# Is it dangerous to ride an old school quill stem bike?



## RockyWA (Jan 23, 2006)

I know that the ahead-set is a vastly superior technological advancement in mountain bike stems.

Lately there are a lot of vintage mountain bikes around here for real cheap problem is they are all 1 inch with quill stems. It's been so long since I've ridden one with a quill stem. Is it a bad idea?

My question to you is: Are they dangerous? Does anyone recommend NOT riding a bike with a quill stem? I'm just so hesitant. Let me know what you think.

Thanks


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

No problemo.


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## crconsulting (Apr 11, 2004)

They come with THE standard of the industry warranty:

If it breaks, you get both pieces!


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Unless you ride harder than Tomac did back in the day, you should be ok.


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

*Wow....*

No disrespect, but that's the most ridiculous thing I've heard in a long time!



RockyWA said:


> I know that the ahead-set is a vastly superior technological advancement in mountain bike stems.


Vastly superior  
I'd have a hard time calling them superior in any way.

Quill stems are great. I can't remember the last time I rode a MTB with a threadless stem.
No durability issues what-so-ever. Quill technology is tried and true.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Pretty much all of use here ride quill stems. Have no fear, they work as good as any threadless set up.


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## patineto (Oct 28, 2005)

Are you Joking....!?!?!

Quill stems are as strong as any ahedset system.

If anything, if you need a worry free super long lasting set up (like on a heavy duty ultra loaded touring bike) the old school type treaded headset and stem still the best.


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## XR4TI (Sep 6, 2005)

patineto said:


> Are you Joking....!?!?!


 That's what I was thinking


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## surly357 (Jan 19, 2006)

*wayback stems...*

heck, there are folks on this forum running 60 year old quill stems on their klunkers!


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## YETIFIED (May 4, 2005)

surly357 said:


> heck, there are folks on this forum running 60 year old quill stems on their klunkers!


Heck, there are 60 year old folks running 60 year old quill stems on their klunkers!


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## TRIPLE R (Jan 17, 2008)

One bike I had was so rusted (not titanic rusted,more like 1960's rusted)the bars,stem and forks are now a one piece unit never to be seperated,the stem is as solid as a rock


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Shayne said:


> Vastly superior
> I'd have a hard time calling them superior in any way.


They can be lighter by a few grams. And easier to adjust mid-ride. I'm sure that either couts as "vast."


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## RockyWA (Jan 23, 2006)

*Yay*

Right on guys- thanks for the advice.

I am just a guy that has been riding for 20 years but I'm not a bike expert by any means- so you guys are more knowledgeable than I am for sure so I appreciate your input.

I just remember since the introduction of the threadless design, most of my friends always thought the threadless design was so much safer, better and the quill system was in their mind inferior, kind of a technologically retarted idea and it was a big "whew- thank god that pile is gone" vibe ever since the threadless design became popular. I guess that perception kind of rubbed off on me.

Basically I'm looking for the most trouble free setup I can get my hands on. If indeed quill is more reliable, long lasting and bulletproof than that is what i will ride.

Again I appreciate all your input. Thank you


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## pinguwin (Aug 20, 2004)

Just today, I replaced a threadless setup with a quill. Pics in a few weeks when I finish the build.


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## PCC (Sep 5, 2005)

The Aheadset system came out to solve two problems: to make it easier for the bicycle shop mechanic to assemble the bike (making it idiot-proof) and to save some weight. When I say "save some weight" I don't mean compared to the high-end quill stems available when the threadless system came out but the low-end systems that weighed a ton. The threadless systems weighed about the same as a high-end system but far less than a low-end system.

It also helps the bicycling industry 'move inventory' when they come out with a seemlingly revolutionary new way of doing things to fix something that wasn't broke in the first place.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

RockyWA said:


> Basically I'm looking for the most trouble free setup I can get my hands on. If indeed quill is more reliable, long lasting and bulletproof than that is what i will ride.


Both are 100% safe.

A threadless setup is easier to adjust if your headset becomes lose mid-ride.

A quill stem is easier to adjust bar height mid-ride.

Otherwise there is no real difference. And yes, a threadless set up saves bike manufacutures and bike shops money. Assuming this savings gets passed to the consumer, it does cut down on the costs of bikes in the end.


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## disease (Nov 27, 2007)

Quill stems are great.

Threadless stems were invented to allow suspension fork manufacturers to sell forks with only one steerer length. The shop mechanic or bicycle assembler simply had to cut the steerer to the right lenght, and not worry about threading the steerer.

Remember that "back in the day" when quill stems ruled, almost all forks were rigid. There were no suspension forks to ease the shock and stress transmitted to the stem and the bearings. Despite this, quill stems held up very well. I don't remember hearing horror stories of quill stems fracturing under this punishing abuse.

This thread has inspired me to put my old silver Syncros stem onto one of my bikes. Nothing said 'cool' like a big shiny Syncros cattleprod QUILL stem on the front of your rig.


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## cdeger (Jan 18, 2004)

*Quill vs. A-head*

It's not the (quill) stem that is dangerous - but the fork (steerer).

