# Pedal Force MTB Frame Group Buy



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Wondering is anyone aware of this group buy? Anyway they are making a special group buy and they need a minimum of 50 people to get the group price. The frame is $500 if the minimum order is met, otherwise it will be at $850.

More information about the group buy can be had here:

http://pedalforce.com/online/product_info.php?products_id=3629

So check it out and get a new bike at a sweet deal! :thumbsup:


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

i'm in


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*uuuuh...*

very optimistic weights here!
an L size (19") at 1200g???

just a reminder: german Mountainbike magazine tested about 10 different high-end carbon hardtail framesets and only 2 came in at this weight! several of these expensive frames were over 1400g, several had low stiffness readings as well...i wouldn't buy such a frame if you can have nice aluminium frames cheaper and lighter.


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## Sprout (Jan 30, 2004)

Looks interesting. Do you know if this frame is the same as any of those tested in 
Mountainbike?

-Mark.


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## Nyquist (May 12, 2005)

I emailed PedalForce to query their weight claims, and got a very prompt reply, with this:

"Thanks for your enquiry. Yes, 1200g is the actual measured weight of the 19" frame. There is of course some variation from frame to frame, but not by very much."

Not sure what length fork the geometry is based on, but the angles certainly seem a little on the steep side.

Seems like a solid deal to me. Shame they aren't disc only so they'd be even lighter. And top tube routed cables. Boo.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

*Now GREMAN Bike can go shove all those tests...*

where the sen does't not shine!!! :eekster: .

The Pedla Force frames come in at requested weights and they make frames for soo mnay people it's not even funny from what I told. I have five people I know get their road frames and they are nothing but OUTSTANDING performing frames regardless of cost. Now I am starting to really dobut all these stupid test they do as bull crap and biased!

Anyone looking at CF MTB take a HARD look at these. The quality and CS seems to be there from what I have heard. These are TOP QUALITY Taiwan made frames.

remeber even Nino's beloved SCOTT is made in China.

Nino, this is nothing against you. But if BIKE put's down this frame, now I know they are talking pumpen Sie aus   :nono:


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## wiiija (Jun 23, 2005)

Very tempted, that price is stupidly low for what your getting.
Have my doubts that it will reach 50 by the deadline though.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

wiiija said:


> Very tempted, that price is stupidly low for what your getting.
> Have my doubts that it will reach 50 by the deadline though.


i'd be really surprised if we reached 50, but we can hope.
michael


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## bhsavery (Aug 19, 2004)

I've never heard of these people... anyone comment on their rep? Looks kinda taiwanesy (greymarketish)


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

bhsavery said:


> I've never heard of these people... anyone comment on their rep? Looks kinda taiwanesy (greymarketish)


 From what I have heard, outstanding. Now they are not grey market frames. These are made by the same factory that makes a TON of the Tawianese CF frames.
They come with 5 yr warranties as well.

More:



*About Us*









 *Pedal Force* - _Advanced bicycles at great prices_

Pedal Force carbon bicycle frames and parts are made by a group of companies in Taiwan who are major Original Equipment Manufacturers of carbon bike components and sports equipment. These are the same manufacturers that produce some of the most high-end products for many well known brand names. We are a USA company selling direct to customers worldwide.
Manufacturing monocoque carbon fiber frames, forks and seat posts is an inherently costly affair. Firstly, carbon fiber is an expensive material that is in high demand. Secondly, an expensive mould has to be made for every new part and frame size. Thirdly, it is a labor intensive process, not suited for high-volume production.
Obviously, most big brands would want to charge premium prices for such exotic stuff. Beside production costs, the final retail prices are also highly marked up by big investment costs in setting up dealer networks, advertising, team sponsorships and brand name promotion with the aim to reach a wide market audience.
So why are our prices so good? Because we sell direct and we don't incur huge costs in brand building campaigns. We only reach out to the real cyclists who know what they want. Our typical customer is a cycling enthusiast with good knowledge of bike riding and technology, knows a good product when he sees one, and found out about us through research or from their cycling network. By minimizing our cost of product promotion to a wider market audience, we aim to make the best cycling technology affordable to people who will truly enjoy it.
We believe that carbon composites make the most amazing bikes. Our products are designed for their high performance, strength, durability and good looks. Now everyone can afford them. All our products have undergone stringent quality control, and have been fully tested for strength and durability. All products come with a satisfaction guarantee and are warranted against defects in workmanship.
 

https://pedalforce.com/online/index.php


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## wordlesssong (Apr 26, 2006)

A word of promotion on my part, since I was the one who recommended the group buy to Atmos in the first place but I guess he was getting impatient with meeting the quota. Also to note, I'm not buying - I already have 5 bikes at home and a 6th one is coming, so please don't misjudge this as an attempt from me to breach the quota, although I'd like to help my friend out. ^^;

Firstly, the service (always the most important for me). Absolutely great service from them. I've had help with fitting, shipping prices, notification of prototype sales together with spy-pix, choice of shipping services, group purchases et cetera. What really impressed me was that they even recalled my interests expresed in one of my queries dating months back and sent me a follow-up when there was a discount in the price. Also, a shout out for Powercordz (IoDupont) and even nino (hey, sometimes you can disagree with what he thinks or what he recommends, but there's no doubt that he's pretty experienced, zealous and friendly to boot; most importantly, he speaks comprehensible and coherent English!) in this category! These are guys you should support and put in business!

Secondly, the weights. Many people have bought from them, a search in bikeforums, starbikes et cetera will yield many results, including that of real weights meeting the claims with decent accuracy. Besides, the weight isn't exactly uber-impressive to the point of disbelief. There are 800++g MTB frames, so what's so unbelievable about 1200g?

Thirdly, the quality. I think what's most significant if you've seen one in person is the finish. The naked carbon weave finish is really beautiful to behold. Users in other forums attest to its stiffness, although I must add that these are personal opinions and not tested. I don't subscribe to the same school of thought, but there are famous framemakers who believe that too much stiffness is not everything (e.g. Merten & Storck GmbH & Co), and others who believe that the torsion acting on a frame to the extent of flexure "springs" back at the end of an oscillation to make up for the loss of power.

Fourthly, for those who were wondering about their manufacture... Their source, ADK Technology Limited, is one of the leading CF components manufacturers in Taiwan, along with Martec Industrial Corporation, Topkey Corporation, Advanced Group/International Multitech Co. Ltd. et cetera, and supplier to many other known brands, and the same frame is rebadged as many other models by other brands. Do a search if you deem this as a form of insurance to build up your trust; I'm lazy to list the names, because it will probably start up another Who-makes-what warfare.

Edit: Yes, they're a US-based company. Basically, you get the warranty and assurance from them at affordable prices, instead of having to buy in bulk from dubious a OEM source or buying a rebadged frame at boutique prices.


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## Minjin (Dec 31, 2006)

I'm ready to sign up for the 29er version...


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Oh come on, nino only complains about stuff he's not selling anyways so the fact he's mentioning some german mag test really has nothing to do with it. But if it was something he was selling, there'd be no end of positive posting ad nauseum about it. All with unsubtle comments like "yes I sell them, PM me" in them. Its amusing how the mods for the different forums treat this kind of spam differently. In the vintage forum, rumpfy's pretty damn consistent on deleting such posts/threads without there being direct links to the classifieds, but lord knows that never happens in here.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*weights...*



DeeEight said:


> Oh come on, nino only complains about stuff he's not selling anyways so the fact he's mentioning some german mag test really has nothing to do with it. But if it was something he was selling, there'd be no end of positive posting ad nauseum about it. All with unsubtle comments like "yes I sell them, PM me" in them. Its amusing how the mods for the different forums treat this kind of spam differently. In the vintage forum, rumpfy's pretty damn consistent on deleting such posts/threads without there being direct links to the classifieds, but lord knows that never happens in here.


c'mon Dee8 - my only concern was the weight. if someone can prove me wrong i would be glad, really! i also think all those carbon frames are way overprized. especially the big names like Scott or Specialized and the like...if those are really that light and hold up that's GOOD NEWS!

it's just that there's lots of big companies selling carbon frames and only very few actually are that light as you can see in the scanned article above.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

I'm participating on the groupbuy for the road frame, i'm considering selling my spot and jumping on this gb..


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## Andfar (Nov 2, 2004)

Could you send the link for the road frame groupbuy? When's the deadline?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

just for a reference, some people successfully did this for the qs2-s back in november. It was started on bikeforums.net and then some people talked about it on roadbikereview.com. Here's the post on rbr:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=75526&highlight=pedal+force
they needed to get to 100 frames. i guess you sign up through pedal force and you do the money stuff through them also. they did a 200 dollar deposit and paid the rest later. hopefully this works out.
Michael


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## wiiija (Jun 23, 2005)

I've added myself, a mate of mine is going to aswell I think, fingers crossed we get enough now


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

i've put this on bikeforums.net and weightweenies so hopefully we can make it.
michael


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Andfar said:


> Could you send the link for the road frame groupbuy? When's the deadline?


Deadline has already passed but if you need/want a 58cm w/no decals and a cf fork i'll give you my spot for the deposit i already paid.


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

I posted this on the XC forum here and the MTB forum over on bike forums a little over a week ago and did not get that much of a response. I am glad it is getting some notice cause I want my frame 

MFW


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## ☻☻☻ (Aug 4, 2006)

*500 Dollar Carbon Fiber Frame*

I've added myself to the group buy list.

My present MTB has a road bike crank with a 147mm Q-factor. With the 68mm bb and shaped chain stays on the cf bike, I'll have the choice to use a road crank again. Maybe a 1X6 drivetrain using a single speed hub, or wait for the new 500 gram lighter Rohloff.

☻☻☻


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

so i'm 5'9" and i am trying to decide between the 19 and 17 inch. what do you guys think. Thanks
Michael


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## Some Guy (Mar 27, 2005)

I'd go the 19 if I were you. I'm 173cm (or 5"8) and going by the geometry information the 19" would be just about perfect for me.


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## Flip D (Sep 16, 2005)

*29er for me*



Minjin said:


> I'm ready to sign up for the 29er version...


I have the QS2 road frame and love it. I'd be the first one to plunk my money down if they were to offer a 29er frame.


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## Sprout (Jan 30, 2004)

I'm tempted by this, but I have a Giant MCM frame which I know weighs 1300g, and I'm a little cautious about buying a new frame which may be 100g lighter, but then again may be much heavier. 


-Mark.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Sprout said:


> I'm tempted by this, but I have a Giant MCM frame which I know weighs 1300g, and I'm a little cautious about buying a new frame which may be 100g lighter, but then again may be much heavier.
> 
> -Mark.


Though they could easily "fake it", why don't the guys at PedalForce show us a picture of the frame sitting on a scale, maybe with a couple more pics showing frame size to back up their claim.


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## Flip D (Sep 16, 2005)

Sprout said:


> I'm tempted by this, but I have a Giant MCM frame which I know weighs 1300g, and I'm a little cautious about buying a new frame which may be 100g lighter, but then again may be much heavier.
> 
> -Mark.


My 53cm PedalForce QS2 road frame came in at 2.18 lbs which is under the advertised weight of 2.20. I broke my road frame in a crash last year and decided to purchase the QS2 to finish out the season. The frame needed no prep work and built it up into a 17 lb bike with no bling on it. I like it so much I am building up another one as my lightweight racer. I am in no way associated with the company, but I am a statisfied customer who got a great product at a great price.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

I just joined the group buy. even at the normal price, I will buy one.


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## Bike Lover (Jul 14, 2006)

Ohhh... I'm still deciding...

It may make a nice b-day present for me but I wouldn't be able to build until sometime this summer. I am getting more involved with racing... but I just spent $$$ on a FS (KHS Team- '07 XTR) and a road bike (Campy Record).

Maybe I can use it as a paper weight?

Oh, BTW, the road bike was the other GB that PF did. We needed 100 people to sign up. In order to make it happen, we posted notices on other forums we frequently visited to let our other friends know about the deal...


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## Nyquist (May 12, 2005)

Hmmm...GB up to 36 people. Tempting...


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Nyquist said:


> Hmmm...GB up to 36 people. Tempting...


where did you get that pic?


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## Nyquist (May 12, 2005)

It's been added to the MT frame page on the Pedal Force website. Presumably they've had a few enquiries regarding the weight accuracy.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

damn this is so tempting..


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

I'm going to be in for a frame but I haven't felt like filling out the registration yet and we still have 12 days left


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

i assume theres still alot of people like you who register at the very last minute


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Atmos said:


> i assume theres still alot of people like you who register at the very last minute


hopefully


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*Probably true.*

If there was more history on these frame's I would buy 2 at that price but I'm not quite sure I'm ready to gamble two yet. But one I will try. :thumbsup:


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Very tempting it is!!! :madmax: 

How many more slots left before you, guys... Well, could start buildin' 'em from the ground up?¿? :skep:


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I think the boys at Pedal Force are gearing up for this GB. I got an email yesterday asking which frame size I'll be ordering.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Well I am in for two frames for sure and have already signed up. After measuring my other mountain bike frames, I will be getting 2 of the 17" frames. I did get an email yesterday about the sizing as well. I would bet that they will still offer this if they get close to 50. I am sure that they would not mind having a bit of stock as once the rest of us get our frames built up, they will get some calls for frames.

I am going to have one built up as an Xterra bike and the other built up as a Single Speed bike. 

Now all I have to do is fine a kick a$$ set of cranks for the Single Speed and they have to be carbon. The single speed should be carbon frame, Pace carbon rigid forks, carbon bars, carbon spacers, carbon seat post, carbon cranks and a nice carbon seat if possible.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

For those of you that are planning to sign up at the last minute--some folks have looked at the early numbers and decided it is not going to happen,so they gave up on the idea. Seems to me that if you plan to do it, you should do it now so others on the fence will get on board. Would be a shame if the group buy failed by one.:thumbsup:


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

C'mon, Nino... Any change of heart? What's your stand here.. Since you're one of the "hardcore" weight-weenies (meant it the good way) here! :thumbsup: 

Ei, how many more slots left?¿?

Cheers!


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## wiiija (Jun 23, 2005)

12 slots left


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Does anyone have quote for shipping to Europe? I sent them a note, but am impatient.


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## wiiija (Jun 23, 2005)

Yeh I wouldnt mind knowing that aswell, if its too high I might have to withdraw.


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## Nyquist (May 12, 2005)

Under 'Reference' >>> 'Shipping & Returns' on the PF website.

http://pedalforce.com/online/pages.php?page_id=24


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Thanks, I somehow missed that page. So, shipping to Germany or Luxembourg is $41 USPS, or $148! for DHL. I don't trust USPS with something delicate, so it's a tough decision.

I'll ask this guy if he can get the MTB frame:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200074177614

Warranty from US distributor doesn't matter much to me when secure 2-way shipping costs nearly as much as the frame.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

EuroMack,

I have actually bought parts from these people. They were by far the cheapest to by the KMC SL10x chains from in the world. Delivery was pretty cheap as well and fast. That being said, I do not see any cheap mountain frames on their site.

I for one will stick it out with Pedal Force and the MT. I am actually thinking about getting a third if I have to to make this deal fly and then just sell the third frame locally. I also have some designs on some decals to spruce up the frame a bit. I think that I will go with an outlined deep charcoal decal color that is just a shade lighter then the frame. Should look good. I have a guy in Hawaii that does custom decals and I am sure he could come up with some cool designs within my specs.

I would say that if you are interested that you should get your name in and then Pedal Force can email you with what size frame you are looking for. When I heard about this deal it was at 20 frames and not it is at 38 I believe that that is just over 2 weeks so hopefully we can get everyone back on track and get this deal going. It is an amazing deal from what I can see.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Ride on bdc88. I second that:thumbsup:


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

I signed up for one. I'm still measuring up the sizes to see which I'd prefer. I like the 19" but the 4.7" head tube is a little short. The zero stack headset means it's functionally even shorter right?


