# Norco Sasquatch vs. Ibex Atlas Sport vs. ??



## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Hi guys,
I've got about 1000 dollars saved up and I want to purchase a decent bike to learn on while I'm at school in Ithaca New York. I'm looking for something that can handle my 5 foot 11, 200lb frame on some All-Mountain and light freeride trials. The Norco Sasquatch and the Ibex Atlas Sport were the first bikes that came to mind. For about 1000 dollars, which one would you guys recommend? I'm looking for the bike that will perform best for 1000 dollars. I don't plan on spending any money to upgrade the bike (if I do upgrade at all), until next summer.

Any input as to which bike would better suit me would be fantastic. As would any recommendation for a different new or used bike. Thanks guys!


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## idaho biker 90 (Jun 24, 2007)

*norco...*

Norco would be the better bike from my standpoint. It has better components, yah its a HT but it has 6" of front suspension. Yah its msrp is $1100, but most people would sell it for about 8 or 9 hundred.


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## Freerydejunky (Sep 21, 2006)

In sorry but I disagree...

Look at the drivetrains Ibex 
Deore vs. X7.

Brakes
Hayes 9 vs. Juicy 5's 

Those two alone would send my in Ibex territory. 

Now having riddin a Atlas I can say that is quick handling, stable, and climbs like a goat. If your looking at AM/FR then its your kind of bike. For the price I say its a good bike and can be upgraded over time. Ibex Customer service is great. 

But there are a few others out there for around the same price with better components and set ups. 

Buying used is always an option. 

Im surprised Dogonfr hasn't chimed in. He must be away from the computer


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

gah, I'll have to get this. yes, the ibex is a better bike. You can find some pretty sweet deals out there if you look for something used, but an atlas would be a pretty good bike for someone to "learn" on because of its versatility. you dont want to buy a kona stinky, then find out you like XC/AM better.


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## mrpercussive (Apr 4, 2006)

The Atlas is definitely capable of some serious FR riding... The one dogonfr's got has been put through some serious norcal DH/FR abuse... extremely flickable and still able to plough through rock gardens. Climbs like a goat too... I've had some saddle time on it and all i can say is wow...


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## Raptordude (Mar 30, 2004)

Don't get either.

Buy my Weyless 67 for $1300 if my friend doesn't buy it.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Raptordude said:


> Don't get either.
> 
> Buy my Weyless 67 for $1300 if my friend doesn't buy it.


Nice plug. I'm not spending that much cash for a bike. The extra 300 dollars will more than cover the cost of hydration and riding gear.

Ibex it is then!


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Nice plug. I'm not spending that much cash for a bike. The extra 300 dollars will more than cover the cost of hydration and riding gear.
> 
> Ibex it is then!


Sweet bike :thumbsup: you'll have a blast with it :cornut:


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## Strykar (Mar 15, 2007)

check out ironhorse. they have some sweetassed deals and good stuff for components


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> Sweet bike :thumbsup: you'll have a blast with it :cornut:


Yeah, I've read your threads about your ibex. Sweet deal you got there!


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Strykar said:


> check out ironhorse. they have some sweetassed deals and good stuff for components


Exactly which Ironhorse is a sweetassed deal? Everyone I've seen (new at least) was really expensive. I wanted to get a 7PointX but quickly came to the realization that spending 2500 dollars on a bike as an undergrad is a dumb thing to do.

What model were you referring to specifically and were you talking new or used?


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Exactly which Ironhorse is a sweetassed deal? Everyone I've seen (new at least) was really expensive. I wanted to get a 7PointX but quickly came to the realization that spending 2500 dollars on a bike as an undergrad is a dumb thing to do.
> 
> What model were you referring to specifically and were you talking new or used?


RS has some sweet deals on blow out's. 

http://www.rscycle.com/s.nl/sc.7/category.55/.f


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> RS has some sweet deals on blow out's.
> 
> http://www.rscycle.com/s.nl/sc.7/category.55/.f


I see! Would any of those IronHorses in the 800-1100 dollar range compare to the Atlas Sport?


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr, I'm surprised you linked to that. I'm no expert, but it looks to me that the Ibex at $999 dollars new still has better components than any Iron Horse up to 1300 dollars. Is there anything there with equal or better components?


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

That discounted 2006 7point5 looks great! But I'm not exactly looking for a 1600 dollar bike..........


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

What about the K2 Lithium?


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> dogonfr, I'm surprised you linked to that. I'm no expert, but it looks to me that the Ibex at $999 dollars new still has better components than any Iron Horse up to 1300 dollars. Is there anything there with equal or better components?


It's called a educational tool  There are allot of sweet bikes out there & looking at them all then making a decision is what it's about. I have been over impressed with the Atlas, quality & bang for the buck Ibex is very hard to beat. :drumroll:


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> It's called a educational tool  There are allot of sweet bikes out there & looking at them all then making a decision is what it's about. I have been over impressed with the Atlas, quality & bang for the buck Ibex is very hard to beat. :drumroll:


Yes, thats why I'm surprised you even mentioned Iron Horse. In any case, the K2 Lithium looks like its got great components as well. I'm thinking about getting that too.


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Yes, thats why I'm surprised you even mentioned Iron Horse. In any case, the K2 Lithium looks like its got great components as well. I'm thinking about getting that too.


I cant speak on the K2 ride but the 4-5" travel is not worth it because you need to adjust the shock for the differen leverage. My old Versus Blitz was a 4-5-6" travel frame, always rode it in the 6" setting, two years. :thumbsup: The pic is unclear on the seatstay to chainstay, if it's a clevis that is nice & solid but cost more to manufacture. If it's 2 flats bolted together with a bearing that is a very common cheap way of manufacturing.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Well if you need pics, here is a web album with a bunch of large ones.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

And I'd always run the bike in the 5" travel setting so the shock adjustment is moot.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

K2 Has a tora-not exactly AM/FR capable fork. Iron horse is a strong frame (any of the 800+ models are plenty strong enough to handle AM/FR and then some)

the ibex-never owned one, but chances are you have to upgrade it heavily for FR the stock fork, and cranks wont take the punishment (if they are suited to what their respective companies rate them for once again i dont own or have ever touched an ibex nor a manitou relic or truvativ firex) its great and all that they have juicy fives and a nice drivetrain or w/e but i personally have found that to not be the most important thing when riding aggressively (you arent planning to race right?) i personally run bb7s and they serve their purpose fine.

now when it comes to freeride a budget constraint like yours isnt bad-thanks to iron horse
just about EVERYONE who come looking for a budget freeride bike gets the same answer
the iron horse yakuza aniki
freeride specific fork and frame, very good ratings, and upgradeable, but i would go a step up if you are serious the sohon bucho is up for 899 dollars, if you can deal with 8 inches of travel i say go for it, but make sure you like freeride and dh-and you get a 20 mm front axle which means if and when you blow out the stock rst rapide (which apparently isnt all that bad of a fork) your options are MUCH more wide open


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Alright then I have two options as far as Iron Horse goes.

I found 2 2006 7point5s, one is used for about 1300 dollars and the other is 1600 brand new. I also found 2 Aniki's for about 600 dollars each. I know the basic difference between the two bikes. I'm somewhat familiar with component quality as well as the merits of the DW Link suspension, but I'd like someone else's input.
What do you think, potvinwannab?


