# EBike for a kid.



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

Are there any options out there? I want to go for a longer rides with my kids of 4 and 8. One option is to buy a very light bike and train them every day (not gonna happen). Another option is to buy an ebike. I know everybody hate them, but I think is a really good option for a kid. One option I found is Haibike hardfour. You can buy one for around 1k. Are there any other options?


----------



## life behind bars (May 24, 2014)

And so it begins.


----------



## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

Personally I would go with an e-moto. My boy got a Stacyc at 2 yrs old and has been ripping ever since. Here is a video of him ripping single track on a decent length ride.






For older kids get an O-set.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

whybotherme said:


> Personally I would go with an e-moto. My boy got a Stacyc at 2 yrs old and has been ripping ever since. Here is a video of him ripping single track on a decent length ride.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Completely forgot about it. I saw a guy with a small boy on one of these things at Santa's village bike park (you have to pedal up to ride down there). They were having a blast. Should work great for my 4yo.


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Seems this is like getting a kid a cell phone. Hard to put that cat back in the bag once it's out.


----------



## Porkchop_Power (Jul 30, 2008)

Going to have to say don't do it. Stick to shorter rides with them. Have them build up endurance. Also, at least here in Colorado ebikes have now been banned in most trail systems.


----------



## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Porkchop_Power said:


> Going to have to say don't do it. Stick to shorter rides with them. Have them build up endurance.


Can also "build up endurance" doing longer rides on the e-bike. 6 of one...

And if they're riding for fun rather than trying to be the best exerciser in elementary school, what does it matter anyway? Whatever gets them out riding and having fun is good.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

slapheadmofo said:


> Can also "build up endurance" doing longer rides on the e-bike. 6 of one...
> 
> And if they're riding for fun rather than trying to be the best exerciser in elementary school, what does it matter anyway? Whatever gets them out riding and having fun is good.


This. It's just fun for them. Plus I don't have a lot of time to ride, if I'm riding with kids, I'm not riding myself. So if kids can ride longer it's a win for me too.


----------



## mjbrox (Jan 6, 2005)

Porkchop_Power said:


> Going to have to say don't do it. Stick to shorter rides with them. Have them build up endurance. Also, at least here in Colorado ebikes have now been banned in most trail systems.


Ebikes are allowed on JeffCo Trails


----------



## SactoGeoff (Aug 11, 2017)

We got to tinker with a Stacyc the other day. There was a 3yr old at the local bike park just ripping that thing. They are pretty cool. The 16" would probably work for your kid. I could see using the Stacyc along with a 12" BMX bike as a great combo for skills building. One for trail timing and balance. The other for overall skills. 

I'm in the "anti e-bike" crowd. But I see the value in something like that for a little one.


----------



## Harryman (Jun 14, 2011)

mjbrox said:


> Ebikes are allowed on JeffCo Trails


Probably why he said "most"....


----------



## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

This is an easy fix, just do downhill shuttles with the kids. Making kids do long pedaling stuff is the opposite of getting them "hooked" anyways. The Ebike stuff is just silly. Save your money and just go downhill, that's what they want to do. If they don't have the skills to handle that yet, then spend a summer working on it and they'll be good to go. If you are successful, you'll need that cash for a real bike anyways.

We ride an Oset electric motorbike once in a while (1600$ & neighborhood kid owns it) but they are tiny and fairly dangerous. They aren't light and having a kid lay one of those down on a single track section is going to jack up there leg fast. Fun bikes I guess but my kids are back on the pedal bikes a lot faster because they can jump .


----------



## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

SactoGeoff said:


> We got to tinker with a Stacyc the other day. There was a 3yr old at the local bike park just ripping that thing. They are pretty cool. The 16" would probably work for your kid. I could see using the Stacyc along with a 12" BMX bike as a great combo for skills building. One for trail timing and balance. The other for overall skills.
> 
> I'm in the "anti e-bike" crowd. But I see the value in something like that for a little one.


The notion that has been tossed around is that using these things makes the kid lazy. That is total BS. My boy has a complete stable of bikes to choose from (12" Stacyc, 16" Hotrock, 18" BMX race bike, 50cc Yamaha, and Strider). Each of his bikes gets used almost daily (except the 50cc). His #1 choice is the 16" Hotrock, it honestly fits him best right now (he is 42" tall at 3.5yrs old). My take on the Stacyc is that the 16" is a waste as the O-set is a much more versatile non-pedal bike and can fit kids for a longer time while building better skills (they pretty much have to stand). 12" BMX is also pretty much a waste IMO.


