# Food and drink for Long Distance Rides



## Norsk (Sep 22, 2015)

Good day all,

My dad and I are going to be doing the Tuscobia 80 Mile race in January, I tried the 150 last year but had to drop out because of some bike issues. Well last year was my first race and did not know what to do for food. I mixed some trail mix (nuts, raisins, craisins, M&Ms, etc.) I also brought some Clifbars. Now the trail mix was taste but didnt help out to much. I did fee better after the clifbars. I am not to godwit nutrition so I am wondering what do you guys (and gals  ) eat while you are on loooong distance rides? I have read that carbs are good and calories are okay. I just get overwhelmed when reading about the nutrition because it seem that one site says one thing I good and the next site says that it is bad. Then there is the drinking side. I know you need electrolites, but how do you get them? I reeeeally like Gatorade but it gets spendy and what do you do with the bottle out on the trail? Well you can leave it so you have to pack it back. I have seen some people say you just need salt and water. The last time I had salt and water was in California after I fell off a surfboard. Yes, I know, "DONT PUT THAT MUCH SALT IN, DUH!" Well then how much DO you put in. I also don't like the taste of water (or lack there of), is there something you can put in the water to make it taste better? I am trying to stay away from not so healthy additives (Gatorade mix and what not), I know I just said I reeeeally like Gatorade. Now you can see my issue, I really have no idea what I am doing.  I like the taste of cucumber and dill water and that is good for you, can I just add some salt and sugar to that? If you don't mind helping me out it would be appreciated. Thank you all and have a great day. Takk


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

I have been able to give up on solid food for rides up to 12 hrs.

I have been using Tailwind Nutrition since earlier this year.

https://www.tailwindnutrition.com/

Your body can only process 200-300 calories an hour....putting in anymore than that is just overtaxing the system.

Tailwind contains everything you need in liquid form....each scoop being 100 calories....put in 2-3 scoops into a 24oz bottle and drink one bottle per hour. Easy on the GI system.

It works for me....but we are all different.

Then again, you are running out of time to try new stuff.....this is the kind of info you should have been asking months ago.


----------



## milliesand (Jun 29, 2015)

In 6 months of riding haven't been strong enough yet to finish 80+ miles but getting closer. 

Before even climbing on the saddle a Banana and or oatmeal. 

On 3+ hour rides 2-3 fruit bars (I get mine from Sprouts) PB&J sandwich and orange slices to break up the grunge mouth. 

Water only in a backpack, and Ultima in the bottle are my drink choices.


----------



## Big Virgil (Dec 8, 2008)

I eat pretty healthy/low carb most of the time, so I bonk pretty quick on rides. for rides, I carb-load the day before. For a really long ride like that, I would load for at least two days, if not 3. 

Low protein/fat and a lot of complex carbs. Burritos w black beans and rice, Bagel w almond butter and honey for breakfast. Oatmeal/raisin cookies, cliff bars and lots of gatorade for snacks.

For the ride, cliff bars, fig bars from sprouts, and some salty snacks for electrolite replacement. That's what I do.


----------



## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

On what planet is low carb healthy?

-----------------------------------------------------------
-=snifff!!=- What's that you say?


----------



## Big Virgil (Dec 8, 2008)

My carbs are mostly complex carbs, not simple carbs unless I'm biking. It is healthy, Oatmeal, sweet potato's, quinoa, fruits, veggies, etc.

It's not no-carb or Atkins or anything but, imho, better than frozen waffles, fruit loops, Starbucks and Burger King.


----------



## Grok (Sep 4, 2015)

Low carb and no carbs is very healthy....it's what we have been doing for 2 million years before the agricultural revolution about 10k years ago. It takes time to get adapted but once you are there is no such thing as bonking or even loading up on anything before any ride.

Please don't t my word for it, read up what's out there in the last decade or so. Also look into why the Netherlands have changed to that as their national diet. There is no special food to buy, and the info is all free if you take the time. I personally am now 2 years on a slightly modified ketogenic diet that I truly thrive on.

That said, it would not work for the person who started this thread since you are not adapted (takes about 3 weeks). You should still stay away as much as possible from sugars and simple carbs.


----------



## aussiebullet (Nov 24, 2006)

This is coming from someone who wrote they only do rides up to 2.5hrs
3 - 4 days p/wk otherwise they get too tired... I used to too coming from a gym junkie strength based back round and following a similar keto diet to yours and it worked well, but not so much for the high volume endurance training I'm doing now. I was more of a slug and had more bad days than good on that diet.

