# Take off, eh



## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

Thinking aboot this over turkey last night... I've seen people who have a Brodie or two, or a small bunch of Ro-Mos, but...

Who in the world has the best collection of Canadian mountain bikes? 

What's the best collection you've ever seen?


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Jimbotoad.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

mainlyfats said:


> What's the best collection you've ever seen?


Best collections seen in person or in general?

I could rattle of a list easy.


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Best collection of Canadian bikes? I can't think of many. The Shark has a number of beauts though.

My collection is made up of a Moulden and a Weasel, so not that great.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

I have 2 original Syncros posts.:thumbsup:


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

Rumpfy said:


> Best collections seen in person or in general?
> 
> I could rattle of a list easy.


Ooooh. In general I guess.

Feel free, either in this thread or via PM. I promise not to harass - this isn't about a personal bike-quest thing.


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## First Flight (Jan 25, 2004)

Out of our entire collection, as close as we get is the Team Chance Fat and Rocky Mtn. Ritchey.......neither of them are really desirable. Kinda sad.


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## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

First Flight said:


> Team Chance Fat.


Teachable moment. I'm clueless. Fat Chance had bikes made in Canada at some point, or am I misunderstanding?


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Offshore bikes made for the Canadian market. A dark but short chapter in Fat Chance history.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

bushpig said:


> Best collection of Canadian bikes? I can't think of many. The Shark has a number of beauts though.
> 
> My collection is made up of a Moulden and a Weasel, so not that great.


If you didn't occasionally mention your Moulden, I don't think I'd have ever heard of them. Weasel is new to me too.

West Coast bikes? Have these folks gone on to other lines of work?


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

No shame in not knowing the Weasel. It is an ugly bike. The dog looks disapproving.


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

I`ve got a bunch of bikes made for the Canadian market, but nothing too exciting.  I`ve seen great collections of antique Canadian bikes, but not mountain bikes...


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## bagpipes (Feb 3, 2007)

I have a bunch of Rocky's. 80's-90's


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## Jupke (Mar 14, 2007)

This guy is certenly trying to get there  http://www.retrorocky.de/40555.html


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

I'm more into their lumber than their bikes...plus, their people are really great too. I hope y'all had a great Thanksgiving.


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## tductape (Mar 31, 2008)

girlonbike said:


> I'm more into their lumber than their bikes...plus, their people are really great too. I hope y'all had a great Thanksgiving.


Agreed, 
Canadians are very hospitable. And their small ski areas (forget Whistler/blackcomb for now) Apex, Red, Furnie, etc..... I couldn't tell ya how many long weekend road trips I have spent in Canada falling for their women and stirring up their powder....


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

A Wedge is probably at the top of my list right now.


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

I'd like to collect a Cameron (sp?) please


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Oh wait. they have ORTs.  That's on my list. A vintage one, that is.


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Shayne said:


> I'd like to collect a Cameron (sp?) please


They guy I sold mine to just sent me an email and said he still loves it! :thumbsup:


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Pic, BP?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

Jupke said:


> This guy is certenly trying to get there  http://www.retrorocky.de/40555.html


Wow. That's a lot of shipping...


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> Wow. That's a lot of shipping...


lol.:thumbsup:


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

*Early adopters*

So... MTBs from 1989 and prior in Canada:

Rocky Mountain
Kona/Cascade
Brodie
Cameron
ORT
Moulden (just)

Norco
Miele
I bet there was a Gardin or two...

Anyone else? Allo Quebec?


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

nevermind.. prior to 89.


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## IF52 (Jan 10, 2004)

This thread sucks. Why aren't there more pictures than just that ugly RM?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

IF52 said:


> This thread sucks. Why aren't there more pictures than just that ugly RM?


I wish I had a picture of a Cameron. I had a stem/bar one-piece combo that tightened from below - they came with their own tool - that I gave to a friend.

He's been riding them on his commuter for about 18 years.


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

Fiori, (and the Canadian Nishiki`s) Concorde, Aquila...


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

MERK26 said:


> Fiori, (and the Canadian Nishiki`s) Concorde, Aquila...


Hmm.... Was Fiori made for a retailer buying group? I remember seeing a bunch of those bikes, but not that early. Decent enough bikes, indistinguishable from Mieles if I recall correctly.

What's a Canadian Nishiki? The only Nishiki's I can think of from that era were the International touring bikes everyone seemed to have (if they didn't have a Miyata 1000).

Concorde - or was it Veltec? - gave us the Canadian "Team Fat Chance" in the 90's and I can vaguely remember a lugged bike with SIS that might fit the bill. Anyone got evidence?

Aquila is Bloor Cycle, right? I don't think they were in the MTB game then, but would happily stand corrected.


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## sansarret (Mar 17, 2006)

mainlyfats said:


> So... MTBs from 1989 and prior in Canada:
> 
> ...Anyone else? Allo Quebec?


1980'S Mikado from Quebec were cool, Quality mountain bikes with rollercam brakes and all.


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

mainlyfats said:


> Hmm.... Was Fiori made for a retailer buying group? I remember seeing a bunch of those bikes, but not that early. Decent enough bikes, indistinguishable from Mieles if I recall correctly.


Fiori was an early Norco distributed line. They sold mainly road bikes under that lable, but they also made some nice lugged Mountain bikes...as early as 84. They continued into the late 80`s/early 90`s. There was an elevated stay bike too...

The Nishikis...again distributed by Norco. Nice bikes that were pretty much the same as the early Norcos, but with some interesting differences.
I`ve just built up mine, it`s a "Conquest". Interesting in that it`s branded Nishiki, but has a "Made by Norco" decal.

