# Over 50 forum - what is your ebike ratio



## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?

How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?

What's your next bike?

What do you like about emtb?

How old are you and what are your injuries/limitations?

Photo?

fc


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## BillyBicycle (Jul 4, 2016)

Currently 0 out of 12. I Had ~ 8 ebikes during 2 year period 2018 ~ 2020. I owned about 5 at once. sold them all. During that period, I'd say 5 out of 21 bikes were electrified. Next bikes (wife and I) are plus size FS bike I can put studded 3" tires on (analog) aka trek farley ex to compliment the rigid fat bikes. 55yo, riding good bikes for about 40 years since I was 14~15yo. Possibly a top shelf emtb in about 5 years to commute to/from trails.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

None for me in the foreseeable future.

For me, it's still about doing the work under my own power and ability.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

51. Never ride an e-bike. Don't plan to any time soon.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

58. Zero eBikes, zero desire to own one. As a recreational cyclist I don't see the point. If you're going to ride a bicycle for fun, ride a bicycle.

Saw a couple of pasty, out-of-shape-looking guys on some eBikes at one of our local trails the other day. Probably younger than me. I hope I never get like that.

My limitations are that I'm old and still 30 pounds heavier than I'd like to be. Big push started this month to lose the weight.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

52yo..no emtb.
Open to it..

Sent from my KB2007 using Tapatalk


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

If my body is too beat down to power the bike, it will be too beat down to ride the way I like to ride. DH is arguably as taxing as climbing. I've done lift days where I'm as trashed as trail days. Easier climbing so I can ride easier terrain that doesn't tax me on the DH sounds horrible to me. I would rather take up knitting.

I'm closer to 50 than 45. I've had a number of injuries. I'm not saying this as a young fit uninjured rider that thinks they'll never deal with a beat up body and reduced energy. My body def feels the decades of use.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

54, riding MTB 30 years.

No e-bike, a whole bunch of MTB, DJ, BMX and other bikes.

Limited by fatness, laziness and lack of skill.

Would ride an e-bike if Santa Claus brought me one of these.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

No ebikes until I have no other option.

My wife rides a Shuttle so she can keep up with me.

Too much weight, too much complexity, more expensive, and for me it's not necessary.

If I wanted power I'd get a moto.

Like so many things, people are always looking for an easier way to do things, but biking was never meant to be easy, it's a challenging sport and that's the point.

In terms of around town, hauling kids and groceries, sure, who cares, but since we have gears, it's still not necessary.

I'd prefer to work on fitness than take the easy way out.

57 this year, too many injuries to list but they include broken spine/neck, ribs, wrist, fingers/thumb, ankle, feet, jaw, and hundreds of stitches.

I ride three to four times a week, mostly climbing so I can descend.

You did ask ...


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## teleken (Jul 22, 2005)

Turned 59 today lifetime of cycling & MTB since 1985. No eBike & no plans to get one. Luckily I still have the ability to pull off 20+ mile XC rides in Colorado but warm up & recovery takes longer.
Cycling is a purity thing for me & an eBike takes something away from that.


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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

0 out of 4.

Next bike is probably a non-motorized plus HT or an electric cargo/commuting bike.

I like nothing about eMTBs, unless they are getting a truly disabled person out on the trail (lazy or out of shape is not a disability - I often suffer from both and I just suck it up).

My limitations are degenerated discs in lower back and lack of bike funds for more bikes.


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## rdawson808 (Oct 19, 2015)

50 with 0 of 3 ebikes. But I'm thinking really hard about a commuter. I have been very lazy the last couple of years so I've put on weight and my knees are hurting me more lately. As much as I'd prefer to work at home most of the time, riding to work gets me exercise. So an ebike could help me get back into it and keep me cleaner in the mornings going in.

A colleague has offered to let me borrow one of his emtb's and we're going to go riding soon. Looking forward to seeing what it's like.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Thank you for the responses so far! Cool insights.

I'm fc and I started Mtbr 27 years ago! I'm 57 years old now. Damn!

I've been ebiking about 10 years since companies have started sending them to me about a decade ago to try. They were awful back then but now, they are getting to the same level as their mtb counterparts.

I live in San Jose, Santa Cruz area where everything is straight up and down and ebikes are more accepted here now. I find it to be a somewhat regional subject. I used to ride ebike 5% of the time. But now, ebike 90% of the time.

Instead of riding 3 days a week and driving to the good trails, I ride now about 5-6 days a week and ride from home. I get to ride with my wife and son too and take them to the big mountains around here. I can ride on the bad days too and they're becoming more frequent with this aging body. 

Good news is I'm fitter now compared to 10 years ago as I'm breaking my hillclimb records in the past decade using a new Santa Cruz Blur. My descending is wayyyy better and I ride with protective gear now. I get a better workout on E and a more frequent one too since I can ride and get motivated on more days. One just has to be disciplined about it and monitor heart rate and rider power output. For pure power and pain threshold though (such as racing and hillclimb records), I think one really has to train on regular mtb and learn to work through the failure point.

My favorite bikes at the moment.









SC Blur












Scor 4060 LT on the left and Scor 4060 Z LT emtb on the right. It seems like more companies are going to start to create an 'E' version of their bike models


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## Hit Factor (Apr 7, 2021)

No

N/A

No plans for a next bike.

Have not thought about it.

61, none to speak of.


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

It's sad to me that the founder of MTBR is more into hybrid motorbikes than mountain biking. Man how times have changed.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

68 years old.

Probably owned 30-35 mountain bikes during the 37 years I’ve been mountain biking; as many as 10 at any one time, now down to 3.

Plus 1 road bike.

And now 1 ebike as well.

Not lazy, not overweight, not decrepit. Have broken several bones during my life and bulged a disc (L5/S1) caused by too high saddle (while mountain biking.) But not complaining about my health or justifying the ebike — I ride it because it’s fun to ride, not because I’m lazy or broken.

Those who think there’s only one way to have fun (or worse yet, a ‘right way’ and a ‘wrong way’) confuse me. Dislike self-righteous pricks regardless what they ride or don’t ride.

One thing I love about cycling is it keeps me fit doing something I have passion for. While I don’t have passion about keeping fit per sé, being fit is a wonderful benefit of pursuing my passion. Which is cycling.

Including tangential two wheeling. But I don’t plan to get another (different) ebike until they’re much improved, including integrated motors & transmissions, higher capacity & lighter batteries, lighter overall weight without power sacrifice. 
=sParty


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Sparticus said:


> 68 years old.
> 
> Probably owned 30-35 mountain bikes during the 37 years I’ve been mountain biking; as many as 10 at any one time, now down to 3.
> 
> ...


sParty!!!!! You're one of the OG my friend! How many years have you been on the site now? 68 years old and 37 years riding. OMG!!!! I always noticed your rad bikes over the years. So well thought-out. You still in Oregon? Still working or just playing now?


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

I'm just entering my 5th decade. Mountain biking 38 years. Zero across the board in terms of personal eBike ownership. Would consider one if had a very long commute or some utility for errands; a one less car mindset.

My next bike will be a Spur or a REEB.

A bit of commentary, I'm sort of resistant to the notion that eBikes become an eventuality with aging. Ride one if you have the inclination and legal access but not all paths lead there. And, in my opinion, regular mountain bikes are the superior experience and always will be. But that's my personal mindset on the rewards of cycling; no one else is obligated to subscribe.

Edit: I have too many injuries to list; I've run out of talent far too often.


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

Carl Mega said:


> I'm just entering my 5th decade. Mountain biking 38 years. Zero across the board in terms of personal eBike ownership. Would consider one if had a very long commute or some utility for errands; a one less car mindset.
> 
> My next bike will be a Spur or a REEB.
> 
> A bit of commentary, I'm sort of resistant to the notion that eBikes become an eventuality with aging. Ride one if you have the inclination and legal access but not all paths lead there. And, in my opinion, regular mountain bikes are the superior experience and always will be. But that's my personal mindset on the rewards of cycling; no one else is obligated to subscribe.


It's the marketing we've been fed that makes us equate e bikes with getting old, weak, or handicapped. In the end it's a different sport that some will prefer. Some will like both MTB and whatever sport E mtb is. Myself I only like MTB. I don't like the weird pulse of power with every stroke. It detracts from things I like to do like slow speed pedal kick drops, tech climbing, and sprinting to dial in just the right amount of speed. Sure you can do all these things on an E bike, it's just a different riding experience. One I don't like as much. I won't go into moving the bike in the air, or doing nose pivots. Those things make e bikes feel like an MTB with a few bricks duct taped to the down tube. It's just not a riding experience I enjoy. I would say each to their own but unfortunately when riders choose to ride hybrid motorbikes instead of mountain bikes it brings heat on multi use trails. Yes I know the sky hasn't fallen, but I've spoken to plenty of non bike trail users that have talked about increased traffic, "and now mountain bikes even have motors." I just wish we would completely segregate E bikes from mountain biking instead of the industry pushing for equal access. Equal access will likely mean segregated bike trials all together.


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

I'm 55 and have been mountain biking for 38 years. 0 of my 12 current bikes are eBikes, and I have never owned one. I have demoed them, but don't see the need to own one. They don't mesh with the reasons I ride. (I might consider an e-townie for local errands.)

I ride to and from the trails most of the time. Most of my rides consist of one or more long climbs followed by one or more long descents. I don't do any shuttles or point to point rides, so a typical ride will average 200-300' of climbing per mile, with the same amount of descending.

Other than some bumps and bruises from working construction for a few years and some nerve damage in one foot from a season in an ill-fitting ski boot, I don't have have any disabilities or limitations. I am about ten pounds heavier than when I graduated high school in the 80s, but during the height of riding season I am at or below my high school graduation weight.

I don't know what my next bike will be because I am pretty pleased with what I have. I'll likely get rid of a few bikes before considering a new purchase. I could probably get down to just my klunker, my ti soft tail, and my steel hard tail and be plenty happy.

Photo per request


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## cunningstunts (Sep 1, 2011)

yes, new eeb as of November. 54, fit, but the time and effort to get to the top of our trail system has become brutal in the last few years. can't keep up with younger, smaller guys in riding group anymore (6 5, 220). old knee injury slowly grinds my knee to **** after about an hour of spinning and it takes nearly 2 to get to the top now. 

it's a game changer on every level. amazing up, amazing down. took a while to adapt to, like any new bike, but it's incredibly capable in either direction. still a great work out, without having a jammer or turning purple on the ups. i spend more time than ever on descents, and i'll be able to ride more when the temps rise. last summer here shut down riding for most people as all records were shattered and heatstroke was a real threat. 

still love my amish bike, and always will, but it won't see nearly as much use as the eeb is just so fun and unlocks so much more descending. 

yes, i am morally and ethically weak and corrupt. head hung in shame. 😆


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Crankout said:


> None for me in the foreseeable future.
> 
> For me, it's still about doing the work under my own power and ability.




That describes me too. Producing 100% of the power all by myself is an integral part of cycling for me and at this point I couldn't imagine getting an ebike, mainly because cycling already takes up all my free time and there's no room for any other hobbies

Hopefully I can still turn the pedals on my own until I pass but until then I'll just play it day by day. If things change anything I'll try to adapt.


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## Juansan (Dec 30, 2020)

No ebike. I'm 71, when and if I get too broke down to ride my MTB I will get a motorcycle.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

slimat99 said:


> It's the marketing we've been fed that makes us equate e bikes with getting old, weak, or handicapped. In the end it's a different sport that some will prefer. Some will like both MTB and whatever sport E mtb is. Myself I only like MTB. I don't like the weird pulse of power with every stroke. It detracts from things I like to do like slow speed pedal kick drops, tech climbing, and sprinting to dial in just the right amount of speed. Sure you can do all these things on an E bike, it's just a different riding experience. One I don't like as much. I won't go into moving the bike in the air, or doing nose pivots. Those things make e bikes feel like an MTB with a few bricks duct taped to the down tube. It's just not a riding experience I enjoy. I would say each to their own but unfortunately when riders choose to ride hybrid motorbikes instead of mountain bikes it brings heat on multi use trails. Yes I know the sky hasn't fallen, but I've spoken to plenty of non bike trail users that have talked about increased traffic, "and now mountain bikes even have motors." I just wish we would completely segregate E bikes from mountain biking instead of the industry pushing for equal access. Equal access will likely mean segregated bike trials all together.


No, it's not marketing, it's the culture of exercise and fitness that makes folks push back against any physical aid that they perceive as unnecessary.

You can call it weakness or whatever, but I've seen far more folks embrace ebikes who are capable of being fit enough to ride with out assist.

Whatever floats a person's boat, personally I can't give a shite what other folks ride, I'm too busy riding what I ride.

I ride with folks who absolutely destroy me, them on a single speed and me with gears, and I ride with folks who struggle to pace me with gears and are decades younger.

Folks need to stop judging others based on what they think and feel, it'll never amount to a hill of beans, you can only account for yourself.


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## k2rider1964 (Apr 29, 2010)

57 and been riding since 1988. I have (3) mountain bikes and none of them are motorized. I have demo'd one and it was fun but I'm also not afraid to admit it was fun because it took away 95% of the work involved. For me personally, I like the sense of accomplishment when I get to the top of a long climb. I would lose that if I switched over to an ebike. 

I fractured my neck in 2014 while MTB'ing, went into AFIB while on a high elevation MTB ride in 2020 and have a plate & (7) screws in my femur from a 2009 dirt bike crash that also tore my ACL, MCL, LCL and both meniscus'. Maybe I should get a motorized bike after all.


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## akacappy (Sep 3, 2013)

57.7 
have sold all my “acoustic“ bikes and am on EBike #2.
never looked back. Ride more, Ride further and ride with more smiles.
think I’m in better shape now due to more/longer rides. Been riding MTB since 85.


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

I love the ebike stereotype that only old people, injured, or slow females should ride them. Thanks for reinforcing this with this thread. 

Based on these assumptions, sounds like i should have a whole fleet of them since i fit all three. 

For me, it’s more overhead of something to pay attention to (a pedal assist). I’m just now learning to deal with recharging my derailleur


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

slimat99 said:


> It's sad to me that the founder of MTBR is more into hybrid motorbikes than mountain biking. Man how times have changed.


It’s who pays his bills. Kinda a letdown.

I’m still on the fence about 29 inch wheels, so I’m not in a rush to figure out motors either. 

They still are young in the market, and they still have a long way to go, and I’m still waiting to see them go down in costs, and make sure right-to-repair happens. 

Even if they do, i still like my bikes. Don’t need a motor.


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## 2sharp7 (Aug 29, 2013)

Ebike ratio = ZERO
Nothing against ebikes but I don't want one or need one.


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Haven't posted here forever. Soon to be 55 but like to ride like I'm 20. Been riding MTBs since there were MTBs. BMX before that back in the 70's. Just picked up an enduro e-bike. Likely it will become my primary ride. I enjoy trails with lots of descents with big features. The climbs are just a means to an end for me. It's all about the trip back down. Always has been. If I can do more laps with more features, then that equals more fun and fun is what it's all about for me. The e-bikes are what I've always envisioned MTBing could become. Will likely still ride an analog for bike park trips, but I'm open on that depending on how well I progress on the e-bike.

As far as cardio and fitness, I'm in great shape for my age and work out daily. I usually ride until exhaustion on the e-bike just like I did on the regular bike. I simply get to do more of it. Most of those folks that I run across that are anti-ebike are simply mileage riders or people that haven't really experienced what e-bikes are capable of. I have no problems with any differing opinions. I'm having more fun on a bike now than I've ever had. Just as everyone else that has made the switch says: it a 'game-changer'.
I can't imagine how anyone could view my increased enjoyment as a bad thing but if you do, so be it. Happy trails.


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

Xlr8n said:


> Haven't posted here forever. Soon to be 55 but like to ride like I'm 20. Been riding MTBs since there was MTBs. BMX before that back in the 70's. Just picked up an enduro e-bike. Likely it will become my primary ride. I enjoy trails with lots of descents with big features. The climbs are just a means to an end for me. It's all about the trip back down. Always has been If I can do more laps with more features, then that equals more fun and fun is what it's all about for me. The e-bikes are what I've always envisioned MTBing could be. Will likely still ride an analog for bike park trips, but I'm open on that depending on how well I progress on the e-bike.
> 
> As far as cardio and fitness, I'm in great shape for my age and work out daily. I usually ride until exhaustion on the e-bike just like I did on the regular bike. I simply get to do more of it. Most of those folks that run across that are anti-ebike are simply mileage riders or people that haven't really experienced what e-bikes are capable of. I have no problems with any differing opinions. I'm having more fun on a bike now than I've ever had. I can't imagine how anyone could view my enjoyment as a bad thing but if you do, so be it. Happy trails.


I’m all for ebikes even emtb, and I’m glad it lets you enjoy riding 

What I’m not for is the stereotyping on this thread of needing to be old, injured, or a slow female to ride one.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

2sharp7 said:


> Ebike ratio = ZERO
> Nothing against ebikes but I don't want one or need one.


Right on, great input. It's not for everyone but tolerance, not hate towards others is a key trait I think. Trying it at some point is not a bad idea either.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

Francis Cebedo said:


> sParty!!!!! You're one of the OG my friend! How many years have you been on the site now? 68 years old and 37 years riding. OMG!!!! I always noticed your rad bikes over the years. So well thought-out. You still in Oregon? Still working or just playing now?


Yo FC! Thanks for calling me out, my friend. 
Not sure exactly when I first encountered MTBR but shiggy told me about MTBR when I got my very first computer (1998) and bingo — I found my first (and only) social media addiction. Thanks for founding this awesome mountain biking site!
I miss those long ago days when shiggy, Justin and I would travel down your way for things like Sea Otter and you and your crew would occasionally come up here to Oregon to visit our gang. @Ogre moved up here from Cali several years ago and he’s been a strong addition to our local riding a trailbuilding group.
If you feel like hanging out for a mellow mountain biker campout next month, c’mon up for the Disciples Of Dirt’s Spring Barbie Camp event in central Oregon. Something like the 28th Annual! It’d be terrific to see you again. Ebikes welcome. 
=sParty


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

akacappy said:


> 57.7
> have sold all my “acoustic“ bikes and am on EBike #2.
> never looked back. Ride more, Ride further and ride with more smiles.
> think I’m in better shape now due to more/longer rides. Been riding MTB since 85.


Love it. 57.7. It is so crazy how age creeps up on us. What was ebike #1 and what is #2. Any good.

"in better shape now due to more/longer rides"

I think this is what's really shocking to most lookers. Most of my neighbors laugh it me (jokingly) and get zero workout as I ride out of the house 4 30 mile adventures every other day. And none of them bike or get out except walk the dog.

fc


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


Yes, occasionally. Have had three eMTBs over the past few years - KTM Kapoho, Pivot Shuttle, and now and Orbea Rise LTD.

I hardly ever ride my eMTB anymore. Roughly spending 50/50 on the gravel bike and regular MTB, some indoor bike stuff. Averaging about once every three months lately, and I ride 5 days a week, so I guess that works out to 1-2% of my miles or rides.

I suspect my next bike will be either a new Hightower or something similar.

Turning 60 in a few weeks, have a metal hip (resurfaced), two shoulders with partially torn rotator cuffs (from dirt biking), a sketchy AC joint, and lots of creaks and aches.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Sparticus said:


> Yo FC! Thanks for calling me out, my friend.
> Not sure exactly when I first encountered MTBR but shiggy told me about MTBR when I got my very first computer (1998) and bingo — I found my first (and only) social media addiction. Thanks for founding this awesome mountain biking site!
> I miss those long ago days when shiggy, Justin and I would travel down your way for things like Sea Otter and you and your crew would occasionally come up here to Oregon to visit our gang. @Ogre moved up here from Cali several years ago and he’s been a strong addition to our local riding a trailbuilding group.
> If you feel like hanging out for a mellow mountain biker campout next month, c’mon up for the Disciples Of Dirt’s Spring Barbie Camp event in central Oregon. Something like the 28th Annual! It’d be terrific to see you again. Ebikes welcome.
> =sParty



Right on man. I think Andy made it to Barbie Camp one year and he was changed forever. 

I did spend a bunch of time in Oakridge and Bend, OR and met a bunch of DOD dudes. Solid people who live and breathe mountain biking.

Good to hear from you oldddddd pal.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Juansan said:


> No ebike. I'm 71, when and if I get too broke down to ride my MTB I will get a motorcycle.


Pro tip: you will destroy yourself way more on a motorcycle ;-)


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Xlr8n said:


> Haven't posted here forever. Soon to be 55 but like to ride like I'm 20. Been riding MTBs since there were MTBs. BMX before that back in the 70's. Just picked up an enduro e-bike. Likely it will become my primary ride. I enjoy trails with lots of descents with big features. The climbs are just a means to an end for me. It's all about the trip back down. Always has been. If I can do more laps with more features, then that equals more fun and fun is what it's all about for me. The e-bikes are what I've always envisioned MTBing could become. Will likely still ride an analog for bike park trips, but I'm open on that depending on how well I progress on the e-bike.
> 
> As far as cardio and fitness, I'm in great shape for my age and work out daily. I usually ride until exhaustion on the e-bike just like I did on the regular bike. I simply get to do more of it. Most of those folks that I run across that are anti-ebike are simply mileage riders or people that haven't really experienced what e-bikes are capable of. I have no problems with any differing opinions. I'm having more fun on a bike now than I've ever had. Just as everyone else that has made the switch says: it a 'game-changer'.
> I can't imagine how anyone could view my increased enjoyment as a bad thing but if you do, so be it. Happy trails.



Thanks XLr8n! Love the handle and has a new meaning now too. What did you get?

Love your words about it. There is so much to discover with this E thing. I do love it when folks say they are more fit. The basic premise is one more riding, more adventures, more experiences. more options.

It's not for everyone and I'll always respect that. There has been significant amounts of hate though and I can attest to that since I've been testing/playing with emtbs for the last 10 years. The transition towards tolerance and participation though has been significant here in Santa Cruz and South Bay area.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

RickBullottaPA said:


> Pro tip: you will destroy yourself way more on a motorcycle ;-)


 I know this much is true


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

cunningstunts said:


> yes, new eeb as of November. 54, fit, but the time and effort to get to the top of our trail system has become brutal in the last few years. can't keep up with younger, smaller guys in riding group anymore (6 5, 220). old knee injury slowly grinds my knee to **** after about an hour of spinning and it takes nearly 2 to get to the top now.
> 
> it's a game changer on every level. amazing up, amazing down. took a while to adapt to, like any new bike, but it's incredibly capable in either direction. still a great work out, without having a jammer or turning purple on the ups. i spend more time than ever on descents, and i'll be able to ride more when the temps rise. last summer here shut down riding for most people as all records were shattered and heatstroke was a real threat.
> 
> ...


You're touching on some cool points. What bike did you get? I think you'll discover sooooo much more.

I mentioned that my fitness is better now. And that's true, just holding back father time and to my hillclimb records by seconds. 

But the real benefit, aside from adventure is descending quality and ability. I can venture out to great downhills (no matter what the ROI) and smile, learn and session. Always knee pads, sometimes full-face even when there are 4000 feet of climbing. AND... I can run my Minions and ASSEGAI!!!. Man, that tire is soooo slow but so good. I can pursue the equipment that will help me descend and corner better and protect me from the inevitable ouchie. Instead of always compromising for climbing optimization. I have my 22 lb blur for that itch.

fc


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Juansan said:


> No ebike. I'm 71, when and if I get too broke down to ride my MTB I will get a motorcycle.