Fast Farward to now on a high carb diet and I now run at 11 compared to running like a slug most days on the keto diet unless I slowed down or took extra rest days even though I was already on the keto type diet for over a decade. Performance and health are much better and I thrive on this type of diet but didn't on a keto.

High carb mostly plant based diet is by far the healthiest & works extremely well for high volume athletes including me, 15 - 25hrs p/wk and 3hr - 6hr training rides and all blood & physicals are the best they have ever been even though they were not too bad back then. 
For lower volume athletes both should work well so long as there's plenty of vegies etc in the diet.

YMMV


----------



## MegaMustang (Sep 12, 2009)

mtnbikej said:


> I have been able to give up on solid food for rides up to 12 hrs.
> 
> I have been using Tailwind Nutrition since earlier this year.
> 
> ...


This ^^^

I'm another Tailwind loyalist.

I eat a big bowl of REAL oatmeal (with maple syrup) about 2 hrs before a XC race, but closer for the long endurance events. Then it's over to Tailwind in the CamelBak. In the 2L (70 oz) bladder, I put in 6 scoops, and this results in about the same ratio that mtnbikej described above. It really does have all the calories and salt you need. Generally, I consume a tiny bit less than the 70 oz in three hours (again, this is very close to mtnbikej's bottle/hr ratio)... when very hot, I'll still get well over two hours of it.

For the events over 4 hrs, I do supplement the Tailwind with aid station food after 4 hours or so... and I'm like a wild dog when I hit those later ones (8+ hours in)! I usually going for the "solid food" options. It may sound odd, but hot dogs, ham sandwiches, PB&Js, etc. all sit in my tummy just fine. I think a little protein at this point may be helpful for my body chemistry too. I grab, throw down, and go... no dilly-dallying!

If you have the option of drop bags, put a few Tailwind stick packs (200 cal) in your drop bags. Otherwise, carry them with you -- one for each more hour. I often have 3-4 in the pocket of my CamelBak. Pour in, fill with water, don't forget to shake..... and don't forget to put your CamelBak back on! I've forgotten this last step twice!

I do carry a Cliff bar in my jersey as a bail out option, but very rarely have to go to it.

Most importantly, PRACTICE this! Actually, more than practice, make it part of your cycling routine. Train with what you will race with. Race with what you trained with.

Enjoy!
_Matt


----------



## Grok (Sep 4, 2015)

aussiebullet said:


> This is coming from someone who wrote they only do rides up to 2.5hrs
> 3 - 4 days p/wk otherwise they get too tired... I used to too coming from a gym junkie strength based back round and following a similar keto diet to yours and it worked well, but not so much for the high volume endurance training I'm doing now. I was more of a slug and had more bad days than good on that diet.
> 
> Fast Farward to now on a high carb diet and I now run at 11 compared to running like a slug most days on the keto diet unless I slowed down or took extra rest days even though I was already on the keto type diet for over a decade. Performance and health are much better and I thrive on this type of diet but didn't on a keto.
> ...


I don't think you quite got what I meant about my exercise routines. It's not the ride I am tired from, it's doing it so many times a week. From an evolutionary point, our bodies are not naturally built for long endurance on a regular basis (Very high cardio daily). When we do it we pay a price, more so as we age. Regardless, I would love to try one of those long distance races, I haven't ever seen something like that here in Montreal.

Elite athletes such as yourself are not the norm, you can pretty much get away with any diet while being very active. There are some interesting new studies on how high endurance secretes to much cortisol and the inflammation associated with it.

From what you describe it seems like you never fully adapted to keto. It's normal to go through the keto flu at induction, but to last as long as you describe most probably means something in your diet was stopping you from adapting to ketones. I say this because one of the best effects of keto is the new and much improved energy levels which you didn't seem to benefit from. The energy levels, sleep patterns and improved mind clarity attributed to the diet are more impressive than any weight loss that naturally follows.

And a steak in butter with a few eggs on it kicks the ass of any veggie....although I do love veggies.

From what you describe you must eat an enormous amount of veggies. I recently started reading some interesting articles on gut biology and probiotics etc.. (see fecal transplants...i'm serious). Some of it makes so much sense and what they are discovering is that the most efficient and natural way to ensure proper gut health is through eating a variety of certain types of veggies.


