# Camelbak alternatives



## woodyak (Jan 20, 2004)

I've been using Camelbak products for about 10 years now and while they are decent I think there is definite room for improvement. I'm pretty fussy about stuff so I'm hoping there is something out there to meet my needs. I'm currently using an 09 MULE for long rides and a 10 Fairfax for races. I'm looking to replace the MULE. My main complaints with it are:

> Chest belt pulls off on every ride. It's kind of a pain to re-thread so I'm leaving it off for now which makes it waggle around too much.
> It's not terribly comfortable when full. It kind of feels like a school knapsack of yesteryear where the entire weight seems to pull down on the shoulder strap. This causes chaffing on longer rides and I can't even think about wearing a tank jersey or go shirtless. Something more backpack look seems fitting here.
> The capacity is strange. It's too large for most rides but not large enough to stuff a fleece. If you completely fill your bladder it's hard to get anything in the pockets. I'd like either bungees or some sort of expandable storage area and greater separation of the bladder and storage area.
> A waterproof pocket would be nice.

So basically I'd like something about the size and weight of the MULE for those longer rides but has better support and smarter storage. Anything out there that fits the bill?


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## ianick (Jul 10, 2006)

Check out the Ergon offerings. Though they may be a little larger than what your looking for.

Ergon BC1


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## woodyak (Jan 20, 2004)

ianick said:


> Check out the Ergon offerings. Though they may be a little larger than what your looking for.
> 
> Ergon BC1


I actually have tried that pack and it was pretty amazing but very big. If they made something a bit smaller I'd jump all over it. I'm 5'5" and kind of a minimalist.


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## summud (Jul 26, 2006)

*I agree*

I have some of the same complaints, but by far the biggest issue for me is when you put a full bladder of water in the MULE it leaves no room for anyting in the other compartments as you said. You think they would assume that you may want to actually put stuff in your camelbak, definitely some room for improvement.


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## AnthemRider (Feb 7, 2007)

Have you looked at http://www.wingnutgear.com/?


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## DAVP (May 16, 2006)

The Osprey Raptor 14 is a great pack. The cargo room is unaffected by the bladder and has tons of pockets and space. The straps tighten up the bag if you're not fully loaded. The new Mule NV might be better than the old Mule, but I went for the hip-pads on the Osprey. I wanted to try the Ergon, but good luck finding one in a real store.

http://www.ospreypacks.com/Packs/RaptorSeries

http://www.ergon-bike.com/us/en/home#


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I use a deuter pack myself now, albeit still with a camelbak bladder. The deuters are usually expandable in volume, have pockets with intergrated rain covers or mesh expansions to strap in a jacket, and are pretty well ventilated (some even employ the semi-rigid aluminium mesh subframes like many full size camping packs to have a clear sideways ventilation zone across your back.


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## Keepthechange (May 18, 2010)

It does feel like im balancing a medicine ball on my back when i put the full 100oz's in my mule nv... not matter how much i fiddle around with it trying to make it more comfortable


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## womble (Sep 8, 2006)

The top contenders have already been mentioned in this thread. Look at the smaller Ergons and Wingnuts.

The Wingnuts have really good storage with easily accessible side pockets (you can access the with the pack on your back). The Ergons come with integrated raincovers. Both are vastly better ventilated than standard pack designs. Both carry weight far better than standard pack designs (i.e. they give a lot more support).

I have both a Wingnut and and Ergon. I am very happy with both.


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## jeffw-13 (Apr 30, 2008)

I picked up a Coleman hydration pack at Walmart. It holds about 3 liters of fluid. I carry a pretty big first aid kit, two tubes a tire pump, cliff bars and a tool kit in it and there's still room for more stuff. I also prefer the bite valve to the Camelbak design.


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## ryball (May 14, 2007)

Source Hydration makes the best bladders. North Face and Columbia use their bladders in their bags and Source also makes their own.


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## breakingbryan (May 29, 2008)

Hydrapak is an awesome company, check them out. Reversible bladder is easy to clean and dry, virtually indestructable (they have a replacement policy should the bladder actually leak) and is made of thermoplastic polyurethane so it's got none of the BPA's or anything i it and is tough as hell. The pack itself is incredibly durable too, I haven't had a problem in the couple years I've owned them.


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## woodyak (Jan 20, 2004)

Thanks for the responses so far. It's giving me some areas to research. I should also mention that my trails are highly technical so I need something doesn't jostle around and/or get in the way when twisting and turning.

The Ergon BC-1 in the regular size looks interesting. I think the one I tried was a large G-2 or G-3. That was way too big and hefty for me. I loved how the pack pivoted though.

The wingnut stuff looks interesting. Seem to be a lot of fans online. I noticed those side pockets stick way out. Could those get away when pivoting around on real techy stuff?

Wish there was I could walk into that carried this stuff. I hat buying things like this site unseen.


