# Mtbsalebike.com



## Johnnyb123 (Oct 12, 2017)

Has anyone successfully purchased from this site?


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

IP comes out of Berlin. Company says it is out of Thailand (https://www.mtbsalebike.com/returns-exchange-policy/). They sell bikes that aren't usually available online and their prices are low:

https://www.mtbsalebike.com/full-suspension-mtb-trek-fuel-ex-5-shimano-deore-m6000-10s-27-5-2020/

vs.

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/...ail-mountain-bikes/fuel-ex/fuel-ex-5/p/29459/

$700 difference on a $2000 bike.

This is 100% scam.


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## Johnnyb123 (Oct 12, 2017)

Thanks for the reply, and don't take this the wrong way, but I'm looking for knowledge from someone who has dealt with them, not just an opinion. I've done a lot of international purchases of close out items. The sites prices are in line with typical close out discontinued older items...40-50% off retail where retailers are attempting to clear old stock. I've bought close out items international with greater discounts. If you look ate the builds, they are clearly speccing bikes with price point components to bring prices down. Not saying you are wrong, I have my doubts also, however they take payments through Paypal, so they must have a Paypal account and Paypal does a good job of policing its customers generally. I've taken the plunge, so I will keep the tread up to date with my experience.


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## KingOfOrd (Feb 19, 2005)

Don't take this the wrong way, the writing is on the wall.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Johnnyb123 said:


> Thanks for the reply, and don't take this the wrong way, but I'm looking for knowledge from someone who has dealt with them, not just an opinion. I've done a lot of international purchases of close out items. The sites prices are in line with typical close out discontinued older items...40-50% off retail where retailers are attempting to clear old stock. I've bought close out items international with greater discounts. If you look ate the builds, they are clearly speccing bikes with price point components to bring prices down. Not saying you are wrong, I have my doubts also, however they take payments through Paypal, so they must have a Paypal account and Paypal does a good job of policing its customers generally. I've taken the plunge, so I will keep the tread up to date with my experience.


Wait so you paid them through paypal? Why not credit card? I think Paypal is a lot more difficult to get compensation from in the event that something happens to the purchase, be it shipping from asia, to damage in transit, to not getting the product.

Let us know what happens I guess. Good luck on this!


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## Johnnyb123 (Oct 12, 2017)

Paypal using Amex. Best of both world's for making a claim should I need to.


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## driver bob (Oct 12, 2005)

Also interested.

The address from the website gives a google search result of (approximately) a large shopping mall in Thailand but there are no bike shops in the mall directory.


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## Sparticus (Dec 28, 1999)

Subscribed for the sake of eager curiosity. :opcorn::
=sParty


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## the-one1 (Aug 2, 2008)

If it looks too good to be true......its true cuz its on the internet. Can't put anything fake on the internet, it's against the law.


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## fredcook (Apr 2, 2009)

Firewall blocked the site. Red flag for me.


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## djlee (Feb 5, 2009)

Fraudulent on-line sites DO NOT need to be so realistic as to trick discerning customers into buying. Fraudulent on-line sites only need be realistic enough to trick discerning customers into blabbing about it on the internet and sharing the link, thereby directing less discerning customers to their site :nono:


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## Johnnyb123 (Oct 12, 2017)

Ok all. Those of you with the sarcastic comments really provide no service to the forum. I happen to be a law enforcement professional who investigates international financial fraud for a living, so I'm pretty well versed in recognizing online scams. So here is what happened. I selected a 2018 Pivot 5.5 in medium and paid $1381 through PayPal which included $75 for international shipping. The site offered this payment option. My initial response from mtbsalebike.com was a notification of the completed sale including an invoice showing the completed transaction. Yesterday I received this follow-up email, "Hi, Thank you for your payment. We will process your order today. We will send our order and tracking number to you tomorrow, because today our store is off. We hope to wait patiently for our confirmation. Thank's
www.mtbsalebike.com"

Last night, I received this email,

Hi John, Your order on MTB SALE BIKE has been refunded. There are more details below for your reference:

[Order #6472] (May 20, 2020)

Product	Quantity	Price
2018 Pivot Mach 5.5 Carbon Mountain Bike Frame - Medium	1	1,309.00$
Subtotal:	1,309.00$
Shipping:	75.00$ via Flat rate
Payment method:	PayPal
Order fully refunded.	-1,384.00$
Total $ 0.00$"

In addition, I received an email from paypal confirming the refund from

"Refund paid by BERKAH MULIA GROUP, UD
[email protected]
3415901851"

Seller's info from PayPal receipt for refund is:
"BERKAH MULIA GROUP, UD
+62 3415901851
http://www.berkahmuliagroup.com
[email protected]"

I received an additional email from mtbsalebike.com apologizing for not having the frame available and asking me to consider trying again for something else from the website. I sent back a reply that I didn't want to waste anymore time, so if they would provide me a list of all medium carbon frames available under $1500 usd I would consider making a purchase.

