# What's up with road bikers who think cyclocross bikes are for singletrack?



## newenglandrocks (Dec 5, 2006)

Last weekend I was driving my daughter back from her soccer game when I spotted a friend of mine shouldering his cross bike with neither tire mounted on their respective wheels. He was riding mellow singletrack and his bike wasn't up to the task. 

Another road friend pings me on email and says that after a few years of trying he realizes his cross bike isn't cutting in the woods and he wants advice on getting a full suspension mountain bike. 

Then this morning I get going for a really mellow ride and someone rides up right behind me and wishes me good morning. It wasn't one of my local riding buddies or Strava "celebrities" but a friend who rides mainly road and instead of replacing his 1990s era mountain bike with a modern tool he is on a cyclocross bike. He decides to follow me on a rooty and rocky but still pretty mellow singletrack and I gave him grief for having the wrong tool. I also predicted that even going slow, in about 50 feet I was going to ride away from him. Sure enough, it happened just like I figured it would. 

What's up with road bikers thinking cross bikes are suitable for singletrack? Cross bikes existed at the birth of mountain bikes and the early mountain bike pioneers immediately realized that was an evolutionary path that was dead to them. The only resemblance that cross bikes have to modern trail bikes are bits of technology they are borrowing from mountain biking - disc brakes, 1x drive trains, thru axles, etc. 

I'm not a road or cross bike hater - I used to ride 10K miles a year back when I was a cat 3 racer and my favorite races to watch in person are cross races. I just can't figure out why road bikers avoid buying mountain bikes for singletrack. It's just weird.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

I know a guy who lives in Ma, and he can and would (he does) be able to go anywhere you go, on his CX bike with skinnies

a) outride you
b) out run you
c) smoke a Marlboro, let you catch up and pass (true story, 1 cig a day)
d) finish his butt, and then catch and pass you
e) anywhere

*
run what ya brung is my mantra*

why rag on CX bikes ? so what...they are totally welcome on the trails,
it means that someone has hardened up...much appreciated in the world of MTB riding trail homogenizers we see too often nowadays


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## newenglandrocks (Dec 5, 2006)

I don't doubt that he could but for the vast majority of average guys like me, they will be walking more than riding their cross bikes. I am ragging on the decision, not the bikes. The bikes are great for some venues, not others. I love my singlespeed, but would never take it to a bike park, for instance. BTW - send me your friend's Strava username - I'll have to compare. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

IMO, a cross bike is a more practical road bike for most people. If you commute, they deal better with the obstacles and realities of commuting, vs. a straight road bike. More versatility. If you only take your bike out on weekends on group rides, then a straight road bike is for you.

Never encountered any of what you are talking about though.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

Funny. On mellow singletrack, I have passed/out ridden many a mtb'er on their fully with their Enduro (trademark) gear. What's up with mountainbikers? Seriously, a CX-type bike can be ridden fast on singletrack with eh right gearing/tires and the right pilot. Its not a substitute for a mtb and they have limits. I ride mine often in a park that has both gravel roads and mtb trails and its fun to be able to ride both and maybe that is what they are doing? I don't know any roadies that have this issue.


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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

What's the difference what type of bike you ride on what type of trail as long as you are out enjoying two wheels, who gives a rats ass what you are on.


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## mik_git (Feb 4, 2004)

newenglandrocks said:


> The bikes are great for some venues, not others. I love my singlespeed, but would never take it to a bike park, for instance. BTW


and then some people take their cyclo cross bike to the bike park...






guess the thing is, some people like a challenge, some people maybe bought a cross bike for some duties and want to see how well it goes on trails, or figure it will hone their skills or something. If they want to do it, fine by me, better than an ebike.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

I've seen some people out on our singletrack who didn't have a bike at all! Can you imagine?


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## life behind bars (May 24, 2014)

They're on two wheels in the dirt, what's not to like?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Sometimes riding involves pavement, dirt roads and single track. A CX bike is a lot fun for that combination.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

Here you go..a little fun on my CruX.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

What's up with airline food anyway?


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Depends with your singletrack is like.


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

I'm primarily a mountain biker that sometimes rides a cx on single track.


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## chazpat (Sep 23, 2006)

I bought my CX so I could commute occasionally to work, all the way from home. I'd commuted on my road bike by driving part way to a "safe to ride" area, parking and riding in the past. And I was riding to single track from my house on my mountain bikes.
It just so happens, the singletrack connects down to the parking lot where I would park to commute. So I realized I could string it all together and ride from home by using the single track. But the commute is probably 2 miles single track and 8 miles road so I decided to get a cyclocross bike rather than riding a mt bike. This also allows me to leave from home and cut through to addition road riding rather than loading my bike into the car and driving.

Plus I like a challenge and new experiences. It's not always about how fast you can go down the trail.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

I think my CruX handles much like the '90s mtbs did that I rode when I started...twitchy handling and slammed forward body positioning...and maybe that's why I can ride mine well offroad.


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

I was expecting those replies  - I recently got a CX bike, I love it.. first day I took it to a very light ST with not much climbing, it is a different animal but so much fun! I can ride it on my Rail Trails and keep myself off traffic when riding around town. Everyone should have CX bike. 

That video looks like a blast btw! 

DJ said it best though.


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

Nat said:


> I've seen some people out on our singletrack who didn't have a bike at all! Can you imagine?


They don't even know!

:lol


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

27.5 minus is coming. And it's gonna take over.


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## Procter (Feb 3, 2012)

I'm with Stoch and A1an.

