# Best Value Bike Company & Worst Value Bike Company???



## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

I've been looking at bikes again and it seems like while you get what you pay for sometimes it appears that there are a few companies that "let" you pay for the privilege of having their name plastered on the side of your frame!!!

I think the Norco bikes look like great values, as well as Rocky Mountain (Canadian Dollar must be weak right now???)

The big three: S, T & C sure expect me to pay a lot extra to have their name taking up the downtube, and almost every other tube, on my bike. 

Unfortunately it seams like very few companies are actually worth buying thanks to these silly press-fit bottom brackets! I do all of my own maintenance so I've decided that I'll only buy a bike with a threaded bottom bracket, why go through the trouble of a clutch RD and have a squeaky bb??

I think the only companies that have threaded BB shells in their upper end frames are: Santa Cruz, Niner and Yeti, anyone else still using threaded shells, especially in carbon????

Holy cow, I just looked at the Specialized Enduro 29 Frame: $4,000 (with a specialized dropper~$200).


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## MSLKauai (Dec 17, 2009)

I think Salsa and Kona make good products at "fairer" prices.


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## tartosuc (May 18, 2006)

Giant, have great bikes for the price.


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## Seven1three (Sep 1, 2013)

tartosuc said:


> Giant, have great bikes for the price.


+1 Giant specs really nice bikes.

Kona also makes some really nice bikes at a fair price.


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## Shark (Feb 4, 2006)

Consider the warranty as well, not just the time but how the company themselves handle warranty claims.

I had a cracked chainstay on my '03 liquid, and Trek replaced the frame with a '10 EX9, no questions asked.


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## trailrider24 (Dec 14, 2012)

I don't know if they use pressfit bbs or not, but the best value is Canyon, the worst is probably Scott.


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## Ladmo (Jan 11, 2013)

Truth be told, I like the attention I get from riding a nice Santa Cruz bike. Just being honest. It's worth a couple bucks to me. Having said that, I was at a large demo event last weekend and tried a Rocky Mountain Altitude that I thought was really nice. Also liked the Giant Anthem I tested. I would be very happy riding either of those bikes.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

freakybro said:


> Truth be told, I like the attention I get from riding a nice Santa Cruz bike. Just being honest. It's worth a couple bucks to me. Having said that, I was at a large demo event last weekend and tried a Rocky Mountain Altitude that I thought was really nice. Also liked the Giant Anthem I tested. I would be very happy riding either of those bikes.


Bikes are just getting really good nowadays! It's hard, but I can nit-pick ANYTHING!!!


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## mudforlunch (Aug 9, 2004)

I've been made brand loyal to Santa Cruz, based on the fact that over the years my non-SC frames tend to give up the ghost eventually, but half of my stable is filled with SC bikes from +/-10 years ago that just will not die. They're not cheap, but they make some of the best brick-shithouse strong, reliable, (and light) bikes around. I'm just waiting for when people start selling their Bronsons to buy the new Nomad so I can snap one up on craigslist. Used ones are really hard to come by right now.


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## Hangtime (Jan 25, 2006)

I have 2500 miles on my 2010 Pivot Firebird and its still going strong. I realize it was not a cheap frame but for the abuse it takes its been a great bike. I've had a Transition and Kona that seem to loosen up very early into owning them


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## VTSession (Aug 18, 2005)

I have to agree that Specialized bike are painfully over priced. Who wants to pay $8k+ for a bike with mostly OEM parts? No thanks, I'd rather build a high end carbon frame up with the parts I want for less $.


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## mjduct (Jul 31, 2012)

I've built 2 Niners when the frames have been on sale and found them to be exceptional bikes worth many times their cost IMO. I really am a fan of salsa bikes as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MtbRN (Jun 8, 2006)

VTSession said:


> I have to agree that Specialized bike are painfully over priced. Who wants to pay $8k+ for a bike with mostly OEM parts? No thanks, I'd rather build a high end carbon frame up with the parts I want for less $.


Last time I was shopping for a bike, the salesguy at Wheat Ridge Cycles tried to talk me into a Specialized. My response: "If I am paying $3000+ for a bike, it's not going to say 'Specialized' on the frame".
Plenty of other, equally good or better bikes can be had for the money "S" wants to charge you.


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## mudhen (Aug 16, 2012)

Depends more on the shop for me. I want to know what the dealer can do for me.

