# why does everyone tell me i need a dropper post?



## Boomchakabowwow (Sep 8, 2015)

i'm not new to mtn biking. i rode a Specialized FSR into the ground..thank goodness they stock bushings from the 90's.

anyways. i got a new bike. everytime i go to the shop, the salepeople say things like.."you owe it to yourself to get a dropper post".

i've never ridden a bike with a dropper. i just do it old school and (well you know)

will a dropper post be some forehead slapping (aha!) moment where i clean downhill portions i never could before? will my sphincter pucker less on the sketchy loose gravely, off camber, switchbacks?

the shop wants to put me on a FOX dropper, and said..buy from them, it is FREE installation..seriously..FREE INSTALLATION!! maybe they think i dont own tools.. my wife is still reeling from the purchase..approaching her right now with..i need a dropp..well, let's just say she is sensitive right now about the spending, and i am sypathetic.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Because they don't have the skills to ride without one.

Dropper posts have their place, and they are helpful to many, but saying that you NEED a dropper post to ride fast is just moronic. These are the same people recommending 140mm bikes for smooth XC trails.


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## DiRt DeViL (Dec 24, 2003)

You need it because is the latest thing going and to be cool you got to have it.


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## the-one1 (Aug 2, 2008)

It all depends on how you ride.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Try one of these first: seatpost quick release

it might not be as quick as a dropper post but it accomplishes the same thing. If you find that lowering your saddle prior to technical sections improves your experience then you should try a dropper post if you want to save that time where you stop and lower your saddle. However if you find that you don't mind stopping at some of the more puckering sections and lowering your saddle manually then you just saved $400 and free installation.


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

Personally, I'd go with keeping the wife happy over a salesperson. It can have more long term benefits, or so I'm told.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

I had planned on buying one for my new bike but I found that I could put the seat at a decent compromise hight and ride perfectly well without one. It's not a must-have. Maybe for some it is but in my case I'd rather save the weight, the money and the servicing when they go wrong. Which they all seem to do..


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

Mr Pig said:


> I had planned on buying one for my new bike but I found that I could put the seat at a decent compromise hight and ride perfectly well without one. It's not a must-have. Maybe for some it is but in my case I'd rather save the weight, the money and the servicing when they go wrong. Which they all seem to do..


This is my strategy too. If the trail is a fast XC style trail I will put it seatpost at a height that is more akin to my road bike. If it is a AM/FR style trail with drops, jumps and technical sections I will put it about 1-1.5" lower than my road bike. That gives me lots of ability to get behind the saddle, more body english room and more seat to ass clearance for unseen kickers. Disclaimer: this works for me on a rigid Jones in Washington your results may vary.


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## 779334 (Oct 10, 2014)

rockcrusher said:


> Try one of these first: seatpost quick release
> 
> it might not be as quick as a dropper post but it accomplishes the same thing. If you find that lowering your saddle prior to technical sections improves your experience then you should try a dropper post if you want to save that time where you stop and lower your saddle. However if you find that you don't mind stopping at some of the more puckering sections and lowering your saddle manually then you just saved $400 and free installation.


This is what I'm doing. It's annoying at time, but I stop, lower my seat, and keep going. Sometimes I forget so I have to stop and lower my seat before I'm thrown over the bars.

Taking jumps is hard and dangerous with the seatpost too high.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

> will a dropper post be some forehead slapping (aha!) moment where i clean downhill portions i never could before? will my sphincter pucker less on the sketchy loose gravely, off camber, switchbacks?


Quite possibly, yes.


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## Jovian (Jun 18, 2013)

Need? Absolutely not. Super convenient if you ride terrain that changes often or is pretty steep? Yes!

I picked up a dropper a year ago and its been great for two reasons.
1. I dont have to get off my bike to lower my seat
2. Once i change the height of my seat I dont spend a lot of time getting it just right again for climbing.

I dont need the dropper but it sure is a time saver.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

AshevilleMtBiker said:


> Taking jumps is hard and dangerous with the seatpost too high.


Yeah, it is. Although my idea of a jump is a foot off the ground ;0) As long as my seats down a little I'm getting away with it. For descents I find getting behind the seat lets me get low enough and I'm simply not skilled/brave/young enough to need anything more. Maybe if I get better I'll want a dropper but I'm fat and old so probably not.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

On my local terrain, a dropper is kinda "meh". Take it or leave it. Since I have it, I LOOK for places to use it. I ride with the post full up better than 95% of the time, though. The downhills we have are short enough that they usually only occupy a few minutes' worth out of a ride that lasts a few hours. I usually only use the dropper when things get techy and leave it up otherwise.

I spent the past weekend in Brevard, NC. On long downhills, it DOES become an "aha!" moment and you wonder why you resisted so long. I rode many of these trails on the same bike earlier this year without a dropper. They were all entirely rideable then, too, but I was less confident in many situations and I found myself contorting my body in uncomfortable ways to get around the saddle. I got a dropper pretty recently, and this was really my first outing where it made a HUGE difference.

I wound up getting a Thomson, and I like it. My wife needs something now. The trip was primarily for her to do a skills clinic. The seatpost on her bike bottoms out without being able to drop it very much, so she can't get her saddle out of the way for technical stuff or skills practice. Plus, she has a lightweight bolt-on seat clamp rather than a QR clamp, so she can't really even do the manual drop thing very well right now. So step 1 will be to cut her post and get her a QR clamp. She doesn't have much exposed seatpost, so that makes finding a dropper that fits a little difficult. The most common models won't fit her bike.

My wife wants to build some skills obstacles for the backyard, too. Our local trails make it tricky to work on certain things in a controlled environment. Gotta go to one trail for drops, another trail for cornering on berms, another one for sessioning on rocks, etc, etc. The skinnies on the trail are mostly well above the basic level skinny. Step-ups on the trail are also generally well-above the basic level. Skills obstacles in the backyard? I'm all over it. Seems like a pretty good winter project, too. It'll be helpful practicing on some of this stuff if she can get her saddle out of the way.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

I think it completely depends on your riding conditions & style, if you love bombing the downhills then you probably ought to have one. I don't have a dropper (yet), but I believe there's a chance my clavicle might still be intact if I would have had one 3 days ago.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Harold said:


> My wife wants to build some skills obstacles for the backyard, too.


You realise that almost every married man on the forum now hates you?


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Mr Pig said:


> You realise that almost every married man on the forum now hates you?


But of course. There were some women at the skills clinic whose husbands are not supportive of their wives wanting to ride, also, so you can direct your hatred thataway.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

Le Duke said:


> Because they don't have the skills to ride without one.
> 
> Dropper posts have their place, and they are helpful to many, but saying that you NEED a dropper post to ride fast is just moronic. These are the same people recommending 140mm bikes for smooth XC trails.


Yep. I don't use a dropper post. Might I be fast with one? Maybe. Maybe not. What I do know is that by ability/desire to ride things is not determined by having or not having dropper post.


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

For technical descents where you need to get your nether regions near the rear tire ^^ it's a must!!

Probably 60% of my riding I definitely need one... 30% of the time I use it b/c I've got it... and, you guessed it 10% is riding to the trails

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## Locoman (Jan 12, 2004)

Boomchakabowwow said:


> i'm not new to mtn biking. i rode a Specialized FSR into the ground..thank goodness they stock bushings from the 90's.
> 
> anyways. i got a new bike. everytime i go to the shop, the salepeople say things like.."you owe it to yourself to get a dropper post".
> 
> ...


I managed just fine for a couple of decades without one. If you ride now and don't have one then by default you don't NEED one.

Where I ride there's some steep up and downs so it's great to get the seat low on the DH and bring it back up when I need to climb. So for me, the dropper is very helpful and improves my ride. But if I didn't have one I'm sure I'd get used to it quickly.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Here is what a dropper does:
It's an automatic lowering of the saddle (obvious) By getting the saddle out of the way, it's much easier to get into a "ready" position. Ready position sets you up to be stable and well balanced and to maximize both the body as suspension and the bike suspension.
Lowered saddle means lower center of gravity = more stable. Lowered saddle + ready position means you are well balanced on your feet = more stable.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

I personally have never had an issue getting into the ready position with my seat in the normal position. That is even with a seat that is above my bars and set for optimum pedaling performance. So it is no way a "must have". Best way to test if you need it is to do it manually and see if the lower seat makes riding any easier for you. If it does then consider the benefit and cost. If not then don't bother.

There are IMHO very few "must haves" when it comes to mtn biking. Rear Suspension optional, Front suspension optional, Tubeless optional, disc brakes optional, 29" wheels optional, 700 mm wide bars, optional, gears optional. 

Some of the above will make riding a little easier or smoother, but I have ridden with people with all mixes of gear and 90% of how a rider performs is based on their own fitness and skill.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

JoePAz said:


> I personally have never had an issue getting into the ready position with my seat in the normal position. That is even with a seat that is above my bars and set for optimum pedaling performance. So it is no way a "must have". Best way to test if you need it is to do it manually and see if the lower seat makes riding any easier for you. If it does then consider the benefit and cost. If not then don't bother.
> 
> There are IMHO very few "must haves" when it comes to mtn biking. Rear Suspension optional, Front suspension optional, Tubeless optional, disc brakes optional, 29" wheels optional, 700 mm wide bars, optional, gears optional.
> 
> Some of the above will make riding a little easier or smoother, but I have ridden with people with all mixes of gear and 90% of how a rider performs is based on their own fitness and skill.


There is a difference between the "ready position" I assume when I have a fixed post, and the "ready position" I assume with a dropper. With the dropper, my body is lower, which means my COG is lower. I can lean the bike into the turns better. I have better bike-body separation. I get air more easily and more comfortably. I do not need to contort my body to avoid the saddle when the grade gets especially steep or the terrain gets especially chunky, which I DO need to do with a fixed post. In the end, it makes riding more fun. It also helps make me faster on the downhills, but that's less of an outright flatline speed issue as it is an improvement in smoothness transitioning from straights to turns and back again. The improvement in smoothness is really where it's at. The extra separation is especially important on really chunky downhills where the bike is moving a TON underneath me. I don't have to worry about the saddle bouncing up and hitting me in the nuts or in the gut or the inner thigh and throwing off my balance.

And I dunno about you, but I physically cannot have a fixed seatpost that can extend as high as it needs to for pedaling efficiency and ALSO drop out of the way as far as my dropper does. The post will bottom out on bottle cage bolts or suspension linkage welds and still be a little high to really be completely out of the way. I have 125mm of drop in my dropper, and I use it. My bike could probably accept 150mm of drop, but not as many posts offer that much.

Necessary? Maybe not, but it DOES make a difference in a positive manner. I'd say a dropper certainly fits somewhere in the "must have" to the "nice to have" range, depending on terrain.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

JoePAz said:


> Best way to test if you need it is to do it manually and see if the lower seat makes riding any easier for you. If it does then consider the benefit and cost. If not then don't bother.


I think it's a little different when you can adjust it on the fly, sort of like the difference between changing gears with a shift lever or stopping to move your chain over to another cog to see what it's like.

I don't have much experience with them but I did demo a really nice one and there is no doubt that lowering the seat is a whole lot different than getting behind it, and knarly drops/steep downhills felt significantly safer to me. I'm a diehard, old school xc kind of guy and don't feel I lack skills with my current setup but have been seriously considering getting one. The main thing holding me back was my super-comfy niner bendy post and my simplistic nature, but I think now for safety reasons alone I'll reconsider.

Definitely nobody *needs* a dropper, regardless of the terrain, but I really don't think it's possible to replicate a lower seat by getting behind a high one.


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## Legbacon (Jan 20, 2004)

Luddite no, XC weight weenie no, flat lander no, everyone else yes. If I had to choose between rear suspension and a dropper I would pick the dropper every time. I rode over 20 years without one and then had one but I've only really learned how to use a few years ago. There are lots of how to and why articles and videos out there and I'm not going to rehash it. My buddy even said he would rather give up his rear brake than his dropper.


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## tualmbr (Jul 18, 2015)

Be careful of a dropper - it adds at least a few pounds to the bike. After spending $300 on a decent dropper you would then need to spend at least $700 on a new set of lighter weight wheels to offset the extra weight.

If you don't shave the extra weight off after adding the dropper, then you'll be riding so much slower because of the extra drag that you end up way behind in the equation.

You'll seriously be so much more worn out and your lap times will plummet.

Or you could save the money and avoid the extra weight - and just ride - you know - what 95% of bike riders have been doing for 500+ years.


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## Misterg (Jul 17, 2014)

Boomchakabowwow said:


> ...will my sphincter pucker less on the sketchy loose gravely, off camber, switchbacks?


Probably, yes.

Need is too strong a word - do you NEED central locking on your car? Do you NEED a remote for your TV? Do you NEED a web browser on your mobile phone?

