# Downhill parks with a hardtail



## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

I just wanted to get a general discussion going on how everyone feels about riding a hardtail at a downhill bike Park. I recently rode my trek x-caliber at Burke mountain in Vermont and felt ok about it. It was my first time trying anything like this so I was 100 percent unprepared. (no pads, no full face helmet, hardtail, wore a pack).... Anyway my buddies and I are planning a few more trips to some parks closer to us, particularly blue Mountain in pa and mountain Creek in North jersey. I know everyone recommends using a full suspension on these type of rides but wanted to know if anyone rides a hardtail or even prefers. Why one more than the other. 

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## CarolinaPanthers (Feb 22, 2013)

Personally, I personally would be terrified riding an XC ht at Creek or Blue. I can't speak for the trails at Burke, but the trails at Creek and Blue are steep. Not sure how your bike is set up, but I am picturing a steep HA, longer stem, narrow bars, and all around geometry that would sketch me out. Blue is also super loose, and I would be more unnerved about the HT skittering around/not finding any traction on the loose stuff than the big hits. 

Not sure how your bike is set up but, at the minimum I wouldn't bring a HT to the park short stem, wide bars, and big tires. And proper brakes! Even still, you might find yourself running out of suspension rather quickly.

All that said, it's doable! Depends on your bike handling skills, but you'll have to take it slow and be smart with your line choices. I personally wouldn't run a HT, but it is doable. Just make sure you rock a full face!


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

CarolinaPanthers said:


> Personally, I personally would be terrified riding an XC ht at Creek or Blue. I can't speak for the trails at Burke, but the trails at Creek and Blue are steep. Not sure how your bike is set up, but I am picturing a steep HA, longer stem, narrow bars, and all around geometry that would sketch me out. Blue is also super loose, and I would be more unnerved about the HT skittering around/not finding any traction on the loose stuff than the big hits.
> 
> Not sure how your bike is set up but, at the minimum I wouldn't bring a HT to the park short stem, wide bars, and big tires. And proper brakes! Even still, you might find yourself running out of suspension rather quickly.
> 
> All that said, it's doable! Depends on your bike handling skills, but you'll have to take it slow and be smart with your line choices. I personally wouldn't run a HT, but it is doable. Just make sure you rock a full face!


Def understand what your saying. I've got some pretty beefy tires on my bike for sure. Maxxis high Roller 2s in a 2.3. Some nukeproof electron pedals that really keep my feet grounded. Upgraded double wall rims, although nothing too over the top expensive, just better than what there was. My brakes work great as well. Other than that the bike is more or less stock other than cosmetics. I felt ok in Vermont but I def felt every jump I didn't land just right. Some of the more technical black diamonds were a bit rough on me as well but the majority of the riding I felt pretty good. We did a good 15 runs up there as well and I would of done 15 more if we had the time. Everyone seems pretty hell bent on not using one at blue or mountain Creek though.

I'm not apposed to renting a full suspension, most likely will when we do go though.

Just purchased a new 661 comp helmet and knee pads as well I can't wait to try out...

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## aerius (Nov 20, 2010)

Me, circa 2002, about to start a run down the world cup DH course at Mont Sainte Anne. Note the complete lack of preparedness, but I was in my early 20s and pretty reckless so it all somehow worked out, only had one crash in a week of riding there and walked away without a scratch. It was actually pretty fun, it was by far the most challenging riding I've ever done in my life and it improved my riding skills a ton.

With that said, no way I'd ride MSA at my age on a hardtail, I don't have the Jedi-like reflexes and dialed in the zone flow that I did in my youth. My local DH parks are no problem on a hardtail, though I am a bit sore the next day once the trails get beaten in with braking bumps. Overall, I'd say I'm in the full suspension camp these days.


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## Joules (Oct 12, 2005)

It's not really the lack of suspension that would sketch me out, it's the steep head angle and inability to get the seat low enough.

The berm/jump trails at Creek, I'd have no problem with. 80% of the trails there are steep and rocky though - to me, way more fun to ride on a proper DH bike. (I for one practically have my ass on the back tire most of the way down, I've never ridden an XC bike where that was feasible).
OTOH, every time I'm at Blue, I see a couple hardtails. 

