# Short travel/4X full-sus for general play?



## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Hi!

I own and love a demo 7 with a Totem that I use for DH,FR and NS type riding.. but I want a second bike as well to use when the mountains aren´t that big or there´s no chairlift around. Well, I really like going downhill and flowing, so a short snappy bike would be a nice compliment for dirt-type tracks to the plush, but soaking demo 7.

I´m thinking along the lines of a short travel air-damped FS bike, around 100-140mm travel for this.. now I´m a bit confused if this is the way to go, and if so, what bike/frame to get..

I´ll be using it for 4X tracks when I get to some of those, general NS flow riding, some non-xc-race trail riding now and again and some dirt jumping.

My general concern is I don´t know what size to get. I´m 188cm tall with long legs which means that I don´t like as big bikes as my height says.. I ride a medium on my demo and like it, it has a 22.6" top tube. The problem is most 4X frames come in short and long, and I want something in between... don´t know but I guess I´d have to go with long and fit a short stem.

Right now I´m thinking Santa Cruz Blur 4X,

Commencal Meta 4X 









or (most likely right now) a Banshee Rampant. 
















something like that but with lighter wheels and tires. Upping the seat for pedalling, upping the fork for NS-ing, lowering both for 4X...

All probably with something like a fox rp23, pike 454 u-turn(possibly air), some semi light wheels + 2.3" tyres, xt cranks + single 36 ring +gamut guide, 25.4 bar + stem, race seat + thomson post. Not sure about rotor size, do I really save enough weight with smaller ones not to go with 8 inchers?

All help, suggestions, sizing information and bike suggestions are welcome and appreciated!


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

I´d also really like an Enduro SX(not trail), but the long has a 23.5" top tube, and I thought the 23" on my Yeti was a bit too long..









Then again, how do they measure those horizontal top tubes? Horizontal means the saddle is in the same height as the top of the head tube, right? Then when you´re standing up, you´re not that far back.

Ah darnit, I need to try out these frames for sizing but noone around here has them!!


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## daisycutter (Sep 18, 2005)

*transition double I love mine*

might be an option though I think it has around 3 inches of travel and is set up as a jump and 4x bike. You seem to want more travel perhaps a transition bottle rocket?


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

If I ever get another FS bike, I think it will be a tough short travel bike. I think the geometry of Banshee's Rampant would work well for me, or maybe even Yeti 4X. With the Yeti, I'd have to figure out where the seat would end up when raised. It might actually work for my proportions, but I suspect it would go too far back for people with very long legs


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

I run a long commencal absolut 4x and I'm 194cm seems to fit me great for general play(as you mentioned I run a short 35mm stem).. way too small for pedaling up hill for me tho..


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## Uncle Cliffy (Jul 7, 2006)

Seen the Nicolai UFO DS? They make it in 4 sizes and custom if you need it... Err posts in these forums frequently and had one. He also is a U.S. authority on Nicolai's and could tell you much more... :thumbsup:

http://www.nicolai.net/products/e-frames/e-ufo-ds.html
http://www.nicolai.net/products/sizechart/ufo-ds-size.html


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## Err (Mar 21, 2005)

Thanks Uncle Cliffy....

Yep, I rode a UFO-DS for part of last season, an absolute ripper for sure. It's strong enough to hit the bigger lines but really easy to throw around. Here's a pic while I was running a Totem Solo Air on it lowered to 140mm. Eventually, I switched to a 36 TALAS which was just about perfect for this frame. I ran mine exclusively in the 4.5" travel setting with a DHX-A. The 2:1 leverage ratio was pretty sweet, the sus took a lot more than you would expect for its stated travel.


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## Guest (Jan 4, 2008)

Another fun little bike is the Soul Cycles Matador. 100-130mm rear travel, built around a 130mm fork. Very nice build quality, Easton tubing, gorgeous welds and pretty cheap at $700.


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## Rb (Feb 28, 2007)

Foes 4x and be done with it:










2:1 Curnutt AIR
full monocoque
builds up right at 32 lbs if you're reasonable.


