# Dropping to flat



## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

Since I have got my new Dawg Deluxe I have been doing a bit of street riding and looking for some drops to play around on (I know its more an all mountain bike but whatever).

My question is what sort of heights do you reckon the bike can handle when I am landing flat on concrete? The highest I have gone is only just above knee height (soft I know) and it seems to handle it fine. I have an air shock (5" front and rear) which I am a bit worried about damaging so am gradually increasing the pressure to take bigger landings.

Any suggestions on the height limit so I won't do serious damage to the bike. Not so worried about damaging myself (my natural selection aka. wimp gene is pretty strong).

Cheers.

Photo of Bike here if link works http://www.konaworld.com/shopping_c...roduct_detail.aspx?productid=325&parentid=253


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## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

Don't do drops to flat. It is damaging to the frame and very hard on components.


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## Ojai Bicyclist (Nov 4, 2005)

Drops to flat are VERY hard on components and you. If you must do them, land rear wheel first and do it smooth. 

I would try to find some natural drops to ride as they will usually have a transition to land on.


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## B100 (Dec 14, 2005)

IMHO, drops 2 flat are less fun than stairs, which are less funn than drops to transition, which are less fun than jumps...


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

yeah I would definately prefer to drop to a transition but I've been keen to practice and the flat landings are the best I can get to quickly after work. 

Thanks for the advice. No excuses now...I've been warned.


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## BascoRider (Jul 12, 2005)

I'd be more worried about your wrists, ankles and knees being able to handle countless drops to flat, then your bike. The parts will be way less money to repair then wrecked body parts.


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## JBsoxB (May 18, 2004)

just above knee hieght cant be that bad.... just try not to go over 6ft.


hieghest i have done is 5 1/2' but that was fycking retarded and i don't suggest that anyone does it....

seriously try to find a tranny (transition, not a tranny) to land on, it will be a lot more fun (but landing on a tranny, like not a transition, would probably be more fun.


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## snaky69 (Mar 8, 2005)

Sick, twisted minds.


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## theg1ant (Oct 21, 2005)

I saw lenosky do a 7 foot to flat at one of his demos but then again lenosky is one of the smoothest trials and street riders ever. Still not good for bike. Not to hijack this thread but how do forces in a drop to flat compare to drops to a tranny. By this i mean generally would a 1 foot to flat equall a 2 foot to tranny? ive always wanted to know this bit of info.


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## bedheadben (Jan 30, 2006)

theg1ant said:


> By this i mean generally would a 1 foot to flat equall a 2 foot to tranny? ive always wanted to know this bit of info.


No where close I think, because think about it, what are the biggest drops people do onto a tranny? Around 60 feet. Now, what are the biggest drops people do to flat? Around 10 feet.

All I'm saying is, go ride a drop to flat, and a drop where you land on a tranny (not the kind that goes in your car), and tell me how much bigger you can go on the drop to tranny than the drop to flat.


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## snaky69 (Mar 8, 2005)

The difference between a drop to flat over a drop to tranny is that on the drop to flat, you decelerate extremely fast, you go from whatever speed you were going downward at to zero downward speed in no time flat. With drops to tranny, the speed goes down a lot slower, hence why it doesn't the bike as much when you have a tranny.


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## Kenny C. (Feb 13, 2006)

Knee high drops to flat really aren't horrible at all. I think I actually did a drop that was about middle of thigh high on a hardtail XC bike. Not the best thing on the cranks but it really didn't hurt much at all. And my friend does slow speed drops to flat that are pretty high (dropping off a dually and a few drops that were about shoulder high) on his Yeti ASX. Heck, one of my other friends dropped off a dually to flat on a Brodie Miscreant DJ bike with his shock locked out. This guy is insanely smooth though. He also tried to drop off a roof with his BigHit but missed the transition and landed to flat. That didn't go very well. The video is here if you want to check that one out. http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&n=2&videoID=572223673&Mytoken=E942E75D-C52C-11E7-63177D45C8553D8E11165538


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## BikeSATORI (Mar 20, 2004)

this might be the most retarded, yet most repeating thread topic ever....

but, get off your bike... if you can easily drop it by jumping off the edge without your bike, then, if you have some smooth bike control, then go for it. Now, I'm not talking walking to the edge of a roof, then hanging off the side, and dropping it, then using your hands to absorb the landing when your knees buckle or rolling out of it... I mean, step off and drop it using your knees, and if they can easily absorb the drop, then, possibly you could do it safely on your bike, assuming you have some bike control skills, not just demolition balls.

that said, why would you want to do this?? when you could go search for a transition and do a drop smoothly that may be well over twice or more larger than you could ever jump on foot! isn't that what makes biking better than walking? flow...