----------



## aussiebullet (Nov 24, 2006)

I'll be sure to let Chris Froome & Richie Port know to skip breakfast and the feed stop and just have a feed of Steak in butter and a few eggs on it after each stage of the 2016 TDF....... LMFAO!!!


----------



## Norsk (Sep 22, 2015)

Thank you all for helping, now that the race is done (unfortunately a DNF) not because of food and water but just because of tiredness and exhaustion. My dad and I both had some kind of a knee problem too. Thank you mtnbikej and megamustang for you suggestion on using Tailwind, I will certainly check into this stuff it sounds great. As for the rest of the suggestions  They are all great I will check into everyone of them. Thank you all for your help. Have a great day. Takk


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

That's a bummer. As far as knowing your own body and performance, do you feel like you might have survived longer with better food and hydration? You might not have been so tired and exhausted?
I'm curious as an aspiring endurance racer.
What kind of nutrition plan did you guys work for this event?


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

Chippertheripper said:


> That's a bummer. As far as knowing your own body and performance, do you feel like you might have survived longer with better food and hydration? You might not have been so tired and exhausted?
> I'm curious as an aspiring endurance racer.
> What kind of nutrition plan did you guys work for this event?


You have to plan/experiment/test all different kinds of things well before your events. Do some longer training rides and see how different items work for "you". Everybody is different, and everybody does it differently.

Personally, I get a lot of saddle time(3-5hr rides) during the week, and usually a very long(7-11 hrs) ride on one of the weekend days. I experimented with different nutritional drinks/gels/bars/real food/fruit....etc. Many things didn't work for me right away during testing. Some things worked for a little while, but eventually I decided it did work well enough.

Figure out what works, then figure out how much you need.

Here are a few good resources that worked for me:

Why Tailwind

Mountain Bike Radio - 100 Miler Race Nutrition


----------



## Norsk (Sep 22, 2015)

Good day all, Chippertheripper, we did not really have a plan but I know usually when I ride I need to eat half a Cliffbar every half hour to keep my energy up. After about 6-8 hours I added in some beef jerky. I found out I did not drink nearly enough water between the start of the race and the first check point (35miles in). I planned on drinking my 2.5liter bladder and close to one thermos (warm apple cider) When we got to the check point I had over half of my bladder yet and about a quarter of my thermos left. I know you are supposed to drink lots of fluids while biking, it gets hard to when you are wearing a face mask and you have to stop to take it off and drink. We had some tasty soup at the check point while warming up by the suuuuper nice fire.  I don't know if I would have done better or worse with different food. I know last year really stunk because I tried to live off of some trail mix and I was tired the whole ride. That is why I switched to cliffbars and that really helped. I think that answers your question. Once the sun went down and it got colder and I just wanted to be done because I was tired and sore (as was my dad), my dad was taking asprin to help with his knees and maybe that had to do with it alittle bit. We were just exhausted. Anyhow that you for you help and ideas Chippertheripper.

mtnbikej Assuming  you read the top part I did some experimenting with what works but I guess I have not found the right stuff yet.  I will read the links you sent me and while I do my rides I will figure out what works more or less than before. Thank you for your help and suggestions as well. 

Have a great day all. Takk


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

Norsk said:


> Good day all, Chippertheripper, we did not really have a plan but I know usually when I ride I need to eat half a Cliffbar every half hour to keep my energy up. After about 6-8 hours I added in some beef jerky. I found out I did not drink nearly enough water between the start of the race and the first check point (35miles in). I planned on drinking my 2.5liter bladder and close to one thermos (warm apple cider) When we got to the check point I had over half of my bladder yet and about a quarter of my thermos left. I know you are supposed to drink lots of fluids while biking, it gets hard to when you are wearing a face mask and you have to stop to take it off and drink. We had some tasty soup at the check point while warming up by the suuuuper nice fire.  I don't know if I would have done better or worse with different food. I know last year really stunk because I tried to live off of some trail mix and I was tired the whole ride. That is why I switched to cliffbars and that really helped. I think that answers your question. Once the sun went down and it got colder and I just wanted to be done because I was tired and sore (as was my dad), my dad was taking asprin to help with his knees and maybe that had to do with it alittle bit. We were just exhausted. Anyhow that you for you help and ideas Chippertheripper.
> 
> mtnbikej Assuming  you read the top part I did some experimenting with what works but I guess I have not found the right stuff yet.  I will read the links you sent me and while I do my rides I will figure out what works more or less than before. Thank you for your help and suggestions as well.
> 
> Have a great day all. Takk


My response was for Chipper.

