# Ok.. got an E-Bike.. and I love it.



## atarione (Aug 24, 2018)

I have been somewhat fortunate in regards to bikes I've had a Giant Trance adv 2 (2018) for a bit over a year.

and on Friday I got a new to me 2019 Giant Trance E+ Pro 1.

I'm just 50 and well I need to lose some weight 6'3" 260lbs~, I have knee issues (arthritis) and a old knee injury from my teens. I love my Trance adv 2 .. but climbs kill me... I've gotten a bit better, but not enough to go ride with my buddies 20~yrs younger than me often.. I can't keep up on the climbs... HOWEVER... I was ripping up the hills past them (for obvious reasons??) today on the e bike... whatever some people don't like emtb's but for me it opens up a ton more opportunities to go on rides, without feeling bad about slowing everyone down..

new 2 me Trance E+









My Trance Adv 2


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## Forest Rider (Oct 29, 2018)

Enjoy dude!


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## MSU Alum (Aug 8, 2009)

I'll be 68 in August. I'm sure one is in my future!


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## cyclelicious (Oct 7, 2008)

Way to go! Your bike choice meets your needs and helps you to enjoy riding to the fullest 'uff said  . You can always lose a few pounds, gain strength and now still do what you love ... ride 

What made you choose the Trek over the other ebikes?


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## careyj1 (May 12, 2017)

Ebikes are so much fun. Old, young, thin, not so thin, fast or slow, they are fun.


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Those who try to justify an e bike on exercise ,distance ridden, resale or any of the other factors we see bantered about are completely missing the whole point of an e bike. An e bike pegs the fun meter and absolutely nothing else is needed to justify the purchase. Everything else is just gravy.
Four years ago I was roundly trashed and called an idiot when I said that in 10 years the bike shops will be selling e bikes 2 to 1 over regular bikes.
Another prediction, WalMart will carry them before too long.


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## Dirtrider127 (Sep 17, 2010)

PierreR said:


> Those who try to justify an e bike on exercise ,distance ridden, resale or any of the other factors we see bantered about are completely missing the whole point of an e bike. An e bike pegs the fun meter and absolutely nothing else is needed to justify the purchase. Everything else is just gravy.
> Four years ago I was roundly trashed and called an idiot when I said that in 10 years the bike shops will be selling e bikes 2 to 1 over regular bikes.
> Another prediction, WalMart will carry them before too long.


^^^^ THIS !

I can play the "I'm 63, have this issue.." game myself but if I was 20 yrs old and healthy as an Ox AND knowing what I know about them now, I would get an eBike. The fun factor is 10X all during the ride.
I ride a lot more, longer, and faster in less time now which for me, I'm feeling better, strong, getting more exercise which are all great for me.

I'm so puzzled about trail access limitations and all the ETMB hate out there. In fact, I'm getting anti-ETMB hater hate myself. People are just hard heads, set in their ways, whatever but it's starting to tick me off a bit.
Ride the bike you want and quit bitching about EBikes. If you want one, get one. If you don't, don't. All pretty simple.
Like everything in life, things are evolving & moving forward.

If climbing is your thing, go climb, but most people dislike that part of a ride. If an eBike brings more enjoyment to YOUR ride, ride one.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Enjoy the trails. It amazing how many of the athletic people I knew when I was young have all the medical issues as they age. 

I was a poor enough athlete that even though I played Soccer in college, I was so bad the coach used me as cannon fodder during practice. I didn't take up skiing until I was 19 and avoided the injuries young racers live with and surfing wasn't that bad on the body. I've always biked but seldom raced and freeride/Enduro/downhill/Park riding did not exist until I was too old to get injured doing it.

I'm holding out on an eBike for now.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

PierreR said:


> ...An e bike pegs the fun meter and absolutely nothing else is needed to justify the purchase...


Agree no further justification is needed, but they won't peg the fun meter for everybody. Like a lot of recreational activities, different strokes for different folks.


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## Dirtrider127 (Sep 17, 2010)

If someone thinks grinding up a fire road for 5 miles is fun, they can have at it


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## mudflap (Feb 23, 2004)

One of my old time riding partners, rest his soul, had to go electric due to Parkinson's robbing him of his muscle power. He rode all the trails we rode on our regular mountain bikes, even though they were all closed to ebikes. His take on it was that he had been riding the trails since before their inception and would continue to ride them until he couldn't. The ebike extended his riding longevity by a year and a half. I'd get one in a minute if our trails were open to them.


