# Official Bontrager Thread



## ¶å©øß (Jan 12, 2004)

I am getting a well used Bontrager frame that definitely needs a makeover and new powder coating. I was thinking of going the original black way... but then my creative side took over... now, I cannot decide. HELP ME OUT, by posting pics of your Bontrager Race or others and let me know what color _you_ think I should paint it...


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

¶å©øß said:


> I am getting a well used Bontrager frame that definitely needs a makeover and new powder coating. I was thinking of going the original black way... but then my creative side took over... now, I cannot decide. HELP ME OUT, by posting pics of your Bontrager Race or others and let me know what color _you_ think I should paint it...


I'm partial to factory if it's a race or race or...but black is always safe. Black everything out.

Check some of the other threads for pics as well...Bontragers have come up often in conversation.

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=177&highlight=Bontrager
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=1916&highlight=Bontrager


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## xrmattaz (Jan 12, 2004)

*Bonnie*

This one belongs to my brother.

Still brand new, and too small for me.....


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## A:42 (Jan 6, 2004)

*Origninal colour samples in NYC (and old Chi Chi)*

There is a shop in NYC that probably still has the original tubing colour samples from Bontrager Circ. @1992-93. They probably have no idea what they are, they have been hanging on the board behind the register since I got them in in 92-93 (my memory is a bit foggy on dates) attached together on a old Cannondale frame Zip tie. I saw them as recently as 2 years ago and see no reason for them to have moved since.

They also have a great selection of 90's Chi Chi. Zooka stems, Kooka Cranks, Purple this, Red that, 1 1/4 Mavic headset. They are not collectors, this is stuff just hanging around since "back in the day", and I am sure can be had for a good deal. Just don't be a pain in the ass and ask all sorts of annoying questions about exact specifications and stuff, if it isn't exactly what you wanted there is always Ebay.

Larry & Jeff's Bicycle's Plus 
2nd Ave @ 87th St
(that's Manhattan fool)
By the way there is 2 locations, avoid the shop on 3rd like the plauge, very very different attitude.


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## bikenerd (Jan 7, 2004)

I just built up my first Bonty as an SS - a '92, SAnta Cruz, black with white panels. I'll get some pics up this weekend.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Here's mine. Had it for about 5 years, but sold it about 2 years ago to buy my Hunter 29"er. There are times when I miss it, but then I ride my new bike and I don't.

And my wifes. Its a Trek version. but still anice bike. She LOVES it, the way it rides, how it handles. I repainted it from the hideous blue/orange it was as stock. Self modified stickers. She likes the one-off appearance of it too. THe only stock part left on it is the stem. Everything else has been changed. It also has pre hollowtech cranks on it too.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Martini,

Did you buy that black/blue/white at Dave's Recycled bikes in Santa Cruz by any chance? That looks exactly like my first Bontrager which I parted with there. It is a really odd size, has the top decal on backwards, and has the horizontal drops. It must be the same one, there really can't be more than one that looks just like this. 

She was way too big for me so I had her set up as a cross/touring bike. I'm trying to remember if there was anything else that I could identify it by. 

Take it easy.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Nope, and you're the second person in two days to accuse me of being from the SC area! Funny. I'm from Minn. and the bike was originally red, there was some rust under the original powder coat, so I had it redone, and called to ask for more stickers. I liked the TT one better backwards. The bike was one of the last out of the SC factory, so it had the Vert. drops on it. I was running 36-18 which fits perfect w/o a tensioner.


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Ti Lite Decals:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3658788294&category=42317


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## aosty (Jan 7, 2004)

How about another identical one without the toptube decal?










Frankie says hi...











Boy named SSue said:


> Martini,
> 
> Did you buy that black/blue/white at Dave's Recycled bikes in Santa Cruz by any chance? That looks exactly like my first Bontrager which I parted with there. It is a really odd size, has the top decal on backwards, and has the horizontal drops. It must be the same one, there really can't be more than one that looks just like this.
> 
> ...


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

aosty said:


> How about another identical one without the toptube decal?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Here 'tis in its orgininal color. Also sans toptube decal. This was taken in Colorado somewhere. Probably on the MonarchCrest Trail. Tires were the Specailized 2.2 Cannibals. Loved those tires. Would like to find another set sometime.


click for bigger pic.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

How could you possibly get accused of being from Santa Cruz, two Bontragers and a Hunter? I get the same accusation every now and again since I have a couple of Bontragers and a Rock Lobster. I did buy most of them when I was living there though. 

I really thought that was my old one. I should have noticed the different dropouts and the cable routing for the top-pull but the super big size and stickers had me. 

What's the deal on the second one you posted? It looks like a large, is it for sale? 

Take it easy


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

*... something*

... green 'n red 'n yellow  one year ago, now it has to be repainted because the powdercoat gets off the dropouts 
it's a '94 race lite, my second "real" custom bike. for me the best hardtail i ever had.

ciao
flo


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## loonyOne (Dec 25, 2003)

*Here is mine again...*



¶å©øß said:


> This was taken just after I finished the SS conversion. I really like the deep purple metallic color, but can't take much more of the yellow decals. There really is a lot of unnecessary solid color in their decals. I plan on getting it repainted sometime and applying new, yet slightly altered decals. I'm thinking silver/black if I can still buy them. Although, I really like how the Trek titanium decals look, nice and clean. We'll just have to see what I can get my hands on.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

The purple one? That's the wifes. If I even think of selling it, I can say buhbye to sex for a good long time. The red one is actually the same bike as the black one. I had a rust problem under the powder coat, so I had it redone.Some guy in S.Carolina bought it two years ago for a steal. $600 as in the black pic.


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## rye (Feb 9, 2004)

Me and my old meany greeny during a muddy ride at Skeggs. Not the best pic. I was late for the ride and didn't have any of my cycling cloths clean, who say you can't ride in cotton?? (you can, it just sucks)


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## phatphil (Feb 3, 2004)

*my race*

here is mine in all her splendor. ride her 3-5 times a week and have pretty much over the last 10 years


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## terry (Jan 17, 2004)

great thread. makes me weepy. had a race for five yrs. great handling in the twisty new england singletrack-loved it but it was time.


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## bikenerd (Jan 7, 2004)

*here's mine . . .*

. . . a '92 Race, Santa Cruz built. I just acquired it and built it up as my first singlespeed (mountain bike, that is). Kitted out with a smattering of vintage parts. Rides sweet!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

bikenerd said:


> . . . a '92 Race, Santa Cruz built. I just acquired it and built it up as my first singlespeed (mountain bike, that is). Kitted out with a smattering of vintage parts. Rides sweet!


Nice looking fork. What is it?


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Loooks liek a abontreraver standae= cmpaostite. holy sows meat i'm drunk as the chica i gave my numer to at th batr.. too may margaties... oh damn! i have tow of those foryks they & they are ho t hot hot.!!! hota damn an d hallkeleujuiah! rock on!


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## bikenerd (Jan 7, 2004)

*you got it, flyingsuperpetis!*

Yep, it's an original Bontrager 3-piece rigid fork, kinda like a Tange Switchblade. Stiff as hell - this thing carves turns like crazy. WTF is a flyingsuperpetis, anyway?


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## bikenerd (Jan 7, 2004)

*here's the front view ~*

the Bonty rigid fork in all its glory

BTW, flyingsuperpetis, que tomas esta noche? Estas bien borracho, no? He tomado unas tres cervezas belgicas (sp?) y no me siento nada.


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

*Hey! That's a me!*

Ohhhh yes, that is one of the finest forks ever made. They sure do handle turns like lips on a nipple. Try to shake em off, just try. Amazing. Once you have one, you may get the idea you could benefit from some softness, ie, a suspension fork. Oh sure, you'd buy a few, start with something cheap, a rockox, then maybe a manitou, then pricier, a Marzocchi, then you go for broke and try a Pace, illigitimately imported from england... it goes on and on. Still you keep the Bontrager, mostly out of sheer obligation. A frame belongs with its fork... well, it's only a matter of time, before you get to thinking, I seem to remember that fork pulling me through these turns twice as fast... sure enough, you ditch the brainslug, and reattach the svelte (relatively) rigid bontrager composite, as the universe intended. Whooooooly shmoka. There it is. There is what you have been missing. Wow. It's like being the wheels on a rollercoaster. You're just in there. And it's fast. And tight. What else is there? Maybe some bumps. You learn how to not hit them, and you do so fast. EVERYTHING seems 15 mph faster. Life is flowing and beuatiful. You take the auction down, and realize it's worth more on the front of your bike than the $300 it would fetch on ebay. A thing of beauty.


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Ohhh no mezcla margaritas y el mead irlandés. peligro del peligro del peligro.

y tengo gusto de su 986's


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## ¶å©øß (Jan 12, 2004)

Thanks ALL!

This thread is definitely pumping me up!

I cannot wait to finish the build!

Either have everything, or everything in mind, except for the cranks. What do you think? Part of me wants to go bombproof Profiles, but part of me doesn't.

Martini, my good friend, I shot you a message... check it, and make me the happiest man in the world?

THANKS!

I really love these BONTRAGERS!!!!
YAYA!


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## JahWind (Jan 20, 2004)

*SS Ti Bontrager*

I've set my Ti Bonty up SS using a SoulCraft tensioner, 34x19. It was sweeeet!!! I've since switched it back to geared and built up a Hunter frame the same way, only this is with a Hunter rigid fork and disc brakes.


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## ~martini~ (Dec 20, 2003)

Nice choice in the Hunter! I've got one too. 29" EBB and disc. Swanky ride. Lets see a picture of yours. I like the Ti lite, you coulda run a 36-18 w/o a tensioner too.


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## kokopelli (Feb 24, 2004)

My 94' Bontrager Race. Rebuilt and repainted this winter. stem/bar-combo, RS SL Ti, copmplete XT M-730, cranks will be replaced with black anodized M-730

Koko


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## BontyRider (Feb 18, 2004)

*One very very very used Bontrager*

This is my 90-something Privateer Comp. Mojo visible on stem. Pedals currently inhabiting another bike...


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## GreenBonty (Feb 11, 2004)

*97 Privateer Comp just upgraded*

that's my ride


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## loonyOne (Dec 25, 2003)

phatphil said:


> here is mine in all her splendor. ride her 3-5 times a week and have pretty much over the last 10 years


WHOA!! Where'd ya get the saw blade logo sign??? Very cool!!


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## icegeek (Feb 16, 2004)

Here's mine, it could be yours...


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

*Here's my Bontrager fleet..*

In Front - Race Frame w/ Comp fork and an extra Race Fork . 
Left - Bontrager Singlespeed(Factory) w/ Custom 2002 SID SL
Center - RaceLite w/Comp fork and Moustache bars. (My favorite ride)
Right - RoadLite

It's a sickness.

jw


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## Tracerboy (Oct 13, 2002)

GrumpyOne said:


> In Front - Race Frame w/ Comp fork and an extra Race Fork .
> Left - Bontrager Singlespeed(Factory) w/ Custom 2002 SID SL
> Center - RaceLite w/Comp fork and Moustache bars. (My favorite ride)
> Right - RoadLite
> ...


Very nice. I really like the RaceLite with shiney forks...
I am getting my hands on a Race w/ shiney Comp fork with the semi horizontals, gonna be an SS...

Still trying to decide on cranks and color...


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## Darren (Jan 13, 2004)

*8 years and counting...*

Clydesdale owner here. 8 years and still riding like brand new. Original horrible orange color, which I still love to this day.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Darren said:


> Clydesdale owner here. 8 years and still riding like brand new. Original horrible orange color, which I still love to this day.


I like orange.


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## icegeek (Feb 16, 2004)

icegeek said:


> Here's mine, it could be yours...


Here, this seems more properly


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

*Looka!*

Some shop is selling a couple NOS pairs of Bonty cut-downs. Hard Ano MA-40s & Silver MA-2's

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3667612056&category=42317

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3667612119&category=42317


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

*Yeah they have been up for a month or more*

I'm surprised that they're not all gone by now, unless of course they have 50 of them.
I've been debating about picking up a pair of the MA-40's but seeing that have more than 2x as many wheelsets as I have bikes to put them on more rims doesn;t really seem wise.


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## Shaun K (Mar 23, 2004)

aosty said:


> How about another identical one without the toptube decal?


Here's the same bike again...almost done now:



















Just waiting on my XT Thumbshifters now...


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## aosty (Jan 7, 2004)

Very nice - and is that a Krylon-job on the fork?

Also, nice collection of boxes.


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## Shaun K (Mar 23, 2004)

aosty said:


> Very nice - and is that a Krylon-job on the fork?
> 
> Also, nice collection of boxes.


Yeah, I put about 6 coats of satin black on the fork. Hope you don't mind. I figure I can always get some more Judy legs if I want to go back to the OEM look.

A1000 boxes kick ass for shipping stuff! Toughest boxes I've seen yet...


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## HoSS (Dec 24, 2003)

*Unmolested Race Lite frame*

Here's a pic of my unpainted Race Lite. It was reps frame to take around to the shops and have them examine. The heat tint from the welds look cool. I haven't decided what to do with it yet. I may have it clear powder coated.


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

*... before*



HoSS said:


> Here's a pic of my unpainted Race Lite. It was reps frame to take around to the shops and have them examine. The heat tint from the welds look cool. I haven't decided what to do with it yet. I may have it clear powder coated.


 ... you do anything, please please please make photos of all the details  and show them to us and/or send them to [email protected]

i would be very happy

ciao
flo


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## Shaun K (Mar 23, 2004)

floibex said:


> ... you do anything, please please please make photos of all the details  and show them to us and/or send them to [email protected]
> 
> i would be very happy
> 
> ...


Better hope you get more pics soon, it's already on eBay: liNky


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## HoSS (Dec 24, 2003)

*Pics coming*

I thought long and hard about keeping this frame but can't justify it right now. I've decided to sell it but will take detail pics before it goes and post here. Kills me to sell this thing. I waited a long time to get it. Hope it goes to a good home.


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## mrmo (Mar 24, 2004)

*my race*

not quite how it is now,


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## mrmo (Mar 24, 2004)

*how it was when new*

first built up. has hs33's and xt chainset now.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

mrmo said:


> first built up. has hs33's and xt chainset now.


What's up with the front brake set-up? Why are the cants behind the fork?


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## shanedawg (Jan 9, 2004)

Here's mine. It's a 92' medium race frame in the original dark purple color. Also a pic of the race lite that was on the cover of the 94 catalog from Bontrager. One of the things that amazes me about this bike is that I have replced almost every part on the bike at least once but the frame is still going. I have used j.p. weigel frame saver in it once or twice and that must have doen some good because I rode it in the rain a fair amount.


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## mrmo (Mar 24, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> What's up with the front brake set-up? Why are the cants behind the fork?


It is how Pace have always been.


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## SSBonty (Jan 30, 2004)

*Wow, super pictures there...*

Wow some beautiful bikes  Not sure why everyone is killin the orange/white/light blue colour scheme, thats one of my favourites! Will have to get some pics of my Race built up as a geary and the Race Lite as a disked up SS for the UK winters (and much much more) - I know its a sacriledge to have it welded but keith himself said it would be OK. Using stickers made up by a guy I know, same colours as originals but in layers instead of just one bit. Anyone need some I'll let you know how much they come to...

Ian


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Please post some photos of your RaceLite when you get a chance. I saw your post on Singletrackworld and it sounds like a cool conversion.

jw



SSBonty said:


> Wow some beautiful bikes  Not sure why everyone is killin the orange/white/light blue colour scheme, thats one of my favourites! Will have to get some pics of my Race built up as a geary and the Race Lite as a disked up SS for the UK winters (and much much more) - I know its a sacriledge to have it welded but keith himself said it would be OK. Using stickers made up by a guy I know, same colours as originals but in layers instead of just one bit. Anyone need some I'll let you know how much they come to...
> 
> Ian


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## Octane (Mar 16, 2004)

I have some detailed pics of my old original Ti Lite. If anyone would like copies, please email me or PM me.

Thanks
-B


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## SuspectDevice (Apr 12, 2004)

All I've got is a 60cm mid- eighties hand-brazed cross frame and fork. So old it's standard geometry. If only I could grow a few inches...


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## SSBonty (Jan 30, 2004)

*Finally sorted this pic business!*

OK, so here are the pics. One of the Race OR geared, one of the Race Lite SS, one of the disc mount welded on the Race Lite SS, and one of the the no tensioner needed drivetrain of the SS (running 36-18 but also have 32 and 40 teeth rings for hills/flat places!). Hope this works...

Ian


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## SSBonty (Jan 30, 2004)

*Damn...*

... think the pics were too big. Back again later!

ian


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## Crell (Apr 7, 2004)

*My 89/90 Race*

There is only one colour for a bonty - Grey

This is my Race
It started out with red banded decals, and I got the yellow ones about 93

It's got a fillet brazed Seat Tube to top tube / stays. 
Horizontal Dropouts
Bonded & Riveted Cable guides

Pics of - 
Toplines
Prototype velo bontrager saddle
Prototype bontrager PG ti bars

Other kit - XT hubs, Mechs, Thumbies, BB
Specialized BCX23 rims
USE Shimmed Ti Post
New ! cheapo SPd's (747's are around somewhere) 
Magura Hydraulics
SRP ti bolts everywhere
Syncros Ahead Stem
Pace RC36 Evo Pro Class (what a mouth full) forks (1")
Ritchey WCS rear, Panaracer Dart 2.1 front


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## SuperClyde (Mar 19, 2004)

*One more....*

asdfasd


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## BontyRaceOR (Feb 25, 2004)

This is my 95 Race.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

BontyRaceOR said:


> This is my 95 Race.


Wow! Did you repaint it, or is the paint still that shiny?

I remember when my Race Lite looked like that many many years ago. Now I leave it covered in dust and dirt so that the beat-up finish is less obvious.


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## uphiller (Jan 13, 2004)

Crell,
Sweet setup, especially the thumbshifters. I have switched to Rapidfire Plus once, 8sp XT, and they were great in their own way, but I always switch back to thumshifters. One thing, though. Maguras on a Bontrager, without a brake booster? Can you lock the rear brake?
Tim


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## BontyRaceOR (Feb 25, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> Wow! Did you repaint it, or is the paint still that shiny?
> 
> I remember when my Race Lite looked like that many many years ago. Now I leave it covered in dust and dirt so that the beat-up finish is less obvious.


It's the original paint! I use Sonax Extreme Wax (wax for cars) to protect the paint.


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## TiLite (Feb 3, 2004)

*Acouple of mine*

Here are mine. I'm actually trying to sell the OR if anyone is interested Ti lite will not ever be sold is a bit different from the picture. It has the original decals and acouple more ti pieces on it. I'll get an updated pic up soon.


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## Crell (Apr 7, 2004)

uphiller said:


> Crell,
> Sweet setup, especially the thumbshifters. I have switched to Rapidfire Plus once, 8sp XT, and they were great in their own way, but I always switch back to thumshifters. One thing, though. Maguras on a Bontrager, without a brake booster? Can you lock the rear brake?
> Tim


No problem at all locking the wheel - esp with the 4 finger levers. The frame flex isn't too bad - it improves modulation  ...which on early maguras is pretty dire.


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

*Here's mine*

All bonty parts, race light cranks with race milled rings, santa cruz stem, race wheels, Judy XC with englunds, nice perf leather Ti railed saddle, New Jones tires (still have white mold release all over them), race bar, pauls levers and brakes (changing to XTR), XTR 8sp. All bonty parts with the paw logo. All new. Medium, I like large also, a little more roomy . . .


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> All bonty parts, race light cranks with race milled rings, santa cruz stem, race wheels, Judy XC with englunds, nice perf leather Ti railed saddle, New Jones tires (still have white mold release all over them), race bar, pauls levers and brakes (changing to XTR), XTR 8sp. All bonty parts with the paw logo. All new. Medium, I like large also, a little more roomy . . .


Ok i will take this one and the red one above.............I need a medium frame now..........**** I will take a privateer for crying out loud, anyone................?


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Hey Williwoods,
It was you who emailed me a week ago right? If so, I've got your pictures coming tomorrow.


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

flyingsuperpetis said:


> Hey Williwoods,
> It was you who emailed me a week ago right? If so, I've got your pictures coming tomorrow.


what was I looking at? remind me. Will


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

My NOS orange santa Race with your choice of stickers... But it was an XL, and I see you mentioned a med. Maybe it wasn't you. Bummer, I lost an entire .pst file (many emails) in the middle of getting photos for someone... suppose I'll have to list it again in the classifieds at some point. Whoever you are, I'm not ignoring you!


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

flyingsuperpetis said:


> My NOS orange santa Race with your choice of stickers... But it was an XL, and I see you mentioned a med. Maybe it wasn't you. Bummer, I lost an entire .pst file (many emails) in the middle of getting photos for someone... suppose I'll have to list it again in the classifieds at some point. Whoever you are, I'm not ignoring you!


thats too bad about the size, anyone ride a medium...........has that same person tried a large? I am in between sizes and could go in either direction. Will


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Williwoods said:


> thats too bad about the size, anyone ride a medium...........has that same person tried a large? I am in between sizes and could go in either direction. Will


I just sold a "large" Race Lite last week.

How tall are you?


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## biking_enthusiast (May 11, 2004)

*Did someBonnie call?*

Here is my girl. She's still holding up well. I have a SID with Englund Air cartridges ready to install as my Summer project.


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> I just sold a "large" Race Lite last week.
> 
> How tall are you?


5'9"

Used to ride a medium Privateer soldthat one (like an idiot)
bought a full suspension bike k2 razorback
jonesin for that bontrager feel again though
Full-Sus is ok just not quite the same.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Williwoods said:


> 5'9"
> 
> Used to ride a medium Privateer soldthat one (like an idiot)
> bought a full suspension bike k2 razorback
> ...


You really are right on the line between medium and large. You could probably go either way, but since you know that you like the medium, it's probably a safer bet.

I'm 6'0", and according to the catalogs, the large fits 5'9"-6'1" and the x-large fits 6'0"-something. I've always ridden a "large" frame and like it.

Prices seem to be reaonable on Race and Race Lites now, so you should be able to pick one up for a reasonable cost. I sold my full-xt (mostly '97 components) in decent shape for $500.

Good luck!


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> You really are right on the line between medium and large. You could probably go either way, but since you know that you like the medium, it's probably a safer bet.
> 
> I'm 6'0", and according to the catalogs, the large fits 5'9"-6'1" and the x-large fits 6'0"-something. I've always ridden a "large" frame and like it.
> 
> ...


See my prob is I got short legs and long torso I think I had a 120-130 mm stem on my medium and a layback seatpost. Worked great and felt good but I still wonder if a Large may be better.


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

*straight from ebay............*

Looks Interesting....not quite as nice as a race-lite though.

Here


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Williwoods said:


> Looks Interesting....not quite as nice as a race-lite though.
> 
> Here


Interesting and kinda cool. The seller has it listed on the SF craigslist for $750but negotiable if anyone is interested and not wanting to do the Ebay thing. After that scam alert, who wants to.

http://www.craigslist.org/pen/bik/34365405.html

Wiliiwoods,

For all it's worth, I am 5'11" and mostly torso myself. I feel fine on medium or large Bontragers. At 5'9" with a short inseam, I would stick with a medium but you know your riding style best. You also might want to consider what fork you will put on it. An 80mm fork will raise the front compared to the intended 65mm. This will slacken the seat tube and head tube angle thereby leaning your seat further backwards giving a bit of offset and will bring the stem up. If you are in between sizes and looking to run a more modern fork, I would go with the medium. I would think a medium with an 80mm fork and a 130x0 stem would put the bars and seat pretty close to where a large would put them with a 65mm fork and a 120x10 stem.

I have two larges. The one with the intended fork length feels smaller than the one with the 80mm marzocchi eventhough the frames have the same geometry.

Cheers


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

Thank u SSue, that was the insight I needed, I will prob use an 80mm fork for sure, my old privateer had a 63 Judy with 1.25 crown offset. What more modern fork has the most similar rake spec? Any good suggestions? I would go with either a 1-1/8" or 1" Bontrager, I dont discriminate as they all feel nearly identical imho......? I have not really ridden a race or race-lite enough to really say but having fork flexibility is pretty attractive without cutting headtubes off etc........
I always liked the quick handling of the medium with 63mm set-up, so maybe 80mm will be the cats meow as the handling should still be a bit quicker than most other vintage frames of the era, bontrager geometry etc....am I making sense? If I find a medium privateer I have an 02 mars super I can throw on. Would this be a good choice? Thanks again.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

I found that once you throw an 80mm fork on a Bontrager, the steering mellows out quite a bit. It won't be as quick as before but will be similar to many of the bikes being built around 80mm forks today. Is this what most other people are finding? 

I can't say I know too many forks. I got stuck on marzocchis early and stuck to them although I can see why people like other forks given their weight. I can say for sure that I don't like the tpc mainitous and the judy sl's.

cheers


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

*Bontragers eh?*

a couple nice Bontragers...

I am not a competent photographer.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

*wholy crap....NINE?!*

I love the small rasta. If I were to ever go for another it would be something along those lines in small or medium.

nice


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## flyingsuperpetis (Jan 16, 2004)

Hehe, ten. Two orange Races, two black racelights, two bmxs, the rasta, the ti, the road, cyclocross (not pictured). Plus a few sawed-off old ones for use as stools...


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

flyingsuperpetis said:


> Hehe, ten. Two orange Races, two black racelights, two bmxs, the rasta, the ti, the road, cyclocross (not pictured). Plus a few sawed-off old ones for use as stools...


Wow! You've gone a long way to make me fill better about myself. I though that I was over extended in the Bonty department, but it turns out you're worse!!!

I currently have:
- Race Lite : red, 9-speed
- Ti Lite : 8-speed
- Race : silver, single speed
- CX : black, 9-speed
Plus two unbuild frames: one Race Lite, and an '83/'84 frame.

I recently sold an orange Race Lite (8-speed), and sold my Road Lite a couple of years back.

All of this seems mild compared to you!  Nice collection!


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

flyingsuperpetis said:


> Hehe, ten. Two orange Races, two black racelights, two bmxs, the rasta, the ti, the road, cyclocross (not pictured). Plus a few sawed-off old ones for use as stools...


 ... this makes me feel very very sick  as I need single speed, cyclo x and road frame to get safe and sound again 

ciao
flo


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## dirt diggler (Jan 14, 2004)

here's my bontrager. 

is there a website for history of this frame ? 

thanks , dirt diggler


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## scurra (Jun 7, 2004)

[/QUOTE]

What is the silver fork leaning against the blue/white bonty? Does it have long forward facing fork tabs. What year is it? Does it have any markings on it that signify it as a bontrager fork, other then the "B" on the front of the fork crown. Does the steering tube have "tange" stamped anywhere on it?


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

It's a Bontrager Race, which pre-dates the Tange. One of the many ways to tell the difference between the Bontrager and the Tange is the brake studs.
Bontrager made two different forks, the Race and the Comp. And then they made many variations of each. My Race has normal dropouts, not the slotted ones. I've got 2 crowns to use with it for different axel to crown heights.

jw



scurra said:


> What is the silver fork leaning against the blue/white bonty? Does it have long forward facing fork tabs. What year is it? Does it have any markings on it that signify it as a bontrager fork, other then the "B" on the front of the fork crown. Does the steering tube have "tange" stamped anywhere on it?


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## scurra (Jun 7, 2004)

GrumpyOne said:


> It's a Bontrager Race, which pre-dates the Tange. One of the many ways to tell the difference between the Bontrager and the Tange is the brake studs.
> Bontrager made two different forks, the Race and the Comp. And then they made many variations of each. My Race has normal dropouts, not the slotted ones. I've got 2 crowns to use with it for different axel to crown heights.
> 
> jw


Mine has slotted dropouts. Do you know the rough date? (late 80s or early 90s). I have an issue of 1990 MTB Action and it pictured a bontrager with switchblade fork. Looks closer to you other fork, with clamp on brake posts.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Sorry, no clue as to when they where made. I do think the Race came first and then the Comp was the last to go out of production. But they were making both models for some time. I have a few catalogs that list both forks from 1990 & 91.

jw



scurra said:


> Mine has slotted dropouts. Do you know the rough date? (late 80s or early 90s). I have an issue of 1990 MTB Action and it pictured a bontrager with switchblade fork. Looks closer to you other fork, with clamp on brake posts.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

I knew I saw this thread,
Finally got it build back up.


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## eggahard (May 24, 2004)

.....


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## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

Here's my Bontrager Race, size Medium, in forest green. I bought this frame from a shop in 1995 where it had been hanging from the rafters on display (and collecting dust) for a long enough time that I felt I should by it. I built it up and rode it off and on for about 2 years solid before I began riding it less and less as I started acquiring more bikes for the growing obsession. I haven't ridden it at all, other than in my driveway, since at least 1998. A couple years ago I did manage to scour the nation in search of what seems to have been the last higher-end 1" threadless XC fork. The Manitou SX-R you see in this photo replaces the Manitou it was originally built with (can't remember the model designation, but was also black and the "sh*t" back when).


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## aka brad (Dec 24, 2003)

*What's wrong with this picture?*

This is a 98 Privateer S. When I bought the bike I upgraded the components to XT. I rode it as a Single Speed for a couple of years and then put the gears back on and put on a girl's seat and shorter stem for my wife.

For those of you that don't know, all Privateers were made by Trek. Here's a Web site that talks a little about Bonty  Frames.

The cool thing about the 98/99 frames (1999 being the last year they were made) are the 1 1/8 head tube; that's right, that's a 1998 Marzocchi Super Fly; the last fork Marzocchi made without disc tabs.

This bike doesn't get ridden much anymore, but before my Rocklobster (which was made from some old Santa Cruz Bonty Tange steel Paul still have left over) this was my main ride.

1G1G, Brad


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

aka brad said:


> This bike doesn't get ridden much anymore, but before my Rocklobster (which was made from some old Santa Cruz Bonty Tange steel Paul still have left over) this was my main ride.
> 
> 1G1G, Brad


Cool, so is it one of the ones labelled as a Nontrager?


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## riderup (Aug 18, 2004)

*1995 Race Lite*

added a 1 1/8 headtube (courtesy of Paul Sadoff at RockLobster) and new paint.


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## loonyOne (Dec 25, 2003)

riderup said:


> added a 1 1/8 headtube (courtesy of Paul Sadoff at RockLobster) and new paint.


Riderup, I think that I emailed you quite some time ago about your 1.125" equipped Bontrager, but maybe not. Oh heck ya, it hadta be you, what are the chances that someone else had done what you did! Anyway, I contacted Rock Lobster about putting an eccentric bottom bracket on my Bontrager and was shot down in flames. He did remember your conversion, and mentioned something about the thinness of the tubing and all of the gussetts and such. Anyway, he declined the job and I guess I'm not really all that affected by it...I can still run a 2:1 ratio with a 36/18 gearing without a tensioner.


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## riderup (Aug 18, 2004)

I'd trust Paul. He built me my favorite bike, despite it's oddity.
Picture attached...853 top and down tubes, Ritchey NiTi seattube, columbus seatspays, and tange chainstays, with a 1.5 inch headtube, running a 70mm ultra Headshok. I love the rigid-fork-like aesthetics of the headshok, plus it steers great and has a very nice lockout...perfect for ss. The bike's got subb11 dropouts and I'm using a Phil Wood chainstay mounted device to run rear disc. Mango king hubs round it out.



loonyOne said:


> Riderup, I think that I emailed you quite some time ago about your 1.125" equipped Bontrager, but maybe not. Oh heck ya, it hadta be you, what are the chances that someone else had done what you did! Anyway, I contacted Rock Lobster about putting an eccentric bottom bracket on my Bontrager and was shot down in flames. He did remember your conversion, and mentioned something about the thinness of the tubing and all of the gussetts and such. Anyway, he declined the job and I guess I'm not really all that affected by it...I can still run a 2:1 ratio with a 36/18 gearing without a tensioner.


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## nicco (Oct 24, 2004)

*My beater*

Gotta love the Carumba cranks. Broke a few BB's but those things are great.
Anyone know what year the privateer was brought out?

Nicco


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## mrmo (Mar 24, 2004)

*a not very retro race*


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## the_dude (Jun 18, 2004)

xrmattaz said:


> This one belongs to my brother.
> 
> Still brand new, and too small for me.....


  .....where does your brother live?!

the_dude


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## PixelPaul (Sep 30, 2004)

*1998 Privateer S*

Here it is in all its orange and aqua glory! Upgraded to XT deraillers. Just aquired a race Lite frame, so I am probably selling the Privateer. Drop me an email if you're interested in it. pmleblanc AT mac DOT com


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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2004)

Got an intersting lead to a Bontrager Ti Lite last week, from a friend of mine. I emailed the owner/seller of the frame to ask about further details. The add told it had a crack and he didn't want a lot for it. It took some emails back and fort before I decided to pick it up.

So; here's my second Bontrager;










As said; the frame has a crack. The guy I bought it from, was the second owner. I asked him if he ever had ridden it with a short seatpost. He didn't, but looking at the crack leads me to think that either he or the first owner used a too short seatpost.










I was not in the market for such a frame, let alone one with a crack. But I can tell you this; the price was this good, I just couldn't leave it there. Had to take it. Plans are already running through my head of having this frame fixed and completely refinished. The welding will be done by someone capable of doing such a procedure. Finishing will be done by myself I guess. As with some of my other frames, this will be a long-term project.

This is my second Bontrager... and ironically both have a crack in the seattube. The RaceLite OR has one in a vertical plane though, between the toptube and wishbone..... That one will be repaired within a half a year, thats for sure.

JB


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## steed_of_steel (Dec 19, 2004)

*I'm tryin' to upload a photo*



Rumpfy said:


> I'm partial to factory if it's a race or race or...but black is always safe. Black everything out.
> 
> Check some of the other threads for pics as well...Bontragers have come up often in conversation.
> 
> ...


I'd like to show off my bonty but my picture file seems to be too large. I've tried upoadin my picture but i get an error message that says that my file is too large (1.8mb, and the limit is 1.9 kb or something like that) I have a 5mp digital camera that I used. Please help me out if you can. Thanks!


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## steed_of_steel (Dec 19, 2004)

*just wondering*



SSBonty said:


> OK, so here are the pics. One of the Race OR geared, one of the Race Lite SS, one of the disc mount welded on the Race Lite SS, and one of the the no tensioner needed drivetrain of the SS (running 36-18 but also have 32 and 40 teeth rings for hills/flat places!). Hope this works...
> 
> Ian


I am wondering about where and how you got those disc mounts welded on, and by whom? Could you tell me, sounds like a cool idea for my bonty, mebe.
Thanks


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

My 2nd Bontrager a '92 Bontrager Race Lite rigid, size L, frame #588 fresh powder coated (silvergrey metallic) looks like "concrete grey" metallic 
Bontrager Competion Composite fork
King GripNut 1"
Bontrager Race Stem 1" 140 15�
Minoura Cable Hanger
Suntour XC Pro (crankarms/deraileurs/shifter/grease guard bb/seatpost/shifter cables)
MAVIC (MA40 32� rims/Paris-Gao-Dakkar VTT hubs/Alu qr's)
Shimano  (sharkfinn, brake cables)
Dia-Compe (986er Canties, SS5 brake levers)
WTB (Cartidge Brake Pads)
Selle Italia (Flite Titan)
Rohloff (8s chain)
Sachs (Aris 13/32 freewheel)
Procraft by Modolo (bar 600/12�)
Magura gripps
Continental (Vertical Pro 2.3)

More photo's

ciao
Flo


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Nice looking bike!


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Very nice build. Definitely one of the nicer Bontragers Ive seen.


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## HoSS (Dec 24, 2003)

*Very nice*

That is one fine looking bike, congratulations on such a nice build.


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## FTM (Sep 14, 2004)

just finished this up as a present for my wife on her birthday.
'96 Race Lite (M) w/ original XT components except:
Spectrum Powdercoat w/ new decals (obviously)
front wheel (CK ISO w / sun 0 deg XC rim)
Panaracer Fire XC Pro - Tubeless w/ Stans (front & rear)
Avid Mech front brake
White Bros. XC .8 fork (w/ 1" steer tube)
CK headset
Thompon post & stem
Easton EC 70 cabob bars
WTB She Speed saddle


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

FTM said:


> just finished this up as a present for my wife on her birthday.
> '96 Race Lite (M) w/ original XT components except:
> Spectrum Powdercoat w/ new decals (obviously)
> front wheel (CK ISO w / sun 0 deg XC rim)
> ...


Now _that_ is a cool bike!
How did you get the 1" for the White? Were they willing to do it at the factory? Or a custom press?


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## FTM (Sep 14, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Now _that_ is a cool bike!
> How did you get the 1" for the White? Were they willing to do it at the factory? Or a custom press?


White Bros. will do it directly (during manufacturing) for an additional $35.00 but you have to pay full MSRP. I actually went through Speedgoat who was selling the regular 1 1/8" version for a good deal less - they charged me $45.00 to have the factory make it with a 1" and it only took a couple of weeks but since this is done during manufacturing the time frame may vary.

Funny thing about the bike - it still hasn't seen any dirt! My wifes birthday was 12/26 and since then we have seen 17" of rain in So Cal. Ive managed to get out a few time during the breaks in the rain but she hasn't. The sun is out this morning so Saturday will be the day.


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## loonyOne (Dec 25, 2003)

FTM said:


> White Bros. will do it directly (during manufacturing) for an additional $35.00 but you have to pay full MSRP. I actually went through Speedgoat who was selling the regular 1 1/8" version for a good deal less - they charged me $45.00 to have the factory make it with a 1" and it only took a couple of weeks but since this is done during manufacturing the time frame may vary.
> 
> Funny thing about the bike - it still hasn't seen any dirt! My wifes birthday was 12/26 and since then we have seen 17" of rain in So Cal. Ive managed to get out a few time during the breaks in the rain but she hasn't. The sun is out this morning so Saturday will be the day.


Don't know if I would own a pink bike, but that is really awesome!! Where in blazes did you get the decals minus the huge mylar panels????


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## FTM (Sep 14, 2004)

loonyOne said:


> Don't know if I would own a pink bike, but that is really awesome!! Where in blazes did you get the decals minus the huge mylar panels????


Spectrum Powderworks had/created the decals for me - $40 for all of them including the 'handmade in Santa Cruz' sticker. I was actually expecting the panel and was surprised when I got the frame back. Not sure if it was miscomunication or an artistic descision on their part but I like how it looks this way.


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## Agency_Scum (Sep 17, 2005)

*Whenever it sees woodland it turns brown...*










Trust me I do clean it! Best riding bike I've ever had bar none. It's outlived half a dozen hardtails I've owned ( including 2 ti ones ). Old skool xtr ( immortal kit ), DX thumbies ( WAY longer lived than the 3 pairs of XT though I'm not sure why ) and a smattering of " back-in-the-day " boutique bits. Cream.


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## lml1x (Jan 13, 2004)

*seat tube on my bonty cracked too*



Jeroen said:


> Got an intersting lead to a Bontrager Ti Lite last week, from a friend of mine. I emailed the owner/seller of the frame to ask about further details. The add told it had a crack and he didn't want a lot for it. It took some emails back and fort before I decided to pick it up.
> 
> So; here's my second Bontrager;
> 
> ...


I had a '93 race lite that developed a crack in the seat tube also. Bontrager sent me a new frame. I sold it and have regretted it ever since.


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## Obi (Oct 16, 2005)

*OK, OK, Ok...*

Some people are still keeping their Bonty's rolling and I keep getting asked for this...

Here's the link to the Bontrager PDF catalog:

http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/html/bontrager.html

Enjoy everyone.

Obi...

fyi: "privvy's been sold, had no space for it, but it's with a good owner."


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## JahWind (Jan 20, 2004)

*Bontrager 9'er*

Hello All,

I just finished the 9'er Project. It is built up around the BlackSheep Ti fork. I just can't justify a third bike (a 29"), and I can't part with my Bontrager. I'm really happy with the performance a month. 

Cheers,
JahWind


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## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

*my beloved '96 (bought new)*

well here's mine, in it's current incarnation (still kinda odd for me to see it like this since putting it in "semi-retirement"):



















up until recently i rode it for several years spec'd as follows:

custom built wheelset: bonty valiant rims, XTR hubs, DT spokes, XTR 11-34 cass
XT crankset w/ race face rings
SRAM ESP 9.OSL rear der / shim XT front der
SRAM ESP 9 shifters (8 spd)
chris king headset
bonty race stem and bar
oury grips / coda bar ends
real designs levers
XT cantilever brakes
judy fork w/ englund total air cartridge
rockshox suspension seat post
bonty SSM 'race day' saddle
time ATAC carbon MTB pedals​
last season i *finally* upgraded to linear pull brakes and swapped out the cantis for an avid arch rival rear brake, single-digit 7 front (wow, brakes actually stop a bike, what a concept). then late in the year the englund cartridge blew out (my second) and i decided it was time to get a full-suspension bike after riding a hardtail since '85 (paid my dues for twenty years). so i pulled the judy and bought a tange rigid fork, swapped the race bar for a ritchey pro rizer, and lastly was forced to replace a valiant rim which had cracked w/ a sun sub IV.

there you have it. i ride it every day, either between the bus and my office or my jeep and my office. i will have this bike forever. it has served me well, from the boston-->new york AIDS ride, to mt. snow, moab, and of course this wonderful colorado singletrack.



terry


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## golfcycle (Sep 13, 2006)

*Bontrager Race Lite*

I'm new to this forum and I'm glad to see so many Bontragers. I've had this one sitting in storage for several years and decided to build it up. Looked around in storage to find what parts to build it up with and found all this. XTR 8 speed and Spinergy wheels, all new. Great forum!


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## holden (Jul 27, 2004)

golfcycle said:


> I'm new to this forum and I'm glad to see so many Bontragers. I've had this one sitting in storage for several years and decided to build it up. Looked around in storage to find what parts to build it up with and found all this. XTR 8 speed and Spinergy wheels, all new. Great forum!


Yours looks like an early 90's Race with newer labels, yeah?


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## Agency_Scum (Sep 17, 2005)

You're definately on yer way to the " Tartiest Bonty " award dude!
ps. nice motor!


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## golfcycle (Sep 13, 2006)

Nah, it's actually a 98 Race Lite frame that I bought at Robinson's Wheelworks in San Leandro, CA. He had Bontrager powdercoat it Judy yellow and had the rasta panels put on. I still have a couple sets of sticker panels around, I just have to find them. I also have a set of superlight original White Industries wheelset, but they are really noisy. But they are light. Yeah, this is pretty "yellowed out" but I may "Rasta it out" later once I find all those parts in my storage.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

anyone got a source for decals? i got a couple of restorations that need some love


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## mello211 (Dec 25, 2005)

NOS Race - Still has the shop SKU sticker on it. XT with Ritchey Logic cranks, XTR headset, Logic brakes, original Megabites and some gold anod SRP bolts here and there. Only needs thumbys and a bar switch.


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## holden (Jul 27, 2004)

golfcycle said:


> Nah, it's actually a 98 Race Lite frame that I bought at Robinson's Wheelworks in San Leandro, CA.


Seriously?

I always thought the Race-Lites, regardless of year, had the externally milled headtube. Also, your front derailleur uses a pulley which they stopped doing like in '93 or so; later they were all top-pull. The seatstays being two-parts, I always thought, were a pre-Trek detail too.

Just curious. I could be wrong. There are some Bonty experts here that might chime in.

edit: older is better anyway


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

GrumpyOne said:


> In Front - Race Frame w/ Comp fork and an extra Race Fork .
> Left - Bontrager Singlespeed(Factory) w/ Custom 2002 SID SL
> Center - RaceLite w/Comp fork and Moustache bars. (My favorite ride)
> Right - RoadLite
> ...


its a sickness without a known cure,thank god. somebody find this man a cross bike and a ti lite


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

hollister said:


> its a sickness without a known cure,thank god. somebody find this man a cross bike and a ti lite


I remember when this this was first posted and I thought, holy god, is he serious. Now I have one more than him, though not nescesarily as nice as his. That factory SS will always get me.

Also, fewer of mine are built. So sad.

As for golfcycle's, I think Holden is right. In '98, Bontrager only sold privateers to my knowledge. The switch to single piece stays and away from the pulley routed deraileur cable came right about the same time as the Trek buyout but weren't nescesarily connected. I've heard it both ways from lots of sources.


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## 95bonty (Oct 6, 2004)

*custard*

From what you can see through the paint it certainly looks like a racelite- the bottle bosses look to be bonded in...can't make out the headtube - too much yellow - but I've never heard/seen a race lite with a non milled HT.

...definitely earlier than 98 - my current race lite was a 96/97 acquisition and it's got one piece stays/no front mech roller etc. I'd guess it's like a 94/95 no earlier since it's not got the uber cool bonded alloy TT cable guides.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

95bonty said:


> From what you can see through the paint it certainly looks like a racelite- the bottle bosses look to be bonded in...can't make out the headtube - too much yellow - but I've never heard/seen a race lite with a non milled HT.
> 
> ...definitely earlier than 98 - my current race lite was a 96/97 acquisition and it's got one piece stays/no front mech roller etc. I'd guess it's like a 94/95 no earlier since it's not got the uber cool bonded alloy TT cable guides.


I thought the bonded TT cable guides were '91 only, and only early '91 at that. I'm assuming tha it has horizontal drops.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> I remember when this this was first posted and I thought, holy god, is he serious. Now I have one more than him, though not nescesarily as nice as his. That factory SS will always get me.
> 
> Also, fewer of mine are built. So sad.
> 
> As for golfcycle's, I think Holden is right. In '98, Bontrager only sold privateers to my knowledge. The switch to single piece stays and away from the pulley routed deraileur cable came right about the same time as the Trek buyout but weren't nescesarily connected. I've heard it both ways from lots of sources.


thats about where im at too,need to finish up a few projects.......... and agreed the factory ss would be my holy grail as well


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Dang, you've got one more then me now.(?) I'm still looking for a CX and a Ti Lite. Guess I better intensify the search again. 

jw



Boy named SSue said:


> I remember when this this was first posted and I thought, holy god, is he serious. Now I have one more than him, though not nescesarily as nice as his. That factory SS will always get me.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> I thought the bonded TT cable guides were '91 only, and only early '91 at that. I'm assuming tha it has horizontal drops.


i was recently told the bonded cable guides stopped being glued on OR's in 93


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## 95bonty (Oct 6, 2004)

*according to mba*

The january 1993 MBA test shows a RaceLite with square panel decals, bonded TT guides, two piece chainstays, front mech roller and horizontal drop outs. The December 1994 issue shows welded steel TT guides, dual piece stays, front mech roller and slant decals.

I think the front mech routing changed 96?

In the UK it was pretty hard to tell what stock we were looking at - when I was looking during 94 the importer still had some square panel/alloy guide RaceLites...sadly I only had the cash for an OR Race at that point ;-(


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

GrumpyOne said:


> Dang, you've got one more then me now.(?) I'm still looking for a CX and a Ti Lite. Guess I better intensify the search again.
> 
> jw


Ha, I've got a ti-lite and a brazed cx.

I thought the horizontal dropouts ended in '92 maybe '93. I have a race with horizontal drops and welded steel cable routing so the switch from bonded cable guides should have been in '93 at the latest.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> Ha, I've got a ti-lite and a brazed cx.
> 
> I thought the horizontal dropouts ended in '92 maybe '93. I have a race with horizontal drops and welded steel cable routing so the switch from bonded cable guides should have been in '93 at the latest.


how bout some pics of your cx. curved forks?silver rounded crown?


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

hollister said:


> how bout some pics of your cx. curved forks?silver rounded crown?


Curved forks. The crown is a lugged one, not that Bontyish at all. I'll look to get picks up tonight.


----------



## PapaLegba (Jul 15, 2006)

Took the plunge today.

I managed to find an old Race frame and am now building it up as an SS.

Have a Surly singleator, Wheelhouse Surly rear wheel, Avid Single Digit 7's, a Raceface crank, etc. for the build. Most likely will put Crank Bros platforms on it.

The only real variable is the new 1'' Marzocchi XC fork I have on order (they still make 'em, it just takes a while to ship). Most likely will convert to new headset technology and get a RaceFace stem with a 35.4 clamp for really fat handlebars.

I'm looking at a 110-120mm stem since the XL is a bit smallish.

Since I don't have the time or the funds right now (the Singleator was inteded for a Specialized before I found the Bontrager) this might take a while.

Will post the finished product in a few months, promise.


----------



## fuquaykid (Apr 30, 2006)

Hello everyone!

Here are my two, a Privateer and a Race.....the Race is now without decals and sporting purple Paul cantilevers (with black cable housing) and a Ringle cage 

Stu


----------



## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

.. to determine which detail would lead to exact production dates of sc bontragers might be a bit confusing  to be honest...

this one, my second race lite, had been bought (acc. to the 1st owner) in germany in jan. 1993. so i think/thought it might be produced in '92 ... 
brazed cable guides, vertical dropouts, rigid geometries, tt nearly parallel to the ground (like the original off road).

my first, but later race lite was delivered in march '94, details like the one above , sloping tt, slightly beefier dropouts, suspension corrected.

up to '94 you could choose, according to the german dealer brochure, between horizontal or vertical dropouts, rigid or susp. corrected geometries.

here you'll find some details of a '90 off road, afaik these are made 'til 1991.

ciao
flo


----------



## Crell (Apr 7, 2004)

fuquaykid said:


> QUOTE]
> 
> You have a Fuquay frame or anything to do with Greg?


----------



## fuquaykid (Apr 30, 2006)

Crell said:


> fuquaykid said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE]
> ...


----------



## Crell (Apr 7, 2004)

Nice. He built a friend of mine a Max OR frame. IIRC it was fillet brazed as well. really nice looking bike. 

Does Greg still build our has he left the bike business behind?


----------



## fuquaykid (Apr 30, 2006)

From what I've been told this one is made from basic Columbus tubing, very light though  

I think Greg has left the bike business but there were rumors he was going to make a comeback.......hope that's true!

Cheers
Stu


----------



## bikenweed (Dec 22, 2005)

My '97 broke on the wishbone. Paul @ RockLobster fixed it up, but I rode it to death. 
Bike is in desperate need of a new fork, headset, bottom bracket and wheelset. 
Pretty much every part on the bike is plumb worn out. 
It's getting revamped for some more winter thrashing, keep tuned for the super duper drive train mod. Road cranks, a 36t single ring, and a chain guide. MMMmmm light and simple, yet still fast. Also considering a 12-27 with an Ultegra deraillure and a 28-38 up front. Hmmm...

It bugs the hell out of me when people pimp out their Bontragers then don't ride them. That's like torture for a bike. Bontys are made to be ridden fast and hard. Ride like you mean it. 









p.s. some sick bikes in this thread!


----------



## 95bonty (Oct 6, 2004)

*dropouts*

hey flo

you mentioned a drop out difference between your two race lites-has your earlier race lite got a really anorexic section that goes down to where the derailleur screws in? Kind of like it's notched/has a square-ish cut out of it?? Sorry don't have an image - but interested to see if you have any shots of yours?

I'm 95% sure I saw a RaceLite frame in the UK in 92/93 with the alloy guides, but the guides were finished in black, with a skinny vertical dropout. But i've never seen anything like it in any of the photo's here or elsewhere.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

hollister said:


> how bout some pics of your cx. curved forks?silver rounded crown?


Sorry about the lag, I've not been able to get to where the frame is in storage. I did find the pictures I was sent of it before I got it. Here we go:


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Did you buy that on ebay maybe a year to a year and a half ago?


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> Did you buy that on ebay maybe a year to a year and a half ago?


No, I got it from another forum member a few months ago in a trade for a brazed Bonty MTB. This one fit me better and I already had a brazed Bonty MTB in need of building up.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Boy named SSue said:


> No, I got it from another forum member a few months ago in a trade for a brazed Bonty MTB. This one fit me better and I already had a brazed Bonty MTB in need of building up.


Thats a nice one. Pretty sure that was mine at one point.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> Thats a nice one. Pretty sure that was mine at one point.


Cool, it is in my queue of bikes needing building. I like it a lot. It could use new paint but I think it will serve a couple of years as a SS cx with the current paint first. I'll just have to keep it well waxed.

cheers


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> Sorry about the lag, I've not been able to get to where the frame is in storage. I did find the pictures I was sent of it before I got it. Here we go:


:thumbsup: gonna run it as a ss, double thumbsup


----------



## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

sorry replying so late, but I'm a bit hindered 'cause I broke the "socket" of my right shoulder "joint" (this might be not the correct medical term  ) hopefully I can make some photos end of the week when i get rid of this :madman::madmax::eekster::madmax::incazzato:sling...

ciao
flo



95bonty said:


> hey flo
> 
> you mentioned a drop out difference between your two race lites-has your earlier race lite got a really anorexic section that goes down to where the derailleur screws in? Kind of like it's notched/has a square-ish cut out of it?? Sorry don't have an image - but interested to see if you have any shots of yours?
> 
> I'm 95% sure I saw a RaceLite frame in the UK in 92/93 with the alloy guides, but the guides were finished in black, with a skinny vertical dropout. But i've never seen anything like it in any of the photo's here or elsewhere.


----------



## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

... some days later 

* the official bontrager dropout gallery!* :drumroll:

offroad ca. 1991



race lite "early 1993" 



race lite definitely 1994 



ciao
flo


----------



## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

*NOS Race, Race Lite (both SC built)*

I previously posted pics of my mid-90s medium Race with 2-piece stays. It was always a bit small, so a couple years ago I put out feelers on CL looking for a large Race or Race Lite.

I was eventually contacted by two guys - one from SC with a Race Lite (who happened to have a plethora of Bontys and was a friend of Keith), and another guy in Oregon who had an unbuilt, post-Trek, SC built Race frame, likely one of the last of those built locally, with the tags still hanging from well-rotted rubberbands!

The Oregon guy drove down to the Bay Area to show me the frame, and I bought it on the spot for $300. The SC guy met me in SC one morning after I drove up from the Sea Otter (I was racing DH that weekend). Along with this complete bike I scored a bunch of spankin' new parts (including two 1" custom RS forks (SID and one-off Judy SL with all Ti fasteners and unique damper), Ti-Crowbar, shifters, Bonty tires, yadda yadda. He happened to have been an R&D engineer at RS way back when they still had their operations in SC.

I sold my medium Race frame to a guy in SoCal.

One of the interesting aspects are the decals on the Race, clearly a post-Trek configuration. The Race Lite had not OR decals, but the road frame decals which are pretty sleek and minimalist. I like them. I've since built the Race using all the era parts from my first Bonty. It's still lacking a fr, derailleur, but is otherwise fully built.

(For some reason pics won't load.... sorry!)


----------



## halfnhalf (Nov 26, 2005)

Just got through wit building up the Bonty that I had sitting around, I used parts that I had stashed over the years and obtained some new parts to go on the bike. One of the parts that I am ecstatic over finding is a Ti one inch threaded stem, $25.00 and also a set of near new Suntour XC Pro thumbies. The bike hasn't seen the trails for many years due to me riding my steel Jamis Dragon. I figure since the Bonty is built again the first ride will be tomorrow night on some fireroads and singletrack.

I love Bontragers.


----------



## CANBONSAN (Nov 20, 2006)

*A late entry*

Here is my 90-91 OR. Bought the frameset from Davis Wheelworks in 90 and took delivery in 91. Still sees occasional usage whenever a hard tail is called for. Some ncie bikes on this thread, enjoyed looking.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

CANBONSAN said:


> Here is my 90-91 OR. Bought the frameset from Davis Wheelworks in 90 and took delivery in 91. Still sees occasional usage whenever a hard tail is called for. Some ncie bikes on this thread, enjoyed looking.
> View attachment 217372


Thats a nice one! Love those older ones. The Silca pump, the Mavic underbar shifters, IRD Macaroni stem...cool stuff.

...er maybe I should say silca-esque pump...


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

CANBONSAN said:


> Here is my 90-91 OR. Bought the frameset from Davis Wheelworks in 90 and took delivery in 91. Still sees occasional usage whenever a hard tail is called for. Some ncie bikes on this thread, enjoyed looking.
> View attachment 217372


Where's the original fork?


----------



## CANBONSAN (Nov 20, 2006)

*Hanging in the garage,*



Rumpfy said:


> Where's the original fork?


with the rest.


----------



## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

Here they are.... Race Lite and Race (NOS and post-Trek), both Santa Cruz built.


----------



## Fat Mike (May 28, 2007)

WOW, so many Bontragers in one place!! :thumbsup: 

Why did it take me soooooo long to find you all?

Now, where's my camera.........


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Fat Mike said:


> WOW, so many Bontragers in one place!! :thumbsup:
> 
> Why did it take me soooooo long to find you all?
> 
> Now, where's my camera.........


whatcha got?


----------



## Fat Mike (May 28, 2007)

An XXXL Race ORS in rasta. Nice but well used.


----------



## Repack Rider (Oct 22, 2005)

I'm surprised that no one has posted this.

Mountain Bike Action, 1990.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Repack Rider said:


> I'm surprised that no one has posted this.
> 
> Mountain Bike Action, 1990.


if i had a scanner i could add 7 more pages to this thread


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

more mag link action

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=71061


----------



## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

does anyone have a scan/PDF of the old MBA article on the ti lites?
saw the issue on ebay a while ago, but w/ shipping from canada didn't think it would be worth it for just a few pages that interested me...

thanks.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Repack Rider said:


> I'm surprised that no one has posted this.
> 
> Mountain Bike Action, 1990.


I think someone on this forum owns this very bike. It's turned up here before. Thanks for posting.


----------



## kaalgsio (Sep 21, 2005)

been meaning to upload a pic of mine for a while now.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

My little Privateer S:









Nice stuff, everyone.


----------



## Fat Mike (May 28, 2007)

Here's a couple of mine, called BJ Fungus, The Bogey Bike.

Firstly, brand new before ever being ridden....









And after a 'summer' race some years ago....


----------



## 95bonty (Oct 6, 2004)

that's enormous! funny how the decals look so small along the toptube!


----------



## Fat Mike (May 28, 2007)

95bonty said:


> that's enormous!


It has to be!!!!

I had the chance of buying BJ's brother a few years ago but couldn't afford it at the time.  I wonder where it is now.....


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

I finished this last spring, but I forgot to post the updated picture.


----------



## aka brad (Dec 24, 2003)

I'm guessing a 93 Racelite, cut and weilded as a singlespeed. I got the weight down to 20lbs flat.


----------



## Givemepeppers (May 24, 2007)

Here is my Race still in service. Pic is from last weekend on the Loon Lake loop in Idaho. Gotta love Bonti's,


----------



## SSBonty (Jan 30, 2004)

Just out of interest, what is the deal with the 'factory SS'? Were some of these sold as singlespeeds straight from the factory? Are there any differences between these and the equivalent geared model at the same time? Right now I have two SS bonties using the magic gear, debating at the moment whether to run the race lite with Pace carbon forks and discs, the race with Pace steel forks and a coaster hub rear brake, or (shh) a Proflex 955 singlespeed in the UK SS champs in Bristol this weeked. I may be swayed by the weather - the race lite is the best in the mud, but the course is bone dry at the moment and tough on rigid bikes so maybe I'll lean towrds the proflex (heresy I hear you shout!).

Ian


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

SSBonty said:


> Just out of interest, what is the deal with the 'factory SS'? Were some of these sold as singlespeeds straight from the factory? Are there any differences between these and the equivalent geared model at the same time? Right now I have two SS bonties using the magic gear, debating at the moment whether to run the race lite with Pace carbon forks and discs, the race with Pace steel forks and a coaster hub rear brake, or (shh) a Proflex 955 singlespeed in the UK SS champs in Bristol this weeked. I may be swayed by the weather - the race lite is the best in the mud, but the course is bone dry at the moment and tough on rigid bikes so maybe I'll lean towrds the proflex (heresy I hear you shout!).
> 
> Ian


There are only twelve of them. All converted by Kirk Pacenti when he worked at the SC factory. They are very similar to the geared versions but exceedingly rare.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

SSBonty said:


> Just out of interest, what is the deal with the 'factory SS'?
> 
> Ian


why?

you know where one is?


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Freshly built! New race frame, year, 1996? 9 speed XT, Ilike the gear range, as I ride anywhere fromthe road to eastern singletrack. Picked the parts from what I had, or how they looked. Love the bike! Now I know why Bonty fans are so loyal. (being from MA, I have a FAT and Indy too!) Yes, I know the cables need trimming, I just like to keep them long until all is broken in, or i've made final parts decisions. Will replace the front v-brake as soon as I can locate the proper Marzoke cable hanger.


----------



## Pelican_Racing (Nov 10, 2004)

Nice collection of bikes here. This thread has got me excited about (re)building up this Race I bought last month. Just put frame saver in it today. Have most of the parts lying around ready to go back on. 

Will post pics when done.

-Hong


----------



## SSBonty (Jan 30, 2004)

No leads on one I'm afraid, just interested in what they were - so these were track ended/horizontal dropout conversions done after manufacture but in the same factory? How do you tell they were done their and not elsewhere? Didn't they know about the magic ratios for bonties?! (32:18, 36:18, 40:18 etc)...

Ian


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

SSBonty said:


> No leads on one I'm afraid, just interested in what they were - so these were track ended/horizontal dropout conversions done after manufacture but in the same factory? How do you tell they were done their and not elsewhere? Didn't they know about the magic ratios for bonties?! (32:18, 36:18, 40:18 etc)...
> 
> Ian


its not about magic ratio's, or horizontal dropout OR frames.its about the real deal from the factory ss frame.

i'd kill every one in this room for one.


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

And again I taunt you... 

jw



hollister said:


> its not about magic ratio's, or horizontal dropout OR frames.its about the real deal from the factory ss frame.
> 
> i'd kill every one in this room for one.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

GrumpyOne said:


> And again I taunt you...
> 
> jw


i hate you


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Hey, it took me a bit over 7 years to find one. How long have you been looking? 

jw



hollister said:


> i hate you


----------



## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

GrumpyOne said:


> And again I taunt you...
> 
> jw


STOP IT!!!!

I want my bike back!:madman:


----------



## MAX LLOYD (Jan 8, 2007)

*Bonty Race 96*

Here's mine.Still raced every Friday night!


----------



## LJordan (Jun 23, 2007)

*Love those Bontys*

Bought this Large Privateer S back in 98 for $519.00 at SuperGo on a fixed budget.

I will never part with the bike..........


----------



## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

LJordan said:


> I will never part with the bike..........


hail the privateer!

(but c'mon man, that seat's gotta weigh 4 pounds!)


----------



## LJordan (Jun 23, 2007)

gotdirt said:


> hail the privateer!
> 
> (but c'mon man, that seat's gotta weight 4 pounds!)


Well, the weekend after I purchased the bike. I did 2 all day tickets at Snow Summit Ski Lifts in Big Bear. After which my buns insisted on the marshmellow comfort seat. So to compensate for the added weight of the seat. I reduced my body fat by 2% so I would weighed in at 192 lbs. 24 of which is the bike. :thumbsup:


----------



## lml1x (Jan 13, 2004)

*Race lite*

Race lite with Mt. Tam in the background. Some propaganda as well.


----------



## Mike A (Jan 14, 2007)

Here is my Privateer that I have just turned into a single speed. I love riding this bike!  I bought it new when I worked at a Bike Barn in Houston Tx back in high school. That was a fun job. :thumbsup: Some crappy riding in Houston though. Check out the sweet XTR chain tensioner.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

no, i wont stop looking.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

*OK now*

put it up on BOTM so I can . . .


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

MrOrange said:


> put it up on BOTM so I can . . .


done.

vote early, vote often folks

its time a bonty took home BOTM


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

hollister said:


> no, i wont stop looking.


HAWTTTT!!!!!!

what a great paint scheme btw. industrial, no sillynness.


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

What the heck is BOTM? 

jw



hollister said:


> done.
> 
> vote early, vote often folks
> 
> its time a bonty took home BOTM


----------



## 95bonty (Oct 6, 2004)

BOTM = bike of the month on a certain retrobike site per chance?

and hollister that is very very nice, but put some gears on it ;-)


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

95bonty said:


> BOTM = bike of the month on a certain retrobike site per chance?
> 
> and hollister that is very very nice, but put some gears on it ;-)


i'll put gears on it when i find my holy grail.

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13815

vote!


----------



## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

*One for the masses*

I'm fairly new to the Vintage Board but regularly visited this here thread. About 2 weeks ago I posted looking for ideas on a fork. My plan was to "pimp" my Bontrager for cyclocross on somewhat of a budget instead of just buying a CX bike (and actually considered selling it to purchase said CX bike ut: ). Well, here it is! I really enjoyed building this and tonight got her out on a long overdue singletrack voyage. Kind of felt light hooking up with an old friend. I forget how fricken fast this bike is. :eekster:  Should be good for the CX season. Enjoy the pics!

1. OG Race Lite
2. Love the Judy, not. 
3. Fully rigid
4. Silver bullet
5. New stuff I'd only buy for an old bike


----------



## FTM (Sep 14, 2004)

here's my Race Lite set up for 'cross. Worked quite well but got tired of switching bits around on my mountain bike each cross race so I've got a dedicated 'cross rig for this season.


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

FTM said:


> here's my Race Lite set up for 'cross. Worked quite well but got tired of switching bits around on my mountain bike each cross race so I've got a dedicated 'cross rig for this season.


is there a 700c wheel upfront? if i had a bontrager i would turn it into a 69er.


----------



## FTM (Sep 14, 2004)

> is there a 700c wheel upfront? if i had a bontrager i would turn it into a 69er.


front and back, I was racing fixed so no rear brake needed, but you could run Paul's Moto-Lite V brake in back.


----------



## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

colker1 said:


> if i had a bontrager i would turn it into a 69er.


:thumbsup:


----------



## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

*Pink, that hawt!*

How does it feel on the run-ups? I was having difficulties getting my Race Lite up and on my shoulder last night while practicing. Seems the triangle's a little too small. Of course, I also had a 15 pound camel back on as well.


----------



## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

*a couple of questions...*

until i saw the 2-piece seatstays i thought i was looking at my '96 privateer, which has the same color and graphics ('cept for the addition of the band around the seattube which says "privateer comp").

so i assume those aren't the original decals?

along those lines, i thought that the race/racelites w/ the segmented stays all had the older square-panel decals-- is this true, or did some get the later chevron style?










(guess i don't have any photos handy from before i removed most of the decals, but you can kinda see where they were):


----------



## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

gotdirt said:


> until i saw the 2-piece seatstays i thought i was looking at my '96 privateer, which has the same color and graphics ('cept for the addition of the band around the seattube which says "privateer comp").
> 
> so i assume those aren't the original decals?
> 
> along those lines, i thought that the race/racelites w/ the segmented stays all had the older square-panel decals-- is this true, or did some get the later chevron style?


We stopped using the 2 pc seat stays in late '94 or early '95. I am not sure when they stopped using the square decals, but I am sure it was before I started working there in '94.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

FTM said:


> I was racing fixed


funny, both bonty track bikes i know of are pink.

internal lugged brazed


----------



## <sL4yEr>RuLz (Apr 24, 2004)

The yellow was my third set (ordered in '98-99?). As far as I can remember, the origial blue decals were identical.



gotdirt said:


> until i saw the 2-piece seatstays i thought i was looking at my '96 privateer, which has the same color and graphics ('cept for the addition of the band around the seattube which says "privateer comp").
> 
> so i assume those aren't the original decals?
> 
> ...


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

obionespeedonly said:


> Some people are still keeping their Bonty's rolling and I keep getting asked for this...
> 
> Here's the link to the Bontrager PDF catalog:
> 
> ...


That's sweet, but is there one in English? (The last one, I mean)


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

By the way, does anyone know if Keith keeps a weblog somewhere? He seems to be a good writer / communicator.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> By the way, does anyone know if Keith keeps a weblog somewhere? He seems to be a good writer / communicator.


Years ago he had a "rants" section on bontrager.com that was the pre-blog equivalent of a blog. I'm not aware of any place where he's doing this type of things any more.


----------



## GaryHill (Jan 22, 2005)

He posts occasional diaries of racing exploits on cyclingnews.com, but it has less of the technical stuff than the old rants - presumably so it doesn't look too much like an advert


----------



## Repack Rider (Oct 22, 2005)

I was doing my day job of moving pianos, and one of my customers had this bike in his garage. I asked him about it, and it was obvious he didn't know much about Bontrager.

Turns out that the bike belonged to a high school classmate of mine, who gave it to the current owner when he upgraded a few years ago. I told him that if he decides to unload it, to call me.

It's really light, feels about like my P-21. The former owner changed from Shimano shifters to GripShift.


----------



## rye (Feb 9, 2004)

I just put my race lite up for sale http://classifieds.mtbr.com/showproduct.php?product=13069&cat=4 the photo's didn't post up...


----------



## rye (Feb 9, 2004)

For those who don't know I'm the HRS / Rock Lobster Cyclo-Cross team Mechanic and I've been working for Paul Sadoff / Rock Lobster Cycles on Mondays.