However, now that you broke down your ride food.....it kinda makes sense. Clifbars and Beef Jerky are very hard to digest....takes much more energy to do so. So some of those calories that you were putting in, were actually being used to digest those things. Items such as gels and blocks are much easier digested and absorbed quicker.

Fluid intake is different for everyone....to me in the cold, 2.5 liters sounds like a lot of water, especially for 35 miles.

Listen to the podcast from Apex Nutrition that I posted above...she does a great job explaining all of this.

It's great you gave it your all and went for it....just goes to show that you have to plan these things out much farther in advance than 4 weeks....it is just the way the cookie crumbles sometimes.


----------



## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

I'm more of a fan of real food. Water and whatever electrolyte you need. What about a banana, pre peeled orange slices and the like? I also like peanut butter, banana and honey on whole wheat bread. Everyone needs something that agrees with them. Gels, not for me. Dried figs or apricots, I like.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

mtnbikej said:


> You have to plan/experiment/test all different kinds of things well before your events. Do some longer training rides and see how different items work for "you". Everybody is different, and everybody does it differently.
> 
> Personally, I get a lot of saddle time(3-5hr rides) during the week, and usually a very long(7-11 hrs) ride on one of the weekend days. I experimented with different nutritional drinks/gels/bars/real food/fruit....etc. Many things didn't work for me right away during testing. Some things worked for a little while, but eventually I decided it did work well enough.
> 
> ...


There's always a lot of: do what works for you. 
Without months of trial and error, it's tough. I know I'm good for s bottle every 10miles-ish. Gu is fine in my stomach, and a sammich isn't the easiest thing to eat under race conditions. 
But if that's what the whole field is doing, it's not that big of a deal to stop for a bite. 
Do you have a time frame that you use as a basis for your longer efforts?


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

Chippertheripper said:


> There's always a lot of: do what works for you.
> Without months of trial and error, it's tough. I know I'm good for s bottle every 10miles-ish. Gu is fine in my stomach, and a sammich isn't the easiest thing to eat under race conditions.
> But if that's what the whole field is doing, it's not that big of a deal to stop for a bite.
> Do you have a time frame that you use as a basis for your longer efforts?


That's why I do the Tailwind....I get everything I need in a bottle. Don't need to stop or slow for gels/sandwiches, etc. I have done that in the past, but what I am doing now just works better.

My long rides on the weekend I generally have an idea of how they will take....they are usually a mix n match of trails...I can usually figure out how long they will all take, where I need to refill water, etc.


----------



## MegaMustang (Sep 12, 2009)

Chippertheripper said:


> There's always a lot of: do what works for you.
> Without months of trial and error, it's tough. I know I'm good for s bottle every 10miles-ish. Gu is fine in my stomach, and a sammich isn't the easiest thing to eat under race conditions.
> But if that's what the whole field is doing, it's not that big of a deal to stop for a bite.
> Do you have a time frame that you use as a basis for your longer efforts?


I recommend basing your hydration/nutrition needs on time, not distance. Certainly, there are then some minor adjustments for temp or exertion level, but whether training or racing, I plan to "drink on the 10s" -- meaning, that I take two long draws off my CamelBak, or from a bottle (depends on event), every 10 minutes, as I can view the chrono on my Garmin mounted on the handlebars. This makes me drink between 22 and 24 ounces per hour. I generally figure my 70 oz CamelBak is good for 3 hours.
Hope this helps.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

That's easy. I used 10miles as a generalization. I don't have much problem with hydration, it's going to be running out of steam after a while. I have some tailwind showing up today, so I'll be able to test it on a good rip tomorrow. 
It's the eating thing that's got me stumped. I have a timer set on my GPS for 45min for a gu, I just need to re-engineer my approach for a 50mile race this year.


----------



## LaneDetroitCity (Nov 10, 2015)

Chippertheripper said:


> That's easy. I used 10miles as a generalization. I don't have much problem with hydration, it's going to be running out of steam after a while. I have some tailwind showing up today, so I'll be able to test it on a good rip tomorrow.
> It's the eating thing that's got me stumped. I have a timer set on my GPS for 45min for a gu, I just need to re-engineer my approach for a 50mile race this year.


