# Levo SL vs. Levo



## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Anyone convinced with one over the other? Which one?

This might help.
https://reviews.mtbr.com/specialized-levo-sl-vs-levo-which-one-is-for-you


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## Dirtrider127 (Sep 17, 2010)

Great review and very fair plus I think, spot on. Thank you!


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## Salespunk (Sep 15, 2005)

Great write up, they serve different purposes for sure


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Light, powerful, range - pick any two. Cheap isn't an option with either. ;-)

Nice bikes, both of them. I'm hedging my bets and holding onto my current eMTB for another year or so, with the prospect that the weight <-> power/range compromise will be mitigated in the not too distant future.

I love the idea of smaller "range extenders" when you need them/want them. I hope other manufacturers follow suit.


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## dustyman (Feb 13, 2007)

I think it depends on what type of rider you are. If your more of a traditional mountain biker you will definitely prefer the new SL because it rides more like a regular Stumpjumper. I’ve been riding a Levo for 2 years but I only use it on longer rides with lots of climbing or when it’s 85 plus degrees outside. If your a new rider or don’t get aerobic exercise regularly you may prefer the Levo. I test road the new SL and was blown away by how much fun it was going downhill. This is how an E bike should ride. My Levo feels like a tank compared to the SL. I’m definitely selling my Levo when I can afford the new SL.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

If the e-bike was to be my only bike, then I would definitely get the SL. I plan on keeping/riding my Hightower when I do eventually get an e-bike, so will probably go for the power/range/ differentiation of something like the Levo.


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## Mtbvkk (Sep 13, 2017)

Great video - very helpful. Any idea of the difference between the levo 500wh and 700wh battery in terms of elevation and hours? I'm thinking of going to the base model Levo to save money and get the 700h later if I need it. I probably do max of 15-20 miles with 3000 feet of elevation over 3-4 hours. I won't be needing anything covering more than that for the near term.


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## MikeTowpathTraveler (Aug 12, 2015)

Very nice, informative and fair review. I hope you are able to do more reviews of other ebikes along the way.

Both are far too expensive but might just be the ticket for that remaining 10% elite mtb crowd where these prices are not a concern. 

Long term Levo issues indicate that internal motor belt to be problematic. I was never a fan of not having a display readout to review the miles you've ridden, estimated miles left, battery percentage remaining; but this does not appear to be a problem for the Specialized fans and owners out there of these bikes. On the plus side, the Specialized and Trek dealership family is a strong one, as compared to say, Haibike, which has very iffy warranty support from things I've read over the past few years. I can see that Levo SL being a very niche product made to attract the anti-ebike crowd into joining the ranks of the pedal assist world. Though I do see alot of sales of that small back up battery.

I bring my Haibike battery (Yamaha ebike drive, Full FatSix) into the house to recharge. Comes in handy on those sub-freezing days when it's best to let the battery stabilize to room temp before recharging. This is all pretty much standard practice with the knowledge gained in lithium ion technology and squeezing the most life from these batteries. Just can't get around the extra steps required to remove these Specialized batteries from the bottom.....

But again, these Levo's are a popular seller, so they have to be doing something right.


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## DonH (Oct 1, 2004)

MikeTowpathTraveler said:


> But again, these Levo's are a popular seller, so they have to be doing something right.


The Specialized website had some decent sale prices on the Levo models (NOT the SL) last week, but I see the sale prices are no longer listed.


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## Browneye (Feb 20, 2020)

Been shopping for a eMTB for a time, you can still find '19 turbo levo comps for $5300 at local dealers here in CA. 

At one shop I tried both SL and Levo Comp. As a old as dirt old dirtbiker getting into eMTB'ing, the Turbo Comp got my nod. But the 2020 model has the 700w pack so it's worth it over the base model. Otherwise if the 500w pack is okay could get last years' comp. 

For 2020 the base comp now has a dropper-seat, but for the cost of the battery upgrade to 700w, you get a whole host of upgrades with it, shifter, brakes, suspension, etc. But yeah, a '20 levo comp is six grand.

The SL is super smooth, but not being able to ride either on a trail left me without a good gauge. For sure it's more 'pure' mtb'ing than the Comp, and it's more money, but gee, 39lbs???

As you can see, I went the other route...


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

MikeTowpathTraveler said:


> I bring my . . . battery. . . into the house to recharge. Comes in handy on those sub-freezing days when it's best to let the battery stabilize to room temp before recharging. This is all pretty much standard practice with the knowledge gained in lithium ion technology and squeezing the most life from these batteries. Just can't get around the extra steps required to remove these Specialized batteries from the bottom.....


I agree - plan for reduced battery life for batteries that you have to leave in the freezing cold or super hot environments or you may need to bring the whole bike into the house if your wife lets you ha ha.

I see that the 700 wh Levo battery sells for $1,299. I wonder how much the smaller SL sells for??? I predict not cheap and for now only available from Specialized.

LBS salesman once told me with proper care, the (Bosch) battery was designed to last 5 years/500 charge cycles. Most people don't keep their bike 5 years I remember thinking.


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## Vin829 (Mar 29, 2019)

I bought a SL with 2 spare batteries. They were $400 each from my LBS. they weigh 2lbs each


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## peterhenric (Jan 31, 2014)

I’m curious as to the interested people in an SL (Especially the SL Founders Edition $$$$$)
I’ve got an Intense Tazer and my preferred mode of use is “Trail” mode or middle assist. I don’t dislike using “Eco” mode but it certainly isn’t my favorite. The ~50lb weight of the bike does take some getting used to but the only place the weight would be too much of a downside is if you were riding in slow rocky terrain where you have to do a lot of up-and-overs or bunny hops. In that one condition I could see the allure of the Levo SL but that’s it.
Less assist, shorter battery life, and lighter bike don’t really appeal to me.

BTW, I ride for the fun of it and the exercise is just a positive byproduct.


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

Vin829 said:


> I bought a SL with 2 spare batteries. They were $400 each from my LBS. they weigh 2lbs each


I may be thinking out of the box here, but I would like to buy an SL and have the dealer remove the internal battery from the start. Would the bike work without the internal battery and only a range extender mounted? Would they sell it to you like that?

Hence, my question, what is the price of the 320wh battery? Could I sell it to defray my cost? Guys, just brainstorming here!


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## peterhenric (Jan 31, 2014)

Jack7782 said:


> I may be thinking out of the box here, but I would like to buy an SL and have the dealer remove the internal battery from the start. Would the bike work without the internal battery and only a range extender mounted? Would they sell it to you like that?
> 
> Hence, my question, what is the price of the 320wh battery? Could I sell it to defray my cost? Guys, just brainstorming here!


What is the end goal? Remove 1 battery just to replace it with another? The location of the external battery is higher and will negatively affect performance.


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

peterhenric said:


> What is the end goal? Remove 1 battery just to replace it with another? The location of the external battery is higher and will negatively affect performance.


Main reason is to fly with my bike in EVOC bag and the range extender in my carryon luggage. Other reason is to ride on any MTB trail - no battery makes it a trail bike again, right?


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

yes, you can ride the bike with just the range extender.


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## prghix (Aug 4, 2019)

Jack7782 said:


> I agree - plan for reduced battery life for batteries that you have to leave in the freezing cold or super hot environments


:thumbsup: I do the same.. I never leave my E8000 battery in bike, when the temperatures fall.. well just below 5-7C.

