# New Cree XP-G3 released!



## scar (Jun 2, 2005)

Cree Introduces the Next Generation of XLamp XPG Platform

****


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## kwarwick (Jun 12, 2004)

Nice to see continuing progress, but what I'd really like to see is XP-G3 Hi Intensity.


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

scar said:


> Cree Introduces the Next Generation of XLamp XPG Platform
> 
> ****


They bumped the current limit up to 2A. 863lm! :thumbsup:


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

kwarwick said:


> .......but what I'd really like to see is XP-G3 Hi Intensity.


I'm still amped by how nice the XP-L HI beam is with 20mm optics. An XP-G3 HI with 10mm optics...... I wonder.....


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Oh no, Vanc is getting excited lol. Cant say an HI version wouldnt be rather fun for me as well, just for different purposes. Laser beam pattern helmet light doesnt do it for me 

BTW Vanc, I got some Ledil Tina 16mm 15deg optics for the build im working on for XP-L HI. Bet with an HI version of an XP-G3 would pull the beam down around 10deg. And my 10mm optics would pull down close to 15deg from what ive been seeing. Now this has me curious to try dedoming some XP-G2 just to get an idea as to how smaller optics would look. AS if i dont have enough projects going on and you add an expiriment to my list


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

tigris99 said:


> ...BTW Vanc, I got some Ledil Tina 16mm 15deg optics for the build im working on for XP-L HI. Bet with an HI version of an XP-G3 would pull the beam down around 10deg. And my 10mm optics would pull down close to 15deg from what ive been seeing. Now this has me curious to try dedoming some XP-G2 just to get an idea as to how smaller optics would look. AS if i dont have enough projects going on and you add an expiriment to my list


Yeah, I understand the too many projects thing. I'm having a hard time getting excited about building more lights. The dual XP-L HI helmet light works so freaking well, I just don't know what more I could want. My old 6 up XPG bar light would see a nice boost with a set of these XP-G3s though.

I tried some Ledil Tinas ~6 years ago on the test stand with an XPG. At the same time I tried the Regina reflector with the XPG and went with it for a couple builds as it suited me better. I machined the Reginas down to 18.5mm diameter to keep the light almost as small as if I'd gone with the Tinas. If we ever got an emitter that made a good beam with the 10mm optics though, I'd have to start carving out a housing for the microlight version 2.


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## OwenM (Oct 17, 2012)

Might be time for a new tower module! Not likely to get mounted on a bike, but I've been sitting on a bored Surefire M3T that'll take 2xIMR18490. Runtime with high-powered incans was low, the original XP-G wasn't bright enough, and emitters with bigger dies didn't throw that well, but a XP-G3 may finally hit the sweet spot.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

You could put an xp-l hi in. Throws just like an xp-g2/3. Not sure how the lumens of xp-g3 will compare (brain is all over other stuff ATM, can't recall xp-l specs ATM)

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## OwenM (Oct 17, 2012)

Think the XP-L is 136lm/w, while this XP-G3 is 190. I should probably look at a mod with a big heat sink and multiple emitters with optics, since the towers aren't that efficient in comparison, but really don't want to spend that much on what will essentially just be a toy. I'm a several years behind on the flashlight stuff, and haven't used, or priced, these newer emitters or the optics for them, so will have to read up.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Had to look the sheets up, seems they havent updated the main page for the XP-L hi. Still says 136lm/w but the data sheet (and I checked via different bins I have here of XP-L hi) but the output is on par with the XP-L now on the higher bins.

SO output now is about the same @2A drive current (if you know where to find the high bin XP-L hi which I have only found 2 places, and not at cutter as of last check) but xp-g2 is half the price, so hopefully well see the same pricing for XP-g3.

Question lies in their ability to go over 2A vs the heat they produce compared to the XP-L hi. COuld be A LOT of fun to dedome these to make throwers. Surprised more people that do DIY lights that want insane throw dont dedome emitters to accomplish it. Works rather well. 

XP-G3 dedomed gives XP-E die size so could do some fun things with 10mm and 16mm optics. I may have to experiment with a triple emitter EDC when I can find some, see how it does. If i can get 15deg spot out of 10mm optics Im going to have some serious fun!


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## WeLight (Aug 12, 2007)

tigris99 said:


> (if you know where to find the high bin XP-L hi which I have only found 2 places, and not at cutter as of last check) but xp-g2 is half the price, so hopefully well see the same pricing for XP-g3.


We have V2 1A, ?
Cheers
Mark


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I have v5 3b sitting here (I only buy neutral white emitters, cool white is dead lol)

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OK guys started doing more digging into these. Wanted to see what actual benefits we're getting.

-Lumen output is exactly the same as XP-G2 up to 1.5A
-XP-G3 can go up to 2A
-XP-L HI is still more fitting for the "lumen whores" as its more efficient at higher currents. Over driving emitters, XP-L HI will handle it better with less heat issues. Beam pattern will remain the same as XP-G2/G3 and XP-L HI fit XP-G2/G3 optics/reflectors no problem

Now HERE is where I have found something interesting. This is where the XP-G3 comes out on top. The forward voltage (vF). XP-G2 and XP-L HI both run a higher vF at a given current than the XP-G3. By round 0.1-0.15v. 

