# Tour Divide; what is needed?



## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

I got the bike. 

I'm wondering what sort of shape a person needs to be in. I can ride 70 miles in a day; I'm a bit more serious than the man on the street, but-

Dunno if this is something I should try or not. Sure sounds cool though. I've seen Ride the Divide several times and each time it just gets better. I'm probably nuts. It looks like a whole lotta pain too. But a lot of satisfaction as well. 

I'm 60. I figure I better get at it sooner than later. I already know I'm slow. I'm just wondering if there are others out there than can share the pain- it would be a lot cooler if there were others that could make the grand rollout with the intention of completing but not really focused on winning. 

Sorry for the word salad...


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## ekripper (Sep 16, 2005)

You should try, you're not nuts...go for it! Make the most of the journey and have fun. You thinking of doing this year?

Sent from my Trio AXS 4G using Tapatalk


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## veloborealis (Oct 25, 2009)

I've been mulling this over, too. I'll be 60 this year and semi-retired in October. Big move from AK to AZ at the end of the year, so I'm thinking the soonest I would have time to do the route as a thru-ride would be summer 2017. Like you, I comfortable with 70+ miles a day, but its been years since I did a long tour with multiple, back-to-back, big mile days. Intrigued with riding south to north to get an earlier start, avoid the snow up north, and meet all the fast people as they pass through NM and CO. Grand rollout would be fun, but more interested in hearing stories after people have been on the trail for awhile. Keep us posted if you decide to do it. It would be great to read about the TD from an older rider's perspective.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

ekripper said:


> You should try, you're not nuts...go for it! Make the most of the journey and have fun. You thinking of doing this year?


If I don't do it this year, next year I'll be 61...

As it is, I have a trip to Colorado coming up in August (I'm from the Midwest but I have friends that live in the Salida area); so I'm thinking of going out there earlier than I'd been planning and just seeing if I can do some of the Colorado passes- see what sort of trouble I'd be in. I am familiar with a lot of the area along the Divide route as I've been flying hang gliders in all of the route states going back 30 years. The big problem with that plan is that it takes a while to acclimate to the elevation, but maybe that's not such a big issue because even people that live out there have troubles once they get high enough. I think most of the passes are 10,000' or under so I might be OK.


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## veloborealis (Oct 25, 2009)

Salubrious said:


> If I don't do it this year, next year I'll be 61.


61 is just a number. That's what I tell myself anyway.

I'm planning to do the Coco 250 next Spring as a shakedown cruise. It doesn't have the altitude, but it should be a pretty good test of where I'm at endurance-wise. I can start from my front door, so why not.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

veloborealis said:


> 61 is just a number. That's what I tell myself anyway.
> 
> I'm planning to do the Coco 250 next Spring as a shakedown cruise. It doesn't have the altitude, but it should be a pretty good test of where I'm at endurance-wise. I can start from my front door, so why not.




I figured I'd be 61 whether I went or not.

So far my only real shakedown has been the Dairyland Dare, which is all on pavement. Last year I did 100km, 4700 feet of climbing. That took me about 6 hours which included rest stops.

So really what I'm trying to sort out is what I need to go. Figuring the time and money _seems_ to be the challenge. Well, logistics is an issue too...


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## veloborealis (Oct 25, 2009)

Salubrious said:


> So really what I'm trying to sort out is what I need to go. Figuring the time and money _seems_ to be the challenge. Well, logistics is an issue too...


If you mean "what should I pack" this is a good place to start, but keep in mind that Josh was riding to win. If it were me, I would pack for "tour mode" ie. comfort, on and off the bike.

Josh Kato?s Tour Divide Pack List - BIKEPACKING.com

As for logistics, I'll do my part. If you finish this I'll pick you up at AW, buy you lunch, and get you to the nearest major airport, assuming you don't have someone to meet you. Heck, if you bail within an 8-hour drive of Prescott AZ I'll still come get you.

All you have to do is keep posting as you prepare for this ride and promise a post-ride write up,


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

!!! Thanks !!!

If I pull this off, writing it down isn't a problem.

Thanks for the link- really helpful!


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## Flinch (Feb 2, 2012)

*Heck yes you can!*



Salubrious said:


> I got the bike.
> 
> I'm wondering what sort of shape a person needs to be in. I can ride 70 miles in a day; I'm a bit more serious than the man on the street, but-
> 
> Dunno if this is something I should try or not. Sure sounds cool though. I've seen Ride the Divide several times and each time it just gets better. I'm probably nuts. It looks like a whole lotta pain too. But a lot of satisfaction as well. I'm 60. I figure I better get at it sooner than later. I already know I'm slow. I'm


Welcome to the Obsession - GO FOR IT !!!

I fast toured the north half (1250 miles) of the TD in 2013...I was 63.

Last year at 65 I raced until my hands stopped working (my fault) at 1700 miles, averaging 103 miles/day. Will I do it again - hey, does the Pope crap in the Vatican?

