# Trek 3700 Disc or Haro Flightline Three?



## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

EDIT: I ended up going with a Motobecane 700 HT. Just to save you a lot of reading....

I tested out the Trek today at the bigger LBS and loved it! They only had a 21" frame though, which is a bit big for me (I'm 6'0, 175 lbs). The brakes were amazing, and it is a lot lighter than what I've been used to (Wal-Mart specials). The shifting mechanisms worked flawlessly and it seemed like an awesome bike all-in-all. The smaller LBS here sells Haro and KHS. I stopped by there today and they didn't have any Flightline Threes in stock, but said they should next week. I'm going to wait to make my decision until then unless any of you can tell me the Haro isn't worth comparing to the Trek. I will use this bike mainly to commute around campus but I also want to start riding a few local trails.

Both bikes are $470

Trek 3700 Disc










*Frame*-Alpha White Aluminum w/semi-integrated head tube, bi-oval down tube w/integrated gusset, rack & fender mounts, disc compatible dropouts, replaceable derailleur hanger
*Front Suspension*-SR Suntour XCT w/coil spring and preload, 80mm travel
*Wheels*-Formula alloy DC20 front hub, Shimano alloy M475 rear hub; Bontrager 550 36-hole rims w/brushed sidewalls
*Tires*-Bontrager LT3, 26x2.0"
*Shifters*-Shimano EF51, 7 speed
*Front Derailleur*-Shimano Tourney
*Rear Derailleur*-Shimano Altus
*Crank*-Shimano M131, 42/34/24
*Cassette*-Shimano TZ31 13-34, 7 speed
*Pedals*-Wellgo nylon platform
*Saddle*-Bontrager SSR
*Seat Post*-Bontrager SSR, 31.6mm, 20mm offset
*Handlebars*-Bontrager Approved Riser, 25.4mm, 30mm rise
*Stem*-Bontrager Approved, 25.4mm
*Headset*-1-1/8" threadless, semi-integrated, semi-cartridge bearings
*Brakeset*-Tektro Novela mechanical disc brakes w/Shimano EF50 levers
*Warranty*-Lifetime on frame (except forks), 2 years on Bontrager components, 1 year on paint and decals

Haro Flightline Three










*Frame*-New Haro Flightline Series 6061 Alloy
*Fork*-SR Suntour XCT V2 100mm travel
*Headset*-Aheadset OS
*Crankset*-Shimano M131 42/32/22
*Bottom Bracket*-Cartridge Bearing Bottom Bracket,
*Front Derailleur*-Shimano Tourney
*Rear Derailleur*-Shimano Acera 8-Speed
*Cassette/Freewheel*-Shimano HG40 8-Speed 11-32t Cassette
*Chain*-Shimano HG50
*Pedals*-Nylon Body/Alloy Cage with Toe Clips
*Handlebar*-Pivit Steel 30mm Riser Bar 31.8mm Clamp Size
*Stem*-Pivit Melt Forged Alloy with Removable Face Plate; 15 Degree Rise
*Grips*-Haro Dual Density
*Shifter*-Shimano EZ Fire Plus 8-Speed Shifters
*Saddle*-Haro MTB Sport Saddle
*Seat Post*-Pivit Alloy Micro Adjust 30.9mm
*Seat Post Clamp*-Alloy Quick Release
*Hubset*-Pivit Alloy Disc 32H
*Rims*-Weinmann ZAC19 Doublewall
*Tires*-Kenda Kadre 26 x 2.10"
*Brake Set*-Promax Mechanical Disc Brakes
*Levers*-Included with Shifter
*Warranty*-Lifetime on frame, 1 year on Haro and Pivit components


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

Ride them both what ever feels better they are both basically the same parts I like the looks of the Trek better.


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## Snagged7 (Feb 15, 2011)

jpeters said:


> Ride them both what ever feels better they are both basically the same parts I like the looks of the Trek better.


Well if that's true then I say Trek all the way. I'm a bit bias though (ha).


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> Ride them both what ever feels better they are both basically the same parts I like the looks of the Trek better.


Yea...the Trek definitely looks nicer.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

You may prefer the haro if you're going to take it on trails. The double wall rims will hold up better than single wall rims. I would also prefer the 8 sp drivetrain. The green color looks better to me, but I'm not buying it.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I wouldn't pay money for a bike with a 7-speed freewheel. That leaves the Haro.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

rlouder said:


> You may prefer the haro if you're going to take it on trails. The double wall rims will hold up better than single wall rims. I would also prefer the 8 sp drivetrain. The green color looks better to me, but I'm not buying it.





