# Some Juice, Brownstone. Build, ride, review, etc.



## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

This is sort of just a heads up thread for now. I pulled the trigger on a Soma Juice yesterday afternoon. It will replace my old single speed frame. I'll get some pictures when it comes in, and comment a little on how looks, build it up, ride and and review it. I've seen a few builds on this bike, and some ride comments, but no real reviews on the frame. So, I'll do that here. Stay tuned.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

Cool! Always interested in that frame. Please give us a good report!


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## sroman (Aug 27, 2009)

+1, been looking the juice to replace an AL frame


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

I'm going to go off the reservation here for a minute.

I'm a little neurotic about having tracking information. It's a long story, but to give you an idea, literally the last thing I ordered and had shipped to be before this frame was destroyed in shipping. At first there wasn't going to be any refunding of anything on that shipment, or compensation of any kind, but because I had the tracking number, and the destroyed in transit code the shipping company provided rather than the "undeliverable" status the shipper provided, I was able to sort that out.

So, this frame was ordered this past Thursday, mid dayish from bikemania.biz - I immediately received an order confirmation email. Late saturday, having not received any status updates on the order, I sent them an email requesting an update. I was assured the frame was in stock and had shipped, and that the shipping department would get me a tracking number by monday afternoon. One additional email monday afternoon (having not received tracking information yet) where I received additional assurances I'd get tracking information, and I still haven't got it Wednesday morning.

I don't have the frame yet, but here's the thing - no matter how good the deal is, I personally find it stressful enough that I haven't received shipping information yet that I can promise I won't be ordering from bikemania.biz again. I hope to have an update soon where I actually have the frame in my hands.


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## SlowPokePete (Mar 27, 2006)

Cotharyus said:


> I'm going to go off the reservation here for a minute.
> 
> I'm a little neurotic about having tracking information. It's a long story, but to give you an idea, literally the last thing I ordered and had shipped to be before this frame was destroyed in shipping. At first there wasn't going to be any refunding of anything on that shipment, or compensation of any kind, but because I had the tracking number, and the destroyed in transit code the shipping company provided rather than the "undeliverable" status the shipper provided, I was able to sort that out.
> 
> ...


Wow...frustrating for sure...

Hope you get it sorted soon.

SPP


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

I know this doesn't help now, but when I ordered my Soma Double Cross frame last year, I ordered from Universal Cycles. I had it in no time at all. I ordered my fork direct through Soma Fab's website, again with no issues. I was so impressed with Universal Cycles' customer service and tech help; I ended up having them build me a custom set of wheels and they supplied the rest of the parts for the build.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Did you receive your frame yet? if so, post some pics.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

So, no frame yet. But as a further update on bikemania:

The frame was ordered May 1st. After 4 requests for tracking information, I received tracking information yesterday (one week after I placed the order). They had previously indicated that the frame had shipped on the 5th. Since bikemania is located in Jersey, I had expected it to maybe arrive yesterday. But it turns out the reason their prices are so low is because they have the frames drop shipped from Soma, because my frame shipped from California, according to the tracking information. So, I should have it Monday. You can do the math yourself. One week to get tracking information, 12 days from the date of order for an "in stock" item to receive it. But there you go. So, look for something from me early tuesday about unboxing and build stuff.


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## SlowPokePete (Mar 27, 2006)

Cotharyus said:


> So, no frame yet. But as a further update on bikemania:
> 
> The frame was ordered May 1st. After 4 requests for tracking information, I received tracking information yesterday (one week after I placed the order). They had previously indicated that the frame had shipped on the 5th. Since bikemania is located in Jersey, I had expected it to maybe arrive yesterday. But it turns out the reason their prices are so low is because they have the frames drop shipped from Soma, because my frame shipped from California, according to the tracking information. So, I should have it Monday. You can do the math yourself. One week to get tracking information, 12 days from the date of order for an "in stock" item to receive it. But there you go. So, look for something from me early tuesday about unboxing and build stuff.


Good to hear that at least it's coming...

SPP


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

Glad to hear you got some confirmation. I'm sure the frame will be super, and you'll have this whole mess behind you soon. I would be interested to see how the frame is packed too if you would shoot a photo. Can't wait to see your build!