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## atarione (Aug 24, 2018)

thanx for the replies everyone.... this ebike is just fun... regardless of the politics of them, ebikes are a heck of a lot of fun to ride... I went near / far back to near then far again today in the the socal sun and felt like I could have kept right on going an going... 25~miles or so at least (no strava atm)... 

Just hella fun however... up/ down ... whatever it is all fun on an ebike.. good stuff.


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Dirtrider127 said:


> I'm so puzzled about trail access limitations and all the ETMB hate out there. In fact, I'm getting anti-ETMB hater hate myself. People are just hard heads, set in their ways, whatever but it's starting to tick me off a bit.


I figured out the quickest way to solve the access issue is to put bureaucrats, politicians and conservancy board members on e bikes. Most of them are older folks like us looking for some fun. Peg their fun meters and its game over.

I get constant re-enforcement. You take an 85 year old man who quit biking with friends because it just wasn't worth it anymore and he is depressed and get him on an e bike. You let him ride within the group again and you watch an 85 year old broken man turn into a taunting 15 year old in front of your eyes then pull out his wallet. When that happens, you know you are doing something right. You do this one time and the e bike haters fade into oblivion within your mind.

I have my 91 year old mother on an e bike. Special build as she is now only 4' 9" tall. She is alive on that e bike. I don't apologize nor hide my love of putting smiles on faces with e bikes.

I think what is magical about an older person on a bike is that bikes are self balancing if the rider will let the bike do its thing. An older person whom does not have to struggle can let the bike do the balancing. Not just any balancing, this is dynamic balancing and that is always a thrill. I have made a few cane holders for bikes.

Keep on living whatever that means to you. Don't let them get you down.


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## iliketexmex (Oct 29, 2016)

The Pursuit of Happiness. You do yours, I'll do mine, Live and let live. That is the way we should look at things. +1 on the no need to justify why. 

I am not interested in one, but I don't sweat it that others ride them.


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## mudflap (Feb 23, 2004)

PierreR said:


> ...I think what is magical about an older person on a bike is that bikes are self balancing if the rider will let the bike do its thing. An older person whom does not have to struggle can let the bike do the balancing. Not just any balancing, this is dynamic balancing and that is always a thrill...


Great point about balancing!
I just mentioned my Parkinson's stricken riding partner in my last post, who due to his disease, was also losing his sense of balance, but was fine once he was moving. He fell a lot, usually while negotiating slow corners or obstacles. It didn't matter which bike he was on, once he got rolling he was fine.
What I forgot to mention about my friend, he said riding his ebike made him young again. We literally could not keep up with him, and it was him who was now waiting at the top for us. It gave him more than another year of riding.


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## JHensley (May 11, 2020)

My Wife is 28 yrs old. She has marfans syndrome and cannot exert much physical effort without great risk to her heart. We purchased an Ebike for her this spring and it has made a huge difference for both of us. I struggle to keep up with her. Her bike has a throttle and she can sprint away from me without even pedaling! This has opened up a whole new activity for us to be able to do together, and she absolutely loves her new bike!


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

iliketexmex said:


> The Pursuit of Happiness. You do yours, I'll do mine, Live and let live. That is the way we should look at things. +1 on the no need to justify why.
> 
> I am not interested in one, but I don't sweat it that others ride them.


With an attitude like that don't try one, they are expensive!:thumbsup:

More power to you if you can leave them alone. I made the mistake of building one for my wife in 2016. She has type 6 Ehlers' Danlos Syndrome and no natural balance because of total lack of proprioception. I was damned the minute I rode to work the bugs out.

Sadly my wife no longer feels safe on the bike because of not knowing when or where the bike will actually come to a stop. Seems odd but that is the way it is. Looking a building a conventional trike.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

PierreR said:


> With an attitude like that don't try one...


There are many things I haven't tried, but I have tried both road and mtb e-bikes. I was associated with a bike shop that had demo Spec e-bikes that I could borrow. I rode each a few times on rides of various duration and difficulty. I though OK, nice, but they didn't light my fire. I preferred my pedal bikes, which was true of the bike shop employees as well.


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## Happybill68 (Feb 4, 2020)

Glad you are enjoying your new e bike. I’m
Probably going to look at one in the next few years. 

