# New cheap-o Chinese LED bike lights 2018



## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Again here is new thread for 2018  Wish you the best cheapo lights in 2018.

* This is the 2018 lights thread to get quick overview with some basic information so keep it clean and useful.*

Here is link to year 2017 thread http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night-riding/new-cheap-o-chinese-led-bike-lights-2017-a-1031635.html

Also as last year I'm addition Chinese festival calendar, note long lasting Spring Festival ie. Chinese New Year:
China Holidays & Festivals

As a start here is "competition" to RACKs 4led Hyperion 








https://www.ebay.com/itm/20000lm-4x...g-Front-Light-Headlamp-Headlight/263216274717

Interesting, it looks it has remote switch.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

With the most ridiculous modes ever!

-Garry


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Yes, and it can winks on both sides, but hey with some type of TIR lenses it shows some kind of progress in design and can have usable beam. Anyway things are changing as the years passes by.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

20,000 Lumens! I must figure out this sorcery! BOUGHT!


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

My little custom pen light is probably brighter than that thing 

$11 for that, that actually kind of screams scam not gonna lie.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Ok here's my submission. I was thinking a few days ago to start a thread of most ridiculous lumen output claims but didn't want to cobble up the board. Guess we don't really need that as we already know the false claims here.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/80000LUMEN...&sd=152860079044&_trksid=p2047675.c100623.m-1


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

mb323323 said:


> Ok here's my submission. I was thinking a few days ago to start a thread of most ridiculous lumen output claims but didn't want to cobble up the board. Guess we don't really need that as we already know the false claims here.


So here's a question for you guys.... How would you reach the common consumer who believes these lumen claims? How do you get them to understand the lumen game that's played by cheap overseas manufactures, and what the proper FL1 standard means?


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Outbound said:


> So here's a question for you guys.... How would you reach the common consumer who believes these lumen claims? How do you get them to understand the lumen game that's played by cheap overseas manufactures, and what the proper FL1 standard means?


I don't think you can, hence the rampant lumen claims and grossly exaggerated specs. I was just thinking about this earlier, how can an honest person producing a true spec'd product (like yourself) compete with all these garbage lights? How do you get the word out . . . "Hey everybody, these claims are all garbage and I have a product that is actually way beyond these garbage lights with true specs!" I guess you try to post up on your website, in product descriptions, and in forums explaining false vs. real claims and hope that consumers run across the information and are persuaded.

-Garry


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

garrybunk said:


> I don't think you can, hence the rampant lumen claims and grossly exaggerated specs. I was just thinking about this earlier, how can an honest person producing a true spec'd product (like yourself) compete with all these garbage lights? How do you get the word out . . . "Hey everybody, these claims are all garbage and I have a product that is actually way beyond these garbage lights with true specs!" I guess you try to post up on your website, in product descriptions, and in forums explaining false vs. real claims and hope that consumers run across the information and are persuaded.
> 
> -Garry


It isn't just in the bike light industry, it's also incredibly rampant in the automotive aftermarket. Between photoshopped pictures, outright lies, and a complete misunderstanding of lights, it's tough to get noticed.

Your thoughts mirrored mine. Semi-unbiased educational information. Provide the facts, and let someone choose. Started putting up some blog posts, that are mostly copy-paste-edits from what I had posted earlier on here.

https://www.outboundlighting.com/engineering/

Definitely welcome topic suggestions!


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

I would guess that no matter how much information you put out there about a half would not research and just go by what the ad says. But better to have the info to research than not.

I suppose that's why they'll continue to make these claims.

One of the ads even said use w/ a 2 cell 18650! (2 by 18650) is how it read.

MB


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

ledoman said:


> Yes, and it can winks on both sides, but hey with some type of TIR lenses it shows some kind of progress in design and can have usable beam. Anyway things are changing as the years passes by.


Banggood's selling it too.https://www.banggood.com/XANES-DL02...-p-1213831.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN

4.2 volts, a reviewer claims 1600 lumens. First reviewer got light for two minutes, then smoke.
Will that country ever run out of XML-T6's?

Banggood has a good looking Xanes tail light on preorder. https://www.banggood.com/XANES-STL0...-1248062.html?rmmds=preorder&cur_warehouse=CN
Too good to be true but I bought a couple anyway.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Its not just that, also the price tag. All about the price tag. Its interesting the insane amount of those lights that get sold and people rarely end up using because it turns them off from night riding. Mainly cause they realize they cant actually see much. Make the assumption the good lights are the same and give up.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

I've met up with folks on the trail and they'll ask how many lumens my lights are. They are incredulous when I give them a real number that is a quarter to a tenth of what they think theirs are and mine are notably brighter.

It's "spreadsheet" buying. Add up all the numbers. Runtime, lumens, Ah on battery, etc. Then the light with the biggest numbers at the smallest price gets purchased.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Vancbiker said:


> I've met up with folks on the trail and they'll ask how many lumens my lights are. They are incredulous when I give them a real number that is a quarter to a tenth of what they think theirs are and mine are notably brighter.
> 
> It's "spreadsheet" buying. Add up all the numbers. Runtime, lumens, Ah on battery, etc. Then the light with the biggest numbers at the smallest price gets purchased.


So guess I should advertise two things. "Real lumens" and "ebay lumens".


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

I've seen something recently called brighteyes that I'm somewhat interested in because I want more of a flood on the bar. I won't spend big bucks but this one doesn't sound like pie in the sky promises either.

Currently using 2 nightrider 750's, a helmet and the bar. It's working nice but I suspect I'd prefer a wider beam (flood) from one lamp.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Outbound said:


> So guess I should advertise two things. "Real lumens" and "ebay lumens".


Sad but true...

I had one person actually argue with me about it. "No way that's 1800. Mines 6000 so yours has to be at least 8000" or something to that effect. He totally was believing the numbers in the ad on some Chinese website he bought it from.

The other thing that I have a hard time understanding is the rush to the bottom for all the cheapo light buyers. So many have spent thousands on the bike and gear and then put the success of their night rides in a $20 POS light.


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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

I'm looking for a half decent mountain bike light again.
Some time ago I built a 7 xpg light that would put out more than 3000 lumens then I sold it...
What's the best bang for the buck right now for a 3000-4000 lumen bike light? 
I mean real lumens, not ebay lumens. Lol


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Vancbiker said:


> Sad but true...
> 
> I had one person actually argue with me about it. "No way that's 1800. Mines 6000 so yours has to be at least 8000" or something to that effect. He totally was believing the numbers in the ad on some Chinese website he bought it from.
> 
> The other thing that I have a hard time understanding is the rush to the bottom for all the cheapo light buyers. So many have spent thousands on the bike and gear and then put the success of their night rides in a $20 POS light.


It's perplexing to me as well. Will spend hundreds on pedals (I'm guilty), multiple thousands on the bike itself, hundreds on gear, but cheap out on a light, which arguably is what makes the ride even more enjoyable at night.

It's also why we are going to be trying to do a lot of demo days, and events where people can try out the lights, and see how it is in person. Because it is incredibly hard to capture everything that the eye can see, especially in motion.


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## mbmb65 (Jan 13, 2004)

Outbound said:


> It's perplexing to me as well. Will spend hundreds on pedals (I'm guilty), multiple thousands on the bike itself, hundreds on gear, but cheap out on a light, which arguably is what makes the ride even more enjoyable at night.
> 
> It's also why we are going to be trying to do a lot of demo days, and events where people can try out the lights, and see how it is in person. Because it is incredibly hard to capture everything that the eye can see, especially in motion.


I think demo "nights" might be more better, no?


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Outbound said:


> ...Will spend hundreds on pedals (I'm guilty),


Haha. Me too. Did I really need those Ti spindle Speedplay Frogs????


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

mbmb65 said:


> I think demo "nights" might be more better, no?


Ha. Yes.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

sergio_pt said:


> I'm looking for a half decent mountain bike light again.
> Some time ago I built a 7 xpg light that would put out more than 3000 lumens then I sold it...
> What's the best bang for the buck right now for a 3000-4000 lumen bike light?
> I mean real lumens, not ebay lumens. Lol


Lots of cheap Chinese lights that claim 3000-4000 (or more) lumens but know of 0 that actually do. Here's some links to lights you might want to look at above 3000 actual lumens.

https://www.rakclighting.com/collections/m-tiger-sports/products/m-tiger-hyperion-wireless-3100-lumen-led-mountain-bike-light-kit

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/gemini-sets-1/products/2016-gemini-titan?variant=9586404421

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/magicshine-sets/products/magicshine-mj-906-headlight-tail-light-set-with-wireless-remote-switch

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/magicshine-sets/products/magicshine-mj-908

M-tiger probably the only one that could be used as a helmet light, both Magicshine lights are very floody. That's about as much as I know about these lights, no actual experience since they all produce more light than I could actually use.
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

bachman1961 said:


> I've seen something recently called brighteyes that I'm somewhat interested in because I want more of a flood on the bar. I won't spend big bucks but this one doesn't sound like pie in the sky promises either.
> 
> Currently using 2 nightrider 750's, a helmet and the bar. It's working nice but I suspect I'd prefer a wider beam (flood) from one lamp.


Not sure if this is the "Bright Eyes" light you are talking about but here's a link. It didn't seem to test out very well!
Mole

We Test Lights | Bright Eyes 1200 Lumen Test and Review


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

MRMOLE said:


> Not sure if this is the "Bright Eyes" light you are talking about but here's a link. It didn't seem to test out very well!
> Mole
> 
> We Test Lights | Bright Eyes 1200 Lumen Test and Review


Mole

I just realized that site is ran by L&M. I am surprised that hasnt created some major conflicts but they keep test simple.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

arc said:


> Banggood's selling it too.https://www.banggood.com/XANES-DL02...-p-1213831.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN
> 
> 4.2 volts, a reviewer claims 1600 lumens. *First reviewer got light for two minutes, then smoke.*
> 
> Will that country ever run out of XML-T6's?


Well, there is no description which voltage has been used when light smoked out. It might well be 8.4V pack. 
I see it as a nice candidate to change/mod the driver if someone (like Garry did for HD-016) is willing to play with. You can take it as learning course 

About XML-T6: they are not. There is huge supply of cheapo Chinese counterfeight of XM-L out there and you'll hardly get geniue Cree. Shurely not with cheapo lights. So you'll keep seeing them for quite some time in the future. So far I've discovered two different counterfeights. The last one has even smaller die than before. It can be distinguisged by looking from "distance".


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

RAKC Ind said:


> Mole
> 
> I just realized that site is ran by L&M. I am surprised that hasnt created some major conflicts but they keep test simple.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Even though it's run by L&M the data they have roughly matches stuff I've measured myself. They seem to be running an honest site there. It's tough to fake or manipulate that kind of data.


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

MRMOLE said:


> Not sure if this is the "Bright Eyes" light you are talking about but here's a link. It didn't seem to test out very well!
> Mole
> 
> We Test Lights | Bright Eyes 1200 Lumen Test and Review


Thanks. The one I looked at claims 1600 but I'm not too giddy on these numbers... b/c of the ways they are rated /claimed.
I'm going to be more critical about the flood pattern as this one at 1600 has tons of good reviews (590 avg 4.5 stars) but some comments on the pattern give me pause. A bit more narrow beam than I first thought.
I love the nightriders in that the power is internal, battery holds well for my ride times and the lighting is good but as my 2nd lamp, I want more flood.

I think the best thing to do is look at how the NR test on some data and compare that same standard to other lights / brands tested, then I know what I'm expecting from what I already have experience with.

If anyone finds a good trustworthy testing criteria on various lamps including NR, please advise ! THNX


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

The only place to find that is right here on MTBR. MTBR Light Shootout.

But even then the problem is that only about 50% at most of the reputable lights out there arent in the shootout.

Some of the other sources are out of date and arent even active/updated anymore. Bikelightdatabase is one of them.

1st thing is that Amazon reviews are to be taken with a grain of salt. Many that give good reviews of products arent picky. Just needs to work. Then you have people that will give bad reviews of products because they didnt read the details and compare products to go after what they required. All of it to save a buck. See it from cameras (even GoPro) to bike lights, automotive accessory lights, even tons of ppl that don't even check vehicle compatibility. 

As for how lights are tested.

Only thing worth while is US based sphere confirmed lumen ratings. A few also have the chart that shows how the beam pattern intensity lays out.

Anything with photos of beam shots you have to be cautious of. They may do a good job of portraying how the beam pattern looks if person doing it is experienced. The problem of some is that they will underexpose competitors/over expose their own.

MTBR lights shoot out again is the most unbiased source I know of except right here in this sub forum. For bike lights you cannot beat the knowledge of the regulars here (Im a regular light geek, have been for years here but since Im also a vendor now I am restricted on help I can provide.)

And its not just a ebay/Amazon chinese seller issue. There are constantly little "brands" popping up selling cheap chinese stuff at higher prices and doing the same things.

Now to get specific to the light your looking at, known as a Magicshine 808 clone, the beam is going to have a strong hot spot. Not going to have the flood your looking for. NR750 is going to have more flood type pattern.

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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

Cool, thanks for the links!
Maybe the best option is the magicshine 908.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

bachman1961 said:


> Thanks. The one I looked at claims 1600 but I'm not too giddy on these numbers... b/c of the ways they are rated /claimed.
> I'm going to be more critical about the flood pattern as this one at 1600 has tons of good reviews (590 avg 4.5 stars) but some comments on the pattern give me pause. A bit more narrow beam than I first thought.
> I love the nightriders in that the power is internal, battery holds well for my ride times and the lighting is good but as my 2nd lamp, I want more flood.


I found the 1600 claimed lumen model. Best guess is it's similar to the linked model with a new lighthead case and an upgraded (slightly) emitter. Single emitter XM-L T6 (if that's true) that gets 5+ hours of runtime on high from a 6400ma battery (if that's true) is probably only 500-600 lumens at best. As RAKC mentioned this will have a very narrow beam but it comes with a optional elliptical diffuser lens which should widen the beam considerably. Doesn't sound like you trust these people any more than I do so If you want to try something like this you'd be much better off buying a original Magicshine 808 U2 + Wide angle lens (elliptical) from Action-LED-Lights or one of the new style MS900 lights. Honest 800 lumens and a nice wide beam. If you like self-contained lights and want a wider beam you should look at either a Ravemen PR900 or PR1200. I own the PR900 and while it's marketed as auto style beam I think it makes a great bar light for mtn. biking (the 1200 would be even better). Good quality lights, accurate lumen values, over 2 hr. runtime on high too.

https://www.rakclighting.com/collections/ravemen-pr-series/products/ravemen-pr1200-led-bike-light

https://www.rakclighting.com/collections/ravemen-pr-series/products/ravemen-pr900-led-bike-light

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/magicshine-sets/products/magicshine-mj-900



> I think the best thing to do is look at how the NR test on some data and compare that same standard to other lights / brands tested, then I know what I'm expecting from what I already have experience with.





> If anyone finds a good trustworthy testing criteria on various lamps including NR, please advise ! THNX


Not sure if you noticed but the site I linked in my last post has 13 pages (12 pp) of lights tested same format as the Bright Eyes. Pretty much all the Niteriders are there.
Mole


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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

Wow, this went offtopic *fast*.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

Sirius9 said:


> Wow, this went offtopic *fast*.


Yep, it didn't make it two days.

9k lumens and 9 leds


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Rod said:


> Yep, it didn't make it two days.


Faster than a thread over at BLF!

-Garry


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Rod said:


> Yep, it didn't make it two days.
> 
> 9k lumens and 9 leds
> 
> View attachment 1177779


Quick math check:

1.2A @ 8.4V = 10 watts of power on high mode

9000 lumens / 10W = 900 lumens per watt.

Worlds highest rated (but not in production) led chip is 300 lumens per watt. Most high end ones are around 160 in perfect conditions.

XML2 datasheet says maximum lumens = 1000, and at 10W of power.

10 watts divided by 9 LEDs = 1.1 watts per XML2

XML2 at maximum efficacy (highest bin, highest grade quality chip, running cold) is *117 lm/W.*

(XLamp XM-L2 LEDs | Cree Components)

That means based on the electrical specs given by KD, the maximum actual lumens if it was truly using the highest grade XML2s (which cost a couple bucks each) then it'd be around 1,170 lumens. In real world, might be counterfeit XML2's that are putting out about 50-60% of the real XML2 chip lumens. XML2's are not dirt cheap, but the counterfeits are. So my educated guess is that it's really around 750 lumens.

Just gave me an idea for a engineering blog post.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

Outbound said:


> Quick math check:
> 
> 1.2A @ 8.4V = 10 watts of power on high mode
> 
> ...


Glad I could help. We know the claimed lumens wasn't close to realistic.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Well, we all know 9K lumens are "theorethical", but light of that size could easily run it at 4000-5000Lm. Usability of such big light is another story so put this aside.

Running it at 10W input is pitty. It should be runt at 30-40W at least.

Right now I'm rebuilding 6 cell pack for for a cyclist whose pack almost died. He is using cheapo 11 led light like THIS. 







Of course leds are not Cree and 18650 cells are generic and low capacity noname. All leds are connected in series. At full power it is pulling about 16W from battery pack. It is very dependable on voltage it gets from battery pack as the driver has to boost voltage up to 25V (measured). Driver is very simple LEDA based (it has sense resistors) with coil to boost voltage and beefier mosfet to maintain all those leds. No wonder coil gets hot very quickly and the power is keept on the low side. Anyway, user is happy with it cause he doesn't know any better (so far).


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## turner_nz (Nov 17, 2017)

hi guys , so i'm looking at getting a Light for night riding guy guys keep raving about the bt40s which is cool but what about the yinding little double led light seem to be more expensive is it more suited to a helmet light ? or should i just get two bt40s ? i have about 30 odd 18650s from dead makita battery's (cells are fine) so just going to run a 4x18650 waterproof box, was think bt40s on bars yinding on helmet ? is this the best budget set up ?


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

If you really want to deal with false lumen claims, it will take government intervention. Start with legal service on Amazon and ebay and notify them of seriously false and fraudulent claims. Then when they don't react, follow up with a criminal complaint. But who wants to bother with that?

A reputable light manufacturer would probably do best by advertising "REAL Lumens" and backing it up with test results from an independent lab.

Scott Novak


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

turner_nz said:


> hi guys , so i'm looking at getting a Light for night riding guy guys keep raving about the bt40s which is cool but what about the yinding little double led light seem to be more expensive is it more suited to a helmet light ? or should i just get two bt40s ? i have about 30 odd 18650s from dead makita battery's (cells are fine) so just going to run a 4x18650 waterproof box, was think bt40s on bars yinding on helmet ? is this the best budget set up ?


Yes, this combination is still one of the best budget combination out there. The only thing you need to care is overheating of Yinding. Using some fins on the mount (Vancbiker) or at least use alu mount from DX would help. Keep it at lower modes when not moving.


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## roadkill401 (Mar 14, 2017)

Perhaps you are missing some of the points why consumers buy certain lights over spending much more for others.

I just picked up a small set of usb rechargeable led lights for my new bike. I looked at some in my LBS and was totally put off by the really high price point. So I did turn to Amazon where I found a cheap Chinese knockoff unit that will fit my needs.

I don't really care about the lumins. I got them for two reasons. 

1. in my town it is illegal to ride a bike on the road without a light installed on it. The town bylaw doesn't say how bright it has to be, just that it needs to be there and working. It's a law that I know is hardly ever enforced, but even having a non-working light might be enough if you get a cop who has a bug up his butt to give you a warning rather than the fine.

2. I have given this a try and having a small flashing light in the daytime on a bike will get you noticed. It doesn't need to be the absolutely brightest light, just enough to catch a drivers attention. 

Now I know full well that these are nowhere near bright enough to use as a nighttime riding light. They might be OK if caught riding near to dusk in the spring/fall time as it gets dark pretty early up here in the north. I am sure if I wanted to ride in the pitch black then a brighter better-designed light would be something that you'd want.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

No, we are not missing it. This is primarly MTB forum and as such we take care more for reliable and bright enough lights.


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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

ledoman said:


> Again here is new thread for 2018  Wish you the best cheapo lights in 2018.
> 
> * This is the 2018 lights thread to get quick overview with some basic information so keep it clean and useful.*
> 
> ...


Anyone tried this light? Looks like a nice successor to my SS X3 on the ML8!

EDIT: F it, 8,80€? Why the hell not, if it's trash I can use it on my winter beater instead.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Be aware it very likely needs 4.2V battery pack, not standard 8.4V one.


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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

ledoman said:


> Be aware it very likely needs 4.2V battery pack, not standard 8.4V one.


I have that 4x18650 pack with USB connection, no idea if it's 8.4 or 4.2V though.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

roadkill401 said:


> ...in my town it is illegal to ride a bike on the road without a light installed on it...


You should be more concerned that riding without a headlight is RUDE to other cyclists. At least 3 or 4 times a year I nearly hit some idiot Ninja riding without a headlight on the road or bike path.



roadkill401 said:


> ...I am sure if I wanted to ride in the pitch black then a brighter better-designed light would be something that you'd want...


Street riding requires a brighter light than off road riding in pitch black, because of the glare from oncoming traffic.

Scott Novak


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

ledoman said:


> Be aware it very likely needs 4.2V battery pack, not standard 8.4V one.


I really wonder if that light is using a linear LED driver. That would explain a likely failure with an 8.4 input voltage.

I would think that most switching LED drivers could easily handle an 8.4V input. I don't think that I've seen a switching LED driver IC that had a maximum input voltage rated less than 20 volts.

Scott Novak


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

MaverickRider said:


> I have that 4x18650 pack with USB connection, no idea if it's 8.4 or 4.2V though.


That's a 8.4v box.

-Garry


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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

garrybunk said:


> That's a 8.4v box.
> 
> -Garry


inb4 this happening: I plug it in, go ride and then the light goes KABOOM while driving out of the street, leaving me in darkness.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I fried one 4.2v light by accident. It simply went "poof" either as soon as I plugged it to the battery or as soon as I turned it on - no magic smoke, no fire, no kaboom - just no function at all.

-Garry


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Garry,

Do you know what type of regulator it had?

There is another problem we have. Using the same connector for different voltages is asking for trouble.

Scott Novak


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Im not sure. It was the Thorefire BL01 I reviewed here: http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night-riding/thorfire-bl01-bike-light-review-1008074.html . Pics of driver toward the end. Seems I didn't quite remember correctly how I blew driver, but still connecting an 8.4v source would likely blow out a 4.2v driver fairly quick.

-Garry


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## turner_nz (Nov 17, 2017)

ledoman said:


> Yes, this combination is still one of the best budget combination out there. The only thing you need to care is overheating of Yinding. Using some fins on the mount (Vancbiker) or at least use alu mount from DX would help. Keep it at lower modes when not moving.


sweet thank mate, i've already ordered that DX mount from reading your guys posts but unsure how to buy the other mount as in in New Zealand, but i bought at cheap heat sink off aliexpress i'm just going to thermal paste it on top see how that goes. also with the 4x18650 battery boxes they will be fine with the bt40s and Yinding light ? it says 8.4v but the light says 7.4v? not to techno savvy got this box https://www.ebay.com/itm/263387332998
thanks fellas


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Those boxes are 8.4V (7.4V is just nominal/average). Make shure cells doesn't bump freely inside. There is a review of it. See post#2 of http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night-riding/battery-thread-2016-beyond-997165.html.


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## turner_nz (Nov 17, 2017)

sweet thanks mate, also do you guys de dome your lights or not bother?


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Gary,

The 7135 is indeed a linear regulator with a 6V maximum input rating. Its no surprise that it burned out with a fresh 8.4V battery. It's not likely that the voltage killed it per se. It just overheated because of the extra power dissipation caused by the higher input voltage.

This also suggests that this is an inefficient regulator wasting precious battery energy and a bad design choice.

To get longer run time it would probably be cheaper to replace the regulator with a switching regulator and operate it from an 8.4V source.


Scott Novak


----------



## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Scott Novak said:


> Gary,
> 
> The 7135 is indeed a linear regulator with a 6V maximum input rating. Its no surprise that it burned out with a fresh 8.4V battery. It's not likely that the voltage killed it per se. It just overheated because of the extra power dissipation caused by the higher input voltage.
> 
> ...


7135s are used in flashlights, they cheap and work for 4.2V systems for torches quite well. Thats basically all that was, a flashlight with external battery pack. Like most components like 7135, you exceed their capacity they overheat and short/burn out.

8.4V systems are rather well known and understood these days around here. Most common is PWM. Switching as you put it. Most lights, even the cheap ones usually use PWM. More expensive the light the more efficient among other points (like quality etc). You will see some that use linear a regulation but its inefficient and generates insane heat compared to PWM.

Gain runtime is dependant on wattage requirements. Both at what the light is designed to emit and efficiency of the system. Everything from the contacts in the battery pack, gauge of wire connecting battery to the light finally into the requirements of the Driver and LED chosen.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

There is a good reason that the 8.4V systems are popular these days. 

For efficiency you need a power MOSFET with a very low on resistance to pass the current with low power losses. You need a sufficiently high gate voltage to drive the MOSFET into it's low on resistance range, and that's very difficult to do with a 4.2 VDC system that drops as low as 2.5 VDC during normal operation.

With an 8.4 VDC system, the minimum voltage before the batteries go into low voltage shutdown is 5.0 VDC, which is sufficient to drive many power MOSFETs to their lowest on resistance, and therefore their most efficient operating range.

At this time it's just not very practical to make an efficient 4.2 VDC LED driver. If you see a 4.2 VDC Li-Ion light system, automatically assume that it's inefficient until proven otherwise.

These days an efficient LED driver is more a matter of good design than parts cost. It's not like the 90's when much of the DC-DC converter was built from discrete parts. Nowadays the switching power MOSFETs are often built right into the driver IC (Integrated Circuit). 

Scott Novak


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

Sirius9 said:


> Wow, this went offtopic *fast*.


 The $11 bike light

or cheap-o lights in general ?


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Some of us have seen for ourselves that 4.2v setups can't even deliver a reasonable amount of power due to losses in cables, connections, etc. . . so in my book they're not even worth messing with due to that alone. (My test sample used a MOSFET, and I even tried replacing it with another high quality MOSFET.)

