# New Da frame photos



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

We've got a new DaVinic in the works for us. This is would be a custom bike with greater tire clearance, long stoker compartment, chain guide etc, etc. The fine folks there have also changed up the rear suspension and frame in general. Thought some might like to see the photos of it.


----------



## ds2199 (Sep 16, 2008)

26" or 29"?


----------



## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Looks pretty cool.

FWIW, the rod ends are good tuning tool for rear suspension. In the past I have modded some bikes to incorporate that. On a single a turn or two can help or hinder headtube angle.

What's up with the bronze bushings? Is that the actual pivot point?

Also, interesting they are running so much falling rate in the rear suspension and minimal anti-squat.

It would be cool if they built the rear suspension pushrods / seatstays out of carbonfibre tubes with adhesive bonded end fittings using rod ends on each end.

Anxious to see it finished...polished or painted? What color, please say Kawasaki Fluorescent Green.

PK


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*frame color?*

26"

The bronze bushing is the rear pivot. We haven't decided on the color yet, suppose we'll have to soon! Procrastination.com? Florescence green might be cool. Any other color suggestions??


----------



## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

Hey Arly! I suggest a dark green or battleship grey to blend in with the Keweenaw flora and geology. Keep us posted with new photos.

Jeff & Katie
Redlands, CA


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

Hi Jeff,

We still don't know what color and of course it wasn't painted on Friday as planned. Procrastination? How was Lead-ville?? Seems like we read you had DNFed??

Hope all is well.


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*New beast shipped. Paint photos*

Thankfully, our new bike will arrive here next week which dearest named the *Silver Bullet*. The frame looks small but its not, the 2.5 tires just makes it look that way. In celebration we're heading to Cable WI to ride and camp at those wonderful Chequamegon trails. This will be on the weekend of July 30-31th in case anyone here would care to join us. We'll be staying at our favorite NF campground on lake Namakagone. (spelling?)


----------



## J (Mar 25, 2004)

Awesome.


----------



## ds2199 (Sep 16, 2008)

Great looking bike!!! What is the standover height for the captain?


----------



## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Looks very nice.

Now I understand why the suspension linkage design is that way. This bike utilizes a fixed swingarm mimicking a single pivot design by flexing the seat stays slightly.

Again a very nice bike, enjoy it.

PK


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

>Great looking bike!!! What is the standover height for the captain? <

Weeeeeeell that's a good question. It was suppose to be the same as our last one. Its predicted to arrive here on Wednesday and we'll measure it when it does.

thanks


----------



## XC Mike (Sep 26, 2004)

Very Nice Congrats!!


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*new rear triangle design*

This is how they've made their rear suspension triangles for at least the past 8 years. We've been quite happy with this setup and done next to no maintenance on them. We like its simplicity. We put on around 2000 miles per summer. How you see this new beast and they changed the link plus they moved the shock to a new location. Will this setup be better?? 



PMK said:


> Looks very nice.
> 
> Now I understand why the suspension linkage design is that way. This bike utilizes a fixed swingarm mimicking a single pivot design by flexing the seat stays slightly.
> 
> ...


----------



## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

What are the pros/cons to the ICS? I understand the idea behind the concept, independent coasting, but am wondering about it in actual use. In the areas we typically ride if one of us stops pedalling, we slow tremendously and we generally pick our spots to coast/stand on downward-sloping sections. Are there other aspects to ICS that I am missing?


----------



## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

arly said:


> This is how they've made their rear suspension triangles for at least the past 8 years. We've been quite happy with this setup and done next to no maintenance on them. We like its simplicity. We put on around 2000 miles per summer. How you see this new beast and they changed the link plus they moved the shock to a new location. Will this setup be better??


I had been to their website several years ago, mainly for info about the ICS.

Never paid much attention to the rear suspension that close until your photos. Did not realize they ran the ran suspension that way.

Yes it is a simple design that should work well for many hours and many teams.

