# Homemade SS Freewheels - step-by-step photo guide



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Homemade SS Freewheels - recycle vintage wheelsets
*
I have had success in recycling older Shimano 5-6 speed freewheels into workable SS freewheels, by removing either lockring (newer Hyperglide) or lockcog (older Uniglide), removing cogs and spacers and rebuilding. Simple tools, available to anyone with basic wrenching skills are all that is needed.

I decided to prepare a step-by-step photo guide to DIY.

The finished product









*Why? or Why Not?*

Since the late 1980's most quality multi-gear hubs use a freehub/ cassette. For most 7-8-9-10 speed applications this is the only way to go. Freehubs also offer easy conversion to SS and there is lots of information available on how to convert or 'ghetto-mod'.

I have a number of vintage freewheel wheelsets of good quality that are 'underutilized' and I would like to use for SS builds. At the same time, I do not want to re-space hubs and re-dish wheels to use a SS specific freewheel. I don't want to buy a number of SS freewheels for different ratios. I want to reuse and recycle. I assume that there are millions of freewheels still spinning around, most are discarded because one cog, usually the highest one, is worn out...

There is little or no information on the internet on freewheel cog replacement. In fact, except for some references on the Sheldon Brown site to sprocket replacement as a lost art, there is not even an image of a 'freewheel bench vise' or adaptor.

The following links to Sheldon Brown give great information. *I credit Sheldon for inspiring me with the paragraph on freewheel sprocket replacement.* It got me thinkin there should be a way..

https://sheldonbrown.com/freewheels.html

*Why Shimano?*

There were many different freewheels in the 70's and 80's.. There are few if any except Shimano (and Sun Race) currently producing multi-gear freewheels. Even the newer Shimano Mega7 7-speed models use a different spline pattern and do not lend themselves to conversion. Except for some Regina and Suntour freewheels, all I have are Shimano, and the proprietary pattern of the cogs is important. Shimano HyperGlide freewheels also have a 'lockring' that does away with the need for a 13t or 14t 'lockcog'. Most home users will have or can find recycled Shimano freewheels, and you will find that for a decent conversion you need at least one HyperGlide freewheel (for the lockring) and one UniGlide freewheel (for the straighter cut teeth on the cogs.)

*Step-by-step Guide.*

It is almost impossible to remove either lockcog or lockring without a vice (or vice substitute) to hold the freewheel. I tried with dual chainwhips with the freewheel in place on a wheel. I broke one whip. I tried bracing a freewheel off the wheel using vice-grips and chain, and even destroyed large cogs trying to brace in a vice without the elusive 'freewheel bench vise'

I want to credit *Wayne at Performance Cycles (local LBS)* at Quadra and Reynolds (just off the Galloping Goose trail at MacKenzie) in Victoria, B.C., for showing me a couple of versions of (now unavailable) vice adaptors and suggesting a home brewed version using a wooden jig and wood screws to secure the freewheel. Screwing the freewheel to a solid surface was the key.

Also *props to Ryan at Recyclistas community bike shop* at the TransCanada flyover on the Galloping Goose, where the Goose meets the Lochside Trail, for providing a number of freewheel carcasses for experimentation and general banging the hell out of...

For the images I show two freewheels, one a 5 speed Uniglide from the early 80's and the other a 6 speed Hyperglide that is current today.

You can successfully do the conversion with just a Hyperglide freewheel, but you will have ramped and cut teeth that are less than completely satisfactory. However, its no different than a 'ghetto-mod' of a freehub using HyperGlide cassette cogs. If you can find an older Uniglide freewheel you will get better teeth (the slight 'twist-tooth' style) and more spacers...hehe...

Remove the freewheel from the bike.

If you have a wooden work surface, simply brace the freewheel with wood screws around the perimeter of the largest cog.









I show a possible variation using a wooden brace in a bench vice.









If you don't have a wood surface that your wife will let you drive screws into, you can also use a plywood 'plate' and clamp to a surface, like the dining room table....

Showing a plywood plate using a chainwhip (counter-clockwise) on a Uniglide freewheel (with lockcog)









Showing a plywood plate using a hammer and punch (counter-clockwise) on a Hyperglide freewheel (with lockring)









I had problems with a Shimano MegaRange 6 (low cog of 34t). The big cog was so flexy that the teeth would jump out of the screw heads with the force of the blows to the punch. I did a butcher job of shimming the big cog, but it worked...









Uniglide comes apart









Hyperglide comes apart









All the cogs and spacers simply lift off, after the first. Here is the body of the freewheel showing two 'steps' - the fatter for the low gears (cogs greater than 20t) and the slimmer for cogs from 13t to 19t.









Here's a comparison of Uniglide vs Hyperglide cogs. You can see why the Uniglide is my preferred one.

















Its a simple matter to build a new SS freewheel on the slimmer step of the freewheel body. Many middle gear chainlines will line up guite well with the middle of the 6 speed freewheel, so you can mount a cog from 15t to 19t against the shoulder of the step and use the slimmer spacers to fill to a point where the lockring will secure.









You cannot use cassette cogs - they differ.









You cannot use BB lockrings or freehub lockrings- they differ.









You cannot use cassette spacers - they differ.









I have tried various sizes of ABS pipe that I had, including 2" and 2.25" but no joy. I hope to try some PVC.

A few other finished product









The finished 18t weighed a little over 220 grams









Just as an aside, I include an image (courtesy Sheldon Brown) of a Var 16 lockring tool, that some suggest is the way to remove the Hyperglide lockring...