AndrwSwitch said:


> I wouldn't pay money for a bike with a 7-speed freewheel. That leaves the Haro


I've been leaning towards the Trek all along. Does the 8 speed drivetrain really make that big of a difference? I might hit a trail once every week or two and nothing serious to start off with.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

7 speed vs. 8 speed isn't that important.

7 speed freewheels suck. The axle isn't very well-supported, and even a relatively light, conservative roadie can bend it. That's why all modern multispeed bikes use a freehub instead. So, the Trek is not a modern bike. In order to fix it, you'll either need to replace the axle fairly frequently or replace the entire hub, which usually means a whole new wheel.

Single-walled rims also suck, but they're not necessarily fragile - sometimes just heavy.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

AndrwS knows what he's talking about. I overlooked the fact that the trek came with a free wheel. The specs show a 475 hub, so I assumed it was a cassette. That spec is obviously wrong because a quick google shows that it is a freewheel. I thought the 475 was odd because they usually cut costs everywhere they can.


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

The SR Suntour XCT fork on both bikes is an undamped pogo fork. Instead, I'd recommend the Suntour XCM (aluminum lowers) or XCR (magnesium lowers) hydraulic lock-out forks as a *minimum* starting point. Also, it's likely that the M131 triple chainrings are welded together which means no 1 x 9 option, no gearing changes up front and a damaged or worn chainring means a whole new crankset. And steel handlebars - seriously?

Instead of either of the above bikes, I'd take a hard look at a *GT Avalanche Disc* 1.0/2.0/3.0 at either REI or Performance Bicycle (the cheaper option of the two). You'd get a real hydraulic fork, much better drivetrain components, better wheels, nice 4-bolt alloy stem and a real alloy handlebar for similar money or less.

Trek thinks that consumers buying entry-level bikes are stupid and easily taken advantage of. Prove them wrong by buying a better bike elsewhere - probably for less money.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

AndrwSwitch said:


> 7 speed vs. 8 speed isn't that important.
> 
> 7 speed freewheels suck. The axle isn't very well-supported, and even a relatively light, conservative roadie can bend it. That's why all modern multispeed bikes use a freehub instead. So, the Trek is not a modern bike. In order to fix it, you'll either need to replace the axle fairly frequently or replace the entire hub, which usually means a whole new wheel.
> 
> Single-walled rims also suck, but they're not necessarily fragile - sometimes just heavy.


Ah, gotcha. So.....the Haro has a cassette, double-walled rims, and an Acera rear derailleur (which is better than the Trek's Altus, right?). How are the Promax brakes versus the Trek's Tektro? I know I like the Tektros from my test ride yesterday.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Clones123 said:


> The SR Suntour XCT fork on both bikes is an undamped pogo fork. Instead, I'd recommend the Suntour XCM (aluminum lowers) or XCR (magnesium lowers) hydraulic lock-out forks as a *minimum* starting point. Also, it's likely that the M131 triple chainrings are welded together which means no 1 x 9 option, no gearing changes up front and a damaged or worn chainring means a whole new crankset. And steel handlebars - seriously?
> 
> Instead of either of the above bikes, I'd take a hard look at a *GT Avalanche Disc* 1.0/2.0/3.0 at either REI or Performance Bicycle (the cheaper option of the two). You'd get a real hydraulic fork, much better drivetrain components, better wheels, nice 4-bolt alloy stem and a real alloy handlebar for similar money or less.
> 
> Trek thinks that consumers buying entry-level bikes are stupid and easily taken advantage of. Prove them wrong by buying a better bike elsewhere - probably for less money.


I'm gonna research that one now. Thanks for all the help, guys! :thumbsup:


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Alright, the GT definitely looks like an awesome bike, but all the sites I've seen it on only list a small, extra small, or medium frame size. Are these no longer in production? I need a large (19.4") frame.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Try to hop on a 21" too.

Acera is a much nicer component level than Altus. I raced an Alivio - the next line up - derailleur for two seasons. I only replaced it because I fell on it. Alivio and up assume you take care of your bike. Altus is built to kinda function with incredibly bad cable runs, but it doesn't keep a tune very well.

I'd say Promax and Tektro mechanical brake calipers are both pretty bad. It's too bad product managers and consumers are so set on disc brakes - Vs can outperform bad mechanical discs if you take care of them, except in deep mud. Tektros are probably a little better, but I'd still be inclined toward the Haro because it's much cheaper to replace the brakes than re-do the rear wheel and enough of the drivetrain to use a cassette and freehub.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

I would say both of those bikes are crap and you really need to consider buying online. This bike has so much better parts its not funny. 27 gears sealed bearing wheels xt dr its so much better than the other bikes.