Chip!!! Glad to see you getting serious. What race?

Go to the store and get a travel dish soap bottle and fill with real maple syrup, coffee grounds and real honey. Take a pull every hour after the first one. If you can handle the taste you'll be flying. Take in comfort food at pit stops. Whatever that is to you. The favorite sandwhich the wife makes etc. For me it's a huge baked sweet potato and a banana sandwich with almond butter. That's what I'll be using as my go to for NUE. It's easy to overeat also. I have done things like odwalla juice protein things in my bottles and those work too. Like on a 3hr ride I'll drink water and at 1.5 I'll chug the naked,bolthouse,odwalla etc pre made beet juice or a protein one if it's a harder ride.

Sent from my 831C using Tapatalk


----------



## bikeeverywhereny (Oct 14, 2014)

Hello all,

Wanted to share my new book "Bike Camp Cookbook" with you all. It derived from a cross country bicycle tour from New York to California in 2014. I prepared meals outside that were healthy, quick and easy to make. All the meals were prepared from my SnowPeak solo camp stove and the food at markets and gas stations.

Take a look inside the book and and buy. I believe my book is the answer to many people who camp and/or bike tour who worry about food and other meals to prepare while out on extended or even short weekend adventure. It's also a book you can adapt to your own style of cooking and perhaps change your perspective overall.

In addition to the food I have 4 stories from the road of my favorite places I've traveled through in the U.S. These locations include Kansas, Colorado, Nevada and Virginia. I'm really psyched on the images because they really take me back to when I was on this trip. I'm pumped for this and hope it can be of help to many of you who are planing a trip or looking at getting creative at the camp site.

Lastly please leave an honest review.

Link to Book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01JGKVKUS#navbar

Thanks,

Dwayne


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

LaneDetroitCity said:


> Chip!!! Glad to see you getting serious. What race?
> 
> Go to the store and get a travel dish soap bottle and fill with real maple syrup, coffee grounds and real honey. Take a pull every hour after the first one. If you can handle the taste you'll be flying. Take in comfort food at pit stops. Whatever that is to you. The favorite sandwhich the wife makes etc. For me it's a huge baked sweet potato and a banana sandwich with almond butter. That's what I'll be using as my go to for NUE. It's easy to overeat also. I have done things like odwalla juice protein things in my bottles and those work too. Like on a 3hr ride I'll drink water and at 1.5 I'll chug the naked,bolthouse,odwalla etc pre made beet juice or a protein one if it's a harder ride.
> 
> Sent from my 831C using Tapatalk


Hah, just saw this now. 
I'm gonna give the freetown50 a go. It's not incredibly long (6hrs), but it's pretty brutal. 
I've been out circumventing the course plenty, but my nutrition plan is really what's lacking. 
Under a faster pace it's a 4 bottle lap. I've been using tailwind, which is working well, but it's not gonna be enough for 6hrs. I have a month until the race, so I'm gonna strap on the feed bag and have a go at actually eating some stuff in the right spots now that I know the course.


----------



## bikeeverywhereny (Oct 14, 2014)

Hey OP and everyone else. I have an eBook titled "Bike Camp Gourmet" which I share recipes I prepared while on a cross country tour. It also includes stories from the road from four of my favorite locations I rode through. Its free for download till 08/19 Here is a link to the book... Also leave a feedback on it. I'd greatly appreciate it.

Bike Camp Cookbook: https://www.amazon.com/Bike-Camp-Co...1471348675&sr=8-1&keywords=bike+camp+cookbook


----------



## TomP (Jan 12, 2004)

Chippertheripper said:


> ... my nutrition plan is really what's lacking.
> Under a faster pace it's a 4 bottle lap. I've been using tailwind, which is working well, but it's not gonna be enough for 6hrs...


I've used Tailwind, and nothing but Tailwind, for several 20+ hour efforts. If it's working, it'll keep working another two hours.

Do what you want, but I think you're mistaken about the capability of fueling the whole event with TW.


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

TomP said:


> I've used Tailwind, and nothing but Tailwind, for several 20+ hour efforts. If it's working, it'll keep working another two hours.
> 
> Do what you want, but I think you're mistaken about the capability of fueling the whole event with TW.


