# Brooks B17 Saddle: Great Divide/Touring Saddle?



## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

Anybody out there using this for extended periods of riding? I'm thinking of trying them out for my Great Divide gear shakedown rides. Looking for something super comfortable and reliable for those real long days in the saddle.

Any riders complete the Great Divide on this saddle? Please let us know of your thoughts and experiences with this saddle.

For reference, I'm currently on a WTB Pure V, Feeling OK, but I think looking for the holy saddle.

I also know that saddle preference is a touchy subject.


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## bolandjd (Jul 23, 2008)

If I was riding the Great Divide, I wouldn't use anything else. The B17 is a great saddle. Just break it in before you start the tour.


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## DGLS (Sep 24, 2013)

I second the recommendation on the B17. Or the B67 of Flyer if you want a B17 type saddle, but with springs.


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## coldbike (Feb 24, 2011)

I have put many full days on my B17 as well as a flyer and an imperial. I like the imperial the best, but I can spend many full days on any of them and my butt is never the part of me that is most sore.


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## edubfromktown (Sep 7, 2010)

I have a B17 from ~1995 that (still) fits like an old glove. It was the first saddle I did long distance rides on and I think it toughened me up so that nowadays, I can ride just about anything w/o issues. Only exception is long distance in wet conditions... that can still cause irritation.


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## skyphix (May 29, 2007)

I ride a B17 on my road bike and did my training for a 24 hour race (that got canceled) on my B17. My only complaint was bruising at the back of my legs because of its width when used over technical trails where getting behind the saddle often was needed. Comfort the rest of the time far outweighed that issue. Break it in (1-200 miles) before you head out and treat it with something so when it gets soaked it wont deform. Mine is untreated but I don't ride the great divide. 

Only saddle I can ride in jeans for more than an hour or two and feel good on.


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## xjcrawlr (Jun 19, 2007)

Have you considered a Selle Anatomica? I tried a B-17 for a while, but I just couldnt get comfortable. Then I hopped on a Selle Anatomica and i havent looked back. I dont even wear padded shorts anymore.
Like the B-17, it is a bit wide in back, making getting behind the saddle interesting.


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

I have actually thought about the Selle Anatomica. Only reason why I'm considering the B17 is because REI carries them they recommend I test it out with the member return policy. I'm not too concerned about getting behind the saddle too much as I have a huge saddle bag that prevents me from doing so anyway. My main concern is extended comfort.


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## hunter006 (Jan 20, 2012)

The best way to approach all Brooks saddles is they should be comfortable at the start, and only get better with time. If you're going to try and see what will win in a battle between man/lady bits and the Brooks, the Brooks will win.

I had a B17, didn't like it, switched to the Team Pro saddle and loved it. I use a non-Brooks saddle now even though I prefer the Brooks because it rains too frequently in Seattle.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

My bikepacking bike has a B17. Saddle comfort is not an issue. I can put in long days in the saddle on tour no problem.

I don't use padded bike shorts.










I find Selle Anatomica saddles even more comfortable and use them on my randonneur bike for those really epic rides. I also use a SA saddle on my trail bike.

If I was going to tour I'd use either saddle happily.

If I was going to race with uber long days on the bike day after day I would use the SA for its edge in comfort.


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## Saddle Up (Jan 30, 2008)

I've never seen a cow dissolve because it was being rained on. I don't get this notion that a Brooks saddle should not get wet. I've even seen people wear leather shoes and jackets and stand in the rain without umbrellas, they didn't dissolve either. Just sayin.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Saddle Up said:


> I've never seen a cow dissolve because it was being rained on. I don't get this notion that a Brooks saddle should not get wet. I've even seen people wear leather shoes and jackets and stand in the rain without umbrellas, they didn't dissolve either. Just sayin.


+1 - we use our Brooks saddles up here in the PNWet and they are fine. I see tons of Brooks saddles out and about.

I do cover my saddle if I am going to leave it for hours in the rain, but sometimes I forget and nothing awful happens. Some people think riding a wet saddle helps in break in. I haven't done that on purpose.


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## hunter006 (Jan 20, 2012)

vikb said:


> +1 - we use our Brooks saddles up here in the PNWet and they are fine. I see tons of Brooks saddles out and about.
> 
> I do cover my saddle if I am going to leave it for hours in the rain, but sometimes I forget and nothing awful happens. Some people think riding a wet saddle helps in break in. I haven't done that on purpose.