I was at Cannondale service with my CUJO NEO 130.. and after 1300kms and 28 full charges (according to the diagnostics) they say there was 99% battery capacity still left...


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## Callender (Mar 25, 2014)

I'm looking forward to trying the SL. I've ridden the Kenevo and Levo. They were nice for knocking out the climbs, but felt like tanks on s/t. I wanted my Ibis Ripley LS for the descents!


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## Grizzy (Sep 12, 2009)

Just rode an SL & Levo back2back. Biggest diff I felt was once you exceed 20 the sl feels like a normal bike, still can accelerate. It manuals like a reg bike. Is planted but not to the degree of reg ebikes. Couldnt feel a huge difference in the motors, it was there, but not huge. 

Its flat where I live, but in real mountains if your self shuttling the std evo would be better. 

If its rolling trails and your relatively fit them SL. 

Just my 2 cents. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## knobs (Oct 13, 2005)

Cool FPV drone video featuring the Levo SL:






Hard to tell it's an ebike at all, with all the airborne time. But freeze frame it and yup it is indeed a LSL.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

mlx john said:


> If the e-bike was to be my only bike, then I would definitely get the SL. I plan on keeping/riding my Hightower when I do eventually get an e-bike, so will probably go for the power/range/ differentiation of something like the Levo.


That's basically my approach. My Hightower is my "everyday" bike, and I have a Pivot Shuttle eMTB. I like the fact that it is burly enough that I can ride it everywhere I ride my Hightower, and I've set the suspension up on both bikes fairly similarly.


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## jcmonty (Apr 11, 2015)

I love my SL. Been riding a Kenevo (2019) for about 2500 miles . Love(d) it, but it was a bit much for most trails, and I was missing the "trail bike feel' after selling my main trail bike. Plus I was eager to try a bit bigger (XL vs L) of a bike.

I have over 200 miles on my SL now (even with all the social distancing/trail closures), and it's been great. Basically what I wanted when originally got an ebike. On my kenevo, I end up dialing back the support/power for most rides - so the less torquey motor wasn't a huge shock on the SL. I actually get about the same range, maybe a bit more, with the SL, but it's about 1.5-2mph slower on average for a ride

Descents are much more maneuverable and can change direction quickly, less plow, and less draining. I have already slackened my SL with an offset bushing and will probably add a 160mm fork + better shock to give it a bit more aggressive feel. That being said, I have taken it done everything I did with my 180mm Kenevo, albeit a bit less comfortably.

If you are normal bike rider on the fence about your next bike being an ebike or not, this is a great option. If you are an ebiker wanting something a bit more of a trail bike feel, but still want the support - this is a great option. If you are all about "turbo" and going as fast as possible on the climbs - probably look elsewhere.


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## stiksandstones (Oct 7, 2004)

6 weeks on the SL, I came off a 700wh levo carbon....not sure I LOVE it. It does handle 'better', certainly is 'slower' and battery doesnt last long (I do have the spare bottle mount battery)....too early to tell if I have buyers remorse, but, it does ride more like a traditional MTB and I was looking for that as classic eMTB's do ride pretty awful (handling wise).


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## roughster (Dec 18, 2017)

Briones ... all SL rides took off early on each segment of heavy climbing because everyone else would catch and pass them. Just saying ...


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

roughster said:


> Briones ... all SL rides took off early on each segment of heavy climbing because everyone else would catch and pass them. Just saying ...


So basically, the SL is less of a motorcycle than a full e-bike? But more of a bike according to every review.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## AGarcia (Feb 20, 2012)

I thought long about the Levo SL, but went with a left over 2019 Levo Expert Carbon, primarily because it was over $2900 off the MSRP (from $8275 to $5350). It's the second Levo in my family (I bought my wife a 1st Gen Levo 4 years ago). I'm really loving my Levo so far. I'm a big guy (250lbs) so it kinda works for me anyway. And I have a Pivot Mach 429SL and a late model Stumpjumper for non-assisted riding.


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## roughster (Dec 18, 2017)

Suns_PSD said:


> So basically, the SL is less of a motorcycle than a full e-bike? But more of a bike according to every review.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Careful, your disdain is showing  Anyone who thinks a Levo Comp is a motorcycle instantly looses all credibility.

My point was more of a real world warning for anyone on the fence.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

roughster said:


> Careful, your disdain is showing  Anyone who thinks a Levo Comp is a motorcycle instantly looses all credibility.
> 
> My point was more of a real world warning for anyone on the fence.


I assure you that I want to own and ride an e-bike if they are made legal on TX trail systems, as currently they are not. I'm eagerly waiting with money in hand.

But a 55#, 400% of the input power isn't so much a pedal assist as it is a rider assisted motorcycle.

And they ARE motorcycles, or scooters if they don't use a hand throttle, just light and slow enough that I hope they will get reclassified as legal as Class 1s. Claiming that a bicycle with a motor, isn't a motorcycle makes YOU lose all credibility, because that's exactly what it is.


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## prghix (Aug 4, 2019)

Suns_PSD said:


> Claiming that a bicycle with a motor, isn't a motorcycle makes YOU lose all credibility, because that's exactly what it is.


What a moronic statement 

I have over 300 000 kms on motorcycles, mostly on GS. Very distant to pedal-assisted emtbs.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

prghix said:


> What a moronic statement
> 
> I have over 300 000 kms on motorcycles, mostly on GS. Very distant to pedal-assisted emtbs.


You are in denial and that doesn't help the cause. You should be arguing that the throttle being controlled by pedaling, the max hp being about 1, combined with their low noise level, should result in these motorcycles getting different privileges than standard motorcyles.

Horse people don't argue that their horse isn't an animal so it shouldn't be classified with any animals, they simply acknowledge that it's a domesticated animal with some different attributes so therefore gets special priveleges.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/motorcycle

*motorcycle* noun
English Language Learners Definition of motorcycle
: *a vehicle with two wheels that is powered by a motor and that can carry one* *or two people*


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## roughster (Dec 18, 2017)

400% of 0 is ? Sorry your logic shows it’s not a motorcycle. It’s a motor assisted pedal bicycle. In order to amplify something, that something has to be greater than zero. A motorcycle does not require a power input from the rider it is 100% powered by a motor. That’s the difference and distinction.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Actually it's just a different way of controlling the throttle. 
This is what really is so annoying about the entire e-bike movement. The absolute disconnect with reality from many of it's defenders. 
A bicycle with a motor, is a motorcycle. That's the definition. 
I'll agree with you 100% that it only has 1 hp, doesn't cause significant trail damage, is quiet, has a legitimate place on trails, and so on, but don't piss on my head and tell me it's raining. 

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## roughster (Dec 18, 2017)

Suns_PSD said:


> Actually it's just a different way of controlling the throttle.
> This is what really is so annoying about the entire e-bike movement. The absolute disconnect with reality from many of it's defenders.
> A bicycle with a motor, is a motorcycle. That's the definition.
> I'll agree with you 100% that it only has 1 hp, doesn't cause significant trail damage, is quiet, has a legitimate place on trails, and so on, but don't piss on my head and tell me it's raining.
> ...


