# My Bikesdirect experience (so far)



## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

I ordered a Motobecane 700HT April 24. Today (April 27) I was emailed a notice of refund, and shortly after I received an email explaining that they oversold the bike in my size. I can get $50 off of a bike of greater value...so naturally I'm thinking about the Fantom Trail ( http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/fantom_trail08.htm#specs ) which would come out to $545. Or do I take this experience as an oman and go to my LBS and purchase the Gary Fisher Marlin Disc ( http://fisherbikes.com/bike/archivemodel/461 ) for $100 more? That's my dilemma...


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

Get the Moto, your the second person to report this same issue in the last week.


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## tsmosher (Mar 30, 2010)

Without at least sitting on it (riding it would be preferable of course), I'd be apprehensive that the bike wouldn't fit me. But, since you ordered the 700HT, you obviously aren't very apprehensive about it. 

BD.com seems legit. They have a representative who posts on these boards and will work to make your BD.com as pleasant as possible if something should go awry. Also, there seem to be many pleased BD.com bike owners on these boards (and no displeased ones).

So... go for it. Consider the $50 a generous gift! :thumbsup:


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

There representative is the Owner of Bikes Direct. I had a good experience with Bikes Direct, but my bike was in stock as they showed. $50.00 is generous, and you have only been inconvenienced for 4 days.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

tsmosher said:


> Without at least sitting on it (riding it would be preferable of course), I'd be apprehensive that the bike wouldn't fit me. But, since you ordered the 700HT, you obviously aren't very apprehensive about it.
> 
> BD.com seems legit. They have a representative who posts on these boards and will work to make your BD.com as pleasant as possible if something should go awry. Also, there seem to be many pleased BD.com bike owners on these boards (and no displeased ones).
> 
> So... go for it. Consider the $50 a generous gift! :thumbsup:


I'm a little apprehensive. But I also feel like I've been comfortable on a 'large' frame on most bikes that I've tried (Marlin 19", Felt Q520 19.5", Rockhopper 21")...I'm 6'1. I'm taking the risk that the 20" is my size.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

Dont take a risk - go to your LBS and get something that fits. It is no good having an ill fitting bike.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

/\ Agree , at the LBS there is a minimum of guess work .


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

I know..I just can't get over the parts I get for the price. And I haven't seen a bike that I'm in love with locally.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

lkn4life said:


> I know..I just can't get over the parts I get for the price. And I haven't seen a bike that I'm in love with locally.


You also have not physically seen one on the net


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

006_007 said:


> You also have not physically seen one on the net


true but its kinda exciting to know that i am getting a fork and brakes on this bike that i would have to pay much more for on a bike locally :wood:


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

Well, your fisher bike you have linked has better brakes, better crankset, a SRAM cassette (vs the moto no name identified cassette), and better hubs.

I would spend the extra $100 for the better components, plus the lbs will assemble it for me plus they will probably give you a deal on other accessories (new helmet etc).


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Thanks for the observations. I didn't look at the Marlin closely other than a ride on it a few weeks ago. It was out of my price range since it was $650 and I was trying to spend $500 or less. Now I'm looking at spending $545, so the Marlin is closer but still a healthy $150ish more after taxes. But I do like that bike. I'm sleeping on it.


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## brianb21 (Mar 23, 2010)

Make the LBS an offer and see what they do.Cant hurt to ask them for a small discount!


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## crump582 (Apr 8, 2010)

I just got a GF Wahoo with disc brakes... it would fit you price range a little better.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

I wouldn't worry about making a BD purchase, I have two of their bikes and was fully satisfied each time. But I knew exactly what sizes I needed, and I'm not afraid to change a stem or saddle... You'll probably need to do that at the LBS anyway.

I agree with what others have said though.. if you aren't sure of sizing, you may want to ride before you buy. 

However, if you're comfortable reading a geometry chart, and have some basic tools and tuning skils, you won't easily find a better value on a brand new bike.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

I don't mind changing a stem or saddle and would not be surprised if after a few weeks I have to do that with either an online or locally purchased bike. I believe that as I ride different trails and with different intensity I will realize what geometry works for me. Part of me feels like I'm shooting in the dark even if I 'testdrive' a bike at the store. The only way to know what works in my opinion is find what isn't working after trial and error..


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## The Ground Truth (Apr 3, 2010)

I am extremely please with my moto 29 SL pro. The quality is top notch and the components are way better than the fisher cobia that was $100 more. If you are concerned with assembly then take it to the LBS and they will charge you around $40 to assemble and tune it. its your call but I got alot more bike for my buck.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

I feel like its my duty to the forum to continue posting my experience. I received my Motobecane Fantom HT today (May 5) after originally ordering a 700HT April 24th and then being notified they were out of stock. I was compensated $50 for my inconvenience.

After the wait I was excited to get started on the bike. The packaging hints that this bike was a return. After putting the handlebars and seat post on and flipping the bike over, I noticed chipped paint near the crank. I looked closer and found a few more scuffs and chips. I'm sending BD an email with these photos attached. Probably not a big deal but I'm afraid it could lead to some rusting in the future or more chipping in those areas. I'm just ticked because I know I wouldn't have bought a bike from a LBS with chipped paint, unless there was a discount on it. And I don't want to send it back for a refund after all of these delays. What would yall do?


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## mullen119 (Aug 30, 2009)

lkn4life said:


> I feel like its my duty to the forum to continue posting my experience. I received my Motobecane Fantom HT today (May 5) after originally ordering a 700HT April 24th and then being notified they were out of stock. I was compensated $50 for my inconvenience.
> 
> After the wait I was excited to get started on the bike. The packaging hints that this bike was a return. After putting the handlebars and seat post on and flipping the bike over, I noticed chipped paint near the crank. I looked closer and found a few more scuffs and chips. I'm sending BD an email with these photos attached. Probably not a big deal but I'm afraid it could lead to some rusting in the future or more chipping in those areas. I'm just ticked because I know I wouldn't have bought a bike from a LBS with chipped paint, unless there was a discount on it. And I don't want to send it back for a refund after all of these delays. What would yall do?


You dont have to worry about rust since the bike is aluminum, but I would try to get some money back.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

That is clearly a used bike , I would expect to pay a used bike price . Just sayin .


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

I would have purchased my bike from an LBS so I would not have to waste my time begging for refunds (I charge $500/hour so my time/services are valuable)

Seriously though, chipped Al is not an issue - will not rust like steel - I also doubt further chipping will result (other then from regular use). 

Ask for a discount - you earned it.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

006_007, I think I might have to say "you were right" by the time this experience is over.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

lkn4life said:


> 006_007, I think I might have to say "you were right" by the time this experience is over.


Just keep working them until you are satisfied - I hear they are good for that sort of thing :thumbsup:


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

And to top it all off, one of the bolts for the front caliper is missing. From reading other posts I understand that this is a common problem. One would think that you would find a way to stop the same mistake from happening repeatedly.

However I do have to say putting the bike together out of the box is not difficult.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

lkn4life said:


> And to top it all off, one of the bolts for the front caliper is missing. From reading other posts I understand that this is a common problem. One would think that you would find a way to stop the same mistake from happening repeatedly.
> 
> However I do have to say putting the bike together out of the box is not difficult.


K, lets not talk too crazy about BD - they may complain to the mods and have us banned 

Agreed that bike assembly / maintenance is not too difficult if you have the correct tools and take your time.


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## shenny88 (Sep 24, 2009)

damn, this thread (your experience) is crazy. i ordered a 700ht from them, and it came perfect and was assembled smoothly. i recently email them due to too much sanction play in the dart 2 (i know...) fork and they sent me a replacement with return label for the old one about 3 days after emailing them. im waiting for it now, but theyve been really good to me, this is nuts.


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

i say to op just return the bike and someone at BD warehouse needs be canned! thats no excuse sending a supposedly new bike like that.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

I'd be pissed :yesnod:


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## tihsepa (May 15, 2009)

Does this mean they are changing their name to "Used Bikes Direct"?

Seems that would be appropriate. 

Sorry about your ordeal.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

I love my Moto, but I paid for a new bike, and I received a new bike.

That is unacceptable!


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Thanks for the support guys. I'm lost about what to do. I got an email back from them saying that I can return the bike and they will ship out a new one today to expedite things, or I can suggest a way for them to "make things right". I know one thing for sure, if I go through the trouble of shipping it back, I'm getting a refund not another bike from them. The other option is to keep the bike (I can't see any obvious damage to the bike) and ask them for $ or goodies. I'll keep you posted.


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## davedg (Sep 11, 2009)

I would ask for another bike and a partial refund for the trouble of having to ship the bike back. 

Of course if you could get them to knock off a large dollar amount on the bike you have now, I would consider keeping it.


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## skankingbiker (Jan 15, 2010)

My general rule of thumb is that if I drop serious coin on a product and I am not completely satisfied, I return it. In your case, you paid for a new bike and were obviously sent a used bike. This is your second issue with this particular company. Once bitten, twice shy, three times the idiot......

Even if the issue is just cosmetic, I can tell you that everytime you ride that bike you will have in the back of your mind the notion that it isn't a new bike and will be wondering what else will go wrong. At the very least, you will ride it with the dissappointment knowing it is not a new bike.

I'd return it hands down, get a refund, and go to your LBS.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

davedg said:


> I would ask for another bike and a partial refund for the trouble of having to ship the bike back.
> 
> Of course if you could get them to knock off a large dollar amount on the bike you have now, I would consider keeping it.


This .........................................., but a used bike is worth at best 50% of retail .


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## kapaso (Sep 15, 2007)

006_007 said:


> K, lets not talk too crazy about BD - they may complain to the mods and have us banned
> 
> Agreed that bike assembly / maintenance is not too difficult if you have the correct tools and take your time.


That's one of BD's most redeeming qualities. The company gets bagged on a lot, but the owner has never had anyone banned. Some of the other advertisers are not so thick skinned, even though they put up with far less abuse.

Seriously, that is one of the reasons I would buy a BD bike.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

I would let them ship you a new bike.... as long as they provide the call tag to ship the bad bike back. 

Third time is the charm, right?

BTW, even retail bike shops have to deal with factory issues just like this.. you are just bypassing the middle man who would otherwise stress on it.


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

Well the cost of them shipping the bike back and sending you a new one will be between $100.00 and $150.00 more than likely so thats a good place to start. Since the bike is obviously tested, I would ask for a extended warranty on all parts past there normal warranty. Those things seem fair to me. Other than that see what you can get from them.


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## glitz (Jan 27, 2010)

kapaso said:


> That's one of BD's most redeeming qualities. The company gets bagged on a lot, but the owner has never had anyone banned. Some of the other advertisers are not so thick skinned, even though they put up with far less abuse.
> 
> Seriously, that is one of the reasons I would buy a BD bike.


I agree. BikesDirect works on a higher scale of ethics on this forum than many other advertisers.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Well... You obviously wanted the bike, since you dropped the coin already. Plus, you also got a free upgrade simply because they were out of stock on what you ordered. Maybe they'll boost you up another level if you really think it's necessary.


Seems all these threads end the same.. with a very satisfied BD customer, even if it takes a week longer than expected.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

HamfisT said:


> Seems *all these threads* end the same.. with a very satisfied BD customer, even if it takes a week longer than expected.


