# Dealing with cut thrus



## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

We have a downhill section of trail with several switchbacks that keeps developing a cut thru that goes straight up the hill/ fall line. It is going to eventually create a ditch from erosion that crosses the trail 2 or 3 times. At first we tried throwing some logs across it and covering it with leaves to hide it but someone took the logs and piled them on the official trail. Our next step was to build a short fence out of cedar to block it and posted a sign asking people to stay on the trail. But after about 24 hours, the sign was all bent up and the cut thru just got moved so it went out around the fence and there were more logs on the official trail. Luckily, we built our cedar fence strong enough so it couldn't be torn down. So the question is, how do we stop this behavior? Should we just extend the fence so it is more convenient to stay on the official trail or has someone had any luck with another method? Also, we are pretty sure it is the walker/joggers creating the cut thru.


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## cmg (Mar 13, 2012)

RockHillMtBiker said:


> We have a downhill section of trail with several switchbacks that keeps developing a cut thru that goes straight up the hill/ fall line. It is going to eventually create a ditch from erosion that crosses the trail 2 or 3 times...... and all the other stuff


wouldn't this create a new obstacle? and therefore increase your ability? and therefore increase your fun?
I love it when I belt down my favorite trail...........and something has changed, suprises are good....................and they test you

just my opinion though


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## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

cmg71 said:


> wouldn't this create a new obstacle? and therefore increase your ability? and therefore increase your fun?
> I love it when I belt down my favorite trail...........and something has changed, suprises are good....................and they test you
> 
> just my opinion though


In this case your option is not going to work. There is a stream at the bottom of the hill and the erosion from the cut thru is going to dump lots of sediment directly into it. There have been other areas on the trail where he have left cut thrus alone as long as they don't create an erosion issue and the people making/using the cut thruare the walkers.


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## Dresdenlock (Aug 10, 2009)

Big rocks are hard to move...that would stop someone from moving it...at least for a while.


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## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

Dresdenlock said:


> Big rocks are hard to move...that would stop someone from moving it...at least for a while.


I'll have to see if I can find some and then transport them to the problem area.


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## UncleTrail (Sep 29, 2007)

"Rattlesnake habitat, please stay on the trail."


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## ghglenn (Jan 26, 2012)

Use rounded logs (peelers/landscape timber), drill 1/2 holes through them. Buy 1/2 rebar, cut to desired length, to drive them deep into ground. Take a sledge hammer and "Nail" the logs 12"-18" into the soil. You can bend the end of the rebar about 2" from the end to make it hold the log down, just make sure to drive it flush with the wood, to not make anything dangerous. Can also stack more than one log and nail them together as described. This will be very difficult to remove if you drive them deep enough. Have also used T-posts driven in to soil, then attached the peelers with U-bolts. Just have to cut the t-posts to the height you want with cordless sawzall, once again for safety. The basic thought is this, if you are more determined and are willing to lug the necessary tools and materials out there, the trail cutters are most likely not going to do the same to demo your work/efforts. Good luck.


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## Skookum (Jan 17, 2005)

In addition to the blocking suggestions...

Try transplanting with new tree saplings or whatever you have growing around there. Put a little time into the re-vegetation, and make it look nice. Hopefully your "trail braider" gives up before you have to use a game camera and find out who the vandal is.


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## ray.vermette (Jul 16, 2008)

Try transplanting with thorny bushes.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

ray.vermette said:


> Try transplanting with thorny bushes.


yup, for sure. pyracantha and blackberries look nice.


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

You need to be more determined than your short cutter. It will be a challenge of who will give up first. Keep repairing, and making it more difficult to tear out.


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## pascale27 (Aug 26, 2011)

we had the problem at my local spot, we opted to maike log piles that are nailed together and fashioned in a way that it doest become a log over. Cut thrus piss me off the mess up the trail and if you get too many a trail turns into a rat maze


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## BonkedAgain (Aug 23, 2005)

Video surveillence? You never know who you might catch. It could be your mom!


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## Ridnparadise (Dec 14, 2007)

It does amaze me the effort some people go to to be dumb. We refurbished a series of tight switchbacks with new climbing lines and bermed turns for DH. Part of the process was closing an old braid. To save 20 extra metres "they" removed piles of branches and logs, collapsed the exit of one berm and damaged the mid-point of another by walking/slipping over them constantly, plus filled in a drain created to save the lower level from water pouring down this unrideable (too steep), falline braid. I guess the drain isn't needed now anyway, cause the water just pours over it by running off over the collapsed bit of ex-berm - sigh.


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## Billy Davis (Dec 12, 2011)

RockHillMtBiker said:


> We have a downhill section of trail with several switchbacks that keeps developing a cut thru that goes straight up the hill/ fall line. It is going to eventually create a ditch from erosion that crosses the trail 2 or 3 times. At first we tried throwing some logs across it and covering it with leaves to hide it but someone took the logs and piled them on the official trail. Our next step was to build a short fence out of cedar to block it and posted a sign asking people to stay on the trail. But after about 24 hours, the sign was all bent up and the cut thru just got moved so it went out around the fence and there were more logs on the official trail. Luckily, we built our cedar fence strong enough so it couldn't be torn down. So the question is, how do we stop this behavior? Should we just extend the fence so it is more convenient to stay on the official trail or has someone had any luck with another method? Also, we are pretty sure it is the walker/joggers creating the cut thru.