I never road-biked in my life until I bought a cross bike. I bought a cross bike because I wanted a new challenge on the same old trails. In SF Bay we have lots of small trail systems with CX-able routes through, all a stone's throw from each other - chaining them together for epic rides is a completely new challenge.

https://www.strava.com/activities/739998754


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## newenglandrocks (Dec 5, 2006)

stochastic said:


> Late to the party but what's really weird is that you assume that folks riding cross bikes on singletrack are roadies. I get it. You lack the skills to ride those trails on a cross bike. Sometimes riders like to mix things up and challenge themselves.
> 
> It's not weird even if it causes myopic folks like you some serious consternation.


Wow - the name calling and assumptions!

Note that in my original post that I mentioned three examples of people I knew. In that group of about 100 people, which is all roadies, I would say more than half of the folks own cross bikes. Less than 10% own mountain bikes.

I also am amused that you say that I lack the skills to ride those trails on a cross bike, when you don't know my local trails at all, and you don't know anything about my bike handling skills.

FWIW, last year, after 20+ years of riding clipless, last season I took the plunge and changed to flat pedals. Nothing like going from cleaning trails 100% of the time to basically having to relearn how to ride every uphill obstacle and spending 6+ months trying to figure out how to get both wheels into the air without being clipped in. I guess that doesn't count as mixing it up and challenging myself, though.


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## Nat (Dec 30, 2003)

Stopbreakindown said:


> They don't even know!
> 
> :lol


They're all cruising along in their hiking boots wondering how the heck people can be doing the same in their running shoes...


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## tims5377 (Oct 20, 2010)

I don't care who it is. If i see another person on the trails that is not riding the exact same bike as me and wearing all the same gear I follow them around and tell them they have a lumpy butt until they leave the park.


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## baker (Jan 6, 2004)

I occasionally ride my cyclocross bikes on singletrack. It can be fun, but I prefer my mountain bikes. The few times I've seen other cyclocross bikes on the trail, the riders have been fast and competent.

Earlier this year, I rode 7 of my bikes over the same 1 mile singletrack loop (twisty and a bit rocky). I tried to maintain a similar level of effort for each lap. Here are there times...

Motobecane Lurch (fatbike) - 7:35 
Groundup (SS cyclocross) - 7:43 
Surly Crosscheck (cyclocross) - 8:06 
Redline Monocog (SS 29er) - 7:12 
Flyxii (carbon hardtail) - 7:27 
Santa Cruz Heckler (long travel FS 650b) - 7:12 
Titus Rockstar (FS 29er) - 7:16

The two cyclocross bikes were slowest and riding the Crosscheck on that terrain was just irritating. Interestingly, when I include the dirt road back and forth to the trail (0.2 miles), the cyclocross bikes faired much better.

To each their own...


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## AllMountin' (Nov 23, 2010)

This is what I don't understand about the 'wanted more challenge' argument:

I've been riding trails for six years. Met thousands of riders on likely hundreds of trails. The number of them riding any one of those trails to it's potential... the number of them who had mastered their craft well enough to need an external challenge... it's zero. 

The challenge you seek is within, and I've got to believe that self improvement is far more gratifying in the long term, than external self limitation. 

Or maybe I've not yet reached the point of enlightenment?


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

newenglandrocks said:


> In that group of about 100 people, which is all roadies, I would say more than half of the folks own cross bikes. Less than 10% own mountain bikes.


WGAS??



newenglandrocks said:


> I also am amused that you say that I lack the skills to ride those trails on a cross bike, when you don't know my local trails at all, and you don't know anything about my bike handling skills.


Glad you're amused. But as Giant Turd said, you just defined yourself as the type of roadie snoot that you somehow don't see yourself as...you're just riding a mountain bike.



newenglandrocks said:


> FWIW, last year, after 20+ years of riding clipless, last season I took the plunge and changed to flat pedals. Nothing like going from cleaning trails 100% of the time to basically having to relearn how to ride every uphill obstacle and spending 6+ months trying to figure out how to get both wheels into the air without being clipped in. I guess that doesn't count as mixing it up and challenging myself, though.


If you have been pulling up on your pedals to bunnyhop for the past twenty years, you must be one of those guys that looks like a doof, doing squat lifts to get his bike over 6 inch logs, all the while running the risk of clipping his front wheel on whatever it is they're pathetically trying to clear, and or yanking their feet out of the pedals and jamming their junk on the top tube when they come down. I can bunny hop UP four steps with flat pedals. The mechanics of bunnyhopping with flat pedals and clipless aren't exclusive to one another.

I also would ride my cross bike on the trails while I still had one. Heck, me and a racing buddy would ride our road bikes with 25's on our local rocky trails...just because. Did we have current mountain bikes at the time? Yup. But we just enjoyed being good at riding, and doing it just because we could. Just to change things up. Multiple times we rode trail on our road bikes in he middle of 80 plus mile road rides. It was a way to link two areas.

On the other hand, we'd leave our visors on our helmets and bunny hop our road bikes to clear the fallen tree debris in the road on the fast local road training rides. That was funny to us in the opposite direction of what has your panties wadded up...we'd do it just to twist up the roadie snoots that we'd end up dropping most of during the rides anyway, who were too busy slapping their asses, pointing and swerving all over the place. Heck, sometimes we'd even do the local double pace line rides on our cross bikes!! That must really upset your apple cart.

And frankly, this mountain vs. roadie BS isn't even really a thing anymore. A rider is a rider is a rider. Some are good, and some suck. Often the exclusive snoots...suck.



GiantTurd said:


> You just admitted you have poor handling skills, fyi.


Amen brother.


