# Ituo Wiz XP3



## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

*Ituo WIZ XP3 Review*

Here is the Ituo WIZ XP3 triple XM-L2 Neutral White light we have been anticipating.

(website isn't showing anything yet as I have the production sample, which I say is good to go)

 Ituo WIz XP3 Light head only (includes everything except battery and charger): $149.99

Ituo WIZ XP3 Full Kit: $209.99

First impressions:

Quality build inside and out. A bit "plain" looking in appearance but its performance and functionality more than make up for that. Nice mounting options, Ituo has their quick release style handlebar mount which is really nice. Better than perma-mounting aluminum ones so I dont have huge gopro mounts on my bars. Pack is rather nice, neoprene (think xeccon) pouch, full rubber casing around the pack (ituo went with neon yellow instead of normal black). Charger is actually branded and looks like something decent. DSS is the brand, huge thumbs up there, no random cheap charger. And charges at 1.5A so another plus. And of course the remote. I still hold to my opinion button could be taller so its easier to find through gloves but thats the only "complaint" with it.

Included:

1 XP3 light head
1 gopro style helmet mount
1 QR gopro style bar mount
1 6400mah Panasonic NCR18650BE 4 cell pack
1 1.5A, 8.4V charger
1 removable wired remote
1 thumb screw and velcro strap
User manual

Ratings:

-2300 Lumens Output (over 2400 lumens tested at 30 seconds, steady output for almost entire run time still a bit over 2300 lumens)
-Run time is 2 hrs. Just barely makes it when ran on high obviously the entire time
-Weight for the head is 108G (remote and mounts not included in that weight, never are with any light i know of)
-Current Draw is 3A at fresh charge, increasing to 4.1A near the end before it drops off to 1000 lumen range. Holds pretty steady at 3A for most of the run time on high.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Low:










Medium:









High:









Video:






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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Thanks for the pic. Looks verrrrrrry good! First question, does the XP series accept standard Vancbiker mounts or is going to be something custom? Please post all the specs. first and answer when you get time.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Looks schweet!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Mole

No standard vancbiker mounts WONT work as they are. The screws are a different size and 2 of them. But if needed I can get measurements for you to give Vanc. Or since you ordered an XP2 already, they uses the EXACT same mount so youll have it there in front of you when you get it to know what you need to make a Vanc mount work.

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OP Updated


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

These looks super sweet! I's got to have one!
Not that I really need another new lamp but the ITOU company is an innovative and new source for Quality bike lights that I really feel needs to be supported by the community. I am really looking forward to how this lamp sizes up to the other really good bike lights in today's market. Tig, prices please for full kit & headlight only as soon as possible.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

currently $149.99 for head, $209.99 for kit. May change and there will be a pre order discount, just amount unknown currently.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Deleted


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Light-head weight?
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

108g head only

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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

That's a joke right, 210$ for a kit! Ituo kinda shoots over their heads, way over their heads.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I'm sitting here with them compared to Gemini amd gloworm. All in hand. The price is rather fair to say the least. Quality and performance all here.

Ituo isn't some cheap Chinese company.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Why are you sitting? We want a ride vid ASAP! Joking, what optics are standard issue for the XP3?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

LOL im working on it, weather hasnt been cooperating, hopefully get a ride in this weekend with it, get at least a little video.

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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Yeah, it's about three times the price I was hoping for, which was obviously very unrealistic. They are making top quality stuff which demands a higher price. It's pretty much exactly what I wanted, but it's out of my price range right now. 

I do feel like a chump though. We spent all that time going back and forth on multiple build-your-custom light threads discussing what would the perfect light. Then someone builds it and sells our own ideas back to us at top dollar. Initially I thought they were doing us a favor, but in reality we are doing them the favor. This will be a big seller and we did all their market research for them. Instead of giving my ideas (or our ideas) out for free, it seems like it's better to come up with your own company and try to sell it to everyone here. I can't be the only one on the forum who has come to this conclusion. Probably not the best place to post this, my apologies.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

varider said:


> Yeah, it's about three times the price I was hoping for, which was obviously very unrealistic. Obviously they are making top quality stuff which demands a higher price. It's pretty much exactly what I wanted, but it's out of my price range right now.
> 
> I do feel like a chump though. We spent all that time going back and forth on multiple build-your-custom light threads discussing what would the perfect light. Then someone builds it and sells our own ideas back to us at top dollar. Initially I thought they were doing us a favor, but in reality we are doing them the favor. This will be a big seller and we did all their market research for them. Instead of giving my ideas (or our ideas) out for free, it seems like it's better to come up with your own company and try to sell it to everyone here. I can't be the only one on the forum who has come to this conclusion. Probably not the best place to post this, my apologies.


That's how market research works. Companies gather information from their target consumers to make the most desirable product. By us investing the time to compile all the things we were looking for we insured that the XP3 was custom made just for us. Sounds to me like Ituo did us a favor and gave us the light we wanted just with quality parts throughout at a very reasonable price for what you get. Gearbest is still planning to build the "Ceap Chinese" version for approx. $50. So lucky us have a choice of 2 quality levels of the light we wanted. I'll happily pay the extra for the Ituo to get the better quality/a warranty/U.S. distributor with fast shipping. If you decide to get the Gearbest version I'll look forward to your review/impressions.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Deleted

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I too was a lil surprised at Ituo's pricing. After using my wiz20 a while, I see the quality is far away better than the cheepies. I don't know if I'll shell out $210, but I'm glad I have another choice for a quality light.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

My thoughts; yeah it would have been nice if the price for the kit would have been under $200. Perhaps with pre-order discount we might be able to get a lower price. Lamp head only is still not a bad deal at $150.

Maybe it's just me but I was never under the illusion that this type of product was going to be sold at a rock bottom price. the price might be higher than expected but it is still in a reasonable range. ( not to mention that it might be the brightest 3 emitter lamp available at this time. )

I'm still waiting to find out when this project is going to be available. Also waiting on a discount code.


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

nevermind


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Deleted

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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

Yeah, I'm just moaning a little bit.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Its cool, its the cost of wanting great build quality and options we want. Plus product support/warranty.  We can have the basic functionality a lot cheap, but then we play the Gamble of if it even works when it arrives and if so, for how long.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

varider said:


> Yeah, I'm just moaning a little bit.


I'm not sure what Ituo plans on doing with the XP3 but I got $30 and $25 off MSRP respectively on my Wiz20 and XP2 pre-orders.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

The gloworm was done on a 6800mah Panasonic pack. But being as it's my primary pack for my bar lights, it didn't run the xs quite as long as a new pack would. Expect runtime to the same as the xp3, maybe a hair longer I'll have to look at current draw readings from the tests.


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## Sirius9 (Apr 24, 2013)

All in all, without ideas served to them from here all they would come up is just regular sh** that you can buy on ebay or aliexpress, on - low - medium - high - strobe - sos - off, thats all they know.
Anyway, for 210$ there is a ton of options not limited only to bike style lights, flashlights also work fine.
I was intrigued at the beginning, wondered how will this light turn up but now I am not even coinsidering it (maybe one day in far distant future when they achieve Nitecore or Olight or Fenix level (on their own) I may give them a chance), I got myself 2 x Nitefighters BC40S (15$ each from ebay, superb quality), made 2 x 2S3P battery packs with genuine panasonic cells (40$ each, including hunk-lee 7A protection pcb and that fancy magicshine plastic case)and that's a 110$ setup that can easily beat XP3 and XP4, maybe even XP5 if they survive that long to make one...

Don't know what else to say while I wait for night to come to try out Fenix BC30R that I got yesterday (from ebay, for half the price of XP3)...

p.s. Nice smiling kity you have there


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Annoyed with childish and disruptive responses to a light that I have the only one in existance outside of the sample at the company. Dont bad mouth a product you dont have, have never seen or anything like that. Not unless its an issue with actual performance and design shown and posted above.

Btw. I also have a Fenix bc30r, didn't last 10 short rides before it broke internally. Not to mention their set up is 10yrs behind the times. I won't touch another Fenix product again. $140 paper weight is all it is.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Don't go Tig! Let him enjoy his fenix lol. Now get back to reviewing a real light..., the xp3


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Deleted, was off topic


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

And one final fact to point out as I just checked history:

Ituo had EVERYTHING except the removable wired remote before we said anything.

AND WE ALL TOLD THEM TO MAKE IT, LOOK AT THEIR THREADS ASKING FOR OUR INPUT.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> And one final fact to point out as I just checked history:
> 
> Ituo had EVERYTHING except the removable wired remote before we said anything.
> 
> ...


:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: Any information Ituo got here (voluntary on our part) they used to our benefit. Gloworm does this too and what we get are products from these companies that fit out needs.
IMO Ituo did us a favor by listening to what we want and I'm happy to have another option when looking for a quality light.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Deleted.


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

delete


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OK enough with all the PM's guys.  Thanks, As long as we can get back to normal things and away from that garbage, keeping on topic (and yes price is topic too, just not in the "manner" above) Ill continue this review thread.

No need for a "TL;DR" moment but Im doing my best to get real, unbiased info here. Havent been this excited about a light since we saw the BT21 last year. But numbers and everything I have in my hands doesnt lie. 

Ituo in my hands has to compete against:

Cheap Chinese lights (all but 2 are modded to get desired functionality from them):
2 SS X3: 1 modded one not (bought it for spare parts to make sure my other ssx3 stays going)
1 SS x2
2 Yindings (one modded, one just optics change)
1 BT21 (modded to repair driver issues)
1 heavily modded 880 clone
1 BT70

Brand Name Lights (and I bought the gloworms myself to feed my desire for them):
2016 Gemini Duo
2016 Gemini Olympia (nice lights BTW, just got 2 major issues in my book, see thread)
2015 Gloworm X2
2015 Gloworm XS (only modded to us U3 bin 3D NW emitters, which I switched back to U2 Cool white stock emitter for comparison testing graphs, then now my U3 NW emitters again)
Xeccon Z10 and Z11 
Fenix BC30R (which no longer works but was untouched till fenix asked me to open it then used that as an excuse not to warranty it since the ribbon cable had fried and I had purchased it from out of the country)


Break down for comparison:

-Ituo XP3 (and XP2) include full standard gopro mount compatibility. Only company that did anything better IMHO is gloworm, and thats only with the handlebar mount. Because its offset so lights are centered on stem. Gemini and such use band mounts.

-Ituo removeable wired remote. Only one that beats that is Gemini because their wireless SEEMS to work well for multiple lights. No issues yet on the trails. Near interference sources like phones, computers etc (inside a house, maybe urban area) it does get glitchy.

-Ituo 6400mah Panasonic pack: ONLY light to compare is the XS, which or a much higher price tag comes with 6800mah panasonic celled pack. Rest are 5200mah packs

-All have programmable driver except Xeccon but thats due to the insanely tiny size of the Z10 and 11, just not enough room in their for a chip that can handle all the programming needed. Ituo and Gemini both have it done right (IIRC on Gemini) its a true, rapid double click that requires a bit of concentration to enter programming mode. Gloworm failed at this.

-Thermal management control: Only Gloworm and Ituo have active control. Rest have a step down. Only Ituo takes temperature readings directly from the emitter PCB to better control overall temps (in theory) but gloworm program works nicely as well.

-optics: Ituo uses easily available optics that many of us have on hand. Gives us the most wide range of options for beam patterns. Gemini comes in second on that. Gloworm has 3 options, 2 are highly usable. The "flood" optic is the spot optic with a little more spill (not much but it can help)

-Button location: Only Ituo and Xeccon have top buttons, Gloworm only has the wired remote.

-Lumen Output: Regardless of how accurate my sphere is (which has been tested and recalibrated several times to ensure best possible accuracy) the highest reading still goes to the XP3 by a substantial margin (graph above)

-OVERALL BUILD QUALITY: All are pretty much identical. Each uses a slightly different design to achieve basically the same thing. Drivers are built with quality components, well thought out and executed. Case thermal transfer is all on par. Proper solid wall behind the emitters, each uses their own PCB for the emitters.

-PRICE: Ituo is almost identical to Gemini lights in price. Gloworm is higher, xeccon in between gemini/ituo and gloworm.

Light isnt perfect as Im dealing with: the light head battery cable is a bit on the long side considering the length of the cable on the battery pack. And the Hidden strobe is activated before completely shutting off. Putting off then hidden strobe modes I think may be better served in the opposite.

But like EVERY LIGHT, what is improvements for down the road? Us finding things for them to make better. Just like every light. One thing Ituo has done is taken us very seriously. Gloworm has been reading the complaints over the programming mode mess for a long time, nothing has changed yet. Gemini thermal step down has been a complaint that still remains (but according to some, worse than before)

Seems to me Ituo is trying to rise above and get into Gloworm (and others in that price range) market while having a Gemini and Xeccon price range. Bang for buck wins here so far. And if the wiz20 is proof of anything, these lights will last the test of durability, holding up as well as the best in the crap we put lights through.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Oh and one more thing:

Was going to get a ride in tonight but celebrated anniversary with wife today (falls during the week next week) plus yard work in the heat this morning, chasing kids first half the day and so on. Too wiped out.

Going tomorrow night, may switch it up to the trail I used for the nightfighter review last summer for a change in scenery. And got a big even with my club next weekend, so be some drunken night riding going on (yeap Ill have at least 2 cameras going, maybe a bit buzzed myself at some point during it)


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

I want to add something for those of you who live in warm climates to consider. I too like the Gloworm mounts for their ability to center the light but the side mount also eliminates the option of adding any additional heat-sink volume or surface area like Vancbikers excellent finned mounts. Gloworms thermal management is seamless and far preferable to a hard step down but being small lights heat build up near 100° and up you have considerable diminished output. At this point I don't have a XP3 W/Vancbiker mount to test but based on past experience with other lights am confident you would retain most of the lights max. output capability at higher temps. Big XP3(and XP2) advantage for hot weather riders over the Gloworm products.
Mole


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## Boom King (Jun 5, 2016)

Geez, there's a **** ton of butt hurt around here. All over what seems to be a good quality light at a reasonable price for what you get.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ok got my ride in tonight!

Awesome ride, much better when I can dial my beam pattern in very specifically. Beat my personal best by 0.5mph, 54 seconds faster in 1.25miles. hit and humid so faster meant comfortable vs miserable conditions. So I decided to see how hard I could push it. Having the nice even beam from tire to as far as I wanted in front gave me a sense of daylight riding without all the distractions in my peripheral vision. Huge confidence boost. Was achievable via other lights but some situations (tight but punchy switchbacks and such) I'd be cautious. Instead now it's like riding with my XS on the lid but with more lumens concentrated down range.

The first longer fast section I ran in high mode. After checking out the throw from the top of the hill, I only went to medium modes which are set to 70% on the xp2 and 60% on the xp3. Did the rest of the ride on that including the fastest area of the loop.

Something I have never done before on clean hard pack in dry conditions, go fast enough around a corner my rear tire came loose without me having been touching the brakes. Realized I have a bit more handling skills that I thought cause didn't even phase me till after. Didn't mess my line up or anything.

Dialed in light set up (and dialed in bike now as well) made for the best ride I've had in a long time. Not saying its because of Ituo lights, but the ability to get just the beam combinations that work perfect for me came because of having several optics choices to work with.

Xp2 with a 45deg and 60deg optics. 45 deg gave me just a bit more throw out of the bars though hot spot isn't visible on the trail at all.

Xp3 was 2 10deg optics on the outsides with the 25 deg (which we think is more 15 deg with some extra spill) which gave me an awesome smooth batch of light from my bars as far as I could possibly need to see.

Also some have seen the hill off to the right of my normal beam shots, from on top of that the xp3 has enough throw and intensity with it that from the top of that hill looking down past where I stand for beam shots to the stables and such behind it. I could make out the horse pictures on the signs marking the trail entrance for them.

That's 350-400 ft I could make out the horse symbol on a 8x12 trail marker sign. 

Yes I got video but you'll have to wait. Both my wheels are leaking a bit on my 29 (contrary to popular belief, gorilla tape doesn't do well for more than a season for tubeless, especially in my humidity). So switching to Kapton tape and putting my 2.35 xr2 on the rear to see how I like it vs the 2.2 I have.

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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Oh btw here's a couple pics from before the sun went down (haven't had a chance to get the video uploaded yet)




























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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Alright a video segment for you guys. Whenever these cycles of nasty storms stop so the trails can dry a little I will try to get something done on more open ground (and hopefully the camera can get it all) so you can really see the full capability. The glare off the plants being really damp (high humidity) kept the camera from being able to pic up the light at further distances.:

XP3 on the lid, XP2 with wide optics on the bars.









PS, just realized half that video was me putting the bike on the car,lol. Ill get it cut down when I get a chance.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Update:

Went on a "camping trip" with the club and just a lot of other local riders. 

Really freaking hot, over 90 and high humidity during the day, still mid 80s and ridiculous humidity after dark.

Same set up again, xp2 bars and xp3 on the lid. Made it about 10 minutes into the group trail ride (about 15 minutes from camp) when a friend's girlfriends light kept going out (cheap tri-clone thing, the place she bought it from didn't even match connectors. Solarstorm on light and ms on the pack)

So I gave her my xp2 off my bars and my pack so she could do the rest of the ride. Which left me with xp3 on the lid on my 2 cell pack for another 45 minutes. Thankfully I had switched the center optic to the slighting wider beam/bit more spill.

Was a fun as hell but we all looked like we just got out of the pool (including our bikes) by the time we got back just because the humidity was so high.

What I learned:

I can see how helmet lights work well alone. With a good mixed pattern you can see just fine. And alot better than a bar only light IMHO. You can see around corners with just a bar light which is why those of us that knew the trails were split throughout the group to call out sections that had little warning out of a corner.

I rode at speed when I could. I'm a "slow rider" so I started being towards the rear of the pack but I know that trail well and night ride all the time. So I ended up moving up to the middle. I'm definitely completely comfortable going at speed at night. Even on a trail I'd never ridden after dark (we got special permission from park rangers just for last night for 1hr. Enough to do a full loop)

Xp3 was definitely flawless, didn't mind the heat at all. Having truely customizable beam pattern made it able to be a single light ride for me and didn't even slow me down. And since I could still ride on medium majority of the time, even being over an hour the indicator on the light was still green just on my 2cell 3500mah pack.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Was just on the Ituo Facebook page and saw what I assume are the XP3 pre-order prices. 
Light-head: 129.95 
Full Kit: 184.99
Too good a deal for me to pass up!
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya goes on pre-order in a few days iirc.

I'm mad at myself though, the case did fog up, but on the outside. I FORGOT TO CLEAN THE DAMN THING so the bit of dust on the case gave the moisture in the air something to stick to. So no video of riding with just this as a headlamp 

I'll get a short one next night trail ride, just wait for a section I feel comfortable doing it on. That park is very strict about it so I have no idea when (or if cause a couple of riders didn't listen and exit trails by the curfew, went off on their own and pissed the ranger off).

Other trails I'm not as comfortable with "testing" a single light set up on. Though still trails I ride regularly, that one I know inside and out. Really the only trail set I rode for the first 2 seasons I started riding again.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Did my preorder on an XP3 Kit plus some extra wide/spot and flood optics this morning. My XP2 should be in stock next week so playing with that will keep me occupied till the 3 comes in. Might be time to revive the "Show us your light collection" thread when it gets here!
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I'm still on the fence. I love the fact of the xp2 and its efficiency or the brute power of the xp3....? I don't understand Ituo speccing the same battery pack. Saves money but a 6 cell offer is prolly in order.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

2 hrs run time on high is kind of a "standard" for lights. But instead of the way other companies do it (lower capacity pack) for their smaller lights, Ituo did it the other way. 2hrs in their big light and use that pack for the xp2 as well. 6 cell is an "upgrade" for other lights as well for those that want more runtime but for me at least, 2hrs on max translates to 4+ during actual use for me.

Hell I ran on a 2 cell 3500mah pack for over an hour. Low mode when we'd stop. Medium for a fair amount. High when things got fast.

And I still had a fair amount t of battery power left by the time we got back to camp.

Always something to think about when getting a battery pack. How much time are you actually going to spend in high mode?

As for decided between lights. Do like I did with Gloworm, just buy both 

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> I'm still on the fence. I love the fact of the xp2 and its efficiency or the brute power of the xp3....? I don't understand Ituo speccing the same battery pack. Saves money but a 6 cell offer is prolly in order.


The XP3 is actually more efficient @ any set amount of light produced. You have to run 2 emitters a lot harder to produce say 1500 lumens than you would 3 emitters so your battery run-time would be longer with the XP3 until you surpassed the amount of light the XP2 can produce. I really think in the long run you will be happier if you buy the XP3 but time is ticking and you don't have long to get an XP2 @ presale prices.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Points taken.... I want the xp3. Prolly lighthead at this juncture. But that is a good-great battery pack for not a lot, shipppp!!! Edit, full kit ordered. too good a deal to pass on. And I need a good charger like everyone else!!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Time for a quick update here:

Been using this purely as my.helmet light and loving it with the 25deg optics for trail use. Programmed medium mode at about 1800 lumens and that's pretty well perfect for most things. Hit high mode for fast descents.

Haven't had time to hit the trails further from home as been rather busy. But a lot of time on the fat bike riding the home trail, randomly exploring or just cruising around after work.

