# Budget ZTTO dropper lever. Blatant Wolftooth light action copy? You be the judge.



## DeoreDX (Jul 28, 2007)

I needed a cheap dropper lever for a budget parts bike build my son and I were making. Gave my son a budget of $30 told him to look through Ebay and Amazon and find a cheap dropper lever to buy. He picked one out and a week later it showed up at the house. 

It's a Chinese ZTTO brand. I don't own a Wolftooth lever but I have used and installed them, and the first thing that hits me is that the design is strikingly similar to the Wolftooth light action I remember. Same size. Same shape. Same pivot design and bearing. Same obround used for side to side adjustments. The biggest difference I can tell is the Wolftooth used the plastic breakaway pivot while the ZTTO is obviously anodized red aluminum. Lever was easy to install and operates and functions great. The fit and finish is obviously a notch below Wolftooth but it doesn't effect the operation of the lever. Very smooth and light action, just like the Wolftooth it copied. On one hand I appreciate getting a good performing lever at 40% of the retail cost of the Wolftooth. But on the other hand I love Wolftooth as a company and _every_ bike I own has Wolf tooth parts on it so I hate seeing someone blatantly rip off a quality design. Anyways I'm not here to advocate for or against buying the ZTTO lever just wanted to give my experience and feedback.


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## ehfour (Oct 17, 2016)

No clue if is the same of different- but now off to search for the ZTTO lever- unless you have a link?


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## DeoreDX (Jul 28, 2007)

ehfour said:


> No clue if is the same of different- but now off to search for the ZTTO lever- unless you have a link?


Son got it off of Ebay. Want to say it was around $26-27USD from a US seller.

Found the listing. 









Bike Seatpost Controller MTB Bicycle Dropper Post Lever Mechanical Universal US | eBay


The horizontal position of the remote lever could be adjustable for a total distance by 8 mm. The remote lever is a part that easily to break when you crash your bike. Did you ever considered why this little thing cost so much?.



www.ebay.com


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Looks damn similar anyway. If it's not made out of Swiss cheese, and is compatible with all the adapters that's a nice buy. The latter being the most important factor in my opinion. 

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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

Lol, look at this one I found on Amazon.
on sale!








Amazon.com : YOUNGL Seatpost Dropper Remote Lever Universal Ergonomic sy Install Removable with Wrench Durable Aluminum Alloy Adjustable Up Down Mountain Bike Bicycle Shifter Replacement Parts(22.2mmRed) : Sports & Outdoors


Amazon.com : YOUNGL Seatpost Dropper Remote Lever Universal Ergonomic sy Install Removable with Wrench Durable Aluminum Alloy Adjustable Up Down Mountain Bike Bicycle Shifter Replacement Parts(22.2mmRed) : Sports & Outdoors



www.amazon.com


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## BadgerOne (Jul 17, 2015)

rideit said:


> Lol, look at this one I found on Amazon.
> on sale!
> 
> 
> ...


"Bicycle lifting seat pipeline controller"

Nice.

Mixed feelings on the 'borrowed' IP of this kind of stuff. Sucks that they flagrantly do it. It also sucks the original is stupidly overpriced. Pick which irritation better suits you.


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## dysfunction (Aug 15, 2009)

BadgerOne said:


> It also sucks the original is stupidly overpriced.


This is why people don't "Buy American"  

Just sayin' as the owner of several of these levers.. and yea, this is clearly a knock off.


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

In the RC world some clone companies have gone on to build better cars, planes, and helicopters than what they were cloning to begin with. Even building whole new platforms. While I wouldn't want to be a company on the other side of being "ripped off", to the consumer and market alike it's not all bad. 

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## meschenbruch (Jan 15, 2017)

This is made of swiss cheese. I purchased one, has a really nice feel and would have got another after it passed the durability test, however I had a fall and the clamp bent slightly rendering it completely useless.

Would not buy again


Slight correction, the rail thing bent a little bit which causes the bearing to seize up.


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## DeoreDX (Jul 28, 2007)

meschenbruch said:


> This is made of swiss cheese. I purchased one, has a really nice feel and would have got another after it passed the durability test, however I had a fall and the clamp bent slightly rendering it completely useless.
> 
> Would not buy again
> 
> ...