I don`t know who made the FC but both Aquila and Concorde were sold through "Racer Sportif" (Toronto & London). I can`t say as a fact they were making them before 89 (i.e: I don`t actually have one myself) but I do have 90(ish) models of both bikes, and I`ve seen older Concordes. Although these were "house brand" bikes, some of them were pretty nice.


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

Now I`m doubting myself...were Concorde mountain bikes sold in the U.S.? Now I`m thinking only Aquila was their house brand...


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Nishiki Caribou, 1981, production mountain bike a YEAR before the stumpjumper. Black painted Tange Mangalloy (Mangenese Molydenum alloy, essentially the same alloy as reynolds used for their 531 tubeset) frame and fork, ukai alloy rims, Suzue sealed cartridge bearing hubs, Suntour micro-shift thumbshifters, DiaCompe alloy cantilever brakes, 15 speed drivetrain. I bought one used from its original owner in hmmmm, 1993, all complete except for a blown rear tire. I overhauled it and resold it in 1994. I've owned so many old rockies its hard to keep count anymore, and that TeamFatChance that FF has in their collection may have possibly made it to the states from me as I two or three of them to yankees in the late 90s/early-2000s period and shipped them off thanks to the wonders of the internet. Breezer incidently had a couple canada-only models as we were one market the brand was still selling well in, during the mid-90s. The Breezer Sky for example. Let's see, Raleigh Canada had different atb models than Raleigh USA, there was Off Road Toad, Cove Bikes, Balfa and their subsequent step-kids (Xprezo and Doberman), Marinoni had mountain frames, Billy Goat (which was a defunct brand of frames made for a local store by Marinoni, since replaced by their Eclipse brand), also oh Devinci which is still around. Then we have Dekerf and True North and Peyto. Ummm, oh Northstar was another one. 

I have an early 80s Mikado Kamikaze in my someday - i'll - restore collection. I have four rocky mountains from the original ownership days (84 FCF, 87 Turbo, 88 Thunderbolt, 91 Stratos) and one recent (2008 Solo 70CR). I also have a Hutsebaut CX frame of unknown exact age but the brand only existed from 84 to 93. It actually rides very well. I also have a Oryx Team XC frame from near the end of the brand's history, several Eclipses (a canada-only distributed brand belonging to a local shop), and anytime I want a Bertrand mtb frame I just need pop over to the store in hull where they still have several frames hanging with a decade of dust on them. Oh another more recent canadian brand I have an example of is Steelwool (which is internationally distributed and even dirtrag reviewed) and locally owned by a couple friends of mine. I'm hoping to get one of their new locally handmade mtb frames next year.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

MERK26 said:


> Now I`m doubting myself...were Concorde mountain bikes sold in the U.S.?


Well Concorde was a European brand. I remember drooling over a friend's Concorde Squadra road bike - the first road bike I'd ever seen with the little nubs for mounting your number.

Like many others though, they may have sold rights to different markets.


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

DeeEight said:


> Nishiki Caribou, 1981, production mountain bike a YEAR before the stumpjumper.


Wow, that`s cool. Ever seen a way to substantiate that? Maybe a catalog reference? What was the build like?

Oh... and didn`t the Stumpjumper come out in late 1981?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

MERK26 said:


> Wow, that`s cool. Ever seen a way to substantiate that? Maybe a catalog reference? What was the build like?
> 
> Oh... and didn`t the Stumpjumper come out in late 1981?


Interesting. Are you saying this was a Canadian (i.e. Norco) built Nishiki that pre-dates the Stumpjumper? Or was it sourced from Japan for the Canadian market?


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

mainlyfats said:


> Interesting. Are you saying this was a Canadian (i.e. Norco) built Nishiki that pre-dates the Stumpjumper? Or was it sourced from Japan for the Canadian market?


The early Nishiki`s (Norco) I`ve seen (and own) are Japanese. They were Kawamura built. Earliest I`ve ever seen is about 83 though...


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## mechagouki (Nov 30, 2007)

Aemmer said:


> I couldn't tell ya how many long weekend road trips I have spent in Canada falling for their women and stirring up their powder....


I fell so hard I emigrated!

I have the aforementioned (and generally disliked ) RM Ritchey, a battered Brodie Catalyst and an '87 RM Hammer. Didn't buy them 'cause they were Canadian though.


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## ShiverDC (Mar 6, 2008)

mainlyfats said:


> So... MTBs from 1989 and prior in Canada:
> 
> Rocky Mountain
> Kona/Cascade
> ...


I ran across an 89 Moulden yesterday :eekster: .. hopefully the guy sells (frame was cracked and re-brazed)


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

girlonbike said:


> Pic, BP?


I'll snap one next time I visit him. It looks like an ARC, kinda.


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Jim started building mountain bikes way before 89. I recall seeing his bikes in 86 at least.


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

bushpig said:


> I'll snatch it next time I visit him.


Good plan
thanks!


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

mainlyfats said:


> So... MTBs from 1989 and prior in Canada:
> 
> Rocky Mountain
> Kona/Cascade
> ...


Marinnoni?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

mainlyfats said:


> Ooooh. In general I guess.
> 
> Feel free, either in this thread or via PM. I promise not to harass - this isn't about a personal bike-quest thing.


Oh not at all. I didn't think thats what you were doin'.

FFB, Cycleshark, Monkey Wrench, and Black Mountain...all shops with pretty stacked collections.

Several of the older vrc 'regulars' that have been doing this for a while.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

bushpig said:


> Jim started building mountain bikes way before 89. I recall seeing his bikes in 86 at least.


Ah - OK - so Hardcore started in 1989... Got it.


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

mainlyfats said:


> Ah - OK - so Hardcore started in 1989... Got it.