-Garry


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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

MaverickRider said:


> Anyone tried this light? Looks like a nice successor to my SS X3 on the ML8!
> 
> EDIT: F it, 8,80€? Why the hell not, if it's trash I can use it on my winter beater instead.


And shipped. That remote looks pretty epic though, pop a wheelie, turn on your light and off you go in the darkness!

I wonder if I can reuse my SolarStorm X3 bracket my dad made a few years ago:


----------



## roadkill401 (Mar 14, 2017)

Scott Novak said:


> You should be more concerned that riding without a headlight is RUDE to other cyclists. At least 3 or 4 times a year I nearly hit some idiot Ninja riding without a headlight on the road or bike path.


I find it more worrisome about the ninja idiots who have never heard of the concept of a bell while riding at full tilt down a multi-directional path.

I would rather have someone with at least some form of light with which to see them, than without anything simply because they cannot afford it. It is all fine to say that we are all into MTBR here so we all should be able to afford a good quality light. Just like we all should wear a proper helmet and follow etiquette on the trails.


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

Not sure if this is a new one (probably not). The cable finally broke on my cheap Chinese eBay light from ~2011, which has served me surprisingly well for those 7 years including my 15,000 mile ride from Portland, OR to Ushuaia, Argentina. I just ordered one of these and wondering if anyone can comment on beam pattern and/or build quality. Appears to be a clone of Gemini Duo.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/322510065712


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Looks like what we call the "KD2" listed by Kaidomain. See the review thread on it here.

Probably the same poor heatsinking, not driven too hard, and a good chance the emitters are fakes (though we never knew of fake emitters in KD's version). Beam pattern is adjustable by swapping readily available cheap optics.

-Garry


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

garrybunk said:


> Looks like what we call the "KD2" listed by Kaidomain. See the review thread on it here.
> 
> Probably the same poor heatsinking, not driven too hard, and a good chance the emitters are fakes (though we never knew of fake emitters in KD's version). Beam pattern is adjustable by swapping readily available cheap optics.
> 
> -Garry


Thanks for the info Garry, very helpful! I may order a wide angle lens for one side as that seems to be a good compromise. This has got to be one of the most attractive cheap Chinese lights on eBay currently as it's small and unobtrusive and should output plenty of light without draining the batteries too fast.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Man I ordered that ebay light when this topic popped up last month. Still isn't here.


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## KeithM (Oct 4, 2005)

I have one of these Ebay lights since they are small and you can get the light head for cheap. I have yet to test it out on a long ride but I opened it up and improved the thermal management using some copper foil and some thermally conductive epoxy (JB Weld works). I essentially cut a piece of Cu foil roughly the size of the heat spreaded on the back of the LED PCB but left some some Cu fingers hanging off the side. I glued the foil to the heat spreader and then when it dried glued the fingers to the inside of the casing. I finished if off by putting a bead of silicone around the rear of the case before reinserting the back panel and also put a big glob of silicone on the bottom underneath the mount where the wire exits. I lastly mounted the light head to a Niterider Lumina handlebar mount. Heat is definitely transferred to the housing well and the light is nice and low profile on the handlebars. I just ordered another to use as a helmet light for mountain biking. The LEDs are cool white but mine has a reasonably smooth beam pattern and decent throw. The medium setting is bright enough for most of my road biking needs particularly because I am coming off a 6 year old LED light.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

merzperson said:


> Not sure if this is a new one (probably not). The cable finally broke on my cheap Chinese eBay light from ~2011, which has served me surprisingly well for those 7 years including my 15,000 mile ride from Portland, OR to Ushuaia, Argentina. I just ordered one of these and wondering if anyone can comment on beam pattern and/or build quality. Appears to be a clone of Gemini Duo.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/322510065712


Like Garry said we were tested it getting it from Kaidomain. KD are proven to have geniue leds. If you are going to get geniue 2 XM-L2 U2-1A LEDs it would be fine, but Cool White tint. From KD you can get NW version. Shurely I would advise you to improve heat transfer as is described in my review - post #261.
Beam pattern is quite nice evenly spreaded at about 15° and good for helmet use. I won't advise to use wider lens unless it is meant to be used as a bar light.

Report it back what user inteface you have got with it.


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Probably my favourite cheap light. Unfortunately waterproofing is non existent on the two I have (gets in around the front optics).


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

znomit said:


> Probably my favourite cheap light. Unfortunately waterproofing is non existent on the two I have (gets in around the front optics).


Maybe the lack of waterproofing is intentional since it overheats, now it's liquid cooled 🤣


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

With as many thermal problems as some of these headlights are having, I think you'd be better off swapping the white LEDs with red ones, reducing the LED current for about 100 lumens output total, replacing the lenses with wider dispersion ones, and mounting the light on the rear for a taillight.

I'm actually considering doing this. One of these lights would fit nicely under the rear rack.

Scott Novak


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

ledoman said:


> Again here is new thread for 2018  Wish you the best cheapo lights in 2018.
> 
> * This is the 2018 lights thread to get quick overview with some basic information so keep it clean and useful.*
> 
> ...


So I finally just got this in. Took 4 weeks to ship.

Has the remote, but no way to mount it. Looks like maybe have to find a zip tie or something, but the spacing is super thin.

I went and found a battery to test with. Turned it on, pretty bright as expected, started falling off quickly. Wire started getting WAY too hot, smelled like burning and now it's dead. It lasted literally 20-30 seconds.

Now just the green light turns on and nothing else. One emitter was barely turned on out of 4, but now nothing but the status light turns on.

Will take it apart here in a bit, but already just the thin gauge wire was far too small to safely handle the current.

Didn't even last long enough to get a beam shot picture, but it was the typical 5 degree wide spot with almost zero falloff. The body looks neat though, I'll give it that.

This is now the second cheap light that has arrived to me, and dead within 30 seconds.

























All in all, fun use of $10 I suppose. Hate to be the guy who looks forward to night riding for cheap with this and it dies immediately. Now gotta put off night riding for another 4 weeks.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

You all think this one might be better. Looks interesting.

https://www.banggood.com/XANES-2700...mpaign=sports-and-outdoor-US&cur_warehouse=CN


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Got the same light few days ago. Should be powered by 4.2V pack. *Outbound* what was your power source?

Currenty mine sits dissassembled on my desk waiting to take some pictures. Driver consist of some switching transistors and bunch of resistors driven by 8 pin noname IC.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Outbound and ledoman,

What is the outer case made from. It kinda looks like plastic in the photos.

Scott Novak


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

ledoman said:


> Got the same light few days ago. Should be powered by 4.2V pack. *Outbound* what was your power source?
> 
> Currenty mine sits dissassembled on my desk waiting to take some pictures. Driver consist of some switching transistors and bunch of resistors driven by 8 pin noname IC.


That could be the reason why. I was using my 7.4V packs. Certainly no instructions or anything included with the thing to say what kind of power source it needed.

Scott, it is pretty thick plastic, then really low grade aluminum heat sink. There is about a half square inch of contact, no thermal paste.


----------



## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Yes, but it was already discussed in post #11 it's 4.2V and description on BG page say so, too. Well good candidate to play with another driver on top of this.

For the price not much to expect, no thermal paste is standard for it. Plastic outer shell, but quite big finned alu chunk under that. Small contact area for leds board, true. There are other issue to. Mount for example is very weak screwed into plastic shell.

What I see good is more and more TIR lenses are used resulting in better beam pofiles.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Outbound,

No real standardization of DC power connectors and voltages is one of the issues with the electronic industry. That kind of voltage mismatch shouldn't occur.

That light manufacturer DESERVES to be providing free replacements for failed lights because they didn't identify the voltage input requirements on the light itself. Seriously, how much does it cost to slap on a sticker with that information? SMH!

With the plastic case covering the heat sink it makes me wonder just how hot they are running that thing. I suspect that the plastic shell is used to prevent burns to the skin. But maybe I'm giving them too much credit.

It will be interesting to see what the driver efficiency is, and if they are using an analog LED driver like another 4.2V light that failed on someone here.

Scott Novak


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Scott Novak said:


> Outbound,
> 
> No real standardization of DC power connectors and voltages is one of the issues with the electronic industry. That kind of voltage mismatch shouldn't occur.
> 
> ...


Indeed, maybe it was mentioned on the ebay listing, and obviously was discussed here. But I didn't even think of that potentially being an issue, or had long forgotten about it, haha.

It's part of why I am not selling the light heads alone for my stuff on the website. I want to verify with customers first that they understand I cannot be held liable that they are using an incorrect power source. Either underpowering it or overpowering. There are protection circuits in place, but still we know how the general public is.... hell I just nuked this light without even thinking about it!

My guess on the plastic is it's a styling choice. It doesn't line up at all with fins on the heat sink, and the spacing is so tight that there really isn't a lot of airflow being allowed. With such a large thermal mass, no thermal paste, and the board hardly touching the case, burns shouldn't be a concern at all.


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

ledoman said:


> Like Garry said we were tested it getting it from Kaidomain. KD are proven to have geniue leds. If you are going to get geniue 2 XM-L2 U2-1A LEDs it would be fine, but Cool White tint. From KD you can get NW version. Shurely I would advise you to improve heat transfer as is described in my review - post #261.
> Beam pattern is quite nice evenly spreaded at about 15° and good for helmet use. I won't advise to use wider lens unless it is meant to be used as a bar light.
> 
> Report it back what user inteface you have got with it.


Just got the little Duo clone in the mail. Unfortunately it doesn't appear to work with my trusty old battery. When I make the connection the button LED very briefly lights green then blinks red. Has anyone encountered this? Insufficient voltage maybe? The Kaidomain light is listed as 8.4V, don't have a voltmeter to measure and not sure what my battery outputs. Anyone have battery pack recommendations?

UPDATE:
I tried connecting my girlfriend's almost identical but much newer battery and it powered on fine. The center brightness between this and my old 1xLED eBay light are similar, but the beam pattern is WAY better (no more hotspot) and it overall throws significantly more light. The color of the light is also much closer to white. The modes are low-med-hi with smooth transitions and a couple second hold gives a relatively slow blinking mode. It will definitely need some silicone glue where the power cable exits the case for strength and waterproofing, but at least the lenses have o-rings. Even for cheap-o Chinese standards the power cable is pretty pathetic, the only thing holding it on are the sketchily soldered leads.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

I've always wanted an 8000LM light.....



merzperson said:


> Appears to be a clone of Gemini Duo.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/322510065712


----------



## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

merzperson said:


> .... The modes are low-med-hi with smooth transitions and a couple second hold gives a relatively slow blinking mode. .....


To compare with KD2 light, does yours has off in the mode cycle? Also KD2 has programable modes so you can set any mode out of 10 brightness levels. At any mode hold button for 5-8 seconds so orange status led starts blinking. Then you can choose any of 10 levels for that mode. Long press saves it in memory.


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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

MaverickRider said:


> And shipped. That remote looks pretty epic though, pop a wheelie, turn on your light and off you go in the darkness!
> 
> I wonder if I can reuse my SolarStorm X3 bracket my dad made a few years ago:


Just got it, damn this thing has a weird UI, on, left on, right on, seizure inducing strobe, off.

Didn't catch fire or burn out on my 7.4v pack however, so there's that.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Outbound said:


> There are protection circuits in place, but still we know how the general public is...


If you have adequate protection circuits in place don't worry about it. Just make sure that you have adequate labeling on your light and proper documentation that is straight to the point and easy to read.



Outbound said:


> ...hell I just nuked this light without even thinking about it!


The light failed because it had no overvoltage protection circuit, nor any reasonable labeling of the power requirements.



Outbound said:


> I want to verify with customers first that they understand I cannot be held liable that they are using an incorrect power source.


Your liability ends with making sure that your bike light design does not catch on fire, emit toxic gasses, cause an electrocution hazard, get so hot that it can burn someone, does not have any sharp edges that could cut someone, and making sure that it meets it's advertised specifications.

A safety agency certification doesn't eliminate your liability, but it does show that you were not negligent and that you made a good faith effort to make sure that your product is safe.

You're kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place when it comes to connectors. There aren't much in the way of voltage standards for small coaxial power plugs.

If you want complete control you need to either use a permanently connected internal battery, a permanently connected external battery pack, or use a proprietary connector. I doubt that you would consider any of those options to be viable and I doubt that your customers would be pleased either.

With the DC5521 connector you can expect that your light could be connected to voltages ranging from 3VDC to 24VDC or maybe even more.

The light doesn't need to operate outside of it's specified range. Just make sure that the light is protected against reverse voltage and input voltage out of the light's specified operating range. It appears that you already have that protection in your light design.

I would hope that you have the voltage and current requirements molded into the casting of your light, or at the very least have the requirements on a label on the side of the light. A label wrapped like a flag around the end of the cable near the power connector would also be advisable.

You have a far greater liability selling Li-Ion batteries than you do selling a bike light.

Scott Novak


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

ledoman said:


> To compare with KD2 light, does yours has off in the mode cycle? Also KD2 has programable modes so you can set any mode out of 10 brightness levels. At any mode hold button for 5-8 seconds so orange status led starts blinking. Then you can choose any of 10 levels for that mode. Long press saves it in memory.


It goes off-low-med-hi-off, and long press doesn't appear to do anything beyond the strobe mode. It's definitely the best case I've yet seen in cheap lights, very low profile and lightweight and not hideously ugly with sharp corners to catch on things.


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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

This is not a bike light par se but it could be if you are interested in some tinkering. It looks it has a LED inside, some COB arrays, USB jack at the back side (so 12V to 5V step down)...
US$15 over at BG


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Anyone know what's up with the green glow in the dark O-Rings that they use to seal some of these Chinese lights?









Is there any reason for using green O-rings other than for appearance?

Scott Novak


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Scott Novak said:


> Is there any reason for using green O-rings other than for appearance?


It's an added feature for flashlights so you can find them in the dark. Doesn't make a lot of sense for bike lights, though when I was DIYing I would paint the LED boards with glow in the dark paint just for the added bling.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

*Xanes ML01*

Here are some pictures of internals for Xanes ML01.

Driver from both sides:















Leds are certainly not geniue Cree:








Inside of Alu shell:








Alu shell from both sides:















Lenses and sealing rubber:








Mount on plastic outer shell. Looks pretty weak:








Remote switch with connector:








Interestingly both Alu and plastic shell have their own switch button.















Light pulls 2.5A from 4P1S battery pack when all 4 leds are turned on.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

From looking at the driver pictures that is one inefficient light. Lots of battery power turned to heat by all those resistors.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Interestingly I couldn't find single capacitor on this circuit. Q1-Q4 marked A1sHB are 2.3A mosfet transistors so in theory they can stand 9.2A continious current alltogether at 25°C and 1.5A or 6A alltogether at 70°C. They should run up to 20V Source/Drain and 8V on Gate (signaling). U1 (8pin IC) is giving signaling on the gate pin let the current flow and thus turns leds on or off. 
I need to take a look again what is the first Q on the input side. S4 should be Schottky barrier diode preventing reverse polarity or similar.

Outbound, can you take a look at your driver if you can see what element blowed up under 2S battery pack? Was it U1?


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

@ledoman,

Am I assuming correctly that there isn't a thermally conductive pad or thermally conductive paste underneath the LED PWB?

They actually have a die casting that stood half a chance at cooling and then they covered it with plastic to reduce the airflow. Just shaking my head and wondering why. 

It wouldn't take much to leave off the rear plastic cover and add a few tapped holes for a better mount.

It also looks like it would be easy to cut a piece of aluminum sheet to replace the plastic front cover. You could actually dissipate a bit of heat with that light.

And what IS their fixation with tack solder joints? They have a double sided board with plated through holes. Why didn't they insert the power wires through holes to make reliable solder joints?

@Outbound,

Let me count the ways..............

Scott Novak


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

Wow, I might be truly scared from ever using a cheap-o battery pack again. Today on my ride home from work my light didn't turn on, I looked down and the cable had pulled out from the battery. I took it off and looked at it to see if I might be able to just solder it back on when all of a sudden the battery started smoking and the plastic shrink wrap melted in two spots. When I got home I unwrapped it and found that the two leads on the battery PCB were less than a centimeter apart and uninsulated from each other! This thing is super dangerous! Is there a legit source for battery packs that fits these type of plugs? Now I have to buy my girlfriend a new battery...


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Check The Battery Thread - quite a few sources depending on where you are located. 

-Garry


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

merzperson said:


> Wow, I might be truly scared from ever using a cheap-o battery pack again. Today on my ride home from work my light didn't turn on, I looked down and the cable had pulled out from the battery. I took it off and looked at it to see if I might be able to just solder it back on when all of a sudden the battery started smoking and the plastic shrink wrap melted in two spots. When I got home I unwrapped it and found that the two leads on the battery PCB were less than a centimeter apart and uninsulated from each other! This thing is super dangerous! Is there a legit source for battery packs that fits these type of plugs? Now I have to buy my girlfriend a new battery...


These type incidents are rarely heard of on the forum. I suspect that they happen much more frequently than what gets posted though. I think many folks that have had a cheapo battery or light either die unexpectedly or dramatically as yours did do not post about it out of fear of having folks say "told ya so".


----------



## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Post battery issues in apropriate Battery 2016 and Beyond thread. @merzperson post some pictures there so we can see what happened.


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

ledoman said:


> Post battery issues in apropriate Battery 2016 and Beyond thread. @merzperson post some pictures there so we can see what happened.


Unfortunately it's too late for photos, as I immediately disassembled the battery pack out of fear of fire or electrocution. Also, it appears that this event has fried my brand new light... what a disappointment. I suppose this means I have the opportunity to buy the Kaidomain version, which seems to have a bit better quality control and maybe even genuine CREE emitters(?).


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

If you decided to go with KD2 light I would suggest you to use better battery. Not that linked set is all bad, but KD Panasonic pack is shurely much better. So get separately
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S023808.z
and 
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S024442.z
Be aware they might have problems shipping battery packs alone. Contact their sales department.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Scott Novak said:


> @ledoman,
> Am I assuming correctly that there isn't a thermally conductive pad or thermally conductive paste underneath the LED PWB?


Of course there isn't any thermal paste. This is common for most chinese lights anyway. I woud be surprised if it was there.


----------



## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*Serfas TSL-2500*









Anything look familiar?

Whether or not the same company is making this light for Serfas is a good question. The internals could be significantly different.

Serfas TSL-2500 Headlight (2500 Lumens)
https://www.serfas.com/shop/products/lights/tsl-2500-headlight-2500-lumens/

Serfas TSL-2500
We Test Lights | TSL-2500 Test and Review









Unfortunately they don't state the airflow conditions. On their home page they show a light test with a fan that could be blowing on the light.









Serfas True 2500 USB Headlight 
https://www.amazon.com/Serfas-True-2500-USB-Headlight/dp/B00MBI3GWS

Scott Novak


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*Ad claims for the Serfas TSL-2500:*

*"Other notable features include Ram Air Cooling for increased brightness and longer LED life, while the extra nylon and alloy construction provides superior shock resistance."*

I'm more inclined to believe that the case actually impedes the airflow over the case.

You would probably increase the shock resistance of the light just as much by clamping over a piece of inner tube as you would by using a plastic case.

If you really want to significantly improve the shock resistance and improve the cooling of the internal electronics of a bike light, just add thermally conductive potting compound.

Jacobs, a manufacturer of high end automobile ignition systems, claimed that by potting their ignition coil in thermally conductive silicone potting compound, they increased the vibrational G-force rating from 7 Gs to 62 Gs.

I was potting prototype DC-DC converters in the late 90's. I don't remember the numbers, but the thermally conductive silicone potting compound increased the G-Force rating of the the modules by a staggering amount. It also allowed the modules to run reliably with a 100°C baseplate temperature.

Scott Novak


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*RE: Xanes ML01 version*

I've made a few assumptions that might not be correct. But, I think that this is the basic equivalent circuit for the Xanes ML01 LED driver, if you want to call it that. I'm not showing any paralleled parts and only the driver for one pair of LEDs. I'm using a switch symbol to represent the LED control IC.









I don't see any provision for either voltage or current feedback on that circuit board.

I've done a few estimates and it appears that if the light is switched on continuously, some parts would overheat and burn up with a fully charged 4.2 VDC Li-Ion cell.

There could be fixed pulse width modulation to reduce the average current to the LED. But it would appear that the light intensity will vary with the Li-Ion cell voltage.

I'd really like to see the waveform at the gate of Q1 through Q4.

Looking at the light dispersion pattern, it seems like this might not be a half bad light if you are willing to modify it. You would want to replace the LED driver circuit of course.

Adding a couple more screws to hold down the LED PWB along with some kind of thermally conductive material under the PWB would be in order. I'd also scrape the case to remove any ridges under the LED PWB.

Then trash the plastic case. Cut a flat piece of aluminum for the faceplate, and rig a mount.

Scott Novak


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Scott Novak said:


> .....Whether or not the same company is making this light for Serfas is a good question. The internals could be significantly different.


Almost certainly sharing the same housing. Based on the runtime/output graph the Serfas light must have a different driver. The crude bleed resistor driver shown in the pictures of the Xanes light would create a different runtime/output profile.

I've had my hands on a Serfas True series light and a Serfas TSL1000 from customers wanting custom GoPro adapters. Outwardly they were well made and based on their behavior used some kind of MCU controlled driver.


----------



## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Scott Novak said:


> I've made a few assumptions that might not be correct. But, I think that this is the basic equivalent circuit for the Xanes ML01 LED driver, if you want to call it that. I'm not showing any paralleled parts and only the driver for one pair of LEDs. I'm using a switch symbol to represent the LED control IC.
> 
> View attachment 1184886
> 
> ...


Yes your circuit is basicaly the one as used. I only don't know what for is the Q beside diode S4 on the power input.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)




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## MaverickRider (Sep 15, 2017)

LMAO, I plugged in the remote for that light I bought earlier, and the internal connector just broke off.

Good thing my SS X3 still works fine, what a POS, oh well I might use it for something else instead considering it still works anyway.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*Welcome to the new Japanese!*



MaverickRider said:


> LMAO, I plugged in the remote for that light I bought earlier, and the internal connector just broke off.


I can't tell you how many times I've repaired failed jacks because:

1. The only support that the jack had was the circuit board.

2. The solder joint was substandard and it cracked.

If a solder joint is good, EVERY other component should fail before a solder joint does.

Bad solder joints have constituted better than 70% of the failures that I've repaired in my career.

By the middle 1980s, the engineering world had figured out nearly everything there was to know about reliable soldering. There is NEVER a good excuse for a bad solder joint.

Scott Novak


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*Acacia L2 & XX2 2000LM*

I'm going to order a 6 cell battery box from GearBest and I thought I'd also buy a cheap light to play with.

Can any of you tell what the beam spread of the optics of these two lights is just by looking?








Acacia L2
https://www.gearbest.com/bike-lights/pp_595198.html








XX2 2000LM
https://www.gearbest.com/led-flashlights/pp_425412.html

Scott Novak


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

I suspect the first one has wider beam. From side view they looks similar to ones KD2 light use. I would not go with second one. Got some similar one and the lenses are somewhat curved. Can take a look at evening when I get home (that is more than 12 hours) and try to compare.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*ZHISHUNJIA lights from Deal Extreme*

Here are a couple more variations from DealExtreme using the same extrusion used for the XX2 2000LM from GearBest.
















ZHISHUNJIA DC4.2-8.4V XML T6 LED 1400lm 4-Mode White Bike Light Headlamp - Black
ZHISHUNJIA DC4.2-8.4V XML T6 LED 1400lm 4-Mode White Bike Light Headlamp - Black - Free Shipping - DealExtreme

*=================================
=================================*
















The same extrusion used with internal Li-Ion cells. Unfortunately it appears to be using cheap reflectors instead of lenses. The case does have considerably more surface area for heat transfer.

ZHISHUNJIA LR-Y2 1400lm 4-Mode LED Flashlight Headlamp, USB Rechargeable Bicycle Lamp
ZHISHUNJIA LR-Y2 1400lm 4-Mode LED Flashlight Headlamp, USB Rechargeable Bicycle Lamp - Free Shipping - DealExtreme

Scott Novak


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Scott Novak said:


> ......Unfortunately it appears to be using cheap reflectors instead of lenses.


Odds are fairly good that some of the popular replacement optics (LEDDNA, Gloworm, etc.) could be fitted in place of the reflectors.

Depending on ones beam characteristic preferences though the reflectors may be nice. A person would want to try it out before condemning them. Reflectors have always made a better beam for my preference than optics.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

Vancbiker said:


> on ones beam characteristic preferences though the reflectors may be nice. A person would want to try it out before condemning them.


You are correct, I shouldn't be making assumptions about those reflectors.

It does make me wonder what their design rational is. They are selling two lights that are basically the same except for internal, vs external battery packs. Reflectors with the internal battery, and optics for the external battery pack. You would think that they would use the same for both, just from a manufacturing cost standpoint.

It is quite probable that I will cringe when I look inside the light. After I finish playing with the light I'll probably swap the white LEDs for red LEDs, reduce the output and use it for a taillight. I'm buying the light mainly for the extrusion and the driver.

Scott Novak


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Yes, it certainly does make one scratch their head a bit when trying to figure out why they would fit different parts. One thing I saw when working on a couple MS lights several years ago was that components in two lights purchased within a couple weeks of each other from the same seller had completely different PCBs. Only thing I could think of was that they had to use 2 different suppliers to meet their needs. For the boards to be different designs and component layouts was surprising though.

I'm sure you will cringe on seeing what is inside. A hollow extrusion with a minimal shoulder supporting a thin MCPCB for the LEDs. Poor soldering. Components with bare minimum ratings.....


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Scott Novak said:


> After I finish playing with the light I'll probably swap the white LEDs for red LEDs, reduce the output and use it for a taillight.
> Scott Novak


You can also do that with your "Bright Eyes" light with just the addition of a red wide angle lens. I ran an old P7 Gemini titan that way for a while just using a helmet mount attached to the seat rails for a mount. Performed excellent but I got tired of having to use a remote battery and dealing with the reduced runtimes for my headlights because of the extra drain. Shot shows from L to R, Surfas TL60 (low)/Titan (low - approx. 250 lumens)/ Superflash w/new battery. Just another option.
Mole

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/lenses-optics-reflectors/products/wide-angle-lens-red


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Scott I've got second one and have already changed lenses for 10 deg. LED-DNA. Driver is whinning so I've tried to fix it with hot glue over big inductor. Unsucessfully though. So I can't show you details, but it's somewhat similar to SS X2 ones. LEDs PCB is sitting on thin lips. I've put 0.1mm copper sheet under it so it sticks just little better. Leds are counterfeight, of course.
You get what you pay.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*Hey Bird Watchers, LOOK! A Four Eyed Owl!*















https://www.lightmalls.com/4-cree-xm-l-u2-4-mode-4500-lumens-bicycle-light-4-18650-battery

Even if by chance this light worked well, with the light being that top heavy, I'm sure that you would spend most of your ride readjusting the light.

