# Insurance time again - IMBA Pete or whoever needs to chime in here



## Fattirewilly (Dec 10, 2001)

Shout if you just got your club insurance renewal in the mail.

Last year they basically said your club can't run its own version of IMBA trail solutions under the club policy. Well duh, if you're out there collecting money for a service, that's a different standard.

However, now there are exclusions for (and I quote):

"1) Building, designing, or maintaining trails for bicycling, hiking, or any other use
2) Operation of power machines in the conduct of club activities. This includes: motorcycles, ATV's, powersaws, chippers, Dingo's and any other power unit
3) All features built on trails owned, leased, designed by or maintained by the club

Except for the volunteer activities to maintain trails not owned or leased to the club and the club is covered by the landowners insurance coverage as volunteers. (Such as - Adopt a Trail programs or trail cleanup programs sponsored by the trail landowner or lesse)" end quote

So does this put all IMBA clubs out of building trails, for free, on public land? 

Are clubs no longer allowed to organize a workday, but now depend on the land owner to organize the workday?

I suppose the tool stash is limited to clippers and trashbags?

Has anyone looked for other insurance?


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Wow, that's a restrictive policy.

IMBA's been working hard to source insurance products that will cover any and all club activities, there will even be add-ons available for freeride and downhill trail construction/facilities.

We're waiting on a final OK from the insurance underwriter before we make any announcement. I'll post updates here, on IMBA's web site, and via email to all of our affiliate clubs. Stay tuned...


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## jbogner (Jul 3, 2004)

Last year they added a separate premium for trailbuilding clubs who need primary coverage. I haven't seen the paperwork yet- are they now expanding the separate premium to all trailbuilding clubs, or are they now not covering any trailbuilding activities at all at any cost?


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## LWright (Jan 29, 2006)

Trail building aside, we left the McKay agency and get the same basic insurance from the League of American Bicyclists for a lot less.


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## Fattirewilly (Dec 10, 2001)

jbogner said:


> Last year they added a separate premium for trailbuilding clubs who need primary coverage. I haven't seen the paperwork yet- are they now expanding the separate premium to all trailbuilding clubs, or are they now not covering any trailbuilding activities at all at any cost?


I don't see an "add on" in my paperwork for a separate trail "building" premium, petro powered machine premium, using a clino premium, etc.

It's like they're trying to make the customer fit their box as opposed to the other way around.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Fattirewilly said:


> It's like they're trying to make the customer fit their box as opposed to the other way around.


That pretty much sums it up.

All IMBA affiliated clubs were sent an email today informing them of the changes coming from McKay and providing notice that IMBA is working on new insurance options that will actually meet their needs.

A large part of the email is a request for action. We need Loss Runs (the insurance industry lingo for an official summary of insurance claims made against an organization) from as many clubs as we can get them from in order to get a final commitment from insurance underwriters. If you are reading this post, and you are a club leader or know a club leader, please do what you can to make sure this is done.

Instructions for acquiring the Loss Runs and submitting them to IMBA are included in the email. I'm not going to post the email here because it contains many phone numbers and email addresses, but I will gladly supply a copy of the email upon request.

Ryan AT IMBA Dot com

I will continue to post updates here as they become available.


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

*Timline seems really tight!*

Thanks DancingBear, we recieved the email earlier today.

The McKay policies are due for renewal on Oct 15th. In order for clubs to not have a lapse in coverage this leaves ~4weeks for:
1) Everyone to get their Loss Runs back from Lexington and sent to IMBA.
2) IMBA to tally all the info and forward that onto whomever they are working with.
3) Whomever IMBA is working with to review the info and have a final commitment.
4) IMBA affiliated clubs to apply for the new policy.
5) Insurance company to approve applications and issue insurance binders.

It seams unlikely that all of this will happen within the next 4 weeks. McKay/Lexington will be overwhelmed with the Loss Run requests, then the new insurance company will be overwhelmed with new applications.

Do you have any info on the turnaround time for the final commitment and policy application process?


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

We can't commit to a timeline yet, but we're doing our best to have things ready for October.

Thanks to all of the club leaders that have taken action on such short notice! This wouldn't work without you.

I'll post any new info here.


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## Ken in KC (Jan 12, 2004)

*Question...*



LWright said:


> Trail building aside, we left the McKay agency and get the same basic insurance from the League of American Bicyclists for a lot less.


I don't understand. So you have a policy with LAB that includes trail building activities or are you saying that you have a policy that doesn't include trail building activities?

If it's the latter, then the policy won't work for a majority of IMBA organizations.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

The LAB policy is an athletic club policy, intended to cover group rides and social events. It does not, to my knowledge, cover trailbuilding activities.


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## LWright (Jan 29, 2006)

Sorry for any confusion. No trail building covered by the LAB insurance, at least not the standard policy. Could not hurt to ask the company about such coverage though if you are serious about shopping around. The club and event insurance are both less expensive than McKay.
If LOBO were to build a trail it would have to be under an agencies (State Parks) umbrella.
How many clubs would really need the trail builders coverage?
Good question for IMBA to research. They could also suggest other options, such as partnering with an agency.
Just random thoughts,
Lyle


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

DancingBear said:


> We can't commit to a timeline yet, but we're doing our best to have things ready for October.
> 
> Thanks to all of the club leaders that have taken action on such short notice! This wouldn't work without you.
> 
> I'll post any new info here.


Ok, thanks! Sent our request in last night.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Update:

We have 2 new contacts to send Loss Run requests to:

[email protected]
[email protected]

If you have received an email from Chartis/Lexington stating that the request needs to be sent to AI Risk Management, please send the request to the above addresses.

I'm on my way to SSWC09 in Durango, but I'll be checking in regularly.

Thanks again for everyone's help and support in getting this thing done.

Cheers,

Ryan


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## LWright (Jan 29, 2006)

I checked, NO trails building coverage with League of American Bicyclist.
"Hello Lyle,

Our program currently does not offer coverage for trail building, maintenance, or clean up. These activities open up a lot more exposure than our program is geared to cover at this time.

