# Garmin Edge 20 and 25



## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Dcrainmaker has a look at the new Garmin Edge 20 and 25 GPS computer that have just been announced:










_- GPS speed and distance
- GPS based recording of route for online access later
- Course navigation (with courses created on Garmin Connect)
- Two customizable data pages (up to three data fields per page)
- Goal based workouts (i.e. time/distance/calories)
- Personal Records (i.e. longest ride)
- 8hr Battery life
- IPX7 waterproofing
- Weight of 0.9oz (25g)
- GLONASS capable GPS
- Garmin quarter-turn mount (compatible with 3rd party mounts)

Things the Edge 25 has that the Edge 20 doesn't (for the extra $40):

- ANT+ sensor connectivity (ANT+ Speed-only, Cadence-only, Speed/Cadence Combo, Heart Rate)
- Bluetooth Smart phone connectivity (for syncing completed activities/courses)
- Additional heart rate data page (HR BPM + HR Zone)
- Ability to create/set heart rate alerts
- Ability to track distance/speed indoors using ANT+ sensors"_ *dcrainmaker*

https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2015/06/garmin-edge-20-25.html

The size, weight (25g) and display looks good. It has GPS and GLONASS and the Edge 25 connects to your smartphone for wireless upload too.

Downsides are that the Edge 25 doesn't support ANT+ power meters. It supports speed, cadence and heart rate sensors but not power. It also only has "smart recording" rather than 1 second recording.

Battery life may be an issue for some too. Claimed 8 hour battery life (presumably best case without sensors, bluetooth etc running and a fresh battery) could start getting a bit close for comfort if you're doing longer rides. When the rechargeable battery begins to age that will reduce battery life.


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## Menel (Mar 15, 2015)

I like! Edge25 may be in my future.

Been wanting to upgrade my 500 to get GLONASS and Bluetooth upload.

Can't see the display anyway when bouncing along trails, just the nerd in me likes logging ****.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

I was starting to get excited, until I saw two things:
smart recording only, and 8hr battery life. 

WTF, Garmin?


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## Tystevens (Nov 2, 2011)

Harold said:


> I was starting to get excited, until I saw two things:
> smart recording only, and 8hr battery life.
> 
> WTF, Garmin?


Unless they had significantly improved 'smart recording' over what my Edge 200 had a couple years ago, I have to agree. I wouldn't buy another device with smart recording only.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Tystevens said:


> Unless they had significantly improved 'smart recording' over what my Edge 200 had a couple years ago, I have to agree. I wouldn't buy another device with smart recording only.


I doubt they've improved it.

I do rides longer than 8hrs sometimes. Already had a couple this year, and may wind up with another this weekend. I'm not usually riding the whole time, but seems silly to turn the GPS off entirely when I stop to eat my lunch or enjoy a nice view.

In other threads, I've criticized Garmin for what seems to be their ever-shortening battery life. Doesn't look like I was wrong.


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## mackdhagen (Jun 17, 2011)

Can't believe it does'nt support power when it supports ANT sensors...wtf..I'm not huge power guy but still use it from time to time...thats gonna eliminate a huge part of their audience.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

mackdhagen said:


> Can't believe it does'nt support power when it supports ANT sensors...wtf..I'm not huge power guy but still use it from time to time...thats gonna eliminate a huge part of their audience.


doubt it. most riders don't want or care about power. this is clearly a more basic model that fits somewhere between the Edge 200 and the Edge 510.


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## thrash_273 (Apr 24, 2013)

if i were introduced to gps world and as a new rider this will be very attractive.


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## Learux (Jun 4, 2012)

I agree, looks very nice for a reasonable price. Doubt that the eight hour battery life is 

a problem for most people.

That is a long time to be on a bike.


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## Machianera (Feb 5, 2011)

I would expect on-the-road battery life to be more like 5-6 hours. According to my past experience with garmin units. And the discrepancy between garmin claim and real life usage.


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## Learux (Jun 4, 2012)

I get very close to advertised battery life with my 510.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Swing and a miss on battery life. We haven't even factored in cold weather.

Fact is, if my Edge500 failed tomorrow (which it might) and I had to go out and get a GPS, I would probably come home with another 500.

Four years later.

In the world of portable electronics, that's quite an oddity.


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## mackdhagen (Jun 17, 2011)

ghetto thats the truth on swing and a miss for battery life....My 510 has been rock solid with over 30k of riding and the battery has been fine. Have others with just the opposite.
I think overall the 510 is THE machine, does it all versatility, smallish durable. The only thing that has failed me is the pin connector flap and now connectivity is starting to become weird.
I'm surprised DC Rainmaker did not just rip into it for not displaying and recording his precious Power.
I think the Lezyne Mini GPS is a better value. Its a little bit more, about the same size and records a few more metrics and looks a lot better than the toy'ish thing that they came out with.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Learux said:


> I agree, looks very nice for a reasonable price. Doubt that the eight hour battery life is
> 
> a problem for most people.
> 
> That is a long time to be on a bike.


Maybe it is. But to assume that more advanced riders automatically want more features is ridiculous.