Scott Novak


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

*ZHISHUNJIA light from Deal Extreme*

I ordered this one from Deal Extreme for $9.43 shipping included.








Hopefully I'll get $9.43 worth of entertainment out of it.

Scott Novak


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Which interface did you choose USB or DC ? I've got USB version. This is the light I did not advise beamwise, but you can change lenses. It looks it can also run on standard 8.4V pack. I might try it when I see your driver.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

ledoman.

I ordered it with the DC option, 4.2 VDC to 8.4 VDC. I'll bet that the driver is the same in both versions with only the connector being different.

I'm planning on buying several different type of lenses and experiment with them.

I was curious to try the mount that it comes with. I'm sure that it's plastic and I probably won't use that mount in winter because it would probably just crack the first time it got bumped in subzero weather.

Eventually I'll probably drill and tap the top of the case so that I can mount it to the underside of my rear rack, and also use red LEDs. I'll hard wire it with a remote switch so that I can turn it on from the handlebars.

I'll disassemble it and take photos when it arrives.

Scott Novak


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## RockySpieler (Jan 8, 2012)

*Cheap Chinese Lights*

I have experience of 2 similar cheap 2 cell lights. I like 18650 replaceable batteries as I use samsung cells and even bring a small pack of spares with me:-

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rH0AAOSwnDpaMTqZ/s-l1600.jpg

The first set has a USB charge option or just take out the 18650, but only lasted 2 rides, there appeared to be a open gap in the centre of each lens, possibly not water proof enough for "sunny" Devon....... 
Additionally I managed to snap the tab off the mounting bracket.

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/0hsAAOSwh1haCfQN/s-l1600.jpg

This second set has survived 2 rides so far, I have 2 of them. Simpilier, no usb charge. Very bright, the light bounces a bit on the bracket, it is the ratchet for direction adjust which is a rivet so cannot be tightened. I will try putting some silicone grease, or thin plastic in the gap.


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## rpitz (Feb 13, 2015)

@RockySpieler, that pretty much sums up the title of the thread: "Cheap-o Chinese engineering". 

Annoying, but I still love my (genuine, to use an oxymoron) two Yindings ;-)


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

New in XANES series - SFL08 "inteligent" light: 








https://www.banggood.com/XANES-SFL0...6-Waterproof-Bicycle-Headlight-p-1261596.html


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

I like that auto-on feature of the xanes. Of course your light might dim if you go under a street light. It would be cool to have a sensor like that pointing forward if you are riding on the road. It could be used to automatically dim the light if there was an oncoming car. 

When was the last time there was a new cheap china light that was actually worth purchasing? I can't remember anything in the last year and a half. There was that one light that around $7 with the four xp-g, but other than that there's been nothing. Even our custom light from gearbest turned out to be a bust due to poor heat conduction. 

I'm still on my NW Yindings. I did end up purchasing a Niterider Lumina 700 all-in-one for around $44 but I haven't used it much.

Am I missing out on something?


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

varider said:


> It would be cool to have a sensor like that pointing forward if you are riding on the road. It could be used to automatically dim the light if there was an oncoming car.


That is exactly what the Imalent BG10 has and how it works. Imalent calls it "smart adapt". I'm in process of reviewing it and hope to post the review soon. The BG10 also let's you turn that feature on & off.

And no, you're not missing anything. Seems things went way downhill with the advent of the fake Cree LEDs.

-Garry


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

garrybunk said:


> That is exactly what the Imalent BG10 has and how it works. Imalent calls it "smart adapt". I'm in process of reviewing it and hope to post the review soon. The BG10 also let's you turn that feature on & off.
> 
> And no, you're not missing anything. Seems things went way downhill with the advent of the fake Cree LEDs.
> 
> -Garry


Looking forward to your review on the Imalent BG10. This lamp has caught my interest. I could care less about the Xanes light. I doubt the light sensor on the BG10 is really something that will make a difference to anyone encountering one while driving a car. Last thing I would want anyway is to have the lamp I am using suddenly drop in output . In certain circumstances that could be catastrophic.


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

That BG10 looks interesting. I like that you can swap out the batteries.

Another USB light that looks half decent. Has this been posted?
https://www.banggood.com/XANES-1200...-Control-Power-Display-No-Batt-p-1206155.html

I know that there's a lot of efficiency loss in the USB lights, but there is a huge convenience factor in having just one type of battery pack. It's probably more of a cheap commuter type of light.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> That BG10 looks interesting. I like that you can swap out the batteries.
> 
> Another USB light that looks half decent. Has this been posted?
> https://www.banggood.com/XANES-1200...-Control-Power-Display-No-Batt-p-1206155.html
> ...


BG10 also allows you to use an external ( USB ) battery pack as well ( or so I am lead to believe ).

The Xanes type lights are just your basic bottom-of-the-bucket Chinese crap lamp. No doubt they are just using the cheapest Chinese clone leds with the lousiest bluish tint you can imagine. Yeah they should light up the road enough to see but you're only going to get what you paid for and no more. The only good in the deal is that it's dirt cheap and will work with any of the USB type battery banks that are available almost anywhere on the net... ( which you have to buy extra ). Personally, if it were me I'd rather buy or use a basic single cell, single emitter torch than one of these cheap-o Junk-in-a-box Chinese bike lights. At least with a torch I can get a better emitter, better tint and carry as many cells as I think I might need and perhaps end up spending less money. Now if these were available with better emitters , better tint I might change my tune.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Based on the teardown of a different Xanes model earlier on in this thread, I'd predict this dual emitter Xanes light has the emitters in parallel and is using a simple PWM, bleed resistor driver. If this is the case, it incurs an even greater loss in efficiency than a USB light using a switching type driver and parallel LEDs.


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## merzperson (Feb 2, 2012)

Anybody have problems ordering from Kaidomain? I placed an order 6 weeks ago and haven't heard anything about the status besides the automated checkout e-mail upon ordering. I tried sending them a message 10 days ago and got no response.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I placed a small order for some dtp copper boards (March 10th) and never saw an update. After a week or two I emailed KD and they replied with a tracking number and tracking website link (www.4px.com). That tracking number FINALLY showed up as departed origin country yesterday. KD is definitely not one of the faster shippers!

Also, there is a thread for shipping issues from China where this discussion is probably better posted.

-Garry


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

merzperson said:


> Anybody have problems ordering from Kaidomain? I placed an order 6 weeks ago and haven't heard anything about the status besides the automated checkout e-mail upon ordering. I tried sending them a message 10 days ago and got no response.


KD is classic for this. Basically have to email them complaining before they will ship your order. Rather irritating. Doesnt matter the size of the order either $20 or $200 they will sit and do nothing with it till you complain.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

merzperson, try to contact member BanL here or at BLF forum. Same person, representative of Kaidomain on both forums. Mostly active on BLF.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

merzperson said:


> Anybody have problems ordering from Kaidomain? I placed an order 6 weeks ago and haven't heard anything about the status besides the automated checkout e-mail upon ordering. I tried sending them a message 10 days ago and got no response.


If you ordered anything with a battery there might be delays. Not to mention that there were a few Chinese holidays during the time that you ordered. Today ( April 5th ) is another Chinese holiday. Not unusual for things to come to a halt during the different holidays, especially the ones listed as "National holidays. Sometimes they even start them early.

Anyway, check your spam folder on your email. Sometimes the return emails get routed as spam.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

Does anyone have follow-ups on lights they ordered? I'm looking for something to play around with.

Also, is there any consensus as to which if any of the gearbest/banggood/DX lights is actually decent or is it so luck of the draw that you might as well order anything?

Thanks


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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

Desertride said:


> Does anyone have follow-ups on lights they ordered? I'm looking for something to play around with.
> 
> Also, is there any consensus as to which if any of the gearbest... lights is actually decent?


Nitefighter BT40S
best all around bike light.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

GearBest sells the "genuine" Yinding dual emitter light, available in cool white or neutral white. That and the BT40S are the "solid" ones you can count on. Some others might be "okay".

-Garry


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

Sirius9 said:


> Nitefighter BT40S
> best all around bike light.


It was on sale last weekend, $24.00 light head only.

There's also a couple sets of Ituo XP3's on amazon for 109USD. If only they shipped to Canada.

C and B Seen has a some nice lights. Tempted to get another one just to try out some new leds. 
They come with XPG3s but the new Samsung LH351D cri 90 leds look interesting.
Not sure what's happening with the company. They shipped my light pretty fast but no shipping confirmation and no response to emails asking what's going on.
The light just showed up the day I was about to contact paypal.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

arc said:


> C and B Seen has a some nice lights. Tempted to get another one just to try out some new leds.
> They come with XPG3s but the new Samsung LH351D cri 90 leds look interesting.
> Not sure what's happening with the company. They shipped my light pretty fast but no shipping confirmation and no response to emails asking what's going on.
> The light just showed up the day I was about to contact paypal.


I had similar experences with C&B Seen. Communication and shipping is slow but never any problems getting what I ordered. Good performing lights for the money! 
Mole


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

arc said:


> It was on sale last weekend, $24.00 light head only.
> 
> There's also a couple sets of Ituo XP3's on amazon for 109USD. If only they shipped to Canada.


Thanks everyone for the info. I've actually been eyeing the Ituo for a few days and with only two left and the advantage of getting it much sooner from a somewhat reputable manufacturer I just ordered it. Hopefully it will come with an improved mount.

The other thing I'd like to pick up is one of those battery boxes that I can use with salvaged laptop 18650s. I'm just confused if they are all the same, whether you can configure them to output 4.2 (for an old light I have from 2012) and whether it makes sense to buy the 6 cell version.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Desertride said:


> Thanks everyone for the info. I've actually been eyeing the Ituo for a few days and with only two left and the advantage of getting it much sooner from a somewhat reputable manufacturer I just ordered it. Hopefully it will come with an improved mount.


Reputable... Amazon is what they have left. I have been trying to get replacement mounts for multiple wiz20s (offered to pay for them) and ignored. They were good till last fall, sadly now it's just more of the Chinese Lottery till they disappear completely.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Desertride said:


> Thanks everyone for the info. I've actually been eyeing the Ituo for a few days and with only two left and the advantage of getting it much sooner from a somewhat reputable manufacturer I just ordered it. Hopefully it will come with an improved mount.


If you go with the Ituo and are disappointed with the mount, you can always switch it to one of my GoPro adapters. Mounting will be bulletproof then.



Desertride said:


> The other thing I'd like to pick up is one of those battery boxes that I can use with salvaged laptop 18650s. I'm just confused if they are all the same, whether you can configure them to output 4.2 (for an old light I have from 2012) and whether it makes sense to buy the 6 cell version.


The battery boxes are pretty much junk IME. Maybe OK for road use, but on trails the cells bounce around and lose contact causing the light to blink or turn off. Some folks have found they work better by adding shims to compress the springs pretty much flat. I've not tried that.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Desertride said:


> Thanks everyone for the info. I've actually been eyeing the Ituo for a few days and with only two left and the advantage of getting it much sooner from a somewhat reputable manufacturer I just ordered it. Hopefully it will come with an improved mount.


Desertride, Israel, I'm guessing you ride in some hot weather. Slim chance that Amazon Ituo XP3 will have a improved mount and I've broken all 5 of the Gopro Ituo mounts I've had (no issues with my Wiz20 mount though) so would recommend you look at the Vancbiker mounts. I ride in the deserts of Arizona and consider these mounts a must even for the better lights like the XP3 your ordered. Lowers operating temp by 10+ degrees from my measurements. 
Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

MRMOLE said:


> .....I've broken all 5 of the Gopro Ituo mounts I've had (no issues with my Wiz20 mount though)


Kind of a surprise there. I've sold far more Wiz20 to GoPro adapters than the XP series to GoPro version.


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Vancbiker said:


> Kind of a surprise there. I've sold far more Wiz20 to GoPro adapters than the XP series to GoPro version.


I believe he's talking about the GoPro adapters made by ITUO themselves.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Vancbiker said:


> Kind of a surprise there. I've sold far more Wiz20 to GoPro adapters than the XP series to GoPro version.


XP series lights come stock with a functional and reliable plastic go pro lighthead mount. Wiz20 comes with a click in QR style mount that requires changing to opeate with a Gopro style system. In both cases it's the bar mount that fails so XP's can still be used with any Gopro style bar or helmet mount vs. the Wiz20 that requires a new lighthead adapter to fit anything other than the stock bar mount + I think your the only one who makes Gopro adapters for that light. I was lucky enough to get one of the first version Wiz20's that came with a much stronger mount but those who's lights came with the fragile mounts have only you to turn to (lucky for them!) to make their otherwise excellent lights functional again.
Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Ah, I thought you meant you had broken the GoPro compatible piece on the light itself. 

While not everyone tells me what broke when ordering adapters there have been quite a few that mentioned breaking or damage to the piece attached to the light head on both XP and Wiz20 lights. A few mentioned the mounting screws pulling through the plastic piece. I do not formally track this type stuff, just recall it from the communication as folks place orders.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

MRMOLE said:


> Desertride, Israel, I'm guessing you ride in some hot weather. Slim chance that Amazon Ituo XP3 will have a improved mount and I've broken all 5 of the Gopro Ituo mounts I've had (no issues with my Wiz20 mount though) so would recommend you look at the Vancbiker mounts. I ride in the deserts of Arizona and consider these mounts a must even for the better lights like the XP3 your ordered. Lowers operating temp by 10+ degrees from my measurements.
> Mole
> 
> View attachment 1202692


Thanks for the info. Part of the idea of riding at night is to avoid the heat  and in some locals where I ride the temps are reliably cooler overnight, but obviously keeping the light cooler will always benefit its longevity. I'll see how it performs with the stock setup and whether I prefer it bar or helmet mounted, then look into alternative mounts.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Okay, saw these on ebay and thought someone might find these interesting. These of course look to be very much like the very nice Fenix lamps. Even has the same ( or similar ) lens on the front to spread out the beam pattern. Looks like a decent mount and you can switch out batteries. Likely the down side is that the emitters are only T6 bright white while the brand name Fenix use the very nice XM-L2 neutral white emitters. Still, at this price not a bad deal. Not sure these are on the USA website but you might be able to order them off the AU site.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

Interesting light. Also available on AliExpress

What's with the cob emitter on the top? Map light?

Edit: the pictures on this listing explain it. It doubles as a work light. You can also see what it looks like inside.


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Bike light, work light and USB power bank too. Probably a useful light if you don't need a dedicated bike light.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Hmm . . . a very interesting multipurpose light!

-Garry


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## phalkon30 (Jan 17, 2009)

I've purchased several of the tail lights that look like that under the name Blitzu on Amazon. Great lights, reliable, nice mount, and cheap.

I don't see that headlight on Amazon, but there are some very similar ones


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

Do you guys know of any good lights to put on the chainstays?


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

znomit said:


> Bike light, work light and USB power bank too. Probably a useful light if you don't need a dedicated bike light.


Indeed! Didn't know that was a COB panel on the top. Looking at the Aliexpress link, me thinks I detect the dreaded "bluish" tint of the cheap T6 emitters. That said it might not be that bad in actual use, certainly looks more than enough light to ride by.

Glad someone mentioned it can act as a USB power bank. Last night forgot to charge my phone and was thinking I'd be battling low power all day. I almost forgot that the Raveman PR1200 I have has the same option. ( Yea! )...I get to use the 1200 today as a power bank!

I tell ya, if I didn't already have enough lights I'd buy one of these just because it has so many uses. ( and replaceable batteries to boot ) :thumbsup:

Edit; would be interesting to see if you could replace the emitters with better emitters since it looks like you can take off the front.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

leaftye said:


> Do you guys know of any good lights to put on the chainstays?


Do you want the light to be visible from the sides or the rear? From the sides, any small tail light should work. If you want a low light visible from the rear, then mount it to the seat stays, right? For side visibility it might make more sense to wrap he chainstays in 3M reflective tape.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

From the sides. Many mounts are made to attach to fat handlebars and seatposts, not so much to skinny chainstays. I've done reflective tape on my other bike, and will probably do it to this one too, but I want lighting as well.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

leaftye said:


> From the sides. Many mounts are made to attach to fat handlebars and seatposts, not so much to skinny chainstays. I've done reflective tape on my other bike, and will probably do it to this one too, but I want lighting as well.


Best bet would probably be those small silicone lights or these. On the latter you can replace the bungee with zip ties for more security.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

Cat-man-do said:


> Indeed! Didn't know that was a COB panel on the top. Looking at the Aliexpress link, me thinks I detect the dreaded "bluish" tint of the cheap T6 emitters. That said it might not be that bad in actual use, certainly looks more than enough light to ride by.


Speaking of BC30 knockoffs, how does this one from lightmalls strike you? (they even copy the name)


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

For anyone interested, the BT40s (light only) is on flash sale now for $16. 11 left as of now.

https://www.gearbest.com/bicycling-gear/pp_182282.html?wid=1433363


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Price doubles when put in cart. No gearbest for me.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Same doubled price for me too. No cheap meal, but it happens from time to time if you are lucky.

I've got in contact with Gearbest. Do you have any suggestions on lights that should be reviewed? I might get one or two.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

Sorry you guys missed it.

Ledoman, maybe review those multi emitter marsing lights?


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Don't know which ones exactly did you mean, but Marsing have had pretty bad quality with SSX2 clone. I don't expect others would be any better. And already know the leds are cheapo fakes.


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

Most of the lights they have seem pretty bad.
The Zanflare B3 has been reviewed as well as the Ravemen.
UltraFire UH - Z1? ON THE ROAD MX3-BL?


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

I'm sure output is dismal, but I like the idea behind lights like this.

https://www.gearbest.com/bike-lights/pp_009943950400.html

There's a version that works with disc brakes, but GB doesn't appear to have it yet.

I don't see anything on GB worth using though. BG has a better selection.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Yes, to bad there are very few good lights there. I was expecting Zanflare would build NW version of their B3, but it looks they never will.

@Desertride, UltraFire UH - Z1 is very likely as most others hollow one, same as many we have seen here. "ON THE ROAD MX3-BL" is just a bit pricely flashlight beamwise with better user interface. Ok it look it has remote switch, but the mount is not suitable for MTB. As title says it's for the road use. Will think about it...


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

It looks like there is a 5000-5500k version of the zanflare, but it's twice as expensive. For neutral white are you looking at something closer to 4k?


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

NW version of B3 is just listed but unavalaible. Around 5000K is just fine, 4k is to warm for my taste.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

If you can get review items from BG, try out the Xanes STL07.

https://www.banggood.com/XANES-STL0...ble-IPX6-Waterproof-Rear-Light-p-1305253.html

I just got it, and can confirm it senses forward and backwards acceleration, and seems to ignore side to side and vertical acceleration. It claims to put out 200 lumens. I don't think it's brighter than my 150 lumen Cygolite Hotshot Pro 150. It's hard to judge in daylight, but I'd estimate around 100 lumens.

I'd also like to see how this performs. 
https://www.banggood.com/XANES-PL01...-High-intensity-LED-Bike-Light-p-1289491.html

They have it mounted to the seat and chain stays, which I'd like to do for side visibility on the street. If you got a free review sample, I'd also like to know how long it lasts mounted to the pedals as they've shown.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Unfortunately I don't have any contacts with BG. Maybe Garry can help you.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I'm not doing any reviews right now. It got to be too much for me to keep up with. 

-Garry


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

I totally understand Garry. It's a lot of work to do a proper review.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

@Leaftye; I really don't think anyone following a bike using something that lit up when braking is actually going to recognize this as " a braking light". IMO having something to indicate braking on a bicycle is just a waste of time.

On the other hand I saw this on BG and thought this interesting although no way I'd use one on my bike. On the other hand if I had an ebike I'd consider one for the back of the rack.

You are right though, BG has a lot of bike light stuff. I wanted to use the other word that starts with "S" but decided to be nice and just say "stuff".


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

It's already lit. It just gets brighter. 

I like the idea of turn signals, but I think they're pointless when so close together. There's a reason why motorcycle signals are required to be a certain distance apart.

Edit: It has different modes. Yes, it can blink, but it can also pulse and then pulse even brighter when braking. I think it has manual and auto full brightness mode too.


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

leaftye said:


> try out the Xanes STL07.
> 
> https://www.banggood.com/XANES-STL0...dered it; thanks! Looks like well-made stuff.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

-Archie- said:


> Just ordered it; thanks! Looks like well-made stuff.


You don't have your seat all the way forward do you? It needs the rear parts of the rails to mount to.

Yeah, it feels solid. Seems like a decent light.


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

leaftye said:


> You don't have your seat all the way forward do you? It needs the rear parts of the rails to mount to.


Unusual mount is a primary reason for me to order it: probably, I'll put it to one of my kid's bikes - as common seatpost-mounted flashers have quite limited lifetime there.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

ledoman said:


> NW version of B3 is just listed but unavalaible. Around 5000K is just fine, 4k is to warm for my taste.


Yep I have the only nw 4K B3 in existence! I haven't gotten around to using the light, GoPro mount on the light head is oddly sized, very poor qc. Won't work on my Vanc mount either. My dremel mite get some action soon, but my nite rides are seriously limited these days due to work schedule.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

-Archie- said:


> Unusual mount is a primary reason for me to order it: probably, I'll put it to one of my kid's bikes - as common seatpost-mounted flashers have quite limited lifetime there.


Sounds like a good candidate then since it's mostly protected by the seat. It uses zip ties to attach, which would probably be good enough, but I think metal ties could be substituted. If I can find mine, I'll give it a shot.


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

Maybe I'll modify it to something like Cateye rear light seat mount (two bars tightened with screws), but probably zip tie is reliable enough. Let's see...


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

https://www.banggood.com/Lumintop-C...4&utm_campaign=fin17&utm_content=chendongling

New Lumintop with cutoff beam and can run off power bank. There's 2 reviews on BLF for this light,


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dirt Road said:


> https://www.banggood.com/Lumintop-C...4&utm_campaign=fin17&utm_content=chendongling
> 
> New Lumintop with cutoff beam and can run off power bank. There's 2 reviews on BLF for this light,


Brownie points for having a cut-off type optic and being able to charge and run at the same time but.....What about the funky bar mount? Judging from the photos there is no locking mechanism for the back of the mount. That said I don't know what is preventing a lamp with a mount like this from just falling off with the first big bump in the road.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Hello, I'm back .

Maybe not newest lamps but I have some new toys .

Last years Vastefire 2*XM-L2 6000LM (It's model number i think )


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dirt Road said:


> https://www.banggood.com/Lumintop-C...4&utm_campaign=fin17&utm_content=chendongling
> 
> New Lumintop with cutoff beam and can run off power bank. There's 2 reviews on BLF for this light,


I took another look at the* Lumintop C01* and looked at the video review. Seems the mount works exactly as I first thought. Basically the back of the mount utilizes plastic teeth on which the back part latches onto. ( Note; there is no "lock-on" mechanism. The back is held on only by tension. ) I have a very low opinion of such mounts as I had a cheap torch mount that worked in the same manner and it was an absolute POS. This one might be a bit better but at some point the teeth are going to wear out and the lamp then be hard to keep from moving ( if not outright falling off the bars ). In the video the guy mounts it to a torch which makes it look stable but in the real world bike handlebars tend to be a bit larger.

The lamp it's self looks half decent. Most of the beam pattern though is more forward but for the price it might work fairly well.

( Edit : If I were to buy one of these likely I'd likely take a piece of two sided Velcro and loop the Velcro around the two pieces in back to make for a more secure lock. While that might work no telling really how much movement might happen once the interlocking teeth begin to wear....I hate stuff with plastic teeth. Just does not inspire confidence in getting a tight fit. )


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> The lamp it's self looks half decent. Most of the beam pattern though is more forward but for the price it might work fairly well.


For me the price is the main drawback to this light. Whatever good qualities it has the price puts it in direct competition with the more powerful Ravemen CR500 that is of known excellent quality and performance. 
Mole

https://www.rakclighting.com/collections/ravemen-cr-series/products/ravemen-cr500-led-bike-light


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Another good looking lamp with very promising specifications :



> 2x Cree XM-L2 LEDs
> max 1800lm
> 4400 built in battery
> 3 constant modes + 2 blinkies (strobe + SOS)
> ...


Banggood - XANES-DL13 - 1800 lumens - 24,89$
Aliexpress - Vastfire 1800 lumens 2x XM-L2 - 26,37$
Tomtop - Y10 600LM USB Rechargeable Bike Light - 24,99$

If somebody would ask - I've bought the one from banggood - 1800 lumens 

















There is also green version rated 2400 lumens, but as the pricing is almost the same I don't think that there be any major difference.

Aliexpress - Wosawe BCD-006 - 28,92$


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> For me the price is the main drawback to this light. Whatever good qualities it has the price puts it in direct competition with the more powerful Ravemen CR500 that is of known excellent quality and performance.
> Mole
> 
> https://www.rakclighting.com/collections/ravemen-cr-series/products/ravemen-cr500-led-bike-light


Correct. The Lumitop CO-1 is definitely over priced. Raveman CR-500 would certainly be the better deal. If it had a better mount and a remote than yes, the $49 asking price would make more sense. Judging from the photos the CR-500 has the better over all more even / smoother beam pattern. Possible though that the Lumitop has better throw but can't say for sure unless I were to see one in person and then do a direct comparison.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dominik.M said:


> Another good looking lamp with very promising specifications :
> 
> Banggood - XANES-DL13 - 1800 lumens - 24,89$
> 
> ...


The BGood Xanes DL13 is interesting, if only because the price is so low and the mount looks like it might actually work. (**Please note that the mount in the photo above is not what is shown on the BGood site for the DL13. Go to the BG site to see the mount...Oh shoot!
Looks like they show two different mounts! The one I like is not the one with the threaded strap shown in the above photo. This creates a problem.  There is another mount they show at the top of the ad that has a mount with a threaded screw...much more to my liking ) ) I don't believe the claim of 1800 lumen. Now if it actually produces 1200 lm that would be great.

