# Elka Stage 5 = me not impressed at all



## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

I had high expectations of this shock. For whatever reason I could not get it to feel good on my bike (Giant Reign X1). Apparently other people like it, so it must work on some bikes for other people. Not for me on this bike! 


Update: They took a look at the shock and found it was indeed defective. I will be trying a different one next week. 

I've also got to give props to Go-Ride. They really have proven to me that they care about their customers and will bend over backwards to help them out in tight situations. Their turn around time on getting the shock back, tested, and another one sent out to me is great. 



NEW REVIEW! 

New shock is for sure better and more controlled. 

Good:
- Compressions feels amazing! Can't stress enough how tunable and buttery the compression is on this shock. Utterly amazing. Helps eliminate small bumps into nothing.
- Shock stroke is very supple and smooth. My last shock had bad stiction.
- Shock feels better in a lot of ways than my Roco TST but is still somewhat lacking. 
- Rebound is a little better on this one than my last Elka Demo.

Bad:
- Damn rebound just isn't cutting it even though it feels better than the last Elka demo. Way too little low speed rebound and then once the adjuster starts getting some, it ruins the high speed.  Still major fail IMO. My Roco TST still puts the Elka to shame in rebound. I guess I could pay a lot more to have it custom tuned, but then I don't know how much I want tuned, which might add up to a lot of trips back for retuning the high speed rebound and lots of money. I like the PUSH rebound feeling the most where it is more damped on the low speed stuff and opens up for higher speeds. 
I'm sure some people like having little or no low speed rebound, as it does help pop the wheel off of jumps and keep it higher in the travel. I find that in conjunction with the good compression and the preloading of the air chamber spring, the back of the bike actually JACKS UP when hitting multiple fast hits. This does not feel good to me personally, and has caused my feet to bounce off the pedals and other crap. 
- Top Out. I'm sorry, but the damn air spring is really pissing me off. I don't know how you guys think of this, but the top out from an unchecked air spring drives me bonkers. Even with a stupidly lighter coil spring, it still feels funky. 

The combination of the air spring preloading effect and the backwards damped rebound leave me not so blown away on this shock. Time for a CCDB and to be done with it!


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## iridemtb (Mar 25, 2008)

I know elka and go-rideboth have good cs. Also, are you sure the shock was "tuned for your bike" as I have heard elka does. Mine feels great on my demo 9. Also, I know Elka asks about your weight and riding style when you go to buy one.


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## juan pablo (Jan 17, 2007)

Really surprissed to hear about your experience of rebound adjustment. I find my Elka to be really sensitive to every click of rebound.


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## Nick_M2R (Oct 18, 2008)

Are you sure the Elka was valved for your bike or was it just a generic tune for go ride test shock? If its just a generic tune, then id guess thats why it feels like crap on your bike


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Nick_M2R said:


> Are you sure the Elka was valved for your bike or was it just a generic tune for go ride test shock? If its just a generic tune, then id guess thats why it feels like crap on your bike


Compression tune felt great and dead on. Rebound should have been the slowest they make, which is what they recommend for the Reign X.

Even if the rebound was better, I would still have to say it isn't going to blow me away like I was expecting. I think big monotube "air sprung" shocks just are not going to be my cup of tea.

I expect a CCDB to cure everything I didn't like about the Elka:
- Adjustable slow/high speed rebound
- No air spring preloading effect or air spring feel in mid stroke. 
- Costs more, thus is better by fact! 

That to me might be worth the extra $200.


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## davec113 (May 31, 2006)

Thanks for the review, but please ask Go Ride to check if the rebound damper is malfunctioning, from what you said I wouldn't be surprised if there was a problem.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

It seems weird because most people have been having awesome luck for it.

just curious how go-ride happened to have the right size shock with the right internals specifically for your bike and weight. I know they have a large selection but it seems they would have way to many to cover every specific situation.

Also i wonder how new the shock is. The program is pretty new and the shock might be as well. maybe it hasn't even had a break in time yet. 

Everything you mentioned seemed strange because i had one and it was amazing and didn't suffer from the things you mentioned. especially the stiction. i found it quite the opposite.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

davec113 said:


> Thanks for the review, but please ask Go Ride to check if the rebound damper is malfunctioning, from what you said I wouldn't be surprised if there was a problem.


Totally. Although I am not going to screw around with this shock again regardless.

Altogether, I don't think this shock provides what I am looking for.

I'm not trying to make any wide claims about the shock, but I think it is important to let people know my experience. If there was something wrong with the shock, does Elka have quality control issues?

It's not a bad shock, I just don't see it ever being the mind blowing change people expect from something like a Bos or Double Barrel.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

climbingbubba said:


> It seems weird because most people have been having awesome luck for it.
> 
> just curious how go-ride happened to have the right size shock with the right internals specifically for your bike and weight. I know they have a large selection but it seems they would have way to many to cover every specific situation.
> 
> ...


I got lucky that it was the right tune.

One thing that could be going on here... My Roco TST might, by blind luck, be the best tune I could want, and it just happened to come that way stock. I have never had any problem with it. It always works as I wish. I just could not help but think a "better" shock would be better.

It could be that the Elka was performing just fine, but since my Roco is by dumb luck so well tuned for my bike and rider, that I didn't get the improvement I was looking for.

I guess the take away here is, "if it ain't broke don't fix it". Sometimes you have to try something else to realize what you had was perfect already. I am still hopeful that a CCDB will turn out better for me than the TST.

Also, the compression adjustments on the Elka were very impressive. If I had a single pivot, that shock would have turned out more beneficial. Since my bike like really light compression, it didn't help my bike much. Compression and adjustment wise, USDA top choice T-Bone!


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## AL29er (Jan 14, 2004)

Interesting. Useable adjustment range is pretty friggin important. My AVA tuned 5th has a very sensitive rebound and it sucks. Fortunately it has no detents, so I can set it anywhere in the rotation and it stays.

One thing to note, even good mfg put out bad shocks from time to time. I had 2 shocks this last year that despite being new had to go back to the factory for rework. Not that I want to condone that failure rate, just sayin it happens.