Yea, I was there when it started. That place smelled so good with all the sausages. Before that Jim was in a warehouse on 50th st.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

bushpig said:


> Yea, I was there when it started. That place smelled so good with all the sausages. Before that Jim was in a warehouse on 50th st.


I found this list of other Edmonton-based frame builders - can you add?

Moulden
Proctor-Townsend (looks like they might have made some early MTBs)
Arvon (No MTBs I'm guessing - but holy crap! http://www.girlsandbicycles.ca/2010/09/arvon-cygnet.html )
Peyto (c. 2001-2006 - too late)
Moose ?


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Arvon made mountain bikes. Cool hubs too.


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Also, before Proctor townsend there was Proctor.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

*Running Tally*

MTBs from 1989 and prior from Canada:

Top shelf:
Rocky Mountain (some models)
Kona/Cascade (ditto)
Brodie 
Cameron
ORT
Moulden
Arvon
Proctor-Townsend (or just Proctor)
Marinoni (There's at least one claimed 1987 bike on mtbr - it looks awesome)
Bertrand (Really? That early? Surely Cycles Bertrand was a real roadie shop back then...)
Gardin

Blue collar (at the time) or Canadian division only:
Norco/Nishiki/Fiori
Concorde (I personally think Aquila as a brand is later than 1989)
Miele
Mikado
Peugeot
CCM
Raleigh
Steve Bauer

Could you buy a Thin Blue Line from Silent Sports in 1989? Not sure... Kinda doubt it.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

bushpig said:


> Jimbotoad.


I think I sold him a RoMo Fat City Flyer. His is a pretty unique story...


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

bagpipes said:


> I have a bunch of Rocky's. 80's-90's


Double U-braked Team Blizzard? (My favoUrite production bike of all time...)

Do you have a family shot?


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

mainlyfats said:


> MTBs from 1989 and prior from Canada:
> 
> Top shelf:
> Rocky Mountain (some models)
> ...


Not so sure about your "blue collar" categorizing for some of those bikes...at lot of that depends on the year and bikes. I figure that "bike store" bikes that were $750.00+ in the mid 80`s were as good as it got (for a production bike).

Also, if you`re throwing in department/hardware store bikes (like the CCM`s of the time) you probably should include Supercycle (Canadian Tire), North Country (Eatons), and Vagabond (Home Hardware),...not that they were any good, but just saying 

You`re right about Silent Sports, but wrong about Aquila...I`m pretty sure they were available before 89...


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

MERK26 said:


> Not so sure about your "blue collar" categorizing for some of those bikes...at lot of that depends on the year and bikes. I figure that "bike store" bikes that were $750.00+ in the mid 80`s were as good as it got (for a production bike).
> 
> Also, if you`re throwing in department/hardware store bikes (like the CCM`s of the time) you probably should include Supercycle (Canadian Tire), North Country (Eatons), and Vagabond (Home Hardware),...not that they were any good, but just saying
> 
> You`re right about Silent Sports, but wrong about Aquila...I`m pretty sure they were available before 89...


It's the age old vrc debate, eh? This is in, but this is out... Feel free to cut and paste as I'm way more interested in building a resource than making a proclamation. :thumbsup:


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## MERK26 (Aug 31, 2009)

mainlyfats said:


> It's the age old vrc debate, eh? This is in, but this is out... Feel free to cut and paste as I'm way more interested in building a resource then making a proclamation. :thumbsup:


Makes me happy to see some else gives a damn! :thumbsup: 
I heard back from the guys at Racer...they`ve been selling Aquila since 1985, so they make the cut...


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

bushpig said:


> No shame in not knowing the Weasel. It is an ugly bike. The dog looks disapproving.


Is that bottom bracket really, really high or is that just how it looks in the pic?


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> I think I sold him a RoMo Fat City Flyer. His is a pretty unique story...


i think the guy still has it! further pictures and details at 11...


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

as promised, here's the bike in question- i do still have it. even has a made in canada serratus seat pack! one of the few bikes i have that fit the 'tighter' criteria of being canadian and pre-1989. not that many out there and certainly not that high a caliber, worthy of these pages? brodie and toad didn't start until 1986, rocky didn't get going with their hand-builts till later in the 80s, as well, being they used/copied the ritchey formula of offering 'affordable' bikes made in japan and offering a limited number of hand-builts for that market. even here in vancouver-town, there's not a ton of higher-end bikes/frames from before 1990 floating around. those roots and rocks made for a high casualty rate!

the fiori name brings back fond memories. it was indeed a 'boutique' brand for norco to separate the higher quality/spec line of bikes from those with the regular norco label, as norco had been to that time, primarily associated and marketed as low-to-mid-end bikes that started back with the 70s multi-speed bicycle boom. the year was 1985 and my buddy had been beating the snot out of his '81 stumpy for 4 years, so offroad riding intrigued me, having been a road racer previously, as well as a backpacker/hiker. anyhow, it was down to the top model san remo from fiori with shimano deer/stag head group or the kuwahara sierra grande, their top offering. affordability steered me to the fiori and that was the start of a great hobby/lifestyle that would take me to places like moab, durango, sedona, page, marin county, etc. the second picture is a scan of an old photo of the fiori during my late spring mtn bike assault of alouette mountain, an hour out of vancouver. hike-a-bike was the order for about 45 minutes to get to the peak. ahhh, to be young and stupid...again!

i'll add another post going into more detail with the rest of my cajun cycles. can con at its best!