All of these things are luxuries that you can get by perfectly well without, but they are SO convenient that once you've got used to them (generally speaking) most people wouldn't go back.

So, when you get to your sketchy loose gravely, off camber, switchbacks, you can just bump the seat out of the way and crank the bike over. Once you're past them, you can ping the seat back up again and blast up that climb - all perfectly possible without a dropper, but soooo much easier with.

I was a mocking luddite as regards droppers until, in a moment of madness, I got one. Now I wouldn't be without.


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## jp08865 (Aug 12, 2014)

Most everyone else has pretty much nailed it. Needed, no. Nice to have, yes. Just an addition, how many times have you stopped and dropped your seat for the downhill and then almost immediately had a climb where you just didn't feel like stopping and losing your momentum to raise the seat back up? Unless your standing, killed your legs. Raising the seat is like downshifting (and often eliminates a downshift). There is also all the space between down and up that is sweet for cornering! Didn't think I'd use one until I bought a bike that came with one, while I'm still finding the benefits, now I wouldn't want to be without one. JMO.


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## Fuzzle (Mar 31, 2015)

formica said:


> Here is what a dropper does:
> It's an automatic lowering of the saddle (obvious) By getting the saddle out of the way, it's much easier to get into a "ready" position. Ready position sets you up to be stable and well balanced and to maximize both the body as suspension and the bike suspension.
> Lowered saddle means lower center of gravity = more stable. Lowered saddle + ready position means you are well balanced on your feet = more stable.


Makes sense to me! Thanks!


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## jp08865 (Aug 12, 2014)

tualmbr said:


> Be careful of a dropper -* it adds at least a few pounds to the bike. * After spending $300 on a decent dropper you would then need to spend at least $700 on a new set of lighter weight wheels to offset the extra weight.
> 
> If you don't shave the extra weight off after adding the dropper, then you'll be riding so much slower because of the extra drag that you end up way behind in the equation.
> 
> ...


*tualmbr*, which dropper(s) add at least a few pounds ? I always thought a 'few' was around 5, so looked it up and dictionary says usually thought of as 3. Most of the droppers I've seen are 500-700 grams or around 1 1/2 pounds (or less). Subtract the weight of the original post and you have no where near an additional 'few' pounds.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

^ I hope tualmbr's post was intended to be satire.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

I ride in N.E. which is typically techy with lots of shorter ups and downs and tried out a dropper for a season and ended up taking it off because I didn't use it enough to justify hauling around extra weight and complexity. I did find I used it a bit more on a HT than on a FS, but still pretty rarely.


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## hankscorpio (Jun 20, 2012)

Seems well covered but I'll give you my experience and why I can see the guys who say things like they'd sooner give up their rear brake. 

Obviously no one "needs" it. Is it a luxury? Totally relative to you. I bought a rs reverb bc I needed a new post after breaking one. I thought i just wasn't getting out of the saddle enough and maybe i should "treat myself" to this "luxury." After a few rides I was totally sold. But after a month or two of using is where the light bulb really went off for me. 

I've been riding for 3 years with no bmx background or anything. I dont have great bike handling skills. I ride in SJ, PA, and DE so the trails really vary. I do not own a full squish so when I do ride steeper more rocky things in PA I'm riding a hard tail when a lot of my friends are on full squish. 

Dropping the post going dh gave me confidence and "forced" me into the proper position. Once I got that post out of the way and easily put my ass over that rear wheel going dh I just grinned ear to ear and though...ahhhhh...that's what all the fuss is about. 

Using it to its full potential takes practice imo. I wouldn't call it a skill but more like an artform, similar to shifting. Anyone can shift a bike but being a skilled rider and using the shifting properly to keep momentum takes time and practice. Using a dropper is similar. there are plenty of spots on routine trails where I drop the post even just an inch or so where I clearly dont need to drop it....but it feels much smoother to drop it. Rolling pumpy sections for example. You dont need to drop the post at all but drop it just an inch or so and its alot more fun and smooth. Steep decline drop that sucker all the way and enjoy. 

Here is something else I've noticed about guys who say they are over rated or you dont need them. This is my experience not a generalization. Typically those guys ride with their seats a little low. I'm not saying slammed like a dirt bike but low in the eyes of a cross country racer. Again, this is my experience, obviously there are guys with their seats up their butt at the "right" height who can descent a mountain that way but I see a bunch of guys who like to flick the bike around alot and do a bunch of jumps who keep their seats low enough where its out of the way and high enough where they can pedal ok. Cross country racers routinely tell those guys to raise their seat up. 

Anyway for guys like that riding the dropper would set the light bulb off when they realize how much more efficient pedaling is with the seat all the way up. I have a few other friends who dont feel they are awesome and they are all under 5'6 and dont really have much room to drop (not saying you can't be under 5'6 and utilize a dropper, just an observation)

Long story short, for me, I find the dropper to be extremely useful. I use it on almost every trail I ride. Sometimes up and down the whole time, sometimes just once or twice a ride. I feel safer and more confident with it. It added a half lb on my bike and I cannot see owning a hard tail without one now.


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## hankscorpio (Jun 20, 2012)

Misterg said:


> Probably, yes.
> 
> So, when you get to your sketchy loose gravely, off camber, switchbacks, you can just bump the seat out of the way and crank the bike over. Once you're past them, you can ping the seat back up again and blast up that climb - all perfectly possible without a dropper, but soooo much easier with.





jp08865 said:


> There is also all the space between down and up that is sweet for cornering! Didn't think I'd use one until I bought a bike that came with one, while I'm still finding the benefits, now I wouldn't want to be without one. JMO.


Forgot about these two things. On my local trail there is actually a dh gravely, loose, switchback that gave me fits, got the dropper and its now at least 83% less butt puckering.

I also find that i'm much more comfortable going over large log overs and such with the seat down


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## Spinsum (Sep 21, 2015)

----


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## gmcttr (Oct 7, 2006)

Harold said:


> ...My wife wants to build some skills obstacles for the backyard, too....


If you need sections of logs to practice log overs, etc., I could fix you up. I'm 20 minutes from BCSP.



hankscorpio said:


> ...I also find that i'm much more comfortable going over large log overs and such with the seat down


Agreed...it's kind of nice knowing the seat isn't going to hit you in the a$$ and try to pitch you over the bars if you don't bring the back wheel up enough.:thumbsup:


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

hankscorpio said:


> Here is something else I've noticed about guys who say they are over rated or you dont need them. This is my experience not a generalization. Typically those guys ride with their seats a little low. I'm not saying slammed like a dirt bike but low in the eyes of a cross country racer. Again, this is my experience, obviously there are guys with their seats up their butt at the "right" height who can descent a mountain that way but I see a bunch of guys who like to flick the bike around alot and do a bunch of jumps who keep their seats low enough where its out of the way and high enough where they can pedal ok. Cross country racers routinely tell those guys to raise their seat up.
> .


Great observation. 
I'd say I'm pretty solidly in the camp you describe.


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## NotQuiteClimbing (Jul 26, 2010)

Travis Bickle said:


> Luddite no, XC weight weenie no, flat lander no, everyone else yes. If I had to choose between rear suspension and a dropper I would pick the dropper every time. I rode over 20 years without one and then had one but I've only really learned how to use a few years ago. There are lots of how to and why articles and videos out there and I'm not going to rehash it. My buddy even said he would rather give up his rear brake than his dropper.


I'd also take a dropper over rear suspension.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Le Duke said:


> Because they don't have the skills to ride without one.
> 
> Dropper posts have their place, and they are helpful to many, but saying that you NEED a dropper post to ride fast is just moronic. These are the same people recommending 140mm bikes for smooth XC trails.


I hope that's sarcasm.

They're helpful to everyone who doesn't ride smooth XC trails and take corners at a leisurely pace. I ride the same stuff I rode before I had a dropper, it's just one hell of a lot...I would say "easier" but "less stressful" is more accurate. For cornering, there's no comparison. There's a way you can corner with a seatpost fully extended, and then there's a much faster way you can corner with dropped saddle.

They're more of a skill enabler than a crutch.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

slapheadmofo said:


> Great observation.
> I'd say I'm pretty solidly in the camp you describe.


I'd say I am too. I used to ride with my seat at full hight then either try to descend like that, which doesn't go very well, or drop my seat. I've found that with my seat down a couple of inches I can still climb and pedal well enough and I have enough clearance to go down the way too. So it's not ideal for either but it works out ok.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

Le Duke said:


> Because they don't have the skills to ride without one.
> 
> Dropper posts have their place, and they are helpful to many, but saying that you NEED a dropper post to ride fast is just moronic. These are the same people recommending 140mm bikes for smooth XC trails.


hahahahahah...true!


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

G


Boomchakabowwow said:


> i'm not new to mtn biking. i rode a Specialized FSR into the ground..thank goodness they stock bushings from the 90's.
> 
> anyways. i got a new bike. everytime i go to the shop, the salepeople say things like.."you owe it to yourself to get a dropper post".
> 
> ...


Since you are asking the question, you may be curious enough to warrant trying one. I was skeptical for many years and got one about 2 years ago, easily the best upgrade for the bike since hydraulic disc brakes.

With the saddle out of the way you can get in a better position for descending, cornering(leveraging the outside pedal), pumping, high speed transitions on rollers, and much better squat and launch for drops and jumps.

Of course you don't need one, you don't need a bike either, but it sounds like the real question was "do I owe it to myself to try on?" Of course, then you can decide for yourself.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

richde said:


> I hope that's sarcasm.
> 
> They're helpful to everyone who doesn't ride smooth XC trails and take corners at a leisurely pace. I ride the same stuff I rode before I had a dropper, it's just one hell of a lot...I would say "easier" but "less stressful" is more accurate. For cornering, there's no comparison. There's a way you can corner with a seatpost fully extended, and then there's a much faster way you can corner with dropped saddle.
> 
> They're more of a skill enabler than a crutch.


So, if I ride all sorts of trails, to include "trail" trails (whatever the hell that means; that's how a local described a certain area), and I'm still faster than everyone else that rides them, what does that mean?

The majority of the people I see out there are on 5-6" bikes; are they just over gunned? Or do I need to ride a bigger, slower bike to fit in? Minion DHFs, dropper and 6" bike for rocky "trail" trails?

Obviously I'm doing it wrong. The bro-bras puttering along with their ill fitting, over-sagged, over-suspended, slow rolling bikes are the ones I should be taking my cues from, it seems.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

WOW, long thread already, so here's my $0.02

No, you don't need a dropper, we got by for years without them, that's for sure, yes you can ride lots of sections without lowering your saddle, but the fact is that if you do, you do gain alot more control and freedom to move around on the bike without getting caught up on the saddle etc. on those steep/tech sections. 
If you have trails with lots of ups and downs, a dropper helps to keep the flow, you don't need to stop when you get to the bottom of that steep long DH/drop/roll and want to keep pedaling back up the climb - that is the greatest thing about a dropper.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Probably a lot depends on how you ride a bike, how skilled you are maybe. I reckon the more hairy the stuff you ride or the more aggressively you ride the more useful a dropper might be. I'm not great at this whole mountain biking thing and am at a fairly basic level so I get by fine without one but if I was dropping six-feet to flat then yeah, I'd really like one!


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

There is no reason to not ride with out a dropper, if you have the money and maintence skills to keep it going. Once you learn to use it is gaining skills. Once you learn to use a dropper and start using the extra range of motion afforded by using one its feels extremely sketchy to not use one. I am fast DH on my FS with one even on smooth rolling DHs and I feel safer even on smooth roling downhill, and above all I feel safer with it. Whats really interesting is i am fast up and down on my hardtail with it, as I can get the seat out of the way for big steps going up hill. 

Le Duke I pick the trail,ill race you on one of my Bro bah bikes and beat you up down and across.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

richde said:


> I hope that's sarcasm.
> 
> They're helpful to everyone who doesn't ride smooth XC trails and take corners at a leisurely pace. I ride the same stuff I rode before I had a dropper, it's just one hell of a lot...I would say "easier" but "less stressful" is more accurate.


Ever ridden in MA and NH? Let me know where you found those 'smooth XC trails' will ya? I've been looking for them for years and years. And not everybody gets stressed out by some tech or steep bits, or is looking to set imaginary speed records every time they get on a bike.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

BushwackerinPA said:


> There is no reason to not ride with out a dropper, if you have the money and maintence skills to keep it going. Once you learn to use it is gaining skills. Once you learn to use a dropper and start using the extra range of motion afforded by using one its feels extremely sketchy to not use one. I am fast DH on my FS with one even on smooth rolling DHs and I feel safer even on smooth roling downhill, and above all I feel safer with it. Whats really interesting is i am fast up and down on my hardtail with it, as I can get the seat out of the way for big steps going up hill.


