# Lighter crank or wheels?



## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

My bike weighs just over 20 (Specialized Crave SL). Would like to get it into the 18's at some point. My next upgrade will be wheels or a crank. I have $500-600 to spend. 

Currently...
Rims- Specialized Stout XC Pro 29, disc, alloy, double-wall, sleeve joint, 26mm inner width, tubeless ready, 24/28h

FRONT HUB- Specialized Stout XC Pro, Hi Lo disc, alloy, sealed cartridge bearings, QR, 24h

REAR HUB-Specialized Stout XC Pro, Hi Lo disc, alloy, sealed cartridge bearings, QR, 28h

Crank- Custom SRAM S-1255, singlespeed specific, GXP, 32T, 104mm BCD spider. I have an AB oval ring that i want to keep so no to shimano i believe?

Which way should i go? If wheels, i would like 29mm inner width.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Wheels every time. You won't feel a crank but light strong wheels will make the bike come alive.


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## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

Any idea of what wheelset and weight that I could possibly save? 1/2 lb hopefully at least.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Obviously carbon wheels are going to save you the most weight, but they are crazy expensive. I switched from a king mavic combo that was around 1760g to a used dt Enve all mountain set that was wider stronger and about 100g lighter. The bigger footprint that wider rims provide increases traction and the stiffness makes the whole bike more responsive. If you are only concerned with weight the specialized roval wheels are decent and easy to find used. Specialized uses a DT swiss style rear hub so parts are easy to come bye too. Another good overlooked option is the XTR wheels. light strong and they seem to pop up on ebay and craigslist.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Well, I think carbon wheels are worth it for the weight savings and stiffness, but they'll set you back about 1000-1200 for a good build on Nextie/Light Bicycles (assuming good hubs like 240s, hope, etc.).


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

I'll just echo the above by saying that wheels would be a great choice, but will likely fall well beyond the budget for now. The Roval Control SLs are in the 1400g range (1440? - I don't remember), but retail for $1800. A custom build as per Jayem would be less, but still about twice your budget for now.

I should also warn you that to get to 18 lbs, you'll be tinkering with several components, so you'll also need to tackle the crank at some point, saddle, bars, etc - it never seems to end. 

Maybe someone would know - the frame itself may be hindering your ultimate weight target. (?)


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## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

Already bought very light seat, seatpost and handlebars. I do run somewhat heavy tires which i like. I could save 66g on a carbon ebay seat for $15. Pretty good $/g ratio. Ive even changed rotors but i didnt go all out with those.

On the other hand, i could nickle and dime it. Stem, rotors, skewers, seat, ti bolts.


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

You could provide a list of what components you have currently, but assuming some already lightweight parts, you are really getting into the diminishing returns zone. Don't know what your current wheelset weighs, but you could probably shed 250-300g all up pretty easily - that's more than a 1/2 pound right there. However it gets much harder after that if you already have mostly lightweight bits.

Just guessing here, but crankset could save 100g, maybe. Change of all bolts to Ti, another 50g. I think a more realistic goal is likely mid-19 lbs.


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## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

Parts that i know the grams

- hbar Easton ec90 sl 9° 159g 
-Stem- Stock 126g.
-Seatpost- ritchey wcs carbon 164g
-Skewers-118
-Seat- 166g. 
-Rotors- 116g each. 
-Tires-Gc 2.3 720g/ardent 2.4 800g
-Grips- esi chunky 55g. 
-Pedals-313g issi
-Clamp- 18g
-Brakes- deore
-Crank-*705g. * 
- chainring-* AB 43g
Chainring bolts-* AB 11g


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Dropping weight is always nice, but control and strength are just as important. If you save and get wheels you will notice the difference every time you ride. Dropping even a lb from the frame will be less beneficial. My race bike is a blur xc Carbon and comes in at 21lb even. I could reduce the weight even more but at the expense for strength. My brand new Tallboy 3 is 27lb with a top shelf build. The difference in climbing mostly comes from the tires. Both are very stiff but the tallboy can descend with nomads and feel comfortable doing it.
You want to start with things that spin and then parts that are high up. 
Best improvements in order:
Tires
Wheels
Fork
pedals
handlebar and stem
seat
everything else.

Looks like you are already on your way to a nice tricked out bike. Don't be afraid of used wheels. Bring a friend or have your shop inspect them before you buy.


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

alexbn921 said:


> ...
> Best improvements in order:
> Tires
> Wheels
> ...


