# 2015 World Cup Thread



## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

OK, so I've got nothing but the race calendar, but it's a start, something to look forward to next May.

*2015 UCI Mountain Bike World Cup calendar*

May 23-24: XCO#1, Nove Mesto na Morave (Czech Republic)
May 30-31: XCO#2, Albstadt (Germany)
July 4-5: XCO#3 Lenzerheide (Switzerland)
August 1-2: XCO#4, Mont-Sainte-Anne (Canada)
August 8-9: XCO#5, Windham (United States)
August 22-23: XCO#6 Val di Sole (Italy)

Perhaps the most conspicuous change is the lack of eliminators, the newest World Cup mountain bike sub-discipline. The UCI said the eliminator will still be part of the 2015 world championships, but it offered no explanation as to why it was dropping them from the World Cup calendar. Since its inception, participation in the eliminator has been significantly less than the cross country, with most top cross country racers choosing to skip the eliminator more often than not.

"The eliminator will not be present in the 2015 Mountain Bike World Cup for various logistical reasons," the UCI told Cyclingnews when asked why it was going away. "However, it will remain part of the UCI MTB World Championships. At this stage, there is not plan to replace it with anything else."

*2015 UCI MTB & TRIALS WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS*
La Massana - Andorra, Vallnord Bike Park
Sept 01-06, 2015


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

LOL, we're getting started early! I'm proud of the 31+ pages of the 2014 thread, I'm so glad there are others in the world who geek out over this stuff like I do.
So my early contribution will be gratitude that Nino is riding MTB full time next season with no road race plans.
Schurter commits to full mountain bike season in 2015 | Cyclingnews.com

Interesting that Eliminator didn't stick around very long. I don't see an issue with the top XCO riders not riding the Eliminators because that format allowed a racer with a different skillset to shine. And that's cool, I stink at climbing for being into XC so I can relate to a MTB race that favors the big-legged sprinter-type racers.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

XCE had a lot of potential. But, I really feel they neutered the courses so much (after the first few), people who would really shine in that type of event wrote it off and stopped coming. 

Will there be many (ie any) stand alone XCE races? Lets hope so, otherwise it's really odd to have a World Champ for a sub discipline that doesn't have races throughout the year.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

The dust has not settled and the mud is not even dry and we are already talking 2015? 

Well, I might as well join...

My questions for 2015...Will Jaro bounce back? Can Nino keep his onslaught? Will Julien be able to replicate his 2014, while juggling HT and FS bikes? Will the real M.A. Fontana show up like in 2012? How long before Hermida decides to stop racing and beating guys 12 years younger? Will Cink show up like in 2013? Can McConnell win a race beating Nino aand Julien straight up? 

I hope to get those answers sometime next year...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

And can the youngsters like Jolanda Neff and Pauline Ferrand-Prévot hold their fitness and performance at the level they have, or will they fade back the way Elizabeth Osl and Julie Bresset did after stomping the field when they first arrived? That seems to be a pattern. 

This past year of XCO racing was quite good, and has made for some great spectating and Red Bull watching.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Looks like the womens races will be a bit more interesting.

Looks like Jolanda is headed to stockli pro team (im sure my spelling is wrong)

Im on my phone and it wont let me post a link to her site


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

Who is the dude that races in baggies? Someone needs to point him (or his sponsors) to this youtube so he can get some lycra kits ordered before 2015. At the WC level, it all adds up. You have to take every advantage if you really want to win.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

I do believe that's the Cannondale team that races in baggies.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Those Specialized Win Tunnel experiments are pretty cool. It is intuitive that baggies are less aero than lycra, but there are so many other variables in a MTB race that it seems like it wouldn't matter that much. For example, drafting behind someone like riding single file on singletrack has a huge reduction in drag and could maybe negate any negative drag caused by flapping baggies. 




Both Fumic and Fontana have had solid results (World Cup podiums I believe) while looking cool in their baggies. Marco did have his best result of the year though in the only race he did in lycra at World Champs! I wonder if they'll change their approach next year if they see this video? Because it is true that every little bit matters at that level.

Not as apples to apples as baggies vs lycra in the tunnel, but more evidence that aero is everything and clothes matter.


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## scottg (Mar 30, 2004)

Did they say what speed they were simulating in the baggy aero test? I know that other tests have been at 40 kph which is not applicable to mountain bike racing on anything with much singletrack. I don't think aero is of much value under 10 kph while pedalling and it is of zero value when you're descending while braking - even if it is at over 10 kph.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I thought about the speed, too, because Caveman's race-fit jersey is certainly flapping quite a bit and implying that he's going pretty dang fast. They don't mention speed that I recall, but they usually report results as time saved over 40 km. For the MTB test, they reduced that to time saved over 20 km. I agree that aero wouldn't seem to matter much at low speeds, but the Win Tunnel tests show just how much of an aero impact drafting has even at distances up to 8 meters between the riders. That depends on speed, too, but it is still amazing to me that there is a measurable drafting benefit when there is more than a bike length between riders. So in that respect, every little thing might really matter for these top level racers at the top level events.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

Some would argue that aero savings matter as much at lower speeds. This is because you are spending more time to cover the distance, so you have more potential to "make up" time with more aero equipment. 

But, with the constant changes of pace in MTB XCO racing, going in and out of the woods, etc... It probably doesn't matter.


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

Watching other videos on their wind tunnel, the range of windspeed is from 20km/h at the lowest to 70km/h at the highest. Being their expressing their results as time saved based in seconds over 20km, id guess they were testing at the 20km/h. Not to say that some of the testing, and video used, was also at 40km/h...

While im sure aero savings probably matters a little at 20km/h.. I dont think that savings is linear as speed increases.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Fontana anf Fumic had very different results this year...baggies had nothing to do with their results...


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## MessagefromTate (Jul 12, 2007)

carlostruco said:


> Fontana anf Fumic had very different results this year...baggies had nothing to do with their results...


Fontana had his best result of 2014 at the Worlds when the Italian National team basically backhanded him across the face for wearing baggies and he donned the team kit. Coincidence? I doubt it.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

briscoelab said:


> Some would argue that aero savings matter as much at lower speeds. This is because you are spending more time to cover the distance, so you have more potential to "make up" time with more aero equipment.
> 
> But, with the constant changes of pace in MTB XCO racing, going in and out of the woods, etc... It probably doesn't matter.


The main question to ask on this subject is: "is there a disadvantage to wearing aero kit on a mountain bike?"

Although there may not be lots of sustained high speed sections on a current World Cup XC race course there are lots of places where the riders are sprinting, accelerating and reaching high speeds for shorter periods of time. These changes of pace are frequent. If you have improved aerodynamics, reducing drag, that would make it easier to accelerate and go fast on these sections, which should add up over the course of a 1 hour 30 minute race.

In terms of aero helmets what I've been finding with my Specialized Evade helmet is that it's just like wearing a normal bike helmet. In UK weather (the hottest this summer riding in it has been around 28c) the ventilation is pretty good, even when climbing at lower speeds, and I haven't missed my Giro Aeon at all. Whenever you do get up to higher speeds for any period of time you're getting some aero benefit from it. It's essentially free speed. The faster you go the more benefit you get. That still applies offroad also.

https://tour-int.com/










The same goes for a skinsuit . To wear it's not that different to a tight fitting jersey and bib shorts but you get improved aerodynamics for something you'd wear anyway.

Quite a nice picture is this one of Todd Wells after he'd won the 2014 Leadville 100 race. Specialized Evade aero helmet and a skin suit. Second place was Christoph Sauser, also in Specialized Evade aero helmet and skinsuit.










https://www.summitdaily.com/news/12542816-113/wells-leadville-finish-lakata

Where I think there are some easy aero gains to be made over the next few years are in mountain bike frame designs too. You can see how it is starting to go that way already with the increased number of mountain bikes using internally routed cables for a cleaner look, see Todd Wells Specialized Epic pictured above as an example. As XTR Di2 becomes more widespread that will clean up the number of exposed cables also.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

MessagefromTate said:


> Fontana had his best result of 2014 at the Worlds when the Italian National team basically backhanded him across the face for wearing baggies and he donned the team kit. Coincidence? I doubt it.


What did Fontana wear on the European Championships? There is video in Youtube, but I don't remember...


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Much disccussion can be had about baggies, aero and FS bikes as far as technology in WC races, but in reality, riders are who they are. We saw Fumic make podium in FS bike and baggies, while his BFF did it in a HT without the baggies. We saw Nino have the worst race of the season (no mechanicals included, I think he just blew up...kinda lika Albstadt) on the most important one, while like on that same exact race, Absalon had his best race of the season. Did equipment played a role? for one of them, almost definitely...

But we also saw other guys mixing it up with the top guns. The Fluck brothers had great showings, while Jaro kept playing Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hide...maybe if he switched to a smaller chainring...I mean, he's big and powerful, but riding a 38T while courses keep getting those nasty climbs might take a heavy toll anybody...

When do the Olympic qualifying period begins next year?


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## CptSydor (Sep 20, 2007)

Bravo Cannaondale marketing squad. Mission accomplished.


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## Purulento (Aug 27, 2009)

I'd like to see redbull bringing in different commentators along with Rob. I like Bart, but different people bring another insights to the viewers. In the WC last year it was nice to see another guy commenting in one the the races...


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Bart must stay!! IF he goes I go....well maybe. I like what they both bring, Rob with his "simplton" questions and Bart knows what he is talking about. Not to mention the best accent, somtimes I say words in my head in his voice like, Tubular tires, Very dusty, SRAM xx1, ect.


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

Are you guys watching the races? When those guys wearing the baggies hit the start/finishing straight each lap they might as well be towing a kite. Instead of looking for marginal gains they have marginal loses each lap! Instead of looking cool I think it looks pretty stupid if the goal is to win.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

Rob is awesome. You can tell over the years he has been doing the commentary that he really has grown to love and respect the XCO gals/guys and their abilities. 

I think most of the time when he's asking somewhat daft questions, he's really just being a good color man so to speak. Setting Bart up to answer a question that he (Rob) knows the answer to, but is looking to add to the coverage and highlight a certain point. 

I also hope that everyone is watching the DH at least some of the time. Rob is pretty much the world's most perfect commentator there. The races are exciting and his coverage is great. Like when he left the booth the Peaty pulled out that win, the amazing chainless run at the WC this year, or of course Danny Hart 2011.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I agree about Rob, he has grown to appreciate the skill and fitness of XC it seems to me. I think he truly digs the Nino/Julien throwdowns. I also totally agree that he asks setup questions for Bart to answer, it's part of being a pro commentator. And Rob's DH commentary is great and his announcer partner "Cunni" know their stuff.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I can't quite decide which one has the thicker and harder to understand accent, Rob or Bart. It's a closer race than the finishes at World's DH this year :skep: 

What's interesting is that Rob obviously rides a XC mountain bike and talks about his 29" bike quite often, he's a very tall dude, must be at least 6'-5".


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Jolanda Neff answering the seldom asked question about whether or not there is static buildup on a set of rollers. Photo from Jelenia Góra Trophy Day 2 (photo by szrubkowski.net).


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

*World Cup Podiums*
_"Some mountain bike trivia for you (which you may already know). You may have seen that in mountain bike World Cup they have the top five on the podium rather than the top three.

The origins for this come from a MTB World Cup race in Cairns in 1994 where a 17 year old debutant Australian came 5th and the race organiser was so impressed by this youthful talent that he asked for the podium to be extended to five to acknowledge him. And they've had five man podiums ever since (because the sponsors liked it).

And that 17 year old was Cadel Evans - and here's that podium (he's on the left)."_ *RichN95*

https://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=12988328&start=20#p19112294










It's marketing from Scott but here's a bit about wheel size choices with a video by Nino Schurter:

https://wheelsizematters.scott-sports.com/


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## jkirkpatri (Sep 16, 2008)

Subscribed! Loved the 2014 thread!


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

Can this be an official WC thread before we have the first post from everyone's favorite World Champion husband from up north?

Funny what happened to the XCE. I recall an article describing the XCE and XCO combining points to encourage more top racers to participate.


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## Gregg K (Jan 12, 2004)

Warning regarding the wheel size comment on this link- SCOTT Sports - Wheelsize matters

They are incorrect regarding wheel diameter making a difference in acceleration. Not only have I done the math, but there are two other threads on this forum where other engineers have also shown the math. There are numerous instances of bike companies getting this important physics fact wrong. But this is a thread about the World Cup, and I hesitated to bring attention to this here.


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## scottg (Mar 30, 2004)

Gregg K said:


> Warning regarding the wheel size comment on this link- SCOTT Sports - Wheelsize matters
> 
> They are incorrect regarding wheel diameter making a difference in acceleration. Not only have I done the math, but there are two other threads on this forum where other engineers have also shown the math. There are numerous instances of bike companies getting this important physics fact wrong. But this is a thread about the World Cup, and I hesitated to bring attention to this here.


Can you point me to this data?


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## Gregg K (Jan 12, 2004)

The one thread I can easily find is this one - http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-650b/what-made-you-want-27-5-over-29-a-919922-25.html

If you only read craigsj posts, you'll get the information you wanted. I've posted the page that just reiterates what he explains somewhere earlier in the thread. I suggest reading through the entire thread, and paying attention to meltingfeather and craigsj posts, as they are the engineers. I could post my calculations, but unless you're fully capable of understanding the math at the physics level, it would be pointless.

Also, there's an example in another location in that same thread that I happen to have on hand. It's a pretty good example of what my math shows, without all of the alpha's and omega's and moment of inertia stuff.






As for the original thread where we all showed our calculations, I think it was in the 29er forum, and I'd have to spend some time trying to find it.

Found it- http://forums.mtbr.com/29er-bikes/inertia-29er-vs-26er-wheel-784938.html


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Stonerider said:


> ...races in baggies? ...


I just watched the vid again. I wish they would have just swapped baggy shorts with lycra shorts, that is the wardrobe choice I find myself with on race day. In the vid, he swaps between a race-fit jersey and a super flappy shirt-like jersey and it just visually looks like by far the biggest source of drag between the two setups.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Gregg K said:


> Warning regarding the wheel size comment on this link- SCOTT Sports - Wheelsize matters


Sorry, I posted that link because I thought they'd done the first headline picture well and only skimmed the rest of it.

If you look at 2014, Nino Schurter won four World Cup rounds on 27.5" wheels (Nove Mesto, Monte Ste Anne, Windham and Meribel). Julien Absalon won three World Cup rounds (Pietermaritzburg, Cairns, Albstadt) plus the World Championships at Hafjell using 29" wheels making it four apiece.

No one else was able to win a World Cup all year, regardless of which wheelsize they were using.