Great for guys like me that dont waste my time doing emitters in series +1 for cells in series. 1 to 1 for me. Well everything runs on 8,4v packs for me basically. Just easier that way since i have a ton of packs from doing reviews.

So thats where the added efficiency is coming in. lower vF. Seems Cree is trying to stay ahead of Nichia now as the 219C has the output of XP-G2 S2 bin with noticeably lower vF and deals with >1.5A drive current a lot better. Now if cree could match the beautiful neutral tint that the 219C has then I will be overly impressed.


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## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

tigris99 said:


> So thats where the added efficiency is coming in. lower vF.


They increased the die size a little which lowers the Vf. It also means the beam is a little wider.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

How about Thermal resistance 3°C/W vs. previous 4°C/W ? 

This is about 25% better (more dynamic) heat sinking, if the ground and everything else supports it, of course.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

znomit said:


> They increased the die size a little which lowers the Vf. It also means the beam is a little wider.


Xp-l hi is xm-l2 die size but vF remains about the same as xp-g2.

Ya the slight change in die size would make a wider beam but real world I would be hard pressed to see a difference other than g2 and g3 side by side beam shot against a wall. So I wouldn't worry about that much.

Ledoman, ya I missed putting that detail in. Works out to more lumens per watt, so would run cooler than the xp-g2.

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ok so I will be ordering: S5 bin. 3A tint ones next week. Only a couple as the tint worries me a bit as to what it's going to look like. Usually stay 3b,c, or d.

Cree data sheet isn't showing S5 bin...think the xp-l hi just got spanked in the lower drive currents. I'll push them to 3.5A and see what happens though. Xp-l hi do it no problem without any added heat issues. My bt21 head I use for testing (custom driver inside) handles almost 2000 lumens out of them no problem. Xp-l HI v2 [email protected] 

Cross my fingers the xp-g3's dont cook themselves when I do it.

I'll report back.

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## NiteLighter (Jun 13, 2016)

Have you given the g3's a try yet? Just curious as to your results...


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

ive been sitting on them, havent had a chance to get them into anything yet. Need to soon, but I have a lot of stuff sitting here that I havent touched. TBH I m not even sure where my XP-G3 emitters are atm,lol.

PS: Just found them, were still in the padded envelope they were shipped in lol. never even opened it till tonight. Ill try to get onto finishing that project soon so I can report back.


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## NiteLighter (Jun 13, 2016)

Ah, I see... The g3s have been shown to be very resilient. They max out at 8amps before output starts falling. That is in a test setup with cooled heatsink, but it can take quite a bit of abuse before giving in. I would say 4-5amps if heqtsinked well.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Problem with trying to push emitters that hard is they become uses for this purpose. Have to make the light head far to big to get enough heat sink. And the same output with less drain from a pack can be achieved a lot more easily by using more emitters instead.

Makes over driving emitters except by a little, excluding in flashlights, almost pointless. I don't push emitters over by much if at all myself. I have one flashlight that is DD on an xp-l, goes over 4A but that's the only light I have is over driven.

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## NiteLighter (Jun 13, 2016)

Yes. I understand. I was suggesting that the G3 will hold its own with the XPL hi at3.5amps without worrying about cooking it


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya it'll put up with a lot more in that respect compared to the old version. It's nice to have an emitter with most of the performance but almost half the price of xp-l hi.

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OK figured id check back in now that i got something done with xp-g3s

I just bought an EDC host (blue S2+) so I could literally match xp-g3 up against 219C and Xp-L HI. Same host, same driver etc.

And here is what I have found:

for CRI, 219C STILL WINS! XP-L HI was barely noticeable difference against the XP-G3, the 219C was very noticeable to me at being better than both.

for lumens is pretty well tied at 1A per emitter between XP-L HI and XP-G3. within 20 lumens (across 3 emitters) of each other at 1A. Obviously the 219C comes in noticeably lower, even visually. 

SO basically if your in a low current driving application, XP-G3 is the way to go just due to price. But if your going after max lumens and want to drive them hard, XP-L HI is still the best for XPG sized applications.


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## ledoman (Apr 17, 2012)

Thanks Tig! Good to know. Do you have any impression on beam profiles? Do you think there is any visual difference between G2 na G3? I see G3 has bit wider spread, 115deg vs. 125deg viewing angle. So you might be getting about same throw (with better efficiency) and more spill compared to G2.

I see XP-G3 interesting in small tripple (or several tripple) led lights as it has 2A as specified max. current vs. 1.5A for G2, bit better efficieny and lower Vf. Including lower thermal resistance it is shurely step forward comparing to G2.

About CRI: would be good to know what cri version you have got (Cree order code would be the best). There is numerus versions up to min 90 cri. See http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED-Components-and-Modules/XLamp/Data-and-Binning/dsXPG3.pdf


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