# Hardtail Downhillin'



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

How many of you guys do it and why?? Post up your sick fr/dh hardtails and show some love for hardtails.


----------



## Bryguy17 (May 19, 2007)

I did a little of it for awhile, but it got old pretty fast.

Reasons why I did it:
hardtails are challenging to ride fast. You have to place line choice as a top priority, otherwise you pinchflat and bounce all over the place.
The aforementioned challenge is great bike handling training that WILL make you faster on a FS bike.
It's cheap. I built my rig for under 1000 and it works quite well. granted, a lot of the parts (including the frame) suck.

Reasons I gave up on it:
It beats you up big time, especially if you're riding in rockier areas and still keeping up with FS guys.
I got a sweet deal on a FS bike, and I'm done outriding a hardtail for the time being. Perhaps something nuts like a knolly free-radical could be in the future though.

here she is









'06 66SL dropped to 140mm
supergo launch wheels (same as TBC revolution32's)
formula oros
and it got a set of saint cranks after the pic was taken.

It ripped for what it was, but I think it'll be awhile before I'm back on a hardtail for any gravity riding (save for some 4x). And yes, i know, holy seatpost etc. I had it able to work as a trail bike too, but I built it as a more DHable bike. Plus, it's how you ride it, not how its supposed to be ridden


----------



## ducktape (May 21, 2007)

Well I sold my old Trance so I could get a bike that would be capable of doing DH as well as XC. My weapon of choice was the STP because it can more than handle the DH riding (well particularly at my lack of skill and ability) and it is light enough for XC rides and going into town etc (compared to FR HT's like Norco Rampage).
My skill would have to improve drastically before I'd have justification to buy a dually. Either way I have plenty of love for this HT










Funny thing is when I'm riding downhill over small rock gardens or happend to get a bit of air, it actually still feels like I've got some suspension back there, guess the legs must work well!


----------



## 3viltoast3r (Aug 27, 2007)

Well i dont post much, im more a reader but heres my time to shine:

Heres my Kona 5-0, and Kona haters dont disreguard just because its a Kona, i can keep up with FS sleds NP.
I will give a little spec list, i have changed a few parts from stock.
Marzocchi 55 R (adjusted to 160mm)
Sun equalizer 31 wheelset
MRP chainguide
Hayes Stroker trail 7"
Crank bros 5050X pedals
Imperial lock-on grips
WTB seat/post

Although it did come with some 'cheesy' alivio drivetrain, i have salvaged parts and its now pretty much a deore. Also i fixed up that dodgy tube frame protector.....

Pretty soon im going to put single ply 2.35" highrollers and ghetto tubeless which will drop her weight by half a kilo.

Also i never flat..........had her for 6 months and ive had 1 flat. running about 25-30 PSI. Just have to have the right technique, alhough i will admit the big drops on DH tracks into rockgardens do cause some concern.

Thats my 'do it all rig', i can freeride,DH,DJ and take her along any trail yet still take her to the shops and my mates house's.

*sorry i will post up piccy's soon, my stupid windows computer doesnt have MS paint to scale down the photos for some reason.


----------



## suicidebomber (Feb 10, 2007)

The blunt answer is I don't have the money. My parents don't understand on spending a lot for a bicycle but I do.

But heck, its good training. It's going to stay with me for a LONG time.

And like ducktape said here, I want to be a hell of a lot better before I go squishy.


----------



## danyiluska (Sep 20, 2006)

> How many of you guys do it and why?? Post up your sick fr/dh hardtails and show some love for hardtails.


I've seen a few "Is it possible at all to actually ride hardtails out there?!!" threads and a bit fed up. Yes, you can ride FR or DH on hardtails, and it's NOT A PROBLEM AT ALL, because i descend in standing position.
And why i ride hardtails? Because i don't like full suspension.


----------



## SteveUK (Apr 16, 2006)

I have an Orange SubZero frame which I switch all parts (except seatpin and rear wheel) from my Big Hit. It was the cheapest way I could find to have two decent bikes. Most (but not all) trails I ride the Big Hit on I'll take the Orange on. It's almost like riding a different trail depending on which frame I'm on, but I'll always learn something on one which I can take to the other. I have a propensity for idleness which my hardtail does not permit me. It's easier to get away with one's mistakes on a long-travel bike, so regular hardtail riding goes some way to preventing mistakes from becoming habit.