If everyone was still riding on 26" wheels I suspect the results would have been the same also.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Pauline Ferrand-Prevot won the women's road race world championships yesterday.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/uci-road-world-championships-2014/womens-elite-road-race/results

If it's true that she's going to be doing a full season of mountain bike world cup races in 2015 she's definitely one to watch, especially when you consider the way she won those MTB world cup races in 2014. The question is if having such a busy schedule of road and offroad racing, similar to what Marianne Vos did last year with road racing, mountain bike racing and cyclocross, all mixed together with lots of travelling, is going to be too much over the course of a long season.

*Young French star juggles road and mountain bike racing*
_"Pauline Ferrand Prevot didn't have a great day at the cross country mountain bike world championships last week in Hafjell, Norway, but that didn't stop her from celebrating a good 2014 season and looking ahead to next season.

After two broken chains and having to run almost a half lap to get to a tech zone, the talented, young French road and mountain bike star told Cyclingnews that she will do more mountain bike racing in 2015 than she did this season.

"Next year, I want to do all the mountain bike Worlds Cups. I think it will be nice," said Ferrand Prevot. "I will also do the road. It will be good to race both."
When asked how she manages changing between the two disciplines, she said, "I think it's important to keep a good balance between the road and the mountain bike. I try to chose my races and to rest as possible."

"Also, the position is not the same between my bikes. So to switch back and forth, I need to make sure I also train on my mountain bike and practice the technical riding."
Ferrand Prevot was disappointed about her race at mountain bike Worlds where she had been expected to battle another under 23 female phenom, Jolanda Neff, but she was keeping the race in perspective. She finished eighth.
"I did a great season, it was just bad luck today," she said.

In 2014, she won the Nove Mesto and Albstadt mountain bike World Cups plus she is also the French road, time trial, cyclo-cross and mountain bike national champion. She was the best young rider and second overall at the Giro Rosa.
Her focus on the 2015 World Cups will be important in helping France qualify more spots for the 2016 Olympic Games in Rio. Given 2012 Olympic champion Julie Bresset's struggles this season, the French team can't take for granted qualifying the maximum of two women.

Olympic qualifications for 2016 began in May of 2014.
Ferrand Prevot was the youngest road rider at the 2012 Olympics in London - she finished eighth. She also races cyclo-cross."_ *Cyclingnews*

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ferrand-prevot-to-focus-on-mountain-bike-world-cup-in-2015

An interesting little twitter snippet:

the Inner Ring ‏@inrng · 3m 
L' Equipe explains yesterday's team tactics with Vos telling Ferrand-Prévot "the team will ride for you" before the start

the Inner Ring ‏@inrng · 2m 
Ferrand-Prévot also earns no salary from Rabo-Liv team, just win bonuses, travel expenses + kit. "Employed" by French govt but free to ride

http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=12988370&start=120#p19115582


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

If she races the full schedule, WC season is gonna be tons of fun!!!


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

If you want to get a feel for the features that will be included in a typical 2015 XC course the Red Bull Rampage is on Red Bull TV in about an hours time from this post (8pm - 11.30pm GST).

Red Bull TV - FMB World Tour 2014


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

There's actually a very fun, super fast, moderately technical course right near there. Look up Virgin, UT on Strava. Frog Hollow, and a couple of other races, take place around that area. 

Amazing XC, AM and FR riding there, in general. I love it.

It might be the best place for winter training I've seen, too. Great weather, dirt cheap, lots of non-riding attractions (Zion NP). There are a couple of U23 World Cup racers that live a couple of miles down the road, too.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

I thought this was quite a good picture. Pauline Ferrand Prevot is wearing her road World Champion jersey but it still has Marianne Vos' name on it as it must be one that was already made for Marianne Vos previously.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

By some amazing stroke of luck I find myself in Switzerland this week. And I just so happen to have the chance to ride at Lenzerheide (site of a 2015 WC event!). I wonder if they already know what the loop will be? I'll try to give you guys some kind of report...


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

criscobike said:


> By some amazing stroke of luck I find myself in Switzerland this week. And I just so happen to have the chance to ride at Lenzerheide (site of a 2015 WC event!). I wonder if they already know what the loop will be? I'll try to give you guys some kind of report...


since there was a race of BMC cup this year (BMC Racing Cup / BMC Racing Cup - MTBCrossCountry) they will very likely use most of that course


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

Long story warning:
Well, I am done with my ride at Lenzerheide. Mixed impressions. The area is gorgeous and worthy of a trip if you are in the area. So, I went to the BIG shop in the area to rent a bike. I was told that as it was the end of the season, they had been selling off their bikes and didn't have many rentals and the few rentals they had were all out for the next few days. They recommended I try another shop just up the road. Before I left, I asked if they could point me to the World Cup/BMC Cup course so I could go see it. They had no idea what I was talking about.The guy who was with me asked around an nobody had any clue. They pointed me to a grove of pine trees to the West where someone thought it was, but told me that it wasn't marked so I would have a hard time finding it. Ok that's fine. Even if I knew the general area, I could probably find the trail eventually. 
I went to the next shop and they did have one medium frame trail bike left (XC was lost on both shops) so I snagged it. This time, the guy at the shop knew right away what I was talking about (the WC course) and pointed me down to the same grove of trees, so I felt pretty confident that I would find something down there. I hopped on the bike and made my way down to the trees. 
There was some ST down there right away so I got excited and figured this had to be it. But quickly it mushed out into a bunch of junk which led me to conclude this couldn't be it. I wandered around some more, but couldn't find anything right. So I abandoned the effort for now. I headed to a trail that had again been recommended by both shops as THE trail for cross country to do (The 603 trail). Even though when I made the proposal that I would be happy to ride up they all looked at me like I was nuts! I followed the map to where it crossed a road to hook in. For some reason, the trail signs took me into downtown...? Then it finally turned into a dirt road, so I was sure it was the right way to start at least. At some point, there would be a ST turnoff I assumed. I kept going and going on this road and it eventually started to go up. The scenery was beautiful and I didn't mind riding on a road. I was still excited for the prospect of awesome DH ST up ahead. The road got steeper and steeper...and steeper...and longer. I kept waiting for the ST. I finally reached the top (after almost 2,700 feet of climbing in just a few miles) and assumed the ST must break off the road at some point...but it never did. The upper elevations had a still cold wind blowing that chilled me to the bone. I kept going and going, but never any ST.The DH was fast, but just more road. I seriously started to question if XC meant something different over in Switzerland than the States. I got back down to the bottom and wandered around some more. I had seen the link that nya had posted above and I kept looking for anything that looked the same. Specifically, I looked for the rock in the pictures. 
At this point, I wasn't sure what to do, I didn't have enough time to ride all the way back up again, and I didn't want to do the same ride. I looked at the map again and figured out that the ONLY open ST at the whole place was the huge freeride DH trails serviced by the lift. I wasn't in the mood to pay another 50 franks for maybe two rides on th lift, so I just took the bike back. At the shop, they seemed offended when I suggested the trail was "ok". I pointed out that I was looking for some good XC singletrack. And they said, "yeah, cross country trail is 603" I didn't want to be that rude American so I backed off right away and told them I still had a good day and thank you. I had a little time to kill before I was to meet up with my ride so I walked back to the first shop as it was much bigger than the second and noticed they had a family skills practice area. I decided to go and see it. I wandered back even further and came into a nice big open field; and what do you know, I looked up and saw the very rock from the photos posted by nya! Here it finally was! But in the complete opposite direction that I was told. I wandered around a bit more and spotted lots of little trails, but this time, they made sense and I could see clear XC tread in the dirt. It looked really cool. I was tempted to run back and get the bike again, but then a nice Bull cow came charging down a hill in my general direction. As the local fence was made out of very durable string, my confidence in avoiding a confrontation soared and I skedaddled! I went into the big shop and told the same guy that I had found the course and I was not far behind their shop. "Really?! That's funny." said the guy...oh well. I got back to the apartment in Zurich and looked up the photos from the post and sure nuff, there was the big red bike shop in the background of the photos. How in the world did they not know there was a race there?!?! Oh well...it was still cool to be able to be on a bike in Switzerland. But next time, I need to get a guide to show me around to the classic ST.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

If you have a rough idea of where the race route is you could look on Strava using segment search and segment explore to see if there is a segment for the race route. There are some BMC Cup downhill segments and an Enduro segment near Lenzerheide but I couldn't see one there for the BMC Cup XC course however.

http://www.strava.com/segments/expl...r/46.728665,9.557472/zoom/15/map_type/terrain

For the World Cup routes they usually have several Strava segments created (with Nino Schurter as KOM) so you can see the route on a map. eg: 2014 Windham World Cup Course:

Strava Segment | 2014 XC World Cup Course


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

WR304 said:


> If you have a rough idea of where the race route is you could look on Strava using segment search and segment explore to see if there is a segment for the race route. There are some BMC Cup downhill segments and an Enduro segment near Lenzerheide but I couldn't see one there for the BMC Cup XC course however.
> 
> http://www.strava.com/segments/expl...r/46.728665,9.557472/zoom/15/map_type/terrain
> 
> ...


Yeah, I have since figured that out. But you are right. The hard part is that we are assuming that they will use the same BMC course right now. What I saw was pretty cool. Even though I didn't ride it, I will remember what I saw for when we watch the race next year. It is cool to know what it really is like. Techy features don't translate well via video. It was cool to be there and I suggested to my family (who lives in Zurich) that they go next year and watch.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Julien Absalon's bike from the 2014 World Championships. 39 tooth chainring for the win.


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## Gregg K (Jan 12, 2004)

That looks huge until I ran the gear inches on it. 27 gear inches isn't much higher than my lowest gear. 

What I find interesting in the photo is the use of a solid pin instead of a quick link. And the Di2 wire routing. 

I wouldn't mind having that bike!


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

39x40 is a really tall gear for the low end of a 29er. Especially when you see the climbs on that course in Norway. Even Kulhavy, who is known to ride big gears runs a 38T ring (and that's with a 42T cog on his XX group). 

The chain fixing pin is likely because he's on Shimano. I'd guess their spare chains in the tech zone are fitted with a quick link though.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Gregg K said:


> That looks huge until I ran the gear inches on it. 27 gear inches isn't much higher than my lowest gear.
> 
> What I find interesting in the photo is the use of a solid pin instead of a quick link. And the Di2 wire routing.
> 
> I wouldn't mind having that bike!


The rear cassette should be a Shimano XTR 11-40 tooth 11 speed cassette. The chainring teeth on the custom front chainring aren't narrow-wide so it can run with an odd number of teeth, rather than the even number of teeth required on a SRAM XX1 narrow- wide chainring (32,34,36,38 tooth etc chainrings only).

Shimano chains don't use a quick link. They have a special connecting pin instead. Have a look at this video on installing a Shimano chain.

http://www.artscyclery.com/learningcenter/installshimanoroadchain.html

.


----------



## Gregg K (Jan 12, 2004)

i assumed it was a 42. (I'm still in the mindset of how I'm going to mix and match Di2 with Sram.) It's still not that much higher than my second lowest gear, haha. But then they're moving faster, which makes it even worse. I can climb 25% grades in that gear, just not going 6 mph.

Oh I see: if he breaks a chain, then the pin removal time is moot. Good thinking.


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## Gregg K (Jan 12, 2004)

WR304 said:


> ...even number of teeth required on a SRAM XX1 narrow- wide chainring (32,34,36,38 tooth etc chainrings only).
> 
> .


Ah! I kept wondering why they didn't do odd teeth. And I'm supposed to be an engineer.

Yeah, I've been riding long enough to have installed chains before the quick links. Hell, I was riding since before there were helmets!


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

I could be mistaken, but most of the pics I saw of Absalon's bikes during the season, had 34t rings...so, did he really used a 39t ring in Norway? I've always seen Nino on a 36 and Jaro on a 38...I also remember seeing Absalon on a 1x10 with a 39 on the front, but that was with 26" wheels...


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

I dont have anything to envy Absalon...well, the only thing I dont envy is the bike...


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I hate you for having tgat bike.......is it as awesome as I think it is?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Yep!!! I can stomp on the pedals out of the saddle, and bobbing is almost non existent while the shock is in the Trail setting...in the Climb setting is almost locked out...the bike is super light for a 29 FS...Size M as pictured is 22.4# and 21.9# in race set up...


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I hate you too.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

If I told you the budget spent here, then you would hate my family also...

But back on topic, anyone know if the new XCO courses for next year will some good ol' technical feature, including nasty climbs and downhills? I don't remember much from the last race I watched at Val di Sole...and Lenzerheide has been discussed in this thread...


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Giant and LIV teams are no more, wondering where their riders will end up (Jolanda in Stockli). And I was kind of a fan of these 2 teams.


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## plupp (Sep 19, 2011)

nya said:


> Giant and LIV teams are no more, wondering where their riders will end up (Jolanda in Stockli). And I was kind of a fan of these 2 teams.


Such a bad move from Giant Bicycles to withdraw from the XC-circus. But again, that might explain why they think 29er are over =) Sad for a bike brand with such good bikes to go in the wrong direction.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

plupp said:


> Such a bad move from Giant Bicycles to withdraw from the XC-circus. But again, that might explain why they think 29er are over =) Sad for a bike brand with such good bikes to go in the wrong direction.


there are actually quite a few top riders w/o team for 2015 so far, Eva Lechner, Blaza Klemencic, Moritz Milatz, some of the giant riders, Irina Kalentieva is w/o team for another season afaik, wondering what went wrong in XCO, thought it is getting even more popular with the redbull coverage etc...was it the 2014 expansive travelign esason that caused that?


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Wow!

Is someone else taking over as the main sponsor?


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

alphajaguars said:


> Wow!
> 
> Is someone else taking over as the main sponsor?


nope the team is gone
jolanda - stockli
giger has a new team as well afaik
maja has no team, I think she is trying to make a polish one again
lingren is looking for a team
not sure about pauline and michiel, pauline was paid by french goverment anyway


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

I would think that Giant would want to keep those folks riding their bikes at least.

Guess they have given up on XC. 😔


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## plupp (Sep 19, 2011)

nya said:


> nope the team is gone
> jolanda - stockli
> giger has a new team as well afaik
> maja has no team, I think she is trying to make a polish one again
> ...


I guess Pauline might still be with the Giant/Shimano Road-team and then race MTB for France or a local sponsor? Or was Paulines main goal MTB for 2015?

Anyhow, to get out of XC-racing with one of the most solid teams is a strange move, and if the deal with the Shimano road team will discontinue next year as the deal for this year was only a temporary solution they will only have the Giant Offroad Team left, but that might be a local US-team I guess?