Well, that's the problem, 'all these threads'.
You don't seem to see these types of threads with PricePoint. (you're welcome Dan )

*I'm not shilling! - I'm making an observation*


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

I wouldn't keep that bike even if they give me discount for it. knowing that you paid for a new bike and they sent you a used one i'll be so aggravated. if i paid for a new bike i expect no less. tell BD to send you a new bike with a return slip for your used bike so you can send it back.


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

This bike would be a good upgrade all around http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/windsor/windsor_cliff29pro.htm. Get them to send it our ASAP, and ride the other one until the new one comes. That would be a good deal.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

highdelll said:


> Well, that's the problem, 'all these threads'.
> You don't seem to see these types of threads with PricePoint. (you're welcome Dan )
> 
> *I'm not shilling! - I'm making an observation*


There does seem to be a fair few of these threads...

It is good to see them handled professionally, though!

I'm no shill either, but I dig PricePoint as well.. They just helped me shave a nearly pound off my Moto 29pro for under a hundred bux! :thumbsup:


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

*Windsor Cliff 29er*



Dremer03 said:


> This bike would be a good upgrade all around http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/windsor/windsor_cliff29pro.htm. Get them to send it our ASAP, and ride the other one until the new one comes. That would be a good deal.


This is the only option that I think will make me walk away from this situation saying "that was good service." I understand they sell bikes in boxes and are not a LBS, but a sale is a sale, both parties should deliver what they promised (a new bike with all parts needed for assembly, within 5 or so business days).

That said, I'm 6'1 with a 34" inseam...the medium size sounds about right to me. 19" seat tube, 24" eff top tube, 32" standover. Whatcha think?


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## Speci-AL (Dec 8, 2009)

Never buy a bike based on what derailleurs it has. Most shops will let you upgrade to better derailleurs at the time of purchase.
But in all honesty when you upgrade from a Deore derailleur to an SLX derailleur there will be no performance increase that is noticeable to the rider. Especially when you still have Deore shifters.
If you are a new rider the drivetrain gets tore up anyway.

Name brand low end forks are not any better than no name low end forks. The main reason is that they are made in the same factory.

Go for the bike that has a better frame and wheels. The frame is the heart and soul of the bike and having one that fits properly and has the right geos for your area is critical.

Having strong and stiff dependable wheels will make the bike handle better and hold up to the punishment of newer riders.

The most overlooked item is the tires. This is where I would splurge. Get some nice grippy, higher thread count tires that are light weight. You'd be amazed how much better your bike will ride.

The best place to figure all this stuff out is your local bike shop.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Speci-AL said:


> Never buy a bike based on what derailleurs it has. Most shops will let you upgrade to better derailleurs at the time of purchase.
> But in all honesty when you upgrade from a Deore derailleur to an SLX derailleur there will be no performance increase that is noticeable to the rider. Especially when you still have Deore shifters.
> If you are a new rider the drivetrain gets tore up anyway.
> 
> ...


That is valuable information. If I return this bike and go to the LBS I will be disappointed because of the wasted time and effort. I want Bikes Direct to make it so that I can forget this ever happened.


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

Give Highdell a six pack and he will make sure BD solves this problem   Unabomber


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Just got a reply from Bikes Direct. They won't agree to either of the options I proposed to end this dilemma on a positive note (I keep the used bike and they refund me $150, or they send me a nicer bike that sells for $100 more at no additional charge to me). Only thing they will agree to is that they will pay to ship this back and send me a new one, or they will refund my money. That's it, bikes going back and I'll suck it up and pay the 650 for a GF Marlin disc '09 from my LBS.

Is it ok for me to start a new post in the Passion section or somewhere and link to this post, or do I run the risk of being banned? I want as many people as possible to see this post because I wish I had seen a similar one before doing business with Bikes Direct.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

I dont think that starting a new thread is the best idea , FWIW , 1200 views on this thread and counting . You can link this thread when someone asks about experiences with B.D. though .


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

lkn4life said:


> Just got a reply from Bikes Direct. They won't agree to either of the options I proposed to end this dilemma on a positive note (I keep the used bike and they refund me $150, or they send me a nicer bike that sells for $100 more at no additional charge to me). Only thing they will agree to is that they will pay to ship this back and send me a new one, or they will refund my money. That's it, bikes going back and I'll suck it up and pay the 650 for a GF Marlin disc '09 from my LBS.
> 
> Is it ok for me to start a new post in the Passion section or somewhere and link to this post, or do I run the risk of being banned? I want as many people as possible to see this post because I wish I had seen a similar one before doing business with Bikes Direct.


sorry to hear about your bad experiance, i know a few people that got motos and love them...

id post it to the moto boards if you havent already, and if they ban you, come back with a vengeance!!! :madmax:


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

Does anybody know about how many forum members have had bad experiences with Bikesdirect? Ive been doing alot of reading on the Motos and am considering buying one but havent seen too many negative things said about them.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

This seems to be an exception rather than the rule. I'm having a great time with my Moto 29er and Windsor road bike.


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

sorry it didn't work out for the op but if it was me i'll ask them to send a NEW bike with a return slip for the old bike and use the living crap out of that used bike they sent you


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## kukulkan (Aug 31, 2009)

Speci-AL said:


> Never buy a bike based on what derailleurs it has. Most shops will let you upgrade to better derailleurs at the time of purchase.
> But in all honesty when you upgrade from a Deore derailleur to an SLX derailleur there will be no performance increase that is noticeable to the rider. Especially when you still have Deore shifters.
> If you are a new rider the drivetrain gets tore up anyway.
> 
> ...


I think you are very wrong on this, no shop will let you upgrade any mayor components w/o paying for them and probably labor other than that i agree w the rest


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

send it back - never deal w/ them again
this thread is all the salesmanship they deserve.

look at the fukkin site!; you'd think they could scrap a layout or two after 'saving' you money.
hahahaha BD is a JOKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I hope you read this Mike - because it is..a joke....seriously
shyte squared


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

highdelll said:


> look at the fukkin site!; you'd think they could scrap a layout or two after 'saving' you money.


you are so right. the signs of a poorly run business are clearly there. they could easily trade a used bike to get some broke college student to come in and improve the website 100%. and the @aol.com email addresses should have been the second clue. i pay something like $10/month for 10 business email addresses with my own domain name. third clue - no phone numbers on the entire site.

i just hope they actually pay to ship the bike back.


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## kiwirider (Jul 12, 2004)

That middle ring is well worn, indicating that the bike has seen more than a few miles.

There is no way BD should get away with selling you a second hand bike as a new one. If you wanted second hand I'm guessing you would bought off ebay etc.

Surely there in the US you have laws against such dishonest behaviour and would have the backing of some government dept. Threaten BD with that and watch them come to the party.


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## Noobi-Wan Kenobi (Dec 24, 2007)

slyderHD said:


> Does anybody know about how many forum members have had bad experiences with Bikesdirect? Ive been doing alot of reading on the Motos and am considering buying one but havent seen too many negative things said about them.


There have been a few. Here's one:



29er_convert said:


> Got one of these Cliff29er from BikesDirect....yea yea I know. But for the price, could not have bought the components.
> Anyway, set this bike up as an urban/go anywhere ride. I had not even taken it out to the
> local trails(SugarBottom) yet.
> So, after 5 months of ownership I started hearing those all so annoying creaks. Changed the saddle, creaking. Changed the post and clamp, creaking. Repacked the BB and pedal bearings with Phil Wood, still creaking. Repacked the headset bearings, ahww creaking. Thread locked and torqued to spec every bolt on the d*mn bike, creaking.:madman:
> ...


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

^to be fair to bikes direct, they make it pretty clear that when you buy a bike from them that they do not cover the return shipping. Its part of the gamble we take when purchasing a bike online and I say tough cookies to the people that are disappointing with the lack of service when it comes to a warranty issue. Also I would bet that there are many more satisfied Bikes Direct customers than are not. People focus on the negatives, but I bet there are way more positives. But just like the news, no one talks about the good things because no one seems to care when everything is good.


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## tm240z (Jan 24, 2010)

I can't figure out why they wouldn't give you the $150 rebate. It's not like they can sell the bike again. Right?:skep: So they could have made the customer happy, and got rid of a used bike. Instead they have a pissed of customer, and a used bike.:thumbsup:


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## davedg (Sep 11, 2009)

I own a Moto 29er and am very happy with it. I did not buy it from BD, I purchased the frame used and built it myself. I've been considering buying a road bike from BD just to have something different to train on. After following this thread, I will be buying from some place other than BD.


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## glazer1972 (Mar 26, 2010)

I think I will steer clear of the folks in the future based on your experiences and the negative experiences of others. The hassle just isn't worth it.


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## CarolinaLL6 (Apr 12, 2010)

Sorry to hear about your frustrations but I suspect they are the exception rather than the rule.

I recently was in the market for an entry-level HT. I ended up purchasing a 700HT from BD. It arrived on time and undamaged. The price was right and I am satisfied.


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

confucius say .. Man who buy from bikes direct is man who gets screwed


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Dremer03 said:


> ^to be fair to bikes direct, they make it pretty clear that when you buy a bike from them that they do not cover the return shipping. Its part of the gamble we take when purchasing a bike online and I say tough cookies to the people that are disappointing with the lack of service when it comes to a warranty issue. Also I would bet that there are many more satisfied Bikes Direct customers than are not. People focus on the negatives, but I bet there are way more positives. But just like the news, no one talks about the good things because no one seems to care when everything is good.


So if I want to return a bike that was sent to me used, I should have to pay to ship the bike back?? If the bike was new but I wanted to send it back I would expect to pay the shipping.

I hope they do charge me to ship it back. That way even you will be able to see how much they SUCK.


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

lkn4life said:


> So if I want to return a bike that was sent to me used, I should have to pay to ship the bike back?? If the bike was new but I wanted to send it back I would expect to pay the shipping.
> 
> I hope they do charge me to ship it back. That way even you will be able to see how much they SUCK.


Didn't you say they will pay for the shipping if you return the used bike or is it BD will pay the shipping IF they ship a NEW bike to replace the used one?

How come you don't like them to send you a new one and just use the one you have now until you get the replacement?


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

lkn4life said:


> I feel like its my duty to the forum to continue posting my experience. I received my Motobecane Fantom HT today (May 5) after originally ordering a 700HT April 24th and then being notified they were out of stock. I was compensated $50 for my inconvenience.
> 
> After the wait I was excited to get started on the bike. The packaging hints that this bike was a return. After putting the handlebars and seat post on and flipping the bike over, I noticed chipped paint near the crank. I looked closer and found a few more scuffs and chips. I'm sending BD an email with these photos attached. Probably not a big deal but I'm afraid it could lead to some rusting in the future or more chipping in those areas. I'm just ticked because I know I wouldn't have bought a bike from a LBS with chipped paint, unless there was a discount on it. And I don't want to send it back for a refund after all of these delays. What would yall do?


:thumbsup: Good for you! All I have to say is that you should have gone to your LBS.

Buying online is not only bad for your local economy but stupid and can screw the buyer(you). :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: rft:


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

They haven't clarified who pays for shipping if I just want a refund. 

