# "monster 'cross bikes" creeping towards world domination?



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

There seems to be a growing subset of people who ride what Higbee recently (and appropriately, I think) referred to as monster 'cross bikes. These are bikes that land closer to the cyclocross bikes than 29ers, but still sport bigger tires than you generally see on a true cyclocross race bike, and manage to do a fair job at anything but the most technical singletrack. Several examples below.

I'm curious about how this all came to be. Surely Matt Chester had a bit of influence, as well as the other contributors to the 63xc.com site.

More importantly, I'm curious why the people who ride setups like this don't ride a conventional mountain bike or 29er. What is it about skinny(ish) tires and little crotch clearance that rings your bell? For my part, the answer is easy. I came to offroad riding by way of "something to do inbetween touring". Fat tires went on the crosscheck (seen below) and I fell in love. I'm also always trying to keep my bike count to a minimum, so having a commuter, offroader, and touring bike in one was a very attractive notion.

I haven't ridding a true "mountain bike" since I was a kid. It seems like most people who choose a setup like this have a bit more experience with a variety of frame styles, so it can't ALL be ignorance, as in my case.





































(I take it as further evidence of Matt Chester's influence that all of the pictured bikes have midge or dirtdrop bars.)


----------



## gpsser (Jan 5, 2004)

ink1373 said:


> More importantly, I'm curious why the people who ride setups like this don't ride a conventional mountain bike or 29er.


I think that is a pretty blanket statement there. I love the 700x44s on my crosscheck, and riding it fixed off road, but I also love my SS and am building a 29er. Riding the CC off road keeps me honest, makes me think more about what I am doing, and more aware of everything. It is more of a "total experience" minus the sex of course


----------



## Mattman (Feb 2, 2004)

*I tried skinnys or is it fatties*

42s and 44s......I guess they are skinnys on a 29r and fatties on a cyclocross bike. They seem to improve the performance and rideability of the cyclocross bike except maybe for actual racing.

On the 29r they seem to lessen the sluggish acceleration and climbing that the heavy tires cause. I have found that they can be a bit sketchy when railing flat or off camber corners fast on hard pack with a dusting of sand or loose dirt compared to the real 29r tires. I have not tried them yet, but I think the Kenda Kharma 29 tires may be the cats meow, I loved them on my 26" SS bike. Light, fast and grippy at least on my local trails.


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Just _because_?
Because you do not want to do everything the way most others do it?
Because you like the idea of a rigid fork and once you are there you might as well put on the drop bar too? (I did not say road bar)

Cool stuff!


----------



## SS4life (Oct 15, 2004)

for me it was all about riding something that I could do singletrack confidently and being able to ride rough fire roads efficiently. I think that it is going to catch on. It's really a fun ride. I'd like to see what I can do on my Vulture with the 45's on a fast dirt road XC race course. You'd have to be a pretty fast on a mountain bike to stay with one of these on certain types of courses.


----------



## Boe (May 6, 2005)

For me (the guy with the yellow jersey) it's about learning more about riding. I want to explore how far I can take my bikes, and you get to learn so much when riding "wrong" or "stupid" bikes on the trails. Riding becomes more about you, and your experience, than the bike.










Fixed off road was really marvelous, I was amazed on the "trail connectivity". Totaly like sex with the trail.

My old monster Cross Check:
https://farfar.2038.com/bo/bikes/2005-07-29/29.jpg
https://farfar.2038.com/bo/bikes/2005-07-29/17.jpg
https://farfar.2038.com/bo/bikes/2005-07-24/28.jpg
https://farfar.2038.com/bo/bikes/2005-07-17/22.jpg


----------



## Pigtire (Jan 13, 2004)

7 miles to the trail/fireroad so it really maks no sense driving there. Rides are mostly fireroads so what's the perfect ride? Cyclocross! They did not make Crosschecks at that time and my cross would only fit a 38c max but hey, it fits my type of riding and it was a blast.


----------



## brado1 (Oct 5, 2004)

This Dude rocked the Icycle Race last Feb, also did the Night Downhill Race on this bike.


----------



## Higbee (Jan 13, 2004)

I heard the term "monster 'cross" from Wade the Vulture. I really like riding fixed offroad and when ordering my new frame I thought of going the "monster 'cross" style. If I could only have one bike it would be a "monster 'cross" for versatility. Since I don't only have to have one bike I went with more of a mountain bike style frame based on drop bars (lots of standover and EBB for discs). I have a suitalbe road road frame that can be made into a fixie and it will take some 35c tires no problem. The other issue for me is where I ride. Locally I have a lot of deep sand on the trails and a wider tire is nice to have, the same can be said for winter riding on the snow. I also live near the Canadian rockeis where the trails can be very rough and the decents long and steep. Of course I want to try some 44c tires on my bike when I get it! I am very impressed with what people can ride on 'cross bikes and I will get one some day.


----------



## 2xPneu (Jan 26, 2004)

Boe said:


> For me (the guy with the yellow jersey) it's about learning more about riding. I want to explore how far I can take my bikes, and you get to learn so much when riding "wrong" or "stupid" bikes on the trails. Riding becomes more about you, and your experience, than the bike.
> Fixed off road was really marvelous, I was amazed on the "trail connectivity". Totaly like sex with the trail.


Great points, except maybe the sex thing, maybe smooth silky singletrack, but not gnarly rocky technical stuff. That might make your d*** sore.

It'll never reach world domination in this society, because technology buys speed and technology makes everything better.

Given equal bike handling skills/cardiovascular fitness, retro geeks who ride fixed rigid skinny tires offroad can't go as fast as guys with the goods, and in today's world it's who crosses the line first that matters to most people.

The attitude makes the difference, and you put it really well about riding being about you, not the bike. The fact that it's a lot more fun and fulfilling to clean a tough course with a fixed gear and skinny tires than full sus and body armor is irrelevant...RC


----------



## Hjalti (Jan 22, 2004)

*Lovin' this thread.*

I think of my QB as more of a cross than Monster Cross (BTW great name Wade), even though it fits 44s. My as yet to be realized dream bike falls into the monster cross category. Fit up to 52 tires, some (or lots of ) slope to the top tube, disc mounts, but handles like my QB.


----------



## KaiMana (Jan 21, 2004)

What tires are you guys running? I have a cross check and want to move up from 35s to 42-44s, I am looking at the mythos cx.


----------



## Low_Rider (Jan 15, 2004)

I’ve never really been exposed to the whole ‘cross scene, in fact there is no “scene” so to speak of here, but the whole monster 'cross bike idea has really hit a chord with me of late... For some reason the whole idea really appeals to me. 

Fixed? Yeah sure, why not I’m up for a challenge! I would have to start with brakes though I think, and loose them one by one when I gain some confidence – or loose my mind! 

Keep the pics and comments coming!

Dave.


----------



## Boe (May 6, 2005)

KaiMana said:


> What tires are you guys running? I have a cross check and want to move up from 35s to 42-44s, I am looking at the mythos cx.


WTB Mutano raptors. Love them.


----------



## SS4life (Oct 15, 2004)

KaiMana said:


> What tires are you guys running? I have a cross check and want to move up from 35s to 42-44s, I am looking at the mythos cx.


the mythos CX is a great choice in the 700x42. Not a whole loot of knobs but it rolls pretty fast and has some pretty good volume. Another good choice is the panaracer fire cross 45's. Lots of knobs and grips super well.


----------



## G-man (Jul 12, 2004)

I ride em mostly because they are lots of fun. I haven't counted lately but I probably own/control 15 or 20 bikes of all kinds and the MC Cross bike set up just like you describe is perhaps the funnest to ride. That bike will always be one of my bestest of the best rides I own. I am up around the 50ish mark on pro bikes in my lifetime. I do ride fixed a lot on the road a lot too, and have been riding 5k miles a year or more since about 1966. What is fun is fun so I stick with it. SS cross racing is about good as life gets in a damn hard way of thinking concept.


----------



## 2xPneu (Jan 26, 2004)

Low_Rider said:


> I would have to start with brakes though I think, and loose them one by one when I gain some confidence - or loose my mind!


If you lose more than one brake, you've probably lost your mind, at least if you're going to venture into technical territory.


----------



## vulture (Jan 13, 2004)

*monster cross*

Ive been building frames like this for a while and needed something to call them. Customers would ask for a cross bike, but they would want discs and big tire clearance and tougher tubing for more single track. They did not want suspension, most wanted drop bars and somehow it wasn't really a cross bike any more, but it wasn't really a 29er either. Most of the actuall 29ers I make get flat/rise bars, exi wolf clearance and room for a sus fork. Monster cross seemed like the right way to describe it. I think that it is important for these bikes to be at home on the singletrack as much as on the fire roads, so I'm trying do design them as such. The green bike pictured above is sort of just a cross bike but I stuffed some big tires in and it works great. I did get my butt way kicked racing it this weekend though. I need to do some push ups and stretch more. It is amazing how the panaracer 45 rides up front though!
cheers, Wade


----------



## KaiMana (Jan 21, 2004)

Will the panaracer 45 fit in a cross check?


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

KaiMana said:


> Will the panaracer 45 fit in a cross check?


More importantly - is the Panaracer 45c (I assume the Smoke) still available for purchase?

I seem to recall them not being made for a long time.

LP


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

Here's mine - not setup the same now, but still a great bike.

Crosscheck w/ 44c Mutanos


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

alex (solitude) posted this one elsewhere on the boards


----------



## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

lanpope said:


> More importantly - is the Panaracer 45c (I assume the Smoke) still available for purchase?
> 
> I seem to recall them not being made for a long time.
> 
> LP


Not the Smoke. They are talking about the Fire Cross 700x45.


----------



## 2farfwd (Jan 24, 2004)

*I like this thread too*

I started riding a geared cross bike offroad in SoCal back in 2002 for something different. It was challenging and fun and fast. Since then I have adapted my SS Cross Check for all purpose exploring road/offroad riding both fixed and Free. Bars higher, offroad drops, etc. Great fun!


----------



## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

KaiMana said:


> What tires are you guys running? I have a cross check and want to move up from 35s to 42-44s, I am looking at the mythos cx.


I want a set of these








https://www.bgcycles.com/access.html


----------



## wolfy (Dec 21, 2004)

*Looks like fun*

The cross bike is aesthetically a cool thing. Whether or not it rides good off road. I'd sure like to find out on my new Bianchi San Jose. Not sure it'll fit the 45c Panaracers. I stacked going down a little dirty DH to get on the bike path with my slicks. So that ain't the way to go.

-M

Oh yeah, Cantilever Brakes SUCK!


----------



## ionsmuse (Jul 14, 2005)

Hjalti said:


> Fit up to 52 tires, some (or lots of ) slope to the top tube, disc mounts, but handles like my QB.


I would buy that. I wish when I get up tomorrow my Gunnar and C-dale have little cross/mountain/ss love bikes running around the garage. That would be awesome.

Monster cross. Someone get a trademark, quick.

I also see it as a step in the neo-Luddite biker movement. One simple, low maintenance bike for everything. Chester has certainly made himself the living muse for all of this, brilliant marketing on his part. Why he doesn't diversify is beyond me, but then he wouldn't be quite so punk.

And a sendoff to 42c Ritchey ZED pro's.:band:


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

shiggy said:


> I want a set of these
> 
> 
> 
> ...


if you get a set, be sure to let us know.


----------



## dannybob (Feb 21, 2004)

shiggy said:


> I want a set of these
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've got a set of those getting all dry and cracked in my bike closet. I've never had a bike that would fit them.


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

shiggy said:


> Not the Smoke. They are talking about the Fire Cross 700x45.


Ah - thanks...

LP


----------



## OneGearGuy (Jun 15, 2004)

brado1 said:


> This Dude rocked the Icycle Race last Feb, also did the Night Downhill Race on this bike.


Yep, that badass is Sean, an Ash Vegas local. The bike is geared and not fixed, but a cool ride nonetheless. 
I have 6 bikes but a gaping hole that could only be filled by a MonsterCross setup!
Been thinking about it for a while. Hopefully I'll have one before this fall/winter rolls around. :thumbsup:

Great thread, BTW.

OGG


----------



## grawbass (Aug 23, 2004)

shiggy said:


> I want a set of these
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah those canties do look sweet. Wait, you mean the tires right?  I want a set too. They remind my of the old Cycle Pro Snake Belly. I have fond memories of Snake Bellies from my first ATB circa 1985.


----------



## weather (Jan 12, 2004)

i also have a so called monster cross. it's geared. i ride it most because i have to ride 30 miles to the trailhead. roadie and mtn bikes either can't ride the trail or can't ride the pavement fast enough.


----------



## xrmattaz (Jan 12, 2004)

*Monster Cross*

My Monster Cross fixie needs were recently met. I wanted clean lines, with no cable guides whatsoever, so chose a Surly Steamroller frameset.

Set up with a nice long moustache bar/Surly hubs, fixed/fixed rear/Salsa Delgado X rims laced 14/15 DT/well worn Brooks saddle and Ritchey Speedmax 35mm tires.

Rides particularly wonderfully, and I still have room for a slightly larger tire. Excels nowhere, but a very practical vehicle that can be ridden anywhere. Wonderful on the road, sweet on gravel/fireroads and actually quite useable on gentle singletrack.

I like it.


----------



## Gambler (Jul 21, 2005)

To me, the 700c single speed adds another dimension to my biking. I sort of liken it to telemark skiing - simpler and purer (such a word?). The telemarkers say "free your heel free you mind", so the monster crosser would probably say "lose the tech, just ride your bike" or something like that.


