# Opinion: The Case For Titanium Bikes



## uphiller2 (Apr 26, 2016)

There was a case for titanium twenty or more years ago. Now, a good carbon frame beats titanium in impact resistance, repairability, weight, ease of shaping tubes into desired forms- all while being cheaper than titanium. If it weren't for the absence of custom carbon frames, the only reasons to buy titanium would be looks and nostalgia.


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## MrDirtHerder (Nov 1, 2017)

Titanium's ride qualities just simply can't be touched and the durability is beyond carbon despite the claim in the comment above.

Every time I thought titanium was done, I'd ride a ti frame again and remember why it's so beautiful. Nothing better for a forever bike if you're gonna spend the money.


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## uphiller2 (Apr 26, 2016)

Have you seen the video on Pinkbike of people taking hammers and dropping heavy steel weights onto carbon without it breaking? I know, that's impact resistance, but fatigue is just a series of impacts. As for ride quality, there's a lot of variation in frames of any material. A lot of modern ti frames use chainstay yokes, which reduce the flex of the frame- and are heavier. Carbon can be more easily shaped and manipulated, allowing you to get better ride quality.


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## Rusty2 (Jul 29, 2020)

I have ti water bottle cages they work great and have not become obsolete. I don't see many ti frames from 10 years ago on the trails. Seems like the geometry, hub sizes, and steer tubes from bikes a couple years ago won't work today all obsolete. Ti durability is great but do you need it to go ride Ashland dh, Moab, or Santa Cruz?


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## coyotegulch (Jun 25, 2008)

I have owned 6 Ti bikes over the years, and currently have a Ti soft tail 29er and a Ti custom gravel bike. I love both, and will always own a Ti bike. The gravel bike rides like a dream as a normal frame without all the accoutrements of say a Diverge or Crockett. 
I recently thought maybe I should go carbon, and a couple friends who own shops commented, "why would you ever change from custom Ti to carbon".

I recently purchased a Trek Domane SLR instead of a custom Ti bike. Saved about a 1/3 to a half in frame price, but after a year I am thinking I should have bit the bullet and gone Ti.

To each his/her own, but if your looking at a relatively high end hard tail, road or gravel bike Ti should certainly be in the mix.


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## B_rad1 (Jul 29, 2020)

Man it is so annoying when people talk about "investing" in a bicycle. No one does that, you buy it, use it and it depreciates. That's just a word you tell yourself to make you feel like less of a prick for spending too much on a bike.

And yes, there are a shitton of things worse than seeing your same frame at the trailhead. Buy what makes you happy.


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## selfredpaul (Jul 31, 2008)

My preference is titanium for ride quality and durability primarily. Carbon ages quickly and looks bad like plastic. It feels like riding on plastic; because it is plastic.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

You must never have owned and ridden a high quality Ti frame, otherwise you would KNOW, from EXPERIENCE, that high quality / well designed Ti frame bikes ride like nothing else in terms of compliance. For a hardtail, nothing can match this unique characteristic, and for long distance rides, you are noticeably less fatigued after the ride. Carbon hardtails are awful in terms of comfort, and aluminum is even worse. Ti frames are 'thee' best choice for anyone who likes to ride hardtails and whose average ride is no less than 5 hours long. The only bike frame material which I will never see myself buying ever again would be Aluminum. But I currently own two Evils, a steel city bike, and a fully custom made Ti hardtail made by Black Sheep Cycles. Any time I plan to do an all day ride [ 6 to 10 hours of long distance riding], I don't even consider using anything but the Ti hardtail. ..Maybe try one for yourself and then see if you still have such a staunch opinion on Ti. And mind you, I am not referring to low end Ti frames...which usually don't ride any different than aluminum. The high end Ti frames built by people who KNOW how to take full advantage of the metal, build frames that are phenomenally comfortable to ride over long distance.