After that, the calculator on my iPhone tells me all I need to know, as it's pretty easy to add up the prices on the components....

mudhen


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## Vegard (Jul 16, 2009)

Europe: Canyon.
NA: Devinci and Ibis. (The deals on the Ibis Special Blend kits are great)


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Devinci is up there with Norco in terms of value. Giant (although in the USA we get shafted.) Kona used to be better but lately I think they've increased prices a bit, especially on full suspension bikes. The new Switchback Bikes is doing pretty good deals as well. Santa Cruz has some good value in the single pivot full suspension and hardtail bikes, but the VPP bikes are kinda pricey. 

Banshee does a good deal on frames.

As far as bikes available in the states but from Euro countries, On-One is the leader there, but they have been slow to keep up with trends, mainly 650b. Rose Bikes will ship to the USA and they offer a good deal (dependent on exchange rates). 

There are quite a few manufacturers like YT Industries, Canyon, etc can be found in the USA but its difficult to do so and usually negates any savings. 

If/when YT Industries comes to the states, it will be interesting to see how much their pricing changes and if they offer as good of a value here as in Europe.


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## Vegard (Jul 16, 2009)

PHeller said:


> Devinci is up there with Norco in terms of value.


IMHO Devinci beats Norco down into their boots due to the lifetime warranty that applies to their frames regardless if they bought new or not


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## DeeZee (Jan 26, 2005)

tartosuc said:


> Giant, have great bikes for the price.


Agree.........won't buy one but they are a good value.


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## BrianVarick (Jan 31, 2013)

Something I consider when buying a bike is resale value. The big brands don't offer as much up front but you get a whole lot more on the back end when you eventually upgrade.


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## NoVA_JB (May 8, 2007)

The way I look at it all bike manufactures don't make most of the components so it comes down to frame and warranty. 
When I was bike shopping I had a spreadsheet that listed the components vs the price and it was easy to see which ones provided initial value resale is another thing but I don't put a lot of stock because it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. 

I will say the best value for any bike is if you can find a leftover and the shop is taking a discount. I would always want to pay for a bike that has a heavy discount than one that you're paying retail on unless technology changed dramatically between years.


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## zgroove (Feb 10, 2009)

trailrider24 said:


> I don't know if they use pressfit bbs or not, but the best value is Canyon, the worst is probably Scott.


I went on the Canyon website and I believe they do not ship in the USA? Am I right or has anyone bought a Canyon and had it shipped here?


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## BEEB (Jul 16, 2010)

Canyon does not ship to US. They plan on starting sometime soon.

and on topic.. best bang for the buck in Europe must be Canyon, Radon, YT Industries.


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## dirt farmer (Mar 28, 2005)

I agree about two of the "big three"; Giant and Trek. I'm not so keen on $pecialized.

I like Trek because I really like their Bontrager parts. They make fine wheels, rims, tires, and bars (and fenders, if you have a commuter bike).


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

I do all my own bike building/maintenance as well, and am a big fan of press fit bb's. The bearings are way bigger, noticeably stiffer and last much longer than any bb that preceded press fit. What's not to like. I may get flamed for suggesting this but it is my belief that it is the non-mechanical types are who have issue with press fit. Then again I also think Specialized has some of the most dialed bikes on the market right now.


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## Flyin_W (Jun 17, 2007)

^ .... Interesting that you're the 1st person I've heard outside the industry with this viewpoint.
Can only wonder if you have a vested interest, lack real world experience, or if as an infant were dropped on your head.
Your last sentence confirms all of the above.

Weaknesses, I see are; Delrin cups, durability, constant creaking, difficulty / inability to service, cost, 
lack of adjustment, must use a press & puller, and the potential for ovalization of the BB shell.
All of these downsides to simplify the mfg process, and to save a few $$.


Singed, not flamed to a carbon crispy.


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## HBSURFDAD (May 29, 2014)

It is funny all the “Specialized” bashing. 

I worked my way through college as a bike mechanic and was blessed to be in Northern California in the mid to late 80’s. I was at ground zero for the MTB birth, (next to it, not in it). I built a lot of early MTB’s (Fisher, Ritchey, Ibis, Cunningham) and I learned what worked and what was hype in the early days, failure happened quickly !! There are a lot of very good companies out there, the bad ones are almost all gone.