Sorry, the law doesn't agree:

https://currentebikes.com/ebike-classes-california/

Exact language from AB-1096:



> SEC. 7. Section 24016 of the Vehicle Code is amended to read:
> 24016. (a) An electric bicycle described in subdivision (a) of Section 312.5 shall meet the following criteria:
> (1) Comply with the equipment and manufacturing requirements for bicycles adopted by the United States Consumer Product Safety Commission (16 C.F.R. 1512.1, et seq.).
> (2) Operate in a manner so that the electric motor is disengaged or ceases to function when the brakes are applied, or operate in a manner such that the motor is engaged through a switch or mechanism that, when released or activated, will cause the electric motor to disengage or cease to function.
> (b) A person operating an electric bicycle is not subject to the provisions of this code relating to financial responsibility, driver's licenses, registration, and license plate requirements, _*and an electric bicycle is not a motor vehicle.*_


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Suns_PSD said:


> You are in denial and that doesn't help the cause. You should be arguing that the throttle being controlled by pedaling, the max hp being about 1, combined with their low noise level, should result in these motorcycles getting different privileges than standard motorcyles.


And your _insistence_ on calling it a motorcycle rather than an e-bike is helping the cause?



Suns_PSD said:


> absolute disconnect with reality


Rigid adherence to specific definitions, I get it...semantics aside, is a class 1 e-mountain bike more similar to a mountain bike or an off-road gasoline motorcycle?

But to get back on topic. Loving my HT right now, so looking at the Levo for that differentiation. 2 very different bikes, both so much fun.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

mlx john said:


> And your _insistence_ on calling it a motorcycle rather than an e-bike is helping the cause?
> 
> Rigid adherence to specific definitions, I get it...semantics aside, is a class 1 e-mountain bike more similar to a mountain bike or an off-road gasoline motorcycle?
> 
> But to get back on topic. Loving my HT right now, so looking at the Levo for that differentiation. 2 very different bikes, both so much fun.


Well said, it truly is hard to take anyone serious when they start out calling ebikes motorcycles. I don't know why this needs to be repeated, but the "E" in front of ebike, should be enough clue for most people to realize there's a electric low power motor in the bike. No one is disputing that!


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

It looks like we are going to have to agree to disagree. 

- stay healthy.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## careyj1 (May 12, 2017)

Both are great bikes. I like the Levo more than the SL because I want to climb as fast as I can. Most of the rides I do have big, steep climbs. 3000 to 5000 feet of climbing. Levo is better for that type of riding. I also have a road bike, Tallboy bike and XC race bike. Last year I raced the XC bike 12 times. 

I am having the most fun on the e-mountain bike because in 2 hours I can climb 4500 feet and get a lot of downhill time. On my 21 pound xc bike, in 2hours I can climb 3000 feet but I am tired and I get less down hill time.


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## Browneye (Feb 20, 2020)

My R1200GS was 125hp, went zero to sixty in 3.2 seconds. 
My Trance? Hmmm...not so much. 

While smart people don't like to censor for ignorance, it's becoming more clear for this type of application. The suns-dingaling simply doesn't know what he's talking about, and should consider just posting less and reading more. 
Thank you.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

mlx john said:


> Loving my HT2 right now, so looking at the Levo for that differentiation. 2 very different bikes, both so much fun.


Spez Turbo Levo Comp shipped. Can't wait...


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## Vin829 (Mar 29, 2019)

Interesting review
https://www.bikemag.com/gear/mounta...mail&em_hash=e9783c665290b7be56bc4d07284a44dc


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

Vin829 said:


> Interesting review
> https://www.bikemag.com/gear/mounta...mail&em_hash=e9783c665290b7be56bc4d07284a44dc


Good review! Makes want to demo an SL!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

If I get a Specialized, it is a tough call. Two things make me lean towards the Levo- riding with my 3-4 buddies who have e-bikes (I'd never keep up with them on the SL, with all the climbs here) and all the steep stuff I have around me makes me just go ride road or gravel when I find an hour or two. With a baby, I hardly have had time to ride so the Levo would be good. I do have my Yeti 4.5 still. If going to one bike, the SL may make sense. The one thing that concerns me is that Brose motor's reliability (and part availability) on the Levo.


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## stiksandstones (Oct 7, 2004)

Flyer said:


> If I get a Specialized, it is a tough call. Two things make me lean towards the Levo- riding with my 3-4 buddies who have e-bikes (I'd never keep up with them on the SL, with all the climbs here) and all the steep stuff I have around me makes me just go ride road or gravel when I find an hour or two. With a baby, I hardly have had time to ride so the Levo would be good. I do have my Yeti 4.5 still. If going to one bike, the SL may make sense. The one thing that concerns me is that Brose motor's reliability (and part availability) on the Levo.


Levo and Levo SL owner here-I do miss my Levo, for its torque/power/speed and the range...I do not miss the weight. I have the SL extender and did a ride that I usually would do on my 700wh levo, so its nice to have that as most of my rides do not require range. I have a few people I ride with that have standard spec eMTB (brose, shimano, bosch) and me on the SL struggles to keep up with them, but they just dial it down to middle power modes. If the SL was my first ever eMTB, I'd probably think its the greatest thing of all time, but I have owned and ridden all the other motors/models and got spoiled with the turbo modes haha.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

So stoked. Really impressed with the power and ride quality. The Geo, kinematics are excellent. Surprised at how well the Lyrik Select and the Rockshox Deluxe performed on the descents, that being said, have ordered a DPX2 and a RC2.1 damper upgrade, as well as a RF Next R handlebar.

Had ordered a new '20 Levo Comp, but order was not finalized, apparently Spez had completely sold out. LBS sold me their Demo, which had a grand total of 62 miles on it-24 by me last October when I demoed it for myself.

OEM wheels are decent enough for now. Threw them in my truing stand, spoke tension fine, holding up well after a couple of rides, one very rocky, lots of climbing/descending.

Range is way better than expected. Did a 16.5 mile night ride, 1800 feet of climbing, using mostly Eco, which I set 25% support, 45% peak power. Used trail setting (45% 60%) for less than quarter mile maybe. Ended with 64% battery left.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

mix john- is that a Levo or Levo SL? I'm still not able to discern- looks like a SL but not sure. Which model year?


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

2020 Turbo Levo comp. Not the SL.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

mlx john said:


> If the e-bike was to be my only bike, then I would definitely get the SL. I plan on keeping/riding my Hightower when I do eventually get an e-bike, so will probably go for the power/range/ differentiation of something like the Levo.





RickBullottaPA said:


> That's basically my approach. My Hightower is my "everyday" bike, and I have a Pivot Shuttle eMTB. I like the fact that it is burly enough that I can ride it everywhere I ride my Hightower, and I've set the suspension up on both bikes fairly similarly.


So a week with the Levo. It's been really fun and different. Was slightly concerned that I would not want to ride my Hightower2 anymore once I got the E-bike.

That has not been the case. Have done 4 rides on the Levo, and 2 on the Hightower. The contrast has emphasized how great a bike like the HT is.

Will probably continue to ride the HT once or twice a week (group rides w/friends who don't ride E-bikes) and the Levo on solo rides. I can already tell that my fitness has actually gone up riding the Levo, my heart rate is a little lower on longer rides.

Did a 30 mile ride last Saturday with 3000 ft climbing on the HT2 on pretty rocky technical terrain. Lots of climbing/descending. Was a blast.


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## Dgo Shelley (May 23, 2020)

Were you able to buy a Levo comp at your LBS in ABQ? I am not having much luck finding a Levo Comp large frame in Durango, Moab, Cortez, Junction, Pagosa.  Put a call into the ABQ Spec shop, have not heard back yet.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

They are flying out of the shops. I know someone who has new 2019s (leftovers) but as far as 2020s go, they are super hard to find, unless you move up to the Expert line and then there are a couple here and there. Here I think one shop has a large 2020 Expert and another has a large 2019. They have just sold everything they could get.