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## Sy_Borg (Jul 21, 2020)

Carbon can appear to take an impact without damage. The truth is that a carbon frame can be severely damaged and appear undamaged. An impact to the outside of a tube can cause delamination on the inside. You are now setup for a failure without warning.

Metal frames show signs of stress which provides a warning of impending failure without the need of an expensive examination.

I had a carbon road bike and I had knee pain on rides longer than about 40 miles. I purchased a Ti bike and I've gone on rides over 80 miles without knee pain. I attribute the positive to the improved vibration damping of the Ti frame.


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## Entrenador (Oct 8, 2004)

"Have you seen the videos of carbon not being broken?" Really? That's the pitch?

Welds > molds all day long. I was not really a titanium fan until my good friend started getting custom titanium frames made. And what made the difference? He had them coated, and they look amazing.


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## uphiller2 (Apr 26, 2016)

I owned a Litespeed Obed ti frame in the early 2000s, and have ridden my brother's Clark-Kent F14. Both were comfortable, with the Clark-Kent being the better of the two, but it was not a mind-bending experience compared to the steel hardtails I owned before and after the Litespeed.


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## froze (Feb 5, 2011)

Arn Saknussen, your comments were really good till you said: "And mind you, I am not referring to low end Ti frames&#8230;which usually don't ride any different than aluminum." That comment was pure BS! Having owned a aluminum bike, and having rode a friends bike who had the cheapest Titanium bike on the market from Motobecane, there is a day and night difference; that "cheap" ti bike so impressed me I bought a Lynskey Peloton, the cheapest TI bike they made at the time, after I got a better price that made it cheaper then the cheapest Litespeed, which I also rode, again no comparison to an aluminum frame. Just because you're rich doesn't mean anything beneath what you would buy is junk.

For the rest of you reading this, don't get scared by thinking you can't afford a ti bike because you have to spend $5,000 or more to get something good, that's pure nonsense, find a low cost Lynskey or Litespeed; I didn't buy a Motobecane because just in case I want to sell it the Motobecane does not have brand recognition.

The Lynskey that I have even beats all my steel bikes in comfort! and aluminum can't touch steel not alone titanium.


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## Bozo T CLown (Aug 10, 2020)

@Rob I have been looking at buying Lynskey Ridgeline 29er. I am curious what 29eer you have. My wife and I rode 11,000 kilometers down the Andes last year and there were 4 riders on Ti bikes. They loved them. Our carbon hard tails did the job more than adequately, but mine is looking a bit tired after now reaching 17,000 kilometers.


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## Bozo T CLown (Aug 10, 2020)

I have been looking at buying Lynskey Ridgeline 29er. I am curious what 29eer you have. My wife and I rode 11,000 kilometers down the Andes last year and there were 4 riders on Ti bikes. They loved them. Our carbon hard tails did the job more than adequately, but mine is looking a bit tired after now reaching 17,000 kilometers.


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## JDub713 (May 21, 2009)

Have you seen what a carbon frame looks like after you've dropped the chain between the smallest cog on your cassette and and the dropout whilst pedaling your ass off? Or when a rock strikes the molded edge of the carbon where the threaded aluminum insert was molded in to the bottom bracket shell? Or noticing that your paint is cracked because the carbon resin begins to distort and lift after years of sun and UV exposure? All 3 of these oddity issues occurred on the same carbon frame, and it's only 4 years old, and made by a premium boutique brand. My eeWings cranks have taken numerous pedal strikes with rocks over the past couple years, and all I have to do to erase the evidence is rub the arms with a red scotch bite pad for a minute and they look good as new. It's not even a contest between the two materials as far as durability is concerned, just a factor of cost and personal preference.


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## older'nslower (Feb 28, 2009)

Word! Of course the post is sponsored by Sage bicycles. What else would we expect them to say?


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## john_habanero (Feb 27, 2012)

But they are expensive. That fact seems to be glossed over. A custom TI frame, fugettabouit...


