# Gloworm X2 Adv. vs Outbound Solutions HANGOVER, or other? Lupine out of business?



## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

I have tried to contact Lupine for a week. No answer or call back. I call two different guys there. Did Lupine go out of business?
I have the Piko and Blika that crapped out. both are a couple few yr old. I like that the lupines mountain low on the top of the helmet, they are not sticking up high like some.

I am trying to decide between the Outbound Lighting Overhang vs the Gloworm X2 Adventure. Maybe another?
I have the Outbound Lighting Trail Evo and it has been great so far.

When the Blika worked it was nice, light wt., beam was good and I have the 4 and 2 cell packs.

I like a light wt. lamp on my helmet.
BUT A LIGHT THAT CUTS OFF IN THE MIDDLE OF RIDING CHUNK ON SINGLE TRACK with rocks and trees, SUCKS!

When using pass through/extra battery pack with the OUTBOUND LIGHTING SOLUTIONS OVERHANG /O.S.O. does it stay connected well? I assume I have to buy a cord to connect the extra battery to lamp for pass through to work
How well does the pass through work? I am wondering about the beam spread and quality of the beam on the O.S.O light.
How long a run time are you getting on the O.S.O.
Thank you.


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

With the Outbound Lighting OVERHANG Does the backup battery run the lamp or the onboard battery runs lamp and the backup keeps the onboard fully charged?
THANK YOU


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Unfortunately things have changed for the worse for high performance helmet lights. I've heard nothing about Lupine going out of business but considering all the supply chain issues going on in our crazy world I don't think I'd give up on them as they may be your best available option. Of my past top helmet light choices (Gloworm XS/Ituo XP3/Magicshine Monteer 3500) Ituo is out of business, Gloworm's new G2 series lights are less helmet capable (currently used emitters give a broader beam but far less throw per lumen than the older lights + battery compatibility limits them to heavier options that are less than ideal if you prefer to mount a battery on your helmet), and pending what I hear back from Magicshine it looks like you can no longer buy separate lightheads from magicshine (their batteries are boat anchor heavy). Gloworm's Alpha is a G1 light with a lighthead only option so simpler lighter battery packs are compatible and uses small die emitters that are more throw oriented but only 1200 lumen rated (should still out throw the 2000 lumen G2 X2). I'm waiting to hear back from Magicshine whether they still sell lightheads separately but Olight sell a co-branded Monteer 3500/RN3500 that's only $100 when listed on one of their flash sales. Outbound EVO is currently my favorite bar light but I don't think the Hangover combo's very well with it. 
Mole


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

I bought the Gloworm X2 ADVENTURE. Supposed to get 2 hours on high.
looks like it should manage lamp heat with the cooling fins.
Keeping my fingers crossed on light quality as a total package.
I really wanted to get the OUTBOUND LIGHT. 
I did speak with Tom at Outbound, seems like a good dude. And he answered the phone speakers English and knows the product! Who would have thought in todays world?
I did get a seemingly killer price on the Gloworm.


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

MRMOLE said:


> and pending what I hear back from Magicshine it looks like you can no longer buy separate lightheads from magicshine


FWIW magicshine.com still sells the mj-902s and mj-906s as light head only (906 currently on sale for about $100). This option seems to appear and disappear at random, though.


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

$146 X2 adv at Wiggle.


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

Thank you for that. Wiggle's prices on Gloworm lights are a LOT less than action-led.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Any reason to believe these are knock-off Gloworm lights?


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

Anything's possible I guess, but Wiggle is a major bike retailer in the UK and I've never seen Gloworm knock-offs on the usual asian sites where copycat gear can be found. So I'd be a bit surprised if counterfeits were to show up at Wiggle and nowhere else.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Good to hear about Wiggles.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Looks ligit to me as they have a full selection of G2 lights and a couple of G1's also (Alpha's and 1700 lumen X2 set). Some great discounts on Nightrider and Knog lights too, but other brands seem to have normal pricing. Free shipping to the US on orders over $100 added bonus.
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

mtnbikerva1 said:


> I bought the Gloworm X2 ADVENTURE. Supposed to get 2 hours on high.
> looks like it should manage lamp heat with the cooling fins.
> Keeping my fingers crossed on light quality as a total package.
> I really wanted to get the OUTBOUND LIGHT.
> ...