I'm pretty sure a motorcycle will kill me within months. And when I stop riding bikes, I'm convinced my lifespan will shorten by 10 years. Hey man... I've seen people my age and it don't look good.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

I hope and expect to never buy one of the damned things.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

slimat99 said:


> If my body is too beat down to power the bike, it will be too beat down to ride the way I like to ride. DH is arguably as taxing as climbing. I've done lift days where I'm as trashed as trail days. Easier climbing so I can ride easier terrain that doesn't tax me on the DH sounds horrible to me. I would rather take up knitting.
> 
> I'm closer to 50 than 45. I've had a number of injuries. I'm not saying this as a young fit uninjured rider that thinks they'll never deal with a beat up body and reduced energy. My body def feels the decades of use.



I love the big downhills too. And I'm a much better descender now than 10 years ago. The emtb helps you climb 4000 feet but it's not gonna help you descend. It's harder in fact as it's a 50 lb bike and it requires more upper body strength.

Some ideal trails are shuttle trails or ski lift trails. I used to shuttle a bunch but now zero. I just pedal up with assist. Northstar, Downieville, all these great descents with 25% access fire roads are on the menu now.

The other discovery is I can run Assegai's, DHF, knee pads, full face, pants anytime. And at the start of big descents, I'm fresh and focused with a 2-second break to enjoy the view.

fc


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## InlawBiker (Aug 19, 2009)

52, I have 0 e-bikes but I'm open to the idea. I also have 2 motos, a dirt and a street bike. They serve different purposes though, I don't think an e-bike replaces a motorbike.

I'm going to keep peddling as long as I can but sure, I'd buy an e-bike for the right purpose and price. 

They sure are pumping out the e-Bikes though. I've been bike shopping, the sales guy told me inventory is very low on traditional bikes but e-Bikes keep getting shipped. Tells you something and profit margin I think. Their store was loaded with em and nobody looking.


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Thanks XLr8n! Love the handle and has a new meaning now too. What did you get?
> 
> Love your words about it. There is so much to discover with this E thing. I do love it when folks say they are more fit. The basic premise is one more riding, more adventures, more experiences. more options.
> 
> It's not for everyone and I'll always respect that. There has been significant amounts of hate though and I can attest to that since I've been testing/playing with emtbs for the last 10 years. The transition towards tolerance and participation though has been significant here in Santa Cruz and South Bay area.


Picked up a Commencal SX Meta Power 27.5. My last two rides were Capras so I've gotten accustomed to long travel. The weight of the ebike is really only noticeable when you hoist it off the rack. Just compress into the jump faces a bit harder and I have nearly as much air time as before.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

I want one. The only thing that's stopping me from getting one is that there are so few trails where I could legally use it nearby.

54 years old, can't claim any physical diabilities that prevent me from using a regular mountain bike, but ebikes just seem like a lot of fun. I borrowed one once for a quick test ride and had a blast.


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## pushinpixels (Jul 4, 2007)

46
0 of 4 bikes are e-powered
I tried my brothers e-bike and had a blast on it. I would love to have one but it's an issue of money and unknown long term reliability.
How often are batteries replaced? How long will the motor last? Is there a long degradation in performance before replacement?
Too many unknowns and too much money to enjoy the electric side of the sport (for me).

I also feel the best years are ahead for e-bikes with better material technology and lightweight solid-state batteries around the corner... I'll re-evaluate then.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Carl Mega said:


> I'm just entering my 5th decade. Mountain biking 38 years. Zero across the board in terms of personal eBike ownership. Would consider one if had a very long commute or some utility for errands; a one less car mindset.
> 
> My next bike will be a Spur or a REEB.
> 
> ...




OMG man.... what a photo. HO LY MOLY. I usually have full face now on hard terrain. Always knee pads. 600+ gram full face now and E can provide cooling.

EMTBs used to suck for downhill and cornering. I've been there as I even started with hub motor emtbs.

But they've come a long way and most of the bike engineering resources are being applied to these things.

This is one of my bikes and it's a great experience. 39 lbs. Assist, slow uphill, more expensive than my Tacoma


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

sgltrak said:


> I'm 55 and have been mountain biking for 38 years. 0 of my 12 current bikes are eBikes, and I have never owned one. I have demoed them, but don't see the need to own one. They don't mesh with the reasons I ride. (I might consider an e-townie for local errands.)
> 
> I ride to and from the trails most of the time. Most of my rides consist of one or more long climbs followed by one or more long descents. I don't do any shuttles or point to point rides, so a typical ride will average 200-300' of climbing per mile, with the same amount of descending.
> 
> ...


Love the share!!! Where is that, Mag 7?


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Xlr8n said:


> As far as cardio and fitness, I'm in great shape for my age and work out daily. I usually ride until exhaustion on the e-bike just like I did on the regular bike. I simply get to do more of it.


There was another similar thread that wasn't worth this musing... but the effect of *incentive *is worth talking about.

Ebike's are really good at exploiting something that you can see in (but lessor effect) regular bikes - namely, people are incentivized by seeing rewards of their efforts. Push on them pedals at level X and you go Y. Push a little harder and, if the bike responds kindly, you keep at it and maybe go a bit harder. If it doesn't (say slow, heavy bike), well, humans are really in tune with diminishing returns and typically find or return to a stasis point where they feel they are being properly rewarded for their effort.

A big part of the allure of eBikes is you get an outsized reward for your effort - well beyond what you put in. So how you internalize this - leverage this incentive - becomes interesting. Less of a barrier to speed and seeing obvious reward, might keep you going or push again.

The effect is real. And if it's a positive one for you, I think that's good. I don't think it's the only path as I like the character building of barrier busting but I get it. So a story like yours where you find more incentive and thus ride more, tracks.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Nat said:


> I want one. The only thing that's stopping me from getting one is that there are so few trails where I could legally use it nearby.
> 
> 54 years old, can't claim any physical diabilities that prevent me from using a regular mountain bike, but ebikes just seem like a lot of fun. I borrowed one once for a quick test ride and had a blast.


Where do you live? Access is going to be a big issue. Place like Bend, OR have so many trails but these things are frowned upon.

Here in San Jose, CA, ebikes were legalized in our County Parks system and it's a huge deal. In Santa Cruz, 40% are now on E and most trails are illegal anyway.

fc


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

pushinpixels said:


> 46
> 0 of 4 bikes are e-powered
> I tried my brothers e-bike and had a blast on it. I would love to have one but it's an issue of money and unknown long term reliability.
> How often are batteries replaced? How long will the motor last? Is there a long degradation in performance before replacement?
> ...


Money?..Meh, no more so that any other bike. Once it's four or five years old the value of any bike is shot. You can pick up a replacement battery for the price of a nice wheelset. It's the price of having fun, no different than any other 'hobby'. You only live once!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

stripes said:


> I’m all for ebikes even emtb, and I’m glad it lets you enjoy riding
> 
> What I’m not for is the stereotyping on this thread of needing to be old, injured, or a slow female to ride one.


Now, now, I never said my wife rides an ebike because she's old injured, or a "slow female".

Granted, she's slow, but that's only because she doesn't exercise much.

We used to ride a mountain tandem, it was great, but I struggled to get us up hills and it was a bear to handle in technical terrain.

The ebike thing was my idea and it's been awesome!

She can ride with me straight off the couch and it also gets used by less fit bikers who comes to visit.

No stereotypes here, just folks riding what they want to ride and how they want to ride.


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Carl Mega said:


> There was another similar thread that wasn't worth this musing... but the effect of *incentive *is worth talking about.
> 
> Ebike's are really good at exploiting something that you can see in (but lessor effect) regular bikes - namely, people are incentivized by seeing rewards of their efforts. Push on them pedals at level X and you go Y. Push a little harder and, if the bike responds kindly, you keep at it and maybe go a bit harder. If it doesn't (say slow, heavy bike), well, humans are really in tune with diminishing returns and typically find or return to a stasis point where they feel they are being properly rewarded for their effort.
> 
> ...


And some folks think riding dirt bikes (MX) is easy too. I can wear myself to the point of not being able to stand up in a couple hours of hard trail and track riding.
Is it about fun, exercise, or both? When I'm on a bike, I'm out to have fun yet still enjoy pushing the boundaries of my endurance while I'm having fun. I exercise at the gym when its dark or raining.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Sparticus said:


> Yo FC! Thanks for calling me out, my friend.
> Not sure exactly when I first encountered MTBR but shiggy told me about MTBR when I got my very first computer (1998) and bingo — I found my first (and only) social media addiction. Thanks for founding this awesome mountain biking site!
> I miss those long ago days when shiggy, Justin and I would travel down your way for things like Sea Otter and you and your crew would occasionally come up here to Oregon to visit our gang. @Ogre moved up here from Cali several years ago and he’s been a strong addition to our local riding a trailbuilding group.
> If you feel like hanging out for a mellow mountain biker campout next month, c’mon up for the Disciples Of Dirt’s Spring Barbie Camp event in central Oregon. Something like the 28th Annual! It’d be terrific to see you again. Ebikes welcome.
> =sParty


Shiggy, man, that dude is a character


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

pushinpixels said:


> 46
> 0 of 4 bikes are e-powered
> I tried my brothers e-bike and had a blast on it. I would love to have one but it's an issue of money and unknown long term reliability.
> How often are batteries replaced? How long will the motor last? Is there a long degradation in performance before replacement?
> ...


Yup, you're touching on some key points. Pricing and availability are tough to ridiculous. They're out of stock mostly and most buyers have to backorder them, sight unseen, no test ride/fit. 

Batteries will actually outlast the bike. They go through 500+ full charge cycles before they drop to 60% of capacity. Most ebikes never go through 200 full charge cycles since that's probably 500 rides for most.

It's definitely a category that's changing so much so one should ride the snot out of the bikes and flip them after 3-4 years. The good news is since demand is so high, 3-4 year old Levos and Treks are selling at the price folks paid for them new.

As far as tech turnover, don't wait if you 'need' it. They're like iphones and laptops. They'll always be better the following year IMHO.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Carl Mega said:


> There was another similar thread that wasn't worth this musing... but the effect of *incentive *is worth talking about.
> 
> Ebike's are really good at exploiting something that you can see in (but lessor effect) regular bikes - namely, people are incentivized by seeing rewards of their efforts. Push on them pedals at level X and you go Y. Push a little harder and, if the bike responds kindly, you keep at it and maybe go a bit harder. If it doesn't (say slow, heavy bike), well, humans are really in tune with diminishing returns and typically find or return to a stasis point where they feel they are being properly rewarded for their effort.
> 
> ...


Great points! 

Ebikes can be very motivating to ride since the barrier to climbing is variable and that assist is like a magic carpet ride. I used to ride around the block, feeling schitty and then I end up on a hilltop 2000 feet high just because the body feels better and loose after 10 minutes of motion. So now, I make sure to strap on a helmet every time!

What the ebike is bad at is CHOICE. Given the choice, most riders will not face the pain and suffer. So the muscle-building, pain threshold is hard to train. It's the reverse of the singlespeed bike (which I did for 10 years). There was no choice but to suffer up the big mountain. So we all got strong with big calves. Ebikes require a bit of self-discipline if getting strong and fast is a goal.


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Love the share!!! Where is that, Mag 7?


White Rim in Canyonlands National Park. Five of us did the 103 mile loop in a day on my birthday a couple of years ago. It was a great way to celebrate another lap around the sun.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

It seems like eBikes are mostly a thing on the west coast. I'd like to see a map showing the sales of eBikes by state. I see them from time to time on local trails, in town. Also see them in ski resort towns. Rarely under anyone under 50 in the former case, and more commonly in the latter.

I have yet to see an eBike poaching USFS trails at high altitude or far from pavement or cell service. I'm guessing that won't change for a long time. I also rarely see long travel bikes out there, so that might be correlated to distance from pavement, too.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

I have two ebikes and four analog bikes.


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## angelo (Sep 3, 2004)

67 here, riding mountain bikes for 34 years in Vermont. Currently have a Ripmo, Farley for winter riding and an Orbea Rise, which I lucked into finding two days after deciding on one (and had it within a week) last March. Love all of the bikes and would have to go through my old school ride journal to total up percentages for each, but my guess is for non-winter riding, 70% Ripmo, 30% Rise. 
I ride the Rise when I ride with my wife on her (Como) ebike on adventure rides, urban cruising, in town errands, vacation noodling around. Also solo (since I don't have a lot of friends with ebikes), on recovery days, longer rides where covering more ground in the same time is rewarding and on under the radar local trails that are almost spiritually significant to me and that I prefer riding alone. 
I was in SF visiting my sister pre-pandemic and rented a Ripley at the Presidio and did a ride over the GG bridge to and around the Headlands--20 miles with the requisite climbing and had a great time. Just got back last night from my first plane trip since then, again to SF, rented two Comos with my wife and rode from Mill Valley into the Headlands, out to Tennessee Cove, on to Muir beach, up Middle Green Gulch, over to Miwok trail and back. 20+ miles 2,700 feet of climbing on baked fire roads and singletrack with super loose kitty litter over hard -- basically on city slicks. Some of those grades were easily 20% -- my wife has experience with that bike, but it certainly isn't the bike or the tires for that ride and she is by no means an avid mountain biker, but the point is we both rode it all and had a great time. Both rides were great, very different and very enjoyable each in their own way. 
I've done the local 50 mile "race" when I turned 50 and again at 60, and I'm planning on doing it again at 70 on a (non-e) mountain bike. I think conntinuing to mix in some Rise riding will keep things fresh, help me stay in that much better shape, and it is proving to be one more very interesting, super fun part of getting out on two wheels.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

I live at 8000ft in Colorado. My county (Jefferson County) has legalized Class 1 bikes on all trails.

Because of this, my e-bikes open up so many more trail options for me. I am not fit enough to do 5000ft of climbing on my YT Jeffsy but I am on my Santa Cruz Heckler. Every trail near my house requires tons of climbing. Now instead of riding one trail and being exhausted, I can string trails together and enjoy more trails in the time I have available.

Ebikes being legal makes my limited riding time so much better.


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

Geek said:


> I live at 8000ft in Colorado. My county (Jefferson County) has legalized Class 1 bikes on all trails.
> 
> Because of this, my e-bikes open up so many more trail options for me. I am not fit enough to do 5000ft of climbing on my YT Jeffsy but I am on my Santa Cruz Heckler
> 
> Every trail near my house requires tons of climbing. Now instead of riding one trail and being exhausted, I can string trails together. Ebikes being legal has made riding time so much better.


Wow jeff co legalized them? I moved away from the front range over a decade ago partly because all the trails are a shi! show of multi use drama. I can only image what jeff co parks on a weekend are like when e bikes enter the fray.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

slimat99 said:


> Wow jeff co legalized them? I moved away from the front range over a decade ago partly because all the trails are a shi! show of multi use drama. I can only image what jeff co parks on a weekend are like when e bikes enter the fray.


Jeffco has, Pueblo has, and I heard Colorado Springs now has (but haven't confirmed).
Front range trail crowding is a far bigger issue than ebikes. Go run NTM on a Saturday and you might see 2 ebikes out of the 8,000 people on the mountain.

Lucky you for escaping! The only good thing about the front range growth is the value of my house has gone insane over the past 10 years


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

Almost 50. 1 bike….not an ebike. The greatest since of accomplishment is climbing mountains on my SS . A motor would take away the purpose for me. Colorado Springs here btw. Geek is right that almost every trail here on the front range starts with a monster climb! I LOVE IT


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

slimat99 said:


> Wow jeff co legalized them? I moved away from the front range over a decade ago partly because all the trails are a shi! show of multi use drama. I can only image what jeff co parks on a weekend are like when e bikes enter the fray.


p.s. one positive of MTBs popularity: We have several new MTB-Only trail systems including some downhill only trails in Jeffco now.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

This past weekend I got together with a group of long time friends (from moto days).
All of us on our ebikes, over 50 and various levels of fitness. 
We all have analog bikes as well but we rarely ride them together because our fitness levels vary too much.
We had a hoot just running around and riding bikes together.
It was like being 12 years old again. 😎










Having a blast!


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## Blatant (Apr 13, 2005)

I hesitate to even respond as the tenor of the conversation by fc is pretty clear.

That said, 53, in shape, still riding black and double black in Phoenix. Climbing them under human power. I have zero interest in electric motors on bikes, other than wishing they didn’t exist.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Blatant said:


> I hesitate to even respond as the tenor of the conversation by fc is pretty clear.
> 
> That said, 53, in shape, still riding black and double black in Phoenix. Climbing them under human power. I have zero interest in electric motors on bikes, other than wishing they didn’t exist.


There's a lot of things I wished didn't exist ... just saying 

I gave up caring about a lot of things over the past couple years, it's all just too much, so I do my job, I love my people, and I ride my bike.

It's all good if you ignore the bad.


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## jiw71 (Feb 15, 2009)

Ailuropoda said:


> 58. Zero eBikes, zero desire to own one. As a recreational cyclist I don't see the point. If you're going to ride a bicycle for fun, ride a bicycle.
> 
> Saw a couple of pasty, out-of-shape-looking guys on some eBikes at one of our local trails the other day. Probably younger than me. I hope I never get like that.
> 
> My limitations are that I'm old and still 30 pounds heavier than I'd like to be. Big push started this month to lose the weight.


wow........you're 30lbs overweight and bitchin' about others on e-bikes??? I hope I never get like that.


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## jiw71 (Feb 15, 2009)

Blatant said:


> I hesitate to even respond as the tenor of the conversation by fc is pretty clear.
> 
> That said, 53, in shape, still riding black and double black in Phoenix. Climbing them under human power. I have zero interest in electric motors on bikes, other than wishing they didn’t exist.


Tell me that when you are 70 lol. Bought my first E-mtb when I turned 70. Now 3 years later I trail ride daily pushing almost 5000 miles annually.......... approx 60% on my full suspension e-bike and the rest on a 29+ hardtail and a 26" fatbike for winter riding Never say never.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Ailuropoda said:


> As a recreational cyclist I don't see the point. If you're going to ride a bicycle for fun, ride a bicycle.


...but ebikes are fun (or at least the one ride I did on an ebike was a total kick in the pants). I picture being able to bang off multiple laps on a day where I might've only been able to do one or two laps with my regular bike. Therefore, superfun!


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Blatant said:


> I hesitate to even respond as the tenor of the conversation by fc is pretty clear.
> 
> That said, 53, in shape, still riding black and double black in Phoenix. Climbing them under human power. I have zero interest in electric motors on bikes, other than wishing they didn’t exist.


It's ok. Many do not want E and that's fine. No pushback from me but it's really good to hear the 'not now, not ever E' initial wave of rider opinions. E folks coming out of the woodwork too.

Purity of biking, xc, prowess, accomplishment are some of what I'm hearing for not going E.

And I'm not hearing a lot of 'not me, and nobody should ever go E' kind of sentiment.

There's definitely a regional element to it and I'm definitely partaking in it as I've been exposed to it for so long. Europe is definitely in, West Coast is happening and East Coast is more WTF?


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## ownyourtime (Dec 11, 2021)

56 No Ebike\moped and no future plans to own one.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Nat said:


> ...but ebikes are fun (or at least the one ride I did on an ebike was a total kick in the pants). I picture being able to bang off multiple laps on a day where I might've only been able to do one or two laps with my regular bike. Therefore, superfun!


I'm not disputing that. And eBikes don't bother me in the slightest. I don't think they hurt trails, at least the ones that aren't barely disguised motorcycles, and I want people out there having fun. Just not sure why we discuss them on a mountain biking forum.


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## Blatant (Apr 13, 2005)

I try not to be too militant about stuff. I can safely say I hope to never need to ride an ebike. I’m not quite sure why we talk about electronics and bikes in the same sentence; they’re clearly not engaged in the same activities.

But, to be fair, I’ve seen a handful of folks riding them that seemed appropriate in my opinion: older riders, a military dude with a prosthesis, etc.


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## Clyde Ride (Jun 7, 2019)

Over 50. No ebikes. No interest. I ride ~140 FS trail bikes under my own power.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

jiw71 said:


> wow........you're 30lbs overweight and bitchin' about others on e-bikes??? I hope I never get like that.


Dude...I'm not morbidly obese or anything...I just need to get to about 180 or so so I can finish the Tour Divide in 2023 on my next attempt. Weight of the bike, gear, and me is the single factor making it hard to stay in the saddle for 14 hours a day. Some of those mountain passes are brutal. I'm an old man. I gained some weight after my divorce but am slowly getting back in shape. None of it on an eBike. I weighed 180 for my entire career in the Marines except that I got down to 165 in boot camp. It's a good weight for me. Haven't seen it in 30 years. There's no reason I can't do it.


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## andy f (Jan 13, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> sParty!!!!! You're one of the OG my friend! How many years have you been on the site now? 68 years old and 37 years riding. OMG!!!! I always noticed your rad bikes over the years. So well thought-out. You still in Oregon? Still working or just playing now?


I joined mtbr.com as a grad student at the University of Arizona in '96 and used to attend the Phoenix gatherings!

Now 55 with 3 bikes, no motors. My wife had a 2018 Turbo Levo for a while. Seems fun but the bike was far too small for me to take out on a real ride. I'd like try one on a really big ride some time, something with too much mileage/climbing for me on my bikes. Start in Aptos, do a couple of Demo laps plus hit all of the pork and pastries on the way back to town. Definitely more than I want to take on at current fitness levels but could be a really fun day with a boost getting up to Demo. That might be enough to sell me on one for myself.


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

over 50, 1 regular MTB, 1 gravel, 1 ebike. And my ebike ratio is high, very high. If going to the mountains, my ebike ratio is 100%. More riding, more fun.


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## mike_kelly (Jul 18, 2016)

Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it? NO, NO

How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs? NA

What's your next bike? ICAN SN04

What do you like about emtb? NOTHING

How old are you and what are your injuries/limitations? 68

Photo?


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Blatant said:


> I try not to be too militant about stuff. I can safely say I hope to never need to ride an ebike. I’m not quite sure why we talk about electronics and bikes in the same sentence; they’re clearly not engaged in the same activities.
> 
> But, to be fair, I’ve seen a handful of folks riding them that seemed appropriate in my opinion: older riders, a military dude with a prosthesis, etc.


Well, we could always discuss dropper posts, clipless v. flat pedals, wheel size, and 1x drivetrains for the millionth-billionth time. Actually, we'll probably do that anyway. Beats the hell out of talking about Covid.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

ownyourtime said:


> 56 No Ebike\moped and no future plans to own one.


I'm approaching 50 and was diagnosed with a genetic heart condition a few months ago. I'm still on a regular MTN bike but I'm GLAD eBikes exist so I can continue to enjoy trail riding and still get some cardio without putting my heart into the red zone. Ask me what I thought of eBikes post diagnosis and my answer would have been completely different.


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Ebikes are a godsend for those that cannot otherwise enjoy cycling, but I do see a comical angle taken by haters on forums everywhere. Portray an e-bike as a handicap vehicle in an effort to shame otherwise healthy people away from them....Honestly, I hope nobody ever has to _need_ an e-bike, but the truth is the large majority of folks aren't getting e-bikes because they _need _one, it's that people _want _one because they are fun.