From the Brooks England site: _If a wet saddle is ridden not only the colour may stain your clothing, but the leather top may easily deform._

From the Dutch Bike Company site: _Do not ride a leather saddle wet. It will stretch out the leather and dramatically shorten its service life._

By god have I experienced that staining of clothing... it's a really long story, but I was wearing a chicken suit at the time, and we had to throw the suit away. Could not get the stain out. I don't have a photo of the stain, but I do of the chicken suit. I don't know if the staining continues to happen after it's happened a few times, but once was enough.

As funny as the cow dissolving because it gets rained on idea is, leather is not the same as a cow. Leather is the product of processing animal hide. The type of processing used affects whether it is damaged, spotted or largely unaffected by water. Leather shoes are typically unaffected but not always. I don't know what Brooks use for their waterproofing process, but from the people handling customer support at their end, the indication is that it's pretty good but not perfect.

I've given it the wax treatment on the underside, but I rarely remember to cover my saddle when it's left out in the rain. I used to carry plastic bags, but now that Seattle has the ban on plastic bags I don't have nearly as many as I used to (there have been no plastic bags in my apartment since 3 months after the ban). It's been a while since we've just had summer, but I'm typically spending upwards of 3 hours a day in the rain, with the Brooks getting at least moderately wet in that time.

I don't think this is an issue for someone doing a 2 month cross-country tour as this thread is supposed to advise on, but for someone using it day in, day out for commuting year round (or possibly going on an extended tour through continuous rain), it starts to sag well before what my other riding buddies in Australia are getting in terms of hours in the saddle. I had the tension bolt snap from what appears to be the saddle sagging too much, and replacing those by hand is something I never want to go through again. I'm also going to give the lacing-the-underside-of-the-brooks trick a shot too once I find someone with a leather punch. Worst case it gets some air vents...

It won't explode and kill all women and children within a 2 mile radius to ride on a wet leather saddle, but IMO it's not exactly good for the saddle either. One of these days I'll remember to buy a shower cap or something and put the Brooks back on.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

hunter006 said:


> From the Brooks England site: _If a wet saddle is ridden not only the colour may stain your clothing, but the leather top may easily deform._
> 
> From the Dutch Bike Company site: _Do not ride a leather saddle wet. It will stretch out the leather and dramatically shorten its service life._


I wouldn't leave a Brooks saddle out in the rain all winter by storing my bike outside, but getting it wet and riding it occasionally doesn't seem to have any effect. My GF commutes on her Brooks so it gets wet regularly and there is no issue. The rest of the Brooks saddles we see around town get wet all winter here. So far I haven't talked to anyone who has had an issue.

We both use fenders so the saddles only get wet from rain running down our bodies and when they are locked outside during a rain. Most of our saddles are black and we haven't noticed any transfer of dye to our clothes.

We treat our Brooks saddles a couple times a year with Proofide.

My bikepacking seatbag protects my Brooks when touring from water coming up from the rear wheel.

My Selle Antatomica saddles are waterproof leather and never need treating and have been left outside in pouring rain for days at a time on tour. I have never treated mine.


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

Hi Vik,

I've always been curious, why no bike padded bike shorts? When did you make the switch? Maybe this is my issue? I was on the 3 day multi this summer in Yosemite and got my first saddle sore. Not cool. I know you have a lot of experience touring so did you used to ride with padded shorts? 

Also ever get a bike fit or just fiddled on your own. I'm pretty in tuned with how I feel on my bike but sometimes still get a little numb here and there which I know is not good. I'm hoping a bike fit will resolve these minor issues.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

VO2 Lax said:


> Hi Vik,
> 
> I've always been curious, why no bike padded bike shorts? When did you make the switch? Maybe this is my issue? I was on the 3 day multi this summer in Yosemite and got my first saddle sore. Not cool. I know you have a lot of experience touring so did you used to ride with padded shorts?


I spent 25yrs or so riding on plastic saddles and padded shorts in varying levels of discomfort. I tried dozens of each item trying to find a good match. It was bad enough that butt pain was the limiting factor for my riding.