After a few years away from riding I needed a new bike. I started with my frame requirements including specific dimensions and angles. I spec’ed out a minimum component level, and then a dream level and went looking for what fit my requirements at what price. I hit every shop in southern California, and every manufacturing website I could find. The Specialized FSR I finally bought was a great value based on the sum of each and every part and fit my (admittedly freaky) dimensions. I could get close for more money and I could get a lot less for the same dollars. 

Example, Yes for $2k more I could have saved 1 lb. I will get a better set of wheels for racing (more like chasing the racers and trying not to die), but what it came with can handle my fat a$$ without being DH specific now.

Not everybody needs the same thing or wants to pay the same amount, but Specialized provided the best bang for the buck for “Me”, and that is the only opinion that matters.

Additional note, this is the only bike in my household in 30 years (for both the wife and me) that was not custom built. My current roady is a custom Litespeed Vortex with Dura Ace and my wife has a custom Ultegra equipped carbon roady.

Just my $0.02


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Flyin_W said:


> ^ .... Interesting that you're the 1st person I've heard outside the industry with this viewpoint.
> Can only wonder if you have a vested interest, lack real world experience, or if as an infant were dropped on your head.
> Your last sentence confirms all of the above.
> 
> ...


I may well have been dropped on my head as an infant, but I'll stand by my post & have no vested interest other than I like riding bikes. I will also reiterate that it is people with limited mechanical aptitude that don't comprehend the advantages of press fit as your post illustrates.

1-Delrin cups are dumb. Why use them? Very nice aluminum cupped press fit bb's out there.
2-How are larger bearings not more durable? They simply are & being captured in the bb makes them deform less, ei last longer, and stiffer.
3-If you use aluminum cupped bb & set it with bearing retaining compound it will not creak...I promise. 
4-You can service it like any bearing, simply remove the outer seal and walla
5-Cost seems about the same to me but since press fit last longer I think it wins
6-Lack of adjustment? Why would you need to adjust or space the cup, you can accomplish any adjustment you need post cup.
7- Press or puller....maybe. I've never needed a puller & 2 small blocks of wood & a C-clamp work just fine for a press.
8-Ovalized bb?? Never seen it never heard of it. Most BB shell's are forged. You're far more likely to strip threads on an outboard bb.

I realize the flaming was in jest & your post made me smile. However, at 240#'s to 
250#'s + I destroy drivetrain parts on regular basis. Outboard & square taper bb's wouldn't last me a month before they started to pop & creak. I've been running the same press fit BB on 2 years now....how could I not be a believer? All your "downsides" are really upsides on a purely mechanical basis. For anybody that may read this & is having press fit issues use a bb like this one & set it green bearing retaining compound. Wheels Manufacturing PressFit-30 Bottom Bracket AC


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## Flyin_W (Jun 17, 2007)

*Re: Best Value Bike Company & Worst Value Bike Company???*



WHALENARD said:


> I may well have been dropped on my head as an infant, but I'll stand by my post & have no vested interest other than I like riding bikes. I will also reiterate that it is people with limited mechanical aptitude that don't comprehend the advantages of press fit as your post illustrates.
> 
> 1-Delrin cups are dumb. Why use them? Very nice aluminum cupped press fit bb's out there.
> 2-How are larger bearings not more durable? They simply are & being captured in the bb makes them deform less, ei last longer, and stiffer.
> ...


Limited mechanical aptitude! Really? Those are fighting words! Fee Fi Fo Fum... I smell an agitating menace who's just stirring the pot. I fart in your general direction!

Until recently OEM press fit BB-92's only had delrin cups that were not serviceable. After burning up a Shimano then repacking a Race Face, I too have ended up with an Enduro alu cup. I can only hope that you're right, and that it'll last longer than 6 months.

Tell us, what are these longer lasting more durable BB's that you mention?? Do any come as OEM? (The only alu cup one's that I've seen are high-end aftermarket.)

The choices are limited the cost is high and other than ISIS BB's I've not had any others be so problematic.

If you're pressing bearings with a C-clamp and blocks of wood chances are good that you are not inserting with even pressure, and are apt to ovalize the BB shell.

No thanks, I'll stick to threads, grease, and risk cross-threading before some ham-fisted shop rat takes another hunk out of my frame when the bearing press slips.

I still believe you to be a mfg's shill, and not a hard-charging Clyde.