Rentals at Blue are like half the price of any other resort I've been to - though there's a good chance that having ridden a proper DH bike, you'll feel compelled to own a proper DH bike.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

Joules said:


> It's not really the lack of suspension that would sketch me out, it's the steep head angle and inability to get the seat low enough.
> 
> The berm/jump trails at Creek, I'd have no problem with. 80% of the trails there are steep and rocky though - to me, way more fun to ride on a proper DH bike. (I for one practically have my ass on the back tire most of the way down, I've never ridden an XC bike where that was feasible).
> OTOH, every time I'm at Blue, I see a couple hardtails.
> ...


Yea the compelled to own a DH bike is one that bothers me.... When we did Burke mountain in Vermont my buddy rented one and now he's looking to drop 2500 on one. Something I just can't afford to do. I wanna say he was on a trek fuel, and I tried it out for half a ride but felt so uncomfortable on it. The handlebars felt much wider than my x-caliber and didn't feel safe to me at all. I've only been rising mountain bikes now for less than a year though and that was my first time at a downhill Park.

I know blue Mountain is supposed to be a lot more rocky than Vermont too so I'll most likely rent the first time, see how it is and decide to ride my hardtail the next time.

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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

aerius said:


> Me, circa 2002, about to start a run down the world cup DH course at Mont Sainte Anne. Note the complete lack of preparedness, but I was in my early 20s and pretty reckless so it all somehow worked out, only had one crash in a week of riding there and walked away without a scratch. It was actually pretty fun, it was by far the most challenging riding I've ever done in my life and it improved my riding skills a ton.
> 
> With that said, no way I'd ride MSA at my age on a hardtail, I don't have the Jedi-like reflexes and dialed in the zone flow that I did in my youth. My local DH parks are no problem on a hardtail, though I am a bit sore the next day once the trails get beaten in with braking bumps. Overall, I'd say I'm in the full suspension camp these days.


That's exactly how I looked in Vermont lol. Hardtail and regular helmet while 12 year old kids road around on full suspensions and full body gear....

I liked the challenge as well though and it def made me a much better rider even after one day.

It's kind of hard for me to justify dropping a few grande on a bike right now for a few different reasons. One, the most important reason is I'm broke lol. 2, I'm not exactly as young as i once was (33), and although I'm in great shape and feel pretty good riding who knows how many years of that kind of riding I actually have left. 3, I've spentclose to 1200 on the bike I have now and it's not even a year old. I'd like to stay married lol....

I've been looking anyway though. I'd say There's at least a chance I spend some money on a used one before next year's season.

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## Terp (Jul 25, 2013)

Forget the parks, I can't tolerate a hard tail on most of my local trails (rocky mountains...some trails are legit black diamonds). 

Anyway for me dh parks are pure concentrated endorphins and adrenaline injected straight into my brain with a firehose. A dh bike is the supercharger and nitrous on the pump because you don't have to waste time thinking. Pick a line through a rock garden? Nah just try and clear the whole thing. Not enough speed for a table? Launch anyway and land on the knuckle. A dh bike can take all the abuse you can throw at it and you don't have to maintain a rental. 

Sure its possible to ride a hard tail. Ride a unicycle if you want, it's just going to be a lot more work and you probably get enough of that during the week.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

Terp said:


> Forget the parks, I can't tolerate a hard tail on most of my local trails (rocky mountains...some trails are legit black diamonds).
> 
> Anyway for me dh parks are pure concentrated endorphins and adrenaline injected straight into my brain with a firehose. A dh bike is the supercharger and nitrous on the pump because you don't have to waste time thinking. Pick a line through a rock garden? Nah just try and clear the whole thing. Not enough speed for a table? Launch anyway and land on the knuckle. A dh bike can take all the abuse you can throw at it and you don't have to maintain a rental.
> 
> Sure its possible to ride a hard tail. Ride a unicycle if you want, it's just going to be a lot more work and you probably get enough of that during the week.


Completely understand where your coming from. The more comfortable I got with the speeds and jumps the more balls I got to go faster and jump farther. Problem is you don't alway go fast enough or jump far enough and that hit on top is pretty heavy at times.