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## CountryBoy (Oct 24, 2006)

Westman,
I ride a medium Demo 7 and I just ordered a Medium Blur 4X for my play bike yesterday. I wanted a bike that could jump, trail ride and be used for a shorter travel freeride bike. One of my desiding points was that my bike shop sells Santa Cruz. I am going to build mine with pike so I can crank it down for hiting the Dirtjumps and put it at full travel for trail riding.


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## NorKal (Jan 13, 2005)

I love my blur 4x. I have it setup with fairly heavy wheels (similar to Azonic Outlaws) and swtich between DH and trail tires depending on mood. The whole bike weighs about 34 lbs which isn't too bad for climbing. My sherman fork switches between 4-5", also good for climbing and the nice thing about the 4x is full seatpost extesion. It makes for a rippin trail bike with it's laid back geo and low BB and handles all the abuse I can throw at it. I'm 6' tall and ride Medium. I like the short toptube compared to a longer one.

I also run very light cranks and an 8" rotor in front and 6" in the rear. Sorta a good mix between DH and XC parts.


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## -C- (Oct 26, 2006)

I'm another Blur 4X person, I use mine for everything, in fact it gets way more use than my big bike.

It absolutely rips, the bike is so much fun its untrue. Mine is built up fairly light, but strong, and really does get used & abused for everything. I cannot reccomend it enough 

Comes in just shy of 30lbs. I reckon I have maybe another 1-1.5lb I can shave off it when bits wear out too.


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## gop427 (Jan 16, 2006)

Not having ridden everything out there, and not having ton's o money, this is my "general plaything". I am a 6 foot clydesdale. This is a 17" frame. The bike fits real nice for chucking it around and I have never felt the bottom of it. I have taken it off some drops 6-7( ijust put it together last weekend, still feeling bike out) to trannys feels great. This is my two cents, not necessarily saying you should get this, there are ton's of prob better options, like the double, or the blux 4x. Forgot to mention that it is a Iron Horse MKIII frame.


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## Rover Nick (Jul 13, 2006)

How about an intense tazer or a morewood ndiza? I don't know your budget, but the Intense is a good amount of scratch though.


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## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

I wouldn't beat on a Pike 454 too hard. It's not as robust as the other two models because of the aluminum steer tube and the hollow crown. And those S-type/MTX rims are already quite light without sacrificing strength.


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## steez (Jul 24, 2004)

-C- said:


> I'm another Blur 4X person, I use mine for everything, in fact it gets way more use than my big bike.
> 
> It absolutely rips, the bike is so much fun its untrue. Mine is built up fairly light, but strong, and really does get used & abused for everything. I cannot reccomend it enough
> 
> Comes in just shy of 30lbs. I reckon I have maybe another 1-1.5lb I can shave off it when bits wear out too.


Ditto, ditto, ditto.... Since OP's legs are long, the ability to use a long seatpost will help pedalling too. I am 6', and riding a medium....

P.S. that bike looks familliar! great taste, my man.


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## daisycutter (Sep 18, 2005)

*Taco Bell !!!!!*

Yum Yum


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## gop427 (Jan 16, 2006)

daisycutter said:


> Yum Yum


I love my Taco Bell!:thumbsup: :band:


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## dd13 (Oct 6, 2005)

jamis parker,transition preston fr


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

custom geometry, sick looking bike, dece cheap for being pretty much fully custom frame geo and paint and brad is just a sweet person


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## JMH (Feb 23, 2005)

*Corsair*

I think you are a candidate for a König. 22.4 top tube for the regular or 23.2 for the long, and even that isn't very long for a big guy. I have ridden the regular a few times with the adjustable travel fork dialed to about 130mm and it feels really snappy, like my street bike. If I planned to DJ it or wanted a radical little bike, I would go Regular. (I am 6' with long legs). I am going to get a Long and put a fixed-150 mm fork on it for more general purpose use when the frames hit the States. I think for 4X the long with a 120mm fork might be the ticket for you depending on your geo preference. Will still have a nice short wheelbase and compact fit.


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## mrpercussive (Apr 4, 2006)

Ibex Atlas... XD
http://ibexbikes.com/Bikes/ATLAS-PRO-FRM-Details.html


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## The Dude (Jan 19, 2004)

hardtail? or you set on FS?


