# Shimano ep8



## tom tom (Mar 3, 2007)

The new EP8 by Shimano


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

tom tom said:


> The new EP8 by Shimano


Tom Tom - Are you trying to source it to save more weight on your Heckler? I wonder if it is the same form factor? Cost and availability etc?

PS: again, I would love to see a pic of your Heckler


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

I'm super skeptical that the form factor will be the same, but who knows. Shimano has been far too tight lipped about this. It's also highly unlikely that the EP8 will be available in volume for upgrades - I suspect most of the production capacity will go to OEMs.


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## shreddr (Oct 10, 2009)

Here's the new M8 by Bafang. These dudes are crushing it.










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Old & Slow (May 3, 2020)

Impressive size. Best info I can find says the M800 is a road/gravel focused motor and been out for 2-years.


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## Shamis (Apr 12, 2015)

I'm not sure I understand the composition of the attached picture from OP. Is the motor being developed with Bosch? Otherwise, what is the purpose of the combined pic?


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## tom tom (Mar 3, 2007)

Shamis said:


> I'm not sure I understand the composition of the attached picture from OP. Is the motor being developed with Bosch? Otherwise, what is the purpose of the combined pic?


The picture with both motors is on the Mondraker

ebike page, they are showing what options they offer.


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

Commencal with EP8 will be released on 8 of august.


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## apriliano (Mar 21, 2007)

magnil said:


> Commencal with EP8 will be released on 8 of august.


2021?


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

apriliano said:


> 2021?


Sorry. 31 of august. 

https://www.commencal-store.co.uk/meta-power-29-c102x3872271


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## JetSedgwick (Jun 14, 2016)

Look like this new motor will compete with the Brose in the Levo.


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## stiksandstones (Oct 7, 2004)

commencal will be online Aug 31, but can you buy one with new shimano motor then?


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

It's actually called the DU-EP800. If you Google "DU-EP800" you'll see a number of bikes that are spec'd with the new drive unit and display unit.

Some indicate ship dates at the end of the year (December).


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

RickBullottaPA said:


> It's actually called the DU-EP800. If you Google "DU-EP800" you'll see a number of bikes that are spec'd with the new drive unit and display unit.
> 
> Some indicate ship dates at the end of the year (December).


Rick - I am looking to buy the new Canyon Spectral ON 7.0. My guess is that this bike will not come with the new motor. Do you think the DU-EP800 is worth waiting for? Same question for the Heckler - the bike I really want but cannot afford.


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

Jack7782 said:


> Rick - I am looking to buy the new Canyon Spectral ON 7.0. My guess is that this bike will not come with the new motor. Do you think the DU-EP800 is worth waiting for? Same question for the Heckler - the bike I really want but cannot afford.


Heckler: Look in this file. Says EP800 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0065/8626/9784/files/MY2021_Kits.pdf

Canyon: Pics has been out for a while with EP8

Edit: Looking at this it seems that EP800 has the same mounting as old motors. Then we will probably se most models updated for 2021.

https://us-en.bmc-switzerland.com/30000813-motor-cover-kit-ep800.html


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Jack7782 said:


> Rick - I am looking to buy the new Canyon Spectral ON 7.0. My guess is that this bike will not come with the new motor. Do you think the DU-EP800 is worth waiting for? Same question for the Heckler - the bike I really want but cannot afford.


I can't really answer that until we know what the specific new features are (higher assist power, more efficient, lighter, etc). Also, you may have to wait until Q1 2021 for the new motor.

On the plus side, if you buy the existing bikes, you'll likely get a very good discount.


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## JetSedgwick (Jun 14, 2016)

new video


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## Old & Slow (May 3, 2020)

Here's a YouTube review of the EP8:


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## grrrah (Mar 26, 2004)

magnil said:


> Heckler: Look in this file. Says EP800 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0065/8626/9784/files/MY2021_Kits.pdf
> 
> Canyon: Pics has been out for a while with EP8
> 
> ...


Good catch. The Santa Cruz, that is the same heckler with the new '21 build kits, and maybe the new motor. I think many are interested in the rumored frame update for the new motor, new battery, 29/mullet, etc.


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## JetSedgwick (Jun 14, 2016)

there are many videos on youtube now reviewing this new motor.


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

https://ebike-mtb.com/en/shimano-ep...pp-en+(Show+in+app+-+E-MOUNTAINBIKE+Magazine)


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## JetSedgwick (Jun 14, 2016)

I'm curious about the YT Decoy with this new motor.


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

New Propain Ekano looks really nice and you can custom build it. For me it is a dealbreaker that it only has 500 wh battery 😟


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20200247502A1/

















Is this the real next gen motor from Shimano?