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

7point5 definitley a better bike(why settle for the rest when you can buy the best?)


aniki definitley a better learners bike

if you get the 7point 5 once again make sure you want to do freeride-pure freeride/dh unless you plan on buying a different fork and a stiffer rear spring so you can do all mountain 

whats the spec list on the used 7point5? and how "used" is it, make sure its from someone reputable-remember never pay with western union, moneygram, money order, cheque, and never send cash in the mail
.
the ONLY ways to pay for a bike is via COD, paypal(ebay transaction is the safest!!!), and a cash-bike handover


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Specs:
Frame: 7" TRAVEL DW-LINK FREERIDE FRAME, 1.5" HEAD TUBE, 150MM X 12MM THRU AXLE HUB, 83MM BB SHELL, REPLACEABLE DERAILLEUR HANGER
Fork: Rock Shox Boxxer Ride U-Turn, 130mm -170mm travel
Rear Shock: PROGRESSIVE 5TH ELEMENT COIL 3 WAY 9X.275
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO SAINT W/ E.THIRTEEN
Rear Derailleur: SRAM X.9 MID-CAGE
Shifters: SRAM X.9 TRIGGER
Brakes Levers: HAYES HFX-9 -HD W/ BFL LEVER
Brakes: HAYES HFX-9 -HD W/ V8 ROTOR
Chain: SRAM PG-951 WITH POWERLINK
Crankset: FSA GAP MEGA XL 170 MM
Cassette: SRAM PG-970 11-34 9 SPEED
Pedals: CRANK BROS 5050X PLATFORMS

Bottom Bracket: FSA MEGA XL
Headset: FSA ORBIT IS11 W/ E .THIRTEEN REDUCER CUP
Saddle: SDG BEL-AIR
Seat Post: SDG 6061 I-BEAM
Handlebar: FUN FATBOY 30MM RIDE 710 WIDE 31.8 CLAMP
Grips: ODI RUFFIAN LOCK-ONS
Stem: FUNN DIRECT MOUNT
Tires: WTB TIMBERWOLF STEEL DNA 2.5
Wheelset: ALLOY DH HUBS SEALED BEARING, THROUGH AXLE 32, HOLE
Weight: DT/SWISS FR6.1D
Color: BRICK RED

Quite good for a 1300 dollar bike, I'd say. Although, the fork is purely for downhill riding, as you stated.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

The bike is slightly used (less than a month) and looks good in the pics, although the pics are somewhat small. I'd be paying via paypal.

Although, my riding style would probably involve more all mountain type riding than pure freeride or downhill. And I don't want to spend any more money after getting the bike, except to fix/maintain it. I'm guessing the Aniki is a better bike for me then?


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Well if you need pics, here is a web album with a bunch of large ones.


Pic's dont show the back of the bike.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

hmmmm a dual crown for a begginer...lets get some other opinions?

if your fine with it go for it (and if you can afford it)


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> Pic's dont show the back of the bike.


Dude, there are 127 pics in that album, not one showed what you wanted?


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> hmmmm a dual crown for a begginer...lets get some other opinions?
> 
> if your fine with it go for it (and if you can afford it)


Well the 7point5 is a nicer bike, but its also 1000 dollars more than the Aniki I'm considering. And its not exactly suited to what I will be doing with it. As much as I'd like to own a great bike like that, I think the Aniki is better, especially since its so much cheaper. I'd have no money left over if I got the 7point5, but I'd have a great deal left if I bought the aniki.

Ithaca New York is a very hilly area so maybe once I get acclimated to the trails near my school I'll get a 7point. I don't quite know if I'll be able to bomb down into the gorges at 50 miles per hour.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Specs on the used Aniki

Fork: SPINNER AMMO 1, OX VALVING, 20MM THRU AXLE, 150MM TRAVEL
Rear Shock: FOX VANILLA R 8.75"X2.5"
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO ALIVIO, 34.9MM CLAMP
Rear Derailleur: SHIMANO ALIVIO
Shifters: SHIMANO ALIVIO EZ-FIRE
Brakes Levers: TEKTRO ALLOY
Brakes: TEKTRO IO SPORT W/8" ROTOR
Chain: KMC Z72
Crankset: FSA ALPHA DRIVE, 170MM
Cassette: SHIMANO HG-40, 11-32T, 8 SPEED

Pedals: WELLGO ALLOY PLATFORMS


Bottom Bracket: FSA POWER DRIVE, 73X118MM
Headset: FSA NO 60ST 1.5 TO 1-1/8 REDUCER STEEL
Saddle: WTB PURE V SPORT
Seat Post: ALLOY MICRO ADJUST, 30.0MM
Handlebar: IRON HORSE DH, 31.8MM CLAMP
Grips: N/A
Stem: ALLOY DH STEM, 31.8MM CLAMP
Tires: ITS NINJA, 2.6" FRONT/2.35" REAR
Wheelset: WTB DUAL DUTY FREERIDE


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

hey its not like the aniki is going to snap or anything it will be a great bike for you and will serve its purpose well, and if something breaks just upgrade as you go along. Neither will ever break unless you do something absolutely horrendously stupid 

i absolutely agree aniki is a bike for you, and when you get the money and the skill throw on some 66's (or 55's that come out next year) a dhx some holzfeller cranks (or whatever upgrades you want) and it will be every bit as qualified as a 7point5


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> hey its not like the aniki is going to snap or anything it will be a great bike for you and will serve its purpose well, and if something breaks just upgrade as you go along. Neither will ever break unless you do something absolutely horrendously stupid
> 
> i absolutely agree aniki is a bike for you, and when you get the money and the skill throw on some 66's (or 55's that come out next year) a dhx some holzfeller cranks (or whatever upgrades you want) and it will be every bit as qualified as a 7point5


Fantastic. 800 dollars and I'll have a capable AM/FR bike along with a good helmet and some good tools (and maybe even a camel back). Even cheaper than getting an Atlas sport!
Great!


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

find out what spring rate is on the rear, because at your weight you WILL need a new one (anyone over 100 pounds needs a new one  ) if you are buying the bike brand new then iron horse will send you one for free, or see if the online shop caries them-if not you have to buy one, unless the person that previously owned it had the spring replaced already


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

One last question, I'm 5'10" with a 30-31 inch inseam. I believe a 17" Aniki would suit me well, what do you guys think?


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Any recommendations for the proper spring stiffness?


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

pfft ionno 500 mebbe? im no expert in this field as i run my shock at like 650 with the preload screwed way down so my shock barely moves unless faced with a large hit (terrific for climbing lolz) ask a guy named shivermetimbers hes about your weight i think and you can find him in just about every thread


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Aright, I'll shoot him a PM.


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Specs on the used Aniki
> Tires: ITS NINJA, 2.6" FRONT/2.35" REAR


 What are these  Also buying a used bike & the grips are listed as N/A :skep: this is very fishey


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

hey whitebread dont buy a used aniki they are a very good price brand new, unless the used aniki has been souped up


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> What are these  Also buying a used bike & the grips are listed as N/A :skep: this is very fishey


As sketchy as it sounds, the guy is within driving distance. I sent him a message asking if I could drive up and get/pay for the bike in person. Any fishness will be assessed upon arrival at the guys house. If its too sketchy, I just leave and no harm done. I'll have burned a couple dollars of gas but thats no biggie.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> hey whitebread dont buy a used aniki they are a very good price brand new, unless the used aniki has been souped up


Well then I have two options:

A brand new 06 Aniki from rscycle.com for 600+ shipping or a new 07 Aniki for 787+ shipping. The used on would be 600 with pickup, so I'd save 50 dollars in shipping. Wouldn't have a warranty though. Do you guys think the extra 187 dollars for the 07 is worth the cost?


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

probably depends once again on just how used the one your buying is, yet moreso, if you do break it somehow it has no warranty and then you have just lost all the benefits of buying a good cheap upgradeable frame, and have to spend EVEN MORE, get the new one


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> probably depends once again on just how used the one your buying is, yet moreso, if you do break it somehow it has no warranty and then you have just lost all the benefits of buying a good cheap upgradeable frame, and have to spend EVEN MORE, get the new one


Well are iron horse warranties transferable? The seller says its about a month old.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

i dont think many mass production companies-if any have transferabel warranties, call iron horse about it


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> i dont think many mass production companies-if any have transferabel warranties, call iron horse about it


Mass production as in bikes I'd assume. Many major companies in other markets have transferable warranties.

I will call Iron Horse in the morning.

I looked over the specs of the two Anikis and I don't really think the 07 is worth the extra cash. What do you guys think?