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## el_chupo_ (Nov 15, 2005)

mine is an 06 with the horst link, but in 07 and 08 they have the derelict and the dissident.

https://brodiebikes.com/2008/2008_bikes/derelict.php

This is the 08 bike, the "long" size has a 22.8 TT, about what mine is. Great riding bike, check out sick lines for a review of last years model.

When I was looking I was thinking of the blur 4x, the Soulcycle Matador, and now I would also be seriously considering the Parker from Jamis. but sizing sucks on the parker.

good luck


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## Freerydejunky (Sep 21, 2006)

mrpercussive said:


> Ibex Atlas... XD
> http://ibexbikes.com/Bikes/ATLAS-PRO-FRM-Details.html


I dont think that applies here. 
That would be a 5" TRAIL bike. Not 4x or slope style.


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## TWISTED (Feb 13, 2004)

This is what I'd get, Jamis Parker. BANG for the BUCK. 
$2325 complete!










https://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/08_bikes/08parker3.html


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## gopher1079 (Nov 28, 2007)

being a shorter dude and having spent alot of time on the brodie dissident, blur 4x and a intense tazer. I would say go for the blur there rad bikes and the medium felt a bit big for me. Dont count the brodie out though that bike was alot of fun and certainly worth another look espeically at its price point


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Thanks for all the replies guys! 

The UFO DS is a sweet frame but it´s a bit too heavy for my target weight, as I´d like to do some 4X-ing on the bike as well. The Jamis bike I don´t like the look of.

But the Brodie and Matador are great tips. Will have to look further into those.

It still sounds like the Blur 4X is the most sensible choice. Just a shame I´d like a frame that´s in between the two sizes available..


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## downhiller12345 (Jun 4, 2007)

bottle rocket


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## -C- (Oct 26, 2006)

mkrobert81 said:


> bottle rocket


A frame that weighs as much as most DH bikes but with none of the benefits doesn't sound like much fun to me.


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## combatkimura (Jul 17, 2007)

You're wrong about that. It sure as hell doesn't feel heavy and if you have a lighter wheelset and run tubeless you would be amazed how nimble they are. A Transition Double might be a better choice though for your 4X needs as it runs a shorter fork and a steeper HTA.

UFO-DS is amazing, Matador is quite similar in design.


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## ryan_daugherty (Oct 8, 2006)

this would probably be one of my choices.. yeti quality is pretty hard to match.


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## ender (Jan 12, 2004)

I have a Bottle Rocket that I built up to do just about everything however I mostly use it for trail riding. BTW you can easily build up a BR so it's not so heavy but, it will cost you. Mine is 33.5lbs.


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## Rover Nick (Jul 13, 2006)

Isn't the frame weight of a BR like 9lbs or something? Sure you can build it to be 33lbs, but the same build on something more reasonable would probably be ~30 or under

But I must say that I am digging the red lowers of that pike


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## CountryBoy (Oct 24, 2006)

I just got my blur 4x frame today! 6.4 pounds of railin' machine!


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## ryan_daugherty (Oct 8, 2006)

Rover Nick said:


> Isn't the frame weight of a BR like 9lbs or something? Sure you can build it to be 33lbs, but the same build on something more reasonable would probably be ~30 or under


I like TBCo. a lot, but i'm going to have to agree w/ Rover Nick.

That Foes 4x frame and build sure are pretty.. also i'm digging the corsair frame a lot.. too bad it has that 55 on'er .. a lowered 36 or lyrik would be fly. Or a Pike would be rad.


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## crosskiller42 (Apr 1, 2007)

if you want to go for something a little bit more travel i would suggest getting a versus blitz. there super fun snapy bikes, because there desigined for slopestyle, and dirt jumping. its a 170mm travel and can handel anything that you throw at it, also as you can see it is an uninterupted seat tube so it can go up for climbing and down for mobing. i have run this bike for a little over a year now and it has never failed me in any race crosscountry or downhill


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## -C- (Oct 26, 2006)

Rover Nick said:


> Isn't the frame weight of a BR like 9lbs or something? Sure you can build it to be 33lbs, but the same build on something more reasonable would probably be ~30 or under
> 
> But I must say that I am digging the red lowers of that pike


9lbs with a very light air shock, more like 9.5 with a DHX Air & the wrong side of 10 with a coil.