Since you claim to own one of these I'm curious as to your take on the claimed output. _How bright do you think this lamp is on it's highest output?_ Which mount do you have? I have to admit I'm somewhat confused by the chart that you supplied. Looks like the chart is saying the lumen output is just over 400 lumen ( ? :skep: ).

Whatever, if the output is near 1K lumen with the emitters being true NW Cree XM-L2's, along with all the other features I'd have to say that the price is a bargain. Not to mention it looks like the front of the lamp is held on with screws so it might even be possible to take off the front of the lamp and use different optics.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

del.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

I've got the lamp exactly as on the attached picture - with the manual for "Y10 Bike light". I've expected about 600-700 lumens on high, these days it's easily achievable, but the real lumen output's are as follow :
HIGH : 433 lumens
MID : 227 lumens
LOW : 109 lumens

So, no bargain here, You get what you pay for :smilewinkgrin:


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

cheap Chinese stuff is always way off from the bogus claims anymore. the days of at least honest cheap stuff are long dead.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

You simply have to find the border between cheap and too cheap to be true . 
That's why I'm doing some research .


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dominik.M said:


> I've got the lamp exactly as on the attached picture - with the manual for "Y10 Bike light". I've expected about 600-700 lumens on high, these days it's easily achievable, but the real lumen output's are as follow :
> HIGH : 433 lumens
> MID : 227 lumens
> LOW : 109 lumens
> ...


Thanks for the feedback. Since it still has two batteries inside ( likely ) can you tell me how long it runs on high? I'm figuring that if it only outputs around 430 lumen the run time on high should be over 3hrs.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

*Cat-man-do*, I did not complete my setup to make burn-time measurements... 







I need to adapt some kind of mount and active cooling system . Then I'll be able to provide some more data.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*@Dominik.M*...I just found one of the lights like yours only with the mount that I wanted ( according to the photo on Amazon ) *sigh*, I don't know why but I ordered another cheap-o light that also caught my attention. The other one is this one ( photo below ) which I also found on Amazon. Sometimes I hate myself because I know I'll likely only use these a couple times but once in a while I still like to see if there are bargains worth buying. I should have these by next week. I'll let you know what I think about them and how they compare to my brand name lights after I've had some time to fool with them ( being the fool I am... ).


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

.del sorry I don't know why it's post itself here.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Another good looking cheapo light... With cutout and a quite reasonable handlebar mount.

Aliexpress : 3 Modes LED Light Bicycle 1000 Lumens -15$
Alibaba : 2018 New German standard USB rechargeable led - 10$ in wholesale



> Case material: aluminum alloy
> Surface treatment: wear-resistant anodic oxidation
> Light source material: T6 (light passed StVZO authentication in Germany).
> Radiation distance: 300-500 meters
> ...



View attachment 1212752

View attachment 1212753

View attachment 1212754


So, 1000 lumens they say? I was hoping for 500-600 from 1x18650 Li-Ion.
View attachment 1212755


Almost 200 lumens, the worst bang for a buck value ever :madmax:
But honestly If you need a cheap light for a city it might actually work


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*@Dominik.M*....about the above lamp.. Looks like a very nice beam pattern but once again it bothers me that the actual lumen output look to be only half of the claimed output. What really draws my attention to this lamp is that it looks like you might be able to switch out the battery. Can you confirm this? Looks like the back of the lamp has a removable cap on it. If so that would be a really big plus and would trump the fact that the one I linked to has a remote...although I love's me's a nice remote and hidden flash modes.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

About :
View attachment 1212752


Yes - it has replaceable battery.
The beam pattern looks fine - I'll make some comparison photos in the future.
The front glass is some kind of thin acrylic like material - It looks that it might scratch easily.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Mini review; Tansoen Y-10*

Okay got the light today and just did a short ride. Nice night for a ride, even if it was at 2:00am. I'm going to be as brief as possible. The Y-10 is advertised as being 1000 lumen. While it is quite bright it's not 1K lm. If I had to guess I'd guess around 500 lumen, tops.

First the positives; I was very impressed with the mount. Very robust mount for such a cheap light. Beam pattern is a typical double spot beam and the lamp does have some decent throw. While 500 lumen is not super bright I was not able to out-run the usefulness of the beam pattern even when I was moving fast. Since I'm pretty much accustomed to a wider beam pattern it was a little strange using a lamp with a much narrower beam pattern. Some of this though was not the fault of the lamp. My handlebars are tapered and so I really couldn't get the lamp aimed exactly the way I wanted. Because of this the lamp was slightly off center of where I was riding. My fault really, I could of fixed this before the ride but it was late and didn't feel like making a shim to fix the issue. The lamp does have a unique feature though in that it is designed to step-pivot side to side. That could come in real handy for someone going down a curved hill at speed. One click to the right or left and you have the lamp aimed 10° to the right or left of center.

The negatives; The voltage indicators are very bright. If I were to use something like this on a regular basis I would have to put tape over the first two. The flash modes are in the main menu with this lamp. While the strobe mode I consider useless the SOS mode is surprisingly useful. Unlike most SOS modes this one is a very fast SOS. This makes it quite useful for daytime riding as it is quite bright. Once again the beam pattern is a typical conical beam pattern. If you aim it straight ahead it will quite likely be blinding to approaching traffic. My biggest pet peeve with this lamp is the tint of the LED's. While not as bad as some others I've seen in the past, this one just seems a tad too cold a tint to be able to please my very critical preferences. If this lamp had used emitters more in the 5-6000K range I'd likely be giving it a rave review. That said, for $20 you get what you pay for.

Summing up, would I buy this lamp again? If I only had $20 for a light, yes I would. Beam tint is only important when you have used better lamps ( of which I have used many better lamps ). When you have the money for a better lamp you can afford to be picky. This lamps works and lets you see what you need to see. If you can live with the beam tint you should be pleased with the product. ( no comment on run time of the lamp as that would require a much longer ride )


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Anyone suggest something to pair my BT40s clone with? Something for my helmet, all in one would be nice, any Exposure clones?


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

What budget are we talking about?
What kind of helmet - ride type ?


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Dominik.M said:


> What budget are we talking about?
> What kind of helmet - ride type ?


Around $50. I've got a 7iDP M2, same as the Fly Racing Freestone helmet. Mostly riding woods / singletrack.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Craig24 said:


> Anyone suggest something to pair my BT40s clone with? Something for my helmet, all in one would be nice, any Exposure clones?


Not sure what clone you have but if it matches the neutral white emitter tint of the BT40s it will limit your choices considerably. If you want to match emitter tint (lights work best that way) here's what I would recommend even though both are above your ideal price range. For the extra money these cost you also get a considerable upgrade in quality over anything less expensive or your clone.

Ituo Wiz1 is self-contained and close to what you want to spend but doesn't come with a helmet mount but is Gopro compatible.
https://www.amazon.com/ITUO-Headlight-Flashlight-Rechargeable-Commuter/dp/B01DN8R65C/ref=lp_11069935011_1_8?srs=11069935011&ie=UTF8&qid=1534875926&sr=8-8
https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/gloworm-parts-and-accessories/products/gloworm-universal-helmet-mount

Ituo XP2 (new old stock) comes with a good helmet mount (bar mount is junk but look in product description for code for free upgraded metal mount), makes a lot more power which would compliment your BT40s clone better IMO.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MFGOOHU/ref=s9_acsd_hps_bw_cr_x__a_whttp://

Mole


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Quite light helmet I would say... So the light also should be on the light side .
Maybe : JETBeam BR10 ?







It's quite easy to get the helmet mount for this light.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*iKirkLiten Urban 600; mini review*

I just got this tonight. Rained all day today and the rain stopped about 2hrs. ago. I really like the look of this lamp. If it wasn't so late (3:40am ) I'd love to take this one for a spin but that will have to wait till tomorrow. ( see photo below )









This little lamp claims to provide 600 lumens. Not sure it does that but my guess is that it comes pretty close. Did a lux comparison with the other cheap lamp I just got ( Tansoen Y-10 ) and the Urban 600 measured ( @~3M ) 574 lux. The Y-10 a tad less at 520 lux. Of course the Urban 600 has the more interesting beam pattern as the optic is designed to provide a bit of light directly in front of the bike with most of the light projected to the front. The optic is actually aimed at a downward angle so while there is not a really sharp cut-off, the angled beam pattern produces somewhat the same effect as long as you don't aim the lamp upward. Just how that is gonna look when I take it outside is anyone's guess but I'm hopeful that it is gonna look nice. From what I can tell shining it around in my hallway the beam pattern is not super wide. Hopefully it will be wide enough to make it worth using on the road but I won't know that till I actually take it out on the road.

So far I'm pretty impressed with this lamp. Nice little wired remote with the lamp and the lamp is made entirely of aluminum. Holding it in my hand it has some weight. The mount....I have to admit this is the first lamp I've used with one of those toothed straps. Damn was I wrong. The mount seems to work fine and holds onto the bars without any need for shims.

Almost forgot to mention the beam tint. This lamp claims to be using the XPG-3. Beam tint looks very close to what the Y-10 has but until I actually take it outside on some dry pavement I won't know for sure. A lot will depend on how the optic spreads the light as to how annoying the tint will be or not.

( Edit: Okay, I had to take it outside even if after 4am. Unfortunately the roads and paths were still very wet. It must of rained a bit more once I got home. Well, I will say the beam pattern is indeed very narrow. Even so the little Urban-600 put out a very even and well lit beam pattern from 2ft. in front of the bike to as far out as it would reach. How far?...quite far. On wet bike paths with lots of ground fog it was hard to say for sure but it definitely out throws the Raveman CR-500 I brought along for comparison. Beam tint worked very well on wet pavement. Can't wait to see what this lamp will do on dry pavement. Please note: I almost killed myself doing the quicky ride tonight....hit some wet leaves while turning and almost bought it. Skinny tires and wet leaves don't mix. I'll give my thumbs up or thumbs down after I do my ride tomorrow night )


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*iKirkLiten Urban 600; review part II*

I did another short ride with the Urban 600. This time on dry pavement and all on the road. Sometimes I forget how well lit the roads are where I live with all the ambient light. Thankfully I do get a couple short segments where there is little light.

The Urban 600 does indeed have a narrow beam pattern when close to the bike. Once it reaches to about the 25 ft. range the beam pattern is about 5-6 ft. wide. At that point it gets wider the farther it reaches. How exactly far is that? Depends on how much ambient light is around but when on a really dark segment of road it looks like it might reach as far as 150 ft. on a fresh charge.

The U-600's strong point is that it works well when on straight or fairly straight roads. I almost forgot to mention that the lamp has side ports for providing some side visibility. While the lamp is designed to swivel ( side to side ) you can't do this on the fly. Once you tighten the plastic screw the mount locks in place.

My ride likely only took about 15 minutes and when I pulled up to my building the voltage indicator was just beginning to turn to "flashing red". This was not good. Flashing red usually indicates the lamp is about to turn off. With that in mind I had to find out how long the lamp was going to run if used on high. When I went inside my home I ran the lamp to cutoff. Surprisingly the lamp did provide the 1hr and 30 minutes promised by the ad ( actual time was 1hr and 35 minutes ). I have to note however that there is considerable loss of output the longer the lamp runs. Using the lux app on my phone I noticed a drop of 100 lux after just over an hour. If it was somewhere in the 550 lumen range at startup it likely was about 450 lumen at about the 1hr. and 13 minute mark. By the time the lamp cut off output was likely in the 150-200 lumen range.

*Summing up: I'd give it a 3.5 out of 5 stars.* Very useful beam pattern as long as you are careful going around turns. Wired remote worked very well. Lamp is listed as having a 2500mAh battery. There is one flash mode in the main menu. I am somewhat disappointed that the lamp was not able to maintain the brightest output for more than an hour but at this price point it is not surprising. Now if you can get by with the medium mode ( which @ ~ 300 lumen is half decent ) you can obviously get a lot more run time. The voltage indicators are for the most part useless. All things considered, you will have a hard time finding a better self-contained road lamp at this price range ( $26 @ Amazon ) ( BTW, these sold out just after I mentioned that I bought one ). ( edit; The lamp has four mini ( hex? ) screws in the back. It might be possible to replace the battery...maybe )


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into them. I had been using a Fluxient U2 Mini on my helmet which worked well, but I appear to have lost it since last winter 

It's the Shark Motorcycle Audio BT40s clone with neutral white emitters. I always fancied a BT21 as a helmet light but never managed to get one.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dominik.M said:


> Quite light helmet I would say... So the light also should be on the light side .
> Maybe : JETBeam BR10 ?
> View attachment 1213146
> 
> It's quite easy to get the helmet mount for this light.


I think the person who you are addressing that wanted the helmet light wanted something self-contained and also "Neutral White". The NW part is the toughy. MMole had it right when he recommended something like the original ITUO Wiz-1. Wiz-1 is a little heavy though for the helmet ( I own one ) but it does supply a NW Cree emitter.

I own several NW single 18650 torches that can work as a helmet light. Since the guy that owns the BT40S he really needs something that will address the limitations of the BT40S...namely; BT40's has limited distance throw. Makes for a nice bar lamp but it really helps if you have another lamp with distance throw to combo with.

I like the Convoy series of torches for bike use. Still if you want "throw" you will need the right size reflector. You can order torches with different drivers and different emitters but getting the right type of reflector to suit your needs is the real toughy. The Wiz-1 can be used with a single 18650 although the one I have can also use a 26650.

Personally I think the person who wanted the NW Self-contained lamp would be better off with a standard two Cree XM-L2 bike lamp and then carry the battery in a pouch or in a hydration back pack. You can use a torch on the helmet but you can't really use torches on full output mode without there being heat issues with the lamp ( depending on what mode you use most of the time ).

Okay, now what would CMD do? I own a BT40S. If I were using it and wanted to run a lightweight self contained lamp on the lid I'd probably use my PFlex Convoy M1 18650 torch. I custom ordered the one I own so I have a NW XPL-HI emitter and a 5 mode UI. I can mount mine directly to my helmet using Velcro or use a standard Gopro helmet mount and then use a Gopro style torch holder. For me this works but I know that I can't use the turbo setting for more than a couple minutes or the torch will get really hot. Still I can run the next setting which is at 50% and that gives me about 500-600 lumen in a beam pattern that still has some decent reach. IMO, this is what that guy needs. ( Gopro helmet mounts and Gopro torch holders are available on Amazon. How well one of these setups works will depend on the vent hole design on the helmet you use )


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Cat-man-do said:


> I think the person who you are addressing that wanted the helmet light wanted something self-contained and also "Neutral White". The NW part is the toughy. MMole had it right when he recommended something like the original ITUO Wiz-1. Wiz-1 is a little heavy though for the helmet ( I own one ) but it does supply a NW Cree emitter.
> 
> I own several NW single 18650 torches that can work as a helmet light. Since the guy that owns the BT40S he really needs something that will address the limitations of the BT40S...namely; BT40's has limited distance throw. Makes for a nice bar lamp but it really helps if you have another lamp with distance throw to combo with.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the detailed response. What if I was going to go down the lamp and separate battery route, what would you recommend for pairing with the BT40s, seen as thought the B21 and the Yinding are no longer available, I only ask as I have a spare battery pack so it may make more sense.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Craig24 said:


> Thanks for the detailed response. What if I was going to go down the lamp and separate battery route, what would you recommend for pairing with the BT40s, seen as thought the B21 and the Yinding are no longer available, I only ask as I have a spare battery pack so it may make more sense.


I still think this Amazon Ituo XP2 is your best value!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MFGOOHU/ref=s9_acsd_hps_bw_cr_x__a_whttp://

Here's another option you can get as a lighthead only in NW tint that works very well with th BT40s. Probably as much for just the lighthead (and your missing out on thee excellent 6800 mAh Panasonic cell battery pack that comes with the XP2 kit) but it does come with this cool QR bar mount that with work with your BT40s with the addition of an additional adapter and Gopro mount for your existing light. Centers the light in front of the stem.

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/gloworm-lights/products/2018-gloworm-alpha-1200-lumen-bike-light?variant=355771482130

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/gloworm-parts-and-accessories/products/universal-adapter-for-gloworm-quick-release-handlebar-mount

Mole









**I know this stuff isn't cheap Chinese but with no availability on the BT21 (I loved this light) or NW Yinding I know of nothing left that's not just junk**


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Thanks for taking one for the team and ordering the iKirkLiten Cateye. I like that we are getting some half-decent all-in-ones for under $40. The fact that it has a car like cutoff and a remote is even better.

I just checked out what MrMole said about the NW Yinding. That's a big loss if it's permanent. I was thinking of grabbing a 3rd NW as a backup this fall. We need to convince gearbest to carry those again, it's still one of the best lights in the cheap-light category in my opinion. There will be lots of guys in the next two months who would have benefited from this light. We always get swamped with the light recommendation requests this time of year. Perhaps we could reengage gearbest.

Here's a Yinding clone with 3 mode groups 
https://www.lightmalls.com/2xcree-x...-bicycle-light-lamp-lamp-cap-only-khaki-color


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

varider said:


> Here's a Yinding clone with 3 mode groups
> https://www.lightmalls.com/2xcree-x...-bicycle-light-lamp-lamp-cap-only-khaki-color


That's interesting! Is it really a clone, or yet another "visually similar" thingie with no thermal path and waterproofing? The reviews tab at LM is empty currently...


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

This is same as KD2 I've reviewed quite some time ago. Besides KD also has NW leds.

So nothing new I would say, driver has same UI. Ok, maybe different lenses, very likely more narrow ones.


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

ledoman said:


> This is same as KD2 I've reviewed quite some time ago.


Ok, thanks.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Craig24 said:


> Thanks for the detailed response. What if I was going to go down the lamp and separate battery route, what would you recommend for pairing with the BT40s, seen as thought the B21 and the Yinding are no longer available, I only ask as I have a spare battery pack so it may make more sense.


Pretty much what MRM just told you. If you want to keep to a low budget likely the ITUO XP2 is gonna be your best bang for the buck. At the $99 price point they are giving you the lamp head, 6800mAh battery which also includes the Gopro style helmet mount I believe....AND, more importantly it comes standard with NW Cree XM-L2 emitters. **_ Basic standard optics are one spot and one medium flood. _ The only thing I would change if I could would be that you find another spot optic and change it to dual spot.

Of course there are other options as MRM has posted. Now although you don't always hear about it you can also contact Jim at ActionLED and ask if he has any refurbished Gloworm X2's laying around. Sometimes he sells those at rock bottom price and can setup with neutral white LED's for a little bit more. Worth looking into if you already have a battery. I own a refurbished X2 with NW leds ( from ActionLED ) and it is my go-to bar lamp on my MTB ( when I'm not testing other bike lights ).

( edit: Actionled also sells helmet mounts for the X2's as well and you will likely need one. )

( edit II; ** this statement might be wrong, see my next post )


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Craig24 said:


> Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into them. I had been using a Fluxient U2 Mini on my helmet which worked well, but I appear to have lost it since last winter
> 
> It's the Shark Motorcycle Audio BT40s clone with neutral white emitters. I always fancied a BT21 as a helmet light but never managed to get one.


I just wanted to make a possible correction from my last post.  I mentioned that the ITUO XP2 came stock with a spot optic and a med-flood optic. MRM has informed me that his XP2 came spot/spot. If so you might want to check with the seller just to make sure. Spot/spot would be better for helmet use. ( If you buy from the seller on Amazon they are usually very responsive to questions ) If you do in fact ask the seller a question, ask him if the XP3 comes stock with all spots as well :thumbsup: )


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*iKirkLiten Urban 600; review part III, The follow up*

After getting home tonight at around 1am I decided to take another road ride. Late as it was with the full moon out and not a cloud in the sky I just had to take a ride. Already had my bike ready with the Raveman CR900 already mounted to my bars. Then just as I was getting ready to leave I decided to take the Urban 600 along as well, just to give it another go round.

A quarter mile after I leave my home I hit a nice 4-lane road that is a slight downhill that goes on for about a mile. Part of the road has some street lamps but not all the way. I decided to turn on the U-600 to see how it works when I'm at speed ( > 20 mph ). Little U-600 did very well seeing that this road is fairly straight. I should mention here that I was also experimenting with the 300 lumen mode and that works pretty good as well. The more I use the Urban 600 the more I like it. That said I still prefer my CR-900. Once you get used to the wide beam pattern of the Raveman's it's hard to go back to anything else with a narrow beam pattern.

Now about that beam pattern; I know I said before that the beam pattern of the Urban 600 is about 5-6 ft wide at around 25 ft. and get wider as it reaches out. While true, it still is about the same width right in front of the bike. If you were on a paved bike path and it was straight you would be able to see the whole bike path just as long as you are continuing on straight.

As I see it this makes for a very good lamp for urban use. Maybe that's why they called it the Urban 600. Because the beam is so narrow it shouldn't be as annoying to on-coming traffic that is in the opposite lanes. I tested this assumption when I got back to my building. Because the Raveman CR900 projects so wide a beam pattern more of that light does enter into the visual periphery of on-coming vehicles. While the same is true to a lesser degree for the Urban 600 the U600 is slightly less annoying as far less light bleeds over to the far lanes. With the Urban 600 you can see virtually nothing off to the sides of the road. Regardless in all honesty, both lights can be annoying if on the higher output levels and pointed at someone or something directly head-on. LED lights are just hard to look at if too close, cutoff or no cutoff. A cutoff beam pattern just helps soften the blow.

Tonight when I got back to my building the lamp's battery indicator was not in flashing red mode. It was in steady red mode but since I was using the 300 lumen mode a lot I guess I had more power left than last night even though I rode longer tonight. I just wish the voltage indicators would only turn red when at half power and flashing red when you have 15 minutes left. Sadly that is not the case. When you use this lamp you have to keep an eye on the clock if you tend to ride longer than 1.5 hrs. ( with the lamp on high )

As for myself I will continue to favor the Raveman CR-900..._( Yeah, because you got it for free right)_....okay, I didn't pay for it but I like being able to see through turns and I like being able to see a wide section of road and I love that the digital readout gives me a better idea of how much battery run time I have left and I love the better beam tint....*whew*. Now if you don't have deer jumping out at you on your night runs the Urban 600 will make for a nice commuting light.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Anybody tried this or even seen it. Seems to be new. Wonder if it's decent. Looks nice but.......................

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2400LM-Dou...687990&hash=item52092726f0:g:R~cAAOSwLh9a4-gF


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

No, but was asking Gearbest if they can get it to stock to be reviewed. No luck so far. It is on my schedule if it shows up at GB. 

Just now I saw same lights with different brand name - you guessed it, it's UltrafFire.  
Will see if I can get any of those.


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

mb323323 said:


> Anybody tried this or even seen it. Seems to be new. Wonder if it's decent. Looks nice but.......................
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/2400LM-Dou...687990&hash=item52092726f0:g:R~cAAOSwLh9a4-gF


Just ordered. Need an all in one to put on the little ones bike. XPEs so should have a nice tight beam. 
I have low expectations but hope it isn't complete crap.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Yo better don't. I know this lamp from Alibaba - in wholesale offer it's described as:


> Y12 Bike LED Headlight Front Lamp 2 x XPE LEDs 350LM USB Charging Bicycle Headlight with 5 Modes


So in practice it might have 300 lumens from 2 Cree XP-E led's


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Dominik.M said:


> So in practice it might have 300 lumens from 2 Cree XP-E led's


Yes, perfect for a 7 year old girl riding around the 'hood.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

mb323323 said:


> Anybody tried this or even seen it. Seems to be new. Wonder if it's decent. Looks nice but.......................
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/2400LM-Dou...687990&hash=item52092726f0:g:R~cAAOSwLh9a4-gF


Looks almost like the Tansoren Y-10 I just got. It seems these types of lights are a dime a dozen both on Amazon and Ebay. * @znomit*....I think your little one will be pleased. The one I have puts out more than enough light to please a very young person. Should make for a good ride-the-neighborhood type light. The biggest danger you will face will be that if she leaves it on the bike that someone might come along and steal it if left unattended.

I should note that on the one I have the rubber flap that protects the micro-USB port will not reinsert. I tried and tried and no luck. Only way I see to get it stay is to just put some electrical tape over it. Goodness knows how the Chinese were able to get it to stay in when first made.


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Thanks for all the recommendations, due to being in the UK the Ituo ended up quite expensive so as I was on a budget I ordered a Kaidomain BL2s, hopefully it will do the job!


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Another good looking under-performer :














Coomas T20C - 30$ - 1200 lumens
Soshine TC17 USB - 28,87$ - 2400 lumens
Dualhouse SFL-T20 - 23$ - 1600 lumens
JEXREE T20C - 30$ - 1200-1500 lumens 
General T20C on Alibaba about 17-18$ in wholesale.

I got mine from Aliexpress for 30$ - it was looking promising, also getting the samples from Ali is sometimes cheaper and faster than asking manufacturer. The lamp arrived in white box, the handlebar mount was broken on arrive (somebody have tried to put it together with superglue !!). Beside that the lamp is heavy and looks very solid, the body is very well finished. 















So the results are :
hi - 470 lumens
mid - 189 lumens
low - 59 lumens









For the price, I was hoping for at least 800 lumens, so a bit disappointed here + faulty mount, also the light is a bit blue for my liking :skep:


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

New light is on the pre-order on Bangood : Xanes DL13 - for 19.99$ looks like a reasonable price light (at the same time it is sold for $56.46 on DHgate but "only" 1200 lumens  ).

- 1200 lumens
- 2 leds warm white / cool white ? (Cool White+ Warm Orange in original description).
- light sensor - with automatic light adjustment
- mode display ?
- modes in 3 groups

XANES DL13 2* L2 1500LM

























The main issue might be this front semi-transparent cover - it might be to bight for comfortable night-riding .

Also - they are changing the price... Now it is : 36.89$ :madmax:

Update : e-mail price (19,99) still works - link update.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Somewhat strange that they decide to use two different tints of LED. Looks like it's intended to be a Fenix BC30 clone. I'd have my doubts as to how this might work as a bike light but if you don't like it as a bike light you still can use it as a portable phone charger assuming you don't already have one.