I have the money, mech skills, and even already own a post that I spent enough time on to know exactly how to use. I'm still not sold on them. YMMV of course.


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## Vespasianus (Apr 9, 2008)

What, I had a FSR from the 90's and could never get the bushings for it!

And no, you don't need anything to make a bike ride enjoyable - beyond a simple bike. I just rode a local trail (White Clay) on my old 1994 Specialized Stumpjumper and had an absolute blast. The ride is what you make it. Your terrain will impact your ride but I think most people are over "biked".


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## bitflogger (Jan 12, 2004)

formica said:


> Here is what a dropper does:
> It's an automatic lowering of the saddle (obvious) By getting the saddle out of the way, it's much easier to get into a "ready" position. Ready position sets you up to be stable and well balanced and to maximize both the body as suspension and the bike suspension.
> Lowered saddle means lower center of gravity = more stable. Lowered saddle + ready position means you are well balanced on your feet = more stable.


Good points.

I'm not saying people need them but the benefits of that seat down became more obvious to me than ever when our MTB community started youth classes and education programs. The first few seasons it helped a lot of kids to have the seats down. As our success grew we got more parents riding dirt with a lot of them moms who never did a lot of playing around on bikes before. Seat down made a major difference in their getting confident and building their skills.



Travis Bickle said:


> Luddite no, XC weight weenie no, flat lander no, everyone else yes. If I had to choose between rear suspension and a dropper I would pick the dropper every time. I rode over 20 years without one and then had one but I've only really learned how to use a few years ago. There are lots of how to and why articles and videos out there and I'm not going to rehash it. My buddy even said he would rather give up his rear brake than his dropper.


Interesting in that our steel hard tail bike with Deore or less parts has a Thomson dropper as the exception.

The seat out of the way lets me corner better. Friends who are great riders and don't drop their seats are often stopping or not riding things I take for granted as easy. Not too long ago I was on my 1992 bike and a demo without a dropper and found myself stopping or not making the same move. I find the dropper especially great for cornering on 29r and large bikes.

Basically, I've learned to watch my statements and try to say you don't need a dropper to ride MTBs, but you need that seat down to do best in some riding scenarios.


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

BushwackerinPA said:


> There is no reason to not ride with out a dropper, if you have the money and maintence skills to keep it going.
> ...


That's a broad generalization. There are plenty of trails/races where a dropper post may be of little help.


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

BushwackerinPA said:


> Le Duke I pick the trail,ill race you on one of my Bro bah bikes and beat you up down and across.


so with home turf advantage where you know every bump, rock, and root, you'll beat another rider in a race who's never ridden there? you must be the most skilled rider on MTBR! congratulations, now that everyone knows your the best you can stop bragging.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> Ever ridden in MA and NH? Let me know where you found those 'smooth XC trails' will ya? I've been looking for them for years and years. And not everybody gets stressed out by some tech or steep bits, or is looking to set imaginary speed records every time they get on a bike.


Ever ridden in the SW?

Like I said, it didn't change where and what I ride, it changes how it feels and makes it better.

Just because you refuse to try something, it doesn't mean that it doesn't work.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Le Duke said:


> I'm still faster than everyone else that rides them, what does that mean?


Maybe going up, but going down, you're not.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

richde said:


> Just because you refuse to try something, it doesn't mean that it doesn't work.


I've already pointed out mulitple times that I own a post and spent all last season using it, on both FS and HT bikes. Try reading all the words before running along with your baseless assumptions.

Just because you bought something and like it, doesn't mean anyone who has come to a different conclusion got there based on some sort of character flaw, no matter how much of an authority you consider yourself to be.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

richde said:


> Maybe going up, but going down, you're not.


And the vast majority of the people that beat me going down are riding big bikes with bike tires. Call me crazy, but it's not exactly surprising that they'd go down a hill faster, with more suspension and tires designed for descending. Are they more skilled than me? Or are their bikes simply optimized for something other than overall speed?

Until last week, I was riding either a 90mm HT 29er, a rigid 29er, or a CX bike. And still going downhill faster than 90% of the people out there.

And, unlike most of the people I see riding, I don't stop at the top of climbs, catch my breath, get my HR down, and put on pads before descending. It's a bit harder to descend faster when you've blown yourself sky high climbing at near max HR before hitting the DH.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Can I whip mine out, too? Yeah yeah! Pecker contest!

I measure my rides in fun. I don't care how fast I ride. I'm a slow climber and a mid-pack descender. So what? I like to stop and session stuff that's difficult. I like to be social on my rides. I like to take in the view.

I resisted dropper posts for a long time. But I eventually bought a nicer one and I find that it adds fun to some of my rides. Maybe it helps me do certain downhills a couple seconds faster. Big deal. It makes it more fun to ride bigger drops and take chunkier stuff a little faster and smoother. That's more up my alley.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

And that's fine.

After blowing up three of them under my 145lb rear end (one of the during a race), I've eschewed them for the reliability of an aluminum post.

I fully recognize the value of a dropper post; it's nice to get the saddle out of the way on a steep descent. But it isn't nice to have to pedal two and a half laps of a four lap XC race, standing up the entire time. That **** sucks. Until companies* make a dropper that doesn't fail constantly under the weight of a relatively small human being, I'll be watching from the sidelines.

*Two DOSSs and a Reverb. Replacement Reverb sitting in my tool chest, blown up again.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> I've already pointed out mulitple times that I own a post and spent all last season using it, on both FS and HT bikes. Try reading all the words before running along with your baseless assumptions.
> 
> Just because you bought something and like it, doesn't mean anyone who has come to a different conclusion got there based on some sort of character flaw, no matter how much of an authority you consider yourself to be.


Just because you have something, it doesn't mean that you know how to use it, which is more often than you think at first, or maybe you don't ride in a way that helps them make a difference.

But when you DO use them, and ride in a way where the benefits come out, it mames a real difference. Try not to forget that the vast majority of people that say they help have ridden for years without them.


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## yzedf (Apr 22, 2014)

Last nights group ride I was the only one with a dropper post. In that group I'm definitely the over biked newbie as I've got a fancy carbon hardtail 29er and most of them are on steel, some single speed, one guy on a Niner carbon SS rigid fork. This is the group thats been riding for decades, mostly together, everyone knows each other and the average age is probably 45-50. Riding here in Rhode Island is very natural trails, tons of rocks, a lot of sand that is super loose right now (little rain here this summer) and we tend to go from singletrack to enduro dirtbike trails and back again. Its the kind of terrain where you might think a dropper is useless, and I certainly did the first time I used one on a friends bike. Eventually I got more comfortable with it and decided to buy one (KS LEV 272) late this summer. At first I was just using it on the steep stuff. Now I use it on anything higher speed, the steep stuff, the techy rooty rocky stuff and on the rolling downhill whooped out made for pumping stuff. At the end of the ride one of the guys asked if he could swap my pedals with his and take my bike for a rip. He had been following me most of the ride (we did 14 miles or so) and wanted to try it out using it the way I had been using it. 15 minutes later he came charging out of the woods in full stand up attack with the dropper down. He said he went from anti-dropper before the group ride, to curious, to I must buy one now all in one night. I'm guessing next Thursday there will be 2 of us with dropper posts on our HTs....


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> I've already pointed out mulitple times that I own a post and spent all last season using it, on both FS and HT bikes. Try reading all the words before running along with your baseless assumptions.
> 
> Just because you bought something and like it, doesn't mean anyone who has come to a different conclusion got there based on some sort of character flaw, no matter how much of an authority you consider yourself to be.





richde said:


> Just because you have something, it doesn't mean that you know how to use it, which is more often than you think at first, or maybe you don't ride in a way that helps them make a difference.
> 
> But when you DO use them, and ride in a way where the benefits come out, it mames [sic] a real difference. Try not to forget that the vast majority of people that say they help have ridden for years without them.


I don't care if anyone uses a dropper post or not, but this is devolving into a "right vs wrong" routine.

@richde:

1. Since slaphead has tried and feels he doesn't need a dropper are you really saying he's "doing it wrong", or his "riding is wrong"? 
2. Are you suggesting that a dropper is required on all bikes, all courses, and by all riders?


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

phlegm said:


> I don't care if anyone uses a dropper post or not, but this is devolving into a "right vs wrong" routine.
> 
> @richde:
> 
> ...


No he only says that the people that don't chose to run the same components he chose can only ride easy terrain at slow speeds and don't have the ability to balance a bike and operate a simple lever at the same time. Oh, and that they have no mechanical aptitude and a low income.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

richde said:


> Just because you have something, it doesn't mean that you know how to use it, which is more often than you think at first, or maybe you don't ride in a way that helps them make a difference.
> 
> But when you DO use them, and ride in a way where the benefits come out, it mames a real difference. Try not to forget that the vast majority of people that say they help have ridden for years without them.


I have plenty of friends that love their droppers. I'm not saying don't use one if you find it benefits you. I'm saying I think they're overrated as a 'must have' item. As far as being familiar what riding with a lower seat gains you, I've got hundreds of chairlift days on DH bikes as well as hundreds more on BMX / park / DJ bikes under my belt. I'm neither a newb nor a one-trick-XC-pony, so please can the patronizing 'tude.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> I have plenty of friends that love their droppers. I'm not saying don't use one if you find it benefits you. I'm saying I think they're overrated as a 'must have' item. As far as being familiar what riding with a lower seat gains you, I've got hundreds of chairlift days on DH bikes as well as hundreds more on BMX / park / DJ bikes under my belt. I'm neither a newb nor a one-trick-XC-pony, so please can the patronizing 'tude.


How does that contradict what I said? If you feel that they don't give an advantage where you ride, for whatever reason, you aren't riding how they DO give an advantage. I ride places where it isn't necessary, and I usually don't even think about using it, but that doesn't mean that I think they're unnecessary. If you regularly took your bike to somewhere that a dropped saddle would be helpful, you'd use one, wouldn't you?

Nobody said they were a must have component, so you guys can just give that strawman a rest.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Did you read the title of the thread?

I regularly ride all sorts of places where many people use droppers. They find them helpful. I find them extraneous. You assume a lot more than you know.


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## abelfonseca (Dec 26, 2011)

Must Have:
tires (at least the front)
brake
frame
handlebar
pedals
crank arms
wheels
fork
awesome strap

Good to have:
Lighter must haves
suspension fork
brakeS
lights
chain
gears
dropper

Nice to have:
Blingy over priced stuff
anodized stuff in purple or orange


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

this thread has devolved into PostWang

I am an XC hardtail dinosaur and droppers are the lamest excuse for lack of fitness and skill I have ever seen come down the pike (just like front suspension, rear suspension, and everything else newer than 1970's technology)

I won't ever use one, and will not feel like I need one, but, hey, if they were available when I was just starting on MTB I'd likely swear to death they are a requirement.

I accept I will be standing up more and dipping behind my saddle more than a dropper user, but I work hard in the gym so my arms and core strength can do that all day long....as I always have done

they will NOT make < -me- > faster. what makes me fastest is simple simple simple. I am way faster on an SS rigid than my current front shock hardtail for rides under 1 hour...simple thoughtless riding motivates me. clutter, cables, extra doodads, timing shifting timing a dropper....steals brain power and that annoys me, therefore I'd slow up... but that is just me and my opinion.


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## Locoman (Jan 12, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> Did you read the title of the thread?
> 
> I regularly ride all sorts of places where many people use droppers. They find them helpful. I find them extraneous. You assume a lot more than you know.


So some find them helpful but you find them unrelated to the subject being dealt with or of external origin or separate from the object to which it is attached? How so?

.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

^^^Spot on. I am in the same boat and feel that while I can see the benefits of a dropper for the gravity riders or even those that enjoy the "techy" type riding, however, you don't "need" one to be a skillfull/fast mtber. We have had a debate locally here on our local mtbing FB page about a new beginner trail that has some jumps, berms, etc. causing several injuries since its opening earlier this year. The response by many newer-school ride is "get a dropper". How is that I can seem to get down this trail faster than most (Strava certainly isn't the end-all but the folks on the top of LBs with hundreds of riders are going to be your faster [note that I didn't' say "fastest"] riders..sorry) riding a 80mm travel XC HT without a dropper? Skill. Fitness. Experience. Period. At some point, I would like to try a dropper but it certainly isn't the reason folks are hurting themselves. I get back, I get low, I get loose, I squeeze my seat with my thighs, and I surf that bike! The issue BTW IMHO is lack of signage on a particularly lippy tabletop catching newbs and experienced riders alike by surprise....its been nubbed down a bit which has solved the issue (remember...this is labeled as a beginner trail).


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Locoman said:


> So some them helpful but you find them unrelated to the subject being dealt with or of external origin or separate from the object to which it is attached? How so?
> 
> .


