# Going tubeless with weight more than 200 lbs?



## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

I have been riding seriously for about the past 2 months, and I am having all sorts of trouble with flats in my tube tires. I'm on a hardtail 29er and it has been suggested to me to try tubeless. I have a pair of used Geax Seguaro tires, some steel bead WTB tires, and also one Kenda small block 8 tire. My rims are mavic 719s.

I read up on some of the Ghetto tubeless articles and I think I may try it. 

The biggest issue to me is my weight. I am at 225 on the scale at home, so probably about 235 with all clothes and riding gear on. Who has succesfully run a tubeless setup in this weight catagory and how did you do it? I don't have much money to put towards it, that's why I was looking at the ghetto way. I saw some recipes for sealant and using a tube as a rim strip and all. I'm not sure exactly how all of it works. I might try it on one wheel first and then maybe do the other if It works okay.


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## CxAgent2 (Oct 24, 2007)

I am (now) almost exactly your weight. I have been running tubeless since about June 2010 when I got a new 29'r. I'm running a Stan's setup on Stan's flow rims and Kenda Nevegals. (Yes I know Kenda does like Stan's inside their tires.) I have had very good results. I burped a tire a couple of times when I first started running tubeless. Once I cranked the pressure up to 25 - 30 I've had very good results. Most of the problems I've had have been when I got side wall cuts on sharp rocks or a BUNCH of thorns that was just too much for the Stan's to handle.

Some buddies have been running the getto tubeless and seem happy with it. For the time/effort required I would try the cut up inner tube for a rim strip and valve stem and use Stan's liquid. Save having to find, mix, store, etc. the liquid.


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## De La Pena (Oct 7, 2008)

There are no weight limits. Do it. I am 215 and ride hard 2-4 foot drops on my regular trail. I have not had a flat since going tubeless 2 years ago. Ghetto tubeless up front and UST Rear. I will never run tubes again.


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## snowdrifter (Aug 2, 2006)

I would go with UST Tires, standard tires and ghetto tubeless are good for burping, unless you keep the pressures high.


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## mtnbiker72 (Jan 22, 2007)

cncwhiz said:


> I have been riding seriously for about the past 2 months, and I am having all sorts of trouble with flats in my tube tires. I'm on a hardtail 29er and it has been suggested to me to try tubeless. I have a pair of used Geax Seguaro tires, some steel bead WTB tires, and also one Kenda small block 8 tire. My rims are mavic 719s.
> 
> I read up on some of the Ghetto tubeless articles and I think I may try it.
> 
> The biggest issue to me is my weight. I am at 225 on the scale at home, so probably about 235 with all clothes and riding gear on. Who has succesfully run a tubeless setup in this weight catagory and how did you do it? I don't have much money to put towards it, that's why I was looking at the ghetto way. I saw some recipes for sealant and using a tube as a rim strip and all. I'm not sure exactly how all of it works. I might try it on one wheel first and then maybe do the other if It works okay.


I'm right about the same weight and have been using a ghetto tubeless setup for two years now. I've used both the Tube method and the Gorilla Tape (currently) method. Both have worked well most of the time. Tubeless Ready or Wire Bead tires have been the most reliable (there are no true UST 29er tires anymore so I haven't used UST tires). I have had no burps or blow offs as long as I run my tires at 25-30psi (I had one major burp but I was testing the limits on a icy day and had my tires at about 15psi). Folding bead standard tires are more of a crapshoot, I'm running Michelin's right now that work great but I've had some issues with others (had a Bontrager blow off my rim at 30psi in my garage...just sitting there!). There are some great videos on Youtube showing how to set up both options.

Good Luck


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

So what constitutes a UST tire? I have the three mentioned. Are any of those UST?


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## mtnbiker72 (Jan 22, 2007)

cncwhiz said:


> So what constitutes a UST tire? I have the three mentioned. Are any of those UST?


UST is a tubeless standard developed by Mavic. It includes specific requirements for bead shape and air retention. There are currently NO UST 29er tires on the market. Geax used to make one but I don't remember the model. If your Geax were UST, it would clearly say on the sidewall. There are however many Tubeless Ready tires in the 29" size. These are tires that use a tubeless bead that meets UST standards but a lighter casing that is not entirely air tight. So a sealant (generally latex based) needs to be used to keep them air tight. Geax does make these and they're referred to as TNT (Tubes No Tubes). If your Geax tires are TNT it will also say it on the sidewall. Your Kenda is not Tubeless Ready (they don't make them) and the WTB tires aren't either (they just started making TCS tires but they are not wire bead).

