# XTR Spiderless Chain rings...Any Interest? (M950)



## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

I've been using Spot Brand Spiderless rings for years and finally wore them out. Somehow I got lucky and got one from HomeBrew about 2 years ago.

It's worn out now and I can't find a new ring any where so I'm having some made.

I run a 35T and so that's what I'm having made but I also plan on having a run of 32T and 34T.

They will be very simple. Aluminum, Black, Good.

Checking to see what the interest will be before having a bunch made.

Thanks.


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

Let me know how much. I'd be interested in 32t.


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

Sounds good. I'm meeting with the Fabricator either tomorrow or Thursday. I'll have more of an idea of the pricing. It shouldn't be too bad. I'm not trying to make money I just NEED a chainring and I figure if I'm going to go through this hassle I might as well stoke a few more people.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

Cool, I'm in - any or all of 32/33/34t. Let me know if you need help with anything, I sketched one up a while ago, but couldn't find a local fabricator that would do it in a higher quality (7075) aluminum.


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

*ChainRing*



cdn-dave said:


> Cool, I'm in - any or all of 32/33/34t. Let me know if you need help with anything, I sketched one up a while ago, but couldn't find a local fabricator that would do it in a higher quality (7075) aluminum.


Hey, Are you the David that sent me the file? If so, the fabricator said it was helpful. I should be meeting with them today. I'll keep you posted.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

Yep, didn't realize that was you! Sweet, looking forward to how everything works out for ya!

cheers,
dave


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## wyatt79m (Mar 3, 2007)

I'd be interested in a 28 and or 30...


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## MTB Pharm (Mar 10, 2007)

I'd be interested in 32. What design are you thinking about using?


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## adinpapa (Dec 4, 2007)

I'd take a 32t


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## bkirby10 (Feb 23, 2012)

Um, yeah, very interested! 31t or 32t for me. Colored or not. I'm not picky at this point...


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

*Design*



MTB Pharm said:


> I'd be interested in 32. What design are you thinking about using?


As far as design goes, All I want it to do is mate up nice and snug to my crank Arm spline. There is a guy by the name of David who sent me a file of a chainring that he worked on. I submitted this to my fabricator. I also gave them my Old Spot Brand ChainRings and they have my worn out HomeBrew Ring.

The Teeth will hopefully be shaped much like the Chris King Cogs and as far as the Cut Outs along the face, well, Whatever is cheap and easy. Definatley no Hearts or goofy shapes. My Fabricator does have an Anodizer that he uses but I think I will only go that route if the original metal color just looks awful. It's going to cost me enough as it is.


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

If it works out looks like I'll have 32T and 34T available. If for some reason it's totally easy to make a 28T or 30T off of the same program I'll let you know.


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## wyatt79m (Mar 3, 2007)

I could live with a 30...


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

yeah, hopefully you can do as low as 30t


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

burmapeak said:


> There is a guy by the name of David who sent me a file of a chainring that he worked on.


Well you're definitely further ahead than I ever got:

http://forums.mtbr.com/singlespeed/spiderless-chainring-open-source-824306.html

Here's the last drawing I made to give the rest an idea:








I'm in for sure!


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## workingcat2 (Sep 29, 2008)

Nice! I have a barely used spot 34t if anyone is interested. Looking for trade... need SS specific 104bcd rings 33-38 pm me if interested.


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## fastfish666 (Aug 24, 2007)

hi -- Id probably go for a 32 depending on price and if you can send to France? Also how about making it so that you can run it as a spider when the teeth wear out -- if using 5-arm design like the pic above, put in 5 holes for 94mm BCD (or maybe 74mm BCD). Or if 4-arm type design, then 104mm BCD?
Bicycle Chainrings (Chainwheels) from Harris Cyclery
Just an idea,
pat


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

*XTR ChainRing Update June 26th*

Hi Guys.

Got a quote yesterday via email from the company that I approached to make the Chainrings.

Pretty much double of what I was expecting.

Here's a sample of the estimate:

_7075 SPROCKET 5 @ $129.93 = $649.65​__7075 SPROCKET 10 @ $87.93 = $879.30
__7075 SPROCKET 15 @ $73.93 = $1,108.95
__7075 SPROCKET 20 @ $66.93 = $1,338.60
__7075 SPROCKET 25 @ $62.73 = $1,568.25
__7075 SPROCKET 30 @ $59.93 = $1,797.90_​_PARTS ARE RAW ALUMINUM NO ANODIZE $0.00

_So it looks like they want me to order a minimum of 5. I am going to meet with them today to see if the Min. 5 all need to be the same Tooth size. I'm also going to see what I can do to drop that $129.93 down to like $40.

Sure wish this was easier. All I want is a new Chainring.


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## arcdesigns (Jul 24, 2007)

If it was easy Boone and Homebrew would still be doing it!