Was in response to "Nobody said they were a must have component". 
Topic of thread is 'why does EVERYONE tell me I NEED a dropper post?'. 
Obviously SOMEONE is saying they're a must have.

Richde won't say it, but will tell you that if you don't have one, you're doing it wrong.

Clear?


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## madsweeney (Sep 18, 2007)

I see the advantage, just not worth the cost and weight imo for the riding i do. I just ride with my seat slightly lower than normal and i dont really have issues adjusting seat while moving when needed.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

You don't know, what you don't know ^^ 

If you've never ridden w/ one... awesome! But, once you do you'll reluctantly go back.

I liken DP's to ABS brakes on a car... you can drive fine w/o em. But, having em just makes sense!

PS - they are a little pricey though... Good things usually are

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## russinthecascades (Jun 1, 2013)

For me there are no "must haves", it's only a matter of how I want my bike to perform and the fun I have getting it dialed. The dropper post is no different than shifters, brakes, high point engagement hub, cf handle bar to dampen shock, blah, blah, blah.

I adjust the seat height frequently - not because I have to, but because I want to. I love the feeling of my body being in balance with the bike and the fact is if I don't drop it, it's in the space that I want to occupy. Generally keeping my mass vertical over the bb and low as possible.

Others take great pride in riding "minimally equipped" bikes on challenging terrian, and do it with great skill. That's awesome as well, but we each get to choose.

OP - thanks for the entertaining thread


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## Shakester (Jun 26, 2012)

A dropper post is a luxury. There have been times I've been lazy and I just left my seat up on steep descents, knowing right when it was finished, there was a climb. Going down wasn't fun and I can say that I crashed a few times. So when I got the dropper post, it was awesome and I never looked back. If you can afford one, then by all means, get it. But it is a luxury.


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## BuickGN (Aug 25, 2008)

targnik said:


> You don't know, what you don't know ^^
> 
> If you've never ridden w/ one... awesome! But, once you do you'll reluctantly go back.
> 
> ...


ABS is for the unskilled masses. A very good driver can usually beat ABS in stopping distance. I think it's a good thing overall since everyone just mashes the brakes while trying to turn but I've demonstrated to several groups at work that I can stop shorter than the computer can and I can get around the track quicker with no ABS and stability and traction control.

Maybe this somehow applies to droppers as well. In the mountain biking world I'm part of the unskilled masses and I'm quicker with a dropper. At my skill level I'm considerably safer with one and I can't imagine riding without one. My terrain changes drastically from one mile to the next so maybe that's a factor too.


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## tubbnation (Jul 6, 2015)

I'm an old school bmx dude from the 80's who's fairly new to mtb'g. I dig rigids, and am not particularly fond of gears or levers, etc.

Also, I like to keep my seat low enough to have it out of the way, but just high enough to pedal ok, and I have no problem dipping behind the saddle if I feel the need to. The local trails around me haven't required this (yet), but I did dip a couple of times on Black Mtn trail a couple weeks ago. I do have to say that I love finessing the bike through techy stuff, especially on a rigid.

So, I've yet to give a dropper any serious consideration, and some have said to me that this will change in time. The same people have also said that I will get tired of riding a rigid (being close to 50, and charging the way that I do).

A lot of people like to think they are _dropping_ knowledge, and or just want your money...

Ride-on, to each their own.


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## AllMountin' (Nov 23, 2010)

Racers like LeDuke have a rather myopic view of riding where riding the fastest lap times = better riding. If this is your mentality, then dropping may not be for you. These riders(not LeDuke specifically) typically bypass much of what I love about riding, in favor of the faster line. They place abnormally high valuation on climbing efficiency, as lap times are heavily reliant on climbing speed/fitness. 

I find dropping ideal for: Jumping; pumping terrain(all trails have pumpable terrain); steep rock rolls; large step ups(2+ feet); hopping large obstacles(rear tire lift is seat height limited); elevated skinnies(more for the ease and safety of unplanned exits); high speed cornering(deep lean angle); and more.

Consider rolling a rather steep rock face with an abrupt transition back to flat. With a fixed post, your only option to get your weight lower is behind the seat. Your weight is so far back that it unweights the front tire and you lose the ability to compress the front into the rock face to setup the dismount. 

With a dropper you can maintain a proper neutral position while lowering your COG. As you approach the transition, you can load the front into the face and then shift your weight back, unloading the front for an easy roll out. 

Rigid post makes you choose between too high a position or too far back, and limits your ability to be a dynamic rider. Whether you ride that kind of stuff is entirely up to you, but for riders who value descending and technical riding over ascending, it's silly to argue against them.


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

Weight Weenies need not trip over dropper post weight: its so centered, the gain is barely perceptible. 

One good crash on a fixed, high saddle was all it took for me....


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Zachariah said:


> Weight Weenies need not trip over dropper post weight: its so centered, the gain is barely perceptible.
> 
> One good crash on a fixed, high saddle was all it took for me....


How about "Reliability Weenies"?


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## yzedf (Apr 22, 2014)

madsweeney said:


> I see the advantage, just not worth the cost and weight imo for the riding i do. I just ride with my seat slightly lower than normal and i dont really have issues adjusting seat while moving when needed.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


Those of us with bad knees can't really do that for more than a couple hours at a time...


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## BuickGN (Aug 25, 2008)

After a particularly bad crash where I got out of the ER at 4:30am which is the time I usually leave for work I had to miss that day of work. I wanted to go to work but the fiancée wouldn't let me. After watching the video of me slurring and barely able to walk from all of the pain killers I'm glad she made me call in sick. When I showed up the following day with everything from my hands to my face skinned up I got talked to about the expected appearance at work and that I may want to rethink my after work hobbies. The dropper gives me so much more control going downhill and in the twisties that it makes me comfortable enough to ride at 70% of my maximum level vs cruising and looking at the scenery scared I may get hurt and lose my job. I weigh 240lbs so getting that weight a few inches lower is a night and day difference for me. With the seat in the climbing position I feel like the bike wants to skid out from under me at any second, even going straight on off camber trails. While legally it would be hard for my employer to fire me for getting skinned up after work when I have weeks of sick time saved up, I don't want to go there. Part of the reason I went with the Magic Mary/Hans Dampf combo was to lessen the chance of injury even though most are on more cross country oriented tires. If the dropper can keep me out of harms way, it's worth it in more than one way. 

Does rider weight possibly have a lot to do with who likes them and who does not? One guy who doesn't particularly care for them is 145lbs. I love them and I'm 240lbs. Maybe we can list our weights along with our preference to see if there's anything in common. 

When drag racing my daily driver, there was a noticeable and measurable difference in getting the engine 1.25" farther back toward the firewall. Back then it was consistently running bottom 10.70s. With no other changes I ran my first 10.6x. The 60' dropped by .05 sec too. That's a 300lb iron V6 in a 3,400lb car. Imagine 240lbs being shifted 3-4" on a 270lb total "vehicle" weight.


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## BuickGN (Aug 25, 2008)

Le Duke said:


> How about "Reliability Weenies"?


I have to agree with you there. I don't know why it's so hard to make a reliable dropper. My Giant one was never reliable. It's one of my favorites when it works but when it doesn't work it ruins the ride. My second one is already going out again. I'm trying to wait until a certain new one hits the market to try it out. I don't see what's so hard about it.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

BuickGN said:


> I have to agree with you there. I don't know why it's so hard to make a reliable dropper. My Giant one was never reliable. It's one of my favorites when it works but when it doesn't work it ruins the ride. My second one is already going out again. I'm trying to wait until a certain new one hits the market to try it out. I don't see what's so hard about it.


Its easiest just to have multiple bikes with the same seatpost diameter and all of them have droppers - then if one fails, you can either grab the other bike, or just swap a post.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> Was in response to "Nobody said they were a must have component".
> Topic of thread is 'why does EVERYONE tell me I NEED a dropper post?'.
> Obviously SOMEONE is saying they're a must have.
> 
> ...


Nobody in this thread said it, and you also have to take into consideration what people actually mean when they say "need" in situations like that. Walk into a bike shop and they'll tell you that you "need" a new bike, but we know what they mean and don't take it literally.



BuickGN said:


> I have to agree with you there. I don't know why it's so hard to make a reliable dropper. My Giant one was never reliable. It's one of my favorites when it works but when it doesn't work it ruins the ride. My second one is already going out again. I'm trying to wait until a certain new one hits the market to try it out. I don't see what's so hard about it.


I have anecdotal evidence too:
I've had the same Specialized Command Post for the last three years, clean inside the seal and air it up when it starts moving slower and take it apart for a quick clean and lube when that doesn't work. It's NEVER stopped working, only stopped working quite as well.


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## madsweeney (Sep 18, 2007)

yzedf said:


> Those of us with bad knees can't really do that for more than a couple hours at a time...


I have bad knees and thats precisely one major reason i ride that way. proper seat height tends to cause me more knee pain and fatigue. Im effectively shortening my rannge of motion and for me, is more comfortable. Of course everyone is different and im sure our injuries are not identical.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I'm surprised that they haven't gone the Lefty route for droppers yet. Square lower shaft, round upper shaft. Roller bearings on races on the square portion. My DOSS had at least 5 degrees of rotation straight out of the box. It didn't get better with time, either.


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## russinthecascades (Jun 1, 2013)

BuickGN said:


> I have to agree with you there. I don't know why it's so hard to make a reliable dropper. My Giant one was never reliable. It's one of my favorites when it works but when it doesn't work it ruins the ride. My second one is already going out again. I'm trying to wait until a certain new one hits the market to try it out. I don't see what's so hard about it.


My wife and I both have Giant Compact droppers. Other than a maintenance lub and clean job a month ago, we've had no problems or other service. As I stated earlier, we use them a lot and have 2 full seasons on them...


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

AllMountin' said:


> Racers like LeDuke have a rather myopic view of riding where riding the fastest lap times = better riding. If this is your mentality, then dropping may not be for you. These riders(not LeDuke specifically) typically bypass much of what I love about riding, in favor of the faster line. They place abnormally high valuation on climbing efficiency, as lap times are heavily reliant on climbing speed/fitness.
> 
> I find dropping ideal for: Jumping; pumping terrain(all trails have pumpable terrain); steep rock rolls; large step ups(2+ feet); hopping large obstacles(rear tire lift is seat height limited); elevated skinnies(more for the ease and safety of unplanned exits); high speed cornering(deep lean angle); and more.
> 
> ...


This is the most compelling reasoning behind a dropper post I have read. I have always not had a problem on any technical riding aspects except the abrupt transition descent where, as *Allmountin'* mentions above, you get behind the saddle to make the descent only to pop the front tire on the transition because your weight is so far behind the saddle. I have actually pop the bars out of my hands on serious abrupt transitions and other times I have caught a jacket on a saddle in the transition on a cold day and had to drop off the back of the bike to recover. The thought that one could actually just lower one's COG instead of dropping behind is intriguing to me. Possibly enough so that I would try a dropper as long as I could find one that would fit my 27.2 jones. I'm not particular about the maintenance, though I don't like the feel of a loose saddle so it'd have to be pretty bulletproof and not rock.

Maybe I'll put one on my christmas list for this winter. I've been a good boy.


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## abelfonseca (Dec 26, 2011)

AllMountin' said:


> Racers like LeDuke have a rather myopic view of riding where riding the fastest lap times = better riding. If this is your mentality, then dropping may not be for you. These riders(not LeDuke specifically) typically bypass much of what I love about riding, in favor of the faster line. They place abnormally high valuation on climbing efficiency, as lap times are heavily reliant on climbing speed/fitness.
> 
> I find dropping ideal for: Jumping; pumping terrain(all trails have pumpable terrain); steep rock rolls; large step ups(2+ feet); hopping large obstacles(rear tire lift is seat height limited); elevated skinnies(more for the ease and safety of unplanned exits); high speed cornering(deep lean angle); and more.
> 
> ...


I agree, I very often lower my seat before a fun and/or techy descent, I just do it manually. A dropper would make that easier but its not a must in order to lower my seat.



BuickGN said:


> ...When I showed up the following day with everything from my hands to my face skinned up I got talked to about the expected appearance at work and that I may want to rethink my after work hobbies..


You need to change that douchebag, apathetic boss of yours!

Cheers


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## Legbacon (Jan 20, 2004)

LeDuke is very unlucky with his droppers, I have not been even though I'm 50lbs heavier and pedal through lots of chunk that stresses my Reverb. I also don't race and if it does crap out on a ride I will install the locking collar that came with it and pedal my a$$ home to install my backup Gravity Dropper. Every moving part is going to give you problems eventually and droppers have to move and lock up solid. Compare them to the old RS Judy which was leaky junk. Then came the Marzocchi Z2 which was reliable, easy to maintain and felt 10 times better. Droppers are already better than this old Judys but someone will come up with the equivalent of the Z2.