07 Specs:
Frame: 6" TRAVEL FREERIDE DUAL SUSPENSION SINGLE PIVOT W/ SEALED BEARINGS, 1.5 HEADTUBE, REPLACEABLE DERAILLEUR HANGER, INTERNATIONAL DISC BRAKE MOUNT
Fork: SPINNER AMMO 1, OX VALVING, 20MM THRU AXLE, 150MM TRAVEL
Rear Shock: FOX VANILLA R 8.75"X2.5"
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO ALIVIO, 34.9MM CLAMP
Rear Derailleur: SHIMANO ALIVIO
Shifters: SHIMANO ALIVIO EZ-FIRE
Brakes Levers: TEKTRO ALLOY
Brakes: TEKTRO IO SPORT W/8" ROTOR
Chain: KMC Z72
Crankset: FSA ALPHA DRIVE, 170MM
Cassette: SHIMANO HG-40, 11-32T, 8 SPEED
Pedals: WELLGO ALLOY PLATFORMS

Bottom Bracket: FSA POWER DRIVE, 73X118MM
Headset: FSA NO 60ST 1.5 TO 1-1/8 REDUCER STEEL
Saddle: WTB PURE V SPORT
Seat Post: ALLOY MICRO ADJUST, 30.0MM
Handlebar: IRON HORSE DH, 31.8MM CLAMP
Grips: N/A
Stem: ALLOY DH STEM, 31.8MM CLAMP
Tires: ITS NINJA, 2.6" FRONT/2.35" REAR
Wheelset: WTB DUAL DUTY FREERIDE
Weight: 42.4 LBS
Color: Black Satin or Green Satin

06 Specs:
Frame: 6" TRAVEL FREERIDE DUAL SUSPENSION SINGLE PIVOT W/ SEALED BEARINGS, 1.5" HEADTUBE, REPLACEABLE DERAILLEUR HANGER, INTERNATIONAL DISC BRAKE MOUNT
Fork: SPINNER AMMO1, 20MM THRU AXLE, 150MM TRAVEL
Rear Shock: APRO GLYDE R COIL, 9"X2.5"
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO ALIVIO
Rear Derailleur: SRAM SX.5 MIDE CAGE
Shifters: SRAM SX.4 TRIGGER
Brakes Levers: TEKTRO ALLOY
Brakes: HAYES MX2 MECHANICAL DISC W/ 8" ROTOR
Chain: KMC Z72
Crankset: FSA ALPHA DRIVE
Cassette: SRAM PG-830, 11X32, 8 SPEED
Pedals: WELLGO ALLOY PLATFORM

Bottom Bracket: FSA POWERDRIVE
Headset: FSA 1.5 TO 1 1/8 REDUCER, STEEL
Saddle: WTB PURE V SPORT
Seat Post: ALLOY MICRO ADJUST
Handlebar: IRON HORSE DH, 31.8MM CLAMP
Grips: BLACK RUBBER
Stem: IRON HORSE ALLOY DH STEM
Tires: WTB MOTORAPTOR 2.4 (KENDA KINETICS ON 24" WHEEL MODEL)
Wheelset: WTB DUAL DUTY FREERIDE RIMS, 32 HOLE ALLOY DISC HUBS, 14G STAINLESS SPOKES
Weight: N/A
Color: GRAY


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

haha if anything the 2006 is the better buy (tektro brakes suck) but there may have been improvements in the spinner ammo one, but both have great reviews so you cant go wrong!


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

The Atlas is better spec'd then either of those.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> The Atlas is better spec'd then either of those.


Yes but its also more money, I'd expect it to be better spec'd than the Aniki's.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> haha if anything the 2006 is the better buy (tektro brakes suck) but there may have been improvements in the spinner ammo one, but both have great reviews so you cant go wrong!


2006 it is then.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

:thumbsup: yah and when you get your stock atlas take it to a freeride park  

yakuza is better, and the amount of money it will take to make the drivetrain more smooth (if it even matters to you) will still be bundles less then it will be just to replace the fork on the atlas let alone all the other xc-rated parts


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> 2006 it is then.


Dont forgt to post bike porn when you get it. :band:


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

dogonfr said:


> Dont forgt to post bike porn when you get it. :band:


Will do!


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

You ARE NOT going to be happy on a yakuza aniki, the fork is a terrible piece of crap, a j1 is a better fork than the spinner ammo. the rear shock is also a waste of money (glyde r coil or whatever). the frame is heavy and NOT even close to being a AM friendly bike. Dont cheap out, you WILL regret it. as far is the strength of the manitou fork and cranks on the atlas, the cranks are AM cranks, they're okay...upgrading your cranks is about$50.00 $20.00 used. The atlas has a better rear shock, the manitou fork on the atlas can handle drops up to about 6 feet. its pretty much a manitou black. the atlas actually has name brand compenents. juicy 5 VS hayes mechanicals? 

for the small price difference...you're making a HUGE mistake, most people hate the stock aniki, and usually replace the fork, bars, cranks, rear shock and brakes within a month. that is going to bring you over that budget that you had set for yourself. if you wanted to beef up the atlas for a little freeride, all that you would need would be a fork and cranks, cranks new at DH strength run about $50.00 fork if you decided to sell your manitou, would still be keeping you near or under $1200.00

K2/Ibex > IH Aniki


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> You ARE NOT going to be happy on a yakuza aniki, the fork is a terrible piece of crap, a j1 is a better fork than the spinner ammo. the rear shock is also a waste of money (glyde r coil or whatever). the frame is heavy and NOT even close to being a AM friendly bike. Dont cheap out, you WILL regret it. as far is the strength of the manitou fork and cranks on the atlas, the cranks are AM cranks, they're okay...upgrading your cranks is about$50.00 $20.00 used. The atlas has a better rear shock, the manitou fork on the atlas can handle drops up to about 6 feet. its pretty much a manitou black. the atlas actually has name brand compenents. juicy 5 VS hayes mechanicals?
> 
> for the small price difference...you're making a HUGE mistake, most people hate the stock aniki, and usually replace the fork, bars, cranks, rear shock and brakes within a month. that is going to bring you over that budget that you had set for yourself. if you wanted to beef up the atlas for a little freeride, all that you would need would be a fork and cranks, cranks new at DH strength run about $50.00 fork if you decided to sell your manitou, would still be keeping you near or under $1200.00
> 
> K2/Ibex > IH Aniki


Just when you think you're set, something else comes up. The savings was nice, but is the Atlas really worth the price increase?


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

thats complete and utter bull, for a begginers freeride bike the iron horse will blow the atlas away in terms of strength(which is really what matters) how can you say the iron horse is barely AM capable. Whitebread check the reviews for yourself, most begginers will love the stock aniki, and AS I SAID PREVIOUSLY it should probably get upgraded, but not nearly half as much as the atlas which by the time your done all you will have left stock is the frame. you will NEVER brake the spinner ammo doing begginer level stuff, or even intermediate stuff it is a dirtjumping fork and is stiff-very stiff, but it is leagues above that base level manitou for light xc that comes on the atlas.

if you want a better rear shock buy the 07 aniki-its a vanilla r which is better than the shock on the atlas, AND its STILL cheaper

p.s-dont buy used cranks...especially if they are 20 bucks


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Just when you think you're set, something else comes up. The savings was nice, but is the Atlas really worth the price increase?


yep. If you want to make it into a pure FR rig, all you would really need would be shorter stem, possibly a beefier fork and some stiffer cranks (with a 22/32 Bash)

The thing is, with the aniki's the spinner ammo fork is honestly ....one of the worst bike parts I've ever ridden. I think the marzocchi MZ Comp elastomer fork had more damping than the spinner. every time you pull up on the bars, the spinner makes this horrible "thunk" sound which is the fork "topping out". the hayes or the tektro brakes are a JOKE compared to the SRAM brakes on the atlas, both brakes arent even close to matching the power of an avid BB5.

the fire ex cranks arent XC cranks, nor are they ment for FR. they're pretty much AM cranks. they're light and pretty stiff. I was impressed with them. SRAM own truvativ and in my experience, just about everything SRAM makes is pretty nice stuff.