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## sonyisdope (Jul 24, 2004)

wordlesssong said:


> Secondly, the weights. Many people have bought from them, a search in bikeforums, starbikes et cetera will yield many results, including that of real weights meeting the claims with decent accuracy. Besides, the weight isn't exactly uber-impressive to the point of disbelief. There are 800++g MTB frames, so what's so unbelievable about 1200g?
> 
> Thirdly, the quality. I think what's most significant if you've seen one in person is the finish. The naked carbon weave finish is really beautiful to behold. Users in other forums attest to its stiffness, although I must add that these are personal opinions and not tested. I don't subscribe to the same school of thought, but there are famous framemakers who believe that too much stiffness is not everything (e.g. Merten & Storck GmbH & Co), and others who believe that the torsion acting on a frame to the extent of flexure "springs" back at the end of an oscillation to make up for the loss of power.


A few things. . .

First off, yes, I am totally ANTI-carbon fiber with bikes, I am sick of it, and I believe it is just a bunch of marketing of junk. So basically take what I am typing with a grain of salt from a self proclaimed "Carbon-Hater."

The weight. . .Sure, it could be right. Who cares though? If you want light weight, there are lighter frames out there. With carbon, you SHOULD be paying for the ride quality of it. You are most certainly NOT getting the renown carbon fiber ride quality on this particular frame. To be honest, you are not getting that "carbon" ride with most cheap carbon frames on the market. When you look at the entry level carbon offerings from companies like Schwinn (road bikes), Fuji, or whoever, they are not going to give you the same ride as some of the more in depth carbon processes that manufactures like Giant or even Trek use. Yes, it's carbon, it looks kind of cool, but your $500 pedal force is NOT the same frame as the Trek Elite series bikes. Don't kid yourself. The $500 pedal force is NOT the same carbon used on a stealth bomber or an F-1 race car. Once again, don't fool yourself. This is like telling me that a steel Huffy is the same as a steel Soulcraft. Sure, there is a much bigger gap between the Huffy and the Soulcraft, but there is still difference between cheap carbon and good carbon. Give carbon a few more years, and trust me, there will be dirt cheap carbon frames, similar to how there are dirt cheap aluminum frames now.

Next, the "Naked Carbon" weave you rave about. That is basically a sticker on top of the fugly carbon underneath. If you were to cut that frame in half, the inside would not look the same as the outside. Trust me. It is like if you buy a cheap desk from Ikea. Sure, the wood on the outside looks nice, but it is just particle board inside. With carbon, there are 2 processes to make carbon. The first process (which is used on F-1 cars, aerospace products, and even higher end bikes and components) is actually a woven process. This woven process is very strong, and will usually be woven in sheets that are layered on top of each other. There is NO carbon fiber process that has as large strips of carbon being woven together that you see on the Pedal Force frame. Sure, it looks cool, but it is merely a fancy cover over what's inside. What's inside you ask? Well, in cheap carbon fiber products, there is a molding process that they use. With a molding process, there is essentially a tube that pieces of carbon are blown into until they fill the mold, then a bladder is put inside the mold to squish all the bits of carbon together. If you don't believe me, cut your Truvativ team handlebar, or your Felt carbon steerer tube in half, and look inside it. Inside, you will see a bunch of pieces of carbon going in a bunch of different directions. It's not the prettiest thing, so that's why manufactures put a nice "carbon-veneer" on it. Now this blow-molded carbon is relatively inexpensive to product, with the nice covers in it, it looks fancy, but because it is not actually a "woven" product, you are not getting the ride quality of carbon fiber. You may get some forgiveness of aluminum, but you are not going to get lateral rigidity and vertical compliance that carbon is known for.

Basically, you are blowing $500 on a piece of carbon fiber from a no-name manufacture. I don't know why the whole bike industry is infatuated with carbon fiber. I mean, you are spending FIVE HUNDRED DOLLARS on something sight unseen, never ridden, because you think carbon is cool! Wake up people! This is FIVE HUNDRED BUCKS! That is not cheap! If you want an awesome mountain bike, there are a lot nicer hardtail frames out there for about the same amount of money!

Here is a look at a piece of a carbon fiber steerer tube from an Aerus (www.rideblue.com) Carbon fiber fork:









If you notice, the outside shell has a nice, smooth, consistent weave. The inside on the other hand is made up of a bunch of little bits that are in the shape of "L's". Some overlap each other, and some sections overlap other sections. They are blown in at the same rate, so there is some pattern forming, but the patterned sections overlap each other. Also, if you look at the cutaway section, there is no evidence of layers. On good quality layered and woven carbon fiber, there will be a consistent pattern even in the cross-section of it. This fork from the outside of the steerer tube looks like really nice carbon, and while it may offer some form of road vibration dampening when compared to aluminum, if you were blind folded, you would be hard-pressed to notice a difference.

Don't be fooled people! Quit wasting your money on carbon junk. If you want a nice frame, get Ti. If you only want to spend $500, get a nice steel Salsa, or nice quality aluminum frame (KHS team frame comes to mind!). You are wasting your money on carbon fiber because it looks cool, and it makes you feel better inside.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

Glad you're anti-carbon fiber. Why'd you waste your time posting in this thread then? 

Oh yea, you've got no idea what you're talking about. God help us if you're an engineer.

Love,
BSME


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## sonyisdope (Jul 24, 2004)

Pivvay said:


> Glad you're anti-carbon fiber. Why'd you waste your time posting in this thread then?
> 
> Oh yea, you've got no idea what you're talking about. God help us if you're an engineer.
> 
> ...


Well, why am I wrong? Are you saying that there are not different processes for carbon fiber? Also, does mechanical engineering make you an expert in material sciences and carbon fiber? Did you read about it in a book somewhere? Have you been to Taiwan and seen these frames being produced? Thanks for pointing out that you are an engineer. That makes me feel bad about myself. :thumbsup:

I just posted in this thread to show my disliking for carbon fiber, and I want to understand why everyone wants it so much. Like I previously posted, this is $500 you people are blowing. That's not cheap. That is a good chunk of change that you people would never consider spending on a nice steel Salsa frame, but when all of a sudden you can get a POS no-name unproven carbon frame, you guys jump all over it. WHY?!


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*Actually...*

Totally unrelated to the PF group buy so probably not necessary reading...

I've done lots of reading on the subject, worked with classmates who produced their own carbon fiber bicycle stems and tested them to destruction and produced real pieces myself. I've also worked with plenty of small automotive "CF" makers that are really just making fiberglass pieces with a carbon top layer. In that industry people want both the light weight of composite pieces but every kid with a modified car isn't going to pay for a 100% carbon fiber piece. In that arena the FG/CF pieces are light enough and cost effective enough. In the bike industry however I haven't heard of companies using fiberglass inside the frames. Yes the other layer that's pretty is for cosmetics. You could leave the more raw looking carbon underneath too but people like the nice look of the 12k weave on the outside so what's the harm. It's not really a sticker, it is functional as well as cosmetic.

There *are* two main ways of producing carbon fiber you're right. However what those two ways are, you are not really on the right track. Why don't you do a bunch more reading on prepreg, what you call the F1 and aerospace work (which is what those industries do use most commonly)? The other technique is various wet layup styles which can be just as strong as prepreg but often heavier due to more than optimal resin percentage. They can also be less strong if produced improperly but it's not rocket science. New(ish) wet layup techniques like vacuum infusion have closed the distance to making nice cost effective carbon fiber pieces in other industries. Not every industry wants or needs to spend money on prepreg and autoclaves.

What you're paying for in carbon fiber is the material cost and the engineering and design. Labor in taiwan is cheap which is why you're seening the majority of bike stuff come out of there right now. The engineering involves which direction you lay up the plies. What number of plies in which parts of the frame. Properly designed molds etc. I'm oversimplifying a little but you get the idea.

In the case of the pedal force bike, someone else did the engineering work. Not Pedal Force and not the factory that's making them. If you have fun with the web you can easily figure out which bike company did it. That same factory that is making them for "big bike company" is pumping out more of those same frames on the side to make more money. Pretty commonly done now today in aluminum and increasingly in carbon fiber. Don't believe me? Check out the Ritchey then Token then Trigon carbon fiber rigid mountain bike forks.

As for what I ride and light weight, well $500 just isn't *that* much money for a light frame. Scott Scale's cost 4x that much for only a little bit lighter frame. If I'm getting a season or two out of the PF frame I'll be more than happy and I bet they last me a lot longer than that. I also ride a $100 Redline Monocog chromoly frame. It's heavy but also serves a purpose and I love to ride it all the time. I put *thousands* of miles on it last year. Steel Salsa frames are probably lovely but they don't fit the purpose of why I am going to TRY a Pedal force frame and probably the same for many others involved.


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## mtbdcd (Mar 23, 2005)

I see that on the seat stays, the rear dropout is "bolted" to the seat stay. Same as their road frame. Most carbon frame manufacurturers "i guess" glue them together. I have noticed Look does the bolt thing too.

Pros/Cons on bolt/glue?


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## avatar78 (Jan 29, 2007)

sonyisdope said:


> Well, in cheap carbon fiber products, there is a molding process that they use...but because it is not actually a "woven" product, you are not getting the ride quality of carbon fiber.


Uh oh, somebody better tell Campy their "IKEA-style" Record Carbon crankset for, oh, $500, is junk!


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

*Well you got some this right...*

but you clueless on others. To keep thins short and simple...


This frame comes from of of the higher end CF frame factories in Taiwain.
Most CF bikes these days from the bigger factories all ride very similar and use the same CF, technology and technique.
These CF frames are being made by a few big CF factories in Taiwan. Then they are shipped off to all the bgi names out there and they put there graphic and severly over-charge the public.

A few companies like TREK, SCOTT and others use thier own "defense-grade" CF. Some says this is BS marketing and others say yes it's a higher grade CF.om my research it is. But many, mnay of the top CF factories in Taiwan use other very HQ, High Modulus CF. High Modulus or Ultra-High Moduls CF is what yuou want. Yes and good engineering of the tubes makes a better ride.

Sure there is cheap CF out their and it rides cheap. Funny but TREK's earlier CF bike rode like a 2x4!!

It's just a matter of time when SCOTT's and Cervelo's CF and Technology make to other factories and sub $1000 frames will be just as goo as mainland China and give a rats a$$ about copyright, etc....

The PF are very nice quality and nice riding frames from what I hear and know about.

How much do you think it cost SCOTT to produce that Scale, CR or Addict?

Not very much in the sweat shops of China! I bet that Scale cost them less than $200 to make!

We have already established here that the factory that makes SCOTT and Cervelo makes frame for the other "big boys."

I have a Blue RC6 made in the top factories of Taiwain. The bike rides as well and any CF bike I have tired so far and has that magical ride.
I cost it at a pro-deal rate which was cheap. I wonder what Blue get's them for ?

The bike is desgined well and buit to their specs. So other small comapnies can do the very same. They are offering very nice frames with out gouging the public as PF is doing.

We ALL should be happy for this.

Also KHS is not what I call a great riding aluminum frame. IMO, Salsa is also is just ok and nothing specila. I sure those are sweat shop stuff from China as well.


----------



## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

avatar78 said:


> Uh oh, somebody better tell Campy their "IKEA-style" Record Carbon crankset for, oh, $500, is junk!


LMAO! Yah, they don't even give you that nice finshing look of the fancy weave for that price....

YES, let's remember CF is just plastic....

I think he is afraid that a $500 CF might out preform anything he bought for much more money! Same with Nino and his love affair with his SCALE and SCOTT bikes   :thumbsup:


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## Baulz (Sep 16, 2005)

sonyisdope said:


> With a molding process, there is essentially a tube that pieces of carbon are blown into until they fill the mold, then a bladder is put inside the mold to squish all the bits of carbon together. If you don't believe me, cut your Truvativ team handlebar, or your Felt carbon steerer tube in half, and look inside it. Inside, you will see a bunch of pieces of carbon going in a bunch of different directions. It's not the prettiest thing, so that's why manufactures put a nice "carbon-veneer" on it. Now this blow-molded carbon is relatively inexpensive to product, with the nice covers in it, it looks fancy, but because it is not actually a "woven" product, you are not getting the ride quality of carbon fiber.


Oh my :eekster:

Funny, I have been researching carbon fibre for the last 5 years and have never heard of that. Sounds to me like the dilusional rant of an anti-carbon fibre guy.


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## Bike Lover (Jul 14, 2006)

Pivvay said:


> In the case of the pedal force bike, someone else did the engineering work. Not Pedal Force and not the factory that's making them. If you have fun with the web you can easily figure out which bike company did it. That same factory that is making them for "big bike company" is pumping out more of those same frames on the side to make more money. Pretty commonly done now today in aluminum and increasingly in carbon fiber. Don't believe me? Check out the Ritchey then Token then Trigon carbon fiber rigid mountain bike forks.


No need to research who did this. It was Fuji: Check this thread!

Edit:

Oh, and there was some discussion on which factory actually makes these. The RS that PF is selling and looks VERY similar (has the buldge from the seat stays to the cross tube) is made by ADK. ADK has an excellent reputation for CF work.

Oh, and I am getting the road bike so I might be just a little biased myself...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Alright, I got the email from PedalForce today and they have to have 50 frames no matter what. The group buy is at 44 and they mentioned sending out an email to everyone in the GP to garner the additional sales. So if you know someone that is looking for a great deal, let them know about this frame. CHEERS.


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

Well its up to 46.... come on baby hit 50....


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*I think we'll get there*

Hopefully we get at least 49. Then I'll consider buying 2 to make 50...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Come on baby. Like I am not going to watch this thing till it is over. I check in ever couple of hours at work. Not the best way to spend my day but hey, I really want to get my two frames.


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## cmdickinson (Dec 30, 2005)

*No 29er Offered??*

I might consider it if they offered a 29er frame, but it doesn't apprear that its offered. Im sure the manufacturer makes one though...


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

48!
This might just happen.


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Regards to all... Let's us know what good news you might bring forth!


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## Flip D (Sep 16, 2005)

*No 29'ers offered*



cmdickinson said:


> I might consider it if they offered a 29er frame, but it doesn't apprear that its offered. Im sure the manufacturer makes one though...


I emailed PF about a 29er frame and this is the response:

Dear Flip D,

Thanks for your suggestion( of a 29er frame). We don't have any plan at the moment, but I'm sure when there's enough market demand we'll offer a carbon 29er.

Regards,
Mike
Pedal Force

Dang!


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

Sweet!!! looks like we got 50...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

I was just going to post that. SWEET. I AM GETTING MY 2 FRAMES:thumbsup: 
Well that is if everyone pays. I think if we get a few more on there, that would be sweet.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

so i see that one person has paid but i can't seem to find a link to pay. anyone know what to do? 
Michael


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## ☻☻☻ (Aug 4, 2006)

*That was me...*

Log into to your account, navigate to the MT group-buy page, select your frame size, then add it to the cart. You'll see the $500 price, $30 shipping charge and payment options.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

cool, now we just need to wait...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Well I have to say with only 32 people paid up and only 2 days left, it looks like this is not going to go. 18 people paying in 2 days is a lot. Man I hope this goes. I really want to get my two frames.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

Mine isn't showing up as $500 even after I log in. I've got an email in to PF about it so I can figure it out then pay...


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*Nevermind*

I figured it out. We're up to 34 frames now. I ended up with 21" frames due to the integrated HS and short TT on the 19". Hopefully this goes through.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

There is no way that this is going to get to 50 in the last few hours since it is at 37 right now. I have my doubts but I hope that people pull through. I will be :madman: if it does not go. I have a lot of parts on hold with a few people for the build up.

Well lets keep out fingers crossed and hope for the best.


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

'Morrow's the big day, Guys! Moment truth for all us here!!! I'll keep an eye on this sizzling thread 

Go0d luck, everyone!


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Looks like it's a no go..


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

captain spaulding said:


> Looks like it's a no go..


Have you received an e-mail from pedal force or something? I am still holding out hope till I hear from them. They got 44 frames sold and we still have till the end of day today. Maybe I am just an optimist.