For those reading who are contemplating the wonderful world of e-bike: I'm completely fit and can ride my enduro analog bike up and down any trail out there as I've done my whole life. I've met every goal I can imagine on a regular bike. With the e-bike It's a whole new dynamic. It's 100 percent the most fun I've ever had on a bike. win-win. Nobody I personally know is on an e-bike because they need it. We are on them for the added fun. Another way to enjoy the trails. Folks had the the same reservations about suspension, 29er wheels, on and on. In the end the stuff people like wins out. E-bikes are here to stay...even for us healthy folks. 😜


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## PTCbiker (Sep 15, 2020)

I'm 54, own 2 bikes none are motorized. In my current situation I could not imagine owning one, could see it if I move to western Colorado where the climbs are brutal. 

I'm surprised people that own an e-bike would ever ride a regular bike again.


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## prj71 (Dec 29, 2014)

stripes said:


> What I’m not for is the stereotyping on this thread of needing to be old, injured, or a slow female to ride one.


Well the young and fit have no excuse to be riding an ebike. So that leaves the older and injured I guess.

Meanwhile Tinker Jaurez is 61 and still kicking ass and taking the Podium. Give him an ebike and watch his fitness level drop.

I'm just a few months over 50. No plans for an ebike ever. Kinda defeats the purpose of trying to exercise and stay fit.

Tried an ebike at a demo a few years ago. Turbo Levo. Zero effort going up the hills and when you touched the pedals going into a corner it liked to lunge forward. No thanks.


Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## fredman1085 (10 mo ago)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


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## fredman1085 (10 mo ago)

prj71 said:


> Well the young and fit have no excuse to be riding an ebike. So that leaves the older and injured I guess.
> 
> Meanwhile Tinker Jaurez is 61 and still kicking ass and taking the Podium. Give him an ebike and watch his fitness level drop.
> 
> ...


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## Dale-Calgary (Feb 14, 2018)

53 and a couple months ago I got my first ebike and can't wait to try it out. so 1-1 regular vs ebike.


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## Gman7 (Jul 11, 2008)

Been riding for over 30 years, first BMX and then MTB. First MTB bike was a Yeti ARC, rode it till the wheels fell off. Also love to ride road although it’s getting much more dangerous of late due to increased distracted driving from cell phones / car gadgets. Have three analog bikes and no e-bike to date, but would love to try one. Definitely see the benefit for long days with large elevation gain. I am 54 now and feel the mileage but have no plans to add an e-bike in the near term. For my wife it’s a different matter and she would benefit from one due to limitations from injury. My fitness level is pretty good and I am still capable of long days in the saddle with decent elevation gain (~4000) when I hit trails
the mountains.

On my local trails pedal assist e-bikes are increasing exponentially and are much more common today. In a matter of two year, since the start of Covid, they have gone from novelty to about 30% share. I think it’s good as it allows folks to enjoy the sport that otherwise couldn’t due to physical limitations. I also see heavy investment into the e-bike segment which is where the explosive growth will be in the future.


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## norcalbike (Dec 17, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> I love the big downhills too. And I'm a much better descender now than 10 years ago. The emtb helps you climb 4000 feet but it's not gonna help you descend. It's harder in fact as it's a 50 lb bike and it requires more upper body strength.
> 
> Some ideal trails are shuttle trails or ski lift trails. I used to shuttle a bunch but now zero. I just pedal up with assist. Northstar, Downieville, all these great descents with 25% access fire roads are on the menu now.
> 
> ...


I think the self shuttle on a bike like the Levi SL is the best use case for emtb. Can sti have your fun on local trails on an AM/Trail/XC bike and do shuttle laps with less hassle and impact on proper dh trails.


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## cyclelicious (Oct 7, 2008)

I'm 60+ female. Former road cyclist. Mtb since 2009. I got my thrills riding DH until a nasty crash in 2015. Since then, I prefer riding enduro trails on a hardtail (occasionally FS) on snow, ice and dirt at least once or twice per week. I'm also a long distance runner and I train for marathons... as if that's not enough, I do crossfit about 6 days/wk.

Over the years I've owned many bikes and I've never considered purchasing an ebike. I still ride with ease along with my husband (who has been riding mtb's longer than me). BTW My husband also rides dirtbikes (enduro and trials) for fun and competively (I don't think that counts as an ebike  ). We both work fulltime have no retirement plans. Getting older and slower (and chronically injured) doesn't mean activities like biking or running (or crossfit) can't still be enjoyed. I'm not sure if I fit any sterotype


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

Le Duke said:


> It seems like eBikes are mostly a thing on the west coast. I'd like to see a map showing the sales of eBikes by state. I see them from time to time on local trails, in town. Also see them in ski resort towns. Rarely under anyone under 50 in the former case, and more commonly in the latter.
> 
> I have yet to see an eBike poaching USFS trails at high altitude or far from pavement or cell service. I'm guessing that won't change for a long time. I also rarely see long travel bikes out there, so that might be correlated to distance from pavement, too.


Agreed. We rented a place in Keystone overlooking the bike path to River Run for the month of September last year, and I'd estimate the number of eBikes on that path was close to 50%. Age range seemed to be pretty wide, but probably a bit skewed toward older folks. So far, the few I've seen poaching local trails have been mostly younger.

I only saw a couple in the Summit County back country last fall and haven't run into any of them on my more remote rides in this area.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

sgltrak said:


> Agreed. We rented a place in Keystone overlooking the bike path to River Run for the month of September last year, and I'd estimate the number of eBikes on that path was close to 50%. Age range seemed to be pretty wide, but probably a bit skewed toward older folks. So far, the few I've seen poaching local trails have been mostly younger.
> 
> I only saw a couple in the Summit County back country last fall and haven't run into any of them on my more remote rides in this area.


The Venn diagram of people who go on big, backcountry rides and people who ride eBikes is likely two circles that don’t intersect.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Wheelspeed (Jan 12, 2006)

This post seems better served as a poll, but I'll play. 51.8 years old. Just spend like $9k on two bikes in '18 and '19, so will try to hold off until I'm 55 to treat myself to an e-bike. Nothing wrong with e-bikes inherently. If someone rides like an asshole, fine them. If not, leave them alone. Don't make rules for "what could perceivably happen".


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

PTCbiker said:


> I'm surprised people that own an e-bike would ever ride a regular bike again.


I was afraid of that before I got my ebike because that's what everybody said.
"You'll never want to ride your mountain bike again, ha ha!"
Bullshit.
I love my mountain bike.
More than my ebike.
But don't get me wrong -- I like my ebike, too.
It's just that mountain biking is ... mountain biking.
And ebiking isn't.
It's ebiking.
Two different sports.
One motorized, one not.
Two VERY different sports.
Both fun.
=sParty


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## blaklabl (Mar 14, 2011)

PTCbiker said:


> I'm surprised people that own an e-bike would ever ride a regular bike again.


I just got my first eMTB a couple weeks ago after contemplating it for a couple years. If every trail around me were legal for eMTB, I likely wouldn’t ride my regular MTB much anymore. There are some trails around here I can’t live without, and not all my riding buddies have them so until that happens, I’ll do both.

The Levo is just so much more fun. Oh, and I’m 47 and in good shape with 30+ years of riding, sorry to crash the o50 forum but I was enjoying this thread.


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## o2binbuzios (Jun 17, 2008)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


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## plummet (Jul 8, 2005)

No ebike are yet. 

Heres an action photo


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

I'm 73 and for the past 4 years i only ride an e bike, haibike 180/180 travel.

I had and have no physical limitations, on my old bike, i rode 8 hours a week, now on my e bike, 12 hours a week.

I got it because i could do a lot more downhill.

My fitness had improved, lost weight and my uphill and downhill technical skills are better.



Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

Own one.... sort of.. My wife owns a 130mm full sus Liv. 

It gets used on non-uplifted DH races to tow my lad to the top. 

Other than that... No... i don't use it at all.


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## ravewoofer (Dec 24, 2008)

Almost 60 years old. Zero ebikes and would NEVER consider buying one. 

I pound the trails old school. Fast as I can for as long as I can. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MTB_Underdog (Jul 8, 2020)

51, no ebike and no plans for one. Rode road and MTB in high school, and started back two years ago when COVID cranked up. I like the challenge of getting faster and being able to ride longer rides in the mountains with more climbing, for me the ebike just feels like I'm cheating. Probably why I don't do lift served downhill either. Gotta earn the downs.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

Admin, please move discussion to the e-bike forum. (worth a shot) The assumption that over 50 people are more interested in or likely to buy them is ageism, imo.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

blaklabl said:


> I just got my first eMTB a couple weeks ago after contemplating it for a couple years. If every trail around me were legal for eMTB, I likely wouldn’t ride my regular MTB much anymore. There are some trails around here I can’t live without, and not all my riding buddies have them so until that happens, I’ll do both.
> 
> The Levo is just so much more fun. Oh, and I’m 47 and in good shape with 30+ years of riding, sorry to crash the o50 forum but I was enjoying this thread.



The sport of mountain biking wishes you a fond farewell. Old as I am, at no time in my mountain biking career including nearly getting heat stroke on my failed Tour Divide attempt last year have I ever wished for a motor on my bike. The OP asked for people’s opinion on eBikes. I don’t hate them but in the context of recreational cycling there’s no point to them. Sort of defeats the purpose of cycling.


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## goldsbar (Dec 2, 2004)

Bit over 50 riding since early 20s. 3 MTBs, 2 road, 0 e. Struggling uphill is (almost) as much fun as the DH for me. Maybe it was the influence of the crew I started with, but we always reveled about making it up the toughest tech climb as much as we did about tearing it up on the best DHs.

The interesting part about ebikes would be the ability to make the flats more fun. Fast is fun. That I could get into. Not enough that I see myself buying one anytime soon.


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## Blue Dot Trail (May 30, 2018)

Just over 50. Currently my eMTB ratio is 0%

Don’t own one. Don’t plan on buying one. 

I have many injuries and have worked construction for over 30 years. Been MTBing at least that long. 

I’m not wholly opposed to eMTB’s per se. But currently I’m in decent shape (I have to be to do my job). One BIG factor of eMTB’s for me is the price point TBH. They’re crazy expensive by any measure.

Will I buy/ride one in the future? Hmmmm…. I think about this sometimes? Maybe, I guess. I personally know older guys (70’s) who are avid cyclists. Just gotta wait and see how my health and motivation plays out I guess. Never say never.


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## D Bone (Jul 20, 2014)

54 years old and my one and only bike is a Santa Cruz Chameleon hardtail. I have no plans whatsoever to buy a motorized bicycle, but I try not to say never as I certainly don't know what the future has in store for me.

I figure the longer I ride under my own power, the longer I will be able to ride under my own power.


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## PVP-SS (Jan 28, 2019)

Been MTBing since 1984 starting as a teenager.

eMTB ratio is 0%.

I have no angst against eMTBs. I consider them a "tool" for a certain given task or condition, just like I treat my SS for one trail system, FS for another, and my fat bike for yet another.

No plans currently to purchase one, and for the future, I'll cross that bridge when I get there.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

More than one poster has stated that having a motor would defeat the purpose of bicycling. A corollary question is, “What’s the purpose of bicycling?” It looks like some of you are assuming that everyone else is doing it for the same reason as you.


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## dezzrat1 (Feb 28, 2014)

Zero, Ive got my 450x if I want a motor other than that my heihei, an honzo


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## fredcook (Apr 2, 2009)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?


No, and no.



Francis Cebedo said:


> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?


n/a



Francis Cebedo said:


> What's your next bike?


Trail with geo leaning more toward enduro, pedal powered.



Francis Cebedo said:


> What do you like about emtb?


No opinion.



Francis Cebedo said:


> How old are you and what are your injuries/limitations?


61 years old. No current injuries, no expected long term injuries or limitations. At least not yet.



Francis Cebedo said:


> Photo?


Of what?


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## baker (Jan 6, 2004)

I'm 51 and have lots of bikes, but no e-bikes. I did electrify my Yuba Mundo back in the day (maybe 10 years ago?) to get the kids back and forth to school. I don't have that setup anymore.

I have no intent to buy an ebike in the short term, but won't rule one out of my future. My local trails are officially non-motorized, but there are plenty of ebikes out there. No one to enforce the rules and, frankly, I no longer care. As long as whatever trail user (mtb, ebiker, hiker, runner, walker, equestrian) isn't being a dick, I just wave and say hi. I help w/ trail building and maintenance and my initial fear was of e-bike induced erosion and trail user conflict. That hasn't happened, yay!

And, since fc started the thread, I have to take the opportunity to thank him for creating mtbr back in the day. I've been around since the first incarnation and have spent countless hours here. My employers probably wouldn't thank you as much as I would.

As far as it being "sad" that the mtbr founder is into ebikes...while I understand the sentiment, I think that is silly. Change happens. It has been a long long time. And, yes, age is a factor of time...and, I do see myself ultimately getting an ebike when I'm no longer capable of riding my mountain bike and/or no longer enjoying it due injury or lack of ability. 

Oh yeah, I'm currently healthy, but have gone thru some terrible injuries over the past 10 years, including 2 knee surgeries, a heart surgery, and a back surgery. Getting back to pedaling has been savior for me.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Nat said:


> More than one poster has stated that having a motor would defeat the purpose of bicycling. A corollary question is, “What’s the purpose of bicycling?” It looks like some of you are assuming that everyone else is doing it for the same reason as you.



I didn't read all the responses but the ones I did seemed to only be relating their own experiences and opinions and not projecting what others should think.

Again, for me any sort of motor would completely change my experience on 2 wheels and personally I wouldn't consider it cycling any more. I love moving myself using only my heart, lungs & muscles, it's hard to explain that to anyone who doesn't get it and that's ok. I'm not asking anyone else to think or act like me.

Also I love going for pr's, mostly climbing pr's.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

I'll speak for one of my best riding buddies, Al (who doesn't hang on social media platforms.)

Al will be 75 in less than a month, retired JAG / lawyer / judge.
Lifelong cyclist and a good one -- former road racer, very strong.
Al is a brilliant road cycling tactician, knows how to get to the front and win; did so for years.
Al's always been a fixture on our local shop's thrice weekly club road rides.
Always.

I want to be like Al. He's inspirational in many ways.
On the bike and off.

Al rides off-road bikes, too.
Has a nicely equipped Guerrilla Gravity Megatrail plus a Trek Rail ebike -- one of the upper-tiered carbon ones.
Much nicer than mine. 

Anyway last month Al found suddenly himself struggling on one of our group road rides. Felt sluggish.
The feeling didn't go away. Missed a couple rides. He got covid-tested. That wasn't it.
In addition to feeling weak, his heart rate would go up and wouldn't come back down.
After about 3 weeks of wondering what was going on, he finally went to the ER. The docs told Al, "Good thing you came in when you did."

He has some blood clots, one in his lung the size of a baseball and some clots in his legs. Now he's on blood thinners.
As well as some meds for a-fib, whatever that is, to help control his heart rate.

Al's not allowed to ride his mountain bike.

Yet.

This all happened so suddenly. To a guy who's been active and strong and healthy all his life. Relatively lean & fit.

Bam!

Doc says Al will recover fully and be fine so long as he takes his meds.
He'll be on these meds for the rest of his life.
Evidently his body will eventually assimilate the clots so this too shall pass.

Meanwhile Al can ride his ebike.
Yesterday my GF Cyn & I rode bikes with Al.
Of course Al was on his ebike.
Cyn rode her Ibis Mojo 4 mountain bike.
I was tired from the previous evening's group road ride so I rode my ebike.
We all had a blast riding together.
Two ebikes and a mountain bike.
Imagine that.

If Al were writing this, he'd tell you the same thing -- people can ride different types of bikes and have fun together.
Pretty sure he'd mention that he feels lucky he has an ebike right now, too.
Something he can still get out into the woods and roll two wheels with despite his sudden health scare.

As for Al's situation, that could be me.
=sParty


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

What's your point? That you can be near death and drive your scooter through the woods?


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## baker (Jan 6, 2004)

Sparticus said:


> As for Al's situation, that could be me.
> =sParty


One of the best riders I know and have ridden a ton with has early onset Parkinsons. He mostly rides an ebike now. That fully opened my eyes. Full disclosure...I had honestly thought of ebikes as a choice for lazy people prior to that. Now, I understand that ebikes can coexist with regular mountain bikes and we can all sing Kumbaya (took a while to get there for me).


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Ailuropoda said:


> The sport of mountain biking wishes you a fond farewell. Old as I am, at no time in my mountain biking career including nearly getting heat stroke on my failed Tour Divide attempt last year have I ever wished for a motor on my bike. The OP asked for people’s opinion on eBikes. I don’t hate them but in the context of recreational cycling there’s no point to them. Sort of defeats the purpose of cycling.


This is obviously your opinion and your narrow view of ebikes, but from my perspective it couldn't be any further from the truth. The purpose of cycling for _me _is to A) have fun, b) be outdoors, and c) get a good workout. E-bike or regular bike both fulfill all of those goals. They really aren't that different at all except for saving more energy on the climbs to be able to do more repeated runs down with less breaks in between. I run the same trails and hit the same features and can have a blast on both. No point? That's the silliest thing I've read in this thread yet.

One of the biggest misconceptions of e-bikes is that they are not a workout. If that's the case then you are doing something very wrong. I can ride mine in full Boost mode the whole ride and still exhaust myself physically by rides end. 

I'd also bet most everyone with a negative opinion of an e-bike hasn't spent any significant time on one aside from maybe a bike path test. It's absolutely hilarious to read all of the dudes puffing their chest out saying 'NEVER'. Okay. Don't then. lol


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

teleken said:


> Turned 59 today lifetime of cycling & MTB since 1985. No eBike & no plans to get one. Luckily I still have the ability to pull off 20+ mile XC rides in Colorado but warm up & recovery takes longer.
> Cycling is a purity thing for me & an eBike takes something away from that.


And you are NOT kidding about the need for increased recovery time.


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## cunningstunts (Sep 1, 2011)

what i don't like about them is the fact that proper technical riding isn't possible. i like to ratchet pedal and negotiate challenging singletrack climbs where an eeb is simply too big, heavy, cumbersome and the motor surges just can't handle it. the bikes just aren't there yet. oh wait.......


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

SteveF said:


> Admin, please move discussion to the e-bike forum. (worth a shot) The assumption that over 50 people are more interested in or likely to buy them is ageism, imo.


I'm thinking the OP posted here intentionally with that in mind, but I can see it as a legit post here. I'm assuming the market for e-bikes is senior-heavy one.


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## R3aPerCr3W (11 mo ago)

Not even tempted for an E bike, good old cycle "is the way "


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

D. Inoobinati said:


> What's your point? That you can be near death and drive your scooter through the woods?


Was enjoying reading this thread. Lots of different perspectives, I respect all of them.

Then right on cue, you show up and just take a big dump on all of it. 

What's it like to be you in real life? Jesus...


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## Mountainfrog (Mar 7, 2006)

I rode, raced, and restored motorcycles prior to retiring from that sport at age forty. I took up mountain biking as a form of aerobic exercise. I found many of my off road techniques applied to mountain biking and I was hooked. I'm sixty eight and resistant to having a motor of any sort underneath me. Call me old school on new tech.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

cunningstunts said:


> what i don't like about them is the fact that proper technical riding isn't possible. i like to ratchet pedal and negotiate challenging singletrack climbs where an eeb is simply too big, heavy, cumbersome and the motor surges just can't handle it. the bikes just aren't there yet. oh wait.......


Furthermore, ebikes are only for old, sick, and out-of-shape people. There's no reason for anyone else to be using one. Oh wait...


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Nat said:


> More than one poster has stated that having a motor would defeat the purpose of bicycling. A corollary question is, “What’s the purpose of bicycling?” It looks like some of you are assuming that everyone else is doing it for the same reason as you.


Yeah, that one is the point of conflict; it's hard not to imprint your motivations onto others.

What is the appeal? Economics? Practicality? Aesthetics? Sporting? Circumstances? Opportunity? Fitness/health tool?

Different for everyone.

However, I think there is a sort of a framing for the* sporting, enthusiasts* - where you could use your rational in a conscious decision to select a bicycle over a different vehicle. It goes something like this:

If you selected a bicycle, you probably didn't pick it because it was the fastest or most passive means from point A to point B - or at least, the one requiring the least physical effort. You can nitpick that apart, of course, but sort of like how XC sking isn't ever going to be as fast or easy as riding a snowmobile on similar terrain.

So there's another motivation. Let's remove the practical reasons here like access (eg: only bikes or skis allowed).

What I think is that the means and methods of how you do something, matters to people. It's not that you did the journey but *how *you did the journey.

And despite some popular sentiments, people like constraints and rules. No one cares that your rode a bus from Denver to LA. But if you constrained yourself to a bike and did that, you have something to talk about and it generates interest. And when you play a game, rules make it more interesting. That's why they exist, you don't just throw down all your cards at once and celebrate. You wait your turn, you play your best card and apply your strategy and acumen to win. Because you won according to the rules gives the victory purpose and meaning.

For a lot of us, it's the constraint of being human powered that generates the interest. A physical challenge, a test of your character to persevere on something that is inherently hard to do. So the notion, that you can overcome that constraint, that challenge - simply by buying something and using a motor...well, that's robbing the meaning and purpose. I already know there's an easier path but I chose this means because it is hard, because it is not a given that I can accomplish it. Further, I've now deferred the level of ability - agency, if you will - to the power of my motor not the ability of the person. And it's for those reasons, that direct comparisons of what you do on an eBike vs. what you did on the a bike doesn't hold any value. They are different.

So that's why the eBike framing thru a mtb lens is ill fitting. Ebike accomplishments compared to other eBike efforts - makes sense, the context is aligned. 

But hey, let's call out - some people just like rolling thru the woods on two wheels. Don't care how, their selection is pure hedonism. I have a foot in this camp. Those sensations, man, I love it. That said, I don't cross the streams - what I can accomplish on the moto stays in that framing, it doesn't internalize with what I do via pedals.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

I think an interesting addition to the initial question would have been:
"Have you ridden an ebike?"


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

I'm thinking about starting another thread asking "what's the point?" but in which forum? Over 50? General? E-bikes?


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Gman7 said:


> Been riding for over 30 years, first BMX and then MTB. First MTB bike was a Yeti ARC, rode it till the wheels fell off. Also love to ride road although it’s getting much more dangerous of late due to increased distracted driving from cell phones / car gadgets. Have three analog bikes and no e-bike to date, but would love to try one. Definitely see the benefit for long days with large elevation gain. I am 54 now and feel the mileage but have no plans to add an e-bike in the near term. For my wife it’s a different matter and she would benefit from one due to limitations from injury. My fitness level is pretty good and I am still capable of long days in the saddle with decent elevation gain (~4000) when I hit trails
> the mountains.
> 
> On my local trails pedal assist e-bikes are increasing exponentially and are much more common today. In a matter of two year, since the start of Covid, they have gone from novelty to about 30% share. I think it’s good as it allows folks to enjoy the sport that otherwise couldn’t due to physical limitations. I also see heavy investment into the e-bike segment which is where the explosive growth will be in the future.


Thank you for the share. What area do live in? The growth is quite regional and some areas are adopting earlier than others. I'm seeing very similar adoption numbers to you and I'm in the Bay Area, Northern CA.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Mountainfrog said:


> I rode, raced, and restored motorcycles prior to retiring from that sport at age forty. I took up mountain biking as a form of aerobic exercise. I found many of my off road techniques applied to mountain biking and I was hooked. I'm sixty eight and resistant to having a motor of any sort underneath me. Call me old school on new tech.


I ride motos, raced in my 30s, and restore motorcycles (still have several - have owned 52 - currently restoring a 1992 BMW K1), and have analog bikes and have ebikes.

I have been mountain biking since 1983.

