# Microspline SS cogs



## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

like it or not, high-end hubs are all going to be Microspline or SRAM XD in the near future. There is at least one solution for XD with a singlepeed drivetrain.

is anyone making a microspline SS cog yet? who will be the first to do it? is there any reason that will not work?


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## edt (Mar 13, 2017)

I haven’t yet seen a microspline cog and I see no reason why it wouldn’t work. I’m guessing here but I suppose microspline cogs may appear onto the market but surely they’ll come at a premium as they may be a very niche component.

Single speed 'drive trains’ are simple and relatively inexpensive, arguably therein lies the basis of their purity. 

What concerns me more is the shrinking availability of affordable/reasonably priced single speed specific boost, 148 hubs for modern bikes. A single speed hub with a HG driver certainly does the trick. As much as I’d like to, I ain’t exactly thrilled about spending $450 for a hub, yeah?


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

edt said:


> As much as I'd like to, I ain't exactly thrilled about spending $450 for a hub, yeah?


I may be in the minority here, but I feel like $450 is very reasonable for what you're getting in a quality hub. A good rear hub will not only last a very long time, but it can change your riding experience. Especially on a single speed where engagement feels more beneficial.

I hear a lot of people get bent out of shape talking about expensive hubs, and I am always curious what they realistically expect. A quality rear hub takes a lot of engineering, design and machining to build. It's not a cheap process.

I'm not calling you out specifically, I am just generally curious what people are looking for in a hub. Don't get me wrong, if someone made a really nice high engagement hub and only marketed it for $250 I would be all over it. I just don't see that happening.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> I'm not calling you out specifically, I am just generally curious what people are looking for in a hub. Don't get me wrong, if someone made a really nice high engagement hub and only marketed it for $250 I would be all over it. I just don't see that happening.


Hope?


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> if someone made a really nice high engagement hub and only marketed it for $250 I would be all over it. I just don't see that happening.


Bontrager has the Line wheels, the rear WHEEL ends up being a little over $200 with the 6x pawl upgrade.

Boyd's rear hub is $175 and sounds really nice, but we'll see how the quality plays out over time.

And yes, Hope.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

I can understand the attraction to Hope. I had a set on my Stache and thought the quality and tolerances were somewhat lackluster. They also had a ton of bearing issues on previous iterations. As a general rule though they are definitely better than most complete build wheelsets. Has anyone emailed them to ask if they plan on putting out a Boost SS hub?

I would also be curious to hear feedback on the Bontragers. I know their wheels in the past came with Formula hubs, which are known to be disposable after a couple seasons. 

Again, take this for what it's worth... I am a bit snobby with my wheels and hubs are one thing I have no problem paying a bit more for.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I asked Hope a year or two ago if they planned to make a boost SS hub. They said "no". I asked again a few weeks ago and they are still not interested. I am sure they analyzed their reasons, but it seems like they are missing a worthwhile bit of the market. Oh well.


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## BrianU (Feb 4, 2004)

mack_turtle said:


> I asked Hope a year or two ago if they planned to make a boost SS hub. They said "no". I asked again a few weeks ago and they are still not interested. I am sure they analyzed their reasons, but it seems like they are missing a worthwhile bit of the market. Oh well.


I wonder who is their intended market for that non-boost SS hub? I have been happy with the Hope Pro 4s I have been running for the last year and a half and think they are a great hub, especially considering their price.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

Why question with SS specific boost hubs is are they really needed? I know you can decrease the cassette area and therefore increase the width between the flanges which should lead to a stronger wheel but the whole point of boost is to do the same thing. I mean is anyone out there single speeding with boost hubs and bending wheels a lot? I kind of wonder if the manufacturers of hubs look at boost and think the same thing and it saves them from making another hub.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

BrianU said:


> I wonder who is their intended market for that non-boost SS hub? I have been happy with the Hope Pro 4s I have been running for the last year and a half and think they are a great hub, especially considering their price.


I have to wonder if they are still making more. They probably have boxes of them that are becoming less and less popular.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> I can understand the attraction to Hope. I had a set on my Stache and thought the quality and tolerances were somewhat lackluster. They also had a ton of bearing issues on previous iterations. As a general rule though they are definitely better than most complete build wheelsets. Has anyone emailed them to ask if they plan on putting out a Boost SS hub?


I have been happy with Hopes and to be honest having tried out Onyx and I9s on other peoples bikes I wouldn't pay more for those. But I figure it is all personal preference. I'd still love a Profile rear hub though.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> high-end hubs are all going to be Microspline or SRAM XD in the near future.


It's just not true.

Any decent rear hub is convertible from QR to TA, and back, and from XD to HG and now Micro.

You'll be able to run HG cassettes (or single cogs) indefinitely.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

93EXCivic said:


> I have been happy with Hopes and to be honest having tried out Onyx and I9s on other peoples bikes I wouldn't pay more for those. But I figure it is all personal preference. I'd still love a Profile rear hub though.


I had the Profile non-Boost SS rear on my last Nimble 9. I am leaning heavily towards going that same route for my new Nimble 9 that's on order. I am having a heavier internal debate this go round between them and Onyx though.

I emailed Onyx yesterday and they said they will have a Boost SS Vesper out by late spring. I may hold off and pick one of those up as soon as they drop. I am just having a hard time selling myself on a silent bike. I am one of the few weirdos that actually likes a loud bike.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

mikesee said:


> It's just not true.


I don't see HG disappearing completely, but I would not be surprised if it becomes relegated to bikes with QR axles, straight steerer tubes, kick stand plates, and rim brakes. I don't have a problem with HG, it works just fine for me. I just can't imagine it competing with the new options in the long run on mid- to high end bike parts. Finding a hub with HG will be like trying to find a suspension fork with canti mounts in the near future. Just something to keep in mind if you want to "future proof" your purchases.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> I don't see HG disappearing completely, but I would not be surprised if it becomes relegated to bikes with QR axles, straight steerer tubes, kick stand plates, and rim brakes. I don't have a problem with HG, it works just fine for me. I just can't imagine it competing with the new options in the long run on mid- to high end bike parts. Finding a hub with HG will be like trying to find a suspension fork with canti mounts in the near future. Just something to keep in mind if you want to "future proof" your purchases.


