# Tubular MTB wheels?



## Hardtailforever (Feb 11, 2004)

Anyone out there using them? Seems like they are showing up more and more at races. With better tire choices and tires coming in under 500g and rims under 300g, this seems like a pretty sweet lightweight and durable setup, not to mention the performance benefits and reliability for XC racing.


----------



## AlexRandall (Apr 2, 2009)

great for worldcup XC racing due to pit zones out on course. Not great for normal XC or marathon due to tricky repair. I think the rolling benefit and better puncture resistance would be a big plus if you chose to use them. Not a superlight standout by today's standards, but competitive with the best nonetheless.


----------



## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

As long as you have a pit crew and a couple of mounted sets as spares...


----------



## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

What is it that makes people believe tubulars roll faster? It is an old myth and by todays standards not true anymore!
Even on the roadbikes tubulars got passed by the clincher tires in rollingresitance!!You'll see many testresults below for road tubulars and clincher tires as well and if you take a closer look you'll see that the Tufo Tubulars have some of the highest numbers regarding rollingresistance....well up in the 50s while the best are around 35 watts (needed at 30km/h). And another test shows that good clinchers are sub 30 Watts.

Maybe have a closer look at the numbers below where german BIKE magazine tested 3 different MTB setups a couple of years ago. They tested rollingresistance as well as the height this setup could take for a weight to fall onto the rim before it punctures.Obvioulsy the tubular setup is much better here. Also better is the XC-1 tire as this has a thick rubber"shield" at the base where it attaches to the clincher rim...where the cuts come from. 
-A "regular" setup using a Racing Ralph 2.0" with Sealant.....20.1 watt......60cm
-A Tufo XC-1 "Clincher-tubular" tire.....................................20.8 watt......65cm
-A Dugast Tubular.............................................................26,8 watt......70cm
.

Weight wise tubular is heavier as well. It's only Tufo that offers light Tubulars. Same as on Roadbikes where you can get very light tubulars from Tufo BUT Tufo tubulars are the slowest rolling tubulars you can possibly buy!! There's several tests that show that Tufo tubulars roll extremely slow. Me too i once was bitten by the virus and wanted to get my roadbike to 5 kilos even...i got myself some of those lightweight Tufos only to find out that riding them is like riding against some wind. Really! I took them off after just 1 or 2 rides. I couldn't stand loosing 1-2 km/h on the flats when the only other benefit was the happy feeling to own a 5,0 kilo bike....I haven't seen any such rolliresistance test of tubular MTB tires though but i have my doubts they got it together when they aren't able to do so on the road tubulars. Anyway - the test shown below is a couple of years old.It might well be they got things better by today but they would need quite an improvement looking at these verified numbers.

Tubulars on the other hand are said to offer a superb feel and bump absorption which also makes for better grip. Also tubulars can be run at lower pressures without having to fear the possible snakebites as the tubular rims are basically flat and well rounded on the sides so damages are reduced to the max. BUT the risk to get a flat from punctures is still the same and especially with the high-praised Dugast collés there is no way to add sealant and no way to repair them after you get a flat....so as mentioned by the others you need a pit-crew and a couple of spare sets around.

For me Tubulars are a niche and only an option for Pros with pit crews and several wheelsets
IF you ride collees Dugast seems the way to go but those are insanely priced
Dugast colles can't be ridden with sealant as the valve can't be opened. I think Mr. Dugast makes this for a reason...and he makes a good living out of this.


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

i have this set , received yesterday . for my Flash 29er 

29" carbon tubolar set for Lefty

front wheel is 600 g , rear is 780 g

Dugast tyres with Caffelatex sealant and Aquasure to be waterproof

tyres + sealant add each about 600 g


nino : only sealants with ammonia are forbidden .


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

AlexRandall said:


> great for worldcup XC racing due to pit zones out on course. Not great for normal XC or marathon due to tricky repair. I think the rolling benefit and better puncture resistance would be a big plus if you chose to use them. Not a superlight standout by today's standards, but competitive with the best nonetheless.


mmmm some 29er wheelsets are about 950 g ... if this is not a superlight set up ...

to repair :

can be used Loctite 406 ... i have a little bottle in my camelback . it dries in 10 seconds , it becomes soft when dry ... try it

can be used sealant inside , but Caffelatex only ( others are too aggressive for casing )


----------



## Dan Gerous (Feb 18, 2004)

We all know the pros and cons it seems. I know a few guys running tubies, they all rave about it and wont go back to clinchers (tubeless or not). I would trust people who try and ride things more than some numbers from a magazine. Seems weight weenies are more interested in numbers on a scale, in a Excel file or in a lab study than actually riding the bikes...