> You're wrong about that. It sure as hell doesn't feel heavy and if you have a lighter wheelset and run tubeless you would be amazed how nimble they are.


That sounds like a standard response for a heavy frame "oh, but it rides light".

It might be nimble, but it's never going to be as nimble as a frame with similar geometry, that weights nearly 4lbs less to start with.

I don't think you can go wrong with a Blur 4X or Yeti 4X. Maybe even a Meta 4X, but i'm not sure on the weight of one of those...


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Yeah, the Bottle rocket is a fun bike, but too heavy for my needs. The blitz is too heavy and too much travel.

I´m looking to go around the 31lb mark, should be fairly easy to achieve with either the Yeti 4X, Blur 4X, meta 4X or the Rampant. Now I just need to figure out this whole effective top tube game. My demo 7 has 22.6" which feels right, if a little short. So 22.6-23 would be ideal. The yeti for instance has 23.5, will this be too long, or is it just because the saddle is far back and not noticed when standing up?


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Yeti lists the seat tube angle as 71 degrees. I _assume_ that is from BB to seat post at head tube level. That is not extreme. Getting the seat much higher would put it further back. Not sure how high you can go before you run out of seat rails to keep the seat in a good pedaling position.

One issue people seem to have with the Yeti is that you do not have a lot of room for seat height adjustment, without a telescoping post at least.


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## -C- (Oct 26, 2006)

westman said:


> Yeah, the Bottle rocket is a fun bike, but too heavy for my needs. The blitz is too heavy and too much travel.
> 
> I´m looking to go around the 31lb mark, should be fairly easy to achieve with either the Yeti 4X, Blur 4X, meta 4X or the Rampant. Now I just need to figure out this whole effective top tube game. My demo 7 has 22.6" which feels right, if a little short. So 22.6-23 would be ideal. The yeti for instance has 23.5, will this be too long, or is it just because the saddle is far back and not noticed when standing up?


You will easily get it around the 30lbs mark, mine is built out of the spare parts bin & other than the wheels I have made no effort to save weight (XT/Atlas level stuff) & it's comfortably under 30lbs.

I think if I really tried, I could get it knocking around the 25lb mark. Maybe later this year


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## cdn_rider (Dec 11, 2006)

cove hustler








i put the mrp guide back on after the pic ... such a sweet do all bike 5inch travel and it jumps so well .. and kills it on the pump track with pearl on the back set at half lock out


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## idrunk (Oct 19, 2007)

my buddy loves his intense 6.6. he has it built up with a fox 36 and rails on it.


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## Iggz (Nov 22, 2006)

YUS!


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## dd13 (Oct 6, 2005)

how do you like the mkIII the way its set up?it looks sick.ive ridden one on the trails,almost bought one but decided i needed a new ss instead.any problems with durability yet or notice anything that could become a problem in the future?


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

i have a demo 7 as well and opted for the transition double for basically the same reasons u want a 4x bike...i wanted some that i could just take out and rip on, dj with, and 4x

it has the top tube u want i think

Top Tube (Effective) 22.2"/563.88mm (short) 23.0"/584.2mm (long)
Top Tube (Actual) 21.5"/546.1mm (short) 22.25"/565.15mm (long


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## yomattyo (Dec 20, 2007)

Anyone ever use and Spesh Enduro for something like this? the Expert has teh 36 talas and DHX 5.0 on it... just curious. have one on order for similar purpose, but less 4x more Trail/light freeride doing skinnies and small drops. should be in the 30-32 lb range...feedback?


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

i just ordered an enduro pro for the same purpose, but expect it to be like 31-33 stock

putting a lower stroke and i2i shock on the rear will lower the travel to 140 and change the geo up a bit, that and a lowered travel 36 talas would prolly be a good 4x and trail bike


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## yomattyo (Dec 20, 2007)

scorp, any plans for new components on it? i've been planning on a shortening the stem and need to decide on a good set of platforms, but was planning on riding it stock other than that. I ordered the Expert. I'm thinking about getting a TBC temple stem, mainly cuz i love TBC, but can't afford a preston atm.... Just curious as to your plans for makin' it a more FR-style machine.