Thank for the alert on the Gloworm discounts! I'm going to post something in the current light deals thread. IMO the X2 you orderedd will combo much better with your EVO than the Hangover as they both have similar throw/max lux but the X2 has about 3x the lumen output so much wider beam + the wireless remote. Older G1 version has even better throw and (I think) would be compatible with your Lupine batteries + ebay FMA batteries that are about 100g lighter than similar capacity GW units (big deal if you mount the batteries to your helmet).
Mole


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

wayold said:


> Anything's possible I guess, but Wiggle is a major bike retailer in the UK and I've never seen Gloworm knock-offs on the usual asian sites where copycat gear can be found. So I'd be a bit surprised if counterfeits were to show up at Wiggle and nowhere else.


Chain Reaction too: gloworm | Chain Reaction


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

MRMOLE said:


> Thank for the alert on the Gloworm discounts! I'm going to post something in the current light deals thread. IMO the X2 you orderedd will combo much better with your EVO than the Hangover as they both have similar throw/max lux but the X2 has about 3x the lumen output so much wider beam + the wireless remote. Older G1 version has even better throw and (I think) would be compatible with your Lupine batteries + ebay FMA batteries that are about 100g lighter than similar capacity GW units (big deal if you mount the batteries to your helmet).
> Mole


You folks are welcome!


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

[delete] (better fit in another thread)


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

^^^^
Say what?

Your deleted post seemed very relevant for this thread. What thread would have a better fit?


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

I put it in the adjacent thread on deals since I thought that would be more widely read. This thread seems like it more specifically pertains to the interests of the OP and drifted into talking about deals on lights. Deals are the whole point of the other thread.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

MRMOLE said:


> Thank for the alert on the Gloworm discounts! I'm going to post something in the current light deals thread. IMO the X2 you orderedd will combo much better with your EVO than the Hangover as they both have similar throw/max lux but the X2 has about 3x the lumen output so much wider beam + the wireless remote. Older G1 version has even better throw and (I think) would be compatible with your Lupine batteries + ebay FMA batteries that are about 100g lighter than similar capacity GW units (big deal if you mount the batteries to your helmet).
> Mole


I have an older 1500 lumen X2 as a helmet light. Do you think the G2 X2 would be better than the G1 on the bars?


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

s0ckeyeus said:


> I have an older 1500 lumen X2 as a helmet light. Do you think the G2 X2 would be better than the G1 on the bars?


I bought my XS (G2) adventure to be used as my main helmet light but have never actually ridden with the light (and currently don't plan on doing so), only done output testing. That being said probably best I just share my observations so far and let you draw your own conclusions. I have the first and second version XS (G1) and the XS (G2) which uses the same emitters overall layout as the X2's with the exception of the number of emitters so G1 to G2 comparisons for the X2/XS should be similar. Even though the XS (G2) has a higher (2800 lumen) output rating my unit's results were somewhere between my 2200/2500 G1 lights and more importantly the throw measurements (max lux/cd) were considerably lower (25-35%) than both G1 versions. Lower cd and similar lumen output should indicate the G2 lights would have a wider beam but shining the lights on a wall 15' away I don't see much difference. Second strike against the G2 for me is lack of battery compatibility which is more important for me since I planned on this being a helmet light. Similar capacity FHA battery packs are around 100g lighter which is more important to me than the powerebank functions and fuel gauge on the GW battery. Additional things that would bug me for bar use are the eliomination of the Hi/Low aux. UI program and the fact you no longer can adjust the preset output levels with the mode button on the light which you now need a smart phone to do. Important to note while it sounds like I'm ragging on the G2 it's still one of the best options compared to what else is available (just not as good IMO as their G1 lights). Hey, it does charge a lot faster. Hope this helps. 
Mole


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

mtnbikerva1 said:


> I bought the Gloworm X2 ADVENTURE. Supposed to get 2 hours on high.
> looks like it should manage lamp heat with the cooling fins.
> Keeping my fingers crossed on light quality as a total package.
> I really wanted to get the OUTBOUND LIGHT.
> ...