PK


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*ICS, Pros and Cons*

OK,

The short on Independent Coasting System is,,, it makes mountain bike tandeming waaaaay easier for single-track trails and more enjoyable in general. The long version is; we started riding tandems in the early 90's and in those years did test ride the Da Vinci thing. We stayed with being in sync. Then 8 years ago we moved here with an abundance of IMBA trails, this prompted us into serious MB tandeming. We had test ridden all the major brands and decided to give the fellows at Da Vince bike a try,, because they used more aggressive geometry for quicker handling. We thought we'd not like the ICS and need to take it off at a later date but during our 1st summer , we discovered we could get over rocks or logs while just one of us was pedaling. As you state, while going at low speeds this ability will keep the riders upright!! Plus while riding on tight single-track or the benched trails we got here, each rider can keep their feet from striking whatever obstacles. In fact, we ride over rocks and logs all the time and rarely do we strike our pedals on them. With this independent setup,, captains don't have to have perfect timing to keep the stokers feet away from rocks. As one can see in the photos we posted earlier, the IC system also keeps the timing chains out of the way while going over obstacles. Plus it has 4 front chains that allows us a wide range of gearing AND they are small and stay out of rocks reach.

Downside of ICS is it adds more parts and expense to bikes but after 8 years of riding the same single-track trails the little bike do,,,,,, you couldn't give us a MB tandem without out it.

Hope that answers your question.



Okayfine said:


> What are the pros/cons to the ICS? I understand the idea behind the concept, independent coasting, but am wondering about it in actual use. In the areas we typically ride if one of us stops pedalling, we slow tremendously and we generally pick our spots to coast/stand on downward-sloping sections. Are there other aspects to ICS that I am missing?


----------



## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

Arly and his wife taught my wife and I how to ride tandem back in Michigan/Wisconsin. We learned on an ICS tandem (da Vinci) and that is still our preference on tight singletrack. However, where we live now (southern California) our riding is not as tight or rooty and we have been fine with a Ventana tandem in sync.

For road riding we have tried both and prefer being in sync.



arly said:


> Hi Jeff,
> 
> We still don't know what color and of course it wasn't painted on Friday as planned. Procrastination? How was Lead-ville?? Seems like we read you had DNFed??
> 
> Hope all is well.


Leadville: we finished in about 13:20. 12 hours is the small belt buckle cutoff and over 13 hours is technically a DNF, although they let you finish the course if you are close. We were quite happy to make all the on-course cut offs and decided some day (and thousands of miles later) we'll give it another shot.


----------



## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

My stoker is 99.9% of the time not looking down at stuff, but looking forward to keep speed and momentum up. On technical stuff, unless there is a real bad concern to call out, we ride by feel of the pedals. We have had, and will continue to have pedal strikes, fortunately, the places are spots where even single bikes are given fits. Overall, it's not that great of a concern for us.

Also, with ICS, how do you not destroy drivelines either when shifting up or down. How would;d the stoker feel the shift so as not to just overload the drivetrain?

We have ridden with a couple that owns a Davinci road tandem. They love the ability of a good fit for mismatched fitness levels. When we were following them, it was almost as if a flailing motion was happening at the cranks. Other than some obvious harmonics from the two bodies at different frequencies and phase angles, they got the job done.

Now knocking the ICS, nor praising it,but openly admitting we should give a test ride at some point to fairly decide.

PK


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*bike photos from the trail*

Below are a few photos we took on local trails over the past few days. Churning Rapids and Swedetown trails for those who are familiar. It's been SO hot here with temps in the low 80s so you'll see tongues and sweaty bodies. Ya 80 is cooking for us. You might not be able to tell from these photos but we REALLY ride these trails fast*. Just burn them up, really. This new bike handles and rides quite differently from our past Da Vinci's and we LOVE the improvements.

*no drive train components were harmed while this film was being shot.


----------



## Rida29r (May 26, 2009)

The rear triangle terrifies me, wayyyy too small imo...good looking bike tho otherwise.


----------



## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Great lookin' trails. I wish we had some of that kind of stuff here in SoCal.


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*Terrifying triangle??*

Ya that terrifies us to. Please remind us why it does that? :???: Do you know its steel?



Rida29r said:


> The rear triangle terrifies me, wayyyy too small imo...good looking bike tho otherwise.


----------



## arly (Apr 20, 2005)

*trails.com*

Thank you. We truly are blessed with well over 100 miles of IMBA trails starting right in town. Michigan Tech trails is just about 5 blocks for our home. We have been out to ride many other locations between here and Ashland OR or Mount St Helen's WA. (look through the photos we've posted here) Rode lots of GREAT trails, but getting out makes us appreciate what we have here.



Okayfine said:


> Great lookin' trails. I wish we had some of that kind of stuff here in SoCal.


----------