In my experience, I had to hammer the hell out of the punch to move the lockring, and I really doubt that the narrow ring would move with the plier type tool. It also costs $80. Wayne at Performance Cycles told me that he just uses a punch and hammer.

I did not build a freewheel with cog greater than 19t, the last that fits up against the shoulder of the step. I could easily do one with 20t plus, but I have to figure out how to secure very wide spacers on the lower step to butt against the cog and/or spacers on the upper (low gear) step.

*Future to-do list*

I will see how the stability of the cogs holds up. I might add a string of large (fatter) spacers to the top step if the cog giggles.

I will experiment with how much tension I need on the lockring to hold without excessive giggle. It will be harder to remove the lockring as it will be harder to secure the SS freewheel to the base. I will experiment with a jig using chain or maybe just using tall screws.

I will see what alternate spacers might be had.

Build a 20t to 30t model, just to see what I need to make it work.

*Final thoughts*

The job went surprisingly easy once I figured out how to secure the freewheel to a solid surface. Be sure to drip penetrating oil into the threads of the lockring/lockcog or just soak in oil for a while.

Watch your knuckles on the teeth of the cogs, especially if you are really whacking on the punch...

I disclaim all responsibility for physical injury, property damage or death. Use at your own risk. Your mileage may vary.

Any comments welcome, suggestions for spacers etc etc

Cheers

dmc


----------



## Mallanaga (Jun 30, 2007)

nice... now that's a cool conversion. if i had to, i'd do it.


----------



## j e SS e (Dec 24, 2007)

Very cool. :thumbsup:


----------



## Schmucker (Aug 23, 2007)

Cool. I wonder how well the old freewheels hold up off road.


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Probably more a hub issue....*



Schmucker said:


> Cool. I wonder how well the old freewheels hold up off road.


Hi guys - thanks for the comments. I was thinking about Schmucker' s question - Freewheels got a bad rap in the early '90s as frame spacing got wider (126mm - 130mm- 135mm) and gears got 'more-multi', more multi-er, from 5-6, to 7 and 8. As the bearing surface was forced away from the drive-side end of the axle and axles could break, most especially with any mis-alignment of the drop-outs. But that was really not a problem with 5-6 freewheels and 126 spacing as much as the later and larger.

As to durability, I think that older Shimano would be at least as good, and likely better, than todays Shimano freewheel, but near the low end of the scale compared to boutique builders.

However, one thing I always liked about freewheels was that they did engage well, and that they never had that annoying wiggle that you see on many freehubs. I would guess that the bearing, pawls, springs whatever, inside a freewheel are bigger, in whatever dimension, just because the body is that much bigger.

Cheers

dmc


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*SunTour 'Perfect' 5 Speed Update - photos*

Hi all - update to the photo guide;

I got a key for a early '80s SunTour 2-notch freewheel and removed the freewheel body.

The SunTour Perfect has thread on lock cog (s). Turns out the first two high gears, in this case 14 and 17 are threaded, the low gears splined on the upper shoulder.

First cog in ghetto mod vice adaptor;









Second threaded cog removal;









Disassembled. The image is dark but you may be able to see that the first (high gear) part of the body is threaded all the way. This means that I can thread as low as a 19 tooth cog all the way to the middle of the body and run without spacers or lock cog. I think I may find other trashed SunTour bodies that might give up non-ramped straight cut teeth in sizes from 14t to 19t. The SunTour body also gives up metal spacers that will be useful in Shimano body rebuilds...









Still looking for other material for spacers on the Shimano bodies...

Cheers

dmc


----------



## robrob (Feb 9, 2008)

*Thanks!*

DMC...AWESOME! Many Thanks!! I've got an old 10 speed that I'm fixing up and found it was the same Sun Tour Perfect cassette. I just disassembled it using your instructions, including the ghetto holder. First cog was tough coming off....think I need a new chain whip after that....but got it apart, and it will make a great SS setup.

Thanks again for the tip and the detailed photos. Priceless. What did we do before the internet?

Rob


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Some Sheldon Brown Karma...*



robrob said:


> DMC...AWESOME! Many Thanks!! I've got an old 10 speed that I'm fixing up and found it was the same Sun Tour Perfect cassette. I just disassembled it using your instructions, including the ghetto holder. First cog was tough coming off....think I need a new chain whip after that....but got it apart, and it will make a great SS setup.
> 
> Thanks again for the tip and the detailed photos. Priceless. What did we do before the internet?
> 
> Rob


 Hi Rob - welcome to the board, and thanks. Glad that it helped out. Think of it as me trying to give back a little to Sheldon Brown (died this week) for all the inspiration I got from his pages...

Funny thing about 10 speeds, I first got the idea for this page when I started on a 1986 Miyata Seven Twelve with 6 speed freewheel with a wonderful wheelset. No way I wanted to mess with the rear wheel, so I tried this....and it worked...

Have fun...

dmc


----------



## robrob (Feb 9, 2008)

*Homemade SS Freewheels - recycle vintage wheelsets*

One more question on this subject.....what about chain compatibility? I have the original chain, which is probably in fine shape under the 6 pounds of crap it's coated in. I was hoping to run a circa '99 8 speed Shimano MTB crank set, for both length ("proper" 175 versus the 165 on the original crank set) and sizing (42 vs 52). Thinking 42 x 17 will be fine for the short, flat distances I plan to ride this bike.

Will the original chain fit the 8sp rings? Will an 8sp chain work with the old freewheel? Guidance is appreciated.


