# Who knows about OHV/Dirt Bikes?



## Haus Boss (Jun 4, 2010)

Yah, I know this is the DH/FR forum, but I also know a lotta DH/FR folks that also ride dirt bikes, so I thought a few of you should have some knowledge on the subject. 

I've never owned or ridden a dirt bike, but I'm thinking of buying a used one in the near future. I'd likely be hitting up Mendocino National Forest and Cow Mountain in NorCal which consist of a lot of big rolling hills with lots of hills climbs. I weight approx 190lb, wondering if a 200c - 250cc is a good place to start.


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## chup29 (Nov 28, 2006)

honda 230 with electric start... you can get them dirt cheap, they are amazing learner bikes, plenty of power but it comes on nice and slow so you can learn to manage the throttle easier - im about 190 and i started moto with that bike in the hollister hills which seems like similar terrain. for a beginner, its amazing, you dont have to futz with kickstarting, you just hit the button and go - dont go straight to a racing bike, too much power too quick for a beginner and the motors tend to be more high-strung and twitchy from my experience...


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## ak pura vida (Dec 15, 2008)

in my opinion i wouldn't waste time or money on a 230. you will out grow it so fast you will be bored and not be able to keep up with your buddies if they can ride at all. (honestly, that is what i would put my wife on who has never ridden and is not aggressive at all) 
2-strokes
if you are looking for a used bike, i would start with at least a 125. it will push you around find and you won't be able to out ride it in a week. but after a season or two you will be wanting more power. i hadn't road in a number of years and just got a 250 when i got back into it. felt fine right away. you might consider just getting a 250 to start. you can always use less power than what is available. you can never use more than what the bike has. if i were you i would try to ride both first. maybe some of your buddies have them? if the bike is in good working condition kick starting them is really a non issue.

4-strokes
i'm not a four stroke guy but if you can afford it, you might consider a 250 four stroke. they have a much different power band then 2-strokes. they are less peaky and have more torque so they _can be easier to ride. but not necessarily. unless you have a substantial amount to spend and can afford a fuel injected 4-stroke then you will have hot start issues when you dump the bike. 4-strokes can be a pita to start when they are hot. 2-strokes do not have this issue. good luck and enjoy. they are a kick in A!

pv_


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## fourtyounce (May 2, 2006)

I had quads before I decided to get a dirt bike. A 250 2-stroke is the way to go unless you're 12, then I would then recommend a 125. If there are hills to be climbed, nothing says FUN like a 2-stroke. Don't waste money on a "beginner" bike. The learning curve is much smaller on a 250 because it has so much power and that power is only a detriment if you are careless. My opinion is aimed at the person that is actually going to ride regularly (weekly). 

As far as 4-strokes go, I have no experience with them outside of quads, and once you smell some Klotz R50 premix burning up, you'll be hooked on 2-strokes.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

For a first bike I would not get a 250 two stroke, especially not one of the Jap MX ones. They are all really snappy and not easy for a new person to ride.

I think you should start with a 125 two stroke or a 250F four stroke. Perhaps a KTM 200 two stroke would be the best idea.

Two stroke will be cheaper and way less maintenance. I replaced the top end on my 250 XC ktm for $150..the same thing on my 450 would be near a grand + way more work.

Get something small to start with, will make you better rider and you wont tire as fast having to much power you can't control.

Cheap Kawi KDX 200 would be good to learn on. or a KTM 200 ( costs way more though )

PS The fastest offroad/cross country racer where I live rides a KTM 150. So its the rider not the bike normally


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## NorKal (Jan 13, 2005)

Whatever you decide to get, you are in one the best areas for dirtbiking. Middle Creek is just awesome and I've heard Stonyford is too.


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## Haus Boss (Jun 4, 2010)

Not sure when this dirt bike pipe dream will become a reality, but Elk Mountain/Middle Creek is a big part of the reason I wanna get a bike. I've seen footage of people riding Sled Ridge Trail above middle creek on downhill bikes. I'm hoping to drag my Santa Cruz Butcher up there with a couple of friends this fall and do some shuttle runs.


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## essenmeinstuff (Sep 4, 2007)

XR250R 

/thread


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## Internal14 (Jan 21, 2004)

Khemical said:


> Whatever you decide to get, you are in one the best areas for dirtbiking. Middle Creek is just awesome and I've heard Stonyford is too.


