# '91 Specialized Epic Ultimate



## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

My newest project: 1991 Specialized Stumpjumper Epic Ultimate, 18", #3441 !



















The Shimano Octalink BB will go out asap and it'll be replaced with Specialized DirectDrive Ti BB.
Parts will be Suntour XC Pro but probably with Nuke Proof hubs and XTR M900 cassette.

Enjoy!


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## djmuff (Sep 8, 2004)

damn. I think this is the bike I would post in that "which VRC'ers bike do you most want?" Please keep us updated with pics and info!


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Ah, the eBay special. Nice. 

That's a nice one.

You're not keeping the Ringle post in it are you?


Looking forward to seeing the finished product!


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Ah, the eBay special. Nice.
> 
> That's a nice one.
> 
> ...


Yeah, a very nice frame! Too bad it's got a little short toptube (~560mm).

I'm trying to find black IRD post for it...

BTW: Does anyone know who many of the ti lugged Ultimates were produced ?


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

get a post w/ setback. an xt or xtr, maybe xc pro. the shallow seat angle plus a low handlebar position will give you room.
the ird, besides being rare has no setback.


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## scant (Jan 5, 2004)

Archangel said:


> Yeah, a very nice frame! Too bad it's got a little short toptube (~560mm).
> 
> I'm trying to find black IRD post for it...
> 
> BTW: Does anyone know who many of the ti lugged Ultimates were produced ?


Its looking very nice Kai 

cambriabike.com are selling american classic titanium layback seatposts for a reasonable price  (& no I dont work for them...its a long commute from wales  EDIT, scrub that, no longer listed!  EDIT

in the specialized anniversary book specialized reckoned on around 1500 ultimate frames & around 2000 steel lug epic frames.


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

Actually I have one Am Classic Ti post but I had planned to use that in S-Works for I have Specialized Ti stem for it and thought that they could match pretty well...


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Here is another oldie Epic, the Ultimate frameset from 1992/1993, its carbon fiber tubes with titanium lugs, handmade, very pricey for its day, the titanium lugs were made by Merlin. The paint job is very cool, its a Burgundy color on the 3 main tubes and the rear triangle is green, it has a 3-D depth to it, a bit holographic, hard to capture in a picture

It used to be a hardtail but its tough to find 1 inch steerer forks anymore.

EDIT: 19 inch frame, #7930, I think there were only a couple hundred of the frames made, they barely broke even on the frames, Merlin charged them a pretty hefty fee to make the Ti lugs


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## AKamp (Jan 26, 2004)

pastajet said:


> Here is another oldie Epic, the Ultimate frameset from 1992/1993, its carbon fiber tubes with titanium lugs, handmade, very pricey for its day, the titanium lugs were made by Merlin. The paint job is very cool, its a Burgundy color on the 3 main tubes and the rear triangle is green, it has a 3-D depth to it, a bit holographic, hard to capture in a picture
> 
> It used to be a hardtail but its tough to find 1 inch steerer forks anymore.
> 
> EDIT: 19 inch frame, #7930, I think there were only a couple hundred of the frames made, they barely broke even on the frames, Merlin charged them a pretty hefty fee to make the Ti lugs


That is a nice looking bike, but I sure hope that isn't a Zoom stem on it. Doesn't give a bike like that justice.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

pastajet said:


> Here is another oldie Epic, the Ultimate frameset from 1992/1993, its carbon fiber tubes with titanium lugs, handmade, very pricey for its day, the titanium lugs were made by Merlin. The paint job is very cool, its a Burgundy color on the 3 main tubes and the rear triangle is green, it has a 3-D depth to it, a bit holographic, hard to capture in a picture
> 
> It used to be a hardtail but its tough to find 1 inch steerer forks anymore.
> 
> EDIT: 19 inch frame, #7930, I think there were only a couple hundred of the frames made, they barely broke even on the frames, Merlin charged them a pretty hefty fee to make the Ti lugs


Then you should recognize this frame...the fork is on the front of your bike.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Yes, I am now embarrassed it is a Zoom stem, been spending all my free money on my Ibis Mojo instead, now I need to replace the Zoom...ugh 

E Man the bike looks sweet! Very nice build. Glad FedEx didn't crater that frame!