We can agree to disagree.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

mack_turtle said:


> I don't see HG disappearing completely, but I would not be surprised if it becomes relegated to bikes with QR axles, straight steerer tubes, kick stand plates, and rim brakes. I don't have a problem with HG, it works just fine for me. I just can't imagine it competing with the new options in the long run on mid- to high end bike parts. Finding a hub with HG will be like trying to find a suspension fork with canti mounts in the near future. Just something to keep in mind if you want to "future proof" your purchases.


I feel like that is unlikely since you can just change the freehub to fit different cassettes. I feel like manufacturers are more likely to keep a freehub in production that can fit that then if it required a whole new hub.


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## edt (Mar 13, 2017)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> I am always curious what they realistically expect. A quality rear hub takes a lot of engineering, design and machining to build. It's not a cheap process.
> 
> I'm not calling you out specifically, I am just generally curious what people are looking for in a hub.


Quality is king and usually comes with a price tag, I get it.
My #1 expectation for a hub is reliability, it's gotta be bulletproof. I have always believed the wider flange spacing makes for a strong and reliable wheel.
I have a set of Halo XCD/XCS on my older single speed, 135 spacing, which have served me reliably since 2013.
Sadly, Halo no longer makes these hubs. My lbs built that wheelset for me for $600 using Stan's ZTR Crest rims.
I had the rear hub bearings replaced two months ago as a matter of maintenance and for the sake of continued reliability.


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## edt (Mar 13, 2017)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> Has anyone emailed them to ask if they plan on putting out a Boost SS hub?


I traded emails with Hope in December - 
Thank you for your email. You can convert the Pro 4 SS/T hub to 148mm Boost using the standard conversion kit, HUB493 and axle HUB1009-49S. Any Hope dealer can order the items and there is a dealer locator on our home page to help find your nearest ones.
Kind regards
Johnny


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

The Hope conversion kit sounds useful if you already bought a Hope SS hub some time ago and want to put it in a new frame. I don't see the point in buying a non-boost hub and then putting adapters on it though.

I have given up on finding a SS boost hub. Not much advantage for me over just using a regular boost hub with cog spacers.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> I have given up on finding a SS boost hub.


Um, Onyx?


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## Sidewalk (May 18, 2015)

New bikes are specced with an HG driver with the low end Sram cassettes.

I wouldn't worry about HG disappearing any time soon.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

mikesee said:


> Um, Onyx?


An SS boost hub that has a reasonable price tag. I am sure the onyx product is very nice but the price is absurd a normal person's budget.

I guess I am jaded. I paid top dollar for a Hadley hub and it's utter ****. I can't imagine paying more for a hub after that.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> An SS boost hub that has a reasonable price tag. I am sure the onyx product is very nice but the price is absurd a normal person's budget.
> 
> I guess I am jaded. I paid top dollar for a Hadley hub and it's utter ****. I can't imagine paying more for a hub after that.


What you wrote here says a lot.

Not judging, just observing.

I get the feeling of being burned. I'm not a Hadley fan, but more because of their _you-must-call-us_ business model. They're holdouts/standouts in that respect, and it's inconvenient.

'Normal person's budget' is relative. People value things differently. Some would rather cut back on beer (wine, weed, etc...) for a few months in order to make their riding experience that much more ____.

I'd pay full-bucket retail for an Onyx hub before I'd ride a Hope or I9 for free. That calculus is arrived at purely based on the amount of noise each makes when coasting.

No right, no wrong, just different perspectives.


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## azjonboy (Dec 21, 2006)

While the Onyx SS, Boost hub is expensive, it is really a quality hub. I can see it lasting for many years. It runs silently and its cool to be in the mountains away from everyone and not hear my rear hub. 

I have a King SS, QR hub on my Klunker. I ran that hub on my SS 29er for 9 years before retiring it to the Klunker. It still spins beautifully.

I have an older I9 SS hub, QR, that is 10 years old and still functions perfectly.

Quality SS hubs will last years. You get what you pay for.

And BTW, have Had DT Swiss SS hubs also. They don’t compare to those lists above.


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## KgB (Jan 13, 2004)

I regret not getting an Onyx hub sooner, well worth the hefty price tag, I checked around and no one has plans to Make a SS microspline cog anytime soon but as it was pointed out the HG freehub will most certainly be available for a long long time.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

I suspect it will be a smaller company like Endless or Wolf Tooth that makes the first MS SS cog. Wouldn't be surprised if we see it by mid summer.


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## Pauldotcom (Aug 15, 2010)

If quality is King there is only one, KING.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Pauldotcom said:


> If quality is King there is only one, KING.


They were pretty slow to adopt MS in the first place. Not expecting a snappy response to the very small SS cog market. If ever.


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## Shinkers (Feb 5, 2014)

Paul Components makes a boost hub that you can thread a freewheel onto. For that reason alone I believe that HG freehubs will be around for a very long time yet. 

I will never again ride a hub that does not have some form of ratchet drive system. DT 350 hubs are unparalleled in their value. I've also had very good luck with the Mavic ID360 system. 

Pawls suck and there's no reason to be riding them on a single speed.

Edit: That is, pawls suck unless they are in a White freewheel.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Shinkers said:


> Paul Components makes a boost hub that you can thread a freewheel onto. For that reason alone I believe that HG freehubs will be around for a very long time yet.
> 
> I will never again ride a hub that does not have some form of ratchet drive system. DT 350 hubs are unparalleled in their value. I've also had very good luck with the Mavic ID360 system.
> 
> ...


Nobody tell him that they use the same pawls in their geared hubs. It will apparently ruin his impression of the freewheels, which I agree are pretty bomb proof.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

Shinkers said:


> Paul Components makes a boost hub that you can thread a freewheel onto. For that reason alone I believe that HG freehubs will be around for a very long time yet.
> 
> I will never again ride a hub that does not have some form of ratchet drive system. DT 350 hubs are unparalleled in their value. I've also had very good luck with the Mavic ID360 system.
> 
> ...


Pawl engagement systems are the most widely used, and probably the most well hashed out design out there from an engineering standpoint... your statement is a bit ridiculous. I understand if people like the Onyx sprag or King ring spline setup, but pawls have been around for a million years and are very reliable.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Most hubs have some sort of pawl/ratchet ring design in them. There are only a few outliers.

I emailed Problem Solvers about the lack of MS singlespeed cogs. I am sure it's not their top priority, but it's on their radar and they're just the company to make such an oddball solution.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

mikesee said:


> I'd pay full-bucket retail for an Onyx hub before I'd ride a Hope or I9 for free. That calculus is arrived at purely based on the amount of noise each makes when coasting.
> 
> No right, no wrong, just different perspectives.


