# Are these Fox recommended tools necessary?



## bobsaget (Feb 17, 2008)

Hi, I'm looking to replace seals/oil in lowers on my 2016 Fox 34 140mm. I've read through the guide, and about to order the Fox Gold Oil, and the seal kit off Amazon.

Do I absolutely need the punch/seal press tools seen below?


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## mtnbiker4life (Sep 19, 2005)

Using the correct tools just makes installation easier and you're less likely to damage your fork or spare parts. It's your choice. If you choose not to buy the correct tools when you screw something up don't whine about it  This forum is full of those types.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

What does that punch do? I've never even seen one of those. 

I must admit, I'd quite like a seal press tool though.


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## mtnbiker4life (Sep 19, 2005)

Mr Pig said:


> What does that punch do? I've never even seen one of those.
> 
> I must admit, I'd quite like a seal press tool though.


That helps pull the damper rod thru the hole in the lower.........


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## Zatoichi (Oct 25, 2014)

mtnbiker4life said:


> Using the correct tools just makes installation easier and you're less likely to damage your fork or spare parts. It's your choice. If you choose not to buy the correct tools when you screw something up don't whine about it  This forum is full of those types.


+1

The tools can be found on pricepoint.com


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## Bhaalgorn (Jul 16, 2015)

Do you *need* the punch? No. I do oil changes by flipping the nuts on the lowers around and lightly tapping them with a soft-faced hammer.

As for the seal driver, I absolutely cannot install the latest version of the flangeless seals on my 2012 Fox Float. I even tried fabricating a press out of PVC to no avail. I'll likely buy a piloted seal driver from RWC (RWC Seal and Wiper Press Tool, 32mm) in the near future since the flanged wipers are no longer available. Your mileage may vary.


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## car bone (Apr 15, 2011)

bobsaget said:


> Hi, I'm looking to replace seals/oil in lowers on my 2016 Fox 34 140mm. I've read through the guide, and about to order the Fox Gold Oil, and the seal kit off Amazon.
> 
> Do I absolutely need the punch/seal press tools seen below?


I would get the tool(s) if you intend to do this a couple of times. And keep the stuff you have for a few years, otherwise not. I'm a machinist though so i would probabably just make the tools instead. The simplest possible that would work though.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

Bhaalgorn said:


> I'll likely buy a piloted seal driver from RWC in the near future since the flang (RWC Seal and Wiper Press Tool, 32mm).


Bought one of those myself last season. Oh my goodness! Why did I not buy one earlier? Wonderful tool. Looks great too. Worth every cent.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

bobsaget said:


>





Mr Pig said:


> What does that punch do? I've never even seen one of those.
> 
> I must admit, I'd quite like a seal press tool though.





mtnbiker4life said:


> That helps pull the damper rod thru the hole in the lower.........


I'm sorry, but you're incorrect. This is a knurled punch from Fox for driving the shaft upwards, or into the shaft hole to separate the uppers from the lowers. They can not be pulled out through the hole in the lower.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Cleared2land said:


> This is a knurled punch from Fox for driving the shaft upwards, or into the shaft hole to separate the uppers from the lowers.


Yeah, I figured that out, it can't be for anything else, but like Blahblahgorn said, a socket on the nut works just fine. Some tools you really can't do without, or make the job significantly easier, but this ain't one of them.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Mr Pig said:


> but like Blahblahgorn said, a socket on the nut works just fine. Some tools you really can't do without, or make the job significantly easier, but this ain't one of them.


I disagree if you know what you're doing. Done carefully and correctly, this can be done by several methods that will work. The difference is someone who is a skilled wrench that can exercise care and patience through learned experience or a hack and a hammer.

Depending on your fork, removal and disassembly techniques will vary.

On the rebound dampener shaft, do not hammer this out with a socket on the black ALUMINUM rebound nut. It's aluminum and the socket can flair the end of the nut and make re-installing the rebound control knob difficult or impossible.

Some fabricate a drift from aluminum rod and . Some drill a hole in an ALUMINUM rod to perfectly fit over the rebound adjustment threads and contact the larger thread portion that the rebound nut tightens the dampener to the lowers (not the rebound adjustment threads) and gently tap out the dampener (uppers) with a plastic hammer. Gently is subjective and if you've done this, you know what I'm talking about. You have to whack these pretty good sometimes, just use skilled judgement.

If you are not comfortable doing this or don't feel you are capable of this, then don't do it. Buy the tool or take it to your LBS.

http://http://www.ridefox.com/help.php?m=bike&id=573

http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eh-sIrnC8xs


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## Bhaalgorn (Jul 16, 2015)

mr pig said:


> ...but like blahblahgorn said...


:d:d:d


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Cleared2land said:


> The difference is someone who is a skilled wrench that can exercise care and patience through learned experience or a hack and a hammer.