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## Tim-H (Mar 20, 2010)

I have a Fox Oasis pack, http://shop.foxracing.com/ecomm/Aut...dration&proNumber=30044&imgName=30044001F.jpg

it's worked well for me. The bungie type straps at the bottom are awesome for extra gear on long rides. I rolled up a sweatshirt and fleece sweatpants and strapped it to the bottom on one ride. If I'm commuting I strap a pair of shoes to the bottom and put a spare set of clothes in the pack. The main compartment has a zipper mesh sewn into the top portion, a couple small sewn in pockets to keep stuff from bouncing around inside, an external mesh pocket, a top external pocket for your wallet and phone/mp3 player, 2 side pockets on the main bag and a small pocket on each torso strap.

The bladder is hydrapak and the opening allows you to flip it completely inside out for cleaning. The clip over flap on the back lets you strap your helmet to it. It's the only one I have experience with but I love it. I cross shopped it with the M.U.L.E. and liked it a little better. I always tell people it's the best purchase I've made for my bike.


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## thefriar (Jan 23, 2008)

I have the BC 2 and the BC3, I find the 2 is perfect for regular trail riding, including Kingdom, as there's room for lunch, an adult beverage, a shock pump, tire pump, 1x26er tube, and 1x29er tube, and tools/zip ties/patch kit, as well as 3L of water. 

The BC1 is a bit small, but not enough to be detrimental. 

The BC2 was redone this year and looks superior to the old iteration I'm on. Their flink system is awesome for drops, step ups, gaps, log rides, etc. I think competitive cyclist has a fairly generous return policy if you were to purchase the BC 1 or 2 from there and not like the pack.

The wife is going to try a mid sized Osprey pack as they do look pretty solid.

(btw... finally getting back on a regular DH schedule, having a fully functioning finger/hand for DH is nice)


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## ArmySlowRdr (Dec 19, 2003)

I got the same Osprey a few weeks back that is reviewed under the pro review sections on this site's front page.

Have five rides or so with it. Excellent. Usually takes a few outings to adjust to a new product but not so with this one.


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## 29ftw (Apr 28, 2010)

woodyak said:


> Could those get away when pivoting around on real techy stuff?


I've bumped my pockets into a couple small trees riding tight east coast ST - but I've also bumped my helmet visor into trees on the same trail so it wasn't the pack..

I bought my Hyper 3 0 having never tried one and I would do it again in a heartbeat. I've given away my old MULE and HAWG. The Wingnuts are in another league, really. If you really like traditional packs the Deuters are sweet (I have the Race X Air and it is ok).


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

woodyak said:


> Thanks for the responses so far. It's giving me some areas to research. I should also mention that my trails are highly technical so I need something doesn't jostle around and/or get in the way when twisting and turning.
> 
> The Ergon BC-1 in the regular size looks interesting. I think the one I tried was a large G-2 or G-3. That was way too big and hefty for me. I loved how the pack pivoted though.
> 
> ...


BC1 is the smallest of the 3, there are a lot of good features and a couple of annoying ones as well.

The fit and ergonomics are great. While the bag is quite compact comparing to my Mule, the main compartment is pretty good size with 2 pocket inside one for hydration and a big main space. Quite useful and does not feel bulky while riding other than the fact that the hip belt designed to carry the load is huge comparing to Camelbak.

Lot's of good details like the chest strap is a bit offset it connect to the right side of the shoulder strap makes it easy to click it back with one hand, unlike the one that's connect to the center which require you to line up both ends, it also has built in whistle.

What's annoying are the split zipper instead of the top, most if not all of the compartment are deep and long not very useful.

If you fit the large, Competitive cyclist had it on sale for about $50, which is a great deal, no reservoir though.


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## GotoDengo (Aug 6, 2010)

I'm waiting for this year's Awesomestraps to come out -- any day now. I don't like camel-backs b/c I sweat a *lot*, and those just seem to make it worse. Tried a friend's saddlebag but it was irritating how it rattled so much. I only take a water-bottle, tube, co2 pump (zip-tied to my seat rails), levers, phone, bandage, and the wedge thing that prevents me from accidentally seizing up my hydraulic brakes when changing a flat. Will be adding a multi-tool soon since my drive-train briefly, mysteriously locked up a couple of times last week.

I've just been putting it in my jersey pockets and all that stuff has been a lot less noticeable than I anticipated. But I don't like the idea of possibly landing on my back with all that stuff, so I plan to put the harder items on the awesomestraps.

I don't race or do epic rides, but the site claims many people use them in racing that they keep things solidly in place on rough terrain. Seems cheap and lightweight, might be a way to store enough stuff so you can fit more water in your camelback?


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## womble (Sep 8, 2006)

woodyak said:


> The wingnut stuff looks interesting. Seem to be a lot of fans online. I noticed those side pockets stick way out. Could those get away when pivoting around on real techy stuff?
> 
> Wish there was I could walk into that carried this stuff. I hat buying things like this site unseen.


I have a Hyper 2.5. When you do up the hipbelt, the side pockets hug your body and don't protrude. I have not had mine snag noticably on anything.