Just because you are a youngster at 60 doesn't let you off the hook. There were 12 over-60 racers last year. My training was 200+ miles/week for the last couple months, with lots of hills. Learn to love hills! Rides should be minimum of 30 miles each - avoid junk miles, mine averaged 50-70, and this is during the last couple months. I took five months of training, starting from a 40 mile/week base, and frankly over-trained at 3100 miles total. Don't try and peak for the TD! You will peak on the route. Don't worry about the elevation, as you will get used to it along the way. For first timer I suggest North-South race.

Note that you must maintain 85 miles/day average or you will be classified in the 'Touring' category. SPOT trackers are mandatory, and you can rent them from Trackleaders.com . Use a GPS - the route GPX file is provided. Lots of info on the net.

The race is 99% mental, and the other 50% is mental too. You CAN ride back-to-back 100+ milers; I had many 120-130 mile days.

Check out the special forum at: 2016 Tour Divide Preparation

You WILL surprise yourself! And won't stop grinning! :thumbsup:


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

If you're looking for a fast time, you might be disappointed. If you're looking for a good time?...

We averaged 45 miles a day, and ran into a 70-year old going even slower. What Flinch wrote – the first week(s) of the ride provide plenty of training. No worries about being in shape as long as you ride regularly and get some mileage beforehand. I would only be concerned about overtraining during the ride, and keeping the contact points in good shape. Maybe take a pre-emptive rest day here or there, or sprinkle in some short days. Take the time to eat. Get your gear dialed in, keep it minimal. Relax and enjoy.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

Flinch said:


> Welcome to the Obsession - GO FOR IT !!!
> 
> I fast toured the north half (1250 miles) of the TD in 2013...I was 63.
> 
> ...


Sweet- thanks y'all! I have a Spot locater that I use for the hang gliding competitions so the real hardware is likely the lightweight sleeping stuff.

I over-trained for a race a few years ago a regretted it. Seems to me on this ride you just take your time- with only occasional burns- otherwise you'll be too tired at the end of the day.

Still trying to sort out logistics. I run a small business so taking time off is always a trick.


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## GoldDust (Oct 24, 2013)

I live on the route and have met many many riders, from 196 mile a day racers to people who do it in multi year stages.

I do remember 3 Germans who I guess were in their late 60's and were doing it as a post retirement trip, they seemed to be stopping at every bar. Then there was the guy on the Unicycle and Fixie Dave doing wheelies in the car park.

Most go North to South, wind direction is the biggie, some seemed to have little preparation, most brought too much and discard en route. 

Those who finish, well a bit of luck but mainly the right mentality, some very serious cyclists never made it this far.


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## freeheel (Sep 27, 2005)

Respectfully, why do you want to race this? You don't sound like you do much racing? Why not just tour the gdmbr?


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

freeheel said:


> Respectfully, why do you want to race this? You don't sound like you do much racing? Why not just tour the gdmbr?


One of the things I like about endurance bikepacking is that it always feels like everyone is racing themselves, not each other.

It makes a lot of sense to me to race yourself.


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## GoldDust (Oct 24, 2013)

Very few people seem to be up to racing themselves, most seem to congregate in like speed groups.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

freeheel said:


> Respectfully, why do you want to race this? You don't sound like you do much racing? Why not just tour the gdmbr?


Not doing much racing is to me irrelevant. What happened is I found out about and saw Ride the Divide recently and found it inspiring.

I don't care to be the first- such would be really unlikely. I do care to complete (although that does not seem to be in the cards this year)- to be able to say I did it, and to meet that challenge to my satisfaction. I've read the book about _touring _ the divide- quite frankly, I don't have that sort of time (if, by the book, a week just to go the first 250 miles??)- I own a small business and don't live in my mom's basement. In fact its not likely that I would be able to complete the race either based on that fact. It would be nice to take off a month, in which I would finish or crash and burn, but I'm already taking off a fair amount of time this summer as it is.

So right now I am very interested to see how far I can get in the time I have, and see how well I do (or don't).


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## GoldDust (Oct 24, 2013)

2 weeks is the record, 3 weeks and under is very respectable, completing for most is a major achievement.


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## freeheel (Sep 27, 2005)

Salubrious, I get where you are coming from. I hope you are able to give it a go. It's an amazing journey.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

freeheel said:


> Respectfully, why do you want to race this? You don't sound like you do much racing? Why not just tour the gdmbr?


If you aren't interested in racing the TD you could start a week or 2 early and let the race pass through you. You'd get to see most of the riders in the event and be caught up in the action for a while.

If you are at the slower end of the event you'll see everyone at the start and then they'll be gone. Not to mention all the good snack food will be gone at the gas stations when you get there. 

Just a thought.