Sounds like a great time 


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Lone Rager said:


> There are many things I haven't tried, but I have tried both road and mtb e-bikes.


Just to clarify, I thought your attitude was gracious and great. I might have come off wrong on that last post to you.


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## Radium (Jan 11, 2019)

mudflap said:


> Great point about balancing!
> I just mentioned my Parkinson's stricken riding partner in my last post, who due to his disease, was also losing his sense of balance, but was fine once he was moving. He fell a lot, usually while negotiating slow corners or obstacles. It didn't matter which bike he was on, once he got rolling he was fine.
> What I forgot to mention about my friend, he said riding his ebike made him young again. We literally could not keep up with him, and it was him who was now waiting at the top for us. It gave him more than another year of riding.


Parkinson's is some thing that cycling in general can produce amazing results with!


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## Mudguard (Apr 14, 2009)

mudflap said:


> He rode all the trails we rode on our regular mountain bikes, even though they *were all closed to ebikes*. His take on it was that he had been riding the trails since before their inception and would continue to ride them until he couldn't. .


To play devils advocate, how would the other's have felt if instead of an e-bike, it was a bike with one of those 50cc kits you could buy and install a few years back? Same thing?

I often wonder how popular e-bikes would be if they didn't have access to mountain-bike trails. That said, I've really only had a couple of negative experiences with them and one ride, which was enough for me.

As a commuter, awesome, shared use, well jury is out. I still think it would interesting to see what kind of trails could be built based on e-bikes, IE have some super technical climbs, basically a descending black trail in reverse, to really push the boundaries of what they could do.


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## Dougr (Jun 15, 2006)

I rented an ebike in Switzerland (play time in the Alps after a business trip) last Fall and I have to say, the fun factor is off the charts. We probably rode 3 times farther than we normally would have on a non ebike. It was ridiculous to be chatting casually with my buddies on a 2 mile uphill grade!


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## Ptor (Jan 29, 2004)

mudflap said:


> He rode all the trails we rode on our regular mountain bikes, even though they were all closed to ebikes. His take on it was that he had been riding the trails since before their inception and would continue to ride them until he couldn't.


Land managers have a lot of things to worry about, particularly so if human activity can have significant impact on wildlife. Our local USFS holdings are one such place - pronghorn, deer, elk, moose, bear, mountain lions and all the other standard small game and birds are roaming the area where we also have non-motorized trails. I know some of the folks tasked with managing the area and they're all about multi-use, so it's not like they're anti-trail or anti-bike or anti-motorized vehicle. But what they have to concern themselves with is the impact those different activities bring to the area. I guarantee you that if the USFS opens what are now non-motorized trails to e-bikes we will lose trails, based solely on the increased user load it will bring to areas formerly not accessed on a regular basis by many people. They have a duty to protect and preserve and that means minimizing human impact on sensitive habitat and breading grounds. As noted in this thread, e-bikes extend range and access for more people. They've closed roads as motorized traffic into the forest increased - it happens. I'm not convinced it's a legitimate reason to ride an e-bike on trails where they are not legal because "he use to do it before he couldn't anymore". Sure, we all have sympathy for those aging out or who are differently-abled, but it's going to happen to all of us some day - it's already happened to me. If someone gets butt-hurt by not being able to do the same rides as younger/fitter/more competent friends or what they use to be able to do and so insist on riding an e-bike illegally, well&#8230;they've got some baggage they need to deal with that goes beyond mountain biking access. If it's legal, go have your fun. If it's not, do the right thing - find some place to ride your e-bike where it is legal.


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Mudguard said:


> To play devils advocate, how would the other's have felt if instead of an e-bike, it was a bike with one of those 50cc kits you could buy and install a few years back? Same thing?


Forget that theoretical argument, the technology for small 750 watts or less gasoline engines does not exist for applications to mountain biking. A 750 watt gasoline engine will never produce enough torque where its needed to make that technology work. They barely worked on the road at much higher wattages and were not practical on the road enough to make a difference in the bicycle world. Nearly impossible to integrate natural pedaling with a gas engine so nobody wanted except a 15 year old. I am confident that we will never see legal gasoline powered mountain bikes according to the e bike description.