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

So, like I said, I'm new at this mountain bike thing.

After the positive response to this thread, I started looking more into the birth of the 29er, and the persistent subset of fixed-offroaders. I've been learning lots about Wes Williams and WTB and I'm so amazed by all of the rich, passionate history that has led to where we're at.

Wes and Matt both show really inspiring dedication to a particular type of machine, and with such a great attitude about life as a "cyclist" and the material aspects thereof.

I'm sure that this is probably just a part of coming to appreciate mountain bikes and offroad riding in general. Of course, there's a lot of rich cultural substructure to the current world of road racing, but the heritage of mountain bikes seems so accessible, and immediate, and relatable.

Thanks for letting me spew my excitement here.

If anyone just can't understand the way i'm feeling, here's a good starting point.

http://www.dirtragmag.com/print/article.php?ID=46&category=features


----------



## Dirt Pilot (Apr 28, 2004)

*Here's my monster...*

...and GREAT article, ink1373. Always been a huge WTB fan. Now if I could just fit those Nanos on my Cross Check...

Sorry for the gears in the pic (no excuses), and yes, I am converting back to SS next weekend. On that note, where do I find a stem with decent rise, like the ones on the cool bikes in this thread?


----------



## nick3216 (Jan 10, 2006)

What tyre width counts as Monster Cross? Does it have to be fixed or will singlespeed do?

Only I'm not sure if my Pompino is plain old cross or monster cross, and I wanted to make sure I was in the latest trendy marketing sub-genre, and not being left in the wake of fashion...


----------



## Sideways (Feb 13, 2005)

You can fit CX tires in traditional 26" MTB frames.

I did this with some success at my first race of the year, sporting a 38 rear, 2.3 front.:
http://www.jandwevents.com/2006xcresults.html
The course is actually one of the more technical in western NC.


----------



## gpsser (Jan 5, 2004)

nick3216 said:


> What tyre width counts as Monster Cross? Does it have to be fixed or will singlespeed do?


Pretty much anything bigger than what would typically be raced on, so obigger than 700x35, but bigger than 700x40 is better for offroad (IMHO) fixed/ss/geared, what ever floats your boat


----------



## jh_on_the_cape (Jan 12, 2004)

gpsser said:


> Pretty much anything bigger than what would typically be raced on, so obigger than 700x35, but bigger than 700x40 is better for offroad (IMHO) fixed/ss/geared, what ever floats your boat


oh oh !! I have 38c tires on for the winter!!! do i qualify!!
dont mind the commuter stuff...
i actually would love to make a commuter/road bike so i could offroadify this one a bit more. maybe later.
whenever i ride this offroad something breaks.


----------



## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

nick3216 said:


> What tyre width counts as Monster Cross? Does it have to be fixed or will singlespeed do?
> 
> Only I'm not sure if my Pompino is plain old cross or monster cross, and I wanted to make sure I was in the latest trendy marketing sub-genre, and not being left in the wake of fashion...


Its OK Nick you can join our clique 

You know us, always looking for the next big marketing opertunity*

Alex

*See and I didn't even mention 4-bar linkages  Doh!


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

*mister sassy pants...*

a "trendy marketing sub-genre"? come on, man...thats way premature. it's only about marketing if you let it be.

did you see Boe's peugeot touring frame above? he must've gotten suckered by the monster cross advertisement conspiracy.

who knows, maybe i'm a corporate trend hunter spying on your hip message boards, seeking the next big thing in cycling.

as for what qualifies as "monster cross"? hell, who knows. ask wade i guess.

i thought maybe it was about how you ride it. i could be wrong.


----------



## vulture (Jan 13, 2004)

*sometimes a little qualifier helps communicate an idea*



nick3216 said:


> What tyre width counts as Monster Cross? Does it have to be fixed or will singlespeed do?
> 
> Only I'm not sure if my Pompino is plain old cross or monster cross, and I wanted to make sure I was in the latest trendy marketing sub-genre, and not being left in the wake of fashion...


Sometimes is doesn't. I call bikes that are more monsterous than cross but not quite a regular 29" wheel mountain bike "monster cross" nobody cares if they are single speed or fixed or geared or whatever, I just thought of this as a way to talk to my customers. As far as this being a trendy sub-genre dont be worried. You can call your bike anything you want. Just say RAHRR. Real monsters come in all sizes and shapes. Elmo is a monster. Godzilla is a monster. There are Gila monsters and monster Trucks. Some would say that bigfoot is a monster, but he's not real like Elmo and Godzilla. Speaking of Godzilla, check out the FuManchu live cover from Germany. Those guys rock!
cheers, Wade


----------



## jh_on_the_cape (Jan 12, 2004)

vulture said:


> Sometimes is doesn't. I call bikes that are more monsterous than cross but not quite a regular 29" wheel mountain bike "monster cross" nobody cares if they are single speed or fixed or geared or whatever, I just thought of this as a way to talk to my customers. As far as this being a trendy sub-genre dont be worried. You can call your bike anything you want. Just say RAHRR. Real monsters come in all sizes and shapes. Elmo is a monster. Godzilla is a monster. There are Gila monsters and monster Trucks. Some would say that bigfoot is a monster, but he's not real like Elmo and Godzilla. Speaking of Godzilla, check out the FuManchu live cover from Germany. Those guys rock!
> cheers, Wade


"and if his d!ck is a monster..." -zappa
he must have been quoting godzilla, upon seeing elmo in the locker room.

you should make a bike that is elmo and godzilla's illegitimate lovechild. scaly green paint with spots of red fur. design the brake(s) to squeel like elmo talking. and put a flamethrower on the front like godzilla spitting fire. that would RAAAHHHRRRR...


----------



## crust & crumb (Mar 4, 2006)

i've been enjoying this thread thoroughly. does anyone here subscribe to the seemingly chesterian school of thought, though? the one which favours _skinnies_ in the dirt?


----------



## Pigtire (Jan 13, 2004)

*Warning: Geary content*

Here is mine. No longer have the the current fork/stem setup. Now sporting straight legged fork/threadless stem 15 degree rise(original setup). I know it's geared


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

delightful rock lobster.

especially delightful cable routing.


----------



## Nonracerrichie (Dec 20, 2005)

*Here is my friggen rig...*

This Steelman has all but ruined me for other bikes. I bought it to have a fun bike, and it is. So much so that after seven years it is the only one left. It is on 38c slicks and geared for the road in the pic and fits 45's. I doubt I will ever own a geared bike, or ride anything skinnier than a 32c ever again. The geometry is 71.5 HT, 73 ST, with a 55.5 tt. 11.75 bb height. Rode it on the road this evening, did two long climbs. It just never gets old. I don't miss gears unless I try to hang on a long hilly group road ride. But that so rarely happens. I wouldn't mind having Paul Sadohff build me a true 29er with the same geometry, outfitted with avid road discs and a the Midge bars for more of a true dirt rig.


----------



## SS4life (Oct 15, 2004)

I lust threw a cane creek thudbuster on my cross bike and I put my paragon sliders to use and singleseeded it. I that for this bike the thudbuster is awesome. It really smoothes out the ride especially on some of the nasty studderbumps that normally eat cross bikes alive. I can just sit and pedal through some pretty rough sections. The singlespeed thing is working out nicely too. I really like the paragon sliding dropout system. I can change up to 3 teeth in the rear cog without changing my chain length


----------



## Hjalti (Jan 22, 2004)

*Sometimes*



crust & crumb said:


> i've been enjoying this thread thoroughly. does anyone here subscribe to the seemingly chesterian school of thought, though? the one which favours _skinnies_ in the dirt?


I have tried a couple of different sets of tires. Now, I'm a bigger guy than most here, so other results may vary from mine, but I had Nokian 35's on and they gave me tons of flats when riding in the rockier areas nearby (think lots of sharp babyheads). If I travel a bit farther to smoother singletrack, they worked OK, but the rear wore out pretty quickly when combining road and trail. Panaracer Paselas 37 (minimal tread) lasted longer but gave me no joy off road. I've been using Mutanoraptor 44s since April and like them. Here is a photo of my new custom bashring and the Mutano 44 on my bike:


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

Nonracerrichie said:


> I wouldn't mind having Paul Sadohff build me a true 29er with the same geometry, outfitted with avid road discs and a the Midge bars for more of a true dirt rig.


:thumbsup: (minus the road discs)

LP


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

Now that I'm finally out riding a bit again... here's my Serotta back with some recent updates.


















​


----------



## Low_Rider (Jan 15, 2004)

Man that thing looks fast just sitting there!


----------



## Pigtire (Jan 13, 2004)

Hey Terminaut,

What rise do you have on your stem? Sweet bike.


----------



## Greenfix (Oct 26, 2004)

Boe said:


>


I am interested in knowing a little more about those bars.

I am currently running Mary bars on my bike, and I really like them. I am looking for a new bar for my commuter bike. Something with sweep like the Mary, but narrower witn more of a drop. The bars in the photo look like what I was thinking of. Right now, I am considering the nitto north road, but I am not sure what else is out there.

Cheers,

GF


----------



## Gambler (Jul 21, 2005)

I was wondering about the stem too - is it custom ti? Builder?


----------



## Guest (Jun 8, 2006)

lanpope said:


> (minus the road discs)
> 
> LP


Why? IThe fixed beast I'm building up right now will have one on the front w/ Midge and Cane Creek brake levers. Not enough power in this brake???


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

Pigtire said:


> Hey Terminaut,
> 
> What rise do you have on your stem? Sweet bike.


If I'm remembering right, it's a 30 degree rise and 120mm extension.


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

Gambler said:


> I was wondering about the stem too - is it custom ti? Builder?


The stem is indeed ti and made by Willits (Wes Williams). A majority of the bike is titanium, including the frame/fork/headset/cranks.


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

Greenfix said:


> I am interested in knowing a little more about those bars.
> 
> I am currently running Mary bars on my bike, and I really like them. I am looking for a new bar for my commuter bike. Something with sweep like the Mary, but narrower witn more of a drop. The bars in the photo look like what I was thinking of. Right now, I am considering the nitto north road, but I am not sure what else is out there.
> 
> ...


Unfortunately I don't know the brand of the bars as they're old-school and don't have any identifying marks. I'd love to find another set like them as IMHO they're the most comfortable bars ever made for riding in the drops.

Here's a front view:









​


----------



## Riding for Sanity (Mar 18, 2006)

I strongly agree to the "low bike count' theory, I'm thinking about buying a Cross Check myself, and I already have a geared FS I've NEVER RIDDEN, and my Hardtail with 1.6 slicks Rigid, for commuting. I don't find the time to ride the really rough stuff anymore, so a simpler ride would be ideal. So I guess my HT is basically a wannabe Monster Cross!


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

indigosky said:


> Why? IThe fixed beast I'm building up right now will have one on the front w/ Midge and Cane Creek brake levers. Not enough power in this brake???


No...no...no problem with the brake. I am sure they work fine.

I was just saying that if I was _hypothetically _having a bike built by Paul of Rock Lobster that _hypothetically _was to built for drop bars, 29" wheels and a rigid fork (maybe a _hypothetical_ custom stem too)...I personally wound not go that route with the brakes. I would _hypothetically_ go with either Paul Motolites or Neo Retros front and rear.

_Hypothetically _of course 

LP


----------



## Greenfix (Oct 26, 2004)

THanks Terminaut,

Those are nice bars, but I am interested in the bars posted on the bike in Boe's post. I would like to use mountain levers on my bars (though I will likely hook mine up to a front brake). 

Your bars look like dirt drops to me, and I have thought of the on-one midge bars, but I would like to use some mountain controls.

Cheers,

GF


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

Greenfix said:


> THanks Terminaut,
> 
> Those are nice bars, but I am interested in the bars posted on the bike in Boe's post. I would like to use mountain levers on my bars (though I will likely hook mine up to a front brake).
> 
> ...


Aw man I was a replyin' foo and didn't pay enough attention.  Anyways, good luck with your quest!


----------



## Boe (May 6, 2005)

Greenfix said:


> I am interested in knowing a little more about those bars.
> 
> I am currently running Mary bars on my bike, and I really like them. I am looking for a new bar for my commuter bike. Something with sweep like the Mary, but narrower witn more of a drop. The bars in the photo look like what I was thinking of. Right now, I am considering the nitto north road, but I am not sure what else is out there.
> 
> ...


The bars I run in the picture are from our local "wal-mart" type store. $6 bars.









Most "no name aluminium" makers have them or similar designs.


----------



## Greenfix (Oct 26, 2004)

Boe said:


> The bars I run in the picture are from our local "wal-mart" type store. $6 bars.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cheers Boe,

I think I may have to find a discarded cruiser bike and pilfer the bars from that.

Thanks again,

GF


----------



## Guest (Jun 9, 2006)

lanpope said:


> _Hypothetically _of course
> 
> LP


Gotcha... I start brazing this weekend. I ordered about 10' of scrap 1.125" x .035" from aircraftspruce.com to start with so I can make sure my torch is dialed before I hit the good stuff. :thumbsup: Don't I owe you a picture of my jig anyway?

How's your fab-re-catin coming?


----------



## big & single (Feb 15, 2006)

So what's the distinction between monster cross and a big wheeled MTB with drop bars? 

Here's my take...


----------



## ppp (Jul 29, 2004)

terminaut said:


> Now that I'm finally out riding a bit again... here's my Serotta back with some recent updates.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good to hear from you Terminaut ,now how about some action shots ? Please !


