# Dropper seatposts--beginner's perspective



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

I recently experienced my first endo, complete with face plant and started a thread on this subject HERE. Lots of super advice on what happened and how to avoid/escape there. Eventually the subject of getting a dropper seatpost came up and while it isn't the magic bullet--that's technique and practice--it sounds like something I'd like to investigate and probably go with. I do have QR seat post, so I can start manually lowering the seat if I'm doing a long descent. But I ride a lot in the Sandia Foothills here in ABQ, and there's a lot of rolling ups and downs and it would be nice to have something that I could drop and raise quickly.

I've started reading threads here at MTBR, but I'd like to ask for advice here in a new unit of time, so to speak. Seems like a lot of the posts have had various problems, but they seem to be getting better. I did run across some info on the Specialized Command Post Blacklite and it had some appeal in being entirely mechanical and probably bulletproof, but that's about the extent of my knowledge.

Open to suggestions and hearing about others' experience with the various types of droppers.

TIA.


----------



## cycljunkie (Feb 6, 2004)

Porschefan said:


> I recently experienced my first endo, complete with face plant and started a thread on this subject HERE. Lots of super advice on what happened and how to avoid/escape there. Eventually the subject of getting a dropper seatpost came up and while it isn't the magic bullet--that's technique and practice--it sounds like something I'd like to investigate and probably go with. I do have QR seat post, so I can start manually lowering the seat if I'm doing a long descent. But I ride a lot in the Sandia Foothills here in ABQ, and there's a lot of rolling ups and downs and it would be nice to have something that I could drop and raise quickly.
> 
> I've started reading threads here at MTBR, but I'd like to ask for advice here in a new unit of time, so to speak. Seems like a lot of the posts have had various problems, but they seem to be getting better. I did run across some info on the Specialized Command Post Blacklite and it had some appeal in being entirely mechanical and probably bulletproof, but that's about the extent of my knowledge.
> 
> ...


I ended up with a CB Joplin 4r. Found one online at a pretty good price... I read lots of neg. reviews on them but probably read just as many positive ones. I'd bet that for every dropper post out there it's 50/50 re: neg vs pos reviews.

I only have a couple rides on the Joplin so far and this is my first dropper post. Even with only a few rides I can see the benefit of having "on the fly" saddle adjustment. It's so easy to drop the saddle going into a little tech section, then raise it back up right before the short climb that follows.

I really wanted the Command Post Blacklite, but couldn't wait for them to become available... I ride here in AZ where we have lots of short ups and downs and lots of rocks. So far I give my dropper post a BIG :thumbsup:


----------



## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

I bought a used Specialized command post and couldn't be happier. The two things that sold me on it are 1- it's mechanical and 2 it's has 3 set positions. I rode a demo bike with an infinite dropper and hated it. I want to know when I drop it it will be in the exact same spot every time.


----------



## nord1899 (Aug 29, 2011)

Reverb post here. I like the infinite part as it allows me to pick a spot that is very comfortable given the current terrain. I did have a barb failure, replaced within days by my LBS with the newer setup under warranty. Done a few rides since, no issues.

One thing to keep in mind is how much travel you need. I have a 125mm Reverb and honestly a 100mm Reverb would work better, just wasn't available when I got mine. Reason being, 125mm is actually a tad more seat post out of the frame than I need/want. Nor do I like it being dropped 100% down, least not at this point in my skill development (low intermediate). 
One advantage of this though is should the seatpost fail, I can then use the QR collar to move it up to a better location to finish that ride.

Also wish the handlebar button was more like the Kind Shock setup.


----------



## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

I've tried many brands and models and of course all have their pros and cons, I like KS the most.