I was helping Paul clean up the shop today and found a box of Bontrager Anti-Chain suck devices he picked up when he bought all the old Bonty tubing from the Santa-Cruz plant... 

Need an original one? We got it, $15+ shipping. Call Paul or e-mail/Private Message me. 

Rye


----------



## Crell (Apr 7, 2004)

rye said:


> Need an original one? We got it, $15+ shipping. Call Paul or e-mail/Private Message me.
> 
> Rye


YHPM :thumbsup:


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I have been told from Trek that there are no more Bontrager decals to be had from them. I'm trying to have some made, but it's kind of expensive to get decent ones due to minimum quantity requirements. Do any of you guys want to maybe pick up a set for your own restoration and help to defray the cost? I'm not sure what it's going to cost yet exactly... I'm having them done at a professional shop and I'm still deciding what color to do. I'm thinking to get just a set of white lettering with black outline and white darts at the ends on a clear background, but I might do silver lettering and black outline on a white outline... pm me if you're interested. I have to do the whole batch in one color, and they won't be pre-cut, but other than that they should be pretty nice.


----------



## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

kenjihara said:


> I have been told from Trek that there are no more Bontrager decals to be had from them. I'm trying to have some made, but it's kind of expensive to get decent ones due to minimum quantity requirements. Do any of you guys want to maybe pick up a set for your own restoration and help to defray the cost? I'm not sure what it's going to cost yet exactly... I'm having them done at a professional shop and I'm still deciding what color to do. I'm thinking to get just a set of white lettering with black outline and white darts at the ends on a clear background, but I might do silver lettering and black outline on a white outline... pm me if you're interested. I have to do the whole batch in one color, and they won't be pre-cut, but other than that they should be pretty nice.


Try contacting Gary Prange of Screen Specialty Shop in North Carolina. He did the Bontrager decals in the past and may have more. The caveat is that he genially only sells them to professional painters for restorations to insure that "counterfeit" bikes aren't being made by applying the decals.

http://www.sssink.com/


----------



## bikewright (Dec 7, 2007)

*Bontrager Restoration Project*

This is a project that I have been wanting to do since I got the bike in 97-98. This is a 1996 Bontrager Privateer Comp (Pre-Trek).It was a full XT build and back in the day ran $1699.00. I received the Frame,Fork and Seat Post from the Bontrager rep. Since the time I got it the paint poped off the chain stays and other places on the frame.

Back in the summer I got the interest to do something with the bike other then hanging on the wall. So I needed to pull all the parts off the bike and find someone to paint the bike. I saw a post on the forum from berrieram of her new painted ride. I made contact with Vince and we where on our way with this project.

I could not find any Bontrager decals for this bike and I tried two online bike decal companies. One did not provide the service and the other would never email or call me back. If you do a project like this PM me and I will let you know who they where so you don't waste your time with them. But I did find a sign shop down at FT Pickett where I work that could do the work and It took about a week to get it done. Learning point number one. Better to take the bike to the sign shop first so they can get all the sizing correct, my mistake.

I just received the bike back from Vince yesterday and what a great job The paint job is better looking than when I got the frame brand new. The red stripes are hand painted and what a great job. Here is a link that shows the bike in its different stages http://vincecarman.com/frame6/. The pictures will not open up to a full view, Vince will be updating the link and I will post the new one so you can see the picyures better.

I will keep updating this post until The project is done.

Before








Damage








Repaint


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## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

bikewright said:


> This is a project that I have been wanting to do since I got the bike in 97-98. This is a 1996 Bontrager Privateer Comp (Pre-Trek).It was a full XT build and back in the day ran $1699.00.


enjoy it...

one point of clarification-- by definition the privateer line is post-trek, as the waterloo production facility allowed KB to offer this frame at that pricepoint.

(and fwiw, yours was a tad cheaper than mine-- if memory serves, i paid $1800 for mine in NYC).


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## SuperClyde (Mar 19, 2004)

I have an orange Bontrager Race that I love, but I've always liked the cherry red color more but could never find one back in 1998 so I settled on the orange.

Now I'm thinking of getting my bike powercoated cherry red, exactly like Keith had it.

Question: I know nothing about paint jobs, will the powercoating shop I take it to know how to match the original cherry red color? Is there a specific paint or shade that Bontgrager used back then?

Thanks for any input.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

and so it begins


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

That's a unique seatpost binder setup. And are the gussets non-standard too?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

laffeaux said:


> That's a unique seatpost binder setup. And are the gussets non-standard too?


head tube gussets lack the cutout along the edges. monostay is capped

seller says he worked at the factory, explained that the seatpost binder was done as a result of worries about muddy conditions(faces front)


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## Mike A (Jan 14, 2007)

Congrats, I know you have been looking for a looooong time.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Mike A said:


> Congrats, I know you have been looking for a looooong time.


understatement

and thanks

now, who's got a silver no logo...


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

hollister said:


> understatement
> 
> and thanks
> 
> now, who's got a silver no logo...


and you've got a classy grey. timeless. bonty fork? m900 cranks? salsa stem stem? suntour post? phil wood wheels?


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## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> That's a unique seatpost binder setup. And are the gussets non-standard too?


it's clearly a fake...


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

colker1 said:


> and you've got a classy grey. timeless. bonty fork? m900 cranks? salsa stem stem? suntour post? phil wood wheels?


Sounds like a perfect start there. Glad you finally landed one, Hollister.


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## kb11 (Mar 29, 2004)

I realized I havent posted my Bonty to the Official Bonty thread, 
so here we go  A '93/'94 Race Lite, all M900 XTR/ Nukeproof 
SuperFly Hubs/ Sun CR18 rims, I've swapped out the stem for 
a Salsa since these pics. This is a rider and I'm very pleased,
not whippy at all. 




























At Keysville '08


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

kb11 said:


> I realized I havent posted my Bonty to the Official Bonty thread,
> so here we go  A '93/'94 Race Lite, all M900 XTR/ Nukeproof
> SuperFly Hubs/ Sun CR18 rims, I've swapped out the stem for
> a Salsa since these pics. This is a rider and I'm very pleased,
> ...


nice steerer tube! and a sweet looking bike


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

hollister said:


> understatement
> 
> and thanks
> 
> now, who's got a silver no logo...


I do.


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## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

Even though I posted a big thread of my own about the restoration on this, I guess I should add it to the "official" thread...to make it official?  '93 Race Light, newly painted and re-built this spring, details can be found here: https://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=392929


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## 29bri (Nov 30, 2005)

My first. 92 Race?


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## bikewright (Dec 7, 2007)

*The finished Project*

Just finished my project bike. Going to take it on a 50 mile ride on the C&O Canal this weekend. Here is the list of the set-up and pic's

96 Bontrager Privateer Comp frame 18"
Paint by Vince
Decals by sign shop at FT. Pickett
Face & chase of the BB and headtube-CED
Crank- old Bontrager 8 speed
Chain Stay- Carbon IRD
Front D- Old top pull XT
Rear D- Old 9.0 ESP 8 speed
Wheels- Cane Creek Used
Front Fork- Custom steel Waltworks
Headset- 1"Black Chris King
Stem- 1" Kelly
Bar- Ritchey WCS Raiser
Brakes- Avid 7's with FR 5 Levers
Shifters- NOS 9.0 ESP 8 speed 
Grips- WTB Dual Compound
Housing- Jagwire Black 
Seat Clamp- Salsa Black
Seat Post- Thompson
Saddle- NOS WTB SSK
Chain- Sram 8 speed
[/ATTACH]


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

ciao
flo


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## M_2 (May 14, 2008)

*My humble addition...*

Well, I finally go my '96 Privateer back together. I have been riding it a lot lately. THought I needed to finally get some pics up...What do ya think I should do with this thing? Definitely needs a paint job, though... :thumbsup:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

M_2 said:


> Well, I finally go my '96 Privateer back together. I have been riding it a lot lately. THought I needed to finally get some pics up...What do ya think I should do with this thing? Definitely needs a paint job, though... :thumbsup:


Don't paint it, keep riding it.

Good for you for going full rigid!


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

*One more...*

As posted before separately here,

https://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=405818


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

DoubleCentury said:


> As posted before separately here,
> 
> https://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=405818


beauty. as always.

now somebody (coughhollistercough) needs to show us a recent Santa Cruz built acquisition...


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Fillet-brazed said:


> now somebody (coughhollistercough) needs to show us a recent Santa Cruz built acquisition...


still waiting on a tracking #

(word travels fast on the VRC underground)


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

hollister said:


> still waiting on a tracking #
> 
> (word travels fast on the VRC underground)


hey, this will be your first complete vintage bike? 

Shipping? I think that guy is pretty close to you. Or at least he used to be.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Fillet-brazed said:


> hey, this will be your first complete vintage bike?
> 
> Shipping? I think that guy is pretty close to you. Or at least he used to be.


don't worry

I'm also getting another project, to maintain the balance of the force


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## haggis1978 (Nov 12, 2005)

*Race Lite*

Here's my '96 Race Lite. She's stripped at the moment awaiting a new coat of paint but should be up and running again soon.


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## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

haggis1978 said:


> Here's my '96 Race Lite. She's stripped at the moment awaiting a new coat of paint but should be up and running again soon.


Holy seatpost Batman!


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## twelvethirtyone (Jan 18, 2007)

*Bontrager Ti Lite, Pimped*

I finally finished this build. It's all back to 8 speed but I did make some upgrades (wheels). Other than that, though, it's all the NOS I've been collecting over the past few years.

Frame: Bontrager Ti Lite 
Fork: '98 SID - Hippie Tech full rebuild - the plushest 63mm ever. . .
Rims: Mavic 821
Hubs: Chris King
Quick Release: Salsa
Tires: Hutchinson Python
Pedals: Time Ti
Crank: Cook Bros. F
Chain: Wipperman 8 Speed
Chainrings: Moonhead Machine Works (RIP)
Rear Cogs: XTR 8 Speed
Bottom Bracket: Square
Front Derailleur: XTR
Rear Derailleur: Paul
Shifters: XTR 8 speed
Handlebars: Bontrager Crow Bar Ti
Grips: Pedros Dice Vice
Stem: Moots 100mm
Headset: Chris King
Brake set: XTR
Brake levers: XTR
Saddle: Selle Italia
Seat Post: Syncros Ti
Seat Post Clamp: Salsa
Paint: Raw (Brushed) Ti
Size: L
Serial #: Yes
Place of Origin: Washington State to Santa Cruz as I recall. . . .


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## jeffgothro (Mar 10, 2007)

I have no pics, but mine was deep dark purple, with silver panel stickers.


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## alexk (Sep 30, 2005)

floibex said:


> ciao
> flo


That is gorgeous Flo. Great use of colour and I bet it's a treat to ride. :thumbsup:


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

alexk said:


> That is gorgeous Flo. Great use of colour and I bet it's a treat to ride. :thumbsup:


thanks alex  yes, its a great ride. brought memories back. 
was a 3 night built before a small classic gathering in southern germany near bad urach, home of magura brakes.









by bonelesschicken

one of two existing pure rohloff ritcheys 

more photo's here. we rode some of the magura testing trails and passed nearly all photo spots you'll find in the 2008 magura catalog.

more of the riding area, swabian moutains, here









by reiner kuenstle

ciao
flo


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## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

hollister said:


> funny, both bonty track bikes i know of are pink.


The only one I know of is (was) black. It belonged to Brian Whitcomb who rode professionally on the track back in the mid-90's, but I have no idea what he's up to now, or where this bike is. It's kind of hard to see in this photo, but it's the only one I have of his Bonty track bike. I took this photo at the Northbrook, Illinois velodrome back in 1994:


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## jdoiv (Sep 12, 2005)

Hi Guys,
Here are a couple of bad shots of my "92 OR Lite. I bought it new in "92 and spoke directly with Keith when I made the order. Originally had it built up with a Manitou fork, Suntour XC Pro Grease Guard components, Sram Grip Shift and Nuke Proof Hubs. I've since changed out the Manitou for a Marzocchi and upgraded the drive train and rear wheel to Sram rear mech and Mavic Cross Max UST Wheel. Only a couple of blemishes on it. A small ding on one of the seat stays from towing the kids in a Burley trailer and a scratch on the top tube that needs to be sanded and touched up. Could use some new decals too.



















Also, anybody know where the serial number is on one of these. I looked the other night and couldn't find it. I did find all of the original paperwork and receipt. Funny, the Manitou fork was only a $35 upgrade.


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Here's my 1994 Medium Race w/1997 Marzocchi Z2 fork (65mm travel)










The bike now has XTR M900 cranks on it.

Marzocchi still has parts for these old forks -- I bought this one via Ebay and sent it to them in Valencia, CA where they replaced the seals.

I wanted one of these bikes for a LONG time... I had the pleasure of interviewing at Bontrager Cycles in early fall of 1994. I slept on KB's couch for a weekend and basically hung out at the shop, went riding, and ate Mexican food the whole time. Best job interview I ever had, even if I didn't get the job in the end! I found this frame on the local CL in 1999 for $200 and snapped it up.

Now I'm looking for a Large Race or Privateer frame...


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jimgskoop said:


> Here's my 1994 Medium Race w/1997 Marzocchi Z2 fork (65mm travel)
> 
> The bike now has XTR M900 cranks on it.
> 
> ...


Great story, neat bike. :thumbsup:


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Anybody care to take a guess at what the deal with this frame on Ebay is?!? Seller claims it's a NOS Race Lite, and while it does appear to be an XL Race Lite, there's only one set of water-bottle cage bolts (and those are missing the threaded inserts), plus the paint and decals are wrong (looks like BMX decals?). Is it maybe a Nontrager?


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## muddybuddy (Jan 31, 2007)

jimgskoop said:


> Anybody care to take a guess at what the deal with this frame on Ebay is?!? Seller claims it's a NOS Race Lite, and while it does appear to be an XL Race Lite, there's only one set of water-bottle cage bolts (and those are missing the threaded inserts), plus the paint and decals are wrong (looks like BMX decals?). Is it maybe a Nontrager?


For what its worth, I've dealt with that seller a couple times in the last few months, and he does not see to be the type to intentionally misrepresent an item.


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## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

jimgskoop said:


> Anybody care to take a guess at what the deal with this frame on Ebay is?!? Seller claims it's a NOS Race Lite, and while it does appear to be an XL Race Lite, there's only one set of water-bottle cage bolts (and those are missing the threaded inserts), plus the paint and decals are wrong (looks like BMX decals?). Is it maybe a Nontrager?


Pretty sure it's not a Nontrager, Paul would never let anything roll out of his shop that wasn't completed. When the Bontrager shop closed up there were probably lots of frames sitting around in various stages of completion. My bet would be this is one of those frames.

I like the green color.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jimgskoop said:


> Anybody care to take a guess at what the deal with this frame on Ebay is?!? Seller claims it's a NOS Race Lite, and while it does appear to be an XL Race Lite, there's only one set of water-bottle cage bolts (and those are missing the threaded inserts), plus the paint and decals are wrong (looks like BMX decals?). Is it maybe a Nontrager?


I've met that seller in person and he is genuinely a stand up guy.

I'm not all that surprised that a Bontrager would slip out of the shop with some unfinished details. Could be a later SC frame and they rushed it. One that was left over that got different paint and whatever decals were close.
It could even be a respray for all we know.

No shortage of Bontrager anomalies out there.


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## Cactus Jack (Nov 29, 2005)

What rumpfy and muddybuddy said......I've bought a few things from the seller; great to deal with.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> I've met that seller in person and he is genuinely a stand up guy.
> 
> I'm not all that surprised that a Bontrager would slip out of the shop with some unfinished details. Could be a later SC frame and they rushed it. One that was left over that got different paint and whatever decals were close.
> It could even be a respray for all we know.
> ...


Absolutely. I have one that came out of the shop after production had finished. It has a one-off paint and came without bottle mounts as well. The story I heard was that the some employees that were let go were sent off with free frames. Some of these got one-off paint jobs. I gathered it wasn't really an official thing, just something one of the welders and the paint guy put together.

I bought mine around this time at a used bike shop in SC. I heard the story from the guy who ran the shop but it was confirmed by a Bontrager employee when I went by and asked if I could get bottle mounts.

Still, could be a respray, ask for photos that would confirm whether a BB or HS has been installed. Could confirm a respray.

cheers


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> What rumpfy and muddybuddy said......I've bought a few things from the seller; great to deal with.


Good to know. Just for the record, I didn't mean to imply that I was questioning the integrity of the seller -- that's definitely a Bontrager frame, IMHO -- just wondering about the story behind the bike, in light of the unusual paint and the incomplete bottle cage mount.

Sounds like it may very well be one of the "closing-shop" frames!

Thanks for the insights!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Rumpfy said:


> No shortage of Bontrager anomalies out there.


 .


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## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

The fact that it has one piece seat stays leads me to believe it's at a post-Trek frame, and probably one of the last ones based on what others have said above. Still nice, and my size... :thumbsup:


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## beewee (Mar 17, 2008)

here is my old faithful


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

beewee said:


> here is my old faithful


Nice -- what fork is that?


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Check out this nice Bontrager 69er hack!


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## beewee (Mar 17, 2008)

jimgskoop said:


> Nice -- what fork is that?


I had Curtis Inglis (Retrotec) make me a "Bontrager" specific 1" threadless fork for it.


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*The age-old Bonty fork question*

Hi all,
Just discovered this forum. Nice to "meet" other Bonty fans. I'm in the process of replacing the Judy on my Race Lite. I'm considering a White Brothers Magic 80 with a custom a/c to match the fork-to-crown length on the Judy. However, needless to say the fork doesn't match the Bontrager 1.25 (32mm) rake. It has 36mm rake (offset). I know I'm not the first to face this dilemma, so can someone weigh in on how (or if) the handling is changed when increasing the off-set? Should I worry about 4mm?
cheers,
Fred


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

fredlf said:


> Hi all,
> Just discovered this forum. Nice to "meet" other Bonty fans. I'm in the process of replacing the Judy on my Race Lite. I'm considering a White Brothers Magic 80 with a custom a/c to match the fork-to-crown length on the Judy. However, needless to say the fork doesn't match the Bontrager 1.25 (32mm) rake. It has 36mm rake (offset). I know I'm not the first to face this dilemma, so can someone weigh in on how (or if) the handling is changed when increasing the off-set? Should I worry about 4mm?
> cheers,
> Fred


4mm is virtually nothing -- I wouldn't worry about it.

Are you able to get the White Bros fork with a 1-inch steerer?!?


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*1" steerer*



jimgskoop said:


> 4mm is virtually nothing -- I wouldn't worry about it.
> 
> Are you able to get the White Bros fork with a 1-inch steerer?!?


Yes I am! It has to be custom directly through White Bros. so you have to pay full (!) retail plus an extra $50 for the custom work. I guess I'm going to go for it. Anyone wanna buy a blown Judy with the Bonty 1.25 crown?

Thanks for the answer. I suspected as much, but I'm so nervous about changing the ride of this bike. It just feels so damn right. I swear on good days it feels like the bike just disappears beneath me and I'm just floating through the woods. On bad days, it doesn't matter what I ride...


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## P'sanbiker (May 15, 2006)

PM'd you.


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## mrmo (Mar 24, 2004)

Bikes are still going, got a small rust hole in the back of the races seat tube. Don't think it is an issue and have cleaned it to stop it getting worse, mud had come down the easton seatpost and collected on the bottle cage mount bolt.

got a set of Englund cartridge Black Crown Judies and a set of original silver on white stickers. Just got to figure out what to do with them. Ithink the race(red one) needs a repaint as it is looking tired.


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## freshy37 (Nov 19, 2008)

*Vintage Bontrager Race for sale*

I have four Bontragers for sale. Call me at 831-435-9376. I also have Bontrager B-dot stickers,complete frame sticker kits and Lapel pins. Go here to have a look

http://classifieds.mtbr.com/showproduct.php?product=27680&cat=500


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

*Bontrager info needed*

I'm new here and see that there are a number of Bontrager people that are familiar with some of the earlier Bontrager OR bikes.
I have a picture of the bike and since I am not familiar with this forum, I hope I have attached them properly. I have had this bike for a couple years, I have not ridden it on trails, mostly street riding and it is in excellent condition. I'm interested in knowing where I'd find the serial number, I've looked in the usual places and there is nothing. I'd love to know when it might have been fabricated. Any one know anything about this bike?

























Thanks for the help.
RagaMuffin


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Heh. Just saw that one on Ebay earlier today. The serial number should be stamped on the inside of the left rear dropout. Look for a four-digit number.


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

You're right, it is on eBay! What do you think it is worth? Beginning to think it was built in 1990. I saw a few pages back a copy of a sales brochure that that describes my bike to a "T". Beginning to think I better not let it go, at least not now. :???:


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Your bike is a 1993 or 1994, based on what frame details I can make out, and the components (e.g., that black LX derailleur was produced starting in 1993, I think).

What's it worth? That's a tough one, since the bike is an XS -- it's either going to be too small for most, or just the right size for one lucky person!


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

RagaMuffin said:


> You're right, it is on eBay! What do you think it is worth? Beginning to think it was built in 1990. I saw a few pages back a copy of a sales brochure that that describes my bike to a "T". Beginning to think I better not let it go, at least not now. :???:


Please read the stickys at the top of this forum.

IMO, it won't sell for much.


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

Ok, I'm new here, different type of board for me, what did I do wrong please?


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## muddybuddy (Jan 31, 2007)

RagaMuffin said:


> Ok, I'm new here, different type of board for me, what did I do wrong please?


To put it simply, it is generally frowned upon to ask the value of something you intend to sell. Especially an item that is currently listed on ebay. It basically comes of looking like you are calling attention to your ad which is against forum rules, unless you pay for a classified ad on the forum.

The reason your bike will probably not sell for much, is that mid 90s Bontys dont seem to make big money to begin with, and the very small size means that it would fit few adults and it will probably be too expensive and too large to be a kid's bike.


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

That was not my intention to draw attention to a possible sale. I was instead directed to this web site by a buyer on eBay who thought this bike might be indeed of more value than I realized which means that I would instead, keep the bike for my son's future use.

Thank you for that info though, I will remember it.
R


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

What the heck is going on with that stem?

Bontragers are simply not made anymore. The one you have will be a total "find" for someone small. Keep it, as it will only go up in value, but it's not going to make you Daddy Warbucks. But, it will make one heck of a bike for your son!

Since you are here, look at the Official Bontrager thread. That will give you an education of sorts on the bike. Yours looks like a pre-trek california version, more desirable than the trek "privateers". if it's a race -lite version, it's even more so. Look to see if the head tube is machined, indicating a "lite" model.

The parts on your bike are not top shelf, but that frame is nice!


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

Thanks for that info, I have to figure out how to tell if it is machined or not, I'll let you know.:thumbsup: 
R


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## muddybuddy (Jan 31, 2007)

Who knows? If you get a couple VRC midgets in a bidding war you might make out pretty well.


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## elrancho66 (May 31, 2007)

*serial # help please*

I have a Bonty frame with the serial # 9481, stamped on the rear dropouts,,,,,,,,,,any ideas on what year it might be? i'll try to post a few fotos soon
thanks:thumbsup:


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Serial numbers don't mean much on Bontragers.


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## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

1993 Race Lite. It was originally built with a nice selection of 90's parts...full M737 XT, Bontrager fork, original Bontrager stem and seat post, Syncros cranks, etc, etc. I worked in a bike shop in college and bought all the cool stuff I could afford. I was an idiot and sold off most of that stuff along with 3 more sets of 7spd XT thumbies, a couple sets of barely used XT cranks, a couple sets of XT cantis, a bunch of XT 7spd cassettes, another Race Lite frame, 2 bontrager forks, etc. I sold a big box of killer parts a few years ago when I got out of cycling and focused on family and work. It was the right choice at the time, but I wish I had kept all that stuff! Fortunately I kept this frame and a few parts! The plan is to sell of the newer stuff...mostly M950/952 XTR, Thompson, etc and build it back with early 90's XT/XTR.

Here it is today:









Here are the wheels that are going back on it. Fortunately I kept these! I laced up a set of M737 XT hubs to an original set of Bontrager/Weinmann BXC red and blue dot rims and American Classic old skewers. Still nice and true after all these years.









And yes, I know my top tube decal is backwards!


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

pint said:


> 1993 Race Lite. It was originally built with a nice selection of 90's parts...full M737 XT, Bontrager fork, original Bontrager stem and seat post, Syncros cranks, etc, etc. I worked in a bike shop in college and bought all the cool stuff I could afford. I was an idiot and sold off most of that stuff along with 3 more sets of 7spd XT thumbies, a couple sets of barely used XT cranks, a couple sets of XT cantis, a bunch of XT 7spd cassettes, another Race Lite frame, 2 bontrager forks, etc. I sold a big box of killer parts a few years ago when I got out of cycling and focused on family and work. It was the right choice at the time, but I wish I had kept all that stuff! Fortunately I kept this frame and a few parts! The plan is to sell of the newer stuff...mostly M950/952 XTR, Thompson, etc and build it back with early 90's XT/XTR.
> 
> Thats gonna be alot of fun. I actually still ride that Marzocchi on one of my bonti's and I find that they are much better than forks from other manufacturers that were on the market at the time.


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## al415 (Mar 17, 2007)

Hey Pint, I have the same frame. At least in a medium, same wheels too. Amazing how well they have held up after all these years.


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

Do you happen to know exactly how old this frame is? Was yours purchased as a complete bike?
R


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## al415 (Mar 17, 2007)

RagaMuffin said:


> Do you happen to know exactly how old this frame is? Was yours purchased as a complete bike?
> R


Mine was _around_ a 1996. It came with a complete XT group and a Judy. The Judy has the black Bontrager crown. The seatpost and stem were Bontrager house brand. Bontrager / San-Marco saddle. Bontrager grips and bar ends.


----------



## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

If you go back to page 7 there is a brochure from 1990 which show my bike exactly. I was thrilled to find that. Mine had been in a box for a number of years and was then given to me unassembled. I had it assembled and rode it on the street for a short time. It is a great bike but I'm realizing I am not able to ride the rough trails any more. 
R


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

RagaMuffin said:


> If you go back to page 7 there is a brochure from 1990 which show my bike exactly. I was thrilled to find that.
> R


Nope, yours is newer than a 1990...and it is a race lite (able to see the scalloped tubing on the headtube on your pictures on eBay)


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

What makes you say it is newer? Just curious since the brochure has the same bike appearance, components as well.
R


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

RagaMuffin said:


> What makes you say it is newer? Just curious since the brochure has the same bike appearance, components as well.
> R


http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/


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## RagaMuffin (Dec 1, 2008)

Thank you, that was very helpful. Mine is indeed, according to your pictures, either a Race or Race Lite. Interesting how it has the OR on the decal though. Still is a very nice frame and is excellent condition, no scratches or gouges and decals are perfect. 
R


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

RagaMuffin said:


> Still is a very nice frame and is excellent condition, no scratches or gouges and decals are perfect.
> R


Mediocre parts, awkward build. 
But if you find a short Bontrager lover, you've got a chance. Almost better off selling as a frame/fork.


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## mbmb65 (Jan 13, 2004)

pint said:


> 1993 Race Lite. It was originally built with a nice selection of 90's parts...full M737 XT, Bontrager fork, original Bontrager stem and seat post, Syncros cranks, etc, etc. I worked in a bike shop in college and bought all the cool stuff I could afford. I was an idiot and sold off most of that stuff along with 3 more sets of 7spd XT thumbies, a couple sets of barely used XT cranks, a couple sets of XT cantis, a bunch of XT 7spd cassettes, another Race Lite frame, 2 bontrager forks, etc. I sold a big box of killer parts a few years ago when I got out of cycling and focused on family and work. It was the right choice at the time, but I wish I had kept all that stuff! Fortunately I kept this frame and a few parts! The plan is to sell of the newer stuff...mostly M950/952 XTR, Thompson, etc and build it back with early 90's XT/XTR.
> 
> Here it is today:
> 
> ...


Soooo, I'am curious. I never knew Thomson made a 1" threadless stem. What size/rise is it? Whaddaya want for it? Selling the fork too? Disc tabs? How much? Sweet frame btw. Mines beat to hell! I think mines prettier!


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

mbmb65 said:


> Soooo, I'am curious. I never knew Thomson made a 1" threadless stem. What size/rise is it? Whaddaya want for it? Selling the fork too? Disc tabs? How much? Sweet frame btw. Mines beat to hell! I think mines prettier!


Take it off line or to PM's. No 'for sale' spam or propositioning in the forums please.


----------



## alexk (Sep 30, 2005)

mbmb65 said:


> Soooo, I'am curious. I never knew Thomson made a 1" threadless stem. What size/rise is it? Whaddaya want for it? Selling the fork too? Disc tabs? How much? Sweet frame btw. Mines beat to hell! I think mines prettier!


Probably using a shim to allow the the 1" steerer to be used with a 1 & 1/8" stem.


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## mbmb65 (Jan 13, 2004)

alexk said:


> Probably using a shim to allow the the 1" steerer to be used with a 1 & 1/8" stem.


You're probably right. Didn't think of that.


----------



## mbmb65 (Jan 13, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Take it off line or to PM's. No 'for sale' spam or propositioning in the forums please.


Righto. Sorry for the improper proposition!


----------



## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

mbmb65 said:


> You're probably right. Didn't think of that.


Yes, using a shim. Hopefully I won't be once I find an old Bontrager stem!


----------



## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

The rebuild of my 93 Race lite is nearing completion. Just waiting on a 26.8 seatpost. Is it "acceptable" to use the Marzocchi Bomber? Will probably go back to a Bontrager rigid eventually, but I really like this fork. Not sure of the exact year, but I'm pretty sure it's close to period correct?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

pint said:


> The rebuild of my 93 Race lite is nearing completion. Just waiting on a 26.8 seatpost. Is it "acceptable" to use the Marzocchi Bomber? Will probably go back to a Bontrager rigid eventually, but I really like this fork. Not sure of the exact year, but I'm pretty sure it's close to period correct?


I think a Bomber will make that a great ride, and isn't that what it's all about?


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

pint said:


> The rebuild of my 93 Race lite is nearing completion. Just waiting on a 26.8 seatpost. Is it "acceptable" to use the Marzocchi Bomber? Will probably go back to a Bontrager rigid eventually, but I really like this fork. Not sure of the exact year, but I'm pretty sure it's close to period correct?


Please post photos when you're done -- I picked up a '93 Race Lite earlier this year (haven't built it up yet, the frame needs some TLC first) and would love to compare notes.

I use a 1997 Bomber on my Race and it works great. I specifically chose the 1997 year because it "only" has 65mm of travel, which is what the Bontrager frames were designed for. I think 1998 Bombers had 70mm of travel, and after that they moved to 80mm. I'm not 100% positive on that though, I'd have to dig through the old owners manuals to check the specs. But many folks use later-year Bombers on their Bontys, and just set up the fork with a bit more sag to preserve the front-end geometry.

-Jim G


----------



## Hpirx (Jan 15, 2009)

Just found this Thread! OMG! Brings back sweet memories, but more importantly can my 1990 frame w/ a cracked seat tube be resurrected? After 10,000 miles of riding it broke in 2000 but I never had the heart to throw the old girl out. Sleeping in the attic w/ the original Rockshox w/ Keith's custom crown. Might have to replace the chainstays too! Rode through alotta wet NE winters. Man that bike went through so many funky parts! Paragon Ti BB, IRDs, Westpines, even had an 8-speed cog cobbled together in 91' (wheel promptly disintegrated on the first big downhill). Stuck with the original fork though. Sorry, sniff, nostalgia is creeping in. Maybe I shoud just stick it over the mantle


----------



## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

I'd give Rock Lobster a call: http://www.rocklobstercycles.com/contact.php

Paul Sadoff acquired much of the left-over tubing from Keith Bontrager when they closed the Santa Cruz shop, and he may still have some original stock to fix your's with. That was a long time ago, so it's a long shot, but it can't hurt to ask.


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

-Anomie- said:


> I'd give Rock Lobster a call: http://www.rocklobstercycles.com/contact.php
> 
> Paul Sadoff acquired much of the left-over tubing from Keith Bontrager when they closed the Santa Cruz shop, and he may still have some original stock to fix your's with. That was a long time ago, so it's a long shot, but it can't hurt to ask.


Beat me to it Anomie. I was going to suggest the same thing, I recently purchased one of Paul Sadoff's olld Nontrager frames which was made out of a Bontrager tubed front triangle and a rear end of his own making welded together. I brought it down to his shop to appease his curiosity as he likes to see his ol' handiwork. The first thing he did is look over the the junction where the seattube meets the seatstays and the toptube. In his mind this was an area notorious for failures at least on the Bontrager Race Lite models. Since he had such a good eye for this, seems like he would be the man to fix any failures in this are as well.

G'luck


----------



## mrkawasaki (Aug 2, 2006)

*Another Bontrager*

Any model and date knowledge appreciated...

Mr K


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

mrkawasaki said:


> Any model and date knowledge appreciated...
> 
> Mr K


Fork is a Tange switchblade, not a bontrager. Looks like there is a headtube relief which would make it a racelite. We would need detail photos to be sure though. From one photo, the wishbone sorta looks privateerish but I think it is just the picture.

The sticker set is really old, definately from before that frame. I would have loved those on their own.


----------



## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

... no front derailleur pulley, no segemented seatstays as far as I can see -> so 95 or later i assume.

ciao
flo


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Rear brake cable stop on the monostay removed? or was it never there?

Never there means later Trek made (but would have to be 1 1/8 head tube)


Need a detail shot of:

Head Tube front

Front Der area (to see if it has pulley)

Rear Seat stays (to see if they are stepped) 


Wasn't there more info on it over on RetroBike? I seem to remember . . .


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

MrOrange said:


> Rear brake cable stop on the monostay removed? or was it never there?
> 
> Never there means later Trek made (but would have to be 1 1/8 head tube)
> 
> ...


The first few years Trek made them with a 1" head tube.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> The first few years Trek made them with a 1" head tube.


Yer right.

96 the Privateer and Privateer S and those were both 1"

97 the Privateer Comp, Privateer S and Privateer in 1 1/8

98 the Privateer Comp, Privateer S and Privateer in 1 1/8

99 the Privateer Comp, Privateer S and Privateer in 1 1/8


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Front Der cable guide location suggests that it is later one - on Pulley versions the guide was at about 2:00 (looking down at the seat tube with bike pointed in front of you)

Later bikes at about 5:30-6:00 O'Clock . . . 

From the pics - looks like a 1 1/8" head tube to me.

Hey MrK . . . . give us a bone here . . .:madman:


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

MrOrange said:


> Yer right.
> 
> 96 the Privateer and Privateer S and those were both 1"
> 
> ...


I own two 97 Privateer S's, the burgundy model with RockShox Indy XC, and they both have a 1" steerer tube. They don't, however, have the canti brake cable hanger on the seat stay. Same with the green Privateer Comp I have of the same year. I'm fairly certain that 98 was the year they went 1 1/8".

If I could pick, I'd probably want a Privateer from '96, when they still had the canti hanger (I build up one for my cousin Dan) and one of the more recent ones, so I wouldn't have to whine about selection of forks. I've got an Indy XC still on one, the RockShox Judy XC on the Comp, and a Marzocchi MX on the other Privateer S (still in the works).

I do have an original pre-Trek Bontrager also, I guess it's a Race, with a pulley and horizontal dropouts. It's been powdercoated blue and has reproduction decals. Might sell that one.


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> I own two 97 Privateer S's, the burgundy model with RockShox Indy XC, and they both have a 1" steerer tube. They don't, however, have the canti brake cable hanger on the seat stay. Same with the green Privateer Comp I have of the same year. I'm fairly certain that 98 was the year they went 1 1/8".
> 
> If I could pick, I'd probably want a Privateer from '96, when they still had the canti hanger (I build up one for my cousin Dan) and one of the more recent ones, so I wouldn't have to whine about selection of forks. I've got an Indy XC still on one, the RockShox Judy XC on the Comp, and a Marzocchi MX on the other Privateer S (still in the works).
> 
> I do have an original pre-Trek Bontrager also, I guess it's a Race, with a pulley and horizontal dropouts. It's been powdercoated blue and has reproduction decals. Might sell that one.


Easy for me to mix up. you are right - typo on my part. 97 = 1".

Anyway, we need MrK to pipe in and give us more data on what he has.

edit: found an earlier pic of the bike over on RetroBike
Does not have the bigger dropouts of the 98,99 trek made ones . . .


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I like the color and decal combo on the bike.


----------



## mrkawasaki (Aug 2, 2006)

*Apologies!*

Sorry bone eaters - I'm travelling at the moment and won't be able to get photos requested until next week. Will do then - promise!

Mr K


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## rolson6432 (Dec 16, 2008)

*vintage bontrager forks*

Have some Bontrager straight blade forks, circa 1988-89. Any idea what these are worth, if anything.


----------



## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

rolson6432 said:


> Have some Bontrager straight blade forks, circa 1988-89. Any idea what these are worth, if anything.


They're absolutely worthless. 

I've sent you a PM.

Oh - and take a look at the stickies at the top of the VRC forum. Ain't supposed to be askin' WIW here.


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## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

I took a rag and lemon Pledge to the '90 Bonty Race I picked up yesterday, and decided to pose it with the '95 Race and Race Lite I own as the sun was setting today. The shots are pretty contrasty, but these seem to OK enough to post up. I still haven't completed the build of the middle bike (Race); it's been in virtual mock-up for almost 4 years, now!


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

*Some Marzocchi fork specs...*



jimgskoop said:


> Please post photos when you're done -- I picked up a '93 Race Lite earlier this year (haven't built it up yet, the frame needs some TLC first) and would love to compare notes.
> 
> I use a 1997 Bomber on my Race and it works great. I specifically chose the 1997 year because it "only" has 65mm of travel, which is what the Bontrager frames were designed for. I think 1998 Bombers had 70mm of travel, and after that they moved to 80mm. I'm not 100% positive on that though, I'd have to dig through the old owners manuals to check the specs. But many folks use later-year Bombers on their Bontys, and just set up the fork with a bit more sag to preserve the front-end geometry.
> 
> -Jim G


OK, I dug through the manuals and copied down the specs...

http://yojimg.net/bike/equipment/forks/


----------



## YETIFIED (May 4, 2005)

scooderdude said:


> I took a rag and lemon Pledge to the '90 Bonty Race I picked up yesterday, and decided to pose it with the '95 Race and Race Lite I own as the sun was setting today. The shots are pretty contrasty, but these seem to OK enough to post up. I still haven't completed the build of the middle bike (Race); it's been in virtual mock-up for almost 4 years, now!


Horn Doggie, I'm sorry, I forget how many nice bikes you have. Thanks for bringing the new steed by for a lookie and little scoot today, it felt great.:thumbsup:


----------



## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

Here's an update of my 1993 Race Lite I've been rebuilding back to close to original spec. I'm using a newer King headset, Crank Bros pedals, an 8 speed freehub body on a M732 XT rear with XTR cassette and Paul's mounts for Dura Ace 8 speed thumbies. It may go all the way back to "stock", but I was tired of digging for parts. Still needs a final tune, cables trimmed, etc. I know the toptube decal is backwards, but it will stay that way until I find a replacement!


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

pint said:


> Here's an update of my 1993 Race Lite I've been rebuilding back to close to original spec. I'm using a newer King headset, Crank Bros pedals, an 8 speed freehub body on a M732 XT rear with XTR cassette and Paul's mounts for Dura Ace 8 speed thumbies. It may go all the way back to "stock", but I was tired of digging for parts. Still needs a final tune, cables trimmed, etc. I know the toptube decal is backwards, but it will stay that way until I find a replacement!
> 
> View attachment 432734


Very nice! Is that definitely a '93? Which year did they stop doing the horizontal dropouts? Cool bike


----------



## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

kenjihara said:


> Very nice! Is that definitely a '93? Which year did they stop doing the horizontal dropouts? Cool bike


Pretty sure it's a 93. However, I did buy this one used about 5 years ago. It came with the original paperwork all from 93, but you never know. A few NOS parts I recently rounded up: Onza Porcs, XT M735 derailleurs, Bontrager Race stem, Bontrager/Titec Ti 118 bar, Synchros Ti BB, Tange Switchblade fork. Waiting to find a perfect Bonti fork, but couldn't wait any longer! Some day...


----------



## Guest (Feb 16, 2009)

the fork tool box thread reminded me that i had scanned in these fork tech sheets a while ago - enjoy!


----------



## holden (Jul 27, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Very nice! Is that definitely a '93?


Mine is just like pint's except it's black ... Race Lite with the angle-style decals but pulley front derailleur. I've always assumed it to be a 1993 also.


----------



## holden (Jul 27, 2004)

Carsten said:


> the fork tool box thread reminded me that i had scanned in these fork tech sheets a while ago - enjoy!


I wonder what a Mod. 1, Mod. 2, option would look like for frame and fork.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

holden said:


> I wonder what a Mod. 1, Mod. 2, option would look like for frame and fork.


Cool stuff, Carsten. All that talk about fork weight and Keith's forks were pretty heavy. Strong though. I admire all the thought, innovation and engineering going into the early mtb stuff.


----------



## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

Classic KB........I am inventing a new phrase, k-bomb. Thanks for posting that, this is well before the 500 page manual or whatever that used to come with every bike in the 90's, had no idea keith was doing aluminum cromo frames all the way back then. I would love to have seen pics of all the models.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

*"Pre-Trek Bontrager Privateer for Sale"*

I saw this on ebay: "This is a very nice and rare 18"Bontrager Privateer steel mountain bike that has been converted to sinlge speed. A true classic!!! *I believe that this particular model year frame was prior to the Trek made Bontragers due to the 1" head tube diameter.* I think the Trek years went to 1 1/8 inch."

I sent him a message and politely pointed out that Privateers were by definition made-by-Trek bikes and that his for sure was made by Trek and got this reply: "Did you have a question? Thanks for clearing up the frame build mystery."

Did I have a question? Yeah, _now_ I have a question. Is he going to amend his auction? I wouldn't even care except that his reply had some side to it. Or am I over-reacting? The irony is that I'm bringing his auction more attention by discussing it.

Also, a Privateer would have to be a 17" or a 19", technically, wouldn't it?


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Williwoods said:


> Classic KB........I am inventing a new phrase, k-bomb. Thanks for posting that, this is well before the 500 page manual or whatever that used to come with every bike in the 90's, had no idea keith was doing aluminum cromo frames all the way back then. I would love to have seen pics of all the models.


I have yet to see a pre-96 multi material frame come from Keith. One thing I have learned is pretty much anything is possible with the early stuff - he did plenty of experimentation.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

pint said:


> Pretty sure it's a 93. However, I did buy this one used about 5 years ago. It came with the original paperwork all from 93, but you never know. A few NOS parts I recently rounded up: Onza Porcs, XT M735 derailleurs, Bontrager Race stem, Bontrager/Titec Ti 118 bar, Synchros Ti BB, Tange Switchblade fork. Waiting to find a perfect Bonti fork, but couldn't wait any longer! Some day...


Might be a 92 bought in early 93? From working in the biz, one thing I've learned is there is always spill from the previous years' inventory. Makes things blurry sometimes. The give away to 92 is the riveted cable stops, but the seatpost clamp is deffo a 93+ style. All other parts, stays and front der wheel and cable stop position are early too. But those things were on 92, 93, 94 too.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> I saw this on ebay: "This is a very nice and rare 18"Bontrager Privateer steel mountain bike that has been converted to sinlge speed. A true classic!!! *I believe that this particular model year frame was prior to the Trek made Bontragers due to the 1" head tube diameter.* I think the Trek years went to 1 1/8 inch."
> 
> I sent him a message and politely pointed out that Privateers were by definition made-by-Trek bikes and that his for sure was made by Trek and got this reply: "Did you have a question? Thanks for clearing up the frame build mystery."
> 
> ...


Not over-reacting but it's going to be an uphill battle as _everyone_ wants their Bontrager to be pre-Trek.


----------



## pint (Oct 6, 2008)

MrOrange said:


> Might be a 92 bought in early 93? From working in the biz, one thing I've learned is there is always spill from the previous years' inventory. Makes things blurry sometimes. The give away to 92 is the riveted cable stops, but the seatpost clamp is deffo a 93+ style. All other parts, stays and front der wheel and cable stop position are early too. But those things were on 92, 93, 94 too.


The cable stops are riveted.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

pint said:


> The cable stops are riveted.


riveted - exactly. Riveted were earlier . . . 92 (ish) and earlier.

The clamp area for the seatpost clamp looks tall. Look under the rubber sleeve and check if there is a faint line of a taller clamp being installed . . . should be roughly an inch tall.

This would confirm my thesis that you have a newer style clamp on a older frame.

No gusset in that area too. Newer ones had a little "V" and hole cutout gusset added there.

I see there are subtle variations between 91, 92, 93 (looking at the frames I have) but this is a good guide.

http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

MrOrange
No gusset in that area too. Newer ones had a little "V" and hole cutout gusset added there.
[/QUOTE said:


> I have a '94 Race that has the seat-tube clamp gusset, and a '93 Race Lite that doesn't.
> 
> IMHO, one of the best ways to discern the year of the frame is by examining the dropouts. See "Bontrager MTB Rear Dropout Differences" (last link in the list) at my page: http://yojimg.net/bike/bontrager.php


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

jimgskoop said:


> I have a '94 Race that has the seat-tube clamp gusset, and a '93 Race Lite that doesn't.
> 
> IMHO, one of the best ways to discern the year of the frame is by examining the dropouts. See "Bontrager MTB Rear Dropout Differences" (last link in the list) at my page: http://yojimg.net/bike/bontrager.php


Nice link. :thumbsup:


----------



## basilsnow (Feb 22, 2009)

How do I find this forum on mtbr? The only way I have been able to find it is by goggling official bontrager thread.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

That's a good way to find it. Otherwise, you could subscribe to it.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Thanks for posting the scanned sheets Carsten!!


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> Nice link. :thumbsup:


yes, indeed 

ciao
flo


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

So I looked all thru here and didn't see anything about Bontrager "curved " blade forks with the 4 bolt crown (sorry I don't know the proper lingo) Anyone have any info or a link I can go to? thanx


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

da'HOOV said:


> So I looked all thru here and didn't see anything about Bontrager "curved " blade forks with the 4 bolt crown (sorry I don't know the proper lingo) Anyone have any info or a link I can go to? thanx


Early-ish. Hollister has been jonesing for one forever. I have one and it is coolio.


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

so would they have been available with say...a '91 OffRoad?


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## muddybuddy (Jan 31, 2007)

Just post the pictures already.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

*what?*



da'HOOV said:


> so would they have been available with say...a '91 OffRoad?


do you mean Off Road as in Girvin or an Off Road Toad?

And I would assume you mean to ask if they were available from Bontrager in 1991?


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

91 would probably be a Comp . . . curvy fork on earlier Toads . . . yes.


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

horizontal dropouts....two piece seatstays....rivited cable stops...and a dead camera battery:madman:


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

*crappy pics...sorry*

Pre clean-up and horrible lighting but pics none the less.. the decals are pretty beat up but the paint is actually pretty good and no signs of any internal rusting. Surface rust on the dropouts and chainstays, most of the marks are dirt and grease...:thumbsup:


----------



## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

*a couple more...*

it turned into a banner day...

first my eBay Breezer frame came in the Brown truck. Nothing great but a good start. 

then I found a '97 Ball-Burnished Zaskar with full XT and Mavic 217's on Hadley/GT hubs 

and then this dropped into my lap as I was purchasing some Klein MC-1 bars...

kaching  ring me up, please :thumbsup:


----------



## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

Careful Stan, you're starting to get too many really nice bikes and are going to lose your reputation   . There's no doubt that's an Off Road. The horizontal dropouts, double bend chainstays, and rear canti cable stop are all dead giveaways. That fork is perfect too, maybe a little older than the frame, but close enough to be correct. Nice score :thumbsup: .


----------



## richieb (Oct 21, 2004)

Stan, that is a sweet ride! Let me know if it's too big for you!


----------



## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

of course it's too big for me


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Nice pick up. That's a great frameset!


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Stan, that bike it *****in'. Love it. I'll give you five lesser frames for it.

Hell, what about a Mountain Goat WTR in 17" if that is too big?


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> 91 would probably be a Comp . . . curvy fork on earlier Toads . . . yes.


Ha! We both guessed wrong. I guess it's cause they're called by their acronym.

Anyway, the obligatory pic is needed here ("of course it's too big for me"):


----------



## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

What cracks me up is in other threads Stan has insisted that 19 inch bikes fit just right! I dig the old Bonty's though and with the curved forks it is even better.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

curved forks look wrong on a production frame

that doesn't look like a '91


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

bushpig said:


> What cracks me up is in other threads Stan has insisted that 19 inch bikes fit just right!


That's 'cause nobody here wants to buy the other 19 inchers he's got.  This bait is getting some bites!


----------



## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

*actually...*



bushpig said:


> What cracks me up is in other threads Stan has insisted that 19 inch bikes fit just right! I dig the old Bonty's though and with the curved forks it is even better.


I never said they fit just right, just that for my type of riding they are workable :thumbsup: . My main rides are smaller frames.

Now tell me you have never bought a frame that wasn't the right size and that you would have passed on this one if it wasn't the right size....


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Sat, what's the serial number? On the frames of that vintage, the year is included in the serial number.


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## cousineddie (Oct 23, 2008)

Fillet-brazed said:


> This bait is getting some bites!


You betcha!:thumbsup:


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

*just a couple more*

I always think a frame looks better with wheels etc. so I threw some on to see what it looked like...not sure how I'm going to build this but it could go this way....

serial # ends in '791' so I assume it was built in July of '91. And it's an 18".

Just a hair over 19 pounds as it sits.


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## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

That's my size, but I'm already up to my neck in projects and can't justify another. That's still a great find, especially with the fork. Which reminds me, I have a lead on a Bonty fork with horizontal drop-outs that I need to follow up on...


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Get that stem off of there right now.


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

Rumpfy said:


> Get that stem off of there right now.


don't worry, it's just my mock-up/sizing stem. Just for getting a quick idea of fit.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Too bad we can't have a Bontrager thread under manufacturers; that would consolidate things nicely.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Too bad we can't have a Bontrager thread under manufacturers; that would consolidate things nicely.


The Bontrager logo has not been on a bike frame since '98. And a lot of us don't associate the things being made today with the Bontrager logo as having anything to do with the original company, so I'm not sure if it's wise to mix the old stuff with the new.


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## hairstream (Apr 20, 2008)

20 questions.

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

MrOrange said:


> Not over-reacting but it's going to be an uphill battle as _everyone_ wants their Bontrager to be pre-Trek.


Know what? I don't, and here's why: I always wanted a Santa Cruz-made Bontrager, until I finally got one with the semi-horizontal dropouts, and it was a major pain to get the rear wheel not to slip.

I've ridden a '97 Privateer for over a decade now and it's just been a fun problem-free dream to ride. Call me a phillistine, but really, it's damn near the same frame. Now that I have a '99 (I think) Bontrager Privateer also, I have a Privateer which will take a fork with a 1 1/8" steerer tube, so I have a ton more choice when it comes to forks.

After all, I bought them to ride, not as wall-hangers.


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## dunerinaz (Mar 5, 2009)

First post.....While looking for info on my bontrager, I stumbled onto this site. I have what I'm pretty sure is a '98 privateer. I bought it brand new in '99 as a leftover. Everything except the seat and pedals is original, down to the grips. Since this is a trek made frame, is it worth much? I'm trying to sell it right now and wondering if it has any worth. It's in great condition.


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## WEBERTIME (Feb 4, 2004)

Would've been, but your fork boots are missing...


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## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Bontrager Race #5712*

Question - Would it be appropriate to use this fork with this frame?

1994 Race









Fork









Or should I use a Judy SL I have from the parts donor bike (1994 KHS Montana Pro)


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

mrjustin007 said:


> Question - Would it be appropriate to use this fork with this frame?
> 
> Or should I use a Judy SL I have from the parts donor bike (1994 KHS Montana Pro)


The rigid fork is older than the frame. The frame is likely suspension corrected.

What is the axle to crown measurement, with the legs as long as they will go on the rigid fork? If' it's under 400mm I'd not use it. If it's over, it will work fine. Slightly longer would be better.


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## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

How do I measure that?
From axel to top of crown = 395mm


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Yeah what Laff said

Frame looks to be a 95/6 1 piece seat stays and no pulley wheel (if I see right - pic is a tad fuzzy)

Deffo a suspension geo frame

That fork will not quite be long enough, but you could put it on and see for yourself what it will do to the geo and ride. Since it has slotted drops, even more fun to experiment with 

But, I would recommend the Judy . . . will ride a lot better with that.


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## richieb (Oct 21, 2004)

Nice fork, though. I see why you want to use it!


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Know what? I don't, and here's why: I always wanted a Santa Cruz-made Bontrager, until I finally got one with the semi-horizontal dropouts, and it was a major pain to get the rear wheel not to slip.
> 
> I've ridden a '97 Privateer for over a decade now and it's just been a fun problem-free dream to ride. Call me a phillistine, but really, it's damn near the same frame. Now that I have a '99 (I think) Bontrager Privateer also, I have a Privateer which will take a fork with a 1 1/8" steerer tube, so I have a ton more choice when it comes to forks.
> 
> After all, I bought them to ride, not as wall-hangers.


Agreed, 1 1/8" gives you more choices. Yes, the frames are close to the same to higher end models.

"After all, I bought them to ride, not as wall-hangers." Yeah, riding them is what they are for.

I think we all know that when it comes time to sell - Race and Race Lite bring more bucks. And that is what I was referencing. People want to connect to those models and away from Trek made. Thus people often quote "made in Santa Cruz" when they are not. I see it all the time.

What I am trying to say is - I agree with you - but I think you are going to have a hard time correcting everybody that puts an ad up on CL or Ebay

edited for content.


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## jimmy (Jan 19, 2004)

*Riding Bonty off road?*

Are you peeps riding your bontys off road now? I have a 94 Race, its been my commuter. I have a Judy XC on it, fixed up by Hippietech. I am thinking about getting it back out on the trail. What do you think?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jimmy said:


> Are you peeps riding your bontys off road now? I have a 94 Race, its been my commuter. I have a Judy XC on it, fixed up by Hippietech. I am thinking about getting it back out on the trail. What do you think?


Yes, I still ride my Bontrager Race. It's a single speed with a 2000 SID fork on it (the last of the 1" SIDs). I still love the way it rides, and have no plans to stop riding it.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Of course I ride my Bontrager off road! I have a road bike for pavement.


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

da'HOOV said:


> So I looked all thru here and didn't see anything about Bontrager "curved " blade forks with the 4 bolt crown (sorry I don't know the proper lingo) Anyone have any info or a link I can go to? thanx


Here's one:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimg/sets/72157606722657538/


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jimgskoop said:


> Here's one:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimg/sets/72157606722657538/


Nice frameset. And my size too! I'm glad that I missed that ad; otherwise, I'd be $500 poorer right now.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

mrkawasaki said:


> Sorry bone eaters - I'm travelling at the moment and won't be able to get photos requested until next week. Will do then - promise!
> 
> Mr K


which one you prefer to ride: ibis or bontrager?


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## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

I've been searching the net for info about this fork, and have come up empty. It's a Switchblade with the slotted drop outs. Can someone fill me in? When it was made, what would be the 'correct' Bontrager to put it on, etc.








I was going to use it on the 1994 Race pictured above, but seems like it's too old.


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## Sizzle-Chest (Mar 22, 2009)

You guys all have some great bikes. I had to register and post my first bike love. In the summer of 2000 I quit my job and threw down 1100 bones for this '99 Privateer Comp, all in the same day. Was a fun summer! It had a Sid fork, XT and XTR components, Chris King rear hub. Sold it a few years later when I was hard up for money, which I regret. Now the search is on to find one to replace her!


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

Sizzle-Chest said:


> You guys all have some great bikes. I had to register and post my first bike love. In the summer of 2000 I quit my job and threw down 1100 bones for this '99 Privateer Comp, all in the same day. Was a fun summer! It had a Sid fork, XT and XTR components, Chris King rear hub. Sold it a few years later when I was hard up for money, which I regret. Now the search is on to find one to replace her!


Now you can afford a real Santa Cruz made bontrager! What size are you looking for?


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## Sizzle-Chest (Mar 22, 2009)

medium or large, you have one your looking to unload?


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## Ride2Suffer (Dec 14, 2008)

ooops, double post...


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## Ride2Suffer (Dec 14, 2008)

96 Race:


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

Oooh clean. My size, too:thumbsup: 

You sure it's a '96? The details point towards an earlier year: 2 piece seatstays, straight decals, XT components and fork from 95 or earlier, etc. What kind of headset is that? Is it a repaint or just a near pristine ol' gem? Whats the history on it?


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## C Miller (Aug 28, 2008)

*96 ?*

Not a 96 but definitely very nice and clean. Decals are just decals but those are the early ones which match the frame. That butted seat stay put it more at 90-91.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

That is really sharp. Nice work.


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## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

That's one of the cleanest pre-96 Bontys I've ever seen!

The decals are for the OR, however. Yours should have the panels with diagonal ends and don't say "OR" on the top panel.


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## d-ray (Apr 27, 2005)

*Ti-Lite*

What a great thread! Here are a couple pics of my Bontrager.


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## Ride2Suffer (Dec 14, 2008)

Hmmmmm,
I just bought this bicycle from the original purchaser, he bought it new in 1997 from the dealer sticker on the seat tube....dealer told him it was a limited production 1997 model, a trek rep told me it was a 1996...

He never rode the bike, it will probably never get ridden either....waaaaay to small for me. anyone want to trade, I ride a large.

Do any of these frames have serial #'s mine has no markings anywhere.



scooderdude said:


> That's one of the cleanest pre-96 Bontys I've ever seen!
> 
> The decals are for the OR, however. Yours should have the panels with diagonal ends and don't say "OR" on the top panel.


,


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

d-ray said:


> What a great thread! Here are a couple pics of my Bontrager.


Gawd that's nice. How do you like the Vicious fork?


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Ride2Suffer said:


> Hmmmmm,
> I just bought this bicycle from the original purchaser, he bought it new in 1997 from the dealer sticker on the seat tube....dealer told him it was a limited production 1997 model, a trek rep told me it was a 1996...
> 
> He never rode the bike, it will probably never get ridden either....waaaaay to small for me. anyone want to trade, I ride a large.
> ...


That's a pre-1993 frame -- note the semi-horizontal rear dropouts and the long gussets at the head tube. It may very well be a teeny OR frame, predating the Race/RaceLite, or it might be some sort of overlap between the two models. Looks like the DT bottle cage mounts are brazed on, not Rivnuts? Ditto on the rear brake cable stop. Hard to tell from the photos, though.


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## Ride2Suffer (Dec 14, 2008)

Pre 93 ?? that is bizarre, I will call the guy I bought it from for more information.

http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/


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## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

... yes, I'll 2nd this, looks like a mix of pre 93 (overly long monostay not capped like early or's 90/91, dropouts) and 92 - 94 details (seatstays, front triangle, gussets).

but 96 never, except mr. sadoff built it from the leftovers


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## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

Yep. Seems to share both OR and Race/Race Lite features, but is certainly pre-95:

Rear cable stop - Race/Race Lite
Rear drop out - OR
Seat stay/rear drop out junction - Race/Race Lite
Mono stay - OR
Chain stay gussttes - Race/Race Lite
Headtube gussetts - OR
Top tube cable guides - Race/Race Lite

More info is found, here:
http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/


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## Doctor Who (Dec 3, 2008)

I just bought this because I put in an offer, on a whim, and the guy accepted it. Whoops. And I was about to bid on a Yeti ARC, but I got this instead.

Now I'm feeling some regret, because I know little about MTB racing other than I want to do it. Cat. 3 in CX and road, but I'm looking for something to do offroad before CX season starts and because I don't like crits.

Also, was the price I paid fair for what I get? Or did I get hosed? I'm pretty sure I could sell the bike locally for what I paid for it, but I like being reassured that I just didn't blow a wad of money.


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Doctor Who said:


> I just bought this because I put in an offer, on a whim, and the guy accepted it. Whoops. And I was about to bid on a Yeti ARC, but I got this instead.
> 
> Now I'm feeling some regret, because I know little about MTB racing other than I want to do it. Cat. 3 in CX and road, but I'm looking for something to do offroad before CX season starts and because I don't like crits.
> 
> Also, was the price I paid fair for what I get? Or did I get hosed? I'm pretty sure I could sell the bike locally for what I paid for it, but I like being reassured that I just didn't blow a wad of money.


IMHO, that frame is worth $250-350, and that fork might be worth $100 since it's got a hard-to-find 1" steerer. I usually assume a used wheelset is worth around $100, but the auction says "Wheels : TNT hubs with Mavic MA 40" -- I don't know anything about those hubs, but if the rims are Bontrager cut-down MA40s (did Mavic make those in a 559 size?) they might be worth more from a vintage standpoint. The rest of the parts seem typical/average. It looks like a pretty clean bike, regardless. If you're going to race it, it might be tough to find replacement parts for that fork...I think Answer stopped supporting that model years ago..


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

jimgskoop said:


> IMHO, that frame is worth $250-350, and that fork might be worth $100 since it's got a hard-to-find 1" steerer. I usually assume a used wheelset is worth around $100, but the auction says "Wheels : TNT hubs with Mavic MA 40" -- I don't know anything about those hubs, but if the rims are Bontrager cut-down MA40s (did Mavic make those in a 559 size?) they might be worth more from a vintage standpoint. The rest of the parts seem typical/average. It looks like a pretty clean bike, regardless. If you're going to race it, it might be tough to find replacement parts for that fork...I think Answer stopped supporting that model years ago..


Agree with those numbers.

Those don't look to be roll downs - decals still present (based on auction pics) They are factory Ma40's.

Set the sag on the fork, make sure it works.

Then forget the remorse.

Ride.


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Doctor Who said:


>


Oh, and if you decide you don't like it, I'd be happy to take that frame off your hands. I've got a blue Z2 Bomber fork that'd match that frame nicely.


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## scooderdude (Sep 27, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> Then forget the remorse.
> 
> Ride.


Yeah, no sh!t. That's a great little bike, both nimble and steady at speed. You'll love it. And it will last decades with proper care.


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## Ride2Suffer (Dec 14, 2008)

nice....I made that guy 2 offers on the bike, not far from your buy price. The bike is worth whatever someone will pay, you made an offer and won,,,,,be happy and ride an awesome classic bonty bike.

I wanted it to hang on the wall of fame....to each his own.


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

I bought a NOS race frame a while back, complete with Bomber fork...a whim also, but I always wanted one, now it's my first choice to ride these days. 

I don't think about the price, knowing it's unique, and I love the way it rides. You'll be happy with it.


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## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*94 Race*

Bar/Stem Combo:









Fork:









Bike: 94 Race - just wish the prior owner hadn't ground off the rear canti hanger


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Stolen Bike Alert!

Here's one to keep an eye out for -- looks like a VERY early KB custom?

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/bik/1120370363.html


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jimgskoop said:


> Stolen Bike Alert!
> 
> Here's one to keep an eye out for -- looks like a VERY early KB custom?


Nice picture.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Nice picture.


WTF?


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## goomicoo (Apr 14, 2009)

*What have I got myself into!*

I picked up a Race lite OS yesterday. I finished putting it back together today and took some pics so I could sell it. After looking through this thread I think I should at least give it a test ride before letting it go. But now I'm afraid that I won't want to sell. I'm running out of space! 
















I just listed it in the Vintage section of the MTBR website.
Please let me know if this considered spam, I don't want to break any rules.
Also let me know if the price is out of line, I had to put something down!


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## hairstream (Apr 20, 2008)

now we're talking. why would you want to sell now that you have it all dialed in??


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## goomicoo (Apr 14, 2009)

I'm thinking the frame might be too small for my liking. I'm 6"0" and it's a medium frame. When I was 20 it might have suited my style but I'm 50 now and like the cush of a large (19) frame. We'll see, if it was Orange I would probably keep it anyway!


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

jeff said:


> WTF?


I was thinking the same thing. Some people don't take glamour shots of their bikes so when they get stolen, they work with whatever they have. Yeah, sh!tty shot and all but alteast I'll recognize it if I see it.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

jeff said:


> WTF?


I took the picture.


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

*and???*



Rumpfy said:


> I took the picture.


I'm not sure why we needed that info ,,,,, just curious??,


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

My bad.
J


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

da'HOOV said:


> I'm not sure why we needed that info ,,,,, just curious??,


Person A posts picture and says here is my stolen bike. Person B says WTF re the picture. Person C says dude, pictures you take of your bike aren't always the best. Person B says, yea, but *I* took that picture. Clearer?


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

bushpig said:


> Person A posts picture and says here is my stolen bike. Person B says WTF re the picture. Person C says dude, pictures you take of your bike aren't always the best. Person B says, yea, but *I* took that picture. Clearer?


that doesn't really seem to celar it up but, Jeff and I thought Rumphy was bashing the guy who got his bike stolen for posting a crap photo when he was actually making fun of his own photo of the other guy's bike.

Incidently, I don't think the bike belongs to jimgskoop, he just pulled it off a CL add, if you find it and need to contact the owner, go through the CL link.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)




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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


>


wow, catty today aren't we?


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Boy named SSue said:


> wow, catty today aren't we?


 I should have put a smile with that. No cattyness here. It was directed at the whole confusion in general, which mainly stemmed from the confused post questioning Rumpfy's post. I was a good boy and refrained in the earlier stages of confusion until I could no longer resist. Just enjoying the entertainment the interweb can provide.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

da'HOOV said:


> I'm not sure why we needed that info ,,,,, just curious??,


Hey here's an idea. Don't worry about it.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Boy named SSue said:


> that doesn't really seem to celar it up but, Jeff and I thought Rumphy was bashing the guy who got his bike stolen for posting a crap photo when he was actually making fun of his own photo of the other guy's bike.
> 
> Incidently, I don't think the bike belongs to jimgskoop, he just pulled it off a CL add, if you find it and need to contact the owner, go through the CL link.


Yeah, I was making fun of my own crappy photo...incidentally taken just days before it was stolen.

I contacted the CL poster to say that I had seen it (where and when)...but that was before it was stolen....and no, I was not the person who stole the bike.


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## da'HOOV (Jan 3, 2009)

Rumpfy said:


> Hey here's an idea. Don't worry about it.


curiousity is a world away from worry....

your answer to boy named SSue explained it, I just wondered why you claimed the picture.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Cool bike. Sad to see it go.


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## MadaEroom (Mar 24, 2009)

I'm a few inches taller than you goomicoo, I wish it was a large. I would buy it right now.


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

MadaEroom said:


> I'm a few inches taller than you goomicoo, I wish it was a large. I would buy it right now.


Judging from the picture, it IS a large and not a medium. You should buy it right away.

Damn, I luv matchmaking...


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## MadaEroom (Mar 24, 2009)

Wait wait wait. How can you determine that? am I being f'ed with here? :skep:


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## MadaEroom (Mar 24, 2009)

Does anyone out there know who has knowledge of serial numbers for Bontrager frames? Is there already some kind of semblance of info on the subject or should I start by contacting Bontrager themselves?


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

MadaEroom said:


> Does anyone out there know who has knowledge of serial numbers for Bontrager frames? Is there already some kind of semblance of info on the subject or should I start by contacting Bontrager themselves?


There is little rhyme or reason to Bonty serial numbers. You're better off picking out frame details.

Trektrager will most likely be of zero help.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

MadaEroom said:


> Does anyone out there know who has knowledge of serial numbers for Bontrager frames? Is there already some kind of semblance of info on the subject or should I start by contacting Bontrager themselves?


It depends....

For early bikes (which happen to have serial numbers), yes, there is is meaning.

During the "glory years" (1992 to 1997), the serial numbers mean nothing. These are 4 digit numbers on the dropouts. They should be unique, but completely random.

Some of the out-sourced frames have meaning too. The Ti Lites have serial numbers include frame size and build order. The Privateer frames likely do to (but I've not paid attention to them).


----------



## jmelani (May 28, 2004)

I'm trying to find out what size seatpost collar I need for a 1992 Race Lite. My guess from measuring the current one is 30.0 but I want to make sure before I buy one. Thanks.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

jmelani said:


> I'm trying to find out what size seatpost collar I need for a 1992 Race Lite. My guess from measuring the current one is 30.0 but I want to make sure before I buy one. Thanks.


26.8.

I think all Bontragers other than the ti-lites and privateers were 26.8. The ti-lites are 27.0 and I think the privateers are the same.


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## jmelani (May 28, 2004)

Boy named SSue said:


> 26.8.
> 
> I think all Bontragers other than the ti-lites and privateers were 26.8. The ti-lites are 27.0 and I think the privateers are the same.


