# 1062g 29" XC race wheels



## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

My new XC racing wheels are done. Hopefully they will work well for my 80kg weight.


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## Livewire88 (Jun 15, 2013)

Very nice, how much did they set you back if you don't mind me asking??


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## chunkylover53 (Apr 5, 2007)

Wow. Crazy light. Spokes?


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

Nice and light as usual Ole, now we need some details like in your 27.5 sub kilo!!


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Are those Pillar PST X-TRA or X-TRA-LITE spokes?


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## RS VR6 (Mar 29, 2007)

Wow...insane weight. They are lighter than most road tubulars!


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## jeffw-13 (Apr 30, 2008)

Here they are - $2550 in the US

CarboCamber 29


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

Wow, nice! I didn't see a weight limit on the site, but I assume there must be?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

not sure how much faith id have in a 1000g wheelset when hitting the gnar


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## trmn8er (Jun 9, 2011)

phlegm said:


> Wow, nice! I didn't see a weight limit on the site, but I assume there must be?


I sent them email asking this question as well as warranty if any. Pretty amazing weight.


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## TBarnaby (Aug 1, 2008)

phlegm said:


> Wow, nice! I didn't see a weight limit on the site, but I assume there must be?


The other 29 carbon wheel they sell has a 220lb limit, so I'd guess less than that.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

obs08 said:


> not sure how much faith id have in a 1000g wheelset when hitting the gnar


Not to mention radial lacing on the front.. If you weigh 135lbs, maybe... In my junior days when I was 160ish I laced up a radial front and the thing was a wet noodle. With beefier modern forks I can't imagine how that thing handles..


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

I have used standard 28h CarboCamber rims. Factory standard CarboCamber wheels weigh 1160g, and are surprisingly stiff and strong. A 90kg friend did Andialucia Bike Race (5 days stage race) on his set, and they survived no problem. We're talking 5 days in the worst rockfield you can imagine.

What is different with my wheels is 28h front and rear. Standard is 28h front and 32h rear.

I use a mix of Pillar Megalite SS steel spokes and Pillar X-Tra Lite Ti titanium spokes. Standard is Megalite SS all around.

Internal Hex nipples are a tiny bit heavier than upside-down nipples. 

I have equipped the hubs with stainless ceramic hybrid bearings. In the rear, I have used the same delrin spacer found in the front disc side, on both rear bearings. To ensure long life, the rear right side bearing, and left side freehub bearing, are Boca Bearing Yellow Seal stainless hybrid ceramic. They are heavier than standard bearings, but last a very long time.


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## VICpt (Aug 10, 2012)

Hi, how are the wheels on the trails? 
Anyway, good luck, i think you will need some! They are very nice and good looking.

Regards


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

I have only done one proper ride, on a steep climb and equally steep downhill right outside Oslo, Norway. Sadly, the snow makes it hard to judge ultimate wheel stiffness, but I never felt any flex, be it during hard braking, cornering or sliding. I am hopeful.


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## simenf (Nov 10, 2008)

Nice, Ole. 


Simenf

Brainwashed by the big wheel mafia


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## scant (Jan 5, 2004)

Ole, how are the hubs holding up?


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

I'm wondering how did you get that HyperRear to that weight, it's almost 20 gr lighter than mine!


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## Livewire88 (Jun 15, 2013)

Maybe a difference in freehub weight?


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

Like I wrote, I use smaller main bearings than what is standard. I use the delrin reducer that is found in the front left side, so I can use smaller bearings. The XD driver also saves some weight, as well as 28h vs 32h, two less spoke knobs.


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

I have used this type hub since they first came out several years ago, and have had no real problems.


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

I guess the main difference comes from the driver, mine is 28 h also.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Really great wheelset! I've got 2 questions for you Ole.

1st, where did you buy your spokes? I'm thinking about building a wheelset with straight pull Mega lite SS spokes but would like to know where to get them.

2nd, what did you do to align the straight pull bladed spokes properly so that they are going the same way as the wheel? (Instead of getting a paddle boat)

Thanks!