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## GoldenDragoon (Apr 21, 2013)

carlostruco said:


> Yep!!! I can stomp on the pedals out of the saddle, and bobbing is almost non existent while the shock is in the Trail setting...in the Climb setting is almost locked out...the bike is super light for a 29 FS...Size M as pictured is 22.4# and 21.9# in race set up...


I wouldn't consider 10kg light for an XC bike (it is a good weight for a stock FS XC bike). If I swapped my frame over to the FS version my bike would be approx 8.8kg built with a similar drivechain (X01) to yours.


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## PlanB (Nov 22, 2007)

I'm surprised to hear of Giant pulling out of World Cup XC. It's funny, I always used to think of Giant as a brand of solid but unsexy bikes. I know they were raced at the highest levels in the past, but they never seemed to make the splash of even, say, Specialized. I always thought they needed to hire some good designers and marketing people (they had the engineering/manufacturing part figured out...) Then, over the last couple of years I started to get excited about them. Yolanda is a true "character" and she's killing it on their bike! They must be good, right?! The men's road team is cool too, with Kittel and Dagenkolb being at the front of the "new" Pro Tour generation. So in my mind, they're starting to get it right, then they pull out. Maybe they do still need to hire those marketing people...


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Giant Shimamo also has the number 1 UCI ranked cyclocross rider Lars van der Haar. I wonder where this leaves him?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

GoldenDragoon said:


> I wouldn't consider 10kg light for an XC bike (it is a good weight for a stock FS XC bike). If I swapped my frame over to the FS version my bike would be approx 8.8kg built with a similar drivechain (X01) to yours.


If you consider a 10Kg bike, that cost me $3,700, only has upgrades for around $800, no weight-weenie parts, not light enough for XC, then we live in different worlds.

Take a look a Manuel Fumic's Cannondale Scalpel profiled in Bike Rumor about two months ago...almost double of my cost...only half pound lighter...and that's a WC machine...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Jolanda Neff's move was actually announced a month ago but the cycling media pretty much missed it.

Jolanda Neff partners with Stöckli in 2015 - Stöckli - The Swiss Ski

There's still nothing to be found in the English online MTB media on the Liv/Giant team demise.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

rockyuphill said:


> Jolanda Neff's move was actually announced a month ago but the cycling media pretty much missed it.
> 
> Jolanda Neff partners with Stöckli in 2015 - Stöckli - The Swiss Ski
> 
> There's still nothing to be found in the English online MTB media on the Liv/Giant team demise.


in german, but giant is gone, is what it says
+ tweets from some of the giant riders
and info from polish source says maja is trying to build a polish team maybe
Erfolg ist keine Garantie: Kein Giant Weltcup-Team 2015 | a cross the country

btw my website registered Jolanda Neff's move!, I guess I do not count as cycling media


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

nya said:


> in german, but giant is gone, is what it says
> + tweets from some of the giant riders
> and info from polish source says maja is trying to build a polish team maybe
> Erfolg ist keine Garantie: Kein Giant Weltcup-Team 2015 | a cross the country
> ...


I was on your site last week. Very impressed!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Your site is the best WC race resource & results website, but all the English language MTB news magazine sites like Cycling News missed it.



nya said:


> btw my website registered Jolanda Neff's move!, I guess I do not count as cycling media


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## Purulento (Aug 27, 2009)

Hey nya there's one more item on the team transfer 2015 you could add: Henrique Avancini=>Cannondale Factory racing


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

So what happened with Plaxton? Signed last year with CFR and never seen him in a WC race. I know he did some or most of the US cups.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Stephen Ettinger signed with Cannondale Sho-Air.


> "@TEAMSHOAIR: @settinger_ fresh on the team. Welcome on board pic.twitter.com/StCplCuYoB" Congrats, Stephen and GREAT hire Sho-Air!
> 
> - Bernard Condevaux (@BernardPT) October 24, 2014


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I hope BMC gets a good US/Can team up this year. I think it would be smart to ride the wave that is Absalon.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Plaxton was a DNS in Windham and a DNF at Mont Sainte Anne, it looks like those were the only two he had entered.



machine4321 said:


> So what happened with Plaxton? Signed last year with CFR and never seen him in a WC race. I know he did some or most of the US cups.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Sho-air just posted up that he is back with them. Must have been a trial.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Looks that way...

"Canadian National Champion Max Plaxton returns to Team Sho-Air/Cannondale after being on loan to Cannondale Factory Racing during the 2014 season. In addition, up and coming women’s athlete Evelyn Dong also joins the team; this is Dong’s second full year as a pro rider. Over the past two years Dong has shown significant growth in the pro ranks to merit considerable attention and a factory ride."


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Wow...Ettinger to Can/Sho? I kinda liked him on BMC...BMC Racing Team then is no longer in the US...the only ones are BMC Dirt Project...


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

How many pages can we have on the 2015 WC thread before 2015 even starts?


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

criscobike said:


> How many pages can we have on the 2015 WC thread before 2015 even starts?


Everyone knows you have to warm up properly. Can't go into the season cold.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

criscobike said:


> How many pages can we have on the 2015 WC thread before 2015 even starts?


Think of it as training for the 2015 mtbr posting season.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

So are we gonna follow some kind of periodization? 2014 is not over yet and we are 4 pages deep into 2015...come spring we might need a prolonged rest...


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Isn't it time for the offseason strength training program?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The fun never stops... 

Everything after the last World Cup race of 2014 and World Champs has to be part of the 2015 season. Stop living in the past.


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## sprocketjockey9 (Jul 18, 2006)

I'm pretty sure BMC Dirt Project is no longer continuing also...


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Here's a look at Dan McConnell's Trek Superfly FS 9.9 SL XTR Di2 race bike.










As with Julien Absalon's bike he's got one of the custom chainrings instead of a stock XTR M9000 chainring also. The stock XTR M9000 chainrings are listed as coming in a 36 tooth size so this may be down to their not being available just yet.










The stem top cap on Dan McConnell's bike looks cool. Any idea what it is?

He has a -25 degree stem and no headset top cover to get the bars low enough.










https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/...nnells-trek-superfly-fs-9-9-sl-xtr-di2-42834/


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Interesting. Dan McConnell is racing in the Tour Down Under in 2015.
Trek Factory Racing announce Tour Down Under team | Cyclingnews.com


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## csteven71 (Jan 15, 2009)

WR304 said:


> The stem top cap on Dan McConnell's bike looks cool. Any idea what it is?


It's a cane creek one. It'll be cool to see him in TDU!


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Julien Absalon broke his collar bone in a cyclocross race crash last week. Let's hope it doesn't impact his MTB season!




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=823700674319746



Post by Julien Absalon Official.


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## kevbikemad (Jan 2, 2006)

I kinda wondered about Julien Absalon doing CX at all earlier this fall. I'm a big fan on having an off season. But then again, I'm not a fan of CX. I get that his team might want him to race some cross, but at what cost. Should be plenty of time to heal.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I think there should be plenty of time to heal. I believe he has raced CX semi-competitively for a number of years to keep fit and improve power. France is one of the traditional CX racing countries and a lot of French road and MTB pros also race CX. 

I love CX so I get excited to see MTB racers that I'm a fan of race CX, too.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

ewarnerusa said:


> I think there should be plenty of time to heal. I believe he has raced CX semi-competitively for a number of years to keep fit and improve power. France is one of the traditional CX racing countries and a lot of French road and MTB pros also race CX.
> 
> I love CX so I get excited to see MTB racers that I'm a fan of race CX, too.


He should be fine. The first world cup isn't until May, which is a long time away.

Speaking of MTBer racing CX. Anybody see the video of PFP bunny hopping the barrier at a race last weekend. Super smooth. (Can we call her a MTBer? Or since she is road world champ maybe she is a roadie?)


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I did catch a glimpse of her hopping the barriers! She's a bad ass!

I was trying to refute a post in a thread last year that claimed that World Cup courses have been so easy that roadies dominate them. I said I don't recall a "roadie" winning a MTB world cup and then the reply was PFP just did and she's a roadie.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

She was a mountain biker first.

It is funny how short peoples memories are. 2012 she was riding at the front of the Houfalize world cup with Julie and Catharine before a crash took her out. I think she didn't get a lot of attention on the circuit because she was in the shadow of Julie.



ewarnerusa said:


> I did catch a glimpse of her hopping the barriers! She's a bad ass!
> 
> I was trying to refute a post in a thread last year that claimed that World Cup courses have been so easy that roadies dominate them. I said I don't recall a "roadie" winning a MTB world cup and then the reply was PFP just did and she's a roadie.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

ewarnerusa said:


> I was trying to refute a post in a thread last year that claimed that World Cup courses have been so easy that roadies dominate them. I said I don't recall a "roadie" winning a MTB world cup and then the reply was PFP just did and she's a roadie.


That is an argument you will never win. Mountain biking is a bazar sport that way, the only one I know of where people are convinced they are better then pros.

I think it comes from back in the 90s there were some pros who were fairly terrible technically but could go up hill like a rocket. Some think the sport is still like that.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Yeah, I sort of had to reply "touché" to that since she is obviously an elite roadie! But I pointed out that she races elite CX and MTB and road, so she's basically just a young phenom finding her way.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I remember Adam Craig tweeting or blogging about her a couple years back when they were both on Rabobank. Like Vos, a talent on any kind of bike.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Are there any WC teams using both wheel sizes next season?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

My only guess would be Scott. Although im not sire if they have any one on 29er. Scott 3rox run both forsure.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> Are there any WC teams using both wheel sizes next season?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Luna.

Two is so much easier then the three wheel sizes they were using last year.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

ewarnerusa said:


> Julien Absalon broke his collar bone in a cyclocross race crash last week. Let's hope it doesn't impact his MTB season!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That crash is crazy. He's riding along nicely and then the front wheel washes out instantly with no warning. It didn't look like he could do much about that at all.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

He touched the front brakes. Hell, even thinking about touching the front brakes in conditions like that could make it wash out.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

The racer in him got up and wanted to get going...you could see the moment he knew something was wrong.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

LMN said:


> He should be fine. The first world cup isn't until May, which is a long time away.
> 
> Speaking of MTBer racing CX. Anybody see the video of PFP bunny hopping the barrier at a race last weekend. Super smooth. (Can we call her a MTBer? Or since she is road world champ maybe she is a roadie?)


More barrier hopping badassness from PFP at Diegem this weekend!

Must Watch: Diegem Superprestige Women's Race Highlight Video - Bunnyhopping, Crashes, and a Three-Way Battle - Cyclocross Magazine - Cyclocross News, Races, Bikes, Photos, Videos



> Must watch video: We'll admit that we thought Prevot was leaving the dismount a bit late: http://t.co/v7fKqfMWbi pic.twitter.com/AS9sV3eswD
> 
> - Cyclocross Magazine (@cyclocross) December 28, 2014


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Bart Brentjens at the Dutch Headwind Championships:


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## rallymaniac (Oct 12, 2011)

Maja Wlosczowska posted on her FB profile that she finally inked a 2 year deal with Kross Racing Team of Poland:
KROSS RACING TEAM | Kross - Mountain bikes, city bikes, touristic bikes

No concrete info yet and the team press conference is planned on early February where the details of the planned races will be released.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

rallymaniac said:


> Maja Wlosczowska posted on her FB profile that she finally inked a 2 year deal with Kross Racing Team of Poland:
> KROSS RACING TEAM | Kross - Mountain bikes, city bikes, touristic bikes
> 
> No concrete info yet and the team press conference is planned on early February where the details of the planned races will be released.


At last, she deserves a pro team as one of the very top riders. Still sucks what happened to LIV Giant teams. I don't think much will change in her schedule tho, poland doesn't really have XC races, so she will do world cup, world champs, eu champs and maybe few other races to get some more points before olympics. Wouldn't mind to see her on some czech national cup series since it is cat 1 with easy points for her.

By the way, if you know about any other team transfers, let me know please, i like to have complete information - Team news - MTBCrossCountry


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

nya said:


> At last, she deserves a pro team as one of the very top riders. Still sucks what happened to LIV Giant teams. I don't think much will change in her schedule tho, poland doesn't really have XC races, so she will do world cup, world champs, eu champs and maybe few other races to get some more points before olympics. Wouldn't mind to see her on some czech national cup series since it is cat 1 with easy points for her.
> 
> By the way, if you know about any other team transfers, let me know please, i like to have complete information - Team news - MTBCrossCountry


Great site you have put together! And a big thanks for direct linking the 2014 series! way easier then going trough redbull.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

nya said:


> By the way, if you know about any other team transfers, let me know please, i like to have complete information - Team news - MTBCrossCountry


Anton Cooper is staying with Cannondale.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

from twitter - 
@marianne_vos and @FERRANDPREVOT announce they will start in all European MTB World Cup races this year.


women world cups might be more than interesting this year, looking forward to it


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

What happened to the LIV team for this year?


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Le Duke said:


> What happened to the LIV team for this year?


it is no more, giant said they do not have money for xc teams, so they canceled both giant xc team and liv team


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

Next year is going to be exciting on the Women's front for sure. 

Vos has such raw talent and the MTBing will certainly help her cx technical chops too. Prevot is amazing as well. Either one of them have a real possibility of winning a world championship in road, cx, and mtb during their career.


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## EBbiker (Mar 15, 2007)

I'm surprised that Mortiz Milatz hasn't found a team for 2015.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Le Duke said:


> What happened to the LIV team for this year?





nya said:


> it is no more, giant said they do not have money for xc teams, so they canceled both giant xc team and liv team


I was just wondering why Neff was posting pics riding dif brand of bikes.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

To be honest, I don't get that. The Liv team laid the wood to the XCO WC last year, and were far and away the most dominant team in any form of mountain bike racing. The Yeti enduro guys, the SC Syndicate, etc. didn't come even close to the dominance they displayed.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Considering Giant/Liv is one of the biggest bike manufacturers on the planet, it's not a good sign if they find that they aren't getting a return on their investment in a top level XCO race team.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Maybe it just costs too much to retain the services of Marcel Kittel.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

I think the demise of the Liv team is related to a couple of things. 

1. The Liv team was not a particularly well financed team. I think last year Maja was only rider making a half decent salary. They would have had to increase their budget significantly to match the salary that Neff is rumored to have signed for.

2. There isn't a need for the team. Vos and Pauline will be racing world cups under the Liv banner. There was no need for a second team.


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## rallymaniac (Oct 12, 2011)

how ironic, Liv-not


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm rather disappointed in Giant :-/

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## pulser (Dec 6, 2004)

Pauline Ferrand-Prevot picks up another world champ jersey. I really really want to see her race world cup XC this year. I think with the olympics coming up and Vos wanting to win gold she's going to be force to recon with this year.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I wonder if they (as a Giant/Liv sponsored athletes) will retain the services of Oscar Saiz.