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Then you should recognize this frame...the fork is on the front of your bike.


that bike does look particularly nice and Nedly in that shot. (all but those crank bolts)


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

pastajet said:


> E Man the bike looks sweet! Very nice build. Glad FedEx didn't crater that frame!


I've been really happy with it. Came out great, it's light weight yet still almost all period correct.

If you ever want to swap forks...you know how to get a hold of me. 

And yeah...FedEx...that was a stressful couple of weeks. :nonod:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Fillet-brazed said:


> (all but those crank bolts)


Hey! :skep:


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

The work progresses...  
All XC Pro except Specialized Ti BB and QRs. Got that IRD seatpost too (Thanks Harzkristall ! :thumbsup: ). 
Still missing brakes (Dia-Compe 986), grips (Grab-On MTN-2) and cables (Suntour/Dia-Compe).


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Archangel said:


> The work progresses...
> All XC Pro except Specialized Ti BB and QRs. Got that IRD seatpost too (Thanks Harzkristall ! :thumbsup: ).
> Still missing brakes (Dia-Compe 986), grips (Grab-On MTN-2) and cables (Suntour/Dia-Compe).


Looking good!

(needs tan wall tires too!  )


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

pastajet said:


> Yes, I am now embarrassed it is a Zoom stem, been spending all my free money on my Ibis Mojo instead, now I need to replace the Zoom...ugh
> 
> E Man the bike looks sweet! Very nice build. Glad FedEx didn't crater that frame!


but the zoom is lighter than the specialized team edition chromoly stem that frame was usually built with.. and high end treks back then came w/ the zoom. it's a good part. it's just not as trendy as a salsa.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

I got it as a frameset so it didn't come with anything. It was my main mtn bike for over a decade so it has gone through a lot of part changes. Had a Rock Shock Mag21 SL until it kicked the bucket. Since the shock was threadless I had a very sweet Ibis Ti stem. I sold it to help pay for my new full suspension bike. Now my Epic is my training and commuting bike. Much prefer the XTR rapidfire shifting compared to the old Suntour stuff, but its not vintage! Same for the XTR V brakes compared to the old Diacompe's.:thumbsup:

EDIT: spelling and typo's fixed


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## AKamp (Jan 26, 2004)

colker1 said:


> but the zoom is lighter than the specialized team edition chromoly stem that frame was usually built with.. and high end treks back then came w/ the zoom. it's a good part. it's just not as trendy as a salsa.


Sure, they were light and functional but having a $30 stem on a 2000 dollar frame is just depressing. But you are right, the did work well.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Ouch, what is with the Zoom stem? Its functional and I happened to own it, I had no other quill stem, not like I can go down to the LBS and ask for a nice quill stem for a 1 inch steerer. If I would find anything it would be another cheapy.

So what do you recommend then? Since the frame did not come with a stem and I had a aheadset shock set up I never had a quill stem installed until I dumped the shock. I had the spare Zoom sitting around. I did have a old Ritchey stem (Nitto) at one time but the reach was to much for my taste.


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## AKamp (Jan 26, 2004)

pastajet said:


> Ouch, what is with the Zoom stem? Its functional and I happened to own it, I had no other quill stem, not like I can go down to the LBS and ask for a nice quill stem for a 1 inch steerer. If I would find anything it would be another cheapy.
> 
> So what do you recommend then? Since the frame did not come with a stem and I had a aheadset shock set up I never had a quill stem installed until I dumped the shock. I had the spare Zoom sitting around. I did have a old Ritchey stem (Nitto) at one time but the reach was to much for my taste.


Sorry, I really don't mean to bag on the stem. To be honest I have had a hard-on for one of those frames for a really long time. Came extremely close to buying one back when they were new but I couldn't quite come up with the money. I really hope you didn't take any offense to the stem comment because that bike is beautiful and I am really sorry if I insulted your bike over something so little as a stem. You really do have a cool bike there and you should definitely be proud to ride it, I know I would be. And I know what you mean, finding a nice 1 inch quilled stem can take a really long time.


