# 13 gauge spokes is it worth it



## giantsaam (Dec 10, 2006)

I have a new set of Halo rims being laced and I was wondering if the 13 gauge spokes where worth the extra weight I am looking for ultimate lateral stiffness and longevity
if you have ever used them I would like to know if it is worth the weight
I am 230lbs with gear and not the smoothest rider


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## GnaR9 (Jul 7, 2007)

giantsaam said:


> I have a new set of Halo rims being laced and I was wondering if the 13 gauge spokes where worth the extra weight I am looking for ultimate lateral stiffness and longevity
> if you have ever used them I would like to know if it is worth the weight
> I am 230lbs with gear and not the smoothest rider


I'm gonna say no. I'm bigger than you and run Mavic EX 721s laced w/ these.....
http://www.go-ride.com/ProductDetail.jsp?LISTID=127A0000-1106933774
Plenty stiff if built right. Some say (I really have no idea), but some say a double butted spoke can build a stronger wheel than a thicker straight gage spoke. But that seems odd to me. 
Either way, I'm hard on wheels, and notice when something flexes, and these spokes are great.


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## .WestCoastHucker. (Jan 14, 2004)

spoke size doesn't really mean shizz, i always use DT revolution 14/15/14 spokes and have been doing so for many many years. spoke tension is where it's at, the huckler makes a promise that wheels that have tight tension will last practically forever. i am a super abusive rider and anyone will attest to that. i regularly keep my spokes in check and my wheelsets last untill i get bored with them, which is usually about 5 years...


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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

wheel builder is the most important not spoke diameter


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## .WestCoastHucker. (Jan 14, 2004)

no, spoke tension is the most important thing, who built them is irrelevant (unless you just want to name drop who built your wheelset). a wheelset built by a reputable builder will still have spokes stretch and come loose just like a machine built set, you keeping them in check is what keeps your wheelset lasting. if you think spending the extra coin just to say 'so and so' built my wheels will get you a better wheelset, you are sadly mistaken...


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## jamesdc (Oct 31, 2005)

.WestCoastHucker. said:


> no, spoke tension is the most important thing, who built them is irrelevant (unless you just want to name drop who built your wheelset). a wheelset built by a reputable builder will still have spokes stretch and come loose just like a machine built set, you keeping them in check is what keeps your wheelset lasting. if you think i spending the extra coin just to say 'so and so' built my wheels will get you a better wheelset, you are sadly mistaken...


Yeah, huckler is right

Does anyone know if you can get 13/14/13 guage spokes, those I would be interested in.


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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

.WestCoastHucker. said:


> no, spoke tension is the most important thing, who built them is irrelevant (unless you just want to name drop who built your wheelset). a wheelset built by a reputable builder will still have spokes stretch and come loose just like a machine built set, you keeping them in check is what keeps your wheelset lasting. if you think spending the extra coin just to say 'so and so' built my wheels will get you a better wheelset, you are sadly mistaken...


that is a given....just like bike maintenance...probably the most important.....if your spokes keep coming loose the have the builder use spoke oil (I think it is called this)....it is like a lite weight loctite for spokes....works wonders


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## lelebebbel (Jan 31, 2005)

jamesdc said:


> Yeah, huckler is right
> 
> Does anyone know if you can get 13/14/13 guage spokes, those I would be interested in.


I'm not completely familiar with that gauge system, but DT Alpines might be what you are looking for.

Anyways, I agree with WCH. almost any spoke can built a stiff and strong wheel if you get the tension high enough. I've used revos before, too. no problem strengthwise, but they make it somewhat harder to build the wheel. 
Generally, I would recommend regular 2.0-1.8-2.0mm spokes (which is 14/15/14 gauge i believe. Like DT Comps.)


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## zachdank (Jun 15, 2005)

SHIVER ME TIMBERS said:


> that is a given....just like bike maintenance...probably the most important.....if your spokes keep coming loose the have the builder use spoke oil (I think it is called this)....it is like a lite weight loctite for spokes....works wonders


You are dumber than a bucket of rocks.


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## jamesdc (Oct 31, 2005)

zachdank said:


> You are dumber than a bucket of rocks.


seriously, bob, its called spoke prep and you would know that if you did any of the work on your bike.


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## jp3d (Oct 9, 2004)

I agree proper tension probably has a lot more to do with strength than gauge. If something is going to tweak or break a spoke it would happen to any gauge spoke.

sorry way OT, but...

damn SMT has been getting put in his place lately...


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## creyc (May 24, 2005)

GnaR9 said:


> I'm gonna say no. I'm bigger than you and run Mavic EX 721s laced w/ these.....
> http://www.go-ride.com/ProductDetail.jsp?LISTID=127A0000-1106933774
> Plenty stiff if built right. Some say (I really have no idea), but some say a double butted spoke can build a stronger wheel than a thicker straight gage spoke. But that seems odd to me.
> Either way, I'm hard on wheels, and notice when something flexes, and these spokes are great.