MFW


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

You would think with $21k+ they would extend it a couple days or go ahead anyway? Anyone got an email from PF yet?


----------



## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Leftync said:


> Have you received an e-mail from pedal force or something? I am still holding out hope till I hear from them. They got 44 frames sold and we still have till the end of day today. Maybe I am just an optimist.
> 
> MFW


ah thought it ended last night for some reason.. gotcha...


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

captain spaulding said:


> ah thought it ended last night for some reason.. gotcha...


I org. thought it ended last night as well, but it must still be going on till the end of day today. I know the total of frames paid for went up from 43 to 44 this morning, so I assume it is still on. Still keeping the faith till I get a message.

MFW


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Also keep in mind that if anyone hasn't signed up to buy yet, you can still do that as well, as long as you pay before the end of the day. We only had to hit 50 before the 14th for them to start taking payments. Its been creaping up from 50 since the 14th. We're at 53 right now. If someone new signs up, and pays, it'll help boost the paid frames number.


----------



## RunningBrave (Nov 17, 2006)

*Up to 46 now...*

Well, we're up to 46 now. I decided to jump on the bandwagon in the end (despite the Scott Scale sitting in my basement and my wife's evil eyes...).

Gotta try it out - $500 for a carbon HT? C'mon, most of my wheelsets cost more than that. It can always become a beater bike if need be, but I have faith that it actually is a great product.

So I bought one for me and one for a friend - now we're getting awfully close to the magic 50 mark. Only 4 more to go.

Decided to take advantage of some pretty good pricing on components as well (XTR 970 cranks around $400, XO rear der $140, XO grips $40 - what the heck...).

I'm hoping that it all works out - if not it's a real shame. But life will go on.

We'll find out in a few more hours either way what PF decides. Note that if we divided the $2000 to buy 4 more frames between the 46 already purchased, it would only raise the cost per frame by $43 per frame, less whatever was recovered when the extra 4 frames were eventually sold....


----------



## mikedesign (Jan 25, 2004)

A few companies like TREK, SCOTT and others use thier own "defense-grade" CF. Some says this is BS marketing and others say yes it's a higher grade CF.om my research it is. But many, mnay of the top CF factories in Taiwan use other very HQ, High Modulus CF. High Modulus or Ultra-High Moduls CF is what yuou want. Yes and good engineering of the tubes makes a better ride.

Sure there is cheap CF out their and it rides cheap. Funny but TREK's earlier CF bike rode like a 2x4!!

LMAO Defense grade


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Well it is up to 47 right now and there is only 4.5 hours left in PST. So I think we just fell short of this goal. This sort of sucks.

Well I am going to get one frame at least no matter what. I was hoping for two thou.:madman: :madman: :madman: :madman:


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## Some Guy (Mar 27, 2005)

Surely if they are a couple short they'll go through with it and just keep the extras in stock?


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

I did ask about this and they did say that 50 is 50 and not 49, so I guess that we will see.


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## pena135 (Nov 17, 2005)

hey guys wats up!!! well as you all know i have a small UCI team Fullerton Bikes - Novo FROM MEXICO...but iam very interested in those frames and have connection with the president of AXMAN if that whole group purchase doesnt work.... all i need is 25 people to want to purchase these frames and ill buy the rest for our Cycling team!! let me know if anyone is interested!!! thanks!!!..................

contact me at [email protected] or weight weenies...look for pena135!!!! i just need 20 for me team but if you guys need the other im ok with it!!!!!


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## pena135 (Nov 17, 2005)

check out weight weenies!!!! im an avid reader and writer..and talkes about a UCI CYCLING team that i started with other partners!! incase you dont trust me...i need some frames for my team so please if it doesnt work out let me know! i do everything threw paypal so its safe for all of us!! thanks!


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

Looks like we got 50!!!! Now I have to start working on the build.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*50*

Wow ummm, now I'm going to have to explain why 2 carbon hardtails are showing up at the house instead of one.  Oh well. Good problem to have.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Anybody get any emails from PF?


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## snowdrifter (Aug 2, 2006)

I heard they ship these frames in a "Cracker Jack" box..


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

somwhere i heard that they take like 3 months to make.
Michael


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

The GB page on PedalForce's site says shipping sometime in May.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

*Spam: anyone want in on this frame GB?*

Hi there,

I have decided that I'm going a different route here, and wondered if anyone is interested in buying my paid spot on this group buy. I'm not looking to make any money here, just recover what I have in it. Please contact me if you're interested.


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## Emax (Dec 4, 2005)

Looks like they pulled the picture of the MT frame on scale from the website - I wonder why?


----------



## glovemtb (Mar 12, 2006)

Sounds like a great deal, a good stiff carbon mountain hard-tail is allot of fun climbing off road with many fun on road options as well. Just watch out and never get chain suck on that chainstay. I used to race a Trek Oclv hardtail recently built back. (Still in great shape at a 1370 grams for the 1995 frame.)They bonded a lil aluminum plate so there was never chain suck destruction worries. (Not even the new Trek Oclv carbon Elites have that anymore cause it was too expensive a manufacturing process i guess; yet the Elites still way about 3 lbs.)


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

Just an update, I emailed pedal force yesterday about the frames and got a response today. Gotta get working on the build...

Dear Mark,

The MT shipment is arriving from our factory and we expect to send the frames out to customers later next week or early in the third week of May.


Regards,
Mike
Pedal Force


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

Hope that's true. I will be psyched to build up my HT in June after a couple big races are over.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Thanks for the update. What fork are you all planning on installing? (I have not decided yet) It will be cool seeing pics of these builds.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

Ritchey/Token/Trigon Carbon on the SS. Reba on the geared (already have it).


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

do you guys know what headset you're using?


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

I was thinking is it using a semi-integrated headset. Not 100% sure thou.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Atmos said:


> I was thinking is it using a semi-integrated headset. Not 100% sure thou.


i'm pretty sure we need a zero stack. but it looks like there aren't many options. 
Michael


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Cane Creek ZS-2 (regular bearings) or ZS-6 (stainless bearings).

FSA have some as well (OEM Giant), but I don't know the part numbers.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

If anyone's interested in a 21" I'll sell mine and change the shipping address so it get's shipped to the buyer's door? My money situation has changed since I got on the gb..


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## leeco (Jan 22, 2004)

*Another 21 incher available*

I also have a 21 inch coming that I need to get rid of. I also can have the shipping address changed so it will be shipped to the buye. (I'll put in an MTBR classified ad when I can take a photo)


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

mpap89 said:


> i'm pretty sure we need a zero stack. but it looks like there aren't many options.
> Michael


Hi Mpap89,

Just checked with pedalforce on the headset.
Its using Zero Stack 44mm ID type headset.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Guys...guess what...


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Atmos said:


> Guys...guess what...


do you have the frame already? i didn't even know they were shipping them out yet.
Michael


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Hi Mpap89,

i just received it. Packaging was good.
The carbon weaves are just so sick looking.


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## Ty (May 20, 2004)

Atmos, got any photos of the frame ?


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

here you go...
btw mine is 17"


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

WOW that is nice. I can not wait to get my two frames now. I got two in the 17" size and I love the fact that they only weigh in at 1154g that is amazing. With my new KCNC brakes on the way and a few other bits, this is going to be a very light build. AWESOME.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

They very nice indeed, but the carbon weaves kind of remind me of scott scale limited 05.
Now, i don't know what headset they should go with, anyone?


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Hey, Eric! Nice one! If you don't like 'em (or have no use for 'em) anymore sell it to me, huh?  Please? TIA! 

Though no idea about the headset thing... Yeah, anyone?!?


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Atmos said:


> Now, i don't know what headset they should go with, anyone?





Onie said:


> Though no idea about the headset thing... Yeah, anyone?!?


Posted by me 2 days ago. I think its about 11-12 posts up  . 


BlownCivic said:


> Cane Creek ZS-2 (regular bearings) or ZS-6 (stainless bearings).
> 
> FSA have some as well (OEM Giant), but I don't know the part numbers.


----------



## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Oh, there you go, Civic! Eric, your question has been answered. LoL! Thanks!


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Can someone measure and post the length of the exposed aluminum top of the seat tube? Does the seat clamp from Pedal Force cover that area?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

EuroMack said:


> Can someone measure and post the length of the exposed aluminum top of the seat tube? Does the seat clamp from Pedal Force cover that area?


i didn't think they came with seatpost clamps. Do they?
Michael


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

It was an $8 option.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

i just got my frame after being lost by usps for a day. mine came in at 1.187 kg for a 19 inch without bottle cage bolts. it's so pretty!


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Finally got my frames today. I weighed one at work on the digital scale and my 17" frame came in at 1143g. I am very happy with the weight and when I have some time tonight, I will put the other one on the scale at home and see what it weighs.

I can not believe the size of the downtube. It reminds me of my old Cannondale frame. This thing is amazingly light to pick up. I can not wait to get it built up.

*Build list for the Pedal Force XC bike will be.*
RS Sid Team (lock out will be changed to Nokon housing)
XTR shifter, front derailleur and rear derailleur (tuned with carbon inner/outer cage and ti spring.
2 X 9 FSA carbon crank. Extralite 44t/30t chainrings and extralite 1.2 bolts.
KMS X10SL chain
KCNC V-Brakes
KCNC Ti Pro Lite 31.6 X 350 post
SLR carbon kit seat
American Classic MTB350 wheels
Eggbeater SL pedals
Easton EC90 25.4 bars
OmniRacer 9g seat post clamp 34.9
Syntace F99 25.4 105mm Stem
Not sure if I can go a 68 X 108 BB yet or if I will have to go with the 68 X 113. I have to try this out in the next few days and order if needed. 
Maxxis Minator tires.
Normal Black Shimano cables until I decided on Nokon's. Still debating this.

*Build list for the Pedal Force SS bike will be.*
Pace Carbon RC31 rigid forks with V-brake mounts. I might sell these to go lighter..
Syntace F99 25.4 105mm stem
Easton MonkeyLite SL bars.
Extralite Ultralevers
Vuelta's tuned
My old Specialized/Hugi wheelset (1450g)
FSA carbon crank with either a Boone Ti or a FibreLyte carbon 32t spiderless chainring
Eggbeater SL pedals
KMS X10SL chain
KCNC Ti Pro lite 31.6 X 350 
SLR saddle
Surley Singulator
Aztec Powerline brake cables and housings.
OmniRacer 9g seat post clamp 34.9

Both bikes should be pretty light. I am hoping for around 18 lbs for the XC and around 15 for the SS.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

I will try to get to the XC build in the next few days since I now have my two Pedal Force MT carbon frames. I just could not wait to build one up tonight so I started with the SS build up. As it sits right now it is 14.75 lbs without the cables but everything else is on including a bottle cage. Oh I have to sort out what grips I am going to use. I do not think that the Aztec Powerlines will add much weight so the first goal is complete with the SS being under 15 lbs. This is also with my crappy SS crank conversion. I think that I am going to go with a carbon spiderless chainring from Fibre-Lyte. I think with all the carbon on the bike that a Fibre-Lyte carbon spiderless ring will look awesome.

Anyways, the Extralite brake levers were very easy to install and I really like the design and feel. Well feel from the point of just using them with no brake cables yet. I am going to match them up with the Vuelta Mags that I tuned to 232g for the set. Not bad but heavy compared to the KCNC brakes that I now have. 

The other good thing about the frames is that I was able to use my FSA Platinum Pro Ti 68 X 108 road BB and my FSA cranks cleared the chainstays no problem. So now I will get a lighter version ISIS 68 X 108 BB that comes in under 150g I hope. This will go nice with my new Extralite 44t/30T chainrings that are on their way.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

bdc88 said:


> Oh I have to sort out what grips I am going to use.


i would go for the esi racer's edge. they came in at 38 grams. and they have really good customer service. i put on a pair then found that they had a tiny cut and they replaced them without any trouble. i used to use pork rinds, but i find that they slip after like 3 months and they aren't as grippy as ESIs.


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

bdc88 said:


> Oh I have to sort out what grips I am going to use. So now I will get a lighter version ISIS 68 X 108 BB that comes in under 150g I hope. This will go nice with my new Extralite 44t/30T chainrings that are on their way.


If you want to try a set of the ESI silicone grips, I ordered 3 pairs a short while ago, and should have them in the next couple days (maybe by Monday) and you're welcome to a pair for what I paid for them to try them out. I ordered 1 pair of black regular, 1 of red regular, and one pair of black Racer's Edge. I kind of want to keep the regular black. but your welcome to either of the other 2. Also, I have a spare KCNC Scandium 108 x 68 BB that weighs 165g with the crank bolts, and you can borrow that one to try it out. And remember, I'm close by!


----------



## mikedesign (Jan 25, 2004)

sonyisdope said:


> A few things. . .
> 
> First off, yes, I am totally ANTI-carbon fiber with bikes, I am sick of it, and I believe it is just a bunch of marketing of junk. So basically take what I am typing with a grain of salt from a self proclaimed "Carbon-Hater."
> 
> ...


CLUELESS


----------



## mikedesign (Jan 25, 2004)

The carbon weaves are just so sick looking.[/QUOTE]

THATS CALLED 12K CARBON


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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

The frame looks cool, with a carbon weave just like scott scale! 
thats 12k carbon? what kind of carbon is that mike?


----------



## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

That looks vaguely familiar.... other than the aero shaped seatpost on the Colnago.


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Can i have my [*drool*] bib, please!!!  Such enviable privileges ya'll got there, fellas!!! :cornut:


----------



## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

Any body on the East Coast gotten their's yet??


----------



## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

Not quite East coast, but I'm in TN and got mine last week. The USPS tried their first delivery on Monday but no one was home. The package requires a signature.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Going to the pedalforce.com page for the Mountain HT frame, it says it is $750 not $850. I remember it saying $850 even yesterday when I was checking the website out...

http://pedalforce.com/online/index.php?cPath=21_100088_101742


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Yup! Up until about a week ago, they were definitely $850 on the website. This makes my decision to sell my frame 2 weeks ago a little easier to stomach. Now when I decide to replace it, it won't hurt quite so much.


----------



## OldManBreezer (May 2, 2004)

*Any more photos?*

Just checked and my box is sitting in customs so can't be far away now.

Would love to see more photos if you guys have any?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

OldManBreezer said:


> Just checked and my box is sitting in customs so can't be far away now.
> 
> Would love to see more photos if you guys have any?


http://picasaweb.google.com/mpap89/FrameAndDoor
here's mine. the weight is without the bottle cage bolts. it's a 19inch.


----------



## OldManBreezer (May 2, 2004)

Just to confirm that it's a 34.9 seat post clamp?? (want to check before i go and order one).

Thanks!


----------



## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

OldManBreezer said:


> Just to confirm that it's a 34.9 seat post clamp?? (want to check before i go and order one).
> 
> Thanks!


yup, 34.9 fits like a charm.


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

That garage door is beautiful. I bet something like that cost a bundle. Does it open in a conventional overhead manner, or like the panels suggest: bifold?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

BlownCivic said:


> That garage door is beautiful. I bet something like that cost a bundle. Does it open in a conventional overhead manner, or like the panels suggest: bifold?


haha, my parents just got that. I'm only 18 and don't care what my garage door looks like. It opens up in three panels and is on a track like a traditional opener. I'll tell my parents you liked it. They spent like 5k on it. Shall i post pics when it's painted white?


----------



## Carbon Ken (Mar 31, 2005)

Wow! Now that is one awesome garage door! :eekster: 

Please post pics when done!


----------



## Leadghost (Sep 13, 2004)

White? What a horrible mismatch color for what I can see of that house. Stain it slightly darker than it is but still a lighter contrast than the house around it imo.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Leadghost said:


> White? What a horrible mismatch color for what I can see of that house. Stain it slightly darker than it is but still a lighter contrast than the house around it imo.


that's what i was thinking.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

mpap89 said:


> http://picasaweb.google.com/mpap89/FrameAndDoor
> here's mine. the weight is without the bottle cage bolts. it's a 19inch.