My best advise to you would be to find a local insurance agent that sells commercial insurance to see if they may have a market for such exposures.

Sorry I couldnt be of more help. Thank you for your business!

Account Representative, Policy Services
American Specialty Insurance & Risk Services, Inc.
260-673-1252 Direct
260-672-8835 Fax

Proud Sponsor of America's Pastimes and Future Times ®"


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## mnwfrank (Feb 2, 2006)

If your club does any type of organized trail work, (maintenance, construction, design, etc) your club insurance needs to expressly cover the activity. State volunteer agreements typically have limits as to what they will cover (such as worker's comp) and the club insurance is necessary to cover liability risks.


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## redriderbb (Aug 30, 2005)

*LAB and local "landscaping" comercial coverage*

This is a good discussion and it seems now may be a good time for all of us out there to look into insurance options. IMBA being an option in the future, a fear of insurance laps is a very valid concern. Perhaps it would be a good idea for clubs that need insurance, guaranteed, would be benefited by signing up for the LAB policy, then speaking with a local insurance company to look into Commercial Liability insurance, typically underwritten as a landscaping policy. Trust the opinion of whoever your insurance agent is.

It seems like in the long term this option may overall be a cheaper one as well. The IMBA policy will be a national policy where as most clubs will only be building locally which will greatly reduce the exposure and cost for a "CGL" policy. My costs are fairly high for a national coverage of CGL, and I have been told that staying localized would "greatly reduce those costs."

This brings up another point, that local clubs could also look into using a professional builder as the "crew leader" for their projects, thus shifting the risk onto the shoulders of a professional. The bonus to a for profit operation, as opposed to non-profits, is they have the revenue to cover such expenses as proper insurance and understand proper safety protocol during workdays.

Just my $.02


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## Mark E (Feb 7, 2006)

I'll ask Dancing Bear to get back on this thread (he's on the road today), but for now I can clear up a few things:

1) The insurance package IMBA is working on for clubs will not be a "national policy." It will be an insurance product designed for local mountain bike clubs and their trailbuilding events.

2) IMBA will have its guidance out on the new insurance options soon -- likely by midweek. 

3) Our research tells us that characterizing trailbuilding as landscaping can lead to problems -- they are not the same thing. 

4) Regarding redriderbb's closing statements, IMBA believes that local clubs can and will have access to "proper insurance" and that volunteer clubs can and do "understand proper safety protocol." 

Look for Dancing Bear's followup tomorrow.


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## redriderbb (Aug 30, 2005)

*Semantics*

Mark,

I hope Ryan had fun in Durango, I know all of my friends did. In reference to a few things.

(3) I will leave the proper underwriting of policies in the hands of insurance companies. If you have a written dialog between a customer and an insurance agent that is truthful and up to date, the policy advised by that agent will be the best policy they can provide. If there are errors, the insurance agency carries the responsibility for those mistakes and carries insurance to cover themselves, professional liability policy. I will continue to listen to the advice of the insurance agency I have been working with for years now.

(4) This is an argument I would rather not delve too deeply into, but I will state that it is rare I work with volunteer groups who are utilizing proper OSHA protocol, where as when working with professionals there is typically a stronger drive to follow proper protocol, as they have something very substantial at risk, ie. their business. This argument is purely one of semantics, however. I am simply trying to illustrate that IMBA insurance is not the sole option for clubs out there.

I do not mean any disrespect to the organization, I am simply trying to illustrate the multiple options. Again, I think this is a very important topic for many people, including some so called "pro builders" out there, to review and understand. One bad lawsuit that was not properly insured would be detrimental to many of the great movements out there.

I hope my imput is not seen as a gripe. If so I apologize.


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## Mark E (Feb 7, 2006)

No problem -- I appreciate the feedback. 

Agree that good coverage is paramount, and also that the policy IMBA is helping pull together will not be the only option clubs have ... we hope that it will be a readily accessible and good one though. 

-- Mark


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## Ken in KC (Jan 12, 2004)

*Clarity...*



redriderbb said:


> Mark,
> 
> I hope Ryan had fun in Durango, I know all of my friends did. In reference to a few things.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your input and perspective. Not seen as a gripe on my end. Valuable suggestions.

Thanks,


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

Mark E said:


> No problem -- I appreciate the feedback.
> 
> Agree that good coverage is paramount, and *also that the policy IMBA is helping pull together will not be the only option clubs have* ... we hope that it will be a readily accessible and good one though.
> 
> -- Mark


One point of clearification, McKay does offer coverage for clubs that are responsible for trail maintainance and trail building, the club I'm in has it. It is offered as a secondary policy beyond the standard bike club policy. However, there is an additional premium for this.

I believe DancingBear/IMBA is looking into alternate insurance providers to find a *lower cost option*, not *an option *because one already exsists.


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

jmitchell13 said:


> One point of clearification, McKay does offer coverage for clubs that are responsible for trail maintainance and trail building, the club I'm in has it. It is offered as a secondary policy beyond the standard bike club policy. However, there is an additional premium for this.
> 
> I believe DancingBear/IMBA is looking into alternate insurance providers to find a *lower cost option*, not *an option *because one already exsists.


We had it ... last year. The new letter that went out has some very confusing language. It basically says that if your landowner will cover your trailbuilding activities, than they will cover you. In other words, if you already have coverage, than you will have it.

So McCay wants to cover us for $300 per year against people slipping on banana peals and falling at group meetings where the host site of the meeting would be liable. They're also happy to cover us on informal group rides when we're riding under park insurance. In other words, McCay is very happy to take your $300 and give nothing in return.

I'll wait patiently for the new IMBA guidelines. Something tells me McKay will not be returning my email request for clarification.


