# I have added some Seoul to my Cateye Double Shot Edit and Triple Shot



## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

I have written it up on candlepowerforums

here is the link.

like I say in the thread its untested long term, so do at your own risk.

they are a load brighter though.

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Its dark enough to do some phots for comparisonmns between the stock tripleshot and the seouled double shot. Same battery used for both lights. Lightr is shining on white ceiling 7 foot or so above bed. Camera and light on bed.

Stock Tripleshot 1/50th F2.8


Seoul Doubleshot 1/50th F2.8

Stick Tripleshot 1/100th F2.8

Seould Double Shot 1/100th F2.8

The double has a bigger brighter spot. I need to charge both batteries, but It lookes like the double is as good at flood too now.

The colour is more blue than the greeny tint the K2s I put in had.

Stu


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## Low_Rider (Jan 15, 2004)

Very nice work Stu! 

I’ve been wondering if someone would do this mod since that thread here on MTBR a while back. It's nice to see someone take the plunge and get it done! :thumbsup:

You mention a “ringy” beam and although it seems to be a common trait of the CatEye optics, I have found that the SSC P4’s don’t seem to work overly well with optics in general. Some are better then others however. A nice textured reflector will help blend things nicely, and create a much smoother light. Finding reflectors with the right profile and physical dimensions for your needs would probably be a challenge though.

Have you tried running your meter in series with the emitters to see if the controller still behaves in terms of drive current with the different emitter forward voltage? It likely wouldn’t have changed, but just out of interest. 

So is your Triple Shot next to hit the operation table? 

Dave.


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Hey Stu, Any chance of seeing the shots on a trail or just outdoors. 

Anybody else change optics on a Niterider MiNewt. Also, does anyone know if Niterider offers an upgrade or plans to.

MB


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## Y-Wrench (Jan 9, 2007)

New MiNewt coming from niterider, "twice as bright, half the voltage draw." But you didn't hear it from me


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

WOOHOO!!!!!!!!!!

You didn't hear that from me.(LOL)

Thanks.

MB


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Low_Rider said:


> Very nice work Stu!
> 
> I've been wondering if someone would do this mod since that thread here on MTBR a while back. It's nice to see someone take the plunge and get it done! :thumbsup:
> 
> ...


Thanks Dave.

I am hoping to do the Triple soon, possibly today if I pull my thumb out hehe. I will measure the optics dimensions when I pull that one apart. I have a few reflectors, non are the right size unfortunatly without more serious mods.

I didn't measure the current, I will try an think of a way to get a meter inline to check it..The Vfs at 700mA aren't that disimilar for the lux 3 and seoul though. The seouls is a bit lower. Goping on the data sheets

mb323323 - I will try and borrow my mates tripod and take some out door shots. I am recovering from a broken leg so it won't be a trail shot. I will have propbably modded the triple by the time I do that so the comparison photos will be different to the wall shots posted.So the photos will have less meaning ( a camera can be set make a light look amazing or bad), I will do the same ceiling ahot though to show how the triple has improved to help with that.

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Just a word of warning 

I just started on my triple which is virgin. The black screws are some sort of alloy of cheese. So be careful not to strip the heads out. 

Stu


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## msxtr (Dec 10, 2006)

Excellent job!!!!!!!!! are a form easy to upgrade the light with a little money.

Enjoy it!!!!!

Cheers - Saludos!!!!!!!!

msxtr


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

msxtr said:


> Excellent job!!!!!!!!! are a form easy to upgrade the light with a little money.
> 
> Enjoy it!!!!!
> 
> ...


Cheers chap. Its abit fiddly, but a very good improvement in light for not much money.

I just finished the triple. It was abit more of a fiddle this one. I striped the black scres heads. They seemd to be made of cheese and threadlocked in. In the double the silver ones also hold the LEDs against the rear, So I drilled out the black ones and kept the screw shaft to keep everything alined. This did mean I couldn't get the bigger plastic piece out. I gor the LEDs out and left the big bit in. I decided to use multstrand insulated wire instead of the bendy wire so everythin was more manouverable (to make the bodge easier . Couple of hours later I have a nitroed triple.

I have leant something too. The flood is not proviided by the optics...all the optics are the same. The flood on the outside LEDs on the triple is provided by the frosting on the front glass.

