# 4 x XML - 4000 lumen chinese light - anyonr tried one???



## peakprowler (Mar 18, 2007)

like these

NEW SKY RAY 4x CREE XML T6 LED Bicycle Headlight 4 Modes 4800 Lumens + battery + charger: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Outdoors

Rechargeable 4 x CREE XML-T6 LED Bicycle Light and Headlight 4000LM 3 Modes - Cree XML T6 Bike Light - Lights-box.com

Tried a 3 x XML but here doesn't seem much difference between level 2 to level 3, wondering if the 4 x is the same?


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

They are are already selling 5x xml. 
5000LM 5X CREE XML T6 LED Bicycle Bike Headlamp Headlight Torch Light 6x18650 | eBay

I haven't seen any reviews of the either one. I can't imagine that they are driving the led's very hard, since they would probably get red hot.


----------



## HakanC (May 12, 2007)

I would also like to see a review of these lights.
But until so I remain sceptical, mainly because of the strange looking reflectors in the middle of 4x-light,
and the whole central reflector in the 5x-light.

/Håkan
SWEDEN


----------



## Fuzzy Dunlop (Jan 3, 2013)

I understand that 5XML is a utilitarian object, but does it have to be so ugly? That square centre reflector looks like the deformed offspring of its circular companions. I can stand the glowing green on/off button, but this crosses a line.


----------



## James Bass (Nov 29, 2012)

Is that battery for the 5xT6 gonna be enough?


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

James Bass said:


> Is that battery for the 5xT6 gonna be enough?


There is so much fiction in the ebay description that the only part I would believe is that the housing is aluminum!


----------



## Lichitisky (Feb 25, 2013)

Vancbiker said:


> There is so much fiction in the ebay description that the only part I would believe is that the housing is aluminum!


kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk True that!


----------



## Lichitisky (Feb 25, 2013)

Vancbiker said:


> There is so much fiction in the ebay description that the only part I would believe is that the housing is aluminum!


The old 4 x 18650 config, wont make up for the task. Good news is that DX sells just the headlight. So you can buy the battery pack you like to use with it.


----------



## romaosl (Dec 22, 2011)

I purchased a 4x XM-L light from ebay, very similar to that second link (Rechargeable 4 x CREE XML-T6 LED Bicycle Light and Headlight 4000LM 3 Modes - Cree XML T6 Bike Light - Lights-box.com).

It only works for 3 minutes in max, before changing automatically to min.


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

romaosl said:


> I purchased a 4x XM-L light from ebay, very similar to that second link (Rechargeable 4 x CREE XML-T6 LED Bicycle Light and Headlight 4000LM 3 Modes - Cree XML T6 Bike Light - Lights-box.com).
> 
> It only works for 3 minutes in max, before changing automatically to min.


Is that when you are standing still or when you are riding? What the air temperature when this happens?


----------



## romaosl (Dec 22, 2011)

varider said:


> Is that when you are standing still or when you are riding? What the air temperature when this happens?


It happens when I'm riding at about 12 degrees Celsius.


----------



## Lichitisky (Feb 25, 2013)

James Bass said:


> Is that battery for the 5xT6 gonna be enough?


This battery can surely do the job;

It is the best battery for the price so far, sold by a USA seller, with a great guaranteed capacity, recomended for the triple and quad led lights.

Here it is, with 12400 mah, and compact size and just 37 bucks! Check it out:

USA 8 4V 7 4V Battery Pack for CREE XML T6 SSC P7 12400mAh Capacity Guaranteed | eBay


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

romaosl said:


> I purchased a 4x XM-L light from ebay, very similar to that second link (Rechargeable 4 x CREE XML-T6 LED Bicycle Light and Headlight 4000LM 3 Modes - Cree XML T6 Bike Light - Lights-box.com).
> 
> It only works for 3 minutes in max, before changing automatically to min.


That is a real drag to say the least but I'm not sure that if someone else bought one from someplace like D/X that they would have the same issue. Three minutes before auto power-down is exceedingly quick. My gut tells me somethings got to be wrong with the one you have. Sadly, no way to be sure unless someone else buys one and then posts up.

*romaosl*, does the one you have use led indicators ( for battery run time ) and does it have 3 steady modes ( H-M-L ) ??


----------



## romaosl (Dec 22, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> *romaosl*, does the one you have use led indicators ( for battery run time ) and does it have 3 steady modes ( H-M-L ) ??


It have a green led in the on/off button. I don't know if it changes color with the battery capacity, because the max time that I use it was about 1.5 hours in mid (in mid, there is no problem).

The light has 3 modes, H-M-L. No flashing mode.

I already purchased on ebay some thermal grease, to try to improve the thermal dissipation.


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

romaosl said:


> It happens when I'm riding at about 12 degrees Celsius.


That's pretty cold. I was thinking of buying one until you described your problems. Seems like a bad design


----------



## romaosl (Dec 22, 2011)

I made a little picture to exemplify the "bad design" thing.