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

BikeSATORI said:


> this might be the most retarded, yet most repeating thread topic ever....
> 
> that said, why would you want to do this?? when you could go search for a transition and do a drop smoothly that may be well over twice or more larger than you could ever jump on foot! isn't that what makes biking better than walking? flow...


Yeah fair enough. I did a search after posting and found a fair bit already. I'm sure I am not the only one guilty for doing this.

I will justify my question by saying that it is much easier to find drops that have flat landings than those with transitions or slopes at the bottom which is why I posed the question. Drops are good fun but if you have to ride half an hour just to get to one with a sensible landing without anything else interesting on the way then whats the point.

Thanks for all the comments though they were very informative.


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## BikeSATORI (Mar 20, 2004)

hey man, I wasn't ripping you personally... sorry for the confusion. go ahead and ask questions! that's what these boards are for, feel free... I'm not one of these post nazi's, I've got plenty of questions myself that others might find idiotic... I'm just clarifying that, in my opinion, drops to flat are rather lame and in a way, I guess, something that comes to mind to someone just getting into the sport... 
but, somewhere, in your local urban setting, there has to be some ditches, banks, or something, no? stair-gaps?


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

Its cool man I wasn't offended or anything. Yeah the search will continue. There are some good freeride trails pretty close to where I am from too, it was more the quick play around after work I am after since this time of the year in Aus its dark by 5:00pm..

quick question for a newb while I'm here...when you guys talk about stair gaps is that jumping from the top or off a wall and landing on the stairs rather than at the bottom as a means of reducing the impact on the bike or do I have it all wrong?


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## BikeSATORI (Mar 20, 2004)

> talk about stair gaps is that jumping from the top or off a wall and landing on the stairs rather than at the bottom as a means of reducing the impact on the bike


yeah, exactly.... usually, it's gapping a set of stairs where it is built as a small set of down stairs, then a flat section in between, then another set of stairs going down farther below... using the bottom section like a tranny, but watch out, if the bottom set is too steep before flat, it will buck you...
damn, I didn't know it got dark that early there... I guess it is your winter now. always wanted to travel there, and new zealand as well... only heard good things, and met some really cool aussies when I lived in Japan...


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

yeah hours are **** this time of year but during summer its light until 8:30 or 9 at night. This is at the very bottom of aus though, its less extreme in the northern states.

Guess its a cool place. Where I'm from (tasmania) its pretty quiet, safe and half an hour drive to the top of pretty decent mountain with some good trails.


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## rocpyro (Feb 7, 2005)

Ive done 8' + drops to flat on my hardtail STP. Granted, I have good wheels, a saint crankset etc..... The biggest thing is just commiting to it and following through in the air. land on the back, lean back, and absorb most of it in your body, not the bike. Too many full sus riders let the bike soak it all up, but you should be doing most of it. with the bike you have(considering stock parts) you should be fine with 6' to flat, but build up to that and learn to land smoothly.


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## Kenny C. (Feb 13, 2006)

After doing a few more 3 or so foot drops to flat at slow speeds (just wheelie dropping), I now realize that it really hurts my ankles.


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## edray (Oct 3, 2004)

drops to flat are mindless and extremely hard on your components and you. I second just about everything that people said here. I


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## DHsloth (Sep 30, 2005)

Classic Kranked 3 video shows a lot of guys dropping to flat by about 10 feet or more...but then again they are trial riders


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## rocpyro (Feb 7, 2005)

Ever heard of Neil Tunicliffe(look him up, watch vids.)? He's my inspiration.


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## rocpyro (Feb 7, 2005)

here he is:
http://www.neiltunnicliffe.com/Videopage.htm


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

I do 2' to flat somewhat regularly on my XC bike. The suspension does not bottom out, so I don't worry too much. I do realise than i am decreasing the life of my frame a little though.

Work on your smoothness on smaller stuff. If you get good, I would not worry too much about waist height.

But, obviously, take note of all the warning you get.


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

Thanks for all the tips, warnings and comments.

Made a 4 foot drop on a downhill trail yesterday which was my biggest yet. Landing was sloping but not steep. First time one foot slipped off the pedals but made it clean the seond time. 

Crashed later after making a smaller drop and quickly trying to take a left onto another trail ended up taking my shoulder out on a tree. After some young kids laughed at me for that I went and watched them kick my ass on the dirt jumps, but thats another story. Should have started younger.


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## jake211980 (Feb 4, 2006)

Drops to flat can be fine if you do it properly. The thing about tranny are the angle you land on. If you are dropping to flat increase your speed that you hit it so hit farther off the ledge to reduce the angle and impact of the drop.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

I love how everyone thinks its rediculous to land big drops to flat.. some act like it doesn't take any skill.. but landing on a tranny does? Anybody can land a drop to flat, but not everyone can do it without breaking themselves or their bikes.


