# Tough decision? Missoula MT or Fort Collins CO.



## coryell (Mar 9, 2008)

I'm trying to decide where to move to, Missoula MT or Fort Collins CO and could sure use some help deciding what to do. Things that i'm taking into consideration are: job availability, cost of living, MTB trail accessability, and quality of road riding. I've actually spent some time living in Missoula so I know their is great MTBing and is very accessible, was within riding distance from my apartment. On the other hand the road riding was very limited and racing, road/MTB, was often difficult due to the fact that most races where atleast three hours away. How do winters compare in fort collins? I know that missoula's where long, dark, and cold. Is riding possible, at least on the roads, year round in fort collins? So for those of you cyclists who are familiar with these two areas what would you do if you had to choose between these places. please help point me in the right direction. thanks.


----------



## mtmtbkr (Jul 16, 2008)

I live near Missoula. I vote Ft. Collins!


----------



## xcguy (Apr 18, 2004)

The winters in Ft. Collins are enjoyable, the winters in Missoula are long gray and miserable. Anybody who lives in Missoula feel free to correct my assessment of winters there but I live just down the road from Ft. Collins and I rode on dry trail all of late January and February this past winter. Not normal, of course, but it can happen here. I bet it never happens up there.


----------



## Funrover (Oct 4, 2006)

Tough choice. I love both. Personally I think the front range of Colorado is too busy. My wife and both are considering moving to Missoula, MT. I have not been there in some years so I want to see what has changed first


----------



## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Funrover said:


> Tough choice. I love both. Personally I think the front range of Colorado is too busy. My wife and both are considering moving to Missoula, MT. I have not been there in some years so I want to see what has changed first


housing has gotten much more expensive.


----------



## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

formica said:


> housing has gotten much more expensive.


Jobs are scarce in MT right now and the pay is never what it is in other places. For instance, I live in Bozeman and would make about 30% more if I moved to the Fort Collins branch of the EXACT SAME COMPANY that I work for here. They call it the mountain/wilderness tax. Apparently there are enough schleps like me willing to work for less in order to live here that employers have taken note.

However, I too can ride dry trails in Jan/Feb, I just need to travel about an hour to do so (it would be about 2 hours from Missoula). But why bother? That's ski season.


----------



## ionsmuse (Jul 14, 2005)

I live in Missoula right now.

Most relevant factor: we do not have good year round mountain biking. The good stuff is snowed or mudded in from late November to early May. 

Second relevant factor: Montana is not Colorado. The wilderness is endless, close, and uncrowded. That goes for both summer and winter. We have no ski-traffic jams around here. 

Third relevant factor: Bernice's bakery.

Nothing else is relevant.


----------



## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

ionsmuse said:


> Nothing else is relevant.


Except maybe the fact that Rockin' Rudy's is the best music store I've ever been to.


----------



## Brown_Teeth (Jan 15, 2004)

Ft. Collins for sure, Missoula while it has its pluses the air quality really sucks in the winter inversion days. People there still think its a god given right to burn wood when its choking thick under an inversion. Winters are like 9 months long too. I lived there in the early '80's fun back then but now its being built out and not so inviting anymore


----------



## gecko223 (Jul 21, 2009)

I don't know much about Ft.Collins, but tried to make a go in Missoula in the mid 90's right out of college, and left after two years. The housing scene is expensive and the job scene is really rough. Low pay and little opportunity, but they do have UM. Missoula seemed to be in a "bowl", you get the bitter cold and ice for 4 months but the snow seemed to stay up in the moutains that surround the city, and riding year round is not really an option. The smoke pollution in town gets pretty bad too. Spring and summers are AWESOME there! I would retire there for sure, no job needed and money to go south for winter:thumbsup:


----------



## Ken in KC (Jan 12, 2004)

*One important and overlooked factor...*

Beer!

There are very few places in the country that could compete with Ft. Collins in number of fantastic, local breweries per capita.


----------



## davidarnott (Feb 28, 2007)

*visiting missoula with bike!*

you have to check out the thread: visiting missoula with bike! It's in the Montana IdaKnow Whineoming section. Too bad they can't keep this circus up ad nauseam. By The Way anybody smart enough to visit Missoula with their bike should help themselves to pizza at Bob Marshall's EXCELLENT pizza joing "Bigga". Tell Bob davidarnott sent ya, You'll come home fatter than when you left!


----------



## Stalls (Jul 29, 2009)

Interesting post. I live in Missoula now, and lived in Ft Collins from '75-81. Many of us who have lived in both remark that Missoula today is like Ft Collins was in the 70's. *Road cycling*: Ft Collins hands down. *MTB*: I say Missoula if you're talking about right from town. *Winter cycling*: Ft Collins milder, more sunny days, longer days. Missoula winters dark, dreary. But those same things mean more people in the Fort. And like someone else said - hell winter is for skiing! *Job Opps*: Ft Collins hands down. *Beer*: Kettle House in Missoula hands down, no contest. *Balloon Boy*: Ft Collins wins that one
*Verdict:* if it's total cycling you're after - both road and mtb and year round, it's Ft. Collins.