And I don't want another bike from them because its been 15 days. And no I can't ride the current bike because its missing a bolt for the front brake. The box has "restock ok" written on it in marker. Someone looked at the bike and didn't notice/care about the scratches, wear, and missing bolt. I'm not going another 5 days without a bike. I get f'd out of more than 2 weeks of riding if I continue to wait..instead they are losing a customer plus who knows how many more. A phone call or reply from user BikesDirect who I pm'd a few days ago on this forum would have been appreciated as well.


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## tihsepa (May 15, 2009)

Hellrazor666 said:



> confucius say .. Man who buy from bikes direct is man who gets screwed


X 11dbillion.


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

lkn4life said:


> So if I want to return a bike that was sent to me used, I should have to pay to ship the bike back?? If the bike was new but I wanted to send it back I would expect to pay the shipping.
> 
> I hope they do charge me to ship it back. That way even you will be able to see how much they SUCK.


Did your bike break and needs to be fixed? Your problem should have been taken care of in the ways I pointed out days ago.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

A from Il said:


> X 11dbillion.


-1

I didn't get screwed :thumbsup:


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

HamfisT said:


> -1
> 
> I didn't get screwed :thumbsup:


+1 i'm a happy Fantom 29 PRO SL ownder and had pretty good experience with BD.

"A man who buys from BD supposedly know what he's doing and what he's getting into"...


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

+1 From me. My Windsor Wellington 3.0 works fine.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Dremer03 said:


> Well the cost of them shipping the bike back and sending you a new one will be between $100.00 and $150.00 more than likely so thats a good place to start. Since the bike is obviously tested, I would ask for a extended warranty on all parts past there normal warranty. Those things seem fair to me. Other than that see what you can get from them.


Dremer if you are referring to the above than that is exactly what I did the day you suggested...I said I would keep their used bike for a $150 refund. They said they can't do that (Friday afternoon at 4pm). I'm not even considering that as an option anymore if they change their mind.


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## oldassracer (Mar 26, 2009)

They already gave you $50 discount off the Fantom Trail simply because they sold out of the 700HT

Just try that at your local shop...all you'll get if you order an out of stock item is a shrug and a refund.

Now, you are mad because they won't give you another $150 off for some scratches.  

They are going to send you a new bike - how is getting a new replacement for your scratched bike an unfair deal? They are paying for the return shipping.

:nono:


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## Snickers (Apr 4, 2010)

The more I read this thread, the more I want to claim B.S.

Oh yeah, I'm a very happy owner of an '09 Fantom Pro DS. It arrived on time and in perfect condition. 

Have you ever been to the plumbing department in Home Depot? There are PVC fittings on the shelves that have purple primer on them with stubs of pipe glued in and cut off. They'll accept a return on anything. It's a given that there are chances you take when buying online.


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## rm26x (Aug 13, 2006)

I guess I can see both sides. They did make a mistake, but they also offered to cover return shipping and send you a new one after already giving you $50 off for the out of stock issue. Yes, it sucks, but at least you weren't scammed out of your money and stuck with nothing. I would tell them to cover the shipping and another $50 discount for the inconvience. I think thats fair.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Fine I'm frustrated and overreacting perhaps. I don't have a functioning bike to ride (old dept store bike needs repair). I expected one in 5 days. All I want is them to take the bike back and pay to ship it back at this point. After that ill never mention bikes direct in a post. Regardless of everything else that is fair, no?


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

lkn4life said:


> Fine I'm frustrated and overreacting perhaps. I don't have a functioning bike to ride (old dept store bike needs repair). I expected one in 5 days. All I want is them to take the bike back and pay to ship it back at this point. After that ill never mention bikes direct in a post. Regardless of everything else that is fair, no?


I FWIW dont think you are overreacting . B.D. has shown an unwillingness to make this transaction anything other thn the clusterfuk that it is . If I did buissness in the manor which they have in this instance , I could count on closing the doors in short order . Props to you , keep it up . :thumbsup:


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

How so?

They gave him a discount on a better bike because the one he ordered was out of stock.

The bike he received was obviously not new, so BD offers to send a new one out, BEFORE recieving the defective one back. and pick up the bad one at their expense.


I think BD did everything any other company could be expected to do. Maybe even more


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

lkn4life said:


> Fine I'm frustrated and overreacting perhaps. I don't have a functioning bike to ride (old dept store bike needs repair). I expected one in 5 days. All I want is them to take the bike back and pay to ship it back at this point. After that ill never mention bikes direct in a post. Regardless of everything else that is fair, no?


They sent you a functioning bike, go ride it until the actual new one comes. Dont worry about missing one little bolt on the rotor.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

HamfisT said:


> How so?
> I think BD did everything any other company could be expected to do. Maybe even more


If shipping used bikes in the stead of new ones is to be expected I guess your right .


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## shenny88 (Sep 24, 2009)

yeah, it really sucks and yeah, you got screwed. THEY made a mistake and seem to be handling the way any other decent company would. someone at BD got lazy inspecting that bike, he should get an ear full. on that note, i would accept their offer for what seems like an amazing deal at the expense of 2 weeks waiting too long, as long as it doesnt cost anymore shipping. hope it works out from here.

...im a satisfied BD customer, but also sympathize.


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## walangkatapat (Jun 2, 2009)

I've ordered one bike from Bikes Direct and plan on ordering again.


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

If you are so fed up with BD, how about you go elsewhere and look at similarly equipped bikes and look to spend a hell of a lot more money? If I were in your position, I would go to your LBS, get a single rotor bolt, maybe some Lizard Skins frame patches and move on with your life and accept the bike you waited for. I wouldn't continue to nag them. It's not like they are out to scam you. If they were, you would still be waiting for that bike to arrive. They realized that they made a mistake and are doing everything in their power to fix it. And I applaud a company that would do that. Even when your other bike comes from them, it's gonna get a scratch (if you actually ride it). It's a mountain bike, not a mantle piece.


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

It seems like the from what is explained here that BD handled it like a regular co. would.
The reason they cannot give you a $150 refund for a used bike is because they are not going to be able to determine that it is used from from the photo alone. If they pay for the return shipping and and send you a new one I think that that is fair. Now if the new one comes with problems then I would not be happy, you have to be clear with them that you want it to be brand new.


Also how many people have advised to ride the piss out of the bike before you send it back? This is why there is used merchandise in their warehouse to begin with. It is selfish and immature of someone to do that. IMO your looking for a cheaper bike to begin with because you MAY be a cheapskate who wont go to your lbs and buy a decent bike.

These negative complainers probably cannot handle making a purchase to begin with without being an insolent snob. (lol my bad)

They can offer the components group at a lower cost due in part to the bikes not being assembled and them not having an elaborate website/staff. (speculation)


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

lkn4life said:


> That said, I'm 6'1 with a 34" inseam...the medium size sounds about right to me. 19" seat tube, 24" eff top tube, 32" standover. Whatcha think?


Im about the same size as you and I require a 25" TT length. I think the Motobecane's geometry may be a little too small for you.


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## savagemann (Jan 14, 2008)

drvn93 said:


> The reason they cannot give you a $150 refund for a used bike is because they are not going to be able to determine that it is used from from the photo alone.
> 
> It has clearly been riden quite a bit. Look at the wear on the chainrings!!!!!!
> 
> ...


Wow.


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

Yes but every company is not going to issue partial refunds over photos from email. Im not saying that the op is faking the photos but a company would have no way of knowing.

I agree that one should not have to specify that they want brand new when ordering, I just think that since it has come this far if one wants a new replacement then they should be clear that they do not want factory restock.

If you want a cheaper bike then you may get cheaper service. But slandering just mirrors the energy in return.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

ut:


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## fischman29er (Mar 30, 2010)

My BD purchase was great compared to this. I sincerely feel for your situation. It sucks not being able to ride when you want to. I do think that their offer was a good one though. If they are willing to make it right by giving you a new bike and pay for the return shipping on the old one you are still coming out significantly ahead. They provided a $50 discount already due to an issue on stock which you would never get at a LBS. Also, you are saving a decent amount on the bike when compared to other options. All in all, I hope all works out for you and that you are happy with what ever you end up riding. That's the most important thing.

Josh


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

was there any obvious damage to the box? sometimes that stuff happens during shipping


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## glitz (Jan 27, 2010)

BikesDirect=great company

I don't know how they do it, but they really get world class bikes to us for a fraction of the price.


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## tihsepa (May 15, 2009)

drvn93 said:


> was there any obvious damage to the box? sometimes that stuff happens during shipping


Bikes get ridden during shipping?


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

drvn93 said:


> It seems like the from what is explained here that BD handled it like a regular co. would.
> The reason they cannot give you a $150 refund for a used bike is because they are not going to be able to determine that it is used from from the photo alone. If they pay for the return shipping and and send you a new one I think that that is fair. Now if the new one comes with problems then I would not be happy, you have to be clear with them that you want it to be brand new.
> 
> Also how many people have advised to ride the piss out of the bike before you send it back? This is why there is used merchandise in their warehouse to begin with. It is selfish and immature of someone to do that. IMO your looking for a cheaper bike to begin with because you MAY be a cheapskate who wont go to your lbs and buy a decent bike.
> ...


Yeah lets send someone a used bike and call it new . You tell me why BD has the guts to send out a used bike to someone claiming it is new ? I call that misleading and dishonest. I think by taking a chance in ordering off line you assume **** like this will happen. To hear about is just bs. So why not beat the heck out of it before sending it back they screwed him turn bout is fair play. You sir are a snob also :thumbsup:


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## Snickers (Apr 4, 2010)

Perhaps bikesdirect as a whole did not send out a used bike. It may have been the decision of a single person in a remote warehouse. (A bad one at that). Before my bike shipped, a woman in Florida confirmed my shipping address before they handed it over to UPS.

Why not let them cover the shipping back and get a new one since in your earlier posts you were impressed with the components? Or just take the refund and get another elsewhere?


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

hardtailkid said:


> If you are so fed up with BD, how about you go elsewhere and look at similarly equipped bikes and look to spend a hell of a lot more money? If I were in your position, I would go to your LBS, get a single rotor bolt, maybe some Lizard Skins frame patches and move on with your life and accept the bike you waited for. I wouldn't continue to nag them. It's not like they are out to scam you. If they were, you would still be waiting for that bike to arrive. They realized that they made a mistake and are doing everything in their power to fix it. And I applaud a company that would do that. Even when your other bike comes from them, it's gonna get a scratch (if you actually ride it). It's a mountain bike, not a mantle piece.


Sending out an obvious used bike is a scam and they got caught on it and now have to fix their problem. Yes bikes get scratched but should it be done by the new owner not the previous one. Those scratches in pic are obviously from someone riding it before he got it.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Hellrazor666 said:


> Sending out an obvious used bike is a scam and they got caught on it and now have to fix their problem. Yes bikes get scratched but should it be done by the new owner not the previous one. Those scratches in pic are obviously from someone riding it before he got it.


Not a "scam". A scam is a consious attempt to deceive or defraud.

This is obviously a breakdown of quality control on bikesdirect's part. It happens with every company.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

glitz said:


> BikesDirect=great company
> 
> I don't know how they do it, but they really get world class bikes to us for a fraction of the price.