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## jbogner (Jul 3, 2004)

Last year the additional $500 charge was for clubs that had "hold harmless" language in their agreements with land owners, and that makes perfect sense from an underwriting standpoint- that "hold harmless" language means that your club's insurance policy is the first line of defense in any lawsuit, and that your insurance will pay for the defense of the landowner in the event the landowner is sued. Your insurance insures you *and* the landowner. I was actually happy that they split it out that way since we don't have that language in our agreement with NYC Parks, and I'd rather not pay higher overall rates just to cover the other IMBA clubs that do.

Is that additional add-on policy not being offered this year? Or is it being expanded to all clubs that build trails whether they have hold harmless language in their agreements or not?


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

willtsmith_nwi said:


> We had it ... last year. The new letter that went out has some very confusing language. It basically says that if your landowner will cover your trailbuilding activities, than they will cover you. In other words, if you already have coverage, than you will have it.
> 
> So McCay wants to cover us for $300 per year against people slipping on banana peals and falling at group meetings where the host site of the meeting would be liable. They're also happy to cover us on informal group rides when we're riding under park insurance. In other words, McCay is very happy to take your $300 and give nothing in return.
> 
> I'll wait patiently for the new IMBA guidelines. Something tells me McKay will not be returning my email request for clarification.


Yea, I guess I need to talk with McKay for clearification on this also.


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## Honkey (Mar 28, 2007)

I nearly peed my pants, laughing my a$$ off when I read that -McKay was pleased to renew our club's coverage at no extra cost- *but excluded all trailbuilding activities*... What a joke.

You exclude the (by far) greatest risk to the insurer and not significantly drop the premium cost? Needless to say, we will be shopping around.


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## joer (Jul 7, 2004)

You have to contact McKay Insurance to request the form for submitting details about your club activity for trail construction. Here's the copy we got via email and have submitted... (no word yet on cost - think they are still trying to find underwriters)...

Information needed to secure a quote is as follows:



Name of club or organization:

State:

Contact:

Contact Phone Number:

Contact E-mail:

Number of club Members:

Cost of work subcontracted: With Certificates of Insurance $ _________

Without Certificate of Insurance: $ ________________

Any paid employees of the club? Payroll annually $ __________

Type of construction and percentages:

Grading of Land _____ Bridge Building ___________________

Structures ____ (Give examples of types of structures built) Jumps, Stunts _______

Are you required to hold other harmless or indemnify them for your negligence? If yes, in what amount? $______________________

Types of equipment used:

Do you own or lease the equipment:

If you own, do you have a policy covering the equipment:

How many miles of trail maintained:

If club builds trails –

Do they own the property:

Do they lease the property:

Do they design trails – if so need the fees associated with the design


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## joer (Jul 7, 2004)

jbogner said:


> Last year the additional $500 charge was for clubs that had "hold harmless" language in their agreements with land owners, and that makes perfect sense
> *snip*
> Is that additional add-on policy not being offered this year? Or is it being expanded to all clubs that build trails whether they have hold harmless language in their agreements or not?


I asked our McKay Insurance agent the same question.

This new additional coverage policy for clubs who do trail maintenance/building replaces last years "hold harmless" premium policy. Basically, it sounds like you submit the form with details about your trail construction activity and indicate if there is an "indemnification" clause (and what amount is stipulated)... and then you get a quote for a premium based on the details. It does make sense. Some clubs are engaged in trail construction from the design and building to ongoing maintenance, and others just doing simply maintenance... Different coverage is needed based on what activity the club is doing.

Just hoping the premium isn't way out of the ballpark for what we can afford!


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## sick4surf (Feb 4, 2004)

We have a "hold harmless" agreement that I sent to MacKay and there was no extra charge so I signed it. 

However, a recent "adopt a preserve" agreement triggered an extra charge but luckily I sent the agreement to MacKay BEFORE it was signed it. Unfortunately, we cannot sign such an agreement or any MOU's or MOA's due to higher insurance prices.

We've never had a claim against us since we started in 1990.

Waiting for word from IMBA on the new program. We may have to join the local hiking club and go in with their insurance plan if it's cost prohibitive.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Update and background:

First off, thanks to everyone for the MASSIVE response to our request that you acquire loss runs. The insurance underwriter has agreed, largely because of the overwhelming number of requests, to provide one summary report of all IMBA affiliates' loss runs. You no longer need to persue loss runs for your club or forward them to Scott Chapin at RJF.

IMBA has been working for some time to develop insurance alternatives to McKay, largely at the request of our affiliate clubs. It's been challenging because the insurance industry does not have much experience with what we do. Mountain bike clubs are fairly unique in our scope of work. And in these trying times, underwriters are weary to write new policies, especially if they're unfamiliar with the risk. This has required us to invest a lot of time in lobbying and educating insurance professionals so that they understand what we do and where our exposures exist.

We had planned to make the insurance a package deal with Affiliate dues or the Chapter revenue share, in an attempt to keep costs down and simplify the process for clubs to get insurance. We planned to launch the new program as part of the Chapter program at our 2010 Summit. 

The changes at McKay caught us somewhat by surprise, so we cranked back the timeline and changed the parameters for the insurance program (basically removing IMBA as the policy faciliatator for now) in an effort to avoid any gaps in coverage come October 15th.

So where are we now? RJF Insurance representatives are meeting with several potential underwriters to source the insurance products that we need. We've put together a compelling argument for taking a risk on underwriting mountain bike club policies. IMBA and RJF are confident that policies will be available in time for the October 15 insurance renewal, but we'll know more early next week.

And I'll keep posting updates as they come.

- Ryan


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## Biker75 (Feb 22, 2004)

*Thanks DB*

Thanks for the updates & work on this DB...pretty daunting stuff for the 'average' club to comprehend, digest & come up w/ a solution for. 
JohnW
BRMBA


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

Sounds like this is progressing well. Our local club will be impacted. 

IMO, if one of the prior posters is trying to suggest insuring construction of technical trail features as 'landscaping,' that is foolish at best. You're asking for a mid-term policy cancellation or denial of coverage at the first claim. Your carrier needs to understand the nature of the risk. If your agent does not understand or is misrepresenting the nature of the club activities, you are playing a dangerous game. You cannot rely on the agent's E & O coverage to come in and save you.


