# noise on my front wheel



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

am really to the point that i am losing my patience with my LBS.

i am the paying customer and yet i am the one trying to befriend them so i get better service. if my LBS was not close to my house i would have not wasted my time with them. the mechanics are super LAZY!

during my ride last Thursday, i, all of a sudden kept hearing a persistent noise on my front wheel. i checked it and nothing was stuck on my disc brakes. i only hear the noise (grinding (?)) when there is load on the bike. my riding buddy tried to adjust the brakes to no avail.

so, i take it to the LBS Friday, 30 minutes to closing and the mechanics diagnosed it as a wheel part rubbing, they where so lazy that they just rode the bike inside the LBS and obviously wasnt long enough of a ride that they were not able to hear the grinding noise (or were just pretending they did not hear anything) and did a couple of adjustments and made described the problem as not a problem (of course this did not make sense to me).

so ended up going home with obviously the problem not being solved. rode again today and the noise was still there.

before going to the LBS i researched what could be the problem and it could be the brake pads, yet my GREAT LBS MECHANICS did not even bother to check it out.

im riding again tomorrow and would not really want to ruin my day by dealing with these "expert" mechanics.

would appreciate it if anyone can help me out as i know its something i can probably do myself.

thanks in advance.

==== MAY HAVE FOUND THE CULPRIT =====

before taking the bike to the LBS, my buddy and i looked at my front wheel and might have found where the original noise was coming from.










i think its the pin sticking out a bit and was hitting just one of the spokes, that was why it was a "TICK-no tick-TICK"(no tick in between) noise rather than "TICK,TICK,TICK,TICK" (constant).

so if anyone comes across with this similar problem, please check the part pictured and make sure its not hitting any of your spokes.


----------



## natzx7 (May 30, 2007)

Sorry to hear your not getting good service at your LBS, but we are going to need more info to help. Best case scenario would be a YouTube vid of the noise, but if that's not possible a better description of the type of noise would help. It could be a warped rotor, dragging pad, or a bearing issue in the hub. Look very closely at the pad alignment through the top of the caliper and see if there is even spacing between the pads and rotor. It's going to be a process of elimination.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

natzx7 said:


> Sorry to hear your not getting good service at your LBS, but we are going to need more info to help. Best case scenario would be a YouTube vid of the noise, but if that's not possible a better description of the type of noise would help. It could be a warped rotor, dragging pad, or a bearing issue in the hub. Look very closely at the pad alignment through the top of the caliper and see if there is even spacing between the pads and rotor. It's going to be a process of elimination.


man, sounds like im almost certain id be seeing those lazy dudes again tomorrow :madman:

but to prove my case and so they dont say im making up things(dunno why i think they'd think of me this way) i did plan to try and record the noise. if my ridin buddies could hear the noise behind and in front of them, then im hopeful id be able to record it.

what i dont understand is the bike was all and well tuesday and all of the sudden the noise on thursday. i had no crash or any incident that would cause the noise (warping).

im thinking maybe the pads need to be changed? already? the bike is barely a month old...

thanks for the input though.


----------



## Loudviking (Oct 23, 2011)

Without knowing more, check your quick release and make sure
it's tight, also see if you can rock the wheel side to side with your hand,
could be loose bearings. Check your disc rotor bolts, see if they are loose.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

Loudviking said:


> Without knowing more, check your quick release and make sure
> it's tight,
> 
> *this is what the lazy mechanics thought and i did, and mind you there was two them with the same idea..*
> ...


......................................


----------



## Loudviking (Oct 23, 2011)

Well then, I would check too see if the disc rotor is straight.
Also check to be sure mounting screws for the brake caliper are tight,
could also be a pad is hanging up and not returning in the caliper.
Keep looking.........


----------



## deke505 (Jul 29, 2012)

bapski said:


> am really to the point that i am losing my patience with my LBS.
> 
> i am the paying customer and yet i am the one trying to befriend them so i get better service. if my LBS was not close to my house i would have not wasted my time with them. the mechanics are super LAZY!
> 
> ...


That actually might be the hub more then the brakes. Also try and go earlier so they can look at it longer or leave it with them for a day or two.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

deke505 said:


> That actually might be the hub more then the brakes. Also try and go earlier so they can look at it longer or leave it with them for a day or two.


darn it!

after a horrible weather this weekend i planned to make the most of the coming weeks better weather... guess that's the smarter thing to do...


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

*did i get my problem worse?*



natzx7 said:


> Sorry to hear your not getting good service at your LBS, but we are going to need more info to help. Best case scenario would be a YouTube vid of the noise, but if that's not possible a better description of the type of noise would help. It could be a warped rotor, dragging pad, or a bearing issue in the hub. Look very closely at the pad alignment through the top of the caliper and see if there is even spacing between the pads and rotor. It's going to be a process of elimination.


think i may have gotten rid of the problem, PROBLEM is i may have another problem!

after taking out the front wheel and inspecting the rotor, i then inspected the brake pads. i noticed there was something (4 prong spring(?)) covering the brake pads(?i know does not make sense, im researching what the part is while also typing) that i thought was in contact with the rotors and i kinda got hold of a flat head screw driver and spread it a bit; after this i tested the brake and noticed i was pulling harder on the lever to get the front break to work so i adjusted the screw by break lever up to the point where i thought i was pulling less (like it was before) to get the front break to work... now, when i tested the bike, i noticed the original noise was gone but now hearing this:



IMG_0211_zps9c4400c0.mp4 video by RAKET-Tech - Photobucket


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I think I know the 4-prong spring you're talking about. It returns the pads to the open position when you let up on the brake lever. I don't believe it's necessary to make the pistons retract, but without it your pads would just rattle around in the space between the face of the piston and the face of your brake rotor when you weren't braking.