How many purchases have you completed with B.D. ?


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

A from Il said:


> Bikes get ridden during shipping?




Don't be an ass hole. If you can help it.


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

HamfisT said:


> Not a "scam". A scam is a consious attempt to deceive or defraud.
> 
> This is obviously a breakdown of quality control on bikesdirect's part. It happens with every company.


I'll add to that.

Bikes Direct is a business. 
They are trying to make money, just like ANY other business in the world. If they obsess over the quality of EVERY SINGLE bike they sell, they would no longer be around. They may not have cared too much about the bike they sent this guy, because they assumed that he would be a normal guy that wants a good bike. Because most other people that order a bike and may get in to this situation, won't care. Sure, they may not be the happiest customer in the world but at least they know that scratches and wear on a mountain bike are just parts of life. Maybe this dude was buying this bike to use as a mantle piece in his living room, but that doesn't give him the right to slam this business. In all honesty, he deserves to be sued for slander. This thread he started is really uncool.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

The bike received should NEVER have been shipped out. It looks to me like the BD customer return supervisor, or whatever they call the person that processes returns, REALLY dropped the ball. That bike was mistakenly put back into stock. There was NO WAY whoever pulled the order could have known the condition of the contents. There was no thought like "this guy's being an a**, let's send him a used bike". 

For the record, I've purchased two bikes from BD, and I'm very happy with them both. I'll buy from them any time!


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

hardtailkid said:


> I'll add to that.
> 
> Bikes Direct is a business.
> They are trying to make money, just like ANY other business in the world. If they obsess over the quality of EVERY SINGLE bike they sell, they would no longer be around. They may not have cared too much about the bike they sent this guy, because they assumed that he would be a normal guy that wants a good bike. Because most other people that order a bike and may get in to this situation, won't care. Sure, they may not be the happiest customer in the world but at least they know that scratches and wear on a mountain bike are just parts of life. Maybe this dude was buying this bike to use as a mantle piece in his living room, but that doesn't give him the right to slam this business. In all honesty, he deserves to be sued for slander. This thread he started is really uncool.


Slander would have to include statements made that the op knew were untrue , I fail to see where the op has slandered anyone FWIW . If the op wants to use his bike as a mantle piece thats up to him , he should have recieved the correct bike in "new , unused" condition the first time .


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

Hellrazor666 said:


> Yeah lets send someone a used bike and call it new . You tell me why BD has the guts to send out a used bike to someone claiming it is new ? I call that misleading and dishonest. I think by taking a chance in ordering off line you assume **** like this will happen. To hear about is just bs. So why not beat the heck out of it before sending it back they screwed him turn bout is fair play. You sir are a snob also :thumbsup:


lol at this thread...honestly I dont know this co. from a hole in my head


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

AZ.MTNS said:


> Slander would have to include statements made that the op knew were untrue , I fail to see where the op has slandered anyone FWIW . If the op wants to use his bike as a mantle piece thats up to him , he should have recieved the correct bike in "new , unused" condition the first time .


Sorry. I didn't know the actual definition of "slander." I thought it was the deliberate attempt to do harm to a person, company, nation, or business, through something negative either spoken or written. It may not be slander, but I can't say I agree with what hes doing. Sorry if I caused any confusion, I'm not too familiar on legal terms.


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

HamfisT said:


> The bike received should NEVER have been shipped out. It looks to me like the BD customer return supervisor, or whatever they call the person that processes returns, REALLY dropped the ball. That bike was mistakenly put back into stock. There was NO WAY whoever pulled the order could have known the condition of the contents. There was no thought like "this guy's being an a**, let's send him a used bike".
> 
> For the record, I've purchased two bikes from BD, and I'm very happy with them both. I'll buy from them any time!


Well all bikes should be looked over before shipping out


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

hardtailkid said:


> I'll add to that.
> 
> Bikes Direct is a business.
> They are trying to make money, just like ANY other business in the world. If they obsess over the quality of EVERY SINGLE bike they sell, they would no longer be around. They may not have cared too much about the bike they sent this guy, because they assumed that he would be a normal guy that wants a good bike. Because most other people that order a bike and may get in to this situation, won't care. Sure, they may not be the happiest customer in the world but at least they know that scratches and wear on a mountain bike are just parts of life. Maybe this dude was buying this bike to use as a mantle piece in his living room, but that doesn't give him the right to slam this business. In all honesty, he deserves to be sued for slander. This thread he started is really uncool.


Not true if they cared about every bike they sent out they would not have problems such as this. They would have way more people buying from them then complaining. Yes wear & scratches come with biking but shouldn't it be the paying customers that put it on the bike not someone else . This gives the op every right to slam this company. He paid for NEW bike not a used one. It was un cool of them to ship a used bike out to someone who was expecting a new one. Like any product things should be inspected before shipping. Never assume cause you can make an ass of yourself in the process


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Not one single major factory is going to open each box and look at the contents. That makes zero sense as a business practice. Why would they bother to pack them in the first place if they need to inspect them on an individual basis.

These bikes are shipped straight off the ship from Taiwan, from multiple warehouses. When a bike gets returned, I imagine there's a department that's responsible for determining it's suitability for sale. This department, and ONLY this department is where the ball got dropped. 

I'm not saying the OP is wrong at all, quite the reverse actually. But there seems to be several people here who think BD is deliberately trying to rip people off.


Oh yeah... I can guarantee you, there are FAR more happy customers than complaints.


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## CarolinaLL6 (Apr 12, 2010)




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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

hardtailkid said:


> If you are so fed up with BD, how about you go elsewhere and look at similarly equipped bikes and look to spend a hell of a lot more money? If I were in your position, I would go to your LBS, get a single rotor bolt, maybe some Lizard Skins frame patches and move on with your life and accept the bike you waited for. I wouldn't continue to nag them. It's not like they are out to scam you. If they were, you would still be waiting for that bike to arrive. They realized that they made a mistake and are doing everything in their power to fix it. And I applaud a company that would do that. Even when your other bike comes from them, it's gonna get a scratch (if you actually ride it). It's a mountain bike, not a mantle piece.


Do you know me? You don't so don't start labeling me. I work hard for my money. I also own a business and we mainly deal in "economy" segment hotels. We too have to provide a clean room, just like the Ritz. If someones TV isn't working and I tell them they have to wait 3 hours until another room is available, don't you think they are going to ask me for a discount??

Last thought...lets say you buy a new car from an out of state dealer because they offer you a hell of a deal. The car arrives and theres a french fry on the floor and theres a paint chip on the front bumper, something that can easily happen the first day that you are going to drive it from pebbles on the highway. Are you just gonna say "well I got a great deal I should expect this. I will send it back and they will send me another one and I will be happy"?

And PS, so that hardtailkid can know me a little better - my wife yells at me because when we get bad service at a restaurant I still usually tip the same as always - more than 15%. I also shop a lot online and have never had an issue with the goods I have received if my memory serves correctly. I'm usually the one saying chill out dude you're overreacting.

In happier news, as soon as the return information is finalized (hopefully tomorrow), I'm picking up a new GF Piranha from last year for $699 from one of the bike shops I hadn't checked out before this purchase. I can't wait to RIDE IT!


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## wheelmanron (May 5, 2009)

Look at the chain rings and cassette. They have been ridden. You are due a MAJOR discount or send it back. I know the wait is tough, but get your money back. I hope all works out for you.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

hardtailkid said:


> I'll add to that.
> 
> Bikes Direct is a business.
> They are trying to make money, just like ANY other business in the world. If they obsess over the quality of EVERY SINGLE bike they sell, they would no longer be around. They may not have cared too much about the bike they sent this guy, because they assumed that he would be a normal guy that wants a good bike. Because most other people that order a bike and may get in to this situation, won't care. Sure, they may not be the happiest customer in the world but at least they know that scratches and wear on a mountain bike are just parts of life. Maybe this dude was buying this bike to use as a mantle piece in his living room, but that doesn't give him the right to slam this business. In all honesty, he deserves to be sued for slander. This thread he started is really uncool.


DUDE SERIOUSLY???? I am just documenting my experience thats what the internet and forums like this are for. I'm done with this thread.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

HardTailKid/KevinBicycle/Glitz/Kona/(sometimes insanity)/RIS/OLD Bxxerrider/AZ.MTNS....who else?


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

highdelll said:


> HardTailKid/KevinBicycle/Glitz/Kona/(sometimes insanity)/RIS/OLD Bxxerrider/AZ.MTNS....who else?


.....Cannn I help you...????


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

hardtailkid said:


> .....Cannn I help you...????


yes Barbie


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

highdelll said:


> yes Barbie


lol leave the kid alone he's 15, I would have seen things the same way as he does back then. i've been burned by people a couple of times..you live and you learn.


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## hardtailkid (Jan 25, 2010)

lkn4life said:


> lol leave the kid alone he's 15, I would have seen things the same way as he does back then. i've been burned by people a couple of times..you live and you learn.


Don't talk to me like I'm 15. And disregard Highdell, hes a bit of a TROLL.


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## drvn93 (Apr 29, 2010)

so you gonna get your gayr fisher or what? that bikes direct seems kinda cheese


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

drvn93 said:


> so you gonna get your gayr fisher or what? that bikes direct seems kinda cheese


Getting a better bike all in all...for $100 more than the Fantom ($150 more if you count the $50 off I got). 2009 Piranha http://fisherbikes.com/bike/model/piranha

With my luck so far the bike will be gone tomorrow before I can pick it up.


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## Hellrazor666 (Oct 27, 2008)

lkn4life said:


> Getting a better bike all in all...for $100 more than the Fantom ($150 more if you count the $50 off I got). 2009 Piranha http://fisherbikes.com/bike/model/piranha
> 
> With my luck so far the bike will be gone tomorrow before I can pick it up.


At least if there is something wrong you know where to go


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## campisi (Dec 20, 2004)

lkn4life said:


> Getting a better bike all in all...for $100 more than the Fantom ($150 more if you count the $50 off I got). 2009 Piranha http://fisherbikes.com/bike/model/piranha
> 
> With my luck so far the bike will be gone tomorrow before I can pick it up.


Don't be surprised if there's a paint chip or two on your Piranha. Little nicks sometimes happen during assembly but you have the right to be pissed if the rings are worn (as they were on your BD bike).


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

Hellrazor666 said:


> confucius say .. Man who buy from bikes direct is man who gets screwed


+1 on that!:thumbsup:

To all of you that say -1 you just have not had the screwing get you yet. :nono:


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

boogenman said:


> +1 on that!:thumbsup:
> 
> To all of you that say -1 you just have not had the screwing get you yet. :nono:


So obviously, you've personally been screwed by bikesdirect?


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

HamfisT said:


> So obviously, you've personally been screwed by bikesdirect?


Not at all, I haven't even been to their site. I'm a LBS kind of guy.

I wish screwing upon people that buy online, there is no need for it.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

There is no need to save hundreds of dollars because you know how to assemble and maintain your own equipment????

That sure makes a lot of sense!


