# Rohloff Skipping



## UncleRobin (Dec 28, 2009)

I have a Rohloff hub that skips/slips under light load in gears 4,6,7,11,13,and 14. Under heavy load, say going up a hill, it does not skip. It is a momentary skip, maybe 45 (or less) degrees of pedal rotation, then it's back to engaged. It may happen every pedal rotation or it may be several rotations between skips. Kind of feels like a paw is not engaging when it’s supposed to. 

The hub is less than a year old (SN 1098xx) with around 6000 - 7000 km on it. A flush / oil change didn't help. It doesn't appear to be bike or shifter related, because my other Rohloff hub works fine on the bike.

A few other notes - The issue may be warm-weather related. It happened one day a week or so ago on a "hot" day, then went away during the week of cooler days. Hot weather returned Saturday and the issue came back. Saturday night it cooled off, issue went away. Same with Sunday. However Monday and Tuesday the issue was present day and night.

During the really cold days in winter, this hub had a pretty bad case of the cold weather freewheeling issue. 

The 7-8 & 8-7 shift can be kind of harsh compared to my other hub. BTW - the other hub is about 500 SNs newer with ~ 2500 km on it.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

UR


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## suba (Jun 25, 2009)

Contact Rohloff. If in the US contact Neil at Cycle Monkey.


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## alanm (Sep 2, 2009)

Mate, something isn't happy inside that hub of yours. Defiantly give your local Rohloff guy a ring. I've given mine hell over it's life and whilst it's been a bit noisy in the past, it's never skipped as you describe.

Al


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## pipe (Oct 10, 2007)

I have the same problem, except my hub is 10 years old. Very interesting because in my case I found that small amounts of wear throughout the system caused the unit to sit lower on the axle widening the distance from the main clutch ring which engages in exactly these gear combinations. When it is under load the engagement is solid because it is already suitably engaged on the teeth which would explain your symptoms. But what I don't get in your case is why such a new hub is sitting so low on the axle. Could be the shim at the base of the axle (inside the hub) or the washer under the e clip that holds the shifting bearing in place (external to hub). Both of these things will widen the distance from the drive side clutch ring if missing or under sized. But given the age of it, it is best not to void warranty to satisfy your curiosity. Send it back.

I doubt this thread is going much further and since my problem is similar I'll tell my story briefly.

Hub old and broken as above and well out of warranty. Rohloff wanted me to send to them to fix with worst case scenario of about 700 USD (Full internals replacement which is what they do when it is uneconomical to diagnose the problem I guess). I didn't think it was worth it so a pulled it apart. Not as scary in there as you might think. Identified the problem and ordered the replacement parts off of their exploded view from their website. No dice. Told that I didn't know what I was doing so would not supply parts.

From their point of view they would lose control over the quality of the hub so they don't want to play ball. 

But from my point of view they risk losing a customer and any referrals if they don't supply the parts.

If they were to supply then they get a happy customer and possibly another sale if the restoration does not work out. If they supply they can't lose, or at least all they lose is control over a single unsanctioned hub build. I just don't think it's right to throw away a whole hub because it needs a few worn parts replaced. What am I missing here?

Anyone agree? Disagree?


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## finch2 (Nov 13, 2009)

I don't see why they shouldn't supply you with parts. It's outside warranty and if it was a car you could get parts. They may be afraid that the hub will come back to them worse off and interfere with later repairs. Being a specialist item the hub would likely find it's way back to them . I am sure they know exactly what is likely to happen and what does happen over time and abuse, and losing control over the repair process may jsut be a hassle. 

It may just be too much bother to keep track of one guy if they have service outlets doing work for them too. Does the hub go back to Germany to the factory or a distributer more local? If it goes local maybe ask them to supply the parts for you?


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## suba (Jun 25, 2009)

UR....what have you decided to do. I would have immediately contacted the person whom I purchased the hub from ( assuming it was purchased new ) making arrangements to send it back for inspection-repair.

Are you the original owner of the hub with full warranty ? Can I ask where you bought the hub ? What have you decided to do ? 

pipe....I could see Rohloff not wanting to send parts because in most situations most people would not have the skills to properly diagnose ~ repair the hub and would probably make matters worse and then decide to return the hub for repair when Rohloff may have no other option but to inform the customer the hub isn't repairable when in fact it most likely would have been had the hub been initially sent in ( just a guess ) Maybe Rohloff did once send out parts, but decided they were getting back most of the hubs after the fact in worse condition than the initial problems incurred.


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## Everett37 (Oct 22, 2008)

pipe, check out Thorn Cycle's website (they are in the UK), they seem to have a lot of Rohloff parts.


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## UncleRobin (Dec 28, 2009)

Being how I have a second hub and other things that need to be done (pesky work stuff), I haven't done anything yet.