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## cobi (Apr 29, 2008)

Dgo Shelley said:


> Were you able to buy a Levo comp at your LBS in ABQ? I am not having much luck finding a Levo Comp large frame in Durango, Moab, Cortez, Junction, Pagosa.  Put a call into the ABQ Spec shop, have not heard back yet.


I was looking Sat at Ruby Canyon in Grand Junction. They have some Comp SL's in Large (maybe one medium?) One XL SL that was out for demo (which he thought may get bought). I think they had 2 SL Experts as well (in large?). One large Levo Comp (demo that they would sell I beleive). Also had a leftover 2019 Kenevo in XL.


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

mlx john said:


> So a week with the Levo. It's been really fun and different. Was slightly concerned that I would not want to ride my Hightower2 anymore once I got the E-bike.
> 
> That has not been the case. Have done 4 rides on the Levo, and 2 on the Hightower. The contrast has emphasized how great a bike like the HT is.
> 
> ...


Don't delude yourself, your fitness will not go up from riding an ebike unless you are hugely unfit (which you aren't given you did 3000 ft of climbing on the HT). I ride my Levo 80% of the time and the biggest thing I notice when I get back on my normal bike is how reluctant it feels to pedal lol takes a few klms to get my legs back up to speed!


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Dgo Shelley said:


> Were you able to buy a Levo comp at your LBS in ABQ? I am not having much luck finding a Levo Comp large frame in Durango, Moab, Cortez, Junction, Pagosa.  Put a call into the ABQ Spec shop, have not heard back yet.


They put in an order for a Levo Comp a couple of weeks ago, but Specialized canceled it, they were out of stock (computer was lagging in info on stock). They let me buy their Demo. (Sport Systems) High Desert is the other Spez dealer in ABQ, did you call them?



springs said:


> Don't delude yourself, your fitness will not go up from riding an ebike unless you are hugely unfit (which you aren't given you did 3000 ft of climbing on the HT). I ride my Levo 80% of the time and the biggest thing I notice when I get back on my normal bike is how reluctant it feels to pedal lol takes a few klms to get my legs back up to speed!


My cardio is good, and I'm pretty strong for an old man (50). I could stand to lose 10+ pounds, E-bike keeps my heart rate in the optimal zone for that, and I'm also out riding a lot more.


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## prghix (Aug 4, 2019)

springs said:


> Don't delude yourself, your fitness will not go up from riding an ebike unless you are hugely unfit (which you aren't given you did 3000 ft of climbing on the HT). I ride my Levo 80% of the time and the biggest thing I notice when I get back on my normal bike is how reluctant it feels to pedal lol takes a few klms to get my legs back up to speed!


I'd dispute this... as "mlx john" stated below, with ebike you can keep your heart rate in the optimal zones = translates to longer and more frequent rides.

More to that -- a lot of recent studies suggest that MODERATE exercise is the key for longtime cardio and overall health... its a gaussian curve.


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## OhioPT (Jul 14, 2012)

springs said:


> Don't delude yourself, your fitness will not go up from riding an ebike unless you are hugely unfit (which you aren't given you did 3000 ft of climbing on the HT). I ride my Levo 80% of the time and the biggest thing I notice when I get back on my normal bike is how reluctant it feels to pedal lol takes a few klms to get my legs back up to speed!


Fitness is a broad term. As mentioned earlier, e-bikes allow you to pedal longer because your heart rate is lower (unless you're in an e-bike race or something). This is awesome for aerobic/cardio and tempo zone training, or even recovery days. Saying that class 1 e-bikes will not help your general "fitness" it simply not true.

However, if you are using an e-bike for MOST of your riding (vs a regular bike), your are unlikely to see gains in power/FTP (unless you are pretty untrained). Significant FTP gains require high intensity interval training. Mountain biking in hilly terrain on a regular bike is a great way to do this, but add a motor and the ride becomes significantly less "intense". When riding solo on a regular bike (not racing, but a good pace), my heart rate is typically ~150 bpm average, and 172'ish peak. On an e-bike it's ~143 average and 162'ish max. My cycling max heart rate is somewhere around 177 bpm, for reference. It doesn't sound like much, but the effort/training difference is pretty significant. After a 2 hour ride, it's the difference between feeling wiped out, vs feeling like I can work out for another hour+.

A lot of people couldn't care less about FTP though. For them, an e-bike is all they need, if they have good access to trails open to e-bikes.


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## prghix (Aug 4, 2019)

btw: you can always tune your assistance levels/curve... at least with Shimano E8000. As far as I remember, the same is possible for Brose.. right?

When your fitness go up.. you just tone down your motor power curve in TRAIL / EMTB.. or how is it called on Brose.


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## jcmonty (Apr 11, 2015)

OhioPT said:


> Fitness is a broad term. As mentioned earlier, e-bikes allow you to pedal longer because your heart rate is lower (unless you're in an e-bike race or something). This is awesome for aerobic/cardio and tempo zone training, or even recovery days. Saying that class 1 e-bikes will not help your general "fitness" it simply not true.
> 
> However, if you are using an e-bike for MOST of your riding (vs a regular bike), your are unlikely to see gains in power/FTP (unless you are pretty untrained). Significant FTP gains require high intensity interval training. Mountain biking in hilly terrain on a regular bike is a great way to do this, but add a motor and the ride becomes significantly less "intense". When riding solo on a regular bike (not racing, but a good pace), my heart rate is typically ~150 bpm average, and 172'ish peak. On an e-bike it's ~143 average and 162'ish max. My cycling max heart rate is somewhere around 177 bpm, for reference. It doesn't sound like much, but the effort/training difference is pretty significant. After a 2 hour ride, it's the difference between feeling wiped out, vs feeling like I can work out for another hour+.
> 
> A lot of people couldn't care less about FTP though. For them, an e-bike is all they need, if they have good access to trails open to e-bikes.


I pretty much agree with you on your points. Why my overall fitness increased (30s guy in moderately decent shape, but no tri-athlete ) was the riding increase. It was more mental than anything given that I wanted to ride more and dreaded the longer climbs less.

After primarily riding a heavy kenevo for 1.5 years, I saw my upper body strength increase, overall cardio increase purely from time in saddle and the transition to steeper, more demanding trails. Out of saddle sprints, etc were less, which I could tell when going back to my normal bike.

Now with the SL - I would say it's closer to a normal MTB in terms of fitness requirements. It takes the edge of off everything, obviously, but it's much less of a difference. I feel more like I have a XCers legs than an Olympians  It throws around more like a normal bike as well, feeling much closer to 30lbs than 50lbs. I sprint more often and am out of the saddle. Climbs are longer than with a normal ebike and more demanding. The smooth motor transition also allows for pedaling 20+mph on the road etc without feeling like you are hitting wall. Wattage improvements, power curve, and heart rate all check out (tracked via the onboard power meter and garmin).