The rear shock on the aniki (glyde R coil) is horrid, my buddy's actually broke! actually cracked, then snapped in half. I dont know how in the hell he managed to pull that off, but ohh well. he replaced it with a fox vinilla, its a good shock, but does not have a platform. platform is something that you NEED on a singlepivot frame. I'm not totally sure the manitou metel has propeal either though, my manitou metel does...but mine has a piggyback reservoir.

All the "iron horse alloy" is pretty nasty stuff, and I wouldn't really even trust it on AM rides.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

potvinwannab said:


> thats complete and utter bull, for a begginers freeride bike the iron horse will blow the atlas away in terms of strength(which is really what matters) how can you say the iron horse is barely AM capable. Whitebread check the reviews for yourself, most begginers will love the stock aniki, and AS I SAID PREVIOUSLY it should probably get upgraded, but not nearly half as much as the atlas which by the time your done all you will have left stock is the frame. you will NEVER brake the spinner ammo doing begginer level stuff, or even intermediate stuff it is a dirtjumping fork and is stiff-very stiff, but it is leagues above that base level manitou for light xc that comes on the atlas.
> 
> if you want a better rear shock buy the 07 aniki-its a vanilla r which is better than the shock on the atlas, AND its STILL cheaper
> 
> p.s-dont buy used cranks...especially if they are 20 bucks


what are you talking about? you havent even ridden the manitou fork, it IS NOT a XC fork.

Since when did the manitou metel, sun rims SOS, juicy 5 and SRAM drivetrain become XC parts? I ride a little bit beefier version of the atlas for DH and I'm not nearly a beginner.

The ammo is a horrible product. you're recommending that he races a geo storm against a ferrari here.

Aniki is not AM capable due to the weight and lack of a platform shock. not to mention the suspension bobbing like crazy on the climbs. but that should be okay, because spinner ammo's only compress when you take drops over 10 feet anyway.

The atlas' big brother at whistler 2007


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

the 07 comes with a fox vanilla r-that oughta do it:thumbsup: still cheaper

face it it will cost more to upgrade the atlas for FR than the aniki espescially when the aniki is built for FR right out of the box. Though i do agree the atlas is probably better for AM. Ive ridden the EXACT same brakes that come on the aniki, and compared to my bb7's, id never be able to tell the difference blind folded (ofcourse i shouldnt be riding a bike) now for FR it would not be wise to get the atlas because even if you did upgrade everything the rear would still only get 5 inches (which by the way is actually fine for freeride i run my bike at 4.5 but most people use like 7-8 inches which the aniki has and the atlas doesnt)

Now if you want an AM bike with light freeride on its mind-choose an atlas

if you want a freeride bike with occasional AM-choose the aniki

Aniki=tough ****

Atlas=Quality drivetrain


Aniki=freeride

Atlas=AM

thats how it is, thats what they were meant for


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

The zone-if he could find one of those THAT would make a killer bike


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Basic consensus is that the bikes components are ok, maybe even bad but the get the job done for the beginner. I don't really know how quickly I'll out grow the Aniki. Sure the frame is upgradeable, but its going to be costly to replace the mediocre fork, brakes, rear shock, rims and BB when compared to a more expensive bike with good components.


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> what are you talking about? you havent even ridden the manitou fork, it IS NOT a XC fork.
> 
> Since when did the manitou metel, sun rims SOS, juicy 5 and SRAM drivetrain become XC parts? I ride a little bit beefier version of the atlas for DH and I'm not nearly a beginner.
> 
> The atlas' big brother at whistler 2007


Relax Todd he's 14 you remember that age :thumbsup:


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> yep. If you want to make it into a pure FR rig, all you would really need would be shorter stem, possibly a beefier fork and some stiffer cranks (with a 22/32 Bash)
> 
> The thing is, with the aniki's the spinner ammo fork is honestly ....one of the worst bike parts I've ever ridden. I think the marzocchi MZ Comp elastomer fork had more damping than the spinner. every time you pull up on the bars, the spinner makes this horrible "thunk" sound which is the fork "topping out". the hayes or the tektro brakes are a JOKE compared to the SRAM brakes on the atlas, both brakes arent even close to matching the power of an avid BB5.
> 
> ...


What do you mean by: "All the "iron horse alloy" is pretty nasty stuff, and I wouldn't really even trust it on AM rides" Are you saying the frame is not as strong as everyone is illuding to?


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

you know what get the atlas. Im a weird rider anyway, very unique with my product preferences-i even still refuse to upgrade to 20 mm axle, i ride a rear shock that barely moves, i never listen to others and just go with what my head tells me to do. I wont use more than 6 inches of travel.Me personally i dont like hydraulics, i will only ride mechanical, i like a stiff fork and a stronger frame thats why id get the aniki especially for a beginner.

The atlas will do fine


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

its strong, very strong unlike the atlas it is ACTUALLY built for freeride-go to the iron horse forum and ask some of the ACTUAL aniki owners. Infact why dont you post a new thread there titled "aniki vs. atlas" i know you may think its biased because its in the iron horse forum, but they will have had alot more experience


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

aniki (needed to be SAFE for freeride)

Minumum spending 
Bars: $30~
Cranks: $50~
Rear shock(if not vinilla) $100FORK: $200.00 at the minumum ...you cant sell the spinner for anything. (the spinner IS NOT a safe fork to ride. I have 3 friends, all on aniki's, one of those forks loosened the bolts on the botom, and the lowers almost dropped out. the fork also rebounds so quickly that it can make riding really sketchy. that spinner is not a safe choice. 

Total Minumum = $280.00
Max = $380.00 

Then you also still have a pretty crappy bike, horrid rims.

Atlas: 
Fork: Sell for ~$150.00 but wont factor that in. $200.00
Cranks: $50.00
Stem: Hozfeller $30.00
Bars: (why not upgrade to OS bars?) Hussefelt $30.00
Total minumum = $110.00
Total Max= $310.00


Sure, this means he's just paid $1310.00 for his bike, but now look at the build. 

Frame:Single-Pivot 6061 Aluminum - 5" Travel
Fork:Manitou Sherman Firefly SPV
Rear Shock:Manitou Metel R w/ Platform Plus
Shifters:SRAM X7 Trigger
Front Derailleur:Shimano LX
Rear Derailleur:SRAM X7
Crankset:TruVativ Hussefelt (32/22Bash)
Cassette:SRAM PG-950 (11-34T)
Chain:KMC X9
Brakes:Avid Juicy-5 Hydraulic Disc Brakes
Levers:Avid Juicy-5
Rims:Sun SOS P1 Mid-Width Rims
Hubs:Novatec 4/2 Sealed Bearing Hubs
Spokes:Richmond 14G Black Stainless
Tires:WTB Moto Raptor 26" x 2.24
Headset:Cane Creek S-3
Cockpit Set:Ritchey Alloy -- Truvativ Hozfeller Stem, Hussefelt Bars
Saddle:WTB Pure V Race
Pedals:SPD Clipless


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

you actually think hes going to bend the bars...i ride generic bars with a generic stem and they havent broken yet-i am replacing them anyways but they havent broken


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> What do you mean by: "All the "iron horse alloy" is pretty nasty stuff, and I wouldn't really even trust it on AM rides" Are you saying the frame is not as strong as everyone is illuding to?


no, What I'm talking about is like the handlebars and stuff. the OEM components made for ironhorse. not the frame.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Basic consensus is that the bikes components are ok, maybe even bad but the get the job done for the beginner. I don't really know how quickly I'll out grow the Aniki. Sure the frame is upgradeable, but its going to be costly to replace the mediocre fork, brakes, rear shock, rims and BB when compared to a more expensive bike with good components.


EDIT: Didn't read your post right, sorry


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> no, What I'm talking about is like the handlebars and stuff. the OEM components made for ironhorse. not the frame.