Call me shallow but that is the reason I don't want Onyx. So I agree with your statement on no right or wrong. I did try out an Onyx equipped bike though.

Only reason I'll take a silent hub is if it is a freecoaster on my BMX.


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

mack_turtle said:


> Most hubs have some sort of pawl/ratchet ring design in them. There are only a few outliers.
> 
> I emailed Problem Solvers about the lack of MS singlespeed cogs. I am sure it's not their top priority, but it's on their radar and they're just the company to make such an oddball solution.


Honestly, it would be relatively easy for them to adapt their current "six-bolt" adaptor to it.


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## Nubster (May 15, 2009)

mack_turtle said:


> The Hope conversion kit sounds useful if you already bought a Hope SS hub some time ago and want to put it in a new frame. I don't see the point in buying a non-boost hub and then putting adapters on it though.
> 
> I have given up on finding a SS boost hub. Not much advantage for me over just using a regular boost hub with cog spacers.


The only advantage getting a Hope SS hub is 2x the engagement. But I also didn't want to use adapters to get one to work in my new boost frame so I ended up grabbing an I9 Classic from Jenson using one of their 15% codes. So I got it pretty reasonable in price. 90 POE should be plenty for single speed. I've never really had issues with 44 POE using Hope Pro 4 hubs. But the 90 will be nice.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

93EXCivic said:


> Call me shallow but that is the reason I don't want Onyx. So I agree with your statement on no right or wrong. I did try out an Onyx equipped bike though.
> 
> Only reason I'll take a silent hub is if it is a freecoaster on my BMX.


There is some weird trait hardwired into the brains of former (or current) BMX guys, where we can't ride quiet bikes. Of all the guys I know and ride with, I am the only one who grew up riding street, and I am the only one who likes loud bikes.

I am not sure if it's just habit, or something to do with being able to hear what your bike is doing underneath you? Whatever it is, I switched bikes with a buddy of mine for one ride and he has Onyx. The engagement was amazing but something just felt like it was missing. Like I was disconnected from the bike or something? I could probably get used to it, but it felt awkward.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I rode BMX and remember lusting for a Profile hub because they were loud. I rode a modified Nankai freecoaster for a while and it felt weird. I told myself that I could gauge my speed by the sound of the hub, but that might be nonsense.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

mack_turtle said:


> I rode BMX and remember lusting for a Profile hub because they were loud. I rode a modified Nankai freecoaster for a while and it felt weird. I told myself that I could gauge my speed by the sound of the hub, but that might be nonsense.


You may be right. Honestly it's not something I can really explain in a coherent manner... A loud hub just provides some kind of weird feedback that I find necessary. The best way I could describe riding Onyx the first time would be to say it felt sort of unbalanced.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> You may be right. Honestly it's not something I can really explain in a coherent manner... A loud hub just provides some kind of weird feedback that I find necessary. The best way I could describe riding Onyx the first time would be to say it felt sort of unbalanced.


No BMX background here at all, and I like the opposite. I feel like a nice quiet hub lets me engage more in my surroundings.

Back on topic: I'm sure somebody will release microspline cogs, but they really aren't necessary. Any decent hub these days can be had with any of the 3 current freehubs, and that's not going to change anytime soon.

Although the Microspline standard should allow thinner cogs to be more durable because the splines are deeper than the HG freehubs.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

As a group, we are a bunch of luddites. You see more posts about steel frames than carbon here. It wouldn't be profitable for a company to make microspline cogs. Someone will fill this niche, but I do not think it will be the standard. It's very easy to switch freehub bodies on modern hubs. There would be more savings from changing freehub bodies than replacing our cogs.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Rod said:


> As a group, we are a bunch of luddites. You see more posts about steel frames than carbon here. It wouldn't be profitable for a company to make microspline cogs. Someone will fill this niche, but I do not think it will be the standard. It's very easy to switch freehub bodies on modern hubs. There would be more savings from changing freehub bodies than replacing our cogs.


I agree it will never become the "standard." HG will always rule SS hubs/cogs, there's no reason to change it. But it's always going to be cheaper to buy a $30 Surly cog instead of an entire freehub on a mid-high level hub.

For example, I9 freehubs go for $130, the stainless HG version goes for $225 or something.

That's a lot of Surly cogs and 8 speed chains.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

*OneSpeed* said:


> I agree it will never become the "standard." HG will always rule SS hubs/cogs, there's no reason to change it. But it's always going to be cheaper to buy a $30 Surly cog instead of an entire freehub on a mid-high level hub.
> 
> For example, I9 freehubs go for $130, the stainless HG version goes for $225 or something.
> 
> That's a lot of Surly cogs and 8 speed chains.


I forget what's my norm is not the norm for everyone. Overall, we love our high end hubs with insane engagement. Good point!

As an aside, a replacement freehub body for my hub would be 60, which includes shipping.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Total sidebar:

It always amuses me what I spend money on and how I value components. $500 carbon fork on the bike? Check. Unused $900 Fox 34 fork sitting in a closet? Check. $8 chain? Check.


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## Shinkers (Feb 5, 2014)

SingleSpeedSteven said:


> Pawl engagement systems are the most widely used, and probably the most well hashed out design out there from an engineering standpoint... your statement is a bit ridiculous. I understand if people like the Onyx sprag or King ring spline setup, but pawls have been around for a million years and are very reliable.


I completely disagree. With normal pawl'd hubs, during load not all of the load is carried through all of the pawls due to axle flex and manufacturing tolerance. Even if all of the pawls are engaged and loaded, the surface area is much lower when compared to a DT star ratchet, where the faces of the ratchets are touching each other.

If you want more engagement, you can purchase a relatively inexpensive set of ratchets and replace what's in your hub. If you do manage to nuke your ratchets (due to too much grease or something causing the ratchets to not mesh properly), they are easily replaced.

If you nuke your pawl'd hub, you are looking at needing to buy an entire freehub body which may or may not be inexpensive, and more likely you will need to replace the drive ring which requires finding someone that has a tool to remove the ring in your hub.