I did enjoy the challenge but there were plenty of jumps I took that I landed wrong and wished I never tried and plenty more I wouldn't try at all because of my suspension.

Were gonna try to hit up blue mountain in another week, weather permitting and I'll def be renting a Scott or trek fuel from a more local shop.

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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

you can ride anything on a hardtail if you have skills but you go a lot slower ....and at the end of the day you will ache less with a full dh bike


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

SHIVER ME TIMBERS said:


> you can ride anything on a hardtail if you have skills but you go a lot slower ....and at the end of the day you will ache less with a full dh bike


Yea i def had some pretty sore muscles the last time I went. Mainly from biting the top of a few Hills. I'm so comfortable with my bike and I think that's what's holding me back some from renting..

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## GoingNowhere (Oct 15, 2014)

I've ridden Killington in VT on a single speed hardtail dirt jump bike (riding on Holy Rollers at that). There are some pedally parts on some of the trails there - especially if you are taking n00bs out on green trails. That part sucked the most. As far as going down the trails if it was flowy I was fine. Whenever I pull that bike out at a park people are usually more amazed I can pedal at all with the seat slammed as low as it is and don't even notice it's a single speed.

All that being said, I just picked up an older Kona Stab Supreme for use at parks. For me, at the end of the day I always have way more fun on a fully. I don't have to worry about what trails I go down. I also don't have to worry about blowing up my DJ/urban assault bike. Going forward I'll probably only bring one of my hardtails out if I'm going to the mountain with my better half.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

GoingNowhere said:


> I've ridden Killington in VT on a single speed hardtail dirt jump bike (riding on Holy Rollers at that). There are some pedally parts on some of the trails there - especially if you are taking n00bs out on green trails. That part sucked the most. As far as going down the trails if it was flowy I was fine. Whenever I pull that bike out at a park people are usually more amazed I can pedal at all with the seat slammed as low as it is and don't even notice it's a single speed.
> 
> All that being said, I just picked up an older Kona Stab Supreme for use at parks. For me, at the end of the day I always have way more fun on a fully. I don't have to worry about what trails I go down. I also don't have to worry about blowing up my DJ/urban assault bike. Going forward I'll probably only bring one of my hardtails out if I'm going to the mountain with my better half.


I'm not sure how Killington compares to Burke but I thought Burke was amazing. The summit wasn't open due to races going on but the first lift took you up quite aways to about 4 black diamonds, one double black, one green circle and a blue square.

Being our first time we rode the circle a few til we got more comfortable and worked our way into the blue square. That was by far the best trail there called jester. Highly recommended that to anyone hardtail or not. The black diamonds were a more technical and extremely rough on a hardtail. That we only did one time as it took too much out of us. We never tried out the double black Diamond. We watched plenty of videos on it and felt we weren't quite ready for anything like that.

My only real regret is no knowing about this stuff until my current age of 33. It was probably some of the most fun I've ever had in my life...

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## Terp (Jul 25, 2013)

Kkon18 said:


> My only real regret is no knowing about this stuff until my current age of 33. It was probably some of the most fun I've ever had in my life...


Man I hear that. I too have wasted 30 odd years of my life.


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## GoingNowhere (Oct 15, 2014)

Kkon18 said:


> I'm not sure how Killington compares to Burke but I thought Burke was amazing. The summit wasn't open due to races going on but the first lift took you up quite aways to about 4 black diamonds, one double black, one green circle and a blue square.
> 
> Being our first time we rode the circle a few til we got more comfortable and worked our way into the blue square. That was by far the best trail there called jester. Highly recommended that to anyone hardtail or not. The black diamonds were a more technical and extremely rough on a hardtail. That we only did one time as it took too much out of us. We never tried out the double black Diamond. We watched plenty of videos on it and felt we weren't quite ready for anything like that.
> 
> ...


I haven't ridden Burke, yet. I like Killington a lot and go there the most for lift assisted riding. Like you, I mostly avoided anything too crazy on the hardtail.


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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

sure its doable but a full on dh rig will be much more enjoyable/fun. You'll get used to the bar width. here is some help justifying a full bike:
1. you can get one quite cheap used
2. your $1300 nice bike that you just got will be absolutely thrashed if you spend time doing dh with it.