^^^^^This^^^^^

I have done several rides upwards of 12hrs on nothing but TW....it works. If it is not working, then perhaps you are running it too light, or not getting the recomended hourly dose.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

mtnbikej said:


> ^^^^^This^^^^^
> 
> I have done several rides upwards of 12hrs on nothing but TW....it works. If it is not working, then perhaps you are running it too light, or not getting the recomended hourly dose.


I generally use 2 scoops per bottle.

More, ya think??


----------



## TomP (Jan 12, 2004)

Chippertheripper said:


> I generally use 2 scoops per bottle.
> 
> More, ya think??


I use a larger sized bottle ~24 oz and mix three scoops in each. I always have plain water with me in case I start feeling dehydrated, but I never do. I try to drain that bottle in between 1:15 and ~2 (longer if I'm loafin'). Usually it's about 90 minutes/bottle. Which is right around 200 calories/hour.

I'd say experiment boosting the mix a little at a time. Don't go over more than about 3 heapers for a larger bottle. Smaller bottle, no more than 3 level. But that's about the concentration I go for.

For reference, I am 6'1", 200 lbs (god I hope so anyway, damn beer) and my summer riding is usually pretty temperate, 90 or less and dry-ish. If it's super hot/humid where you are, be more careful with strong mixes. But yes, I'd recommend stronger than 2/bottle.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

Thx. I'll certainly give it a whirl.
It HAS been pretty hot and humid, but race day is a month away, so I'm hoping it's a little more temperate.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

3 scoops, no Bueno for race efforts. 
I still feel like crap after puking my guts out repeatedly today. 
Two seems to work better for me.

The puke is a combination of factors, I'm not blaming solely the tailwind here.


----------



## TomP (Jan 12, 2004)

Chippertheripper said:


> 3 scoops, no Bueno for race efforts.
> I still feel like crap after puking my guts out repeatedly today.
> Two seems to work better for me.
> 
> The puke is a combination of factors, I'm not blaming solely the tailwind here.


It's hard to know what's going to work for race efforts until you do it. Sorry to hear about the puking. Nobody likes puking.

But to be clear, you're puking still _after_ the race day? Any chance you got some food poisoning or something?

Hope you're doing better.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

TomP said:


> It's hard to know what's going to work for race efforts until you do it. Sorry to hear about the puking. Nobody likes puking.
> 
> But to be clear, you're puking still _after_ the race day? Any chance you got some food poisoning or something?
> 
> Hope you're doing better.


Actual race day hasn't come yet. I tried to go out and put down a solid effort. 
I'm gonna have to go back to 2 scoops and maybe some snacks. That, and cross my fingers it's not 90° that day.


----------



## shredchic (Jun 18, 2007)

mtnbikej said:


> I have done several rides upwards of 12hrs on nothing but TW....it works. If it is not working, then perhaps you are running it too light, or not getting the recomended hourly dose.





TomP said:


> I've used Tailwind, and nothing but Tailwind, for several 20+ hour efforts. If it's working, it'll keep working another two hours. ...


Hi Tailwind people!
I'm planning on doing my first long ride (not a race) with Tailwind. I know it's good to test things out prior to relying on them, and have experienced stomach churn bonkage and it's no fun. But I know that liquid nutrition works best for me. I have had success in long races/rides in the 80-100 mile range with making my own blended drinks ahead of time, (dates, lemon/lime, sea salt & water), and I can usually send replenishments to an aid station in a cooler. However this time there is no option to send stuff to an aid station. I'm going to experiment with Tailwind, as it will be light to carry and I can replenish water along the way. Problem is, all I have is a 3 liter reservoir and only room for a very small bottle (riding the big bike - can't use my hardtail with lots of bottle cage room for this ride).

Do you think the tailwind drink will be ok in the 3 liter pack? I'd hate to stop every hour to refill/mix up my tiny bottle.
It says it does not foul up your hydration pack on its website, but I'm always interested in the real experience. 
Do you ever find after a while it's too sweet?