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

pipes10 said:


> i have a demo 7 as well and opted for the transition double for basically the same reasons u want a 4x bike...i wanted some that i could just take out and rip on, dj with, and 4x
> 
> it has the top tube u want i think
> 
> ...


I do like the look, travel and sizing of that bike, however I saw some weight figures over at sicklines.com and my only nag about this bike is that it´s a bit heavy. Weighs more like a 6" frame than a 4X one. It´s not strange however since it´s a DJ frame..

How have you built yours up, how´s it ride and how much does it weigh? Do you have any pictures?

thx
/W


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## danyiluska (Sep 20, 2006)

I saw a Jamis Parker LIVE at a shop and it's soo nice and beefy!


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

coil shock is all it would need to make it a fr machine


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

westman said:


> I do like the look, travel and sizing of that bike, however I saw some weight figures over at sicklines.com and my only nag about this bike is that it´s a bit heavy. Weighs more like a 6" frame than a 4X one. It´s not strange however since it´s a DJ frame..
> 
> How have you built yours up, how´s it ride and how much does it weigh? Do you have any pictures?
> 
> ...


haven't even received the bike yet...it should be delivered to my place next week....i chose the freeride single ring kit from the transition site, rock shox pike 454 air u-turn, rp23 shock...it should be around 33lbs with that build but u can easily shed weight with lighter wheels, tires, tubes/tubeless


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## Rover Nick (Jul 13, 2006)

Given that it is a DJ and needs to stand up to regularly cased doubles, 7.7lbs W/O shock seems kinda portly, especially since the blindside frame is less than a pound heavier(ignoring the different shocks that are used).


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## patch-rik (Aug 28, 2006)

another option for custom steel: 

swdracing.com

check out the 6-gun, priced at around a grand, 5.5 travel, and whatever geo you want. Mine should be coming in soon.


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## Iggz (Nov 22, 2006)

dd13 said:


> how do you like the mkIII the way its set up?it looks sick.ive ridden one on the trails,almost bought one but decided i needed a new ss instead.any problems with durability yet or notice anything that could become a problem in the future?


If that was my bike, I would be stoked.


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Pipes10 : I doubt you´ll achieve that weight since the transition kit comes with fairly heavy crankset and wheelset.. but still, it´d be interesting to hear from you as you build it up!

I e-mailed santa cruz and banshee yesterday asking for complete frame weights with rear shock for the blur 4x and the rampant frames, and the blur 4x med is 6.4lbs including rp23 shock. Haven´t received reply yet from banshee... however a fair bit over 7 lbs for the transition double without shock seems kind of too much.

At the moment I´m in favour of a Blur 4X in anodized silver since it´s got VPP, a good amount of travel, and it seems fairly easy to achieve a 31lbs build with it. But that will probably sway a few times before I make my decision...


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## KavuRider (Sep 22, 2004)

*I 2nd this*



sixsixtysix said:


> Another fun little bike is the Soul Cycles Matador. 100-130mm rear travel, built around a 130mm fork. Very nice build quality, Easton tubing, gorgeous welds and pretty cheap at $700.


Soul Cycles Matador.
I just built up the one in the picture.

Something to keep in mind...these bikes are going to be super stiff and not very forgiving...Its been eye-opening for me. They have just enough suspension to save you, but not enough to cushion you. So the ride is going to be harsher than you are used to. After a session of dirt jumping, my arms and legs were sore from having to suck up some of the impacts (I suck at DJ'ing...) that my bigger bike would eat up.

The Matador is awesome - I have mine built with a Pike coil and a Roco R Air shock, 5x5. It just loves to fly and its super stable in the air.