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

lRaphl said:


> Really great wheelset! I've got 2 questions for you Ole.
> 
> 1st, where did you buy your spokes? I'm thinking about building a wheelset with straight pull Mega lite SS spokes but would like to know where to get them.
> 
> ...


Pillar Mega Lite SS Spoke
https://fairwheelbikes.com/pillar-mega-lite-ss-spoke-p-5352.html

Sapim Bladed Spoke Holder
https://fairwheelbikes.com/sapim-bladed-spoke-holder-p-4540.html


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Those spokes are J-Bend and the spoke holder helps to maintain the spoke when you turn the nipple but doesn't help you to make sure the blade of the spoke is aligned properly with the rim/wheel.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

lRaphl said:


> Those spokes are J-Bend and the spoke holder helps to maintain the spoke when you turn the nipple but doesn't help you to make sure the blade of the spoke is aligned properly with the rim/wheel.


They used to sell straight pull ones too. Give them a call.

As far as I know, there isn't a tool to align bladed spokes with the rim/wheel. You do it by sight.


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

lRaphl said:


> Really great wheelset! I've got 2 questions for you Ole.
> 
> 1st, where did you buy your spokes? I'm thinking about building a wheelset with straight pull Mega lite SS spokes but would like to know where to get them.
> 
> ...


I buy them directly from Pillars trading company Top Venturer. Pillar spoke/nipple Trader|Top Venturer International Limited They can sell you quite small quantities.

I rotate the spokes with a small, slotted piece of metal. I also use loctite on the spokes heads, to keep them from twisting later on.


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## xcbarny (Jun 10, 2009)

Back2MTB said:


> Not to mention radial lacing on the front.. If you weigh 135lbs, maybe... In my junior days when I was 160ish I laced up a radial front and the thing was a wet noodle. With beefier modern forks I can't imagine how that thing handles..


This makes no sense, radial lacing is actually stiffer, since they're shorter - less material to flex. On a front disc wheel they also allow you to even up the difference in spoke tension between the disc and non disc side.

Most road wheels use radially laced spokes on the front wheel, and non drive side rear. The only reason you rarely see them on MTBs is because they don't transfer the axial torque generated by disc brakes, so in this case only half the spokes on the front wheel can transfer this load to the rim.

However, this isn't a problem. I've been building my front wheels this way for the last 5 years with zero issues.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

xcbarny said:


> This makes no sense, radial lacing is actually stiffer, since they're shorter - less material to flex. On a front disc wheel they also allow you to even up the difference in spoke tension between the disc and non disc side.
> 
> Most road wheels use radially laced spokes on the front wheel, and non drive side rear. The only reason you rarely see them on MTBs is because they don't transfer the axial torque generated by disc brakes, so in this case only half the spokes on the front wheel can transfer this load to the rim.
> 
> However, this isn't a problem. I've been building my front wheels this way for the last 5 years with zero issues.


Radial lacing is stiffer when cornering on a front wheel with disc brakes on a mountain bike? I am stunned if that is true. Certainly didn't feel that way the one and only time I attempted it.


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## xcbarny (Jun 10, 2009)

sfer1 said:


> They used to sell straight pull ones too. Give them a call.
> 
> As far as I know, there isn't a tool to align bladed spokes with the rim/wheel. You do it by sight.


I use one of these:


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Hey Ole, would you feel confident of using the Extralite hubs on an everyday wheelset?


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

lRaphl said:


> Hey Ole, would you feel confident of using the Extralite hubs on an everyday wheelset?


Depends a lot on the conditions. I prefer to think of them as race only hubs, but I do put in quite a few rides on them throughout the year. If you use them a lot, you should change the freehub once a year, and pull the freehub off once in a while to wipe clean and re-lube. It's a 5 minute job.


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## litany (Nov 25, 2009)

lRaphl said:


> Hey Ole, would you feel confident of using the Extralite hubs on an everyday wheelset?


I have a hyperfront on my everyday wheelset (LB rims, Sapim cx-ray spokes, 240s rear) and it is fine. My friend is running the same setup and he is 170. We have ridden Moab, Tahoe, everything. It's a great hub.

