# Lightest FS frame able to handle 180mm fork



## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Hey everyone. I ride a wide range of trails and though I currently love my ride for the more gnarly spectrum of riding, I also use my sled for more XC duties as well. I might not be the norm in this because I love a long-travel for the full range of my riding which includes XC. My current bike is roughly 36 lbs and I'd like to hear some ideals on a lighter frame on which to put a Marz 66 in order to target the weight down to closer to 30 lbs. I'd like to put a 180mm travel on as light a frame as possible without messing up it's geometry. Any ideas for me? Most helpful would be frames under $2k.


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## Quarashi (Aug 23, 2006)

If you really really want to go light you should go fox 180 float over marz 66. It's over a pound lighter.


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

I think your super light 7" frame for under 2k is completely ridiculous. You arent building a capable freeride bike with a 66 and getting down to 30lbs. Your best bet is a carbon nomad but a new frame is way over 2k and you wont get it down to 30lbs with FR/DH parts and a 66.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Haha! You're totally right about the price of frame. When I wrote under 2k and posted it, I realized that was being a bit absurd. Too low a price for retail. Though, I do see now frames on sale for under 2k. It'd have to be a significant improvement in weight compared to what I ride now. 

Then let's say regardless of price, what would be my choices? Carbon is hot now and I realize there aren't many substantial discounts on them. 

Ya, the Marz 66 is HEAVY! But it's like butta on the trails and I've not had any other fork match its suppleness, hence I'd like to run it for all applications. Does the Float even come close to a newer Marz 66 in feel?


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## nightofthefleming (Jun 14, 2009)

nomadc or mojo hd or yeti asr7


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## Norcoshore1 (Apr 28, 2010)

Aust95 said:


> Haha! You're totally right about the price of frame. When I wrote under 2k and posted it, I realized that was being a bit absurd. Too low a price for retail. Though, I do see now frames on sale for under 2k. It'd have to be a significant improvement in weight compared to what I ride now.
> 
> Then let's say regardless of price, what would be my choices? Carbon is hot now and I realize there aren't many substantial discounts on them.
> 
> Ya, the Marz 66 is HEAVY! But it's like butta on the trails and I've not had any other fork match its suppleness, hence I'd like to run it for all applications. Does the Float even come close to a newer Marz 66 in feel?


well I am selling a 66 titanium


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

I'd like to imagine I could run 180mm fork on a frame like Yeti 575 or Tracer or 5 Spot or Rune. Something like that would be nice. I know it'd probably wreck the geometry. Carbon a bit pricey for me right now.


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## juanbeegas (Oct 1, 2007)

The Rune, built with a 7" fork and a zero stack lower headset cup, could be exactly what you're looking for. The frame is stupidly strong for its weight.


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## dwyooaj (Dec 14, 2006)

Of those 3 frames, only the Rune has warranty coverage for a 7" fork. Also the Runes geo would be the least wrecked of the 3. As far as frames that can run a 7" fork (and "can" meaning designed for it, e.g. warranty coverage) for under 2k the Rune is the lightest. Quite a few cracked runes, though (mine included). Burl it up a little, get a 7" frame (transition blindside? Banshee Scythe?) for the 7" fork, as long as you keep lightish wheels/parts xc is still fine.. Or up the $ and look at nomad, mojo hd, intense uzzi. Canfield one or scott genius lt would be ideal if money is no object.



Aust95 said:


> I'd like to imagine I could run 180mm fork on a frame like Yeti 575 or Tracer or 5 Spot or Rune. Something like that would be nice. I know it'd probably wreck the geometry. Carbon a bit pricey for me right now.


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## Gemini2k05 (Apr 19, 2005)

Uhhh, does it really matter? Just don't tell them that there was a 7 inch fork on it if you have to warranty it.


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## Iceman2058 (Mar 1, 2007)

Just sell everything and get an Enduro Evo, done. 32-33lbs stock, which is as light as you'd ever want to go for any kind of aggressive riding, and geo designed around the longer fork.


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## jakester29959 (Aug 30, 2011)

specialized demo 7 used frame u could prob get for 2k... i bought my whole bike for $2,200. good luck


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## freeriderB (Jan 9, 2004)

*enduro evo*



Iceman2058 said:


> Just sell everything and get an Enduro Evo, done. 32-33lbs stock, which is as light as you'd ever want to go for any kind of aggressive riding, and geo designed around the longer fork.


i was going to say this too. I saw the carbon version in person and it feels freakin' light.
Not sure what the stock travel up front is though.
It had that dual crown specialized fork.
I would swap it out for a single crown.