----------



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

nice rides. keep em coming.


----------



## DirtGash (Mar 1, 2008)

Because they're cheap, burly, look bad ass, and have little maintance.

If setup correctly you can do anything on a hardtail that you can do on a dually, well maybe not a world cup DH course...

Key is the biggest fork you can put up front, big wide tires with low pressure, a nice burly frame. Your body is your biggest source of suspension, so keep your seat all the way down and ride.

I sold my last dually I owned to get my freeride hardtail. Since then I have far exceeded any downhill trail or jump, drop, gap that I was pulling off on my dually. Best of all is when you can really shred on your hardtail, chances are you're out shredding people on their duallies. Oh yeah, and you can actually climb a hardtail back to the top of the run.


----------



## gop427 (Jan 16, 2006)

Rode it today with my bro on his 7 & 7 dual crown rig. Had a blast, like usual. The last pic was from over a year ago, it's the only HT pic I have, I am usually to picture taker, not the one being shot.


----------



## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

Bryguy17 said:


> I did a little of it for awhile, but it got old pretty fast.
> 
> Reasons why I did it:
> hardtails are challenging to ride fast. You have to place line choice as a top priority, otherwise you pinchflat and bounce all over the place.
> ...


Supergo Launch is not the same as the TBC wheels. The Supergo wheels are the same as the Locos... which use the Supra BH rim. Same rim as the Outlaws, but 32h and pinned.


----------



## pro (Oct 7, 2007)

Anyone runnin a DC fork on a hardtail?


----------



## spazzy (Aug 15, 2004)

nice hardtails everyone, im running an 07 mongoose ritual, but its in dj mode right now, im kinda half building for dh/fr and half for dj, ill see if i can get some pics up later
fork: argyle 318 (looking for a pike or something else that i can adjust the travel)
wheelset ditch witches laced to shimano lxs i think not quite sure what hubs i have now though lol
brakes bb7s paired to avid speed dial levers (yea its flat in wisconsin and i can get away with mechs)
bmx style crankset its a singlespeed and im changing that sometime too, looking to go deore or saint rear derauller
azonic world force bars, sette stumpy stem


----------



## Bryguy17 (May 19, 2007)

pro said:


> Anyone runnin a DC fork on a hardtail?


I believe DWF runs a DC on his knolly when he's doing more gnar stuff or parks. AFAIK he's got a totem on there right now though. He would be the guy to talk to about DH hardtailing :thumbsup:


----------



## crazy Jim (Mar 31, 2005)

went to AngelFire back in 2000 with a Jamis full sus xc rig and a dirt jump bike. One trip down the mountain and I figured out the geometry of the xc bike and the narrow bars were not gonna cut it. I got the DJ bike out and killed the mountain on it. Similar thing happened back in '98 at Steamboat when I had just a HT xc rig. One time down the mountain with narrow bars and I went straight to the shop and purchased some DH bars.


----------



## PepperJester (Jan 2, 2003)

DH SS! I love this bike to death. Shown more or less in it's full on DH mode. It's pretty damn fast for a hardtale, slack angles, long wheel base, shot top tube. It's great it feels just like my real DH bike but with out the squish. It's really stable at speed and on steep trails.










the key to hardtail downhilling it in building your own drop outs to get the perfect angles


----------



## PepperJester (Jan 2, 2003)

best shot of me ripping on my Astrix










(wrong date on the pic that was in 2007)


----------



## GravityWins (Dec 18, 2005)

I switched from a FS to a hardail at the beginning of the summer to improve my bike handling skills, it has made me a much better rider in the 3 months I've been on it. Soaking up bumps, jumps and drops with my body as opposed to rear suspension has made me smoother and better able to read the trail.

Heres my Vagrant 










This is as far as the wife was willing to hike the hill to film me


----------



## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

Geeze this thread cracks me up  Not trying to sound like a grumpy old man here, but in my day when I started riding 20 years ago, all we had were hardtails and rigid forks. You stood on the pedals, moved your butt as far to the rear of the bike as you could, pointed the bike downhill and hung on! Sure it was bumpy! It would rattle you skull so bad you had blurred vision and chattering teeth! But that's the way it was and we *LIKED* it!.