Don't see much riding going on this week, going to be hot as hell for a bit. Too hot with high humidity for me to trail ride.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yeah, and the 25d optics are sold out on Ituo's website.... What's the stock optics configuration for the xp3?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

3 10deg spot optics.

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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I was just about to pull the trigger on the Wiz XP3 when suddenly my flat screen T.V. went on the fritz.  Bad enough I had to buy a new computer two weeks ago now the TV goes up...:madmax: Smoke is starting to come off my credit card it's been used so much this month.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I can relate! My preorder for the xp3 was made a few days before my son aka John Force
Blew the rear end in my pickup. $1200 later my cc is gettin wooped on. Put myself on a self imposed ban from buying anything but ramen noodles. (And beer).


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dirt Road said:


> I can relate! My preorder for the xp3 was made a few days before my son aka John Force
> Blew the rear end in my pickup. $1200 later my cc is gettin wooped on. Put myself on a self imposed ban from buying anything but ramen noodles. (And beer).


Yep, the family guys probably deal with this kind of stuff all the time. I got told a month ago that my car was leaking coolant from the head gasket ( say it ain't so Joe :bluefrown: ) . I was hoping it was just a leaking hose. If I do the repair it will cost about $1300 and likely another $200 for a rent-a-car while the car is being worked on. I'm still thinking about that as my car is 13 yrs old and has 98K miles on it. Not sure I'm willing to invest that much money in my old car. I'd buy a newer car but the timing and available money is all wrong right now. I've got too much **** happening right now that I have to take care of and only so much money to go around to fix all of it. Don't think I've ever dealt with a such a money draining crap-storm before.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Ituo xp3 is expected to arrive in the U.S. Early next week. I better get mine before MRMOLE! Very excited for this one as it clicks all my boxes for a great light. Gonna pair it up with my refurb gloworm xs for close to 5000lumens out the front door! $185 presale is a great price.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> Very excited .


Me Too! Big group night-ride (usually 150+ riders) next Sat. that I hope to try the light out on. Glad they got the shipping/packaging issues worked out on the XP2 so there's no additional shipping delays. Do you know if they ever got more "Wide Spot" optics in? Those optics work even better in my XP2 than they did in the Wiz20. Think they should more appropriately (and politically correctly) be called "Plus sized" spot optics for their excellent beam width which should be even better in a XP3. By this time next week the wait should be over!
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

That's cool the 25d work so good in the xp2. I had emailed Keith at Ituo yesterday to install the 25d optics in my xp3 and to check on stock status of the xp3. Looks like 25d stock is a lil thin so idk. Waitin on another shipment apparently.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*CAtman on board with the XP3*

*Just ordered the XP3 ( lamp head only ).* My T.V. is in the shop and should only cost ~$200 to fix ( knock on wood ). That's better than the $500 to $600 for a new TV I thought I might need so I figured I could afford a new light since I would of been spending the money anyway. I will of course be using the XP3 primarily as a helmet lamp ( at least that's my plan ). I'm gonna miss the Gemini wireless remote lamps but when Gloworm comes out with _their_ wireless lamps I'll likely pick-up an XS and move the XP3 to the bars. If things go good with both lamps likely they will be the last lamps I will ever *need to buy. ( *comic disclaimer: Not needing something and buying it anyway is still an option.  )


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

XP3 preorder prices are gone off the Ituo website. Hope that means the lights are in.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Good news for us that preordered....


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Confirmed, Lights are in-stock!
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> Confirmed, Lights are in-stock!
> Mole


Wow! Looks like I got in under the gun. Anyone know where these are going to be shipped from? The Paypal address was for someone in the USA I think. Anyway, I'll be checking my e-mail to see when it all ships. ( assuming they will email us when they start shipping ).

Just wondering: Is there going to be a discount code for the MTBR members? If so that would be nice, even if it was only for a month or so.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Continued from my last post; Whoa! Just got an e-mail from ITUO. Shipment is on the way! With luck I may get it by this weekend. ( damn, already told boss I'd work Saturday... ). Can't wait to see how the ITUO stuff compares to the other lamps I have.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yep mine shipped this am. Getting pumped for this one.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

My guess is the preorder discount was it. Remember were dealing with an actual brand like gemini and glowworm. I've never seen a discount code for any brand, just sales on older models and such.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Btw, I was going through my videos and found I did get some video when I was running this by itself on the group ride.

This is a big reason that neutral white emitters are 1000x better than cool white. Humidity that night was around 90% in the woods and temps in the mid 80s. Unlike cool white where I'd be getting a TON of glare off of everything including the air, everything looked natural.

I'll get segments pieced together and hopefully get good mix out of what part of the ride i did record. Should have just left it running the entire ride 






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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Judging by my XP2 shipping experience (to Arizona) of a couple of weeks ago we should have our lights by the weekend.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Got an expected delivery date for my xp3, 7/29. and I'll be home this wknd! Tigris, ya should have passed that fat bike so we could get some solo footage! Looks like a fun ride.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I took up the rear for the first part, with the other sweeper behind me. After a bit I did jump ahead of a few riders so I could blast for a bit. But that was the last bit of the return side of the loop. I wasn't in a big hurry. Was hot as ****. And half our group had never ridden trails at night.

There should be something in some of the segments I have where I let the fat bike get ahead so I could carry my desired momentum.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Xp3 is sitting at my local post office and will be delivered today!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> Xp3 is sitting at my local post office and will be delivered today!


 USPS tracking update shows mine arrived at a sorting facility in Phoenix 13 min. ago. Still needs to be sent to my local post office but shows delivery today also. Will make sure my XP2 battery is fully charged so I won't have to wait on that and should get to ride some with it tonight (weather permitting). Cat should be getting his too so I imagine there will be plenty of activity on this thread the next few days.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

XP3 in the house! Initial reaction, Looks sweet. Gloworm or better quality. I have to get to work so no time for a long report. More on it when I get home. I will say that anyone planning to use this on the bars will want at least one wider optic. The lamp definitely has a good dedicated hot spot with the stock optics. Should have killer throw but I'll know more about that by the time I get home tonight. 

Two things I'm not sure I like; Beam tint not as warm as I'd like ( tint similar to Gemini Olympia ). Could be the U3 neutral white doesn't look as warm because it's so bright. I'll have to program a lower output to see how it looks compared to other lamps I have. Second, you have to hold the button down quite long to turn the lamp off. You hold, then it blinks about 2-3 times and then turns off. Damn, I like lamps that turn off real quick. ( Oh crap, I hear thunder outside. Suppose to rain today )


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya they drop into flash mode before shutting off. I mentioned that on the XP series lights that putting the hidden flash after off would be better as flash mode wouldn't be often used by most. The flash mode is programmable though, has a 10% steady mode so at least it doesn't blink at you when you shut it off.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> The flash mode is programmable though, has a 10% steady mode so at least it doesn't blink at you when you shut it off.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Didn't know that, going to get my XP2 and change that right now. Thanks!
Mole


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## alexdi (Jun 25, 2016)

*First-impressions review*

Mine arrived today. My first impression is generally positive.

*Build:*

Claimed weights are almost dead-on. On my scale, this is what I see:

12g Switch (claimed 12g)
34g Helmet Mount (claimed 32g)
45g Bar Mount (claimed 46g)
113g Light Head (claimed 110g)
306g Battery (claimed 296g)

The light head and battery pack feel very solid. The mounts are some sort of shiny black plastic. You can flex them a bit in hand, but they're quite firm on the bike. The fit between the mount and the light head is stiff. Like my Cygolite, it takes care and finger strength to dismount the light without jerking the mount.

*Controls:*

Basic controls are simple enough. I'm still learning how to use and adjust the blinking modes. I'm not fond of the off sequence. It takes over four seconds, half of that inexplicably in a blink mode.

*Mounted: *















The lower bar is a Minoura CS-500. Keeps things centered without a swivel.

*Beam Shots:*

Keyed to the brightest setting of the XP3. (f/7.1, ISO 400, 1/60, 5000K WB)

Black Diamond Storm 2012, high (claimed 90 lumens)








Cygolite Metro 550, low








Cygolite Metro 550, high








Cygolite Metro 550, turbo (measured 600 lumens)








Ituo XP3, low default 








Ituo XP3, med default 








Ituo XP3, high default 








Cygolite Metro 550 high vs. Ituo XP3, low default








*Potential Improvements: *

* The off sequence, as above. It should be max 2 seconds hold to off. 
* The beam pattern. With this many lumens, I'd rather have more flood. As configured, it'd be better on a helmet than a bar.
* The "low" setting isn't low enough for bike path use. I wasn't able to get it any lower than the factory defaults. Based on the Cygolite pattern, it appears to be putting out north of 300 lumens, not the 230 claimed. Hard to say.

I haven't taken it out for a ride yet or tested thermal management and output consistency. Assuming it holds up in this hot Georgia weather, I'd recommend this light even with the quirks above.

Tigris99, do you know which wide-angle lenses are compatible with this unit? Also, how did you program the blink modes? The method in the manual for the steady modes doesn't seem to affect them. (Double-click just returns you to the last steady mode.)


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Good stuff alexdi! Beamshots look great. Get some ride video, and make me happy!
Joking, I'm living vicariously thru yall til I get home to my xp3 Saturday..,


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Actually should just be a double click ONCE IN the hidden flash mode.

There should be a lower output mode in the hidden flash options.

Also low is 10% iirc

Optics are available on their website where you would have ordered the light.

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## alexdi (Jun 25, 2016)

Excellent, I just ordered both sets of replacement lenses. Very reasonable pricing. I'd have bought them from the get-go if I'd thought to look there. 

I may need a walkthrough on the programming. I'm doing a press-and-hold for two seconds. This enters the first blink mode. If I then double-click, I go back to sustained light. It doesn't appear to enter program mode.

I'm also having trouble getting the remote to work. I'll run that one by Ituo. EDIT-- didn't have the connector pushed in hard enough.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Sun going down soon and bike and light are ready. Just going to run stock optics to give her a test run.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Sorry guys, I was wrong it's not a double click. It's simply go into the hidden mode (mode right before off) and select the mode you want. 

I forgot to check about the ultra low mode, but i question whether that's there or not on these. I know it is on the wiz20, assumed it was the same but I may be wrong.


And btw, check the low mode, I think the preset is 20% so may be able to go one step lower. But remember this wasn't designed as an urban light(bike paths, streets etc), it's purpose is as a mountain bike light. Wiz20 is more suited for all around use as it has lower outputs available for such uses while having plenty to be a bar light on the trails.
Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

It figures that I get a new light and as soon as I open the package it starts to rain outside. Then it continued to rain off and on all day. I did get a chance to shine it around some yesterday but of course under less than ideal conditions. Sadly when I tried to simulate the lamp as a helmet light ( by holding it at head height ) there was just too much rain/moisture in the air to be able to judge it's throw. Of course when I held it lower ( as on the bars ) I was getting better results and the lamp appears very impressive.

I'm hoping tomorrow that the weather is more conducive for judging beam patterns. Sadly the weather forecast for the next 3 days is not promising. If I'm lucky perhaps I'll see only spot showers with a lot of dry periods. Those I can deal with. It's the rain that covers a whole area and hangs around all day is what I hate. Crossing my fingers and hoping for the best. 

I got a better chance to compare the beam tint when I got home last night. I'm still not sure but I think if the XP3 were to use at least one flood optic it might look almost as warm as the Gloworm X2 I have that is using NW emitters... ( My Gloworm has one flood optic ) , in which case I might decide the tint to be fine...jury still out on that though. I'm pretty sure though that it will look warmer with wider optics

I do indeed like the beam pattern. With the stock spot optics I'm expecting exceptional throw. Thanks to Tigris for explaining how the programming works. The "off" sequencing is very similar to the Gloworms once you set the flash to "*steady/flash", ( *this is a steady mode with a periodic pulse ). I wish it would turn off faster because I've been spoiled by the "instant off" of the Gemini's ( not to mention the Gemini wireless remotes ). I guess I can live with it though...at least for a while.

I ordered only the Wiz XP3 ( no battery ) so I thought I'd comment about that. The male connector on the XP3 lamp head includes a screw type sleeve behind the plug but surprisingly the connector works very well with my "round " Magicshine/Xeccon/Bikeray/Gemini type ( female ) connectors. Surprisingly the sleeve fits right over the top of the female plug and stays in place almost as though it was actually screwed on. Not as sleek looking as a normal connector but it works fine.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

The tint on my wiz20 Is slightly cooler than my bt21. I noticed it when I was putting the spot optics in the bt21.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Very impressed after first ride with the XP3. Stock optics, bar mounted, presets @ 40/70/100% on my ASU-West loop (24mi., 30/50/20% surface streets/dirt canal banks/flat dirt trails). Slightly narrower than my preference but still adequate beam width for this ride, stock optics provided tons of (GW XS like) throw and should make a very nice setup for helmet use. Way more power than needed and ran lowest setting (40%) most of the time only switching to higher levels when I wanted to see what she would do. Can't wait to try some of the accessory optics I purchased with the light. This is the best performing light I've ever owned.

Also ran the XP3 against my Gloworm XS with my light-meter.

Lux Test @ 2 meters..................bounce................Center-beam (x100)

Ituo XP3.....................................318..........................100

GW XS........................................275...........................96

























Nice looking light too.
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Nice mole. Looks like Ituo is posting some great numbers. That mount looks stout!! Waitin on optics report, your 2 for 2 thus far! 


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> Nice mole. Looks like Ituo is posting some great numbers. *That mount looks stout!!* Waitin on optics report, your 2 for 2 thus far! 


It's a nice mount. GoPro interface swivels allowing horizontal adjustment (although I don't need it on this bike). Vancbiker makes nice stuff. I want to run both XP's through this weekend but next week I think I'll send my XP2 to him to use as a template so he'll be able to make custom fit mounts for the XP Ituo's.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> It's a nice mount. GoPro interface swivels allowing horizontal adjustment (although I don't need it on this bike). Vancbiker makes nice stuff. I want to run both XP's through this weekend but next week I think I'll send my XP2 to him to use as a template so he'll be able to make custom fit mounts for the XP Ituo's.
> Mole


I wish the stock Gopro mount on the XP3 were aluminum ( so an all aluminum mount could be used for optimum heat sinking to the bars. ) The ITUO mount looks like it's made of hard plastic. Nice bike MM BTW.

So far no rain today. Just wish I didn't have to go to work.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

No way I'd want heat sinking to my bars, I run carbon fiber and being the temps lights can see I can't see playing the odds that it's not going effect them. That's also why I like the plastic, something that will break long before damaging my bars in a crash. Full aluminum system if the light takes a hit, chances are I have to spend the money to replace my bars.

That said, truth be told, aluminum system takes on very little heat so it takes a fair amount of time to have any effect but in a hot night running at higher modes the mounts do get hot. Which is why I stopped doing it. I'm already a big guy and even dh/fr bars I wonder how much abuse they'll take at my weight.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> I wish the stock Gopro mount on the XP3 were aluminum ( so an all aluminum mount could be used for optimum heat sinking to the bars. ) The ITUO mount looks like it's made of hard plastic. Nice bike MM BTW.
> 
> So far no rain today. Just wish I didn't have to go to work.


When my mounts come in I'll post pictures. Haven't had a single heat issue with my XP2 so far and of course only 1 ride on the XP3 but good insurance for me. Also I'm dealing with the possibility of rain too (pattern Monsoon Storms) so I'm never sure if I can ride in the evenings plus don't what to get that shinny fat-bike muddy.
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> I'm already a big guy and even dh/fr bars I wonder how much abuse they'll take at my weight.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Good thing you're smart enough to realize that. I've had too many others try to set up their bikes like mine only to experience reliability problems or worse because they weigh 100 lbs. more than I do ( it just doesn't work). So if I offer you a really nice set of light carbon wheels you know you probably did something to piss me off!
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

My bars are the ONLY carbon fiber part on my bikes. And that's cause of the vibration dampening against trail chatter. Takes a lot of shock out of my right wrist and elbow so I'm not in pain after long rides.

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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

MRMOLE said:


> It's a nice mount. GoPro interface swivels allowing horizontal adjustment (although I don't need it on this bike).


I've sold a few to folks for their commuter bikes. They aim their beam a tiny bit to the right as well as down to minimize glare for oncoming traffic.


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

How does this compare in size to the GW xs?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Same size give or take a couple mm

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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I had some chances last night to do some shine-arounds while doing my job. No rain to deal with thankfully but still a lot of humidity and particulate matter hanging in the air. The Wiz XP3 looks like it's getting the job done. At the end of my work day I found a local trail head and quickly jumped out to do a quick shine-around. Whoa!, XP3 has some throw!..and some excellent spill, even with the spot optics. The XP3 really lights up the woods! I set the low mode to the lowest setting and it still has reach! I figure the low mode is still over 200 lumen. Can't wait to actually try it out on some trails. I've got a feeling though that the XP3 is going to take some juice once you crank it up to the higher output levels. Anyway, I've got to work Saturday but hopefully should get a good ride in on Sunday ( if it doesn't rain ).

If all goes good after the initial run-through I might try to install a kill switch somewhere along the power cord. I just have to find a good momentary switch that will do the job. I can't see having my hand on my head pressing a button for more that 3 sec. just to turn the lamp off. 

@tigris and vanc; Not too many people running carbonfiber handlebars that I know of. Would be nice to have an aluminum Gopro mount to replace the little quick release adapter they have mounted on the lamp. Might not really be necessary though. All depends on how hot the lamp gets when on high

Anyone have recommendations on some medium flood optics that will work with the XP3? If I put the P3 on the bars just one good flood optic should add to the spill without losing too much throw. I might be getting ahead of myself though. I might end up liking it just the way it is , bars or helmet. ( hummm...I might have an old Gloworm or BT21 flood optic that might work )

Just had an interesting after-thought; Two Gemini Duos on the helmet Synced with one wireless remote....XP3 on the bars....now THAT would be Hellaciously BRIGHT! ....second after-thought; I wonder if it might be possible for ITUO to create a wireless ( BT ) receiver that plugs into the remote port?? Would that be cool?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Cat, Ituo sells the optics right on the website, it's posted a couple posts back lol . Their a couple bucks each. You can get the same optics from leddna but means you wait month or more to get them.

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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

tigris99 said:


> Cat, Ituo sells the optics right on the website, it's posted a couple posts back lol . Their a couple bucks each. You can get the same optics from leddna but means you wait month or more to get them.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Yeah, I remember someone saying they ordered from the website. ( wish I had thought about that when I ordered.. ) I tried to look it up again and got an older website and they weren't listing anything. I finally got the right website from the link on the first page of this thread. They have all the listings for the products but sadly it seems they are completely out of all of the flood type optics. Could be ITUO under estimated demand. Thanks.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

You probably got the company website for Ituo instead of the US location website. Gets confusing on Google search.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Raining like a beast hope it clears up! Got a 6 cell all charged. Gotta deliver some malt beverage piss water, then homeward bound!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Provided the rain stays away I'm gonna try something different with optics. I gave 2 of the wide spot and put a 45deg in the center. Looks to still have all the throw I need and then some, but smooths the spill out a bit more. See how I like it as I like more spill/wider coverage on the lid.

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Holy ship this looks good! Got the 25d optics factory installed. Thx Keith! Very little size diff between the xp3/gloworm xs. Like a kid at Xmas!!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Rain was a b-itch today. Flash flooding all over the place. I might have to take a drive tomorrow to hill country if I want a ride. That's providing of course that more rain doesn't arrive tomorrow night and threaten to rain again on my parade. Good part is that at least I didn't lose out on a ride today because I had to work anyway. Crossing the fingers for Sunday.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> You probably got the company website for Ituo instead of the US location website. Gets confusing on Google search.


Tidy little site:

https://www.ituolights.com/collections/parts-accessories

I ordered the last Wiz20 package they had. I was going to order through Amazon, but Keith included a set of wide spot optics. Including some additional optics with the XP series would be a nice touch.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I have the 25d optics in, thinking I will install a flood optic in the middle channel. This xp3 is beast mode all the way. Short ride last nite, on the pathways. I think I blinded a couple fishermen. Oops sorry gents! The xp3 kit is well thought out and loving this light.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I just checked the local weather for today and the rest of the week...> :madman:

Seems the monsoon season has arrived. If I get a ride tonight I'll be lucky. 3-5" in the last 72 hrs. depending on where I might choose to ride. :smallviolin: Not looking good the rest of the week either....unless you're a duck


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

Cat-man-do said:


> I just checked the local weather for today and the rest of the week...> :madman:
> 
> Seems the monsoon season has arrived. If I get a ride tonight I'll be lucky. 3-5" in the last 72 hrs. depending on where I might choose to ride. :smallviolin: Not looking good the rest of the week either....unless you're a duck


 Play hooky from work jump on a plain,,,, i can show you all the trails around here, and there are no restrictions to night ride anywhere. Weather is sunny and not to hot.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

I got lucky and had very good weather for the MMP group ride (200+ riders). Unfortunately my diabetes got the best of me last night and after 18 mi., 6 Gu packs, 1 cliff bar and 6 Keibler fudge striped cookies I finally had to stop and just sit for 30 min. just to let my blood sugar come up to normal levels. Decided at that point I didn't have enough food to complete the ride so my friend George and I took a side trail (Bluff) that would get us back to the car in 4 mi. From where we were Bluff is a constant 3-4% downhill grade of smooth/fast/flowy/open trail and while my medical problems eliminated any reliable impressions of the XP3-helmet(stock spots)/XP2-bar(45 degree floods) set-up I was running the final 4 mi. of clarity proved to be fun and enlightening. XP3 is a fantastic helmet light!!! Trail conditions allowed speeds in the 20's and running the XP3 @ 70% I wasn't even coming close to out running the light. It wasn't just the throw but the very wide spot provided allowed for excellent trail awareness. Wish I wasn't so F/U'd for most of the ride but I still had fun, especially those last 4 mi.
Mole


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

I've gutted out rides & hikes on an empty stomach and didn't enjoy it; having to consult a glucometer sounds far worse. Glad you made the safe call, and had a friend along, too. If you do much solo riding out of cell coverage and think that might be a recurring problem, a PLB or SEND unit might be worth having.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Glad ya made it back MRMOLE! Don't be scratching my nice fatbike. It's a beaut!!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

flat said:


> I've gutted out rides & hikes on an empty stomach and didn't enjoy it; having to consult a glucometer sounds far worse. .