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## cobi (Apr 29, 2008)

jcmonty said:


> I pretty much agree with you on your points. Why my overall fitness increased (30s guy in moderately decent shape, but no tri-athlete ) was the riding increase. It was more mental than anything given that I wanted to ride more and dreaded the longer climbs less.
> 
> After primarily riding a heavy kenevo for 1.5 years, I saw my upper body strength increase, overall cardio increase purely from time in saddle and the transition to steeper, more demanding trails. Out of saddle sprints, etc were less, which I could tell when going back to my normal bike.
> 
> Now with the SL - I would say it's closer to a normal MTB in terms of fitness requirements. It takes the edge of off everything, obviously, but it's much less of a difference. I feel more like I have a XCers legs than an Olympians  It throws around more like a normal bike as well, feeling much closer to 30lbs than 50lbs. I sprint more often and am out of the saddle. Climbs are longer than with a normal ebike and more demanding. The smooth motor transition also allows for pedaling 20+mph on the road etc without feeling like you are hitting wall. Wattage improvements, power curve, and heart rate all check out (tracked via the onboard power meter and garmin).


So I just demo'd a SL last night and this morning. Did about double my normal after work mileage last night and more than double my usual climbing. Re-rode a moto trail I just did Sunday on my reg bike. Made all the climbs for the first time ever! Liked the overall feeling of the bike, etc... Did another ride on trails I do more often this morning and had a blast. Definitely notice you have to put out on the SL to get the boost, a few times I misjudged the proper gear and I was almost ground to a halt.

So I liked it, but I'm really torn since I can't demo a regular Levo. I can certainly see where more power would have been nice in some places.

For reference I ride a good amount but am at least 40lbs over where I'd like to be weight wise (have been for years, it doesn't stop me... just slows me down). With the SL I'd honestly simply be able to keep up with my regular riding partner (ok maybe be a little faster). I noticed overall I was probably averaging about 1.5 - 2 mph better overall for the ride. My average speeds last night and this morning were nothing special to fast riders locally.

If and when I get an eBike, I plan to adhere to the limitations currently in place locally, which means no non-motorized trail until BLM and Forest Service give the thumbs up "officially" (hearing it could still take a YEAR and may be limited to specific trails to start). So I'm looking for something that can currently get me out further, riding farther on moto trail, double-track and jeep trail mostly (of which we have PLENTY that I haven't explored). Not sure if the SL is the right fit for that, for me (and my body type). I keep reading the SL is being geared towards the fitter riders that just want to go farther, etc... that's not really me.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

cobi said:


> So I just demo'd a SL last night and this morning. Did about double my normal after work mileage last night and more than double my usual climbing. Re-rode a moto trail I just did Sunday on my reg bike. Made all the climbs for the first time ever! Liked the overall feeling of the bike, etc... Did another ride on trails I do more often this morning and had a blast. Definitely notice you have to put out on the SL to get the boost, a few times I misjudged the proper gear and I was almost ground to a halt.
> 
> So I liked it, but I'm really torn since I can't demo a regular Levo. I can certainly see where more power would have been nice in some places.
> 
> ...


As others have alluded to, if you ride by yourself or other MTBs the SL is the perfect ebike. But if you are going to ride with other normal powered ebikes, you'll be slower on the climbs or using to much power trying to keep up. I still haven't had a chance to try out an SL, long forward to swing a leg over one. 
Good luck with possible ebike purchase!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

cobi said:


> So I just demo'd a SL last night and this morning. Did about double my normal after work mileage last night and more than double my usual climbing. Re-rode a moto trail I just did Sunday on my reg bike. Made all the climbs for the first time ever! Liked the overall feeling of the bike, etc... Did another ride on trails I do more often this morning and had a blast. Definitely notice you have to put out on the SL to get the boost, a few times I misjudged the proper gear and I was almost ground to a halt.
> 
> So I liked it, but I'm really torn since I can't demo a regular Levo. I can certainly see where more power would have been nice in some places.
> 
> ...


I already have a regular 29er MTB so the SL would be nice but not enough of a difference, especially if riding with others on regular e-bikes. That is what finally swayed me away from the SL to the Levo. However, I ended up with a Pivot Shuttle since it was discounted and seems to be a more nimble e-bike than the Levo. I am not a rider who lives for the DH only so I figured it would match me better with its shorter chainstays and wheelbase. Plus, I like the way DW Link bikes climb. So Levo or Shuttle type of -e-bikes for me. Regular riding with friends- I'll take the Yeti 4.5.


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## smoothmoose (Jun 8, 2008)

Spesh - used to have range and climb estimator for the Levo on their website. Can't find it anymore. One of the primary inputs is your body/riding weight. Power is directly related to mass.

No judgement on others size and weight, but given my experience being a 150# rider and trying to get my wife who is 110# an e-bike. A typical 50# ebike with 500W assist and 500-700Wh battery is typically overkill unless I'm planning to scream uphill all the time.

I would take a guess if you are 180# or more a Levo is better suited, but if you weigh less the Levo SL.


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## cobi (Apr 29, 2008)

Flyer said:


> I already have a regular 29er MTB so the SL would be nice but not enough of a difference, especially if riding with others on regular e-bikes. That is what finally swayed me away from the SL to the Levo. However, I ended up with a Pivot Shuttle since it was discounted and seems to be a more nimble e-bike than the Levo. I am not a rider who lives for the DH only so I figured it would match me better with its shorter chainstays and wheelbase. Plus, I like the way DW Link bikes climb. So Levo or Shuttle type of -e-bikes for me. Regular riding with friends- I'll take the Yeti 4.5.


So, I got to try a few laps around the block on someone else's Levo. Wow what a difference over the SL.... felt like a rocket ship in full Turbo. Maybe not a fair comparison due to being on pavement, but I did test the SL a bit on pavement before taking it out for my demo rides. Definitely need to try a Levo on trail before making a decision. But for hauling my fat butt around some remote areas, extra power and battery may be the ticket.


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## Callender (Mar 25, 2014)

I'm SO glad I got my Levo (2019 Expert)! I've had 10 rides on it over the last three weeks and it just keeps getting better. At 60, I feel like I'm riding downhills better than ever because of all the extra practice--and I'm not gassed from the uphills. Coming from a Ripley LS, the extra suspension is a lot more capable on jumps, drops, and steeps (mostly around Santa Cruz). I did 4K of climbing today (mostly Trail mode) and I still had 5 bars left at the end. 

I only weigh about 154, but the suspension and overall setup is much better on the Levo compared to the SL. I think it comes down to if you're riding more XC or AM. And, yes, it will feel sluggish when you first start riding a Levo, but your technique adjusts quickly and for me it's almost as playful as my Ripley at this point. 

I am planning on switching to Shimano brakes at some point, because the Sram's aren't very confidence-inspiring.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Edited for clarity:

Returned the Levo. Pretty fit for an old man, found myself with 50 percent battery life at the end of 30 mile, 3000+ feet of climbing. Riding in primarily dialed down eco mode. Lugging around a 700wh battery and a 565 watt motor that I did not need.
Levo comp weight 52 pounds.

Wanted best of both worlds, the nimble handling of my HT and the assist of the Levo.

So bought the Levo SL Carbon Expert. 39.1 pounds with XT trail pedals and bottle cage. Feels like a regular long travel 29er. The short chain stays are legit.

First real test, 4500 ft elevation, 29 miles. Climbed a mountain. Part of the climb is affectionately called Satan's @sshole. No range extender, ended ride with 21% battery. The bike was a revelation (sorry Satan).

Heart rate average 140, max 185.

A ride like that would regularly wreck me for a couple of days. Did a ride the next day, 16 miles, 1780 elevation. Felt great. Have a range extender on order.

Sold the Hightower. Put it on Craigslist, sold in 36 hours. Bikes are scarce out there.