I'm enjoying your other pictures more than the frame. LOL
Don't get the wrong idea, it's just because i have the same frame.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Has anyone finished their build and ridden it around and can offer any reviews/feedback? Is the geometry too small? Too flexy? Superb? Managed to compare it to other light weight carbon frames like the Scott or Canyon?


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

I have my MT frame built up as a SS and my other one will be a XC build. The SS build is very solid. Since I do not have any gears on the bike, if I have to get up a hill I have to put the power to the pedals and I did not find the bike complaining. It was solid and allowed me to put the power to the pavement. I did take it down some stairs, did some 1.5' - 2' drop offs and was doing some small jumps (a couple of feet off the ground) and there were no issues. I will not ride the bike like this all the time of course but thought I would see how it faired on the initial ride. They are a strong, light build and I am confident on the frame being a strong and light XC bike when I get all the parts.

Build list for the Pedal Force XC bike will be. 
RS SID Team (lock out will be changed to Nokon housing) 
XTR shifter, front derailleur and rear derailleur (tuned with carbon inner/outer cage and ti spring. 
2 X 9 FSA carbon crank. Extralite 44t/30t chainrings and extralite 1.2 bolts. 
TOKEN ultralight cassette (11-32)
KMS X10SL chain 
KCNC V-Brakes 
KCNC Ti Pro Lite 31.6 X 350 post 
SLR carbon kit seat 
American Classic MTB350 wheels 
Eggbeater SL pedals 
Easton EC90 25.4 bars 
OmniRacer 9g seat post clamp 34.9 
Syntace F99 25.4 105mm Stem 
I still have to figure out what BB I am going to use.
Maxxis Minator tires. 
Normal Black Shimano cables until I decided on Nokon's. Still debating this.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Great news! Please pardon the personal question, but how much do you weigh?

Mine is waiting in a Luxembourg post office. Unfortunately, I can't figure out WHICH one!


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

EuroMack said:


> Mine is waiting in a Luxembourg post office. Unfortunately, I can't figure out WHICH one!


So this will be built by this time tomorrow, right? Pictures, pictures, I demand pictures.

Oh, and good luck with the tax man.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Euromack,

You do not ask someone about their weight but I am alright with letting you know I weigh 180 lbs.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

The rear derailer hanger is replaceable right?


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## SnowMongoose (Feb 18, 2007)

BDC: you don't ask a woman her weight... guys are fair game.
don't act like you're doing him a favor.


hot frame, looking forward to seeing more of them built up.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

What headset are you guys using? I'm planning to use extralite or tune ones. But i do not know which to go for, anyone? Tune would be bobo, how about extralite? I'm confused by so many different types.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Can you use the Tune BuBu headset? Does the frame take a full integrated headset or a semi integrated headset?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Cheers! said:


> Can you use the Tune BuBu headset? Does the frame take a full integrated headset or a semi integrated headset?


It's neither. you need a zerostack. Cane creek makes two, zs-2 and zs-6. The zs-6 has nice bearings and is more expensive. FSA also makes one but it's oem.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

mpap89 said:


> It's neither. you need a zerostack. Cane creek makes two, zs-2 and zs-6. The zs-6 has nice bearings and is more expensive. FSA also makes one but it's oem.


Neither? Omg. How about the extralite? I'm confused by so many types from extralite. Thanks


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Atmos said:


> Neither? Omg. How about the extralite? I'm confused by so many types from extralite. Thanks


I've been told by the Extralite dealer in Florida that none of the Extralite headsets will fit. None of them are "zero stack" style.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Looks like you have to stick w/ the cane creek ones that weigh in at 106g. You could always go with the extralite top cap and extralite ultrastar to save some weight


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

My two headsets that I bought from Pedal Force are 81g each and were $25.00 each so that is not too bad. I thought there was no point is searching if they already had a good one they were offering.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

bdc88 said:


> My two headsets that I bought from Pedal Force are 81g each and were $25.00 each so that is not too bad. I thought there was no point is searching if they already had a good one they were offering.


Are they made by cane creek or fsa?


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

oh.... that's bad news, damn.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

BlownCivic said:


> I've been told by the Extralite dealer in Florida that none of the Extralite headsets will fit. None of them are "zero stack" style.


I thought the Extralite Scalehead was zero-stack compatible.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Just got my frame and headset. It looks like all the others, so I'll just post weights:

Bare 19in frame: 1178g
V-brake bosses (2): 20g
Bottle cage bolts (4): 11g
Headset: 80g (no cap, star nut, or bolt was included)

The finish is nearly flawless. I was pleasantly surprised, and so were my office mates.

I only have a few cosmetic gripes. The bare aluminum seat tube extends 13mm past the carbon, so most clamps won't hide it. You could easily cut it down or paint it black.

I HATE bare pop-rivets. While they are painting the dropouts and head tube inserts black, the sweatshop kids should paint the rivets.

Tuning opportunities:

Headset-
If you're willing to spend $160 and reduce bearing size to shave an ounce, the Extralite Scalhead will fit (yes, I measured!)
http://www.extralite.com/Products/scalhead_anglo.htm

Cable guides-
The cable guides are riveted+glued, or the frame was clear-coated after they were applied. Either way, removing them would require some touchup clearcoat.

Bolts-
Of course you could replace the bottle bolts with something lighter.

The dropouts are secured by long steel chainring bolts, like those used for granny rings of older cranks.
The replaceable derailleur hanger is secured by a short steel chainring bolt, the type used for singlspeed applications.
These three bolts could be replaced with aluminum to save a few grams.

V-brake studs-
KCNC aluminum M10 studs weigh only 7g, but don't fit because they are at the fat end of M10 thread tolerance. The aluminum sockets in the frame are at the tight end of the spectrum. So, some clearancing would be required to install the KCNC. The factory steel bosses fit very tightly.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

EuroMack,

I did not have a problem putting my KCNC M10 Studs on the MT frame at all. They went in with little problems and little force. I had a harder time with my TI M10 studs on my last frame. 

Other than that, everything sounds exactly the same and a bit heavier than my 17" @ 1143g. 

You will love this bike.

I was able to start my build this weekend on my XC bike at right now on paper, the build is 17.75 lbs. I do have to wait for a few items to arrive. I do not have skewers, have a new Token 11-32 (150g) on the way, new expander/compressor and need to pick up a new BB 68 X 108. 

The KCNC brakes were not too bad to set up on the frame but I find the front brakes a bit loose on the studs. I think it is the brass bushing on the inside that is the problem. They have just a little play in them while the back brakes have no play at all. 

What are you going to build this frame up with. Intersted people want to know.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

I am headed to the US this weekend until the 18th or so. My tools and most parts are there, so I will wait until I return to build the frame.

I confirmed that the derailleur hanger and bolt weigh 19g and you can securely fasten a wheel without them. So, add 19g to the weigh you'll save when you lose that ugly tensioner!


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

One person's ugly tensioner is another person's beautiful soon to have a carbon makeover and tuned tensioner. I am sure that I can cut the weight down on this badboy tensioner to about 75g without sacrificing durability.

Sub 14 lbs. here I come baby. The only problem is the road bike is still lighter which bothers me a bit.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

EuroMack said:


> Just got my frame and headset. It looks like all the others, so I'll just post weights:
> 
> Bare 19in frame: 1178g
> V-brake bosses (2): 20g
> ...


Scalhead can really fit? GREAT!


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Hi euromark, does the scalhead need any modifications in order to fit? or it fit readily? thanks you brought great news


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

If the scalehead fits, it means the ID of the headtube is 44mm.

There are a lot of other choices of internal headsets at 44 mm diameter.


Ritchey Logic WCS Press Fit (44 mm OD x 9 mm cup height, 18 mm total stack height) (110g w/ everything)
Tune Bubu Headset (44mm OD x ?? mm cup height, 8.9 mm total stack height) 66g 

For the Cane Creek ZS-6 there are two 1-1/8" versions. Tall and Short
Tall: 44mm OD x 24 mm total stack height (135 g w/ everything)
Short: 44 mm OD x 14 mm total stack height (113g w/ everything)


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Does the scalhead really fit? confirmed?


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## OldManBreezer (May 2, 2004)

*"That" gap...........*

Anyone come up with a smart idea/solution for the gap between the seat clamp and the aluminium sleeve? dont really want to paint it and i assume it doesn't come out for cutting?

Just wondering.............


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*gap*

Black sharpie?


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Has anyone installed a Ritchey/Trigon/Token carbon fork on this bike yet. If you have can you post a picture of the build. I am seriously considering getting the Trigon fork to replace my heavy Pace fork with V-Brake mounts. I think the Pace somes in at 730g right now with the V-brake mounts and the Trigon will come in at around 450g with everything and cut to size. That is almost 300g savings and should get my build down to almost 14 lbs. If anyone has installed these forks, I would like to find out how the bike rides and your impression of the fork stiffness.

If no one has done this yet, then I might be the first tester of such a set up.

I am now shotting for 14 lbs or just under.

Cheers.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*Trigon*

I haven't yet but I'm going to. I've been running a similar A-C fork on a Monocog and haven't found it too steep of a head angle.


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

This one looks almost the same as everyone's Pedalforce HT here... except with some minor(?) differences that I've noticed only (but not limited to) at the seat tube-seatstay junction where it has an adjoining bar









and this new style of putting disc tabs 








along the chainstay not the typical seatstay location... I'm digging it... But talk about p$r$i$c$e--> € 3000. I'd rather go with your PF here any given day! :thumbsup:

But the weight discrepancy b/w the two... Storck's 19" is weighing measly at 1050 grams (claimed target weight) 

https://www.light-bikes.de/eng/2007/06/01/storck-rebelion/#more-60


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## carbon_addict (Jul 7, 2006)

So guys did somebody else recieve their frames? And what are your comments about them? I got mine but didn't build it up yet because I have some parts to be delivered next week.


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## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

I got mine. I am also waiting for parts to arrive to do the buildup. Comments so far...it's very light and it looks good.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

My build will only be ready end of the year...its a long wait....
But its gonna be awesome


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## Leftync (Jan 10, 2007)

I built up mine about two weeks ago as an inexpensive light weight XC HT. For reference I weigh 180 lbs and the frame was a 19”, the build highlights include:
Aeries Sport
WCS stem – 130 mm 
Race Face XC flat bar
SRAM 7.0 grip shift
7.0 Rear Der.
X9 Front Der
M960 Crank set and BB
Avid SD ti – v brakes and levers
KCNC Ti pro lite seat post
Sette Race Ti seat 
Mavic X517 laced to xt hubs
Conti. 2.1 speed king protection
Lunar light tubes 
Pedal force head set and seat collar

Bike comes in at 20.85 pounds with profile bottle cage, but it is just over 21 with my home made chain stay protector made out of an old lunar light tube and electrical tape. After a couple of weeks on it and one race, I have to say this thing has been impressive thus far. The stiffness of the frame seems to be as good as my 98’ S-works M2 and the carbon does take the edge off. It climbs extremely well especially on out of the saddle climbing. The real test will be the off road assault on Mt Mitchell in just over a month.


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## cvillatri (Nov 21, 2005)

Just finished my build last night.

Question about the PF headset. I am having a problem getting a smooth "roll" and no play in the headset. It seems that if I tighten the top cap enough to take out any play in the headset, turning the bar/fork is stiff (too much load?). If I get this to be smooth with no drag/load, there's play in the headset when I apply the brake. Anyone else having this problem? Any suggestions?

Here's my steed. Mainly XT build, shifters/brake lever, crankset, derailleurs, hubs laced to 717s, avid BB7s. Comes in at 21 lbs. This will do until my Money Tree blooms and I can afford to upgrade/lighten up.









Chris


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Here is my 2+2 cents worth. I tried to use the PF generic no name brand headset too. Here was my problem and sounds like it could be yours as well. Check to see if the cap is contacting the upper cup. That may be where your drag/stiffness is comming from. I played with mine for a while and even contacted Perfomance about it. They said they could send some micro washers to space the cap away from the upper cup. I was a little put off to begin with since the headset did not come with star nut or bolt or cap or instructions and was packaged in a sandwich baggie. I purchased a cane creek zs2. We will see how it works when it gets here. ZS2 with everything included = $36, Performance headset without cap, bolt, star nut = $25. Driving around town looking for cap, bolt, starnut = $10 for gas and still could not find them.


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## cvillatri (Nov 21, 2005)

It did seem like there was contact as you stated. Looks like the upper bearing cover is binding on the upper cup race, but not pressing on the bearing. I've got a ZS2 (or 6) on another bike and will see if changing will fix. 

Luckily, I had a few extra star nuts and top cap/nuts lying around for mine. 

Thanks for the input.

Chris


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Roger that. Let us know if the zs2/6 works. Nice looking bike, by the way. I'm hoping mine comes in below 20 lb when complete.
Later


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## Emax (Dec 4, 2005)

Both FSA Orbit ZR and ZS work as they should, smooth, no play, no binding at all. I'm using both on two PF bikes (mine and wife's). I've used FSA Carbon Compound to install the seatpost - prevents sliding/overtightening on carbon parts - works awesome.

PF bikes ride great - absorb nearly all vibration from the trail and are quick up the hill - more comfortable than my Schwinn HG Factory Team.

Emax


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Just got and installed my zs2--works great, smooth, and slick. Anyone want a great deal on a Pedal Force headset?


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## AggieXCRacer (Oct 10, 2005)

Anybody have a spare 17" MT they want to offload?


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## RunningBrave (Nov 17, 2006)

Nope - but I have a 19" that could use a home. 

I got impatient waiting for the PF MT to arrive, and went out and bought an 07 Scale LTD.... I am building up a PF 15" for a friend and it looks sweet so far; I just can't bring myself to dismantle my new Scale and drop the parts onto the PF MT. So the new PF frame will either collect dust over the summer and become some sort of winter project (maybe SS?), or else find its way into the hands of someone who actually has the time to build and ride it.


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## AggieXCRacer (Oct 10, 2005)

RunningBrave said:


> Nope - but I have a 19" that could use a home.
> 
> I got impatient waiting for the PF MT to arrive, and went out and bought an 07 Scale LTD.... I am building up a PF 15" for a friend and it looks sweet so far; I just can't bring myself to dismantle my new Scale and drop the parts onto the PF MT. So the new PF frame will either collect dust over the summer and become some sort of winter project (maybe SS?), or else find its way into the hands of someone who actually has the time to build and ride it.


That's too bad...  If it were a 17" I would give it a great home! :thumbsup:


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

RunningBrave, you have PM.

Jacques


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

So after buying in on the group buy, then changing my mind and selling my frame to EuroMack before taking delivery, then changing my mind again, and buying a frame from RunningBrave so I could build up a new bike for my wife, then finding a crack in the seat tube just above the bottom bracket on my 3 month old Anthem Advanced, I have stripped the Anthem, and transfered the parts over to the PF to ride while the waranty is taken care of by Giant.

It came out to 7.8kg (17lbs,3oz). I was so hoping for sub 17lbs, but with the carbon NewUltimate seatpost that is on the way from Nino, and the plans I have for my SLR, I think it'll be sub 17lbs in no time.

The problem with the headsets that PF supplied with the framesets is that the upper bearing seat with the split in it is the wrong size. When it gets tight in the bearing, there's a large gap between the steerer tube and the bearing seat. I took the part from the FSA headset that came with my Giant frame, and it fit the steerer tube snugly, and I no longer had the slop in the headset that I first had using the collar/seat supplied by PF.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

OldManBreezer said:


> Anyone come up with a smart idea/solution for the gap between the seat clamp and the aluminium sleeve? dont really want to paint it and i assume it doesn't come out for cutting?


Black zip-tie / wire tie / tyrap like this http://www.pacificparts.com/vends/tb/tb.tyrap.htm. They are available in many widths, so just choose one that fills the gap left by your seat clamp. As a bonus, it may help keep water and grit out of the slots in the seat tube.


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## Emax (Dec 4, 2005)

Why is cutting 2mm off of the top of the seat tube bad? Is it just the warranty being voided? If you use FSA carbon compound you won't have to tighten the seat clamp as much and keep the seatpost still. So the loads on the aluminium insert shouldn't increase that much - am I wrong?

