# Chain cleaner: Park Tool vs Finish Line



## Cobra Driver (Jun 2, 2011)

I would be interested in some thoughts before I drop 25-30 bucks on one of these.

Thanx

CD


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## Squash (Jul 20, 2003)

About a horse a piece. I've used both in the shop and they both clean the chain well enough. The Park does tend to drip a bit more is all. But you get a bit splatter from both. Replacement brushes and pads are readily available for both systems. When I have the time and the chain lends itself to removal, I still prefer the remove, soak, scrub, let dry, and re-lube system. But I know that isn't always possible. Anyway, either system works well. I like the Parks handle better, but either will work. You'r call. 

Good Dirt


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## Jvan_wert (Apr 8, 2007)

Get a Sette chain cleaner form price point. Been using the bejesus out of mine for five years, just don't drop it or it will break.


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## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

I wouldn't waste my money on those machines, when they are far cheaper and more effective ways of cleaning chains. While the below method may take slightly more work, it cleans the chain exceptionally well and doesn't make a mess on your other components the way a chain cleaner does. (FWIW I own a Finish Line chain cleaner and a Park Tool cleaner.)

1. If your chain doesn't already have one, get a quick link from SRAM to make chain removal easy and tool-free.

2. Locate an old Nalgene bottle (I use my old ones with BPA, since I won't be drinking out of them.) A Tupperware-style container, juice bottle, etc. also work well.

3. Pour some paint thinner in the container (enough to cover the chain.)

4. Drop your chain in.

5. Shake, shake, shake. Soak for 10 mins. Shake, shake, shake.

6. Fish the chain out.

7. Wipe with a rag, and allow to air dry.

Your chain should be clean at this point. If it's still dirty, than that means you had a really dirty chain to begin with, and even one of those chain cleaners wouldn't be able to help. If so, proceed to step 8:

8. At this point I usually take the chain to the sink. The paint thinner has really broken up the crud, so a quick hit with a toothbrush and some dishsoap should remove 99% of the rest of the junk. Takes about 2 minutes.

9. Wipe the chain down to remove excess water. Shake the chain a bit to remove water from inside the rollers, and allow the chain to dry a bit (I hang mine in a warm location or hit it with the air compressor.)

10. Apply chain lube to each link as necessary, and avoid over-lubing.


I've used the above method for years, and it helps the chains last a long time. When the sediment settles out of the paint thinner, you can transfer it to another container (another Nalgene?) and re-use. A method like this works really well with lubes that initially require a clean chain, like Dumonde Tech.


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## Cobra Driver (Jun 2, 2011)

Jmartino, EXCELLENT!!

TY


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## knl2stl (Jan 7, 2011)

I take my chain off to clean when possible, and soak in some enviro-friendly cleaner. I set it on top of the clothes washer for a cycle.


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## Cobra Driver (Jun 2, 2011)

Sadly I must say, I can see some actually going thru that. That is a serious "twisted phone chord" syndrome. You know when the phone chord is twisted and you just have to make it even so it wont overlap on itself.

OK...must get this whole idea out of my head....I just might obsess and do it!!!

CD

*******HOW DID THAT HAPPEN? My newer post ended up OVER the older one?*******


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## Fred Smedley (Feb 28, 2006)

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainclean.html


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## 2gunnz (Jun 30, 2006)

Fred Smedley said:


> http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainclean.html


Lol, to funny!!!

Oh, almost forgot. Ive been using my park chain cleaner since 2007. The handle broke but I don't blame Park for that. I think it had a lot to do with me dropping it...


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## runkmaster (May 6, 2011)

How well do those cleaners really work? Seems more thourough to pull it off and give it the old shake and scrub treatment. These things kinda look messy and gimmicky.


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## random walk (Jan 12, 2010)

jtmartino said:


> 5. Shake, shake, shake. Soak for 10 mins. Shake, shake, shake.


Reminds me of an old disco song. Can't quite put my finger on it...

And I have heard some people use these for chain cleaning:
http://www.amazon.com/CD-2800-Ultrasonic-Jewelry-Eyeglass-Cleaner/dp/B001DKDAVW


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## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

random walk said:


> Reminds me of an old disco song. Can't quite put my finger on it...
> 
> And I have heard some people use these for chain cleaning:
> http://www.amazon.com/CD-2800-Ultrasonic-Jewelry-Eyeglass-Cleaner/dp/B001DKDAVW


Ultrasonic cleaners are awesome. You can get industrial-sized ones from decommissioned laboratories, but they're still a few hundred dollars. The best at cleaning parts.

Shake shake shake!