The GoRide demo program is a very cool way to see if a shock fits you. In this case it may just not be a good fit for you and your preferences. I am with you, far better that it turned out to only be a $50 experiment. I have toyed with the notion of testing out a couple of other shocks just to see if they are an "upgrade".


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## SENNABLAZE (Jan 23, 2008)

*How about the rider : 0*

My friend i ride two elka 5's, one on a M3 with 9.5 travel and the other on a uzzi set at 6.75 both shocks ride completely different.I think maybe on your frame the shock might not be so happy for what ever reason but i can tell you that the rebound is not the problem.On my M3 if i am in only 3 or 4 inches of travel the rebound is very fast and snaps me out of turns and ruts just the way i need it to be, only when the travel gets going deeper will the rebound slow down and not buck no matter what setting i have it on. So do not give up on the ELKA 5 just maybe it's time to give up on your old style of riding and take it to a new level where the shock can shine. Trust your shock,trust yourself and go rip it up !!! : 0


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## GearTech (Mar 3, 2009)

I will agree with only one statement you've made and that's on the rebound. I find the shock to perform noticeably better than both the DHX 5.0 coil and the Roco WC on my Cove STD. My Elka came directly from the factory custom tuned for me and the bike which may make a difference. I have no complaints about the feel of the shock in any situation and do not share the feeling that it has poor midstroke performance. It keeps the back tire glued to the ground without feeling dead.

On the rebound...I do have my dial turned way in but the clicks before and after my current setting make a small but noticeable difference and do not change it so drastically that the performance goes to hell.

It's not for you and that's okay. I hope you find what you're looking for.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

Nuff said!

Been using the CCDB since it was available in 2006. I have not been on anything that feels as good.


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## GearTech (Mar 3, 2009)

boogenman said:


> Nuff said!
> 
> Been using the CCDB since it was available in 2006. I have not been on anything that feels as good.


CCDBs are definitely nice. I want to try the new Diverse shock as well. It's nice having so many good options out there.


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

YoPawn said:


> I got lucky that it was the right tune.
> 
> One thing that could be going on here... My Roco TST might, by blind luck, be the best tune I could want, and it just happened to come that way stock. I have never had any problem with it. It always works as I wish. I just could not help but think a "better" shock would be better.
> 
> ...


You got a shock that either had issues or was the complete wrong tune for your bike.

This fact is backed up by your statement that the Roco TST feels better than the Elka. I have ridden Roco TST shocks on a few bikes and always felt they were choked down and spiked way too much w/o a useable range of compression adjustment. Good for a pedal bike that may need lots of low speed damping at the expense of traction. The Roco WC is better for gravity riding, but can have a bit too much wallow for me.

The Elka offers the most seamless performance I have experienced in a shock to date. The hi and low speed compression adjusters work beautifully, have a very large usable range of adjustment and stay decoupled (they feel truly independent of each other). The increase in traction and control when switching to an Elka is quite significant. I passed the Elka on my DHR around to a few of my (dhr riding) friends at Northstar last summer and after just a single run every one of them could not believe the difference in performance. They went from "is it worth the effort to switch shocks?" to "do I have to give it back?"

Mini link bikes do require very specific shock tunes to behave properly, and the Elka shines on this suspension design when tuned for it.
One other thing to keep in mind, Elka custom tunes each shock for your bike and if you don't like the initial tune they will revalve your shock to suite your needs for free. I don't know of any other suspension manufacturer that will do this.

It's too bad the test didn't give you a good idea of how well this shock can perform, and this brings to light one of the difficulties involved in running a shock demo program.


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## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

well said.


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## AL29er (Jan 14, 2004)

1soulrider said:


> One other thing to keep in mind, Elka custom tunes each shock for your bike and if you don't like the initial tune they will revalve your shock to suite your needs for free. I don't know of any other suspension manufacturer that will do this.


Avalanche will do it again w/o charge in the first 60 days. Not sure about CC, I know they are very helpful in the setup of the shock. But I can't say if they will revalve or not (no 1st hand exp with them).


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

The CCDB's are all the same. No need for a re valve.


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

YoPawn said:


> I got lucky that it was the right tune.


Eh... apparently not.  
I've previously owned Fox DHX 5.0, Roco TST and WC, Avalanche Chubbie, and Push'd Vanilla... the Elka is my fave so far.

Not sure what the dealio with yours was, but don't slag the shock off based on your brief demo experience. Ive got one on my new ride and am impressed so far. How impressed? I've only got 3 rides on it, and it's on a new bike so I can't really make fair comparisons against the shocks I've owned on previous bikes. However... for sure I can say it feels very good so far.

Also! No tools required for compression adjustments. Gimme a freaking break, I've owned and Avy and it felt great when it was tuned in, but no way in hell a $600 shock like the Avy or CCDB should require tools for adjustment. Weather changes, traveling to ride, and just coming to understand the shock are 3 reasons I want to be able to change those adjustments every ride, no tools required.

I was also very impressed with the documentation provided by Elka. Much as I liked the Avy on my last bike, it took several calls to Craig to figure out how to tune it (since the adjustments weren't labeled on the shock, and were labeled incorrectly in the manual :madman: )

Couple other things I dig.

Backing off the HSC completely does not bypass the LSC circuit on the Elka.
The adjustments do what you would expect them to, unlike "pro-pedal", "boost valve" or other cool marketing terms that don't explain what's actually happening inside the shock.
Cool that Elka provides awesome hardware- steel sleeve with aluminum spacers, instead of aluminum step-down reducers that focus the load on the center of the shock bolt.
I also dug the price- I think mine was under $500 shipped? Thats cheaper than a fox rc4.


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

FM said:


> Eh... apparently not.
> I've previously owned Fox DHX 5.0, Roco TST and WC, Avalanche Chubbie, and Push'd Vanilla... the Elka is my fave so far.
> 
> Not sure what the dealio with yours was, but don't slag the shock off based on your brief demo experience. Ive got one on my new ride and am impressed so far. How impressed? I've only got 3 rides on it, and it's on a new bike so I can't really make fair comparisons against the shocks I've owned on previous bikes. However... for sure I can say it feels very good so far.
> ...