Also, Simon Andreasson, the Junior XCO world champ, laid the wood to the Junior men today, picking up a second set of stripes.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

So, if PFP finds a way to win the XC World Championship, will she be the first ever to hold all three of the "big" disciplines (big IMO)? That would be incredible. I can't wait for the World Cup this year. 

Now if we can just get LMN to skype with us during the events


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

criscobike said:


> So, if PFP finds a way to win the XC World Championship, will she be the first ever to hold all three of the "big" disciplines (big IMO)?


Downhill, Enduro and Slopestyle?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

...on another topic...I saw the full highlights of the Santos Tour Down Under, and Dan McConnell was there with the big boys near the last climb of Willunga Hill...and he finished 26th overall!!! 

Is it just me, or does anyone else think this is a good result?


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> ...on another topic...I saw the full highlights of the Santos Tour Down Under, and Dan McConnell was there with the big boys near the last climb of Willunga Hill...and he finished 26th overall!!!
> 
> Is it just me, or does anyone else think this is a good result?


There's not much to learn about finishing 26th overall in a road race. It's a somewhat meaningless result other than to observe that he didn't get completely left for dead in a race in which the riders may have wildly different goals both in the race itself (going for GC, targeting stages, riding for their team mates, etc.) and in the overall context of their training and competitive calendars.


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## VICpt (Aug 10, 2012)

Hello, do you guys know what tires the pros use: 2.1,2.2,2.25?


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Did Neff leave Giant to join a home country team? Or did she leave because Giant dismantled? She left kinda early and the way the Stockli press release read it kinda sounded like they snatched her away from Giant...then maybe Giant got mad and decided to not do XCO lol.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

VICpt said:


> Hello, do you guys know what tires the pros use: 2.1,2.2,2.25?


1.9 to 2.2 typically.

Absalon rolls on 29x2.2 Continental Race Kings (they look like 2.2s anyways)
Schurter rolls on hand made Dugast tires 
Kulhavy has been seen with 1.95 Specialized Renegades, I've also seen a Fast Trak up front on his. 
Neff has been typically rolling on Racing Ralphs that look 2.0-2.2ish.


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## VICpt (Aug 10, 2012)

Thanks


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

zephxiii said:


> Did Neff leave Giant to join a home country team? Or did she leave because Giant dismantled? She left kinda early and the way the Stockli press release read it kinda sounded like they snatched her away from Giant...then maybe Giant got mad and decided to not do XCO lol.


Giant folded and Stocki payed a lot of money for her. Like a lot of money.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

UCI Team list for 2015 is out. Feel free to check it at Team list - MTBCrossCountry (or uci page obviously  ) . Quite a huge number of teams this year. And some road teams added their mtb section as well (raboliv, rusvelo..)


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Interesting, looks like Marco Fontana will be racing in the Strade Bianche World Tour road race this weekend. This is an awesome road race by the way, they incorporate many kilometers of dirt roads. Think he'll wear baggies? 
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ne...ntana-switches-to-the-road-for-strade-bianche








" Fontana switches from MTB to road for Strade Bianche

Mountain bike rider Marco Aurelio Fontana will ride Saturday's Strade Bianche race as part of an Italian national team.

He will switch his mountain bike for a road bike and take on the likes of Peter Sagan (Tinkoff-Saxo), Fabian Cancellara (Trek Factory Racing) and Zdenek Stybar (Etixx-QuickStep). Fontana rides for the Cannondale Factory Racing mountain bike team and won a bronze medal in the London 2012 Olympics despite losing his saddle in the finale of the race.

"The idea is a bit crazy but the location is spectacular. The competition is pretty tough and the route has steep climbs that will remain in the legs. The last 70 km will be decisive. I'm not used to riding such long distances, so I will try to spend as little as possible in the first half of the race," Fontana said.

The Italian national team will field a squad in several major Italian road races during the 2015 season as new national coach Davide Cassani works to strengthen the team and inspire riders to try different disciplines. Several endurance track riders have already competed in road races and under-23 riders will also be given a chance to race with elite professional riders. "


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

It seems to me that USA Cycling wants to make sure the come out of Colombia with a Rio 2016 spot...

USA Cycling names 2015 Pan Am Continental MTB Championships Team - USA Cycling

Last year, Ettinger won easily ar Brazil, but the year before, whoopings where handed out by Colombia...

Last time this event was held in Colombia, 2011, Hector Leonardo Paez came out on top...if anybody is interested in live commentary by me, feel free to ask!!!


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## AndySTi (Aug 19, 2009)

Giger's Colnago for this year.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I'm glad he got rid of the Kendas. Blah.

I wish more tire makers would go back to skin walls. Dugast tires just LOOK fast, and classy.

Also, I'd sell all of you into abject slavery for a custom built, lugged carbon Colnago MTB. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Wish the Maxxis Ardent 2.4 skinwall was exo and tubeless...


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

I know this isn't a World Cup question: does anyone know if the US Cup will be shown live again?


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I believe next Saturday.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

It'll be linked here

USA Cycling US Cup | Bonelli Park | UCI C1

USA Cycling US Cup | Fontana City National | UCI HC

USA Cycling US Cup Race 3 Bonelli Park | UCI HC

USA Cycling US Cup Race 4 Sea Otter Classic | UCI C3

USA Cycling US Cup Final Race Colorado Springs | UCI HC


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

rockyuphill said:


> It'll be linked here
> 
> USA Cycling US Cup | Bonelli Park | UCI C1
> 
> ...


Do you know what time the various races will start? Specifically pro women/pro men? I haven't been able to find anything on the site (or the web for that matter). Hoping that being pacific time Saturday it'll be a nice way to start NZ time Sunday! The TV link on the site says it's 1 day and 15min away currently, but that would make it an 8pm start...


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

It's a little weird...but I can't wait to watch the US Cup. I know that Emily Batty will be there again. Keegan Swenson for sure. Any other big names going?


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## plupp (Sep 19, 2011)

criscobike said:


> It's a little weird...but I can't wait to watch the US Cup. I know that Emily Batty will be there again. Keegan Swenson for sure. Any other big names going?


Fontana will be racing


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Looks like Giger's RD needs a little TLC.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

US Cup Bonelli Park races start at 11AM PDT on Saturday, apparently, according to Chloe Woodruff's Twitter feed. Although the lack of actual event schedule info on the website is an oversight of substantial proportion. That makes the timer on the Youtube feed seem a bit out to lunch.

US Cup TV | USA Cycling


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

We found it in the technical guide. But it turns out it's delayed coverage anyway (tweet from Scott Tedro).


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## PlanB (Nov 22, 2007)

Anyone having any luck watching? Their homepage is saying "the races have begun!" But the video is still counting down another 8 hrs till start... Not impressed so far...


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

PlanB said:


> Anyone having any luck watching? Their homepage is saying "the races have begun!" But the video is still counting down another 8 hrs till start... Not impressed so far...


Maybe it just isn't going to be live? Maybe a delayed program? It should be on now, but isn't. I hope this isn;t going to be a mega-fail on their part.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

WTH? 

From USA Cycling FB page: FYI, the US Cup at Bonelli Park will be taped delayed on our YouTube channel or at USCup.net at 7pm PST, both men's and women's elite.

They've really missed the point of covering a bike race. I can only assume that they couldn't get a a fast enough network uplink for live streaming for this race. Let's hope they all aren't delayed like this.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

XCKiwi said:


> We found it in the technical guide. But it turns out it's delayed coverage anyway (tweet from Scott Tedro).


Jeez, how hard would it be to put this on the actual website

Event Schedule
Friday, March 13, 2015
14h00	- 18h00:	Registration	/	Package	Pick-up (White Registration Tent	in	Team	Area)
14h30	- 18h00:	Course	Open	for Training	- Elite	Men,	Elite	Women
17h00	- 17h15:	Team	Managers'	Meeting (Same	Location	as	Registration)
Saturday, March 14, 2015
07h00	- 08h00:	Course	Open	for	Training
09h00:	Final	package	pickup	deadline	for	Elite	Women	XCO
11h00	- 11h15:	Elite	Women	XCO	- Staging	/	Call-up
11h15	- 13h15:	Elite	Women	XCO	Race
13h20	- 13h25:	Elite	Women	Podium	Ceremony
11h30:	Final	package	pickup	deadline	for	Elite	Men	XCO
13h30	- 13h45:	Elite	Men	XCO	- Staging	/	Call-up
13h45	- 15h45:	Elite	Men	XCO	Race
15h50	- 15h55:	Elite	Men	Podium	Ceremony


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

😡😡😡


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

rockyuphill said:


> Jeez, how hard would it be to put this on the actual website
> 
> Event Schedule
> Friday, March 13, 2015
> ...


ill try to keep at least my webpage updated - US Cup - Fontana + UCI Junior Series XCO - MTBCrossCountry


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## jacoborf (Jun 5, 2013)

Last Sunday Coloma vs. Absalon show at Montjuic, Barcelona. It is not a WC XCO race but UCI C2 class (warming up!). Salut!


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

I bet having the World Champion there raises the intensity for everyone. I bet it was awesome to witness!


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

jacoborf said:


> Last Sunday Coloma vs. Absalon show at Montjuic, Barcelona. It is not a WC XCO race but UCI C2 class (warming up!). Salut!


Did he win? I ask this as a serious question, not because I doubt his ability to win, but more because I am curious to see the approach taken by different racers to early season events in deciding to either race to win, or else only to put in a few efforts at selected times as part of their overall preparation.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

Looks like he recovered from the broken collarbone.


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## jacoborf (Jun 5, 2013)

Coloma won the Race. They were riding really hard together up to lap 3 when Coloma attacked him getting an important gap (around 20 seconds). After that, Absalon had a mechanical problem with the rear wheel and was 5th at 2 minutes from Coloma...


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## fugenxuae (Mar 24, 2015)

I am egarely waiting for that..


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## frank6262 (Oct 9, 2006)

1. you guys in Cal know that he (2 time Olympic Gold medalist!!) ....will be here in Bonelli Park this Sat right !? 

2. i was rewatching the 2012 Olympics London race.. what has become of Julie Bresset ?


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

1. Yeah? Who's that? 
2. Injury and slow come back.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

frank6262 said:


> 1. you guys in Cal know that he (2 time Olympic Gold medalist!!) ....will be here in Bonelli Park this Sat right !?
> 
> 2. i was rewatching the 2012 Olympics London race.. what has become of Julie Bresset ?


1. I have heard rumors of Julien being there but I would be surprised to see him. He has two young kids and BMC is not a sponsor of the race. I don't see him making the trip.

2. Winning creates a lot pressure. I think Julie was/is feeling that pressure. You win a couple world championships and an Olympic gold any think less than a win because a failure. Tough to race with that kind of pressure.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I was wondering if that poster had confused Julien's resume with Nino's. I'm definitely psyched that Nino is coming!


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

LMN said:


> 1. I have heard rumors of Julien being there but I would be surprised to see him. He has two young kids and BMC is not a sponsor of the race. I don't see him making the trip.
> 
> 2. Winning creates a lot pressure. I think Julie was/is feeling that pressure. You win a couple world championships and an Olympic gold any think less than a win because a failure. Tough to race with that kind of pressure.


How did LMN enjoy Bob stealing kisses from your wife (and the entire podium for that matter) at Bonelli?


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## cuzitsmyUSofwtvr (Apr 10, 2011)

Hey everyone,

There is a chance I may be in Germany for the world cup event in late may. I have not had much success with finding any information (particularly in english). Has anyone here been to the event that can make any recommendations on where to stay, where to eat, etc? It appears there is an amateur race this same weekend, has anyone participated in this?

Cheers
Spemcer


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The race in Albstadt? MTB-World-Cup-Albstadt / GONSO Classic - skyder.de (select English language at the top)

Tripadvisor would be a good place to start...

Albstadt Tourism and Travel: Best of Albstadt, Germany - TripAdvisor

A lot of the local crowds will likely take the train to get there, but the World Cup circus will take up a lot of local accommodation. Big centres like Stuttgart are about 2 hours away by train. You can check out train travel times here.

European rail, train tickets & passes | thetrainline europe



cuzitsmyUSofwtvr said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> There is a chance I may be in Germany for the world cup event in late may. I have not had much success with finding any information (particularly in english). Has anyone here been to the event that can make any recommendations on where to stay, where to eat, etc? It appears there is an amateur race this same weekend, has anyone participated in this?
> 
> ...


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## Purulento (Aug 27, 2009)

Not entirely related but we can already see the usual Nino and Absalon...


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

High speed, off camber, wet, roots. 
All hard tails too...

Ohh, some of the BMC micro travel bikes in there too.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

7 pages...we are at 7 pages and race one hasn't even occurred yet. How many pages will be hit when the series wraps up? 

We are FINALLY within "Get excited" time. Race one is coming up. Will Nino make it 4 for 4? Will Jaro finally be in good form? Will someone else finally step up to challenge the big guys?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

There 8 pages and 774 posts on the 2014 WC thread.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Hi.

My name is Alphajaguars, and I have a problem.

I have re-watched every race - Men's, Womens, XCE, XC, Downhill, that I can find on Red Bull TV. 

Like 4 times each. 

I need some new races!!!!!!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

It'll be interesting to see what the Elite women's field looks like now that the powerhouse Liv gang of Neff, Ferrand-Prevot and Włoszczowska are all on separate teams, and Batty is in very good form early giving Pendrel a run for her money in the US Cup races, but she often is and then fades, or stands still about 2-3 races in while everyone else catches up. Will Bresset make a splash again this year? Kalentieva and Gunn-Rita will likely be pushing hard for Olympic qualifying. Will the Chinese women riders be back again now that it is an Olympic quali year? Just a week away to see how the season is shaping up.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

I expect the women's race with be a battle between the world champions. Annika, Pauline, Jolanda, and Catharine are all current world champions and all are on good form. The winner is likely to be one of those four.

If I were to pick a winner by early season results it would be Annika. But with late start to the season being fast early isn't necessarily a good thing.


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## Loch (Apr 29, 2011)

Purulento said:


> Not entirely related but we can already see the usual Nino and Absalon...


These are great highlight videos ( I watched them all. Some of them more than once). Very well put together. Mud and carnage. Nino, Julien and the BMC boys battling it out. Neff looks like she's having fun. Did you put them together or just find them on Youtube?

Thanks for posting!


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

U23 Women's race of NMNM World Cup is over,
no surprises there I would say.