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## Gemini2k05 (Apr 19, 2005)

Kkon18 said:


> I know everyone recommends using a full suspension on these type of rides but wanted to know if anyone rides a hardtail or even prefers. Why one more than the other.


No one who knows what they are doing, prefers riding hardtails on true DH trails. No one. If they do they are either A. Very young, B. Dumb, or C. Not riding real DH trails



Kkon18 said:


> I've got some pretty beefy tires on my bike for sure. Maxxis high Roller 2s in a 2.3.


Those are probably not beefy tires.



Kkon18 said:


> I wanna say he was on a trek fuel, and I tried it out for half a ride but felt so uncomfortable on it. The handlebars felt much wider than my x-caliber and didn't feel safe to me at all.


Very incorrect assesment.


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## GoingNowhere (Oct 15, 2014)

pizon said:


> sure its doable but a full on dh rig will be much more enjoyable/fun. You'll get used to the bar width. here is some help justifying a full bike:
> 1. you can get one quite cheap used
> 2. your $1300 nice bike that you just got will be absolutely thrashed if you spend time doing dh with it.


Exactly why I picked up a dedicated DH rig. Used ones are cheap and I didn't want to eat up my hardtails going down hill. It's also much more fun knowing you can ride any trail at the park.


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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

Lance Canfield broke a shock on his Jedi at whistler after this stunt (video Below)....after that ...he rode a hardtail 29'er and just killed us on the techy trails...he was a beast


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

SHIVER ME TIMBERS said:


> Lance Canfield broke a shock on his Jedi at whistler after this stunt (video Below)....after that ...he rode a hardtail 29'er and just killed us on the techy trails...he was a beast


Yea that looked like a pretty heavy blow... I def dont wanna blow out my front shocks. I don't want to have to replace them until next year...

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## SuperbMan (Dec 17, 2004)

Look at it this way: Why go to a DH bike Park? I mean, you are actually traveling and paying for something specific. What they offer is FUN, absolute, worth the money adrenaline fused FUN with little to no pedaling required. They offer an upgraded level of thrill with professional, purpose built mountain bike trails that are all one-way, and therefore steeper and more exciting than even the best trails we all regularly ride and love on our xc/ trail riding excursions. 

Yeah, you 'can' ride an xc bike on the flow trails and do 'ok'..you add an element of 1. suffering, 2. sketchiness and 3. hyper-vigilance to a day that ought to be devoid of all of those…in fact, that's what you are PAYING for when you opt for a bike park. 

Honestly, without a slacker, burlier, dual suspension bike (not necessarily or even primarily and true DH bike, I don't own one, I ride a near ghetto level Norco Range) you are completely missing out on the whole experience the park was designed for and you are paying for. Yes, a good rider can 'navigate' most of the trails at most east coast bike parks on a hard tail…but is that what you came and paid for-just to 'navigate' the trails??? Rent a big bike for one day and you'll get it…it's about fun and adrenaline, save the suffering and survival for free xc mountain bike days.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

SuperbMan said:


> Look at it this way: Why go to a DH bike Park? I mean, you are actually traveling and paying for something specific. What they offer is FUN, absolute, worth the money adrenaline fused FUN with little to no pedaling required. They offer an upgraded level of thrill with professional, purpose built mountain bike trails that are all one-way, and therefore steeper and more exciting than even the best trails we all regularly ride and love on our xc/ trail riding excursions.
> 
> Yeah, you 'can' ride an xc bike on the flow trails and do 'ok'..you add an element of 1. suffering, 2. sketchiness and 3. hyper-vigilance to a day that ought to be devoid of all of those&#8230;in fact, that's what you are PAYING for when you opt for a bike park.
> 
> Honestly, without a slacker, burlier, dual suspension bike (not necessarily or even primarily and true DH bike, I don't own one, I ride a near ghetto level Norco Range) you are completely missing out on the whole experience the park was designed for and you are paying for. Yes, a good rider can 'navigate' most of the trails at most east coast bike parks on a hard tail&#8230;but is that what you came and paid for-just to 'navigate' the trails??? Rent a big bike for one day and you'll get it&#8230;it's about fun and adrenaline, save the suffering and survival for free xc mountain bike days.