It's amazing what can you get used to. Luckily it doesn't happen too often. Thanks for your concern.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I've got the XP3 set up on the helmet ready go. Not sure where I'll ride because by the time it gets dark something is bound to pop-up. A slight shower came through an hour ago. Not much precip. ( 0.02" ), just enough to make things damp. I might have to keep things local so I can bail out if a storm comes my way. No telling though what trail conditions I'll see with the two inches we got yesterday. Regardless, I's GOT TO RIDE! 

XP3 feels good on the lid. The button on the lamp is positioned perfectly for easy access ( if you're a righty ) Lefties might not be as pleased. 

The Gopro adjustment knob/slots is kind'a tight. I was thinking some lube could help. Any recommendations on what kind of lube to use. I don't want something that will eat the plastic parts of the Gopro mount.

@MMole; I feel your pain. I've bonked terribly on some longer rides before. I can only imagine how bad a "diabetes induced" bonk can be ( not to mention how dangerous ). At least you weren't alone. When you're alone and bad stuff happens it can be REAL scary.


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

MRMOLE said:


> I got lucky and had very good weather for the MMP group ride (200+ riders). Unfortunately my diabetes got the best of me last night and after 18 mi., 6 Gu packs, 1 cliff bar and 6 Keibler fudge striped cookies I finally had to stop and just sit for 30 min. just to let my blood sugar come up to normal levels. Decided at that point I didn't have enough food to complete the ride so my friend George and I took a side trail (Bluff) that would get us back to the car in 4 mi. From where we were Bluff is a constant 3-4% downhill grade of smooth/fast/flowy/open trail and while my medical problems eliminated any reliable impressions of the XP3-helmet(stock spots)/XP2-bar(45 degree floods) set-up I was running the final 4 mi. of clarity proved to be fun and enlightening. XP3 is a fantastic helmet light!!! Trail conditions allowed speeds in the 20's and running the XP3 @ 70% I wasn't even coming close to out running the light. It wasn't just the throw but the very wide spot provided allowed for excellent trail awareness. Wish I wasn't so F/U'd for most of the ride but I still had fun, especially those last 4 mi.
> Mole


 Anyone who has had a true bonk can maybe start to imagine what you must have gone through. Glad you made it out ok and enjoyed those last few miles. The XP3 is really sounding as good as eveyone had hoped.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Mine is ready on the lid.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Got a ride in tonight. Good news/Bad news. Good news is that the XP3 is an awesome light. My apologies for saying I didn't like the tint earlier. The tint seems fine once the beam gets some space to do it's thing. No complaints on tint. Beam pattern is perfect for helmet use. This could just very well be the most usable lamp I have but I'll wait till after I get some better rides in before I start saying anything like that. 

The Bad news; The trails near me are in dire straits right now. The storm system that came through my area a couple days ago did way more trail damage than I could have imagined. The damage was almost akin to what happens when a hurricane comes through the area. ( thankfully we don't get many of those ). Sections of trail completely washed out by the flash flooding. Stream crossings that used to be easily rideable are now unrideable. After just 10 minutes into the ride I decided to cut it short and go back to the car. Nope, going to be a while before I get to ride the local trails again. Hopefully the local bike clubs will get together to do some fixes. I can only imagine what my regular trail ride is going to look like the next time I see it since it has a lot of hills and a lot of places where water can wash/erode things to the point of creating massive gaps. Not going to help that it is calling for rain almost everyday next week. At least I did get a chance to see the XP3 in action on the trails but not the way that I wanted to ( and not for very long.. )


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

To anyone who has bar mounted the XP3,,,,,are there any issues with the wired remote length for those with wider bars??


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

No, was mentioned either earlier here or in the xp2 thread. There is plenty of reach on the switch wire for about any bar width.

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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

Ok thanx tigris.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

No problem, I should have mentioned it here (I can't find it here at all) too. That's one nice thing is I have 740mm bars and I could go a fair bit wider and have the wire still be long enough. I could almost see some that still run really narrow bars complaining about it because of the length.

@ Cat:. Man sorry to hear about your trails, thats pretty bad. Somehow most of the bad stuff that gets to you seems to narrowly miss me. Usually by 50 miles to the north or south, then a day or 2 later you get it.

Btw also seems they saw your mention of a discount for a bit longer. Price isnt as low as original preorder but still a pretty solid discount I think. And seems they extended it to the xp2 as well:
https://www.ituolights.com/collections/mtb-light-kits

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Last night, midfat instead of my cx bike (I spend way too much time on cx). Had to branch off into some tight single track. Used low/med. This xp3 kicks azz on the lid. Keeps a very low profile with the helmet mount (put mine as forward as possible for branch clearance). The team involved with the xp3 development should be proud of this light. It's my new favorite along with the mighty gloworm xs. A wash between the 2 in my opinion, both are super powerful and quality units.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

indebt said:


> To anyone who has bar mounted the XP3,,,,,are there any issues with the wired remote length for those with wider bars??


Here's a picture I posted in the XP2 thread compared to a (long wire version) Gloworm.
Mole


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

It's very impressive how many things Ituo got right on these two new lights, clearly they have done research on what most of us look for in a good light, and to have executed it this well on their first production run,, wow!!

A friend of mine works for Canada post, so i'm trying to get the inside scoop to whats happening with the pending strike. If there is a window of two weeks of safety, i may order these ASAP.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

indebt said:


> It's very impressive how many things Ituo got right on these two new lights, clearly they have done research on what most of us look for in a good light, and to have executed it this well on their first production run,, wow!!
> 
> A friend of mine works for Canada post, so i'm trying to get the inside scoop to whats happening with the pending strike. If there is a window of two weeks of safety, i may order these ASAP.


Can you do the border two-step and pick up one from the U.S. distributor?

https://www.ituolights.com/collections/mtb-light-kits


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

flat said:


> Can you do the border two-step and pick up one from the U.S. distributor?
> 
> https://www.ituolights.com/collections/mtb-light-kits


 Of coarse anything is possible, but considering i live a five hour round trip just to get to the border and about $50 in gas, it's not at the top of my list as these four sets of lights are not for me.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Damn, I'm about to get a union job in the U.S. Just interviewed, hate the word strike.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

indebt said:


> Of coarse anything is possible, but considering i live a five hour round trip just to get to the border and about $50 in gas, it's not at the top of my list as these four sets of lights are not for me.


Oh well. Didn't know if you lived near the line. 
I'd avoid the southern border, too.


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

indebt said:


> It's very impressive how many things Ituo got right on these two new lights, clearly they have done research on what most of us look for in a good light, and to have executed it this well on their first production run,, wow!!
> 
> A friend of mine works for Canada post, so i'm trying to get the inside scoop to whats happening with the pending strike. If there is a window of two weeks of safety, i may order these ASAP.


Will Ituo sell directly to us Canadians or do we have to go through the Canadian distributor?


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

arc said:


> Will Ituo sell directly to us Canadians or do we have to go through the Canadian distributor?


 I'm unaware of a Canadian distributor? I believe the only option is to order from Ituo US using USPS and then Canada post takes over from there.

Yes there is a Canadian distributor K9 Outdoor Sports & Fat Bike Shop , but their website only shows Light & Motion.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

The US location ships world wide I know that much (people were asking before about it, think in the wiz20 thread).

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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

arc said:


> Will Ituo sell directly to us Canadians or do we have to go through the Canadian distributor?


Try contacting Keith - https://www.ituolights.com/pages/dealer

My order shipped the next business day, so he appears to be on top of things. My guess is he'll have some ideas on how best to get lights to Canada.


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

flat said:


> Try contacting Keith - https://www.ituolights.com/pages/dealer
> 
> My order shipped the next business day, so he appears to be on top of things. My guess is he'll have some ideas on how best to get lights to Canada.


 Just keep in mind that if not using USPS/Canada Post,,, and going the courier route your almost guarantied large duty fees and taxes on top of the exchange rate. Cost of the lights will be 50% higher when all is said and done. USPS/Canada Post not very often that i get stung.


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## arc (Sep 9, 2004)

indebt said:


> I'm unaware of a Canadian distributor? I believe the only option is to order from Ituo US using USPS and then Canada post takes over from there.
> 
> Yes there is a Canadian distributor K9 Outdoor Sports & Fat Bike Shop , but their website only shows Light & Motion.


They had the Wiz 1 and 2 without batteries listed back in the spring, the price seemed pretty decent for this side of the border.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*First good ride with the Wiz XP3*

The hardest thing I had to do tonight was to decided "where" to ride. With much of the local trail systems near me in disarray from the massive flash flood that occurred several days ago I didn't want to go out and end up doing a lot of hike-a-bike/portaging over debris strewn trails. Not wanting to ride the trail I usually ride on weekends, I decided ( with a late start ) to ride a trail near my usual trail that I hadn't rode in a number of years.

Turns out it was a good choice. For one the hills were more moderate and there were long stretches of straight trail where I could really see how much distance throw the XP3 had.

First thing I noticed was how well the Wiz XP3 was doing in combo with the Gloworm X2 ( NW ) that I have on my bars. The beam tints seem to match completely. Right now I have the XP3 low mode set on the lowest possible setting. It amazed me that even on the lowest possible mode the lamp is quite bright and provides good throw. The mid and high modes I let stand at the standard default settings. The trail I was riding while quite nice still had a lot of loose rock in places which meant I had to keep my speed in check. The fact that I hadn't ridden the trail in some years also meant that I had no idea what was going to be around every turn. The XP3 was getting the job of letting me know what was coming up done very well.

Sadly and unexpectedly, midway into the ride I had to cut the ride short. Seems I had an unexpected visit from _"The Dreaded Mid-ride *Super Bonk". _ In this case I think it was because my sleep patterns had gone awry which in turn caused my energy levels to take a sudden nose dive at a time when usually I'm full of "get-up-and-go". Also didn't help that I was getting a late start. Dang it I hate when stuff like that happens. 

As I was returning to the car I even had to walk up a hill ( on a paved road ) that I usually just pedal up without a problem. Very embarrassing. My fault for staying up so late the previous night I guess and not eating till I was almost ready to leave the house. Anyway, it had me worried for a moment but by the time I was halfway back to the car the "Super bonk" effect had faded to "basic bonk" and I returned without any more problems.

(* to those who don't know what I mean by Super bonk; it's a bonk where you feel so tired you almost feel like you can't stand up. Very scary when you're alone back in the woods at night. )

Well, the Super Bonk took the joy out of the ride but at least I got the ride in ( not to mention that the rain stayed away ). The XP3 continues to impress me. Only two things keep this from being the perfect lamp. I wish it had a "wireless" remote and second, I wish turning the lamp off was more easier/faster. The current, "press/hold for 3-4 seconds while the lamp flashes, is a PITA. Even the Gloworms, which I also complain about for the same reason are faster/easier to turn off. Whatever the makers of the Wiz do for next year they need to fix that issue ASAP. _( A simple, press/hold one sec ( no flashes ) should **instantly turn the lamp off...**like what the Gemini lamps do. )_


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> Only two things keep this from being the perfect lamp. I wish it had a "wireless" remote and second, I wish turning the lamp off was more easier/faster. The current, "press/hold for 3-4 seconds while the lamp flashes, is a PITA. [/U]. )[/I]


Never used a wireless remote so I don't know what I'm missing but I'm sure I'd like it. Good thing you don't own a Wiz20 or you'd be even more irritated by the turn off procedure. Still press and hold but 1 sec. to dim (no flash) and 2 sec to total off. Hope your next ride is bonk free.
Mole


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

Cat-man-do said:


> First thing I noticed was how well the Wiz XP3 was doing in combo with the Gloworm X2 ( NW ) that I have on my bars. The beam tints seem to match completely.


I was happy to see that my Wiz20 and Light & Motion LEDs match well, too. I take that as another sign that Ituo is doing it right.

Question about the Bonk & Super Bonk. Where do shaky hands fall between the two? I want to make sure I'm using the terms correctly.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Seems like Mother Nature has not been kind to those of us trying to get some mileage using our new XP3's. Monsoon Storms or the treat of a storm every night has kept me off the trails more than usual. Tonight was no different but predicted arrival not till approx. 2 am. so I thought I'd give it a try with a local Wednesday group night ride. 2 miles into the trail it started to sprinkle (approx. 8:30 pm.). Everyone else had driven to the trail head and decided to continue on, I had 17 mi. to go if I backtracked which is what I decided to do. Light rain till I got away from the mountains but luckily dry for the last 12 mi. home (I didn't appreciate the 20 mph headwind thought!). Guess I'll find out tomorrow how everyone else fared on the trails.

So how did the XP3 do? This turned out to be a good reminder of how neutral-white emitters work. Not too impressed riding with the group and all those cool-white lights. When I backtracked by myself I could see so much better. This trail is a lot slower and snakes in and out of brush. XP3 worked just as effective as it did on the fast trails of its initial mountain outing. Lots of things for the light to reflect off of but not a problem with these emitters. I'm very satisfied so far. Look forward to more posts by other owners as they get more mileage with their XP3's.
Mole


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

Geez, you and Cat have been having quite the time dealing with weather and your body's failing you lately. I feel for both of you. Once again it's nice to hear just how much people are liking the neutral emitters. A couple years ago i thought ( who cares lol) light is light!! was i ever wrong. Listening to you guys and swapping over my led boards to 4900K tint was one of the best upgrades i have ever done. Even more important now as the ouputs of the good lights are very strong.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

indebt said:


> Geez, you and Cat have been having quite the time dealing with weather and your body's failing you lately. I feel for both of you. Once again it's nice to hear just how much people are liking the neutral emitters. A couple years ago i thought ( who cares lol) light is light!! was i ever wrong. Listening to you guys and swapping over my led boards to 4900K tint was one of the best upgrades i have ever done. Even more important now as the ouputs of the good lights are very strong.


Yep, and now it's my turn again for crappy weather. Yesterday was record heat. ( the heat index was near 113°F ) Nevertheless I likely would have tried for a ride but I had an important errand to run. Today a thunderstorm hit the area just as the sun was setting. , otherwise I would of tried for a ride. Tomorrow could end up being the same. Even if it doesn't rain it will be as hot as the dickens. Actually I'm looking forward to the heat. I want to test out the vancbiker Gopro mount for my Duo but I'm also looking for a second chance to use the XP3.

Once again I have a week off and the weather is looking like I'll be able to fry eggs on my car hood and then get it cleaned by Mother nature the same day ( for the entire week )... :smallviolin:


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya I feel you, was looking forward to some night riding this weekend but got too much rain Thursday night 

Sadly except for taking my son stomping around on his new fat bike (nothing special just a mongoose Logan) all my miles this week have been road... Feel like I'm cheating on my fat and my 29er.

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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

Cat-man-do said:


> Yep, and now it's my turn again for crappy weather. Yesterday was record heat. ( the heat index was near 113°F ) Nevertheless I likely would have tried for a ride but I had an important errand to run. Today a thunderstorm hit the area just as the sun was setting. , otherwise I would of tried for a ride. Tomorrow could end up being the same. Even if it doesn't rain it will be as hot as the dickens. Actually I'm looking forward to the heat. I want to test out the vancbiker Gopro mount for my Duo but I'm also looking for a second chance to use the XP3.
> 
> Once again I have a week off and the weather is looking like I'll be able to fry eggs on my car hood and then get it cleaned by Mother nature the same day ( for the entire week )... :smallviolin:


 Hopefully the weather works out and all you have to deal with is some heat and the down pour from the thunder storms is minimal. Getting dark a bit before 9pm now so some night rides are on my radar too (cant wait!!)

Will be interesting to get your feedback on Vancbiker's heat sync. Cheers!!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I sure did have the crappy weather blues this week. rft: Finally got my first ride of the week in today. ( Yea! ) XP3 continues to impress. The weather is finally a bit cooler but the humidity is still up in the 90% range. I thought about taking a chance for a ride last night but because the last rain was near 1" and less than 24hrs I decided to wait till the next day. Glad I did. The trail I rode was the same as the last time I rode and once again it was in pretty good shape. Thankfully no bonking. SuperCAt was back to his normal white knuckle/Bone-jarring/Claw-climbing self. :cornut: Damn, days are getting shorter. Getting dark now around 8:00pm.

I noticed tonight that the XP3 does get quite warm especially if you're using the high mode and not moving very fast. It's no "branding iron" but it does get hot. Then again I'm only using the high mode for minutes at a time. No problems though. The XP3 is working wonderfully as a helmet light.

Once again really cool riding during a full moon. When I was leaving the trail head and riding back to the car, I noticed as I was riding down the road the moon was casting some very strong shadows from the trees I was passing. Suddenly out of nowhere from the past an old song I haven't heard in years hauntingly came into my mind. I sang a little of it as I made my way back to the car.

Hoping for another ride tomorrow night. I'd like to ride some faster trails but to get those I have to travel. No rain in the forecast, just need to decide where to go.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*XP3 ride ( continued from my Duo review thread )*

The second half of my ride tonight was with the XP3. Previously I had the Gemini Duo with vancbiker Gopro adaptor on the lid for it's first test. ( see my Duo review thread ). At the halfway point of the ride I stopped to not only switch lamps but to rest. Seems I was a little winded and beat-up from all the juking over all the ruts and storm debris from last weeks storm._ Thankfully I pulled out my 1960's "Hercules Power Ring" hoping to get a boost of energy to get me though the night. Damn, I held it high in the air just like the cartoon Hercules of the 60's but sadly no lightning or thunder arrived to power the ring._..:incazzato:...curses, foiled again. ...no problem, I made due with a couple GU packs and that got me going again. ...Anyway...

The moment I switched to the XP3 there was a remarkable difference in how much of the trail I was able to see. I'm not just talking output wise. Sure, the XP3 blows the duel emitter Duo out of the water with it's brighter output. That's pretty much expected. Nope, the difference in the warmer emitter tint of the XP3 makes almost as much difference as the added output. Together, they blow the Duo's away.

Tonight was tough going because I was dealing with a lot of trail debris from last week's flash flood in the area I was riding. The Duo, while doing a pretty good job at distance was having problems giving me the trail details I needed to see when close up. The Duo emitters are still a bit too cool for my liking. ( I will at some point send it to ActionLED for the warmer retro-fit ).

With the XP3 on the lid I had much more confidence to use more speed. When I hit the final downhill I used high all the way back to the trail head. Once again, I will reiterate, the XP3 does indeed get hot ( when used on high ). When I got to the trail head I reached up on the helmet to turn the lamp off. The lamp was hot enough to be uncomfortable to touch. Because the "off sequence" is a bit long you have to hold the button down more than a couple seconds. More than enough time to get your fingers burned if holding the lamp the wrong way**. Once I detected how hot it was I let go of the lamp and just used one finger to push the button down.

Anyway, the throw of the XP3 continues to impress me. On the trail I shone the lamp out over a long open area and boy did it light things up. I have a feeling this will be my "go to" helmet lamp for quite a while.

(**if using the remote you obviously don't have to worry about holding the lamp and getting burned. Using the remote on the XP3 is always an option )


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Waiting on a review of the vanc mount forthcoming.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

Cat-man-do said:


> The second half of my ride tonight was with the XP3. Previously I had the Gemini Duo with vancbiker Gopro adaptor on the lid for it's first test. ( see my Duo review thread ). At the halfway point of the ride I stopped to not only switch lamps but to rest. Seems I was a little winded and beat-up from all the juking over all the ruts and storm debris from last weeks storm._ Thankfully I pulled out my 1960's "Hercules Power Ring" hoping to get a boost of energy to get me though the night. Damn, I held it high in the air just like the cartoon Hercules of the 60's but sadly no lightning or thunder arrived to power the ring._..:incazzato:...curses, foiled again. ...no problem, I made due with a couple GU packs and that got me going again. ...Anyway...
> 
> The moment I switched to the XP3 there was a remarkable difference in how much of the trail I was able to see. I'm not just talking output wise. Sure, the XP3 blows the duel emitter Duo out of the water with it's brighter output. That's pretty much expected. Nope, the difference in the warmer emitter tint of the XP3 makes almost as much difference as the added output. Together, they blow the Duo's away.
> 
> ...


Power rings aside , are you using a bar light with the XP3?

I know some people will always want more light, but from the reviews, it seems the output of a pair of XP3s may be reaching the limit WRT actual useful light. Does that seem to be true?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

For me high on dual triples is too much. Floodier optics on the bar light makes it so much better. Well for me it's almost total flood. Very slight, large spot is noticeable on open ground.