I have no experience with the hyperrear though. I only didn't choose it because according to extralite due to the mechanism you have to do more maintenance and replace the freehub body more often. Durability though I would have no worries. According to them the freehub mechanism is designed to last 1-2 seasons.


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

I've now done the first proper off road ride that's not on snow, and the wheels deliver! I feared they would be as flexy as my 26" 954g wheels from a few years back, but they are not, they are plenty stiff for agressive riding. I found that I could ride "heavy" like I do on my Tracer T275, i.e. I didn't have to tip-toe at the bottom of steep chutes or take it easy in the curves, I could just ride it hard. Very happy! Now for some engine tuning.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

You're lucky to be able to trail ride it already! Here there is still a lot of snow in the wood...if I'm lucky I should be able to hit the trails in 2 or 3 weeks! This is the joy of living up north (Abitibi / Quebec / Canada)!


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

lRaphl said:


> You're lucky to be able to trail ride it already! Here there is still a lot of snow in the wood...if I'm lucky I should be able to hit the trails in 2 or 3 weeks! This is the joy of living up north (Abitibi / Quebec / Canada)!


I hear you man. Also, it will be black fly season soon enough too.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Hahaha yes! I'll try to hang on to my bike so they don't take me up in the air.


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

lRaphl said:


> Hey Ole, would you feel confident of using the Extralite hubs on an everyday wheelset?


A little late and not Ole, but&#8230; I've been using the Extralite hubs on a daily basis since August, I must say my wheelset is not as light as Ole's and it's 27.5, also weather is very bike friendly here in Mex, but they are holding up with minimal maintenance, anyway, I already have an extra freehub (just in case).


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

I have to admit, I'm amazed that these wheelsets are holding up. Believe me - as a full-on WW I want them to, but I suspected they'd taco pretty easily, or at least some other hub symptoms.

Only other full set that I've been afraid of are these from MCFK. 1190g for 650b! (Although price is an astonishing 2200 Euro!)
Mcfk - Wheelset


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

phlegm said:


> I have to admit, I'm amazed that these wheelsets are holding up. Believe me - as a full-on WW I want them to, but I suspected they'd taco pretty easily, or at least some other hub symptoms.


Most carbon rims don't taco, they break, luckily I haven't had any of those events (yet)


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

Good point - I should stop using generic failure terms like "taco" as it wouldn't apply to carbon. Maybe "splinter" makes more sense. Either way, I'm impressed with the durabilty at that weight.


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

Ole said:


> I use a mix of Pillar Megalite SS steel spokes and Pillar X-Tra Lite Ti titanium spokes. Standard is Megalite SS all around.
> View attachment 960928


Can you please tell me how many spokes are on top on this scale and if they are all Megalite SS or X-Tra Lite Ti? or is mixed?
I'm basically trying to estimate the weight of a future wheel build for me, so far I have the Extralite lefty front hub 24 Holes and it will be a 29er.

Thanks


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

You've made an old-ish post andrepsz, but I agree, this wheel build is amazing. You can spend a lot for a ~1400g 29er build. To be close to a kilo? Crazy.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

I'm pretty sure it's mixed. Here is what it looks like with 56 Megalite SS spokes:


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Have you weighed your HyperLefty hub yet? I just built a wheel with a 28h hub. Advertised at 84g. I'll be damned if it wasn't 79g when I got it home and weighed it. Damn manufacturers reporting incorrect information! (=


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

lRaphl said:


> I'm pretty sure it's mixed. Here is what it looks like with 56 Megalite SS spokes:


Awesome thanks! that's for a 29er right?


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

BlownCivic said:


> Have you weighed your HyperLefty hub yet? I just built a wheel with a 28h hub. Advertised at 84g. I'll be damned if it wasn't 79g when I got it home and weighed it. Damn manufacturers reporting incorrect information! (=


81.9g mine, but its 24h. I'm kinda freaking out a little that is 24h, wondering if putting a carbon rim, the stiff enduro kind would cover up the lack of spokes? I'm not a Enduro rider....just XC no jumps guys...but I'm still wondering if 24h on the front is too little.