Infinite travel is awesome but comes at the price of more moving parts and possible maintenance issues. Fixed travel has less issues but you are limit to a few predetermine height.:thumbsup:


----------



## Woozle (Jun 13, 2008)

Whichever post, I prefer the handle bar trigger as opposes to under seat. I a pinch, I don't want to be fishing under the seat for the trigger. With the handle bar trigger, I can lower the seat while in the sh*t.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

nord1899 said:


> Reverb post here. I like the infinite part as it allows me to pick a spot that is very comfortable given the current terrain. I did have a barb failure, replaced within days by my LBS with the newer setup under warranty. Done a few rides since, no issues.
> 
> One thing to keep in mind is how much travel you need. I have a 125mm Reverb and honestly a 100mm Reverb would work better, just wasn't available when I got mine. Reason being, 125mm is actually a tad more seat post out of the frame than I need/want. Nor do I like it being dropped 100% down, least not at this point in my skill development (low intermediate).
> One advantage of this though is should the seatpost fail, I can then use the QR collar to move it up to a better location to finish that ride.
> ...


What is the best way to determine the size. Many of them, including the Blacklight come in multiple sizes. I was figuring on getting 125 mm, but your comment makes me wonder if that's too much.

Also, aren't all the posts "100% down" when you drop them all the way? I might be just missing the point here. I guess a shorter post would mean that the actual distance between your top position and fully down would be less--so the seat would be "higher" in its lowest position.

I measured the amount of post exposed on my bike as it is set up now and it's about 7.5" from the top of the seatpost clamp to the seat rails.


----------



## nord1899 (Aug 29, 2011)

Porschefan said:


> What is the best way to determine the size. Many of them, including the Blacklight come in multiple sizes. I was figuring on getting 125 mm, but your comment makes me wonder if that's too much.
> 
> Also, aren't all the posts "100% down" when you drop them all the way? I might be just missing the point here. I guess a shorter post would mean that the actual distance between your top position and fully down would be less--so the seat would be "higher" in its lowest position.
> 
> I measured the amount of post exposed on my bike as it is set up now and it's about 7.5" from the top of the seatpost clamp to the seat rails.


Hydraulic posts (Reverb, KindShock, etc) are "infinite" in where you can have your seat height be. Mechanical posts (Gravity Dropper, etc) have pre determined locations, either 2 or 3 of them (up, down and maybe a middle).

The two measurements I would make is how much seat post is exposed at your climbing height. And then how much is exposed at your downhill height.
Climbing height will tell you if the dropper post will fit easily, that is if you won't need it slammed down to the frame and/or not use it fully extended. Another way to put it, is will you have any of the non-dropper part exposed. This is also important as there is a min length of the post that must be within the frame.
The difference of the climbing height to downhill height will tell you about how much travel you need. Seems like most droppers start at 100mm with 125mm being very common (thats not quite 5 inches btw). Kind shock has ones with even more travel.

Hope that helps.


----------



## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

Porschefan said:


> What is the best way to determine the size. Many of them, including the Blacklight come in multiple sizes. I was figuring on getting 125 mm, but your comment makes me wonder if that's too much.
> 
> Also, aren't all the posts "100% down" when you drop them all the way? I might be just missing the point here. I guess a shorter post would mean that the actual distance between your top position and fully down would be less--so the seat would be "higher" in its lowest position.
> 
> I measured the amount of post exposed on my bike as it is set up now and it's about 7.5" from the top of the seatpost clamp to the seat rails.


Ok, the amount of travel/drop is easy if you are tall enough for the frame and have no clearance issues. The problem that some riders have would be the fully extended post on a small(er) frame or the frame that has higher seat post mount. I ran into that problem with my Maverick ML8 and KS i950r I needed 15mm more. No issue with the same post on my Mojo.

There's a minimum height you need for the 125mm dropper post usually 7"(180mm)-8"(203mm) KS i950r required about 195mm and about 165mm on their i7r(100mm). In your case you have 7.5" of length expose it may be a tight fit for most 125mm travel post. I'm posting some pics so you can get a better idea.

Ride height wise, the only time you need your post fully extended is a long climb or fire road climb all other times I usually drop 1" and halfway thru rolling single track, full down on the descend. Dropping the saddle height in crease the movement and make it easy to get over the rear without the saddle getting in the way.


































i7r add about 30mm for the clamp


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

Thanks for the replies. I think I'm being a little dense here, so let me run my understanding by you and see if I'm making some wrong assumptions here.

