# Self Shortened chainstays...Bad Idea?



## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

I was wondering that since i was switching to 24's would it be bad to dremmel out the horizontal dropouts to shorten the CS length? right now i am at 14.9 if i slam it. i was thinking of maybe .2 or .3 inches worth. 14.6 stays would be pretty sick for street. there would be enough room for tire clearance and also plenty of metal to keep it stable. it seems like it would be fine but i was wondering what you guys think. 
i would have someone do it for me of coarse. i have a friend who has been a welder/metal worker for many years.


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## Fox787 (Jun 2, 2005)

yes it will mess everything up your geo, not to mention all of the angles will be off


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## sittingduck (Apr 26, 2005)

As long as you are sure you won't do any structural damage, and have it done precisely, I would say go for it. Maybe ride the bike with the 24s to make sure you want to go that route beforehand? You can always router out the drops later....


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

sittingduck said:


> Maybe ride the bike with the 24s to make sure you want to go that route beforehand? You can always router out the drops later....


thats what i was thinking. 
also i was going to see how tight i could have the chain and if it is perfect without shortening it then ill leave it but if it is inbetween links in my chain (half link) i would rather shorten the dropouts then pull the wheel back... does that make sense?

also i don't think it would hurt the geo. all it would do is shorten the wheelbase.

plus check out this NS bike that they show on their own website


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## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

If you have super burly dropouts with lots of extra material... then maybe... I've heard of lots of guys cutting their dropouts to save weight or so they can slam their wheel further in. But it's certainly not something the company is going to approve of and will void your warranty.

Why would you shorten to pull your wheel back? If the chain tension looks like it'll be just about perfect when it's slammed all the way, then size the chain, pull the chain partly off on the sprocket size, join it, then turn the cranks to get the chain all the way on the sprocket.

The bike above... those cuts are soooo nasty ugly.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

XSL_WiLL said:


> Why would you shorten to pull your wheel back? If the chain tension looks like it'll be just about perfect when it's slammed all the way, then size the chain, pull the chain partly off on the sprocket size, join it, then turn the cranks to get the chain all the way on the sprocket.


thats what i was trying to explain above. if it did fit perfect i wouldn't cut into the chainstays. my current dilema with 26's is that the tire is to tall not to rub the rear triangle when it is slammed but when i add one link i changes it .3 inches. im saying if it is slammed with my 24's at 14.9 and the chain is too tight to fit on the sprocket or too loose to have slammed then i would cut the dropout until it fits perfectly slammed. wether it is .1 or .3 inches.



XSL_WiLL said:


> The bike above... those cuts are soooo nasty ugly.


i agree. it was just to show that NS isn't completely against stuff like that. they wouldn't warranty my bike but they say that the guy rides that hard and it hasn't broke. its their way of saying their stuff is strong.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

ill post a picture of my dropouts in a little bit


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## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

How tight is too tight? You could run it with the extra link for a while, wait for the chain to stretch, and then pull the link out. And then you might be able to slam it.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

thats true.. i have been running it for a month now and its a half link so it shouldn't stretch too much.

to tight is when i pulled the wheel back so the rear tire didn't touch the rear triangle and then tried to get the chain on and it was so tight the wheel wouldn't turn very well and the cassette didn't didn't rachet.

yeah ill just wait and see if it works when i get the wheelset. i am switching my gearing too. it will be 23X11. so that might change where the chain is tight in the dropouts. 
also ill have to have the chain pretty tight cause the gears are so small. any slop and it will hit my frame.


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## buckoW (Feb 7, 2007)

I did that a couple of years ago with an XS Chameloen frame. I couldn't x-up because the TT was too short so I put 24's on but then the vbrake mounts were not in the right place so I cut the dropouts to put the 24 inch wheel in the right place for the vbrake and then the back wheel was slammed. I think you can judge if there is enough room/material.


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## buckoW (Feb 7, 2007)

how about a photo of the dropouts?


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## Pastor D (May 30, 2007)

Could be bad, could be good. Try it and find out.


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## derfernerf (Jun 25, 2006)

not to be a total dick, but is .2" or .3" gonna change the bike that much to risk ****ing your frame up? i mean really, what is .2" or.3" gonna change? i say just leave it and ride it!


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

derfernerf said:


> not to be a total dick, but is .2" or .3" gonna change the bike that much to risk ****ing your frame up? i mean really, what is .2" or.3" gonna change? i say just leave it and ride it!


did you read above at all? it would depend on where the chain was tight. if the chain sat good at 14.9 then i would leave it. but if it was a little loose to have it slammed but not loose enought to take a link out then i would grind it until it fit perfect. if i left it and had to pull it back to make the chain tight then it would be more like 15.1 or 15.2. shortening it .2 or .3 would then make a hugh difference. 14.5 or 14.6 is a big difference compared to 15.1 or 15.2.

on a side note. i had posted on pink bike and kyle from transition said that he ground his Trail or Park down .5 inches. so it must not be too stupid


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## sittingduck (Apr 26, 2005)

I would LOVE to have my chainstays .3" shorter. I think it would definitely make a difference. As it's also been mentioned, it may help out with chain tension.