Some really good points there. As long as I've waited to go in between the last time I went I better do it the right way. We actually just reserved a few bikes to rent for the day too. A Scott Park 29er, Scott spark 27.5 and a trek fuel 29er. Not specifically designated DH bikes but will be considerably better than my hardtail.

I guess it all depends on the park and terrain as to weather or not a hardtail should even be considered. I felt perfectly comfortable on mine in Vermont but from watching videos of blue Mountain pa it would be absolutely brutal on most of the trails there.

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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

Why are you renting xc bikes to go DH??? In that case just save your cash and use your hardtail. Or you know just rent a proper bike. There is a reason people buy these bikes for this sport, and its not because our wallets are weighed down with excess cash


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

pizon said:


> Why are you renting xc bikes to go DH??? In that case just save your cash and use your hardtail. Or you know just rent a proper bike. There is a reason people buy these bikes for this sport, and its not because our wallets are weighed down with excess cash


The main reason is my one buddy is lookin to actually buy one of those three bikes in the future so he wants to see if he likes any one over the other. He actually used a fuel in Vermont too and did considerably better than me and my other buddy did on our hard tails. Again I know the difference in terrain between Burke and blue are considerably different but none of us are are going to be going over the top crazy anyway. Were all in our 30s and have only rode a park one other time before we go again. I also just assumed riding any full suspension bike would be considerably better than a hard tail anyway....

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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

Why keep mentioning 30? I'm 28. There are plenty people here over 40 who still rip. Anyways just seemed odd that you would go to Dh park to ride Dh and purposely rent bikes that are not really suitable for the terrain. Maybe rent a proper bike one of the days to see the difference


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

pizon said:


> Why keep mentioning 30? I'm 28. There are plenty people here over 40 who still rip. Anyways just seemed odd that you would go to Dh park to ride Dh and purposely rent bikes that are not really suitable for the terrain. Maybe rent a proper bike one of the days to see the difference


I only mention that I'm in my 30s because I just started riding. I just bought my first bike less than a year ago so mtb in general is extremely new to me ya know. Downhill riding wasn't even anything I knew even existed before a few months ago. Now I'm hooked and just trying to learn a little more about it I guess. Nothing like that rush. I'll Der consider renting one of their bikes next time I go though if it really would be that much of a difference. While we're on the subject though, what is the main differences between an XC FS bike and an actually DH bike? Is it just travel?

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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

No, its geometry actually - longer wheel base and slacker headangle make going downhill at speed more comfortable and safer. It's easier to steer and you don't feel like flying over the bars on steep sections.


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

I'm 41, and I ride with plenty of people in their 30s and 40s who rip just as hard as our friends in their 20s. You're nowhere near as old as you think you are (but it'll catch up with you if you keep thinking that).

Again, although these are FS bikes, they're solidly in the XC/Trail category. If the main point of these rentals is for a demo with potential purchase in mind, why not find an interesting new trail network in the area and make a day of that? Would you test drive a sport sedan on a rock crawling trail? Bike parks come in two flavors: 1) bring your DH bike, or 2) just bring your AM bike. I've only skied Blue Mountain and that was 20 years ago, but I see a consensus that Blue is better with a DH bike. Riding your rentals in a park like that won't be anything like riding them on your home trails, and will probably be pretty sketch unless you're really new enough not to know any better. It doesn't sound like you'll be savvy enough to extrapolate whether or not you'll like them at home based on that. Don't take that as a knock- we were all in the same boat at one point, and most of us have stories that include "I had fun, but mostly because I didn't know any better." I certainly do.


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## cerebroside (Jun 25, 2011)

Gemini2k05 said:


> No one who knows what they are doing, prefers riding hardtails on true DH trails. No one. If they do they are either A. Very young, B. Dumb, or C. Not riding real DH trails...


I occasionally ride with a guy who is pushing 40 and uses an old Kona hardtail for almost everything. Went on a shuttle day and he was hitting road gaps on the thing (with his FS bike hanging unused on the shuttle truck...)