You should give ebikes a try. It is as aerobic as you want it to be (and can be a much better workout keeping you in zone 2 if you want).
The ebike doesn't care what mode you have the motor in 😋

The difference is that for the amount of physical energy you have available, many more options open up to you.
There's no downside and many upsides.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

rod9301 said:


> I'm 73 and for the past 4 years i only ride an e bike, haibike 180/180 travel.
> 
> I had and have no physical limitations, on my old bike, i rode 8 hours a week, now on my e bike, 12 hours a week.
> 
> ...



Your experience is very much appreciated. I've had similar experiences of riding more and getting more fit. I'm a much better descender now as well because of so much more practice.

The other thing Is I'm able to ride with the best suspension, tires, protective gear for the trail at hand. Before, it was always a compromise of what's good enough to get me past that 2500 foot climb.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


I have an E-MTB and a MTB. Mountain biking since 1989. On my 17th mountain bike. Had a smattering of road bikes over the years, but no more. I've made it this far without any indelible injuries, not going to be taken out by some idiot in a car. 

Ride 50/50

Next E-MTB will most likely be a full power Levo in maybe 8-10 years. Plan on keeping my SJ for the foreseeable future. Best MTB I've owned to date. Not because it's the one I currently own...It's really a wicked bike.

I like the E-MTB because it's fun and I can do some monster rides with lots of elevation gain without destroying myself. Good recovery tool and a fun option when not feeling particularly motivated.

52


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Geek said:


> The difference is that for the amount of physical energy you have available, many more options open up to you.
> There's no downside and many upsides.



Personal opinion for sure and you're welcome to it but I can think of a half dozen downsides right off the bat.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Nat said:


> I'm thinking about starting another thread asking "what's the point?" but in which forum? Over 50? General? E-bikes?


If you do - please include the question "Have you ridden an ebike".
It is amazing how many people who have an opinion about them have never actually tried one.

I have 1500 calories of energy I can spend today.... 
On my analog bike I can climb 2000 ft and ride 18 miles.
On my ebike I can climb 4500 ft and ride 39 miles.

Either way I'm going to finish with a huge grin on my face 🥰


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Geek said:


> I ride, raced in my 30s, and restore motorcycles (still have several - have owned 52 - currently restoring a 1992 BMW K1), and have analog bikes and have ebikes.
> 
> You should give ebikes a try. It is as aerobic as you want it to be (and can be a much better workout keeping you in zone 2 if you want).
> The ebike doesn't care what mode you have the motor in 😋
> ...


Yes! One of the cool, unspoken things about ebikes is it's like an exercise bike where you can dial in your effort. You can cruise and easy pedal up a hill or you can hammer to 200bpm as you muscle the heavy rig up. And it compresses time too. You can your normal loop in 3 hours or in 1+ hour. So it's enabling and motivating.

Because you can dial back your effort near the top of the hill, you can be fresh and focused at the start of EVERY downhill. This makes all the difference in fun, safety and learning.

And I'm usually home in time, rarely short on food and water and have the energy to take the spouse out, play with the kids, etc. after the big adventure ride.

fc


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

J.B. Weld said:


> Personal opinion for sure and you're welcome to it but I can think of a half dozen downsides right off the bat.


Please share!
Most of the arguments I see are the purely selfish "the trails are going to get more crowded" argument.

Cheers


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Geek said:


> If you do - please include the question "Have you ridden an ebike".
> It is amazing how many people who have an opinion about them have never actually tried one.


This is a terrible argument. If it matters, I've ridden one.

But people have all sorts of opinion on things they haven't done: cheat on taxes, murder, religion, pedos, impractical material possessions, you name it. Our brains are capable of forming, well thought out opinions and decisions without direct experience of said act. I know it's not in my interest to place my hand on the stove without actually having done it.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> have the energy to take the spouse out, play with the kids, etc. after the big adventure ride.
> 
> fc


This


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

SteveF said:


> Admin, please move discussion to the e-bike forum. (worth a shot) The assumption that over 50 people are more interested in or likely to buy them is ageism, imo.


Ahh, the whole point of this thread is to understand the preferences of the over 50 crowd, Yeah or Nay.

Obviously ebike isn't just for over 50. But there are age related factors that make it very relevant to some.

fc


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Yes! One of the cool, unspoken things about ebikes is it's like an exercise bike where you can dial in your effort. You can cruise and easy pedal up a hill or you can hammer to 200bpm as you muscle the heavy rig up. And it compresses time too. You can your normal loop in 3 hours or in 1+ hour. So it's enabling and motivating.
> 
> Because you can dial back your effort near the top of the hill, you can be fresh and focused at the start of EVERY downhill. This makes all the difference in fun, safety and learning.
> 
> ...


EMBN has put out videos about effectively exercising with an e-bike.

The really interesting point in it for me was the effective usage of an e-bike to keep your heart in the zone you want when training. 
You can't control the terrain but you can use an ebike to use the terrain more effectively.
i.e. If you have a nasty climb on an analog bike you have little control over your target heart rate as you need to get up the climb; whereas with the ebike you can stay in the zone you are targeting.

edit: a quick google search - this might be the video:


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

baker said:


> I'm 51 and have lots of bikes, but no e-bikes. I did electrify my Yuba Mundo back in the day (maybe 10 years ago?) to get the kids back and forth to school. I don't have that setup anymore.
> 
> I have no intent to buy an ebike in the short term, but won't rule one out of my future. My local trails are officially non-motorized, but there are plenty of ebikes out there. No one to enforce the rules and, frankly, I no longer care. As long as whatever trail user (mtb, ebiker, hiker, runner, walker, equestrian) isn't being a dick, I just wave and say hi. I help w/ trail building and maintenance and my initial fear was of e-bike induced erosion and trail user conflict. That hasn't happened, yay!
> 
> ...



Thank you, sincerely.

I started the site AND the. over 50 forum and it has enriched my life tremendously thanks to this community and the lifestyle that we love.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I understand why the OP started this thread in the over the hill gang forum, but...

It's time for it to be moved, it's taking on the flavor of ebike threads of old ... which is why MTBR created an ebike forum.

Just saying ... I'm tuning out because it's not really reflecting the OP's stated intent: Info gathering.

Instead it's become a thread of validation and invalidation.

To the OP, I'd like to know if you would add a new forum function: "Ignore a thread".

Thanks for all you do.

Ben


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

I'm going to be 53 this year, just before my 50th B-day, I bought an ebike. I thought I would still ride my mountain bike, but month after month, it just stayed in the garage. Eventually I sold it. I'm 100% ebike and have not looked back.

In my group of riders, who all use to be mountain bikers like me. Almost all have converter 100% to ebike, some still ride both bikes. We have guys in all age range from as young as 30yrs to 65yrs old and the common theme is fun and we can all ride together as ebikes pretty much makes everyone close to be equal on the climbs. The stronger riders ride in ECO and the others in trail.

The misconception that you don't get a workout is just that! You still get a great cardio workout, because you are still spinning the pedals pretty darn hard. Obviously not as hard as a regular mountain bike, so you will lose some leg power and I'm fine with that. As I lift weights and do plenty of leg workouts.

Lucky the only health issue I have is I'm asthmatic and here is So Ca when the Santa Ana winds gets going, I have a really tough time breathing. I take daily inhalers and if needed emergency inhalers, but still when the winds come, I have a tough time.

Before the fires hit Lake Tahoe, I took a vacation out there and did a double ride each day for 4 days. Each ride was roughly 20plus miles and about 3.5k ft of climbing. By the 3rd day, I was getting worked. I've ridden Lake Tahoe for years, and riding up there on a regular bike, once a day is brutal. Pretty much any ebike trips I take are now double day rides and having so much fun doing it!


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Geek said:


> Please share!
> Most of the arguments I see are the purely selfish "the trails are going to get more crowded" argument.
> 
> Cheers




Heavy
More expensive
More maintenance
More batteries to charge
Aesthetics (yes, eye of the beholder)
Louder
Less satisfying experience (personal preference)


Oops, that's 7. I got more 

Yes I've ridden an ebike. Several of them


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Carl Mega said:


> This is a terrible argument. If it matters, I've ridden one.
> 
> But people have all sorts of opinion on things they haven't done: cheat on taxes, murder, religion, pedos, impractical material possessions, you name it. Our brains are capable of forming, well thought out opinions and decisions without direct experience of said act. I know it's not in my interest to place my hand on the stove without actually having done it.


It is not an argument - it is a data point.


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## baker (Jan 6, 2004)

I know this has been said elsewhere, but the terms analog bike and acoustic bike drive me crazy. It is a bike. An e-bike is an e-bike. There is no need (imo) to add analog or acoustic in front of the word bike to signify self-propelled.
</rant>

Edit; "Get off my lawn!" There's the over 50 content for ya... I understand fighting the use of the term analog is like tilting at windmills.


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

52/no ebikes yet. I've considered a long travel enduro ebike to self shuttle. I sometimes shuttle in vehicles and sometimes take lifts, so no difference IMO and that has nothing to do with age. I just don't see enough use/need to justify an electric bigger bike to go with my regular bigger bike. (someday the tech might get so good the tradeoff will not matter) Back when my 19 year old nephew was 5 yrs I told him I'd probably be riding an electric bike someday to keep up with him. I haven't needed that yet, he now has to wait for me at the top sometimes, but I usually have to wait for him at the bottom so it all works out. BUT, I could see that still happening someday? (and that is an age related thing) My .02, as long as it's safe for everyone I don't have a problem with them. 

I have to admit for some hypocrocy here, I HATE all the BS excuses people give for riding them. I don't have time, I'm in better shape now, the hills are too steep where I live, etc. etc. Ride them if you want to, but stop making excuses for it. (obviously some people really do need them; must be an amazing thing for someone who has reduced leg function to be able to pedal as fast as they used to, or pedal again! OR someone who is medically not able/supposed to get their heart rate up too far, etc.) BUT... I'm sure people could look at my reasoning for for an ebike and think it's an excuse too?

I'm surprised there aren't more accidents with people climbing/traversing 3x faster then normal, especially given how crowded the trails are these days. That's just one of those things where there is always someone who ruins a good thing. You have people riding DH bikes at full full speed on multi use trails, etc. So that stuff just happens and isn't necessarily an ebike thing. It is a MTB trail advocacy thing though and so I sure see the problems ebikes "could" cause. However it seems like they keep getting allowed in more area's, so I'm guessing the problems are not so bad...? IDK


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

J.B. Weld said:


> Heavy
> More expensive
> More maintenance
> More batteries to charge
> ...


Heavy: not relevant as the motor offsets? My analog Moonlander weighed more than my Canyon Grail:ON or my SantaCruz Heckler.
Expensive: One's personal situation so irrelevant.
Maintenance: agreed. I consume more chains, brakes and tires. Worth it! 
Batteries to charge: it takes 5 seconds to plug in the battery. Irrelevant. My analog bikes have AXS so I need to charge those too 
Aesthetics: I think my Canyon Grail:ON is BEAUTIFUL. 🥰 - but agreed - eye of beholder.
Louder: 100% I agree with you - definite downside to ebikes. Lets hope harley riders don't start buying them and putting baseball cards in the spokes! 🙃 
Less satisfyingly: personally I find my ebikes more satisfying because I get to ride much further in the time I have available.

So I'll give you 2 outta 7 - lol 
I appreciate the food for thought. Cheers!


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Xlr8n said:


> This is obviously your opinion and your narrow view of ebikes, but from my perspective it couldn't be any further from the truth. The purpose of cycling for _me _is to A) have fun, b) be outdoors, and c) get a good workout. E-bike or regular bike both fulfill all of those goals. They really aren't that different at all except for saving more energy on the climbs to be able to do more repeated runs down with less breaks in between. I run the same trails and hit the same features and can have a blast on both. No point? That's the silliest thing I've read in this thread yet.
> 
> One of the biggest misconceptions of e-bikes is that they are not a workout. If that's the case then you are doing something very wrong. I can ride mine in full Boost mode the whole ride and still exhaust myself physically by rides end.
> 
> I'd also bet most everyone with a negative opinion of an e-bike hasn't spent any significant time on one aside from maybe a bike path test. It's absolutely hilarious to read all of the dudes puffing their chest out saying 'NEVER'. Okay. Don't then. lol


It's not cycling. It's motor cycling. It's cool. I don't even mind seeing eBikes on the trail. I've never ridden a motorcycle either but I'm pretty sure it's not where my recreational interests lie. I don't hate motorcyclists, however.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Geek said:


> It is not an argument - it is a data point.


Sure. It's a framing that I've heard before so it triggers a bit. Basically rationalize away all inductive reasoning: "reasoning that involves drawing a general conclusion from a set of specific observations."

I've never ridden a Side by Side on our multi-use open space trails but I know that's not something I'd be in favor of and have a strong opinion about.

Similarly, in our public comment meetings, hikers who already have concerns about speed of mountain bikes and thus have opinions on faster eBikes attempted to be dismissed by "you've never ridden one". And other poor arguments.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Crankout said:


> And you are NOT kidding about the need for increased recovery time.


Amen to that. And then there are some days, you call the body and muscles and nobody's home. . 

And then of course, one day, something hurts. No rhyme reason, it just does. That may be the over 50 factor.

fc


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

J.B. Weld said:


> Heavy
> More expensive
> More maintenance
> More batteries to charge
> ...



These are true. And the big one is... the good ones are not available. Backorder, waiting list. Many have to buy with no test ride, test fit, sight unseen.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Crankout said:


> None for me in the foreseeable future.
> For me, it's still about doing the work under my own power and ability.


Props to this answer. 'For me...'
And hopefully not a judgment on others.

I find that when it comes to ebike adoption, it's a matter of understanding What Cycling Is To A Rider. If cycling means exploring/discovering many new places, then the ebike is relevant. If cycling is having fun, playing, jumping, and descending... then the ebike is interesting.

If cycling is mainly for personal achievement, challenge ONLY, then ebike is a no. If cycling is for beating everyone up a hill and showing one is more fit than everyone else, then no for me and hate on everyone on E. 

Some love so many different aspects of cycling. Some only love one or two sides of it. Kinda like this:









just a sample chart.


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## Ogre (Feb 17, 2005)

J.B. Weld said:


> Heavy
> More expensive
> More maintenance
> More batteries to charge
> ...


I just have 1 thing about ebikes for the moment: My wife rides with me about 10x more often. 

That's enough. 

My reason for considering an ebike personally is eliminating shuttle logistics. Lots of routes out here involve 6-12 mile climbs. Most of the time they just get shuttled but that's it's own kind of suck. I don't mind climbing single track, but long gravel road climbs are just not fun. I just want that crap over.


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## MSU Alum (Aug 8, 2009)

I'm 69, my wife is 68. No injuries.
Neither of us has an E-bike. 
Each of us has one bike. 27.5 for my wife, 29 for me.
I expect we'll get one each, eventually, but no plans for now to do so.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

Carl Mega said:


> Similarly, in our public comment meetings, hikers who already have concerns about speed of mountain bikes and thus have opinions on faster eBikes attempted to be dismissed by "you've never ridden one". And other poor arguments.


Ebikes are only faster on the climbs and the biggest issues is still the same as always, the downhill speed and idiots. I hike at least once a month with the wife, on a busy OC, CA trails. I take the lead when we head up a trail, because we have almost been hit many times. But not once have we almost been hit by an uphill rider! I doubt uphill riders are an issue.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Props to this answer. 'For me...'
> And hopefully not a judgment on others.
> 
> I find that when it comes to ebike adoption, it's a matter of understanding What Cycling Is To A Rider. If cycling means exploring/discovering many new places, then the ebike is relevant. If cycling is having fun, playing, jumping, and descending... then the ebike is interesting.
> ...


Well, I guess I don't need to start a poll.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

mtbbiker said:


> Ebikes are only faster on the climbs and the biggest issues is still the same as always, the downhill speed and idiots. I hike at least once a month with the wife, on a busy OC, CA trails. I take the lead when we head up a trail, because we have almost been hit many times. But not once have we almost been hit by an uphill rider! I doubt uphill riders are an issue.


I was wondering if anyone would bring up hiking. I find it interesting (and maybe hypocritical) that people say that using an ebike is cheating because it makes things easier when the bicycle is a contraption that makes foot travel faster and easier. Most of the arguments against having a motor can be applied to using a bike spoken by someone who is on foot.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

mtbbiker said:


> Ebikes are only faster on the climbs and the biggest issues is still the same as always, the downhill speed and idiots. I hike at least once a month with the wife, on a busy OC, CA trails. I take the lead when we head up a trail, because we have almost been hit many times. But not once have we almost been hit by an uphill rider! I doubt uphill riders are an issue.


Let's say I disagree and have a different experienced opinion on how net speed increase cause conflicts. Related rates about approach times between climbing speed and descending speeds in a collision scenario - tells you all you need.

But this thread is neither the time or place. I'd leave this out of it.


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## XterraMike (Jul 12, 2012)

Age 59 and hopefully never succumb to the Vespa. My 82 year old dad recently bought a new Santa Cruz 5150 so if he can ride a real bike, nearly every one should be able to...


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Nat said:


> I was wondering if anyone would bring up hiking. I find it interesting (and maybe hypocritical) that people say that using an ebike is cheating because it makes things easier when the bicycle is a contraption that makes foot travel faster and easier. Most of the arguments against having a motor can be applied to using a bike spoken by someone who is on foot.


Or both hiking and traditional bike riding are inherently limited to your human powered efforts and not the boundaries of a motor. Pullies (mechanical advantage) vs. a motor.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

Carl Mega said:


> Let's say I disagree and have a different experienced opinion on how net speed increase cause conflicts. Related rates about approach times between climbing speed and descending speeds in a collision scenario - tells you all you need.
> 
> But this thread is neither the time or place. I'd leave this out of it.


You were complaining about hikers, correct? Are you not anymore? Changing the argument? I bet, if you were to ask the hikers that had run ins with a biker/ebiker, it was a downhill issue and not a climbing issue.


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## rdawson808 (Oct 19, 2015)

OP could have just asked people to brag as much possible and **** on everyone else who isn't like them. So tiring.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

mtbbiker said:


> You were complaining about hikers, correct? Are you not anymore? Changing the argument? I bet, if you were to ask the hikers that had run ins with a biker/ebiker, it was a downhill issue and not a climbing issue.


I was "complaining" that people have discounted Hiker's opinions in our public comment meetings because "they never rode an eBike". Basically, the ol' "you never rode one so shut up" argument that pops up time to time - not logical line of thinking.

You can 'bet' all you want. Yes, downhill is a troublespot. But so has flat, fast/open terrain, or pinch points....crowding, jockeying. etc. It isn't singular.

Again - not this thread.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

fc, you really ought to think about starting a site dedicated to powered travel or so-called ebikes. That way, devotees could get their preferred content unabated and MTBR could go back to being a site about bicycles for Luddites without these futile fukking debates supplanting useful content every day in New.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Carl Mega said:


> Let's say I disagree and have a different experienced opinion on how net speed increase cause conflicts. Related rates about approach times between climbing speed and descending speeds in a collision scenario - tells you all you need.
> 
> But this thread is neither the time or place. I'd leave this out of it.


Right on. I'm impressed with how civil this post has been, 150 replies in. It's a departure from the E threads in the last 10 years on this site. 

So hats off to all. Keep it civil still and keep the ideologies out.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

She&I said:


> fc, you really ought to think about starting a site dedicated to powered travel or so-called ebikes. That way, devotees could get their preferred content unabated and MTBR could go back to being a site about bicycles for Luddites without these futile fukking debates supplanting useful content every day in New.


Thought long and hard about that but in the end, creating another site/brand on ebikes is like creating another bike shop like E-Jenson USA. It's very hard and expensive to do. And over the years, they merge anyway and E just becomes a category of the sport and a lot of people learn, try, and cross over, or not.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

Carl Mega said:


> I was "complaining" that people have discounted Hiker's opinions in our public comment meetings because "they never rode an eBike". Basically, the ol' "you never rode one so shut up" argument that pops up time to time - not logical line of thinking.
> 
> You can 'bet' all you want. Yes, downhill is a troublespot. But so has flat, fast/open terrain, or pinch points....crowding, jockeying. etc. It isn't singular.
> 
> Again - not this thread.


I think the bigger issue in most places since Covid or at least around my area is overuse from all the trail user groups. Wen this happens, no matter what, people are going to have some issues.


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

Ailuropoda said:


> It's not cycling. It's motor cycling. It's cool. I don't even mind seeing eBikes on the trail. I've never ridden a motorcycle either but I'm pretty sure it's not where my recreational interests lie. I don't hate motorcyclists, however.


Nope. It's cycling in every sense of the word. Still need all the skill set of non-powered cycling with a bit more ability to air it out. Still need to pedal up and down. If you think it's motor cycling you truly haven't spent time off road on an e-bike. It really isn't much different at all aside from some assist on the climbs.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Carl Mega said:


> Or both hiking and traditional bike riding are inherently limited to your human powered efforts and not the boundaries of a motor. Pullies (mechanical advantage) vs. a motor.


Pulleys and levers are an advantage all the same.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

XterraMike said:


> Age 59 and hopefully never succumb to the Vespa. My 82 year old dad recently bought a new Santa Cruz 5150 so if he can ride a real bike, nearly every one should be able to...


“Whoosh!”
The sound of you missing the point entirely.
=sParty


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Nat said:


> Pulleys and levers are an advantage all the same.


Heh. Despite my typo I got your point. Don't get me started on that friction & momentum aid, the wheel.

FWIW, I don't compare hiking/running efforts to cycling either. There's a difference. Sort of like here.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

53 years old. No e-bike. No plans to ever ride an e-bike. No friends that ride e-bikes. I started riding a SS hardtail at the end of 2021 which is the anti-e-bike! 🤓


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

XterraMike said:


> My 82 year old dad recently bought a new Santa Cruz 5150 so if he can ride a real bike, nearly every one should be able to...


Just like every mountain biker should be able to hike instead. 

But maybe that's simply not what they feel like doing. 

Yup, amazing but true.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

vikb said:


> 53 years old. No e-bike. No plans to ever ride an e-bike. No friends that ride e-bikes. I started riding a SS hardtail at the end of 2021 which is the anti-e-bike! 🤓


Singlespeed... I discovered that 15 years ago. I built 5 beautiful machines and for 5 years, singlespeed is ALL that I did. Then it tapered off and it is a good memory.

Back then all we talked about was gear ratio. And as I passed folks on a climb, folks would always check out my drivetrain and bow to me. Now we talked WH. And folks still check out my drivetrain as I pass but they have another reaction.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

D. Inoobinati said:


> What's your point? That you can be near death and drive your scooter through the woods?


Your vitriol toward emtbs is beyond tired...


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## Hippo04 (Sep 17, 2009)

50 here and been riding emtbs for the last seven years. Not because of age, fittness or ability, it's just more fun to me. I also ride lift assisted dh, so all my mtbing is assisted.

I do have couple of unassisted commuter/city bikes which I do enjoy riding.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

PS mtb said:


> Your vitriol toward emtbs is beyond tired...


One trick ponies tend to be that way.


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## rtonthat (11 mo ago)

Nat said:


> More than one poster has stated that having a motor would defeat the purpose of bicycling. A corollary question is, “What’s the purpose of bicycling?” It looks like some of you are assuming that everyone else is doing it for the same reason as you.


The guys I know that ride emtbs do it for….get this, fun. Dafuq?