Black - Light Frame
Yellow - Optic
Blue - XM-L T6 Led
Red - Aluminum cylinder with an aluminum disc at the top (electronics are inside cylinder, and the 4 LED are in the top aluminum disc)
Green/Pink - On/Off Button

The problem (i think) is that there is very little contact between the disc where the LEDs are and the frame.


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Sounds plausible to me. Also, I think that disc needs to be pretty thick, especially with 4 leds. I don't think these guys do any thermal engineering.


----------



## romaosl (Dec 22, 2011)

The disc is about 2mm thick.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

...said in response to my question: Does the light have indicator LED's?



romaosl said:


> It have a green led in the on/off button. I don't know if it changes color with the battery capacity, because the max time that I use it was about 1.5 hours in mid (in mid, there is no problem).
> 
> The light has 3 modes, H-M-L. No flashing mode.
> 
> I already purchased on ebay some thermal grease, to try to improve the thermal dissipation.


I would think that after an hour you would of seen the green led turn to blue if indeed the lamp has voltage indicators ( if using a 4-cell battery ).


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Upcoming Review: D/X Quad XM-L lamp*

Hi Folks,

A quad XM-L lamp has arrived from D/X that I will be reviewing shortly. This week I'm on a graveyard shift but I should get a chance to do a quick "Shine around" with the lamp to give a quick preliminary evaluation when I get home tomorrow morning ( AM ). So far just shining it around inside my home I can say it is truly bright. I'll not say more till I do some comparative testing.

*Disclaimer:*



> I was approached by D/X and asked if I wanted to review one of several of their bike lights. I wrote back telling them I was willing to review the Ultrafire Quad XM-L lamp. They agreed and sent me a quad lamp but I don't think it is the Ultrafire because it only has 3 modes ( H-L-strobe ). The Ultrafire version was likely sold out so they sent the next best thing. Nevertheless I will review the lamp and give an honest opinion. No money was paid for the lamp as it was provided by the vendor for review purposes.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Quick review and comparison: D/X Quad XML vs. Tri-Clone ( triple XML ) part 1*

My initial impression when I took the Quad out for a quick "shine around"; 
On high, not bad at all. Perhaps a little brighter than the Tri-clone but not by much. The low beam on the Quad is a bit disappointing. Good enough for a slow fire road climb but not enough output for medium speeds IMO. Beam pattern for the quad is very similar to the Tri-clone but the quad seems to have a more intense center area. Don't get me wrong, this is not a spot lamp but it does offer a good mix of flood and throw. On high this would make a nice light on the bars.

The lamp itself is a little heavier than the tri-clone. I will weigh it tomorrow at work if I remember to think about it.  The reflector is a little deeper than the Tri-clone and slightly wider. The Tri-clone might actually have the wider beam but I need to comfirm that. Either way the difference would be very slight.

Right now I'm on a late shift which means I don't have lots of time to do everything I need to do so pardon me if the review drags on a bit. 
Tonight ( this morning actually ) *when I got home I did do a thermal shoot-out between the Quad and Tri.* I'll post the figures on that comparison as soon as I get more time. Without letting the "cat out of the bag", the results are going to surprise some.

One tid-bit before I call it a night...

*...5M lux comparison to Quad Vs. Tri-clone*...( both lamps on High)

Quad XM-L.......500 lux
Tri-clone..........455 lux


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Looking forward to it. Is it the same light that romaosl has? Because that one is not so good, to put it mildly.

Do you get to keep the light from DX after your review?


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> Looking forward to it. Is it the same light that romaosl has? Because that one is not so good, to put it mildly.
> 
> Do you get to keep the light from DX after your review?


No, it's not the same one that romaosl has. I wanted one like his that is why I requested the Ultrafire quad XM-L with 4-mode. Unfortunately when you don't buy the lamp you get what they give you. ( Yes, I do get to keep the lamp ).

I'm not sure yet if the one I have has any thermal monitoring circuitry. The thermal testing I did last night showed no indication of any but then again I was using a fan while testing. I also don't know if the lamp I have has voltage indicators.. I hope to have the answer to both those questions when I come home tonight ( early AM ) to continue the testing. Anyway, I hope to post the results of the thermal testing when I come home after work. ( I'd do it now but I'm pressed for time ).


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Quad XM-L vs. Tri-Clone Thermal Shoot-out*

Room temperature at the start of the test was 73°F / 22.7°C. Starting temp on the quad was 75°F/23.8°C. Starting temp on the Tri-Clone was 72.3°F / 22.3°C. A small 1 ft. fan was used on medium at a 1M distance for lite cooling. Readings taken with a digital infrared thermometer.



> ..........*Quad XM-L*.....................*.Tri-Clone.*........................
> 
> 1-min.....78°F / 25.5°C..>>...77.9°F / 25.5°C
> 
> ...


The Quad with it's heavier weight seems to not heat as fast. This surprised me. After 10 minutes it barely seemed warm. The Tri-clone after 15 minutes was too hot to touch. In a previous test the MagicShine 808E turned off with it's thermal switch at the same temp. ( 51.6°C ) When I turned the Quad off after the test I was also surprised that it cooled very fast. Perhaps there is more to the Quad than meets the eye. If it only had a medium ( 60% power ) mode...