Jenny Rissveds
Margot Moschetti
Kate Courtney
Alessandra Keller
Perrine Clauzel
UCI World Cup XCO 1 Nove Mesto na Morave - Women Under 23 / World Cup - MTBCrossCountry

standings obviously the same

looking forward to tomorrow's races


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I hope this isn't a sign of the Red Bull season to come, where they don't bother to make the women's races available for replay. Judging by the finishing order it looks like it would have been a helluva a good race to watch. Gunn-Rita finishing 1 second behind Jolanda Neff to take second is amazing. 

All the early success of Emily Batty's in the US Cup races still left her back in 12th in the first World Cup race, with Catharine Pendrel finishing 2 minutes ahead in 4th place.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

The women's race was fast this year. Catharine's norm power was 15 watts higher then it was last year when she placed 2nd. It is the highest norm power she has had and not won the race.

The difference in Norm power between US cups is significant, almost 30 watts. Catharine was definitely a little frustrated after a couple of US cups. She felt the passive racing was not best preparation for anybody for the aggressive racing found at world cups.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

LMN, by passive racing you mean the US Cup races were run/won on the basis of winning at the slowest possible pace? Kinda like Monaco F1 races. There wan't much aggressive place changing in the Fontana and Bonelli Park races, there was a lot of line defending on the narrow bits and only a bit of attacking on the open road areas.

Gunn-Rita's result was impressive, she's almost exactly 20 years older than Neff.

It looks like Red Bull finally got the women's replay sorted out

Replay: UCI XCO World Cup 2015 - Nové Mesto na Moravě


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

I guess you all know the results already.

Both Men's and Women's race were exciting and fun to watch. Jolanda won on technical section, but props to Gunn-Rita, was a race of generations.

Great race from Catharine as well, tell her my grats LMN.

Men's race was exciting as well, all the titans were there ready. Glad Kulhavy is back in action, was getting boring last year with just 2 in contention for everything and Florian and others are getting stronger as well. Watching those guys climb the hard climbs is insane, they have so much power and they dont even seem to be at their max.

Results :UCI World Cup XCO 1 Nove Mesto na Morave / World Cup - MTBCrossCountry

Pictures will be ready bit later


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Neff is such a beast and good rider. She will be tough to beat for many years I bet. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

That was an awesome duel. Not to nit-pick the otherwise pretty good coverage but right after Kulhavy launches a major attack they cut to Absalon riding alone in 3rd with nobody else within a minute of him- wtf?

Does anyone else ever wonder if maybe some of best riders might also have the best doctors? Kulhavy was almost looking a little _too_ composed throughout that race.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

J.B. Weld said:


> That was an awesome duel. Not to nit-pick the otherwise pretty good coverage but right after Kulhavy launches a major attack they cut to Absalon riding alone in 3rd with nobody else within a minute of him- wtf?
> 
> Does anyone else ever wonder if maybe some of best riders might also have the best doctors? Kulhavy was almost looking a little _too_ composed throughout that race.


Uh, watch the last 10-15km of the Giro's mountain stages (today being a great example), note the 5 or more dudes in aqua, and everyone else without teammates.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Gunn-Rita was 12s back when the A & B lines merged again after bobbling on that root...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Both Gunn-Rita and Jolanda were completely spent when they crossed that finish line, Gunn-Rita actually bumped the TV camera with her head as she leaned up against that fence. If that is what this season will look like, it's gonna be a lot of fun to watch.


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## pulser (Dec 6, 2004)

I can't wait for the next few races. I want to see Pauline Ferrand-Prevot come back in to form, and then add Marianne Vos to the mix. I think its going to be one of the best seasons to watch. And on the men's side its so cool to see Kulhavy back on top. I really hope he can stay on form it will be allot of fun to watch a possible 3 or 4 way battle for the top.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Just got done watching both races.

WOW!!!!!

For GRD to still be pushing it that hard after almost 20 years is simply amazing!

Watching Kulhavey crack Nino on that last big climb was awesome! 

Can't wait for next week!


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## kupoo (Sep 12, 2014)

Nina was blocking him on that climb but Kulhavy just forced himself through... Nino had nothing left to respond, such amazing display of raw power.

Hopefully this season there will be more than 2 riders fighting for top spot, love to see such battles.


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## PierreV.E. (Mar 18, 2012)

Nice race, and boy, does Kulhavy have watts. 

Still that saddle... I thought he did it for climbing, but he's mostly out of the saddle on climbs. I feel like sliding forward all the time if i put my saddle down too much.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

J.B. Weld said:


> That was an awesome duel. Not to nit-pick the otherwise pretty good coverage but right after Kulhavy launches a major attack they cut to Absalon riding alone in 3rd with nobody else within a minute of him- wtf?
> 
> Does anyone else ever wonder if maybe some of best riders might also have the best doctors? Kulhavy was almost looking a little _too_ composed throughout that race.


Totally thought the same. It looked effortless for him.


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## tommyrod74 (Jul 3, 2002)

machine4321 said:


> Totally thought the same. It looked effortless for him.


It's a sad commentary on our sport that any impressive performance triggers immediate suspicion of doping.

The gap from Schurter back to Absalon was a big one as well. Does this mean Schurter was juiced too, just not as well?

Or maybe, just maybe, do these guys have different fitness levels early in the season?

People outside of cycling do a good enough job of tearing it down; maybe we, as cyclists, shouldn't help them if we can help it.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I would be devastated if these guys were caught doping. I want to believe that they are all clean. Sometimes I wonder though. You can say it never crosses your mind?


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## tommyrod74 (Jul 3, 2002)

machine4321 said:


> I would be devastated if these guys were caught doping. I want to believe that they are all clean. Sometimes I wonder though. You can say it never crosses your mind?


I can say it's not my first conclusion when I see a strong finish by the reigning Olympic champion.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

Well, also the fact the best doctors, nutritionist, physio, masseuse, coaches, etc. will make a difference, even if the field is 100% clean.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

machine4321 said:


> I would be devastated if these guys were caught doping. I want to believe that they are all clean. Sometimes I wonder though. You can say it never crosses your mind?


Unfortunately it does cross everybody's mind. We have all been burned too many times, by both road and mountain bikers.

But the suspicion of doping purely because someone is fast isn't right. The people at the top of the sport have a lot going for them; training, tactics, metal strength, and incredible genetics. They are fast for a reason.

I know that on the women's side you can win world cups and world championships clean. Does this mean that women's racing is complete clean, no it doesn't. There probably is women racing who are dirty. But if there are clean riders are beating them.

On the men's side I have to take peoples word. But I am pretty sure Geoff Kabush is clean and at his peak he could podium at world cup. If he can win clean then why can't others.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Im not crying dopper just cause he was fast. I was excited to see him back on form. I agree completly that a good support team makes a huge difference.

I guess I question his "on and off " performances. I know hes had some bad luck last two years but is it normal to come back that strong all while putting focus on marathon racing? Im honestly asking as I dont know.

I guess with my lack of experience its still hard for me to imagine the human body is capable of performing to that level, so out of my disbelief, my head goes there.

The reason I like watching the womens racing is that I havent felt that any of them were red flags. Neff is uoung and a crazy skilled tech rider.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

If wee look back bit on history, we can found 2 or 3 races that Kulhavy beat Nino just in the exact same way, a powerful attack on the last lap, and Nino could not respond. Also, I could factor in that the race is in his home country, just about 60km away from his home, if what they said is true. That can give any rider a big boost!!!

As for the rest of the field, we never saw them. A few shots here and there of Absalon a Vogel, and maybe less of the chasing bunch. In my opinion, bad coverage of the rest of the field!!!

Women's race was awesome!!! To see that battle, a 22yr old Neff taken to her limits by a 42yr old GRD is completely amazing!!!


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## tommyrod74 (Jul 3, 2002)

machine4321 said:


> I guess with my lack of experience its still hard for me to imagine the human body is capable of performing to that level, so out of my disbelief, my head goes there.


And for those of us who have raced pro/elite, or even high-level amateur, it's very believable that there are others that fast.

The world is a big pond, and there are some impressively big fish lurking in it.

I choose to believe the best of others in our sport unless given good reason to do otherwise. As I said earlier, plenty of people outside cycling - who have no problem cheering for 275 lb football players who can run a 4.5 second 40 meter dash and have a 40" vertical leap, mind you - are quick to call all of our best racers dopers and cheats. I just hate to see us do the same to our own for no good reason.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

If you look at the way Julie Bresset came back after she was off for an extended time with an injury, it's likely a good comparison with Kulhavy. The strict recovery and training regimen after an injury is likely much more rigorous than training in a healthy period, as there'd be more oversight and management of the return to condition. And maybe when the body is recovery and repair mode, it is actually capable of higher performance.

The big question is whether he is just out ahead of everyone else right now because he had a home race, and everyone else is planning on hitting their stride a bit later, or can he carry that level of output through the season.

BTW, where was Julie Bresset, she was conspicuously absent.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

tommyrod74 said:


> And for those of us who have raced pro/elite, or even high-level amateur, it's very believable that there are others that fast.
> 
> The world is a big pond, and there are some impressively big fish lurking in it.
> 
> I choose to believe the best of others in our sport unless given good reason to do otherwise. As I said earlier, plenty of people outside cycling - who have no problem cheering for 275 lb football players who can run a 4.5 second 40 meter dash and have a 40" vertical leap, mind you - are quick to call all of our best racers dopers and cheats. I just hate to see us do the same to our own for no good reason.


Point taken. I ride with an elite and the gap from me to him is nuts. Then to think that there is a handful in the country that can gap him by a good margin, then to think on a world level he might be lucky to not get pulled. Its hard to imagine for me but I know they are out there.

I also forget that this is their job. And they dont have to balance a 40h work week.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

tommyrod74 said:


> I choose to believe the best of others in our sport unless given good reason to do otherwise.


That's my general nature as well, unfortunately many pro athletes have come to feel that they do have good reason to do otherwise ($$$). I'd bet the farm that most pro NFL players are juiced. I think it was nearly 20 years ago when I was emphatically holding on to the notion that pro road cyclists were honorable and clean, even when some friends in the inner circles were telling me otherwise. It was a heartbreaker when I finally accepted the truth.

I think (hope) the saving grace for mountain bike racing is the fact that there's not a whole lot of money involved in it.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Did anybody noticed Hermida's bike? Him, on a full suspension? And it looks like a prototype...


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## bananajoe (May 15, 2015)

rockyuphill said:


> BTW, where was Julie Bresset, she was conspicuously absent.


She announced on her facebook page that she cannot train because of a viral infection and needs to rest.



carlostruco said:


> Did anybody noticed Hermida's bike? Him, on a full suspension? And it looks like a prototype...


Some images of his bike here. According to the article, Merida will officially present the bike at Albstadt next weekend.

And even though i'm swiss, i liked the attack of Kulhavy  Looking forward to the next world cups!


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Having finally managed to watch the men's race I thought it was a good race to watch. It made a change from 2014 where you could predict that the winner of any race would be one of two riders.

I thought it was notable how many times Nino Schurter was failing to clear the steepest rocky climb at Nove Mesto. He normally makes everything look easy but with all those dabs both Jaroslav Kulhavy and Julien Absalon had far less trouble up there. You could see from the footage that it was quite wet and slippery in the forest so maybe he wasn't quite hooked up tyre wise? He didn't seem to have any real advantage descending either, which is usually his strength.

Stephane Tempier's Shimano Di2 electronic gears malfunction on the first lap was excruciating! I was looking at the bike, with the seatpost removed and the mechanic looking lost as to what to do whilst the other 150 riders in the field passed him. I was wondering what was going on. Then I saw that the bike had an electronic gear indicator on the bars and realised why the seatpost was out as the battery would be inside the seat tube. He eventually got going but by that time had been lapped by the leaders. Ouch.

Did you hear the commentators comments about Julien Absalon? Maybe he's eating pasta again, having put some weight back on again from last year. He doesn't seem to have the visible veins in his arms that he did in 2014. When you've won everything it must be hard to stay as motivated. I reckon that black shorts with the white world champions jersey looks better than Nino Schurter's white jersey and white shorts from last year. I thought the white/ black colour scheme on the bike looked great too.

There was a telling comment part way through the race. Remember that new BMC Teamelite soft tail bike launched with great fanfare a few weeks ago? It has 15mm of rear travel from an elastomer in the frame.

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/old-is-new-bmc-teamelite-01-introduces-micro-travel-technology.html

Apparently Julien Absalon did one lap on it at Nove Mesto in practice. He then spent the rest of the weekend on his full suspension BMC Fourstroke FS01 instead.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

Great to start the season, finally after 8 pages of anticipation!

During the ladies first lap, Neff was off with a big gap. Then the commentators said technical problems with the feed and it only seemed like we missed a minute at most. Then suddenly Gunn Rita was with Neff with a big gap on 3rd. Any idea what happened? Did Neff bobble or wait? Did Gunn Rita just burn a bright match and close the gap? Very cool seeing the veteran and the young gun throwing down with a big gap on the chasers. 

Nice duel in the men's race, too. Great to see Jaro back at the pointy end. It seemed like Nino could stretch the elastic on every tough climb and I was expecting the opposite attack on the last lap. But Jaro made room to pass even though Nino was doing a good job of closing the door. Jaro seems to know how to read Nino and when he can throw down the one attack that matters, just like Beijing Olympics!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

machine4321 said:


> Totally thought the same. It looked effortless for him.


Compared to the Marathon World Champs, it may have been effortless.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

machine4321 said:


> Point taken. I ride with an elite and the gap from me to him is nuts. Then to think that there is a handful in the country that can gap him by a good margin, then to think on a world level he might be lucky to not get pulled.


Yep. The people getting pulled are quite likely national champions in their own right.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

NordieBoy said:


> Compared to the Marathon World Champs, it may have been effortless.


Let's be honest:

The majority of the field that lines up for the Marathon World Championship would get pulled in a WC XCO race. Different horses on different courses, except at the pointy end.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Le Duke said:


> Let's be honest:
> 
> The majority of the field that lines up for the Marathon World Championship would get pulled in a WC XCO race. Different horses on different courses, except at the pointy end.


Thats my thoughts aswell. He posted a pic of his garmin on facebook, avg HR of 165 and max of 185. Avg power at 364w. I dont know power numbers but that HR seems like he was just cruising along lol. But I know every one is different.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Sweet! His average and max HR are the same as I aim for. 
Power means nothing, right?


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

machine4321 said:


> Thats my thoughts aswell. He posted a pic of his garmin on facebook, avg HR of 165 and max of 185. Avg power at 364w. I dont know power numbers but that HR seems like he was just cruising along lol. But I know every one is different.