So, I can't say they are legitimate yet, but I can say that typically online fraudster's don't make almost immediate full refunds. Please draw your own conclusions.

If my dealings with them continue, I will provide updates.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Johnnyb123 said:


> Ok all. Those of you with the sarcastic comments really provide no service to the forum. I happen to be a law enforcement professional who investigates international financial fraud for a living, so I'm pretty well versed in recognizing online scams. So here is what happened. I selected a 2018 Pivot 5.5 in medium and paid $1381 through PayPal which included $75 for international shipping. The site offered this payment option. My initial response from mtbsalebike.com was a notification of the completed sale including an invoice showing the completed transaction. Yesterday I received this follow-up email, "Hi, Thank you for your payment. We will process your order today. We will send our order and tracking number to you tomorrow, because today our store is off. We hope to wait patiently for our confirmation. Thank's
> www.mtbsalebike.com"
> 
> Last night, I received this email,
> ...


Ok here are some facts:

1. just in case you are wondering what the actual value of a 2018 Pivot Carbon Mountain Bike frame would be there is currently one available from competitive cyclist here:
https://www.competitivecyclist.com/pivot-mach-5.5-carbon-mountain-bike-frame-2018

This company in Thailand was giving you a $1300 discount. Over 50% off CC's sale price of this frame from an authorized dealer.

2. BERKAH MULIA GROUP, UD is a safety equipment company from Indonesia. (https://id.linkedin.com/in/berkahmuliagroup)

3. The website given from the Paypal has no associated site for that company nor the company you bought the bike from.

4. Their email is an @yahoo.com website but they have their own "website" listed and the Berkah Mulia Group associated company which has its own URL as well.

If you work with scams and have seen any of the hundreds of companies that do this sort of thing, everything about this says scam. I do hope you get a high end carbon bike for half off because it is 2 years old but I think the only thing that will come from this will be fraud.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

rockcrusher said:


> Ok here are some facts:
> 
> 1. just in case you are wondering what the actual value of a 2018 Pivot Carbon Mountain Bike frame would be there is currently one available from competitive cyclist here:
> https://www.competitivecyclist.com/pivot-mach-5.5-carbon-mountain-bike-frame-2018
> ...


5. Their background image of their shop:










is from here:
https://www.dbia.com/district-hardware/

in Reston VA


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## Finch Platte (Nov 14, 2003)

Johnnyb123 said:


> Please draw your own conclusions.


We already have.


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## KingOfOrd (Feb 19, 2005)

rockcrusher said:


> in Reston VA


Hey, that's not far from Burke VA!


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Johnnyb123 said:


> I happen to be a law enforcement professional who investigates international financial fraud for a living, so I'm pretty well versed in recognizing online scams.


What kind of moron are you for tempting fate with this? It has every single hallmark of being a scam that is widely known in the bicycle industry. You must not be very good at your job.


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## milehi (Nov 2, 1997)

China counterfeits everything. Has anyone heard of them counterfeiting high end bikes?


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## NorCal_In_AZ (Sep 26, 2019)

I think the OP isn’t in law enforcement at all. I think he works for bikesitescammersareus.imayahoo


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## Johnnyb123 (Oct 12, 2017)

Ok haters, thanks for all your replies. The thread was started to find out if anyone had done business with the company. A legitimate answer would have provided a benefit to all. Instead, I mostly received condescending responses from a bunch of pricks. Since I have no issue pissing away $1300 if it was a scam (which I would have recovered from PayPal) I acted as the sacrificial lamb and took a shot. I didn't have to give personal information except name and address during the attempted purchase, and made the payment through PayPal, so no red flags there. I received constant updates regarding the purchase. Again, no red flags. And, as noted in my previous post, received a full refund in a day. Good find on the picture rockcrusher. District Bike however was not in Reston, but was in SW DC. As far as being a moron, well I don't know, I've built up a couple of bikes for around $2500 by finding good closeout/overstocked deals on the internet that would have cost $6000 to buy new. I wonder how many of the haters, just spent the 6 grand? And to NorCal_in_AZ,
You hurt my feelings man. I don't know if I can go on. The pain! The pain! Ok, back to the purpose of the thread...if I get anymore insight to the legitimacy or non-legitimacy of the company, I'll continue to share for the good of all.