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## RBrady (Jan 20, 2009)

jakester29959 said:


> specialized demo 7 used frame u could prob get for 2k... i bought my whole bike for $2,200. good luck


30lbs? I seriously doubt that.:madman:


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

freeriderB said:


> i was going to say this too. I saw the carbon version in person and it feels freakin' light.
> Not sure what the stock travel up front is though.
> It had that dual crown specialized fork.
> I would swap it out for a single crown.


The last year they did the double crown was 2008. They run 160mm single crowns and 170mm on the evos...


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

Aust95 said:


> Hey everyone. I ride a wide range of trails and though I currently love my ride for the more gnarly spectrum of riding, I also use my sled for more XC duties as well. I might not be the norm in this because I love a long-travel for the full range of my riding which includes XC. My current bike is roughly 36 lbs and I'd like to hear some ideals on a lighter frame on which to put a Marz 66 in order to target the weight down to closer to 30 lbs. I'd like to put a 180mm travel on as light a frame as possible without messing up it's geometry. Any ideas for me? Most helpful would be frames under $2k.


What size steer tube do you have? And if its cut that could create a problem, further limiting choices. The Rune, as others mentioned, is one of the few light and cheap frames that is designed to pedal with a 7" fork. I would look further into it though because there have been many problems/ complaints from cracked frames to bearing problems ( I think banshee has recenly swapped to better ones). As i said before the carbon nomad is the closest frame to fitting you requirments and is lighter than the mojo hd. You might be able to pick one up used in your 2k budget. Good luck.


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## dwyooaj (Dec 14, 2006)

Its not really about getting a warranty, its about not having your head tube, and therefore your face, crack. If a bike is warrantied for up to a certain size fork, that means its engineered and designed for that size, and possibly no bigger; longer forks put more leverage on the head tube and if the head tube is not designed for the longer fork it may eventually crack. its probably a low risk, but not worth it as that can cause serious injury if it happens at the wrong time.. Also when a frame is designed for a ceratin size fork, a longer fork can sometimes screw up the geo and handling.



Gemini2k05 said:


> Uhhh, does it really matter? Just don't tell them that there was a 7 inch fork on it if you have to warranty it.


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## myarmisonfire (Mar 28, 2005)

Cheap, light, strong and lots of travel? Not to be a knob but you can't have your cake and eat it too. The Enduro Evo is a good idea though. Sell your current ride and take that cash and your $2k to buy on of those. I think they are pretty sorted out spec and geo wise. A few minor tweaks and you could get pretty close to your target weight.


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## davet (Jan 12, 2004)

Mojo HD, it's made for exactly what you've described.


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## Iceman2058 (Mar 1, 2007)

freeriderB said:


> i was going to say this too. I saw the carbon version in person and it feels freakin' light.
> Not sure what the stock travel up front is though.
> It had that dual crown specialized fork.
> I would swap it out for a single crown.


I meant the current model, in Evo version. It runs a Fox 36 180, dropped to 170mm (stock):










And jakester...c'mon dude, the Demo 7 is a great bike (in fact, it's probably really close to what OP currently has...i.e. a big sturdy FR rig that doesn't pedal too well and weighs a a bit too much), but it's NOT a good base for dropping weight and going on XC rides with. Apart from the weight, the geo is not suitable either - short seat tube, wrong angle, etc.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

jtnord said:


> What size steer tube do you have? And if its cut that could create a problem, further limiting choices. The Rune, as others mentioned, is one of the few light and cheap frames that is designed to pedal with a 7" fork. I would look further into it though because there have been many problems/ complaints from cracked frames to bearing problems ( I think banshee has recenly swapped to better ones). As i said before the carbon nomad is the closest frame to fitting you requirments and is lighter than the mojo hd. You might be able to pick one up used in your 2k budget. Good luck.


Steer tubes are 1 1/8. I am not about to sell my main ride and it is plenty burly for anything I need to do; the issue that I have with it is the weight during technical single track riding that includes steep and frequent ups over granite rocks that requires sudden blasts of strength and upper body movement to heave equipment upwards to clear obstacles. On long rides (2hrs or more), it is absolutely draining for me and I ride 5 days per week so it's not to say my fitness is lacking. Hence, this is why I'd like to shed some weight.

On flip side, my local trails have a lot of very steep rollers (much off of granite rocks, and some include irregular lines at a steep angle, in fact, from above some look like almost straight down) that I've been working on and I can say I've started riding stuff that in the beginning, I'd thought I'd die on. I'm still alive today. That's why I like a big front fork up front to help give me confidence, and I TOTALLY need any help I can get. That's why I want to keep 180mm in front. I currently run about 200mm rear travel.

There are also a multitude of natural and builtup drops every where, some of them I still need to build up the courage to do, but I found that weight is not as much a concern in this area. Basically, it's the first two paragraphs that made me open this tread.

There are good ideas I hadn't though about here so all comments are appreciated.