I am finishing up a mtb trip in Georgia. It is a bit hot for 8+ hour rides but every single one of my rides exceeded 4hrs. If I didn't have access to recharging, my Forerunner 310xt could have squeaked out the whole weekend without charging.

This is my major reason for complaining. Not necessarily because 8 hour single rides are common. But because it is nice to be able to do a riding and camping vacation and not need to worry about power. I recharged nightly because I could but it wasn't going to be a problem if I forgot.

With these, forgetting can be a problem.

It's just extremely shortsighted. I will get my existing gpses rebuilt with new batteries before I spent several hundred on one with a ton of features I don't want and/or insufficient battery life.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

My summer solstice road ride was just over 14 and a half hours(don't ask).

My Edge 500 (which is now in a Edge200 case with a new-ish Edge200 battery) started protesting low battery at about the 13 hour mark, but kept logging to the end. (I did use the backlight for about the first 2 hours of the ride.) However it barfed trying to upload the file. I did end up with an intact ride log on endomondo, but strava wouldn't take it.

I had my 310XT running in my pocket as a backup, and it still had almost 30% battery at the end. Uploading over the ANT+ link (1-second logging) took forever and a day, but the file tracklog was fine. Only "problem" was the lack of barometer elevation.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

ghettocruiser said:


> Fact is, if my Edge500 failed tomorrow (which it might)....












I really have to learn the art of knocking on wood.


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## Learux (Jun 4, 2012)

^^ What are the odds? 

You had no indication that that was about to happen?

Contact Garmin, they might swing you a deal.


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## c8stom (May 19, 2015)

I have had my eye on Garmin Edges for a long while but the battery life has turned me off on all their models. 

If they added a bit more weight and doubled the battery life, I'd definitely buy one.

If the Edge 20 / 25 weighed 45g instead of 25g and offered 20 hour battery life, who'd complain ?


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

ghettocruiser said:


> I really have to learn the art of knocking on wood.


Like a guy at the shop recently who was bragging to his buddies that he never gets flats, so he doesn't carry anything to repair one. Next ride out, bam! Flatted during a thunderstorm.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Yeah, there is no "JRA" story here, I dropped it down the stairs. 

Two weeks after I replaced the internal battery, to add insult to injury.

Looking into a temp solution until the 520 hits the market.


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## shenny88 (Sep 24, 2009)

Harold said:


> I was starting to get excited, until I saw two things:
> smart recording only, and 8hr battery life.
> 
> WTF, Garmin?


Totally agree on the smart recording thing. Will not use another computer without other options.


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## mackdhagen (Jun 17, 2011)

ghettocruiser said:


> My summer solstice road ride was just over 14 and a half hours(don't ask).
> 
> My Edge 500 (which is now in a Edge200 case with a new-ish Edge200 battery) started protesting low battery at about the 13 hour mark, but kept logging to the end. (I did use the backlight for about the first 2 hours of the ride.) However it barfed trying to upload the file. I did end up with an intact ride log on endomondo, but strava wouldn't take it.
> 
> I had my 310XT running in my pocket as a backup, and it still had almost 30% battery at the end. Uploading over the ANT+ link (1-second logging) took forever and a day, but the file tracklog was fine. Only "problem" was the lack of barometer elevation.


I ran my 500 in a 10hr ride (SM100) a couple of times and it ran straight through. I recently uped the recording time to 1 persecond from the default (suggested if using a Stages PM)...Anyone know if this eats up battery time? I have that race coming up again and i don't want it to fail.
Ghetto super smart with the backup 310! Hey by chance was the ride you did on soltice the Tour De La Marin in N Cal?
Ride on!


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

mackdhagen said:


> Ghetto super smart with the backup 310! Hey by chance was the ride you did on soltice the Tour De La Marin in N Cal?
> Ride on!


Belt-and-suspenders to make sure I have a tracklog of the all-day rides. This was a (failed) attempt at a sub-10-hour double that after a bunch of wrong turns and time-wasting mishaps we salvaged into a 400k.


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## FireLikeIYA (Mar 15, 2009)

ghettocruiser said:


> I really have to learn the art of knocking on wood.


Garmin will repair it for $89 Garmin | Out of Warranty

I have an edge 705 that I planned on having repaired. I check last week and it was still available to do so. I went to submit to have it done tonight and it is no longer available for my device. My 705 had a solid 18 hour battery life.


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## kylepeveto (Apr 25, 2006)

Don’t buy the Edge 25 for mountain biking. Even with a speed sensor it is incredibly inaccurate.

I bought the Edge 25 because it was a good price point, and, according to the preliminary reviews, it had all the features I wanted. A big plus was that it could sync with my smart phone. 
Because I ride my mountain bike about 75 percent of the time, I also bought a speed sensor so I could get accurate distance measurements on the trails I ride. 
The Edge 25 and the speed sensor were easy to set up.
But the Edge 25 never gave me an accurate distance reading, even with the speed sensor installed. Over two weeks, I rode my local trails, and the Edge 25 with speed sensor was off by 1.5 miles over a 6-mile course. That’s too much over a 30-minute ride. I tested it on other trails, judging it against friends’ computers, and it was consistently wrong. 
On the road it was decent. Over a 55-mile ride, I had a difference of 1 mile compared to my friend’s computer. 