One day I get a Brooks saddle based on somebody's post on the interwebs. I figured it was a crazy idea - leather??!??! - but I had nothing to lose. Amazingly it was pretty comfy, but my padded shorts felt weird on the hard leather so I ditched them and never looked back.

Now I hardly ever think about my butt or my saddle when riding - even 12-14hrs all day epics. And the second I am off the bike I pretty much forget I've been riding all day other than being tired.

That's a huge change from my plastic saddle days.

I typically wear Exofficio boxer briefs on tour. They don't have much in the way of crotch seams, they wash and dry fast and they are breathable on hot days.

I don't want to come off as a leather saddle zealot. Everyone is different so I can't say that what works for me will work for someone else. However, I know enough people who are very happy riding leather saddles after lots of issues with plastic saddles that I can suggest it as a reasonable option to check out.

One major issue with bike touring is keeping your butt clean to avoid infections.

How to keep your butt clean on tour? | The Lazy Rando Blog...

I found with padded bike shorts they took so long to dry I couldn't clean them as often as I would have liked. With travel boxer briefs I can clean and dry them daily if I want.

I gotta say when I see riders in padded bike shorts I never ever think "I miss those days!".



VO2 Lax said:


> Also ever get a bike fit or just fiddled on your own. I'm pretty in tuned with how I feel on my bike but sometimes still get a little numb here and there which I know is not good. I'm hoping a bike fit will resolve these minor issues.


I kept meaning to get a real bike fit, but after plugging away at it I seem to be pretty successful tweaking my bikes to get comfortable.

If you are having persistent issues you can't resolve I would give a bike fit a shot. If you see an improvement - awesome and if not you tried something new to solve the issue.


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

Thanks for taking the time out to answer my questions. I'm going to give it a try and give your blog posting a read about keep the bum clean.


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## Saddle Up (Jan 30, 2008)

I can't stress enough how big a role the choice of seatpost plays in my comfort level when using a Brooks saddle. The greater the setback on the post the easier it is to compensate for the short rear biased saddle rails typical of Brooks saddles. The Truvativ Stylo comes in a 25mm seatback option. I haven't used padded shorts for quite sometime. I combine the leather of a Brooks saddle with Merino wool of Ice Breaker underwear.


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## hikernks (Aug 21, 2012)

I didn't complete the Tour Divide, but I made it twelve days to Togwotee Lodge in Wyoming on a Brooks B-17. I had a small saddle sore about day 5 or 6, but it was just a little too far forward. I made a slight adjustment, and had no further issues. Irregardless of what saddle you choose, I would STRONGLY suggest getting a professional bike fit before you go. It will be worth every penny. Best of luck, it's a monster!


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

OK,I tried the Brooks B17 on a shakedown run this weekend, a short 40 mile round trip with decent climbing, 90% dirt. On my way to camp, I went with a wool underwear, I don't think it's for me due to the amount of sweat I output. Started off comfortable, but ended up a bit painful and that was just toward the end of a 20 mile ride so... we get it.

On the way back, I wore padded shorts. Much better, but was sliding forward so I stopped and made some minor adjustments and that help. The 20 miles back home didn't have too many climbs so I'm not sure if that minimized time in the saddle helped? I feel like I'm close to get it it right but am not sure. I'm going to stick with it for a while, tweak things here and there and see how it feels. Obviously 40 miles round trip will not give me a real sense of how comfortable it is but I have to start some where.

I will say that this saddle is not too cool while climbing single track in just a pair of underwear. The padded shorts did help a little but not much. 

At this point I'm down to the WTB Pure V and Brooks, just need to decide before I commit to a real bike fit.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

VO2 Lax said:


> OK,I tried the Brooks B17 on a shakedown run this weekend, a short 40 mile round trip with decent climbing, 90% dirt. On my way to camp, I went with a wool underwear, I don't think it's for me due to the amount of sweat I output. Started off comfortable, but ended up a bit painful and that was just toward the end of a 20 mile ride so... we get it.


Some people need 1000kms+ to get their Brooks saddles broken in.