----------



## unsuspended (Dec 17, 2005)

I thought about springing for a set of tubulars a while ago. I still want them though. Even with discounts I can get on Reynolds Wheels and Geax tires, they are still cost prohibitive for me (or so my wife says).


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

lovely 1st ride  

what a carving power !! sticky sensations !! glued to terrain !!


----------



## YB1 (Apr 15, 2006)

Nice.


----------



## Hardtailforever (Feb 11, 2004)

Got some Edge Composites wheels, with DT hubs. After one ride on very rocky, loose, off-cambre terrain, my impressions were very good. Wheels are unbelievably stiff and will track through anything. They came set up with some GEAX tires, which aren't super light, but they have unbelievable traction. Running Caffelatex in them with confidence. I plan on getting some Tufos XC2 tires for them for a lighter setup. I'll post more when I take the current tires off and can weigh the wheels separately.


----------



## djphill (May 11, 2008)

picked these up yesterday

Edge Composite Tubular Rims
Tune Prince/Princess Hubs
Scrub Rotors + ti bolts
Relic Quick Releases
Tufo XC2 Plus Tubular Tyres
DT Aero Lite Spokes

Weight 1060 grams
ready to ride Front 1064 grams
Rear 1341 grams with sram xx 11-36 cassette


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

great set !!!


----------



## dennis rides Scott (Mar 3, 2005)

I saw these numbers form Nino earlier. I have tested some tubular wheels for a few rides. My opinion is that I NEVER was so impressed with a combo like this. There was so much more speed and grip, that I just can't believe those numbers from that German magazine. Sadly I don't race. I have built me a set with Dugast tubes, but haven't had the chance to use them. Simply because I have no mechanics waiting for me when I go out riding  Probably going to sell these before they got used :blush: .


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

djphill said:


> picked these up yesterday
> 
> Edge Composite Tubular Rims
> Tune Prince/Princess Hubs
> ...


11-34 really from XX ? i know XX are 11-32 and 11-36 only


----------



## djphill (May 11, 2008)

eliflap said:


> 11-34 really from XX ? i know XX are 11-32 and 11-36 only


sorry thats what i meant 11-36


----------



## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

djphill said:


> picked these up yesterday
> 
> Edge Composite Tubular Rims
> Tune Prince/Princess Hubs
> ...


Wow, that set, as is looks to be around $3000 USD.


----------



## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

djphill that's an impressive weight for the complete wheels! 
Do you know the weight of the wheels only without tires and cassette etc?


----------



## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

sergio_pt said:


> djphill that's an impressive weight for the complete wheels!
> Do you know the weight of the wheels only without tires and cassette etc?


Quoted in his post @ 1060g.


----------



## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

my set is 1198 g only wheels for lefty


----------



## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

Eliflap, where have you got that wheels from?

A pro friend?


----------



## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

Circlip said:


> Quoted in his post @ 1060g.


ok, But I'm curious about the individual weight of the wheels.

what's the weight of the Tufo XC2 Plus Tubular Tyres and the Edge carbon rims?


----------



## djphill (May 11, 2008)

sergio_pt said:


> ok, But I'm curious about the individual weight of the wheels.
> 
> what's the weight of the Tufo XC2 Plus Tubular Tyres and the Edge carbon rims?


Edge Rims 247 grams
256 grams

Tufo XC2 Tyres 452 grams
458 grams

Tune Prince 196 grams
Tune Princess 103 grams

28 DT AeroLite Spokes with Edge nipples x2 ??????? didnt get a chance to weigh the spokes

Tufo Tyre Tape was 50grams x2


----------



## Rivet (Sep 3, 2004)

Wow Nino. German products won a BIKE magazine test, how amazing, that never happens.


----------



## Madcow... (May 27, 2010)

djphill said:


> 28 DT AeroLite Spokes with Edge nipples x2 ??????? didnt get a chance to weigh the spokes


For Aerolites or CxRay and a matching Pillar nipple (which is what Edge uses) you can figure and avg weight of 4.54grams per spoke/nipple. So for your set that should mean 254grams give or take a gram.

As for the tubs, they really do ride fast. I've ridden several versions of tub mtb wheels with different tires and have yet to find one I didn't like. I don't think so much importance should be placed on CRR tests for mtb tires. There is so much more that goes into riding an mtb. Constantly accelerating, decelerating, changing lines, changing terrain, ground firmness and smoothness etc... I'd be willing to be that with the dimensions of an mtb tire/ wheel that aerodynamics plays a role as well(unless you're always under 12mph). Then of course you have to worry about grip and punctures as well. It just seems to me that there are so many things that go into finding the right mtb tire that worrying about small differences from a drum test is the last thing you should consider.


----------