Where the wolftooth has the cheap breakaway plastic part probably would have saved the assembly and cost you $5 to fix.


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## TimTucker (Nov 9, 2011)

DeoreDX said:


> Where the wolftooth has the cheap breakaway plastic part probably would have saved the assembly and cost you $5 to fix.


If you buy direct from ZTTO, they're only $16 on sale, though:








4.45US $ 44% OFF|Ztto Mtb Dropper Seat Post Lever Bicycle Seatpost Remote Controller Adjustable Handle Bearing Mechanical Universal Shifter Style - Bicycle Seat Post - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com





In my case I picked one up because I'd gotten a Wolftooth lever on its own used and needed a clamp (Tektro brakes were advertised as I-Spec compatible but apparently not 100% compatible).

The ZTTO is a close enough copy that getting an entire spare lever for less than Wolftooth charges for just a clamp seemed like the more sensible option.


For either lever, I found that adding a cheap silicone brake lever cover like one of these improves leverage and overall feel (cover just needs to be trimmed to fit):








Amazon.com: JooFn 5 Pairs Anti-Slip Brake Handle Silicone Sleeve Mountain Road Bike Dead Fly Universal Type Brake Lever Protection Cover : Sports & Outdoors


Amazon.com: JooFn 5 Pairs Anti-Slip Brake Handle Silicone Sleeve Mountain Road Bike Dead Fly Universal Type Brake Lever Protection Cover : Sports & Outdoors



smile.amazon.com





Added benefit is that it covers up the end of the cable.


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## DeoreDX (Jul 28, 2007)

TimTucker said:


> If you buy direct from ZTTO, they're only $16 on sale, though:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I was all excited thinking I could get a purple one but it says that the seller doesn't deliver to the united states.


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## TimTucker (Nov 9, 2011)

DeoreDX said:


> I was all excited thinking I could get a purple one but it says that the seller doesn't deliver to the united states.


I was going to order another one and noticed that as well after I signed in -- I've ordered from them in the past and as far as I can tell everything else I look at within their store shows as OK to ship to the US.


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

TimTucker said:


> I was going to order another one and noticed that as well after I signed in -- I've ordered from them in the past and as far as I can tell everything else I look at within their store shows as OK to ship to the US.


Right now they're about $23 on fleabay (with tax) from a US seller. Still not bad and no worries about it getting stuck on a boat.

I broke one in a crash (bought 2 at the time) and had forgotten to get another as a spare. Glad this thread popped up even though it's been running fine more than a year since then.


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## GKelley (Sep 4, 2018)

Good. Those greedy scoundrals at Wolftooth need a reality check on prices. The more competition, the better.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

ZTTO has a HAG clone for under 30 bucks

HAG costs 185

ZTTO has been at all the bike shows, they aren't hiding, they make _a LOT_ of crap


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

GKelley said:


> Good. Those greedy scoundrals at Wolftooth need a reality check on prices. The more competition, the better.


You know they make all their stuff in house, right? American designed and made is worth a premium, imo.


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

SteveF said:


> You know they make all their stuff in house, right? American designed and made is worth a premium, imo.


Maybe there was some sarcasm involved because blatantly copying someone else's product design is hardly considered competition at least in my book.

But when we can save a buck or two who cares about supporting our fellow citizens who still design and make stuff in the USA.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

acer66 said:


> Maybe there was some sarcasm involved because blatantly copying someone else's product design is hardly considered competition at least in my book.
> 
> But when we can save a buck or two who cares about supporting our fellow citizens who still design and make stuff in the USA.


Ah, if it was sarcasm I apologize for my scolding comment. I'm invested in the Wolftooth brand, so to speak. I have some of their parts on most of my bikes and one of their bikes (Otso Voytek fat bike) I just like the brand, they make cool stuff.


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## acer66 (Oct 13, 2010)

SteveF said:


> Ah, if it was sarcasm I apologize for my scolding comment. I'm invested in the Wolftooth brand, so to speak. I have some of their parts on most of my bikes and one of their bikes (Otso Voytek fat bike) I just like the brand, they make cool stuff.


Was just guessing and yes, I have a few of their levers, chainrings and other small bits too and like their stuff.

I also had only good experiences with their CS.