They are gym rats like me and get their exercise elsewhere. The ebike rage on this forum does not represent what I see/hear on the trails. Actually the whole bickering/condescending tone I see on this forum is not consistent with what I see/hear when I ride. Weird. I like the real world mtb community much more. Something about the anonymity of forums turn people into jerks. Im starting to see why this site doesnt get many new members….


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## Xlr8n (Apr 29, 2010)

vikb said:


> 53 years old. No e-bike. No plans to ever ride an e-bike. No friends that ride e-bikes. I started riding a SS hardtail at the end of 2021 which is the anti-e-bike! 🤓


I'm 54, about to turn 55 and could have posted the exact same thing when I was 53. No e-bike then. No plan for one. None of my friends had one. Have been riding some SS's as well my whole life off and on, as well as XC, and full on enduro. 

...Then I rode an e-bike last summer a couple times and decided it was a flipping riot. Many of my friends did as well. Now I own one of those too as do many of my riding group. So I get to ride many types of bikes plus I'm now having more fun while doing it! 

Not knocking your post, just struck me as how things can abruptly look different in a very short span of time. It isn't ALL e-bike or NO e-bike. It's just another toy in the quiver.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

I want to be badass so I’m thinking about getting a singlespeed ebike.

Waddya think?
=sParty


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

I wouldn't be surprised if ebikes are half the riders you see on the trails in the next 5 years. It sure is tending that way in the SF bay area


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Sparticus said:


> I want to be badass so I’m thinking about getting a singlespeed ebike.
> 
> Waddya think?
> =sParty


The only singlespeeds that will actually make you cool are BMX bikes.

Fight me.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

Sparticus said:


> I want to be badass so I’m thinking about getting a singlespeed ebike.
> 
> Waddya think?
> =sParty


Comment removed


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

rtonthat said:


> The guys I know that ride emtbs do it for….get this, fun. Dafuq?


That's the best reason, IMO. That's why I want one. I make no excuses about having physical diabilities or whatever.


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## QuickSilverZ (Oct 23, 2011)

zorg said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if ebikes are half the riders you see on the trails in the next 5 years. It sure is tending that way in the SF bay area


I would say that we are already at that point in Southern California... Feels like every ride now that I get stuck behind them on the downhill and have to pull off to give them time while they are meandering down the trail.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

QuickSilverZ said:


> I would say that we are already at that point in Southern California... Feels like every ride now that I get stuck behind them on the downhill and have to pull off to give them time while they are meandering down the trail.


HAHA. That's exactly what has happened to me a couple of times lately. Hilarious. Fly past me on the uphill, only to get caught on the DH.... and won't pull off for me. So I stop.


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## rtonthat (11 mo ago)

Nat said:


> That's the best reason, IMO. That's why I want one. I make no excuses about having physical diabilities or whatever.


Yep. They have a blast doing multiple runs while im climbing. Doesnt bother me any because Im not much of a talker on the climbs anyways. Their riding style hasnt changed from a pedal bike to an ebike. They arent all of a sudden destroying trails or mowing hikers down any more they used to! I think a big part of the problem (or perceived problem) is just more, new, riders on the trails. You will always have a portion of people that dont care for others or their environment. More riders = more problems. I can see myself with an emtb later but for now, Im really enjoying the grind. Less leg days needed at the gym!


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

d365 said:


> HAHA. That's exactly what has happened to me a couple of times lately. Hilarious. Fly past me on the uphill, only to get caught on the DH.... and won't pull off for me. So I stop.


A fast DH rider will be fast on anything going down and a slow DH rider will be slow on any bike as well. Speaking from experience, I'm just as average on my ebike as I am on my MTB going downhill. On twisty bits, I'm a tad slower due to the additional weight, but not meaningfully so.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

d365 said:


> HAHA. That's exactly what has happened to me a couple of times lately. Hilarious. Fly past me on the uphill, only to get caught on the DH.... and won't pull off for me. So I stop.


That happens to me with people on regular mountain bikes.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

zorg said:


> A fast DH rider will be fast on anything going down and a slow DH rider will be slow on any bike as well.


Of course, only now every e-noob is an olympic athlete on the climb.


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## kpdemello (May 3, 2010)

I hate motorized bikes on any mountain bike trails. Dirt bike, quad, ebike... all the same in my book. There's something about being under my own power and not having to worry about running out of fuel/battery. Adding a motor changes it to something else that just feels too cheap.

I'm not saying ebikes shouldn't exist, but if they all miraculously self-destructed one night, I wouldn't shed any tears.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

kpdemello said:


> I hate motorized bikes on any mountain bike trails. Dirt bike, quad, ebike... all the same in my book.


If they're allowed on the trail then wouldn't it be a multi-use trail and not a mountain bike trail? If they're poaching then that's different.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

d365 said:


> Of course, only now every e-noob is an olympic athlete on the climb.


Fire road only. I doubt a noob whether on an ebike or regular bike will be able to go around switch backs or other trail obstacles on single track. I think people give ebike power way too much credit. I ride where a lot of High School XC teams train, I've been passed several times by these kids while in Trail mode.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

mtbbiker said:


> Fire road only. I doubt a noob whether on an ebike or regular bike will be able to go around switch backs or other trail obstacles on single track.


Yeah. OK. Riggghhhhttttt.


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

d365 said:


> Yeah. OK. Riggghhhhttttt.


Having a motor doesn’t make a rider sudden have mad skills. Did you forget when you were a noob or did you have mad skills and cleared everything? 

You are giving the motor way too much credit! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

mtbbiker said:


> Having a motor doesn’t make a rider sudden have mad skills. Did you forget when you were a noob or did you have mad skills and cleared everything?
> 
> You are giving the motor way too much credit!
> 
> ...


Yup.

This is exactly why skill tends to trump fitness on DH/tech.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

At least people riding emtb's aren't using the chairlifts or truck shuttles...Oops, different sport...not !


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

mtbbiker said:


> Having a motor doesn’t make a rider sudden have mad skills. Did you forget when you were a noob or did you have mad skills and cleared everything?
> 
> You are giving the motor way too much credit!
> 
> ...




Maybe he was suggesting that all climbs don't require technical skills. I would say that most climbs in my area don't and having an extra few hundred watts on hand is a huge advantage for anyone.

Nothing wrong with that, just saying it is what it is.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Nat said:


> That's the best reason, IMO. That's why I want one. I make no excuses about having physical diabilities or whatever.


To me, this is the preferable honesty. No equivalencies, no comparisons, no justification, no half-truths, no excuses.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

QuickSilverZ said:


> I would say that we are already at that point in Southern California... Feels like every ride now that I get stuck behind them on the downhill and have to pull off to give them time while they are meandering down the trail.


That's the gravel riders around here!

In the old days. singlespeeders... like me.


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## Skooks (Dec 24, 2008)

Been riding mountain bikes for the last 36 years or so. I've probably gone through 15 mountain bikes, and none of them have been motorized. No interest in e-MTB's and no plans to get one any time soon. My wife has rented them occasionally, and it makes riding together a lot more enjoyable. I recently built up an e-commuter for riding to work and back. It's fast and fun, but in no way comparable in terms of exercise. I have to limit myself to riding it only a couple times per week or else I will definitely loose my fitness.


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## Gman7 (Jul 11, 2008)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Thank you for the share. What area do live in? The growth is quite regional and some areas are adopting earlier than others. I'm seeing very similar adoption numbers to you and I'm in the Bay Area, Northern CA.


I live in the Charlotte NC metro region, northern burbs. I am about 90 min away from really great riding in Pisgah near Asheville, less than that if I hit Kitsuma or Wilson’s Ridge. Seeing the same trends play out when I go to the mountains. I also have extensive product management and NPD experience, which provides some insight into disruptive technology and mature markets.


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## woodway (Dec 27, 2005)

61. No e-bikes and no plans for e-bikes. Currently I own 1 MTB, a Ti cross-bike that I use for office commuting and road rides, and a steel cross bike that I put studded tires on for winter and gravel tires on for summer. Between my three bikes I manage 5-6K miles per year. No health issues.

I think e-bikes are great. They get a whole bunch of people onto bikes that otherwise would not be. I get passed by ebikes on my office commute almost every day. They are not for me, but I still don't understand the animosity towards them.

Requisite photo. Of my bike of course.


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## ElTortoise (Jul 27, 2015)

I'll be hitting the 6-oh this year. I've seen some pretty sweet looking e-bikes out there but I'm of the mind and attitude that as long as I'm still able-bodied enough to pedal a bike, I'm going to pedal a bike. If an injury or health condition force my hand and an e-bike is what will keep me riding, I'll seriously entertain the idea at that time.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Xlr8n said:


> Nope. It's cycling in every sense of the word. Still need all the skill set of non-powered cycling with a bit more ability to air it out. Still need to pedal up and down. If you think it's motor cycling you truly haven't spent time off road on an e-bike. It really isn't much different at all aside from some assist on the climbs.



I get that some people pedal. But every eBiker I've seen going uphill either weren't pedaling or doing so in a desultory manner. They're hearts weren't into it. I know these things are limited to 200 watts but that's actually a lot of power for a "bicycle." I put out about 250 watts going up a steep, gnarly trail. the leftover 50 watts is trivial. That's my power output going downhill. As for skill, take a rocky climb up a steep pitch. Speed is important here. The difference between stopping suddenly on a ledge or clearing it besides bike handling is a little extra speed or power. The motor decreases the required skill significantly. In fact, speed can cover a multitude of sins on a full-suspension bike. Mo' speed, less skill all other things being equal.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

zorg said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if ebikes are half the riders you see on the trails in the next 5 years. It sure is tending that way in the SF bay area


And 80 percent of the skilled riders, like in Europe.

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Ahh, the whole point of this thread is to understand the preferences of the over 50 crowd, Yeah or Nay.
> 
> Obviously ebike isn't just for over 50. But there are age related factors that make it very relevant to some.
> 
> fc


Well see, here's the thing. I'm sick of e-bikes being thrown in my face by media and marketers. I'm not interested in the things, I don't want one, I don't care about them. Bicycles are human powered, full stop. Moving under my own power is a fundamental part of the enjoyment and experience I get from riding. Sure, I'm slower and don't ride as long or as far as I used to, but I'd rather go 10 miles under my own power than 20 with a boost. When you add a motor to a bicycle it becomes something else and no amount of BS about whether it is throttle or pedal assist or what ever is going to change that. If you want to talk about the things, do it in your safe space in the E-bike forum. You've made it clear that opposing opinions are unwelcome there and I try to respect that. But keep it out of the forums where actual cyclists want to discuss real bicycles. Please.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

SteveF said:


> Well see, here's the thing. I'm sick of e-bikes being thrown in my face by media and marketers. I'm not interested in the things, I don't want one, I don't care about them. Bicycles are human powered, full stop. Moving under my own power is a fundamental part of the enjoyment and experience I get from riding. Sure, I'm slower and don't ride as long or as far as I used to, but I'd rather go 10 miles under my own power than 20 with a boost. When you add a motor to a bicycle it becomes something else and no amount of BS about whether it is throttle or pedal assist or what ever is going to change that. If you want to talk about the things, do it in your safe space in the E-bike forum. You've made it clear that opposing opinions are unwelcome there and I try to respect that. But keep it out of the forums where actual cyclists want to discuss real bicycles. Please.


Really?
Are you able to read thread titles?
Choose between titles you want to open and those you don't?
C'mon. Just choose not to open this thread or any similar threads.
They're not hard to spot.
Life is hard; we each have to make our own way.
=sParty


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

SteveF said:


> Well see, here's the thing. I'm sick of e-bikes being thrown in my face by media and marketers. I'm not interested in the things, I don't want one, I don't care about them. Bicycles are human powered, full stop. Moving under my own power is a fundamental part of the enjoyment and experience I get from riding. Sure, I'm slower and don't ride as long or as far as I used to, but I'd rather go 10 miles under my own power than 20 with a boost. When you add a motor to a bicycle it becomes something else and no amount of BS about whether it is throttle or pedal assist or what ever is going to change that. If you want to talk about the things, do it in your safe space in the E-bike forum. You've made it clear that opposing opinions are unwelcome there and I try to respect that. But keep it out of the forums where actual cyclists want to discuss real bicycles. Please.


That was awfully dramatic.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

Nat said:


> That was awfully dramatic.


Not sure if he likes emtb or not...


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## kosmo (Oct 27, 2004)

0 of 7 at age 63.

Was looking hard at an e-bike, but more as a replacement for my "real" dirt bike.

Moved to a less climby region, and no longer planning an e-bike anytime soon.


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Singlespeed... I discovered that 15 years ago. I built 5 beautiful machines and for 5 years, singlespeed is ALL that I did. Then it tapered off and it is a good memory.
> 
> Back then all we talked about was gear ratio. And as I passed folks on a climb, folks would always check out my drivetrain and bow to me. Now we talked WH. And folks still check out my drivetrain as I pass but they have another reaction.
> 
> ...


That's quite the drastic flip, going from single speeding, especially rigid SS to assisted pedaling... seems like a hugely opposite mindsets? I mean singlespeeding is fun, I've dabbled, but it's kind of masochistic if you got real hills to climb and beyond any long term commitment I could make to it! I guess in a way someone going from SS to gears is kind of like someone going from gears to assisted?

Do they make single speed e-bikes? 😂


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

SteveF said:


> . Bicycles are human powered, full stop.


No ****. That's why they call these things e-bikes instead.

E-biking is a different sport. Adding the motor makes this so. 

If everyone would stop trying to conflate it with normal cycling, on both 'sides', much of the opposition would go away.

E-bikers simply need to own that they are a new and distinct user group, and the motor creates a fundamental difference.
Many do, but many don't and for some reason want to pretend it's the same thing, while at the same time admitting it's obviously not. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Stop pretending your motor isn't a motor, if for no other reason than to help shut the cycling purist types up.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Nat said:


> That was awfully dramatic.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

slapheadmofo said:


> No ****. That's why they call these things e-bikes instead.
> 
> E-biking is a different sport. Adding the motor makes this so.
> 
> ...


Quoting this for emphasis.
=sParty


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

slapheadmofo said:


> No ****. That's why they call these things e-bikes instead.
> 
> E-biking is a different sport. Adding the motor makes this so.
> 
> ...


Well-stated.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

stiingya said:


> That's quite the drastic flip, going from single speeding, especially rigid SS to assisted pedaling... seems like a hugely opposite mindsets? I mean singlespeeding is fun, I've dabbled, but it's kind of masochistic if you got real hills to climb and beyond any long term commitment I could make to it! I guess in a way someone going from SS to gears is kind of like someone going from gears to assisted?
> 
> Do they make single speed e-bikes? 😂


Yes, it is a big change. from no-frills to all-frills. I'm obsessive though about all riding types I try so I go deep into every type of riding. The good news is emtb is rapidly improving every year so the experience now is really good. Very hard to get the good bikes though and very expensive at the moment.

Singlespeeding was good 15 years ago since the gearing (3x8) generally sucked. The shocks were marginal and the frame suspension designs were a work in progress. I just got on my Retrotec singlespeed cruiser and flew!










My body transformed since every bike ride was an interval workout. My trail selections became more limited as I would only ride trails where I could fly and maintain momentum. (aka, no 2000 foot 20% climbs). But everyone stroked my ego as they checked out my drivetrain as I flew by them on a climb.

These days, emtbs enable a lot of options for me. And I have to test them anyway. The 1.5 hour ride from my house is devastatingly efficient and fun. I'm not forced to crush myself so it's motivating to go out daily. And then I'll max out my lungs and legs if I have it in me.

As I pass riders, they look at my drivetrain and express disgust sometimes. So I make sure we're conversing beforehand.... And I turn off my motor as I pass them. 








My riding options are vast now and I've even gotten good at descending fire road!!! 

The bikes above are from Scor. My favorite emtb at the moment is the Orbea Rise H15.

Oh, singlespeed ebike.... I have one of those! I'll take a photo later.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Francis Cebedo said:


> View attachment 1975355


Nice lawn.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Nat said:


> Nice lawn.


It's very California now. Front lawn too!!!

You know this back lawn used to be a pump track, Rrrrrright?


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Frankly, if I could afford it I would own an eBike (like an Orbea Rise) and keep my Guerilla Gravity Smash. Just ride em both. But I'm too cheap right now to have both $7000+ bikes depreciating in my garage. I'm still dreaming of the day a manufacturer like Orbea creates a good looking eBike where the motor and battery can be pulled out 'as needed' to convert to a regular MTB. Then on the days you will be doing a lot of climbing (Like Kanuga bike park here in NC) pop the motor and battery in. To me that would be a very cool one bike solution.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

DirtDiggler said:


> Frankly, if I could afford it I would own an eBike (like an Orbea Rise) and keep my Guerilla Gravity Smash. Just ride em both. But I'm too cheap right now to have both $7000+ bikes depreciating in my garage. I'm still dreaming of the day a manufacturer like Orbea makes a good looking eBike where the motor and battery can be pulled out 'as needed' to convert to a regular MTB. Then on the days you will be doing a lot of climbing (Like Kanuga bike park here in NC) pop the motor and battery in. To me that would be a very cool one bike solution.


That would be very cool indeed!
=sParty


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## Retire (Jan 11, 2020)

I guess my ratio is 1:3 Trek Antelope from the 80s, Kona hei hei and a Trek Rail.
I have to tell you going from the Antelope to the Kona was mind blowing with all of the technology improvements. I was doomed to buy it after a few minutes in the saddle at the dealers parking lot!

they all have their place. No regrets.


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## Fltrail (Jan 5, 2007)

No ebike or desire to own one. I ride for fun and fitness. If I wanted to have fun on two wheels with a motor, I’d just ride a motorcycle!
Could buy a used one cheaper then a ebike too!


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

Fltrail said:


> No ebike or desire to own one. I ride for fun and fitness. If I wanted to have fun on two wheels with a motor, I’d just ride a motorcycle!
> Could buy a used one cheaper then a ebike too!


A motorcycle is a terrific option!
What if I told you what's even better is one (or more) of each? 
=sParty


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

Fltrail said:


> No ebike or desire to own one. I ride for fun and fitness. If I wanted to have fun on two wheels with a motor, I’d just ride a motorcycle!
> Could buy a used one cheaper then a ebike too!


You're not kidding about prices. Last motor bike I bought was a klr 650 for 5.5k with barely any miles on it. It would do 100mph on the hwy, and handle pretty darn technical jeep roads and some single track. Think I got over 60mpg as a commuter too. Prices for e bikes and mountain bikes for that matter aren't about getting what you get for the money, it's about what us suckers will pay. I'll let someone else bend over and take it hard up the rear on these e bike prices.


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Fltrail said:


> No ebike or desire to own one. I ride for fun and fitness. If I wanted to have fun on two wheels with a motor, I’d just ride a motorcycle!
> Could buy a used one cheaper then a ebike too!


I own MTBs, eMTBs, and Motos.
All different types of fun and all a hoot!

Cheers! 🍻


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Sparticus said:


> A motorcycle is a terrific option!
> What if I told you what's even better is one (or more) of each?
> =sParty


If we're really comparing them - motorcycles are heavy, around 185#'s for a KX125. They're much louder and frankly higher risk depending on where you ride. Depending on where you live there might not be OTV trails close by either. You also need a trailer or a truck to transport them since they're too heavy for a bike rack. They're hella fun but the experience is very different. eBikes are lighter (40-65#'s), much quieter and you can decide if you want to get some cardio or not at the push of a button. It's cute when people compare eBikes to full dirt bikes. It's really insulting to motorcycles! They're both fun but one moves using a throttle and the other moves by pedaling.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

DirtDiggler said:


> one moves using a throttle and the other moves by pedaling.


Ruh roh raggy. Cue the pedantic gymnastics!


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

mlx john said:


> Ruh roh raggy. Cue the pedantic gymnastics!




Aside from that and missing the point, you can also definitely put motos on a hitch rack.


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## kosmo (Oct 27, 2004)

Fltrail said:


> If I wanted to have fun on two wheels with a motor, I’d just ride a motorcycle!
> Could buy a used one cheaper then a ebike too!


Sadly, for many, used motorcycle prices are also pretty crazy these days.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> Aside from that and missing the point, you can also definitely put motos on a hitch rack.


The 'point' was intentionally ignored in response to the generic comment made about eBike's being similar to motorcycles.  And to my previous response, you will need a 'truck' with a hitch rated for that massive rack in the image to carry at least 200#'s +. It's a nice rack but it's not happening on a car hitch.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

DirtDiggler said:


> If we're really comparing them - motorcycles are heavy, around 185#'s for a KX125. They're much louder and frankly higher risk depending on where you ride. Depending on where you live there might not be OTV trails close by either. You also need a trailer or a truck to transport them since they're too heavy for a bike rack. They're hella fun but the experience is very different. eBikes are lighter (40-65#'s), much quieter and you can decide if you want to get some cardio or not at the push of a button. It's cute when people compare eBikes to full dirt bikes. It's really insulting to motorcycles! They're both fun but one moves using a throttle and the other moves by pedaling.


You quoted me when replying so I assume you believe you're talking to me.
Telling me something I didn't know when in fact I do know since I own an off-road motorcycle.
I don't see any negatives within the points you stated.
I've been riding motos off-road since 1990. My expectations about noise, weight, cardio, etc. are in the right place.

Except that you're wrong about needing a truck or trailer, both in your post above and in this post:


DirtDiggler said:


> The 'point' was intentionally ignored in response to the generic comment made about eBike's being similar to motorcycles.  And to my previous response, you will need a 'truck' with a hitch rated for that massive rack in the image to carry at least 200#'s +. It's a nice rack but it's not happening on a car hitch.


I have a hydraulic hitch rack (bottle jack type) for my dirt bike that I mount to the hitch on my van. It's a very cool way to transport the moto.
=sParty


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

And the thread has jumped the shark


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

DirtDiggler said:


> you will need a 'truck' with a hitch rated for that massive rack in the image to carry at least 200#'s +. It's a nice rack but it's not happening on a car hitch.


Not true (and your number is way off btw).

Though that double rack is an extra large example and most carry single bikes, these can easily be handled by any vehicle that will accept a Class III hitch (2" receiver, 600lb TW)

That includes almost all minivans, crossovers and smaller SUVs, as well as a fair number of other non-compact vehicles. You can put a Class III on an Outback or a Legacy for example. See it at the track all the time.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

zorg said:


> And the thread has jumped the shark


Are you going to talk to the manager?


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> Not true (and your number is way off btw).
> 
> Though that double rack is an extra large example and most carry single bikes, these can easily be handled by any vehicle that will accept a Class III hitch (2" receiver, 600lb TW)
> 
> That includes almost all minivans, crossovers and smaller SUVs, as well as a fair number of other non-compact vehicles. You can put a Class III on an Outback or a Legacy for example. See it at the track all the time.



Good to know! I stand corrected. I didn't realize you can put 600#'s on the back of an outback. I'm surprised the frame can withstand that much weight and leverage.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

zorg said:


> And the thread has jumped the shark


Just like all eBike threads do.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

DirtDiggler said:


> Good to know! I stand corrected. I didn't realize you can put 600#'s on the back of an outback. I'm surprised the frame can withstand that much weight and leverage.


I personally probably wouldn't, but that's what Class3 / 2" receivers max out at so... 🤷‍♂️ 

But for a single dirt bike and rack, you're looking at less than half of that. 
I mean, weight wise, even a Class 2 / 1.25" receiver is rated at 350lbs TW, but I wouldn't push that myself.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

I tried it on my Outback once.
1996 Honda XR400 weighs at least 260#
Hydraulic lift rack probably weighs 50#.
Sag City.
I could drive it… but I wouldn’t. 
=sParty


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Sparticus said:


> I tried it on my Outback once.
> 1996 Honda XR400 weighs at least 260#
> Hydraulic lift rack probably weighs 50#.
> Sag City.
> ...


