# WTB content, if it works



## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

i'm going to try and give this a shot, never posted on the new forum yet.

here's my rigs, all special to me because the sport WTB Speedmaster Rollercams, headsets, BB's and hubs. i'm a nut for that stuff. i write up more on each if this picture posting works correctly.

thanks
nate
https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3842.jpg
https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3844.jpg


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

man, i really messed this up. maybe i'll just try one picture.
This should be a picture of my 92 Steve Potts, 93 WTB Phoenix, Ritchey Super Comp, and a super mint Ritchey Timber Comp.

both the Ritcheys have Speedmaster Rollercams front and rear, kinda unique i think, and ther reason i dig these Ritcheys, since the WTB Rollercams are my favorite brakes.

over and out
nate

https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3845.jpg


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*clean seatstays*

all right, this is tricky, especially for us slow kids trying to use a mac when your use to a pc.

this should be a rearend shot, i hope.

nate
https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3855.jpg


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## wooglin (Jan 6, 2004)

cursivearmy said:


> man, i really messed this up.


No you didn't.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

*and the susp forks bow humbly to*

to their rigid superiors?


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Now, that! ...is one great room.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

VERY cool. What a nice place to work on bikes! Id love to see a shot of each one individually.

Ritcheys with front roller cams are pretty rare from what I have seen. Laffeaux would also love to have those Ritcheys posted on his site: www.oldmountainbikes.com

Definitely an enviable collection. They all look so clean too.

Thanks for the pics.


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

We seem to be attracted by similar bikes. My fillet-brazed Potts 1991, my wife's 12" XC-racer and my Phoenix.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*yup, we sure do!*

Hey, twins!

wasn't your Potts on display at a show in Germany about 5 months ago? Very nice bikes you've got there, we definetly have the similar tastes eh. I can't get enough of the work that Steve and Charlie did in the beginning. Did you know that Steve is building frames again full time, and do you happen to know how many of his frames he painted like ours?

thanks for the comments.

here's a picture of my other Phoenix like yours with my 96 TiMojo with a Fat City Big Once Inch fork. not really vintage, but it's gettin there.

over and out
nate
https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3837.jpg
https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/DSCN3836.jpg


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

cursivearmy said:


> wasn't your Potts on display at a show in Germany about 5 months ago? Very nice bikes you've got there, we definetly have the similar tastes eh. I can't get enough of the work that Steve and Charlie did in the beginning. Did you know that Steve is building frames again full time, and do you happen to know how many of his frames he painted like ours?
> QUOTE]
> 
> It is good to hear Steve is building frames again. His bikes are so good and so beautiful. Do you have any contactinformation?
> ...


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

I don't know how many frames were painted like ours. I know about the bike-art bike show in SF around 1990. That made me wanting that paintjob. Was that your bike?[/QUOTE]

The postcards that accompanied the show, with all the various bikes on them is supposedly my bike, i think that Victor told me that. i don't have one of the postcards but Charlie Cunningham sent me the postcard that had his rig on it. very cool guy.

i have Steve's phone number somewhere in the house, i'll dig it up for you. I think he might even be able to do TypeII's again. i'll check.

yeah, both my 96 Phoenix, and the Ti Mojo steer alot better with the rigid forks, since the axle to crown height on both is better for each, most susy forks are to tall these days, unless they are only 63mm of travel.

nate


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

" The postcards that accompanied the show, with all the various bikes on them is supposedly my bike, i think that Victor told me that. i don't have one of the postcards but Charlie Cunningham sent me the postcard that had his rig on it. very cool guy."

I have one of those original postcards. This is a scan of it. It should be your bike then.


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## airwreck (Dec 31, 2003)

Fillet-brazed said:


> Ritcheys with front roller cams are pretty rare from what I have seen. QUOTE]
> 
> Was hoping someone would comment on this ebayer.
> Looks like it didn't sell.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> VERY cool. What a nice place to work on bikes! Id love to see a shot of each one individually.
> 
> thanks Fillet-brazed, very nice of you to say. i had to move my shop into the basement and out of my garage, too much moisture. kinda turned a nice basement into a dirty bike work room. but it won't be downstairs for long. things are in the works.
> 
> ...