Stony is great. Can't beat it for the vastness of it all.

When I got back into riding I picked up a four year old 4-stroke which is a `00 YZ426F that a buddy of mine was racing hare scrambles with. He was lighter, but faster, so the suspension settled right in for me. The trigger was a bit much at first, but let me tell you, you get used to that power real fast.
I went with a KTM450EXC as my recent bike and it's much mellower allowing me to rip trail for 6-8hours before being completely exhausted where the YZ wore me out in 3-4. 
Depending on the race courses I'll still use that Yamaha that's over ten years old now. Those YZ's were/are bombproof.

As for getting a 250 4-stroke, I'd veer away from anything that's more than a few years old. The smaller bore 4-strokes tend to get wrung out more often=more wear and tear.

The 250 2-stroke TRAIL bike version of the KTM or the Kawi's aren't bad though as they're meant to have some grunt down low, but still not as flawless as a big bore thumper.

Get a bike and hit me up! My trail riding buddy killed his bike a few months ago and hasn't found the funds to put it back together, so I'm getting tired of riding alone!


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## Mr. Blonde (May 18, 2008)

The displacement is less critical than the gearing IMO. Get something with a nice wide XC gear range and you'll have no problem controlling the bike. That would explain the discrepancy in opinions here.


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## Archi-Magus (Feb 22, 2010)

I say jump head first into the 250cc or 450cc motocross bike. After a day of experience you will thank yourself for doing so. If you're going two stroke get a 250 and if you're going four I personally wouldn't ride anything but a 450, but I know guys that ride and love their 250 four strokes.

Avoid the air cooled, slow, four stroke, grandpa bikes like the plague (i.e. xr's). You will hate it when the 7 year old neighbor kid smokes you on his ktm 65sx, and I'm not exaggerating, that little kid bike would smoke you if you were on any XR smaller than a 400. But even the big ones are nothing compared to the motocross bikes. Do yourself a favor and get the full blown motocross bike.


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

^
|
|

Lol

Although those 65 KTM SX's are faster than **** by the way! 6 speed they haul.


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## rmb_mike (Jun 12, 2007)

I'm failing to understand all the 125cc two stroke hate. I weigh about 160 lbs and a 125 still has enough power to almost pull me right off of it. 
Are they ridiculously similar in frame size and weight? 
If the 125 doesn't have enough juice, you do know you can rejet the carb, put a hot pipe on it and even a 144 big bore kit. 
The only advantage I would see having a 250 over a 125 is if they are pretty much shoehorned into the same frame. Otherwise you have the lightness and flickability advantage of the 125.


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## Tkul (Mar 1, 2007)

Yes, KTMDirtface putted some good options!
KDX200 althought it is very old design!
KTM200 

For a new bike I would look on new 4 strokes:
If you have the money a new Yamaha WR250R + a set of good tires
KDX250 is a good option (although this are more Trail bike!)

These two bikes are road legal in the US - I think.... were I live, almost every bike can have a licence plate...

Second hand:

XR400 / 250 but the little one has limit power and you soon get bored...
KDX300 - liquid cooled bike
TTR250 - I don't know if it exists over there... same thing has the XR250!

PS - i think manufactures are not making real good dirt bikes for the weekend! Not everyone likes to dissasemble the engine every xx hours! Or have a seat hard as rock!
A Good Weekend Trail/Enduro must have - good engine (torque in almost every rev), good suspensions (but not that Hyppe!), low maintenance! kick and electrical start!!!! 6 speed with the 6th a bit longer for commuting (home-trails!)
that is my opinion...

DR400 I think would be a good one to start! Electric start... good engine, suspension can be upgarded latter.


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## rmb_mike (Jun 12, 2007)

Tkul said:


> PS - i think manufactures are not making real good dirt bikes for the weekend! Not everyone likes to dissasemble the engine every xx hours! Or have a seat hard as rock!


I'm not discounting your beef, but if you don't have at least a simple understanding of how to do basic maintenance on a dirt bike, you shouldn't own one. 
Besides, a 2 stroke engine is stupid simple compared to a 4 stroke. 
Plus, it's not like dirt bikes are so complex that you need an engineering degree to fix them.