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## freeheel (Sep 27, 2005)

I want to add that when I was suggesting that you consider touring instead of racing, I wasn't suggesting that you go slow... I do a lot of touring but typically I go as fast as I can and put in very long days. It's just my personal style bred from being a mid-pack bikepacking racer.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

vikb said:


> If you aren't interested in racing the TD you could start a week or 2 early and let the race pass through you. You'd get to see most of the riders in the event and be caught up in the action for a while.
> 
> If you are at the slower end of the event you'll see everyone at the start and then they'll be gone. Not to mention all the good snack food will be gone at the gas stations when you get there.
> 
> Just a thought.


Really good point. I can ride a long time, but I'm not fast...



freeheel said:


> I want to add that when I was suggesting that you consider touring instead of racing, I wasn't suggesting that you go slow... I do a lot of touring but typically I go as fast as I can and put in very long days. It's just my personal style bred from being a mid-pack bikepacking racer.


Good point!


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

I'm racing the Tour Divide this year. By racing I mean I'm going to do it as fast as I personally can. I don't think the top riders need to be worried or constantly check behind them.

I've been training all year. I started out 30 pounds heavier as a guy who rode a lot of single track but considered a 25 mile ride on gravel roads to be epic. After a year I'm riding around 800-1000 miles a month on my fully loaded bike.

I'm not as ready as I would have liked to have been. I also work full-time so this has limited my riding hours. I'd like to finish the race in 25-28 days but I have no idea if I can sustain 100+ mile days, day-in and day-out, for this long. I have ridden quite a few 100+ days but not back to back.

The advantage I'll have is not having to go to work. Currently, I get home at 7AM, sleep until 2PM, and then get up and go for a ride. I'm usually limited to 50 miles or so by the constraints of time, work, and professional and family responsibilities. I hope that if I have all day to ride I can get up and crank out the miles.

Plus, to be honest, I've ridden the local dirt and gravel roads around here so often that I'm beginning to get a little bored looking at them. Some new scenery will be nice.

I'm prepared to be humbled but I'm going to give it all I've got.

I started thinking about racing the Tour Divide in 2013 but talked myself out of it. My fiancee who is also a cyclist has been very supportive and gave me the little extra push to commit to it it this year. 

It's a free race but very expensive. I'm taking a month off of work, not to mention travel expenses and the bike and equipment.

Pm me if you have any questions about preparation. I'm an amateur, of course, but I've learned a few things over the last year and I have my bike and gear dialed in.


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## veloborealis (Oct 25, 2009)

Kudos and best of luck! That's how I would approach training for this event, credible but not obsessive with an emphasis on being fit enough to have a good time and finish in a reasonable amount of time. Would you consider sharing some identifying information (age, hometown, initials), so we can follow your blue dot?


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

My name is Gus Laskaris. I guess my blue dot will be GL.

I'm 52.

I'm from Alexandria, Louisiana. 

I work hard to hit as many hills as I can but I'm lucky to get 2000 feet of vertical ascent on a 50 mile ride. I've taken to repeating the hills.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

vikb said:


> If you aren't interested in racing the TD you could start a week or 2 early and let the race pass through you. You'd get to see most of the riders in the event and be caught up in the action for a while.
> 
> If you are at the slower end of the event you'll see everyone at the start and then they'll be gone. Not to mention all the good snack food will be gone at the gas stations when you get there.
> 
> Just a thought.


Just to point out that most years people starting with the Grand Depart have to deal with some really snowy passes early in the race. If you leave from Banff before they do you will just have more of that, depending on the year. So if you wanted to do something like this but you weren't going to go the full distance you could start farther south.


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## Iowagriz (Jan 14, 2008)

Adding my two cents to what others are pointing out. I've been wanting to race this for a long time. The route goes through my high school town of Columbia Falls and I rode a week from the Border to Ovando and back 2yrs ago (casual pace).

I've always wanted to take part in the Grand Depart, but I also know the area and the weather. I equally want to just do a time trial starting mid-July. That would likely be the fastest possible conditions. Warmer, less wet, no snow.

I am torn between the camaraderie of the Grand Depart (but with suffering in the cold and snow) vs the speed and better weather of a start in July/August.

I will race this in the coming years, Grand Depart or TT is the question and I'm leaning towards a TT.


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## tominbend (Jul 23, 2010)

Does anyone know the reason behind the June start? Just tradition? It seems like an early July start would be more enjoyable with little negative (heat down south?). We need a 2nd Grand Depart at the beginning of July. I will be there. Any takers?


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

Glad I found this thread... I am 52 and really got interested in the TD a few years back. Back in February, I finally bit the bullet and booked a flight to Calgary and a hotel in Banff. June 15th, I arrive and if all goes as planned will roll out on June 17th at the earliest light. I picked the date due to my effort falling on the longest days of the year and a full moon. I am leaving 7 days after the grand departure with a goal of West Yellowstone. Since I'm not making a full effort they won't put me on the main tracker which kind of sucks but it's their tracker. 

