# Should We Respond to Woman-Unfriendly Posts on MTBR?



## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

Vote in the poll & discuss


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

I used to ignore them, not wanting to give them even negative attention, or hoping a male poster might find it offensive. But that got old. I've had mixed results. The first time, I was able to incorporate humor, and got zero negative replies and zero negative feedback, one positive reply, and zero word from the o.s.p. (original sexist poster). The second time I did not incorporate humur, but kept it simple (not a lecture). The jury is still out, but so far one reply supporting the o.s.p.

Update: Ha! Anon neg rep received "Cry baby"


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

I'm subscribed to this as I'm very curious - *What's a "woman unfriendly" post ?* (please give an example)


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

Stuff like this (today)...



snowdrifter said:


> It's the best when they sit in the middle of the trail, deepthroating their footlongers.





epic said:


> At least most of their women look good in the official team uniforms. I love "Canadian Bacon".


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Call em out, no place on this board for demeaning sexist comments imo. Sorry for interloping, I'll leave now.


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## Berkeley Mike (Jan 13, 2004)

I'll leave too but, yeah.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

mtbxplorer said:


> Stuff like this (today)...


Wow, I need to get out of the WL more. That's pretty nauseating. What forums were those in?

We could make comments, and then they'd come here, and then the gals could stomp them with tampax posts.

But seriously? It could be worth pursuing just to keep all parts of the board welcoming to the whole mtb population. Females shouldn't have to stay here in order to not be subjected to male asshattery like that. I find the the little "report post" button pretty handy if I don't feel like making a statement. I think in the big picture, it comes down to what admin feels is acceptable. If admin thinks it's acceptable, all the complaining in the world isn't going to change anything. However if it isn't, but no one has said anything... that's different situation.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Ah, OK ut: Most definitely use that little "Report Post" button under the username, as I don't think that's something the Mods Would tolerate. Thought you were talking more along the lines of _women can't...._ and such type, not flat out childish vulgarity.



mtbxplorer said:


> Stuff like this (today)...
> 
> 
> > It's the best when they sit in the middle of the trail, deepthroating their footlongers.
> ...


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

formica said:


> Wow, I need to get out of the WL more. That's pretty nauseating. What forums were those in?
> ...


It was on a regional forum...
http://forums.mtbr.com/vermont-new-hampshire-maine/kt-our-neighbors-north-790074.html#post9339245

The previous time was on fatbikes, but of course it was OT, so I don't remember which thread.


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## chuky (Apr 3, 2005)

Just report 'em. Francis doesn't tolerate this stuff. Negative rep from multiple people will get them banned, too.


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

Ugh, really? I only check out a couple of forums so I haven't seen that stuff.

I used to get all defensive on the dirt bike forums and I just never got anywhere. You're not going to change their minds. So sure I gave up, but I guess it was better than wasting my time arguing with morons.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Firecrackerktm said:


> Ugh, really? I only check out a couple of forums so I haven't seen that stuff.
> 
> I used to get all defensive on the dirt bike forums and I just never got anywhere. You're not going to change their minds. So sure I gave up, but I guess it was better than wasting my time arguing with morons.


You don't have to argue. Like Chuky said,_ if they know about it _( report post button) it's not tolerated here.
Mods don't read every single post in every single thread in every single forum. Many times, unless someone brings something to their attention, it may go unnoticed.


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

Whether or not the post gets removed, however, I find it depressing that they'd even say that.


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## hawkychick (Jun 5, 2011)

I'm a long time lurker, & this is my first post.

I run a forum for a different group of enthusiasts, but it's similar in size & activity. The mods not only don't have time to read every post, they likely have very little time to read many at all. It's up to the community in places like this to report things like this. Sure they'll remove it if they see it, but the likelihood is very high that they won't. Just report it & move along. Guys that like to get down in the mud & take shots like that aren't worth getting down in the mud with. Kind of like the old saying that even if you win a p!ssing contest, you're still covered in urine. It's sooooooo not worth your time.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

I guess this is my personality coming out, but I'm more inclined to confront a bully than report them (good there is that option though). Neither approach is necessarily successful on any given individual, but I hold out some hope that the community improves over time when people are willing to speak out against bad stuff. Maybe someone else will reconsider posting something similarly offensive. Or maybe they will just think I am a b****h with no sense of humor, but I can live with that.