Emax


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

My Extralite seatpost clamp covered the bare aluminum portion of the seat tube completely.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

What front derailleur are you guys using. When I asked Pedal Force what front derailleur I should get they told me that I would need the FRONT DERAILLEUR, FD-M970, XTR TOP-SWING 34.9MM but this does not allow me to get my front derailleur low enough. I am thinking that the FRONT DERAILLEUR, FD-M971, XTR DOWN-SWING 34.9MM would have been a better choice. Am I wrong in this.

What pisses me off is that there is no way that the M970 can get low enough to be where Shimano says it should be. Should I just sell my M970 and buy the M971 as this will allow me to get the front derailleur down to the correct setting.

Does Pedal Force not know this. It sort of pisses me off that when you ask for advice on a frame that you would hope that the manufacturer would know what would work best.

Any suggestions would be great thanks.

Cheers.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I'm using a top swing M952 XTR, and you're right, it doesn't get low enough. It not because its a top swing though (the clamp still has room to go lower), its the actual derailleur cage that touches the chainstay at the very back of the cage. I saw that and worried as well. I've been riding for about a week now, and though the derailleur is nowhere near as low as Shimano (and common sense) says it should be, it shifts my 2x9 just fine.


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## cvillatri (Nov 21, 2005)

I'm using an LX bottom swing. Not the lightest, but works fine. I tried the XT top swing first, but because my bike frame size is small (15"), it didn't fit. The seat tube "flares" up from the BB too far.

Chris


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> So after buying in on the group buy, then changing my mind and selling my frame to EuroMack before taking delivery, then changing my mind again, and buying a frame from RunningBrave so I could build up a new bike for my wife, then finding a crack in the seat tube just above the bottom bracket on my 3 month old Anthem Advanced, I have stripped the Anthem, and transfered the parts over to the PF to ride while the waranty is taken care of by Giant.
> 
> It came out to 7.8kg (17lbs,3oz). I was so hoping for sub 17lbs, but with the carbon NewUltimate seatpost that is on the way from Nino, and the plans I have for my SLR, I think it'll be sub 17lbs in no time.
> 
> The problem with the headsets that PF supplied with the framesets is that the upper bearing seat with the split in it is the wrong size. When it gets tight in the bearing, there's a large gap between the steerer tube and the bearing seat. I took the part from the FSA headset that came with my Giant frame, and it fit the steerer tube snugly, and I no longer had the slop in the headset that I first had using the collar/seat supplied by PF.


Nice build!:thumbsup:

Two questions:
1. What is that crank you are running?
2. How do you setup V-brakes on that fork?

One recommendation:
1. How about a lighter seatpost?


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Axis II said:


> Nice build!:thumbsup:
> 
> *Thank You*
> 
> ...


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

I just finished my build of a PF 17 inch. Lots of great components. Bad news is that I suddenly need to come up with some cash for a powered wheel chair for my wife.
If you are interested I can provide the component details. Let me know.


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## alexedge (Jul 11, 2007)

*Geometry?*

Hey guys I don't know too much about geometry, but this frame has a killer frame, and I'm considering using it for my ultralight urban machine, what kind of handling will I end up with if I fit it with these forks:

http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/FK409C13-Winwood+Purist+Carbon+Fork.aspx

??

oh and will be running 26x1.5 street-biased tires and rear V-brakes only....


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

so finally got everything together to build my new bike. 
It comes out to around 19 lbs. This thing flies. I went from a 80mm fox and the 100mm manitou feels so plush. It descends so much better with the extra 20mm.

specs can be seen here. and i know some of you guys were interested in my garage door. so i took the pics of the bike against the new painted door.

Michael


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Wow!! That door looks awesome! Keep up the good work on your garage door skilz.:thumbsup: No, really, very nice build. I'm thinking about this frame for next season myself. I'm waiting for the reviews to roll in after you guys put them to the test. Is the frame designed for a 100mm fork or did you do that for downhill reasons?


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

@ Alexedge

Take a look at the Trigon. The only place that I know where to get information and pictures is Ebay. I am not selling them nor involved in the sale so relax.

http://cgi.ebay.com/TRIGON-CARBON-F...ryZ58086QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

I did however buy a pair of these and have them on my 14.5 lbs Pedal Force MT purchase. They fit amazingly well and look like they were designed for the frame.

These are almost 200g lighter and they work very well. I am very happy with my purchase. If you are doing a Ultralite Urban Machine, these forks are a must and look less expensive than the ones you are looking at.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Axis II said:


> Wow!! That door looks awesome! Keep up the good work on your garage door skilz.:thumbsup: No, really, very nice build. I'm thinking about this frame for next season myself. I'm waiting for the reviews to roll in after you guys put them to the test. Is the frame designed for a 100mm fork or did you do that for downhill reasons?


i believe the frame is designed for 80-120mm forks. The reason i went with the 100 was because it was cheaper and i wanted a little bit more travel. The fork does sit up higher though so I think I am going to invert my stem to get a little lower down.
Michael


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## Bike Lover (Jul 14, 2006)

Very cool builds guys. It's great to see them finally built and some weights in. Wow. I'm sorry I missed this buy...


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## Overkill (Mar 28, 2004)

Have you had any issues with the 1x9 and the chain coming off?? I don't see an n-gear or guard. Just curious, as I may do the same to one of my bikes.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

Overkill said:


> Have you had any issues with the 1x9 and the chain coming off?? I don't see an n-gear or guard. Just curious, as I may do the same to one of my bikes.


so far I haven't run into any problems but I was about to ask what I should do about that. Initially it was falling off in the largest gear but I adjusted the chainline over.


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## alexedge (Jul 11, 2007)

bdc88 said:


> @ Alexedge
> 
> Take a look at the Trigon. The only place that I know where to get information and pictures is Ebay. I am not selling them nor involved in the sale so relax.
> 
> ...


:thumbsup:

Funny, a little bit later after posting that I found the Ritchey and decided it looked nicer than the first fork I saw (plus a more reputable name). Apparently the fork you linked me to is the same as the Ritchey, although a fair amount cheaper. Thanks!

Oh and I demand pics and specs of your 14.5lb build!!!


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## alexedge (Jul 11, 2007)

Oh yeah, and I'm pretty sure that this BB size will work OK with the Dura-Ace road setup I already have? Since I am currently using them on another MTB I was pretty sure it would be OK but just want to check.

Sorry if this is a stupid question but kinda new to this bike stuff. Not a complete idiot mechanically (IMO at least) as I used to build and tune Honda K-series motors for roadrace cars, but it's taking a little bit to get the bicycle setups figured out...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

@ Alexedge

You will be fine running a Dura-Ace BB if it is the older style Octalink that I think you are talking about. I am running 68 X 108 on both of my Pedal Force MT builds. The second build is a sub 18 lbs. hardtail. I am running that one as a 2 X 9.

So you will be more than fine.

I think that I posted the bike as it sits right now with the older Pace fork on the site. Here is the link to that one.

http://fairwheelbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3313

Build list for the Pedal Force SS bike is.
Pace Carbon RC31 rigid forks with V-brake mounts. I did get the Trigon carbon fork and it dropped the weight down to 14.72 lbs.
Syntace F99 25.4 105mm stem
Easton MonkeyLite SL bars.
Extralite Ultralevers
Vuelta's Mag tuned
My old Specialized/Hugi wheelset (1450g)
FSA carbon crank with FibreLyte carbon 32t spiderless chainring on the way
Eggbeater SL pedals
KMC X10SL chain - I am currenlty running my old PC89 hollowpin for now
KCNC Ti Pro lite 31.6 X 350 
SLR saddle
Surley Singulator
Aztec Powerline brake cables and housings.
OmniRacer 9g seat post clamp 34.9

Parts that I have on order but need to wait for are.

Carbon Spiderless 32t chainring - Custom Build
Carbon Surly Singulator Pulley
Carbon Singulator Guides for each side of the pulley - Custom Build
Carbon Single Speed Cassette spacers - Custom Build

Total weight should be under 14 but I will not know till it is done. I am not sure that I will get the bike under 14 lbs at this time. I do have heavy tubes right now so I should be able to get to just over 14 lbs.

I might get carbon replacement levers for the Extralite Ultralevers. Not a big savings but keep up with the carbon theme and I might get them with the next company bonus.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

alexedge said:


> I used to build and tune Honda K-series motors for roadrace cars, but it's taking a little bit to get the bicycle setups figured out...


Why "used to"? I still do. Not K series, but Bs and Ds. My 89 EF hatch has a D16 with an Endyn M62 blower kit on it. Ya think a well built K would make more power than 18-20lbs of boost from the M62? Oops, sorry for the OT.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> Why "used to"? I still do. Not K series, but Bs and Ds. My 89 EF hatch has a D16 with an Endyn M62 blower kit on it. Ya think a well built K would make more power than 18-20lbs of boost from the M62? Oops, sorry for the OT.


Humpf.....when your ready to step up to a real Honda check this:


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## alexedge (Jul 11, 2007)

BlownCivic said:


> Why "used to"? I still do. Not K series, but Bs and Ds. My 89 EF hatch has a D16 with an Endyn M62 blower kit on it. Ya think a well built K would make more power than 18-20lbs of boost from the M62? Oops, sorry for the OT.


I like the staggered setup! Autocross car?

I worked at a shop for a while and still play around in my spare time, helping friends and such. Just concentrating on my career and my fitness right now - the car thing was getting too out of control so I'm taking a break.

If you're on Honda-Tech you probably know who 'Streetwerkz' is, that's my buddy Joe, he has a Jackson-blown D-series in a CRX that's pretty rad. Currently in the process of swapping to built B-series + modified JR blower.

Another good friend of mine, a guy named Harvey from Holeshot Racing (they are in Honda-Tuning a lot doing the how-to articles) has an EG with a K-series, street/drag car. He's been through these setups:

- regular intake manifold (same one as new Si, the best for K-series)
- manifold + direct port nitrous
- TWB individual throttle bodies
- TWB individual throttle bodies + direct port nitrous
- the latest, Jackson Racing supercharger

He likes the Jackson the best by far above all the other setups. I believe it is making close to 300whp...

Soon to be Jackson supercharger + direct port nitrous 

And I am SO OT


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## alexedge (Jul 11, 2007)

bdc88 said:


> @ Alexedge
> 
> You will be fine running a Dura-Ace BB if it is the older style Octalink that I think you are talking about. I am running 68 X 108 on both of my Pedal Force MT builds. The second build is a sub 18 lbs. hardtail. I am running that one as a 2 X 9.
> 
> ...


They are fairly recent Dura-Ace (he bought them in 06 I think), my dad had them laying around (he went to Campy record carbon). I am running them on a steel Marin MTB frame in a 1x9 configuration (42T front) with SRAM X.9 shifter and rear d. Love the SRAM stuff, just got it. Next upgrade is a nice wheelset.

In a couple months planning to buy the Pedalforce frame and the fork you recommended and transfer everything I have on this Marin over to those.

BTW, your bike is amazing, but those Trigon forks will certainly make it MUCH more aesthetically pleasing. Plus lighter. So you can't lose!


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Finally have both my projects almost finished. I am still waiting for some carbon goodies from Fibre-Lyte in the UK for the single speed build up which should be very close to 14 lbs. 

I did take my MT hardtail out for its first ride today. Just an hour to see how things would go and this thing is a rocket. I have it set up as a 2 X 9 and love it. I have never set up a bike this way and I really like it. The build is just at 18 lbs at this time but I am just waiting for me new grips and I am having a ***** of a time sourcing some good skewers for this build. I just have to change the chain to the KMC X10SL, put the grips on, get some light skewers and install my light weight tubes and this should just be under 18 lbs.

I will of course post the build list, pictures and final build list when each bike is done. 

So lets see everyone elses builds.


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## bbtheory (Mar 20, 2007)

I want to get in on this, I've clicked on the link in the first post but it just sows me a few pics, thats it.... how do I get in on the group buy?


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

bbtheory said:


> I want to get in on this, I've clicked on the link in the first post but it just sows me a few pics, thats it.... how do I get in on the group buy?


Toooooo late.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Way too late. I have had the frames for over a month and am just finish up the builds. You can still buy them but they are now $750.00 I think.


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## Zeratul (Jul 31, 2007)

i have just get email from Pedalforce that they will have another MT group buy in the next 4 weeks !!


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## bbtheory (Mar 20, 2007)

whew! awesome!


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Well I like my build so much (down to 16 lbs, 14oz now, and getting lighter by the day), that I've decided to pick up another 2 framesets for my wife and buddy. I'm after 19" frames. Let me know what you have. If not, I'll just wait for the new GB.

If from the US, shipping will be to Blaine, Wa 98230. 

If from elsewhere, shipping to Surrey, BC Canada, V4A 8E6 

Thanks 

Jacques


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## hairyharris (Sep 8, 2006)

*ride quality*

Gentlemen, how's the ride quality? Are the frames holding up to true xc racing? Are they comfy? Please give some reviews. Thanks


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

I don't race these days, but I've put some hours on my frame in rocky hills, cobbles, and asphalt. The carbon rear really takes the edge off. Ride is much smoother than the S-Works hardtail it replaced. I've hit rocks hard enough to twist my stem around and tweak the front wheel, but still no scary noises from the frame. I only have a few gripes and they would not prevent me from buying another Pedal Force frame:

The optional no-name headset sucks. Spend another $10-20 and get a Cane Creek, KCNC, etc. Bearings are OK, but the other parts are rubbish. Unlike some other customers, I was able to adjust mine properly after deburring the aluminum bits with a file. But, there is still slop in the headset. I can't feel it while riding, but I can see the top race cover move relative to frame when I rock the front wheel. This is my first integrated headset, so maybe my standards are too high. Perhaps they all have more slop than a good traditional headset?

I know I'm in the minority, but I prefer downtube-routed cables because they're lighter, easier to service, and have less friction. The huge BB-chainstay interface and radically-shaped chainstays make downtube routing conversion impractical.

The included cable guide ferrules rattle in the cable guides. If you run hydraulic brakes, you won't use these anyway.

When I ran a rigid fork, the frame had a loud, annoying resonance on the road. It was loud enough that pedestrians turned to see where the noise was coming from. With fat tires and suspension fork, it's only slightly louder than aluminum or steel frame.


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

hairyharris said:


> Gentlemen, how's the ride quality? Are the frames holding up to true xc racing? Are they comfy? Please give some reviews. Thanks


I'm not really good at comparing ride quality, but i do like the frame. i've taken on some drops and pushed it around at it worked flawlessly.


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## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

*review*

no real notes from me until I abuse it all winter. If both frames survive the winter mileage I will be pleased.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

EuroMack said:


> The optional no-name headset sucks. Spend another $10-20 and get a Cane Creek, KCNC, etc. Bearings are OK, but the other parts are rubbish. Unlike some other customers, I was able to adjust mine properly after deburring the aluminum bits with a file. But, there is still slop in the headset. I can't feel it while riding, but I can see the top race cover move relative to frame when I rock the front wheel. This is my first integrated headset, so maybe my standards are too high. Perhaps they all have more slop than a good traditional headset?


Agreed that some of the headset parts suck. I managed to get mine working perfectly by substituting the split upper bearing spacer/race for the one from my Giant integrated headset. The one supplied with the Pedal Force headset is not correctly machined. Once it is tight in the top of the upper bearing, it is still loose around the steerer tube. That was the source of the slop in my headset.

I like the frame just fine. I've only had it offroad once so far, but I've put many miles on it commuting to work. I fractured my scapula and dislocated my shoulder at the begining of June, so it took till now for it to be sufficiently healed for offroad riding.

I pounded around for about an hour and a half and it performed flawlessly. I also noticed the ride being smooth. I did cmoe from the Giant Anthem Advanced FS, but recall the road ride being much more harsh on my old Giant ATX890 aluminum hardtail, and now I'm using a SpeedNeedle.