----------



## bcd (Jan 27, 2004)

nice recycling!


----------



## plume (May 26, 2006)

very cool!


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Chain 'should' be OK. for 5-6-7-8.*



robrob said:


> One more question on this subject.....what about chain compatibility? I have the original chain, which is probably in fine shape under the 6 pounds of crap it's coated in. I was hoping to run a circa '99 8 speed Shimano MTB crank set, for both length ("proper" 175 versus the 165 on the original crank set) and sizing (42 vs 52). Thinking 42 x 17 will be fine for the short, flat distances I plan to ride this bike.
> 
> Will the original chain fit the 8sp rings? Will an 8sp chain work with the old freewheel? Guidance is appreciated.


Hi Rob - you're using older cog and chainring, so you can use old chain (all being worn). The issue with new chain and old ring/cog is that the new fresh chain may skip on the worn teeth. Since you can't get new cogs, stick with 'pre-owned'. However, since you have a ten-speed frame, and probably semi-horizontal drop-outs, you can keep good tension on the chain and you could probably live with a new chain. Its really really bad to throw a chain on the SS, nothing to hold it in place and you can jam it hard into the BB...

There is no issue of size, all are 3/32" and 1/2 inch pitch. The one thing you might do is either buy a new SRAM chain (cheap one like PC-48 or PC-58 for 6-7-8 speeds) and get the SRAM 'Powerlink' for no tools chain breaking. You can buy the Powerlinks on their own for a couple of bucks, but the old chains tend to be too thick in the sideplates for the Powerlinks to fit nice...

You can use the Mtn crank no problem, but would preferably use the centre ring for chainline purposes. Can't you just use the second 'inside' ring of the old road double and get the 42? If the road double is a POS then take the large mtn ring and mount on the centre of the mtn triple. In either case, you either buy BMX style short chain ring stack bolts, or grind up some spacers by cutting the tabs off one of the large chainrings and using the tabs as spacers in the single ring setup.

Cheers

dmc

PS - hi plume and bcd - thanks for the comments...


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*SunRace 7speed freewheel update..*

Hi all;

Rebuilt a 1999 or maybe 2000 SunRace (Taiwan) 7 speed last night, but forgot to take photos.

SunRace is about the only company other than Shimano that still makes mutli-gear freewheels.

The SunRace is removed with a standard Shimano splined freewheel and cassette tool, I use the Park FR-1.

The SunRace has a threaded first cog (normal right hand thread) exactly the same appearance as the old Shimano and the SunTour above. The first cog unscrews and the rest of the 6 cogs simply lift off. The cogs and spacers are not interchangable with either Shimano or SunTour, however the newer style *Shimano lockring fits * on the threads of the SunRace body, so I was able to spline on a SunRace 18t cog and secure using a spare Shimano lockring.

Cheers

dmc


----------



## FKMTB07 (Mar 29, 2007)

As I was reading this, I was thinking "I've got a bunch of Suntour freewheels, I wonder how those are put together" then, "oh, there it is. Cool."

Looks like I'll be spending some time in the ole' workshop tonight...



Much love for the cool mod and recycle job.


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Needle Nose LockRing Plier update - photos*

Hi all;

The Shimano freewheel lockrings used on the (relatively) newer freewheels let you mount cog and spacers on any of Shimano, SunTour or SunRace freewheels without having to resort to using the kludgy lockcogs from the older models.

Removing the lockring from the factory torqued freewheel, the first time around, requires brute force and a hammer and punch, in my experience.

Once you rebuild the SS however, you don't need to hammer the snot out of the lockring to secure it, and a gentle approach makes it easier to remove and change the cog.

I happen to have a large set of bent needle nose pliers, with a 50mm spread at the jaws, and they work a charm.

Shimano lockring in place;









Freewheel and large needle nose pliers;









Lockring removal;









The pliers are a house brand of MasterCraft from the local Cambodian Tire (Crappy Tire or Canadian Tire, depending where in Canada you live). I'm not sure how you measure the length, but the tool from the grips to the bend of the tips is 7' and the maw of the jaws extended is 50mm (2'). Plenty of torque to remove a lockring that is moderately tightened.

Cheers

dmc


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Classic SunTour...*



FKMTB07 said:


> As I was reading this, I was thinking "I've got a bunch of Suntour freewheels, I wonder how those are put together" then, "oh, there it is. Cool."
> 
> Looks like I'll be spending some time in the ole' workshop tonight...
> 
> Much love for the cool mod and recycle job.


Thanks FKMTB07 - I like the SunTour - the older model with the fully threaded outer shoulder lets you go to 19t without a lockring or cog.

I know that the early 1980s used the two-prong removal tool (Park FR-2), and 1986 and later used the four-prong tool (Park FR-3).

What I don't know is if the post 1986 still used the fully threaded lower shoulder. Sadly I threw out my only newer SunTour Pro years ago, all I have left is the Park FR-3...hehe..

If you break down a few SunTour, come back and post how the newer ones are put together...

Cheers

dmc

PS - be sure to drip oil (I like cheap ATF) into the threads a while before you tackle the lockcogs. Makes a huge difference.


----------



## robrob (Feb 9, 2008)

*Chain 'should' be OK. for 5-6-7-8.*

Thanks DMC! Again.

I don't think any of the components in question have significant wear. The old cogs have very few miles on them...maybe 100. And the MTB cranks got retired because the granny and middle were toast, but the big ring is in great shape. I am concerned about chain line, and will need to play with that as I put this all together. The dropout are semi-horizontal, so I have that going for me.