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## chuky (Apr 3, 2005)

For me, it just has to do with patience. Jerks are boring, I would rather sift them out. I run a couple of online communities (50K + participants) and have found that some folks just really want to be angry and mean. Trying to stop it is a waste of my brain space and just gives them the attention they are craving.


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## Vah_Nay (Aug 31, 2011)

For those that feel it's a waste of time/not worth it to report it/respond to it, that is your choice. I do think the minimal effort required to simply hit the 'report post' -- whether or not it gets taken down, is worthwhile and will could result in more moderation of sexist commentary -- if enough people do this simple thing. 

Though I understand it's not healthy to let such comments get to me, I do feel a need to be somewhat proactive when it comes to sexism, here or anywhere. Otherwise we are complicit and essentially saying that disrespecting women is normal and acceptable.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

I notice the "footlong" orignal post has been taken down.:thumbsup:


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

yes and report them when you do see them.

same with threads where the poster uses gay to describe something or calls someone a phaggot. No tolerance for bigoted responses no matter the vein. Hate is hate no matter how you paint it.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

make a thread where you can list the offensive posts, and then have people go neg rep them.


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## Vah_Nay (Aug 31, 2011)

same with threads where the poster uses gay to describe something or calls someone a phaggot. No tolerance for bigoted responses no matter the vein. Hate is hate no matter how you paint it.[/QUOTE]

Yes, thank you!


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## smilinsteve (Jul 21, 2009)

I looked at this thread thinking "are there really sexist comments around here? Apparently there are. I then went to the beer forum where this was just posted:



> Ultimately, I think beer is better served with cans. Preferably topless.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Stripes said:


> Unfortunately, sexism exists everywhere. It's how it's handled that's important. Knowing Francois, I don't think he's going to tolerate it so report it.
> 
> The worst part is the anonymous rep part--people can make comments there and you can't reply or defend yourself if someone makes a sexist comment there. Long live the 21st Keyboard Brigade . As long as people are behind a keyboard, they're going to say what they want with no repercussions. Most people are too chicken to say this stuff to your face--and it's worse when it can be said anonymously.


I find the a misogynistic person will have a history of that. If they leave you degrading or insulting rep notify a moderator or supermoderator. They can look into it and generally when i look into things i also look at the person's post history in general. A lot of times this directs me to give them a warning regarding how they handle themselves in grown up world and it can also result in time outs or outright banning depending on the severity of how far away from putting on the big boy pants they are.

The tools are at your disposal, don't be afraid to use them!


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## 411898 (Nov 5, 2008)

While I agree that this sort of thing should not be tolerated here, the truth is that outside this forum in the open world, girls and guys are equally guilty of such actions.


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## gabrielle (Jan 2, 2005)

Firecrackerktm said:


> Whether or not the post gets removed, however, I find it depressing that they'd even say that.


Yep.

I call 'em out when I have the energy to do so. Lately, it seems like it's coming from all sides (I'm in IT - google 'brogrammer' for starters). I'm pretty sick of it, frankly.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Um, how about offensive avatars that are degrading/offensive to either sex?
<-----------------------
<-----------------------


gabrielle said:


> Yep.I call 'em out when I have the energy to do so. Lately, it seems like it's coming from all sides (I'm in IT - google 'brogrammer' for starters). I'm pretty sick of it, frankly.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Love the NEG rep I got for the above question. So it's all right to degrade men, but not all right to degrade women then and I'm taking it too serious  Glad my little rep hammer is normally bigger than those who like to leave stupid neg rep like this without signing it.