I still have that bike too: Diamond Back Ascent EX with Shimano Rapidfire XT components. Double butted chromolly tubing with a lifetime warrentee on the frame and forks. I've trashed 5 rims over the years, had my lower bracket replaced, too many different tires to remember, yada yada. I still ride that bike to this day, its set up with fat slicks. Back in college I used it to messenger part time.

So now I'm looking to buy a new bike, 29er hardtail. I've ridden a coupe of full suspension bikes in the last couple of years, and I couldn't stand riding any of them for any distance, even with the rear preload fully cranked up. I'll probably get a Fisher X-Caliber.


----------



## DanD (Jan 15, 2004)

GpzGuy said:


> ...when I started riding 20 years ago, all we had were hardtails and rigid forks...


And that's all that the guy standing next to you in the start line would have had, also.


----------



## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

Nice one DanD
But seriously I think its all relative. Before I understood the whats what of fullies I was riding a xc hardtail. Found out about freeriding and Dh so changed my bars, stem, fork, wheels and tires. Made a huge difference but was hard to manual and jump obviously and I found aluminium to be harsh-but only after trying a chromoly frame. So I decided to get a fully and it was amazing. Then I tried a friends hardtail and was blown away. Sold the fully and bought a custom chromoly frame and it Rawks! But for DH I take a beating through the rooty rocky sections. 
Whats the point? Well if I hadnt tried a fully and then a really good hardtail then I wouldnt of known the pros and cons of each. I am digging my hardtail and everything anyone has ever posted is true. My riding over the last month has improved immensely and I think now if I were to ride a fully I would understand how to use it properly. Hardtails really do make you look more into how a trail can be ridden. I see far more lines and options than I did when on a fully. I seriously think I would be far quicker on a fully now and not feel so battered after a good DH ride. But I would never go back to just having a fully, hardtails jump so nice and feel so fast and responsive on the smooth sections. I aslo find I enjoy not having to go through the compression of a fully after jumps and drops. 
Enjoy whatever you and ride whatever you enjoy!


----------



## danyiluska (Sep 20, 2006)

Here's me...


----------



## 3viltoast3r (Aug 27, 2007)

Ok heres pictures for my Kona 5-0:
Although this photo is a tad old, the only major change is that stupid chainstay tube........Dont worry Ive fixed up so its all nice and neat and Ive stretched it so it only uses about 1/4 of the tube.


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Where's that pic....
Ahh, EastCoastHucker's Morphine:


----------



## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

who's the couple in the pic. nearly didnt notice the morphine - nice!

3viltoast3r- before anyone else tells u, watch that fork skewer. leave it like that and your fork could be grabbing some rocks.


----------



## _daemon_ (Sep 16, 2007)

ducktape said:


> Well I sold my old Trance so I could get a bike that would be capable of doing DH as well as XC. My weapon of choice was the STP because it can more than handle the DH riding (well particularly at my lack of skill and ability) and it is light enough for XC rides and going into town etc (compared to FR HT's like Norco Rampage).
> My skill would have to improve drastically before I'd have justification to buy a dually. Either way I have plenty of love for this HT
> 
> 
> ...


Got a Trance and a STP 

What fork is that on the STP? I have a DJ4, thinking of upgrading to something with a bit more travel, perhaps a Pike.


----------



## ratmloud (May 21, 2007)

DH and hardtail mentioned , yet NO one posts up a Sinister Ridge?


----------



## man w/ one hand (Dec 29, 2003)

Some yrs back on MTBR, there used to be some really sick lookin' ht's, (used mainly for urban, I think), Le Toys, that were built up w/fat tires and really slung back geo. that gave them a killer look. Liking old HD choppers, "showin' my age", they really stood out for me. Not sure if you can find them on here now....


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

The 24 Bicycles website seems to under construction (Le toy makers).
Looks like they have some products coming.