So you have an Elka now, my question is what is this new bike that it is mounted to?
Also must note that back to back testing of the Elka vs the RC4 (same bike) left the Elka out front in my opinion.


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## nightnerd (Mar 5, 2007)

Just out of curiosity, I have a question for you Yo Pawn. What year is your Reign x1 from?


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

1soulrider said:


> So you have an Elka now, my question is what is this new bike that it is mounted to?


Pardon the crap phone picture....
Anyways only have 3 rides in on it so far, but she's a keeper  
Got the K9 cups slackening it out to 66.5 degree up front. But still low 30's with the elka & float 36. Feels like a really good match for our local stuff, I'm pushing or climbing for everything and our trails are fairly smooth, so a light bike is nice. But the rune is very stiff and the suspension & geometry are dialled in nicely for steep trails with booters and drops.


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## Uncle Cliffy (Jul 7, 2006)

Trade shocks with Krispy and see if he has the same problems... He probably won't want to part with his CCDB.

(The old and new Reign X run the same size shock BTW.)


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## nightnerd (Mar 5, 2007)

I know they have the same stroke and eye-to-eye but the 2007-08 and 09 had the glory hole. On Elka's site, they don't list the pre-2010 Reign x1 as compatible with their shock...


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## Uncle Cliffy (Jul 7, 2006)

nightnerd said:


> I know they have the same stroke and eye-to-eye but the 2007-08 and 09 had the glory hole. On Elka's site, they don't list the pre-2010 Reign x1 as compatible with their shock...


It may just need a test fit. I remember you could run a CCDB in the old frame, but it had to be upside-down with the roost guard removed. The Elka may be the same way...


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## ThePunisher (Feb 15, 2006)

Elka did try their shock on the pre-2010 Reign X and it didn't fit.

YoPawn - try checking the pressure in the chamber with an air pump. it should be around 150-160 psi. if it's not, just pump some air to reach that pressure.

if the pressure keeps coming down (after a few rides) you might have a defective reservoir cover/valve.


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

FM said:


> Pardon the crap phone picture....
> Anyways only have 3 rides in on it so far, but she's a keeper
> Got the K9 cups slackening it out to 66.5 degree up front. But still low 30's with the elka & float 36. Feels like a really good match for our local stuff, I'm pushing or climbing for everything and our trails are fairly smooth, so a light bike is nice. But the rune is very stiff and the suspension & geometry are dialled in nicely for steep trails with booters and drops.


Very nice! I keep hearing good things about Banshee's new bikes. Never thought I'd say that...


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## Renegade (May 10, 2004)

Here's a better pic of FM's bike. I just stole it out of his garage:










Nice bike FM!


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## highrevkev (Oct 31, 2005)

ThePunisher said:


> Elka did try their shock on the pre-2010 Reign X and it didn't fit.
> 
> YoPawn - try checking the pressure in the chamber with an air pump. it should be around 150-160 psi. if it's not, just pump some air to reach that pressure.
> 
> if the pressure keeps coming down (after a few rides) you might have a defective reservoir cover/valve.


Elka uses nitrogen in their shocks, using a shock pump is not recommended & probably would make the shock perform less than its potential.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

The elka does look prettier than the pics on their website..


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## Acadian (Jan 1, 2004)

highrevkev said:


> Elka uses nitrogen in their shocks, using a shock pump is not recommended & probably would make the shock perform less than its potential.


nope - if you call Elka they will suggest the same thing Punisher suggested. for a small amount like 30 to 50 psi's, it's okay to use a hand pump. if the pressure is way low - then yeah, you're better off sending your shock in for service.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

ThePunisher said:


> Elka did try their shock on the pre-2010 Reign X and it didn't fit.
> .


I guess my 2008 Reign X1 frame didn't get the memo. 

I wonder if they are only claiming that it does not fit because the damper doesn't like the suspension design? 

I will take FM's word that it is a better shock if you get a good one that is tuned right.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Update in my original post. Shock was borked.


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

I suspected it!


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

YoPawn said:


> Update in my original post. Shock was borked.


Kinda figured it had to be.. 
Hope you get a chance to ride an Elka in good working condition, I'm pretty sure you will be impressed.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

1soulrider said:


> Kinda figured it had to be..
> Hope you get a chance to ride an Elka in good working condition, I'm pretty sure you will be impressed.


I hope this prompts them to test their shocks before sending to people for demos. I was kind of under the impression they did this already and was surprised they did not.

It's good news that I might still have hope for this shock after all. I was worried about having to poop out the extra money for a CCDB.


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## nightnerd (Mar 5, 2007)

Yo,
Get back to us when you will get the new shock. Riding a 2008 Reign x1 too, I'm particularly interested in reading your second review of the shock. By the way, Elka dudes are within 30 minutes drive from where I live. Unfortunatly, they don't have the demo program...


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Updated review with working shock up above. Better, but I'm still not blown away or impressed enough to buy one.


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## ThePunisher (Feb 15, 2006)

YoPawn said:


> Updated review with working shock up above. Better, but I'm still not blown away or impressed enough to buy one.


oh you were talking advantage of the Elka/Go-Ride demo program?


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

I think you got a defective shock again.









Just kidding.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

If I already had one in ownership I wouldn't worry and just spend money to have it custom tuned. Otherwise, I'm not going to buy a shock knowing that I could potentially spend just as much as a Double Barrel in the end to get it right. I do see lots of potential there in the future as they refine the Elka. Hasn't really been around long enough to go through a couple development cycles to nail just right or offer tunes for various bikes ALONG with various rider types. I like a slightly regressive rebound and the Elka seems to be progressive in my experience.


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

I dunno man. Something is not right, maybe Elka doesn't have the tune right for your bike or it's not tuned for your weight. I have owned a lot of shocks including the Roco tst and wc, the Elka is in a different league (along with pushed stuff and avy). 

Anyways, good luck with the cane creek!