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## Harryman (Jun 14, 2011)

Might be a while

https://www.cyclevolta.com/story/eb...rV-gV732EYbBS_MuUQS_SYC7SKFeEAHBE6QnvDyVcS3qU


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Harryman said:


> Might be a while
> 
> https://www.cyclevolta.com/story/ebike-components/hold-up-shimanos-new-emtb-motor/


Gist of that article is that DU-EP800 equipped models are under release/ship-hold, pending further investigation regarding the rattle sound that some early reviewers encountered. They're questioning QA in manufacturing, regarding the case cracking when the motor is stressed with the frame.

The new patented design's main feature seems to be having the battery is guided in underneath the motor, similar to the Spec Levo and Whyte E-160. The reviews for the Whyte seems to hype that the bike's weight balance is way better, making it handle better than most competitors, and Whyte themselves say that the frame weighs less, since there's less reinforcement needed to make up for a large hole for the battery.


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## NZSpokes1.0 (Sep 20, 2020)

I can confirm its great. Sooo much power.


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## NS-NV (Aug 15, 2006)

NZSpokes1.0 said:


> I can confirm its great. Sooo much power.


Can you comment on the rattle?


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

NS-NV said:


> Can you comment on the rattle?


From what I heard, it's related to the motor's method of disengaging/engaging from normal pedaling. In the past, I think it used a sprag clutch, which never completely disengaged and dragged slightly. It probably was a reason for high weight and larger size. Whatever they use now, it's supposedly a trade-off to get lower weight, lower noise, lower drag, smaller size, etc. Bosch CX gen 4 also has a similar rattle.


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## NZSpokes1.0 (Sep 20, 2020)

NS-NV said:


> Can you comment on the rattle?


Yes.

It rattles.


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## Simonns (Mar 25, 2004)

NZSpokes1.0 said:


> Yes.
> 
> It rattles.


Hey, I think I saw a post by you on another message board that you were going to put a 52 tooth ratchet in your DT swiss hub to stop the rattle. I was wondering if it worked?


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

The rattle would not bother me at all...well, not much. What would be nice is if it were quieter than the E8000 when pedaling uphill.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Flyer said:


> The rattle would not bother me at all...well, not much. What would be nice is if it were quieter than the E8000 when pedaling uphill.


It is. And less drag doing downhill.


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## The Squeaky Wheel (Dec 30, 2003)

flyer said:


> the rattle would not bother me at all...well, not much. What would be nice is if it were quieter than the e8000 when pedaling uphill.


gmafb


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## NZSpokes1.0 (Sep 20, 2020)

Simonns said:


> Hey, I think I saw a post by you on another message board that you were going to put a 52 tooth ratchet in your DT swiss hub to stop the rattle. I was wondering if it worked?


It doesnt stop the rattle at all. The buzz of the hub does now drown it out a bit though.


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## Simonns (Mar 25, 2004)

NZSpokes1.0 said:


> It doesnt stop the rattle at all. The buzz of the hub does now drown it out a bit though.


I get it. I was thinking of something more, scientific, I guess. Crank up the headphones!


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## Old & Slow (May 3, 2020)

Curious about the sound comments and wondering if it had something to do with the pedal sense? Specifically torque vs PAS. I've now had experience with two ebikes: 1) An Lectric XP with a rear hub motor and PAS, 2) A Bafang BBSHD mid-drive retrofit also with PAS.

It is my understanding that the Shimano, Bosch, et al all use torque sensing to activate the motor. I was wondering if that torque sensor is the source of the noise?

In my experience the hub motor could be heard going uphill under load and silent downhill. While the Bafang is silent all the time up or down or at least inaudible over the tire noise. I've tried to hear the Bafang and only under the quietest tire noise can I hear anything. Quite a joy, because the silence is why I ride an ebike and not a 2-stroke ICE.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

Old & Slow said:


> Curious about the sound comments and wondering if it had something to do with the pedal sense? Specifically torque vs PAS. I've now had experience with two ebikes: 1) An Lectric XP with a rear hub motor and PAS, 2) A Bafang BBSHD mid-drive retrofit also with PAS.
> 
> It is my understanding that the Shimano, Bosch, et al all use torque sensing to activate the motor. I was wondering if that torque sensor is the source of the noise?
> 
> In my experience the hub motor could be heard going uphill under load and silent downhill. While the Bafang is silent all the time up or down or at least inaudible over the tire noise. I've tried to hear the Bafang and only under the quietest tire noise can I hear anything. Quite a joy, because the silence is why I ride an ebike and not a 2-stroke ICE.


No. It has to do with the internal clutch/engagement mechanism. I suspect (but have no data to back this up) that it is a byproduct of the engineering goal to reduce motor drag in the EP8 vs the E8000.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

The Squeaky Wheel said:


> gmafb


They are very loud and I scare the wildlife. It is sad. Plus, I can't stealth it past someone.


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