Which is a little unfortunate as it measn you can't swap between the triple and double.

Before I would say the double was brighter than the stock triple...now the seouled triple is noticable brighter than the seouled double. 

The triple is no more ringy than before I would say. I will take similar beam shots as before tonight.

Edit I didn't take phots....but its the same kinda thing as the double.

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Here is a beamshot of the triple


This is at 1/100th of a second exposure and F2.8

significantly brighter than stock 

I did some static runs today. the lights gets as warm as it did before (by feel) when not in moving air. I observed some temperature related dimming. the unit was probably 50 Celcius (guess). I have heard that seouls are quite temperature sensitive. I would guess it was still a fair bit brighter than stock.

I will do a soak but with the unit being blown on by a fan simulating riding and update you.

I just found trhe oversize bar clamp that comes with the triple....my crutchs are about the same diamerter as an over size bar.....so I fitted it hehe. Might take a piccy of it tomorrow 

Stu


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## [email protected] (Jan 4, 2004)

Nice. I like the whiter color as well.


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Nice. I like the whiter color as well.


Yeah I like the colour too. Especially against the k2s I had in the double before, these were quite green.

I haven't had chance to compare to my trailtech hid yet. Its on my bike hund up from the ceiling. Next time a mate comes around I might ask them to pull it down for me. Hopefully they are more similar in output and colour. I still use the the HID with the double as I need to be able to swap lights at races for run time. The HID should have a harder time drowning the double out now.

Edit mode on - I forgot to say....I soak tested the triple using the fan, it ran perfectly fine for 2 hours. It started gettiing a bit dim due to the battery at this stage. I will try again tonight with a freh battery to check. The original figure says it shoudl run for 3.3 hours. The LED voltage should be thee same. Even so, there isn't much head room above the battery voltage with three leds and its hgoing into unregulated mode. I am nort sure I ever used the triple for 2 hours straight before with out recharging, I used to use the HID more which I have 2 batteries for. I will ask my mate to do a similar test with his stock triples to see if its a new feature hehe. I know its the battery as I quickly swapped the doubles battery on and all was bright again.

I am tempted to try it with my LiIons and buck puck. I can try em at 1 amp then. whoich in theory should be 25% brighter. If I can find a source for the double shot extnebsions to chop up I'll try it. This will have greater voltage headroom also.

Edit mode off

Check out the new light testing rig hehe










I haven't tried it yet....but I might if I go to my mates house up the road later in the week ....offroad at least. If I use it on the pavement I will annoy cars as a tilt the crutch back when I move it forward. I need to see whre I am going arounf the back of his flat (unlit steps and narrow path), I usually have a small torch in my mouth dribbling...it ain't pretty.

Stu


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## akashra (Dec 30, 2006)

Are these new modded LEDs regulated LEDs (like are used in the Cateye Doubleshot pro/Tripleshot pro and Princeton Tec Switchbacks), or just standard LEDs which will drop off over time?


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

akashra said:


> Are these new modded LEDs regulated LEDs (like are used in the Cateye Doubleshot pro/Tripleshot pro and Princeton Tec Switchbacks), or just standard LEDs which will drop off over time?


LEDs are driven by the original/standard controller circuit mounted on the battery which regulates to 700mA. I wan't aware the Pro LEDS were regulating themselves. I haven't got the pro, but I imagined its very similar in setiup. Unregulated LEDs, Current regulating circuit and battery. I haven't seen a self regulating high power LED (not saying they don't exist) except fror drop in bulb replacements for mag lights and so on.

I haven't properly investigated the dimming at the end of run of the triple yet. But like I said, I believe its due to the battery voltage dropping low enough for it to bo longer posible to drive 700mA. So the current drops off.
Some lights do quote their run time down to half brightness even if they are constant brightness for a good chunck of time (in regulated mode). I will get my mate to run his stock triple to see if its just my modded ones, if it is I need to check its not dues to a slightly high resistance somewhere or just that the Vf of LED is actually higher than stated..

I will do sa similar burn time test on the double soon. I have used this a fair bit, so know that it didn't dim much at the end of its charge before flashing (low bat warning).

Update, I have just ordered a couple of extension leads. I will use these to check the drive voltage and currents with the stock controller. I will also make a setup with a buck puck on my Lithium Ions at upto 1 Amp (will post beam shots at 1 Amp).