I’d hope he speaks English, lives in Olympia WA and been working with him for almost 3 years now. 😂


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

MRMOLE said:


> Even though the XS (G2) has a higher (2800 lumen) output rating my unit's results were somewhere between my 2200/2500 G1 lights and more importantly the throw measurements (max lux/cd) were considerably lower (25-35%) than both G1 versions. Lower cd and similar lumen output should indicate the G2 lights would have a wider beam but shining the lights on a wall 15' away I don't see much difference.


Where do you think the light went then? If both lights have similar total output and beam width I don't understand what sort of beam pattern could give one a lot more throw than the other.


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## Brad (May 2, 2004)

Lupine.de definitely not out of business. 
they have dropped distributors around the world as I suspect sales have dropped with the flood of cheap Chinese lights into the market.
Pika is in stock too.
I’m using exposure Diablo on the helmet but it does mount high. It’s self contained and can be operated from the bar with a blue tooth controller. If you have an exposure bar mounted light also compatible with the controller both can be paired and you can operate both lights . 
the speed adaptive Reflex tech is really cool too. 
I used mine for a 360km Mtb race recently. The maxxD and Diablo were faultless


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

wayold said:


> Where do you think the light went then? If both lights have similar total output and beam width I don't understand what sort of beam pattern could give one a lot more throw than the other.


I'm sure a good thermal image of each beam would reveal differences in output distribution I was unable to detect with my eyes but I don't have equipment to test that. Actual usage of the G2 may also have shown more obvious differences in beam width at full throw distances compared to the 15' I was away from the wall but as I said I've not had the chance to ride with the G2. Less room for error with the max lux readings so confident G1 lights will out throw corresponding G2 units but not enough information provided from my limited G2 exposure to explain "where the light went" or have an opinion on whether the G2 lights would have any advantage for bar use.
Mole


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## andy2667 (9 mo ago)

MRMOLE said:


> I bought my XS (G2) adventure to be used as my main helmet light but have never actually ridden with the light (and currently don't plan on doing so), only done output testing. That being said probably best I just share my observations so far and let you draw your own conclusions. I have the first and second version XS (G1) and the XS (G2) which uses the same emitters overall layout as the X2's with the exception of the number of emitters so G1 to G2 comparisons for the X2/XS should be similar. Even though the XS (G2) has a higher (2800 lumen) output rating my unit's results were somewhere between my 2200/2500 G1 lights and more importantly the throw measurements (max lux/cd) were considerably lower (25-35%) than both G1 versions. Lower cd and similar lumen output should indicate the G2 lights would have a wider beam but shining the lights on a wall 15' away I don't see much difference. Second strike against the G2 for me is lack of battery compatibility which is more important for me since I planned on this being a helmet light. Similar capacity FHA battery packs are around 100g lighter which is more important to me than the powerebank functions and fuel gauge on the GW battery. Additional things that would bug me for bar use are the eliomination of the Hi/Low aux. UI program and the fact you no longer can adjust the preset output levels with the mode button on the light which you now need a smart phone to do. Important to note while it sounds like I'm ragging on the G2 it's still one of the best options compared to what else is available (just not as good IMO as their G1 lights). Hey, it does charge a lot faster. Hope this helps.
> Mole


Thank you Mole for the insight of G1 vs G2 Gloworm. You have been always very knowledgable and has been providing great insights/information for Nike lights. However, for battery compatibility about Gloworm x2/Xs/XSV G1vs G2, I have different opinion.

The G2 actually compatible to a lot of batteries using PD protocol. These batteries are widely available as power banks for smart phone, laptops, tablets, other smart devises…..etc.You can easily get such power banks/batteries ranging from 10000mah to 27000mah available from different brands including those big players at higher prices and small brands at lower prices with different capacity, weight, spec and fictions…..etc. On the contrary, G1 can only use those old style /old spec which available only in a small market niche. So, IMO, G2 has much much wider battery choices available at different price range from all markets ( not only from eBay). Also, we can use a normal Gan Charger for smart devices/power bank charging to power the G2 light head off the power socket from the wall enabling more use case for the power hand of G2

Also, G2 has much better technologies/functions IMO though I am not able to compare the throw of G1 vs G2.