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## redriderbb (Aug 30, 2005)

*Underwriting Language*

Okay, lets get into this discussion a little deeper. Is anyone in the current discussion an insurance agent? If so, can you please lay down how underwriting and insurance coverages work. I have spoken to my insurance agent a number of times over the last three years of carrying coverage from them and they have underwritten my policy as Landscaping/Trail Clearing with language that denotes what I do. I am not a club, but a for-profit trail/park contractor. When asked for my insurance certificate from various agencies, I have produced one that was satisfactory to them. So, why doesn't this work? I have never been dropped, and seem to have a full discourse with my insurer. Do you not like the language because it is what IMBA says? Or does anyone actually sling insurance for a living. I have shopped around and find that this is the best coverage, nationally, for me at a decent deal. I am curious to see what IMBA comes up with as much as anyone else, but have limited resources to research this kind of thing. If anyone has first hand knowledge as to why this type of coverage doesn't work, I would love to hear it. (ie. your club did get a claim filed against it and the carrier didn't cover you, or an agency did not allow your club to do work because of this type of insurance.) I feel like we have opened Pandoras box and still don't know that there was anything wrong with the current system. Please someone, with first hand knowledge, fill me in.

Thanks,
Ben


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

Ben: I hope my post did not come off harsh. 

I've been in the insurance industry for 20 years, though not directly involved in liability claims for many years. I am not an agent. By posting here I am not speaking on behalf of my employer or giving legal advice or insurance advice. 

It's important that your carrier understand exactly what you do so that they know exactly what sort of risks they are insuring, and what sort of claims they may be facing. Insurance is priced based on the nature of the business, using books of classification codes, such as 'retail dry cleaner'; 'bicycle sales', 'residential drywall contractor', etc. MTB/BMX trail construction does not fit in the standard classifications, so I expect they slotted you into the closest category - landscaping. 

If your carrier believes that you do landscaping and tree clearing, what sort of claims might they expect as part of your operations? Perhaps your crew person backs the digger into a house, or runs into a passerby, or perhaps a tree is felled onto something or somebody. 

There are exposures in your business that they are not expecting. Suppose you construct a technical trail feature such as a bridge. Later a rider falls from the feature and sustains an injury. He or his attorney alleges that the bridge was not designed correctly, or was not constructed correctly, and you as the contractor were negligent. You could theoretically be found liable for the injuries. Your insurance carrier would never expect this sort of claim to arise out of a lanscaping project. 

If your carrier is aware of exactly what you do, and you have that in writing, you may be ok, but trail building is certainly not the same as landscaping. If they think you lay sod and build retaining walls, and they get a claim for a rider falling off a techincal trail feature, they could try to deny you coverage for the claim, or pay the claim, and drop you immedidately after. 

Your insurance certificate has nothing to do with it, it just confirms the existence of insurance, it has nothing to do with the underwriting of the policy. 

Again, I am not providing you with insurance advice, just trying to explain how this works.


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## Megashnauzer (Nov 2, 2005)

so we can ride the trail and be insured but we can't fix the trail and be insured. what happens if we get hurt because we didn't fix the trail?


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

JSG hit it on the head, thanks for breaking that down for us.

Ben, the McKay policy does not work because they have excluded trailwork from the club policy (unless the LM names the club as insured, in which case, the club doesn't actually need the insurance). No Pandoras Box to it. I read your post and don't know if you are talking about club insurance or for-profit business insurance. They are separate issues.

Latest update:
Our insurance partners have met with several underwriters that are interested in the program. Now we must provide the Loss Runs to the underwriters so that they can develop the policy and create a pricing structure. Our current underwriters have promised to provide the Loss Runs this week. The delay is because IMBA affiliate clubs have been placed on the same policy with other sports groups and race promotors, so our initial Loss Run report showed HUGE claims that had nothing to do with mountain bike clubs. The current underwriter and agent claim that the process of unraveling these claims is complicated and time consuming. 

On a side note, the practice of combining our group with other, unrelated groups on the same policy has raised some eyebrows with our insurance partners, and it's not how we will operate going forward.

Also, an important issue to understand is that we, the community of mountain bike clubs, will get a better rate on our general liability insurance if we can come to an underwriter as a large group. So the more clubs we bring into the new program, the better it will be for all clubs. 

Of course, I will post any new info as it comes.

Cheers,

Ryan


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

One issue that has come up is that of clubs building trail for money. 

This policy will not cover fee-based trail construction. Underwriters see volunteer activities as distinctly different from fee based activities. A club that builds a trail for a fee risks the underwriter denying claims that may come in related to that trail and activities surrounding the construction/maintenance of that trail. 

However, the policy will cover events that raise funds (even time trials if the competitors are club members), so there's some grey area that we are discussing with the agent.

Clubs that do provide fee-based trail construction will need professional liability coverage, and should build the cost of that coverage into their fees. IMBA sees fee-based construction as an opportunity for clubs to enjoy a win-win, and we plan to work towards supporting this activity, but it's an issue that much larger than just insurance, so it's something we'll tackle in the coming year with help from our affiliate club partners.

Of course, I'll post more info when we know more.

- Ryan


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## Ken in KC (Jan 12, 2004)

*Thank you...*



DancingBear said:


> JSG hit it on the head, thanks for breaking that down for us.
> 
> Ben, the McKay policy does not work because they have excluded trailwork from the club policy (unless the LM names the club as insured, in which case, the club doesn't actually need the insurance). No Pandoras Box to it. I read your post and don't know if you are talking about club insurance or for-profit business insurance. They are separate issues.
> 
> ...


Ryan,

Thank you for staying on top of this and keeping us informed. Figuring out insurance for a single entity is a pain, figuring it out for all of us can't be that much fun.


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

DancingBear said:


> JSG hit it on the head, thanks for breaking that down for us.
> On a side note, the practice of combining our group with other, unrelated groups on the same policy has raised some eyebrows with our insurance partners, and it's not how we will operate going forward.