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Well then. Lets have a look at what turned up at my door.

















Now, it could be I've just been suffering from massive single speed withdrawal, but even the box looks good to me. The packing was certainly quite good. Well secured in cardboard cutouts, double wrapped in bubble wrap and a good heavy plastic.


__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content

















So there it is with the protective stuff still in place - plastic spreader in the dropouts, plug in the seat tube, wrap through the BB, etc.









The finish on this thing is first class. I mean it looks and feels good. Flawless and smooth.

Keeping in mind this is an XXL sized frame (really, it seems to be the equal of everyone else's XL, but whatever) here it is on the scales at 5 lbs 10 oz.









I'm not going to go into huge detail about the build. Everything going on to the bike came off my old SS frame (Nashbar) which gave out on me. The bar and stem are the stock bits off that bike, the brakes are BB7's with Ashima Airotors. The wheels are Pacenti TL28's, 2.3 Exiwolf front, 2.25 Tioga Psycho Genius on the rear, both mounted tubeless. The BB and cranks are stock bits off the Nashbar bike. The seat post is an XCR carbon 400mm and the seat is the stock seat off my wife's Giant Talon, which is the same as the seat on my Giant Anthem, which works well for me, so I figured why not use the take off from her bike. The only thing that didn't transfer from the old bike was the seat tube clamp (different sizes) and the fork - the fork on this bike is the take off from a friends Redline Monocog (Flight?) - but other wise even the headset bearings and crown race came off the Nashbar bike. I did clean and repack the headset bearings while waiting for this frame.









So I have to go somewhere and find a seat post clamp - my LBS says they think they have a 30mm clamp laying around. But after that I'll ride it more than just in a circle around my yard. I'll get back with you then.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

Very cool! Thanks for the pics and the update!


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## SlowPokePete (Mar 27, 2006)

Looks great...

SPP


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Pretty light for a huge steel frame. My medium Inbred weighs the same or more. These seem under represented on the trails for such a decent frame.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

SS Hack said:


> Pretty light for a huge steel frame. My medium Inbred weighs the same or more. These seem under represented on the trails for such a decent frame.


My thoughts too. I haven't actually weighed the whole bike yet, but I suspect that this is actually going to end up lighter than my old SS by a couple ounces in spite of the weight of the frame. That's because the fork is almost a pound lighter than the fork on the old frame. I suspect a lack of dealers hurts sales for Soma. I only found 2 places online other than the Soma Fab website that sold these frames.

So, I got some work I needed to get done yesterday done by a little after noon, and had time to swing by my LBS, pick up a collar for the seat post, and make a little shake down run. I could sit here and nit pick a little - my initial guess on the seat height was too high, I dropped it down after the ride. The bike is a little longer than my old SS and my FS bike, but it's the right size - smaller would have been too short. I had three minor pedal strikes. That could be because the BB is a little lower, or because I'm out of practice and my timing is off. But on to things I can't explain.

Ok, I can explain this. This bike feels like it's got suspension compared to my old AL framed SS. Steel, for the win. I think the shape of the seat stays helps.

The mythos of steel? Maybe for this one. The frame let me feel the trail in a way that was almost more like an instinctive sixth sense than the brutal transmission of the trail on the AL frame. It made the trail come to me in a way I can't say I have ever experienced. I'm not saying I rode better yesterday than I ever have. In fact, there are a few places that adjusting to the bike caused me to not clean technical turns due to being wider than I expected in the turn, but other turns where I needed exactly the same tighter type of line I was able to nail. I'm just saying the trail felt really good, nothing seemed to surprise me.

Now for something way, way out. Remember, all of the components except the fork and the seat post collar on this bike are the same as what came off my other SS. And while I got the sense my other SS rolled faster than my FS bike, which I could just as easily write off as being tire related, this bike, with the same air pressure in the tires, was noticeably faster. Maybe the slacker head? Maybe the forgiveness of the steel frame? I don't know, but the bike was fast. I was able to pump and roll flats that I've had to pedal on before just because the pumps seemed to net me so much more speed.