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

I Think...I say think....it need investigating...but

I have some IMS reflectors, one of them might fit...i think its the 20mm one.

If it fits it will be luck....the diamter is spot on. when placed on top of the LED with the reflectors legs chopped off and with all the plastic cateye pieces inside still is prodrudes out the front of the light....by what look like the thickness off the clamping plastic piece....hopefully the protrusion is slightly more, i mean fracion of a mm. Tomorrow I will try removing the top plastic piece that clamped the LED in and see if the reflector can be used to clamp the LED in with the gasket acting as an nice firm but compressible compression holding the LED against the back.

With the cateye plastic pieces inside still the LED doesn't sit far enough into the reflector.

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

looks like the seoul and ims 20 are a perfect fit in the cateye. I did a "blink" test. I only have one IMS 20 so I put the stock in the other (Not perferct as the plastic pieces were removed) but the IMS is so smooth, hardly ringy at all, I would say they are less lossy too. Possibly becaue more the refelector is over the LED and catching more light. The stock set up is shaded around the circumference slightly by the top plastic part (I need to call them other than pieces hehe) 

With the IMS legs clipped off it was a perfect fit with it slightly poking out the front of the light allowing the rubber gasket to compress against it.

I have ordered a bunch. Hopefully next week I will have more beam shots.

Stu


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## 6thElement (Jul 17, 2006)

Y-Wrench said:


> New MiNewt coming from niterider, "twice as bright, half the voltage draw." But you didn't hear it from me


Is this it:
http://www.niterider.com/prod_minewt.shtml

Or is there a new revision coming?


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

6thElement said:


> Is this it:
> http://www.niterider.com/prod_minewt.shtml
> 
> Or is there a new revision coming?


Nope. That's the old Minewt. Luxeons. The new one should have crees or seouls.

I'm waiting.

MB


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

I didn't realise 20mm reflectors were pretty much standard in size. 

I have gone a bit reflector crazy to find out what works best. I have ordered some IMS 20, MCR20 (Seoul and non Seoul versions) and the Khatod wide and narrow beams.

Hoping to oreder a couple of nFlex controllers too so I can try them at 1 amp on my Lithium bats I have already. I didn't realise the nFlex has a low voltage warning...which is awesome on litiums.

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Update

I have my Khatod reflectors. My IMS and McR ones have been sitting in customs....should be here tomorrow. I had to pay 8.50 tax and 13 quid to parcel force for the privilege of them handling it.

So far I am impressed withthe kahtod ones....nice beams and fit like a glove.

For the triple so far my favourite beam (on a wall at least...need out door tests still) is to use 1 wide in the middle (through the clear part of the lens) and run to spots on the outside (under the frosted bits). This gives a nice flood, but with a big soft hot spot. the hot spot is atleast as big as my HID and actually blends better into the spill than the HID. The Spill is brighter than the HID, but the diameter of the spill is smaller than the HID. I think this is shading due to the housing. The HID spill diam is much biigger than needed though.

In the double I think narow angle reflectors works well. Hot spot is tighter than triple, but there is still a brighter flood than the HID....again the spill diameter is smaller that the HID....but this isn't critical for helmet use.

should I have measured the voltage and current output from the stock contreoller on the triple. Output sithe factory 700mA and the voltaeg is 10V across 3 leds. Less than I thought it would be after reading the data sheet. I was expecting 10.7V or so.....thats a bit extra burn time from what I thought . I am getting my mates stock triple to do the stock voltage measuremenst and to do run time tests. last time I did a burn test on the stock setup it got noticably dim after 2 hours. my tests/comparisons with the stock lightget the answer to that.

I did a 2.5 hour run using the neflex and 1 of li ions at 1 amp with a fan blowing on the houising. The Lowvoltage cut in just before the batterys protection did....so happy there. Might knock the nflex voltage threshold up a bit to allow some time on the emergency light level. If the bat circuit cuts out on its own you have no light. the voltage warning flash on the nflex is much more friendly than the cateye one which is a quick 50% strobe.....not so good when it happens hacking down a techy section at a race like it did last year hehe.

I did notice a bit of blue shift after a while at 1amp. the housing was warm to the touch. I still have 2 layers of thermal tape I used to gain clearance when using the stock optics/plastic clamp. now the reflector is the clamp....i will put a single fresh layer in to reduce thermal resistance.