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## TimTucker (Nov 9, 2011)

acer66 said:


> Maybe there was some sarcasm involved because blatantly copying someone else's product design is hardly considered competition at least in my book.
> 
> But when we can save a buck or two who cares about supporting our fellow citizens who still design and make stuff in the USA.


From an ethical standpoint, it's hard to make the call that my "fellow citizens" are any more deserving of support just based on living in closer proximity to me.

I've heard these arguments for years living in the heart of the American auto industry -- I'm not sure that American bike manufacturing is going to fare much better when (not if) China starts to pull ahead of the US in both quality and innovation.

From a practical standpoint, China has both vastly more people and more area of the country covered by mountains. As we've seen in the US, it really only takes 1-2 generations of people growing up as enthusiasts with a handful going into engineering and manufacturing to start pumping out a steady stream of new ideas.

From the rapidly improving build quality of clone products, we can see that they're starting to "get" quality manufacturing. Glimpses we have into the MTB scene that's been developing there would suggest that they're likely close to the tipping point where there's more than enough local talent to start pushing the envelope on innovation as well:


https://www.pinkbike.com/news/the-goat-house-southwest-chinas-downhill-scene.html


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

Thread drift, but these look…awesome. Gotta love the professional photography backgrounds.








399.99US $ |Handmade Titanium Crankset Mtb Crank Arms Crankset Mountain Bike Crank Arms Road Bike Crankset Titanium Mtb Parts - Bicycle Crank & Chainwheel - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com


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## richj8990 (Apr 4, 2017)

rideit said:


> Lol, look at this one I found on Amazon.
> on sale!
> 
> 
> ...


This one above is the 3rd I've bought so far, the last one being only $15 and just dropped it off at the bike shop yesterday with the new dropper post (I was going to do it myself in the garage but the rest of the bike is already there being built so...). I don't like it quite as much as the vertical push levers but I'm used to it now. Really, as long as a dropper post works and the lever works, it's not really that complicated of a system. Whatever works at a reasonable price, you buy, it's not like trying to choose an air fork or anything. And may I ask why some dropper posts are $700+ and weigh almost 1.5 lbs? Any advantage to that besides the brand name? The OneUp V2 post is $200-250 and weighs somewhere between 1.0 and 1.2 lbs depending on the travel. Again, it's not a hard decision, it's up and down, I don't need 1/2 dozen preset positions...do you?


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

I have a couple of those very generic droppers Levers. Neither one is performing it’s basic job very well. I just went up market and bought a one-up lever. I’m Going to be sorely disappointed if it isn’t better.


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## OneTrustMan (Nov 11, 2017)

The ZTTO lever is already around 2 years old.
When it came out the ZTTO sales manager stated here in the forum that they maybe have to stop production, because Wolftooth was preparing a copyright lawsuit.

In the end it never came to a lawsuit.
My guess is that the Wolftooth lever either was made fully, or partly in china, which means they can't file a lawsuit, because by chinese law you have to give up your intellectual property rights ( there are some exceptions like Jeep ) if you want to produce anything in china.
Or Wolftooth thought nothing will change anyway. Not sure, we never heard back from the ZTTO sales manager.
His last statement was that he isn't working for ZTTO anymore.

I have two ZTTO levers paired with 210mm Oneup droppers. They work flawless and have a light feel. Pairing them with brake levers is a little bit tricky. You can buy the original Wolftooths adapters, or have to 3D print something.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

TimTucker said:


> ...I've heard these arguments for years living in the heart of the American auto industry -- I'm not sure that American bike manufacturing is going to fare much better when (not if) China starts to pull ahead of the US in both quality and innovation...


I'm a Michigan boy so I know exactly what you mean about the pressure to buy American. The difference I think at least with places like Wolftooth is that they design and manufacture and sell many of their products, either directly to consumers or through distributers. It's nearly a craftman/artisan sort of arrangement. I just like that. Also, the quality and functionality of Wolftooth stuff is 2nd to none in my experience. Can't say that's always been the case with larger American manufacturers.


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

rideit said:


> Thread drift, but these look…awesome. Gotta love the professional photography backgrounds.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Those have my attention. 