The hub was purchase from starbike.com in Germany. I am the original owner and I am in the USA. Frankly I am not sure how the warranty process would work; if it would have to go back to Germany or could it be handled in the USA by say Cycle Monkey. With the reputation the Rohloff hub has, I didn’t think warranty service would ever be a concern. 

An easy DIY fix is what I was hoping for to avoid figuring out the warranty issue and having to ship the wheel off to be repaired. 

In a similar note, I like to be self-reliant and not be dependent on third parties for repairs. The experience pipe had about not being able to obtain repair parts, especially for an out-of-warranty hub, concerns me. BTW - Thanks pipe for informative post. Honestly I would rather enjoy cracking open the hub and having peek at the internals.

Probably my next step should be to contact Cycle Monkey like suba suggested and see what they have to say.

UR


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## pipe (Oct 10, 2007)

I'm in New Zealand and there is no local service center here. So it would have to go back to Germany. But if there are service centers in the US or UK then perhaps I could get the parts through them. Thanks for that idea f2 and Everett37.

UR, if you do decide to pull it apart do know this, the top 4 layer stack of suns and planets only go back together in certain combinations and it would be best if you don't disassemble this part of the assembly as there is no need and by far the hardest to put back together. You can slide it off the axle as one unit and then make sure you hold it all together. But if it does come apart then there is a method to getting all back together again so don't worry too much. And change it to 11th before disassembly. In that gear all the pawls are disengaged. And drain the oil first.

Sending back to rohloff is obviously the least risk option but if you do go ahead with having a peek inside take it slowly and keep the exploded view handy.

http://www.rohloff.de/fileadmin/rohloffde/download/verschiedenes/explosionszeich/Explosion_speedhub500_14.pdf

The bit you are interested in is why the clutch mechanism nearest the drive side does not always engage properly.

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## alanm (Sep 2, 2009)

Mate,

I reckon not supplying parts for a 10 Yo hub that you OWN is a bit off, to say the least. Particularly given your location.

I'd write them a letter saying they'd be absolved of all responsibility, and if they didn't come to the party I'd then write 'em another letter extolling the virtues of my new Da Vinci hub and point out that Rolhoff technology was so "Yesterday" and how the majority of your mates are changing to the Da Vinci. Then I'd look for the parts elsewhere!!!!!!!

Australia has an agent on the East Coast and a mob called Quantum Cycles in Perth service the units. Guys name is Sat.

Al


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## pipe (Oct 10, 2007)

That is a very cool hub. Though it is a bit big and heavy in its current format. One to watch out for though. But I see the main competitor being Shimano, especially if the 11 speed Alfine is reliable. Trigger shifter is a bonus too for changing gears on the rough stuff. For now trying to get my old Rohloff working again is a fun project that hopefully has a good ending.

Servicing the units (oil, sprockets, bearings, seals e.t.c) is a bit different from reconditioning which requires the replacement of what are normally considered non-wearing parts. The question is, are these service centers authorized to completely strip down the hubs and are the able to source the core components?

I have emailed Thorn so will wait and see what they say. Will check out Quantum too. Thanks alanm.


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## itsdoable (Jan 6, 2004)

pipe said:


> I have the same problem, except my hub is 10 years old...
> 
> ...If they supply they can't lose, or at least all they lose is control over a single unsanctioned hub build. I just don't think it's right to throw away a whole hub because it needs a few worn parts replaced. What am I missing here?
> 
> Anyone agree? Disagree?


The company has every right to decide who it supplies spare parts to, and I can understand from the corporate view why one should not supply spares to unauthorised repair persons. That doesn't mean I like it either, being someone who like to repair things like this.









(not mine...)

However, at 10 years old, it's almost as old as my first hub. I tried to have it upgraded to disc (years ago) and ran into some issues. It seems the early hubs (pre-disc) used hand matched parts due to tolerances, and even after some trimming, they could not get the new parts to seal properly on my old hub, and there were also some issues with the bearing tolerances. The end result was, they upgraded me to a new hub - which was not necessarily a good thing, as it had to be broken-in again!

Although the _*NuVinci*_ hub is just as tough, it weighs twice as much, does not have the same range, and is not as efficient. The 11-speed Alfine is another matter though, but I'm not a fan of the trigger shifter.


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## NZPeterG (Mar 31, 2008)

Hi there is a Rohloff Service Centre in New Zealand it Chris a Puresports. So if you need service in N.Z. Chris is Your Man.
I only have a miss gear at the end of a long 100+km Mountain Bike ride so get a little slow at gear charge's But after 6 years a Rohloff is the best thing to come out for MTB's


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## pipe (Oct 10, 2007)

Yeah, its definitely possible that new replacement parts may be incompatible with my old hub. Would still be nice to give it a try though.