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## MessagefromTate (Jul 12, 2007)

DeeEight said:


> Nishiki Caribou, 1981, production mountain bike a YEAR before the stumpjumper. Black painted Tange Mangalloy (Mangenese Molydenum alloy, essentially the same alloy as reynolds used for their 531 tubeset) frame and fork, ukai alloy rims, Suzue sealed cartridge bearing hubs, Suntour micro-shift thumbshifters, DiaCompe alloy cantilever brakes, 15 speed drivetrain. I bought one used from its original owner in hmmmm, 1993, all complete except for a blown rear tire. I overhauled it and resold it in 1994. I've owned so many old rockies its hard to keep count anymore, and that TeamFatChance that FF has in their collection may have possibly made it to the states from me as I two or three of them to yankees in the late 90s/early-2000s period and shipped them off thanks to the wonders of the internet. Breezer incidently had a couple canada-only models as we were one market the brand was still selling well in, during the mid-90s. The Breezer Sky for example. Let's see, Raleigh Canada had different atb models than Raleigh USA, there was Off Road Toad, Cove Bikes, Balfa and their subsequent step-kids (Xprezo and Doberman), Marinoni had mountain frames, Billy Goat (which was a defunct brand of frames made for a local store by Marinoni, since replaced by their Eclipse brand), also oh Devinci which is still around. Then we have Dekerf and True North and Peyto. Ummm, oh Northstar was another one.
> 
> I have an early 80s Mikado Kamikaze in my someday - i'll - restore collection. I have four rocky mountains from the original ownership days (84 FCF, 87 Turbo, 88 Thunderbolt, 91 Stratos) and one recent (2008 Solo 70CR). I also have a Hutsebaut CX frame of unknown exact age but the brand only existed from 84 to 93. It actually rides very well. I also have a Oryx Team XC frame from near the end of the brand's history, several Eclipses (a canada-only distributed brand belonging to a local shop), and anytime I want a Bertrand mtb frame I just need pop over to the store in hull where they still have several frames hanging with a decade of dust on them. Oh another more recent canadian brand I have an example of is Steelwool (which is internationally distributed and even dirtrag reviewed) and locally owned by a couple friends of mine. I'm hoping to get one of their new locally handmade mtb frames next year.


Please get something new, then we can welcome you to the modern world. 1992 ended a looong time ago, but I'll throw in a bag of razors for your efforts! Is your P.O. Box at the local Tim Hortons? :thumbsup:


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

babbalanja said:


> Is that bottom bracket really, really high or is that just how it looks in the pic?


I think the bb is pretty high and the effect is exaggerated by the 24 inch wheels.


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

this thread got me to wondering exactly what did i have in canadian bikes, especially being that b.c. bikes are what i try to concentrate on, so i did an inventory and this is where i seem to be, right now;

1.	88 TOAD FBrazed TEAM GRN
2. 92TOAD MY ORIGINAL TEAM GRN
3.	94 TOAD DK GRN
4.	94 TOAD BLK
5.	88 BRODIE ROMAX FRAME FB MUSTARD YELLOW
6.	89 BRODIE CLIMAX METALLIC JADE/MOSS
7.	90 BRODIE CATALYST, DARK BLUE
8.	90 BRODIE CATALYST LAVENDER/PRPL
9.	91 BRODIE CATALYST GRN FRAME
10.	89 BRODIE CLIMBAX FRAME
11.	91 BRODIE SOVEREIGN DK GRN
12.	93 BRODIE CATALYST FRAME
13.	93 BRODIE RODIE FRAME/FORK
14. 94 BRODIE EXPRESSO FRAME/GATORBLADE
15.	95 BRODIE LIBIDO
16.	90-ish BRODIE LIGHT BEAM
17.	91 DEKERF with colour-matched mag-20s
18.	89 KONA EXPLOSIF
19.	84 ROCKY MTN FAT CITY FLYER
20.	89 RM STRATOS
21.	89 RM AVALANCHE
22.	90 RM SUMMIT
23.	91 RM EXPERIENCE
24.	91 RM EXPERIENCE(ANOTHER)
25.	91 RM CIRRUS
26.	91 RM CIRRUS FRAME
27.	91 RM EQUIPE(?)FACTORY CHROMED FRAME
27.5 92 RM BLIZZARD
28.	92 RM STRATOS
29.	92-ish RM TEAM COMP
30.	93 RM THIN AIR
31.	93 RM THIN AIR FRAME
32.	96 RM ALTITUDE T.O.
33.	FWIW…89 NISHIKI TIMBUK II…ALL ORIGINAL, XT
34.	NOT REALLY ‘VINTAGE’ OR MTB, BUT ‘TIS CDN…2001 CERVELO PRODIGY- HAS SYNCROS REVOLUTION RD CRANKS. GORGEOUS BIKE/FRAME, OR SO I’M TOLD BY FRIENDS WHO HAVE RIDDEN IT…

that makes 34 mountain bikes/frames- boy, that was a wake-up call/surprise!? funny how the number creeps up and whacks you on the back of the head like that! the scary thing is, i think there's more bikes out in the world i don't have yet- and that's just local!

anyhow, something to chew on. as mentioned in my reply to mainlyfats, only a few fit the pre '89 criteria, but i think the most important bikes to come out of this great white north didn't really show up until the early 90s, my 'happy place'/era. 

p.s. sorry about the caps for the list. i'll spin more yarn in another episode- 'the method to the madness'! go out there and ride, dag nabbit! ;o)


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

there is a lot of real estate there to place 34 bikes.:thumbsup:


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

colker1 said:


> there is a lot of real estate there to place 34 bikes.:thumbsup:


lots of real estate, yes, but none of it's mine. all my money is tied up in bikes!! ;o)


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

colker1 said:


> there is a lot of real estate there to place 34 bikes.:thumbsup:


lots of real estate, yes, but none of it's mine. all my money is tied up in bikes!! ;o)


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

jimbotoad said:


> this thread got me to wondering exactly what did i have in canadian bikes, especially being that b.c. bikes are what i try to concentrate on, so i did an inventory and this is where i seem to be, right now;
> 
> 1.	88 TOAD FBrazed TEAM GRN
> 2. 92TOAD MY ORIGINAL TEAM GRN
> ...