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

FM said:


> I dunno man. Something is not right, maybe Elka doesn't have the tune right for your bike or it's not tuned for your weight. I have owned a lot of shocks including the Roco tst and wc, the Elka is in a different league (along with pushed stuff and avy).
> 
> Anyways, good luck with the cane creek!


I think it just comes down to preference. I don't see anything wrong with the Elka if it is how your like your shock to feel.

The Reign X doesn't really need good compression damping to feel good. I've found that frame is all about getting the rebound dialed. Roco TST just happens to have a rebound that works for my frame and riding style I've been on other bikes with the TST that feel like dog turds, as in the Kona Stinky. As well, I'm sure the Elka feels spectacular on other frames that I could like.

Also keep in mind, that this was a demo shock, and I didn't have the honeymoon effect from buying it. Thus, I am going to be really critical about my assessments to make sure I spend money on something I feel is worth it in terms of cost/vs./performance. Right now, the Elka is not $450 better than my Roco TST, but in itself the Elka is a great deal at $450. If I had no shock and only $450, I would buy the Elka no question and then have it tuned down the road when more cash comes rolling in.

Also again, people have bought CCDB shocks and not liked those either. So, I think it just comes down to picking your flavor. Some people are lucky in that their flavor is $200 cheaper than others.


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

YoPawn said:


> Also keep in mind, that this was a demo shock, and I didn't have the honeymoon effect from buying it. Thus, I am going to be really critical about my assessments to make sure I spend money on something I feel is worth it in terms of cost/vs./performance. Right now, the Elka is not $450 better than my Roco TST, but in itself the Elka is a great deal at $450. If I had no shock and only $450, I would buy the Elka no question and then have it tuned down the road when more cash comes rolling in.


Keep in mind no extra $ is needed to custom tune this shock for you...it is custom tuned for you when you buy it, and if it doesn't impress you they will retune it for free to meet your needs.
But, as you said, every rider is different and what is great for some may not be so much for others. 
The Cane Creek DB is a good example of this, many rave about it and others can't stand it. 
Different strokes for different folks.


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## commencal-guy (Aug 20, 2008)

I just got my Elka Stage 5, and all I can say im sticking with Elka for a long time. Also the fact their pretty local to where I live. Ive tried, DHX 5.0, CCDB, Marzocchi Rocco wc, Rock Shox Vivid 5.1, and Avalanche. It defiantly blew the Rocco, Vivid and DHX out of the water hands down. The Elka feels like a mix between a Avalanche and CCDB. The shock is so smooth and plush. Its defiantly the shock I wanted. Simple. The shock's Compression and rebound can be felt with each click, and it just seems endless in its travel.

Make sure you get the Shock tuned correctly for your frame / setup. Anything incorrectly set up can feel like ****.


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

commencal-guy said:


> It defiantly blew the Rocco, Vivid and DHX out of the water hands down. The Elka feels like a mix between a Avalanche and CCDB.


Yep that's my impression as well. The Elka feels very similar to the Avalanche I had with that "back wheel stuck to the ground" feel, even when cornering over chop. The difference is, the elka has firmer low-speed compression, which I like... it feels very "composed". And the no tools required thing... big advantage for elka in my book, compared to Avy/CCDB.

To me the difference between the "custom tuned" shocks I've owned (Avy, Elka, and to a lesser extent, Push) and the stock one Fox & Marzocchi shocks is immediately noticeable. That's why I keep coming back to this thread and scratching my head (sorry YoPawn)



YoPawn said:


> Also keep in mind, that this was a demo shock, and I didn't have the honeymoon effect from buying it.


Nor did you get the :30 minute conversation with Elka where they ask about your riding style, weight, frame, suspension preference, size and frequency of airtime and climbing, etc etc, correct? I am wondering if that's where things went wrong. I have only had great experiences with Go-Ride, but it seems optimistic that they had a demo shock&spring which just happened to be "perfectly" custom-tuned for you.

Well anyways, I would also say that for most of us non-racers, the difference between a custom-tuned shock and a stock one should be noticeable, but won't give us super-powers or anything. A custom tuned shock can improve most any frame, but not really change the characteristics of the suspension design.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Does Elka actually give you guys different shim stack tunes based on your needs totally custom?

I ask because they have three tunes of rebound and compression for each. In a way it is custom tuned for everyone's bike. 

Mine came with the 30 and 30 rebound and compression. Which is exactly what they recommend for my frame.


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

YoPawn said:


> Does Elka actually give you guys different shim stack tunes based on your needs totally custom?
> 
> I ask because they have three tunes of rebound and compression for each. In a way it is custom tuned for everyone's bike.
> 
> Mine came with the 30 and 30 rebound and compression. Which is exactly what they recommend for my frame.


That is probably better answered by Elka..  
I think they do tune to the rider, not the bike, if you order from them directly.
The reason I say that, why else would they have asked me for my weight and lots of questions about my riding style.. if the only factor they actually consider is frame design?

I think they use the chart you mention as a starting point, then tune from there based on riding style and weight.

When first contacted Elka they sent me some information that's not on their site. I think it's intended for customers, rather than being advertising? But here is *some* stuff from it....



> Q: What is "custom" about your shocks?
> A: We adapt the damping range for each bike design (leverage ratio, travel, rising or falling rate, etc.) and provide
> the appropriate spring rate for the rider weight. We are also able to fine-tune the hydraulic internals (valving) to
> suit specific needs expressed by the customer, whether a manufacturer or individual.





> Elka Suspension's design is a high-speed and low-speed adjustable compression system paired with a standard De
> Carbon main damping system (shimstack main piston). This design provides infinite internal tuning possibilities and
> intuitive external adjustability. The hydraulic valving (internal shimstack) can easily be tuned for each bike's suspension
> design. The adjustment range then becomes fully usable for the rider, allowing more precise fine-tuning with smalller
> ...


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

FM said:


> That is probably better answered by Elka..
> I think they do tune to the rider, not the bike, if you order from them directly.
> The reason I say that, why else would they have asked me for my weight and lots of questions about my riding style.. if the only factor they actually consider is frame design?
> 
> ...


Thanks FM.