You probably introduced a kink or a bend or something when you accosted it with a screwdriver. They're not the same on every brake, but in general, the brake pads are set up so that the spring sits further away from the rotor than the surface of the pad does, and never contacts the rotor. I bet that metal-on-metal between the spring and rotor is what you're hearing now.

If I'm right, you need a new spring. It's probably not sold separately, but your shop might have one kicking around or you can just buy a new set of brake pads. Use the new spring, and then when you eventually wear out your brake pads, use that same spring again. If the spring fails, you won't be in any danger, or at least any special danger - still a sport with some risk in it - it'll just cause your brakes to make annoying noises.

That the original noise only happened under load makes me wonder about other parts of the bike. I think loudviking and deke505 had some good possibilities. I'd add that when I ride my bike in the dirt, dirt sometimes gets in my brake calipers (go figure) and if there's dirt between the brake pads and rotor, there's often noise. So I wonder if that's what you heard.

I'm happy enough never to have worked as a bike mechanic. I like to make more money.  But I can say that in any remotely complex system, diagnosing an intermittent problem is a huge PITA. Don't be so hard on your mechanic for being unable to diagnose a sound that you can't describe, your riding friend can't fix, has an unknown source, and that he didn't even hear. FWIW, I've never tried to befriend my mechanic (well, until my mechanic was a friend-of-a-friend anyway, which is kind of fun) to get good service, and most of the time, I've been pretty happy with the service I've received. I also appreciate it when mechanics are comfortable enough to tell me they just don't know something - how to magically make my crappy cantilever brakes be less crappy, for example.


----------



## Danielrg_usa (Feb 12, 2011)

Did you put your sticky fingers all over the pads and rotor? Contaminated pads or a dirty rotor would cause that. Also, that 4 prong piece of metal is a retraction spring. It helps hold the pads in place and backs them off the rotor when the brakes are not being applied. I would not modify or change anything if you do not know what it is or how it works. That is usually not a good idea.


----------



## sauprankul (Sep 6, 2012)

^^^ this guy is right(The guy above the guy above me, no offense to the guy right above me). You might have screwed up when you put that spring back in there. I believe those are also called h-springs for they look like H's when totally unfolded. Those are crucial to good braking. Without those, you will get brake rub when you let go of your lever. I think you put the spring in wrong, and now the spring is actually hitting the rotors. You may have a) ruined the spring b) scored you pads c) scratched your rotors. 
On another topic, a grinding sound eh? You might not have tightened the skewer/axle enough. That would cause brake rub whenever you sat on the bike or turned sharply.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> I think I know the 4-prong spring you're talking about. It returns the pads to the open position when you let up on the brake lever. I don't believe it's necessary to make the pistons retract, but without it your pads would just rattle around in the space between the face of the piston and the face of your brake rotor when you weren't braking.
> 
> You probably introduced a kink or a bend or something when you* accosted* it with a screwdriver. They're not the same on every brake, but in general, the brake pads are set up so that the spring sits further away from the rotor than the surface of the pad does, and never contacts the rotor. I bet that metal-on-metal between the spring and rotor is what you're hearing now.
> 
> ...


*after trying to diagnose what was wrong and adjusting the brakes. we thought we fixed it. after we resumed our ride, he turns around (i was third rider behind him) and blurts out "its that you? (referring to the noise that he was hearing)"

i am and never was hard on my LBS mechanics even if i felt that they were more antagonistic towards me rather than being helpful. i felt that they were more of sarcastic with their remarks or mocking me for comments that probably was not MTB jargon. that was why i made extra effort/s to befriend them as i know i dont know anything about bikes. heck i even brought them gloves from work for them to use.

but right now, i just felt that effort to appease/please them is backwards and should not be the case. i bought close to 4K worth of bikes NOT including other bike stuff. and one would think they should be the one's kissing my BUTT and not the other way around.*



Danielrg_usa said:


> *Did you put your sticky fingers all over the pads and rotor? *Contaminated pads or a dirty rotor would cause that. Also, that 4 prong piece of metal is a retraction spring. It helps hold the pads in place and backs them off the rotor when the brakes are not being applied._* I would not modify or change anything if you do not know what it is or how it works. That is usually not a good idea*_.