----------



## TomP (Jan 12, 2004)

shredchic said:


> Hi Tailwind people!
> I'm planning on doing my first long ride (not a race) with Tailwind. I know it's good to test things out prior to relying on them, and have experienced stomach churn bonkage and it's no fun. But I know that liquid nutrition works best for me. I have had success in long races/rides in the 80-100 mile range with making my own blended drinks ahead of time, (dates, lemon/lime, sea salt & water), and I can usually send replenishments to an aid station in a cooler. However this time there is no option to send stuff to an aid station. I'm going to experiment with Tailwind, as it will be light to carry and I can replenish water along the way. Problem is, all I have is a 3 liter reservoir and only room for a very small bottle (riding the big bike - can't use my hardtail with lots of bottle cage room for this ride).
> 
> Do you think the tailwind drink will be ok in the 3 liter pack? I'd hate to stop every hour to refill/mix up my tiny bottle.
> ...


I've mixed TW in a hydration bladder. Only ones I have are 100 oz (3 liter). It mixes clear without any sediment.

The risk you take on when you do it that way is that it will start to not agree with you and you'll be stuck without plain water. It will be critical to get your mix right. Since you haven't used it before, that's a little troublesome. Higher risk that you won't get your mix right.

FWIW, my way of doing long rides/races (> 1 bottle needed) with TW is exactly what you are planning to not do. When I run one empty I mix a new bottle from the fresh water in my hydration bag. My bike fits a large (~24 oz) bottle. I go anywhere from 90 minutes (hard pace) to over 2 hours (recreation pace) on one 24 oz bottle. Then I stop and mix. You can bend slightly at the waste, hold your hydration hoze down and pinch the mouthpiece with your fingers and water will stream out. I stop, fill the bottle from my pack (30 seconds) put in mix, shake, go. Total ~1 minute. Don't need to take the pack off unless it's where you're storing your TW powder.

I do not find that anything about the taste bothers me. It has enough sodium to offset the sweetness.

People I know who've had trouble have had trouble because their mix was too strong. Mix up two scoops in ~20 oz and see what that tastes like. Set it aside. Mix your hydration bag. Compare taste. Make them same-same.


----------



## shredchic (Jun 18, 2007)

TomP said:


> I've mixed TW in a hydration bladder. Only ones I have are 100 oz (3 liter). It mixes clear without any sediment.
> 
> The risk you take on when you do it that way is that it will start to not agree with you and you'll be stuck without plain water. It will be critical to get your mix right. Since you haven't used it before, that's a little troublesome. Higher risk that you won't get your mix right.
> ...


Thanks for the quick reply TomP! Good idea - I will plan to just try refilling my small bottle in the beginning. (I wish I had room for a 24 oz bottle!) If I'm doing well on that mix ratio, then later on I can probably start putting it in my reservoir. I expect to ride for 9 - 10 hrs., so that many stops might be tedious - but sounds like it's not a big deal. I just have to remember it's not a race... haha.


----------



## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

TomP said:


> I've mixed TW in a hydration bladder. Only ones I have are 100 oz (3 liter). It mixes clear without any sediment.
> 
> The risk you take on when you do it that way is that it will start to not agree with you and you'll be stuck without plain water. It will be critical to get your mix right. Since you haven't used it before, that's a little troublesome. Higher risk that you won't get your mix right.
> 
> ...


On days where I cannot get water refills easily and have to take my pack.....I do the same thing. Mix my TW into a bottle. Water in the pack. When the bottle is empty, mix another bottle with water from the pack. This allows me from time to time to drink straight water. It really doesnt take that long to mix a bottle.

However most of my rides I have water stops planned out, so taking the pack is not necessary.

I also recomend taking something solid with you to eat....just in case. I found I carried the same Hammer gel and Clif bloks in my pocket for a couple weeks when I first started using TW....however, never needed them.

You will get a slight growl in your stomach...telling you that you are hungry. It is just your stomach looking for something solid to process. As long as you maintain your energy level and are not bonking....you are getting the calories that you need.


----------



## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

I seem to agree with 2 scoops/24oz. Do the math, mix that. 
I've found that a stronger mix messes me up. Ymmv and whatnot.


----------



## skidad (May 23, 2005)

*E-Fuel*

Alternative to TW is a product called e-Fuel from Crank Sports that I feel is superior. I've used them all and this has been the best so far with no stomach issues. You literally don't need food using this stuff for extended periods. Great info on their site comparing it to just about everything on the market.

e-Fuel Endurance Blend Electrolyte Hydration Drink


----------



## Choice Cut Nutrition (Nov 9, 2016)

Breaking it down.