From their description of the rebound, it sounds like mine was working as designed. I don't like their rebound philosophy, even though I can see it working better for others. Feels too "racey" to me. If I was into more jumping this shock would feel pretty good as it really likes to hop and pop when you want it to.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Got my CCDB! :band:

Obviously I'm really stoked on this shock. It does EVERYTHING better than the Elka even without making any changes to the adjusters. It got even better once I did start tuning it. 

Most noticeable is how the DB transforms the way the entire bike handles, not just the rear end. My fork sticks better now and the whole bike just feels like one cohesive damped unit. Within 2 runs I was charging corners way faster and with more confidence knowing the bike would track a line and not get kicked out. 

For drops, the DB seems to use all of its travel a little easier than the Elka. On the other hand, it uses all the travel, but I never feel the end. On top of that the DB keeps the wheel AND my feet planted together at all times. The Elkas would kick my feet off the pedals.:nono: You would think this translates to a bike that can't be hopped around and jumped as easily. In fact, quite the contrary. My bike bunny hops easier than it ever did, but still has rebound damping in effect at all speeds. In fact it seems like damping is happening all the time and never stops. 

Elka is a noisy punk. DB is utterly silent. 

DB is totally incognito inside my Reign X frame. Looks like a old coil Vanilla is in there. Did I mention it also comes with a beer opener inside the adjuster tool?


I know a lot of people want to convince themselves that their $200 cheaper shock is just as good, but it isn't    Even if the DB was $400 more, I would say it is worth it. I hate always wondering what that next best thing might have been like if I had shelled out the dough. In this case, it was worth every penny and I don't ever have to wonder if anything is better. Cause there isn't. 


Also, keep in mind that this is the latest redesign of the double barrel. As far as I know, the last one sucked balls at high speeds and low leverage bikes. So keep that in mind when researching and seeing reviews of the old one.


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

YoPawn said:


> Got my CCDB! :band:
> 
> Obviously I'm really stoked on this shock. It does EVERYTHING better than the Elka even without making any changes to the adjusters. It got even better once I did start tuning it.
> 
> ...


The best shock is the best you've tried... don't jump into conclusions too soon


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## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

YoPawn said:


> I know a lot of people want to convince themselves that their $200 cheaper shock is just as good, but it isn't    Even if the DB was $400 more, I would say it is worth it. I hate always wondering what that next best thing might have been like if I had shelled out the dough. In this case, it was worth every penny and I don't ever have to wonder if anything is better. Cause there isn't.


Really? I completely disagree. I think you got a bunged shock, had a bad experience with it, and then got a shock that was not custom tuned for you.

This is from a guy who owned a CCDB and sold it for an elka. On a 3:1 progressive leverage ratio bike (something that should have been perfect for the ccdb).

But to each their own, I'm glad your double barrel is working out for you!


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## [email protected] (Dec 29, 2003)

Shocks are very personal just like bike choice or tire choice. Different riders prefer different feels. Here at Go-ride.com Krispy and I are split on preference. He prefers the ultra sensitive and infinite adjustability of the CCDB. I, however, prefer the more direct feel and adjustment range of the Elka. I had the opposite experience with the Elka on my 2010 Reign X in that after a couple of DH runs and a XC loop I felt I had it dialed in so well that I wouldn't change a thing again. With the CCDB I really like the shock and it's high quality, but has too much adjustability for me. Leaving me feeling like I'd always be trying something differnt with it. 

To clear a couple of things up a bit:
1. When we received the demo shock back from YoPawn it definitely had some problems. It's off at Elka getting a full check over. It seemed to be to have a rebound issue as YoPawn notice.
2. We did not pre-test the shock on a bike before sending it out. I guess we could have, but it was brand new and often customers just buy the shock they test as long as it was new when it was shipped. We also don't test brand new shocks when they are ordered because customers expect products to be brand new and never used. I doubt anyone would be happy if you received a new fork with a few scratches and a cut steertube because we already took some DH runs on it. 
3. Elka does offer custom tunes for individual bikes. We stock all of the shock sizes and most of the tunes for our demo and sales program. The tune we sent to YoPawn is the exact one that Elka would recommend. With that being said, it certainly is possible if you bought a new shock and did not like the recommended tune for your bike, Elka could choose a different tune more to your liking, but so far we have not needed to do this.

YoPawn, we are happy to be able to get you the shock you wanted and completely understand why you like it so much. It is an excellent product. :thumbsup:


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

My talking smack about the Elka is tongue in cheek.  I don't think it is a bad shock at all. I prefaced in my first post that this shock was not for me, but could be for others. Then I go into why I don't like it. For me. 

What a lot of people don't understand is that you can tune any shock to the end of time, but in the end, the inherent design of the shock will determine the feel you gain. 

A twin tube design like the Double Barrel is vastly different than the monotube design of the other shocks. Even among monotube shocks, there can be big differences. 

The ONE thing I feel the Double Barrel does that no monotube shock has before for me, is that it initiates damping instantly when the shock changes direction. There is no perceptible transition, where with other shocks there is a tiny bit of dead zone while the valves and oil change direction back the way they came. 



If this thread proves anything, it is worth the money to demo a shock, even if it is high end and a lot of people like it. You can't always guarantee you'll like it. I don't think any amount of shimming the Elka would result in my ideal shock setup.

Edit: also take into account that the fork's damping can make a huge determination on your perception of the rear shock. If my fork felt the same as the elka then I think my opinion of it would be much higher. As of now, my fork feels almost identical to the double barrel (rebound wise, Elka felt similar compression wise), thus maybe one reason I am liking it so much more. It's like having the same length of travel, rate of spring, and damping hooked up front and rear.


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## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

Good point on matching the fork characteristics with the shock.

I'm thinking of going the Elka route with my Rune. I've ridden FM's Rune with Elks and love it (vs. my DHX Air). However, he run's a 36 Float and I run a 36 Talas and our dampening is set up completely different. 

Probably shoud demo one first. But, will the demo be identical to the custom tuned version from Elka? Any difference?