26.8 is the size of the seatpost. I'm trying to find out the size of the collar.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

jmelani said:


> 26.8 is the size of the seatpost. I'm trying to find out the size of the collar.


Ah crap, that is indeed what you asked. I am now deserving of a face palm.

I just pulled the coller off my race from around the same time and measured it as a 29. I can't say whether the races and racelites had different coller sizes though. Sorry.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

My recollection is that I needed a 28.6 for my OR. I think I used a Ritchey Logic clamp.


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

+1 - Yep 28.6mm is correct.

jw


----------



## jmelani (May 28, 2004)

28.6 it is. Thanks all.


----------



## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

I believe what I have is a '92 Race Lite. Purchased the frame new from a LBS in the Spring of '93. Frame was hanging for a while before I pulled the trigger. Year ago upgraded a few things including wheels and a front Disk Brake. It's already changed form the pics (bar ends gone, new grip shift boots, new grips) and considering making it a 1x9 or just selling it.

Here is my Race Lite...


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## Slimpee (Oct 3, 2007)

Jeepnut22 said:


> I believe what I have is a '92 Race Lite. Purchased the frame new from a LBS in the Spring of '93. Frame was hanging for a while before I pulled the trigger. Year ago upgraded a few things including wheels and a front Disk Brake. It's already changed form the pics (bar ends gone, new grip shift boots, new grips) and considering making it a 1x9 or just selling it.
> 
> Here is my Race Lite...


That's an odd assortment of parts and colors but I dig the bike! If it were mine i'd ditch the disc front and put together a more cohesive color combo...but that's just me!

Glad you're having fun w/ 'er!


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## slowisthenewfast (Dec 8, 2008)

*FrankenTrager*

After months of lurking, I've finally gotten the kinks out of/put into my '96 Race. It's a xxl and I'm 6'8", so that's why it likes like a Dahon folder. (I believe it's a '96 anyway. That's when I ordered the frame from Bicycle Renaissance in NYC.) I hope to have Walt build a fork for it before the cyclocross season starts, then I'm going to race it poorly. (The folks at Marzocchi were kind enough to put a 1" steerer on the present fork, but it's kind of overkill.)
I know some of you probably blew your coffee all over your monitors when you saw it, and for that I apologize, but I love riding this freaking thing.
Does anyone have any suggestions for a painter in the Pasadena area, and maybe a source for stickers? 
Thanks for a great group! sean


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## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

Slimpee said:


> That's an odd assortment of parts and colors but I dig the bike! If it were mine i'd ditch the disc front and put together a more cohesive color combo...but that's just me!
> 
> Glad you're having fun w/ 'er!


Actually I am trying to figure out what I want to do with it. I don't ride it much as I have been riding my dual squishy mostly as of late.

1x9?
1x1?
Cyclo?
Sell it?


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Boy named SSue said:


> Incidently, I don't think the bike belongs to jimgskoop, he just pulled it off a CL add, if you find it and need to contact the owner, go through the CL link.


Yup. Not my bike, I saw the listing on the local CL. Just trying to help a fellow Bonty owner out.

-Jim G


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

datasurfer said:


> Judging from the picture, it IS a large and not a medium. You should buy it right away.


Mediums (17") have a very sloped top tube. 

















Larges (19") less so. 

























XLs (21") have a level top tube. 















(although this is an OR frame, which is slightly different admittedly)

Smalls (15") have even more TT slop, and very little wishbone on the mono seat stays.









The TT and seat stays on the XS frame (12") form a straight line from the head tube to the dropouts...mixte-like.
(no photos found)

And then of course the XXL is just HUGE!







(photo borrowed from above, sorry)

-Jim G


----------



## floibex (Feb 7, 2004)

sorry, but that's size L, rigid geo. I know, 'cause she's mine  
tt 23.2" rigid geo vs 23.6" xl rigid.

ciao
flo


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

floibex said:


> sorry, but that's size L, rigid geo. I know, 'cause she's mine
> tt 23.2" rigid geo vs 23.6" xl rigid.
> 
> ciao
> flo


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

floibex said:


> sorry, but that's size L, rigid geo. I know, 'cause she's mine
> tt 23.2" rigid geo vs 23.6" xl rigid.
> 
> ciao
> flo


my bad. thanks for the correction!


----------



## rufiboy (Jun 9, 2009)

*hello*

Just a quick hello,

Hopefully I've managed to up load a picture of my '94 Bontrager Race.

Medium
Full Shimano XT
Rockshox Mag 21's
Lots of other tasty bits.

Very Original

It needs re-painting, but the question is where could i get new decals?

thanks in advance


----------



## rufiboy (Jun 9, 2009)

*New to the Forum, Need Stickers*

Just a quick hello,

Hopefully I've managed to up load a picture of my '94 Bontrager Race.

Medium
Full Shimano XT
Rockshox Mag 21's
Lots of other tasty bits.

Very Original

It needs re-painting, but the question is where could i get new decals?

thanks in advance


----------



## MadaEroom (Mar 24, 2009)

rufiboy said:


> It needs re-painting, but the question is where could i get new decals?
> 
> There is a guy in the UK who manufactures old decals, Bontrager frame stickers being one of many. His email is [email protected] I found him when I joined the retrobike.co.uk forum a while back. Relatively inexpensive, you can't tell them from the originals. I think he said it was about 33 British pounds shipped to the U.S. but don't quote me on it.


----------



## rufiboy (Jun 9, 2009)

Thanks so much.

I live in sunny Stockport.

JUst I've been out on my bike recently, (not been used for years. And in my state of poor fitness I can still smoke the people I've been out with on the full suspension bikes.

Going to stay retro and annoy them.

cheers


----------



## Videogirl32 (Jun 17, 2008)

I'm probably going to get blasted for blasphemy by posting this, but due to budget restaints I couldn't afford to rebuild back to original completely... I was given a 96 privateer comp from neighbor that had it collecting dust in his garage. The frame had a bit of rust on it and finding the right decals proved impossible for me at the time. So... I converted it a bit. Here's pics of original frame and my re-build of it. 






I do have all the original parts for it that I didn't use (most were put back on) and will continue to seek out the one that are missing to turn it back to original status. Biggest troubles were finding the sticker set. So for now it's my get off the sofa and ride when it's too wet to hit the local trails bike.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

*'Real' Bontrager*

This guy is selling a 'Real Bontrager', and I quote:

_



You are bidding on a piece of cycling history!

I have one of the last REAL hard tail Bontrager Mountain bikes ever made. 
purchased as NOS in 2004

Click to expand...

_This is the second person who tried to sell a Privateer as a Race or Racelite on Fleabay this week. It's getting old. The first guy has edited his listing. Come on, 'bought new old stock in 2004'? Ridiculous.


----------



## littlebarney (Aug 2, 2008)

just finished my build,some old school parts and some new....


----------



## Berkeley Mike (Jan 13, 2004)

*What a beauty!*

Sweet touch on the cables. The greywall XC Pros really work. The black big ring on the crank is sweet. Blue Bomber decals and bottle tips are a sneaky detail. I can tell this one will be ridden seriously; it is a better bike than when it was produced. Just try to find a modern HT that comes close to this one.

Where did you get the set of decals? 
Is there a before picture?
Which WTB saddle is this with the drop nose? It makes the bike an even better climber.

Very nice.


----------



## Repack Rider (Oct 22, 2005)

Spotted this old Bonty outside the coffee house. The owner says it's one of the last hand-built Bontys, but I will defer on that claim to anyone more expert on the subject than I am. This isn't a "collector" bike, it's the guy's main ride. The saddle says it all.


----------



## sho220 (Aug 3, 2005)

littlebarney said:


> just finished my build,some old school parts and some new....


Did that rabbit get away??? And what the *@#& was that chasing it???


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Repack Rider said:


> Spotted this old Bonty outside the coffee house. The owner says it's one of the last hand-built Bontys, but I will defer on that claim to anyone more expert on the subject than I am. This isn't a "collector" bike, it's the guy's main ride. The saddle says it all.


It looks to have an 1&1/8" headtube which would make it a '98 privateer. He is totally correct in saying it was one of the last handbuilt bontys. The Santa Cruz operation was shut down a year or two earlier and the '98s were the last of the Trek-made ones.


----------



## Henry Chinaski (Feb 26, 2006)

Ok, I'm guessing this is the oldest Bonty in this thread. Sorry for the terrible pic. I'll dig it out of the basement and clean it up later. It's a Columbus SL cross bike, probably built in 1985 or so for Dave Mac. I've had it since 1987.


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

Henry Chinaski said:


> Ok, I'm guessing this is the oldest Bonty in this thread. Sorry for the terrible pic. I'll dig it out of the basement and clean it up later. It's a Columbus SL cross bike, probably built in 1985 or so for Dave Mac. I've had it since 1987.


Henry that's awesome. Thanks for posting up the pic. I look forward to more when you have the chance. Really pretty color blue that you don't see on the later models. Is she still a rider?


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

Henry Chinaski said:


> Ok, I'm guessing this is the oldest Bonty in this thread. Sorry for the terrible pic. I'll dig it out of the basement and clean it up later. It's a Columbus SL cross bike, probably built in 1985 or so for Dave Mac. I've had it since 1987.


Awesome! Please consider adding your Flickr photo to the Vintage Bontrager Cycles Group!


----------



## Henry Chinaski (Feb 26, 2006)

datasurfer said:


> Henry that's awesome. Thanks for posting up the pic. I look forward to more when you have the chance. Really pretty color blue that you don't see on the later models. Is she still a rider?


It was repainted by Todd Pugsley (sp?) in 1986 or 1987. I think before that it was a paler blue. Fillet Brazed on this forum now owns the bike's twin, which was owned by my friend Dave Hagen for many years. Dave Mac, Hagen, Todd and I all worked at Palo Alto Bikes in the 80s.

The bike served as my dirt/trail til the early 90s when I finally broke down and bought a mtb (a Bonty Race). Then it was my commuter and rain bike for a while. Haven't ridden it in about five years, though it needs nothing, really. I just need to yank off those fenders and put on proper wheels and tires.


----------



## Henry Chinaski (Feb 26, 2006)

jimgskoop said:


> Awesome! Please consider adding your Flickr photo to the Vintage Bontrager Cycles Group!


Done!


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Henry Chinaski said:


> Done!


you are the king of VRC today!!


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Henry Chinaski said:


> Ok, I'm guessing this is the oldest Bonty in this thread. Sorry for the terrible pic. I'll dig it out of the basement and clean it up later. It's a Columbus SL cross bike, probably built in 1985 or so for Dave Mac. I've had it since 1987.


cool. thanks for the PM. hard to tell for sure from that angle, but your frame looks to be bigger than mine... Yeah, mine is original and is a little more turquoise-ish. I have it in the "to be PCed" pile. Hopefully soon! Can't wait to see more of yours.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Fillet-brazed said:


> Can't wait to see more of yours.


+1

the lugs at the head tube look to be different from the ones on mine or FB's, need more pics to be certain

side shot please!


----------



## Repack Rider (Oct 22, 2005)

I dunno, does it look like this one?










John Loomis is on the left. The story on the shirt is that his race jersey violated some rule, and the only other shirt he had was a dress shirt in his car.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Repack Rider said:


> I dunno, does it look like this one?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


that's the one I've got. Looks like Dave Mac lapping the field. There are some more shots from that race in an old Cyclist magazine and if I recall, the pictures were taken by you, CK...


----------



## Henry Chinaski (Feb 26, 2006)

Again, sorry for the bad shots. I can't remember which frame got built first. It was probably 1985 when I first met Dave Mac. He was racing for Avocet (I think Miyata bikes at one point) and he was racing cross on Vitus cross frames if I remember right. I think he was already done with the Bonty frames at that point.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

neat lug work on that one


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Fillet-brazed said:


> hard to tell for sure from that angle, but yours looks to be bigger than mine... Can't wait to see more of yours.


Gay.


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

*Finally*

I finally moved the parts over from the Race (top) to the Race Lite (bottom)...



Got a spare frame now...


----------



## Berkeley Mike (Jan 13, 2004)

*'96 Racelite*

I posted this already but she belongs in this thread.
The only things from the original bike besides the frame are the seatpost binder and the anti-chainsuck device. As such she is not restored but revived. She'll see a ton of use.
24 lbs. 4 oz.

Still working out the kinks in shifting. I made a guess about stem length as I went from Mary Bars to the Salsa Pro Moto 17º sweep. Wrong! I am going to lengthen the stem. I'm really looking forward to hammering on this bike again.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Wow, that paint looks dynamite. Nice.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Yeah, the color looks great.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

So, if I may ask, who painted it?



Berkeley Mike said:


> I posted this already but she belongs in this thread.
> The only things from the original bike besides the frame are the seatpost binder and the anti-chainsuck device. As such she is not restored but revived. She'll see a ton of use.
> 24 lbs. 4 oz.
> 
> Still working out the kinks in shifting. I made a guess about stem length as I went from Mary Bars to the Salsa Pro Moto 17º sweep. Wrong! I am going to lengthen the stem. I'm really looking forward to hammering on this bike again.


----------



## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

Probably sacrilege but here's my 93 Race.

Incidentally, does the "left open" wishbone help pinpoint the year? My frame has this and the semi-horizontal dropouts but the cable guides are not riveted on.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

jack lantern said:


> Probably sacrilege but here's my 93 Race.
> 
> Incidentally, does the "left open" wishbone help pinpoint the year? My frame has this and the semi-horizontal dropouts but the cable guides are not riveted on.


I like this bike a lot.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I've got a blue frame with these same qualities. If you figure out the year, it should apply to mine too.



jack lantern said:


> Probably sacrilege but here's my 93 Race.
> 
> Incidentally, does the "left open" wishbone help pinpoint the year? My frame has this and the semi-horizontal dropouts but the cable guides are not riveted on.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> I've got a blue frame with these same qualities. If you figure out the year, it should apply to mine too.


The '91 frames that I have seen have the open wishbone. The '93 and later frames are closed. I'd guess that the frame in question was from somewhere in between - '92 or early '93.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

*My latest Bontrager*

I recently found this Road Lite frame on eBay, and picked it for a winter bike. It looks like a first production year (1995) frame, except that it does not have the "wishbone" mono-stay. Otherwise the gussets, frame measurements, and braze-ons are the same as a '95. I guess it was made before the wishbones arrived, or on a day when they were misplaced.

I owned a '97 Road Lite from 2001 to 2003 and put a couple of thousand miles on it, so I kind of knew what to expect from the ride. Previously I owned an XL frame, and this is a large, which I think fits me a bit better. It's built up with components that I had lying around - I did have to buy a new stem, a new King bearing cap to convert the headset from threadless, and few minor odds and ends.

Today I took it out on it's maiden voyage, and did a nice hilly 35 mile loop. After a few minor positioning tweaks, I should have a nice winter bike.


----------



## Berkeley Mike (Jan 13, 2004)

*Max, the Yellow '96 Racelite*

was powder coated by Maas Brother of Livermore California. I wanted a certain yellow but it kept orange-peeling and they did not know what to do. I went over there and picked out this color when I saw what it did in the sun.


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

looks like the perfect Halloween bike!



laffeaux said:


> I recently found this Road Lite frame on eBay, and picked it for a winter bike. It looks like a first production year (1995) frame, except that it does not have the "wishbone" mono-stay. Otherwise the gussets, frame measurements, and braze-ons are the same as a '95. I guess it was made before the wishbones arrived, or on a day when they were misplaced.
> 
> I owned a '97 Road Lite from 2001 to 2003 and put a couple of thousand miles on it, so I kind of knew what to expect from the ride. Previously I owned an XL frame, and this is a large, which I think fits me a bit better. It's built up with components that I had lying around - I did have to buy a new stem, a new King bearing cap to convert the headset from threadless, and few minor odds and ends.
> 
> Today I took it out on it's maiden voyage, and did a nice hilly 35 mile loop. After a few minor positioning tweaks, I should have a nice winter bike.


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> I recently found this Road Lite frame on eBay, and picked it for a winter bike. It looks like a first production year (1995) frame, except that it does not have the "wishbone" mono-stay. Otherwise the gussets, frame measurements, and braze-ons are the same as a '95. I guess it was made before the wishbones arrived, or on a day when they were misplaced.


I interviewed there in '94, and KB showed me the wishbone for the Road Lite's mono-stay (something similar to this), so they definitely did have 'em then.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

still waiting to be built









very cool road lite btw


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

*yuh*



hollister said:


> very cool road lite btw


yuh good colour


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

I just purchased a IRD fork for a 1995 race frame. The fork was on another Bontrager that was for sale. It has a 1" steer and is straight legged. Does anyone have any info on these?


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

dcurtis said:


> I just purchased a IRD fork for a 1995 race frame. The fork was on another Bontrager that was for sale. It has a 1" steer and is straight legged. Does anyone have any info on these?


A picture is worth a thousand words...


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

*IRD Fork*

This just came in the mail.....not sure if it is going to be the right length for a 1994-95 Race frame. Does anyone have any info on these???http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=495384&stc=1&d=1257550058 http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=495385&stc=1&d=1257550253


----------



## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

dcurtis said:


> This just came in the mail.....not sure if it is going to be the right length for a 1994-95 Race frame. Does anyone have any info on these???http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=495384&stc=1&d=1257550058 http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=495385&stc=1&d=1257550253


What is the axle-to-crown-race-seat measurement? Should be something around 415mm for a mid-1990s suspension-adjusted frame (~65mm travel suspension fork).


----------



## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

Looks like it is 394mm. I'm guessing this isn't going to work too great.


----------



## MadaEroom (Mar 24, 2009)

Spotted the elusive CX at a recent Massachusetts Cyclo-Cross race! What a beauty. How many of these were made?


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Threaded Steer length*

Does anyone know what is the longest length threaded steer Bontrager made. I have a XL Race with a head tube of 5.5 (140mm) inches and headset stack height of 40mm. The longest I've seen is 6 1/8, but need something about 7 inches, unless I'm wrong about my length calc requirement.


----------



## riderup (Aug 18, 2004)

*Selling A Perect 1996 Race Lite - Medium - Updated To 1 1/8 Head Tube*

I have a perfect condition red medium race lite, 1996.
it was a super low mile, perfect condition bike, when I asked Paul Sadoff (rocklobster, santa cruz, nontrager) to revise the bike for me...who else would you go to for something like this? I wanted a 1 1/8 head tube so I could run modern forks. During that process I also had mib build me a fully custom-sized bike which mimicked the geometry, feel, etc of the race lite. The custom bike fits me better and I like to run discs, so the bonty was built back up but never saw dirt. I rode it up and down the street a few times and then pulled it apart, covered it in bubble wrap, and packed it away. I'm having one of those times in my life where I really don't want 'extra' stuff around...a couple of my guitars are going, a couple bikes...I want to ride what I have and cut out the 'collecting.'
So, yes its hard to part with but I'm willing to. No, it's not going on ebay, CL, or whatever, though I've sold 100's of items on mtbr with all positive feedback...it's only being mentioned here for what I believe are true enthusiasts.
if you're interested, contact me via email at [email protected]


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Swapping steer tubes?*

I have a Bontrager Race and a Tange Switchblade. Both have 1" steer. The Bonty's steer is too short for the frame I just bought, but the Tange is long enough. Can I just swap them?


----------



## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

As long as the Tange steerer has a groove around the bottom for the circlip (or whatever it's called) it should work fine. I actually might have a couple of steerers that are long enough, but I'll have to check them tomorrow to be sure. Stand by.


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

-Anomie- said:


> I actually might have a couple of steerers that are long enough, but I'll have to check them tomorrow to be sure. Stand by.


Cool thanks!


----------



## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

Check your PM's Justin.


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Newest Bontrager Project*

Frame - Pics are from ebay auction









Rear drops









Was going to use this fork, but the steer is too short - have a line on another


















Plan - strip and re-spray. Build with M732 kit. except for brakes - I picked up some Arch Supreme's at a swap meet and am going to use some Altek levers.


----------



## Fiskare (Sep 5, 2008)

Can anyone help with a Bontrager serial number? I think it is a 95 Race, but can't be sure juts yet. The serial number is 100195. Thanks!


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Fiskare said:


> Can anyone help with a Bontrager serial number? I think it is a 95 Race, but can't be sure juts yet. The serial number is 100195. Thanks!


need pics


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Which brakes to use*

Which brakes should I use on my Race? Avid Arch Supreme with Altek levers, or Shimano XT m-737 Canti's with M733 levers?


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

mrjustin007 said:


> Which brakes should I use on my Race? Avid Arch Supreme with Altek levers, or Shimano XT m-737 Canti's with M733 levers?


If the race is '95 or older I would go the m-737/m733 route as that is period correct. Save the arch supremes and altek levers for something 97 or newer.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

mrjustin007 said:


> Which brakes should I use on my Race? Avid Arch Supreme with Altek levers, or Shimano XT m-737 Canti's with M733 levers?


It's up to you. The XT components are more in-line with the frame's age, but the Avids likely offer better stopping power.


----------



## nikesite (Apr 12, 2010)

*Bontrager = Love*

She has showed me the road ahead. Rolled me in and out of the wilderness unharmed. Held no grudges when I had to abandon her to seek safety. She has witnessed transformation. Fore the frown turnith to a smile. She has seen others like her come and go. Now it is time for her to support flip flop's and perhaps a baby seat. She was built with loving care by the "hands" of man and will get the respect she deserves as the hand of man become less important. For she is a symbol. A symbol of something far more greater then the machine. BONTRAGER = LOVE


----------



## matt07302 (Feb 14, 2007)

*1998 Bontrager Catalog*

In a moment of OCD I scanned my 1998 Bontrager catalog, all 48 pages. Thought I would share as I can't find it online other than the copy that is in German. Anyone know where I should submit/give the PDF file? I know it is a bit modern for many, but may hold some good info some.


----------



## soundz (Jun 26, 2008)

Scored a '97 Privateer Comp recently. It's 17" from center of BB to center of top tube. Someone told me that this is a large according to Bontrager method of sizing things. Is this correct? Photo:


----------



## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

I have a '96 Privateer S that has been stripped and sitting in my parents' attic for the last few years. I had slightly outgrown the bike (size medium) and was uncomfortable with the amount of my body weight that was over the front wheel. 

This thread has encouraged me to revive the ride. My plan is to strip and clean the frame and repaint it bone white. This will be a retro-mod with some original parts but many new parts. My main goal is to keep it clean and simple.

The original fork (RockShox Indy) is dead. I intend to replace it with a rigid fork (was thinking the Kona P2). I would like to find a fork that is long enough to raise the front of the bike (rotating it around the rear wheel). I am hoping this would shift my body weight back slightly and slightly mellow out the steering (it was a little too twitchy as stock). I would like opinions on the fork option and what crown-to-axle length would best suit my needs.

I do not want to radically alter the original geo, just mellow it out a little. Thanks for the advice and thanks for sharing all of those beautiful bikes!


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Hi, 
First of all, first post here - greetings to all!

Moving right along, has anyone here done (or had done) a steerer tube swap on a Comp fork? I'm contemplating replacing the 1" threaded steerer in mine and putting in a threadless steerer.

Back in the day I replaced a couple of steerers on Bonty forks and Tange forks. I remember the method well enough. (Loosen bolts, remove snap ring, etc.) I have a fleeting memory of removing the crown race seat using a rubber mallet and the crown as a jig to hold it in place while doing so. But that was back when one could just pick up the phone and order a new one if the one you're working with gets bunged up. Times have changed, now that number rings in either Taiwan or Wisconsin, not sure which.

I'm just going to order a length of 1" steerer from one of the tubing supply places online. 

Does anyone have a source for new crown race seats for these? It's not a complex piece of machining, but if you walk into a machine shop and ask for a one off it could cost quite a bit of money I'd imagine. Of course, if anyone were to have a threadless steerer ready to go ...

(Pics of bikes soon to come. I've got a '93 Racelite, and a '92 Salsa La Raza, along with an interesting package currently in the mail to me.)


----------



## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

The only hard part about your steerer tube swap scenario is the new threadless tube won't have the groove on the bottom for the snap ring. That snap ring keeps the steerer tube from pulling up thru the crown. I'm sure if the crown bolts were torqued down correctly this would almost never happen but that's not good enough for me personally. I like me teeth where they are. My solution was this: I cut the steerer tube off a 1" threadless fork and made my cut in the middle of the crown race seat. What that left me with was a small 26.4mm lip at the bottom of the steerer tube which countersunk in the bottom of the crown nicely. Not an easy cut to make but well worth the piece of mind IMO.


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

Hey Jak,

Welcome to the list. Your procedure for replacing the steerer on a Bontrager fork is exactly the procedure the same as I use currently. Each time it is performed, it seems to deteriorate the the seat just a little bit more. I have a source for the actual replacement threaded steerers, but replacement seats have proved elusive.

Please post the pics ASAP. I have a 1997 La Raza still in need or a resto. Would love to see a finished product.



Jak0zilla said:


> Hi,
> First of all, first post here - greetings to all!
> 
> Moving right along, has anyone here done (or had done) a steerer tube swap on a Comp fork? I'm contemplating replacing the 1" threaded steerer in mine and putting in a threadless steerer.
> ...


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

jack lantern said:


> The only hard part about your steerer tube swap scenario is the new threadless tube won't have the groove on the bottom for the snap ring. That snap ring keeps the steerer tube from pulling up thru the crown.


I was going to just dremel the groove for the snap ring myself. It's in a non-structural bit of the fork, and just keeps the steerer from pulling free if the bolts come loose. I would potentially consider riding the fork without it *IF* I had the crown bolts torqued to spec. It should be an easy cut, as it just needs to be deep enough to let the snap ring settle into place.

If it were anywhere else on the steerer than that last 1/8" that sticks out the bottom of the crown I'd not be so casual about it.

Thx for your reply!


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

datasurfer said:


> Hey Jak,
> 
> Please post the pics ASAP. I have a 1997 La Raza still in need or a resto. Would love to see a finished product.


Will do. Mine is pretty stealth, it's just got a coat of the stock Salsa purple powder coat.

I groused about the stock SR Prism aluminum fork, so Ross built me a steel fork with a flat crown, Reynolds 531c blades, and a Columbus steerer. My shop had sold about 6 Alacarte's, and Ross and I were "phone buddies" as I was the shop buyer.

Probably the wrong thread to go on about this ... :winker:


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

*My '94 Racelite*

To add to the gallery of sweet Bontragers, here's my 1994 Race Lite. It's a mix of XC Pro and other parts, pretty much as I assembled it in 1994.









(Yes, they put my top tube decal on backwards.)









Thumbshifters, Salsa, Titec, Eiglehart custom bar-ends.










I make no apologies for the slicks, I live in Brooklyn NY and I see many more miles on the pavement than offroad. I'd still rather ride my favorite hardtail ever, and don't want to wear down nice knobbies to no effect on NYC streets.


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## jason745 (Apr 13, 2007)

So, here's this thing. I had neither the time nor the inclination to keep it period specific, so only a select few parts could qualify as V, R, or C. I've been using this as a near daily rider, and couldn't pass up the opportunity to adorn this deserving frame with modern tech. The ride quality is impeccable.



















Frame: 1994 Bontrager Race
Fork: White Brothers Magic 80
Rims: Bontrager Valiant OSB Ceramic
Hubs: Bontrager by Chris King
Quick Release: Bontrager Ti
Tires: Bontrager Jones XR Tubeless
Pedals: Shimano PD-M770 Deore XT
Crank: Truvativ Noir Cash (Green)
Chainguide: e*thirteen XCX
Chain: SRAM PC-991 Hollowpin
Rear Cogs: SRAM PG-990 11-34 Cash (Green)
Bottom Bracket: Truvativ GXP Team
Front Derailleur: N/A
Rear Derailleur: SRAM XO Cash (Green)
Shifters: SRAM XO Trigger Cash (Green)
Handlebars: Bontrager RL Big Sweep Flat
Bar Ends: Profile SOS Stubby
Grips: SRAM Locking 
Stem: Thompson Elite X4
Headset: Chris King Nothreadset
Brake set: Avid Single Digit Ultimate
Brake levers: Avid Speed Dial Ultimate
Saddle: Bontrager FS +10 Comp
Seat Post: Thompson Elite


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

This frame was sent as a "no fault" replacement. I had previously been on a 1991 RaceLite, with horizontal rear dropouts. When I stood up out of the saddle to climb, about 95% of the time, my rear wheel would slide in the dropouts so that the wheel would skew to the left and the rear tire would smoosh itself onto the inside of the non-drive chainstay. I would have to stop, and recenter my rear wheel.

I started out with WTB GG hubs, and some sort of light ti skewers. WTB machined some new axle ends for me with serrated steel faces; no dice. I switched to a boat anchor XT skewer; no dice. I switched to a Deore XT rear hub, with steel axle ends; no dice. Bontrager modified some Deore XT axle end nuts to be "grippier"; no dice.

So finally they met me halfway and gave me a new frame (horizontal dropouts) for $75 plus shipping and return of the old frame.

I like to think that in some small part, I helped the development of the Race/RaceLite dropouts. I must have been on the phone with WTB 15 times, and Bontrager 20 times to try to get relief. I was just NOT going to ride any other frame.

(And then I let it sit in my closet for 10 years, but that's another story.)


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## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

*^^*

jason: so what's the verdict on that white bros fork?

wish they weren't so expen$ive so i could find out firsthand...


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## jason745 (Apr 13, 2007)

gotdirt said:


> jason: so what's the verdict on that white bros fork?
> 
> wish they weren't so expen$ive so i could find out firsthand...


So far, so good. It's absolutely rock solid as far as torsional stiffness and tracking, but I'm still working out the ratio of air pressure to IMV damping. I have a feeling it still needs to break in a bit, as well.

BTW: I can't heap enough praise upon MRP/White Brothers' customer service. They've got great folks over there.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

gotdirt said:


> jason: so what's the verdict on that white bros fork?
> 
> wish they weren't so expen$ive so i could find out firsthand...


Speaking of ride reports on unusual forks, were you the guy who 69ered a ti-lite? How did that one turn out?


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Where do you guys recommend I get my frame painted? I live in southern Minnesota, but I can surely ship it wherever. I have a Privateer I want to have painted nice and build up, a late model so it has a 1 1/8" headtube so I never have to beat my head against the wall looking for a fork again (theoretically). Who does good work? I'd rather not get my pants pulled down over the price, but I'm willing to invest if the work is worth it. Decals are of interest as well.


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## JunkMail (May 5, 2010)

Hey everyone, 

I just picked up what I think is a 96 Race. It looks an awful lot like Jak0zilla's (that top tube decal's backwards? Mine's exactly the same way!)

I was reading above about the switchblade crown and how everyone is switching out steerers. While that is totally informative, I'm also wondering about the legs? When/if the fork legs go, is it just a matter of swapping out the legs? Where can you find replacement legs?

Thanks!


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## doccutter (May 12, 2010)

Anyone know the best threaded stem for a race frame? The frame has a set of shocks on it, but I got an old bontrager rigid fork, and I want to bring it back to stock. Some have mentioned problems with the bontrager stems, but does anyone have any ideas for me? Thanks! The frame has the one-piece seat stays, and vertical drop-outs.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

doccutter said:


> Anyone know the best threaded stem for a race frame? The frame has a set of shocks on it, but I got an old bontrager rigid fork, and I want to bring it back to stock. Some have mentioned problems with the bontrager stems, but does anyone have any ideas for me?


Use whatever stem works to get you in the correct position. The "stock" stem would have been a Bontrager 1" quill stem. I've owned several of these stems and have never had any issues with them. Salsa Stems are a bit easier to find and also look good on almost any bike.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

doccutter said:


> The frame has a set of shocks on it, but I got an old bontrager rigid fork, and I want to bring it back to stock.


you sure about that?

lets see some pics


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## doccutter (May 12, 2010)

hollister said:


> you sure about that?
> 
> lets see some pics


OK, fair enough. I'm out of town now, but I'll post when I get home. It seems a bit like a frankenbike right now, it was converted to single speed, then some random parts put on it before I got it. I'm also trying to source a long enough ritchey spindle for the BB, because the one on there now won't allow a 3-ring crank without grinding the frame.


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

doccutter said:


> Anyone know the best threaded stem for a race frame?


It probably would have come with a Bontrager Race or Race Lite stem if it came with a build kit. They pop up on ebay with some regularity, and are not especially expensive.

I'll second the recommendation for a period appropriate Salsa stem. LOTS of nice bikes were rolling around with those. They are really proper stems in every sense of the word.

Other than that, just find a stem that fits you that you like! Esthetically I think welded cromoly stems look good on these frames, but so do Ibis Ti stems ...

If you want a Bontrager Race stem you can PM me. I've got a 130mm(?) in about a 5deg rise, that is in good shape. It's not the fanciest stem, and in fact you can make out the "Hsin Lung" made in Taiwan (to KB's spec) under the powder. But it has the proper logos, and the gusset. It came as part of a 1997 XT build kit from Bontrager. Lemme know if you want pics. I'd trade it for ... something interesting .... but not necessarily your fanciest bit of bling.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

JunkMail said:


> It looks an awful lot like Jak0zilla's (that top tube decal's backwards? Mine's exactly the same way!)


Well ... truth be told ... I think mine *IS* facing the correct direction. :blush:

I have had this memory of the older OR's that were running around my shop, and if I am not AGAIN mistaken, they had the "chainwheel/OR" logo towards the rear. (I'm too lazy to go sift through the pic archive.)

I kind of thought that because mine was a "no fault" replacement there might be something there to subliminally suggest to any future Bontrager personnel that I was that trouble maker with the hub thing going on. I was on the phone with them over and over again about that rear wheel slippage thing. All polite conversations, but I really felt scandalized that every time to I stood up in the granny gear the rear wheel would "ZZZZZzzzz!" into my left chainstay. Only the constant polishing action of the Smokes kept the inside face of my stay from rusting.

Maybe I was (and now for sure am) on the edge of too big for the Race Lite, but I was head over heels in adolescent love with them. I figured if I broke it, I'd no-fault it. I'm a careful rider, and have seen 110lb greyhounds who destroy more nice gear in a year than I've done in my entire life ... ! As long as I stay away from carbon saddle rails, and no-name Ti handlebars, I'm just fine! I think spending my formative years on fragile 700c wheels, that I had to repair myself, taught me to go easy on stuff.


----------



## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

*funny you should ask...*



Boy named SSue said:


> Speaking of ride reports on unusual forks, were you the guy who 69ered a ti-lite? How did that one turn out?


it worked out really well; i am sold on the big wheel up front... however, i came to realize i'm not so sold on rigid forks. :skep:

so, _just_ finished a (re)makeover saturday-- i had an extra bonty/judy fork w/ rebuilt englund air cartridges just sitting in the basement.
just had to rattle-can it first, as i've never been a fan of the 'champagne' color (i've got another, original internals, w/ canti brake boss).










'96 bontrager ti lite:

bonty race stem
chris king grip nut headset
bonty race lite bar
bonty race lite bar ends (magnesium)
gripshift ESP9.0 shifters (8 spd)
real design levers
rock shox judy xc w/ total air cartridges (bonty crown)
XTR 952 hubs (28 f, 32 r)
dt swiss rims (old skool bonty valiants finally gave up)
avid arch rival, rear
avid single digit 7, front
bonty race seatpost
bonty race +10 saddle
XT compact cranks
white industries ti square taper bb
race face rings (got a NOS shimano IG 42, but couldn't find a 32 anywhere)
panaracer fire XC 2.1 tires
XT front der
ESP9.0SL rear der
XT cassette 11-32
oury grips
time atac carbon, world championships, pedals
jen green limited edition bontrager headbadge

fun bike which will see a lot of dirt miles to come...
:thumbsup:


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## doccutter (May 12, 2010)

Thanks for all the help, folks, jak0, I'm not sure I have anything good enough to trade, but I'll look through my bins when I get home. I have another question while I'm thinking about it, as I mentioned, it arrive half-converted to single Speed. The BB spindle is too short for my cranks (I have a specialized set, and a Suntour XC pro). What was the original spindle size for the bontragers? Right now I put in a sealed shimano BB, 122.5 I believe, and it's still too short. I'd prefer the user-servicable ritchey BB, I have the cups, but I can't find a 127 spindle. Any ideas?


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## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

Finished up the Newest Bonti in my collection - 
1991 Race - Semi Horizontal Drops
Race Fork with Semi Horizontal Drops
Race Face/ Bontrager 1 piece Bar/Stem Combo
XT 732 build kit
RM-20 rims
Avid Arch Supreme Brakes
Altek Levers
XTR post
Bontrager Racelite seat W/Ti Rails


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

doccutter said:


> The BB spindle is too short for my cranks (I have a specialized set, and a Suntour XC pro). What was the original spindle size for the bontragers? Right now I put in a sealed shimano BB, 122.5 I believe, and it's still too short. I'd prefer the user-servicable ritchey BB, I have the cups, but I can't find a 127 spindle. Any ideas?


XC Pro (non-MicroDrive) was 122.5mm, but the chainline is probably different than your sealed Shimano unit. I've used White Industry BB's in bikes that I had concerns about chainline with. They allow you to put the spindle where you need it, and then lock it in place. (The older ones more so than the new ones, but they all are great in that respect.) There are a ton of BB's out there that will give you an adjustable chainline.

You could potentially order a White, or Phil BB with a few extra mm of spindle on it.

Specialized had a bunch of different cranks made for them. Usually the nice ones were cold forged by Sugino in Japan. Nice stuff. Post a pic, and I'm sure someone could make an educated guess about spindle length.


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## doccutter (May 12, 2010)

OK, here're the shots of my new-to-me bonty. So they questions are:
What kind is it? The seller said race lite, I think it's a race.
What year?
Did it come with a shock, or should I get to work putting on the rigid fork I got?
What size BB should I use to avoid the chainring grinding the frame?
Thanks y'all!


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## muddybuddy (Jan 31, 2007)

doccutter said:


> OK, here're the shots of my new-to-me bonty. So they questions are:
> What kind is it? The seller said race lite, I think it's a race.
> What year?
> Did it come with a shock, or should I get to work putting on the rigid fork I got?
> ...


The answers to most of your questions can be found here:

http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/

If that rigid fork came with it, I'd put it back on. That's the way it should be.
Bottom bracket width is dependent on the crank not the frame. I'm not sure what model cranks you have there, but I someone here will likely be able to identify them and give you a spindle length recommendation. Good luck on the build up.


----------



## doccutter (May 12, 2010)

muddybuddy said:


> The answers to most of your questions can be found here:
> 
> http://www.eandsweb.com/me/bontrager/
> 
> ...


Thanks MuddyBuddy,
The problem is that the bike arrived to me pretty hacked up, I have no idea what's original on it at this point. If I could figure out the year, that might be helpful, but it's all been painted "anti-theft black". The rigid fork I bought later, assuming that the bike was originally rigid, but I'm not entirely sure that it was! It's got single-piece seat stays, capped wishbone, and gussets on the headtube and around the bottom bracket shell. Could it be a privateer?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

That's a later model frame. I'd guess that it is suspension corrected for 63mm of travel. The fork would steepen it a little, but it would work fine with the rigid or suspension fork.

A relieved headtube is the easiest indicator between the Race and Race Lite. I can't tell form your picture which it has.


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*Selling off some OEM 96 RaceLite parts, including fork*

spam


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## 1978 (Sep 23, 2010)

Here are my two current Bontragers, a 1997 Privateer Comp and a 1996 Race Lite


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*FS: RaceLite OEM Judy XC Fork*

spam


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

fredlf said:


> C'mon and follow the forum guidelines with regards to selling something. It's $2 cheap to but an ad on MTBR and supports the forum.


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

Boy named SSue said:


> C'mon and follow the forum guidelines with regards to selling something. It's $2 cheap to but an ad on MTBR and supports the forum.


I'm sorry, I had no idea that posting stuff for sale was outside of guidelines. I'll buy an ad next week. 
regards, F


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*Replacing forks on old Bonty's: my story*

Well, despite the less-than-warm welcome, I'll share with the forum my recent experience replacing forks on vintage Bonty's.

A broken back has forced me into a more upright riding position, so I had to replace the forks on my 96 Racelite and 97 Privateer with modern, threadless steerers I could run long enough to get my bars higher.

For the RaceLite I got White Brothers to build a custom Magic 80 fork with a 1" steerer and a custom a/c (424mm) that matched the a/c of the OEM Judy XC that came on the bike. The rake on the Magic is 1.4", longer than the 1.25" that Keith spec'd for his bikes, but less than the more common current standard of 1.6". In theory, the steering should be slower, but I can't really tell any difference. Everything about me on a bike is slower now! The Magic is plusher, faster and stiffer than the Judy. Lovely. Disappointingly, it's a little heavier. It wasn't cheap, but it was no more than other high-end forks.

For the Privateer, which is mainly a townie now, I got Rody of Groovy Cycles to build me one of his rigid forks with the Bontrager rake and the same a/c as the RaceLite's Judy. I don't remember what was originally on the Privateer Comps, but it was a Rockshock, so I figured the same a/c was probably right. The fork rides great. Rody uses a big box crown that is actually kind of reminiscent of the way old bolted together Bonty crowns. The price was really reasonable and the wait wasn't too terribly long (6 mos or so).

So yes, it can be done. You can replace the forks on your vintage Bonty and still largely retain that sweet Bontrager ride.

I'll post some pix at some point.


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## tfkid (Mar 12, 2010)

*seat collar replacement*

what size seat collar fits a privateer? my original one is stripped,and now misplaced, i was thinking a salsa quick release would be a good replacement..would a 28.6 fit? I know the seatpost is 27.0 but unsure of collar size...


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## 1978 (Sep 23, 2010)

tfkid said:


> what size seat collar fits a privateer? my original one is stripped,and now misplaced, i was thinking a salsa quick release would be a good replacement..would a 28.6 fit? I know the seatpost is 27.0 but unsure of collar size...


Both my Privateer and Race lite run a 28.6 front mech, so yes a 28.6 collar for your privateer would be perfect........


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## 92gli (Sep 28, 2006)

1978 said:


> Here are my two current Bontragers, a 1997 Privateer Comp and a 1996 Race Lite


:yesnod:


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## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

From this:









To This:


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## GFAthens (Sep 10, 2009)

These bikes are all so sweet. I've got a friend here in Athens who has a Bonty Privateer. Not the most valuable of Bonty's but i'm still pretty jealous. She never rides it either . The most interesting thing about her Bonty is that her brother found it in a dumpster. I wish I had that kind of luck!


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## GOODY925BONTY (Jun 22, 2010)

soundz said:


> Scored a '97 Privateer Comp recently. It's 17" from center of BB to center of top tube. Someone told me that this is a large according to Bontrager method of sizing things. Is this correct? Photo:


HEY THEIR , YOU ARE RIGHT ABOUT YOUR FRAME , 17 INCHES , BEING A LARGE BUY THE PRE TREK BONTRAGER SIZING CHART:thumbsup:


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Delete


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Not sure why my posts get re-routed to the center of the thread, but just deleting


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

soundz said:


> Scored a '97 Privateer Comp recently. It's 17" from center of BB to center of top tube. Someone told me that this is a large according to Bontrager method of sizing things. Is this correct? Photo:


I just picked-up this 96 Privateer S and its also a size large frame.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

GOODY925BONTY said:


> HEY THEIR , YOU ARE RIGHT ABOUT YOUR FRAME , 17 INCHES , BEING A LARGE BUY THE PRE TREK BONTRAGER SIZING CHART:thumbsup:


I don't think they changed it after the buyout. I have a large pre-Trek and a large post-Trek and they fit the same.


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

OK, so I´ve been an on and off lurker on this site  
Here´s my not finished race lite ´97.
It will feature a nice build of XT 739-740. The brakes are Avid 20´s.
Forks are Marz Z2 Atom. It´s not been finished this year as I had hoped but here it is anyways


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Here´s my Privateer Comp which I bought brand new in ´98.
It has more or less stock components and has been a very good friend to me these years  
It´ll be great to see if there is a difference between the brethren. 
I almost forgot to mention that I also ride with the team Rasta jersey  
Bye for now


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*Rasta paint*

I had a Keith-built, custom Bontrager back in 1983. Originally, it had a yellow-to-green fade paint-job, yellow forks and h-bars and yellow down to about the middle of the top-tube. A friend crashed the bike into a cliff hard enough to bend both top and down-tubes at the head tube.

Fortunately, Paul Sadoff, who worked for KB at the time, was able to fix the frame by cutting out the bad sections and re-attaching the head-tube. Being broke, I didn't want to repaint the whole bike, so we masked off the front section and just resprayed it red, with a hard line (no fade) at the green. That left the frame red and green, with a yellow fork and h-bars. Yah mon!

I don't know if it planted the seed of someday having a production rasta paint job on a Bontrager, but I bet it was the first rasta Bonty ever.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

fredlf said:


> I had a Keith-built, custom Bontrager back in 1983. Originally, it had a yellow-to-green fade paint-job, yellow forks and h-bars and yellow down to about the middle of the top-tube. A friend crashed the bike into a cliff hard enough to bend both top and down-tubes at the head tube.
> 
> Fortunately, Paul Sadoff, who worked for KB at the time, was able to fix the frame by cutting out the bad sections and re-attaching the head-tube. Being broke, I didn't want to repaint the whole bike, so we masked off the front section and just resprayed it red, with a hard line (no fade) at the green. That left the frame red and green, with a yellow fork and h-bars. Yah mon!
> 
> I don't know if it planted the seed of someday having a production rasta paint job on a Bontrager, but I bet it was the first rasta Bonty ever.


what size wheels?


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Small world?


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

*No freakin' way*



hollister said:


> what size wheels?


24" wheels. That is clearly my old bike! I recognize the chip in the h/s cup. Wow.

Are you the guy I sold it to back in the mid-90's?

Amazing...


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

fredlf said:


> Are you the guy I sold it to back in the mid-90's?


He's not. Still pretty cool though!


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

Rumpfy said:


> He's not. Still pretty cool though!


Well, I'm dying to know how the bike ended up where ever it did. So startling to see it after 15 years! I put a lot of miles on that bike.

I only have two pictures from "back in the day", though maybe more lurking in a box of slides in a shoebox somewhere...


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Very cool Bonty:thumbsup: 
But what´s the deal with 24 " wheels? Were the early mtb´s 24"?


----------



## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

namkrad said:



> Very cool Bonty:thumbsup:
> But what´s the deal with 24 " wheels? Were the early mtb´s 24"?


Some builders back then were experimenting with smaller wheels. Cannondale even had production bikes with 24" rear, 26" front.

But no, in the case of this bike, it was originally built for a kid who rode BMX and he wanted an MTB that was more like a BMX. I don't think that KB built 24" wheel bikes in general at that time.

It was a fun bike to ride. Very nimble for such a long wheelbase. The small wheels were really only a disadvantage on fire roads/asphalt, when it was hard to keep up with the "adult sized" bikes.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

fredlf said:


> Well, I'm dying to know how the bike ended up where ever it did. So startling to see it after 15 years!.


BIN on ePay about an hour(maybe less) after it was listed. do you remember what year the repair was done?

good looking shepherd


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

hollister said:


> BIN on ePay about an hour(maybe less) after it was listed. do you remember what year the repair was done?
> 
> good looking shepherd


Dude, post some pics for the guy!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

did you ever notice the rear dropouts fred


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

*Fork swap*

I originally built my 96 NOS race a few years back with a "zokes Z3 light. Springs waay too soft for me, never thrilled with it for that reason.

So I threw my Big One Inch on, feels much better! I don't recall seeing a bonty with a FAT fork here before, so...

I just picked up heavier spring for the zokes, so we'll see what the future brings.


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

hollister said:


> BIN on ePay about an hour(maybe less) after it was listed. do you remember what year the repair was done?
> 
> good looking shepherd


As best I can recall, the frame was repaired in 1987. One of the rear canti-bosses (left, I think) was replaced a year or so after that. The fork steerer was repaired after it broke jumping a water bar in 1994 (that was an exciting ride...).

I believe the main triangle is Reynolds 531 and the rear triangle is 501.

And yes, yes please, do post some pics! It's like finding an old friend you were sure had died!

I'll trade more stories for some pics...
cheers,
Fred


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

this has feel good written all over it.


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## fredlf (Nov 18, 2008)

hollister said:


> did you ever notice the rear dropouts fred


Wow, it looks like it's pretty much exactly as I sold it, back in '95 or '96. The front wheel is original, so are the cranks, brakes and the ders. The rear wheel was built by me around 1989 or so? I replaced the original yellow "bull-moose" style bars around 1990 I think.

The rear dropouts are campy, as I recall. Or something else?

That bike was my main form of transportation for nearly a decade. I'm guessing I put about 15 or 20k miles on it. It's been ridden in Utah, Santa Cruz, Colorado, North Carolina, Idaho and even Mexico. Ah, the memories...

Many thanks for posting the pics. Really made my day (week, even).

cheers,
Fred


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## kellyjk (Oct 3, 2008)

Can some one show me the different kinds of Bontrager steel forks. Since the frame rake was 1.25" this is not that common. I have seen that Bontrager offered not only the composite fork but also a welded fork. but I have nerver seen the welded fork thanks


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

KDXdog said:


> I originally built my 96 NOS race a few years back with a "zokes Z3 light. Springs waay too soft for me, never thrilled with it for that reason.
> 
> So I threw my Big One Inch on, feels much better! I don't recall seeing a bonty with a FAT fork here before, so...
> 
> I just picked up heavier spring for the zokes, so we'll see what the future brings.


Sure that isn't a Yo fork? What is the axle-crown length? Looks rad, in any case!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kellyjk said:


> Can some one show me the different kinds of Bontrager steel forks. Since the frame rake was 1.25" this is not that common. I have seen that Bontrager offered not only the composite fork but also a welded fork. but I have nerver seen the welded fork thanks


The link below shows both styles on the 2nd page:
http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/Bikekataloge/PDF/Bontrager/Bontrager_Bericht.pdf


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

yo-Nate-y said:


> Sure that isn't a Yo fork? What is the axle-crown length? Looks rad, in any case!


Blades measure 1", not 1.25" like the Yo.

It's threaded too, so it may be an early BOI. Definitely not the taller "suspended" length.

I've had it long time...spent many years on my Klein.

I'm running 9 speed on it now, but during this winter I'm thinking of going back to 8-speed, and canti's.


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Interesting mix! There were a couple phases of sus correction with BOIs, but your certainly looks like a 395 from here. My '93 fork is just over 400 (405-10?).


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

kellyjk said:


> Can some one show me the different kinds of Bontrager steel forks. Since the frame rake was 1.25" this is not that common. I have seen that Bontrager offered not only the composite fork but also a welded fork. but I have nerver seen the welded fork thanks


there's a few missing from this pic


----------



## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

hollister said:


> there's a few missing from this pic


Any of those forks ever end up on a bike?


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

kellyjk said:


> Can some one show me the different kinds of Bontrager steel forks. Since the frame rake was 1.25" this is not that common. I have seen that Bontrager offered not only the composite fork but also a welded fork. but I have nerver seen the welded fork thanks


Do you mean the factory welded Unicrown fork specd on the Privateers? If so look at the dark green 96 Privateer S above in post 560. Thats a Bontrager factory rigid welded unicrown fork.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

N10S said:


> Do you mean the factory welded Unicrown fork specd on the Privateers? If so look at the dark green 96 Privateer S above in post 560. Thats a Bontrager factory rigid welded unicrown fork.


tange


----------



## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

yeah I was about to say I have never heard of a bontrager welded unicrown fork from the 90's. I have seen unicrown bonty forks but only on his 80's bikes.


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Yeah...I use the "Bontrager fork" term loosely as I know the fork is just a Tange steel fork that Bontrager specd on their Privateers. Even so, I wonder if its just a standard off the shelf Tange fork painted at the factory or if they actually bothered to build the fork with Bontrager fork rake specs? At any rate its the only "welded" Bontrager fork I know of and figured thats what kellyjk might be referencing.


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

yo-Nate-y said:


> Interesting mix! There were a couple phases of sus correction with BOIs, but your certainly looks like a 395 from here. My '93 fork is just over 400 (405-10?).


Exactly where are you taking the measurement from? 
From the top of the crown race to center of dropout is approx 388mm.

From center of drop to top of fork leg (yo eddy cap) is approx 375mm

Sticker on the side of the leg says "RD 1991"

Dropouts are Campy. Stem is 1" threaded.


----------



## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Sorry--should have said 390. Perhaps I was remembering an end of the axle length---I don't have one of the older forks (that isn't bent to hell) any longer to check--or just misremembering. But yours is the proper length for 90-91-92. My '93 is 16" a-c, so about 405-6ish millimeters.

The stickering was the same even into the Serotta years. Nice to have Campy ends on it--not all of them had 'em. And nice to have one with a long steerer--most I see are for medium Yo's which are pretty short.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

N10S said:


> Yeah...I use the "Bontrager fork" term loosely as I know the fork is just a Tange steel fork that Bontrager specd on their Privateers. Even so, I wonder if its just a standard off the shelf Tange fork painted at the factory or if they actually bothered to build the fork with Bontrager fork rake specs? At any rate its the only "welded" Bontrager fork I know of and figured thats what kellyjk might be referencing.


he probably meant welded on bosses and dropouts unlike what's on the comp fork.


----------



## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

So, my girlfriend has been riding with me (not since it started snowing) on one of my bikes, and she wants something which is really HERS, which means that she wants a certain color. I bought her a Bontrager Race frame which someone painted black because she wanted a black bike with purple decals. I plan to buy some purple diagonal cut decals from those guys in Uruguay, and I have most of the parts that I need. Here is what I don't have: The brake posts/ bolts, and the plastic pulley. 
Any of you on the forum who can point me in the right direction?


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Fillet-brazed said:


> he probably meant welded on bosses and dropouts unlike what's on the comp fork.


Yep, could be. I just noted his comment made the distinction between the composite style forks (which I assumed to be all bolted crown), and a welded version (which I assumed to be a unicrown or some kind of rare segmented fork I had never seen) rigid fork. Probably thinking too hard about something that doesn't really matter..


----------



## theNomad (Dec 27, 2010)

So what are the weights of some of these bikes?
How about a ace lite built into a simple single speed with normal (not weight weenie) parts?
What about a full XT geared bike?

I hope to get one shortly if the guy wants to sell.


----------



## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

kellyjk said:


> I have seen that Bontrager offered not only the composite fork but also a welded fork. but I have nerver seen the welded fork thanks


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

That's a cool fork! I've never seen one before. When were they made? (Or was this another thing KB whipped up just because the factory had not churned out an anomaly for a week or two and they needed something odd?) Could it be something from Rock Lobster done with leftovers?


----------



## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

I think it's something KB whipped up. Could be a Lobster leftover but the dropouts are different. I bought it from KB recently but he didn't say anything about what it was originally built for.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

do you have a better pic of the dropouts?


----------



## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

hollister said:


> do you have a better pic of the dropouts?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

looks legit. very cool


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Cool fork.


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## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

Does anyone know what the stock headset crown race was on a '96 Privateer?


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

It was a Tange Levin CD-S 1":

http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/html/bontrager.html


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

I didn't think Privateers were 1".


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> I didn't think Privateers were 1".


Most were 1". The final year (1998) the Privateers came with a 1-1/8 head tube.


----------



## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Actually the Privateers came with 1 1/8 headsets both ´98 and ´99, which was the final year Privateers were made.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

namkrad said:


> Actually the Privateers came with 1 1/8 headsets both ´98 and ´99, which was the final year Privateers were made.


Pretty sure Laffeux was dead on right, there was no '99 model.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0102.jpg?t=1302372123" >

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0086.jpg?t=1302372233" >

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0083.jpg?t=1302372267" >

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0082.jpg?t=1302372288" >

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0079.jpg?t=1302372304" >

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0100.jpg?t=1302372316" >

A few pages back (https://forums.mtbr.com/showpost.php?p=5507331&postcount=393), I mentioned wanting to replace my '99 Privateer Comp. I finally found one and it's 22lbs of pure fun! Here's the parts list for anyone interested:

-1994 Race Frame
-Judy Fork
-Paul Word Hubs / Sun Rims / White Industries 20t Freewheel / Salsa Skewer
-Ritchey WCS Crankset / 34t Ring
-Time ATAC Pedals
-Paul Crosstop Brakes
-Chris King No Logo 1" Headset
-Nitto Stem
-Salsa Moto Ace Bars
-XT Levers
-Yeti Grips
-Thomson Elite Seatpost
-Bontrager Race FS Saddle


----------



## proto2000 (Jan 27, 2007)

Those red ano bits look great on your bike. Thanks for sharing it.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Well done Sizzler, that bike looks like a lot of fun.


----------



## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Agreed--looks like a fun ride! I really dig the hubs and brakes. 
(but your seatpost is facing backwards)


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

yo-Nate-y said:


> (but your seatpost is facing backwards)


Yeah, it makes the bike go faster. 

Thanks for all the compliments, but I can't take much credit. The only things I have changed are the drivetrain and the saddle.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

Sizzler said:


> I mentioned wanting to replace my '99 Privateer Comp. I finally found one and it's 22lbs of pure fun! Here's the parts list for anyone interested:


I want to ride it. Want to swap bikes some weekend?


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Sure, as long as you sterilize your taint or bring your own saddle. I want to keep that embroidered logo pristine!


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

Sizzler said:


> Sure, as long as you sterilize your taint or bring your own saddle. I want to keep that embroidered logo pristine!


I'll see if I can borrow a pressure washer.


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Sizzler said:


> <img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/IMG_0083.jpg?t=1302372267" >


Where do you guys keep coming up with these metal head badges from? Cost? Availability?


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

^^^^^ +1


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Jak0zilla said:


> Where do you guys keep coming up with these metal head badges from? Cost? Availability?


They were made by Jen Green. $65 IIRC.
http://www.headbadges.com/


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

^ Thanks!


----------



## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

*KB's website gone?*

The website that Keith Bontrager maintained after the Trek aquisition (http://ridesmarter.com/) seems to have disappeared recently. Does anybody happen to have a copy of the frame geometry chart that was located there?


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

*Data*



iamkeith said:


> The website that Keith Bontrager maintained after the Trek aquisition (http://ridesmarter.com/) seems to have disappeared recently. Does anybody happen to have a copy of the frame geometry chart that was located there?


Yeah, I noticed it went bye-bye last week. I used internet time machine to get the data:


----------



## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

MrOrange said:


> Yeah, I noticed it went bye-bye last week. I used internet time machine to get the data:


Thanks! I guess I need to get in the habit of saving worthwhile items off of the internet instead of counting on them always being there.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

With the help of Chris King I was able to convert the old No-Logo to threadless. Here's how it looks now:

<img src = "https://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/Sizzle-Chest/Rigid.jpg?t=1304828899" >


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

Sizzler said:


> With the help of Chris King I was able to convert the old No-Logo to threadless. Here's how it looks now:


I like the rigid fork. How you like those tires so far?


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

MrOrange said:


> Yeah, I noticed it went bye-bye last week. I used internet time machine to get the data:


Thanks.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

umarth said:


> I like the rigid fork. How you like those tires so far?


I haven't had a chance to try them, but they are definitely on the smaller side of 2.0, so I'm not hold out much hope, a mistake perhaps, a misguided attempt to drop a pound! :bluefrown:


----------



## paetersen (Jul 28, 2007)

Sizzler said:


> I haven't had a chance to try them, but they are definitely on the smaller side of 2.0, so I'm not hold out much hope, a mistake perhaps, a misguided attempt to drop a pound! :bluefrown:


I've used those tyres for years for racing in the northeast. I think they work very well and they are light as hell. They are billed as a 2.1 but closer to a 1.9- the trick is to pump them up to 65psi and let them stretch for a week. Good all around tyre that is old school to fit the bikes.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

paetersen said:


> I've used those tyres for years for racing in the northeast. I think they work very well and they are light as hell. They are billed as a 2.1 but closer to a 1.9- the trick is to pump them up to 65psi and let them stretch for a week. Good all around tyre that is old school to fit the bikes.


Thanks for the tip, I'll give that a shot, they are incredibly light, Ritchey lists them at 478g but they ended up being 450g each!


----------



## topmounter (Jul 30, 2003)

Nice rides, they bring back a lot of memories... it amazes how few of these you see floating around nowadays. I'm just hoping there are more Bontrager bikes hiding in the back of garages that will find their way into garage sales, craigslist, etc. over time. It makes me sad that Bontrager is all but forgotten nowadays, except as house brand parts for Trek... especially as steel single-speed, 29'er and boutique frames have come back into favor in recent years.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Thought I would add these shots of my 91 OR to this thread. Bontrager 1 piece bar/stem and composite fork. I previously owned a 96 Race Lite, 97 Ti-Lite, and most recently a 96 Privateer. This particular bike rides great on our tight missouri singletrack, and has lots of cool details like the pump peg and bonded riveted guides. Need to find a good syncros post and Bontrager or flite saddle for her at some point.


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Classy and stealthy.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Here's another one for the thread:










The frame used to be ChefMiguels, until he _MADE_ me take it.  It's a '92(?) with horizontal rear dropouts.

The fork is a "frankenfork" made from a Bontrager crown (for proper rake) and Tange blades, although I think I'll be swapping it for a Comp fork soon. The Tange blades "chatter" under heavy braking.

It's interesting that it feels so different than my RaceLite (geared), but then again very familiar.


----------



## Vlad (Feb 7, 2004)

Oooh. I dig it.


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

If you ask me nicely Jack, I'd be willing to take it back.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

i will start looking for a Bonty again.. but w/ a rigid fork.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Jak0zilla said:


> The fork is a "frankenfork" made from a Bontrager crown (for proper rake) and Tange blades, although I think I'll be swapping it for a Comp fork soon. The Tange blades "chatter" under heavy braking.


For what it's worth, my Comp fork chatters too under real hard braking. Not sure if it's the pads or what, but I think I need a Type II.


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Fillet-brazed said:


> For what it's worth, my Comp fork chatters too under real hard braking. Not sure if it's the pads or what, but I think I need a Type II.


I noticed you both run the cable from your stem, which along with the forks flex slightly when braking, and if I understand the concept correctly, this changes the length of the cable causing cyclically inconsistent braking and consequently fork chatter. I think your only solution is the admittedly ugly fork crown cable stop.


----------



## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

Sizzler said:


> I think your only solution is the admittedly ugly fork crown cable stop.


I've heard that theory, but there are countless examples of forks without this fork crown cable stop that don't chatter.


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Ditto. I've run similar stems on a few bikes, some with rollers and some with welded stops integrated into the extension. I'm as sure as can be that this has nothing to do with brake chatter - what does cause it is the brake grabbing the rim which makes the fork blades deflect. Once the blade cannot flex more it springs back. You can watch this happen. 

The solution is a beefier fork. The Groovy fork on my RaceLite has never done this. Different brake pads sometimes alleviate it also. Unfortunately the WTB pads that I know to work with that fork are no longer made. The one last thing would be for me to lose 20 pounds - which i expect would also make things better!


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Bontrager made the blades in different thicknesses, probably have the light ones?


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

*fine tuning continues*

When I first built my NOS '96 in 2007, I went 9 speed, v brakes, "newer" Bonty wheelset, etc.etc. I wasn't happy at all with the way-soft "zokes, so over the years I've been playing around. Manitou EFC was on for a while-a bit too tall, FAT BOI felt good, but my bad shoulder wanted a sus fork.

Wanted to ditch the nine V-speed stuff for good old 8.

Rebuilt the Zokes with heavier Speed Springs and new oil, finally found a cable hanger for it, went back to Suntour 8 speed XC pro thumbies, XC pro levers, Gravity Research canti's front, Avid Tri in rear, "old" style Paul's Moon Units, matching XTR deraillers, Titec Ti bar, Salsa steel stem, NOS Ingleheart bar gnats, Pedros slimwall grips, Mavic blue X222-XT wheelset, and a NOS Control Tech sus seatpost (that fits, no shims!). Post is set up pretty firm, just takes the edge off hard hits.

I think I'm finally happy with it!


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

*fine tuning continues*

When I first built my NOS '96 in 2007, I went 9 speed, v brakes, "newer" Bonty wheelset, etc.etc. I wasn't happy at all with the way-soft "zokes, so over the years I've been playing around. Manitou EFC was on for a while-a bit too tall, FAT BOI felt good, but my bad shoulder wanted a sus fork.

Wanted to ditch the nine V-speed stuff for good old 8.

Rebuilt the Zokes with heavier Speed Springs and new oil, finally found a cable hanger for it, went back to Suntour 8 speed xc pro thumbies, XC pro levers, Gravity Research canti's front, Avid Tri in rear, Paul's Moon Units, matching XTR deraillers, Titec Ti bar, Salsa steel stem, NOS Ingleheart bar gnats, Pedros slimwall grips, Mavic blue X222-XT wheelset, and a NOS Control Tech sus seatpost (that fits, no shims!). Post is set up pretty firm, just takes the edge off hard hits.

I think I'm finally happy with it!


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> Bontrager made the blades in different thicknesses, probably have the light ones?


Did they make different thicknesses at the same time or change things as time went on? I have early ones that are tanks compared to later ones.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> Did they make different thicknesses at the same time or change things as time went on? I have early ones that are tanks compared to later ones.


same time. medium was stock, light(and ultralight) and heavy were up charge options


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

hollister said:


> same time. medium was stock, light(and ultralight) and heavy were up charge options


seconded


----------



## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

KDXdog said:


> When I first built my NOS '96 in 2007...
> 
> Looks like a size large? I managed to pick up both an 1996 NOS size small Race and a size medium Racelite in the same paint color w/yellow decal set. I wonder if there was a stash that was discovered years after the bikes were discontinued that was then put on the market, or maybe they were just an unpopular color combo when new!


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

hollister said:


> same time. medium was stock, light(and ultralight) and heavy were up charge options


Any tips on determining which version is which? I have had this discussion in the past, but never really found a way to validate which version I have for sure. I can't say that I have had any fork chatter, but missouri trails aren't full of steep hills that would result in me needing to lock on the brakes on a regaular basis. That said I can vividly recall the prestige straight bladed unicrown fork on my first gen Alien chattering like crazy though, so I am familiar with the feeling. Just wondering as there appears to be wide variety of versions of the Bontrager forks.


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

N10S said:


> Any tips on determining which version is which? I have had this discussion in the past, but never really found a way to validate which version I have for sure. I can't say that I have had any fork chatter, but missouri trails aren't full of steep hills that would result in me needing to lock on the brakes on a regular basis. That said I can vividly recall the prestige straight bladed unicrown fork on my first gen Alien chattering like crazy though, so I am familiar with the feeling. Just wondering as there appears to be wide variety of versions of the Bontrager forks.


By weight and by taking caps off and looking for reinforcing tubes mounted inside

The light ones I have do not have anything inside while the heavier and more rigid ones have another thicker tube inside


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

MrOrange said:


> By weight and by taking caps off and looking for reinforcing tubes mounted inside
> 
> The light ones I have do not have anything inside while the heavier and more rigid ones have another thicker tube inside


Thats good info. Mine does have the reinforcing tubes at the top where the legs insert into the crown, so it must be one of the standard versions and also why my fork doesn't have chatter issues.

Thanks Mr Orange!


----------



## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

N10S said:


> Thats good info. Mine does have the reinforcing tubes at the top where the legs insert into the crown, so it must be one of the standard versions and also why my fork doesn't have chatter issues.
> 
> Thanks Mr Orange!


Digging further, I also notice and remember

Tube material thickness also different

Different finish levels and color combos were also offered


----------



## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

Well, all of the parts to restore/modernize my '96 Privateer Comp have finally arrived. The frame has been stripped of the old parts and cleaned up. There are several spots where chain slap and use have worn the paint off but there is VERY little rust. Should I build the bike and ride it for the remainder of this season as it is or should I have it powder coated now and then built up?

I am trying to decide if I should spend the $150 now on powder coating or wait until the paint starts to really go and/or surface rust appears.

Thanks for the input,
Ben


----------



## exapkib (Jul 24, 2006)

Question about the Bontrager CX - 

Some photos I've seen show a gusseted frame and what seems to be larger (in diameter) tubing in the main triangle. Where does a frame like this fall in the CX family/timeline? 

Thanks in advance--I've learned a lot reading through this thread.


----------



## TraumaARNP (Oct 13, 2005)

icegeek said:


> Here's mine, it could be yours...


Ahhhh, the M739 cranks; best looking crankset Shimano ever sold. Oh, nice bike btw.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

exapkib said:


> Question about the Bontrager CX -
> 
> Some photos I've seen show a gusseted frame and what seems to be larger (in diameter) tubing in the main triangle. Where does a frame like this fall in the CX family/timeline?
> 
> Thanks in advance--I've learned a lot reading through this thread.


Here's a pic of the production CX frame which was made from about 1994 until the end of the frame building days 1997ish. The "stock" color was gray but other colors exist. Any bike that looks different from this was made prior to 1994.


----------



## exapkib (Jul 24, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> Here's a pic of the production CX frame which was made from about 1994 until the end of the frame building days 1997ish. The "stock" color was gray but other colors exist. Any bike that looks different from this was made prior to 1994.


