# NAHBS wierdness.....here



## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

This silver brazed sweated joint is going to last about 5 minutes in the real world.......










There is lots of good stuff.....this just is not smart though,


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

Is this a track bike or a bike for artistic cycling?


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## Guest (Feb 27, 2010)

dbohemian said:


> Is this a track bike or a bike for artistic cycling?


better question: Dude or Chic?


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## Walt (Jan 23, 2004)

*As an aside...*

I've never understood why ti makes sense for track bikes.
Corrosion resistance: irrelevant
Weight: irrelevant
Cost: high
Aeroness: low
Flexiness: high, unless you use wicked big tubes

But yes, that looks like a good artistic cycling bike to me. Or a good bike to put cut-down riser bars on.

-Walt



dbohemian said:


> Is this a track bike or a bike for artistic cycling?


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## Thylacine (Feb 29, 2004)

Someone please make it stop.


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## TimT (Jan 1, 2004)

IDK I kind of like the track bike notice the double chain stays? 
Also the sweated joint could have some internal fillet. I read on Fred Parr's site about brazing a bead on the inside of a tube then braze that tube to the other tube. Never tried it.

looks like a chick to me.

Tim


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

The CIA should incorporate this into their torture techniques


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

TimT said:


> IDK I kind of like the track bike notice the double chain stays?
> Also the sweated joint could have some internal fillet. I read on Fred Parr's site about brazing a bead on the inside of a tube then braze that tube to the other tube. Never tried it.
> 
> looks like a chick to me.
> ...


It is a cool looking bike but.......The weight distribution is totally off whack. Secondly, everything Walt said was right on. Ti is only a 2/3rds as stiff as steel and you need more of it (either thickness or diameter) and you need to orient that in the right plane. That guy can stack (4) .5 inch chainstays on top of each other and its not going to do a lot for lateral stiffness.

Internal fillet brazing works....Kind of. There are some major brands that have done it in the past but of all the possible methods of securing tubes this is the weakest since it relies on a bare minimum of brazing material. There used to be a local (to me) builder who did this and his failure rate was immense. He is not longer in business of course. Better to add a touch of material and be on the safe side, especially on a downtube. You could maybe get away with this on a ST-TT juntion or something.

Chick or dude? I was debating whether to put that image up but for some reason I couldn't stop laughing so I went for it....


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## pvd (Jan 4, 2006)

Dave, call me on my cell. I'm shooting pic and doing seminars today. I'll be at the Calfee semoinar first thing.

-pete
415-686-0257


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Is it just me, or does there seem to be more weirdness than usual this year? I'm used to seeing an odd duck or three, but in the photos coverage thus far, there seems to be more of them. Builders trying to get attention by doing odd things to bikes?


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## Schmitty (Sep 7, 2008)

Maybe this will be the year it all 'jumps the shark'.

The dirty shoes, the piles of dirt, the bottles of wine, the flowers.... it's all a bit precious.

Reminds me a bit of the <1900 bicycle boom where anything that could be done with a bicycle was, regardless of merit.


-Schmitty-


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

Schmitty said:


> Maybe this will be the year it all 'jumps the shark'.
> 
> The dirty shoes, the piles of dirt, the bottles of wine, the flowers.... it's all a bit precious.
> 
> ...


Don't know. There is some pretty impressive stuff there too, don't get me wrong. I also noticed the booths. They have really stepped it up a lot. Makes my little banner and table coverings look pretty ridiculous. :sad:

Used to be that companies like Chris King had the badass booths and the framebuilders all looked totally homespun. Not anymore.

I am as guilty as anyone about making blingy sh-t but if it crosses that fine line between being at all useful or not even being ridable that is where I call it.


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## Schmitty (Sep 7, 2008)

dbohemian said:


> Don't know. There is some pretty impressive stuff there too, don't get me wrong. I also noticed the booths. They have really stepped it up a lot. Makes my little banner and table coverings look pretty ridiculous. :sad:
> 
> Used to be that companies like Chris King had the badass booths and the framebuilders all looked totally homespun. Not anymore.
> 
> I am as guilty as anyone about making blingy sh-t but if it crosses that fine line between being at all useful or not even being ridable that is where I call it.


Right. Need to remind myself it is a 'show' after all.

Bring on the floral arrangements.

-Schmitty-


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

I was looking at a NAHBS bike with v-brakes and fenders and was wondering if anyone was going to start a NAHBS rant thread.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

dbohemian said:


> This silver brazed sweated joint is going to last about 5 minutes in the real world.......
> 
> There is lots of good stuff.....this just is not smart though,


What if you were to machine the socket portion out of solid bar to give the brazed joint lots of surface area? Assuming this effect was worth the time, effort, weight, internet commentary, etc.


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

dr.welby said:


> What if you were to machine the socket portion out of solid bar to give the brazed joint lots of surface area? Assuming this effect was worth the time, effort, weight, internet commentary, etc.


I don't see why that would not work really well. Silver as we all know is great for overlapping joints and it does not need a lot of surface area to work well. Whether it is worth the effort is up to the individual.


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## Schmitty (Sep 7, 2008)

More weight and cost just for looks? No good.

-Schmitty-


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## Thylacine (Feb 29, 2004)

I kinda still like the Speedvagens, and Black Cat is nice and contemporary in a scene largely obsessed with tall socks and moustache waxing.

Aside from that, I haven't really seen anything particularly exciting or different.


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## Thylacine (Feb 29, 2004)

Goddamnit!!!!