----------



## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

svinyard said:


> This is an easy fix, just do downhill shuttles with the kids. Making kids do long pedaling stuff is the opposite of getting them "hooked" anyways. The Ebike stuff is just silly. Save your money and just go downhill, that's what they want to do. If they don't have the skills to handle that yet, then spend a summer working on it and they'll be good to go. If you are successful, you'll need that cash for a real bike anyways.


i can't see that really being an option before they are 3 yrs old. operating a hand brake prior to that age was hard for my kid and he is 95 percentile. striders pick up speed FAST on a descent so anyone in the 2-4 yr range can really get a ton of riding in with their kid on flat trails using a Stacyc or similar if the kid has the desire. my older boy is a bike nut, some of his friends that are same age still aren't very good on a strider where my kid was riding a pump track at 16 mo. yet to see if my younger one is the same (currently 8 mo.) but he will have the opportunity if he wants it.








at 3.5yrs he pedals along with the wife on her 2 mile runs but can't really climb much elevation but we have ridden with him much farther than that in the desert on the Stacyc.


----------



## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

OP kids are 4 and 8 hence the DH suggestion. That desert run looks like a blast with the kid. Being on a giant mountain here it's all a little buff for the tiny guys (on moto) but we are doing 7days of braapp on the coastal dunes in 3 weeks for family event. Cheers


----------



## zgxtreme (Mar 25, 2007)

At work we’d call this a “training scar”... here, I’ll just echo another posters reply and say one you go down that road, you’re on that road. The time comes for a real bicycle and to learn to push themselves, they’ll already be reliant upon a motor as the easy (norm) way.


----------



## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

zgxtreme said:


> At work we'd call this a "training scar"... here, I'll just echo another posters reply and say one you go down that road, you're on that road. The time comes for a real bicycle and to learn to push themselves, they'll already be reliant upon a motor as the easy (norm) way.


To use a popular phrase...

Fake news.

















































Kids will do what is fun for them, what challenges them. Doesn't matter if it has pedals, a motor, etc. Though if your kid is lazy, or doesn't like things with wheels, etc... all the restrictions to which type of bike/riding/etc is only going to keep them from getting into it. If given the opportunity my boy pictured would maybe sit on a couch and never move if allowed to watch Youtube Kids all day. We all have to realize there are limits to each kid and each kid is different. My boy can't throw a ball or hit one with a bat to save his life, his cousin that is the same age only wants to play catch and hit a ball with a bat.

If you are concerned with aerobic training on a kid under 14 yrs I would think something is wrong, and not with the kid. I mean, were you an elite/pro level athlete?


----------



## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

svinyard said:


> OP kids are 4 and 8 hence the DH suggestion. That desert run looks like a blast with the kid. Being on a giant mountain here it's all a little buff for the tiny guys (on moto) but we are doing 7days of braapp on the coastal dunes in 3 weeks for family event. Cheers


we try to get out to the desert as much as possible during the cool weather months. wish i could bring the motos with us on our summer vacay to Utah.


----------



## dc40 (Oct 4, 2013)

zgxtreme said:


> At work we'd call this a "training scar"... here, I'll just echo another posters reply and say one you go down that road, you're on that road. The time comes for a real bicycle and to learn to push themselves, they'll already be reliant upon a motor as the easy (norm) way.


I completely disagree... no different than kids riding moto, then wanting to ride bicycles. IMO, it opens more area/ground for a little one to explorer. They will still gain valuable bike handling experience either pedaling or electric assist or moto.

The main thing the kid is outside, spend time and bonding with dad or mom or other kids.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

My daughter (8yo) been riding downhill since 6. Green and blue trails at Mammoth and green Big Bear. If I could go to bike parks every week I would do it in a heartbeat and forget about ebikes. Unfortunately I only have time for it 2-3 times a year. With an eBike my daughter should be able to join me on my normal rides. She has a 24 Riprock now. It’s a great bike, but too heavy for long rides.


----------



## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

Gotcha, I thinking more of the Mom-shuttle kind of days than full bike park stuff. We lived off that for a long time as the kid developed enough endurance to ride up the mountain from home with me. Sounds like maybe that's not an option. I hear you on the long rides tho, I think it's a bad idea to get them doing a bunch of cross country sufferfests while they are really young...tho there are kids on here that do it.


----------



## GSJ1973 (May 8, 2011)

life behind bars said:


> And so it begins.