Pawl'd hubs have been around forever, you're not wrong. And they have worked for millions of people. But I do believe that the DT and similar systems are superior in pretty much every way.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

If DT Swiss would make a hub that actually has what anyone would consider "high engagement" I might buy one. They sell the hub with bullshit slow ratchets and then expect everyone to shell out another $100+ for two metal bits to make the engagement tolerable at least.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> If DT Swiss would make a hub that actually has what anyone would consider "high engagement" I might buy one. They sell the hub with bullshit slow ratchets and then expect everyone to shell out another $100+ for two metal bits to make the engagement tolerable at least.


I don't/won't/can't speak for DT, but I suspect that they know what a tiny fraction of the market even knows what engagement *means*, much less gives a **** about it.

Sure, they could spend some R&D $$$$$ to develop something with high engagement, and they'd sell _maybe_ a few thousand of them per year. Compare that to the hundreds of thosuands that they're selling now -- and that last forever with next to zero maintenance -- and it's easy to see why they're unmotivated to go down that road. Loss leader, most likely.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

That makes sense. Doesn't make me any more likely to buy one.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mack_turtle said:


> That makes sense. Doesn't make me any more likely to buy one.


Let's be honest here: You're not that likely to buy _anything_. You've written in this very thread that DT lacks the engagement you desire. Fair enough. For a few bucks more you could have DT with high engagement, but you've also said you won't buy that. Also -- again, right here in this very thread -- you've said that you wouldn't buy Onyx because they're too expensive.

You've sort of backed yourself into a corner. Truthfully, it's a corner that not many manufacturers care about -- if they did they would be filling the gap.

And all of this because you've convinced yourself that there's a problem that doesn't actually exist. And is not likely to exist for at least a decade, if ever.

So, if I have this right, you've created a non-existent problem, and are now e-wringing your hands because you don't like the (easily accessible and super high quality) solutions to a problem that doesn't exist?

The first world is landing hard on you today, man.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

mikesee said:


> The first world is landing hard on you today, man.


I deserve that! Being an insufferable gooch as usual.

I had written something more, but then another big stupid vaping company ad took over the screen.

for context, I was reading about the new Shimano hubs. it appears that XT and XTR hubs are only Microspline now, which made me wonder if more hubs are going to have limited options in the near future. most manufacturers have zero interest in catering to the "singlespeed" market so, they have no reason to keep HG around for anything but their low-end products. I posted this originally to tell anyone who might be interested in being the _first to marke_t with such a thing: there will be some demand for microspline SS cogs. how big is that demand? I dunno, we'll find out. give it a few years. no one will be making 142x12 hubs in a few years either.

I don't think 10 degrees available from a DT 54t rather setup is remotely "high engagement" and is a $100+ "upgrade" (not what I would consider "a few bucks" unless they have some deal going that I don't know about) to an already nice, albeit pricey hub. it's just disappointing to me considering the price of those hubs. they could do better but I accept that it's a sticking point for me and not everyone else. I'd pay for a 350 hub if that was an option.

I'll most likely build my next wheel around Boyd Tripel hubs. under $300 for the pair, great engagement, simple build, but no long-term reviews yet.


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## Shinkers (Feb 5, 2014)

I still haven't figured out why everyone is so titillated with high engagement. I have 18 tooth ratchets in all of my bikes and they are great. I have never (NEVER) been in a situation where I thought to myself that higher engagement would have made something more rideable. If anything, I see slightly more benefit to higher engagement on a geared bike where you are more likely to be spinning a higher cadence (more revolutions within a given space) while being seated.

We are to a point where engagement has become purely a marketing tool, and I think it's hilarious that the same Luddites who complain about modern geometry and changing standards continue to suck up the uber-high engagement BS. 

Again, I know that I'm in a minority here and I'm perfectly fine with that. I will continue to smugly ride my 18 POE DT Swiss hubs.

And FWIW, 54 tooth ratchets provide 6.6 degrees between points, not 10.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Shinkers said:


> I still haven't figured out why everyone is so titillated with high engagement. *I have 18 tooth ratchets in all of my bikes and they are great. I have never (NEVER) been in a situation where I thought to myself that higher engagement would have made something more rideable. If anything, I see slightly more benefit to higher engagement on a geared bike *where you are more likely to be spinning a higher cadence (more revolutions within a given space) while being seated.
> 
> We are to a point where engagement has become purely a marketing tool, and I think it's hilarious that the same Luddites who complain about modern geometry and changing standards continue to suck up the uber-high engagement BS.
> 
> ...


Have you ever owned a high engagement hub for a significant amount of time? Sounds like you're making some pretty strong conclusions without having spent a good amount of time on a hub with high POE.

High engagement is important to me on every bike, but much more important on a SS MTB. Hands down the one bike where high engagement has tangible benefits.

Marketing has nothing to do with my perception of the ride qualities I spec my bikes with. I have +/- 8 American made hubs with moderate to super high engagement on my bikes, all of which I built myself. I put in about 350-400 hours per year on the bike. For technical terrain in particular, I much prefer a high engagement hub, and frankly the higher the better.

There is no right or wrong, and you're entitled to your opinion, but just because you don't notice or care doesn't mean other people can't tell the difference.


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## Shinkers (Feb 5, 2014)

With regards to my post above, it states that "I" don't understand the hype, and that "I" don't believe there's benefit on a SS bike. I'm not telling you not to ride a bike with high POE, but I personally don't think it's better and I stated that I do know I'm in the minority.


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## BrianU (Feb 4, 2004)

Shinkers said:


> If anything, I see slightly more benefit to higher engagement on a geared bike where you are more likely to be spinning a higher cadence (more revolutions within a given space) while being seated.


It is the other way around. In situations where you can maintain a smooth cadence while seated, a lower POE is not as noticeable. I run Hope Pro 4s on my geared HT and the 44 POE is not an issue, however I do appreciate the higher POE of the Chris Kings on my SS where mashing out of the saddle is common.

There was a time in my life where the majority of my cycling was on the road. At a constant 90+ rpm, POE is a non-issue. I honestly do not think I ever heard of POE until I got into mountain biking.


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## Shinkers (Feb 5, 2014)

BrianU said:


> It is the other way around.


I completely disagree.


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## Nubster (May 15, 2009)

I've ridden low POE and I've ridden Chris King and several things inbetween. I also just received my new I9 Classic (90 POE) hubs from Jenson today that's going on my single speed. There's absolutely a benefit and quite noticeable one at that when riding higher POE on single speed. I agree...it's not as noticeable riding geared.


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## PHS (Sep 5, 2009)

*DT 350 for SS*

Has anyone had any experience single speeding with the DT 350 rear hub?