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## mtbrdan (Jun 1, 2004)

It's amazing how little attention the regular Levo's motor issues is getting, I know half a dozen guys with them and they all have had to go through the warranty process at least once if not more. Props to Speccy for keeping it this quiet, sucks too because I would buy one tomorrow if not for this issue.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

mtbrdan said:


> It's amazing how little attention the regular Levo's motor issues is getting, I know half a dozen guys with them and they all have had to go through the warranty process at least once if not more. Props to Speccy for keeping it this quiet, sucks too because I would buy one tomorrow if not for this issue.


Yeah, that's why i didn't buy the kenevo, improved motor 
I bought a haibike, same geometry and travel with a Bosch motor, a year and no issues

Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

mix john: Thanks for the feedback. Glad you are on a bike you really like and it fits your riding style. I was somewhat i the same boat so went with the Pivot Shuttle for it shorter chainstays and wheelbase. It is around 45 lbs. It also has 27.5+ wheels and all that make it very nimble. I think that is why I really like the bike. I am mostly in Eco and we have a ton of super twisty trail and sharp steep switchbacks. If I ever sold this bike, I'd get something like the Levo SL. I have a 500 wh battery but it is good for 30-40 miles and 4,500 feet (in Eco and some Trail). The battery is just small enough to carry in a pack in those instances where I am doing a long long day on the bike in the backcountry. 

For now, I am absolutely loving the bike and can relate to your thoughts. Enjoy that Levo SL...it looks fantastic!


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Flyer said:


> mix john: Thanks for the feedback. Glad you are on a bike you really like and it fits your riding style. I was somewhat i the same boat so went with the Pivot Shuttle for it shorter chainstays and wheelbase. It is around 45 lbs. It also has 27.5+ wheels and all that make it very nimble. I think that is why I really like the bike. I am mostly in Eco and we have a ton of super twisty trail and sharp steep switchbacks. If I ever sold this bike, I'd get something like the Levo SL. I have a 500 wh battery but it is good for 30-40 miles and 4,500 feet (in Eco and some Trail). The battery is just small enough to carry in a pack in those instances where I am doing a long long day on the bike in the backcountry.
> 
> For now, I am absolutely loving the bike and can relate to your thoughts. Enjoy that Levo SL...it looks fantastic!


It's interesting. After all of the research that I went through, had convinced myself that a 504wh battery equipped e-bike was completely off the table. I guess if you _need_ to keep it in turbo mode, You'll need a bigger battery, but 504wh is plenty of power for most situations IMO.


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## dustyman (Feb 13, 2007)

Mix john,

I also have a 2018 Levo Comp which has had no motor issues. I only ride it in Eco and use trail on short steep climbs. Turbo mode is only used on the street or boring fire roads. I'm considering upgrading to the Levo SL but concerned about the motor noise. I watched a few You Tube videos and the SL has a louder high pitched noise coming from the motor during climbing. This could be just the poor audio on the You Tube video. Since you owned both what are your thoughts? I just don't want a motor that's as loud as the Shimano steps. The new Bosch motor is pretty quiet also. The Brose motor on the Levo was the quietest of the bikes I tested back in 2018.


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## jcmonty (Apr 11, 2015)

dustyman said:


> Mix john,
> 
> I also have a 2018 Levo Comp which has had no motor issues. I only ride it in Eco and use trail on short steep climbs. Turbo mode is only used on the street or boring fire roads. I'm considering upgrading to the Levo SL but concerned about the motor noise. I watched a few You Tube videos and the SL has a louder high pitched noise coming from the motor during climbing. This could be just the poor audio on the You Tube video. Since you owned both what are your thoughts? I just don't want a motor that's as loud as the Shimano steps. The new Bosch motor is pretty quiet also. The Brose motor on the Levo was the quietest of the bikes I tested back in 2018.


Non-mix Jon answering here.. ( have a 2019 Kenevo - with the Brose 1.3 motor and an SL). SL is definitely more high pitched and noticeable. My kenevo was always impressively quiet compared to other ebikes I have ridden or been around. If noise is a deal breaker for you, I would definitely go test ride an SL. For me - it's not something that bothers me. I do like the easy feature to turn off the motor, without power cycling the whole bike, for the moments you want to be stealthy


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

I think you made a good choice. I do like that SL a lot. Yeah, I don't put it in Turbo or Boost mode unless just wanted to blast through a small section of pavement. I think I got about the best bike for my style of riding and my needs, though I do not ride with other e-bikers. I think many do keep it in Trail or Boost/Turbo especially on open trails and I can see that (especially on a hot day) and that is where a 700wh battery would be handy. 80% of my riding is solo anyway.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

It is more noticeable. Not that much louder, but a higher pitched noise. 

I actually like it, I also like the sound of a swarm of murder hornets my 54 tooth ratchet makes.

I don't know/ride with any other e-bikers. I do ride with a group of friends who are a bit stronger than me, they're all on xc bikes that are 25 pounds or less. I tend to prefer longer travel trail bikes, it becomes a challenge to hang with them on the longer climbs. We tend to ride 25-30 miles, with 2500-4500 elevation. The last aforementioned ride was a lot more fun and they didn't have to wait for me.


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## AGarcia (Feb 20, 2012)

mlx john said:


> It's interesting. After all of the research that I went through, had convinced myself that a 504wh battery equipped e-bike was completely off the table. I guess if you _need_ to keep it in turbo mode, You'll need a bigger battery, but 504wh is plenty of power for most situations IMO.


Yep. Interesting. I bought the Levo Expert with the 700wh battery. But like you, I found I didn't need all that much juice, so I ended up swapping it for a 500wh battery.


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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

hi guys
Did anyone tried to make the levo turbo chainstay... shorter?
Can you drill a new rear axle holes? 2cm fwd
With 27 wheels
And rear shock with longer stroke


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

saruti said:


> hi guys
> Did anyone tried to make the levo turbo chainstay... shorter?
> Can you drill a new rear axle holes? 2cm fwd
> With 27 wheels
> And rear shock with longer stroke


Don't even consider that please. There is more to rear axle location than 2 holes.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Vin829 (Mar 29, 2019)

saruti said:


> hi guys
> Did anyone tried to make the levo turbo chainstay... shorter?
> Can you drill a new rear axle holes? 2cm fwd
> With 27 wheels
> And rear shock with longer stroke


You're joking right?


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## Radium (Jan 11, 2019)

Vin829 said:


> You're joking right?


I don't think saruti is joking. It's gonna be quite surprising to see all the "upgrades" that e-riders are gonna be making. Hopefully zero major injuries from them.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

No, please don't be insane. Just buy a Pivot Shuttle or a Santa Cruz Heckler. They have shorter chainstays and are more nimble. You're welcome.


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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

can I order an extra rear seat stays? to play with?


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

saruti said:


> can I order an extra rear seat stays? to play with?


Why are you asking us? Go to your LBS, or contact Specialized. I think you're going to be disappointed.


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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

Thsnks
I will ask th LBS


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Brake mounts, derailleur mounts, rear wheel, and shock linkage with an understanding of kinematics would all be requirements in addition to drilling the thru axle holes themselves. Of course the chain stay is likely hollow at that point, where-as it's solid where the axle is located. 
In short, this would be a project for a product designer and machinist with way too much time on their hands, not a layman. 
I would suggest purchasing the e- bike with the specifications that you desire, instead of attempting geometry modification. If they don't make it currently, they soon will.