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

phlegm said:


> You've made an old-ish post andrepsz, but I agree, this wheel build is amazing. You can spend a lot for a ~1400g 29er build. To be close to a kilo? Crazy.


That is a great Wheelset! inspiring me to focus on that: here are my calculations:

Front Lefty	
Hub:	Extralite Hyperlefty(81.9g) tuned with Full ceramic bearings (7.6g less):74.3g
Rim carbon 29er (china):350g
Spokes: 24x Pillar X-Tra Lite Ti: 69.6g
Nipples: standard: 6.43g

Rear 
Hub: Extralite Extralite hyper1 QR 10mm 32h(168g) Maybe full ceramic later
Rim carbon 26er (China): 330g
Spokes: 32x Pillar X-Tra Lite Ti: 76.16g
Nipples: standard: 8.57g

TOTAL: 1083.06g

Sorry...not going to hijack this thread...will post updates on my stuff...on my threads.


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## Seb K (Apr 21, 2009)

Put it this way . They wouldn't make a 24h hub if they didn't think it could hold up even to XC which is the least 'heavy' style of MTB racing . The hub is fine dude . A carbon rim will help to reduce buckling big time so best to go for that .


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Yes, it's for a 29er wheelset I'm currently building.


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

karimian5 said:


> Put it this way . They wouldn't make a 24h hub if they didn't think it could hold up even to XC which is the least 'heavy' style of MTB racing . The hub is fine dude . A carbon rim will help to reduce buckling big time so best to go for that .


I agree...Yey !!! 4 spokes less to save some more weight!


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

The middle pile is Megalite SS, the top and bottom is X-Tra Lite Ti. I used the 2x stiffer Megalite SS on the side with high tension, and Ti on the other. Building with all Ti would make a flexy and unstable wheel compared to my setup. Differences in spoke tension should be matched with similar difference in spoke stiffness.


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

Ole said:


> The middle pile is Megalite SS, the top and bottom is X-Tra Lite Ti. I used the 2x stiffer Megalite SS on the side with high tension, and Ti on the other. Building with all Ti would make a flexy and unstable wheel compared to my setup. Differences in spoke tension should be matched with similar difference in spoke stiffness.


Thanks for revealing the secret! Very cool! So I checked on eBay pricing for those spokes...and Holly smokes!!!! 231306990008
231303050981


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

Yes, they cost a freaking lot. Costed me roughly 500$ CAD for my 64 Megalite SS spokes


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Have a look at the Sapim SuperSpokes. I built my wheel with these, and 14 x 244mm + 14 x 260mm = 97g without nipples. They're about 2.95 euro each (3.50 euro with VAT) plus shipping from R2 Bike.

My front wheel with a 375g carbon rim came out to 570g with the Extralite hub, above mentioned spokes, Stan's rim tape and valve.


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## andrepsz (Jan 28, 2013)

Or going China mode? http://m.alibaba.com/product/60275904738/pillar-titanium-spokes.html


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## diskox (Apr 19, 2014)

or alpina hyper


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

lRaphl said:


> Yes, they cost a freaking lot. Costed me roughly 500$ CAD for my 64 Megalite SS spokes


_A brief dramatization about the perils of being a Weight Weenie, brought to you by Phlegm:_

Me - "Hi honey, I'm home!"

Wife - "Hi!"

Me - "Remember that lakefront property we looked at?"

Wife - "Yes, of course."

Me - "Well, forget about it. I bought some spokes instead, and I can't wait to get them laced up!"

[Divorce]

_End of dramatization._


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

sfer1 said:


> They used to sell straight pull ones too. Give them a call.
> 
> As far as I know, there isn't a tool to align bladed spokes with the rim/wheel. You do it by sight.


A small piece of wood. Take a saw with a thin blade to it, cut about 1/4" into the wood.

Done. Spoke holder.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

This is why I'm not maried! I'm just getting kicked out of home if she ever knows it!


