# Front wheel lifting up when climbing



## drtgirl (Jan 8, 2008)

I'm not a newbie but I think this is kind of a newbie question. What would cause the front wheel to lift up when climbing something steep? I recently purchased a new frame and it seems like I'm positioned too far over the back wheel, but I'm not sure how much more I can move forward.I suppose I can move the seat forward and get a slightly longer stem...?


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## Dremer03 (Jun 19, 2009)

Stand when you go up hill, and position your self in the middle of the bike. When you are sitting your more towards the back and would obviously be more prone to flipping backwards.


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## KevinB (Oct 5, 2004)

drtgirl said:


> I'm not a newbie but I think this is kind of a newbie question. What would cause the front wheel to lift up when climbing something steep? I recently purchased a new frame and it seems like I'm positioned too far over the back wheel, but I'm not sure how much more I can move forward.I suppose I can move the seat forward and get a slightly longer stem...?


Yeah, try moving the seat forward. As you say, a longer stem might help too.

Are you using a setback seatpost? If so, you should consider switching to a straight (zero offset) post. This might allow you to move your saddle forward by another 3/4" to 1".


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## Surestick Malone (Jan 24, 2004)

Leaning forward towards the bars and sitting on the nose of the nose of the saddle will really help keep the nose down. 
Also pay attention to spinning smoothly, any sudden bursts of power are going to try and lift the front wheel (or break traction on the rear wheel). 
It may seem counter-intuitive but you might try using a harder gear, if you're using the granny gear/big cog try dropping a cog or two. Too easy a gear can give you too much torque at the back wheel and make it easier to either spin the rear or lift the front. 

Climbing a steep section is a balancing act between keeping the front down and enough weight on the back to keep it from losing traction. What works for me is to sit on the nose of the saddle and then adjust the front/rear weight balance by leaning closer to the bars. You develop a feel for it and how much you have to adjust weight distribution as the front tire rides over rocks/roots/ruts.


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## steadite (Jan 13, 2007)

I never had this prob till I traded in my "upright geometry" hardtail (Cannondale F3) for a bike with slacker geometry (Motolite)...I expect your Blur is similar. What I've found to help is sliding forward on the seat...basically sit on the nose of the seat. I know, sounds off, but it works.

Hey, I see you like Island Lakes! I really miss that place since I moved away from Hartland.


edit: I see someone beat me to the "nose of the seat" recommendation.


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Standing when climbing tends to make it harder to maintain traction (I ride singlespeed and geared...).

Sounds like your new geometry is probably different from the old. My older HT has a steep seat tube and I need a set back seat post to get the seat where I need it. The newer one has a slack seat tube and the seat is a little forward on a straight post for a similar balanced position on the bike.

How is the bar height? A higher bar can make it harder to keep weight on the front.

Is it full suspension? Soft rear suspension _may_ sag on uphills, moving your center of gravity back. Even fork damping can make the front bounce on uphills.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

*what's the new frame?*

As you've guessed, the front end doesn't have enough weight on it, causing it to lift, and wander. I don't know what bike you have now, but when I went from a HT to a 5" FS bike, my front end was all over the place, mostly due to the upright riding position - slacker geo. My seat was in the correct position, and my reach felt correct. Here's what helped me out....

I lowered the stem, by swapping a couple of spacers on top, and that made a lot of difference, without changing my reach very much. I think you have to adjust your climbing position a little too, if you've gone to a slacker geo. I sit a little more on the nose of the saddle when going up the steep stuff, now. It just took getting used to, and some adjustment to my riding style.

A longer stem will help too, if you feel you need to stretch out more, but too far a reach can be uncomfortable, and hand numbing.


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## laxman2001 (Jun 1, 2009)

d365 said:


> As you've guessed, the front end doesn't have enough weight on it, causing it to lift, and wander. I don't know what bike you have now, but when I went from a HT to a 5" FS bike, my front end was all over the place, mostly due to the upright riding position - slacker geo. My seat was in the correct position, and my reach felt correct. Here's what helped me out....
> 
> I lowered the stem, by swapping a couple of spacers on top, and that made a lot of difference, without changing my reach very much. I think you have to adjust your climbing position a little too, if you've gone to a slacker geo. I sit a little more on the nose of the saddle when going up the steep stuff, now. It just took getting used to, and some adjustment to my riding style.
> 
> A longer stem will help too, if you feel you need to stretch out more, but too far a reach can be uncomfortable, and hand numbing.