#1 assumption I'm making is that ANY dropper seatpost should and will be fully extended when released. The proper seat height for normal/climbing pedaling will be set by locking the seatpost in the seat tube with the dropper portion fully extended. So you have to make sure that the seat tube on your particular bike is deep enough to slip the post in for the seat to be at the proper height when fully extended, and on smaller bikes the longer seatposts might be too long. But in either case the fully "up" position any post, mechanical or hydraulic is the same--they stop at the top.

# 2 assumption is that on either type of dropper post, the bottom is the bottom--where the adjustable portion hits the collar.

So the 3 positions of the Blacklite, for example, really have the same top and bottom as an infinitely adjustable post of the same length--e.g., 100, or 125mm. The difference is in the middle positions. The Blacklite has a "cruising" position that is 35mm lower than the top. An infinitely adjustable post has an "infinite" number of middle positions
but fully-dropped is fully-dropped.

Mimi, I get that you have a couple (or more) "middle" positions that you like for different conditions.

Specialized makes a point of saying that the 3-position "standard" is a PLUS in that you always know where you are. I can see the point of that, but it's also classical marketing to make a positive out of a negative.

Main thing I want to make sure I'm getting is that the top is the top and the bottom is the bottom on both types.

On the KS models: I was told by KS that the 950 and the new "Supernatural" are virtually identical except for new graphics. Since the 950's are about $80 cheaper there seems to be no point in buying the latest if I decide to go that way?


----------



## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

Porschefan said:


> Thanks for the replies. I think I'm being a little dense here, so let me run my understanding by you and see if I'm making some wrong assumptions here.
> 
> #1 assumption I'm making is that ANY dropper seatpost should and will be fully extended when released. The proper seat height for normal/climbing pedaling will be set by locking the seatpost in the seat tube with the dropper portion fully extended. So you have to make sure that the seat tube on your particular bike is deep enough to slip the post in for the seat to be at the proper height when fully extended, and on smaller bikes the longer seatposts might be too long. But in either case the fully "up" position any post, mechanical or hydraulic is the same--they stop at the top.
> 
> ...


The KS i950 is a 125mm post and the Supernatural is a 150mm travel everything else is the same only travel more. Do you need the 6" dropper post? no, but it's cool:thumbsup:


----------



## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Porschefan said:


> Thanks for the replies. I think I'm being a little dense here, so let me run my understanding by you and see if I'm making some wrong assumptions here.
> 
> #1 assumption I'm making is that ANY dropper seatpost should and will be fully extended when released. The proper seat height for normal/climbing pedaling will be set by locking the seatpost in the seat tube with the dropper portion fully extended. So you have to make sure that the seat tube on your particular bike is deep enough to slip the post in for the seat to be at the proper height when fully extended, and on smaller bikes the longer seatposts might be too long. But in either case the fully "up" position any post, mechanical or hydraulic is the same--they stop at the top.
> 
> ...


That's not just marketing for some people it is better. Only you'll able to say for yourself.

When riding technical terrain or obstacles, I sometimes use the inside of my thighs on the seat. So for me, when I drop the seat I absolutely want it in the same exact spot every time.

I hated infinite drop seat post I rode, so for me that's not marketing hype it's a fact I agree with. We all have our preferences, no one can tel you which will be best for you.


----------



## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

TwoTone said:


> That's not just marketing for some people it is better. Only you'll able to say for yourself.
> 
> When riding technical terrain or obstacles, I sometimes use the inside of my thighs on the seat. So for me, when I drop the seat I absolutely want it in the same exact spot every time.
> 
> I hated infinite drop seat post I rode, so for me that's not marketing hype it's a fact I agree with. We all have our preferences, no one can tel you which will be best for you.


That's a good point as I use the inside of my thigh for control as well. The middle position is great whether 1" or 2" drop it adds control and clearance when you don't need the max height.