I'm not a mechanic by any means but I managed to swap out a manual transmission from my 1989 Acura Integra, in my car port using nothing but two jacks, two jack stands and simple hand tools.

It's never a good idea when you have zero clue about how the equipment you use, works.


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## Archi-Magus (Feb 22, 2010)

Tkul, every newer dirt bike out there is just about bullet proof. I can do anything with my '06 cr250 and it will put up with it with no complaint what so ever. That's the thing I love about moto, the bikes are TOUGH.

rmb_mike, I'm not hating on the 125, they're good bikes, but they have a different kind of power. They're totally lacking any bottom and usually void of mid as well and the TS is looking for something that would be good on the trails. A bike that he has to run all out all the time isn't the bike for him. A 250 or bigger will let him putt around with minimal rpm's if he needs to.


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## rmb_mike (Jun 12, 2007)

Archi-Magus said:


> Tkul, every newer dirt bike out there is just about bullet proof. I can do anything with my '06 cr250 and it will put up with it with no complaint what so ever. That's the thing I love about moto, the bikes are TOUGH.
> 
> rmb_mike, I'm not hating on the 125, they're good bikes, but they have a different kind of power. They're totally lacking any bottom and usually void of mid as well and the TS is looking for something that would be good on the trails. A bike that he has to run all out all the time isn't the bike for him. A 250 or bigger will let him putt around with minimal rpm's if he needs to.


Ahhh...I see. It's pretty much the same reason I'm getting a CBR1000RR next year instead of a 600RR. The 600 is a great bike with a great engine but the 1000 will have better low-mid range power and won't be as stressed as the 600 to achieve the same power level.

That said, if I wanted to get a dirt bike to just put around on the trails, I'd consider a bigger 4 stroke.


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## Guest (Aug 28, 2010)

With your size and inexperience, get a 4-stroke something over 400cc. It'll go anywhere you point it.


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## dd13 (Oct 6, 2005)

sorry to highjack a thread but im in a similar position now,i have riding experience but its been about 10 years and the problem is i have been 5'6" for 10 years (im 22).I have been considering,but would rather not, going with a quad...any other short riders out there riding mx bikes successfully. Ill primarily be riding in the woods (in Pa)


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## trlrdr (Apr 11, 2006)

dd13 said:


> sorry to highjack a thread but im in a similar position now,i have riding experience but its been about 10 years and the problem is i have been 5'6" for 10 years (im 22).I have been considering,but would rather not, going with a quad...any other short riders out there riding mx bikes successfully. Ill primarily be riding in the woods (in Pa)


ktm 200 xc would be great but cost a little more ,as for thinking your to short dont, but you can always have it lowered by a suspension guy .since you have xperience .youll have a blast either way .what part of pa?also an older yamaha wr 250 or 450 w/elec.start. dont get a 125 there not as easy to ride .


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## trlrdr (Apr 11, 2006)

$$$ it all depends on how much you want to spend but a ktm 200xc or 250 xc is a great choice but $$. You can pik up a used yamaha wr 250 or 450 ,or a 250 or 450 honda crf x there like big teddybears easy to ride and in stock form bulletproof , they have throttle stops that can be altered or replaced to get some easy performance ..but when it comes time to make them really faster theres lots of mods you can do ,my buddy has an 05yamaha wr 450 and he had some offroad suspension work done and put on a pipe and took off all the smog stuff and it runs like a raped ape now .IT RIPS! stay away from anything smaller youll out grow the bike to quickly,even as a begginer if you have mountain bike skills youll pick it up quick.just remember good helmet, goggles,chest protector,riding pants ,and a good pair of boots, oh yeah and{ Good Knee protection },and not those cheap ones evs makes several levels so does asterisk to pick from .[ $$ Dress 4 the crash not the ride] happy trails


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## ajd245246 (Sep 1, 2008)

I'd suggest getting a 250 2-stroke, for a few reasons. 

1.) As stated above, for trail riding you will be able to achieve the same power as say a 125 without putting the engine all out all the time.
2.) They are WAY easier to maintain, costs included. If you are a beginner rider then you'll probably have some spills and the dollar figure attached to the four stroke would be insane.
3.) I weigh under 150 and have ridden many my buddies 125 all the time, it's really not a lot of power, unless you mod it.