You just let me know if items 5 through 16 are getting in your way... Nice to be back in touch, jimbotoad!


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

*Vancouver*

Anyone with intel about small Vancouver builders we haven't touched on yet?


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## sansarret (Mar 17, 2006)

mainlyfats said:


> Anyone with intel about small Vancouver builders we haven't touched on yet?


UFO


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## tductape (Mar 31, 2008)

sansarret said:


> UFO


Been waiting patiently for your input in this thead..
Cheers,
Tim


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

sansarret said:


> UFO


Can you help a brother out? A little history... A picture or two?


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## sansarret (Mar 17, 2006)

mainlyfats said:


> Can you help a brother out? A little history... A picture or two?


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

jimbotoad said:


> this thread got me to wondering exactly what did i have in canadian bikes, especially being that b.c. bikes are what i try to concentrate on, so i did an inventory and this is where i seem to be, right now;
> 
> 1.	88 TOAD FBrazed TEAM GRN
> 2. 92TOAD MY ORIGINAL TEAM GRN
> ...


Pics please!


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

as req.'d, a few pics. these first two bikes are brodies, a 1990 catalyst in dark steely blue and what turns out to actually be a june 4, 1987-built romax frame with briefly-used internal cable routing on the top tube.

the cat. is pretty much all original, as purchased by the original owner. he did have it repainted to the present colour, but otherwise, it's as he bought it/had it built. the wear on those parts would indicate it hasn't seen anything much more radical than the stanley park seawall, but regardless, it's been maintained meticulously. look at those welds...

the romax i got from the second owner and is a very early brodie creation. i've got some thinnin' to do, bubba, as far as parts selection, as i'm a fan of 'period-correct', by the year, that is, resto'ing. i know that's another thread that's floating out there, so i won't dwell on it. the fillet brazing of the frame and fork is tasty and it's in decent shape despite years of hard use. that'll been a fun/interesting project, i ever get to it...

i'll post a couple bikes a day/every couple, as opportunity allows. i sure hope you enjoy'em as much as i do! bombs away...!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

lets see the ORT's


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> You just let me know if items 5 through 16 are getting in your way... Nice to be back in touch, jimbotoad!


short a few brodies? no plans to 'thin the herd' just yet, as i do have 'doubles', but i might trade for a ken dryden and guy lafleur rookie card! ;o) i need'em to clip to my frames so they can flap on the spokes!


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

hollister said:


> lets see the ORT's


2nd'ed!


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> 2nd'ed!


now, now, lads, don't you know when it comes to toads, good things come to those who wait and patience is a virtue and...? what's all the excitement about ORTs? i guess that's the problem with not being here, in vancouver- toads are relatively common- here, where beer flows like wine and beautiful women instinctively flock like salmon to capistrano, yes, vancouver!

okay, i was going to wait and get a few of these lesser, 'boring', garden variety brodies and rockys out of the way, but i'm fair. i'll throw you a bone. it's my most customized toad, though it needs the most work. it was relegated to a 'girl friend' bike when i saved it from the original owner. it's a '94 and it had been well-used and had a mixture of decent parts- race face cranks, nukeproof rear hub with ringle bubba purple front hub, syncros parts, flyte ti saddle, xt drivetrain, fwiw, a rock shox indly sl, but the cherry on the whipped cream is/was the profile 'comfort' stem and equally comfort-able high-rise bars, making for the perfect riding position in most trail conditions!! pics are as i got it. laugh, cringe, but that's all yer getting toad-wise, for now. no more toads til you eat all your vegetables on your plate. oh, the bike is took apart and a minor micro dent filled and smoothed by chris dekerf, but as yet, not colourized.

other two bikes are both mostly stock, original 92 rm blizzard and 89 kona explosif- the one that didn't get painted black!

'til the next installment...cheerios!


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jimbotoad said:


> i guess that's the problem with not being here, in vancouver- toads are relatively common- here, where beer flows like wine and beautiful women instinctively flock like salmon to capistrano, yes, vancouver!


Big gulps huh? Welp, see ya later!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

not what I was hoping for


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## elpuro (Oct 21, 2010)

That dog cracks my ass up! He's thinking to himself "WTF? who would ride that thing"


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

hollister said:


> not what I was hoping for


oh, man, didn't you read the text i so carefully typed with the shots? it's all about build up. if i put up the toads first, then you'll be loitering in the parking lot, wondering where to go next. i purposely put up the junky one first to fulfill the request with the intentions of getting a few non-toads up before posting what i guess a few folks is drooling for. now you're going to have to clean your room before i post'em! oh, and i was kidding about how common toads are, even here, in the pond from whence they were hatched. not many out there to begin with, as i'm sure you know. nothing a trip to their website wouldn't fix! ;o)

i intend on throwing a set of accu-trax fork on this decrepit one and fresh beautiful parts worthy of the marque after new paint. too many projects for a fixed income!


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## rhett101 (Apr 17, 2004)

*Cheers!*

Jimbo,

Good to see you back in action. It has been quite a while. Your collection of Canadian steel is impressive. I am happy all those bikes are in good hands.

PS: Here's a shot of the DeKerf.


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

hey rhett! ditto. got through leukemia last year(like being paralyzed isn't enough!) and now it's a blood clot in my leg. last year was 4 months in bed, 24/7- not cool when you're brain still works, but your body doesn't. once i'm up in my chair, i hit the ground rolling.

generation looks awesome still. good thing i didn't keep the frame. that'd broke my bank giving it a great build like you did. steel is still real!