As described in Natural Surface Trails by Design "efficiency" is a highly valued perceived need by pedestrians. It's going to be hard to fight human nature right, maybe installing a sustainable "short cut" with steps or something similar will be the best solution?


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

Billy Davis said:


> As described in Natural Surface Trails by Design "efficiency" is a highly valued perceived need by pedestrians. It's going to be hard to fight human nature right, maybe installing a sustainable "short cut" with steps or something similar will be the best solution?


mmm, good point.


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## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

Billy Davis said:


> As described in Natural Surface Trails by Design "efficiency" is a highly valued perceived need by pedestrians. It's going to be hard to fight human nature right, maybe installing a sustainable "short cut" with steps or something similar will be the best solution?


I am kind of worried about giving in like this. I think the person who has been causing the problem will take it as meaning they were right and will just start causing more problems out there. We really don't have time to fix every new trail someone decides to make out there and still get the .5 mile new trail built that we have been planning. I think I might get out there this weekend and try some of the options people suggested.


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## Loren_ (Dec 3, 2006)

Our best results in preventing this sort of thing has been transplanting trees as suggested. People will move rocks, they will drag logs, they will even shovel dirt - but they think long and hard about killing a tree. 

It's a pain, though, especially if this means you need to drag water out there every day or so to keep them alive during a dry month.


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## Dresdenlock (Aug 10, 2009)

You put a big enough rock there...no one will move it...also finding a big dead tree..big enough where people cant bunny hop the thing...it will deter people Im sure.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

I suggest combining options. build fences out of very heavy materials - rock + heavy timber. Anchor that stuff. rebar, screws, large bolts, heavy baling wire. then around the fence plant the most vicious native plants you can find. a combination of shrubs and perennials (blackberries, devil's walking stick, nettles, poison ivy/oak, etc) and surround your constructions. post signs explaining WHY this fall line route is being closed (fall line route increases sedimentation into the stream below, which reduces oxygen in the water and kills fish and the things those fish eat).

if the person wants a direct, more convenient route down the hill, the person needs to work WITH trail crews to create a sustainable route down the hill. cutting through all the switchbacks is not the solution.


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## fishbum (Aug 8, 2007)

You could also try a sign; "Cut the crap, or a can of whoopass will be unleashed", or something gentler that describes who to contact if they want to help with trail work. If the individual(s) didn't know, then now they will, and others will be alerted that this is an issue. Of course the next day the sign may be gone, but it's worth a try.


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## Skookum (Jan 17, 2005)

Loren_ said:


> It's a pain, though, especially if this means you need to drag water out there every day or so to keep them alive during a dry month.


When transplanting a tree form the dirt in somewhat of a bowl, so it catches water from uphill. Make sure there is plenty of organic covering the base, and plant a stick and tie it up to keep it upright. If the roots stay wet there is a good chance a young tree will make it.

Keep as much of the original organic matter on and around the root ball as you can.


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## gmcttr (Oct 7, 2006)

We knew the hikers would shortcut the last tight switchback I helped with, so we built a stone stair case for them.


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## LWright (Jan 29, 2006)

Who manages the property and how concerned are they with the destruction?


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

why has no-one suggested a rattlesnake den or Croc pond in the 'cut-thrus'?


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## Ridnparadise (Dec 14, 2007)

Got our too lazy to walk/ride an extra 20m trail cutters today. They might have moved the last closure debris off, but it won't be as easy this time. Huge tree trunk, plus lots of add ons. Just use the trail....


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## Spec7 (May 3, 2000)

Around here we typically back fill the entire cut through from beginning to end with enough heavy logs, rocks, brush, and briars to deter reopening the cut through. If you have any dead standing trees nearby, some expertly made cuts to position the fall of the tree into the cut through trail bed helps too, but only do this if allowed by the land manager and you have an expert chain sawyer.

Basically if you back fill the cut through's so much that the removal of the back fill is more than a 15 minute project, people will generally give up and use the correct trail or.......create a new cut through :madman:


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## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

LWright said:


> Who manages the property and how concerned are they with the destruction?


The city's Parks and Rec department manages the property. If we took them out there and showed them the problems they might be a little annoyed but they probably wouldn't do anything about it.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Few things annoy me as much as people who straighten out trails. On some trails I have tried filling the cut through with rocks and trees only to find a couple of weeks later it has been all cleared out.

Now, I have take the philosophy that if there is a cut through then there must be something wrong with way I designed the trail. I find that do something like adding a berm (even though I dislike berms) at the right spot makes the cut-through go away.


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## HarryCallahan (Nov 2, 2004)

RockHillMtBiker said:


> The city's Parks and Rec department manages the property. If we took them out there and showed them the problems they might be a little annoyed but they probably wouldn't do anything about it.