The original crankset is a total POS. It's too short (165) and the arm and 52 ring are one piece. The inner ring then just bolts to the other (no spider). So that's gotta go...and 52 x 17 sounds too big to me.

I'll see what I have for chains. I think I have a couple of almost new SRAM 8sp ones. (One of my kid's bikes got horrible chain suck and 1 or 2 links got totally bent in getting it unjammed, but otherwise are like new.) And will run PowerLink as I'm a big fan of the simplicity.

Rob


----------



## FKMTB07 (Mar 29, 2007)

deadmanschest said:


> Thanks FKMTB07 - I like the SunTour - the older model with the fully threaded outer shoulder lets you go to 19t without a lockring or cog.
> 
> I know that the early 1980s used the two-prong removal tool (Park FR-2), and 1986 and later used the four-prong tool (Park FR-3).
> 
> ...


I've got one from 1979 and one from 1990. I'll do the '90 first and report back with my findings regarding the fully threaded shoulders. Should be able to get to it tonight.


----------



## FKMTB07 (Mar 29, 2007)

Just pulled apart a 6 speed Suntour freewheel from 90 or 91. The freewheel uses a lockcog on the outside followed by three different spline sizes. Ugh, not to versatile.

I screwed the freewheel to the end of a 4' 2x4 to allow me to brace the other end of the 2x4 under my armpit so I could get both hands on the chainwhip and really lean on it. I needed all that extra oomph.









Here's a shot of the body, disassembled.









This shot shows the farthest each cog group will slide down the body. The two biggest can slide all the way down, the middle two halfway down, and the smallest two just barely down the body (including the lockcog). Three different sized spacers are used on this one. I feel like it wouldn't be as easy to really dial in cog size or chainline with this one.









I may start a project to sacrifice the lockcog and transform it into a lockring of sorts, just for aesthetic purposes.

While I was downstairs with the 6spd, I pulled apart a Suntour Perfect 5. Just like was mentioned, the first two cogs thread on and the rest sit behind it with metal spacers on the splines. I'd like to use this one as a conversion, but there's some lateral play inside the freewheel. Anyone know how to get in there and poke around? More out of curiosity, I won't be too upset if this thing is junk.


----------



## dirtydownhill (Aug 11, 2006)

Ive tried that a few times and it has always ended in stripped freehub bodies. Not to say that it cant work...


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Sounds good to go..*



robrob said:


> Thanks DMC! Again.
> 
> I don't think any of the components in question have significant wear. The old cogs have very few miles on them...maybe 100. And the MTB cranks got retired because the granny and middle were toast, but the big ring is in great shape. I am concerned about chain line, and will need to play with that as I put this all together. The dropout are semi-horizontal, so I have that going for me.
> 
> ...


Hey Rob - yep, slap the big triple on the middle position of the mtn crank and space the freewheel for the centre and should be really close. 42 x 17 is good for town, a little tall for hills and wind.

Have fun

dmc


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Armpit Vice Adaptor!*



FKMTB07 said:


> Just pulled apart a 6 speed Suntour freewheel from 90 or 91. The freewheel uses a lockcog on the outside followed by three different spline sizes. Ugh, not to versatile.
> 
> I screwed the freewheel to the end of a 4' 2x4 to allow me to brace the other end of the 2x4 under my armpit so I could get both hands on the chainwhip and really lean on it. I needed all that extra oomph.


Hehe - Armpit Vice Adaptor!, love it. I like seeing pictures of workbenches with all kinds of parts and stuff lying all around, sometimes I spend 10 minutes pushing stuff to the edges to get a small clear spot to work in...hehe..

The 6 speed SunTour is disappointing, with the 3 sizes, may be the best is to use the 5 speed body and see what teeth count you have in the thread on cogs. Looks like 13t, probably 14 or 15t and 19t?

Check out the Sheldon Brown link for info on disassembly of the body - the wisdom is *don't do it.*...

http://sheldonbrown.com/freewheels.html

Apparently 64 little ball bearings will spill out all over the floor...What you can try is just put the 5 speed body into a yogourt cup and fill with heavy (30+) oil. Let is percolate a while and then drain. Helps to quiet the pawls and maybe give new life to the old gal...

Otherwise, just scrounge a couple of Shimano freewheels and experiment. Its clear to me that the SunTour 5 speed is probably the only workable one, cause you can just run the first threaded lockcog up to the centre and be done with it...The later proprietary cogs look to be a pita...

One clarification for folks - The Shimano HyperGlide lockrings work on all Shimano bodies (I think) and on SunRace bodies. The Shimano lockring does not fit on the SunTour 5 and I am assuming not on the 6 either...

Cheers

dmc


----------



## FKMTB07 (Mar 29, 2007)

deadmanschest said:


> Hehe - Armpit Vice Adaptor!, love it. I like seeing pictures of workbenches with all kinds of parts and stuff lying all around, sometimes I spend 10 minutes pushing stuff to the edges to get a small clear spot to work in...hehe..
> 
> The 6 speed SunTour is disappointing, with the 3 sizes, may be the best is to use the 5 speed body and see what teeth count you have in the thread on cogs. Looks like 13t, probably 14 or 15t and 19t?
> 
> ...


Yeah, haha. Bonus points to who can identify the most crap in the background of those pictures.