I agree with that list except for the tires. Not to say the OP can't shed a ton of weight by switching them out, however there's always a trade-off with tires when you consider the terrain, and intended use.

As an extreme example, he could go to Schwalbe FF (29x2.0 @360g) and save 800g (1.76 lbs) in rubber alone straightaway, but those are obviously fragile, dry course, race-day-only tires. If he likes the GC/Ardent combo he's running currently, it's hard to argue against that.

I'd agree that there's probably not a trade-off with wheels, and a good carbon set will offer less weight with a pleasant stiffness. (Hmm, "pleasant stiffness" sounds a bit weird, sorry.)


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## MattMay (Dec 24, 2013)

phlegm said:


> The Roval Control SLs are in the 1400g range (1440? - I don't remember), but retail for $1800.


Not that it helps, but Spesh has dropped the price on these to 1500.

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/equipment/components/wheels/roval-control-sl-29/118106


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

MattMay said:


> Not that it helps, but Spesh has dropped the price on these to 1500.
> 
> https://www.specialized.com/us/en/equipment/components/wheels/roval-control-sl-29/118106


Damn.


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## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

Well thats very tempting. I hit my rim every now and then. How much abuse can they take?
The ones on the website are 21-22mm internal for $1445/1450 or 27+ with 30mm. 21-22 a Little skinny? Mine are 26 inner now and i would like 29-30 inner. 

27x2.6 would be cool but low bb and not a ww


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Ibis 928 wheels are 1099 new and they weigh 1588. Light and strong carbon wide wheel.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

27lbs for a top shelf 120mm bike? That's insane. 

Did the shop drop lead weights into the seat tube during assembly?

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## RS VR6 (Mar 29, 2007)

With a budget of 500-600...I don't think you're going to get a i30mm wheelset that is going to be lighter. What you can do is get some China carbon hoops and lace them to your existing hubs. You can find them for around $160 per rim.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Le Duke said:


> 27lbs for a top shelf 120mm bike? That's insane.
> 
> Did the shop drop lead weights into the seat tube during assembly?
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Seems pretty normal to me, most of the time, complete bikes at bike shops are not that light, even the high end "race" versions that cost 8K or more are not that light , as in a 24-25lb FS bike or a 23lb hardtail. There's a few that are significantly lighter because it seems the manufacturer really does pay attention to it with the frame design and selections, but you have to sort through how they achieved it, was it moving to unrealistic parts like skinny bars and tires that no one would use, or through using good parts for the application that drive the price way up? Never all that simple. 27lbs real world weight for 120mm trail bike with a dropper is pretty normal IMO. I know he doesn't have a dropper, so maybe it's a touch on the high side, but not all that much unless he's sat and considered the entire build.

To have one of those "really light bikes" you have to throw a ton of money at it usually and most importantly, not compromise on the weight/parts. That's where your $450 cranksets come from, Ti-spindle pedals, X01 or XX1 cassette, etc. All crazy high dollar items, but few choices that offer lighter weight without significantly compromising the strength, and even with these items you have to know how abusive you are. It's not a cheap process.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

My build was to make the bike as strong as possible while keeping it as light possible. No cost was spared. Things that add weight are the 942 ibis rims and 29x2.6 on the front. Not the lightest but worth it. The frame is a XXL too. 203mm rotor front with 180 rear, because where I ride its steep. I have a 200mm dropper coming from 9point8 so that will up the weight too. Also I'm swapping out the rear shock to an DB inline. All told without pedals it should be 28.2ish. It's setup to run with the big dogs. My blurs is the opposite end and race only now.


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## MattMay (Dec 24, 2013)

Mountain Bike Action February 2017 issue has a decent wheel roundup.

http://mobileservices.texterity.com...017/MobilePagedReplica.action?pm=1&pg=36#pg36 (hope this link works for you)

My son in law is a pro enduro rider who just got sponsored by a fairly new US company Ridefast Racing (ridefastracing.com) and they're running a 15% off sale on their '16 models. Code is 2016SALE


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Jayem said:


> Seems pretty normal to me, most of the time, complete bikes at bike shops are not that light, even the high end "race" versions that cost 8K or more are not that light , as in a 24-25lb FS bike or a 23lb hardtail. There's a few that are significantly lighter because it seems the manufacturer really does pay attention to it with the frame design and selections, but you have to sort through how they achieved it, was it moving to unrealistic parts like skinny bars and tires that no one would use, or through using good parts for the application that drive the price way up? Never all that simple. 27lbs real world weight for 120mm trail bike with a dropper is pretty normal IMO. I know he doesn't have a dropper, so maybe it's a touch on the high side, but not all that much unless he's sat and considered the entire build.
> 
> To have one of those "really light bikes" you have to throw a ton of money at it usually and most importantly, not compromise on the weight/parts. That's where your $450 cranksets come from, Ti-spindle pedals, X01 or XX1 cassette, etc. All crazy high dollar items, but few choices that offer lighter weight without significantly compromising the strength, and even with these items you have to know how abusive you are. It's not a cheap process.


That is my experience too. A 27lb 120mm FS is actually a pretty high end bike. Particularly if you are running a dropper, a trail fork, and trail tires.

For the OP, I would go for cranks over wheels. Wheels are expensive and a small mistake can destroy even the best wheels. Cranks aren't cheap either but it takes more than a small mistake to destroy a crank.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I guess when people say "top shelf" I interpret that to mean the highest end build offered by a manufacturer, or a similar amount of money spent.

I mean, there are a good number of bone stock 120mm/120mm bikes that come in under 26lbs in their most expensive factory builds (which are often a) a terrible deal and b) not that light). The new Scott Spark, Orbea Occam TR, and 2016 Trek Fuel EX all came out under 26lbs with pedals. With house brand components, "real" tires, dropper and pedals.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Built frame up with the exact components I wanted. It was less expensive. Complete bikes cheap on of things like cassettes and other house brand parts that most people don't notice. Plus no one likes Sram brakes and all the eagle bikes come with them.


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## apuking (Mar 3, 2015)

Here some of the lightest I could find for the budget.
1365g for the wheelset
https://r2-bike.com/Laufradsatz-29-DT-Swiss-Straightpull-Naben-DT-Swiss-Felgen-Sapim-CX-Ray-XC-MA
That should be around 505 Dollar with the widest rim option, free delivery but probably Tax to be added

A bit more expensive but with wider rims and a weight of 1350g
Thats about 625 USD including free shipping (You need to include Tax)
https://r2-bike.com/Laufradsatz-29-...ben-NoTubes-ZTR-MK3-Felgen-Sapim-CX-Ray-XC-MA


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

apuking said:


> Here some of the lightest I could find for the budget.
> 1365g for the wheelset
> https://r2-bike.com/Laufradsatz-29-DT-Swiss-Straightpull-Naben-DT-Swiss-Felgen-Sapim-CX-Ray-XC-MA
> That should be around 505 Dollar with the widest rim option, free delivery but probably Tax to be added
> ...


Solid prices! Impressive.


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## apuking (Mar 3, 2015)

They do good handbuilt wheels. The low prices are quite low also due to the Euro being so weak compared to the USD at the moment.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Wow great price on some nice wheels. They have great prices on tires too. A schwalbe tire combo could save you another 300 to 400 grams. I love the nobby nic snake pacestar front and rocket ron snake back. its amazing how fast they roll compared to maxxis tires.


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## russinthecascades (Jun 1, 2013)

I haven't been a weight weenie in mtn biking (now backcountry skiing is another topic...), but I'm doing some upgrades which will weigh less and not sure how far to carry it.

The obvious:
1. Went from Stans Flow EX 27.5 with Hans Dampf 2.35 (F) and Nobby Nic 2.35(R) to Nox Teocalli rims with NN 2.25 front and rear.

2. Going from 3x10 shimano to 1x11 shimano/OneUp hybrid - don't know the weights but there should be significant weight loss dropping a shifter, F derailleur and chainrings.

Question:
3. Replacing the crank/chainrings should shed about 325 grams. I could also save another 78 grams by changing pedals. So that's a little over 400 grams of rotational weigh - am I likely to feel the difference? Changing pedals would purely be for weight savings - can you feel a 78 gram difference on rotation?

Thanks!


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## Seb K (Apr 21, 2009)

You will feel a slight difference but the drivetrain friction will hinder any real noticeable feeling . 78grams will definitely not make a noticeable difference . It's all about numbers .


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## alexdi (Jun 25, 2016)

Cranks and pedals shouldn't count as rotating weight. They do physically rotate, but their inertia is insignificant relative to your legs. If you compared a solid steel crankset to Next SL with an extra 500g in the water bottle rack, I doubt you could tell them apart.


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