# Spiderless cranks and intended use



## tuvok (Jun 22, 2008)

Sorry if the title makes no sense. Out of curiosity I'm trying to get a handle on whether manufacturers of spiderless chainring-capable cranks are aware of, or support, the use of spiderless chainrings.

When looking at product descriptions of cranks with removable spiders (well OK, just Truvative) I notice that they don't seem to try to emphasize, note or promote the fact that the spiders are removable. It would seem that for may consumers this would be a selling point that could cause them to choose one crank over another.

Also, that there seem to be so few sources of spiderless rings suggests that spiderless use is not something that crank manufacturers are keen to encourage. Does this ring true (no pun intended), or are there other aspects to spiderless chainring supply and demand?

Also, exactly how safe are spiderless chainrings (which seem to be a bit of an improvisation) compared to standart bolt on cranks? Just wondering about all this since I started reading about spiderless while trying to see if I could get a < 32 tooth chainring.


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## Dry Side (Jun 7, 2011)

Been riding an X7 crank with a 32T HBC spiderless chain ring all year with out any problems. Don't see any downside.


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## zaskaranddriver (Oct 14, 2009)

The crank, rings, and bearings all see the same forces regardless of whether chainring bolts are present. Spiderless is no less safe and actually more reliable since there are fewer parts to come loose or fail, and it's a little lighter as well. There are many instances in which this industry has lead us away from perfectly adequate designs in order to maintain profitability (sorry for the cynicism).


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## Lonecrow (Jun 20, 2011)

My White Industries Eno crank has been very solid,
chain ring has held up great with little wear with
over a 1000 miles on it, no more chain ring bolts
to check and it minimizes uneven chain tension.
Crank is coupled with Phil Wood BB for a very
smooth drive train.


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## tuvok (Jun 22, 2008)

Lonecrow said:


> My White Industries Eno crank has been very solid,
> chain ring has held up great with little wear with
> over a 1000 miles on it, no more chain ring bolts
> to check and it minimizes uneven chain tension.
> ...


Very nice, is that an HBC ring (looking for alternate sources)? Edit: Just checked out the White Industries site and see its a chainring of their own design.



zaskaranddriver said:


> There are many instances in which this industry has lead us away from perfectly adequate designs in order to maintain profitability (sorry for the cynicism).


No need to apologize. Just seems that in this case there is an opportunity for manufacturers to run with this and provide a useful product, but it seems that only a few vendors have noticed this so choice is limited.


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## davesauvageau (Jan 8, 2010)

Profile NoBoss cranks
Profile Spline Drive chainwheel

Solid, clean, super easy to set up and looks great! I have this setup on my Karate Monkey, wish I had pics of it assembled!


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## ferros (Nov 8, 2010)

Here is my set up. I am actually surprised SRAM does not make a spider less ring their own.


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## fast_times (May 22, 2011)

Damn.......y'all are making me go google more stuff to buy!


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## Click Click Boom (Oct 23, 2008)

I'm running X0 cranks with a hbc ring on my Ragley TD:1 and I just orfered some MRP spiderless rings for a set of X7s I have laying around. The X0 crank, ring and bb come in at 586grams.


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## zaskaranddriver (Oct 14, 2009)

I guess that's about 10 or 20g lighter than crazy8's SS-modded and tuned M960 crankset?


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## tuvok (Jun 22, 2008)

ferros said:


> Here is my set up. I am actually surprised SRAM does not make a spider less ring their own.


This is also what I was thinking. Makes me think they designed the spiderless interface with some other purpose in mind.


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## Stevob (Feb 27, 2009)

It makes sense to me that a manufacturer would go for a spiderless set-up, especially when they're making carbon cranks. Spindle interfaces need to be alloy and it would be cheaper to design for spiderless than to design and manufacture a carbon wrapped one piece spider/crank. It also gives them the option of utilising spiders for 2x & 3x cranksets without needing to redesign the whole crank. Now they still have the option of going 1x on the same crank, without extensive devolopment costs, which they will, especially given the introduction of XX1. No doubt that they were probably involved with MRP and their design. Sram will probably release something better looking soon because quite frankly, the MRP looks "out of place" with that grey colour and the shape of the chainring arms.

As with most designs, the basis is usually cost driven.


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## Click Click Boom (Oct 23, 2008)

What I find strange is that the xx1 is spiderless and uses a spider and chain ring set up.


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## zaskaranddriver (Oct 14, 2009)

They did that to facilitate chainring swappage. Yes, swappage. :winker: Gotta take the whole crankset off to swap spiderless chainwheels. And the torque spec on that 8mm retaining bolt is 416-478 in-lbs. Try that with a 4" allen key!


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

So are there any other sources of spiderless chainrings? Experimental Prototype in Sweden just announced they won't be making rings any more...


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## rob1035 (Apr 20, 2007)

MRP for SRAM cranks... Mountain Racing Products home of MRP, White Brothers, Kreitler, Tamer, and Power Grips | MRP Bling Ring Chainrings


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## Click Click Boom (Oct 23, 2008)

MRP just got in a new batch of rings. Mine were shipped out 2 days ago. 