Taken from Sheldon Brown's page on wheel building:


> Double-butted spokes do more than save weight. The thick ends make them as strong in the highly-stressed areas as straight-gauge spokes of the same thickness, but the thinner middle sections make the spokes effectively more elastic. This allows them to stretch (temporarily) more than thicker spokes.
> 
> As a result, when the wheel is subjected to sharp localized stresses, the most heavily stressed spokes can elongate enough to shift some of the stress to adjoining spokes. This is particularly desirable when the limiting factor is how much stress the rim can withstand without cracking around the spoke hole.


Sounds plausible to me


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## giantsaam (Dec 10, 2006)

awesome I think I am going to go with 14 gauge spokes instead my wheel builder is good


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## joelalamo45 (Aug 3, 2006)

zachdank said:


> You are dumber than a bucket of rocks.


Made me laugh out loud.


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## watermoccasin (Jan 28, 2004)

giantsaam said:


> I am looking for ultimate lateral stiffness and longevity


If you want stiffness, straight-gauge spokes make a stiffer wheel. If you want longevity, double-butted spokes make a wheel last longer - DT Swiss proved it in their testing - a little give is a good thing. Personally I run DT Swiss Competition 14/15g double butted spokes for everything from road biking to Whistler. Great combo of light, durable, easy to build, and easy to find replacements.



.WestCoastHucker. said:


> i always use DT revolution 14/15/14 spokes


Are you seriously running 14/17/14 Revos? I tried them when they first came out on my road bike and XC bike. Flexy and a PITA to build/adjust because they are so thin in the middle that they would rather wind up than allow the nipple to tighten. Or are you running 14/15/14 Comps, the best spokes evarr?


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## lelebebbel (Jan 31, 2005)

watermoccasin said:


> Are you seriously running 14/17/14 Revos? I tried them when they first came out on my road bike and XC bike. Flexy and a PITA to build/adjust because they are so thin in the middle that they would rather wind up than allow the nipple to tighten. Or are you running 14/15/14 Comps, the best spokes evarr?


I am running Sapim Laser 14/17/14s in a DH/FR front wheel.
Flexy? no, not when you get the tension way up there. You definitely need higher tension than with DT Comps though, so don't do it with a thin walled rim.
PITA to build? Kind of, yes. You need to feel the spokes with your fingers and untwist every spoke after adjusting it, so the whole process takes more time. Especially with the high tension required. Definitely lube the threads.
If I had money to waste, I'd use Sapim CX Ray (or DT AeroLite, pretty much the same thing) bladed spokes. Just as strong, not lighter, but you can grip them so they don't twist.

I had build several road wheels with 14/17/14s (Revos and Lasers) before, that DH/FR wheel was kind of a (succesful) experiment.
To get the strongest/lightest wheels for the money, just use 14/15/14g DT Comps (or Sapim Race for hubs with thick flanges).


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## Huck Banzai (May 8, 2005)

.WestCoastHucker. said:


> no, spoke tension is the most important thing, who built them is irrelevant (unless you just want to name drop who built your wheelset). a wheelset built by a reputable builder will still have spokes stretch and come loose just like a machine built set, you keeping them in check is what keeps your wheelset lasting. if you think spending the extra coin just to say 'so and so' built my wheels will get you a better wheelset, you are sadly mistaken...


Agreed - although a shyte builder can make some syte wheels; The 'hand built vs machine built' crap is pretty lame -- retension ANY wheel after a nice break in period and they will be gravy!

Good wheelsmith's might become useful when you are trying to make a beaten wheel 'carry on' like my 02 Mammoths (they're not quite round, but mostly straight!!)


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

I heard somewhere that DT didn't recommend Revolutions for disc brakes


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## .WestCoastHucker. (Jan 14, 2004)

watermoccasin said:


> .....Are you seriously running 14/17/14 Revos?


one thing you will learn about me is that i am cheap, spokes are spokes...


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## kidwoo (Aug 11, 2004)

.WestCoastHucker. said:


> spoke size doesn't really mean shizz, i always use DT revolution 14/15/14 spokes and have been doing so for many many years. spoke tension is where it's at, the huckler makes a promise that wheels that have tight tension will last practically forever. i am a super abusive rider and anyone will attest to that. i regularly keep my spokes in check and my wheelsets last untill i get bored with them, which is usually about 5 years...


"the huckler?" :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

I just talked to a very very good wheelbuilder and he told me:

Me:
What do you think of running Revos for DH and FR?

Him:
They don't resist hub twist from braking any more so than a Dt Comp....best spoke for pure DH/FR is the DT -Alpine

He tells me that running high tension light spokes is great, you just have to have a great hub!


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