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## Bill_Wildenberg (Aug 4, 2020)

In my opinion, carbon needs a "grading system". Right now, if you bought a steel or Ti bike, you would know the type or grade of metal used to produce the bike. When you buy a carbon bike, there is no mention if you bought the cheapest grade carbon or something with unique properties. I will be interested in a carbon bike once I know what I would be paying for...


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## ctxcrossx (Jan 13, 2004)

You can make a carbon frame as compliant as you want, just look at the new Scalpel. I get the ride quality of Ti, but carbon can have excellent ride quality as well, and has much more opportunity to be tuned.

And I don't find the longevity of ti to be anything desirable. With all the changing standards, improvements, and geometry. It's just not a selling point. And this is across all large disciplines of cycling. A 10 year old bike in (road, mtb, cross, gravel??, tri) is extremely dated.

I'm not saying Ti is bad at all, but if we factor in all the different aspects of all the materials, with impact resistance, cost, weight, etc. Ti is not heads above the others. It's likely not even the top material.


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## jimka (Apr 23, 2020)

Never owned Ti bike.
Have and currently own steel.
1920 iver johnson/Indy fab/Merckx/Gunnar 
Still have and ride the iver johnson and gunner.
Wanted to try carbon-bought new stigmata.
After spending the money and riding the bike would have rather bought custom steel or ti.
Stigmata rides nice-doesn't feel the same 
Looking into buying steel/ti to replace the stigmata


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## Tim15 (Jul 12, 2015)

Tim, Tim Tim, litte Timmy, you're making an arese of yourself. You don't like Titanium bikes far enough. However stop trying to convince the rest who own Titanium bikes that the choice is invalid because little Timmy loves cheap Chinese moulded carbon crap pooped from a mould and filled with voids and body filler. Really we're not interested in your view because we've all owned or on carbon bikes as well and know why we've bought and love to ride our Titanium bike. I'll take my Ti hartail over a stell or carbon version every day, hence sold them. The Litespeed Vortex hanging in the garage is still raced after 18years of ownership and probably 3 decals changes. Yes its not as lightning snappy as my Look 795 but its a great stage race bike and when I zipp down to the coffee shop it gets more looks, strokes and pick up (you know to feel the weight) than the Giants and Specializeds parked next to it. So little Timmy my boy, put your carbon frame in your pipe and smoke it because I'm ordering myself a new custom made Ti frame with hydro-formed 3AL2.5V and 6AL4V tubes, BB386evo, space for 30mm tyres and disc brakes and no chain-stay yokes. Why? because it doesn't need chain-stay yokes. Your knowledge of the Ti frame builders knowledge and expertise tells me you're a recent joiner to this wonderful sport of ours. Better to listen and learn rather than speak a lot of nonsense.


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## uphiller2 (Apr 26, 2016)

@Brad. Several things. 
-I've been riding on and off road since 1994. 
-I don't own a carbon bike, and am not an apostle of carbon.
-I have four years of experience riding a Litespeed ti hardtail. I didn't find it particularly compelling in terms of ride quality, weight or certainly price compared to the bikes that came before or after it, which were both steel. 
-I agree that ti rides smoothly, but at this point so do a lot of carbon frames, which also offer lower weight, lower price and better impact resistance (although, as someone pointed out, carbon has the disadvantage that it can fail catastrophically without any external cracks appearing).
-I'm glad you're happy with your ti frame. I agree they look amazing and last a long time, the last thing being their main benefit.


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## Major_Glory (Aug 19, 2020)

I worked with materials science in aerospace with carbon, steel, and titanium for a few years, studied in college as well, and I don't think you understand strength of materials concepts and the science behind it. Generally speaking, titanium has proven significantly stronger than carbon over time. Again, you have some valid points and are entitled to your preferences on ride quality and flexibility of design with carbon fiber, but you can't credibly say it is stronger because you saw a video on Pinkbike.