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Flyin_W said:


> Limited mechanical aptitude! Really? Those are fighting words! Fee Fi Fo Fum... I smell an agitating menace who's just stirring the pot. I fart in your general direction!
> 
> Until recently OEM press fit BB-92's only had delrin cups that were not serviceable. After burning up a Shimano then repacking a Race Face, I too have ended up with an Enduro alu cup. I can only hope that you're right, and that it'll last longer than 6 months.
> 
> ...


I really think the delrin is at fault for most of the bad rap here. Lets see we have a steel bearing captured in what is essentially plastic then inserted into aluminum. Add the force one applies peddling and the delrin simply does not retain the bearing true relative to the MUCH stiffer steel & aluminum. Delrin as the medium to retain the bearing is just a bad idea from square 1. Delrin is cheap to machine and is the reason it's used.

I think one would have to work really hard at ovalizing the BB. Not only does 6 & 7 series aluminum have excellent shape memory but there is an awful lot of contact surface between the bb shell and bb cup. One could remove a lot of material & still have adequate contact surface. The key here is to use a well crafted aluminum cup & set it with bearing retaining compound, just like every other bearing in your frame. BTW Yukon Cornelius hangs from my rear view mirror....true story.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

I choose to believe that if Santa Cruz, Yeti, Niner, Banshee and a few other brands that actually are known for their high standards continue to thread their bb shells then I would be retarbeb to buy a frame with a press fit.


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## Flyin_W (Jun 17, 2007)

WHALENARD said:


> I really think the delrin is at fault for most of the bad rap here. Lets see we have a steel bearing captured in what is essentially plastic then inserted into aluminum. Add the force one applies peddling and the delrin simply does not retain the bearing true relative to the MUCH stiffer steel & aluminum. Delrin as the medium to retain the bearing is just a bad idea from square 1. Delrin is cheap to machine and is the reason it's used.
> 
> I think one would have to work really hard at ovalizing the BB. Not only does 6 & 7 series aluminum have excellent shape memory but there is an awful lot of contact surface between the bb shell and bb cup. One could remove a lot of material & still have adequate contact surface. The key here is to use a well crafted aluminum cup & set it with bearing retaining compound, just like every other bearing in your frame. BTW Yukon Cornelius hangs from my rear view mirror....true story.


Yes, I often see you running red lights, and picking your nose.  
Delrin is the weakest link, and is used by mfg's to forgive misalignment. I do not know of any new bikes that come built with alu pf BB's.
(This is relevant towards worst value in bike makers.)

Ever seen a headset cup that was ridden loose, and ovalized a head tube? Think about all the torque you lay down. Ever wonder what would happen if the interface wasn't tight, and if the cups were harder than the frame? 
^ This is what keeps me from buying another frame with a pf BB. Also IMO Spec used to produce bikes of good value, my all time fav was a '90 Stumpy Comp. Their litigious actions prevent me from ever again owning their bikes, and is why they get my vote for worst big bike company.

Back to the show..

(tapa)


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Yep I've seen ovalized headtubes...totally different forces & my assumption would be not only were the cups loose, but so was the steerer tube in the head tube allowing for lots of leverage (not to mention the leverage of the length of the fork). An idiot can ruin anything this site is evidence enough for that. Also is why you need to set your bb cups with bearing retaining compound like every other bearing in your frame. Furthermore, a bb shell may be misaligned relative to the bike ei not jigged well while welded but the bb shell itself not machined right would be no more likely than a threaded bb not being machined right. Again mechanical aptitude and internet myth account for more belief than reality.....such is life. Over & out this horse has been thoroughly beaten.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

Flyin_W said:


> Also IMO Spec used to produce bikes of good value, my all time fav was a '90 Stumpy Comp. Their litigious actions prevent me from ever again owning their bikes, and is why they get my vote for worst big bike company.


What??? You don't like knowing that part of paying for a specialized bicycle goes towards suing a cafe owner for naming his cafe after a place in Spain??? Social media explosion over Specialized's Roubaix lawsuit | Bicycle Retailer and Industry News

Makes me mad every time I hear about it, but I did just buy my wife a pair of grips from them, but only because they are the only grips she likes even if they are a knock-off of ergon. . .

Looks like Mike Sinyard appologized to the owner of Cafe Roubaix, : Specialized founder Sinyard visits Cafe Roubaix, apologizes for trademark controversy - VeloNews.com

Still won't buy a bike from them until they go back to threaded bottom brackets.


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## Mattcz (May 26, 2005)

Not to bring this back to the op's topic but Jamis puts out some very good bikes at a good price. Specialized seems very overpriced and underwhelming in kit.