I am still playing with nflex current levels for the lower settinsg. At 0.45A with no airflow the light hardly gets warm to the touch when in still air. an it is still loads brighte than stock. at that level it should last nearly all of a mid summer night.

LowRider - I have added this to your database thread 

Stu


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

quick update

the mcr20 reflectors don't fit. they would need a nats cock turned off on a lathe.

Stu


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## justaguy (Jun 9, 2005)

*Walk me through this*

Stuart. Ead the post and am interested in upgrading my DS and TS. Can you give me somse step by step instructions and tell me what to buy?

Thanks Mate


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## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

justaguy - look at the link in his first post and you will have what you seek.


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Hi

Yeah the link in my first post pretty much covers it.

As for parts,

If keeping the stock battery and controller you will need

thermal tape (I got mone on ebay)
Some White Seouls P4 Leds (I usually get mine from www,leds.de, I thinmk mine are U bin ones...bins are brightness catagorys (the are color tint catgories too))
You can use the standard optics as posted in that link.
A soldering iron, hex key ( can't remember what size) and a smallish cross head screw driver.
and a couple of hours (take yer time to get it right).

pul it to bits as described, swap the LEDs as described and carefully put it all back together.

This set up is significantly brighter than stock.

I have since changed the optics in mine to get a better beam. I have put 20mm diameter khatod reflectors in. The beam is very much improved. to fit these, don't refit the samller plastic piece that clamps the led to the back of the light, put refelctors in over the LED bubble, its should pretrude slightly out the the open light so that when the light front is put back on it provides the clamping force.

If the LED isn't thermally bonded and clamped to the rear it will over heat and go blue and get damaged or even die. Like said in the link, the rear of the LED isn't electriclly neutral, so I used thermal tape as it is an electrical insulator. Thermal compound risks shortng out when the led is clamped.

If you have any spoecific queries feel free to ask. You won't damage the light by popping the front off, and carefully removinf the optics to have a look before doing any surgery to familiarise your self.

]Stu


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## Low_Rider (Jan 15, 2004)

It’s great to hear you’re still playing! Did you go for the textured or smoother Khatod reflectors?


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

Hey Dave,

good to see ya back on mtbr 

on the triple I used a combination of 1 textered in the middle and 2 outer ones as smooth. the outer ones perspex is frosted sofening them up. the beam is not disimilar ot my 12degree hid....nice and floody with quite a gradual transition to a biggish spot. The HID beam has always been my goal. the double uses 2 smooth ones that gives quite good spill with a tighter brighter hotspot....perfect for a hemelt light.

all the rings are gone too.

I still haven't tried them on the bike...still on crutches.

Stu


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## Low_Rider (Jan 15, 2004)

Very nice, from the data sheet and various comments that have been made it sounds like the textured Khatod reflectors make for a really nice smooth flood, while the smooth reflectors have quite a bit of throw at the expense of beam quality. 

A slight frosting makes sense (I guess you had no option with the CatEye), and it sounds like a great combination. Some beam shots would be fantastic! 

How long before you can get mobile again, you seem to have been on those crutches for a while now! I hope you’re out and about soon. 

Dave.


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

I will try to take some beam shots. Just got a new pc and need to get ftp setup on it.

The textured provides a very floody smooth beam with out a real hot spot. the smooths are on a par to ims reflectors.

I really like the khatod reflectors....perform well and good value.

I will hopefully be off crutches soon. I see physio again tomorrow.

Stu


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## justaguy (Jun 9, 2005)

*Updates?*

Stuart,

Finally getting around to upgrading the DoubleShot and TripleShot. Reading back through I think you had some IMS reflectors ordered and were using some Khatod ones.

I don't want to reinvent the wheel. I appreciate all the work you did, and the step by step instructions on how to replace. Now my question is which reflector worked best?

Thanks,


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## heatstroke (Jul 1, 2003)

New measurment unit to me.. .how many mm is that exactly


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

justaguy said:


> Stuart,
> 
> Finally getting around to upgrading the DoubleShot and TripleShot. Reading back through I think you had some IMS reflectors ordered and were using some Khatod ones.
> 
> ...


Hi Chap,

I reckon that the khatod combo I described in post 24 works best. The triple produces a beam very much like my HID, and the double is nice and throwy with good spill still.