I called Garmin, and they began testing the speed sensor with the Edge 25. Because it was a new product only a few weeks old, they didn’t know how the two paired. 
The next day the representative called after testing the combo and said that the Edge 25 doesn’t offer any additional calibration options with the Edge 25. It’s either on or off. You can’t adjust wheel size. The representative said that the computer was comparing the GPS mileage to the speed sensor while I was on the trail, so it wasn’t giving an accurate reading. 
Plus, she said that the Edge 25 does not offer the same accuracy as their higher end models. It takes fewer points of data compared to the 510 or others. It was meant for a more “recreational” cyclist who wants to throw it on his bike and ride occasionally. 
A $170 computer is a little steep for a “recreational” cyclist, especially when a smart phone will work just as well. 

Garmin offered me a return, which was great.


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## thasingletrackmastah (Nov 15, 2005)

I bought the Edge 25 and returned it.
On the road it may be useful, but in the woods it is useless.
Reception is very unacurate, even with GPS and Glonas enabled.
Didn't use speedsensor because I have multiple bikes, the unit should be able to be used an all, without replacing the sensor, or buying multiple speedsensors.
(BTW calibration of th speedsensor is an automated proces, but the unit needs good gps reception to do this accurately)
Compared it with my Etrex 30.
In the woods, under a dense canopy, the Edge's tracklog was all over the place.
Following a track (convert it to a course (.fit file) first) is impossible because of this.
Sometimes the tracklog was as far off as 200m /600ft !
Maybe if you ride only on road, with a clear view to te open sky, this could be your gps.
Glad I live in the EU where we have the right to undo a online purchase within 14 days.


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## rob1035 (Apr 20, 2007)

hmmmm....good info since I was looking at the Edge 25, 75% mtb, 25% road. The hub mounted speed sensor is great but if the package doesn't work, I'll pass.

Any other options other than going up in the Garmin lineup?


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Just don't buy a cheap GPS bike computer. If you want a cheap GPS with accurate recording, an etrex 10 will do the job. It has limited features, but that doesn't include reduced sampling intervals that limit accuracy.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Got an opportunity to have a play with an Edge 25 today.
The 8 hour battery life isn't really a concern as I see this as a cool little race/training GPS for when you don't need the full features of an Edge 520/810.
The screen only displays 3 lines of info, but time, distance and heart rate are all I need normally.
Unfortunately, HR isn't a choice on the 2 screens you can play with and only appears on the 3rd, non-customisable screen. Bugger.
As referenced in many posts above, the accuracy of the downloaded track is a serious concern.

Well, this is an Edge 810, 1s recording with one CCW and one CW loop in pine tree cover...









With GLONASS turned off on the 25 and smart recording, this was the same loop...








Interesting...
Next time out, I'll try with GLONASS on too.
Distance was within the bounds of previous rides with the 810 using a wheel sensor.

Elevation profile was a bit "lumpier" than the barometrically helped 810's.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Can you post an actual link to your ride? I want to get an idea of scale and exactly HOW twisty the trail is, as well as differences in the recorded distance. It's also entirely possible that Garmin has issued some updates to improve the accuracy of the recorded files.

However my initial impression is that the loop you rode isn't anywhere near as twisty as the trails near me. I've heard for years folks in the western US (whose trails are MUCH less twisty than what I ride regularly) are often happy with "Smart" recording. "Smart" recording results in a mess on my local trails at mtb speeds. IME, "smart" recording is better suited for slower speed activities like running, hiking, and paddling, because results obtained on a bike depend HEAVILY on trail layout. That shouldn't be the case. Results should be pretty consistent from one ride to the next, regardless of trail layout.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Was only an old forestry road 6k loop and quite low speed but was surprised how it compared to the 810.
Won't get a chance to test it on the single track until next week.
Those 2 rides are...
25 https://www.strava.com/activities/485484866
810 https://www.strava.com/activities/475617969

Next week I hope to get them both out on parts of this ride...
https://www.strava.com/activities/482291049
Enough open single track, densely vegetated single track and switchbacks galore to really test the smart recording. Also no GoPro to interfere with the signal.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> Was only an old forestry road 6k loop and quite low speed but was surprised how it compared to the 810.
> Won't get a chance to test it on the single track until next week.
> Those 2 rides are...
> 25 https://www.strava.com/activities/485484866
> ...


Okay, that makes some sense now. The spots where the 810 had the most trouble were when you were in ravines. Almost always iffy. And riding with the two on different days limits the comparisons you can make. Use them both at the same time if you want a real comparison. If you don't do that, you can't control for atmospheric conditions or satellite constellation configuration (which not only varies from day to day, but throughout the course of the day).

A ride on fire roads, at relatively low speed SHOULDN'T challenge a GPS very much. Looking at that XC course, THAT will challenge the Edge 25. Climbing those switchbacks, maybe not so much, but when you're descending, yep.

Also, I have my doubts that GLONASS will do much for you, in the southern hemisphere. GLONASS is best in extreme northern latitudes. GPS is at its worst at extreme northern and southern latitudes (GPS is best at equatorial and temperate latitudes).