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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

Neat. I hope we see the market put more effort into efficiency, battery endurance, and features. I know there will always be a market for lights that can be seen from space, but having 2000 - 3000 lumens in a smaller/lighter package, with better controls, that will run for six hours sounds like a more useful goal.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Well those things are limited by LED and battery technology. Nothing to do with light manufactures. The run times can be achieved but the packs are huge. 

Other problem is the average user, stick it on high and leave it there from the time they get to the trail head till they get back. Which makes high lumen bit small heads impossible because people complain that a light steps down all the time then or the life of the light is reduced.

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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

flat said:


> Power rings aside , are you using a bar light with the XP3?
> 
> I know some people will always want more light, but from the reviews, it seems the output of a pair of XP3s may be reaching the limit WRT actual useful light. Does that seem to be true?


Well...depends on the opinion of the user. I'm satisfied with my Gloworm X2 ( with neutral white emitters ) on the bars. It's using one spot and one standard flood optic. It works very well in combo with the XP3 ( using three standard spots ) on the helmet. Anyway that is my "go to" bar light at the moment. By next year Gloworm and possibly ITUO will be offering lamps with "Wireless remotes". When that happens I will almost have to have a lamp with wireless remote for the helmet. I got spoiled using wireless remotes while testing the Gemini light sets.

Anyway, if that happens the XP3 will likely end up replacing the GWX2 on the bars ( maybe ). Gloworm should end up with a wireless remote version of the XS and I might consider one of those for the helmet. I'm also hoping that ITUO will follow suit and go wireless remote as well with their new XP4. Never know though what might be announced and what new options will be available when the new season arrives.

On a side note; I need to compare the Gemini Olympia to the XP3. I'll be doing that on my next ride. Wish that were tonight but rain is in the area. The storm is almost past and the rainfall was minimal....maybe if I see some drying...

A second side note: the vancbiker Gopro adapter used on the Duo also seems to work on the Olympia...although on the Olympia there is not as much surface contact with the adapter as with the Duo. It will work though for the time being.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> Well those things are limited by LED and battery technology. Nothing to do with light manufactures. The run times can be achieved but the packs are huge.
> 
> Other problem is the average user, stick it on high and leave it there from the time they get to the trail head till they get back. Which makes high lumen bit small heads impossible because people complain that a light steps down all the time then or the life of the light is reduced.


Sure. I know the technology has been the limiting factor to a certain extent.

My point is that rather than seeing manufacturers trying to one-up each other on lumens, I hope they'll put more effort into producing more efficient lights. If so, heat issues could decrease, battery endurance could go up, and/or battery size could decrease. Those design goals seem more important to me than producing an affordable 8000 lumen light with the same heat and battery performance that's currently available.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

That's the thing though, the efficiency your talking about is tech limited. 90%+ driver efficiency already exists in the better lights. Nothing more to gain there. It comes down the the LEDs now. The heat they generate, the wattage requirement per lumen etc is the limiting factor.

Even the best of the best can't do more than 1-2% more efficient systems than we are starting to see with Ituo which has at least on the xp2, hit the max efficiency achievable for a driver at these price points. And that's only a few percent better than 2015 glowworm.

The most efficient driver I've seen available has been ~93% avg across a battery cycle and those are expensive, custom drivers.

So we are still waiting for a system that works better. Either lower wattage LEDs, some new electronics tech or the next best thing in rechargeable batteries.

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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Cat-man-do said:


> ......A second side note: the vancbiker Gopro adapter used on the Duo also seems to work on the Olympia...although on the Olympia there is not as much surface contact with the adapter as with the Duo. It will work though for the time being.


I want to warn future readers of this ^. There are two styles of Olympia housing. One will work with a Duo adapter, and the other will not due to there being a step in the mounting surface. I make a finned adapter modified to fit the stepped housing Olympia.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> That's the thing though, the efficiency your talking about is tech limited. 90%+ driver efficiency already exists in the better lights. Nothing more to gain there. It comes down the the LEDs now. The heat they generate, the wattage requirement per lumen etc is the limiting factor.
> 
> Even the best of the best can't do more than 1-2% more efficient systems than we are starting to see with Ituo which has at least on the xp2, hit the max efficiency achievable for a driver at these price points. And that's only a few percent better than 2015 glowworm.
> 
> ...


I'm theorizing about future developments, not currently shipping products.

I'm hoping that there will be less of a demand for even brighter lights with similar heat, weight, and battery characteristics of lights like the XP3. I'd rather see light output stabilize, with an emphasis on battery endurance, system weight, features, and cost. In the future.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I'd vote CMD sonnet or laterar$ hit San there


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Flat

I get where your going, here is what holds as constant:

Lumens vs cost have improved leaps and bounds over the years. 

Batteries, better means higher costs. Either better batteries or trying to maximize driver efficiency. 

Features adds costs

System weight is proportional to the requirements of the light design. Surface area is needed regardless. Batteries are a "fixed" weight. There is a small range of variation. 18650 cells maintain one rule right now, more capacity, the heavier the cell.

Beam patterns have specific requirements. Optic diameter being the main one. So size is limited.

BUT HERE IS SOMETHING YOU MIGHT LIKE:

There is a way around some of this. As we have discussed on so many occasions here. More LEDs combined to create the same number of lumens is more efficient.

Now my numbers aren't EXACT so don't take it as fact, it's JUST FOR EXAMPLE EXPLAINATION ONLY.

1 xm-l2 to create 1000 lumens out the front (OTF after losses)= 3A drive current @ 3.0 volts. So 9 watts

2 xm-l2 to create 1000 lumens mean 500 each OTF. But instead of requiring the same 9 watts, the power requirement is only 8 watts.

Or the other way, 9 watts to a single xm-l2 = 1000 lumens, 9 watts to 2 xm-l2 = 1100 lumens. 9 watts to 3 xm-l2 = 1300 lumens.

So you can increase runtime for the same lumen output number by increasing the number of emitters used. Also since the emitters are running more efficiently, less surface area for cooling is needed. So size and weight theoretically can be reduced to that of what the next lower count of emitters is.

But you run into the beam pattern issue. Optic size is rather fixed. To create the throw people want, for the most part you can't go below a 20mm optic. But there is a exception to this, more later 

Trade off is price remains or slightly increases because of machining work and the extra emitter(s) used.

Now that said, the optic "block" of size. This is where led tech is moving right now. More output from smaller die emitters. The smaller the emitter, the smaller the optic can be to create the same beam pattern. Output levels aren't able to match xm-l2 which is why you rarely see anything different.

Now if the market demand mattering only about lumen number would chill out, then a whole new world can open up. Some riders will need the insane lumens like the xp3 and xp4 (don't be fooled by all these people that don't understand) the only need for that much output is areas where you can get up to really high speeds and have the open ground (think desert, mountains, downhill courses type open ground and speed). But the up side is these high max lumen lights will produce what most of use want for lumens with increased run time and sharp decrease in head temperatures.

Other thing being the "better the product, the more people will pay" rules of economics. So people have no issues paying big bucks. And also the bragging rights of using said brands.

Ituo is one that is trying to bridge the gap though. Quality and the rest of the list at more respectable pricing. 

Oh and I keep seeing mentions of wireless remotes, I was told a couple months ago they are working on it, but they are going at it carefully because they want to do something reliable but a bit different than we see normally. So probably won't see it till winter or so is my guess.

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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> Flat
> 
> I get where your going, here is what holds as constant:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the State of the Market Report. :thumbsup:


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya was long winded, but I spend so much time learning about these lights and sorting out why they cost so much, figured I'd share that and the "limitations" faced when making a light.

I've made one prototype myself with another FINALLY in the works. Had all the electronics laying here for months, havent touched the projects though. Since I don't have a proper mill or CNC, I use a drill press that I modded for the job and my Dremel. Not the cleanest looking when finished but played with some odd design ideas. Biggest one now is trying to get my preferred lumens and beam pattern (thankfully I'm not all about laser beam lvl throw) while making the head as small as possible. So XP-L HI with ledil optics. Triple for that then a quad Nichia 219c set up with Carclo 10mm class optics. Whenever I get time to work on then again

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OK played with this light first on the lid with my xp2 then on the bars (changed optics) with xp4 on the lid.

Xp3 for helmet light all the way. Though I think dual isn't overkill at all. Only because programming down the modes to what you like has the lights running much more efficiently to generate the same lumens as is max in smaller lights. 

I knew more LEDs to produce a set amount of lumens was better but this just confirms it. A dual set up will yield better run times to run at 1500 lumens each than doing it with a couple dual emitter lights.

But also why I like my xp2 on the bars, don't like a lot of output there. I like it on the lid. Bar light covers in close and adds spill.

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## bluesaint (Jun 22, 2005)

Liking NF BT70 on Bars and XP3 helm.

@tigris99 does XP4 provide better throw and lumens than BT70? curious.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Got these Vancbiker GoPro mounts in the mail today. Haven't ridden with them yet but should have plenty of opportunities with the next 6 days off work.

























Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)




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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I'm in for one definitely. Cooler running, and low pro. Nice work.


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

That is definitely a nice setup with Vancbiker's mount MRMOLE . I think it's crazy how well they work though, it makes me think that the design of the lighthead isn't quite good enough. An 11 degree drop is pretty big in my opinion. Just having a couple of fins in the direction of the wind must make all the difference.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Well we see this with most light heads. Any light as long as it's within its designed operating temps is fine. LEDs themselves are meant to run 10000 hrs at 85C. ALOT hotter than these light heads ever see.

Doesn't matter the light, the more surface area you add, the cooler it's going to run. The trick is having enough surface area while keeping the size and weight low.

Mole does have the hard core temperature testing though as he sees higher temps than pretty much any of us. So the benefits he's sees from every little bit are greater than like what I would see.

As you said, adding fins in the direction of air flow will have greater results than cross air flow. Inline fin design is more difficult to achieve though just do to space limitations. I can bet in time we will see lights that have fins going in the direction of air flow to allow the higher outputs to come out of lighter, maybe even smaller light heads.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Got to do a "hard-core" temp. test ride last night of the XP3 w/Vancbiker mount. Learned the previous night that the mount works slightly better in the higher LoPro position (better airflow). Nice ride that included a 2+ mi. canal section where I could run 20,000 lumens and not offend anyone. By the end of that section the light had dimmed noticeably (20% est.) so the estimated 100 degree ride temp was enough for the thermal protection to notice even with the vancbiker mount. Very acceptable results considering I noted that the XP3 would activate its thermal protection @ about 130 degrees from the previous nights indoor bench testing. The only light I could say for sure I own that would handle the heat better are the XP2 and my hot weather champ Wiz20. I have a few other lights that may not be effected in these conditions but they all produce a lot fewer lumens and have thermal protection thresholds set @ 150 degrees (case temp.). As usual :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: for the usefulness of the vancbiker mounts with this light.
Mole


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## varider (Nov 29, 2012)

If your handlebar is made of metal, then your entire bike would act like a heat sink. That might be as significant of an effect as the air moving over the fins in order cool the light.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Now seeing that mount from Vanc, I want one.

Thanks for the update Mole!

I got a sweet ride in tonight. Did realize that the 25deg optics (all 3 installed) was a bit much for me. The trails I got to add to my options (and I'll be riding the hell out of, it's may favorite trails set these days) I need a bit more punch if I'm going to ride with a light like the xp4. Going to try xp2 on the bars next round see if things balance out better where I like them.

I'm definitely glad I went this light for my helmet now though, works better for me that way. More output on the lid is just nice lol.

I'll share some video when I get back from Missouri next week.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Now seeing that mount from Vanc, I want one.
> 
> Thanks for the update Mole!
> 
> ...


The more I night-ride the more I realize the perfect light setup depends on what trail I'm riding on. So far though the XP3 seem to be my favorite helmet unit no matter where I've taken it (Love this light).
Look forward to the new video.
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

bluesaint said:


> Liking NF BT70 on Bars and XP3 helm.
> 
> @tigris99 does XP4 provide better throw and lumens than BT70? curious.
> 
> View attachment 1091124


I'm curious about this too. So far I think my BT70 is my favorite match as a bar light used with the XP3 on the helmet. I have the lower power model BT70 though (unfortunately I think Tigris does too) but still would like his (Tigris) opinion on this.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Xp4 is defiantly better. Good bit more throw and substantially more lumens. 

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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I like that full vanc setup. Would eliminate the Ituo mount completely. Looks pricey tho.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

The ituo mount is a bit different to deal with but I like it because it's quick on/off the bike. Though I use the qr lever itself when I need to adjust aim, when mounting I use the finger nut. Probably use some improvements there but we'll see how it goes with updates. I did notice how it can mount at an angle but if you think about it, not a bad idea for those with funky bars (if it was intentional).

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

To put things in perspective the issues with the mount stand out because the rest of the light is sooo good. For most lights sold I would consider this mount an upgrade (Gloworm is the major exception). Now that this has been brought to Ituo's attention I'm sure they will react by giving us an improved mount with less shortcomings!
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Man that bt70 is freakin huge.... It has to outweigh a wiz20 with batteries!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

No its not THAT heavy lol. It's a beast though for how little lumens it puts out.

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## stew325 (Jan 3, 2011)

Glad I found these threads. Just pulled the trigger on an XP2 and XP3 set. I've been through the fiasco with the magic shines. Had the origninals, then replaced the heads with Magic shine light heads that look exactly like the BT40s. Just found the colour to be horrible for me. Everything looks like shades of grey, with not much throw. So can't wait to get the Ituos.
May use the XP3 on helmet and XP2 on bar. Or let my son use the XP2 on his bar and each use the Magic shines on the bars. 

I also found that the batteries (Panasonic recall replacements from Geomangear) haven't had great run times. Maybe 1.5 hrs switching between med and high. But measured voltage from Magic shine chargers at around 10 volts. So not sure if they are permanently damaged?? I won't be using those chargers again. 
Will the Ituo chargers work with those batteries? Pretty sure they are 4 cells, 8.4v.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Another XP3 ride*

Last night I did another ride with the XP3. This time I took the Gemini Olympia-R along so I could do some comparisons. The trail I rode was the one I mentioned before that had had major storm damage. I found out last week ( from the local MTB club ) that there were trails around the damaged areas so I decided to return there to check it all out.

I started the ride with the Olympia on the helmet ( gloworm X2 "neutral white" on bars as usual ). After about 30 minutes of riding through some previously unknown trails I switched over to the XP3. I really missed the wireless remote of the Olympia but other than that the XP3 certainly had the more useful beam pattern ( helmet set-up ...all spot optics ) . Even when just on low, the XP3 has some very useful throw. The beam pattern of the XP3 certainly compliments the GWX2 quite nicely.

Turned out to be a really nice ride. I explored a couple new trails thanks to my GPS app ( thank you OpenstreetCycle map ) which turned out to make my usual ride a little longer. I even got in the extra downhill trail which I had been putting off due to the storms. That trail is known for a lot of technical sections so the XP3 / GWX2 combo got a good workout while moving at speed.

It also turned out to be one of those rides where I was banging on all cylinders. I guess a lot of that had to do with the temps being near 70°F or lower. Once again I finished off the final downhill section in stellar manner with the XP3 giving all the advance warning of obstacles that I needed. I was hoping a train would come by again ( on the other side of the river ) but sadly that didn't happen. I did however clear the technical rock section at the bottom even though one foot came out of a cleat right in the middle of it all. All in all, a good ride. The XP3 continues to impress me. If ITUO comes out with a wireless remote for this lamp I will be on one of those REAL quick.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Wireless would be killer! Good report CMD. Mine is waitin on the vanc mount as soon as available.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I know their working on a wireless system but they want to get it right the first time. Will probably be next year sometime before I even see a test unit. But would require a new light, wireless isn't a "plug and play" system sadly. It's a completely separate electronics system.

Cat, if you pull the duo apart (just take the screws out so you can pop the back cover off) youll see a secondary board with the components for wireless signal reception. That board only has connections to the driver for power, ground, and signal. In a simple sense all it does is replicate the action of the on head button. But little more to it when you add a dual button system for the "flash" mode of the second button.

This is why you end up with wireless remotes that activate programming modes and such. Too keep it simple. More simple (aka only acting the same as the on head button) means less to go wrong. Just like the removable wired remote we have now. It's simply in parallel with the on head button, nothing more than a second button right inline to allow the exact same functions.

As for why ituo is planning right now I can't get into. But it's something different (sorry no blue tooth to your phone bs). I personally like the idea. Once I see a test unit (and probably just driver assemblies to put in my current lights) I'll post up so we can all discuss just as Ituo prefers to do. Ask all of us what we think and go from there.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

@tigris; Do you know the exact emitter/bin that ITUO is using in the XP3? Whatever it is I want to know so I know what to ask for if dealing with other companies. 

On a side note: Next time out I'll likely compare the XP3 to the SStorm"****"...duh...I forget what it was called now...:lol:
This is the quad version of the SStorm with neutral white emitters. Not exactly apples to oranges but both should do really well in a head to head comparison.. I just hope I can get the Gopro adapter I have to work on the SStorm. If I can't I won't bother. I don't feel like taking off and installing a whole helmet mounting system while on a ride. With the Gopros all you do is change the head which is super great.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*The next ride*

Ah, I remember now. Solarstorm XT40!. Anyway, I got the vanc Gopro mount I have to fit onto the XT40. Not a perfect fit for thermal contact right now but at the moment I just want it to work with the Gopro helmet mount.

Not sure I'll go out tonight. Slept late and been screwing around all day. 
Damn, never enough time to do everything you want to do. FWIW, I've been comparing the XT40 output/tint to the XP3 while shining them around inside the home. Tint is about the same. Output wise I'm rather shocked. I figured the XT40 had an advantage since it has an extra emitter.  Nope, XP3 blows it away. It was so obvious that I don't even need to do a lux test. I still want to compare them on a ride though. The SStorm XT40 has a slightly tighter beam pattern. I need to see how that translates when riding. Both though are great as helmet lamps. Sadly, I don't think you can buy the XT40 anymore ( 4 reflector set-up )...hmmm..Gearbest might still have it. (?)...nope, not on Gearbest either.

Still on the fence on whether to go out tonight for a ride...damn, hungry right now, need some grub.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Cat: XM-L2 U3 3D. Only warmer tint (below 2 range) available in U3. Tint is ever so slightly warmer than our well known U2 3C which is probably why you like it. It's also a matter of the optics too. One brand of optic will make the light look slightly whiter or slightly warmer vs another.

I did expect the xt40 to be a bit warmer due to non-AR lens and reflector vs optics of xp3.

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## mentawais (Feb 16, 2005)

*XP3 X BT21 for helmet*



tigris99 said:


> Cat: XM-L2 U3 3D. Only warmer tint (below 2 range) available in U3. Tint is ever so slightly warmer than our well known U2 3C which is probably why you like it. It's also a matter of the optics too. One brand of optic will make the light look slightly whiter or slightly warmer vs another.
> 
> I did expect the xt40 to be a bit warmer due to non-AR lens and reflector vs optics of xp3.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


I current using a BT21 on Helmets , it is worth to change it for a Ituo XP3??


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## mentawais (Feb 16, 2005)

mentawais said:


> I current using a BT21 on Helmets , it is worth to change it for a Ituo XP3??


is XP3 light head compatible with 2 cell battery?
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S024751....ble-18650-Li-ion-Battery-Pack-with-10cm-Cable


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

mentawais said:


> I current using a BT21 on Helmets , it is worth to change it for a Ituo XP3??


Depends on how much light you think you need. I can get by with just a single emitter lamp on the helmet if I want to but I much prefer having more light. I suppose it depends on the type of trails you are riding. If you're riding smooth, groomed, fast trails with lots of turns any lamp will do. On the other hand if you're riding in rough terrain with lots of ruts, wide turns, loose rock or multiple obstacles at any one moment, then having a lot of light coming off the helmet can be a big help.

I wondered myself how the XP3 would work with a two-cell. I wouldn't think it a problem if using the low and medium setting but the high is certain to draw a lot of juice. If you're into high mode the XP3 would drain a two cell battery really fast. That's assuming of course that the 2-cell you're using can handle the current draw of the XP3 on high and not have the protection circuit cut off the juice.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

The 2 cell he listed will work, it's what Ive been using this entire time. Well my 2 cell is the Fenix case with the same cells used in that pack. That pack is specced for more current than the xp3 will draw so it'll be fine.

Cannot run it on high full time, will suck the battery down too fast. Running on medium except the really fast sections I get over an hour no problem. If for some reason I'm going to be out longer I have my hydropack anyway so I can put the 4 cell in the upper pocket and good to go. It's what I did for testing the xp4.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

mentawais said:


> I current using a BT21 on Helmets , it is worth to change it for a Ituo XP3??