Yup, grab your popcorn...sit back and watch this one unfold.


----------



## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

My kid has mixed it up between motorized and human powered fun since he was very young. At 14 now, he's still not a fan of XC riding, but put him on DH/DJ/BMX stuff and he'll easily show up the vast majority of adult riders. There's plenty of time for him to get into XC riding later in life if he becomes interested in it, just like most of us did. Whatever I was doing at 3 years old definitely didn't include XC training.


----------



## RMCDan (Feb 28, 2008)

El_Zilcho said:


> Are there any options out there? I want to go for a longer rides with my kids of 4 and 8. One option is to buy a very light bike and train them every day (not gonna happen). Another option is to buy an ebike. I know everybody hate them, but I think is a really good option for a kid. One option I found is Haibike hardfour. You can buy one for around 1k. Are there any other options?


If e-bikes are legal on the trails you want to ride them on, sure, go for it. Have you looked at the specs on the Haibike though? 42 lb hardtail with a 2.5" travel fork, the cheapest Tektro brakes available, and dirt jump tires. That feels like you're robbing Peter to pay Paul. The ups will certainly be easier, but that may be a tough bike to handle on the downs.

This looks like a waaaay better option, but it's twice as expensive and you probably cant get it in the US
https://ebike-mtb.com/en/e-mtbs-for-kids/4/

The KTM that article covers doesn't look any better than the Haibike, and considering that it's E-MTB Magazine those three are probably your only options. I'm not anti-ebike (where they are legal) and I get where you're coming from, but the Haibike does not seem like a good option for the reasons already stated.

Personally, I'd save $960 and buy a TowWhee. Tow the 8 y.o. on the ups and turn her loose on the downs on a bike that doesn't weigh more than adult DH bikes. If you want to get both kids out, tow the 4 y.o. and make the 8 y.o. pedal herself up. The 4 y.o. with a tow is probably good for about as many miles as the 8 y.o. on her own. In a couple years she'll probably be faster than you are when pulling the young one, especially on a nice light bike that you bought with the money you saved not buying the e-bike.

Just MVHO. Like I said, I'm not anti-ebike, I just don't think that Haibike is the droid you're looking for.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

I actually made something very similar to towwee for my 4yo. Tried rope before, but it was a really stupid idea. 
Good call on the weight of the Haibike. Somehow I missed it. Way too heavy. KTM looks good and it’s not a big problem for me to bring it from Europe, but it looks like I can make something similar with my daughters current bike. There are a lot of different conversion kits out there.


----------



## RMCDan (Feb 28, 2008)

El_Zilcho said:


> I actually made something very similar to towwee for my 4yo. Tried rope before, but it was a really stupid idea.


Hah, yeah, you definitely need some stretch. Before the TowWhee was a thing I used bungee-in-webbing dog leashes that are basically the same thing. Hauled my little guy up some pretty long climbs.



El_Zilcho said:


> KTM looks good and it's not a big problem for me to bring it from Europe


Do you mean the Ben-E? The KTM weighs even more than the Haibike!


----------



## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

It also sounds like the existing pedal bike sucks for any sort of climbing. It might not be bad to see what getting her a proper bike would do for the climbing. Those plus bikes combined with the heavy fork is going to really slow a kid down on a climb, who knows maybe a really light pedal bike could get the kid close enough to make the trips possible with just some extra stops until she gets her legs. I know SteveXTC does some insane climbs (like 2-3k ft) with his kid (who I think is 8-ish) but that's the extreme.

Here's an idea (bear with me)
Those Ebikes aren't cheap (Oset is like 1600-2000$), I'd spend that money (and maybe a bit more) on an Uber light highend XC kid bike. 

1- Sell the RipRock24
2- Avoid the embarrassment of being an Ebike family (I'm joking)
3- Buy IsaBike Creig Pro Series 24"

Go on long rides together on an insanely nice bike that you'll get two kids out of. That Creig is only 19 lbs and change (Riprock is approx 29lbs). That will be nearly 10lbs dropped off the bike. HUGE, MASSIVE improvement in climbing for an 8yo and it'll be super capable over the Riprock since it has an actual usable suspension. She'll be able to manual off drops and climb techy stuff much better. Its amazing what happens when a kid gets on a really nice bike. Confidence goes up and so does their capabilities. Throw in the Towee solution and you are riding long with the girl.

Downside is that its a fair amount of more money than you want to spend but hey your kid could be a XC machine.