If your Geax are TNT, I would recommend using them. Second choice would be the wire bead WTB's.


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## SquishyPanda (Jul 19, 2010)

I just did the ghetto conversion on my 29er with Panaracer Rampage 2.35's and Alex EN24 rims, using a 26" inner tube as a rim strip. Haven't ridden it yet, but I don't do big drops or anything. I seated them at 55psi and they've held air for almost 2 days hanging from the garage ceiling, so I'm feeling confident. I'm 240lbs and rode this bike with tubes at just under 30psi on trails, 45-50 around campus.

I'm hoping the better rolling I hear about with tubeless means I can just leave it at 30psi and not have to air it up/down all the time


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

SquishyPanda said:


> I just did the ghetto conversion on my 29er with Panaracer Rampage 2.35's and Alex EN24 rims, using a 26" inner tube as a rim strip. Haven't ridden it yet, but I don't do big drops or anything. I seated them at 55psi and they've held air for almost 2 days hanging from the garage ceiling, so I'm feeling confident. I'm 240lbs and rode this bike with tubes at just under 30psi on trails, 45-50 around campus.
> 
> I'm hoping the better rolling I hear about with tubeless means I can just leave it at 30psi and not have to air it up/down all the time


I'm gonna attempt it soon. Let me know how your setup works if you don't mind. Send me a pm with an update if you get a chance. I would appreciate it


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

mtnbiker72 said:


> UST is a tubeless standard developed by Mavic. It includes specific requirements for bead shape and air retention. There are currently NO UST 29er tires on the market. Geax used to make one but I don't remember the model. If your Geax were UST, it would clearly say on the sidewall. There are however many Tubeless Ready tires in the 29" size. These are tires that use a tubeless bead that meets UST standards but a lighter casing that is not entirely air tight. So a sealant (generally latex based) needs to be used to keep them air tight. Geax does make these and they're referred to as TNT (Tubes No Tubes). If your Geax tires are TNT it will also say it on the sidewall. Your Kenda is not Tubeless Ready (they don't make them) and the WTB tires aren't either (they just started making TCS tires but they are not wire bead).
> 
> If your Geax are TNT, I would recommend using them. Second choice would be the wire bead WTB's.


How would I know if they are TNT? Would it be written on the tire? I bought them used and don't have them sitting in front of me at the moment. They have old sealant inside of them, so I'm sure the previous owner was running them tubeless.


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## dysfunction (Aug 15, 2009)

it would be written on the sidewall.


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## mtnbiker72 (Jan 22, 2007)

cncwhiz said:


> How would I know if they are TNT? Would it be written on the tire? I bought them used and don't have them sitting in front of me at the moment. They have old sealant inside of them, so I'm sure the previous owner was running them tubeless.


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

mtnbiker72 said:


>


thanks!


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

Ok I checked out mt Geax Seguaros last night and they are TNT 

I bought them used from a guy in Texas and they probably still have about 50% life in them. I might try to come up with some ingridients this weekend to do some sealant. My rims have holes sized for presta valves. Does this mean that if I use a 26" tube to do the rim seal, that I need one with a presta valve? I don't thing the schrader valve stem will fit through the hole.


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## dysfunction (Aug 15, 2009)

That'd be what that means, unless you drill it out to fit schraders. IMO though the gorilla tape method's easier and works just as well


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## paulrb02 (Aug 3, 2009)

I bought a set of Stan's Flow wheels, so I can't speak on the ghetto end, but I'm 260 naked and I am riding my tubeless just fine. Weight is not an issue here.


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

I got my tubeless conversion done last night folks. It wasn't as hard as I thought it would be and didn't take long at all. I decided to mount the used Geax Sagauro tires. I called Geax and talked to them and they explained why not to use a non UST tire in further detail. They said that once a non UST tire has been mounted on a rim with a tube inside and inflated, it actually stretches the tire to an extent. Then, when an attempt is made to mount it up tubeless, the tire will have a greater chance of burping because of being stretched. Also, the UST designed tires have a coating of rubber on the inside to help hold air. 

I did the gorilla tape method and used my own mix of sealant, which was 1 part mold builders latex, 1 part slime, 1 part antifreeze, and 2 parts water. I used a presta valve cut from a tube for each rim and mounted them up. I must say this was my first experience with a UST type tire and a I had to fight with the bead to get it over the rim. Wow. 

The first tire seated instantly, a little leakage from the tape overlap near the inflation valve. The sealant sealed it up pretty quick though. I put 6 ounces in each tire. I inflated the tires to hold a decent ammount of air, but I didn't have an air psi gauge handy so I don't know exactly how much. The back tire acted up a little and didn't want to seat, but after picking up the wheel and rotating it and flipping it and doing the same (to distribute the sealant a little) it popped right on. The same leakage from the tape overlap there as well, but it sealed up. Both are still holding air this morning. 