As it is, almost every night I wake up with the foreboding fear of what the hell was I thinking and why am I doing this? Or the "Am I fit enough?" second thoughts. The TD really causes us to question ourselves on so many levels because of the unknowns. As I sit at my desk, I see mountains in the distance that I have ridden over many times. Saturday I did a 74 mile road ride with 5700 feet of elevation. For my birthday last December I did 52 gravel miles with 5100 feet of climbing in under 4 hours. Just the fact that I can hop on a bike and ride to and over them helps settle the nagging voice that keeps saying "You're going to suck sooo bad out there." I still hear the voice though.

This year will be looking down the belly of the beast. I am not doing it as a race as I have no interest in racing. It is more of a challenge to see what I can do. And it is definitely not a tour. The goal is to enjoy the ride while putting down a lot of miles.

Josh Kato set the record last year in just a bit over 14 days. IIRC the relegation pace is 2x the current record. So that would make it a hair over 28 days which is just under 100 miles a day.


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## freeheel (Sep 27, 2005)

Baker, why do you say what you are doing is not touring? Because you are trying to go as fast as you can? You are loading up your bike with camping gear and going from A to B. That's touring. No offense, I just don't get why some people don't want their effort to be viewed as touring...as if it's an activity not worthy of respect???

Trackleaders has a specific page for people who are touring the GDMBR. Not sure why it "sucks" that you can't be on the race tracker when you're not racing.


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

Yeah my comments probably came across a bit condescending which certainly wasn't the intent. Thanks for pointing it out.

The first goal is to enjoy the ride, 2nd is putting in miles, and lastly is comfort. Most die hard racers switch 1 and 2 and people who do touring tend to move comfort up a bit. 

The only reason that I won't be listed as doing an ITT is that I do have to bail off of the trail at a certain point due to work limitations. Last year, 14 people were shown on the General map. It doesn't seem worth the effort when friends and family can find me on my Delorme page. There is one person who might be going NoBo whose path I'd love to cross and being on the same map would make it easier for my wife to give me a heads up when she sees that we're with int a day of crossing.

Just chalk it up to pre-ride jitters and constant nagging self doubt.


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## freeheel (Sep 27, 2005)

Yeah, it's kind of a shame more people don't use that general tracker. Like you mentioned it would be a great tool for riders to hook up out there. I am starting to think this route needs a 2nd grand depart date for non-competitive riders. There certainly is something very cool about the vibe at a grand depart. Maybe a couple weeks after the race start to avoid all the walking through snow that usually happens....


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## 12:00 RIDER (Apr 2, 2016)

bakerjw
Safe travels brother, you and everyone else older than me and doing this are an inspiration to me, whether you realize that or not. I'm just getting in to this, and stories like yours motivate me.


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

Thanks for the kind words. Part of keeping myself going forward is having a collection of YouTube videos that I watch almost nightly. It keeps the gremlins of doubt away and mine sometimes have pretty darn loud voices.

If you want inspiration, here you go. I watch it nightly as it is my main inspiration for those times when I'll be out there, cold, lonely and wondering why I am doing it. It still gives me shivers of excitement. He's also a great guy.


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

Here are other favorite inspiration videos.

Great great video. Wait until you see the majestic creature at 4:01. Unbelievable.





Alex Harris. A south African rider. I love his spirit.





The Alessi Brothers. They documented their trip very well.
At 11:00 minutes in, they have a lot of shots of people that they met on the road.
At 11:07, they show a special person riding by.





Iohan is a cycling animal. Great attitude and likes to stop and smell the roses and enjoy the ride. The scene with him and the wild horses is really funny.





Some Swedes? Norwegians? Good video nonetheless.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

In regard to a second Grand Depart, I'm not sure why that would be necessary. While I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be a top finisher and am, in fact, shooting for 28 days or less, I am racing...as fast as my stumpy little legs will allow.

No matter how many start out the top riders will leave the rest of us in the dust and after a few hours we'll probably all be spread out enough where congestion won't be an issue.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

With so many racers ahead of me at least the snow on the passes will be beaten down a little...


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

I would say you are a lot better off than many who start with the grand depart. I did the TD in 2012 at age 59. Began training for the Stagecoach 400 in December, raced the Stagecoach in April and toed the line for the Grand Depart in June. There is no such thing as junk miles in my book, because that is the speed you will probably be riding. Miles in the saddle are extremely important as well as a good recovery period before the race.
Make sure you kit is dialed in before the race and that you can handle any weather situation. Hypothermia is a real risk and can kill you. I had a super scary 2nd day out where I literally thought I was going to die from cold, wind and rain. I along with many other racers got lucky in that we found a warm cabin to hole up in. 
Ask yourself if you can survive the extreme conditions you will find in the TD from heat to cold? I have since changed my kit to where I feel more comfortable with my ability to deal with these conditions.
Good luck to you!


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

As I tell people all the time. Nothing says "Quit now and go home" like getting cold. That is one reason that the Navy Seals do so much cold water immersion in their training.

Without having experienced the mountain passes out there, it is hard for many of us to strike the perfect balance on what gear works best. Unfortunately that leads to a lot of second guessing and taking too more than is needed.

Thanks for your insight.