I'm not sure why you think a GoPro would interfere with the signal, though. I honestly can't say I've encountered RF interference that screws with GPS reception. That absolutely happens with wireless sensors, but I haven't seen it with GPS.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Harold said:


> I'm not sure why you think a GoPro would interfere with the signal, though. I honestly can't say I've encountered RF interference that screws with GPS reception. That absolutely happens with wireless sensors, but I haven't seen it with GPS.


Edge 810 on stem with GoPro 2cm in front.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> Edge 810 on stem with GoPro 2cm in front.


Okay then. Which GoPro? Yours have WiFi or other wireless stuff going on? Mine's a 1st gen without any wireless, and I've seen nothing like this. Granted, I also don't mount it on my handlebars. Helmet, chesty, or elsewhere. Not handlebars.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Harold said:


> Okay then. Which GoPro? Yours have WiFi or other wireless stuff going on? Mine's a 1st gen without any wireless, and I've seen nothing like this. Granted, I also don't mount it on my handlebars. Helmet, chesty, or elsewhere. Not handlebars.


GoPro Hero.
The new basic model Hero 4 that's non-removable from it's case.
No WiFi or anything else.

It seems common in the drone community to wrap the GoPro in foil before putting it in it's case to stop it interfering with onboard gps's.

Looking back at some older tracks, my Hero HD and Hero 2 look to be interfering too, but mainly if close to the GPS.

Annoyingly the chesty mount is right on top of the HRM transmitter which isn't very comfortable.
On the motorbike, I use a helmet mount with no issues.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> GoPro Hero.
> The new basic model Hero 4 that's non-removable from it's case.
> No WiFi or anything else.
> 
> ...


May be worth looking at a helmet mount.


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## 202cycle (Dec 6, 2006)

Has anyone had issues with the hub mounted speed sensor since the 3.0 Update? My Edge 25 will recognize the sensor, but won't show the speed.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

202cycle said:


> Has anyone had issues with the hub mounted speed sensor since the 3.0 Update? My Edge 25 will recognize the sensor, but won't show the speed.


I'll go have a look...

Although, I've just realised I don't have a hub mount one...


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## rpearce1475 (Jan 24, 2015)

With the updates, does the GPS now allow you to input different wheel diameters? Any increase in accuracy?


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## owenfranssen (Apr 14, 2016)

*Seduced and dissapointed*

I was seduced by the small compact size of the Edge 25. I made sure to update the software to the latest version, 3.00 i think was the last update. However, I ran into the same accuracy issue while on MTB trails. I didn't think it would be as big an issue when compared to my smart phone, which is what i normally use. However, my phone is far more accurate than the Edge 25.

I posted my disappointing experience on my blog, including the differences in trail accuracy and time/speed measurements compared to Strava on my Android phone:
Garmin Edge 25 not for mountain bikers


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## bbqmike (Jan 5, 2016)

Maybe its my location, but the 25 isn't THAT bad for me, its almost always 10% off, which was better than what my phone was doing previously. I will be getting a edge 520 though, I want to display more stuff on the screen at once, and the added accuracy will be appreciated.


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## owenfranssen (Apr 14, 2016)

I guess it depends on what you are comparing it to. If I'd had no previous experience, then I guess I might have been satisfied, I'm not a cartographer so total accuracy is not that important. However, I was under the impression a phone would be less accurate than a dedicated device. In the case of my HTC One M9 however, that was not the case, and I guess thats what let to my disappointment in the edge. When I get some more funds, I might be tempted in a 500 or 520.

The trail maps I posted on the link in my previous comment are not the worst I have seen. Last month I ran both the Edge and my phone at a bike park, so lots of short but technical and twisty runs, and my phone was pretty dead on, but the Edge straightened out a lot of the trails and consequently also affected distance and time measurements - unfortunately i deleted most of that data so I cant post screen shot.

One tip I can give on the Edge that would improve it if you;re not in to twisty trails, is switch off the auto pause feature. It tends to detect a pause very quickly, but doesnt seem to then unpause nearly as fast, losing you anything up to 30 seconds. And I noticed the last day out, that on very steep climbs when I went too slow it would auto pause... not very flattering


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

The end result of the settings on these budget GPSes depends on your trail layout. It's worse the twistier the trails are. On twisty trails, 1Hz recording is a minimum requirement, and the Edge 20/25 don't come close. Unfortunately, not too many GPSes out there using 10Hz recording intervals yet (but they do exist).


