# 26650 battery pack..



## fightnut (Jul 5, 2007)

First one of these that I've seen. Thought I'd share it here with all the talk about underpowered batteries that come with the various triple xml's now.

I don't buy the specs listed, but thought it was interesting nonetheless.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

fightnut said:


> First one of these that I've seen. Thought I'd share it here with all the talk about underpowered batteries that come with the various triple xml's now.
> 
> I don't buy the specs listed, but thought it was interesting nonetheless.


It could be legit. 26650 cells are 8mm wider than 18650 cells. I've seen 4000mAh 26650 cells but I've heard there are ones with a larger capacity so these could be real. If they are, getting a nice 5000mah ( 2-cell ) set-up would be much lighter. A four cell set-up ( like the one being sold ) would be a little heavy but would be good if you really needed maximum run time. The other alternative would be to build a 10200mah battery using the Panasonic 3400mAh cells ( 18650 6-cell set-up ) I figure both would weigh about the same but the Panasonic brand name would bring a more hefty price. Hard to beat the price on that Trustfire set-up though.

Hmm....looks like that web site sells the single 5000mAh 26650 cells as well. No mention if they're protected or non-protected....interesting :ihih:


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

Thank you fightnut. Hopefully they are not built with Ultrafire cells. This could be an amazing battery pack is it's made with good cells. I hope it has protection circuitry.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

I'm tempted to buy this light. Is lt-box/lights-box.com a reputable vendor? I guess I shouldn't have to worry if I use Paypal, but I'd rather not have the hassle.


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## Infinity123 (Dec 11, 2009)

leaftye said:


> Hopefully they are not built with Ultrafire cells. This could be an amazing battery pack is it's made with good cells.


Well...a quality 4 x 26650 battery pack for $29 sounds a bit unlikely to me.


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## fightnut (Jul 5, 2007)

I agree with infinity123, at that price I really doubt the specs are accurate.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Infinity123 said:


> Well...a quality 4 x 26650 battery pack for $29 sounds a bit unlikely to me.


They're Chinese made cells. They is what they is. 

If you look on BatterySpace you will see that the best 26650 cell they sell is 4000mAh.
The Chinese seem to be the only ones selling higher capacity 26650 cells ( King Kong, Ultrafire and Trustfire 26650's ) I say go with it. Even if the capacity is a bit less than the claimed 5000mAh per cell they will still be higher than standard 18650 cells.

I'm thinking of building myself a two cell set-up using 26650's. Might work well for a helmet mounted set-up if they're not too heavy. If not it would still be great for the bars. :thumbsup:

*In the mean time if someone has a link to an 26650 cell shootout please enlighten us.*


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## Infinity123 (Dec 11, 2009)

Cat-man-do said:


> They're Chinese made cells. They is what they is.
> In the mean time if someone has a link to an 26650 cell shootout please enlighten us.[/B]


How right you are, and very chingrish










A buyer of Trustfire 26650 cells on DX wrote this:

*Cons: The capacity is much smaller than stated. I wanted to use the battery combined with a USB-adapter to charge my cellphone (samsung galaxy SII) when on the road. 5 Ah should be easily enoth to charge it twice. However, the battery manages to charge it only once, even when fully charged. I am not content with it.*

Expect perhaps only half capacity of the claimed 5000 mAh or maybe a bit more.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

Cat-man-do said:


> They're Chinese made cells. They is what they is.
> 
> If you look on BatterySpace you will see that the best 26650 cell they sell is 4000mAh.
> The Chinese seem to be the only ones selling higher capacity 26650 cells ( King Kong, Ultrafire and Trustfire 26650's ) I say go with it. Even if the capacity is a bit less than the claimed 5000mAh per cell they will still be higher than standard 18650 cells.
> ...


I'd be very happy if it was King Kong or Trustfire flames. Ultrafire has a bad rep for recycling batteries. Unless they match them before recycling them into battery pack, which is highly unlikely imo, it's a recipe for disaster.

Here's a thread about Ultrafire 26650's.
Review: UltraFire Orange 26650 5000mAH (2286mAH) | BudgetLightForum.com

Here's a longer thread about 26650's.
26650 Batteries | BudgetLightForum.com

I currently have King Kong INR's, Trustfire flames, and Keeppower protected 26650's.