Any review or reports of people riding these? Looks like the dimensions are Sram GXP and cost about as much as the XO1's. Where the crank arm attaches to the spindle looks a little thin though. 

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## Urnso3 (Nov 13, 2021)

TimTucker said:


> From an ethical standpoint, it's hard to make the call that my "fellow citizens" are any more deserving of support just based on living in closer proximity to me.


There’s more to it than proximity. I’m fairly certain these companies treat employees differently. I’m not sure about this product but some manufacturing in China is still done by slave labor, particularly the Uyghurs who are often imprisoned for not being good citizens and practicing religion.


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## Urnso3 (Nov 13, 2021)

OneTrustMan said:


> When it came out the ZTTO sales manager stated here in the forum that they maybe have to stop production, because Wolftooth was preparing a copyright lawsuit.


It could be that a letter alone was enough to stop blatant exports with IP violations to the US. Especially if the letters are sent to US based distributors. Companies may surrender IP in China but that doesn’t always mean that IP protection doesn’t still exist in countries that recognize it.


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## AlpineMTBTraining (Apr 26, 2009)

Grinchy8 said:


> I have a couple of those very generic droppers Levers. Neither one is performing it’s basic job very well. I just went up market and bought a one-up lever. I’m Going to be sorely disappointed if it isn’t better.


I vastly prefer the ZTTO lever over the oneup lever. I do not like oneups lever ergonomics. For me the ZTTO lever is second to a specialized lever I used back when the Command post first came out. Unfortunately I didn;t know the ZTTO was a knock ff until i just found this thread.


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## SB Trails (Sep 14, 2012)

Seems like a decent lever here... ive heard good things about transx.. $39 isnt bad












TranzX Kitsuma 1X Dropper Lever


Long thumb paddle for leverage Adjustable hinged 22.2mm clamp for easy installation and custom fit Provides for a clean and traditional under the handlebar cable routing Compatible with all TransX droppers and cable actuated droppers of other brands Includes lever, cable, short and long housing...




thebikehub.com


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## TimTucker (Nov 9, 2011)

SB Trails said:


> Seems like a decent lever here... ive heard good things about transx.. $39 isnt bad
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks like the stock lever that comes with the Brand X post from CRC. IMO, less comfortable to use than the Wolftooth / ZTTO levers.


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## Hexsense (Aug 10, 2021)

If you can copy a lever,
Why copy Wolftooth and not Shimano SL-MT800-L?
Is it a lot easier to manufacture Wolftooth style lever than Shimano style?


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## TimTucker (Nov 9, 2011)

Hexsense said:


> If you can copy a lever,
> Why copy Wolftooth and not Shimano SL-MT800-L?
> Is it a lot easier to manufacture Wolftooth style lever than Shimano style?


Probably because the Wolftooth lever came first.


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## Monty219 (Oct 26, 2020)

Hexsense said:


> If you can copy a lever,
> Why copy Wolftooth and not Shimano SL-MT800-L?
> Is it a lot easier to manufacture Wolftooth style lever than Shimano style?


I have both and prefer the wolf tooth, different strokes.


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

AlpineMTBTraining said:


> Unfortunately I didn;t know the ZTTO was a knock ff until i just found this thread.


So, did you stop to use ZTTO lever immediately after you you found this thread? RRRight??..


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

Unfortunately I am going to go down this rabbit hole.

I wanted the wolftooth. But it is over 100 with shipping. Figured I would head over to pnw instead. They want close to 100 plus another 50 for shipping.
One-up ? Also approaching 3 digits on the wrong side of the decimal. 

These things cost more than what I paid for my x01 shift lever. There is nowhere near the precision/moving parts as the shifters. 

So I can get two of the ztto units for under 100 and that includes shipping. People with the ztto still going, or have they broken leaving you stranded with a dropped post out in the wilderness and you are still making your way back to civilization?

Or I will do what I did on one of my other bikes and use an old left side front derailleur shifter with the guts torn out.

/Rant


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## bcriverjunky (Jul 8, 2014)

006_007 said:


> Unfortunately I am going to go down this rabbit hole.
> 
> I wanted the wolftooth. But it is over 100 with shipping. Figured I would head over to pnw instead. They want close to 100 plus another 50 for shipping.
> One-up ? Also approaching 3 digits on the wrong side of the decimal.
> ...