Oh yes, I like the idea of the Rune. Much cheaper than the carbon stuff. I actually began looking at it, but after reading about all the trouble with the frame pivots, I recoiled from it like a finger to a hot kettle.


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

Im fairly certain they changed the bearings on the rune so they are shipped with better ones now. I would do more research before giving up on it!


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Iceman2058 said:


> I meant the current model, in Evo version. It runs a Fox 36 180, dropped to 170mm (stock):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks sweet. Weight in the low 30's?


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## craigstr (Sep 19, 2003)

Titus El Guapo in february, way under $2k.


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## RBrady (Jan 20, 2009)

I'm liking that Evo Carbon bike right now. Too bad it doesnt come specd w a Marz.


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## myarmisonfire (Mar 28, 2005)

You have yet to mention what frame you currently have. It sounds like it is really light if you have a 200mm travel frame and a 36lb build with a Marz 66. What is your ride right now?


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

myarmisonfire said:


> You have yet to mention what frame you currently have. It sounds like it is really light if you have a 200mm travel frame and a 36lb build with a Marz 66. What is your ride right now?


Nicolai AFR. It has adjustable travel of 4 settings between around 165 to 197mm. I run it longest setting because I find it with the same pedaling efficiency between the shortest to the highest. I figured if I'm going to lug around the weight, I might as well take advantage of full travel. Plus, it's just fun. I only sacrifice crank clearance in the highest setting.

The weight is based on a bathroom scale measure. It may be totally wrong but I think it's in the ball park. I have to admit it is a lot for me to move around on trails with the type of climbing as I mentioned above. I'm not a big guy at 150lbs.


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## craigstr (Sep 19, 2003)

New Titus El Guapo...will be out in February.
» New things - Titus and on-one Shed Fire : Designing for On-One, Titus and Planet X from Calderdale.


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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

you look into the one by canfield brothers


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## Gman086 (Jul 4, 2004)

jtnord said:


> Im fairly certain they changed the bearings on the rune so they are shipped with better ones now. I would do more research before giving up on it!


LOL, the Rune has bushings not bearings and it is a HUGE issue right now (there's a really nasty thread going on in the Banshee forum at present). The other huge strike against the Rune is the downtube BB juncture needs a gusset like the Spitty has - WAY too many frame failures there. I wouldn't touch a Rune with a 10 foot pole until the Rune II comes out (2013 is the rumor). Don't get me wrong - LOVE my Banshee but they have some problems to iron out for now.

Have FUN!

G MAN


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## Gman086 (Jul 4, 2004)

Aust95 said:


> Nicolai AFR. It has adjustable travel of 4 settings between around 165 to 197mm. I run it longest setting because I find it with the same pedaling efficiency between the shortest to the highest. I figured if I'm going to lug around the weight, I might as well take advantage of full travel. Plus, it's just fun. I only sacrifice crank clearance in the highest setting.
> 
> The weight is based on a bathroom scale measure. It may be totally wrong but I think it's in the ball park. I have to admit it is a lot for me to move around on trails with the type of climbing as I mentioned above. I'm not a big guy at 150lbs.


Let me know if you decide to sell the AFR (if it's a medium)!

Have FUN!

G MAN


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## myarmisonfire (Mar 28, 2005)

Aust95 said:


> Nicolai AFR.


That is already a pretty light frame especially for the amount of travel. I think that if you went to something like a Carbon Nomad or Mojo HD you might save a pound. If getting something nearer to 30 pounds is your goal there may be better places on your build to save weight than the frame. I honestly don't think that your going to get a much better frame than what you already have.


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## Gman086 (Jul 4, 2004)

myarmisonfire said:


> That is already a pretty light frame especially for the amount of travel. I think that if you went to something like a Carbon Nomad or Mojo HD you might save a pound. If getting something nearer to 30 pounds is your goal there may be better places on your build to save weight than the frame. I honestly don't think that your going to get a much better frame than what you already have.


No that frame is a heavy pig, it's a total dog too; it's a PIG DOG! He should definitely sell it to me! 

Have FUN!

Gman


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

Gman086 said:


> LOL, the Rune has bushings not bearings and it is a HUGE issue right now (there's a really nasty thread going on in the Banshee forum at present). The other huge strike against the Rune is the downtube BB juncture needs a gusset like the Spitty has - WAY too many frame failures there. I wouldn't touch a Rune with a 10 foot pole until the Rune II comes out (2013 is the rumor). Don't get me wrong - LOVE my Banshee but they have some problems to iron out for now.
> 
> Have FUN!
> 
> G MAN


My bad. You knew what I meant.

Now that I know the OP has an AFR I would just keep that and lighten it up with the money you were going to use on a frame upgrade!