*no i did not. just probed a flathead screwdriver on the "retraction spring". it looked like a "V" shape to me and i just probed the flathead on the "V" shaped part so it wont rub on the rotor, so i thought :madman:

guess to late about the modifying thing....*



sauprankul said:


> ^^^ this guy is right(The guy above the guy above me, no offense to the guy right above me). *You might have screwed up when you put that spring back in there.* I believe those are also called h-springs for they look like H's when totally unfolded. Those are crucial to good braking. Without those, you will get brake rub when you let go of your lever. I think you put the spring in wrong, and now the spring is actually hitting the rotors. You may have a) ruined the spring b) scored you pads c) scratched your rotors.
> On another topic, a grinding sound eh? *You might not have tightened the skewer/axle enough. *That would cause brake rub whenever you sat on the bike or turned sharply.


*i did not take anything out. *

*the mechanics, both of them, tried to do adjustments to no avail*

i think too, what this boils down too, is that, if the mechanics where not just in a hurry or more responsible to look into the problem more, this would have not turned out to be a bigger problem.

had they rode the bike outside the shop, they would have heard the noise instead of having me shoulder the "BURDEN OF PROOF" by having me describe the problem.

i understand it was close to closing time but they should have told me to either leave the bike or come back so they can look at it more. instead of kinda "shooing" me away and in effect telling me to go away, "the boss is not around and im busy surfing the internet".


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

You can always try a different shop too. They're not all the same, and some local shops just don't have a very good culture.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> You can always try a different shop too. They're not all the same, and some local shops just don't have a very good culture.


i most definitely would. but i guess itll be after a year when my warranty expires....


----------



## swl7 (Sep 4, 2012)

this is what I did when I had the same exact problem as you. I found out from my LBS, and had a better experience fortunately. My mechanic told me the brake pads were contaminated with oils while I was probably lubing my chain and cables. Instead of charging me $30 to ATTEMPT to decontaminate my pads and/or place an order for my specific pads, he told me the exact steps to clean my pads.

(some users do not agree with the following methods of cleaning pads as it may remove some of the coating existent in the system)

1. take out your wheel and remove the brake pads.
2. using isopropyl (I used 90%), pretty much soak the pads and try to clean off the pads with something like a microfiber towel or worst case scenario (which I used) q-tips.
3. also decontaminate the brake rotor on your wheel with the same method

this should reduce or remove your sound. if not, you probably have to replace your brake pads.


----------



## gridtalker (Dec 7, 2006)

bapski said:


> am really to the point that i am losing my patience with my LBS.
> 
> i am the paying customer and yet i am the one trying to befriend them so i get better service. if my LBS was not close to my house i would have not wasted my time with them. the mechanics are super LAZY!
> 
> ...


Sounds like its the hub


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

The work on your bike is not worth that much. In my area, about $60/hr., but most things only take a few minutes, for a minimum labor charge, to about a half hour if it's something more complicated. It's really only things like full overhauls, wheel work (which is what makes the overhaul expensive) and new bike assembly that start running into a lot of shop time, and therefore really getting hit with the high labor rate.

If you don't like your shop, don't let the warranty tie you to them. It won't void your warranty to go elsewhere, and if you value your time and another shop has you out on the trails again with less messing around, that's probably worth the $15-$30 you spend when you do make one of your less frequent visits.

I think it shows up in those "7 secrets of successful people" lists from time to time, even. But if you paid to have an extended service period or whatever, that money is gone. Every time you need to visit a shop, you have a choice to take it to this one or to a different one. If you're not confident that your shop will give you something of value, and you think another shop will, maybe it's worth the extra few dollars to pay for it. You won't get the time you spend on an unsuccessful visit to a shop back either.

FWIW, you have called your mechanics lazy at different points in your posts. Three times! (Thanks, Chrome Search, for making it easy to find that.  ) I think that qualifies as being hard on them. In the post in which you said you weren't being hard on them, you also called them sarcastic and antagonistic. Maybe all that is true - that much more reason to look for a different shop.


----------



## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

I gotta say, the sound in the vid sounds like rotor contamination with organic pads. I have not ever had completely squeak-free organic pads before, but anytime they get that bad, a good cleaning helps a lot.

sintered pads don't squeak so much, but they have their own unique sound.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> The work on your bike is not worth that much. In my area, about $60/hr., but most things only take a few minutes, for a minimum labor charge, to about a half hour if it's something more complicated. It's really only things like full overhauls, wheel work (which is what makes the overhaul expensive) and new bike assembly that start running into a lot of shop time, and therefore really getting hit with the high labor rate.
> 
> If you don't like your shop, don't let the warranty tie you to them. It won't void your warranty to go elsewhere, and if you value your time and another shop has you out on the trails again with less messing around, that's probably worth the $15-$30 you spend when you do make one of your less frequent visits.
> 
> ...


despite this dilemma that i have one good thing happened. a good friend, another riding buddy of whom i blame my getting hooked to MTB dropped by at work today and i had the opportunity to vent out what the problem was. he was kind enough to go to my house and get my bike and check it out himself. wow, now, i dont need a mechanic...

hopefully he gets to find what the problem is, as he too, is confident he will be able to find and fix it... worse case scenario would be just to bring the bike to the shop.


----------



## deke505 (Jul 29, 2012)

After hearing the noise I am thinking you should really not take a pet duck with you when you go biking. 


Okay serious now, does it only happen when you are braking or just when the shocks compress?