Need to counterweight the front.
More donuts.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

Maybe invest in air lift suspension…


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## woodway (Dec 27, 2005)

slapheadmofo said:


> Though that double rack is an extra large example and most carry single bikes, these can easily be handled by any vehicle that will accept a Class III hitch (2" receiver, 600lb TW)


Before anyone runs out and drops 600 pounds on their Outback hitch, remember it's not just the hitch rating, it's the combination of the hitch and what the vehicle frame/suspension/tires are rated for. My 2020 F150 for example has a 2" receiver but the max tongue weight on the receiver is 500lbs (you need to weight distribution hitch to go higher). If you look at the Subaru Outback, the max tongue weight is 270 lbs. Plenty enough to carry a couple of e-bikes!


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

woodway said:


> ... If you look at the Subaru Outback, the max tongue weight is 270 lbs. Plenty enough to carry a couple of e-bikes!


I use mine for this as well as for mountain bikes. 
Added a custom seat on it, too.









=sParty


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## rtonthat (11 mo ago)

Whoa that is sweet! I can see how useful that seat would be before and after the ride. A beverage holder would be icing on top.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

rtonthat said:


> Whoa that is sweet! I can see how useful that seat would be before and after the ride. A beverage holder would be icing on top.


I use it mostly for changing shoes before / after rides. After the photo above was taken, I added SeaDek to the diamondplate seat surface in order to make it more comfortable. 
My GF teases me because it cost about $125 all together but I consider the benefit well worth the price.  Use it every time I ride.
=sParty


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Sparticus said:


> I use mine for this as well as for mountain bikes.
> Added a custom seat on it, too.
> View attachment 1975753
> 
> ...


This is pretty cool!!! Tailgate party for one!. Or maybe for two with a lap dance


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## Calsun (May 12, 2021)

The hitch is going to be the weakest point and this is the restrictions of having a vehicle without a frame but a unibody construction instead. Compare a Toyota 4Runner with a Toyota Highlander with the latter using the same unibody as the Toyota sedans and minivans. 

Most racks are not rated for use on an RV or truck where more of the road shock gets to the rack. Most vehicle mounted as compared to hitch mounted are OK for two mountain bikes but not for two e-bikes. 

My wife and I have Specialized Turbo Creo SL road bikes that are Class III and at 27 lbs ride like a regular road bike. The advantage with these bikes is when encountering a strong wind we do not need to slow our pace as we can get a boost from the motor. We get a much better workout with these bikes than we would with trail bikes in our area. If we live in the Lake Tahoe area or in similar mountainous terrain it would be quite different. We have limited trails and they are heavily used on the weekends which is not particularly fun. I do envy people that live in more rural areas with many miles of dirt or gravel roads and trails nearby.


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## woodway (Dec 27, 2005)

Calsun said:


> The hitch is going to be the weakest point and this is the restrictions of having a vehicle without a frame but a unibody construction instead. Compare a Toyota 4Runner with a Toyota Highlander with the latter using the same unibody as the Toyota sedans and minivans.


I have a 2014 Highlander XLE. It's hitch weight carrying capacity is 500lbs, same as my F150. Go figure. Of course the F150's overall towing capacity is nearly 3x the Highlander  

My Thule tray rack is rated at 160lbs, so if I had two ebikes, I would feel OK about dropping them on the trays. But not the motorcycles


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

Rode in Santa Cruz, CA yesterday, and it looked at least 1/4 of all riders were on ebikes. I would bet that the number will climb to over half in the next few years.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

zorg said:


> Rode in Santa Cruz, CA yesterday, and it looked at least 1/4 of all riders were on ebikes. I would bet that the number will climb to over half in the next few years.



I predicted that number a few years back on this site and people mocked me. Well who's laughing now 🙃


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

J.B. Weld said:


> I predicted that number a few years back on this site and people mocked me. Well who's laughing now 🙃


The only “prediction” that matters is the one about you and yours, what other people think will matter only to them.

I’d like to think that I won’t ever need or want an ebike, that’s my plan and it’s one I’m going to stick to as best I can.

A few years ago I was out riding Ash to King, it’s a fairly rigorous climb from either direction, but the technical climbing is north to south.

I’m out there riding from the north, solo and not in a hurry, after a bit I hear someone approaching from behind, so I let him by; it’s an older guy riding a pretty nice FS bike.

I started talking to him, pacing him to the top of the climb; another forty five minutes from that point. His name is Mike, he’s 75 yo and retired, he worked many years as a waiter at a resort, now he rides or skis everyday.

I’m pretty fit and twenty years his junior, and I had to work to pace him. This guy, Mike, I wanna be like him 👍

So you all enjoy your motor, it’s your thing not mine.

But please, don’t foist your propaganda and predictions on the rest of us, you won’t gain much traction but you may create animosity.

Just ride your bike and be satisfied.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> The only “prediction” that matters is the one about you and yours, what other people think will matter only to them.
> 
> I’d like to think that I won’t ever need or want an ebike, that’s my plan and it’s one I’m going to stick to as best I can.
> 
> ...







Interesting post but not sure why you quoted me 👀


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## rtonthat (11 mo ago)

Nurse Ben said:


> The only “prediction” that matters is the one about you and yours, what other people think will matter only to them.
> 
> I’d like to think that I won’t ever need or want an ebike, that’s my plan and it’s one I’m going to stick to as best I can.
> 
> ...


Why would making predictions for the sake of conversation on a forum create animosity? I genuinely dont understand.


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

rtonthat said:


> Why would making predictions for the sake of conversation on a forum create animosity? I genuinely dont understand.


Agreed. Seems fairly benign.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

Hey @Nurse Ben, you been hittin' the bottle again? 
=sParty


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

J.B. Weld said:


> I predicted that number a few years back on this site and people mocked me. Well who's laughing now 🙃


Did Wall-e predict it before you though?


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Ouch! Not the Wall 'E' image! 
First eBikes then META, and eventually this. Now it all makes sense! You just saved another person from becoming an eBiker. JK ; )

BTW, great movie. I use this movie reference with my kids whenever they get lazy or spend too much time on their tablets.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

stiingya said:


> Did Wall-e predict it before you though?
> 
> View attachment 1975909


They're just big-boned, in an effort to avoid being offensive to the soft and squishy folks among us.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

I’m big boned.

I think you know what I’m talkin’ about. 
=sParty


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

Sparticus said:


> I’m big boned.
> 
> I think you know what I’m talkin’ about.
> =sParty


Wall-e goes over the bone structure too...


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## eonflux (May 3, 2020)

*Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?*

No ebike, and not currently considering
I guess someday if I can't/won't ride an analog bike on the rides I want to do, could be getting an ebike
But a significant part of mountain biking for me is the work out, which an ebike undermines
*What's your next bike?*

Not sure what to get after my SB130
Would prefer something lighter; my SB130 is 29 lb, but previous S-Works Stump FSR was 27.5 lbs
Most of my riding is at Waterdog and Skeggs, so something more downcountry would be fine


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

E-bike ratio is 0:4

Not interested.


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

0:1. N E V E R. I will take up a new hobby if it ever comes to that


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

It IS a new hobby, fun as heck too !


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Sparticus said:


> I’m big boned.
> 
> I think you know what I’m talkin’ about.
> =sParty





maynard4130 said:


> 0:1. N E V E R. I will take up a new hobby if it ever comes to that


Never say never. Let's say your doctor suddenly finds that you have a condition where you heart valve could fail if you consistently hit 170-180BPM on a daily basis. Yet, you still need a certain mid-tier level of cardio to stay healthy and keep your BP down. Would just give up rolling on two wheels altogether and take up bowling? After riding for 30+ years I would definitely not want to hang it all up. If there is a tool out there that lets you achieve a more controlled amount of cardio and fitness, why not utilize it? Pride is one thing but health and genetic predispositions can shift your life quickly. I know there are a lot of eBikers that ride them for fun, but I'm also stoked eBikes are around to allow people with real health issues or disabilities to keep spinning and enjoying the trails.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

DirtDiggler said:


> Never say never. Let's say your doctor suddenly finds that you have a condition where you heart valve could fail if you consistently hit 170-180BPM on a daily basis. Yet, you still need a certain mid-tier level of cardio to stay healthy and keep your BP down. Would just give up rolling on two wheels altogether and take up bowling? After riding for 30+ years I would definitely not want to hang it all up. If there is a tool out there that lets you achieve a more controlled amount of cardio and fitness, why not utilize it? Pride is one thing but health and genetic predispositions can shift your life quickly. I know there are a lot of eBikers that ride them for fun, but I'm also stoked eBikes are around to allow people with real health issues or disabilities to keep spinning and enjoying the trails.


Well said


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

DirtDiggler said:


> Never say never. Let's say your doctor suddenly finds that you have a condition where you heart valve could fail if you consistently hit 170-180BPM on a daily basis. Yet, you still need a certain mid-tier level of cardio to stay healthy and keep your BP down. Would just give up rolling on two wheels altogether and take up bowling? After riding for 30+ years I would definitely not want to hang it all up. If there is a tool out there that lets you achieve a more controlled amount of cardio and fitness, why not utilize it? Pride is one thing but health and genetic predispositions can shift your life quickly. I know there are a lot of eBikers that ride them for fun, but I'm also stoked eBikes are around to allow people with real health issues or disabilities to keep spinning and enjoying the trails.




If I were unfortunate enough to find myself in this hypothetical situation I would seek flatter trails and fit my bike with easier gears.

There's nothing wrong with using an ebike instead if that's your thing but know that it's just one alternative of many. Another tool to achieve a controlled amount of cardio and fitness is a power meter. Using only heart rate is flawed because it lags, if you keep your power within a certain zone your heart rate will stay even and controlled.

Again, if ebikes get your juices flowing and can help control a dangerous heart rate condition and allow you to get good exercise that's great, buy one today! Still if I had such a condition I'd also get a power meter just to make sure I stayed in the correct zones. Also as mentioned I'd just gear down and keep it in zone 2 on a standard bike but that's just my preference.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

eonflux said:


> *Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?*
> 
> No ebike, and not currently considering
> I guess someday if I can't/won't ride an analog bike on the rides I want to do, could be getting an ebike
> ...


I used to work in Redwood City so Waterdog and Skeggs were my jam!!! Waterdog is small but tricky. Skeggs has been neutered down to be easy. My Blur is 22 lbs with new Vittoria tires and it may be time to take it Skeggs again. It's been a long while.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

DirtDiggler said:


> Never say never. Let's say your doctor suddenly finds that you have a condition where you heart valve could fail if you consistently hit 170-180BPM on a daily basis. Yet, you still need a certain mid-tier level of cardio to stay healthy and keep your BP down. Would just give up rolling on two wheels altogether and take up bowling? After riding for 30+ years I would definitely not want to hang it all up. If there is a tool out there that lets you achieve a more controlled amount of cardio and fitness, why not utilize it? Pride is one thing but health and genetic predispositions can shift your life quickly. I know there are a lot of eBikers that ride them for fun, but I'm also stoked eBikes are around to allow people with real health issues or disabilities to keep spinning and enjoying the trails.


Most of the ebikers I know said they would never ride one. Correction: "I'll never effin ride one, ever". Maybe 30 of them.  It's a foreign/alien abyss to most enthusiast mountain bikers. Now they're all in and most split time with the mtb. Some are old, some are young.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> I used to work in Redwood City so Waterdog and Skeggs were my jam!!! Waterdog is small but tricky. Skeggs has been neutered down to be easy. My *Blur* is 22 lbs with new Vittoria tires and it may be time to take it Skeggs again. It's been a long while.


Beautiful bike. I owned a few Blur xc's some time ago and loved them for racing and riding.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Crankout said:


> Beautiful bike. I owned a few Blur xc's some time ago and loved them for racing and riding.


The new one is a model of function of style and efficiency. "It makes me want to be a better rider" is my review.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

Francis Cebedo said:


> The new one is a model of function of style and efficiency. "It makes me want to be a better rider" is my review.
> 
> View attachment 1976089
> 
> View attachment 1976090


 So nice....enjoy!


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## Horseshoe (May 31, 2018)

As it stands 100% of my MTB riding in on a traditional bike, and 100% of my commuting/street riding is on an e-bike. That being said the one demo I took on a Turbo Levo was about the most fun I've ever had on two wheels and an e-mtb is definitely in my future. No way am I missing out on all the fun.


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## jhleech (May 2, 2012)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


1 of 7 is an e-Bike. I bought an Orbea Rise last year to help rehab a fractured kneecap. 95% of my rides last year were on the eBike This year, I expect the ratio to start around 50%, and likely will be under 20% by the end of the season. 59 yrs old. 310 lbs. e-Bike allowed me to ride longer rides, and actually get out on the same trails and distances I was able to ride before the injury. Without it, I would have been mostly relegated to paved trails.


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## dsjc (May 14, 2007)

53 and too many injuries to list over the 40+ years of riding moto and MTB, including catastrophic ones like broken neck and femur, but that's not why I got an ebike. My Turbo Levo sits between my KTM 250 and Transition Smuggler, they are all different experiences and all super fun in their own right. Each has a place and purpose. I was one of those who said "never" to ebikes, until I tried one ! And if it's fitness cheating you suspect, I can tell with all confidence that you can get just as much of a workout on the ebike, if you want to, you simply get more miles and downs. Whatever you ride, it needs to be done respectfully and in the right place and time otherwise our trails will close to all sports.


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## bikefoole (Mar 30, 2008)

Thank the mountaibike Gods for ebikes!


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## elder_mtber (Jan 13, 2004)

I'm over 75 and have had 3 low back fusion surgeries after my 60th birthday. I've grown so weak I can't ride some trail sections I rode OK only 2 or 3 years ago. Now I'm walking them, no fun at all. Actually makes me sad.

If there is a next bike it will have to be an e-mtb. I've been thinking about it and I want a bike/drive system that will help me over and through the big rocks. I'n thinking highly controllable and responsive assist. I don't want or need a super slack long travel downhill bomber. My current Trek Fuel EX 9.9 (130mm give or take) is a big enough bike for me.

I know I won't be able to consider myself a real mountain biker with the e-mtb, but maybe I'll be able to have fun riding again.


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## mtwitche (Mar 24, 2008)

70 years old and out of shape. Got my Trek Rail 9.7 in July and love it. Climbing things that I haven't been able to in a long time. Actually looking forward to the steep stuff again. Been riding for 40 years (since 1980) have owned quite a few bikes. First FS bike was a Pro-Flex. Recently sold my 2009 Trek Remedy, which, until now, was the best bike ever. The Rail is just the best bike I've ever had. Love the geometry and the suspension, plus, it has a motor! 
Currently own a Chinese e-bike, (similar to Rad Rover) that I bought for my wife. We had a chance to get her a Trek Powerfly FS (which she rode once and then fell and broke her ankle) and so the Chinese bike needs to go.


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## bennycanare (10 mo ago)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


Luna X1 Enduro
emtbs are not allowed in single tracks here in Ohio.

58 years old with two heart attacks. Doctor restricted me with cycling. Lost over 80 lbs riding an e-bike. Benn riding ebikes since 2016, had my last heart attack 2009.

My baby


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## markAA (Apr 2, 2021)

65 years old. Riding MTB since '97. Started on a fully rigid aluminum bike from REI. Gradually moved up to full suspension (current pedal bike = Pivot Mach 6). Also, I have had 2 ebikes - Intense Tazer, now Specialized Levo. As I aged, I found I needed more recovery between rides. When I rode only the pedal bike, I could ride maybe 3x per week. With the ebike, I can alternate and ride just about every day. Honestly, I really enjoy both. For me a pleasant suprise has been the fun of technical climbing on an ebike. What would have been a grind (or a walk) becomes an adventure. My observation: riding an ebike you can get tons of exercise; but it reduces the very top end of effort/HR. That lets you get back on the bike sooner without feeling wiped out.

End of September I had a total knee replacement (I'd been without a meniscus in that knee since a water skiiing accident in '78). Since then I've been riding ebike only. It turns out to be the ultimate rehab machine. I can modulate boost to get the level of effort I want. If I didn't have an ebike I wouldn't be back on the trails yet. Now I can put boost on high and ride with my buddies. 

Lord willing, I'll get back on the pedal bike in a few more months, and keep going for a few more years.


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

DirtDiggler said:


> Never say never. Let's say your doctor suddenly finds that you have a condition where you heart valve could fail if you consistently hit 170-180BPM on a daily basis. Yet, you still need a certain mid-tier level of cardio to stay healthy and keep your BP down. Would just give up rolling on two wheels altogether and take up bowling? After riding for 30+ years I would definitely not want to hang it all up. If there is a tool out there that lets you achieve a more controlled amount of cardio and fitness, why not utilize it? Pride is one thing but health and genetic predispositions can shift your life quickly. I know there are a lot of eBikers that ride them for fun, but I'm also stoked eBikes are around to allow people with real health issues or disabilities to keep spinning and enjoying the trails.


You’re right… I should never say never, but I honestly can’t see the point of biking with a motor personally. For ME it kind of defeats the purpose. I get my enjoyment out of the suffering on big climbs mostly. The downhill is just a way to get to the next climb. I do know that the day will probably come when I can no longer ride a bike. Perhaps I will have changed my tune by then, but I would probably just start hiking or swimming….


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

bennycanare said:


> Luna X1 Enduro
> emtbs are not allowed in single tracks here in Ohio.
> 
> 58 years old with two heart attacks. Doctor restricted me with cycling. Lost over 80 lbs riding an e-bike. Benn riding ebikes since 2016, had my last heart attack 2009.
> ...


Losing 80 pounds is very impressive eBike or not! Congrats!


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

mtwitche said:


> 70 years old and out of shape. Got my Trek Rail 9.7 in July and love it. Climbing things that I haven't been able to in a long time. Actually looking forward to the steep stuff again. Been riding for 40 years (since 1980) have owned quite a few bikes. First FS bike was a Pro-Flex. Recently sold my 2009 Trek Remedy, which, until now, was the best bike ever. The Rail is just the best bike I've ever had. Love the geometry and the suspension, plus, it has a motor!
> Currently own a Chinese e-bike, (similar to Rad Rover) that I bought for my wife. We had a chance to get her a Trek Powerfly FS (which she rode once and then fell and broke her ankle) and so the Chinese bike needs to go.


Inspiring share. Thank you. 

Yes, ride like you haven't done so in decades! Make new biking memories, not just rehashing only ones.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

maynard4130 said:


> You’re right… I should never say never, but I honestly can’t see the point of biking with a motor personally. For ME it kind of defeats the purpose. I get my enjoyment out of the suffering on big climbs mostly. The downhill is just a way to get to the next climb. I do know that the day will probably come when I can no longer ride a bike. Perhaps I will have changed my tune by then, but I would probably just start hiking or swimming….


If all you get from cycling is the suffering and the sense of accomplishment, then it is hard to get into an ebike.

But if you get fun, exploration, commute, adventure, then the emtb can help. The adventure bubble expands and one can see and explore 3x more with the same effort. The key is to exert the same heart rate and power output so you still get the suffering/accomplishment part. Not the easiest to do but definitely doable.


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## ajlevine (12 mo ago)

53 years old. Riding in the dirt since I was 5. Currently have 5 bikes, 1 eMTB (Levo SL). Doing roughly 50% eMTB. I try to ride at least 5 days a week.

Lots of steep hills directly out my front door. I ride my regular bikes when I am with other folks or want a strenuous workout (intervals or anaerobic work). I ride my eMTB when I want to have fun and when I want to keep my heart rate aerobic. I got the Levo SL because it rides like a regular bike and you have to actually work to get up hills.

I'm in very good shape, but riding my other bikes, I found I would frequently be overtrained and would not have a good aerobic base or adequate recovery. I think the balance of more long, lower intensity rides on the Levo SL and strenuous days on the traditional bikes has increased my fitness. The added mileage has also improved my technical handling skills. Plus, the eMTB rides are amazingly fun.

-Andy


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Francis Cebedo said:


> If all you get from cycling is the suffering and the sense of accomplishment, then it is hard to get into an ebike.
> 
> But if you get fun, exploration, commute, adventure, then the emtb can help. The adventure bubble expands and one can see and explore 3x more with the same effort. The key is to exert the same heart rate and power output so you still get the suffering/accomplishment part. Not the easiest to do but definitely doable.



I get both sides. Suffering, sense of accomplishment and fun, exploration, etc. All of these are things I love about cycling.

It's cool that people get so much enjoyment out of ebike rides and I wish them all the best. I see lots of people getting out on rides that I'm sure would probably stay home without the motor assist so for them it's a definite win.

For others (e.g. me) distance is irrelevant, especially when referring to seeing more. I definitely see and observe more when I'm going slower. My experience is kind of limited but so far trying to push myself on an ebike feels unnatural and unrewarding.

I'll never say never because I always reserve the right to change my mind but as of now they seem like 2 completely different deals and as previously mentioned I only have time for one obsession.


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## Maxeymum (Mar 2, 2017)

58 years old here. Had surgery to repair a couple of Meniscus tears about 3 years ago, so I thought, why not, an ebike might be good while I rehab. Anyways, I healed very quickly, doctor was quite surprised, and I kind of went on an ebiking kick for a while, but now I seem to enjoy my non-ebike MTB just as much if not more than the ebike. Could be because my ebike is a bit of a tank (Kona Remote 160) and the non-ebike is so much more snappy. I will say, however, on 90-100 degree days when I might've skipped a ride, I'll take the ebike no worries -- they're great for that kind of weather.

I also think pure stubborness prevents some people from trying the ebikes. They can be thought of as just another tool in the shed.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

ajlevine said:


> 53 years old. Riding in the dirt since I was 5. Currently have 5 bikes, 1 eMTB (Levo SL). Doing roughly 50% eMTB. I try to ride at least 5 days a week.
> 
> Lots of steep hills directly out my front door. I ride my regular bikes when I am with other folks or want a strenuous workout (intervals or anaerobic work). I ride my eMTB when I want to have fun and when I want to keep my heart rate aerobic. I got the Levo SL because it rides like a regular bike and you have to actually work to get up hills.
> 
> ...


Hear, hear! Great observations and I can totally relate.

I have the Levo SL and Kenevo SL. But now, I have the cheap, new Orbea Rise Aluminum. It is truly, truly a great bike. It has double the power of the SLs but it still has amazing range with its 540wh internal battery.


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

Lots of opinions! Glad everyone is free to pursue their varied desires. Not sure why it seems like an either-or thing… After 39 years associated with the US Army, we’ve been lucky enough to ride most mountain ranges around the world. So we have a stable of bikes - from hardtail single speeds to plush all mountain e-bikes. Regarding e-bikes – we use our trek Verve +3s to pull the dogs in a tail wagon around town. We use our Rail 9.8s for local singletrack trails. Enjoy alternating between the current pedal bikes (stumperjumper experts) and the current e-bikes (Trek Rails). At 62, I’m retired and very comfortable doing my thing. Photo per request.


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## squakmtn (Jun 12, 2009)

I have been riding MTB since '84 and have owned each evolution of bikes along the way. I'm 63 and after about 60 my capacity started to diminish, despite the same amount of weekly riding. I was getting so fatigued at the top of big climbs (2000' to 4000') that I was crashing on the descents and not having fun. I was nearing the point of quitting the sport when I test rode an EMTB, which led to purchasing a Specialized Turbo SL. After 6 months I sold my last pedal MTB (Yeti SB6) due to lack of use, the SL had taken over. Six years ago, I scoffed at the notion of ever owning an EMTB, but then the body aged...