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## bbqmike (Jan 5, 2016)

owenfranssen said:


> I guess it depends on what you are comparing it to. If I'd had no previous experience, then I guess I might have been satisfied, I'm not a cartographer so total accuracy is not that important. However, I was under the impression a phone would be less accurate than a dedicated device. In the case of my HTC One M9 however, that was not the case, and I guess thats what let to my disappointment in the edge. When I get some more funds, I might be tempted in a 500 or 520.
> 
> The trail maps I posted on the link in my previous comment are not the worst I have seen. Last month I ran both the Edge and my phone at a bike park, so lots of short but technical and twisty runs, and my phone was pretty dead on, but the Edge straightened out a lot of the trails and consequently also affected distance and time measurements - unfortunately i deleted most of that data so I cant post screen shot.
> 
> One tip I can give on the Edge that would improve it if you;re not in to twisty trails, is switch off the auto pause feature. It tends to detect a pause very quickly, but doesnt seem to then unpause nearly as fast, losing you anything up to 30 seconds. And I noticed the last day out, that on very steep climbs when I went too slow it would auto pause... not very flattering


Yes, I found the same with auto pause, it lost too much data, and strava does a decent job of calculation the moving vs no moving time anyway. Autopause for the road seemed fine.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I'm now using the 25 mainly on the road/CX/gravel bike.
Not too worried about the accuracy on the more open sort of roads/trails and let's face it, it's f...in tiny!

Still waiting for the ability to have HR as a selectable data field.

Time, distance & HR on screen at once is all I need.

If be more use off road if it actually used the wheel speed sensor though.


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## bbqmike (Jan 5, 2016)

I did a fast paced ride yesteday, 5 mile loop, I logged with my S7's shealth app, and the 25, garmin came up with 4.5 mi, and shealth nailed the 5.0 that I know the loop to be, the maps aren't terribly different, but you can see the garmin log jump around more. I won't strap my phone to the bars though, afraid to destroy it, so I still need a display, 520 it is!


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

bbqmike said:


> I did a fast paced ride yesteday, 5 mile loop, I logged with my S7's shealth app, and the 25, garmin came up with 4.5 mi, and shealth nailed the 5.0 that I know the loop to be, the maps aren't terribly different, but you can see the garmin log jump around more. I won't strap my phone to the bars though, afraid to destroy it, so I still need a display, 520 it is!


There's a greenway path where I live that passes underneath a multistory parking structure. Most GPS-only devices get iffy in there, and tracks I've seen recorded with 520's and 1000's are spot on perfect there. They also do well in the concrete and steel canyons of downtown close to that spot, too. I still recommend pairing the Garmin with a wheel sensor. Even an accurate device at 1sec recording is shorting you on distance.


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

bbqmike said:


> I did a fast paced ride yesteday, 5 mile loop, I logged with my S7's shealth app, and the 25, garmin came up with 4.5 mi, and shealth nailed the 5.0 that I know the loop to be, the maps aren't terribly different, but you can see the garmin log jump around more. I won't strap my phone to the bars though, afraid to destroy it, so I still need a display, 520 it is!


Did a XC race last weekend (mostly under trees) and the Edge 25 logged about 16 miles, when it should have logged at least 19 miles. With both GPS and Glonass on, using the magnet-less speed sensor on front hub.

Interestingly, I highlighted/selected a section in Strava, and with the Edge 1000, it shows 9.4 miles during a training ride and with the Edge 25, it shows 7.3 miles during the race. I've never noticed much of a difference for my beginner races, but I'm starting to notice for the faster paced sport class races.

Looking at what others have said and from my experience, it seems that if it's not a fast ride, then the 25 might be ok. But for fast paced rides or races, it seems that it's far from ideal. 

Really wanted it to work out but might have to send it off to eBay....


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

In tree cover, the 25 might be registering 7kph and the 810 is showing a more realistic 20kph.
The 25 does not use the wheel sensor at all if the GPS is turned on.

Working great on the road though.


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

Just installed the beta 3.13 which will prioritize the speed sensor over GPS, and went on a medium speed ride dcrainmaker-style with both 25 and 1000 installed on the handlebar.

Edge 25:
Time: 1:43:19
Distance: 15.72 miles
Avg. speed: 9.1 mph
Elev. gain: 904 ft.


Edge 1000:
Time: 1:42:30
Distance: 15.48 miles
Avg. speed: 9.1 mph
Elevation gain: 1,201 ft

This is with auto stop and didn't start and end both at the same time (started recording one and then started recording the other one).

Hmmm...maybe it's not so bad now.


Next test is w/ auto stop off and use remote to start/end both at same time.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Pegleg81 said:


> Just installed the beta 3.13 which will prioritize the speed sensor over GPS, and went on a medium speed ride dcrainmaker-style with both 25 and 1000 installed on the handlebar.
> 
> Edge 25:
> Time: 1:43:19
> ...


Seriously, the Edge 25 finally got an update to prioritize the wheel sensor over GPS for distance readings? It's about damn time! The recorded GPS data is still a little less than optimal, but if the wheel sensor now actually does something useful, that might actually make the Edge 25 recommendable.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Just installed the Beta and still no HRM as a pickable data field.
Should be able to test it today.


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

Practically all of the ride is on singletrack and under trees (no open-field or double tracks). Auto-pause turned off and both GPS and GLOSNASS on.

1000 (latest firmware with Garmin Magnet-less speed sensor on front wheel; 1-sec recording):
Distance: 7.16 miles
Time: 51.26
Avg. speed: 8.4 mph
Elev. Gain: 659 ft

25 (3.13 beta firmware with Garmin Magnet-less speed sensor on front wheel):
Distance: 7.22 miles
Time: 51:25
Avg. speed: 8.4 mph
Elev. Gain: 395 ft 

All info from Garmin Connect, with 25's elevation corrections "enabled".