----------



## ionsmuse (Jul 14, 2005)

Stalls said:


> Kettle House in Missoula hands down, no contest.


Fail.


----------



## coryell (Mar 9, 2008)

davidarnott, i actually read that post a while back and thought it was hillarious. while i do find quality pizza important and would like to think of myself as being somewhat of an expert on the subject i found the thread quite intimidating and felt that i may be getting in over my head by joining in on the discussion. beer...hmmm...beer. many of you have pointed out what i failed to mention on my list of priorities. thank you, sometimes i'd forget my head if it were'nt attached. but really thanks for all of the great advice, i think i've decided on fort collins. winter in missoula can be rough.....even with all the great pizza.


----------



## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

I have only visited Missoula in the summer, and thought is was a great place, even though I did not get to ride there.

We did ride much of the year last year, both off and on road, here in Fort Collins.

These photos were shot on rides this last winter:
1. January 9, 2009
2. January 31, 2009
3. February 7, 2009
4. March 19, 2009


----------



## twouareks (May 13, 2004)

I went to CSU, and I love love love Fort Collins.


----------



## zod (Jul 15, 2003)

I have not ridden in either location however I happen to be drinking a Chocolate Stout from Fort Collins Brewery at this very moment.....and it rocks. So Fort Collins (how's that for fuzzy decision making)


----------



## WickedGood (Aug 19, 2008)

Is there riding in Ft Collins around Thanksgiving?


----------



## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

WickedGood said:


> Is there riding in Ft Collins around Thanksgiving?


Yes. Riding is usually not a problem then. We've had a bit of snow on the ground one or two of the last several years.


----------



## brianb (Apr 25, 2004)

I don't know Ft. Collins, but I would not recommend Missoula unless, unless you like to play in the snow too. The 'bowl is a scant 25 min. from town with usually no crowd and there's also lots of accessible backcountry within an hour of town. Can't tell you how many days I'd be up in the sun riding at the 'bowl looking down on the dreary socked-in valley. Of course that's the student's life, riding at 11 am on a weekday...
Ride a bike: Spring Summer Fall
Ride a board: Winter Spring
works out alright. Throw in some kayaking and you're set, although I never did get into that.
Beer: 1) Bayern 2) Kettlehouse 
Pizza: yes do go see Bob


----------



## Robin1 (Dec 23, 2003)

*missoula for sure*

I live in so cal but my parents relocated to Hamilton (it's about 45 miles south of missoula). If I could afford to live in MT. I'd move there for sure. The summers are the best and winter is for snow sports.


----------



## lostmaniksoul (Jul 20, 2009)

Guys I have some questions regarding Fort Collins. If anyone on here can spare some local info it would be much appreciated. Thx!

1. How far are the trails from the center of town? Is it relatively convenient/quick access?
2. Is there a good variety of trails in the area? 
3. If I were to be moving to the area what part of Fort Collins would offer the best mountain views from my house - North, South, West etc? Or are mountain views pretty much universal from anywhere in town? 
4. How long of a drive, on average, does it take to get up to Winter Park resort?


----------



## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

lostmaniksoul said:


> Guys I have some questions regarding Fort Collins. If anyone on here can spare some local info it would be much appreciated. Thx!
> 
> 1. How far are the trails from the center of town? Is it relatively convenient/quick access?
> 2. Is there a good variety of trails in the area?
> ...


4. 2 hours to Winter Park without traffic.
3. The town is up against the foothills. Therefore, the east side of town has the best views of the high mountains and snow covered peaks. However, that side of town is farthest from the trails.
2. Except for DH, there is a good variety of trails. Some rocky and technical, and some flowy. Search Fort Collins and Loveland in the Colorado Front Range forum for photos.
1. From the geographical center of town, it is about 4 miles to the Foothills trail that runs along the front side of the reservoir. The town is a very bike friendly town, and has many bike lanes rec paths, so access is easy and convenient. 
There are also numerous trails that are within 5 to 10 miles of the edge of town. Almost 2500 of my 3000 miles so far this year have been on a mountain bike, and I have probably not driven to a ride more than a dozen times all year. I chose my house based on the location (2758 feet from my driveway to the closest trail head)


----------



## forkboy (Apr 20, 2004)

lostmaniksoul said:


> 1. How far are the trails from the center of town? Is it relatively convenient/quick access?


There is riding 5 min. from town, but not Good Riding. The vast majority requires a car and a parks pass.

Great riding around Fo Co, but it is definitely outside of town.