A $30 battery pack with new 26650 cells does seem unlikely. It might be possible to make a slim profit with a volume purchase though. I doubt the battery pack has protection, not at that price. It would cost me around $50 to build a 4x26650 pack with protection. I suppose I'll hold off until I'm ready to build my own battery pack. I really want a 26650 battery pack.


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

I think that the market for 26650s is so small and the one for 18650s so large (especially now that they're appearing in electric car batteries), that the capacity gap between the two will get smaller and smaller as more RnD goes into 18650 cells. The gap is currently around 30% or so (NCR18650B 3400mAh to 26650 4500mAh or so) for a ~50% increase in volume.

As for the linked pack, my guess is that, for that price, you're looking at probably 2500mAh per cell, so 5Ah in total. Perhaps 5.5Ah and possibly (but unlikely) 6Ah. I'd rather go with one of the many MS batteries out there for that money instead - at least you know what you're getting.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

From the budgetlight forum is sounds like the King Kongs are playing out at their listed rating ( 4000mAh ). Not sure about the Trustfire or Ultrafire cells. No time to read about those but it should be on those links somewhere. Thanks lefttye. :thumbsup:


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

18650's may catch up in capacity, but the price will likely be much MUCH higher for a very long time. New legitimate 26650's regularly get over 4000 mah. It's the recycled and fake 26650's that don't perform as well. I've kind of said it before, but it's not the diminished capacity that bothers me, it's the mismatching that may be vastly different in terms of capacity and internal resistance. $30 for a true 6Ah would be pretty good if the cells were matched.


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## gmcttr (Oct 7, 2006)

Infinity123 said:


> ...Expect perhaps only half capacity of the claimed 5000 mAh or maybe a bit more.


Am I missing something here with the references to "claimed capacity of 5000mAh/cell"? The OP's link is to a *4* cell 10000mAh pack...10000/4=2500mAh per cell.


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## leaftye (Dec 27, 2007)

gmcttr said:


> Am I missing something here with the references to "claimed capacity of 5000mAh/cell"? The OP's link is to a *4* cell 10000mAh pack...10000/4=2500mAh per cell.


8.4V, 2S2P

For final spec, add capacity once, add voltage once.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

gmcttr said:


> Am I missing something here with the references to "claimed capacity of 5000mAh/cell"? The OP's link is to a *4* cell 10000mAh pack...10000/4=2500mAh per cell.


First, I'm not sure I can accept that as true. If these cells are only 2500mAh ( when claiming to be 5000mAh by the OEM ) then they would be true POS.

I've seen the claims on some of the cheap 18650 cells as being > 3000mAh. 
Even on those, actual rating can be as low as 2300mah so not near as bad as what some claim these cheap 26650 cells are doing. This doesn't make sense to me as 26650 cells are much bigger in size and should have no problem achieving higher capacities ( even for the cheaper made Chinese cells ).

Since I don't own any 26650 cells yet I can only speculate but my gut feeling is that if I buy a cheap 26650 Trustfire or Ultrafire cell ( LiMnNi or LiNiMnCo ) and the manufacture rating is 5000mAh per cell the actual rating shouldn't be less than 3300mAh.

Now as to those 10000mAh (4 cell ) battery packs ( or 10Ah if you may ): If the actual rating is only 8-6.6Ah, "You are still getting your money's worth" !
If you hook this battery up to your 3 x XML clone lamp and get twice the run time as on the original battery, you definitely got more than your money's worth. If the original battery ran say 1 hr and 20 minutes and you now get 2hrs and 30 minutes, while a bit disappointing, for the money you laid out this is still not a bad deal. If you get 3hrs or greater using this 10Ah battery with the tri-clones, you made out like a bandit ( for the $30 asking price )

Just don't buy batteries from E-bay vendors...never a good idea.