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## rogsim (May 4, 2012)

Who cares. Let people ride what they want to ride as long as they're not a dick or a danger to you on the trails. Maybe, just maybe, one day they will have a moment of clarity and realize they're using the wrong tool for the job. But until that happens, or if that never happens, they're still out there riding.


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## Procter (Feb 3, 2012)

AllMountin' said:


> This is what I don't understand about the 'wanted more challenge' argument:
> 
> I've been riding trails for six years. Met thousands of riders on likely hundreds of trails. The number of them riding any one of those trails to it's potential... the number of them who had mastered their craft well enough to need an external challenge... it's zero.
> 
> ...


For me, the cx challenge is not doing the same routes on a bike which isn't as good for pure trail.

It's about using the advantages of the bike to do rides I couldn't do on a MTB: long mixed dirt / road rides spanning different trail systems.


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## misterbill (Aug 13, 2014)

I have an 1982 Moto road bike I converted to 7 speed Shimano because the original gears would freewheel, it was dangerous. I have a new chain on it that has rusted with a kink in it from lack of use(two years?). I was seriously thinking of putting the 700c wheels off of my old mountain bike, putting the drop handlebars back on it with cyclo cross tires on it. Some of my favorite rides are riding on subdivision roads or the paved bike path, mixed with gravel roads and singletrack. But everything is too expensive. I would need to buy shifters, hubs for quick release, and tires are not cheap(I buy used car tires for less than bike tires). I seem to be compelled to change things. My Trek XCaliber is actually very good for this kind of riding.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

What about a gravel bike? Higher bottom bracket; longer wheel base; roadie gearing.

Can I ride that off road and not be chastised I may ask? Or I may not ask.


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## heartland (Oct 1, 2009)

Ima just leave this here to stir the pot: http://forums.mtbr.com/cyclocross/cross-bikes-singletrack-post-your-photos-728285.html

OP: sure, they're slower, and sure, you're more likely to pinch flat, but it's a fun challenge--give it a try sometime!


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

I like riding my mountain bike, but sometimes, I crave something different. Occasionally, I'll ride my CX bike on singletrack because A. It's hard. B. It's fun C. I like it. D. All of the above. Sometimes, I'll even ride my road bike on gravel, too, because I'm crazy like that. Dirt drops are a good time and keep you on your toes, especially in gnarly conditions. Sure, I can bomb my way though just about anything on my FS 27.5 plus bike, but as a 6'8", 260# clyde, I need to use all of my bike handling skills when I ride with tubed, 32mm tires; it keeps me on my toes and my skills sharp. It's fun to mix things up and in CX season, ride inappropriate bikes...


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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

heartland said:


> Ima just leave this here to stir the pot: http://forums.mtbr.com/cyclocross/cross-bikes-singletrack-post-your-photos-728285.html
> 
> OP: sure, they're slower, and sure, you're more likely to pinch flat, but it's a fun challenge--give it a try sometime!


But..but...but the OP said its not the right tool for the job.


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

This thread made me...go for a ride not quite ST but had so much fun..isn't that the point?


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## DoctorJD (Jan 15, 2004)

DIRTJUNKIE said:


> What's the difference what type of bike you ride on what type of trail as long as you are out enjoying two wheels, who gives a rats ass what you are on.


I couldn't agree more.


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## burtronix (Jun 5, 2006)

I have great respect for CX riders who can ride technical single-track. A couple years ago, I was passed by a CX on a flowy section, then watched him pick his way through a rock-garden (trials style). Mad skills!


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

^^^Exactly...its the rider...the bike does certainly come into play, but less so for a competent skilled rider.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

burtronix said:


> I have great respect for CX riders who can ride technical single-track. A couple years ago, I was passed by a CX on a flowy section, then watched him pick his way through a rock-garden (trials style). Mad skills!


A guy used to show up at the local race series and crush us on his CX bike.


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## baker (Jan 6, 2004)

Chris Akrigg showing the potential of a cyclocross bike on technical terrain...


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## jfudge02 (Mar 24, 2016)

Who cares, let them deal with bent wheels and flats if they want. From the vids I've seen, even mellow speeds are pretty exhilarating on the cx. Even if a capable rider on a fs would fly by them on the descents. It's kinda just the next step in trying rigids on technical trails. There's gonna be limits, the fun is discovering them sometimes.


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## hikerdave (Mar 8, 2006)

newenglandrocks said:


> Last weekend I was driving my daughter back from her soccer game when I spotted a friend of mine shouldering his cross bike with neither tire mounted on their respective wheels. He was riding mellow singletrack and his bike wasn't up to the task.
> 
> Another road friend pings me on email and says that after a few years of trying he realizes his cross bike isn't cutting in the woods and he wants advice on getting a full suspension mountain bike.
> 
> ...


I sometimes ride my CX bike on mountain bike trails and find that it is surprisingly capable. I use wider tires, though -- 42 mm. The only think that keeps me from doing this more is my back. After about an hour on a rough trails those lower back muscles tighten up from the pounding probably because I'm spoiled by my full suspension bike. You don't always need a full mountain bike to have a blast on the trail -- I even borrowed a hybrid city bike for a mountain bike ride and rode out on the trail.

As far as riding road bikes on trails, remember Jobst Brandt?

https://ritcheylogic.com/content/news/tom-ritchey-a-tribute-to-jobst/#


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## l'oiseau (May 5, 2015)

I used to ride hybrid/commuter/cross bikes on XC trails. Surprisingly capable with decent tires. A front suspension helps immensely but then it's not a true CX bike.

I followed a CX biker down a mellow descent at night last week and I had trouble keeping up. This on my AM 29er hardtail with dropper post. He was blistering me through the flatter section and our cornering speeds were similar. Lots of leaves down too and I was fighting for traction - not sure how those slicers were getting it unless they were cutting right through the leaves down to the dirt!