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

since i'm here, might as well post a couple more canadian bikes. the '90 catalyst might be familiar, but the '89 rm avalanche is 'new'. more tomorrow, maybe even a toad?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

jimbotoad said:


> since i'm here, might as well post a couple more canadian bikes.


I MUST HAVE ONE! 89 Avalanche or Team Blizzard - aesthetically, they are just the height of mountain bikes for me. That whole near-mixte thing just gets me where I live.


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## xy9ine (Feb 2, 2005)

jimbotoad said:


> what's all the excitement about ORTs? i guess that's the problem with not being here, in vancouver- toads are relatively common- here, where beer flows like wine and beautiful women instinctively flock like salmon to capistrano, yes, vancouver!


while i may agree with you on the latter part of the comment, i've been looking for a toad here for years, to no avail. those that have them, tend to cling. greedy bastards.

were you racing here in the late 80's / early-mid 90's? was a pretty cool scene. were you racing for team toad?


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

xy9ine said:


> while i may agree with you on the latter part of the comment, i've been looking for a toad here for years, to no avail. those that have them, tend to cling. greedy bastards.
> 
> were you racing here in the late 80's / early-mid 90's? was a pretty cool scene. were you racing for team toad?


yah, i was being just a bit facetious on the supply of toads- here or anywhere and the dumb and dumber quote didn't help, but, indeed, not many to go around at all and, yes, those that gots them, tend to cling to them!

i never raced mtbs ever, but i did road race in the early 80s. a buddy, who got into offroading early with his 81 or 82 stumpy got me into it, did race on seymour/cypress in the 'western canadian mtn bike championships' back in the late 80s and won the hillclimb and the downhill in the expert class, but missed the xc due to work or some other commitments, so no overall victory! i was definitely fit enough, but i just always rode offroad strictly for fun .

i got my first toad in 1990, that had the early toad character logo, but that got stolen and i bit the bullet and spent big coin on a new one in '92 and had it built up with the 'new' xtr group and mag 20 shock. syncros everything else. i still have the receipt/invoice! that second one got stolen in 1997, but miraculously- more like a lot of work getting the word out at area shops, etc- it was back in my hands in 3 weeks. big thanks went to a shop owner i had spoken with when i went on my poster-distributing rampage- not too many toads, so when it showed up, he noticed. won't ever happen again!

speaking of racing, i still have 2 toad lycra jerseys, one blue and one black- the blue one was never worn and still has the sugoi tag! still have a couple toad tees, a coffee mug and water bottles...i just try to live up to my name, grooving on all things ORT...


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## RMB-PM (Apr 24, 2009)

Anyone got a Coggs? From Calgary I think, remember them being around the western Canadian race scene in early 90's?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

sansarret said:


>


What has become of Toby Schillinger? Is Toby's Cycle Works still open?


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

sunday installment leading out with my '91 dekerf with matching mag 20 fork. don't worry, super-cool fender has been removed since the pics were taken. as the bike currently hangs from the ceiling over my computer, it's tough to get someone to take it down to take pics. them bar ends have to go, too...super cool early chris dekerf 'solo work'.

second and third are part of the coveted toad hoard. my '92 i had built new. the pics are from when it was 6 months old. they are scans of old photos, so not razor sharp. i do need to take more updated pics, though it hasn't changed much and i'm in-kleined to get it back to 'as purchased' spec. i have the original parts that i had updated- shifter/brakes, cantis, but not the seat. all xtr and syncros bits.

third is the 94 toad i have that as is i received it. definitely retro-spec with bear traps, thumbies, xt732 front derailleur, ti post and bb, pulstar rear hub and xt732 front hub. xt 737(?) rear derailleur and good old ringle cage. even has a mavic needle-bearing headset. riser bars could use a change...

next stop, the 'good one'...


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

*88 ORT fillet brazed*

here's the last toad. the oldest one, but newest to me. got it this past easter after first seeing it 5 years previously. everything is original as i got it except the newer gel-ier seat was replaced with an nos avocet racing II and an offshore purple ano'd seatpost qr was replaced with an nos suntour xc unit. otherwise, the only non-1988 ish part on it are the spd pedals. that paint is original and has nary a scratch or chip on the chainstay.

gooder-spec are the bonty forks, grove stem, ird post, and 105 hubs so that it could run a 7-speed rear end when off road spec was limited to 6 speed for shimano and suntour. all the braze-ons you could need back then- pump peg, hite rite, chain hanger and fenders. a great example of an early toad.

i have a number of other canadian bikes, but mostly aluminum beer can bikes from rocky. i can post a pic of the 91 rm summit in all its twin downtube goodness when i dig it out and get pics took.

my new old toad...





































anyhow, that's what a fillet-brazed toad looks like, in case you're wondering! ;O)


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

That is how a toad should look. VEry nice.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

very cool


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Indeed. That '88 is super cool


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

I don't think I've ever seen a Toad in the flesh. You'd think that some would have come straight over to Toronto back in the day...

Awesome bikes jimbotoad.


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

thanks, mf. i was actually speaking with rod on saturday while in vancouver and he told me, that of the 150 frames he ever had made, almost a third of them went to europe! 150 frames, with say, a 20 percent casualty/attrition rate from catastrophic damage, wear-and-tear, neglect, etc and that doesn't leave a lot of original toads in existence. even the number ever made is a drop in the bucket for other notable hand-builders in usa, canada, etc. i'm not sure how many toads made it back east, of the 100-odd that were sold here, in north america. i would imagine the vast majority were sold right here, in the greater vancouver area!

i was also mentioning to rod that with all the press/coverage in magazine articles(for the size of the company) between 1989 and 1994(probably 5-odd articles/tests), i would have thought the production numbers/demand would be much higher, but maybe in that niche, a lot of ppl with go with their own local/regional builders whose designs reflect demands in those areas? i dunno. all i know is, i've been a fan since my first toad in 1990. i was enjoying it in moab, sedona, durango, marin county, tahoe as well as the local vancouver terrain and the toad loved the challenge. my '92 was a solid bike- not as light as the '94s, but probably somewhat sturdier.
peace on dirt...(who said that?)