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## DHidiot (Aug 5, 2004)

A green sticker 200 or 250 two-stroke is the cheapest way to get into the sport that gives you the most access in the state of CA.


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## NorKal (Jan 13, 2005)

dd13 said:


> ...any other short riders out there riding mx bikes successfully.


 Ricky Carmichael and James Stewart were/are pretty successful and they are supposedly both 5'6".

There are ways to lower a bike with linkages, lower seats, etc.


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## trlrdr (Apr 11, 2006)

Khemical is absolutly correct look at jeff ward he was another guy that was short and i dont know if i ever saw a cut down seat but linkages and springs wer definatly used .


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## RallySoob (Aug 16, 2010)

Im not even gonna read this thread. I read the 1st few posts and almost puked...

Your gonna want a nice 4 stroke for woods stuff unless you are a 2-stroke MX racer type of guy and most people arent. If you were I would say get a CR250 or equivelant 2-stroke.

If you wanna save money you can try an older yz426 (01-04) but I think any of the newer 04+ 450's would be your best bet. Prepare to spend 2K to 3.5K depending how nice you want to go. 

If you get anything smaller than a 400 stroke you will outgrow it and hate yourself for buying it. I promise... Get a 450 or an older yz426 for around 1500-2K if you have too


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## Tkul (Mar 1, 2007)

Well when I said low maintenance I think I didn't make myself clear.
I own at the moment a Fazer600 with more than 100.000 kms. This bike has covered almost anything from long distance travels, to circuit riding and daily use and as low maintenance! On all these years I changed a clutch and nothing more, besides chains, sprockets, tires, disc pads, bla, bla, bla!

My brother with a XR250 had some problems but also solved - and I consider a XR (250/400/600) a bike with good reability!
KTMs, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki/Kawa and almost every brand with the new generation of four strokes high rev single piston aren't for weekend warriors!
Yes you may have a master in mechanic (not mechanical engineering – these guys learn theory, not how to fix bikes!) and work in a shop... bla, bla, bla!

But at the end of year what matters is the time spent ridding your bike, and not around it!
And yes, you can put at a shop, but it will bloody expensive!
Because if you ride it has they are designed, things get really exciting... and expensive!

2 strokes with some bore (>200cc) are OK if you don't mind the oil smell and mixing oil and gas!
I love both!
I had a 125 bored to almost 140 or something and it was fun! With great reability!
But a 250 I think it is a bit over the head for someone that is inexperience...


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## RallySoob (Aug 16, 2010)

hmm. your bored out 125 2-stroke was reliable but somehow you think new 4 stroke 450's arent?

I'm confused because I am no mechanic, I mean I suck at taking things apart lol, but I have (2) 4-stroke 450 honda's (quads) and they perform awesome still, never required anything more than an oil change. The CR250 on the other hand was almost all stock and needed a new top end every summer soley because its a 2 stroke.

The new 4strokes aren't what you think...They are EXTREMELY reliable in stock form and will last multiple years with just oil changes if you do them frequently.

We ride our modded trx450's about 20-30 trips a year, alot more than normal people ride and no problems yet knock on wood.

So you know I'm not bs'in, here are my bikes, pics taken throughout this riding season:


































































The Red one is my buddy's bike which has a 471 stroker crank, hi-comp 13.5:1 piston and a HC3 cam. It runs like a champ year to year also


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## RIS (Nov 4, 2009)

Husaberg FS650e. Definitely.















Or a TM 660 SMX:









Or an Aprilia SXV 550 VDB:









Or a KTM 560SMR:









Or a Vertemati SR600:









Or a Husqvarna NOX:









Or a Husky SMR 630:









Or just a plain old garden-variety Japanese 450:


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## Tkul (Mar 1, 2007)

Well I never had a problem... 
Of course it had a lot of taking care... compared with my Fazer! Hell at this moment I don't have time to maintain bikes!

On the other hand my brother with a Aprilia RS125 that raced for a year (±34hp) had a lot of problems... maybe because it was Italian! eheheh!

Of topic - Nice quads!