O, thanks


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

This thread is out of control. I need a little time to think this over. I'm basically back at square one. I want something that I don't really need to upgrade. I'm also going to look at other bikes.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

hardtail 

you really need more ppl to come into here me and todd obviously have very different opinions

but the sasquatch will blow the brains off both these bikes (dont worry about the "deore" derailleur)


EDIT: i just saw the exact specs on the norco, wow, what was i thinking recommending an aniki over this it looks killer


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

2006 Ojiki?

Frame: 7" TRAVEL FREERIDE DUAL SUSPENSION SINGLE PIVOT W/ SEALED BEARINGS, 1.5" HEADTUBE, REPLACEABLE DERAILLEUR HANGER, INTERNATIONAL DISC BRAKE MOUNT
Fork: MARZOCCHI DROPOFF III W/ ALLOY STANCHIONS, THRU AXLE, 150MM TRAVEL
Rear Shock: MANITOU METEL R, COIL, 9" x 2.75"
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO DEORE
Rear Derailleur: SHIMANO HONE
Shifters: SHIMANO DEORE RAPIDFIRE
Brakes Levers: HAYES HFX-9 HD
Brakes: HAYES HFX-9-HD W/ 8" ROTOR
Chain: SHIMANO HG-73
Crankset: TRUVATIV RUKTION
Cassette: SRAM PG-950, 11X32, 9 SPEED
Pedals:

Bottom Bracket: TRUVATIV HOWITZER
Headset: FSA BIG FAT PIG 1.5R
Saddle: SDG BEL AIR ST I-BEAM
Seat Post: SDG 6061 I-BEAM
Handlebar: TRUVATIV HUSSEFELT 31.8MM CLAMP
Grips: RUBBER
Stem: TRUVATIV HUSSEFELT 31.8MM CLAMP
Tires: WTB TIMBERWOLF 2.5
Wheelset: WTB DUAL DUTY FREERIDE RIMS, 36 HOLE ALLOY DISC HUBS, 14G STAINLESS SPOKES
Weight: N/A
Color: ORANGE


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

i dont know...im just a 14 year old



(psst: get it!)

seriously that spec list is better than the aniki or the atlas in terms of freeride-ness


but what EXACTLY do you want, an AM bike, or a FREERIDE bike, and if you want someting that will do Both very well this isnt it


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

The sasquatch is okay, my buddy has a Z.1 and hates it, I rode on it but didnt find anything wrong. The norco hardtails are pretty well built. But now heres the problem, the hayes HFX-9 are really horrible brakes. I have a set, and I'm swiching back to BB-7's to avoid using them. The drivetrain also isnt as nice as the one on the atlas. It just all depends on if you want full suspension or hardtail. normally I would reccomend a hardtail, but I took mine up to whistler with me, and wow...I think I'm done with fast DH on a hardtail. 

so far, looks like your best bet would be to either get an atlas/norco. or you could possibly get an aniki, toss all the components and build up a nicer bike from the frame. all of these bikes have great frames, the aniki's are kind of fun, a little harder to throw around than my zone, but still fun and responsive to the trail due to being a simple singlepivot design. Atlas are really fast bikes, I personally love em because its just like my zone, but more like a "Zone Lite" Norco is a cool company, their bikes are great, but keep in mind...hardtails are a bit unforgiving. but probably the best thing to learn on. I had gotten the sasquatch confused with the bigfoot. I dont really memorize norco's catalogs. I should probably work on that for 2008.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

ITs gotta be something that will do both. I'm a bigger guy and I'm only betting bigger. The trails around my school and my home are rough, steep and rocky. I want to purchase something that has decent components and potential to perform well should my skill, wallet and bravery increase. I want something that can do FR and AM and won't need to be upgraded right out of the box. Having a frame that is conducive to goo FR and AM riding with stock and aftermarket parts is important too. 

It seems the Atlas has the components (for the most part) but not the frame. The Aniki has the Frame but not the components. Maybe I should just spring for a 2007 Ojiki and be done with it. Better for AM than a 7point and better at FR than both the atlas and the Aniki. Its 1400 dollars though.

It seems as though I won't be able to get something that will meet my needs for under 1000 dollars.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> The sasquatch is okay, my buddy has a Z.1 and hates it, I rode on it but didnt find anything wrong. The norco hardtails are pretty well built. But now heres the problem, the hayes HFX-9 are really horrible brakes. I have a set, and I'm swiching back to BB-7's to avoid using them. The drivetrain also isnt as nice as the one on the atlas. It just all depends on if you want full suspension or hardtail. normally I would reccomend a hardtail, but I took mine up to whistler with me, and wow...I think I'm done with fast DH on a hardtail.
> 
> so far, looks like your best bet would be to either get an atlas/norco. or you could possibly get an aniki, toss all the components and build up a nicer bike from the frame. all of these bikes have great frames, the aniki's are kind of fun, a little harder to throw around than my zone, but still fun and responsive to the trail due to being a simple singlepivot design. Atlas are really fast bikes, I personally love em because its just like my zone, but more like a "Zone Lite" Norco is a cool company, their bikes are great, but keep in mind...hardtails are a bit unforgiving. but probably the best thing to learn on. I had gotten the sasquatch confused with the bigfoot. I dont really memorize norco's catalogs. I should probably work on that for 2008.


Do you know if Ibex plans on making the Zone again?


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

the ojiki is nice, but it a pig (heavy) def more a FR/DH bike, the forks damping technology is outdated, but a bit better than the spinner. the dropoff uses SSV and isnt made by marzocchi, but by suntour in taiwan. the truvativ rukiton cranks are worse than those on the aniki.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

like todd said (i think he did-im really just trying to look like im agreeing with somebody) the ojiki is a freeride bike-so dont plan on climbing and super steep hills. the atlas is for all mountain probably has a weaker frame (you wont notice it unless you get serious) and will need heavy component upgrading AS WILL the aniki (if you get hard enough to break that spinner ammo) the norco is the best bet, or if you can handle it the ojiki probably is better than all of them when you get into the fr extreme/dh spectrum


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Do you know if Ibex plans on making the Zone again?


I was hoping they were bringing it back for 2008, but I guess we'll have to wait for 2009. they were planning on re-designing the frame from the ground up, making it like a 6,7,8" adjustable frame or something. I thought they said it was going to be similar to the ride of a bottlerocket from transition. but it was nearly a year ago, so I'm not sure.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Ok.........next................

Todd, citing my requirements, what would you recommend? FS only


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> I was hoping they were bringing it back for 2008, but I guess we'll have to wait for 2009. they were planning on re-designing the frame from the ground up, making it like a 6,7,8" adjustable frame or something. I thought they said it was going to be similar to the ride of a bottlerocket from transition. but it was nearly a year ago, so I'm not sure.


Alright, so no point in waiting then.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

potvinwannab said:


> like todd said (i think he did-im really just trying to look like im agreeing with somebody) the ojiki is a freeride bike-so dont plan on climbing and super steep hills. the atlas is for all mountain probably has a weaker frame (you wont notice it unless you get serious) and will need heavy component upgrading AS WILL the aniki (if you get hard enough to break that spinner ammo) the norco is the best bet, or if you can handle it the ojiki probably is better than all of them when you get into the fr extreme/dh spectrum


the atlas is a AM/FR frame, the ojiki isnt going to be as nice if he were to upgrade an aniki or an atlas. he probably wont break the spinner, just hate every moment on his bike because of that fork. the atlas doesnt need "heavy upgrading"


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> Ok.........next................
> 
> Todd, citing my requirements, what would you recommend? FS only


well, look around used. you can usually pick up a pretty nice bike FS used for $1300.00 sadly not much in terms of an AM/FR bike since AM bikes are somewhat new to the market (only a couple of years) I would recommend either buy an atlas and leave it as it is or upgrade it, or buy an aniki and upgrade the snot out of it.

The aniki could possibly withstand DH better than the atlas, but the atlas can climb all day without tireing you out too much, then rock just as hard on the decent. I'd recommend getting the atlas for FS mostly because you're getting a lot better components. Juicy 5's would seal the deal for me.


