# Check out my custom built filet-brazed rigid mtb, 1998



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Frame - 21 inch filet-brazed steel. 26" top tube. 74 degree head angle, 74.5 degree seat angle. Originally made for 71.5/74 with a Manitou Mach 5 suspension fork. The tange fork is shorter, but I've been riding the bike this way for years. At this point I'm used to the steep geometry. The wheelbase is 43.5 inches.

You can pretty much see the parts are -

Sunlite 26+ inch handlebar, 3.5" of rise.
Barracuda 1.125 quill stem, 100 mm.
Ritchey Logic threaded headset
Dean Titanium seatpost
Ithy's Titec titanium rail seat (Super comfortable, 208 grams)
Avid altimeter/cyclometer
Tektro v-brake levers/ 'Darwin' bar-end brake lever extensions
Tektro front brake, Cane Creek rear brake.
Xtr Wheelset, titanium qr skewers, Bontrager sl tubes, 95 grams.
IRC tires - Mibro/Mythos Xc
FSA titanium spindle bottom bracket

Suntour Xc Pro shifters, and a 6 speed shimano shifter on the left bar-end for remote shifting. Popping off a few gears during out of the saddle climbing is sweet and very useful. Check out the bolt on cable stop and the cable joining idea on the top tube. I can get 5 out of 9 gears from the bar-end before I have to adust the handlebar mounted shifter to tighten/loosen the cable. Being able to shift the rear derailler from 2 hand positions is something I wish I'd tried years ago. On bumpy terrain in high gears, it's a little faster/safer for me to shift the bar-end shifter with my left hand knuckles than to reach around with my right thumb for the other one.

Suntour Xc Pro crankset 20/30/32 - need to find a 94mm bcd 38 tooth.
Sram Cassette with Shimano 36 tooth cog.
Sachs Huret road front derailler, shimmed w/ 2 popsicle sticks to work with 3 rings.

Sram ESP carbon long cage derailler, 198 grams. I accidentally broke the b-tension screw/tab off the derailler so I used a spoke nipple, a small screw and some zip ties. Shifts ok, although I think the Xc Pro shifters have quite enough cable pull to deal with 9 speeds well. The 'friction' mode on these suckers still feels like indexing to me, although it's a lighter feel. Whatever works, lol.

The last time I weighed the bike it was 26.8 pounds. Since then I have upgraded a few parts and lost almost a pound in weight. The bike was built in 1998 by Bill Stevenson in Olympia, Washington. It's been through many incarnations but I've mostly done trail riding with it. I started riding it with the old mach 5, but went rigid when I got another (short travel xc suspension) frame from Bill. I've also run it as a commuter with extra wide drop bars, slicks, and a single chainring. It's most fun as a technical singletrack bike, although I do have to be alert. Geometry of 74/74/5 is no joke in the quickness department but it's 2nd nature to me now. My other bikes feel flow by comparison. 

Hope you like the pics, let me know what you think!


----------



## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

Man, you win the award for make it work no matter what, attitude, glad you're out riding that sucker! 

Who made that thing? And what's the point of the bent seat tube, if not for tire clearance, which it most obviously, is not there for....

And for what it's worth, many here may be offended by you taking so much time to post, and not getting close ups of the frame details. Junctions, drop outs, etc, we love the little things in life....


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

The curved seat tube is there to look nifty. If you asked the builder, he might say it adds a certain degree of give to the frame. It's hard to say, but for a rigid steel bike, the ride is damn smooth. It's not thin tube-serotta style supple, but the ride quality is pretty lively anyway.

The builders name is Bill Stevenson. He makes custom bikes in Olympia, Washington. Bill worked for Ross, and for Fisher back in their late 80s/early 90s heyday.

Point taken on the close-up shots. I'll take some, that's a good idea!


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Man, you win the award for make it work no matter what, attitude, glad you're out riding that sucker!


Seriously, OP, what is your inseam? That seat is way up there on a frame that isn't exactly small.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

I think my inseam is 36". I'm 6'4", and have especially long arms/legs for my height, and a somewhat short torso in my own unscientific estimation. I have some bmx cruisers and a suspension bike, but this one is my favorite ride of the quiver. It fits like a glove.


----------



## HungarianBarbarian (Jul 24, 2008)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> And what's the point of the bent seat tube, if not for tire clearance, which it most obviously, is not there for....