It does sound like either a contaminated pads or a very dry shock.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

deke505 said:


> After hearing the noise I am thinking you should really not take a pet duck with you when you go biking.
> 
> Okay serious now, does it only happen when you are braking or just when the shocks compress?
> 
> It does sound like either a contaminated pads or a very dry shock.


 thats what i was thinking too.. it would have been a bad idea to continue to ride on the trail . ..

noise happens only when breaking.

my riding buddy just reported most likely oil contamination. as i recall this probably happened after inserting the flathead screwdriver to try to widen the H-spring AND while the flathead was in between the break pads i squeezed the brake lever and felt i was pulling more compared to a usual "snap" to engage the break.

with the flathead in-between the pads, it would have been like the rotor in place, right? so in effect it was just like i was breaking? it should have not leaked right? it should have engaged the pads ... grr...


----------



## wsmac (Sep 5, 2010)

Just my thoughts... and these may not pertain to the O.P. specifically, but are my general thoughts on customer/business relationships...

First... adjust your attitude. Not being harsh here, but if you approach your interaction with your current LBS (or any other LBS to come), with all that negativity... see #1

#1. You will possibly always be on the defensive when you go in... which can sometimes be "read" by other people even if you don't think it's showing.

also...

#2. Don't KissAss! Your approach as you outline it, was to go in with the hope of "winning them over", even to the point of bringing them in gloves? I could totally see how they would treat you with some skepticism. I'm not condoning their actions or attitude, but you need to just go in seeing this whole thing as a business transaction. You are NOT special because you spent money in there, unless they feel it is in their interest to treat you that way. If I feel someone is trying to kiss my ass, I tend to think some things...
- they are up to something and I cannot totally trust them. I may do the best I can, but they will find something wrong and blame it on me whether or not I caused or failed to fix said issue.
- they are lazy and think they can "buy"my attention, "buy" my dedication to their personal requests, as well as take care of even the most basic owner-fix and not charge them for it.
I had this in horseshoeing as well as in the medical field. There are basic things people can do for themselves, but if they take it to a professional instead... they need to understand they will likely be charged time/parts for it. The option to not charge is the mechanic's/shop owner's... not the customer's. You warrant my attention by walking in to the shop, but at some point I have to decide when it becomes a burden to the business(and maybe other customers) to keep dealing with you.

#3. Try to define your problem in concise terms and not add anything extra to it. Happens in the medical field as well... patient comes in listing one complaint... then when being seen by the nurse or doctor, starts elaborating and adding material that is not related the original complaint. So, instead of the professional taking the original complaint and dealing with that, they are being drawn away by other added things which really does waste time. List all problems when you initially go in.

You may have done this the first time, I don't know. Just be aware of it when you go to another bike mechanic.

- What is the specific issue? Noise, vibration, loss of normal function, reduced function, and so on.
- When does it happen? All the time, only when I ______, right after I ______'ed...

#4. The only time a bike mechanic should be rushed upon with a bike problem, with 30 minutes left for them to diagnose/work on the issue... is at a race when they are a team mechanic! If you go in, even 2 hours before closing... to a bike shop.... consider this...

A bike shop with Bike Mechanics is likely to have plenty of jobs going on before you ever approach them. They may have new bike builds for the floor or a customer who just bought one, they may have bikes in for estimates on work or upgrades, they may have bikes in with simple repairs/numerous repairs/complicated repairs, and they may have bikes that are total garbage to the general biking enthusiast but the owner is damn sure it's worth it to fix their box-store bike as long as you can _"keep it under $100, but be sure to do me a tune-up... unless you can just replace a couple of things and not do the whole tune-up.. which is cheaper right?... then put on that new wheel my friend gave me that he said is 'high dollar' and is in 'brand-new' shape (in other words, it's was garbage for his friend, and if you do true it to at least make it rideable, he doesn't want you to charge for that)... oh and can you just patch my tubes instead of putting new ones in, and don't worry about the tires.. I know they're kinda old (15yrs, but only sitting in a shed for that time.. not really ridden on ) but I think they're still good..... on and on and on...."_

They may also be responsible for cleaning up at the end of the day, restocking shelves on the floor, taking in inventory when the big brown truck rolls in....

Yes... they may take a quick look, but you shouldn't really expect much unless they say they can take you in right away. Always be prepared to leave your bike for 2 days, but in the back of your mind... remind yourself it may be 3 or 4 (people don't show up for work for various reasons, mechanics who also have sales duties get drawn away from wrenching for the "I have a question about this _____!... minutes later... Do I want one? No, I'm just looking!"

Now... about your noise... 

From what I hear, the noise in your video is your brakes. That's it!
You are getting squeal from your brakes... pads rubbing out-of-line with your rotor, or possibly contamination.

My recommendation is this... get new brake pads (they will come with a new spring.. which is the "H", or "V", "thing" you guys have been talking about).
Depending on the brand, model, composition... you can spend $20 on up.

IF... and this should be a REALLY BIG if!... you are not confident enough to replace the pads and spring yourself... have a competent friend do it for you (realizing that just because someone says they've done it "hundreds of time on their own bike" doesn't qualify them as a bike mechanic and they may still F it all up for ya!  ). Have them show you how. Do it when you both have PLENTY of time... not too soon before a ride you really want to go on.