Yeah, I lowered my stem just to try it out/I was bored and it made a noticeable difference. Glad i was bored...


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## drtgirl (Jan 8, 2008)

I went from an old classic Blur to the new Carbon model, which measurement-wise is slightly larger, but I'm suprised at how different it feels. Yesterday I lowered the stem one spacer and brought the seat forward, and then rode soemthing moderately steep to test it out. I really had to move far up on the nose. It's got a 90mm stem and I think I might try a 100mm. I have a straight seatpost so I can't do much with that. 

Thanks for the advice!


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

With a new bike it often takes some trial and error to get it just right, whether you are trying make it just the same as another bike or find ways to make it different in character.... 

which brings me to a different question: Any observations on how the new bike behaves down the hill or over obstacles?


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## Qatarbhoy (Jun 13, 2008)

I wouldn't go crazy making changes at first. It takes time to get used to a new bike. I could barely ride my 69er when I first got it, then i found the front wheel popping up on climbs, and the fork would bounce right off rocks... All of these are no longer an issue, without changing anything major (the grips are different and i adjusted the fork settings) - simply by adapting to the slacker geometry and finding the right style to suit the bike. Result: I'm climbing steeper, more technical slopes I never managed before on my old bike.


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## Lookup (Jul 2, 2009)

I had the same issue with my new bike. It had an 80mm stem, with about a 5 degree rise. We lowered it and flipped it, so the rise was going down. It helped tremendously. 

You didn't say how tall you are, and how proportional you are. If you're long torso'd, I'd definitely go for a longer stem. However, if you're shorter, and proportionate like me, don't be afraid to try a shorter stem. (I know, totally opposite of everyone else's advice). I just went to a 50mm stem a few weeks ago, and it really helps get me over my bars when climbing. I haven't inadvertantly wheelied once, AND I have a lot better control for when I do want to wheelie over things. Worth some consideration...


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## mlepito (May 1, 2007)

Yeah, bar ends! It's 1996!

Try to keep your weight over the BB. You should be there anyway to keep the bike balanced and maintain good traction while still having control over the bike. (So it doesn't steer you. The stem ideas are good, but if you are comfortable with the set-up it might cause some other problems. 

Also, staying out of that small chainring in the front helps.


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## KevinB (Oct 5, 2004)

drtgirl said:


> I have a straight seatpost so I can't do much with that.


I met a fellow, perhaps a month ago, who was riding a Giant Reign X or possibly a Giant Glory. (I don't remember which save for the fact that he said that the bike weighed more than 40lbs.) I noticed that he had a Thomson setback post, except that he had the post rotated 180 degrees thus making it into a set-forward post. He told me that the bike's slack seat tube angle made it difficult to get his seat far enough forward with a straight post, so he flipped the Thomson around to compensate for the bike's slack geometry. He told me too that he had checked Thomson's website and found that it was safe to do this. It was definitely working for him because the dude was climbing some pretty steep hills. (I had met him at the top of the hill coming from the easier direction. I was thankful that I was descending the much steeper stuff that he'd just ridden up.)

Anyway, keep this trick in mind in case you can't find another approach for keeping the front end down.


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## drtgirl (Jan 8, 2008)

Downhills on my new bike are sweet. I'm having a bit of difficulty on rock piles and stuff though.

I'm 5'4" with very long legs. I'm not sure how going with a shorter stem will help if I need to put more weight over the front wheel...

I'll put in a few more rides and hopefully I'll adjust to the new geometry. Thanks again for the advice!


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## Lookup (Jul 2, 2009)

drtgirl said:


> I'm 5'4" with very long legs. I'm not sure how going with a shorter stem will help if I need to put more weight over the front wheel...


Yeah, it didn't make much sense to me either, but several bike fitters suggested it, so I tried it. I found that when my body was stretched out with a longer stem, it was impossible to really keep some weight forward without standing in the saddle. Consequently, I was bouncing off of every obstacle I encountered on a climb, and I always had to sit on the nose of my saddle, even on a slight incline. By having a short stem, I don't have to reach, and I keep my power centered on a climb. The bike doesn't want to come up on me at all. It still feels solid on descents and through rock gardens.

If you have a good LBS that you've worked with before, you might see if they will let you try different length stems (longer and shorter) on a demo basis.