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

William42 said:


> Really? I completely disagree. I think you got a bunged shock, had a bad experience with it, and then got a shock that was not custom tuned for you.
> 
> This is from a guy who owned a CCDB and sold it for an elka. On a 3:1 progressive leverage ratio bike (something that should have been perfect for the ccdb).
> 
> But to each their own, I'm glad your double barrel is working out for you!


Wasn't your shock the old tune? I remember reading your posts on RM about yours last year.

I think the shock has been drastically changed since then.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

<sL4yEr>RuLz said:


> Good point on matching the fork characteristics with the shock.
> 
> I'm thinking of going the Elka route with my Rune. I've ridden FM's Rune with Elks and love it (vs. my DHX Air). However, he run's a 36 Float and I run a 36 Talas and our dampening is set up completely different.
> 
> Probably shoud demo one first. But, will the demo be identical to the custom tuned version from Elka? Any difference?


Here's what I gather from Elka. They have a bunch of different "tunes" for compression and rebound, which are all presorted degrees of damping. I think they have 3 levels for rebound and 3 for compression. With those 6 and the range of adjustability in each, it covers every bike made just about.

That's why, as Scott said, my bike DID get the recommended tune from Elka. It felt like I could get the right range of adjustment. My only issue is with the performance of the rebound, not the adjustability.

The Elka does everything they claim. I can attest to that. I just don't like their suspension philosophy. To me, the DB feels less floaty and more connected. Quite the opposite of what other people claim.  Elka never felt connected without also making it harsh.

Elka would always be an upgrade over a DHX air. Why not just borrow FM's shock? From his cold dead hands of course.


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

YoPawn said:


> The Elka does everything they claim. I can attest to that. I just don't like their suspension philosophy. To me, the DB feels less floaty and more connected. Quite the opposite of what other people claim.  Elka never felt connected without also making it harsh.


Still sounds to me like your Elka demo was just Eff'd up...



[email protected] said:


> To clear a couple of things up a bit:
> 1. When we received the demo shock back from YoPawn it definitely had some problems. It's off at Elka getting a full check over. It seemed to be to have a rebound issue as YoPawn notice.


I can see what you mean about the Elka feeling racy though. It's very efficient... doesn't like to use a lot of travel unless you hit something bigger, even if it's very active on the small stuff. I find this helps me ride "in control" since the shock isn't constantly spazzing out over every impact. Although other people might see that "spazzing out" as being "very active".:aureola:

I do definitely like it better than the Avalanche Chubie I had on my previous ride. And again... no tools required for tuning! :thumbsup:

Anyways... As Scott said there's a lot of personal preference involved. I think Elka summed up the feel of their shocks well in their documentation:



> The overall feeling of the suspension that results is firm, nimble, stable and quick. The chassis tends to
> maintain its ride height, use less travel, reduce unwanted suspension movement and weigth transfers does not affect
> geometry as much. In short, the bike has a strong "platform" feeling throughout the entire travel, the shock reduces the
> force transmitted to the rider and this general feeling can easily be adjusted in the parking lot via the low-speed
> compression adjuster.


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

FM said:


> Still sounds to me like your Elka demo was just Eff'd up...
> 
> I can see what you mean about the Elka feeling racy though. It's very efficient... doesn't like to use a lot of travel unless you hit something bigger, even if it's very active on the small stuff. I find this helps me ride "in control" since the shock isn't constantly spazzing out over every impact. Although other people might see that "spazzing out" as being "very active".:aureola:
> 
> ...


Nope dude. I'm sorry I hurt your feeling by not liking this shock.   

My second one was working as described to a freakin dot.

Let me condense WHY I did not like this shock for everyone's easy viewing.

1. I do not like the rear end of my bike always trying to stay high in the travel all the freakin time. Esp. when my fork is not set up to work this way. I equate it to putting air into a Marzocchi coil fork. Feels like junk to me, but others don't mind. Elka had an undeniable topout from the air spring. This is where I get the floaty feeling from.. 
2. Rebound is too fast on slow stuff and then jams on the brakes when it hits a higher speed or hits the topout hard. My feet were coming off the pedals all over the place. If my last bike was set up similar then I might not have noticed as much, but I am used to my feet sticking no matter how bad of a rider I am. When I get the low speed rebound to where I like it, the high speed is ruined. 
3. Shock is noisy as hell compared to the DB when jumping.

Things that WOULD make me like this shock more:
1. If I was into jumping more than anything else. This thing has good pop.
2. If I was a racer who liked the racy feeling. I'm not the most skilled rider, I like a more controlled ride when sitting down. Elka likes standing up. 
3. If my fork matched the spring characteristics of the Elka. 
4. If it wasn't so noisy on the rebound.

It's obvious most people like the Elka. Good for them and Elka! Elka seems like a top quality company and puts out a nice product for the price. If there other people reading this thread I hope I can inform them a little more about how this shock rides differently than others and they might want to take this into consideration before blindly laying down money. Demo if you can!

Once again these are just my personal observations being compared to how I like my bikes set up. Thanks to FM for providing reasons and info as to WHY HE likes the shock. It makes it more helpful for people reading this to get an idea of what they want.


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## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

*Great info BTW*

But I think yoiu should give it 1 more shot.  I mean you've put this much effort into it, right?

Since I've already ridden on the Elka, my guess is that by dropping 50 pounds in the spring (FM's got about 15 pounds of baby phat on me) and by using titanium, it should feel pretty darn good.


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## Renegade (May 10, 2004)

sounds like Yopawn has made up his mind, just as I did when when I bought a ccdb, and found it to be a POS, IMO. Nope, I won't change my mind, no way, even if they did improve the shock, I'm not gonna budge, it's still a POS, and that's that.



it's okay to read a little sarcasm into the above statement


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

YoPawn said:


> Nope dude. I'm sorry I hurt your feeling by not liking this shock.


No hurt feelings, although I do have this itchy, flaky rash that I blame on you. :ihih:


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

FM said:


> No hurt feelings, although I do have this itchy, flaky rash that I blame on you. :ihih:


:lol:


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

Renegade said:


> sounds like Yopawn has made up his mind, just as I did when when I bought a ccdb, and found it to be a POS, IMO. Nope, I won't change my mind, no way, even if they did improve the shock, I'm not gonna budge, it's still a POS, and that's that.
> 
> it's okay to read a little sarcasm into the above statement


If I went through the crap you went through. I would hate the DB too. 