----------



## DirtGash (Mar 1, 2008)

Here is a not so good picture of my beast. '04 Norco Rampage with lots of upgrades...SRAM X-9 drivetrain, Diablous seatpost, and headset, have an Easton Vice stem on the way, Husselfelt bars and cranks, New Hayes 9 with 8 inch rotors, Mobster 2.7 in front, High Roller 2.5 in rear, and still rocking the stock 160mm DJ 2. The fork is a love/hate relationship....not bump sensitive at all (what do you expect for a DJ), but man when doing hucks, or drops this fork is your best friend! 

Plan on rebuilding my bike this winter. Current weight is 42lbs, hoping to shed a little. Most of it is the fork which weighs 7 lbs. Have new cranks going to convert to MRP single ring (38T), fresh wheel set, and best of all....going to slap a Totem up front!!!! 

I love my HT and I love riding it, everyday, and everywhere. Urban, single track, freeride park (jumps and skinnies), all day epics in the mountains, and even commuting on. I've ridden lots of duallies with small to really big travel. They all have their place, and I would love to own something like a Norco A-Line for doing bike parks as Whistler and actual circuit DH tracks. But for my everyday riding in the dirt, I have yet to ride a dually that can out perfom my HT in all the the varying conditions and places I ride. Like most people I don't have a bank account to own a bike for every kind of riding I like to do.


----------



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

that five-0 is just plain sick


----------



## Davidcopperfield (Jan 17, 2007)

Ok now show me your Rigid DH rigs


----------



## gop427 (Jan 16, 2006)

I ride this down all the time, usually after a climb.
P.S. the gay Batman does the steering, i just hang on and pedal.


----------



## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

It's SS now and has some new parts that drop the weight to around 26. Setup with gears for 4x... it's still sub-30.


----------



## StinkyFTW (Jun 29, 2008)

^DUDE. I frickin lone your bike!


----------



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

im looking at a free radical or vagrant to replace my FS, what do you guys think??


----------



## ducktape (May 21, 2007)

_daemon_ said:


> Got a Trance and a STP
> 
> What fork is that on the STP? I have a DJ4, thinking of upgrading to something with a bit more travel, perhaps a Pike.


No I don't have the Trance, I sold the frame and used the parts to upgrade my Husbands Alias and some on the STP. I figured after I got the STP and set it up as an all round bike then there would be no need for the Trance any more, think I was pretty right there too, but she was a fun bike - just a lot more maintenance compared to a HT.

I've got a Pike 454 Air U-Turn on the STP, brought from DropNZone. It's only adjustable from 110-140 bit that seems ample. I rode the Alias for a while after the Trance, and it took a little to get used to the geometry of the STP, now it would be hard to go back to the steeper angled bike such as an Alias (it's like an XTC or Yukon etc)


----------



## fisherdude4eva (Apr 29, 2007)

I have a vagrant with a 36 talas. It is the most versatile bike ever. Everything from xc, dj, fr, dh. Its very stiff/stable downhill and can be built light enough to climb rather comfortably especially if you have a travel adjust fork.


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Djponee said:


> im looking at a free radical or vagrant to replace my FS, what do you guys think??


I think... If I had the money, and *if it were actually available*, I'd get the Free Radical.

DWF's prototype frame is not the only one in existence but there are no production frames.


----------



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

yea, i will wait for a bit anyway.


----------



## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

Consider chromoly. My Cotic is strong and stiff but still has a little give. 853 all the way!


----------



## 6_grams_of_fat_not_less (Jul 23, 2008)

3viltoast3r said:


> Ok heres pictures for my Kona 5-0:
> Although this photo is a tad old, the only major change is that stupid chainstay tube........Dont worry Ive fixed up so its all nice and neat and Ive stretched it so it only uses about 1/4 of the tube.


Sweet ride, dude!
Here goes mine.


----------



## Davidcopperfield (Jan 17, 2007)

Now show your passion for dual crown forks on HT frames and rogod forks on suspended DH frames with 10" of travel.


----------



## sidhoyer (May 6, 2005)

*MY Soul Titan*

play bike mostly now that I am getting older and working more, the XC bike gets more ride time


----------



## ducktape (May 21, 2007)

6_grams_of_fat_not_less said:


> Sweet ride, dude!
> Here goes mine.


Wills Addict is one seriously good looking bike. But I reckon yours would get my vote for a DH mean machine! . . .Never heard of that brand before but it would be on top of my list! So I've got my new avatar! I'll be looking at that when / if I need a new HT! WEll maybe the FRD frame!