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## b-kul (Sep 20, 2009)

scott genius lt? its a weird bike, like a super xc bike, but it seems to be what you are after.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

The AFR is too good to let go right now. Just like to think of alternatives. I did check the spec page and jtnord is right in that's a relatively light frame for the travel it has. I'm figuring I might have to change the gearing 1x9 (32T in front and 34T low in back) to 36T in the back.

I don't intend on changing the fork. So I don't think I could shed any more weight. Basically my build:

2011 Marz 66 Ti Evo
Avy Chubie rear shock with 350lb steel spring (I was told Ti not an option for Avy at this spring rate)
I9 Enduro wheels.
Tires: Nevegal 2.35 singly ply kevlar with regular tube in front. Minion DHF DH specific 2.5 wire bead with light DH tube (any smaller I get pinch flats)
Handlebar: Gravity Lite 28 inch
Stem: Sunline DH stem 50mm (this is pretty heavy)
Drivetrain: XO and short cage XO derailler. XTR cranks with single 32T ring
Brakes:Formula The One (208 front, 180 rear)
Cassette PG990 9 speed.
Ethirteen Bash.
Hope ceramic bottom bracket.
Thompson seatpost.
Cheap light roadbike seat (I need to change this one)

Don't think I could shave off much weight. Any ideas let me know.
I'm thinking more of the 1x9 drivetrain as what's getting me wasted tired at the end of my rides.


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

I'll be throwing a 2012 180mm Float 36 on my 2011 Remedy in about a week. Will be 29lbs(28lbs now with the 32 Talas), but not quite a FR bike.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

thuren said:


> I'll be throwing a 2012 180mm Float 36 on my 2011 Remedy in about a week. Will be 29lbs(28lbs now with the 32 Talas), but not quite a FR bike.


Errrr...won't that wreck the geometry?

That's a significant move up in fork size. Saw that the Remedy has 150mm in rear. Wouldn't 180 be more at home on a Trek Scratch (friend of mine has one)? If you can do it, it'd be cool.


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## Bowen1911 (Nov 3, 2011)

Trek Scratch if you can find a frame for sale. They are light as hell.


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

Aust95 said:


> Errrr...won't that wreck the geometry?
> 
> That's a significant move up in fork size. Saw that the Remedy has 150mm in rear. Wouldn't 180 be more at home on a Trek Slash (friend of mine has one)? If you can do it, it'd be cool.


"Wreck" would be subjective haha! 

No really, it is going to net a 65.5* head tube angle, and give a bit more wheelbase, which the bike needs the way I ride. I run high pressure in the stock modded 150mm forks, and run on the low end of shock sag, which makes it feel "almost" perfect. With the 180 I should be able to get the rear sag in line, and run a more normal PSI in the forks, only giving a slightly higher BB height. Calculates out to a 16mm BB height increase, but won't know for sure how it "feels" till I run it through a few sessions.


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## juanbeegas (Oct 1, 2007)

Heh... Wonder why no one's mentioned the Trek Session?


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## dwyooaj (Dec 14, 2006)

Aust95 said:


> .
> I'm thinking more of the 1x9 drivetrain as what's getting me wasted tired at the end of my rides.


ummm...Duh? of course! lower the gearing and run a granny ring. That will make a way bigger difference than a 1 pound lighter frame.


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## sonic reducer (Apr 12, 2010)

because he is looking to do xc rides on it too. 

I have heard lots of good things about the yeti asr-7 and it would probably fit the bill pretty well.


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## fermenter (Feb 19, 2008)

Aust95 said:


> The AFR is too good to let go right now. Just like to think of alternatives. I did check the spec page and jtnord is right in that's a relatively light frame for the travel it has. I'm figuring I might have to change the gearing 1x9 (32T in front and 34T low in back) to 36T in the back.
> 
> I don't intend on changing the fork. So I don't think I could shed any more weight. Basically my build:
> 
> ...


You could swap in an EXO DHF to save some weight but you would have to go up a few psi because it should pinch flat easier. Convert to tubeless too but I am not a fan.

Sounds like a great bike!


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## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

Lightest frame that can handle a 7" fork is the Mojo HD, but it only has 160mm rear travel. Lightest 7" frame I've found is the Scott Genius LTc. Mine is 29.2lb with really heavy tires and a build that handled a season of DH, jumping, Super D, and epic pass rides without a flaw (it's got a Reverb now):









My short list of frames was Genius LTc, Mojo HD, Nomadc, Giant Reign X, Yeti 7, and Pivot Firebird. I chose the Scott for its geo, weight, travel, and adjustable travel (sag) shock.


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## DeanH (Jan 9, 2008)

id say the Scott LTc as well, or if price wasnt set at 2K for the frame.. the Ibis Mojo HD.