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/motobecane_700HT_xi.htm

Its just not as pretty as the other bike lol.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Try to hop on a 21" too.
> 
> Acera is a much nicer component level than Altus. I raced an Alivio - the next line up - derailleur for two seasons. I only replaced it because I fell on it. Alivio and up assume you take care of your bike. Altus is built to kinda function with incredibly bad cable runs, but it doesn't keep a tune very well.
> 
> I'd say Promax and Tektro mechanical brake calipers are both pretty bad. It's too bad product managers and consumers are so set on disc brakes - Vs can outperform bad mechanical discs if you take care of them, except in deep mud. Tektros are probably a little better, but I'd still be inclined toward the Haro because it's much cheaper to replace the brakes than re-do the rear wheel and enough of the drivetrain to use a cassette and freehub.


Yeah but make sure you get a disk ready bike because you can upgrade the hydros for like 100 bucks when you are ready if you get v brakes it will cost a fortune to upgrade.


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## High Side (Apr 16, 2010)

Haro


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> I would say both of those bikes are crap and you really need to consider buying online. This bike has so much better parts its not funny. 27 gears sealed bearing wheels xt dr its so much better than the other bikes.
> 
> http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/motobecane_700HT_xi.htm
> 
> Its just not as pretty as the other bike lol.


Wow, that's a killer deal. The only thing I don't like about that bike is it's polished aluminum. wtf? The finish would tarnish and require a LOT of upkeep, no?


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

No. It should have a clear top coat on it. Fwiw, I've always thought the polished aluminum is the best looking color on a bike. Some people remove the paint to get that look.

The upside to that bike is that it's so much better all the way around. The difference between it and what you tested is greater than the difference between what you tested and wally bike.

The downside with internet or used bikes is that you have to learn to adjust them yourself. This is actually a benefit in my opinion. You can usually learn to adjust something quicker than it takes to drive the bike back to the dealer. Some dealers offer a basic adjustment plan for an extra cost, others offer it free.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

rlouder said:


> No. It should have a clear top coat on it. Fwiw, I've always thought the polished aluminum is the best looking color on a bike. Some people remove the paint to get that look.
> 
> The upside to that bike is that it's so much better all the way around. The difference between it and what you tested is greater than the difference between what you tested and wally bike.
> 
> The downside with internet or used bikes is that you have to learn to adjust them yourself. This is actually a benefit in my opinion. You can usually learn to adjust something quicker than it takes to drive the bike back to the dealer. Some dealers offer a basic adjustment plan for an extra cost, others offer it free.


Oh cool. I just saw on the one site that it simply said "polished aluminum." Glad to know it is top coated. I'm a junior in mechanical engineering and have a long history of automotive work, so I shouldn't have a problem adjusting the drivetrain. I've adjusted this cheapy Mongoose all I can stand. :madman:

After reading up on Motobecane a bit, I'm a little skeptical. Some people say their frames are outdated and not very good. Any reason why I shouldn't go with the 700 HT? The components are definitely the best of any bike I've looked into yet in this price range. I'll order it tonight unless someone here talks me out of it. :lol:


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Motobecane is a ghost brand. They filed for bankruptcy in 1981, and while a company formed from the remains still makes motorcycles, but the Motobecane bikes on BD have no relation to that original brand, beyond that someone is paying licensing fees to whoever owns the trade name.

BD's bikes are all made by Kinesis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinesis_Industry_Co._Ltd.

Kinesis also does frames for a lot of big American brands. Honestly, I'd say that one aluminum hardtail is much like another, at least until you start getting into upper-end racing bikes or the very bottom of the barrel Wal-mart stuff. From the geometry chart for the 700HT, the top tube runs about an inch short of what I'd expect for each size. That's suitable for a more upright riding position; whether that's good or bad is a matter of opinion, rider fitness, and intended use.

I'd say if you know what you're doing in terms of sizing and you can find an internet bike that you expect to be suitable, go for it. If you're going to need (and pay for) a lot of help from a shop, internet bikes tend to end up costing something more in line with LBS prices.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

AndrwSwitch said:


> ... From the geometry chart for the 700HT, the top tube runs about an inch short of what I'd expect for each size. ...