The bent seat tube is there because when he switched forks he increased his head angle by 2.5 degrees but only increased his seat angle by 0.5 degrees, something had to give.


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

I'm...uh....speechless.


----------



## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> And what's the point of the bent seat tube, if not for tire clearance, which it most obviously, is not there for....


I'm not sure but Schwinn has made some in the Paramount MTB and Sprint road bike.

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/172343-Schwinn-Sprint-bent-tube-info-needed

https://www.classicrendezvous.com/USA/Schwinn/Schwinn_curvd.htm


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

CS2 said:


> I'm not sure but Schwinn has made some in the Paramount MTB and Sprint road bike.


The Schwinns you posted and most other bikes with bent seat tubes are done so the rear wheel can be moved forward without hitting the seat tube. The OP's bike's rear wheel hasn't been. There is a huge gap between the wheel and tube.


----------



## Linoleum (Aug 25, 2008)

Install a 9er wheel set... BAM!


----------



## trailville (Jul 24, 2006)

Rumpfy said:


> I'm...uh....speechless.


I'm assuming that's just a temporary condition.
This is one I've been watching over the last 24 hours and the silence is hilarious.

Phoenix, you've clearly accomplished something there (both with the bike and this thread). You're thread title surely had some of these guys in full masturbatory anticipation as they clicked through, but that's not exactly what they were expecting.

You obviously have your own tastes, but Lucy, you got some splainin' to do.


----------



## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

trailville said:


> I'm assuming that's just a temporary condition.


I tried to get in and set the tone, so thanks for checking in Eric

He took the time to write it up reasonably, and hasn't gone psycho like some others of late, I'm chalking this one up as a rider, who doesn't care a wit about fashion or presentation....

Still awaiting close ups from the OP, get on it sir :thumbsup:


----------



## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Why are there three shifters on this bike?


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

chefmiguel said:


> Why are there three shifters on this bike?


It's for the third derailleur since the front derailleur has a wood shim in it.


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

I especially like how the front derailleur is attached to the bike.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Yup, you got me. I will pick function over fashion, every time. chefmiguel, the 3rd shifter connects to the cable on the top tube, so I can shift on either the bar-end, or the flat bar.
Being able to pop off a few shifts from the bar-ends on a climb is handy. I also like it because I can shift gears while standing up, makes rollers pretty fun.

I'll get some close-up shots tonight. Wait til I unveil my other super wierdo filet brazed modified bizarro bike. You guys might like it even better than this one!


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Function over fashion seems to indicate a seat tube which is aligned with the bb shell enough so that you can use functionally use a front derailleur.

Looking forward to your strange bike.


----------



## trailville (Jul 24, 2006)

phoenixbikes said:


> Yup, you got me. I will pick function over fashion, every time. chefmiguel, the 3rd shifter connects to the cable on the top tube, so I can shift on either the bar-end, or the flat bar.
> Being able to pop off a few shifts from the bar-ends on a climb is handy. I also like it because I can shift gears while standing up, makes rollers pretty fun.
> 
> I'll get some close-up shots tonight. Wait til I unveil my other super wierdo filet brazed modified bizarro bike. You guys might like it even better than this one!


Are you the "booty traps" kid from the Goonies? 
Seriously, you clearly have your own thing happening there and I for one look forward to seeing the bike you consider super wierdo bizarro. Although, if my logic is correct, that one might end up being a perfect pristine classic mtb.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

girlonbike said:


> Function over fashion seems to indicate a seat tube which is aligned with the bb shell enough so that you can use functionally use a front derailleur.
> 
> Looking forward to your strange bike.


Ok Ok, you're right. A bolt-on xt front is a ***** to find.


----------



## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

I love all the duck tape and zip ties. Reminds me of a MacGuyver episode.


Instead of a bolt-on front derailleur, check out the E-type ones. Or you can always use a braze-on road FD like I have on my Maverick Matic.


----------



## sithlord3 (Aug 12, 2007)

*.*

random stem...


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

I've never been in a situation where I've been climbing on bar ends and needed to shift so quickly and urgently that I couldn't get to my handle bars to select the gear I need in time.

Or brakes for that matter. 

If you spend that much time on your bar ends....does your bike not fit you properly?

Negative rise stem + riser bars?