As I said above, I'm really happy with the outcome, and looking to buy more frames.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Here's a similar alternative for those who can't wait for next group buy:
http://cgi.ebay.com/No-Logo-Carbon-...0783538QQihZ010QQcategoryZ98084QQcmdZViewItem

If you're looking for cheap and light, but don't want carbon, he also has these:
http://cgi.ebay.com/MOSSO-ferret-Sc...3733930QQihZ010QQcategoryZ98083QQcmdZViewItem


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I'm not too enamored by Mr Yan_Kelly these days. Be careful!


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

I have bought a lot of things off of Yan_Kelly and have never had a problem and get pretty quick delivery. Do not count him out as I got my KCNC brakes from him at a great price.Well below what they list them for.


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## wiiija (Jun 23, 2005)

Yan_Kelly.......slowest delivery from HK ever! I use mr_bikestore alot and everything arrives in an amazing 2-3 days, no matter what it is I ordered.
I ordered a chain from Yan and it took over 2 weeks to arrive.That being said, it did arrive so I cant really complain


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

wiiija said:


> Yan_Kelly.......slowest delivery from HK ever! I use mr_bikestore alot and everything arrives in an amazing 2-3 days, no matter what it is I ordered.
> I ordered a chain from Yan and it took over 2 weeks to arrive.That being said, it did arrive so I cant really complain


Two weeks is a long time? The guy is all the way on the other side of the world. Somtimes I don't even get stuff from Universal cycles or SpeedGoat in 2 weeks time and they are on the same continent as me.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I've bought from Yan_Kelly 3-4 times now. He's hit and miss as far as I'm concerned. A couple times, things were 100%, and I had my parts inside of 2 weeks (which is fine as far as I'm concerned from China). However, a couple times I had to chase after him, and right now I'm having trouble with a warranty claim for my Giant Anthem Advanced frameset that I bought from him,.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Here is my completed build.:thumbsup: 
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=120152236624&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=002
Life is what happens when you are making other plans:sad:


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## dr.wierd (Aug 10, 2007)

Would I be correct in saying that the Pedal Force frame is a Full-Dynamix?

http://www.battaglin.it/catalogo/cicli_elenco.asp?id=4

Looks really similar.


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## aeroshots (Oct 21, 2006)

Sure does. It is safe to say that the manufacture, not marketer, makes this frame for several marketers. It is for sure a high end item of great quality no matter who's logo is placed on it.


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## Guest (Aug 17, 2007)

"We are a USA company selling direct to customers worldwide."

So is Leader. All factors of production are abroad. All technical know-how sent abroad. All profits accrued to a very small group of people. No hard working domestic (US) workers learning how become artisans and craftsmen.

"Manufacturing monocoque carbon fiber frames, forks and seat posts is an inherently costly affair. Firstly, carbon fiber is an expensive material that is in high demand. Secondly, an expensive mould has to be made for every new part and frame size. Thirdly, it is a labor intensive process, not suited for high-volume production."

Ahh, and to do this domestically that would be "labor intensive" x 10. 

"Obviously, most big brands would want to charge premium prices for such exotic stuff. Beside production costs, the final retail prices are also highly marked up by big investment costs in setting up dealer networks, advertising, team sponsorships and brand name promotion with the aim to reach a wide market audience."

Thank goodness there are manufacturers around that are looking out for our best interests. 

"So why are our prices so good? Because we sell direct and we don't incur huge costs in brand building campaigns. We only reach out to the real cyclists who know what they want. Our typical customer is a cycling enthusiast with good knowledge of bike riding and technology, knows a good product when he sees one, and found out about us through research or from their cycling network. By minimizing our cost of product promotion to a wider market audience, we aim to make the best cycling technology affordable to people who will truly enjoy it."

Prices are so good because US domestic makers exported finances, knowledge and expertise (investing abroad instead of domestically) bypassing the costs associated with trial and error thus enabling Taiwanese manufacturers (yes, I do believe they are building great products without having to do the dirty work. In truth, Taiwanese manufacturers are probably the best at using carbon fibre) to, well, we can't really call it stealing..., let's say capitalizing on the gold mine laid before them by profit-only-seeking business people. As for building a company name, it takes money and we as cyclist thrive on discussions about products. It really comes down to whether the person who "produced" your frame is important to you or not. Sponsorships? Sponsorships are what makes the racing scene. Even if you are not into racing the racing scene is the electrocardio impulse igniting the heartbeat of mtb cycling. Trek contributes to the "scene" but I wonder if Pedal Force does or ever plans to?

"We believe that carbon composites make the most amazing bikes. Our products are designed for their high performance, strength, durability and good looks. Now everyone can afford them. All our products have undergone stringent quality control, and have been fully tested for strength and durability. All products come with a satisfaction guarantee and are warranted against defects in workmanship."

I absolutely agree. To bad so people prefer to buy nameless and faceless rather than spending a few hundred dollars more on something that supports their local sporting scene and more importantly their domestic economy and industry.

This is not a slam against "Made in Taiwan" or staunch support for "Made in America," but more about what local craftsmen have given up over the last decade. Sure, we can get cool frames more cheaply. The cost to us isn't short-term financial, but long-term in that we (tax paying Ameican people) lose out on the factors of production for bicycles including the ability to build one from scratch. Slowly, albeit, but steadily and without perception until we have just another part of American society, in this case a fundemental pleasure closely associated with American culture, that it overly reliant upon foreign producers.

I'll say this in closing: I am a bit of a protectionist in general. But my feelings only came about when the balance of foreign vs domestic production in all good became grossly weighted. I really don't mean to turn this into a political or economical discussion, but those are both considerations I take into account when purchasing a bike. Didn't used to have to, but the selling out of cycling production has forced my closer inspection of these issues as they relate to the sport I love and the culture and society I love. 

I would kindly request anyone considering a Pedal Force purchase, being one of the fifty on the list, to consider these issues as well. Even better, contact a domestic builder (yes, I know it won't be easy to find one but that is something that needs to change!) and just talk to them about their frames, their riding and how they support our sport. I won't hold your purchase of a (insert Taiwan-made frame here) against you unless you use the bike to race (remember, they save $ by not investing in domestic racing), complain about outsourcing, or just plain don't give a crap where your bike is made. Cheap has a price and just becuase you don't pay for it now doesn't mean you won't in the future.

Like to hear your thoughts. 

C-D


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## chrism (Jan 27, 2004)

Just wondering whether anybody buying this frame got the Pedalforce seatpost with it, and if so whether it's any good? Looking at getting one for a road build, as if it works it's hard to justify anything else on a $/g basis (given I am building to a budget).


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

*Pedal Force build lists for XC and SS builds.*

Here are the build lists and one picture for each build that I did with the Pedal Force MT first group buy. I am very happy with both builds and there is still room for improvement with the XC build. True weenie fashion I can not say that the XC is done.

BIKE: PEDAL FORCE MT XC

BOTTLE CAGE: Planet bike 24g
BOTTLE CAGE BOLTS:	Syntace 4g
BOTTOM BRACKET:	Token 68 X 108 148g
BRAKE LEVERS: KCNC VB1 V-Brakes and lever kit 286g
BRAKES REAR: See levers 
BRAKES FRONT: See levers 
CABLES/HOUSINGS:	Standard housings at this time 140g
CASSETTE: TOKEN 11/32 154g
CHAIN: KMS X10SL silver with links missing	240g
CRANKSET: FSA Team Carbon 433g
-	CRANK ARMS:	
-	BRANK BOLTS:	Token aluminum bolts 9g each 18g
-	OUTER RING:	Extralite 44t 60g
-	MIDDLE RING:	Extralite 30t 28g
-	INNER RING:	
-	RING BOLTS:	Extralite 1.2 4g
DERAILLEUR FRONT:	XTR 127g
DERAILLEUR REAR:	XTR tuned with carbon cage and ti spring	175g
FORKS: Sid Team Cut to size 1426g
FRAME: Pedal Force MT carbon HT 1143g
GRIPS: ESI silicon 51g
HANDLE BAR: Easton EC90 SL 99g
HEADSET: Pedal Force Supplied 81g
HEADSET CAP/BOLT:	Syntace Cap, standard bolt and compressor	30g
HEADSET SPACERS:	Carbon Spacer 20g
PEDALS: Eggbeater SL 268g
QUICK RELEASES: 
SEAT: SLR Carbonio 160g
SEAT BINDER: OmniRacer 34.9 10g
SEAT POST: KCNC Ti Pro Lite 31.6 X 350 155g
SHIFTERS: XTR 217g
STEM: Syntace F99 25.4 105mm 108g
TIRE FRONT: Maxxis Minatour 465g
TIRE REAR: Maxxis Minatour 464g
TUBES: Maxxis UItralite tubes 108g eash 216g
WHEEL FRONT: 
WHEEL REAR: 
WHEELSET: American Classic MTB 350 1452g
MISC OPTION:

TOTAL WEIGHT IN GRAMS:	8206g
TOTAL WEIGHT IN POUNDS:	18.09lbs.









BIKE: PEDAL FORCE MT SS

AEROBARS: 
BOTTLE CAGE: Planet bike 24g
BOTTLE CAGE BOLTS:	Syntace 4g
BOTTOM BRACKET:	Kult 68 X 108 155g
BRAKE LEVERS: Extralite Ultralevers 64g
BRAKES REAR: Vuelta Mag Tuned 116g
BRAKES FRONT: Vuelta Mag Tuned 116g
CABLES/HOUSINGS:	Aztec Powercord 80g
CASSETTE: Single 16T Shimano Cog and spacers 100g
CHAIN: KMS X10SL silver with links missing	212g
CRANKSET: FSA Team Carbon 433g
-	CRANK ARMS:	
-	BRANK BOLTS:	FSA aluminum bolts 11g each 22g
-	OUTER RING:	Custom Fibre-Lyte Carbon 32t 51g
-	MIDDLE RING:	
-	INNER RING:	
-	RING BOLTS:	
DERAILLEUR FRONT:	
DERAILLEUR REAR:	Surly Singulator c/w carbon upgrades	110g
FORKS: Trigon Carbon Fork 475g
FRAME: Pedal Force MT carbon HT 1143g
GRIPS: ESI silicon 51g
HANDLE BAR: Easton MonkeyLite SL 135g
HEADSET: Pedal Force Supplied 81g
HEADSET CAP/BOLT:	Syntace Cap, standard bolt and compressor	30g
HEADSET SPACERS:	Carbon Spacer 20g
PEDALS: Eggbeater SL 268g
QUICK RELEASES: 
SEAT: SLR 150g
SEAT BINDER: OmniRacer 34.9 10g
SEAT POST: KCNC Ti Pro Lite 31.6 X 350 155g
SHIFTERS:	
STEM: Syntace F99 25.4 105mm 108g
TIRE FRONT: Maxxis MaxxLite 310 310g
TIRE REAR: Maxxis MaxxLite 310 311g
TUBES: Maxxis UItralite tubes 108g eash 216g
WHEEL FRONT: Specialized S-Works wheel and rim strip	661g
WHEEL REAR: Specialized S-Works wheel and rim strip	778g
WHEELSET: 
MISC OPTION:

TOTAL WEIGHT IN GRAMS:	6389g
TOTAL WEIGHT IN POUNDS:	14.09 lbs.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Nice bikes bdc88.

On another note, I emailed PF about another GB, and they said nothing planned for the near future. However, they said that a quantity purchase would yield discounts, as I suggested that I would be bringing them 3-4 frame sales. I wonder if we could approach them about a GB of our own, and tentatively get the pricing near or at the $500 per frame from before. Anyone interested? I'd consider administering this.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

After so many months, finally its up! Weighing at 7.1kg  i'm fairly satisfied.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Does anyone know where i can find alu bosses for me to replace the stock ones? And what is the size needed? Thanks


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

has anyone figured out what model of XTR front derailleur works best with this frame with a 2x9 set-up?[/B]


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

Atmos.......check these out....7.5 grams for both!!! will they work, they are M10 size

http://cgi.ebay.com/M10-Aluminium-B...ryZ42319QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

i just noticed they make these M10 studs in a 1.0, 1.25, or a 1.5 pitch....what does that mean? what "pitch" would work with this frame? does it matter?


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

hey cyclemanpat, thanks alot for your link. I will check it out.

I'm using the xtr 953 front dee, i don't say it works best, but so far it doesn't give me any problems yet. Still in the search for top clamp 952 thou, btw does it exist at all? I don't seem to see 952 in top clamp around.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Up until about a week ago, I was using an M952 top swing (bottom clamp) bottom pull, and it shifted OK from the 29t to the 44t. If I tried to rush the shift, it would often shift off the outside of the 44, and if I backed off the limit screw to stop this, then it would have trouble shifting it up at all. It also would absolutely *not* shift up if I had *any* torque at all on the chain.

I wanted to WW the bike some more, so I bought a Campy Record Titanium (carbon outer plate) 10 speed compact FD, and proceeded to convert it to top pull, as well as grinding out the 32mm clamp to fit the 34.9 seat tube, and grinding some slots into the clamp band for weight reduction. It weighs 79g (as opposed to the M952 at 109g), and absolutely shifts 1,000% better than the old XTR M952. It *never* overshifts, and it will pull the chain up off the 29 without any trouble, even if I'm pushing on the pedals.


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

wow.....how did you covert it to a top pull? I have a Dura Ace front der., could i possibly convert that to work on this frame?


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## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

BlownCivic said:


> Up until about a week ago, I was using an M952 top swing (bottom clamp) bottom pull, and it shifted OK from the 29t to the 44t. If I tried to rush the shift, it would often shift off the outside of the 44, and if I backed off the limit screw to stop this, then it would have trouble shifting it up at all. It also would absolutely *not* shift up if I had *any* torque at all on the chain.
> 
> I wanted to WW the bike some more, so I bought a Campy Record Titanium (carbon outer plate) 10 speed compact FD, and proceeded to convert it to top pull, as well as grinding out the 32mm clamp to fit the 34.9 seat tube, and grinding some slots into the clamp band for weight reduction. It weighs 79g (as opposed to the M952 at 109g), and absolutely shifts 1,000% better than the old XTR M952. It *never* overshifts, and it will pull the chain up off the 29 without any trouble, even if I'm pushing on the pedals.


yeah, we need pics. I'm interested in doing this. i have a 1x9 right now because i couldn't find a proper fd that i liked.
Michael


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

I have been lusting after the Campy carbon compact front derailleur for a while and would love to see details of the top pull conversion. Did you follow this method?
http://www.light-bikes.it/forum/index.php?topic=759.0

Pat, 
I have a Dura Ace FD-7800 on my desk and it's certainly not possible to flip the linkage as shown on the Italian board. I could convert the DA by adding a linkage, but at that point it would probably weigh as much as my other old derailleurs.


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

OK.....I will ditch that idea then


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## dr.wierd (Aug 10, 2007)

Is it just me, or is the area where the TT and DT meet at the HT is different in the pics that Atmos and bdc88 posted than what is on the pedal force site:


















*From PedalForce.com:*









Not trying to knock the bike, I'm sure its great, but unless my eyes deceive me, its a different design. Or is it different sizes??


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

My guess is that it is a different size. My frame is a 17" and I would bet that the one in the picture is the smallest they sell.

Edited: I would actually think that this is a larger frame and not the smallest.

As for the 2 X 9 set up, it has been working great with little problems.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

EuroMack said:


> I have been lusting after the Campy carbon compact front derailleur for a while and would love to see details of the top pull conversion. Did you follow this method?
> http://www.light-bikes.it/forum/index.php?topic=759.0


That's the exact method I used. However, I skipped the part about putting in the spacer to take up the gap from flipping the linkage. I will eventually get around to putting one in there.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

dr.wierd said:


> Is it just me, or is the area where the TT and DT meet at the HT is different in the pics that Atmos and bdc88 posted than what is on the pedal force site:
> 
> Not trying to knock the bike, I'm sure its great, but unless my eyes deceive me, its a different design. Or is it different sizes??