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## samwe (Jul 27, 2015)

Now that it is getting dark again I installed my BT40s and found that it only works for about 10 seconds. I will probably open it up and look for obvious things, but is there a good replacement anyone would recommend? 
I am considering just getting another one off of amazon if I don't find a better option.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I don't think you'll find a better option in it's price range.

-Garry


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## samwe (Jul 27, 2015)

I placed an order for two more today.

Tonight I was investigating and it seems I have a break in the cable near the connector.
I guess I should go to the DOY light forum and look for a parts source.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

samwe said:


> I placed an order for two more today.
> 
> Tonight I was investigating and it seems I have a break in the cable near the connector.
> I guess I should go to the DOY light forum and look for a parts source.


Should be easy to fix but I've never tried to access the back of the lamp. I'm sure someone on DIY forum will tell you exactly what you need to do.

Last weekend I finally had the chance to giveaway another one of my cheap Chinese lights. I was loading my MTB and gear into my car when I noticed a young boy riding a MTB through the parking lot wearing one of those pointy birthday hats. Some of his friends / family were watching, they too wearing the pointy birthday hats. He was riding up and down the parking lot to my building and was grinning ear to ear with joy as he was likely riding his first MTB. This inspired me to run back inside my place and find one of the Blitzu Gator 390 lamp sets I have sitting in a box collecting dust.

Anyway, I called the boy over and gave him the lamp set ( front and rear lamp ) and helped him put it on his new bike and quicky explained how to work the functions of the lamps. I left shorty after but I'm sure at some point that I'll see him riding through the parking lot again with his new bike and light. When I do I'm sure it will give me a warm fuzzy feeling inside. Like I've said before, if I'd had one of these lamps when I was a kid I'd been thrilled to all get-out.


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## Craig24 (Nov 1, 2017)

Cat-man-do said:


> Should be easy to fix but I've never tried to access the back of the lamp. I'm sure someone on DIY forum will tell you exactly what you need to do.
> 
> Last weekend I finally had the chance to giveaway another one of my cheap Chinese lights. I was loading my MTB and gear into my car when I noticed a young boy riding a MTB through the parking lot wearing one of those pointy birthday hats. Some of his friends / family were watching, they too wearing the pointy birthday hats. He was riding up and down the parking lot to my building and was grinning ear to ear with joy as he was likely riding his first MTB. This inspired me to run back inside my place and find one of the Blitzu Gator 390 lamp sets I have sitting in a box collecting dust.
> 
> Anyway, I called the boy over and gave him the lamp set ( front and rear lamp ) and helped him put it on his new bike and quicky explained how to work the functions of the lamps. I left shorty after but I'm sure at some point that I'll see him riding through the parking lot again with his new bike and light. When I do I'm sure it will give me a warm fuzzy feeling inside. Like I've said before, if I'd had one of these lamps when I was a kid I'd been thrilled to all get-out.


Love it! Very nice thing to do.


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## samwe (Jul 27, 2015)

Cat-man-do said:


> Anyway, I called the boy over and gave him the lamp set ( front and rear lamp ) and helped him put it on his new bike and quicky explained how to work the functions of the lamps.


That is an awesome thing to do. 
I have a wife and 4 kids who also bike and it gets dark up here so i know these will all get put to use.


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## phalkon30 (Jan 17, 2009)

samwe said:


> Now that it is getting dark again I installed my BT40s and found that it only works for about 10 seconds. I will probably open it up and look for obvious things, but is there a good replacement anyone would recommend?
> I am considering just getting another one off of amazon if I don't find a better option.


I have two battery packs for my Amazon bt40, both died. I opened the packs and found one of them had a shorted wire where it bends around the tip of the pack. I soldered new wore on and epoxied the end tight do it won't rub through again.

The other pack had a. 3v difference between cells with no balancing or protection board. Straight power to the batteries........ That one turned off after a few seconds too, I think it's the balance. I bought a board off ebay, will let you know if the $5 board fixes it.

Both came from the Amazon seller, although I don't remember which was the replacement.

BTW, that blitzu light is one of the best deals for a marker light I've found, I love that brand


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

I was just looking at that new Gloworm/GoPro connector, looks sweet.

BT40S is still a great lighthead/Value, Throw away the battery.
Revtronic 1600 Lumens Bike Light - Cree LED Bike Lights



MRMOLE said:


> I still think this Amazon Ituo XP2 is your best value!
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MFGOOHU
> 
> ...


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## matt4x4 (Dec 21, 2013)

Ledoman - I am looking at the "KD" website under bike lights. Decent prices. You say geniune Cree leds. Can assume geniune claims of Lumens too?
Those are probably USD, so I'd be in for $40 which would be $50 Canadian bucks.

I just ride paved pathway trails that dog walkers, runners, use, two lane probably 4 to 5' across, and the older red clay trails that arent used as much, but also want to start riding single track at night. I like bright, never had any decent bright bike light before.

Any recommendations?
KD Bike Lights Link





ledoman said:


> Yes, this combination is still one of the best budget combination out there. The only thing you need to care is overheating of Yinding. Using some fins on the mount (Vancbiker) or at least use alu mount from DX would help. Keep it at lower modes when not moving.





ledoman said:


> If you decided to go with KD2 light I would suggest you to use better battery. Not that linked set is all bad, but KD Panasonic pack is shurely much better. So get separately
> http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S023808.z
> and
> http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S024442.z
> Be aware they might have problems shipping battery packs alone. Contact their sales department.





ledoman said:


> I suspect the first one has wider beam. From side view they looks similar to ones KD2 light use. I would not go with second one. Got some similar one and the lenses are somewhat curved. Can take a look at evening when I get home (that is more than 12 hours) and try to compare.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

What I have seen and tested (BL2s, KD2 10 level, SS X5, SSX2 (where noted as geniue), KD S023818) all have original Cree leds which is rare nowadays. Now it depends on your needs and where you want to put the light (bar, helmet). On pawed paths almost any could be good. Bumpy trails are whole different story.


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## Scott Novak (Mar 2, 2013)

matt4x4 said:


> Can assume geniune claims of Lumens too?


Assume not unless measured by an independent source. Most Chinese bike light lumen output claims are very exaggerated.

This site has tested the lumen output or a good many bike lights.
We Test Lights | Bike Tests and Teviews

Scott A. Novak


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Well, if you know what are leds capable off and aprox looses then you you can get feeling about real lumens. 
So in this case for Cree XM-L or XM-L2 you can take 1000-1100 lumens per led in ideal (cooled) environment. Take 30-40% looses away any you get aprox values for OTF. Honest Chinese sellers advertize ideal lumens, rarely real ones out of the front (OTF). Anything above is exaggerated.


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## matt4x4 (Dec 21, 2013)

Those look like decent prices to me. I just may buy two different ones.

The one I purchased and tried last winter was 
https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/6-1-4-in-led-spot-flood-light/A-p8546038e
just too large, I got it on sale, for half off or something.

Solar Storm X5 is $25

Solar Storm X3 is $19

KD2 Level 10 - $16 - found your review, very nice!
http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night...umens-bicycle-light-picture-heavy-940595.html

KD S023818 - Cant find

BL2s - $16



ledoman said:


> What I have seen and tested (BL2s, KD2 10 level, SS X5, SSX2 (where noted as geniue), KD S023818) all have original Cree leds which is rare nowadays. Now it depends on your needs and where you want to put the light (bar, helmet). On pawed paths almost any could be good. Bumpy trails are whole different story.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

If we are talking only about suitable KD lights then:

- SS X5 is good for paved roads/urban and has NW leds option, mount is bit shakey, has two beam types. (near, far). User interface need some time to get used to, but can operate each led separately.
-

For MTB bar use
- KD S023818 (part number) - NW leds, can be modified for 20mm TIR lenses

For MTB helmet use:

-Geniue NW SS X2 from KD if you want to stay on cheapo side. No that is soo good (still needs internal inspection and adding thermal paste), but comes with NW leds XM-L2 3C. 
- KD BL2S - bit wider beam 
- KD2 same TIR lenses as above, has the best user interface but it needs some tweaking for heat transfer. Not waterproof. Yes, there is thread about it.

All above has NW leds about 3C.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Another XANES DL14 selfcontained USB rechargable el cheapo light. Looks prommising for commuting purposes. It might be good to mod it with better leds.









https://www.banggood.com/XANES-DL14...le-E-bike-Front-Light-Headlamp-p-1340528.html


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

My first thought was it's too short to contain 18650(s). Then I see the mAh rating is 1250, so I wonder if it contains a single 18350 (assuming the 1250mAh is accurate). They could have probably put two 18350's in it and doubled capacity/runtime. 

Mount looks decent. 

-Garry


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## gr8fasushi (Aug 14, 2014)

what battery would you recommend to replace the one with the BT40?



patski said:


> I was just looking at that new Gloworm/GoPro connector, looks sweet.
> 
> BT40S is still a great lighthead/Value, Throw away the battery.
> Revtronic 1600 Lumens Bike Light - Cree LED Bike Lights


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

garrybunk said:


> My first thought was it's too short to contain 18650(s). Then I see the mAh rating is 1250, so I wonder if it contains a single 18350 (assuming the 1250mAh is accurate). They could have probably put two 18350's in it and doubled capacity/runtime.
> 
> Mount looks decent.
> 
> -Garry


Probably only going to output 300-400 lumen tops, likely with a 2hr run time on high. Likely using Chinese cool white emitters. At least is uses a decent mount. Same mount as the Tansoren lamp I have.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

gr8fasushi said:


> what battery would you recommend to replace the one with the BT40?


I don't know why patski said to throw away the battery. No one who owns one as mentioned getting a bad battery AFAIK.

Always going to be other options for batteries but the cheapest / easiest option is to buy a 4 cell battery holder ( like the Trustfire ) and buy some good quality loose cells. After that when the cells get old just buy new loose cells ( which, I may add has become easier to do than buying an affordable dedicated 4-cell battery pack )


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Ok, maybe one of you can mod this thing to be real 2500+ lumens. It's weird but might be capable in the right hands here. And maybe a KD 10.2 battery.

https://www.banggood.com/XANES-2500...nd-outdoor-US&utm_medium=cpc&cur_warehouse=CN


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## gr8fasushi (Aug 14, 2014)

Cat-man-do said:


> I don't know why patski said to throw away the battery. No one who owns one as mentioned getting a bad battery AFAIK.
> 
> Always going to be other options for batteries but the cheapest / easiest option is to buy a 4 cell battery holder ( like the Trustfire ) and buy some good quality loose cells. After that when the cells get old just buy new loose cells ( which, I may add has become easier to do than buying an affordable dedicated 4-cell battery pack )


awesome, thanks for the tip!


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## juhake (Oct 26, 2007)

What do you guys think about Gaciron bike lights?

https://gaciron.aliexpress.com/store/2906009

V9F-600 looks like an interesting commuter light, it has cutoff lens. Does anyone know, if the 18650 is replaceble? A Panasonic 3400mAh in one would be great. 
It has 4 screws in the back:









Price is about $16-20 at Aliexpress and Ebay.

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pr...Cycling-Accessories/2906009_32825944914.html?

There is an additional remote switch for V9F-600

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bic...iron-V9C-400-V9F-300-V9F-600/32908854561.html

and extra brackets are available

https://www.ebay.com/itm/GACIRON-Bi...298610?hash=item3b1939f2f2:g:3VsAAOSwZQxW4SdO


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

juhake said:


> What do you guys think about Gaciron bike lights?
> 
> https://gaciron.aliexpress.com/store/2906009


Some of those Garciron offers look pretty good. I like the dual emitter setups. The 1800 version has some nice features ( Cree XM-L2 U3 emitters, LG batteries, remote switch ) Could give the Raveman PR-1200 or Fenix BC30R a run for the money. The big question though is the optics. These are not exactly cut-off type optics ( lens ) but more or less a partial flood enhanced lens. I like the idea of a wider commuter light as long as it still has some throw. The Gold version ( claimed 1800 lumen ) is not real cheap so pretty much cost as much or more than a Raveman PR-1200. Now the 1600 version is just like the 1800 but not as bright...price much more to my liking. If I was in the market for a new self contained dual emitter lamp I might consider the 1600 version.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Cat-man-do said:


> Some of those Garciron offers look pretty good. I like the dual emitter setups. The 1800 version has some nice features ( Cree XM-L2 U3 emitters, LG batteries, remote switch ) Could give the Raveman PR-1200 or Fenix BC30R a run for the money. The big question though is the optics. These are not exactly cut-off type optics ( lens ) but more or less a partial flood enhanced lens. I like the idea of a wider commuter light as long as it still has some throw. The Gold version ( claimed 1800 lumen ) is not real cheap so pretty much cost as much or more than a Raveman PR-1200. Now the 1600 version is just like the 1800 but not as bright...price much more to my liking. If I was in the market for a new self contained dual emitter lamp I might consider the 1600 version.


The battery is a 2 cell claiming 5000mah on the 1600 and 6700mah on the 1800. I'm guessing the 1600 and 1800 claim are way off based on the battery mah claim as a 2 cell. Just a thought. Be careful you get what you pay for.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

mb323323 said:


> The battery is a 2 cell claiming 5000mah on the 1600 and 6700mah on the 1800. I'm guessing the 1600 and 1800 claim are way off based on the battery mah claim as a 2 cell. Just a thought. Be careful you get what you pay for.


Yes, I know I saw the same thing. Perhaps they are both LG's ...this...and this

I should note that none of these lamps have the digital read out like the Raveman's or Fenix.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

thing is those lamps arent even theirs. like 10 different companies make similar "claims" for the same exact lights. And one thing I have found is lights that cheap is that the emitters are NOT cree (or some very old version cree) and cells are never whatever brand they claim. And we all know lumen numbers are never near the claims either sadly. 

But that said, you get what you pay for. If that's your budget and works for what you need, you have a light and can be out riding so that is all that matters.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Saw this in the MTBR Interbike coverage sidebar. Interested to see full specs. but the video said it had XPL emitters, 2000 "Magicshine lumens", field replaceable batteries (the term battery pack was uses so may not be individual cells), OLED display, and a twist on garmin style mount. Nice features but wonder what the price will be (reasonable but not necessarily cheap?).
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

RAKC Ind said:


> thing is those lamps arent even theirs. like 10 different companies make similar "claims" for the same exact lights. And one thing I have found is lights that cheap is that the emitters are NOT cree (or some very old version cree) and cells are never whatever brand they claim. And we all know lumen numbers are never near the claims either sadly.
> 
> But that said, you get what you pay for. If that's your budget and works for what you need, you have a light and can be out riding so that is all that matters.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


I have to laugh and while I know what you are saying is true, I'm not sure this is really breaking news to anyone if you understand how the Chinese go about doing business. They will clone and re-market almost anything if they think it will make a buck, even one of their own.

When it comes to the Gaciron brand, I think this is an attempt at the Chinese to take a different approach to marketing. Looks as though they've even gone as far as marketing this brand name at Interbike. The website looks very nice and obviously is trying to impress. ( interesting that it is linked directly to Aliexpress...) One of the lamps they sell is the _*GACIRON V9F-600 lumen_. This is an exact duplicate of the _*iKirkLiten Urban 600 lamp_ I bought some weeks ago. That said I see no other ( exact ) clones of the Gaciron dual emitter lamps although I'm sure they are likely out there somewhere under another brand name...lol.

The ad for *_both lamps_ is the same. Both say the lamp comes with a Cree XP-G3 and is 600 lumen. If that's true they chose a lousy LED bin. Too much blue in the beam tint to please my discerning eyes. The video ( Gaciron ) and still photo ( iKirkLiten ) do nothing to show you the actual beam pattern. The videos on the Gaciron site show a bike riding down a dark road from the front! How can you judge a beam pattern viewing from the front?!...LOL. The still photo on the Amazon website shows a photo looking from the rear but there is ambient light that appears to make the lamp provide a wider beam pattern. The actual beam pattern is quite narrow when close to the bike.

I still wouldn't mind reviewing the Gaciron dual emitter 1600. That said I'm not willing to drop coin on one if the emitter tint is anything like the iKirkLiten's. I'm too used to the beautiful white tints and wide beam pattern of the Raveman lamps to drop coin on something unproven and likely inferior. If I got one for free I'd try it but I'm not spending money on something that my CAt-gut is telling me is a waste of money.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> ...Saw this in the MTBR Interbike coverage sidebar. Interested to see full specs. but the video said it had XPL emitters, 2000 "Magicshine lumens", field replaceable batteries (the term battery pack was uses so may not be individual cells), OLED display, and a twist on garmin style mount. Nice features but wonder what the price will be (reasonable but not necessarily cheap?).
> Mole


Looks like it's using a COB panel for close up flood. That might actually work if it's bright enough. Of course a lot of COB led's don't always provide a nice white tint.

Need I say, I don't know if I can ever trust Magicshine with any lumen claims they make on any lamp they sell.


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## j__h (Jul 16, 2012)

I have been out of the light market for a while. Just coming back it seems none of the lights I used to know about are still available...

I'm looking for a helmet light to complement a BT40s on the bars.

I do like the looks of this one, but hearing that the heat-sinking is no good:
http://kaidomain.com/bike-lights-an...-Groups-of-2-to-3-Mode-2200-Lumens-Bike-Light









(or maybe this http://kaidomain.com/bike-lights-an...-4700k-5000k-4-10-Mode-2200-Lumens-Bike-Light not really seeing much a difference overall)

Also seems a lot of places are not selling batteries with the lights. Where are people going for decent quality battery packs?


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

j__h said:


> I have been out of the light market for a while. Just coming back it seems none of the lights I used to know about are still available...
> 
> I'm looking for a helmet light to complement a BT40s on the bars.
> 
> ...


I'll guess this at about 800 lumens at best.

BTW, does Magicshine still exaggerate their lumen claims. That 6500 lumen lamp looks nice but what i it in the real World and is the quality better than it used to be.


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## j__h (Jul 16, 2012)

mb323323 said:


> I'll guess this at about 800 lumens at best.
> 
> BTW, does Magicshine still exaggerate their lumen claims. That 6500 lumen lamp looks nice but what i it in the real World and is the quality better than it used to be.


Given 2 XML2's I would have suspected more, maybe they under-drive them.

As for MagicShine I used to buy from action Led, they give measured lumens as well. So for this one https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/magicshine-sets/products/magicshine-mj-908 that claims 8000 lumens it actually is 4200 lumens.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

j__h said:


> Given 2 XML2's I would have suspected more, maybe they under-drive them.
> 
> As for MagicShine I used to buy from action Led, they give measured lumens as well. So for this one https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/magicshine-sets/products/magicshine-mj-908 that claims 8000 lumens it actually is 4200 lumens.


no such thing as "under driving" them. They dont have to be driven at max. Actually max isnt the most efficient which is why most dont push LEDs at max current, more heat to deal with. As well.as cheap lights use either fake cree or much older low bin ones that are cheap.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## j__h (Jul 16, 2012)

RAKC Ind said:


> no such thing as "under driving" them. They dont have to be driven at max. Actually max isnt the most efficient which is why most dont push LEDs at max current, more heat to deal with. As well.as cheap lights use either fake cree or much older low bin ones that are cheap.


I am aware of the technical details of driving an LED. If instead of "under driving" lets just say driven significantly below what the LEDs can handle. If the LED's used are accurate then 800 lumens out of 2 XML2's would mean significantly lower current than the LEDs themselves (though not necessarily the light head system) could handle.

Take for example the 2018 M-tiger with 2 XML2 LEDS (big fan of the features of this light series, seriously thinking of buying it), it claims 1800 Lumens (is this accurate?). Are those LED's being operated at a good point for it's max setting? If instead it was sold with a max light mode of 800 Lumens, would that be less than ideal max setting?

As for the dies, I was seeing mention of the KD branded ones being legitimate, but that could have been wrong or outdated.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

There haven't been any reports of the KD lights coming with fake emitters. They're probably just underdriven to deal with their lousy heatsinking (thermal path).

-Garry


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Yep cooling is ALWAYS the limiting factor except in a laboratory setting where an LED is placed on a massively oversized and cooled heatsink to figure out the max truly is. There is just no way for the smaller size of some of these tiny bike lights to handle the power load of 2000 lumens, that's nearly 20W of power.

I need to figure out a way to convey this information a bit more clearly... about how much power a certain size lighthead can actually support reliably and what the actual "max lumens" possible is.... any ideas?


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

garrybunk said:


> There haven't been any reports of the KD lights coming with fake emitters. They're probably just underdriven to deal with their lousy heatsinking (thermal path).
> 
> -Garry


Are you still in contact with Andy @ Revtronic/Nitefighter? Was out with my BT21 last night and the BT70 the night before and got me thinking about the current situation with inexpensive performance lights. The exit of Yinding means no good combo (that I know of) for the BT40s anymore that isn't considerably more expensive and will make it hard for me to recommend the BT40s because of the lack of a good tint match that's similarly affordable. Also if the tariff's raise the price of lights in general I would think this would expand the market for less expensive performance lights. Maybe it's time to rattle Andy's cage about bringing the BT21 back.
Mole


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

My last contact with Andy was a long time ago when he lead me to believe something was in the works (but I've not seen anything since). I could email him again and try to persuade him that releasing something in the near future would be a very good move for him. 

-Garry


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Outbound said:


> ... about how much power a certain size lighthead can actually support reliably and what the actual "max lumens" possible is.... any ideas?


It really is a tough thing to just try to apply some sort of "rule of thumb" to. Ambient temp while in use is a huge variable. The housing design is a factor too.

In building several different DIY designs over the past 7-8 years, I've landed on trying to get a housing surface area about 1 square inch per Watt. At a slow riding pace (~5MPH) in the 40F-60F temps will pretty easily keep the light under ~130F when running at a high setting. If I took that light formula to Phoenix and rode with MrMole, there is no way that would work. In my later designs I have been putting the majority of the heatsink fins directly behind the LED mounting surface. This seems to give slightly better results. My housings are monolithic so no thermal joint between an LED mount surface and the housing though since in the DIY world, I'm pretty much forced to use emitters on stars, there is a thermal joint.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

garrybunk said:


> My last contact with Andy was a long time ago when he lead me to believe something was in the works (but I've not seen anything since). I could email him again and try to persuade him that releasing something in the near future would be a very good move for him.
> 
> -Garry


I'd appreciate if you tried to contact him.:thumbsup: Would be great if current events convinced him that now is a good time to start producing the BT21 again. I'll keep my fingers crossed!
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

garrybunk said:


> My last contact with Andy was a long time ago when he lead me to believe something was in the works (but I've not seen anything since). I could email him again and try to persuade him that releasing something in the near future would be a very good move for him.
> 
> -Garry


I think the better approach would be to contact someone with Gearbest and see if they can bring back either the Yinding and/or the Solarstorm X3 with neutral white emitters. Bonus points if you can get either with XP-L HI NW emitters. I think it best to forget about the two emitter BT21 Nitefighter lamp.

Gearbest still has the web link to the NW Solarstorm X3 only the website says it is discontinued. I know the SStorm stuff was/is not real snazzy but I had one of the SSX3's in NW and it did a fairly nice job when used as a helmet light. The slightly larger size of the X3 also helped get rid of some of the heat. If I had a choice between Yinding with NW XP-L HI's or SStorm X3 with NW XM-L2's....ugh....I'd have to flip a coin to decide which would be best. X3 with XP-L HI's...give me the X3.

I also see the NW SStorm X3 listed on Amazon, also listed as, "unavailable". I'll send a message to the Amazon seller and see if they plan to renew the stock.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> I think it best to forget about the two emitter BT21 Nitefighter lamp.


I gotta ask why you think this? Personally I would have no interest in another Yinding (I don't use the one I have) or anything from Solarstorm (never had any interest when available) but would be all over a new BT21. I still use my BT21 all the time and it remains one of my favorite lights even though I have lots of newer/more expensive lights (that I don't like to use as much) so I don't understand.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> I gotta ask why you think this? Personally I would have no interest in another Yinding (I don't use the one I have) or anything from Solarstorm (never had any interest when available) but would be all over a new BT21. I still use my BT21 all the time and it remains one of my favorite lights even though I have lots of newer/more expensive lights (that I don't like to use as much) so I don't understand.
> Mole


It doesn't have anything to do with what I myself would want. The BT21 was linked with the BT40S and was only sold under the Nitefighter brand name. None of us really know why they stopped selling them. FWIW someone in China decided to stop making them. For some reason the BT40 series continues to sell under both the Nitefighter and Revtronic brand names as you well know.

The Yinding is likely in the same boat as the BT21. It's gone and probably not coming back Whoever was making them probably decided to retool and sell something else, who knows? The Solarstorm X3 is still made and sold. That said all that needs to be done with those is to switch out with NW emitters.

The whole basis for my previous comment was in response to other's question, "What NW cheap Chinese helmet lamp could best be matched with the BT40S"? If you are going to ask the Chinese to bring back a lamp that is no longer made I would think your best bet of getting that done would be with a lamp that is or was sold by many websites. The BT21 was only sold by Gearbest under the Nitefighter brand name and was only available for a short number of months AFAICRemember. The Yinding and SSX3 were sold by many. Heck, even if the BT21 was to be brought back there is no guarantee that they would use the same driver.

Anyway, just trying to help the poorer folk who are looking for a light to combo with the BT40's. At least there are a couple options on KD. If it were me and I was looking to buy a cheap Chinese NW helmet lamp I'd lean toward the KD NW version of the MJ880. Otherwise as I've often said, "If you are going to buy two lamps at least one should be a good brand name lamp". Lots of options for a cheap NW bar lamp. Not as many options if you want something decent in NW for the helmet. Buying a good ( brighter ) brand name lamp for the helmet is always going to be the better way to go.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> It doesn't have anything to do with what I myself would want.
> 
> Anyway, just trying to help the poorer folk who are looking for a light to combo with the BT40's.


