# Dual purpose DH/FR



## railleur (Nov 21, 2009)

I'm wondering if anyone has recommendations for a DH bike that's strong enough for FR abuse and isn't too slacked out... The trend these days seems to lean toward really light, long & low DH racers that aren't much good for anything else. I prefer multi-pivot suspension & American made.


----------



## FA-Q (Jun 10, 2008)

railleur said:


> I'm wondering if anyone has recommendations for a DH bike that's strong enough for FR abuse and isn't too slacked out... The trend these days seems to lean toward really light, long & low DH racers that aren't much good for anything else. I prefer multi-pivot suspension & American made.


If you got the $$ I'd say look at Knolly, being from the North Shore area they are very FR-oriented, although they do also offer the type of DH bike you're describing. Canadian company, but the bikes are all "North-American" made, not cheap, but very high quality according to all reviews and fanatical owners. Never owned one myself, but the new Delirium is my dream-bike for whenever I wear out my current FR ride.


----------



## railleur (Nov 21, 2009)

I'm not actually in the market at the moment, but I like to plan my bikes way into the future. So cost is no object, at the moment 

I know Knolly has a great reputation, but the Delirium T's a bit short on travel (besides, I doubt it could take a dual crown fork), and the V-Tach is a bit hefty at 12-some lbs. There's been a lot of buzz about their new DH sled... anyone know if it's freeridable?


----------



## railleur (Nov 21, 2009)

GearTech said:


> The Intense Uzzi looks to be a nice freerider that can DH too...


I also was looking @ Intense, but their website says that a dual crown on the Uzzi is a no go b/c max fork travel is 180mm. I was planning on using a Fox 40...

I've heard that the STD is a bit harsh over mid-sized hits- anyone agree with that?


----------



## GearTech (Mar 3, 2009)

railleur said:


> I'm not actually in the market at the moment, but I like to plan my bikes way into the future. So cost is no object, at the moment
> 
> I know Knolly has a great reputation, but the Delirium T's a bit short on travel (besides, I doubt it could take a dual crown fork), and the V-Tach is a bit hefty at 12-some lbs. There's been a lot of buzz about their new DH sled... anyone know if it's freeridable?


The new DH sled is low and slack so...

The Cove STD is pretty damn nice and with a light enough build you could pedal it all day. The frame is a touch heavy but it's plenty burly so you wouldn't have to worry about breaking it. Cove plans on redesigning the Shocker for 2011 with plans of lightening it up considerably. Maybe the STD will receive the same treatment?

The Intense Uzzi looks to be a nice freerider that can DH too...


----------



## norbar (Jun 5, 2007)

Maybe Jedi? It's not very long and slack, and the cs is pretty short. People seem to be using them for fr as well.


----------



## freeriderB (Jan 9, 2004)

i think you should look for a used VP free...8.75" of travel, and more freeride than DH, but does both well.


----------



## Gemini2k05 (Apr 19, 2005)

What kind of geometry are you looking for exactly? That would be more helpful rather than "not low and slack". 14 inch BB's? 15? 69 HA's? 45 inch WB's?

Just kinda strange to hear that. Maybe just cause of location but I've never hear someone wish for a shorter less stable bike on any of our DH, FR or XC trails.


----------



## Uncle Cliffy (Jul 7, 2006)

Aren't you wanting a freeride bike?

Definately need some prefered geometry numbers to help...


----------



## supramk388 (Mar 6, 2007)

Canfield Jedi


----------



## MaddSquirrel (Aug 5, 2005)

Banshee Scythe
Transition Blindside


----------



## DJ Giggity (Sep 9, 2008)

railleur said:


> I also was looking @ Intense, but their website says that a dual crown on the Uzzi is a no go b/c max fork travel is 180mm. I was planning on using a Fox 40...
> 
> I've heard that the STD is a bit harsh over mid-sized hits- anyone agree with that?


Jeff Stebber himself posted a pic of an Uzzi with a dual crown. There are also pics in the uzzi photo album with dual crowns. At 9-10lbs for a frame I think it is appropriately beefy.

I had the chance to take a short test ride on an STD with an Elka. It felt pretty good to me.


----------



## FA-Q (Jun 10, 2008)

*Made where?*

How big of a deal is "American made"? Some of the names being tossed out here are American companies that have their frames made overseas. I think that good bikes can be made almost anywhere (except China), but if you want to support an American builder, maybe check out Ventana? If they don't have a model that is exactly what you want, they can also do custom bikes with custom geometry...