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## JazzEcho (Feb 6, 2021)

uphiller2 said:


> There was a case for titanium twenty or more years ago. Now, a good carbon frame beats titanium in impact resistance, repairability, weight, ease of shaping tubes into desired forms- all while being cheaper than titanium. If it weren't for the absence of custom carbon frames, the only reasons to buy titanium would be looks and nostalgia.


You may want to check your facts on that...I think you are seriously confused. I still have two Ti bikes from the 90's one being a XC racer and the other a Road. I also have a 3 yera old road and a 1.5 year old FS trail. 
Lets put your calims/theory to a test an I will be happy to play. Take your most favorite ride and place it on the ground. Then go find a standard landscaping brick and hold it above you your cross tube five feet in the air...count to three, then let go. Post a macro pic of the strike area and then I will post mine.


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## JazzEcho (Feb 6, 2021)

uphiller2 said:


> I owned a Litespeed Obed ti frame in the early 2000s, and have ridden my brother's Clark-Kent F14. Both were comfortable, with the Clark-Kent being the better of the two, but it was not a mind-bending experience compared to the steel hardtails I owned before and after the Litespeed.


The best steel frame that I have ever ridden was a custom built Salsa Team Issue. It was a friends bike back in 97 and I liked even better that my Lynskey Litspeed!


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## SprSonik (Jul 29, 2004)

selfredpaul said:


> My preference is titanium for ride quality and durability primarily. Carbon ages quickly and looks bad like plastic. It feels like riding on plastic; because it is plastic.


How does it age quickly? I had a 2013 Trek Superfly Carbon that still looked amazing last time I saw it being ridden by my buddy.


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## Pedalon2018 (Apr 24, 2018)

john_habanero said:


> But they are expensive. That fact seems to be glossed over. A custom TI frame, fugettabouit...


Not really expensive when you consider all aspects of the bike.


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## milehi (Nov 2, 1997)

I've sold Ti frames to finance custom steel frames. The ride quality of a well executed steel frame is head and shoulders above the parameters of Ti tubes. Ti also can't meet the weight of some steel tube sets like S3 either. I'm a Ti whore. I design and manufacture Ti joint implants. I have thousands of pounds of the highest grade 6AL/4V bar stock on hand. I know it's properties. Hands down, steel is a better property for a frame, and has a better spring to it.


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## Pedalon2018 (Apr 24, 2018)

milehi said:


> I've sold Ti frames to finance custom steel frames. The ride quality of a well executed steel frame is head and shoulders above the parameters of Ti tubes. Ti also can't meet the weight of some steel tube sets like S3 either. I'm a Ti whore. I design and manufacture Ti joint implants. I have thousands of pounds of the highest grade 6AL/4V bar stock on hand. I know it's properties. Hands down, steel is a better property for a frame, and has a better spring to it.


This discussion never ends, ride what you love. Ti for me after owning numerous steel, aluminum and carbon. We are all looking for what works best for whatever you do on a bike. If you are trying to decide what material works for you, buy one and see what you think. Many of us own several bikes so if you want, move on or keep and increase your stable.....


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Ride compliance seems to be lost on most people today, but it's extremely important to me. I love the ride quality of a GOOD steel frame! 

I used to lust after Ti, but after having read many stories on here from guys who took the plunge and went for a custom ti frame only to realize for one reason or another that they prefer the ride quality of steel and end up going back to steel. This speaks volumes. 

On top of that, the value of steel frames is awesome. 'Better' ride quality AND a lower price tag? Heck yeah! 

Off the shelf steel- $600-1,500
Custom steel frame- $1,500-$2.5k
Off the shelf Ti- $3k
Custom Ti- $4k+

Ti is beautiful, and maybe one day if the right bike comes along, but my love affair with steel is more engrained than ever after recently testing a few aluminum and carbon bikes, then jumping back on one of my steel frames. Unless it's a full suspension bike, I have no desire to own an aluminum or carbon frame. 