As for what you need, you don't need a mountain bike at all, you could just hike or trail run barefoot so that you don't use any lame crutches at all. I will stick with my bike for the fun and yes, the adrenaline.


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## TiGeo (Jul 31, 2008)

AllMountin' said:


> Racers like LeDuke have a rather myopic view of riding where riding the fastest lap times = better riding. If this is your mentality, then dropping may not be for you. These riders(not LeDuke specifically) typically bypass much of what I love about riding, in favor of the faster line. They place abnormally high valuation on climbing efficiency, as lap times are heavily reliant on climbing speed/fitness.
> 
> I find dropping ideal for: Jumping; pumping terrain(all trails have pumpable terrain); steep rock rolls; large step ups(2+ feet); hopping large obstacles(rear tire lift is seat height limited); elevated skinnies(more for the ease and safety of unplanned exits); high speed cornering(deep lean angle); and more.
> 
> ...


I agree with you 100%...it all comes down the type of riding you do/like to do/type of trails you ride. So these questions should be first when determining if someone would benefit from a dropper...not just a blanket that everyone needs one. I tend to be more like LeDuke and value speed and efficiency when I ride. I certainly enjoy tech features but most are fairly tame as I get into my mid-40s getting hurt just isn't something I want to be dealing with and staying on the ground/mild features reduce my risk. There are plenty of times I think "A dropper right now would be killer"...I get it....but everyone doesn't need one to ride well/ride features.


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

Le Duke said:


> How about "Reliability Weenies"?


my eTen going strong almost 2 years ^^

how much $$ do the unskilled masses waste on KY every year!?

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## av8or (Jun 9, 2013)

must have? nope.. but if you can afford to spend another $300 ++, then why not.. just a heads up, they will break even though you don't use them that often.. i have gone through 3 reverbs in 3 years.. each one had air leaks but each was replaced new with warranty.. hardly used them but your "ass" weight will eventually cause the seal to fail.. 
imho, it is better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.. my .02..


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Le Duke said:


> I'm surprised that they haven't gone the Lefty route for droppers yet. Square lower shaft, round upper shaft. Roller bearings on races on the square portion. My DOSS had at least 5 degrees of rotation straight out of the box. It didn't get better with time, either.


you realize DOSS are just about the worst droppers ever made......


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

AllMountin' said:


> Racers like LeDuke have a rather myopic view of riding where riding the fastest lap times = better riding. If this is your mentality, then dropping may not be for you. These riders(not LeDuke specifically) typically bypass much of what I love about riding, in favor of the faster line. They place abnormally high valuation on climbing efficiency, as lap times are heavily reliant on climbing speed/fitness.
> 
> I find dropping ideal for: Jumping; pumping terrain(all trails have pumpable terrain); steep rock rolls; large step ups(2+ feet); hopping large obstacles(rear tire lift is seat height limited); elevated skinnies(more for the ease and safety of unplanned exits); high speed cornering(deep lean angle); and more.
> 
> ...


I tried to rep this, best post on the tread, but it wouldn't let me?


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

If you can run a rigid with a smile, you don't need a dropper.
If you are 6ft and 150lbs with a skinny saddle and lycra shorts, you don't need a dropper.
If you can stay seated through all your corners and transitions, you don't need a dropper.
If you are more worried about KOMs than tech, you don't need a dropper.

If you wear baggies you will love the dropper.
If you have a wide seat and a spare tire (the one around your waist) you will love a dropper.
If you like tight flow with fast hard bike leans you will love the dropper.
If you enjoy rolling big drops with hard transitions you will love the dropper.
If you enjoy pumping big steps and gaps you will love the dropper.
If you enjoy pumping with manuals involved you will love the dropper.
If you enjoy steep switchbacks with little to no berms you will love the dropper.
If you enjoy keeping your feet on the pedals between climbing and descending you will love the dropper.

No one NEEDS a dropper. But I LOATH riding without one now.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Justin MD said:


> If you can run a rigid with a smile, you don't need a dropper.
> If you are 6ft and 150lbs with a skinny saddle and lycra shorts, you don't need a dropper.
> If you can stay seated through all your corners and transitions, you don't need a dropper.
> If you are more worried about KOMs than tech, you don't need a dropper.
> ...


yeah I think a ton of people who do not like them should video themselves riding with one. MY guess is they never use the extra range of motion that a dropper allows them to because they have been riding with a high seat for so long.

Personally I have been setting more KOM going down with one than with out one.


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## banditpowdercoat (Aug 13, 2015)

Just build a poor mans dropper with basically a spring inside seat tube. Will be trying this out until funds improve LOL


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## the-one1 (Aug 2, 2008)

banditpowdercoat said:


> Just build a poor mans dropper with basically a spring inside seat tube. Will be trying this out until funds improve LOL


Gravity Dropper beat you to it. It's just a spring and a pin. Nothing fancy.


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## banditpowdercoat (Aug 13, 2015)

the-one1 said:


> Gravity Dropper beat you to it. It's just a spring and a pin. Nothing fancy.


But mine cost $3


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

I've got a sprung seatpost in the shed. Worst of both worlds..


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

Mr Pig said:


> I've got a sprung seatpost in the shed. Worst of both worlds..


Dad? (in-law)....

Better half's father designed/built his own version of a spring assisted seat ^^

Fugliest thing you've ever seen!?

PS - he uses it on his carbon HT

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## av8or (Jun 9, 2013)

banditpowdercoat said:


> Just build a poor mans dropper with basically a spring inside seat tube. Will be trying this out until funds improve LOL


or go ghetto dropper..
step 1 : remove seat from seat post... 
step 2: done..


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

av8or said:


> or go ghetto dropper..
> step 1 : remove seat from seat post...
> step 2: done..


step 3: find out what prison is like


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## banditpowdercoat (Aug 13, 2015)

Lmao. No thx. This isn't perfect. But I can teach down and open the clamp squish seat down. Tighten. And go down the techys. Then if I see flats for a while. Stand up open clamp and up she comes to my height. Just have to use legs to keep seat straight. Yes I know it's not perfect but I don't have to stop now. Slow down yes. And I'm not spending a bucketload on a ht I'm not keeping. I like making things. If it works then awesome. If you don't like it don't ask to ride my bike. Hahahahaa


Sent from my iPhone while my Heli plays with the gophers


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## MSU Alum (Aug 8, 2009)

You don't "need" tubeless tires. You don't "need" disc brakes. You don't "need" light components. Hell, maybe you don't "need" toilet paper.....but they're all nice to have. I have a dropper post, use it, like it. If you don't, okay.


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

MSU Alum said:


> You don't "need" tubeless tires. You don't "need" disc brakes. You don't "need" light components. Hell, maybe you don't "need" toilet paper.....but they're all nice to have. I have a dropper post, use it, like it. If you don't, okay.


+1

You don't need teeth either!

But they're pretty bloody handy alright.

Sent from my Kin[G]_Pad ™


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## Fuzzle (Mar 31, 2015)

Do I really need to spend $300? I want to get one for my b-day or x-mas.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Yes.


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

Fuzzle said:


> Do I really need to spend $300? I want to get one for my b-day or x-mas.


No. KS-eTen are $150 of your US dollars if I remember correctly... not the flashiest looking dropper. But, gets the job done.

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## Fuzzle (Mar 31, 2015)

Sorry man, I trust the lady .


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

Fuzzle said:


> Sorry man, I trust the lady .


Her Majesty?

Even better then!!

-----------------------------------------------------------
'Yes! I'm an opinionated Mofo... Next question'.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

If there are reliable sub -300 options, go for it.... the last time I bought one (that didn't come installed) that option didn't exist.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Most of my riding in MA is lots of quick up n downs. Small ridges and such. Do people really use a dropper post for 30 seconds? I can't imagine. Sold one I won in a raffle. No interest in owning one. Some people I ride with have them, always leaking and not working. My enduro seems to work fine without one. Not everyone needs a dropper post. And get off my lawn.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

leeboh said:


> Most of my riding in MA is lots of quick up n downs. Small ridges and such. Do people really use a dropper post for 30 seconds? I can't imagine. Sold one I won in a raffle. No interest in owning one. Some people I ride with have them, always leaking and not working. My enduro seems to work fine without one. Not everyone needs a dropper post. And get off my lawn.


Yeah, but as the experts said - you mostly ride easier and non-technical terrain.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Rode a trail yesterday that is generally pretty easy. It's fast and flowy, which can be fun at times. Oddly, it also has some of the biggest drops around as optional lines.

If it wasn't for those drops, I wouldn't use my dropper post there at all, but man, the more I ride those drops with a proper dropper post, the more fun they are. The biggest one probably involves about 4-5ft of air (if you have enough momentum to get at least half a bikelength out from the lip, the drop is right after a short, steep climb so you need to hammer before the climb to make sure you've got the mo' to clean everything smoothly) before landing to a really nice transition with a nice runout. I've taken those drops without a dropper and the landing is always a little tense with the saddle up near my gut. I notice that I'm a lot more loose and a lot smoother on them when using my dropper. I nailed one of the landings absolutely perfectly on my ride yesterday. I was loose, hit everything smoothly. Barely felt like I ever left the ground at all. Didn't feel like the suspension compressed much on the landing at all. 

That kind of thing gives me the confidence to go bigger if the opportunity presents. And anyone who rides with me knows I'm generally not comfortable with big air. I have a healthy sense of self-preservation.

Yesterday's weather was absolutely gorgeous so the trail was pretty busy. I didn't see a single other rider hitting the drops. But then again, I also didn't see very many dropper posts out there.

I gotta figure that a lot of the folks saying you don't need one are the folks that don't necessarily ride in such a way that they'd take advantage of one if they even had it.


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## WA-CO (Nov 23, 2013)

*Depends, but I'm saying yes...*

I held out on getting a dropper for the longest time. I don't need one. Adds weight. They are for those who ride super sketchy stuff. Just another thing to go wrong. I'm basically a XC guy. All correct.

This said, I *rarely walk *tech sections. I walk a couple places in Moab, specifically the super steep sections on Jacksons. Handful of spots on Fruita Lunch Loops too. I walked a couple of super gnarly sections in Sedona. Of those I ride with over the years, I'm probably one of the better technical riders. My go to bike is a XC monster truck, a Santa Cruz Tallboy2.

Two summers ago, I was riding with a factory wrench for one of the big bike companies. We were blasting down the hills over near Keystone. He convinced me to drop my saddle. I resisted. He suggested it again. I reluctantly did so. Been riding with the guy for a week. For the first time, I was able to keep him in sight on the downhill. Hmmm...

Last year in Moab I went over the handlebars and busted out my front teeth. I rode this exact section the day before no problem. (For the record its the one kinda steep off camber drop on the directional section of Hymasa.) So $3500 later, maybe I need to consider it. Hmmm...

In the last year, I've been able to take the 3 day IMBA ride guide course. One topic they continued to reinforce was dropping your saddle. Drop your saddle. Drop your saddle. Hmmm...

I've ridden a dropper for nearly a year now. Just this summer a buddy said to me "You're a lot faster on the downhills now." Hmmm...

I'm making the transition based upon my own personal experiences. Its improved my skill, and honesty in tech terrain, it's much safer. Understand, I live with 5 hours of some of the most technical terrain in the US (North Shore excluded).

So, if you ride aggressive terrain, or regularly find yourself on steeper downhill trails, get one. Me, as budget allows, will convert all my bikes to a dropper.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

slapheadmofo said:


> Yeah, but as the experts said - you mostly ride easier and non-technical terrain.


Smooth like the MUPs.


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## Fuzzle (Mar 31, 2015)

Safer, more fun, more confidence and faster. Yeah, I want all that!


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## spyghost (Oct 30, 2012)

... or just drop the seatpost 5-6" off the normal height and pedal standing (easier said than done)


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## Boomchakabowwow (Sep 8, 2015)

Wait! Don't I get socks?

Auto correct changed the word "socks" to "*****". Glad I caught that!!!


Sent via Jedi mind trick.


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## L. Ron Hoover (Feb 1, 2006)

leeboh said:


> Most of my riding in MA is lots of quick up n downs. Small ridges and such. Do people really use a dropper post for 30 seconds? I can't imagine. Sold one I won in a raffle. No interest in owning one. Some people I ride with have them, always leaking and not working. My enduro seems to work fine without one. Not everyone needs a dropper post. And get off my lawn.


We have the same sort of terrain and it's exactly the reason why I love having a dropper. It's great to be able to drop the seat at the top of a short but steep descent and then flip it back to full height at the bottom for the inevitable steep climb coming up next. I use mine a probably a dozen times a ride. While I _can_ ride everything with my seat at ideal pedaling height (well maybe except the jumps and drops) it's way more fun and faster with the seat down. The dropper gives me a way to instantly get good body position for both climbing and descending and I dig that. It works for me. I am also perfectly ok with your stance on it if that's what works for you. 