He did seem serious though - a racer type. No matter... didn't hurt my ego.

I'm now of the mind I'd rather ride a real MTB on those trails though - I can do stuff on the MTB I couldn't do on the commuter. A real trail bike these days sucks on pavement, but I barely touch paved anything with my trail bike, so it's not a big deal. If I did a lot of rides that were a mix of long road miles coupled with singletrack, I'd definitely favor a CX or hardtail commuter. My rigid bike is OK for that stuff, but the fatter tires do show themselves for long asphalt or dirt road miles.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I bought my 'cross bike to race, but it didn't take me long to start messing with it on singletrack. Like some others have said, it makes mellower trails interesting again and presents the possibility of stringing together longer mixed surface routes. The logging road riding that can be a boring necessity in some mountain bike routes can become an interesting element of variety on a long mixed route.

I'm envious of my teammate's gravel bike. I don't think I do enough of this kind of riding to buy one, though, as long as my 'cross bike is working okay.

It's certainly true that I can ride more challenging stuff and go faster on technical trails on a proper mountain bike. But so what - some variety is fun. I don't really use my 'cross bike to ride singletrack badly so much as to do a different kind of ride.

Sent from my E5803 using Tapatalk


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

Saturday there was a girl on the trail on a Hybrid, she left her male friend in the dust..at least on the way up. Not a technical trail but it was impresive how well she was riding.


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## gmats (Apr 15, 2005)

From my perspective? I don't see what the issue is. Riding a bike is all about fun (or training I suppose) for the majority of us. I mean we don't get paid. Most of us aren't professionals. So in the end, who cares what one rides when riding a trail, or a bike path or a fire-road? Heck, I used to ride my mountain bike out on the strand in southern california for years and pace with the roadies. Why should there be an "ideal tool" for each kind of riding? That's marketing speak from the industry that says one has to have a different bike for every single kind of riding. In the end, it's all about the challenge, solving the puzzle of riding the trail or what ever with what one is riding. My take anyway. As long as it's fun...........


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## RajunCajun44 (Aug 12, 2012)

I need to toot my own horn here... and I know some of you may not like it... I ride a lot of mountain/singletrack as well as a lot of dirt roads... I own both a cross bike (ritchey swiss cross) and a more road friendly mountain bike (Ti bike with bigger rings up front, 2.0 tires, hardtail)... 

For most of our Arizona dirt roads, the mt bike is faster.. especially on the downhill.. We just had a "gravel" race -- Bradshaw Grinder -- and the mountain bikes dominated.. First place was on a FULL SUSPENSION mt bike... I crushed my previous (up and down hill) segment times (that were on a cross bike) while using a mountain bike... 

So, I think the whole gravel bike thing is a phase just like fat bikes... it will chill out... 

However, there is a place for gravel bikes... I still love to ride my steel ritchey.. Its a fast road bike and I can take it out on graded dirt roads... In fact my Ritchey cross bike is not that much slower than my (4 lbs less) carbon road bike on pavement... 

For well graded dirt and rides that are gravel/pavement combinations, my cross bike is a great choice... 

ps -- as far as riding a cross bike on singletrack.... I don't get that at all but whatever, have fun...


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I think the endgame of the gravel bike thing is that brands with more successful designs will keep offering them and a lot of brands will drop them again. I totally want one, but it's kind of an odd use case so I bet the market saturates and then doesn't support so many.

Sent from my E5803 using Tapatalk


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## MOJO K (Jan 26, 2007)

Bikes are awesome!


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## bakerjw (Oct 8, 2014)

My friend Jesse can out climb and out descend me on all but the most technical of terrain. This on my hardtail with a suspension fork and 2.1 Nanos and him on his 700-34 or so cross tires and no front suspension.

It is the rider more often than the ride.


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

MOJO K said:


> Bikes are awesome!


Winner


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## RajunCajun44 (Aug 12, 2012)

bakerjw said:


> My friend Jesse can out climb and out descend me on all but the most technical of terrain. This on my hardtail with a suspension fork and 2.1 Nanos and him on his 700-34 or so cross tires and no front suspension.
> 
> It is the rider more often than the ride.


a more relevant comparison would be to see how fast Jesse can ride the same segment under the same conditions with a cross bike vs a mountain bike... not how Jesse compares to you

when you are descending loose rough rocky Arizona dirt roads, you are faster on a mt bike... sorry but there is no disputing that...


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## gravelynp (Aug 28, 2009)

Riding more singletrack on my drop bar bike is my new goal. I think it's fun to change things up. My skills have gone to **** riding my 27+ full suspension bike so time to shake things up. Sure there are marketing approved better bikes for the job, but as long as I'm on two wheels I am happy. I try not to be a snob or sound just like one of those Strava obsessed lycra boys. After all, didn't we all start riding bikes because it was fun? Now granted my drop-bar bike is somewhat cheating, but it is still more challenging off road than my full squish bike and I can get to and from the trailhead a lot faster.


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## MOJO K (Jan 26, 2007)

The original goal of 'cross racing was to improve bike skills and fitness. To that end, a cyclocross bike is the perfect tool.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

mtnbkr80015 said:


> Riding more singletrack on my drop bar bike is my new goal. I think it's fun to change things up. My skills have gone to **** riding my 27+ full suspension bike so time to shake things up. Sure there are marketing approved better bikes for the job, but as long as I'm on two wheels I am happy. I try not to be a snob or sound just like one of those Strava obsessed lycra boys. After all, didn't we all start riding bikes because it was fun? Now granted my drop-bar bike is somewhat cheating, but it is still more challenging off road than my full squish bike and I can get to and from the trailhead a lot faster.