Additionally, how about if it's laced to a Specialized Carbon Roval Control rim or the Traverse Carbon rim?


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## BrianU (Feb 4, 2004)

PHS said:


> Has anyone had any experience single speeding with the DT 350 rear hub?
> 
> Additionally, how about if it's laced to a Specialized Carbon Roval Control rim or the Traverse Carbon rim?


I have set of 350 hubs that I picked up several years ago on a killer deal and have always planned to build them up as a spare wheelset for my SS. Although my 14 year old daughter seems to be growing like a weed and I can see her soon fitting my old Kona Unit frame currently hanging in the garage, so maybe I'll put them on that. They are proven hubs and I see no reason why it would be different than running them on any other rim or bike.


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## PHS (Sep 5, 2009)

Thx for the reply. I've had good luck with I9's but never had DT Swiss 350 hubs. Hopefully they are solid enough to handle a single speed setup.


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## BrianU (Feb 4, 2004)

PHS said:


> Thx for the reply. I've had good luck with I9's but never had DT Swiss 350 hubs. Hopefully they are solid enough to handle a single speed setup.


They are solid hubs, but the POE is going to be significantly less than your I9s if that matters to you.


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## PHS (Sep 5, 2009)

Current rear DT350 hub has the Microspline. Need to run my singlespeed spacer and cog kit. Would anybody know what options that are out there? Guessing I need to change freehub out?


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Unless something changed since I brought the topic up, you'll need to change the freehub. I'd email some companies that specialize in oddball stuff like this and let them know you're interested in a MSSS cog.


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## Sidewalk (May 18, 2015)

Any updates on this? I am thinking about running my XC bike as an SS outside of race season. Has a nice XTR M9100 hub and nice wheel already, and I don't want to replace those.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I don't need one, but I can't find anything yet. if you really want it, you'll need to start emailing the smaller manufacturers mentioned earlier in this thread and let them know there's interest in such a thing.


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

Stand by, as soon as it ships, I have a stupid idea involving denuding the spider from a MS cassette and coaster brake sprockets.


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## register (Jun 25, 2011)

Reached out to both Endless and Rennen. Both said they plan on making Microspline SS cogs. Time frame, who knows. The more that ask the better.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

register said:


> Reached out to both Endless and Rennen. Both said they plan on making Microspline SS cogs. Time frame, who knows. The more that ask the better.


I reached out to Wolf Tooth, waiting to hear back.


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

Okay, as promised. I bought a new SLX cassette for this butchering, but there's no reason that you can't use your worn out MS cassette (they all appear to use the same spider attachment, though I have not verified this).

Step 1: Drill out the rivets on the two smallest sprockets (they're already mostly center punched) using a drill press. You can do the others if you want to make your life easier later.

Step 2: Punch out the rivets with a 1/8 or 3mm punch. The rivets are quite tight regardless of whether or not you remove the head all the way.

Step 3: Cut off the arms of the spider in a convenient place. I chose the second hole, and I may still remove them all the way down to the first one.

Step 4: File/cut excess, and tap the holes (use an M4x0.75). _NB_: you can through drill and use an M4 nut on the other side, but the clearance is tight.

Step 5: Acquire a coaster brake sprocket of your choosing. I had a 20t Alfine sprocket with integrated chainguard, which got this whole thing rolling around in my head. I noticed that the holes for the plastic guard seemed about the same spacing, and reasoned that rather than changing their tooling, they would re-use what they could in manufacture. As you can see, I was 100% accurate in my size assessment, even if the reasoning is not.

Step 6: Using a file/sander/stone/milling head, enlarge the center hole of the sprocket to fit over the raised cone on the modified spider. If using a different sprocket than the above, fix it with a clamp/spray adhesive/whatever, and center punch it through the rear holes of the spider. Drill/enlarge the holes to 4mm.

Step 7: Mount to spider with hardware. I used road brake retaining screws--please note that there is not a preponderance of material that has threads on the spider. I mocked this up as is, but will likely go back to install the screws using red loctite. I'm still personally mulling over putting nuts on the back.


















Things I didn't immediately think of at the outset:

-Freehub spacers to take up room are not really readily available yet--regular HG spacers fit (the 'splines' on Shimano HG spacers have the same ID as the outside diameter of the Microspline freehub), BUT

-The lockring is made to clamp down on something SMALLER than the diameter of the splines on the freehub. You must either use the top two sprockets, or custom tooled hardware will need to be made.

At any rate, this is currently a proof-of-concept. I need to get checked out by the doctor before trying this out, as my back hasn't recovered from 1.5 weeks ago pulling it while riding.


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## socal_jack (Dec 30, 2008)

So these guys are making an MS SS cog, but only 2mm thick

Stainless steel singlespeed cogs (to fit 3/32" and 5/64" chains) - Shimano Micro Spline compatible


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

socal_jack said:


> So these guys are making an MS SS cog, but only 2mm thick
> 
> Stainless steel singlespeed cogs (to fit 3/32" and 5/64" chains) - Shimano Micro Spline compatible


As I discovered with my debacle, the main issue that I had after getting a sprocket mounted was that the lockrings included with cassettes (of which there are no other current analogues) don't actually get far enough out to clamp onto the spacers on the hub. Unless a manufacturer undertakes both the sprocket AND lockring, we're still not there yet. I will say, though: bravo, for the next step to making it more accessible.

Incidentally, before I took my frankenstein creation for a shakedown, I realized that the chainline would require me to flip the sprocket, so back under the knife it went:










A little profiling and red loctite later, I put in a spirited 10 mile ride, and nothing broke. Given that similar setups are used to adapt sprockets to hubs as a jackshaft transmission on tricycles, I am satisfied that this will hold up long(ish) term. Since the wheels that it is on live with studded tires, they don't get used THAT much.


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## teamdicky (Jan 12, 2004)

Boone did it!!


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## register (Jun 25, 2011)

That is awesome! Just need to figure out how to space it.


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## 834905 (Mar 8, 2018)

teamdicky said:


> Boone did it!!
> View attachment 1925970


Wow, it even looks badass. I dig it.


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

Once I get my wheel and 22T cog back from Boone, that is my first order of business!


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## Provurban (Nov 28, 2012)

mack_turtle said:


> like it or not, high-end hubs are all going to be Microspline or SRAM XD in the near future. There is at least one solution for XD with a singlepeed drivetrain.
> 
> is anyone making a microspline SS cog yet? who will be the first to do it? is there any reason that will not work?