Well regarding 4 strokes, high revs, I see the problems that my dirt group had. Maybe they were unfortenate!
Several years without changing pistons, and valves? What says the shop manual?

We don't ride with those flags... are those for saftey!?!?

PS I think we lost the track on this post! Go with a 200 cc 2 stroke with low HP!

Afterwards, if you need power, go with the ATK 2 stroke! By the way, ATK bought Cannondale Motorcycles, right?
Never saw an ATK but always loved them! The ATK 406 with disc brake mounted in the sproket location, and their system to avoid chain tension messing suspension!... and the rear suspension has the same design has todays KTM!

https://www.fezone.com/atk/atk-9.jpg


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## RIS (Nov 4, 2009)

Did you say ATK two stroke?

How about the 700 Intimidator SM:









I'm sure it won't kill you more than once...


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## RallySoob (Aug 16, 2010)

those are some awesome bikes!


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

My Quiver: the 250XC smoker is by far my favorite. my 450 is fun on the dunes/supermoto it sucks for trail riding and the maintenance on it is annoying and expensive.
2007 KTM 950 Super Enduro


2008 KTM 250XC









2004-2006 frankenbike KTM 450SX


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## essenmeinstuff (Sep 4, 2007)

RallySoob said:


> If you get anything smaller than a 400 stroke you will outgrow it and hate yourself for buying it. I promise... Get a 450 or an older yz426 for around 1500-2K if you have too


IMO, if you are a beginner, something like a 250 4 stroke is perfect for cutting your teeth on. When I started riding dirt bike, XR250R was the best all-round beginner bike out there, neutral handling, enough power to keep things interesting not enough to get you into too much trouble too quickly. (replaced by the CRF250 shows my age eh)

Ride that for a year or so until you can ride a bike properly, less power forces you to ride better to be fast, anyone can twist a throttle and shift a bit, but carrying speed because you have to teaches you a lot about riding.

Then move onto something with more herb when you can handle it safely.

I had a CR250, I was completely comfortable riding it and didn't think it was *that* powerful. Some of my buddies wanted to have a go on it, I gave them a run through on the basics and sent the off to try it. They all 1) put the thing down at some point due to the power delivery, and 2) were $hit scared of motor cycles after that...

Mind you around here (NA) the attitude of starting small and working your way up to something bigger doesn't seem to be the thing to do, and people with zero bike experience run off and buy a hyabusa or some sort of 1000cc race bike and smash into a parked car on the first corner.

Short of a straight line take off, I have not seen many people on street bikes here that have any business riding the bikes they do... but what ever.


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## KTMDirtFace (Aug 7, 2008)

essenmeinstuff said:


> IMO, if you are a beginner, something like a 250 4 stroke is perfect for cutting your teeth on. When I started riding dirt bike, XR250R was the best all-round beginner bike out there, neutral handling, enough power to keep things interesting not enough to get you into too much trouble too quickly. (replaced by the CRF250 shows my age eh)
> 
> Ride that for a year or so until you can ride a bike properly, less power forces you to ride better to be fast, anyone can twist a throttle and shift a bit, but carrying speed because you have to teaches you a lot about riding.
> 
> Then move onto something with more herb when you can handle it safely.


This!

Guy speaks the wisdoms.

The fastest guys are smooth, and will kick everyones butt on smaller bikes because of it.


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## wormvine (Oct 27, 2005)

I got back into Dirtbiking in 98. 
What did I get? A used KX250. I dealt with it and it was powerful. Then the engine blewup and I had to spend $900 to get it completely rebuilt. Then it was really powerful.
I changed the gearing to be more mellow and that helped power delivery tremendously. 
So keep in mind that gearing is very important... 

I sold the KX250 a few years ago and only recently picked up a 2008 WR450F.
It is a sweet bike and the power delivery is super smooth and long. It has more power than I need for sure. I ride Colorado jeep roads and tight single track.

A couple things to keep in mind. And some of my opinions...
A 450 four-stroke is a bit heavier than a 250 two-stroke. 30-50lbs.
Mixing gas sucks. 
A TT-R230 or CRF230 (late model XR250) would be a great bike to learn and explore on and will have excellent resale value. Plus both bikes engines are bombproof. There are a ton for sale on craiglook.com and will take you just about anywhere.
Electric start is nice when learning. XR's do not have electric start OEM. And most 2-strokes don't as well.
2 strokes are easier to kick start but my WR450 is super easy. Easier than the KX250. FWIW. Most newer 4-strokes have a hot start lever anyway. It was an issue in 2000 but not so much in 2010.