OK, I understand where your coming from now. Probability of getting a NW X3 is more realistic. With the fact that the last time Garry and Andy communicated it was mentioned that something was in the works about bring the BT21 back I was hopeful the lack of competition in the inexpensive performance thrower category might be enough incentive for Revtronic/Nitefighter to make it happen. It might be a light that I want (and other members of the BT21 cult) but also a better light for everyone else too. Like I said earlier, I'm keeping my fingers crossed!
Mole


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## NWAtrailyguy (Aug 13, 2014)

MRMOLE said:


> I gotta ask why you think this? Personally I would have no interest in another Yinding (I don't use the one I have) or anything from Solarstorm (never had any interest when available) but would be all over a new BT21. I still use my BT21 all the time and it remains one of my favorite lights even though I have lots of newer/more expensive lights (that I don't like to use as much) so I don't understand.
> Mole


Mole...if you have a Yinding that you don't ever use, I'll gladly buy it from you. If it's not neutral white, that's even better to match my bright white S12 Xeccon helmet light that's still going strong!

I LOVE the Yinding, because of the tiny size and weight. Mine just died on me after over 2 years of usage a few times a week. The green light still comes on the back, but the LED's don't fire up. I don't have the knowledge to take it apart and see if it's something simple...but I might try since it's a "no lose" situation at this point.

Seriously...I would love to get your Yinding if you want to part with it. (That almost sounds bad...)


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

Has anyone played around with one of these? I picked one up for $15 and it seems pretty dang bright (bright enough for street rides and slower trail rides).
I bought a diffuser lens for two buck to give a wider beam, but it sacrifices too much projection. 
'Gonna buy a second light and use that one for the diffuser. All-in for both lights will be less than thirty bucks.

Of course I have nothing to compare it to, so it may be dim by "normal" standards.
Single "cree" LED in each unit with a 4x18650 LiPo hand grenade for each:


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

They are typical Magicshine 808 clones. They usually have lousy heatsinking, but are so underdriven that it's okay as is. They appear bright because most of the output is focused into a fairly tight hotspot. I'd ballpark them around 600 lumens typically. I have two, but have never actually used them on rides. They are generally "okay" if the beam pattern works for you. 

The battery packs may be another story. No telling how safe the pack actually is, nor how good the cells are without tearing it apart. It's probably not a bomb wait to explode. Most important thing would be to check the charger that it's not going to overcharge the pack.

-Garry


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

garrybunk said:


> They are typical Magicshine 808 clones. They usually have lousy heatsinking, but are so underdriven that it's okay as is. They appear bright because most of the output is focused into a fairly tight hotspot. I'd ballpark them around 600 lumens typically. I have two, but have never actually used them on rides. They are generally "okay" if the beam pattern works for you.
> 
> The battery packs may be another story. No telling how safe the pack actually is, nor how good the cells are without tearing it apart. It's probably not a bomb wait to explode. Most important thing would be to check the charger that it's not going to overcharge the pack.
> 
> -Garry


Yeah, the one that I have doesn't get very warm even running on "high". Maybe #2 will arrive in time for me to get a ride in before the weather turns to crap (I'm a fair weather rider and prefer 90 degrees over 40 degrees).

I'll report back on how they work together.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I did some diffusion testing (using one of these 808 clones) back some time ago - posted over at BLF here. The testing wasn't that good (should be redone using my sphere and a proper luxmeter), but there are beamshots and such including mouse-overs. Just note that the "DC Fix Upper 1/3rd" photos aren't loading for some reason.

-Garry


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

robbnj said:


> Has anyone played around with one of these? I picked one up for $15 and it seems pretty dang bright (bright enough for street rides and slower trail rides).
> I bought a diffuser lens for two buck to give a wider beam, but it sacrifices too much projection.
> 'Gonna buy a second light and use that one for the diffuser. All-in for both lights will be less than thirty bucks.
> 
> ...


For a comparison of beam patterns. I have the "Bright Eyes" one in this video, although it's essentially identical to the one you bought optically wise.


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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

robbnj said:


> Has anyone played around with one of these? I picked one up for $15 and it seems pretty dang bright (bright enough for street rides and slower trail rides).


TBH, I think you over-paid. And batteries are probably not worth s***. Sorry m8.


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

Sirius9 said:


> TBH, I think you over-paid. And batteries are probably not worth s***. Sorry m8.


It's on its third season, so it ain't all bad.
The next one will probably be pushing the odds.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Ok, tell me what you boozers think of this. It's somewhat a basic 3 led light head and you'd have to mod it w/ a good battery but the housing looks to have a lot of cooling fins and someone here might be able to mod this to be able to handle 2500-3000 real lumens in a fairly small light head for that kind of lumens. Take a look.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/10000Lumen...=item2c8430212e:g:z1kAAOSwYUdbTFWe:rk:53:pf:0


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Depends on internals. I'm not shure if there is any good thermal path. Driver is very likely the same as with "three clone" light. Dumb modes with 1-2-3 leds. I would be surprissed if there are real Cree leds. Anyway light is too small to handle heat for 3000 lumens. 2000 (before looses) is more likely.

Charger is declared as Power adapter not Li-ion charger. It might happen to have 12V output regardless of 8.4V declaration. I won't loose timew on battery pack, we know it...

For the price you won't loose much if you buy one and report us back


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

I've got a few of those 3*XM-L's in my hands over the years, and the highest power input was 26.2W - the real lumen output won't be higher than 2000 lumens otf.


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## X83 (May 14, 2018)

ledoman said:


> Another XANES DL14 selfcontained USB rechargable el cheapo light. Looks prommising for commuting purposes. It might be good to mod it with better leds.
> 
> View attachment 1217893
> 
> ...


Here's another option for the self-contained USB rechargeable el cheapo lights with a more compact design. They seem work well for short commute trips with an internal 3.7V 1200mAH lithium polymer battery that should last for about 1.5-hours on the highest mode. They use two XML T6 LEDs combined with the 15-degree 20mm diameter lenses. They can be taken apart with some effort to change the lens angles, internal battery and LEDs if you choose to mod it. They have an IP65 waterproof rating with green o-ring seals inside and they're a good lightweight option for the weight weenies.

VASTFIRE XS-DT002 
WOSAWE BCD007

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5-m...pm=a2g0s.13010208.99999999.259.40ec3c00119v21


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## X83 (May 14, 2018)

Here are some more pictures and the internals of this model.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Thanks X83. Leds are no way XM-L. They are to tiny. They looks in size of XP-E and of course are very likely not Creee. 
Can yo make close picture of leds and driver from the other side?


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## X83 (May 14, 2018)

ledoman said:


> Thanks X83. Leds are no way XM-L. They are to tiny. They looks in size of XP-E and of course are very likely not Creee.
> Can yo make close picture of leds and driver from the other side?


I believe you're correct about the LEDs because they appear very tiny compared to the pics in your KD XM-L2 U2 thread pics. The website says they're XML T6 LEDs but you know how the Chinese never lie about their specifications.

I've purchased a couple of these lights on eBay and they have one model with the flat lenses that seems to have good beam pattern while the other has lenses with holes drilled in the center which doesn't seem to have the best beam pattern. I plan to change out the lenses for a wider 20 or 25-degree type or maybe the ribbed shape design to get rid of the bullseye effect hotspots. They seem to be using XPE type lenses with an 19.7mm outer diameter with an 11.7mm height.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Yeah, some chinese copy of XP-E leds I suspect. Tiny led is reason you have spotty beam. I agree you need wider angle TIR lenses. You can find some here: Reflector / Collimator Lens - CREE - LEDDNA

Driver looks direct drive with two R330 resistors in parallel regulating current over FET. Lowering resistance should make light brighter. But of course no point to do that if you have only tiny lipo battery.


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## X83 (May 14, 2018)

ledoman said:


> Yeah, some chinese copy of XP-E leds I suspect. Tiny led is reason you have spotty beam. I agree you need wider angle TIR lenses. You can find some here: Reflector / Collimator Lens - CREE - LEDDNA
> 
> Driver looks direct drive with two R330 resistors in parallel regulating current over FET. Lowering resistance should make light brighter. But of course no point to do that if you have only tiny lipo battery.


After looking at the LEDs with an eye loupe they appear to be most similar to the XP-E R4 emitters which is a far cry from the XML T6 as advertised.

It would be nice if an external battery pack could be plugged into the back micro USB port when the light is in operation but the driver board automatically turns off the LEDs while its in the charging mode.


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

Outbound said:


> For a comparison of beam patterns. I have the "Bright Eyes" one in this video, although it's essentially identical to the one you bought optically wise.


Wow!
Does such a wide/consistent pattern and strong illumination affect the riders in front of you at all?


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## BigHit-Maniac (Apr 13, 2004)

Do you guys actually use these Cheap-O lights on long rides on unfamiliar trails in the deep woods in the legit dark? 

I'm just curious. Do you actually have faith in these things?


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Well, yes and no. I do have faith on "serviced" cheapo lights much more than on cheapo battery packs. 

First: Carry at least two independed lights/battery combo - it raises reabilty of the system by 50%
Second: Use good battery packs/cells with brand name cells like (LG, Samsung, Panasonic, Sanyo, Sony)
Third: Service all cheapo lights with thermal paste 

Following those 3 steps would lead you to quite trustful lightning system. Of course paying more for quality system is no brainer at any time.

PS. I carry small 16340 cell based zooming flashlight with me all the time (even on daytime rides). I take it as a part of my bike since I've stayed without light for the first time back in time using early P7 MJ-808 MagicShine (it was battery problem, causing I'm doing all that lightening stuff).


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

BigHit-Maniac said:


> Do you guys actually use these Cheap-O lights on long rides on unfamiliar trails in the deep woods in the legit dark?
> 
> I'm just curious. Do you actually have faith in these things?


I have faith in things that I have tested and know they work. My "cheapo" light is still going after years.
Remember, cheap doesn't always mean "crap". "Expensive" doesn't always mean "good". QC is certainly better on more expensive stuff, but even the best things can fail. 
Being prepared for failure is the smart thing to do.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

robbnj said:


> Remember, cheap doesn't always mean "crap". "Expensive" doesn't always mean "good". QC is certainly better on more expensive stuff, but even the best things can fail.
> Being prepared for failure is the smart thing to do.


I agree wholeheartedly!

-Garry


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

I follow all of the above rules too and I've never had a failure yet.

2 independent lights bars and helmet.

Batteries from action led 

Install go pro mount

Go ride

I normally use these in very cold temps so I haven't needed to install thermal paste like others. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## BigHit-Maniac (Apr 13, 2004)

robbnj said:


> I have faith in things that I have tested and know they work. My "cheapo" light is still going after years.
> Remember, cheap doesn't always mean "crap". "Expensive" doesn't always mean "good". QC is certainly better on more expensive stuff, but even the best things can fail.
> Being prepared for failure is the smart thing to do.


I hear ya. Didn't mean to come across "brash" I guess. Was just genuinely curious with the luck folks have had in the back woods... hours into a long night-time epic. LOL.

Personally, I carry at least one extra battery in my pack... with my other stuff. I've legit gotten lost in the woods out here in OKC... and didn't get back to my pickup truck till almost 2:00am before. Knowing that my lights kept me going that long, even when it started raining (and everything got soaked)... was a good piece of mind.

Basically an overgrown trail led me in a completely wrong direction... that's the moral of the story. The good news is my lights kept going after hours and hours of wet, cold, and mud... and that is the piece of mind I meant.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

BigHit-Maniac said:


> I hear ya. Didn't mean to come across "brash" I guess. Was just genuinely curious with the luck folks have had in the back woods... hours into a long night-time epic. LOL.
> 
> Personally, I carry at least one extra battery in my pack... with my other stuff. I've legit gotten lost in the woods out here in OKC... and didn't get back to my pickup truck till almost 2:00am before. Knowing that my lights kept me going that long, even when it started raining (and everything got soaked)... was a good piece of mind.
> 
> Basically an overgrown trail led me in a completely wrong direction... that's the moral of the story. The good news is my lights kept going after hours and hours of wet, cold, and mud... and that is the piece of mind I meant.


I've mostly used magic shine and they're going 8 or 10 years later. Bt40 clone and some others that aren't so cheap. I dont think I would have enough battery for a ride lasting until 2 am ride but I'm in the middle of a remote national forest. I use these without hesitation. Like others said I test them before a super remote ride and sometimes I'll carry a backup too depending on the distance.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

BigHit-Maniac said:


> I hear ya. Didn't mean to come across "brash" I guess. Was just genuinely curious with the luck folks have had in the back woods... hours into a long night-time epic. LOL.
> 
> Personally, I carry at least one extra battery in my pack... with my other stuff. I've legit gotten lost in the woods out here in OKC... and didn't get back to my pickup truck till almost 2:00am before. Knowing that my lights kept me going that long, even when it started raining (and everything got soaked)... was a good piece of mind.
> 
> Basically an overgrown trail led me in a completely wrong direction... that's the moral of the story. The good news is my lights kept going after hours and hours of wet, cold, and mud... and that is the piece of mind I meant.


What you chose to use as bike lights has a lot to do with what kind of riding you do or what you might plan to do. If you plan on riding epic rides ( more than 4 hrs ) then you definitely want your lamps and your batteries to be dependable. If you even think getting caught in the rain ( or getting lost ) is a possibility than you need dependable lights and batteries. If you even think you might run out of battery juice while on a ride you definitely need to do a run time test of your batteries before going out ( or carry a backup that you know will get you out of the woods in a pinch )

I've only ever gotten temporarily lost at night once but that was back in the days of halogen lights and NiMh batteries with only 2 hr. run time tops. Let me tell you that was some scary $#!T. Thank God I had a compass along because I had completely lost my sense of direction and I was in a very large wooded area that I was navigating with use of a map (with tons of side trails ). ( back then no GPS was yet available ) I learned a big lesson that night about not biting off more than I could chew.

Today with LED lamps and Li-ion batteries you have so much more you can do at night. Not to mention you also have GPS units or apps than can help you navigate. I don't do epic rides at night anymore ( age and health issues ) but if I did I'd use my best lights and newest batteries. Otherwise if you're only riding a couple hours at best in a park you know like the back of your hand almost any cheap light set is going to work. If you have two lamps and decent batteries ( or a back up torch or lamp ) you should be good to go. .


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Back in the early days of LED lights, I advised two friends to buy the Magicshine MJ808. Both eventually failed during rides. Both failed for exactly the same reason which was a poorly assembled driver board. I repaired both and based on that experience, I would never advise anyone to go out with a cheap Chinese light without first having opened it up and corrected any deficiencies. Poor thermal path or no thermal compound. Cold or questionable solder joints. Unsupported inductor. Poorly fitted or missing o-rings. And so on. If one does all that then the reliability factor is greatly improved.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

robbnj said:


> Has anyone played around with one of these? I picked one up for $15 and it seems pretty dang bright (bright enough for street rides and slower trail rides).
> I bought a diffuser lens for two buck to give a wider beam, but it sacrifices too much projection.
> 'Gonna buy a second light and use that one for the diffuser. All-in for both lights will be less than thirty bucks.
> 
> ...


I got some custom 3.7v battery packs from Kaidomain, and they threw in 3 of these lights- something about the rules for shipping lights with batteries vs just batteries.

Nasty blue tint, tiny hotspot, only 2 modes plus flash.

Worth changing the LEDs to neutral XML2? Any other upgrade worth the bother, or do I give these away or toss 'em out?

PS- KD got me the battery packs within a week!


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## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

I've always used cheap Chinese lights, starting with first generation Magicshine $89 lights, that you could buy for $19 a year later from DX.com. On those, I added thermal paste and had to replace parts on controller boards, etc.

My latest are these Amazon versions.

For the bars:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NHFT9S4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_TLH0BbY12Z60V

For the helmet:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JP8K80U/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_XMH0BbJ2SVRH6

I've run the bar light for 1 year and the helmet light since 2015. No modifications, no disassembly and still using original batteries. I've never experienced lights failing, and I ride in the woods alone. I may be pushing my luck.

I ride 2 to 3 mornings a week in the dark for an hour each ride.

I think I can justify a better light at this point, though I can't complain given my luck with these cheap ones. I wonder what I'm missing. Is the light output, color, battery life and quality significantly better? It seems like Action LED batteries and maybe the Revtronic light might be a good next step?

Revtronic 1600 Lumens Bike Light - Cree LED Bike Lights - Mountain Bike Headlight Bundle with 5200mAh Rechargeable Battery Pack, AC Charger https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00R1JC894/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_OSH0Bb9DQG4A0

Or maybe a Glow worm?

I have no experience with anything over $100, but I'm ready to make the move toward a better product.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

isleblue65 said:


> I've always used cheap Chinese lights, starting with first generation Magicshine $89 lights, that you could buy for $19 a year later from DX.com. On those, I added thermal paste and had to replace parts on controller boards, etc.


Actually, DealExtreme has never dropped the price for original MJ-808 light: ~$20 were knock-off clones. Some of them were excellent, some inferior.

BTW, I'm still using two original ones bought in 2009: converted them to 808E when XML became available. Working fine (with new cables & batteries, of course) till today!


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

isleblue65 said:


> I've always used cheap Chinese lights, starting with first generation Magicshine $89 lights, that you could buy for $19 a year later from DX.com. On those, I added thermal paste and had to replace parts on controller boards, etc.
> 
> My latest are these Amazon versions.
> 
> ...


you could check these out too if Your looking for good lights that arent too expensive:

www.rakclighting.com

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

My mistake - I have the MS Clones- from DX. They were a notably better product than the original MS product. 

This morning I paid more attention to my light beams, and after watching Outbound Lighting videos last night, I can truly say my lights suck in comparison. Not sure I’m ready to drop $450 (less $20 website coupon) on lights, but if one product clearly stands above the rest, I’ll spend some cash. 

Those RAKC lights look like a decent mid-priced option. I’ll watch some videos to try to get a better feel for the light output and pattern. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

There isnt much out there yet except in Europe. My video skills are not great but have a GoPro now to get video that represents output and beam better.

Pic is beam of Hyperion at full power for that idea









Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

RAKC Ind said:


> There isnt much out there yet except in Europe. My video skills are not great but have a GoPro now to get video that represents output and beam better.
> 
> Pic is beam of Hyperion at full power for that idea
> 
> ...


Just not finding enough out there, including reviews on RAKC. I'm shifting my focus (and budget) toward a higher end light like Gloworm or Outbound.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

There is a lot on the lights over in Europe, we just brought them to the US last winter, thread titled "New Lights Coming"

We used to be a brand specific dealer, with RAKC Industries as the owner, till the Brand imploded. Now we stick to our company name.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

isleblue65 said:


> ......including reviews on RAKC.


RAKC's owner has been a long time customer for my GoPro adapters and mounts. He seems to be a "stand-up" guy. We cooperated some on helping out folks with broken mounts on their Ituo lights after they went out of business.

I don't know anything about the lights he is currently selling since I build my own for my use.


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## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

Vancbiker said:


> RAKC's owner has been a long time customer for my GoPro adapters and mounts. He seems to be a "stand-up" guy. We cooperated some on helping out folks with broken mounts on their Ituo lights after they went out of business.
> 
> I don't know anything about the lights he is currently selling since I build my own for my use.


Thanks,

Yes he reached out to me via IM a couple of times and clarified some things. I have no doubts about his integrity, and wouldn't have any problem sending money for the lights, it comes down 100% to not knowing enough about the lights and not finding enough online about them at this point to feel comfortable choosing the product. There's a lot more out there to read and research with Gloworm, and Outbound, who is small and relatively new, but has a lot of media, YouTube, website and forum presence.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Now we have got triple selfcontained bar light.







https://www.gearbest.com/led-flashlights/pp_009889627324.html


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

> 7500K


That's a showstopper.


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## Dominik.M (Sep 21, 2007)

Yep, the dual version have mind-blowing 362 lumens :eekster:, so we can expect over 500 lumens from the triple !! :cornut:


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

Delete


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## snipes287 (Mar 7, 2004)

deleated


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

I think this is new but not sure. Check it out. My guess is it's cheap Chinese light but I could be wrong so anybody know about this. It's interesting if it's true advertising though I didn't see what type of cells, etc. Take a look.

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com...eation&ctocode=Outdoor Recreation-156942&mx=a


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Could be el cheapo, but hard to say. No real data on it and I've found two distinct weight info. Your link says "159g (197g including aluminium handlebar mount)" while HERE they say "273g (312g including aluminium handlebar mount)". 
Very likely it has 7 XP-G2 leds being so close the beam would be quite wide. Could have three 18650 or 18500 cells.


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## rpitz (Feb 13, 2015)

mb323323 said:


> I think this is new but not sure. Check it out. My guess is it's cheap Chinese light but I could be wrong so anybody know about this. It's interesting if it's true advertising though I didn't see what type of cells, etc. Take a look.
> 
> https://www.chainreactioncycles.com...eation&ctocode=Outdoor Recreation-156942&mx=a


This guy has already done a video review. Not too many tech details, but the beamshots don't look too shabby either...





Gesendet von meinem Moto Z2 Play mit Tapatalk


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

The price has gone down to 90 bucks now. Just an FYI.

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com... Recreation&ctocode=Outdoor Recreation-156942


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

OK, this isn't a new light and it definitely isn't a cheap-o but the newest deal is cheap for what you get and of course it is Chinese. Ituo Wiz1 for $41.95 @ Amazon ($49.95 - $8 discount code). 800 real lumens, 3 programmable preset levels in the main program, Gopro compatible, field changeable battery, 3 hr. runtime in high. Draw backs are larger than normal size and no U.S. based support network. Worth a look if your needs are for a longer running, mid powerful usb rechargeable self-contained bar light.
Mole

https://www.amazon.com/ITUO-Headlight-Rechargable-Lithium-Included-Wiz1/dp/B07CBSLPSK?ref_=bl_dp_s_web_11069935011


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

*KD BL2S Quick Ship!*









So I ordered the KD BL2S XM L2 U3 in 4000K along with another of their 4-cell Panasonic flat packs plus a bunch of zip ties etc, selected Free Shipping Registered Airmail (NOT DHL) and it all arrived at my doorstep just two days later... curtesy DHL. 

http://kaidomain.com/BL2s-2-x-Cree-...-Groups-of-2-to-3-Mode-2200-Lumens-Bike-Light

http://kaidomain.com/S024761-KBP-18...18650B-Rechargeable-18650-Li-ion-Battery-Pack

Don't feel qualified to write a full fledged review but must say I think the color temperature is superb, so am posting some pics strictly to illustrate this - frankly am too lazy to try capturing the throw (which isn't bad at all for such a small and inexpensive light, seems more powerful to me than either of my 4000K/5000K Yindings though of course shorter in range than Ituo's XP2 or Wiz20 .) Beam has nice soft spot but UI is not the best with Off included in the regular cycle and doesn't fade between modes (Flash and SOS activated through long press, that's okay.) And although the power button is raised quite nicely from the case, sorta like on a SolarStorm, the stiff click switch within can be kinda recalcitrant. If depressed from an angle is possible to emit the clickety sound without actually advancing mode (but works fine when pushed straight down).

Anyway this little lamp comes with a generously long power cable which easily allows it to sit on the noggin while run from the KD 4-cell flat pack stashed in a chest pocket. Should note here, I ride a recumbent so my bike's Jagwire Gold Medal cable housings reach pretty high up into my view, can't run any head lamp on High mode without being dazed by the reflection. Fortunately discovered that my frame mounted NiteFighter BL40S and Ituo Wiz XP2 and XP3 on the bars was all I needed for distance, so can run the BL2S on Low just to illuminate the cockpit and help see around close corners where my other lights would miss. For such short distances don't need a lot of lumens, would only create useless glare.

First three pics all shot from the lid on High mode

























Kitty on Low Mode








Sorry but V-Bulletin has a mind of its own and rotated my first pic, swear I didn't post it that way am not _quite_ that spaz!


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## MK96 (Nov 5, 2012)

Nice find!


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Thanks MK96 but I actually found out about the BL2S myself right here. Just that there wasn't a separate thread about it, seems to have appeared only in conjunction with the KD BL70S. Showed comparative beam shots but I didn't get a true appreciation of the XM L2 U3 4000K color bin until getting this baby into my own hot little hands. (Originally purchased the 3000K but it was too warm even for my perverted taste.)

Anyway tried to get some "wall" shots to better illustrate what I perceive to be the natural quality of this light with its XM L2 U3 emitters. Unfortunately the mist grew terribly dense while I was out so didn't get quite the anticipated results.

























At least discovered I could run the KD as a head light on Medium or High by raising its angle so as to point just above the horizon when I'm seated on my 'bent. Most of the light is wasted that way but at least it's available at a moment's notice, without laboring over the crappy mode button. Am still satisfied with Low mode for general purposes but it's certainly nice not to be limited.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*4200 actual lumen light with wireless remote for $75*









https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/warehouse/products/magicshine-mj-908

*900 actual lumen light with wireless remote for $33*









https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/warehouse/products/magicshine-mj-902

Here's a couple of sweet deals I saw on the Action-LED-Lights sale that might interest anyone looking for a cheapo light without the risk of unknown performance/reliability/customer service.
Use the discount code WAREHOUSE19 during checkout for 50% off the prices shown. (on website)

https://www.action-led-lights.com/collections/warehouse

Mole


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

The Kaidoman website shows a "full set" for the Kdlikter BL2S lights adding $23 to the price. Anyone know what's in it? It doesn't seem like enough for battery + charger, I thought it might be accessories. I tried to click the little info link, but it no clicky. I sent them an email form, just wondered if you all know first.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

...they responded that it is indeed a battery pack and charger. They didn't provide any more details, though.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Darth Lefty said:


> ...they responded that it is indeed a battery pack and charger. They didn't provide any more details, though.


The best way to have gone about this would of been to order the light separately, wait a day and then go to their website and order the best Panasonic battery pack they sell. I only suggest this because it's possible the battery might get delayed because of shipping restrictions. Since you ordered the complete set the entire order could possibly get delayed. Not to mention you might not get such a great battery when ordering the complete set.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> The best way to have gone about this would of been to order the light separately, wait a day and then go to their website and order the best Panasonic battery pack they sell. I only suggest this because it's possible the battery might get delayed because of shipping restrictions.


Actually the last few times my Kaidomain orders have included batteries, the packages were sent to me DHL Express at no charge and arrived at my doorstep within just a couple of days.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Just ordered a KD BL70S (in 4000K, thanks for asking) and noticed under Mode Arrangement:

Lo > Med > Hi (Recycle)

Hidden Str: Double Click

On / Off : Long Pressed

Is this something new, didn’t the BL70S originally include Off in the cycle or am I confusing it with their BL2S?


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

andychrist said:


> Actually the last few times my Kaidomain orders have included batteries, the packages were sent to me DHL Express at no charge and arrived at my doorstep within just a couple of days.