More tests to come....


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Surprising results! So the quad is cooler and brighter. 

By the way, do you have a link to the exact dx product?


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> Surprising results! So the quad is cooler and brighter.
> 
> By the way, do you have a link to the exact dx product?


Must be something wrong with the D/X website right now because I couldn't find the direct link for most of their bigger lights. Very strange. I had to search my history to find a link. This one looks like mine only the one they sent only included a 4-cell battery. It is also available as "light head only" but I couldn't find the link on the website.


----------



## Reign2Rider (Jan 28, 2010)

Not getting hotter may mean that the thermal path is poor compared to the triple...


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Just looking over my own readings....Both lamps seem to peak within the last three reading. The quad went down slightly at the end but that could of been a fluke. I'll try to contact the D/X people to get the proper SKU order number on this lamp. 

I did another "shine around" with the quad last night while at work. I continue to be impressed with the output on high. I can tell that the center area of the beam pattern is more intense than the tri-clone. I'm not sure yet how that's going to translate on the bike but the tint is very pleasing to the eye. This weekend if it doesn't rain I hope to take the mountain bike out for a spin and test the Quad out. 

When I get home from work I want to hook the Quad up to the provided 4-cell so I can see not only how well the D/X battery does but whither or not the lamp head has voltage indicators. During that test I will also check how much the output drops during the first 10 minutes.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Quad XM-L thermal issues: Part II*

I continued on with some more testing. Once again, same set-up with the fan as before. This time I wanted to see how well the light output held up after a good run through. _ Distance is ~ 5M_ as before.



> Time...........*.LUX.*................Temperature................................................
> 
> Start............*550*.....................75°F / 23.8°C
> 
> ...


After twenty minutes the lamp got to 45.1°C, at that point it stabilized around 44.2°C. *The lux level remained rock solid around the 490 mark through out the remainder of the run time test. *

At the 47 minute mark the green indicator turned to BLUE...yes, it has voltage indicators. At the two hour mark the led turned to RED. Five minutes after that the RED started to BLINK....one minute after the light went out.

*Total run time for the D/X 4-cell, 2 hours and 6 minutes.*

I think I can safely say at this point that the thermal properties of this model Quad are not too shabby. That fact that the lux output didn't drop in excess once the lamp was warm is impressive for such a light. This has to mean that the additional weight of the lamp has something to do with removing the heat from the emitter area of the lamp...at least that is my take on it. Just remember that a fan was used throughout the duration of the test. Keep air moving over the lamp and you should be fine. Now how it will do in warm environments is anyone's guess.

I'm really pleased to see that the Quad has LED voltage indicators. Since you don't have a mid-mode that means you will likely use the high mode more than you should. That being the case, having the indicators will help the user make better use of their battery power. When you see the RED, go immediately to your low mode because in 6 minutes the lamp will go out if you stay in high. A good six cell battery should easily get over 3 hours. ( *On a side note, the D/X 4-cell battery did much better than I expected. This is a much better battery than what I got with the tri-clone ).


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> Surprising results! So the quad is cooler and brighter.
> 
> By the way, do you have a link to the exact dx product?


I'm going to have to get back to you about this issue. In the PM I received from D/X I gave the SKU number of the lamp I wanted. They sent back a reply ( listed the same SKU number ) and said it was on it's way. This is the lamp I wanted.

As you can see from the product description It should be a 4-mode with the last mode being a "press to hold" strobe. The one I have is only 3-mode and more like this set-up. Interestingly the one review on the Ultrafire quad had the lamp only last 1.2hr with 4-cell battery yet mine lasted just over 2hrs. :skep: I'm sending a PM to the D/X rep with some questions. Hopefully he should get back to me soon.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> Surprising results! So the quad is cooler and brighter.
> 
> By the way, do you have a link to the exact dx product?


Okay hopefully this is the last time I answer this. The D/X people told me the Ultrafire Quad is the one they sent me. Apparently the website ad had to be changed ( after I told them that mine was a three mode ) The website ad now reads correctly. 

Now I have to wonder if they have a 4 mode version, perhaps the Skyray.

Anyway, I believe this weekend I might get to do my first night MTB ride of the season. Suppose to be nice. If everything goes as planned I'll have three new lights to try out, the Quad, the Xeccon X-12 with new XM-L2 and the D99 lamp if it shows up by Friday. I really didn't planned for all these lights to be reviewed at the same time, what can I say. Lights happen. :thumbsup:


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Thanks for the info. Looking forward to the mega-review.

For me, a light with that much power needs at least three non-flash modes and maybe even four. This only has two! It's a dealbreaker in my opinion.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

varider said:


> Thanks for the info. Looking forward to the mega-review.
> 
> * For me, a light with that much power needs at least three non-flash modes and maybe even four. This only has two! It's a dealbreaker in my opinion.*


I agree. Two things would make this a better lamp, either a good mid-mode in the 60-75% range or a little more output to the present low mode bringing it up to the 35-40% output range. Right now low mode is around 20% output.

My guess is that D/X will see the point after the review and likely fix the problem with an updated version. It might be till next year before that happens though.