----------



## RMCDan (Feb 28, 2008)

Long shot, but demoing a Trailcraft/Creig Pro/etc. probably wouldn't be a waste of time.


----------



## SactoGeoff (Aug 11, 2017)

El_Zilcho said:


> My daughter (8yo) been riding downhill since 6. Green and blue trails at Mammoth and green Big Bear. If I could go to bike parks every week I would do it in a heartbeat and forget about ebikes. Unfortunately I only have time for it 2-3 times a year. With an eBike my daughter should be able to join me on my normal rides. She has a 24 Riprock now. It's a great bike, but too heavy for long rides.


Why not get your daughter a nice lightweight MTB and your 4yr old an E-Bike? Just throwing it out there. Might be a good excuse to get her the 26" Trailcraft she's likely to get sooner or later (if it fits). The difference between a 30lb RipRock and a 22lb bike will be significant. You won't likely get 15mile rides out of her anytime real soon. But you could get into the range of an "acceptable" distance that's entertaining enough for you and challenging for her. And have the little one on the E-Bike.


----------



## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

I've got a couple of perspectives... no proper answer..
My kid does XC and DH ... and we use uplifts on DH weekends...



Svinyard said:


> I know SteveXTC does some insane climbs (like 2-3k ft) with his kid (who I think is 8-ish) but that's the extreme.


It's not just my kid... we usually go with one of his buddies as well...
The most "insane" days though happen partly because the two are fairly evenly matched... or as a result of planned "Dad's only" days... that end up not being Dad's only.

That said we just "go riding"... and the kids just progressively keep up.



SactoGeoff said:


> Why not get your daughter a nice lightweight MTB and your 4yr old an E-Bike?


As I said above having two fairly evenly matched kids is the recipe for the HUGE days... they push each other.. whereas his buddies younger brother is just out of the equation. 
At one point his Dad and I were discussing it and he had thought perhaps the younger one maybe just wasn't going to do the cycling but with the advantage? of looking from an external view I said that perhaps it was the gap between the brothers and either rides had to be planned for one or the other..

Anyway, that is the riding with his XC buddy .... and in general that requires his XC bike..he's a lot bigger and heavier than his buddy so that does even out a bit in that he sometimes takes his FS...

On the last 3k climb it was both bikes... He did 1.5k on the XC then 1.5k on the FS
The difference was pretty huge (even though he used the lighter wheels on the FS)... that said the descent was also different but in the other way.

In some ways the 4yr old e-bike might solve part of this but personally I'd be very wary... 
My kid has another buddy... his dad owns a Bike park and 3 shuttle uplift services...and as a result he gets free uplifts... (and bike park access from his back garden)
Anyway, I think my wariness is his DH racing buddy just won't pedal ANYWHERE... 
It's either uplift or push... going back to the aim of riding with the family this is proving quite a challenge. 
... and my kid given a choice at any one time is getting less likely to choose the climb over an uplift (well who wouldn't)...
The difference for us is the uplift is a 1.5hr minimum drive.. whereas we have miles of trails at the door.. 
Give him the choice and we'd be at the uplifts every weekend or even evening... but once he's on the trails we have loads of fun...

We have some local DH's but they are all long and steep rides back (or push)... and the idea of an bike crossed my mind... we get more runs in... but then ALL we would ever do would be this.

Last weekend he had a DH race and it was a long weekend.. and we also took his HT to the bike park for the pump track and dirt jumps.. (even though the geo is far from ideal)..
His buddy who won't pedal had a try... and amazingly started pedalling....but overall I think it's going to be very hard to get a kid accustomed to either only uplift or an eBike to actually ride without assistance. My guess is its going to be a very difficult cat to get back in the bag.



> One option is to buy a very light bike and train them every day (not gonna happen).


All we have ever done is ride at weekends...
From 5 to the present 8.... 
This has been easy to be progressive (longer/further/faster etc.) because it's just the two of us...so I can see how having the 4yr old is going to prevent the 8yr old

My 8yr old is much bigger and stronger than his XC buddy... so in some ways we handicap him by letting him ride the FS on the big climbs.. as he races DH as well he's obviously much faster anyway on the descents so sticking him on the FS just makes that even bigger but not much we can do about that other than the decents are only a small time part of the days. When we do the truly epic climbs he switches to his lighter XC HT... I guess he also gets time to session parts of the descents as well so it sorta works out...

Anyway, I think the point is really that you don't need to train every day... we just ride weekends and kids progress so quickly

My thoughts are that we'll need an e-bike but it won't be for Jnr... but if he keeps going there is no way I will keep up without one in 10yrs when he's 18 and I'm 60...