Elevation gain info sux, but otherwise, not bad, not bad…..


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

What's impressive is that the trail has a lot of twists and sharp turns. Took me 51 minutes but the fastest guys would have taken about 33 minutes. Would be interesting what the comparative results would have been at faster speed.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I tested mine yesterday, but the heavy tree cover test didn't happen as it's just been logged


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

Final test on a ride where half of the ride was under trees and half of the ride was under no trees:

25 (on beta 3.13):
Time: 1:36
Distance: 15.32 miles
Avg. speed: 9.5
Elev. Gain: 848

1000:
Time: 1:36
Distance: 15.24 miles
Avg. speed: 9.4
Elev. Gain: 1,194

25 seems to be reading 0.5% greater distance; when riding, 25 consistently reads 0.03-0.04 mph faster in speed.

Seems that 25 is salvageable.


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## cooper58 (Aug 30, 2006)

Thanks for the update


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## rpearce1475 (Jan 24, 2015)

Encouraging to see that improvement. Still pretty sucky on the elevation though


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

rpearce1475 said:


> Encouraging to see that improvement. Still pretty sucky on the elevation though


If you want more accurate elevation, you have to buy a GPS with a barometric altimeter. No firmware update will fix that.


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## rpearce1475 (Jan 24, 2015)

Yea I figured. Planning on an Edge 520 for the bday this year


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Tested yesterday and over 18.x km with good solid tree cover, the 25 was only .1km less than my 920xt.

Need to test the other direction now as that is the one with the tree cover and my body blocking the signal to the north.


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

Where did you find that latest firmware update for the 25? Mine says it's up to date thru garmin connect but shows 3.0 software??

I bought this cause I was looking for a more compact unit with basic cyclocomputer functions, but also cause of the elev data, sucks it's so inaccurate there.


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## cooper58 (Aug 30, 2006)

Garmin: Edge 25 Updates & Downloads


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

Thx!


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

Curious why some folks have the auto pause turned off, is it more accurate with it turned off? I keep forgetting to stop/start unit at breaks


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Tickle said:


> Curious why some folks have the auto pause turned off, is it more accurate with it turned off? I keep forgetting to stop/start unit at breaks


Don't stop/start it at breaks.

Just turn it on and let it run. All software will calculate moving time vs. stopped time from the elapsed time, anyway, so it's kinda unnecessary to have it on the device. Compounding that fact, auto pause is frequently a problem on slow climbs or slow hike-a-bike sections. It will pause when you're technically still moving, albeit very slowly.


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

Harold said:


> Don't stop/start it at breaks.
> 
> Just turn it on and let it run. All software will calculate moving time vs. stopped time from the elapsed time, anyway, so it's kinda unnecessary to have it on the device. Compounding that fact, auto pause is frequently a problem on slow climbs or slow hike-a-bike sections. It will pause when you're technically still moving, albeit very slowly.


Gotcha that makes sense, I will keep the auto pause turned off as well. Thx man!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Used my 25 mounted to the bars to display heart rate at the 6hr XC race on Sunday. Battery still shows half. I'll use it until it's flat and see how long it takes.

Nice to have an alternative to the 810 for events where I don't need all the features or weight.

Still want HR to be a selectable data field. Time, distance, HR on one screen.

Was using my 920xt to do the recording.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

NordieBoy said:


> Still want HR to be a selectable data field. Time, distance, HR on one screen.


Not an official solution, but it does work!

Garmin Edge 25 - Enrich your Edge 25 with funky stuff

Generates a FIT file you save in your NEWFILES folder and lets you select HR as a data field.

Woohoo!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Tested over a 99km ride yesterday and worked well.
Time, Dist, BPM on first screen, and Time, Speed, BPM on the second.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Jenny Rissveds used an Edge 25 on the stem for her Lenzerhiede win and Nino used one to get Olympic Gold...








Jenny used the mount though...








Would be cool to know what data fields they were displaying.


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

Maybe they or their mechanics are reading our posts....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mcam (Sep 11, 2013)

I bought a Garmin Edge 20 two weeks ago. I had a Sigma computer, but that seemed to error up all the time, due to the fork mounted sensor mount not being very stable, and moving a lot (I tried a bunch of things, including double sided tape and extra zip ties, so it started to look a little hillbilly  )

I have to say, as a standard computer replacement, this little GPS is perfect at that role. It is no bigger than the Sigma, and the data seems to be about as accurate as the Sigma. It isn't packed full of features, and I didn't bother with the 25, as I didn't want HR monitoring or Bluetooth. All in all, I'm really happy with it.


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

I've enjoyed mine I can get accurate elevation data once the file is downloaded but usually about 15-20% off on unit. I have auto pause turned off so I'm not getting an accurate avg. speed with breaks as I just let it run, can't remember to start/stop every time. Don't really care about avg speed tho, mostly time, distance and vert


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Mine started turning itself off randomly 
Now at the point it sometimes won't turn on...


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## Pegleg81 (Aug 6, 2014)

I've used mine in a few cyclocross races and for some reason, it loses connection with my HR meter during the middle of the race. It seemed ok when I'm riding by myself. Not sure if it's the new firmware or the relative density of riders in closer proximity in cross races...