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## scant (Jan 5, 2004)

pastajet said:


> .
> 
> So what do you recommend then? .


sell the frame to me 

I've mailed you direct b.t.w regarding http://kalimotxo.com/mtb/specialized_ultimate_owners.html


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

pastajet said:


> Ouch, what is with the Zoom stem? Its functional and I happened to own it, I had no other quill stem, not like I can go down to the LBS and ask for a nice quill stem for a 1 inch steerer. If I would find anything it would be another cheapy.
> 
> So what do you recommend then? Since the frame did not come with a stem and I had a aheadset shock set up I never had a quill stem installed until I dumped the shock. I had the spare Zoom sitting around. I did have a old Ritchey stem (Nitto) at one time but the reach was to much for my taste.


a ringle zooka quill black 135 stem sold for $60 on ebay a couple days ago. it doesn't get any nicer than that. having said that i just bought a specialized team edition for $10. it's heavy..


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

No offense taken...well maybe a little, sense of pride etc, anyway I will explore getting a new stem for the bike, I have ridden a lot of frames in my life and nothing had the feel of the Epic Ultimate, something about combining the 2 properties of Titanium and Carbon Fiber together was simply magic, it seemed to accelerate down hill, kind of a weird feeling, but one special bike frame. It was pricey for its day, think it was $2600 or so in March 1993

I wouldn't sell for anything, after all its the Ultimate!


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## scant (Jan 5, 2004)

pastajet said:


> No offense taken...well maybe a little, sense of pride etc, anyway I will explore getting a new stem for the bike, I have ridden a lot of frames in my life and nothing had the feel of the Epic Ultimate, something about combining the 2 properties of Titanium and Carbon Fiber together was simply magic, it seemed to accelerate down hill, kind of a weird feeling, but one special bike frame. It was pricey for its day, think it was $2600 or so in March 1993
> 
> I wouldn't sell for anything, after all its the Ultimate!


I wouldnt sell either  US price seems like a bargain! in UK in 92 ultimates were £3100! 

ibis titanium quill stems are superb & come up on ebay/private sale every so often. that would be an ideal stem


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

pastajet said:


> No offense taken...well maybe a little, sense of pride etc, anyway I will explore getting a new stem for the bike, I have ridden a lot of frames in my life and nothing had the feel of the Epic Ultimate, something about combining the 2 properties of Titanium and Carbon Fiber together was simply magic, it seemed to accelerate down hill, kind of a weird feeling, but one special bike frame. It was pricey for its day, think it was $2600 or so in March 1993
> 
> I wouldn't sell for anything, after all its the Ultimate!


ritchey quill stems. wcs. nitto built. bought mine at firstflight. classy and light.they have a gold tint that matches the carbon.


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## steelhead (Jul 8, 2004)

Ahhhhhh......... This is my dreambike!!


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## Arran (Jan 27, 2006)

There's nothing wrong with Zoom stems (or bars for that matter). I used them back in the day and actually have a few of them lying around now waiting for the right project...

Rumphy,

I wasn't impressed by the 8mm crank bolts either.  Otherwise... :thumbsup:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Arran said:


> Rumphy,
> I wasn't impressed by the 8mm crank bolts either.  Otherwise... :thumbsup:


Send me the correct Shimano crank dust covers.


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

rad frames. i forgot all about these. there's one for sale i may check out today; is there anything to look out for? what's reasonable market pricing?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Hard to say what they're worth.

Personally I think the market value for a clean Epic frame and correct fork should be $250-500...but thats a pretty broad number.

Keep in mine this is the steel lugged version. Ti luggers go for quite a bit more.


Great riding bike.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Geez I have no idea on price, I wouldn't let mine go for anything! Well maybe $1M :thumbsup: 

Its tough to get an idea of what my frame looks like but this pic does it best:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Keep in mind that there are 'Epics' and 'S-works'.

Here's one of each:


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

what's the difference / which is the 'ultimate' (or are they both)?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

xy9ine said:


> what's the difference / which is the 'ultimate' (or are they both)?


Neither is the Ultimate. Ultimates had the Ti Lugs.

The one with the yellow is an older 'Epic' from about 91.

The other is, essentially the same bike, but the name changed to the 'S-Works' in about 92/93.

Both are steel lugged.


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

ah, ok. thanks. this one is purportedly an ultimate. if its not mangled, i'll pick it up & report back (the price is right).