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## Evil4bc (Apr 13, 2004)

scorpionsf said:


> custom geometry, sick looking bike, dece cheap for being pretty much fully custom frame geo and paint and brad is just a sweet person


Ahhhh SICK! I was just gonna post pic's of my bike :thumbsup: 
Thanks for the props on my personal rig and the kind words !!
Stay tuned we got something new in store for that section of the bike market .
-Brad


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## Rover Nick (Jul 13, 2006)

How about some more info on that double agent? Price, stock geo, travel....stuff like that.


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## tibug (Dec 5, 2006)

I think this is what you're looking for....:thumbsup: *Mountain Cycle Battery*














































I have no clue when it will be available. Visit the MC forum and talk to TWISTED, he'll have the answer for you.

Tim


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

no problem brad


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## ianinco (Jan 19, 2006)

The Giant Boys, I believe, are riding Trance's. I am going to build one up for that exact reason with a 36 Talas and Mavic SX wheels


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## tibug (Dec 5, 2006)

TWISTED said:


> This is what I'd get, Jamis Parker. BANG for the BUCK.
> $2325 complete!
> 
> 
> ...


Holy crap dude, that's insane.   I work for a shop that deals Jamis, and I was very interested in the Parker, but figured it would be at least on the upper end of 3 grand, so I didn't even ask. With the employee discount, that'll be cheap as a 60 year old prostitute!

I might actually be able to buy 2 bikes this summer, a Haro Forum Pro Lite, and a Parker. That would be sweet...

Tim


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## Evil4bc (Apr 13, 2004)

Rover Nick said:


> How about some more info on that double agent? Price, stock geo, travel....stuff like that.











Price is $1800 for the frame 
Stock geo:
68.5 HA
71.5 SA
22.50TT
17.0 rear stays 
12.5 standover


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## Rover Nick (Jul 13, 2006)

Evil4bc said:


> Price is $1800 for the frame
> Stock geo:
> 68.5 HA
> 71.5 SA
> ...


What about the 'custom' part, what kinda things can you change, how much more does custom geo cost?


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## dd13 (Oct 6, 2005)

the battery is sick,but im not sure if im feeling the cnc'd seat tube/downtube junction...back on topic,of all the bikes listed, you cant beat the parker for the price.the spec on that thing is awesome


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## mjw (Feb 26, 2007)

*Transition Double!*


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## tibug (Dec 5, 2006)

dd13 said:


> the battery is sick,but im not sure if im feeling the cnc'd seat tube/downtube junction...back on topic,of all the bikes listed, you cant beat the parker for the price.the spec on that thing is awesome


I second the Parker, now that I've had a revelation. If I have enough money after I buy my bmx, the Parker is where it's at.:thumbsup: I don't know man, the cnc right at the most critical area of the frame stress wise is a little sketch, but I trust Mountain Cycle made sure it could handle what it was built for. Maybe just be be safe we should wait until '09 to see if MC has smoothed out all the kinks (not that I know of any ) in their new super hot Battery.


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

RN
it costs the same
the frame can be for a dj fork like the pic brad put up or a 160mm fork like the one put up
the st, tt, and bb heights and lengths can be adjusted for the most part
brad also has a build kit with a 55 tst2, a fly headset, and nem pro bars and stem for $2500 which is a killer deal


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## dd13 (Oct 6, 2005)

the double looks alot better with the shock mount on the top tube


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

westman said:


> Pipes10 : I doubt you´ll achieve that weight since the transition kit comes with fairly heavy crankset and wheelset.. but still, it´d be interesting to hear from you as you build it up!
> 
> I e-mailed santa cruz and banshee yesterday asking for complete frame weights with rear shock for the blur 4x and the rampant frames, and the blur 4x med is 6.4lbs including rp23 shock. Haven´t received reply yet from banshee... however a fair bit over 7 lbs for the transition double without shock seems kind of too much.
> 
> At the moment I´m in favour of a Blur 4X in anodized silver since it´s got VPP, a good amount of travel, and it seems fairly easy to achieve a 31lbs build with it. But that will probably sway a few times before I make my decision...


was going by the transition website...i don't have a scale but i will try to weigh the bike when i get it


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## atomicAdam (Sep 19, 2005)

sixsixtysix said:


> Another fun little bike is the Soul Cycles Matador. 100-130mm rear travel, built around a 130mm fork. Very nice build quality, Easton tubing, gorgeous welds and pretty cheap at $700.


