# Commencal Power vs YT Decoy vs Specialized Levo



## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

After posting a few weeks ago about finding a bike under $4K I've realized that I will hardly ever touch a normal MTB again after pulling the trigger on an E-mtb. I'm better off selling my current mtb and using those funds to get a better E-mtb. Our local bike park allows them on the lifts so I don't see the point of keeping a normal bike in the stable right now.

Trying to decide between the Meta Power 29 Essential, YT Pro Decoy 29, YT Decoy Comp, or the Specialized Levo or Levo Comp. A lot of choices I know. Been riding a Pivot Switchblade with the fork extended to 160. Would like something that descends at least as plush as that bike if not more. Most rides I do are long boring fire roads to chunky, sandy, Socal descents.

Couple things I'm wondering:
1) Obviously the YT and Commencal seem like better value for the overall spec. The Specialized is only on this list because the reviews of this bike are hands down the best for an Emtb. Also, if I'm willing to spend $6K the Levo Comp 700 wh battery sounds pretty awesome.

2) Wondering if the YT carbon frame is better than going with these other aluminum options? 

3) The reviews of the YT All Mtn are that it pretty much wants to be pointed one direction: downhill. Sounds like fun, but I do occasionally enjoy a technical climb. In this respect the YT Trail sounds like a better bike. I'm wondering if the same could be said for the Commencal, that it rips downhill, but not so much going up.

If anyone has experience with these bikes would love to hear about it. I've never owned an "Enduro" bike, so not sure if the 170 fork/160 shock suits me. 

Any Specialized owners want to chime in? Is this bike all that and a bag of chips? Does the slightly smaller travel feel like it holds you back? Can you extend the fork to 160 on this bike?

Thanks!


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## rmanalan (Aug 19, 2017)

I have a decoy 29 pro and I can say that it rips as well going up as it does going down. The longer chainstays keep that front wheel planted on the steeps. I love my decoy. Highly recommended.

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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

That's the all MTN bike right?


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## rmanalan (Aug 19, 2017)

Yup.

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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

I have a 180 mm front and rear with 64 degree head angle haibike.

It obviously rocks on the down but it also climbs really well.

With an ebike you don't need to worry about the uphill, you'll crush anything technical or not.

Get it for the down, and you'll be really happy on the up.

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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

rod9301 said:


> I have a 180 mm front and rear with 64 degree head angle haibike.
> 
> It obviously rocks on the down but it also climbs really well.
> 
> ...


Which haibike do you have?


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## nilswalk (Nov 26, 2014)

I love my Levo but it's not made to be a monster truck plush chunky descent-eating machine. I'd look elsewhere. The Commencal looks like the ticket to me.


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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

nilswalk said:


> I love my Levo but it's not made to be a monster truck plush chunky descent-eating machine. I'd look elsewhere. The Commencal looks like the ticket to me.


Which battery do you have on your Levi the 500 or 700 wh?


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## nilswalk (Nov 26, 2014)

eman555 said:


> Which battery do you have on your Levi the 500 or 700 wh?


I have both. The 500 stays in it for most days and the bigger one only if I know I'm going to need it.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

eman555 said:


> Which haibike do you have?


Nduro 10.0

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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

nilswalk said:


> I have both. The 500 stays in it for most days and the bigger one only if I know I'm going to need it.


What kind of ride requires the 700? How many hours or miles are we talking?


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## nilswalk (Nov 26, 2014)

eman555 said:


> What kind of ride requires the 700? How many hours or miles are we talking?


Probably 3+ hrs, more than 2500 ft of climbing.


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## rwdbkr (Jan 24, 2008)

eman555 said:


> What kind of ride requires the 700? How many hours or miles are we talking?


2020 Levo. Last ride w/ 700 battery was 33 mi, 5600 ft, 3 hrs moving time. Think there was 7% battery left

.


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## K. Trout (Jan 18, 2020)

I've had my 2019 Levo for just over a month, and my longest ride has been 30/5900 with less than 10% battery left. But I have friends that have 2 700's for the really big days!


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Waiting for Shimano to unveil their rumored next gen motor(s) next month. Heard they're offering a lightweight compact XTR that's ~2kg and a more powerful update to their 3kg motor (48V, 85Nm?)

Commencal and Privateer have ebike announcements this summer too, that I'm anticipating. 

So far the Forestal Siryon is the only emtb that's been announced that interests me as an upgrade over my current emtb. 

Current offerings are all kind of meh to me, at least in size med. Kona Remote 160 looks close. Alutech has a good looking one that makes me consider going direct with their factory (looks like Genio). Most options seem like they're made for taller people.

----

Biggest turn-offs are:

- Long CS instead of steeper STA to cope with steeper climbs. I'm biased because I ride with a mid-foot over pedal axle stance, which makes the STA like 5 degrees slacker (60mm more rearward saddle in relation to pedals). In other words, the STA could be 5 degrees steeper (than 74 degrees, esp for longer travel bikes)... don't like how long CS bikes ride in tech, and how easily the rear wheel spins when climbing tech out of the saddle. Steeper STA achieves similar in-saddle climbing comfort, keeping the front down, but with more bearable downsides (higher saddle to grip height diff, which can put more pressure on hand on flatter terrain).

- Long seat tubes with limited insertion. I want the saddle to be able to be slammed close enough that the saddle can be buzzed by the rear wheel on full travel. That means a 380mm seat tube in med without any kinks, welds, pivot, nor conservatively placed internal routing port limiting insertion.

- Low stack and aggro race position. I want a taller stack for more upright position. I'm not racing. I want to adventure in comfort, able to look further in front of the wheel without needing to bend my neck back. Solves the steep STA downside too, and makes the front end less flexy if you're running spacers under stem anyways.