Edit to add:

You're entitled to your own opinion, of course. But to wish "screwing" on someone for saving a few bucks seems pretty low, in MY opinion.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

A local shop can lower prices to meet a customer in the middle for an online deal. Sure there is the rare occasion that a product is cheaper online by a few dollars but it is usually tires or some other small part, not a bicycle. There are not many times where anyone is going to save hundreds or dollars. More like $10-$20. 

Back on topic here the dude got screwed and has been without a bike for a few weeks. Why not just spend a bit more and get the face to face support that many bikers need? Good luck getting quick and reliable warranty support from something you purchased online, especially a bike.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

shops rarely have what I want specifically
BUT!, they 'can order it for me' !! :idea:
F-that...pay more for someone else to 'order it'? and have it take twice as long to arrive? ut:


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

A good shop can get product in just as fast as you can buy it online and for the same price plus shipping, sometimes cheaper if you buy a lot or if it is a big item. 

I'm doing consulting for a new shop right now and we have set up a plan where we can get a good amount of stuff in less than 24 hours for no additional shipping costs. The owner just oredered a complete build kit for a DH bike for about $400 less than the customer could get everything for online, everything was in the shop 3 days after the customer walked in and the shop still turned a pretty darn good profit on the stuff. 

rft:


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## Cday1616 (Oct 12, 2009)

I love BD threads....they always seem to degenerate into something entertaining 
:devil:


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Unless you buy dozens of bikes from your LBS, and get a serious good customer discount, there's NO WAY they can match online prices. it just isn't possible.

I did research before I bought, and I literally saved hundreds of dollars!


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

HamfisT said:


> Unless you buy dozens of bikes from your LBS, and get a serious good customer discount, there's NO WAY they can match online prices. it just isn't possible.


I just told you it is possible. I am not going to tell anyone what cost is on bike parts but it IS POSSIBLE. I have done this for 2 local shops, one a few years ago which is killing it in sales and again just a month ago for a new shop which is also getting a ton of business.

Some shop owners are greedy idiots and those are the places where this will never happen. The thing they don't understand is that by reducing profit margin to internet pricing is going to increse traffic and slaes volume which in turn increases profit margin because the customers are buying other stuff off the shelf like lube, tools, tires and clothing which they did not intend to buy.

10+ years working in shops as a teenager and through college I learned a thing or two and them applied what i learned in college to make the plan work.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

Cday1616 said:


> I love BD threads....they always seem to degenerate into something entertaining
> :devil:


Me too:thumbsup:


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## davidbeinct (Dec 6, 2007)

boogenman said:


> Not at all, I haven't even been to their site. I'm a LBS kind of guy.
> 
> I wish screwing upon people that buy online, there is no need for it.


That's ridiculous. I support my LBS(s) WHEN they will match reasonable (i.e. NOT flea-bay) prices for components, etc. Many of the LBSs in my area will not budge, most of the rest will go 10% off retail. I can install any part on any bike I own, why should I pay them full retail for a cassette when Jenson, among others, will ship me the same cassette for a little over half retail including shipping?

LBSs are learning to adjust. The one's that do have seen me drop coin for CK, X0, etc. The one's that don't, don't get my money.

As to BD in particular, my one experience with them was positive. I got the bike advertised, and when the rear wheel only was way out of true (verified by iPhone video), they agreed to ship me a new and much better wheelset and include an RA for the return of the old one.

David B.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Not everyone has lifelong connections with bicycle wholesalers, the average guy off the strees is not going to get those discounts. Certainly not around here.

I'm happy for you though, It's good to see shops are seeing the light. The internet has made things hard for all forms of brick and mortar businesses.

I am also happy for ME, and that's all that matters, isn't it?


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

HamfisT said:


> Not everyone has lifelong connections with bicycle wholesalers, the average guy off the strees is not going to get those discounts. Certainly not around here.


Where are you located? I would try talking to a shop owner to what they are willing to do.

The average guy around here gets the discount because we advertise the deals and also price product on the shelf like our internet competition.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

The closest shop has maybe 4 new bikes for sale, very small operation. There is a larger store in Hilton Head that I've never been to. 

Don't get me wrong, I still support my shop when it comes to things like tubes and clothing, but I can have any component I desire within three or four days ordering it myself.


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## jdgang (Oct 1, 2009)

HamfisT said:


> Unless you buy dozens of bikes from your LBS, and get a serious good customer discount, there's NO WAY they can match online prices. it just isn't possible.
> 
> I did research before I bought, and I literally saved hundreds of dollars!


I hate to shop at your LBS. I just started riding this past sept. I have not purchased a complete bike from my LBS. In fact I purchase my frame locally and all of the parts from the internet except for a couple of parts given to my by a friend. I had my LBS put it all together. I needed to replace the brakes since they where given to me, my LBS sold me a pair of Avid Elixir R 2010 185mm F/R for $135 each installed. Not only that but even after riding them once or twice they needed to be re-bled, brought them back and he had them re-bled in about 20 minutes for no charge. and even on top of that the back level failed after three weeks and my LBS had it warranty for no charge.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

uhhh


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## sanjuro (Sep 29, 2004)

hardtailkid said:


> I'll add to that.
> 
> Bikes Direct is a business.
> They are trying to make money, just like ANY other business in the world. If they obsess over the quality of EVERY SINGLE bike they sell, they would no longer be around. They may not have cared too much about the bike they sent this guy, because they assumed that he would be a normal guy that wants a good bike. Because most other people that order a bike and may get in to this situation, won't care. Sure, they may not be the happiest customer in the world but at least they know that scratches and wear on a mountain bike are just parts of life. Maybe this dude was buying this bike to use as a mantle piece in his living room, but that doesn't give him the right to slam this business. In all honesty, he deserves to be sued for slander. This thread he started is really uncool.


The customer is always right... sometimes?

I prefer, "You get what you paid for".

With the custom framebuilders I know minor paint blips, like next to a head badge, will result in an automatic return.

Of course, these frames cost more than anything from BD...


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## byknuts (Aug 9, 2008)

HamfisT said:


> Not a "scam". A scam is a consious attempt to deceive or defraud.


I'm pretty sure that's exactly what's being said.
Client (and many others) feel that BD's shady reputation is deserved, and said individuals are directly inferring that BD deliberately tried to screw this kid. 
So how would it NOT be a scam? 
How exactly does the warranty department let a used bicycle get packaged and shipped, especially to a customer that's already disatisfied and would obviously be double checking his stuff form here on in? This is the mail-order equivalent of spitting in the customer's soup because they sent the salad back. 
Then wondering how you got caught spitting in the soup.

Sorry, but Banshee is a 2 or 3 man operation, no excuses for this type of behaviour from BD, because the guys at Banshee are stellar in treating their customers. "lack of manpower or oversight" cuts no ice.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

That's ridiculous..

He wasn't a dissatisfied customer! BD OFFERED to take 50 bucks off the upgraded bike because the one he ordered was over-sold.

I would not have accepted the damaged bike either, but I would surely have let them ship me a new one.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

HamfisT said:


> That's ridiculous..
> 
> He wasn't a dissatisfied customer! BD OFFERED to take 50 bucks off the upgraded bike because the one he ordered was over-sold.
> 
> I would not have accepted the damaged bike either, but I would surely have let them ship me a new one.


Done deal, they emailed me the shipping label. Bikes out the door tomorrow. You're right HamfisT, I could let them send me another bike and I would probably be happy with it a year down the road. But if we all do that when something goes wrong, when are they going to realize that they need to check returned bikes more closely? And that the front caliper needs 2 bolts not one? When you delay a person for a significant amount of time they deserve a phone call? One of those 3 issues alone, fine, I would have been ok with it. All 3 together? Sorry you aren't getting a dime from me. I would LOVE to see what their warehouse and office look like, I can only imagine.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

You did the right thing, you are making yourself happy, and that's all that matters.

I'm sure you'll totally enjoy the new GF bike!


I'm just sick of all the haters who haven't dealt with BD bouncing speculation around. I've had good luck with them, and as long as they continue to offer product that interests me, I'll shop there.

Like I said, the GF bike you're buying was shipped in exactly the same manner as a BD bike, You're just paying the LBS to deal with any problems that may arise.


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## fuji1971 (Apr 13, 2010)

highdelll said:


> send it back - never deal w/ them again
> this thread is all the salesmanship they deserve.
> 
> look at the fukkin site!; you'd think they could scrap a layout or two after 'saving' you money.
> ...


Wow - Nice reply . I have never purchased a bike from BD, but have had my fair share of problems at local bike stores. I have found one I like and continue to spend ALOT of money with them. I'm looking at the Fly XX and asked the LBS I deal with their opinion. They said get it. It's a great deal and anything I'm not capable of working on they would take care of for me. Again I am loyal to this shop and I believe they are loyal to me in return. I have been in the retail business for many years, and have done very well. You have to try and make every customer happy within reason. It sounds like BD has done this with the offer of letting you ride the damaged product until the new bike ( shipped expedited ) arrives. Sometimes things happen and the purchase of a new bike is definetly a passionate and exciting one. I hope you find the bike you appreciate.

As for this tools post. These are the customers you don't want to do business with. It doesn't matter if it's BD, the LBS, or something you sold this gentleman from ebay. He would never be happy, or have anything good to say about your services or proucts no matter how hard you try to please him. These are the customers who's dollar is worth more than the next guys because it's his. When it comes to my business I like to tell these people to save their money and spend it with someone who NEEDS their business. I would rather wipe the shyte from my AZZ with his money.:eekster: Have a great evening fella.:thumbsup:


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

are you serious - have you even read the crap the OP went through?
f-off


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## fuji1971 (Apr 13, 2010)

highdelll said:


> are you serious - have you even read the crap the OP went through?
> f-off


Come on highdell, is f-off the best you got. Wow you must be one of those tough guys I've been warned about. As for seeing what he went through, I did. His situation sucks and someone at BD made a mistake. It happens to the rest of us. BD offered to send him a new bike and cover shipping. If he was not happy with the resolution he should have declined, and he did. He purchased a great bike and hopefully he is happy.Your post about BD and comments were wrong. I've read lots of posts praising these guys. I've had worse experiences at LBS, some could care less about you. The others are truly interested in getting you the right bike. BD sells alot of bikes and maybe they could care less also, but to trash them with the comments you made says alot. I ,and the others posters can't wait for the wisdom of your reply. Let's strive to do better than f-off.:thumbsup:


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## GR1822 (Jun 23, 2009)

CarolinaLL6 said:


>


Ha!!! Love it


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

here's what i don't understand, people keep *****ing and whining how the website looks like crap, no numbers to call, etc. etc. apparently, they don't understand that those things COST money and that where i think BD cut cost to be able to sell their bikes that low. it's unfortunate what happen to the op my question is why it took 2 weeks like what he stated to fix this problem? i had some issue with my hubs not so long time ago and it only took 5 days to get my problem resolved. somewhere along the line there was a miss communication there. 

it's a risk you're taking when you purchase anything unseen on the internet like wrong fit, wrong product, broken product, etc. but everyone should know that (i hope). but the significant money that you save when you buy online compare to local lbs is too much. too much for me that is. i bought the 29 pro sl for $995 now can anyone find a similar bike with the same component the sl have from a local lbs? everyone keeps saying support your local lbs, that's a bunch of crap! your local lbs is more than happier and makes more profit when you bring your bike for service. 

enough of the yapping so good luck to the op and i'm sure he'll be happy with his fisher and make sure to post some pictures when you get it


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Fine they don't have to post a phone number. But they have my number, I don't care if they call me with a blocked ID so I can't call back! 