A couple more quick pictures.









CS clearance with the 2.25. This picture may not do it justice. There's plenty of room even with the sliders slammed. If I was a half-link kind of guy, I could probably take a link out, put in a half link, and run the sliders slammed on this, or very close to it, with about the right chain tension. Gearing is 32/18.









Speaking of sliders, that's how it's set right now. You can also see one of my few gripes about the whole thing. The way the brake mounts puts a pretty good angle on the cables. Fortunately, I haven't noticed it adversely affects the performance or feel of the BB7's in any way. It just looks odd. If you look at this picture close, you can sort of see the lower part of the contour on the seat stays. I'm sure these get a little flex and it contributes to the plush feel of this frame.









On the whole, it was a pleasing ride. I'm still not certain it isn't just a smidge too long. I'm still looking to put some carbon bars on it, and when I do, I my make the new stem a 90mm rather than a 100.

That's all for now. More thoughts after I get some more saddle time.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

Thanks for the great write up. It's cool how you could plainly feel the trail feedback with the steel frame. I have never ridden a ti bike, but I have ridden some well done-aluminum and plastic bikes, but the info you seem to get from a steel frame is unique. Riding a Niner Air 9 scandium, and while being impressed with the feel of it, it is not the same as my old steel bikes. I'll have to look up the head angle on that frame. Is your new fork longer than your older one? If you get a chance, ride a nice steel bike into a hard turn with choppy pavement, and do it with a plastic bike. It's a great test.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

The new fork and old fork are identical axle to crown lengths. Soma says the resulting Geo should be 70.5. Believe it or not, that still makes it the slackest bike I've owned.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

That's pretty cool. I've only had XC geometry too, so it would be interesting to see how that would feel. The biggest thing I notice about my SS is that since the fork is rigid, the geometry doesn't change, resulting in a consistent feel. That may be the biggest thing I notice when I go back to a suspension fork. Maybe just the longer travel alone is the reason for the need of the slacker angles at sag--so when you are at full compression, you aren't at like 76 percent or something.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Any ride updates on your new Juice?


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Sure. I've put about 30 miles on the bike this week. The ride is plush. The head angle being a little more slack has made the bike feel a little better on some of the descents around here, but I haven't noticed it throwing me wide in turns. I have noticed the slightly longer wheel base in turns, but it was very easy to adjust to. I've put a couple of good climbs in, and this thing has traction for days, and climbs like a homesick angel. 

For all the plushness of the ride, I've noticed the bottom bracket doesn't flex as much as I expected it too. My old AL frame seemed very, very harsh in comparison to this bike, but I am certain there was more flex in the BB area than there is in this bike. I'd really like to be able to criticize this frame somewhere so you know I'm not just freaking in love with it because I've bought a new SS frame and happen to like it. But I honestly can't think of any downers about it at the moment. Except that after several months of no SS, riding 30 miles on it this week has made my legs sore, curse this bike. As punishment, I shall ride it more. There.

Seriously. The differences between this frame and the old one in geometry caused me to have to make a few adjustments to things - I'm still not certain I've got my seat exactly right, I think it's at the right height now, but maybe needs to go back a couple mm on the post. On the whole though, the feedback the frame provides is so good that you intuitively know what to do with it to make it do what you want to, the important signals don't get all cluttered up with a bunch of trail chatter and general harshness the way the old frame did. 

The bottom bracket on this frame is a little lower than the old one. I've had three pedal strikes, but none of them have been hard ones. It really rails turns when you lay it over though, something the other frame never really did as well as I'd have liked. Oh yes - jumping. Historically, I've made a habit of getting plenty of air time on bikes. I've managed a bit on this frame now, and can honestly say, this may be the best jumping bike I've ever owned. Take off seems automatic, and I haven't muffed a landing yet.