Thanks for the reply--that photo is beautiful for so many different reasons.

I can't quite tell, though--are the tube junctions gusseted on that frame? It seemed to me from some of the other photos in this forum that they are not always gusseted.

What would you compare the ride of this frame to? I used to commute on a Surly Cross Check, and have been trying to find an affordable replacement. Is this frame in the ballpark?


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

exapkib said:


> I can't quite tell, though--are the tube junctions gusseted on that frame? It seemed to me from some of the other photos in this forum that they are not always gusseted.
> 
> What would you compare the ride of this frame to? I used to commute on a Surly Cross Check, and have been trying to find an affordable replacement. Is this frame in the ballpark?


The frame is gusseted. If you're familiar with the Race and Race Lite mountain bikes, the gussets are at the same place (near the head tube and BB). Some of the older frame do not have gussets, but the production frames do.

I've not ridden a Surly, so I can't compare the ride to that. However.... the biggest factor that I notice on the Bontrager is related to the fork which has much less offset than a typical CX fork. The stock fork makes the bike very stable - the bike is excellent for bombing downhill. It's not a quick steering bike.

There were two forks available on the production bikes. The catalog shows one with curved legs (I'm not sure who made the fork), and some came with a straight bladed fork made by Steelman. Otherwise the frames should be the same.


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

exapkib said:


> I used to commute on a Surly Cross Check, and have been trying to find an affordable replacement. Is this frame in the ballpark?


I thought the Surly was the affordable replacement. If you can find a Bonty for less than a Surly, you should get it.


----------



## exapkib (Jul 24, 2006)

girlonbike said:


> I thought the Surly was the affordable replacement. If you can find a Bonty for less than a Surly, you should get it.


Thanks for the reply (and the wisdom). I have missed my Surly a lot ever since I had to sell it. The used market is so crazy in these parts that the CX is:

#1 - available, and 
#2 - costs less than I got for the Surly last year.

I think I've got a bike to buy.


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Check for condition. Paint, rust, dent, cracks. Check the parts. You didn't give us much to go on. No pictures or price. This makes it really hard to help you. Good luck and I hope you will be happy with it.


----------



## exapkib (Jul 24, 2006)

girlonbike said:


> Check for condition. Paint, rust, dent, cracks. Check the parts. You didn't give us much to go on. No pictures or price. This makes it really hard to help you. Good luck and I hope you will be happy with it.


Thanks for the suggestions. I will give it a good going-over. Frame looks to be rust-free. Shimano XT drivetrain/brakes with Sachs brifters. Rolf Vector wheelset, though I have my own wheels that I'll throw on.

Seller is asking $650 - top of my (graduate student) budget, but fills two needs - a commuter and back-up road bike that can handle the dirt roads around here. I'm going to aim for $550ish.

Apparently I have not yet posted enough to include photos. Sorry about that.

I also apologize for filling this fantastic thread with a 'what's it worth' question--not my original intention. Look at it this way, though--if I can accumulate enough posts and talk myself into buying this bike, I will have some nice photos of another CX! (Will that absolve me of my guilt?)


----------



## mrjustin007 (Jul 22, 2008)

My two Bonti's, both are Races.

Not sure of year, but I think 1996ish, due to the non-segmented stays.


















This one I think is a 1992, has the semi horizontal drops.



















(Sorry for the bad cell phone pics)


----------



## skush (Jan 15, 2011)

My pre-93 OR and Road Lite.

In the process of slowly working on a '95 Race project.


----------



## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

What is the size of that road lite?

Cheers


----------



## skush (Jan 15, 2011)

Road Lite is a Small - 45.4 cm C to C


----------



## markaitch (Feb 17, 2010)

*should i buy this privateer?*

ok...so i finally got the old lady's ok to spend a few bux to buy another bike & i've been wanting to relive my childhood by buying a retro(?) mtb. 
sadly, i lost out on a couple of very cool steel rigid stumpjumpers. 
then ran across this bonty privateer in average, at best, condition. it needs work but of course the owner thinks he's got classic gold in his hands. for a couple weeks he has not been able to sell @ his $300 firm asking price. a few days ago i offered $175 & he passed.
he just contacted me willing to "let it go for $250"...am i crazy to consider going up to $200-225 for this bike?
fyi...where i live is not a hotbed for decent vintage mtbs...


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## edray (Oct 3, 2004)

*My newly acquired '92 OR!*

Just picked this up yesterday, first CX race in November! '92 OR with original fork. Not planning to change much, rides like a dream. Thanks, Frank!

Just out of curiosity, what is the largest rear tire you guys have been able to fit on these frames?


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Had a great ride yesterday afternoon. Perfect fall day in the midwest. Afternoon ride in a canopy of gold leaves with the sunlight spilling through. Nice solo ride on the Bontrager. The bike is perfect for this kind of ride. No rush and no worries, just nice wooded singletrack and a well-matched trail bike.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

edray said:


> Just picked this up yesterday, first CX race in November! '92 OR with original fork...
> 
> Just out of curiosity, what is the largest rear tire you guys have been able to fit on these frames?


If you're using that bike for CX races, the better question is: "what is the narrowest rear tire that you guys have run on these?" 

Nice looking bike.


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

*Weld question*

Can someone give me an opinon on this weld. I just purchased this bontrager race lite bike from ebay and the seller is stating that this is a factory weld. This is an older frame. It has two piece seat stays and is a size extra small.

The rest of the welds on this bike are clean. Was this something that was comon to early bikes. The seller is claiming to be the original owner and that no repairs have been done to the bike.


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

I have never seen that poor of a weld on a bontrager.

I am intersted in what others have to say, that sure looks like a repair to me. Looks like the frame has been repainted as well. I dont recall that color as a stock color.......how about pics of the whole bike?


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

gawd, that's terrible. 

Is this it? 1995-1997 BONTRAGER RACE MOUNTAIN BIKE SHIMANO XTR DEORE XT ROCK SHOX | eBay


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

I will get more pictures tonight. I don't have any of the bike itself.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Wow!! That's a crappy weld and the smallest wishbone I've seen on a Bontrager. 

I've not seen anything but nice looking welds on the Santa Cruz Bontragers. Either someone was having a really really bad day when they did that, or it's a repair.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

girlonbike said:


> Is this it?


no. you don't even need colkervision for that one. 

Yeah, I would say that's most definitely a repair.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Fillet-brazed said:


> no. you don't even need colkervision for that one.
> 
> Yeah, I would say that's most definitely a repair.


.


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

No that isn't the bike I bought. This thing is really small (size 12). I actully bought it for my daughter, so I'm not too worried about it getting beat to death. Just thought if it had been welded that it should have been diclosed.


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

Here is the listting photo....


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

That repair should have been disclosed to you. I would take it up with the seller and/or ebay asap.


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Positively a re-weld/repair


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

Thanks for the responses. I agree, unfortunately the seller still is instisting that it has been.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

dcurtis said:


> Thanks for the responses. I agree, unfortunately the seller still is instisting that it has been.


So long as all the communication was through ebay, I think you should be able to make your case.


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## edray (Oct 3, 2004)

Im super stoked on mine. '92 Racelite @ Something Wicked 6hrs of Cathedral Pines. My hands/arms were considerably more sore than I have ever felt before, but it kept me honest and was a blast in the corners. I love this bike. 
PS: Anybody have a line on any CX frames?


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## paetersen (Jul 28, 2007)

edray said:


> Im super stoked on mine. '92 Racelite @ Something Wicked 6hrs of Cathedral Pines. My hands/arms were considerably more sore than I have ever felt before, but it kept me honest and was a blast in the corners. I love this bike.
> PS: Anybody have a line on any CX frames? Saw one on eBay a week ago but it was a bit out of my price range.


Nice! I was at Cathedral Pines with my orange '94 Race. The mag21 up front was the deciding factor for that over my '90 OR rigid. Even with the front fork my wrists were killing me after 70 miles on the bike. Your bike and my '90 could be twins: Same colour, same decals and rigid SS. As far as I know there were about 5 Bontragers there on Saturday.


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## edray (Oct 3, 2004)

paetersen said:


> Nice! I was at Cathedral Pines with my orange '94 Race. The mag21 up front was the deciding factor for that over my '90 OR rigid. Even with the front fork my wrists were killing me after 70 miles on the bike. Your bike and my '90 could be twins: Same colour, same decals and rigid SS. As far as I know there were about 5 Bontragers there on Saturday.


Ah thats awesome! I definitely saw you there, very cool. The '94 is really pretty. I met another guy there who has a whole quiver of Bontragers in his basement, none that were present though. I saw our three, must've missed the other two. I loved it out on the course, all those sweeping turns were crazy fun. My wrists are still aching after 60miles though. Going for 70+ next year!


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

Can someone please tell me what the little black thing is on the seat tube under the seat clamp on some Bontragers? It almost looks like a pice of tape, but I've seen it on several bikes. Thanks.


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## IZH-35M (Jan 15, 2011)

classen said:


> Can someone please tell me what the little black thing is on the seat tube under the seat clamp on some Bontragers? It almost looks like a pice of tape, but I've seen it on several bikes. Thanks.


Original.

They're slow though.


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## gotdirt (Jan 17, 2006)

classen said:


> Can someone please tell me what the little black thing is on the seat tube under the seat clamp on some Bontragers? It almost looks like a pice of tape, but I've seen it on several bikes. Thanks.


a simple rubber sleeve to keep brake-cable rub from wearing down the finish...


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

gotdirt said:


> a simple rubber sleeve to keep brake-cable rub from wearing down the finish...


I think it's to keep water from getting in. But yeah, just a piece of rubber.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Boy named SSue said:


> I think it's to keep water from getting in. But yeah, just a piece of rubber.


Yep. It's too keep water out of the slot in the seat tube. They came from the factory on Bontrager frames. If you need one, an inner tube cut to size makes a good replacement.


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## 1978 (Sep 23, 2010)

laffeaux said:


> Yep. It's too keep water out of the slot in the seat tube. They came from the factory on Bontrager frames. If you need one, an inner tube cut to size makes a good replacement.


Needs to be a fairly skinny inner tube, I've found road bike tubes fit best.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

They even came on CX frames.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

*Imposter crown?*

What do you experts make of this?

I recently bought a Rock Shox Judy DH with a 1" steerer, specifically because it was supposed have a bontrager crown. Now that I have it in my hands, it doesn't look any different from the regular, silver Judy crowns that I have - except that it's black. :madmax:

Am I correct in thinking that this is _not_ a reduced-offset crown, or is the difference between the two versions too subtle to see? I unfortunately no longer have the correct one that came with my bike to compare against, and I don't remember exactly what it looked like.

If anyone can show me or direct me to some pictures comparing known-different crowns, I'd appreciate it.

Also, any idea what's up with the bolt head at the bottom of the steerer tube? This is a _threadless_ 1" steerer. Could it have something to do with that? I've never seen this either, on any threaded tubes.

Sorry for the crappy cell phone pictures.


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

this may or may not be helpful, particularly since it's a threaded 1" bontrager specific judy compared to a 1 1/8" threadless judy crown


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Sizzler said:


> this may or may not be helpful, particularly since it's a threaded 1" bontrager specific judy compared to a 1 1/8" threadless judy crown


Hmmm... The fact that the bontrager one has press-fit legs, instead of bolt-in, makes it even harder. But thanks nonetheless.

I found this thread after posting my question, but it doesn't quite answer the question either - other than to suggest that there were very few threadless 1" bontrager crowns.

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/bontrager-fork-crown-335083.html


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Well, I just recieved a black bolt-on judy crown, with a long ti steerer.
Only the top is threaded so about 7 " threadless. I´m gonna use it as threadless


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Since we're on the topic of forks, could someone please give a simplified explanation to a doofus such as myself what the bontrager offset does to the geometry and handling? 

In another thread, colker1 explained that it moves "your front wheel axle is closer to your downtube by .25in. . ." 

So, does the bontrager offset reduce trail and give the bike handling characteristics similar to increasing the head angle beyond 71 degrees? 

colker1 also explained that it give the bontrager "Better high speed stability", but it seems like the bontrager would be less stable and more twitchy as a result? 

Also, if increasing the fork's length reduces the head angle, then would a suspension corrected bontrager frame handle poorly with an earlier bontrager composite fork? 

I'm guessing everything I just said was wrong so please help me understand.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Sizzler said:


> Since we're on the topic of forks, could someone please give a simplified explanation to a doofus such as myself what the bontrager offset does to the geometry and handling?
> 
> In another thread, colker1 explained that it moves "your front wheel axle is closer to your downtube by .25in. . ."
> 
> ...


I'd like to hear some thoiughts on this, too. I've _often_ heard that the bontrager crown was intended to "quicken steering," but that doesn't make sense to me.

As you noted, a REDUCED-offset crown should INCREASE TRAIL, which would make the steering slower and more stable.

This might explain why so many people have been happy with the change to taller( 80mm) forks with increased (ie.: standard) offset crowns: The resulting REDUCED TRAIL would theoretically quicken steering a bit, thereby compensating for the slackened head tube angle.

I'm in the process of rebuilding 3 bontys - a race, a race lite, and a ti lite - and I have three different 1" forks and crowns, of varying offsets and travels, and have been trying to wrap my head around this question too, as I decide which to pair with which.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> I'd like to hear some thoiughts on this, too. I've _often_ heard that the bontrager crown was intended to "quicken steering," but that doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> As you noted, a REDUCED-offset crown should INCREASE TRAIL, which would make the steering slower and more stable.


Bontragers came with a somewhat steep HTA which make bikes handle quickly. To offset the steepened angle the fork used a reduced offset to stabilize the handling at speed. So the bikes handled quickly at slower speeds, yet weren't too unstable at higher speeds.

And Sizzler... it's somewhat counter intuitive, but moving the wheel closer to the frame by reducing the fork's offset makes a bike more stable. Conversely, moving the wheel further forward by slackening the head tube angle also makes a bike more stable.


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## puddletown (Jan 30, 2011)

I have a 94 Race with the Bontrager fork and ti hellbent bars. Love it and ride it often.










I have wondered so many times why KB does not get back into frame production. I'd buy a steel 29'er in a heartbeat.

Any ideas why he called it quits and remains in "retirement"?


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

puddletown said:


> Any ideas why he called it quits and remains in "retirement"?


Might have to do with the dumptrucks full of money Trek delivers to his house each morning.


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## StanleyButterfly (Nov 4, 2009)

Lol! Dump truck full of awesome.


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## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

Alright, we all love our Bontragers. Like many of you, I have owned several bikes since I originally retired my Bonty due to a blown fork, but none have compared.

I am finally getting to the point where my '96 Privateer Comp is almost revamped (just waiting on a new headset to come in). I am also, however, preparing myself for the time when I will eventually need to replace the Bonty (due to frame stress, fatigue or god forbid a crash). 

Then, the question becomes, who, if anyone, is currently producing a frame with similar ride qualities? Production models only, custom doesn't count. From my research, it appears that Voodoo follows the geometry most closely. Any other thoughts or comments?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

bianchinut said:


> Alright, we all love our Bontragers. Like many of you, I have owned several bikes since I originally retired my Bonty due to a blown fork, but none have compared.
> 
> I am finally getting to the point where my '96 Privateer Comp is almost revamped (just waiting on a new headset to come in). I am also, however, preparing myself for the time when I will eventually need to replace the Bonty (due to frame stress, fatigue or god forbid a crash).
> 
> Then, the question becomes, who, if anyone, is currently producing a frame with similar ride qualities? Production models only, custom doesn't count. From my research, it appears that Voodoo follows the geometry most closely. Any other thoughts or comments?


Why not just get another Privateer? They're not uncommon or expensive. Go with what you like and what you knows works.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)




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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

fix your housing


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Too lazy.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

bianchinut said:


> Then, the question becomes, who, if anyone, is currently producing a frame with similar ride qualities? Production models only, custom doesn't count.


Why limit it to "production" frames only? There are plenty of builders that can build you a bike that will ride like a Bontrager. Rock Lobster and Hunter have the Santa Cruz connection, and Kirk Pacenti (BikeLugs.com) probably built the frame that you're riding right now.

Vicous Cycles makes frames that are somewhat similar, but the BB is a bit higher.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


>


Nice!!!


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

The full.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Where did you get it? From Sky? Why the new Syncros there?


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## bushpig (Nov 26, 2005)

Great looking bike. Looks like the relatively old Syncros too...


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## asa572 (Sep 13, 2010)

colker1 said:


> Why the new Syncros there?





bushpig said:


> Looks like the relatively old Syncros too...


 which one is it?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Great looking bike, R. The problem with Bontragers is once you ride one the rest of your bikes will seem ho-hum.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> Great looking bike, R. The problem with Bontragers is once you ride one the rest of your bikes will seem ho-hum.


The Phoenix and potts.. they became lethargic.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

bushpig said:


> Great looking bike. Looks like the relatively old Syncros too...


feels too new for that bike. An XT would fit better.. and then strap a turbo saddle there.


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## paetersen (Jul 28, 2007)

Mud would be a better fit. Go get that poor thing dirty. It's *too* clean...


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

colker1 said:


> Where did you get it? From Sky? Why the new Syncros there?


Ya, VeloCult purchase. Vertical text is older Syncros. Not a first gen post, but not totally out of place. It was on my 89 Ultimate (which the original owner of that bike spec'ed it with).



laffeaux said:


> Great looking bike, R. The problem with Bontragers is once you ride one the rest of your bikes will seem ho-hum.


Rode better than expected yesterday. I need more time on it of course, but I'd say the rest of my bikes are safe.



colker1 said:


> feels too new for that bike. An XT would fit better.. and then strap a turbo saddle there.


Flite is technically a year too new on this bike...but I'm not splitting hairs here. 
I'd swap for an XT or better yet a Ritchey/Nitto. A little setback would have been good.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Almost bought that bike from him.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Flite is technically a year too new on this bike...but I'm not splitting hairs here.
> I'd swap for an XT or better yet a Ritchey/Nitto. A little setback would have been good.


I vote for an American Classic.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

Boy named SSue said:


> I vote for an American Classic.


Yaa, that'd be my first choice too. Last one on ePay went higher than I wanted.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

colker1 said:


> Almost bought that bike from him.


Glad you didn't.


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## cursivearmy (Jan 26, 2004)

Factory ss, one of the few 26" bikes I like to ride every now and then. Never mind. I'll get the pic later.







[/URL][/IMG]


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Glad you didn't.


I hate you.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

colker1 said:


> I hate you.


:winker:


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

It's now later, where are the pics? I've attached a photo of mine, so let's see what you've got. 

jw



cursivearmy said:


> Factory ss, one of the few 26" bikes I like to ride every now and then. Never mind. I'll get the pic later.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Hot.


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

I've got a Bontrager fork that I want to run with a 700c Bontrager frame. It looks like the clamps that hold the brake posts in place are held there with a pop rivet. Has anybody had success moving the posts up the fork legs (or have any recommendations about doing so?).


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Crown identification update:

A couple of weeks ago, I asked if anyone could tell whether or not my recently-acquired black Rock Shox crown was truly a reduced-offset Bontrager version. I never got a definitive answer, but have figured some things out that I thought I'd share:

The specified 1/4" difference in offset, between the standard and Bontrager-specific crowns, is a lot, relatively speaking. So I always assumed (and had read) that it would be easy to see the difference between the two when placed side-by-side. Well, that's not necessarily the case....









There seem to have been a couple different versions of the forged, bold-on crowns made. (Perhaps they weren't even made by Rock Shox at first?) The following picture from Mr. Orange, which must be of an older one, really had me worried. Note the large flat spot at the base of the steerer tube. The typical, silver Rock Shox versions don't have this. The "black" crowns I've been able to get ahold of looked just like the silver crowns, with no flat spot and _definitley_ don't have a 1/4" different positon for the stancion holes, relative to the steerer tube.









I don't know how to measure this accurately or scientifically, but the following photos show what I figured out: *The offset difference between the two crowns is accomplished entirely by varying the angle at which the steerer tube inserts into the crown:*






















I always assumed that the components of a suspension fork were all parallel to each other and acted on axes that were parallel to the head tube, and that the offset was created by the shape of the crown and dropouts - but I guess that's not the case. The Bontrager crown is actually closer to doing this than the standard crown, though. However, since the axes of the steerer tube and stanction tubes diverge, this means that _the longer the fork, the more pronounced the offset reduction will be,_ compared to a standard crown!

So the real reason for bringing this up, if I understand the relationship between offset, trail and steering properly, and the implication for those of us who are building "frankenforks" to keep our Bontys alive is this: Unless you plan to stick with 63mm or less travel, the black Bontrager crown might not be the best choice for retaining the bike's factory handling. The offset & steering stabilizing/slowing effect would theoretically be increased _beyond_ 1/4" (relative to a standard crown) with a longer fork (ie: 80mm travel). So for those cases, the typical silver crown might be better.

I know I'm WAY over-thinking this (and am not a skilled enough rider to notice the difference, probably), but I found it funny that I've spent so much time looking for the black crowns when I might not even prefer them in the end....



laffeaux said:


> Bontragers came with a somewhat steep HTA which make bikes handle quickly. To offset the steepened angle the fork used a reduced offset to stabilize the handling at speed. So the bikes handled quickly at slower speeds, yet weren't too unstable at higher speeds.
> 
> And Sizzler... it's somewhat counter intuitive, but moving the wheel closer to the frame by reducing the fork's offset makes a bike more stable. Conversely, moving the wheel further forward by slackening the head tube angle also makes a bike more stable.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

babbalanja said:


> I've got a Bontrager fork that I want to run with a 700c Bontrager frame. It looks like the clamps that hold the brake posts in place are held there with a pop rivet. Has anybody had success moving the posts up the fork legs (or have any recommendations about doing so?).


They brake bosses are held in place by some seriously powerful epoxy (something like Dupont Scotchweld DP-420 ) in addition to the pop rivet. I bought a pretty beat up pair of the Bonty comps and wanted to breath some new life into them so I removed the brake bosses in order to reanodize them and paint the legs, but I put them right back where they came from. If you want to relocate them check the diameter of the leg higher up where you want them to be positioned and it might work just fine. I used a block of wood on top of the brake boss and a rubber mallet to beat the bosses off the fork. It took some patience, but eventually they slide off the bottom. The fork legs will have some epoxy residue on them so you will most likely have to sand/blast the fork legs to get it off.... which means new paint.

Anyways, let's see some pictures if you decide to do this.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> View attachment 664314


Great pic for showing the difference!!!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

classen said:


> They brake bosses are held in place by some seriously powerful epoxy (something like Dupont Scotchweld DP-420 ) in addition to the pop rivet. I bought a pretty beat up pair of the Bonty comps and wanted to breath some new life into them so I removed the brake bosses in order to reanodize them and paint the legs, but I put them right back where they came from. If you want to relocate them check the diameter of the leg higher up where you want them to be positioned and it might work just fine. I used a block of wood on top of the brake boss and a rubber mallet to beat the bosses off the fork. It took some patience, but eventually they slide off the bottom. The fork legs will have some epoxy residue on them so you will most likely have to sand/blast the fork legs to get it off.... which means new paint.
> 
> Anyways, let's see some pictures if you decide to do this.


.. and then rake for a 26in wheel bike usually is different from cyclocross, road bikes or 29ers.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> Crown identification update:
> 
> A couple of weeks ago, I asked if anyone could tell whether or not my recently-acquired black Rock Shox crown was truly a reduced-offset Bontrager version. I never got a definitive answer, but have figured some things out that I thought I'd share:
> 
> ...


Interesting. So you'd think the Bontrager black crown would look like it was bent from a frontal impact from the side view, but maybe it's so slight that it's not really noticeable. The Judys run parallel to the steerer tube I'm pretty sure. The pre-Judy versions of Rock Shox forks all had stanchions that were off a few degrees from parallel (to get their offset) but in the other direction vs the Bontrager crown.


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

colker1 said:


> .. and then rake for a 26in wheel bike usually is different from cyclocross, road bikes or 29ers.


According to KB, the frame is an OR that one of his employees made into a cx bike by positioning the rear brake mounts higher (and setting the rear dropouts at 130mm). The original frame geometry was 71 HTA and 74 STA.

He added that the guy used one of their composite forks with the bosses moved to the 700c position. He also said that I could use any 700c cross fork I think as long as it's not too long.

I may go with a cross fork ultimately, but the switchblade looks so perfect on the frame that it may be worth the trouble to move the brakes. Incidentally, the fork I have has a 5 stamped on the underside of the crown, but I can't recall if that means it's one of the models with the most rake or the least.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

classen said:


> They brake bosses are held in place by some seriously powerful epoxy (something like Dupont Scotchweld DP-420 ) in addition to the pop rivet. I bought a pretty beat up pair of the Bonty comps and wanted to breath some new life into them so I removed the brake bosses in order to reanodize them and paint the legs, but I put them right back where they came from. If you want to relocate them check the diameter of the leg higher up where you want them to be positioned and it might work just fine. I used a block of wood on top of the brake boss and a rubber mallet to beat the bosses off the fork. It took some patience, but eventually they slide off the bottom. The fork legs will have some epoxy residue on them so you will most likely have to sand/blast the fork legs to get it off.... which means new paint.
> 
> Anyways, let's see some pictures if you decide to do this.


I met a guy at Tour de Fat a couple of years back who had done it for his GF. He had built her a pretty sweet Bianchi including that fork.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

what fork did you go with?


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## nikesite (Apr 12, 2010)

*My Bontrager.*

Back from the dead and converted to full rigid.

Rides like a dream.

new forks
stem
bars
grips
seatpost
tires


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## seebee (Feb 9, 2008)

nikesite said:


> Back from the dead and converted to full rigid.
> 
> Rides like a dream.
> 
> ...


can't see it being setup any other way. That's a proper mtn bike. 
Still the best, most worry free, non pedal bob, non brake jack "linkage" system out there.

Nike Site - Nice handle brah!


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## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

Ok, so I met with my local mechanic today and we have set up a tentative date for this Saturday for the restoration/modification/rebirth of my '96 Bontrager Privateer Comp. All the parts are finally in save the chain, cables and housing. Pictures to follow.


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## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

*Build Base*

Here is the frame, stripped of all parts and ready to be built.

Build Kit:

Fork: Kona P2
Headset: Cane Creek S-2
Handle Bar: Bontrager Race
Grips: Ritchey
Stem: Soma
Saddle: Specialized BG Tomac
Seat Post: Bontrager Race
Crankset and BB: Shimano LX with external BB
Front D: Shimano XT
Rear D: Shimano XT
Shifters: SRAM Rocket 9 speed
Brake Levers: Cane Creek Direct Curve
Brakes: Cane Creek Direct Curve
Pedals: Shimano M520
Wheelset: Shimano Deore
Cassette: SRAM 9 speed
Tires: Specialized Team and Dirt Control


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

GrumpyOne said:


> It's now later, where are the pics? I've attached a photo of mine, so let's see what you've got.
> 
> jw


Really like the drop bar set-up on your Bontrager. I have been thinking about going that route with my OR this past year, but finding the right stem is always the issue. Edit: ignore earlier stupid question as its obviously a clamp-on stem!! Looks great though!


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Thanks. Yep I had the stem custom made, there's a bit more info here: Link
I've made a few changes since the original post, but it's still setup with a drop bar and I'm still liking it set up that way.

jw



N10S said:


> Really like the drop bar set-up on your Bontrager. I have been thinking about going that route with my OR this past year, but finding the right stem is always the issue. Edit: ignore earlier stupid question as its obviously a clamp-on stem!! Looks great though!


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

GrumpyOne said:


> Thanks. Yep I had the stem custom made, there's a bit more info here: Link
> I've made a few changes since the original post, but it's still setup with a drop bar and I'm still liking it set up that way.
> 
> jw


Thanks for the link to the other thread. I have been on and off the forums at times and missed that post totally. Great looking set-up with the Pace fork.I bet that bike is pretty light eh? I think your mix of new and old works great and that stem is the deal. I have been out on Rody's site and now realize why that stem looked familiar!  I have been thinking about a similar set-up using the new Nitto RM014 handlebar. A Groovy stem with 31.8mm clamp would work perfectly.

JR


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## teamfatnold (Jan 18, 2012)

I have a Bontrager with a 1" head tube and a blown rock shock fork, should I put a rigid fork on it, put an RST Gila on it for $190 or just buy beer and ride the blown fork? Any and all opinions appreciated.


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## teamfatnold (Jan 18, 2012)

I have a Bontrager with a 1" head tube and a blown rock shock fork, should I put a rigid fork on it, put an RST Gila on it for $190 or just buy beer and ride the blown fork? Any and all opinions appreciated.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

teamfatnold said:


> I have a Bontrager with a 1" head tube and a blown rock shock fork, should I put a rigid fork on it, put an RST Gila on it for $190 or just buy beer and ride the blown fork? Any and all opinions appreciated.


What model fork? Blown how? I had a 95 Judy XC and swapped out for a Mountainspeed (I think) spring and it works far better now.


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## teamfatnold (Jan 18, 2012)

Sorry for the my ignorance I love this bike but I'm not a real bike person. The fork is a red Rock shock xc. It is the second fork I have put on this bike and it cost over $300. It bottoms out and comes back up immediately. there is oil leaking. I took it to the local bike shop they told me it is"blown" and that the rebuild kit is no longer available. I bought another bike but I still covet the bontrager and would be happy to use it as $1000.00 parts bike (my wife might be pissed) if I could get a decent new fork.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

there are some shops that could rebuild your RS... hippie tech and others. Just go w/ the bontrager. That's the spirit of this forum.


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

If it is a bolt on crown, send it to shockpital and have them put a 1999-2000 SID legs on it. I did this this with mine and they also put 2008 SID internals in it. I now have a pretty modern fork, with a 1 inch steer tube and up to date performance.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

dcurtis said:


> If it is a bolt on crown, send it to shockpital and have them put a 1999-2000 SID legs on it. I did this this with mine and they also put 2008 SID internals in it. I now have a pretty modern fork, with a 1 inch steer tube and up to date performance.


What does an operation like that run? I assume that you have to supply both the Judy aNd the SID? If I have a curmudgeonly preference for coil sprung, what is the best option? I had looked into this before but never pulledthe trigger. 
For my next planned build, I have a pretty light, brand new red coil- sprung Judy SL that I want to use with a 98 Privateer frame once it's repainted. I'm not too worried about the rake of a fork of that vintage.
Who should I get to paint my frame?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Also have a 98 Privateer frame with a little cancer bubbling the paint under the end of the wiishbone. Should I leave it as is or peel it and paint it?


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## jason745 (Apr 13, 2007)

teamfatnold said:


> Sorry for the my ignorance I love this bike but I'm not a real bike person. The fork is a red Rock shock xc. It is the second fork I have put on this bike and it cost over $300. It bottoms out and comes back up immediately. there is oil leaking. I took it to the local bike shop they told me it is"blown" and that the rebuild kit is no longer available. I bought another bike but I still covet the bontrager and would be happy to use it as $1000.00 parts bike (my wife might be pissed) if I could get a decent new fork.


I built this one a couple years ago with a brand new 1" threadless White Brothers Magic 80. Give the kids at MRP a call, and they can custom make you a fork with a 1" if you want to go down that route.

 My 1994 Race Resto-Mod


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## dcurtis (Sep 5, 2007)

I'm not sure what the cost was. I did some trading with them. I didn't supply any of the parts, he had everything. I would call them and ask for B. Rose. He was very good to work with.

Phone # 888-871-2711
Contact | Shockspital


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## teamfatnold (Jan 18, 2012)

Thanks for all the help I was mourning now I have hope. I took it to a bike shop yesterday and the guy there actually knew enough to identify the bike as a racelite built in Santa Cruz and said the fork is an early version of the SID fork.


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## bianchinut (May 27, 2010)

After many delays, here is the picture I just received from my mechanic. It has been 10 years since this bike was last completely built! I cannot wait to pick it up on Saturday:thumbsup:
I feel like a little kid with Christmas fast approaching!


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## labarnett (Mar 14, 2011)

*which fork for 1994 Bonty Race?*

I am faced with the classic problem of finding a fork with a 1" steerer to replace the old Mag 21 on my Bonty Race. I have been waiting for a 2001 or 2002 marzocchi z2 atom race 80mm (coil/oil) to show up on ebay in a reasonable color scheme, but am getting impatient! There is a nicely rebuilt 1999 marzocchi superfly z2 (air) available for the same price, but I am hesitant to go with an older air fork with a history of complaints about blown seals and other issues (difficulty accessing air valves, necessity of a extra long allen to adjust rebound).

The superfly does have a shorter A-C length at 433mm (as opposed to about 450mm for the atom), which would probably be good considering the bike was designed for a fork with a 395mm A-C length. I vary between 180 and 190lbs, which may favor the coil/oil option.

What do you all think?


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## labarnett (Mar 14, 2011)

Keep in mind I have converted the 94 Race to SS, so it is pretty light...putting a 4+ lb coil/oil marzocchi fork on there would make the front end really heavy! I'm not a weight weenie, but this might be another advantage of the superfly (at a little over 3 lbs).


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I like coil sprung for the low maintenance.


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Hey folks,
got my 97 priveteer back which I sold to a friend 10 years ago!



now I need help to get some decals, wheels, stx rc parts and a fork for it.
I am serching the web for two weeks now and everywhere I find somethig the ppl want a lot of money for the part. For example a guy offered me some copy decals for 50$.

So please have a heart for my bike and offer me some stuff I can afford!
PM TO ME PLZ


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Is that a picture of the bike in its current condition or an earlier picture taken when you owned it before? Other than the seat it looks pretty clean. If you want decals I think that a guy named gil over on retrobike uk is probably one source that can provide nice bontrager decals. Those will be reproductions too though, and it may be difficult to find any factory original decals. 

Always nice to get one of your old bikes back!


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

It is the current condition, if you have a closer look you see a lot of scratches so I have no choice than repainting it. heard a lot of gil but couldn't find him yet. what do you think about paying 50 bugs on it(silver yellow decals) at least I would have some? Someone else got a new back gear stx rc and I asked him to pay 60 and he said he wants more, I can't belive that someone who has a heart for bikes wants to make money out of someone else who has the same problems. If I could get a good picture (vector grafic) I would make my own decals but with the pictures I found yet it is impossible.

I am very happy to have it back, I was so sad to sell it but it was a good friend who gave it back to me for free!

I have a problem getting the seat pole of, tried oils and rust killers and now the frame is filled with coke, hope I get it out. I don't want to use force on it.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

boblike said:


> Hey folks,
> got my 97 priveteer back which I sold to a friend 10 years ago!
> 
> now I need help to get some decals, wheels, stx rc parts and a fork for it.
> ...


It looks good, tune it up and go ride it!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

...well, I guess a new saddle. I saw new Bontrager Inform R saddles on ebay for $20 shipped last week.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

boblike said:


> It is the current condition, if you have a closer look you see a lot of scratches so I have no choice than repainting it. heard a lot of gil but couldn't find him yet. what do you think about paying 50 bugs on it(silver yellow decals) at least I would have some? Someone else got a new back gear stx rc and I asked him to pay 60 and he said he wants more, I can't belive that someone who has a heart for bikes wants to make money out of someone else who has the same problems. If I could get a good picture (vector grafic) I would make my own decals but with the pictures I found yet it is impossible.
> 
> I am very happy to have it back, I was so sad to sell it but it was a good friend who gave it back to me for free!
> 
> I have a problem getting the seat pole of, tried oils and rust killers and now the frame is filled with coke, hope I get it out. I don't want to use force on it.


Bum deal on the seatpost, hope you get that cleared up. Here is Gils website, I think it has his contact info listed.

Wheel Building

I have had good luck with him in the past. My 91 OR still needs decals and when I get ready to purchase it will be from Gil.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Doesn't have to be STX-RC, any eight speed Shimano components will work. For what you are seeing as prices, you should look for Shimano Deore LX or Shimano Deore XT eight speed derailleurs instead. STX-RC was usually original equipment and is kind of the lowest of the better grade Shimano stuff. Eight speed LX or XT are going to be compatible.


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## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

Bontrager question of the day: I have a set of nos unfinished Bontrager fork blades that are smaller in diameter then any I've ever seen. As I remember the Comp's measured 28.6mm where inserted at the crown and the Race blades measured 25.4mm, these measure 24.0mm. I remember seeing pics of old Bontrager cyclocross forks that had a sleeve mounted at the top of the blades (some form of external butting maybe?) but those had curved blades and mine are straight. Was such a thing ever produced or maybe these were a one-off. DId they never receive the sleeves or was there a crown made small enough to fit them as is?


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

any pictures?


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Yesh, you have CX legs.


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## jack lantern (Jun 23, 2006)

From left to right: Comp blade, Race blade, & mystery blade. Other pic hopefully shows space with blade placed in Race crown.


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## -Anomie- (Jan 16, 2005)

I suppose I should throw some recent photos of my '93 Race Light up here, since it's been completely reconfigured. One of these days I'll get around to posting a complete build thread, but these will do for now:


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## dec993 (Jan 26, 2011)

Mine, almost two years after I started gathering parts for it. I'll post more when I have her cleaned up.


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## mark831 (Apr 5, 2012)

*what year is this Bontrager*

Hey guys I am trying to figure out what year my bike was built.I know it is from the eighties but not sure what year. Any ideas or opinions will be greatly apreciated. I need a two part tensioner for head set too. Looking forward to hearing from you. The serial number is 240


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

94-5


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Hello,

is it true that I can only use 1" forks for my 97 Privateer.
Have so many nice old forks, like Manitou XC 700 and one of the first ROND FORKS (before WP or Magura) and there is now way of using them? Do you want to see a grown up man cry!

Thanks


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## puddletown (Jan 30, 2011)

MrOrange said:


> 94-5


Agreed. What's the serial no?


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## puddletown (Jan 30, 2011)

boblike said:


> Hello,
> 
> is it true that I can only use 1" forks for my 97 Privateer.
> Have so many nice old forks, like Manitou XC 700 and one of the first ROND FORKS (before WP or Magura) and there is now way of using them? Do you want to see a grown up man cry!
> ...


No tears...

Chris King Devolution


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## mark831 (Apr 5, 2012)

*serial number to bontrager*

Hello I believe the serial number is 240.Thanks for your help


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

We also offer a model for use with 1-1/8" forks and “Evolution”-sized 1-1/4" frames. Again, no shims and no special adaptors here. Devolution™ has the same number of parts as our NoThreadSet™.

I have a 1" frame


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## mark831 (Apr 5, 2012)

bbb


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

-Anomie- said:


> I suppose I should throw some recent photos of my '93 Race Light up here, since it's been completely reconfigured. One of these days I'll get around to posting a complete build thread, but these will do for now:


Love the build, quite tasty! :thumbsup:


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## edray (Oct 3, 2004)

Anybody have a 1" threadless steerer for a '92 Tange Switchblade they'd be willing to part with?


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## jeffgothro (Mar 10, 2007)

I used to have a pre-trek Bontrager - I found a 96 Privateer cheap recently in my area - sooooo tempted to buy.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

That one has a pretty good build, Jeff. Wouldn't be a bad pick up.


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## Kdboxerdog (Feb 11, 2012)

I just picked up that same frame/fork/stem at a bike swap. I asked this question in a different thread but no one seems to look there, so I'll ask it here. Quadra 21r with a black crown, threaded 1" steerer. Same as in the photo above. Is it a Bontrager specific crown?


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## jeffgothro (Mar 10, 2007)

Kdboxerdog said:


> I just picked up that same frame/fork/stem at a bike swap. I asked this question in a different thread but no one seems to look there, so I'll ask it here. Quadra 21r with a black crown, threaded 1" steerer. Same as in the photo above. Is it a Bontrager specific crown?


I dont believe it is since it appears to be bonded instead of bolted. You need to get a second opinion however, I'm no athority on those crowns, I've only owned one pair of Bontrager switchblades and no RS Bontrager crowned forks.

I hear that GOB, its a XT/LX mix...aint she gorgeous, still, I'm having a really hard time justifying it...I really dont need "another" bike. :nono:

Additionally, I'm just starting building my Psyclone (which is my "holy grail") honestly, and logically, my money would be better spent on the build, and I think I would be happier in the end.

Interesting sort of ironic side story - (how I came to own a Bontrager). Long story short, I bought a sick 3,500.00$ GT Psyclone custom built XTR and all the top shelf race goodies of the day, Cooks bros, Control Tech, Advocet Ti, etc (mid 90's)...had the bike a few weeks, fell in love like never before...OMG, this bike rode as if Thor came down from the sky with his hammer and lighning and custom made this thing to my exact body type - as perfect a fit and better than anything else I've ever ridden, she was ultra light (kept the stock steel fork - to keep weight down), shifting was ultra quick, and smoothe as butter.

A few weeks after I had her, (the short story) she got destroyed was an accedent. Istead of buying/waiting for a replacement, my impatient a$$ when and bought a Bontrager Race OR w/ the Bontrager fork, the one piece Bontrager bar/stem combo, and a few other goodies. Awsome bike, but ultimatly, the Psyclone stole my heart, and I wish I had waited on the replacement...and here we are, almost 20 years later.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

jeffgothro said:


> I dont believe it is since it appears to be bonded instead of bolted. You need to get a second opinion however, I'm no athority on those crowns, I've only owned one pair of Bontrager switchblades and no RS Bontrager crowned forks.
> 
> I hear that GOB, its a XT/LX mix...aint she gorgeous, still, I'm having a really hard time justifying it...I really dont need "another" bike. :nono:
> 
> ...


How the F did you spell Kazakhstan?


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## jeffgothro (Mar 10, 2007)

I looked it up, I cant speel worth a crap... :lol:

ooops spell*

See.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

*Bontrager Race*










Bought new old stock and assembled with bits I'd been hoarding. I think it's a 1995. Tried to keep it pretty period correct. It's almost all Shimano Deore XT including the brakes, derailleurs, cranks... went with the LX shifters which had the more compact shape (mimicking later Deore XT v-compatible brake/ lever sets, but canti-compatible) over the bigger Rapidfire Plus Deore XTs. Fork has a Mountain Speed Spring in one leg.


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## kellyjk (Oct 3, 2008)

*1996 privateer bb? 68 or 73 ?*

Just like the title is the 96 privateer a 68 or 73mm?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kellyjk said:


> Just like the title is the 96 privateer a 68 or 73mm?


All of the Santa Cruz built bikes are 68mm. I assume that the Privateers (built in Wisconsin) are the same.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> All of the Santa Cruz built bikes are 68mm. I assume that the Privateers (built in Wisconsin) are the same.


Oddly enough, I have encountered at last one Privateer bottom bracket in 73mm, pretty sure. Best way to tell is to measure with a ruler / tape measure.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

I have to post mine here. I abandoned old tech whenever possible:
Bontrager Race Lite | MTB Marin


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

The privateers bb shell is 73 mm.
/J


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

What length BB spindle would I need to run Cook Bros RSR cranks on a 1994 Race Lite?
Thanks


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

classen said:


> What length BB spindle would I need to run Cook Bros RSR cranks on a 1994 Race Lite?
> Thanks


RSRs need a really wide spindle. Depending on the chainline you need, use a 123mm or slightly wider spindle.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Man...I have no will power when it comes to buying (and selling) bikes. I just sold and shipped my 1990 Bontrager OR this week and turned around this weekend and stumbled across an extremely clean 1999 Bontrager Privateer S. Some grease on the chainstay but no grindage and the bike came with the TIME ATAC pedals, cateye computer, and lizardskin chainstay guard. Owner has had the bike for over 10 years and ridden the bike very little.

I went to look at the bike expecting it to be a 96-97 but this is the last of the Bontrager model run with the 1.125" head tube which I think is a cool find especially for the price I paid. The fork is a likely replacement item in the future but that will be an easy find considering its a 1.125 steerer. Anyway just wanted to share the pics.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Great find, a lovely bike! Have fun getting her muddy!


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## uphiller (Jan 13, 2004)

Cool bike. Beware those first-generation of mass-produced Avid V-Brakes- they are powerful, but in my experience squeal, and the return springs tend to come out of adjustment very often.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

I am going to use this bike as a baseline for a light 1x9 trail bike. I will keep all of the original parts in a box and change out brakes and levers to xtr, lighter wheelset, lighter post, saddle stem and bars, and a rigid fork of some sort. The bike has some potential but right now its a porker and thats a contradiction considering all of the bontragers I have owned in the past have been reasonably light.That fork alone is around 4.2 lbs and has way too much travel for the bike. I actually have a great old 1" rigid straight blade fork but in this case the size of the head tube doesn't work for me.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

A friend found this in his garage while cleaning up and bestowed it to me:


































Looks like a Privateer or some mid to late 90s vintage with a missing downtube. It doesn't oven look like the downtube was every welded on .

If I can find a frame builder that would be willing to fit a downtube, I think this would make a great bike for one of my boys.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Take off the head tube while you're at it and put a new one on that accepts integrated bearings for tapered or 1-1/8" bearings.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Anyone try running 650b on a Bontrager with sliding dropouts? I could get a new White Bros. fork up front and 650b it... if it would fit.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

goto11 said:


> Take off the head tube while you're at it and put a new one on that accepts integrated bearings for tapered or 1-1/8" bearings.


Why?


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by goto11
> Take off the head tube while you're at it and put a new one on that accepts integrated bearings for tapered or 1-1/8" bearings.
> Why?


I know firsthand as the owner of a Bontrager with 1" head tube that it is very difficult to find a decent front shock with a 1" steerer, unless you have White Brothers custom build you one for ~$900.


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Goto11:
There´s a guy on Retrobike that had a bonty with horizontal dropouts that used 650B.
He also used it on his Ti Lite.
I´ll probably do it in the future on my privateer, I´m curious to try it myself.
Check out my privateer link below, it´s in there somewhere...
/J


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

N10S:
Nice find!
It looks almost brand new, and with the steel crowbar that came with it :thumbsup:
/J


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Not with sliders, but with track ends/horizontal drops: Bontrager Single Speed 650b Conversion

The main issue is rear brake positioning. I have to have my wheel as far back as possible or the brake pads won't reach. And even then the brake noddle clearance is tight.

jw



goto11 said:


> Anyone try running 650b on a Bontrager with sliding dropouts? I could get a new White Bros. fork up front and 650b it... if it would fit.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

namkrad said:


> N10S:
> Nice find!
> It looks almost brand new, and with the steel crowbar that came with it :thumbsup:
> /J


Thanks! Having put some trail miles on the bike I can report that it handles like my other past Bontragers and is a joy to ride on singletrack. Thanks to the influences of this thread I just bought a Pace RC31 for the Privateer (this is where the 1.125 head tube really starts to pay-off), and now just have to hunt down the Pace V-brake kit.  At any rate I can shed around 1200 grams of weight with the Pace fork and will be on my way to a significantly lighter Privateer, and maybe even a 650B conversion in the future. Looking forward to posting some "after" shots downstream someday.

Jeff


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

*My new Avatar*

I've been anxious to post this one up for a while. I finally got this bike put together over the weekend, and figured I should take and share some snapshots before I go muck it up. Through a little serendipity (or bicycle Karma or payback or something) and luck, it came together pretty well. 








Background, for those who care, is this:
Some time around '95, one of my best friends - a local race god and shop wrench - gave me his XL '94 Race frame, when he traded up to an XXL. For about 9 years, it was my only functioning bike and I put countless miles on it. But after I got my first full-suspension bike, a '97 Ellsworth Truth, used from yet another racer friend, the Bonty slowly fell out of rotation and ultimately into disrepair.

I always missed the Bontrager though, and so I set out a couple of years ago to start restoring it. But, through a process of rationalization that can only be achieved by someone who spends too much time reading the VRC forum, I got sidetracked. First I thought "Well, if I'm going to go to all this trouble, I might as well do it with a Race _Lite_," ... and ended up buying one. But then I started worrying that I might now be too heavy for the Race Lite, and decided that "If one is ok, and two are good.... then _three_ must be great!"

So, long story short, I ended up with this well-used '95 XL Ti Lite frame! Meanwhile, the Truth had fallen into disrepair and, since it was still my main ride, I decided to upgrade _it_ to a modern shock with more travel, and some disk brakes. And boy-oh-boy, did that decision provide me with the ideal parts to build up the Ti Lite!!!!























The wheels, skewers, fork, brakes, cassette and rear derailleur came from the Truth. The good folks at White Brothers were kind enough to install a 1" threaded steerer when they serviced the fork. (Amazing customer service , considering that this is a 15 year old fork!)









The impossible-to-find 27.0 seat post, in titanium, from _Titec_ no less, was a $40 ebay score. Perfection. (Many thanks to those of you who talked me into being patient and not reaming it out to a larger size.)








(Anti-chain suck plate in place!)















Crankset, pedals, saddle, shifters and tires came from my parts boxes, and the rest of the parts are new. The polished titanium quill stem, somehow still made by Nitto _in this day and age_, is the other highlight.









I never liked the plain, stock, blue decals (which were mostly missing), so I had Gil M. make me a new set to play off of the red bits on the fork, and to be a little more grahically consistent with typical Bontragers.









The ladies seem to approve!


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Keith,
That is one beautiful bike. Great job on the build. Functionally and aesthetically gorgeous. Your choice to go with the White fork is the topper in my book.

Now.......how does it ride?


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

jeff said:


> Keith,
> That is one beautiful bike. Great job on the build. Functionally and aesthetically gorgeous. Your choice to go with the White fork is the topper in my book.
> 
> Now.......how does it ride?


Thanks! I'm really happy about it, as you can tell. I'll take my first good ride this week, as soon as I can, but I'm not the guy to give an expert bike review. I've also been off of the Race for a fair number of years, so I don't have a fresh frame of reference. But so far, it basically feels like an "old familiar friend," which is exactly what I was hoping for!

I've often heard, and can now definitely confirm, that it feels stiffer than the steel versions - be that for better or worse.

There are some other subtle things about this particular frame (which may actually be a bit unique, too), which would be interesting to fellow Bontrager geeks, but probably nobody else: Geometry differences dictated by the thicker titanium tubing, and what appears to be the intention to require a longer-travel fork. Between those, switching to a seatpost with setback, wider bars, and a taller/shorter stem than I used in the past, it is considerably more comfortable than I remember - which is great, because I'm older than I remember, too!


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Love the Ti-lite, cool build and nice job on getting it set-up and on the trail again! Out of all of the many bikes I have owned over the years I can honestly say my favorite was a ti-lite equipped with a Marzochhi superfly fork. I don't regret selling many bikes, but thats one I should not have let get away. Thanks for sharing the pics and the story!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Okay, Brother followers of Brother Grumpy, 

Here's the situation. Trying to breathe life into an old Bontrager Race / OR. It has regular verticaI dropouts, but it still has the pulley for the front derailleur. I need the brake studs and the pulley. I'm going to just use conventional brake studs rather than the sleeve/ bolt arrangement, apparently they are M8 studs. I also found a nylon pulley which I think might work, out of a kit for sliding doors. I will have to drill out the tin housing around the pulley. So, that might work. What sort of bolt do I need to attach the pulley? I am going to try Fastenal or another fastener supply place, I guess. I already tried Menards and Home Depot. It seems like an M4? 4mm seems to start into the post holding the pulley on, but it doesn't seem to keep going. But maybe I'm doing it wrong. 
If anyone who has some of these, I'd buy them or trade some spoke bracelets for them, same with a chain deflector plate if anyone has it. Or can point me in the right direction. Thanks! If that pulley fits, I'll post a photo of the pulley.


----------



## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Random question: anyone ever try putting 700c wheels on a 26" bontrager frame, and if so, how'd it ride?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Do you mean like, with road tires? There isn't anyplace to mount a road brake. There isn't clearance for anything approaching a niner, of course, but people have done 69'ers with mixed results.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

...now, how about my problem?!? I have a frame that needs a pulley and brake studs! 

Actually, I might have a pulley that fits. I was wondering, are those Problem Solver repair cantilever stud kits long enough to use for the Race frame, or no good? It looks like the sleeve is included.


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

moved


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

kenjihara said:


> ...now, how about my problem?!? I have a frame that needs a pulley and brake studs!
> 
> Actually, I might have a pulley that fits. I was wondering, are those Problem Solver repair cantilever stud kits long enough to use for the Race frame, or no good? It looks like the sleeve is included.


if memory serves, no. the directions on the ps kit tell you to cut the original stud above the flats and then the sleeve goes on

just make new studs out of old canti bosses. drill through em and cut off the threads


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

Sizzler said:


> Random question: anyone ever try putting 700c wheels on a 26" bontrager frame, and if so, how'd it ride?


I have a 92(?) Race that, according to Keith, was built with the brake posts higher up so somebody in his shop could run CX wheels. Supposedly it worked pretty well, but the frame is halfway across the country (in my parents basement) and still in need of a suitable fork, so I can't speak from experience about whether or not that's true.

Here's a photo of it mid-build, when I figured out it needed 700c wheels (the person who sold it to me thought it took 26" wheels).


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

Sizzler said:


> Random question: anyone ever try putting 700c wheels on a 26" bontrager frame, and if so, how'd it ride?


There were a bunch of the old fillet brazed Bontrager frames with brake studs for both 26" and 700c but that is just a side note. Should fit, brake mounting will be an issue.


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Regarding the 26"-700c brake issue, there are adapters available that move the studs up higher, but before I went and bought them I wanted to get opinions. I'm thinking about making a modified, dirt drop, single speed type cross bike.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

hollister said:


> if memory serves, no. the directions on the ps kit tell you to cut the original stud above the flats and then the sleeve goes on
> 
> just make new studs out of old canti bosses. drill through em and cut off the threads


Thankyew for the info


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

Sizzler:
Check this thread out. He seems to be pretty happy with his Bonty set up with 700C :thumbsup:
/J
My '94 Bonty OR - updated 09/07/12 | Retrobike


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

okay, another quick question, my digital caliper is broken, could anyone tell me the proper front derailleur clamp diameter for a bontrager frame?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)




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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Thanks! :thumbsup:


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

So my Privateer Comp has turned SS.
This one is gonna be my singletrack bike from now on 
And it feels real light too!
/J


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

This might sound nuts, but I think I bought your red Racelite (edit, never mind, mine is a size medium. Weird thing is, it had a sticker on the seat tube in the same way and the scar on the top tube sticker in the same spot.)


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## kellyjk (Oct 3, 2008)

*Bontrager brake studs*

Can anyone tell me where to get and what to look for, since my frame didn't come with brake mounts. Thanks JK


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

kellyjk said:


> Can anyone tell me where to get and what to look for, since my frame didn't come with brake mounts. Thanks JK


Since your frame is a 96 or later (no tapered seat stays), why not use V brakes which are period correct for the frame? They will thread right in with no need for cantilever brake mounts.


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## kellyjk (Oct 3, 2008)

*brakes*

So I can bolt them on with a m8 or m10 bolt? do I use washers on either side of the v brakes?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

You'll still need the sleeves. If you find some let me know, I need a pair too.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I've not tired using v-brakes without the spacer-sleeves, but I'd imagine that the arms would move around without them. The part that you need is the one on the right. They are hard to come by. Some industrious person could likely machine a set.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

pm me guys. I can make some for you.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Nice work, Classen.


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

If you have a damaged frame or fork that is otherwise worthless, you can cut the bosses off and drill them out to make these sleeves if you are careful.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

girlonbike said:


> Nice work, Classen.


Thanks. The ones pictured above have already been sent off to someone, but they're pretty easy to make during my lunch break. And just so you don't feel that I'm abusing the forum and trying to make $ from this endeavor - I'm not making any money from this.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

classen said:


> And just so you don't feel that I'm abusing the forum and trying to make $ from this endeavor - I'm not making any money from this.


In that case, I'd like to order 100. 

Just kidding. They look great!!


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> In that case, I'd like to order 100.
> 
> Just kidding. They look great!!


If you post a picture of yourself standing next to 100 Bontragers, and they're all missing their brake bosses.... then I guess I'll be spending a long time in the machine shop 

Seriously, if you need a pair let me know. I'd like to provide these to as many desperate Bonty owners as I can.... within reason. I only ask for reimbursement of shipping costs. If I become totally inundated or can't reasonably keep up then I'll stop.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

classen said:


> Thanks. The ones pictured above have already been sent off to someone, but they're pretty easy to make during my lunch break. And just so you don't feel that I'm abusing the forum and trying to make $ from this endeavor - I'm not making any money from this.


Ha. No, I'm not that big a hardass. I think what you're doing is important. Please keep it up.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

classen said:


> pm me guys. I can make some for you.


Cool! srsly cool..:thumbsup:


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

kenjihara said:


> You'll still need the sleeves. If you find some let me know, I need a pair too.


I stand corrected...yet again
I guess I was thinking about my Privateer, it has traditional screw in brake studs. Already plead by case to Classen for a couple of sleeve sets for my race and racelite frames!

Now if someone would just start machining the 6mm OD step down cable ferrules for YETI bikes once again, I would be a happy man!


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## Linedog59 (Feb 7, 2013)

*Bontrager Privateer Comp.*

I decided to rescue my Bonty from the shed and giver her a wash. We'll see how she looks after the weekend.


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## franktuesday (Mar 2, 2013)

*I've got your pulley.*

I was digging through my parts bin today, and found the original pulley and anti-chain-suck-plate from my '93 Race, which I sold 15 years ago. I miss it, but it never fit me quite right. If you still need the pulley, let me know.



kenjihara said:


> Okay, Brother followers of Brother Grumpy,
> 
> Here's the situation. Trying to breathe life into an old Bontrager Race / OR. It has regular verticaI dropouts, but it still has the pulley for the front derailleur. I need the brake studs and the pulley. I'm going to just use conventional brake studs rather than the sleeve/ bolt arrangement, apparently they are M8 studs. I also found a nylon pulley which I think might work, out of a kit for sliding doors. I will have to drill out the tin housing around the pulley. So, that might work. What sort of bolt do I need to attach the pulley? I am going to try Fastenal or another fastener supply place, I guess. I already tried Menards and Home Depot. It seems like an M4? 4mm seems to start into the post holding the pulley on, but it doesn't seem to keep going. But maybe I'm doing it wrong.
> If anyone who has some of these, I'd buy them or trade some spoke bracelets for them, same with a chain deflector plate if anyone has it. Or can point me in the right direction. Thanks! If that pulley fits, I'll post a photo of the pulley.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

My poor Bonty was the last bike to be picked up from the Museum SFO Exhibit yesterday. Home now though!


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Rumpfy said:


> My poor Bonty was the last bike to be picked up from the Museum SFO Exhibit yesterday. Home now though!


Wow! They really did treat those things with kid gloves, didn't they. Almost excessive care taken if you're going to go out and race it like you threatened. Glad you posted some more pics of yours, though. I finally found an OR project for myself, an all visual resources are welcome


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

*Po?*



Rumpfy said:


> My poor Bonty was the last bike to be picked up from the Museum SFO Exhibit yesterday. Home now though!


Poor?

Pfft, uh-huh.

Shining example Bontrager, right down to the cable routing.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

MrOrange said:


> Poor?
> 
> Pfft, uh-huh.
> 
> Shining example Bontrager, right down to the cable routing.


Thanks to your help and guidance! Holli too I guess.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

iamkeith said:


> Wow! They really did treat those things with kid gloves, didn't they. Almost excessive care taken if you're going to go out and race it like you threatened. Glad you posted some more pics of yours, though. I finally found an OR project for myself, an all visual resources are welcome


They were amazing with the bikes. So careful and respectful.
Full bike photoshoot on my Flickr (same handle).


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Hi all, I just realized that I never posted a pic of my Racelite with the Groovy fork. It's built with Bontrager spec'ed rake, and handles great.

(Since the pic was taken I've cut some of that steerer off. Measure twice, cut once you know!  )


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Nice! Looks much better with the knobbies!!!!!


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

It's about time you realized, good to see you're still riding.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Thanks! Long time no see. We should hook up. I'm in the middle of setting up that Race you traded to me as a drop bar single speed, and am going to be commuting some on it. (Pics coming soon.) I'll give you a ring soon.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Oh, thank god. I was about to give you hell for spacerville.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

slapped this together this past weekend.

Not exactly the way I want it built up, but I need a bike that actually works and that I can ride to work.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

A few more.


































like I said... what a weird combo of parts - early XT, M900, and later M950 XTR hubs, plus 3DV critical racing front cantis.

It rides though :thumbsup:


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Looks good, love the stem!


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## yo-Nate-y (Mar 5, 2009)

Agreed. Nice rider


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## ekcyclops (Mar 13, 2013)

Wow, classic. Nice!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

I like everything but the xtr hubs.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

What do you not like about M950s? Is it just what they did to the CNC market back in the day or something? I can't help it, I still love that entire series.


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

It's probably because they are newer than the bike and the other period correct components on the bike. I like M950 stuff too, but only when appropriate to the vintage of the bike.



datmony said:


> What do you not like about M950s? Is it just what they did to the CNC market back in the day or something? I can't help it, I still love that entire series.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

datasurfer said:


> It's probably because they are newer than the bike and the other period correct components on the bike. I like M950 stuff too, but only when appropriate to the vintage of the bike.


 This.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Tell KB thanks for the XTR cranks and BB I got from him off ebay, that was quite a treat to see the box as having come from him.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

I'm curious to know what are the largest tires you've all run on the steel frames?

I'm considering trying some Maxxis Hookworm 2.5's as an "urban assault" tire. I'll likely get one at first, as I know I have fork clearance. 

My hazy memory of running Ritchey Z-Max 2.35's on the rear was that they fit, but that there was not a lot of mud clearance. Sound about right?

EDIT - Just in case anyone ever wonders, the 2.5" Hookworms fit just fine AND feel better than the Judy XC I built the bike up originally. Really sweet tire for "urban singletrack"


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## Steel29er (Jul 1, 2008)

*New old Bontrager*

I was looking for some Vintage steel in my size to replace the 92 Stumpy and this 21" Bonty popped up on CL. The previous owner said its a 95 or 96 Racelight, he was the 2nd owner and replaced the origininal decals. It's a mix of more modern components including XT and SRAM x-9 rear derailleur. My first priority is finding a Rigid fork, shortening the stem, and finding a Race lite front rim. Until then I will enjoy the ride.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Nice score. That one could really use some love.

Bontrager OR wraps (sku 575)


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## Steel29er (Jul 1, 2008)

Thanks Jack0zilla!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Found it!!!!

Been trying to find the pulley that works with the front derailleur on the vintage Bontrager OR / Race frames. 

Finally found it at Lowes: Sliding Screen Door Roller Assembly, part number B-551. Fits like it was made to do nothing else in this world, and the bolt even fits the frame perfectly!!


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

LOL! Nice detective work.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Found it!!!!
> 
> Been trying to find the pulley that works with the front derailleur on the vintage Bontrager OR / Race frames.
> 
> Finally found it at Lowes: Sliding Screen Door Roller Assembly, part number B-551. Fits like it was made to do nothing else in this world, and the bolt even fits the frame perfectly!!


It makes you wonder if in the early '90s there were a bunch of home repair guys saying: "We finally found a source for anodized blue screen door rollers!! These are so sweet!"


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

Anodized aluminum? How about cheap plastic? I always wondered
why the pulleys had the asymmetric lips, but it makes sense that
it was designed for something completely different.









While I'm at it, here is mine. Sadly, still unridden at this point.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Everybody knows that it's all about the pretty colors...


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Incidentally, my modern CX bike uses a pulley for the front derailler. So some manufacturers are still sourcing pulleys - and they may well be repurposed from sliding doors.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

It's a nylon/ plastic- looking roller. I'll post a photo when I get a minute. I had heard that it was an off - the- shelf hardware part, had been looking at different stores under pulleys for window blinds previously, but sliding door roller makes more sense. The fact that the bolt works too makes me wonder if they welded the post onto the frame that comes with it- that sounds like Uncle Grumpy in action, waste not, want not.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Pulley on vintage Bontrager Race frame! by ashwednesday555, on Flickr


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Roller for Bontrager OR / Race frames! by ashwednesday555, on Flickr


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Ooh, pretty!


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## CYCLEJCE (Nov 2, 2010)

I'd love to use this on a retro cruiser I'm building! Can anyone remove the pulley and take a pic of the mount? I wonder if this could be added as an afterthought.. 

Thanks for your help!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

CYCLEJCE said:


> I'd love to use this on a retro cruiser I'm building! Can anyone remove the pulley and take a pic of the mount? I wonder if this could be added as an afterthought..
> 
> Thanks for your help!


The pulley allows for a ft derailleur that was intended to have it's cable pulled from the bottom to be pulled from above. The mount part is a small, hollow post , the pulley slides over / around it and the bolt screws into the post. I hope this helps.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

iamkeith said:


> Crown identification update:
> 
> A couple of weeks ago, I asked if anyone could tell whether or not my recently-acquired black Rock Shox crown was truly a reduced-offset Bontrager version. I never got a definitive answer, but have figured some things out that I thought I'd share:
> 
> ...


Yeah, right?! It's bad enough trying to find a 1" steerer tube fork, now it has to be black?!?

I mean, mine's black. ...you know.


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## CYCLEJCE (Nov 2, 2010)

kenjihara said:


> The pulley allows for a ft derailleur that was intended to have it's cable pulled from the bottom to be pulled from above. The mount part is a small, hollow post , the pulley slides over / around it and the bolt screws into the post. I hope this helps.


I have one on my Rock Lobster, I'm sure it's similar. And I DO have a bottom pull FD and a frame intended for top pull. I may have to look further into this option!

Thanks,


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Hey all -

I thought I'd join this thread as a long time Bontrager fan/rider. I've got 2 Bontragers that I bought new and are both original. The first is a '96 Privateer S in black. I did have the shop upgrade this one to V-Brakes, which were relatively new at the time, before I picked it up at the shop. The second is a '97 Race Lite in red. I bought this one from Supergo at a closeout price - can't remember when for sure but assume it was in '98. Of course is was the one I wanted in '96 but was beyond the budget.

I just completed a rebuild of the Privateer a couple of months ago and it came out great. I haven't ridden it yet though as it's too pretty to ride. I'm kidding of course as I just want to take some photos first. And tonight I took the Race Lite apart down to the frame. One thing lead to another but the end of the story is that I tore into the frame and it's pretty much done. It cleaned up great with only a couple of very minor flaws mostly in the decals. It's going to be a like new and a real beauty when I'm done. The right crankarm has a crack and it was getting pretty bad the last time I rode it in February. So that is the main part I need to replace. The rest of the components look like they are going to clean up fine. I think I'm going to enjoy this rebuild much more than some of the old Schwinns I've been doing recently. And I expect to be hitting some of you up with some questions too.


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## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

DrSpoke said:


> I did have the shop upgrade this one to V-Brakes


Is that an oxymoron ?

Jusrt Kidding :smilewinkgrin:


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

In retrospect certainly though at the time it didn't seem so. I believe stock were cantilevers. And the price went from around $800 to about $1k as I recall though my memory is not so good.

I've since disassembled the (Rock Shox Judy) fork on the Race Lite including the cartridge. I hope I'm not in over my head on this one.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

A few quick (admittedly poor) photos of the Privateer S - including the "upgraded" brakes.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

DrSpoke said:


> A few quick (admittedly poor) photos of the Privateer S - including the "upgraded" brakes.


Wow, that is extremely well- preserved! You can't go wrong with basic black. 
I've got a rigid one like that in my garage that I'm working on that isn't anywhere near as nice as that, for a friend of mine.
Does the fork still work, or are those elastomers stiff? I think I have a Q21 somewhere I was going to put coil springs in.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

kenjihara said:


> Wow, that is extremely well- preserved! You can't go wrong with basic black.
> I've got a rigid one like that in my garage that I'm working on that isn't anywhere near as nice as that, for a friend of mine.
> Does the fork still work, or are those elastomers stiff? I think I have a Q21 somewhere I was going to put coil springs in.


Thank you for the comments. They got me to thinking about the history of this bike. I bought it new, probably in the Summer of '96 from a local bike shop now since absorbed by Performance. It was right after by divorce was finalized and was my first good mountain bike after many years on road bikes as well as an '82 Stumpjumper. The Stumpjumper was more of a beach cruiser, which is what I used it for, but it was in great shape too - when it was stolen. Wish I still had that one as it was, I think, the second year of production. Anyway, it was about in 98 that I found the Race Lite on closeout at Supergo and that become my goto mountain bike. In about 98 or 99 I was living with a friend who was fixing up his house to sell. He was using a sprayer to paint it. My bike was in the garage with the door closed but apparently close enough to a gap in the door whereby a lot of paint particles got on the bike. They weren't that noticeable from a few feet away but were all over the front of the bike - the frame, cables, shifters, stem, bars, etc. And then about 2002 I bought a Santa Cruz Superlight and that bike became, and still is, my main mountain ride (started upgrading my road bikes as well as being diverted by some Schwinn restorations). So in 2006 I got into another serious relationship and had a my workbench setup at her house. So I took the Privateer apart and was going to restore it. I got the frame, fork and wheels done then the relationship ended. There were other things going an as well so it sat in pieces for more than a few years. So finally I decided to make it whole a few months ago. Fortunately I was able to find the pieces and it came together beautifully.