Nice.


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## bmf032 (Sep 8, 2010)

I like bikes.


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## Solo-Rider (Sep 15, 2013)

I don't see anything wrong with it. CX bikes are designed to take some abuse, and if you can ride. Then why not?


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## racebum (Mar 13, 2013)

bakerjw said:


> It is the rider more often than the ride.


bottom line right here. the skill gap can be huge between riders


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## Sidewalk (May 18, 2015)

Pivot set up a demo day at my local MTB trails (I was there on my MTB coincidentally). I stopped by to test ride a bike, because I love riding bikes, and they said that they didn't have anything in my size until the next group returned, unless I wanted to ride a CX. I had never tried one outside of my commute bike, so I said "Hell yeah!"

Notice the list of PR's, and a KOM (which I still have):
www.strava.com/activities/504844637

I also cleared a set of doubles on it that most people on the full suspension demo bikes skipped.



127.0.0.1 said:


> it means that someone has hardened up...much appreciated in the world of MTB riding trail homogenizers we see too often nowadays


You see guys shuttling XC trails on a 160mm enduro, and HTFU goes out the window,



newenglandrocks said:


> I am ragging on the decision, not the bikes. The bikes are great for some venues, not others.


You could have made that argument when I took a demo BMC TeamElite (XC race hardtail) to Snow Summit. But as I am clearing doubles and asking to pass guys on 200mm downhill bikes to let me pass, maybe they brought the wrong tool for the job: skillset.



Jayem said:


> IMO, a cross bike is a more practical road bike for most people. If you commute, they deal better with the obstacles and realities of commuting, vs. a straight road bike. More versatility. If you only take your bike out on weekends on group rides, then a straight road bike is for you.
> 
> Never encountered any of what you are talking about though.


My first commuter (still me commuter) was a low end CX set up as a hybrid. Perfect bike for commuting, though I did go to drop bars and disc brakes. That bike has taken me on single track and 40 mile, 5000' road climbs. If I could only have one bike, a CX would be it.

Luckily, I don't have just one bike 



DIRTJUNKIE said:


> What's the difference what type of bike you ride on what type of trail as long as you are out enjoying two wheels, who gives a rats ass what you are on.


I can't up your rep again yet.



Nat said:


> I've seen some people out on our singletrack who didn't have a bike at all! Can you imagine?


Raises hand.

I'm an ultra runner too.



LMN said:


> Sometimes riding involves pavement, dirt roads and single track. A CX bike is a lot fun for that combination.


Sounds like a CX race course 



A1an said:


> I'm primarily a mountain biker that sometimes rides a cx on single track.


I'm a triathlete who is far better at riding MTB then triathlon, so here I am.



One Pivot said:


> 27.5 minus is coming. And it's gonna take over.


Cannondale Slate 

I demo'ed one earlier this year and it was a blast!



AllMountin' said:


> This is what I don't understand about the 'wanted more challenge' argument:
> 
> I've been riding trails for six years. Met thousands of riders on likely hundreds of trails. The number of them riding any one of those trails to it's potential... the number of them who had mastered their craft well enough to need an external challenge... it's zero.


You never master a craft, and you are foolish if you think it is possible. But also note that Nino Schurter rides road, enduro, and dirt bikes on top of his XC bike and gym training sessions. You can't master the craft, but you also can't improve if you stay in your comfort zone.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

newenglandrocks said:


> I'm not a road or cross bike hater - I used to ride 10K miles a year back when I was a cat 3 racer and my favorite races to watch in person are cross races. I just can't figure out why road bikers avoid buying mountain bikes for singletrack. It's just weird.


a cross bike in the hands of a mountain biker is a much more capable machine than in the hands of a road biker.

i don't have an answer for why road bikers won't just buy a MTB, but the roadies i've seen have ZERO skill in the woods. i can confidently say that i can get through many sections cleaner on my cross bike than they can on a MTB. maybe not faster due to the skinny tires and lack of suspension, but cleaner.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

*OneSpeed* said:


> a cross bike in the hands of a mountain biker is a much more capable machine than in the hands of a road biker.
> 
> i don't have an answer for why road bikers won't just buy a MTB, but the roadies i've seen have ZERO skill in the woods. i can confidently say that i can get through many sections cleaner on my cross bike than they can on a MTB. maybe not faster due to the skinny tires and lack of suspension, but cleaner.


It's all about getting used to the riding conditions. That's why XC riders ride enduro bikes and DH racers ride MX bikes, to become accustomed to far worse than what they'll normally encounter.

Every year at Interbike I ride a CX bike at Bootleg. It is, for that once or twice up and down the hill, insanely fun. If not for the traffic and waiting for someone, I'm sure I could have set a PR on the climb up Girlscout because those light little bikes climb so well. I also ended up leapfrogging a guy (because I was waiting for someone) demoing a 27+ bike on the descent, finally passed him when he got a flat. Silly tourists. It was definitely slower, but speed didn't matter, fun did.

Point being, they're a hoot. They're not $3K+ worth of fun to me personally, but if I had one, I'd ride the **** out of it.


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## gmats (Apr 15, 2005)

I live here in Hawaii. So a while back, I would visit my GF in Santa Clara area. All she had was a Target POS. That's ok because riding single track out there on this thing was fun and challenging. 

Years before that, my friend owned a bike shop in Southern, CA. I had my pic of any and many ultra custom built mountain bikes of the day (friend's bikes). However, I'd go down to the shop, grab some rental thingy on the side of the shop and go out and ride trails because that was the fun challenge.