Nothing else to report right now. Oh. One thing. The color. Everyone sort of expected the bike to just be brown. I kind of did too. But it's much deeper than just brown, it's got some sort of gold fleck somewhere in the paint that gives the color a depth, almost like colorshift paint. Everyone has remarked how good the frame looks. One of my friends (a welder by profession) even spent about 3 minutes just looking at the welds, and said they were all very clean, and quite good looking. I already knew that because I weld too, but not professionally. It was cool to hear that from him.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Good to know that the Juice is still agile considering the longish chain stays. I've had a Jones Diamond, a Canfield N9 and an On One Scandal and the Scandal with the longest stays felt clumsy compared to the other two.


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## mwv (Jan 24, 2012)

Does it use SS specific dropout hardware?


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

mwv said:


> Does it use SS specific dropout hardware?


No, but I didn't expect it to. The drive side drop out has a derailleur hanger, and they're vertical drops, not track ends. Of course, with sliders, I'm not sure why you'd want track ends. As far as the hanger, the bike comes with frame fittings for everything - fenders, racks, whatever you could want to put on a bike. It's part of Soma's ideology. That said, if you want a drop out without a hanger on it, they posted on their blog that their sliders are Paragon compatible, so apparently, you can go to Paragon and order any sort of slider configuration you want for the Juice.


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## mwv (Jan 24, 2012)

Cotharyus said:


> No, but I didn't expect it to. The drive side drop out has a derailleur hanger, and they're vertical drops, not track ends. Of course, with sliders, I'm not sure why you'd want track ends. As far as the hanger, the bike comes with frame fittings for everything - fenders, racks, whatever you could want to put on a bike. It's part of Soma's ideology. That said, if you want a drop out without a hanger on it, they posted on their blog that their sliders are Paragon compatible, so apparently, you can go to Paragon and order any sort of slider configuration you want for the Juice.


Thanks. I figured that it did not but was not sure if there was a separate dropout on the drive side or not.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Wanted to throw this out there. I rode 2 mile loop yesterday that's one of the most technical (tight, rocks, run-ins, etc) and physically demanding (always up or down) trails in the area. This bike was like auto pilot. I know I was riding it, but really, I'd point it at lines that were a little less than perfect because they set you up better for the next section, and it didn't fight me. Timing always felt good on it, and effort translated well. It was a fun ride.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

Nice, I really liked my old green Juice--smooth and fun to ride. I think Somas are way under-represented considering how good they are. I'll take their sliders any day over the @#&^&! track ends on my Krampus.


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## phsycle (Apr 14, 2011)

seat_boy said:


> I'll take their sliders any day over the @#&^&! track ends on my Krampus.


Really? I am rather fond of the Surly track ends. In fact, I'll be building up a custom frame with track ends, as I think they're simple and reliable; albeit a bit cumbersom when changing wheels/tires.

Nice Soma, though. Good looking bikes.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I'm getting ready to sell my Krampus, so I've kind of given up on mastering the track ends, but last time I had to reinstall the wheel, I decided it was easier to just break the chain at the master link and do it that way. I'm using a SRAM derailer which I think makes it more difficult.

If you're running single speed, the track ends are only bad, not frustratingly awful.



phsycle said:


> Really? I am rather fond of the Surly track ends. In fact, I'll be building up a custom frame with track ends, as I think they're simple and reliable; albeit a bit cumbersom when changing wheels/tires.
> 
> Nice Soma, though. Good looking bikes.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Cotharyus said:


> Wanted to throw this out there. I rode 2 mile loop yesterday that's one of the most technical (tight, rocks, run-ins, etc) and physically demanding (always up or down) trails in the area. This bike was like auto pilot. I know I was riding it, but really, I'd point it at lines that were a little less than perfect because they set you up better for the next section, and it didn't fight me. Timing always felt good on it, and effort translated well. It was a fun ride.


How's the Juice treating you lately?


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Good. I still have no complaints at all, but I am getting ready to try a little wider bar on it to see if it helps or hinders. I've got a 690 on it, and picked up a 730 take off from a friend cheap. Once I figure out what I like, width wise, I'll pick that up in carbon. I've been leaning on this bike pretty hard for a while now, it's really been my work horse for the last month and a half or so. I build trail all the time, and prefer testing it on my SS to my geared FS bike. That way when people whine to me about how hard my trail is, I can tell them I clean it on my rigid SS. And oh yeah, this bike is still just a joy to ride. Makes me smile every time.