I haven't ridden the bike as yet as I want to take some good pictures of it before I go get it dirty. It's pretty much all original except for the tires. And the tires are some NOS Bontrager Revolt Super-X that I purchased new and aren't too far removed from the vintage of the bike. I did rebuild the fork though, as per above, it was probably 5 or 6 years ago. I remember as how simple it actually was and how pretty much useless it would be as a fork. Just a few days ago I disassembled the Rock Shox Judy XC on the Race Lite and though it's a little more complex it's still pretty basic. It has about a 3" spring and a 4" elastomer on each side and a single hydraulic damping cartridge. As I was surfing eBay for parts for the Judy I've come across some of the coil spring kits you mention - for both the 21R and the Judy. I think I'm going finish the Judy in stock form for now. And as far as the Privateer I'm going to ride it first and then for both decide whether or not to put a spring kit in them.

The Race Lite has much more use on it that the Privateer but looks to be in great shape. I had setup the Santa Cruz for my girlfriend, so it was my main bike at that time. And when I started riding again earlier this year it was on it. That is until I noticed the crank arm was cracked. So I need to find an M739 crank to complete this rebuild. Right now the fork is in pieces including the cartridge system. And now I'm not sure if I've got the tools or ability to put it back together. But once the fork is done it should go fairly smoothly - hopefully I can get it finished in a few weeks. That is rather than a few years like the Privateer S.

I'm assuming the Privateer S is a Trek model. And I'm sure the Race Lite is also Trek but does have the Handmade in Santa Cruz, California decal on it. And, of course, the one piece seat stays. I'll try to get some better photos of the Privateer S up soon - I want to go ride that thing. And, of course, will put photos up of the Race Lite when done. And maybe some teaser of the frame if there is any interest.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Ok - some Race Lite teaser photos:


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## oldskoolwrench (Jul 12, 2012)

You are correct; Race and Race Lites were built in Santa Cruz, and the Privateer/ Privateer Comps were built by Trek in Wisconsin.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

DrSpoke said:


> View attachment 808403


Nice! That looks exactly like a Race Lite that I bought brand new in '98. I loved that bike.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

"Each bicycle owned exponentially increases the probability that none is working correctly."

Man, is that so true. I'm up to 12 right now, 9 for me and 3 for my daughters, including a vintage Schwinn still in the box, never built. The 9 include 3 road bikes (76 Alan, 02 Serrota Concours, 07 Ducati Factory 900 XR), 3 mountain bikes (the 2 Bontragers and a 02 Santa Cruz Superlight), 2 Schwinns (76 Sierra 10-sp & 79 Collegiate 3-sp) and 1 Cx (a 2010 Scott Team). And I'm very much trying to get them all fully functional. It's a battle. In fact, just trying to get them all with pedals is an effort.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

So, seriously doods, what kind of off - the- shelf brake posts can I get to fit an old Bontrager race?


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

You could order these: Canti Studs M6 in stainless steel e.g. for Magura forks - BrakeSTUFF Company

It's from Germany though, can't seem to find the same thing in the US. And I think you'd need to shorten the threaded portion...

jw



kenjihara said:


> So, seriously doods, what kind of off - the- shelf brake posts can I get to fit an old Bontrager race?


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

kenjihara said:


> So, seriously doods, what kind of off - the- shelf brake posts can I get to fit an old Bontrager race?


. Make them

Clamp a standard boss in an axle vise and hacksaw off the threads, then drill out the center

Viola


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

I find hardware sexy. I hope that's not weird.


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

girlonbike said:


> I find hardware sexy. I hope that's not weird.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

GrumpyOne said:


> You could order these: Canti Studs M6 in stainless steel e.g. for Magura forks - BrakeSTUFF Company
> 
> It's from Germany though, can't seem to find the same thing in the US. And I think you'd need to shorten the threaded portion...
> 
> jw


Weren't there M6 brake posts used by RockShox for a while?


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Exactly, H.


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Yes, that's where mine came from. Don't remember when or which model forks though.

jw



kenjihara said:


> Weren't there M6 brake bolts used by RockShox for a while?


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

*Just got a Bontrager Race*

Hi Everyone,

I just picked up a Bontrager Race, about a week ago. I knew nothing about this bike when I bought it. I've started learning more about just from the research I've done online. The bike I got is in nearly new condition and appears to have barely been used. I bought this bike with the intention on using it on single track and some road riding. The more I read about this bike I'm wondering if I should be riding it like I am. My concern is twofold. One; how easy is this bike to get parts for. I know it has the 1 inch head tube so what am I looking at for a new fork when the need arises. Its currently got what I believe to be a Rock Shox Judy on it that is still working great.

My second concern is; Is this such a highly collectible bike that I shouldn't be riding it hard? From what I can tell this is a pre-Trek Bontrager as it has the two piece seat stay.

Thanks for sticking with me on my long winded first post. The LBS I bought it from knows next to nothing about this bike, and the same goes for the other shop in town.

I have attached some pictures of my bike. Thanks for your help!

Edit; not sure why they are upside down the originals are fine.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

It's a great bike but not a lost treasure. Ride it like heck! The parts on there are not that hard to replace and a lot cheaper to get than modern stuff.

Have fun!

p.s. what's going on with your stem?


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

There isn't anything you can't get for the bike. 1" forks are not easy to find, but not impossible.

Rare? The Race Light is more desirable for "collectors". 2 piece stay says it's a pre-trek buyout bike, a "real" Bonty to some.

Ride it HARD as you planned, that's what it was made for!

it does look very nice, except for those pedals!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Yup, romp on it. The reason they are sought after is that they are durable and ride great! You may be able to find someone to rebuild the fork when the time comes. In the meantime, it wouldn't hurt to cache away a spare with a 1" steerer.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

girlonbike said:


> It's a great bike but not a lost treasure. Ride it like heck! The parts on there are not that hard to replace and a lot cheaper to get than modern stuff.
> 
> Have fun!
> 
> p.s. what's going on with your stem?


The stem is a standard threadless on a quill stem adaptor. Or were you just kidding?

...darn nice looking bike once I downloaded the images, then rotated them .


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

The bike looks great. Like the others have already said, the best thing you can do is ride the bike and enjoy one of the best handling bikes made. Thats only my opinion, but I think most people who are subscribed to this thread would agree. I am without a Bontrager right now and am having some serious withdrawal pain!


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

Great! Thank you everyone that is what I was wanting to hear. I am going to continue riding it. I love the way it handles, although I dont have much to compare it to as this is my first time riding trails on any bike. None the less I love it.

Yes, it needs new pedals bad, I have a feeling it didn't have any and the guy who traded it in just threw those on quick. 

For those wondering I paid $300 for this bike and feel like that was a pretty good deal. Serial number on this bike is 5483.

Last thing can anyone help me out with what the numbered dials are for on the rock shox.


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

Thanks guys


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

rryyyaannn said:


> this is my first time riding trails on any bike. None the less I love it.


Good for you, ryyyyaaaannnnnnn. Welcome to the world of mountain biking.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

rryyyaannn said:


> For those wondering I paid $300 for this bike and feel like that was a pretty good deal. Serial number on this bike is 5483.
> 
> .


Hush your mouf! Was it at gunpoint?!? You scored a sweet deal!


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Probably you got a discount because the bike is upside down, lol!


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## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

rryyyaannn said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I just picked up a Bontrager Race, about a week ago. I knew nothing about this bike when I bought it. I've started learning more about just from the research I've done online. The bike I got is in nearly new condition and appears to have barely been used. I bought this bike with the intention on using it on single track and some road riding. The more I read about this bike I'm wondering if I should be riding it like I am. My concern is twofold. One; how easy is this bike to get parts for. I know it has the 1 inch head tube so what am I looking at for a new fork when the need arises. Its currently got what I believe to be a Rock Shox Judy on it that is still working great.
> 
> My second concern is; Is this such a highly collectible bike that I shouldn't be riding it hard?


The Fork on there appears to be a later Mag21, not a Judy.

On your second concern, NOT riding the bike is a bit like having a hot virgin girlfriend but trying to keep her preserved for her next boyfriend....


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Hollister and Mr. Orange told me about this video today. I hope you guys enjoy this as much as I did.


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

girlonbike said:


> Hollister and Mr. Orange told me about this video today. I hope you guys enjoy this as much as I did.


Cool that this got mentioned. If I'm listening right, that is.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

MrOrange said:


> Cool that this got mentioned. If I'm listening right, that is.
> 
> >


"basically a Sugar"



It was good to hear more mentions of Tadd


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

kenjihara said:


> Probably you got a discount because the bike is upside down, lol!


 Ha, I just got lucky I didn't know what I was buying just really liked how it rode, and the shop wasn't real familiar with the bike. I didn't realize it was a deal until I started reading about these bikes online!


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

GrayJay said:


> The Fork on there appears to be a later Mag21, not a Judy.
> 
> On your second concern, NOT riding the bike is a bit like having a hot virgin girlfriend but trying to keep her preserved for her next boyfriend....


Lol  I will for sure be riding this bike without regret. Thanks for the info on the shock that will help me look up some info about it.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Thanks for posting a link to that video!!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> Thanks for posting a link to that video!!


And one more thing...

It's was interesting to hear Paul W. talk about the Bontrager bikes being "fun to ride." I've always felt that way about Bontrager frames. I have bikes that are faster - I can get around a race course in a shorter amount of time. However, those bikes are less fun to ride (at least to me). Unless I'm competing in a race, I'd much rather ride a bike that's more fun. I guess that's why I'm still putting miles on a Bontrager frame more than 15 years after buying my first one.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

girlonbike - thank you for the video link too - Kind of a slow start but watched the whole thing. I'm keeping my 2 Bontragers - and maybe looking for another.

rrryyyannn - I think that's a great price. And I agree with others, just ride it! I've got a red one similar to yours only a couple of years newer. It's in pieces now but can't wait to get it going. I did see a Race Lite on ebay that has a smilar colored fork to yours that appears to be a Judy XC - I'm sure a very early one. Mine is a '97 and appears to be a revised design. I was able to find some documents on operation and repair online - some from the SRAM site. So I just rebuilt it - it's pretty simple. I ended up with a little air in the hydraulic cartridge but it's still better than it was. And if I need to redo it I'm sure it will be easier the second time around. I reused the original seals and bushings but used fresh lube and hydraulic fluid. I think it's going to be ok. In addition, there are coil spring update kits still available on ebay.


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Pah!

Tadd still doing powder coating?



hollister said:


> "basically a Sugar"
> 
> 
> 
> It was good to hear more mentions of Tadd


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Ok - As promised, I finally got the PrivateerS out for some (supposedly) "good" photos. I hope there aren't too many and, if so, slap my hands. It wasn't until I got out to take the pictures I realized the rear tire was on backwards - another (in a long succession of) "senior" moments. I wanted to take the pictures as, after reading all these posts, I want to get out and RIDE it again. Some friends I've meet on meetup.com are planning to head up to the Big Lanuna Trail, East of San Diego, on Sunday morning and I thought I'd take the Bontrager rather than my regular ride - a Santa Cruz Superlight. For some reason I couldn't get to MountainBikeBill's site which has some photos, a description of the trail as well as a map but did find these (among many others on youtube - search "Big Laguna Trail"):
Big Laguna Trail Mountain Biking - YouTube
Big Laguna Trail: Red Roost to Los Gatos Ravine - YouTube

I hope his site comes back up as I need his map for Sunday  Happy Summer to all as well and don't forget the Supermoon on Sunday. And now I got to get back to getting that Race Lite back together.

Noble Canyon drops down the valley from the Big Laguna Trail but I've never done it - and may not:
Noble Canyon Mountain Bike Trip.wmv - YouTube


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)




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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Great pictures. Maybe someday you can run cantilevers again. Do you like those tires? The front one look rather boxy and stiff.

Is that a 1" steerer? I like the stem with your bike. The colors are nice too. Good job!


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Hi girl -

Thanks for the compliments. The bike is almost exactly as I picked it up in '96. I had the shop upgrade to the V-brakes, which were relatively new as far as Shimano was concerned, at the time - M739s. I don't have the original brakes so doubt, and have no desire to, ever change them back. The only other non-original parts are the tires. I bought them so long ago that I don't remember but I'm assuming prior to 2000. They are Bontrager Revolt Super X 47/46 w/Kevlar bead - I like them as the grey sidewall kind of matches the decals on the frame. I think they are (were) a racing weight and tread. I've not ridden them yet as they were just installed during the rebuild. I'll let you know after Sunday.

The stearer/headset is the original 1" threaded as is the stem. I don't expect to put a lot more miles on this bike as my early 2000s vintage Santa Cruz Superlight is my main bike. I'm also currently rebuilding my '97 Race Lite. I liked riding that one more as it has a slightly better fork as well as the other components - and, of course, the frame. But all will see mileage. One of my main rides is at Lake Hodges here in Escondido which is mostly flat, a fair amout of singletrack, with only a couple of climbs and not many (almost no) technical sections - so the Bontrager works well there. That is, no steep, technical downhill sections where I prefer the fork and rear suspension of the Santa Cruz.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*Bontrager Race Lite Monstercross*

I've had a '91 or '92 Bontrager Race Lite since I ordered it built for me new at the Santa Cruz factory. You could order it at the time with or without suspension geometry, and I opted for the frame built for the Mag 21 with custom Bontrager crown. I rode the piss out of it until 2009, when I finally gave into peer pressure and got a full-suspension bike. The Bontrager has been through many different incarnations, with the pinnacle of its existence as a 26er shown below. The photo was taken when I was getting my broken full-suspension frame replaced, so I was forced to revitalize the hardtail if I wanted to keep riding for the month it took to replace the FS frame. So I decked the Bontrager out as far as the geometry and 1" steerer would allow, with a beastly Marzocchi fork, whose main improvement over the Mag 21 was that it had disc brake mounts. The wide riser bar was quite a departure from the long and low stem and narrower-the-better flat bar the frame was designed for. I had gotten hooked on having a dropper post on my FS bike, so I also added a Gravity Dropper, the only 26.8 dropper post made.

This pic was taken during a muddy ride out at China Camp in NorCal, before I got my FS bike built back up:







After I got my full-suspension bike built back up again, I found that I never rode the Bontrager on anything serious... Its 2 inches of travel couldn't keep up with the 5.5 inches I had gotten used to on my FS rig. I had wanted a big-tired, disc-brake cyclocross, AKA Monstercross, bike for a long time, so after a ton of research on these forums, and elsewhere on the inter webs, trial and error, parts from eBay and adjustments, this is the final incarnation of my Bontrager Race Lite:

Bontrager Monstercross - up to 29 x 2.3 up front and 29x1.75 (45c) in the back:















I picked up the NOS WTB Dirt Drop bar a few years back, after I heard they stopped making them. The carbon fork is Exotic brand, one of the few still available with a 1" steerer, and the length matches my Mag 21, so handling is as Keith Bontrager intended it, but without the suspension arch it fits 29er wheels quite easily. Since those frames don't have chainstay braces, the rear triangle can accomodate 29er wheels as well, but the size is limited to around 1.75" (45c), which is plenty for a cross bike. The Xtracycle brake adapter helped relocate the brake posts for the larger wheel diameter on the rear, and I opted to upgrade the braking power from cantilever to a Sweet Paul's Motolite V-Brake. I used an Avid BB7 MTB disc brake on the front, and Cane Creek V levers that have the correct cable pull for both. I have been taking the bike on commutes and fire road rides and love it! It fills a slot in my quiver now that my full-suspension bike can't compete with. As a rigid bike, it doesn't do the rough stuff so well, but if I want to ride far and fast, this bike will take me there, on-road or off.

I highly recommend this conversion to anyone with an old Bontrager gathering dust in their garage. Let me know if you have any questions about the build or want to see more photos.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

I like!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

You sure that wasn't a few years after '92?


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

hollister said:


> You sure that wasn't a few years after '92?


Good eye. This is not an original museum piece, by a long shot. That frame and I have been through a lot. It is definitely a late '91 or early '92 (still have receipt somewhere), as evidenced by the horizontal dropouts. It originally had the pulley and bonded aluminum cable guides, but somewhere around its second or third powder coat, the guys at the Bontrager factory took off the bonded guides for paint prep and replaced them with welded guides (much to my disappointment). When I cracked the seat tube and had it replaced under warranty, I asked them to leave the pulley off and opted for a top-pull derailleur instead. Original stickers were square/straight (not diagonal), and it has also been powder coated two other colors. It's far from pristine. It's dented, scratched, needs new decals, and has survived over 20 years of loving abuse, but it still has that "real steel" ride and I'm glad I used it for my CX build, because it's a bike that deserves to be ridden, perhaps subjected to less abuse than in its mountain bike days, but ridden hard until the next tube breaks and I have to find someone to weld in yet another replacement tube and put on another powder coat.

Here's a blurry old photo of me riding the Tamarancho trail around '97 with the original fork and no decals on the frame. If you look closely, you'll see the purple anodized King headset, which went with the previous "deep metallic purple" paint job.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

And here's another one of me on the Bontrager on Wagon Wheel at Tamarancho in the late 90's, Mt. Tam in the background.







These are the only two digitized photos I have of my Bontrager from that era. If I have any more photos, they must be in a shoebox somewhere...

_*Bontragers are meant to be ridden, not curated.*_


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

It sure would be great if someone took the original specs and started making Bontrager frames again, but with tapered head tubes this time around for universal fork compatibility. I am still sad that Trek bought the brand and stopped frame production. Steel frames aren't the lightest, but nothing compares to the ride of a high-end steel frame. Soulcraft and others make some pretty sweet steel frames, but the Race Lites are still about a half pound to a pound lighter due to thinner tube walls and extensive use of gussets. The Bontrager Race Lite still to this day represents the pinnacle of steel bike frame construction.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

goto11 said:


> It sure would be great if someone took the original specs and started making Bontrager frames again, but with tapered head tubes this time around for universal fork compatibility. I am still sad that Trek bought the brand and stopped frame production. Steel frames aren't the lightest, but nothing compares to the ride of a high-end steel frame. Soulcraft and others make some pretty sweet steel frames, but the Race Lites are still about a half pound to a pound lighter due to thinner tube walls and extensive use of gussets. The Bontrager Race Lite still to this day represents the pinnacle of steel bike frame construction.


I really like your drop bar build man, thats a neat set-up and I bet its fun to ride. I think Paul Sadoff's Rock Lobster frames would be the closest thing out there to providing a contemporary Bontrager type frame. I had a 99 Privateer that had the 1.125" headset and that really opened the fork choices up in a major way.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

goto11 said:


> It sure would be great if someone took the original specs and started making Bontrager frames again, but with tapered head tubes this time around for universal fork compatibility. I am still sad that Trek bought the brand and stopped frame production. Steel frames aren't the lightest, but nothing compares to the ride of a high-end steel frame. Soulcraft and others make some pretty sweet steel frames, but the Race Lites are still about a half pound to a pound lighter due to thinner tube walls and extensive use of gussets. The Bontrager Race Lite still to this day represents the pinnacle of steel bike frame construction.


There are plenty of custom builders that could build a frame with the same geo as a Bontrager. The tubing and gussets would likely be different, but the handling could be made very similar and you could have whatever modern changes that you'd like.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

I like it too. I was (mtn bike) riding a couple weeks ago with 2 guys on single speeds, one with a rigid fork. They were very fast and said I should build my Race Lite in that fashion. Well I wouldn't do it with my current Race Lite as it is going through a complete rebuild to my as purchased spec though maybe some other in the future. And I like that idea of a Privateer w/1 1/8 headtube.

I also thought a Bontrager frame with 650B wheels/fork would be a good city/dirt road bike too. And judging by what you've done it's certainly possible. And that would be either with road or mtn bars.

As far as Trek is concerned, even in the KB video on the previous page, he was saying the market for steel frames was about to die when he sold the company to Trek and the bikes/frames became almost unmarketable. I'm sure that is why they dropped the frames and only continued with components. It's certainly no better today though it seems there are many more custom steel framebuilders than back then. Kelly Bedford and Dave Kirk come to mind though they do specialize more in road frames. That is, if you want a modified Race Lite replica it seems the only route would be custom. I surely don't think there is a market for mass or even limited production steel mountain bike frames today.

I like to think of it as an era that has come and gone - though a great one. Thankfully there are still frames available. Another option could be to create a 1" stearer crown that would accept modern, larger diameter fork tubes and internals.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

N10S said:


> I really like your drop bar build man, thats a neat set-up and I bet its fun to ride. I think Paul Sadoff's Rock Lobster frames would be the closest thing out there to providing a contemporary Bontrager type frame. I had a 99 Privateer that had the 1.125" headset and that really opened the fork choices up in a major way.


Thanks. It is a lot of fun to ride, and I'm really glad I used this frame instead of buying a new cyclocross bike. If it had a 1.125" head tube like your Privateer, then I'd probably still be riding it as an MTB with a modern suspension fork on it.

This build is a mountain biker's idea of what a dirt-capable road bike should be, compared to most CX bikes that seem just like road bikes with skinny knobbies, designed for the spandex crowd. Here's another pic, after I got back from my first off-road night ride on it:








I contacted Sadoff awhile back on behalf of my buddy who was inspired to convert his old 26er Rock Lobster into a monstercross bike also, and he thinks it will work (depending on the chainstay bridge - some Rock Lobsters have them and some don't). Who knows, maybe one day I'll have Paul or Sean (Soulcraft) build me a monstercross frame, but I have a feeling that this Bontrager build will roll with me to the grave. There are no toe overlap issues with the front wheel and handling is spot on. A rear disc brake would be nice, but the Paul Motolite V brake works great. The bottom bracket is a bit higher as a result of the big wheels, but the extra clearance is a bonus for me, since I have 180mm cranks and I'm used to being up higher on my full-suspension bike. Can't wait to put some more miles on it, as I only finished building it six days ago .


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> There are plenty of custom builders that could build a frame with the same geo as a Bontrager. The tubing and gussets would likely be different, but the handling could be made very similar and you could have whatever modern changes that you'd like.


True, but the thinner tubing with gussets to stiffen it up where needed are what make a Race Lite ride so well. It's not just the geometry. Much like how the layup of a carbon frame can dramatically affect its ride quality, the thickness of the tubing and design of gusseted tube junctions is critical. There's a reason why there's a 38-page long forum devoted to old Bontragers here... They are uniquely awesome and no one builds frames like the old Santa Cruz-made Bontragers anymore.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

*Thanks, but no thanks.*

This blog entry from Paul Sadoff has been mentioned before in other threads, but it seems like this might be a good time and place to post it again. In case someone was thinking about having a replica Bontrager made. Kind of an enjoyable read, actually:

can't we just get along ?: Thanks, but no thanks.


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## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

*Bontrager Bike Mag / Mission Workshop Video*

This video was pretty good... slow in spots, but I learned a bunch that I didn't know before.

Ask a Founder: Keith Bontrager Tells His Story

EDIT: Sorry - did not see that the vid was posted already.

Cheers, 
KP


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Kirk Pacenti said:


> This video was pretty good... slow in spots, but I learned a bunch that I didn't know before.
> 
> Ask a Founder: Keith Bontrager Tells His Story
> 
> ...


Not a problem, KP! Thanks for dropping in!


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## tductape (Mar 31, 2008)

Nice drive by!


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Thanks for posting, good to hear KB directly! I didn't see the earlier post either, sometimes the threads are tough to follow...
Been riding my Race w/700c wheels a LOT lately, love it.


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## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

KDXdog said:


> Thanks for posting, good to hear KB directly! I didn't see the earlier post either, sometimes the threads are tough to follow...
> Been riding my Race w/700c wheels a LOT lately, love it.


Is your Race a converted 26" frame, or is it one of the few we made as 'purpose built' 700c frames?

Cheers,
KP


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Kirk Pacenti said:


> Is your Race a converted 26" frame, or is it one of the few we made as 'purpose built' 700c frames?
> 
> Cheers,
> KP


Not a purpose built frame (I'd love to see one of those!), just an east coast winter project, much like others posted on this site:

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retr...ager-race-cx-explorer-frankenbike-848139.html


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## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

KDXdog said:


> Not a purpose built frame (I'd love to see one of those!), just an east coast winter project, much like others posted on this site:
> 
> http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retr...ager-race-cx-explorer-frankenbike-848139.html


We only built a handful of them, mostly for shop guys and SC locals... Super rare.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

And the hunt begins all over again..


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Anybody have a picture?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

hollister said:


> And the hunt begins all over again..


LOL I knew that was coming.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

I was thinking the same thing.

jw



hollister said:


> And the hunt begins all over again..


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*Bontrager CX Race*

My brother has the cross frame. He bought it used after some bastard stole his 26" Race Lite. As I recall, it looks pretty much like any other Bontrager Race frame, but with brake posts located for 700C wheels. This is the only image I have, but I can snap more detailed images the next time I see it. I am not a fan of the flat bars, but it's not my bike.








So, if the CX frames are rare one-offs, then why did Bontrager make CX-specific decals, or were the decals I see on old websites made by a third party?

That said, does anyone know if I can still get decals for my Race Lite (CX or MTB decals, straight or diagonal edges)?

Thanks,

Kevin


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

goto11 said:


> My brother has the cross frame. He bought it used after some bastard stole his 26" Race Lite. As I recall, it looks pretty much like any other Bontrager Race frame, but with brake posts located for 700C wheels.
> 
> So, if the CX frames are rare one-offs, then why did Bontrager make CX-specific decals, or were the decals I see on old websites made by a third party?


I have one of the Bontrager CX bikes as well, and the red CX decals are original to the frames. These have similar tubing to the mountain bikes, but do not have good tire clearance. The rear triangle will only accept a tire up to about 35mm - I've tried a 38mm tire and it will not work. 

I think KP meant that there were 700c wheeled frames that accepted wider mountain-ish tires, correct? I assume that they were for the 700c Smoke tire, as that was about the only widish 700c knobby available at the time. More info would be nice.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> I have one of the Bontrager CX bikes as well, and the red CX decals are original to the frames. These have similar tubing to the mountain bikes, but do not have good tire clearance. The rear triangle will only accept a tire up to about 35mm - I've tried a 38mm tire and it will not work.
> 
> I think KP meant that there were 700c wheeled frames that accepted wider mountain-ish tires, correct? I assume that they were for the 700c Smoke tire, as that was about the only widish 700c knobby available at the time. More info would be nice.


So, you think the Bontrager "monstercross" bikes based on 26" frames with 700c brake post positions are the rare bikes that Kirk Pacenti refers to? My converted 26" to 700c build fits 45c tires and perhaps up to 48c (haven't tried, but there's still some clearance left w/ 45c tires). If that's the case, then I'll take it over my brother's CX. 

Kirk - can you confirm?

Anyone have the scoop on decals listed on this forum in years past?


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

goto11 said:


> So, if the CX frames are rare one-offs, then why did Bontrager make CX-specific decals, or were the decals I see on old websites made by a third party?


He's not talking about the CX frames. Be careful what you assume here....


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*26er to 29er Monstercross Recipe (Or, How to Breathe New Life into an Old Frame)*

*Ingredients*

Bontrager Race or Race Lite 26" frame, or possibly Rock Lobster or other 26" frame with sufficient tire clearance, 1" head tube (if you have a late model with a 1.125" head tube, congratulations, you have a ton of fork options, move along).
eXotic Rigid Carbon Fork 1" Steerer Disc Only (42.5 replaces my original Mag 21).
MTB mechanical disc brake (e.g. Avid BB7 MTB).
Rear V-brake to match cable pull of disc brake (e.g. Paul Motolite).
Xtracycle 26" to 700c brake post adapter.
V-Brake/Linear-pull drop bar levers (e.g. Cane Creek Drop V Levers for Linear/Long Pull Brake)
Bar-end shifters (e.g. Shimano Ultegra 8-speed bar end shift levers)
Add your own 8-speed drivetrain. 7 and 9-speed derailleurs will also work with 8-speed shifters on an 8-speed cassette.







Drop bar of your choice (e.g. Salsa Woodchipper).
High-rise stem (unless you prefer to hunch down).
29" or 700c 6-bolt disc brake front wheel.
29" or 700c rim brake rear wheel.
29" and/or 700c front & rear tires (front fits whatever, rear can easily fit 45c/1.75", perhaps a bit larger).
What drove the ingredients list above was an existing 8-speed drivetrain with Avid BB7 MTB brake. Avid now makes a BB7 SL brake that works with road levers, so you could use Shimano or SRAM brake/shifter combos, but you might have to get a cyclocross rear cantilever brake. Not sure. I went with bar-end shifters because they are a lot more affordable and the 8-speed ones still have friction mode. Friction Mode! Just in case.

I hated those old reverse-pull (Rapid Rise) derailleurs for MTB use, but they work great with bar-end shifters, since both shifters go up to go fast, down to go slow. My brother gave me an old XTR M951 Rapid Rise rear derailleur, which works great. Any old 7-8-9 rear derailleur will shift great with 8-speed shifters and cassette.













For weight savings and better rigidity/handling, I replaced the suspension fork on the Race Lite with the eXotic Rigid Carbon Disc Only Fork because it looked like the best, *if not only*, 1" steerer fork still available. The fork that my frame was designed for was a Mag 21, which measures 40.5 cm axle to crown. I went with a 42.5 cm length rigid fork because I wanted slightly less twitchy handling, plus a longer fork allows for a taller front wheel. Before the monstercross conversion, I used this fork for awhile with flat bars and 26" wheels and it was great (see left). It is also a great CX fork with 700c/29" wheels, although it definitely doesn't look like your typical cyclocross fork, as it will accept large 29er tires (see above, right). It's Monstercross!

A couple of nice options are:

Inline cable adjusters (e.g. Jagwire J2) - Unlike MTB shifters, bar-end shifters lack adjustment barrels, which makes it difficult to adjust your indexed shifting, unless you use an older rear derailleur with a barrel adjuster. The rear derailleur I used had no barrel adjuster, so this was very handy for getting the indexed shifting dialed in.
Bar-top levers with barrel adjusters (e.g. Paul Cross Lever, with pivot pin in outer hole for long pull) - Ditto: road levers lack barrel adjusters. Cross top levers not only give you another braking position, but give you a way to adjust your brake tension.

Thanks to others on this forum for the inspiration and ideas. Thanks to friends for spare wheels, derailleurs and other parts. My build is about 10 days old and I'm loving it. It definitely breathed new life into my 20+ year-old frame. Ride on!

Here's the final result:


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

goto11 said:


> As I recall, it looks pretty much like any other Bontrager Race frame, but with brake posts located for 700C wheels.


On second thought, the CX definitely has skinnier stays than the Race Lite and less tire clearance. Still a sweet bike, although it needs drops, or it risks being called a *hybrid*. Ouch!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

What did the BB height end up being after you put on the 700c wheels? (with 45mm tires)

Did it rise very much?


----------



## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Just came accross this photo in my surfing:


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> What did the BB height end up being after you put on the 700c wheels? (with 45mm tires)
> 
> Did it rise very much?


The BB height rose two-fold, due to both a longer fork and larger diameter wheels. But to me, it just felt right.

... So I just got around to measuring the BB height and it's a whopping 13 inches (330 mm). Then I measured the BB height of my Ibis Mojo SL and it's 13.5" without sag, so that explains why the Bontrager feels right to me: it has nearly the same stance as my main ride.


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## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> I think KP meant that there were 700c wheeled frames that accepted wider mountain-ish tires, correct? I assume that they were for the 700c Smoke tire, as that was about the only widish 700c knobby available at the time. More info would be nice.


^^^ This.

When I said a handful, I mean 5 (_*maybe*_ seven) of these purpose built, 700c frames were made.

Cheers, 
KP


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Kirk Pacenti said:


> ^^^ This.
> 
> When I said a handful, I mean 5 (_*maybe*_ seven) of these purpose built, 700c frames were made.
> 
> ...


I believe Hollister may be reaaally interested now.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Kirk Pacenti said:


> ^^^ This.
> 
> When I said a handful, I mean 5 (_*maybe*_ seven) of these purpose built, 700c frames were made.
> 
> ...


btw.. what fork was on those bikes? Don't tell us there was a custom segmented fork..


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*1993 Race / Race Lite Specs*

My frame may be a year newer than I thought. I can't find the original receipt, but have a repair receipt from 7/93 after a car hit me on the bike and I had to replace a buckled seat stay. I also have an owner's manual [C]1993, which I believe came back with the repaired frame, so the frame may be a '92 or '93; I'm not really sure.

Anyway, I'm including the specifications here for those who might be interested in the frame geometry. It specifies an 11.75" BB height, which I raised by 1.25" to 13" with a longer fork (42cm) and bigger wheels (700Cx45).


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

colker1 said:


> I believe Hollister may be reaaally interested now.


Among others. Are these the ones with the boss mounts for both 700c and 26". Ones' been posted here (and yes, it had a brazed segmented fork) and a biology professor at UCSC has one.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Boy named SSue said:


> Among others. Are these the ones with the boss mounts for both 700c and 26". Ones' been posted here (and yes, it had a brazed segmented fork) and a biology professor at UCSC has one.


I'd love to see some links or pics of those purpose-built 26"/700C Bontragers.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

goto11 said:


> I'd love to see some links or pics of those purpose-built 26"/700C Bontragers.


I am striking out in finding the post. I know Williwoods posted his old neighbor from Ojai's one at some point. The other I've seen in person belongs to UCSC biology professor Mike Dalbey. Maybe he'll send photos if you ask nice.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Boy named SSue said:


> Among others. Are these the ones with the boss mounts for both 700c and 26". Ones' been posted here (and yes, it had a brazed segmented fork) and a biology professor at UCSC has one.


Those were earlier customs, I've seen 3. Green, black, and another green. I saved pics of Willi's neighbors, gimme a sec

I know I've seen a 7hundo "production" sometime reccently, but I don't remember exactly where

It's driving me nuts


----------



## Kirk Pacenti (Sep 26, 2006)

colker1 said:


> btw.. what fork was on those bikes? Don't tell us there was a custom segmented fork..


No, not a Bontrager fork. Iirc, they were tig-welded uni-crown forks, but I don't recall what brand... maybe Tange.


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

I have a set of Bontrager Comp (triple-clamp) fork legs with bosses for 700c wheels. What would be the story on that?


----------



## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

DoubleCentury said:


> I have a set of Bontrager Comp (triple-clamp) fork legs with bosses for 700c wheels. What would be the story on that?


Comp, race, or cx legs?

The bike willi posted


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

hollister said:


> Comp, race, or cx legs?


Like I said, they are Comp legs (1-1/8" dia.) but the bosses are positioned for 700c or an apparent CX
configuration, yet I've not seen a CX bike running these legs before.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

DoubleCentury said:


> Like I said, they are Comp legs (1-1/8" dia.) but the bosses are positioned for 700c or an apparent CX
> configuration, yet I've not seen a CX bike running these legs before.


Hmmm

I think I need your fork


----------



## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Well, thanks to you all here , I've just doubled the size of my Bontrager bikes from from 2 to 4. The first two I had purchased new - a Privateer S in '96 (photos a few pages back) and a '97 Race Lite purchased I think in '98. I just got the crankset I needed last week in order to complete the rebuild of the Race Lite and will post some photos of that when complete.

In the meantime I found 2 more Race bikes on ebay. Both are green and are the first green bikes I've owned after an assortment of blue, black and red. The first was a local seller and I picked it up on Tuesday. It was a complete bike, the term used loosely, that is now in a bunch of pieces. I think it is a '94 though not sure. It has an older repaint by Cycle Art in Emerald Green that I rather like though it is a little rough. It also has a Mag 21 fork that as far as I can tell is a '93 or '94 - it seems to have parts from both years. It has the Bontrager crown but is also very rough. The rest is an assortment of parts, mostly old Shimano including an XTR rear hub wheel, LX/XT shifters and derailleurs, XT cantilever brakes and some Cook Bros cranks that I really like and cleaned up nice. I normally ride a Med (15" ctc) frame and this is a 19" ctc. It does seem to have an almost level top tube though and the standover is ok. And, since I'm planning to set this up for some sort of road/off road use, I think it's going to be good. The frame is missing the chain suck device, has horizontal dropouts, the FD pulley and the seat stay tupe cap is welded. The worst part, and the seller did not disclose it to me, is that the seatpost is frozen - so I'm working on that now

The second is a frame only in British Racing Green and just arrived a couple of hours ago via FedEx. This one also has a frozen seatpost but at least it was disclosed. This one has an interesting looking 4 piece chain suck plate, horizontal dropouts, the FD pulley and the second set of water bottle cage bosses on the underside of the down tube and the seat stay looks plugged. It's missing all of the decals but not the glue . But most of the glue is coming off and other than a few of the usual battle scars is cleaning up pretty nice - thanks to the powder coat. This one I plan to set up as a single speed, perhaps w/650b wheels and probably a suspension fork. Originally I planned to build this one up first using some of the components from the first bike. But now I think I'm going to just rebuild the first one as purchased and then start changing some of the components later - upright bars, better brakes, etc. And hopefully a repaint as some point. So the BRG one doesn't look like it will need a repaint so I just need some decals ... and a fork ... and, and, and perhaps a donor bike.

So many of the bikes I've done, inlcuding a few Schwinns, are just rebuilds of complete bikes. So I'm looking forward to having the freedom to try some different things with these two. And happy I'm starting with Bontrager frames.


----------



## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Some photos of the Emerald Green just before being dismantled:


----------



## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Here is the BRG frame. Still needs a little more glue removal but cleaned up pretty good. I think it has potential. SN=9597. I couldn't find a SN on the Emerald Green frame. The bottom bracket has an 18 teeth on the cups - not sure what they are and don't have a tool to get it out. Maybe I'll just leave it.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Phil wood bb


----------



## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

Thanks Hollister - that is good to know and a bit of a bonus I suppose. I can see a sealed bearing and it's still smooth. But still want to take it out and inspect and clean inside the BB.


----------



## classen (Oct 7, 2009)

I've been riding my Bonty alot lately and I'm really grooving on it. It's become my daily commuter and I've been taking it on longer offroad weekend rides. However, I am noticing that the front end gets a bit jittery under heavy braking.

Can anyone give me some advice on how to minimize or eliminate the jitter?

Is it just a matter of getting the toe-in correct? Or different pads?


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Do the canti's "wobble" in the post? If the brass bushings and or post are worn, the "play" can cause the shudder.


----------



## CYCLEJCE (Nov 2, 2010)

Short top tube + 150mm stem and retro narrow bars may be the cause.


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

classen said:


> I've been riding my Bonty alot lately and I'm really grooving on it. It's become my daily commuter and I've been taking it on longer offroad weekend rides. However, I am noticing that the front end gets a bit jittery under heavy braking.
> 
> Can anyone give me some advice on how to minimize or eliminate the jitter?
> 
> Is it just a matter of getting the toe-in correct? Or different pads?


Different fork.  I've found every Bontrager fork I've ridden to get a little excited under hard braking.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> Different fork.  I've found every Bontrager fork I've ridden to get a little excited under hard braking.


The fork on my Bonty CX (fork is actually made by Steelman) flexes a lot during hard braking - especially at lower speeds. I can see the fork ends move back and forth. 

I've not experienced it on the Comp forks, but the legs did come with different wall thickness, so I'm sure that the thinner ones have more flex.


----------



## aspreti (Apr 20, 2013)

Same with my Bontrager, I've made a video at 00:14 you will see the flex
It seems normal to me :thumbsup:


----------



## Chall (Mar 31, 2010)

Loving the photos of your Bonty! Could you possibly tell me the dimensions fo the roller though please? Mine has been long lost but a mate is going to machine one from a type of plastic for me. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Chall.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Chall said:


> Loving the photos of your Bonty! Could you possibly tell me the dimensions fo the roller though please? Mine has been long lost but a mate is going to machine one from a type of plastic for me. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Chall.


Look elsewhere in this forum for the part number for the roller. It is an off-the-shelf screen door roller, available at many hardware stores. No need to machine anything.


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## Chall (Mar 31, 2010)

goto11 said:


> Look elsewhere in this forum for the part number for the roller. It is an off-the-shelf screen door roller, available at many hardware stores. No need to machine anything.


Cheers for this bud! I will get on it asap!


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

A few more photos - cleaned them up a bit more though won't be done until seatposts come out.


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

*700c Bontrager*



goto11 said:


> I'd love to see some links or pics of those purpose-built 26"/700C Bontragers.


I have one of them (silver w/ blue decals). I'm in the process of building it up. Using a segmented fork w/ Paul's bmx motolites until I can find a proper cx fork. I'll post pics in a few days.


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

goto11 said:


> I'd love to see some links or pics of those purpose-built 26"/700C Bontragers.


Finally got this built up, mostly with spare parts for now to see how it would ride. Pretty much a stock 26" frame with 130 spacing (check out the photo of the bends on the stays, near the dropouts) and higher brake posts.

It needs a narrower spindle (107 or 103) to get a good chain line and some motolites for the rear. Ideally it would get a Bontrager CX fork at some point.

I'm planning to run some 700X45 Panaracer Smokes. There is a surprising amount of tire clearance.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

how does it ride w/ such a tall BB?


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## babbalanja (Jan 20, 2008)

colker1 said:


> how does it ride w/ such a tall BB?


It definitely feels taller, but I also ride 29ers so it doesn't feel strange. That said, I think it's better suited for gravel roads than tight trails.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

colker1 said:


> how does it ride w/ such a tall BB?


That bike is really cool. I didn't know they existed a month a go but now I want one.

FYI, I've seen the same fork 'adjusted' for 700c wheels by drilling out the rivet that secures the brake boss and setting a new one.


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

A few, (probably dumb), questions...

When did they go from 1" to 1 1/8" headtube?

When was the switch to one piece seat stays?

When did th e canti hanger disappear?

Did any of the 90's frames have regular rear brake studs?

The Grafton Mag I took off the rear won't work on a regular brake stud...did they make Bonty specific brakes?



Thanks for I indulging my stupidity.



Steve


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

98

95ish

98, unless it was shaved

None of the Santa Cruz mtn bikes did

No


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Thank you Hollister.

So...my 1" ht, one piece seatstay, canti-hangered, no rear stud frame
Was probably made between '95 and '98.

Any way to tell if it was CA or WI built?

Should there be a serial# on the BB?

I'll have to take another look at the rear Grafton to see why it wouldn't fit on a regular stud.


Thanks,
Steve


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Yup

Race and rl were all sc built

Serial mumbers(on the dropouts) mean nothing

I'm betting the boss is stuck in the brake


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## ted simmons (Apr 6, 2004)

*My newly built up Privateer*

Finally got all the parts together and it's ready to go.

98 Privateer Comp frame(EwBay $120!)
XT M750 shifter, hubs, derailleur, crankset, BB, etc
Avid Single Digit Ti brakeset
Easton carbon riser bar, Ritchey WCS stem, Titec post and barends
Selle Gel Ti seat
Salsa Cromoto fork

I tried to keep it somewhat retro but reliable and not stupid light. I know it's from Wisconsin and I've had Racelites and even a TiLite in my past but hey, it's the same tubes and geometry, the welds just aren't as pretty and it was cheap and I'm not stuck with a weird fork.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

ted simmons said:


> and I'm not stuck with a weird fork.


What weird fork?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

girlonbike said:


> What weird fork?


1 1/8 headtube on his bike


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## Steel29er (Jul 1, 2008)

Here's mine, it had been modernized when I purchased. Wish I had a rigid fork up front.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Steel29er said:


> Here's mine, it had been modernized when I purchased.


That's a big one.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

And it looks like a very nice one too.


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## Fillet-brazed (Jan 13, 2004)

From a friend's garage (not mine):




Been riding this one of mine for the last couple days:


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

That rear triangle is different from all the bontrager tandemns I've seen

So uh... Does he wanna get rid of it?


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## DoubleCentury (Nov 12, 2005)

hollister said:


> So uh... Does he wanna get rid of it?


You really want to go down that path?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

DoubleCentury said:


> You really want to go down that path?


LOL! Looks pretty natural to me!


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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

Rumpfy said:


> LOL! Looks pretty natural to me!


giggity


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## rolondo (Jul 19, 2005)

XXL Race


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Cool bikes FB, but what is the red one hanging behind the orange one, (crazy angles on fork and seat tubes)?


Steve


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

This Bontrager Race Lite is "borderline" vintage. The frame is from about '96 but the components are mostly from the early '00s. The drive-train is M952, and the fork is a Marzocchi Marathon which his a little tall for the frame (but not horribly so) - I run more air in the negative spring so that it has a bit more sag than I'd normally run. Although I've ridden many different bikes, the Bontrager Race and Race Lites are still among my all time favorite bikes.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

I'm looking for decals for my Race Lite. I would prefer the "rasta" colors with straight edges instead of diagonal decals. I've searched the interwebs, but haven't found anything like this. Anyone?


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

goto11 said:


> I'm looking for decals for my Race Lite. I would prefer the "rasta" colors with straight edges instead of diagonal decals. I've searched the interwebs, but haven't found anything like this. Anyone?


Paint the front of your bike red, the rear green, and then add these decals in yellow:

Bontrager CX wraps (sku 574)


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> Paint the front of your bike red, the rear green, and then add these decals in yellow:
> 
> Bontrager CX wraps (sku 574)


That could work, but painting my bike is more effort than I want to put in for bike number five. It's already green, so just a half paint job would be necessary, but still sounds like more work than I have time for now. Decals are easy. The bike originally came with the straight decals in '92. The decals shown below are what I'm looking for, except with straight edges instead of diagonal:


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

laffeaux said:


> Paint the front of your bike red, the rear green, and then add these decals in yellow:
> 
> Bontrager CX wraps (sku 574)


Just ordered the CX decals with yellow background. Thanks for the tip.


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## DrSpoke (Mar 27, 2013)

laffeaux said:


> This Bontrager Race Lite is "borderline" vintage. The frame is from about '96 but the components are mostly from the early '00s. The drive-train is M952, and the fork is a Marzocchi Marathon which his a little tall for the frame (but not horribly so) - I run more air in the negative spring so that it has a bit more sag than I'd normally run. Although I've ridden many different bikes, the Bontrager Race and Race Lites are still among my all time favorite bikes.


I like that combination. I too have a Race Lite, a '97, in red, all original w/JudyXC/XT - great bike. My '96 is a PrivateerS w/Quadra21R/LX and also quite nice. My Santa Cruz Superlight has a Marzocchi Marathon and sure wish I could find one w/1" steerer tube for a Race project I have. Finally, I just rebuilt for a friend a 2002 Trek STP (Soft Tail Pro) 400 that had the M952 group on it. The bike itself was quite interesting as it had a very early OCLV carbon fiber frame and was very light. Quite a high performance rig for it's day. And the XTR stuff was very nice though pretty much worn out.


----------



## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

I would like to put 29s on my ~93 Race. How did you get a 29 on the rear?


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

rryyyaannn said:


> I would like to put 29s on my ~93 Race. How did you get a 29 on the rear?


You just get the rear brake adapter from Xtracycle and use skinny tires. I posted pics of mine awhile back in this forum. It's a '93 race lite with horizontal dropouts. Won't fit big 29er tires and the BB is really high with the bigger wheels. After it was all built up, I didn't like the geometry, so I ended up getting another bike for my monstercross experiment (a 29er).


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## rryyyaannn (Jun 20, 2013)

Right on thanks for the response. Sounds like from your experience I'm just going to stay with 26. What about the 27.5 think that would be a good compromise?


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## Rumpfy (Dec 21, 2003)

rryyyaannn said:


> Right on thanks for the response. Sounds like from your experience I'm just going to stay with 26. What about the 27.5 think that would be a good compromise?


If you want a 29er, get a 29er, if you want a 27.5er, get a 27.5er. Keep it the way it is.


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## DarkSeries (May 13, 2014)

I'm thinking of restoring a fully stripped Bontrager Race frame. It would need a new powder coat but does anyone have a line on a seat post clamp and a an anti-chainsuck device? 

Does anyone know what size the seat post clamp is or one that might fit? Thanks for any help.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

DarkSeries said:


> Does anyone know what size the seat post clamp is or one that might fit? Thanks for any help.


The external diameter of the seat tube is 28.6 mm. There are many options available: DKG, Salsa, Hershey, etc.


----------



## oldskoolwrench (Jul 12, 2012)

My contribution to the Thread...

























Alan :thumbsup:


----------



## DarkSeries (May 13, 2014)

laffeaux said:


> The external diameter of the seat tube is 28.6 mm. There are many options available: DKG, Salsa, Hershey, etc.


Thanks Laffeaux, that will help me get the clamp and derailleur. Look like I need to get some brake bosses. The guy making some in this thread isn't replying to PM's.

This frame is missing brake bosses as well. Any idea what a a good boss would be that I can order to cut down and drill out?


----------



## fire02red (May 28, 2011)

Mainly a parts bin build... 32/18 magic gear for the SS conversion 
1996 Bontrager Privateer 19" frame
Rockshox Quadra fork
Bonty Post/stem/bar
Crap saddle/bar ends
ESI grips
Shimano LX cranks
Bonty wheels/tires
Shimano Deore V-Brakes with avid levers


----------



## yardley (Dec 19, 2013)

*Bontrager Restoration [email protected]*

More restoration [email protected] for your viewing pleasure! This is my Race, built it up new in 1994. You're looking at new powder coat (same green as the original), NOS decals, original fork, original brake levers (new powder coat), original brakes. The stem is an original, but not to this frame. Everything else is new, or close to it. Full White Industries Drivetrain, the "DOS ENO."

classen - huge thanks for brake studs!!!
Jak0zilla - huge thanks for helping out with the stem!!!


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Very nice! I'm glad the stem went to a good home. I'm considering a similar build (SS, Eno, etc.) on my Ti-Lite.


----------



## nimesq (Sep 4, 2014)

97 Bontrager Privateer - bought new in 99 and rode it until, literally, the wheels fell off. Somehow it made it into the crawl space at my mom's house. I forgot about it for the last few years and dug it out about a year ago. For some reason, I decided rebuilding an old bike was a great idea while I studied for the bar this summer (it wasn't). Parts are mostly period correct.

97 Indy XC - switched to threadless
Bonty Maverick wheels, red ano
Bonty Revolt tires
LX thumbs, brakes (levers are horrible but work for now), rear derailleur
STX special edition crankset
SDG Bel Air saddle
Cheap pedals, seatpost, stem


----------



## corwyn74 (Sep 12, 2014)

*Anyone tell me what year my Bontrager is?*

Hi;

This is my first post, I've been reading MTBR for years but never had need to post... I appreciate all of the info and opinions here, have guided many purchases and experiments and provided entertainment.

Can anyone tell me what year my Bontrager Race is? Also if it is for sure a Race and not Race Lite. I bought the frame new off the wall in a bike shop in Santa Cruz in '98, my receipt doesn't say what year the frame is. Now I am curious if it is <'96 or 96 or 97...

Let me know if any other pics or info would help.

I've always loved riding my Bontrager and still mix it up with my more modern FS. I'm playing with some upgrades/changes, mostly stem/bar combos and looking at better 1" fork options. I just swapped the XT top mount thumb shifters and 8 spd XT cassette for 9 speed setup mostly so both bikes have similar type of shifting, and replaced the XT cantilever brakes with V-brakes. I'll probably keep this frame forever whether it is SC built or not but still want to know which it is.

Thanks!


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## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

Looks like a Race, 96. I had one like it, and love it!
Note: Race lite would have had a machined head tube.
Look at the other Bonty’s on this site for comparison.
1st gen Avid shifter “thing", nice!


----------



## corwyn74 (Sep 12, 2014)

I read that about the head tube and assumed mine was a Race, but was also told so many frames were custom there isn't much of a rule. I have no idea if this was stock or custom.

How can one tell the difference between a '95 and '96? I've looked at a number of pics of each and can't see any difference yet. 

I just replaced my 2nd gen plastic Rollamajig with this 1st gen when going to 9 spd from 8psd, I thought the metal one looked best. 

Trying out higher volume tires on it too (had some on briefly and it was pretty fun), soon I'll put the original wheel set, Bonty rims on Nuke Proof Superfly hubs) with a WTB Weirwolf 2.3 back and Mutano 2.4 front tires


----------



## KDXdog (Mar 15, 2007)

corwyn74 said:


> I read that about the head tube and assumed mine was a Race, but was also told so many frames were custom there isn't much of a rule. I have no idea if this was stock or custom.
> 
> How can one tell the difference between a '95 and '96? I've looked at a number of pics of each and can't see any difference yet.


An explanation (old one) from KB himself:

There are a lot of differences between the two frames, too many to discuss in a lot of detail. The big difference is the tubing. The Race lite frame uses the lightest tubing we could find that was strong enough for XC racing. The main triangle tubes are butted and 0.7/0.5/0.7 mm thick. The chainstays and head tube are also lighter on this frame. The Race frame uses 0.9/0.6/0.9 mm butted main triangle tubes.

The geometry of each is the same.

The Race frame is intended for larger and more aggressive riders. These riders won't mind a few hundred extra grams to have a very durable frame.

There are two easy ways to distinguish one frame from the other.

The first is the easiest way. The head tube of a Race lite frame is relieved on the forward facing side to save a few grams. It's thinner in the center, away from the ends of the tube, but only on the forward facing surface. The head tube sticker is placed on this surface, and there are two "ridges" on this surface, one about 1/2" down from the upper headset bearing seat and the other 1.5" up from the lower headset bearing seat that show where material was removed. The ridges are about 0.7mm deep, big enough to see easily. Race frames are not relieved this way.

The other visual difference is a little trickier. Race lite frames use 3/4" chainstays while Race frames use a 7/8" diameter tube, measured near the bottom bracket. The Race lite stays have a round cross section in the reqion where the tire comes close, the Race frames are formed into a "D" section in this area.

Of course, none of these frames are in production any longer, though as of today there are still a few new ones available.

KB

I think 95 seat stays were still 2 piece, while 96 went to one tapered tube. 
but not 100% sure on that.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

KDXdog said:


> The other visual difference is a little trickier. Race lite frames use 3/4" chainstays while Race frames use a 7/8" diameter tube, measured near the bottom bracket. The Race lite stays have a round cross section in the reqion where the tire comes close, the Race frames are formed into a "D" section in this area.


If you have a Race and Race Lite side by side this difference is very obvious. When looking down the back of the seat tube at the location where the chain stays join the BB, the space between the two is much larger on the Race Lite. It's less obvious when there is no frame to use for comparison.


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## corwyn74 (Sep 12, 2014)

What about the differences between 1995 and 1996 (Race)? 

I am pretty sure my frame is a Race and think that 1996 is a reasonable guess on year but would like to find out for sure. I have seen plenty of pictures of 1994 and 1994 that look indistinguishable from my frame, straight chain stays and not butted etc. How can I determine mine is a 1996 and not an SC built 1995?

Thanks,
Josh


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

corwyn74 said:


> What about the differences between 1995 and 1996 (Race)?
> 
> I am pretty sure my frame is a Race and think that 1996 is a reasonable guess on year but would like to find out for sure. I have seen plenty of pictures of 1994 and 1994 that look indistinguishable from my frame, straight chain stays and not butted etc. How can I determine mine is a 1996 and not an SC built 1995?
> 
> ...


On 1994 and earlier frames the Race and Race Lite came with segmented stays. Later models came with tapered rear seat stays. Your frame has tapered stays, so it's 1995 to 1997. There is no difference between a Race made in 1995 or 1997 - they're the same frame.

At about the same time as the changes to the seat stays, the decals also changed from "square edged" to a "chevron" shape. Square edged decals would signify an older frame - you have the chevron decals. Most (all?) 1997 Race Lites were red and the Races were orange (the catalog says that they only came that way), in 1996 there were more color options, and in 1995 there were even more.

So it's really not possible to know the exact age (as Bontrager did not have model years). However, I'd guess that was a '96 Race based on it being a later model and not being orange. (Although it could easily be a '95 as well.)


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

corwyn74 said:


> What about the differences between 1995 and 1996 (Race)?
> 
> I am pretty sure my frame is a Race and think that 1996 is a reasonable guess on year but would like to find out for sure. I have seen plenty of pictures of 1994 and 1994 that look indistinguishable from my frame, straight chain stays and not butted etc. How can I determine mine is a 1996 and not an SC built 1995?
> 
> ...


Two more clues that might help:

1. I'm guessing that it is NOT Santa Cruz built, because of the shape of the seat stays at the wishbone/mono-stay connection. It resembles the privateers (that I've seen), with a more "peaked" arch, whereas the Santa Cruz frames (that I'm aware of) form more of a "rounded" arch.

2. The front derailleur cable hanger being located at about 5:00 on the seattube might be a clue. I think it moved around a bit through the years - though maybe not consistently at both (or all three) factories. Yours resembles my '95 Ti Lite (Sandvik built, sure on the year), whereas my Santa Cruz '96 Race Lite (reasonably sure on the year) has it located at 7:00.

3. As Lafeaux said, definitely NOT a '94. My '94 Race (positive as to year on this one, too), has the segmented seat stays as well as yet another cable hanger position that works with a pulley for bottom-pull derailleurs.

Look back through the thread, with these details in mind, and see if you can detect a pattern. And, of course, do it with a grain of salt - keeping in mind that few people seem to know for absolute sure what year their bike is, and that there were probably some inconsistencies and mid-year changes.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> Two more clues that might help:
> 
> 1. I'm guessing that it is NOT Santa Cruz built, because of the shape of the seat stays at the wishbone/mono-stay connection. It resembles the privateers (that I've seen), with a more "peaked" arch, whereas the Santa Cruz frames (that I'm aware of) form more of a "rounded" arch.


Good eye. The SC built ones also had stamped steel dropouts. You can see a ridge on yours right above the QC which means it's cast. I agree on it being a privateer.

Also, were there '95 ti-lites? I thought they were all '97s.


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## corwyn74 (Sep 12, 2014)

Thank you all for the great information on some of the differences. 

It sounds like mine is probably a '96 which was my guess, but also like I may never know for certain. Oh well, doesn't ride any different either way but would have been interesting to know for sure.

Thanks


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Boy named SSue said:


> Also, were there '95 ti-lites? I thought they were all '97s.


The Ti-Lite is in the '95, '96, and '97 catalogs.


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## yardley (Dec 19, 2013)

I would agree with SSue & iamkeith - most likely a Privateer. The 1994 Race I restored (pics earlier in this thread) is all from 1994 - frame, fork, stem, and decals. I purchased and built up the bike back then, so I absolutely know I am right about the date! Note the seat stay, wishbone, and dropout designs. The 1995 & 1996 frames I worked on (back then) had the same frame features - although I only handled a few of them. Not sure about when the transition to one piece seat-stays took place.

In any case, the geometry of the Privateer is killer, and what's not to love about steel!? You have a great ride!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> The Ti-Lite is in the '95, '96, and '97 catalogs.


Hmmm... I have catalogs labeled as '95-'97, and I have another one without a year listed that is even newer (maybe '98) which also has the Race, Race Lite and Ti Lite.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

The catalogs in the back are '95 to '97 (labeled). The one on top (black cover) does not give a year, but it's the newest of the four - maybe it's the '98 catalog? I also have the '99 catalog (which is labeled), and it does not show any frames at all.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

I'd have to dig when i get home, but i found a date somewhere in that black one last time I looked


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Boy named SSue said:


> Also, were there '95 ti-lites? I thought they were all '97s.





laffeaux said:


> The Ti-Lite is in the '95, '96, and '97 catalogs.


Plus, the Ti Lites have "normal" serial numbers: starting with the year - in this case 95; followed by the frame size; followed by sequential number built. Mine is _002, but I don't know if that means the second one altogether or 2nd one of it's size. It is interesting in that it does not have the relieved head tube that most later ones did, which further suggest that it's from early in the first year.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> Plus, the Ti Lites have "normal" serial numbers: starting with the year - in this case 95; followed by the frame size; followed by sequential number built. Mine is _002, but I don't know if that means the second one altogether or 2nd one of it's size. It is interesting in that it does not have the relieved head tube that most later ones did, which further suggest that it's from early in the first year.


My Ti Lite had a different serial number scheme. It started with BT19 and then had the build order. I assumed that mine translated to: Bontrager Ti 19" frame. But no year was included. So even the "normal" serial numbers are abnormal.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

laffeaux said:


> My Ti Lite had a different serial number scheme. It started with BT19 and then had the build order. I assumed that mine translated to: Bontrager Ti 19" frame. But no year was included. So even the "normal" serial numbers are abnormal.


You know what - you're right. I was trying to shoot from memory, which is always a stupid thing for me to do. Talk about spewing disinformation on the internet. :nonod:

So mine _actually_ says:

BT21004

Which I too took to mean: Bontrager TiLite or (Bon-Trager?); 21" (which, interestingly, is the c-t length rather than the c-c tube that Bontrager usually referenced); 4th frame built, (NOT 2nd at all, but still early - which, combined with mention in the '95 catalog, is why I assumed '95)

So at least it is consistent with yours. I'll shut up now.


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## Boy named SSue (Jan 7, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> My Ti Lite had a different serial number scheme. It started with BT19 and then had the build order. I assumed that mine translated to: Bontrager Ti 19" frame. But no year was included. So even the "normal" serial numbers are abnormal.


Both mine fit this number scheme. I remember hearing that they were all built in '96 and sold as '97s.


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## rolondo (Jul 19, 2005)

Mine needed the Pink Paul brakes. The whole thing is completely ridiculous, but I love it.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Pulley Size?

What's the proper front derailleur pulley size? The one I have has a 1"ish OD. It's cabled so the OD of the groove is hard to measure accurately. The cable rubs the band clamp. Not horribly but still enough to bug me. This is on a mid 90's CX with a 6004 Ultegra mech if that matters.


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## whatisaidwas (Apr 26, 2014)

The black frame up thread you all are discussing has a rear brake housing stop, but doesn't seem to have a front derailleur pulley. So it's before V-brakes but after top pull derailleurs? Does that say much about its lineage?


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## gravityhurts (Nov 27, 2014)

*Bonty CX tubing?*

Recently acquired a well preserved Bontrager CX bike from the original owner. I've owned and ridden many steel cross bikes. That said, the ride quality and feedback from this particular bike feels livelier.

Anyone know what type/brand tubing was used to build this frame?

Your expertise is appreciated.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Nice CX bike! The tubeset is the True Temper OX series.


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## gravityhurts (Nov 27, 2014)

laffeaux said:


> Nice CX bike! The tubeset is the True Temper OX series.


I genuinely thank you for your swift response.

OX huh? Thats good stuff and good to know.

Now it might just be me but, it seems heavier than my buddy's Kelly Knobby-X. Is that due in part to the gussets, and or, the threaded fork?

BTW-Happy Holidy


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## rabbit68 (Jan 12, 2015)

The twins are going to turn 2 at the end of this month, and my Bonty project will be almost exactly 9 months older - total coincidence. It's with a heavy heart that I have decided to part with it, and hope it goes to a good home.
I listed it in the classified section - any questions, let me know.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Hoping folks might be able to help me identify this frame. Based on the rear stays, confident that it is a non-trek frame. Curious with the details that you see on if you might be able to help me identify the year and confirm that it is an Offroad.

It has the roller for the front derailleur and has the sliding rear drop outs. It has the later style rear brake cable guide and the later style gussets. I believe the fork to be original to the frame and when I picked it up it had DX wheels, XT Derailleurs/Shifters and a forged Logic crankset.

Sticker set is the later version of them. I cannot find any serial on the drop outs to work off of. I am guessing 94ish? Any thoughts?

It is getting rebuilt with primarily m900 but with 732 top mounts. I am really not a fan of the Mag 21s and I have a 1" Atom Bomb that is by luck of the draw completely color matching for it. I do also have a Tange Switchblade that could find its way on there. Fork decision is still pending.

If anyone has a 26.6 XTR post around I would love to figure out something to trade for it too.......


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

datmony said:


> Hoping folks might be able to help me identify this frame. Based on the rear stays, confident that it is a non-trek frame. Curious with the details that you see on if you might be able to help me identify the year and confirm that it is an Offroad.
> 
> It has the roller for the front derailleur and has the sliding rear drop outs. It has the later style rear brake cable guide and the later style gussets. I believe the fork to be original to the frame and when I picked it up it had DX wheels, XT Derailleurs/Shifters and a forged Logic crankset.
> 
> Sticker set is the later version of them. I cannot find any serial on the drop outs to work off of. I am guessing 94ish? Any thoughts?


I'm guessing about a '93 Race, with a newer sticker set as you mentioned?? Maybe early '94?

Closed monostay means it's probably not older. Horizontal dropouts means it's probably not newer. Ovalized chainstays means it's not a Race Lite. FWIW


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> I'm guessing about a '93 Race, with a newer sticker set as you mentioned?? Maybe early '94?
> 
> Closed monostay means it's probably not older. Horizontal dropouts means it's probably not newer. Ovalized chainstays means it's not a Race Lite. FWIW


Agreed. The non-recessed head tube also points to it being a Race frame. '93 is a good guess on year.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Very nice, thanks for the help. I assumed it was right around that area. Currently pulling together all of the parts for it. Looking forward to riding it. Scored this one along with another one that is one size bigger and a bit too big for me in the same package deal. 

That other one was the frame only, anyone know where to find the brake posts and mounting bolts for one of these as the other frame didn't have any?


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*Bontrager CX*

Just contributed some parts (NOS WTB dirt drop bar) to my brother's Bontrager CX build, posted elsewhere in this forum with flat bars. Now it looks like a proper cyclocross bike. 







Correction: with a 40c tire up front (only 30c fits in the rear), I suppose it's dabbling in monstercross territory.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Does anyone have any scans of the old Bontrager catalogues? I would love to see the sizing charts on them. I have been eyeballing the frame with wheels on it compared to other bikes I have and it looks to be good sizing for me but would love to see what they were saying back in the day.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

datmony said:


> Does anyone have any scans of the old Bontrager catalogues?


Look at page #4:

http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/Bikekataloge/PDF/Bontrager/bontrager1996.pdf


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Thank you fine sir. Height wise looks like I should be having a Medium. Near as I can tell the two frames I have are a Large and XL respectively, so we shall see how I feel on the Large. I will post this in the trade section as well but if there is anyone out there with a Santa Cruz built Medium and they need an XL I am sure we could arrange a swap.


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## ben_h (Feb 3, 2015)

*Latest CL find*

I bought this 1996 Race Lite from the original owner earlier today. I paid $355 for it...I couldn't believe my luck!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

That red reminds me of a Park Tools ad w/ a Bontrager on the stand.


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## Uncle Grumpy (Oct 20, 2005)

goto11 said:


> View attachment 964924


Aesthetically, two thumbs up.

More importantly, looks like a fast and fun bike.

Grumps


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*22 years and still rolling!*

I bought this Bontrager Race Lite frame in February of 1993 and it was shipped with a Rock Shox Mag 21 fork and Bontrager crown to my San Diego apartment, where I assembled everything in my living room, using mostly parts pulled from my previous mountain bike. The frame was hand made for me by the factory in Santa Cruz before Bontrager was sold to Trek. The steel frame has several thousand miles and has endured two catastrophic events that resulted in bent or cracked tubes (one the result of a car plowing into the rear end, with me on it). Unfortunately, the last repair at the Bontrager factory sent it back with welded on cable guides instead of the bonded aluminum cable guides unique to the Race Lite. It's now on its third paint job and is sporting a new set of decals. Looking forward to another 22 years and then some...













My goal with this most recent rebuild was to make a big BMX bike: Short DH stem, 3" rise DJ bar, flats, single speed, Schrader valves. I can ride fast on my other bikes. This is just for cruising around.

It's a lot more comfortable than back in the day when I raced it with a long, low stem and narrow bar.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*Circa 1990 Bontrager Race*

Here's another one of my Brother's builds. Reproduction decals courtesy of retrodecals.co.uk.


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

I bought a Mag21 with a Bontrager crown but it didn't have the piece that goes under the crown race. I am sure that is a total needle in a haystack part, but anyone know of where to source one or has anyone had one made? Perhaps someone has a cad drawing of one?

I am assuming it is something that would take a machine shop three minutes to whip up. I would love to have one made if anyone can guide me......

Thanks much....


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

datmony said:


> I bought a Mag21 with a Bontrager crown but it didn't have the piece that goes under the crown race. I am sure that is a total needle in a haystack part, but anyone know of where to source one or has anyone had one made? Perhaps someone has a cad drawing of one?
> 
> I am assuming it is something that would take a machine shop three minutes to whip up. I would love to have one made if anyone can guide me......
> 
> Thanks much....


I saw these a while ago and thought they may work on Bontrager steerers....

1" Pace Crown Race Shim Adaptor 25 4mm RC36 RC30 RC31 Steerer Headset | eBay

Steve


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

Thanks Steve!!