I was at the LBS earlier and they were putting together some bikes and I saw the boxes they came out of. Pristine. Am I wrong to assume they got their bikes shipped to them the same way as Bikes Direct? Did you see the pic of the box that I received?


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

did you pm mike from bd like what i suggested before? if you did, did you get a respond from him? we all know someone f*ed up at BD and we all know who ever shipped that bike of yours screwed up. i'm pretty sure he just pick up the box without looking at it. and yes i saw that box your bike came with and you do know UPS was used to ship that box right? that was a pristine box from UPS i say.


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## davedg (Sep 11, 2009)

Me thinks there are people posting on these BD threads that work at the LBS.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

bRyAZSig228 said:


> did you pm mike from bd like what i suggested before? if you did, did you get a respond from him? we all know someone f*ed up at BD and we all know who ever shipped that bike of yours screwed up. i'm pretty sure he just pick up the box without looking at it. and yes i saw that box your bike came with and you do know UPS was used to ship that box right? that was a pristine box from UPS i say.


PM'd him May 5th, no reply. "Restock OK" was written on the box, meaning someone had seen it before putting it back into inventory.

And to clear some things up, they never said I can ride this one until the other one gets here. They said they will ship the other one out that day (last Friday), that they aren't going to wait until the used bike gets there to ship out the new one. Regardless of everything else, I was ordering a bike April 24th and even if I took them up on their offer the day they offered it, I wouldn't have a bike until May 12th to 13th. In return for these delays Bikes Direct would have given me $50 off (which they were only offering if I bought a more expensive bike, so I still ended up spending $50 more than I wanted to originally). One group of people sees that as acceptable, the other doesn't. I've told the story how it is, people clearly have both sides of opinions on the situation. Future customers can make a fair decision based on this thread and the ones that praise the site.


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

davedg said:


> Me thinks there are people posting on these BD threads that work at the LBS.


thats a possibility


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

davedg said:


> Me thinks there are people posting on these BD threads that work at the LBS.


Actually, it's probably the other way around.

Their brands don't have high recognition and aggressive advertising so most of their sales are by Word-of-Mouth. Makes you wonder if the BD pushers aren't employed by BD or if they get some sort of incentives.

You will notice that whenever someone new to mountain biking asks for advice on what bikes to buy, a lot of people will give them several options to choose from which is what people with more experience should be doing to help the new guys...but you will always get a number of BD pushers that only recommends BD bikes.

I'm sure BD bikes are great, but it annoys the hell out of me when there are all these people trying to give good advice with variety of options...and then comes these BD pushers that only recommends BD bikes.

Nothing personal, BD...but your BD faithfuls annoy me.


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## bikesdirect (Nov 7, 2006)

lkn4life said:


> I feel like its my duty to the forum to continue posting my experience. I received my Motobecane Fantom HT today (May 5) after originally ordering a 700HT April 24th and then being notified they were out of stock. I was compensated $50 for my inconvenience.
> 
> After the wait I was excited to get started on the bike. The packaging hints that this bike was a return. After putting the handlebars and seat post on and flipping the bike over, I noticed chipped paint near the crank. I looked closer and found a few more scuffs and chips. I'm sending BD an email with these photos attached. Probably not a big deal but I'm afraid it could lead to some rusting in the future or more chipping in those areas. I'm just ticked because I know I wouldn't have bought a bike from a LBS with chipped paint, unless there was a discount on it. And I don't want to send it back for a refund after all of these delays. What would yall do?


I am sorry your bike got beat up.
Is is clearly not a used bike as some have suggested; however this bike has been damaged intransit. That sometimes happens. {I have seen bike with just small paint rubbed areas all the way to bikes cut in half or run over by a truck]

Of course, we and UPS cover such issues - not the customer

I hope someone in customer service has already helped you [although we have had one key guy out sick] - if not please PM me.

Thanks for your order


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## bikesdirect (Nov 7, 2006)

AZ.MTNS said:


> That is clearly a used bike , I would expect to pay a used bike price . Just sayin .


This is not a used bike [take a close look at the tires]
This is a bike that has been really beat up in transit

Look at all the tape on the box - we do not put on tons of tape like that.
My guess is the box was smashed then fell open then the bike was damaged and put back in box and then retaped. I have seen this type of stuff in transit before: and worse.
But of course, we always take care of the customer with a discount or a replacement.


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## bikesdirect (Nov 7, 2006)

captainjoon said:


> Actually, it's probably the other way around.
> 
> Their brands don't have high recognition and aggressive advertising so most of their sales are by Word-of-Mouth. Makes you wonder if the BD pushers aren't employed by BD or if they get some sort of incentives.
> 
> ...


The ONLY person that works and BD and posts on forums is me. I always ID myself clealy.

You are correct - lots of our sales are word of mouth. BUT our bikes are advertsied, reveiwed, and do have high recognition in the industry.

People who suggest our bikes on forums are generally repeat buyers from us: and some that just see the value. Some that post against online buying are LBS types & some are just members that prefer local purchases.

There is plenty of more for bikes to be sold in many assorted methods - and alternative sales methods only help cyclists.


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## wv_bob (Sep 12, 2005)

captainjoon said:


> Nothing personal, BD...but your BD faithfuls annoy me.


Do Black Sheep, Jones, Niner, etc, etc, faithfuls annoy you? Seems to me that often the only difference is the size of the bank account.


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## USAF (Apr 18, 2010)

I've had great experiences (first purchase 5 years ago and no issues ever) with BD and there is NO WAY anyone could get a comparable bike for nearly the same price at an LBS. My latest BD purchase is a Ti Fantom Pro and I will proudly ride that bike in races for years to come. The money I've saved vs. getting a "name brand" Ti bike will buy my beer for years! Why should I pay so much more for a litespeed etc just to pay for their advertising, factory sponsored riders, and large workforce? Think I'm wrong? Then tell me where I could've gotten a Ti MTB comparably equipped to the Ti Fantom Pro for $1495. Most of you BD trashers are most likely associated with an LBS knowing that BD can kick your ass by offering a bike with comparable components for MUCH less money. The world-wide-web has now enabled us to make better buying decisions and the LBS's better think of something besides trashing BD in order to survive. My closest LBS went out of business last year (30 miles away) but I'll still gladly drive 45 miles for service at another LBS IF I would ever need to.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

bikesdirect said:


> This is not a used bike [take a close look at the tires]
> This is a bike that has been really beat up in transit
> 
> Look at all the tape on the box - we do not put on tons of tape like that.
> ...


I'm calling you out on this! look at the tires? BS dude! No kidding it is not a used bike but it sure as hell was returned to you for some reason and then resold to Ikn4life. Anyone who has a few years in a shop building bikes knows that every now and then a return like that comes in but you shouldn't resell it without letting the customer know or at least double checking that all the parts are in the box. If the box didn't have "restock ok" written on it I would believe you.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

davedg said:


> Me thinks there are people posting on these BD threads that work at the LBS.


So? What is wrong with that?


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

boogenman said:


> So? What is wrong with that?


They might not be able to form a biased decision about the bike, because there lively hood is built around people coming in and buying bikes.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

For me the bike has nothing to do with it. It is all about supporting a local business, paying taxes, the experience and the aftersale support.


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

boogenman said:


> For me the bike has nothing to do with it. It is all about supporting a local business, paying taxes, the experience and the aftersale support.


And thats exactly what you dont get when buying online, which is how online supporters save tons of money.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

No doubt the bike had been returned and restocked. Whether it was in the current condition at that time is impossible to tell, but it had definately been mishandled. 

UPS wouldn't write "restock OK" on a box.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

bikesdirect said:


> This is not a used bike [take a close look at the tires]
> This is a bike that has been really beat up in transit


did the chain get dirty in transit too?? :skep:


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## skankingbiker (Jan 15, 2010)

This is the thread that keeps on giving


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

bikesdirect said:


> This is not a used bike [take a close look at the tires]
> This is a bike that has been really beat up in transit
> 
> Look at all the tape on the box - we do not put on tons of tape like that.
> ...


Do you really think the users on this forum are stupid ? That bike is obviously not new , means that it is used , not new , used , pretty simple . I used to recomend B.D. , no more . For you to suggest that the bike in question is new is beyond rediculous , the claim in it self is comedic .


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Dremer03 said:


> And thats exactly what you dont get when buying online, which is how online supporters save tons of money.


Says the guy with a mail order house in his sig. line . :bluefrown:


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

AZ.MTNS said:


> Says the guy with a mail order house in his sig. line . :bluefrown:


So how do you think they get there prices so cheap? If its not the lack of local service, stores, and instant gratification then why are they up to half the cost of comparably speced store bought bikes?


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

Dremer03 said:


> So how do you think they get there prices so cheap? If its not the lack of local service, stores, and instant gratification then why are they up to half the cost of comparably speced store bought bikes?


the correct answer would be volume. :madman:


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## shenny88 (Sep 24, 2009)

i think its safe to say BD does what it was established to do pretty well. local bike shops that are run properly do what they were intended to do pretty well. the MAIN POINT is that they cater to their desired customer base. i dont understand how everyone could bash one or the other. i have a BD bike and i love walking into a bike shop to buy accessories and just wandering.... whats the problem?

...not to mention your thread totally got jacked, sorry.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

boogenman said:


> the correct answer would be volume. :madman:


WHAT!!!!????


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Dremer03 said:


> So how do you think they get there prices so cheap? If its not the lack of local service, stores, and instant gratification then why are they up to half the cost of comparably speced store bought bikes?


When you source your product from Vietnam , a Communist country in which its workers are paid pennies a day its easy to sell cheap products .


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

Another illogical argument.

Motobecane and Windsor frames are made in the Kinesis factory in Taiwan. same place that makes Fuji, Trek, Giant, etc

Shimano, Avid, SRAM, Truvative, WTB?

These sound like no-name generic parts to me!


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

My Windsor was made by Kinesis in Taiwan, not sure where your getting your info AZ.


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## SteveUK (Apr 16, 2006)

highdelll said:


> WHAT!!!!????


That's 1 louder, innit?


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Dremer03 said:


> My Windsor was made by Kinesis in Taiwan, not sure where your getting your info AZ.


I was refering of the products that you shill .


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

AZ.MTNS said:


> I was refering of the products that you shill .


I guess your oddly talking about Sette for some reason. As far as I know come from either from Taiwan or America, so I still have no idea what your talking about. This topics not about Sette, so move on.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

SteveUK said:


> That's 1 louder, innit?


It's not 10
you see most blokes ya know be playing at 10
you're on 10 here; all the way up, all the way up, all the way up, - you're on 10 on your guitar - where can you go from there? where?


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Dremer03 said:


> I guess your oddly talking about Sette for some reason. As far as I know come from either from Taiwan or America, so I still have no idea what your talking about. This topics not about Sette, so move on.