I guess it depends on one's perspective. I consider their geo middle of the road - not nearly as aggressive as a c'dale or fisher, but more than the 3700 he looked at.

The ett on a 19" 700ht is the same as the 21" trek -- 23.2".

http://motobecane.com/400_700ht/#geo
http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain_hardtail/3_series/3700disc/


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Well, vs. my expectations based on Specialized hardtails, and Trek 6000s and up. 

Sometimes I dream about having a bike company and using a rational sizing system.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

Trek 3xxx and 4xxx frames are relatively short in the top tube length department compared to Trek 6xxx and other brands. The 21" 3700 frame has an ETT of 591mm where the 6000 in a 21.5" has an ETT of 641mm (roughly 2" longer than the 3700 in a 21" frame). The 17.5" 6000 frame is 588mm.

If the OP can get by with the standover on the 21" Trek 3700, I don't think the top tube length will be an issue. If anything, the top tube will still be a little short by conventional standards.

A good shop will take a little time to try to assess your needs and get you sized appropriately. IMHO, the Trek dealer should explain the differences between the different models and see if you want to ride a bike with relatively relaxed geometry like the 3700 or 4000 series bikes or something more traditional (sporty/racey) like the 6000 series bikes.

A note to the OP: This is why they call this (bikes around this price point) an entry level bike. The entry level hardtail gets you out there and riding for a relatively modest price of admission. It will be your ticket to find out many things about yourself as a mountain biker. It will let you decide if this sport is something you wish to continue in. It will let you get a feel for the type of riding you wish to do the most. It will let you get a feel for the level and type of componentry you prefer and it will let you get a feel for the type of bike that really appeals to you the most. You should not really try to get the perfect bike the first time around because it's almost impossible to hit a home run when you actually know so little about yourself as a rider. Get an entry level bike, ride a lot, replace what breaks with modest replacement parts and try to resiste the upgrade bug. Instead of upgrading the entry level bike, start putting money aside for your 2nd bike, the 'dream bike'.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jeffj said:


> Trek 3xxx and 4xxx frames are relatively short in the top tube length department compared to Trek 6xxx and other brands. The 21" 3700 frame has an ETT of 591mm where the 6000 in a 21.5" has an ETT of 641mm (roughly 2" longer than the 3700 in a 21" frame). The 17.5" 6000 frame is 588mm.
> 
> If the OP can get by with the standover on the 21" Trek 3700, I don't think the top tube length will be an issue. If anything, the top tube will still be a little short by conventional standards.
> 
> ...


I understand. I don't make too many $500 purchases, so when I do, I want to make sure I'm not buying something I'm going to regret.

I must say that I do fit the Mongoose I have pretty well, and it measures 19.5" for the seat tube and 22" for the effective top tube (although the top tube is pretty much horizontal). One of the main considerations for this purchase is a good frame because I'm not dismissing the possibility of upgrading the bike later on. I'm definitely not planning on riding this one for a year and then dropping $1,000 on another bike. I want to make sure the frame is worthy of a few reasonable upgrades should I choose to do so.

EDIT: Just measured, and the 30.5" standover height on the 19" Motobecane is ideal for me (based on 1-2" of clearance).


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

It almost never makes sense to upgrade an entry level bike. You pretty much have to replace everything, and then the frame, and at that point, you've spent more than if you held off and bought a complete bike.

If you start upgrading much at all, it's going to be even more wildly inappropriate for locking up at school, so there's that too. When you finish school, hopefully, you'll have the kind of income that lets you make decisions like more expensive bikes.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

AndrwSwitch said:


> It almost never makes sense to upgrade an entry level bike. You pretty much have to replace everything, and then the frame, and at that point, you've spent more than if you held off and bought a complete bike.
> 
> If you start upgrading much at all, it's going to be even more wildly inappropriate for locking up at school, so there's that too. When you finish school, hopefully, you'll have the kind of income that lets you make decisions like more expensive bikes.


I see. Sorry for the noobness. 

So.....what you're all saying is that the Motobecane would probably make me happy? The frame was one of the only things that concerned me. Everything else seems acceptable (or better) for an entry-level mtb, correct?


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

If it fits, bikes like it are a great value.

If you think that you have an okay basis for reading a geometry chart and making sense of it, go for it. I'm fairly confident that I could do okay buying a bike online, but I have a MTB that fits me well, a 'cross bike that fits me well, and a road bike that's off, but in a way that I understand. So I'd start by figuring out the pertinent numbers on those frames, and I could then compare them to the numbers on geometry charts with some real-world basis. That's why the ETT you measured earlier is important - it's a relatively simple but extremely useful metric. Not that I might not still make a mistake...

