# Goat head thorns: Dealing with nature's tire spikes



## Pollution Warrior (Apr 3, 2010)

I live in an area with a lot of goat head thorns (see photo). A friend and I once had a total of about 20 punctures in three tubes all at once. I hate these things. They're like little tire spikes. 

Any suggestions on preventing punctures? I've just started using Kevlar strips in the tires on my nice bike and I just put Avenir thorn resistant tubes on my second bike, but I haven't had a chance to go to any thorny areas to see how they work. Has anyone else who deals with these things found a good way to deal with this?


----------



## pop_martian (Mar 20, 2007)

Go tubeless like the rest of the mountain biking world. Tubes are for suckers!:thumbsup:


----------



## scoutcat (Mar 30, 2008)

tubeless solves the problem. unless you are a downhiller then i cant see a reason not to go tubeless. havent had a puncture flat in 1600 miles, seriously.


----------



## Pollution Warrior (Apr 3, 2010)

pop_martian said:


> Go tubeless like the rest of the mountain biking world. Tubes are for suckers!:thumbsup:


The "rest of the mountain biking world" does not all run tubeless. Tubeless tires in general are non puncture-proof. I've had plenty of punctures in other kinds of tires. 
Researching this on the internet I found the following from http://mountainbike.about.com/od/buyersguideandreviews/f/Tubless_ornot.htm. They advise using sealant in a tubeless because "tubeless tires still get flats from thorns and other punctures. It is in most cases more difficult to fix a flat in a tubeless tire than a standard tire." I appreciate your reply, and I'm open about this, but I'd like for you to convince me. If sealant is necessary it may not be a good option for me since I can't find it here in China where I live. A friend who's really into mountain biking and speaks great Chinese has been looking for it with no luck so I think you just have to bring it over from the US, and depending on the regs since it's a funky liquid that might not be possible. Most people in China run tubes as far as I can tell.

I'm also afraid of not being able to get a tire to seat if I need to change one. I would imagine one of those nifty CO2 thingys would do the job but we can't get those here either and it's a big "no no" to ship it by air or carry it on a plane.

Really, tubeless tires may in fact be better, but tubes are more practical for me where I am so I'm mainly interested in the best tube solution.


----------



## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

it doesnt matter if you puncture them. part of running tubeless is running sealant in the tire. you can run over all the goatheads you want, they'll puncture your tire, but they'll seal right up.

plus they give you more traction, a better rolling tire, ability to run lower pressure without pinch flatting. those kelvar strips make tires ride so poorly!


----------



## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

Sounds like you do have a dilemma on your hands. Or am I the only one who picked up on the "can't get what I need to make it run, here in China" bit?  

Not being in China, I can't say for sure, but can you get Slime Tubes? They have sealant in the tubes, which does work. I have a few pals out in the western US that use them, due to all the sharp rocks, they find straight tubeless to not work so great, sealant won't repair a 1" tear. (Lotso' goatheads out there too!) 

I LOVE tubeless, and run it without problem or complaint. But if you can't get the sealant, the point is moot. 

I assume you've checked on line places, and they've said they can't send it to you? Perhaps ditto on Slime tubes? Have you researched other shops in the region? There may be a specialty shop that deals with MTB's more specifically, and since tubeless isn't new, and is well respected, they may be better able to help than your average "sell and fix for everyone" Chinese shop..... 

They build enough MTB's over there, I'm sure someone rides them over there too


----------



## weezal (Apr 21, 2009)

A couple of recumbant riders from the west coast came up with some good suggestions... I'd try the goat head dance.


----------



## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Sounds like you do have a dilemma on your hands. Or am I the only one who picked up on the "can't get what I need to make it run, here in China" bit?
> 
> Not being in China, I can't say for sure, but can you get Slime Tubes? They have sealant in the tubes, which does work. I have a few pals out in the western US that use them, due to all the sharp rocks, they find straight tubeless to not work so great, sealant won't repair a 1" tear. (Lotso' goatheads out there too!)
> 
> ...


I saw that, too. Some people get very myopic when they have a "solution" even if the situation rules it out.

PW, is there any industrial/truck/auto tire sealant sold in your area? If so, you may be able to use it in your inner tubes.

The DIY "tubeless" sealants are usually based on a liquid latex used for making molds for plaster casting. You may be able to find that, too, and use it in the tubes.


----------



## pop_martian (Mar 20, 2007)

If you can't find the sealant you can make your own. There are many people who make their own sauce.

Check out the demo of the tubeless system for further proof!

http://www.notubes.com/movie_newdemo.php


----------



## LWright (Jan 29, 2006)

If you cannot find slime (for your tubes) in a bike shop, look for it in a hardware or tractor/agriculture shop.