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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

Thanks
I know it all
And take this into considoration.
When i made the first -2 headset for my sundsy in 2005... all said its not needed... 
When i shorten my DHR with offset headset few years ago.. again...
When i ssid to everyone that plus tires are not good for enduro e bikes...
Well.
I hope that again, it will make a change.
I think that if you kbow what you want. Snd understand all the issues, it can only do good for the future


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

If you have that much MTB experience than surely you know that a call to Spesh to price the parts is in order, not asking a bunch of forum enthusiast. 

I've not ridden a long chain stay bike personally. However I did spend 1 day on my bike set up as a Mullet, and hated it. My geo mods consisted of just dropping the fork, so maybe I'd feel differently on a mullet with fully corrected geo. But at my height 5'11" I am certain it's not a path worth pursuing for my application. 

Good luck. 

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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

Yes. Your right
But i always interested in other opinions.
It will be 27 rear and front
Not mullet


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

saruti said:


> Thanks
> I know it all
> And take this into considoration.
> When i made the first -2 headset for my sundsy in 2005... all said its not needed...
> ...


Wow Turner DHR?! I wonder what DT thinks about ebikes? It would be interesting to get his take on all of this.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Did another big ride on the Levo SL this weekend. Went with two friends, one on a Spec Epic hardtail, the other on a Santa Cruz Blur. Super fast guys, they would usually have to wait for me at certain points on rides.

They really pinned it this time, partly, I think, because I was on the SL. There's no way I would have been able to hang with their pace on a normal bike.

Rode mostly in eco, towards the end of the ride I was using more trail and occasionally turbo. All of these modes were dialed down using the Mission Control app. The stock power settings are 35/35 60/60 100/100 
Here's a screenshot of the power setting I've been using:








Here are a couple of screenshots of the ride on Strava:















I was able to stay with them the whole ride, I was pretty tired at the end, but relatively fresh. I usually feel like I've been hit by an 18-wheeler at the end of these long rides.

Needless to say, I did drop them on the descents, and even though the Blur has a 120mm Sid w/35mm stanchions, and those guys are evenly matched with me on descent handling skills, no match for a 150/150 trail bike. The SL was a joy on the descents.

22% battery left, no range extender.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Awesome info and awesome bike. 

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## scottie mac (Nov 3, 2011)

mlx john said:


> Did another big ride on the Levo SL this weekend. Went with two friends, one on a Spec Epic hardtail, the other on a Santa Cruz Blur. Super fast guys, they would usually have to wait for me at certain points on rides.
> 
> They really pinned it this time, partly, I think, because I was on the SL. There's no way I would have been able to hang with their pace on a normal bike.
> 
> ...


I've done a few 30 plus milers on my SL and I was pleasantly surprised with how efficient that motor/battery combo is. My biggest concern when I sold my 19 Expert Levo and went to the SL was range because my two main riding buddies are still on 19 experts. I'm in fairly good shape and have yet to kill the battery even chasing them. Like you, I stick to eco and trail, almost exactly what your settings are. The SL will never be mistaken for the big girl Levo in terms of torque, but in fun factor, for me at least, it isn't even close. The SL reminds me of my stumpjumper, but keeps these 50 year tore up knees in the game.

As someone who has owned both, you can't really make a mistake with either Levo, you just have to figure out one is best for your intended purpose. For me, it was lighter weight, normal MTB feeling and shorter chainstays.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

My truly local (as in private neighborhood trails) get me around 3,500 ft of climbing in 17-20 miles. We have 45 miles so the climbing is intense and I am a lot older than when I joined MTBR 20 years ago. So given that and my baby and the new job, I has started to avoid my local trails due to the steepness. With the Pivot, I am now able to ride them all. I think I have become a bit too enthusiastic so I can really feel it in my knees. I'll back on and build up a base, but I have started to really really enjoy mountain biking again, instead of watching my HR climb over 185 on every steep climb. I think bikes like the SL are fantastic and serve a subset of bikers who still want a nimble lighter bike. 

Of course, some trails are not open to e-bikes but things are shifting for sure...more and ore are opening up every season.


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## scottie mac (Nov 3, 2011)

Flyer said:


> My truly local (as in private neighborhood trails) get me around 3,500 ft of climbing in 17-20 miles. We have 45 miles so the climbing is intense and I am a lot older than when I joined MTBR 20 years ago. So given that and my baby and the new job, I has started to avoid my local trails due to the steepness. With the Pivot, I am now able to ride them all. I think I have become a bit too enthusiastic so I can really feel it in my knees. I'll back on and build up a base, but I have started to really really enjoy mountain biking again, instead of watching my HR climb over 185 on every steep climb. I think bikes like the SL are fantastic and serve a subset of bikers who still want a nimble lighter bike.
> 
> Of course, some trails are not open to e-bikes but things are shifting for sure...more and ore are opening up every season.


Couldn't agree more, buddy. Ride what puts a smile on your face, that's really all that matters. I love my SL and I loved my Camber Evo, I loved my Stumpy ST and I am sure I will love my Epic Evo when it gets here. Different tools for different applications, but when push comes to shove, did you have fun? If the answer is yes, then that's all that matters.

SM


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

Yeah, it has been a rough three years and I have been off the bike mostly. I may have fallen off the wagon completely, if it were not for this. Cycling is my thing too, so it saved me in a way. It has raised my fitness level again and I'm getting on my Yeti this weekend. It really saved my mind.


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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

Anyone know a shop in SoCal that has Specialized emtb's for demos?


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## g_dejesus (Dec 17, 2007)

I just rented an SL from Incycles.

https://www.incycle.com/articles/bike-rentals-pg202.htm


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## Julie (Jul 26, 2005)

What did you think ???


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## g_dejesus (Dec 17, 2007)

I liked it more than I expected because the SL handles more like my acoustic bike than my Turbo Levo. I was worried the SL wouldn't have the power for steep climbs and range for longer rides compared to the Turbo Levo (500Wh), but that wasn't the case.


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

g_dejesus said:


> I liked it more than I expected because the SL handles more like my acoustic bike than my Turbo Levo. I was worried the SL wouldn't have the power for steep climbs and range for longer rides compared to the Turbo Levo (500Wh), but that wasn't the case.


How would you compare motor noise/sound compared to Turbo Levo?


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## g_dejesus (Dec 17, 2007)

Jack7782 said:


> How would you compare motor noise/sound compared to Turbo Levo?


The SL sound is definitely more noticeable. It's a higher pitched gear whine. The Turbo Levo, you can barely hear it unless you're really on the power. Nice thing with the SL is when you want to be discreet, you can just turn off the motor and it still pedals like a trail bike.

I uploaded a short video comparing the sounds of the 2 bikes.


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## fos'l (May 27, 2009)

Definitely what I've been waiting for if/when the price goes down. I could afford one now, but my penurious nature kicks in.


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## saruti (Aug 9, 2008)

guys,
the SL is a lot harder to pedal up than the Levo. a lot harder.
its a real blast when going downhill. it jumps from anything. but the Levo is really great downhill too. a littel too planted to my taste, but thats what you get with heavy and longer CS...
the battery doesnt hold even half like the Levo. or any other bike we rode together.
and if your friend have regular (strong) E-Bikes... you will eat **** riding with them.
another thing we noticed is that, the battery shows 2 lines at the end... and you think, OK I can pedal to my car now... but it taked the power down to nothing. and you want to kill everyone around 
if you demo a bike. do it with someone who have a regular Levo or any other e- bike


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

There is definitely a fundamental difference in the type of e-bikes people prefer. Maybe it's terrain dependent?