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

The Atlas can more than handle what you will do with it & you will progress.:thumbsup:

Maybe i should keep my Atlas on the paved roads instread of the trails. :eekster:


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

SUUURRREEE:thumbsup: ok well no point in talking im leaving this thread on this note

despite what todd tells you ibex doesnt make a freeride frame-they have in the past, the zone which if it were still around would definitley take the cake, but he has ridden the atlas, i havent he knows what it can do. The yakuza line (the ENTIRE LINE) is for freeride and extreme freeride. The norco does it ALL at the sacrifice of rear suspension (i'd still get it) you have to make a decision do you want something that does it ALL (like an atlas or norco sasquatch) or something that will probably only be useful for much tougher freeride terrain (any yakuza bike) the atlas WILL brake with 200 pounds on it (sorry if that is offensive but hey im also around there) on any drop over maybe 8-10 feet if repeated. if you dont think you will be doing MORE than this than go for the atlas. You need to decide what it is exactly you are doing. Id tell you to get a specialized enduro, or a santa cruz nomad which are much better than any bike mentioned here but they are out of the question.

Good Luck


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> well, look around used. you can usually pick up a pretty nice bike FS used for $1300.00 sadly not much in terms of an AM/FR bike since AM bikes are somewhat new to the market (only a couple of years) I would recommend either buy an atlas and leave it as it is or upgrade it, or buy an aniki and upgrade the snot out of it.
> 
> The aniki could possibly withstand DH better than the atlas, but the atlas can climb all day without tireing you out too much, then rock just as hard on the decent. I'd recommend getting the atlas for FS mostly because you're getting a lot better components. Juicy 5's would seal the deal for me.


The Yazuka frame seems quite capable of DH action, although I'm concerned it won't be able to handle the technical stuff. The Atlas might just be the best bike to get new, but I'm still going to look.

Are there any other bikes I should look into? There are quite a few makes out there, I'd be surprised if Iron Horse and Ibex were the only two manufacturers who make good AM/FR bikes in the 1200 dollar range.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> SUUURRREEE:thumbsup: ok well no point in talking im leaving this thread on this note
> 
> despite what todd tells you ibex doesnt make a freeride frame-they have in the past, the zone which if it were still around would definitley take the cake, but he has ridden the atlas, i havent he knows what it can do. The yakuza line (the ENTIRE LINE) is for freeride and extreme freeride. The norco does it ALL at the sacrifice of rear suspension (i'd still get it) you have to make a decision do you want something that does it ALL (like an atlas or norco sasquatch) or something that will probably only be useful for much tougher freeride terrain (any yakuza bike) the atlas WILL brake with 200 pounds on it (sorry if that is offensive but hey im also around there) on any drop over maybe 8-10 feet if repeated. if you dont think you will be doing MORE than this than go for the atlas. You need to decide what it is exactly you are doing. Id tell you to get a specialized enduro, or a santa cruz nomad which are much better than any bike mentioned here but they are out of the question.
> 
> Good Luck


Yeah, at 2800 and 3100 dollars MSRP respectively, theres no way I could find one in my budget at this time.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

It seems I can't do better than the atlas new without getting an older model. A 2006 6point or similar bike would work well I think, but I can't seem to find anything. It looks like the Atlas sport is the way to go here.


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

http://www.woodstockbikes.com/707/707.htm

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/mountain_bikes.htm


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

I usually go to performance bikes, they usually have some good deals, here are some other options.

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=21343&subcategory_ID=3050 (my friend has one of these he built up for AM he likes it. but it really is a FR bike and specs arent much greater than the ojiki.

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=21340&subcategory_ID=3050 These are REALLY nice, but less FR capable than the atlas. and the components arent the best.

this bridges the gap between FR and AM pretty well still not as nice components as the atlashttp://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=23855&subcategory_ID=3050

Just a few more options to throw at you


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

That Sachem looks like it might do the trick...hmmmmmmmmm


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> That Sachem looks like it might do the trick...hmmmmmmmmm


yea, the sachem is nice...downside is the brakes are horrible, same with the wheels. it dissapoints me that WTB still makes the dual duty's. they're pretty flexy and not well built. the hayes mechanicals....just stay away from em, if the bike comes with them, make sure you saved up enough cash to replace them.

choosing a new bike is not an easy task, a thing that helps me, is create a folder on your desktop or wherever, and save images of the bikes you're considering. then give it a few days. dont rush into things take your time, the bikes will wait for you.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> yea, the sachem is nice...downside is the brakes are horrible, same with the wheels. it dissapoints me that WTB still makes the dual duty's. they're pretty flexy and not well built. the hayes mechanicals....just stay away from em, if the bike comes with them, make sure you saved up enough cash to replace them.
> 
> choosing a new bike is not an easy task, a thing that helps me, is create a folder on your desktop or wherever, and save images of the bikes you're considering. then give it a few days. dont rush into things take your time, the bikes will wait for you.


Yeah, I'm looking over every manufacturer as well as online retailers and LBSs to see what I can find. These bikes cost way too much for me to make a hasty decision.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

I'm giving serious thought to just building my own bike. Its will cost more but I'll get exactly what I want and have a bike that will last no matter what I end up doing with it.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> I'm giving serious thought to just building my own bike. Its will cost more but I'll get exactly what I want and have a bike that will last no matter what I end up doing with it.


You could do that, but remember...thats going to take you WAY over your 1200 budget. A good AM FS frame used goes for about 5-7 hundred alone. Honestly, I think you're better off buying a complete bike, and swapping components around. this way you'll still be in your budget and have a bike which you can ride.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> You could do that, but remember...thats going to take you WAY over your 1200 budget. A good AM FS frame used goes for about 5-7 hundred alone. Honestly, I think you're better off buying a complete bike, and swapping components around. this way you'll still be in your budget and have a bike which you can ride.


That is true, but as it stands now, I can't really find something suitable for under 1200 dollars. I'm thinking about waiting a while and upping the budget to 2 grand. There are quite a few good bikes that can be had slightly used to discounted for that price. And a good number of them would be properly spec'ed for the FR/AM riding I will be doing while being able to handle my 200 pounds.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

The Iron Horse 6point line seems like it was designed with me in mind. The frame seems to be a bit more capable that the AM bikes we've discussed in this thread but isn't quite as FR or DH specific as the Yakuza line. The components it has aren't bad and it's not that expensive either (at least in comparison to Specializeds, Santa Cruz, etc offerings). I was hoping I'd be able to find a 2006 model for a discount (as I've found 7 point 3s) but they seem to be scarce. Can't find them anywhere on the net and every LBS I've called either didn't stock it, couldn't order it or didn't know what I was talking about.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

2007 Sachem? 

Better Fork and more capable frame. 300 dollars more than the 4.0 and the Atlas sport

Frame: 6" TRAVEL ALL MOUNTAIN DUAL SUSPENSION, SINGLE PIVOT W/ SEALED BEARINGS, 1-1/8" ZERO STACK HEADTUBE, REPLACEABLE DERAILLEUR HANGER, INTERNATIONAL DISC BRAKE MOUNT
Fork: MARZOCCHI Z.1 SPORT RV, THRU AXLE, 150MM TRAVEL
Rear Shock: FOX VANILLA R 7.875"X2.25"
Front Derailleur: SHIMANO DEORE, 34.9MM CLAMP
Rear Derailleur: SHIMANO DEORE XT
Shifters: SHIMANO DEORE RAPIDFIRE
Brakes Levers: AVID JUICY 3
Brakes: AVID JUICY 3 W/ 7" ROTOR
Chain: SHIMANO HG-73
Crankset: RACE FACE RIDE XC, 170MM
Cassette: SRAM PG-950, 11/34T, 9 SPEED
Pedals: WELLGO ALLOY PLATFORMS