I'm really excited. I'm not out of the woods yet though because I still have not reinstalled the wheels an attempted to ride but I think they will do fine.


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## CaveGiant (Aug 21, 2007)

I went tubeless because I weigh as much as you.


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## eokerholm (Apr 9, 2005)

Not to burst your bubble or burp your tire, but at 260 I couldn't go tubeless...or couldn't for long....

I'm on Flows. Tried Neves and Rampages. No luck.
PSI too low and the sidewalls tear. Even at 50+ PSI the sidewalls would tear.

Absolutely loved the rotational weight savings and it is totally noticable, but I couldn't get a tire to hold up.

Need the tube for sidewall support. Use old Tubes, and put in my own Slime (Super cheap at Home Depot or Lowes compared to LBS), wipe with alcohol, and patch. Heavier, but I don't flat, pinch, or snake bite.....


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

I'm hoping that won't happen. I had a set of Kenda small blocks and the sidewalls are like paper. The first flat I had was when one of those blew a sidewall when I hit a sharp rock or something. That was running tubes. 

Both of these Geax Sagauro tires are now at 35 psi. I'm gonna check them tonight and see if they have leaked down any. I expect to have to add air but I'm just looking for any significant air loss. 

The Sagauros seem to have a pretty sturdy sidewalls.


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## CxAgent2 (Oct 24, 2007)

Interesting. Somewhere between 260 and 230 seems to be the weight cutoff for tubeless. I weight ~230lbs, ride Nevegals on Stan's Flow rims, on the same/similar trails as eokerholm - but I run tubeless. I have had 2 - 3 sidewall cuts since I made the conversion about 6 months ago. But I think I would have had that many flats with tubes. So I keep running tubeless.:thumbsup: 

Some of the people I ride with seem to have flats almost every ride. They are running tubeless Maxxis and Specialized tires but I doubt they break 150 lbs.


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## norm (Feb 20, 2005)

Go tubeless, and don't look back. One of the better bike investment I've made. I would use some sealant as some have said.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

eokerholm said:


> Not to burst your bubble or burp your tire, but at 260 I couldn't go tubeless...or couldn't for long....
> 
> I'm on Flows. Tried Neves and Rampages. No luck.
> PSI too low and the sidewalls tear. Even at 50+ PSI the sidewalls would tear.
> ...


Interesting. My weight has been 255 to 275 (nekit) and I've been riding 29" Flow rims tubeless for the past year and a half. The only tires I have had issues with are S-Works Eskars (I tore one S-Works Eskar sidewall myself and my 190lb son tore the other one. . . .) . Kenda Karmas, WTB Wolverine & Exiwolf have all been great tubeless and I never run over 30psi. Currently running 2.2" Specialized Captain (Control) and 2.2" Purgatory (Control) tires. I average about 4 rides a week.


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## Ike Turner (Dec 20, 2006)

I run 2.4 Ardent front and rear tubeless. Rigid. I mount them on a Velocity p35 rim. the 35mm width allows me to run less pressure now. at 217 I am running 19 lbs in the front and still feel like I could take some out.


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## cncwhiz (Sep 8, 2010)

I rode yesterday for the first time to see how they would work out. Wow what a difference!

I am at 35 psi front and rear, but I am on a 20mm? (about 3/4" wide) mavic 719 rim. I weigh around 225, and this is a hardtail so I am a little nervous about going lower psi. 

My previous setup was tubes of course, running 50 psi front and rear to prevent any type of flats. Just imagine the ride on those pressures. The back tire did more bouncing than rolling..

I just took it out for the short part of our trail at 4 miles to get a feel for it. I was pushing a little more, but my results amazed me. My previous best was 37 min in the 4 mile. Yesterday I went 23.19!!!

Norticeable improvements were 1) better ride quality. As you probably know, having a little bit of "give" in the rear tire really helps with a hardtail. The bike stuck like glue on the drops and really handled better. More tire footprint on the ground because of less air inside and better squish, and better traction in the turns and climbing as well. 2) My feelings may deceive me, but I think I actually notice the less rolling resistance. It really is better. 

I'm sold 

My setup seems to be working okay. I was nervous that I would have trouble but it looks like it's going to work out so I am glad about that.


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## Ike Turner (Dec 20, 2006)

I am not an expert and I am not sure how accurate gauges are and respect personal preference. But 35 psi tubeless would be quite high for my riding. That is about my max on a 26 tubed setup.