If that was actually average power, not normalized power, that's a lot of watts for XCO. Essentially it means his power for any parts of the course where he was pedaling with any urgency was probably noticeably higher the 364 average. I'm not entirely surprised if that's the case, since he a bigger guy (for XCO) who is somewhere in the top group of fitness even for world cup types.

HR is probably deceptive too. Even with a few nasty rock gardens, a top pro who is comfortable with the descents (they get to session them in practice, and in previous years, not to mention they are just good bike handlers) is probably going to settle down and recover quite a bit in terms of their effort during those spots, so that their HR won't be pinned for the entire duration of the race.

For people with lesser fitness, their HR may stay up even for a while even after cresting a tough climb, but for pros like this their HR can come back down quite quickly after efforts ease off, which is one of the hallmarks of their superior fitness. I think I recall someone posting up workout data from Nino last year that, showing how he could get his HR over 180 on hill reps and then be back down to around 110 in just the time it took him to turn around and coast back down to the bottom. That's a really quick response compared to a "normal" person, and probably brings their average HR down quite a bit even though they are drilling the climbs, compared to the normal rider's HR which would stay higher for longer, and yield average HR for the whole event which might be a higher % of their max.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

364 for a marathon? Thats what your average Grand Tour roadie will do on a stage...for 21 days...

364 for 4 hours is a huge engine...XC? Dont know much...


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> 364 for a marathon? Thats what your average Grand Tour roadie will do on a stage...for 21 days...
> 
> 364 for 4 hours is a huge engine...XC? Dont know much...


No one on the road is averaging 364 for a complete stage day after day for 3 weeks. Not even close.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

https://www.facebook.com/jardakulha...9215767466292/819401361447726/?type=1&theater

I wasnt clear, but it was numbers from his marathon race.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Circlip said:


> No one on the road is averaging 364 for a complete stage day after day for 3 weeks. Not even close.


I could be mistaken, but check this one out...may not day after day, but its still impresive...

http://home.trainingpeaks.com/blog/article/michael-rogers-stage-11-giro-victory-by-the-numbers


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> I could be mistaken, but check this one out...may not day after day, but its still impresive...
> 
> Power Analysis: Michael Rogers Stage 11 Giro Victory | TrainingPeaks


That is an unreal ride with amazing numbers (I remember seeing the data before) but if you look closely you'll see that even in a massive effort like this his average for the 6 hours of the stage was "only" 256w. It isn't the average that made the numbers so impressive though, as it was the efforts detailed in the blog, especially within the context of the complete stage and complete Giro. Jaro's 364w average from marathon worlds, albeit for a shorter 4 hours and only for a one day even rather than in the midst of a 3 week GT, are pretty impressive too.

Bottom line is simply that these guys put out a lot of watts!


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Circlip said:


> That is an unreal ride with amazing numbers (I remember seeing the data before) but if you look closely you'll see that even in a massive effort like this his average for the 6 hours of the stage was "only" 256w. It isn't the average that made the numbers so impressive though, as it was the efforts detailed in the blog, especially within the context of the complete stage and complete Giro. Jaro's 364w average from marathon worlds, albeit for a shorter 4 hours and only for a one day even rather than in the midst of a 3 week GT, are pretty impressive too.
> 
> Bottom line is simply that these guys put out a lot of watts!


Indeed...


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## Derkson91 (Aug 14, 2013)

Jaro is an interesting guy and after watching him for a number of years now he appears to be the kind of guy that really needs to be motivated to win a race. But when he is motivated to the highest level he is unbeatable. He seems to set one big goal for himself every year. He commented on his FB page that his big goal this year was to win the Novo Mesto World Cup race. Last year it was the marathon world champs. If I were to bet on one guy for one big race it would be him. He seems to win the races that are his 'big goal'. Olympics, Cape Epic, Marathon World, Novo Mesto WC. NS & JA will alway be near the front but Jaro is a guy I would bet on if he has the motivation. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if he didn't win another WC race this year and kind of crusies along the rest of the season then get super motivated for next years Olympic Race in Rio....that could very well have the same result as we saw in London. He also might just be the best XC racer of all time. I know JA has 30+ WC wins but Jaro has a very impressive diverse win resume - Olympic Gold, WC Champ in 2011, XC World's Gold in 2011, Two Cape Epic wins, Marathon World's Gold, JA & NS don't nearly all of those.....

I love to watch all three of these guys race but I won't be surprised one bit if Jaro doesn't cross the finish line first again until the Olympics.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

women's race - pics: XCO World Cup #1 ? Nove Mesto, Elite Damen: Das Duell der Generationen in der Fotostory - MTB-News.de


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

WR304 said:


> Did you hear the commentators comments about Julien Absalon? Maybe he's eating pasta again, having put some weight back on again from last year. He doesn't seem to have the visible veins in his arms that he did in 2014.


I don't know if is it a factor, I would be strongly surprised if it isn't - but remember Absalon became a father for a second time last year. First year - second kid, usually takes a huge toll, even if you are completely committed.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Goran_injo said:


> I don't know if is it a factor, I would be strongly surprised if it isn't - but remember Absalon became a father for a second time last year. First year - second kid, usually takes a huge toll, even if you are completely committed.


There was a recent interview with Julien Absalon that machine4321 linked. The section regarding 2015 gives some insights. Apparently he didn't have a great early season build up with some allergy issues. The tone of the interview seemed quite introspective too with his upcoming retirement after the 2016 Olympics on the horizon :

-------------------

http://www.bmc-switzerland.com/int-...o/absolutely_absalon_undeniably_the_greatest/

_*Q:* We are now at the beginning of the 2015 season, your penultimate?

*JA:* Surely.

*Q:* What are your goals for this new season?

*JA:* It is a pre-Olympic season and we are all already thinking about Rio. I would like to get to the same level as last year and win as much: a few World Cups and the French, European and World Championships as well. My preparation did not go as well as I wanted due to some allergies but the international season starts later which is good for me. But from now on, we'll have to stay as fresh as possible as there is no break during the season.

*Q:* The World Cup kicks off this weekend in Nove Mesto na Morave, an event you did not win until now.

*JA:* I love training there, the course is so much fun, but it is true that results were always below my expectations there. I like the course but it doesn't suit my strengths very well. I enjoy training in Albstadt way less but the course suits me with its long and steep climbs. So I bank more on Albstadt!

*Q:* It would then be your 30th World Cup victory&#8230;

*JA:* Maybe, I am too sure exactly&#8230; 30 is not the goal.

*Q:* Knowing that you're in your penultimate season, does it give you more or less pressure?

*JA:* A bit of both actually. Sometimes I think that there are only two seasons left and that I should win as many races as possible. And sometimes I think I have nothing to prove anymore and that I'd better enjoy my last two seasons and last Olympics. But all in all, my long experience makes everything a bit easier and relaxed. Rio 2016 will be my fourth Olympics so I clearly know how to tackle it._

--------------

In other words he's a nailed on certainty to win at Albstadt this weekend.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Bikerumor have quite a detailed look at Jaroslav Kulhavy's Nove Mesto S-Works Epic race bike:

https://www.bikerumor.com/2015/05/2...c-pro-bike-check-kulavy-wins-on-s-works-epic/










He has a 130mm length stem at a -21 degree angle and a -15 degree downwards saddle angle for a low position. Apparently he actually adjusted the saddle to point down more for this season than in the past.

In this article they confirm that the extra hard foam between the saddle body and rails (as seen on his Cape Epic bike also) is there to act as a bumper, stopping the saddle flexing too much.

For Nove Mesto he had Specialized Fast Trak tyres front and rear but they come in a pro only soft tyre compound for added grip over the retail tyres.

The entire bike was weighed at 10.31kg/ 22.91lbs. He's running SRAM XX1 with a single ring up front (no electronics or added batteries) even so his bike seems to be getting heavier each year!


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## team_wee (Mar 26, 2006)

looks like he's riding a 24" wheel bike!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Wonder what the saddle to bar drop is?


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

NordieBoy said:


> Wonder what the saddle to bar drop is?


It's probably not as extreme as it appears because of the saddle tilt he runs. Also, looking at the picture it appears he's sitting on the nose of the saddle while pedaling, which is way lower because of the saddle tilt. Whatever the case, it worked for him on this day.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Here's the big image from the article, it doesn't look like that big a drop at all. It does look like he could use a frame with an extra inch or two of HTT. Although even that is compounded by the angle of the seat tube.


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

Pretty incredible racing in the women's and men's. I'd love to see the course in the flesh to see just how hard they are riding. Jaro & Nino just smacked the hell out of each other!

Also, a little off topic, but anyone taking any notice of Spencer Plaxon's Kona.
It's managed to sneak under the radar being not one of the 'major' manufacturers, but I'm very interested!


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> Here's the big image from the article, it doesn't look like that big a drop at all. It does look like he could use a frame with an extra inch or two of HTT. Although even that is compounded by the angle of the seat tube.


That picture isn't a true side on view of the bike.

Here's a side on picture of Jaroslav Kulhavy's 2015 Cape Epic S-Works Epic bike. I'd say he has plenty of saddle bar drop there!










He uses a size large frame.

Jaroslav Kulhavy Critical Measurements:

Rider's height: 1.87m (6ft 2in)
Rider's weight: 76kg (167lb)
Saddle height from BB, c-t: 788mm
Saddle setback: 100mm
Saddle to bar drop: 140mm (measured from highest point of saddle)
Seat tube length (c-t): 470mm
Head tube length: 120mm
Top tube length (effective): 620mm
Weight: 11.5kg (25.3lb), as pictured

https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/...ulhavys-specialized-s-works-epic-wc-29-43850/


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Commonaeros said:


> Pretty incredible racing in the women's and men's. I'd love to see the course in the flesh to see just how hard they are riding. Jaro & Nino just smacked the hell out of each other!
> 
> Also, a little off topic, but anyone taking any notice of Spencer Plaxon's Kona.
> It's managed to sneak under the radar being not one of the 'major' manufacturers, but I'm very interested!


There are a couple of pictures of Spencer Paxson's Kona from Nove Mesto here. You can't really see much detail of the rear suspension though:

http://cog.konaworld.com/spencer-paxson-channels-mick-jagger-at-world-cup-cross-country-opener/

There were some pictures of the new Trek Top Fuel and Trek "domane" isospeed hardtail frames at Nove Mesto too. The article says that, as with the BMC "soft tail" frame, the riders mostly ended up using full suspension bikes at Nove Mesto, instead of the "soft tail" bikes.

http://www.bikerumor.com/2015/05/27...op-fuel-and-isospeed-hardtail-mountain-bikes/


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

Circlip said:


> That is an unreal ride with amazing numbers (I remember seeing the data before) but if you look closely you'll see that even in a massive effort like this his average for the 6 hours of the stage was "only" 256w. It isn't the average that made the numbers so impressive though, as it was the efforts detailed in the blog, especially within the context of the complete stage and complete Giro. Jaro's 364w average from marathon worlds, albeit for a shorter 4 hours and only for a one day even rather than in the midst of a 3 week GT, are pretty impressive too.
> 
> Bottom line is simply that these guys put out a lot of watts!


There is absolutely no way he averaged 364W for 4 hours in a MTB race. Someone in the Facebook comments said to include zeroes, and I think he nailed it.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Out of all those things, the one that really raises a flag is the 100mm setback on the saddle (that's just crazy, I wonder why he doesn't run an XL frame?), followed by 140mm of bar drop. But then it looks like about 75-80mm of height difference between the nose and rear of the saddle, so that's maybe 100mm of bar drop from the middle of the saddle which is not as unusual. He's won some races, so it obviously works for him, but definitely not a poster child for conventional bike fit theory. 



WR304 said:


> Saddle height from BB, c-t: 788mm
> Saddle setback: 100mm
> Saddle to bar drop: 140mm (measured from highest point of saddle)
> Seat tube length (c-t): 470mm
> ...


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

bloodninja said:


> There is absolutely no way he averaged 364W for 4 hours in a MTB race. Someone in the Facebook comments said to include zeroes, and I think he nailed it.


I'd believe it. The main thing to remember is that bigger heavier riders put out big power and top professionals put out a lot more power than even good amateur riders. Jaroslav Kulhavy is one of the best in the world. In the Nove Mesto commentary Bart Brentjens was saying how Jaroslav Kulhavy mostly trains by himself, he then added as an aside that he wouldn't want to train with Jaroslav Kulhavy because it would be so brutal trying to keep up. I agree!

There's quite a nice youtube highlights video of the 2014 UCI World Marathon Championships at Pietermaritzburg. Jaroslav Kulhavy did the 95km/ 59 mile course in 4 hours 15 minutes, an average speed of 13.9mph. That included a ton of climbing and also some portage sections where they had to run off the bike. In general however the course looks like it was mostly dirt road and smooth singletrack. If you watch the video you can see that the race course was nothing like a recent World Cup course (short and twisty). It looks to be a long loop course where you could get on with working at constant high effort on the long open straights. On that particular course I can see how it would be possible to average 364 watts for the full race distance.

Official 2014 UCI World Marathon Champs 52min High Video:






*Edit:* I got the wrong Marathon race. That 364 watt average power number is from Jaroslav Kulhavy's 2015 European Marathon Championships win, not his 2014 World Marathon Championships win. I'll see if I can find a video or course map of that race. *I suspect it will be a similar type of course, or quicker as he averaged 29km/h 18mph for the race distance!* For that sort of average speed it has to have been mostly fireroad.

https://www.facebook.com/jardakulha...9215767466292/819401361447726/?type=1&theater


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> Out of all those things, the one that really raises a flag is the 100mm setback on the saddle (that's just crazy, I wonder why he doesn't run an XL frame?), followed by 140mm of bar drop. But then it looks like about 75-80mm of height difference between the nose and rear of the saddle, so that's maybe 100mm of bar drop from the middle of the saddle which is not as unusual. He's won some races, so it obviously works for him, but definitely not a poster child for conventional bike fit theory.


In previous years I've seen the reason given for his frame size choice as being that the XL Epic frame has a much taller head tube.

The 2015 size Large Epic World Cup frame has a 120mm length head tube whilst the size XL Epic World Cup frame has a 140mm length head tube. He already has his -21 degree downwards pointing stem slammed, along with the upper headset cover removed on the size large frame to get low enough. With a taller head tube on the larger frame he wouldn't be able to get the front end as low as required.

Specialized Bicycle Components

In the video I linked of the 2014 Marathon World Championships in the post above there are some sections where the camera motorbike is driving directly alongside Jaroslav Kulhavy whilst he pedals the bike seated. In that video he's sitting right on the nose of the downwards pointing saddle. By sitting that far forwards it reduces the saddle handlebar drop quite a bit and he's also further forwards over the bottom bracket. The bike looks more extreme than his actual riding position I think.