IF... this is another really big if... you do not have the skillz, or a friend you trust... don't buy the pads!
Go to a bike shop (your LBS or the ATWATBS[all-the-way-across-town-bike-shop]) and buy your pads from them and let them put the pads on.

Disc brakes... clean rotor with rubbing alcohol and rag, but do NOT scrub it clean!
The pads deposit onto the rotors... like they're designed to... it helps with the braking.
If you even suspect your pads are contaminated... why not spend the money to just start all over with new clean ones? Once you put new pads and spring on, you know THAT is no loner the issue. You can now diagnose from there, if the noise or whatever is still happening.

Rotors will bend and warp. They will wear down. New riders are more apt to lay on the brakes, for longer periods of time, than more experienced riders. Heat brings the wave on to rotors (some rotors more than others)... same with human hair of past, better-forgotten, bad-music eras... 

Loading a bike into the back of your car, your truck, having it fall over whether you were riding it or parking it, hitting a solid object on the trail... there are ways to introduce even a slight bend in your rotor that will cause it to rub your pads which will cause a consistent, rhythmic rubbing sound or feel.

Be sure your rotor bolts are properly tightened.
Having your wheel tightened down in the dropouts, out-of-line, will also introduce rubbing and/or noise. Of course I'm talking QR axles here.

aaaaaaaaand.... here's some more wonderful tidbits from wsmac! (_not sure why he thinks his sh*t's so special_ :nono:  )...

Do not use a screwdriver to spread your pads. You risk gouging/chipping your pads, torquing your brakes. I know some folks do it very carefully and are just fine with it. If you can be one of those people... more power to you!:thumbsup:

If not... remove your pads and spring, then spread your pistons... slowly... carefully...
Or else you could keep an old set of pads on hand to be protection when you want to spread things a bit.

eta: I see I forgot to mention something :ihih:
_Not sure if you know about toe-in toe-out, as it relates to brakes. With caliper brakes... when you have the pads parallel to the rim... they brake nicely and quietly. Now picture this... if you rotate the pads/shoes so that one end hits the rim first... you get chatter/squeal. Usually this is when the front end hits the rim first (there can be other issues at play like condition of the rubber, etc).

Now.. with that picture in mind...

With disc brakes, you shouldn't get that exact "out-of-alignment" issue, but instead your whole brake will be out-of-alignment with your rotor. Loose mounting bolts, or not bringing the brakes squarely against the rotor while tightening the bolts, can be one cause of squeal. If your bearings in your hub (or your hub body itself) are worn or not adjusted correctly, this could make your hub bring in this mis-alignment at certain times which could cause your noise._

Check out YouTube, ParkTool, Sheldon Brown, Zinn's book, Park's BigBlueBook.... to get a real sense of how to properly maintain your brakes, and how to service them, or at least understand what the servicing entails when you leave the job for the bike shop to do. You will also gain knowledge of the terminology, tools, and other great stuff from these sources so you can converse with your beloved bike mechanic... just don't try to act all "Pro" on them because you think you can "talk the talk" 
Daaaaaaaammmmmmnnnnn! What the heck am I doing? Sorry for the long, long, long, post :madman:

If anything I have posted applies to you, or makes sense to you, or helps you in any way... fanTAStick! 

If not... then kindly disregard everything and accept my apologies for the hour I have taken from your life while you read this... :bluefrown:

btw... my qualifications for the expertise required for your query....are...
Have ridden bikes since I was a kid
Speech Therapy in 3rd Grade (couldn't pronounce my R's, but I could play a mean game of Chutes & Ladders!)
Have worked on my bikes since I was a kid (note: I did not say "successfully")
Paratrooper/Medic 82nd Airborne
Rode my Sears 10-speed 60 miles once from El Paso to White Sands Missile Range when I was a teen
Worked as a Roughneck and Roustabout in the West Texas Oilfields
Trained and competed once in a "Half Triathalon"
Worked for the Department of Defense (can't tell you any more than that or else I'd have to send a Drone down on you on your next ride)
Owned, rode, and wrenched a Harley Davidson (not a Harley Yuppie Davidson).. bike, bicycle... eh... what's the difference? 
Worked for SoNat SubSea Services out of Morgan City, LA (my big dream of being a deep-sea diver... short-lived as it was)
Rode a Haro Mtb (no suspension) around Fairbanks, AK, even down to -20
... and the qual's go on 

today... I work in the medical field and parttime as a wrench in a bike shop... but I'm no expert... just saying... :thumbsup:


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

@wsmac

appreciate your inputs and your time putting in your thoughts. unfortunately i can only read so much at this time but i do see you put in thoughts about my dealings with the LBS.

for one ive never been anything but civil and proper with my LBS or for anything else. ive been raised and thought well i believe that id been admonished for addressing a person a SIR or a MAAM which is why im perplexed. how is it that i feel my LBS has negative vibes towards me? this only leaves me the DISCRIMINATION option as this is the only thing left. im asian.

me bringing in the gloves was nothing really. i just saw a mechanic using gloves and i happen to carry a box regularly in my car. the thing of it was i see this mechanic donning gloves all the time and with several visits he wasnt. so i thought they maybe out of gloves.