----------



## trailville (Jul 24, 2006)

Rumpfy said:


> Negative rise stem + riser bars?


You're just not paying attention. The curved seat tube with no functional purpose clearly shows that this is a guy that doesn't believe the shortest distance between two points is a straight line. So why would he go the simple (and common) route of using a + rise stem with a flat bar to get to that same hand positions? I think he's being consistent. Some say why, and others say why not. He's definitely a why not kind of guy. He has a custom frame built and then finishes it with duct tape and cable ties. There is some consistency to his madness.

Check out his other thread where he made a 40t cog from an old chainring and created a 14-40 6-speed. And then look at the bike and chainring combo he's using it with. There probably is no good answer to Why? (actually a whole bunch of why?s), but I'm kinda digging what he's doing.

I still want to see that other bike.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Ahh shoot. My camera batteries are dead. Stay tuned.

Not that it matters one way or the other, but the duct taped zip tied 3rd shifter business is all stuff I did after more than 10 years of riding the bike.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Rumpfy said:


> I've never been in a situation where I've been climbing on bar ends and needed to shift so quickly and urgently that I couldn't get to my handle bars to select the gear I need in time.
> 
> Or brakes for that matter.
> 
> ...


It's not that I NEED to shift or brake from the bar-ends but I like having the options open. 
I don't NEED my full suspension bike with hydraulic disc brakes and 5 inches of travel in order to ride, but having the choice is something I like.

I started out with a longer stem, so yes I spend a fair amount of time on the bar-ends. That is just personal preference/habit though, I have plenty of reach at the handlebar as well. The bike fits better than anything else I've ever ridden, and I've gone through lots of bikes since I started mtn biking in 1987.

The stem is just something I haven't bothered to replace. It works. The length is perfect. I will get a new one at some point when I find a fork that actually fits this bike. I'd like to find an Origin 8 black ops but I think the 26" version is no longer made.

Trailville pretty much nailed it. I guess I'm a 'why not' kind of guy.


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

trailville said:


> Check out his other thread where he made a 40t cog from an old chainring and created a 14-40 6-speed. And then look at the bike and chainring combo he's using it with. There probably is no good answer to Why? (actually a whole bunch of why?s), but I'm kinda digging what he's doing.
> 
> I still want to see that other bike.


Nice use of noodle. You are quite the little engineer. Go Phoenix! Way to jury rig!


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Ya that bar-end shifter works a little better than the one in this thread in that i can shift all 6 gears without having to take up/release cable tension with the handlebar shifter. The 32/26 combo is definitely a 'sweet spot'.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Here's a side shot I found. Thought I'd share it in the meantime before I get some camera batteries. Anyone else here have a rigid bike with (really) steep geometry like this ?


----------



## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

Boy named SSue said:


> The Schwinns you posted and most other bikes with bent seat tubes are done so the rear wheel can be moved forward without hitting the seat tube.


Correct, that's one reaseon for the bent seat tube. Another possibility is clearance for a big rear tire. Someone mentioned the front derailleur was shimmed out. Surly had problems with Karate Monkey if you put a really big rear tire on. It rubbed the back of the front derailleur. Maybe the bent seat tube in conjunction with a shimmed derailleur gave them clearance for a big back tire.

Basically somebody asked a question and I tried to answer. What was your answer for the bent seat tube?


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Sweet XTR wheelset, you must have picked them up from some super-stud on craigslist.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Yes indeed..

Was it you ?


----------



## rigidftw (Mar 21, 2010)

that's a minger. don't you get yelled at in the street riding it?


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

phoenixbikes said:


> Yes indeed..
> 
> Was it you ?


Yeah buddy! If memory serves me, we met outside the Rite Aid on 29th. :thumbsup:


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

ha! You guys live in Eugene?


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

CS2 said:


> Correct, that's one reaseon for the bent seat tube. Another possibility is clearance for a big rear tire. Someone mentioned the front derailleur was shimmed out. Surly had problems with Karate Monkey if you put a really big rear tire on. It rubbed the back of the front derailleur. Maybe the bent seat tube in conjunction with a shimmed derailleur gave them clearance for a big back tire.
> 
> Basically somebody asked a question and I tried to answer. What was your answer for the bent seat tube?