One issue I have with both my Mech post with multiple position is that I miss the middle position sometimes on both directions up/down.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

TwoTone said:


> That's not just marketing for some people it is better. Only you'll able to say for yourself.
> 
> When riding technical terrain or obstacles, I sometimes use the inside of my thighs on the seat. So for me, when I drop the seat I absolutely want it in the same exact spot every time.
> 
> I hated infinite drop seat post I rode, _*so for me that's not marketing hype it's a fact I agree with*_. We all have our preferences, no one can tel you which will be best for you.


Understood. I suspect that Specialized is pretty sincere in considering the non-adjustability a plus. Since I'm such a newb, I really can't make a judgment that means anything. I do like the idea of the simplicity and reliability of the mechanical approach. I also like the idea of having the remote lever attach to a grip end...but I think you have to get some specific Specialized grips to take advantage of that.

While following this thread, I ran across THIS on eBay. I put in a bid of $150, thinking that was a no-brainer for a Blacklite. Then I wasn't so sure that it WAS a Blacklite--the picture doesn't seem to have enough detail to tell, and every reference I've seen to the Blacklite specifies "2012" as the model year. Anyway, I got outbid at the last second, so the point is moot. But I'm curious about whether it actually IS a 2012 Blacklite? Any idea?


----------



## Kaba Klaus (Jul 20, 2005)

I have a Specialized seatdropper. It sucks. Requires constant tinkering to keep it going. Most of the time it is adjusting the cable tension of the remote. Lever is horrible as I run my shifters outside of the brake.

My wife has a turbo dropper and simply loves it.


----------



## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

I have been using a Specialized Command Post for about a year and a half and ride several times a week. I have had to adjust the cable . . . . once, and then upgraded to the newer lever about six months ago (haven't adjusted the cable yet on it).

I have really got used to the convenience of being able to raise and lower the saddle on the fly, but it does take some getting used to having another control to use while riding. Sometimes I feel like I'm texting while driving but I have grown attached to the convenience.

If I was able to change one thing, I would like it to go about an inch lower (more travel) for those times on the super steep stuff, but if I get to places like that, I just stop and lower it, no biggee.

A friend has the Command Post Blacklite and likes it too.


----------



## Hardluckhero (Jun 4, 2010)

I've got a Spec command post, bought on ebay for $125 shipped. Had it about 6 months and I like it. It only has 3 positions and I think that's all I need. I live in AZ and use it in a less than a handful of spots, where I think it comes in handy is if for some reason I stop in the middle of a climb of descent and then try to continue. True you don't really need it, with some practice you can drop your saddle if you have a QR while still rolling, but the drop post is a really neat feature.


----------



## savagemann (Jan 14, 2008)

I have a gravity dropper turbo.
Super simple, strong and easy to use.
I have had to do 0 adjustments with it since I got it over 1.5 years ago.
I did get the 5" drop model with 3 positions.....Full up, middle and bottom.
I use the full up for climbs, middle for flat sections and down for descending.
The thing is absolutely bomber.
For my bike, I felt that 5" was a bit too high at the highest position, so I ordered a 4" shaft kit for it for like $30.
At least for the frame I have it on right now 4" is perfect, but when I put it on my Nomad I am about to build, I will most likely convert it back to 5".
It is super easy to work on and maintain.....super cheap to have it serviced if you don't feel like doing so yourself.
Made in the USA by a great company who has very friendly staff and who are very helpful.
Call them up and see what they have to say. 
Last I checked they have it available in a 27.2 and 30.9.
If your seatpost is 30.9 or bigger, make sure you get the 30.9 and shim if needed.
Smaller than 30.9 get the 27.2 and whatever shim you need to fit your bike.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

jeffj said:


> I have been using a Specialized Command Post for about a year and a half and ride several times a week. I have had to adjust the cable . . . . once, and then upgraded to the newer lever about six months ago (haven't adjusted the cable yet on it).
> 
> I have really got used to the convenience of being able to raise and lower the saddle on the fly, but it does take some getting used to having another control to use while riding. Sometimes I feel like I'm texting while driving but I have grown attached to the convenience.
> 
> ...