My 19" frame looks pretty much exactly like Atmos and bdc88's bikes. I suspect maybe the PF photo is an early one.


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## yater (Nov 3, 2006)

I'll ask again.....has anyone actually raced this bike? How does it feel at race pace off-road? How has it held up after a few races?


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## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

Sorry, I still haven't taken mine for it's maiden voyage. But it will get a lot of training time this winter and racing next year.
Why do you distrust the frame?


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## yater (Nov 3, 2006)

jyeager said:


> Sorry, I still haven't taken mine for it's maiden voyage. But it will get a lot of training time this winter and racing next year.
> Why do you distrust the frame?


I don't distrust it. I'm just looking for more information. I haven't seen a race report yet on this frame.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Does anyone here have the measurements for the cantistuds on the frame? I'm looking to change them. Thanks alot


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## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

Looks like we have 21 people signed up at the moment  that gets us to the $510 frame price.

If anyone was thinking about this frame, the group buy deadline is Oct 31st, 1 day left to sign up for it.


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

Today i got an email from pedal Force saying that I need to pay the deposit before Nov.10. I have no idea how top pay this deposit? I went to the site and there is no Link or anything to pay them. Anyone else get this email? Did you figure out how to pay?

pat


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Atmos said:


> Does anyone here have the measurements for the cantistuds on the frame? I'm looking to change them. Thanks alot


Anyone?


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Atmos said:


> Anyone?


My guess would be M10x1.25. I'll let you know when I get my frameset. M8 is used in front and all my frames have been M10 in back. You can get a thread pitch guage at the local hardware store if you need to know ASAP. Finding the posts in Al is the real challenge, though. The last set I bought were from Trevor.


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

I just paid my $200 deposit, make sure we all pay this so we get the frames....cant wait!!!


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Axis II said:


> My guess would be M10x1.25. I'll let you know when I get my frameset. M8 is used in front and all my frames have been M10 in back. You can get a thread pitch guage at the local hardware store if you need to know ASAP. Finding the posts in Al is the real challenge, though. The last set I bought were from Trevor.


Axis, thanks for your reply. The current studs weigh a tonne.
I do not know whether it is 1.25 or 1.5 pitch as i do not have a gauge and i'm quite reluctant to strip the brakes. Btw Toronto Cycle in ebay sell them about usd10. :thumbsup:


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Atmos said:


> Axis, thanks for your reply. The current studs weigh a tonne.
> I do not know whether it is 1.25 or 1.5 pitch as i do not have a gauge and i'm quite reluctant to strip the brakes. Btw Toronto Cycle in ebay sell them about usd10. :thumbsup:


I just checked Toronto and your right they do have them in stock now.:thumbsup: It was really difficult to source these the last time I was looking. Since no one is appears to know what the dimensions are on these things.............about stripping the brakes: this is really simple to remove one caliper, remove the post and take to the hardware store for a sneaky measure if your cheap like me and don't want to actually purchase a thread pitch guage. Then bolt back together and all your adjustments should be unaltered.


----------



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Axis II said:


> I just checked Toronto and your right they do have them in stock now.:thumbsup: It was really difficult to source these the last time I was looking. Since no one is appears to know what the dimensions are on these things.............about stripping the brakes: this is really simple to remove one caliper, remove the post and take to the hardware store for a sneaky measure if your cheap like me and don't want to actually purchase a thread pitch guage. Then bolt back together and all your adjustments should be unaltered.


muahaha guess i have to do it. But i need to check whether my lbs have the gauge.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

:thumbsup: to pedalforce. They gave me the answer. M10X1.5. cOoL~~~


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Atmos said:


> :thumbsup: to pedalforce. They gave me the answer. M10X1.5. cOoL~~~


Excellent. Toronto bike here I come........


----------



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Axis II said:


> Excellent. Toronto bike here I come........


Hi Axis, any idea on what is the cantistuds size on sid world cup? hehe Thanks


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

Cheers........so this headset will work? This is listed as the "press fit"


----------



## mpap89 (Mar 10, 2005)

cyclemanpat said:


> Cheers........so this headset will work? This is listed as the "press fit"


yeah, it looks like the same design as the canecreek is-6 that i used.


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

found this Token headset, weighs 78 grams and is only $25!! would this work? I posted the specs: 
_____________________________________________
This is for one Token KUDOS-N (TK017CN) 
Alloy 1-1/8" Internal Needle Bearings Headset for ATB

TOP cover Ø28.6x50mm CNC alloy 6061T6
Cups Ø44x50mm CNC alloy 6061T6
Crown race Ø30mm Steel
TK417CN high rolling Cartridge Needle Bearings
Stack Height: 12mm
Weight: 78g


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## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

or this token: 
-- ------------------------------------
This is for one Token Alloy 1-1/8" Internal Headset for ATB

Ø28.6x30x44x50mm
Top Cover: Ø28.6x50 Alloy 6061T6 CNC machined
Cups: Ø44x50 Alloy 6061T6 CNC machined
Crown race: Ø30 steel
High Rolling Cartridge ACBearings
TK417CB: Ø31x41.7x36ºx45º
Height: 13mm
Weight: 89g (w/o Cap)


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Atmos said:


> Hi Axis, any idea on what is the cantistuds size on sid world cup? hehe Thanks


I dunno offhand but my Sid takes the Extralite Canti studs whatever they are.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

What QR's is everyone using that owns a MT frame. I am having a b1tch of a time finding some light weight QR's that fit. I bought a pair of bolt ons but the rear is too short and it is a 135mm spacing. 

So what is everyone using and what is good, light and inexpensive. Not asking for much.

Cheers


----------



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

bdc88 said:


> What QR's is everyone using that owns a MT frame. I am having a b1tch of a time finding some light weight QR's that fit. I bought a pair of bolt ons but the rear is too short and it is a 135mm spacing.
> 
> So what is everyone using and what is good, light and inexpensive. Not asking for much.
> 
> Cheers


I'm using the extralite aliens2 now, works great with no complaints. Weight wise is not very impressive thou. Maybe anyone in here can share which light and compatible ones are they using with this frame?


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Tune Skyline MTB. 25g for front and rear. I'm only using the rear, since I have the Lefty front shock. I was buying these from Svelte Cycles, but he now tells me that the US distributor is no longer importing them. I'm looking for a new source as I want another set for my commuter build.

Anyone have a set for sale, or know of possible source?


----------



## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

I'm having a hard time figuring out what size frame to get. I am 5'7" 145lbs. 31" inseam. I have a medium(17") Cannondale f4 that fits me well. Do I go for the 17" or the 19"? The reason why I dont automatically go for the 17" in this case is becuase the TT seems alot shorter than the Cdale? Anyone have suggestions? I'd love to pay for this thing by Monday and get it shipped out  thanks.


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

I guess it won't go wrong with the right TT with your dale if you want a good fit. But again, you can compare the downtube as well.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

TabascoJoe said:


> I'm having a hard time figuring out what size frame to get. I am 5'7" 145lbs. 31" inseam. I have a medium(17") Cannondale f4 that fits me well. Do I go for the 17" or the 19"? The reason why I dont automatically go for the 17" in this case is becuase the TT seems alot shorter than the Cdale? Anyone have suggestions? I'd love to pay for this thing by Monday and get it shipped out  thanks.


FWIW, I would get the 17 at your height and fit a longer stem to get your cockpit length correct. I'm 5'11" and I went for the 19 but, take this with a grain of salt; I tend to like my rides on the petite side.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

If you can afford to invest the money for 3 months, buy BOTH sizes. When they arrive, ride the one that fits best and sell the extra one. You'll easily get your money back, unless PF drops the standard price or some eBay shop starts selling them cheap.

FWIW, I am 6ft tall with long limbs (34in inseam and 35-36in sleeve length for dress shirts). My PF bike is 19in with 130mm stem and 230mm of exposed layback seatpost. I considered the 21in, but I'm very happy on the 19in.

If you don't want to deal with 2 frames, go for the 17in. You may need an unfashionably long stem, but your bike will handle better.



TabascoJoe said:


> I'm having a hard time figuring out what size frame to get. I am 5'7" 145lbs. 31" inseam. I have a medium(17") Cannondale f4 that fits me well. Do I go for the 17" or the 19"? The reason why I dont automatically go for the 17" in this case is becuase the TT seems alot shorter than the Cdale? Anyone have suggestions? I'd love to pay for this thing by Monday and get it shipped out  thanks.


----------



## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

Thanks for the help, guys  Can only afford one atm so Iam going with the 17". Cant wait to get this thing!


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

I'm 6'3".. I'm right going with the 21"right?


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## 2wheelsoul (Mar 24, 2005)

*SPAM - 17" Pedalforce MT - For Sale - NOW - not 2008*

I ain't gonna build it up. Someone please make this beauty scream. She looks so pathetic all nude without her bits.

I know there are Group Buyers who want 2 frames....well....get this one NOW. Then get a nice gift for Valentines Day.

I had the ZS-6 pressed, this frame is ready to be built.

http://classifieds.mtbr.com/showproduct.php?product=13239


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## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Isn't the buy out ended ?!?

I wanted a CF frame w/o almost/any graphics and for V-Brakes and this one is very interesting...price wise and all


----------



## Salt Cycles (Sep 25, 2004)

I emailed Pedal Force Sunday the 11th asking if there was still any way I could get in on the group buy. Monday they emailed back saying 2 people did not pay their deposit so I could take one of those spots. Sent in my funds and now I am getting a sweet/light carbon 21" frame. WOO HOO:thumbsup: :thumbsup:


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## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

cmanser said:


> I emailed Pedal Force Sunday the 11th asking if there was still any way I could get in on the group buy. Monday they emailed back saying 2 people did not pay their deposit so I could take one of those spots. Sent in my funds and now I am getting a sweet/light carbon 21" frame. WOO HOO:thumbsup: :thumbsup:


Well i finally decided to take my chances and emailed them...i doubt that there is still a spot free but who knows ?!? Their frame is exatly what i wanted...less than 1200grams (1160grams for a 17" frame), VBrakes compatible, good looking CF , great price and minimalist graphics ! Almost zero graphics !


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Cheers! said:


> If the scalehead fits, it means the ID of the headtube is 44mm.
> 
> There are a lot of other choices of internal headsets at 44 mm diameter.
> 
> ...


Can anyone confirm that the Tune BuBu headset is possible? I believe it is but just want to confirm. This a light option.
Gracias


----------



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Axis II said:


> Can anyone confirm that the Tune BuBu headset is possible? I believe it is but just want to confirm. This a light option.
> Gracias


Axis, i think they are ok.
I'm using the extralite scalhead now and i think the bubu is the same as the scalhead. :thumbsup:


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

anyone who is in this last GB have received the frame yet?? post pics & weight please.. im curious about the 21"!! mine should be here soon


----------



## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Axis II said:


> Can anyone confirm that the Tune BuBu headset is possible? I believe it is but just want to confirm. This a light option.
> Gracias


I don' t think there is much difference in ZS headset weight except the caps, as the spec does not leave much room for creativity. I'm sure you have a light cap, so buy a Cane Creek or Ritchey and save $100.

I think the varying weights are due to some people including bolt/cap and others excluding it. By spec, the bearings must be the same size. The aluminum cups can't vary by more than a couple grams or they won't fit the frame and bearings.

Cane Creek ZS-2 is nice and ZS-6 is same with SS bearings. You can get them with or without integrated spacers.

If you want to spend money, the Extralite Scalhead is lighter than Tune, and comes with cool cap! But, they save the weight by using tiny bearing on top.

http://www.canecreek.com/zs-6-headset.html


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## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Well, it seems that i got it on time :thumbsup:  
Received the answer by email from Pedalforce and they gived me the OK     

I bought it in the name of my off-road_motorcycle/MTB_bike store so if i don't like it, i can put it in display in my store and sell it easily to one of my customers in a perfectly legit way 

I gone for DHL transport because their current delivery guy know us and because USPS here transfer the packages to CTT Express witch are some times "subpar" as for care with frames :nono: :incazzato: :bluefrown: :yikes: :rant:


----------



## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

felipedana said:


> anyone who is in this last GB have received the frame yet?? post pics & weight pppplease.. im curious about a 21"!! mine should be here soon


I received mine on the 15th. will post pics and weights later today/tonite.


----------



## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

EuroMack said:


> I don' t think there is much difference in ZS headset weight except the caps, as the spec does not leave much room for creativity. I'm sure you have a light cap, so buy a Cane Creek or Ritchey and save $100.
> 
> I think the varying weights are due to some people including bolt/cap and others excluding it. By spec, the bearings must be the same size. The aluminum cups can't vary by more than a couple grams or they won't fit the frame and bearings.
> 
> ...


I think that's sound advice, prolly. I'm done with EL headsets, I think. The ZS seems like a decent choice. Maybe I'll post up weights when I get it.


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Even a PRO RS-11 headset weights only 84gr...and i believe that includes the cap and spider in the weight...i have one in my current frame...i don't use it's stock cap and spider however...instead, i'm using a expander with carbon cap and Ti screw from Point :thumbsup:


----------



## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

Heres a pic of my 17" frame. It came in at 1127g with derailleur hanger and bolt, minus all 4 bottle cage bolts :thumbsup:


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

1127g ?!? That's great :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: 

Is the rear derailleur bolt made of steel ? If it is you can put one of Alu witch compensates the 4 alu bolts weight to plug the 4 bottle bolts holes.

BTW, where is the Toronto Bike store online ?!?
I want alu cantistuds but we don't have them here...

TIA,
AJSB


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

AJSB said:


> 1127g ?!? That's great :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
> 
> Is the rear derailleur bolt made of steel ? If it is you can put one of Alu witch compensates the 4 alu bolts weight to plug the 4 bottle bolts holes.
> 
> ...


There you go dude! Enjoy! One in alu the other in ti :thumbsup:

http://cgi.ebay.com/M10-Aluminium-B...hZ007QQcategoryZ42319QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/M10-Titanium-Br...hZ008QQcategoryZ42319QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Atmos said:


> There you go dude! Enjoy! One in alu the other in ti :thumbsup:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/M10-Aluminium-B...hZ007QQcategoryZ42319QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/M10-Titanium-Br...hZ008QQcategoryZ42319QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem


Thanks Atmos :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

I checked the ebay store and zooming the image of the studs saw their URL...visited their site and just bought the Ti version using PayPal


----------



## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

AJSB said:


> Thanks Atmos :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
> 
> I checked the ebay store and zooming the image of the studs saw their URL...visited their site and just bought the Ti version using PayPal


That was lightning fast haha


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

just got my frame! such a beauty 

will post pics soon.. 

it's a 21" btw.


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

some photos:


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Atmos said:


> That was lightning fast haha


That's me...lightning fast     

Only wish that was true


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

felipedana said:


> some photos:


Thanks for the pics...beautiful frame :thumbsup: 
I notice that this frame is different from the ones of some others and same as one in PF site...i belieive that they are using two slightly different designs near headset area...frame size related ?


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

yes, looks like the smallest the frame, the closer the junction of the toptube and downtube.. so that area is "beefier" on smaller frames.. that's due the headset tube being bigger on bigger frame. thats actually pretty usual with many manufactures... on side note i prefer the looks of the 17" frame.. too bad it wouldn't fit me.


----------



## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

*FSA ZS Headset 82g*

So, I just ordered this as a good compromise, I hope, between the Tune BuBu and the Cane Creek ZS. It may be essentially the same headset as the Cane Creek, I dunno. I'll post weights and pics when it arrives. There was some mention erlier here that the FSA ZS HS was only available as an OEM product. It can be found out there. Got this one from Universalcycles.


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

Felipedana,
The 17" will be just fine with me (using now a RockMachine 16,5") no matter i'm 176cm tall...i like small frames...we can make a u-turn in a dime if we need to :thumbsup:
I need however a 400mm seatpost...and it's right on the limit mark (actually bellow in my current frame  )

Axis II,
Aren't those headset edges where it goes inside frame too sharp ?!? You better be extra careful to have it 100% aligned when start to press it...