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

Pottser said:


> " The postcards that accompanied the show, with all the various bikes on them is supposedly my bike, i think that Victor told me that. i don't have one of the postcards but Charlie Cunningham sent me the postcard that had his rig on it. very cool guy."
> 
> I have one of those original postcards. This is a scan of it. It should be your bike then.


yup, that's it. the original owner removed the WTB fixed angle post and installed an XC Suntour, but other than that it's the same. i installed the two layers of Cork/Cloth, but the Shimano 600 aero levers with the cables ran under the cork with an Inline adjuster on the rear brake housing, distinguish it. thanks for posting the postcard, that's what my Cunningham one looks like.

over and out
nate


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Yep. WTB in my mind made the best equipment out there. It really id too bad that Charlie and Steve had to part ways with WTB, but life happens. It is good to hear that Steve is building again. Maybe I can talk my way into a 29" TypeII? Oh, wouldn't THAT be nice! Nate, I had no idea you have so many *nice* rigs! My Pheonix was originally green like that one of yours, but I was unhappy with the quality of it. I totally wore through the green on my top tube in one summer. I loved the green though, I just wish it was better quality. Now its a nice beery color.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

hey marty!

wearing away one's paint is probably a good thing, it means you rode the thing a ton! 

i like how you've changed up your Phoenix since i last saw it in MPLS, the Paul brake on the front is a great choice, nice complement to the Togglecam out back. You put gears on it eh, after you got the Hunter back.

yup, WTB is the stuff, and i do bet that you could get a 29" type II, especially since Steve has built some of those. that would be a bike i would love to have, a Ti Steve Potts like the Ti Phoenix, but 29" wheels and dual Togglecams on a Type II out front! better sell my truck.

how's the snow, we've got 15 or 17 inches around here, lot's for lincoln.

nate


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

I actually talked to Steve recently and he still does Type II forks and you can get them for 29ers. I have his number somewhere on an email too. I'll see if I can find it.


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## ssmike (Jan 21, 2004)

Gorgeous! I need to get my buddies together and get some photos - let's see, one Potts, 4 Salsas including my wifes, one Ibis among others.

Thanks for the photos. Glad to hear Steve is making bikes again. He is most at home in the shop. The 29 Type II sounds most intriguing.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*some Type II's*

here's some Type II's awaiting their prospective frames to be attached to.

ones a potts, the other is a cunningham, the later using the taper wedge system.

over and out, i'm tired.

nate


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

and another, 

after a whole day of this crap, i finally fingered it out. 

night,

nate


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

oops, wrong angle

nate


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

I assume the one on the right is the Potts made? Hard to tell from those angles, but I heard that Potts always has a nice concave indentation near the drop out rather than just flat. My WTB TREK is concave.... Its a nice little touch. 

Wow, you sure have a lot of WTB stuff and lots of stickers!!

Thanks for hte pics.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> I assume the one on the right is the Potts made? Hard to tell from those angles, but I heard that Potts always has a nice concave indentation near the drop out rather than just flat. My WTB TREK is concave.... Its a nice little touch.
> 
> Wow, you sure have a lot of WTB stuff and lots of stickers!!
> 
> Thanks for hte pics.


thanks for the complements FB, but actually the one on the right is the Cunningham, it has the Taperwedge top, and the left is a Potts, except it is a Tig welded Potts, instead of Filletbrazed, so neither one of those forks has the concaved ends like on my Potts F/F or my old Phoenix F/F.

yup, i'm a dork for the early WTB stuff,still waiting to get a full Cunningham, and maybe a Ti Phoenix with dual Togglecams, then i'm done. i've got some more early WTB equiptment as well, but the digital cam is shot. got about 3 extra pairs of MultiMounts that aren't on rigs, some powerband stems, Ti WTB bars, Toeflips, RM2 Dirtdrops, Classic WTB Hubsets, Paradigm front hubs, stuff like that.

oh, and the stickers came courtesy of a decade as a bike mechanic making 5 dollars an hour in NE, only to go in debt to try and make 7 dollars an hour as a bike mechanic shop owner. but the stickers really did come free, gotta love stickers.

over and out
nate

i'm glad we have the new Vintage forum, change is nice.


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## Darren-Birkin (Feb 12, 2004)

*My WTV Phoenix*

Pic taken last summer at Dalby Forest (UK).


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## smudge (Jan 12, 2004)

*I miss my Phoeni(xes)*

I had two of them. A steel red one that I sold to a friend and a Ti one. My favorite was the 15" titanium Phoenix that I had for a few years and stupidly sold after I bought an Ellsworth Specialist and didn't ride the Phoenix anymore. It was the 11th made and it definitely rocked the house. I miss it and it's the only thing I've ever sold that I regret. I still have the headbadge though.


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## Tad (Jan 13, 2004)

*freakin' beautiful, D-B*

what year is the frame?? And what's with the triple bottle bosses? Adjustable positioning? Is that some kind of rubber seal on the seat tube? Does it work?