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

ppp said:


> Good to hear from you Terminaut ,now how about some action shots ? Please !


LOL. I took it for a ride this morning with some downhiller types and got a couple of photos and also a video from my bulletcam setup. I'll create a new post once I get the video editted. 


















​


----------



## lanpope (Jan 6, 2004)

Totally off topic Term, but are you in anyway involved in this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7247012923&fromMakeTrack=true

Certainly looks like something you might have (or need) laying around.

BTW - What's the latest on "the Willits"?

LP


----------



## terminaut (Dec 19, 2003)

lanpope said:


> Totally off topic Term, but are you in anyway involved in this?
> 
> https://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7247012923&fromMakeTrack=true
> 
> ...


That auction is just nutty. No offense to the high bidders (and Moots owners), but the Moots bars are not *that* special. I suppose if you're trying to build up an all-titanium Moots-equipped Moots, then maybe... but only if Moots made you some nice matching ti cranks to go with the ensemble... and you also had the proper Moots stem (with the ti 4-bolt front face) to hold those bars. ;-)










As for the Willits, my B2 is running great but the B29 is still "at the shop"...


----------



## Potential Roadkill (Nov 5, 2004)

*adding another to the mix*

Here's my "Monster Cross" Kona Sutra, 700X42 ritcheys and it's a sweet ride. Sliding dropouts allow for geared or SS. Currently running in the geared mode to better tow my B.O.B. Trailer. Still it's a fun bike, and a great way to get around. Though now that I have gears on it I do find myself riding my converted F1000 more than the Kona.


----------



## black cross (Dec 10, 2005)

I have been thinking about adding some larger tires to my Crosscheck. I noticed that Bruce Gordon offers a 700X43 off road tire. What experiences have people had with these. My wheels are made with Mavic MA 3 rims, I am guessing these tires will fit fine on these rims. Any advise would be helpful.


----------



## SpinWheelz (May 3, 2004)

I don't have a "monster 'cross bike". What I do have is a very versatile lugged steel Trek 950 that I've managed to stuff with some 700c wheels with knobby tires. Right now, I'm running a Kenda Kross Supreme 700x35c tire in the rear and a WTB Cross Wolf 700x32c tire in the front (the Kenda wouldn't fit).

Up front, I've got some Cane Creek SCR-5 brake levers mounted onto moustache bars. That setup feels great and they're definitely a chick magnet (as I found out on a rather lengthy tour ride around NYC recently!), but I've got some On*One Midge bars lying around now doing not a whole lot and was thinking of replacing the moustache bars with them. Changing non-MTB bars is always a bit involved (proper cable routing along the bar, bar tape, positioning the levers, etc.), so I wanted to ask first before I did the swap: are there any fundamental advantages a moustache bar might have over a dirt drop bar like the Midges?

I do love the Midge bar and the multiple hand positions they offer, but I've always had trouble lifting the front-end with them, hence my bit of hesitation here.

Can anyone offer any help/insight on the two bars?


----------



## stiffy (Jun 12, 2006)

like it, without knowing I'm running a monster cross bike, cool.


----------



## hikerdave (Mar 8, 2006)

I never knew I was riding a monster cross bike until now. I just wanted a little better ride for my Specialized Tricross, bought some 700c x 42 Ritchey Zed Pro tires, and on a lark rode some of the local singletrack, the Desert Classic trail on South Mountain. I was amazed by how well the bike handled in the drop bars, even on rocky sections and just started riding the bike more and more on trails.


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Tires?*

I know there are a couple of mentions of tires in this thread already, but I wanted to get all of the options listed here. I currently have an Airborne Carpe Diem that is sporting some Ritchey Mount Cross 700x38 tires, but I would like to go bigger. I think I can squeeze a 42 in the back, maybe with a little "tweeking", and think I can fit a 45 in the Steelman cross fork up front. So below is the list or possibilities I came up with. Any advice/experience with any of the tires would be appreciated, including actual weight and size. Right now I am leaning toward the Panaracer Fire for the front and the Ritchey Zed for the back. Thanks, Mark!

Maxxis Wormdrive 700x42, 405g

WTB Mutanoraptor 1.85 (44/44), claimed weight 850g?!

Panaracer Fire Cross 700x45

Ritchey Zed Race 700x42, 520g

IRC Mythos XC 700x42

Bontrager Jones XR 29 1.8 (45), 550g


----------



## Boe (May 6, 2005)

bikeny said:


> WTB Mutanoraptor 1.85 (44/44), claimed weight 850g?!


My Mutanos weight in at 630g


----------



## WillitsBrand.com (Jan 15, 2006)

I'm having a Willits 28-Incher built right now that I plan on running with Nanos. I've been riding cross bikes on trails for 10 years but this is gonna be awesome.

-steven


----------



## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

big & single said:


> So what's the distinction between monster cross and a big wheeled MTB with drop bars?


 To my mind, these bikes are defined by the tires: 38-45mm tires, bigger than UCI-sanctioned cyclocross tires (35c max) but smaller than fat MTB tires (about 48mm/1.9" and up). If your 29"er is shod in 700x42s it qualifies in my book.

Here are the non-slick tires I know of in this size range. I'm including Euro-"trekking" tires if they have some actual usable tread to them. Comments added for the ones I've actually ridden:

Avocet Cross II SL 700x38, 445g.
Bontrager Jones XR 1.8, 550g.
Club Roost Terra 700x38, 500g.
Conti CountryRide 700x37, 605g.
Hutchinson Acrobat 700x37/700x42, 660g/810g.
IRC Cross Country 700x38, 495g.
IRC Metrocross Duro 700x38, 502g.
IRC Mythos CX Slick 700x38/40/42, 495/510/550g. The 700x42 is ubiquitous and stocked on the GF Dual Sport bikes, last I checked. A bit buzzy and slightly slower rolling than some of the other semislicks, it's still an excellent all-rounder. Not to be confused with a full knobby of course, it still seemed to work decently everywhere I've tried it offroad. A bit sketchy on wet pavement for you commuters.
Kenda Kross Plus K847 700x38/42, 630g/650g. Not to be konfused with the Kenda Cross or the Kenda Kross Supreme. Believe it or not, this tire (for which I paid $6.50 at Nashbar) is my _favorite_ tire in this class if you want something that is still fast on pavement. Rolls ultra-fast and has decent grip everywhere from gravel to wet pavement and even mud. Worth the weight.:thumbsup: 
Maxxis WormDrive CX 700x42, 445g. I have two of these. Looks a lot like the K847, so you'd think it would perform similarly. It rolls just as fast (and is much lighter) but has much less grip offroad. Oddly, better in snow and ice than in mud.
Michelin TransWorld Sprint 700x40, 640g. Bigger than the K847 or the WormDrive, this sucker grips well offroad, including mud, snow and ice. Not great if you plan to include a lot of road work: sketchy on wet pavement, and rolls slower than you'd think given the low diamond center tread. I'm starting to think that Kevlar puncture belts incur a pretty huge cost in terms of rolling resistance. Seems like thick center treads (like on the K847 or the Karma) give just about as much protection against glass punctures, with about the same weight penalty and much less rolling resistance.
Panaracer FireCross 700x45, 690g.
Panaracer Smoke 700x45, 550g, out of production. _The_ classic monster-'cross tire. More like 700x42. Oodles of grip. Oodles of rolling resistance.
Ritchey Mount Cross 700x38, Pro/WCS 425g/370g. Round carcass and lots of closely spaced flat-topped knobs. Light, smooth, fast and easy-cornering on pavement. Good offroad too, rocks, gravel or even slimy mud. Haven't ridden it in sticky mud, but I bet it would pack up like crazy.
Ritchey ZED Race 700x42, 520g. So many rave reviews, I really need to get around to trying this one.
Schwalbe Black Jack 700x45, 650g. Raised smooth center tread gives you low rolling resistance, yet still gave me amazing MTB-level traction everywhere I've tried it, from the dry sandy trails of central Oregon to the mudbogs of Western Oregon. Commuters be warned about the worst wet-pavement traction of any tire I've ever ridden, as bad as the old Conti Goliath. Probably scary on wet rocks too.
Schwalbe Marathon Cross 700x38, 630g.
Schwalbe Marathon XR 700x40, 680g.
Schwalbe Hurricane/Hurricane Sport 700x40, 740/630g.
WTB Interwolf 700x38, 450g.
Tioga Bloodhound 700x38, 473g.
WTB Mutanoraptor Comp 700x45, 550g(?).

Edit: I suppose 35mm tires might qualify too, especially the Kenda Kross Supreme bogblasters. Too many of those for me to list here though.


----------



## Riding for Sanity (Mar 18, 2006)

I'm building my track bike parts list as we speak, I'm going with 32mm's. I'm not going dirty with this bike, I hope to have pics up while this Thread is still alive!


----------



## WillitsBrand.com (Jan 15, 2006)

*Willits*


----------



## 2xPneu (Jan 26, 2004)

WillitsBrand.com said:


>


Not a monster cross bike. That's a drop bar 29"er.


----------



## WillitsBrand.com (Jan 15, 2006)

"Not a monster cross bike. That's a drop bar 29"er."

I hear you. I think this bike overlaps so many different categories that it sits firmly in the "none-of-the-above" column. It's kind of funny you say that because mine is the first one not to be called a "28-Incher". We'll have a new name soon. Wes built the first 28-Incher in 1988 around a Continental Goliath 700x47 and left some huge clearance. It was based on some early 1900s model touring bike. In the Golden Age of Handbuilt Bicycles book, there is a 1930s French "camping" bike that looks just like this (minus the ExiWolf).

I actually just posted this picture with the giant tires to show the clearance. I will probably run it with 700x42s, like I have run my CX bikes for years. 

-steven


----------



## 2xPneu (Jan 26, 2004)

WillitsBrand.comI will probably run it with 700x42s said:


> Now yer talkin' monster cross!
> 
> I use 34mm Tufo CX tubulars which are light, hook up pretty well, and last a long time. Plus you can add Stan's and have the best of both worlds.
> 
> ...


----------



## 1x1clyde (Oct 5, 2005)

WillitsBrand.com,
that bike is beautiful!
I run a San Jose with Paul WORD hubs, Mavic CXP33 rims and Ritchey ZED 700x42. I added a Winwood carbon fork for a little plushness in the front.
I hope I qualify for "monster"cross.....I ride it all over my local trails in socal, it works great on the hardpack trails and fireroads. I've been thinking of geared CX rig but not sure I am ready to turn from the darkside!


----------



## ernesto_from_Wisconsin (Jan 12, 2004)

*here's my rendition*

Rock Lobster...

Mofo crosser/adventure bike n' what-not.

It eats and wants your grandma...

https://www.adventurefind.com/images/for-whiteind-copy.jpg


----------



## Mackie (Dec 30, 2003)

*Now you are talkin' my language*

$5 bike at a church sale, plus some lovin' =


----------



## Riding for Sanity (Mar 18, 2006)

MAckie, are you running a Brake Caliper or a Cantilevers up front? What's the biggest tire you can stuff in there?


----------



## happygofun (Jan 13, 2004)

*monster truckin*

Well fewer knobs than I like offroad but it is good all arround. Scwalbe big apples (700x50) replaced that Irc mythos 42's on my surly.







definitley monster - very little room in the rear. Must instert wheel in drops before inflating fully in order to squeeze past the chainstay bridge. Wheel is almost all the way back


----------



## DaveA (Jan 15, 2004)

*great for combo rides...*

Sorry, I am late to this thread. (Trying to upload pic of my Atlantis with 44's).

I thought these were coined "Adventure Bikes". Anyways, I have been riding my Montster Cross for combo rides etc... also for less than technical single track. The Midge bars are also a nice fit for this type of bike. The second generation of Atlantis will fit true 29" tires, though with a bit of toe pedal overlap. Typicaly I run 44mm WTB Mutano's on mine. These bikes are a nice fit in the quiver, and are especially good "road" bikes for us mountian bikers that like to find car-free routes. That said, I won't be ditching my full-sus mtb any time soon.


----------



## SpinWheelz (May 3, 2004)

Mackie said:


> $5 bike at a church sale, plus some lovin' =


Mackie, perhaps we ought to take our bargain bikes out to some dirt and see what sort of beating they can take.


----------



## DiDaDunlop (Oct 22, 2005)

Can anybody tell me the height of those tyres? Bead to top of thread. Yesterday I measured the room that I have in my old MTB frame and it's about 40 to 45 MM. Is that enough clearance for some of those cross tyres?


----------



## nm13 (Jun 5, 2005)

I like it. Been working on somthing similar. What bars are those? Thought they were upsidedown Mary's but they look silver.


----------



## Mackie (Dec 30, 2003)

Riding for Sanity said:


> MAckie, are you running a Brake Caliper or a Cantilevers up front? What's the biggest tire you can stuff in there?


It's standard calipers. Because the bike was designed for 27 inch wheels and I now run 700c wheels, I have plenty of room. The 45's from my Redline cross frame fit easily. 
I am in the market for a 700c fork with canti studs & a 1 inch steerer though.


----------



## Mackie (Dec 30, 2003)

SpinWheelz said:


> Mackie, perhaps we ought to take our bargain bikes out to some dirt and see what sort of beating they can take.[/IMG]


Nice ride Spin. 
I take mine on dirt fairly frequently out on Long Island - i ride the Bethpage path up to the White Trail that runs around up there. The bike is great on singletrack as long as it's not too rocky. Where it needs work though is the bar/stem/fork connection. Right now I'm using the stock fork - 1 inch threaded, with a Nasgbar threadless steerer adapter taking me up to 1&1/8th. Then an MTB stem & the Midge bars. Feels nice and tight and smooth, but makes an AWFUL  knocking sound when I bunnyhop. Not very reassuring.