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## OldHouseMan (Dec 7, 2006)

NorCal_In_AZ said:


> I think the OP isn't in law enforcement at all. I think he works for bikesitescammersareus.imayahoo


That was also my original thought as well, even before the OP said they were in law enforcement.

The name of this company is dumb, this in itself should raise a red flag. mtbsalebike is redundant.


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## NorCal_In_AZ (Sep 26, 2019)

OldHouseMan said:


> That was also my original thought as well, even before the OP said they were in law enforcement.
> 
> The name of this company is dumb, this in itself should raise a red flag. mtbsalebike is redundant.


Of course the name is redundant. That way noobs are desperate people doing a google search find this site first on google searches.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Johnnyb123 said:


> Ok haters, thanks for all your replies. The thread was started to find out if anyone had done business with the company. A legitimate answer would have provided a benefit to all. Instead, I mostly received condescending responses from a bunch of pricks. Since I have no issue pissing away $1300 if it was a scam (which I would have recovered from PayPal) I acted as the sacrificial lamb and took a shot. I didn't have to give personal information except name and address during the attempted purchase, and made the payment through PayPal, so no red flags there. I received constant updates regarding the purchase. Again, no red flags. And, as noted in my previous post, received a full refund in a day. Good find on the picture rockcrusher. District Bike however was not in Reston, but was in SW DC. As far as being a moron, well I don't know, I've built up a couple of bikes for around $2500 by finding good closeout/overstocked deals on the internet that would have cost $6000 to buy new. I wonder how many of the haters, just spent the 6 grand? And to NorCal_in_AZ,
> You hurt my feelings man. I don't know if I can go on. The pain! The pain! Ok, back to the purpose of the thread...if I get anymore insight to the legitimacy or non-legitimacy of the company, I'll continue to share for the good of all.


any update? My guess was that they were going to come back at you with a report that paypal wasn't working but they would accept western union if you still wanted this other bike or with a bait and switch scenario.


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

I think there's a TLC show you could be on


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## Picard (Apr 5, 2005)

You guys really crucified the guy. Give him a break. 

Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk


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## driver bob (Oct 12, 2005)

Picard said:


> You guys really crucified the guy. Give him a break.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk


I swear to god this is not my alter-ego.

Whose got the chips?


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Just want to pop in here and also show that the images on their contact page are from 2 different bike shops:

https://www.mtbsalebike.com/contact/

First image is from a bike shop in Paarl South Africa: https://community.bikehub.co.za/fea...new-concept-in-store-for-paarl-cyclists-r5842

indicated on the page over the address indicating a Thailand location.

Second Image is a Trek concept store in Milan, Italy: https://www.facebook.com/milanocycling/

Indicated on the page over the address indicating a Jakarta location.

not saying have false images on a website is indicative of it not being a bike website but if I was going to lay down thousands of dollars on a bike, I would want the people providing it to be trustworthy.

The important thing is to have weblinks up here so when someone searches this website they will come to this thread and see that at minimum there are red flags here and to support a local provider that is up front regarding their products, availability, and legitimacy.


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## driver bob (Oct 12, 2005)

rockcrusher said:


> Just want to pop in here and also show that the images on their contact page are from 2 different bike shops:
> 
> https://www.mtbsalebike.com/contact/
> 
> ...


But what do you know? ...


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## Mike Aswell (Sep 1, 2009)

I just perused this thread for the first time. Will also add (and throw my hat in the ring to be included with the logical bunch of pricks) that Johnnyb123 has 9 posts in three years, over half of which are in this thread.

Red flag for me even though he accepts and loves PayPal.


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## Finch Platte (Nov 14, 2003)

driver bob said:


> But what do you know? ...


Right? He's just an administrator! A poser, at that!

Oops, was that a prickish reply?


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## driver bob (Oct 12, 2005)

Finch Platte said:


> Right? He's just an administrator! A poser, at that!
> 
> Oops, was that a prickish reply?


Every rose has it's thorn...