> Too serious about this!





> nice derailing attempt!


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

Stripes said:


> Unfortunately, sexism exists everywhere. It's how it's handled that's important. Knowing Francois, I don't think he's going to tolerate it so report it.
> 
> The worst part is the anonymous rep part--people can make comments there and you can't reply or defend yourself if someone makes a sexist comment there. Long live the 21st Keyboard Brigade . As long as people are behind a keyboard, they're going to say what they want with no repercussions. Most people are too chicken to say this stuff to your face--and it's worse when it can be said anonymously.


I know it does--that's why it's depressing. But like I said, we might get the posts removed, but it's not going to change how people think. YES, the anonymity of the internet definitely makes for some "brave" people.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

To date, I have received more positive rep than negative for "speaking out", and not just from the WL.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

LyNx said:


> Love the NEG rep I got for the above question. So it's all right to degrade men, but not all right to degrade women then and I'm taking it too serious  Glad my little rep hammer is normally bigger than those who like to leave stupid neg rep like this without signing it.


Dude, stop.


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

Stripes said:


> Gotta love the 21st Keyboard Brigade. Their keyboards are their weapons, and they're pretty powerful.
> 
> They're too chicken to say anything to you in person, but online--especially anonymously--some people have gotten really big heads.
> 
> People should just log off and go ride a bike


Winter is fabulous. You can tell who lives in the northern states.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

*WOW, talk about double standards*

So, going by you thought process then it's OK to degrade men in here_ (womens lounge)_ but not OK for men to do likewise out there :skep: ut: You either want it gone/not done or you don't, you can't have it to suit you when you fancy it and then ***** when it doesn't/isn't.



Stripes said:


> Not that I would negative rep you for your original comment, but you do have to realise this is the _*WOMEN'S*_ Lounge and whining about men being mistreated or treated as sex objects ... well this probably isn't the right place for it if you think about it


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

LyNx said:


> Um, how about offensive avatars that are degrading/offensive to either sex?
> <-----------------------
> <-----------------------


Avatars don't bother me as much as the comments do. All genders like to look at shapely specimens of whomever they find attractive.

It's a gray area, but personally I don't think avatars are as degrading as some of the comments I've seen quoted here.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Firecrackerktm said:


> Avatars don't bother me as much as the comments do. All genders like to look at shapely specimens of whomever they find attractive.
> 
> It's a gray area, but personally I don't think avatars are as degrading as some of the comments I've seen quoted here.


I'm wondering what the ratio of avatars with boobies and bikinis etc is to the single Dude Memorial avatar....


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## Firecrackerktm (Jul 16, 2009)

formica said:


> I'm wondering what the ratio of avatars with boobies and bikinis etc is to the single Dude Memorial avatar....


Huge, I am sure. Maybe I should go look for something yummy.

maybe all the ladies could go change their avatars. I bet the guys wouldn't even notice.


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## NicoleB (Jul 21, 2011)

I am a female who has the audacity to make most of my posts outside the women's lounge 
mostly because its quiet here.

i've gotten sexist rep, and i've considered reporting it. Then again, sometimes i'm asking for it. When i go goofing off with the guys, some guys just DONT LIKE that. They'd let that behavior slide if it was another guy, but silly gross talk from a female? some just cant handle it. They should just treat me like the guys, but some dont. Its like they consider my humor as having a "motive". it doesnt. Anyone who knows me in real life is like, "oh thats just nicole!"

whatever, i've gone in and challenged them...on the boobie threads for example, try to keep it lighthearted, but give your opinion. Guys get scared by vocal ladies sometimes, and will probably try to neg you and call you a nagging wench. I dont know, i get stuck between just laughing at the misogynistic stuff and being mildly offended. To some degree, guys will be guys.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

OT, but thought some might like this story...