Fun town. One of the places on my shortlist of "Cities that I could stand to live in".

The main problem with Fort Collins is proximity to Denver. There is an assload of people on the Front Range, and all of them seem to be trying to get to the same places you are...

I'd like to visit Missoula... .never been.


----------



## Linoleum (Aug 25, 2008)

I used to vacation in Missoula every summer (about 30 yrs ago) and loved the area. Is Rock Creek still good fishin?

R.


----------



## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

forkboy said:


> There is riding 5 min. from town, but not Good Riding. The vast majority requires a car and a parks pass.


... or a 5 - 8 mile ride on pavement.


----------



## sleestak (Feb 12, 2008)

sgltrak said:


> 4. 2 hours to Winter Park without traffic.


and there will be traffic. The weekends are almost not worth going, if at all.



forkboy said:


> There is an assload of people on the Front Range, and all of them seem to be trying to get to the same places you are...


definitely true.


----------



## lostmaniksoul (Jul 20, 2009)

sgltrak said:


> 4. 2 hours to Winter Park without traffic.
> 3. The town is up against the foothills. Therefore, the east side of town has the best views of the high mountains and snow covered peaks. However, that side of town is farthest from the trails.
> 2. Except for DH, there is a good variety of trails. Some rocky and technical, and some flowy. Search Fort Collins and Loveland in the Colorado Front Range forum for photos.
> 1. From the geographical center of town, it is about 4 miles to the Foothills trail that runs along the front side of the reservoir. The town is a very bike friendly town, and has many bike lanes rec paths, so access is easy and convenient.
> There are also numerous trails that are within 5 to 10 miles of the edge of town. Almost 2500 of my 3000 miles so far this year have been on a mountain bike, and I have probably not driven to a ride more than a dozen times all year. I chose my house based on the location (2758 feet from my driveway to the closest trail head)


sgltrak, thanks for the great feedback. Much appreciated!

Thx to everyone else that chimed in too.


----------



## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

I can't add a lot to what has already been said, but I lived in Missoula for 4 years when I went to college in the late '90s. Ditto on the dreary winters. The valley smells like dirty diapers all winter from the pulp mill just West of town. Jobs are scarce and if you find one you can expect the pay to be 40 - 50% lower paying than same job in major cities, yet home prices are the same or more than in many of those cities with more and much higher paying jobs. Go figure.

The mountain biking was pretty good around Missoula, especially up in the Rattlesnake wilderness area. Blue Mountain and Pattee Canyon were pretty fun too. Snowboading in the winter at snowbowl was a definite highlight of my time there.

My wife and I have tried to relocate to Kalispel a few times, and even started the process of buying a house there once, but lack of jobs, or jobs that wouldn't cover all our expenses stopped us in our tracks. It's not an easy place to live. I guess that's what keeps Montana so pristine. It's still in our sights for retirement in 25 years though!

In the Spring, we'll be visiting and checking out Colorado where I grew up (Englewood). Fort Collins and Colorado Springs are possibilities for relocation. Obviously jobs are more prevalent on the Front range, and good biking/ skiing is appealing too. Mike, sounds like you are a Realtor? We probably won't be ready to buy yet, but mind if I look you up while in Ft.Collins?

Sorry for the hijak. To the OP, I'd say Ft. Collins is the better choice unless you have a trust fund you can live on for the next 30 years. In Montana, I'd pick the area between Kalispel and Glacier National Park over Missoula. Kalispel is surrounded by more beautiful mountains, has better hiking, biking and cleaner air year round. It also has a bigger help wanted section in the paper than Missoula does, though not by much.


----------



## Bula (Sep 20, 2004)

Wow, you folks are making Ft. Collins sound pretty good. How far is from there to good skiing?


----------



## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

Bula said:


> Wow, you folks are making Ft. Collins sound pretty good. How far is from there to good skiing?


2 - 2 1/2 hours to Winter Park, Copper Mountain, A-Basin, Keystone, Breck.
3 hours to Vail


----------



## M_S (Nov 18, 2007)

I'm sure winters are more dreary in Missoula than FT. Collins, but FWIW the air pollution is not as bad as I hear it once wass, due to a variety of factors.

Lots of different XC trails/systems, though none are particularly technical. Still, I can access a pretty large one literally from my front door, and I'm still only a mile from downtown, mere blocks from campus.

The town is very fun. Lots of live music, ok art scene, and people generally just seem stoked to be here. It isn't particularly touristy. Very laid back, and bike friendly.

I don't know if I will stay in Missoula after I graduate next year, but it's been a fun place to live for sure.