If there's a Performance Bike near you, they often have comparable deals to BD, but you can hop on the bikes and try them out. So you might look for that.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

AndrwSwitch said:


> If it fits, bikes like it are a great value.
> 
> If you think that you have an okay basis for reading a geometry chart and making sense of it, go for it. I'm fairly confident that I could do okay buying a bike online, but I have a MTB that fits me well, a 'cross bike that fits me well, and a road bike that's off, but in a way that I understand. So I'd start by figuring out the pertinent numbers on those frames, and I could then compare them to the numbers on geometry charts with some real-world basis. That's why the ETT you measured earlier is important - it's a relatively simple but extremely useful metric. Not that I might not still make a mistake...
> 
> If there's a Performance Bike near you, they often have comparable deals to BD, but you can hop on the bikes and try them out. So you might look for that.


I wish there was but the closest one is in Georgia. I'm going to compare a few measurements with my Mongoose (the only real-world basis I have) and if I think everything is on-point, I'll probably order it tonight in hopes of it getting here this week. Sprtymama (ebay) is located in Florida, so hopefully shipping won't take too long.

EDIT: Thanks to everyone for the help and support! I definitely would have made an ill-informed choice had it not been for you guys.


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## jakedsnake (May 15, 2010)

Pay a little more and get a Trek 4300 Disc.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jakedsnake said:


> Pay a little more and get a Trek 4300 Disc.


I wish I had $700 to spend right now.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

I would for sure get that one form bd if I only had 500 to spend. I am thinking about getting a 600 dollar 29er from BD because the value is so good. Its not like a fs bike where the suspension needs to be perfect to work good its just a ht. If you look on the internet you can find all of the how to vids on how to adjust the bike and if you want to pm me I can call you and help you. Problem is I am in Germany so I am 6 hrs ahead of the states.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> I would for sure get that one form bd if I only had 500 to spend. I am thinking about getting a 600 dollar 29er from BD because the value is so good. Its not like a fs bike where the suspension needs to be perfect to work good its just a ht. If you look on the internet you can find all of the how to vids on how to adjust the bike and if you want to pm me I can call you and help you. Problem is I am in Germany so I am 6 hrs ahead of the states.


Thanks! I'll definitely keep that in mind should I run into trouble. :thumbsup:


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

The Motebecane 700 HT has been ordered! I'll be sure to compile a beginner's review of it once it arrives. Once again, thanks to everyone for all the info! :thumbsup: 

-Grant


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

jakedsnake said:


> Pay a little more and get a Trek 4300 Disc.


Why? Since when is a Trek 4300 Disc - with a Spinner fork and Promax brakes - any sort of good deal or great value?


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## Snagged7 (Feb 15, 2011)

g9m3c said:


> The Motebecane 700 HT has been ordered! I'll be sure to compile a beginner's review of it once it arrives. Once again, thanks to everyone for all the info! :thumbsup:
> 
> -Grant


Congrats on the new purchase. It is a great feeling to get a new bike.

Do you have to put together a bike that you order online?


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

Cool bro thats not a bad bike let us know how you like it.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Snagged7 said:


> Congrats on the new purchase. It is a great feeling to get a new bike.
> 
> Do you have to put together a bike that you order online?


Got this in an email from the seller.

"Bikes are shipped knocked down with pedals, handlebars, seat, and front wheel off.
The brakes and derailleurs will need some minor adjustment. It takes me about 25 minutes to setup a bike that is shipped like this. It is very easy to do."

Looking very forward to the bike getting here. According to the UPS tracking site, it shipped this morning, so I definitely can't complain about the handling speed. :thumbsup:


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

:thumbsup: Sweeeeeeet Nothing like getting a new bike:thumbsup: 

Cant wait to see how it looks :thumbsup:


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> :thumbsup: Sweeeeeeet Nothing like getting a new bike:thumbsup:
> 
> Cant wait to see how it looks :thumbsup:


Thanks! Me as well. I think I'm gonna like this polished aluminum look. I like shiny.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

I checked out an awesome trail today on the Mongoose. Can't wait to try it with the new rig. 

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=691362


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

g9m3c said:


> The Motebecane 700 HT has been ordered!


Come on, Grant - don't you want to support your local Trek dealer?

When I needed brake cable housing this week I found that I could get Jagwire housing from REI for $1.50/ft or Bontrager-brand housing from my local Trek dealer for $3.00/ft. Where do you think I bought my cable housing?