*Brazil: Pilot Ejects Passenger Over Sexist Remarks*

A Brazilian airline said Tuesday that one of its female pilots ejected a passenger from a flight because he was making sexist comments about women flying planes. Trip Airlines said in a statement the pilot ejected the man before takeoff on Friday as he made loud, sexist comments upon learning the pilot was a woman. The passenger, who was not identified, was met by police officers at the plane and escorted out of the Belo Horizonte airport. The jet continued on to the state of Goias after a one-hour delay. The airline said it would not tolerate disparaging remarks made about any of the 1,400 women working for it.

from World Briefing | The Americas
Brazil: Pilot Ejects Passenger Over Sexist Remarks


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## cigarlover (Oct 24, 2011)

Please forgive some of our counterparts ??? not all men are that way. But please feel free to smack them around a bit if needed.


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## bee (Apr 7, 2008)

It's truly unfortunate, but there are men on this forum that are making demeaning sexist threads. The problem is that there are probably about 90% men here and they post crude photos and make leud comments. Maybe they think that it is ok, or that there aren't any women in this forum. Doesn't matter. It is wrong.

Another very disturbing trend I am seeing is for some very high-count popular users on here to gang up on unpopular minority opinions from less high-count unpopular users. You see it every now and again. Some jerk posts a picture of a girl with her ass in the air and then 3-4 guys all pat the guy on the back for such a good picture. Then, when someone speaks out and says how wrong it is, that person gets shouted down. Strength in numbers I suppose. I call it bullying in numbers.


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## KarateChicken (Dec 11, 2005)

Sometimes those who are exposed end up showing an even more frightening mysoginistic side, to the point of wondering if they are actually a danger to Public Safety.

Such as the case is in this recent thread on the Front Range CO Forum: the thread in question


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## MtbRN (Jun 8, 2006)

KarateChicken said:


> Sometimes those who are exposed end up showing an even more frightening mysoginistic side, to the point of wondering if they are actually a danger to Public Safety.
> 
> Such as the case is in this recent thread on the Front Range CO Forum: the thread in question


Hmmm- a well-known pot-stirrer on the Colorado Front Range Forum trying to draw more people into a flame war. 
Just an FYI to folks who might think that incredible mess of a thread is worth reading...


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## KarateChicken (Dec 11, 2005)

MtbMetichi said:


> Hmmm- a well-known pot-stirrer on the Colorado Front Range Forum trying to draw more people into a flame war.
> Just an FYI to folks who might think that incredible mess of a thread is worth reading...


It is worth knowing if you are female and ride in or plan on riding in Colorado.

FTR, I contacted an upstanding female member of this forum before cross-posting and they actually offered to post it up. I didn't want to drag them into somting involving a sociopath like the creeper in question, so I posted it up.

JD


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## Ithnu (Feb 16, 2007)

bee said:


> It's truly unfortunate, but there are men on this forum that are making demeaning sexist threads. The problem is that there are probably about 90% men here and they post crude photos and make leud comments. Maybe they think that it is ok, or that there aren't any women in this forum. Doesn't matter. It is wrong.
> 
> Another very disturbing trend I am seeing is for some very high-count popular users on here to gang up on unpopular minority opinions from less high-count unpopular users. You see it every now and again. Some jerk posts a picture of a girl with her ass in the air and then 3-4 guys all pat the guy on the back for such a good picture. Then, when someone speaks out and says how wrong it is, that person gets shouted down. Strength in numbers I suppose. I call it bullying in numbers.


I wandered over here from the CO Front Range forums and I'll advise you to stay out of the KC vs XCguy fight unless you have a sense of humor. Most the us on the Front Range forums are a bunch of smart arses who don't take the Internet too seriously. And contrary to popular Internet culture, a lot of us know each other in person.

Anyway bee is very correct here, it's hard to fight the high post count folks. For some reason lots of posts seems to make everyone think your point is correct.

Over on RideMonkey the posting of borderline porn is far far worse; however they have tags to block NSFW pics (that require an extra click to see) that usually end up being scantly dressed girls. Not the greatest solution I know; but it is some type of moderation that allows me to read that site at work. Or if you are female to not be offended by random pictures.