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> Mine started turning itself off randomly
> Now at the point it sometimes won't turn on...


When was the last time you cleared all old rides off of the device?


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Harold said:


> When was the last time you cleared all old rides off of the device?


The rides never get saved. I discard them as soon as I'm finished.

Still turning off even after a factory reset.
I can get in to the settings, turn off the button tones and can't get back out of the settings before it's turned off and forgotten I've turned off the tones.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Aaaand now, it's working.
Maybe it just needed some alone time.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> Aaaand now, it's working.
> Maybe it just needed some alone time.


This is beginning to sound like maybe a loose solder or something with the electronic components, to be honest, rather than a software issue.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Harold said:


> This is beginning to sound like maybe a loose solder or something with the electronic components, to be honest, rather than a software issue.


I could make it happen every time at exactly the same moment when turning the key beeps off though.

Some more rough rides will test it out.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Nino Schurter used a Garmin 20 during the Cape Epic.
He may have been wearing a watch for recording as well though as he was using a power meter too.


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

Maybe someone can help me out. 
Just got a 25 last week and had a race today.
It's set to upload to Strava. I'm not really getting duplicate uploads to Strava but my name is list 3 times on the people you rode with? 
My friends that follow me, I'm showing once in the people they follow along with my profile pic and 2 times in the people they don't follow with the profile pic?? 

Any advice?


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## -Todd- (Jun 13, 2011)

Jatrma said:


> Maybe someone can help me out.
> Just got a 25 last week and had a race today.
> It's set to upload to Strava. I'm not really getting duplicate uploads to Strava but my name is list 3 times on the people you rode with?
> My friends that follow me, I'm showing once in the people they follow along with my profile pic and 2 times in the people they don't follow with the profile pic??
> ...


Do you have both the Glonass and GPS runnin? If only GPS the mapping might not be as accurate...


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

-Todd- said:


> Do you have both the Glonass and GPS runnin? If only GPS the mapping might not be as accurate...


Yes the Glonass is running, I try turning it off for my next group ride and see if they helps. 
Thanks


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Jatrma said:


> Maybe someone can help me out.
> Just got a 25 last week and had a race today.
> It's set to upload to Strava. I'm not really getting duplicate uploads to Strava but my name is list 3 times on the people you rode with?
> My friends that follow me, I'm showing once in the people they follow along with my profile pic and 2 times in the people they don't follow with the profile pic??
> ...


I doubt this has anything to do with the device. it sounds like a strava thing. reset your strava sync settings.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Do you have a phone running Strava as well?


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

NordieBoy said:


> Do you have a phone running Strava as well?


Not since I started using the garmin, the phone was in my truck.


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

Harold said:


> I doubt this has anything to do with the device. it sounds like a strava thing. reset your strava sync settings.


I think I figured part of it out anyway. Looks like I had logged in and synced the garmin to Strava website using a different email address and synced with the Strava app through Facebook. The Strava website is only showing 2 rides both since I got the garmin. That would explain one duplicate but maybe not the 2nd one.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Jatrma said:


> I think I figured part of it out anyway. Looks like I had logged in and synced the garmin to Strava website using a different email address and synced with the Strava app through Facebook. The Strava website is only showing 2 rides both since I got the garmin. That would explain one duplicate but maybe not the 2nd one.


That will do it

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## campagnolo07 (May 17, 2017)

Pegleg81 said:


> Final test on a ride where half of the ride was under trees and half of the ride was under no trees:
> 
> 25 (on beta 3.13):
> Time: 1:36
> ...


How about the GPS tracking on the Garmin Connect or Strava? Is it more accurate now with the speed sensor?

Although this latest firmware update seems that it did a good job in selecting the speed sensor over the GPS signal, can I assume that the navigation precision has improved by the same level?

I want to buy this unit for both ride tracking (in twisty trails) and navigation but for me edge 520 exceeds my needs and wouldn't be an option for the moment.

Tks for your help!


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

campagnolo07 said:


> How about the GPS tracking on the Garmin Connect or Strava? Is it more accurate now with the speed sensor?
> 
> Although this latest firmware update seems that it did a good job in selecting the speed sensor over the GPS signal, can I assume that the navigation precision has improved by the same level?
> 
> ...


The wheel sensor has nothing to do with positional accuracy of the track. All it does is add new fields in the xml data with speed and distance, rather than the viewing software calculating speed and distance from the positional data. The positional data is still the same.

"Smart" recording offers pretty poor accuracy on fast and twisty trails. The accuracy is better on straighter trails and at slower speeds like in walking or running. There is some regional variation on trails of these types. Western trails tend to be more open and straighter because there is more public land to spread them out. Eastern and especially midwestern trails tend to be much more dense and twistier, and the lower accuracy from "smart" recording makes tracks a mess.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## campagnolo07 (May 17, 2017)

I thought that some how the speed sensor could improve the navigation capabilities of this device by overlaying or adjusting the location based on travelled distance but I guess I was wrong. 

So in your opinion, the edge 25 is not suitable for off round navigation? Perhaps this would okay for on road navigation or as you said slow speeds only...