Who else makes then? Besides HBC.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

The bling-rings are sweet, thanks for sharing the link! Makes me want to go out a buy a sram crank.

Anyone want to buy an LX (spiderless) crank 175mm? 

Ok, so there's HBC and MRP (SRAM only). EP is out. Any more suppliers i.e. for Shimano?


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## zaskaranddriver (Oct 14, 2009)

Maybe tehan will save the day?


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## bedell99 (Jan 5, 2007)

Is it possible to buy just the X0 left and right crank arms instead of buying the entire cranks set. I would love to go with a spiderless setup and use a 30 tooth upfront.

Erik


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## Stevob (Feb 27, 2009)

Click Click Boom said:


> ...The X0 crank, ring and bb come in at 586grams.


That's a very impressive weight. 28t?


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## Click Click Boom (Oct 23, 2008)

I miss quoted. That's the X0 cranks with a hbc 28t with a press fit bb when it was on my Lurcher. Its now on my ragley with a 32t hbc ring and a chris king bb. Its around 635 grams with its current set up.


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## Stevob (Feb 27, 2009)

still very light


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

Apologies for this resurrection -



ferros said:


> Here is my set up. I am actually surprised SRAM does not make a spider less ring their own.
> View attachment 732856


Seriously thinking about using this SRAM X0 set-up as it's the lightest (but strong and tough) SS splined crankset I can think of. Does anyone know where I can buy just the cranks without the spider and rings, and then a decent bling ring to go on the cranks? (in the UK... :skep: ??)


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## pwu_1 (Nov 19, 2007)

If you have a BB already you might want to look into getting the XX1 crankset. Sell the spider to offset some of the cost and then getting the MRP bling ring or the NSB chain ring since the XX1 crankset can be had for about $240 new(without BB) whereas the X0 stuff usually cost a bit more than that.
I'm actually building my first SS and should be receiving my XX1 crankset and 30T bling ring in a couple of days.
I will take some pictures and report back when I get it but there is another thread where others have tried this set up and been pretty happy with it.


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## billendk (Apr 5, 2012)

pwu_1 said:


> If you have a BB already you might want to look into getting the XX1 crankset. Sell the spider to offset some of the cost and then getting the MRP bling ring or the NSB chain ring since the XX1 crankset can be had for about $240 new(without BB) whereas the X0 stuff usually cost a bit more than that.
> I'm actually building my first SS and should be receiving my XX1 crankset and 30T bling ring in a couple of days.
> I will take some pictures and report back when I get it but there is another thread where others have tried this set up and been pretty happy with it.


Is it possible to run this setup without a chain guide?


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## MTB Pharm (Mar 10, 2007)

billendk said:


> Is it possible to run this setup without a chain guide?


If you are talking SS, then yes. 
If you are talking 1X then yes if you are running a shimano shadow derailleur or SRAM type 2.

There are more manufactures of spiderless chainrings for SRAM coming out. Some with the alternating tooth profile like the XX1 rings. Wolftooth is testing theirs out now. wolftoothcomponents.com


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

pwu_1 said:


> If you have a BB already you might want to look into getting the XX1 crankset. Sell the spider to offset some of the cost and then getting the MRP bling ring or the NSB chain ring since the XX1 crankset can be had for about $240 new(without BB) whereas the X0 stuff usually cost a bit more than that.
> I'm actually building my first SS and should be receiving my XX1 crankset and 30T bling ring in a couple of days.
> I will take some pictures and report back when I get it but there is another thread where others have tried this set up and been pretty happy with it.


I must admit that makes sense, but I thought I read somewhere that the spider was not removable on the XX1 but is removable on X0 - is this not true???


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## billendk (Apr 5, 2012)

The spider is removable both on xx1 and x0. You can use the xx1 spider on a x0 crankset.


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## pwu_1 (Nov 19, 2007)

BigwheelsRbest said:


> I must admit that makes sense, but I thought I read somewhere that the spider was not removable on the XX1 but is removable on X0 - is this not true???


I think you have the xx1(11 speed) confused with the xx(10 speed). The xx crankset spider is not removable. The xx1 spider is removable like the x0


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## arcdesigns (Jul 24, 2007)

2013 Carbon-Ti X-Monoring Titanium spiderless single-chainrings


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

arcdesigns said:


> 2013 Carbon-Ti X-Monoring Titanium spiderless single-chainrings


Very nice. Will try to find out weights and a UK distributor.


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

pwu_1 said:


> I think you have the xx1(11 speed) confused with the xx(10 speed). The xx crankset spider is not removable. The xx1 spider is removable like the x0


Yes you are right.

The XX1 set up will work out 50-60g heavier than X0 though, by my calcs, including BB.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

BigwheelsRbest said:


> Very nice. Will try to find out weights and a UK distributor.


I have one. 62g for a 34t SRAM spiderless ring. Looks nice, but have not tried it yet. Waiting for my Ti HBC ring to wear out, so it could be a while!