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

What you want is a used Nomadc and a Fox Float 180. Great combo, especially if you use a super low stack headset. You would be fine with a used aluminum one as well, but it won't be as stiff or light.


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## Gman086 (Jul 4, 2004)

thuren said:


> "Wreck" would be subjective haha!
> only giving a slightly higher BB height. Calculates out to a 16mm BB height increase, but won't know for sure how it "feels" till I run it through a few sessions.


You call more than half an inch a slight BB height increase?! Good luck with that, esp on a Remedy. I've grown to appreciate low BB's since switching to Banshee this year. Let us know how it goes.

Have FUN!

G MAN


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

Gman086 said:


> You call more than half an inch a slight BB height increase?! Good luck with that, esp on a Remedy. I've grown to appreciate low BB's since switching to Banshee this year. Let us know how it goes.
> 
> Have FUN!
> 
> G MAN


I hear ya man me too low BB all they way! I manually measure my BB at 340mm right now, so I don't think 356 is going to be too out of whack.


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## ryan_daugherty (Oct 8, 2006)

Tada 32lbs with a 180mm 36 talas.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Recommendations thus far:

Nomadc
Scott Genius LTc
Mojo HD
Giant Reign X
Yeti asr7
Pivot Firebird
Trek Scratch
Trek Remedy
Banshee Rune
Titus El Guapo
Specialized Enduro Evo
Canfield One

A lot of choices. Maybe if I can get one cheap. Probably not the carbon offerings. Saw the AFR7 on sale for $850. Wow, tempting! Don't know but probably a sideways step from what I currently have; have to check weights.


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

There's a white Carbon Nomad frame for $1,800 in the classifieds right now. So it can easily be had for under the $2,000 you mentioned.


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## m-dub (Apr 22, 2005)

Ben's bike looks pretty light.

Ben Cruz Trail Riding in Novato, California - sspomer - Mountain Biking Videos - Vital MTB


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

m-dub said:


> Ben's bike looks pretty light.
> 
> Ben Cruz Trail Riding in Novato, California - sspomer - Mountain Biking Videos - Vital MTB


Ahhhh, yeaaaahhhh. Those trails looked super fun.


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## schlockinz (Feb 6, 2009)

I'd say keep your current ride and maybe get some lighter weight parts to swap over when you're not full on freeriding.

And I know what you mean about the zoke, I've got a 66 on my wildcard, and its incredible, and I use it for XC stuff as well as light freeride


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## elsinore (Jun 10, 2005)

The Alu. Nomad should also be on your list. Built properly it makes a great freeride rig. My large 09' aluminum MK2 frame weighed exactly the same as the Mojo HD that replaced it. You can find them used for a decent price as well.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

elsinore said:


> The Alu. Nomad should also be on your list. Built properly it makes a great freeride rig. My large 09' aluminum MK2 frame weighed exactly the same as the Mojo HD that replaced it. You can find them used for a decent price as well.


How's the switch from Nomad to HD?


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

schlockinz said:


> I'd say keep your current ride and maybe get some lighter weight parts to swap over when you're not full on freeriding.
> 
> And I know what you mean about the zoke, I've got a 66 on my wildcard, and its incredible, and I use it for XC stuff as well as light freeride


Yea, I am totally spoiled by the feel of it. Blows away my Fox and RS. I thought the Lyrik DH coil was good until I tried the 66. No contest. Everything is better other than the weight.


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

Lelandjt said:


> Lightest frame that can handle a 7" fork is the Mojo HD, but it only has 160mm rear travel. Lightest 7" frame I've found is the Scott Genius LTc. Mine is 29.2lb with really heavy tires and a build that handled a season of DH, jumping, Super D, and epic pass rides without a flaw (it's got a Reverb now):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Unless I am missing something, The Nomadc is lighter than the Mojo HD by .25 lbs... both size med with RP23, measurements on their websites.


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## elsinore (Jun 10, 2005)

*Nomad VS HD*



Aust95 said:


> How's the switch from Nomad to HD?


They are both great bikes, and I am in love with the HD right now. 
If I had to pick one to ride with a DH/FR build though it would be the Nomad all the way. Without droning on for ages about their differences, which I could do easily... I just like how the Nomad handles when the riding gets steep. The Nomad rides deeper in its travel when the bike is moving fast, making the HA feel significantly more slack, and the BB lower. The HD has so much anti squat built into it that I feel like the HA is a few degrees steeper than the Nomad. The HD also bottoms out easier than the Nomad. 
The HD is stiffer, pedals/ accelerates better and I think jumps a bit better as well. This is just my opinion though, lots of folks have switched and prefer the HD for the DH/FR side of things. 
I am happy I switched to the HD because I have a DH bike and I feel like the HD can help me keep up with my XC friends when I am chasing them around on their hardtail 29ers. Then I can turn around and huck it off something on the same ride.