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

Yeah. I read Homebrews FaceBook site lastnight and I feel really bad for the guy. Sounds like he's been having some health issues and that's terrible. The guy makes a REALLY Great product. It's amazing just how SLAMMED he is with orders. The pictures of his "Work Load" on the FB site were unreal. As far as Boone goes. I called him and spoke to him about getting a Chainring for the XTR Crank and his response was very vague. Almost as if he didn't quite know what I was talking about. Infact he re-directed me to a different supplier (forgot the name) who also did not produce a product for the M950. On a lighter note, I sent an email to Experimental Prototype lastnight and asked Mattias for Availability of a Chainring so we'll see what happens.
Best thing would be if HomeBrew gets Healthy and finds a way to get his business up and running. His products are so nice. Oh, I guess Mafi also tried it but it didn't pan out: MaFi Components Singlespeed Chainrings by MaFi Components ? Kickstarter


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

Is that machined i.e. thick in the centre thinner at the teeth, or just laser/water cut?

I had one ordered from Mattias too, but it apparently got lost in the mail and he refunded me. Considering the amount I was willing to pay for a 2mm thick cut ti ring, yours isn't too far off, especially since it sounds like your fabricator put some work into the design.

I totally missed the boat on the that Kickstarter campaign - definitely would've supported that project.


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

I just sent you an email.

How much was a Ti chainring from Mattias?


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

burmapeak said:


> How much was a Ti chainring from Mattias?


shimano spiderless, 34t, ti: 85€ plus shipping

Last I heard he said he wasn't making any more, due to difficulties with the supplier that does his cutting... If you can convince him, ask him to make an extra for me too


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

Sounds good. That's about $110 U.S. right? I'd totally pay that for a Ti ring.

I'll let you know as soon as I hear from him. Maybe if he gets enough request he'll run a small batch.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

The best quote I got was 154.70€ for two chainrings just laser cut out of a 1.8m x 1.0m sheet of 2.5mm 7075.

I'd be able to keep the leftover material, so I'm sure to just cut as many rings as possible out of the entire sheet would drastically reduce the price/ring.

Luck of the draw how good it fits - I could end up with 50 rings that are too tight (could file it down) or worse, too loose... I decided not to pursue, since I don't like the idea of so much (potential) scrap lying around.

Food for thought - for 36€ / ring, I could actually get some prototypes cut out of 3mm AlMg3, fine tune it, then go ahead with the better material.

Sigh, all I want is a ring too!


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## Warhawk (Jun 9, 2005)

Hey Guys, we decided to go ahead and start accepting pre-orders for our shimano spiderless chainrings for the M950 crankset. We have already had this chainring done and being tested for a long time we just haven't been able to get to production with all the other orders we have coming in for our custom chainrings. Early next week I'll have a few hours open on the laser to cut these out and mill the teeth. They will be available in Stainless Steel, Titanium and the Aluminum ones can be anodized black, red, blue, brown, gold, purple, green, orange, grey or pink. They can be pre-ordered online in which payment is only authorized online and you will only be charged when the product ships. If you have any questions just let me know, Thanks - Colin


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

:thumbsup:

Great news, I'm in - just gotta decide what colour!


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

anyone ordered yet?


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

fishcreek said:


> anyone ordered yet?


I've got my order in for a 32t and a 33t - aluminum and silver, nothing fancy :thumbsup:


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

I ordered a 35T Aluminum in Black and a 35T Ti. Seems a bit strange that I didn't get any sort of a order confirmation. Maybe I need to give them a call today.

***just checked my Order History on Warhawks site and it says PROCESSED.***

Can't wait, I flipped my HBC a while back and it's almost time to hanger' up.


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## LucasARG (Dec 29, 2010)

any news on Warhawk rings arriving?


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

No. I have not recieved the chainrings. All I know is that my Account shows "Processed". I assume that means the order has been taken and that they are working on the rings.

I checked again last Friday night if the Account said anything new like: Shipped etc. but all I saw was that they now offer a better price for buying multiple rings. I sent them an email asking if my order had shipped yet because if not I'd like to tack on some more rings but I haven't heard back yet. It's still early. I can't expect them to deal with Business emails over the weekend. Hopefully everything will work out. It just makes you feel kinda funny when you don't get any feedback.