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## smudge (Jan 12, 2004)

Tad said:


> what year is the frame?? And what's with the triple bottle bosses? Adjustable positioning? Is that some kind of rubber seal on the seat tube? Does it work?


The three holes for waterbottles were for the ultra big bottle cage that WTB developed to hold Evian bottles and such. They were able to utilize the three mounting holes.

I'm assuming that what you think is a seal, is actually a seat tube reducer shim. The frames were made to accept a 31.8 mm seat post size which were (are) hard to come by at times. A think more than a few people used spacers for them instead of purchase the Thomson, Syncros or American Classic posts that were likely needed.

Sean


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

I recently bought a second hand Willits 29-er. One of the reason to by this one was the Type II it had. Wes Williams told me Steve did the crown and he did the legs. It is the black one next to the fillet-brazed one on my Potts and the Tig one of my wife. So nice!

The other picture is one I got at the end of the 90's from WTB. Steve building Type II's.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*nice!*



Pottser said:


> I recently bought a second hand Willits 29-er. One of the reason to by this one was the Type II it had. Wes Williams told me Steve did the crown and he did the legs. It is the black one next to the fillet-brazed one on my Potts and the Tig one of my wife. So nice!
> 
> The other picture is one I got at the end of the 90's from WTB. Steve building Type II's.


man, that's a great picture! they sent you one eh, nice photo. I remember seeing the Willits on Ebay a while back, good for you on picking it up, nice bike, and even nicer with a 29" type II. how do you like the 29" wheels? i've been ridding my Matt Chester 29"er pretty much exclusively for over a year now, so dang versatile.

thanks for the pics
over and out
nate


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## tianyou (Jan 13, 2004)

That's a cool photo--but do you think it was a staged promo shot? That's the whole WTB crew right? Slate, Seidler, Cunningham and Potts.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Man, I'm not sure what it is, but Ritchey's just don't do anything for me. I mean, I can tell they're nice bikes and all. I just don't like them all that much I guess. Asthetically there's just something off to me. Something just doesn't add up. Short TT's, long looking rear ends, level TT's(I know, it goes for the day). I guess that why I like the WTB's and Cunninghams so much. Sloping TT's just look good to me. Now Ritchey's road bikes and cross bikes...that's another matter. Beauty's, all of 'em! My wife has a Road Logic she loves. I think it'd be pretty cool to find a Mountcross too.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Ok, how many of us are bidding on the WTB Rollercams on eBay right now? That dude gonna make a killing on those brakes if we keep it up!


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## ssmike (Jan 21, 2004)

~martini~ said:


> Man, I'm not sure what it is, but Ritchey's just don't do anything for me. I mean, I can tell they're nice bikes and all. I just don't like them all that much I guess. Asthetically there's just something off to me. Something just doesn't add up. Short TT's, long looking rear ends, level TT's(I know, it goes for the day). I guess that why I like the WTB's and Cunninghams so much. Sloping TT's just look good to me. Now Ritchey's road bikes and cross bikes...that's another matter. Beauty's, all of 'em! My wife has a Road Logic she loves. I think it'd be pretty cool to find a Mountcross too.


Me too! I really wanted to like the P23 when it came out but it was just way too short in the t/t - like almost 2" too short in the largest size. And yes, the road bikes are gorgeous. I particularly liked the Swiss Cross.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*i have to agree*



ssmike said:


> Me too! I really wanted to like the P23 when it came out but it was just way too short in the t/t - like almost 2" too short in the largest size. And yes, the road bikes are gorgeous. I particularly liked the Swiss Cross.


i only like the Ritcheys with all WTB components. the geometry is way stinking off. but dual rollercams and WTB/King Hs, thats the stuff for me.

but marty is right, Cunningham/WTB geometry is the stuff

nate


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

cursivearmy said:


> even nicer with a 29" type II. how do you like the 29" wheels? i've been ridding my Matt Chester 29"er pretty much exclusively for over a year now, so dang versatile.
> nate


I am riding my Willits for over 2 months now. I almost ride this bike exclusively. I don't have a reason to ride my other bikes. Like you said, it is such an allround bike and very precise. The geometry is a pretty much copy of my Potts, so it rides very similar. The bigger wheels give an extra advantage.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*that dude's gonna make....*



~martini~ said:


> Ok, how many of us are bidding on the WTB Rollercams on eBay right now? That dude gonna make a killing on those brakes if we keep it up!


a killing if we bid those suckers up to $135 per brake plus $40 for each brake brace! then we'd be paying original cost price, but, if you want them, where you going to find them?

what's it worth, you know.

i'm just stoked someones actually selling, cause i'd be hoarding.

over and out
nate


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## Darren-Birkin (Feb 12, 2004)

*WTB Phoenix*



Tad said:


> what year is the frame?? And what's with the triple bottle bosses? Adjustable positioning? Is that some kind of rubber seal on the seat tube? Does it work?