Back when these programs were developed, our clubs' activities were not that different than road bike clubs, so maybe at that time it made sense to pool the exposures.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

*The latest update on affiliate insurance*

Dear Club Leaders,

First off, thanks for your questions, support, and patience throughout the process of sourcing insurance alternatives for IMBA's affiliate clubs. We really couldn't make this work without your help.

We now have a firm commitment from a nationwide insurance underwriter and we plan to start the process of enrolling clubs into the IMBA/RJF insurance option this week. Tomorrow, affiliate clubs will receive an email announcing the underwriter, describing the new program with pricing, and providing a comparison to the McKay/Lexington insurance option. The email will include a survey that we will need you to complete as soon as possible.

We have worked closely with RJF Insurance to make sure they fully understand all the activities that IMBA affiliated clubs participate in, and RJF has designed a program that provides the coverage needed to protect club and individual member's assets. RJF went to many different carriers to find the best program for the best pricing.

So, the point of this message is to be ready for tomorrow's message. Your quick action will be critical to avoiding gaps in club insurance coverage.

Cheers,

Ryan Schutz

IMBA Field Programs Manager and Rocky Mountain Regional Director


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

*IMBA/RJF Insurance is ready for YOU!*

Dear Club Leaders,

Our insurance partner, RJF Insurance, is ready to provide insurance to trailbuilding clubs around the United States. Please read the following communication from Scott Chapin at RJF Insurance and quickly complete the survey form linked at the bottom of the page.

Once the survey has been recieved by RJF Insurance, you will be promptly contacted by an agent of RJF who will provide a copy of the policy and policy pricing.

Cheers,

Ryan

Greetings,

As most of you already know, IMBA and RJF Agencies have been working together to build an alternative General Liability program that will protect the IMBA Clubs from potential liability suits and litigation.

The current Lexington program excludes the following critical exposures to loss:
a. Building, designing or maintaining any trails for bicycling, hiking or any other use.
b. Operation of power machines in the conduct of club activities. This includes motorcycles, ATVs, power saws, chippers, Dingos or any other power unit.
c. All features built on trails owned, leased, designed by or maintained by the club.

Of course, those activities are a big part of what many IMBA Clubs do. I personally know this because I am an avid single-track rider. I help build hybrid-mechanized trails for the Chequamegon Area Mountain Bike Association. (I don't get to run a mini-dozer&#8230; They only let me use the brush cutter and hand tools.) I also assist our club with fundraising activities.

RJF Agencies has six offices, and is headquartered in Minneapolis, Minn. We write a National Bicycle Retail Shop insurance program within our programs division. I became involved with IMBA a couple months ago when I was invited to do a presentation on the Economic Impact of Trail Building. The audience was a group of local politicians and business owners from Cayuna, MN, a city where the IMBA plans to build an IMBA Ride Center.

We have worked closely with IMBA to make sure we fully understand all of the activities that IMBA clubs participate in. With their help, we designed a program that provides the coverage needed to protect the clubs as well as the individual member's assets. We went to many different insurance carriers to find the best designed program with the most competitive pricing.

Coverage information

The carrier we will be utilizing is: Interstate Insurance, a subsidiary of Fireman's Insurance.

This program will provide coverage for (but not limited to):
a. Trail Building, including some man-made features (underwriting approval)
b. Club Time Trials (DH and XC)
c. Trail Maintenance
d. Fundraisers (per underwriting approval)
e. Club Social Events
f. Group Rides

Your individual premiums will be contingent upon whether you steward or construct trails, and whether you have created any manmade obstacles or articulating structures such as teeter-totters. The pricing of this new program is very competitive, especially in view of key coverage additions that are needed and required.

In order to make sure we are providing the proper coverage for each club, we need your help. Please complete the survey linked below immediately. Thank you for your assistance and support in developing a program better suited for your needs.

Sincerely,

Scott Chapin, RJF Agencies, Inc.

Please go to the following link to comple the insurance survey: go.imba.com/insurancesurvey

You may need to cut and paste the address into the browser.


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## cjohnson (Jul 14, 2004)

*link doesn't work*

been unable to use the link and unable to respond to ryan via email. imba server down?


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

cjohnson said:


> been unable to use the link and unable to respond to ryan via email. imba server down?


Same here...


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Thanks for the heads-up, I'm working on it.

- Ryan


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

*Insurance survey form update*

Ahhh, there's nothing like the feeling of a fumble at the one yard line.

All of IMBA's interactive pages are part of our go.imba.com domain, basically a separate website that lives within our static www.imba.com domain, and the entire go.imba.com domain is currently down. Surveys are part of the go.imba.com domain, and that's why the survey link is not working.

We're working on getting it back online ASAP, and we'll probably switch to a different survey format if the problem isn't rectified in the next two hours.

Thanks again for your patience, I'll post up as soon as the website is live again.

- Ryan


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

*The Survey Form is ACTIVE!!!*

Alright, the website is back up and the survey form is active.

Go to go.imba.com/insurancesurvey to complete the survey and begin the enrollment process.

Thanks for your patience and support,

Ryan


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## jbogner (Jul 3, 2004)

Thanks Ryan. Filled out the form. Love the page that pops up once you submit, touting the Highbridge trails...


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## gasgas (Jan 14, 2005)

I filled out the survey last week. I was just curious how long it might take before getting something back? I know they are probably swamped with inquiries. Thanks!


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## Fattirewilly (Dec 10, 2001)

gasgas said:


> I filled out the survey last week. I was just curious how long it might take before getting something back? I know they are probably swamped with inquiries. Thanks!


+1....


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

I filled out a similar survey from McKay and it took a week.


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## mergs (Feb 14, 2004)

survey done for JORBA. easy, took me longer to locate the affiliate nr than to fill out the survey 

expiration of our McKay plan is quickly approaching (15th?). so we're looking forward to being able to get a quote from new the carrier asap. 

luckily the new carrier's product, with its apparent coverage of machine built trails, ttfs, etc is perfect timing for NJ as these issues are looming on our horizon. which is sweet. the "chapter issue" with mckay was problematic as well.

thanks imba for sorting this out for your affiliates!