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## jmcdev1 (Jan 1, 2011)

So, Ole, would love to hear how your wheelset held up through the last year of riding. Could you give us an update? Any durability problems? Roughly how many times did you ride them? Thanks, Jeff


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

Apart from a rim failure during training early in the spring (slow leak, high speed landing in rocks, kaboom!) the wheels have held up beautifully. I've decided to go for Racing Ralph 2.35 this year, because the races are getting more and more technical. Still keeping the 120mm FS bike at around 9.5kg, so can't complain.


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

Ole said:


> Apart from a rim failure during training early in the spring (slow leak, high speed landing in rocks, kaboom!) the wheels have held up beautifully. ...


Believe me, I think this wheelset is amazing, and I'm the biggest WW here, but saying "they were great aside from a rim failure" is kind of a big thing.

It would be like saying, "yep, this new engine is great, except for the stalling".

Do you think the failure was truly conditions and circumstances-based, or perhaps were you on the bleeding edge of weight? I'm honestly curious, because we all know there is always a limit.


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

I have been neverous ever since, but have not had a single problem. When it happened I had already stopped once to inflate my overly soft rear tire, so I had a leak for sure. Half an hour later I launched off a rocky ledge, impacted the rim hard on the ledge, and the hard landing 2ft lower down finished it off. Landed on my rear cassette.

All the races and trail rides the rest of the year went without a hithc. I have 15+ wheelsets under my customers with stock (albeit re-tensioned by me) CarboCamber wheels using the same rims , and apart from a few cracked rims due to rock strikes, no problems. Including one 210lb guy doing the Andalucia Bike Race.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

How is the rear hub wearing after a full year?


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

lRaphl said:


> How is the rear hub wearing after a full year?


No problems. Have overhauled a few times, but not replaced anything. I am planning to replace the freehub before spring, just to be sure.


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## lRaphl (May 26, 2007)

I'm glad to hear that everything is holding up fine!


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## phlegm (Jul 13, 2006)

Ole said:


> I have been neverous ever since, but have not had a single problem. When it happened I had already stopped once to inflate my overly soft rear tire, so I had a leak for sure. Half an hour later I launched off a rocky ledge, impacted the rim hard on the ledge, and the hard landing 2ft lower down finished it off. Landed on my rear cassette.
> 
> All the races and trail rides the rest of the year went without a hithc. I have 15+ wheelsets under my customers with stock (albeit re-tensioned by me) CarboCamber wheels using the same rims , and apart from a few cracked rims due to rock strikes, no problems. Including one 210lb guy doing the Andalucia Bike Race.


Cheers, thx for confirming.


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## jmcdev1 (Jan 1, 2011)

That's amazing, Ole. May I ask what size rear wheel you were running at time of failure? I am seriously considering this wheelset. Hoping that since I am running 2.35 tires it might give me an extra safety cushion. I do run very low tire pressures but not low enough to get rim strikes commonly. Thanks, Jeff


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## Ole (Feb 22, 2004)

jmcdev1 said:


> That's amazing, Ole. May I ask what size rear wheel you were running at time of failure? I am seriously considering this wheelset. Hoping that since I am running 2.35 tires it might give me an extra safety cushion. I do run very low tire pressures but not low enough to get rim strikes commonly. Thanks, Jeff


I was running Rocket Ron 2.25, but because of the slow leak I most likely had a stupid low pressure.

I weigh 80kg, and run 22-25psi in the rear, depending on conditions.

Ole.


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

lRaphl said:


> How is the rear hub wearing after a full year?


On a similar build, but 27.5, in 18 months I've changed the body once (star ratchet wear) and the outer bearing twice.


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## poynt (Jan 15, 2004)

Ole, were the X-tra lite Ti spokes pretty accurate for weight, ie well south of 3gms, as it seems manufactures claims on some of these light spokes are way off these days. If not then I may stick to the Mega Lites. I am planning on getting some for a non disc xc build and wondered if you thought they were OK to say lace radially on a 28h front wheel and 2x/3x rear using Tune hubs, Stans rims. I am only 55kg.


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