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## Rock (Jan 13, 2004)

Apparently these "cross bike guys on mountain bike trails people" can't afford proper equipment for their seasonal sport. We should not look down on them. It's not nice.


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## racebum (Mar 13, 2013)

Rock said:


> Apparently these "cross bike guys on mountain bike trails people" can't afford proper equipment for their seasonal sport. We should not look down on them. It's not nice.


if someone can only afford one bike and much of it is road, what's the big deal? short knob on a cross bike can ride flatter trails just fine


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

I've ridden my cx bike on relatively tame single track. It was fun because I was on a bike and because it was different. It definitely wasn't the right tool for the job. Similar to playing 18 holes of golf with only a 6 iron. I always smile when I see others riding trails on a cross bike because I know they're just having fun.


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2016)

Back in the day (late 70's) we road whatever we had wherever we wanted to. We didn't separate "Roadies" and "Everyone else" cause there wasn't enough of either group to separate. If someone had a flat tire, you asked if they had a patch kit. Life was much simpler when we were too busy riding to worry about who rode what.


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## Scott O (Aug 5, 2004)

All I know is that I will punch the next guy I see riding a trail bike on an all-mountain trail. Makes me want to puke.


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## unterhausen (Sep 28, 2008)

Forster said:


> Back in the day (late 70's) we road whatever we had wherever we wanted to. We didn't separate "Roadies" and "Everyone else" cause there wasn't enough of either group to separate. If someone had a flat tire, you asked if they had a patch kit. Life was much simpler when we were too busy riding to worry about who rode what.


In the late '70s, we had heard about people using cruisers as mountain bikes, but according to the internets, the first mountain bike wasn't built until '78. I worked in a bike shop until '82, and we couldn't give them away. Which is pretty funny because that's in a great area for mountain biking, and when I went back there in '85, everybody was mountain biking.


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## mtbmike24 (Jul 25, 2009)

Sorry I don't agree. I have a really good friend of mine that races CX and just can't believe were he has taken his bike. Does he get flats sure he does but so do I. Thing is that's what he chooses to ride...he does have a mountain bike but he races CX so riding tough trails on his CX helps him alot in races and believe me he is a fast SOB on that skinny wheeled bike. If it's a smooth trail with lots of climbing I struggle to hold his wheel on my Mountain bike he flat out flies up the climbs. He has to slow down and even pick his bike up in several spots but it's all about training as you have to do this all the time in CX racing so it's really really good for him. In CX there is alot of technique that goes into the dismount and re mount of the bike and being able to remount smoothly after running with it while losing minimal time in the process. CX is not my thing but mountain biking isn't alot of peoples thing either I'm sure there are hikers that say to themselves why the hell would that guy want to ride mountain bikes. 

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## Guest (Nov 26, 2016)

unterhausen said:


> In the late '70s, we had heard about people using cruisers as mountain bikes, but according to the internets, the first mountain bike wasn't built until '78. I worked in a bike shop until '82, and we couldn't give them away. Which is pretty funny because that's in a great area for mountain biking, and when I went back there in '85, everybody was mountain biking.


 That was our transition as well. We cobbed together old Schwinn frames, bmx parts, old 10-spd hubs and any 26" rims we could find to make ourselves a close approximation of an off-road worthy bike. Generally we'd use the white walled beach nobbies if we could find them. Since I lived in the Midwest brakes were less important than they were to mountain state riders, but the diacomp bmx brakes were generally preferred. I remember being pretty excited when I got a bike with cantilever brakes.


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## milliesand (Jun 29, 2015)

Gotta say I'm drawn to a rigid, steel frame, drop bars and circa 40MM tires on the next bike.


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2016)

milliesand said:


> Gotta say I'm drawn to a rigid, steel frame, drop bars and circa 40MM tires on the next bike.


Sorry, you're either going to have to mount 45mm tires or flat bars. Otherwise Scott O will take you out. (Says the Fargo guy.)


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## milliesand (Jun 29, 2015)

all I need is somebody chasing me down because I have skinny tires  Likely will kick sand on my drops too.


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2016)

milliesand said:


> all I need is somebody chasing me down because I have skinny tires  Likely will kick sand on my drops too.


 Well, they gotta catch you first. Climb first, then head for a couple of hurdles.


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## Rock (Jan 13, 2004)

bakerjw said:


> My friend Jesse can out climb and out descend me on all but the most technical of terrain. This on my hardtail with a suspension fork and 2.1 Nanos and him on his 700-34 or so cross tires and no front suspension.
> 
> It is the rider more often than the ride.


You can ride what ever you want, but just know when you hear"on your left" be cool.


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## MyCol (Oct 3, 2012)

I test rode a cx bike with 700x34 with carbon fork on a local trail. Not even 2 miles into it I had to turn around. The ride was brutal and stiff. I rather have mike tyson punch my scrotums than to ride a cx bike on a local mountain bike trail.


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## Guest (Nov 28, 2016)

MyCol said:


> I test rode a cx bike with 700x34 with carbon fork on a local trail. Not even into 2 miles into it I had to turn around. The ride was brutal and stiff. I rather have mike tyson punch my balls than to ride a cx bike on a local mountain bike trail.


I'll bet not.


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## Hurricane Jeff (Jan 1, 2006)

I ride my cross bike on pretty much the same trails I ride my FS bike on, except the extremely rocky trails that we have where I live( Big Bear Lake, Ca)
I find it amusing when I pass riders on seemingly more capable bikes, the looks they give me are priceless. While I'm glad it's not my only bike, I sure love riding it. I do cross races and gravel events on that bike. I also ride a lot of road ( on my road bike) and race xc and enduro events on my other bikes. 
This last year, my cross bike probably has more miles ridden than any one of my other bikes.