I might well be singing a different tune if I had any trouble with my dropper but I'm on season 6 with my AMP and the only maintenance I've done is the occasional new cable and a bit of grease here and there. I've been tempted to replace it but I'm afraid the replacement won't be as reliable.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

slapheadmofo said:


> Did you read the title of the thread?
> 
> I regularly ride all sorts of places where many people use droppers. They find them helpful. I find them extraneous. You assume a lot more than you know.


This


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> Because they don't have the skills to ride without one.
> 
> Dropper posts have their place, and they are helpful to many, but saying that you NEED a dropper post to ride fast is just moronic. These are the same people recommending 140mm bikes for smooth XC trails.


This is the argument in a nutshell. I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but a dropper isn't necessary at all. Lower your seat an inch from where it's set on your road bike and ride. Get out there and practice cornering, shifting your weight, and learning to get behind the saddle. Wear clothes that don't get caught on the saddle. If you're jumping off 6 feet rocks then you may prefer to own and use a dropper. It's a convenience item that has a lot of hype. Flame on


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Rod said:


> This is the argument in a nutshell. I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but a dropper isn't necessary at all. Lower your seat an inch from where it's set on your road bike and ride. Get out there and practice cornering, shifting your weight, and learning to get behind the saddle. Wear clothes that don't get caught on the saddle. If you're jumping off 6 feet rocks then you may prefer to own and use a dropper. It's a convenience item that has a lot of hype. Flame on


no one needs to ride a MTB either, no one needs suspension, no on needs gear.

Its a convenience items but I am much faster on even the flattest and smoothest of trails with one, because once you learn to use it, you can generate speed from pumping turns and an any undulation. Sure you can pump with your seat at pedaling height but you will never be able to pump as well as someone with a lowered saddle.

and conversely sure you can pedal with your seat down but you will never be able to pedal as well with your seat up.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

I think for accuracy's sake, you ought to go back and edit the 'you's in your post and change them to 'I's.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

leeboh said:


> Most of my riding in MA is lots of quick up n downs. Small ridges and such. Do people really use a dropper post for 30 seconds? I can't imagine. Sold one I won in a raffle. No interest in owning one. Some people I ride with have them, always leaking and not working. My enduro seems to work fine without one. Not everyone needs a dropper post. And get off my lawn.


The thing that is exactly the point of the dropper. I use to lower my seat for DH sections over a couple minutes that had enough turns or pump or tech to make it worth my while, but not I will literally lower it for one feature then put right back up.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> I think for accuracy's sake, you ought to go back and edit the 'you's in your post and change them to 'I's.


its not just me.

You are close enough to come ride with me, I say if you think not having a dropper is better prove it to me.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

BushwackerinPA said:


> no one needs to ride a MTB either, no one needs suspension, no on needs gear.
> 
> Its a convenience items but I am much faster on even the flattest and smoothest of trails with one


This is exactly my point. It's a convenience item. It's not needed. Can it make your life a little easier? Yes, it does. Does everyone need to own them for most of their riding? No.

In my state most riding happens in city parks. Do you need a dropper and a 140mm full suspension bike for terrain that I can ride with no hands? Nope, but you'll find em there.

In short, it's consumerism.


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## Boomchakabowwow (Sep 8, 2015)

thanks EVERYONE. i like the debate.

doing "tricks" like a Manual,or a bunny-hop..the seat lower would really help me..i suck. (right now..but i'm practicing)


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

BushwackerinPA said:


> better prove it to me.


Sorry, but that's the kind of attitude I strive to avoid when I go riding.
"You don't worship my gear?!?!?! Wanna race about it!!!???!!"

Getting it wrong on so many levels.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> Sorry, but that's the kind of attitude I strive to avoid when I go riding.
> "You don't worship my gear?!?!?! Wanna race about it!!!???!!"
> 
> Getting it wrong on so many levels.


It not worshiping my gear its accepting simple facts and physics that a lower COM and more area to move around in will make anyone faster once they learn how to use the extra range of motion.

I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant about simple facts of physics, it not an opinion. Given equal riders on 99 percent of the terrain the person with the dropper post will all ways be faster. Another way to put it is the GIVEN EQUAL rider skill the person with dropper will have more control. IF you can argue against this by quantitative and reasonable means I would love to hear it but its not really possible. Use facts, not opinions and do not post believes post finding.

Do you need a dropper? no...not at all not what I am saying.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Rod said:


> Does everyone need to own them for most of their riding? No.


I know that for a cross or XC race once the riders knew how and when to use it, most would be faster with one.



Rod said:


> In my state most riding happens in city parks.
> 
> Do you need a dropper and a 140mm full suspension bike for terrain that I can ride with no hands? Nope, but you'll find em there.
> 
> In short, it's consumerism.


First there are some city park out there with really good terrain. Second some people own only a 140mm bike because it far easier to ride easy terrain on "big" bike then it is to ride gnarly terrain on a "small" bike.

All of MTBing is consumerism, the entire sport is.


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2015)

Everyone tells me I need a smart phone and data plan. For what? I've saved at least $7500 on phone bills over the last 6 years, that's a lot of bike parts. I've also been told my cycling hobby is too expensive (last time by a guy who just dropped 19K on a fishing boat). Good thing I took accounting and economics classes and can do math. As an aside, the "Fisherman" generally releases his fish but did estimate that he'd saved "Hundreds" on food with the fish he brings home. Really? I ride more than 2500 miles of commuting every year (so offsetting around $.50/mile or $1250/year) for the last 30 years. Hmmm. I buy a bike about every 5 years (6 in 30 years) at an average cost (not weighted for dollar value) of $1200 so that's $7200 in bikes. I save between $600 and $1250/year (adjusted for the price of gas, etc) so $925/year or $27K+ and I'm not teetering on diabetes. I think I'm doing okay.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

BushwackerinPA said:


> I know that for a cross or XC race once the riders knew how and when to use it, most would be faster with one.
> 
> First there are some city park out there with really good terrain. Second some people own only a 140mm bike because it far easier to ride easy terrain on "big" bike then it is to ride gnarly terrain on a "small" bike.
> 
> All of MTBing is consumerism, the entire sport is.


I agree the entire sport is based around consumerism and so is our society. The post directly below this one reflects that as well. It's easier to buy a dropper instead of fiddling with bike setup or technique. As long as the rider feels more comfortable or more in control.

I was unclear, but I was stating that people buy 5inch plus travel bikes solely for these city park trails. I'm sure some city parks have great trails. Our trails are fantastic, but they're not technical though. They're great for what they are. It lowers the bar so anyone can ride.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

BushwackerinPA said:


> Use facts, not opinions


Wanna share the details of the study that led you to your "99%" and "always" conclusions?
Sounds to me like you pulled those out of your ass.

"I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant"

Classic.


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## l'oiseau (May 5, 2015)

Oh boy... this again...

I recently just bought a dropper for my hardtail. Why? Because I need it? No. To make me faster? No.

Because I thought it would make some of the steeper, twisty trails more fun to ride.

I went over in my head just using the quick release method but honestly after watching some vids of guys flowing through ups and downs using them on the fly, I couldn't not want one. I could think of about a million areas where I could drop my seat and take a corner or jump about a million times better than I could with my seat up.

I honestly started comparing it to having to get off my bike to change gears. That seemed ludicrous to me. I want the seat up for going up or flat. I want it low to pump, jump or corner. Seemed like a no brainer.

I'm still keeping my rigid bike with a fixed seat, but honestly rigid bikes handle so much better and I don't ride it on steep, rough terrain, so I don't see the need for it... yet...


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Nobody cares about this so everyone else except BushwackerinPA please disregard this silly post.



BushwackerinPA said:


> I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant about simple facts of physics, it not an opinion. Given equal riders on 99 percent of the terrain the person with the dropper post will all ways be faster.


First, I'm guessing that 99% of dropper post purchasers are buying them for reasons other than making them faster.

And for the 100th time, the worlds fastest non-gravity fed riders don't use them in races. I know you think that they are just too dumb and set in their roadie ways to use something that doesn't fit in with all the other cool kids but consider this- Absalon and Schurter could be considered nearly identical equals on the trail with Shurter maybe having the slightest edge. Both of these guys are familiar with droppers and have used them on their "fun" and/or enduro bikes. Both of these guys have a team behind them with deep pockets who are constantly searching for any possible advantage, no matter how small with a very analytical eye.

Given those facts does it really seem possible that Absalon would forgo the honor (and $$$) of wearing the World Champion jersey in the name of tradition? It doesn't to me.


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## drwx (Jun 4, 2011)

I got a 650b specific dropper post. So much more rollover capability.

--
Stephen


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

l'oiseau said:


> I honestly started comparing it to having to get off my bike to change gears. That seemed ludicrous to me.


How about if you only found you felt the need for a different gear once every many hundred miles, if that? Not every rider feels the need to fiddle with their gears or bike geometry every couple seconds. I'm sure many, like myself, find it more of a distraction (bordering on annoyance) than a 'must have' function. Hell, there are a bunch of people out there that only use ONE GEAR!!!! on their bikes. How do they ever get anywhere at all?


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## l'oiseau (May 5, 2015)

slapheadmofo said:


> How about if you only found you felt the need for a different gear once every many hundred miles, if that? Not every rider feels the need to fiddle with their gears or bike geometry every couple seconds. I'm sure many, like myself, find it more of a distraction (bordering on annoyance) than a 'must have' function. Hell, there are a bunch of people out there that only use ONE GEAR!!!! on their bikes. How do they ever get anywhere at all?


Not wanting to argue but that was the rationale I had. Obviously I rode a long time without one before and got by, but I never really got off the bike and changed my seat position much.

I guess I should clarify; if I wanted to change my seat position, I'd rather it have two very important function:

1 - be adjustable on the fly
2 - go back to the exact same position each time

I know not all droppers do those things, but the one I bought does.

I actually hate changing my seat height, or my handlebars, or my stem position. I feel like I never get it just so...


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## Legbacon (Jan 20, 2004)

U


l'oiseau said:


> I honestly started comparing it to having to get off my bike to change gears. That seemed ludicrous to me. I want the seat up for going up or flat. I want it low to pump, jump or corner. Seemed like a no brainer.


Good comparison. A couple of months ago I was stuck on a borrowed bike with no dropper. The trail was a real mix, steep, rocky, lots of ups, flowy, and tech. I had to stop ad adjust manually constantly. If you don't ride trails where this is an issue, and a lot of people don't, cool, but here they are ubiquitous.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Here too.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

l'oiseau said:


> Oh boy... this again...
> 
> I recently just bought a dropper for my hardtail. Why? Because I need it? No. To make me faster? No.
> 
> ...


Ty for this logical post in this train wreck.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

Travis Bickle said:


> U
> 
> Good comparison. A couple of months ago I was stuck on a borrowed bike with no dropper. The trail was a real mix, steep, rocky, lots of ups, flowy, and tech. I had to stop ad adjust manually constantly. If you don't ride trails where this is an issue, and a lot of people don't, cool, but here they are ubiquitous.


I ride trails like that too. Different strokes for different folks though. Mine are old hiking trails that have been widened by atvs. Straight up and straight down.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

TB - you say you "had' to stop and adjust to ride these trails?

Were you forced to walk this type of terrain up until a few years ago?
I'd be curious to see some pics/vid.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> TB - you say you "had' to stop and adjust to ride these trails?
> 
> Were you forced to walk this type of terrain up until a few years ago?
> I'd be curious to see some pics/vid.


the thing is no one has to "stop"

Their are very few trails that I could nt ride with out my seat dropped. The thing is I can ride basically anything better including some techincal climb with an adjustable height seat post.

after riding for 3 years with a dropper though, getting on bike with out one is just about the most frightening ever, once you get use to using one, everything will seem worse with out one.

As far as the fastest non gravity riders not using one. Its such a cop out. XC racers are some of the most conservative with set ups out there with changing happening very very slowly. As far as I know not a single top 20 riders has done any extensive testing or has their ever been any talk. Think about how long it took for 29er and 650b bike to become the norm well after 29er were basically the status quo at just about every american XC race.

To anyone who does not think loering your seat cna help you ride better, go to a local pump track and try to ride with your saddle at road height, then lower it as far as you can as see how much easier it is. No matter what your skill level the lowered seat will be faster. Now imagine that every time the trail is not pancake flat and straight how much faster(or easier or more control) you can do it with a lowered seat. Anyone who say they have more control with a higher seat just has no developed the core muscle and the pump skill to make the lower seat work for them


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> Wanna share the details of the study that led you to your "99%" and "always" conclusions?
> Sounds to me like you pulled those out of your ass.
> 
> "I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant"
> ...