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## NicoleC (Sep 28, 2007)

Since you mentioned long legs and a short torso (like most of us gals compared to guys)...

Can you look up the old geometry on your bike vs. the new one? Then you can figure out if it really is much of a change or if it's just a minor thing throwing you off for now.

If it turns out to be a real fit issue, I think you'll have more luck asking for a frame swap so soon after you bought it instead of later.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

Lookup said:


> I had the same issue with my new bike. It had an 80mm stem, with about a 5 degree rise. We lowered it and flipped it, so the rise was going down. It helped tremendously.
> 
> You didn't say how tall you are, and how proportional you are. If you're long torso'd, I'd definitely go for a longer stem. However, if you're shorter, and proportionate like me, don't be afraid to try a shorter stem. (I know, totally opposite of everyone else's advice). I just went to a 50mm stem a few weeks ago, and it really helps get me over my bars when climbing. I haven't inadvertantly wheelied once, AND I have a lot better control for when I do want to wheelie over things. Worth some consideration...


I think these are good points too. A shorter stem will give you more control, if you're too stretched out to begin with. If you're too stretched out, you have less leverage. You did say your new bike is a little larger, and you have a smaller torso.

First make sure your saddle is in the correct position to put you correctly over the pedals. Then decide if you feel too stretched out, or do you feel like you want to stretch out more?


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## 4slomo (Jul 4, 2006)

drtgirl said:


> Downhills on my new bike are sweet. I'm having a bit of difficulty on rock piles and stuff though.
> 
> I'm 5'4" with very long legs. I'm not sure how going with a shorter stem will help if I need to put more weight over the front wheel...
> 
> I'll put in a few more rides and hopefully I'll adjust to the new geometry. Thanks again for the advice!


First you want to get the frame fit to you, if you haven't already done that, to get your adjustments (saddle/seatpost, handlebar/stem). It's worth spending a few bucks for a professional fitting, if you're LBS isn't able to help you.

Next, you try riding strategies to put more weight over your front wheel while climbing (leaning forward/standing).

Third, consider getting an adjustable fork, to get the ability to drop it down on climbs.

If all of these don't work, you may want to consider another frame.


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## dulyebr (Jun 18, 2004)

try increasing sag. went from 25% (standard) to 30% and it really seemed to help.


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## emptybe_er (Jan 15, 2006)

Hmm... okay, I'm answering this question because 1) you're 5'4" w/ long legs, 2) you actually check back after posting a question and have since made some adjustments, 3) I'm relatively bored and have a slight beer-buzz going.

First, does your fork have "travel-adjust"? Reducing the travel on a long climb will assist transfer of weight toward the front; more weight on the front = less likelihood the front will lift and/or wander.

Second, a longer stem _will_ help but a gain of only 10mm indicates you just need to scoot to the tip of your saddle when the going gets steep.

Finally, because you shelled-out for a carbon-version, I'm guessing you're a rare-breed that just plain enjoys climbing. Part of the problem might just be an over-enthusiastic approach to the climb. Have you attempted the climb using different gear-combos and cadences. Personally, I've always thought of myself as a good climber. My problem was having enough for the climb and torquing it out so hard the vessels in my head burst only to be passed by others who could not only climb but had the gas in their tanks to blow by me after the climb.

Ah well, that's my two cents and my pint-glass is empty so best of wishes! Cheers! :thumbsup:


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## Red Leg (Jun 26, 2008)

From everything I've heard you mention, I would urge you to try riding standing more often.

Perhaps try it for a few rides or at least off and on and see what happens.

It may feel foreign at first but will pay big dividends once learned as a second-nature skill

It has revolutionized my own riding despite the fact that it took some time to adjust to after having ridden for 7 years in the seated position almost exclusively ... all I can say is wow what a great way to open doors for yourself and to become more fully rounded and armed as a rider ... especially for someone such as yourself who enjoys the rough stuff like rock piles and hair-raising downhills where standing exponentially increases your immediate control over the situation

You can just feel the bike moving and responding beneath you wherever you want to position it when attacking the inclines and great fun on the downhills like you're up there soaring with the birds ... standing incerases the "cone of movement" your whole body is contained within, side-to-side, front-to-back, and everywhere in between as you re-position yourself in a split second in response to trail conditions as well as increasing your view of the horizon because you're up higher


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## FruitaGuy (Jun 11, 2009)

Also, see this exact thread here: 
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=536680


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