Apparently he does Whistler tech with it too, says it's more challenging. He's certainly not dumb, but can't say I would pick a hardtail for that stuff.

Edit: Jinya Nishiwaki might count also.

Jinya Nishiwaki


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## GeePhroh (Jan 13, 2004)

[Edit: Damn...cerebroside beat me to the punch by about 2 minutes... :thumbsup:]

Can't believe this thread has gone two pages without anyone posting this:

hardtail in whistler Video - Pinkbike

or this:

Chromag Shredder Jin on Trespasser! - Pinkbike

So, yeah, it's possible to shred the park and the gnar on a hardtail. But it's a lot more likely to happen if you're Jinya riding a chromag.


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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

Ignore the trolls. However some resentment may stem from the fact that you ask for advice then seemingly ignore it when it is provided.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

pizon said:


> Ignore the trolls. However some resentment may stem from the fact that you ask for advice then seemingly ignore it when it is provided.


I don't think I'm really ignoring it. I'm Def not using my hardtail in any bike Park anymore. I did it once because I didn't know any better and had no clue until I got there and saw how many weren't. Only asked cause I wanted to see what everyone's opinion on the matter was.

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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

cerebroside said:


> Can't see why anyone would be so butthurt about this thread as to register two fake accounts just for the purpose of crapping in it...


Apparently the original question was that outrageous that it warranted a complete meltdown. I completely understand not using a hardtail and why a downhill bike is recommended. But me not being a professional, not jumping off any drops, or have money to rent a downhill bike I think the Scott sparks and trek fuels with FS at least should be just fine for us. Maybe I'm dead wrong but I highly doubt it. I know every bike I saw at Burke mountain wasn't all a downhill bike. Seen plenty of XC bikes.

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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

The question is fine, not sure what the issue is with those guys and the mods are probably sleeping. It just seems strange that you'd take the time to drive all the way to park, purchase lift tickets, pay for bike rental, but stop short of renting a Dh or at least am bike. But its your time/money/fun


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

pizon said:


> The question is fine, not sure what the issue is with those guys and the mods are probably sleeping. It just seems strange that you'd take the time to drive all the way to park, purchase lift tickets, pay for bike rental, but stop short of renting a Dh or at least am bike. But its your time/money/fun


Ok I cleaned this up, now go back and show me where the OP said he rented a bike....

Reading is important on forums, the OP used his hardtail and tried it at a bike park and asked if others did so. He said his buddy rented a bike once and now wants to buy a DH bike, something the OP said he can't afford.

For what it is worth, if there are any more troll/puppet accounts showing up from philly I will block their IP addresses completely. You are lucky you did it from where it wasn't associated with your other accounts in anyway or you would be done at MTBR.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

pizon said:


> The question is fine, not sure what the issue is with those guys and the mods are probably sleeping. It just seems strange that you'd take the time to drive all the way to park, purchase lift tickets, pay for bike rental, but stop short of renting a Dh or at least am bike. But its your time/money/fun


Yea i understand ya. I mentioned it earlier to though, my one buddy is looking to buy one of the three bike were renting so he want to try em all out. I guess if your gonna put a bike to the test there's no better way than on a downhill Park. From all the advice though I'd say without a doubt I'll be renting a downhill bike in the future. Would probably even go that route if I decide to purchase a FS bike in the future too. I don't feel the need to buy another XC bike just to have full suspension when the main purpose of it would be to ride downhill.

Appreciate the advice though.

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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

rockcrusher said:


> Ok I cleaned this up, now go back and show me where the OP said he rented a bike....


it was later in thread, where he said they were gonna rent some fs trail bikes for bike park.


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## pizon (Jul 7, 2009)

Kkon18 said:


> I guess if your gonna put a bike to the test there's no better way than on a downhill Park.


except for if its an xc trail bike thats going to be used on different terrain? When I got my Intense slope style i though great it works in a park and will work on my local single track because its not a full on dh. Well I was wrong, it was really heavy, and all the travel made my local trails unexciting to ride. While there is nothing technically wrong with that plan, and it will give some idea as to what a bike is like, its best to test a bike on the type of trail one will be using it for. Im unfamiliar with that particular mountain, if they have some xc trails with ups and downs your buddy would do well to do some laps of those.