The comment about Ergon zips is one worth repeating. I have a BA3 (30L pack) with a split zip. This is probably the single most irritating thing about an otherwise fantastic pack design- the split makes it a bit awkard to load and unload. The other downside to the pack is that the rigid frame is not collapsible, so the pack always takes up a lot of space in your car or at home. Still, this latter point isn't a big downside- I'm going to get a lower capacity BC2 to complement by BA3 and Wingnut 2.5.


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## pitbull592 (Jul 23, 2010)

I second the fox pack. I had enough of camelbak's in the service, and the fox pack has never let me down. I also like how the bladder is designed it's very easy to clean.:thumbsup:


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## 2wheelsnotfour (Aug 18, 2010)

I have two major complaints about my Camel Mule pack. First, I rode ride with the pack and had to cut my hose really short in order for it not to hit my legs when I'm in the drops. Its annoyingly short now. Secondly, the amount which you fill the bladder dramatically reduces your storage room.

The Osprey packs have a magnet attached to the bite valve which allows you to anchor the hose so its not swinging around and hitting your legs (some of us guys have this problem). If a full bladder doesn't affect the Osprey's storage capacity, they sound like a winner to me. Though the one I saw was big. It would be for epic rides.


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## INeedGears! (Jul 29, 2010)

I've been using the Osprey 10 all summer. I love it! The bladder is awesome, while the storage volume is technically smaller than the MULE I can actually carry more (though I usually don't) because of the efficient layout and the storage not being affected by the bladder.


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## redranger (Feb 5, 2004)

anybody know if there is a bladder larger than 3L? Thanks


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

redranger said:


> anybody know if there is a bladder larger than 3L? Thanks


I was looking at the same option before I bought my bg1. I couldn't find any. Best be is to carry an extra bottle on a longer ride, or lug 2 bags.


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## womble (Sep 8, 2006)

redranger said:


> anybody know if there is a bladder larger than 3L? Thanks


Yeah, get an MSR Dromedary and then a Hydromedary conversion kit (cap + hose). They go up to 10 litres.


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## woodyak (Jan 20, 2004)

mimi1885 said:


> BC1 is the smallest of the 3, there are a lot of good features and a couple of annoying ones as well.
> 
> The fit and ergonomics are great. While the bag is quite compact comparing to my Mule, the main compartment is pretty good size with 2 pocket inside one for hydration and a big main space. Quite useful and does not feel bulky while riding other than the fact that the hip belt designed to carry the load is huge comparing to Camelbak.
> 
> ...


Split zipper? The one on the site looks like a top zipper for all of there models?


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## woodyak (Jan 20, 2004)

thefriar said:


> I have the BC 2 and the BC3, I find the 2 is perfect for regular trail riding, including Kingdom, as there's room for lunch, an adult beverage, a shock pump, tire pump, 1x26er tube, and 1x29er tube, and tools/zip ties/patch kit, as well as 3L of water.
> 
> The BC1 is a bit small, but not enough to be detrimental.
> 
> ...


Which pack did you have when we were at KT? It looks like the size difference between the BC1 and the BC2 is pretty small. It seems like the BC2 has a ton more useful pockets and such. They are quite pricey though...

Glad to here you're back in the game. I haven't had time to get to the lifts all season. It's driving me nuts. We did get a trip up to Stowe. Sick riding up there.


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## redranger (Feb 5, 2004)

womble said:


> Yeah, get an MSR Dromedary and then a Hydromedary conversion kit (cap + hose). They go up to 10 litres.


Thanks


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## mattsmc43 (Feb 6, 2004)

Check out the Dakine Nomad (or possibly the one larger than that, although I don't recall the name). I switched from Mule NV camelback to a Dakine Nomad a while back and love the Dakine pack. More secure, more organized pockets with easy access to side pockets w/out removing the pack, and the Hydarpak bladder is a unique system that is so easy to use, set-up in the pack, clean, etc. - only my opinion of course - but I think it's far superior to the camelback bladder. I would definitely check them out if possible. If you decide on one though - I'd switch the bite valve out to a nalgene bite valve (about $6.00) - better quality than the hydrapak bite valve - no leaking, and it seems to me to fit more securely in the hydrapak tubing.


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## crank1979 (Feb 3, 2006)

DAVP said:


> The Osprey Raptor 14 is a great pack. The cargo room is unaffected by the bladder and has tons of pockets and space. The straps tighten up the bag if you're not fully loaded. The new Mule NV might be better than the old Mule, but I went for the hip-pads on the Osprey. I wanted to try the Ergon, but good luck finding one in a real store.
> 
> http://www.ospreypacks.com/Packs/RaptorSeries
> 
> http://www.ergon-bike.com/us/en/home#


I'll second the Osprey Raptor pack. Much better build quality than my Camelbak or Deuter. Extremely comfortable. Plenty of storage without moving around while riding. It's just a great bag, very well designed and made.


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## 3034 (Apr 12, 2006)

I use the psych trail bag
http://store.pcych.com/

this combined with the awesome straps (when the come out)
should keep everything low and off my back
i carry long ride supplies (100 oz, 2 tubes, pump, singulator, food etc)


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