That's true but the guy who knows what he's doing is probably more likely to buy the correct tools!


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Mr Pig said:


> That's true but the guy who knows what he's doing is probably more likely to buy the correct tools!


Again, given the circumstance, I might disagree with your statement. I look at specialized tool acquisition in terms of a 'break even analysis'. I look at the cost of the tools and determine the frequency of usage against the cost to purchase and my ability to correctly perform the task with what I have. If I have to spend $100 on a specialized tool that might get used only once a year (and sometimes much less often), over possessing the skill set to correctly perform the same task with other common tools, then I will frequently do that. I think the difference is knowing your abilities and what you can comfortably do with what you have without risk of damage or harm to what you are attempting to accomplish.

As I always tell others...If you're not comfortable or confident in your abilities to complete the task correctly, then it's you're call to explore other options. In many years of professional wrenching, I know when I need to explore other options.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Cleared2land said:


> I look at specialized tool acquisition in terms of a 'brake even analysis'.


Maybe, but sometimes I buy tools because I just plain want them! ;0) I have a bearing press I made up which works fine, threaded rod and various disks and washers, but I wanted the Park one. Just like having it, although it is also easier to use.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Mr Pig said:


> Maybe, but sometimes I buy tools because I just plain want them! ;0)


Absolutely! Sometimes, we elect to buy a tool because we simply want it regardless of the cost. This is often not out of requirement, but desire. Exercise caution&#8230;High-end, specialized tools in your hand can provide euphoric results that can result in uncontrollable expenditures.

This part of the conversation deviates from the topic of needing to buy an expensive specialized tool because we have the perception that it's a requirement to perform the task correctly.


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## mtnbiker4life (Sep 19, 2005)

Cleared2land said:


> Absolutely! Sometimes, we elect to buy a tool because we simply want it regardless of the cost. This is often not out of requirement, but desire. Exercise caution&#8230;High-end, specialized tools in your hand can provide euphoric results that can result in uncontrollable expenditures.
> 
> This part of the conversation deviates from the topic of needing to buy an expensive specialized tool because we have the perception that it's a requirement to perform the task correctly.


It's not a perception it's reality. High end equipment requires specialized tools.....unless your bike is a 1985 Schwinn High Sierra then you can service it with Chevy Luv Tool Kit from JC Whitney.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

mtnbiker4life said:


> It's not a perception it's reality. High end equipment requires specialized tools...


Unless you are creative, intelligent and own a big hammer! ;0)


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

mtnbiker4life said:


> It's not a perception it's reality. High end equipment requires specialized tools.....unless your bike is a 1985 Schwinn High Sierra then you can service it with Chevy Luv Tool Kit from JC Whitney.


Given the fact that you are a seller of these types of tools, I would expect your opinion to be biased and predisposed towards the need for others to purchase such tools&#8230;especially the tools that you sell here and on eBay. It's obviously in your best interest to promote the use of these tools and to discourage the use of anything else.

Your analogy of maintaining a 1985 Schwinn and tools from J.C. Whitney it clearly at the far end of the spectrum.


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## link1896 (Jul 13, 2007)

Tooling on a shoe string budget. 

Damper/air rod removal: two m8 nuts, a washer and a deep socket. Socket makes contact with the washer. Bash away with due care.


Seal install tool: 

Plumbing fittings from the hardware store . A million options, you'll find something. Large 12 point sockets work too but will be more then plumbing fittings. Do not make any contact with the raised lip, only the outer edge. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

mtnbiker4life said:


> It's not a perception it's reality. High end equipment requires specialized tools.....unless your bike is a 1985 Schwinn High Sierra then you can service it with Chevy Luv Tool Kit from JC Whitney.


This brings up an interesting point, with the performance of bikes getting so high, why are so many people willing to put up with such crappy tools?


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## mtnbiker4life (Sep 19, 2005)

customfab said:


> This brings up an interesting point, with the performance of bikes getting so high, why are so many people willing to put up with such crappy tools?


It depends what "crappy tools" means to you and others that are buying them! So define crappy tools?


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## skileh (Dec 12, 2010)

Here is what I'll be using instead of the punch. A coupling nut!

Here are some links:
McMaster-Carr
http://www.amazon.com/ZFE-Pitch-Cou...id=1456026954&sr=1-8&keywords=m8+coupling+nut

You can either pound straight on the nut, or screw in a hex headed M8 nut and pound away. Work on the same exact principle as the punch but for a fraction of the price.

The price on McMaster isn't bad, provided you can buy other stuff to compensate for shipping costs, otherwise just buy from amazon. Who knows your local hardware store might have them, but most likely they only have inch thread sizes in stock (Lowes and Home Depot don't have metric coupling nuts)

Hopefully this will help someone.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

skileh said:


> The price on McMaster isn't bad, provided you can buy other stuff to compensate for shipping costs, otherwise just buy from amazon.