One of the reasons I really want to take a ride with this lamp is so I can more properly judge how "useable" the low mode is. My gut tells me though that it won't be enough for general cruising speed.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*D/X Quad XM-L T6 3-mode; Trail test*

I finally got a chance to see what how well the Quad lamp does on the trail. It does a little better than what I had previously thought with my quick shine-around test. I could still wish for more light ( on low ) but for the most part the low mode throws a little better than I had previously thought and is usable as long as you tilt the lamp down to make better use of the lesser output.

High mode with the Quad is most impressive. Definitely brighter than my Gloworm X2, hands down. Not surprising since it is using 4 XM-L's vs. the Gloworm's two XM-L's. Very nice beam pattern too that covers all the bases with a nice amount of throw and a nice full beam pattern that lights up the breath of the trail very nicely. No blueness to this lamp, nothing but bright white light.

On a side note I also tried using the Quad lamp as a supplement to my Gloworm X2. In this role the Quad excels. When you first turn it on it comes on in high mode. That means it's very easy to quickly turn it on for maximum output on demand. The problem with running two lamps is that when it comes time to turn off the extra lamp you usually have a hard time telling if the lamp is off. Not so with the Quad. Thats because when you cycle through the modes the off mode is just after the strobe mode. As soon as you see flashing you know the next click will turn the lamp off. That's going to be real useful once I do those fast fire road descents.

This was the first time I've ever had two bar lamps going at the same time. Output with both the Gloworm X2 and Quad XM-L on High was absolutely awesome. Definitely a whole different level of output if I do say so. Too bad I can't run that kind of output more often but if I did it would certainly run the battery down real quick with both lamps on high.

The Quad lamp I received free for testing purposes ( from D/X ) but I would definitely buy one unless I thought I could get one somewhere else with three steady modes. Tomorrow I might get a chance to try using the lamp again, hopefully in a area that will make better use of the massive output ( from both lamps ).


----------



## capoccia (Jun 17, 2013)

I bought this light, with 3 step of power. I tested it with a laboratory power supply (8Vdc), the results are the following:

Power 1: 8Vdc 115mA 1W -->8%
Power 2: 8Vdc 625mA 5W -->40%
Power 3: 8Vdc 1.55A 12.5W -->100%

And v-meter level is (approximate):
Green--> ok
Blue--> 7V
Red-->6.2V

How much mAh is the battery??


I'm looking forward to test it for an overnight ride, one of next days.
Bye.


----------



## Kir (May 30, 2013)

capoccia said:


> How much mAh is the battery??


Could be anything from 1700 to 4200mAh. Don't expect anything higher.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

capoccia said:


> *I bought this light, with 3 step of power.* I tested it with a laboratory power supply (8Vdc), the results are the following:
> 
> Power 1: 8Vdc 115mA 1W -->8%
> Power 2: 8Vdc 625mA 5W -->40%
> ...


You bought "what light"? You're new so you likely can't post links. Give us the name of the light and where it was bought, thanks. FWIW, Fasttech now offers a 4-mode quad XM-L. If I didn't already own one I'd likely buy one from Fasttech.


----------



## capoccia (Jun 17, 2013)

I bought the light for your link at dx.com.

The link is:

UltraFire 4 x Cree XM-L T6 2600lm 3-Mode White Bicycle Headlamp - Metal Grey (4 x 18650) - Free Shipping - DealExtreme


----------



## johndh61 (Jun 29, 2013)

Anyone using one if these http://dx.com/p/trustfire-tr-d010-5-...-x-18650-21713 I have just bought one so be interesdting to see what it is like.

I use two of these UltraFire XL-3A19 5 x Cree XM-L T6 1200lm with a 8.4V 8000mAh Rechargeable 26650 Li-ion Battery Pack for Bicycle Light - Black - Worldwide Free Shipping - DX on the handle bar.

There is plenty of light and they last for 4 hours plus on high haven't actually had them completely die only get down to red after 3hr 45 min.

On my helmet I use a FandyFire D99 Cree XM-L T6 2-LED 1200LM 5-Mode Neutral White Bike Light Headlight - Silver + Black - Worldwide Free Shipping - DX with the battery above it ran for 3 hrs without going of green and has plenty of light. Each light and battery cost me $65 each delivered $195 for the three lights.
i also have a 4led light and it uses even the bigger battery power in half the time of the 5led light.

o have a


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

capoccia said:


> I bought the light for your link at dx.com.
> 
> The link is:
> 
> UltraFire 4 x Cree XM-L T6 2600lm 3-Mode White Bicycle Headlamp - Metal Grey (4 x 18650) - Free Shipping - DealExtreme


Oh...okay, then the lamp you have is High-low-strobe like mine. D/X does have the 4-mode version again with the mid-mode being 80%. It is on another link here but can also be bought as head light only. ( provided this time they get the ads right... ) I'd rather have the mid-mode at 60-70% but at least at 80% you will get better run time than keeping the lamp on high.