Unfortunately I still haven't used them in anger yet (I am doing some easy road miles when I can though).

Let us know how your mods go.

Heatstroke, which units do you mean?

Stu


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## troutie-mtb (Sep 20, 2007)

Stuart B said:


> Hi Chap,
> 
> Heatstroke, which units do you mean?
> 
> Stu


I think he means the gnats cock, 
which is smaller than a cock hair . it is an english standard measuring unit .

Great mod . would have liked to see the internals while you had them in bits.

Like the crutch light .


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

lol, I forgot I said that 

I will pop the front off and take a snap if I remember.

Stu


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## wadester (Sep 28, 2005)

*Thanks, comments, lenses?*

Yo Stu! Your original post was my inspiration and guide to mod my double and triple as well as a friend's triple. Thanks for your help!

You were right about needing to be careful with the screws - I didn't have any serious trouble with the internal screws, but the outer (allen) screws gave me fits. Had to drill one out and helicoil it, but learned that if they start getting stiffer as they come out - stop and run them back in a bit/put a little penetrating oil on/wait a bit/proceed.

After reading your comments on the "live" nature of the base, I thought: I'll just use nonconductive heat compound! Turns out that it works fine until you get the unit fully screwed back together, and then has enough contact to bypass all but the last emitter. But I came up with a good solution! Add a thin bit of filter paper in there. Punched out a bit of coffee filter with a paper hole punch, saturate it with heat goop (arcticsilver ceramique) by putting a coat on both sides and the led and the base - put it together. Minimal stack height, seems to conduct heat very well, no electrical contact.

So what exact Khatod lenses are you using? I don't see a 20mm diameter listed - the KEPL198 at 21.7mm is smallest for SSC's. http://www.khatod.com/k52_lens_zpower.htm I find the stock optics are decent, but since the double is the "spot" and it is overpowered by the triple "flood" it would be nice to get some tight focus lenses for the triple on the helmet. I'm working on a non-frosted cover so at least I get min spread from the "opticube" lenses.

As a comment, I'm running the stock Cateye power on the bar and a 1A buckpuck for the helmet. Both bar and helmet are triples until my friend asks for his triple back :sad:


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

wadester said:


> Yo Stu! Your original post was my inspiration and guide to mod my double and triple as well as a friend's triple. Thanks for your help!
> 
> You were right about needing to be careful with the screws - I didn't have any serious trouble with the internal screws, but the outer (allen) screws gave me fits. Had to drill one out and helicoil it, but learned that if they start getting stiffer as they come out - stop and run them back in a bit/put a little penetrating oil on/wait a bit/proceed.
> 
> ...


I am chuffed my post was useful, the cateye is a good, but not great light...with some tweaking it is much better . Glad you found a solution to the slug shorting.

I am not using lenses, I am using reflectors http://www.khatod.com/k52_parabole.htm. The 20.5mm version. They are intended for Luxeons, but work great on the seouls too. They are just the right size to get get squeezed when the front goes on.

The opticube lenses are the worst thing about the cateyes in my opinion, really ringy. Even the non textured reflector is much smoother. It still has great throw, but also better spill.

Stu


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## wadester (Sep 28, 2005)

I'll have to get some of the reflectors - narrow down the beam for the hat and spread it out for the handlebar. Thanks!

And I'll post some pics here:
1) Double with cover off/lenses out - note broken screw on housing. 6 retainer screws are removed - then I remembered to take the pic.
2) Top plastic retainer bit removed - showing wiring for future reference - note black silicone on solder joins.
3) Here is what comes out of the housing - takes a bit of tweak to break the thermogoop.
4) Aaaaahhhhh. P4's in plastic retainer. Note the wiggles where the tabs had to be straightened out to fit.
5) All the parts of a tripleshot


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

sorry for the latre reply...somehow this managed to slip me by.

Great to see another open heart surgery on a triple 

how are you getting on with then. did you get any reflectors?

Stu


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## nynx (Mar 1, 2007)

Hola Stu! Just wanted to drop a thanks for the motivation to buy and mod a Tripleshot! Did the first ride tonight and I was more than impressed!

I used Cree XR-E P5 bin from Deal Extreme mounted on round bases. I cut out a replacement slug for the LEDs to mount to and Arctic Silver epoxied them in place. Worked great ! no loss and ran them for 2.5 hours straight. The housing never got more than slightly warm. 