Anyway, where are you riding that nice green machine?


----------



## SpinWheelz (May 3, 2004)

Mackie said:


> Nice ride Spin.
> I take mine on dirt fairly frequently out on Long Island - i ride the Bethpage path up to the White Trail that runs around up there. The bike is great on singletrack as long as it's not too rocky. Where it needs work though is the bar/stem/fork connection. Right now I'm using the stock fork - 1 inch threaded, with a Nasgbar threadless steerer adapter taking me up to 1&1/8th. Then an MTB stem & the Midge bars. Feels nice and tight and smooth, but makes an AWFUL  knocking sound when I bunnyhop. Not very reassuring.
> 
> Anyway, where are you riding that nice green machine?


Having only just built it up, I've only taken it on a test ride around a small lake in my town. Unfortunately, it was between rainfalls and the lake is surrounded rocks and roots. Wet rocks and roots on (relatively) skinny cross tires - that was unnerving at best. I think this bike will see the most time on flat(ish) fire roads going up from New Rochelle to White Plains as well as out to Orchard Beach. Pretty much the same sort of ride you're taking with your bike (which you've turned into one tasty ride). Front end setup is somewhat similar to yours. Nashbar threadless stem adapter, hi-rise MTB stem and On*One Midge bars. I'm still having a fair bit of trouble lifting the front end with the Midge bars.


----------



## happygofun (Jan 13, 2004)

nm13 said:


> I like it. Been working on somthing similar. What bars are those? Thought they were upsidedown Mary's but they look silver.


They're old three speed bars salvaged many years ago and inverted in the above setup. A bit narrow for off road ridding (not enough leverage) but they porovide a couple good hand position for arround town and longer rides.

I think these are more similar to the old 'preist' bars as oposed to the northroads which are longer and have more sweep. 
kinda like these
http://www.rivendellbicycles.com/html/membership_rivendell12.html
but with less bar, mine might be a 'kids' version


----------



## scarface (May 16, 2004)

*weird.*

I have been riding slightly technical singletrack with my karate monkey running kenda klaws. I was really digging the CX feel on the trails, wondering what I stumbled into...sort of like grinding out the drops of my specialized hardrock and disecting my rear hub, making it singlespeed. So crazy to find this thread talking about "monster cross". seems like this will be the next trend, now that everyone makes singlespeeds and I swear I saw a huffy 29er


----------



## redxj (Oct 17, 2004)

Better late than never. Here is my 'monster crosser' fixed of course.


----------



## D_Man (Jan 7, 2004)

Here is another fixed/free monster crosser. Those are 700*40 Michelin transworld sprints. Don't let the fenders fool you.


----------



## nm13 (Jun 5, 2005)

Mackie said:


> It's standard calipers. Because the bike was designed for 27 inch wheels and I now run 700c wheels, I have plenty of room. The 45's from my Redline cross frame fit easily.
> I am in the market for a 700c fork with canti studs & a 1 inch steerer though.


Wow 45s. I was hoping for 38s on a similar '84 Trek 620 conversion (with canti's though). This opens a whole new world.


----------



## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

This one resides in Term's shed now, but it was fun while it lasted. 2.1's in the pic for off-roadin', but it rode real nice and the geo was still spot-on with 35-44's.

I miss it, but not enough to get another.







Yet.

MC


----------



## yukmak (Aug 6, 2006)

*What about wheels?*

Hi all,

I was delighted to find this thread. I was in the process of building my version of a Monster Cross without knowing it. I have a Surly Crosscheck frame on order, the first bike that I am going to build from scratch. I was going to get 700x45c tires for it, or perhaps the WTB Nanoraptors, which judging by other posts should fit on a Crosscheck (Fatties Fit Fine!). I am not sure what wheels to get though. I will be riding road, singletrack, gravel roads, you name it. I wanted them to be pretty strong, I am 190 lbs and ride pretty hard offroad. The LBS suggested hybrid-width rims, but that means I might not be able to run 700x23 road tires on it (which I have bunches of). Any opinions on this?


----------



## Boe (May 6, 2005)

yukmak said:


> Hi all,
> ...I was going to get 700x45c tires for it, or perhaps the WTB Nanoraptors, which judging by other posts should fit on a Crosscheck (Fatties Fit Fine!)....


Im not sure about this, but I *belive* that older versions (pea green) of the cross check had better tire clearance (and also nicer tubing). The current version will not run much bigger that 45 in the back I think.


----------



## hutchkintoot (Aug 21, 2006)

Potential Roadkill said:


> Here's my "Monster Cross" Kona Sutra, 700X42 ritcheys and it's a sweet ride. Sliding dropouts allow for geared or SS. Currently running in the geared mode to better tow my B.O.B. Trailer. Still it's a fun bike, and a great way to get around. Though now that I have gears on it I do find myself riding my converted F1000 more than the Kona.


Is it possible to use "full" fenders with that setup? When I say fenders i mean full length mounted ones. I'm shopping for a Sutra -07 but is a bit worried about tire clearance.

/Hutch


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Canti or V brakes?*

So I finally traked down a Ritchey Zed pro 700x42 for the rear and a Bontrager XR 29"x1.8 for the front and went about mounting them on my Carpe Diem and encountered my first problem. I cannot get the tires past the Canti brakes on the front and back when they are inflated. The obvious solution is to inflate them after mounting the wheels, but this seems like lame solution. Should I look into V-brakes (whicj I have lying around) and get some travel adaptor thingies to work with my road levers (Sorry, no 287V levers for me, bike has STI)? Does this kind of setup work well, or is it a PITA?

I also need to do a little chainstay mod in the back to clear the knobs on the Ritchey 42 tire, although the Steelman cross fork fits the Bonty tire no problem, and it looks sweet! I will post pic's when it is done.

Mark


----------



## dwnhlldav (Feb 2, 2006)

yukmak said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I was delighted to find this thread. I was in the process of building my version of a Monster Cross without knowing it. I have a Surly Crosscheck frame on order, the first bike that I am going to build from scratch. I was going to get 700x45c tires for it, or perhaps the WTB Nanoraptors, which judging by other posts should fit on a Crosscheck (Fatties Fit Fine!). I am not sure what wheels to get though. I will be riding road, singletrack, gravel roads, you name it. I wanted them to be pretty strong, I am 190 lbs and ride pretty hard offroad. The LBS suggested hybrid-width rims, but that means I might not be able to run 700x23 road tires on it (which I have bunches of). Any opinions on this?


In my expirience, you won't be able to run 23 and 45c tires on the same rim.

Anyway, back to the thread. I think my surly needs and overhaul. I was thinking of ditching the gears but I'll end up with 38c IRC knobbies from a few years ago, as a little one on the way has curtailed my bike spending substantially


----------



## ekoostick (Oct 7, 2004)

Here is my MONSTER


----------



## RobW (Jan 18, 2004)

redxj said:


> Better late than never. Here is my 'monster crosser' fixed of course.


Here's mine...


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

*Can my Surly CxC play?*

Of course it can. Play on the pavement; play on the dirt with 42c ZED Pro tires. I like the "mofo cross" tag that Ernesto from Wisconsin coined. This was 2500 feet elevation in 11.5 miles today. Last pic has town were I started, right above the top tube. Weeeeeeeeeee! :thumbsup:


----------



## ejrejr (Aug 15, 2006)

*Moustache Bars*

FYI, Van Dessel has a set of moustache bars that are 22.2mm, mountain bike size. They don't have any drop, but if you want to run nasty MTB brakes on your monstercross, they might be just the ticket.


----------



## Grunk (Jan 2, 2006)

Here's my newly build monster. Surly Cross Check with Dimension MTN disc fork. Mutano in the rear, Nano in the front.


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

Grunk, I like that a lot. Does the crosscheck's handling get a little weird with the nanoraptor on the front?

Curious what kind of tire pressure people are using for singletrack with the 42-45mm tires...I haven't experimented with it much.


----------



## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

*Work in progress...*

Well I have bitten the bullet and designed a "monster cross" / drop bar 29er for the biggest pain in the @ss customer I know....me 

On-One carbon 29er forks and Midge bar, Avid road disc on the front / M900 XTR canti on the back, Phil double fixed / disc front hubs on MA3, Sugino/Surly/EAI/PC58 drive chain on an old Race Face BB (this is the 5th frame it will be fitted to!)

Might try a Brooks saddle again now I run my saddles slightly nose up....I found the old one too damn slippy 

Oh, and "Midnight Green Metallic" is the latest colour....see, I told you I was a nightmare to deal with!

Alex


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

Sounds pretty awesome, Alex. I look forward to seeing how that turns out.


----------



## long hazy daze (Oct 19, 2005)

*Does this count?*

After looking at all this monster cross stuff. I got to thinkin, if I threw some skinnys on my MC29, with it's flopped mary bars, would it constitute as a Monster Cross? Even if the 77x37's are slicks?

I put some Panaracer CTX 37's on my MC29, because I had them laying around. And did some experiementing to see how big of a range in gear inches I can get without having to fidle with removing/adding chainlinks. Right now Im running a 36t ring, with 22t and 16t cogs. The 22 gives me about a 48" trail gear (MTB), and the 16 about a 63" (with the ctx's anyway) gear. Nice gear for cruisin or light off road perhaps, but not terribly fast on the pavement. I can run either cog with the same chain length, the 22 being all the way forward in the drops (which is where I want on the trails anyway), and the 16 being at the back end, giving me a longer wheelbase which is fine for the road or fireroads. I could easily run an even smaller cog by simply installing a shorter length of chain between the two power links on my chain.


----------



## RemfSS (Jun 22, 2006)

I want to build up a Monster Cross Rig with 700x62 (29x2.1) Nanoraptors. Sounds like the Surly Cross Check might work, I know the Qball works but I have one of those already and I like mine the way it is (just as a Single Speed rig), however I would like to find either a road type frame with rear brake posts and all the fixings for a commuter rig that will accommodate 29er tires. What do you suggest?


----------



## hoovermd (Dec 22, 2007)

I like riding my SS 'Crosser in the dirt but I can only fit a Firecross 45 in the rear so I've "modified" my MTB into a FrankenBike with a 650B in the front and Midge drop bars and a rigid Carbon front:


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

RemfSS said:


> I want to build up a Monster Cross Rig with 700x62 (29x2.1) Nanoraptors. Sounds like the Surly Cross Check might work, I know the Qball works but I have one of those already and I like mine the way it is (just as a Single Speed rig), however I would like to find either a road type frame with rear brake posts and all the fixings for a commuter rig that will accommodate 29er tires. What do you suggest?


I cannot get Nanos front or rear on my CxC.

Biggest tire that rolls almost as smooth is the Conti Vapor. They call it a 2.1, but really a 1.8 - 1.9.


----------



## zoro (Mar 14, 2007)

Loving the Monstercross thread!! (and the other one too!).

What do you guys think about the Ritchey Speedmax Cross 40c for monstercrossing applications?? Linky here

There cheap and seem like a decent compromise; any opinions?

Thanks!


----------



## RemfSS (Jun 22, 2006)

slocaus said:


> I cannot get Nanos front or rear on my CxC.
> 
> Biggest tire that rolls almost as smooth is the Conti Vapor. They call it a 2.1, but really a 1.8 - 1.9.


I think that is why I have to get a 29er frame and go from there.


----------



## PaintPeelinPbody (Feb 3, 2004)

I kinda want to try monstercrossing one of my many bikes.

I currently have a 1990 Marin, but its 26" and a 84 Schwinn LeTour, but it uses road calipers.

Do I have any chance of CX or MX either of these bikes? I'm poor and don't wanna buy a new frame (too many as it is).


----------



## duotone (Dec 31, 2006)

Sure you can build a monstercross out of your 26er. True people will say it's not a true MX, but if you like it who cares.

I don't have a pic of my GT Karakoram but if you go to my site I have pics.


----------



## tony [email protected] (Mar 12, 2008)

big & single said:


> So what's the distinction between monster cross and a big wheeled MTB with drop bars?
> 
> Here's my take...


great bike,im not sure if i want the swift or the peregrine


----------



## bricke (Jul 23, 2008)

I can't understand if you are using race frame or mtb frame.

If I use a race frame, is there the possibilities of broke it, using larger pneus and riding in non-asphalt road?

Sorry for my poar English...


----------



## campredcloudbikes (Feb 22, 2008)

26" bike








It is 26" rigid, singlespeed, go anywhere. it has normal mtb tires currently, but has seen days with skinny slicks and a 1x8 setup with just a 42t in the front, and DIY drop bars - MTB flat bar, to stubby barends, with elbow bar ends coming down from there for drops.... looked weird, but it worked fine. The brakes were still on the flat bar.
So, I've treated it like a monster cross, just with smaller wheels..... and 26" cyclocross tires are hard to find and expensive.


----------



## Ze_Zaskar (Jan 3, 2008)

Nice bike, what gear are you running on it?


----------



## hoovermd (Dec 22, 2007)

bricke said:


> I can't understand if you are using race frame or mtb frame.
> 
> If I use a race frame, is there the possibilities of broke it, using larger pneus and riding in non-asphalt road?
> 
> Sorry for my poar English...


I've tried using a larger penis and it just gets in the way....


