# Chain whip substitute



## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

Discovered this works pretty well. It's a standard vise grip c clamp, just clamp it between opposite teeth on one of the larger cogs. Don't overdo the clamping force, but got the job done for me in a moment of need and it's all I've used since. Some minor grinding on the clamp tips would make it even better but I haven't bothered yet. :thumbsup:


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## PUBCRAWL (Feb 9, 2007)

...or something similar that's actually made for the job.
Pedros Vise-Whip.


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

You could always make one out of an old chain and some steel plate...


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

just use an old glove.

been doing it for years, works every time.


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## RLK (Nov 4, 2009)

I love my Vise-Whip!


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

redmr2_man said:


> just use an old glove.
> 
> been doing it for years, works sometimes.


FTFY^ And yeah, there are other ways to do the job, so? I'll be out riding long before you fabricate a whip or mail order one. Just another trick to add to your bag... relax.


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

...


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

bsieb said:


> works sometimes


don't put the cassette on that tight then

or get a bigger glove :thumbsup:


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

redmr2_man said:


> don't put the cassette on that tight then
> 
> or get a bigger glove :thumbsup:


You got that right, too tight is one of my pet peeves, but it happens. You could clamp it in a vise too, if you had a vice. Might trash the cassette but you're putting another one on, right? Shop rags work too if the lock ring isn't too tight. :thumbsup:


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Not sure what the big deal is...why not just spend the $15 bucks for a chain whip?


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## Shark (Feb 4, 2006)

my diy whip was free....works every time too & doesn't bugger up the cassette (what if you need to service hub but your cassette is good?)


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> Not sure what the big deal is...why not just spend the $15 bucks for a chain whip?


...because a glove is free.


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

If I were going to buy a chain whip I would probably get a vice whip. Chain whips are always a bit of a balancing act so locking on is good. The wrench and lock ring tool can be awkward too. The vise grip works well for me and I have had no trouble with cassette damage, so I have little incentive to buy or make something else. But to each their own, it's all good.


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## 2fargon (Jan 22, 2011)

I've used an old chain and a claw hammer in a pinch!


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

redmr2_man said:


> ...because a glove is free.


I know an old glove is free but I prefer to use the right tool for the job. I have used a glove, rag, an old towel, but the job goes much easier with the correct tool.


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## borbntm (May 4, 2011)

This works well.....single speeders have lots of extra excess chain lying around:thumbsup:


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## kikoraa (Jul 25, 2011)

How do yall use a glove?


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

Put glove on hand.

Hold cassette.

Use cassette tool to loosen lockring.

Drink beer.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> Not sure what the big deal is...why not just spend the $15 bucks for a chain whip?


That's what I thought when I first read the thread title. While it's great to have MacGyver skills and be able to improvise in a pinch I can't understand not getting the right tool if you have to use it often and it is inexpensive. Redmr2_man mentioned that an old glove is free but so is a scrap of steel and a chunk of old chain. I could never get mine off with a glove anyway because I do like the cassette lockring tight, one of _my_ pet peeves is vibration noise caused by a loose cassette.


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## edmorales (Sep 9, 2010)




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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

You can also clamp a length of chain (or old chain) in a bench vise and wrap it around the cassette like the miniature human in the picture above me is doing. If you put the wheel between yourself and the bench corner and rotate the wheel backwards to pull the chain tight it works very well. Leaves both hands free, too. That being said, I have a Pedro's vise-whip and a regular ol' chainwhip.


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

edmorales said:


>


This is elegant in it's simplicity and could be done road or trail side by loosely knotting one end of the chain around a sign post or small tree. Thinking touring/bikepacking here, as I don't know of too many other riders who carry a lock ring tool. I may drill a 3/8" hole through one of the porch posts at the bike house, slip a chain through the hole, nail through the end of the chain. The $15-$40 I saved is irrelevant, if it works well it's one less tool to keep track of. And then there's beer too.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

Speaking of touring and simple...


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

^That is awesomely minimalist, I used to carry a Hyper-Cracker which works similarly and has a spoke wrench built in.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

I think chain whips are shop tools, or neglected bike tools. I have one, but for my bikes its always the glove/rag.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

One Pivot said:


> I think chain whips are shop tools, or neglected bike tools. I have one, but for my bikes its always the glove/rag.