----------



## DucJ (Aug 14, 2009)

railleur said:


> I also was looking @ Intense, but their website says that a dual crown on the Uzzi is a no go b/c max fork travel is 180mm. I was planning on using a Fox 40...


Someone Correct me if I'm wrong but. Can't you travel limit F-40's?
There is a KHS in one of the pic. threads in this forum with one set at 7".........
Uzzi would be sweet.


----------



## The_Pitbull (Nov 13, 2008)

DucDucGoose said:


> Someone Correct me if I'm wrong but. Can't you travel limit F-40's?
> There is a KHS in one of the pic. threads in this forum with one set at 7".........
> Uzzi would be sweet.


they are internally adjustable from 8 to 6.5 in .5 inch increments, each dropping (or raising) the a2c that respective height


----------



## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

giant faith or banshee scythe


----------



## DucJ (Aug 14, 2009)

*Trek Session*

If it hasta be made here..Session was doin' double duty until this year when the Scratch came out.....


----------



## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

this thread needs pics


----------



## railleur (Nov 21, 2009)

Thanks all,
I'm basically looking for a ride that will be competitive for DH (good suspension performance, weight, decent stability) while being nimble & tough enough for FR (easy to air, pedalable so some extent).

I plan to run a dual-crown 40 at full travel, though I might try cranking it down to ~7" for park riding.

As far as Geo's, you can't always judge a bike by its numbers. That said, 64 HA is probably too slack, and 22" TT is minimum I would go.

American made is less important than the right bike. I believe Trek has moved to Taiwan, as has Santa Cruz.

I'm against _faux_ four bar linkages ala Kona stinky/stab b/c they usually tend to stiffen under braking (Turners of the past prove me wrong, I admit). If I were to go Single Pivot, I'd choose a straight design like Foes.

and now pix of two nice looking candidates.


----------



## schneidie (Aug 30, 2008)

F-bomb FTW


----------



## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

can you freeride this?...


----------



## Iceman2058 (Mar 1, 2007)

What you need, is what I got... 

Morewood Zuza, set up with a Boxxer 2010. HA 66, bb around 14, short and nimble, pretty much built like a tank. Morewood website says 180 max travel....but seriously, it's heavily overbuilt...
Besides, they recommend a Totem, which sits at 565 A-C. The Boxxer is only 3mm more...at 568...and because of the 1 1/8 steerer, you can run a flush internal headset (like a Cane Creek double-XC), which helps keep the front nice and low (it is actually lower at the top of the headset than the same frame running a Totem 1.5" steerer with an external headset...). The frame has a 1.5" headtube.
23.3 TT on the large (still quite short).
Takes a front deraileur, straight seat-tube so you can easily get in the right position to pedal it around if you must.

Very good all-rounder...OK so obviously it won't be all that competitive in a pure DH situation...it will lack stability compared to a full-on DH sled...but you're after a pretty tough compromise. I know from reviews that the driver 8 for example fell short of expectations in that area when reviewed...it's a tough equation to crack, that one.

Anyway, here's a couple o' pics...:



















Good luck!


----------



## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

So basically, after looking at the suggestions in this thread, FR bikes that can still rip the DH are better then ever. The driver 8 was literally DESIGNED AND MADE for exactly what you are describing. 

Also on the list: 

Giant Faith (7 inch, good geo, great linkage, great manufacturing process, great warranty) 
Banshee Scythe- great company, great support, Bike does fine as a racebike if you so choose, a number of guys are running them that way. Designed with "FR" intent
Cove STD only heard good things
Knolly V-tach (nuff said, Knolly's reputation speaks for itself)
Intense 951 in the steeper higher setting (also made in the US, plus great geometry and the linkage is super plush and "FR") 

You really can't go wrong, and I'd way rather any one of those bikes then an old clunky banshee scream or something. Quit your whining, buy one, and shred it!


----------



## PsyCro (Jun 8, 2007)

Keep in mind that a lot of these bikes have 1.5" head tubes. Keep a dual crown and head angle reducer cups in the garage, and you pretty much have a DH rig when and if you really need it.


----------



## ryan_daugherty (Oct 8, 2006)

Second banshee scythe - there is a lot of adjustably with the shock position. it can be a 7" FR bike, 8" FR bike, 7" DH bike or an 8" DH bikes. Solid price point and killer company.