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## tominbend (Jul 23, 2010)

Ailuropoda said:


> In regard to a second Grand Depart, I'm not sure why that would be necessary. While I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be a top finisher and am, in fact, shooting for 28 days or less, I am racing...as fast as my stumpy little legs will allow.
> 
> No matter how many start out the top riders will leave the rest of us in the dust and after a few hours we'll probably all be spread out enough where congestion won't be an issue.


I suppose a second Grand Depart is appealing for the same reasons as a June start. Camaraderie, motivation, "making it an event," support, etc. However, some people are not able to attend the June start (as a teacher, I may never be able to) and some people may desire the better weather of a July start.

How about a Northbound Grand Depart on the first of July  That way it won't duplicate the SB start but serve the same purposes. I sure it won't be a popular idea, but I can only hope.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

I used live in a mountain town and I'd get all sorts of emails from touring cyclists saying "I'm coming in June what weather should I plan for?"

I'd have to answer "I have no idea. Could be summer hot or winter cold. Dry or snow/rain."

If you are crossing mountain passes and don't need some gear items that year on those specific days it doesn't mean you packed too much. It simply means you got lucky.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

With regards to the cold my main concern is shoes (the rest of my setup is tested in Minnesota this last winter). My mtb shoes don't block water and are not particularly warm, so if I have to posthole my feet are going to be a problem. I have warm hiking boots but they are a lot to bring along... seems like waterproofing my shoes with plastic and some really good wool socks might be helpful- any tips??


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

I don't have any tips but... And not to divert from the original topic.

When I play mountain biking, I use egg beaters and mountain bike shoes.
When I cross country ride, I use flat pedals and some Merrill hiking shoes. My theory is that if I'm tired and start to wipe out, I will likely not unclip fast enough. That is why I go with a suspension fork over rigid. I could shave off some weight, but it might just absorb going over an object that I miss and keep me on the bike. 

I am also considering going with a shoe 1/2 a size larger than normal. The rest can be taken up with socks. The thought is that if my feet start to swell, I'd hate to have to shove them into too small of a shoe.

Feet are also like hands. With flats, I can change where the pressure is on my foot. If the Achilles tendon starts acting up, I can move my foot forward and take the pressure off of it for a while.

Just random thoughts. Yes... I think about these things all the time.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Salubrious said:


> With regards to the cold my main concern is shoes (the rest of my setup is tested in Minnesota this last winter). My mtb shoes don't block water and are not particularly warm, so if I have to posthole my feet are going to be a problem. I have warm hiking boots but they are a lot to bring along... seems like waterproofing my shoes with plastic and some really good wool socks might be helpful- any tips??


Gore-tex socks and shoes big enough for extra warm socks and foot swelling.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

I got my shoes 2 sizes too big. That way I can tighten them down as needed- or loosen them. So far that has worked really well- I'm a late adopter of clipless pedals because my feet are so wide and hard to fit. I've ridden for years with toe clips and sandals! My pedals have clipless on one side and platforms on the other. So I can ride either way. I've never been a fan of Shimano but so far they've been working really well. 

Its no diversion from the topic- this is some of the information I've been looking for! I have a very strong feeling that no matter how well researched I am, when the big day comes I'll still be clueless.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

Research is no replacement for experience. Skip the research and ride until you and your ride are dialed. 

MTBR can be used for scratching the itch as your big ride draws near. I think I've read/watched all there is on the CT. Didn't help me prepare but keeps the stoke high.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

TD in 2012. Pearl Izumi water resistant clipless shoes. Brought wool socks and they were great. I ride with wool socks year around. Shoes got tight later in the ride. Common foot swelling as most riders get. People were cutting into their shoes with knives to reduce pressure on their feet. One guy I was riding with tore up his feet so bad from bad shoe fit and swelling that he had to drop out.
AZT 300 Bigger Pearl Izumi clipless shoes. Was going for the 750 but my feet were getting tore up and bruised from all the HAB on the route. Many riders in the AZT have foot and shoe problems as most go clipless.
AZT 750 Sturdy Hi-tek hiking shoe and flat pedals. Got me through the whole route and the canyon hike with no feet issues. Feet kept warm but never got hot even in the desert sections all with wool socks. My shins and calves got a beating from my flats but it was worth the price.
Now I almost totally ride flats with hiking boots. I can move my foot around on the pedal for a change of pace and often times I pedal on my arches. 
The performance difference between flats and clipless has been proven to be very minor.


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## crewjones (Aug 24, 2007)

Rich, did you finish? Any plans to bring back the Death March?


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

AZT 750 yes, TD yes, CTR this summer? I hope so!
Death march is impossible to put on any more. The permit process is out of control and I have no stomach for that anymore.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Matterhorn said:


> Research is no replacement for experience. Skip the research and ride until you and your ride are dialed.
> 
> MTBR can be used for scratching the itch as your big ride draws near. I think I've read/watched all there is on the CT. Didn't help me prepare but keeps the stoke high.


in fact, if you do too much online research you will end up talking yourself out of it.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

These are the shoes I'm using:


Shimano MT71 MTB SPD


I got them one European size bigger than normal (a 46 when I usually wear a 45) and they seem to fit fine with two pairs of socks. They are pretty comfortable, feel like hiking shows when hike-a-biking, and waterproof as well.