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Communications from RJF will arrive this afternoon or tomorrow morning, with a full explanation of coverage and pricing. We're in the final process of establishing the policy right now.

We're still confident that there will be no gap in coverage. Coverage can be bound before the documents/payments are complete.

The price is going up significantly, somewhere in the neighborhood of twice the price of years past. This is largely because we were effectively paying for a "sporting club" policy intended for groups that do little more than group rides and social events, whereas the new policy is designed specifically for mountain bike advocacy organizations and all of the activities that we undertake. The price could go down as more clubs enroll.

I'll provide a full update once I have the final information from RJF.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

*The latest: IMBA/RJF insurance is ready*

Dear Club Leaders,

Here's an update on club insurance as we head into the final day of coverage for most clubs under their current policy:

As is often the nature of business, this deal is being sealed at the last possible moment. We now have a binding quote from the preferred underwriter and we are working dilligently to prepare enrollment documents for clubs.

Tomorrow (Thursday, October 15th) RJF will send out emails, including policy details and enrollment documents, to all clubs that have completed the survey at go.imba.com/insurancesurvey.

All clubs that have completed the insurance survey will have bound coverage as of tomorrow, and a grace period will be provided to give clubs time to submit their payment and enrollment documents. Clubs that have not completed the enrollment process within the grace period will be removed from the policy.

Be prepared for the price of insurance to go up significantly, to approximately $6 per member plus additional fees for freeride parks, some technical trail features, and dirt jumps. Affiliate clubs have been paying for a "sporting club" policy for years, intended for little more than group rides and social functions, which created artificially low insurance premiums. The new policy is designed for mountain bike advocacy clubs and all that we do. The price of the policy could decrease as more clubs enroll and additional actuarial data proves that we are a low-risk group to insure.

One important note is that teeter-totters and other articulating trail features will be excluded from coverage. If clubs choose to keep, build, or maintain these features they must understand that it is done at the club's risk. Claims related to articulating technical trail features will be denied by the underwriter. This exclusion is the result of a large claim against an IMBA affiliated club related to an on-trail teeter-totter. IMBA plans to revisit this issue in the future.

Again, thanks for your support and patience.

Ryan Schutz


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## sick4surf (Feb 4, 2004)

$6 per member plus additional penalty for free ride parks, technical trail features and dirt jumps?

That means our insurance costs will go from about $1,000 per year to over $4,000 per year?

What about non-members riding the trails and getting hurt?

Anyone look into alternatives?

Too bad about the short notice...not good!


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

sick4surf said:


> $6 per member plus additional penalty for free ride parks, technical trail features and dirt jumps?
> 
> That means our insurance costs will go from about $1,000 per year to over $4,000 per year?
> 
> ...


My quote from McKay was $441 (for a small club with less than 25 members) excluding "sport activities". I'm not exactly sure I even need to cover these as this would be the landowners liability if someone got hurt on a "club ride". At least ... I assume this is why McKay had us strike indemnification clauses and "Land Use Agreements" last year in favor of a "Memorandum of Understanding".


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

The general liability policy will cover claims that come from non-member cyclists that get hurt on the trail.

I can appreciate the sticker shock, but the cost is actually pretty reasonable, and I've encouraged folks that have asked to shop around and learn for themselves. Be weary of agencies that want to sell you professional grading contractor or landscaping policies, mountain bike advocacy organizations are neither of those things, and relying on insurance intended for professionals or an entirely different type of activity sets the stage for the underwriter to deny a claim, leaving the club to pay defense costs and any judgment against them.

This policy is designed for mountain bike advocacy organizations and all that we do. There will be no more sudden, unannounced changes in coverage, vague policies, or attempts to sell clubs coverage intended for an entirely different industry.

I know we're asking you all to go on faith here, but I assure you that we've done everything we can within this short timeline to provide stable, affordable insurance that covers our affiliated clubs and their members' assets.

More info is on the way, we're wrapping things up right now.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

willtsmith_nwi said:


> My quote from McKay was $441 (for a small club with less than 25 members) excluding "sport activities". I'm not exactly sure I even need to cover these as this would be the landowners liability if someone got hurt on a "club ride". At least ... I assume this is why McKay had us strike indemnification clauses and "Land Use Agreements" last year in favor of a "Memorandum of Understanding".


Something that I need to make very clear:

Clubs need general liability insurance, even if the land manager provides worker's comp insurance to volunteers on work days and openly accepts the risk associated with the use on their lands. If someone sues, the plaintiff's lawyer will name every organization associated with the trail or event in their suit, and that means the club will have to cover defense costs. A simple suit that gets thrown out at the first opportunity can cost well over $10,000 in legal fees, and a case that goes to court before being thrown out can easily cost $40,000 or more to defend. A case that actually goes to trial could be extremely expensive. And, in most states, a judgment could put member's personal assets in jeapordy if there is no insurance.

Clubs have a responsibility to protect their members, and that happens through general liability insurance.

Again, IMBA doesn't make any money from clubs taking part in this insurance program. In fact, we've put out about $5000 in staff time and resources to make this program happen. We strongly believe that the mountain bike advocacy community will benefit as a whole by taking part in this program, that is our only motivation.

- Ryan


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## sick4surf (Feb 4, 2004)

We'll go with whatever IMBA decides is best.

Hate the short notice though, that means I'll have to use my personal credit card to pay the bill via phone...not sure about my credit limit.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

sick4surf said:


> We'll go with whatever IMBA decides is best.
> 
> Hate the short notice though, that means I'll have to use my personal credit card to pay the bill via phone...not sure about my credit limit.


Thanks for the vote of confidence Mike.

I understand about the short notice, I'm about to have a heart attack here.