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## arcdesigns (Jul 24, 2007)

Warhawk said:


> Hey Guys, we decided to go ahead and start accepting pre-orders for our shimano spiderless chainrings for the M950 crankset. We have already had this chainring done and being tested for a long time we just haven't been able to get to production with all the other orders we have coming in for our custom chainrings. Early next week I'll have a few hours open on the laser to cut these out and mill the teeth. They will be available in Stainless Steel, Titanium and the Aluminum ones can be anodized black, red, blue, brown, gold, purple, green, orange, grey or pink. They can be pre-ordered online in which payment is only authorized online and you will only be charged when the product ships. If you have any questions just let me know, Thanks - Colin
> 
> View attachment 811711


Just as a heads up to Warhawk,

There are lots of us on this forum that have been left in the dest by chainring makers that stopped answering eMails. First with Boone and then with Homebrew (although I am glad to see Homebrew has shipped a lot of backlogged orders) so keep your started threads updated and keep those that order well informed 

Thanks


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## Warhawk (Jun 9, 2005)

@burmapeak, I did get your email and responded within a few hours. We're aware that our server has not been sending out emails and they have been bouncing back, most likely we're just going to use our alternate gmail address instead. Also I'm in the process of getting a helpdesk system on the website where customers can submit tickets as this will help us to try and prioritize. I have everyone's orders for the splined chainrings cut except 2 because those orders just recently came in over the weekend. I expect to have all these shipped out within the next 2-3 days with the exception if you got it anodized it may not be until the end of the week. Burmapeak I'll most likely mail your Ti ring and then the black ring a few days after.

@ arcdesigns, Thanks for the tip, I'll keep you guys updated the best I can through our website and the new helpdesk system. I understand all the problems you guys have been through waiting and not knowing what's going on with other manufacturers. Unfortunately we are faced with the same delivery problems taking forever to get orders shipped, mainly because we offer so many BCD's, tooth sizes, materials, colors, splines ect...that we receive alot of orders that are rarely the same so the logistics of trying to keep everything organized can get out of control.

Thanks - Colin


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

anyone got their orders yet?


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## Warhawk (Jun 9, 2005)

*on the way*



fishcreek said:


> anyone got their orders yet?


I've shipped about half the orders so far and was able to finish up the remaining this weekend but wasn't able to get them in the mail today so look for an email from the USPS with the tracking information Monday evening. Burma's Ti ring has been sent this weekend and I'm waiting on 2-3 rings to be anodized. Keep us up to date as you receive them because as expected we're finding inconsistencies in the tolerances and spacing of the shimano cranks even though they are the same models they have slight variances. Every spiderless ring is tested for a proper fit on a M950/952 crankset before sending, Thanks - Colin


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

i can see a potential problem with that stainless steel chainring. if the base of that chainring is not wide enough, the lockring won't hold it in place. the chainring base should be wider than the crank arm interface so it won't wobble.


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## burmapeak (May 24, 2013)

Not yet. I spoke to colin at the beginning of last week and he said the Ti was done and ready to go but the Black Anodized was still at the anodizer. I was a bit worried when I heard of the UPS plane crashing but it sounds like he's using USPS. Hope it arrives soon and I also hope it fits. When I spoke to him he made it sound like the fit might not be good but to contact him asap if I have any concerns. Fingers crossed.


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## Warhawk (Jun 9, 2005)

fishcreek said:


> i can see a potential problem with that stainless steel chainring. if the base of that chainring is not wide enough, the lockring won't hold it in place. the chainring base should be wider than the crank arm interface so it won't wobble.


We are sending 3-4 custom washers with the spiderless rings to account for the variances in the thickness or height of the shimano spline. The ones I have here at the shop are .12" while others have been .10", .09" so the custom washers take care of the problem if their is a gap. All the spiderless rings we made in the first batch were .125" thick. We're going to try the next batch with the standard .09" chainring thickness as I think they will fit better - Colin


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

fishcreek said:


> i can see a potential problem with that stainless steel chainring. if the base of that chainring is not wide enough, the lockring won't hold it in place. the chainring base should be wider than the crank arm interface so it won't wobble.


I mentioned that in my order as well (my M569 & M570 have ~0.2" splines), and Colin confirmed he'd include some spacers (thanks!)

Colin, did my order (2591) make it out? Haven't received any response to email nor via your website.

Ordered June 28.


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

i see, scary. so its pretty much like running a cog from a cassette on an aluminum body, thin base and high torque is a recipe for something..

then again, i can be wrong.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

Hmmm, good point, never thought of that =/

At this point I'm just glad Warhawk is offering a Shimano compatible chainring. I ordered aluminum, so perhaps it's a gamble which side wears out first (?).

I'm still pretty interested in what Absolute comes up with though!!


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

I just got an email from Absoluteblack that they'd have spiderless rings for the m950/952 cranks in about 6 weeks.... their other stuff is beautiful, so I hope they materialize.


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

Awesome news. Thanks! I hope they proceed with it too. And hoping for a matching cog.


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

Since the existing spider on my m952 cranks is effectively worthless, I'm considering cutting down the integrated 44t ring into a bash guard, and ovalazing the holes to fit a standard 32t ring. With 4 holes the ring should stay centered, if it wants to slip outward at the 9 o'clock position, the bolts at 12 and 6 wouldn't have any sideways space to move, no?