I put a Brooks on my GF's commuter bike and she came home from her first commute totally unhappy with it. I suggested she try a bit longer before I put her old plastic saddle back on. She agreed and rode for another week, but still wanted that Brooks gone. I was called away for a 4 week project out of town and didn't get the saddles swapped and totally forgot about it. When I got home I told her I'd get those saddles swapped and apologized for not doing it before I left.

She looked at me and said "No way I love that saddle!". 

Everyone is different and you may not enjoy your B17 even after a longer trial period, but just a head's up that you may not get a good feel for how it will perform unless you give it a longer term test period.

One Brooks tip I setup all my B17's pointed nose up. They look like they would be uncomfortable, but once you compress the leather it makes for a nice platform for the butt. If I set them up level I am always sliding forward off them.

BTW - the Selle Anatomica saddles have no break in period so if you don't want to invest the time and still want to check out a leather saddle they are worth a look.


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## bolandjd (Jul 23, 2008)

Yeah, you need way more than 40 miles to break in a Brooks. You might still not like it, but you should give it a fair shot.


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

Oh no. I'm giving it a fair shot, I'm not giving up on it. Like I said, 40 miles is nothing but I have to start somewhere. Just adding to the thread my first ride impression that's all.

As much as I'd love to try out the Selle Italia, I'm in between work right now so my days of experimenting are limited for now.

Thanks all for the input.


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## hikernks (Aug 21, 2012)

Baseball glove conditioner can help reduce the amount of break-in time.


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## GRAVELBIKE (Oct 7, 2006)

xjcrawlr said:


> Have you considered a Selle Anatomica? I tried a B-17 for a while, but I just couldnt get comfortable. Then I hopped on a Selle Anatomica and i havent looked back. I dont even wear padded shorts anymore.
> Like the B-17, it is a bit wide in back, making getting behind the saddle interesting.


This.

All my bikes have Selle Anatomica saddles now.


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## VO2 Lax (Jan 2, 2011)

I have read that the Selle Anatomica Titanico X is super comfy at the beginning but after longer distances it will sag and pinch. Any of you guys experiencing that? Now I'm curious to try also. TruLeather or Watershed. What's you're guys's experience? I'm familiar with the difference.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

VO2 Lax said:


> I have read that the Selle Anatomica Titanico X is super comfy at the beginning but after longer distances it will sag and pinch. Any of you guys experiencing that? Now I'm curious to try also. TruLeather or Watershed. What's you're guys's experience? I'm familiar with the difference.


I've used the titanico watershed for several years up to 19hrs at a stretch without padded shorts. No comfort issues.

I have several of these saddles and they are all comfortable for the long haul.


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## GRAVELBIKE (Oct 7, 2006)

VO2 Lax said:


> I have read that the Selle Anatomica Titanico X is super comfy at the beginning but after longer distances it will sag and pinch. Any of you guys experiencing that? Now I'm curious to try also. TruLeather or Watershed. What's you're guys's experience? I'm familiar with the difference.


TruLeather is stiffer than Watershed. The X is stiffer than the plain Titanico. FWIW, I weigh 195, and prefer the more flexible Titanico. I have one that's seen daily service for several years, and it's still going strong (despite being ridden in rain, snow, and off-road).

I, personally, don't want a saddle that lasts 30 years if 20 of them are spent waiting for it to break in.


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## coldbike (Feb 24, 2011)

I tried a Titanico watershed, and it ran through the tension adjustment in a very short time. I got the leather replaced and had the same problem with the new one. I think they are plenty comfortable, but I would really prefer a saddle that lasts me more than 1000km. I find that some Brooks are stiffer than others, but they always break in for me within the first 200km.


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## 1 Speed (Jan 8, 2004)

I used a Brooks Ti Swift for the TDR and for most of my riding. It fits my body type much better. In fact, 

I have two B17's here at home that I'd be willing to part with for a reasonable price.


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## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

Get the select version. Thicker stronger leather and no staining. Wallbike has a 6 month return policy if you don't like it.


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## Rthur2sheds (Apr 26, 2005)

I have 6 bikes in the stable. All six have a B17 (although I currently have a selle anatomica on one of the roadies ... And I am NOT sold on it, yet)


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## Spinymouse (Jul 11, 2010)

aBicycle said:


> Get the select version. Thicker stronger leather and no staining. Wallbike has a 6 month return policy if you don't like it.