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## Rockrover (Jul 4, 2012)

All I have to say, is that Spec'y litigation hype-per-bole aside, my Enduro 29 is the best flippin' bike I've ever ridden. I've honestly never felt as dialed on a bike as I do right now on the E29. 

All companies sue for potential intellectual property and/or trademark violations. How is SC doing against Yeti for "stealing" their VPP design? I think we should boycott SC because Yetis' are boutique and cool!!! Should I stop using my Mac because Jobs (God rest his soul) kept all the Droid copycats at bay through litigation?


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

trailrider24 said:


> ... the worst is probably Scott.


So true. Scott is notorious for denying claims, citing user error and/or abuse. Swiss....of ALL people!


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## phattruth (Apr 22, 2012)

My 2 cents...

Worst Value: Ellsworth- They charge $500 more than anyone else for old technology.

Best Value: Giant & Ibis (Special Blend)- you won't find better bikes for the money.

Worse PR: Specialized - I think it's already been said.

BTW, the PF bottom brackets are not an issue if you use a threaded bottom bracket setup. The 2 halves thread together. I know Yeti is using this on there new bikes.


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## RiceBrnr (Oct 13, 2014)

Kona and Giant(till they went 27.5 only) for the best bang for buck.

Spec is definitely overpriced. Only thing about them is the Epic won't take any other rear shock. And the 30hr service intervals, WTF! Best handling XC bike on the planet though.


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## KevinGT (Dec 25, 2012)

Best: Motobecane (yes, the bikesdirect.com bikes). I don't ride one but I helped my BIL pick one out and it had good components on what looked to be identical to a Giant frame -- for $1000 less.

Worst: Scott. I demo'd a few Scotts and they just felt cheap and heavy at a premium price. I demo'd a 650b that was heavier and more sluggish than any 29er I rode.


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## jasonmax (Jan 21, 2015)

It depends on what kind of bike your looking for nowadays theres like 5000 different application specific bike. As far as your basic trail bike say 2k Giant and Kona rule the world in value. Dont agree? look at their 2k trail bikes compare them to C-dale trek n unspecial and if you know anything about not only valued parts spec but real world benefits from having good specs in certain areas


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## Thor29 (May 12, 2005)

I like to roll my own, so that means starting with the frame. My current ride is a Kona Honzo and I have owned several Niners. Currently, Bikeman sells the Honzo frame for $525 (if they ever have any in stock) while the Niner ROS9 goes for about $900. The ROS9 is probably a little bit better built but functionally they are very similar. 

If I were looking for a good value complete mountain bike, I'd probably look at Kona or Jamis before I considered any other brands. I'd avoid Specialized (because they are evil) and Santa Cruz (because there are way to many of them around here close to their hometown and their top tubes are too short).


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## hags707 (Apr 22, 2010)

Canadian bike company's for the most part ( - knolly ) and giant. I know there is a lot of hate on Spec but they are not to bad part wish for dollar on par with most company's and Kona. Are in house brand parts that bad they serve their intended function and the big three use them? I don't see why people get mad/upset with them, the higher end stuff is nice, so what if it does not have the cool name on it. IMHO


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## jmmUT (Sep 15, 2008)

Surly (mostly). Bomb Proof.


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## BikeIntelligencer (Jun 5, 2009)

Had a Giant once and it broke. Good part was they gave me a brand new bike! Bad part was it was an NRS1.... But that was a decade ago, different today no doubt.


DeeZee said:


> Agree.........won't buy one but they are a good value.


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## BikeIntelligencer (Jun 5, 2009)

Looks like Evil may be trying a price reset...but too early to say if the value is there. Depends on yet to be proven durability. RM on the upside, Spesh and Yeti on the negative.


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## misterbill (Aug 13, 2014)

FYI-Specialized is dumbing down their bikes. My LBS was explaining to me why the SJ Elite was a better bike, he pointed out the deraileur, and the front fork. Specialized does not have the same components on the 2015. I do not remember the name on the front fork, but it is not the RockShox listed on the 2015. MSRP for the 2014 is $4200, MSRP on the 2015 is $3800(Stumpjumper FSR Elite). Going to make the left over 2014 a hard sell.

The Rockhopper 29 2014 MSRP is $880, while the 2015 MSRP is $700.

The good news for my LBS is that as far as I am concerned, the 2014 SJ is already sold! Hope is a good thing.