Where I live (Central TX) , there are only a handful of places where we just climb for 10+ minutes solid on a bike then just go down on a clear path. Most of the bike riding is rolling. Much of it you would not get any cardio workout at all on an e-bike unless you were literally going MX bike speeds which isn't safe as these are mixed use trails. Not to mention that I quit MXing in exchange for MTBing specifically because the higher speeds of MXing leads to much more severe injuries. When I'm riding well I can already pedal absolutely as fast as my skill set can manage on these trails on all but the steepest extended up bits.

I'm interested in e-bikes (if they make them legal in TX as currently they are not) not to effortlessly pedal everywhere, but to simply take the sting off the really extended steep chunky bits, particularly during the brutally hot Summer months. But I still want it to feel like riding a bike. I want it to be hard both up & down.

Certainly I'd feel differently if I lived somewhere where a rider has a mostly uneventful uphill climb for an extended period of time, followed by a great true DH type run. But I still could not utilize the e-bike on the XC trails as it would just be way to fast to be safe for flatter terrain.


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## g_dejesus (Dec 17, 2007)

If nimble and playful handling on the downs is more important than blasting up the hills, then the SL would be the better bike for you. It will take the edge off the climbs, but it's not like you can shuttle up the hills like on the Turbo Levo. If you ride with strong climbers on acoustic bikes, but you enjoy the downs more, the SL would be a great equalizer.

If you ride with other ebikers, like charging up hills as fast as you can, and don't mind how the extra weight changes the handling of the bike, then the Turbo Levo might be a better choice. 

It really depends on what you're looking for in an ebike, who you ride with, and the type of trails you typically ride. For me, I was never using the full power the Turbo Levo was capable of putting out. I dialed back all the power settings, Eco, Trail, and Turbo. So I'd gladly take the lesser power for the better handling of the SL.


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## Vin829 (Mar 29, 2019)

I went with the SL. I don’t need to be blasting up the hills I just need a little more help especially doing all day rides at Henry Coe. 95% of my ebike rides are at Henry Coe. For me the SL fits perfect. The only time I wish I had more power is when I ride with my full Levo buddies. They end up waiting for me on the climbs. Other than that I don’t want to lug around a 50+ lbs bike on 50 mile 10k rides out there


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

g_dejesus said:


> If nimble and playful handling on the downs is more important than blasting up the hills, then the SL would be the better bike for you.
> 
> If you ride with strong climbers on acoustic bikes, but you enjoy the downs more, the SL would be a great equalizer.


It really does handle much like a regular long travel 29er trail bike on the descents. I do ride with stronger climbers than myself, rarely do we climb less than 3000 feet sometimes up to 4500 and I'm able to hang with them riding in a dialed down eco and trail mode, just giving me enough assist. They are on XC bikes, so I am able to drop them on the descents.
Definitely still working hard-avg HR in the upper 140's maxing at around 185/190. Have been using the assist conservatively to preserve battery life.



Vin829 said:


> I don't want to lug around a 50+ lbs bike on 50 mile 10k rides out there


I'm impressed with the range, 36 miles, 3500 feet on the last big ride (22% battery left). Had a Levo comp for a few weeks before the SL, and I do not miss that 52 pounds or the 700wh battery. SL is currently at 38.93 pounds.

Just got a range extender, going to drop the motor, remove the main battery in the near future just for kicks. Interested in the weight/handling difference just using the extender for solo rides in the Sandia foothills just outside my front door. Have been doing 15-17 mile rides with only the main battery with 50%+ battery life left over. The extender should handle that no problem.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

Originally I was thinking about 625 watt/70nm type of bike because I want to use this as an exploring bike in the mountains, which would include gravel, single track, double track, and Jeep trails (think Engineer Pass). I’m lighter and in decent shape but not to the extent I can do 50 miles of 8k total elevations.
What do you think about the SL with a light set of wheels/tires for doing longer gravel rides, like 60-100 miles? Would definitely need to always be in a dialed down ECO mode and a spare battery, but is it possible?


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## whackum (Oct 21, 2005)

mtbbiker said:


> As others have alluded to, if you ride by yourself or other MTBs the SL is the perfect ebike. But if you are going to ride with other normal powered ebikes, you'll be slower on the climbs or using to much power trying to keep up. I still haven't had a chance to try out an SL, long forward to swing a leg over one.
> Good luck with possible ebike purchase!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


My experience as well mtbbiker. Had a 2020 Levo Comp aluminum which I had a ton of fun on. Decided to give the Carbon Comp SL a go. Great with a mix of acoustic/ebikes but when hooking up with my ebike buddies a different story. Back with a 2020 Levo Expert and loving it.


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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

g_dejesus said:


> I just rented an SL from Incycles.
> 
> https://www.incycle.com/articles/bike-rentals-pg202.htm


Awesome! Thanks for this. Which location did you rent from?


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## g_dejesus (Dec 17, 2007)

eman555 said:


> Awesome! Thanks for this. Which location did you rent from?


San Dimas. But they will ship from the main warehouse in San Dimas to the other locations.


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## CD1 (Jul 8, 2011)

I am similar to others in this thread. I have the 2020 Levo Comp and a 2020 Levo SL Comp. I think the SL is my favorite bike ever. I prefer that bike, but when I ride with a group of people on other ebikes I ride the Levo so we can all go a similar speed.


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## MatJStubbs (Jul 11, 2020)

Has anybody put Lyric or Fox 36 on their Turbo SL. Will the bike manage enduros with rock gardens and hard drip offs? Thanks


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## jcmonty (Apr 11, 2015)

MatJStubbs said:


> Has anybody put Lyric or Fox 36 on their Turbo SL. Will the bike manage enduros with rock gardens and hard drip offs? Thanks


 I have a Manitou Mezzer - which is meant to compete with those forks (more the Zeb an 38 actually), but short answer is "absolutely".

For me - the bike is setting DH PR's that I had previously set on my old Evil Insurgent or my 180mm Kenevo. Fork is a big difference, but also brakes (went to MT7 vs. guide Rs) and slackening out the bike slightly with an offset bushing (preference thing IMO). These are sustained steeps, loose, rocky, drops, jumps, etc.

Further DH performance is expected with an incoming Ext STORIA V3 + Cascade components progressive linkage.


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## motoadve (Nov 14, 2004)

springs said:


> Don't delude yourself, your fitness will not go up from riding an ebike unless you are hugely unfit (which you aren't given you did 3000 ft of climbing on the HT). I ride my Levo 80% of the time and the biggest thing I notice when I get back on my normal bike is how reluctant it feels to pedal lol takes a few klms to get my legs back up to speed!


To get in better shape riding an E bike you need to do long ride and push it.

I ride 5 times a week, 4 with my regular non E bike, once a week with the Ebike(Levo) .
When I ride the Ebike I do 25 to 30 mile loops with more than 6,000ft vert, all single track ,lots of techy stuff, most of it on Eco mode dialed down to 25% assist, some steep sections on trail mode, usually finish with 30% battery or so.

Lately I am putting 2 of those rides a week and 3 rides with non E bike.

Those E bike rides are getting me in better shape, stronger legs than ever.

If I ride the E bike for less than 20 miles , I feel I have not done much exercise.

Will get an SL, to replace my non E bike, will be more fun for sure, and keep my Levo.


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