# New (old) Klein Adroit



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Hey guys, just got this one and thought you might like to see.

By the serial # (20T0996344) I'm assuming that this a post trek takeover, rebadged attitude adroit. It doesn't have the welded on internal cable 'hoods', and it doesn't have any reinforcing around the water bottle bosses. 

Full XTR M950 group, syncros post, ringle hubs on mavic sunburst rims, wheelsmith gold build labels. I had to swap out the old specialized rubber, as they were shot, and replace with what I had handy, namely a hutchinson bulldog and a WTB for the front. Uncut mission control (2?) bar stem, no-rise at about 130 length. An aftermarket, painted to match Judy SL is what it looks like up front too. I didn't get the original rigid fork with it, unfortunately. I haven't pulled it apart yet, but the abundance of oil in the boots is whispering "blown damper". Really a bummer the rigid fork isn't around..

Can you guys tell me if the group is original to the frame? I seem to think that the 950 stuff was later than 96, but I'm not sure. I knew the owner of this bike, and it was probably a warranty frame from Trek/Klein back in the day, might explain the newer? grouppo.

Am I right on the rebadged 'Attitude' as well? From the lively threads with CF, it seems to fit that description. What's the color called, sunrise? Need to get a new chain and cable set, and a set of rear inserts for the brakes, and it should be up and running again.

Thanks.

Plum


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

that's a 1997 Adroit (built in September 96). Color is Koi and it was not available with a rigid fork, only with the yellow Judy SL. That's likely the original fork but it has been painted differently. The M950 group is "correct" for 97. The frame is the same as the 94-96 Attitude but it has a threaded bb shell instead of the press-fit bb, the loose seat post clamp instead of the welded-on and the rear brake cable outlet is V-brake ready and it does not have the canti brake cable bridge on the seat stays. Btw, the T in the serial number was used for the Attitude until 1996, the pre-Trek Adroit had the X. 
The MC2 is not original as it has the brake cable noodle which is only needed for a rigid fork and cantilever brakes.

Nice bike and a great rider!

this is the pic from the 1997 catalog, full M950 group










Carsten


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## jasonwa2 (Oct 28, 2004)

96, yes.
The rumored rebadged attitude, yes.

Though in my opinion, its still a real "adroit"
Klein got to decide what a adroit is...not us.

Why can't we just say the truth.... that in our opinion, this klein maybe wasn't as nice or the same as some previous models??

That klein right there is about race ready(blown shock and all)
And will stomp just about anything out there.

No, klein didn't stock that frame with that package.
He put that together....and it's nice.

I'm sure its REAL FAST and handles REAL WELL.

I'll stomp anybody on my 96 attitude.(with worn out manitou SL ti)


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## pinguwin (Aug 20, 2004)

Just about to post when Jason & Carsten beat me to it. One way to check the Adroit vs. Attitude thingie is the size of the downtube, Adroit only has 2.0" downtube. M950 was out in 96.

Pinguwun


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

pinguwin said:


> Adroit only has 2.0" downtube.
> Pinguwun


oh no, please not that discussion again 

Carsten


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## jasonwa2 (Oct 28, 2004)

Carsten said:


> > The M950 group is "correct" for 97.
> 
> 
> Carsten


I've been corrected...

I guess it was 98s that klein/trek got all cheap.
Wasn't the 97adroits available with full xtr but it was an option?
or did all 97 adroits come stock with 950 XTR?


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## jasonwa2 (Oct 28, 2004)

Carsten said:


> oh no, please not that discussion again
> 
> Carsten


Hey, i'm just happy to have the discussion.

I get all giddy every time i see a klein thread or pic.


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

jasonwa2 said:


> I've been corrected...
> 
> I guess it was 98s that klein/trek got all cheap.
> Wasn't the 97adroits available with full xtr but it was an option?
> or did all 97 adroits come stock with 950 XTR?


according to the catalog the 97 adroit came as fuselage only (frame, Judy SL, MC2, Thomson seat post) but it was pictured built with the M950 group. most i have seen were built with that group but i dont think they left the factory as complete bikes. afaik no such frames were built anymore in 98, only 97 leftovers were sold.

Carsten


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

Just wondering: What kind of a bottom bracket was in those '96 Attitudes and Adroits that were specced with the XTR group ? I mean, the M950 was available already and the BB is splined, not square taper. So, did Klein use old M900 XTR instead od did it fit some kind of different "Klein Precision" BB in those bikes ?


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## pinguwin (Aug 20, 2004)

The 97's were spec'd with Shimano UN-72 for the Attitude Race and the UN-51 for Attitude Comp.

96 Attitudes had the pressed in Klein BB, this was the last year for them. RIP.

Pinguwin


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## Archangel (Jan 15, 2004)

pinguwin said:


> 96 Attitudes had the pressed in Klein BB, this was the last year for them. RIP.
> 
> Pinguwin


Yes indeed, but how about the ones that had XTR parts in 1996 ? I've seen photos of one 1996 Nightstorm Adroit (from Netherlands if I remember right) and that bike had full XTR M950 spec with M950 crankset too. This can't be possible with Klein Precision BB. So, does Carsten or anyone else know how they solved the problem BITD ?

It had also a V-brake in rear with Klein V-brake adapter. But the 1996 spec sheet says that the '96 XTR spec came with a V-brake in front & canti in rear. Of course one can't strictly rely on the catalogues...

(Sorry Plum for partially hijacking the thread)


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## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Thanks for all the info. I think this may be a warranty replacement frame, hence the non-stock MC2 bar/stem. Knowing the owner, I'm sure he broke at least one frame. He used to have the old pink/white/green framesets as well, with the huge rigid fork. 

Bummer that there's no rigid fork for it, I would much prefer to ride it that way. I'm not positive the Judy is blown, but I'll get around to pulling it apart to check.

