# Hightower LT for tall guys? How is it?



## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

Hi guys, hoping you can pass along a bit of wisdom to not-an-expert. I'm 6-4, 34in inseam and 190lbs. I'm guessing most bikes are a bit small for me judging by the geos out there. But, the Hightower LT comes in with the XXL which I'm guessing is about right for a guy my size (let me know if that's not ideal). I newer to the bike buying side and looking to replace an older 26in. I'd like a do-it-all bike tho, mostly I do a lot of climbing with flow downhill with a few drops in there and gardens. Some days we ride the rocky/chunky stuff but it's not in my backyard. The Hightower LT seems to be a sweet setup as its as efficient as less travel bike but can take the heat if I do an uplift/rough day. I'm still learning and probably won't be hitting hit hard and fast for now which makes a bit apprehensive with some of the bigger travel bikes. I'm wondering if the Hightower suspension is harsh when not charging hard? Is the bike still playful too or a dead fish? FWIW I've heard that you can swap the DPX2 shock on the hightower lt for a straight X2 and get much better performance, especially within the early portion of the shock...which is where I've read that HT LT is a little rough. Curious as to others experiences here. 

Any other super good bike options that seem to be consensus favorites? I'd really like a Yeti SB5.5 I think but they don't make an XXL, its not a super big XL and I've heard their support is vastly inferior to Santa Cruz. Thanks


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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

svinyard said:


> Hi guys, hoping you can pass along a bit of wisdom to not-an-expert. I'm 6-4, 34in inseam and 190lbs. I'm guessing most bikes are a bit small for me judging by the geos out there. But, the Hightower LT comes in with the XXL which I'm guessing is about right for a guy my size (let me know if that's not ideal). I newer to the bike buying side and looking to replace an older 26in. I'd like a do-it-all bike tho, mostly I do a lot of climbing with flow downhill with a few drops in there and gardens. Some days we ride the rocky/chunky stuff but it's not in my backyard. The Hightower LT seems to be a sweet setup as its as efficient as less travel bike but can take the heat if I do an uplift/rough day. I'm still learning and probably won't be hitting hit hard and fast for now which makes a bit apprehensive with some of the bigger travel bikes. I'm wondering if the Hightower suspension is harsh when not charging hard? Is the bike still playful too or a dead fish? FWIW I've heard that you can swap the DPX2 shock on the hightower lt for a straight X2 and get much better performance, especially within the early portion of the shock...which is where I've read that HT LT is a little rough. Curious as to others experiences here.
> 
> Any other super good bike options that seem to be consensus favorites? I'd really like a Yeti SB5.5 I think but they don't make an XXL, its not a super big XL and I've heard their support is vastly inferior to Santa Cruz. Thanks


Our LBS owner is a pretty tall guy and is riding the HTLT as his ride of choice this year. He's on an XL though. I just started watching the YouTube channel of Ben Cathro. He races enduros in the UK and he's a very tall rider like yourself. He just did a video on his new HTLT that's an XXL and he's loving it. Cool videos and an excellent rider!

Sent from my LG-LS777 using Tapatalk


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

svinyard said:


> I'm 6-4, 34in inseam and 190lbs. I'm guessing most bikes are a bit small for me judging by the geos out there.


What XL bikes have you tried recently that felt too small?

I don't get to try out many bikes so I'm genuinely curious, most companies list their XL bikes as being recommended for at least 6'4" and many up to 6'6", however I regularly see posts from people well within those ranges saying they need an XXL bike. I get that people have different proportions and preferences but I'd think they'd be in the minority and most riders within the recommended range would feel comfortable on an XL bike. Are manufactures that far off on sizing recommendations?


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

jeremy3220 said:


> What XL bikes have you tried recently that felt too small?
> 
> I don't get to try out many bikes so I'm genuinely curious, most companies list their XL bikes as being recommended for at least 6'4" and many up to 6'6", however I regularly see posts from people well within those ranges saying they need an XXL bike. I get that people have different proportions and preferences but I'd think they'd be in the minority and most riders within the recommended range would feel comfortable on an XL bike. Are manufactures that far off on sizing recommendations?