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## MootsRider (May 16, 2004)

I used the Park cleaner years ago and was unimpressed. 
For a new chain, I use jtmartino's method to remove the factory grease and apply a fresh coat of chain lube.
Otherwise, I use degreaser, an old toothbrush and a couple of rags to clean my chain.


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## Pooch (Apr 6, 2011)

I used to use one of those cleaners but didn't find that it cleaned my chain that well (still seemed "grity") and wasn't the cleanest of operations.

Found a method on another site and tried it last week. 

1. Take chain off bike - I have a powerlink and just got a Park tool master link pliers.
2. Put chain in decent sized plastic bottle - I used a medium sized Gatorade bottle.
3. Add dish detergent and hot water.
4. Like jtmartino says, shake and keep shaking. After about 5 - 10 minutes, the water was black and full of dirt.
5. Drain, add more soap and water and repeat. After the second time, the water was pretty clean.
6. Drain and rinse chain thoroughly in clean water.
7. Place on tray and bake in oven. I've heard some people add an alcohol wash to help remove the water, i just put it in a 350 F oven for about 40-45 minutes. GF wasn't sure what I was making for dinner but since I also clean her bike, she didn't complain that it was her oven.
8. Let cool, put back on bike and lube.

Overall it took more time than using a chain cleaner but it was a lot easier and less messy than using the cleaners. Rode on it the next day and the chain felt like new.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

runkmaster said:


> These things kinda look messy and gimmicky.


That's because they _are _messy and gimmicky. My one or two attempts to use the Pedro's device a few years ago left me with a chain soaking in a messy stew of degreaser and lube and grit. Nothing actually came off the chain. While those rotor brushes sure look nice spinning around like they do, a dry rag is more effective. Degreaser splattered from the device all over my Feedback stand, and to this day the finish on the stand still has spotting as a result. Meh.

These days I usually run the chain through a rag. If for some reason I feel the need for a thorough cleaning, I'll use the shake-it-in-a-bottle method. Mostly though, I just wipe down w/a rag.


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## estabro (Oct 9, 2009)

jtmartino said:


> I wouldn't waste my money on those machines, when they are far cheaper and more effective ways of cleaning chains. While the below method may take slightly more work, it cleans the chain exceptionally well and doesn't make a mess on your other components the way a chain cleaner does. (FWIW I own a Finish Line chain cleaner and a Park Tool cleaner.)
> 
> 1. If your chain doesn't already have one, get a quick link from SRAM to make chain removal easy and tool-free.
> 
> ...


I do the same thing, but just steps #1-7 about once every few weeks. Between rides I wipe with rag, oil with ProLink and then re-wipe.

Also recommend odorless mineral spirits as the solvent. Some paint thinners can be pretty noxious.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

Personally I think soaking a chain in solvent is a very bad idea. Most chain manufactures will agree with me on this. Once the grease inside the rollers is gone there is no way to get that kind of lubrication back in there. Down inside the rollers is where you need good lubrication and soaking it, well. Personally if your even a little anal about applying chain lube you won't really ever need to do a cleaning like this. I haven't done anything more than wipe the last 4 chains I've worn through down with a rag. 

Seems like everybody has an opinion when it comes to chain lubes and cleaning, this is my time tested approach.


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## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

customfab said:


> Personally I think soaking a chain in solvent is a very bad idea. Most chain manufactures will agree with me on this. Once the grease inside the rollers is gone there is no way to get that kind of lubrication back in there. Down inside the rollers is where you need good lubrication and soaking it, well. Personally if your even a little anal about applying chain lube you won't really ever need to do a cleaning like this. I haven't done anything more than wipe the last 4 chains I've worn through down with a rag.
> 
> Seems like everybody has an opinion when it comes to chain lubes and cleaning, this is my time tested approach.


I used to believe the same thing, until I took apart a couple chains I had used for about 4 months. There was not a trace of the factory grease in the rollers, probably because it had all been displaced by chain lube which can act like a solvent to grease.

If the rollers were sealed and the grease stayed put, I would not soak my chain. But the fact is, factory grease doesn't last long anyways on my chains, so there's no point in trying to preserve it. Maybe it's due to the types of lube I use? I'm not sure, but I get long life out of babying my chains the way I do. Sure, it's probably not worth it to save $20 every 6 months, but it's fun and I'm OCD like that.