----------



## trekusps (Nov 14, 2008)

Just picked up one of these 4 x Cree XML T6 bike lights. Tried it for the first time last night. It is extremely bright. Even brighter than my car headlights on low beam. And my car headlights are modified to produce 2100 lumens. Even though this bike light is advertised on eBay to produce 5200 lumens, I am sure it is at least half that much judging how it compared to my car's headlights. Beam pattern is wide with a large spot. The throw on this just blows away my other eBay light with a single XML T6 and single R5 led. I thought that light was bright, but this new one is much, much brighter. At full power, there is no problem coming off the mountain at full speed. Felt like I was using the high beams from my car to light the way.

This no-name light has four modes. a H-M-L and strobe in that order. The way the light levels decrease is by reducing the amount of voltage to all four LEDs to lower the light output. It scrolls through all the functions. I guess that would be a downside to the switch that has no memory and not remember the last function you used. The low setting seems to be around 300-350 lumens and comparable to my Cygolite Mitycross rated at 350 lumens. The strobe function flashes around 2X per second at full power and will get everyone's attention.

At full power, the head unit was warm but not hot. I do not know what the run time is but it was certainly more than enough for my two hour ride last night. There is no indicator light on the switch to tell you when you are running low on battery power so choose your ride time wisely and have a backup in case.

Here is a link to the bike light I am describing: 4 x CREE LED XML XM L T6 LED 5200 LM Bicycle Light Headlight Headlamp | eBay

Will have to do more testing to determine how well built and what the actual lumen and run times are. Weight of headlight and battery is 352 grams using a 4x18650 battery pack, if you are interested.


----------



## capoccia (Jun 17, 2013)

Cat-man-do said:


> Oh...okay, then the lamp you have is High-low-strobe like mine. D/X does have the 4-mode version again with the mid-mode being 80%. It is on another link here but can also be bought as head light only. ( provided this time they get the ads right... ) I'd rather have the mid-mode at 60-70% but at least at 80% you will get better run time than keeping the lamp on high.


My lamp is 4-mode: low-middle-hight and strobe. 
I bought a lamp from your link, but my lamp have 4 level... 
Low: 8Vdc 115mA 1W -->8%
Middle: 8Vdc 625mA 5W -->40%
Hight: 8Vdc 1.55A 12.5W -->100%


----------



## trekusps (Nov 14, 2008)

So far so good with the light. It is very bright and certainly brighter than a standard car's low beam. Had a friend purchased the same light and when we both turned the lights onto high, they are definitely brighter than any halogen lite car, high beams or not. I will have to try and compare to my wife's car with Xenon lamps. Noticed that the seller upped the price that I paid at $54.00 to almost $100!!! Not sure what the seller is thinking when there are other source still selling the same light for almost half the price. Though this light uses the same type of rubber mounting system that slips, I found that if I use a piece of rubber and slip it into the mounting area where it touches the handlebar, I don't have any issues with slippage. Still impressed with this light and haven't had any issues with run times with my night rides of two hours.



trekusps said:


> Just picked up one of these 4 x Cree XML T6 bike lights. Tried it for the first time last night. It is extremely bright. Even brighter than my car headlights on low beam. And my car headlights are modified to produce 2100 lumens. Even though this bike light is advertised on eBay to produce 5200 lumens, I am sure it is at least half that much judging how it compared to my car's headlights. Beam pattern is wide with a large spot. The throw on this just blows away my other eBay light with a single XML T6 and single R5 led. I thought that light was bright, but this new one is much, much brighter. At full power, there is no problem coming off the mountain at full speed. Felt like I was using the high beams from my car to light the way.
> 
> This no-name light has four modes. a H-M-L and strobe in that order. The way the light levels decrease is by reducing the amount of voltage to all four LEDs to lower the light output. It scrolls through all the functions. I guess that would be a downside to the switch that has no memory and not remember the last function you used. The low setting seems to be around 300-350 lumens and comparable to my Cygolite Mitycross rated at 350 lumens. The strobe function flashes around 2X per second at full power and will get everyone's attention.
> 
> ...


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

Just received this one in the mail from AUD DX, 9 day wait so not too bad there.

Buy Cheapest UltraFire 4 x Cree XM-L T6 2600lm 4-Mode White Bicycle Headlamp - Metal Grey (4 x 18650) at au.dx.com US$54.86

The add says 2600lm but the box says 900lm which has me a bit worried as I was working on halving the advertised lumens roughly for a real estimate. The part numbers and items match the description. 
I'm new to lights and can't compare with others but so far it seems good. I'll be looking to build or buy a 6 cell for longer races/rides. it feels a little heavy for a helmet but good for the bars. The plug is the same as my old vistalight so could I use the charger that I have for them? in case the one supplied is no good. 
The box looks legit ultrafire with r trademark but who knows. I'll try and give a better review after a solid night ride. Bloody good price considering the cost of AyUps etc so hopefully worth the gamble.
How can I measure/test my battery that it came with to see if what I've got is any good or should I just rely on practical test of riding and timing it that way?
cheers


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

It's interesting that is a four mode light, and Cat only had a three mode light. I wonder if it's even the same light? Hopefully the light has the same thermal properties, since those were good. Is the strobe mode hidden (three second hold) or is it part of the regular rotation?