That sure does look close and if not, might make a good sample of one to get started. I just ordered one so we will see. I will report back if it looks like it works. It will take a couple weeks to get here from the UK so if in the interim anyone has a caliper they might be able to use to get some dimensions of a real one that would be awesome.....


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## jessp (Sep 14, 2005)

What size are those tires? I wonder if a privateer has has that much clearance?



goto11 said:


> Here's another one of my Brother's builds. Reproduction decals courtesy of retrodecals.co.uk.
> View attachment 971914


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## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

eastcoaststeve said:


> I saw these a while ago and thought they may work on Bontrager steerers....
> 
> 1" Pace Crown Race Shim Adaptor 25 4mm RC36 RC30 RC31 Steerer Headset | eBay
> 
> Steve


I got one of these in the mail last night, unfortunately not quite the fit needed, the ID is just a touch to small. With a bit of emery cloth I think I can get it to work though.

Does anyone have one handy that they might be able to put a caliper on and get me some measurements?

Thanks much!!


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## Henry Chinaski (Feb 26, 2006)

PM me if one of these will help your resto project.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Nice stuff here...

I have a '92 Race (square stickers, horizontal DOs, chain-suck plate) that I bought from LBS after my Klien cracked. It's been setup as a commuter, but it's time to convert. 

Question, I'm either going to restore to original condition (I have original kit, mostly), or go for a SS 650b conversion with all new Gucci specs. 

I'm leaning to the SS. But the 7-speed xt thumb shifters are there too... Any thoughts?


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## yardley (Dec 19, 2013)

Nice project! Whatever you choose I'm sure you'll end up with a killer ride. To answer your question about 650b conversion... "what would Keith say?"

He'd probably say that he designed the frame around a specific wheel size (26"), and the resulting design delivers one of the best hard tail riding experiences, period. Converting to 650b doesn't solve any problems or limitations with the 26" wheel (there are none), and will probably introduce ride quality/mechanical issue that are difficult to anticipate now, but will be glaringly obvious once you start riding.

I restored my '94 Race with a Bontrager rigid fork, and White Industries Dos Eno drive train. If you go SS, you will have one of the sweetest SS bikes around. 7-speed XT would be awesome too. Check out post #1023 in this thread if you want to see my ride, and feel free to PM me with other questions.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

soemone in this forum did a conversion to 650B singlespeed. I have also seen a front wheel only conversion (on the rivendell website,, it belongs to one of the staff members). 92 could be a susp. corrected frame. If so, a rigid fork would have to compensate in height if you want the original ride..


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Very nice SS…

Yea, the hight BB with 650Bs might change the handling a bit (hope not), but I'm curious so I think I'll give it a try. I know what bigger rubber on a 26" feels like but want to compare that to less rubber on a slightly bigger rim...

If it sucks I'll go back to old-school or make it an urban SS'er/CX kind of thing.

I'll PM you if my head starts to spin during the build. Thanks for the offer.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

colker1 said:


> soemone in this forum did a conversion to 650B singlespeed. I have also seen a front wheel only conversion (on the rivendell website,, it belongs to one of the staff members). 92 could be a susp. corrected frame. If so, a rigid fork would have to compensate in height if you want the original ride..


My '92 geo is for the switchblade. 
Front only conversion. Interesting. Why not.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Got this one together this summer. I wanted a Privateer with a 1 1/8" steerer so I would have freedom to pick different suspension forks.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

Jspagat said:


> Very nice SS&#8230;
> 
> Yea, the hight BB with 650Bs might change the handling a bit (hope not), but I'm curious so I think I'll give it a try. I know what bigger rubber on a 26" feels like but want to compare that to less rubber on a slightly bigger rim...
> 
> ...


I've also been thinking about building up a bonty race frame I have as a SS and possibly 650b. I have another '93 bonty race as well with mostly orig parts and some mid 90's upgrades. I love the frames and will keep that one as close to original as possible, but would like to have one that I can ride more aggressively on with a rigid fork that is more stable than the bonty specific fork.

I am not so concerned about the BB height change due to going to 650b as it would only increase it by 1/2". I have ran large volume tires on my complete bonty which ran over 27" diameter and didn't notice any issues with the BB height being higher. The bike actually handled better due to more traction and lower psi of the bigger tires. But if running 650b on that bike I don't think I would be able to use as high volume of a tire, so not sure if there would be an advantage to 650b.

Regardless, please update as you convert your bike. I am very interested.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

The difficulty with 650b will be chainstay clearance and brake setup. I converted a Bontrager factory SS to 650b and had to run the wheel all the way back and barely could reach the rim with the pads and still had clearance issue with the noodle/cable on the linear pull brakes.

It was fun to play with, but I ended up putting 26" wheels back on.

jw



Jspagat said:


> Nice stuff here...
> 
> I have a '92 Race (square stickers, horizontal DOs, chain-suck plate) that I bought from LBS after my Klien cracked. It's been setup as a commuter, but it's time to convert.
> 
> ...


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Jspagat said:


> My '92 geo is for the switchblade.
> Front only conversion. Interesting. Why not.


I guess the space reserved for susp travel was used by the bigger wheel.. if your frame is not susp corrected it may be better to stay 26in.


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## Repack Rider (Oct 22, 2005)

Riding through San Rafael the other day, a guy passes me on an incredible original Bonty, I say, "Nice bike," hoping to start a conversation and get a photo. He grunts, and keeps on keepin' on, apparently on a mission of some sort. I didn't feel like chasing him down.


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

colker1 said:


> I guess the space reserved for susp travel was used by the bigger wheel.. if your frame is not susp corrected it may be better to stay 26in.


Hmmm, thanks for pointing that out. I didn't think of that, but that way you could run 650b in the front, 26" in the rear and I would think the ego would stay close to original.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

here> Staff Bikes - Mark


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

GrumpyOne said:


> The difficulty with 650b will be chainstay clearance and brake setup. I converted a Bontrager factory SS to 650b and had to run the wheel all the way back and barely could reach the rim with the pads and still had clearance issue with the noodle/cable on the linear pull brakes.
> 
> It was fun to play with, but I ended up putting 26" wheels back on.
> 
> jw


I wonder if these brakes would make the brake pad adjustment easier with 50mm of adjustment: Bombshell 686 V-Brakes-Pro (Long) 108mm at J&R Bicycles

Or a combo of these that I saw on another thread here https://www.biketrailershop.com/xtr...345_a_7c1600&gclid=CJbNgL3z4cgCFZAkgQodMnkBPQ along with these in the lowest setting Bombshell 686 V-Brakes-Mini (Short) 85mm at J&R Bicycles

Still will need to deal with the chain stay clearance, but one step at a time.

Just curious, why did you change it back to 26"?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Wouldn't you still have the largest overall tire selection with 26"? That would be enough for me. 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

After reading/thinking, I'm going 26" SS, not 650B. With a rigid switchblade I'd like as much volume as reasonably possible. 

I'm going to build a WIDE rimmed wheel (25-30mm ID) but can't find anything other than a Velocity Cliffhanger that has:

- 26" rim size
- machined walled (v-brakes, not disc)
- UST or tubeless capable

Anyone have a wide rim to suggest? Thx.


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

singletrackmack said:


> I wonder if these brakes would make the brake pad adjustment easier with 50mm of adjustment: Bombshell 686 V-Brakes-Pro (Long) 108mm at J&R Bicycles


CaneCreek Direct Curve 5 (if you can find them)










Pulled by Paul's Canti levers (because of how high up the pad carrier sits on the arms - but honestly, it's not even maxed out on these).









Works GREAT if your frame/fork can fit the rubber.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Jspagat said:


> After reading/thinking, I'm going 26" SS, not 650B. With a rigid switchblade I'd like as much volume as reasonably possible.
> 
> I'm going to build a WIDE rimmed wheel (25-30mm ID) but can't find anything other than a Velocity Cliffhanger that has:
> 
> ...


I'll answer my own Q:
Sun Rhyno XL Lite


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## nimesq (Sep 4, 2014)

Rehashing an age-old question - since my frame needs a 1" steerer tube, I've been keeping an eye out for older Bombers (I have the set of original threaded Indy XCs and a set of threadless Indy XCs on there now). Since I haven't been able to locate vintage Bombers that would fit, I searched and found some info on 1" RST steerers fitted to the bolt-on crowns that some old Bombers came with. 

It sounds doable (and I see those bolt on crown Bombers come up from time to time), but I couldn't find a single person that seems to have actually done just that. Anyone here able to offer advice (or have a lead on 1" steerer Bombers of any kind)?


----------



## datmony (Jul 12, 2012)

The RST steerers work well and I have used them. Next time I do one I will likely mill it down a little as they are a little larger than the stock bomber ones are. Not necessary though.....


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Goto,

I recently purchased a 1992 Bontrager race and I'd like to put some new decals on her, you mentioned you've done this with yours, where did you managed to find the nice square edged ones (pre 1995)?

BTW, very sweet ride and sounds like it's been through the wringers.

Take care and thanks,


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Mr. Claus said:


> Goto,
> 
> I recently purchased a 1992 Bontrager race and I'd like to put some new decals on her, you mentioned you've done this with yours, where did you managed to find the nice square edged ones (pre 1995)?


Mr. Claus:

Email Gil at Retrodecals ([email protected]). Check out their work at http://www.facebook.com/retrodecals

I'm in Northern California, but the fact that Retrodecals is in the UK has never been an issue. The color was a bit off on my first set of decals (there weren't any originals in my colors to reference), but they fixed it and sent me a second set of decals for free. Gil was super nice and easy to work with.



Mr. Claus said:


> BTW, very sweet ride and sounds like it's been through the wringers.


Thanks and yes, my Race Lite has been through many lives since I got it in '93 (this frame has the horizontal slotted dropouts from '92 and earlier, great for SS). The great thing about steel is that, unlike aluminum, it can be repaired without any loss in strength. The pictures below show how I used blue tape to mark the centerline of each decal before installing them. The hardest part was getting the old decals off, which was aided by a heat gun, but took a lot of scraping and paint thinner to remove the adhesive.


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Goto,

Thanks for the quick response and I will e-mail Gil (classic UK name) today. Mine was nicely repainted and is now a beautiful orange, so I'll have to think about the color scheme, thinking white background, blue stripes and lettering, we'll see.

I too am a huge fan of steel, the Bontrager is my "BMX" kinda bike and is a medium (5'11" and a tad on the smallish side for me), I used to race BMX and love the feel of a slightly smaller frame underneath me. My other steel bike for long haul rides is a a classic waiting to be, a Ritchey P-29er, very different bikes, both rigid, but they have their own personalities...

Thank you very much again and may you have many more miles ahead. Cheers.


----------



## corwyn74 (Sep 12, 2014)

I got my replacement decals from index who produced the originals from what I understand, they have decals in stock for $40 a set plus shipping, the ones I got look exactly like my originals

Thanks,
Josh


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Many thanks Corwyn, I'll give them both a try and see which are best and convenient to get. Thanks for the tip and take care,


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

*I'm know pre-1995, but when?*

So, here's my restore of a pre-1995 Bonty (not sure about age really, serial # 1437), in either case, here's a good pic of the straight steel fork and bike in general. Decals are on there way, I debated getting the square edged ones or slanted, went with square, not sure when the change occurred, but I wasn't trying to make it back to original, but just the way I like it. The Bonty/Titec bars are nice, but I'm going to have to replace them with riser bars as they are just too narrow and low for me. Any one want them? I think I'd be more comfortable with a 5-8 deg riser bar.




















In either case, ride on and enjoy the great outdoors, group ride tomorrow in Briones (Norcal).


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Beautiful paint job, Mr. Claus. I just rode my Bonty "BMX" yesterday... makes me feel like a kid again . I know what you mean about the riser bar. I used to ride that same Ti flat bar (hard to believe how long and low I used to have it set up), but ended up with a Deity Villain III high-rise bar, which would work great with the 1" stem you have on there now, and you could get it to match your decals. Deity Villain III Handlebar


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Goto,

Thanks, yeah with mine being a medium, I consider it my BMX joy-toy (respectfully of course), thanks for the tip about the Deity riser bars, they seem to have them in stock at jenson, the 25.4 mm width is key (a ted pricey at $63 though), I like the blue, that should go nicely with the orange, I know it's a departure from the more time-accurate Titec bars, but at the end of the day I ride this bike and the more comfortable the better.

Well, back to the ole career, but have a good weekend hopefully some of it on 2 wheels


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Very nice looking. I just powdercoated my '92 in orange - hope it comes out looking as good as your pics when built back up. I have silver bar/stem etc. too. Will post pics when done (ss 650b conversion).


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Jspagat,

Interesting, curious to see how the 650b looks and more importantly handles, also when you get a chance let us know how much effort (and $) it took. Hope the powder coat turns out well, I'm hoping my new decals are coming soon so I can glam her up. Might give you an idea of what color decals you're looking for, unless you've already got them. Goto11 on this forum pointed me to Gil of retrodecals to get mine, we'll see.

Take care and do post pics when you're complete.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Mr. Claus said:


> Jspagat,
> 
> Interesting, curious to see how the 650b looks and more importantly handles, also when you get a chance let us know how much effort (and $) it took. Hope the powder coat turns out well, I'm hoping my new decals are coming soon so I can glam her up. Might give you an idea of what color decals you're looking for, unless you've already got them. Goto11 on this forum pointed me to Gil of retrodecals to get mine, we'll see.
> 
> Take care and do post pics when you're complete.


I'm curious on the handling too. Although it's gonna be a ss gravel grinder - the single track where I ride (New England) is too brutal for rigid.

I'll give a $ breakdown when done. Had to dip into the kiddies' college fund (someone has to finance this stuff). Was gonna use an xtr m952 crankset, but gave up and got a WI eno. Brakes are monolites (if they fit). Coincidentally, the widest 650 machine walled rims I could find are Pacenti rims. Kirk Pacenti, as you may know, was the head frame builder for Bontrager, although after my frame left the shop. After I retired this Bontrager, I got a Merlin, which is where Kirk worked for some time as well, although after my frame left the shop...


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

I've got Pacenti rims (SL25?) on my mid 90s conversion. Velocity Synergy also works and they look a bit more period correct. 

Chances are your handing will be fine. A suspension corrected 26" frame (410mm fork) converts to a nicely non- corrected 650B ride (if they fit). My bottom bracket height is just under 12" and it's a blast to ride. The larger tires fill in the gaps nicely.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

*Finished and a a blast to ride*

Groto et all,

BTW thanks for the tip about the Deity bars, the rise was just what I needed to make the med frame work for me. I also am looking forward to hearing about how the 650b conversion goes, I'd contemplate giving it a try next year, good luck....OH and BTW the decals from RetroDecal (Gil) are perfect, I think the color works great with the orange powder coat..My lil Bonty BMX bike...

Take care all and ride on,


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Nice decals. I have some great/white originals with the angled edges. My frame had the square edge decals, so I'm not putting them on. I think I'll go with the ones from RetroDecal. Thx.


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Well, here's the beginning of my third Bontrager, my second Santa Cruz Bontrager, and my first Race Lite. I think it's a '91 or '92 and I believe it's "Neon Grey" but I could be wrong on both accounts and would appreciate any input from the experts. I know the fork isn't exactly correct for the frame, but that's what it came with along with an XTR M900 group. Looking forward to getting it rolling, I'll update along the way!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Better pics of the seat collar, and the slit in the seat tube.

Please


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

hollister said:


> Better pics of the seat collar, and the slit in the seat tube.
> 
> Please


This help?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

89-90'

Odd no pump peg

Very cool!


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

*'92 Race SS 650B*

I have about 100 mi. on it.

The 650B's are tight-ish, but seem to fit fine. I have Thunder Burt 2.1s on there. I still have some drop-out room to move the wheel back once the chain stretches.

Was worried about loosing some handling going to 650Bs (higher BB, etc), but I think I like the overall ride much more than the 26ers. The bar got wider and stem shorter, so that might contribute to some of the difference, but in general, the bike feels more-or-less the same, only it's a bit more forgiving.

Here are some pics.
I photobucket them tomorrow.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

loosing ---> losing


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

Very cool, Jspagat. Clearance looks a bit tight though! 

Well, I'm finished for now. I kept and rebuilt the fork, and re-spaced an XT wheelset to accept the 8 speed XTR group. Eventually, I would like to find some XTR hubs and headset to complete the group. Oh, and if anyone knows who made the ti bars I would like to know!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Looks great! I love the color.


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Looks pretty snug.


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## cheesophile (Mar 21, 2014)

*Bontrager Project*

My friend is giving me this bike. It should be a fun project. This is the only picture I have right now. I was hoping the color scheme might reveal info about the bike. More pictures to follow.

https://i1063.photobucket.com/albums/t511/climbandboulder/Bontrager/image1_zpsse31yciv.jpeg

Thanks


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## nimesq (Sep 4, 2014)

'97 Privateer. 1" steerer, full STX-RC. The "least desirable" Bontrager I think. That said, I'm almost done restoring the exact bike that I've had since new. It is a fantastic frame and well worth fixing up!


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## cheesophile (Mar 21, 2014)

nimesq said:


> '97 Privateer. 1" steerer, full STX-RC. The "least desirable" Bontrager I think. That said, I'm almost done restoring the exact bike that I've had since new. It is a fantastic frame and well worth fixing up!


Thanks. I'd love to see pics of your rebuild. I may either restore to original or go ss. Depending on frame size , for me or my son.


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## YakimaDeathYaks (Aug 15, 2012)

Heres my 90 or 91 Bonty OR, kind of a frankenbike build but it works.


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## YakimaDeathYaks (Aug 15, 2012)

Heres my 90 or 91 Bonty OR, kind of a frankenbike build but it works.


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## nimesq (Sep 4, 2014)

cheesophile said:


> Thanks. I'd love to see pics of your rebuild. I may either restore to original or go ss. Depending on frame size , for me or my son.


Link to my previous rebuild below:

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/official-bontrager-thread-3836-41.html#post11429991

Here is where she sat as of last year. Bit of a parts bin build. Totally overhauled her again recently, still waiting on NOS original decals and a few parts before I post an update.

I'm also loving the two gray Bontys posted recently. That is a fantastic color.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

chefmiguel said:


> Looks pretty snug.


It is snug, but my old Yeti 26'er had even less with 26 x 2.25s. Never a problem. I'll see if the noodle can handle it.

I really like how the bike rides regardless...


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

ha - looks like you have the same "conversion" wheels that I originally used.

Pacenti QuasiMoto fit pretty well in back

















Kona Project II is your friend in front (with a big ole NeoMoto):


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## shamobius (Jul 26, 2014)

*What Year?*

Hello Bontragians,

I've just found two Bontragers but don't know their years of production.

One is a 17" blue Race (ser# 0278), and the other is a red 15" Race Lite (ser# 7552). My best guess is the Race is 1993, and the Race Lite is 1996. Please let me know if you think otherwise, and thanks for playing!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

teh blue looks to be a large and the red, a medium.


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## shamobius (Jul 26, 2014)

Thanks colker1, I had figured that was the case. I was surprised when I looked up the 17" and found it was considered a Large, suitable for 5'9" - 6'1" riders. But then it is measured cc bb to top tube. Its 19" to the top of the seat tube...


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## PhxBuckeye (Feb 8, 2010)

Just had my buddy in Denver pick this up for me. Guy who sold it said it's a '98 Privateer Comp. However, I thought by '98 they had 1-1/8" head tubes. This is 1".

I've wanted one since the early 90s when I was an underclassman in college.


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## shamobius (Jul 26, 2014)

Nice bike, I like the decals and the Bontrager stem. The lack of a cantilever brake bridge braze-on on the monostay in the rear suggests that 1998 could be accurate, though the 1" head tube is a bit of a puzzler...


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Yeah, I owned a 98 privateer and it had the 1.125" headset. Ialso owned a dark green 96 privateer with silver decals. I would think your bike is a 96 or 97 maybe?


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

I've been looking for one of these a long time....



Lots of rust, hoping it will clean up well.

Steve


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

20" or 24"?


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

chefmiguel said:


> 20" or 24"?


20

As far as I know they only built 20" frames in Santa Cruz. The 24" frames came with the move to Waterloo.

Steve


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I've got the '97 Bontrager BMX catalog and the frames don't seem to have a gusset at the BB like your does. Is the gusset only on earlier frames?

In '97 there were three complete bikes: B1, B52, and B29 (24"), and there were two frames: Diesel, and Warthog.

That's a lot of options.


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

laffeaux said:


> I've got the '97 Bontrager BMX catalog and the frames don't seem to have a gusset at the BB like your does. Is the gusset only on earlier frames?
> 
> In '97 there were three complete bikes: B1, B52, and B29 (24"), and there were two frames: Diesel, and Warthog.
> 
> That's a lot of options.


As far as I know, the completes were all Trek-built in Waterloo and had less gusseting.
The Warthog and Diesel frames were still built in Santa Cruz.
Kirk told me they made about 100 frames total in CA.

Would love to see a scan of that catalog if you could.

Steve


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## peter.thedrake (Aug 6, 2009)

Crazy, I just saw a Bontrager BMX locked up on the street outside King Kog Oakland a couple days ago.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I don't have time right now to scan the whole thing, but here are the two pages on the Diesel and Warthog. There's not much info about either.


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

laffeaux said:


> I don't have time right now to scan the whole thing, but here are the two pages on the Diesel and Warthog. There's not much info about either.
> 
> View attachment 1044685
> 
> ...


Thanks for the scans...very cool, but even more confusing...

Diesel is supposed to be the race bike (canti mounts and a 1 1/8" ht)
Warthog is supposed to be the DJ (990 mounts under the stay and 1" ht)

My frame has canti mounts but never had a canti stop (both of the frames in the have a stop...weird)

The guy who sold me my frame got it from a Bontrager Team rider...might have something to do with differences.

Something is just screwy...I'll post some more info soon.

Steve


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

From Gary (site owner) at BMX Museum:



This is directly from Keith Bontrager himself.
The production Bontrager BMX frames that were made in the Santa Cruz CA were the Warthog and Diesel. Sold over 3 years from 1996 - 1998. Very Rare. Warthogs were orange in the first year, baby blue after. Very few orange frames exist. Diesels were red, and one of the first "test riders" was Wade Bootes. Not sure if he ever raced one, he raced for Trek for a short time and rode their monocoque bike mostly.

Primary difference between Warthog and Diesel was that Warthog had 1 inch bmx headtube, Diesel had 1 1/8 for threadless setup. Warthog had 990 mounts, Diesel had cantilever mounts.

The Production Bontrager BMX bikes that were sold as completes had True Temper frames, similar design, less gusseting around the chain stays, etc but were made by Trek's manufacturing facility in Waterloo Wisconsin. Offered in two different build specs (B1 and B52) with two frame lengths each, and B29 was 24 inch cruiser frame, only one size offered. One guy that worked there, started his own company, Rock lobster cycles, which is currently in Santa cruz, and still makes custom bike frames!




Steve


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

I still crack up every time I see this


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

hollister said:


> I still crack up every time I see this


Cable stop and 990 mounts...wtf?

What year is that from H?

Steve


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Frame cleaned up nicely.

Looks a bit grayer after bead blast and clear coat, but at least the rust is gone.

Before:


After:


Now I just need some nice decals, a few parts, and some warm weather.

Steve


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

What color are you going with?


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## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

chefmiguel said:


> What color are you going with?


Hard to tell in the full frame shot, but I kept it raw with a clear coat.
Wanted to be able to see the welds, details, and serial number.

Not sure what color decals I want just yet.



Steve


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

*Bontrager Single Speed*

Finally went back to a riser bar after playing with drop bars and not riding the bike for years...

-jw


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## Vlad (Feb 7, 2004)

Bravo. I love the way that bike looks.


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## PhxBuckeye (Feb 8, 2010)

I decided to go rigid, change to some old skool handlebars, new bear-trap type pedals, Kenda Small Blocks and new wheels on Hadley hubs.


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## jjbnum3 (Feb 13, 2016)

Found A interesting Bontrager Titanium road frame 700c.I just started researching
Bontrager and his frames.Now I want to own one someday.
This might be a early Bontrager frame? I searched and did not find anything that looks close to this one.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

jjbnum3 said:


> Found A interesting Bontrager Titanium road frame 700c.I just started researching
> Bontrager and his frames.Now I want to own one someday.
> This might be a early Bontrager frame? I searched and did not find anything that looks close to this one.
> 
> ...


The titanium frame production was outsourced. The frame pictured appears to have a 1-1/8" steerer, which would probably make it a Trek. If you want a real Bontrager, get a steel frame made in Santa Cruz... plenty of examples in this thread.


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## stw (Feb 13, 2016)

*What year do these Bonty features indicate?*

I've been reading through this thread and now have some doubts about what year my Bontrager Race is.
It's a black medium 15" c-c Race OR I bought new old stock as a frame/fork in spring 1997. At the dealer (in Cleveland) they told me it was built in Santa Cruz at the end of production, and said it was a 1996 model.

I will try to post a photo later but here's what it has:

-1" head tube, not milled 
-_sleeved_ seat stays 
-BB gussets on both chainstay and seat tube above BB (as well at the tt and dt gussets too)
-_no_ derailleur wheel
-_welded_ top tube cable stops on top tube
-rear brake cable stop on the wishbone
-_slanted _edge mylar panels top and down tube
-RS Judy (?) with black Bontrager special offset crown

Replaced the RS fork years ago with a Marzochi Atom B. but still have the RS around here somewhere.

Kirk P said early in this thread that that sleeved seat stays were discontinued in 1995 and square panels discontinued in 1993 or 94, so my Race would be a 1995 or 1994? Did any sleeved seat stays come out of the Santa Cruz shop in 1996?

thanks!
Now to find Bontrager fork legs. I have a NOS crown/steerer but no legs.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

I think you can rule out '94, as that would have likely had the derailleur pulley. Not sure about sleeved stays in '96 though.


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## jjbnum3 (Feb 13, 2016)

goto11 said:


> The titanium frame production was outsourced. The frame pictured appears to have a 1-1/8" steerer, which would probably make it a Trek. If you want a real Bontrager, get a steel frame made in Santa Cruz... plenty of examples in this thread.


Thanks for the info.Just looking at other images of Bontrager Ti bicycle I posted did not match the Ti frames Bontrager built.

Truth is I knew very little about Keith Bontrager before I did A little online research about this bicycle I seen posted.When I have more time I'm going to read more about him and most interested in the bike frames he built.If there is not A book about him,there should be.

I still might have bought this Trek with Bontrager headtube badge if it was my size and made into a touring bike.They want $600 and it most be close to 25 years old and Ti frames are the hardest to weld.

Yeah I hope to someday own A real Bontrager that I can ride or hang on wall.jk about that last part.


----------



## stw (Feb 13, 2016)

stw said:


> I've been reading through this thread and now have some doubts about what year my Bontrager Race is.
> It's a black medium 15" c-c Race OR I bought new old stock as a frame/fork in spring 1997. At the dealer (in Cleveland) they told me it was built in Santa Cruz at the end of production, and said it was a 1996 model.
> 
> I will try to post a photo later but here's what it has:
> ...


Thanks Keith, we rule out 1994.

On page 43 of this thread last year on 2-17 Ben posted a photo of a red 1996 Race Lite with the same fork mine came with but I can't tell from Ben's photo if his 1996 has sleeved seat stays.

Here is a photo of mine. Sadly I peeled off the decal panels in a moment of bad judgement. You all may think the drop bar is another moment of bad judgement but, if so, it's not just a moment 'cause I built it this way from the beginning. Those are XT shifter pods modified so they fit behind the brake levers and I shift easily with my fingers. 
The interrupter cross brake levers turned out to be a dumb idea. I added those just a few years ago when they were so in fashion and I was trying to be open minded. Useless for me since I ride the hood not the tops. 
I added the Marzochi Atom Bomb in about 2000 and liked the change--I think it has more travel than the stock RS, axel to crown in 44cm compared to the stock RS of 42.5cm. 
I'm really wanting to try a rigid fork on this now. 
thanks.
link to the flickr album

__
https://flic.kr/p/24735781250


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

stw said:


> Kirk P said early in this thread that that sleeved seat stays were discontinued in 1995 and square panels discontinued in 1993 or 94, so my Race would be a 1995 or 1994? Did any sleeved seat stays come out of the Santa Cruz shop in 1996?


The '96 and later frames did not have the segmented stays. Your frame is older. 94-95 is a good guess.

There weren't model year changes for the frame, so it's not like a '94 frame is different from a '95. When changes happened, the model years/name did not change - things were just updated.

Your frames - Race with segmented stays - is one of the more desirable frames. Enjoy it.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jjbnum3 said:


> Found A interesting Bontrager Titanium road frame 700c.I just started researching
> Bontrager and his frames.Now I want to own one someday.
> This might be a early Bontrager frame? I searched and did not find anything that looks close to this one.


I'm not sure what that bike is. It does not look like Bontrager's Ti Lite or Road Lite frames. It's much newer, made well after the Bontrager facility was closed down. It looks like a Trek hybrid - likely nothing special.


----------



## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Are you sure that's a Bontrager? The headtube badge isn't like any Bontrager logo I've ever seen. And Bontrager only ever made Ti MTB frames.

*laffeaux beat me to it...

-jw



jjbnum3 said:


> Found A interesting Bontrager Titanium road frame 700c.I just started researching
> Bontrager and his frames.Now I want to own one someday.
> This might be a early Bontrager frame? I searched and did not find anything that looks close to this one.


----------



## surlytman (Nov 9, 2005)

That is not a Bonty


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Its been a few years since I sold my last Bontrager. This thread keeps popping-up in my email and in a moment of weakness I bought a Privateer Comp. Its my fifth Bontrager over the years and although its not a SantaCruz bike its pretty clean and from my perspective a decent deal for a complete bike. It was also set-up exactly the way I like my bikes with 1x gearing with a single xt thumbie using the ghost click. I already have a nice ti-railed Bontrager saddle for the bike in my parts bin and will need to find a Bontrager stem.

The downside is that my wife is going to kill me (again).


----------



## jjbnum3 (Feb 13, 2016)

GrumpyOne said:


> Are you sure that's a Bontrager? The headtube badge isn't like any Bontrager logo I've ever seen. And Bontrager only ever made Ti MTB frames.
> 
> *laffeaux beat me to it...
> 
> -jw


You are right,I looked again the Bontrager roadies are steal.This ad got my brain
all mushy.

When I seen Bontrager name and Ti,I got real interested.As I never ridden or own A Ti bike.I was really interested at first.But because I did not see anything close to the bicycle picture,I thought it might be A rarer model.

It was A craigslist listing. The person trying to sell this bike is very odd to say the least.They never came out but they did turn on the porch light for me..haa ahh.

I do not want to derail the thread to much.Lets just say I went by to take a look at the bike at nighttime and did not get a good look at the frame.The headtube badge was the only marking.The parts on it were pre 2000 for sure.
So who ever sold them this bike,sold them A fake?

They changed the ad to say
manufactured for Bontrager by Trek limited Edition 2014.lol

https://corvallis.craigslist.org/bik/5443872237.html


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## jjbnum3 (Feb 13, 2016)

[/QUOTE]
Very nice Bontrager


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Thanks. It's always great to buy a bike you know will perform in a certain way. That's one thing that always draws me back to these bikes.


----------



## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Not mine, but I thought it deserved to be posted in here:



Steve


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I really like that!!



eastcoaststeve said:


> Steve


----------



## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Done.

Can't wait to see how it handles on the track this Spring.



Steve


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Hello, I am new to the forum and I am here for some help and advice. I have a 1994 Race Lite that I have had since it was new and I want to upgrade to a modern drive line. I love the bike and it is in great condition and I intend to get it as modern as I can. Currently it is a XT 7 speed with a Manitou EFC that has been upgraded to spring and oil dampening. Trying to figure out what the rear spacing and bottom bracket size is. I have it in my head the the rear spacing is 135, is this true and if it is can I upgrade it to 1x11? If not what is the most that I can go without cold setting the frame? Thanks


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Ridgeback01 said:


> Trying to figure out what the rear spacing and bottom bracket size is. I have it in my head the the rear spacing is 135, is this true and if it is can I upgrade it to 1x11? If not what is the most that I can go without cold setting the frame? Thanks


Rear spacing is 135mm. You're likely limited to 10-speed. I think for 11 you need an HD-driver hub which you're not likely to find in a standard 9mm quick release setup. Most modern hubs are thru-axle and you'll not be able to use that, so even if you widened the rear to 142, you'd not find a hub to use on it. 135mm is pretty much standard for mountain QR rear hubs.

The BB is 68mm wide and English threaded. Finding a crank with external bearings that will fit this is pretty easy.

The big limiting factor on the bike is the fork. You'll not find a modern fork to use on it. The head tube is 1". It's getting hard to find a modern 1-1/8" fork these days, as almost everything come with a tapered head tube and too much travel for your frame.

My Bontrager has 9-speed components and and a 15 year old fork on it. It still rides pretty well.


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Thanks for the info. 10 speed will be fine but I am really interested to converting to the newer 1X cranks you I have seen one example from some pictures someone posted on flicker so I will take a look at that. The fork that I have right now works fine and if it stops working I can just lock it out and use it like a rigid. To be honest I am moving to CA soon and will be living next to the Ord National Monument and I am getting old enough that I will be buying a full suspension bike to deal with riding off road. So I am really thinking that I will go to one of those Carbon cycles ridged forks and turn the bike into a multi purpose /gravel bikes so the suspension fork is not really an issue. Do you know what size fork I need to get? 42.5?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Ridgeback01 said:


> Do you know what size fork I need to get?


It needs a 1" fork corrected for 63 to 80 mm of travel. Your bike would have come with 63mm, but the front end is steep enough that 80 mm of correction is fine. That's probably in the 410-420 mm of leg length range.

As far as offset goes, Keith speced forks with very little offset. The shorter the fork the less offset it should have. If you use a longer than recommended fork, and some offset to make sure that the trail stays somewhat similar.


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## clock (Sep 24, 2010)

Please keep us posted as to your progress. I have a 94 RL with full XTR, white hubs and BB, and a Judy XC. A truly great ride that I was thinking to convert as you have described.



Ridgeback01 said:


> Thanks for the info. 10 speed will be fine but I am really interested to converting to the newer 1X cranks you I have seen one example from some pictures someone posted on flicker so I will take a look at that. The fork that I have right now works fine and if it stops working I can just lock it out and use it like a rigid. To be honest I am moving to CA soon and will be living next to the Ord National Monument and I am getting old enough that I will be buying a full suspension bike to deal with riding off road. So I am really thinking that I will go to one of those Carbon cycles ridged forks and turn the bike into a multi purpose /gravel bikes so the suspension fork is not really an issue. Do you know what size fork I need to get? 42.5?


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Has anyone investigated rear disk break adaptors and if there was one that will fit?


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

Ridgeback01 said:


> Has anyone investigated rear disk break adaptors and if there was one that will fit?


I've not investigated it, so maybe someone will come along and tell you the "Club Enduro Roost-booster" is what you need .... but I'd be afraid to add the brake force load to those thin stays. They were made thin where possible and thicker where needed to handle rim brake forces.

I know you've said you're in the market for an additional full-squish bike. If you want all the new features on a rigid/hardtail you could probably get enough bucks for your Bontrager to find a newer frame with the specs to take all the newer gear.

I've actually never owned a bike with discs. I'm curious. I'm probably going to end up buying one or the other of the Surlys or a similar frame. I'd not weld disc tabs onto any of my vintage bikes, and the adapters ... well ... enough grouchery from me.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Jak0zilla said:


> I've not investigated it, so maybe someone will come along and tell you the "Club Enduro Roost-booster" is what you need .... but I'd be afraid to add the brake force load to those thin stays. They were made thin where possible and thicker where needed to handle rim brake forces.
> 
> I know you've said you're in the market for an additional full-squish bike. If you want all the new features on a rigid/hardtail you could probably get enough bucks for your Bontrager to find a newer frame with the specs to take all the newer gear.


This. Just sell the BOntrager and buy a disc brake 11 sp, 120mm travel front fork bike.


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Naaaaw can't be gettin rid of it!! These bikes are the last of an era, fine american craftsmanship. That may be maudlin and sentimental then so be it. The idea is to get it as far as I can without modifying the frame. At that point, thats where it will stay until it falls apart.


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Then maybe I will buy a Rock Lobster! Who says I can't have more than one bike?


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## peter.thedrake (Aug 6, 2009)

Then I would stick with rim brakes on the Bonty


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

peter.thedrake said:


> Then I would stick with rim brakes on the Bonty


Agreed. If you're looking for all of the features of a modern bike, get a modern bike. The Bontrager will do well as it's intended. Spending money is not going to make it ride like a modern bike.


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

Good quality V-Brakes will suffice I'd say. Shimano XTR with paired levers are the bomb. You can get stand alone shift pods in both XT and XTR. The crank might be an issue though. You'll have to research Q factor and ring clearance. There are shimano tech docs out there that will give you the info you need.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Trying to find some old photos on a backup hard drive and found this article...

-jw

View attachment 1063098

View attachment 1063099


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

Ridgeback01 said:


> I have it in my head the the rear spacing is 135, is this true and if it is can I upgrade it to 1x11? If not what is the most that I can go without cold setting the frame? Thanks


I just replaced the drivetrain on my 1997 Race Lite frame, and I considered the 1x11 options. There are certainly 135mm hubs that support both 11 speed systems (I chose the Hope Pro2 Evo 40t rear hub because it works with everything with inexpensive adapter kits). For SRAM you need the xD driver, and that 10t cog is pretty far outbound and pretty small. Some 135mm full suspension frames have fit issues, but hardtails are usually alright for 11-speed fit.

I also considered going with Shimano 1x11, which would have certainly worked in the rear with the new Hope Pro2s, but up front I was concerned about single chainring clearance at the chainstay (and with an 11t small cog I would have needed a larger chainring up front).

I ended up going with SRAM X0 2x10 with 28/42 in front and a 42t cog extender on top of a 1070 11-36 cassette. This gives me the same range as the old XT M770 3x9, and I can still convert to a single chainring in the future (probably direct mount, so I have more flexibility in chainring clearance).










Here's are all the new parts, as you can see this is a pretty modern drivetrain (2014 parts mostly):

- 2000 Marzocchi Bomber Z1-CR 100mm fork (professionally rebuilt)
- SRAM X0 2x10 drivetrain with 28/42 crank, X0 type 2 rear derailleur, 1099-R chain
- SRAM X0 2x10 Grip shifts
- 1070 11-36t cassette w/ eThirteen 42t extender and 16t Wolf tooth cog
- Avid BB7 front disc brake
- Avid SD-7 SL adjustable-leverage magnesium brake levers
- Easton EA70-XCT front wheel (tubeless)
- Custom rear wheel with Hope Pro2 Evo 40tooth hub and Mavic XC717 rim (tubeless)
- Panaracer Fire XC Pro Tubeless 26 x 2.1
- On-One Fleegle 15 deg sweep flat bar (715mm)
- Bontrager Race Lite 90mm stem

The best part is that all the new parts were on sale for at least 50% off (because anything 26", 2x10, or non-hydraulic is suddenly considered obsolete).

Individual shifts aren't really better than they were with the Shimano XT 3x9, but overall shifting is much improved. I can shift between the two front chainrings instantly under full power, and the Grip Shift allows me to dump 1, 3 or even 9 gears at once up or down.

The old fork was a Marzocchi Z2 Atom Bomb, and the extra 20mm stanchion height and disc brake on the Z1-CR really changes the character of the bike (the bottom bracket is still below the axle, but barely). It still climbs like a goat, but it's so much more confident downhill. If I'd known ahead of time, I would've gotten a wider rear rim, since now I am tempted to bomb downhill. Of course, some would say that I ruined the character of the bike by changing the geometry and making it slower, but I kept the old fork and will be rebuilding it with brand new MountainSpeed 80mm long-travel springs. Once I test it on my old '94 Marin Eldridge Grade I might end up putting it back on the Bonty. But probably not, I get more sag on the Z1, so I don't think the overall geometry is too badly affected. It actually makes the geometry feel a bit more modern.









Speaking of upgrading the Race (Lite) I have seen a lot of nice Bomber forks with 1" steerers on eBay recently, if anyone reading this thread wants to upgrade their Race/Race Light (the first one looks like an XC600, but is brand new in box and unused!!):

Marzocchi MTB Bike Fork | eBay

Vintage Marzocchi Bomber Comp 80 mm 26 in V Brake Super RARE 1 inch Steerer Air | eBay

Marzocchi Bomber 1" Threadless Mountain Bike Suspension Fork Old School Vintage | eBay

Marzocchi Bomber Fork | eBay


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

hey all, new to the forum and thread here. intending to do some upgrading on my 1997 race lite, and hoping for feedback from those that have done similar.

haven't dug back through all this thread, but at least the last few pages, so forgive me if this was discussed much earlier. main questions are:

1) can i go 1x11? i am really interested in a new drive train, and would like something more modern. just upthread here it seems like maybe...? i was thinking of building a rear wheel with the BHS MTB270 hub which i believe should accept an 11sp cassette. but maybe there will be issues up front with clearance..? has anyone done this to one of these frames?

2) for the wheel build, i am thinking the BHS hub laced to a mavic xm317 (717 is more than twice the price). any other better rim or hub choices that make more sense, or are more economical?

3) Ridgeback01 let's go ride. i live in marina and have been riding Fort Ord regularly.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Hey there Alex,

Hmm, I somewhat recently converted my 1991 Bonty Race to 1 X 9, it's not "vintage correct", but it did revitalize the ride for m and made the bike look cleaner. I suppose it could have accepted at least a 1 X 10 as thee seemed be enough space, but I wanted to keep my period rear wheel (XT wih Mavic 517 SUP). As for rims I like Mavic 517's, pretty light, sturdy and you can get them pretty reasonably used. I'm assuming this is a 26", I would go with a nice lightly used pair of 26' wheels (CL or EB), people seem to be purging them and they are plentiful and if you search enough you'll get a nice pair.

I live in Berkeley (went to UCSC and miss the riding down there), I can't seem to get myself to drive all that much on the weekends in the Bay Area as it always seems like a nightmare, but Fort Ord is awesome from memory. Not sure any of this helped, but I'm sure others will chime in. Dig it, roll on and take care,


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Hey mr. claus,

thanks for your input. not worried about "vintage correct" - prefer to use newer tech but still ride the same frame.

i was thinking the same on the 517 (thats what i have on front and used to have on back until i ruined it), but they appeared intermittently available. so the newer version (717) seemed like the ticket, but it is also hard to find and much more than the 317......hence my thought that maybe the 317 is the ticket.

but maybe i can wait and find a good deal on a used or NOS 517 rim...


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

alex-henson said:


> hey all, new to the forum and thread here. intending to do some upgrading on my 1997 race lite, and hoping for feedback from those that have done similar.
> 
> haven't dug back through all this thread, but at least the last few pages, so forgive me if this was discussed much earlier. main questions are:
> 
> ...


You can go 11 speed. There are hubs available that will let you use an xD driver in the 135mm spacing, with convertible axle. I had a wheel built up with an XC717 and a Hope Pro 2 40t 10mm bolt-on hub. The Hope Pro 4 is similarly capable (I went with the 2 to save grams). DT Swiss 350 hubs are another good inexpensive choice for this.

The 11th cog is actually at nearly the same position as the 10th cog on a 10x cassette, but the big cog is further inbound. This is why only certain hubs can be converted, their has to be enough spoke clearance for the dinner plate.

For the front, you probably can't go bigger than 28 for a ring in the inner position of a 2x10 spider crank. I expect that at least 34t should work with a center chainline, but I plan on using direct mount when I go 1x so I have a little wiggle room on chainline. I went 2x10 X0 for now, with 28/42 and 11-42 with an e.Thirteen expander cog. This crank and hub should work with either 2x11 or 1x11 nicely.

The Mavic 317 is very similar to the 717. IIRC, the difference is that the 317 is pinned, and the profile looks a little less like a UST rim. Unless you are running tubeless and want to avoid the possibility of leaks at the pins, I don't think there is much difference. I went tubeless, and the 717 only required a few layers of Stanz 21mm yellow tape and some Orange seal. I did have to use a CO2 inflator, which I've never needed with other UST rims with the same tire, but it worked great after that.

If you aren't doing flat-out XC, the 721 are modern width and UB rim-brake compatible even though they are sold as disc rims. They only add 175 grams, but I wanted to keep my wheel below 1000 grams (came in at ~900 with DT Swiss Competition spokes and brass nipples).


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

banjor said:


> If you aren't doing flat-out XC, the 721 are modern width and UB rim-brake compatible even though they are sold as disc rims. They only add 175 grams, but I wanted to keep my wheel below 1000 grams (came in at ~900 with DT Swiss Competition spokes and brass nipples).


BTW, I had good luck finding Mavic rim brake rims from prowheelbuilder.com and CRC. Prowheelbuilder still had Mavic 719 in stock, last time I checked.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

yikes, that bonty is jacked up. Curious: if you guys want all new stuff on your old bikes, why not just get a newer used bike?


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

banjor: awesome and very useful feedback! thank you! 
couple questions:
1) are you familiar with the BHS hubs? they look like they should fit 11spd at 135mm spacing (BHS calls it out as 10/11) but its nice to hear from someone who has heard of it done or knows for certain...
2) is going tubeless worth it? i have no experience with that.



girlonbike said:


> yikes, that bonty is jacked up. Curious: if you guys want all new stuff on your old bikes, why not just get a new bike?


ha. fair question. seemed like upgrading would do three things that buying a new bike wouldn't:
1) i would still be riding the race lite...
2) seems like if i am thrifty, it is cheaper to upgrade than buy a whole new bike...
3) buying a bike is considerably less fun than building one...


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## Ridgeback01 (Mar 15, 2016)

Alex,

I am not in Marina quite yet, I currently live near Tacoma and in the process of selling my house. I expect to be down there in a couple months.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

alex-henson said:


> banjor: awesome and very useful feedback! thank you!
> couple questions:
> 1) are you familiar with the BHS hubs? they look like they should fit 11spd at 135mm spacing (BHS calls it out as 10/11) but its nice to hear from someone who has heard of it done or knows for certain...
> 2) is going tubeless worth it? i have no experience with that.


Alex,
The BHS hubs should work fine, and people like them. I considered using those, but I got a good deal on the Hope, so the price difference was small.

BTW, I'm in the Mission if you want to go riding sometime.

girlonbike,

I would totally agree with you if this was an aluminum mountain bike. I like steel bikes, and I wouldn't be able to afford a brand-new ultralight hand-built custom steel frame, so anything new would be a downgrade to me.

By the time the Bonty made it into my hands (from someone with identical measurements), it had been upgraded to XT 9-speed, but was largely original. I rode it that way for years, but the wheels and drivetrain wore out. I didn't see the point in replacing like-for-like on the drivetrain, since there were more options available these days.

I started riding MTB as a young teen in 1990, and people used to keep their frames as long as they liked and would upgrade to the latest components as they became available. The reason people don't do that anymore is because manufacturers started introducing new standards that weren't backwards compatible. Why buy into that? This is still a better ride than most hardtails available today.

Anyway, I kept the 65mm Bomber, XT drivetrain, and original 120mm stem and narrow Race Lite flat bar if I ever get nostalgic. I don't think I will, it's a better ride now.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Thanks again Banjor.

Glad to hear the BHS will work.

Another question: looking at 11spd components, everything looks like it should work....but what about the rear mech mount? the XT M8000 i was looking at had a different mount than the bike has. is that normal these days? and if so, what's the solution?

Oh and what fork are you running? I still have the bomber z2 which seems ok but maybe down the road more travel would be cool.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

alex-henson said:


> Thanks again Banjor.
> 
> Glad to hear the BHS will work.
> 
> ...


Alex,

The rear derailleur mount on the M8000 is a different design, but the bolt that threads into the derailleur hanger is the same. I think you already figured out that you want a "10/11 speed" hub driver for Shimano, the XD driver is just for SRAM 11-speed. I have no idea if the new 12-speed Eagle stuff would work.

I was running a '98 Z2 Atom Bomb with 63mm travel before, and it had ~440mm axle-to-crown length. I bought a 2000 Z1-CR on eBay, and recently fitted that. It has 100mm travel, and an axle-to-crown length of ~465. The bars are about 20mm higher now, but the Z1 has more sag than the Z2, so the difference is more like 10mm when I'm in the saddle. The Z1 adds about 200 grams. Model year 2000 and later Bomber forks had an IS mount for discs, so I'm also running an Avid BB7 which adds more weight.

I just swapped out the springs in the Z2 for a pair of MountainSpeed long travel springs that should increase travel to 75mm, and increases the height about 5-10mm. I will either run the Z2 on my old Marin Eldridge Grade or eventually put it back on the Bonty if it turns out that the Z1 negatively affects performance, but so far it's been great.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Dude banjor you're a wealth of info! Thanks!

I don't make it up to the bay much but if I do, I'll send you a PM.

Ok so the standard mech bolt is still there and bolts on...it's just also set up to attach to that newer design. That's a cool idea about the longer springs....I'll look into that. How much of a difference does 10-20mm make on the feel - I can't imagine it's much...? Though I imagine having more travel is noticeable. Maybe that's the next project after rear wheel and drive train.

Ridgeback01 - sent you a PM.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

Alex,

The Shimano M8000 has a "direct mount", but includes a bracket that attaches to the derailleur hanger. See page 8 of this Shimano tech doc:

http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/dm/DM-RD0004-07-ENG.pdf

This bracket moves the axis of the b-limit screw further behind the axle, allowing better alignment with a wide-range cassette. You can add a Goat Link to move it back further and get even more range if you want to use a SRAM 10-42 cassette or a 9-44t with an XT M8000 derailleur.

http://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/products/goatlink

As far as judging the difference between the Z1 and Z2, you can't feel it on level ground, but it shows up on a climb. I was expecting it to hurt climbing, but since there is more negative travel available I have actually been lifting the wheel less, which was always a problem (the extra pound in the front end might be helping). Going over big rough stuff is like night and day, the Z1 soaks up 5" square-edge steps with just a little bounce in the handlebars, while the Z2 would bottom out and lose speed if I didn't pull up at the right moment. Descending is much plusher, but I am getting a little brake dive, which is entirely new, but then again I moved from a very worn-out XT V-brake to a disc brake (with Nokon rigid cables) up front, so no doubt I'm applying more braking force now. I found myself accidentally lifting the rear wheel on some stops until I got used to the power.

It isn't a fair comparison, though, since the Z2 hadn't had a service in many years and wasn't working at top capacity. It creaked and squeaked and had stiction issues. Now that I've serviced the Z2 I'll report back at some point with a side-to-side comparison of the Z2 and Z1 on the Bonty. I also have some medium springs to try in the Z1, which will increase the amount of travel I'm using. Disc brakes are probably the biggest change, so I'll do the back-to-back with V-brakes.

If you already have a pre-2001 Z2 , then you can easily swap the crown and 1" steerer to any other Z1/Z2 made with bolt-on stanchions, which is all models through 2000. That's what I did, since the Z1 I bought came with a 1 1/8" steer tube. Also, the early crowns with the detachable steer tubes will take a brand new RST 1" steerer. The ultimate fork for this bike might be the 99-2000 Z2 BAM 80mm with disc tabs, but the 100mm Z1 is close (just heavier). Note that 1997 and some 98 models had Formula 47mm disc tabs, you want IS-2000 to use modern disc brakes.

There are a couple of things you can do to improve performance with your current fork. Servicing it with Enduro fork seals from enduroforkseals.com and new oil/grease will help. I also swapped out the front QR skewer for a DT Swiss 10mm through-bolt inside a 10-15mm axle adapter inside of 15mm front hub. It's MUCH stiffer and acts just like a 15mm through-axle, although this setup adds 40grams. Also, rigid brake cables help with power, cable fade, and modulation.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Cool stuff. The fork would be a later upgrade but it's nice to hear what you've done. I always just assumed the longer travel forks would jack ride up significantly.

The current fork is pretty reasonable considering the era it came from - its been rebuilt with those seals and new oil ~2yrs ago.

First step is to dig up a rim brake acceptable rim and build the rear wheel. Second step do the drive train. But geez, finding a new rim brake rim is ridiculous. XM317's really only seem to be stocked in UK bikestores, where the shipping negates the benefit of their low price. Think I'll post a wanted ad on the site.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Cool stuff. The fork would be a later upgrade but it's nice to hear what you've done. I always just assumed the longer travel forks would jack ride up significantly.


I've ridden lots of miles on Bontrager with various forks. The best setup I've used was with a 70mm travel early 2000's Marzocchi Z2. I currently have an 80mm Marathon on a bike and it does not ride as well - it wanders on climbs more than it does with shorter forks. I'd be careful and not put too much travel on the bike; it will be fine for the downhills but not great for the ups.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

laffeaux said:


> I'd be careful and not put too much travel on the bike; it will be fine for the downhills but not great for the ups.


Nice to get another opinion also. An easy way to try more travel may be the long spring option, and see how they feel.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Well, I thought I would add a few pics of the bike. Since I have been finding inspiration from others, I thought I'd add to it.

Here is the bike in its current state. Recently added new decals from Velocals. Kinda fun to do. They are definitely not super durable unfortunately, which I learned the hard way the first day they were on!





















Bought materials to build a new wheel to replace the old one with shot hub. Found a cheap 317 and laced to BHS MTB270 (very nice looking hub by the way). Still working to fine tune the truing.....









As for the drive train.....been researching all options. Lots of changes to the MTB industry that are new to me. Been very interesting learning new stuff! But wow it's a bit overwhelming.

Initially I wanted to go 1x11, but I heard many people having chain drop issues, and the cost (~$380 if replacing cranks, which I think I want to do) is maybe a bit more than I want to spend. I spec'd out a 1x10, using various parts for ~$250. Essentially it comes down to the trickle down effect, which has happened for 1x10 but not for 1x11.

Does anyone have experience with the following: zee cranksets and BB, slx 10spd shadow+ and shifter, or sunrace 11-42t cassette? Are there any glaring issues with this combination? The zee does not have NW, and I wonder if that is an issue? Also, I wonder if the slx will be able to accommodate the 42t cog? I would appreciate any input if others have built similar drivetrains!


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

mr. orange has some neat ones:

. by mrorangevrc, on Flickr

DSC00092 by mrorangevrc, on Flickr


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

yummyyyyy....

bforks1 by mrorangevrc, on Flickr


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

One of my favorites of Laffeaux's:










https://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/1986-bontrager-mountain-bike-815003.html


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

There are some nice looking Bontragers on that site! Thanks for that link.

Not too sure about the drivetrain on that pinky there...........seems like a backwards step to me.

Definitely not going rigid either! I had a lust for one of those forks years ago, but that has lapsed by now.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

alex-henson said:


> Initially I wanted to go 1x11, but I heard many people having chain drop issues, and the cost (~$380 if replacing cranks, which I think I want to do) is maybe a bit more than I want to spend. I spec'd out a 1x10, using various parts for ~$250. Essentially it comes down to the trickle down effect, which has happened for 1x10 but not for 1x11.
> 
> Does anyone have experience with the following: zee cranksets and BB, slx 10spd shadow+ and shifter, or sunrace 11-42t cassette? Are there any glaring issues with this combination? The zee does not have NW, and I wonder if that is an issue? Also, I wonder if the slx will be able to accommodate the 42t cog? I would appreciate any input if others have built similar drivetrains!


Nice photos, it looks good! I'm hoping to find a place to get good quality decals for my Race Lite. Does anyone know where?

The Zee crank will work fine, although it's designed for downhill (and landing jumps standing on the pedals), and the XT single crank is 150-200 grams lighter. An M8000 "11-speed" single crank will also work just fine with a 10-speed chain.

Narrow/wide is nice, but it's hardly necessary. How many times have you had a chain fall off the front ring when you weren't shifting the front mech? If you're paranoid, there are lightweight chain guides.

I would argue the trickle down effect is happening in 1x11, see the SRAM NX and XT Di2, but it's still a money-pit. Wait until 12-speed is the new hotness for prices to come down.

There is still exciting stuff happening for 1x10, though. Lots of extender cog options. The Praxis cassettes look like a really good deal. Garbaruk has some great stuff as well. I really like the E-Thirteen TRS+ 9-42t cassette, which converts from 10-11, but it requires an XD hub driver.

But, if you want to use a Deore/SLX/XT/XTR rear mech , then you either are limited to 40 tooth or you need to use a Goat Link or a replacement derailleur cage. 42t is too tight to shift cleanly. The Garbaruk replacement cages are really good quality, and look bling. I have one I'm very happy with, but it didn't work for 2x10, so it's sitting in a box until I change one of my bikes to 1x10.


----------



## mauricer (Apr 15, 2011)

Didn't even know they already existed in '82. Amazing bike!


----------



## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

banjor said:


> Nice photos, it looks good! I'm hoping to find a place to get good quality decals for my Race Lite. Does anyone know where?


He said it in the post you're quoting from. Velocals.

Now as to all that about 13 speed clusters, and Di3 .... :skep:


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

mauricer said:


> Didn't even know they already existed in '82. Amazing bike!
> View attachment 1072290


Who is that?


----------



## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Jak0zilla said:


> He said it in the post you're quoting from. Velocals


Yes. That is where I got mine. They are slightly fragile it seems. That, or I am just too hard on everything. Despite that, they still look good.

The other thing I just realized, is I can run a WolfTooth ring up front on my current XT crank and drop the price more.

And then spend some of the saved money on the goat link.....

Bout to look into the e13 9-42....that's some nice range....


----------



## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

alex-henson said:


> Bout to look into the e13 9-42....that's some nice range....


Never mind...just saw that price tag!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Another "other"

Joy!


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

That's an awesome frame Hollister!

So are the seat stay aluminum too? The thickness of the wishbone sure makes it seem that way. Is the only steel portion of the frame the chain stays?

What's it weight? Much lighter than a Race Lite?

Are you going to build it up and ride it.


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

gawdddddd.....wow!!!


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

laffeaux said:


> That's an awesome frame Hollister!
> 
> So are the seat stay aluminum too? The thickness of the wishbone sure makes it seem that way. Is the only steel portion of the frame the chain stays?
> 
> ...


Seat stays are steel, I tried to get the bolt inside the wishbone in the pic, but it wasn't bright enough out :/

I stopped weighing my bike years ago(hi, my name is hollister and I'm a recovering weight weenie)

Looking for a donor bike all week..

He snuck something else in the box, Santa Cruz bike #1


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

So the former is 1 of 2?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Both of these bikes are awesome! Is the green bike mountain or CX?


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

girlonbike said:


> So the former is 1 of 2?


Yes ma'am



laffeaux said:


> Both of these bikes are awesome! Is the green bike mountain or CX?


 a big ol' CX


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

hollister said:


> Yes ma'am
> 
> a big ol' CX


that makes it the most rare bike ever!


----------



## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Hollister,


Aluminum frame is stunning....

Green CX is beyond words and coolness....you are my hero.




Steve


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

hollister said:


> He snuck something else in the box, Santa Cruz bike #1


So what year did Keith move to Santa Cruz? The bikes made prior to this were from Sunnyvale (his in-laws garage), correct?


----------



## Vlad (Feb 7, 2004)

That aluminum Bontrager is dope!


----------



## stw (Feb 13, 2016)

Selling my the Judy suspension fork that came with my 1996 Bontrager Race frame/fork. Black lowers.

Putting it in the new MTBR classifieds but I don't know what $ to ask. 

1" threaded forks seem to go dirt cheap on ebay but I wonder if there is value in an OEM Bontrager fork with Keith's custom offset. 
Don't know if a "what is it worth" question is ok for this thread. I was going to post it in the "what is it worth" thread but decided this thread had more people knowledgeable about classic Bontrager.

thanks. I set up my Bontrager rigid and really enjoying it that way.

(I will add a photo)


----------



## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

I just picked up a second Race Lite to go with the one that I've been riding for 12 years or so. This one is a 1995 (1996?) metallic blue Extra Small that's pretty much all original, and has been ridden less than 500 miles total. It's a bit smaller than my current Small Race Lite, but not too much, it still fits me and will fit my girlfriend even better.


























Above you can see that on the XS frame there isn't room behind the seat tube for the cantilever brake stop in the rear to be on the centerline, so it was tilted 45 degrees so the cable can clear the seat tube. This affects braking somewhat, so the left brake pad touches before the right. The brakes are Sachs New Success cantilevers, which were manufactured by Modolo. The rear tire is a Bontrager Jones 26x1.95".

The original Bontrager stem has gussets just like the frame to increase strength and allow for thinner tubing. The stem and original 2014-aluminum handlebars are very light.

I would have been happy if just the frame were in good condition, but it turns out that everything on the bike is spotless and in near-mint condition. The one previous owner was a bike shop owner. It's got a full SR Suntour XC Pro MicroDrive drivetrain, which I'd never seen in person but the quality feels top-notch. The XC Pro kit came with WTB Grease Guard ports, so I don't even have to disassemble the hubs or bottom bracket to pack new grease before it's ready to ride. Without adding grease, the hubs spin longer and quieter than any of my other wheels, and the wheels are perfectly true. Did Bontrager ever specified Suntour components as an option? I only see the XT kit in the old catalogs, so I assume that this was a custom build. Total weight: under 25 pounds.










I'm going to keep this one as vintage as possible (unlike my workhorse Race Lite which just got a brand new drivetrain). The one component which might need some attention is the Rock Shox Mag 10 fork with the Bontrager-specific fork crown. It holds air, but the stiction tells me that the seals are bone dry. I'm hoping I can get this working smoothly, so I can at least get a good feel for what this bike is like with the 1.25" fork rake. The RockShox fork pump that came with the Mag 10 is comical by today's standards. It's a syringe attached to a brass valve and a PSI guage, with an inflation needle similar to those used to inflate soccer balls. As a backup I have a spare Marzocchi Bomber Z2 fork which would need almost no maintenance.

Here are some more pictures:

Closeups of the original Bontrager grips, bar ends, and the Suntour MT twist shifters:
https://dansneddon.com/race_lite/95_xs/05-Front_Derailleur_Grips.png

Closeups of the MicroDrive 20-32-42 crankset and 11-28 cassette and derailleurs:
https://dansneddon.com/race_lite/95_xs/06-Suntour_XC_Pro_Drivetrain.png

Closeups of the Suntour XC Pro hub (with Grease Guard port visible), Sachs brakes, Bontrager BCX Red rims, and Bontrager Jones 2.1" front tire (installed backwards in that picture, oops):
https://dansneddon.com/race_lite/95_xs/07-Hub_Tire_Wheel.png


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

banjor said:


> I just picked up a second Race Lite to go with the one that I've been riding for 12 years or so. This one is a 1995 (1996?) metallic blue Extra Small that's pretty much all original, and has been ridden less than 500 miles total. It's a bit smaller than my current Small Race Lite, but not too much, it still fits me and will fit my girlfriend even better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks like an awesome find. I always hated those forks. Amazingly the needle valve port actually made it all the way into the 98 and 99 SID's which was then replaced by their even worse, proprietary valve, which needed a separate schrader adapter.

That rear brake is definitely an engineered disaster. I think they probably missed the release of v brakes by a few months.


----------



## eastcoaststeve (Sep 19, 2007)

Looks a bit like my garage.

Steve


----------



## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Hi,
I just got my hands on this one:


It seems to be a 1995/96 never ridden Race Lite! Since I don't want to mess around with the sus-corrected geometry I will have a rigid fork for this - my first thought was: ask Paul Sadoff to do this - so it will be still a Santa Cruz build bike...

Cheers,
Marco


----------



## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

caemis said:


> Hi,
> I just got my hands on this one:
> 
> 
> ...


You might want to read THIS, and then think long and hard about asking Paul to build a fork. Not that he isn't a worthy builder, mind you. Just sayin'...


----------



## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

iamkeith said:


> You might want to read THIS, and then think long and hard about asking Paul to build a fork. Not that he isn't a worthy builder, mind you. Just sayin'...


Hi, thanks for the link - I didn't know this! But I guess - at least from my perspective - this case is somehow different. Let me explain. I have this frame and want to build it as a rigid race bike for my wife. The sus-corrected geo and the 1" headtube makes it really difficult to find - just even to know of - a decent fork. Maybe you know of something else but in my mind just the PACE RC30 would fit the bill (changeable steerer, sus-corrected A-C). On the other hand, Paul did a great job for me on my single speed lobster few weeks ago and build a nice fork for it as well. To conclude, I won't ask Paul to build me something like a "Bontrager fork" but a typical Rock Lobster fork which would match the needs of my frame...
Cheers


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

I think your case is also different. You want a fork made by RS for a Bontrager. You're not asking him to build you a Bontrager frame or repair.

I recently asked Curtis Inglis to make me a fork for an old Retrotec. Couldn't be more excited about the bike now. I ride it all the time.

Go for it!


----------



## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Thanks. Thats what I thought. Anyway, since I am from Germany I have to consider customs, CO2 footprint etc. before I decide. It happens that I own a Bontrager Comp fork and I was offered by a german frame builder to build new legs for it to fit the frame. That sound quite cool to me.

Is there any picture of your Retrotec with Iglis fork? 
Cheers


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

*Nice find*



caemis said:


> Hi,
> I just got my hands on this one:
> 
> 
> ...


Marco, your bike selections are looking a lot like mine, ion top of the fraternal twin (though as) lobster, I too have an orange (91/92) Bonty but it's a race. In either case I hope you find a suitable rigid fork for it. Mine is an odd ball, not sure who made it, pics of my Bonty are in this thread, but a bit earlier. Best to you and I do like how the Lobster paint job turned out. Cheers


----------



## mauricer (Apr 15, 2011)

Next in line of projects...1991


----------



## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Colkervision says, BIG!


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

girlonbike said:


> Colkervision says, BIG!


How long is that seat tube? Or top tube? To make things slightly more difficult it's an old OR w/ riveted cable stops. The head tube says it can't be too big and the rivets say there can't be suspension correctness..
We need Hollister. I bet it's a 20in w/ 22.8 or something top tube. (i never miss an opportunity to be called a ********ter... it's like gambling. an addiction).


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

What's with the cable stays? Recent powder coating? I went with the square paneled decals too for my 91/92 Bonty, what's the serial #? I know they're not necessarily informative for dating....nice looking frame


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## mauricer (Apr 15, 2011)

It is a 20". SN


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

mauricer said:


> It is a 20". SN


top tube?


----------



## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

caemis said:


> Hi,
> I just got my hands on this one:
> 
> 
> ...


Hi, is there any indication of the frame number to build year? - I found a race lite on flickr what supposed to be a 1994 frame and it looks very similar to mine. Thanks!


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

caemis said:


> Hi, is there any indication of the frame number to build year? - I found a race lite on flickr what supposed to be a 1994 frame and it looks very similar to mine. Thanks!


Yours is a small. It does not have the roller for the front derr. so it's not early 90s. Wrapped seatstays says it's santa cruz made. cable stop positin on the seat tube would tell year.


----------



## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

colker1 said:


> Yours is a small. It does not have the roller for the front derr. so it's not early 90s. Wrapped seatstays says it's santa cruz made. cable stop positin on the seat tube would tell year.


Thanks! Here some pics of the cable stops:




And some more pics of the rear end:
Album Bontrager Race Lite - MTB-News.de

Cheers,
Marco


----------



## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

I managed to pick up this Marzocchi bomber Mx coil in great condition with a long 1" steerer. Pretty excited about getting a more Tahoe freindly front end on this bike. 

I plan on dropping the fork down to 65mm from 80mm as I assume that is more inline with what this bike was designed for. Please correct me if I am wrong.


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

singletrackmack said:


> I managed to pick up this Marzocchi bomber Mx coil in great condition with a long 1" steerer. Pretty excited about getting a more Tahoe freindly front end on this bike.
> 
> I plan on dropping the fork down to 65mm from 80mm as I assume that is more inline with what this bike was designed for. Please correct me if I am wrong.
> 
> View attachment 1085012


Definitely drop it down if you can. I had one on my privateer and I'm pretty sure it's a good 15 - 20mm taller than an 80mm SID which I have now. I did not like the way it changed the feel at all.


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## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

singletrackmack said:


> I managed to pick up this Marzocchi bomber Mx coil in great condition with a long 1" steerer. Pretty excited about getting a more Tahoe freindly front end on this bike.
> 
> I plan on dropping the fork down to 65mm from 80mm as I assume that is more inline with what this bike was designed for. Please correct me if I am wrong.
> 
> View attachment 1085012


Keep it at 80mm if you like to ride fast. Bontragers are too steep and sketchy compared to modern bikes. A longer fork will slacken the head tube angle and improve the ride. I'm the original owner of a '92 Race Lite and did really love the bike with the original Mag 21 (46mm), but that was relative to my previous rigid bike. I loved it more with a Mag 21 long travel kit (60mm), but the 80mm Marzocchi BAM Z2 I finally installed allowed me to ride faster without feeling out of control, yet still capable of tight handling at low speeds.

Then again, if you're just tooling around at low speeds, the shorter travel may be preferable, although I can't say I ever missed it, regardless of how slow I rode.