For a KM that makes sense. For this bike, there is a brace between the seat stays which would prevent a large tire from being used long before the frame would become an issue. The bent tube in this case seems odd. Build with what you've got laying around, maybe?


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

girlonbike said:


> ha! You guys live in Eugene?


eugeney-weiney's all the way!


----------



## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

laffeaux said:


> For a KM that makes sense. For this bike, there is a brace between the seat stays which would prevent a large tire from being used long before the frame would become an issue. The bent tube in this case seems odd. Build with what you've got laying around, maybe?


That's another explanation.


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Sizzler said:


> Yeah buddy! If memory serves me, we met outside the Rite Aid on 29th. :thumbsup:


These wheels rock man, THANK YOU! I had them more or less rebuilt at Pauls, and they've held up pretty well under my 220+ lbs. Probably the single best upgrade I did last year.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

phoenixbikes said:


> These wheels rock man, THANK YOU! I had them more or less rebuilt at Pauls, and they've held up pretty well under my 220+ lbs. Probably the single best upgrade I did last year.


I please to aim!


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

If you know anyone locally who might have a fork that would fit this bike let me know. The a-c length on this Tange fork is 395mm, would like to get something more like 420..


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

*Unmodifed bikes are boring*

This bike has been through a number of changes in the past couple years. Carbon fork & bars, 70mm threadless stem, new remote bar-end shifter setup, ks dropper post, color mismatched cbr e-type cranks (1 red 1 purple), etc. The spider that came with the cranks was 58/110 which is silly (imho) so I modified a 58/94 Cannondale spider to work with them. The fit is quite snug and has held up to a couple of years of xc trail riding. The chainrings are 18/29/44. The 18t granny is a 9 speed cog attached to a section (cut very short) of freehub body with external threads. It's attached to the crank with a bb lockring & a cog drilled to 58mm bcd to act as a 'retainer plate'. The cog is then attached and secured with a lockring and plenty of loctite on the threads. I can post up more detailed pics if anyone is curious to see the steps involved. The 18x39 bailout gear is useful at high altitude (I live at 7000 ft in northern NM now, no longer in OR at 500 ft, ). The 18x30 and 18x34 combos get used more often.

Still putting this bike through its paces, 15 years later! It's gone through more changes than I can remember almost., drop-bar skinny tire commuter, 1x7 off-road torture rack (don't get me wrong, I love torture racks), 3x8 touring bike, etc.

The handling is not quite as fast with the longer a-c fork (425mm) but the bike was originally designed around a 413mm fork so I'm in the ballpark. Not having to worry about timing my pedal strokes just right in rocky terrain is great.


----------



## tductape (Mar 31, 2008)

Stevenson makes some great bikes. 

Was this made to your specs bitd?


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Yes, it sure was. I knew this bike was right for me within 15 ft. The night I picked it up, there was a rather large snowdrift in the parking lot of the bike shop, at the bottom of the ramp. It was a natural fit, within feet!


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

phoenixbikes said:


> Not having to worry about timing my pedal strokes just right in rocky terrain is great.


That's one of the thrills of mountain biking. 

I don't get the seat tube but it's an interesting looking bike. Of course more pictures are more fun.

Keeping a bike relevant to your use through all these years is great. 7000 feet at NM must be fun as hell. Ever feel like throwing up some trails pics, please do!


----------



## phoenixbikes (Sep 24, 2010)

Probably not what you had in mind, but here's a recent shot. The 1st one is at the top of a pass I ride once in awhile during the summer. Riding singletrack on a skibike is a bit more 'technical' than riding a skibike on a slope where there's plenty of room for carving turns in order to slow down. Riding the same trail on a skibike, and then later on a mtn bike is a study in contrasts.  It's hard to see on these pics (camera phone only ) but I rigged a dh ski binding so that it's brake arms can be activated with a regular brake cable by pulling on the (v-brake) handlebar lever. The brake works decently on hardpack snow, in deep powder there's no need. 

The other pics here are at the top of Tesuque Peak, above Santa Fe. The elevation is 12,000 ft, and the other nearby peaks are a bit taller. There's a grueling jeep road climb to the top which goes up about 3000 ft in less than 7 miles. There are several other options off the peak, most of which are rocky and steep. Having an 18x39 bailout gear is extra cool when my lungs and legs are burning at high elevation. :thumbsup:


----------