They're a little heavy but not too much heavier than the SPD shoes I normally wear and like a lot of things, I'll tolerate some extra weight for increased durability and comfort.

You should see my saddle. And I have a Thudbuster seatpost.

My rear wheel for the race is built around a White Industries XMR hub and has 40 spokes (I'm a big guy, weigh about 225, and need a strong rear wheel for my fat ass and my gear).

I also will install a Hope bottom bracket next month to replace my Wheels Manufacturing bottom bracket (that has about 3000 flawless miles on it).

I'm taking a little extra cold-weather gear. I guess I can always ditch if it tuens out to be warmer than usual.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

I use a leather brooks b-17 and a thudbuster. your ass will thank you!


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

Well it looks like I'm in; Letter of Intent, booked my flight, bus ride and room for the night before the Grand Depart.

I have a _really_ queasy feeling that 'not knowing what I'm up against' is really going to be a serious challenge, one that I have no idea if I'm up to.

Now I'm trying to sort out details of my bike and equipment to bring- or not...


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

Salubrious said:


> I have a _really_ queasy feeling that 'not knowing what I'm up against' is really going to be a serious challenge, one that I have no idea if I'm up to.


This is the sweetest part of life.

About two and a half years ago, I had a first date with my girlfriend Kelley. I said to my friend Jim that I hated the first week of constant anxiousness/nervousness that goes with new dates.

Jim says "What?! That's the best feeling! You only get to experience it in the beginning, and then it's gone! I love those moments."

If you think about the uneasiness, anxiousness, queasiness as a wonderful feeling indicating you're doing something momentous, you'll feel better.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

^^ +1 agreed! 

Now as long as I can avoid being eaten by bears...


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## GoldDust (Oct 24, 2013)

Good luck, hope to see you in Como, probably with a lot less equipment than you thought was essential when you started.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

Lots more to worry about than bears. No Tour Divide rider to my knowledge has ever been attacked or eaten by a bear!


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

Salubrious said:


> ^^ +1 agreed!
> 
> Now as long as I can avoid being eaten by bears...


I my house, we don't say the "B" word.

A bear did charge a girl last year. Not quite being attacked, but still left her quite rattled and the bear spray can a bit depleted.


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## bamwa (Mar 15, 2010)

bakerjw said:


> As I tell people all the time. Nothing says "Quit now and go home" like getting cold.


Except getting HOT, but that is another discussion.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

richwolf said:


> Lots more to worry about than bears. No Tour Divide rider to my knowledge has ever been attacked or eaten by a bear!





bakerjw said:


> I my house, we don't say the "B" word.
> 
> A bear did charge a girl last year. Not quite being attacked, but still left her quite rattled and the bear spray can a bit depleted.


Those bear sprays aren't cheap! You'd better mean it when you spray it.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Salubrious said:


> Those bear sprays aren't cheap! You'd better mean it when you spray it.


For anyone who has never fired off a can of bear spray I recommend buying two [maybe a friend has an old expired can?] despite the cost and firing one so that you understand how limited the range is. You really have to keep your nerve and wait until the last 10' or so before you pull the trigger or it will be wasted.

I would also recommend carrying bear bangers. They are good at scaring away bears at long range and you can carry 10 of them without adding much weight/bulk to your gear.

Most trips into bear country I'll use a banger or 3, but I have yet to need spray.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Salubrious said:


> Well it looks like I'm in; Letter of Intent, booked my flight, bus ride and room for the night before the Grand Depart.
> 
> I have a _really_ queasy feeling that 'not knowing what I'm up against' is really going to be a serious challenge, one that I have no idea if I'm up to.
> 
> Now I'm trying to sort out details of my bike and equipment to bring- or not...


That's me exactly.

Plus training is starting to be a chore. Another fifty-mile ride on the same gravel roads I've been up and down for the last year? And then I feel bad because I know I'm not really ready.

Then excited to see some new scenery and actually go somewhere instead of making a big loop back to my house.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

Any thoughts on shoes? Hiking boots or the like with trials pedals, or clipless? I still can't figure that one out.


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Salubrious said:


> Any thoughts on shoes? Hiking boots or the like with trials pedals, or clipless? I still can't figure that one out.


Clipless, definitely, but a pedal with some platform like Crankbrother Mallets or, in my case, Time ATAC DH4s.

For shoes, I use Shimano MT71s. They are waterproof and feel like comfortable hiking shoes but they have cleats. They are little heavier than dedicated racing shoes but you can, in fact, hike-a-bike very well in them.

Shimano MT71 MTB SPD Shoes 2015 | Chain Reaction Cycles

I set my cleats so I have a lot of float. That and a large platform seems to give me the benefit of flat pedals without the many disadvantages.