I want to like Trek and also my LBS but that's not possible when they try to stick it to me every way they can. No thanks. And if they both go out of business, it won't matter a wit to me. Between REI and Performance - one store each right near my work and another store each near my home - plus the internet, I've got my cycling bases covered.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Clones123 said:


> Come on, Grant - don't you want to support your local Trek dealer?


:lol: The value couldn't be ignored. If it ever needs work outside of my abilities, I'm not against taking it to a LBS, but it will be going to the smaller, old-fashioned place here. The bike mechanic I talked to there seemed much more down-to-earth than the other guys and he has been in the business for a LONG time.


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

g9m3c said:


> If it ever needs work outside of my abilities, I'm not against taking it to a LBS, but it will be going to the smaller, old-fashioned place here.


Not likely that will happen - it's all pretty simple and if you have questions there are a ton of resources on the internet to help.

For me, it's all about the cost of the special tool needed. If the tool I need costs more than three times the cost of asking a shop to do it (Steerer Race Puller, for instance) I'll pay for the labor rather than buy the tool.

So far I own:

Crank Puller
Cartridge BB tool
External BB tool
Cassette Removal tool
a full set of Cone wrenches

What I can't do that I've needed to do is:

Pull the race off a fork
I can't true a wheel to save my life


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Clones123 said:


> I can't true a wheel to save my life


I finally joined a shop that has a coop space so I could replace a spoke and do some halfway-quality work. Wheel truing's not rocket science, but you need a reference point, something that's pretty hard to MacGyver onto a modern, disc-brake MTB, and truing stands are a lot easier to work with than rim brakes anyway. I've built a few wheels and done a fair amount of truing, and while some posters here have come up with homebrew solutions that work for them, the quality of my work depends a lot on whether or not I used a truing stand.

The other thing you need is patience.


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## Snagged7 (Feb 15, 2011)

AndrwSwitch said:


> The other thing you need is patience.


Well that counts me out then.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Got the Motobecane in today. :thumbsup: I was pleasantly surprised when I saw the Avid brakes on it instead of the Tektros. Too bad I have a ton of studying to do today and I have to work tonight. I'll try to get some pics up later tonight if I have time to assemble it.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

Sweet how does it look you like it ?


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> Sweet how does it look you like it ?


I LOVE IT. :thumbsup:




























I rode it about a mile tonight and everything has exceeded my expectations so far. The build quality is outstanding. I haven't touched any adjustments on the drivetrain yet, and it still shifted very well. The brakes are amazing. The front brake cable came unassembled, so when I cut it to length, I wrapped electrical tape around it and cut in the middle of the tape. I'm gonna go back and dip the end of the cable in solder tomorrow to make it permanent.

Awesome bike is awesome.


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## Botman (Aug 3, 2010)

Nice bike :thumbsup:


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Botman said:


> Nice bike :thumbsup:


Thanks bud!


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

I've been ogling these welds all night. :lol:


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

Looks nice!

But something is missing. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Oh yeah, we need the 'couch shot'. 

Just do it!


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jeffj said:



> Looks nice!
> 
> But something is missing. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> 
> ...


You got it.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

Sweet bro thats a hell of a good bike for what you paid and you got the avid brakes:thumbsup: the quality of the frame looks good and I love the polished look.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> Sweet bro thats a hell of a good bike for what you paid and you got the avid brakes:thumbsup: the quality of the frame looks good and I love the polished look.


Thanks a lot! I'm definitely glad I went this route instead of the Trek.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

^^ Now that's what I'm talking about! ^^

Great couch shot.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

you did not show the drive side


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## tyscobe (Jan 28, 2011)

sweet looking ride. looks like we're in the same boat and ordered our 700HTs at roughly the same time. mine arrives tomorrow :thumbsup: i'm hoping i get the Avid brakes also. i actually ordered a 500HT a month ago but BD is letting me replace it w/ the 700HT even though i'm just out of the 30 day window  

question: when i put together the 500HT, all the cables were assembled. you mentioned having to assemble the front brake cable and having to cut it lenght... how much did you cut off and anything tricky about this?


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

tyscobe said:


> sweet looking ride. looks like we're in the same boat and ordered our 700HTs at roughly the same time. mine arrives tomorrow :thumbsup: i'm hoping i get the Avid brakes also. i actually ordered a 500HT a month ago but BD is letting me replace it w/ the 700HT even though i'm just out of the 30 day window
> 
> question: when i put together the 500HT, all the cables were assembled. you mentioned having to assemble the front brake cable and having to cut it lenght... how much did you cut off and anything tricky about this?