All dirt bikes are very high maintenance IMO. Both 2 stroke and 4 strokes need their oil changes regularly. Both can have coolant systems. Both have chains and sprockets and linkage systems that all need to be lubed and maintained. 

The only difference I see is engine maintenance. Two strokes have no valves so they need no adjustments but 4-stroke valve adjustment intervals will depend on the bike and the usage. And the person.


2 strokes need new pistons every season ideally and it is not exactly simple for a beginner to pop the cylinder and replace the piston. Valve adjustments are probably easier if you follow the owners manual. If you have the tools and aptitude to replace your own 2stroke top end, you can adjust the valves on a 4 stroke. 4 strokes need new pistons but not as often IME. 
Very few people will work on the bottom end of an engine. 

Valve adjustments can be done quickly at any dealer for a reasonable price once or twice a season if you don't want to do it yourself. So not too big a deal. Parts for a 4 stroke engine seem to be more expensive. 

A carb is a carb is a carb... Both bikes have them and they are a pain to setup but JD jetting kits make that a whole lot easier.
It is harder to get at a 450 4-stoke carb than a 250 2-stroke due to the cramped chassis.

Make sure the suspension is setup for your weight and riding style.
This is soooooo important. A bike that was plush for a 250# rider with be like a bucking bronco to a 150lb rider of equal ability.

Biased opinions are rampant in the moto world, just like mtbikes), so read up and make a decision. Websites like Thumpertalk and Advrider are grate places to data mine.


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## RIS (Nov 4, 2009)

essenmeinstuff said:


> IMO, if you are a beginner, something like a 250 4 stroke is perfect for cutting your teeth on.
> 
> Mind you around here (NA) the attitude of starting small and working your way up to something bigger doesn't seem to be the thing to do, and people with zero bike experience run off and buy a hyabusa or some sort of 1000cc race bike and smash into a parked car on the first corner.
> 
> Short of a straight line take off, I have not seen many people on street bikes here that have any business riding the bikes they do... but what ever.


It's actually spelled "Hayabusa".

My first bike was an unrestricted 2000 model year Hayabusa:










I got my permit, bought it new at the dealer, aced my DMV parking lot test on it, and got my endorsement. Within a few months, I was out doing wheelies and stoppies with my friends. At about one year, my wife and I did a 2000+ mile weekend on it (for our honeymoon) to Laguna Seca. A year or so after that, I used it for my novice road racing school, and earned my expert road racing license after my first weekend. Shortly after that, I was asked to serve as a road racing instructor.

I really don't think that the Hayabusa slowed my learning curve, and I didn't smash into any parked car on the first corner. In fact, I've never crashed in any corner.

The truth is, that even on a Hayabusa, the throttle is the LEAST powerful control. The brakes and handlebars are capable of generating much greater forces than the throttle. The reason that people crash is usually not a throttle problem. It's usually a steering problem or a braking problem.

A motorcycle can only do three things: stop, turn, and go. In order to stand a good chance of continuing to turn oxygen into carbon dioxide, you need to be able to perform all three of those things to a survivable degree of competency. And in my experience, more than 90% of motorcyclists are not capable of doing two of those three things (braking and turning) well enough to have any role in their own survival. They are only alive because no one has killed them yet.

And the answer is not to get a slow bike. The throttle works both ways. If you're having problems with the throttle, you're also going to have huge problems with the handlebars and the brakes. Sucking on an EX250 or a Harley doesn't make you a better rider if and when you graduate to something better.

And practice (in and of itself) is not the answer either- sucking for a long time doesn't make you any better. A lot of very "experienced" motorcyclists are simply folks who have become very comfortable at sucking, but have never actually learned how to ride.

The answer is to actually learn how to ride, and then to practice actual riding skills until they become muscle memory.

Code's school uses the BMW S1000RR for it's students. To put that into perspective for those who don't know about stuff like this, here is a short video of a nearly stock S1000RR. The valve cover has never been off this bike:


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## essenmeinstuff (Sep 4, 2007)

Thanks for the spell check there ris, the world is whole again.