.. ill check on the rest of your posts later...oh btw. .am in the medical field as well. been a nurse for 20 years... hence no bike repair knowledge.. brake diagnosing to be specific...


----------



## wsmac (Sep 5, 2010)

bapski said:


> @wsmac
> 
> appreciate your inputs and your time putting in your thoughts. unfortunately i can only read so much at this time but i do see you put in thoughts about my dealings with the LBS.
> 
> for one ive never been anything but civil and proper with my LBS or for anything else. ive been raised and thought well i believe that id been admonished for addressing a person a SIR or a MAAM which is why im perplexed. how is it that i feel my LBS has negative vibes towards me? this only leaves me the DISCRIMINATION option as this is the only thing left.


Since I wasn't there, I don't know you or the mechanics... I totally understand my statements may not apply to you specifically. Glad you're taking them nicely :thumbsup:



bapski said:


> im asian.


I'm CaucAsian... so there seems to be some Asian in me too! I think we'll get along just fine! 



bapski said:


> me bringing in the gloves was nothing really. i just saw a mechanic using gloves and i happen to carry a box regularly in my car. the thing of it was i see this mechanic donning gloves all the time and with several visits he wasnt. so i thought they maybe out of gloves.


Nice gesture, but human nature being what it is sometimes... until you know these people pretty well... a nice act like yours can be taken totally out of context and then the attitude they apply to it may not be what you were looking for. Just my thought on it. There is a bike shop I still frequent because I know and really like the owner and mech's there.
It wasn't until I had shopped there a bit, and brought bikes in for service (before I started helping out in my town's shop) numerous times, that I did things like bringing in local apple cider for them and other stuff. Thing is... we did hit it off as friends and I ride with these guys as well.



bapski said:


> .. ill check on the rest of your posts later...oh btw. .am in the medical field as well. been a nurse for 20 years... hence no bike repair knowledge.. brake diagnosing to be specific...


Oh... you're a nurse?.... oooookay.... I'll just walk away now... 
Just kidding... heck, even some of my mtb friends are nurses... sorta helps them feel like regular folk... 

See ya 'round!:thumbsup:


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

so, turns out the noise is indeed from contaminated rotors and brake pads. there seems to be a leak coming from somewhere, think they mentioned the seal/s malfunctioned?

one of the mechanics i dealt with last friday was like a walmart greeter yesterday. stopped me halfway towards the service area and before i can even recount what has transpired, he asked me if the noise was still there and i said it was worse, sat on the bike like it was his own, pulled the brake lever and realized brakes were not working. looked at the brakes, grabbed the bike and mounted on the bike stand and studiously assessed the front wheel. even took out the front wheel.

i was dumbfounded! now that was what i call service! it changed my outlook towards the LBS and the mechanics to be specific, till i realized the manager was in the house! but still i was happy the mechanic was more receptive. i just wish itll be more consistent.

i was told replacement will take place in a week... which sucks... wont be riding till then, good thing is i wont be constantly check on the weather for a week.

thanks for your inputs guys..


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

*as for the original noise*

before taking the bike to the LBS, my buddy and i looked at my front wheel and might have found where the original noise was coming from.










i think its the pin sticking out a bit and was hitting just one of the spokes, that was why it was a "TICK-no tick-TICK"(no tick in between) noise rather than "TICK,TICK,TICK,TICK" (constant).

so if anyone comes across with this similar problem, please check the part pictured and make sure its not hitting any of your spokes.


----------



## wsmac (Sep 5, 2010)

Hope that ends the problems and you can get out and enjoy a squeal-free ride!
Thanks for the update and info!:thumbsup:

I think you may have learned a valuable lesson though.... YOU NEED MORE THAN ONE BIKE!!!
Somewhere... somehow... someday... your bike will be down for something... gotta have a second bike at least, so you can continue to ride!

You're an RN... we all know how you RN's only have to work like, 3 days a week, making $70+ an hour, often sent home because of low census but you get paid extra... and all that... filthy rich, that what nurses are... you can afford a half-dozen new bikes if you really wanted to ride


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

wsmac said:


> Hope that ends the problems and you can get out and enjoy a squeal-free ride!
> Thanks for the update and info!:thumbsup:
> 
> I think you may have learned a valuable lesson though.... YOU NEED MORE THAN ONE BIKE!!!
> ...


i dont know where you got that line of thinking. i was initially amazed by your previous inputs till the false facts you have about RN's... lol...

i wish that was true my friend. i dont only work 3 days. i work 10 days @ 96 hours to try and keep up with bills (and bikes)

funny, the mechanic remembered i initially bought a MAMBA from them and blurted "you still have the MAMBA right?" when he saw me flabbergasted when he said itll be a week before i can get the bike back.

both fortunate and unfortunate for me that i do not have the MAMBA (sold it) 
fortunate because im out of the doghouse (cant justify two new MTB for me, one for the wifey and one for the son)

but unfortunate because i now do not know what to do with such fortunate weather this week..


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I'm surprised Shimano just uses a split pin to retain everything. Not that it's supposed to be load bearing, but still.