+1 :thumbsup:

I was going to sell mine cause I need the $$$$ - but then my other bike broke and I was riding my Matador again and it is freaking wonderful little ripper that is super cheap!


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## atomicAdam (Sep 19, 2005)

KavuRider said:


> Soul Cycles Matador.
> I just built up the one in the picture.
> 
> Something to keep in mind...these bikes are going to be super stiff and not very forgiving...Its been eye-opening for me. They have just enough suspension to save you, but not enough to cushion you. So the ride is going to be harsher than you are used to. After a session of dirt jumping, my arms and legs were sore from having to suck up some of the impacts (I suck at DJ'ing...) that my bigger bike would eat up.
> ...


I've had no problems like that on mine. You might want to check your rear shox set up. Mine is stiff, but has never felt super stiff. You might want to drop your spring rate by 50lbs or get something other than a Roco Air. Maybe something w/ a coil would help you out.


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

well here's the final build (for now)

'08 double frame
rp23 (stock)
pike 454 air u-turn (stock)
transition revolution wheelset with red hubs (stock)
truvativ team dh bar
thomson x4 50mm stem
thomson elite post
sram pg 990 11-32 cassette (red)
nevegal stick e 2.5" front
nevegal dtc 2.35" rear
juicy 7 (stock)
hussefelt crankset (stock)
maxxis ultralite tubes
transition stepdown pedals (stock)
transition freeride saddle (stock)
sram x9 rear der (stock)
sram x9 shifter (stock)

with the above build weight = 33.95 lbs (stock was 37.02 lbs)


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## scabrider (Oct 3, 2004)

foes 4x would be sick...


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## ianinco (Jan 19, 2006)

I don't think that anyone has said it yet but the Trance would be awesome. They are cheap, strong, light and pedal super well


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## nitzer (Apr 27, 2005)

I just got a GT I-Drive 5 4.0 frame, I'm building it up with some Freeride gear to use as my 4X / Trail bike

I gots:
Marz Z1 Freeride III Set at 130mm
Fox Van R
Azonic Outlaws (white)
and white E.13 SRS

Now I just got to put it together... :madman:


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Hasn't anybody mentioned Banshee Wildcard?

I suppose you can call it short travel in the 5" position. And it should make a good play bike.


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## Nut! (Nov 2, 2007)

Yeti 4X...


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## builttoride (Jan 15, 2007)

Banshee Rampant 4X
VF4B linkage, 100mm travel, tight geo and angles and great ride.










some info and a few pics

a little vid of a guys first ride.


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## nitzer (Apr 27, 2005)

builttoride said:


> Banshee Rampant 4X
> VF4B linkage, 100mm travel, tight geo and angles and great ride.
> 
> 
> ...


Sick.:thumbsup:


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## mravery (Dec 28, 2007)

Rover Nick said:


> Isn't the frame weight of a BR like 9lbs or something? Sure you can build it to be 33lbs, but the same build on something more reasonable would probably be ~30 or under
> 
> But I must say that I am digging the red lowers of that pike


Oh ya, because there are a hell of a lot of abusable 5.5-6 pound fs frames out there, right?

A BR is 1 -1.5 pounds heavier than most of the other comparable frames out there. Not 3 or more pounds.


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## mravery (Dec 28, 2007)

CountryBoy said:


> I just got my blur 4x frame today! 6.4 pounds of railin' machine!


air or coil?


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## BikeSATORI (Mar 20, 2004)

Turner flux 4X.... may not take the same abuse as a TBC Double, but may be a nice ingredient in your recipe for lightweight flickability.
I had a Turner Rail for awhile, but they are tough to find now, and a couple #'s heavier than what you may be looking for, not to mention you can only run a stub seatpost.

I think the Meta would be a very smooth option too. I rode the XC 4.2 version when I was in Japan not too long ago, one with the new larger stiffer single stay swing-arm... Very clean bike. ...did they not incorporate that new swing-arm into the new 4X as well??