While you seem to have gotten on well with your bike, that does not mean its the same for everyone.

The answer is to learn, as you have stated.

The question I have for you, is it better to learn on a little 250, or on a 1000cc race bike?

Why is it that "traditionally" racers move up the rank in capacity rather than going straight into a super bike, or a F1 car? 

Is it better to hone your skills at 50mph with 20hp or learn that same mistake at 150mph with 160hp?

I'd start small, but thats me. As I stated earlier, "IMO".


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## charging_rhinos (Jul 29, 2008)

I raced mx for many years from junior high until I was in my early 20s. I picked up mtn biking as a substitute ahen I got too poor to ride mx. I still think of riding every day though. Man, it was fun.

As a suggestion, I'd go with a four stroke 250 race bike. As stated earlier, you don't want to get a bike that you'll master within a week and nit be able to progress further. A 250F would be plenty of usable power, cheaper than a 450 and more rideable, and would allow you years of progression. I would say don't go with an enduro style bike if you plan on jumping or doing any sort of heavier riding though. Bikes like Honda's XR line or some KTMs out there are fine trail bikes, but their handling will be slower and their power will be less than a race style bike. I had an XR and hated it after a year because it sucked when I wanted to just go out and play ride and jump off stuff. The bike just wasn't designed for that and it performed horribly when I forced it to. Race bikes will do it all, are usually lighter and handle better. No contest in my experience.
Just my opinion.


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## essenmeinstuff (Sep 4, 2007)

I should add that when I say "XR250" I'm showing my age, and at the time I was riding (mid-late 90's) the XR250/400/600 were the only "decent" 4 strokes around where all MX was dominated by 2 strokes.

And yeah they are more trail oriented (compare to the MX bike at the time, the CR series).

So where I say "XR" I mean the current incarnation of what that bike was, and that is the CRF250.

Don't look at the lower capacity CRF models they are a much lower tech bike.


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## RIS (Nov 4, 2009)

My first choice for a dirt bike would be something around 600cc from Europe, with a 16.5" front wheel, but all fun and games aside, my choice may not be your choice.

A great standby for general off-road use is the BRP (Big Red Pig). They're not expensive to buy and to maintain, they're about 50 horsepower (uncorked), and you can't kill them. Honda has won the Baja 1000 about 13 times in a row, and about 9 of those were the BRP.

...and with 17" wheels and sticky rubber, they're more fun than giving two toys to three kids.


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## ajd245246 (Sep 1, 2008)

If you want a well rounded bike that can go from trail riding to the race track, the KX 250 is the way to go....


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## RIS (Nov 4, 2009)

ajd245246 said:


> If you want a well rounded bike that can go from trail riding to the race track, the KX 250 is the way to go....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


...except that Kawasaki hasn't sold the KX250 in the U.S. for about five years now, and two-smoke MX bikes age like something from the "faces of meth" video.

A 19" rear wheel, close-ratio transmission, no flywheel weight, no headlight, no tail light, no battery, no charging system, and no side stand do not make for a very friendly trail bike.


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## ajd245246 (Sep 1, 2008)

RIS said:


> ...except that Kawasaki hasn't sold the KX250 in the U.S. for about five years now, and two-smoke MX bikes age like something from the "faces of meth" video.
> 
> A 19" rear wheel, close-ratio transmission, no flywheel weight, no headlight, no tail light, no battery, no charging system, and no side stand do not make for a very friendly trail bike.


First off, what does where they are selling it matter; if i was a new rider I would never buy a brand new bike anyway. And are you from green peace  , how does the smokey-ness of the bike have to do with how it performs.

You're never going to get a bike that is GREAT for both worlds, trail and track. Yes it is primarily a track bike, hence the 19" rear wheel, no lights, and no side stand, which if you really wanted you could make very easily. Did you not watch my link!?  Those hills were huge for a 2-stroke! Granted the rider is what makes the bike capable to do what it does. I was just showing what the bike can do to it's full potential. Am I a bit biased... Yes, my friend has had his since 1998 with no problems whatsoever. If they are maintained well they will last a lifetime.


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