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## xcguy (Apr 18, 2004)

(


KarateChicken said:


> FTR, I contacted an upstanding female member of this forum before cross-posting and they recognized me as the psycho stalker I really am. After reading that thread and seeing me in action, they didn't want to touch me with a ten foot pole)
> 
> Fixed it for ya.


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## miatagal96 (Jul 5, 2005)

I am lucky not to have come across a lot of crap. When I did, I'd just assume the person was a total jerk and moved on. After reading this thread, I will report stuff that I find obnoxiously degrading to women so other women (and men) don't have to read that crap (assuming the moderator removes it). 

Everyone has different tolerance levels. I tend to be very tolerant of good-natured joking and jabbing, but when I sense that the motivation is hate-based or the intent is to degrade, I lose my tolerance.


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## NicoleB (Jul 21, 2011)

the way i see it is, i am not surprised when a man points out a good looking female. we cant get bothered by that.

where i tend to fight back is (and this happened in the hot girls of mtb thread, since closed) are when a NORMAL girl is being called ugly or fat and generally being picked apart for not being perfect. Seriously, a normal thinnish girl (maybe size 4 tops?) was being judged for not being tight and muscular, and there were comments like "she needs to hit the gym". Seriously? or when girls are judged for not having big enough boobs, or washboard abs, etc. I'd like to see the perfect physiques of the men posting these, jeez. I will defend any woman being picked apart by her looks because all it does is add to the misery and eating disorders women face. So yeah, pointing out an attractive female? no problem. Picking apart a normal woman? i'll fight!


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## zazzafrazz (Apr 12, 2012)

xcguy said:


> ([QUOTE
> =KarateChicken;9426544]FTR, I contacted an upstanding female member of this forum before cross-posting and they recognized me as the psycho stalker I really am. After reading that thread and seeing me in action, they didn't want to touch me with a ten foot pole)
> 
> Fixed it for ya.


 okay thanks for "fixin' " it... now back to your cave.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

Yes.

http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/sh*t-should-not-tolerated-here-904528.html#post11079616


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

oh sorry, did not link the post. Here's one:

http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/woman-rides-fat-bike-south-pole-902687.html#post11054484

post #11 in the thread

there's probably a way to direct link, but not finding it for you.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

It looks like the offending post has finally been taken down, thank you to anyone who helped.


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## gabrielle (Jan 2, 2005)

Wow...the amount of tone policing in that thread is quite disappointing.

Meanwhile, I'm going to go ride my new bike 

gabrielle


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## kris7047th (Dec 27, 2013)

So sad (more like pathetic) that he chooses to be a cad. Jon's post is a standard AUP violation for most boards .. and I would assume here too. So where is the moderating?


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## kris7047th (Dec 27, 2013)

gabrielle said:


> Wow...the amount of tone policing in that thread is quite disappointing.
> 
> *Meanwhile, I'm going to go ride my new bike *
> 
> gabrielle


New bike .. Pics .. or it didn't happen 

Enjoy your ride.


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## mtbxplorer (Dec 25, 2009)

Well, that was interesting, 4000 views later - in one day- both my thread objecting to the posts, and the "press conference" that followed were sent to the Recyclebin after devolving to the lowest common denominator. Some people were supportive publicly or privately, and I thanked them individually and privately. Publicly, I thanked those supportive of an inclusive community after the offending posts were taken down, but otherwise stayed out of the fray. While I doubt that the loudest will be doing anything differently, hopefully some of the 4000 will sincerely consider how their posts will be perceived by women on MTBR, and others will just think the better of it. I really hope that MTBR starts paying more attention to the reported posts (see triangle links under each post), because this could have been resolved without all the spectacle over a week ago when I first reported the offensive post. The fact that it occurred in a thread about the first woman to cycle to the South Pole was particularly concerning.


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