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## mik_git (Feb 4, 2004)

Just a question, how much do people use Paypal?
I remember it being about the best thing since sliced bread back in 2000, especially being in Australia and buying stuff from the rest of the world, but by 2010 was barely using it and now I don't even think of it.
Saw a popup add the other day for a local lottery company that was stating "we now have Paypal" with little comments behind saying "when are you going to have Paypal" etc... And all i could think was , what, people still use Paypal?


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

people use it for online transactions and things like splitting bills with large groups (easier to paypal someone the money than ask a restaurant to run multiple separate cards). I don't use it too much.


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## Smackem (Sep 2, 2019)

You will enjoy incredible features and the latest innovations for ATVs.
It displays the capabilities of trail busses much more expensive: it goes on the singletracks and can even take me from marathon type evidence.
With the seat post and the saddle, you can lower the seat on the fly so that you can easily adopt your attack position on descents.
The RockShox Solo Air fork is characterized by the ability to adjust

Broke ass English 1st sign of a scam.


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## driver bob (Oct 12, 2005)

mik_git said:


> Just a question, how much do people use Paypal?


I use it all the time and when we had to switch to the LBS to online ordering with curbside pickup around 40% of our business was through paypal.


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## waltaz (Oct 14, 2004)

mik_git said:


> Just a question, how much do people use Paypal?


All the time, when ordering online.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

mik_git said:


> Just a question, how much do people use Paypal?


a fair number of online businesses use paypal for their credit card processing services. I rarely ever login to paypal for those, frankly. I just punch in my card number instead. but I'm sure plenty of people do it that way.



Millennial29erGuy said:


> and things like splitting bills with large groups (easier to paypal someone the money than ask a restaurant to run multiple separate cards).


What kind of lame millennial are you? That kind of thing is what Venmo is for!


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Harold said:


> a fair number of online businesses use paypal for their credit card processing services. I rarely ever login to paypal for those, frankly. I just punch in my card number instead. but I'm sure plenty of people do it that way.
> 
> What kind of lame millennial are you? That kind of thing is what Venmo is for!


Lol, I was going to say that as well but didn't want to sound like a hip dad trying out the lingo for stuff. "You kids always venmoing each other, and riding your ubers to Tinder dates. I was just checking out my myspace page and a Beyonce tiktok is trending. #hashtag"


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

this thread is giving an obvious scam site (although not obvious enough, apparently) undeserved attention. is there a way to change the title and get rid of everything in this thread that does not let people know that it's a scam?


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## Klurejr (Oct 13, 2006)

mik_git said:


> Just a question, how much do people use Paypal?
> I remember it being about the best thing since sliced bread back in 2000, especially being in Australia and buying stuff from the rest of the world, but by 2010 was barely using it and now I don't even think of it.
> Saw a popup add the other day for a local lottery company that was stating "we now have Paypal" with little comments behind saying "when are you going to have Paypal" etc... And all i could think was , what, people still use Paypal?


i use it at least once a month. i sell random things on ebay on occasion and only accept paypal, my paypal account is my fun money for me to use. we also use it to transfer money between family members on occasion.

Most online retailers have an option for PayPal and it works great in my opinion.

I don't use Venmo.


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Harold said:


> a fair number of online businesses use paypal for their credit card processing services. I rarely ever login to paypal for those, frankly. I just punch in my card number instead. but I'm sure plenty of people do it that way.
> 
> What kind of lame millennial are you? That kind of thing is what Venmo is for!


:lol: venmo is hard


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## mik_git (Feb 4, 2004)

Yeha I guess.
I mean I used to use Paypal all the time, from 2000-2010ish buying heaps of stuff from overseas it was a godsend, especially when buying from the US. (also along with Hopshopgo for shipping), but I think that now, here, Australian Banks have upped their game a bit in what they offer (most banks will do instant transfers to people for sharing cash (like paying restaurant bills) and especially the US stores seem to have embraced taking credit cards and shipping internationally...plus ebay now kinda sucks for stuff.
I just don't use it any more, and nobody I know uses it. I mean there might be an occasion to use it, but regularly, no. I thought it had gone the way of 26ers.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

rockcrusher said:


> Lol, I was going to say that as well but didn't want to sound like a hip dad trying out the lingo for stuff. "You kids always venmoing each other, and riding your ubers to Tinder dates. I was just checking out my myspace page and a Beyonce tiktok is trending. #hashtag"


I'm right at the edge of the gen-x/millennial transition (xennial, or whatever they're calling it these days), so I can pull off the lingo for either well enough. I also don't fit neatly with either, so there's that.


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