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

FWIW. I am going with Merrill mid height hiking shoes and flat pedals. That's how I train on my BP rig.

A lot of people that have done the entire route have said that the one thing that they underestimated was the amount of hike a bike that was required. It is good to also train pushing your bike up hills. Different muscles do get used.

Also, much like having multiple hand positions on the handlebars, a flat gives me multiple positions on the pedal. If your Achilles needs a break, move your foot forward a bit.

When out riding my "play" mountain bike, I use egg beaters and when on my road bike I use Shimano SPDs, but when I am am on my BP rig, I like to be able to bail without the added requirement of unclipping.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

bakerjw said:


> FWIW. I am going with Merrill mid height hiking shoes and flat pedals. That's how I train on my BP rig.
> 
> A lot of people that have done the entire route have said that the one thing that they underestimated was the amount of hike a bike that was required. It is good to also train pushing your bike up hills. Different muscles do get used.
> 
> ...


A flat pedal and hiking shoe provide lot of flexibility from comfort on and off the bike and more weather protection to keep your feet warm. I use a Hi tec hiking shoe that is super comfortable and plenty stiff. Test have shown that flats are just about as efficient as clipless since most people are mashers and don't spin circles. I like clipless but for bikepacking give me flats and hiking boots.


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## lentamentalisk (Jul 21, 2015)

I would have thought clipless was the clear win, but after a few very long days, I'd recommend flat pedals. After 90 super hilly miles, you'd be surprised just how hard it is to muster up the strength to unclip your feet. Heavy bike + gnarly rocks + extreme exhaustion + clipless pedals led to a fall both days of my last overnight. 

I will continue to use clipless on my 'cross style light bikepacking rig because I need to be able to hop things and it it worth the risk of falling. But on my more mountainy bigger tired bike I'm going back to flat pedals.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

I sent in my letter of intent, but not heard anything back... How do I get my Spot locater to report to the leaderboard?

Has Garmin developed a map of the Tour Divide? IOW, is a GPS all that useful, or am I better off with a bike computer (which will have longer battery life)?


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Salubrious said:


> I sent in my letter of intent, but not heard anything back... How do I get my Spot locater to report to the leaderboard?
> 
> Has Garmin developed a map of the Tour Divide? IOW, is a GPS all that useful, or am I better off with a bike computer (which will have longer battery life)?


Looking down at a GPS track, when the GPS is working, is a lot simpler than navigating by map. And if you set the zoom you'll have a pretty early warning if you have left the route.

With that being said I have followed downloaded tracks on my Etrex30 that still required a little educated guessing and map work. Nothing is fool-proof.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

Salubrious said:


> I sent in my letter of intent, but not heard anything back... How do I get my Spot locater to report to the leaderboard?
> 
> Has Garmin developed a map of the Tour Divide? IOW, is a GPS all that useful, or am I better off with a bike computer (which will have longer battery life)?


Letter of intent is not needed since this is a non race. Before the race (non event) keep an eye out on the bikepacking.net site for spot registration through trackleaders for the event. You can either use your own spot or rent one from trackleaders. Good idea to buy one so you are familiar with it and you can use it year around for other trips or day rides when your loved ones want to keep track of you. You can also hide it in the trunk of a car to spy on your kids!


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

I'm still trying to sort out what to bring- and what to leave behind!

Right now the spare tire and a tiny cooking pot (in case I have to cook in the middle of nowhere) are the things that I'm thinking of leaving behind. The pot simply because I may not need to cook all that much, the tire because its by far the heaviest thing in my packing other than water, and I have needle and thread as well as a strip of material to place behind a big tear, so the spare seems redundant. My tires will be brand new when I start the ride and I figure on replacing them if they show wear as I go.

Any thoughts? One I have is I would hate to have to push the bike 50 miles simply because I lelft a tire behind!


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## veloborealis (Oct 25, 2009)

Salubrious said:


> I'm still trying to sort out what to bring- and what to leave behind!
> 
> Right now the spare tire and a tiny cooking pot (in case I have to cook in the middle of nowhere) are the things that I'm thinking of leaving behind. The pot simply because I may not need to cook all that much, the tire because its by far the heaviest thing in my packing other than water, and I have needle and thread as well as a strip of material to place behind a big tear, so the spare seems redundant. My tires will be brand new when I start the ride and I figure on replacing them if they show wear as I go.
> 
> Any thoughts? One I have is I would hate to have to push the bike 50 miles simply because I lelft a tire behind!


Consider leaving both behind and go light, light, light.


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## tahic (Jul 21, 2008)

ignore post


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## Ailuropoda (Dec 15, 2010)

Salubrious said:


> I'm still trying to sort out what to bring- and what to leave behind!
> 
> Right now the spare tire and a tiny cooking pot (in case I have to cook in the middle of nowhere) are the things that I'm thinking of leaving behind. The pot simply because I may not need to cook all that much, the tire because its by far the heaviest thing in my packing other than water, and I have needle and thread as well as a strip of material to place behind a big tear, so the spare seems redundant. My tires will be brand new when I start the ride and I figure on replacing them if they show wear as I go.
> 
> Any thoughts? One I have is I would hate to have to push the bike 50 miles simply because I lelft a tire behind!