If you continue to talk about objectivity , I will continue to call yours into question . You are of all people the least objective to be part of this discussion . Your record of shilling and your "vested intrest" in an online retailer should leave you out of any "objective" discussion IMHO , so move on .


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

...


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## random walk (Jan 12, 2010)

highdelll said:


> ...


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

random walk said:


>


yeah, the link went to a 30sec clip :shrug:
so I un-linked it


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

the windsors do have Fuji frames....they even come with Fuji owners manuals


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

lkn4life said:


> Done deal, they emailed me the shipping label. Bikes out the door tomorrow. You're right HamfisT, I could let them send me another bike and I would probably be happy with it a year down the road. But if we all do that when something goes wrong, when are they going to realize that they need to check returned bikes more closely? And that the front caliper needs 2 bolts not one? When you delay a person for a significant amount of time they deserve a phone call? One of those 3 issues alone, fine, I would have been ok with it. All 3 together? Sorry you aren't getting a dime from me. I would LOVE to see what their warehouse and office look like, I can only imagine.


Nice work - post pics of the new rig once you get it!


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## CRed (Aug 4, 2007)

If i were the OP I would be upset too,but I have heard a lot of good things about BD also.I may be wrong about this,but it seems to me most of the people that complain about BD don't have,or never will have,a bike from BD.They see BD or Motobecane in the title and it's like hunting season to them.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

It was a good day...old bike is packed up, paid for the new bike. While packing the bike up I found that the previous shipping label wasn't fully cut off. So I've got the guys name and number that the box went to before me, maybe we can call him and ask what happened  So I think its safe to say the bike was sent to someone (back in August of 09). Also, I find the date stamped on the box kind of interesting, "Feb 09"...guess they started shipping those 2010 Motobecanes pretty early. Of course, they could just be reusing box's to save money so they can pass the savings on to you, the consumer.

But I digress...back to the new bike. *2010* Gary Fisher Cobia. Yes observant fans of this thread, I did double my budget, and yes I moved up to a 29er. And I'm not looking back. I did put some sh*t on Craigslist though to make up for it. That baby gets a new thread tomorrow when I pick it up and can take some pics, getting some changes made to it to fit right until then.


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## skankingbiker (Jan 15, 2010)

So not only did they send you a used bike and try to pass it off like it was new, but they also flat out pulled a bait and switch--selling you one model year and then shipping another........ :lol: 

Well, your thread has at least narrowed down the places from which I will NOT buy my next bike.


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## brianb21 (Mar 23, 2010)

Congrats on the new fisher and what a bunch of BS from the previous seller. I would be effing fuming.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

Congrats OP on getting what you want - although it took a bit.
F all the BD fanboys because that's all they are.
Jenson, BlueSky, CBO (old days), etc and others never seem to have any amount of sh!t like you describe.
Protesters?! prove it!
BD can suck it


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## dunerinaz (Mar 5, 2009)

highdelll said:


> Congrats OP on getting what you want - although it took a bit.
> F all the BD fanboys because that's all they are.
> Jenson, BlueSky, CBO (old days), etc and others never seem to have any amount of sh!t like you describe.
> Protesters?! prove it!
> BD can suck it


How do you really feel? 

And for the record I agree with you :thumbsup:


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## Cday1616 (Oct 12, 2009)

*Epic*

Who knew it could get anymore entertaining? Lets see what Mike from BD has to say about getting caught with his hand in the cookie jar...
:nono:


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

highdelll said:


> Congrats OP on getting what you want - although it took a bit.
> F all the BD fanboys because that's all they are.
> Jenson, BlueSky, CBO (old days), etc and others never seem to have any amount of sh!t like you describe.
> Protesters?! prove it!
> BD can suck it


This .......................


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## superotto80 (Jun 3, 2008)

This is by far the most entertaining thread I have read on any forum.


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

highdelll said:


> Congrats OP on getting what you want - although it took a bit.
> F all the BD fanboys because that's all they are.
> Jenson, BlueSky, CBO (old days), etc and others never seem to have any amount of sh!t like you describe.
> Protesters?! prove it!
> BD can suck it


just wondering, did you have bad experience with BD and that's why your so negative towards them?


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## skottt160 (Apr 25, 2008)

he he heh...

Did UPS put on the old shipping labels too, underneath yours, Mike?

Glad you got it all worked out lkn4life...


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## davedg (Sep 11, 2009)

superotto80 said:


> This is by far the most entertaining thread I have read on any forum.


\

It's like a train wreck. You don't really want to keep looking, but you just can't help it.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

AWESOME

I was gonna ask for a photo of the box with the writing on it, but you provided WAY better stuff!

So I wonder what mr bike durect has to say about "no way we shipped a used bike" now?

Excellent choice on the upgrade. Cant wait to see the new thread!



lkn4life said:


> It was a good day...old bike is packed up, paid for the new bike. While packing the bike up I found that the previous shipping label wasn't fully cut off. So I've got the guys name and number that the box went to before me, maybe we can call him and ask what happened  So I think its safe to say the bike was sent to someone (back in August of 09). Also, I find the date stamped on the box kind of interesting, "Feb 09"...guess they started shipping those 2010 Motobecanes pretty early. Of course, they could just be reusing box's to save money so they can pass the savings on to you, the consumer.
> 
> But I digress...back to the new bike. *2010* Gary Fisher Cobia. Yes observant fans of this thread, I did double my budget, and yes I moved up to a 29er. And I'm not looking back. I did put some sh*t on Craigslist though to make up for it. That baby gets a new thread tomorrow when I pick it up and can take some pics, getting some changes made to it to fit right until then.


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

I wouldn't blame BD as a whole. I think the biggest fault lies in the person who did the inspection and allowed it to be re-stocked.

If you know how bike sales work, even your LBS sells supposedly used bikes as new. If you're buying anything that is in stock, there's about 30% chance that it's been test ridden and about 5% chance that it's been returned. It's a common practice where they take in returns, inspect them, swap out any parts that show noticeable wear and then restock for new sale.

Even the bikes that are never test ridden will have little scratches and chips due to constant off/on racking in the store. The only way to be absolutely sure that you get a new bike is by making an order for a bike that is not in stock.

So in conclusion, I blame the guy who did the inspection. He should have inspected the bike more thoroughly and should have never restocked the bike. He could've even swapped out the parts that showed wear and restocked the bike but either due to his laziness or incompetence, this situation which put a big scar on BD's reputation has surfaced.

I still think BD faithfuls are annoying but I really think that their bikes are good deals and if they had paid more attention, they could've avoided this whole fiasco.

BTW...if you're reading this BD, I think your site can use some work. I think the shabby design of the site turns away a lot of potential customers. It's hard to give out your personal info and credit card number to a site that looks like it was designed from someone's basement. LBS sites don't really need much in site design since most of their business is local, but online only shops like yours needs a little more to give more confidence to online shoppers.


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## davedg (Sep 11, 2009)

captainjoon said:


> I wouldn't blame BD as a whole. I think the biggest fault lies in the person who did the inspection and allowed it to be re-stocked.
> 
> If you know how bike sales work, even your LBS sells supposedly used bikes as new. If you're buying anything that is in stock, there's about 30% chance that it's been test ridden and about 5% chance that it's been returned. It's a common practice where they take in returns, inspect them, swap out any parts that show noticeable wear and then restock for new sale.
> 
> ...


Well said.:thumbsup:


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## InlawBiker (Aug 19, 2009)

I don't see what the big deal is. If you order online you take a chance that you might have to ship it back. In exchange, you spend less money. 

All kinds of crap can go wrong with online sales. Shipments get lost, damaged, mis-delivered or whatever. Why all the fuss? All shops make mistakes. BD offered to make it right or refund the money. What else could they do? They sound like a good company to me.


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## amanda757 (May 14, 2010)

wow, I can't believe what I am reading, I am appalled at the way you have been treated by these people.


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## tsmosher (Mar 30, 2010)

InlawBiker said:


> I don't see what the big deal is. If you order online you take a chance that you might have to ship it back. In exchange, you spend less money.
> 
> All kinds of crap can go wrong with online sales. Shipments get lost, damaged, mis-delivered or whatever. Why all the fuss? All shops make mistakes. BD offered to make it right or refund the money. What else could they do? They sound like a good company to me.


They also claimed that the bike was new (when it clearly wasn't) and refused to issue a partial refund in exchange for him keeping the bike (which sounds like a win-win situation for them)... Instead, they're gonna have him send him back, and then they'll send it off to another poor shmuck. :thumbsup:

Gotta say that before this post, I was thinking I might order a bike from BD down the line if I get a FS. Not any more...


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

Dont BD ship factory direct? Do they ship directly from Motobecane or BD? or are they the same thing? If they are drop shipping bikes then it could be said that BD employees never touched the box. Just a thought.


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## Noobi-Wan Kenobi (Dec 24, 2007)

slyderHD said:


> Dont BD ship factory direct? Do they ship directly from Motobecane or BD? or are they the same thing? If they are drop shipping bikes then it could be said that BD employees never touched the box. Just a thought.


Nope, BikesDirect, Motobecane, and all their different brands are the same people.

There is no BikesDirect factory. BikesDirect is a customer of factories in China and Taiwan that manufacture bikes. Most brands do it that way.

This bike was a return, so BD employees touched the box at least two times.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

They do ship from multiple warehoused, but presumably they're still staffed by BD employees.

No excuse for the condition of that bike.


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## TwoHeadsBrewing (Aug 28, 2009)

*Thanks to the OP!*

First of all, thank you very much to the OP for posting their experience. Any honest information about BD is great, whether it be good or bad. Your situation is one of those bad experiences and was not handled correctly by BD. I've bought two bikes from them and been perfectly happy, and they're both going strong hundreds of miles later. We'll see how they stand up over time.

If anyone from BIkesDirect is reading this, here's what SHOULD have been done to make this failure into a big WIN for your company and for your customer:

1. Ask for pictures of the bike and packaging.
2. Upon seeing pics of the damage, offer to ship them a new bike and pay for return shipping.
3. If that doesn't work, take the customer up on their offer of a $150 refund so they can get out on the trail and have fun.

If you really want to make this right and WOW potential future customers:

 Ship them an upgrade: like a Fantom HT Comp. This means you eat $200 but earn the respect and confidence of current and future customers.
 Ship them a replacement bike and a $100 gift card to BikeIsland.com.
 In any case, personally call the customer when this happens. Make sure they know you're making it right, and they'll post this experience online for thousands to see and for years to come.

Whenever I personally am faced with an issue like this, I am thankful for the opportunity to "wow" my customer. I can take the potential to fail and turn it into a more positive experience than a normal transaction. This was a missed opportunity for the OP, sad to say.

BikesDirect has been great for me in the past, but I gotta say this is a disappointing experience. It makes me even more likely to warn people about buying from BD. This is a good customer service lesson on what NOT to do.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Between this thread and their rediculous warranty I'm sure I'll never use them . Kids make sure you read the warranty before purchasing from BD .


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## tihsepa (May 15, 2009)




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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

why is he in a pasture with a tie on?


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## tihsepa (May 15, 2009)

slyderHD said:


> why is he in a pasture with a tie on?


Pervert? I dunno.


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## TwoHeadsBrewing (Aug 28, 2009)

slyderHD said:


> why is he in a pasture with a tie on?