I'm in the same boat to be honest. I haven't ridden a bunch of XL bikes, only a few and they weren't modern. I have read a fair amount that there are companies like Santa Cruz where many/most of their bikes are sized rather small. When you look at the reach/stack etc for those XL bikes...they are really close to what other manufs are doing as well. I could be off on this and I'm DEFINITELY not the expert. FWIW I'd guess that a lot of tall guys haven't ever been on a bike that truly fits them hence their positive perspectives of an XL may very well be skewed as well. I'm just trying to come up to speed as its tough to buy a bike as there aren't exactly a lot of XXL bikes available to even demo...many times even the XL's as well (I saw the Yeti sales guy talking about how they nearly lose money on even having that size).


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## IceBuerg (Apr 7, 2015)

FWIW, I'm 6'3" with a 34" inseam and I ended up buying a XXL HT LT after demoing both an XL and a XXL. The XL would have worked but I felt a little too over the bars when in the standing attack position, even on flat ground. 99% of the time the XXL's reach feels perfect for me, even at 6'3", with the only trade off being that I feel slightly stretched out when spinning in the saddle. That trade off was totally worth it and I can always go with a 35mm stem if I feel the need in the future. 

Also FWIW, all the Santa Cruz factory demo employees I spoke with said I should go with the XXL, and there's a big tall clydesdale dude who works there who owns a XXL, himself. 

Good luck!


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

I'm 6'4.5" which puts me outside the recommended range of a few XL bikes like the Trance but well under the 6'6" recommended range of the Bronson. Yet the Bronson is only 5mm longer than the Trance and has a lower stack... something doesn't add up. Those two along with the Hightower LT are on my list of potentials but I'm hoping to try them before buying.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

XXL is the way to go at 6'4" and up. I highly recommend a 44 or less offset fork. This will help keep weight on the front end and allow you to run a high stack height.


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

MadPainterGrafx said:


> Our LBS owner is a pretty tall guy and is riding the HTLT as his ride of choice this year. He's on an XL though. I just started watching the YouTube channel of Ben Cathro. He races enduros in the UK and he's a very tall rider like yourself. He just did a video on his new HTLT that's an XXL and he's loving it. Cool videos and an excellent rider!
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS777 using Tapatalk


His channel is so cool I like it.

Cahtro is 6'7" and had one complaint on his HT build about the slack seat tube angle. 





I'm 6'6" or 6'7".. with 36.5-37" ish inseam, and 6'8" wingspan.

I have not demo'd or been on many bikes and I also am by far no expert.

I own a Guerrilla Gravity Pedalhead XL and liked it so much I have a smash on the way.

Look into GG Bikes...take some measurements and email or call them. I love mine and they are super awesome to deal with. Seriously those guys are rad, they emailed me pictures after my bike was done with powdercoat, and reply to every email or phone call very fast.

I have tried a couple bikes recently that said they were for 6'4+ riders...and they were not even close to fitting me at all. ( Evil, Specialized was better but still was small )


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

jeremy3220 said:


> Are manufactures that far off on sizing recommendations?


Most of them seem to be. At least for me. And at my height im not inbetween sizes.. either the biggest size they makes is way too small by a lot. or its not.


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## sturge (Feb 22, 2009)

I'm 6'4" / 220lbs / 36" inseam. Existing bike is 26" SC Heckler (XL). I initially had issues with seat rails & seat post hardware failures due to sliding seat back in rail to get more cockpit room. Eventually bought Thompson 'setback' seatpost which allowed me to get the room I needed while keeping seat rails in 'sweetspot' of post clamp. Have ridden the hell out of this bike since...very fun and very reliable. Ride year round in New England singletrack so it's been put through it's paces in all conditions. I never felt the need for a 'bigger' frame.

Just bought a 2018 Kona Process 153 AL/DL (27.5", XL frame). Was looking into SC Bronson and a couple of others but got a steal on this and pulled the trigger ($2300!). It showed up about Xmas time. I assembled and first impression was WOW...this is a BIG bike and built like a tank. Looks to be very well built and should hold up to a clyde pounding it through boney terrain. I can't close tailgate of my truck without kitty-cornering bike in truck bed. I've only had 2 COLD rides (<25 degF and 3" of snow on trails) before 12" snow dump hit us yesterday. Not ideal conditions but enough to confirm this thing is going to be awesome for my riding. The long/slack geo is way different than the 
Heckler but it provides more cockpit room and for a big bike it climbs very well. Puts power to the rear wheel effectively - on snowy single track 'granny' gear climbs I was able to control wheelspin (tubeless at 20psi). Kona claims the 2018 'Gen 2' Process is a better climber than the Gen 1 version (I never rode previous version). Coming from 3X9 I love the 1X12 Eagle drivetrain! 