Thanks for taking one for the team!


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## ritopc (Jul 3, 2004)

After reading this thread, I want an Elka even more. Seems to do everything i would like a shock to do. Thanks guys!


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

ritopc said:


> After reading this thread, I want an Elka even more. Seems to do everything i would like a shock to do. Thanks guys!


Hahahaa!!


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

The whole point of posting this thread was to give people my perspective on the product, not to bag on Elka. If people leave feeling like they have a better idea of what they want, and it happens to be Elka, then that's good! 

Let me first say that Elka is one amazing company in terms of customer relations and getting feedback. I got an email from them thanking me for my honest feedback and they totally understand that I was just not happy with the feel and not trying to dog on their product. Hopefully my feedback will help them offer tunes for people who want more standard trail bike feel and not a racer feel. I have never experienced such a clean attitude from any other manufacturer. They are not full of themselves, they just want to make shocks that everyone will want to buy.


HEY ELKA! You still have one more chance to sell me on one when my Highline needs upgrading.  Hopefully a match made in heaven. :thumbsup:


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## FullMonty (Nov 3, 2008)

I don't feel like sifting back through the thread, but I recall you didn't like the rebound characteristics of the shock. What was it specifically that you didn't like? 

My understanding is that on big compressions/hits the rebound slows down quite a bit but near the top of the stroke it's relatively fast - "progressive rebound" as Elka says on their site. Were you looking for the opposite?


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## 1soulrider (Jan 21, 2004)

On a Highline, eh?


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## YoPawn (Mar 26, 2008)

FullMonty said:


> I don't feel like sifting back through the thread, but I recall you didn't like the rebound characteristics of the shock. What was it specifically that you didn't like?
> 
> My understanding is that on big compressions/hits the rebound slows down quite a bit but near the top of the stroke it's relatively fast - "progressive rebound" as Elka says on their site. Were you looking for the opposite?


Yup it is VERY progressive at the higher end of the damping range.

I want either a more linear (CCDB) or slightly regressive rebound (PUSH). Just a tiny bit more low speed rebound and a tiny bit less high speed rebound.

Let's just say, Elka is working with me to get me back onto an Elka. Hopefully I can create a new thread...

Elka Stage 5 trail tune = me happier than a Canadian in maple syrup. 

Let me also say that their customer service really has me sold. They truly want to find the right tune for my liking. And almost seem to take it to personal level of commitment.


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## FullMonty (Nov 3, 2008)

YoPawn said:


> Yup it is VERY progressive at the higher end of the damping range.
> 
> I want either a more linear (CCDB) or slightly regressive rebound (PUSH). Just a tiny bit more low speed rebound and a tiny bit less high speed rebound.
> 
> ...


Gotcha, I guess you're looking for more chassis control from the rebound circuit then? You're on a reign, right? I guess a little more low speed rebound would counteract the anti-squat when pedalling and make a nice, stable bike. I know that my Banshee Rune doesn't require much LSC on the shock, but definitely benefitted when I got the ISX-6 custom tuned. It feels like the tuner did something similar to PUSH's rebound settings.

I have an Elka coming for my 2010 Stab Deluxe, so I'm really looking forward to how the shock will work on a big go-fast single pivot. The Van R that's on there now is lacking to say the least.


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

Elka's customer service is top notch. 

I've dealt with Yann Guilbeault, the sales representative, and he is always fast, helpful and polite. 

I will try an Elka as soon as some cash flow comes in, I need to upgrade some other stuff first


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## FullMonty (Nov 3, 2008)

well, got my Elka and installed, set things in the middle-ish, and went for a ride. unfortunately the trails very wet and sloppy, so it's kinda hard to notice the nuances of suspension when you're thinking "don't eat sh!t and die on that root, that corner's full of mud, turn early, oh good more wet roots."


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## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

*Trying to stay on target...*

Cool, what bike is it on?

I was talking to Chris at Go Ride (after talking to Yann at Elka), and he suggested maybe running lighter compression settings. Rune Elkas use something like a 30/30 recipe, running a 20/30 recipe might be just the ticket.


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## FullMonty (Nov 3, 2008)

<sL4yEr>RuLz said:


> Cool, what bike is it on?
> 
> I was talking to Chris at Go Ride (after talking to Yann at Elka), and he suggested maybe running lighter compression settings. Rune Elkas use something like a 30/30 recipe, running a 20/30 recipe might be just the ticket.


2010 Kona Stab.

I can see how the rebound as-is wouldn't be so hot on a trail bike. standing and mashing makes things move around a fair bit, particularly if there's some anti-squat inherent in the suspension design.

Made a little vid, too. :thumbsup:


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## Rock Climber (Jul 25, 2007)

FullMonty said:


> 2010 Kona Stab.
> 
> I can see how the rebound as-is wouldn't be so hot on a trail bike. standing and mashing makes things move around a fair bit, particularly if there's some anti-squat inherent in the suspension design.
> 
> Made a little vid, too. :thumbsup:


That's a nice looking trail!


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## nightnerd (Mar 5, 2007)

- Elka Stage 5 = me really really impressed!

Hey guys, I'm bringing back this thread to life to share my experience with the Elka Stage 5. 

I have a 2008 Giant Reign x1 which is the same bike the original poster have. I rode the bike with the stock DHX 3 for a full year and could never get the back end of the bike to track as well as the front( Fox 36 Van R for trail days \ Marzocchi 2007 180mm RC2X for freeride and dh days). 

At the beginning of this season, I bought a FOX RC4 as an upgrade for the bike. I rode the thing a couple days, enough to tune it for the bike. It felt definitely better than the DHX 3 but I could never get it as plush as I like. It felt OK with the fox fork but it seemed to have too much compression (HSC fully open) compared to the RC2X. I was at a point where I was considering getting a ligther spring rate to see it would make the shock more sensitive to the small bumps. I was then running 400 lbs, same as with my dhx3.