What optics are in your BT21? Stock optics in that light are inefficient and hold back its performance, especially throw. That being said, even with the best performing optics in your BT21 individual emitter performance is only about equal to the XP3 so your looking at 50% more light produced by the Ituo light. That's a large very noticeable performance increase using the XP3. If this sounds like what your looking for then it's worth it, ultimately up to you to decide.
Mole


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## Brooks04 (Jun 1, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> Got to do a "hard-core" temp. test ride last night of the XP3 w/Vancbiker mount. Learned the previous night that the mount works slightly better in the higher LoPro position (better airflow). Nice ride that included a 2+ mi. canal section where I could run 20,000 lumens and not offend anyone. By the end of that section the light had dimmed noticeably (20% est.) so the estimated 100 degree ride temp was enough for the thermal protection to notice even with the vancbiker mount. Very acceptable results considering I noted that the XP3 would activate its thermal protection @ about 130 degrees from the previous nights indoor bench testing. The only light I could say for sure I own that would handle the heat better are the XP2 and my hot weather champ Wiz20. I have a few other lights that may not be effected in these conditions but they all produce a lot fewer lumens and have thermal protection thresholds set @ 150 degrees (case temp.). As usual :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: for the usefulness of the vancbiker mounts with this light.
> Mole
> 
> View attachment 1091539
> ...


Where can you purchase this mount system and what is the cost? Also, how much does it weigh? Thanks!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Brooks04 said:


> Where can you purchase this mount system and what is the cost? Also, how much does it weigh? Thanks!


GoPro adapters for bike lights

There's a link for you. Vancbiker is on vacation right now but may be back tomorrow (9/7). These mounts are "Fit" prototypes so He's waiting on my OK but mounts fit both my XP2 & 3 perfectly. I'll PM him tomorrow that they're good to go. You'll also have to check with him on pricing and delivery. Finned light mount: 15g, swivel bar nount:31g
Mole


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> I'm in for one definitely. Cooler running, and low pro. Nice work.


PM'd Vancbiker yesterday with the fit "OK". Did you order your mount yet?
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Monday I'm going for the vanc mount. Might grab a bt21 mount as well. My Gearbest/deals machine mount disappeared somehow....


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

MRMOLE said:


> PM'd Vancbiker yesterday with the fit "OK". Did you order your mount yet?
> Mole





Dirt Road said:


> Monday I'm going for the vanc mount. Might grab a bt21 mount as well. My Gearbest/deals machine mount disappeared somehow....


I'll be running a production batch within a week. Gotta catch up on some other work first. I'll start a new thread when production Ituo XP adapters are ready.


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

My Ituo WIZ-XP3 LED Mountain Bike Light and Wiz20 USB LED Bike Light just arrived. Can’t wait to try them out!


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## Speeder500 (Oct 9, 2012)

Maybe some of you can answer some questions about this light for me. Currently I use a Yinding 900 with spot optics and BT40S.

1) Will this be a noticeable improvement over the Yinding 900?

2) Would it be better to just buy two Yinding 900 lights instead of one of these?

3) Does this light work best in 3 spot optics, and use a BT40S for close up light?

4) Is the BT40S better than this XP3 for close up light if using best optics for close up light on XP3?

5) I'm looking for even more light output than my Yinding 900 and BT40S,
Would you consider this the best value light to get more light on the trail?

6) Is this light too heavy or on the heavy side for a bicycle helmet mount, and better off using a lighter light like the Yinding 900? 

Thanks


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I have mine out now. It kills all my lights, except the gloworm xs (best light I have). It's a beast. It can do it all, and it's remarkably small. Best buy category winner. But you have a decent setup with the "ding" and the bt40. $200 is chump change, but not to me. If you bought one, you would be happy. Good after sales support as well!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Speeder500 said:


> Maybe some of you can answer some questions about this light for me. Currently I use a Yinding 900 with spot optics and BT40S.
> 
> 1) Will this be a noticeable improvement over the Yinding 900?
> 
> ...


If you run the BT40S on the bars and the XP3 ( comes standard with all spot optics ) on the helmet, you will have a complete dialed in "neutral white" set-up that will be a noticeable improvement over the combo using the yinding. Also the XP3 comes with GoPro helmet mount which is superior to standard O-ring mount set-ups. Only downside to using the XP3 on the helmet is that the lamp takes more than 3 seconds to turn off. This is only difficult though if you are moving ( think one hand on head for >3sec. ) If you want the next level of visual acuity while riding trails at night using the XP3 will help get you there. With XP3 you are getting great bang for the buck.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Speeder500 said:


> Maybe some of you can answer some questions about this light for me. Currently I use a Yinding 900 with spot optics and BT40S.
> 
> 1) Will this be a noticeable improvement over the Yinding 900?
> 
> ...


Question #1): Absolutely better! Over 2½ times the light produced measured with my light-meter. One of the main things for me comparing these 2 lights is the mode button. XP3's top mounted button is very easy to use and accurate (reliable mode change every time) vs. the back mounted Yinding button which is the worst functioning of any light I've ever used.

2): No.

3): Stock spot optics are perfect for me (helmet use) and the way I would use it with a BT40s on the bars.

4): No, XP3 is better with correct optics. You can change optics to produce a similar beam pattern to the BT40s but with all the XP3's additional power you would have a wider beam, lots more throw and considerably brighter. Using max. power settings may not be the best way to use this light on the bars but it is easily adjusted to the perfect amount of light needed compared to only preset modes on the BT40s. Remote switch is very nice for bar use too. Keeps your hands on the bars.

5): At this moment yes. Hard to predict how much light another person really needs. My suggestion is you get an XP3 and try it with your BT40s first. If you still want/need more light 2 XP3s would work great together and you can purchase a second one later.

6): My skinny little neck has no problems with the XP3 on my helmet. Did 30 mi. all off road last night and didn't notice the weight at all.

The last 3 light purchases I've made have been Ituo products (Wiz20. XP2, XP3). I've been very impressed with the quality and performance of all these lights and been very happy with each purchase and I'm sure you would be too.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I've been using mine as my helmet light for a couple months with a 2 cell pack on my helmet too. And I am weenie about weight on my helmet. 4 cell or a big light and my neck hurts half way into a ride. This light I can ride for over an hour with 2 cell on the lid without even noticing.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

After last nights ride I'll never refer the max. power on the XP3 as overkill again. Last half of the 16 mi. loop is all down hill, pretty twisty at the top but opens up to smooth, flowy, fast section to finish off the ride. My riding buddy is a faster decender than I am but if I stay on his tail I can use his lights to give advance warning of turns and trail irregularities and it compensates for his greater skill. If he gaps me a little usually its all over and I have to slow down. Stayed with him in the twisty sections but he had gotten about 75 yards ahead once it opened up and I figured it was over staying with him. Usually run the XP3 (helmet mounted) @ 70% but decided it wouldn't hurt to kick it up to max. Surprised myself and caught right up. Lesson learned. As I've said before, "I love this light"!
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Nice Mole! The right lights definitely help. For me my fat bike did a lot for me last night. Won't get into the long version but spent the weekend camping next to my favorite and second closest trails etc. Wake up looking out over the river, look the opposite direction and see the hills and bluff the trails are on. When we came in to pick a campsite I drove first the the back tent sites the the river side tent sites.

At the end of the road the last site I saw mountain and road bikes, talked to the couple staying there, said to take the site next to them. He was a rider out of Chicago area, racer and so on. Gf was a roadie who's now been corrupted and adding trail riding too now lol. Saturday I took him and my son out to ride a lap. Ended up never letting go my 29er out this weekend, I took all 3 bikes bit only rode my road bike a little and rest on the fatty. He enjoyed the ride a lot, liked the trails a lot.

After we get back, he goes out for another lap he and his gf borrowed mine and my sons fat bikes (his gf is tiny) and go do the south loop. Hence corrupting her now. He's considering a fat bike now too lol. 

Earlier is just conversation I had mentioned night riding. He was open to it but no lights. Of course I brought spares. He didn't seem overly into it beyond the fun of another lap with a new riding buddy.

Then I put the xp4 on his bars (I went my xp3 lid 2 bars combo). His eyes lit up.

We hit the trails. Thankfully this time he wasn't so confident and fast. So I was able to hang without issue till the downs. Oh and he was being chill about the climbs. Fat bike, low gearing, almost no sleep the night before....I was slow but cleared them. Once climbs were over my new found confidence of riding my fatty I was able to either keep up or have enough speed when he was following to keep him having fun too. Each half of the lap is a long climb up, fast flow in a loop up top with a mix of minor tech of all sorts then a bit techy but fast descent. Go to other half of the set and climb up and same type of trail with another fast but minorly techy descent. 

Now he wants to get into to night riding. He's not a fan of big brand lights. High output is insanely priced and he enjoyed the NW tint of my lights. 

So made great new friends (though a couple hours away normally) that are awesome people and was able to show someone how much fun night riding really is when you get away from the cheap crap and overpriced branded stuff that's all cool white tints and not much on output. Add that with a couple new PR'S (white night riding on my fat bike which I couldn't believe) both in total lap time and the upper loops. Not to mention felt great to be able to keep someone that's way faster entertained. Always hated dragging people down a lot.

Fat bikes and my ituo lights have opened up a whole new level of happiness and speed this weekend.

I'm actually considering selling, my 29er and my fat bike so I can get a new fatty that will except plus forks. B+ hardtail summer, rigid fat winter. Or a small fat with Sus forks (3.8 tires ish) for summer and rigid fat with 4.7 in front at least for snow.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Had a good ride last nite with the xp3 on the lid/ wiz20 on the bars. My new KD 2cell pack was on point running on low/med and about 5min on high. With temps in the 50s was an awesome ride. Had 1-1/2hrs of pushing speed more, I ride faster (still slow) in colder months, last night was perfect. Xp3 is a really good helmet light. This will be my winter setup, but will use the 4 cell stuffed in my jacket. Wiz20 should be good to go as is.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> Had a good ride last nite with the xp3 on the lid/ wiz20 on the bars. My new KD 2cell pack was on point running on low/med and about 5min on high. With temps in the 50s was an awesome ride. Had 1-1/2hrs of pushing speed more, I ride faster (still slow) in colder months, last night was perfect. Xp3 is a really good helmet light. This will be my winter setup, but will use the 4 cell stuffed in my jacket. Wiz20 should be good to go as is.


What optics are you using with this combo? I'm still using the "wide spot" ones in my Wiz20 but I usually use that light solo without a helmet light. Happy with stock spots in my XP3 for the helmet combo'd w/either my XP2 or BT70 on the bars.

_***Ran some tests with fresh GW XS spots in all my Ituo lights last night. 2-4% lux increase from a bounce test depending on the light and a consistant 10% increase of center-beam readings. Questionable if those modest gains warrant the optics change unless your anal about it. Road testing may reveal beam pattern advantages that further justify the change though.***
_
Mole


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yep I'm using the wide spots in the wiz20, stock narrow in the xp3. I'm sure there's better bar lights than the wiz20, but I'm just trying to get a good cold weather combo together as I love winter riding. Wiz20 should not have any issues with cold weather riding. I don't want 2 packs in my jacket so wiz20 will be a go to! Xp3 is just a beast of a good light. Low/med for tighter trails is very sufficient. Great optics info from MRMOLE as expected!!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I know for sure the wiz20 deals with the cold quite well as long as it's left in higher levels if it's much below freezing. Rode my fat bike like that a lot last winter. I like dual emitter lights for the bars and more power on my lid anyways so the wiz20 or xp2 on the bars with xp3 or 4 on the lid I really like.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Brooks04 (Jun 1, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> Got these Vancbiker GoPro mounts in the mail today. Haven't ridden with them yet but should have plenty of opportunities with the next 6 days off work.
> 
> View attachment 1091158
> 
> ...


Mole,
How do you like the Vancbiker GoPro mount mounted with the stock Ituo helmet strap and XP3? Is there any noticeable extra weight added to the helmet with this setup vs using just the stock helmet strap and XP3? Also, is the light as stable with this adapter? Since the adapter puts the light further out front of the mounting strap I am curious on how this affects the weight and stability of the XP3.

I like the lower profile mounting this adapter offers and would like to purchase one. I just don't want to add any noticeable extra weight to my helmet as my neck tends to get fatigued easily with some helmet lights. Thanks!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Brooks04 said:


> Mole,
> How do you like the Vancbiker GoPro mount mounted with the stock Ituo helmet strap and XP3? Is there any noticeable extra weight added to the helmet with this setup vs using just the stock helmet strap and XP3? Also, is the light as stable with this adapter? Since the adapter puts the light further out front of the mounting strap I am curious on how this affects the weight and stability of the XP3.
> 
> I like the lower profile mounting this adapter offers and would like to purchase one. I just don't want to add any noticeable extra weight to my helmet as my neck tends to get fatigued easily with some helmet lights. Thanks!


Have been surprised how comfortable this setup has been. Like you, was wondering if the more forward position of the light would cause fatigue but hasn't been a problem (done some 4 hr. rides with it) and no noticeable difference between this mount and the stock one. As helmet fit is a big part of this I can only say for sure that it works well with a tight fitting Bell or Kali helmet but that's a good sign.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> What optics are you using with this combo? I'm still using the "wide spot" ones in my Wiz20 but I usually use that light solo without a helmet light. Happy with stock spots in my XP3 for the helmet combo'd w/either my XP2 or BT70 on the bars.
> 
> _***Ran some tests with fresh GW XS spots in all my Ituo lights last night. 2-4% lux increase from a bounce test depending on the light and a consistant 10% increase of center-beam readings. Questionable if those modest gains warrant the optics change unless your anal about it. Road testing may reveal beam pattern advantages that further justify the change though.***
> _
> Mole


MRM...you got me going again. Any problems getting the GW XS optics to fit in the ITUO XP3? If you think you're getting a 10% Lux increase in the center area using the GW optics, to me that's significant enough to warrant the upgrade.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> MRM...you got me going again. Any problems getting the GW XS optics to fit in the ITUO XP3?
> 
> No modifications required but a slightly tighter fit. Optic its self is slightly taller so it spreads the retention tabs on the white optic holder a little. Overall fit height is the same because it's determined by the holder but interface around the circumference is snugger.
> 
> ...


Sorry for the funky format! My comments above in RED.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Damn you mole . Now I'm gonna have to try it.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## randan (May 18, 2005)

Is there any european shop that sells Ituo lights? I found brightbikelights.com from the UK but it looks like they only ship within the UK.


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## BmoreKen (Sep 27, 2004)

I picked up a XP3 and I'm impressed with the quality of the build and the NW beam. However, I'm less than impressed with the fact that you must hold the switch for 4.5 seconds to power down. What' s the deal with that? My Gemini powers down in 2s, and GW, which I thought was long, is 3s. Just seems strange and feels like I'd get annoyed every time I power the lights down, which is actually pretty often when we're out riding (power down every time we stop and regroup, which is probably 6x per ride).


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yep, the off sequence sux on the xp3. The flash really pisses in my wheaties. But it's about the only ***** I have.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

BmoreKen said:


> ........ feels like I'd get annoyed every time I power the lights down, which is actually pretty often when we're out riding (power down every time we stop and regroup, which is probably 6x per ride).


Easy fix.....ride solo. No more stops to regroup. :devil:


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Damn you mole . Now I'm gonna have to try it.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Hope that means you're going to run it through your sphere. Love to see how my C-B/bounce test results compare to you sphere results. Married my son off last night so have been busy with that for the last few days and still haven't had a road test opportunity.
Mole


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## Speeder500 (Oct 9, 2012)

Turning off the light should be quick and 4.5 seconds is too long. What makes it worse is when you have to shut off a few lights. 
I am always turning my lights on and off as I go from woods to street. I always thought there should be a separate on/off button for fast turning on and off and keeping your last light setting.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

MRMOLE said:


> Hope that means you're going to run it through your sphere. Love to see how my C-B/bounce test results compare to you sphere results. Married my son off last night so have been busy with that for the last few days and still haven't had a road test opportunity.
> Mole


Much more important that light tests. Congratulations on the addition to your family!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

flat said:


> Much more important that light tests. Congratulations on the addition to your family!


All these light tests will tell you something different about the light. Center-beam will give you a maximum light intensity reading which equates to throw capability. Bounce test is s good representation of OTF power. Beam width sensitive though so it favors narrow angle optics/reflector. Sphere testing is most accurate for measuring total lumen amount and optic efficiency but reveals nothing about beam pattern so not accurate at forecasting how the light will actually look to the user without additional information. All important IMO.

Thanks! Love my new Daughter-in-law to death, Son's pretty awesome too.

Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Congrats Mole!!

Ya at some point Ill do the switch and run through the sphere, see where we end up.

As for the longer duration to shut the light off: They were trying to make it simple to access hidden modes. I know its on the "update" list. Its the firmware they used in their USB lights and not goign over quite as well as they thought it would.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> Congrats Mole!!
> 
> Ya at some point Ill do the switch and run through the sphere, see where we end up.
> 
> As for the longer duration to shut the light off: They were trying to make it simple to access hidden modes. I know its on the "update" list. Its the firmware they used in their USB lights and not goign over quite as well as they thought it would.


Any chance the firmware can be updated via the charging port?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

There is no charging port on these. These aren't USB lights, separate battery pack and such. No where to plug in.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OK got a chance to start looking at videos from Fridays ride.... And I broke down and ordered what should be a better camera.

Chest mount attempt this time too (forgot to invert video). I am still trying to sort out how to make a half way stable video on a chest mount. New camera, Xiaomi Yi 4K should give me the git1 level night video with the git2 stability. Almost got a Sony as200v but don't like the idea of that thing on my chest. If I crash that's some messed up ribs.

I'll try to grab a few segments that are relatively stable and make a short video this week.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> There is no charging port on these. These aren't USB lights, separate battery pack and such. No where to plug in.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Oops! Yeah, I'm still in Wiz20World. Forgot about that.

Anyway, are they considering adding end user programming to the XP series? I'm not overly impressed with phone integration via Bluetooth, but being about to do some basic programming via a simple web interface through the remote switch port (or via BT once they go wireless) would distinguish Ituo from a lot of competitors, and may not add much cost to the lights.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

there is basic programming done from the buttons for mode output levels already. No need for some pain in the rear interface. No company is going to give customers something to modify the firmware as that can trash the light.

But I know its been passed along about the UI update but no clue when that will come to pass. In manufacturing NO CHANGES are small. To us they may be, but the work needed to change anything in a manufacturing process is quite a task. I work in plastics manufacturing so I understand very well what every bit of anything takes to accomplish.

I do know the XP4s that I have for testing have the updated UI in them. Dont even think they have a flash mode at all at the moment. Dont think its going to have one or its going to be well hidden.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

The programming I'm talking about wouldn't be a "pain in the ass". I don't think many (any?) people want to use a web interface to _operate_ a light, but using a simple interface would make it easy to load preferences into a light, to be accessed through one or two buttons. Give users the ability to decide what 1, 2, 3, and 4 rapid clicks mean, and define the available options in the programming interface; something as simple as that. Yes, it would take some effort on the design end, and likely require some changes in the control chip(s), but it's not a huge change to the function of a light. All of the current modes would still be present, but it would be much easier for someone to access them, or remove them from the light, if desired.

I know from experience that even small production changes can be a big PITA, but since you're in the development loop with Ituo, I thought it'd be worthwhile to mention the above interface change to you. Something like I suggested could end complaints about blink modes cluttering up the controls, lengthy power down button presses, etc. Don't want any blinking? Don't load that option. Want fast power-off? Assign it to the 3-click slot.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Actually a pretty simple ui was used back in the beginning of their lights and they thought these would be better (based on the jumble of people's requests in lights all over forums).

Normal press on, 3 solid modes, each programmable output levels(like they are now).

Off was much quicker.

Double click from off to flash modes.

The big concensus though is on MTB lights not to have a flash mode. I think a hidden from off position is best if it exists at all.

What your asking about is basically what lupine does (just via Bluetooth). That kind of system would add significant expense to the lights. As well as added complications which can add a point of failure. 

Like right now the remote switch port is a mini headphone jack and plug. An interface that functions as a switch as well...

When it comes to lights I'm more with Ituo. Try to make most happy as possible but keep it on the simpler end and reliable. That's why we won't see a wireless system from them for a while. Gotta get it right the first time. They had ideas they were asking me about but the simple ways we've seen, they want to do better. 

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

^^^....I'll just add at this point in the discussion that it shouldn't be too difficult for the manufacturer to plan a change for the driver to become more useful. I would think this would just be a change in firmware in how the present driver is programmed but if I'm wrong and they need a more compatible driver in order to make needed changes, "that", indeed may take some time to get sorted out. Regardless of how easy or hard it will be, by next year it should be... > "DOABLE". 

I will add also that if ITUO had indeed sent me a test version of the XP3, I would of been very quick to point out the problem with the "Off sequence" being much too long. Not to mention that the Gloworm lamps take a long time to turn off too so I'm not picking on ITUO. I didn't complain about the GW's too much but only because I'm using their lamp only on the bars. Since I usually only turn the bar lamp off when I'm stopped It wasn't a major issue. The helmet lamp on the other hand I will sometimes turn off ( when riding ) if I don't need the extra light. Nevertheless, the GW's seem not as tedious to turn off as the ITUO's but having to hold your hand on your head for more than a couple seconds to turn a lamp off is a super PITA when using ANY helmet lamp. 

Going forward; my next lamp will ( or better have ) a faster off sequence...AND....a choice of wireless remote and/or using a button on the lamp. Whoever gets it right first ( GW or ITUO ) is going to get my business.


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

I know Lupine has the gee-whiz phone app and a BT switch, but neither of those would be required to add the level of user programming I suggested. All I'm asking for is a list of canned modes that could be assigned to dumb, wired button clicks. Add in a relatively dumb BT button, and I think Cat would be happy, too. 