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I recently bought another 2 of these frames, and once again bought 2 headsets from PF as I figured it was a cheap and easy way to get the bearings and the frame cups. This time, I managed to get them to fit correctly. They came with some thin aluminum shims. 

At 1st, I tried to assemble the bike without using the shims in the headset. I encountered the same trouble with the sloppy headset. I then included 2 of the 3 shims that they sent, and was able to correctly tighten the headset so there was no play whatsoever.

This is my wife's bike. 19lbs, 10oz (8.94 kg), and I didn't try all that hard to keep the weight down. Now if the weather would just warm up a bit so I can get her to ride the thing. Also, she says the grips clash with the seat. I said no one would see the seat with her on it :ciappa: and subsequently got a kick in the nuts  .


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

guys, take a look at this thread i just started; http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=359648


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> Also, she says the grips clash with the seat. I said no one would see the seat with her on it :ciappa: and subsequently got a kick in the nuts  .


You should have seen that coming a mile away but, wait a second, isn't that the CS you had on your rig? I've been searching Fleabay for a black Next LP for ages to no avail.:madman:


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Axis II said:


> but, wait a second, isn't that the CS you had on your rig? I've been searching Fleabay for a black Next LP for ages to no avail.:madman:


I have 2 black ISIS Next LP sets. I also have the used Power Arms that I picked up a few months ago, and I'm seriously considering a set of the Natec Mythic arms. If I pick up another set anytime soon, one of the Next LPs will be for sale.


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

I heard the Token Kudos-Z headset works also...........at $25 and under 100 grams I will try this with my PF frame


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

felipedana .................you say u just got your frame, did you buy it with the group buy#2? I was wondering if people that paid are already getting their frames??

I thought frame wouldnt arrive til Feb.??


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

Atmos.....I saw your bike came in at 7.1 kgs. Mine will be pretty close to that, can u post a list of your parts and weights??


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

yes, I bought the frame on GB#2 and they shipped right away... they have it in stock.


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

btw guys, I have GREAT news!! 

My frame is from the GB#2 as mentioned in my previous post, and i weighted it today and it's 1184g for the 21" (naked frame + derr hanger.)!!


----------



## tolleyman (Mar 5, 2006)

That's great for you, but I decided not to purchase during the Group Buy, because I was told that there was no 21" in stock. Something obviously changed. Now I'm a little miffed!

I swear at one point in the GB, only "in-stock" frames were an option.

Am I wrong?


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

tolleyman said:


> That's great for you, but I decided not to purchase during the Group Buy, because I was told that there was no 21" in stock. Something obviously changed. Now I'm a little miffed!
> 
> I swear at one point in the GB, only "in-stock" frames were an option.
> 
> Am I wrong?


quite the contrary.. First thing they said is that they would only ship next year (all sizes).. but then a day before the deposit date they emailed me (and everyone I believe) saying that they had everything in stock and would ship as soon as full payment was done..

but anyway, they never said they didn't have 21" available. GB was open to all sizes.. that's why I got in.. because the 21" is the only one that fits me.

too bad you missed 

why don't you try to email them maybe they will make the special price for you.. they are very nice to deal with IMO.


----------



## tolleyman (Mar 5, 2006)

*Here's the post that changed my mind! - I knew I didn't imagine it.*

BlownCivic
mtbr member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 418

Well bad news for you guys after 15" frames. There are none. Ming also said that our special pricing applies only to their current inventory. So if you're after a 21" frame, get in there quick.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeratul
Strange... I got confirmation and discount

So did I. You have to get pretty far along in the purchasing process for the coupon discount ot be shown, but not to the point of making your payment.


----------



## AJSB (Nov 16, 2007)

My PF 17" arrived yesterday :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I'm still in shock about how fast it all happened 

Like i said i installed a PRO RS-11 headset w/o any problems :thumbsup: 

I'm in the process of transferring all parts from old frame to new one...


----------



## G-Live (Jan 14, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> Also, she says the grips clash with the seat. I said no one would see the seat with her on it :ciappa: and subsequently got a kick in the nuts  .


Yessir, Get her some pink grips!

Great looking bikes!

G


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

I just paid for m ine last night.....so i should have it early next week!! I also got that Token headset, so we'll see how that works:thumbsup:


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

need new wheels now


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

felipedana said:


> need new wheels now


That is a truly sexy bike. Probably something to do with the photography, but I like it quite a lot. I don't see anything wrong with the look of the wheels.


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

BlownCivic said:


> That it a truly sexy bike. Probably something to do with the photography, but I like it quite a lot. I don't see anything wrong with the look of the wheels.


thanks mate..
nothing wrong with the look of the wheels.. they are just quite heavy.


----------



## TabascoJoe (Aug 22, 2007)

Sexy...
whats the total weight?
i'm thinking of getting those cranks for my build and doing a 2x9 set-up.
Also, what bottle cage is that? looks fast


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

pretty!!! final weight?


----------



## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

That will be a very worthy race rig. I like the white background for contrast against the black of the bike. Nice shots. One weight saving recommendation for those wheels: remove the shrader valve adapter on the front wheel for a 5g savings.


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

Just got my 17" frame!!! wow, is it pretty...........came in at 1131 grams


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

ignore this post


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

just got my 17" frame today, weighed 1131 grams. I put some of my parts on it, should be around 16.2 lbs complete!!


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

Thanks everyone.. I'm very happy with the bike, current weight is around 9.7kg, the new wheels will bring it to 9.2kg..

hey pat.. you're the one i bought the kcnc chainring  now i see why you damped it.. your build is looking good 

TabascoJoe, the bottlecage is a SRP here is a detailed shot for you: https://www.felipedana.com.br/felipedana/bikes/pedalforce-10.jpg


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

cool. The trails I ride have no need for a Top ring, tight single track and lots of steep climbs............so i am going to try a 32T ring up front and a 11-34 cassette. These frames are unreal! Thick tubes, what a deal we got


----------



## youngrider (Jul 29, 2006)

I just saw these bikes on MTBR classifieds and wanted to know a bit more about them.
I can tell they are very light bikes, but how durable are they?


----------



## youngrider (Jul 29, 2006)

So I have done some research on these frames and i really want one and bummed out that I was to late. Anybody know some place I can get one of these frames for the group price?


----------



## snailbike (May 29, 2006)

Maybe we can just start another group buy?


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

almost done now!!'


----------



## Tracerboy (Oct 13, 2002)

any chance of getting one of these frames with horizontal drops?


----------



## G-Live (Jan 14, 2004)

felipedana said:


> need new wheels now


Your bike looks great.

Is anyone else looking at larger sized mtb frames with 26" wheels and finding them looking a little unbalanced. 

G...Looking for the PF group buy for the 29er version. Bottom pull front derailluer option preferred thank you.:cornut:


----------



## grgilchrist (Feb 25, 2006)

snailbike said:


> Maybe we can just start another group buy?


If there is another group buy, I would be interested.:thumbsup:


----------



## Spanky Malone (Jan 14, 2004)

Me too, especially if horizontal dropouts are an option! A disc-only frame though, please.... I don't have any need for brake bosses.


----------



## Batas (Jan 16, 2004)

It looks like this one doesn't it?










FELIPEDANA, what is your frame size?


----------



## felipedana (Aug 23, 2007)

Hi mate, my frame is 21" .. 

and yes, looks like it's the same frame as fuji's


----------



## grgilchrist (Feb 25, 2006)

Here's my build, about the only thing I plan to change is some fatter tires (I will switch the 2.1 Mibro to the back and get a 2.3 for the front).


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

I noticed when running V-brakes on the PF frame, the outter-most cable stops(far left set) to install the rear V-brake is too big for the regular housing ferrules? I guees it is the width for disc brake hoses....so how do i get this to work? is there a wider(special ferrule) that fits on regular brake cable housing, but is also wide enough to fit into this cable stop......HELP!!!


----------



## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

cyclemanpat said:


> I noticed when running V-brakes on the PF frame, the outter-most cable stops(far left set) to install the rear V-brake is too big for the regular housing ferrules? I guees it is the width for disc brake hoses....so how do i get this to work? is there a wider(special ferrule) that fits on regular brake cable housing, but is also wide enough to fit into this cable stop......HELP!!!


Both my PF framesets came with adapters to hold regular brake cables in the hydraulic line holders that are bonded to the top tube.


----------



## cyclemanpat (Jul 26, 2007)

really? I didnt get those, i guess i can email PF and get some, thanks!!


----------



## zurC atnaS (Feb 1, 2005)

*another group buy*

I would be in....anyone else interested?


----------



## Juanmoretime (Jul 30, 2004)

zurC atnaS said:


> I would be in....anyone else interested?


Sure if it can be done.


----------



## thetschappats (Mar 27, 2007)

Quote:
Originally Posted by zurC atnaS
I would be in....anyone else interested? 


I would be very interested... These frames look great, and I haven't heard of any problems.


----------



## jlharden (Sep 14, 2006)

I'm interested as well. What would it take to get another group buy together? How many is necessary to receive what discount? What's the time frame for a group buy? I've been waiting for a ti frameset from a well known U.S. company for 4 months now and growing uninterested. I really wanted to be riding it by now!


----------



## stevemtu (Mar 29, 2006)

*me too*

count me in


----------



## SevenSola (Aug 5, 2007)

If it's for the MTB frame count me in.


----------



## Pivvay (Aug 19, 2004)

I still might be in for a 15". I've got a couple brand new 21" frames I'm probably not going to use now though


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## jlharden (Sep 14, 2006)

Thinking in a different direction....did anyone end up with a 19" frame they don't intend to use? I sure wish I wouldn't have missed the boat on this one, could make a nice, light build up!


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## the rat (Jun 3, 2005)

Im interested in one of these if theres another group buy. Just some quick questions, firstly, how does it ride? Is it noodly at all? Or just comfortable enough without flexing too much? 
Secondly, how would i go about getting it down to australia? Dont they all have to ship to the same place?


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## lushmd (Apr 9, 2004)

Just curious if anyone has tried to see if this frame will accommodate a 650B wheel/tire?


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

The frames are not noodly at all. I am not sure about the 650B wheel/tire but the nice thing about these frames is that I was able to run a 68 X 108BB which is very nice when running a 2 X 9 set up.


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

can I ask a favor? Can folks post a bunch of pics of the rear tire clearance? I'm trying to see how big of a tire I can run. I need good shots of the CS and SS bridge areas. I'm mainly concerned about the height/length, rather than width.
Or, maybe easier is to measure from the axle to the Chain Stay and Seat Stay bridge.

TIA


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## gracelandheightz (Jun 16, 2008)

Has anyone shipped an MTB frame from pedalforce to Canada and what kind of shipping charges were you looking at for the frame on top of the standard ship charges from pedalforce? I want to get one of these frames, any word on the next group buy?


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## thetschappats (Mar 27, 2007)

gracelandheightz said:


> Has anyone shipped an MTB frame from pedalforce to Canada and what kind of shipping charges were you looking at for the frame on top of the standard ship charges from pedalforce? I want to get one of these frames, any word on the next group buy?


The last group buy had a deadline of May 31st 2008. You can try to talk Pedal Force to let you join late. the worst they could do is say "no". Pedal Force has reasonnable shipping rates to all parts of the world. They just shipped my frame for $35 for delivery in the USA. I think the shipping weight was 10lbs.


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## gracelandheightz (Jun 16, 2008)

Received reply from Pedalforce:

Quote: 

Thanks for your interest in our products. All our groupbuys have ended and we have strict policy with groupbuy pricings. Groupbuy pricings are only available during groupbuy when there is a minimum quantity order achieved.

If you create an account on our website, we sometimes do notify customers of groupbuys. However, there is no guarantee that there will be a groupbuy for the frame that you want. Also we will not be doing a groupbuy for road frames for this year.

Regards,
Pedal Force

End Quote. I really want one of these MT Frames for a build I am starting, anyone willing to part with theirs in Canada? Also how have the frames been keeping up after 4 months of use?

Steve


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## carstenschaltz (Oct 24, 2007)

Has anyone put in alot of miles on their frames through trails, and not the smooth tame type? I am interested, even if I don't manage to get in a group buy, but durability is the only issue I have as I broke my last two HT frames (one alu one CF). Just wondering if anyone has "pushed it to the limit" with these things.


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## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

carstenschaltz said:


> Has anyone put in alot of miles on their frames through trails, and not the smooth tame type? I am interested, even if I don't manage to get in a group buy, but durability is the only issue I have as I broke my last two HT frames (one alu one CF). Just wondering if anyone has "pushed it to the limit" with these things.


If you've got a history of breaking frames, then this one might not be for you. It seems very light. 
I'm right on the boundary of clydesdale and haven't had any problems with mine yet. I have ridden/raced it on some really harsh rooted/rocky trails. It jumps me all the heck over the place when blasting through that stuff at speed, but takes the abuse.
I will say though that for a 200lber I'm pretty easy on a frame (ie. my riding style is smooth)


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## Salt Cycles (Sep 25, 2004)

Getting ready to build up my Pedal Force MT bike and wanted to know what people are using for travel on the front fork??

The website says made for 80-125mm travel - anyone have thoughts they are willing to share on what travel they like?

I am going to be riding some XC races and XC trail riding on an Extra Large Frame.

Thanks for any input.


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## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

I like my SID Team. I race and train for racing...staying away from hard hits and jumps so it works well for me...that's in keeping with the way the frame should be used too. (I say that because some will say that the SID is too light and flexy)


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## Fastskiguy (Jan 15, 2004)

Hey guys, I just bought one of these frames and would appreciate any comments after riding it for awhile. It's a light, nice looking frame, I'm pretty psyched so don't bum me out with bad reviews LOL. Kidding! I'd appreciate the info.

Also have one question....is it made for a 100mm fork? I've got 69'r thoughts....

Thanks !


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## jthurd (Oct 4, 2006)

I run the ritcyey/trigon rigid fork (short axel-crown) on it, handles a little twitchey, but not bad. 

Also run WTB's 2.55 tires with no clearance problems. Very happy with them, and the bike in general. rides very smooth, but the big tires help a good bit.


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## liam2051 (Apr 19, 2008)

Im also looking at buying one, are there any full reviews on these? its just that 600$$$ seems a little low for a great quality frame


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## Fastskiguy (Jan 15, 2004)

jthurd said:


> I run the ritcyey/trigon rigid fork (short axel-crown) on it, handles a little twitchey, but not bad.
> 
> Also run WTB's 2.55 tires with no clearance problems. Very happy with them, and the bike in general. rides very smooth, but the big tires help a good bit.


Is that about 415mm axle to crown?


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## jyeager (Nov 30, 2006)

I raced this frame all last season. I've got a nice lightweight build - almost weight-weenie. I run a SID Team fork on it (80mm) and it seems right. I don't think a 100mm would be too far off, might not climb quite as well as mine does now. I don't know what fork it was designed around but whether it's 80 or 100 you'd still be fine substituting the other one.
Ask the guys at Pedal Force and they'll tell you.

Oh, I should tell you that I weigh in at 200lbs and I'm a proud Clydesdale. I'm a pretty smooth rider, but I don't baby the frame when I'm riding fast. And if it breaks, I trust Pedal Force to make good on their warranty.


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## Fastskiguy (Jan 15, 2004)

jyeager said:


> I raced this frame all last season. I've got a nice lightweight build - almost weight-weenie. I run a SID Team fork on it (80mm) and it seems right. I don't think a 100mm would be too far off, might not climb quite as well as mine does now. I don't know what fork it was designed around but whether it's 80 or 100 you'd still be fine substituting the other one.
> Ask the guys at Pedal Force and they'll tell you.
> 
> Oh, I should tell you that I weigh in at 200lbs and I'm a proud Clydesdale. I'm a pretty smooth rider, but I don't baby the frame when I'm riding fast. And if it breaks, I trust Pedal Force to make good on their warranty.


Glad to hear the frame is holding up, I'm at 190# and pretty smooth too but I'm hoping to racing fast this summer. It sure is a purdy thing, I'm just luvin' it!


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