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## JHensley (May 11, 2020)

Ptor said:


> Land managers have a lot of things to worry about, particularly so if human activity can have significant impact on wildlife. Our local USFS holdings are one such place - pronghorn, deer, elk, moose, bear, mountain lions and all the other standard small game and birds are roaming the area where we also have non-motorized trails. I know some of the folks tasked with managing the area and they're all about multi-use, so it's not like they're anti-trail or anti-bike or anti-motorized vehicle. But what they have to concern themselves with is the impact those different activities bring to the area. I guarantee you that if the USFS opens what are now non-motorized trails to e-bikes we will lose trails, based solely on the increased user load it will bring to areas formerly not accessed on a regular basis by many people. They have a duty to protect and preserve and that means minimizing human impact on sensitive habitat and breading grounds. As noted in this thread, e-bikes extend range and access for more people. They've closed roads as motorized traffic into the forest increased - it happens. I'm not convinced it's a legitimate reason to ride an e-bike on trails where they are not legal because "he use to do it before he couldn't anymore". Sure, we all have sympathy for those aging out or who are differently-abled, but it's going to happen to all of us some day - it's already happened to me. If someone gets butt-hurt by not being able to do the same rides as younger/fitter/more competent friends or what they use to be able to do and so insist on riding an e-bike illegally, well&#8230;they've got some baggage they need to deal with that goes beyond mountain biking access. If it's legal, go have your fun. If it's not, do the right thing - find some place to ride your e-bike where it is legal.


I hadn't even considered this. I assumed that e-bikes being illegal in certain areas was just about people not wanting Possibly higher Speed bike traffic through trails.

E-bikes will absolutely bring more traffic through all trail systems and that can definitely adversely effect the wildlife occupying the area.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

As far as I know, e-Bikes are still not legal on trails in NJ but I see them frequently and the riders seem to be young. So much for many of the arguments being used to justify them. Its easy for me. I am not going to pay $8000 for a 45 lbs. bike but I'm only 71 so what do I know?


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

Rev Bubba said:


> As far as I know, e-Bikes are still not legal on trails in NJ but I see them frequently and the riders seem to be young. So much for many of the arguments being used to justify them. Its easy for me. I am not going to pay $8000 for a 45 lbs. bike but I'm only 71 so what do I know?


Obviously not much

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## beastmaster (Sep 19, 2012)

Allowing e-bikes onto trails prohibited to other motorized bikes is going to make for a huge mess in how we safeguard our collective public lands in the USA. "If they can go, why can't I go on my 250 dirt bike?" It is difficult to exclude one class of motorized bike (internal combustion or total electric) while allowing another (e-bikes). There are too many different types of e-bikes produced (some of them are really electric mopeds) and they all visually appear to be pretty much identical to the casual observer while motorcycles (or full battery powered electric bikes) are easily identified. The speeds which can be achieved on a power assisted bike or motorcycle are substantially faster while climbing and thus contribute towards erosion of the trail surface and their potential approach speeds to horses or hikers are considerably faster than pedal-only bikes and this means more potential trail user conflicts. Legislation/policy has been passed/created which expressly prohibits e-bikes on almost all National Forest Lands. This was done for good reason (reason=rationality).

E-bikes might have their place, but it most certainly isn't on Public Lands managed by the National Forest Service. Ride them on BLM lands, or open to motorized vehicles roads traversing NF Lands, but don't go onto trails made for hiking, horseback riding, or human-only pedal powered bikes. Period.

Enjoy your new toy.

(BTW, posting about e-bikes in the 50+ forum only adds to agism and discrimination towards older people)


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

beastmaster said:


> Allowing e-bikes onto trails prohibited to other motorized bikes is going to make for a huge mess in how we safeguard our collective public lands in the USA. "If they can go, why can't I go on my 250 dirt bike?" It is difficult to exclude one class of motorized bike (internal combustion or total electric) while allowing another (e-bikes). There are too many different types of e-bikes produced (some of them are really electric mopeds) and they all visually appear to be pretty much identical to the casual observer while motorcycles (or full battery powered electric bikes) are easily identified.


Thanks for your opinion but I don't buy your argument.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

I'll give you no argument.


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## atarione (Aug 24, 2018)

The trails I care to ride around here are all (just about) open to e-bikes now... class 1 bikes are limited to 20mph... I easily hit the limit on flat or descents certainly and with enough boost on climbs as well..