I was going to do this on my new road bike! Argh!!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

dbohemian - How about your thoughts on the bikes/builders who you think are doing good stuff/innovative stuff? 

I'd rather hear about that stuff from a builder's perspective than reading about the stuff that you think is weird/stupid/etc. etc.

Let's see/hear about the good stuff from your perspective please.

Cheers,

Mark


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

You can still do it:thumbsup: 

I have done that, that is old....Still cool though. I like those Chirubums (sp). They are ridiculous but there was a lot of effort as far as fabrication.

One of the coolest TT bikes I ever saw had brakes inset in the CS and fork blades and when you activated them they would just peak out, otherwise they were nearly invisible. 

Still full internal routes are a PITA.

I am finding this year that my gut feeling favorites are leaning towards things like that flat green black cat.


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## Smokebikes (Feb 2, 2008)

Yawn........showed up Friday left Saturday morning. Nice folks though! Anybody talk to a couple of guys from Copenhagen (?).........they did some pretty cool stuff with hubs and brakes.


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

MMcG said:


> dbohemian - How about your thoughts on the bikes/builders who you think are doing good stuff/innovative stuff?
> 
> I'd rather hear about that stuff from a builder's perspective than reading about the stuff that you think is weird/stupid/etc. etc.
> 
> ...


That is a good idea Mark... Urban Velo put up nice picture sets, which I am just looking through now. We have all become a bit jaded because really the stuff is so good nowadays and you know that every person thinks their bike is awesome and poured a lot of time into it but I will put up a few examples of what I thought was cool.


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## Thylacine (Feb 29, 2004)

LMAO!

Eric told me before the show that he was doing a 'jet powered' bike. Glad at least one guy has a good sense of humour and irony [that is actually aware of it, I mean].

Best In Show!


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## Thylacine (Feb 29, 2004)

Discuss.


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## marks_bike (Aug 22, 2006)

dbohemian said:


> This silver brazed sweated joint is going to last about 5 minutes in the real world.......
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I talked to that dude about that, he said "we use internal fillets" whatever that means. Also when I asked him about how they deal with moisture since wood likes to move and warp when wet he told me "we deal with it" umm ok good luck!


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## dbohemian (Mar 25, 2007)

marks_bike said:


> I talked to that dude about that, he said "we use internal fillets" whatever that means. Also when I asked him about how they deal with moisture since wood likes to move and warp when wet he told me "we deal with it" umm ok good luck!


It's an actual technique, just not a very good one. You place a pre-placement ring inside the tube and then just sweat it out. An internal fillet is created. It is small though and not very strong when compared to other techniques. There are ways to help stabilize wood with chemical treatments. You soak them for weeks and they drive off the moisture and replace it with another compound but you are right. By no means can wood be as stable as other things.


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## metrotuned (Dec 29, 2006)

Great show, great pix, thanks for allowing me to be there while sittin' in front of my PC sippin' on tea and chompin' on a dinner sandwich. I don't feel worthy! 

As with any culture on the up (to mainstream), there will be a plateau and a drop when the ridiculous gets taken too serious. Don't forget, it's about the makers and bikes first. The rest is secondary. In hindsight, you will ask, was it worth compromising XXXX to expose it to the mainstream?


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## BREW1dude (Jan 6, 2006)

Had a GREAT time at the show! Nice meeting a bunch of old and new friends.


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## Welsh Dave (Jul 26, 2005)

Thylacine said:


> Discuss.


Best first. Awesome. 2-speed kick-back coaster hub? Love the seatstay junction, the finish and the general scabby look. I'd want some "extras" for the winter - Like grips and fenders, but I'd very happily ride around on that forever.








>

Love the custom dropouts and the overall look is very "track bike meets muscle-car". Works great as a show bike and (hopefull) as a track bike, too. But those fat stays look way too harsh for a lightweight like me.








>

No, thanks. Not my thing - No offense.








>

"_Impressively Vulgar_". Gold-plating? It reminds me (in a bad way) of the gold Hutch Trick-Stars etc.. I do like the 29er wheels and discs. And also the segmented fork. It's probably well-made and took a long time to do, but... why?








>

This is a Specialized? In that case, I assume the frame is not handmade and so the bike is there to showcase the paint? Amazing. Too extrovert for me, but still impressive. Beats a bit of shaky lug-lining.








>

Love the concept. Very "_constructeur_". Very slightly spoiled by the modern crank and the black rims. But it looks like it would make a bombproof tourer that would last years. For real use (or my use), it would need a long rear fender and a rack. 








>

Beautiful looking frame. Somebody was busy with the polishing kit.
But they should have bought a seat for it. Really.








>

Please. Make. It. Stop - both kinetically and visually. 
Form over function. 
It's not a serious track bike, so what is it?
Street bike? Only if you kid yourself. I commuted on a Lo-Pro pursuit bike at college. It was ridiculously inappropriate and a major F-A-I-L.

And if this is one of those contraptions for the laughable web-fad of "fixed-gear freestyle", then I'd have to say my BMX has decades of evolution behind it and is a WAY better tool for the job.

But if you like wearing your Star Trek pyjamas in public, I'm sure you'd also like that bike.


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## BREW1dude (Jan 6, 2006)

Thanks! The Ol' Rusty bike does have rack mounts. The bars are 1" and wrapped in friction tape which have a slight tack to it.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

Does the big steerer part on the stem conceal a plunger that pumps out mayo for your frites? If not, consider the gauntlet raised.


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