# Opinions on old Shimano DX hubs



## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

I picked up a cheap set of wheels for my RTS today and don't know much about them but figured you guys/gals would. They are Deore DX f650 hubs with Matrix single track rims.The guy selling them said the rear has been converted to run 8/9sp cassettes.

I was thinking if nothing else they would work till i could afford to buy a new wheel set and if they turn out to be worth it ,maybe lace some new rims on them.

Whats your experience with these.?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Shimano DX was/is decent level componentry. It's not the lightest stuff available, but is solidly built and will last a long time. In the early 90's it was sold between the LX and XT component levels. At that time there was no XTR, so it's was a step below the best.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

The hubs last forevers, are actually as light as any shimano road hubs (mtb and road hubs were identical bodies till 1993) like Ultegras and such until the Ti freehub bodies came out, but they aren't compatible with 11T smallest cogs. You could also read the bikepro guide entry on them.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> but they aren't compatible with 11T smallest cogs. You could also read the bikepro guide entry on them.


Bummer....thats what i was planning on going with. i'll check out bike pro. I did a search but didn't really come up with anything.

My old rts had either lx or alivio hubs (93 model) and they took everything i threw at em for the 4 years i had them. I did clean / relube a coupe times a year and always kept proper tension on the axles bearings.

Are the new lower line shimano hubs as bad as everyone says?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jeepguy812 said:


> Bummer....thats what i was planning on going with. i'll check out bike pro. I did a search but didn't really come up with anything.


The stock DX was intended for a 7-speed cassette with an 12-tooth small cog. It sounds like the freehub on yours has been swapped (based on what you said). the new hub may be compatable with an 11-tooth cog.

Compare your freehub to these pics:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_ho-z.html#hyperdrivec

If you have a Hyperglide-C you can use an 11. A Hyperglide is limited to a 12-tooth.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

It looks like it may be the c free wheel. It's just missing the line that goes around it towards the outside.

btw i don't have them yet but here is a pic of the hub.










I couldn't find these on bikepro but some they had up looked similar.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jeepguy812 said:


> It looks like it may be the c free wheel. It's just missing the line that goes around it towards the outside.


That's a hyperglide-c hub, so you can fit an 11-tooth cog on it. I like the DX stuff - sells for cheap yet functions very well. Ride them for years to come!


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## top_ring (Feb 9, 2004)

I've been running a set (7 spd) on Wolber rims since 1992. Still running great.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

They came in today and the rear hub has a little roughness as it spins.

Anyone know if bearings and seals are still available for these hubs?


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

*Yup*

Through the Quality catalogue at your LBS, and maybe The Third Hand.

There's a good chance the LBS will have parts on hand too.


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## J_S (Sep 12, 2005)

*Seals?*

There are no seals to speak of. Unless the dustcaps are bent, just leave them alone. It is not necessary to remove the dustcaps to overhaul the hub. Pull the axle, clean everything, add new grease and bearings, and ride for another decade.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

This rear has a rubber seal on the free hub side but it doesn't look like it does its job well, has about a 1/16th gap.


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## alexk (Sep 30, 2005)

jeepguy812 said:


> This rear has a rubber seal on the free hub side but it doesn't look like it does its job well, has about a 1/16th gap.


You should find that the seals (loosely used term in this case) just fit snugly over the cone on the axle, which sits inside the dustcap. That's the case on the LHS of the rear hub, the seal on RHS should sit inside the dustcap that's on the freehub body. By this time the seals need renewing, the hubs are about 13-15 years old and the rubber perishes especially when in prolonged contact with the bearing grease.

That 1/16" gap you're talking about, is it looking along the axle from the RHS (between the dustcap and the seal) or is it the vertical gap between the cone and where the seal sits on the cone?

EDIT: But if the person you had bought it from changed the spacing from 7 speed to 8/9 speed then they have probably changed the axle spacers to mimic that of an XT-737 Parallax hub axle. I'm just looking at a spare XT-737 rear hub I have and there is a metal spacer immediately after the locknut on the RHS. This metal spacer has a larger diameter than the locknut and is about 3mm (1/16"?) out from the dustcap on the freehub body. So you would have an 8 speed freehub body and when you install the cassette (with the 11 tooth high gear) that forms a basic seal as the 11 tooth gear & spacer (all one unit) closely fit over that slightly larger diameter metal spacer 3mm out from the freehub dustcap blocking the worst of the contamination and easing the workload (so to speak) of the rubber seal on the cone that fits inside the dustcap of the freehub body. Looking at my hub the metal spacer lines up exactly with the outer edge of the freehub body.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

The xt seems to be a little different than this set up. Here is a pic of mine.