I have been dealing with Chris and have nothing but good things to say about his customer service but he is not authorized to do full service work from what I understand. I am working with him at the moment to try and get the parts from Rohloff but so far to no avail, hence attempting to contact a service center that can get parts.

And yes part of the motivation is to avoid having to break it in. Funny when old (but not too old) is better than new.


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## Wombat (Jan 25, 2004)

Perhaps try one of the authorised repairers in the US (ride monkey?) and see if they will provide the parts. I agree it sucks that Rohloff won't provide them directly. The hub is already buggered, so they have already lost control of the hub's quality. 

Tim


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## Everett37 (Oct 22, 2008)

*SJS Cycles in UK*

pipe, the site you want to look at is SJS cycles, also in the UK (they look like they may be part of Thorn). SJS has a pretty extensive selection of parts, but not sure they would have what you are looking for.


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## pipe (Oct 10, 2007)

Thanks for that E37 but just got an email from them this morning saying that they can't get internal parts because opening the hub up voids warranty. Looks like I am going to have to try and get it working without new parts. Possible I think, but just a shame. Truth is I don't even like grip shift so am quite looking forward to the Alfine 11. I will still see if I can get it going though if only to test my theory as to why it was failing.


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## MichiganClydesdale (Mar 24, 2004)

UncleRobin said:


> I have a Rohloff hub that skips/slips under light load in gears 4,6,7,11,13,and 14. Under heavy load, say going up a hill, it does not skip. It is a momentary skip, maybe 45 (or less) degrees of pedal rotation, then it's back to engaged. It may happen every pedal rotation or it may be several rotations between skips. Kind of feels like a paw is not engaging when it's supposed to.
> 
> The hub is less than a year old (SN 1098xx) with around 6000 - 7000 km on it. A flush / oil change didn't help. It doesn't appear to be bike or shifter related, because my other Rohloff hub works fine on the bike.
> 
> ...


Mine is having identical symptoms - I'm curious if you found any resolution to this issue? Mine has about 800 miles on it though, less than a year old. Definitely worse in hot and humid weather, but the problem is worsening with each ride (although the current rides are all hot / humid).


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## Boyonabyke (Sep 5, 2007)

I went down the same road. Do a search under my name or BrontoTX to see similar threads.
I lost the love for a Rohloff, felt like I was sold a Bill of Goods that never matched my expectations, compared to everyone elses.

Slowly, the failures are getting exposed. Not being able to get parts to tear into it myself sucks. Last Month, I did a full automatic to manual transmission swap on my Vw TDI. This is just a simple gearbox on a bike. Germans are really funny about self service and availablility of parts, as well as bailing out on warranting defects, both VW, Audi and Rohloff. Pretty sick of it, myself.


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## finch2 (Nov 13, 2009)

part of the attraction of the rohloff is the legendary reliability and robustness. i will be sorely peeved if mine has issues as well, but I have to admit so far so good, despite selecting a warantee voiding chain ring. Only about 2000km of steep offroad so far but loving it. If it breaks on me I will not get another one that is for sure.


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## UncleRobin (Dec 28, 2009)

*Update*

Just a quick update - I have been communicating with Neil at Cycle Monkey via e-mail and he has given me a few suggestions to try. Unfortunately no luck so my wheel/hub is going on a holiday to visit Neil to have the internals replaced.

In case anyone is wondering why it has been taking so long, it is slowness on my part and nothing to do with Neil or Cycle Monkey. Just recently I contacted Neil and he has been very helpful and receptive.

Also during my "possible fixes checking" the issue seems to be very strongly related to temperature. Start riding from being in air conditioning, all is well until it gets warm. Sit it out in the sun and warm it up, the issue is right there. My other hub is fine in the hot weather (around 4500+ km on it).

UR


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## MichiganClydesdale (Mar 24, 2004)

*another update*

Sorry to jack this thread somewhat - but after experiencing identical problems as the OP, I sent my wheel / hub to Neil at CycleMonkey and 4 weeks later I had it shipped back to me, with new internals - rode it today and it was perfect. No charge, no hassle (results may vary), and great service from Neil. I'm putting him on my Holiday Card list.


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## botibendi (Oct 8, 2021)

pipe said:


> I'm in New Zealand and there is no local service center here. So it would have to go back to Germany. But if there are service centers in the US or UK then perhaps I could get the parts through them. Thanks for that idea f2 and Everett37.
> 
> UR, if you do decide to pull it apart do know this, the top 4 layer stack of suns and planets only go back together in certain combinations and it would be best if you don't disassemble this part of the assembly as there is no need and by far the hardest to put back together. You can slide it off the axle as one unit and then make sure you hold it all together. But if it does come apart then there is a method to getting all back together again so don't worry too much. And change it to 11th before disassembly. In that gear all the pawls are disengaged. And drain the oil first.
> 
> ...


hi Pipe, please contact me. I would like to talk about the small polyurethan washer in between the two axles of the Rohloff hub. I ve seen several damaged ones, i ve got replacement, the skipping is caused by this, exactly how you say: the rotating axle position is essential. And this is very much depending on the condition of this little piece of plastic. email me if possible info et agyvaltoszerviz dot com.