Good call. Just checked and they have them cheap on eBay.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

It is interesting that some are willing to spend large amounts of money on a quality ride and choose to maintain them with inferior quality tools. I’m referring to commonly used hand tools to maintain anything, on an ongoing, regular, day-to-day basis (not specialty tools). Many fail to understand that not only will a quality tool will outlast “crappy” inferior tools, but perform a better job at maintaining the fasteners and hardware that be found on anything, not just bikes. Quality, high-end tools will have a precision gap and profile, proper hardness and finish that achieve the removal/installation objective with less slippage and damage to the fastener.

One tool that should never be compromised for anyone who wrenches on a bike, is the hex wrench or Allen wrench. Don’t scrimp on these. Even the best of these wrenches are not that expensive and very well worth what you will pay for them. In fact, these will pay for themselves in grief saved and damage prevented. While I don’t generally endorse products, take a look at Bondhus for uncompromised quality. 

Not only do quality hand tools do a superior job of protecting the fastener and being more efficient, but they usually come with an eloquent tactile element that can’t be denied. An example is the Bondhus Felo Ergonic screwdrivers… pure indulgence.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Cleared2land said:


> One tool that should never be compromised for anyone who wrenches on a bike, is the hex wrench or Allen wrench.


I agree with that. I bought a set of Allan/Torx T-bars, which were not actually that cheap, and some of the Allen keys do not even fit into the bolt!


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## Zatoichi (Oct 25, 2014)

*32mm Chamfer-less Socket for Fox Forks*

Since we're on the subject of proper tools for servicing a Fox fork, I thought that I'd throw this into the mix...

I've been thinking about changing the air volume spacer in my 2015 Fox 36. After watching the video that Fox has out on YouTube, I started looking around for the proper 32mm 6 point chamfer-less socket. Searching with google, I could not find much on the socket. It seems that some will buy a standard socket an grind it down to remove the chamfer. Others will use a chamfered socket or even an adjustable wrench.

For those lucky enough to have access to grinding tools or a machine shop, purchasing a standard chamfered socket and grinding/machining the surface to a flat would be the best option.

Since I don't have access to grinding/machining tools, nor do I want buy them, I found a custom machined "Fox Fork Flat Socket - 32mm" from a company out of the UK. They also have 26mm and 28mm sockets.









Fox Forks Flat Socket - 32mm - £9.99 | Epic Bleed Solutions

The sockets are also available thru eBay, were you can purchase in US Dollars.
Fox Flat Socket 26 28 32mm for Servicing Fox 32 34 36 40 Forks | eBay

My thoughts are if you have a bike that you value, spend the money and get the proper tools. Especially since the final torque on the top cap assembly is 220 in-lb.

_And use a torque wrench..._


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

These are WAY sweet...and the large knurled/sculpted edges are great with greasy hands.


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## Zatoichi (Oct 25, 2014)

Those are nice! Wish that they offered the various sizes individually...


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Zatoichi said:


> Since I don't have access to grinding/machining tools, nor do I want buy them...


A belt sander will work. Someone on here put a file in a vice then spun the socket in a drill. Nice hack I thought.


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

Cleared2land said:


> These are WAY sweet...and the large knurled/sculpted edges are great with greasy hands.
> 
> View attachment 1051506


His stuff is gorgeous but I need to get a second job before I look at his site again.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Friar Quade, has there been any consideration to offer these Suspension Top Cap Sockets separately?


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

Cleared2land said:


> Friar Quade, has there been any consideration to offer these Suspension Top Cap Sockets separately?


Patiently awaiting an answer.


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## thag (Mar 7, 2012)

Fox has the 26mm and 28mm 6-point Chamfer-less sockets for sale on their website.

The 26mm has a part#, 398-00-602. The 28mm socket has no part number but it is for sale. 20 bucks each plus shipping.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

acer66 said:


> Patiently awaiting an answer.


I stumbled across this thread while doing research for another suspension tool. Best to send me an email if you've got questions. We are probably going to offer them in singles sometime in the near future. We build tools with professional mechanics in mind and those people are better served by the set. Enough people have hounded us for singles that we can't ignore you for too much longer.

There is a sizeable difference in our sockets being built from scratch than removing a chamfer from a standard socket. Our sockets are much tighter fitting than a standard socket and they are the same height regardless of size, two things that really help them stay on the fastener and avoid damage. As mentioned the finger splines are nice with oily hands as well. Most of the factory techs from various manufacturers have adopted our sockets in their boxes


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

customfab said:


> I stumbled across this thread while doing research for another suspension tool. Best to send me an email if you've got questions. We are probably going to offer them in singles sometime in the near future. We build tools with professional mechanics in mind and those people are better served by the set. Enough people have hounded us for singles that we can't ignore you for too much longer.
> 
> There is a sizeable difference in our sockets being built from scratch than removing a chamfer from a standard socket. Our sockets are much tighter fitting than a standard socket and they are the same height regardless of size, two things that really help them stay on the fastener and avoid damage. As mentioned the finger splines are nice with oily hands as well. Most of the factory techs from various manufacturers have adopted our sockets in their boxes


Cool and I bet there are differences, I am a tool nut in general but I also just wrench on a very few bikes so a set is overkill for me but I could maybe spring for a single socket depending how much they go for.