Office Space reference:


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## Dictatorsaurus (Sep 11, 2009)

TwoHeadsBrewing nailed it with his post.

Disappointed in BD. There are quite a few online bike companies but it seems most complaints are about BD.


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

yeah im kinda weary now. I was about to buy a 29er from BD but with all this crap im not sure now. Even with all the good things people say about em this cancels that out. Im under enough stress without dealing with returns and phone calls. At least if I buy from the LBS I can drive down there and back hand somebody if I have problems. Its hard to ***** slap somebody in an email!


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## fuji1971 (Apr 13, 2010)

This is a great post. I find it interesting how people jump the bandwagon. So i'm going to give my two cents. With that said I have never bought a bike from BD. I am considering the Fly Ti XX. This post really has no bearing on my decision. I do have my own business and I supply equipment to the public, so I have my own experiences with customer satisfaction. The way I read this post is that this gentleman was sold a used bike. He emailed BD and explained the problem, BD offered to send him another boxed unit. The customer declined and bought from his LBS. What does everybody think BD should have done? I think what they did is exactly what I would have done , except I would have apologized to the customer. They were going to expedite this customer a new unit. I'm not saying what happened was right, but with the posts I've read describing their excellent customer service I think I'll take my chances. I have a great LBS I purchase from consistently, but they agree the Ti XX is a great deal and to purchase it. I found this shop after dealing with two that just out right blew. Way worse than anything I have read about BD. My opinion is BD messed up and made a reasonable offer to make things right. The customer went a different way because of time. What would happen if you ordered a GF from the LBS and it was scratched out of the box. The LBS is going to make you wait until they get a new unit or discount the damaged one. This will be done at the shops discretion. Maybe a $50.00 credit from what I've seen. Again I am in no way tied to BD, I have never purchased from them. I am considering it and maybe I'll get burned and post about it. Maybe I'll post about a great experience. If I decide to purchase from them I will post. It seems to me there are many people who love them, and alot of people who don't. I think what they did was reasonable for customer service. If your not happy with your purchase return it. Looks like they covered the return shipping and credited the gentlemans money. Why are people commenting like they stole his last dollar, knifed his tires, and kicked his dog in the nuts.


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## bRyAZSig228 (Jan 25, 2010)

fuji1971 said:


> This is a great post. I find it interesting how people jump the bandwagon. So i'm going to give my two cents. With that said I have never bought a bike from BD. I am considering the Fly Ti XX. This post really has no bearing on my decision. I do have my own business and I supply equipment to the public, so I have my own experiences with customer satisfaction. The way I read this post is that this gentleman was sold a used bike. He emailed BD and explained the problem, BD offered to send him another boxed unit. The customer declined and bought from his LBS. What does everybody think BD should have done? I think what they did is exactly what I would have done , except I would have apologized to the customer. They were going to expedite this customer a new unit. I'm not saying what happened was right, but with the posts I've read describing their excellent customer service I think I'll take my chances. I have a great LBS I purchase from consistently, but they agree the Ti XX is a great deal and to purchase it. I found this shop after dealing with two that just out right blew. Way worse than anything I have read about BD. My opinion is BD messed up and made a reasonable offer to make things right. The customer went a different way because of time. What would happen if you ordered a GF from the LBS and it was scratched out of the box. The LBS is going to make you wait until they get a new unit or discount the damaged one. This will be done at the shops discretion. Maybe a $50.00 credit from what I've seen. Again I am in no way tied to BD, I have never purchased from them. I am considering it and maybe I'll get burned and post about it. Maybe I'll post about a great experience. If I decide to purchase from them I will post. It seems to me there are many people who love them, and alot of people who don't. I think what they did was reasonable for customer service. If your not happy with your purchase return it. Looks like they covered the return shipping and credited the gentlemans money. Why are people commenting like they stole his last dollar, knifed his tires, and kicked his dog in the nuts.


there's only 2 words i can think of after reading all op's post, buyers remorse... granted BD screwed up. but after he declines BD's solution to send him a new bike he went out to and bought a GF Cobia. he spent twice as much and the Cobia 29r from a fantom trail 26". but anyway i'm sure op is happier with the GF.


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## glitz (Jan 27, 2010)

HamfisT said:


> Another illogical argument.
> 
> Motobecane and Windsor frames are made in the Kinesis factory in Taiwan. same place that makes Fuji, Trek, Giant, etc
> 
> ...


Giant? Last I knew, Giant was making most frames for a huge chunk of the rest of the industry, including their direct competitors.


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## MTBERMISS (Jan 2, 2010)

Hopefully you bought the Motobecane... I bought the Fantom Trail a few years ago and it was a great bike. The motobecane has a better fork and it comes with a Shimano HG 12-34 Cassette which is just as good as a comparable SRAM. The fisher does look pretty cool though. The Motobecane will size up just like the Gary Fisher. Good Luck


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

MTBERMISS said:


> Hopefully you bought the Motobecane... I bought the Fantom Trail a few years ago and it was a great bike. The motobecane has a better fork and it comes with a Shimano HG 12-34 Cassette which is just as good as a comparable SRAM. The fisher does look pretty cool though. The Motobecane will size up just like the Gary Fisher. Good Luck


LOL.


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## Dictatorsaurus (Sep 11, 2009)

captainjoon said:


> LOL. This is why BD pushers annoy me.


And who cares?


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

Dictatorsaurus said:


> And who cares?


Obviously, you do...otherwise you wouldn't have replied.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

captainjoon said:


> Obviously, you do...otherwise you wouldn't have replied.


Do you care?


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

006_007 said:


> Do you care?


Yes I do.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

captainjoon said:


> Yes I do.


excellent.

What are we caring about?


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

006_007 said:


> excellent.
> 
> What are we caring about?


I forget, but whatever it is...I care...with passion.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

captainjoon said:


> I forget, but whatever it is...I care...with passion.


no you don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

see, that's passion - look at all the exclamations!!!!!!! ooh even more!!!!!

regardless, 006_007 wins simply because of his superior avatar


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

I am passionate about BD - I was not happy that they gave me a far inferior wheelset on the freeride bike I received from them.

They totally hooked me up with a set of the edge composites. Evidently these wheels are going to be standard on all of their 2013 products!


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

highdelll said:


> no you don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> see, that's passion - look at all the exclamations!!!!!!! ooh even more!!!!!
> 
> regardless, 006_007 wins simply because of his superior avatar


Dang man...I'm a lazy, passionate guy.

BTW...006_007 couldn't win. He is clearly gettin' a blow from a fat chick.

Wait...that's better than not gettin' a blow at all.

OK, he wins.


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## savagemann (Jan 14, 2008)

captainjoon said:


> Dang man...I'm a lazy, passionate guy.
> 
> BTW...006_007 couldn't win. He is clearly gettin' a blow from a fat chick.
> 
> ...


Fat chicks are kinda cool.
It's kinda like a motobecane, they're fun to ride until your buddies see you on one.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

savagemann said:


> Fat chicks are kinda cool.
> It's kinda like a motobecane, they're fun to ride until your buddies see you on one.


I actually laughed out loud so...LOL (<~~hate that acronym BTW)


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## Dictatorsaurus (Sep 11, 2009)

savagemann said:


> Fat chicks are kinda cool.
> It's kinda like a motobecane, they're fun to ride until your buddies see you on one.


If you are concerned with what others think, maybe home decorating or fashion would be more up your ally.


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

Status:
Delivered 
Delivered On:
05/17/2010 10:04 A.M. 
Shipped/Billed On:
05/10/2010

But still no refund. :madman:


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## captainjoon (Aug 11, 2009)

Have you tried a "Yo, where's mah money??" phone call?


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

Possible to get your credit card company to reverse the charges? 

Can always place a complaint with the BBB as well if things dont get worked out.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Suck's that it is taking so long , hope it works out without resorting to complaints and such .


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## lkn4life (Apr 22, 2010)

captainjoon said:


> Have you tried a "Yo, where's mah money??" phone call?


I would have called if I had a number. I emailed them earlier today...I waited until now in order to give them a chance for some redemption by getting the refund part right. After so much time to think about it (unfortunately), I understand how some people can say "not a big deal, Bikes Direct couldn't be expected to do more than what they offered." But I don't think anyone can say that anything they have done in this long ordeal points towards them being professional businesspeople.


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## slyderHD (Apr 21, 2010)

I got my refund in less than 4 working days and that wouldnt have taken that long had it not been for Paypal being dorks and putting a hold on it.


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## HamfisT (Mar 31, 2010)

No way to defend or explain this delay.. Come on, Mike, let's show some professionalism.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

lkn4life said:


> Status:
> Delivered
> Delivered On:
> 05/17/2010 10:04 A.M.
> ...


Now's just about the time to send Luca Brasi.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

I was gonna get a 29er from them, but not certain it is the best way to go. Maybe a 650?


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## savagemann (Jan 14, 2008)

Nah, get a 27.5.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

savagemann said:


> Nah, get a 27.5.


yeah.. now, but they're going to a 28.8 here in a bit.




CALIFIORNIA!


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## lanuch1110 (Apr 18, 2010)

All I have to say on this subject is this. 1. I feel bad for you dude, I didnt read the whole thread but i hope you like the Gary Fisher. And 2. My girlfriends dad and I bought new bikes at the same time. He bought a Windsor Somethin or other off BD and it came all messed up with the front derailer and Chainrings outta whack and is still at his LBS and they are trying to fix it, While I was sketched out by the website so I went to my LBS and bought a 2010 Stumpy comp which I love and works perfectly. Only problem is ive had to ride by myself lately because his bikes BROKEN!


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

highdelll said:


> yeah.. now, but they're going to a 28.8 here in a bit.


Cant find anyone w the 28.8 to demo.


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## bikingchad (Jul 15, 2009)

I have a BD bike that I'm happy with. It had none of the problems that others have described, so *my unique* experience was great but mainly because I have had no reason to contact them after the sale.

My next bike in the spring will be a 29" FS and cost will not be an object (within reason..). I would have BD on my consideration list for the purchase, but I have to say I am really distraught with BD Mike's consistent assertion that the OP's bike was not used.

I can forgive damage in shipping, overcharging, wrong item shipped.. as long as its all handled by customer service. However, trying to stick to the story that this wasn't a used bike?

BD: C'mon.. if you *really* want to win good customer service kudos, 'fess up to the obvious truth! However, if you *really* want to push people who are on the LBS/BD fence WELL over onto the LBS side then keep up the misdirection.


The gears on the cassette are obviously worn. This is esp. evident on gears 2-3-4, indicating that its not only used.. its WELL used.
There is considerable wear on the chainrings, as well - esp. the big one.
The wear on the crank arms looks exactly like a wear-pattern made from shoes.
The chain is dirty, the wheels are dirty and the paint is scratched.

Liars suck. :nono:


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## Snickers (Apr 4, 2010)

I still say the OP is the one that used it and the rest has been fabricated.


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## bikingchad (Jul 15, 2009)

Snickers said:


> I still say the OP is the one that used it and the rest has been fabricated.


Always a possibility!


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

Snickers said:


> I still say the OP is the one that used it and the rest has been fabricated.


Quit reading my diary - you DEMON!!


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