One of the things that's nice about bicycles, although it's getting less true with some of the hydraulic systems, is that almost all the mechanical stuff is visible. Next time something like this comes up, and it will if you keep riding off-road, make sure to really look at where you think the noise is coming from, try it in motion, etc. before you start shoving hand tools in things. Hopefully you can avoid any more object lessons.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> I'm surprised Shimano just uses a split pin to retain everything. Not that it's supposed to be load bearing, but still.
> 
> One of the things that's nice about bicycles, although it's getting less true with some of the hydraulic systems, is that almost all the mechanical stuff is visible. Next time something like this comes up, and it will if you keep riding off-road, make sure to really look at where you think the noise is coming from, try it in motion, etc. before you start shoving hand tools in things. Hopefully you can avoid any more object lessons.


point taken.

i take it you are referring to the flathead screwdriver making it through the H-spring? that was just out of exasperation! was very frustrated as to why nobody(mechanics included) could not point out where the problem was.

believe me, i was on top and below the front of wheel numerous times....and to my untrained eye i just did not see anything wrong... you guys probably did not want me for a neighbor the night i was trying to fix/locate the problem... the squeaky sound was loud and horrendous..you guys might have called the cops on me..


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

bapski said:


> i take it you are referring to the flathead screwdriver making it through the H-spring? that was just out of exasperation!


I get that.

It's when we make our worst decisions. Sometimes it's better to just walk away. I don't care to think about how much time I've wasted trying to figure out why some big, nasty math problem isn't doing what I expected it to before revisiting it in an hour or the next morning or whatever and finding some silly mistake. I've also figured out that if I want to make good-quality wheels for any of my bikes, I need to space the build over a few days.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> I get that.
> 
> It's when we make our worst decisions. Sometimes it's better to just walk away. I don't care to think about how much time I've wasted trying to figure out why some big, nasty math problem isn't doing what I expected it to before revisiting it in an hour or the next morning or whatever and finding some silly mistake. I've also figured out that if I want to make good-quality wheels for any of my bikes, I need to space the build over a few days.


am curious though, did the prying of the H-spring have anything to do with the brake fluid leaking? how so?


----------



## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

AndrwSwitch said:


> I'm surprised Shimano just uses a split pin to retain everything. Not that it's supposed to be load bearing, but still.


My Maguras use a split pin to hold everything in place. And, no return spring. The pistons hold the pads magnetically.


----------



## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

bapski said:


> am curious though, did the prying of the H-spring have anything to do with the brake fluid leaking? how so?


pressing the pistons open on my Magura Julies can force fluid out of the system, but it does so at the fluid reservoirs on the levers, not at the calipers.

I can't say about yours, though, because I've never used Shimanos.


----------



## midnightlost (Feb 26, 2012)

wsmac said:


> #4. The only time a bike mechanic should be rushed upon with a bike problem, with 30 minutes left for them to diagnose/work on the issue... is at a race when they are a team mechanic! If you go in, even 2 hours before closing... to a bike shop.... consider this...
> 
> A bike shop with Bike Mechanics is likely to have plenty of jobs going on before you ever approach them. They may have new bike builds for the floor or a customer who just bought one, they may have bikes in for estimates on work or upgrades, they may have bikes in with simple repairs/numerous repairs/complicated repairs, and they may have bikes that are total garbage to the general biking enthusiast but the owner is damn sure it's worth it to fix their box-store bike as long as you can _"keep it under $100, but be sure to do me a tune-up... unless you can just replace a couple of things and not do the whole tune-up.. which is cheaper right?... then put on that new wheel my friend gave me that he said is 'high dollar' and is in 'brand-new' shape (in other words, it's was garbage for his friend, and if you do true it to at least make it rideable, he doesn't want you to charge for that)... oh and can you just patch my tubes instead of putting new ones in, and don't worry about the tires.. I know they're kinda old (15yrs, but only sitting in a shed for that time.. not really ridden on ) but I think they're still good..... on and on and on...."_
> 
> ...


Personally I would never show up to any business 30 minutes before closing unless I had a real quick issue: grab an item I need and get out, or was going to leave the bike with them overnight.

If I was there 2 hours prior to closing, it depends on how busy they look, if they have a lot of bikes in their work area being worked on versus if their all standing around bullshitting. But since my LBS is about half a mile from my work, I generally just drop it off when they open and pick it up when I get off work. :arf:


----------



## midnightlost (Feb 26, 2012)

bapski said:


> i dont know where you got that line of thinking. i was initially amazed by your previous inputs till the false facts you have about RN's... lol...
> 
> i wish that was true my friend. i dont only work 3 days. i work 10 days @ 96 hours to try and keep up with bills (and bikes)
> 
> ...


Does your LBS have loaner or rental bikes? The one near me does, and the rates aren't too bad either. I think it's like 15$ a day or something around there.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

midnightlost said:


> Personally I would never show up to any business 30 minutes before closing unless I had a real quick issue: grab an item I need and get out, or was going to leave the bike with them overnight.
> 
> If I was there 2 hours prior to closing, it depends on how busy they look, if they have a lot of bikes in their work area being worked on versus if their all standing around bullshitting. But since my LBS is about half a mile from my work, I generally just drop it off when they open and pick it up when I get off work. :arf:


30 minutes is approximate.. more like an hour... and they were not busy.. they were killing time.. watching tv, surfing...

if they would have said to leave the bike because they needed to check it out what the problem was, i would have been cool with it...that was what i expected anyway..

my meanie riding buddies has been texting me about the good weather and how they are having trouble finding who to ride with.. so, the wait for me hasnt really been fun..

on a good note, i checked on the bike and the shop is replacing the whole brake set, so i think ill be happy....