----------



## davee5 (Jul 16, 2016)

Hey crew, long time lurker.

I have a 1997 Ti Race Lite that I recently re-tooled for the wifey. I bought it for myself despite it being too small for me because I just had to have it (turns out an 18" frame with tight geometry is a touch petite for me at 6'3"...). Eventually I got older and started to ride harder and the hardtail started to feel harsh, and the cockpit increasingly small, so it only got sporadic use. Eventually I managed to wrangle a Marzocchi Z3 BAM with a 1" steerer that slackened it up a touch so my non-riding wife could enjoy it (still twitchy for the amateur, though). Plush and more stable, big win. Anyhow, I digress...

I now have a leftover Manitou fork that has languished for a few years in a Marzocchi box. It's a touch soft for my 195lbs, but the stanchions are smooth and ding-free and it ran fine when it was put away.

Anybody need a fork?

Any reasonable offers entertained (it's just eating shelf space, so reasonable is a fairly low bar to clear...)

2000 Manitou SX-R
1" steerer with 7.6" of steer tube
Black, worn in but not abused
crown race pulled, ready for a new headset.

Happy riding, and though it's just the lady's sometime use bike, the Ti Bonty is definitely not destined for the auction block anytime soon...


----------



## hud56 (Nov 9, 2008)

*Buck's Bontrager*

After some cajoling from a Board member, I am posting some pics of an oldie but goody.
Details include 126mm rear spacing w/road cable braze on's,original owner had it built w/a nod towards back country trekking so it has 3 water bottle mts.,portage strap (being re-furbished),bosses everywhere for racks,and internal top cable to sling it over the shoulder.
It has spent the better part of 30 Years in it's home town w/it's prior two owners and the last couple in the high desert of Central Oregon w/me.


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## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Beautiful


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## hud56 (Nov 9, 2008)

*'96 Privateer*

Purchased as a frame 'n fork (Quadra 21R) and built up as a tribute to an old buddy who was a Marine combat vet from Viet Nam era.
He never got to see it, but the memory of his toughness helps me huff it up the steep's. Rides really well to this day....


----------



## chefmiguel (Dec 22, 2007)

Great tribute to your friend


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

chefmiguel said:


> Beautiful


Amen


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## hud56 (Nov 9, 2008)

He was known as "The World's Smallest Marine" in our group of 9. Got shot in the butt by friendly fire and sent home only to contract Hep B from dirty needles through more than a few transfusions. Became a Metal Sculptor and always found my bicycles fascinating. Thank's to Hollister and Yerself for kind feedback, I will preserve the patina on the older bike...


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## aspreti (Apr 20, 2013)

Tyrol, Austria last year


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

That's a beauty of a custom order, rough and rugged. Hollister would like that I bet


----------



## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi all,

Found this thread trying to dig up details on an OR I picked up recently. Brace yourselves for possibly the sorriest looking OR on the thread! Not as sorry as it was when I got it though, horribly neglected for years, chucked away then rescued from a skip by a chap on STW who passed it on to me to get it running again. Stuff growing on it. Non working bits binned/shelved and swapped for working bits: parts bin, s/h or cheap for now.










link to large pic

__
https://flic.kr/p/28936283253










I read that the frame numbers were a bit random for some years, but looking at the pic in the posts above (mauricer's whopping 20 incher), it seems these BB shell no's are a bit more useful. So this is a 16in frame from 1991? and what, the 22nd made in July of 1991?

Shabby and anonymous works for now, as it's a commuter that gets locked up now and then, but I'd like to do a proper job on it at some point, and get the right year decals for it.

Cheers!


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Ned,

Sure she might be a bit rough around the corners, but a diamond in the rough, Bonty's are bomb proof IMHO, looks like a few coats of paint on it, guessing that red is original? That's an odd color from what I recall of early'ish Bontys. I also like that fork, are the drop outs Ritchey? Maybe a close up pic of the front end? In either case I dig her, good find. Cheers


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Oh BTW, Gil at retro decals makes nice replacement decals, his contact is somewhere in this thread.


----------



## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

It was Gil's post on fb earlier with the Bonty decals that reminded me I was going to do some digging!

Fork is a threadless Kona P2 I found on classifieds - the threaded Manitou 2s that were on the bike when I got it were seized solid!

I've found one pic online, allegedly of a 1991 OR, in red. The straight, rather than diagonal edged decals are right for the year, aren't they?


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Love the accidental stealth look, but classy looking bike even with the fenders and rack. I almost grabbed a local privateer with the same rigid fork a few weeks ago. I rarely see any bonty's with a rigid bonty fork.


----------



## Flash (Jan 30, 2004)

Plan on selling this canvas Bontrager poster. Any idea what it's worth?









Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Yeah, I believe the straight edged decals are correct, at least that's what I have on my 91 OR, but others know better than I. Enjoy it


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Yes, the straight edge decals lasted until '94 or so. Also, in the pic of the red bike, the decal includes the older style head tube decal as well. If your frame has this decal it definitely should have the square edge decals - later decals did not have the chain ring on the outer edge.



nedrapier said:


> I've found one pic online, allegedly of a 1991 OR, in red. The straight, rather than diagonal edged decals are right for the year, aren't they?


----------



## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

I purchased this 94 Race Lite about a 3-4 weeks ago and finally got a chance to get it out for a 24 mile ride. This is my 7th Bontrager purchased over the years and my second race lite. These bikes just feel right to me and always bring a smile to my face.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

I picked up a '95 B29 BMX frame a few weeks ago and was going to build it up for a fun bike to cruise around on.

So, everything I've read about this frame says it has a 1 1/8" headtube, and only the warthog had a 1" headtube. After measuring it, it looks just a hair above 30mm. Does anyone know if the first year B29's came in 1" or possibly there were some prototypes or a mid-production change from a 1" version the first year.

It's in super nice condition for its age, I'm just a bit confused on why this frame would have a 1" headtube when the listed specs and every build and sale thread I've seen shows them with a 1 1/8" headtube.

It's not a huge deal either way, as I'm just planning on building it up and riding it, but definitely interested if anyone knows for sure on this frame.


----------



## Ranew (Sep 17, 2016)

I just became a first time Bontrager owner. I'm going to do my best to rebuild my '94 RACE with OE. The search is on. I have a couple questions. What does the number located on the left chainstay/dropout indicate? Mine is: 1888. If I decide to have it repainted, this one is red (but I also like the blue and purple ones), what paint shops do you think would do the best job matching the color? Does anyone know the original RAL color numbers?


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## Ranew (Sep 17, 2016)

Any links to rigid or suspension forks for Bontragers , national or international are welcome. I'd love to locate a rigid Bontrager one.


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Ranew said:


> What does the number located on the left chainstay/dropout indicate? Mine is: 1888.


The dropouts had unique numbers stamped on them and then the dropouts were placed in a big box. The builder grabbed a pair and built a frame. So the number is unique and vaguely a serial number, but has no meaning (i.e. is not sequential).


----------



## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Built this privateer up for my brother this past winter. Came out somewhere around 21 lbs. Crossmark 2.1 on the rear and 2.25 on the front with 517 rims and CK hubs. Absolutely rips on singletrack. Probably would have gone 1x11 if I were to do it again, but got some fire sale prices on the XT 9sp drivetrain from ebay. It's not a race or racelite, but you just can't reproduce the feel of these bikes with anything I've ridden from the past 10 years.

Got it on ebay looking like this at well over 30 lbs. Jet suspension up front and a seat and post that weighed over 2 lbs on their own. Just a completely travesty to ride this thing the way it was setup, felt as bad as a $100 walmart bike except it did shift well...










The '99 privateer's are by far my favorite for privateers because they are the only ones with a 1 1/8 headtube. I've got 3 other Bontrager's with 1" headtube's and the difficulty in finding decent suspension forks is ridiculous. This is the one thing I wish Bontragers would have deviated from early on since many other era manufacturers saw that 1 1/8 was quickly going to become the standard.


----------



## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

Nice build! Amazing how light of a build you can get with these frames.



jestep said:


> The '99 privateer's are by far my favorite for privateers because they are the only ones with a 1 1/8 headtube. I've got 3 other Bontrager's with 1" headtube's and the difficulty in finding decent suspension forks is ridiculous. This is the one thing I wish Bontragers would have deviated from early on since many other era manufacturers saw that 1 1/8 was quickly going to become the standard.


Maybe this has been asked before here, but why is it that Bontrager never really converted to the 1 1/8 head tube?


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

singletrackmack said:


> Maybe this has been asked before here, but why is it that Bontrager never really converted to the 1 1/8 head tube?


To get the complete answer you'd need to ask Keith. However, a steel head tube and steerer are plenty strong for XC use (which is what Bontrager bikes were built for).

Over-sized headsets were introduced to make for weakness in other materials - specifically aluminum. Aluminum is about 1/3 the strength of steel (also about 1/3 the weight). For a tube made of any material you can strength it by either increasing the wall thickness of the tube, or increasing it's diameter. Increasing the wall thickness provides a linear increase in strength (i.e. doubling the thickness, doubles the strength); however, increasing the tube's diameter exponentially increases it's strength - so a 1-1/8" tube is much stronger than a 1" tube. For aluminum frames a 1" head tube will not last long (unless the tube is really thick), same thing for fork steerer tubes.

Given a frame that is being designed around a fork with 0-80mm of travel, a steel 1" head tube is plenty strong. Going to 1-1/8" does not improve the design but it does add weight. So the "best" design is a 1" head tube.

At the time that these frames were being made, suspension forks all (or most) had steel steerer tubes. Again, the 1" steerer was lighter than 1-1/8" and plenty strong for the amount of travel at the time. Once aluminum steerers appeared, it made sense to make them in 1-1/8" sizes which does reduce weight. As as side note, I have a 2000 SID with a 1" aluminum steerer and the steerer is incredible thick in order to meet the strength requirements - I talked to a tech at Rock Shox about it and he said that the tube was actually heavier than a steel steerer, but no one would have bought the fork with a steel steerer, so they speced the heavier part.

So at the time, for steel bikes using a 1" steerer made sense. It was lighter and strong enough for the intended application. It's only now, after the fact, when all forks went to 1-1/8" in order to use aluminum steerers that the decision seems poor.


----------



## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

^thanks for the explanation. Seems to make sense. I always figured it was to make the frame lighter.


----------



## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

I had a rs mag 21 w/ the long travel kit and i have the impression it worked better than the Judy and marz. Bomber. Yes, it was flexy but the motion and damping were really good. The mag 21 fits well under a Bontrager hardtail.


----------



## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

singletrackmack said:


> Maybe this has been asked before here, but why is it that Bontrager never really converted to the 1 1/8 head tube?


In addition to what @Laffeau explained above, I've heard another justification for the 1" head tube. I'm pretty sure this came directly from Keith Bontrager. If not, then it came from Tom Ritchey, who clung to skinny steel tube sets and 1" head tubes even longer:

The argument was that the connection between the head tube and the top & down tubes becomes stronger, the closer the tubes are to being the same diameter. If they are the same size, the cope would theoretically extend half way around the headtube. So it's more supportive. And the length of the welded seam is longer and therefore stronger. Conversely, when a small diameter tube is joined to a larger diameter tube, it's more like a butted joint, which is weaker.


----------



## Ranew (Sep 17, 2016)

Is this style of dropout unique to Bontrager?


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## Ranew (Sep 17, 2016)

I bought a '94 RACE and it comes with a pully attached to the downtube close to where a derailleur goes. Can anyone explain how this integrates with the derailleur? I bought a top-pull Shimano M565 derailleur. If this pully breaks where would I locate a replacement?


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Ranew said:


> I bought a '94 RACE and it comes with a pully attached to the downtube close to where a derailleur goes. Can anyone explain how this integrates with the derailleur? I bought a top-pull Shimano M565 derailleur. If this pully breaks where would I locate a replacement?


Really the only time I've seen them was when someone was using a bottom pull front derailleur before the front ones came with the dual pull option. I'm assuming this is what it's for and shouldn't be needed for a top pull derailleur.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Ranew said:


> Is this style of dropout unique to Bontrager?


Yes, the dropouts on Bontragers are unique. No other frame builder uses them.

And as far as the pulley goes...

It is used for routing the cable if you use a bottom pull deraileur. When the pulley was omitted from the frames the cable stop was moved to a better location to accommodate top pull deraileurs. If your cable is running at an odd angle, switch to a bottom pull.

If you need a new pulley you should be able to order a new one pretty easily. Some CX bikes still come with these. I bought a new frame this spring that uses one.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> In addition to what @Laffeau explained above, I've heard another justification for the 1" head tube. I'm pretty sure this came directly from Keith Bontrager. If not, then it came from Tom Ritchey, who clung to skinny steel tube sets and 1" head tubes even longer:
> 
> The argument was that the connection between the head tube and the top & down tubes becomes stronger, the closer the tubes are to being the same diameter. If they are the same size, the cope would theoretically extend half way around the headtube. So it's more supportive. And the length of the welded seam is longer and therefore stronger. Conversely, when a small diameter tube is joined to a larger diameter tube, it's more like a butted joint, which is weaker.


Bicycles moved towards fat oversized tubes and everybody liked it. Even road bikes: one of the all time great steel tubesets is EL OS. NOt only that but 1 1/8 steel steerers are lighter than 1in. You can't argue w/ lightweight and good road feedback but i am sure KB and TR know way more about bikebuilding than me.


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## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

Similar discussion happening now, as a couple of frame builders are sticking with straight 1 1/8 rather than tapered or 44mm.

Here's Sam of Singular explaining why the Swift is still 1 1/8:

Thoughts on tapered steerers - Singular Cycles


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

nedrapier said:


> Similar discussion happening now, as a couple of frame builders are sticking with straight 1 1/8 rather than tapered or 44mm.
> 
> Here's Sam of Singular explaining why the Swift is still 1 1/8:
> 
> Thoughts on tapered steerers - Singular Cycles


Then you build bikes so stiff that can only be comfortable w/ fat tires; 28mm minimum on the tarmac and 3.0 on trails. well.. a mtn bike can ride perfectly fine w/a 2.1 tire.


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## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

So, not sure what year mine is. It's an OR Race Lite, has telescoping seat stays, chain suck guard, FD pulley, came with straight edge top and bottom tube decals, no seat tube decal, and the older head tube decal with chain ring, etc... Serial number is 0231. I think it's a '94 but not sure. Bought the frame new in the Spring of '95, but it had been at the shop for a while.

Is there any serial to year mapping anywhere on the interwebs?


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

laffeaux said:


> The dropouts had unique numbers stamped on them and then the dropouts were placed in a big box. The builder grabbed a pair and built a frame. So the number is unique and vaguely a serial number, but has no meaning (i.e. is not sequential).


Hey Eric, thanks as always for the Bontrager knowledge, I picked one up that actually fits me over the weekend for a very fair price. She's that gorgeous (IMO) blue/purple, in very good shape and is a large (SN#489, not that it matters per se). The dropouts are partially horizontal (see bad pic), my other Bonty are vertical, any idea of the difference in age or reason?









I'm going to go out on a limb and put my RM-2s and bar cons to use and pick up a salsa drop bar, I've seen some built up like this. All I need now is a nice/decent pair of composite forks (black or chromed, preferably threadless), do you happen to have a pair about, or know someone who does?

Enjoy the cooler fall riding weather in ID, I'll be in MT for thanksgiving, but w/o a proper bike, but will get a day of riding in if the weather cooperates.

Cheer and take care,


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Hi Benjamin,
as far as I understand, those dropouts were used until (or just in) 1991...
The website which contains some information seems to be down for a while.
Cheers,
Marco


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

colker1 said:


> Then you build bikes so stiff that can only be comfortable w/ fat tires; 28mm minimum on the tarmac and 3.0 on trails. well.. a mtn bike can ride perfectly fine w/a 2.1 tire.


"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to colker1 again"

The obsession (or possibly marketing angle) to make non-DH frames as stiff as possible is starting to get out of hand. What ever happened to making a frame "comfortable" to ride? Most people who buy a mtb will never ride anything close to a trail that necessitates the extreme frame stiffness (or suspension) on modern bikes. Then, to alleviate the pain they get from harsh vibrations that the frame is transmitting directly to their hands, they have to get carbon bars and sh!t like this suspension grip contraption. Something has seriously gone wrong when you end up needing a grip this complicated. (Reminds me of those dreaded Proflex stems for some reason)


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Mr. Claus said:


> Hey Eric, thanks as always for the Bontrager knowledge, I picked one up that actually fits me over the weekend for a very fair price. She's that gorgeous (IMO) blue/purple, in very good shape and is a large (SN#489, not that it matters per se). The dropouts are partially horizontal (see bad pic), my other Bonty are vertical, any idea of the difference in age or reason?
> 
> View attachment 1096340
> 
> ...


The horizontal style is older. I'm not sure if they were optional or standard. In the early '90s both horizontal and vertical dropout were used.

I don't know of any forks for sale but they show up on eBay pretty often.

Hard to believe fall is here already. It will be far bike season before you know it!


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## namkrad (Jul 22, 2009)

"The '99 privateer's are by far my favorite for privateers because they are the only ones with a 1 1/8 headtube."
The ´98 had 1 1/8" head tubes as well. I have one 
I do like it´s ride a bit better than my RL, though the difference is small.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

jestep said:


> Built this privateer up for my brother this past winter. Came out somewhere around 21 lbs.....


Man that's light! Mind dropping the components list on that?

I have a 96 or 97 RL, and can't get it much below 25lb (not that I've tried terribly hard, but 4 lbs difference is a lot!). I had it at 24.5lb with tubeless, 517/317, ck hub front and bhs rear, xt/stx 1x10 components, and avid ti lite v's. Thinking maybe the z2bam is a bit heavy, but with the 1" headset not sure what a reasonable lighter alternative is.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Man that's light! Mind dropping the components list on that?
> 
> I have a 96 or 97 RL, and can't get it much below 25lb (not that I've tried terribly hard, but 4 lbs difference is a lot!). I had it at 24.5lb with tubeless, 517/317, ck hub front and bhs rear, xt/stx 1x10 components, and avid ti lite v's. Thinking maybe the z2bam is a bit heavy, but with the 1" headset not sure what a reasonable lighter alternative is.


Have you upgraded the bars, post, stem, etc. These can definitely account for a pound of weight for steel or heavier aluminum ones.

I may have weighed it without the pedals but it's really light.

Here was my build estimate for it, a few things like the wheels and cables were rounded up.

ComponentDescriptionQtyWeight Each (g)Total (g)Total (lbs)Frame1999 Bontrager Privateer Comp1205020504.52Fork1999 Rockshox SID (1 1/8")1133013302.93HeadsetRitchey11101100.24Front WheelMavic 517 CK17007001.54Rear WheelMavic 517 CK18008001.76TubesMaxxiss Ultralight21252500.55Front TireMaxxis Crossmark 2116006001.32Rear TireMaxxis Crossmark 1.914804801.06StemRace Face Deus XC*11361360.30HandlebarEaston Monkeylite XC Low Rise11801800.40SeatpostTitec 27 x 35012102100.46SeatWTB Volt Team12002000.44Brake LeaversAvid FR52751500.33GripsLizard Skins Lock Ons2601200.26Front BrakeAvid SD Ti11301300.29Rear BrakeAvid SD Ti11301300.29CranksetXT M76017657651.69Bottom BracketXT M76011051050.23Cassette9Sp M76012752750.61ChainPC971*12982980.66ShiftersXT M77012502500.55Rear DerailleurXT M77212252250.50Front DerailleurXTR M95011091090.24CablesXTR13003000.66PedalsA53013803800.8410022.5010282.5022.67

Guessing the SID is probably about a pound lighter than the z2 bam. The 98 would be the best for your bike but they're difficult to find in 1". The 99 and later with the disc tabs are about 20mm higher than 98, so this is definitely the one I'd be looking for if you do try to find one. If it doesn't have any disc tabs it's 98.

Here's my privateer that I bought when I was in 9th grade in '96. Took me about 2 years to find a 1" SID for it, but that was in about 2003 when there was still enough demand for them that nobody was getting rid of them. The stock Indy went to complete crap and I had a 80mm Marz MX Comp on it, but that fork made the front way too high and messed up the steering.

It's right at 22 with the pedals. Has a lighter drivetrain but a bit heavier wheels and tires than the other one.










Here's the build estimate for mine as well:


ComponentDescriptionQtyWeight Each (g)Total (g)Total (lbs)Frame1997 Bontrager Privateer S1205020504.52Fork1998 Rockshox SID1115011502.54HeadsetCane Creek S2 1"11101100.24Front WheelVelocity Synergy, Sapim Xray Spokes, XTR 960 hub17357351.62Rear WheelMavic 517 Rim, Dt Swiss Spokes, DT 240 hub18408401.85TubesMaxxiss Ultralight21252500.55Front TireMaxxis Crossmark 2.115705701.26Rear TireMaxxis Crossmark 2.115705701.26StemSette Edge (110mm)11401400.31HandlebarEaston CT2 Monkeylite Riser (610mm)11601600.35SeatpostThompson Elite 27 x 33012202200.49SeatWTB Silverado Carbon11851850.41Brake LeaversAvid SD Ti21853700.82GripsLizard Skin Locks Ons2601200.26Front BrakeAvid SD Mag11201200.26Rear BrakeAvid SD Mag11201200.26CranksetRacefact Next16006001.32Bottom BracketRaceface11051050.23CassetteXT M785 11-3613403400.75ChainSRAM 109112552550.56ShiftersXT M78512552550.56Rear DerailleurXT M78612352350.52Front DerailleurXT M78511551550.34CablesAvid Flak Jackets13003000.66PedalsRitchie V3 Comp13903900.86Total10345.0022.81


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Sweet thanks for the list!

Yeah I have carbon bars (niner flat top) with an easton ea 90 stem that dropped quite a bit of weight.

I'll make my own list and compare and see where the discrepancy is.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Thanks alot for the list there. That was helpful. I built my own, and quantified differences between mine and the average of your two sheets. My list values were derived by combo of weighing and pulling info from internet. Most of the big differences (> 0.2lbs) were due to the parts below.

Z2bam fork, rear wtb velociraptor tire, seat, BB, wheels, and potentially brake levers.

Amazing how it all adds up.

Not sure where the difference in wheel weight is, since my hubs seem comparable. Spokes I guess? I did add my skewer weight into that though and am not sure if you did or not.

Anyways, this has been enlightening thanks. Gives me good info on how/where to lighten up the next time I have money to buy parts.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Not sure where the difference in wheel weight is, since my hubs seem comparable. Spokes I guess? I did add my skewer weight into that though and am not sure if you did or not.
> 
> Anyways, this has been enlightening thanks. Gives me good info on how/where to lighten up the next time I have money to buy parts.


I believe the skewers were included on the spreadsheet in the wheel weights but not 100% sure, they are definitely on the bikes for actual weight though. We switched the first one to allen head ti QR's, just to prevent someone from easily stealing the wheels. They're something stupid light like 35g for the pair.

I think the CK wheels were using DT revolutions. I think I had the tires on them before I thought to weigh them individually. They were right at 1500g but I can't remember the individual weights of each, so just put that as a reference.

The older one is using some pricepoint sette ti QR's, probably around 80g for the pair. The sette stuff was some of the best value for the money of any white label / generic components I've found.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Wow, 21 pounds is really light. I weighed mine to compare. My single speed is right at 21 pound with a SID, and the geared bike is 24 pounds (both weights without pedals - since neither had pedals installed).


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Is the SID as easy to rebuild as the Z2? The ability to easily rebuild that thing and have it feel nice is pretty awesome.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Figured I should show a pic of the bontrager since this is a bontrager thread and not a "get your bike light" thread!


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## jeff (Jan 13, 2004)

At the moment it's a "Get your Bontager light" thread.


alex-henson said:


> Figured I should show a pic of the bontrager since this is a bontrager thread and not a "get your bike light" thread!
> View attachment 1097301


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

laffeaux said:


> Wow, 21 pounds is really light. I weighed mine to compare. My single speed is right at 21 pound with a SID, and the geared bike is 24 pounds (both weights without pedals - since neither had pedals installed).


Eric,

Love that brownish SS, don't think I've seen pics of it on this thread, but this a many paged thread. Is that the legendary brazed one that Hollister seems to lust after? Cheers


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

My '93 XXL Race weighs 23.8lbs (as seen in this pic without pedals). Lightest bike own :thumbsup:


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Mr. Claus said:


> Eric,
> 
> Love that brownish SS, don't think I've seen pics of it on this thread, but this a many paged thread. Is that the legendary brazed one that Hollister seems to lust after? Cheers


It's a TIGed frame, but a factor single speed. There were only a handful made (in the 10-20 range). Other than the lack of brazeons and rear dropouts, it's a standard Race frame. Hollister used to lust after it but then he found one of his own.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

*What do we have here???*

Ok, just throwing this out there, but mainly wondering what's going on with this little grape of a bike. This is purportedly an early Bontrager, not really convinced, but it's a kinda interesting bike, not a particularly nice build, but pretty brazed (salsa?) stem, nice Campy horizontal drop outs and what appears to be nice brazed frame. Any thoughts you Bonty aficionado's? Eric L, Hollister, Colker?



























Cheers and thanks for previous DB advice! 
Benjamin


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Looks like something from the mid to late 80's although I can't remember seeing one of the older ones with the seat stays having this low of an angle or that short of a headtube. Dropout looks early Bontrager.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

brazed bontrager stem.

the cool rear brake routing(odd on that side)

what does the bb shell look like?

and uh... where is that bike?


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

hollister said:


> brazed bontrager stem.
> 
> the cool rear brake routing(odd on that side)
> 
> ...


Hmm, I thought this might perk your interest, it's an oddity, but maybe interesting enough to maybe make you reach for your wallet. If it is what it is, the price is about right. You can't see the BB shell all that well, but my eyes are not as discerning as you pros. As for where this is, not much guessing needed, somewhere on the Bay, it won't take much searching on flea to find it. The stem is a lil purple gem.

Does this find/post get me a decent deal on a Bonty composite fork (1" threaded, prefer threadless)? or a nice dirt drop bar (120mm length, ~170mm rise)?? please?? Let me know if in your opinion you think it's legit. Dig it, Ben


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

Outings are still not kosher here, fwiw.


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## bikerNik (Oct 23, 2012)

*Bontrager Mustang 29 Tubeless Ready Mountain Bike Wheels Causing Inner Tube Punctures*

If you are getting too many inner tube punctures and you are riding on a Bontrager Mustang 29 Tubeless Ready wheels you may want to read this - posting on my blog from my experience with that.....


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## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

Jeepnut22 said:


> So, not sure what year mine is. It's an OR Race Lite, has telescoping seat stays, chain suck guard, FD pulley, came with straight edge top and bottom tube decals, no seat tube decal, and the older head tube decal with chain ring, etc... Serial number is 0231. I think it's a '94 but not sure. Bought the frame new in the Spring of '95, but it had been at the shop for a while.
> 
> Is there any serial to year mapping anywhere on the interwebs?


Bueller?


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Eric L (laffaux) has a good post concerning serial numbers, but short answer is they don't mean much, 93-94 is a good bet, unless it has semi horizinal drop outs (see my post recently), they're closer to 91-92, but the #'s are a great joyous joke. Now get a Bonty comp fork and PM me, I'm having a fit getting one, go fig they're all in "museums". Bummer as I ride, cheers


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Jeepnut22 said:


> Bueller?


Yeah, the serial number mean nothing. A large batch of dropouts were made, stamped with numbers, and then the dropouts were thrown into a box. Builders reached into the box and grabbed dropouts randomly.

The exception to that is bikes in the really early '90s. The tend to have serial numbers on the BBs which includes the year of manufacture. The Race and Race Lite from however do not (see above).

'94(ish) is a good guess. There aren't model years. Things changed as needed, and the changes were pretty minimal" drop out shape, FD roller, FD cable stop location, decals, seat stays,... maybe that's it. Post pics and maybe there will be something to narrow it down, but '94 +/- a year is pretty good.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Just got these nice Bontrager comp forks from Bernie Mikkelson who extended the steer tube and made threadless. Many thanks to Lee for hooking me up with these, with a bit of very fine brillo they buffed quite well. These will go on my eggplant 91' Bonty dirt drop project...or a Jelly bean Salsa that may be making it's way back to Cali, but that's another story. I really love these forks and they seem to be getting a tad harder to come by at the reasonable price.

Hey if anyone has a fork blade cap I'd love it, or I'll "engineer" something suitable. Cheers all and enjoy the trails this weekend!


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Mr. Claus said:


> Hey if anyone has a fork blade cap I'd love it, or I'll "engineer" something suitable. Cheers all and enjoy the trails this weekend!


Head down to the Hardware store and look for the appropriate size Panel Plug. That's what Bontrager used.

-jw


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Mr. Claus said:


> Just got these nice Bontrager comp forks from Bernie Mikkelson who extended the steer tube and made threadless. Many thanks to Lee for hooking me up with these, with a bit of very fine brillo they buffed quite well. These will go on my eggplant 91' Bonty dirt drop project...or a Jelly bean Salsa that may be making it's way back to Cali, but that's another story. I really love these forks and they seem to be getting a tad harder to come by at the reasonable price.
> 
> Hey if anyone has a fork blade cap I'd love it, or I'll "engineer" something suitable. Cheers all and enjoy the trails this weekend!
> 
> View attachment 1101236


Good to know BMikkelsen is up and running.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

G1, thanks for the tip, I'll do just that. 

Colker, yeah he's still pretty lively and his wife is helping in the shop, he has some trouble speaking, but if you listen carefully he still has some great stories and still has a great passion for frame building and repairs. He was working on repairing a beautiful early to mid 80's Colnago....cheers


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## Jeepnut22 (Jul 16, 2008)

laffeaux said:


> Yeah, the serial number mean nothing. A large batch of dropouts were made, stamped with numbers, and then the dropouts were thrown into a box. Builders reached into the box and grabbed dropouts randomly.
> 
> The exception to that is bikes in the really early '90s. The tend to have serial numbers on the BBs which includes the year of manufacture. The Race and Race Lite from however do not (see above).
> 
> '94(ish) is a good guess. There aren't model years. Things changed as needed, and the changes were pretty minimal" drop out shape, FD roller, FD cable stop location, decals, seat stays,... maybe that's it. Post pics and maybe there will be something to narrow it down, but '94 +/- a year is pretty good.


Here is the thread where I rebuilt it into a single speed. A resto-mod so to speak. Changed the bars and turned it into a 1x10 since I did the built up here:
http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/my-92-race-lite-buildup-578524.html

I thought it was a '92, but was corrected way back. Also, one other thing. The 0231 serial number was on the official Bontrager owner's manual/paperwork I got with the frame. I should take a picture of that at some point...


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

>takes victory lap<


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

hollister said:


> >takes victory lap<


Nice side-by-side pic, that's great for comparison.

Is that a threadless steerer on the taller fork? It looks like the crown is the same as the Bontrager crowns for the RS Mag 10/20/21. Does anyone know the diameter of the steer tube at the crown pinch bolts for the rigid forks?

I have a '92 Race rigid fork just like the one on the right (395mm), and I'm thinking of swapping out the crown for one I have from a Mag to get a little extra height (to better fit a suspension-corrected '95 frame). I was thinking of also installing either a threadless steel steerer or a titanium threaded steerer from an old Marzocchi fork crown if it's the same diameter (that steer tube needs a shim to fit in Marzocchi crowns, but it might fit without the shim).


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

I think a little research has answered most of my questions.

Hollister's beautiful tall fork is a 29" model, with a threadless steerer installed (I think that's right). That model had the arched brace, which adds a little room for tire clearance and raises the axle-to-crown slightly.

I pulled out my RockShox Mag, and the crown brace is quite different, it has the pinch bolts on the outside, not between the stanchions and the steertube. It's black, but has smooth rounded edges and no logo/markings.

I also pulled out my Bontrager rigid fork, and realized I could put a caliper on the underside of the brace to measure the steer tube diameter. It appears to be 27.2mm, which would be great, because that is the exact size of Marzocchi steerer without a shim, as well as RST threaded/threadless steerers that are available online new for $20 each.

I can see that the original steerer has a retaining ring which sits in a groove at the bottom of the steerer tube. I could cut a similar groove, and/or remove some material from the bottom of the steerer tube if necessary. It appears the crown race seat is long enough to peek above the collar. Has anyone attempted such a conversion with the RST steerers?

With the earlier discussion about custom built replacement steerer tubes for these forks, I have to ask, is there anything unusual about the shape of the steer tube? I can't seem to tell without prying the current steerer out, which I will do next.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Someone else needs to answer questions regarding Hollister's crown, but I thought I should mention something quickly in the meantime, before you make a mistake:

You don't need to "pry" the steerer out of your fork! Prying the crown open could damage it. Just loosen the clamp bolts at the crown, and tap the steerer down from the top. Protect the threads, obviously. The crown race and the shim that it is seated on will come loose as the steerer tube drops, and slide off the top. (if they are even that tight to begin with) SAVE THE SHIM! There is nothing special about the steerer tube itself - it's just straight 1" steerer the entire length. Unlike many forks, the crown race seat is not created by a bulge in the tube - it is created by the above mentioned and difficult-to-find shim.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

It's a bontrager suspension crown(mag 20 I believe)

When I bought it it had a different crown with the same dimensions, that I swapped for the one above

Yes, that's a thread less steer in the first pic


AC 418 without a CRA


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

OT, but that's a nice little stash of odds and ends, bits of marinovative brakes and is that a RM-2? If so, does it have a home?


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

banjor said:


> Nice side-by-side pic, that's great for comparison.
> 
> Is that a threadless steerer on the taller fork? It looks like the crown is the same as the Bontrager crowns for the RS Mag 10/20/21. Does anyone know the diameter of the steer tube at the crown pinch bolts for the rigid forks?
> 
> I have a '92 Race rigid fork just like the one on the right (395mm), and I'm thinking of swapping out the crown for one I have from a Mag to get a little extra height (to better fit a suspension-corrected '95 frame). I was thinking of also installing either a threadless steel steerer or a titanium threaded steerer from an old Marzocchi fork crown if it's the same diameter (that steer tube needs a shim to fit in Marzocchi crowns, but it might fit without the shim).


why would you want to butcher that Bontrager fork? If you must use it on your build and need to acomodate a different axle to crown height, keep the crown and get some new legs. What´s the point in getting rid of the cool bonty crown and swapping for a mass produced RS? Why swap the steerer for an RST or titanium? Weight savings? You will race xc on that bike?


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

colker1 said:


> why would you want to butcher that Bontrager fork? If you must use it on your build and need to acomodate a different axle to crown height, keep the crown and get some new legs. What´s the point in getting rid of the cool bonty crown and swapping for a mass produced RS? Why swap the steerer for an RST or titanium? Weight savings? You will race xc on that bike?


Great question. The reason for considering a threadless steerer was to make it easy to swap between 2 vintage steel rigid, 2 modern carbon rigid, and 5 suspension forks on my 4 Bontrager frames. I don't tend to do trail riding in the winter months, so I'd like to switch to rigid for road training. I'm building up one frame as a 27.5, but I'll use an Exotic carbon fork with the 425 AC for that, rather that trying to stuff it into the Bontrager fork with the ugly Mag crown. I'd be better off installing the titanium steerer to save weight off of a suspension fork. I'm just going to install the Bontrager fork and enjoy it.

I think I'm probably not going to swap all that often, so if I install either Cane Creek or Chris King headsets all around I can swap the top nut between threaded and threadless without touching the cups. One frame is a 1 1/8 inch Privateer, but I ordered some headtube reducers to let me replace the headset with a 1" for ease of sharing forks. Any opinions on that before I install them? If it's a bad idea I'll find another solution, like assigning one rigid and one suspension fork to each frame, with the appropriate steerer for the headset.

Oh, and if you are wondering why I want to ride 4 different Bontragers? Its because I don't have a fifth yet. ;-) Also, I have a lot of back problems, and find that changing between bikes with different positions (between wide, flat w/bar-end, and drop bars) helps strengthen additional back muscles and reduces my pain.


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## Agamemmnon (Mar 15, 2004)

*My Bontrager OR project bike!*

Thought I had better start posting pics of my latest find before I really start messing around! Been wanting an original non-suspended Bonty since forever, and nearly got one back in the early 90's but ordered a Yeti FRO instead. This is going to be a "patina" restore: not going for a full repaint and am using mostly period-correct parts for the build. The brakes are NOT tho, because I don't have anything else laying around I like better than these old-style newer cantilevers. I am thinking that this frame is from 1990-92? The residue from the old straight edged stickers is still visible, and I am removing the incorrect angled ones. It came with the fork, and I am super-stoked about that! I really need those proper decals, tho... Not sure about wheels yet. I have an old Nuke laying around for the front, and might be able to salvage an old American Classic rear. Have a newer Syncros seatpost and old Tioga T-Bone stem to use, XT older crank and thumbies ('natch!) Might even run toe clips with my XC pro pedals!

First order of business is to get the frame cleaned of rust and proctected. I think that chainsuck gouge is OK. I could use the chainsuck plates too.. they are missing! Thanks for reading about my project and wish me luck!


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

That's a nice find, double bonus for the original fork! I have a couple Bonty's and from what I've seen and learned here I would say closer to 1990 (semi-horizontal drop outs and riveted cable stops), but I'll defer to more smarty people than me. Is that what Bontrager would have called a large? As you probably know retrodecal makes pretty good replacement straight edged decals I have them on a 1992 (https://www.facebook.com/retrodecals/) Enjoy and keep us updated.


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## yardley (Dec 19, 2013)

I think it's 1993 or earlier. Check out my 1994 Race restoration, let me know if you have any other questions.

http://forums.mtbr.com/members/yardley/albums/1994-bontrager-race-restoration/


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## UF415 (Apr 7, 2017)

That's a beauty! Very classy vintage look.

I have the same frame (medium) in British racing green. Recently fixed it up will post pics soon.

Where did you get the Trager decal for your stem?


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

I would also love to get some of those stem stickers as well.


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## Vlad (Feb 7, 2004)

What a beauty. What's the RAL number for that green powdercoat?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I'm not able to view anything on the resto link. Can you tell us more about that fork? Cheers, beautiful bike. 

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## UF415 (Apr 7, 2017)

I am the orignal owner of this 1994 Race I bought for single track. As I now live in the concrete jungle I have converted it to an "Urban Adventure Bike" and am loving it. Paint is original British Racing Green and needs a little touch up.

Some key components are 27 speed Gripshift with XT Rear, WTB cantilever brakes with curved Kool Stop dual compound pads, Brooks Swift Titanium saddle, TiGR mini lock, Moots Ti TailGater bag, Manitou 4 with new elastomers, Lumos helmet with turn signal and accelerometer activated brake light. Swept back post so I can tuck into wind more and stretch out.


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## Aaron47pb (Apr 22, 2017)

I'm trying to ID this and determine whether this is a pre or post-Trek Bontrager:









































































Thoughts?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Aaron47pb said:


> I'm trying to ID this and determine whether this is a pre or post-Trek Bontrager:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It is definitely a Santa Cruz bike. You can tell by the head tube and the shape of the drop outs. There will also be butterfly gussets at the bottom bracket junction with the chainstays and seat tube. These details are only found on Santa Cruz made Bontragers.


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## restlessrider (Nov 29, 2007)

Pics aren't showing for me, but I could tell if I saw it (worked at Trek at that time).
Keep in mind that if it has a one inch headtube, it was made in Santa Cruz. Only the 'Privateer' model had a 1.125" headset and was welded in Waterloo, WI at the Trek factory.
As far as I know, there were no new Race and Racelite frames produced after the merger. And none were made by Trek so I always think it's funny when people refer to pre- or post- Trek Bontragers. However Trek took a couple years to sell through the Bontrager frame inventory after the merger.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

restlessrider said:


> Pics aren't showing for me, but I could tell if I saw it (worked at Trek at that time).
> Keep in mind that if it has a one inch headtube, it was made in Santa Cruz. Only the 'Privateer' model had a 1.125" headset and was welded in Waterloo, WI at the Trek factory.
> As far as I know, there were no new Race and Racelite frames produced after the merger. And none were made by Trek so I always think it's funny when people refer to pre- or post- Trek Bontragers. However Trek took a couple years to sell through the Bontrager frame inventory after the merger.


At least the first two years of production Bontrager Privateers had 1" headtubes. I own several from 1997 and two from 1996 and they all have 1" headtubes. I only have two Bontragers with 1 1/8" headtubes, one a Privateer Comp from probably the last year they were made and another from the year before (98?) which I stripped down to a naked frame but never got around to having powdercoated. It's hanging in the shed.

Both of my Racelites are relatively late model. One has two part seatstays and one had one piece seatstays. The Racelite (probably) we're talking about seemed to have one piece rather than two piece seatstays so it would have been relatively late production, but was still not a Wisconsin made bike.

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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I can't see the pices either.

All Race and Race Lite frames were made in Santa Cruz. No Privateers were made in Santa Cruz.

Trek bought Bontrager in ~1995, which roughly corresponds to when the stays went from segmented to tappered. You can consider tappered frames as being post-Trek Santa Cruz frames, and those with segmented stays as pre-Trek Santa Cruz frames.

Privateers were built by Trek in WI.


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## Aaron47pb (Apr 22, 2017)

How about these?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

That's a Race Lite made by Bontrager Cycles in Santa Cruz after Trek purchased the company.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> At least the first two years of production Bontrager Privateers had 1" headtubes. I own several from 1997 and two from 1996 and they all have 1" headtubes. I only have two Bontragers with 1 1/8" headtubes, one a Privateer Comp from probably the last year they were made and another from the year before (98?) which I stripped down to a naked frame but never got around to having powdercoated. It's hanging in the shed.


I've seen 1 1/8" privateers from 98 and 99, but they were being produced at the same time as identical 1" versions. I know this because I have had 2 pairs of matching privateers with different head tube sizes. The Rasta Green/Red/Yellow and the Blue/Cream/Orange are the only 2 I've ever seen with 1 1/8" headtubes, but I've had identical 1" versions of each bike. I've never seen a 1 1/8" in any color but these. Was yours a different color than these?


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

jestep said:


> I've seen 1 1/8" privateers from 98 and 99, but they were being produced at the same time as identical 1" versions. I know this because I have had 2 pairs of matching privateers with different head tube sizes. The Rasta Green/Red/Yellow and the Blue/Cream/Orange are the only 2 I've ever seen with 1 1/8" headtubes, but I've had identical 1" versions of each bike. I've never seen a 1 1/8" in any color but these. Was yours a different color than these?


I used to have the catalogs for 97 and 98. My recollection is that 98 was the year Keith noted in the catalog that he was "done jousting windmills" and that they were switching to 1-1/8". I guess that could mean they were still making both, but it seems like it would've been a confusing time at the Trek facility.

I consider myself to be a pretty voracious Bontrager fan, but am by no means an authority.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Wife's 97 Privateer S is also a 1".









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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

This naked frame in the shed is 1-1/8".









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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

We moved into a smaller place and now we're rearranging. I'm having trouble compressing. 

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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I've got another green 97 Privateer Comp at my cousin's place. It's a 1". And the burgundy one I built for him, 97 Privateer S, also a 1". 

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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

K,

Nice collection you got there, shame none of them have a rigid Bonty fork, is that your preference or is it the scarcity/cost? FYI there's a really nice chrome comp fork out here in the Bay Area (CA), but the seller wants pretty top dollar. I have one on my Salsa Jelly Bean dirt drop and an IRD Ti one for a 1991 purple Race.. BTW, really dig that Bontrager chainring! Let me know if that's headed for storage. Cheers


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

You really are the king of the outings.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Mr. Claus said:


> K,
> 
> Nice collection you got there, shame none of them have a rigid Bonty fork, is that your preference or is it the scarcity/cost? FYI there's a really nice chrome comp fork out here in the Bay Area (CA), but the seller wants pretty top dollar. I have one on my Salsa Jelly Bean dirt drop and an IRD Ti one for a 1991 purple Race.. BTW, really dig that Bontrager chainring! Let me know if that's headed for storage. Cheers


At the time these were accumulating, it was my preference. Now I wish I'd gotten one, but not bad enough to throw down the big bucks.

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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

So right now, I have:
97 Burgandy Privateer S 1"
96 Silver Privateer Comp 1"
99 Rasta w/1 1/8" headtube
99 Blue/cream/orange w/ 1" headtube
95 B29 w/ 1" Headtube
97? B1 w/ 1 1/8" Headtube

I'm starting to think they used whatever headtube stock was closest to the bench...

Separate question for anyone, I've had this in my garage waiting for me to do something with it for some time.









Did these ever come with a fork like this stock? I figured it was aftermarket but if so someone color matched it perfectly if that's the case. This is the same frame color scheme that I had a 1 1/8" frame some time ago. This one is 1".


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

girlonbike said:


> You really are the king of the outings.


Wow, nothing gets by you GOB, you're like the eye of Soron.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

jestep said:


> I'm starting to think they used whatever headtube stock was closest to the bench...


My guess is that the last batch(es) of Privateers were built with 1 1/8" head tubes. The 1 inch frames that were sold later were likely made earlier but had not sold. In the late 80's there weren't many people looking to buy steel frames.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

jestep said:


> Did these ever come with a fork like this stock? I figured it was aftermarket but if so someone color matched it perfectly if that's the case. This is the same frame color scheme that I had a 1 1/8" frame some time ago. This one is 1".


Yes. Privateer W/LX group, the next step up was the S (same group w/quadra 21r)


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> My guess is that the last batch(es) of Privateers were built with 1 1/8" head tubes. The 1 inch frames that were sold later were likely made earlier but had not sold. In the late *90's* there weren't many people looking to buy steel frames.


That's what I was told by a Bontrager Sales Rep at a CABDA show in ~1998. (The same show I met Sheldon Brown at...)

-jw


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

My old Racelite. Probably 95ish. Built to look more or less like a photo from the catalog except for the RaceFace cranks, IRC Mythos XC tires, and the Hadley hubs. Mostly Deore XT, shifters are XTR.









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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

This one is a little older, since it has the two piece seatstays. Pretty sure it's also a Racelite due to the facing of the headtube. Just added Konus coil springs to my tired old Judy XC. This one is an XT bike with Deore LX shifter brake levers because I preferred the '95 LX brake lever shape.

I bought this one as a new old stock frame with tags on it and built it up.









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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

*What year Race?*

Hey, I just picked up an early 90's race frame and am trying to pinpoint the year. Any help would be appreciated!

It has the two piece seat stays so that makes me think before '94 or '95.
It has vertical drop outs, but does not have a seat tube/clamp gusset

I have another Race, that is to big for my liking, which I was told is a '93 by the original owner. Other than size, the bikes seem to be the same except it has the seat tube/clamp gusset and the other does not.

Anyone know what year the seat tube gusset was added?

Thanks!


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

Some pics if that helps.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Hmm..... that's not a feature that I've paid much attention to. I don't know the answer. However, there is a vintage Bontrager page on FaceBook that Keith and several ex-employees post to regularly. You may want to ask there.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

The seattube gussets are one of the earliest features of Bontrager frames. On my 91' OR they already are in place. Is there are pulley for the FD on the driveside seattube? Is the frame suspension corrected?


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

Laffeaux, thanks and I will look for that FB page if I can't find an answer. 

Caemis, that's earlier than i thought since I always thought that the vertical drops outs didn't start until after '92 and before that they used the sliding dropouts. The bike does have the pulley for the FD, but am not sure about suspension corrected. Is there a way to tell if it is suspension corrected without the frame built up to measure angles?


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

caemis said:


> The seattube gussets are one of the earliest features of Bontrager frames. On my 91' OR they already are in place. Is there are pulley for the FD on the driveside seattube? Is the frame suspension corrected?


Looks like you guys might be talking about two different things. There are gussets at the sides of the seat tube at the connection to the bottom bracket shell, but there is also a "reinforcement" gusset at the bottom of the notch where the top of the seat tube clamps to a seatpost.

@Mack's appears to have the former, but not the later. In case it helps, my 90 OR has neither, but my '94 race and newer race lite have both. So, unless it was an oversight during production, I'd guess that puts it in the range you were thinking: 'late 92 - '93? Total speculation, though. I've seen many people say that their horizontal dropout Race was a '92.

I could be wrong, but I don't think that a bonty's "year" is as cut-and-dry as with many manufacturers who ordered or built frames in large batches. I'm pretty sure the Santa Cruz shop was building frames successively and continuously, so evolution was constant, and subtle changes probably happened all the time. Would be nice to see that confirmed.

As to determining whether it is suspension corrected or not, I think it really is easiest to mock up a build and measure the frame angles. But there _was_ a slight difference in top tube lengths, shown in the attached schedules. (From '92* and '94) The difficulty is knowing how to measure, and I'm still not 100% sure I understand. Is it effective or straight, center to center, end-to-end, etc. For that matter, I also still don't really know if the angles are cited with fork sag or not. If yours happens to be an XXL, I could help compare against mine which I know to be suspension corrected.

















(*Unfortunately, the resolution on the image isn't quite good enough to see if the seat tube clamp reinforcement existed in '92)


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

iamkeith said:


> Looks like you guys might be talking about two different things. There are gussets at the sides of the seat tube at the connection to the bottom bracket shell, but there is also a "reinforcement" gusset at the bottom of the notch where the top of the seat tube clamps to a seatpost.


You're absolutely right @iamkeith - but at least as far I can tell from the pics above there are no gussets at the bottom bracket as well. I had to check some other pictures to find the small gusset you are talking about  - I had one on my 95' Race (but no FD pulley), on my OR there is no such gusset. Sorry for the confusion.


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

Ok, so yes, it sounds like we were talking about different things. The bike in question does have the gussets on the seat tube at the BB, but not at the top of the seat tube near the collar. Below is a pic of the seat tube gusset near the collar on what I think is a '93 Race. The orange bonty does not have this gusset.

So, if I understand this correctly, the order of progression was:

No seat tube gussets, sliding drop outs & 2 piece stays
To
BB seat tube gussets, sliding drop outs & 2 piece stays
To
BB seat tube gusset, vertical drop outs & 2 piece stays
To
BB and collar seat tube gussets, vertical drop outs & 2 piece stays
To
BB and collar seat tube gussets, vertical drop outs & 1 piece stays

Does this look right?

If so does anyone have a guess as to the years or abouts of these changes?


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

iamkeith said:


> @Mack's appears to have the former, but not the later. In case it helps, my 90 OR has neither, but my '94 race and newer race lite have both. So, unless it was an oversight during production, I'd guess that puts it in the range you were thinking: 'late 92 - '93? Total speculation, though. I've seen many people say that their horizontal dropout Race was a '92...
> 
> As to determining whether it is suspension corrected or not, I think it really is easiest to mock up a build and measure the frame angles. But there _was_ a slight difference in top tube lengths, shown in the attached schedules. (From '92* and '94) The difficulty is knowing how to measure, and I'm still not 100% sure I understand. Is it effective or straight, center to center, end-to-end, etc. For that matter, I also still don't really know if the angles are cited with fork sag or not. If yours happens to be an XXL, I could help compare against mine which I know to be suspension corrected.


Hmm, the orange bonty is a XL so comparing won't help there I don't think, but my other is also an XXL and I was told by original owner it is suspension correct. Also came with bonty specific RS fork crown, so pretty sure it is. I will measure just to compare anyways.

However, I can see in both the scans you posted (and thank you for that, they are awesome) that it says "c-c". When measuring the orange frame it is pretty much right on the mark for 19" c to c from BB to center of the top tub, but the TT measurement is more like 23.25 instead of 23.4, however I was using a tape measure and for some reason it seems harder to measure the TT accurately than the ST. Maybe it's just me, however it is definetly not over 23 1/2" c to c so I am thinking it is suspension correct. And good thing since that bomber the frame is sitting on is the only decent 1" head tube fork I could find.



caemis said:


> You're absolutely right @iamkeith - but at least as far I can tell from the pics above there are no gussets at the bottom bracket as well. I had to check some other pictures to find the small gusset you are talking about  - I had one on my 95' Race (but no FD pulley), on my OR there is no such gusset. Sorry for the confusion.


Hey, thanks for the help. Just curious, does your OR have sliding dropouts or not? 
Also, Above I posted a pic of that seat tub clamp area reinforcement gusset from my XXL just cause.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Yes, my OR has horizontal Dropouts:



Also the build came to an abrupte stop after the painter informed me about rustholes at the chainstay  I'll see what I can do for it...
Cheers!


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Marco,

You've been busy or is that Bonty an older acquisition? The fork is sweet, that looks to be just like my eggplant purple 91-92 Bonty OR which also has the horizontal dropouts. I'm curious now about the gusset question, after work I'll look more closely at the frame and post a pic or two. Having lived in Santa Cruz for a few years, knowing the vibe down there I'm not surprised there were some "irregularities" in that shop. I have a soft spot for SC frame makers, and personally think Bontrager's are great bikes, steep head tube angle, sloping top tube and rigid fork make them very nimble ride IMHO. Dig it


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

singletrackmack said:


> Hmm, the orange bonty is a XL so comparing won't help there I don't think, but my other is also an XXL and I was told by original owner it is suspension correct. Also came with bonty specific RS fork crown, so pretty sure it is. I will measure just to compare anyways.
> 
> However, I can see in both the scans you posted (and thank you for that, they are awesome) that it says "c-c". When measuring the orange frame it is pretty much right on the mark for 19" c to c from BB to center of the top tub, but the TT measurement is more like 23.25 instead of 23.4, however I was using a tape measure and for some reason it seems harder to measure the TT accurately than the ST. Maybe it's just me, however it is definetly not over 23 1/2" c to c so I am thinking it is suspension correct.


Ok this will help - i'd forgotten that the catalog actually stated c-c for the seattube measurement. That means mine are actually XL, not XXL (the thing that always throws me off is that my ti lite is stamped 21", which is c-t but, since it was outsourced, that doesn't really mean anything)

The ACTUAL top tube c-c on a suspension-corrected, xl frame (measured along the side of the tube itself) is 23". So 23.4" is the effective (horizontal) measurement.

If you're really lucky, yours will be NON suspension corrected, btw. Much rarer, and it's always possible to find a bonty fork with enough time and money. No such thing as a "good" 1" suspension fork, on the other hand - only "acceptable."


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Mr. Claus said:


> Marco,
> 
> You've been busy or is that Bonty an older acquisition? The fork is sweet, that looks to be just like my eggplant purple 91-92 Bonty OR which also has the horizontal dropouts. I'm curious now about the gusset question, after work I'll look more closely at the frame and post a pic or two. Having lived in Santa Cruz for a few years, knowing the vibe down there I'm not surprised there were some "irregularities" in that shop. I have a soft spot for SC frame makers, and personally think Bontrager's are great bikes, steep head tube angle, sloping top tube and rigid fork make them very nimble ride IMHO. Dig it


Hi, this is my old Bonty as a new acquisition - I asked the former buyer/owner if he is willing to sell it back to me a few weeks ago, because I missed it. I'll try to get it home tomorrow from the painter and see what the rust has done to it. All the best!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I'm not positive on the order of the changes from below, but after looking at a few frames in the basement...

- I have two with two-piece (segmented) stays and both have vertical non-adjustable dropouts. One has the small gusset at the top of the seat tube and the other does not. My personal guess on age are '94-'95 on one and '92-'93 on the other, but those could be off.

- I also have a tapered stay Race and Race Lite. Both have all the gussets.

My guess is that there was some overlap with vertical and horizontal dropouts were both offered. A few Race Lites have the horizontal dropouts, so they still existed at least until it's introduction.

And as Keith said, there's not really a "model year" for Bontragers. Changes were made when changes were needed or a "better" way was found. Nailing down dates exactly is hard because what shop received as stock might not have been the newest frames. Only the guys on the factory floor "may" know the whole story.



singletrackmack said:


> So, if I understand this correctly, the order of progression was:
> 
> No seat tube gussets, sliding drop outs & 2 piece stays
> To
> ...


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I bought an interesting frame this past weekend. It's a standard early '90s Race that was on eBay: Bontrager OR Mountain Bike Vintage MTB w/ Extra Vicious Cycle Fork | eBay
It seemed like a good deal, the frame was my size, came with a few nice parts, and most interestingly the decals looked kind of odd. It sold for a reasonable price, so I ended up with it.

Once it arrived the reason that the decals looked "off" is that they're not decals. They're painted on. I kind of suspected it from the pictures but wasn't sure until I saw it in person. The finish is wet paint applied by Cyclart, and the panels (and I'm pretty sure the head badge) are applied as paint. It's the nicest looking finish I've seen on a Bontrager - it has a few chips here and there, but the wet paint looks really nice, and the red panels look so much brighter than decals. 

I've asked the seller if knows anything about the finish, but I'm guessing not. It's not-original, but kind of cooler than original in my book.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

I got my OR back from the painter today. The holes are quite tiny (less than 1mm) but still...:





The rest of the frame looks pretty good...


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

EL, that is an interesting find, never saw that on the Bay, but I'm looking less and trying to finish a project. You're right that wet paint and painted decal look awesome and unique, plus the fork and brakes are pretty nice, a better than fair price I would say (even with shipping).

Marco, hmm, those don't look too bad, but I wonder if there is more damage in the internal tubes, meaning rusted from the inside out? A frame builder or the likes would know better. Does the tube "feel" or seem thinner near those pin-holes?

Cheers all and happy dog-days of summer.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Mr. Claus said:


> Marco, hmm, those don't look too bad, but I wonder if there is more damage in the internal tubes, meaning rusted from the inside out? A frame builder or the likes would know better. Does the tube "feel" or seem thinner near those pin-holes?
> 
> Cheers all and happy dog-days of summer.


Hard to tell, the tube does not feel and sound different to me. And there a holes on the downside as well as on the upside of the chainstay; but I have no idea what could cause such damage in and/or outside the tube. Well, I already contacted a frame builder here but maybe I gonna ask Paul or if possible Keith Bontrager for their opinion.

Besides, I like this naked frames, the welding and brazing is awesome.

Have a good weekend (of course all of you)


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

caemis said:


> Hard to tell, the tube does not feel and sound different to me. And there a holes on the downside as well as on the upside of the chainstay; but I have no idea what could cause such damage in and/or outside the tube. Well, I already contacted a frame builder here but maybe I gonna ask Paul or if possible Keith Bontrager for their opinion.
> 
> Besides, I like this naked frames, the welding and brazing is awesome.
> 
> Have a good weekend (of course all of you)


Update: The first information on the chainstay I received from Georg B. (Gebla Bikes) was: change the chainstay.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Bummer. Given how cheap Bontrager frames sell for these days, it would be cheaper to find one for sale in nice shape.



caemis said:


> Update: The first information on the chainstay I received from Georg B. (Gebla Bikes) was: change the chainstay.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

laffeaux said:


> Bummer. Given how cheap Bontrager frames sell for these days, it would be cheaper to find one for sale in nice shape.


Yeah. But you're probably right, it might be cheaper or even faster to wait for a matching frame... Still its sad to see a frame in this condition... In a few years, it will be 30 years old, if it stays with me that time, I will have it repaired as a birthday present


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Just saw this on my ebay watch list. If this was from basically any other selling on earth, I'd call BS, but NOS unpainted racelite... I wouldn't pay for it but cool nonetheless.

Vintage 1994/95 Keith Bontrager Mountain Bike Frame 21in XL 26" Steel Hardtail | eBay


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

jestep said:


> Just saw this on my ebay watch list. If this was from basically any other selling on earth, I'd call BS, but NOS unpainted racelite... I wouldn't pay for it but cool nonetheless.
> 
> Vintage 1994/95 Keith Bontrager Mountain Bike Frame 21in XL 26" Steel Hardtail | eBay


From the listing:

"Keith Bontrager factory unpainted original, 1994 or 1995. Note visible on top tube "_c/s out of spec_". No canti posts or bottle cage rivets installed."​
So it was built incorrectly, the factory discarded it before bothering to finish it.... and now Pro's Closet wants $800 for it? I think there's another thread where this would fit.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> From the listing:
> 
> "Keith Bontrager factory unpainted original, 1994 or 1995. Note visible on top tube "_c/s out of spec_". No canti posts or bottle cage rivets installed."​
> So it was built incorrectly, the factory discarded it before bothering to finish it.... and now Pro's Closet wants $800 for it? I think there's another thread where this would fit.


Glad someone said it.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

colker1 said:


> Glad someone said it.


For the record, i wasn't intending to give @jestep a hard time. If nothing else, it's neat to be able to see all the welds and heat-affected areas, knowing how much consideration was given to them during the design of these frames.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> For the record, i wasn't intending to give @jestep a hard time. If nothing else, it's neat to be able to see all the welds and heat-affected areas, knowing how much consideration was given to them during the design of these frames.


I totally missed that part of the description. Pretty funny though, 25 year old defective frame that was likely trashed at the time, $800... I love seeing it completely raw though, that's what caught my eye initially.

In looking at it now, I'm trying to figure out what is going on at all with the canti posts, what's with the hollow ring? I looked at all my frames including an OR and a racelite and handful of privateers and can't put together what's going on there. The amount it sticks inward towards where the wheel will be looks way more than any of my frames. On that same image, the bottom bracket weld is drool worthy...


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## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

Hey All,

Bad times, good times, even more good times. The "sorriest looking OR on thread" on p. 12 came to sad end.

All those years neglected in the bottom of some garden, canal, skip, wherever it was, came home to roost. After a week or two of wondering what that creak was, I did some investigating:










Spiral crack all the way round the DT. That hole, I just poked it through with my finger. :-/ Sent it to a framebuilder friend for a possible rescue/ DT replacement. He was unenthusiastic, but wanted to do his best as he has soft spot for old Bontys. But the seat stays were rusted through as well apparently, so wall hanger at best, and not a very pretty one at that!

I moaned on STW, and asked if someone had a donor frame for a hack bike that I could bolt all the bits to and started getting offers from "take this thing off me" to "yours for £50 if you can pick it up from x ". One offer was of a Raleigh Randonneur F&F if I could scoop it up. Didn't know much about the frames, but went a googlin'. Different sort of bike, would need a bunch of bits to build it up, but was too good to turn down. He'd rescued it from being thrown out when a guy was upgrading to a Ti frame. Too big for him, but he held onto it for 7 years, waiting for someone correctly-heighted to turn up who would ride it and appreciate it. I bloody do! So smooooth. I ride it 6 days out of 7, but everytime I get on it, it's a joy how smooth it is. Love it.










A year later, we're back to Bonty's: Tuesday night trail ride, a riding buddy said he'd just been offered an old Bontrager frame by a mate wanting to offload. No great use for it himself, but he said he knew someone who might...










It's definitely in better nick than the not-so-trusty-rusty OR! It's been powder coated and re-stickered, so no reliable clues from the decals. Riding buddy's mate reckoned pre-Trek Race? But from some reading here, 1 1/8 headtube, no chainstay gussets and "functional" welding, means maybe Virginia Privateer? What do we think?


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

If it has a 1 1/8 headtube it would be a 98 or 99 privateer. Pre trek would have 2 piece seat stays as well. But still a great frame.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Yep, the wishbone shape of the seat stays is definitely a Privateer. The 1 1/8 head tube makes it the last year mde. Got to be a '98 Privateer. Made in Waterloo, WI.


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## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

Cheers guys! Don't know whether to build it up rigid or throw some suss forks on it. I've got some 2010 Reba Teams that would space down to 80mm and probably not be too far off A2C? What was the Indy XC 63mm? 425mm ish? If I do that I'm going disc at front and wondering about getting a tab brazed on the back. 

Or I can go light and rigid and keep it simple. get some big slicks maybe. Annoying the P2s I had for the ORs won't fit. I'll have to keep my eyes open on the classifieds and the ''bay for some nice 425mm steel forks P2s or Cromotos.

Pretty jazzed that I've got a Privateer. First bike that turned me onto skinny steel when I read about it in the mags.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

nedrapier said:


> Cheers guys! Don't know whether to build it up rigid or throw some suss forks on it. I've got some 2010 Reba Teams that would space down to 80mm and probably not be too far off A2C? What was the Indy XC 63mm? 425mm ish? If I do that I'm going disc at front and wondering about getting a tab brazed on the back.
> 
> Or I can go light and rigid and keep it simple. get some big slicks maybe. Annoying the P2s I had for the ORs won't fit. I'll have to keep my eyes open on the classifieds and the ''bay for some nice 425mm steel forks P2s or Cromotos.
> 
> Pretty jazzed that I've got a Privateer. First bike that turned me onto skinny steel when I read about it in the mags.


The Indy's were actually really short, like 405 - 410mm. But, you shouldn't have any problem in the 420 - 430 range. I believe the 98 SID's that I have are around 430mm and they work great. I had a 80mm Marz on one of my frames a while back and at ~450mm height, it was negatively affecting the geometry IMO.

Double check the Reba's height. If I remember correctly the 80mm 2000+ SID's and Rebas are more like 450mm. Not unusable but not ideal IMO.

The good thing about the 1 1/8" privateers is that you can actually find forks for them, I'm about to sell one or two of my Bontrager frames because 1" forks are getting impossible to find. But, I see first generation 1 1/8" SID's on ebay fairly frequently, they'll be the SID blue with no disc tabs.

Example, I think they're asking too much for it, but this is the SID you want if you want to keep an eye out for a deal: Rock Shox SID 1996, first model, rare vintage parts | eBay

Other options are late 90's marz like the Z1 or Z2. I can't remember the model but there were some decent Manitous as well. There's a number of steel rigid forks that should work well also.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Kona P2 at 410mm. Rigid.


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## nedrapier (Jun 11, 2008)

410 is good for the Privateer you reckon colker? I've got a Kona P2 in 410mm that was on the OR. 1" steerer though. Might be the simplest way forward just to get some headtube shims and use that. Wouldn't need a new headset either. 

All working out nicely. This build will need to be cheap. Cheap or "later". I went on pinkbike to look for forks yesterday and got distracted. I'm picking up a new (s/h) bike on Friday.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

I've got a couple on Bontragers built up and finally meased the forks. 410mm is probably amout right fir a rigid fork. 

I have a 2000 Rock Shox SID (~440mm) and a 2003 Marzocchi Marathon (~470mm) on my bikes. The SID is perfect. The Marathon is too long and the bike handles less well. Going down to 410mm is probably pretty close to where the SID rides on the trail.


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## Cragod1 (Oct 10, 2017)

1996 Comp. I bought it new back then and have really kept it original.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

*Circa '91....*

So I graduated college and decided to take the year "off" to mountain bike upstate NY/VT. Soon after, cracked a down tube on my Klein Attitude and needed a new bike.

Found myself for a moment way out on Long Island. Hit a local bike shop. Got directed to a Bontrager Race OR. Didn't know anything about the bike, but it seemed right. Today, bike purchases are a bit more researched. Anyhow, had some questions about the geo and the like. Shop owner suggested we call Santa Cruz for answers. I took the phone. The guy in SC said, "hold on, Keith is walking the floor now". Keith got on. We talked for half an hour about the bike...

Needless to say, that bike was so awesome - fit me better than anything ridden before/after.

Have had some good ones since then. Got rid of them all. Kept the Bontrager.

Can't do single track with it anymore. But I put some love back into it recently to make it a gravel grinder. And it remains, not surprisingly, so awesome to mash on...

Still have all the original bits, but as a single speed, 650B conversion, it gets a spot in my weekly rotation. Highly recommended.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Dreamy!

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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Nice!!

How does it handle with the 650b wheels? I have a spare bonty frame, this might be an option...


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

What´s that doodle on the rear brake studs? an adapter? Bontragers are so right.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

colker1 said:


> What´s that doodle on the rear brake studs? an adapter? Bontragers are so right.


Adapter for 650B wheels so the brakes match up with the rims.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

I think its a really good setup. Really good... one that I look forward to riding. And I'm not a gravel/cross rider. However, I'm on a mid-travel 27.5 trail bike most days, which has full-suspension handling, so any rigid is going to feel quick... I ended up on 650x43s. Very light and lively. Tons of clearence. I might try some 700c....  Ore maybe 29ers.... :0

Btw, my stem is pretty stout. I think a 45. A longer stem would keep it even quicker; but its right where I want it.


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

Its a BMX brake adaptor.

ELEVN RACING Components | Brake Adaptators

The Paul's weren't getter there on their own...


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Have a build question for all y'all. Sorry in advance for the lengthy post...

I have a 96 or 97 race lite I have reincarnated many times. This year I got a modern mtb and haven't put my finger on the next incarnation for the bontrager. I set it up SS and had a free 100mm fork idea/build fall through....well I had it built with the 75mm atom bomb SS but that didn't prove to be something I found useful. Recently the idea of a mixed use/gravel/monster cross hit me and I think this pairs with my FS trail bike well.

Anyway....this is the intent for the new build. I just recently put drop bars and 415mm rigid Carver fork on and they feel great. The only thing that is weird is that I wound up with a stack of spacers (1-2") to put the bar in the "right" place.