Pro's on TW:

First thing I noticed when I visited the "why tailwind" page was that all the sources were referenced! That means the products were formulated based on SCIENCE. So right off the bat, I'm feeling good about it.
Next, liquid nutrition does digest way more quickly than solid foods. So yes, totally good. 
Lastly, it is very convenient to not have to plan out a bunch of foods. It is totally easy to just drink up the mix knowing that you are meeting your nutritional needs.

Cons:

Boring. Lol. Food is a pleasure! On an endurance ride, I want some options! Sure, you can make this stuff work for a looooong race, and maybe some of you fall back on this because solid foods don't sit well with you. I get that. Most people probably use TW and pack some additional snacks. That is both convenient, effective, and tasty.

I think a KEY point has been overlooked throughout this ENTIRE thread. That is the effectiveness of a proper carb load. 
Carb loading takes a WEEK! So 6 days of loading before race day. 
If you were to not eat on a long ride, the carbs stored in your body as glycogen would last you about 90 minutes at an intense pace. Carb loading can close to DOUBLE that. Of course you are going to continue eating along the way, but this will make your fuel last quite a bit longer.

If you want your carbohydrate needs for a carb load calculated out for you. You can get it for free here. www.coach/choicecutnutrition.com


----------



## MTBKNG (Dec 30, 2015)

skidad said:


> Alternative to TW is a product called e-Fuel from Crank Sports that I feel is superior. I've used them all and this has been the best so far with no stomach issues. You literally don't need food using this stuff for extended periods. Great info on their site comparing it to just about everything on the market.
> 
> e-Fuel Endurance Blend Electrolyte Hydration Drink


^^^^^

I will second this and I've tried them all...


----------



## Choice Cut Nutrition (Nov 9, 2016)

Interesting. I'm gonna nerd out on this a little. I actually haven't tried e-fuel or TW. So I'm responding to the science here. If it works for you, I can't argue with that.

Here we go.

e-fuel... on their overview page was talking about insulin/ blood sugar response to sugar based drinks. Suggesting that too much sugar will cause spikes and crashes in blood sugar. Well, actually exercise induces hormones that inhibit the activity of insulin. Thus preventing blood sugar crashes. Of course everybody responds differently, so this may be a problem for the occasional athlete. 
Another science issue is that the little bit of sugar that IS in these products are fructose. Fructose is used to prevent blood sugar spikes and insulin responses because fructose is metabolized in the liver. It doesn't immediately affect blood sugars. Because of this, fructose does not improve performance as well as glucose or sucrose. 

I like that e-fuel has some anti-oxidants in it. I also like that it has more total grams of carbs.

I mostly didn't like that they explained the science incorrectly.:madman: I'm almost offended by that. But hey, I'll give it a try.


----------



## MegaMustang (Sep 12, 2009)

Choice Cut Nutrition said:


> Interesting. I'm gonna nerd out on this a little. I actually haven't tried e-fuel or TW. So I'm responding to the science here. If it works for you, I can't argue with that.
> 
> Here we go.
> 
> ...


I believe you've made an error above with regard to Tailwind:









_Matt


----------



## Choice Cut Nutrition (Nov 9, 2016)

MegaMustang said:


> I believe you've made an error above with regard to Tailwind:


Yeah, it looks like I have. I was using the comparison tool on the e-fuel website. Thanks for pointing that out.


----------



## Norsk (Sep 22, 2015)

Hey everyone. I realize its been a while since I posted anything about this. I went and tried the Tailwind and I do believe we have a winner.  I ordered a couple of sticks to try first and they seemed to work so I ordered one small bag of the Berry flavor. I did my regular and hard rides to get the correct amount for me and it is dialed in at about 2 scoops (as directed) for my 24oz bottle. So my dad and I took a test ride (80mile fully loaded like the race) While I did bring some other snacks because drinks get boring, I did mainly just use the Tailwind and it was great. So after that I ordered one large bag of the Berry, Razzberry(caffeinated) and Tropical(caffeinated). This stuff is great just like some people said on this thread. Test #2 came in the form of a 56mile gravel grinder (Heck of the North). Had two bottles of water and TW for the race. Drank one up before the half way stop. Ate two stinger waffle things and then just drank the other bottle on the second half ( one gue near the end to make sure I beat my dad  ). And I just placed another order in. So if anyone is wondering if some of the fellows on this thread are fibbing about how well this stuff works, I would say give it a shot because it certainly works for me. Thanks again for the advice everyone. Have a great day. Takk.


----------