I agree that the "pretty simple UI" sounds better than where Ituo has ended up, and that they can't please everyone. OTOH, opening up the programming just a bit would seem to address many issues, and I think they're going to need a wireless solution sooner than later.


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

My 1st Gen Betty-R's have the programming you describe somewhat using just the lamp head button and (NO) smartphone app. You can assign two/three/or four output modes including a flash mode and program each one to what ever output you want. As the lights shut off quickly having a mode to adjust that isnt needed. So it can be done but as i'm no techy electronic guy i dont know how much cost would be needed to execute this?


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## flat (Jul 31, 2016)

indebt said:


> My 1st Gen Betty-R's have the programming you describe somewhat using just the lamp head button and (NO) smartphone app. You can assign two/three/or four output modes including a flash mode and program each one to what ever output you want. As the lights shut off quickly having a mode to adjust that isnt needed. So it can be done but as i'm no techy electronic guy i dont know how much cost would be needed to execute this?


Sounds good to me.


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## dgw7000 (Aug 31, 2011)

flat said:


> Sounds good to me.


Mine on the way, I also have the Gloworm xs.!!


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## j3ffro (May 8, 2015)

My XP3 came in the mail last night, I'm going to mess around with it this weekend. Huge thanks to all of the contributors on this thread - I would have gone with a much larger company making inferior lights if it weren't for you and your posts.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*Attention : Warning; ITUO Helmet Mount Failure*

Hi all. I was just getting ready for a ride tonight and while mounting the ITUO Gopro mount to my helmet one of the straps broke while tightening. Strange but I've had the same thing happen with the cheap rubber torch mounts that use the same two sided Velcro. Seems if you stress the place where the Velcro changes it will pull apart. While I've had this happen with the cheaper mounts I certainly didn't expect this with my ITUO mount.

I now know "Not to pull from the end of the straps" but to pull before where the two sides change. Lay together once you get the strap tight enough. Do this and you won't have a problem. Thankfully I can MacGyver the other side by replacing with a normal piece of Velcro ( which I always keep on hand ). Damn! hate when stuff like this happens. This is only the second time I've mounted the mount to my helmet. I'm kicking myself now because I should have known better but really I would of thought ITUO had supplied a stronger strap.

Going forward I should be able to fix the strap by using some strong glue coupled with some strong thread and or stapling. * Once again; Don't pull the straps from the end. Pull at the point BEFORE where the two sides are reversed and you should be good. Regardless, I think at some point these will fail because the place where the Velco changes is a VERY WEAK spot. * Good idea to carry some Velcro along just in case it breaks during a ride.


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## TrevorJackson (Sep 22, 2015)

I sent an ITUO XP3 for review at SingleTrack (based in the Northern UK). SingleTrack have a magazine and website and are very well respected in the UK. My experience of these guys is that they test a product for at least a month in horrible conditions and really put it through its paces. Some products that pass get a coveted 'Recommended' . I'm more than hugely pleased that the XP3 has been awarded a SingleTrack 'Recommended' - in my view it deserves it all as it is a fantastic piece of kit.

Here is a link to the review: Singletrack Magazine | Review: Ituo Wiz-XP3 Light


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## TrevorJackson (Sep 22, 2015)

Regarding helmet mounts - I'm sure this would not be the manufacturers recommendation - but have you thought about dispensing with the straps and using cable ties ?. The straps can be fiddly - I fitted an ITUO mount recently using four cable ties and the result was pretty solid.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Velcro straps work just fine for any light I've used. Just pull it tight, no issues.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## TrevorJackson (Sep 22, 2015)

Maybe my technique is not good - I find the velcro ones fiddly to work with. I will try and use the velcro straps again using the advice from cat-man-do above. The helmet mount needs to be tight and I've always struggled with this. Riding some rough terrain and having a wobbling helmet light is really not great. I'll try again to get them tight....


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## dgw7000 (Aug 31, 2011)

I use Camco 42503 1x12 inch awning straps with metal buckle. Amazon for $4.67 for 2 pack. The best velcro straps I have used.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I pull mine good and tight and my helmet moves more than the light. It is tricky to get sorted but once you find a way that works all is good.

Cat I wonder if you just got a weak strap. The way they are formed together I see all over anymore. I've paid good money for RC battery pack straps made the same way that have done that. I've got a few of them, I'll see if I can break one. If so I'll pass it one to Ituo to check into the issue.

I've found the scotch lock is some wonderful stuff too. I don't have a through strap for me 2 cell helmet pack anymore. Literally slap it on and go. Never moves no matter how rough it gets. Awesome stuff when you have a flat enough pair of surfaces for it to adhere to.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

tigris99 said:


> I pull mine good and tight and my helmet moves more than the light. It is tricky to get sorted but once you find a way that works all is good.
> 
> Cat I wonder if you just got a weak strap. The way they are formed together I see all over anymore...


No, I don't think I got a weak strap. Like I said, I had the same thing happen with a similar strap. Normal Velcro is just two sided and very durable. The straps used with these mounts are much thinner than normal Velcro. They are using a buckle and have about a four inch piece of velcro at the end that is reversed. To do that they have to somehow glue or heat press the two pieces together. You can see the area where they are joined. It looks like a series of small dots about a quarter inch long. I didn't notice this before but the piece that holds the buckle has the same small dots. That means there are actually two potential failure points for each strap. One on the buckle and one at the end of the strap.

I don't mind using regular Velcro but then I lose the buckle which makes tightening more easier. Not a problem as long as one side ( with buckle ) still works. Really though, the straps on these things are pathetically thin. Now that I think about it, probably the best fix is to use regular velcro and use some hot glue to make it work with the buckle system. I'll order another one and be more careful the next time when tightening the straps. ~ ~ ~

Got a nice ride in tonight with the XP3 on the helmet. It's been over a month since I last rode but only because of the car problems I was having. Since then I bought a new vehicle and then had to shop around to figure out what bike rack I was going to have to buy. Finally bought a new rack last week but took me a couple days to figure out the best way to mount it.

XP3 was working wonderfully tonight. Weather has been very dry lately and the trails were in great shape. What was really nice was that the air was very, very clear of particulate matter. With GWX2 on the bars and XP3 on the lid I could see really, really good. So good that I never felt compelled at any time to use the high mode on either lamp. The only downer was that I was a bit out of shape haven't not ridden for over a month. Didn't have my usual mojo with me tonight so I took things easy. Then again I'm not used to starting night rides so early. Weather has been great the last few days. Too bad I have to go back to work tomorrow. :nonod:


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

dgw7000 said:


> I use Camco 42503 1x12 inch awning straps with metal buckle. Amazon for $4.67 for 2 pack. The best velcro straps I have used.


...or these. Both should work. Then again ITUO might give me a new mount for free.


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## dgw7000 (Aug 31, 2011)

Ituo cust. service is excellent!! Keith gets back to you really fast.

I had a chance to try out the XP3 on head and the Wiz20 with flood optic lens on the bar. I really like this combo! Nice not to have all the clutter on the bike and both batteries on each light last over 2 hours on high. The spot on the XP3 is perfect for the head and with the flood on the bars with no hot spots, its just all wide great color light. With all the leaves down I had really good vision of rocks under the leaves.
One thing I don't like about the XP3 turning it off sometimes I get it the flashing mode by mistake while trying to turn off the light. Really all I want is a simple low, med and high than hold down for second than off!! I have no need for all the programing bull crap, this is why I love the Serfas lights so much, simple to operate and great Quality but too big!! Ituo almost perfect!! I really like that you unplug the remote switch and still have a button on the light, same as Serfas.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Cat-man-do said:


> .....To do that they have to somehow glue or heat press the two pieces together. You can see the area where they are joined. It looks like a series of small dots about a quarter inch long. I didn't notice this before but the piece that holds the buckle has the same small dots. That means there are actually two potential failure points for each strap. One on the buckle and one at the end of the strap.


I've had Velcro straps of similar construction fail similarly. Whenever I get something that has heat bonded Velcro straps I sew a couple passes over the joint with the wife's sewing machine. Never had a modded one pull apart.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Cat

Ive tried to break 2 of them. Im gonna have to put some serious force on them to get them to give it up. Figured id break the ring before that so I gave up.

Ok finally, my XP3 video for you guys, well this first one, going out tomorrow for a club group ride and ill get the second part:


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

You've got a typo on the titles there tigris - Neutral not Nuetral

Great video though, it might just make me buy one of these!


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## Soulseller (Jan 17, 2012)

I want to buy new lights for both handlebar and helmet and I like what you are saying about these lights. But would you recommend going for two XP3 or one XP3 and one XP2 and why?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OTH-. Thanks, can't believe I didn't see that...

Soulseller

It's a matter of preference is all. The video was only done with 2 to show what it's capable of at both extremes for the optics set ups. I do like running 2 xp3 though because in matching the lumens of the xp2, the xp3 is more efficient thus longer run times and runs cooler. There's a whole science behind it too.

One of each is a pretty common set up. Most people will use light like xp2 on the helmet and xp3 on the bars. Or people like me run xp3 on the helmet, xp2 on the bars.

Just all about what you want. And with optics options you can set up the beam pattern to whatever you like.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

Soulseller said:


> I want to buy new lights for both handlebar and helmet and I like what you are saying about these lights. But would you recommend going for two XP3 or one XP3 and one XP2 and why?


 Tigris has very detailed reviews on these lights if you need more info. The reviews are fantastic and is concurred by many other members who opinions i trust. Some riders are sensitive to having any weight on their lid and really stick to smaller lighter weight lights for that reason. In this case i think the XP3 only has a small amount of extra grams over the XP2. IMO if in your budget two XP3's will be a smoking set up and with many different optic options you can customize beam shape to your preference. So you will have a little more output going that rout vs one XP2. Either combo is very good though.


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## TrevorJackson (Sep 22, 2015)

BrightBikeLights will ship within the EU. Just contact me - there will be an international tracked postage charge which I keep to a minimum. Email is [email protected] Trevor


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Trevor, please stop spamming review threads. 

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## slyfink (Apr 15, 2004)

I figured it might be useful if I added my experience with the XP3 here.

First off, I'd like to thank Moleman, Tigris, and Cat-Man-Do for kicking this off. I don't think I'd have bought these lights without your initial testing and reviews...

For the past 3 or 4 years I have been using a combo of Gemini Xera on the helmet, and Duo on the bars. I had found that both lacked throw for my riding purposes. The Duo I have is the original generation, so without interchangeable optics. I think it has flood/flood configuration. My Xera has the super-spot optic in it. So I was looking to upgrade. Mostly, I was looking for a new helmet mounted light with good throw, so I could ride at DH speeds without slowing down. After reading the tests and reviews on here, I decided to give the XP3 a go, and also picked up a Wiz 20 for my commutes, and figured it would be a good shoulder-season light to bring along in case spring/fall rides went too long or night came early.

I've had them now for about 6 rides. I can honestly say the XP3 is exactly what I was looking for. My Strava times tell me I am riding as fast at night now as during the day. I even PRd a downhill segment at night in late September, so that's settled in my mind! 

The light beam on the XP3 is perfect for helmet use, the power is just right, the run times are good (my longest ride was about 2.5 hours and I rode in medium most of the time, kicking it up to high on the descents), the light colour is good, the build quality is high, and the price is right.

I had been using the XP3 on my helmet and the duo on my bars, but decided one night to try the Wiz20. I wanted to see if the Wiz 20 mount was solid enough for proper rowdy descents. It is. I generally run it in the medium setting, and kick it up to full for descents, and I easily get 2 hours this way. it was only on my 2.5 hour ride that it started to run out of juice. It dropped down to the low setting, but that was still plenty given I had the XP3 still able to crank out full power. I was surprised that I really preferred the Wiz 20 beam pattern and especially light colour to the Duo. The colour works much better in conjunction with the XP3. I wouldn't have thought mismatching the colours of the Duo and XP3 would have such an effect, but it does, so now my standard setup is XP3 on the helmet, and Wiz 20 on the bars. I guess I'll keep the Duo around as a loaner....

The only downside I can find now is that I find myself very annoyed by the time it takes to turn it off. And to be honest, i think I may have entered the programming mode by mistake and messed up the high setting, so now I have to figure out how to reset the dang thing. But I guess I'll get used to it eventually. It's also a bit of a let-down to go from the nice light and compact setup of the Xera with a 2-cell strapped directly to the helmet, back to having a cord connected to a battery in my pack, but that's a very minor inconvenience, and a trade-off totally worth making given the benefits of the light.

So tl;dr: this is a great light, at a great price. buy it!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*ITUO mount failure; continued*

Last night I super-glued the two pieces back together. Seems to be holding...for now. In order to lessen the stress on the strap I threaded the buckle on the outer most slot of the mount. This gives me more length when I start tightening the straps and allows me to follow my own recommendation of pulling the strap "before" where the Velcro reverses. Looks like it's going to work but I'm still going to carry a piece of normal Velcro just in case it breaks while I'm on a ride.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Cat-man-do said:


> Last night I super-glued the two pieces back together. Seems to be holding...for now.


No sewing machine available?


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Vancbiker said:


> No sewing machine available?


No wife or sewing machine available...

Actually, I considered using some needle and thread or perhaps a couple of staples but If I wanted to do that it would of been better to do it while the glue was liquid..Thing is; that would of been messy. Needle and thread alone would of been the best way to go I suppose but I'm all thumbs. I used a lot of glue so it should hold. If it doesn't hold I'll go medieval on it with needle and thread the next time. Yep, always pays to have some extra Velcro, needle-thread, super glue, electrical tape...etc..etc.. around when messing with bike stuff.


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## gtluke (Aug 15, 2007)

The light on my new xp3 is awesome. However I have one complaint. With the light mounted on the helmet, the cable is like 6 inches too short for the battery to fit in my jersey pocket. Actually pretty annoying. Is there an extension cable available? I don't see one on the website.
The power off function is also highly annoying as mentioned in this thread. I swear it won't actually turn off until I cycle between solid, flashing, back to solid, and THEN it will turn off. If I go from on, to try and turn it off it never turns off no matter how long I hold down the button.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

gtluke said:


> The light on my new xp3 is awesome. However I have one complaint. With the light mounted on the helmet, the cable is like 6 inches too short for the battery to fit in my jersey pocket. Actually pretty annoying. Is there an extension cable available? I don't see one on the website.
> The power off function is also highly annoying as mentioned in this thread. I swear it won't actually turn off until I cycle between solid, flashing, back to solid, and THEN it will turn off. If I go from on, to try and turn it off it never turns off no matter how long I hold down the button.


Not sure if I understand your shut-off issue. Mine takes 4x as long as I think it should to shut off but always cycles through flash mode before shutting down (shuts down every time so far). Definitely see your issue with the battery cable length. My camelpack has a pocket on the very top I put my battery in and there's not much extra cable left from there.
Considering the type of connectors Ituo uses a extension cable should be offered IMO. Also agree the light works awesome!
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

SOrry guys forgot to fill everyone in. The extension cables are coming. Going to take a little bit longer to reach the US but Ituo has them as of this week. Seems it took enough people bringing it up for their factory to realize how badly they are needed instead of listening to the ones of us in the very beginning (early summer) saying it was needed.

THe turning off thing sounds odd. I have every light ituo makes now and all of them turn off just fine. Little heavy of a delay through the flash mode to do it but never had a problem.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

tigris99 said:


> SOrry guys forgot to fill everyone in. The extension cables are coming. Going to take a little bit longer to reach the US but Ituo has them as of this week. Seems it took enough people bringing it up for their factory to realize how badly they are needed instead of listening to the ones of us in the very beginning (early summer) saying it was needed.
> 
> THe turning off thing sounds odd. I have every light ituo makes now and all of them turn off just fine. Little heavy of a delay through the flash mode to do it but never had a problem.


Yep, any magicshine type extension cable will work even if there is no threaded end. Turn-off procedure is annoyingly long but should turn off in about 4 sec after you press/hold and see the flash. If it doesn't do this from any mode you have a problem and need to contact ITUO.

FWIW I'm starting to get used to the elongated turn off. For me it's only a problem when I'm tired and don't feel like holding my arm in the air waiting for the lamp to turn off. Now when I stop to rest I just switch it to low and wait till I catch my breath.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> SOrry guys forgot to fill everyone in. The extension cables are coming. Going to take a little bit longer to reach the US but Ituo has them as of this week. Seems it took enough people bringing it up for their factory to realize how badly they are needed instead of listening to the ones of us in the very beginning (early summer) saying it was needed.


Ya!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> .
> 
> FWIW I'm starting to get used to the elongated turn off. For me it's only a problem when I'm tired and don't feel like holding my arm in the air waiting for the lamp to turn off. Now when I stop to rest I just switch it to low and wait till I catch my breath.


While it's really not that big a deal I'm having a harder time than you getting used to it. Probably because my Wiz20 doesn't scroll through flash mode and turns off in about half the time.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*XP3; Optic question*

I was just looking at the ITUO website and see that they offer three different optic set-ups. At a future date I may want to move the XP3 down to the bars. That might require a different optic set-up than the triple spot I'm now using. To the people already using one of these on the bars...; "What optic set-up is working best for you"? I'm thinking two of the 25° optics and one spot...thoughts? ( I don't totally want to lose all of the throw and should only need so much spill ).


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ive been going between dual wide and flood and dual flood with a wide. But Im not a fan of a serious hot spot on my bar light. draws my eyes in instead of ahead where my helmet light is at. The wide spots still have the hot spot but its slightly bigger and the transistion is nice and smooth. adding a flood in the middle of them I like (my cameras not so much, they hate hot spots in close lol)


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## adagioca (Apr 28, 2004)

My BT70 on my bar crapped out last night (gotta wonder why it got pulled off the market!). Looking for some advice on a replacement. Seems like the XP4 would be comparable but I'm also afraid of having a hot spot rather than a more wider flooding beam and therefore also considering getting the XP3 instead.

FYI, I run a BT21s on my lid and BT40 + BT70 on my bar. Yes, I do like it bright but more importantly having backups in case something goes wrong.

So between XP3 and XP4, what would benefit me most?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Bt70 at put out as much light as the xp3, maybe a little more if yours was a first production run. Xp4 is A LOT brighter than a bt70 ever was (I have one that still works only because I did the review then it got tossed aside).

Xp3 optics can be customized where as the 4 as of right now has the strong hot spot. No word on wider optic for it yet.

But the xp4 obviously is A LOT of light. And the hot spot is rather large so it might be to your liking. I don't mind it much with as much as I hate strong hot spots on a bar light.

You'll be sitting a lot better off than that bt70 either route you choose, that's for sure.

And based in your current set up, xp4 puts out almost as much as both of them combined (without fear of the light failing) so you could drop to the one xp4 and be done with it.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

tigris99 said:


> Ive been going between dual wide and flood and dual flood with a wide. But Im not a fan of a serious hot spot on my bar light. draws my eyes in instead of ahead where my helmet light is at. The wide spots still have the hot spot but its slightly bigger and the transistion is nice and smooth. adding a flood in the middle of them I like (my cameras not so much, they hate hot spots in close lol)


Looks like I'll have to order a few of them and then start switching them one at a time. I'll don't think I'll like the flood optic because likely a lot of light ends up being wasted. Keep in mind I'm happy with the Gloworm X2 on the bars with standard spot and one wide. I might be happy just replacing the center optic on the XP3 with just one wide optic. Nevertheless, I'll buy three wide and two floods and play around to see what I like. If I do decided to move the XP3 to the bars the hardest part will be losing the nice center mounting that the GW lamps provide. None of this will happen though until Gloworm comes out with wireless remotes. In the mean time I still plan on sending one of the Gemini Duo-R's back to have it switched over to the warmer NW tint.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

LUX TEST (S=Spot, WS=Wide Spot)
XP3 optic setup.........................Bounce Test..............Center-beam

S/S/S...........................................310..........................9800

WS/S/WS......................................303.........................9300

WS/WS/WS...................................298..........................9100

As you can see not huge differences in these setups measured with the light-meter. Last nights ride with the bar mounted XP3 (WS/S/WS, no helmet light) was far more revealing. Love the "wide spot optic" in my Wiz20, hate them in the XP3. Low (40%) was OK but on Med/Hi (70/100%) there was way too much light around the front of the bike killing the perceived throw and a hot spit mid beam making the additional spill ineffective. Retested tonight with all spots and it was much better. I've got lots of different optics so when I get a chance I'll try something different.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I just took that fat bike out on my home trail run xp3s. Right after sun down, so an early ride for me.

Mole if you have to seen the pic, my forks are still MIA but I did post a pic in the other thread. Except now I got 4.7 tires front and rear. Omg what a fun ass ride! Little tire run when I'm mashing cause their isn't much room but rides like a dream. And not not pedal striking in root clusters anymore!

On Topic again:

Dual flood and one wide spot, LOVE IT. Found my beam patterns now. Just enough balance to not screw with my eyes so I'm on the helmet light not looking down. 

Sorry no pics or video, this was a "check conditions" ride cause I haven't been out there in a bit and it's my trail to manage. Bought a cordless chainsaw after I realized I have 5 downed trees out there now. Be out there first thing tomorrow since this little thing I can strap to the rack. Ride and do clean up instead of hiking it.

I'll get some video out there in the next few days. Fat bike on big tires with the current leaf cover is keeping trails in rideable condition even through recent rains.