Most recently, I've been eyeing up some full suspension steel frames... Want!!


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## rekmeyata (Jan 25, 2021)

uphiller2 said:


> There was a case for titanium twenty or more years ago. Now, a good carbon frame beats titanium in impact resistance, repairability, weight, ease of shaping tubes into desired forms- all while being cheaper than titanium. If it weren't for the absence of custom carbon frames, the only reasons to buy titanium would be looks and nostalgia.


Actually, CF still does not beat TI frames, I've seen newer CF MTB bikes shatter while roughing them. CF problem is fracture resistance, it doesn't deflect far before it goes kablooey, and even if it doesn't go kablooey right away it can suffer either external fine fracture cracks, but most of the time those fractures are INSIDE the tubing not on the outside. Sure they use CF in racing, but those guys get their bikes and frames for free, so replacing a damaged frame doesn't cost them anything, we don't have that luxury. Warranties do not cover damage from abuse, and they will consider roughing it as abuse. With CF you will get a stiffer and lighter frame with a numb feeling ride ideal for racing no question about it, but I think you'll find more compliance and a more rugged frame with titanium.

The other thing with a CF frame is that not all manufactures will build in impact resistance, only a very few will spend the time and money to do that, problem is you don't which manufacture does that. But even with that impact resistance built-in it still won't be as durable as TI or even steel for that matter. Originally when MTB racing became all the rage it was done using aluminum, well aluminum didn't do well either with impacts even after beefing them up, so when CF came out it actually performed better in that department, so that's when the rage for CF took off. The lifespan of a titanium frame is much higher than a CF frame, which is a very well-known fact.

By the way, I have several steel bikes, the oldest one has over 150,000 miles on and still going good but it needs to be restored to some degree, but I retired it due to its vintage components are expensive to find; at one time I had a scandium bike, that one cracked at the top of the head tube under the headset and radiated downward about an inch, the bike manufacture refuse to warranty it saying it was from fatigue, this was after only 13 months and 8,000 some odd miles! The warranty was a 25-year warranty, but it was on workmanship and materials, but the fatigue issue is how they got around it, getting a lawyer would have been more expensive than the bike was! I was sort of glad it broke, it rode like I had bricks for tires, So I gutted it and recycled the frame; I had a CF bike, it broke at the rear stay at the dropout, the company said I abused it and again no warranty. I also have a Lynskey titanium bike, this bike is by far the most comfortable riding bike I've ever had, there just isn't any comparison to other materials I've either owned or test rode, and I bought the cheapest one Lynskey made and it's that good. I wanted to buy a TI touring bike, but the cost was prohibitive so I got a steel one instead, and that bike is my newest bike I just got this last year just before the bike shortage hit, now that bike rides really smooth, but it's also riding on 700 x 45 tires instead of 700 x 23 or 25's.


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## Iain2310 (Feb 18, 2021)

uphiller2 said:


> Have you seen the video on Pinkbike of people taking hammers and dropping heavy steel weights onto carbon without it breaking? I know, that's impact resistance, but fatigue is just a series of impacts. As for ride quality, there's a lot of variation in frames of any material. A lot of modern ti frames use chainstay yokes, which reduce the flex of the frame- and are heavier. Carbon can be more easily shaped and manipulated, allowing you to get better ride quality.


That is utter rubbish. Carbon can be manipulated but is a layered weave and is stiffer and more rigid - it does not and cannot be manipulated to flex like titanium and certainly can never have the impact resistance of ti. The fact that downhillers use alloy rims should prove that to you. The tolerances are just not built for impact - it is the rigidity of carbon fibre that makes it a good frame material - and it's weight v strength ratio. You hit carbon with a sharp object - you will put a hole in it.