----------



## rabidweasel999 (Oct 22, 2006)

Nope.


----------



## scrublover (Dec 30, 2003)

Beefy custom ti, Lyrik Solo Air combo. Not a real Dh hardtail, but it was meant for steep, tight, twisty, technical trails. 67* head angle. 15" seattube, 22.5" toptube. 13" bb height. 16.5" stays at the shortest. 42.5" wheelbase.










Downtube, headtube, & chainstays are 1.2mm walled, the rest are 0.9mm. All slightly larger diameter than most ti frame tubes. Disc side stays braced, ring & lap gussets at the headtube. Seattube insert down to below the toptube and seatstay junction to beef that up. Sliding drops for SS or a Rholoff hub someday. A Kenda Nevegal DH 2.5 fits in back with lost of room to spare.









I love this bike.


----------



## 6_grams_of_fat_not_less (Jul 23, 2008)

ducktape said:


> Wills Addict is one seriously good looking bike. But I reckon yours would get my vote for a DH mean machine! Never would have guessed it's a Macmahone! That company seems to be taking off these days.


Well, that's not MacMachone frame, that's Brave Machine 33. I've never heard about MacMachone Cycles before.


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Davidcopperfield said:


> Ok now show me your Rigid DH rigs


That is what they used in the good old days. I don't have one ... yet 









http://www.sonic.net/~ckelly/Seekay/mtbwelcome.htm


----------



## rabidweasel999 (Oct 22, 2006)

Davidcopperfield said:


> Now show your passion for dual crown forks on HT frames and rogod forks on suspended DH frames with 10" of travel.


Why must you do this?


----------



## fisherdude4eva (Apr 29, 2007)

Here is my vagrant, now it has a gamut bash and a blackspire stinger. I think those are the only changes.


----------



## cdburch (Apr 25, 2007)

my ss dh ht
07 chameleon w/dt swiss 6.1/hope wheels, lyrik 2step and 185mm bb7s. sooo much fun!


----------



## toowacky (May 24, 2005)

*Dialled*



juan pablo said:


> Consider chromoly. My Cotic is strong and stiff but still has a little give. 853 all the way!


Word on the CroMoly. I just rec'd my Dialled Alpine frame yesterday, excited to build it up.
http://www.dialledbikes.com/products/mtb/alpine.html
Geo to accept a 130-160mm fork.

Edit: the pic below is not mine, but one of the pre-production builds that some e-mag was showing


----------



## JKOBD (Jul 6, 2007)

My answer is that I don't have the loot to go for the full rig....and I like to jump too much. Here is my hardtail....Specialized P-All mountain. Nice bike with the exception of the fork springs being too soft and the lack of the 20mm front axle/hub combo for my riding style. Other than that it has held up nicely.




















I recommend clicking the "watch in high quality" link below the number of views for a better viewing experience. I uploaded both qualities for those people stuck back in 1990. IF you do not see this link, refresh your page y0.


----------



## Djponee (Dec 20, 2006)

that is a cool vid. who sings the song in the first link??


----------



## DraVen (Jan 9, 2006)

here is my HT beast.
2005 GT Moto
2004 Marzocchi Dirt Jumper 2 150mm
Hayes Hfx-9 8in.


----------



## Mountain biker 41 (Oct 13, 2007)

Hey gop427, what frame is that? I love it.


----------



## NAT0007 (Nov 3, 2007)

I'll snap before it does.


----------



## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

dont know bout freeriding on a pike. i had a leaky seal but didnt ride the pike for a year so no big deal. then i got my hardtail and decided to service the pike and fit use it for my move to korea, WRONG! blew the seal last night and now I may be out of a ride for 3 weeks. I am missing my domain now. Gonna fix and sell the pike and use the money elsewhere.


----------



## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

If you blew a seal then it wasn't installed properly or you had too much oil in the semi-bath. There's very little oil in the lowers.

I've had my Pike with the same seals since 04ish.

If you're really concerned, get yourself a set of Enduro wipers.


----------



## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

XSL
Its an internal seal. I had a leaky seal before but this time its bad and last night I checked my lock out and flood gate features - they no work no more! CRAP.


----------