No problem, as long as the steerer's made of steel and its wall thickness is wisely choosen.

Real problem as soon as aluminum is used for the steerer. "notch effect" is the technical term.


2ctfromgermany


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## ssmike (Jan 21, 2004)

Actually...if there is one aspect of the threadless headset that has proven to be (and I hesitate to use this word, but can't find a better word at the time) better than a threaded headset is their longevity as an OEM product. It is much easier to properly adjust a threadless headset than a threaded headset. However, if you are a competent mechanic, that's a moot point. 

Hack mechanics can all too easily over or under tighten a threaded headset that results in brinnelling of the races. Threadless aheadsets with the cone shaped bearing load system make it less easy to overtighten a headset.


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## datawhacker (Dec 23, 2004)

I have always thought that it was mildly interesting that the stem manufacturers didn't get the memo saying that 1 1/8" forks were going threadless. There are a bazillion 1 1/8" quill stems around and maybe around 10 or so 1 1/8" threaded forks.


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## notrelatedtoted (Mar 3, 2005)

Next up: why the new ISIS bottom brackets are vastly superior to those crappy old square tapers...


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

ssmike said:


> Actually...if there is one aspect of the threadless headset that has proven to be (and I hesitate to use this word, but can't find a better word at the time) better than a threaded headset is their longevity as an OEM product. It is much easier to properly adjust a threadless headset than a threaded headset. However, if you are a competent mechanic, that's a moot point.
> 
> Hack mechanics can all too easily over or under tighten a threaded headset that results in brinnelling of the races. Threadless aheadsets with the cone shaped bearing load system make it less easy to overtighten a headset.


I think a big percentage of the brinelling of the races was due to riding around with a loose headset. That was another huge problem, it seemed like half of the threaded headsets in that came into the shop I worked at were loose. Adjusting them was a bit of an art that is no longer needed.

From a design standpoint, I prefer threadless. It initially was released as a way to save weight. The name of the headset design was originally called "Light Set" until Dia Compe bought the design and called it A-head. Its now easily adjusted properly (not with your hand as you hit a straightaway on the singletrack ) on the trail with a simple allen wrench. Also, there is no more threading forks which was always kind of a pain and didnt turn out so good sometimes. The removable face plates that came along with threadless was another huge bonus. SUddenly the time required to swap out a stem was decreased 10 fold.

But yeah, a quill stem is certainly a safe stem.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> The removable face plates that came along with threadless was another huge bonus. SUddenly the time required to swap out a stem was decreased 10 fold.


I agree that removable faceplates are a HUGE plus - especially on road bikes. However, it's a completely seperate change from threadless stems. Removable face plates became popular at about the same time as the threadless headset, but there were removable face plates on quill stems prior to and after threadless headsets were introduced.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> I agree that removable faceplates are a HUGE plus - especially on road bikes. However, it's a completely seperate change from threadless stems. Removable face plates became popular at about the same time as the threadless headset, but there were removable face plates on quill stems prior to and after threadless headsets were introduced.


i had 2 control tech stems, quilled and w/removable face plates.

though i can swap older stems very quick.. provided i have a syringe w/ alcohol or a high pressure pump.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> I think a big percentage of the brinelling of the races was due to riding around with a loose headset. That was another huge problem, it seemed like half of the threaded headsets in that came into the shop I worked at were loose. Adjusting them was a bit of an art that is no longer needed.
> 
> From a design standpoint, I prefer threadless. It initially was released as a way to save weight. The name of the headset design was originally called "Light Set" until Dia Compe bought the design and called it A-head. Its now easily adjusted properly (not with your hand as you hit a straightaway on the singletrack ) on the trail with a simple allen wrench. Also, there is no more threading forks which was always kind of a pain and didnt turn out so good sometimes. The removable face plates that came along with threadless was another huge bonus. SUddenly the time required to swap out a stem was decreased 10 fold.
> 
> But yeah, a quill stem is certainly a safe stem.


i heard that 1 1/8 headsets like to loosen up while 1in stay put easily. i always thought that oversized steerers gained more from aheadsets than 1in..


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> I agree that removable faceplates are a HUGE plus - especially on road bikes. However, it's a completely seperate change from threadless stems. Removable face plates became popular at about the same time as the threadless headset, but there were removable face plates on quill stems prior to and after threadless headsets were introduced.


Not true. It's pretty much an impossible feat to put a removable face plate on a quill stem.

 just jokin' of course.

Charlie Cunningham had a removable face plate on his stems back in 1980. Why none (99% anyway) of the quill stems had this feature is somewhat of a mystery.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

colker1 said:


> i heard that 1 1/8 headsets like to loosen up while 1in stay put easily. i always thought that oversized steerers gained more from aheadsets than 1in..


nah, that doesnt make any sense to me, nor did I ever see that take place in the real world. 1" loosened up real quickly if it wasnt adjusted properly.


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## azjeff (Jun 3, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> A threadless setup is easier to adjust if your headset becomes lose mid-ride.