All clubs that have submitted a survey by today will have bound coverage today, there will be a grace period to complete documents and payments. You'll be able to send a club check. Clubs that have submitted a survey are in no way obligated to enroll, their names will simply be removed from the policy after the grace period.

- Ryan


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## sick4surf (Feb 4, 2004)

Thanx for all your hard work on this...it could not have been easy.

Looks like we'll have to take advantage of some of the new benefits under the new policy and have some time trial races etc to raise funds.


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## jbogner (Jul 3, 2004)

Thanks Ryan and everyone else at IMBA who's put this together. Despite the additional cost, I think it's good to have an all-encompassing policy that clearly covers all potential exposure (other than articulating features) for trail building clubs.

Mike- lets get that Cunningham time trial going!


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

The teeter issue is going to cause some angst countrywide, I am sure. 

Thanks for the work you guys have done on this.


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## pcrap (Aug 2, 2004)

DancingBear said:


> Affiliate clubs have been paying for a "sporting club" policy for years, intended for little more than group rides and social functions, which created artificially low insurance premiums.


So clubs that build, design or maintain trails haven't actually been covered up to this point?

Glad to see that something as important as proper insurance coverage is finally being addressed.

Hopefully RJF will do a better job of communicating with the local clubs. Club leaders should be able to understand what their insurance policies cover, what is expected of them, and what they are allowed to build on the trail. Much of the insurance info that was sent to me (last year) from the local club president was ambiguous at best.

Thanks for working on this IMBA.


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## ovbc (May 9, 2008)

Hi guys, some of us have been doing business with Dan McKay (under separate policy) to hold mountain bike races..or series races as a part of their annual activities. Generally speaking our Club promotes races as a way to create more awareness of our recreational trail building efforts. I realize the G/L policies that we are speaking of here are designed for trail activities but I am wondering if RJF will be able to make available (or will be willing as McKay has) to make available coverage under a separate policy for these specific racing events as McKay has in the past. Any comments on this appreciated.


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

Ok, my understanding was that quotes were going out on Oct 15th. Was it via snail mail? I never received a quote and I filled out the IMBA questionair. I have no idea wether we have coverage at this point or not.

BTW, I appreciate IMBAs efforts in this arena.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

The deal is done as of 5 minutes ago. All clubs that submitted the insurance survey have bound coverage as of yesterday. RJF will send clubs an invoice today or Monday, they're cranking through the process right now.

The underwriter is Interstate Insurance, a division of Fireman's Insurance, the third largest insurance underwriter in the world.

RJF does event insurance, and we have a new event insurance partner, Holmes Murphy, that has regularly beat McKay's rates on events. IMBA believes that a competitive market for event insurance will benefit clubs.

The per-member premiums had to be pushed higher than originally anticipated in order to reach the policy minimum of $212,000 (the full policy cost is $265,000). The policy could be cancelled if the minimum isn't reached, so we didn't really have a choice. 

IMBA has committed to making up the difference if club premiums don't reach the minimum premium, we're potentially on the hook for tens of thousands, so rest assured that this program is sustainable and the policy cannot be suddenly cancelled by the underwriter.

We're looking at $7 per member for most clubs with a $500 minimum premium. After assessing insurance costs in similar associations, $7 per member was established as our maximum acceptable premium for clubs that don't have freerideTTF/DJ exposure. We were shooting for $5, but we just couldn't make it happen. We'll be working to push rates down in the coming year, but the premium price will largely be dictated by how may clubs enroll in the program. Out of 400 trailbuilding clubs in the USA, just over 100 have submitted surveys, that's a lot less than we anticipated and has a lot to do with the higher price.

Coverage for club built/maintained teeter-totters and other articulating structures will be $1000 (this isn't a per-structure fee).

Clubs that have notified us that they need insurance certificates ASAP will be serviced first.

We plan to launch some new programs in 2010, like waiver support and low cost chainsaw certification through Stihl, that should help to drive prices down in the future.

Further details on rates will go out in a club email, which I'll copy here. And sorry for the brain dump, no time to make this communication read well at this point.

Thanks for your questions and support, it has really helped us to shape a policy for all contingencies.

More soon...

Ryan


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

Damn, the underwriter just came back with a teeter-totter exclusion, they will not be covered at any price. But, the deal is done and signed.

Sorry for the back and forth info, that's the trouble with live updates on a short timeline.

- Ryan


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## ovbc (May 9, 2008)

Ryan, all your efforts are appreciated. I am surpirsed to know now that only 100+ of 400 potential Clubs are submitting surveys. This is somewhat disconcerting. Perhaps there are many Clubs that either lack the financial wherewithall or are just out of the immediate line of communication. How many Clubs are IMBA affiliated? and do you expect more to join on after-the fact? Seems like this is a huge IMBA subsidy! 

The policy premium minimum at $500 (if that's the final approx number) is very reasonable I think for the assurance we are getting and likeness of coverage in all other aspects of the old policies Clubs have been writing. A huge piece of mind.


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## Seanbike (Mar 23, 2004)

The policy premium is a minimum of $500. My club with 400 members would be looking at a premium of $2800 at $7 a member. But my club has 1 bike park with dirt jumps and is trying to get an agreement with a land manager for another one in addition to a pumptrack that is in the approval process. I'm guessing I can expect that $7 per member to not be the final price for my club and it looks like we'll be ripping out a tetter totter too.

While it's good news to hear we can obtain insurance that will continue to cover trailbuilding and maintenance, there are many less than swell aspects of the new coverage.


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

Hopefully Ryan, other clubs are just a little slow on the uptake on this issue.


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## Megashnauzer (Nov 2, 2005)

so what's the downside of not having insurance? i understand if someone gets hurt they could sue but who are they going to sue? the club officers? the club members? the club if it's a corporation?


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## redriderbb (Aug 30, 2005)

*Using a Pro for maintenance and instalations*

Okay,

I have seen a few things change as this whole process has moved forward and want to offer a potential solution to certain issues. What about hiring a "pro" to take on some of the liability and maintenance needs of your facilities.