From Sheldon:
"Use a hammer and punch (or an old flat-blade screwdriver) to drive the ring in a clockwise direction. This ring is actually a bearing cone with a left ("reverse") thread, and once you have removed it you will see a row of 1/8" bearing balls and a stack of very thin washers surrounding the threads that the cone threaded on to. These are shim washers, and you can remove one or more of them to make the bearing tighter, if the freewheel has too much play." I may give it a go just through this part and see if I can't remove one of those shim washers to tighted it up a bit. Who knows? The worst that happens is I ruin a 28 year old freewheel that I wouldn't be using anyways. This experiment is mostly out of curiosity.


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Links to Freewheel Vice Adaptor and Misc. tools..*

hi all - happened to stumble onto a link to BikeTools.Etc which has a couple of the elusive Vice adaptors for freewheels

Bicycle Research Vice Adaptor

VAR Regina Freewheel Body Holder

The Bicycle Research adaptor is one that I have seen before, the latter Regina tool is getting into the heights of obscurity...

Cheers

dmc


----------



## P.K. Motorsports (Sep 16, 2008)

*IRD freewheel*

This thread has inspired me to disassemble one of the new IRD freewheels. Why take apart a $40 freewheel? I am trying to make a "modern" Ultra 6 freewheel with 5mm cog spacing. Pictures to follow!


----------



## Velobike (Jun 23, 2007)

When I was a lad and used to hang around the bike shop (what's changed) one of my privileges was to stand on the pedals of a bike (in low gear) while the chainwhip was applied to the small cog/lockring. 

It usually worked, but I did learn a lot of useful new words to use in less polite society.


----------



## P.K. Motorsports (Sep 16, 2008)

Candidate is a 6-speed IRD Mark 2 13-28 freewheel. I considered using a 7-speed, but am glad I didn't (more on this later). Freewheel in the vise, oil soaking into the threads on the lockcog:









Took a little elbow grease, but I'm sure this was easier than most because it had never been ridden. The results:









The body:








Sorry for the blurry pic. Anyhow - it looks exactly like the Shimano bodies pictured above. The body is 31.7mm tall, with a 1.7mm lip, leaving 30mm of splines and threads. The larger splines are 12.4mm tall and have an outside diameter of just a few thousands under 2". The smaller splines are 10.9mm tall and have an outside diameter of about 1.68" This leaves 6.7mm of threads. The spline pattern is asymmetrical: one spline is squarish and offset a few mm to the left.









The lockcog has about 1.7mm unthreaded at the bottom. This will be very helpful as I plan to mill 0.5mm off of it and now know that I won't be reducing the number of threads engaged.









The cogs are 1.8mm thick and the spacers are 3.7mm, for 5.5mm cog-to-cog spacing - the old Shimano standard. This means the lower stack is 12.8mm tall, so the third cog only engages the splines by 1.4mm. Due to the asymmetric spline pattern, they will only slide onto the body in one orientation - like a Hyperglide cog on a contemporary Shimano freehub body.









Similarly, the upper stack is 11mm tall, and so the 5th cog only engages the splines by 1.3mm.

THE TASK:
Reduce the cog spacing to 5mm.

This will require four modifications:

Thin the spacers by 0.5mm each to 3.2mm
Mill 0.5mm off the bottom of the lockcog
Add a 1mm spacer under the largest cog
Grind about 0.9mm off the upper splines, so that they are 10mm tall.

The first and third are easy. The second won't be as easy - the lockcog is quite hard - but is doable. The third has me concerned, but I will prevail.

A potential fifth task would be to grind 2.2mm off the end of the body so that it is flush with the face of the lockcog on the finished product. However, I test fitted the body on my 124mm OLD hub in the frame, and there is adequate clearance with the chain and seat stays. On a 120mm OLD hub this could be an issue.


----------



## P.K. Motorsports (Sep 16, 2008)

*Why not start with a 7-speed freewheel?*

The cog spacing would already be 5mm, after all.

There are a couple of reasons. First of all, I've never seen a 7-speed and probably never will. It's apparent that the 5-, 6-, and 7-speed freewheels use different bodies. I am making the assumption that the large spline portion doesn't differ between the three, and the only difference is the length of the threaded section (and maybe the small splines). To convert a 7-speed to 6, you would be either dropping the largest cog or the smallest cog. Looking at these two options...

Getting rid of the smallest cog would leave you with a 15-28 freewheel, which is not what I want. Additionally, you'd probably need a Shimano/Sunrace freewheel lockring to secure the stack, unless the second largest cog is actually threaded on. However, this would work if a 15-28 is what you are after (might not be bad with a 54 tooth large ring...)

Getting rid of the largest cog would probably mean adding a 1.8mm spacer in its place. You can't slide all the cogs "down by one" because the spline pattern will be different on cog #4 versus cog #3. Maybe you could dispense with the 1.8mm spacer because the stack height of the bottom three plus spacer would be 3*3.2+3*1.8 = 15mm, more than 1.8mm taller than the 12.4mm tall splines. However, this might cause problems higher up in the stack. My presumption is that the second largest cog has notches in an integrated spacer just like the second cog on many Hyperglide cassettes, because the cog itself will - probably - be up in the threaded portion. It's unknown whether these notches will be cut all the way through so that the second cog can be slid down on the splines by 1.8mm. Finally, this would leave either a 5mm or a 3.2mm spacer as the bottom item in the stack. As well as being aesthetically displeasing, my suspicion is that it would crack with use.

A final concern is that the 7-speed body is longer than the 6-speed body. It would rub on the stays of many 120-122mm spaced frames. Grinding the body down sounds difficult to me.