Guess, I have to get on your mailing list or something
and thank you for keeping us posted.


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## mtnbiker4life (Sep 19, 2005)

Cleared2land said:


> Given the fact that you are a seller of these types of tools, I would expect your opinion to be biased and predisposed towards the need for others to purchase such tools&#8230;especially the tools that you sell here and on eBay. It's obviously in your best interest to promote the use of these tools and to discourage the use of anything else.
> 
> Your analogy of maintaining a 1985 Schwinn and tools from J.C. Whitney it clearly at the far end of the spectrum.


I was a buyer before I was a seller. What started it for me was taking my shock into a high end shop to get bushings changed in my shock. I asked if they had a tool and they said no we use a socket to push the bushing out and a hammer to install it. That was an immediate red flag. So I jumped on the lathe at work and made my own tool.

As an engineer, I also follow similar return on investment principles when it comes to buying tools. Then occasionally I lose all self control and buy it even if I use it once. But having a lot of my own tools has enabled me to help out my riding buddies and teach them how to wrench. I design specialized tools for a living........the last one I designed cost $275K. So my bias isn't towards my own goods, it's trying to provide a cost affective solution. So times I succeed and sometimes I fail.......I let the free market dictate my success.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

customfab said:


> We are probably going to offer them in singles sometime in the near future. We build tools with professional mechanics in mind and those people are better served by the set. Enough people have hounded us for singles that we can't ignore you for too much longer.


Let us know if you decide to offer them in singles. I know several who are interested.


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## Zatoichi (Oct 25, 2014)

Cleared2land said:


> Let us know if you decide to offer them in singles. I know several who are interested.


Count me in. Always use the best tool for the job.

Good tools are less expensive than replacing the parts that bad tools or worse, the wrong tools, tear up...


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

One of those sockets would make a perfect gift for an upcoming birthday.

Hint, hint.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

Cleared2land said:


> Let us know if you decide to offer them in singles. I know several who are interested.


They are on our site for pre-order now. Pre-order pricing is the same as the set, $30 each. After we go to production they'll be $35 each. Delivery in December.

Billet top cap sockets


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

customfab said:


> They are on our site for pre-order now. Pre-order pricing is the same as the set, $30 each. After we go to production they'll be $35 each. Delivery in December.
> 
> Billet top cap sockets


Cool, guess it will be a x-mas present now.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Thanks Friar Quade!


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

tool looks really handy, i am going to get it. Do i need it? I typically use a socket extension and rubber mallet for the punch. I found something that works perfectly for the seal press, I think it's and odd sized plastic cup. seals are the worst if it is just me and me fingers, requires ninja warrior strength with some seals.


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## kf9yr (May 15, 2012)

skileh said:


> Here is what I'll be using instead of the punch. A coupling nut!
> 
> Here are some links:
> McMaster-Carr
> ...


Tried the M8 coupling nut. No Good unless you find a fine threaded one as the standard ones are coarse thread.

I was able to use a nut with a spacer and tapped it out with a rubber mallet. I found the Fox tool for $20 or so online and ordered it last night.

The RWC seal driver worked great. I have one of the Abbey Tools sockets on the way, can't wait until December (their HAG tool arrived and it's almost too nice to use).

Stop starting these threads as they are expensive for me! I can't control my tool lust...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## Desertride (Nov 1, 2012)

This Chinese ebay seller has a 20mm fine thread m8 coupling for 8.50
Select Size M4 M10 Round Threaded Rod Coupling Nuts 304 Stainless Steel | eBay

which seems a bit much, especially if you can get the tool for 20 (I haven't seen it for less than 25.) I have a nut from an old damper that I use instead.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Yeah, it does seem a little high, but you get two and they're 304 Stainless. I bet you can find these less expensive and not in stainless.


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## oberwil (Nov 5, 2007)

If you ride a lot, seals should be done on a yearly basis. So if you plan on riding for several years, plan on doing seal changes. So If you want piece of mind get good tools. If you feel confident and want to save $$ you can get by with hardware stuff. For me the it would be hard to remember what each piece of hardware was intended for if I didn't label it.
And with what the forks cost now a days, I find it better to invest in quality tools.
And since I've taken UBI's suspension classes, and do some work for freinds etc.. the tools have already paid off.


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