Jeff, which length do you have? The Blacklite comes in 75, 100 and 125 mm.


----------



## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

Porschefan said:


> Jeff, which length do you have? The Blacklite comes in 75, 100 and 125 mm.


I just measured it at about 4 inches, so that would be 100mm.

I would try your current post at 4" and 5" lower and see which you prefer as you may prefer the shorter drop.

I also sent you a PM earlier.

Jeff


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

*Update...with a couple more questions*

Still haven't decided which way to jump on the dropper seatpost and there's no super urgency with ribs not quite yet healed and winter closing in.

I had decided that I would probably like the Specialized Command Post Blacklite, but when I tried to order one, I found that they are not available ANYWHERE in the 30.9 x 125mm size. I've talked to Specialized's customer support twice and got no useful information. I've been told that they will be available as early as December and as late as May 2012. There was one recently available on eBay, but Specialized won't warranty if purchased second-hand. So on that front, I can just be patient or see if an earlier model (non-Blacklite) one appears on the used market at a price where giving up the warranty makes sense.

I almost pulled the trigger on a 2012 Reverb, but after reading tons of posts here and elsewhere on this model, I decided that there are just too many reports of ongoing failures with these--even the new 2012 ones.

Right now, I'm strongly considering the KS model. It's very attractively priced--about $215 for an i900R 30.9 x 125mm. There are also a couple of threads here that claim it is very user-friendly as far as servicing/maintenance goes. I do have a couple of questions on them though--mainly directed at Mimi who supplied the great pix and measurements above.

First--KS does make a 150mm post (cost is around $300 though). Using Mimi's photographs above, I came up with the following measurements:

From mid-point on the seat rail itself to the top of the dropper section of the post: 1.75"

Drop section: 5.10" (150mm)

Collar section with bevel: 1.1" (27mm)

That's a total of 7.95". I re-measured my current post and I get just a hair over 8" measuring from the seat clamp to the mid-point on my seat rail. Mimi--do I have those measurements correct? I probably don't need 6" of drop anyway, but I'm curious if I could get away with it. It seems that the purpose of the full-drop position is to get the seat "out of the way," and 5" is probably plenty "out of the way"--especially considering Jeffj's comment about his 4" Command Post being almost enough anyway.

Then comes the question of offset (again....  ) KS makes the i900 and i950 models (now called the "Supernatural" and the "Dropzone," but from what I've read, identical). The i950 is a zero-offset and the i900 is a 30mm offset. My current post has a 15mm offset, so with the i900 I'd have to slide the seat 15mm forward (further back on the rails) to get my current spot. The i950 would require the opposite. Currently my seat is fairly well-centered on the clamp, which would seem to be the ideal position. Would there be any reason to prefer the seat off-center one way or the other? All things being equal the i900 is about $30 cheaper.


----------



## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

If reliability is a big concern, I don't know that any post out there right now has as solid and long of a record as the Gravity Dropper. They have proven themselves to be very reliable over the last 6 or 7 years. Also, they have top-notch customer service, I consider them up there with companies like Real World Cycling (makers of Enduro Seals and bearings) and PUSH Industries. Call them up, they will solve your problem.

How big a drop you get will depend on how much room you have between your saddle rails and the top of the frame's seat tube.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

*Miscellaneous update data--KS posts*

The 150mm KS Super Natural is available at Bike Bling for $255.

Good price, but I asked them to measure from the bottom of the post to the seat rail and it was 8.5". There's 8" exposed on my current seatpost, so the 150mm is a no-go unless I were to get a saddle with low profile. . The 125mm version should be fine though.

On the question of offset, after talking with Rick @ KS a couple of times it looks like the zero-offset version is probably best. He said the trend to zero-offset on adjustable posts is to you a little forward as well as centered over the bottom bracket for maximum power while climbing with the post is fully extended. He also mentioned that my bike, and trail bikes in general tend to have a slacker seat tube angle than XC or road bikes and the "default" riding position is already biased a little to the back. And the zero-offset clamp should still allow enough for fine tuning and duplicating the exact position I have now, if that's best.