Another thing...I've never used a dropper because of the setback Thompson on my Heckler. After 2 rides, having Reverb 170mm is great. On downhills and technical sections it's out of the way and very roomy. On a flatter grind or climb, it's instantly extended giving my full leg extension for most efficient power.

I'm sure XXL would be OK but for the tight, technical trails I ride, I prefer XL for a bit more maneuverability. Having the dropper makes it a no brainer.


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## Crockpot2001 (Nov 2, 2004)

I LOVE SC bikes. I've had 4. However, until they start increasing the stack heights I will be staying away. Long and low is cool and all but having 2" of spacers and 3" riser bars is silly. I have ~35-ish inseam and that results in being in a more head down position until I drop the saddle with the dropper.


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## manpurse (Feb 6, 2011)

I'm also 6'4" with 34 inseam and emailed Santa Cruz about the HT and they suggested the XXL size, which I assumed they would. I'm on an XL Intense Spider now, the stack height is a little on the low side but it has a nice reach length.


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

sturge said:


> I'm sure XXL would be OK but for the tight, technical trails I ride, I prefer XL for a bit more maneuverability. Having the dropper makes it a no brainer.


The sizing on the HTLT is a bit different. The XL HTLT has a shorter reach and has a shorter height recommendation compared to their other XL bikes like the Bronson. The Process 153 is very big for an XL, the reach and stack numbers are larger than the XXL HTLT.


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## Ray Lee (Aug 17, 2007)

jeremy3220 said:


> The sizing on the HTLT is a bit different. The XL HTLT has a shorter reach and has a shorter height recommendation compared to their other XL bikes like the Bronson. The Process 153 is very big for an XL, the reach and stack numbers are larger than the XXL HTLT.


Had a chance to ride the Process 153 27.5 but the bars were way to low.... 4 inches lower than the seat hight at least (Im 6'3) had to look it up when I got home and found the Konas stack hight on the XL is a hair lower than the Hightower LTs SMALL. The body position was very similar to my road bike.


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

Ray Lee said:


> Had a chance to ride the Process 153 27.5 but the bars were way to low.... 4 inches lower than the seat hight at least (Im 6'3) had to look it up when I got home and found the Konas stack hight on the XL is a hair lower than the Hightower LTs SMALL. The body position was very similar to my road bike.


I was looking at the wrong numbers I guess. I'm seeing stack on the Kona Process 153 AL/DL 27.5 XL is 24.6" which is taller than most XL 27.5 bikes. The HTLT stack is 25.43" for the XXL and 23.98" for the Small.


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## Ray Lee (Aug 17, 2007)

jeremy3220 said:


> I was looking at the wrong numbers I guess. I'm seeing stack on the Kona Process 153 AL/DL 27.5 XL is 24.6" which is taller than most XL 27.5 bikes. The HTLT stack is 25.43" for the XXL and 23.98" for the Small.


Sorry, the one I rode was an older model (SE or something) this is it. the newer ones and especially the 29 have taller stack heights. 
KONA BIKES | MTB | PROCESS | Process 153


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## Obscured (Oct 8, 2004)

I am 6'4 with a 34 also.

I demoed a XL Hightower LT and a XXL Hightower also rode an XL Nomad v4 the same day, for comparison I ride a XL 29er Stumpjumper and a XL Demo 8.

The XL hightower TL felt fine about the same fit as my Stump then I tried the XXL Hightower it seemed massive with a very long top tube after a few laps in the bike park I 
was starting to get used to it and it ripped. I ordered an LT in XXL will have it next week! 

What I want to try next is a V10 in XXL I am very close to pulling the trigger on one, but they did not have the V10 at the demo day


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

Obscured said:


> I am 6'4 with a 34 also.
> 
> I demoed a XL Hightower LT and a XXL Hightower also rode an XL Nomad v4 the same day, for comparison I ride a XL 29er Stumpjumper and a XL Demo 8.
> 
> ...