By the meantime, my friend got a Nicolai Helius fr with a elka shock. He graciously let me try his beauty of a bike on one of our regular trail at Bromont while he took mine. The first thing I noticed was how glued to the ground the rear wheel felt. I needed one to.

The week after my friend and I went directly to Elka with my frame. They kept it for a couple days in order to see if there was and fitment issue and then to tune a shock specifically for it. I don't know where go-ride got their information in order to send Yopawn the right shock but I highly doubt he ended up getting the right setting. The thing is so plush and dialled. Its night and day compared to the two previous shock I have had on the same frame. It track as well as on my friend's bike. The range of adjustment is amazing and the progressive rebound feels great all the time. I am now able to run a 350lbs spring which makes everything more lively. The bike capacity really just opened up with this shock. Its much more stable at speed and on technical section. For me, its a no way back.


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## 8664 (Oct 17, 2005)

*shocker go elka*

i bougth my shock from a new shocker owner where prefer a rc4 

this nois is from:

The loud noise upon rebound stroke that some riders describe as a "sucking" sound is also a normal characteristic of our shock design, which is displacing a very large volume of oil for such a small shock. That's why we use a 14mm shaft and a bigger reservoir than most other shocks. Also, our rebound damping... relies a lot more on the valving (shim stack) than on the needle (adjuster) to provide the "progressive rebound" that most riders enjoy about the Stage 5. Finally, that noise will vary from bike to bike based on the valving used; the more progressive the rebound is, the louder the shock is. As one of our sponsored riders put it best: "It's the sound of performance, just like the turbo whoosh from a rally car."

says elka!

my shock works like a horse..


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## 8664 (Oct 17, 2005)

sunday i tried the stage5 in gnar dry conditions.. that shock tracks the earth like nothing else... super plush glued rear.. can't remember after the ride that i hafe a rear end so plush!!





Untitled from Antonio Joder on Vimeo.


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## dirtydawgnz (Jun 5, 2008)

*Elka/X-fusion/CCDB*

Good read! wow.

Now I'm really confused.

I have a Lapierre Froggy (not on Elkas 'list'). It has the same leverage ratio as two bikes on their list - Haro xtreme 7 and the Morewood Kalula (2.3:1) both have different tune recommendations and spring rate options.

I have talked to both Go-ride and Elka. The guy at Go-ride reckons the x-fusion is better for the aggressive all mountain that I do and reckons the Elka is a bit noisy.

I currently have a DHX Air - its shite after coming from a VP Free with DHX 5.

Price is not too much of a concern, weight is a small issue but a Ti spring will fix that.

At the moment I am leaning towards the 2011 X-fusion vector HLR. Its lighter, had plenty of great reviews and looks the business. I have heard too many varied reviews on the Elka which make me shy away from it (this one to boot). The CCDB seems great, however I don't like the fact you need a tool to tune it......

I guess all shocks are going to feel better than the DHX Air.

The rear shock will be paired with a FOx 36 float on a bike that will weigh 32lb with the coil. I ride mainly smooth/rooty trails, north shore stuff etc nothing epically big, but love speed.

All I want out of my shock is that it keeps the wheel on the ground over small bumps, can pop when needed and sits in its travel when run at 30% sag.

What would you do!!!!


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## derby (Jan 12, 2004)

dirtydawgnz said:


> ...
> 
> I guess all shocks are going to feel better than the DHX Air.
> 
> ...


Get a coil fork to better match the balance of a coil shock. Or coil fork to improve an air shocked bike handling (at least in front). Air forks don't match coil shocks.


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## Gman086 (Jul 4, 2004)

derby said:


> Get a coil fork to better match the balance of a coil shock. Or coil fork to improve an air shocked bike handling (at least in front). Air forks don't match coil shocks.


Wha? My Lyrik Solo Air DH is very linear (too much so in fact) and matches my Avy rear shock perfectly!

To each their own,

G

PS - This is an old thread but what I get out of it is that YoP had his mind made up that a CCDB was better from the first bad experience with the Elka. I see a lot of close-mindedness thruout this whole thread. I guess that's human nature tho!


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

derby said:


> Get a coil fork to better match the balance of a coil shock. Or coil fork to improve an air shocked bike handling (at least in front). Air forks don't match coil shocks.


I have to completely disagree with this

Air forks have come so far that there is hardly a difference. I have owned many of both kinds and have now decided I like air better since you can fine tune the fork easier and they are quite a bit lighter too.

I have owned both a boxxer WC and a boxxer Team (both new versions) and actually prefered the WC a little more.

Now going from an air shock to a coil shock is night and day different. Especially coming from a DHX air to a quality coil shock.

As for Elka or not, its hard to say. I have had one be one of the most amazing shocks ever and the other be just ok. The second one the rebound was way off. it went from waaay to fast for 3/4 of the clicks down to barely moving for the last couple. No inbetween. It was a custom deal though that hadn't been done before so it had probably just got the wrong rebound tune.


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## istandalone (Feb 6, 2011)

i've got one of these shocks and i can say it's been great. infinitely adjustable and totally plush.


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## darkzeon (Jun 15, 2006)

Thread revival. 

I just got a used Elka. I noticed that the HSC has no clicks, I cannot open the knob cause the tiny allen bolts have been "rounded" off by the previous owner. Maybe the detent ball has fallen off or something.

I also noticed that the first initial stroke of the travel (around 5mm) is overly sensitive compared to my DHX. You can activate movement just by "lightly" pressing on the bike without rider, it also has a sag of 3mm without rider. I also noticed that there is a clunking feel if you pull up on the bike, or by rocking the bike to check for loose pivots. It feels like there's a loose pivot but I'm certain that it is the shock. The clunking is in the first initial part of the travel. Anyone has the same issues on your Elka?


And, yes the shock is making that sucking, slurping sound.


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## FullMonty (Nov 3, 2008)

yeah, I had that with mine.


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## darkzeon (Jun 15, 2006)

FullMonty said:


> yeah, I had that with mine.


Have you had your shock serviced yet? I find the service fee of $99 a bit steep though (yes I'm friggin' poor ). And I have to ship it international.


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