How true. I never rode with anyone who carried headset wrenches



laffeaux said:


> A quill stem is easier to adjust bar height mid-ride.


 With cantis you'll probably have to adjust the brake cable length too.


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## pinguwin (Aug 20, 2004)

azjeff said:


> I never rode with anyone who carried headset wrenches


I used to ride with someone who carried headset wrenches (and used them on the trail once). The other day, I had to borrow a headset wrench and the wrench was one designed to be carried with you.

Another time, we were doing a late night ride (from 10 p.m. to about 3 a.m.). Several of the riders were mechanics. About 1 a.m. (on the Greenway for your Minneapolis folks) we saw someone who had a pedal fall off. We stopped to help the guy and a mechanic pulled out a pedal wrench and put it back on. He also touched up a few other problems on the guys bike. He looked on in wonderment, "1 a.m. and you come by with a pedal wrench."

'Guin


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

pinguwin said:


> I used to ride with someone who carried headset wrenches (and used them on the trail once). The other day, I had to borrow a headset wrench and the wrench was one designed to be carried with you.
> 
> Another time, we were doing a late night ride (from 10 p.m. to about 3 a.m.). Several of the riders were mechanics. About 1 a.m. (on the Greenway for your Minneapolis folks) we saw someone who had a pedal fall off. We stopped to help the guy and a mechanic pulled out a pedal wrench and put it back on. He also touched up a few other problems on the guys bike. He looked on in wonderment, "1 a.m. and you come by with a pedal wrench."
> 
> 'Guin


"that will be a $100... "


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

pinguwin said:


> I used to ride with someone who carried headset wrenches (and used them on the trail once). The other day, I had to borrow a headset wrench and the wrench was one designed to be carried with you.
> 
> Another time, we were doing a late night ride (from 10 p.m. to about 3 a.m.). Several of the riders were mechanics. About 1 a.m. (on the Greenway for your Minneapolis folks) we saw someone who had a pedal fall off. We stopped to help the guy and a mechanic pulled out a pedal wrench and put it back on. He also touched up a few other problems on the guys bike. He looked on in wonderment, "1 a.m. and you come by with a pedal wrench."
> 
> 'Guin


why carry a pedal wrench when you can carry an allen wrench to do the job. Or maybe some people like carrying a backpack full of steel.


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## ssmike (Jan 21, 2004)

azjeff said:


> With cantis you'll probably have to adjust the brake cable length too.


Only if the cable stop is on the stem. Lots of cable stops were also spacers in the headset.


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## AKamp (Jan 26, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> why carry a pedal wrench when you can carry an allen wrench to do the job. Or maybe some people like carrying a backpack full of steel.


Some pedals don't take allens and some cranks don't have holes. Didn't origional Cool-Tools used to have headset wrench adaptors?? The other day I was going through my pack and found a UB-71BB and the hunk of steel of a wrench to put it in. I also found links for about 6 or 7 different chains of which maybe one would fit any of my bikes right now. Amazing how that crap fill up a pack, I probably lost 5 pounds just by dumping all that crap.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

pinguwin said:


> I used to ride with someone who carried headset wrenches (and used them on the trail once). ... We stopped to help the guy and a mechanic pulled out a pedal wrench and put it back on.


The park tool pedal wrench as a 1" headset wrench on the other side. So if you have one, you've got the other. 

I can't say that I've ever ridden with my headset wrench. But I have needed one on a ride more than once.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

AKamp said:


> Some pedals don't take allens and some cranks don't have holes. Didn't origional Cool-Tools used to have headset wrench adaptors??


Are there people still brave enough to ride those Topline cranks with the enclosed pedal threads?  Which pedals don't take allens? I know Ive seen a couple, but I dont recall what they were. Speedplay?

I believe somebody made a headset piece that fit in CoolTool's crescent wrench.


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## Bertleman (Feb 10, 2004)

maybe you should ask this guy


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## stan4bikes (May 24, 2006)

owwwww! and look at the chain, although that's the least of his worries!


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## YETIFIED (May 4, 2005)

It actually looks like the steerer snapped along with the headtube, because the headset with cup is still on the quill. Check out the compression on the front tire.


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## TRIPLE R (Jan 17, 2008)

I can think of something else thats going to compress too,I can almost feel the pain


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## TRIPLE R (Jan 17, 2008)

push those legs and superman it and you'le be fine.........lol


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## jacdykema (Apr 10, 2006)

I don't know. Maybe it was my setup or sub-par mechanic skills (although I worked in a shop at the time) but I always had problems with quill stems. It seemed like I could never get them tight enough to not slip in the steerer tube. Even when I would get out the super long allen wrenches and use a seat post over the wrench for extra torque the stem would always slip. It was a decent setup too. Ritchey 1" headset and stem. 

As soon as I switched to a Chris King No-threadset and Control Tech ahead stem all my problems went away. Like I said, maybe its just me.


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## TRIPLE R (Jan 17, 2008)

I had a prob once wid a kids bike,tightend it up till I bent my good allen,took it apart rought sanded down steerer tube and stem binder,hay presto it worked ,no slip


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