Did you check with 9point8. Their's is made by Wolftooth and in Canada.


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

70$ for 9.8
13$ for ztto

Uhm...


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

I"m not running any ztto levers anymore. Have the shimano on a couple of the kids bikes, and the one-up on my bike. My narrow opinon, it's a waste of $13. PNW basic black lever is $50. ONeup is $50. Shimano mt500 is $30. I think the Shimano is the best budget choice.


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

Grinchy8 said:


> . My narrow opinon, it's a waste of $13.


Ok, but why it's a WASTE?
Just curious..


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

ka81ua said:


> Ok, but why it's a WASTE?
> Just curious..


because you will buy a replacement and throw it away


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

what replacement ?!..

so, bicycle component type - dropper lever.

products to buy:
ztto - 13
fancy brands - XX (tipple-... higher prices)

ztto - works the same. functioning as this component should. looks ok. costs lessssss.

and yet it's a waste?...
Nice... )


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## dysfunction (Aug 15, 2009)

China labor rate (and as a blatant copy without any design cost) vs US (with design cost). But ok. Enjoy the service jobs


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

Oh, that reason, ok.
I just thought there's some technical argumentation..
Good luck.


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## 006_007 (Jan 12, 2004)

Grinchy8 said:


> I"m not running any ztto levers anymore. Have the shimano on a couple of the kids bikes, and the one-up on my bike. My narrow opinon, it's a waste of $13. PNW basic black lever is $50. ONeup is $50. Shimano mt500 is $30. I think the Shimano is the best budget choice.



So they broke / failed on you? What is failing on these? Breaking in a crash?


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

The two I tried didn’t work very well. They weren’t broken, they just were non functional. If you want your dropper to be unreliable, get a crap lever. 
I’m not a brand elite, I have lots of generic parts on my bikes. This generic part just didn’t work well. I bought two for restomods around the same time and neither worked reliably. Same cable, same dropper, with shimano or one up levers everything worked fine on those bikes. 
I tried to fix them obviously before I got new levers (multiple cables, different housing, more tension, less tension) etc. that had a time cost and a small $ cost as well. Nothing says weekend fun like trying to adjust your dropper lever again. And again.
I’ve done 5 bare frame builds now, lacing up three pairs of wheels and doing all the install and tuning. I have a lot to learn still, but adjusting cable tension on a dropper isn’t one of them.
The basic shimano lever is much nicer, has more flexible install options, and costs $15 more. Why screw around with your time and effort for $15?


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## DeoreDX (Jul 28, 2007)

I've had zero problems out of mine. Use the hell out of it. The black anodizing is now faded and brown. I have over 1200 miles on the bike. I built up with the lever. Other than the fading anodizing no complaints.


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## ka81ua (Oct 14, 2014)

Same with me and with a lot of riders I know.


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## norcom (Feb 22, 2007)

Just upgraded one of my bikes with the Brand-X Ascend II as the KS Lev developed galvanic corrosion and started to feel a bit rough after a few years. I'm running Ascend droppers with the stock remotes on a couple of my other bikes and one bike with a FOX dropper and a Wolf Tooth remote. Just couldn't justify the WolfTooh remote because of the price. The Ascend droppers, including a remote, are on sale right now and cost as much as just the Wolf Tooth remote.

The Wolf Tooh remote is a bit more rigid. The ZTTO remote has a slight amount of play if you wiggle the lever vertically. This seems to happen because the cup that inserts through the bearing doesn't press against the bearing enough on the ZTTO. In comparison the generic Brand-X lever remote feels like a wet noodle with the pressed rivet bolt holding the lever in place. I've never noticed any of this play on the trail. I think the actuation feels better on the WolfTooth but I have the standard lever length Wolf Tooh on the FOX and I believe the ZTTO could be closer to the Wolf Tooh "Light Action Leverl". Could also be the FOX droppers actuation feeling that's different.

To me the lack of play on the Wolf Tooth gives it a slightly more premium feel. But the stock Brand-X remotes and the ZTTO work just fine too.


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## solarplex (Apr 11, 2014)

Have two, one on a one up v2 and one on a pnw rainer 3 for a couple years now. They work fine.


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