This would be something to explore away from the public forum. If this interests anyone in the discussion please contact me at benblitch at gmail dot com.

I am thinking that the club handles the $7 per member thing, but as far as a tetter and those types of features (DJ parks etc.) instead of buying additional insurance why not sign an agreement where a pro is willing to "maintain" the structure for the club. This would allow the club to shelve some of that responsibility while still having the fun feature to ride. Get in touch if you are interested and the discussion can continue.

Thanks,
Ben


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## jsg (May 26, 2005)

Megashnauzer said:


> so what's the downside of not having insurance? i understand if someone gets hurt they could sue but who are they going to sue? the club officers? the club members? the club if it's a corporation?


Does your club have a board of directors? They could potentially be named. Also a trail steward, dirt boss, etc. Anyone who was involved in the design, construction or maintenance of the trail. Those people's personal assets are at risk. You can sue _anybody. _ Even if that person has no liability at all, he'll need legal representation to be dismissed from the litigation. Compentent attorneys cost a lot of money.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

JSG once again hit it on the head. In some states, even members' assets could be at risk in the case of a judgment against the club, but that's an extreme case.

Anyone can be sued if the plaintiff has the filing fees ($35 here in Colorado), and defense is expensive. In the case of an injury suit, the plaintiff's attorney will usually name any organization or person involved in an attempt to extract the maximum amount of money for the case. I was once named in a suit when I was on the board of a club in Florida, along with the rest of the board members. It was scary at first, but we all relaxed when our insurance agency came to the rescue. The case was summarily dismissed, but it would have been financially crippling for me personally to cover the cost of defense.

Carrying insurance is something that clubs owe to themselves and their membership, it's the responsible thing to do.


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

Still no quote. Are these going out email or snail mail?


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## Seanbike (Mar 23, 2004)

The check's in the mail for my clubs policy. It's a hard pill to swallow at 3 times last years premium but it needs to be done. I was sad to see our little teeter totter go but I'll just need to build something equally as cool without it being articulated. 

Thanks for taking care of this IMBA.


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## Megashnauzer (Nov 2, 2005)

i got the quote today. i haven't seen a policy yet to know exactly what's covered. what kinds of events can we have? what is meant by man made trail features?


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## indytrekracer (Feb 13, 2004)

*Insurance*

HMBA's check is going out tomorrow. We paided for the additional $500 rider last year with Mckay, because we weren't comfortable with the basic policy. Even if more expensive, having a policy specifically written for what we do is worth the extra cost and having power equipment covered is a bonus

Thanks Ryan and Scott (RJF)

Paul


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

Megashnauzer said:


> what is meant by man made trail features?


I asked this same exact question to Scott at RJF, he said that this includes any man-made structure of wood or steel that is 36" above normal trail grade.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

There are three categories of "trail objects"

Trail Structures, including kiosks, gates, signs, and traditional bridges used to cross wetlands, gullies, etc. Traditional bridges are considered to be at trail grade.

Man-made trail features under 36" above trail grade, including pump tracks, log piles, skinnies, rock features, drops, etc...

Man-made trail features at or over 36" above trail grade, including dirt jumps, log piles, skinnies, rock features, drops, etc...

Man made features can be constructed of any combination of dirt, steel, rock, timber, lumber, or masonry.

The 36" height is not arbitrary. There is growing discussion and evidence around the idea that features that place the rider more than 36" above trail grade significantly increase the chance of spinal injury in the case of a fall. 

Basically, being three feet above the ground puts you high enough to fall on your head.

We're working on an FAQ and support documents to get these answers out in the open and readily accessible.

- Ryan


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## willtsmith_nwi (Jan 1, 1970)

DancingBear said:


> There are three categories of "trail objects"
> 
> Trail Structures, including kiosks, gates, signs, and traditional bridges used to cross wetlands, gullies, etc. Traditional bridges are considered to be at trail grade.
> 
> ...


The quotes sent out were vague. There was a line item for plain "trail maintenance" with the $500 minimum. Then it said that :

Club Members (Trails) $7 (per member)
(Trail Maintenance and/or Construction-
*No Man-Made Trail Features*)

Club Members (Trail) <your club members> $7 (per member) <subtotal>
(Trail Maintenance and/or Construction 
AND *Man-Made Trail Features over 36
inches above grade*) $1.50 (per member, <obstacle subtotal>

3% Surplus Lines tax
per obstacle

yadda, yadda, yadda

So there seems to be a price jump from $7 from trail building ($500 minimum) with just dirt and rocks to $8.50 per member ($600 minimum) for building anything besides teeter-totters.

Was this quote written wrong. Was it supposed to say Man-Made Trail Features UNDER 36 inches? I cannot believe that a straight up trail grade bridge or boardwalk should bump you into a higher category when they make the trail SAFER.

I read what Dancing Bear wrote. It's easy to understand and makes a LOT of sense. But the quote I got didn't seem to reflect that categorization structure.


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## DancingBear (Jan 12, 2004)

willtsmith_nwi said:


> The quotes sent out were vague. There was a line item for plain "trail maintenance" with the $500 minimum. Then it said that :
> 
> Club Members (Trails) $7 (per member)
> (Trail Maintenance and/or Construction-
> ...


Sounds like something is off with the quote, you are probably best off calling RJF to get things straightened out. 1-800-444-3033 ask for Theresa Terry or Scott Chapin.

- Ryan


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## mergs (Feb 14, 2004)

ovbc said:


> Hi guys, some of us have been doing business with Dan McKay (under separate policy) to hold mountain bike races..or series races as a part of their annual activities. Generally speaking our Club promotes races as a way to create more awareness of our recreational trail building efforts. I realize the G/L policies that we are speaking of here are designed for trail activities but I am wondering if RJF will be able to make available (or will be willing as McKay has) to make available coverage under a separate policy for these specific racing events as McKay has in the past. Any comments on this appreciated.


I believe several of our chapters do their races under a USA Cycling policy separate from us. Just a thought in case RJF doesn't work out in that respect.


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