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

WR304 said:


> There are a couple of pictures of Spencer Paxson's Kona from Nove Mesto here. You can't really see much detail of the rear suspension though:
> 
> THE KONA COG | Spencer Paxson channels Mick Jagger at World Cup cross country opener | Kona COG
> 
> ...


All the new tech excites me greatly. The cycling industry moves at such a phenomenal pace, there's never a dull moment!

The Kona bikes are of particular interest due to my current ride and potential upgrades!


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

A gallery from the NMNM world cup race by Jiri Svoboda - UCI World Cup XCO 1 Nove Mesto na Morave / World Cup - MTBCrossCountry


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## stillhardtailing (Apr 17, 2007)

Seems like she had a great last couple of laps. Too bad her start wasn't a little better. Definitely a fast race with the two leaders pushing each other the whole way. Respectable 3rd keeps her in the hunt.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

bloodninja said:


> There is absolutely no way he averaged 364W for 4 hours in a MTB race. Someone in the Facebook comments said to include zeroes, and I think he nailed it.


Are you questioning whether Kulhavy is physically capable of putting out 364w for 4 hours?

Or instead doubting whether that can be possible on MTB course because of the lower wattages on descents? (i.e. maybe his data is set to drop periods coasting with zero wattage as you suggest)

I'm not sure about the former, but based on his posted weight of 76kg, that's about 4.8w/kg. Can someone like Kulhavy sustain that for 4 hours at a one day event? Kind of uncharted territory for any of us in terms of personal knowledge, no? Seems like a lot but maybe not impossible?

If it's the latter, then I would need to understand more about the course. Euro marathon layouts are mostly fireroad from my understanding. With him putting out a bit more than 364w on climbs, and then having very fast fireroad descents not taking up much clock time at zero or low wattage, are you sure that can't come out to 364w average? I just don't know...


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

Circlip said:


> Are you questioning whether Kulhavy is physically capable of putting out 364w for 4 hours?
> 
> Or instead doubting whether that can be possible on MTB course because of the lower wattages on descents? (i.e. maybe his data is set to drop periods coasting with zero wattage as you suggest)
> 
> ...


I think it's highly, highly unlikely that he could physically do 364 watts for 4 hours. His FTP would need to be about the same as Wiggins, if you figure holding a .85 IF steady for 4 hours...which is optimistic.

364 average for a 4 hour MTB race, there's just no way. I've looked at tons of pro road race power files and never saw anything approaching that kind of average wattage.

I'm guessing it's either NP or he excluded zeroes.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

*sighs* I do miss XCE as I thought it was cool watching them race in an all out sprint of craziness even though sometimes the course was lame. 



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## OLx6 (Feb 5, 2011)

zephxiii said:


> *sighs* I do miss XCE as I thought it was cool watching them race in an all out sprint of craziness even though sometimes the course was lame.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


I will second that statement. The eliminator is unpredictable and fun to watch. Kind of like MotoGP on mountain bikes.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

bloodninja said:


> I think it's highly, highly unlikely that he could physically do 364 watts for 4 hours. His FTP would need to be about the same as Wiggins, if you figure holding a .85 IF steady for 4 hours...which is optimistic.
> 
> 364 average for a 4 hour MTB race, there's just no way. I've looked at tons of pro road race power files and never saw anything approaching that kind of average wattage.
> 
> I'm guessing it's either NP or he excluded zeroes.


One of the guys I coach is 75kg has an FTP north of 400 watts, can out descend Nino and he still got pulled at Novamesto. The front of the field at a WC is crazy fast, all of them can do at least 6.0 for an hour. Kulhavy probably has an FTP somewhere around 450 watts. Every single guy who races in the top 10 at WC could to switch to road and be very good.

I don't coach any elite guys who race with a power meter. Catharine does races with a power meter. Normally her average power for a WC is about 4.0. It is very course specific, the highest average power I have seen from her around 4.5. Normally the top women are 0.5 to 1.0 off the top men. 364watts is in the range of what I would expect a rider of Kulhavy's size would have to do to win marathon worlds.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Nino did switch to road last year and given his inexperience and how things play out in road races i think he represented MTB well. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

LMN said:


> One of the guys I coach is 75kg has an FTP north of 400 watts, can out descend Nino and he still got pulled at Novamesto. The front of the field at a WC is crazy fast, all of them can do at least 6.0 for an hour. Kulhavy probably has an FTP somewhere around 450 watts. Every single guy who races in the top 10 at WC could to switch to road and be very good.
> 
> I don't coach any elite guys who race with a power meter. Catharine does races with a power meter. Normally her average power for a WC is about 4.0. It is very course specific, the highest average power I have seen from her around 4.5. Normally the top women are 0.5 to 1.0 off the top men. 364watts is in the range of what I would expect a rider of Kulhavy's size would have to do to win marathon worlds.


I concur. I know how long I can push 4.8w/kg (certainly not 4 hours but...), and I'm just Joe Schmoe, so extrapolating that to a rider of Kulhavy's caliber and I actually think 4.8w/kg for 4 hours for him sounds pretty doable if he has flattish terrain or a hill to push against for the majority of that time.

Power files for pro roadies aren't comparable. They don't do 4 hour time trials, and the entire premise is to find wheels and conserve energy until the right points within a race. I'll bet a Tony Martin or Fabian Cancellara type is completely capable of 400w for 4 hours also if that was the goal. Wiggins is listed as being 7kg lighter than Kulhavy. Even if his w/kg is less than Wiggins, doesn't seem a stretch that he could have a similar absolute power output.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Circlip said:


> I concur. I know how long I can push 4.8w/kg (certainly not 4 hours but...), and I'm just Joe Schmoe, so extrapolating that to a rider of Kulhavy's caliber and I actually think 4.8w/kg for 4 hours for him sounds pretty doable if he has flattish terrain or a hill to push against for the majority of that time.
> 
> Power files for pro roadies aren't comparable. They don't do 4 hour time trials, and the entire premise is to find wheels and conserve energy until the right points within a race. I'll bet a Tony Martin or Fabian Cancellara type is completely capable of 400w for 4 hours also if that was the goal. Wiggins is listed as being 7kg lighter than Kulhavy. Even if his w/kg is less than Wiggins, doesn't seem a stretch that he could have a similar absolute power output.


I found a few Strava files from the 2015 European Marathon Championships, along with a description of how the race played out.

The 2015 European Marathon Championships wasn't a four hour race. Roel Paulissen, who finished 12th, had a race time of 3 hours 27 minutes for 61.7 miles at an average speed of 17.8mph. According to Strava he weighs 66kg (using the w/kg power curve) and averaged 286 watts for the race. 4.27w/kg for the full race. It sounds like he was in a chasing group so could have been drafting for some of it.

You can also see the race elevation profile from his strava file. It's up and down but there aren't any long extended descents.

https://www.strava.com/activities/302908594/overview

Jaroslav Kulhavy, who won, is 10kg heavier and averaged 18mph. He would have done it in a time around 3 hours 25 minutes. The shorter the race the higher the power output can reasonably be. According to this description Jaroslav Kulhavy attacked early on and with one other rider basically soloed the entire race as a time trial effort.

_"Jaroslav Kulhavy and Sabine Spitz crowned themselves to the new European marathon champions. In Singen, Germany, the Olympic Champion took gold in front of surprising Sascha Weber and Alban Lakata, while Sabine Spitz on a sunny day in the Hegau area defeated Swiss ladies Jolanda Neff and Esther Süss.

Not a lot of experts expected this kind of scenario in the 98 kilometer men's race. The bunch was not more than twelve kilometers under way, when Jaroslav Kulhavy (Specialized Racing) put the hammer down. In a muddy single trail, the Czech took the lead and some seconds. His country mate Kristian Hynek (Topeak-Ergon) followed him and also, surprisingly Germany's cyclo cross and road specialist Sascha Weber (Orbea-smp).

This trio was able to leave the chasers behind, the gap grew up to 1:30 minutes within 15 kilometers.

At the end of the first 49 kilometer lap, Hynek got problems with his pedal. The European champion from 2012 stopped and tried to fix the problem, but he could not. Then he changed the pedal in the Tech Zone and the medal got out of reach.

Meanwhile Kulhavy was hammering the flat sections with the highest gear, Sascha Weber on his wheel. They extended their gap up to 3:15 minutes and stayed together until one kilometer to go.

"Jaroslav was riding the flat sections like a motor cycle, it was unbelievable. The last 15 kilometers I started to get cramps and one kilometer to the finish, he left me behind", Weber explained. "I am really happy. I came here good prepared, but totally relaxed and now I have the silver medal."

Weber is 27 years old, but as a young guy he did mountainbike races as well and in the last few years also marathon races.

Jaroslav Kulhavy was smiling. "It was the last championships title, I still missed. Really happy about that."

The 30 years old is the first biker in history who could win the worlds and the Europeans in marathon as well as in cross country, plus the Olympic gold medal and the world cup overall.

*"I felt really strong and I was confident on my strength on the flat sections. When we lost Kristian, it was a bit harder for me, because I had no one to help me in the lead. Sascha was not able to", Kulhavy explained.*

Out of the chasing group Alban Lakata attacked with eight kilometer to go. He got away and took the bronze medal. "It was difficult for us, because Robert (Mennen) and me, we could not chase the leaders because our team mate Kristian was there. Maybe we should have done it earlier. I was worrying, that I missed this attack, because I had really strong legs today", the Austrian told after crossing the finish line 2:06 minutes back.

Robert Mennen came into fourth, six seconds behind."_

http://uec.ch/en/component/k2/item/...thon-european-championships-full-results.html


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Commonaeros said:


> All the new tech excites me greatly. The cycling industry moves at such a phenomenal pace, there's never a dull moment!
> 
> The Kona bikes are of particular interest due to my current ride and potential upgrades!


There are some details about Jolanda Neff's Stockli Beryll RSC hardtail here. Stockli is a Swiss brand. You see high profile riders using them but they don't seem to have widespread availability.

https://www.bikerumor.com/2015/05/2...ke-check-neff-wins-on-new-stockli-beryll-rsc/

There are some pictures of the carbon wrapped and tied spokes on her bike. As with tied and soldered spokes it stiffens the wheel up and if you break a spoke should keep the wheel straighter. Using carbon is supposed to be lighter than the traditional tie and solder approach. This looks easy enough to do at home if you wanted.










There are some pictures of Nino Schurter's Scott Spark from Nove Mesto here:

https://www.bikerumor.com/2015/05/2...ything-electronic-then-wires-your-money-away/

The Scott Spark 700 Ultimate Di2 with Fox iCD electronic shocks at the start of the article is the bike he should be using. It has an electronic lockout lever for rapid suspension adjustment (as used by Julien Absalon, Dan McConnel etc). Nino Schurter is sponsored by DT Swiss so he uses DT Swiss suspension instead.


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

WR304 said:


> I found a few Strava files from the 2015 European Marathon Championships, along with a description of how the race played out.
> 
> The 2015 European Marathon Championships wasn't a four hour race. Roel Paulissen, who finished 12th, had a race time of 3 hours 27 minutes for 61.7 miles at an average speed of 17.8mph. According to Strava he weighs 66kg (using the w/kg power curve) and averaged 286 watts for the race. 4.27w/kg for the full race. It sounds like he was in a chasing group so could have been drafting for some of it.


(76/66)*(18/17.8)*286 = 333.

Between this and LMN's post, I'll admit I could be wrong and it's not as impossible as it seemed at first to me. I was just thinking about raw numbers, ignoring the fact that he's at least 15% more massive than the average pro.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Commonaeros said:


> Pretty incredible racing in the women's and men's. I'd love to see the course in the flesh to see just how hard they are riding. Jaro & Nino just smacked the hell out of each other!
> 
> Also, a little off topic, but anyone taking any notice of Spencer Plaxon's Kona.
> It's managed to sneak under the radar being not one of the 'major' manufacturers, but I'm very interested!


This Kona? This picture was taken on March 29th at the American Continental Champs in Cota, Colombia.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Also, I am seeing more and more pros use PM on their bikes. McConnell and Fumic are some examples. Sho-Air guys use SRM in their bikes...

Maybe in the near future we will see power profiles for races like we have seen from roadies...


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

Strava just posted this Power analysis from the Tour of California, if you are interested in some power numbers from the road...
The Power it Takes to Ride Tour of California | Strava


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

I was looking at the schedule for this weekend. E-bike race? For real?


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

carlostruco said:


> This Kona? This picture was taken on March 29th at the American Continental Champs in Cota, Colombia.
> 
> View attachment 992095


That looks like the one! Thanks dude..


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## danishmtbkid (May 29, 2015)

LMN said:


> One of the guys I coach is 75kg has an FTP north of 400 watts, can out descend Nino and he still got pulled at Novamesto. The front of the field at a WC is crazy fast, all of them can do at least 6.0 for an hour. Kulhavy probably has an FTP somewhere around 450 watts. Every single guy who races in the top 10 at WC could to switch to road and be very good.
> 
> I don't coach any elite guys who race with a power meter. Catharine does races with a power meter. Normally her average power for a WC is about 4.0. It is very course specific, the highest average power I have seen from her around 4.5. Normally the top women are 0.5 to 1.0 off the top men. 364watts is in the range of what I would expect a rider of Kulhavy's size would have to do to win marathon worlds.


Out of curiousity. Who do you coach who can out-descend Nino?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

danishmtbkid said:


> Out of curiousity. Who do you coach who can out-descend Nino?


Evan Guthrie. He did an EWS last year on a borrowed bike after his went missing in transit. With minimal practice he was battling for position with like Steve Pete, Greg Minar and Nichos V. Guys with a lot DH world championships.

Out descending Nino may have been an exaggeration but if Nino is quicker it is not by much.


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

I'm interested in the tech side at Albstadt. Will Julien ride his new BMC soft tail or stick with the full suspension? What about Nino, Spark or Scale? Dan, will he be on the new Domane inspired Trek hardtail?


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

Albstadt seems to be much smoother than last week, the climbs are a bit longer and steeper too.
It seems efficiency and weight will be the answer.


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## danishmtbkid (May 29, 2015)

Stonerider said:


> I'm interested in the tech side at Albstadt. Will Julien ride his new BMC soft tail or stick with the full suspension? What about Nino, Spark or Scale? Dan, will he be on the new Domane inspired Trek hardtail?


He's riding his softtail. More riders should opt for hardtails in Albstadt as the need for extra traction isn't as important as in Nove Mesto, where Absalon, Schurter and Kulhavy might've had a big advantage on Florian Vogel on that part.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

At least Jaro doesn't have to make a decision on which bike to ride...