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## Iceman2 (May 15, 2020)

*OneSpeed* said:


> Ride compliance seems to be lost on most people today, but it's extremely important to me. I love the ride quality of a GOOD steel frame!
> 
> I used to lust after Ti, but after having read many stories on here from guys who took the plunge and went for a custom ti frame only to realize for one reason or another that they prefer the ride quality of steel and end up going back to steel. This speaks volumes.
> 
> ...


Off the shelf Ti for $3k is just incorrect these days. Unless you meant a whole bike. For a frame it's $1500, $2000 tops. On the low end/middle end its a $0-$500 difference between steel and Ti and on the high end/custom it is about a $1000 difference between the two (some builders offer frames in both materials so its easy to compare).


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Iceman2 said:


> Off the shelf Ti for $3k is just incorrect these days. Unless you meant a whole bike. For a frame it's $1500, $2000 tops. On the low end/middle end its a $0-$500 difference between steel and Ti and on the high end/custom it is about a $1000 difference between the two (some builders offer frames in both materials so its easy to compare).


After looking at some less expensive brands I see they do start around $1,500, I guess I was looking up a level or two from those entry level options.

They definitely do not top out at $2k though. Moots go for $3,750 and I'm sure there are more expensive options.

I'll still take custom steel over off-the-shelf Ti.


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## Pedalon2018 (Apr 24, 2018)

*OneSpeed* said:


> After looking at some less expensive brands I see they do start around $1,500, I guess I was looking up a level or two from those entry level options.
> 
> They definitely do not top out at $2k though. Moots go for $3,750 and I'm sure there are more expensive options.
> 
> I'll still take custom steel over off-the-shelf Ti.


Ride what you like and trying to convince others what you like is a fools errand. I however do want to say two things. The ride of Ti is a large variable determine by the builder's design choices. Secondly, I do not want s bike that can be severely damaged by use the incorrect torque wrench or set it wrong. My friend picked up the wrong Park wrench and crushed his frame. Took four months to sort out while I was riding everyday on myTi. Ride and buy what you love and if you buy steel or carbon, enjoy it. I did want to mention I bought a Trek 8900 in 1988 that had the very first SID and an early attempt at hydraulic brakes. Still being ridden today and still provides tons of fun. So old does not always mean obsolete. Safe rides to all.


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## PierreR (May 17, 2012)

I have a carbon full suspension S works Stumpy and a Ti Motobecane fat bike framed bike. On the Stumpy, I got a stick about 3/4" in diameter through the rear wheel and it snapped the carbon seat stay. Fortunately Specialized had the rear triangle for $300 in stock or I would have had no value in my frame. The stick did not break any spokes or untrue the wheel or take out the derailleur. My Stumpy pretty much sits. 
I ride my custom made Ti Motobecane framed e bike and it's a tank at 83 lbs. The Bluto front fork has many scratches and a few gouges but the Ti frame doesn't have a scratch on it a looks the same after 4 years and 11k miles. Main use is long distance touring.
I will take the titanium, my buddy wants the stumpy.


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## Pedalon2018 (Apr 24, 2018)

PierreR said:


> I have a carbon full suspension S works Stumpy and a Ti Motobecane fat bike framed bike. On the Stumpy, I got a stick about 3/4" in diameter through the rear wheel and it snapped the carbon seat stay. Fortunately Specialized had the rear triangle for $300 in stock or I would have had no value in my frame. The stick did not break any spokes or untrue the wheel or take out the derailleur. My Stumpy pretty much sits.
> I ride my custom made Ti Motobecane framed e bike and it's a tank at 83 lbs. The Bluto front fork has many scratches and a few gouges but the Ti frame doesn't have a scratch on it a looks the same after 4 years and 11k miles. Main use is long distance touring.
> I will take the titanium, my buddy wants the stumpy.


You pretty much nailed the issue. Carbon has come so far yet, the neighbor 50 acres down the street has his year old carbon fall over and hit something that broke the frame. It freaking just fell over and has been parked ever since. Now just parts in the barn. I saw a race where a frame failed during a race and the rider and his bike in two pieces sprawled across the pavement. Think about that as you speed down the Mountain. I ride Ti.