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## Buster (Jan 4, 2004)

I tried the Edge 20 about 2 years year ago, with the speed sensor, and mileage was still not accurate. I returned it to REI for a refund.

Maybe something has changed since then, so I am always following these threads to find out. I'd love to use the Edge 20 or 25 and have all my info on one device.

REI has the Edge25 on sale right now by the way...


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

campagnolo07 said:


> I thought that some how the speed sensor could improve the navigation capabilities of this device by overlaying or adjusting the location based on travelled distance but I guess I was wrong.


yeah, it does no such thing. the wheel sensor just improves distance measurements (to a point, the recording interval is still the major limitation - it is too infrequent), but does not change the navigation capabilities of the device.



> So in your opinion, the edge 25 is not suitable for off round navigation? Perhaps this would okay for on road navigation or as you said slow speeds only...


No. Garmin's product page says it will do "Courses" to compete against yourself or someone else's previous effort, but it doesn't really give you much to go on for how that works. Courses CAN be used to navigate (I have done so on a few different devices, and currently with an Edge 520), BUT there's a big caveat in that. If you load someone's previous ride into the device and compete against the times in it, navigation assistance will be minimal. To get nav assistance, you've got to program the Course on a computer using a site like RideWithGPS to program the turn notifications into the Course file. I have done this for long road rides (up to 100mi long) and it worked well. The Edge 25 probably wouldn't do all that well for such long rides, as its memory/processing power is limited compared to the Edge 520.

IMO, the Edge 25 should be okay for a beginner road rider, or for someone who maybe rides hybrids on paved greenway paths and is looking to record basic data and doesn't want to use their phone. But frankly, other companies like Lezyne offer more features for the same price range, so in that light, I can't really recommend the Edge 25 at all.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

As an ultra light head unit for racing where up to 3 fields on display is all you need, then it works well.

I use Time, Dist, BPM or Time, Cad, BPM.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Wonder what fields Nino displays?


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> As an ultra light head unit for racing where up to 3 fields on display is all you need, then it works well.
> 
> I use Time, Dist, BPM or Time, Cad, BPM.


Again, Lezyne gives you more for the same dollars, so if those are the things you want, then Lezyne wins every day.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

More size, more weight, more features, much more battery life.
No GLONASS?


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## thasingletrackmastah (Nov 15, 2005)

never mind


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## -Todd- (Jun 13, 2011)

I run the Edge 20 so I can keep a decent Strava log of my efforts and not much more. It's small, fairly accurate and cost effective... Simple is good.

I save the cellphone for emergencies only, I don't need the man tracking me either...


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

NordieBoy said:


> More size, more weight, more features, much more battery life.
> No GLONASS?


Meh, the mini is a few mm bigger and 4g heavier than the Edge 20/25. So horrible. It's massive.

The mini costs less than the Edge 20, but offers BTLE sensor compatibility to improve distance accuracy, record HR, record power, or even pair with electronic shifting. The Edge 20 offers no wireless functionality whatsoever. The Edge 20 doesn't even do ephemeris satellite predictions (speeds position lock), so you have to download it from Garmin when you plug the GPS into the computer, which you have to do with some frequency if you want relatively up-to-date ephemeris so you're not sitting in the parking lot waiting for signal lock while your buddies heckle you for holding them up.

GLONASS is nice, but IME, it has only made a substantial difference in cities with skyscrapers and parking garages and stuff. Otherwise, GLONASS hasn't been that big of a deal for me. When I'm looking at budget computers, it's not a feature that's on my radar. And frankly, the positional accuracy of the Edge 20/25 models is still garbage, because of "Smart" recording, anyway. Recording an accurate distance is kinda important, and the Garmin Edge 20 and 25 fail horribly on that front. No 1sec recording (which Lezyne offers on its budget computers), and because of that, the wheel sensor capability of the Edge 25 doesn't make as much of an improvement as it really should.

If Garmin put 1sec recording as an option onto the Edge 20/25 models, they'd move up pretty substantially on my list. That one thing alone would address the majority of my complaints about the devices (but not the shitty battery life). But looking at the specs, I think there's a major hardware limitation that prevents it. Lezyne states up to 100hrs of recording capability. Garmin vaguely states "up to 10 rides" which makes me thing that it's got very limited memory (probably to keep the size of the device down). If Garmin offered 1 sec recording for the Edge 20/25 models, it would probably mean that under current hardware, you'd probably get fewer hours of recording than battery life would support. It's hard to know specifically because Garmin doesn't say how many hours those 10 rides can be. Is there a max limit of the number of hours per ride? It sure makes it seem that way.

What it all really comes down to for me, though, is cost. If the existing Garmin Edge 20/25 models were well under $100, I might have a different assessment, too. But Lezyne offers the battery life and the memory to support 1 sec recording. I get that to offer a low priced GPS computer, the manufacturer has to make sacrifices somewhere to achieve a given price point. I would much rather give up GLONASS than to give up a fast recording interval. IMO, fast recording is an essential feature for a bike GPS computer.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

If I didn't already have a 25 then there​'d be a Mini strapped to my bars.


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