# Fd-m950? Fd-m952? Fd-m953?



## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

How old is too old? I'm shopping around for a 31.8mm clamp, top swing, top pull front derailer... I noticed that the new M970s weigh in quite a bit more than some of the older models. Unfortunately I never got a chance to enjoy such high end parts like XTR back in the day.

How do these older front derailers shift compared to more recent ones? 
What is the oldest model you personally would try to obtain (in good condition ofcourse).
M900?
M950?
M952?
M953? <--- does this exist?
M960?

or screw and just buy the newest latest M970?


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## Voltron (Aug 8, 2006)

I have only the M960 on both my HT and dualie, and I can only say that it shifts flawlessly, but that's what you would expect from XTR gear. I don't think the M970 FDer has changed much from the 960.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I, till just yesterday was using an M952 (Top swing, top pull). Yes there is an M953, but it is simply a variation on the M95x generation of derailleurs. M950, M951, M952, M953 are just like top swing/bottom pull, bottom swing/bottom pull, top swing/top pull, bottom swing/top pull (not necessarily in that order). My 34.9 M952 was 107g with a little tuning, and shifted great, even though I was asking it to shift a 10 speed chain between a 29t and a 44t (2x9).


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## Some Guy (Mar 27, 2005)

I'm using an M952 also, works just fine.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The 900 and 950 series were 8 speed and have a wider cage for 8 speed chain so they don't shift so crisp with a 9 speed chain. They work great with 8 speed chains, especially the parallelogram linkage.

The 952 series also could work with a 47.5mm chainline where the new ones are all aimed at 50mm chainlines.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

*952*

This is what I went with for the Kona. I had to do some shaving from the underside of the inner cage plate to allow for clearance with the linkage. This is as light as you will prolly be able to go with any FD, AFAIK.


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## gratiflying (Sep 21, 2006)

i have a FD m953. it's a 34.9 bottom pull, top swing and it works flawlessly on my freeride bike shifting b/w 22-36 rings. it's 122g with some tuning. good rings made more difference to me than switching FD. i found specialites WAY better than shimano in terms of shifting performance and stiffness.

i thought the same thing you did and found one for cheap on ebay.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Axis II said:


> This is as light as you will prolly be able to go with any FD, AFAIK.


I have to say, this is as light as you'll get with any *MTB* FD. I have the M952 in 34.9 with some bolt tuning and a bit of shaving of the clamp to clear the welds on my old Giant NRS frame and it is 109g. It has now been replaced by a Campy Record Titanium (the one with the carbon outer plate) compact clamp-on (32mm clamp that I opened up to 34.9) 10 speed, and with the shaving of the clamp, an aluminum cable clamp bolt, a carbon seatpost clamp bolt, as well as a couple slots ground into the clamp, its at 79g, and shifts much much better on my 2x9 29t/44t setup with 10 speed chain than the XTR that it replaced.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> I have to say, this is as light as you'll get with any *MTB* FD. I have the M952 in 34.9 with some bolt tuning and a bit of shaving of the clamp to clear the welds on my old Giant NRS frame and it is 109g. It has now been replaced by a Campy Record Titanium (the one with the carbon outer plate) compact clamp-on (32mm clamp that I opened up to 34.9) 10 speed, and with the shaving of the clamp, an aluminum cable clamp bolt, a carbon seatpost clamp bolt, as well as a couple slots ground into the clamp, its at 79g, and shifts much much better on my 2x9 29t/44t setup with 10 speed chain than the XTR that it replaced.


Yes, road derailleurs are lighter but hard to get to work on frames with a top-pull orientation. Cheers just picked up a new Kona Hei Hei Supreme which is top pull. If there was a quick and dirty way to get a Record FD to work on my top pull frames I'd be all over it.


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## Strong Ti (Jun 1, 2005)

*Morris posted his toppull record*

conversion on this fourm a while back and more details are here http://www.light-bikes.it/forum/index.php?topic=759.0

I was going to pick up a C-Record and do the conversion, but the closeout ones on Speedgoat ($55) went before I got my order in :-( If I can find them at similar price I'll give it a go.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

I've looked at those pics so many times over at the various light weight / weight weenie forums and I still don't 100% understand what is being done. Is all the person doing is taking the black piece that says "RECORD" on it and flipping it over and swapping ends? Then grinding to fit? Plus Will the Record front deraileur be ok with tripple rings?

Axis: Yup I just picked it up yesterday from the bike shop. It's bling. You definitly need to wear sunglasses when viewing this thing. 

I'll keep my eye peeled for M952 front Ds on ebay.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Axis II said:


> Yes, road derailleurs are lighter but hard to get to work on frames with a top-pull orientation. If there was a quick and dirty way to get a Record FD to work on my top pull frames I'd be all over it.


Did someone say top pull Record? It was really quite simple to do. Yes, you take the black piece that says "Record Titanium" off. It simply unbolts at one pivot, and there's a circlip that I popped off with my fingernail at the other pivot. You turn it around and try and put it on, and you'll see right away where it needs some grinding. It took me about 20 minutes with my file to take off the required material, and I was being extremely careful to not remove too much. The only step I skipped was putting in a spacer to take up the gap left from turning the piece around. And yes, I know I need to change my derailleur cable. I picked mine up from the classifieds on Weight Weenies for $65 shipped. It literally looked brand new when I got it.


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## Strong Ti (Jun 1, 2005)

*Excellent!*

Now you've really made me want to give it a go, are you running the compact C-Record and is are those 42/29 Boone rings?


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Strong Ti said:


> Now you've really made me want to give it a go, are you running the compact C-Record Yes and is are those 44/29 Boone rings?


:thumbsup:


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> Did someone say top pull Record? It was really quite simple to do. Yes, you take the black piece that says "Record Titanium" off. It simply unbolts at one pivot, and there's a circlip that I popped off with my fingernail at the other pivot. You turn it around and try and put it on, and you'll see right away where it needs some grinding. It took me about 20 minutes with my file to take off the required material, and I was being extremely careful to not remove too much. The only step I skipped was putting in a spacer to take up the gap left from turning the piece around. And yes, I know I need to change my derailleur cable. I picked mine up from the classifieds on Weight Weenies for $65 shipped. It literally looked brand new when I got it.


That's very nice!:thumbsup: I will put this on my winter project list for certain. 20g or so saved over the 952 isn't a huge deal but it all counts. I assume this is a go for 2x9 only?


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Axis II said:


> That's very nice!:thumbsup: I will put this on my winter project list for certain. 20g or so saved over the 952 isn't a huge deal but it all counts. I assume this is a go for 2x9 only?


I was thinking the same thing will this work for a 3x9?

What about the Dura-Ace Front D? Is that possible? It too only weighs 74 grams for the braze on version.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Axis II said:


> I assume this is a go for 2x9 only?





Cheers! said:


> I was thinking the same thing will this work for a 3x9?


I know it works for 2x9. I don't have any direct experience with triples, but there are some that do. I have read about it a few times. I think Nino has some experience. Search for his posts.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

After doing some research. It appears it can shift a 3x9 setup. But you pretty much have to back out all of the screws to get to the wider limit. 

However I'm still not 100% it will work right. I believe a road bike has a Chainline of 43.5mm. Where as MTBs have a chainline of 50mm. Oddly Shimano does not specify a chainline for the FD-7803 Dura-Ace Tripple.

What is everyone out there using these days? Just the latest XTR offerings by Shimano?


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