Also check out a Transition Blindside... very gravity do it all oriented.

































Maxle Compatible


----------



## iloveboobies (Jan 26, 2010)

Maybe a used Kona Stinky,? and then upgrade into a double crown fork?


----------



## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

maybe a DH TEAM?


----------



## HTFR (Jan 11, 2007)

WHat? No love for a Demo? Except the 2010 Demo 8, they are DH/FR rigs. I have a 2010 Demo 7 and it is fun as hell. Although it does not rip anywhere near as hard as my old Shocker. I vote Demo but if the coin is available the STD is titties.


----------



## Orange-Goblin (Jan 27, 2008)

DH throws more at a bike than anything else, so when you say "strong enough for FR abuse" i'm a little confused, the DH'ing is the thing the bike needs to handle no?

I think the line between DH and FR is a pretty blurred one. How would you define FR versus DH?

I DH on all my bikes over the last 3 years, my Orange 5 for a while(!) my Intense SS, and now my 951.

Anyway, the 951 is super strong, and i'm getting an Uzzi for the ability to DH but lighten it up for more FR/Am duties. ANd i'll be putting 203mm Fox 40's on it. I am positive its ok as Intense emailed me this last year when i was ocnidering it with Boxxers:
"Jay,

I think that this would be fine for the boxxer. It will make the head angle slacker and the bottom bracket higher than what we had planned for, but as long as you keep this in mind you should be fine with it."

So it would SEEM fine.I'd check with them first to be sure. The Uzzi really does seem like an awesome DH / FR/AM bike.


----------



## oakhills (Mar 30, 2004)

Don't forget about a Foes Fly. You can find them on ebay cheap sometimes...
Pedal-able, and DH-able..


----------



## b-kul (Sep 20, 2009)

highdelll said:


> maybe a DH TEAM?


get my vote:thumbsup:


----------



## GearTech (Mar 3, 2009)

DJ Giggity said:


> Jeff Stebber himself posted a pic of an Uzzi with a dual crown. There are also pics in the uzzi photo album with dual crowns. At 9-10lbs for a frame I think it is appropriately beefy.
> 
> I had the chance to take a short test ride on an STD with an Elka. It felt pretty good to me.


My STD with an Elka is super smooth and controlled over small, medium, big, square edged and pretty much any other bump or hit you can imagine. The Elka really opened the STD up, with a DHX 5 it wasn't nearly as supple and controlled.


----------



## kntr (Jan 25, 2004)

Small Intense 951 with the rear G3 dropouts in the lowest setting to raise the rear end and shorten the wheelbase. I use mine for everything. You could also use a flush headset to lower the front. You would have a short DH bike with close to FR geo.


----------



## NeverFree (Nov 8, 2009)

You are making to much fuss over geo.

Get an Evil Revolt.

Be like Thomas Vanderham and 'freeride' with a 64˚ HA and 13.75' bb

Or you can flip the geo chips and run it at 66˚ and 14.25 BB.

This thread is useless anyways because you aren't actually buying a bike....


----------



## BRMBA MONKEY! (Aug 9, 2007)

My vote goes for Intense 951! I have mine set with a 40 as well and since the stanchions can be moved in the crowns, travel is adjustable, and ability to shorten the rear end, these bikes have tons of adjustability. I built mine on Thursday and have spent the last three days shredding the list of trails of where I had to hold back because of the bike I was riding. Steep, flowy, rocky, wood, mud, gravel, etc. the bike has rocked them all!:thumbsup:


----------



## baltik (Nov 16, 2005)

Turner highline - one of the better pedaling big bikes despite the weight, also plenty of people run them with a dual crown


----------



## mjsca07 (Dec 30, 2005)

Cannondale Perp! I do DH trails with mine and it loves being in the air. Doesn't pedal bad either.


----------



## rongarr (Jan 27, 2009)

Santa Cruz Driver 8


----------



## mjsca07 (Dec 30, 2005)

rongarr said:


> Santa Cruz Driver 8


I do love my Perp, but I'd get a Driver 8 in a heartbeat if I had the cash.


----------



## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

railleur said:


> I also was looking @ Intense, but their website says that a dual crown on the Uzzi is a no go b/c max fork travel is 180mm. I was planning on using a Fox 40...
> 
> I've heard that the STD is a bit harsh over mid-sized hits- anyone agree with that?


get a used SoCom then


----------