Bottom Bracket: FSA ISIS, 73X118MM
Headset: FSA ORBIT Z, ZEROSTACK
Saddle: WTB PURE V SPORT
Seat Post: RITCHEY OE SINGLEBOLT, 30.0MM
Handlebar: SYNCROS GAIN 6061 OS, MID RISER, 31.8mm CLAMP
Grips: N/A
Stem: SYNCROS RACE DH, 31.8MM CLAMP
Tires: ITS DH, 26"X2.35"
Wheelset: WTB DUAL DUTY FREERIDE
Weight: 35.7 LBS


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

the Z.1 RV isnt really better than the manitou, it uses "rebound valving technology" which means it only has rebound adjustment if my heads on straight. its a little beefier than the manitou, but lacks damping control. The sachem also has race face ride XC cranks, in my experience...these arent much better than the truvativ fire ex on the atlas. Juicy 3 brakes, you get the juicy stopping power...but you get NO adjustments. WTB dual duty wheels are crap. 

the 6. series is nice, make sure to keep in mind that 2008 models will be rolling into stores. and now the 2007 stuff will be on clearance.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Yes well, waiting did cross my mind and I do think its a good idea. I might not be able to get in on the late summer/early fall season in Ithaca, but I'll save a ton of money.
rscycle.com has:
06 7point5
06 7point7
07 7point3
07 7point5
07 6point4
07 6point6

I think I'll wait and see what happens when the 08 bikes come out. Maybe I can get an 06 or an 07 model dirt cheep.

Do you know when the 08 models will be comming out?


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Called RS and they said the 07 models just reached them a month or two ago. I'd have to wait a year to get the 07s on discount. The 6points just came out and are more expensive than the 7points. Not looking too good for this year...........


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Found a new 06 7point3 that fits me for 1400+ shipping. 

Frame: 7” Travel DW-link Freeride Frame
Fork: Marzocchi Dropoff III, 150mm travel
Rear Shock: Manitou Metel R Coil, 8.75”x2.75”
Headset: FSA Big Fat Pig R
Crankset: TruVativ Hussefelt, 170mm
Bottom Bracket: TruVativ Howitzer
Shifters: SRAM X.7 Trigger
Levers: Hayes HFX-9-HD
Handlebar: TruVativ Hussefelt, 31.8mm clamp
Stem: TruVativ Hussefelt, 31.8mm clamp
Front Derailleur: SRAM X.GEN
Rear Derailleur: SRAM X.7 Mid cage
Cassette: SRAM PG-950, 11-34T, 9-speed
Brakes: Hayes HFX-9 Hydraulic Disc w/ V8 rotor
Wheelset: Rims: WTB Dual Duty Freeride; Hubs: Alloy DH, Sealed bearing, Thru axle, 36H
Tires: WTB Timberwolf Steel DNA 2.5
Pedals: Funn Soljam Viper Platforms
Seatpost: SDG 6061 I-Beam
Saddle: SDG Bel Air ST I-Beam
Chain: SRAM PG-951 w/ PowerLink
Grips/Tape: NA

Really thinking about pulling the trigger on that right now.

I'm thinking the brakes might need to be changed, then maybe the rear shock.
What do you guys think?


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## mrpercussive (Apr 4, 2006)

the 7.3 is a good bike... though i dont really like the fork and rear shock it is really nice for AM and introduction to FR and DH... Though a few months ago an 06 7point3 was like 999 at RScycles.com


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

mrpercussive said:


> the 7.3 is a good bike... though i dont really like the fork and rear shock it is really nice for AM and introduction to FR and DH... Though a few months ago an 06 7point3 was like 999 at RScycles.com


I think they are all sold out. They only have 15" 06 7point5s and 17" 06 7point7s. The 7point5 is too small and the 7point7 is too expensive. I'd have to wait for a year to get the 07s on discount.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

the 7. bikes arent the best for AM, def more a freeride bike. like I said, the dropoff fork is total crap. not too much better than the spinner.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> the 7. bikes arent the best for AM, def more a freeride bike. like I said, the dropoff fork is total crap. not too much better than the spinner.


Your advice is much appreciated, but I'm thinking your subjective definition of whats good and whats not is much more critical than most, mine included.

Another option I'm investigating is just waiting until the 07 7points and 6points are discounted at rscycle.com. I'd have to wait a year and I'd miss a riding season but I'd have way more money left over after my purchase. The 07's are better bikes without a doubt.

I'm looking for the best for my money. Even if the 7points aren't as good for AM riding as the 6points, they are still good bikes (even for AM riding). I'm looking to get the best for my money and the 7points would still perform well. If I can get performance bikes to match rscycle.com's price for the 7point3s when they were selling them (optimistic, but unlikely), it would be an even better deal. Can you find any new bikes that would beat the 7point3 for the aggressive AM/light free ride I'll be doing and not cost more than 1450 with shipping?


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## mrpercussive (Apr 4, 2006)

check these out...
http://www.rscycle.com/s.nl;jsessio...4Pa38Ta38Nahf0?it=A&id=13539&sc=7&category=55


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Specs look pretty good, is the frame any good?


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## mrpercussive (Apr 4, 2006)

Whitebread said:


> Specs look pretty good, is the frame any good?


besides the fork... you're pretty much good to go... but the fork is rideable til you can afford a new one... just scout ebay and such when you've got funds... the frame is good... XD


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

the commencal are nice bikes. the 7. ARE NOT AM/Light FR bikes. they ARE NOT fun to pedal. atlas/aniki built up/commencal is the best for your money right now, but you dont want to listen to any of my advice anyway, so I guess I'm done with this thread.

Dont take my opinion into consideration, because I have experience with just about everything mentioned in this thread, I know a lot about all the bikes and their components.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> the commencal are nice bikes. the 7. ARE NOT AM/Light FR bikes. they ARE NOT fun to pedal. atlas/aniki built up/commencal is the best for your money right now, but you dont want to listen to any of my advice anyway, so I guess I'm done with this thread.
> 
> Dont take my opinion into consideration, because I have experience with just about everything mentioned in this thread, I know a lot about all the bikes and their components.


The bitterness and harsh attitude is not needed. I am trying to weigh your advice into my decision making but your bias, subjective wording and absolution is making it difficult. Not once did I say I was dead set on getting a 7point or a 6point. Matter of fact, I've been searching for a cheap Yakuza frame or bike for the last 24 hours. Quite frankly, I don't see why you have such a dislike for the 7point bikes (for what I plan on doing).

You're obviously an experienced and knowledgeable rider, but you are too testy. I ask for advice so that I can have options. Just because you give yours doesn't mean I'm going to follow it to a T.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> The bitterness and harsh attitude is not needed. I am trying to weigh your advice into my decision making but your bias, subjective wording and absolution is making it difficult. Not once did I say I was dead set on getting a 7point or a 6point. Matter of fact, I've been searching for a cheap Yakuza frame or bike for the last 24 hours. Quite frankly, I don't see why you have such a dislike for the 7point bikes (for what I plan on doing).
> 
> You're obviously an experienced and knowledgeable rider, but you are too testy. I ask for advice so that I can have options. Just because you give yours doesn't mean I'm going to follow it to a T.


once again, if you want an AM/light FR bike, the 7. is not it. I tried riding my friends 7.3 for AM and it sucked. the 7. are made for FR and DH. you think it will be good when you see an image of the bike or see the specs on paper, but that bike is heavy and sloppy... where as you'll have to slightly modify a AM bike to take FR, you're also going to have to modify the 7. to be capable of AM

if you had said "whoo hoo I want to do FR and DH riding!" then yea, I'd tell you to go with something like a 7. but you didnt say that...you said "I'll be riding more AM than FR"


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> once again, if you want an AM/light FR bike, the 7. is not it. I tried riding my friends 7.3 for AM and it sucked. the 7. are made for FR and DH. you think it will be good when you see an image of the bike or see the specs on paper, but that bike is heavy and sloppy... where as you'll have to slightly modify a AM bike to take FR, you're also going to have to modify the 7. to be capable of AM
> 
> if you had said "whoo hoo I want to do FR and DH riding!" then yea, I'd tell you to go with something like a 7. but you didnt say that...you said "I'll be riding more AM than FR"


I think I said I wasnt sure what I'm going to be doing. But if the steep hills and deep gorges are Ithaca is any indication of the gradients I will encounter, then I will be doing quite a bit of steep climbing and fast downhill riding when I'm at school.