----------



## BLUEMEANIE (Jan 28, 2009)

lanpope said:


> More importantly - is the Panaracer 45c (I assume the Smoke) still available for purchase?
> 
> I seem to recall them not being made for a long time.
> 
> LP


They're no longer made but I believe Panaracer now makes the Firecross in a 45.

Ive been stuffing the Panaracer Smoke/Dart 700x45 combo into a Trek 7900 since about 95 and around 99 or so I switched to drops because as a broke college grad I didn't have the cash for a road bike.


----------



## lemonpedals23 (Feb 5, 2007)

vulture said:


> Sometimes is doesn't. I call bikes that are more monsterous than cross but not quite a regular 29" wheel mountain bike "monster cross" nobody cares if they are single speed or fixed or geared or whatever, I just thought of this as a way to talk to my customers. As far as this being a trendy sub-genre dont be worried. You can call your bike anything you want. Just say RAHRR. Real monsters come in all sizes and shapes. Elmo is a monster. Godzilla is a monster. There are Gila monsters and monster Trucks. Some would say that bigfoot is a monster, but he's not real like Elmo and Godzilla. Speaking of Godzilla, check out the FuManchu live cover from Germany. Those guys rock!
> cheers, Wade


Here here. One of the coolest posts Ive ever read. well done sir. Not sure if Elmo is a monster but he scares the hell out of me.


----------



## nuck_chorris (Jun 6, 2008)

im about to be finished with my project that is built around my old trek 850. all it needs is for the rear rim spokes to be triple crossed ,bars to be set in on it, and the brake levers setup. hopefully the road bars (that i already own) help with my hand numbness.


----------



## chklto (Dec 6, 2004)

*Here's my 990 trek*

Ive posted it here before.


----------



## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

i was going to put knobby tires on my road bike and take it to the local trails but people on this message board said "no, that's a terrible idea. it will never work. just buy a mountain bike. so i sold the roadie and bought a mtb. and then i see this thread...


----------



## nuck_chorris (Jun 6, 2008)

mack_turtle said:


> i was going to put knobby tires on my road bike and take it to the local trails but people on this message board said "no, that's a terrible idea. it will never work. just buy a mountain bike. so i sold the roadie and bought a mtb. and then i see this thread...


i was told the same thing, i do believe the frame is not road specific maybe some are.
some road frames don't have the clearance for the 700x30 tires. i mean if you find a smaller knobby tire let me know


----------



## sndive (May 11, 2009)

*Questions from the newbie about the mtb dropbars*



shiggy said:


> I want a set of these
> 
> 
> 
> ...


what the heck is the two thingies extending from the dropbar
in https://mtbtires.com/features/bikes/why_dropbars.html
at the bottom pictures. the ones that vaguely look like aerobars
but hook downward and backwards

are the dropbars available somewhere or did you have to
somehow make them.


----------



## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Don't know what the extensions are, maybe Shiggy will notice your question (or you can try to PM him).

On-One makes bars like that (the Midge bar). I think there's a couple of others too.


----------



## Schmucker (Aug 23, 2007)

It's where he puts accessories so can access them from the drops.


----------



## monkeynut (May 7, 2010)

Hi Guys Ive just stumbled on your thread interesting !
I have been riding my cross bikes on rough stuff now for 20 years+ I have 3 crossers built up for just that purpose including an 30 year old Allan
will post some pics soon
I guess you have all been on Joels CX history site here
cross is soft these days
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/cx/


----------



## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

*1978 Raleigh Grand Prix*

I just converted this 10 speed to SS, just waiting for the Tioga Bloodhounds, few adjustments and we are set! :thumbsup:


----------



## CycleAddict (Aug 8, 2009)

I love all the monstercross threads. I really want to set my 29er up with drops at some point. Here's a bike I set up yesterday in the most monsterous fashion possible. Univega Gran Turismo with 700x35's which are actually wider than some 37's I had in the past. Almost no room at all out back with the 35. front has room for up to a 40mm tire I'll bet. Pretty cool, might see some trail use at some point after I true the rear wheel.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

here's my cross bike, although i dont really know if it's a monster cross (or even what the true definition is actually).
It had drops, but i ride it strictly on the trails, so the risers went on. It's a blast to ride, and with my new extra heavy duty tubes, i expect to do some fairly adventurous rides.


----------



## SlowerThenSnot (Jul 16, 2004)

*Mine*

It isn't fixed........ yet


----------



## agu (Jun 22, 2007)

here's mine!

loves playing in the mud!


----------



## wvucyclist (Nov 8, 2007)

I just acquired a Kelly Knobby X bent stay. It'll fit WTB 45c tires. Since Kelly set it up for V brakes, I'm running Tektro Mini-V's but the cable rubs the tire on the rear! I do plan on racing it, probably with fat tires (I'm not racing UCI Elite, so I can do that). It's more cross than mountain, but with the fat tires, definitely "monster cross". Now I have to choose between two monsters to race! Kelly pic to follow, but here's my modded gunnar.


----------



## kittens&cobras (Oct 17, 2008)

*True North Monster Cross*

Hugh Black did a great job on this frame.

EBB with a der. hanger for gears later on.

Nice Pacenti mountain fork crown....I can run up to 45c tires. Currently in trail mode I'm running 29x1.8 Bontrager Jones XR on Delgados.

Army green with pink powder coat...yet to scratch it.

Handles like a dream...for the first time ever I like riding the drops!

Due to my slowness I think trail riding will be it's domain...unless Ontario gets a bigger contingency of hessian single speed cross riders, I'll stay off the courses here.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

bump. I'll hopefully join you all in your monstercross conquests soon enough. Currently I'm stuck with 35mm only....


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> bump. I'll hopefully join you all in your monstercross conquests soon enough. Currently I'm stuck with 35mm only....


well i'm on 32's and i still posted. but like you, i mtb with the thing so i consider it to fit more in this catagory.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> well i'm on 32's and i still posted. but like you, i mtb with the thing so i consider it to fit more in this catagory.


I tend to consider a real "monster cross" as one you take on singletrack. I've seen some old Peugeots with 38 shoe horned in some side pulls and I think that counts because they are out on the trails. Not really feeling the drop bar 29er. Probably should call those "Shiggies."

Trails are about to get pretty muddy. In town, the loops are easy enough that I can get away with the tires I'm rolling, but I was thinking about trying to climb up wet rocks and then drop down slick roots. Not sure what to get now.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> I tend to consider a real "monster cross" as one you take on singletrack. I've seen some old Peugeots with 38 shoe horned in some side pulls and I think that counts because they are out on the trails. Not really feeling the drop bar 29er. Probably should call those "Shiggies."
> 
> Trails are about to get pretty muddy. In town, the loops are easy enough that I can get away with the tires I'm rolling, but I was thinking about trying to climb up wet rocks and then drop down slick roots. Not sure what to get now.


yea, makes sense. mine is for the trails only at this point. I even have mtb gearing on it (36-20). Someday i might get bigger tires, but i really like the pizza cutters. Kinda makes it more interesting, especially with the 80psi i have to run just to avoid pinch flats. It teaches you to be really light on the bike or it will rattle your nuts off. It feels like cheating on switchbacks though... the thing can corner like no tomorrow. I love the canti brakes too... they add to the fun, and i nearly go over the bars everytime i ride something with disks now. Total skidiotism.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> yea, makes sense. mine is for the trails only at this point. I even have mtb gearing on it (36-20). Someday i might get bigger tires, but i really like the pizza cutters. Kinda makes it more interesting, especially with the 80psi i have to run just to avoid pinch flats. It teaches you to be really light on the bike or it will rattle your nuts off. It feels like cheating on switchbacks though... the thing can corner like no tomorrow. I love the canti brakes too... they add to the fun, and i nearly go over the bars everytime i ride something with disks now. Total skidiotism.


Do you really ride at 80psi? How wide are your rims? My rims are pretty skinny, so I get scared about pinching below 50.

You really have to get drops on your bike at some point. Dirt drops will finish the joy of riding a cross bike on singletrack.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> Do you really ride at 80psi? How wide are your rims? My rims are pretty skinny, so I get scared about pinching below 50.
> 
> You really have to get drops on your bike at some point. Dirt drops will finish the joy of riding a cross bike on singletrack.


80-90psi.. i have road wheels so they're pretty narrow (and bent). We have a lot of sharp protruding rocks around here so even that isnt enough pressure sometimes.

I had drops, but they were road drops and i didnt like them. I know i gotta try some dirt drops at some point, but i dont wanna buy anything at this moment. I usually hold out for trades


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> 80-90psi.. i have road wheels so they're pretty narrow (and bent). We have a lot of sharp protruding rocks around here so even that isnt enough pressure sometimes.
> 
> I had drops, but they were road drops and i didnt like them. I know i gotta try some dirt drops at some point, but i dont wanna buy anything at this moment. I usually hold out for trades


Daimn that is high pressure. Mine are about 15mm wide with 35mm tires. I think I might build a wheelset that is a bit beefier if I can find some decent hubs at the neighborhood used **** bike store. The guys on the ******bag (cyclocross) forum probably pissed themselves when I said I rolled 50 and not 35....

Bad timing with the dirt drops. I have a pair I could have sent down if my friend hadn't stolen them from me...


----------



## hchchch (Aug 24, 2009)

Thanks for the bump. I've been looking for this exactly since changing out my rigid SS drop bar 29er to plain ol' drop bar 29er HT. I manage to clear the long epic climbs now with gears without stopping, but when out went the single gear, so did the challenge and fun.

I missed the efficiency and silence of a single gear. I'm lazy to change back everything on my 29er, so after building up a road fixie from 80's steel road frame, and after a little reading on this thread, I decided to get another 80's road frame for SS again. Need to bang out more room for the 700x42 wheel set I bought, clean it up, epoxy, and apply a fresh new coat. Then slap back on the old SS parts I stripped. Can't wait!

So how does the ride compare to a normal MTB frame? I've done rigid SS, so I'm not a stranger to finding better lines and feeling the trail.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

hchchch said:


> So how does the ride compare to a normal MTB frame? I've done rigid SS, so I'm not a stranger to finding better lines and feeling the trail.


it's all in the tires. i run 32cm with 80psi, so naturally it's going to be murder compared to a mtb with 2.3's and 30psi.

Stay off the brakes as much as possible and relax your arms. I only really get fatigued when i need to ride the brakes alot on rocky steep stuff.


----------



## SlowerThenSnot (Jul 16, 2004)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> it's all in the tires. i run 32cm with 80psi, so naturally it's going to be murder compared to a mtb with 2.3's and 30psi.
> 
> Stay off the brakes as much as possible and relax your arms. I only really get fatigued when i need to ride the brakes alot on rocky steep stuff.


beefy casings like on a conti tour ride tire and a bit of stans in your tubes well let yah drop 20 psi without an increase in pinches


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

SlowerThenSnot said:


> beefy casings like on a conti tour ride tire and a bit of stans in your tubes well let yah drop 20 psi without an increase in pinches


hmmm may have to try that, i just gashed another sidewall on my sb8's.

My buddy keeps telling me to go tubular but i dont feel like springing for another set of wheels. or tubular tires.


----------



## SlowerThenSnot (Jul 16, 2004)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> hmmm may have to try that, i just gashed another sidewall on my sb8's.
> 
> My buddy keeps telling me to go tubular but i dont feel like springing for another set of wheels. or tubular tires.


Stay away from tubular!!! rocks and them dont get along! only place for them is a standard cross race....


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

SlowerThenSnot said:


> Stay away from tubular!!! rocks and them dont get along! only place for them is a standard cross race....


i wouldnt think so either.. but he swears by them. Of course, he rides actual cross, where i'm just mtbing on my cross bike. My bike sees quite a few rock gardens.

I'll just stick to clinchers. I've been pretty good about avoiding flats so i'll stick with what works. I'll look into those tires you mentioned when my sb8's are shot.


----------



## SlowerThenSnot (Jul 16, 2004)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> i wouldnt think so either.. but he swears by them. Of course, he rides actual cross, where i'm just mtbing on my cross bike. My bike sees quite a few rock gardens.
> 
> I'll just stick to clinchers. I've been pretty good about avoiding flats so i'll stick with what works. I'll look into those tires you mentioned when my sb8's are shot.


not the lightest or best traction but have been very flat free and over 1500 miles... bomber


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

SlowerThenSnot said:


> not the lightest or best traction but have been very flat free and over 1500 miles... bomber





ISAR said:


> i wouldnt think so either.. but he swears by them. Of course, he rides actual cross, where i'm just mtbing on my cross bike. My bike sees quite a few rock gardens.
> 
> I'll just stick to clinchers. I've been pretty good about avoiding flats so i'll stick with what works. I'll look into those tires you mentioned when my sb8's are shot.


I'm wondering why you guys wouldn't put wide 700c rims on your cross bike- that'll help with the pinching.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> I'm wondering why you guys wouldn't put wide 700c rims on your cross bike- that'll help with the pinching.


well i could ride my mountain bike, that'll help with pinching. I guess it just depends on where you draw the line. I think having a bike that is totally unacceptable for trail riding is half the fun.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> well i could ride my mountain bike, that'll help with pinching. I guess it just depends on where you draw the line. I think having a bike that is totally unacceptable for trail riding is half the fun.


I wasn't suggesting you get larger tires, but have better traction. Cool if you don't want to go down that road, of course.

I took a small offroad trip today on the way to go study, and in the spirit of ISAR I decided I'd pump up to 70psi and I washed on a corner. Super.