Incidentally, the 5-speed IRDs must use a body with ~5mm shorter small splines (and more threads). The pictures I've seen put the face of the smallest threaded-on cog several mm below the face of the outer bearing race. This would make the 5-speed body very difficult to convert to an ultra-6, totally aside from the fact that you'd be missing a 6th cog!


----------



## velomann (May 29, 2009)

*ghetto singlespeed*

I've been experimenting with this for a couple weeks now - mostly just taking apart and cleaning up old freewheels I have lying around, or scoring good cheap ones I think might be useful for this project. My plan is to have a full quiver of centered single-speed freewheels I can choose from depending on the ride. A couple observations:

I like the older Suntour freewheels for the straight teeth, but other posters are correct in the observation that at three different "platforms" and inner diameters for each freewheel, they're less versatile. I'm also finding them harder to get the first cog off - I've got 2 that despite pounding, grunting, plenty of WD-40 and a broken whip, they won't budge.:madman:

I'm curious about the Suntour 5-speeds; whether they are also triple platform and whether the middle cog on those could be used.

For the Shimano freewheels, besides the ones with a lock cog and those with a separate lockring (most useful) I've found a couple that have a funky indexing system that demands the cogs be lined up just so. For these, one of the splines (normally shaped kind of like a flattened shark fin) is actually square cut, so each of the cogs (except the smallest) can only go on one way. These cogs are obviously NOT compatible with other Shimano freewheels.

In response to an above comment, there are plenty of 7-speed freewheels out there. I'll have to check, but I think they still only have the smallest 3 cogs on the narrow diameter platform, so they would tend to place the chainline more to the outboard side. I'll double check on this when I get home.

If you can find them, older Dura Ace freewheels might be the best bet. Super quality cogs and bomber freewheel mechanisms. No lockring though - the small cog threads internally on the freewheel, effectively sealing the bearings and mechanism. Another nice feature of the Dura-Ace (and Shimano 600) freewheels is that once you get the cogs off you will discover there are to oil ports in the side of the freewheel body - very handy for keeping them serviced and spinning smoothly. I have a couple that are probably 25 years old and still spin smooth as butter. The other nice thing about the Dura-Ace freewheels is that all the spacers are steel. May make no difference to otheres, but I like it.


----------



## velomann (May 29, 2009)

*ps*

I just picked up and took apart a 6-speed shimano wide-range 13 (14?) -32freewheel (no lockring). The 3rd cog - the largest one with the smaller diameter center - has 20 teeth, so it's possible to create a 20 freewheel in the above configuration as well. Anyone know if there's even bigger?


----------



## Big Pete (Feb 1, 2009)

Thanks!


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

*Glad this dyi is still alive...*



cheers

dmc


----------



## nbeav (Jun 30, 2009)

*uhm*

This was very helpful, where is the section on replacing those 64 ball bearings on the floor? :madman:


----------



## DanD (Jan 15, 2004)

nbeav said:


> This was very helpful, where is the section on replacing those 64 ball bearings on the floor? :madman:


http://www.toolleader.com/product_info.php?currency=USD&products_id=129


----------



## pcxmbfj (Apr 7, 2006)

*Good Thread!*

My road single speed is on Bullseye freewheel hubs so I am using a BMX threaded cog to get my one. There's some history to these hubs as they were 8s early on via a Regina 8s freewheel. I still have it and several complete and broken freewheels lying around that I'm glad I haven't disgarded. This discussion offers some interesting possibilities.


----------



## pug (Jun 23, 2009)

I have the same two level hub on my ss conversion bike. I used one of the cogs off the old cassette, but I feel the teeth are too short and the chain comes off. 

Does anyone sell aftermarket cogs to fit the two level hubs?

Thanks


----------



## crazy8 (Apr 21, 2009)

*Ti Art*

Mattias 's freewheel cog is ti art.


----------



## SaturdayKid (Aug 29, 2010)

This is just the thread I need at the mo, cheers fishcreek for directing me here and to dmc for creating it. I could do with a bit of help, I'm not sure what's going on with this 6-speed shimano (hyperglide?) freewheel I've got.

If you take a look at the pics below hopefully you can see the rivets at the rear of the freewheel - those rivets go right through the largest 3 cogs effectively riveting them together by the look of it. Can they be separated? Looks like they'd need some kind of oversized chain link splitter to do the job!

I've yet to buy myself a chainwhip (looks like I'll be doing that tomorrow!) so I've got the job of separating the cogs to come but have I got it right that with this type of freewheel I'll need a chainwhip which I'll use on the smallest cog and that cog is a lock cog? Then I'll need a lockring from a hyperglide freewheel to secure whichever cog I use onto the body of the freewheel?

Sorry to have to ask what must seem like obvious questions but I'm pretty much a novice at this kinda thing. Cheers


----------



## SaturdayKid (Aug 29, 2010)

Woohooo! This afternoon I found an old rear wheel I'd forgotten about and what did that sucker have on it? Yep that's right, an old (but not very worn) shim' freewheel with lockring. The lockring came off fairly easily once I'd braced the freewheel in the wooden jig/screws arrangement (cheers dmc  ) and whacked it with a punch. 

So off comes the lockring, lockcog and the 6 other cogs plus spacers. I really need some more spacers (well only one more actually) to make the 16T cog tight on the freewheel so I've been searching around for something made out of similar stuff to what the spacers seem to be made of. I've found what seems to be just the thing (an old door sign made of some kind of hardened rubber/plastic composite) so I'm going to cut some discs out of that and then using a smaller diameter hole cutter drill bit cut out the middle of the discs to leave something closely resembling the spacers I found in the freewheel. Hope it turns out OK lol. 