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

I have titanium, aluminum, carbon, and steel bikes in my stable right now and don't have a strong preference for any of them. The Reynolds 853 steel, the aluminum, and the carbon bikes are all hardtail 29ers with similar geometry that I have set up nearly identically so I could see if I really did have a preference for one frame material over another. I've found little difference in the 3000-5000 miles I've ridden them. My three titanium bikes are all soft tails, so the ride is a bit different from my other bikes, but I attribute that more to the soft tail design than to the frame material.

As for durability, I don't have a strong preference there either. I have dents in my aluminum, steel, and titanium frames that I still ride. I have cracks in a steel and a titanium frame. I built my carbon hardtail out of a frame that had a hole in the seat stay from the previous owner's crash, and have ridden it hard for over 3000 trail miles without further incident or damage, even though I've crashed it a few times. All of my bikes were bought used, so I have no idea what kind of life they had before I bought them and started abusing them.


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## Iceman2 (May 15, 2020)

*OneSpeed* said:


> After looking at some less expensive brands I see they do start around $1,500, I guess I was looking up a level or two from those entry level options.
> 
> They definitely do not top out at $2k though. Moots go for $3,750 and I'm sure there are more expensive options.
> 
> I'll still take custom steel over off-the-shelf Ti.


Yes my post wasn't clear - I meant the off the shelf, middle of the road Ti is 1500-2000 (i.e. lynskey/litespeed - which is still made in america, lifetime warranty - not a random chinese frame) - most high end or custom Ti will start in the 3000-4000 range and that's before any major custom changes.

people should ride whatever they want, doesn't matter to me, but helps those making frame decisions to have good intel. I've been biking long enough to know that the "next bike" is always further off than I think it is. Getting the right bike for you that makes you happy cannot be understated.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Pedalon2018 said:


> Ride what you like and trying to convince others what you like is a fools errand.


I'm sharing my opinion. Not trying to convince anyone of anything.


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## Pedalon2018 (Apr 24, 2018)

*OneSpeed* said:


> I'm sharing my opinion. Not trying to convince anyone of anything.


Well that's what opinions do but I am not being critical. It was more of a phrase than anything cause this is still America but barely. I appreciate your posts. Thanks and Safe Travels..


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## LithiumMetalman (May 12, 2016)

Interesting POV on material for bikes!

I am pretty lucky to have a ti bike (honzo ti) and a couple carbon framed hardtails. I love my honzo ti and actually took a big fall last year and watched my bike tumble 25ft down a side of a cliff hitting a bunch of stuff along the way. Upon recovery and initial inspection, handlebars bent (raceface alu), busted seat, the frame, after further inspection and cleanup looked like nothing happened and the frame was still straight! Granted the honzo ti is overbuilt (4.5lbs for a size small frame, which is still light) and not super compliant relative to other ti / steel frames. However it is compliant enough for me (rides like a fluffy aluminum frame, does that make sense?) that I love it enough for endurance rides and bikepacking. I’ve been super impressed by the durability. I like the fact I do not have to worry about the Honzo ti allowing me to charge into questionable terrain, strap things to it or just get on and ride it!

Don’t get me wrong, the carbon frames I own are rocketships in comparison to my honzo ti for outright efficiency, riding precision and even compliance, however I have cracked older carbon (and alu) frames in the past and mentally for me, I am still leary being on a carbon frame, even though modern layups in quality carbon frames are logically more durable (only if the frame layup direction is appropiate). I also find that I think more about my life choices on the trail with the carbon bike than I do on the ti bike.

Mentally I’m still sold on ti as a my everyday / life-long / no worries bike.

I think in the end it’s mentally what makes a rider happiest / most confident / relaxed regardless of the material. Ride on.


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