There's a lot of fake ultrafire stuff out there, I wouldn't place too much fate in that.

Knowing how long it will last on high or medium is probably the only real thing that practically matters. If you could measure the current drawn from the battery, then you could estimate how many mAh the battery contains. A decent 4 cell battery has around 4400 mAh. 
Action-LED-Lights ? MJ-6002 4400mAh Waterproof Battery
The battery that came with this light may contain much less.

I don't know the voltage on your vistalite system, so I wouldn't mix chargers with batteries unless you are absolutely certain.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

Yeah I read this thread and specifically wanted a 4 mode after that. The strobe is a hold for three sec deal which is great. I've got it on in the yard now and it cranks with good spread. I'll have to find the req's for beam shots so I can post some in the next few days but so far it looks like it'll do the trick nicely.

I also ordered a Solarstorm x2 from ali express at the same time. Hope fully that arrives soon and I can compare.
Hopefully the battery is good! Good idea on the vistalight.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

ISO-100, Exposure-6 seconds, Aperture-F4.0, Focus-Manual, White Balance-Daylight".

found em will do soon


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

After spending 30 minutes going through the dx bike light section, I figured out that this is the Lightfoot bought (for USA buyers).
UltraFire 4 x Cree XM-L T6 2600lm 3-Mode White Bicycle Headlamp - Metal Grey (4 x 18650) - Free Shipping - DealExtreme

So the title says four mode, but the description seems to be messed up. This is also the same link that Cat posted, but he only had a three mode. So maybe they changed the driver.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

yeah mine is definitely hi - mid - lo - off and 3 sec hold for fast strobe. holding ony makes it strobe not turn off. Off is part of the cycle through lo,mid,hi,off.

1st run had the indicator light go from green to blue after 1hr on high
- another 20 on blue 
- then red for 5 and then lights out.

No obvious heat issue, warm to touch with bare fingers at 12 deg C air temp. charging again and i'll see if it lasts longer with a longer charge time. The charger just has a led that is red when charging and green when charged ( i'm assuming as there were no instructions with the unit)


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Lightfoot said:


> yeah mine is definitely hi - mid - lo - off and 3 sec hold for fast strobe. holding ony makes it strobe not turn off. Off is part of the cycle through lo,mid,hi,off.


I wouldn't care for that operation style. I would prefer not cycling through the off position. Wonder what the logic in that pattern is?


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

So that's a pretty good battery life for a 4 led unit, in my opinion.



Lightfoot said:


> yeah mine is definitely hi - mid - lo - off and 3 sec hold for fast strobe. holding ony makes it strobe not turn off. Off is part of the cycle through lo,mid,hi,off.


I don't care for having to cycle through off, but it's seems to be somewhat common on these inexpensive lights. I think the manufacturers just use flashlight drivers, where it doesn't matter as much. I suppose you get used to it. At least the strobe is hidden.

Ok, thanks for the info.


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Yes, I'm pretty sure you are right about the driver selection. 

It would only take a small change in programming to skip the off position unless a special actuation of the switch were used. Kind of like how all the cheap lights used to cycle through the strobe, now you press and hold for a couple seconds to get the strobe. Press and hold for 5 seconds for off????


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Vancbiker said:


> Yes, I'm pretty sure you are right about the driver selection.
> 
> It would only take a small change in programming to skip the off position unless a special actuation of the switch were used. Kind of like how all the cheap lights used to cycle through the strobe, now you press and hold for a couple seconds to get the strobe. Press and hold for 5 seconds for off????


You're right about the programming, it's such a small but crucial difference. Someone on the 18 page single-xml-light thread actually replaced the microcontroller and reprogrammed the light to work they way he wanted it. If you could do something like that you could with this light than you could fix all the problems with the UI. You could even add modes, makes a custom flash mode etc.

The press and hold for strobe isn't ideal either. I just pulled out my magicshine 808 from action led which has the strobe mode hidden. It takes a three second hold to turn the light off, and if you hold it another 2 seconds (for a total of 5 seconds) the strobe turns on. It's not ideal if you actually want use the strobe during a night ride as you will be sitting in the dark for two seconds.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

I'll get the beam shots in a couple of days when I have access to a manual camera. The modes are fine for me, I ride singletrack from 1-3hrs and will only have it on high power so I won't be cycling through, I can see how that would be an issue for people though. If I hit fire trail I'll drop the power to give me longer life.

I just need battery that will last 3 hrs on high as this one is 1.5hrs on the dot in three tests. I'll be riding tonight for the 1st time with it. I was hoping the SS X2 had arrived but aliexpress is taking way longer than DX to Australia.

I reckon I'll just buy a pre made pack and save the build for another time. Would the connections on the Action LED (Gemini etc) fit my light?


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

so I tried some beam shots but my camera would only allow me to go as low as ISO 200. Not sure how that affects things. It's the best I could do lightwise while at work but there's probably too much reflection from the fence. 