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

Squakmtn – couldn’t agree more. E-bikes have erased 20 years from my life. At 62, I’m cutting laps like I’m 42. Wife and I are reinvigorated, and we ride a lot more than we did just a couple years ago.


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## marksrichards54 (12 mo ago)

I'm 68 6'0' and 170lbs...and have had 2 total hip replacements. My passion is strapless kitesurfing which is more pure than MTB for you purists out there... but that's my perspective... you do you but biking is a hobby for me... I used to play lots of competitive tennis, basketball, ultimate frisbee, and windsurfing... I did the road bike thing back in the mid '70's and then again in the mid 2000's.. cars, dogs, and cell phones drove me away from biking..when Covid hit I sold my 2011 Ti Lynskey road bike and bought a Salsa Timberjack. A 27.5 HT w/ 3.0" tires in the south during the summer will flat out kill ya... so at the advice of trail riders I bought a FS and loved every minute of it... except in the summer... then I rode an eBike... so I sold my Tallboy and decided to buy a Levo SL... I won't look back..game changer for me and I love pulling the Cat 2's and keeping up with them... I still get 85% of my workout on the SL beacuse I ride eco and trail modes mostly.... I just get around the trails faster and can put in more miles during the day and not have to recover the next day.. .. at 35Nm of torque it's on the low end of the power zone so I'm still pedaling my ass off... and I get **** from some of the analog wankers cuz I'm on an ebike, so the f$#k what..... i don't give a flying f$#k what you ride.. I'm having fun.....


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## bamdave (Mar 18, 2015)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


I'm 55, I’m fat- if that’s a limitation, I ride 99% of the time on an emtb on trails I cannot ride on an analog bike, 1% of the time I ride on an all carbon cross country on easy trails. I rode an analog bike for 7 years in the greater phoenix area and could only ride 40% of the trails because I ride for fun and I don’t have fun when I ride an analog bike on black diamond trails. 3.5 years ago I bought an emtb because I knew it would open up a lot more trails. I now can ride 95% of the trails in the area. I’m just having more fun on an emtb. Let the hate begin…..


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## milehi (Nov 2, 1997)

51 and I don't see an ebike in my future. I ride bikes because I love to ride bikes. From the threads on here, people have been saying you get more laps in. I don't ride lap trails (because there are none here and it sounds monotonous) but big long loops and long point to point rides.
ETA- Ebikes are only allowed on a few multi use trails here. There are offroad staging areas across the mountain and I don't want to ride the same trails, fire roads and forest service roads, where most ebiking is permitted, with dirt bikes and Jeeps. I already have a dirt bike and Jeep for those trails.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

bennycanare said:


> Luna X1 Enduro
> emtbs are not allowed in single tracks here in Ohio.
> 
> 58 years old with two heart attacks. Doctor restricted me with cycling. Lost over 80 lbs riding an e-bike. Benn riding ebikes since 2016, had my last heart attack 2009.
> ...


Way to go, man.
Keep on livin'. 
=sParty


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## Al Fong (Oct 20, 2021)

Blatant said:


> I try not to be too militant about stuff. I can safely say I hope to never need to ride an ebike. I’m not quite sure why we talk about electronics and bikes in the same sentence; they’re clearly not engaged in the same activities.
> 
> But, to be fair, I’ve seen a handful of folks riding them that seemed appropriate in my opinion: older riders, a military dude with a prosthesis, etc.


Please don't be so quick to judge by appearances. There is much that can't be seen, right? I was a roadie in my 20s and switched to mtb after a bad crash on tarmac, but my Marin Pine Mt. 2 didn't get ridden much cuz all of my friends did other things. But I couldn't ride as long and hard as I wanted to anyway as my right knee always started to ache, so riding home was often cranking the final miles with one leg. I was young and fit, so you wouldn't know I had a bum knee just by looking. Anyway, I still look fairly fit at 69, 5'8" and 160, but my weak knee is still invisibly with me. I hadn't ridden for 3 decades until last year when a friend offered a ride on his e road bike. OMG, I could ride without straining my knee. If ebikes were around when I was 30, I would have kept riding. You would have scoffed at a 130 lb. 30 yr old on an ebike, but you wouldn't have know the whole picture. So anyway, I searched e road bikes and bumped into emtb along the way. Got all excited and splurged on a Turbo Levo last Oct. SO, FUN! I could ride again! Instead of practicing golf where I get so little exercise, I ride 3-4 days a week. I'm getting fitter along with the joy of riding and learning new motor skills. My younger 63 yr old brother saw my excitement and bought a used non-motorized mtb. Now we ride together and share the excitement and what we're learning about our new sport. Without the motor, I would aging more quickly and playing senior level golf. Ballroom dancing is fun and decent exercise too, but emtb riding is way more exercise and so exciting. I just wish it wasn't so hazardous. I've had more injuries in the last 5 months that the previous 20 years. I'm all armored up but hitting the deck still hurts. I'm almost getting use to living with some level of pain and accept that it comes with the sport, lol. I get so annoyed with ebike haters. Why does anyone have to condemn another for having fun in a different way than theirs. What does it matter? Do haters need to put others down to make themselves feel good? Make someone small so they feel big? Doing that really has the opposite effect. By not respecting other's choices, haters make themselves look small and insecure. Can't we all just have a good time and respect whatever others enjoy?


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## Al Fong (Oct 20, 2021)

Xlr8n said:


> Ebikes are a godsend for those that cannot otherwise enjoy cycling, but I do see a comical angle taken by haters on forums everywhere. Portray an e-bike as a handicap vehicle in an effort to shame otherwise healthy people away from them....Honestly, I hope nobody ever has to _need_ an e-bike, but the truth is the large majority of folks aren't getting e-bikes because they _need _one, it's that people _want _one because they are fun.
> 
> For those reading who are contemplating the wonderful world of e-bike: I'm completely fit and can ride my enduro analog bike up and down any trail out there as I've done my whole life. I've met every goal I can imagine on a regular bike. With the e-bike It's a whole new dynamic. It's 100 percent the most fun I've ever had on a bike. win-win. Nobody I personally know is on an e-bike because they need it. We are on them for the added fun. Another way to enjoy the trails. Folks had the the same reservations about suspension, 29er wheels, on and on. In the end the stuff people like wins out. E-bikes are here to stay...even for us healthy folks. 😜


I completely agree with you, but I got a turbo levo last Oct and wouldn't be riding without the motor. You can't tell by looking, but I my knee has always gotten sore while cranking out miles on my road bike. I quit at 30 cuz the pain of limping home took away the fun. I'm 5'8" and 160. I look to be in decent shape for 69, but couldn't ride unassisted. I'm having a fantastic time averaging 2 hr rides on trails, 3-4X a week. I just wish I didn't crash so often, but that won't stop me! lol. Haters? I see them as insecure. Those people try to boost their self-image by putting others down, but you only make yourself look small when you can't tolerate how someone else finds joy.


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## woodshed48 (Jun 26, 2009)

I got my first MB in the late '80's. I'm on #5 now, a YETI. I just turned 74. I've always thought that an ebike defeated the purpose of getting good exercise, seeing remote areas, etc. If I had a commute, that would make more sense, as I could commute further, even into a strong headwind. I rode with a guy on an ebike last summer. He did great until he started having power and mechanical issues. Then he was pushing a really heavy bike home. I still have my first real bike that I save for Sunday afternoons (ha ha); it is a 1964 Schwinn Corvette 5 speed. I rode it everywhere as a kid. Now it seems as heavy as a tank. 

Great set of posts here.


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## rustie (Apr 21, 2010)

Always riden a bike. Now 81 yrs. I like technical trails and exploration. Do a lot of trail work too.

I do now have an ebike ...... and it's a mixed blessing!
On the whole it's wonderful, and lets me get around extensively........However, downhill an ebike is hard to jig around and doesn't work well for climbing unless the cadence is high. It takes a while to get used to all this.
So.........I don't like to hear any BS about how much of a give-away ebikes are.........
Thanks.


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## beastmaster (Sep 19, 2012)

Having no experience on e-bikes, so it's not possible for me to comment on them directly. However, there are things that I do which have a "power-assist," if you will.

I ski a good bit. Most of my turns are in the resort and as such, I ride a chairlift many, many times a time. This said, skiing where I ski (Taos Ski Valley), there is an abundance of hike-to terrain not served by any lifts. Depending on the day, snow conditions, and who I am with, I hike between 3 or 4 laps and upwards of 20 (my record is 27 in one day). An average day sees between 5 and 7 laps off the ridge.

E-bikes are not legal to use in the Santa Fe National Forest except where motorized vehicles are allowed. When power-assisted bikes first came on the scene I have to admit I was downright pissed. The concern was that a few people with no idea of trail etiquette could potentially jeopardizing trail use for all cyclists. This turns out to be no more of a significant problem than non-motorized riders shredding trails in rude ways.

I am very lucky. At 58 years old I have no physical problems which prevent me from skiing and riding bikes a lot. I am fit and strong enough to be able to ride completely under my own power and foresee it being this way for a good long time to come. When this condition changes I just might roll out with power assistance. Until then, I just ride what I am riding...


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

I'm 64 and I've been riding MTBs for 36 years. I do not own an ebike. None of our local trails are legal for ebikes, although there are some people that poach without repercussions. I tried a friend's ebike briefly and yeah, it was fun but no doubt it is a motorized bike. There may be a day when I have to decide whether to get an ebike or stop riding. I know which I would choose if it comes down to that. I might feel differently if all trails were open to them but they're not.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

This is somewhat unrelated to the original questions, but check out what Geoff Gullevich can do on a light weight eBike. His videos shredding the Orbea Rise on Boogey Man convinced me that eBikes are legit tools for fun.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

I'm loving the boomer adoption of the word haters. The judgiest of generations would like a word.

I thinks its great if eBikes provide some outdoor activity potential for people who have health issues.... where they are legal to ride. 

However, there's no...oh what's the word...ah yes...entitlement. The world doesn't need to cater to your entitlement just because your aging might limit your past abilities. No obligation to equate motorized bicycles with human powered. Generations prior just dealt with it.. sans the sanctimonious whining that not everyone 100% loves your motorized bikes as much as you do. 

But hey...in a world where a blue pill can help ease dysfunction from lifelong bad habits and health, I guess the expectation is anything and everything just to keep going.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

My apologies in advance but as patient as I try to be regarding ebikers, my immediate reaction upon seeing them ease on by as I work on my threshold power is one of ire and disdain.

But really, who cares?


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

rustie said:


> Always riden a bike. Now 81 yrs. I like technical trails and exploration. Do a lot of trail work too.
> 
> I do now have an ebike ...... and it's a mixed blessing!
> On the whole it's wonderful, and lets me get around extensively........However, downhill an ebike is hard to jig around and doesn't work well for climbing unless the cadence is high. It takes a while to get used to all this.
> ...


What motor do you have?

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk


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## Horseshoe (May 31, 2018)

My other main passion is music, and I can't help but compare the current "purist" sentiment towards eMTBs to Dylan going electric at the Newport Folk Festival in 65. He certainly ruffled a bunch of feathers with the folkie crowd, but rock n roll really hasn't been the same since.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Horseshoe said:


> My other main passion is music, and I can't help but compare the current "purist" sentiment towards eMTBs to Dylan going electric at the Newport Folk Festival in 65. He certainly ruffled a bunch of feathers with the folkie crowd, but rock n roll really hasn't been the same since.


I get that comparison. But I'd say its more like how it might how it acceptable to strum an acoustic in the park pretty much anytime, but maybe not so great to hook up your 1000watt rig unless permitted to do so.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

rustie said:


> Always riden a bike. Now 81 yrs. I like technical trails and exploration. Do a lot of trail work too.
> 
> I do now have an ebike ...... and it's a mixed blessing!
> On the whole it's wonderful, and lets me get around extensively........However, downhill an ebike is hard to jig around and doesn't work well for climbing unless the cadence is high. It takes a while to get used to all this.
> ...



Great feedback. What kind of ebike are you riding? Good news is the ebikes are improving dramatically every two years. Right now, I'm riding an Orbea Rise Alloy and it's so good for the money, that i just shake my head how far ebikes have come.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Carl Mega said:


> But hey...in a world where a blue pill can help ease dysfunction from lifelong bad habits and health, I guess the expectation is anything and everything just to keep going.


Crap genetics, cancers, disease and injury generally doesn't really care how fit you are or have been in the past. As an example, how about someone who pre-maturely wears out their hip socket from a life time of running while trying to stay fit? Assuming every eBiker is just using them to aid themselves from life full of 'bad habits' is super ignorant. But, I know that's a common assumption. I used to have the same ignorant thought process as it related to eBikers.


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## Horseshoe (May 31, 2018)

Carl Mega said:


> I get that comparison. But I'd say its more like how it might how it acceptable to strum an acoustic in the park pretty much anytime, but maybe not so great to hook up your 1000watt rig unless permitted to do so.


I am 100% in favor of the "permitted to do so" aspect. I assume most of us on this forum have been around long enough to remember fighting for access and not having nearly the ability to ride pretty much anywhere like we can now. I might have poached a trail or two in my 20s but in my 50s I've learned to go along to get along. As with all aspects of proper trail stewardship, don't be a jackass and f$%k it up for everyone else.


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## DirtDiggler (Jun 19, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Great feedback. What kind of ebike are you riding? Good news is the ebikes are improving dramatically every two years. Right now, I'm riding an Orbea Rise Alloy and it's so good for the money, that i just shake my head how far ebikes have come.


The Orbea Rise almost looks like a regular bike from afar. No large bump out where the motor or battery is. Very sleek - probably the best looking eBike out there. I hope they release a 160mm version of the Rallon at some point with more travel!


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

DirtDiggler said:


> Assuming every eBiker is just using them to aid themselves from life full of 'bad habits' is super ignorant. But, I know that's a common assumption. I used to have the same ignorant thought process as it related to eBikers.


Cool. Where'd I write that? Sounds like you are making an ...assumption. 

Thanks for the dissertation on health issues, I had no idea that underserving people were stricken with cancer and the such. Who knew?


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

A lot of “enthusiasm” on this topic. I celebrate everyone’s ability to express their opinions and be able to pursue their varied hobbies… I spent yesterday doing trail maintenance and riding my “pedal” Stumpjumper with our local mountain bike club. I intend to go out later this week and ride e-bikes with my wife. Life is good…


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## Geek (Aug 17, 2010)

Saturday I went on an eMTB ride. Had a hoot!









Sunday I went on an eGravel tour. Had a hoot!


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Geek said:


> Saturday I went on an eMTB ride. Had a hoot!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice. This thread needs more E-Bike pictures.

Yesterday


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

MtnBkrBob said:


> A lot of “enthusiasm” on this topic. I celebrate everyone’s ability to express their opinions and be able to pursue their varied hobbies… I spent yesterday doing trail maintenance and riding my “pedal” Stumpjumper with our local mountain bike club. I intend to go out later this week and ride e-bikes with my wife. Life is good…


I love it. 

We have a common pleasantry in our ebike group as we discover yet another benefit of ebikes.
"reason #358 to ride an ebike..." or #xxx
Discoveries like outclimbing mosquitos, doing trailwork, portaging beer, towing the broken or injured. Enabling the older riders to do great rides is just ONE of the reasons.

But I do understand it's not for everybody and I'll still take my mtb and crush myself once a week... for now.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Crankout said:


> My apologies in advance but as patient as I try to be regarding ebikers, my immediate reaction upon seeing them ease on by as I work on my threshold power is one of ire and disdain.
> 
> But really, who cares?


This IMHO is at the core of why so many hate ebikes. They don't like being passed. Something about earning your turns or earning your spot on the XC totem pole. The hate is deeper among the fittest, fastest, and most retro. 

So pass with care ebikers. And the ones disturbed by the passing, understand that most hikers have/had the sentiment about being passed on the trail by mountain bikers. Change is hard. Many evolved, some don't.

fc


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Francis Cebedo said:


> The hate is deeper among the fittest, fastest, and most retro.


I dunno. 

There's plenty of fast and fit people out there who aren't such insecure wannabes that they manage not to get their panties bunched about being passed by someone on a completely different machine who's out there just to have fun.
Of course, this applies to certain Class 1 ebikers thinking they're somehow superior to those who ride other classes, or motos, etc.

Relax Champs, no one gives a damn about taking away the Worlds' Best Exerciser trophy you gave yourself. You can un-puff. 😜


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

slapheadmofo said:


> I dunno.
> 
> There's plenty of fast and fit people out there who aren't such insecure wannabes that they manage not to get their panties bunched about being passed by someone on a completely different machine who's out there just to have fun.
> Of course, this applies to certain Class 1 ebikers thinking they're somehow superior to those who ride other classes, or motos, etc.
> ...


Absolutely. Heck... I'm super fast. lololol.

I find though that the ratio is higher among them. So places where they run the trails or trail council, E will take forever to be allowed, if ever.... like Bend, Oregon.

fc


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> This IMHO is at the core of why so many hate ebikes. They don't like being passed. Something about earning your turns or earning your spot on the XC totem pole. The hate is deeper among the fittest, fastest, and most retro.
> 
> So pass with care ebikers. And the ones disturbed by the passing, understand that most hikers have/had the sentiment about being passed on the trail by mountain bikers. Change is hard. Many evolved, some don't.
> 
> fc


I think there is some truth to this. I know my first "e-pass", I was gassed breathing hard, slowly climbing and this guy waited till the last second to say anything about passing and flew by barely peddling. It scared the crap out of me and I stopped, it made me mad he didn't call out sooner, and then I just laughed at the way he went right up the hill while he was barely pedaling, no climbing possition, not breathing hard, it was like a cartoon...

I've now seen him many times in the desert hills and he is flying. So also at first I thought it was funny that he was wearing a full face on such mellow terrain, but at that speed I guess it makes sense!! His traversing/climbing speed is concerning for other riders; but those trails/4x4 tracks are pretty sparsely ridden so I think it's fine where he's doing it.

And I have to say all the rest of the times I've been passed by ebikers or seen them other then it being a shock sometimes at how fast they passed/traversed it's been fine and they've looked like they were actively "riding" and not just sitting there letting the bike do all the riding!!


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> about being passed by someone on a completely different machine who's out there just to have fun.


As meaningless to me as if someone on a moto passed. However, the common courtesy, safety and patience in which one passes - yeah, that does matter. Don't be a d1ck just because you got the watts.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)




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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Carl Mega said:


> As meaningless to me as if someone on a moto passed. However, the common courtesy, safety and patience in which one passes - yeah, that does matter. Don't be a d1ck just because you got the watts.


For sure.

I'm talking about the whole Fitness Boyz crowd who think simply having fun isn't a good enough reason for people to be allowed to use public trails.
Cuz they didn't 'earn it'.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

nice. Cascade link!!


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

mlx john said:


> View attachment 1976871


Is that pic from last year?


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

stiingya said:


> Is that pic from last year?


Yep
If it makes you happy, here's one from today


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

Just thought there would have been snow at the peak still... so wondered.


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Lower Armijo is good to go. Probably another few weeks for the higher stuff.
All of Cedro/Otero perfect dirt conditions...


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## akacappy (Sep 3, 2013)

Here’s the deal, if ebikes were around when I was 19 I’d be riding them. The fun factor is off the chart. I ride to have fun. I’m 57 now and enjoying the ride more. Good for me!


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## zorg (Jul 1, 2004)

At 53 with below average stamina/power (got to play the hand that genetics handed you), the ebike is a gift. I can ride more and more often. I'm not as gassed after a ride, it's great. And I still ride the MTB or GG once in a while to push my HR.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

akacappy said:


> Here’s the deal, if ebikes were around when I was 19 I’d be riding them. The fun factor is off the chart. I ride to have fun. I’m 57 now and enjoying the ride more. Good for me!



From another 57-year-old, yes the fun factor is off the chart. I think a lot of us have forgotten that word. I believe that's what makes mountain biking special, and the key differentiator from road biking.

I started in this sport because i thrived in the suffering. Most of my peers could not relate. These days I still play in the suffer segment but maybe just 20%. Fun is a huge part of the pie now. Exploration, adventure, progressing, trail building are other parts of it. A lot of my peers now too can participate and reach the high peaks.


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## stiingya (Apr 30, 2004)

Which IMO is what the message should be. FUN! Not look at how much more fit I am because of my ebike. Look at how much time I save because of my ebike. That stuff just doesn't make any sense to me. It's a shiny new carrot, which isn't any different then me getting new carbon bars the other day and going for a ride when I still had work to do. I wouldn't go post about how my new bars are making me more fit? Cause they aren't. Me doing exercise is what makes me more fit. 

And time is time, period.


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## Prognosticator (Feb 15, 2021)

I am 55. Two mountain bikes; one road bike; zero e-bikes. I have nothing against e-bikes. Been riding mountain bikes since '92 before that road riding, before that BMX. 

As a kid, I thought moving so swiftly and smoothly under my own power was magical. I still do. I went to college for a few years on the Gulf Coast of Florida. I had a friend who owned a sailboat. We used to sail evenings and weekends. Being pushed around in water by wind is similar magic to riding a bike. No motors. Just bliss.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Francis Cebedo said:


> The hate is deeper among the fittest, fastest, and most retro. So pass with care ebikers.


OTOH, F those guys.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


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## Ipe (Jan 28, 2014)

I'm nearing 55. Been riding mtb since the early 80's. I currently own/operate a small home remodeling company. Working all day in the spring and then riding is no big deal. You work, you ride, all is good. Try that in the summer (at least for me) and its no good at all. I'm just plain spent. Put a fork in me, I'm done. I swear I could drink over a gallon of water a day (perhaps an exaggeration, but you get the idea) and still be dehydrated. I've attempted to go ride after work but typically that results in exhaustion related injuries. So I don't ride as much when its hot and my conditioning suffers. 
This year I'm adding a Rocky Mountain Powerplay Altitude C70 to the bike stable. Its due in a week or so and I am very excited. This bike should allow me to ride once the weather gets hot and steamy and will also allow me to ride with younger folks that would crush me even in my fittest spring condition. I think that's going to be a lot of fun. 
As far as pissing people off by passing them? One of the rules that I live by goes along the lines of: Just because you can doesn't mean you should. I follow that up with: Don't be a jerk! 
There's a time and place for everything. I'm hoping that application of those two rules minimizes the potential for pissing people off.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Ipe said:


> I'm nearing 55. Been riding mtb since the early 80's. I currently own/operate a small home remodeling company. Working all day in the spring and then riding is no big deal. You work, you ride, all is good. Try that in the summer (at least for me) and its no good at all. I'm just plain spent. Put a fork in me, I'm done. I swear I could drink over a gallon of water a day (perhaps an exaggeration, but you get the idea) and still be dehydrated. I've attempted to go ride after work but typically that results in exhaustion related injuries. So I don't ride as much when its hot and my conditioning suffers.
> This year I'm adding a Rocky Mountain Powerplay Altitude C70 to the bike stable. Its due in a week or so and I am very excited. This bike should allow me to ride once the weather gets hot and steamy and will also allow me to ride with younger folks that would crush me even in my fittest spring condition. I think that's going to be a lot of fun.
> As far as pissing people off by passing them? One of the rules that I live by goes along the lines of: Just because you can doesn't mean you should. I follow that up with: Don't be a jerk!
> There's a time and place for everything. I'm hoping that application of those two rules minimizes the potential for pissing people off.