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

I'll take the 88 please.


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Bikes look great Jim! Glad to see them in such great shape.


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

thanks. doing what i can to preserve bc/cajun bikes. so, eric, how many '88s can i put you down for? remember, the limit is 15! ;o)


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

jimbotoad said:


> thanks. doing what i can to preserve bc/cajun bikes. so, eric, how many '88s can i put you down for? remember, the limit is 15! ;o)


put me down for one with a curved fork


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jimbotoad said:


> thanks. doing what i can to preserve bc/cajun bikes. so, eric, how many '88s can i put you down for? remember, the limit is 15! ;o)


Just the one pictured above. I'll trade you something for it.


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## utahdog2003 (Jul 8, 2004)

My Brodie and my RM Avalanche. I waffle on which gets built first. 


But mostly I just like to type the word "Waffle".


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

utahdog2003 said:


> My Brodie and my RM Avalanche. I waffle on which gets built first.
> 
> But mostly I just like to type the word "Waffle".


AVALANCHE! UGH! WHY MUST YOU TAUNT ME?


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## utahdog2003 (Jul 8, 2004)

Waffle
Waffle
Waffle


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## tashi (Apr 17, 2005)

Do you know the serial number for your DeKerf? Reason I ask is that I have one that's around 246 or something and I'd like to get an estimate as to when it was made. My decals are green and white tough, I can't remember ever seeing ones like yours.

Thanks, be sure to take care of yourself, it sounds like you're going through a great deal. But keep the CDN goodness coming!



jimbotoad said:


> sunday installment leading out with my '91 dekerf with matching mag 20 fork. ..


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

tashi said:


> Do you know the serial number for your DeKerf? Reason I ask is that I have one that's around 246 or something and I'd like to get an estimate as to when it was made. My decals are green and white tough, I can't remember ever seeing ones like yours.
> 
> Thanks, be sure to take care of yourself, it sounds like you're going through a great deal. But keep the CDN goodness coming!


hey tashi- mine is a very early one that was made in april, 1991, according to chris. i forgot if i got that by email or when i went out to get some paint/repair work done. my number is in the low 100s, if i recall correctly. i can't flip the bike over to get at the bb- the bike is buried and i don't think i'm going to get too many volunteers to dig it out, though i do need my summit pulled for photographic purposes! anyhow, i'm willing to bet you're into 1992 with that number and decal style.

going through a great deal, indeed! all my bikes add up to a 'great deal'! ;o) seriously, sure do suck not being able to ride, that's for sure, but collecting these old dinosaurs and talking to ppl who were doing it bitd keeps things interesting. keeps me busy between crises/afflictions!
keeping the crtc happy with my can-con...


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

utahdog2003 said:


> Waffle
> Waffle
> Waffle


that's an easy one. do you have a canadian quarter? if not, i'll mail you one. heads, the brodie, tails, the avalanche...


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## utahdog2003 (Jul 8, 2004)

How about a Canadian nickel. Flipped that sucker and it came up heads, so I guess the Brodie is up next after all. Poor RM.


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## RitcheyRider604 (Sep 14, 2016)

yo-Nate-y said:


> Offshore bikes made for the Canadian market. A dark but short chapter in Fat Chance history.


They're asking about Canadian made bikes, not 'offshore for the Canadian market'


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## RitcheyRider604 (Sep 14, 2016)

Weird - all those bikes and not a single picture?


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## whatisaidwas (Apr 26, 2014)

Since the old thread is new again, I'd like to recommend all fans of Canadian frame building buy a copy of Paul Brodie's book, The Man Behind Brodie Bikes

It's a very entertaining read from a brilliant and humble man, with beautiful photos. Mr. Brodie teaches a frame building class at The University of Fraser Valley.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

Bump. jimbotoad, you still around? Where's the collection at?

It occurs to me in reviewing this old thread that we never mentioned ze Germans. I have it in my head for some reason that they have tremendous wood for Canadian bikes.

Anyway - there was that music video shot in a BC basement that featured a ton of cool bikes that came out in the interim. Can't find it again to link to to save my life...


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

mainlyfats said:


> Bump. jimbotoad, you still around? Where's the collection at?
> 
> It occurs to me in reviewing this old thread that we never mentioned ze Germans. I have it in my head for some reason that they have tremendous wood for Canadian bikes.
> 
> Anyway - there was that music video shot in a BC basement that featured a ton of cool bikes that came out in the interim. Can't find it again to link to to save my life...


Do you mean this video?


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

singletrackmack said:


> Do you mean this video?


That's it! Cheers!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> So... MTBs from 1989 and prior in Canada:
> 
> Rocky Mountain
> Kona/Cascade
> ...


Davinci.

Cove.

Toad

North (Something...)


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## .je (Jan 15, 2019)

In '91 I had a BRC Sierra almost exactly like this one, just larger:










I rode it to high school a few times, then suddenly didn't have it anymore. 

Here's a web page you might like: Canadian Bicycle Brands


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## MattiThundrrr (Jul 6, 2019)

Subscribed.
Cuz Canada is a beauty way to go, you hosers!


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

colker1 said:


> Davinci.
> 
> Cove.
> 
> ...


Ha! Yes, that's Quebec, but not 80's.