Different users would have different needs and preferences. Those with the old style batteries or those have been using the old style batteries would definitely prefer G1 for battery compatibility. But for me, I will take G2 over G1 any time in view of battery choices and availability, functionality and technologies, and user interface….etc

( PS: you can easily use a normal power bank with PD function to power the G1 using a special cable/dongle: PD protocol converting to the specified DC voltage. In my area, I can get this type of cable/converter cheaply. To me, there is no point to use old style battery compatible with only DC 8.4v)


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

andy2667 said:


> To me, there is no point to use old style battery compatible with only DC 8.4v)


If one is concerned about best efficiency (runtime vs weight) the 8.4V battery method is best.


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

Vancbiker said:


> If one is concerned about best efficiency (runtime vs weight) the 8.4V battery method is best.


Is there some inefficient DC-DC conversion step when using PD powerbanks as batteries or some other factor?


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

wayold said:


> Is there some inefficient DC-DC conversion step when using PD powerbanks as batteries or some other factor?


To power the older lights you have to step the 5V up to around 8V for the lighthead, so there are inefficiencies in that, probably 10-20%. You'll also lose they battery level monitoring from the lighthead too.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

wayold said:


> Is there some inefficient DC-DC conversion step when using PD powerbanks as batteries or some other factor?


znomit hit part of it. The other part is that the nominal voltage of the battery in the powerbank is not 5V so it has undergone one round of DC-DC conversion to 5V with associated losses already. 

USB stuff is convenient though.


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## andy2667 (9 mo ago)

Vancbiker said:


> znomit hit part of it. The other part is that the nominal voltage of the battery in the powerbank is not 5V so it has undergone one round of DC-DC conversion to 5V with associated losses already.
> 
> USB stuff is convenient though.


Yes. USB stuff is more convenient with much wider compatibility for different stuff. It is available from different brands, different quality level and different price range. That is why I prefer the new USB PD standards to the conventional lighting power packs or powering methods. Now, all my power banks in hand for my mobile phones, laptop, other electronic stuff can be used for the Gloworm light heads ( be cautious that the power bank should be real PD power bank compatible with 15v output. Nearly all my power banks, except for those lower capacity old stuff, comply with this).


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

andy2667 said:


> Yes. USB stuff is more convenient with much wider compatibility for different stuff. It is available from different brands, different quality level and different price range. That is why I prefer the new USB PD standards to the conventional lighting power packs or powering methods. Now, all my power banks in hand for my mobile phones, laptop, other electronic stuff can be used for the Gloworm light heads ( be cautious that the power bank should be real PD power bank compatible with 15v output. Nearly all my power banks, except for those lower capacity old stuff, comply with this).


Unmentioned Gloworm specific USB-C interface advantage should also be reliability considering power/remote cable failure has been a common G1 issue I've noticed over the years. I can definitely see some advantages to the PD tech. but for me compatibility with my older batteries, better throw characteristics of the older emitters, and weight advantage of available plug style batteries make keeping my older G1 lights and getting rid of my G2 the best choice for my needs.
Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

andy2667 said:


> Yes. USB stuff is more convenient.........



Certainly a personal preference, but I’ll take performance and efficiency over convenience.


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## andy2667 (9 mo ago)

Vancbiker said:


> Certainly a personal preference, but I’ll take performance and efficiency over convenience.


We may be talking about or thinking about different perspectives in performance and efficiency. Cheaper PD power banks can easily support 30w~45w fast charge. Higher end PD power banks support extremely fast charge rating at 65W ~ 100w vs 10w~20W charging rate supported by old style power packs/batteries.

About DC -DC conversion efficiency, I am not familiar with how the PD chips works or their performance so I am not able to comment about it but I don’t think that they are not that inefficient. On the contrary, for powering the DC light head, higher voltage means lower current. Resistive losses is proportional to square of current…..


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## andy2667 (9 mo ago)

MRMOLE said:


> Unmentioned Gloworm specific USB-C interface advantage should also be reliability considering power/remote cable failure has been a common G1 issue I've noticed over the years. I can definitely see some advantages to the PD tech. but for me compatibility with my older batteries, better throw characteristics of the older emitters, and weight advantage of available plug style batteries make keeping my older G1 lights and getting rid of my G2 the best choice for my needs.
> Mole


Sure compatibility with battery inventory is important. That is why I prefer the G2 Gloworm over G1 since I have a few PD power bank in hand for other electronic stuff. So, different users have different needs.