Not sure if anyone mentioned this but Boone is back in the SS cog game and it looks like they are offering a microspline option.


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## register (Jun 25, 2011)

Going to order a Boone cog. With microspline can I just use regular single speed spacers meant for hg? And will a standard 11speed lock ring work?


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## northy185 (Feb 10, 2019)

OF COURSE Boone makes a cog a month after I decided to go a different direction with my wheelset. Gonna keep this feather in my cap for later though!!


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

register said:


> Going to order a Boone cog. With microspline can I just use regular single speed spacers meant for hg? And will a standard 11speed lock ring work?


1) kind of.

2) no.

HG spacers that have locating splines--such as those from cassettes-- fit snugly on top of the microspline pattern. Cheapies float/rattle.

The lockring thread diameter is significantly smaller on MS versus HG. UNfortunately, the MS lockring is also not fully threaded, so spacers must be used to allow for clamping...but the lockring is such a small diameter, that is doesn't contact even the microspline spacers, even if you could arrange that to work. Additionally, the unthreaded shoulder means that you NEED to have some kind of spacer arrangement, since you can't remove the excess length that you don't need. Someone would need to make a custom lockring, or a spacer that would work for the standard one. TLDR you must use the two top-end sprockets from a microspline cassette, plus the lockring, in order to fasten anything to the freehub body.


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## serious1 (Jan 11, 2013)

Couldn't you just use something like this instead of a spacer kit? I'm sure someone could 3d print a prototype for the MS freehub.









GearClamp-Single Speed Kit (Shimano/SRAM)


Two clamps on your freehub allow for a lighter weight single speed conversion. A 2.5mm allen bolt on each clamp allows fast, even trailside, gear swaps and chainline adjustment. <br/> <br/> <ul> <li>Use clamps with 16t Cogs and larger</li> <li>If using 15t Cogs or smaller, install two...




www.modernbike.com


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## northy185 (Feb 10, 2019)

serious1 said:


> Couldn't you just use something like this instead of a spacer kit? I'm sure someone could 3d print a prototype for the MS freehub.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 I use gear clamps on all my HG SS bikes, and love them. I would definitely throw some scratch to a big brained 3d printer person for some that would work reliably with MS.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

serious1 said:


> Couldn't you just use something like this instead of a spacer kit? I'm sure someone could 3d print a prototype for the MS freehub.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Being the cheap bastard I am, I used PVC to make spacers for my HG driver and cog. Takes 30 seconds with my chop saw and a stick of Carlon 1 1/4" pipe is less than 5 bux.


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## habaden (Sep 16, 2019)

Anyone have a Boone SS ring? What spacers/lockring do I need to purchase inorder to install?


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## zef95 (Oct 5, 2009)

Custom microspline spacer for this silly (and hopefully temporary) problem of no commercially available ones. Carbon-filled nylon, and mounted easily with a SLX lockring. I could entertain a small run if people are interested.


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## GoldenPromise (Dec 4, 2020)

That's rad. I have a set being made from aluminum locally, waiting on these now. The hardest part is getting the chainline dead nuts on. Good call on using black plastic, as that'll be cheaper than painting or anodizing them to get to black.


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## ssjimbo (Dec 6, 2016)

Boone now has both spacers and a lockring. It's not a cheap solution ($182 for 20T cog plus spacers and a lockring), but cheaper than a new wheel, so there's that. Fortunately I bought an I9 HG freehub a couple weeks ago for my rear wheel, so I don't have to make that decision, though I do happen to have a MS Boone cog sitting in my small parts drawer, so it will be on there someday.
Spacers – Boone Technologies (booneti.com)


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Hi, there, new here! I already bought 2 Boone cogs, but I'm struggling to select the correct spacers, because Boone doesn't make them thin enough(say 1mm) and I don't want to have problems with my chain line (52mm). I'm thinking to buy from Boone one wide spacer with the lock ring (they look clean and sturdy for the trails) and fill the rest of the body with regular HG spacers (1mm). I'm assuming that the outer diameter of the micro spline hub is the same as the HG? Can you help me? Otherwise, those Boone cogs, no matter how artisan they look, will be useless as jewelry. Thanks in advance! 

Btw, can anybody provide pictures or video with a complete built with the Boone kit ( spacers, lockring and cog)?


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

SS777 said:


> Hi, there, new here! I already bought 2 Boone cogs, but I'm struggling to select the correct spacers, because Boone doesn't make them thin enough(say 1mm) and I don't want to have problems with my chain line (52mm). I'm thinking to buy from Boone one wide spacer with the lock ring (they look clean and sturdy for the trails) and fill the rest of the body with regular HG spacers (1mm). I'm assuming that the outer diameter of the micro spline hub is the same as the HG? Can you help me? Otherwise, those Boone cogs, no matter how artisan they look, will be useless as jewelry. Thanks in advance!
> 
> Btw, can anybody provide pictures or video with a complete built with the Boone kit ( spacers, lockring and cog)?


I put up a video on YouTube on how I installed mine. I'll see if I can find it later, but if you search Boone Microspline Singlespeed cog I bet you'll find it


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

SS777 said:


> Hi, there, new here! I already bought 2 Boone cogs, but I'm struggling to select the correct spacers, because Boone doesn't make them thin enough(say 1mm) and I don't want to have problems with my chain line (52mm). I'm thinking to buy from Boone one wide spacer with the lock ring (they look clean and sturdy for the trails) and fill the rest of the body with regular HG spacers (1mm). I'm assuming that the outer diameter of the micro spline hub is the same as the HG? Can you help me? Otherwise, those Boone cogs, no matter how artisan they look, will be useless as jewelry. Thanks in advance!
> 
> Btw, can anybody provide pictures or video with a complete built with the Boone kit ( spacers, lockring and cog)?


Unfortunately, the microdrive is a smaller splined shell that is slightly larger diameter than XD. 
I did my spacers with aluminum tubing and my compound mitre saw after measuring for correct chainline. That process can be done with HG and correct diameter material.
HG carries the right diameter to get away with 1.25" PVC pipe. Don't remember the diameter for microdrive.


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

SS777 said:


> Btw, can anybody provide pictures or video with a complete built with the Boone kit ( spacers, lockring and cog)?