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

pizon said:


> except for if its an xc trail bike thats going to be used on different terrain? When I got my Intense slope style i though great it works in a park and will work on my local single track because its not a full on dh. Well I was wrong, it was really heavy, and all the travel made my local trails unexciting to ride. While there is nothing technically wrong with that plan, and it will give some idea as to what a bike is like, its best to test a bike on the type of trail one will be using it for. Im unfamiliar with that particular mountain, if they have some xc trails with ups and downs your buddy would do well to do some laps of those.


Yea that makes a lot of sense. He actually rode the fuel in Vermont as well. At kingdom trails and at Burke mountain. So he's got a pretty good idea on how that bike feels in both situations. We're all pretty good riders and know what we're capable of doing. We'll try the most difficult ones and if it's too rough we move on. We rode every trail at Burke except the double black Diamond and only rode two more than once and I had a great time.

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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

rockcrusher said:


> Ok I cleaned this up, now go back and show me where the OP said he rented a bike....
> 
> Reading is important on forums, the OP used his hardtail and tried it at a bike park and asked if others did so. He said his buddy rented a bike once and now wants to buy a DH bike, something the OP said he can't afford.
> 
> For what it is worth, if there are any more troll/puppet accounts showing up from philly I will block their IP addresses completely. You are lucky you did it from where it wasn't associated with your other accounts in anyway or you would be done at MTBR.


Appreciate it. I didn't think I was being to unreasonable but being new to the sport I was starting to be unsure... Just out looking for some friendly advice.

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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Kkon18 said:


> Yea that makes a lot of sense. He actually rode the fuel in Vermont as well. At kingdom trails and at Burke mountain. So he's got a pretty good idea on how that bike feels in both situations. We're all pretty good riders and know what we're capable of doing. We'll try the most difficult ones and if it's too rough we move on. We rode every trail at Burke except the double black Diamond and only rode two more than once and I had a great time.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk


Kudos to you for having a very thick skin. For what it is worth I only ride full rigid mountain bike on everything I can find and I am substantially older than 30. It is all in your desire to abuse yourself, your bike and the skill you bring to the table. Learning on a hardtail is good but injuring yourself because you get over your head because you are on a hardtail is a bad call. I suggest renting DH bike and giving it a go. You will see what is possible and will be able to determine if you want to stay on your bike or whether it is worth picking up a used or a closeout DH bike on which to cut your teeth. Either way the most important thing is the having fun part and it seems you have that down!


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## Kkon18 (Aug 21, 2014)

rockcrusher said:


> Kudos to you for having a very thick skin. For what it is worth I only ride full rigid mountain bike on everything I can find and I am substantially older than 30. It is all in your desire to abuse yourself, your bike and the skill you bring to the table. Learning on a hardtail is good but injuring yourself because you get over your head because you are on a hardtail is a bad call. I suggest renting DH bike and giving it a go. You will see what is possible and will be able to determine if you want to stay on your bike or whether it is worth picking up a used or a closeout DH bike on which to cut your teeth. Either way the most important thing is the having fun part and it seems you have that down!


Yea the hardtail is def out the window for now on. I've spent to much money on my bike to keep abusing it. I worry more about that than I do myself. I'm pretty confident we can have a good time on XC FS bikes. If im wrong I'll be sure to update everyone either way. I really like all the input I've gotten.

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## sped30 (Aug 28, 2015)

I ride a 2005 trek bruiser hardtail and went to Windham 5 times in the past 2 months. Wilderness trail was fun going 20-30MPH and jumping over 40 tabletops. Batavia was rocky. ith quick steep switchbacks. those are the blue trails. Rode Citizens downhill diamond trail ok, but was very rocky. Had to go slow the 1st time because of rock drop offs. I got through it.


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## shwinn8 (Feb 25, 2006)

I've taken my 2000 15" Homegrown down many dh trails while the straight 8 was down... It's all in how you ride


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## melt339 (Jul 8, 2014)

Recently I took a Lynskey 650b HT down Angelfire for a few runs... It did quite the number on all parts that rotate (bike, less so the rider). I could have saved the money in minor repairs on the rental.


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