I demoed the HTLT in XXL for a bit (not a true demo)... the reach is a bit too far but only a bit... Problem is that man, it just felt like such a big bike. Definitely not as agile as some smaller bikes at all. I'll definitely be doing some real demos on it as it was nice... but geesh it just felt big and really tall. I can see how a 6-7 guy could rip it tho. Side note, it had the dps shock not the DPX2, bike was harsh on small bumps and stuff like that. I rode the HT, Yeti 5.5, Bronson and Camber. I just kept swapping bikes back and forth and doing 15min rips (not ideal demos, real demos coming soon for me) . In the short time with the bikes, Yeti really impressed me. The suspension is bad ass, even for a non-expert like me it was noticeable... but the fit is too small I think. Sucks.

Great learning experience even if not ideal. Now I have a general understanding that I probably will feel better in a bike with a 19in+ reach but not above 19.5 I think (ideally). Looking into the Switchblade or Mach 5.5 now. Switchblade is kind of a odd bike in certain ways.... None of the sex appeal of the Yeti but pretty neat bike with nice reach numbers.


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## Obscured (Oct 8, 2004)

I have put 4 solid days riding on my XXl HT XE built It came with DT swiss 370 hubs instead of the novatec hubs specced on the SC web site  and I changed the air shaft in the 36's to run them at 160mm

It is a big bike but it's not any slower on the tight stuff compared to my demo 8, I have rode it mostly on tight rooty steep enduro trails and it is awsome much better than I expected it to be on slow-med speed tech.

I did one day on my local DH trail (we use it for the national champs here) and it ripped I did not time myself but I felt faster on the LT than my Demo 8 and much much faster than my 29er Stumpy, it's a beast and likes to party when the speed picks up and the ground gets steep and rough, the 160mm fork is what the bike should have come with.

Size wise for my 6"4 frame it's a great fit and the most comfortable I have every owned to climb on.


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

svinyard said:


> I rode the HT, Yeti 5.5, Bronson and Camber.


How did the Bronson fit? The bike shop I talked to thought I would probably need something in XXL. I might get to throw a leg over a HTLT and Bronson soon hopefully.


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

jeremy3220 said:


> How did the Bronson fit? The bike shop I talked to thought I would probably need something in XXL. I might get to throw a leg over a HTLT and Bronson soon hopefully.


Yeah good question. Bronson felt better than HTLT XL (its got a bit more reach stock 468 vs 475 in bronson) but still on the shorter side and not super ideal for me.

I really want a bike that is still a lot of fun and can whip around a bit rather than a giant sled. That being said, THE SHIZZ so far has been a Pivot Switchblade or Mach 5.5 the reach is awesome at 485mm. That thing fit like a damn glove. I'm 6-4, 34inseam and a 6-3 wingspan. Pretty proportional with maybe a slightly longer torso but not much. That size definitely feels nice and natural (so far). In the saddle and out. Plus the seat angle isn't stupid slack like the HTLT which for many tall guys can be a deal breaker pedaling wise. I haven't had extended demos yet so take it for what its worth. Norco has a bit more reach as well, I think the sight/range is 480/483mm too. I'll be demoing those too.


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## fishrising (Mar 11, 2012)

I'll second the GG Smash in XL! I'm 6'7", 34" inseam 6'5'+ wingspan. Nothing necessarily wrong with the HTLT, it was my runner up. But I went with the Smash, and love it!!! It was a bold decision going with it as I have never even seen a GG in person before. But they have a 30 day satisfaction return policy.


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

Ben Cathros +/- on the LT hightower.






Watch till the end he really does seem to like it. I'm about his build and height and whatnot. I just didn't think that slack seat tube would do it for me.


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## climbanymtn (Mar 9, 2018)

Obscured said:


> I have put 4 solid days riding on my XXl HT XE built It came with DT swiss 370 hubs instead of the novatec hubs specced on the SC web site  and I changed the air shaft in the 36's to run them at 160mm
> 
> It is a big bike but it's not any slower on the tight stuff compared to my demo 8, I have rode it mostly on tight rooty steep enduro trails and it is awsome much better than I expected it to be on slow-med speed tech.
> 
> ...


This is very useful feedback as I am trying to make a buying decision on the XL vs XXL. If you don't mind, how do you have your cockpit set up as far as bar width, stem length, bar rise, and stem spacers with the 160 fork?