----------



## Enigmma (Jun 20, 2011)

On my 3rd ride with KS i950-R. 

Read so much about dropper's being a game changer, had to get one. So far I like it but not a game changer yet. Hopefully that will change with more experience.

But! I really wish I had read this thread, especially the info about measuring the exposed post, before purchasing. I ride a 17.5" frame that is a little too big for me (although I need the longer top tube). With the KS inserted completely into the seat tube the fully extended position is too tall for me to pedal. I have to drop it slightly from the top position to achieve the proper pedaling position.

Obviously this is not ideal. It is difficult to get right while flying through single track. Measure twice purchase once!


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

Enigmma said:


> On my 3rd ride with KS i950-R.
> 
> Read so much about dropper's being a game changer, had to get one. So far I like it but not a game changer yet. Hopefully that will change with more experience.
> 
> ...


Do you have the 125mm or 150mm model?


----------



## Enigmma (Jun 20, 2011)

Porschefan said:


> Do you have the 125mm or 150mm model?


I have the 125mm version. I think even the 100mm version would be close.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

Enigmma said:


> I have the 125mm version. I think even the 100mm version would be close.


Enigmma,

If you can get to it, I would appreciate getting your measurement of the distance from the bottom of the collar, with the collar resting on the top of the frame seat tube to the mid-line of the seat rail in the clamp. Should be 27mm (collar) + 125mm (dropper tube fully extended) + "X" (the distance from the top of the dropper tube to the clamp. If "X" is 2" or less, I should be OK with 125mm.

"Measuring twice, hopefully cutting once."


----------



## Enigmma (Jun 20, 2011)

Porschefan said:


> Enigmma,
> 
> If you can get to it, I would appreciate getting your measurement of the distance from the bottom of the collar, with the collar resting on the top of the frame seat tube to the mid-line of the seat rail in the clamp. Should be 27mm (collar) + 125mm (dropper tube fully extended) + "X" (the distance from the top of the dropper tube to the clamp. If "X" is 2" or less, I should be OK with 125mm.
> 
> "Measuring twice, hopefully cutting once."


It's 7.5" or 190mm from top of seat tube to middle of saddle rail when inserted all the way in.

So X = 1.5" or 38mm


----------



## Will Goes Boing (Jan 25, 2008)

I just ordered a crank bros joplin. I ride a 19" frame which is on the larger end for me, it fits me great for XC riding but whenever I hit the gnarly downhills it's difficult for me to scoot my butt back and down off the seat. 

I can do it, but the seat is really close to my stomach and my arms are almost stretched out completely so I really have no control. So before it was either I risk crashing or I have to stop and adjust the seat post constantly. 

IMO if you need it, get it, but for me personally if I didn't have a problem with hanging off the back of the bike I wouldn't have bought it.


----------



## Porschefan (Jan 14, 2011)

Enigmma said:


> It's 7.5" or 190mm from top of seat tube to middle of saddle rail when inserted all the way in.
> 
> So X = 1.5" or 38mm


Thanks--that should work! :thumbsup:


----------



## JPSC37 (Nov 1, 2011)

I am running the Crankbrothers Joplin 4 and I love it. I have three of them and never have had any problems yet. I ride in dry areas and love the infinite positioning for the different terrain. Given the advantage that their company is not far from where i live i can go right into the store and get instant service and feedback. Having a dropping seatpost has helped my riding out in lots of ways.


----------



## tantrumizer (Dec 28, 2010)

Being a beginner and starting to make some slight progress, my dropper post has always been my favourite component. I like the infinite positioning on mine - mostly I'm either full down or full up, but sometimes I like to ride just an inch or so down on varying terrain, or maybe half-down if I really have no idea what's coming up.

In Europe, the RockShox Reverb post seems to get the best reviews. I have one and I've had no problem at all with it in 8 months of use. A friend has the Specialized post and I tried it and found it a little unreliable - but it was relatively old by then I guess.

Definitely get one though! It really can't hurt (except the cost).


----------