This is how it is. I'm looking at all bikes that can be had brand new with warranty for under 1500 dollars. Currently, some older 7points fall in this category. Even if they are designed more for Freeriding than all mountain riding, they are still good bikes and it would be a stupid for me to completely disregard them. I know they 7points are marketed as freeride bikes and I know they are heavy and I also know they might not be the best option but they are an option nevertheless. I am exploring (as you have suggested, albeit harshly) other bikes like a built up atlas, Yakuza frame or 6point ahead of the 7points. I look at the components and the bike weight and YES its obvious its build more for freeride. They lack some parts that would make technical riding and climbing easier, but they are still good bikes. Matter of fact, even the 7point would be better at anything I plan on doing than the crappy walmart specials I've ridden in the past.

This is how it is, of all the bikes I'm considering, the 7points are LAST in line as I do realize they are not the best bikes for what I think I'm going to be doing. But I see absolutely no reason to remove them from the list of potential bikes. And frankly, I doubt they will perform as bad as you make it seem.


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## Vertr (Oct 10, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> once again, if you want an AM/light FR bike, the 7. is not it. I tried riding my friends 7.3 for AM and it sucked. the 7. are made for FR and DH. you think it will be good when you see an image of the bike or see the specs on paper, but that bike is heavy and sloppy... where as you'll have to slightly modify a AM bike to take FR, you're also going to have to modify the 7. to be capable of AM
> 
> if you had said "whoo hoo I want to do FR and DH riding!" then yea, I'd tell you to go with something like a 7. but you didnt say that...you said "I'll be riding more AM than FR"


You really need to chill. This whole thread is full you calling all kinds of stuff garbage and touting IBEX as the end all be all of bike brands. Get over yourself. There are different bikes for different people.

There is nothing wrong with 7 points. They pedal just fine thank you.

es


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

Amen to that
dont worry whitebread i dont think any bike mentioned wont fit the bill. everything suggested from the aniki all the way up to the 7point5 will suit you perfectly after that it all comes down to budget-get what you can afford and get the best bang-for-buck that you see fit
Have fun, and good luck! i think we have provided you with some food for thought, enjoy!

P.s-Todd if there was a weakest choice-it would be the ibex, especially at his body weight


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Yeah, thanks guys. I'm going to keep looking for an Aniki frame but we'll see what happens. I think I'm going to end up waiting until next year. The 2007 6points and 7points will be discounted and I'm sure more Yakuza frames or used Aniki's will be available. Plus, I'll have more money so spending 2000 dollars on a bike won't hurt so much.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

if your going to get a used aniki frame, might as well get a used 6point/7point since you are fine with buying used. Dont forget ebay!


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## Snowpug (Apr 23, 2007)

How about a Kona Coiler for under 1500? Great bike. Pedals well. Tough as hell. Handles the drops like butter. Good geo. Decent parts spec for the money.

http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/BI310T02-Kona+Coiler+Bike+07.aspx


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

coiler is not a bad idea-but i heard the frames aren't as strong as they seem (ive seen several snapped on pinkbike) but i also hear they are the bomb


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

potvinwannab said:


> if your going to get a used aniki frame, might as well get a used 6point/7point since you are fine with buying used. Dont forget ebay!


Well, I misspoke. I'm not really looking for an bare aniki frame but a used and cheap aniki bike. Building up a bare aniki frame would cost right about 1500 dollars, in which case I might as well just get a used or discounted 6 or 7point for a little less. It'll work like this:

1. Used Aniki frame with used aniki components. I change the key components (brakes, BB and cranks, front and rear shocks, wheels, tires, front and rear dérailleurs, etc) until I have something very capable.

-or-

2. Used or discounted 6point

-or-

3. Used or discounted 7point

-or-

4. Commercial recommended to me earlier in this thread

-or-

5. Some other bike I haven't spoken of yet (an LBS wants to sell me a Fuji Thrill for 1200, so I'm going to check that out tomorrow)

I'm not going to be hasty so i might not buy anything for another few months.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

Snowpug said:


> How about a Kona Coiler for under 1500? Great bike. Pedals well. Tough as hell. Handles the drops like butter. Good geo. Decent parts spec for the money.
> 
> http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/BI310T02-Kona+Coiler+Bike+07.aspx


Yep, that was another option I came upon last night when searching, its on the list as well. I just haven't put as much effort into researching it as the Iron Horse, Commercial and Ibex offerings.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

potvinwannab said:


> P.s-Todd if there was a weakest choice-it would be the ibex, especially at his body weight


you wish. Ibex is a moderate choice here, you are all dumb kids with no experience.

good day children.

p.s I have a friend who rides a schwinn made in china hardtail, he's 230 pounds and he rides all mountain. weight doesnt play much of a role on the frame, but more in the suspension.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

haha at least you smartened up and went from "ZOMG BEST BIKE IN WORLD WHY WOULD YOU GET A DEMO NINE WHEN YOU COULD GET AN IBEX" to "moderate choice"


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

potvinwannab said:


> haha at least you smartened up and went from "ZOMG BEST BIKE IN WORLD WHY WOULD YOU GET A DEMO NINE WHEN YOU COULD GET AN IBEX" to "moderate choice"


they should allow an age limit to the forums. all caps and flame bait ... way to be a man...woops, you're far from it...you're 14


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

im not quite sure what your trying to communicate to me, but dont worry it wasnt "flame bait" i was just pointing out how much you love those ibex bicycles  meant to be innocent sorry if you found it offensive :sad:


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## dogonfr (Jan 6, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> they should allow an age limit to the forums. all caps and flame bait ... way to be a man...woops, you're far from it...you're 14


How many pages have you wasted your energy on, let the children have their way, you dont have to ride the bike Whitebread does. :band:


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

dogonfr said:


> How many pages have you wasted your energy on, let the children have their way, you dont have to ride the bike Whitebread does. :band:


yea, guess I shouldent waste my advice on people I dont know too huh? 

to everyone, so sorry for pointing out the pros and cons of each bike and trying to help this guy. I'll just let him buy something and possibly make the wrong choice, leaving him with a $1200.00 - $2000.00 mistake.


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> they should allow an age limit to the forums. all caps and flame bait ... way to be a man...woops, you're far from it...you're 14


He may be 14, but you haven't had the most mature posts in this thread.

Lets just all agree to disagree. I don't want this thread turning into a flame fest. Tod has his opinions and ways of expressing himself, as do others. I have gained a lot of knowledge and have a lot of options. I don't really see me needing this thread any longer.


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## potvinwannab (Jun 23, 2006)

oh stop your embarrassing me :blush:

but seriously lets just all stop talking


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Whitebread said:


> He may be 14, but you haven't had the most mature posts in this thread.
> 
> Lets just all agree to disagree. I don't want this thread turning into a flame fest. Tod has his opinions and ways of expressing himself, as do others. I have gained a lot of knowledge and have a lot of options. I don't really see me needing this thread any longer.


I leave you with this advice... if you dont buy new, or off a mountainbike classifieds site....

www.craigslist.com is your best friend, its where I've pretty much always found the best deals, along with a 2006 kona stinky for $600.00

check daily, last time I checked mine, someone was selling a 2004 coiler dee lux for $800.00


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## Whitebread (Aug 28, 2006)

todd_freeride said:


> I leave you with this advice... if you dont buy new, or off a mountainbike classifieds site....
> 
> www.craigslist.com is your best friend, its where I've pretty much always found the best deals, along with a 2006 kona stinky for $600.00
> 
> check daily, last time I checked mine, someone was selling a 2004 coiler dee lux for $800.00


I will surely check, thank you.


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