I received the SSX2 yesterday and it's the 8.4V 4 mode and black shrink wrapped batts. Haven't checked the duration of the battery as I just received two new batterys from Xeccon which were really quick in arrival and great service thanks to Leonard. Definitely a big difference in quality of the cells and workmanship between xeccon and the supplied batts with the ultrafire (clone) and X2. I noticed a difference between the two LED's in the SSX2 and i'm hoping its not a defect but that maybe the optics are different in each one to provide more spread or spot?? can anyone clarify that or should they be identical?

The X2 has overheat protection and dropped to lo when I had it running indoors with no fan within 10min. both have identical modes: 
low -mid - high - off and 3 sec hold for strobe. 
You cycle through off to repeat and they both turn on with low mode

They both provide good spread and a plenty of light but I reckon i'd like more of a spot on the helmet. I guess I could swap the optics in the X2 as the ultrafire is too big for the helmet. I'm yet to ride in the bush with them and will do that on Friday so i'll update then.

The order of the pics show the SSX2 on high 4xml ultra on med- low-- high and witches hats are at distance of 20m,40m and 50m


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Nice beamshots. Thanks for doing those. It looks to be much brighter than the SSX2 with a broader beam. A real light blaster.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

varider said:


> Nice beamshots. Thanks for doing those. It looks to be much brighter than the SSX2 with a broader beam. A real light blaster.


no worries but as I said i'm not sure if the SSX2 has a fault or not. The utrafire puts out more light and is broader, great for the bars I think. I'll have to do a battery life test with the tobest 6000 mAh from xeccon tonight, I think that will be a good combo. i'd like to switch one of the optics in the SSX2 for more of a spot but I don't know it that's easily achievable.


----------



## steelhmr (Sep 30, 2011)

Very nice pics. Beauty of a beam that 4x puts out. SSX2 is no slouch either. Pretty good throw as well.


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

steelhmr said:


> Very nice pics. Beauty of a beam that 4x puts out. SSX2 is no slouch either. Pretty good throw as well.


If the first photo is the photo of the SS X2 on high to me it looks like the lamp is pointed down too far. My bet is that it has more throw than the photo revealed. Those quad lamps are pretty nice. As long as you have a good battery and can find a way to keep it from moving around on the bars it can work.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

Cat-man-do said:


> If the first photo is the photo of the SS X2 on high to me it looks like the lamp is pointed down too far. My bet is that it has more throw than the photo revealed. Those quad lamps are pretty nice. As long as you have a good battery and can find a way to keep it from moving around on the bars it can work.


yep i agree on the angle but i couldn't take anymore as the battery went flat in the camera. I reckon the X2 is maybe 80% of the quad in brightness and throw.

Had the Quad on for 3hrs with the tobest xeecon 6000 battery last night and it was still on blue battery level. got bored but guessing 3.5 is the life


----------



## eugenelt (Jul 23, 2009)

Does anyone use those lights helmet-mounted, or they're too big/heavy for that ? DX says the light can be mounted on handlebars and helmet, but "can" doesn't mean its going to be comfortable.


----------



## Lightfoot (Mar 18, 2013)

I reckon its way too big a profile IMO that's why I got the SSX2 for the helmet. Also i reckon i want more spot than this one provides on the helmet


----------



## zuuds (Jan 30, 2004)

How do the low-mid-high modes work on these 4X lights, do they shut off individual LEDs, or do they cut power to all 4 simultaneously?


----------



## trekusps (Nov 14, 2008)

zuuds said:


> How do the low-mid-high modes work on these 4X lights, do they shut off individual LEDs, or do they cut power to all 4 simultaneously?


On mine, the power is reduced on all four LEDs. They are not individually shut off.


----------



## Kir (May 30, 2013)

Usually LEDs are wired in series and current is supplied/reduced to all LEDs simultaneously.


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Kir said:


> Usually LEDs are wired in series and current is supplied/reduced to all LEDs simultaneously.


Except for the 3 xml lights, some of those come with the weird turn-on one led at a time drivers. But you know that because you own all of the lights!


----------



## zuuds (Jan 30, 2004)

varider said:


> Except for the 3 xml lights, some of those come with the weird turn-on one led at a time drivers. But you know that because you own all of the lights!


That's why I asked, I read about that issue in the 3 XML light thread and was wondering it applied to the 4's as well.

I'm thinking about picking up a Nitefire NFC-41, which seems to be the latest and greatest iteration - XML-U2's, battery indicator, and looks the business. The glass lens looks pretty vulnerable though. As someone pointed out in the other thread, it's held on by screws, which seems like it could crack over time. (Maybe some teeny tiny O-rings or plastic washers could address that though.) Also, the edges of the lens are exposed by the crenulations in the bezel- seems easy to chip or crack, and I wonder if that would let dust get into the reflectors.


----------



## rideitall (Dec 15, 2005)

Had a look at the light on eBay from the link on the previous page. Price is down to $52.98, but shipping is $199.99, but goes down to a slightly less ridiculous $149.99. 

Light looks good though.