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## DrDon (Sep 25, 2004)

I was behind two very fit riders one time who ignored me when I came up on their wheels. I took a quick short cut and passed them. I then heard a commotion and one wiped out trying to catch me.I have never seen a CX bike on very rocky trails.

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## miatagal96 (Jul 5, 2005)

Two years ago on Thanksgiving, 2 fat bikes, 3 x-c bikes, and 1 cyclocross bike went on a ride in singletrack. Guess who was the fastest? Believe it or not, the cyclocross bike was the fastest, followed by the fat bikes.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

^^^ Ugg, wrong tool. Sometimes it not about fast. How deep was that snow? Whatev.


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## miatagal96 (Jul 5, 2005)

In this case, "fast" meant being able to ride more and walk less. In my book, being able to ride more and hike-a-bike less doesn't equate to the wrong tool.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

miatagal96 said:


> Two years ago on Thanksgiving, 2 fat bikes, 3 x-c bikes, and 1 cyclocross bike went on a ride in singletrack. Guess who was the fastest? Believe it or not, the cyclocross bike was the fastest, followed by the fat bikes.
> View attachment 1107564


Nice Colnago!


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

One of the lessons of racing, for me, was not to worry too much about riding vs running. Seems like a lot of courses have a spot where it's faster to run, especially if there's traffic making it harder to flow well.

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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

miatagal96 said:


> Two years ago on Thanksgiving, 2 fat bikes, 3 x-c bikes, and 1 cyclocross bike went on a ride in singletrack. Guess who was the fastest? Believe it or not, the cyclocross bike was the fastest, followed by the fat bikes.
> View attachment 1107564


And I bet 99% of that was due to rider skill and fitness level.

I'm still all for anyone having fun on two wheels no matter that the surface or tool you choose. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

MyCol said:


> I test rode a cx bike with 700x34 with carbon fork on a local trail. Not even into 2 miles into it I had to turn around. The ride was brutal and stiff. I rather have mike tyson punch my balls than to ride a cx bike on a local mountain bike trail.


Please see rule #5 (language warning):
Velominati ? The Rules


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

Things said to me whilst riding the cx on single track:
"Wrong bike."
"Dude, why are you on a road bike?"
"People are going to think you are on drugs."


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## luvdabeach2001 (Nov 11, 2011)

DIRTJUNKIE said:


> I'm still all for anyone having fun on two wheels no matter that the surface or tool you choose.


What a bunch of crap. They need to be riding the correct bike for the surface they are riding!!! if the surface changes they need to change bikes.









 JK


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## ryguy79 (Apr 12, 2007)

I ride road, gravel, trails...sometimes all in one ride. Sometimes on a mountain bike. Sometimes on my gravel bike. 

Personally I love the funny looks I get from guys on mountain bikes when I'm on trails on my gravel bike.


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## gravelynp (Aug 28, 2009)

DIRTJUNKIE said:


> And I bet 99% of that was due to rider skill and fitness level.
> 
> I'm still all for anyone having fun on two wheels no matter that the surface or tool you choose. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.


It's two wheels that make it fun


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## Guest (Nov 29, 2016)

luvdabeach2001 said:


> What a bunch of crap. They need to be riding the correct bike for the surface they are riding!!! if the surface changes they need to change bikes.
> 
> View attachment 1107617
> 
> JK


Anyone can wheelie like that if they have another bike to keep them balanced. Geez.


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## Scott O (Aug 5, 2004)

Where do you find a gravel road? I've seen a couple of short gravel driveways, plenty of dirt roads, hiking trails and singletrack, but never seen a gravel road.


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## Sidewalk (May 18, 2015)

Scott O said:


> Where do you find a gravel road? I've seen a couple of short gravel driveways, plenty of dirt roads, hiking trails and singletrack, but never seen a gravel road.


I drove down gravel roads for miles on end in Alaska when they were between repairs.


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## gravelynp (Aug 28, 2009)

pablum police said:


> The Midwest is polluted with them. The West, less so.


I've got gravel roads abounding in Montana


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Scott O said:


> Where do you find a gravel road? I've seen a couple of short gravel driveways, plenty of dirt roads, hiking trails and singletrack, but never seen a gravel road.


Lots of land in Western Washington that's held for logging is served that way. Much of it, probably most, is DNR. And it's big enough chunks that you can get a pretty great ride linking it up.

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## MyCol (Oct 3, 2012)

A1an said:


> Please see rule #5 (language warning):
> Velominati ? The Rules


Post fixed. No harm, no foul.

Cheers


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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

MyCol said:


> Post fixed. No harm, no foul.
> 
> Cheers


I think you need to go to that link and read rule #5.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

Scott O said:


> Where do you find a gravel road? I've seen a couple of short gravel driveways, plenty of dirt roads, hiking trails and singletrack, but never seen a gravel road.


I've got a 30 mile loop within the city of Philadelphia that is 70% gravel; a group of friends are working on expanding that to an urban gravel century, keeping the same ratio of gravel to MacAdam.


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## Scott O (Aug 5, 2004)

"A gravel road is a type of unpaved road surfaced with gravel that has been brought to the site from a quarry or stream bed. They are common in less-developed nations, and also in the rural areas of developed nations such as Canada and the United States."
Gravel road - Wikipedia

How well does a gravel bike ride on a dirt road? 

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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I find packed dirt to be an easier surface.

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## ryguy79 (Apr 12, 2007)

Just about any non-paved road in the Pikes Peak region is gravel. There's practically no dirt here, just decomposed granite. Same for the trails once you get above the city.