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## MK96 (Nov 5, 2012)

This seems to be very true, fleabay math counts 2S2P capacity by those 3XMLs as 4 x ~1100mAh cell - this is what I measured by 2 somewhat good 4400 packs.



mattthemuppet said:


> I think that the market for 26650s is so small and the one for 18650s so large (especially now that they're appearing in electric car batteries), that the capacity gap between the two will get smaller and smaller as more RnD goes into 18650 cells. The gap is currently around 30% or so (NCR18650B 3400mAh to 26650 4500mAh or so) for a ~50% increase in volume.
> 
> As for the linked pack, my guess is that, for that price, you're looking at probably 2500mAh per cell, so 5Ah in total. Perhaps 5.5Ah and possibly (but unlikely) 6Ah. I'd rather go with one of the many MS batteries out there for that money instead - at least you know what you're getting.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I picked up a 26650 flashlight over the holidays. It came with a Trustfire 5000mAh ( black and red fire ) Li-ion battery. I ran a run time test and found the battery lasted a good long time. It ran about 2.5hrs on high at which point the output was down to mid-level. At that point I stopped the test although I'm sure I could of gotten more time out of it at the lower output level. Most 18650 cells will reach that point at about 70min. ( Panasonics perhaps a bit longer ). I figure the Trustfire 5000mAh battery is somewhere around 4000-4200mAh real capacity.

I suppose if you were in the market for a high capacity Li-ion battery pack and you had a little money to burn, you might rather have a 6-cell 18650 battery built with the best Panasonic cells. If so expect to pay >$90 for a set-up like that. ( real 9300mAh using Panasonic ) If that's too much money than the 26650 batteries start to look a little better at about $30 ( for a real 8000mAh 4-cell ).


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## MK96 (Nov 5, 2012)

I think RC Lipos are the way to go with high power lights. BTW I also have 4 x 26650 - they are TFs ~4200mAh in Trustfire X100 battery. They run satisfactory long for a 50W light.



Cat-man-do said:


> I picked up a 26650 flashlight over the holidays. It came with a Trustfire 5000mAh ( black and red fire ) Li-ion battery. I ran a run time test and found the battery lasted a good long time. It ran about 2.5hrs on high at which point the output was down to mid-level. At that point I stopped the test although I'm sure I could of gotten more time out of it at the lower output level. Most 18650 cells will reach that point at about 70min. ( Panasonics perhaps a bit longer )
> I figure the Trustfire battery is somewhere around 4000-4200mAh real capacity. I suppose if you were in the market for a high capacity Li-ion battery and you had a little money to burn, you might rather have a 6-cell 18650 battery built with the best Panasonic cells. If so expect to pay >$90 for a set-up like that. ( real 9300mAh using Panasonic ) If that's too much money than the 26650 batteries start to look a little better at about $30 ( for a real 8000mAh 4-cell ).


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MK96 said:


> I think RC Lipos are the way to go with high power lights. BTW I also have 4 x 26650 - they are TFs ~4200mAh in* Trustfire X100 battery.* They run satisfactory long for a 50W light.


I had to look that up. The X100 is a torch, not a battery. Anyway, so the torch powers 7 XML's and uses 4 x 26650's. Damn, that thing must have some output. I bet it gets hot if run for over a couple minutes.


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## MK96 (Nov 5, 2012)

Sorry, yes you are right a torch :smallviolin: I just wanted to write the capacity of about 4200mAh. There is nothing higher in 26650. But in 2s2p they are still more expensive than a single Lipo.



Cat-man-do said:


> I had to look that up. The X100 is a torch, not a battery. Anyway, so the torch powers 7 XML's and uses 4 x 26650's. Damn, that thing must have some output. I bet it gets hot if run for over a couple minutes.


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## jsigone (Aug 25, 2004)

My battery pack shipped on the 3rd so hope to get it some time in the next week or so. Can't wait to blast the 3xXML the entire ride


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MK96 said:


> ...I think RC Lipos are the way to go with high power lights.


You may be right about that, particularly when it comes to multi-emitter lights that draw more than 3A. So far I've yet to take the plunge to LiPo. That's basically because the LiPo batteries that I've seen tend to be a little larger that typical 18650 battery packs. Then again if you're considering 26650 packs the Li-Po's might be the better way to go. LiPo's do require a special charger so there is that to consider too.

Sooner or later someone's gonna produce an emitter that can output a real 1500-2000 lumen. When that happens they will probably require a current draw close to 4A. With current draws in that range the Li-Po's will become the rage. :thumbsup:


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## MK96 (Nov 5, 2012)

Li-Ion (also protected) needs normally a special (hobby) charger too, if you want to charge it properly.



Cat-man-do said:


> LiPo's do require a special charger so there is that to consider too.


Is there anybody that has some 26650 holders for the light? Or do you solder them together to a 2S2P config?


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