I am not posting opinions. Opinions and belief are soft, and should never be held to same merits as actual facts.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

BushwackerinPA said:


> I am not posting opinions. Opinions and belief are soft, and should never be held to same merits as actual facts.


But they are your opinions. They are not incontrovertible facts. I'm not sure why you don't get that.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

"I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant"

A low seat does help at the pumptrack. Actually, what helps most is riding a 20" bike with the seat completely slammed. So that's what I use there. And I use a DH bike for DHing. And a trail bike for trail riding. I have a certain seat height I like for those different pursuits. I feel no need to screw with it every couple seconds, or minutes, or hours, just like I don't feel the need to twist knobs and flick levers on my suspension every 50'. Some people get a lot of joy from constantly dicking around with one gizmo or another. Others don't. Droppers are just another gizmo I feel no need to dick with.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Le Duke said:


> But they are your opinions. They are not incontrovertible facts. I'm not sure why you don't get that.


so tell me how a lower COM and being able to move around more make you less capable and riding a bike? I am all ears......as far as I am concerned that is a fact.

so tell me something I posted as opinion one at a time......


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

slapheadmofo said:


> "I am not wrong that is why I seem arrogant"
> 
> A low seat does help at the pumptrack. Actually, what helps most is riding a 20" bike with the seat completely slammed. So that's what I use there. And I use a DH bike for DHing. And a trail bike for trail riding. I have a certain seat height I like for those different pursuits. I feel no need to screw with it every couple seconds, or minutes, or hours, just like I don't feel the need to twist knobs and flick levers on my suspension every 50'. Some people get a lot of joy from constantly dicking around with one gizmo or another. Others don't. Droppers are just another gizmo I feel no need to dick with.


I hate gizmos as well, and actually have hardtail Single speed with a dropper. I probably hit the dropper plunger more on that bike then the brakes.....

the thing being able to pump and lean the bike are stuff that happen on typical trail ride, if the trail was really smooth sure a BMX bike would rock, but quite often even on supposed flow trails a BMX would be hell.


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## TSpice (May 15, 2015)

BushwackerinPA said:


> so tell me how a lower COM and being able to move around more make you less capable and riding a bike? I am all ears......as far as I am concerned that is a fact.
> 
> so tell me something I posted as opinion one at a time......


...because it is based on "feel" or "control" which is a human variable. How do you quantify feel?

If you had a dropper and got rid of it, how many units of control did you lose? May or may not be able to show a time difference, but that isn't what you are talking about, you are talking about capability. A relative term.

How is anything relative, in the eyes of one person versus another, a "incontrovertible fact."

It is an opinion.

I mean it is an opinion I agree with, but that doesn't make it fact.

Hell just about anything that helps/hurts/speeds/slows you down or better/worse is a personal preference, therefor an opinion. Saying a 2.3in tire is 2.3in? Ok that is a fact. Saying a 720mm bar provides more control than a 675mm bar? Is an opinion. Saying a 120mm fork provides XYZ travel? Likely to be a fact unless someone proves it otherwise or you have faulty equipment. Saying 120mm fork gives you more control than a 100mm does? An opinion.


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## L. Ron Hoover (Feb 1, 2006)

Here are the facts of the matter: You can get into objectively better body positions for descending with your seat lowered and you are in an objectively better position for pedaling efficiency with it up. Descending with the seat up presents a compromise just as climbing with it down does (ow, my freakin' knees!). And yes, these things are quantifiable.

Picking an intermediate position compromises on both ends. Using a dropper allows on the fly shifting between good body positions for climbing and descending but also presents a compromise in complexity, weight and often reliability. 

Pick the compromise that's least obtrusive for you, then shut up and ride! 

Personally, the advantages of the dropper significantly outweigh the compromises so I use one. On the trails I ride it enhances my experience. YMMV and that's cool too.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

BushwackerinPA said:


> As far as the fastest non gravity riders not using one. Its such a cop out. XC racers are some of the most conservative with set ups out there with changing happening very very slowly. As far as I know not a single top 20 riders has done any extensive testing or has their ever been any talk. Think about how long it took for 29er and 650b bike to become the norm well after 29er were basically the status quo at just about every american XC race.


What about this vid I saw here the other day?






Honestly I'm not positive but that sure looks like he's using a dropper to me. I guarantee he's not the only one.

Wacker you should get out there with your dropper and kick those xc roadie weenies @sses!


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## TSpice (May 15, 2015)

L. Ron Hoover said:


> Here are the facts of the matter: You can get into objectively better body positions for descending with your seat lowered and you are in an objectively better position for pedaling efficiency with it up. Descending with the seat up presents a compromise just as climbing with it down does (ow, my freakin' knees!). And yes, these things are quantifiable.
> 
> Picking an intermediate position compromises on both ends. Using a dropper allows on the fly shifting between good body positions for climbing and descending but also presents a compromise in complexity, weight and often reliability.
> 
> ...


Best description of a business case for a dropper I have seen on this forum.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

TSpice said:


> ...because it is based on "feel" or "control" which is a human variable. How do you quantify feel?
> 
> If you had a dropper and got rid of it, how many units of control did you lose? May or may not be able to show a time difference, but that isn't what you are talking about, you are talking about capability. A relative term.
> 
> ...


I can measure speed differential. I am between 20-30 seconds faster with a dropped seat post on numerous 2-5 minute long DH. The difference can be much more if the DH has any punchy uphill in it.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

J.B. Weld said:


> What about this vid I saw here the other day?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I said equal skill and fitness level, My fitness is not equal to someone who has rode 10-20 hours a week for 15+ years.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

BushwackerinPA said:


> I said equal skill and fitness level, My fitness is not equal to someone who has rode 10-20 hours a week for 15+ years.


But do you concur that he's using a dropper in that vid?


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## Legbacon (Jan 20, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> TB - you say you "had' to stop and adjust to ride these trails?
> 
> Were you forced to walk this type of terrain up until a few years ago?
> I'd be curious to see some pics/vid.


I use the dropper constantly now, but that particular trail has section where I would be holding on to trees to walk down. 20 years ago I would have walked, 15 years ago I would lower manually. The thing is a couple minutes later you're climbing again. A few days out hear and my flat land buddy bought my old Reverb for his vacation road trips. The last place I lived I road my old 98 Explosif Rigid SS non dropper, except on vacation when the FS dropper got used. Now the Explosif is my townie and a Warden is my daily driver.


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## goodmojo (Sep 12, 2011)

slapheadmofo said:


> I have plenty of friends that love their droppers. I'm not saying don't use one if you find it benefits you. I'm saying I think they're overrated as a 'must have' item. As far as being familiar what riding with a lower seat gains you, I've got hundreds of chairlift days on DH bikes as well as hundreds more on BMX / park / DJ bikes under my belt. I'm neither a newb nor a one-trick-XC-pony, so please can the patronizing 'tude.


A lot of it might just be terrain. In so cal I ride long grinding smooth ups then back down. Dropper not useful.

In Austin we have highly technical but short ups and downs the dropper is great


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## Sarah Ireland (Jun 13, 2015)

I got one this year. I was like I don't need one I rode years without it. My husband who is not that in to mountain biking I have more time on a bike then him. Well he told me to get one. Well if you insist!! I got one put it on myself and let me tell you what it's cool! Do I need it No. I use it and I like it but I can live without it. I don't plan on putting one on my second bike. 

If all you do is shuttle a down hill no need for one. If you climb to ride down it is a great thing to have. I enjoy mine would I recommend it depends. They are really cool and lots of fun. Did it make me a better rider No it just made life easier.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

My hubby heard a good one today: " if your bike is sized right, you don't need one". This was from a rider on a custom built HT, walked everything technical.


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## Guest (Oct 25, 2015)

formica said:


> My hubby heard a good one today: " if your bike is sized right, you don't need one". This was from a rider on a custom built HT, walked everything technical.


 If you're walking your bike you don't need a dropper or technically a bike.


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## blackitout (Jun 30, 2014)

There's a lot of things I've been reluctant to get because people said it was better. 140mm fork, wide bars, short stem, dropper post. I've been riding since the early 90s and I thought it was all hooplah. I was wrong. All of them have either made things more fun or created better control. 

A dropper post I just bought 7 days ago is one of those things. It makes everything more fun. I have plenty skill getting behind the seat on steeps but being able to get low, manual over big rocks and not worry about the seat hitting my ass or chest, leaning the bike more than ever before is worth it. It's weird feeling how nimble a bike is when the seat isn't hitting your thighs. It's like riding on jello until I got used to it. I love it. Like someone else said, rear suspension or a dropper, I'd pick a dropper.


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## l'oiseau (May 5, 2015)

I don't know why there is all this shaming of people who use a dropper? It's rather strange behavior. It's almost like you have to justify your badassness w/o one to earn the right to buy one. Who cares?

I've also not seen many (actually no) BMX bikes with their seats up. I certainly don't have a good BMX background - if I did, I'd be a lot better with my seat down than I am. It surely helps, but you really do need a lot of skills to be able to use it to it's full potential. To think of it as cheating or something like that is ludicrous. It really just opens your mountain bike up to a whole new skill set that you may or may not have. If you don't have it, you should work on it... it helps, and you can't use it's full potential without your seat out of the way.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

l'oiseau said:


> I don't know why there is all this shaming of people who use a dropper? It's rather strange behavior. It's almost like you have to justify your badassness w/o one to earn the right to buy one. Who cares?
> 
> I've also not seen many (actually no) BMX bikes with their seats up. I certainly don't have a good BMX background - if I did, I'd be a lot better with my seat down than I am. It surely helps, but you really do need a lot of skills to be able to use it to it's full potential. To think of it as cheating or something like that is ludicrous. It really just opens your mountain bike up to a whole new skill set that you may or may not have. If you don't have it, you should work on it... it helps, and you can't use it's full potential without your seat out of the way.


Here's the problem:

For every "attack" by non-dropper riders, there are several snide remarks about "well, if you just ride tame XC..." from the other side.

Make me a 300g dropper that won't die under my portly 145lbs and you'll see me in line.


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## l'oiseau (May 5, 2015)

Well the GD seems fairly reliable, not 300g, but maybe only 300g more than a regular post? I could care less about the weight...

Even on 'tame' xc there is plenty of use for it. Some of the easiest trails where I am have tons of pump features in them. They are easy to ride, hard to ride well.

I gotta be honest, I don't yet possess enough forethought and mastery of the seat down to make it as effective as I could on that tame stuff. On all dh runs it's a no brainer to figure out where the seat should be, but when you add in actual ups and downs it takes some thought, and it's hard to time it right. I'm definitely more fluid on that type of terrain with a fixed seat just because I don't have enough experience to know exactly when to change and how to do it seamlessly. I've seen plenty of vids on people doing it right and being completely fluid with it, and I'll say it's not nearly as easy as it looks.

Not only is riding with the seat down a new technique to learn, learning when to put it down is yet another skill to master. I can easily see how some wouldn't want to bother, but when you see someone do it well, it's hard not to want to try.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Boomchakabowwow said:


> i'm not new to mtn biking. i rode a Specialized FSR into the ground..thank goodness they stock bushings from the 90's.
> 
> anyways. i got a new bike. everytime i go to the shop, the salepeople say things like.."you owe it to yourself to get a dropper post".
> 
> ...


Because you do.


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## cmc4130 (Jan 30, 2008)

:thumbsup:


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Good article as to why: http://www.pinkbike.com/news/zeps-how-to-body-position-descending-cornering-braking-2016.html


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Also, anyone without a dropper, how do you do manuals or even a proper American style bunny hop?


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## Mudguard (Apr 14, 2009)

There's an American bunnyhop?


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

SDMTB'er said:


> Also, anyone without a dropper, how do you do manuals or even a proper American style bunny hop?


Do you really think no one ever did those things until as few years ago, when someone finally dropped $450 bucks on a seatpost and all of a sudden, BAM! manuals and bunny hops were born?

Is this similar to how no one was ever able to ride in snow deeper than 1/4" until fad...er fat bikes showed up?


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

SDMTB'er said:


> Also, anyone without a dropper, how do you do manuals or even a proper American style bunny hop?


Someone has never watched Peter Sagan do no-handed manuals on a road bike, it seems...

(Go to ~3:50) 




Video: Peter Sagan Goes Mountain Biking - Pinkbike

The idea that you need a dropper, or have to lower your seat, to bunny hop or ride a manual is just ridiculous.



slapheadmofo said:


> Do you really think no one ever did those things until as few years ago, when someone finally dropped $450 bucks on a seatpost and all of a sudden, BAM! manuals and bunny hops were born?
> 
> Is this similar to how no one was ever able to ride in snow deeper than 1/4" until fad...er fat bikes showed up?