This is news to me. Used to be that if you ordered anything with a battery half the time the battery would get delayed or never received. If you ordered using DHL they used to charge you more. Nice that they sent yours using DHL at no extra cost. ( Been a Loooong time since I bought anything from KD ).

Edit; Maybe the stuff you ordered came from a USA warehouse. If it took only days that is what I am thinking because nothing coming from overseas can get to you in just a couple days.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

My neighbor gave me his bl70. It’s decent love 4k. It has the strobe on the main cycle which really pisses me off. Tint trumps all, it’s too warm for most folks.....


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> Edit; Maybe the stuff you ordered came from a USA warehouse. If it took only days that is what I am thinking because nothing coming from overseas can get to you in just a couple days.


That was my reaction too at first but when I checked the shipping log it showed that it had been despatched from HK. DHL really clears stuff through Customs in no time, dunno how they do it. Recently ordered some other bike related items from the UK which were shipped out immediately and DHL again got 'em through Customs and onto their own vehicle same day it arrived in the States, was at my local PO for delivery next day. Makes my head spin!

But my monthly CC statement just came in and now I don't feel too good...


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> It has the strobe on the main cycle which really pisses me off.


Oh then I guess KD did change the UI from the original because apparently now Strobe and Off are both hidden (by Double Click and Long Press).

Thanks DR now I don't feel like such an idiot (still _am_ an idiot, just don't _feel_ like one, to be clear.)


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Andy, if you would open it for some reason, please take macro pictures of driver on both side. I'm wondering how it looks. 

User interface looks quite similar to the KD2. Try to see if it has programing interface like KD2 using very long press (8-10 seconds) when the light is on. If yes status led should blink in yellow color.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Well ledoman I just recently ordered it and with everything going on in HK right now haven’t any idea when it might be shipped. But there’s no mention on Kaidomain’s web page about it being programmable and of course the shape is very different from that of the KD2, would the same driver board even fit into it? Had only planned to open the front in order to swap out the glass if possible for a couple of Action-LED Light’s Wide Angle Lenses — when layered at 90º from each other they create a terrific square beam without rings or color separation (and which oriented 45º delivers a diamond shape). Do you know, can I just pop out the OP reflector to access the board or would I have to open the tail cap?

Thanks for getting Kaidomain to update the UI ledoman. Now if they’d just do the same with the BL2S, would make a much improved helmet light (as I’m currently using my 4000K model).


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

I think it's easy to see it from back side. See disc around mode button.

I've seen bigger round driver with those KD2 modes long time before KD2 was created. It was actually offered on DX.com. Will add link if it still exist.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Okay ledoman I’ll let you know when I get it. Still just processing, hasn’t shipped.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

hi,
I have last year asked Kaidomain why they not offer there Bike lights in alot Temperatur ranges like there flashlights to stay over any other company and they add it.:thumbsup:

not only ugly 6000K bluelight like cheap chinese stuff.

5000K
4000K
3000K

free decision.

on that way you get for ~15€ a 4000K natural looking, night vision increased Light and not selfblinding bluepeak junk"+6000K" what other company offers.

big thx to KD again for that step.

i think in my light mod thread i show to swapp the basic 20mm lenses to increase the Beam quality to.

one of the Spot lenses must be removed, and be changed to a TIR wide beam or Rippel one.
This one gives good results.

I have there post alot of pic so need to search a little bit.
You will find there to, KD2 mod with change the 2x XM-L to 2x XHP50 LED + driver change= 4000 Lumens putput.
and alot other stuff, feel free to check my pics for fun.

The basic KD2 in 4000K have a much higher value in use then anythink other like gloworm .......s

some lumen + or - never was anythink what makes a big difference.

the chinese light what brings me most fun was the Xanes XL03.
a 30x30mm 50 gram Aluminium light.
i upgrade that tiny 7$ light to a 2000 Lumen 4000K trail light beast, find that in my link to.

at the beninning you see how i make from an 4€ chinese street light a fantastic 2000 Lumen one.
only use the 18mm x 15mm Street reflektor, the other parts junk.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

I made an order too, didn't even think about the protests before clicking the checkout button and then coming back here to report in. If they can't come through I'll get one of those constant-output Cygolites mentioned in the other thread. I have a Metro 300-ish and it feels reassuringly familiar.


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## Eneen (Jul 4, 2017)

This one seems to be new:
http://kaidomain.com/bike-lights-an...2-LED-4-Mode-2400-Lumens-Bike-Light?limit=100
Hard to google due to lack of brand/model. Has anyone tested it?

Also BL2s now has button on the top, so shell is different. I'm thinking about buying one and replacing driver to be able to drive it with 3.7 cell only.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

No word from Kaidomain since the order confirmation a week ago. Considering HK is in a meltdown I'd like to give them the benefit of patience but how much?


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

No that’s not new at all Eneen but is apparently a very well made lamp, from the thread about it on this forum. Note that it runs cool white LEDs and has OP reflectors rather than TIR lenses plus is comparatively heavy. And the BL2S has always had the button on top, you must be thinking of the KD2.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

I know this bike light under other name - see: https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+light+Jexree

It is pretty heavy for helmet use, but no problem on bar. My friend likes it since it has glowing outer circles so he can save enery when needed. I've managed to change central leds for him from some chinese cool white to 5000K LG LH351D (CRI 90), but I needed to cut off central PCB and replace it with thin 16mm for 3535 led size. It got nice neutral white light. Driver is very messy and it is better to leave it in place. Also outer silver rings are plastic so front cooling fins are useless and only rear part is really cooling. Because of its weight it's just about enough.


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## Eneen (Jul 4, 2017)

@andychrist: yes, I meant KD2, sorry. I've treated BL2s as new version of KD2
@ledoman: thank you! So KD2s is way to go, cheaper, easier to upgrade and light enough for helmet. What lens diameter does it use? What lenses have you tried with it?


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Well, KD2 has better user interface, but BL2S has better thermal transfer. Drivers are different, but lenses and LED PCBs are the same. Lenses are 20mm diameter (21mm with holder). YOu can get them here: Reflector / Collimator Lens - CREE - LEDDNA (the XM-L ones). Depending in preferences you can use two 10deg or kombination 10+25 deg for wider beam. If you have bar light with wider beam I would use two of 10deg. Stock lenses are about 15 deg.

Both lights are not really waterproof but good enough for some light rain.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Also Eneen, BL2S uses XM L2 U3 LEDs. Everyone seems to really like the 4000K; it is warm without being yellow.


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## Eneen (Jul 4, 2017)

This 4000K may indeed be really great.
Driver seems to use PWM, what chip is used by driver? Maybe it can be re-programmed to have turn-off on long press...
I've got old litemania scolo with mechanical switch, just low-off-high, perfect UI.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

Darth Lefty said:


> No word from Kaidomain since the order confirmation a week ago. Considering HK is in a meltdown I'd like to give them the benefit of patience but how much?


New reply this morning: "The bike light is being installed and tested, it will be shipped in this week."


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

ledoman said:


> User interface looks quite similar to the KD2. Try to see if it has programing interface like KD2 using very long press (8-10 seconds) when the light is on. If yes status led should blink in yellow color.


ledoman I just received the BL70S and long press simply turns the lamp off, no matter how long it's held down.

On the plus side, from indoor testing alone (because it is day now) the light doesn't seem to have any noticeable color separation/rings. Can't say for sure though until night falls because such effects can be subtle and difficult to detect until it is pitch dark out.

Wow this thing is as heavy as it is bright. :eekster:

And the power cord is long enough to strangle a cat. Uhm, not talking about you, Sylvester. Good kitty.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Thanks Andy. Not to bad, it's still good to have Off mode out of mode cycle which is same as KD2 (except level programming). Good to know and kudo to KD for that. It is feature all MTB lights should have, IMHO.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

It's listed at 3000 lumens. What do you think the actual is. 36 bucks plus another 34 for the 6800 battery is not too bad as long as it's durable and maybe 2k lumens not a bad deal. Wonder if it's even close to the 3k tho as advertised.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

@mb323323 Well if you want the 4000K (recommended) that's $1.99 extra so $38.79. I think it's worth it, this thing is BRIGHT. Have no way of knowing how much it puts out but Cree lists the max of the XHP70.2 at 4292 lm, so what with the general underpowerment of KD lights 3000 sounds pretty reasonable to me.

But I wouldn't order Kaidomain's Panasonic packs if you bike in cold weather because their Magicshine style waterproof "pop"connectors have problems under such conditions - you wont be able to separate the battery and lamp cables at the end of a ride. Fiddling with them stresses both the connectors themselves as well as the solder joints on the packs, which will soon cease to function (happened to all four of mine.) Better idea is to purchase a set or two of Panasonics, Sanyos or LGs from FastTech or the like and a TrustFire 6-cell power bank from KD - it comes with the screw style connector which is still compatible with the Magicshine style socket on the BT70S but will not freeze to it. http://kaidomain.com/S027968-TrustFire-EB03-Bicycle-Mobile-Power-Box

When it's dark tonight I'll compare the BL70S to the Ituo XP3. Know they have very different beam patterns but they're the closest I have.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Okay Kaidomain's BL70S blows away Ituo's XP3. Not only is it brighter and floodier but the color temperature of the 4000K model is just sensational. Makes both fallen brown leaves and fresh grass glow like lit up from within. No discernible ring effect even with its orange peel reflector. Perhaps could use a better mount because the power button is a bit difficult to press and the lamp is so heavy. No idea yet what runtime might be on the various modes when run from a TrustFire 6-cell of 3400mAh Pannies. Too tired now to keep riding until the indicator turns red, been a long day. But so far this is definitely the best bar lamp I've ever had, can't imagine needing anything more powerful.

Kaidomain BT70S Hi Mode by andyXchrist, on Flickr

Thanks again to ledoman for getting KD to upgrade the UI so that it no longer cycles through Off!


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

Yeah, the BL70 is a solid light, especially for the price. If I could make a premium version, it'd have a better mount like you want too, and a three button (up/down/off) remote switch. A commuter version with a movable cutoff would be nice too.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Thanks for sharing all your info and pics Andy!

-Garry


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Did you purposely aim it down in that pic? The amount of light on the front tire and the huge tire shadow seems like it was aimed very low. Is this a pic from an "unconventional" MTB maybe?


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Vancbiker said:


> Did you purposely aim it down in that pic? The amount of light on the front tire and the huge tire shadow seems like it was aimed very low. Is this a pic from an "unconventional" MTB maybe?


Yeah the BL70S was mounted to the lower member of the RANS chopper bar on my Stratus XP recumbent bike, which I have set up with mtb wheels and drive train. Since then have forced the lamp between the cable housings onto the upper cross bar, where it shouldn't spill as much light onto the front tire.

RANS Stratus XP New KDLITKER BL70S XHP70.2 by andyXchrist, on Flickr

Also, took the pic in my back yard rather on the trail, didn't have a lot of space in which to capture the entire beam. So chose to aim more towards the ground with its mix of greens and browns in order to show off the 4000K NW light's wide color spectrum which would not have been so obvious up in the tree top.

When I get the chance will try to take more illuminating pics from a canopied trail, if the winds haven't already blown most of the leaves off. Autumn is having quite an early go here this year!


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

Who is looking for a great little helmet light.

Sofirn ad to the basic SP40 nicer color tints now.
3000K or 4000K

with the code: M226 
you get adittional discount.

*18$* for a quality lightweight helmet light with nice color temperatur.

I Bought a 4000 kelvin one.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

lostplaces said:


> Who is looking for a great little helmet light.
> 
> Sofirn ad to the basic SP40 nicer color tints now.
> 3000K or 4000K
> ...


I have to admit even the skeptical Mole thinks that one may be good for helmet use. I watched a few videos on it and beam looks good + reviewers seem universally impressed with its performance and value.
Mole

***Any suggestions for a suitable mount for helmet use?***


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

lostplaces said:


> Who is looking for a great little helmet light.
> 
> Sofirn ad to the basic SP40 nicer color tints now.
> 3000K or 4000K
> ...


Link?


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

It's at Banggood: https://m.banggood.com/Sofirn-SP40-...26.html?akmClientCountry=America&rmmds=search.

-Garry


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

sorry forget to post a link.

SP40 with 4000K"helmet" + KD2 with 4000K"on the bike" will be a great Nightride setup.

Low glare and selfblinding+ higher Color rendering+ higher contrasts then the basic 6000K lights.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Thx Andy for the info on that light. Sounds like I should have one. Not that I need it. LOL

I'm in Coastal Calif so I won't be riding in anything below about 50 degrees, maybe 45 coldest so I'm assuming their battery set up will be ok. Just makes it easier to buy it all at once and be ready to go when it gets here.

Does the quality seem ok. Wires decent etc. How long do they usually take to deliver and do you think there will be an issue delivering the battery.

Thx again!

MB


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

BTW, I just ordered an SP40 in 4000k. I can offer up info on it if anyone wants it. It does sound like it's a limited production run. Oh, and there are coupon codes for the light if you google around. 

-Garry


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

I have the same question as Mole, how do you mount it? I've tried using that style of light on a hard hat, its just too front heavy.

I'd also be concerned about having too many modes to accidentally get into at the wrong time, the button might be too sensitive for mode changes while bouncing down the trail.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

~ 100 gramms of this helmet lights i dont find to front heavy.
set it more in the middle like cat-me do it.
https://forums.mtbr.com/lights-nigh...ain-now-h600w-mk-iv-1084673.html#post13817590

The basic silicone holder is ok, but it need some seconds to put a light in









the better one is the fast click mount from Armytek, any 18650 light snaps in with a move. it cost ~3$









if you not like holders, simple a rubber ring.
https://i.imgur.com/Dd9a0zi.jpg

and yes the UI is not the best for bike use from the Sofirn, hold the button to cycle between modes, but 17$ for this type of lights is crazy low.......
some years ago there was no way to get this type of helmet lights for under 50$.

on any light mounted on the helmet it is a pain to jump between *to much *settings what u not need.
you are 100% right, thats why i like programable lights so much.

The Zebra what i use mainly i set to 2 modes, low and high, ~200 and ~600 Lumen and jump between them with a easy to do double click.
but a Zebra cost 90$.

totally in the front i never mount my helmet light like he does it.
https://forums.mtbr.com/lights-nigh...-solution-commuting-1064453.html#post13452243

The fast growing chinese company Sofirn offers alot very high quality made lights for crazy low prizes so the little downside for a basic UI is not the big problem.

I own at moment 2 lights from this company and the SP40 will be number 3.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

mb323323 said:


> Does the quality seem ok. Wires decent etc. How long do they usually take to deliver and do you think there will be an issue delivering the battery.
> MB


Well the power cables are the same standard Magicshine type found on most bike lamps and battery packs that don't use screw connectors or USB. Can't speak for longevity of course because only just got it, but as long as you're not riding in freezing temperatures you shouldn't have any problems.

It took a while for mine to ship, probably because of the situation in HK at the time. But I put in another order with them less than a week ago and just received a tracking number that shows it in transit already. Also the last couple of times my orders included battery packs, all the items were shipped together DHL Express at no charge to me and arrived in just a couple of days, before Kaidomain even posted any tracking info - boy was I surprised! Of course can't guarantee you'll have the same experience because KD doesn't publish such details but seems they are expediting orders again, even though the turmoil there is not over.

BTW I found their BL2S pairs really well with the BT70S, has a more narrowly focused beam great for helmet use and the 4000K matches perfectly. Quite an overachiever for its size, although it does still cycle through Off (obviously not such a big deal when you're running another lamp concurrently.)

Hope you have a blast riding the coast at night, MB. I'm insanely jealous.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

Re KDLIKTER BL2s from Kaidomain.

I ordered it ($16) with the accessory set ($23) on 8/31. I got a shipping notification from Kaidomain on the 19th, for which I forgive them, things must be strained in HK. It arrived today 9/28. If there were any problems with the shipping I wasn't made aware of them.

The light is a dinky thing, a size smaller than I expected. It seems solid and well made. Weighs at 79 grams with cord and connector. There'd be no trouble using it for a helmet light with the pack in a pocket. I'm not worried about whether it will shift on the handlebar. It had two rubber bands in different lengths, which are pretty thick. They're injection molded with a tag to pull them taut. The cord is about two feet long and the battery cord is about one foot so the battery and light could either go anywhere on the bike or body. I think I'll try it first with the battery at the bottom of my frame bag. I had originally thought to put it at the front corner of the bag but now that I've got the thing I see there's no reason to do that. I strapped it to my handlebar and the curve in the is not big enough for 31.8. But the rubber pad is big enough. The rubber band hook on the back of the light interferes a little with the rubber band on installation but it's of no consequence, because once under tension the strap is pulled out of the way.

The accessory pack includes a battery, charger, battery strap, and a head lamp harness which could be turned into a helmet mount with a change of straps. I don't know from batteries but it was a hefty thing, much bigger than the light! Half a pound. The battery box is obvs four cell and has seals at either end. It has a connector which envelops and seals the connector on the light. The gaskets on either end will also keep it from shifting around in the bag. The charger is 8.4V 1A. It's got screws at either end but I didn't undo them.

I compared the beam to my Cygolite Metro 300 and it's obviously brighter even at the lowest setting. Much whiter beam too. I got the 3-speed version. I didn't try the blink modes.

I don't know when I'll actually use this thing - maybe not til DST ends in six weeks.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Darth Lefty said:


> Much whiter beam too.


Which color temperature did you order?


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

4000k

The Cygolite is very blue next to it


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

The indicator LED on the light stays lit even when the light is off. Shouldn't it be open circuit when not in use?


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

Shown next to the Cygolite


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

garrybunk said:


> BTW, I just ordered an SP40 in 4000k. I can offer up info on it if anyone wants it. It does sound like it's a limited production run. Oh, and there are coupon codes for the light if you google around.
> 
> -Garry


Yeah, I'm interested in one of these. I use and love my zebralight very often for camping to mountaineering to caving to you name it. A cheaper high performing backup and loaner would be great. Any other info on this thing?


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

WHALENARD said:


> Yeah, I'm interested in one of these. I use and love my zebralight very often for camping to mountaineering to caving to you name it. A cheaper high performing backup and loaner would be great. Any other info on this thing?


I found several video's on youtube and a few reviews by just doing a search online. I'm curious how the tint options end up working out. Reviews I saw were all the 5300 tint and there were a lot of comments on how warm the light appeared. Since I'm interested in testing the viability of using this as a bike helmet light (4500-6500 is the range of my current lights) I ordered the 5300 version. Just have to wait till I receive it and I'll report back on how it fits in with my current lights.
Mole


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Any reason I can't buy just the light head BL70 and use my Ituo XP3 battery. 

What's the actual lumen count on the BL2. Curious.


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## afie (Aug 28, 2006)

Im looking for something cheap yet effective for a commuting bike, but some of the models in these threads like the BT40s arent available anymore - whats out there?

Cheap as in it gets hard mounted to the bike but matters less if it gets stolen.

I currently have a set of Dinotte 400 front and rear lights, and Dinotte 200 front and 140 rear but want to save them for other bikes (or convert the AA battery pack into something rechargeable).


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

mb323323 said:


> Any reason I can't buy just the light head BL70 and use my Ituo XP3 battery.
> 
> What's the actual lumen count on the BL2. Curious.


Your Ituo battery pack will be perfectly compatible with either KDLITKER lamp.

Dunno the actual lumens on the BL2S but the 4000K is noticeably brighter and whiter than my Yindings, better color than my Ituos too. Pretty amazing for such a small and inexpensive bike lamp, liked mine enough to order another.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

garrybunk said:


> BTW, I just ordered an SP40 in 4000k. I can offer up info on it if anyone wants it. It does sound like it's a limited production run. Oh, and there are coupon codes for the light if you google around.
> 
> -Garry


Tracking on my light shows it to be at the local USPS location already so possibly could get it tomorrow or Monday. Sooo much quicker than I expected!!
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*Sp40*



SP40 arrived today!!! I made a mount with an old band style helmet mount and a stretchy Gloworm strap. Definitely will work well enough to try the light out. 5300K Tint seem to match my NW Ituo Wiz20 the best so will try it out with that light tonight. Dinner first!!!
Mole


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

MRMOLE said:


> SP40 arrived today!!! I made a mount with an old band style helmet mount and a stretchy Gloworm strap. Definitely will work well enough to try the light out. 5300K Tint seem to match my NW Ituo Wiz20 the best so will try it out with that light tonight. Dinner first!!!
> Mole
> 
> View attachment 1284415


How'd it do? 
I'll be buying one of these (or not) based on your review.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

WHALENARD said:


> How'd it do?
> I'll be buying one of these (or not) based on your review.


As far as the initial ride the light worked great. Beam is nice mix of hot spot and spill + throw seems to be quite good. Running mostly in the high mode (500 lumen) + brief periods of turbo had no problems with overheating. Definitely have more testing I want to do before recommending going this route though. Will have trouble getting very accurate lumen estimates because spill area is very large but max lux numbers (throw measurement) won't be affected. Also want to chart lux drop vs. runtime to see if airflow will affect stable lumen output amounts and runtimes of course.
Mole


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Sorry, I wasn't getting notifications on thread updates for some reason. Glad you got yours Mole and waiting to hear more impressions!

One thing that bothers me is this runtime graph posted in the review over at BLF: Sofirn SP40 Headlamp | BudgetLightForum.com . It shows output continually drop, unlike other lights of theirs that have more steady output. Your only 500 lumens or more during the first 20 mins. I'd rather have seen it hold at least 500 lumens for an hour to an hour and a half. I'm rethinking the Skilhunt H03 (reflector version) now, but I don't think it has as much throw as this SP40.

My 4000k still hasn't shipped from China!

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

garrybunk said:


> Sorry, I wasn't getting notifications on thread updates for some reason. Glad you got yours Mole and waiting to hear more impressions!
> 
> One thing that bothers me is this runtime graph posted in the review over at BLF: Sofirn SP40 Headlamp | BudgetLightForum.com . It shows output continually drop, unlike other lights of theirs that have more steady output. Your only 500 lumens or more during the first 20 mins. I'd rather have seen it hold at least 500 lumens for an hour to an hour and a half. I'm rethinking the Skilhunt H03 (reflector version) now, but I don't think it has as much throw as this SP40.
> 
> ...


Well I got to do some light meter testing which I'm sure you'll find interesting. Max lux numbers were less than I would have guessed from my ride observations, a little bit less than a Yinding but definitely adequate for a helmet light. Broad spread of the spill on this light made my bounce test method inaccurate so I just calibrated my max @ turn on numbers to the output chart on the BLF so lots of room for error here and my results should be viewed with all that in mind. On thing it does show for sure is that the testing on the BLF was almost certainly done with no air flow as there was no big drop of output within a couple of minutes and the light reacted more or less like a typical self-contained bike light. I had to stop the test at 75 minutes because the area I use to test is not completely sealed from outside light (sunrise) but still was putting out more than 500 lumens if the error factor in my testing wasn't too great. Hope your light comes soon!
Mole

Black line = SP40.........***Click image to expand***


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

garrybunk said:


> My 4000k still hasn't shipped from China!
> 
> -Garry


I have same luck, my SP 4000K is in back order......
i hope they get it next week.

I order 2 adittionals SD05 from Sofirn to an they jump to on back order.....

no luck.

@MRMOLE

the SP40 is Temp regulated, i think ~500-600 Lumen for ~100 minutes is a Realistic falue in use with a little bit airflow.

thx for measuring.

it will perform better on the output side then the 140$ Outbound much more bulky light in the other thread.:thumbsup:


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Thanks Mole! Yeah, I would have guessed the BLF test would be done without any additional cooling (that would be typical). So it's still dropping output quite a bit from max during that first +/-30 minutes. At least 1hr 15mins above +/- 500 lumen still seams respectable though. I just don't know that I would replace my current helmet light setup with this full-time. Regardless of bike lighting use, I always like a good budget headlamp!

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

garrybunk said:


> Thanks Mole! Yeah, I would have guessed the BLF test would be done without any additional cooling (that would be typical). So it's still dropping output quite a bit from max during that first +/-30 minutes. At least 1hr 15mins above +/- 500 lumen still seams respectable though. I just don't know that I would replace my current helmet light setup with this full-time. Regardless of bike lighting use, I always like a good budget headlamp!
> 
> -Garry


This was an easy to justify light for me since I have no actual flashlights and can multipurpose it. It's definitely usable as a helmet light! I'm curious how much longer it would have run in turbo mode and if air flow will help it maintain output better in the high mode. Will eventually do those tests (under more controlled conditions) to find out.
Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

IMO the SP40 would be a better light if they dropped the high mode to ~750-800 lumen. That would give the battery a break and let the light stay in that range through the bulk of the runtime. All these folks are chasing that high peak, unsustainable, output for ad purposes and taking too much power up front from the battery.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Vancbiker said:


> IMO the SP40 would be a better light if they dropped the high mode to ~750-800 lumen. That would give the battery a break and let the light stay in that range through the bulk of the runtime. All these folks are chasing that high peak, unsustainable, output for ad purposes and taking too much power up front from the battery.


.....Or just add another preset mode in the 750-800 (bike appropriate) lumen range that would make it a better bike light and not hurt its functionality as a flashlight.
Mole


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

I'd agree 100%. Gimmie a mode with the most output for 1.5-2 hours. Otherwise the light has no utility to me.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

MRMOLE said:


> .....Or just add another preset mode in the 750-800 (bike appropriate) lumen range that would make it a better bike light and not hurt its functionality as a flashlight.
> Mole


Yes, that would work as long as it is easy to go through the levels. I do have a hard time imagining needing more than 700-800 lumen for flashlight use though other than willy waggling about how many lumen ones flashlight has.

For bike use the mode arrangement that most flashlights have would keep me from using one as a bike helmet or bar light. Anything that cycles through a flash or off with normal switch clicks is a deal breaker for me. High and low in the "normal rotation". An extra low level for map reading, repairs, or rest breaks and a flashing mode only accessed by a special switch actuation are my preference.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Well the flashlight enthusiasts (i.e. "flashaholics") are almost always pushing for max output - their not looking for "sustainable output". These are the ones driving the sales. It's two different worlds MTBR & BLF. They also generally hate the "long press for off" drivers.