- Weight weenie components. I want beefier components that are lower maintenance. I don't want this compromised for the sake of lower weight, and definitely don't want to pay extra like for pricey drivetrain stuff. With motor assistance, I don't mind a 10 speed if it's costs half as much per mile. That Fox 38 looks good. What happened to that new 1.8 tapered steerer standard?

- Crappy brakes and tires. I want stronger brakes (e.g. Guide RE, Code or Magura MT5/7) and less pinch-prone rear tire (Eddy Current).

I like that Canyon ebike saddle tail idea for climbing, but I'd need a saddle that spreads weight out better to cope with the more upright position. 

I wonder if Ibis and Yeti will get into the game with the new Shimano motor generation. Niner is due to release a WFO 9e too. Not expecting much from these 3, though. Just figure it's about time for US brands of their size to jump in.


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## TraxFactory (Sep 10, 1999)

The Levo has much more torque than the current Shimano and is more of a fun trail bike.

If you use turbo too much you may be going through motors more often than you think. Personally went through 4 in 12 months on 2019 Levo Expert.

Super fun bike and the power delivery is nice, just not confidence inspiring for long treks.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

Varaxis said:


> So far the Forestal Siryon is the only emtb that's been announced that interests me as an upgrade over my current emtb.
> 
> I wonder if Ibis and Yeti will get into the game with the new Shimano motor generation. Niner is due to release a WFO 9e too. Not expecting much from these 3, though. Just figure it's about time for US brands of their size to jump in.


That Siryon is some serious work! For some reason, it looks like most EBike geometry is larger than the non-powered brethren. My Yeti Medium (Yeti known for longish TT) has stack & reach number smaller than most small size ebikes. Have you noticed that?


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## Jack7782 (Jan 1, 2009)

Varaxis said:


> Waiting for Shimano to unveil their rumored next gen motor(s) next month. Heard they're offering a lightweight compact XTR that's ~2kg and a more powerful update to their 3kg motor (48V, 85Nm?)
> 
> Commencal and Privateer have ebike announcements this summer too, that I'm anticipating.
> 
> ...


Varaxis - great comments, sounds like you are in the industry. I have the short seat tube problem on my Haibike. One question in regard to mid-foot. Are you running "extra large platform pedals" to do that?


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

I have ridden both the Leo and the Pivot which has the Shimano 8000. Since I have little use of the Turbo/Boost setting, I could not tell if one had more max torque or not. The Pivot feels much more like a regular trail bike while the Levo feels long and more DH focused. On open trails or also with fast bomber downhills, the Levo is more stable. For tighter twister trails, the Pivot is quicker and more fun. I still need to ride the Levo SL. I really like the idea of that bike, especially if it gains more range soon.


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## eman555 (May 31, 2016)

Flyer said:


> I have ridden both the Leo and the Pivot which has the Shimano 8000. Since I have little use of the Turbo/Boost setting, I could not tell if one had more max torque or not. The Pivot feels much more like a regular trail bike while the Levo feels long and more DH focused. On open trails or also with fast bomber downhills, the Levo is more stable. For tighter twister trails, the Pivot is quicker and more fun. I still need to ride the Levo SL. I really like the idea of that bike, especially if it gains more range soon.


I wish Pivot had a less expensive emtb option, I think the Shuttle would feel similar to my Switchblade. Still the Levo sounds like fun. I need to demo one.


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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

I've been studying which emtb to get and I've narrowed it down to the Commencal Meta Power 29 Essential, the YT duck 29, RM Instinct Powerplsy BC Edition or RM Altitude PP and a couple of others if these aren't available.

Honestly I have not ridden the YT, Meta, or Instinct PP BC but the Altitude PP I really liked except for the seat but thats easily fixed. 

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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

I rode the Pivot Shuttle and it was pretty nice but it had 2.8 tires and I hate that size tire but other than that it was nice. They told me it was a Mach 5.5 with a motor basically. 

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## Shamis (Apr 12, 2015)

I'm seriously leaning towards the YT Elite Mullet Machine. This would be my sore legs, buddy calls me up to ride right now machine. I normally ride a Transition Sentinel. Thinking these would be complimentary bikes.

But waiting till Fall to get one bums me out a little. 

Wife is onboard because it will piss off her Brother, one of my ebike hating ride buddies :lol:


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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

Shamis said:


> I'm seriously leaning towards the YT Elite Mullet Machine. This would be my sore legs, buddy calls me up to ride right now machine. I normally ride a Transition Sentinel. Thinking these would be complimentary bikes.
> 
> But waiting till Fall to get one bums me out a little.
> 
> Wife is onboard because it will piss off her Brother, one of my ebike hating ride buddies


I'm digging both the 29 and the enduro mullet machine. I wish I could get a ride on these bikes to help me make up my mind.

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## ziscwg (May 18, 2007)

nilswalk said:


> Probably 3+ hrs, more than 2500 ft of climbing.


interesting......I can get 4000-5000 ft of climbing on my 540 wh Decoy. Sure, it's eco and some trail mode, but I get a good ride in.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

ziscwg said:


> interesting......I can get 4000-5000 ft of climbing on my 540 wh Decoy. Sure, it's eco and some trail mode, but I get a good ride in.


yeah, similar with my Shuttle. I can get around 35 miles and 4500 feet and still have a little left...mostly Eco and Trail. I can prob stretch it to 40-45 and 5500 feet if I watch it carefully. I do have an extra battery that I will try to carry soon and go on a really long ride (for me) maybe 60+ and 8000 ft. I'll wait till the Fall actually. I like that 45-65 temperature range in the mountains.


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