Nope, nothing too tricky. The way I did it was align the slots in the silver cable adjustment nut and its silver lock nut with the slot on the front brake lever housing. Then, you can slide the cable inside the assembly.










Squeeze the brake lever to expose the attachment point for the cable on the lever and position the barrel-shaped end of the cable in this slot on the lever. Now you can release the lever and turn both nuts a 1/4 turn to misalign the slots with the slot in the lever housing. This will prevent the cable from falling out while you continue.

Next, position the black cable sheath into the end of the adjustment nut on the lever housing and position the opposite end into the the adjustment nut on the front brake caliper. You can just slide the cable through this nut and then align the sheath inside of it, as well. Now, loosen the cable stay bolt on the arm of the brake caliper and slide the cable between the arm and the cable stay. Pull the slack out of the cable and tighten the cable stay bolt. Now you can cut the cable while leaving about 2" of extra length past the cable stay.

I wrapped a piece of electrical tape around my cut mark before I cut the cable so it wouldn't fray. This won't last forever, so it's best if you can solder it or squeeze a cable end on it, although I have no clue where to find those.

You'll have to adjust the cable with the adjustment nuts and/or by loosening the cable stay bolt and pulling even more slack out of the cable before tightening it again.

I'm well aware that I have over-explained this, but you can't say I didn't try! :lol:


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> you did not show the drive side


It's already muddy, so too late for that now.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

This forum generally prefers shots of muddy bikes.

Have at it.  Maybe not on the couch...


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

tyscobe said:


> you mentioned having to assemble the front brake cable and having to cut it lenght... how much did you cut off and anything tricky about this?


You can make the cutting of brake/shifter cable and housing (or hose) a lot easier for FREE by making yourself a small cutting block that you can clamp in a vise. Just put two very small pieces of scrap wood together and drill straight through the center along the seam. With the hole just a little smaller in diameter than your hose/housing, the block firmly grips either material making it easy to use a knife (for hydraulic hose) or hacksaw (for cable housing) to cut a clean, square end.

To cut cable, add a groove near one edge to hold the cable and saw a perpendicular slot part-way through the block. Use a fine-tooth hacksaw blade to gently cut though and you won't fray the end of your cables at all. With a clean cut on the end, cables are less likely to unravel as you insert them through new housing and crimp-on ends are easier to apply too.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

I just found a couple of cable ends in the bag the front caliper came in.


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## tyscobe (Jan 28, 2011)

Awesome, thanks for the detailed instructions. I'll check for those cable ends in the bag too. My 700HT is out for delivery... patiently waiting :smilewinkgrin: 

I also noticed that the price of the 700HT is now $550 (up $50). i noticed your sig says 2010. I can't remember if the listing was for a 2010 when I ordered but the listing now says 2011. I checked my emails from BD and it doesn't state the year of the 700HT I ordered. The specs look the same though. Just thought that was interesting...


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

tyscobe said:


> Awesome, thanks for the detailed instructions. I'll check for those cable ends in the bag too. My 700HT is out for delivery... patiently waiting :smilewinkgrin:
> 
> I also noticed that the price of the 700HT is now $550 (up $50). i noticed your sig says 2010. I can't remember if the listing was for a 2010 when I ordered but the listing now says 2011. I checked my emails from BD and it doesn't state the year of the 700HT I ordered. The specs look the same though. Just thought that was interesting...


Hmm, I dunno. Sprtymama(bikes direct)'s listing on ebay says 2010, but it might just be outdated. I don't really know how to tell if mine is a '10 or '11. I paid $495.99 shipped to the door.


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## jpeters (Nov 19, 2010)

Hey how does that fork feel g9m3c is it diving alot do you think you need a new spring? I am pretty sure at 175 you should be fine. What size bike did you get I hope a large? How do you like those brakes are they working good for ya?


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

jpeters said:


> Hey how does that fork feel g9m3c is it diving alot do you think you need a new spring? I am pretty sure at 175 you should be fine. What size bike did you get I hope a large? How do you like those brakes are they working good for ya?


The fork feels fine, at least to me. As my skills sharpen, it might become a weakness but it seems great at the moment. I got the 19" frame which I think they call a medium. It fits me well. I rode a 21" Trek at the LBS and it felt a good bit too large for me. The brakes are ridiculously powerful. The front can be a little touchy, but that's probably because I'm used to the crappy brakes on my old bike. :lol:


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Ride through a winter and you'll want more powerful brakes. 