Finally to my question after my rambling....would running a 96er bring the front end up in a useful way to remove some spacers or slacken the steering enough to be a negative? Anyone done it? Other options I've considered: leave it be as 26" road/dirt tourer with lots of spacers, make it a 96er and remove some spacers, convert both wheels to 700c....

FYI.....I need excuses to build wheels....

What do you all think?


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Jspagat said:


> Its a BMX brake adaptor.
> 
> ELEVN RACING Components | Brake Adaptators
> 
> The Paul's weren't getter there on their own...


Thanks. 
( btw, i believe longer stems slow down the steering. They pair well w/ 71degr head angles.)


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Have a build question for all y'all. Sorry in advance for the lengthy post...
> 
> I have a 96 or 97 race lite I have reincarnated many times. This year I got a modern mtb and haven't put my finger on the next incarnation for the bontrager. I set it up SS and had a free 100mm fork idea/build fall through....well I had it built with the 75mm atom bomb SS but that didn't prove to be something I found useful. Recently the idea of a mixed use/gravel/monster cross hit me and I think this pairs with my FS trail bike well.
> 
> ...


I think changing the wheel up front will affect the bike way more than just raising your hbar. You may end up liking it ... or not. 
Otoh there is nothing wrong w/ spacers.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Uh ya sorry too long explanation of my actually short question! Story of my life...

I know it will change it more than just raising bar - I am curious: has anyone done it and how did it change handling?


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Uh ya sorry too long explanation of my actually short question! Story of my life...
> 
> I know it will change it more than just raising bar - I am curious: has anyone done it and how did it change handling?


Do you know what the total height of that fork / wheel would be. That's the deciding factor IMO. I had a longer fork on one of mine for a while and I couldn't stand how lifeless it made the bike feel. Add that to increased rotational weight of a 29" front wheel and it could compound it. If you're adding spacers above the headtube, you aren't changing the geometry. You add height below the headtube and that's when the actual feel of the bike changes.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

jestep said:


> Do you know what the total height of that fork / wheel would be. That's the deciding factor IMO. I had a longer fork on one of mine for a while and I couldn't stand how lifeless it made the bike feel. Add that to increased rotational weight of a 29" front wheel and it could compound it. If you're adding spacers above the headtube, you aren't changing the geometry. You add height below the headtube and that's when the actual feel of the bike changes.


Not sure exactly how much higher but I estimate approximately 1.25". Would be similar to putting 440-450a2c fork I *think*.


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

FYI, if you want to run 650B on a bike like this without adapters, the CaneCreek Direct Curve 5 is your huckleberry. Use them with a short pull brake lever with the pads up so high in the slots - works great and clean.

Untitled by Mr. P, on Flickr

Untitled by Mr. P, on Flickr


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## Jspagat (Oct 5, 2015)

fatchanceti said:


> FYI, if you want to run 650B on a bike like this without adapters, the CaneCreek Direct Curve 5 is your huckleberry. Use them with a short pull brake lever with the pads up so high in the slots - works great and clean.


I don't know about taking advice from someone riding without a downtube. 
Those CCs must have high slots. Are they confirmed to work on this frame? The Paul's did not give enough power without the adaptor, although the adaptors work fine, and are available 1st hand. The CCs ain't easy to come by. Good to know though...


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

The slots are super long. Look at the top pic (rear wheeel). I wasn't even close to the top of the mounting slot. Seems like more than enough to work with any 26er like my Slingshot. 

Yes, they are a bit hard to find now. It took me about two months to find my 2nd one for the above build.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> I know it will change it more than just raising bar - I am curious: has anyone done it and how did it change handling?


I'm running a 80mm Marzocchi Marathon on a Race Lite. The fork raises the front end too much IMO. It's most noticeable on climbs. To me a Bontrager is one of the best climbingbikes ever made. With the long fork it is not. The bike tends to wander, and keeoing it on trail on steep singleteack climbs is hard. It's also less fun on tight twisty single track. Its not a bad handling bike, but not a great handling one.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

laffeaux said:


> I'm running a 80mm Marzocchi Marathon on a Race Lite. The fork raises the front end too much IMO. It's most noticeable on climbs. To me a Bontrager is one of the best climbingbikes ever made. With the long fork it is not. The bike tends to wander, and keeoing it on trail on steep singleteack climbs is hard. It's also less fun on tight twisty single track. Its not a bad handling bike, but not a great handling one.


I felt the same way with a 80mm MX comp. If you haven't ridden these a lot, one might not realize how much it changes the feel.


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## Dom8484 (Nov 26, 2017)

So, I just picked up a titanium “bontrager” from an older gentleman for what I believe was a good deal. It has/had full XTR (except wheels). What I am discovering is the frame although has Bontrager OR stickers it has Sandvik Drop outs and the SN starts with DBR. Now I know sandvik made bikes for DBR but I’m not sure why this bike is stickers as a Bontrager. Just was wondering if anyone knew any history if DBR made ti frames for Bontrager or if it just had Bontrager stickers. The guy said he bought from an garage sale in Charleston, WV.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Dom8484 said:


> So, I just picked up a titanium "bontrager" from an older gentleman for what I believe was a good deal. It has/had full XTR (except wheels). What I am discovering is the frame although has Bontrager OR stickers it has Sandvik Drop outs and the SN starts with DBR. Now I know sandvik mad bikes for DBR but I'm not sure why this bike is stickers as a Bontrager. Just was wondering if anyone knew any history if DBR made ti frames for Bontrager or if it just had Bontrager stickers. The guy said he bought from an garage sale in Charleston, WV.


Can you post a picture? Does it have the ugly 2 piece welded seat tube? That's usually the dead givaway on ti lites. Sandvik made the tubing on ti lites though. Personally, I have no clue on the serial, one of the Bontrager gurus could probably answer based on that.


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

The ti lites were made bu Sandvik.



Dom8484 said:


> So, I just picked up a titanium "bontrager" from an older gentleman for what I believe was a good deal. It has/had full XTR (except wheels). What I am discovering is the frame although has Bontrager OR stickers it has Sandvik Drop outs and the SN starts with DBR. Now I know sandvik mad bikes for DBR but I'm not sure why this bike is stickers as a Bontrager. Just was wondering if anyone knew any history if DBR made ti frames for Bontrager or if it just had Bontrager stickers. The guy said he bought from an garage sale in Charleston, WV.


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## Dom8484 (Nov 26, 2017)

I have added pics to my original post.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Dom8484 said:


> I have added pics to my original post.


That's not a Ti Lite. The cable guides, brake stop, and head tube do not match a Bontrager.

It likely is a Diamond Back with Bontrager decals.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Wonder where he got those decals?

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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Wonder where he got those decals?


They're pretty easy to come by. They were designed to be be beat up and replaced as needed to save the paint.

Those decals came on the steel bike. The Ti Lite had it's own decals that were not panel. Also, I've never seen a painted Ti Lite.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> Wonder where he got those decals?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


B - Bontrager - VeloCals


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Just saw this on my feed. Haven't seen one with a switchblade in a long time. 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/bontrager-race-with-original-switchblade-fork/332478109581

I'd be all over this if I didn't have 4 projects already going.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

jestep said:


> Just saw this on my feed. Haven't seen one with a switchblade in a long time.
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/bontrager-race-with-original-switchblade-fork/332478109581
> 
> I'd be all over this if I didn't have 4 projects already going.


Sooo... there's kind of a "no outing" policy on the vrc forum, but i guess ebay is public enough that it matters little? I'd been trying to get him to sell me the fork before he listed, but he hadn't responded anyway. FYI, frame is '92 or older and fork is from '94 and wrong length, so not quite matched. Still nice though.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

That looks a Judy crown. Did the forks come with that crown originally? Not a bad looking setup, but it looks pieced together to me


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

laffeaux said:


> That looks a Judy crown. Did the forks come with that crown originally? Not a bad looking setup, but it looks pieced together to me


It's a mag 21 crown. Bontrager made a few rigid ones like that, but quit when the Rock Shox started getting a lot of recalls for cracked crowns. Said "they didn't want any part of that."


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

its looks to be a sus corrected fork, came with that crown


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## Sizzler (Sep 24, 2009)

My Bontrager ownership has come full-circle. Years ago, on this thread I lamented selling my Trek made '99 Bontrager Privateer Comp. Later, I bought a Santa Cruz made Race and after that an even nicer Race Lite. But, for sentimental reasons I always wanted the original one back and this weekend, 15 years later, I finally got the chance after bumping into the guy who bought it. Amazingly, it's still in the same condition I sold it. I know the Privateers don't get as much love but I love it and I'm so glad to have it back!


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Sizzler said:


> My Bontrager ownership has come full-circle. Years ago, on this thread I lamented selling my Trek made '99 Bontrager Privateer Comp. Later, I bought a Santa Cruz made Race and after that an even nicer Race Lite. But, for sentimental reasons I always wanted the original one back and this weekend, 15 years later, I finally got the chance after bumping into the guy who bought it. Amazingly, it's still in the same condition I sold it. I know the Privateers don't get as much love but I love it and I'm so glad to have it back!


The 1 1/8" headtubes on the 99 and a few 98 Privateers make them the most versatile by far.

As far as ridability goes, I can't tell the difference between any of them, they're all great bikes as far as I'm concerned. There's some obviously nostalgia and collectability to the pre-trek frames, but if you just want a good steel bike to ride, you can't go wrong with any of them.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Looks great!

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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

jestep said:


> The 1 1/8" headtubes on the 99 and a few 98 Privateers make them the most versatile by far.
> 
> As far as ridability goes, I can't tell the difference between any of them, they're all great bikes as far as I'm concerned. There's some obviously nostalgia and collectability to the pre-trek frames, but if you just want a good steel bike to ride, you can't go wrong with any of them.


I agree regarding the ride of the privateer vs the race and race lites. I should have never sold my 98 privateer with the 1.125" head tube as it really opened up fork options. Lots of those "shouldn't have done that" sales over the years. 


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## ex shop rat (Jun 10, 2005)

*Need a fork idea*

Hello! I have question about fork options on a race. But first I never posted on this thread so I should do an intro.

I have one of the last races made in SC. At the time I worked in a shop we sold Bontrager and Klein before and after Trek right until the end. I know I have one of the last because I bought it from the Trek blow out fax dealers got. One fax included all the last run of SC bikes. They had road, Ti, Race and Race lights on blow out about a full year after the SC shop was closed. I actually ordered a Race lite,They shipped me a Race instead. I was pissed as I wanted a lite and was charged for it. I remember to this day a race was $179, race lite $225, Ti $350. I tired to get the order made right but all larges where taken. So I ended up with a race and complained enough they ended up refunding me the difference plus some, so I paid $150. I remember all of this because I was so proud of the deal and consider it my best bike deal ever. Frame hung on the wall of my house for a year and then I built it with a new 99 SID SL TI and XTR. The only parts left from that build are the frame, fork and headset.

But now the fork is pretty much done and I need to replace it and I'm looking for opinions. I use the Race to tow my kids trail a bike and trailer mostly on the C and O canal path. I tossed some knobbies back on the it and hit a couple of trails with it this past summer. Forgot how much I liked hard tails and went out and bought a Lyndsky Pro 27.5. So it's not really going to be a trail bike for now, but the option to use it that way would be nice. I am thinking of going with a rigid fork. What should I get? A true bonti fork is way more than I want to spend on this bike. Or should I get a suspension fork? I've seen some out there for sale used, make sense to get one now before they are even harder to find, if that possible. So what would you do?


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Is your fork/stem/headset threaded or threadless?

If you don't mind the look, these aren't horrible:

https://www.carboncycles.cc/?s=0&c=82&p=887

or

https://www.carboncycles.cc/?s=0&c=82&p=1659

The height isn't perfect, yours with sag is probably running close to 405mm.

Another option something like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carver-Bik...944635&hash=item3aee827709:g:TEAAAOSwqMFZnGTo


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## ex shop rat (Jun 10, 2005)

Sizzler said:


> My Bontrager ownership has come full-circle. Years ago, on this thread I lamented selling my Trek made '99 Bontrager Privateer Comp. Later, I bought a Santa Cruz made Race and after that an even nicer Race Lite. But, for sentimental reasons I always wanted the original one back and this weekend, 15 years later, I finally got the chance after bumping into the guy who bought it. Amazingly, it's still in the same condition I sold it. I know the Privateers don't get as much love but I love it and I'm so glad to have it back!


Awesome! I have way too many bikes I want back I sold. I dream of finding them again. There's a Fat Chance Yo Eddy out there I miss the most. I was a snob about privateers in the past, but you couldn't tell the difference riding and the steer tube size was better. These frames where still US made, just in Wisconsin, so the quality was there.


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## ex shop rat (Jun 10, 2005)

I saw those Carvers, that's what made me think rigid. Those other forks sort of look like the bontrager fork, where the Carvers are more classic looking. How do they ride compared to a steel fork?

I have a treadless and it was the long travel sid at 80mm.


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## Jak0zilla (May 16, 2010)

You might want to look for one of these Kona P2's. They're nice forks, and the straight blade matches the Bontrager aesthetic well.

Bikeman Kona P2 Mountain Fork, 1 Inch!

They do come back in stock there from time to time.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

As for rigid steel forks you can have a look on the PACE RC30 (GoatSurfer Retro MTB - Pace Forks Timeline) the 1996 modell was avaiable suspension corrected as well. Still not easy to find. Good luck.

I got myself this one on the weekend:









A friend picked it up. The seatpost was a bit too large but came out without any problems.

All the best!


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

caemis said:


> A friend picked it up. The seatpost was a bit too large but came out without any problems.


LOL Glad you mentioned the seat post. I was able to ask about your saddle height.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

I didn't realize seatposts came in 700mm versions...


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

Its really long, isnt it. And the position on the bike would look pretty funny, but I assume I'll need some assistance to get on top of it 
Cheers


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

jestep said:


> Is your fork/stem/headset threaded or threadless?
> 
> If you don't mind the look, these aren't horrible:
> 
> ...


Bro did you see the weight on those carbon forks? They are heavier than that steel one. I just picked up a race lite today and might build it up 1x7 and try to go sub 10 kilos. Interested in getting a rigid fork for it. So far this looks to be the best option new:
Carver XC 410

My guess is that there are better, lighter options from back in the day with the 1" threaded steerer.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

4AM said:


> Bro did you see the weight on those carbon forks? They are heavier than that steel one. I just picked up a race lite today and might build it up 1x7 and try to go sub 10 kilos. Interested in getting a rigid fork for it. So far this looks to be the best option new:
> Carver XC 410
> 
> My guess is that there are better, lighter options from back in the day with the 1" threaded steerer.


Note that the weight listed for the Carver fork is without V-brake posts, which are clamp-on and available separately. I own both forks (as yet unused), and they are clearly made with the exact same dropouts, crown, and maybe in the same factory in China.

The Exotic 425mm carbon version of the fork with disc and V-brake posts is listed as 1060g (mine is 1087g uncut). I also have a 410mm Carver fork (938g uncut disc only). The V-brake adapters are over 100g as a pair so the weights are equivalent. Cutting the steerer should shave 100g or more, but both of these forks are already lighter than my Bontrager composite fork.

The Carver is better because 410mm is perfect for the Bontrager frame, and the V-brake posts are bolt-on. You could certainly buy the Carver bolt-on V-brake posts and use them on the Exotic fork with no fixed V-brake posts, they use identical carbon tubes.


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## Bontracer (Mar 19, 2018)

Just wanted to show you all my 1991 Bontrager Race (L) w/ Fat Chance Big One Inch fork. Salsa Roller stem.w/ Chris King headset & Front Hub. Paul's Stoplight brakes,levers, rear derailleur w/ Titanium 7 speed cassette. I tried to keep it all American as I upgraded parts with the exception of the XT Thumb shifters  . Weighs about 21.5 lbs. Trying to decide whether I should repaint it or just replace the decals. Also thinking about putting the switchblade back on to keep the original geometry of the bike. However the one inch is lighter and an awesome fork.


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## mikemazz11 (Apr 2, 2018)

*Bontrager Privateer S Build with 1x10*

Hello everyone and hoping I can begin my project here. I'll try to make this simple...
I recently bought a 97 Bontrager Privateer S Frame and looking to build it up with modern components. I recently saw a "90's" Marin built with Sram 1x11 NX components and it looks fantastic (see pic)... 
My problem is this. What bottom bracket do I even start with to begin my project? Getting started has been difficult.. Any advice on getting a beginning plan together would be grateful.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

mikemazz11 said:


> Hello everyone and hoping I can begin my project here. I'll try to make this simple...
> I recently bought a 97 Bontrager Privateer S Frame and looking to build it up with modern components. I recently saw a "90's" Marin built with Sram 1x11 NX components and it looks fantastic (see pic)...
> My problem is this. What bottom bracket do I even start with to begin my project? Getting started has been difficult.. Any advice on getting a beginning plan together would be grateful.
> View attachment 1191053


You need a standard 68/73mm BSA BB.

But, figure out what crankset you want first, then get the bottom bracket for that crankset. There are bottom bracket / crankset options from square taper, ISIS, Shimano interfaces, and 22/24/24/ and 30mm external cup BB's that will all fit this frame.

But, really, you should probably come up with a budget and general direction you want to go with this. If you just want to get it ridable again with some decent components, you could probably get a used wheels, crankset, BB, cassette, and drivetrain on ebay and only spend a few hundred dollars. Otherwise, you could spend as much as you want as modern components will still fit this frame. The NX route would be somewhere in the middle, you'll need a 68/73mm GXP bottom bracket for that crankset. Otherwise, once you have wheels, the rest of the NX groupset except the brakes should fit. I'd get some Avid FR5 levers and whatever comparable brakes they have these days.

One other thing, is the fork usable at all? These indy's were pretty bad even back in the mid-90's, not even sure if you can get elastomers for them these days.


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## mikemazz11 (Apr 2, 2018)

Jestep,
That is the answer I was hoping for and really appreciate it and your time. I understand about a budget and where I want it to look cool, so why drop so much $$..? Glutton for punishment perhaps..
As for the fork? I have no idea except for the guy that sold it to me believes it is in good shape. He found it on ebay and does not believe it saw any use whatsoever. Total Mech type of guy.. I can replace of course..
That said,
I have no problem getting used on ebay but since I'm new to this I fear I'll buy the wrong part and be stuck with it, LoL.. This is why I thought starting with the BB would be the plan.. I do like the 1x concept instead of the classic 3x which I've considered and vintage is even more expensive then new!... what group do you think I should I begin to search for that would not have "new" prices and give me what I'm looking for? 
I would say that i will be using the bike for light mtn biking and city ripping. I have a DS mountain bike so it won't be hitting the hard trails..


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

mikemazz11 said:


> Jestep,
> That is the answer I was hoping for and really appreciate it and your time. I understand about a budget and where I want it to look cool, so why drop so much $$..? Glutton for punishment perhaps..
> As for the fork? I have no idea except for the guy that sold it to me believes it is in good shape. He found it on ebay and does not believe it saw any use whatsoever. Total Mech type of guy.. I can replace of course..
> That said,
> ...


I suggest starting a new build thread for this in the vintage or 26er forum. That way this thread isn't consumed by a personal build. Can make suggestions further from there. There's a number of potential issues so would be much better for its own thread.


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

jestep said:


> One other thing, is the fork usable at all? These indy's were pretty bad even back in the mid-90's, not even sure if you can get elastomers for them these days.


We have 1 Indy XC and 3 Judy XCs. We sent one of them to Jerry from Hippie Tech in Garden City, Idaho. He did a very good job rebuilding it and replacing the springs. You can also get springs online for Indy XCs. We bought some for another one of our bikes and did a fork rebuild at home, and the fork works flawlessly now. If you have to replace the elastomers I definitely recommend upgrading to springs, the fork functions much better with them.


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## Williwoods (May 3, 2004)

you selling that hippie tech rebuilt judy by chance?


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

Williwoods said:


> you selling that hippie tech rebuilt judy by chance?


No sorry. I have it on my 1997 Privateer Comp that is converted to 1x with new rims, wide bars, and tubeless.


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## mikemazz11 (Apr 2, 2018)

You have a pic of this bike? I'm almost done with my 97 privateer and I'm doing the same with handlebar, components and wheels. Found a great retro seat on ebay. 
I'll post when completed.


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

*Picture*



mikemazz11 said:


> You have a pic of this bike?


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## mikemazz11 (Apr 2, 2018)

That is really sweet. Are those Indy XC forks? How is that holding up? My frame is in this string a few posts ago. I should have it finished this week. 
Doing the same type of build with shimano zee 1x10.. It will be more of an urban assault vehicle.


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## mikemazz11 (Apr 2, 2018)

*Bontrager Privateer S Build with Shimano Zee 1x10*

She is all done. I really dig it and rides nice. Weighs in about 20 pounds and rips nicely.
The Indy XC fork seems to be just fine at least for now...


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

mikemazz11 said:


> She is all done. I really dig it and rides nice. Weighs in about 20 pounds and rips nicely.


20 pounds? Damn that is such a light build. Sick saddle it's the same one I have on my bike, only mine has 2.5k miles of rubbing so there is barely a label left on it. Glad you went 1x. Old bikes are so nice when you choose the right modern aspects to include in them. My dad and I started a club called the Neo-Retro Cycling club where the members ride bikes that have the best of the old (steel radness) and the best of the new (1x drivetrains, wide rims, etc.). So stoked on your build man I hope you love it.


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## mtbslocal (Apr 1, 2016)

*'92 or '93 Race*

Just picked this up a few weeks ago. Always wanted a classic Bontrager. It's a '92 or '93 Race by my estimation. All parts from the original build except probably the tires which are still mid-90s. Interesting that it has a Specialized build kit - fork, crankset, rims, Prolong saddle, handlebar, and grips. Great condition.


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## singletrackmack (Oct 18, 2012)

^nice looking bonty! Hard to tell from the pic, but are the seat stays one piece or two pieces? That and the drops outs are two distinctive ways to date these bikes.


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## mtbslocal (Apr 1, 2016)

Yes, definitely two piece seatstays, this is way before Trek. I'll take a closer look at the dropouts, I seem to remember horizontal or vertical dropouts mean something.

Some other features to date stamp it: block vs. slanted decals, I'm not sure when they switched, I can only tell from the online catalogs but there's a couple year gap in the ones I can find on the web. Other identifiers: bottle mounts are brazed on mine and not bonded. Cable stops are TIG welded and not bonded/riveted aluminum. Not sure when they made the switch.

I had a friend who bought one in '93 or so and I remember it had bonded cable stops and water bottle mounts. He also set it up with the Stealth fork


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

The front derailleur pulley was only on the earlier race/racelites as well. I think it was around 94 when they removed it. They switched to the slanted stickers maybe a year later, so guessing late 93 or 94 on this frame.


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## Loey (Nov 19, 2011)

I think the above date guesses are good but it looks more, to me, like an Off Road as opposed to a Race. The seat clamp is the same as the one on my fillet brazed which is built with an Off Road tube set. Off Roads also had two bends on the chain stays. Mtbslocal's look that way though it's hard to tell from the side view. That said, All the stops appear to be welded and Race style.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

Early ‘93 OR race


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## polomanH2O (Aug 18, 2018)

Fork options - Privateer S?

Trying to get a bike and rider out of retirement. The bike's 20 years old, but generally in good working order. However, the Indy XC elastomers are shot, coming out of the fork in crumbles. Elastomers seem to be an abandoned suspension tech, so looking for help here. Point me at an old thread if it exists (probably).

Scanning the web and this thread gets me:
"New bike" - not happening, other places to sink cash first
"Replace elastomers" - I can find them, $52. Simple, but tech is dated
"Replace elastomers with springs" - how? Can I get damping?
"Rigid fork" - this bike will be on trails or it won't be ridden
"Replace fork" - the dreaded 1" threaded steerer rears its ugly head. What's doable?

My goal here is a bike suitable for trail riding. New elastomers seem the path of least resistance, but if there's a great improvement to be made, I'll consider it. For sake of discussion, let's cap it at around $200.


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

What’s the axle to crown you need? I have a 1” threadless fork with carbon legs that I’m not using. It’s disc only though.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

polomanH2O said:


> "Rigid fork" - this bike will be on trails or it won't be ridden
> 
> My goal here is a bike suitable for trail riding. New elastomers seem the path of least resistance, but if there's a great improvement to be made, I'll consider it. For sake of discussion, let's cap it at around $200.


After getting the first of my now 4 bontragers in 1994, I'll tell you that I've now essentially spent almost a quarter of a century trying to make them rigid. The only reason you "need" a suspension fork for trail use is if you're trying to keep up with a bunch of reckless, testosterone-fueled, 30-something, bros on boulder-strewn trails like you see in the you tube / go pro videos. There are other valid ways to enjoy trails. And honestly, if that's the kind of riding you want to do, the bike's geometry is going to be more limiting than anything.

My best 1" fork is an air-sprung 2006 SID that I cut apart and re-built usind a bolt-on judy crown. That's a lot trouble though and, again, the 28.6 stancions are limiting for hard core trail riding.

The suspension-corrected Carver forks that are available on ebay right now are one of the best, readily available, inexpensive rigid options we've ever had.

Keeping the bonty is a worthwhile goal but unless you get lucky and find some high-end and lightly used sus fork on ebay, my personal suggestion would be to go rigid with the biggest, cushiest tire (2.5, 2.6?) tire you can fit, slow down a tiny bit, and put the savings toward a second, modern, all-mountain geo bike for crazy downhill stuff.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

If you can find a replacement coil spring set to replace the Indy type 2 setup, that might be the best option. Coil springs last and work well. That's what I did with my 95 Judy XC's when the elastomers turned to chalk. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## polomanH2O (Aug 18, 2018)

Good suggestions, thanks

iamkeith - I like the "don't be a sucker for the propoganda" vibe. Not a true retro-grouch, but I may jury rig the fork for a trial and get a Carver fork. Would have to get the headset taken care of at LBS, but eBay cro-mo forks are in the price range.

fatchanceti - looks like 410 mm, but I don't plan to switch to disc 

kenjihara - Replacement elastomers/MCUs are availalbe - would a coils be a real improvement? If so, is there any guide to swaps: size, spring rate, dampers? DIY or check with LBS?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

polomanH2O said:


> Replacement elastomers/MCUs are availalbe - would a coils be a real improvement? If so, is there any guide to swaps: size, spring rate, dampers? DIY or check with LBS?


If you go with looking for replacement fork parts, my suggestion is to avoid replacing the internals with coil springs. Elastomers have natural damping (a slow return to their unsprung state), coil springs do not. Unless you find a spring kit that included oil damping, adding a coil spring creates a pogo stick on your bike (not unlike a WalMart bike). A rigid fork would be way better than a coil fork without damping.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Finally scored one of these. Have been looking forever for one. Been harder to find than switchblade forks.


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## Mr. Claus (Oct 5, 2015)

Hmmm, interesting item, can't say I've ever seen one, about what year were those made? Oh and where did it pop up from? Enjoy...they look sweet


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Mr. Claus said:


> Hmmm, interesting item, can't say I've ever seen one, about what year were those made? Oh and where did it pop up from? Enjoy...they look sweet


Ebay. I've only seen 2 of them for sale in roughly 6 years of watching. My guess is they came out late 90's likely when the other titec made flat crowbars were being produced. I haven't been able to pinpoint an exact year on them. If anyone has the details I'd love to know.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

Bump... Thread has had no new posts in far to long.

-jw


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## ronaldmiles (Jan 26, 2019)

Another bump to keep things alive. My '97 Race Lite in Vermont. Currently Sram XX but I got a new, modern ride so this is about to be cleaned up and rebuilt with the original M950 XTR from back in the day.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

A couple of pics of my Privateer and Race Lite. In these days where big travel bikes with carbon fiber or hydroformed aluminum frames are the norm for every kind of off-road riding, the Bontragers still shine as the essence of all that's really needed for simple single track riding.


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## davee5 (Jul 16, 2016)

If you're still looking for a decent, period correct, 1" fork a 1998 Marzocchi Z2 just popped up on craigslist in San Jose, CA. $150, looks like it's in good shape.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/bop/d/san-jose-1998-marzocchi-z2-atom-bomb/6808534780.html


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## ronaldmiles (Jan 26, 2019)

*Some mid-winter photos of my newly restored Race Lite*

Mostly M950 XTR, as it was when I originally bought it in 1997. It had a Judy SL at that point though, instead of the SID I bought in 1999. The wheels are CrossMax SLs from 2003 and the crank is an M952 9spd, which looks slightly different than the original, but close enough. Decals from Gil at retrodecal.co.uk. Powdercoat is original - a little (well, a lot) Brasso really brought the shine out.


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Nice work, that bike looks a lot like my RL, wish I had that Sid though!!🙂 My Judy has a Risse cartridge which helps, but still running elastomers which are pretty dead feeling.


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## boots (Aug 15, 2008)

I went with new technology on Bonty. Eagle NX on my '96 Privateer. Parents bought it brand new for me for my 15th birthday and it has sentimental value to me so I finally brought it back to life.









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

boots said:


> I went with new technology on Bonty. Eagle NX on my '96 Privateer. Parents bought it brand new for me for my 15th birthday and it has sentimental value to me so I finally brought it back to life.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Love it!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## davee5 (Jul 16, 2016)

I threw a Z3 BAM on my 97 ti lite a while ago but the springs are mucho soft for my fat arse. So I keep cruising ebay for NOS springs.

Ran across this today, in case anybody wants a "new" build of a longer travel 'zoke in 1". Intriguing, anyway: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Marzocchi-MX-PRO-Air-w-1-steerer-Custom-build-Set-up/173849733459


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## looper (Jul 26, 2004)

I am getting ready to put my vintage Bontrager collection up for sale in the classifieds. I have a Road Lite, a CX and olden Paul Sodoff of Rock Lobster modified modified race lite, all size XL. I will post pics soon, please give me a shout with any interest.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

looper said:


> I am getting ready to put my vintage Bontrager collection up for sale in the classifieds. I have a Road Lite, a CX and olden Paul Sodoff of Rock Lobster modified modified race lite, all size XL. I will post pics soon, please give me a shout with any interest.


Got pics? In what way is the race lite modified?


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

looper said:


> I am getting ready to put my vintage Bontrager collection up for sale in the classifieds. I have a Road Lite, a CX and olden Paul Sodoff of Rock Lobster modified modified race lite, all size XL. I will post pics soon, please give me a shout with any interest.


Post pics for sure.


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## banjor (Dec 8, 2015)

davee5 said:


> I threw a Z3 BAM on my 97 ti lite a while ago but the springs are mucho soft for my fat arse. So I keep cruising ebay for NOS springs.


A while back I purchased a couple of lots of Marzocchi '96-01 Bomber and 90's Rock Shox Mag/Judy/SID springs and replacement parts from Hippie Tech and a European parts seller that shut down.

If anyone on this forum needs springs or parts for Judy or Bomber Z1/Z2/Z3, etc. forks, I'll let them go for less than eBay sellers. I have several Bontrager bikes with various forks, but I don't need all these parts and springs, especially the heavy ones. This isn't meant to be a commercial post, my only motivation is to help keeps these great bikes on the road.

I also have the tools to install bushings in Judy/SID forks, and some spare knobs and caps and things. Send me a PM if you need anything, please don't reply in the forum.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

laffeaux said:


> I've got a couple on Bontragers built up and finally meased the forks. 410mm is probably amout right fir a rigid fork.
> 
> I have a 2000 Rock Shox SID (~440mm) and a 2003 Marzocchi Marathon (~470mm) on my bikes. The SID is perfect. The Marathon is too long and the bike handles less well. Going down to 410mm is probably pretty close to where the SID rides on the trail.


Hey laffeaux, hopefully you'll see this.

Did you have the Extension Control Cartridge (ECC) in your Marathon fork?

I'm wondering if this is one way to provide lowered climbability when "locked down" but also allow more travel when headed downhill.

Anyone else know of this option, or used it?


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

A couple of months ago I got this one for my wife. Its obvious a Privateer build in 1998 with a 1 1/8 headtube. Some pics for now:





It came with the original Judy and Dia.Compe headset and I will build it mostly with parts I have around...

Cheers,
Marco


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

caemis said:


> A couple of months ago I got this one for my wife. Its obvious a Privateer build in 1998 with a 1 1/8 headtube. Some pics for now:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice. I just finished a fully rigid SS build on the same frame, mine's a 1in though. I'll have to post a picture. This and the rasta are the only 1-1/8in frames that I've seen but they both came in 1in as well.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

jestep said:


> Nice. I just finished a fully rigid SS build on the same frame, mine's a 1in though. I'll have to post a picture. This and the rasta are the only 1-1/8in frames that I've seen but they both came in 1in as well.


Yeah, post some pics. This one will be a Singlespeed as well but I will try the Judy first (rather my wife). I think these 1 1/8" Bontis are pretty rare...


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

caemis said:


> Yeah, post some pics. This one will be a Singlespeed as well but I will try the Judy first (rather my wife). I think these 1 1/8" Bontis are pretty rare...


Ignore the crazy steerer shim height. I hadn't messed with this short of a stem before with this frame and bar combo so didn't want to cut it until I figured out what I want to do with it.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Does anyone have the grey paint with blue decals colorway that was likely from mid 90s ish? If so please post up! I remember seeing one in a shop years ago but couldn't find any pics online.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Does anyone have the grey paint with blue decals colorway that was likely from mid 90s ish? If so please post up! I remember seeing one in a shop years ago but couldn't find any pics online.


It may have been someone putting non-standard stickers on it, the ti lite has a blue paw print as well but I'm assuming that's not what you're talking about. I have a grey one with the yellow and black stickers, but I think that one was fairly common.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

jestep said:


> It may have been someone putting non-standard stickers on it, the ti lite has a blue paw print as well but I'm assuming that's not what you're talking about. I have a grey one with the yellow and black stickers, but I think that one was fairly common.


I am fairly certain it was an original option. The one I saw was in late 90's in a shop, and I saw one on craigslist a year or two ago in a too small size.

I just looked in 1997 catalog and I think its this:


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Selling my Carver 1" rigid fork thought someone here might be interested as it's a good 1" rigid option. It's the 410 A2C some have spoke of in this thread. Anyone interested? If so, make me a reasonable offer. It's threadless and ~10-10.5 inches of steer tube.

Sorry i dunno how to upload pics using my phone but can email if anybody is interested.


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

since this thread came up, there is an almost minty bontrager road lite with dura ace listed for sale on velocipedesalon.com right now. Size large I believe.

https://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f3/fs-nos-bontrager-road-lite-size-l-52324.html


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## cjbiker (Jan 11, 2016)

This thread brings back memories. I had to dig up these old photos. If memory serves, this was a 1998 Privateer S that I bought as a left-over in 1999. It was a bit small for me, and the stock seatpost was too short, so I had them swap it for the longer Ritchey post. I got plenty of ribbing for a Ritchey post on a Bontrager!

I sold it 2003ish on eBay.


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## ranberry7 (May 25, 2019)

Hey All - Hope I'm posting this kind of question in the correct thread. Can anyone help identify the year and model of this Bontrager frame? I believe it to be a mid 90's pre-Trek , steel frame Race Lite. Numbers stamped on the rear hangers are 0510 and 0600. Bought and rode it way back when, just can't remember the details! I'm looking to sell it and want to make sure to provide the right info for buyers.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

ranberry7 said:


> Hey All - Hope I'm posting this kind of question in the correct thread. Can anyone help identify the year and model of this Bontrager frame? I believe it to be a mid 90's pre-Trek , steel frame Race Lite. Numbers stamped on the rear hangers are 0510 and 0600. Bought and rode it way back when, just can't remember the details! I'm looking to sell it and want to make sure to provide the right info for buyers.


As stated many times before, you can not determine the year and/or modell by the frame number. Still, it is possible because of different markers:

a) seatstays are one piece - 1997/98 (not pre Trek! but made in Santa Cruz)
b) no pulley on the seattube for the FD - at least 1994 if I am not mistaken, but because of the seatstays that doesnt really matter
c) the headtube is not recessed, therefore its a Race and not a Race Lite

So my conclusion: you have one of the last Santa Cruz made Bontrager Race frames from 1997/98.

But be aware, price wise Bontrager frames are usually [aka reality not ebay] sold for around 300$ if not less pending on overall shape, etc.

Cheers


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Unless they're absolutely pristine, $300 is a huge stretch these days. I was only able to get about $225 including shipping for my 95 race lite frame about a year ago. Seems like unless it's a ti lite or a super rare earlier model, horizontal dropouts for example, their value is the lowest it's ever been.


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

jestep said:


> Unless they're absolutely pristine, $300 is a huge stretch these days. I was only able to get about $225 including shipping for my 95 race lite frame about a year ago. Seems like unless it's a ti lite or a super rare earlier model, horizontal dropouts for example, their value is the lowest it's ever been.


You're probably right ...


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## rainerhale (Jul 17, 2019)

*Reviving this thread with a new old bike!*

Hey all, I was gifted this old Bontrager frame and after reading through this thread, I've come to realize that it's probably nicer than the Privateer I thought it was, and is more likely an early 90's, Santa Cruz, pre-Trek, Race Lite! I bought a cheapo Sunlite fork before I understood better what I had unfortunately, so forgive the crass aesthetics. I threw some random parts on just so I could check sizing, it might get a nicer rebuild down the line.

Can anyone confirm for me what I've got? Also, anyone have any cool old rigid forks that'd pair nicely with it?

Features of note: relieved headtube, segmented seatstays, front derailleur pulley, anti-suck mount, gussets galore.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

Link for your pics seems broken. Can´t see them


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## rainerhale (Jul 17, 2019)

Ah Imgur is blocked on this forum? Bizarre. Tried to upload directly and that didn't work either, heres the imgur album link!


http://imgur.com/5NxSh0b


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

rainerhale said:


> Ah Imgur is blocked on this forum? Bizarre. Tried to upload directly and that didn't work either, heres the imgur album link!
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/5NxSh0b


93 or 94 racelite by my estimation, definitely a racelite though. It has the front derailleur pulley threading which I believe was gone in 95'ish, but the recessed headtube is only on the racelites.


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## atown bikes (Jan 21, 2016)

*Bontrager Mountain bike*

Im not sure if this is how to post something in this forum but I have come across a Vintage Bontrager and would like to find out some more info about it, any help would be appreciated.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

atown bikes said:


> Im not sure if this is how to post something in this forum but I have come across a Vintage Bontrager and would like to find out some more info about it, any help would be appreciated.


That doesn't look like any bontrager frame I can think of, but if it is, it's going to be something super early, like late 80's with the fillets and the seatpost clamp. The fact the sticker is on crooked makes me think someone just threw it on there. Maybe a late 70's to mid 80's ritchey?


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## rainerhale (Jul 17, 2019)

Awesome, thanks for info!


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## caemis (Dec 12, 2015)

My wifes Bontrager in bikepacking mode ...


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

Bro I'm so stoked right now. Just picked this up from an absolute legend!









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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

4AM said:


> Bro I'm so stoked right now. Just picked this up from an absolute legend!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Awesome. Looks like it's in great condition. There's a NOS one on ebay I've been watching, but way too expensive IMO.


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## 4AM (Jun 6, 2017)

jestep said:


> Awesome. Looks like it's in great condition.


From afar it looks great, up close there is a crack on the seat tube weld between the actual seat tube and the seatpost sleeve:








I emailed Ti Cycles yesterday about repair... Haven't heard back from them yet but I hope it is easy.

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## MrOrange (Jun 21, 2004)

atown bikes said:


> Im not sure if this is how to post something in this forum but I have come across a Vintage Bontrager and would like to find out some more info about it, any help would be appreciated.


Legit. Brazed early one. Probably mid 80's. Salsa Portage strap.


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## paetersen (Jul 28, 2007)

Took the geared orange bike out to play in the rain.


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## old school 27 (Mar 9, 2017)

*mid 1980"s Bontrager*



atown bikes said:


> Im not sure if this is how to post something in this forum but I have come across a Vintage Bontrager and would like to find out some more info about it, any help would be appreciated.


Looks like one of his mid 80 cyclocross bikes. I had Keith make me a custom mountain Bike frame back in 1987 and it's all filet brazed like the bike you have. I haven't been able to find but a couple of examples on the internet that he made this way. I also have a lot of his early paper work he gave out on ordering custom bikes, fit guides and price lists etc. Attached is a pict of the bike I still have. Over the years most the parts were replaced but are still pretty vintage.


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## Zracre1 (Nov 9, 2015)

I just pulled this down from my bike cave area. I'm trying to get some general info on it. Toying with the idea of building a vintage ish gravel/cx bike..


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

Zracre1 said:


> I just pulled this down from my bike cave area. I'm trying to get some general info on it. Toying with the idea of building a vintage ish gravel/cx bike..
> 
> View attachment 1322739


Late 80's to early 90's, cant remember the steel but these were top end hand built bikes and would make a great cruiser or CX/gravel bike. They still have value as well, roughly $900 - $1000 for the fork and frame, which is way more than even racelites, if you do ever decide to part with it. Personally I would build it up and enjoy it, absolutely a classic.

Google images may be one of the better places to find info these days, the main search results are difficult on the more obscure stuff like this.


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## 1 cog frog (Dec 21, 2004)

I hate to even post this. A teacher at my school sent me this pic of a tandem project he started during quarantine. It made me a little nauseous.









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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

1 cog frog said:


> I hate to even post this. A teacher at my school sent me this pic of a tandem project he started during quarantine. It made me a little nauseous.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I just died a little seeing this... I saved up for an entire summer in 8th'ish grade and bought this same bike which I still have.

Mine in its current form.


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## Zracre1 (Nov 9, 2015)

I will get a few more photos up. Thanks for the info! Didnt realize it had that much value. It is pretty mint.


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## 1 cog frog (Dec 21, 2004)

jestep said:


> I just died a little seeing this... I saved up for an entire summer in 8th'ish grade and bought this same bike which I still have.
> 
> Mine in its current form.
> 
> View attachment 1323055


I know! I like yours 10000000000000000000x more!

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## cjbiker (Jan 11, 2016)

1 cog frog said:


> I hate to even post this. A teacher at my school sent me this pic of a tandem project he started during quarantine. It made me a little nauseous.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wow, that's sickening. I hope you told him that was a big mistake. Millions of crap MTBs rotting away, and chops up a Bontrager? Ugh.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Zracre1 said:


> I just pulled this down from my bike cave area. I'm trying to get some general info on it. Toying with the idea of building a vintage ish gravel/cx bike..
> 
> View attachment 1322739


Nice!!

I still have my Bonty CX and take it out occasionally. The only less than ideal thing with these frames is the rear tire clearance. There are many newer wider high-volume tires being made today that won't fit on these bikes. If you only want a 32 or 33mm tires you are set. But if you try and put on a 38mm tire, it won't work on the rear.


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## 1 cog frog (Dec 21, 2004)

cjbiker said:


> Wow, that's sickening. I hope you told him that was a big mistake. Millions of crap MTBs rotting away, and chops up a Bontrager? Ugh.


I did. He didn't know any better. He got it at a garage sale or off the local classifieds I think. He just needed something steel.

I wish I'd known before he chopped it up, I would have bought it and given him something worth cutting up.

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## Zracre1 (Nov 9, 2015)

Another picture


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## looper (Jul 26, 2004)

*Bontis going up for sale*

I have a few vintage Bontragers going up for sale if anyone is interested all are XL. I have a Road Lite, CX and a Race Lite. tomlapinski at hotmail


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Slowly coming along. For some reason the top tube decal is white on a silver backgroundand the down tube decal is silver on a white background.










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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

*Bontrager Ti Lite*

Hi, to all all on this thread. I have just pulled out of storage Ti Lite that I bought new and haven't used in a number of years- It is basically all original in very little used shape, the only thing i changed on it was the last time I used it I put on 1.25 tires as I used it as a street bike in NYC. Now I am trying to decide what to do with it. i like that it is rather small and easy to haul in the car. i am thinking of possibly going electric or 1x11speed. Any ideas on what to do with it?


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## datasurfer (Nov 24, 2006)

If it IS a size small I may be interested in it should ¥ou sell it. you can contact me at [email protected]



lightstrum said:


> Hi, to all all on this thread. I have just pulled out of storage Ti Lite that I bought new and haven't used in a number of years- It is basically all original in very little used shape, the only thing i changed on it was the last time I used it I put on 1.25 tires as I used it as a street bike in NYC. Now I am trying to decide what to do with it. i like that it is rather small and easy to haul in the car. i am thinking of possibly going electric or 1x11speed. Any ideas on what to do with it?


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

As a past owner of a ti-lite I can say it was one of my favorites set up as a hardtail with a Marzocchi short travel super fly fork. I have gone the route of street oriented fatboys on vintage frames and I am at a point where I hate to see that street vintage anymore, as most of these bikes can still be great fun on smoother single track.

I would freshen it up with a newer wheelset and lighter tubeless mtb tires, equip the bike w/1x drivetrain (even an 11-34 xtr works great and the Shimano xtr SL-m970 rear shifter is one of the best imho). I have used this combo on more than a few vintage frames and it’s worked out well. The 10 (11-36) and 11 setup would get you a clutch style rear derailleur though, and match that to a big/little 34 tooth ring on the front and you would have a nice setup. For comparison I am running a SRAM 1x10 on my 29er Vassago Verhauen and it’s 11-36 XO x 38 up front and that’s precise super reliable and simple while also covering a great range of gear options.

This is just my thought process and may not align with your thoughts at all, but having done this with various Bontragers, Gt Zaskars, and various other 90’s vintage bikes I thought I would reply.

I would also consider going with a rigid front fork if your body can stand it. The result will be an agile bike that can be run fast on a lot of single track and if you want to jump back to your old wheels with street tires it will translate nicely with the gear range and bike weight.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

lightstrum said:


> Hi, to all all on this thread. I have just pulled out of storage Ti Lite that I bought new and haven't used in a number of years- It is basically all original in very little used shape, the only thing i changed on it was the last time I used it I put on 1.25 tires as I used it as a street bike in NYC. Now I am trying to decide what to do with it. i like that it is rather small and easy to haul in the car. i am thinking of possibly going electric or 1x11speed. Any ideas on what to do with it?


I don´t like 1x. A 2x9 or 2x10 makes a lot more sense to me. If you want slicks go w/ compass rat trap 2.3 tires and experience state of the art supple tires; it will cost you but i would rather spend on good tires than new shimano drivetrains.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

lightstrum said:


> Hi, to all all on this thread. I have just pulled out of storage Ti Lite that I bought new and haven't used in a number of years- It is basically all original in very little used shape, the only thing i changed on it was the last time I used it I put on 1.25 tires as I used it as a street bike in NYC. Now I am trying to decide what to do with it. i like that it is rather small and easy to haul in the car. i am thinking of possibly going electric or 1x11speed. Any ideas on what to do with it?


If you decide to go electric, please just sell it and grab something else with what you make from it. Not going to get into any sort of existential debate, but it' such a classic bike, someone will still ride it as intended and you can make money in the process.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

jestep said:


> If you decide to go electric, please just sell it and grab something else with what you make from it. Not going to get into any sort of existential debate, but it' such a classic bike, someone will still ride it as intended and you can make money in the process.


This^^^.


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## 1 cog frog (Dec 21, 2004)

lightstrum said:


> Hi, to all all on this thread. I have just pulled out of storage Ti Lite that I bought new and haven't used in a number of years- It is basically all original in very little used shape, the only thing i changed on it was the last time I used it I put on 1.25 tires as I used it as a street bike in NYC. Now I am trying to decide what to do with it. i like that it is rather small and easy to haul in the car. i am thinking of possibly going electric or 1x11speed. Any ideas on what to do with it?


Pics? Lots of interest here I'm sure!

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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

Hey, thanks for this. I was unaware of these tires but this may get me back into this bike, I never liked it with the skinny tires but road it more on the road and the old knobbys were too slow- this sounds great. What do you think of the new 5100 1x11 or 2x11 for this? And any idea how to but a drop bar on to this?


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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

N10S said:


> As a past owner of a ti-lite I can say it was one of my favorites set up as a hardtail with a Marzocchi short travel super fly fork. I have gone the route of street oriented fatboys on vintage frames and I am at a point where I hate to see that street vintage anymore, as most of these bikes can still be great fun on smoother single track.
> 
> I would freshen it up with a newer wheelset and lighter tubeless mtb tires, equip the bike w/1x drivetrain (even an 11-34 xtr works great and the Shimano xtr SL-m970 rear shifter is one of the best imho). I have used this combo on more than a few vintage frames and it's worked out well. The 10 (11-36) and 11 setup would get you a clutch style rear derailleur though, and match that to a big/little 34 tooth ring on the front and you would have a nice setup. For comparison I am running a SRAM 1x10 on my 29er Vassago Verhauen and it's 11-36 XO x 38 up front and that's precise super reliable and simple while also covering a great range of gear options.
> 
> ...


New wheelset and lighter tubeless mtb tires- Like what? I just looked into the compass rat trap 2.3 in the other answer- that seems like a good way to go. Any idea how to put drop bars on to this?


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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

1 cog frog said:


> Pics? Lots of interest here I'm sure!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I will get them up soon.


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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

colker1 said:


> This^^^.


The electric thing is just passing lazy ass thought- what has me interested is the newer tires the 2.3 rat traps may just be what this old rat neees to get rolling again.


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## lightstrum (May 3, 2020)

datasurfer said:


> If it IS a size small I may be interested in it should ¥ou sell it. you can contact me at [email protected]


It is not a small. Thx.


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

lightstrum said:


> New wheelset and lighter tubeless mtb tires- Like what? I just looked into the compass rat trap 2.3 in the other answer- that seems like a good way to go. Any idea how to put drop bars on to this?


Drop bars? Not difficult. Chose the bars you want then check their diameter: most new ones are 31.8. So next you will have to find a stem to place your bars where they need to be. There are fewer stems which raise the bars tall enough for comfort but they are there. You may have to buy diff lengths and rises till you find what you need so go w/ the cheapest stem possible. They are all ahead stems: if you have a threaded steerer you will need an adapter and that´s super easy to find. Next you will have to buy brake levers, shifters, cables.
If it were me i would go w/ a Jones bar which flares enough to mimic the lower drops. You get to keep your brake levers and shifters There are a myriad of different bars these days. The hardest part is findind the right stem length,


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## N10S (Sep 27, 2004)

Regarding the "newer, lighter wheelset" new is relative to the Bontrager. I have used Mavic Crossmax and Crossland wheel sets and they are both very light and tubeless. I ran both at different times on my ti-lite. There are really a lot of nice wheelset options out there and custom builds with Chris King or even XTR hubs are nice options. As far as the handlebars go I have had many of my 26 and 29 rigid and hardtail bikes set-up with flared drop bars. Personally I like the feel of the On-One Midge flared drop bar. I had one of the original WTB dirt drop bars and the Midge is very close in bend and feel. Its a great option with bar end shifters, I typically just roll with a shimano 1x9 using a single Dura Ace bar end rear shifter and an 11-34 XT or XTR cassette. The Midge bar is available in 25.4 and 31.8 and for me the latter feels more laterally stiff and is a bit lighter than the 25.4 version. Here is a recent example I had last year on a Raleigh Furley. The stem is a Velo Orange Cigne 90mm and has a removable 31.8mm faceplate. Worked great with the Midge and the 1x set-up. This is perfect if you like riding in the drops as opposed to the brake hoods. According to the folks I emailed with at Velo Orange this stem can be used with their quill adapter for those with a 1" threaded headset.















Another option is what I have on my 89 Bianchi Axis, which is a quill dirt drop style riser stem. This pic shows the stock set-up (fresh tape ) and this stem and bar according to my micrometer are 25.4 although some are 26.0 depending on the stem you find. This one also has a roller which is a bit different than precious ones I have used which just have a through-hole to route the cable through the stem iirc.This set-up requires less work but finding a flared 25.4 bar is getting tougher these days.









I got a look at those Rat Trap Tires and really like those. Did not realize those existed. I could imagine a drop bar 1x ti-lite with those tires set-up tubeless. Go with a ti syncros seatpost and a ti railed brooks swallow and you are good to go!


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## cbmarb (Jun 13, 2020)

Just had to post because it gives me so much pleasure. Found behind a thrift store covered with punk stickers. Was destined for the metals bin. They insisted that I give them a nominal donation of $5 for it. When I peeled off the stickers, holy ****! It is a medium, but they must run small. I bought a new Thomson seat post for it. Has a Chris King headset, and Marzocchi bomber fork. I just replaced the seals.

Love it!


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

cbmarb said:


> Just had to post because it gives me so much pleasure. Found behind a thrift store covered with punk stickers. Was destined for the metals bin. They insisted that I give them a nominal donation of $5 for it. When I peeled off the stickers, holy ****! It is a medium, but they must run small. I bought a new Thomson seat post for it. Has a Chris King headset, and Marzocchi bomber fork. I just replaced the seals.
> 
> Love it!


It´s a small.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

colker1 said:


> It´s a small.


Definitely a small. I have that exact frame that I rebuilt up for my mom during the shutdown here about a month ago. Still a wonderful bike, I'd ride it, small, medium, or large!


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## cbmarb (Jun 13, 2020)

Yeah, remeasured it properly. Disappointing, but since it is comfortable, has enough seatpost depth, and handles well on the trail, I guess the size is not so important.


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## bike_or_hike (Jul 19, 2020)

*Bontrager OR value?*

My wife would like to sell her Bontrager OR mountain bike circa 1992, serial # 0630. I am trying to determine its value. Can anyone provide some insight as to what it might be worth?


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

bike_or_hike said:


> My wife would like to sell her Bontrager OR mountain bike circa 1992, serial # 0630. I am trying to determine its value. Can anyone provide some insight as to what it might be worth?


That´s nice: 2 piece seatstays.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

97 Privateer Comp. So much fun.









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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Late model Racelite.









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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

I've ridden more off-road this summer than I have in a long time.









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## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

My wifes medium Bonty Race, 92-93 vintage, my best guess based on sleeved stays, roller and TIG'd guides. It has been a geared bike, singlespeed, mudguarded commuter and now back to its best form...singlespeed.

Powder coat polished up and new decals from Gil at RetroDecals. New forks built to correct spec (419mm A-C / 38 offset and 1" threaded) by Lee Cooper and powder coated black to match.

Nitto bullmoose bar/stem combo because TIG steel! ESI grips, Control Tech Cantis with new Shimano flat bar canti brake levers which are very reminiscent of the old Deore levers. Brakes are a PITA to set up and I might need to switch pads to Kool Stop Thin Line v-pads to get the angle right.

Deore cranks running a 36t ring and an 18th sprocket at the back for perfect singlespeed tension. Hoops are Sun CR18 running on XT hubs. Halo Twin Rail tyres for all round use, she has a custom 29er hardtail for "proper" off road.

Only bad news is that the Control Tech post is seized in the frame, once my daughter approaches needing a 26" wheel (probably soon as she is on a 24" aged 6 and a half!) I'll caustic soda the hell out of it and get the frame re-powder coated


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

Hope to have this little beauty in my hands shortly (who knows, perhaps the nice gentlemen selling to me is on here as well). XS, looks like an early 90s frame with the square logos and segented seat tube and Mag 20 w/Bontrager specific crown. Condition looks "very nice". Will be my first Bonty (building for my son as the 16.5" trek I was hoping to move him into is still too big):


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

finished. for now.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Singlespeedpunk said:


> View attachment 1383237
> 
> 
> My wifes medium Bonty Race, 92-93 vintage, my best guess based on sleeved stays, roller and TIG'd guides. It has been a geared bike, singlespeed, mudguarded commuter and now back to its best form...singlespeed.
> ...


How much did the fork cost?

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## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

kenjihara said:


> How much did the fork cost?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


With plain black powder coat the forks were £200GBP so less than original Bonty forks go for on Ebay!


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

I don't have my race lite anymore, but thought others here might be interested in bontrager fork:









Bontrager Switchblade carbon mtn fork, 26” - bicycle parts - by...


Bontrager Switchblade Carbon mountain bike fork in excellent shape. Crown race not included, 7 and 3/4” steerer. For 1 1/8” frames, and 26” wheels.



sfbay.craigslist.org


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

alex-henson said:


> I don't have my race lite anymore, but thought others here might be interested in bontrager fork:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well I take that back. Wasn't my post, but I guess it got flagged.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Well I take that back. Wasn't my post, but I guess it got flagged.


Still for sale if you search for it on the sfbay craigslist. Not really vintage, it's a newer Trek part. And 1 1/8" wouldn't work on a classic Bonti frame.

-jw


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

GrumpyOne said:


> Still for sale if you search for it on the sfbay craigslist. Not really vintage, it's a newer Trek part. And 1 1/8" wouldn't work on a classic Bonti frame.
> 
> -jw


Oh well what are ya gonna do


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## 76Binder (May 6, 2004)

97 Privateer - bought new 01/06/98 in Las Vegas


XTR drivetrain
Chris King headset
Raceface cranks/rings
Ti BB
Front wheel w/King hub, Bonty Valiant Ceramic hoops, DT Rev spokes (radially laced)
Rear wheel w/King hub, Bonty Asym Ceramic hoop, (3 cross drive side/radial non-drive rear)
XTR Ti 12-32 cassette
Raceface bar
Terry Fly Ti saddle
Magura MM85xc fork (so sad when my Marzocchi SuperFly died)
Stock Bonty stem and seatpost
ODI grips

I still have the original receipt, original owners manual, and just about every receipt for every part I've put on this bike for the past 23yrs.

Still the bike I choose to ride over any others in my stable. I still love the way this rides!


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

76Binder said:


> 97 Privateer - bought new 01/06/98 in Las Vegas
> 
> 
> XTR drivetrain
> ...


Was this one of the few ones with a 1 1/8 headset, that fork is awesome, didn't think they ever made a 1in though.


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## 76Binder (May 6, 2004)

Yeah it’s a 1-1/8" headtube


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## radrider (Jul 12, 2018)

Just finished...I'm in love..
Bontrager privateer comp "Rasta"
Bomber super fly fork
Bontrager race lite wheelset with Chris King hubs(thickened flanges for radial lacing)
Bontrager revolt super X tires
Race face IB forged with green "clover" spider
TWP Rasta chain guide
Avid Supreme Ultimate brake set
Kooka billet stem


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## radrider (Jul 12, 2018)

added red altek levers...and painted the crown black.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Has anyone with a Lg race lite with vertical dropouts gone 650b? I have a fork that will accommodate but wasn't sure on the rear.

I saw some 650b in this thread with the horizontal dropouts, but didn't see others.

Or alternatively, does anyone know a modern-ish 26" rim at least 22i and tubeless that's not terribly expensive? Ideally, I'd do a cliffhanger but their retail is more than I want to spend. 650b rim options are mo better in this regard.


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Or alternatively, does anyone know a modern-ish 26" rim at least 22i and tubeless that's not terribly expensive? Ideally, I'd do a cliffhanger but their retail is more than I want to spend. 650b rim options are mo better in this regard.


Going to be almost impossible to find if they do exist. ZTR 355 immediately comes to mind, but finding rim brake versions is damn near impossible. I have an ebay alert going on 6 years now and I've seen 1 in that time. There were a few others, I think DT had one, maybe Shimano XT for a year or two, likely some Mavic from 2010'ish, but nothing is readily available these days.


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## alex-henson (May 6, 2016)

Ya I know. I didn't note it, but my intention is to go disc front, nothing rear so I don't have to find a modern rim brake rim. It's a town / light trail bike after all so that'll be enough braking. That should open options up more I figure.


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## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

I used Pacenti rims on the Slingshot I converted to 650B a few years ago, here's a current version of what they offer









Brevet wheel set 650b rim brake Shimano


650b Vintage wheelset Shimano or Campagnolo compatible. Hand built in NC USA, with new large flange hubs and Sapim leader spokes.




pacenticycledesign.com


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## Ernie577 (Jun 2, 2021)

banjor said:


> A while back I purchased a couple of lots of Marzocchi '96-01 Bomber and 90's Rock Shox Mag/Judy/SID springs and replacement parts from Hippie Tech and a European parts seller that shut down.
> 
> If anyone on this forum needs springs or parts for Judy or Bomber Z1/Z2/Z3, etc. forks, I'll let them go for less than eBay sellers. I have several Bontrager bikes with various forks, but I don't need all these parts and springs, especially the heavy ones. This isn't meant to be a commercial post, my only motivation is to help keeps these great bikes on the road.
> 
> I also have the tools to install bushings in Judy/SID forks, and some spare knobs and caps and things. Send me a PM if you need anything, please don't reply in the forum.


This is a complete long shot - but here goes. I have a Race Frame from the 90's (SC) that I am trying to keep alive.
Having a very hard time finding 1" steer tube shocks. I found a Judy XC from what looks like 1996-7. Do you still have any spare parts left? Please let me know. Thanks!


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## Ernie577 (Jun 2, 2021)

While I’m here,- I am looking for some shocks for my 90’s Race Frame (SC)
I am having a hard time deciding what to do. Suggestions on what will work and is available are appreciated.

Does anyone on here have a 1” steer tube RockShox (or the like) that will work on my frame they want to sell?

what is the approximate or average length that a steer tube needs to be cut on Race Frame?
Is 8” enough? (here come the bad jokes)

Thanks and I am glad that I found this thread.

Keith really knew what he was doing. It’s good to know that there are so many of these frames still in use.


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## Ernie577 (Jun 2, 2021)

Here's some good news that I found for anyone looking to put a 1 1/8" Shock on a 1" steer tube. This guy makes an insert that he can press into a 1 1/8" crown that reduces it to 1". Blue Liquid Labs | An Oliver Majewski Project Very reasonably priced too.


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## al415 (Mar 17, 2007)

Avert your eyes purists...


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

al415 said:


> Avert your eyes purists...


If they're still being ridden and enjoyed, I don't think anyone cares at this point, with some exceptions... What fork is that?


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## al415 (Mar 17, 2007)

jestep said:


> If they're still being ridden and enjoyed, I don't think anyone cares at this point, with some exceptions... What fork is that?


good point. The fork is a Judy variant, but I'm not sure beyond that. I was going to ditch it for a tange but after getting it serviced, the whole package rides really well.


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## radrider (Jul 12, 2018)

Picked up this ole girl for 500canadian.. CK headset. Bontrager Comp fork, 1993 Racelite frame...and salsa moto roller...


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

radrider said:


> View attachment 1937220
> 
> Picked up this ole girl for 500canadian.. CK headset. Bontrager Comp fork, 1993 Racelite frame...and salsa moto roller...


niiiice.


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## kenjihara (Mar 7, 2006)

Okay dudes.

I have been visiting this forum for well over a decade... that's crazy.

I need some help. I may have brought this up before. I've got a pretty well-preserved Race frame I want to sell but for some odd reason it's missing the two water bottle threaded inserts on the downtube.

I'm not sure why that's the case and I'd like to correct the issue before I try and sell it. The seat tube inserts are already in place, although they look like someone installed them. They appear to be M5 rivnuts

I bought a rivnut kit and some M5 rivnuts, but they didn't fit the existing holes. I'm reluctant to drill the holes larger, although I haven't ruled it out. Does anyone know what part I need in terms of these inserts, or who I should contact to figure this out?

Thanks for any help I can get.























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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

kenjihara said:


> Okay dudes.
> 
> I have been visiting this forum for well over a decade... that's crazy.
> 
> ...


Measure your hole. Suppliers will give you the uninstalled dimensions of rivnuts. My guess is that an aluminum one will fit without issues. You should grind/drill/file/whatever those other ones off--they look _bad_.









McMaster-Carr


McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.




www.mcmaster.com





Planish the proud parts of the flanges with a ball-peen hammer when you are done, so they lay flush, then scuff/paint with a white acrylic.


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## bendiamond119 (10 mo ago)

This thread is overdue for a revival. This is a 1996 Privateer Comp which I rode hard for many years. XT build. I've gotten back into mountain biking now with carbon fiber etc etc. but this bike is still very special to me. I researched and researched to try and figure out parts that would work on it. I got a Box 4 groupset, although I love the way some of your single speed builds are looking. I also found the Xotic fork, though I'm honestly not crazy about the way it looks. I got a Canfield crank for my main bike and was shocked to find the GX crank and BB just went right on easy-peasy. I have a mix of different wheels I want to try, one being an old Surly fatbike front wheel with a 2.75 tire. It's disc only though, so I'll need a front brake. Anyone have any luck with a disc brake on the back without welding? For tires, I think something like Maxxis Holy Rollers. I am not sure what the goal is with this bike. I do want to try it trail riding, but not sure. Modern is just so good for that. But this is good in its own way. This is pretty much just a rolling mock-up cause it was getting sad just thrown into a corner of the basement for so long.


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## Rambler1277 (Dec 23, 2018)

I finally put some replacement elastomers in my RST Mozo Pro, which although it's still a little tall for the bike is still better than a Judy and 300% better than the garbage Suntor fork a shop put on for me a few years ago. I bought this in Berkeley around 1995 or 1996 I think; I recall it was one of the last hand-made SC frames. That said I've always been under the impression it was a RaceLite but I read earlier in this thread that all the Races were orange. I don't know, but it's an awesome bike. Minus the frozen seatpost that I literally took a pipe wrench to and it still wouldn't budge and the headset that's in there a little loose, it has no issues (except the decals). The guy I bought it off had this high-angle stem (and a rack...) on it that I've just never replaced, rides just fine. I'm pretty sure the bottom bracket is also rusted shut, but I have no issues with it. Still rides like a dream.


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## bendiamond119 (10 mo ago)

Finally got this bike fully built up and rideable! I'm not super experienced with this kind of thing, so I reused the old brake cables and most of the housings, and then just hooked it all up and it worked! The shifting isn't even that bad either. Definitely want a bigger chainring though.


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## eshew (Jan 30, 2004)

Hehe


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## colker1 (Jan 6, 2004)

alex-henson said:


> Or alternatively, does anyone know a modern-ish 26" rim at least 22i and tubeless that's not terribly expensive? Ideally, I'd do a cliffhanger but their retail is more than I want to spend. 650b rim options are mo better in this regard.


Alex Adventure 2 rims.


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## thatdrewguy (Jul 28, 2009)

Bontrager RaceLite medium size bought in 1992. Anyone interested in putting this bike back into riding condition?


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## ronaldmiles (Jan 26, 2019)

I'm thinking about selling my Santa Cruz built Road Lite (size large, Campy Chorus 10 speed with Mavic wheels and Easton carbon fork). It's in great shape (unfortunately the paint is not original though). I know the mountain bike frames don't go for much these days since the world has moved on from 26" wheels and geometry has changed dramatically, but the Road Light still holds up pretty well. Any thoughts on pricing and/or a place to sell it? Thanks in advance!


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## jestep (Jul 23, 2004)

ronaldmiles said:


> I'm thinking about selling my Santa Cruz built Road Lite (size large, Campy Chorus 10 speed with Mavic wheels and Easton carbon fork). It's in great shape (unfortunately the paint is not original though). I know the mountain bike frames don't go for much these days since the world has moved on from 26" wheels and geometry has changed dramatically, but the Road Light still holds up pretty well. Any thoughts on pricing and/or a place to sell it? Thanks in advance!


I would definitely get a second opinion, but I would be shooting for $1000 or more on it, they and the CX never go for sale so it's hard to guess accurately these days and IMO this is the most versatile frame size. They do still hold value though, the 26in frames, except the ti lites, even the race lites are worth crap now unfortunately, but I can't see any huge decline on these. I guess you're in a bit of a weird area since someone wanting the nostalgia might want the original fork and stem setup, but I think it should still get a good price. Definitely get another opinion or two though, I could be off in either direction.


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## hud56 (Nov 9, 2008)

thatdrewguy said:


> Bontrager RaceLite medium size bought in 1992. Anyone interested in putting this bike back into riding condition?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> ...


I had sent You a message, but did not hear back.


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## thatdrewguy (Jul 28, 2009)

hud56 said:


> I had sent You a message, but did not hear back.


Sent a reply, thanks.


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## br0qn (6 mo ago)

ronaldmiles said:


> I'm thinking about selling my Santa Cruz built Road Lite (size large, Campy Chorus 10 speed with Mavic wheels and Easton carbon fork). It's in great shape (unfortunately the paint is not original though). I know the mountain bike frames don't go for much these days since the world has moved on from 26" wheels and geometry has changed dramatically, but the Road Light still holds up pretty well. Any thoughts on pricing and/or a place to sell it? Thanks in advance!
> View attachment 1991184


Nice one! Did you decide to move it on?


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## ronaldmiles (Jan 26, 2019)

Yes, but I haven't had time to find a place to sell it.


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## eshew (Jan 30, 2004)

Buzzzz!


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## br0qn (6 mo ago)

Here is one of mine. It's an early, inch sized ~'90 OR with some cool details.

-flat top tube
-hand cut gussets
-brazed brake stop with pump peg
-horizontal drops
-riveted cable guides





















more images in this album.

I have a Race and a Race Lite I'm working on too.


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