Unfortunately I'm now addicted and debating ordering new optics and a 1A controller. I'm impressed now, especially for the cost. It's hard to imagine much more!


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## Homebrew (Jan 2, 2004)

nynx said:


> Unfortunately I'm now addicted and debating ordering new optics and a 1A controller. I'm impressed now, especially for the cost. It's hard to imagine much more!


Ditto, props to Stu for being the first brave Seoul to break into a perfectly functioning light.

Nynx, which optics did you get?


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

nynx said:


> Hola Stu! Just wanted to drop a thanks for the motivation to buy and mod a Tripleshot! Did the first ride tonight and I was more than impressed!
> 
> I used Cree XR-E P5 bin from Deal Extreme mounted on round bases. I cut out a replacement slug for the LEDs to mount to and Arctic Silver epoxied them in place. Worked great ! no loss and ran them for 2.5 hours straight. The housing never got more than slightly warm.
> 
> Unfortunately I'm now addicted and debating ordering new optics and a 1A controller. I'm impressed now, especially for the cost. It's hard to imagine much more!


Excellent work mate! This is the first Cree triple I have heard of...I wonder if its a first...very good work. I am also interested in what optics you use.

Stu


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## nynx (Mar 1, 2007)

Oh sorry I wasn't more clear. I stayed with the stock optics for the initial mod. The combination of the new copper base and cree on star is same as the stock aluminum/LEDs/plastic bits. This enabled me to just drop the whole rig together. The stock optics fit nicely over the Cree domes. They also remain very "ringy" with a nice hot spot and a ridiculous amount of fill. Nice on trail and I had several cars flash their headlights at me on the road. 

On that note though I have ordered some 20mm Ledils and will be trying those out when arrived. I basically ordered two of each so I can figure what works best.

I also started thinking of modding the pack with a 1 amp controller. I'll either do this or buy a Li-Ion 5200MAh pack and put a bFlex in it. I'd like to have multiple levels of brightness... Anyone have any thoughts on mounting the bFlex on the pack instead of the housing?
I'd then craft a homebrew double and use the stock pack with it for a helmet light.

Now I'm sure you guys would probably like a pic, Sorry I don't have any more Arctic Silver or I'd pull it completely apart. so.....









I used a 1.5" copper union and cut it down the side and then flattened it out. I traced the shape from the original aluminum base and cut out with a jigsaw. I then used a dremel grinding bit in my drill press to smooth out the edges. I glued the Cree's down with Arctic Silver adhesive and wired them up. I polished the mounting surface of the light to bright and shiny and applied a thin layer of regular Arctic Silver. and installed with new allen head bolts instead of the poor Phillips heads. The rest remains stock for now.

Oh also, I destroyed the factory LED's and plastic bits playing with ideas but it would be easier to just snip the leads and keep the factory assembly in case it's ever needed.


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

I am chuffed you got the Crees in. I wasn't sure they would fit with bases, and too much faff with out bases (shorting etc).

The bFlex is a great controller. I have tested it, but not used it in anger with the triple. To have the controller with the battery you wil have to run a pair of wires to a switch somewhere to get the levels/on/off. You can't use the stock switch as it is inline with the power to the head. I asked george about running the controller open loaded, but he said the capacitor on the output may be over volted (depending on battery), becase the output will max out to battery voltage as will be trying to get to the set current into a very large resitance (Air). So if you keep the inline switch, be careful to keep it closed.

It would be nicer to run a new cable into the back of the light, but I couldn't figure out if the silver back plate would come out with damaging anything. 

I want to put the b/nFlex in mine, so I may have to have another play. Multilevel triple/doubles would be amazing for both racing/playing and commuting.

Stu


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## gessner17 (Jun 15, 2004)

I am in the process of upgrading mine. I have found that if you run the lights hard before you dissassemble and heat the unit up, the screws will come out much easier. I stripped out one and managed to get it out after I nearly burned out the LEDs driving them so hard but who cares about the LEDs right? I'm doing 3 U bin P4s with 20mm reflectors, I am amazed at how well it all fits in there!