Anyway, they are both freaking fantastic rides.:thumbsup:


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## jtnord (Jun 5, 2010)

elsinore said:


> They are both great bikes, and I am in love with the HD right now.
> If I had to pick one to ride with a DH/FR build though it would be the Nomad all the way. Without droning on for ages about their differences, which I could do easily... I just like how the Nomad handles when the riding gets steep. The Nomad rides deeper in its travel when the bike is moving fast, making the HA feel significantly more slack, and the BB lower. The HD has so much anti squat built into it that I feel like the HA is a few degrees steeper than the Nomad. The HD also bottoms out easier than the Nomad.
> The HD is stiffer, pedals/ accelerates better and I think jumps a bit better as well. This is just my opinion though, lots of folks have switched and prefer the HD for the DH/FR side of things.
> I am happy I switched to the HD because I have a DH bike and I feel like the HD can help me keep up with my XC friends when I am chasing them around on their hardtail 29ers. Then I can turn around and huck it off something on the same ride.
> ...


Good review, it confirms most of what I have heard. Just thought I would point out that this is the Nomad Aluminum Mk2 vs Mojo HD. Obviously a fairer comparison would be with the Nomadc. From what I have heard the Nomadc is stiffer than the HD. :thumbsup:


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

Took my Nomadc out for a ride and was thinking about this thread. How could someone buy anything else (for the price)?


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## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

^Adjustable sag, shorter chainstays, more travel, rear thru-axle.


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

elsinore said:


> They are both great bikes, and I am in love with the HD right now.
> If I had to pick one to ride with a DH/FR build though it would be the Nomad all the way. Without droning on for ages about their differences, which I could do easily... I just like how the Nomad handles when the riding gets steep. The Nomad rides deeper in its travel when the bike is moving fast, making the HA feel significantly more slack, and the BB lower. The HD has so much anti squat built into it that I feel like the HA is a few degrees steeper than the Nomad. The HD also bottoms out easier than the Nomad.
> The HD is stiffer, pedals/ accelerates better and I think jumps a bit better as well. This is just my opinion though, lots of folks have switched and prefer the HD for the DH/FR side of things.
> I am happy I switched to the HD because I have a DH bike and I feel like the HD can help me keep up with my XC friends when I am chasing them around on their hardtail 29ers. Then I can turn around and huck it off something on the same ride.
> ...


Your description of the DW-link sounds similar to the Firebird DW - they seem to ride high out back, even with more sag and it tends to make the front feel low and as if it was a steeper HTA. The bird, however, doesn't bottom out easier than the 'mad.


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

Just noticed the Nomad's CS length yowza, thats a long one!


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## rzalewski6 (Sep 28, 2008)

Pivot Firebirds are on sale $1599 from Go-Ride. 2012 Kashima 36 Float 180 is close, but still not as stiction free as the 66. Of course the 66 is heavier because it actually has oil in it, not a mist of float fluid


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## Nechako (Apr 11, 2008)

My Rune is sitting at 33.37lbs with a 2011 66 RC3 Evo.

I still have places to drop weight and I don't think it would be hard to get it under 32lbs.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Nechako said:


> My Rune is sitting at 33.37lbs with a 2011 66 RC3 Evo.
> 
> I still have places to drop weight and I don't think it would be hard to get it under 32lbs.


What's your build? Any problems with the frame?


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## Nechako (Apr 11, 2008)

Aust95 said:


> What's your build? Any problems with the frame?


I just put a new axle kit in it and it seems like the little bit of play I had is gone. I'll have to do a few rides and see how it holds up.

Here are the specs.

09 Large Rune
11 66 RC3 EVO
Manitou ISX-6
Enve Carbon DH bar
Works Components headset
Hope 50mm stem
Hope Tech M4 brakes
RaceFace Atlas FR cranks
MRP G2 SL guide
Trail King 2.2 tires
Funn Xlrater wheelset
X.9 drivetrain
Sram 990 cassette
Look Quartz pedals

Here is a picture from before I changed the fork that shows the 36 Float I had on it and old stem.










My wheels and uncomfortable seat are fairly heavy so those will be swapped out.


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## slimat99 (May 21, 2008)

Your question has been answered a few times: lightest frames that are rated for a 180 fork are the nomadC, and HD. 6.2lbs is as light as it gets for a frame that can handle a 180. They are both rated for light FR, if anyone really knows where the line between light FR and full on FR is?


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## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

^Trannys, smooth style, rubber side down vs flat landings, smashing, and crashing. Same trail, different riders.

While my very light FR build has held up fine for me on harsh terrain and big jumps I wouldn't recommend it to just anyone.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

Does anyone know if the listed quoted weight of 6.2 lbs (about 2.8 kgs) for the Nomadc and HD includes the air shock or not?