In most catalogs, 19" is a large. So an average-sized American man is actually more likely to ride a large than a medium. Go figure. It looks like you've got plenty of potential to make your reach longer if you start feeling cramped, so the bike is probably big enough if you're comfortable now.

Getting enough leg extension? That saddle looks very low to my eye, for someone 6' tall, although I don't know that frame or your proportions.

Anyway, have fun, and go buy a $70 U-lock.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Ride through a winter and you'll want more powerful brakes.
> 
> In most catalogs, 19" is a large. So an average-sized American man is actually more likely to ride a large than a medium. Go figure. It looks like you've got plenty of potential to make your reach longer if you start feeling cramped, so the bike is probably big enough if you're comfortable now.
> 
> ...


Yea, the leg extension is fine. I kept the seat pretty low while I was riding trails so I could move around a little easier though.

EDIT: Also, I weighed my old Mongoose today: 37 pounds. The Motobecane is 7.5 pounds lighter. :thumbsup:


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## Fish_Sticks (Mar 15, 2011)

This was a good read.

How is the 700HT holding up?


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Fish_Sticks said:


> This was a good read.
> 
> How is the 700HT holding up?


Pretty nicely so far! When I was setting up the bike, I noticed the rear wheel and both brake rotors were very slightly warped. I thought with some application time, the rotors might straighten themselves but that hasn't happened yet. What's the best way to go about this? Is this normal?

Other than that, I have no complaints. I've been riding it around campus this morning while enjoying the terrific weather we're having lately. :thumbsup:


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## Clones123 (Apr 29, 2010)

g9m3c said:


> I thought with some application time, the rotors might straighten themselves but that hasn't happened yet. What's the best way to go about this? Is this normal?


I don't think this is 'normal' but not all that unusual either. In point of fact, there is a special tool one can buy for truing rotors (though such a tool seems unnecessary). The most common method to true a rotor is with a large adjustable wrench. Either right on the bike or laid half off a table, you can use the wrench to apply subtle bending to the rotor.

I've done this myself and been anal enough to want to put tape on the wrench jaws to reduce the chances of scratching. Really not a big deal to do. The trickiest part is actually carefully, evenly and progressively tightening the fasteners on a 6-bolt rotor (torque wrench recommended) to avoid getting warps later on.


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## g9m3c (Mar 3, 2011)

Clones123 said:


> I don't think this is 'normal' but not all that unusual either. In point of fact, there is a special tool one can buy for truing rotors (though such a tool seems unnecessary). The most common method to true a rotor is with a large adjustable wrench. Either right on the bike or laid half off a table, you can use the wrench to apply subtle bending to the rotor.
> 
> I've done this myself and been anal enough to want to put tape on the wrench jaws to reduce the chances of scratching. Really not a big deal to do. The trickiest part is actually carefully, evenly and progressively tightening the fasteners on a 6-bolt rotor (torque wrench recommended) to avoid getting warps later on.


See, that could be where I went wrong. These are 6 bolt and I just used an allen wrench. Now, over the years of wrenching, I'd like to think I have a good feel for wrench torque but nothing can replace a torque wrench. I think that might be my next approach.

What's the recommended method for truing wheels yourself?


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

g9m3c said:


> What's the recommended method for truing wheels yourself?


You need a truing stand and a spoke wrench. You can find instructions, once you have those things, on parktool.com.

For a lot of us, a good truing stand is too expensive to be worth owning. There are some alternatives. Another poster here, Mike T., has a site he put together to encourage people to work on their own wheels, and with some tips as to how to do it without buying some of the large-ticket items.

http://miketechinfo.com/new-tech-wheels-tires.htm

Honestly, I prefer a professional wheel truing stand. I joined a bike coop in my area recently because I'm going to be building some wheels for one of my nicer bikes soon, and I've noticed that the quality of my work correlates strongly with whether I used a truing stand or not.

None of it is rocket science, but it takes patience.


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## LolaS (May 17, 2011)

I went with the Haro FL3 over the Trek 3700 because of the price. Everything between the two is comparable. I picked the green over the red. It really just comes down to personal preference of frame design and color. 
Been riding on moderate trails around town, getting muddy, riding thru the river overflow on the trails. It's a nice bike. I'm perfectly happy with it. 
I almost went for a Motobecane. Maybe if I get a road bike, that's the one.


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## Karl Smith (Aug 2, 2012)

Moved


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