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## Hurricane Jeff (Jan 1, 2006)

The USFS has been putting down gravel( base material) on more and more roads in my area. I believe the thought is that it is easier to maintain and stays in better condition over time than the natural road surface. We have hundreds of miles of dirt roads within the San Bernardino National Forest. I like to ride the roads in addition to the single track, it's almost like "old school" mountain biking when there wasn't as many trails and we rode fire roads to get to the single track trails.


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## ravewoofer (Dec 24, 2008)

I'm going on a 16 mile mixed terrain ride Saturday. It seems most of the riders have some type of cyclocross bike. I'll be on my Mach429 Pivot. 

My guess is the ride is fast on the road. It should be interesting in the woods asI know the trails. Very rocky and loaded with roots. I just don't see them riding faster than me while they're riding a rigid frame. We'll see. I'm just doing the ride as an end of season thing. 

They'll ride those bikes year round. 

Oh yeah, pace line on the road. I haven't done that since the late '70s. 

Might just be my first and last mixed terrain ride. 


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## chazpat (Sep 23, 2006)

ravewoofer said:


> I'm going on a 16 mile mixed terrain ride Saturday. It seems most of the riders have some type of cyclocross bike. I'll be on my Mach429 Pivot.
> 
> My guess is the ride is fast on the road. It should be interesting in the woods asI know the trails. Very rocky and loaded with roots. I just don't see them riding faster than me while they're riding a rigid frame. We'll see. I'm just doing the ride as an end of season thing.
> 
> ...


Please post a report afterwards, sounds interesting.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

There's a term for it: "Under-biking." Meaning, riding terrain that's more challenging than that for which your bike is intended. I've done singletrack and two-track on my gravel bike, shod with 650bx42mm slicks-it's fun! Can get a little bumpy tho. Mixed-terrain rides are a great way to explore and experience all an area has to offer...


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

ravewoofer said:


> I'm going on a 16 mile mixed terrain ride Saturday. It seems most of the riders have some type of cyclocross bike. I'll be on my Mach429 Pivot.
> 
> My guess is the ride is fast on the road. It should be interesting in the woods asI know the trails. Very rocky and loaded with roots. I just don't see them riding faster than me while they're riding a rigid frame. We'll see. I'm just doing the ride as an end of season thing.
> 
> ...


How much road vs. st?


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## ravewoofer (Dec 24, 2008)

50/50 usually. I think tomorrow might be closer to 60% single track. 

9:00 am Eastern time on the bike. I wouldn't ride normally tomorrow as deer shotgun season has started. I figure, though, a half dozen plus riders will make enough noise to alert any hunters nearby. 




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## ravewoofer (Dec 24, 2008)

Did the ride with 5 others. Three rode cyclocross bikes highly tricked out. Think Seven and Moots titanium, with light weight everything. No one except me has a hydration pack. 

We started on the road at a moderate pace, hit a few hills on the road and began to push it. No problem for me as I'm in good shape. 

The leader had a titanium hard tail fatty with that inverted Rockshock. As soon as we hit the trail, the cyclo cross riders couldn't keep the pace. In fact, the ride began more as a toodle. Boredom (for me) began to set in. 

One other rider came a bit later on the route riding a serous $10,000 Specialized dualie with superlight every thing. 

We ended up riding together and promptly lost the group. When we dumped out onto a road, the rider turned superhuman! He lost me twice on some hills. As I caught up to him I mentioned he was the first rider to ever drop me. Turns out he is the 2016 Masters champion on the road bike and time trials! 

He couldn't keep up with me in the woods. Near mile 19, I was a bit tired and this guy was still cranking. 

Made it back to the meeting place and met the other fellows. 

In the end, mountain bikes were way faster than cyclocross on single track. 

I'm 54 and the Master rider was 57. 

I'm pooped now. 

Will do again next weekend. 



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## misterbill (Aug 13, 2014)

I rode my Specialized Sirrus road bike on a single track yesterday, an awesome shortcut to the bike path from some new subdivision roads. I had a rock against my back tire, front tire in a hole against a root, no problem whatsoever. I am running Specialized Nimbus* 700x28c smooth road tires.









One of the best bike rides I had was when I was first exploring trails in the State Forest. I use the trip log on my GPS to print out maps. I had three trails that I did not have on my trip log, they were about a mile apart. I rode my road bike down Punch Brook Rd, took a single track to George Washington Tpke, back to Punch Brook on the road and over the hill on the trail to Mountain Spring Rd, and back to the trail head on the Tunxis Trail. I want to convert my 82 Motobecane(that I actually bought from a Motobecane bike shop)to a cross bike. I have 22 front and 34 rear gears to put on it-I will need to buy new shifters to put my nice light drop handlebars back on it, the price of tires may kill this project idea.

*Specialized Nimbus Sport Tire (700c) 
Specialized's Nimbus Sport is a smooth-rolling tire that's tailor-made for commuting and taking on the concrete jungle. Its quick-rolling, grippy tread is siped to give you confident handling even when the road conditions are less than stellar. Plus, the Nimbus boasts Specialized's excellent Flak Jacket puncture protection technology to keep flats at bay.*


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## OlMarin (Oct 22, 2016)

Many people choose cross bikes due to their versatility. Some can only have one bike. 
While the reasons for that are myriad, the two most common are funds, spouses and spouses who control the funds. For these people a cross is a viable option as you can do some dirt stuff as well.
By the same token, try to catch that cross bike on a gravel road while riding your FS mt. bike. If the rider has close to your skill and conditioning, you wouldn't stand a snow ball's chance in hell.


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