----------



## Steve71 (Mar 15, 2004)

jestep said:


> Seems this is like getting a kid a cell phone. Hard to put that cat back in the bag once it's out.


That's not been my experience.

After outgrowing a few OSET's and Spawn MTB's, we gave our 9 year old a choice of a 24" OSET or a 24" Trail Craft Maxwell. She chose the MTB and loves climbing and sprinting and never complains about having to pedal.

It really just depends on the kid.


----------



## homeslice (Jun 3, 2008)

I'm teaching my child that some parents raise their children to become lazy, not value physical educate, and that he shouldn't associate with those people.

I'd rather raise him with values that merit physical health than to respect parental neglect. Call it elitist while I call it appropriation to proper physical health.

Keep ebikes away from children.


----------



## dc40 (Oct 4, 2013)

homeslice said:


> I'm teaching my child that some parents raise their children to become lazy, not value physical educate, and that he shouldn't associate with those people.
> 
> I'd rather raise him with values that merit physical health than to respect parental neglect. Call it elitist while I call it appropriation to proper physical health.


Lol... this most ignorant comment I heard for keeping your child away form e-bike. It great that you are teaching him the importance of health, but to classify parents that support it don't care about physical health is complete BS IMO.

Bikes (E-Bike, pedal, or motor) is about the kid having fun, period!!!!

I guess since my kid and I, only ride lift access (almost every weekend when schools gets out)... we don't care about his physical health. My kid hates XC riding, because he thinks it is boring... but can spend hours at the bike park or DJ. We even ride motocross, but he prefers downhill or DJ over that.

Is he physically fit, I would consider it. His primary sport is running... took 3rd in XC 8th grade conference this year, 2nd the previous year, won several 5k's for his age group and won multiple medals/events this year in Track.

He would take a lift access and/or E-bike over pedal assist anytime. Does that make him lazy, no just his preference.


----------



## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

homeslice said:


> I'm teaching my child that some parents raise their children to become lazy, not value physical educate, and that he shouldn't associate with those people.
> 
> I'd rather raise him with values that merit physical health than to respect parental neglect. Call it elitist while I call it appropriation to proper physical health.
> 
> Keep ebikes away from children.


Absolutely true! And not the slightest bit ridiculously elitist!

I got my son one of those Power Wheels ATVs when he was 4 and I've continued to neglect him for another 10 years. Inevitably, he's now so lazy and unhealthy, his life is pretty much ruined. If only someone like you had found it in themselves to deign to associate with the likes of people like us, maybe you could have shown us THE WAY before we made that fateful mistake in Toys R Us one Christmas season. :sad::sad::sad:


----------



## dc40 (Oct 4, 2013)

slapheadmofo said:


> If only someone like you had found it in themselves to deign to associate with the likes of people like us, maybe you could have shown us THE WAY before we made that fateful mistake in Toys R Us one Christmas season.


Slap... we are just terrible parents.


----------



## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

dc40 said:


> Slap... we are just terrible parents.


The worst.

I never was much for instilling an exclusionary mentality in my kid myself, or dissuading him from trying different things because of my own inability to operate outside my comfort zone. Guess I should work on that huh. 

I'm basically a weathered old XC rider and trail builder. Be great if my son loved the exact same thing, but he prefers speed, flow, air, and wheelies. Lots and lots of wheelies. I've had a lot of fun following his lead as far as what really brings him joy rather than trying to force him to fit neatly into my box. Ended up doing a lot of things, meeting people and going places I never would have otherwise.


----------



## swissarmychainsaw (Aug 4, 2010)

I buddy who is a serious mtb guy (leadville every year for 18 years) got a pair for his kids so that they will ride with him. He pedals his ass off and they ride with him (they are teenagers so I imagine them taunting him the whole way!)

Based on his recommendation I took an old full suspension bike and put a Luna Cycles kit on it. Very happy with the set up (also you can move to "the new bike" when they out grown the one they are on).

I use mine for commuting to work (40 miles round trip). It cuts the time in half and I'm not wasted when I get to work. But I'm getting old and fat.

Do it! The kids will love it


----------



## SactoGeoff (Aug 11, 2017)

Just announced this week. EU spec only at this time. Woom is rolling out an E-MTB

https://bikeshopgirl.com/blogs/upda...M28vRryYXxQGL1gdve0qxaOeob9OWo1ejZATykQR6WuEM


----------