I can easily exceed these speeds on my Trance (non ebike)... there is nothing inherently more damaging / dangerous about a class 1 ebike than a regular trail bike...

worst most dangerous riders are see are about mid 20s~30s strava bro's on cross country bikes trying to get the KOM on multi use trails..

but whatever enough about that... on the upside I now have a orange battery cover.. on the downside the tabs on it are also f*cked so it is also held on by duct tape =p... a new not broken cover is on order however.

Yesterday was about as hot as it has been, I got done with super boring conference calls early, and rode out from my house.... 20miles up hill in 90 degree weather... and then back down the hill ... the whole ride was super duper fun... and I didn't die of heat stroke as I might well have done on my non E Trance adv... (all trails ridden open to class 1 ebikes..btw)


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## beastmaster (Sep 19, 2012)

PierreR said:


> Thanks for your opinion but I don't buy your argument.


It is the law. No argument or opinion needed. If you ride an e-bike on FS Public Lands expect a federal citation.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

beastmaster said:


> It is the law. No argument or opinion needed. If you ride an e-bike on FS Public Lands expect a federal citation.


Not every law should be obeyed

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## Dirtrider127 (Sep 17, 2010)

beastmaster said:


> It is the law. No argument or opinion needed. If you ride an e-bike on FS Public Lands expect a federal citation.


If you go drive over the speed limit expect a ticket


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

beastmaster said:


> Allowing e-bikes onto trails prohibited to other motorized bikes is going to make for a huge mess in how we safeguard our collective public lands in the USA. "If they can go, why can't I go on my 250 dirt bike?" It is difficult to exclude one class of motorized bike (internal combustion or total electric) while allowing another (e-bikes). There are too many different types of e-bikes produced (some of them are really electric mopeds) and they all visually appear to be pretty much identical to the casual observer while motorcycles (or full battery powered electric bikes) are easily identified. The speeds which can be achieved on a power assisted bike or motorcycle are substantially faster while climbing and thus contribute towards erosion of the trail surface and their potential approach speeds to horses or hikers are considerably faster than pedal-only bikes and this means more potential trail user conflicts.


Beastmaster, I don't agree with the above quoted part of your argument, not the part of the argument you think I zeroed in on. If its illegal, I don't knowingly ride it and do not advocate doing so.
Your argument is purely academic in nature and has no basis in reality. You cannot prove your erosion hypothesis. I can put up a good case that your non e bike, foot traffic and horses contributes more to erosion than an e bike and convince a lot of people that its true.
I can look at a motorcycle and tell you that its not an e bike, I can look at a moped and tell you its not an e bike. I can look at an e bike and tell you if its likely overpowered or an e dirt bike. The distinction is clear and simple. I can tell you that yes, its reasonable to ban all of them on singletrack.

As current technology and economics stand, the description of a US or Euro e bike can only be met with electric. Everything else is not a reality. The only possibility might be something exotic built as a non hybrid gasoline/electric for something like the Caning Stock Route. $30k plus. I would love to build something like that but there is no market for it.


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## Ptor (Jan 29, 2004)

rod9301 said:


> Not every law should be obeyed


How about taking the recommendation of expert land-use professionals? At least in the case of USFS officials, they have access to a myriad of facts and reams of data to use for making policy. These folks have a 10,000 foot view as well as a "boots on the ground" perspective, and if they say e-bikes shouldn't use non-motorized trails then maybe they just might know something you don't. And if they say certain trails are appropriate for e-bike use, then I would have no reason to whine about it just because I don't ride one. It's become a very American thing to disregard experts (note the current situation regarding mask use and social distancing), but I do hope we can get back to a place where we're less selfish and more respectful of "reasoned decisions" by committed professionals.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

Ptor said:


> How about taking the recommendation of expert land-use professionals? At least in the case of USFS officials, they have access to a myriad of facts and reams of data to use for making policy. These folks have a 10,000 foot view as well as a "boots on the ground" perspective, and if they say e-bikes shouldn't use non-motorized trails then maybe they just might know something you don't. And if they say certain trails are appropriate for e-bike use, then I would have no reason to whine about it just because I don't ride one. It's become a very American thing to disregard experts (note the current situation regarding mask use and social distancing), but I do hope we can get back to a place where we're less selfish and more respectful of "reasoned decisions" by committed professionals.


Ok, I'm in France for a year, and most serious mountain bikers are on e bikes.
No adverse stuff, no conflicts, just fun.