I have a B17 Select on both my Cross Check and my Pugsley. I love the one on my CC. Very comfortable. But the one on my Pugsley really beat me up on my recent bikepack trip.

Then again, I broke the CC one in over many weeks of short rides. Whereas, I rode the one on my Pugsley 120 miles fresh out of the box with hardly any break in period. Ouch. Really. Ouch. :cryin:

The B17 Standard on my Karate Monkey has been awesome right from the start.

I really gotta work on that Pugsley seat...


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## Iamrockandroll13 (Feb 10, 2013)

My first B17 was ordered as a test. I just got the basic black steel rail version and put it on my El Mariachi. I went for one ride and immediately went back and ordered the Ti Rail Select version. Most comfortable saddle I have ever rode, right out of the box. I raced the B17 Ti Rail saddle on Trans North Georgia, a race with 1/4 of the climbing in the divide in a mere 350 miles. Lots of parts of me were sore 3 days later when I finished, my ass wasn't one of them. I will never let go of that saddle now that it is thoroughly broken in.


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## hendricks97 (Aug 7, 2013)

I bought a B17 about a month before I did 220 miles in 2 days. It felt great on the first day of 110, but around midnight, it started raining and didnt stop until around mile 60 of the second day. I had forgotten to bring a bag and didnt have fenders. Long before it stopped raining, the leather had absorbed so much water that it stretched a lot and I spent the final 50 or more miles in pain. I let it dry out for a week, then tightened it up and its felt amazing ever since.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

I have a B17 Narrow on my Crosscheck and love it. It might be worth looking at for those having trouble getting behind the saddle or just wanting something narrower between the legs. I've been putting 100-200 miles on it a week, often in really heavy downpour, and it performs flawlessly even though I still worry a bit.

I was thinking of getting a Brooks Cambium for my bike-packing rig just for the sake of doing something different and piece of mind.


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## Jethro_A (Dec 11, 2013)

I have a B17 Narrow that I love as well. I put about ~220 miles a week on it. As an ex-road racer I couldn't stand the size of a standard B17. I've never had a problem in the rain, but I'm pretty careful to not let it get truly soaked, which takes some effort here in Seattle. I have a C15 Cambium I'm going to install for this winter though.


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## Central Scrutinizer (Aug 30, 2005)

I'm running a C17 Cambium on my rig because I didn't want to worry about rain/moisture on a B17. At least for me, the Cambium feels great & disappears underneath me. 

I did have an issue with one of the nuts/bolts on the saddle loosening during a recent 5-day in CO. They're an uncommon T20 size (i.e. not a T15 or T25, which I had for my BB7s), but I managed to tighten it up enough with the flathead screwdriver on my multitool. Some Loctite should take care of that for good.


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## lextek (Mar 24, 2004)

Would buying a used Brooks bypass the break in? Or is it better to fit it to your butt?


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## Yagi (Dec 24, 2013)

I think, the majority of the time you come out winning if you tough it out and customize the seat to your butt, but I got lucky and bought a used one from a buddy of mine and it fits me perfectly. I rode his bike for a while before he decided he was going to sell the saddle, and when he finally decided, I grabbed it. Now, I've got B17's on my LHT and Psychlo-X, a Cambium on my Mooto-X, and a B17 Pro on my Soulcraft and love them all. I'm also in the minority, I guess, whereas I had a Titantico-X on my LHT for a couple years and really didn't like it. I'm 220 pounds and it just doesn't fit like a B17. Now, it just sits on the shelf. I'd sell it to anyone local to Fort Collins for 50 bucks. Just PM me.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

lextek said:


> Would buying a used Brooks bypass the break in? Or is it better to fit it to your butt?


I think its best to start fresh but then again my break in was easy. I just mounted it and used to for the 6 mile commute to work for a week before I started sprinkling in rides on my 60 mile route. The distances were short enough at first that it really didn't matter if it was a little rough. Then again, I might be one of the lucky ones since even at its worst its never been that bad.

Don't forget to condition the saddle!


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## Iamrockandroll13 (Feb 10, 2013)

lextek said:


> Would buying a used Brooks bypass the break in? Or is it better to fit it to your butt?


No you're good buying a used one to bypass breaking it in. they just get softer with time, it's not a thermoplastic mold to a specific butt.


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