In this pic it looks like you can see the bearings but they are farther inside as you can see in the other pics in my gallery. 
I'm no expert but this looks like the axle and parts are new, just not the right ones for this set up. I haven't taken it apart yet so i don't know if that seal rides in a groove in the race or if there are two pieces involved that create the notch that it sits in. If it's 2 parts then looks like a shorter cone/inner axle race and a washer to make up the difference on the width may be what i need.

As far as the cassette goes i haven't even figured out which one to get yet so not sure how that would fit up. Looking at sram 950, 970 , and shimano lx. These seem like they are about as good as i can get on my budget. 
Happen to have any opinions on these cassettes and a cheaper(around 20$) chain?

If it helps i will more than likely be running shimano 460 or 440 cranks w/ stock rings, unless i can find a cheap set of used cranks in the near future.
Thanks


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## alexk (Sep 30, 2005)

*Helpful photos*

Hi Jeepguy,

I'm working on posting some of these photos that will hopefully show the differences between the 8/9 speed freehub body and the 7 speed body.

First photo is of the two freehub bodies side by side, the one on the left is the XT 8 speed body mounted to an XT-737 Parallax hub circa 1995-96 vintage. The body on the right is the 7 speed body.

The second and third photos show the difference in length between the two freehub bodies. The 8 speed freehub body is approx. 58mm long while the 7 speed freehub body is approx. 48mm long. Consequently the axle spacing on the older 7 speed DX hub needs to be rearranged to accomodate the longer 8 speed freehub body.

The edge of the ruler butts against the shoulder on the freehub body which mounts the lowest gear of the cassette as close to the hub as possible. However the indents on the 7 speed body are deeper as the 7 speed cassettes (XT, LX etc.) used three long bolts running through 5 of the cassette sprockets and associated spacers to hold the cassette together. These bolts have a 4mm (?) sized head. On the 8 speed cassettes the 4 lowest gears and associated spacers are mounted to an alloy carrier (using rivets) and consequently space on the shoulder of the freehub body is considerably less as there is no need to compensate for protruding bolt heads (compared to the 7 speed body).

The fourth photo shows the left hand side of the 7 speed Shimano Deore XT hub which should look the same as your DX hub in regards to the shape of the hub shell, dust seal and locknut and cone arrangement.


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## alexk (Sep 30, 2005)

*And a few more*

OK, here is a couple of detailed photos on the right side of the XT 8 speed Parallax hub.

In the first photo the red line is highlighting a metal spacer that has a diameter slightly larger than the right hand side locknut. This just acts to located the splined cassette removal tool for when you remove the cassette. The tool just bottoms out on this spacer as you place it in the locknut that holds the cassette to the freehub body. At first glance it could be mistaken as a seal. Looking at it vertically this spacer lines up with the edge of the freehub body, however this feature is not on my 7 speed XT hub assembly. Now the yellow line in that first photo is highlighting the dustcap on the freehub body. Just inside that dustcap is the rubber o-ring on the cone (fitted to the axle) and those two components working together attempt to stop the dust and water from getting in the bearings.

The second photo is highlighting that dustcap again. When you remove the axle assembly to overhaul the hub you don't need to remove this dustcap. However if you want to lubricate your freehub body using the Morningstar Freehub Buddy tool then you will have to _CAREFULLY_ remove this dustcap. Again be careful as these have a habit of splitting as they're quite a tight fit into freehub body.

The third photo is a cone off an XT 7 speed hub and this shows the groove that the rubber o-ring fits in, which fits inside the dust cap on the both the left and right sides of your hub. The cones on the 8 speed XT hubs are a slightly different shape but I don't have any photos of these. The principle is the same.

I'm using an XT 8 speed cassette for the XT hub but an LX level one would suffice too. I think it's HG-70. Any decent bike shop should have one. You can always use Ebay too, the XT 8 speed cassettes come up from time to time at good prices. You could also use an XTR 8 speed (12-32T) cassette for slightly lower gearing if you're doing lots of climbing. I haven't had experience with any of the SRAM cassettes. I use an HG-70 Shimano chain with no problems on both my 7 and 8 speed set ups. Again I've stuck to Shimano with no troubles. Some people like the SRAM powerlink and hate mucking around with the special Shimano chain pin, but look after your chain and you shouldn't have any problems with chain breakage unless you're a torque monster.

Hopefully this helps out a bit.


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## jeepguy812 (Oct 30, 2006)

Wow, you go all out.

The way this dx is setup is different than yours.It has zero protection to keep dirt out.
Where yours has the grove in the cone and it sits down in the free hub ,the grove on mine is out where you have the metal washer but mine has a weird shaped seal that does nothing. I can look right past it to the bearings.
At least from looking at yours i know what to look for when i find a shop near me that has some parts in stock.

I went ahead and picked up a 11-34 970 and xtr chain decently priced at a fairly local shop ,so i went ahead and set everything up because i was getting impatiant to take a ride. My luck it started raining about the same time and has kept it up for the past 3 days.

Thanks for the help :thumbsup:


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