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## skidje (Oct 23, 2010)

hi, 
What are you dimensions?
Is that a Hollowtech 2 in de BB?
Which model?

Nice bike


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

193cm, 225lb

The crank is FSA gravity, BB is FSA GigaPipe I think, but the frame is threaded.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

I thought I'd drop an update on here. I picked up a set of Guides for my FS bike, so I pulled the XO brakes off that, and replaced the BB7's on the Juice with those XO's, which are significantly lighter, and much easier to keep from rubbing while still keeping good lever travel, and feel. It's a nice little upgrade. Dropped the weight of the bike down to 25lbs 5 oz.


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## NDD (Jul 22, 2013)

I think the bike shop I go to is about to start carrying soma bikes... inspiring write up.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Some updates and corrections. The crankset that was on the bike was a GRP Gravity crankset. It was the original crankset on my Nashbar 29er, and got migrated to this frame with everything else off that bike (some of which had been upgraded previously) when the frame took a dump. Recently, those cranks started displaying a somewhat troubling trend, in that the little plastic screw cap that tightened/torqued the cranks in the BB would back out. If I didn't tighten it back up about every other ride it would fall off and be lost. I was wondering where I could pick up an inexpensive crankset, when a buddy of mine ordered a brand new GT Sensor (top of the line carbon model) and announced he would be stripping the frame, selling all the components, and completely rebuilding it to HIS spec. - to my surprise, the bike came with a threaded BB, and RaceFace Turbine cranks. So I snapped those up and put them on the Soma yesterday to replace the failing GRPs. Result? Nice and smooth. As a bonus, the RaceFace crank and BB combo is 6 oz lighter than the GRP (not really surprising). Since the last update, the bike as also gotten a new saddle, which I don't know how happy I am with - although I don't actually USE the saddle that much, so I may live with it (it's too wide at the back though, which makes me a bit nervous when I have to get behind the seat real fast...maybe a dropper?) but anyhow, with all the changes, the bike now weighs in at 24 lbs 6 oz. It will soon be due for some new tires, and since what's on it now are basically just tires I had laying around, I suspect it will get something that rolls a little better than the Psycho Genius that's on the rear.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

Sounds great! How about a new photo? If my current frame kicks the bucket, I am considering the Soma. If I had the money, I would like to get a Double Cross DC frame, get disc wheels, and swap my old stuff over to that frame.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I recently built up a Juice as well. love it! with the sliders shoved all the way forward, my 32/20 gear fits perfectly with a new chain.


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## HPIguy (Sep 16, 2014)

Nice updates! I picked up some turbines myself for my B side on clearance last week. And yes, we need new pics!


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

New picture? Try this link. I've always had problems with pictures on these forums..

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ego8j0wa9iy5wq0/2015-02-14 09.36.58.jpg?dl=0


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

It's also worth noting, that somewhere along the way I missed posting the fact that I put a composite 690mm bar on this bike. Again, originally using the 660 bar than came on the Nashbar, I picked up a 730mm bar for my Giant Anthem, and swapped the stock 690 bar from that over to this. I decided I liked that width on here, so when I saw Bluesky running a deal ($49?) on the composite version of the giant bar, I snapped one up. It really helped with vibrations going through the bars. It seems less fatiguing on my arms now over longer distances.


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## HPIguy (Sep 16, 2014)

Cotharyus said:


> New picture? Try this link. I've always had problems with pictures on these forums..
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ego8j0wa9iy5wq0/2015-02-14 09.36.58.jpg?dl=0


Looks great :thumbsup:


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## kikoraa (Jul 25, 2011)

So you ride an xl frame and opted to go with xxl? I ride large and am worried about going xl. Seatpost would stick out 10 inches on a 17.5 large juice for me.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

Soma seems to size their description up one size from what is typical. I typically ride an XL frame, but the "XXL" (22") Juice fit fine.



kikoraa said:


> So you ride an xl frame and opted to go with xxl? I ride large and am worried about going xl. Seatpost would stick out 10 inches on a 17.5 large juice for me.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

kikoraa said:


> So you ride an xl frame and opted to go with xxl? I ride large and am worried about going xl. Seatpost would stick out 10 inches on a 17.5 large juice for me.