I am not sure about the reliability of G2 as I am a new owner of this lighting. Hopefully it could last reasonably well as I have already got it. I discovered the G2 Gloworm through this forum and has been fascinated about it for the PD compatibility and adjustability for different optics/ Bluetooth setting…etc. maybe that is me… I was previously considering the Magicshine for Price, value and performance….


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

andy2667 said:


> We may be talking about or thinking about different perspectives in performance and efficiency.…..


Least weight for longest runtime are my criteria.

Some DC-DC conversion circuits can be as much as 95% efficient but more commonly 85-90%. So at the first conversion from battery nominal voltage to USB voltage you have only about 90% of the battery capacity available. Then the conversion from USB voltage to what the light needs you have about 90% of the 90% available. So if your powerbank is rated at 10,000mAh the power available for the light will be about 8,100 mAh.


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## WhiteDLite (Mar 4, 2016)

Outbound lighting is #1, the only other lights I consider for myself are the Cyclops lights.
Who knows, Outbound and Cyclops may know of each other. Since I believe Cyclops is also producing their stuff in the states.








Explorer helmet mounted light kit-EXP-HL






www.cyclopsadventuresports.com


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

Vancbiker said:


> Some DC-DC conversion circuits can be as much as 95% efficient but more commonly 85-90%. So at the first conversion from battery nominal voltage to USB voltage you have only about 90% of the battery capacity available. Then the conversion from USB voltage to what the light needs you have about 90% of the 90% available. So if your powerbank is rated at 10,000mAh the power available for the light will be about 8,100 mAh.


I'm not an expert, but I think the conversion process in current (PD 3.0) powerbanks is more sophisticated than this.The newer powerbanks go through a handshake protocol, sense the required voltage, and convert directly to that. I don't know the actual efficiency achieved, but I suspect it's significantly better than you'd get from a couple of simple voltage converters.


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

WhiteDLite said:


> Outbound lighting is #1


The problem is that several manufacturers are #1 at some aspect of bike light production, but as far as I know, none are the best at everything.

Just my opinion: 
Outbound is clearly #1 in optical design (putting the light only where you want it), but there are several other manufacturers who offer a LOT more lumens/dollar (e.g. Magicshine) or better configurability and integration of multiple lights and accessories (e.g. Gloworm). We all just have to figure out which is most important to us.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

WhiteDLite said:


> Outbound lighting is #1, the only other lights I consider for myself are the Cyclops lights.
> Who knows, Outbound and Cyclops may know of each other. Since I believe Cyclops is also producing their stuff in the states.
> 
> 
> ...


Cyclops might do some post assembly or putting stickers on things, but their bike lights are 100% just rebranded M-Tiger bike lights similar to what has been sold over the years under various names:



http://www.mtigersports.com/cpzs_r.asp?id=8&.html











Explorer 3 Bicycle/e-bike light-CIL-EP2






www.cyclopsadventuresports.com





Hopefully we'll get some more photos and video as we bring in some more robotic systems, but we do all the design, testing, assembly and shipping 100% in house.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

andy2667 said:


> I am not sure about the reliability of G2 as I am a new owner of this lighting. Hopefully it could last reasonably well as I have already got it. I discovered the G2 Gloworm through this forum and has been fascinated about it for the PD compatibility and adjustability for different optics/ Bluetooth setting…etc. maybe that is me… I was previously considering the Magicshine for Price, value and performance….


G2 powercord setup should end up being more reliable than any of the past hard-wired units (and easier to repair). Power/remote cord issues were from a few generations back and more recently bullet plug connectors would get stuck in cold weather but electronics have always been excellent. To be fair I have the same weight issues with plug style batteries from Magicshine and Gemini, at least for their 2 cell units. 
Mole


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

WARNING 
DO NOT UPDATE YOUR Gloworm X2 Adventure!
Mine is Bricked/non functional now!
Brand new!
When I got it battery was dead so I slow charged the battery and then shined it out my window to check brightness. Never used on the bike!
I watched the GLOWORM videos, Followed the steps, and now the battery is stuck in UPDATE mode all night long.
I emailed Gloworm they just said my 10.5 iPad Pro was too old.
I tried everything on my iPhone XS Max. Still stuck in update mode!