I'm itching to try that Sofirn SD05 XHP50.2 as well (with that discount code from lostplaces in another thread). I don't have any 21700 cells (or appropriate charger) yet, so that'll lead to even more spending!

-Garry


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Just ordered the BL70. Didn't receive an email conf and all I received after ordering was a message stating the following.

YOUR ORDER HAS BEEN PLACED!
Thank you for your ordering. Your order has been successfully processed!

Please direct any questions you have to the kaidomain.com KD.

Thank you for shopping with us!

I've never ordered from KD so hopefully this is just how they work. Any input would be helpful.

Thx


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

garrybunk said:


> Well the flashlight enthusiasts (i.e. "flashaholics") are almost always pushing for max output - their not looking for "sustainable output"........


Hence my comment about having those high peak values only good for weinie waving.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

garrybunk said:


> I'm itching to try that Sofirn SD05 XHP50.2 as well (with that discount code from lostplaces in another thread). I don't have any 21700 cells (or appropriate charger) yet, so that'll lead to even more spending!
> 
> -Garry


basic 18650 work to.
only for longer runtimes 21700 are the way to go.

i have switch LED to 4000K one, that is easy to do.

i used a basic 20mm LED board from kaidomain.
only a soldering iron is neeedet to solder the + and - wires.

now i love this great light more.



garrybunk said:


> Well the flashlight enthusiasts (i.e. "flashaholics") are almost always pushing for max output - their not looking for "sustainable output".


not only flashys.
Alot companys use it for pure marketing.
for example take lupine a german bike light company.

they realeased now the lupine piko 1900 lumen.
after you switch it on it overheat now faster then previous modells and will be regulated down from the temp reguation to ~1000 lumen.

the light befor was the piko 1800 lumen., same game , after 3 minutes down to 1000 lumen real output use.

befor the piko 1500 lumen......
Piko 1200.....

all of them the same ~1000 lumen real output light, but the newer modells only overheat faster.

and if you reduze it to the only relevant points its a overprized Yingding, same output, beam, battery consumtion.

and yes there are real dragsters for flasoholics to like for example the Emisar D4, ist ultratiny but can put out ~4000 Lumens, but only for ~30 seconds.

after that the temp regulation put it to the real amount of heat what this tiny toy can handle ~1000 lumen constant output.


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## caRpetbomBer (Jul 13, 2013)

Where did everyone else get there sofirn sp40 from? I ordered mine from bangood last week and it hasn't shipped out yet.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

MRMOLE said:


> Well I got to do some light meter testing which I'm sure you'll find interesting. Max lux numbers were less than I would have guessed from my ride observations, a little bit less than a Yinding but definitely adequate for a helmet light. Broad spread of the spill on this light made my bounce test method inaccurate so I just calibrated my max @ turn on numbers to the output chart on the BLF so lots of room for error here and my results should be viewed with all that in mind. On thing it does show for sure is that the testing on the BLF was almost certainly done with no air flow as there was no big drop of output within a couple of minutes and the light reacted more or less like a typical self-contained bike light. I had to stop the test at 75 minutes because the area I use to test is not completely sealed from outside light (sunrise) but still was putting out more than 500 lumens if the error factor in my testing wasn't too great. Hope your light comes soon!
> Mole
> 
> Black line = SP40.........***Click image to expand***
> View attachment 1285059


Time to update this as I got a chance to redo this using 250 lumens as the floor limit. So light continued to produce a little over 500 lumens till 90 min. where it gradually descended to just below my 250 limit @ 2 hrs. I would have preferred a more stable output for say 90 min. but to be honest I'm happy it didn't do the 3 min. dive to 500 lumens like the still air test on the BLF as it's still useable (IMO) for bike helmet use the way it is. I'm not going to do a new chart yet because I want to add results from the Hi mode when I get that done. Will get to that as soon as I can!
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

garrybunk said:


> Well the flashlight enthusiasts (i.e. "flashaholics") are almost always pushing for max output -* their not looking for "sustainable output".* These are the ones driving the sales. It's two different worlds MTBR & BLF. They also generally hate the "long press for off" drivers.
> 
> I'm itching to try that Sofirn SD05 XHP50.2 as well (with that discount code from lostplaces in another thread). I don't have any 21700 cells (or appropriate charger) yet, so that'll lead to even more spending!
> 
> -Garry


I agree but if you've been a collector of various torches you already know this. This is why is really helps to have a torch with good heat sinking qualities. Also helps if there is a good UI that has a good mode that will give a steady output and still be bright enough to use as a helmet lamp while MTB'n.

It will be interesting to see how the_ Fireflies E01_ I just got works in this regard. At least with the E01 it has the ramping UI which lets the user decide just how much output they want to use. I can also reprogram the thermal regulation if that becomes necessary ( which in case of the E01 I have a feeling I will probably have to do since it seems to get so hot ) That said in all likely hood doing that might only give a couple more minutes of higher output. Still waiting for my first outdoor test.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

It took a few weeks but the battery indicator light on my BL2S ran down the battery. Irritating. Why isn't it open circuit when it's off?


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

It can't be off since it has momentary (electronic) switch and all bicycle lights has it same. Only reverse click (mechanical) switch like in torches has complete off state.


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## Darth Lefty (Sep 29, 2014)

Then I want some way to turn that indicator off or not have it. My Cygolite doesn't run down in two weeks of just sitting


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Can't you just simply disconect the battery as everyone else?


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

BL70 shipped. Can't wait.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

caRpetbomBer said:


> Where did everyone else get there sofirn sp40 from? I ordered mine from bangood last week and it hasn't shipped out yet.


I too ordered from Banggood and it still hasn't shipped.

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Didn't get to use the SP40 much last night but did take it with me mounted for 45mi. of riding on a different helmet that mounted pretty far forward. Happy to report no comfort issues at all.
Mole


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## caRpetbomBer (Jul 13, 2013)

I might just cancel my bangood order for the Sofin sp40 3000k which is taking way to long to even ship. I orderd my light sept 29th and end up ordering the light from Amazon for a few bucks more. Only thing i don't like about the Amazon light is its a 5500k colour temp.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

caRpetbomBer said:


> I might just cancel my bangood order for the Sofin sp40 3000k which is taking way to long to even ship. I orderd my light sept 29th and end up ordering the light from Amazon for a few bucks more. Only thing i don't like about the Amazon light is its a 5500k colour temp.


I'm wondering if their waiting for enough orders of the 4000K before they have them made. My recently received from Bangood SP40 only took 8 days from the order date to receiving it. You may be OK with the cooler option as I would have estimated my 5500K light to be in the 4500-5000K range compared to some of my other lights. 
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*Safirn SP40 450 lumen mode*



I was hoping for more output stability from this mode but steady degrading of output makes this a limp home mode for most of the 4 hrs. I tested it (for my old eyes anyway).
Mole

SP40 450 lumen mode = Black line


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## Zayphod (Nov 11, 2018)

Most likely people have already figured this out, but instead of those floppy silicone mounts for the P-shaped lights like SP40, a lot sturdier and cleaner option would be a GoPro bar mount:









Some rubber would need to be used depending on light's dimensions, but something like this is an option too:










It's not as sturdy, but the bonus part is some form of a quick release.


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## Ponik78 (Oct 12, 2019)

Hi!
I saw on aliexpress a rear light of 300 lumens on a 18650 battery. There are no reviews on it, but maybe someone bought a flashlight for this?


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## sandro87 (Oct 20, 2019)

I read all the thread, basically from what I got no Chinese knock offs of those integrated battery flashlights go over 400-500 lumens is that Right?


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## Ponik78 (Oct 12, 2019)

sandro87 said:


> I read all the thread, basically from what I got no Chinese knock offs of those integrated battery flashlights go over 400-500 lumens is that Right?


Do you need a front or rear light?


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## sandro87 (Oct 20, 2019)

Ponik78 said:


> Do you need a front or rear light?


Front.


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

Just for laughs. Old bike, redundancy lights


----------



## Timopeeaa (Oct 25, 2019)

Hello! I bought a BL70S lamp, and I really like it. Couple of questions: Can I change the lens to more floody, less spot lens? Are such lenses available? Is it easy to change, I have never disassembled a bike light. Thanks!


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

Timopeeaa said:


> Hello! I bought a BL70S lamp, and I really like it. Couple of questions: Can I change the lens to more floody, less spot lens?


not really or you try to get in the 60mm hole for example a 40mm C8 reflector with OP.

the BL70S have a extrem big reflector to focus the light a lot.
to make it little bit more floody this light get an OP texture on the reflector.

if you like it more floody then you need a much smaller reflector vs LED size ratio!!

I can show you a compare from the SD05 ration in flood vs throw.

typical XM-L2 based light with the typical 20-26° spot lenses in typical 6000K.









Thats the beam from the SD05, i change the LED to a 4000K one.
out of the box this light have a ~ 6000K LED inside.









a very great ration in flood vs throw, what says LED size vs Reflector size, for night rides on the bike the SD05 have i think."~ 20$"



robbnj said:


> Just for laughs. Old bike, redundancy lights


this lights are still a great base for DIY projects.
A friend from me mod his one to XHP70 and geht now pumped out 2400 lumen full regulated.

With the OP Reflector the beam looks near similar to the SD05 beam, what i post here.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

See if there is suitable reflector: http://kaidomain.com/Flashlight-DIY-and-Tools/Reflectors?limit=100

Little bit of OP furface you can get if you use hairsparay. Spray in the air and go with reflector in your hand through the cloud. You can repeat few times until you get enough. If to much, you can wash it out with alcohol.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

Putting some scotch tape on the lens is a quick and easy way to soften up the beam pattern.


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

Timopeeaa said:


> Hello! I bought a BL70S lamp, and I really like it. Couple of questions: Can I change the lens to more floody, less spot lens? Are such lenses available? Is it easy to change, I have never disassembled a bike light. Thanks!


Maybe this?: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bright-Eye...448847?hash=item28400f7d8f:g:9QoAAOSw3v5YsHQI

I used one on one of my lights and it provided a much wider beam. Less throw, though.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

robbnj said:


> Maybe this?: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bright-Eye...448847?hash=item28400f7d8f:g:9QoAAOSw3v5YsHQI
> 
> I used one on one of my lights and it provided a much wider beam. Less throw, though.


No that wide angle lens is too small for the BL70S.


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## mestapho (Sep 3, 2011)

I'm really liking this new helmet light. Super bright and floody. And my neck is incredibly strong now!

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32814...d=3216amp-umZc3c16NckdZR41d6i_PQ1573319653184


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## mrbubbles (Apr 9, 2007)

mestapho said:


> I'm really liking this new helmet light. Super bright and floody. And my neck is incredibly strong now!
> 
> https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32814...d=3216amp-umZc3c16NckdZR41d6i_PQ1573319653184


Yikes... there's actually 9 orders and 5 reviews.

Oh, and https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32864545237.html.


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

andychrist said:


> No that wide angle lens is too small for the BL70S.


What's the diameter of BL70 lens? The lights look awfully similar, but none of the pics I've seen have anything to show the scale/size.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

robbnj said:


> What's the diameter of BL70 lens? The lights look awfully similar, but none of the pics I've seen have anything to show the scale/size.


Haven't measured it but you can see the difference between the BL70S (top of chopper bars) and the Magicshine clone (bottom of bars) on my RANS Stratus XP.

BL70S (Top) Magicshine clone (Bottom) by andyXchrist, on Flickr

Swapped a CREE XHP70.2 into the MJ clone and installed a wide angle lense. Like the beam even more than the BL70S but unfortunately the clone only has H L and Strobe; I prefer to operate that emitter on M so mostly just use the KDLITKER.

https://forums.mtbr.com/lights-diy-...er-magicshine-mj808-1091641.html#post14068374


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

andychrist said:


> Haven't measured it but you can see the difference between the BL70S (top of chopper bars) and the Magicshine clone (bottom of bars) on my RANS Stratus XP.
> 
> BL70S (Top) Magicshine clone (Bottom) by andyXchrist, on Flickr
> 
> ...


Are those mounted on a push lawnmower handle?

Anyway, I see you have a focusing lens on the smaller one. Have you tried it on the BL70 just to see what effect it'll have? A dot of Scotch tape to hold it in place for the test...

i was thinking of getting another lens and drilling out the center hole a little at a time to see if I would provide a spot beam, but still create some side-throw.
I don't ride much at night (maybe 5x a season at most), just like to play around with this stuff.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

robbnj said:


> Are those mounted on a push lawnmower handle?


Andy rides a recumbent, see his post with pics here.

-Garry


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## robbnj (Jul 19, 2013)

garrybunk said:


> Andy rides a recumbent, see his post with pics here.
> 
> -Garry


I was just joking with him. I can see the bar stem in the picture


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

@robbnj: https://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night-riding/first-xhp-bikr-lights-1021297-2.html#post14342363 Here you can sorta see how the Magicshine clone with a single wide angle lens stacks up against the KDLITKER, though my iPad was not able to capture the entire width of the beams within the frame. 

I wouldn't bother tying to jerry the little diffuser onto the BL70S, you really need to address the entire area of the lens to achieve the desired effect.


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## Ottoreni (Jan 27, 2004)

Ordered a BL70 light through Kaidomain this past Sunday.

I have not received a confirmation email, just Paypal payment notice.

Does Kadomain send out an email? How long to arrive to the Southeastern U.S.?

Thanks!


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Kaidomain doesn’t send out confirmation email. When I ordered my BL70S they notified me when it shipped, almost three weeks later, and it took around twelve days thereafter to arrive where I am in upstate NY. Remember they’re in HK and things are not going too well there right now.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

*Sofirn SP40 4000K*

Hey the Sofirn SP40 4000K is in stock and on sale right now at aliexpress.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33014058575.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.40694c4dGOhz72

Free shipping but with PP international charge and USA NYS taxes came to $24.70 for me. So maybe a little bit more expensive than with banggood's supposed discount code but at least there's a slight chance it might actually ship, keeping my eyes crossed.


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## caRpetbomBer (Jul 13, 2013)

Thanks @andychrist. I have been waiting for 2 months for my Sofirn SP40 4000K from bangood.

Aliexpress This is what i get under my shipping options. 
Free Shipping 
to Canada via Seller's Shipping Method
Delivered before 12/22 or full refund

I wonder how much of this is true lol.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Well aliexpress isn’t the best at actually shipping either but at least they’re really good about issuing refunds.


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

Sofirn is excellent to deal with, they ship right away. Their batteries are pretty good too. I ordered a C8G with battery using Aliexpress standard shipping and it was less than three weeks from order to my door in Canada. I find E-packet to be almost as fast but rarely use other shipping methods. Its getting to be a busy time of year for them and they are partway through shipping a couple thousand BLF lanterns so there may be some delays right now.


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

I believe this is a real Yinding but have not actually ordered one. The shipping rates to Canada make the price too high to find out.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32951719338.html?spm=2114.12010612.8148356.2.6a2853ccTyo55R


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

arc said:


> I believe this is a real Yinding but have not actually ordered one. The shipping rates to Canada make the price too high to find out.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32951719338.html?spm=2114.12010612.8148356.2.6a2853ccTyo55R


Looks like it. Looks like only "nature white" is available using 1st Gen XM-L's, but there are 99,000+ units available! Shipping for me shows $6.39 ePacket.

-Garry


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

garrybunk said:


> Looks like it. Looks like only "nature white" is available using 1st Gen XM-L's, but there are 99,000+ units available! Shipping for me shows $6.39 ePacket.
> 
> -Garry


If I knew what I was getting 100% for sure its not a bad deal but its also 1/3 of the way to a Gloworm Alpha. Or about the same price as a Kaidomain KD2 with a two cell 18650GA battery pack with a velcro flapped case perfect for helmet mounting .

Modding a KD2 by bolting in a new led shelf and using mcpcb's seems to transfer heat pretty good. It takes a bit of time but ends up with a better user interface and a driver that resistor mods pretty easily. I'm curious about the Yinding but would rather deal with the devil I know at this point.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

*On Sale Now!*

Hey my Sofirn SP40 4000K shipped, USPS tracking reports acceptance in China.

And it will be in sale for like two and a half dollars less starting Chinese Black Friday (Saturday here in the States) and Ali is offering an addition 1$ discount coupon on top of that.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33014058575.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.40694c4dGOhz72

Well apparently Ali's countdown timer was behind schedule because the sale is on now! Starting at $19.79 without battery and minus one buck with coupon so $18.79 before state taxes.


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## caRpetbomBer (Jul 13, 2013)

Thanks i ordered booth the Sorfirn SP40 4000K and a Sorfirn SD05 from AliExpress.
Cancelled booth lights from Bangood. I hope it doesn't take AliExpress 2 months to ship my lights LOL.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

caRpetbomBer said:


> Thanks i ordered booth the Sorfirn SP40 4000K and a Sorfirn SD05 from AliExpress.
> Cancelled booth lights from Bangood. I hope it doesn't take AliExpress 2 months to ship my lights LOL.


Well my SP40 has already been "processed through facility" so looks like it's moving pretty fast!

Do you know what the color temperature is of the SD05? Can't find that info on Ali, TIA.

Update: Well the SD05 seems only to be available in Cool White, bummer.

BUT, found these two little Sofirns in 4000K so ordered them both:

Sofirn New SC31B USB Rechargeable LED Flashlight 18650 Tactical USB Torch SST20 1000lm 5 Modes with Power Indicator 4000K 6500K

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Sof...ch-SST20-1000lm-5-Modes-with/32917707163.html

Sofirn C01S BLF Mini LED Flashlight AAA Twisty High 95 CRI SST20 4000K LED keychain Flashlight Hat Light with Clip

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Sof...000K-LED-keychain-Flashlight/32952525303.html

Weird thing, they will ship by two different methods, e-Packet and Ali Free Ship, even though I selected each without battery.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

andychrist said:


> Well my SP40 has already been "processed through facility" so looks like it's moving pretty fast!
> 
> Do you know what the color temperature is of the SD05? Can't find that info on Ali, TIA.


I don't know for sure but my guess would be around 6000k (if Lostplaces sees this I'm sure he can tell us the actual #'s). I got one of the 5300K SP40's and it's a nice tint appearing warmer than the rating would suggest. My SD05 is noticeably cooler. Ordered a SP33V3.0 today. That light look like it may adapt itself better for cycling than my SD05. Different preset levels (extra 100 lumens in the med mode willl help me) but also has a ramping mode so adjustable output levels + extra 1000 lumens @ max. (not that I'll use that). Down side is a little extra weight and some additional cost. Betting it will be worth it.
Mole


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Thanks Mole.

Yeah I saw that SP33V3.0 too but couldn’t dig up any info on ºK. Under Emitting Temperature there is just a choice of with or without battery, D’oh. So passed on that for the moment and just ordered those little Sofirns in 4000K with 95CRI.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

I see (on BLF posts) that the SP33 V3 also has temperature monitoring without a timed step-down! That's a big plus for us cyclists!

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*Cheepo price while they last!*











https://www.ebay.com/itm/142796062545?ul_noapp=true

Very good quality light for this price.
Mole


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

caRpetbomBer said:


> Thanks i ordered booth the Sorfirn SP40 4000K and a Sorfirn SD05 from AliExpress.


me to.
my SP40 4000K still not shipped from banggood they dont get it restocked now 6 weeks.......
so i order it from sofirn store now to.



garrybunk said:


> I see (on BLF posts) that the SP33 V3 also has temperature monitoring without a timed step-down! That's a big plus for us cyclists!
> 
> -Garry


and ?
the Astrolux EC01 cost 20$ is fully programmable on any way, brithness modes programmable , how many brightnessmodes you want, temperature regulation programmable ,anythink can a cyclist customise personally for his personal wish.

Its a Anduril software based light and so fantastic like all of them.

one of the top end lights off the year 2019 for 20$.

nd a temp regulation by itself is a big plus ?
explain it pls with a practically example.

temp regulation is only interessting if you drive LED + there Headsink on the abolutly limits and not want that the LED burn down.
If the brightness settings in the practical range the light itself not became warm on any way.

temp regulation are interessting in dragster or hard overdriven lights, like the EC01 is one.
i set the brighness to max ~4000 Lumen, the ~45 Watt og heat the small headsink"lightbody" cant not handele and the temp regulation kicks in and beware the LED to burn down.

to set the EC01 to for example 2500-3000 lumen will result in burned down a battery in 30-40 minutes.:thumbsup:
what is the practical use in that for a cyclist?
frustration about ultra short runtimes.

only coz a light are able to do hillarious amounts of light put out thats not means it is practically in use if the result will be burn down batterys in minutes.

cyclist need a good amount of light"~1000 lumen" a good beam and very good runtimes for hours.

the ratio= output vs runtime vs light size and weight is the most importand part and in that is the SD05 better then the EC01, the SD05 gives at ~1000 lumen ~25% longer runtimes than the EC01.

at this level the SD05 not need there build in temp regulation the light stays ice cold same like the EC01 not need it.....

and coz the SD05 have very pactically light modes, low"300 lumen" high "~1000 lumen" and for needs a burst with 3 minutes"~3000 lumen" to check out somethink, on that way the battery will last for hours.
and i love the easy to switch style.

thats why i prefer the SD05 on the bike befor the EC01.
the only doenside on the SD05 to the EC01 ist it have no USB charge port.









in sofirn store the light i have senn below 20$ and in set with charger and 4000 mah battery only some bucks more.

tiny lights like that and equiped with 1 battery have a limited capacity ~16 Wh.
and yes take some adittional battery will extend runtimes, but to change every 40 minutes a battery is not funny i try that out on a longer run......
and i think most cyclist will have long runtimes with only the battery in the light.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

lostplaces said:


> the Astrolux EC01 cost 20$


Link?

On aliexpress it's $24.63.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

andychrist said:


> Link?
> 
> On aliexpress it's $24.63.


3 days ago on banggood it was exact 22$.
about this black fridey stuff is jumping every day.
1 day later they where shipped so banggood is not dead like on sofirn lights get restocking.......

i orderd the "5000K" and the "6000K" to compare it for myself a little bit more.

but what i read the 6000K is a 1A color bin and the 5000K is a 2A color bin.

real 5000K color bins start at 3, for example 3A.

there is a very small difference to see i have read.

the next top light is comming to.
*an anduril software based helmet light for 25$!!!!*
i have preorder 3 of them.
Astrolux HL01 1200Lumen magnetic angle/headlight groupbuy | BudgetLightForum.com


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

I don't know how anyone can deal with the xhp50 beam pattern out of a reflector, the colour distribution (Cree rainbow) would drive me nuts. Especially the three volt version where there are so few emitter choices and all seem really bad. It would annoy me to no end on a road and drive me nuts on a trail, that led needs a colour mixing tir lens in my experience. 

Light intensity is only one requirement for a good light. The beam needs to be uniform and of high quality for the eye and brain to quickly identify an object. When rounding a corner at speed determining if something is a muddy spot, piece of wood or a skunk needs to happen fast. Its one thing to limp out on a crappy backup light if the main one fails, but having to slow down or enjoy the ride less because you chose a poor main light to save a few bucks makes no sense to me.


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Am in total agreement with arc, TIR lenses are the way to go. Reflectors tend to yield ringy beam patterns that refract the light causing color separation. If the LED emitted pure white light that might result in an attractive rainbow of colors (the way diamonds sparkle) but since it is only a combination of blue light and a yellow (or orange-yellow in the case of NW emitters) phosphor, the rings look sickly. Plus they just produce a small hotspot and a lot of spill. Most beam shots of sofirn torches look pretty terrible to me. But as pocketable devices for emergency use they probably can’t be beat, as there don’t seem to be any TIR flashlights on the market right now. 

Amazingly, Kaidomain’s BL70S with its CREE XHP70.2 emitter doesn’t seem to be afflicted by noticeable color separation, despite its massive orange peel reflector’s slightly ringy beam. So I find it an acceptable bar light, especially when supplemented with a NW TIR lamp such as the BL2S or Nitefighter BL40S aimed a bit lower.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

andychrist said:


> , as there don't seem to be any TIR flashlights on the market right now.


TIR or not TIR have nothing to do with it.
Read ARCs post in detail.

The XHP50 have the phospor layer across the *complete* LED, not only the Emitters, the part what stayed above the emitters produce a tint shift in *all* spot optics, reflector and TIR.
from spot to spill a smal lightcolor change.

the only way to get this away is an mixing optic, TIR or heavy OP reflector makes no differenz, the mixing is the importand part.

For example my Unicorn comes with an Samsung LED and a 20mm Spot TIR optic what makes ugly rings+ discoloration.
here left side for example.

the only ways to fix it if you not like it are, make a diffusor befor like here.

or like i do it buy 20mm lenses what smooth out the beam!!
an 20mm heavy structured OP reflector will do the job to.








with the stripes lens i get for example a street light beam.








ist my keychain backup light.
















but with 850 lumens for 1 hour an 10 minutes, more is not possible with the samsung LED and a 18650 battery its only a backup light.
the sofirm performes with only a little bigger size *3 times better*.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

SD05 beam pattern for bar use did not work for me either (OK for helmet though). Adding an elliptical lens cover did make quite a positive difference. Without the lens cover there was *no* light around the front tire and obstical recognition going into corners was unacceptably poor.
Mole


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## andychrist (Aug 25, 2011)

Mole, where did you get that lens cover? Doesn’t look like the wide angle lens from Action LED Lights, unless my eyes are deceiving me (which is entirely possible).


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

lostplaces said:


>


 lostplaces, what is that mount your using to mount the SD05 on the bars?

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

andychrist said:


> Mole, where did you get that lens cover? Doesn't look like the wide angle lens from Action LED Lights, unless my eyes are deceiving me (which is entirely possible).


It's an Action-LED-Lights lens cover, it just looks different because of the temporary mounting system I used (small section of old tube). Unfortunately its
diameter is a little too large and haven't taken the time to file it down to size yet.
Mole

Stock...................................................................................................Action-LED-Lights Lens


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## abrooks (Feb 1, 2015)

I bought one of these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mini-Rechargeable-2x-XM-L2-LED-Cycling-Head-Bike-Bicycle-HeadLamp-Light-4-Modes/382584665708?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=651348523260&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

It's not quite as advertised, it should have three constant light modes and a hidden strobe mode. In fact it has two constant modes and an unusable strobe mode. Additionally only one of my three in use batteries will power it. But it was so cheep it's not worth returning. It will make an ideal candidate for modification, when I can get round to it.


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