----------



## hchchch (Aug 24, 2009)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> it's all in the tires. i run 32cm with 80psi, so naturally it's going to be murder compared to a mtb with 2.3's and 30psi.
> 
> Stay off the brakes as much as possible and relax your arms. I only really get fatigued when i need to ride the brakes alot on rocky steep stuff.


Thanks for the advice. But as for the tires, would putting on skinny tires on my 29er and pumping it up to 80 psi make it feel the same? I was thinking more along the lines of the roadish geometry that would change the ride more than the skinny tires, ie. more skittish handling and more responsive acceleration.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

hchchch said:


> Thanks for the advice. But as for the tires, would putting on skinny tires on my 29er and pumping it up to 80 psi make it feel the same? I was thinking more along the lines of the roadish geometry that would change the ride more than the skinny tires, ie. more skittish handling and more responsive acceleration.


the rake makes it steer a little faster i believe, but i dont notice much. I think the fact that the cross bike is rigid and my mtb is not is the biggest difference between the two. Both my bikes have pretty much the same cockpit dimensions and i run mtb risers on both.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> I wasn't suggesting you get larger tires, but have better traction. Cool if you don't want to go down that road, of course.
> 
> I took a small offroad trip today on the way to go study, and in the spirit of ISAR I decided I'd pump up to 70psi and I washed on a corner. Super.


it hooks up awesome. I think because it cuts into the trail a little and uses pretty much all the tread of the tire. I'm really not sure why, but it does climb and decend great, especially in loose switchbacks. The only thing it sucks in is soft sand on flats and climbs because it cant float on top.

I am odd man out on most stuff though, so my disclaimer is dont do what i do!


----------



## misterdangerpants (Oct 10, 2007)

I've been wanting to build a monster cross bike for awhile so I thought I'd convert my 953 650B SS to such a creature over the winter. 

View attachment 574017


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

misterdangerpants said:


> I've been wanting to build a monster cross bike for awhile so I thought I'd convert my 953 650B SS to such a creature over the winter.


Sweet bike. Glad it isn't me reaching for them bars...

Rumor is that Pacenti will have a cross-ish 650b coming down the pike...


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> it hooks up awesome. I think because it cuts into the trail a little and uses pretty much all the tread of the tire. I'm really not sure why, but it does climb and decend great, especially in loose switchbacks. The only thing it sucks in is soft sand on flats and climbs because it cant float on top.
> 
> I am odd man out on most stuff though, so my disclaimer is dont do what i do!


I love the skinny tires offroad and I'm looking forwards to seeing how sketchy they are going to get with the mud and wet technical sections. I'm with you on everything but the 80 psi and the wide rims (which I don't have yet, but am hoping to get...). But I likely don't have your mad skillz.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

umarth said:


> I love the skinny tires offroad and I'm looking forwards to seeing how sketchy they are going to get with the mud and wet technical sections. I'm with you on everything but the 80 psi and the wide rims (which I don't have yet, but am hoping to get...). But I likely don't have your mad skillz.


i run a fairly narrow wheel. whatever the stock roadish wheels are on the san jose. I changed the rear wheel to one with a freehub, but it's about the same width rim, just far less spokes.
I'd prefer to run maybe 50psi, but there's no way i can... i just ride too many rocky trails and i'm not exactly a featherweight (or smooth).
I need to borrow a helmet cam for a ride so you can see what i typically ride. Definitely no mad skillz here lol


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

Aw, bummer. I was really hoping that this OLD thread would stay true to Monster *CROSS*, and the drop bar 29er stuff would not sneak in.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

slocaus said:


> Aw, bummer. I was really hoping that this OLD thread would stay true to Monster *CROSS*, and the drop bar 29er stuff would not sneak in.


yea, i think we need a tire width limit in here.


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> yea, i think we need a tire width limit in here.


And no disc brakes.

A monster cross is a *CROSS* bike with fatter tires, not a 29er with skinny tires; huge difference.

Simple really. This is a monster cross.










This is not.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

slocaus said:


> Aw, bummer. I was really hoping that this OLD thread would stay true to Monster *CROSS*, and the drop bar 29er stuff would not sneak in.


My take is that "monstercross" has really loose definitions. Most of the time it is based around a drop bar and 700/29er wheels and tires, but I've seen the gauntlet of wheelsizes and bars. There are a lot of bikes with tires that don't have much business on singletrack and clearly never go there.

If I were defining the genre, it would be based around these principles- <45mm tires, road(ish) geometry and used on singletrack.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

slocaus said:


> And no disc brakes.
> 
> A monster cross is a *CROSS* bike with fatter tires, not a 29er with skinny tires; huge difference.
> 
> ...


agreed!


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

I think the folks who started this thread back in 2006 defined it very well.

The title is *"monster 'cross bikes"*

*Monster* *'cross bikes*. 'cross bikes are NOT 29er mountain bikes. Show me a 'cross bike with disc brakes and flat bars, and I will show you a 29er mountain bike that is not a monster 'cross bike.

Lots of other threads on this topic have gone way off into left field, and to bikes that do not carry the spirit. Let's keep the spirit alive, true and precise here; that is all I am asking. I guess it is silly, but like the folks posting suspended and geared bikes in the "show us your Rigid Single Speed bikes" thread, why? Why shotgun a picture of any bike into any thread? I don't get it.


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

slocaus said:


> I think the folks who started this thread back in 2006 defined it very well.
> 
> The title is *"monster 'cross bikes"*
> 
> ...


well thank god i have risers and not flat bars on my san jose 

I'm planning on getting dirt drops eventually, but i just couldnt handle the road drops anymore. They were too narrow and were hitting my forearms.


----------



## hatake (Jul 16, 2004)

Sorry for a noobie question here but other than cross race situation, how does a drop help you on mtb? Slapping a drop on a regular hard tail mtb frame (say Zaskar) not the right thing to do? Why? I guess why not, but why?

Or is it just another excuse to have another set of bikes?


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

hatake said:


> Sorry for a noobie question here but other than cross race situation, how does a drop help you on mtb? Slapping a drop on a regular hard tail mtb frame (say Zaskar) not the right thing to do? Why? I guess why not, but why?
> 
> Or is it just another excuse to have another set of bikes?


Shiggy has it all covered. Descending in the hooks is superior in the hooks. Especially rigid, because if you are jostled your hands stay put, so you can have nice, loose arms. I never got to the point where I liked them more than my riser bars on climbs and tech.


----------



## bolandjd (Jul 23, 2008)

I've been away from the forums for a little while, but its nice to see that everyone's still arguing about the true definition of 'monstercross'. I was worried we might have actually come to some concensus since 2006 on this subject. BTW, since disc brakes are officially legal this year for UCI competition, does that change anything for monstercross?


----------



## Cptn. Sense Of Direction (Mar 10, 2008)

i have a masi speciale cx. last year it was more of a cross with 35's, canti's and gears. right now it has 2.0 race kings, deore v brakes, xcheck fork, ss(currently a friend's eccentric rear wheel w/ bright orange rear rim), road rims, road drops, brass bell...and the frame is bright pink. i use it for cross racing and the 2.0's haven't held me back in the straights and help a ton in the corners. it also see's a lot of single track. I usually run 35 or so (i weigh 170) w/o problem on single track.

edit: for whatever reason the other monstercross thread won't load. hence posting here


----------



## rob1035 (Apr 20, 2007)

Dan, 
What levers are you using? I love my San Jose and am about to set it up with some flat bars but need levers...


----------



## SlowerThenSnot (Jul 16, 2004)

rob1035 said:


> Dan,
> What levers are you using? I love my San Jose and am about to set it up with some flat bars but need levers...


these work very well with cantis http://www.canecreek.com/component-other?product=flat-top


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

rob1035 said:


> Dan,
> What levers are you using? I love my San Jose and am about to set it up with some flat bars but need levers...


just some cheapo shimano levers. They do work very well though. When i dig my bike out of my van, i'll take a look for the model.


----------



## blak_byke (Jun 21, 2006)

Curious....

Why no discs if there are indeed cross bikes with disc brakes? Is it a culture/purist thing?


----------



## ISuckAtRiding (Jul 7, 2006)

blak_byke said:


> Curious....
> 
> Why no discs if there are indeed cross bikes with disc brakes? Is it a culture/purist thing?


yea, it's getting too close to an actual MTB at that point, IMO.
But then again, i dont really think a true singlespeed has things like eliptical chainrings or dual rear cogs, regardless if you cant shift on the fly.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

I'll say that I like me some cantis with my skinny tires because I want a different experience.



ISuckAtRiding said:


> yea, it's getting too close to an actual MTB at that point, IMO.
> But then again, i dont really think a true singlespeed has things like eliptical chainrings or dual rear cogs, regardless if you cant shift on the fly.


I want to hear why elliptical chainrings don't qualify as true SS. Just curious.


----------



## blak_byke (Jun 21, 2006)

ISuckAtRiding said:


> yea, it's getting too close to an actual MTB at that point, IMO.
> But then again, i dont really think a true singlespeed has things like eliptical chainrings or dual rear cogs, regardless if you cant shift on the fly.


Gotcha....I think.


----------



## ferday (Jan 15, 2004)

meh, this thread is just starting to prove that the line between elitist, retro grouch and purist is a thin one at best. the word "monster" 'cross in the thread title has quotation marks, that should mean something even to those of us who don't have english degrees, myself included.

if you feel like defining a bike category with any rigor feel free to slam a Dew and head on over to the AM forum.

this is the *SS forum*, where the only racism we are supposed to exhibit involves more than 1 gear, which seems like an easy distinction.

but hey i like to define categories too, it makes me feel good inside when i'm "all mountain" or "DH" rather than "old and slow".


----------



## blak_byke (Jun 21, 2006)

I'm old'ish and slow-er......er.....


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ferday said:


> meh, this thread is just starting to prove that the line between elitist, retro grouch and purist is a thin one at best. the word "monster" 'cross in the thread title has quotation marks, that should mean something even to those of us who don't have english degrees, myself included.
> 
> if you feel like defining a bike category with any rigor feel free to slam a Dew and head on over to the AM forum.
> 
> ...


Mehyonnaise. The fact that it is called "monster cross" differentiates it from SS mtbing. A 29er with drop bars is just that. A cross bike with disc brakes, is again, just that. A cross bike with cantis and 45mm slicks is a commuter. Of course, I don't have an English degree, so I'm probably making arbitrary designations.

My general point with "monster cross" is that we all ride mountain bikes and they are all fairly different. The "monster cross" makes me think several things- "cross" says road geometry and cantilevers (though UCI has switched this. That being said, you have discs on your mountain bike, cantis are a buttload of different fun). "Monster" means two things for me- bigger tires than UCI, or doing trails you never see in a cross series.

I don't think I am being any of the things you mentioned, nor ISAR or anyone else. I do think we're doing a good job describing which aspects we like, and why. I know you have your own interpretation of a cross bike in your Peregrine. I agree with it, but I prefer narrow tires for a couple reasons, which might mean you have a "purer" sense of monstercross.


----------



## ferday (Jan 15, 2004)

LOL

at the end of the day i don't give a crap it's just the internetz. it's really cold here, the trails are pretty well snowed in, i'm getting cranky and i think i'm having a mid-MTBR-life crisis. i'm starting to get irritated with this place. i need to go for a ride!

i had a crosscheck for years and sold it cause canti's aren't fun _at all_ in the winter, at least on the roads with cars around. i have ridden drop bar 29ers for a few years, fun enough in their own way.

and for the record i never mentioned my own monstercross bike, nor did i give my personal definition of "monstercross". that would've been a little silly to do, given i was ranting about over-defining, don't ya think?


----------



## Ash Andi (Jan 28, 2010)

Monster Cross, MTB w/ drops, 29er w/ alternative bars, etc. I don't care what you call it. Just ride it! *thumbs up*


----------



## rob1035 (Apr 20, 2007)

mijome07 said:


> . I don't care what you call it. Just ride it! *thumbs up*


:thumbsup:


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

misterdangerpants said:


> I've been wanting to build a monster cross bike for awhile so I thought I'd convert my 953 650B SS to such a creature over the winter.
> 
> View attachment 574017


What fork is that?


----------



## ds3000 (Jan 12, 2010)

Here you go, not sure what it's turned into really.


----------



## Mr Pink57 (Jul 30, 2009)

50cm Vassago Fisticuff

Has 38c now but ordered some Smart Sam 45c and just waiting on a new FD (sorry not SS) to get a OEM RK 2.2 f/r.


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

ds3000 said:


> Here you go, not sure what it's turned into really.


I like it. A lot.


----------



## monogod (Feb 10, 2006)

> And no disc brakes.


actually, i believe there are plenty of bona fide 'cross bikes that have disc brakes.


----------



## 1SPD (Apr 25, 2010)

I saw a video posted in one of the threads some time ago of a guy rolling down the road on a cross bike, then off onto a trail and through the woods. The guy had some really good skills as we saw him ride up to a log that crossed the trail diagonally, get up on the log, ride down the log and off the other side to continue on. If anyone remembers what I am talking about and has a link for it can you please post it?

As much as I want to completely finish my mtb build (basically get a new frame by next year) I am really starting to lean towards getting a cross bike. That way I can ride around with the wife out on the roads when she gets her bike this spring and then jump on some of the trails whenever I feel like it as well.


----------



## al415 (Mar 17, 2007)

1SPD said:


> I saw a video posted in one of the threads some time ago of a guy rolling down the road on a cross bike, then off onto a trail and through the woods. The guy had some really good skills as we saw him ride up to a log that crossed the trail diagonally, get up on the log, ride down the log and off the other side to continue on. If anyone remembers what I am talking about and has a link for it can you please post it?