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Please update when you find the fix


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

Also tried:
To return the light to the factory default settings, follow the process below:


> *>>*Disconnect the light from the Power Pack
> *>>*Hold the power button on the back of the light
> *>>*Whilst holding the button, connect the light to the Power Pack
> *>>*Continue to hold the button for about 10 seconds
> ...


no go. The light/button on the lamp never lit.
tried 3X with increasing hold times up to 50 seconds.


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

The light was FIXED, with the help of Taylor at Action Led! And a mtbr poster that said I should try Action Led.
problem may have been due to to many other Bluetooth products in close proximity.
I took of my GARMIN watch and moved to a different room without ear buds and other Bluetooth stuff.
I then closed out the Gloworm app by swiping up on my iPhone.
It then paired and took itself out of update mode. 
I think it will function correctly now.
Hoping the system will be as good or better than thought.


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

Also from GLOWORM:
Good Morning 

Sorry for the slow reply, we're based in NZ. My last message was when I went to sleep and I've just woken at 5.50 to see your messages. 

I understand your frustrations, but we will get this sorted. 

Your battery is not bricked. It is part way through an update, and it stays that way, so it doesn't become bricked. 

When it reconnects to the app it will continue the update. 

I suggest the following

Unplug the battery from the light and restart the app to the paired devices screen (I've attached a screenshot). Delete any devices on the paired devices screen, you can reconnect these later. You do this by tapping the offline device image, it will then tell you no connection can be made and then offer to delete. 

Press the check for updates button and leave the phone and battery close to each other and the update process should resume. 

**** Ensure location services have been activated on your device and Gloworm Link App has been given permission to use device location.

**** at no time should the battery be connected to the light by the cable. Your battery is directly communicating with your phone. 

*** also try reinstalling the app. 

**try another device if possible 
*
If this doesn't work I'm happy to call you to see what we can do but at times some devices simply don't work. The Bluetooth connection is simply unreliable. At this stage we could either send you a new updated battery. 

But please understand this is not a common issue but it does happen and we are always here to help. 

Cheers and talk soon. 

Bruce
Owner


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## Ktmexperiment (Apr 11, 2006)

So after sifting through three pages, I still don’t really see a straight comparison of GloWorm to Outbound. I’ve been running the X2 (gen 1 I assume since they’re hardwired) on my helmet and bars. I love the machining, the battery indicators, the programmable remote, and the crazy amount of light they emit. I don’t love light systems with battery packs anymore. My time is very limited these days and anything that adds to the process of getting out the door can often deter me from going for a ride altogether. Yes , it sounds trivial but routing the cables and fighting with the Velcro straps through helmet vents and then mounting everything on the bike is time consuming.
So, a friend that owns a small apparel company (Cognative MTB) was telling me about Outbound and how the beam pattern makes the light so efficient. We’re both small business owners and often Outbound has come up, as they/he are a small US based business too. 
So, in my quest for efficiency, self contained setups, and ultimately wanting to support a small business, I just ordered some this morning. My initial thoughts are that the Gloworms machined build is superior and they’re also “brighter”, but the Outbound’s convenience and beam pattern will “outshine” GloWorm. #dadjokes
I’ll try to put together a comparison and post back on here.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Ktmexperiment said:


> My initial thoughts are that the Gloworms machined build is superior and they’re also “brighter”, but the Outbound’s convenience and beam pattern will “outshine” GloWorm. #dadjokes
> I’ll try to put together a comparison and post back on here.


Good post! I've got separate lighthead/battery helmet lights and a Hangover and like both but use them differently. Looking forward to your opinions as someone who self-contained is a must have deal breaker.
Mole


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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

One solution that isn't cheap (but hey, none of these lights are cheap) is to have a separate "night helmet" that you leave your helmet light attached to. I have a bunch of helmets floating around and have done this. Not a big deal, but it does save a few minutes.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

A separate night light helmet is exactly what my wife has. For me, my XS snaps on and snaps off. Easy and fast.


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## Ktmexperiment (Apr 11, 2006)

wayold said:


> One solution that isn't cheap (but hey, none of these lights are cheap) is to have a separate "night helmet" that you leave your helmet light attached to. I have a bunch of helmets floating around and have done this. Not a big deal, but it does save a few minutes.


Excellent idea


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