Right, so what I did was look at the top tube length. To me, that's pretty much the key to whether or not a bike fits me. Some manufacturers I ride a large, some XL, this is XXL because I like my TTL right at 25" - for me that's the starting point on a bike fitting me, and I go from there. Everything else is adjustable. You can get longer seat posts (I run a 400mm post anyhow) or shorter seat posts, stems, wider or narrower bars, and different crank lengths. But if the bike is too short or too long for you in the frame, you pretty much have to start over.


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## Andy R (Nov 26, 2008)

Cotharyus said:


> I build trail all the time, and prefer testing it on my SS to my geared FS bike. That way when people whine to me about how hard my trail is, I can tell them I clean it on my rigid SS.


Funnily enough, I do exactly the same.


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## iowamtb (May 17, 2014)

Thanks for the review. I am more excited now to get on my bside. I am almost done with it. FWIW I ordered my frame from Tree Fort Bikes. Not only were their prices cheaper than anyone elses, I had prompt shipment with tracking numbers. My only gripe on mine so far is that one of the brake cable anchors has solder inside the slot so nothing will fit in there to hold the cable. I tried a skinny zip tie and it still won't fit. I am not sure I need it though. It is the one that gives you such an extreme angle on the rear cable so maybe I will just leave it undone? After trying to shove some tiny allen wrenches through to break out what I thought was a paint bubble, I discovered it was solder. I gave up and took some finger nail polish and dabbed it inside to cover up any chipped paint I may have created.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

I picked up some new tires this month, which was kind of a big deal, because the front tire was actually pushing 3 or four years, and the rear was bought as a cheap tire, in a pinch, and was never that good to start with - actually, it was bought for another bike. So, I had a knackered WTB Exiwolf up front, and a Tioga Psycho Genius on the rear. Being a guy who likes some volume to his tires, I came across the Vee Rubber Speed-R 2.4 on Jenson for $21 and figured I could pick two of those up and my feelings wouldn't really be hurt if it didn't work at all, or didn't work well as a rear, or whatever. But the tread pattern looked a lot like an Ardent (which I love on my FS) while being much lower in the center (faster rolling) and lighter.

I finally got a chance to put them on and take the bike for a spin, and on the whole, they did pretty well. Now it's just a matter of seeing how they do over time. I'm not sure the rear is going to stay there - it might be a bit delicate for a rear tire, given some of the rocky trails I ride, I may put an EXO Ikon back there. But I did get a few pictures of the bike with the 2.4's on it so you can get an idea of frame clearance.









So, that's not a lot of clearance, but it doesn't rub anywhere. Should be fine unless you find yourself in sticky mud, but I certainly wouldn't go any larger on the Juice.









It looks good with a lot of rubber on it. I'd say these tires have at least the volume of a 2.4 Ardent, maybe a little more.









For what it's worth, these tires are significantly lighter than the old ones, 7 oz as a pair. To be honest, I'm a little surprised this bike has gotten this light. Remember, thats an XXL steel frame, with no real weight weenie parts on it, because I'm way to heavy a guy to ride weight weenie parts.


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## Forged1 (Dec 8, 2011)

*Nice!*


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## Raging Thor (May 28, 2016)

I just bought a L Juice frame and am attempting my first bike build. What brand and size headset did you use?


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

good old Cane Creek 40. cheap and does the job. the model/size you need depends on the fork you want to put in it.


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## Raging Thor (May 28, 2016)

I have a Surly Krampus. Would the below model work?

http://www.amazon.com/Cane-Creek-ZS...words=Cane+Creek+40+ZS44/EC44+Headset+Tapered


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

mack_turtle said:


> good old Cane Creek 40. cheap and does the job. the model/size you need depends on the fork you want to put in it.


Exactly.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Raging Thor said:


> I have a Surly Krampus. Would the below model work?
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Cane-Creek-ZS...words=Cane+Creek+40+ZS44/EC44+Headset+Tapered


Yes.