----------



## giantbikeboy (Dec 3, 2004)

Stan's Stan's Stan's Stan's Stan's!!!!! Just have to refill every few months. Takes 5 minutes. I carry some in my pack just in case. I went through all kinds of liner and tubes with little success. Moved to tubeless and Stan's and not a single goat head problem since.:thumbsup:


----------



## eringel (Jun 1, 2007)

pop_martian said:


> If you can't find the sealant you can make your own. There are many people who make their own sauce.
> 
> Check out the demo of the tubeless system for further proof!
> 
> http://www.notubes.com/movie_newdemo.php


+1 for making your own. I have been running a friend's homebrew for a couple of years and have had zero problems. If you can't get the brand-name stuff where you are, search the forums for homemade recipes.


----------



## bbrins (Nov 2, 2009)

I don't have to worry about goatheads where I live now, but I did when I lived in Colorado. One thing that helps if you don't know already is to learn to recognize the plant that produces the thorns. I used to use the thicker thorn resistant tubes and Mr. Tuffy tire liners to reduce the number of flats I got. I would still occasionally get a flat, but it greatly reduced the number of them. I haven't had to deal with goatheads since the late 1990's, so there are probably some better products available to you now.


----------



## dave54 (Jul 1, 2003)

Lots of goat heads around here too (and other thorns, and razor edged rocks..). Tubeless does not seem to make much of a difference among local riders. Both get punctured. Everyone has just gotten used to it and accepts that a good ride means fixing flats.

I run slime inside puncture resistant tubes and use the tire bands. Still get the occasional puncture but a lot less than before.


----------



## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

MendonCycleSmith said:


> Or am I the only one who picked up on the "can't get what I need to make it run, here in China" bit?


you might have picked that up, but you sure did miss that he edited that in after everyone gave their suggestion. dont pat yourself on the back too hard 

you might not be able to get the commercial tire sealants, but you sure can get a 20 inch tube, and some latex and do it yourself.

goatheads really suck, theres just no good solution except sealant.


----------



## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

One Pivot said:


> you might have picked that up, but you sure did miss that he edited that in after everyone gave their suggestion. dont pat yourself on the back too hard


But there are still replies being posted that ignore the fact.


----------



## Pollution Warrior (Apr 3, 2010)

One Pivot said:


> you might have picked that up, but you sure did miss that he edited that in after everyone gave their suggestion. dont pat yourself on the back too hard
> 
> you might not be able to get the commercial tire sealants, but you sure can get a 20 inch tube, and some latex and do it yourself.
> 
> goatheads really suck, theres just no good solution except sealant.


I didn't "edit" anything. I _replied_ including the China info after I had two people (not "everyone") tell me to run tubeless without any supporting reasons.


----------



## Wherewolf (Jan 17, 2004)

*Forget Slimetubes*



MendonCycleSmith said:


> ..t can you get Slime Tubes? They have sealant in the tubes, which does work. I have a few pals out in the western US that use them, due to all the sharp rocks, they find straight tubeless to not work so great, sealant won't repair a 1" tear. (Lotso' goatheads out there too!)


Slimetubes do nothing for goatheads so don't bother.


----------



## Pollution Warrior (Apr 3, 2010)

Thanks for the replies about making my own stuff. I'll look into it, but I'm not too optimistic. A lot of things we take for granted in the US are difficult or impossible to find here. It took me 1.5 years before I found slip joint pliers and I still haven't found trash bags. I have to bring bags from the US. Paper towels (like Bounty, etc.) are a novelty. They've only been seen here in the last couple of years and are still hard to find, so I'm not all that optimistic about getting the stuff to make my own sealant. I may just be able to bring some back from the US with me. I'll have to check.

We have lots of truck traffic here, but trucks here use tubes. I see them repairing them all the time so that's not a good place to look. Maybe a place that does car tires would have it.

My main concern about using tubeless is having trouble getting the bead to seat on the rim. I know with big truck tires they often need to rapidly shoot pressurized air into the tire with a special tool. How do you do that with a bike tire? A CO2 inflator maybe? I looked for CO2 inflators here but finally gave up. I couldn't even find anyone who knew what a CO2 cartridge was.


----------



## JCullen (Oct 20, 2009)

Wherewolf said:


> Slimetubes do nothing for goatheads so don't bother.


They work well enough for me! You must have some extra special goatheads out your way!


----------



## MendonCycleSmith (Feb 10, 2005)

One Pivot said:


> you might have picked that up, but you sure did miss that he edited that in after everyone gave their suggestion. dont pat yourself on the back too hard


Sheesh...

I came in, saw 3 responses telling him to buy something he couldn't, based on his location, which was also listed when I wandered through.

I'll consider time lines more carefully in the future so as not to insult anyones integrity


----------



## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

you guys tried to call everyone out, it was just funny  

does china have a huge import tax, or do they just flat out block packages with funny content? a lot of tubeless tires will pump up with a floor pump. a lot are extremely difficult to impossible without a compressor. automotive sealant wont work, you'll need bicycle specific stuff, or a home made sealant.


----------



## m77ranger (Jan 12, 2009)

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=612071


----------