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## Waiting for RAD 2 (Oct 19, 2007)

I had to grind out my 20" to replace the 3/8" axle with a 14mm. I had no problems at all. I did grind a little at a time and kept a cool rag on it so I wouldn't mess with the tempering. I think it is great that you want to modify your bike. Think the Grim Reaper was done completely on the computer? Just be careful, analyse the stress and forces applied and don't go overboard. Take into consideration your safety, that is first and foremost. I have seen some cool mods, but those were all done by people with some skill and enough money and/or sponsors not to worry about screwing up.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

i have the money if i screw up the frame and i do have a very skilled metal worker friend to do it. he made me a custom snowboard rail that is 22 feet long that breaks in half and has detachable legs. very sick. i would trust him with my frame cause he has done much harder stuff then taking .3 inches out of a drop out. im still trying to find the cable to my camera so i can take a picture of it. i will tomorrow while im enjoying a lazy sunday in the snow.


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## bringdoom (Sep 1, 2007)

I drilled my dropouts on my ritual, about a half an inch. now my wheel is slammed. the bike has huge dropouts so they are still plenty strong. with the wheel slammed and the 28/12 drive train, i have great tension without a chain tug.


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## DJskeet (Oct 19, 2007)

bringdoom said:


> I drilled my dropouts on my ritual, about a half an inch. now my wheel is slammed. the bike has huge dropouts so they are still plenty strong. with the wheel slammed and the 28/12 drive train, i have great tension without a chain tug.


Hoe does that effect the disk brakes? I'd imagine it would off center them with a whole half inch but it looks good in the picture?


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## bringdoom (Sep 1, 2007)

DJskeet said:


> Hoe does that effect the disk brakes? I'd imagine it would off center them with a whole half inch but it looks good in the picture?


I only get half a pad worth of bite, and I have to run shims inbetween the calipar and frame. Im gonna fab up an adapter sometime when I get a worth while brake to see if I can get better bite, that or try a larger rotor.


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## derfernerf (Jun 25, 2006)

climbingbubba said:


> did you read above at all? it would depend on where the chain was tight. if the chain sat good at 14.9 then i would leave it. but if it was a little loose to have it slammed but not loose enought to take a link out then i would grind it until it fit perfect. if i left it and had to pull it back to make the chain tight then it would be more like 15.1 or 15.2. shortening it .2 or .3 would then make a hugh difference. 14.5 or 14.6 is a big difference compared to 15.1 or 15.2.
> 
> on a side note. i had posted on pink bike and kyle from transition said that he ground his Trail or Park down .5 inches. so it must not be too stupid


oh my bad, its more about chain tension then trying to get the shortest stays, i understand now what your saying


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

that looks pretty sweet man. i i were you i would grind all of the excess off the end too. luckily i can my disc mounts are completely adjustable. they are long ovals so you can adjust where the caliper sits. let me get a picture of the rear end so everyone can give me advice on wether to do it or not. it will be up in a little bit


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

ok here is the picture. i had to use my camera phone because my wife must have our camera in her truck at work.
it shows two things. 
1. i only have .3 i could cut out before the nuts run into the welded sections. (except my new hub coming in appears to have smaller nuts so it could slide in a little more) you can see where the current nuts hit when they are slammed by the paint missing.
2. you can see the brake mounts and how they are adjustable


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## Pastor D (May 30, 2007)

climbingbubba said:


> thats what i was thinking.
> also i was going to see how tight i could have the chain and if it is perfect without shortening it then ill leave it but if it is inbetween links in my chain (half link) i would rather shorten the dropouts then pull the wheel back... does that make sense?


Not when it ia s Suburban around $350-$400, built by riders who know what they are doing, a designed around 24"(but can be used with 26") wheels already. Just add a link to your chain...


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## bringdoom (Sep 1, 2007)

climbingbubba said:


> that looks pretty sweet man. i i were you i would grind all of the excess off the end too. luckily i can my disc mounts are completely adjustable. they are long ovals so you can adjust where the caliper sits. let me get a picture of the rear end so everyone can give me advice on wether to do it or not. it will be up in a little bit


My disc mounts are adjustable too, but only for the stock dropouts, just like yours. You will loose bite if you grind yours out.

As far as grinding off excess dropouts, I thought about it, but I might be buying a trailpimp frame off a buddy and dont want this frame to not sell because the person wants to run 26s and there isnt enough dropout to do so. also I would loose half my disc mount in the process.


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## climbingbubba (Jan 10, 2007)

oh ok, makes sense.
as for the bite im not too worried about it. as is i have to pull it in the position that is furthest away and hold it there why someone tighens it. if not the disc will rub the top of the caliper. it can drop quite a bit. i understand that yours wouldn't because you ground quite a bit off. i guess well see when i get the wheels done.
thanks for all the advice


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## sittingduck (Apr 26, 2005)

Pastor D said:


> Not when it ia s Suburban around $350-$400, built by riders who know what they are doing, a designed around 24"(but can be used with 26") wheels already. Just add a link to your chain...


That kind of attitude could lead to an awfully boring and uneventful life. Some of us like to think outside the box.


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## boyfromthelak (Feb 16, 2004)

definetly don't dremel them. as the dropouts are already machined out on the inside and it would probally cause some structural damage.

on another note if you mess it up you could always get a new 2008 capital instead


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## bbrz4 (Jun 12, 2007)

capitals are so sweet

*drool


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## bmxracer_2 (Oct 8, 2007)

A lot of different companies are buildin shorter chain stays for 24" bikes. ex. FireEye Shortfuse 360. 360mm long chain stays


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