----------



## -Archie- (Aug 25, 2013)

rideitall said:


> shipping is $199.99


Say what?!? :eekster:


----------



## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

zuuds said:


> That's why I asked, I read about that issue in the 3 XML light thread and was wondering it applied to the 4's as well.
> 
> I'm thinking about picking up a Nitefire NFC-41, which seems to be the latest and greatest iteration - XML-U2's, battery indicator, and looks the business. The glass lens looks pretty vulnerable though. As someone pointed out in the other thread, it's held on by screws, which seems like it could crack over time. (Maybe some teeny tiny O-rings or plastic washers could address that though.) Also, the edges of the lens are exposed by the crenulations in the bezel- seems easy to chip or crack, and I wonder if that would let dust get into the reflectors.


Yeah, I don't like how that lens attaches. I would much rather have a ring or something that screws down and hold the lens down. That's a more time tested method.

These quads are all about heat management, in my opinion. The quad that Cat reviewed was very good in that respect. This NFC-41 has some nice cooling fins, but you don't know if there is a good thermal path between the leds and the outside case. As Kir and others have shown, that is the downfall of these cheap lights. Looks good on the outside, bad on the inside. It's a $60 gamble.

For me the point of getting a triple, or a quad, would be to get a both a brighter and more flood-like beam. I want an even beam with no artifacts.

Others want a super focused, super bright, super thrower for high speed riding. Both are valid approaches.

But the Chinese manufactures aren't really thinking about this, in my opinion. They are just making more lights with more leds in order to outdo each other and to get your $50 bucks.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

If anybody interested I just got 5 xlm t6 light from amazon 
SecurityIng® 6000LM 5 x CREE XM-L T6 LED Waterproof 3 Modes Bicycle Light Headlamp, CREE LED Bicycle/Bike Lamp Headlight, Portable Rechargeable Bicycle LED Flashlight with 8000mAh Battery Pack Charger for Outdoor Riding, Camping and Other Activites -

So far tried it couple of times. Light is extremely bright on high, on low I would prefer it to be brighter. During riding it does not heat up at all, when you hold it, after 15 min it is just barely warm. So, as I understand the more LEDs the cooler it runs with some small increase in brightness.


----------



## capoz77 (Sep 14, 2006)

El_Zilcho said:


> If anybody interested I just got 5 xlm t6 light from amazon
> SecurityIng® 6000LM 5 x CREE XM-L T6 LED Waterproof 3 Modes Bicycle Light Headlamp, CREE LED Bicycle/Bike Lamp Headlight, Portable Rechargeable Bicycle LED Flashlight with 8000mAh Battery Pack Charger for Outdoor Riding, Camping and Other Activites -
> 
> So far tried it couple of times. Light is extremely bright on high, on low I would prefer it to be brighter. During riding it does not heat up at all, when you hold it, after 15 min it is just barely warm. So, as I understand the more LEDs the cooler it runs with some small increase in brightness.


i can't imagine the beam spread being good on that at all! SSX2 seems the way to go.


----------



## Kir (May 30, 2013)

El_Zilcho said:


> If anybody interested I just got 5 xlm t6 light from amazon
> SecurityIng® 6000LM 5 x CREE XM-L T6 LED Waterproof 3 Modes Bicycle Light Headlamp, CREE LED Bicycle/Bike Lamp Headlight, Portable Rechargeable Bicycle LED Flashlight with 8000mAh Battery Pack Charger for Outdoor Riding, Camping and Other Activites -
> 
> So far tried it couple of times. Light is extremely bright on high, on low I would prefer it to be brighter. During riding it does not heat up at all, when you hold it, after 15 min it is just barely warm. So, as I understand the more LEDs the cooler it runs with some small increase in brightness.


Umm...no. Brightness increase in different modes depends on how your light's driver was programmed.
And it doesn't heat up just because the thermal transfer from leds to case is absolutely horrible:

One led is basically handing in the air while 4 others have a very nice 1mm aluminium point of contact to outer case (this ring on top). So leds are cooking inside at probably 100+ C while outer case stays cool. 
Enjoy your chinese lottery, you didn't win today :bluefrown:


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

Kir said:


> So leds are cooking inside at probably 100+ C while outer case stays cool.
> Enjoy your chinese lottery, you didn't win today :bluefrown:


I'll disassemble it today and see whats going on. And I don't play lottery, that is why I bought it from amazon prime, not from chinese web site, I can always return it for free.

Edit:
You were mostly right. LEDs are glued to a flimsy peace of aluminium similar to one on your picture, it looks more accurate and all the chips are glued to metal and don't hang in the air, but unfortunately it does not change anything. Heat management is crap, this alu plate is not even touching the light body:skep: Reflector is actually a huge aluminium chunk which has a pretty good contact to the body, problem is it connects to LED chips through plastic spacers:madman:
Overall I really like the light, but they need to redesign the packaging.
It goes back to Amazon.


----------



## El_Zilcho (Feb 4, 2013)

capoz77 said:


> i can't imagine the beam spread being good on that at all! SSX2 seems the way to go.


VERY wide pattern and a lot of reach to the light. I really liked it. It would be really disappointing if Kir is right about the heat transfer and I have to return the light.


----------