You don't get your cassette tight enough then..


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

I dont know why I would tighten it so tight its not easily serviceable. Having it as tight as I do causes no issues at all...

Just to see what would happen, I did about 200 miles with a cassette way too loose, just hardly snugged up. Nothing happened.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

One Pivot said:


> I dont know why I would tighten it so tight its not easily serviceable. Having it as tight as I do causes no issues at all...
> 
> Just to see what would happen, I did about 200 miles with a cassette way too loose, just hardly snugged up. Nothing happened.


Loose cassette = sloppy shifting, premature wear of chain and freehub body, unnecessary noise and vibration and the obvious risk of it coming off. You want your cassette tight. I've worked in a shop and seen some pretty gnarly stuff from people who run their cassettes looser than they're supposed to.


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

i tighten my cassette. probably moreso than it needs.

no loose cassette. no sloppy shifting. But I don't go a full or a half rotation after TIGHT either.

and I still use a glove.


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## edmorales (Sep 9, 2010)

do you also torque the lock ring with hand in glove?


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Loose cassette = sloppy shifting, premature wear of chain and freehub body, unnecessary noise and vibration and the obvious risk of it coming off. You want your cassette tight. I've worked in a shop and seen some pretty gnarly stuff from people who run their cassettes looser than they're supposed to.


^^^ :thumbsup: I've put in my fair share of shop time as well and after some time you get really tuned in to notice any flaws whatsoever when you test ride a bike, I guess you could say you develop "rabbit ears" so to speak and for me a loose cassette is easily noticeable when riding, especially when you transition from coasting to engagement.

As mentioned earlier on "to each his own", but with all the cheap and easy ways shown here to remove a cassette and given how relatively infrequently it needs done I can't understand the reasoning behind _not_ getting it tight.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> You don't get your cassette tight enough then..


Agreed.

I also don't understand why people have trouble with chain whips, it's a simple tool.


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## bsieb (Aug 23, 2003)

customfab said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I also don't understand why people have trouble with chain whips, it's a simple tool.


It's not so much that it's hard to use, it's just a little awkward handling the three tools (chain whip, lock ring tool, adjustable wrench) with two hands, especially since none of them will stay in place well without being held there. Your lock ring tool with the handle welded on to it would attest to that. I suppose you have an understandable bias towards the chain whip though.


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## rangeriderdave (Aug 29, 2008)

I made a chain whip with a old chain and a piece of metal . When I want to remove the cassete ,I put the locking tool in the vice ,chain whip on cassette holding it with one hand and turn the wheel ,a lot of leverage with wheel .


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

A wrench handle with a lockring tool built on does make things a lot easier, however a lot of people make it hard on themselves by doing it wrong. If you do find yourself with only a chainwhip, adjustable wrench, and cassette lockring tool I suggest using gravity to your advantage. Here is an unknown mechanic making things harder than need be IMO-










And here is the first (only) image I could locate of someone doing it the easy way. An unknown bike mechanic somewhere in Africa using a custom made chainwhip-










The chainwhip falls right on that way and you have all of your body weight to loosen it! :thumbsup:


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

You're right. A lot of it is technique, however a lockring tool with a handle makes the job much easier.


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## 1niceride (Jan 30, 2004)

edmorales said:


> do you also torque the lock ring with hand in glove?


No tool needed to hold the cassette when tightening it.

If the chain whip is in the shop (garage} and I'm in the basement I'll try the 18" pipe wrench on the largest cog. If too tight to use without damage I'll make the 100' trek to get the tool. If its really cold or raining I'll try a little harder with the pipe wrench.


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## edmorales (Sep 9, 2010)

1niceride said:


> No tool needed to hold the cassette when tightening it.
> 
> If the chain whip is in the shop (garage} and I'm in the basement I'll try the 18" pipe wrench on the largest cog. If too tight to use without damage I'll make the 100' trek to get the tool. If its really cold or raining I'll try a little harder with the pipe wrench.