I'm not going to lie, I think it would be funny to watch some people try to ride technical east coast XC singletrack without their 6" bikes and droppers.


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## Vespasianus (Apr 9, 2008)

SDMTB'er said:


> Also, anyone without a dropper, how do you do manuals or even a proper American style bunny hop?


I know. Really, how could you even ride a mountain bike before 2010? Really. Really. Really. Silly.

And yes, I hope you are being as sarcastic as me!


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Le Duke said:


> I'm not going to lie, I think it would be funny to watch some people try to ride technical east coast XC singletrack without their 6" bikes and droppers.


Didn't you hear? There's no tech in the NE. That's the only reason anyone is able to ride here without first purchasing certain magical components.


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## Mudguard (Apr 14, 2009)

Le Duke said:


> I'm not going to lie, I think it would be funny to watch some people try to ride technical east coast XC singletrack without their 6" bikes and droppers.


They'll probably ride slower. So the same speed as the non-dropper, 100mm travel riders...


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Mudguard25 said:


> There's an American bunnyhop?


Google it.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Vespasianus said:


> I know. Really, how could you even ride a mountain bike before 2010? Really. Really. Really. Silly.
> 
> And yes, I hope you are being as sarcastic as me!


Every "how to" video starts with "lower your seat." Bikes evolve, allowing us to do more. Saying otherwise is silly.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Mudguard25 said:


> They'll probably ride slower. So the same speed as the non-dropper, 100mm travel riders...


Boom. Nice reply and correct.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Le Duke said:


> Someone has never watched Peter Sagan do no-handed manuals on a road bike, it seems...
> 
> (Go to ~3:50)
> 
> ...


Now post a vid of YOU doing a manual on a road bike. Then I would be impressed.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Mudguard25 said:


> They'll probably ride slower. So the same speed as the non-dropper, 100mm travel riders...


 Of course, in real life, equipment matters a lot less than it does on the internet.
Fast riders are fast, slow riders are slow. It's very unlikely that swapping seatposts, or even swapping complete bikes, would make much difference. I've had my ass kicked by people on every conceivable set up no matter what I'm riding at the time.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

slapheadmofo said:


> Of course, in real life, equipment matters a lot less than it does on the internet.
> Fast riders are fast, slow riders are slow. It's very unlikely that swapping seatposts, or even swapping complete bikes, would make much difference. I've had my ass kicked by people on every conceivable set up no matter what I'm riding at the time.


Almost every aspect of your MTB whether you have an XC setup, trail, Enduro, or DH bike has evolved over the past years.

There is a reason DH riders do not ride with their seat high. If you are a typical trail rider there are lots of times when your intended route ventures into or close to DH territory. In these cases it is nice to be able to lower the seat so you can get into the proper neutral (attack) position - then raise it again when the inevitable climb happens.

Unless your MTB rides are mostly flat a dropper post is a huge advantage on the trails. Saying otherwise is silly.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Huge? Can you quantify it? Alternatively, do you believe that it is possible that others might have adapted to simply do without?

I live in the mountains of western VA, and currently have a dropper on my ASRc. I'll be attempting to determine how much time a dropper will save me on the average steep, rock-filled descent here.


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## Legbacon (Jan 20, 2004)

For me, it's not just about faster, but safer as well. At 57, my bikes are setup with safety in mind, and going down a chunky rock face with my saddle up just isn't as safe as lowered. As for "it's the rider, not the bike", I watched a video of some Guy riding down a mountain in Iran on a unicycle last year, so yeah, that's true. I suggest those who justify old fashioned equipment try it so they can confirm how awesome it is.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

SDMTB'er said:


> Unless your MTB rides are mostly flat a dropper post is a huge advantage on the trails. Saying otherwise is silly.


Judging by lots of experience riding New England trails with lots of other folks, I haven't seen this huge advantage.

Yes, on really nasty DH, I want my seat way down. I also want a whole shitload of travel. I really can't think of spots on regular trail rides that approach what I consider steep and nasty DH.


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## rm25x (Apr 2, 2005)

Travis Bickle said:


> I watched a video of some Guy riding down a mountain in Iran on a unicycle last year...


Did he have a dropper?


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

Travis Bickle said:


> As for "it's the rider, not the bike", I watched a video of some Guy riding down a mountain in Iran on a unicycle last year, so yeah, that's true.


Maybe he was using one of those new unicycle 'direct insertion' seatposts? ;0) Really connects you to the trail apparently.


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

slapheadmofo said:


> Judging by lots of experience riding New England trails with lots of other folks, I haven't seen this huge advantage.
> 
> Yes, on really nasty DH, I want my seat way down. I also want a whole shitload of travel. I really can't think of spots on regular trail rides that approach what I consider steep and nasty DH.


How many miles do you ride per year? Sorry to ask but just want to understand what your perspective is. I ride about 3800 miles per year. Droppers for the win. Not sure what the downside is.


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## fatkidonabike (Feb 7, 2016)

Do I need a dropper? Absolutely not. As an American am I free to spend my money on whatever the hell I want? Absolutely. Dropper is on my bike because I want it.....I need to justify it with nobody but myself.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

SDMTB'er said:


> How many miles do you ride per year? Sorry to ask but just want to understand what your perspective is. I ride about 3800 miles per year. Droppers for the win. Not sure what the downside is.


Lucky if I get 1/4 of that in these days, though I have been playing the game for 25+ years and for a lot of them, I was a 5-7 day a week rider. And not saying there's a downside to running what you like, but after running one for a season or so, I rarely found it useful and never saw it as anything close to a necessity.


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

Interesting points of view from both sides. I sold my HT and soon picking up my new bike and I'm thinking this is definitely my next purchase. It might not be a "necessity" but if it helps my ridding I'm all for it. I'm an avg. tall skinny dude and I never lowered my saddled on my 26'' but I did run into issues w/my shorts catching on the saddle occasionally, plust the ability to maneuver your bike better and just by reading how important it seems to be. Since I'm buying my bike, my budget is on the low end (I went a bit over budget on the bike) but since they are setting up my bike, I want to see if they can just install it from the get go. 

I'll probably get sh*t for this but I'm going with the KS Eten remote model - I did a LOT of research last night and 90% of the users seemed to be ok with it. I'm looking forward to it though.


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## Thustlewhumber (Nov 25, 2011)

The Eten is good, my wife has one on her bike. She is 5'6" though, so keep in mind that if you are taller you will probably want more of a drop. I am 6' and have 125mm, for reference.


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## Mudguard (Apr 14, 2009)

SDMTB'er said:


> Google it.


Ah who knew! This sounds like the change of technique I used going from a hardtail to full suspension. On flat pedals though. Rocking forward then back used the rebound to lift the bike, and as a consequence the front would come up first. I tend to only do that now for slow speed bunny hopping up curbs. If on the trail at speed then it's both up at the same time. Hopefully.


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## Jeffsky (Jan 12, 2016)

Harold said:


> "I don't have to worry about the saddle bouncing up and hitting me in the nuts or in the gut".


If the above statement from Harold's post is the only benefit I experience from a dropper post - I want one immediately!


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## jcd46 (Jul 25, 2012)

Thustlewhumber said:


> The Eten is good, my wife has one on her bike. She is 5'6" though, so keep in mind that if you are taller you will probably want more of a drop. I am 6' and have 125mm, for reference.


Thanks! Yeah I'm about 1/2 inch short of your height, so I was wondering the 100mm would be enough. Bike is getting ready now, once I have it in hand I'll measure and see how that goes. Nice to hear it works though.


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## banditpowdercoat (Aug 13, 2015)

FWIW just got my first dropper today and even on the smoothish trails around town. Omg I love it! See I only got 6 mos mtb under my belt and just installing the dropper has given me the confidence to hit the trail faster. When're I would slow down Bc my seat was high I just dropped it and didn't loose any speed. Then flip back up onto the pedal section. 

Yup. May not be for everyone but I already think it was $300 well spent. 


Sent from my iPhone while my Heli plays with the gophers


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

On Friday I found myself thinking for the first time 'I would really like a dropper post right now!'. 

Typically we ride on trails were I find it possible to put the seat at a hight were I can still pedal but also get behind the bike easily enough for drops. On Friday we went to try a walkers path/route in a glen near Loch Lomond. Some of the drops were worse than anything I've met before, just eroded hillside paths that are not designed to be cycled down, and I had no choice but to drop my saddle to even think about going down them. Even at that there were several I walked down. 

So I don't really agree that they're needed for everything, I'd rather save the weight most of the time, but if I keep finding trails like Friday's I can see a dropper on the Christmas list.


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

The only time you need your post up high is when you climb. Usually people don't stop and adjust post before and after the climb so they leave the post up. As the matter of fact on the super steep climb we could use half an inch to an inch more saddle height for better leverage due to the angle of the bike. 

Adjustable posts can shorten and/or bypass years of practice with conventional high saddle position, usually lower saddle puts your weight at the lowest position on the bike, the pedals, not on the highest, saddle. The riders automatically gain more traction and control, not to mention tons of confidence and movement. 

There are some guys I ride with who still get so OCD about there saddle height not being precisely where there should be and BMW(b!tch,moan,whine) throughout the ride, one even said he wishes that he could superglue the seat post. Hmmm!


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

mimi1885 said:


> The only time you need your post up high is when you climb.


¿

The only time I don't want my post high is when I'm descending something gnarly or on particularly technical terrain. For actual pedaling my knees prefer to have the saddle at the correct height for that purpose.


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

J.B. Weld said:


> ¿
> 
> The only time I don't want my post high is when I'm descending something gnarly or on particularly technical terrain. For actual pedaling my knees prefer to have the saddle at the correct height for that purpose.


Absolutely agree with this. I found that the correct height for normal cruising to be about an inch below climbing height, both my knees and my butt thanks me for it

We have to compromise with fix post but there's no compromise with adj post when it comes to ride height.


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## RWhiz (Jun 10, 2013)

I had a good get off last year when I was on a new to me trail and the 8 mile climb turned quickly into a punchy, short decent. I quickly tried to get my butt behind the seat, but it caught me and I went OTBs. 

Could I have seen the decent and stopped to lower my seat?
Yes,
Did I?
No I was trying to flow with the trail and thought I could get behind the seat fast enough. 
My wife got me a dropper after that. I adjust my seat height about 6 times during my typical 12 mile ride, so it isn't a necessity, but really helps the flow of the trail. Also after a good climb, staying on the pedals into the decent with a quick push of a button adds to the fun factor of my ride. Which is why I'm doing this after all!


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

RWhiz said:


> No I was trying to flow with the trail and thought I could get behind the seat fast enough.
> My wife got me a dropper after that. I adjust my seat height about 6 times during my typical 12 mile ride, so it isn't a necessity, but really helps the flow of the trail. Also after a good climb, staying on the pedals into the decent with a quick push of a button adds to the fun factor of my ride. Which is why I'm doing this after all!


I use it like I was charged by the hour. Usually, 25-40 times on typical ride now more on the flowy trails I'd double that in 2 hour ride.


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## Mr Pig (Jun 25, 2008)

RWhiz said:


> I was on a new to me trail and the 8 mile climb turned quickly into a punchy, short decent. I quickly tried to get my butt behind the seat, but it caught me and I went OTBs.


Not actually crashed but that has happened to me a few times. My trousers hook on the nose of the seat and I end up going down the slope a lot further forward on the bike than I would like. In fact it happened on Friday but I really did not fancy going down this rocky slope hanging off the front of the bike...so I just pulled backwards hard enough that my trousers came down! Managed to stop after that section and pull my trousers back up without anyone noticing ;0)

Dropper-trousers! Maybe that's what we need :0)


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## jp08865 (Aug 12, 2014)

mimi1885 said:


> I use it like I was charged by the hour. Usually, 25-40 times on typical ride now more on the flowy trails I'd double that in 2 hour ride.


Agreed, the more you get use to it, the more you will learn to use it. 
Probably more so for someone that stays seated than someone that stands more. I refer to myself as a 'lazy' rider, being in the saddle more often than not. With a dropper I find myself positioning the saddle where I'm sort of floating on top of it where I can use it to shift the bike around beneath me for cornering. I find seating height makes a big difference in power delivered to the pedals and can often eliminate a shift by being at a given seat height.

On another note, the other day I discovered how much of a 'crutch' (mentally) it can really be. The cable pulled out of the lever while in the full up position, making me realize it's value even more. Although I rode for years with a stationary post in the full up position, I cringed at not having the dropper. I didn't ride the sections where I'd need it most, went home and installed a new cable instantly  / . Crutch ? Maybe so, but one that I'll use when I have a choice.


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## mattyice (Dec 31, 2015)

I say ride like a man, full manual with your nuts aimed right at the back of your seatpost. It's incentive to not mess up that drop or roller, as you will certainly be unable to father children if you wreck. Do or do not.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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