That MkIII looks SICK too.
I've still got an old '04 Hollowpoint 15" dw-link frame laying around too, you've actually inspired me to break it out and rebuild her, haha! Pretty good geo. numbers too if I remember correctly...

Trance looks like a decent option as well, but more on the trail side of things I would think, or like more disposable 4X, not stout DJ.

Cove looks sick, but I wish they would ditch the easton RAD tubing, it may have been rad a number of years back, not so much now IMO. Does that frame have the bb-centric pivot like the g-spot had??


...been hearing a lot of buzz around mongoose's supposed come-back too, might be interesting to check out their new offerings.... can't tell you anything first hand though, never ridden any of the Pacific products yet.

and (speaking of Dorel owned companies) nobody mentioned the Prophet MX, just another option in the category....


just comes down to getting some time on these various bikes here and comparing, or just crunching numbers in your head and playing russian roullette with your purchase based on our loose opinions here, haha!


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## Iggz (Nov 22, 2006)

Evil4bc said:


> Price is $1800 for the frame
> Stock geo:
> 68.5 HA
> 71.5 SA
> ...


Holy crap that is freaking amazing! :thumbsup: 

Couldn't you get away with shorter stays? 17" seems a bit long. Also, how much travel is that? like 4" or so ? Damn, I want that.


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## scorpionsf (Nov 16, 2006)

its 5", and its a ventana rear end so there prolly isnt much leeway in the stay length, pretty much fully customizable too


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Update : 

I´m 6´1 and got an offer to trade my Yeti frame for a Preston FR in size M. Most of you guys my height seem to ride Large and I do think the top tube sounds a bit short at 22.4". I´m not at all bothered with seat post height, the length is the only concern here(I´m not going to climb steep anyway, it´s going to be a single ring setup) My DH bike is 22.6 and feels a bit short with 40mm stem, but good for rull on DH. For 4X / general play FR with some single track, will a M with a 60/70mm stem do me good, or should I splash out and get a new frame with around a 23" top tube instead?

It´s a bit heavy but I´ll get it cheap, a third of the price compared to a new frame. With an air shock it should be a fun bike, if it´s not too short that is..


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Tried a friends bike and came to the conclusion that the preston is too short. Back to the drawing board.

Currently it´s the da bomb da pukka, blur 4x, rampant or double frames which I can get hold of.

Man those Jamis Parkers and Brodies look good but I haven´t found them in Europe..?


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## gop427 (Jan 16, 2006)

Just made an upgrade to mine. I put a Marzocchi 120mil-160mil AM1 SL on it. One pic is the fork at 120 and the other is at 160.

By the way, I am 6 foot and have long legs and a short torso. The frame is a 17" and I love the sizing on this bike. I tend to like a longer TT.


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## PaintPeelinPbody (Feb 3, 2004)

Prophet MX?










You could probably find one cheap.


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## Bolym (Jun 11, 2007)

I'm in for another vote for the Blur 4X. I'm 6ft tall and ride a large, which is absolutely perfect for pretty much any riding you could ever want. I use mine for XC, FR, DJ, DH, AM absolutely everything. 
And it's pretty light too, mine's a heavy ass build and it weighs around 33lbs. Could get it sub 30lb with a few changes.


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## westman (Jul 13, 2007)

Now I´ve made my buy. I ended up making a sweet deal on a frame not mentioned here at all. A cannondale prophet with a Fox Float shock. Weighs in at a nice 2.7kg with shock and should build up as a nice light and fun righ with a 454 air u-turn pike. Thanks for the input!


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## EDizzleVR6 (Oct 4, 2007)

FYI:
jensonusa is selling a complete EASTERS 4X bike with 140mm travel and single pivot shock in the rear for $999


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## recycle127 (Nov 15, 2007)

pipes10 said:


> well here's the final build (for now)
> 
> '08 double frame
> rp23 (stock)
> ...


Sweet ride! I seen your bike on Pink Bike. what size rotor are you running in the front 7 or an 8?


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

recycle127 said:


> Sweet ride! I seen your bike on Pink Bike. what size rotor are you running in the front 7 or an 8?


thanks...it's an 8" up front...it also has a gamut bash guard and atomlab aircorp pedals on it now


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