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## Alias530 (Apr 1, 2013)

tartosuc said:


> Giant, have great bikes for the price.


I've never understood why people say that...

I was looking at the Giant Reign 27.5 1 and it's $6k for an aluminum frame and the lowest end 1x11 SRAM makes. People say Specialized is expensive for what it is but at least for $6k you get a carbon frame and X01 instead of X1.

That's just one example but I imagine that their pricing is consistent down the line.


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## BikeIntelligencer (Jun 5, 2009)

And he said, Yer damn right. For it to say Specialized is $200 extra...


MtbRN said:


> Last time I was shopping for a bike, the salesguy at Wheat Ridge Cycles tried to talk me into a Specialized. My response: "If I am paying $3000+ for a bike, it's not going to say 'Specialized' on the frame".
> Plenty of other, equally good or better bikes can be had for the money "S" wants to charge you.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

I haven't found one company that really has the best value across the board. There are good and not-so-good values from each company, depending on what a particular buyer wants to do and can afford. Just because a particular company's bike seems overpriced at one price point, doesn't mean you can't find something else in their lineup that is at least very competitively priced.

IMHO, bikes at the lower end of the spectrum are the most competitively priced, while bikes at the higher end are all over the map. . . . not to mention the subjective criteria that many riders prioritize.


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## Terranaut (Jun 9, 2014)

Why do I feel this will turn (as if it hasn't already) into a "I love this bike but hate that bike" based on what you own?
Oh yeah because very few people on here could have or will have owned more than a couple brands. How many people have owned 10 different brands of bikes? I love My Specialized bike and it was great value. I love my Devinci and my kid loves his giant. Would I say one was "better" value than the others? No. They are all different setups with different part combos. How could a person compare value from a $1000 bike to a $3000 bike or FSR to a HT? These threads keep popping up and it all goes to hell after a page or two. Like...no, no LOVE your bike. Be confident in your choice of purchase and never mind what lovers or haters of brand X say. When you shop for a new one and do research don't forget that not one shred of research will tell you how you will feel in the saddle until you ride it. Feeling like a million bucks in the saddle is more important than spending the million or ensuring you get 1.2 million in value.


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## jeffw-13 (Apr 30, 2008)

MSLKauai said:


> I think Salsa and Kona make good products at "fairer" prices.


I was gonna say Kona too. Alot of bike for the money.


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## mtndude23 (Apr 18, 2012)

Rocky Mountain and Norco, are great bikes for the money.


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## gsa103 (Sep 1, 2014)

Giant is darned near impossible to beat for the combination of components and frame quality. Probably helps that they run the manufacturing for like half the bike industry.


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## Goran13 (Jun 26, 2012)

Who are we kidding... all these bike companies are expensive. Reality is, who is cheaper for the same stuff. 

The companies that are going to be cheaper for a complete bike, are the ones that buy the most stock of components and such in bulk. Those are the ones that are capable of having a cheaper price and still making money. Think big 3! 

Just go buy last years model for 3/4 of the full price and be happy, unless you want this years tech. If you have expensive taste, bust out the cheque book and buy it. 

Just make sure it fits and puts a smile on your face. Everything else is secondary.


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## fuel15 (Feb 2, 2015)

I would have to say bang for your buck and without a huge budget... Giant. No I don't own or ride one but from the bulk of the comments their Warranty is the best out there. Yes they are not without their problems but they seem to handle the warranty without much fuss. 

Having a brand new 2015 Fuel EX8 in the shed missing pieces for the last month while arguing with Trek isn't why I purchased a mountain bike. I should be out riding not arguing over the fine print of their Warranty. 

If I could turn back time the Trek would be replaced with a Giant.


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## Boyonabyke (Sep 5, 2007)

I bought a 2014 VW passat TDI SE, for about $24000, new in March of 2014. On sale, regularly $29800. There is no way three $8000 mountain bikes are any where near 1/3 or 1/4 the value in terms of machining, fit, precision of parts, weight of steel, 4 tires, who knows how many bearings, pumps, valve, electrical circuits, head lights, LED or HID, etc compared to how little is on a mountain bike, parts, price, or that almost all of it is made in China or Taiwan, all the mountain bike parts. 

Nope, there is no value in mountain bikes for your money... not really. It's all about being label conscious, and marketing. So over it. Plus, no better way to get hurt/injured in a sport than mountain biking. Yep, you are gonna fall, and yep, you will get messed up, sooner or later. Just a matter of time. I can't think of anyone I've ridden with that hasn't piled and gone to the hospital to get fixed up.