Here is the video I made. Thank jeebus I'm not striving for internet fame.
I found that "HG" spacers, as long as they have the tab to fit between the splines, work great as they sit on top of the microspline, uh, splines. But as @BansheeRune said you can always fabricate your own up with some other options. For my video the trickiest part was using the right size headset spacers to step up from the lockring to the cog. This is one area I would absolutely splurge on. The Boone lockring would make that step so much easier.
Hope this helps.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

As long as the spacer ID slips over the driver with a close fit, of o the races! Then it is an alignment check, measurements and chop saw time.
While there are a host of commercially available parts, I like to fabricate parts and make it my bike. 

Just as territorial as a tomcat...


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Thanks for your replies. The way I see it, my Boone cogs pictured above are the most expensive pieces of jewelry I ever purchased thus far with no practical use in the foresseable future. I couldn't find an affordable wheel with HG free hub body to replace the bloody wheel with the microspline (shimano, stop being harsh on me) and thus I thought Boone's cogs were the solution. But the guys there clearly don't know the concept of chainline and they based their calculations without having in mind the length of the end cap drive side. To add more frustration to this, they don't offer narrow spacers (btw, again their spacers and lockring are artisan pieces and that's why I don't want to think or look for other solutions proposed here, I even rejected the idea of visiting a local lathe worker) with diameter of 1mm (yet they offer them for the HG hub!!!). If I knew for sure that their HG spacers will fit the microspline, I would have ordered 2 wide sparers + lockring and a stack of those with 1mm to properly fix my chainline. I think I will keep my SC Chameleon geared (which sucks). Already today I placed an order for my 2nd Kona Unit which I adore. Now I want a trail/XC ss horse...

#ratherdeadthangeared


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

You will find the microspline body has a smaller OD that does HG. HG spacers would be like a person with a 30" waist trying to wear 38" pants!
Get the chainline sorted, measure both sides for appropriate spacer dimensions and gitter dun. 

#bloody'ell


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Thank you for clarifying that HG spacers can't do the job on a micro spline. Already ordered a surly ss kit and a couple of cogs and I'm camping in my pc room trying to find an affordable boost wheel with HG.

I will probably sell the wheel with the micro spline + drivetrain to recoup some of the money I spent on Boone cogs.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

SS777 said:


> Thank you for clarifying that HG spacers can't do the job on a micro spline. Already ordered a surly ss kit and a couple of cogs and I'm camping in my pc room trying to find an affordable boost wheel with HG.
> 
> I will probably sell the wheel with the micro spline + drivetrain to recoup some of the money I spent on Boone cogs.


No worries! Just hate to think a fella might order up parts and when they arrive, cannot be used. If you know the make/model of the hub, you might be able to simply purchase an HG driver vs. a whole wheel. Savin bux, brother, savin bux!


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Savin bux and cycling are incompatible things, I'm afraid. What keeps me from repurposing my bikes into office furniture (need a couple, three tables btw) is my reluctance towards manual labor, a syndrome I most probably developed since started cycling.

I've already bought and I'm expecting 2 rear wheels ( 27.5 for mullet configuration and a 29), both cost me about the same as the the Boone cogs (shipping included).

Eagerly and patiently waiting to find out who will be the 3rd person to buy microspline Boone ss cogs and his solution


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Finally, I found a 3rd user of Boone cogs. How did he configure his chainline with a centered cog on the rear hub? Messing around with the crankset?


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## kustomz (Jan 6, 2004)

SS777 said:


> Finally, I found a 3rd user of Boone cogs. How did he configure his chainline with a centered cog on the rear hub? Messing around with the crankset?


You simply place the cog where you need it for a centered chainline, then order the correct length spacers for each side of the cog. Spacers


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

SS777 said:


> Finally, I found a 3rd user of Boone cogs. How did he configure his chainline with a centered cog on the rear hub? Messing around with the crankset?


No offense, but it seems like you are making it harder than necessary. It is no different from any other HG style freehub body with the exception of it being shorter. As @kustomz pointed out above, you just line it up and use spacers. Also, there are HG freehub spacers that have tabs as I pointed out in my video I linked for you above. Those tabs fit just fine on a Microspline freehub.
I ran my Boone Ti Microspline cog for well over 1K miles. On my 157mm spaced bike, with the crankset I was using at the time the Microspline cog sat right on the end of the Microspline unit so I used appropriate spacers. I switched cranks, which moved my chainline in-board, so I just repositioned the cog and moved some spacers around. Just like any other HG singlespeed setup.
Nothing different with Microspline.


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## GoldenPromise (Dec 4, 2020)

Here is how you determine your spacer widths:









Why does this happen!


this is the second time since FRIDAY!!!!!!! its a sram pc9




www.mtbr.com


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

measure the width of your seat tube. divide that by 2.
measure from the side of your seat tube to the center of the chainring. add that to the number above. that's your chainline.

take the width of your rear axle divided by two.
135/2=67.5
142/2=71
148/2=74
that's the length from the center of your axle to the end of the axle.

subtract the chainline from the axle half length. put some spacers and a cog on your hub. put a straight edge against the end of your axle and measure the horizontal distance from that plane to where the cog currently is. if it's with 1–2mm of the chainline, you're good. if not, rearrange spacers as needed until it lines up.

this sounds complicated when described in types words, but it's simple enough for any child to figure out. rather than eyeballing it, this takes less than five minutes and gives results immediately without guessing.


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## Monty219 (Oct 26, 2020)

I went with boone and followed their instructions for spacing measurements to match their lock ring. I eyeballed the center line on my cassette using a caliper and it came out pretty well.


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

This looks neat! This is what I'm looking for! My struggle is to determine the width of those two spacers (I wouldn't have the same problem with a kit with spacers of various widths). So what are the widths of those two spacers you are using? I'm assuming that I will need the same for a boost rear axle (front chainline approximately 54-55mm, measured using wooden skewer as suggested in other topic of the forum).

Am I right to assume that Boone should have made fixed widths (maybe kits?) for non-boost, boost and super boost rear axles? While I was implementing the method with the wooden skewer for the front, I thought to do the same for my other mtb bikes. And I got similar results: 52-53mm for the non boost, 54-55 for the boost ones (I have 3 non-boost and 2 boost). I guess we can skip the part of determining the front chainline?


Btw, thanks for all the replies.