Tad - I'm really not sure what year the frame is. I bought it as a complete bike off Ebay a few years back. The paintwork was pretty scuffed up and it had all sorts of stickers on it. I had it resprayed as close to the original colour as I could get it and WTB supplied the new decals and head tube badge (with the exception of the chainstay "140mm dropout spacing" decal that they didn't have). It makes a lovely summer single speed 

The three bosses do let you put the cage in different positions. I didn't realise that WTB also did extra large cages that used all three.

As for the seat tube, yes that's a shim to take a 27.2 post. I have a Syncros Ti inline post that is the right size that came with the bike but wanted to add a bit of layback.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

cursivearmy said:


> i'm just stoked someones actually selling, cause i'd be hoarding.


 a-fockin'-men nate. T'ain't no way I'd be selling them. I would really like them. REALLY like them. but I don't know if my account can handle that kind of out put right now.


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Yeah, I know I can't either, that's why, at my $90 max, & the next guy who puts a bid down has em.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

*phoenix geometry*

i would like to take a look at the phoenix geometry numbers. if i remember right (why do i remember these things????) a 17 in would have a 22.5 tt, 72 seat and 71 head angles. cs would be 16.8. an 18in would have a 23in tt and the other numbers would be the same. 
weight would be 4.5 lbs for steel and 3.5 for ti.
does anyone have an old catalogue wiht numbers for all sizes?


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Actually, I think the 18 had a 23½" tt. I was debating tween it and my 19" which has a 24" tt on it. I went for the 19" cause I didn't think I could get a seat post long enough for the 18". My frame wieghs about 5 lbs even I think. 7" head tube on it. I don't even cut my steer tubes. Just a few spacers and I'm good to go! Makes putting the bike together easier.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

*oh yeah: the tall head tubes.*

7" head tube on it. I don't even cut my steer tubes. Just a few spacers and I'm good to go! Makes putting the bike together easier.[/QUOTE]

really tall. you don't need risers and... you can have a drop bar with not much hassle.


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## victorthewombat (Jan 12, 2004)

flyingsuperpetis said:


> Yeah, I know I can't either, that's why, at my $90 max, & the next guy who puts a bid down has em.


Dude; that was me <victorthewombat>, with apologies. I bid 'em up to $105 which was about my max for buying them. Did you see the final?, $205!!!!!!!!! Some guy from Germany. There must be a WTB hoarding going on over there.

Victor


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Yeah, my max was about $120. I bid $110 but dropped it after that 'cause there was too much time left to actaully get tehm for that price.

On another note, what's everybodies handles on eBay? I figure it might be nice to know what/who we're up against. I'm *unclefuzzy_ss*.


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## victorthewombat (Jan 12, 2004)

*ebay monikers and identities*

Mine is more of a sobriquet:

ebay: 1203zorlag
mbtr: victorthewombat

Victor "super retro and super grouch" Hanson


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

*... found in switzerland*

... near a streetcar station 

enjoy the pic's ...

ciao
flo


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*that's a beaut!*

nice!

that two tone pink Potts is amazing! have you had it long? i thought i remember seeing it some time recently. maybe not, can't remember.

either way, great bike, i sure do dig Potts bikes.

over and out
nate


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

cursivearmy said:


> nice!
> 
> that two tone pink Potts is amazing! have you had it long? i thought i remember seeing it some time recently. maybe not, can't remember.
> 
> ...


... thanks, but this, and some other great bikes, belongs to a friend. I'm only the happy one who can make the pictures 

ciao
flo


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## Guest (Feb 26, 2004)

floibex said:


> ... thanks, but this, and some other great bikes, belongs to a friend. I'm only the happy one who can make the pictures
> 
> ciao
> flo


...and you are not the only one taking pictures there... this one is from the same stable.










and this one










and many many more...

thanks to Pete for collecting all these gems and to Flo and Reto for taking the pictures!

Carsten


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

hey! 

I know where both of those Cunninghams came from! The top one was purchased from Rim Cyclery in Moab, and the bottom one is Chuck's from Pacific Coast Cycles in Oceanside Cali. I've ridden that bike, truly amazing, especially with the custom stem, front modified "scissor" cam, and custom shifter mounts.