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

gessner17 said:


> I am in the process of upgrading mine. I have found that if you run the lights hard before you dissassemble and heat the unit up, the screws will come out much easier. I stripped out one and managed to get it out after I nearly burned out the LEDs driving them so hard but who cares about the LEDs right? I'm doing 3 U bin P4s with 20mm reflectors, I am amazed at how well it all fits in there!


Glad to hear you got the screw out! Good tip.

Stu


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## nynx (Mar 1, 2007)

I think running a new cable setup is an absolute if I change packs and go with the bFlex. Seems easier that way too. Also I can use the entire Tripleshot harness and battery assembly for my helmet light. I figure I won't need the multiple brightness levels on that light anyways. Not to mention 700mA sounds better on the helmet light that won't be as well heatsinked as the Cateye. 

Those black phillips heads are the devil! :devil: I drilled the head off one after stripping. After the tension was released the rest unscrewed easily with needle nose pliers. The aluminum base is stuck down with a little heat sink goop. Once the screws are out it will pop out when pried with something pointed. If someone is doing this in the future. You can leave the silver screws in. Just unscrew the two black ones. That way the whole factory LED assembly comes out in one piece. Of course that's irrelevant in you're using the aluminum base plate.

Once the assembly is out you'll find a large hole in the center of the housing, Where teh cable comes in. Unfortunately it's not quite large enough for a bFlex. Also this was of concern due to the effective area for conductivity being reduced. Thus the copper plate idea came up. I figured it gave better thermal conductivity and transfer to the housing. I think the housing get's hotter than before so I'm guessing this is correct. After seeing the stock design I'm thinking it wasn't as thermally effective at moving heat to the housing and thus outside. Hopefully I'm right, Driving at 1A will surely indicate if the LEDs are getting too hot. 

Now I need to figure out how to get my Canon S3 to do a proper beam shot. I'll post after I get some shots. I'm good with electronics and suck at photography!


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

nynx said:


> I think running a new cable setup is an absolute if I change packs and go with the bFlex. Seems easier that way too. Also I can use the entire Tripleshot harness and battery assembly for my helmet light. I figure I won't need the multiple brightness levels on that light anyways. Not to mention 700mA sounds better on the helmet light that won't be as well heatsinked as the Cateye.
> 
> Those black phillips heads are the devil! :devil: I drilled the head off one after stripping. After the tension was released the rest unscrewed easily with needle nose pliers. The aluminum base is stuck down with a little heat sink goop. Once the screws are out it will pop out when pried with something pointed. If someone is doing this in the future. You can leave the silver screws in. Just unscrew the two black ones. That way the whole factory LED assembly comes out in one piece. Of course that's irrelevant in you're using the aluminum base plate.
> 
> ...


What a star. I think mine will get opened again for recabling for the nflex then. chaning the plarte also means we can play with depth and there for optic options too. I like the Khatods alot for their beam pattern....but TIR optics are theoretically more efficient.

I will also play with the thermal path....as I know that the lights get hot on zero airflow at 1A. If the path is bad then the LEDs are perhaps getting to hot....and even if they arn't over heating acording to the data sheet....heat is lost lumens (although it is rare to need 1A when stationary).

Stu


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## StrongLight&Cheap (Nov 1, 2005)

*Tripleshot Mod*

Stu,

First, thanks for the inspiration and confidence to dig into a functioning device (albeit, I've always been dissatisfied with the amount of light from the stock Triple). I used gessner's tip of heating things up and have the light fully disassembled - one of the cheese-bolts struggled a bit, but a little persuasion was all it needed.

Thermal tape is ordered from eBay and on its way.

A few questions:
The original solder has a rubberized coating on top (I think?), I'm guessing to avoid shorts, although I can't see any metal the connect points could touch. Do I need to somehow coat the contact points after soldering the new LED's in place?

Do the P4's have a polarity I need to be concerned about, and if so, which way should they be oriented?

For parts to order from: http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=169435 , is the following correct?
Three (3) SSC P4 Emitters, U2SW0H
Two (2) Khatod Smooth Reflectors, 20mm
One (1) Khatod Stippled Reflector, 20mm
Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound (for the contact point between the back plate and the body of the Tripleshot).

Anything else I'm missing?

Again, thanks, I'll post how everything turns out.

Rob


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

StrongLight&Cheap said:


> Stu,
> 
> First, thanks for the inspiration and confidence to dig into a functioning device (albeit, I've always been dissatisfied with the amount of light from the stock Triple). I used gessner's tip of heating things up and have the light fully disassembled - one of the cheese-bolts struggled a bit, but a little persuasion was all it needed.
> 
> ...