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## skidje (Oct 23, 2010)

Gents, ANyone ever tried a 650B/27,5 rear wheel in de Soma Juice? I'm considering this wheel for the rear with a 29er plus in front in Krampus fork.

Would a rim (inner width 45) fit with a 2,8 tire?

I have the 2013 Juice Green (22")


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

skidje said:


> Gents, ANyone ever tried a 650B/27,5 rear wheel in de Soma Juice? I'm considering this wheel for the rear with a 29er plus in front in Krampus fork.
> 
> Would a rim (inner width 45) fit with a 2,8 tire?
> 
> I have the 2013 Juice Green (22")


The green frame is older than mine, so I can't speak specifically to that, but I haven't put anything other than 29" wheels on mine, and I suspect that a 2.4 is the limit for a 29er on a 23mm inner width. The whole bike is designed a little old school, so I'd try to verify fit before you spend money on it.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

It seems to me a sweet spot for the fatter tires deal is a 30mm inside width with a 2.8. Picked up Flows at DirtFest with 2.8 on there (think they were Nobby Nics) and was amazed at the lightweight. Thought it might be cool to put that combo on. My WTB wheels are 8 years old and I seem to be knocking them out of true pretty quickly on the rocky and rooted trails that I ride on. Going to get a set up from a guy who has them to test the fit, so I'll post some measurements and fit on my '07 KHS Solo One SE. Might answer a lot of questions. Hopefully have a Juice one day!


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

WARNING!!!! the new juices have a structural weakness like the last version except this time it's in a different spot.

Had my juice for 4 months and the frame has cracked right where the sliders are welded to the frame....clean crack right along the "weld". To make matters worse soma customer service is nonexistent

You have been warned...the frame may ride well but for how long before it cracks and leaves you facked


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## skidje (Oct 23, 2010)

Cotharyus said:


> The green frame is older than mine, so I can't speak specifically to that, but I haven't put anything other than 29" wheels on mine, and I suspect that a 2.4 is the limit for a 29er on a 23mm inner width. The whole bike is designed a little old school, so I'd try to verify fit before you spend money on it.


I fitted a 650B rim with 35 mm internals and the panaracer nimble 3.5 which in the real world has a width of 66 mm. I still have to go for a spin and what I heard it will stretch a couple of mm in due time. So far it fits perfectly and look nice with 29plus in the front.


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## hardmtnbiker (Feb 22, 2005)

Very nice write up! Rigid steel single speeds look awesome. Great color too.


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

I had the same bike and loved it. I just downsized and now my fatbike wears 29er wheels sometimes. The Juice was wicked fun, and it went to a good home.

Here was my review:

Steel Magnolia: My Review of the Soma Juice 29er


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Singletrackd said:


> WARNING!!!! the new juices have a structural weakness like the last version except this time it's in a different spot.


Is this the new belt drive friendly version? I emailed Soma this week and heard back within 48 hours.

In other news, my Juice is about to be my only bike as soon as someone buys my Double Cross Disc.


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## slohr (May 22, 2008)

skidje said:


> I fitted a 650B rim with 35 mm internals and the panaracer nimble 3.5 which in the real world has a width of 66 mm. I still have to go for a spin and what I heard it will stretch a couple of mm in due time. So far it fits perfectly and look nice with 29plus in the front.


Curious if you have gotten a good test ride in with your new set up. Looking at some 27.5 wheels with 29mm internal width, and possibly trying the rocket ron liteskin 2.8s.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I'm always oddly envious of you one bike guys, but I just can't do it. I just can't combine "mountain bike" with "bike with fenders and racks and stuff to ride around town with" and "zippy road bike." That doesn't explain my other four bikes though...



mack_turtle said:


> In other news, my Juice is about to be my only bike as soon as someone buys my Double Cross Disc.


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

seat_boy said:


> I'm always oddly envious of you one bike guys, but I just can't do it. I just can't combine "mountain bike" with "bike with fenders and racks and stuff to ride around town with" and "zippy road bike." That doesn't explain my other four bikes though...


I have a Pugsley, with two sets of wheels, 26er fat wheels for snow and 29er plus wheels for touring/MTB.