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

well, it's size huge & pretty rough cosmetically, but for $50 i couldn't pass it up. really light for its size - about 3.5lbs on my scale:


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## scant (Jan 5, 2004)

obviously thats an ultimate! (if it wasnt for the decal the more square cut rather than rounded dropouts without the mud guards eyelets is the give away)
nice find, espicially for the price!


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

xy9ine said:


> well, it's size huge & pretty rough cosmetically, but for $50 i couldn't pass it up. really light for its size - about 3.5lbs on my scale:


id put drop bars on that and 700's just for the goofy factor of it all!


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

yeah, i was thinking i could do something roadie-esque. for now i'll probably strip it (paint over titanium seems so wrong) then ponder its fate.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Williwoods said:


> id put drop bars on that and 700's just for the goofy factor of it all!


How would you get 700's on there?


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

Nice catch xy9ine! :thumbsup:

As the thread starter, I thought I'd share some light on the current progress with the Ultimate:










It's finished and having lots of NOS parts but I'd love to have black period-correct Specialized alloy handlebar in it. Shayne generously helped me obtain one Ground Control Extreme /S 1.95" tire but I need another one to have the correct tires in it too.
However, it won't be a faithful restoration for I'm using a Specialized ti bb instead of XC Pro in it and currently it has Specialized quick releases instead of XC Pro as well.


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

Here's a parts spec:

Frame: 1991 Specialized Epic Ultimate, 18"
Fork: Specialized Direct Drive
Headset: Suntour XC Pro Grease Guard  1" 
Stem: Specialized Team
Handlebar: Titec / Bontrager Titanium
Grips: GrabOn MTN-2 
Brakes: Dia-Compe 986
Cantilever cable hangers: Dia-Compe 
Brake Levers: Suntour Multimount, 2-finger model 
Brake Cables: Dia-Compe MTB Advantage
Shifters: Suntour XC Pro thumbies
Front Derailleur: Suntour XC Pro 
Rear Derailleur: Suntour XC Pro
Shifter Cables: Shimano XTR with Suntour Accushift housings 
Cassette: Suntour XC Pro Powerflo 7 spd 
Chain: Shimano HG-90 
Cranks: Suntour XC Pro 
Chainrings: Suntour Powerflo 46/36/26 
Bottom Bracket: Specialized Direct Drive Titanium 
Pedals: Suntour XC Pro Grease Guard 
Quick Releases: Specialized Titanium 
Rims: Araya RM400 Pro 
Hubs: Suntour XC Pro Grease Guard 
Tyres: Specialized Ground Control II /S & Team Control /S 
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo 
Seatpost: Interloc


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Archangel said:


> Nice catch xy9ine! :thumbsup:
> 
> As the thread starter, I thought I'd share some light on the current progress with the Ultimate:
> 
> ...


It looks absolutely fantastic! Classy, classy bike. :thumbsup:


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## Seb Clawhammer (Nov 23, 2009)

Sorry to bring up this thread from the dust but how much would an Epic Ultimate go for? What sort of price are we looking at?


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

Ultimate? your referring to the model with the Ti lugs?


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## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

Seb Clawhammer said:


> Sorry to bring up this thread from the dust but how much would an Epic Ultimate go for? What sort of price are we looking at?


About 3 used Powerbar wrappers, unless it's mint, then I'll give ya 4

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=463090

Welcome to the VRC, and eBay is a great place to look for pricing. It's an odd lot around here, learn the ropes, and have a good time:thumbsup:

KB, have you ridden both? I've got a ti, always wondered if the steels rode any different....


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> KB, have you ridden both? I've got a ti, always wondered if the steels rode any different....


I have the steel lug version, rides great. Never ridden the Ti lug version, Dont think you would feel any difference


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## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

kb11 said:


> I haDont think you would feel any difference


Yeah, kinda what I figured, but it never hurts to ask.....

I'll have to keep my eye's open for a steel version, not common, but probably cheaper than a ti at this point.....

I think they went 19, 21 didn't they? I always find my 19 a tad small feeling. Love my 20" S Works steel......