The owner of the bike died unexpectedly, and I got it from his daughter to clean up and go over. I found a crack in the paint on the TT, right in front of the ST/TT junction, but it also had some bubbling in the paint. I removed a little paint, just to confirm that it was only a paint flaw and not a broken frame, and it looks ok underneath. This bike was definitely ridden, there's a couple good size dings in the TT (probably from the controls hitting the TT, and there's lots of wear on the paint in general, rubs and a few small chips.

Is there any other common place I should be looking for cracks on these frames? I stripped it down and washed it up pretty good, but didn't see anything else alarming. I'm not sure what she wants to do with it, but I might buy it from her. She wants to sell it, but for what it's worth on today's market, I would rather hold onto it. 

Plum


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

Plum said:


> Thanks for all the info. I think this may be a warranty replacement frame, hence the non-stock MC2 bar/stem. Knowing the owner, I'm sure he broke at least one frame. He used to have the old pink/white/green framesets as well, with the huge rigid fork.
> 
> Bummer that there's no rigid fork for it, I would much prefer to ride it that way. I'm not positive the Judy is blown, but I'll get around to pulling it apart to check.
> 
> ...


the only area a bit typical for cracking on those Gradient tube frames were the welded-on seat post clamps on the pre-97 frames. Yours doesn't have that anymore so no need to be worried.

You can still put the rigid Attitude or Adroit fork on that frame if you can find one. If i am not mistaken the geometry did not change from the 94-96 Attitudes and Adroits and the head set not too. Swapping out forks is just not really easy as they are pressed and loctited in and they have that Klein specific oversized steerer tube.

Carsten


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## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

*Fork*

I'm guessing that I could find any 1 1/8 fork for it, as there's adapters in the frame right now for the Judy, No?

The HS feels pretty good with no play, so I think that I'm down to either replacing the Judy with something similar, or finding a rigid fork of the right length, between 63 and 80mm of travel adjusted length I'm assuming.

I know the bearings are locktited, but is the actual steerer loctited into the HT as well? I don't have tool to adjust the top nut (who does?) but by the looks of it, I can just get the top HS nut loose and the fork/MC2 should come off, right?

I think the Judy is a press-fit crown with the lowers, so I'd have to replace the whole assembly, not just the lowers too. I guess I could always try and source a replacement cartridge for it, but I'm not terribly excited about that either.

Plum


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

Archangel said:


> Yes indeed, but how about the ones that had XTR parts in 1996 ? I've seen photos of one 1996 Nightstorm Adroit (from Netherlands if I remember right) and that bike had full XTR M950 spec with M950 crankset too. This can't be possible with Klein Precision BB. So, does Carsten or anyone else know how they solved the problem BITD ?
> 
> It had also a V-brake in rear with Klein V-brake adapter. But the 1996 spec sheet says that the '96 XTR spec came with a V-brake in front & canti in rear. Of course one can't strictly rely on the catalogues...
> 
> (Sorry Plum for partially hijacking the thread)


the bikes in the 1996 catalog all have canti brakes front and rear and press-fit bbs with square taper cranks (Attitude and Adroit XT M737). the XTR group in the spec sheets would be the M910, not the M950.

you have two options to put a splined bb into the older press-fit bb frames: 
a) thread the bb shell with italian threads (BSA is too small) and use the DuraAce splined bb 
b) use the Reset bb http://www.reset-racing.com/ http://www.reset-racing.de/reset/innenlager_index1.htm

I think back then i have seen a sort of adaptor that went onto the square taper and converted it to splined but memory is a bit fuzzy and i have never seen it again. might have been a proto that did not make it into production?

Carsten


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## Guest (Jul 2, 2007)

Plum said:


> I'm guessing that I could find any 1 1/8 fork for it, as there's adapters in the frame right now for the Judy, No?
> 
> The HS feels pretty good with no play, so I think that I'm down to either replacing the Judy with something similar, or finding a rigid fork of the right length, between 63 and 80mm of travel adjusted length I'm assuming.
> 
> ...


just from the looks i would say this is the stock fork with the oversized Klein steerer. you can quickly check when you pry off the plastic cap on top of the MC2. you will see the steerer tube and if it is really large and thin walled it is the Klein steerer. there are adaptors/shims for the frame to use 1 1/8 head sets and adaptors to use 1 1/8 forks in the original bearings and the Reset 1 1/8 head set. in order to use the MC2 on a 1 1/8 steerer you would need a shim (available at, you guessed it, Reset). you would see that thinner 1 1/8 steerer tube and the shim if you take off the plastic cap.

the Klein head sets cannot be adjusted. if they have play they are shot and need to be replaced. the wrench is only needed to remove the MC2. the fork needs to be pressed or hammered out and you would need said reducers or the Reset head set to run a 1 1/8 fork.

as i've said you can mount the original Klein rigid fork from the Attitude or Adroit, it is just difficult and usually pretty expensive to get one. the Adroit fork would have the Strata writing on the legs and the carbon re-inforced crown (is 10% lighter than the Attitude fork). the Attitude rigid fork has the Klein writing on the legs.

Carsten


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## pinguwin (Aug 20, 2004)

Not to hijack the thread anymore but will anyways. The Klein BB is special in that it is pressed in but the ends of the spindle are standard square tapers. You can use a Klein spindle or a Phil Wood one will do just fine. It's unusual but not Klein-only as the fork steerer tubes are.

The only problem I have with XTR & the spindles is that I have one frame that is spec'd for XTR and has a narrower spindle than I want for my Syncros cranks. But that's only an issue of spindle length, not format.

Humble 'Guin

P.S. Reset Racing has a setup where you can use hollowtech2 cranks on your press-fit Klein but haven't heard any ride reports of them yet.


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