My current frame is 3.5kg or 7.7lbs without shock. Shock probably makes it close to 11lbs.


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## elsinore (Jun 10, 2005)

*Large Frame weight*



Aust95 said:


> Does anyone know if the listed quoted weight of 6.2 lbs (about 2.8 kgs) for the Nomadc and HD includes the air shock or not?
> 
> My current frame is 3.5kg or 7.7lbs without shock. Shock probably makes it close to 11lbs.


My Large HD weighed 6.9 lbs. with an rp23, the Alu 09' Large Nomad it replaced weighed 6.9 lbs with a Monarch.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

*My Main Ride...*

I use this bike for 95% of my riding. I even prefer to take it on my once a week XC rides that I do when I visit family. I run the rear full travel 197mm (7.75 in) to be exact and it's surprisingly pedal efficient for the amount of travel it has.


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## -C- (Oct 26, 2006)

Large Nomad C bare frame.










Add ~50g for seat clamp, mount hardware & shock bolts.

Shock obviously varies, but a 2012 RP23 in the right size was ~270g as I weighed mine before I put it on. The DHX Air weighed pretty much as advertised at ~450g (I replaced the DHX with the RP23).

Mine complete was 2689g on the scales with the RP23, which equates to pretty much 6lbs on the nose. They seem to be a fairly realistic weight, allowing for slight manufacturing differences/intolerances


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## mefistofeles (Jun 1, 2009)

I would recommend the Cannondale Claymore. When elevate mode is engaged travel in the rear shock is reduced by 70mm and the bike becomes much stiffer and less compliant. With elevate mode engaged the Claymore's rear end feels much stiffer and less compliant than my Giant Faith 0 freeride bike. In fact in elevate mode I'd have say that the Claymore actually feels stiffer than my Trance X2 with 120mm of front and rear travel. Unfortunately I haven't had a chance to take any drops with the Claymore so I can't comment on it's huckability. In terms of weight I would guess than my medium claymore 3 comes in around 32-33 pounds.


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## tls36 (Dec 10, 2005)

Hey clay how about one of our FB's, I am running the Float 180 RC2, DHX AIr, mid heavy build, L frame at 34.75 lbs


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## Rucker61 (Jul 21, 2006)

Aust95 said:


> Does anyone know if the listed quoted weight of 6.2 lbs (about 2.8 kgs) for the Nomadc and HD includes the air shock or not?
> 
> My current frame is 3.5kg or 7.7lbs without shock. Shock probably makes it close to 11lbs.


My NomadC large frame weighed a quarter ounce under 6 lbs with an RP23.


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## gticlay (Dec 13, 2007)

tls36 said:


> Hey clay how about one of our FB's, I am running the Float 180 RC2, DHX AIr, mid heavy build, L frame at 34.75 lbs


If OP was looking for the best freeride/all mountain bike for the money, the Firebird would win - EASILY. But he's looking for the best frame to be had for under $2000. The 'bird on closeout is way high up, IMO, but a slightly used Nomadc really beats it out given the constraints (lightest build). If the OP can expand his/her requirements, the F'bird would really rise to the top.


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## [email protected] (Dec 29, 2003)

For the money is there really another choice??? :thumbsup: A medium with shock weighs just under 7.5 lbs.


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## AlexZ28 (Aug 19, 2011)

Nechako said:


> I just put a new axle kit in it and it seems like the little bit of play I had is gone. I'll have to do a few rides and see how it holds up.
> 
> Here are the specs.
> 
> ...


Sorry to highjack but how does the Marz 66 compare to the Float 36? I was really tempted to get the 66 when HucknRoll had them for $300ish but I couldn't justify the extra 2 lbs (vs the Float) and the lack of lockout for climbing.

OP, my contribution: https://ridesolstice.com/index.php


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## Nechako (Apr 11, 2008)

AlexZ28 said:


> Sorry to highjack but how does the Marz 66 compare to the Float 36? I was really tempted to get the 66 when HucknRoll had them for $300ish but I couldn't justify the extra 2 lbs (vs the Float) and the lack of lockout for climbing.
> 
> OP, my contribution: http://ridesolstice.com/index.php


The Float is a very nice fork and I do like it, but stiction free plushness of the 66 makes my wrist happy. The Float made the front end more playful and popped off small trail features better while the 66 just plows right over them.


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

Thought I would post back...

Just put a 2012 Float 36 180mm on my 2011 Trek Remedy. This is how the bike should have come. Head angle is spot on, you can get on the bars in rough terrain with confidence, and it's a point and shoot bike now, instead of twitchy all over the place.

Measured BB height of now 358mm and it feels right at home in that regard.

Very happy with the bike now instead os "so-so" before.