You'd mentioned that whoever did the cut thru also vandalized signs on site. Just a thought. but have you thought about signs at the trail-head or some other visible location, asking folks not to cut switchbacks? There seems to be a subset of the population that just cuts switchbacks, whether on foot or a bike. I've seen the same problem on hiking trails deep in the mountains. Signage out at the trail head means everyone sees the message, and ostracizes the behavior. It won't stop it entirely, but may slow it down.


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## codyh12345 (Sep 15, 2011)

Land mines.... definitely land mines.


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## Dave_schuldt (May 10, 2004)

A big a log as you can find the drill holes for rebar at opposing angles then pound 4 foot lengths into the ground. This will make it so it can't be pulled up. If the center is soft drive rebar lengthwise down the center, that way when someone tries to saw it it will kill the saw.


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## BacDoc (May 31, 2011)

Snare pit lined with punji sticks. Sustainable, green and effective.

Sight and smell of decomposing bodies acts as deterrent and provides food source for beneficial microbes and scavengers. Aberrant gene pool removed from population. No hate from the Eco crowd- don't panic, it's organic!

Seriously, I have major issue with anyone who does unauthorized trail work. How much trouble is it to navigate turns/switchback? Don't like the trail then don't use it or build your own!


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## Spec7 (May 3, 2000)

Please be careful with the usage of rebar and mark it clearly. It certainly has its place and as long as it is well known to be present and clearly obvious to see, then it is less of an issue. However if the land manager is not aware of its usage in specific locations, in the event of a forest fire the rebar could spell disaster for an uninformed wildland firefighter crew running chainsaws to help clear underbrush.


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## sambs827 (Dec 8, 2008)

I like the idea of planting trees and shrubs there.

As Spec7 said, rebar use could be sketchy and in my opinion takes away from the natural feel of a trail as well.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

Is it completely unreasonable to build a sustainable shortcut? That sounds like (by far) your best option if its doable.


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## Ridnparadise (Dec 14, 2007)

One Pivot said:


> Is it completely unreasonable to build a sustainable shortcut? That sounds like (by far) your best option if its doable.


If the terrain allows for a cuthrough or braid or bludger line and multiple users are on the trail, then that makes sense, but: It could turn a singletrack system into a sculptured park system though if done widely and to modern trailbuilding guidelines.

In addition, the chance of sensibly making a walking line through the drainage of switchbacks, berms or other features is limited. You might put in a new diagonal line to preserve drainages and have walkers trample the ends. Snakes and ladders doesn't work off-the-board.

I think it is sad that walkers would even want to go to a place to avoid walking all of it! I walk trails over and over and over and never fail to enjoy the chance of being able to be there, see how the weather changes it all, what critters are up to etc. I'm there for a reason and still can't help but enjoy it!

It won't solve the OP's problem saying it and even taking the trailbuilder's emotional-advocacy hat off; changing a working trail system to suit someone who might be happier on a straight length of pavement makes no sense whatsoever.


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## dl1030 (Sep 3, 2009)

Heavy logs that are linked together with metal wire strips. wrap it around the logs, staple them together. bury it all in a little dirt so you can replant thorns (or PI) in the logs. (move one log, you move them all... and thorns)

if they are stealing or moving signs, paint the back of them with axle grease.


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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

RockHillMtBiker said:


> I am kind of worried about giving in like this .


That's pride F-ing with you:nono:

Do not let an unreasonable person prevent you from a reasonable action.

I'm not saying that accommodation is necessarily the answer here (I don't know enough about it), but if it seems like it could be less work for you in the end, then do it.

When people go off trail, it can been seen as a sign of irresponsibility on their part, but also as a failure of the trail to meet a user need.


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## RockHillMtBiker (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanks for the responses on this from all of you. I found some of them very helpful. I think I have finally decided what I am going to try next. When I have time I am going to build a fence to block off the whole area and then plant some trees and bushes where the cut through was. I think if I build the fence heavy duty enough where they can't tear it down by hand it will stay up. 

As far as trying to make a sustainable cut thru, I am not even thinking about going that route. This short cut thru is in no way a need for any of the trail users and it only cuts off about 30-40 ft of trail.


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## Fattirewilly (Dec 10, 2001)

Spec7 said:


> Please be careful with the usage of rebar and mark it clearly. It certainly has its place and as long as it is well known to be present and clearly obvious to see, then it is less of an issue. However if the land manager is not aware of its usage in specific locations, in the event of a forest fire the rebar could spell disaster for an uninformed wildland firefighter crew running chainsaws to help clear underbrush.


Dowel rods can be a nice substitute, sharpen one end into a spike for driving into the ground. Another downside to rebar is that when the wood rots, you have a chunk of metal sticking up for someone to impale themselves on 30 years down the road. Dowels obviously rot w/ whatever they're holding.


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## thumpduster (Nov 19, 2008)

dl1030 said:


> if they are stealing or moving signs, paint the back of them with axle grease.


Nice, I learned a new trick today. Thanks for that!


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## Westside Trail (Apr 18, 2012)

We like to build features or berms (positive control points) that draw people to the trail, not cut through. Keep in mind to leave bypasses, if needed.


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