Pics to follow.....


----------



## jackspade (Jul 23, 2010)

Cool.

I never know that multigears freewheel can be made into single gears.

I've seen the sprocket cassette one but this one is new for me.


----------



## SaturdayKid (Aug 29, 2010)

Yo, here's some photos of my ghetto ss freewheel from a shimano 7speed freewheel (not the one in the last lot of pics I posted - it couldn't be done with that one to cut a long story short).

This shows all the cogs separated from the freewheel. 
The lockring is on the far right, second row. 
The freewheel body with 16T cog plus spacers is second from the left, middle row. 
Bottom row shows spacers, the spacer on the far right was cut out of the stuff the cogs are laid out on.









Close up of the freewheel body with cog. Above this and to the right is the lockcog which was situated just below the lockring before the cogs were separated from the freewheel. 









Close up of the lockcog.


----------



## RSW42 (Aug 22, 2006)

Very cool thread. 

Thanks!



S


----------



## auraslip (Aug 22, 2010)

Hey guys - Awesome thread and I love the pictures. 

I was wondering if you knew what threaded cogs are compatible with the shimano lockrings. 

The reason I ask is that there seems to be a shortage of 11 tooth freewheels. I was hoping maybe I could find an 11 tooth sprocket that would screw on to the threaded portion of a freewheel.


----------



## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

SaturdayKid said:


>


I like your shoes :thumbsup:


----------



## Rabies010 (Jan 20, 2011)

Thanks for the info in this thread..!!
I am currently waiting on a custom made freewheel adapter/extender cause the first one didn't turn out that well.
And i had a brand new Shimano freewheel in front of me that i didn't want to install because i want to use it on another project.
But when i saw this thread i could not resist the temptation as i realy want to take my SS out for a ride.
I did not have any extra spacers or material to make them from, so i used a zip-tie and the spacers from the freewheel and it holds up great. (for now)

Here are some pics of the first version of the adapter/extender that didn't work to well.
The freewheel just wont go any further after 4 or 5 turns.


----------



## steelhead (Jul 8, 2004)

Are the cog body interfaces of the old Shimano UG freewheels and the new IRD defiant the same?

Then one could use IRD cogs and use the more durable UG bodies.


----------



## tugofwar (Jul 2, 2013)

*Singlespeed Fun*








I never thought this would be so addictive and fun!!!!


----------



## tnike (Feb 27, 2014)

Hey thanks for this, I am just trying to work out the exact same cassette and this has helped alot.
Please can you advise how to re-grease this casette? How do I get in there - is it the little centre piece with the two holes in it that I would need a pin wrench for? If so do you know the right direction to turn the pin wrench? Thanks


----------



## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

tnike said:


> Hey thanks for this, I am just trying to work out the exact same cassette and this has helped alot.
> Please can you advise how to re-grease this casette? How do I get in there - is it the little centre piece with the two holes in it that I would need a pin wrench for? If so do you know the right direction to turn the pin wrench? Thanks


These are freewheels, not cassettes, same overall function but there is a fundamental distinction. To open the freewheel use punch or pin spanner to tighten the inner lockring clockwise (It is left hand thread!). IT often works better to just flush the body clean with solvent and re-lube with oil rather than grease which usually just clogs the prawls. THe bearings dont really carry much load so grease is really not necessary. See service instructions at Traditional Thread-on Freewheels

I have also been experimenting with turning suntour 5-speed pro-comp FW into 2 and 3 speeds (budget dinglespeed). The pro-comp is only 26mm wide so can be setup to re-space the hub axle so as to move the drive side hub flange over for a near dishless rear wheel, very strong wheel and reduces incidents of bent axles that were so common with 7-speed freewheels.


----------



## tnike (Feb 27, 2014)

haha, I'd only just read the difference between freewheel and casette the other day but my brain still thinks freewheel is just an American term for the same thing, duh!

I'll give the WD40 and re-oil a go first then. It's got to be at least 30 years old but the sprockets look fine. I'm putting a brand new vintage remake crankset on - Do you think I'll get away with a new chain too? (as the old one looks like it has seen better days)

Good luck with the wheel - it looks bombproof! Does the chain not mind shifting up those big gaps from high to low? And are you using a retro shifter with it or do modern ones pull the right amount of cable through?
cheers


----------



## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

tnike said:


> Good luck with the wheel - it looks bombproof! Does the chain not mind shifting up those big gaps from high to low? And are you using a retro shifter with it or do modern ones pull the right amount of cable through?
> cheers


Danger of using an old stretched chain with new chainrings is that it it will wear the chainrings and cogs faster. New singlespeed chains are can be found very cheap.

No derailleur used on my dinglespeed freewheel setup. The three speed FW is paired with a triple chainring crank, yielding option to manually move chain to select from among three different ratios for "singlespeed" riding.


----------



## tnike (Feb 27, 2014)

Ah, I see, but are you achieving adequate chain tension on each ratio?

Warning..one chain whip died in the making of this photo! My attempt to get the first sprocket off using a long lever broke the tool. I was applying the force anti-clockwise and applied lots of WD40 first.

Before I buy a stronger chain whip and ruin that too, are there any mechanical engineering solutions you can suggest?