My middle ring is so worn I can't shift without horrific chain-suck, so I've been effectively running 1x9 for a while. Time to make it official. Any reason I shouldn't re-drill the holes in the spider? The cranks were the right price, free.


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

I found a 5x110 spider and 32t ring at the local used parts/bikes shop, and made an even trade 

Now I'm sporting a 1x9 setup, I'm not in as much rush to find a good splined ring and can wait for the Absouluteblack rings. 

2/3 of the way to SS (not sure I want to make that jump...)


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## kaiser2 (Jul 27, 2008)

Sorry, just subscribing to the thread.


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

cdn-dave said:


> Ordered June 28.


Did you get your order yet? How was it?


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

fishcreek said:


> Did you get your order yet? How was it?


Yep, just picked it up today from customs (there went another 20€...) and all in all I'm happy with what I got. :thumbsup:









32t came in at 52g, 33t at 61g.









Here's the after picture of the installation. (The blue chain seemed like a good idea at the time, but I'm cheap so I'll live with it until it wears out.)









I used one of the thin spacers Colin included, then filed the ID of an aluminum cog spacer to take up the rest of gap between the extra spline length and the lockring (the thin ones just slide around when tightening). The fit is a tad loose, so I made sure to lock it down good and tight.

Sorry, no ride report - been raining for the last week or so, hopefully it lets up soon!

Oh yah, here's the before setup, you can see why I was itching to go spiderless!


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## LucasARG (Dec 29, 2010)

I just order this one from a local manufacturer


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## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

that's beautiful.


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

details on that ring?


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## LucasARG (Dec 29, 2010)

I asked an argentinian CNC factory to build me a ring for my m950, they said OK. I'm still waiting for the finished product, it will be build with aluminium 7005 T6 and it's 6mm wide, black anodized. Check www.facebook.com/FuegoFabrica, I'm only a costumer, I let you know how it's goes


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

I'm interested


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## LucasARG (Dec 29, 2010)

It's getting closer








still work in progress


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## LucasARG (Dec 29, 2010)

Done!


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

nice! 

availability?


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## kaiser2 (Jul 27, 2008)

Very nice!


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## pimpbot (Dec 31, 2003)

So, that Warhawk ring... It looks totally flat. Does it have problems clearing the chainstay? I'm using a 112mm XTR Bottom Bracket, and my current HBC ring (which is offset) doesn't give a ton of clearance. Same story with my old Jericho SufferRing, 34t. I can't see how it would clear without the offset. 

Is this a problem? I mean, I guess somebody must have noticed by now if it was a problem. 

I'm happy with my HBC ring for now, but I probably have 500 miles on it so far, much of it in bad weather. It won't last forever. Finding 180mm cranks that go spiderless is a chore, I tell ya. The only current cranks I've seen are the SRAM X9s. It would be nice not to have to change out my crankset and BB just because the ring wore out.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

I've got a 110mm bb, and have a ton of clearance with the flat Warhawk ring. The most offset I could handle is 3mm at with the rear hub or 5mm to my chainstay. Add 1mm if I were to use your bb width.

That being said, I'm still waiting for a stainless steel replacement for the aluminum ring I first bought, due to early wear. Here's what it looks like after 40km:


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## pimpbot (Dec 31, 2003)

Is that a KMC chain? I'll be there's your problem. Those things come from the factory past the wear limit for stretch. Yeah, I heard about that recently so I checked my own near new chain. Whatddya know... less than 50 miles and it's past the 1.0mm wear limit. Too bad, because they do seem to last pretty good otherwise, look good, and they're cheap to boot.

*edited because I got the mfg wrong... KMC, not KCMC.


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## cdn-dave (Jan 6, 2007)

pimpbot said:


> Is that a KCMC chain? I'll be there's your problem. Those things come from the factory past the wear limit for stretch. Yeah, I heard about that recently so I checked my own near new chain. Whatddya know... less than 50 miles and it's past the 1.0mm wear limit. Too bad, because they do seem to last pretty good otherwise, look good, and they're cheap to boot.


Mine's alright. I had a SRAM that was at 1.0% so put on the new KMC along with the chainring. Nice and tight, still can't even force the same gauge (Spin Doctor) through between the pins.


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## pimpbot (Dec 31, 2003)

cdn-dave said:


> Mine's alright. I had a SRAM that was at 1.0% so put on the new KMC along with the chainring. Nice and tight, still can't even force the same gauge (Spin Doctor) through between the pins.


Good.

I've been using KMC chains for the past couple of years, but never bothered to check when they were new... until recently. Dang. I like their chains, and they're easy to find a the LBS for a good price. It kinda makes me want to check them before I leave the store, now. Maybe it was just a bad batch.


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

just checked my new KMC x10SL (2 rides on it) and it's fine, hopefully that was a bad batch. Good to idea about checking new chains, no matter the brand.

That photo looks more like deformation than wear.


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