I am 6'4" as well with 38" cycling inseam and 80" wingspan (37" sleeves). I demoed the XXL at the Factory twice and it felt really big and slow to maneuver at times, but then again it was extremely stable at speed through rough stuff and I set PRs on several DH segments. Toward the end of my 4-hour demo I was starting to adapt to the "bigness" of the bike. I have not demoed the XL, but several 6'4" guys over in the Santa Cruz forum seem to prefer that size over the XXL.


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

I ended up getting the HTLT in XXL. I'm 6'4.5" with a 36" inseam. It felt big at first but being able to get into the proper riding position with a flat back and weight centered between the wheels is so much better than having to hunch over to keep my weight between the wheels. It's freed up my riding since I don't feel like I'm trying to contort my body to get into the right position in corners and descents. Maneuverability hasn't been an issue and I live in TN where the trails tend to be pretty tight. I guess I could see how the size could become an issue on some really tight super slow techy trails where you're averaging like 4 mph or less but I'd say that's more of a bike category issue than size. Anyway, I love the bike and don't have any desire for a smaller size.


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## ucsbwsr (May 12, 2004)

I am 6'8" w/ 7'2" wingspan 35" inseam and have an XXL HTLT.

I love it but the seatpost is too slack and I could use more reach (especially with the steeper seatpost). If they took the new Nomad and made an XXL that would be a pretty nice fit for what I am looking for. 

Out of the mainstream bike companies for a big guy I think it is hard to beat the XXL HTLT but the specs on that GG Smash look great and should be given some serious consideration. 

Evan


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## climbanymtn (Mar 9, 2018)

I am also 6'4" with a long inseam, so I am curious about the setup on your XXL. What bar width/rise, stem length/rise and how much stem spacers did you go with?

I am close to buying a HTLT XE build and trying to decide if I should order the XXL with an longer uncut steerer tube so I can have 40mm of spacers under the stem and whether I should swap out the 20mm rise Santa Cruz bars and 0 degree Race Face Aeffect R 50mm for more rise. I also plan to swap out the airshaft for a 160mm which bumps up the stack and reach a tiny bit. Buying the bike online through Competitive Cyclist.

UPDATE: This was intended in response to jeremy3220's post above on his XXL.


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

climbanymtn said:


> I am also 6'4" with a long inseam, so I am curious about the setup on your XXL. What bar width/rise, stem length/rise and how much stem spacers did you go with?
> 
> I am close to buying a HTLT XE build and trying to decide if I should order the XXL with an longer uncut steerer tube so I can have 40mm of spacers under the stem and whether I should swap out the 20mm rise Santa Cruz bars and 0 degree Race Face Aeffect R 50mm for more rise. I also plan to swap out the airshaft for a 160mm which bumps up the stack and reach a tiny bit. Buying the bike online through Competitive Cyclist.
> 
> UPDATE: This was intended in response to jeremy3220's post above on his XXL.


I'm running stock except I'm running a 800mm wide 20mm rise RaceFace bar. I don't remember how many spacers under the stem but I have one 5mm spacer on top of the stem. I feel like it'd be too hard to keep the front down on climbs with much more height.

The best thing to do is figure out what stack and bar height you need based on riding other bikes if you can't test the HTLT. Your dealer should be willing swap parts at a decent discount when you're spending that kind of money.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

jeremy3220 said:


> most companies list their XL bikes as being recommended for at least 6'4" and many up to 6'6", however I regularly see posts from people well within those ranges saying they need an XXL bike. I get that people have different proportions and preferences but I'd think they'd be in the minority and most riders within the recommended range would feel comfortable on an XL bike. Are manufactures that far off on sizing recommendations?


Yes they are. They want to sell bikes, so those charts are rubbish in the very big and very small size for the most part.

Think about it: If the 6 footers prefer bikes around 460-500mm in reach*, where does that put people who are taller?
10% taller people would conceivably need a 10% larger bike right? So that puts us at 506-550mm reach for someone 6'7".

Also read:

Size matters: why weâ€™re all riding bikes that are too small - MBR

*That number is just a rough guess, based on reading a lot of bike reviews and looking at size charts.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

climbanymtn said:


> I also plan to swap out the airshaft for a 160mm which bumps up the stack and reach a tiny bit..


Raising the fork will indeed increase the stack, but it will *decrease* the reach.


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