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## fuel15 (Feb 2, 2015)

Boyonadyke said:


> I bought a 2014 VW passat TDI SE, for about $24000, new in March of 2014. On sale, regularly $29800. There is no way three $8000 mountain bikes are any where near 1/3 or 1/4 the value in terms of machining, fit, precision of parts, weight of steel, 4 tires, who knows how many bearings, pumps, valve, electrical circuits, head lights, LED or HID, etc compared to how little is on a mountain bike, parts, price, or that almost all of it is made in China or Taiwan, all the mountain bike parts.
> 
> Nope, there is no value in mountain bikes for your money... not really. It's all about being label conscious, and marketing. So over it. Plus, no better way to get hurt/injured in a sport than mountain biking. Yep, you are gonna fall, and yep, you will get messed up, sooner or later. Just a matter of time. I can't think of anyone I've ridden with that hasn't piled and gone to the hospital to get fixed up.


Yes you are very right. What gets me is that you spend 3k on a bike and have to pay the labour costs on a warranty job on a 1 week old bike. WTF! No car manufacturer does that! But cars, beer, bikes etc are all far from good investments or good value, but lots of fun. Funny enough the 2015 Fuel cost half the price of my Yamaha R1 1000cc motor bike. At least the R1 is reliable


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## sandmangts (Feb 16, 2004)

Resale value on bikes is kinda a joke. I see guys posting relatively new bikes on my local MTB site and craigslist all the time at high prices all the time. A week later they knock off 100 bucks, 2 weeks later a few hundred more, etc. etc. Works for me because I always buy used and since I know how to fix bikes I am not concerned with minor issues. I got my 2013 Norco Sight with lots of nice upgrades (Hope wheelset, KsLev dropper) for under 2k and it looked new. It has been an outstanding bike. Norco has some very good spec'd bikes for reasonable prices and they really do perform very well and the pivots are easy to maintain. If you must buy new and want good warranty service and budget minded value vs. bling go with Norco, Giant, Kona, Trek. They all perform great. I have no experience with Norco customer service but Giant and Trek have both treated me well when I had issues.


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## misterbill (Aug 13, 2014)

Boyonadyke said:


> I bought a 2014 VW passat TDI SE, for about $24000, new in March of 2014. On sale, regularly $29800. There is no way three $8000 mountain bikes are any where near 1/3 or 1/4 the value in terms of machining, fit, precision of parts, weight of steel, 4 tires, who knows how many bearings, pumps, valve, electrical circuits, head lights, LED or HID, etc compared to how little is on a mountain bike, parts, price, or that almost all of it is made in China or Taiwan, all the mountain bike parts.
> 
> Nope, there is no value in mountain bikes for your money... not really. It's all about being label conscious, and marketing. So over it. Plus, no better way to get hurt/injured in a sport than mountain biking. Yep, you are gonna fall, and yep, you will get messed up, sooner or later. Just a matter of time. I can't think of anyone I've ridden with that hasn't piled and gone to the hospital to get fixed up.


I thought about this the whole time that I was at work tonight, because I couldn't believe I was reading something so derogatory and sarcastic on a mountain bike website-I really enjoyed the humor of it. Unfortunately, as I said, giving it a lot of thought, I realized you were not being sarcastic or derogatory.

I put a $985 catalytic converter on my car the most expensive one the auto parts store ever sold. I needed also to replace the front 02 sensor. The computer reads the 02 readings from the front sensor and compares it to the rear sensor and they are supposed to match or not match or something I forget. The mechanics that I talk to tell me when there is a problem with something computer related in an auto, it is usually not the computer. I would hate to think what a computer would cost. How much are the six leather seats worth on my car. I only paid $1000 for the car. I had one of my bikes apart, had the seat, handlebars, wheels and crankset off. I said to myself, there are only five or six more parts to take off and I can paint it. What the heck is there to a bike that they can justify thousands of dollars. I wish that I had not thought of this because I am really interested in a nice bike. Actually this is not going to stop me, but I think you are correct.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

As I get closer to buying a new bike in a few years, I'm watching what brands are offering. Pretty much decided I don't want one of the big brands like Trek, Spec, or even (as nice as I think they are) a Santa Cruz.

I'm interested to see how brands like Airborne and Fezzari shake out in the long haul. They look pretty nice on paper.


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