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## NZPeterG (Mar 31, 2008)

botibendi said:


> hi Pipe, please contact me. I would like to talk about the small polyurethan washer in between the two axles of the Rohloff hub. I ve seen several damaged ones, i ve got replacement, the skipping is caused by this, exactly how you say: the rotating axle position is essential. And this is very much depending on the condition of this little piece of plastic. email me if possible info et agyvaltoszerviz dot com.


You're got misleading information, Rohloff has great support in New Zealand and the problem is only if anyone over tighten the axle! 

Rohloff fix it for free and know more then you.

You're just a troll.. plus this is a old post from 11 years ago. 



Sent from my SM-T590 using Tapatalk


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## botibendi (Oct 8, 2021)

NZPeterG said:


> You're got misleading information, Rohloff has great support in New Zealand and the problem is only if anyone over tighten the axle!
> 
> Rohloff fix it for free and know more then you.
> 
> ...


thank you for your reaction, but my entry was addressed to someone else. Did you see it?

i know this was an old post from 2010. 

if you think that skipping is only due to overtightened axle, you are wrong.

if you knew what i am talking about, you would not have answered to this post. But it is obvious that your rohloff knowledge is stretching as far as taking the wheel out and putting it back. Oh yes, and not to overtighten the axle. Or the nuts? or the skewer?

Than, and not then. 

My aim is purely technical, and no intention to question Rohloff's policy, accuracy, and friendliness of customer service of theirs. So, in this case, you are the troll.


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## NZPeterG (Mar 31, 2008)

botibendi said:


> thank you for your reaction, but my entry was addressed to someone else. Did you see it?
> 
> i know this was an old post from 2010.
> 
> ...


Hi 

I have double checked and the last post before you're is from 2010.
Most gear problems with a Rohloff hub in people using the wrong gear inner gear cables which caused excess drag making miss gear shift problems. 
Miss aligned frames also do not play and a number of different problems are user error. 
My 1st Rohloff was 47,--- and my 2nd was 147,--- and my 3rd was even newer.
I was personally looked after by my good friend Chris (the New Zealand Rohloff agent)
Plus if anyone have a problem in middle of the North Island of New Zealand with work on Chris behalf in fixing the Rohloff customers bikes. 
So I may know a load more than I let on here and probably do, with a background in Motorcycle Engineering and performance tuning, before changing over to work for one of the top MTB shops and we also have been selling eMTB's for over 8+ years. 

We also now rebuild Bosch and Brose ebike motors. 

So there.

Have a good day and it's time to enjoy Summer riding 

PS: Trolls live under bridges in Norway! 
I proudly live in New Zealand. 
You're just spamming people.


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## botibendi (Oct 8, 2021)

Hello Peter. 
It seems to me that you have to share your thoughts with someone who is only spamming people and is a troll. I did not ask what you do. How good or bad you are. I do not care what king of work you do. But you are very good, a good mechanic, you are proud, and you know a lot, et cetera et cetera. I hope it helps you to be present and keep your voice being heard. 

I ask one more time (ask myself, and not you, because i did not ask you), what could be your problem with a simple question regarding the rohloff axle. This is why i wanted to contact the member Pipe. If you can not share your thoughts about rebuilding a rohloff axle, please do not interfere. Just listen, or simply be silent.


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## NZPeterG (Mar 31, 2008)

botibendi said:


> Hello Peter.
> It seems to me that you have to share your thoughts with someone who is only spamming people and is a troll. I did not ask what you do. How good or bad you are. I do not care what king of work you do. But you are very good, a good mechanic, you are proud, and you know a lot, et cetera et cetera. I hope it helps you to be present and keep your voice being heard.
> 
> I ask one more time (ask myself, and not you, because i did not ask you), what could be your problem with a simple question regarding the rohloff axle. This is why i wanted to contact the member Pipe. If you can not share your thoughts about rebuilding a rohloff axle, please do not interfere. Just listen, or simply be silent.


1st stop being a A hole!

Second the problem was fixed year's ago.

3rd you're the one spamming old posts from over 11 years ago. 

4# go back to your cave.

5# Rohloff's are now out dated with no true thru-axle option.

6# start being nice to people! 

Sent from my SM-T590 using Tapatalk


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## sxotty (Nov 4, 2005)

Companies that won't supply replacement parts (Shimano brake seals) are super annoying. Obviously they should be willing to sell the parts, but they think the consumer will mess it up then be mad at them instead of accepting responsibility for their own failure. Canecreek would not sell me parts for an old Joplin either. It is common but annoying


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