Bike has a pretty extensive list of weight saving $$$$ thrown at is, but even with the Joplin 4 and still heavy and up-sized 203mm rotors, comes in at 29lbs on the nose.


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## Frac (Mar 12, 2007)

Not trying to be rude here, but - you seem very worried about having a light frame. What are you weighing in at?

10lbs from your waist is a lot cheaper than a 2k frame...


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## 30something (Dec 20, 2011)

I am wondering if you are going to leave the stock shock on your remedy or do you have a plan for that? Also, how does your remedy climb now, it seems like it has lost its All Mountain touch? I was thinking swapping the stock fork for a 160mm float on my 2011 r8 so this is why I ask.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

If that remedy had a real shock on it, it would probably be a real ripper  so close...


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## thuren (Jul 29, 2009)

30something said:


> I am wondering if you are going to leave the stock shock on your remedy or do you have a plan for that? Also, how does your remedy climb now, it seems like it has lost its All Mountain touch? I was thinking swapping the stock fork for a 160mm float on my 2011 r8 so this is why I ask.


The shock has already been re-worked to have the valving be more linear, to match the dual-chamber "spring" lol.

Climbs fine! I run it weekly on a 10 mile 1300' elevation climb then rip down.

Do the swap. I used to always feel sketchy on the bike, and now it is the best all around bike I have ever ridden, with the taller fork.


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## The Experience (Feb 25, 2012)

jtnord said:


> What size steer tube do you have? And if its cut that could create a problem, further limiting choices. The Rune, as others mentioned, is one of the few light and cheap frames that is designed to pedal with a 7" fork. I would look further into it though because there have been many problems/ complaints from cracked frames to bearing problems ( I think banshee has recenly swapped to better ones). As i said before the carbon nomad is the closest frame to fitting you requirments and is lighter than the mojo hd. You might be able to pick one up used in your 2k budget. Good luck.


There is no comparing the ride quality between the HD and the Nomad. They were put head to head during our decision of which bike to use for the Megavalanche at Alpe d-Huez. Get a night job for a short time and you will have the extra cash. The bike really does pedal like mad. In September I did a combined event in Northern Italy. Both the 6000ft climb on Saturday and the wicked descent on Sunday had to be done on the same bike. The only thing we could change was tires. While it involved suffering, just the idea of being able to go race pace up 6000ft on a 180mm fork is a testament to advancement in cycling.

I should also mention that it descends with fury. It is not a DH bike with DH angles, but it absolutely smashed down sick terrain at amazing speed.


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## Aust95 (Apr 24, 2008)

What bike are you referring to that you decided to use? HD or Nomadc? It's not clear from your post. I am still totally up in the air as what I'll eventually do. I a few years experience with 1st gen VPP and much prefered the active feel of my horst link bikes though they had a small tradeoff in pedaling feel. The VPP1 seemed to stiffen up through the fast chop while under pedaling loads. Don't know if VPP2 is much different.


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## The Experience (Feb 25, 2012)

Yeah, I see that was about as clear as mud. Honestly, the HD is so far superior it did not occur to me that I needed to actually state that.

I have about 12 years experience with the Horst Link on three different Ellsworth frames. It was the clear winner in active suspension that pedaled well; I was a believer in Ellsworth ICT and won the Idaho Mountain Bike Marathon State Championship. Not bragging, just making clear that I am serious about pedaling. I thought the VPP was a joke after having one for 2 years, although I was willing to look into the new design (carbon Nomad) as a possibility for my more FR oriented rig.

In 2008 I moved from the Ellsworth to the Ibis Mojo SL. I loved the Ellsworth, but it was time for a new bike and after 12 years of "The Truth" was ready for something different. The weight to travel ratio on the Mojo was very enticing and the ride over a parking curb in the shop lot felt good. Seriously, that is all I had to go on before throwing down 5 large (plus great reviews on MTBR). My first ride was an experience of how humanity is advancing technology everywhere. The bike was a completely new experience, both climbing and descending. The DW link IS the next progression. There will be something better, but it has not been invented yet.

Enter the HD: a beefed up Mojo with increased travel. While not as fast as the SL up, it climbs well enough that it has become my main bike. I really only got it for DH Marathon (Super D) events, but it is just wicked fun all of the time. It has 80% of the climbing ability of the SL, with 2-300% the DH ability.

I cannot add links yet, but it should be clear how to get to this video and see it in action. It was a combined shuttle, ride, hike to get to the top. The guide is marketing this area, so the riding and trail is not designed to show off the bike.

www[dot]freeridestash[dot]com/europe/italy/south-tirol/ridanna


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## Nsynk (Sep 30, 2008)

Have you looked at liteville 601 6.6lb 190mm frame. Size specific geometry and immaculate attention to detail.


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