----------



## honkinunit (Aug 6, 2004)

*Skiing*



sgltrak said:


> 2 - 2 1/2 hours to Winter Park, Copper Mountain, A-Basin, Keystone, Breck.
> 3 hours to Vail


However, factor in the traffic on weekends, and those numbers are out the window. I reluctantly bought a WP/Copper pass this year. I'm thinking this will be my last year for the I-70 madness. It sucks to be stuck in the car for 5 hours to ski for 4.5 hours. It is so bad on Sunday afternoons now that unless you leave the ski area by 1:30 you are guaranteed to hit stop and go. If you leave after 3 you are totally screwed, and the sky is the limit. I've spent 4 hours returning from Vail to Golden, and the Fort is another hour. It is probably faster some of the time to get back to Ft. Fun from WP by going over Cameron Pass.

The only reasonable strategy is to get through Idaho Springs by 7AM, get to where ever, hang out drinking coffee, get first lift, ski non-stop, and leave by 1:30. That means you would leave Ft. Collins at 5:40 AM or so. It isn't worth it to me anymore unless the snow is really good.

Of course, if you don't mind skiing ice in a wind tunnel, you can go to Eldora and skip the I-70 problems. A few days a year, Eldora is a great place to ski, but you just can't count on it.

I've only been to Missoula once, in the summer, and it looks like a totally different place from Ft. Collins to me. Ft. Collins is a midwest suburban college town that happens to be close to the mountains. If that appeals to you, then go for it.


----------



## KERKOVEJ (Jan 23, 2004)

Moved to Fort Collins 2 years ago from Northern Iowa. Why? Because I wanted to ride year round...and I hated riding outside when it was 5F out. Winters are super mild compared to what I had to deal with in the Midwest....and I am sure what you would have to deal with in MT.

Here is a good site for some local riding BETA...including group rides: http://yourgroupride.com/home

There is plenty of good quality mtbing. The road riding is top notch as well. Not to be over looked is the cycling culture in Fort Collins. The town eats, sleeps, and breathes 2 wheeled pedal power....and beer.

Here are links to riding photos taken in and around Ft Collins....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffkerkove/sets/72157605268454206/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffkerkove/sets/72157605232229132/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffkerkove/sets/72157605627083346/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffkerkove/sets/72157602649816166/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffkerkove/sets/72157619745656974/


----------



## isleblue65 (Sep 5, 2009)

honkinunit said:


> However, factor in the traffic on weekends, and those numbers are out the window. I reluctantly bought a WP/Copper pass this year. I'm thinking this will be my last year for the I-70 madness. It sucks to be stuck in the car for 5 hours to ski for 4.5 hours. It is so bad on Sunday afternoons now that unless you leave the ski area by 1:30 you are guaranteed to hit stop and go. If you leave after 3 you are totally screwed, and the sky is the limit. I've spent 4 hours returning from Vail to Golden, and the Fort is another hour. It is probably faster some of the time to get back to Ft. Fun from WP by going over Cameron Pass.


This was great insight for me. It sounds like things have really changed since I last lived in the Denver area in 1988. C470 wasn't even in then. Traffic in Denver was bad, and you could hit traffic to and from the mountains - mostly weather dependent - but you could count on 1 1/2 hours from Englewood to Copper. Maybe 2 if Eisenhower pass was messed up. I usually just went to A-Basin because lift prices hadn't yet skyrocketed ($22 for all day at the time), and you didn't spend more time in lift lines than on the mountain like you did at the bigger places.

I snowboarded my legs off almost daily in Missoula because Snowbowl was close, cheap and had zero lift lines. When I moved to Northern California, I went through a season of dealing with the kind of traffic that you describe (not to mention crazy lift prices and unbearable lift lines), and that drove me to give up my passion for snowboarding and focus on year-round biking (road and Mtn).

Part of my excitement about moving back to Colorado is for the skiing that I grew up with, however it sounds like I would likely revisit a lot of the frustrations that drove me away from it in California.

Like Kerkovej said, being able to cycle year round still makes Colorado a huge draw for me. Here in Minneapolis there's a good 5 months where temperatures make riding impossible for all but the most insane riders. At -20° F, there is nothing you can wear that will keep you warm and allow you to operate your shifters/ brake levers.

By the way, Missoula and Western Montana was called "Tropical Montana" by some locals because it stays relatively warm due to the mountains and warm inversion layers in the valleys. It's colder than Colorado, but nothing compared to Iowa or Minnesota.


----------



## BeanMan (Jul 6, 2006)

I grew up in FTC and lived there until I was 28. It WAS a great little town. Now it is a congested mess IMHO. It has a lot of amenities to be sure. You asked which direction the view of the mountains would be, FTC is on the Great Plains so the one mountain view would be west. If I had to live in the Front Range it would be Fort Collins, 

BUT, I get to live in the Grand Junction Area of western Colorado. That trumps any riding that Fort Collins has to offer in spades. Winter or Summer.


----------