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## nepbug (Sep 3, 2004)

There is no doubt that taking the chain off does get a pretty clean chain as outlined earlier. I tend to use the Finish Line cleaner as it is faster for me. Here's my process

1 Bike in stand
2 Fill chain cleaner with water
3 Put chain cleaner on chain
4 Add a small amount of Simple Green or Citrus Degreaser to chain cleaner (I add it at the chain entrance)
5 Freewheel the chain through the chain cleaner
6 Dump Chain cleaner
7 Repeat 2-6 until the dump water/cleaner is no longer dingy
8 Make sure I'm shifted onto the large chainring
9 Using a toothbrush with some degreaser give the links a scrub while on the chainring (scrub, rotate cranks, scrub, etc)
10 Fill Chain cleaner with just water and put on chain
11 Freewheel the chain through the chain cleaner
12 Dump water
13 Repeat 10-12 until water is clear
14 Backspin to fling water off chain, followed by a wipe with a rag to absorb some water
15 Fill chain cleaner with IPA and run the chain through it (to facilitate water removal and faster drying)
16 Backspin and wipe again
17 Let Dry
18 Lube

It really doesn't take long and I like having the chainring to support the chain while I scrub it with a toothbrush.

I do this outside, inside is a bad idea as the scrubbing splatters stuff everywhere and the chain will drip as you're cleaning it.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

jtmartino said:


> I used to believe the same thing, until I took apart a couple chains I had used for about 4 months. There was not a trace of the factory grease in the rollers, probably because it had all been displaced by chain lube which can act like a solvent to grease.
> 
> If the rollers were sealed and the grease stayed put, I would not soak my chain. But the fact is, factory grease doesn't last long anyways on my chains, so there's no point in trying to preserve it. Maybe it's due to the types of lube I use? I'm not sure, but I get long life out of babying my chains the way I do. Sure, it's probably not worth it to save $20 every 6 months, but it's fun and I'm OCD like that.


Curious what type of lube you use and how wet it is were you are? Here in Central Oregon it's pretty dry and I use Dumonde pretty much exclusively. Seems like I can get the factory grease to last half a season if I stay out of the few creek crossings.


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## knl2stl (Jan 7, 2011)

Factory grease? You mean what comes on the chain when it is new? Yes, it is grease, but not intended as lubrication. Its final function is to keep the chain from rusting after manufacturing and shipping. Many chains are group shipped in a box with out being individually packaged. Many sit on new bikes in humid conditions for months in some LBS. Without packing grease, they rust. When Dumonde states that the chain must be completely clean before initial application, I am pretty sure that they want the chain to not only be free of dirt and grime but also of packing grease. Dumonde bonds to metal, it does not bond to grease.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

knl2stl said:


> Factory grease? You mean what comes on the chain when it is new? Yes, it is grease, but not intended as lubrication. Its final function is to keep the chain from rusting after manufacturing and shipping. Many chains are group shipped in a box with out being individually packaged. Many sit on new bikes in humid conditions for months in some LBS. Without packing grease, they rust. When Dumonde states that the chain must be completely clean before initial application, I am pretty sure that they want the chain to not only be free of dirt and grime but also of packing grease. Dumonde bonds to metal, it does not bond to grease.


I am very well aware of all of this. Sram chains come in a heavy cosmoline/fish oil packing grease that is super sticky and doesn't lubricate well but is intended for the the reasons you described. The Shimano chains I run though come in something a little lighter and is actually a really good lubricant. It's not until I have worn all of that off do I start adding traditional chain lube.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

customfab said:


> I am very well aware of all of this. Sram chains come in a heavy cosmoline/fish oil packing grease that is super sticky


Yeah, I once followed Sheldon's advice to leave on the factory grease. That was on a newly-installed SRAM chain. Big mistake in a sand-filled area like I live in. Big mistake. These days, I wipe that sticky stuff from the outside of a new chain using a rag wetted in solvent. I just get it off the outside. I don't stress much about the inside, because I run Chain-L, which is just oil, which is probably compatible enough with whatever sticky coating a manufacturer uses. I apply the Chain-L on top of whatever factory lube remains inside the links.


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## estabro (Oct 9, 2009)

The stuff that SRAM comes with new is pretty sticky and nasty. A couple of rides and applications of ProLink or other light lube and wipe down with a rag and it's pretty much gone.


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## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

customfab said:


> Curious what type of lube you use and how wet it is were you are? Here in Central Oregon it's pretty dry and I use Dumonde pretty much exclusively. Seems like I can get the factory grease to last half a season if I stay out of the few creek crossings.


I ride in dry conditions too, but it's probably more related to the fact that I like to clean my bike more often than the average rider, so I'm probably running soap/lube through the chain every other week during a normal riding season. Part of that is because I'm anal, and part of it is because when I'm not racing I like riding older gear (90s era frames, M952 stuff, etc.) and since I weigh about 200lbs, I like to stay on top of the wear-and-tear issue.