I prefer to use a Torque Wrench and tighten the lock ring to the manufacturer's specs


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## 1niceride (Jan 30, 2004)

I believe the thread is about chain whip substitutes. One does not need a chain whip to tighten. Of course one should tighten to specs.


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## edmorales (Sep 9, 2010)

1niceride said:


> I believe the thread is about chain whip substitutes. One does not need a chain whip to tighten. Of course one should tighten to specs.


we all know that one does not need the chain whip when tightening, pic above was when loosening the lock ring. I am just curious how one can tighten the lock ring without using the torque wrench


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

Haven't there been other threads saying torque wrenches were pointless with cassette lockrings? The knurling on the lockring and/or smallest cog throw off the torque ratings.


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## edmorales (Sep 9, 2010)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Haven't there been other threads saying torque wrenches were pointless with cassette lockrings? The knurling on the lockring and/or smallest cog throw off the torque ratings.


this is why Shimano cassettes have a thin aluminium washer on the lock ring, Sram does not. The washer unfortunately does not come separately, I just make one from an empty beer can, And drink beer while servicing the freehub


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

It aint no fine Swiss watch, just crank it tight- or loose according to some on this thread. No need for a torque wrench.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

+1 jb


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## JDM (May 2, 2008)

I use a strap wrench in place of a chain whip because I have one lying around that I have no other use for.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

bsieb said:


> It's not so much that it's hard to use, it's just a little awkward handling the three tools (chain whip, lock ring tool, adjustable wrench) with two hands, especially since none of them will stay in place well without being held there. Your lock ring tool with the handle welded on to it would attest to that. I suppose you have an understandable bias towards the chain whip though.


Using a lock ring tool with a handle integrated into it is the only way to go. Weather it's mine or something inferior, it's way better than trying to fumble around with an adjustable wrench.

Even before I made my chain whip I still preferred them over anything else I've come across. It's just such a simple and quick tool. The thing that I never liked about other whips is they are almost all made from flat bar stock,


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Haven't there been other threads saying torque wrenches were pointless with cassette lockrings? The knurling on the lockring and/or smallest cog throw off the torque ratings.


There have. But as long as they stamp torque specs on the lock ring, some people will feel the need to torque them to spec.

Technique with the chain whip and lock ring remover is everything.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Just get the freakin' Vise Grip, well worth the cost. LZ (Lennard Zinn) came up with the idea when he kept visiting shops where the mechanics were welding together pieces that functioned the same as the VG.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Speaking of touring and simple...


please explain for the newb? thank you.


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## Bro (Dec 20, 2010)

Bill in Houston said:


> please explain for the newb? thank you.


I was wondering this as well. Maybe you can fit that nib on the lockring into the dropout and then pedal the bike, thereby rotating the freehub while the lockring is stationary? One direction tightens it, the other loosens.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

mm, maybe so. if it slides into the dropout like that, then standing on the pedals would loosen the lockring. i think.


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## Ridnparadise (Dec 14, 2007)

*Resurrection*

Recently I had to buy a new magic tool to remove cassettes because the one I owned was MIA. More recently I had a carbon rim failure which also took out the rear tyre I had only ridden 5 times. The rim failed while crossing a 4 lane road - sketchy. The sidewall delaminated and blew out when I chose a ride to the beach over the bush. A sliver created an un-sealable escape valve in the edge of the tyre right on the rim bead. No amount of slime would hold over 15psi, so into the bin it went with it's carbon penetrating mate. At least that was the plan. Think I could find Miss Chain-Whip? She's probably in Switzerland with Magic Tool getting wed.., I pronounce you Mr Magic and Mrs Chain Tool. I can't see movies being made about it though!

I digress. When there's no whipping tool, you need an alternative. I have plenty of gloves, but why hurt your hand and a glove when an old, dirty Tee shirt works just as well. Loop one "end" around the cassette and tie the other end to the rim and you have a mechanically sound system that can even clean the cassette a bit. It tightens as you apply more force to the cassette tool.


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## KevinGT (Dec 25, 2012)

To handle the awkwardness of the lock ring tool and adjustable wrench (or socket), slip an old quick release through the whole thing and the lock ring tool won't go anywhere.


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