Then I have a Soma Double Cross, which is sometimes a go-fast road bike on 28mm slicks, and sometimes a commuter with a basket, and sometimes an adventure/CX bike with 41mm rubber.

Two bikes, but it feels like a full stable.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Singletrackd said:


> WARNING!!!! the new juices have a structural weakness like the last version except this time it's in a different spot.
> 
> Had my juice for 4 months and the frame has cracked right where the sliders are welded to the frame....clean crack right along the "weld". To make matters worse soma customer service is nonexistent
> 
> You have been warned...the frame may ride well but for how long before it cracks and leaves you facked


I had a Juice frame the non belt drive, was yours belt drive?


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

seat_boy said:


> I'm always oddly envious of you one bike guys, but I just can't do it. I just can't combine "mountain bike" with "bike with fenders and racks and stuff to ride around town with" and "zippy road bike." That doesn't explain my other four bikes though...


I am trying to be a one-bike-guy due to budget. I know my Juice is not a good road bike, but i would rather have one really nice mountain bike that I can use on the road in a pinch than two mediocre bikes. I don't have the disposable income for more than one really nice bike, hense the single bike.


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

djembe975 said:


> I had a Juice frame the non belt drive, was yours belt drive?


Nope just the regular Soma Juice Brownstone and so far only one email back from Soma customer service asking for pictures and that was over a week ago.

Just sucks because I was debating the Soma Juice, Salsa el Mariachi, and the surly karate monkey. I have had experience with both salsa and surly customer service and they kick ass....that plus the fact that the bikes are built a lot stronger. I know that soma frames are made in almost the same location as surly, it just doesn't seem that soma fabrications understands how to make a strong mountain bike.

Now I'm just going to suck it up and buy a salsa el mariachi frame like I should have done in the 1st place even though it'll cost 200 more than the soma frame it'll be totally worth it . Soma warranty says I have to pay for all the shipping cost and assembly cost on my warrantied frame so there goes all the money I saved buying a soma frame


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Well, slow response is particularly frustrating here, because that should clearly be a warranty issue. Welds simply shouldn't break, period. I don't think the bike is weak, as mine has held up to me for 2 years and change so far (I PR'd a big climb on it just yesterday) which is just more evidence that there's something abnormal with yours. Keep us posted on how it works out. To be honest, when I bought this frame, being steel, I didn't look too hard at the warranty - for AL bikes, I'm a fan of lifetime frame warranties. But I've got a welder sitting in the garage, so I'm not afraid to stick this one back together.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I know you're mad at this point, I would be too, but it should not be too expensive or burdensome to remove the seapost, wheel, fork, cranks, and brakes from the frame and send it to Soma. Shipping should be less than $30 unless you have to ship it overseas.


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

So soma ended up sending me a new soma juice to replace my broken one but I noticed that the design of the rear dropouts have changed...notice how one the newest frames they filled in the open space that was on the rear dropouts

Hopefully it's stronger


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Singletrackd said:


> So soma ended up sending me a new soma juice to replace my broken one but I noticed that the design of the rear dropouts have changed...notice how one the newest frames they filled in the open space that was on the rear dropouts
> 
> Hopefully it's stronger


What is that oval tab in the drop outs for?


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

djembe975 said:


> What is that oval tab in the drop outs for?


Err to make it even stronger...idk


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Did they send you the belt drive version?


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

No but that woulda been cool......rode it today and it felt good to be back in the single speed. Definitely like the added confidence with the beefed up dropout.l, without that I was probably going to change frames, but I am a big guy and I bounce around a lot


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

Does that tab interfere with the bolt being tightened unevenly? Based on the pics it looks like it.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

Good to hear they were able to set you up with a new frame. It's a different look for sure, but I don't know how much stronger it might make it. Regardless, there was something wrong if the first one broke, I doubt you'll have problems with this. It's just so unusual to break a steel frame since it doesn't fatigue like aluminum does, but anything that breaks on a weld is a manufacturing problem.

I had a hard time figuring out what oval tab you were talking about - looks like it's flat with the surface that the rest of the bolt head contacts to me - shouldn't interfere.


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