It's only because in the us the land managers had their head in the sand, not looking forward, that we have this mess.

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## Ptor (Jan 29, 2004)

rod9301 said:


> Ok, I'm in France for a year, and most serious mountain bikers are on e bikes.
> No adverse stuff, no conflicts, just fun.
> 
> It's only because in the us the land managers had their head in the sand, not looking forward, that we have this mess.
> ...


Land management in Europe and the US is an "apples and oranges" thing. I've hiked the Alps, ridden in Tuscany -- amazing and beautiful places. 15 moles from my house in a 30,000 population city in the Rocky Mountains of the US I can be in more authentically naturally wild ecosystem (wildlife to plants) than you can find anywhere in Europe. I'm only 45 miles from a trailhead into a Wilderness Area. Much of the western US is like this -- it's one of our great national treasures and luckily there are people on both sides of our immense political divide that want to keep it that way. If land managers in the US only had to consider what access humans wanted, that would make life simpler. Sorry that it's not as simple or as obvious as you would like...


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Ptor said:


> How about taking the recommendation of expert land-use professionals? At least in the case of USFS officials, they have access to a myriad of facts and reams of data to use for making policy. These folks have a 10,000 foot view as well as a "boots on the ground" perspective, and if they say e-bikes shouldn't use non-motorized trails then maybe they just might know something you don't. And if they say certain trails are appropriate for e-bike use, then I would have no reason to whine about it just because I don't ride one. It's become a very American thing to disregard experts (note the current situation regarding mask use and social distancing), but I do hope we can get back to a place where we're less selfish and more respectful of "reasoned decisions" by committed professionals.


You are making a huge assumption that land managers have reams of data on the impacts of e bikes. The one's I know don't have much of what they call unbiased data and don't believe the e bike haters either. They move slow and don't make as many mistakes. New changes take time.

They are professionals all right but have limited resources and like having facts to cover their asses in the case of special interest land users. They don't believe anyone with a special interest agenda.

There are at least some studies being conducted, mostly in Europe. 
So far it looks like the difference between regular bikes and e bikes is statistically insignificant one way or the other.

I can tell you from personal experience that trail damage is less for me when climbing with an e bike and I have no idea about the difference descending. From personal experience, e bikes meld a lot easier with regular mountain bikes than they do with ORV's I don't need any more beer bottles thrown at me for being in the way, stuck in a sand rut I can't get out of quickly enough for Billy Bop.


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## Ptor (Jan 29, 2004)

PierreR said:


> They don't believe anyone with a special interest agenda.


And that's one reason e-bike advocates have had a rough time -- you're posts here being a great demonstration of that. While only intimately familiar with the local USFS management efforts, they do have reams of data on users, wildlife, habitat, etc. I don't get any impression that they're particularly worried about trail surface impacts from e-bikes -- they're worried about overall use patterns, impacts on sensitive environmental sites, safety, conservation, logging, watershed, grazing. It ain't all about you -- or me or the hiker or the equestrian. The cool thing is they'll even explain the basis for closing roads/trails or building new ones if you ask or look for it in official publications or local papers.


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

Ptor said:


> And that's one reason e-bike advocates have had a rough time -- you're posts here being a great demonstration of that. While only intimately familiar with the local USFS management efforts, they do have reams of data on users, wildlife, habitat, etc. I don't get any impression that they're particularly worried about trail surface impacts from e-bikes -- they're worried about overall use patterns, impacts on sensitive environmental sites, safety, conservation, logging, watershed, grazing. It ain't all about you -- or me or the hiker or the equestrian. The cool thing is they'll even explain the basis for closing roads/trails or building new ones if you ask or look for it in official publications or local papers.


Well its pretty obvious that land use concerns are vastly different where you live than where I live. Try to understand that the US west is not the only place where there are USFS land managers.


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## Velobike (Jun 23, 2007)

A much younger friend of mine got an eBike about a year ago because they're fun.

He rides more often, but has lost a lot of bike fitness when he's on a non eBike, eg long climbs. 

That's not a criticism of eBikes, I think they're a good idea (so long as they are power limited to human levels, ie around 250 watts), but it's worth bearing in mind if you're tempted.

It's changed my thinking about them. I will get one eventually, but I'm now going to leave it until it becomes a need rather than a want.


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