I don't think too many people carry an extra tire. Honestly I have ridden mountain bikes (on this iteration) since 2007 and I have only had one tire slashed so badly it couldn't be repaired in the field. And that was on some very poor quality single track.

I went through my gear and got rid of a lot of stuff. Redundant tools, etc.

Don't think I'll want to cook anything. You never know. I have a titanium cup that fits on a water bottle. Should be enough for some impromptu coffee.


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

My gear list started off rather large and then got reduced. stuff added, stuff taken out. Repeat until a balance is reached. A tire and cookware never made the list. 

Weather is really one of the biggest factors IMHO. Cold. Hot. Rain. Snow... That has a big impact on clothing levels which I found to be the biggest weight area. Since I'm just riding a week after the grand depart I'll know from the call ins how the weather is trending and how the route is running.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

Thanks! The bike is now a bit lighter- the tent is only about a pound and a half. The water seems to be the main thing making it heavy at this point...


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## tatuowen (Jun 27, 2013)

Just out of curiosity- how much did anyone spend while doing the TD? Not taking into account the monies involved in travel to/from, gear, etc... more the en-route expenses for things such as food/hotels/laundry/bike related stuff such as maintenance and repairs/food/ other necessities?


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## Wild Wassa (Jun 4, 2009)

Salubrious, G'day Mate.

Oh!, you poor old bugger, at 60 years old, Young Grass-hopper, in my neck-of-the-bush, we respect and appreciate mature aged Gentlemen riders. They are few and far between.

You can ride your number one track on any old day, when you're aging ... but until then, come to Oz and have a ride on Australia's Bicentennial National Trail. Our super trail here, is longer and cumulatively higher than the Great Divide Trail, by nearly a 1000 klicks and it has the same difficulty level as the Iditarod Trail, 10/10 for torment and wild beauty. Over here, you'll be unique, and not just another old bloke riding a trail, among the many.

Do you have a pack raft? That'll cut heaps off the BNT. And, you'll see some of the most beautiful country Australia affords a long-distance wilderness bike rider. 

In Oz the Continent is roughly about the size of the US, and the greater metropolis of Los Angeles has more people. Come to Oz and enjoy the people-free solitude.

Warren.


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## Salubrious (Dec 21, 2015)

Thanks- sounds like a great suggestion!

I rode the Tour Divide until circumstances at home called me back. 

The trip was challenging and delightful and I rode about 99% of it completely alone. The Wall of Mud might have been the most physically challenging part of it (the same day I encountered two grizzlies, both of which bolted when they saw me) but one day I encountered 50mph headwinds that also presented a mental challenge (it took a day or too to be alright with headwinds after that). As they say, 95% of doing the Tour Divide is mental, and the other 5% is mental. 

I was slow- I knew my training was inadequate but I refused to let that stop me. A guy that was 67 was riding a single-speed and kicked my butt. 

The amazing thing is that I pulled it off at all. But once I got to the airport things went smoothly. From the time I checked the bike with the Sky Cap to the point I cleared TSA was 7 minutes flat. I had 45 minutes from when the plane landed in Calgary to when I had to catch the bus to Banff after going through customs and collecting my bike. I had 25 minutes to spare.

The bike suffered a loss of oil from the front fork (traveled upside down in the hold), which I should have gotten sorted in Banff rather than ride off with the Grand Depart. It cost me- its a lot harder to climb when the fork can't be locked!

Beyond that my gear held up well despite being plastered, daubbed, splatted and saturated with mud and I really didn't bring too much stuff. The merino wool jersey and the long sleeved Smartwool shirt were lifesavers. I wore lycra the first day and regretted it as it rained a cold rain and I got hypo-thermic by not donning my rain gear fast enough. Rain on the Divide is nothing like rain in Minnesota! My jacket did not shed rain well enough either (although my poncho which was also part of my tent worked great). I sorted that out at the Boulton store with a heavier jacket. 

I carried 5 water bottles. The largest was a 1 liter bottle on the bottom outside of the down tube. I rode 300 miles before drinking a drop from it. The water was by far the heaviest thing on the bike other than myself. I carried a triple filter pump and never used it, although had I done further I'm sure it would have been handy! 

I think next time I will look at carrying my gear on a rack on the fork rather than on the frame. I met two Northbounders that were doing this. They insisted that the bike handled a lot better. 

I got treated well everywhere I went and had no worries finding gluten-free food (I also listen to NPR and drive a hybrid car  ) even in the middle of no-where. Overall I ate really well and lost 5 pounds. I ended the ride at the Holland Lake Lodge, which has spectacular views and good food. 

If you think about doing it- do it!!


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