This?


----------



## 1SPD (Apr 25, 2010)

Yep, that is it. I would love to ride those trails. I think this is the one video that has gotten me hooked on the idea of getting a cross bike!


----------



## umarth (Dec 5, 2007)

1SPD said:


> Yep, that is it. I would love to ride those trails. I think this is the one video that has gotten me hooked on the idea of getting a cross bike!


You need to get some friends that will let you borrow a bike or two.


----------



## 1SPD (Apr 25, 2010)

That would mean that I have to make some friends first! Seriously, I will just have to start talking to some of the guys I link up with at group rides as none of my immediate friends have one. But being a roadie in the beginning and riding mtb's the whole time it just seems like the next logical thing to try out. I would definitely have to give some thought as to whether or not I would want to go SS with it though since the plan would be to be able to get out and ride with my wife on the road as well (she will be on a geared bike). who knows at this point. But I do want to get out on one for a ride though.


----------



## Frequent_Traveller (Sep 9, 2009)

Actually I really wanted to have something like a monstercross for some time.

So I got it for 200 $ and have ridden it since May 2010, as you can see below :



















It's green and mean (but also kinda heavy). I'm thinking to make it SS (I had a SS MTB, stolen now, and loved it).


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)




----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

ink1373 said:


>


Those don't look like 700c wheels.


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

Hah, rest assured they are. The dudes at UBI said that it might be the biggest headtube ever to leave there, but I'm only 6'2". It's the Matt-Chester-style frame effect.


----------



## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

biggest pedals too.


----------



## vaultbrad (Oct 17, 2007)

That is a dream bike of mine, ink1373. I've been dreaming of building my own frame and that is exactly what mine would look like since I'm 6'2" as well.


----------



## monkeynut (May 7, 2010)

Racing in a MTB duathlon a couple of years ago on one of my crossers the pic was taken on the smoothest glass like part of the course .
finished half way up the field not bad for a 49 year old on a 25 year old bike!!
I was the only one on a cross bike
The chain set was a mix of stronglight and vintage suntour(SVX) with bar ends


----------



## kittens&cobras (Oct 17, 2008)

Rad!


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

ink1373 said:


> Hah, rest assured they are. The dudes at UBI said that it might be the biggest headtube ever to leave there, but I'm only 6'2". It's the Matt-Chester-style frame effect.


So you made this frame yourself? Cool!


----------



## vaultbrad (Oct 17, 2007)

Yeah, 'nut! That's righteous!


----------



## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

Frequent_Traveller said:


> Actually I really wanted to have something like a monstercross for some time.
> 
> So I got it for 200 $ and have ridden it since May 2010, as you can see below :
> 
> ...


I've got an old Nishiki in the garage that has one of those bolt on derailleur hangers on it. It's begging to be converted into a SS bike. It reminds me of your bike. BTW, nice job.


----------



## hammeredbean (Jul 30, 2011)

I am glad to see this thread! I have been toying around with the idea of putting 29x2.0's on my steel 29er...then I started pondering some pics of a Salsa Fargo with drop bars.....then I started pondering the percentage of time I now spend on dirt/gravel/asphalt/ vs trails.....then I found this thread. Now I am doing more pondering while I am wandering... Here is my question to those of you who have been riding these "other bars". They are obviously not road bars...so what are they and who makes them..WTB? How hard is the transition between going from mtn flat/riser bars to those? Also, it appearst that the brakes are usually in the drop portions of the bars which puts the hand position a fair bit lowere than the saddle height. In the past, I have raced endurance/marathon mtb series style races, but never reached a point to where I was any lower than dead even that saddle height. Does it stress your lower back more?? PLEASE keep the pictures coming. I am interested in building a rig like this. I have a vintage Le Tour frame hanging in the tool room..but I might like the idea of a drop bar 29er. I


----------



## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

hammeredbean said:


> I am glad to see this thread! I have been toying around with the idea of putting 29x2.0's on my steel 29er...then I started pondering some pics of a Salsa Fargo with drop bars.....then I started pondering the percentage of time I now spend on dirt/gravel/asphalt/ vs trails.....then I found this thread. Now I am doing more pondering while I am wandering... Here is my question to those of you who have been riding these "other bars". They are obviously not road bars...so what are they and who makes them..WTB? How hard is the transition between going from mtn flat/riser bars to those? Also, it appearst that the brakes are usually in the drop portions of the bars which puts the hand position a fair bit lowere than the saddle height. In the past, I have raced endurance/marathon mtb series style races, but never reached a point to where I was any lower than dead even that saddle height. Does it stress your lower back more?? PLEASE keep the pictures coming. I am interested in building a rig like this. I have a vintage Le Tour frame hanging in the tool room..but I might like the idea of a drop bar 29er. I


These are traditional road or cyclocross bikes with those bars and brakes that have had wider tires added and are ridden in the dirt.


----------



## Greggo (Sep 20, 2005)

Love this thread!

I am a noob to all of this, having just started biking again recently on a hard tail 26er. My bike has served me well, but I bought it in a highly misinformed state of mind and it is not really what I want at all. The stuff in this thread is coming close, but not quite hitting the mark exactly for me yet.

My ideal is "urban monster cross single speed belt drive".... I ride around the neighborhood on paved roads any chance I get, then often on dirt roads or field roads for most of my serious rides, and then on smooth trails to mix things up. All three types of riding are equally weighted for me, and even on the smooth trails my 26 inch wheels and MTBR frame make me feel like I am dragging stuff along I just don't need.

....more to follow so just skip the next post if I am boring you already : )


----------



## Greggo (Sep 20, 2005)

*....continued*

I agree with what I think I remember being posted earlier in this thread for the most part, but would add my own twist to the definition of "monster cross" to simply be cyclocross or heavy duty road frames with 35-48mm 700 tires, drop bars, and canti or disc brakes.

For the riding I described in my post above, here is my "Urban Monster Cross Single Speed Belt Drive" definition:

A cyclocross or urban frame set, preferably with a metal frame (steel, alu, or Ti) and carbon fork, the former to handle all season abuse and the latter to help soften the dirt roads and trails, tires bigger than regulation cx, but smaller than typical 2inch mtb tires, flat or riser bars like a typical urban bike, but wider and maybe even with bar ends like a mtb, and canti brakes to stay light and simple as I don't feel like I need a super duper amount of braking power like I have now on my 26er.... and the rest of my definition is self explanatory...

I test drove a Trek District and loved it, I am completely sold on belt drive single speed, but I didn't think the District was quite beefy enough for my dirt roads and trails and the LBS dudes thought it would max out with 32 or 35mm tires and I want a little more volume for my rigid trail bike. So I am looking at cyclocross frame sets (new Raleigh Twin Six looks perfect) and trying to educate myself on all the parts needed to build a nice light bike for my 1-2 hour rides and my 15-30 minute romps around town. The whole urban messenger thing is very inspirational but I don't want a fixie and skid skills to slow down or thin road tires. The cyclocross stuff comes close but I don't ride long enough to feel the need for drops and rather like the more mtb aesthetic. It all boils down to my own interpretation of what a "hybrid" bike should have been in the first place rather than what the major players have given us to fill that gap or at least attempt the one perfect "do it all" bike for me. I hope I am happy with what I am wishing for when I finally get my chance to build the Urban Monster Cross Single Speed Belt Drive.

Anyways, this thread has encouraged me to stay with this line of thinking and once funds permit, get my LBS to do a build for me.


----------



## drewboy79 (Jun 13, 2011)

I have got a Genesis Day One Drop Cyclocross single speed that I have had for a few months now. I have mostly been using it for commuting. I want to beef it up a bit though and make it more of a monster cross. The rims are Alex ACE-19 rims that have the following: ETRTO 622X17mm. I think my frame and forks after measuring might just fit a 700x45 tyre. I was thinking maybe Panaracer Fire Cross tyres. Does anyone know if they will go safely on those rims or is there a general rule of thumb? Cheers


----------



## fishcreek (Apr 10, 2007)

i am currently eyeing a 90's Bianchi Project-3 for a monstercross conversion. just wondering if anyone owned one of these and if it can handle some off-road action?


----------



## dwnhlldav (Feb 2, 2006)

I bought a 2011 Trek Sawyer on blow out and I'm in the process of converting it to a commuter/monster cross bike. Right now it's got a 46cm road bar on it. If I really like the drop bars, I'm going to invest in some Salsa Bell Lap bars. I've got two sets of wheels for it. both on XT hubs. Salsa delgado cross rims for the skinny tires (700x38c) and Velocity P35s for fat tires. Right now it's a pair of 2.55 WTB Weirwolfs. I need to take some pictures to share.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

*Tessier Monster Cross*

Here is my monster cross rig I designed and a friend of mine built. I now consult on his monster cross builds. Arguably, my favorite bike in my quiver.

Frame: Tessier Custom (Tessier Bikes, true aerospace/med industry guru)
Fork: Aluminum Lemond cross fork (will fit up to a Panaracer Fire Cross)
Handlebar: On-One Midge
-Thomson Post
-Bruce Gordon 43c Rock n Road Tires (best monstercross tire out there)
-Paul's hub rear w/White Industries Freewheel
-XTR 177.5 cranks
-Gearing 42x18
-XT v brakes with Tektro v levers
-Specialized tape
-Time Pedals


----------



## AlexCuse (Nov 27, 2011)

Those tires look amazing. Makes me wonder what the biggest my frame can handle are. And whether I could set them up tubeless I guess.


----------



## byknuts (Aug 9, 2008)

what's your frame?

BTW to all concerned: I fit schwalbe 28x2" fat franks on DT Swiss TK 7.1's in a 2010 salsa casseroll.
they're much closer to 45mm.
so if yer lookin for vintage style chubby tires... traction's kinda crap though.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

byknuts said:


> what's your frame?
> 
> BTW to all concerned: I fit schwalbe 28x2" fat franks on DT Swiss TK 7.1's in a 2010 salsa casseroll.
> they're much closer to 45mm.
> so if yer lookin for vintage style chubby tires... traction's kinda crap though.


Frame is my own design that was welded up by my friend Jeff Tessier at @ TessierBikes.com. His day job is designing CNC machines and products for a large medical supply company. He's the best fabricator (not just welder) I know. And I know some great ones for sure.

I highly recommend the Bruce Gordon tires. Anyone who wonders why many of us ***** about a 29er w/drop bars not being a monstercross bike will get it after running these tires. They truly bring out the all around aspect of a true monster cross (which technically sits between a cross bike and a 29er genre wise). It's a fast rolling gravel/pavement tire, but it grips better in sand and such off road than many 29er tires. Lightweight too. I run mine with cyclocross tires and road rims.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

AlexCuse said:


> Those tires look amazing. Makes me wonder what the biggest my frame can handle are. And whether I could set them up tubeless I guess.


The tires are amazing. Nuff said. I'll be testing some other 38c-45c tires in the near future for our upcoming website on monstercross, but it'll be tough to pull me off the Rock n Roads. The tire is amazing. It's also one of the few I think is unnecessary to run tubeless (even though I'm sure you could). The casing is exceptionally supple and I actually run mine fairly firm (40-50psi) which seems to work well in all conditions best that way...well, for me. (i'm 220lbs-230lbs with a threshold around 300 watts).


----------



## Tinman (Aug 18, 2013)

It is interesting to read how some want to, nearly insist on,defining monster cross by the bicycle itself rather than the terrain .......

(examples: must be down bars but can be MTB frame geometry, must be ridged fork, must run tires in these widths.........even "steel"...........wew...wow ) 

People like to be unique ................Special.

Ride what ever you like............cycling is about friends,fellowship,enjoying the outdoors,fitness and ........................FREEDOM


----------



## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Tinman said:


> It is interesting to read how some want to, nearly insist on,defining monster cross by the bicycle itself rather than the terrain .......
> 
> (examples: must be down bars but can be MTB frame geometry, must be ridged fork, must run tires in these widths.........even "steel"...........wew...wow )
> 
> ...


Monstercross is unique in itself, no need to attempt to redefine it.


----------



## Hairnet (Jul 23, 2013)

Well, it isn't SS and too heavy for CX and rides like a touring bike but still a lot of fun.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

The title "Drop-bar 29er" doesn't work for me, so I'm gonna call my disc-braked, front-suspended, WTB Dirt Drop-equipped 29er with 2.1" tires "Monstercross." Just try and stop me. Monsters come in all shapes and sizes. Haters gonna hate.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*Monsters come in all shapes and sizes...*



goto11 said:


> The title "Drop-bar 29er" doesn't work for me, so I'm gonna call my disc-braked, front-suspended, WTB Dirt Drop-equipped 29er with 2.1" tires "Monstercross." Just try and stop me. Monsters come in all shapes and sizes. Haters gonna hate.


Elaborating on my previous statement, I would say that one could arguably exclude drop-bar 26ers from the monstercross title and call them drop-bar mountain bikes, since that genre has existed since the early days of mountain biking, with Cunningham and even Tomac racing a drop-bar 26er back in the day, and no one considered calling it a 'cross bike.

We all would probably agree that monstercross bikes by definition exceed the narrow UCI definition of cyclocross bikes, so we do not need to dwell too heavily on the UCI restrictions.

That said, the barest fundamentals of a cyclocross bike today are drop bars and road-bike-size rims, fitted with off-road tires (does the UCI restrict cyclocross to drop bars? I'm not sure). Now that discs are becoming more popular on cyclocross bikes and are allowed by the UCI (correct me if I'm wrong here), I don't think anyone can argue that discs exclude a bike from being in the 'cross category.