Right on, best of luck and keep us posted.

What I will say is this: Usually one goes E for a specific reason that finally tips the scales. But every week, you'll discover some new benefit that will just surprise you. We call it "reason #xxx". It's a little different set and order of priority for everyone.

As far as pissing people off, I'd say just be secure about yourself and have thick skin. Change is never easy and this is getting accepted around the world but on different timetables. Here in Santa Cruz, E is becoming very normal this year. But 6-8 years ago, it was hate and heckle city. Every area will have its transition and some will take another 10 years IMHO.


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## natas1321 (Nov 4, 2017)

Don't have one and not considering one, have spent a few days on one on a few occasions and it's not for me. Ask me again in five years and maybe my views will have changed but for the moment I will pass on the pedal assisted bikes. 

Sent from my moto g(7) supra using Tapatalk


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## slomtbr (Oct 9, 2010)

62 - 25% eMTB, 75% MTB, and I'm riding 3 to 5 days a week rather than 2 to 3 days before the eMTB.


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## Larsey (Jan 14, 2004)

I am 56. I got just over a 1000 miles of off-road last year with 800 conventional and 200 eBike. I absolutely love riding an eBike but definitely find the conventional bike more rewarding. I do see a future where eBikes will probably be more mainstream.

I was 228lbs at the end of 2014 and got myself down to 160lbs now. Would never be there without the love for bicycles


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## bamdave (Mar 18, 2015)

slimat99 said:


> It's sad to me that the founder of MTBR is more into hybrid motorbikes than mountain biking. Man how times have changed.


Remember when mountain bikers were the friendliest and happiest exercisers? Most would check on you if you had a flat or were off your bike for another reason. I was always amazed when I would see most mountain bikers with a big smile on there face and it would in-turn make me happy. Those days are gone for those of us who choose to EMTB. 40% of MTB’ers still have that glow but 60% have pure undiluted hatred on their face for how I choose to exercise. The intolerance of these haters is astounding to me considering how friendly those same people used to behave. I am hoping more people can learn to tolerate people with different viewpoints, religions, sexual preference and those who exercise in a different way. Is that too much to ask?


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## bamdave (Mar 18, 2015)

SteveF said:


> I hope and expect to never buy one of the damned things.


Remember when mountain bikers were the friendliest and happiest exercisers? Most would check on you if you had a flat or were off your bike for another reason. I was always amazed when I would see most mountain bikers with a big smile on there face and it would in-turn make me happy. Those days are gone for those of us who choose to EMTB. 40% of MTB’ers still have that glow but 60% have pure undiluted hatred on their face for how I choose to exercise. The intolerance of these haters is astounding to me considering how friendly those same people used to behave. I am hoping more people can learn to tolerate people with different viewpoints, religions, sexual preference and those who exercise in a different way. Is that too much to ask?


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## bamdave (Mar 18, 2015)

Blatant said:


> I hesitate to even respond as the tenor of the conversation by fc is pretty clear.
> 
> That said, 53, in shape, still riding black and double black in Phoenix. Climbing them under human power. I have zero interest in electric motors on bikes, other than wishing they didn’t exist.


Remember when mountain bikers were the friendliest and happiest exercisers? Most would check on you if you had a flat or were off your bike for another reason. I was always amazed when I would see most mountain bikers with a big smile on there face and it would in-turn make me happy. Those days are gone for those of us who choose to EMTB. 40% of MTB’ers still have that glow but 60% have pure undiluted hatred on their face for how I choose to exercise. The intolerance of these haters is astounding to me considering how friendly those same people used to behave. I am hoping more people can learn to tolerate people with different viewpoints, religions, sexual preference and those who exercise in a different way. Is that too much to ask?


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## Blatant (Apr 13, 2005)

It’s not hatred. It’s contempt. I don’t hate people who ride mopeds on MTB trails. I hate that those mopeds exist. 

And are you really, really equating your riding “preferences” to someone’s sexual preference? Jesus …


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## Dr Hollidaze (9 mo ago)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


Bee Cool Adventurer.....750 watts! I have severe OA and am 70. Was unable to ride for the last 5 yrs..I'm riding daily and back in the saddle for trails and back country.....pedaling as much as I did with analog and getting good solid workouts.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Blatant said:


> It’s not hatred. It’s contempt. I don’t hate people who ride mopeds on MTB trails. I hate that those mopeds exist.


I am so happy to have an actual life.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

that was an amazing display of melodrama. so much, it couldn't fit in one message and needed repeating.


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## Horseshoe (May 31, 2018)

Eh. I can’t say I’ve witnessed any of that myself. There are certainly people that don’t like e-bikes and that’s no skin off my nose, but I haven't really seen this manifest out on the trail. Now if you want to talk about true user conflict, think back to the great skier bs snowboarder wars of the early 90s. I worked at Snow Summit at the time and a weekend wouldn’t go by without a fight n the lift line.


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## Ipe (Jan 28, 2014)

I think this is starting to tangent away from the real topic, but here goes. 

I started mountain biking at the commercial dawn of the sport back in the 1980's. I had a fully rigid, all steel, bull moose bar and bear trap pedal Bianchi Grizzly. I had a lot of fun on that bike. I bought it because I was burned out on road bike racing. No Pain No Gain in stickers on the handlebar. In my mind mountain bikes were for fun and road bikes were for being miserable going very fast. After a while the road bikes disappeared, and the mountain bikes remained. At the time every stranger met on the trail was an instant friend just because we were mountain biking. It was that simple. It was pretty awesome. 

Fast forward a few years and mountain bike racing became a thing. I was asked if I wanted to compete. Answer was (and still is) no, thank you for asking though. If you do it I'll cheer for you. My thought being mountain bikes are for fun, road bikes are for racing. With racing the instant friend thing started to not be so universal, but it was still a high percentage. 

Fast forward a decade or so and Strava comes about. This really changed things. Now the racing people were ALWAYS competing on every trail. Must get that KOM! Civility became less commonplace and distain for everyone in their Strava way became far more common. 

Fast forward again and leaving politics to the side, it became apparent the tolerance for anything _not-our-approved-thing_ was becoming conspicuous absent. If your thing is not like their approved thing well then, you're the enemy and damn are they going to let you know about it. This brought about riding at odd hours by myself or with close, known friends. Mountain biking is supposed to be fun. These people are joy sucking lampreys. 

Now we come to the present. The Covids have driven the population stir crazy and everyone had to recreate all the time. Trail networks have become very, very crowded and abused. Trail braiding is rampant. Obstacles are getting dumbed down or destroyed. People appear to be terrified to utter a single word to a stranger less they get the plague. Civility? Fawk That! I need to enjoy nature! Get away from me you plague carrier! 

So add all that up and you've got a scenario where far fewer people are nice any more. If you're different in any way you're bad. If you're in the way of a record KOM you're bad. If you're anything and Karen has a hair across Karen's butt.... well, you get the idea. 

Finally, lets circle back to emtb. There's a lot of "super tolerant" people out there that will despise you. They'll despise you for going against the grain and not being in the approved norm. They'll despise you because you're not as fit as they are and you're using an alternate means to get fitter and enjoy the trails. They will despise you for riding what they don't deem worthy. I am confident there will be some that will despise what I've written here, and by extension, me. So effing be it. I've been riding mountain bikes since the start. I will still always ask if someone, anyone needs assistance. I will still always be pleasant, smile, and say Hi! I will still always be nice absent a reason not to be nice, and even then I'll be nice until its necessary not to be. Should all that fail, well, there's always this:


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## Dr Hollidaze (9 mo ago)

cunningstunts said:


> yes, new eeb as of November. 54, fit, but the time and effort to get to the top of our trail system has become brutal in the last few years. can't keep up with younger, smaller guys in riding group anymore (6 5, 220). old knee injury slowly grinds my knee to **** after about an hour of spinning and it takes nearly 2 to get to the top now.
> 
> it's a game changer on every level. amazing up, amazing down. took a while to adapt to, like any new bike, but it's incredibly capable in either direction. still a great work out, without having a jammer or turning purple on the ups. i spend more time than ever on descents, and i'll be able to ride more when the temps rise. last summer here shut down riding for most people as all records were shattered and heatstroke was a real threat.
> 
> ...


Cast off your shame and hold your head high! Actually you are demonstrating intelligence...... "adapting to the environment".
At 70 with severe osteoarthritis, E bikes put me back in the saddle and on the trail..riding strong with No regrets E bike power to the people, old folks rock, lead follow or shut up and get out the way there are trails to ride!
Hoka Hey


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Ipe said:


> I think this is starting to tangent away from the real topic, but here goes.
> ....
> 
> Finally, lets circle back to emtb. There's a lot of "super tolerant" people out there that will despise you. They'll despise you for going against the grain and not being in the approved norm. They'll despise you because you're not as fit as they are and you're using an alternate means to get fitter and enjoy the trails. They will despise you for riding what they don't deem worthy. I am confident there will be some that will despise what I've written here, and by extension, me. So effing be it. I've been riding mountain bikes since the start. I will still always ask if someone, anyone needs assistance. I will still always be pleasant, smile, and say Hi! I will still always be nice absent a reason not to be nice, and even then I'll be nice until its necessary not to be. Should all that fail, well, there's always this:
> ...


Great words. Very well said. Despise and contempt among us is an unfortunate reality. Luckily, it is reserved for the few and the winds of change are upon us.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

I've seen quite a few eBikes lately, both on the roads and trails. The common feature is that nobody is really pedalling except in a desultory fashion. These are really quiet, environmentally friendly mopeds dressed up to look like bicycles. Remember, although they had pedals, nobody pedals mopeds.


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

Strange. I haven’t seen any “mopeds” on the local roads or trials in my neck of the woods. I do see a fair amount of class 1 e-bikes. And obviously -- they require pedaling. 

According to my Garmin/Strava:

Last week’s neighborhood ride on my class 1 Verve e-bike yielded 1:24:01 in heart rate Z1 and 57:00 in heart rate Z2. 

Last week’s trail ride on my class 1 Rail e-bike yielded 6:57 in Z1 and 1:03:37 in Z2. 

Last week’s trail ride on my Stumpjumer “pedal” bike yielded 1:33 in Z1, 22:57 in Z2 and 33:50 in Z3. 

So all bikes are providing health benefits, albeit at varying levels.


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## russinthecascades (Jun 1, 2013)

I'm about to hit 70 with no physical ailments. On about a 3:1 ratio of mtb:emtb rides, ride 3 - 4 times per week. When I ride alone with my wife, it's ebike all the way! When with friends or friends riding with both of us, it's my regular mtb. I have fun at both, but they're very different rides. 

Today was a rare exception, because yesterday I got a stick in my derailleur of my mtb, and it was ghost shifting all over the place and I didn't have time to fix it. So I rode with friends using my emtb, after checking to see if anyone minded. It was nowhere as much fun as our normal group rides. Good practice balancing up slow, steep climbs; fun being outside with friends; very little exercise. Pushing myself is one of the things I like most about biking and mixing emtb's with mtb's generally doesn't work very well. The main reason I bought the ebike was that my wife was getting bored waiting on me and everyone else. It wasn't until I bought mine that I truly understood.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

Blatant said:


> It’s not hatred. It’s contempt. I don’t hate people who ride mopeds on MTB trails. I hate that those mopeds exist.
> 
> And are you really, really equating your riding “preferences” to someone’s sexual preference? Jesus …


They are an entitled lot it appears.


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## pushinpixels (Jul 4, 2007)

I rented this e-bike in Mesa, AZ. Had a blast riding the Hawes trail network! 
4 hour ride and I still felt reasonably fresh after. I'm now starting a multi-year savings plan for a similar e-bike.
The way I can fly up technical climbs is addictive.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

pushinpixels said:


> The way I can fly up technical climbs is addictive.


Motors will do that.


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

If ebikes were not made by any existing “analog” bike companies, and they were not marketed at all in any bike magazine or on any mtb sites, would they have more stigma attached to them for trail riding? Would they be viewed more as mopeds and dirt bikes and less as cycles?


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

maynard4130 said:


> If ebikes were not made by any existing “analog” bike companies, and they were not marketed at all in any bike magazine or on any mtb sites, would they have more stigma attached to them for trail riding? Would they be viewed more as mopeds and dirt bikes and less as cycles?


If there was an 'outsider' push vs. industry insider advocates, the resistance would have been different. The thing is, outsider groups & industry traction is gaining momentum and with that, differences in ethics and agenda.... Basically, to serve the agenda of "selling units" the insurgent companies are willing to push thru barriers that even traditional companies held to. In terms of access, the fast track push to accept motorized on historically non-motorized trails is causing turbulence for this quasi category. The consumer market, which began by targeting traditional cyclists, was the hook but target demo is shifting to 'new users' and at a lower price point and, subsequently, different marketing. Get ready.

A cautionary tale can be seen with the rise of SxS. The marketing is borderline reckless; the manufacturers behind that marketing are basically absent in the advocacy efforts necessary to soft land their fresh new user group in the existing infrastructure of public lands. Thus, poorly informed users, en mass, laying waste to trails & terrain with significant conflict. SxS are extremely approachable due to ease of use, but they are a tool that lends itself to abuse if unaware of impacts, self restraint and empathy for other trail users.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Carl Mega said:


> If there was an 'outsider' push vs. industry insider advocates, the resistance would have been different. The thing is, outsider groups & industry traction is gaining momentum and with that, differences in ethics and agenda.... Basically, to serve the agenda of "selling units" the insurgent companies are willing to push thru barriers that even traditional companies held to. In terms of access, the fast track push to accept motorized on historically non-motorized trails is causing turbulence for this quasi category. The consumer market, which began by targeting traditional cyclists, was the hook but target demo is shifting to 'new users' and at a lower price point and, subsequently, different marketing. Get ready.
> 
> A cautionary tale can be seen with the rise of SxS. The marketing is borderline reckless; the manufacturers behind that marketing are basically absent in the advocacy efforts necessary to soft land their fresh new user group in the existing infrastructure of public lands. Thus, poorly informed users, en mass, laying waste to trails & terrain with significant conflict. SxS are extremely approachable due to ease of use, but they are a tool that lends itself to abuse if unaware of impacts, self restraint and empathy for other trail users.


I can't believe no one saw that coming.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

What's SxS?


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Nat said:


> What's SxS?


Side by Side. Razr.

A "Texas Wheelchair". Lulz.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Carl Mega said:


> Side by Side. Razr.


Yup.

The advent of quads brought about a similar situation.

In my region, it ended up with moto riders losing practically all of their long-standing trail access through guilt by motor-association, and seeing the few remaining legal spots they were left with being blown out into unrideable messes in the short term, then following with being completely closed to motors in the long term. The moto groups and riders were pretty successful for a long time with getting along with other user groups and being active as far as trail work/maintenance, etc, but when ATVs exploded, the crowd changed significantly and you saw vehicles that had a ton more impact being operated by much less skilled and invested users. Rather than try to manage one vs the other, LMs did the predictable thing and just threw them all out.


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> The advent of quads brought about a similar situation.
> 
> being operated by much less skilled and invested users.


Totally. A funny thing is, I now find myself wishing for the days of the quads. Never thought I'd say that but they were safer times. 

I live in SW CO and routinely hit four states and well known areas (hundreds of 2 wheeled motor hours per year) so I get to see a lot. In terms of conflict, restriction and destruction - it is actually shocking. And as a 2 wheeled moto user, pretty much getting the shaft due to the bad behaviors.

A general rule of thumb I found for predicting behavior is related to what you wrote: "the less investment a user has to make to engage in their activity, the more predictably bad their conduct will be". The harder effort, more skill, literal skin (vulnerable) in the game - gatekeeps those won't invest and apply themselves. Those tend to be our worst users.


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

Carl Mega said:


> The thing is, outsider groups & industry traction is gaining momentum and with that, differences in ethics and agenda....


Add to that the push to label those resisting as "haters".


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Carl Mega said:


> A general rule of thumb I found for predicting behavior is related to what you wrote: "the less investment a user has to make to engage in their activity, the more predictably bad their conduct will be". The harder effort, more skill, literal skin (vulnerable) in the game - gatekeeps those won't invest and apply themselves. Those tend to be our worst users.


This is why you may be seeing the 'golden age' of e-biking right now actually.
Many of the early adopters are coming from an MTB background, and so have that built-in skill, investment level and predisposition towards physical effort.
That will go down over time and you will start to see more and more people who are less trail-savvy and more inclined to want more powerful motors and heavier duty rides, and who know (and care) less and less about trailwork, etc.
Pretty inevitable IMO.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

D. Inoobinati said:


> Add to that the push to label those resisting as "haters".


Too true.

I can come and do come out in support of e-bikes all the time, in many ways, but for certain people, my observations in the last few posts will have put me way deep into the 'HATER!!!' camp.

It's weird.


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

slapheadmofo said:


> Many of the early adopters are coming from an MTB background, and so have that built-in skill, investment level and predisposition towards physical effort.


And, as I've detailed several times before in Mtbr, many adopters are coming from the motocross end, bringing with them their demands for backcountry access, increased e-power, and MX riding style. Astonishingly, emtb riders on this site are totally OK with that.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Carl Mega said:


> Side by Side. Razr.
> 
> A "Texas Wheelchair". Lulz.


Ahh, okay


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

The Texas Wheelchair is the scourge of the Southwest. 

I’d rather have 100 eBikers than a single group in an RZR. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

Those things have made Moab intolerable....and riding any gravel out of Silverton unbearable.

But hey, they're the future. And they're fun. Right?

*RIGHT?!!?*


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

I will be 73 in two months. I've given some thought to an eBike but the minuses easily outweigh any gains. My new SC Tallboy at 30 lbs. really ticks all the boxes for me. I enjoy working for my climbs and I don't want to go any faster heading back down. 

Having just purchased the Tallboy last year, I am not in the market for a new bike anytime soon. More realistically, I would probably benefit more by buying a lighter weight XC bike like the SC Blur. Solo is my preferred way to ride so I don't need more speed to keep up. 

Last year I rode 166 days. I wouldn't ride anymore with an eBike and might ride a lot less having to put such a heavy bike in my car. My current riding is somewhere around 65% mountain and 35% road. My 16.6 lbs. road bike is a joy to flick about.

For what it's worth, I'm heading west tomorrow and will spend a week riding NorCal would an old friend before 23 more days in Hawaii. On the Big Island, I have an MTB eBike tour booked. Hawaii is steep and there wasn't a choice anyway. I may rent a regular MTB later and do so riding on my own and will be renting a road bike too. On Oahu my wife and I have a road tour lined up.

When it comes down to it, weight and price are the two big reasons eBikes are not attractive to me. I'm not sure I'm ready for a bike whose technology will keep making wish I had waited for the latest and greatest version. 

I have no answers.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Rev Bubba said:


> I will be 73 in two months. I've given some thought to an eBike but the minuses easily outweigh any gains. My new SC Tallboy at 30 lbs. really ticks all the boxes for me. I enjoy working for my climbs and I don't want to go any faster heading back down.
> 
> Having just purchased the Tallboy last year, I am not in the market for a new bike anytime soon. More realistically, I would probably benefit more by buying a lighter weight XC bike like the SC Blur. Solo is my preferred way to ride so I don't need more speed to keep up.
> 
> ...


PS: I don't see many eBikes around mid-week and when I do, the riders are young, not old.
PPS: No injuries but some arthritis in my right knee. The said to just ride more and it will take care of itself. So far, that works.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

No ebike plans. I'm not interested in riding through the woods. I've done lots of that on motos in years past. My motivation is propelling myself through the woods, as far and fast as I best can, which has been decreasing as I age. I have no interest in going further are faster with the assist of a motor. I plan to keep at it as best as I can until I can't or don't wanna anymore.


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

My ratio is 4 meat powered / would be happy to never see an E-moped again.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

joecx said:


> My ratio is 4 meat powered / would be happy to never see an E-moped again.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

My "moped" lol.


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## Emtboldguy (10 mo ago)

59. I have a 2012 Scott HT and a levo SL expert. Fifty- fifty split. I ride the Scott for a workout and the sl for fun. That said, the SL is a great workout in its own right for a guy my age. I can ride it the day after lifting, put it on hi power and go 25 miles. Or I can turn off the motor and suffer. Can't do without it. Highly recommended.


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## vmakuc (Dec 5, 2012)

Hi. I'm 56. May ebike ratio is 50:50 if I count number of rides only. I ride Orbea Rise as ebike, mostly in company of my wife. She has Rise too. Other 50% is mostly done with my classic FS bike on local hill trails.


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## edj (Mar 31, 2010)

I'm 77 and I'm looking to get either an e-bike or lighter weight F/S. Just too much effort for me to get me and my 2012 Turner Sultan up anything steep. Main reservation for e-bike is having to lift it up on my roof rack and I don't feel to install a hitch (though maybe I should.) Wondering how much easier it will be to go uphill on a lightweight SC Blur or RM Element. Looking to demo these and then decide.


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## PS mtb (10 mo ago)

edj said:


> I'm 77 and I'm looking to get either an e-bike or lighter weight F/S. Just too much effort for me to get me and my 2012 Turner Sultan up anything steep. Main reservation for e-bike is having to lift it up on my roof rack and I don't feel to install a hitch (though maybe I should.) Wondering how much easier it will be to go uphill on a lightweight SC Blur or RM Element. Looking to demo these and then decide.


Uphill is where you will love an emtb. I have only riden a couple, and ended up with an Orbea rise M LTD. It weighs in around 36 lbs, but has less power than the bigger motors on the 48+ pound emtb's. I wanted light weight and don't need the power most have. Good luck with your search, make sure and demo a lightweight one if you can.


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## jiw71 (Feb 15, 2009)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


yes, I ride a full-suspension E-mtb..........as well as a 29+ hardtail and a 26" fat bike. 60% of my riding is on the e-bike. For the last 8 years I have averaged 6000+ kms annually......... riding mostly singletrack and paved/hard-pack trails. Again, approximately 60% of this distance is on paved trails (with my wife who also has an e-bike. I purchased an e-bike 3 years ago at age 70 when I reluctantly conceded (to myself) that my stamina was waning............particularly on climbs. My E-bike removes ALL excuses for not "getting out there". Windy days, long distances and climbs are non-issues. Like any long term rider I have had numerous crashes and falls over the years but fortunately nothing permanent or debilitating. My limitation now is the battery power (lol)


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## KRob (Jan 13, 2004)

Francis Cebedo said:


> Do you ride an ebike? Are you thinking about it?
> 
> How much do you ride it compared to your normal mtbs?
> 
> ...


Yes. (Well, I ride my wife's Turbo Levo Comp occasionally.... maybe one out of every 20-25 rides will be e-assist)

Not sure. Really liking the new Fezzari La Sal Peak but pretty happy with my current v.2 Evil Offering

I love that I can do very different rides than I would be able to do on my regular bike. Long exploratory rides with massive climbing up old moto-created fall line trails if need be (35-40 mile rides with 6000-7000 feet of climbing in three hours. I consider it a different sport... but what's not to like about that??). Also use it occasionally to get in multiple laps on my usual trails or to self shuttle on my every day before work rides and it is a total game changer for marking course and sweeping our annual Fears Tears and Beers Enduro.

I'm 60 yo and really don't have any limitations. Shattered my radial head 12 years ago. Broke my pelvis in three places racing motos 24 years ago. Been mtbing about 25 years. I still out climb most of my 30-40 yo riding buddies and put in ~2500miles and 350-400K feet of climbing 98 percent on dirt trails on my analog mtb every year.


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