----------



## wsmac (Sep 5, 2010)

bapski said:


> i dont know where you got that line of thinking. i was initially amazed by your previous inputs till the false facts you have about RN's... lol...
> 
> i wish that was true my friend. i dont only work 3 days. i work 10 days @ 96 hours to try and keep up with bills (and bikes)


One of the E.D. nurses I work with told me that someone gave them that look and line... "Oh.. you ONLY work 3 shifts a week?"... Yeah! 12-hour shifts... in the Emergency Department which means most likely you are on your feet for the vast majority of that time dealing with patients and doctors and the other ancillary personnel!




bapski said:


> funny, the mechanic remembered i initially bought a MAMBA from them and blurted "you still have the MAMBA right?" when he saw me flabbergasted when he said itll be a week before i can get the bike back.
> 
> both fortunate and unfortunate for me that i do not have the MAMBA (sold it)
> fortunate because im out of the doghouse (cant justify two new MTB for me, one for the wifey and one for the son)
> ...


CROSSTRAIN! Go for a run or hike? Got a pool you can swim laps in nearby?

Sounds like things have changed between you and the LBS? Maybe that one day they were just short on manners and attention? :thumbsup:


----------



## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Get better at justifying additional bikes? 

When my mountain bike is down and I just have to ride dirt, I hop on the 'cross bike...

Do none of your friends have loaners? I think next time I visit San Francisco, I'm going to be riding a friend's FSR so he can show off his awesome new Santa Cruz. Cyclists can be real gear addicts. Not that I'd know anything about that.


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

wsmac said:


> One of the E.D. nurses I work with told me that someone gave them that look and line... "Oh.. you ONLY work 3 shifts a week?"... Yeah! 12-hour shifts... in the Emergency Department which means most likely you are on your feet for the vast majority of that time dealing with patients and doctors and the other ancillary personnel!
> 
> 
> *wifey supposedly works 3 12hr shifts a week in a hospital and sidelines in SNF to support my MTB addiction lol  (wish this was true)*
> ...


...........................................................................................................


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Get better at justifying additional bikes?
> 
> When my mountain bike is down and I just have to ride dirt, I hop on the 'cross bike...
> 
> Do none of your friends have loaners? I think next time I visit San Francisco, I'm going to be riding a friend's FSR so he can show off his awesome new Santa Cruz. Cyclists can be real gear addicts. Not that I'd know anything about that.


another friend has a TREK FUEL just gathering dust and he did tell me way back i can borrow it anytime, so called him yesterday and he is cool ....

texted/call back at my meanie buds after the call and see if they want to ride anytime and the funny thing, NOW that i have a loaner bike i get no answers... what the..

i think after i am certain that getting into MTB is not just a FAD for me that'll go away, i might just do a search on ebay/craiglist for FRAMES i can afford to have built up and use as a back-up ... just a frame so it can be work on progress (ergo, get parts as funds are available) and plus i get my hands dirty on assembling/working on my own bike and learn so i do not have to go to the LBS anymore.. :thumbsup:


----------



## bapski (Jul 27, 2012)

*how long does it take to replace hydraulic breaks*

the wait is just killing me. i was told one week and well, its the 8th day... LBS is open everyday so weekends count.

dropped by sunday and after exchanging pleasantries with the manager he said my replacement brakes already came in but he is not sure if it has been installed. i was ecstatic and one of the sales associates checked their computer logs if there was anything new noted and there was none! so we just thought the manager probably has not informed floor staff that he has received the replacement brake.

monday, i was eagerly waiting for their call to tell me i can pick up the bike as i was going to ride after work and dreaded the idea of having to use a loaner bike (TREK EXFUEL 8), finished my ride and its noontime tuesday and no call yet..  does it really take this long to put in replacement brakes? should i call them? i have a feeling my LBS has this bad impression on me so im trying to be as patient as i can so they dont think im freaking out on them.

to explain my visit on sunday, it was not planned. was going to check out a shock pump for the loaner bike, and of course see if could get an update on my bike (since it was still the 6th day, i guess i had no excuse to ask) and the LBS manager was just kind enough to update me about my bike without asking... sooooo should i call?


----------



## midnightlost (Feb 26, 2012)

Personally when ordering parts and waiting, I always ask for a rough time frame of when parts should be in and when work should be done. Then I give a day after that before I call and find out what happened. If parts came in and work isn't complete, I understand they get busy, I ask why and go from there. But if they had the parts in since at least Sunday which means they arrived Saturday, I'd be down there asking the manager why it isn't complete and whats the hold up.

I use this for any vehicle I have that needs repairs. The only time I've had to leave my bike at the LBS is because they had to order the part, part came in 4 days later, was put on next day, that evening I was out the door and riding home. They qouted me 5 to 7 days for the part to arrive.


----------