So, my friends, it sounds the narrow definition proposed by some of you is basically a cyclocross bike with tires that exceed the UCI regulation, but are under 45mm? Someone even said that they must have "road bike geometry," but that's silly because cyclocross bikes have no set standard for geometry (or is this another example of my ignorance to UCI regulations?).

From what I have seen marketed as cyclocross bikes, there is plenty of overlap between cyclocross and 29er geometry. As I believe the progenitor of the term "Monstercross" posted elsewhere in these forums, "monsters come in all shapes and sizes," so your narrow definition seems a bit extreme.

Do wider tires on a cyclocross bike turn it into a 29er? Does adding a suspension fork to a cyclocross bike turn it into a 29er? I think not. What makes it a 'cross bike (monster or otherwise) is a drop bar riding position on terrain that is typically ridden with flat/riser bars.

I would propose a wider definition as follows...

*Monstercross:* [1] A bike with wagon wheels, dirt tires and drop bars, that exceeds the official cyclocross definition. ex. _We're going to ride to the trailhead on our monstercross rigs and crush some singletrack. _[2] The pastime of riding a monstercross bike through rough terrain. ex. _Anyone care to join us for some monstercross, followed by Gestalt Haus?_

UCI plays no part in defining my monster... Talk amongst yourselves.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

I've been following "monstercross" for about 10 years now. It's always been about tires smaller than a mountain bike, but bigger than a cross bike. 

I don't know why people get so defense of their bike being called a "Drop bar MTB", there is no shame in the title and wow....it is an accurate description. It's a mountain bike with drop bars. Simply is what it is. Some very fine drop bar mountain bikes in the past (Cunningham, Bridgestone, many others...) to modern day (Salsa Fargo and Singular Gryhpon). Damn nice bikes all of them. 

You throw a set of road tires on a cyclocross bike, it's still a cyclocross bike. I call my cyclocross bike my road bike, but in the sense it's what I use as a road bike. But it's still a cyclocross bike. 

Last....take the time to ride what is a true monstercross and you'll know exactly why those of us who've owned and even designed actual monstercross bikes feel the need to call it such. It's a bike all it's own. A true all around bike. Just pick up a set of Bruce Gordon Rock n Road tires, 43mm wide tires that roll fast on pavement and hook up off road well too. 

So be childish and say "haters gonna hate" kanye west rehetoric. Accept that drop bar mtb isn't a negative title, it's actually one of pride when you look at the history of such and who's ridden them. And try a true monstercross set up. You'll see why there is a difference.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

I should also point out that the people who came up with the term monstercross has never said "monsters come in all shapes and sizes". In fact, they've never posted to this thread or this site that I've ever seen. This thread is only a few years old, the term dates back 10+ years and described a very specific type of bike...most noted for the fact Matt Chester ran wtb and Midge dirt drops, and used 38c (think old Club Roost tires) up to the 44c Mutano Raptors rather exclusively. 

Thats' history folks and the real story. Not just some forum junkie. People who ride. And ride a lot.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

The sport of mountain biking, on which this website is based, has always been one of inclusivity. The culture of mountain biking has always been one where people of all backgrounds and abilities scrape together whatever parts they can buy or collect to create a machine that facilitates good times out in the woods and hills. 

There is no agreed-upon technical definition for the term monstercross. You cannot go to a bike shop and buy a monstercross bike. To turn monstercross into some narrow classification would destroy its charm. Monstercross is a genre of bikes comprised of custom-built or adapted frames, assembled by independent thinkers, with “monster” connoting a Frankenstein of a bike, cobbled together from pieces of different bikes.

Mountain biking has always been a counterculture movement that goes against the exclusive and super-competitive culture of the road bike racing world. Since this is a monstercross forum on a mountain biking website, we should strive to keep the monstercross definition an inclusive one. 

It appears that a large percentage of the proud cyclists who post pictures of their beloved creations here are being told, "no, that's not a monstercross bike," I think it’s clear that many of us are getting shot down when we reveal our monstercross creations, and that is wrong.

Monsters do come in all shapes and sizes. Anyone who assembles a bike for the purpose of riding both on-road (drop bars, 700c rims) and off-road (big tires) should not be disparaged for wanting to call their creation “monstercross.” In fact, it should be encouraged, for if we turn this into some category that can be mass-produced and pumped out in high volumes, then it ceases to be the monstrous creation it originally was.


----------



## vaultbrad (Oct 17, 2007)

Good words there.


----------



## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

Correction: No agreed upon definition in this forum. But that's it. It's quite well defined. 

A mountain bike is a mountain bike. Again, no shame in calling a mountain bike with drop bars a drop bar mountain bike. Zero. Zip. It's a term that's been used since drop bars first hit mountain bikes in the 80's. When Tomac road them that's what it was called. That's fact. That's history. The term far pre-dates this thread. Salsa refers to the Fargo as a drop bar mountain bike. Singular's Gryphon you'll see over and over called a drop bar mountain bike. Drop bar mountain bikes have been what they are for about 30 years. Argue what you want, Just how it is. 

Not sure why you feel so negative to let a perfectly admirable title stick? 

Monstercross roots and definition is as I mentioned below. It is what product managers and such looking at the category are defining it as when considering it for the next model year. Which you'll see in the next 2-3 years a monstercross bike will be something you can buy. And again, go ride some Bruce Gordon Rock & Rock tires or such. You'll see there is a HUGE difference between a drop bar mountain bike and monstercross. 

In the end...yes, call what you want what you will. But doesn't change what it is. I throw slicks on my mountain bike, it isn't now a road bike. I can call it my road bike (and I have) but I don't get upset when someone calls it a mountain bike. Because thats' still what it is.


----------



## phsycle (Apr 14, 2011)

I vote to create a sanctioned body to oversee the use of various cycling terms, such as this "monstercross" that has some people's undies in a severe knot. Mis-use and mislabeling of bikes will result in a week of online ridiculing and flaming. Further offenses may result in the prosecutor screaming at the monitor and actually emerging from his mother's basement in absolute fury. We'll call them Nerds Who Never Ride Association.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

phsycle said:


> I vote to create a sanctioned body to oversee the use of various cycling terms, such as this "monstercross" that has some people's undies in a severe knot. Mis-use and mislabeling of bikes will result in a week of online ridiculing and flaming. Further offenses may result in the prosecutor screaming at the monitor and actually emerging from his mother's basement in absolute fury. We'll call them Nerds Who Never Ride Association.


I would nominate juansevo for president of the NWNRA, but 30 years of riding cross and mountain bikes has made me ineligible to vote. Have fun with your exclusive club. I'm going to go ride my bikes, and call them whatever best describes the way I use them.:madman:


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

*The monstercross classification enforcement police can go home now...*

Just to lay this stupid debate to rest, here is the quote from the vulture's mouth himself:



vulture said:


> I call bikes that are more monsterous than cross but not quite a regular 29" wheel mountain bike "monster cross" nobody cares if they are single speed or fixed or geared or whatever, I just thought of this as a way to talk to my customers. As far as this being a trendy sub-genre dont be worried. You can call your bike anything you want. Just say RAHRR. Real monsters come in all sizes and shapes. Elmo is a monster. Godzilla is a monster. There are Gila monsters and monster Trucks. Some would say that bigfoot is a monster, but he's not real like Elmo and Godzilla. Speaking of Godzilla, check out the FuManchu live cover from Germany. Those guys rock!
> cheers, Wade


You can find it 3/4 of the way down on this page in this forum.

RAHRR


----------



## proline69 (Apr 14, 2009)

kittens&cobras said:


> Hugh Black did a great job on this frame.
> 
> EBB with a der. hanger for gears later on.
> 
> ...


Sharp looking rig


----------



## Sheepo5669 (May 14, 2010)

Typical Monster X Bullish.


----------



## james-o (Nov 8, 2010)

"I throw slicks on my mountain bike, it isn't now a road bike."
Maybe it is. Objectivity vs subjectivity. I'd say it is now a road bike, you changed the tyres for the purpose of riding on the road. It probably wouldn't be a 'branded' idea of a road bike, well f- it, categorisation is just a part of easy consumerism. 
Well said goto11.


----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

Pre-build: Seatpost & stem fit.


----------



## AlexCuse (Nov 27, 2011)

Whoa, not sure I've ever seen one with a suspension fork. Bad ass.

I think this probably qualifies?



I promise its going to be a singlespeed soon for the winter. I just put on a set of old IRC mythos tires, those make it look a bit more monster-y I suppose. Have a pair of firecross that I hope fit once it gets really nasty out there, but the frame was built for rock n roads on a 23mm road rim (even that proved somewhat challenging with a 68mm BB shell). It fits those with the sliders pretty far forward so I'm hopeful. The angles are a little steep (73/73) but thats how I like em.


----------



## misterdangerpants (Oct 10, 2007)




----------



## goto11 (Jun 12, 2009)

AlexCuse said:


> Whoa, not sure I've ever seen one with a suspension fork. Bad ass.


Thanks, AlexCuse!

This is my third attempt at creating a monster, and it's definitely a keeper. I found an amazing deal on a 2009 Mooto X YBB 29 10th Anniversary Edition frame with the same TT length as a large Ibis Hakkalugi CX frame. I'm 6'1", so it fits perfectly with drop bars. I took it on a ride last weekend that's scary even on my 5.5" travel FS bike, and cleaned the whole thing, passing a couple of mountain bikers walking their bikes through the rough stuff on the way down. I've broken too many bones to enjoy riding on dirt without some cush.

Your build is pretty sweet. I think I'll go with Rock n' Roads when I wear out the WTB Nanos.


----------



## slohr (May 22, 2008)

What about a new category for the disputed bikes? How about CryptoCross? 

I just like looking at all of these bikes. I'll go back to another thread now.


----------



## bgenesis12 (Jul 11, 2014)

Sheepo5669 said:


> View attachment 877430
> 
> View attachment 877431
> 
> ...


Whatcha ridin? :0!!


----------



## proline69 (Apr 14, 2009)

misterdangerpants said:


>


Great looking rig , love those tires . So what bike is it ? And your components ?


----------



## misterdangerpants (Oct 10, 2007)

proline69 said:


> Great looking rig , love those tires . So what bike is it ? And your components ?


Thanks. Here are the specs from that particular build:

Frame: 2007 Ted Wojcik; Black Cat swinger dropouts installed in December 2012 by Circle A Cycles
Fork: Chris Igleheart
Hubs: Shimano XT
Spokes: DT Swiss
Rims: Velicity Blunt
Tires: Schwalbe Super Moto 2.35
Pedals: Shimano XTR
Crank, Chainring & Bottom Bracket: White Industries ENO, White Industries 32T, White Industries Titanium
Chain: SRAM
Cog: Chris King 16T
Handlebars: WTB Dirt Drops
Stem: Thomson Elite X4
Headset: Chris King NoThreadSet
Brakes: Avid BB7
Brake Levers: Cane Creek SCR-5
Saddle: Brooks Swallow Titanium
Seat Post: Paul Components Tall & Handsome
Head Badge: Jen Green

It's currently disassembled awaiting the next build. It'll be something similar, though the stem is going to a Firefly (titanium) +20 degree. I had it fabricated back in December for this as I wanted the handlebars to be at a higher position.

You can see it in its many forms here.


----------



## bigringrider101 (May 13, 2006)

slocaus said:


> And no disc brakes.
> 
> A monster cross is a *CROSS* bike with fatter tires, not a 29er with skinny tires; huge difference.


This has been going on for a long time. People like you think you came up with concept of "monstercross'. When I ride my El Mariachi set up with drop bar, people tell me ...-Oh you're riding your cross bike- and I go... Excuse me It's a Monstercross! 
If we were talking about monster trucks the BIGGER the tires are the more "monster truck" that would be. Right? So here it's the same frisking thing. A fat bike set up with drop bars, to me it would be the ****ing king of monster cross.


----------



## mathoss (Mar 30, 2004)

bigringrider101 said:


> This has been going on for a long time. People like you think you came up with concept of "monstercross'. When I ride my El Mariachi set up with drop bar, people tell me ...-Oh you're riding your cross bike- and I go... Excuse me It's a Monstercross!
> If we were talking about monster trucks the BIGGER the tires are the more "monster truck" that would be. Right? So here it's the same frisking thing. A fat bike set up with drop bars, to me it would be the ****ing king of monster cross.


Amen!


----------



## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

Higbee said:


> I heard the term "monster 'cross" from Wade the Vulture. I really like riding fixed offroad and when ordering my new frame I thought of going the "monster 'cross" style. If I could only have one bike it would be a "monster 'cross" for versatility. Since I don't only have to have one bike I went with more of a mountain bike style frame based on drop bars (lots of standover and EBB for discs). I have a suitalbe road road frame that can be made into a fixie and it will take some 35c tires no problem. The other issue for me is where I ride. Locally I have a lot of deep sand on the trails and a wider tire is nice to have, the same can be said for winter riding on the snow. I also live near the Canadian rockeis where the trails can be very rough and the decents long and steep. Of course I want to try some 44c tires on my bike when I get it! I am very impressed with what people can ride on 'cross bikes and I will get one some day.


I recently came across this article that contends to know the origin of the term:

Monstercross: What it really is & where it really came from

This doesn't quite match up with the account from the early part of this thread. My impression was that Wade at Vulture coined the term to describe his personal ride, pictured here:









Anyone have any additional info? Has Wade ever spoken about this?


----------