I agree with your follow-up posting regarding the factory grease - SRAM stuff is ridiculously sticky, whereas Shimano is not nearly as bad. But even so, I've had pretty good luck using Dumonde (best lube ever) on a completely clean chain - the guys at Dumonde say it has no problem getting into the rollers and polymerizing on the surface of the metal, so perhaps that's part of the reason why my chains have long life spans. Also because I swap chains every 300-400 miles to reduce wear on the drivetrain.


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

jtmartino said:


> I ride in dry conditions too, but it's probably more related to the fact that I like to clean my bike more often than the average rider, so I'm probably running soap/lube through the chain every other week during a normal riding season. Part of that is because I'm anal, and part of it is because when I'm not racing I like riding older gear (90s era frames, M952 stuff, etc.) and since I weigh about 200lbs, I like to stay on top of the wear-and-tear issue.
> 
> I agree with your follow-up posting regarding the factory grease - SRAM stuff is ridiculously sticky, whereas Shimano is not nearly as bad. But even so, I've had pretty good luck using Dumonde (best lube ever) on a completely clean chain - the guys at Dumonde say it has no problem getting into the rollers and polymerizing on the surface of the metal, so perhaps that's part of the reason why my chains have long life spans. Also because I swap chains every 300-400 miles to reduce wear on the drivetrain.


I think washing your bikes all the time is what the root cause is. I wash my bike a couple times a season. It's just dusty after all. I do clean (and by that I mean throughly wipe down) my drivetrain every couple of rides. But my bike rarely gets the house again. Since I work on bikes for a living the last thing I want to do is work on my own bike. Washing it leads to more work, and why I only do it a few times a year.

Dumonde is the greatest chain lube ever. If I was a wax lube user or used Chain-L (aka gear oil) I would certainly be a believer in soaking my chain in the nastiest solvent I could get my hands on.


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## Waltah (Aug 5, 2011)

my buddy uses a park and i just purchased the finish line. id say you are good with picking either one they both do a great job. the finish line has a larger magnet to catch more metallic debris and is slightly more compact so thats nice for when you travel. i think they both work great for what they are.


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## bing! (Jul 8, 2010)

estabro said:


> I do the same thing, but just steps #1-7 about once every few weeks. Between rides I wipe with rag, oil with ProLink and then re-wipe.
> 
> Also recommend odorless mineral spirits as the solvent. Some paint thinners can be pretty noxious.


I use camp gas. I do the same thing, but instead of shaking, Ive attached a holder on top of my air compressor head. I put the chain in the bottle, the bottle in the holder and turn on the compressor  It gets pretty jiggy in there


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## mudflapper (May 30, 2009)

I use my ultrasonic cleaner. Nice and shiny!!!! :thumbsup:


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## neex (Mar 30, 2005)

runkmaster said:


> How well do those cleaners really work? Seems more thourough to pull it off and give it the old shake and scrub treatment. These things kinda look messy and gimmicky.


Maybe I'm doing something wrong as I've been using my Park cleaner for years and have never had issues with leaks, mess, etc. Pay attention to the fill line, hold it level on the bottom potion of the chain with a slight downward force fwd/backward pedal whichever you prefer (or depending on if it's in the stand or not). The key is the spin the crank slowly and make sure the magnet stays clean. I think this thing rocks. I dry it with a rag after cleaning, let it sit maybe 30min, lube and let sit a few hours and then wipe clean with a rag. My chains last a long time and stay clean for the mostpart. A rag alone works well too but I find I need to put it through a few toothbrush/rag cycles to get the same effect as the cleaning tool. YMMV.

A.


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## dblvanos (Mar 17, 2010)

I use the finish line tool, water and simple green solution. Then I spin the chain fast an use a cloth to remove as much moisture as I can. I recently picked up an air compressor, now I use that to blow water out of the links. 

Use lube of choice, run through gears or gear, then wipe of excess. I wash my chain everytime the bike is washed, and that is often.


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## William_Cannon (May 5, 2009)

$0.79. Works well if you use dry lube.


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## Bnystrom (Apr 28, 2007)

knl2stl said:


> Factory grease? You mean what comes on the chain when it is new? Yes, it is grease, but not intended as lubrication. Its final function is to keep the chain from rusting after manufacturing and shipping.


This is not true of all chains. KMC chains are factory lubricated and they even sell the oil they use as chain lube.


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

Bnystrom said:


> This is not true of all chains. KMC chains are factory lubricated and they even sell the oil they use as chain lube.


Good to know, but holy late to the thread Batman!