When Devinci came into the marketplace in Toronto around 93 it had this yellow bike that was Alivio-level, but 100% Shimano. The only bike in the shop with Shimano hubs, BB, Headset... the works. It was a quality steel frame and fork and everything else near the price-point had crappy non-serviceable suspension and "you won't notice because DERAILLEUR" parts kits. We sold every one we could get. We could have sold twice as many. It was such a throw-back bike that people thought the industry had put its head back on.

North (something) must be True North? Hugh didn't really get going until the mid 90's. Ontario.

Cove is 90's too - B.C.

Toad must have started in the 80's, but didn't hit it's stride until early 90's. Also B.C.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> Ha! Yes, that's Quebec, but not 80's.
> 
> When Devinci came into the marketplace in Toronto around 93 it had this yellow bike that was Alivio-level, but 100% Shimano. The only bike in the shop with Shimano hubs, BB, Headset... the works. It was a quality steel frame and fork and everything else near the price-point had crappy non-serviceable suspension and "you won't notice because DERAILLEUR" parts kits. We sold every one we could get. We could have sold twice as many. It was such a throw-back bike that people thought the industry had put its head back on.
> 
> ...


80s bikes had much more personality. In the 90s it was all about price points, tubeset labels, norba, titanium, rock shox, steep geometry and sillyness.


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## DFA (Jan 26, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> I bet there was a Gardin or two...


Yup. Dropped off a BB for someone I know who use to work at Gardin. Showed him these pics of mine. He stood there with his mouth open.


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## DFA (Jan 26, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> When Devinci came into the marketplace in Toronto around 93 it had this yellow bike that was Alivio-level, but 100% Shimano.


Prior to 93 Devinci was Douglas. 1 1/4" headsets and unusual under top tube mounted roller to under seat stay U-brakes.


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

singletrackmack said:


> Do you mean this video?


hi gang,

been a long time. i recently got out of a 5-day, then 44-day hospital stay that involved sepsis where i got as far as early stages of organ shut-down. it was close. i'm out, but very weak- i can barely push my wheelchair. i lost a decent amount of weight and also 'lost' a colon and gained a percent ileostomy as part of the original reason why i went into the hospital in the first place. many years of ulcerative colitis had thinned the walls of my colon to the point where any surgeries in the area seemed to result in torn bowels, infections, then the inevitable septic attack then surgery to repair the plumbing.

anyways, on to better things. i have expanded my collection since this 'early' days, likely around/close to fifty bikes, though many need restoration- too many. in any case, since my close call in hospital, i'm kind of shifting gears and want to downsize in a fairly big way. the house is too full at this point, so it just makes sense. oh, to save y'all from asking, no toads or bodies are going anywhere, for now. tat cleared off the table, i'll list off bikes i've since accumulated, to the best of my recollection that i still have...

-'91 rocky altitude
-'90 bridgestone mb-0
- '91bridgestone mb-0
-'92? cannonade se 2000 omega 1 of 115 edition
-'90 nishiki timbuk ll 100 percent mint original
-91 brodie sovereign
-'93 brodie light beam
- '88 kona explosif nmint original purported to be 'first splatter-painted kona' by the seller who worked for kona
-'85 rocky sherpa mint original, beautiful red paint, no rim wear
-'89 brodie romax with fillet-brazed uni-crown style fork
-a few more toads
-did i have the '92 goat wtr with reverse team colours from first flight bikes when i did the original list? got that from jeff about 8 months before he was stolen from us by a drunk driver...
-a few experiences, a few cirruses, a couple team comps
-a few more brodie catalysts and climbaxes
- '95 kona explosif

and a few others possibly. and i fear i repeated myself here from the originally posted 'inventory'. too many. if i was dan tanna(remember him(played by the late robert urich) the 57 t-bird driving p.i. in vegas who lived in a storage warehouse unit? hit the remote and door opened up and he just drove into his 'house'. a kitten, a nautilus, bathroom- all mod cons, as it were. the ultimate bachelor suite. too funny. anyhow, i'll leave y'all with those nuggets as to what i've been up to. happy trails!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

jimbotoad said:


> hi gang,
> 
> been a long time. i recently got out of a 5-day, then 44-day hospital stay that involved sepsis where i got as far as early stages of organ shut-down. it was close. i'm out, but very weak- i can barely push my wheelchair. i lost a decent amount of weight and also 'lost' a colon and gained a percent ileostomy as part of the original reason why i went into the hospital in the first place. many years of ulcerative colitis had thinned the walls of my colon to the point where any surgeries in the area seemed to result in torn bowels, infections, then the inevitable septic attack then surgery to repair the plumbing.


Get well! A yr ago i went thru a similar abyss. 2 mo of hospital, sepsis, icu... now i am back to riding my bike.


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## mainlyfats (Oct 1, 2005)

Glad you're still with us, jimbotoad. Thanks for the update! We need to send a photographer your way to get the collection recorded...


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

colker1 said:


> Get well! A yr ago i went thru a similar abyss. 2 mo of hospital, sepsis, icu... now i am back to riding my bike.


just goes to show, you can't take your health and well-being for granted, especially as we all get older. when was the last time you got your prostate checked? exactly. glad you got through your situation unscathed and i'm sure you learned the last place you want to be when you're not doing well, is a hospital. they fix something and you come out with something else!


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## jimbotoad (Nov 5, 2004)

mainlyfats said:


> Glad you're still with us, jimbotoad. Thanks for the update! We need to send a photographer your way to get the collection recorded...


thanks mf. like i mentioned quite a few are 'in progress' for rebuild/resto. they sure take up less space as frames and bins of parts as compared to built bikes! i bet there's 20 that need building/restoring...


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