I dont have access to a vise. I thought about a plank of wood with 4 screws in it but can't think how I would get the screws to fit into the teeth..


----------



## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

tnike said:


> Ah, I see, but are you achieving adequate chain tension on each ratio?


Chainrings and freewheel cogs carefully selected to provide constant chain length for all three gears, (using 30t, 34t and 38t chainrings). Does not work well using typical 22t granny gear as the jump to middle chainring would be too large.

Horizontal dropouts for tension but a wide chain tensioner could work for vertical DOs and would make the changes faster since no need then to release the wheel to change chain path.

Looks like your whip broke in part because it was being bent sideways. Pull strait and it should be plenty strong. Placing the whip onto the cog to move the lever fulcrum away from the tip will provide more leverage.


----------



## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

tnike said:


> are there any mechanical engineering solutions you can suggest?


hammer and a screw driver. it worked for me.


----------



## tnike (Feb 27, 2014)

impressive. sounds like you got it pretty sussed. These old sprockets seem really tough.
I can assure you I was pulling very straight until the last second when the force overcame the chainwhip pin which broke causing the angle to change and bend the handle.
My home made tool with the planks was looking pretty good but sheared a tooth off the first sprocket, so not feeling bothered about ruining it further I tried the hammer and chisel method which got the dam thing off. My advice to anyone attempting the same thing with such a highly seized sproket would be to first try a really strong industrial chain-whip (i.e. park tool) and failing that try tapping the base of each tooth getting progressively harder with a hammer and chisel until it starts to turn. There were rust spots on the thread inside and between the sprockets that gave an indication as to why it was so stuck. 
The only other thing I could suggest is sheldon browns method of wrapping a chain around the sprocket and clamping the ends of the chain in a vise - but then not too sure how you would turn it.

If you have a spare 14t sprocket spare that would be much appreciated! happy to cover costs by paypal of course.
Cheers
Tim


----------



## tnike (Feb 27, 2014)

cheers for that. so is the tooth that's missing the one you hit with the hammer by any chance!?


----------



## deadmanschest (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi - been a decade awol, but image hosting let me down, so edit thread to hopefully preserve the photos.

Cheers
dmc


----------



## Y282 (Jun 6, 2020)

Joined to say thanks so much for posting this info, it's a game changer for rescuing old junk bikes and this knowledge really isn't out there that much.

Screwing the freewheel to a plank works perfectly, I already used this yesterday and got a perfect chainline on something I'd have had to scrap as a project. Thanks again, you've really helped!


----------



## oileand (Nov 7, 2020)

*SunTour lockring*

Thanks so much for this thread. I'm thinking about doing this with a SunTour freewheel from the 90s, but I'm not sure if it has the lockcogs or if this is a lockring. If so, any advice on where to get the correct tool to remove this lockring? Thanks


----------



## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

Oileand- It looks like your suntour FW lockring probably used a suntour proprietary removal tool, probably same tool that would be needed for suntour cassette lockring removal? Older (much more common) suntour freeweheels used a threaded outer cog instead of lockring. The last generation of suntour freewheels were a different design and these are somewhat rare, I cannot even find a picture of the tool that would be needed. Unless you can find a well equipped bike shop that still has the (rare) suntour lockring removal tool, you might try holding the freewheel with a chain whip and using a punch and hammer to loosen the lockring for cog removal. It looks like the body of this later suntour freewheel still used the original suntour 2-prong removal (to get body off the hub). Weird that they went back to the 2-prong body tool since the 4-prong tool was introduced in middle 1980's as a slight improvement to the poor 2-prong design that was easy to break on stubborn stuck freewheels if you dont fully tighten down the QR skewer to retain the tool prongs in the body. Shimanos splined freewheel body removal tool works much better, does not even require the skewer to be in place when removing. 
If you want to mess with freewheels, might be best to use a different model than this oddball late suntour. Either use early suntour or else shimano , yoiu will have a much easier time sourcing tools and finding extra freewheels to use a s cog and spacer donors. 

6 years after I made post #51 above, I am still riding my dinglespeed conversion made from old suntour "perfect" model 5-speed freewheel.


----------



## Lalratty (3 mo ago)

I remember back in the 1970's I couldn't get the ratios I wanted - and we were limited to 5 on the rear and 3 on the front - so I needed to rebuild my freewheel.
The first trick I used was to push the large gear into 2 pieces of balsa (half inch thick was about the best), one on the opposite side to the other. You could then place this mass in a vice without using wood screws.
For the lock-ring, I built a tool using a socket that was just larger than the distance between the two pin holes - I then welded 2 pieces of piano wire - the right diameter for the pin holes inside the socket with just enough protruding to engage with the holes properly - the zigzag pattern inside the socket helped to lend the wires strength. Next I bonded a piece of copper pipe centered on the socket that was long enough to go through the centre of the freewheel - this helped to align the tool to the freewheel. Finally, I filled the space between the socket and the pipe with Araldite. Once this had cured the whole tool would be attached to a socket wrench and would easily remove the lock ring without damage or danger.
Back then, the teeth on the cogs were relatively easy to make, so I'd make my own a lathe - I ended up with a 5 speed 11-22T. The front set that I made was 34, 48, 62T. Giving me a very easy low gear, that went like stink at the top end.


----------



## Lalratty (3 mo ago)

*oileand *With your Suntour I'd suggest modifying my trick above with the socket - bond a few keys inside to match some of the pattern, or better still, if you have access to a grinding wheel, grind out some of the socket end to match the lock ring.


----------