Monty219 said:


> I went with boone and followed their instructions for spacing measurements to match their lock ring. I eyeballed the center line on my cassette using a caliper and it came out pretty well.
> View attachment 1992233


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

SS777 said:


> Am I right to assume that Boone should have made fixed widths (maybe kits?) for non-boost, boost and super boost rear axles? While I was implementing the method with the wooden skewer for the front, I thought to do the same for my other mtb bikes. And I got similar results: 52-53mm for the non boost, 54-55 for the boost ones (I have 3 non-boost and 2 boost). I guess we can skip the part of determining the front chainline?


Maybe, but I (and I would think, most) people who are laying out that much money for a single sprocket are also going to be concerned with it being perfect--not just "close enough".


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

SS777 said:


> Am I right to assume that Boone should have made fixed widths (maybe kits?) for non-boost, boost and super boost rear axles? While I was implementing the method with the wooden skewer for the front, I thought to do the same for my other mtb bikes. And I got similar results: 52-53mm for the non boost, 54-55 for the boost ones (I have 3 non-boost and 2 boost). I guess we can skip the part of determining the front chainline?
> 
> 
> Btw, thanks for all the replies.


If a fella takes the time to get measurements, Boone might do one off spacers for people. Stocking spacers can get out of hand since there are too many variables.

Sort out your chainline needs, get measurements and ask em to do the deed. Or Purely Custom, for that matter.
Monty and a few others did the deed and some simple fabrication, look where it got em.

They took the science out of rocket science... Be resourceful and innovative.


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Nah, won't do Boone's measurements. Already got my wheels with HG hubs (both cost me 50 USD less than Boone cogs, not counting the import tax- actually I didn't have the courage to do so ).

Btw, can you please point me to other topic/discussion in the forum about turning a road bike into ss? Hopefully, I got it right this time. Thanks in advance!


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

SS777 said:


> Btw, can you please point me to other topic/discussion in the forum about turning a road bike into ss? Hopefully, I got it right this time. Thanks in advance!


roadbikereview.com


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

SS777 said:


> Nah, won't do Boone's measurements. Already got my wheels with HG hubs (both cost me 50 USD less than Boone cogs, not counting the import tax- actually I didn't have the courage to do so ).
> 
> Btw, can you please point me to other topic/discussion in the forum about turning a road bike into ss? Hopefully, I got it right this time. Thanks in advance!


Doesn't differ all that much other than likely will require a tensioner to be in the system. Sliders are not common on road frames.


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Redlands R&C said:


> roadbikereview.com



Thank you, buddy! Didn't see something useful though  . Already ordered a surly chain tensioner and some cogs and spacers from reverse components (they confirmed me that I can use their spacers on a road bike without problem). Also a grx 600 1x crankset (40t, couldn't find with 42t, still 50-55 USD cheaper than sram rival) to replace the ultegra crankset. Also a 18mm cone wrench which is needed to install the surly tensioner.

On the original topic, I managed to find a lathe worker/turner in a neighboring village of mine. I phoned him and he agreed to see the wheel with the microspline hub and Boone cog when he's back from vacation. Hopefully he can fabricate some spacers. If this is the case, I will instantly order that luscious Boone lockring.


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## AdamR83 (Jan 21, 2021)

socal_jack said:


> So these guys are making an MS SS cog, but only 2mm thick
> 
> Stainless steel singlespeed cogs (to fit 3/32" and 5/64" chains) - Shimano Micro Spline compatible


They now also offer a 1/8" version, but of course that will only fit a 1/8" chain unless you get handy with some machinery: BIKEPUNX 22t single speed cog Shimano Micro Spline 1/8" 304 stainless UK made | eBay


I used a 12 speed Shimano sprocket as a 'piggyback' for a dedicated singlespeed sprocket for a couple of rides recently, and even though it only has a 1.5mm base, didn't dig into an aluminium freehub body. I guess that is something to do with MS having 22 splines rather than the usual 9, so the effective base width is somewhere around 4mm going from the sort of splined interfaces we are used to.

Anyway, I bought one of those cogs off eBay last week and fitted it yesterday. It's a decent quality item, though clearly laser cut and brushed to finish, so not quite as nice as a fully machined item. It offers a nice fit between the chain and teeth, very deep and square teeth, and the fit to the freehub body is good - slightly better than the OE Shimano sprockets actually!

The 22T 1/8" sprocket is very chunky at 97g, but I am using a 9 speed chain and wanted as wide as base as possible, so chucked it in the lathe to remove some weight and get it to fit.

Spacers... well this was quite a head f*ck. Ended up using an internal headset cup, an external BB cup, a freewheel spacer, a bashring spacer and a 1 1/8" headset top cover to get it all to work. It's come out pretty neat but it did take a good hour of playing around with all the spacers at my disposal and a lathe!

First ride on the sprocket last night and it was as you'd expect, no weirdness, popping, skipping, noises, etc. With hindsight, knowing that a 1.5mm base worked ok, I'd just get the 2mm one in future and not bother doing all the machining work.

I do think if someone can come up with a spacer kit that will really help... 3D printed could be the way to go, you can get a nicer finish on certain materials by giving the 'finished' product a quick dip in acetone, for example. Chainline - within a couple of mm is fine, so a kit with two big spacers and, say, two 3mm spacers would be good enough.


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## AdamR83 (Jan 21, 2021)

Pics separate, and in a stupid order, because the way the image uploader works on Android hurts my head...














































No digging in even with a 22T cog with a 1.5mm base.


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## SS777 (6 mo ago)

Willing to sell those for half price, unused (I had enough with geared hubs), otherwise I'll use them for a rap video


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## RideOften (3 mo ago)

Why not just get a problem solvers zinger? So much faffing around on here, I don't understand. Zinger Single-Speed Conversion Kit for Micro Spline™ | Drivetrain | Problem Solvers


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

RideOften said:


> Why not just get a problem solvers zinger? So much faffing around on here, I don't understand. Zinger Single-Speed Conversion Kit for Micro Spline™ | Drivetrain | Problem Solvers


Because that didn't exist yet.


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## RideOften (3 mo ago)

Redlands R&C said:


> Because that didn't exist yet.


Well I guess I was referring to the last 20+ posts that happened after the PS zingers birth.


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## RideOften (3 mo ago)

Redlands R&C said:


> Because that didn't exist yet.


Also not a single reference to it on this thread.


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## Redlands R&C (Dec 14, 2013)

RideOften said:


> Well I guess I was referring to the last 20+ posts that happened after the PS zingers birth.


beats me.
I'm still incredibly happy with my #1 Boone Microspline Singlespeed cog. Even if I had to faff a bit to install it. Love it.


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