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Yeah, kinda what I figured, but it never hurts to ask.....
> 
> I'll have to keep my eye's open for a steel version, not common, but probably cheaper than a ti at this point.....
> 
> I think they went 19, 21 didn't they? I always find my 19 a tad small feeling. Love my 20" S Works steel......


Steel versions are way cheaper than the TI. Mine is a 18", Sizing is the same as the steel bikes, if a 20" s-works fits then get a 20" Carbon. Is thing you will notice is how much smoother the carbon rides


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## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

kb11 said:


> Steel versions are way cheaper than the TI. Mine is a 18", Sizing is the same as the steel bikes, if a 20" s-works fits then get a 20" Carbon. Is thing you will notice is how much smoother the carbon rides


Did they do a 20 in the Ti? I don't recall that being the case. I bought one of the 19's, and a customer at the shop who was perhaps 2" taller, got a 21. I want to say, he wanted a 20, but they didn't offer it.

Guess I should just go and look myself....

Yeah, the carbon is definitely smoother, love that bike, even if she's a tad small.....


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Did they do a 20 in the Ti? I don't recall that being the case. I bought one of the 19's, and a customer at the shop who was perhaps 2" taller, got a 21. I want to say, he wanted a 20, but they didn't offer it.
> .


My '94 specialized catalog show Ti Carbon bikes available in 16.5" /18"/19"/20"21.5"


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## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

kb11 said:


> My '94 specialized catalog show Ti Carbon bikes available in 16.5" /18"/19"/20"21.5"


Now I'm curious if I'm crazy...

You have any info on the '95 Ned editions? I know they only made 60 of each size, but I could have sworn they did a limited number of sizes too.

All I know is, when our rep called us to tell us they were hot sheeting these frames for $500, I nearly shat myself, and begged borrowed or stole (well, not really) to get the funds for #35 ....:thumbsup:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

$500 for that is cheeeeap.


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Now I'm curious if I'm crazy...
> 
> You have any info on the '95 Ned editions? I know they only made 60 of each size, but I could have sworn they did a limited number of sizes too.
> 
> All I know is, when our rep called us to tell us they were hot sheeting these frames for $500, I nearly shat myself, and begged borrowed or stole (well, not really) to get the funds for #35 ....:thumbsup:


I don't have any info on the '95 TI Carbon frames. I believe this was the last year they were made. Nice score for $500!!! :thumbsup: If it were me, I'd try to pickup a steel lug version for a rider and keep the Ti unmolested


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

*Not 'Back in the Day'*



Rumpfy said:


> $500 for that is cheeeeap.


That was the going rate in in the mid to late 90's

Complete used bikes could be had for about the same price.


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Now I'm curious if I'm crazy...
> 
> You have any info on the '95 Ned editions? I know they only made 60 of each size, but I could have sworn they did a limited number of sizes too.
> 
> All I know is, when our rep called us to tell us they were hot sheeting these frames for $500, I nearly shat myself, and begged borrowed or stole (well, not really) to get the funds for #35 ....:thumbsup:


'95 is basically the same as all the Epic Ultimate frames from 1991 onwards.
But it was not limited to 60 frames per each size but 60 frames total. You could get it in all normal sizes 16", 18", 20", 22".

1991: Stumpjumper Epic Ultimate: black hued tubes, black lugs (painted)
1992: S-Works Ultimate: green or red hued tubes, black lugs
1993: S-Works Ultimate: similar to 1993
1994: S-Works Ultimate: black hued tubes, silver lugs (painted)
1995: S-Works Ultimate: similar to 1994, limited to 60 pieces, each with number plate

Here's my '91 in its original factory spec:


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## Seb Clawhammer (Nov 23, 2009)

I'll have to pop some pics up of the bike, got the magnet out and it is steel lugged, pretty sure it's a '93 frame though. All original spec - full XTR apart from XT rear mech, Pace RC35s on the front, Hope hubs, Ti bars and stem - still trying to work out the make of them mind. 

As you can tell this bike is nearly as old as me, just meant to be selling it on behalf of a friend of mine, he raced it in the Nationals here in the UK in 92 and 93 and won both series on it then stored it in a heated loft for the last 14 years! It's in mint condition, just need to pop some pics up so you can guys can help me work out exactly what it is!

Pete


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