Your friend must do some serious collecting, especially since there is a big difference in size between the Potts and his Cunningham's, so he couldn't really ride all of them. 

either way, you two should take some more photos, seems like pete has an amazing collection.


over and out
nate


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Both of those Cunninghams are beautiful. I remember that first one selliing on ebay 2-3 years ago maybe. It only went for $1750! I should have bid...........My size too.

Awesome bikes.

Pete has lots of nice bikes. Please, bring on more pics of Petes bikes. Id love to see his whole collection.

That pinkish Potts was on ebay not too long ago also if thats the same one........


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## islander (Jan 21, 2004)

Anyone know what used rollercam brakes are typically selling for? Also, any ideas on where to find (other than ebay)?

Thanks for the great old bike pics guys,

Mike


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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2004)

*My WTB content*

Arrived today...

1994 Phoenix, 15"










Partly unfortunatly; its a Phoenix, not a Phoenix SE. Nevertheless, I'm pleased, Looking forward to see who it rides beside my DeKerf's, Bontrager and Breezer....

Will be a long-term project thought, to get it rolling....


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

*right on!*

way to go, where'd you pick that phoenix up? one of mine up above in this thread, the two tone tan and creme one, use to be gunmetal blue like yours, i loved that color.

i wouldn't be bummed if i were you about it being a Phoenix and not the susy adjusted SE, cause they still don't handle too awful well with as a SE with a 63mm fork. I would be stoked, cause you can contact Steve Potts, and have him build you a Type II racing fork, that will go perfectly with the geometry of your rig.

Keep us posted on the build as you go along.

i ride both of my Phoenix's regularly, just raced the 93 phoenix fully rigid and dirt drops this past weekend, got a lot of weird looks from all the kids on their full susy race rigs. even had a guy ask me if my WTB multimounts were the "new" sti! haha. only about 11 years old.

anyway, nice phoenix.

over and out
nate


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## Pottser (Jan 30, 2004)

I borrowed this "Fitfinder" from a shop today to find the right dimensions for the stem I need for a WTB drop bar on my 29-er. This truly shows the perfection Charlie is aiming for.


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## thaumazein (Feb 18, 2004)

*Steve Potts*

Does anyone have contact information for Steve Potts? I seem to remember someone saying that he's still brazing up forks...I'm thinking it's about time for a Type II. Thanks.


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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2004)

cursivearmy said:


> way to go, where'd you pick that phoenix up? one of mine up above in this thread, the two tone tan and creme one, use to be gunmetal blue like yours, i loved that color.
> 
> i wouldn't be bummed if i were you about it being a Phoenix and not the susy adjusted SE, cause they still don't handle too awful well with as a SE with a 63mm fork. I would be stoked, cause you can contact Steve Potts, and have him build you a Type II racing fork, that will go perfectly with the geometry of your rig.


The SE version is not neccesarily the suspension adjusted. There where basically two models; the Phoenix and the Phoenix SE. The only difference between both these models where, that the SE had the 'powerbosses' for the Rollercam/Togglecam brake setup.

Both the Phoenix and the SE were available in a suspension or rigid fork geometry. Only the 12" versions never got available for a suspension fork.

My Phoenix won't be anywhere near a suspension fork. I ride rigid forks in all my rides and prefer the overall ride and joy I get from that. This Phoenix will get a WTB Offroad bar and trying to get it as much WTB-complementary as possible.

To bad the 'reall' WTB doesn't exsist anymore. The current WTB lifts on the hertiga Charlie, Steve and Mark had built up. The current WTB is nothing, compared to what the real guys did back in the days.

Little off topic:

I'm still thinking I made some dreams true the last couple of years. I always dreamed of having a DeKerf. Got one... dreaemed ahead... wanted a '94 Team/Mountain DeKerf.. Got one as well (aside 2 other DK's). Breezer and Bontrager where an eyecatcher too. Currently riding many of my trainingmiles on a '94 Breezer. The Bontrager (with horizontale dropouts) is in a -search-for-parts- process (same as the '94 DeKerf).

With the finding of this Phoenix I made one of my last wishes true. It's not a big deal it isn't a SE version. I'm a pleased youngman


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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2004)

Finally found the picture I was searching for a while....

Alice B. Toeclip, or Jacquie Phelan. Nice in person and nice in pictures too ;-)

(Thanks Marco!!)


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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2004)

A little WTB Content also:

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?p=137329#post137329


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