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## Bnystrom (Apr 28, 2007)

noapathy said:


> Good to know, but holy late to the thread Batman!


Yeah, I guess nothing has changed in the chain cleaning arena for a while and KMC just started offering their lube late last year.


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

Bnystrom said:


> Yeah, I guess nothing has changed in the chain cleaning arena for a while and KMC just started offering their lube late last year.


Cool, if I ever get a KMC chain, I won't wipe off all the goo right away. I heard some Shimano chains are made by KMC. Wonder if they're now lubed with this stuff, too?


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## Bnystrom (Apr 28, 2007)

noapathy said:


> Cool, if I ever get a KMC chain, I won't wipe off all the goo right away. I heard some Shimano chains are made by KMC. Wonder if they're now lubed with this stuff, too?


KMC chains are pretty much all I use these days, but it's been a long time since I've seen a chain with Cosmoline-style protectant on it. Shimano, SRAM and Campy chains (at least the upper-end models) can be ridden with the factory lube, as it IS a lubricant, not just a protectant. However, since they're heavy oils, they will attract dirt and get gunky pretty quick compared to most lighter, drier chain lubes. What I typically do is install the chain, then wipe it thoroughly with a rag moistened with odorless mineral spirits (a.k.a. "paint thinner") to remove the lube from the outside. That minimizes the gunk buildup for the first ride or two. I lube the chains on my off-road bikes pretty frequently and the factory lube gets flushed out after a few applications of the "lube du jour".

BTW, the KMC tech guys say it's fine to dilute their lube with mineral spirits so it penetrates and cleans better, and wipes off the outside easier.


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

Bnystrom said:


> KMC chains are pretty much all I use these days, but it's been a long time since I've seen a chain with Cosmoline-style protectant on it. Shimano, SRAM and Campy chains (at least the upper-end models) can be ridden with the factory lube, as it IS a lubricant, not just a protectant. However, since they're heavy oils, they will attract dirt and get gunky pretty quick compared to most lighter, drier chain lubes. What I typically do is install the chain, then wipe it thoroughly with a rag moistened with odorless mineral spirits (a.k.a. "paint thinner") to remove the lube from the outside. That minimizes the gunk buildup for the first ride or two. I lube the chains on my off-road bikes pretty frequently and the factory lube gets flushed out after a few applications of the "lube du jour".
> 
> BTW, the KMC tech guys say it's fine to dilute their lube with mineral spirits so it penetrates and cleans better, and wipes off the outside easier.


Been using wax-based lube and sounds like I kind of "dilute" it on the chain. My most recent method is just treat a new chain like it's dirty/in need of lube. I drip a bit of lube while rotating the chain hitting each link, spin it round several times to let it work its way in, and then wipe it off. I do this one more time and done. It only takes a couple minutes, so I do it about once a week (more when it's wet). Seems to work pretty well and would probably work as well with most lubes out there.


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## Pasley69 (Dec 11, 2015)

*Using wax as lubricant*



noapathy said:


> Been using wax-based lube and sounds like I kind of "dilute" it on the chain. My most recent method is just treat a new chain like it's dirty/in need of lube. I drip a bit of lube while rotating the chain hitting each link, spin it round several times to let it work its way in, and then wipe it off. I do this one more time and done. It only takes a couple minutes, so I do it about once a week (more when it's wet). Seems to work pretty well and would probably work as well with most lubes out there.


I read some years ago that the best way to lube a new chain was to 
1, soak in degreaser to remove all traces of factory lubricant
2, then soak chain in melted beeswax in a tin on a hotplate
3, remove chain from wax (don't burn yourself) and allow to cool and solidify.
4, fit chain and ride - excess wax will break away and fall off
The idea was that the hard wax would not attract dirt, it would repel water, and chain remains nice and shiny. NO grease or oil required. Re-do the treatment every 6-10 rides (500km). Anyone heard of this? I might give it a try if I can get a heap of wax. Love the idea of no mess.


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

Waxing works great if you like squeeky chains


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## alaskamatt (Nov 10, 2013)

Park tool works great for me. I use the wd40 chain cleaner from their bike line. Comes out sparkling every time. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Bnystrom (Apr 28, 2007)

While waxing works, - It's a real pain to do - It lasts less than 100 miles/160 KM - It provides no significant rust protection Overall, it's a waste of time and is less effective than most other methods, particularly on mountain bikes. If you want get into mixing wax, PTFE and other additives, you can improve the durability and lubrication, but the rust issue still remains.


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## spyghost (Oct 30, 2012)

these work great for chains...









toothbrush is too soft


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