But Mole I do agree, wide spot has a lot of spill which isn't bad Imo but I like the floods better which seem to be actually 30 degree. The specs from whoever makes them are way off, think they are measuring total spread, not how you are supposed to which is off the center line against 90 degree to one side. I can't ride heavy on spots or wide spots on the bars. All flood is a bit much too. Dual wide spot with single flood was still too much spot for me.

Anyway, back to getting ready for tomorrow. Charge batteries for camera, gimbal, lights and chainsaw lol. Can't wait to let the Mukluk off the chain out there once I get trees cleared.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> LUX TEST (S=Spot, WS=Wide Spot)
> XP3 optic setup.........................Bounce Test..............Center-beam
> 
> S/S/S...........................................310..........................9800
> ...


This is the very thing I'm trying to avoid. Too much light directly in front of the bike hampers distance vision. This is why I will replace only one optic at a time until I find the combination that works for me. MRM, if you can try ...spot/w-spot/spot....let me know how you like that combination.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I'm going out in a few with the xp3 on the lid. Going to try two wide spots with one regular spot in the middle. I had 3x25d wide spots in before and liked it on the lid. Having problems with intense spot patterns at my old age! Smooth is good even if I loose a lil distance...


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> This is the very thing I'm trying to avoid. Too much light directly in front of the bike hampers distance vision. This is why I will replace only one optic at a time until I find the combination that works for me. MRM, if you can try ...spot/w-spot/spot....let me know how you like that combination.


Sorry it took so long to respond. I've been out all day off-roading in a jeep. Different but very fun. No chance to get out tonight but maybe tomorrow. Will try your suggestion and thinking about incorporating Gloworm elliptical wide angle's after that.
Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

MRMOLE said:


> ...... I've been out all day off-roading in a jeep. Different but very fun.


For sure! Years ago on the first time I went to Moab my son and I were tired of riding as we had spent the previous 4 days in the St George and Zion area, so I rented a Jeep and hit some of the trails. Amazing where that thing could go!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dirt Road said:


> I'm going out in a few with the xp3 on the lid. Going to try two wide spots with one regular spot in the middle. I had 3x25d wide spots in before and liked it on the lid. Having problems with intense spot patterns at my old age! Smooth is good even if I loose a lil distance...


The spot optics on the XP3 don't really provide that intense of a spot IMO. Works great on the helmet and provides the distance throw I need when helmet mounted. I might be fine with 3-spots on the bars but since I use one spot and one med-wide optic with the Gloworm X2 I usually use on the bars, I figured just a single med-wide optic with the XP3 would be fine for use on the bars. I might just have to try the XP3 as is ( 3-spots ) on the bars just for the heck of it. Thing is XP3 is my go-to helmet lamp. If I use the XP3 on the bars I'll have to use either my Gemini Olympia on the helmet or my old SStorm XT40 ( neither of which can equal the throw of the XP3 with 3-spot optics ). Might just have to run the Olympia on the helmet just to see what it looks like to run two lamps capable of outputting over 2000 lumen. ( not that I would normally need that much light )


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yep, after my ride last night, I'm taking the 2 wide spots out and going with the 10d across the board. The setup last nite was definitely not to my liking. I had my gloworm xs on the bars and had it on low med for most of the ride. I used my KD 2cell pack for the xp3 and had no issues for the 1-1/2hr ride. 3 spots seem best for the helmet, agreed.


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## Speeder500 (Oct 9, 2012)

What are the 10d optics, are they spot optics?


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Stock optics are narrow spot 10d

The smaller the beam angle, the smaller the spot/more throw

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> MRM, if you can try ...spot/w-spot/spot....let me know how you like that combination.


Spot/w-spot/spot bar mounted worked much better. Cut down foreground light intensity enough to where it no longer interfered with distance vision. :thumbsup: My preference would be for something a little wider so will continue to experiment.
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Dirt Road said:


> Yep, after my ride last night, I'm taking the 2 wide spots out and going with the 10d across the board. The setup last nite was definitely not to my liking. I had my gloworm xs on the bars and had it on low med for most of the ride. I used my KD 2cell pack for the xp3 and had no issues for the 1-1/2hr ride.* 3 spots seem best for the helmet, agreed.*


Yep, 3-spots on the helmet for sure. 

Tonight I finally got around to try the XP3 on the bars ( with Olympia-R on the helmet ). Beautiful day, 75° and sunny. About 5:30 I started loading up the car. When I came out with the bike I happened to notice some dark clouds on the horizon...pause....took the phone out to run my weather app. %4#@#$$%ich!!....Storms moving in! :incazzato: Damn!, wasn't suppose to rain today! Hate when that happens. Anyway, canceled the ride, cussing all the way as I walked the bike back to the house. Didn't help that two hours later most of the rain happened to miss the area and what rain did come was only a slight drizzle. :madman:

Life goes on. About 10:00pm I considered going out but I hate to start night rides that late ( unless it's summer and I'm on vacation ). In an attempt to stave off the funk I was in after canceling the trail ride I decided to take the mountain bike out on the local paved trails. I was dying by this time to know how the XP3 was going to work on the bars so I figured a ride on pavement was better than nothing.

First thing I noticed that when I first turned the lamp on ( low ) that it was very clear that the spot pattern of the 3 optics was very apparent and somewhat narrow. I adjusted the angle of lamp and rode a short distance through a series of winding turns using just the XP3 on low. Definitely not as wide a beam pattern as my usual GW setup ( spot/wide ) off the bars. When I finally decided to switch to the medium mode a lot changed. Suddenly I could see a whole lot better and the throw coming off the bars was outstanding. Beam pattern was still tight-ish but for the most part I think I could deal with it on a trail as long as I'm using a helmet lamp with a medium-wide beam pattern in combo.

Of course once I turned on the Olympia I had more than enough extra spill to spot anything close in. A lot of the paved trail was leaf covered and most of it damp. Color rendition of the two lamps in combo was very good. Probably helped that the XP3 is a tad warmer in tint although the two lamp tints blended together very well. With both lamps on high... Freeking Awesome.

All things considered; I think I might like the XP3 on the bars with just a tad more spill to help light things up a little better in the periphery. I'm thinking one wider-spot in the center might give me that. That said I loved having all that throw coming off the bars. Most of the time I was using the medium settings for both lamps and could see things in the distance ( and close in ) very well. I'm hoping all of these observations translates over the next time I hit the dirt trails.

A few side notes; Gemini Olympia on the helmet seemed to work very well in combo with the ITUO XP3 on the bars. This was my first time using the XP3's wired remote and I will say it worked very well. The Olympia; I was using vancbiker's Go-pro adapter and it too was working very well. The ITUO's Go-pro mounts; both bars and helmet were also working well. The repair I made to the helmet mount seems to be holding up, at least for now.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

MRMOLE said:


> Spot/w-spot/spot bar mounted worked much better. Cut down foreground light intensity enough to where it no longer interfered with distance vision.  My preference would be for something a little wider so will continue to experiment.
> Mole


Mole

Since glowworm optics fit the white holders.....

I'm liking 2 flood and a wide spot. For the bars. 3 narrow or 2 and a wide (don't remember what's fitted in mine atm) Smooth, even beam (at least to my eyes, well see what the GoPro h5 has to say about it lol).

Took the fatty out and rode trails I didn't think I would again on the fat bike. First 2 times I tried it was miserable on that trailset. Tonight being the new bars and such plus now a matching 4.7 in the rear it was MUCH more fun. The really rough stuff was a lot more bearable and having my lights dialed made for a full pace ride.

Just got home so be a bit before I get video uploaded. Hope the hot spot isn't crazy off the bar light now like it was my last attempt last week.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Mole
> 
> Since glowworm optics fit the white holders.....
> 
> ...


My plan for next setup to try is GW elliptical/Ituo wide spot/GW elliptical. Should provide very wide smooth beam without a lot of foreground light and little wasted spill. Vertical flood less important on the flatter trails I ride. No ride tonight, Halloween duties.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Here's a video with my bar set up works good for my stuff since I have a lot of low hanging stuff to worry about.






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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Here's a video with my bar set up works good for my stuff since I have a lot of low hanging stuff to worry about.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the video, Nice! I got to try the GW wide-angle/Ituo wide-spot/GW wide-angle setup last night. Smoothed the beam out a lot over any usage of narrow-spots that I've tried and much wider beam. Throw still very good. 2 meter center-beam light meter test was 6700 lux which is about what I normally see from my XP2/X2 with narrow spot optics. Will try the Ituo 45's in place of the GW wide-angles next (your setup).
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Mole, you won't like them lol. Granted the light in close is probably a bit less than the wide spots, the beam is rather spread out. My bar light is pointed almost straight forward with my set up to avoid too much light in close but have solid coverage all the way around.

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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Mole, you won't like them lol. Granted the light in close is probably a bit less than the wide spots, the beam is rather spread out. My bar light is pointed almost straight forward with my set up to avoid too much light in close but have solid coverage all the way around.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


I've got the optics and I'll never know till I try (I've been surprised before) so we'll just have to see if your prediction is accurate. I want to run lux readings on the setup anyway + I ride so much I'm always looking for ways to keep it interesting (light testing is great for that).
Mole


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

tigris99 said:


> Here's a video with my bar set up works good for my stuff since I have a lot of low hanging stuff to worry about.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great video tig. That Gopro camera looks to get some decent clarity. Obviously riding with two XP3's has to be great. I'm considering buying another but I'll give Gloworm till spring of next year to come out with a wireless remote version of the XS.

Interesting to hear you all talk about the different optic combos. Sadly videos can't demonstrate total spill. Doesn't really matter though because everyone will still have their own preferences. I'm going to order two of the Flood and three wide-spots and play with it to see what works best for me.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

tigris99 said:


> Mole, you won't like them lol. Granted the light in close is probably a bit less than the wide spots, the beam is rather spread out. My bar light is pointed almost straight forward with my set up to avoid too much light in close but have solid coverage all the way around.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


Tried your 45/25/45 optic setup and you were right. I didn't like it because nearly all my trail rides involve a 10-20 mile ride on surface streets or pedestrian populated canal banks to get to the trail and aiming the light down to make it some what acceptable puts way too much light right in front of the bike hindering distance vision. Aimed as you described this optic combo worked great for trail riding. Wide smooth beam and still good throw. Bounce test lux #'s were only slightly less the using the GW elliptical's in place of the 45's, center-beam (throw) more effected (GWW/25/GWW - 6700 vs. 45/25/45 - 5900) but still quite good for a flood. For me the ovalized beam of the elliptical style is a better fit.
Mole


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I expected as much. But now you see why I like it for trail use. I don't have the pavement matter to deal with to get to a trail (it's a 35min or more drive via highway to all except one)

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## Rockhucker (Aug 1, 2010)

I received my xp3 today and changed the optics to ws/f/ws for a floody bar light and paired it up with my nw gloworm xs on my helmet and boy this is a mean combo! I would like a hair more throw from the xp3 on the bars so I need to play with the optics a bit but with both lights at 1500lumens it's like riding in the daylight, just more fun.
I'm super pleased with the quality of the light setup ecspecially for $100 less than my xs.

Good job Ituolights


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

If you want more throw put a stock optic in the middle. The flood optic has no throw in the sense we think of. If you've seen the videos posted, my trails dont really give room for a lot of throw but with all my switch backs and such in the woods the added spread is nice. I'm weird like that though 

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## Rockhucker (Aug 1, 2010)

I switched out the optics for stock/ws/stock(similar setup as my XS) and snuck out for a quick 17mile ride before the sun came up this morning. Setup is now exactly what I wanted. XP3 is a great light!!


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

Yesterday I managed it to do the first night ride with my new Ituo Wiz XP3. Due to strong rain- and snowfall (southwest of Germany) in the last days my hometrails were very wet and slippery and the humidity was very high (temperature 0° C).

Setup was the Ituo as helmet light and the Yinding YD-2XU2 on the bar (MTB: Alutech Sennes Freeride Ltd.). Most of the time I was running both lights on medium mode and only went to high mode in very technical and/or fast sections. To keep long story short – I’m very impressed, nice even beam in front of the tire and an excess of lumen. I’m pleased with 10° standard optics as a helmet light, maybe I will experiment with other optics in future to see what works best for me. The neutral white emitters of the Ituo are fantastic compared to the cool white of the Yinding – great contrast, can see every detail on the wet foliage. Wired remote (attached on helmet too) worked fantastic. It’s easy to control the lamp even with thicker gloves it’s not a problem to switch between the modes – that’s the way it has to be.

Unfortunately a misfortune happened – had the helmet with the running Ituo still on my head when I was trying to return the bike in my car (it was very dark). I pushed the helmet against the open tailgate of the car, breaking the plastic lamp holder (see pic) – **** happens. Had already contact with Trevor of BrightBikeLights (UK) – he will send me the replacement part tomorrow.

The Ituo Wiz XP3 is the best bike light you can get for your money and thumbs up for the fantastic customer service of Trevor from BrightBikeLights:thumbsup:.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Welp after playing with multiple light combos since I needed to test out all the options I come back to:

Xp3 with 2 narrow and a wide spot for the lid (or the other way around...)

The a wide spot/flood mix on an xp2 on the bars.

Got pretty crazy on my fat bike tonight, "LOOK MA, NO BRAKES" was the theme for tonight. Went on a group ride with fellow club members (the ones that aren't afraid to ride in 35F) and I felt like crap for the first half. Strong temp drop killed my air pressure by the time I got to the trails, that was fun....NOT. we stopped at what we call the "moon deck", drank a beer (yes hydropacks are beer can haulers more often than for water) and about a mile after that I felt like a tank rolling down the trail!!!

Learned why even fat bikes need suspension, not sure how I didn't eat it hard, smack a tree with my bars, or break something but it was all smiles and and some killer speed. Feeling the beating now though lol. Think fatty might need a dropper cause getting a seat rammed up in the wrong places isn't noticed till after the 45 minute drive home.

Also ran the 2 cell pack (not ituo, same 2 cell ncr18650ga 3500mah cells, but no neoprene pouch, nylon thing instead). Glued some of that scotch dual lock Velcro to it so it would mount the same as my Fenix case and away I went. Nothing like good, high discharge cells to make a 2 cell pack doable for a 3x light.

This was my last night ride for about a week and a half, heading to STL Wednesday morning for the holiday weekend. Know im taking the fat bike, bit rack has room for 2 so trying to decide on road or 29er. Wife said no bikes inside her van for the trip so limited to 2.

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## barncat (Aug 18, 2006)

Cyber monday 20 percent off!,,


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Blue66 said:


> .......Unfortunately a misfortune happened - had the helmet with the running Ituo still on my head when I was trying to return the bike in my car (it was very dark). I pushed the helmet against the open tailgate of the car, breaking the plastic lamp holder (see pic) - **** happens. Had already contact with Trevor of BrightBikeLights (UK) - he will send me the replacement part tomorrow.


Replace the plastic GoPro mount with the aluminum one shown here and it won't be breaking from hitting the tailgate (or anything else for that matter)...

Ituo Wiz XP3 - Page 4- Mtbr.com

It also makes the light sit lower so might be less likely to get hit in the first place. One of these days I'll update my website and get these newer adapters listed.


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## mentawais (Feb 16, 2005)

*what Key?*



Vancbiker said:


> Replace the plastic GoPro mount with the aluminum one shown here and it won't be breaking from hitting the tailgate (or anything else for that matter)...
> 
> Ituo Wiz XP3 - Page 4- Mtbr.com
> 
> It also makes the light sit lower so might be less likely to get hit in the first place. One of these days I'll update my website and get these newer adapters listed.


What´s the right key to ITUO XP3 screws , I got my aluminum GoPro mount but I can´t screw out the original ITUO screws:madman::madmax::nono::eekster::nono:


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

IIRC the Ituo uses TORX head screws. The screw size is metric M2.5 but I do not remember what size TORX wrench it uses. The screws I provide with the aluminum adapter are regular metric Allen head screws.


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

Torx wrench size T8


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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

Does anyone know how many lumens each of the default light levels are? Their website mentions 2, 4, and 10 hours of run time, but they don't say how bright each level is. Or at least I can't find it. The online manual only shows data for the XP2.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Stock program is 10-50-100%. So about 300 on low and about 1200 on medium. I have the numbers somewhere from the sphere test but the default output percentages fall in line pretty close to what the lumen outputs actually are.

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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

I would imagine it would be slightly more than 1500 on medium judging by the XP2 that is rated for 4 hours at 1500 lumens. The XP3 shouldn't have to be driven as hard to hit 1500 lumens so the led's should be a bit more efficient. Of course that difference probably wouldn't be perceptible. 

I just ordered the light, now to find out if my wife will let me open it up early or wait until Christmas.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I was just throwing a guess because I can't remember if it's 50% of lumens or 50% of current draw. Guess I'll have to plug it in and find out again.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

Vancbiker said:


> Replace the plastic GoPro mount with the aluminum one shown here and it won't be breaking from hitting the tailgate (or anything else for that matter)...
> 
> Ituo Wiz XP3 - Page 4- Mtbr.com
> 
> It also makes the light sit lower so might be less likely to get hit in the first place. One of these days I'll update my website and get these newer adapters listed.


Played with the idea to replace the original mount with your GoPro aluminum adapter right after the crash - fine work btw. I had already ordered one if the delivery of the original replacement mount has taken longer.
About the busted mount - my opinion is that it's nice to have a defined breaking point in case of a crash but hitting the car's tailgate not so hard should not break the mount easily. Would be better if the GoPro quick release mount is the weak point because it's not a problem to get GoPro mounts just around the corner. Anyway the new replacement mount looks a little bit different (maybe improved design) let's see how long it will last.
One the other hand - when using your aluminum adapter, the GoPro quick release mount should become the weak point (quick & cheap replacement) and I get a better heat transfer and a light head reduced in height. 
In addition to longer delivery time, another point are the shipping costs from USA to Germany and the customs clearance. No idea what the shipping costs are but I hope they do not exceed the costs of the adapter?


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Blue66 said:


> .......In addition to longer delivery time, another point are the shipping costs from USA to Germany and the customs clearance. No idea what the shipping costs are but I hope they do not exceed the costs of the adapter?


Sadly the international postage increase by the USPS in January 2016 nearly doubled the price to Germany and other EU countries. It now costs me US$13.50 to send a package. I add US$1.00 to cover the cost of mailing supplies for a total of US$14.50. I have seen an increase in "group buys" due to this. A group of friends or club members get together and place a larger order and split the postage cost. Depending on the adapters ordered, I can mail 4-8 at the same price.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

I got my xp3 mount from vanc, quick to the my door. I just been so freaking busy at work, I jump on the bike with the xp3 on the helmet with the 20d optics I still have to change out (don't like this setup) for the 10d optics. I have not opened the package yet, but I'm sure , the mount is going to be sweet.


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## ~Ish (Aug 25, 2009)

yeah, the mounts I picked up from vanc for the XP2 and XP3 are working great!


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

Vancbiker said:


> Sadly the international postage increase by the USPS in January 2016 nearly doubled the price to Germany and other EU countries. It now costs me US$13.50 to send a package. I add US$1.00 to cover the cost of mailing supplies for a total of US$14.50. I have seen an increase in "group buys" due to this. A group of friends or club members get together and place a larger order and split the postage cost. Depending on the adapters ordered, I can mail 4-8 at the same price.


Thanks for the fast reply :thumbsup:, shipping costs are OK and in the range as I expected. Good idea with a "group buy" - will ask my bike buddies if they are interested in.


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## MtnBkrBob (Aug 15, 2007)

Have 3 night rides with my recently purchased XP3. Other than the cable seems a tad short and it’s a little funky to turn off, I love ‘em. Haven’t even experimented with the other lenses yet. 

Get comments from others that they like it when I’m behind them because they can now see where they are going. Good stuff.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

There is an extension cable available if you need it so you can put the battery pack about anywhere you would want.


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## adagioca (Apr 28, 2004)

Somewhat related, I was under the impression reading how everyone had experimented with the different lens that the different lens would be included with the light. Those have to be purchased separately?

Looks like I'll have to wait until next week to try out. Just looking at it fit and quality seems very good for this price point.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

That would depend partially on where your ordered from, US location (not sure about UK dealer) is the only one that carries the other optics. Then when ordering you specify what you want installed. Factory doesn't ship with other optics, just stock ones.

That said if your using for helmet then stock optics are perfect. And some prefer stock optics for bars. Its why I offer the other optics (and option to have them changed). So many different preferences since so many different styles of trails around the world, each rider preferring specific beam patterns for their trails.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

Mine came in the mail yesterday. I ordered the light with the battery pack. It came with the battery, light, extension cable, remote, bar mount, and helmet mount. So at least if you order the full package you shouldn't have to worry about also getting the extension cable. 

The user manual also answered my questions about brightness levels. It includes lumens at each level, but not run time for anything other than the default levels. 

Custom levels
10% - 230 lumens
20% - 460 lumens
30% - 690 lumens
40% - 920 lumens
50% - 1150 lumens
60% - 1380 lumens
70% - 1610 lumens
80% - 1840 lumens
90% - 2070 lumens
100% - 2300 lumens

Default levels
Low - 600 lumens - 9 hours battery
Medium - 1200 lumens - 4.5 hours
High - 2300 lumens - 2 hours. 