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## TooTallUK (Jul 5, 2005)

eokerholm said:


> Not to burst your bubble or burp your tire, but at 260 I couldn't go tubeless...or couldn't for long....
> 
> I'm on Flows. Tried Neves and Rampages. No luck.
> PSI too low and the sidewalls tear. Even at 50+ PSI the sidewalls would tear.


I was 250 plus riding kit and had no issues with Flows and tubeless - currently running Bonty tubeless ready and not had a single problem with them. I can run the pressures high enough for me.


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## SquishyPanda (Jul 19, 2010)

My Rampage 29x2.35/ Alex EN-24/Ghetto tubeless/Stan's combo is still holding up. The front seems to lose pressure slowly so I'll have to put some more sealant in there.

I'm not a very good rider so I can't say how it holds up in aggressive off-road adventures, but I'm 240-250lbs and ride mostly around campus. I can't bunnyhop to save my life so I get up on curbs by popping up the front wheel to clear it and then letting the rear one bash into the curb, and haven't had a burp yet.

Yeah, pretty hardcore, I know.


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## 3fast3furious (Dec 10, 2010)

What most of these guys are saying is true. Weight doesn't matter all that much on tubeless. I have been using it for a few years now with weight ranging between 235 and 265. I wouldn't worry at your weight. Although I would suggest at some point to get some tubeless specific stuff to avoid having any issues. Stan's rims are the best at not burping your air out. I have had a few pairs of their rims and they are way better than the other ones that I have used before.


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## Surfdog93 (May 30, 2005)

cncwhiz said:


> I rode yesterday for the first time to see how they would work out. Wow what a difference!
> 
> I am at 35 psi front and rear, but I am on a 20mm? (about 3/4" wide) mavic 719 rim. I weigh around 225, and this is a hardtail so I am a little nervous about going lower psi.
> 
> ...


Great to be enjoying the tubeless....I'm 225lbs and relatively new to riding as well, about 6 months now but 3-4 x / week and making a lot of changes. I monitor my times on a regular basis and continue to make improvements, but none as significant as yours. I doubt that your time dropping from 37 minutes to 23 minutes is due entirely to going tubeless......other forces must be present


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## Breitness24 (May 7, 2010)

sorry to thread jack . i have 29er flows and kenda SB8s can those tires be ran tubeless the sidewalls seem kind of thin thanks!!!


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## INeedGears! (Jul 29, 2010)

I've been running tubeless for several years. 3 years ago I was 290, today I'm 240. I have several wheelsets all setup as tubless and not one UST tire. Using a Maxxis Ardent/Ignitor set and most commonly Crossmarks. I ride a lot of different terrain and have never torn a sidewall (although it is possible even on UST). Generally speaking I use 28-32psi


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## AL29er (Jan 14, 2004)

Another clyde weighing in...

I have been dedicated on tubeless via one variation or another since ~2005. I have run every variation of ghetto and stans conversions that were logical. After 5 years I have tried on over 50 different tires and a over a dozen wheelsets (I could list them, but we will get off topic fast. Here are some of the tires I tested back in 2009 on the 26in platform.).

Here is the bottom line:
It depends on how you ride and where you ride 
-26in Full UST tires are the most durable (_of course they are actually heavier than the tubed equivalent by the time you have sealant in them_). You can ride, jump, and bash them off whatever. On rare occasion you will have a 5-10psi burp. By rare I mean that either you forget to check tire pressure pre-ride, you over steer on an off camber with a bump/rock, or you land cockeye off a jump, or you come in side-loaded off a 4+ft jump/drop.

So where does this leave the 29er??
Screwed for the most part. Dedicated 29er UST came and went. Nobody wanted to run a tire that big and heavy. So you have to run a conversion tire. I would also recommend keeping the tires within about 24in of the ground at all times if you value your teeth. Okay, that sounds bad. Honestly there are some decent 29er tires that convert well and have decent sidewall protection. Personally I run tubes in my 29er AM rig so I don't have to worry about burps. But I can get away with tubeless just fine on my 29er hardtail. In fact I prefer that bike tubeless. Despite riding the same trails, the way I ride is different when I am on a 5in bike vs a 100mm front suspension hardtail.


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## Gunnur (Apr 29, 2010)

*SB8s*



Breitness24 said:


> sorry to thread jack . i have 29er flows and kenda SB8s can those tires be ran tubeless the sidewalls seem kind of thin thanks!!!


I was told that the SB8s will not hold air tubeless. The sidewalls are too porous/thin? Was in your position and ended up with 2.1 ignitors F/R.


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