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## Cormac (Aug 6, 2011)

arcdesigns said:


> 2013 Carbon-Ti X-Monoring Titanium spiderless single-chainrings


nice! Where to buy those?


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## pwu_1 (Nov 19, 2007)

Just received my XX1 crankset and 30T MRP Bling ring.
The XX1 GXP Crank arms weigh 476 grams
The XX1 32T chainring and spider weighs 94 grams
The MRP 30T Bling ring weighs 56 grams.

The Bling ring was a tight fit onto the crank but I suppose tighter fit is better than a loose fit.
Anyone happen to know the torque spec for those 3 bolts?


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

pwu_1 said:


> Just received my XX1 crankset and 30T MRP Bling ring.
> The XX1 GXP Crank arms weigh 476 grams
> The XX1 32T chainring and spider weighs 94 grams
> The MRP 30T Bling ring weighs 56 grams.
> ...


pwu_1 - I see you're just across the water from me - please could you tell me where you bought the XX1 and bling ring? (I'm presuming you hunted down a good deal!)

Any chance of pics?


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## pwu_1 (Nov 19, 2007)

BigwheelsRbest said:


> pwu_1 - I see you're just across the water from me - please could you tell me where you bought the XX1 and bling ring? (I'm presuming you hunted down a good deal!)
> 
> Any chance of pics?


The cheapest price I found on the XX1 crankset is upgradecycle.com They are selling them for $241 with free shipping in the US. Took them about a week after ordering before they shipped. Make sure you order the right Q-factor cranks for your bike.

The cheapest bling ring I've found is $57 with $2.99 shipping in the US at universalcycles.com They are out of stock at the moment though.
I found another place called benscycle.com where they are selling the bling ring for $69.95 plus $2.92 shipping but they had a 15% discount code(SRCH15) which brought the total price down to $62.38 They shipped the 30T ring a day after I placed the order


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

^^^ Cool. Thanks. Looks nice.

I thought from your profile you were in Dublin (I'm in the UK) but if you're shopping in the US I must be mistaken.


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## Coach417 (Jul 13, 2007)

Just picked up a XX1 168q 175mm Crankset with External BB inc. from Backcountry for $228 shipped. They have a 20% off code until April 7th if anyone is interested.


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

*What BB shell for this spiderless crank set?*

Anyone know what BB shell these cranks are designed for?

X0 cranks


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## Stevob (Feb 27, 2009)

I'd say its a normal 24mm spindle which means gxp bb which means 68 or 73mm English threaded shell. But don't take my word for it. Ask the seller


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

Stevob said:


> I'd say its a normal 24mm spindle which means gxp bb which means 68 or 73mm English threaded shell. But don't take my word for it. Ask the seller


Thanks. I have asked but am not getting a reply!


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## Click Click Boom (Oct 23, 2008)

I'm using XX1's on 2 of my bikes. The best weight weenie combo I have found is the BB30 cranks using e13 bb and a 28t bling ring. They came in a 584 grams. They are on my On One Scandal. this combo works with most 68mm BB shells.


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## jmartinez84 (May 1, 2012)

Anyone seen spiderless rings for rotor cranks?


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## dfuse (Feb 8, 2013)

BigwheelsRbest said:


> Very nice. Will try to find out weights and a UK distributor.


Did you ever find a UK online shop that sells it? So far I've only found this link: Ison Distribution
via the mountainbike forum of Belgium (where I am from).


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

Just bought some XO with 32T bling ring on eBay - waiting for them


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## dfuse (Feb 8, 2013)

In the US then? Cause I can't find any UK seller on ebay that sells MRP, US only it seems


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

dfuse said:


> In the US then? Cause I can't find any UK seller on ebay that sells MRP, US only it seems


Don't know where the dude got the bling ring from but he is in North Wales. I'm in the south east. It was on a set of X0's. Paid £240 for the set, and it hasn't been used.

It's gonna be on my Ti rigid singlespeed in a couple of days, hopefully... as long as he posted it!


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

dfuse said:


> In the US then? Cause I can't find any UK seller on ebay that sells MRP, US only it seems


Cranks arrived. Look awesome. 523g without BB but with the 32T bling ring. Looks like the MRP bling ring came from Evans (UK):

MRP Bling Ring Direct Mount Chainring for SRAM X Series Cranks | Evans Cycles


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## dfuse (Feb 8, 2013)

At Evans the 32t has been out of stock since late 2012, but I ordered a Wolftooth yesterday and it is already shipped!
http://forums.mtbr.com/singlespeed/different-brands-spiderless-rings-853562.html


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## Kyri (Mar 1, 2009)

davesauvageau said:


> Profile NoBoss cranks
> Profile Spline Drive chainwheel
> 
> Solid, clean, super easy to set up and looks great! I have this setup on my Karate Monkey, wish I had pics of it assembled!


What kind of bottom bracket did you use with that setup?


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

How does chainline work out with either XX1/XX0 cranks, and the various chainrings/hubs?


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