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

Jim311 said:


> Anybody can land a drop to flat


^probably ment to be a general statement, but of course there are exceptions.
I have witnessed somebody crack their helmet off a two footer to flat.


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## stevensj2 (Jun 19, 2006)

It can be done from decent heights if you know how to land.

I've seen people make 6-foot drops soft as a feather. It's all about control.

I do 2-3 ft drops pretty smooth. Any heigher and it starts to get rough.

With today's frames, I highly doubt you will damage your actual frame from any drop that doesn't kill you. Your rims on the other hand will taco and bend in half long before that.

General rule: if your head drops down upon landing, you're dropping from too high of a height or are landing improperly.


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## loco-gringo (Sep 29, 2005)

I do around 2 feet with no trouble. I can't imagine that any bigger wouldn't just hurt.


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## hardcore newbie (Nov 6, 2004)

depends on how smooth you are and if you are wearing WCH's infamus dickey


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## thebigred67 (Mar 29, 2005)

Three feet is something I do on my hardtail all the time. It gets a little boring. I don't want to go too nutz till I get insurance. 1) Get med. insurance. 2) make sure the rear tire hits first. )pull back and hang on). 3) Make sure you have enough room between top tube and taint! hehe


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## Kenny C. (Feb 13, 2006)

Another mistake is letting your poor shocks take all the impact. It ain't cool to bottom out your 6 inch travel freeride rig off of a 3 foot drop.


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

Its interesting that people have different Ideas of landing. 

I have been aiming to land on both wheels at the same time whether on a drop, jump, whatever. The only time I can see why you would want to land on your back tire is if you are doing a trials style drop where you end up nearly touching the ground with your ass and don't actually have foward momentum when you land. If you lad on your back tire then front at speed aren't you going to hurt the back wheel since its taking the full force that would otherwise be spread over two wheels?


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## theg1ant (Oct 21, 2005)

I think that landing rear wheel first lessens the forces around the headtube and other areas of the bike. Both wheels at the same time is easyer on the wheels but harder on the frame and fork.


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## snaky69 (Mar 8, 2005)

I've done 5 feet to flat yesterday, the chain didn't even slap the chainstay, it's all about smoothness. Land rear wheel first, hang your butt over the rear wheel and let your knees absorb most of it, and when your front wheel drops down, let the fork do whatever's left. I used about 40mm of the travel on my dirt jumper 3 on that drop, and it's set up fairly soft.


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## thebigred67 (Mar 29, 2005)

JKWITS said:


> Its interesting that people have different Ideas of landing.
> 
> I have been aiming to land on both wheels at the same time whether on a drop, jump, whatever. The only time I can see why you would want to land on your back tire is if you are doing a trials style drop where you end up nearly touching the ground with your ass and don't actually have foward momentum when you land. If you lad on your back tire then front at speed aren't you going to hurt the back wheel since its taking the full force that would otherwise be spread over two wheels?


At speed landing closer to both wheels on the ground makes more sense. I run a welded rhynolite rim on the rear so it will take allot of impact.


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## snaky69 (Mar 8, 2005)

JKWITS said:


> Its interesting that people have different Ideas of landing.
> 
> I have been aiming to land on both wheels at the same time whether on a drop, jump, whatever. The only time I can see why you would want to land on your back tire is if you are doing a trials style drop where you end up nearly touching the ground with your ass and don't actually have foward momentum when you land. If you lad on your back tire then front at speed aren't you going to hurt the back wheel since its taking the full force that would otherwise be spread over two wheels?


Thing is, the point of landing rear wheel first is to use your legs as rear suspension. When you stand on your pedals, the space between your seat and your crotch is what I consider to be my rear wheel travel.


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## bwolmarans (May 25, 2005)

ever watch a bmx video? they got your drops to flat allright - like 10 foot to flat no problem, like how about jumping 3 flights of stairs to flat landing. 
But that is with a 40lb bmx bike, lot of chromoly and 20" wheels.

The first thing that will break is your wheels, if you have bomber wheels like sun doublewides or doubletrakcs then maybe your fork will break next.