Hi Chap,

I didn't coat any of the connections. I just snipped the LED terminals nice and short (while still allowing a good connection), they can't flex at all that way and short.

The list looks good with a quick squiz. The only thing is if you ordered thermal tape you don't need the arctic silver. I would recommend you get enough reflectors to let you try different combos. maybe 1 extra stippled and 1 extra smooth perhaps, or go the whole hog and have 3 of each if you are like me lol. Beam pattern preference is subjective, you may want more throw or more flood than my suggestion. I would also order a spare led or 2, just in case you don't get a good thermal bond first time....but that is why i have loads of different LEDs and optics reflectors kicking about....can't have too many spares/options lol.

make sure the slugs are electrically isolated from the chassis.

Happy modding,

Stu


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## brihas (Dec 18, 2008)

Hi, I know this thread is a bit old now but was wondering if the latest Led's like the ssc p7 or cree xre would work on the doubleshot mod, using the stock battery & driver.
Thanks Bri


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## gessner17 (Jun 15, 2004)

It would not be just a drop in solution like the P4's are. There are currently no reflectors or optics that i know of that would fit it without cutting it down. The other problem is power. The P7 requires a lot more juice and the 700ma regulator would probably not be substantial to get any decent addition to the output of a U2 P4. If you put in a new driver and cut down your own reflectors you could potentially do it, I've thought about trying. I have an empty TS laying around that's disassembled. : )


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## Stuart B (Mar 21, 2005)

brihas said:


> Hi, I know this thread is a bit old now but was wondering if the latest Led's like the ssc p7 or cree xre would work on the doubleshot mod, using the stock battery & driver.
> Thanks Bri


the P7 (and the new cree MC-E) is a fair bit bigger than the p4 and xr-e. if you used the stock controller the P7 or MC-e (in parallel config) would be a bit brighter and should use a bit less power. I think it would be too big and I doubt there is room for suitable optics, but you never know! if you can get it to fit, it will prbably be floody with such a big die area in a small reflector/optic.

the XR-E should fit, but I chose the seoul as it is very similar in size to the lux 3 it replaced. I don't think the XR-E offers much if any advantage personally, but it should fit with a bit of effort.

Stu


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## Buck268 (Aug 22, 2007)

SSC P4's are typically a better replacement for Lux III emitters because, like Stuart said, they have more similar dimensions. This translates to better reflector fit and beam patterns. Cree's tend to be very ringy and have other issues when used in place of luxeons (at least without taking any action to solve, such as shimming or replacing the reflector/optics).


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## brihas (Dec 18, 2008)

Thanks, SSC P4's it is then.
Are these the one's I need http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.2026
Sorry but I know absolutely zilch about this but I gotta give it a try.


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## Buck268 (Aug 22, 2007)

I would recommend going over the the candlepowerorums marketplace, looking up a guy named photonfanatic and buying some P4's off him. It'll cost you a little bit more but you'll get them quicker, plus you should be able to get a nicer tint. Maybe jump in the group buy for the SUN emitters. I'm thinking about re-doing my Triple Shot when those come in.


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## gessner17 (Jun 15, 2004)

I just modded another cateye triple body i picked up with some 250 lumen K2s and IMS20 reflectors. I think the results are better than the P4, beam is better, color is better, and K2s at 700ma don't produce a lot of heat, since they are underdriven, spec is 1A. You can almost leave it on stationary without it getting too hot. The K2s I got have a very low (3.03-3.25) VF plus running them below spec, they probably are at the low end or even below that so the runtime has increased significantly. I almost got a solid 4 hours of bright light, probably started dimming 3 hours and 30-45 minutes of blinding light 

I'm also working on sanding down the outer edges of some boom reflectors to mod a Double shot with 2 P7s and am trying to figure out how to outfit it with a new driver to power the P7s at 1A-2A. Should be a real night blaster.


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## gonediesel (Oct 9, 2005)

*P7s*

If you get it to work I will be interested in what you have done. I have one battery pack giving me trouble so I am at the point of doing something similar. I am not sure if I should just put one MC-E in the triple with two XP-E or something else. I need to do some reading on optics and wiring the MC-E


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