I am not sure why the custom levels don't match up with the default levels. It's like they rounded the default levels or picked levels that aren't available from the programmable interface. The manual also mentions that the battery pack is 6400 mAh, not 6800 mAh so the numbers could just be slightly out of date. 

Overall it feels like a good light. Very bright and much smaller than I was expecting. This is my first light though and I unfortunately won't be able to use on a ride until around Christmas. I may try to get beam shots or something before then.


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

MTB night ride: temperature -1° C / 30° F, humidity 94%

Helmet: Ituo Wiz XP3 (optic 10°/25°/10°)
Bar: Yinding YD-2XU2 (optic 2x elliptical spot lens 30°x60°)
Mode: high (both lights on the trails, except on the last picture)














Soccer field - goal to goal distance approx 90-120 meters (100-131 yards)


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Nice pics Blue, thanks for sharing. Nice bike too!

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Well, had to wrestle the xp3 mount off just to get at the torx bits to install the vanc mount. I won't be reinstalling the original mount ever again. I feel like burning it.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Sounds like you put it on backwards lol. All the ones I have come off really easy by squeezing the tab towards the light head amd sliding the light forward(or mount backwards from the light)

From the posts about that here that's a detail that may need to be adjusted because several have accidently managed to force them on the wrong direction. Or maybe they go together easier than the ones I have (afraid I'll break the mounts if I try to force them on the wrong direction)

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> Nice pics Blue, thanks for sharing. Nice bike too!
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


No problem - yeah love it, my bike for everything (DH, park, trail riding).
Btw. to the community: thx for sharing your opinion & knowledge:thumbsup:


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## Rockhucker (Aug 1, 2010)

I have dozens of rides on my xp3, both for mtbing and my daily commute. Today it got the full on under water dunk test when I seriously misjudged the depth of the puddles on the bike path, needless to say my ride home included a swim. The light went into the water in flash mode and came out in flash mode. PASS


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Nice especially when they aren't rated for swimming . Good to know xp3 is being put through the worst we do to lights and come out the other side without any issue.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## eTrex_FSR (Dec 18, 2009)

Blue66 said:


> No problem - yeah love it, my bike for everything (DH, park, trail riding).
> Btw. to the community: thx for sharing your opinion & knowledge


Which bike is it?

Gesendet von meinem LG-H850 mit Tapatalk


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Rockhucker said:


> I have dozens of rides on my xp3, both for mtbing and my daily commute. Today it got the full on under water dunk test when I seriously misjudged the depth of the puddles on the bike path, needless to say my ride home included a swim. The light went into the water in flash mode and came out in flash mode. PASS


Rock

I just realized something I had better post ASAP.

The light heads can take it but it may have cost you the battery pack. They are NOT sealed completely. They can handle rain at any level but you had better take the pack out of the pouch and the bottom of the pack has a square looking "plug" . Pop that out and make sure there is NO water inside the pack! if water gets in to the protection circuit (which thankfully the pack has another level of protection, the shrink wrap) that pack will short out. Not something that was expected was for the packs to take a swim lol.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Got my vanc mount on and put 10d optics back in.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Looks good! 

BTW, the XP series LoPro adapters are double sided. It can be mounted as you have it or flipped over for an even lower mounting.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Yep, I noticed the 2 sides! Excellent machining, top notch piece. Wery happy!


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

eTrex_FSR said:


> Which bike is it?
> 
> Gesendet von meinem LG-H850 mit Tapatalk


Sorry, it's OT but he asked - it's the 2016 "Alutech Sennes FR 2.0 FREERIDE limited-edition" 

https://alutech-cycles.com/Sennes_1


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

Deleted


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## Blue66 (Sep 18, 2016)

First of all - Merry Xmas to all!

Last night I did another ride with the XP3 anf the Yinding.
1st try with my GoPro on a night ride under very hard conditions for filming - cold, wet & foggy, the humidity was still up in the 90% range. The glare of humid air, wet trees, shrubs and bushes etc. reduced the range significantly.

Here is the video:


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

I've got two of these on the way, as well as a vancbiker mount for each. Tired of messing with cheap garbage, I have had what I suspect to be a yinding killing battery packs (its the only constant, currently two picks that won't charge), I also have A bt40. Looking forward to having some reliability 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

What's the best optic set up for helmet and bar? 


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I use wide spots/narrow spot mix on the helmet and wide spot/flood mix for the bars myself.

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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

I notice there are three diff ones, I assume the clear is narrow spot, slightly frosted is wide spot and "pixelated" is the flood? That sounds like a good mix. They really should have an instructional video on changing them, really easy to lose the tiny and large o rings. Glad I noticed I had dropped a tiny one. 


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Ya your exactly right on which is which. I've been meaning to update the images properly as to which is which.

They werent meant as "user changeable" for the masses from Ituo directly. It was allowing the option due to our requests here. Also why I'm the only option for getting custom optics done in house right now.

The optional optics and all that offered on the website are something I do myself for those that want them(and change them upon request). A "how to" video is on the list for this but optics change is somewhere near the bottom at the moment. All of those things are completely on my shoulders to make right now. 

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

rad3144 said:


> What's the best optic set up for helmet and bar?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I use 3 narrow spot optics on the helmet, and two floods and one wide spot on the handlebars. 
I love the 3 narrow spots on the helmet. They are not as spotty as I was thinking they would be, but it's perfect for riding. Just a giant perfectly even hotspot, with enough spill on the side to actually be useful. The only time I would have liked more is when I was I was going very quick down a fire road and was looking out for washed out sections of the trail way up ahead. 
For the handlebars I like my current setup, but I am tempted to replace one of the floods with another wide spot or a narrow spot. Most of the trails I ride you rarely see more than 50 feet in front of you which my setup works fine at. But I have noticed if I get onto a fire road it doesn't light up as far as I would like unless I really bump the brightness up. But for narrow twisty trails the handlebar lights up pretty much everything in my peripheral vision. This leaves me free to point my head wherever I like without feeling like I have blind spots.

My last ride I kept both lights at about half brightness most of the time and never found myself uncomfortable because I was unable to see where I was going.


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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

One thing some of the existing screenshots didn't show too well is how the spot beams look when mounted on a helmet. I was worried it would be to narrow but it is not. Putting it lower on the bars changes the shape a bit.

Here is it helmet mounted with the beam pointed around 10 feet in front of the front tire. 








Here is the beam pointed 20-30 feet in front of me. Its a giant perfectly even round wall of light that covers the whole width of the trail. There is also enough spill so that my peripheral vision can see things around me. 








Here is the headlamp combined with another XP3 mounted on the handlebars.








While the exposure is the same on all 3 images, I forgot to force the white balance. Thus why the second one looks a bit more yellow than the other two. Both lights were also set to about half brightness, but the images you see are pretty close to what I see in real life.


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## Oxidizer (Oct 27, 2015)

^ Thanks for sharing your photos of the beam pattern. In person the spread seems much wider than I've seen in any photo. I'm really happy with my XP3 and the stock optics. I run it on my helmet and use a L&M Trail 850 on the bar. I went this route after messing around with cheap Amazon lights (all of them failed by the way). What a difference the XP3 makes out on the trail. Here'a shot of my lights on full blast.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*XP3 accessories*











Having the proper Ituo extension cable should make helmet mounting a little more reliable as I would sometimes disconnect from the non screw on one I was using. New jersey's RAKC now sells are pretty nice! Made of a very light weight material and should be great for the hot summer nights coming up.
Mole


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Glad you like the shirt, figured you would their nice when it gets warm!

If you didn't know, the entire price (minus shipping fee) of the shirts does straight local cycling organizations. One of which is the club that is building the local multi-use trails, Human Powered League. 

Currently total multi-use but we are starting to cut trail to break away from equestrian traffic in the areas that stay wet longer as they like to ride once the upper bluff trail is dry. Plenty of land to work with and the founder wants to get it to the point were we can host 24hr events and such. Those are the trails I do most of my night rides and first test runs because their 10 minutes away (20 by bike on a good day, brutal hill to get to the park entrance).

I should do a new video out there. Me and my plus bike just fly through it. Done it a few times just on my XP3, no bar light because I forgot to grab my case but XP3 and 2 cell were already on my lid.

Let me know how you like the shirt in the REAL HEAT since you average nights are the hottest we see during the day 99.9% of the time.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Already tested it on tonight's ride. Only in the 90's but I can tell the fabric breaths very well + it's just very comfortable overall. I actually have had it on ever since I took that picture in my last post so along with 36 mi. on the bike it's been to the grocery store and with me to get a hair cut too.
Mole


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## Mr Bman (Jun 5, 2016)

Love my XP3 light!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

184.95 for an XP3 set - GREAT SALE PRICE! - Mole
https://www.ituolights.com/collections/mtb-light-kits/products/ituo-wiz-xp3-led-mountain-bike-light-kit-2200-lumens-w-6400mah-panasonic-battery-pack


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MRMOLE said:


> 184.95 for an XP3 set - GREAT SALE PRICE! - Mole
> https://www.ituolights.com/collections/mtb-light-kits/products/ituo-wiz-xp3-led-mountain-bike-light-kit-2200-lumens-w-6400mah-panasonic-battery-pack


Wow! That's the kind of deal that if I didn't already own one I be on real quick.

Hey MRM, I heard on the news a day ago that you were getting 117°-120°F down in your neck of the desert. If so that's got to be brutal. Makes me think of the phrase, "No world for old men". Do the bikes shops down there sell "*Still Suits"? ( *Dune reference )


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Cat,
Checked the weather channel an hour or so ago and said 117 then. Looking forward to a ride tonight, so this "old man" can handle it (with single digit humidity I'm sure you could too). Here's a couple of pictures from last Saturday's night ride in Fountain Hills. Was only 109 that day but with over 100 participants I never heard one complaint about the heat. Don't know what lights the riders in the Pictures had but I was wearing my XP3 helmet mounted so I guess these qualify for this thread.
Mole


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Nice

Man i miss the dry heat!!! 30 minutes in the woods here your soaked like you just crawled out of a lake.

Temps today here are low 80s . Just got back from doing the last of the weed wacking on my home trail. Was so bad it was unrideable. Trimmer going full blast like i was clearing new trail cause no trail visible (was there once everything hanging over it was cut back). Glad i brought a change of clothes cause i was soaked. And got rained on 50 yrds from the van due to a passing thunderhead opening up.

Now tonight, once the sun goes down i can get a lap or 2 in over there again. Hoping friday to hit one of the other trails after dark.

Xp3 on the helmet as well, probably play with the xp4 on the bars. The looks i get (and the reactions of startled couples hiking after dark as i come flying down the trail) is comical with that pair.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

They say word of mouth and the best advertising. In the few months I've been active in MTBR forums I have been in the lights and night riding subs a bit and you're all over this topic and you're input seems to be of the most helpful kind.

I have only read the first page yet and been siting to long to read the rest till later. I get stiff and sore when I'm not in motion. Makes sleeping........ interesting. I need to read rest to see if I want to go wider on the center lamp or not and how to mounting options have developed. But I now plan to buy at leat one set. The best light I've ever owned is a gen one niterider mounted to my motocross helmet back in my single days when I rode 4 stroke 30 or more hours a week and camped as many weekends as not. How would you rate these against those. My personal dream light is a night rider 3600 but with 2 kids talking about racing cross country this upcoming season and not even having real bikes yet, dreams are just that.



MRMOLE said:


> This is the best performing light I've ever owned.
> Mole


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

SoCalEpicRyder said:


> .......The best light I've ever owned is a gen one niterider mounted to my motocross helmet back in my single days when I rode 4 stroke 30 or more hours a week and camped as many weekends as not. How would you rate these against those.


You'll be blown away at how much brighter the XP3 is compared to the old Niterider.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Ive never ridden a light that old but new led lights are so much brighter.

If your wanting something thats comparable to the 3600, the XP4 would be right up your alley. Rated 3200, comes out a hair over 3300. Its a freaking monster lol. Fun on the rare occasion i can make use of full power though (dont have much for open ground here, usually its winding through the trees)

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

SoCalEpicRyder said:


> They say word of mouth and the best advertising. In the few months I've been active in MTBR forums I have been in the lights and night riding subs a bit and you're all over this topic and you're input seems to be of the most helpful kind.
> 
> I have only read the first page yet and been siting to long to read the rest till later. I get stiff and sore when I'm not in motion. Makes sleeping........ interesting. I need to read rest to see if I want to go wider on the center lamp or not and how to mounting options have developed. But I now plan to buy at leat one set. The best light I've ever owned is a gen one niterider mounted to my motocross helmet back in my single days when I rode 4 stroke 30 or more hours a week and camped as many weekends as not. How would you rate these against those. My personal dream light is a night rider 3600 but with 2 kids talking about racing cross country this upcoming season and not even having real bikes yet, dreams are just that.


I'm glad Vancbiker chimed in on the old niterider thing cause I'm not very familiar with the earlier models. Adding to his comments about light output, adjustability (optics for beam pattern, programmable power levels) and ease of use (wired remote and mode button on light-head far easier to use than niteriders clunky buttons) are probably a similar level of improvement as power output over the old niteriders. Changing optics is something best experimented with. I can give you a good idea what each different optic will do (ask away if you have questions) but customizing the beam pattern is best done by you. Finally here's what I use for bar mounting (got them from Vancbiker so PM him and he'll take care of you on this), Ituo helmet mount is very good so no change necessary there. Hope this helps!
Mole


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

I honestly doubt that much light is usable for the vast majority of us. I ran that old niterider on my chin bar riding my 450yzf at ocotillo Wells for a few years and it was more light than I needed. The most light I've ever played with is the 1200 lumens I have my rifle mounted light set for on burst only and that is to blind anything and everything foreward of the my point of view. Brighter is not better in most applications. What the molle and tigre have reaffirmed at various points in this discussion is that the lights designed to put out more light tend to put out a more usable amount of light for a lot longer than the lights designed to put out that level of light.

Thanks for chiming in. I'm going to check out the run times on the xp4 since I got some kids thinking or cross country racing. If one or both go down the endurance rabbit hole I'm going to be looking for cost effective long running quality lighting options. For now I think I have to order an xp4 so I can enjoy some quality off pavement night riding.



RAKC Ind said:


> Ive never ridden a light that old but new led lights are so much brighter.
> 
> If your wanting something thats comparable to the 3600, the XP4 would be right up your alley. Rated 3200, comes out a hair over 3300. Its a freaking monster lol. Fun on the rare occasion i can make use of full power though (dont have much for open ground here, usually its winding through the trees)
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

Yea. I've been very happy with the way LED technology has developed since my very first inova key chain and pocket lights back in my 98. Every year it's better and better. And now with good rechargeable batteries an intuitive chargers to make life bearable it's just so much better than life before led and smart natteriies/chargers. I remeber my old RC-10 and all the drama dealing with the batteries(I'm mechanically inclined, electronics makes my head hurt.) I'm excited to toss an xp3 on my helmet and hit skyline. Thanks for the input. And your heatsink gopro mount is like candy, I got to have some.



Vancbiker said:


> You'll be blown away at how much brighter the XP3 is compared to the old Niterider.


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

Thanks to the peeps who have contributed to this thread. You've done a lot of boots on the ground field testing of a product that was built to your specs and I like where it's gone. 12 hours ago I was excited to stumble onto some sketchy site selling niterider 2800s for 300 bucks. I'm glad I held off and I'm glad this thread made is to the top today so I got to see it at the right time. Niterider as of now has IMO gone the way of the magligt in the sense that they used to make the best but when the state of the art evolved they just kept doing the same thing. Yea, niterider may have embraced led and incorporated it into their line better than mag light has done but if ituo can come out of nowhere and accomplish this then a well established light maker at the top of the chain should have already been all over this and there's no reason for them to be charging what they do for what they are selling. As for magligt, I can trash talk them all I want, I used to sell them when I was in high school and they really dropped the ball by letting everyone else, including China leave them in the dust like they did. 

I can't wait to enjoy these things myself.


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

Oh yea, kudos to ituo for giving people what they want. I wish all companies would operate like this. I know it's a pita amd people are fickle. But sometimes it's so hard to find a good product because it seems like the companies making things a lot or the time don't even understand how their products are used by the customers. Others just push their ideas of how things should be onto us. Good on you guys. You've got another customer with 2 kids.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

SoCalEpicRyder said:


> I honestly doubt that much light is usable for the vast majority of us. I ran that old niterider on my chin bar riding my 450yzf at ocotillo Wells for a few years and it was more light than I needed.


I had 4 sets of old Halogen Niterirders of a couple different styles that I used for 24Hr races. After having 2 sets of them crap out within a short time and having to fix them myself, I decided I could build my own lights which started with an HID but then switched to LED. If you have good night vision, an old halogen is OK and I found that slower laps at night were more likely due to fatigue than holding back because of lighting. I estimate that the 12V niteriders were 300-400 lumen. 1500 lumen from an LED light is a huge improvement. Now 15+ years later (in my very late 50s!) I know my night vision is nowhere near as good. I usually run my lights at ~1800 lumen between helmet and bars. It really is more than enough, but I still click up to ~3500 for fast stuff because I can. It's really nice to have more than enough than to not have enough.


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

I think incandescent lights failing in use is the single mostly powerful strength of leg over them. I used to do post flight daily inspections of Seahawks on the flight deck at 2am with a Maglite 3D running krypton bulbs. Good usable light but battery life was meh. Always had to changed batteries at least once a shifter. And inevitably the bulb would blow immediately so I went through a bulb a shift as well. A couple years latter when I stumbled onto Gen 1 Inova lights it finished incondescent for me. It's really great to see companies pushing LED in this direction. It's only getting better. Like never changing a toasted bulb again!


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

SoCalEpicRyder said:


> ....I used to do post flight daily inspections of Seahawks...


Hope you mean SH60s and not football players  .


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

For a helmet light I love my XP3 run @ max. for a lot of the open desert trails I ride. With the stock spot optics it has great throw and a perfect for me beam size for comfortable (and safe) high speed riding especially for picking the best lines on double track. Tighter trails the beam pattern is still optimal but less power is required.

For bar use the power settings and beam shape that work best for me are considerably different. Stock spot optics have too narrow of a beam for my taste but substituting wider angle symmetrical optics puts too much light around the front wheel for my glare sensitive eyes. This limits the amount of power I can use before I start to lose visibility from too much light. Solution for me has been using elliptical style optics (Gloworm XS wide angle). These only widen the beam horizontally so vertical aim (and coverage) matches spots when combining optics but doesn't dump a lot of light around the front wheel or up in the sky plus less intensity loss (than with symmetrical wider angle optic) makes for a smoother beam IMO. This setup allows me to run more lumens before glare starts to negatively affect visibility. This is also why I prefer the XP3 style light with individual changeable optics compared to the more powerful XP4 (or similarly configured single optic/multi emitter lights).
Mole


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

Red light! Red light! I say again. Red light!



vancbiker said:


> hope you mean sh60s and not football players  .


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Hahaha. Only Vanc would go there lol.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## SoCalEpicRyder (Apr 26, 2017)

Just got mine in the mail. ITUO has excelent costumer communication. I get Facebook messenger notifications hahahaha. To bad I have notifications disabled for Facebook but I can look anytime I want to see status. They also fallow up on emails promptly. 

I have to say I'm super impressed with the whole package. The light itself is pretty compact and not heavy at all. The battery is 99% sealed in a nice rubber housing. Some silicone tape on the cable entry point with make it submersible. The included mounting options are very good, especially at the price point(185 bucks on sale.) I like the helmet mount enough to try it out and don't plan to bar mount it but the bar Clamp is a nice QD Clamp with the standard go pro mount. I'm hoping to give it a nice run this week. I can see ordering one or two two more units if my kids end up racing at night or if they start riding actual trails with me at night. 

Another hidden gem from the bike light gurus here on mtbr light forums.


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## Wire (Nov 2, 2015)

*Screw of front cover*

I changed optics of my XP3 and lost two screws of the front cover at the next ride, obviously I didn't tighten enough. Does anyone know the exact size of the screws?

I found some screws which looked very similar, but none of them did fit, it seems the thread of the original one is quite narrow.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Wire said:


> I changed optics of my XP3 and lost two screws of the front cover at the next ride, obviously I didn't tighten enough. Does anyone know the exact size of the screws?
> 
> I found some screws which looked very similar, but none of them did fit, it seems the thread of the original one is quite narrow.


Your biggest worry now is that you might have stripped the screw insert inside the lamp and maybe that is why the screws fell out in the first place. The only place I see on the web that still has a couple XP2 or XP3's for sale is a U.K. site. Maybe send them an email asking if they have any spare screws for the ITUO XP's sitting around(?) If not and if it were me I might consider using what screws I have, arrange them so I at least have one on the top, one on the bottom and then make sure I use something like the blue version of "Loctite" to keep the screws tight and in place. Then perhaps add a bit of electrical tape around the outside of the front to help keep the part that holds the front piece from rattling around or letting moisture seep in. Do what you have to do to make it work even if it means never being able to take the front off again. Losing the use of your XP3 would be a major bummer. ( note; the electrical tape idea might not work so good because the XP-3's get really hot when used on high. Possible the tape might actually melt. )


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## Wire (Nov 2, 2015)

Thanks, Cat! I tried one of the remaining screws at all positions, screw inserts seem to be OK at each site. If I don't find replacement screws I'll try the Loctite-fix. It would be a shame if Icouldn't use the XP3 anymore...


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