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## free rider (Nov 14, 2005)

i dont know how all you people ride urban, but to me urban consists of stair gaps, ledge drops, railing hops...and all of these have drops to flat...ive done 5.5' to flat and i do it consistantly...i have been doing it for months (since november) and i am yet to break a part. it seems so smooth, maybe im a smooth rider but the effect on the parts in my cased is minimal compared to drops with trannies. in my opinion urban consists of drops to flat, land rear wheel first compress and your body to take the shock.

just giver man


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## aggiebiker (Apr 18, 2006)

BascoRider said:


> I'd be more worried about your wrists, ankles and knees being able to handle countless drops to flat, then your bike. The parts will be way less money to repair then wrecked body parts.


dang nothin personal but i hear to many mtbr's coplain about flat landings
look at bmx, guy s ride stuff with big drops to flat just cause it was at the end of a rail or rail hop or somthin. there takin big hits w/ no cush.

check out this video, this guy does some massive rail hops to flat, and pay atention to the last thing he does in the vid http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?e...earch?ei=UTF-8&p=federal+steven&vback=Results


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

*oops*


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## free rider (Nov 14, 2005)

rkj__ said:


>


baby drop...thats hardly a curb


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## thebigred67 (Mar 29, 2005)

free rider said:


> baby drop...thats hardly a curb


 Quite Try a pinic table!


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

free rider said:


> baby drop...thats hardly a curb


Exactly. My bike is not going to explode just cuz it's "to flat"



thebigred67 said:


> Quite Try a pinic table!


Oh I did. Landed rear wheel first, and it did not seem too harsh.

Why am i posting int the urban/park forum anyways :???:


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## free rider (Nov 14, 2005)

thebigred67 said:


> Quite Try a pinic table!


quite try a 5.5 foot stair


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

free rider said:


> quite try a 5.5 foot stair


Maybe if you loan me your bike.


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## free rider (Nov 14, 2005)

rkj__ said:


> Maybe if you loan me your bike.


why youir girly trike wont handle it...i mean because my bike is so amazingly awesome


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## rkj__ (Feb 29, 2004)

free rider said:
 

> why youir girly trike wont handle it...i mean because my bike is so amazingly awesome


I would not want the streamers to get damaged if i wiped out.


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## Tarbaby4Ever (May 2, 2006)

JKWITS said:


> Since I have got my new Dawg Deluxe I have been doing a bit of street riding and looking for some drops to play around on (I know its more an all mountain bike but whatever).
> 
> My question is what sort of heights do you reckon the bike can handle when I am landing flat on concrete? The highest I have gone is only just above knee height (soft I know) and it seems to handle it fine. I have an air shock (5" front and rear) which I am a bit worried about damaging so am gradually increasing the pressure to take bigger landings.
> 
> ...


Just make sure to check your frame for cracks after every ride,especially when you are doing drops to flat and the like...


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## aggiebiker (Apr 18, 2006)

that drop would be a annoying and in the way on my rides, tiny little curb


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## standard235 (Jul 23, 2005)

Drops to flat suck. End of story. Time for pr0n..


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## theg1ant (Oct 21, 2005)

when you land rear wheel first how much rear wheel is too much rear wheel? My friend got this sequence shot of me landing a drop off of a loading dock a while ago and some one said i landed too much on my rear wheel and that i should try and get the wheels to touch down around the same time.

Heres the picture:
https://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5514/1638/1600/Ericdrop.jpg

Ya i know i have very ugly form but it feels smooth and i have never had anything brake on any of my bikes because of impacts.This is including my giant yukon that i use to do this drop atleast 10 times every day for 1 year


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## InsaneP2rider (Jun 10, 2004)

wow... a lot of you guys need to chill. yes, you can drop to flat moderate big if you want to, but no matter what it's hard on you bike. and that doesn't mean if you do some drops to flat sometimes you WILL break your bike.

like someone said, when doing urban sessions, a lot of stuff is just small drops to flat. You're supposed to be hard on your bikes... haha.

but when you get to big, then drops to flat just hurt and seem pointless because they're not fun.


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## JKWITS (May 8, 2006)

*Dropping to uphill*

Okay so I landed the 3-4 foot drop to flat on my local trail a few weeks ago (I'm a noob so was a pretty big step for me) returned to hit it again. Unfortunately this time I approached it on a bad angle where the landing sloped up and then flattens out. By the time I was aware of this it was to late so decided to bunnyhop off the takeoff to attempt to clear the uphill section but all I did was land the front wheel square on the slope sending me and my bike in two different directions.

Actually felt good to have a stack since it woke me up a bit although I was lucky not to get hurt.

Will return again soon to hit it properly.


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## free rider (Nov 14, 2005)

InsaneP2rider said:


> wow... a lot of you guys need to chill. yes, you can drop to flat moderate big if you want to, but no matter what it's hard on you bike. and that doesn't mean if you do some drops to flat sometimes you WILL break your bike.
> 
> like someone said, when doing urban sessions, a lot of stuff is just small drops to flat. You're supposed to be hard on your bikes... haha.
> 
> but when you get to big, then drops to flat just hurt and seem pointless because they're not fun.


:ciappa:...sorry i couldnt find any other salute than that....but i agree totally and thats why im saluting you


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