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## Ed J (Dec 4, 2013)

I noticed Plaxon's Kona looks an awful lot like the KTM Scarp, have a look:


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

WR304 said:


> There was a telling comment part way through the race. Remember that new BMC Teamelite soft tail bike launched with great fanfare a few weeks ago? It has 15mm of rear travel from an elastomer in the frame.
> 
> Old is New: BMC Teamelite 01 introduces Micro Travel Technology - Pinkbike
> 
> Apparently Julien Absalon did one lap on it at Nove Mesto in practice. He then spent the rest of the weekend on his full suspension BMC Fourstroke FS01 instead.


Uh...That IS telling. I wonder if the BMC managers were annoyed at all. I mean THIS was their big "breakthrough" design right?


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

criscobike said:


> Uh...That IS telling. I wonder if the BMC managers were annoyed at all. I mean THIS was their big "breakthrough" design right?


Horses for courses; not a course for a HT, by all accounts. 15mm or "pure" HT, it gives up a lot to an FS in certain terrain.

If you see him on the FS the entire year, well, that might be more telling.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

According to his Facebook page he is riding the soft tail tomorrow. We will see!


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Albstadt the land steep climbs and no grip.

This week riders busted out the hardtails, put on smaller chain rings and desperately search for a tire that works. As one riders said "even the gravel has no grip"

Tech: the only people racing duallies will be those he didn't bring a hardtail. Climbs are too steep and the descents can ridden on equal speed on either. Interestingly Batty appears to be racing on a 27.5 hardtail (this is why she is running Maxxis tires, her official tire sponsor doesn't do 27.5 XC tires)

Picks:
Men: The course suits Absalon but I am not sure he has the form, I don't think he thinks he has the form. I suspect it will be another Kulhavy vs Nino battle with maybe Vogel making a run at it.

Women: Last week Gunrita looked to be the strongest rider in the race. She is really good at managing her efforts long steep climbs. But I think the danger ride PFP, she was off a bit last week but I think this course really suits her. Joland of course will be a factor but I think this weekend is going to be harder then last. If Catharine can get off the line half descent this week she will give everybody a run for the money. But if she spots them 20 positions again, she will not make the lead group.


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

Love your insight LMN!
It's great to have someone on the ground and with the thoughts of one of the best in your mind!

Interesting comparison between the KTM & Kona. Still can't find out much about the Kona..


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

For the 4 + 4 top placings combined men + women, you nailed 7 of 8 (only PFP DNF kept you from a shot at all 8). That success rate in picks will be tough to match again, but would be highly entertained to see you give it a shot. 

Thanks for the nice insider's pre-race report and predictions.



LMN said:


> Picks:
> Men: The course suits Absalon but I am not sure he has the form, I don't think he thinks he has the form. I suspect it will be another Kulhavy vs Nino battle with maybe Vogel making a run at it.
> 
> Women: Last week Gunrita looked to be the strongest rider in the race. She is really good at managing her efforts long steep climbs. But I think the danger ride PFP, she was off a bit last week but I think this course really suits her. Joland of course will be a factor but I think this weekend is going to be harder then last. If Catharine can get off the line half descent this week she will give everybody a run for the money. But if she spots them 20 positions again, she will not make the lead group.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Men's results promise great season imo, if those 3 + Vogel will keep fighting hard, it will be really hard to judge the world cup winner.

I hope though that in women's field Jolanda will not dominate as much as she has so far. Bad news about PFP and her sore back. Home Catharine or some others (Maja is my favorite) will give Jolanda hard times!

Results and Standings after Albstadt - UCI World Cup XCO 2 Albstadt / World Cup - MTBCrossCountry


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Looked like Nino went down hard! Hope it's nothing more than trail rash.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Dammit Nino, almost had it!

Pic of his dirt rash:

https://www.facebook.com/NinoSchurt...99210888909/10153362203923910/?type=1&theater


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Must be Absalon's birthday today.


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

You take the risk, you fall. Nothing to do with birthdays.


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

I'm certain Nino could have railed that turn if he'd been on a 29er.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Here are the Red Bull links to the Albstadt race replays. They're actually on the front page for once.

Albstadt 2015 Men's Race
Cross Country Men | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Albstadt, Germany | Red Bull TV

Albstadt 2105 Women's Race
Cross Country Women | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Albstadt, Germany | Red Bull TV

Not Mountain Biking but June 7 is scheduled as the Red Bull Hare Scramble at Erzbergrodeo. That was awesome last year so is one to watch when it's available.

The toughest single day off-road race in the world | Red Bull Hare Scramble at Erzbergrodeo 2015 | Red Bull TV

In the women's race at Albstadt there was some negative racing going on for the first lap. Everyone was marking Pauline Ferrand Prevot expecting her to set the pace, not knowing that she had back problems and was about to quit the race. That slowing down saw the lead riders regrouping and spread out across the road over the start finish line. No one seemed to want to keep the speed high, wiping out their efforts to make up time on the first lap.

Catharine Pendrel had made a bad start and was still a way back at this point. She wasn't quite with the lead group. In this screenshot you can see the timings at the beginning of lap 2:










Immediately after this screen shot you see Catharine Pendrel get onto the back of this group, you know she's hard charging and isn't going to mess around following wheels. She goes straight to the front, makes up 10 places, puts the hammer down and - boom - part way up the hill what had been a big group has splintered until it's just her and Gunn Rita Dahle disappearing off into the distance.

I thought this shot from later in the race was quite an interesting one. Catharine Pendrel and Gunn Rita Dahle are both on the steepest part of the climb. Catharine Pendrel is sitting a long forwards on the saddle whilst Gunn Rita Dahle has stayed sitting towards the back of the saddle. Neither is right or wrong just contrasting styles.










Another thing were the gloves that Jolanda Neff was wearing. For mountain biking nowadays long finger gloves are what most people seem to use but for this race she was in short finger gloves. She seemed to have a badly fitting World Cup leaders jersey for this race, you can see it bagging around her shoulders instead of being a skin tight fit. Jolanda Neff was using a double chainring at the front also, which seemed to be working as she was keeping a fairly high cadence on the climbs.










In the men's race I thought Nino Schurter looked clearly stronger than Julien Absalon fitness wise. Nino Schurter was covering Julien Absalon's attacks on the climbs easily and you could tell he was comfortable throughout the race.

Nino Schurter really threw it away with that crash though. Although his ankle looked sore immediately after the finish he seemed to be walking ok by the time of the podium ceremony.

The big question for me is what has happened to Dan McConnell. He was good in 2013 (winning the Albstadt World Cup and 2nd overall in the World Cup series, had some decent results in 2014 but seems to be slipping backwards again this year. He was 11th at 4 minutes 17 seconds in Nove Mesto and 11th at 3 minute 34 seconds in Albstadt also.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

They had a good shot of that happening later in the race when they were starting the last lap around 1:39:00 in the replay with Maja leading Irina and Emily down the finish line straight and they wouldn't go take a pull, they just sat in behind her as she weaved back and forth, you could see her swearing quietly and shaking her head. That was a tactic Emily was using in the US Cup races against the Luna team threesome.



WR304 said:


> In the women's race at Albstadt there was some negative racing going on for the first lap. Everyone was marking Pauline Ferrand Prevot expecting her to set the pace, not knowing that she had back problems and was about to quit the race. That slowing down saw the lead riders regrouping and spread out across the road over the start finish line. No one seemed to want to keep the speed high, wiping out their efforts on the first lap.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Goran_injo said:


> You take the risk, you fall. Nothing to do with birthdays.


It is pretty risky to imagine yourself on top of the podium before you cross the finish line. Julian rode a good race but Schurter was stronger and on the home stretch Absalon was clearly riding for second place until Nino started dreaming of kisses & flowers.


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

I don't think Schurter was stronger. 
If he was, he would have left Absalon during 7 laps at any stage, and he couldn't and seemed content hanging on to the wheel.

He won races before on the decent, he lost this one on the descent.
Sometimes taking risks pays off, yesterday it didn't.


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## jet9rdopilot (Nov 10, 2012)

Going to the 2015 World Mountain Bike Championships and would like recommendations on places to stay in Andorra around the Bike Park in Vallnord. Condo or apartment for 50's couple for the week. Do they offer bus service to the site, like some other Worlds have offered? Have looked at TripAdvisor, but do not know how reliable the reviews are. Also, fly into Toulouse, FRA or Barcelona, Spain from the states. United Airlines employee.

Last time in Europe went to the Livigno ITA Worlds. in 2006.

Thank


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Some Lap time statistics from the World Cup in Albstadt 
UCI World Cup XCO 2 Albstadt / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry

Some facts, 
U23 winners had one of the fastest lap times even in Elite category.
Absalon's last lap was one of the fastest laps of all.
Women U23 lap times are by far the least consistent.
Dahle was 2nd fastest and 5th most consistent woman.

Let me know if you are interested in more statistics, more will come with next rounds. Kind of interesting to see imo.


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## jkirkpatri (Sep 16, 2008)

^ I find this stuff pretty interesting, keep it coming for future events!


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

LOVE the stats. Definitely keep it coming - there's no such thing as too much data.

The women's race was fascinating. Couldn't help but think if Catharine had been with the chasing bunch coming through for the start of lap 2 things could have worked out differently. 

Great summary WR304 - good to get confirmation that Jolanda was on a double chainring - I couldn't see how she could maintain such high leg speed on the steepest of climbs running a 30. I know her power to weight is incredibly high, but...

Between LMN, nya and WR304 it's great to have so much additional insight to the races, both before and after.


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## PlanB (Nov 22, 2007)

For sure (on the stats.) No detail is too geeky for me. I'm especially enjoying the tech pieces Pinkbike has been running around the World Cup.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Goran_injo said:


> I don't think Schurter was stronger.
> If he was, he would have left Absalon during 7 laps at any stage, and he couldn't and seemed content hanging on to the wheel.
> 
> He won races before on the decent, he lost this one on the descent.
> Sometimes taking risks pays off, yesterday it didn't.


What I try and look for is the body language and positioning of the rider. There are some give away signs that indicate how they're feeling.

If you watch Jaroslav Kulhavy over the first few laps at Albstadt, where he was trying to stay with the leaders, you can see from his bike positioning he was struggling at that point. This sequence of screenshots is the section where it became clear that Jaroslav Kulhavy wasn't going to be in contention at Albstadt.

The first picture shows how far behind he would be from choice riding in a group. On the climbs and flat sections this distance of 1 wheel length, or less, is his normal positioning. This isn't going to change if he can help it. If he's feeling strong you would expect him to be able to close any gap that opens immediately early on in the race.










At Albstadt he was gapped slightly on the steepest part of the climb. A gap of perhaps one or two bike lengths opens between Jaroslav Kulhavy and the other three.










That small gap isn't an issue in itself but it's over the top, where the gradient flattens off, that the warning signs begin. He's still one or two bike lengths behind. See the gaps between the three riders ahead and then the larger gap to Jaroslav Kulhavy.










A few seconds later after the short descent and flat section and he still hasn't closed the gap. This early in the race he would never spend such a long time with that over one bike length gap unless he was near his limits.










Contrast that with Nino Schurter on the same section of course on the final lap. Julien Absalon is pushing hard to try and break him on the climbs. Any time the smallest gap opens Nino Schurter can close it easily straight away. If you watch the section at 1h 37min 33 seconds in the replay there is a short rise that they both sprint up. A very small gap between them opens but Nino Schurter in second place is quicker, instead of opening the gap further he's practically touching Julien Absalon's back wheel by the top, a sign of strength.










It looked to me like Nino Schurter was riding to a game plan, letting Julien Absalon wear himself out with attacks and saving energy for the end of the race. The time he went past Julien Absalon on the steepest section of the climb, just after Julien Absalon had attacked, was a message that he was feeling good.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

WR304 said:


> Contrast that with Nino Schurter on the same section of course on the final lap. Julien Absalon is pushing hard to try and break him on the climbs. Any time the smallest gap opens Nino Schurter can close it easily straight away. If you watch the section at 1h 37min 33 seconds in the replay there is a short rise that they both sprint up. A very small gap between them opens but Nino Schurter in second place is quicker, instead of opening the gap further he's practically touching Julien Absalon's back wheel by the top, a sign of strength.
> 
> It looked to me like Nino Schurter was riding to a game plan, letting Julien Absalon wear himself out with attacks and saving energy for the end of the race. The time he went past Julien Absalon on the steepest section of the climb, just after Julien Absalon had attacked, was a message that he was feeling good.


Great summary^ :thumbsup:

I wouldn't go so far as saying he cracked but I do think Absalon was somewhat resigned to a 2nd place finish after the last climb, if he would have had an answer he never would have allowed that gap on the downhill.


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## OLx6 (Feb 5, 2011)

I agree with WR304 on the body language that Nino looked strong. Why didn't he pass sooner to create a bigger gap before the descent? Remember a few years back when Absalon had the lead and did an endo on the last lap at La Bresse? He still won because his gap was large enough.

Also anyone catch Absalon looking over at Nino on the ground after the finish? It looked to me like he wanted to wish him well but thought better of it. I like that these two fierce competitors have respect for each other.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

WR304 said:


> What I try and look for is the body language and positioning of the rider. There are some give away signs that indicate how they're feeling.
> 
> If you watch Jaroslav Kulhavy over the first few laps at Albstadt, where he was trying to stay with the leaders, you can see from his bike positioning he was struggling at that point. This sequence of screenshots is the section where it became clear that Jaroslav Kulhavy wasn't going to be in contention at Albstadt.
> 
> ...


I agree, Schurter was looking great and riding smart, he just blew it in that one corner.

I watched the race live on the way down to the 2nd DINO Race.

It was fairly clear to me that Kulhavy was not gonna be a contender for the top spot judging by how he was trailing behind the lead group. Then he fell back etc.

I thought "good job" when Schurter let Absalon by to lead for a while just so he can tuck in behind his wheel and ride along, that is ideal.

Schurter had the entire race under control IMO until he f'ed up that one corner in the end... Just like Sam Hill did in 2008 lol.

He was prob too excited and too hot instead of being careful. He didn't need the risk, he had it.

Oh well.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Nino has a couple of race tactics. 
1. Go out hard and force everyone to chase all day. He just about always tries this. 
2. Do most of the race in a group and then win with a last lap move.
3. Attack into every descent and force people to burn themselves out chasing on each climb.

Julien has one race tactic: Go as fast as possible for the whole race and hope to break everyone with raw pace. When he is on form this works, but even a little bit off form he is vulnerable.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Keep that stats flowing...short, sweet, simple!!!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The stats are cool, the UCI live timing website and even the UCI Results part of the web site have a link to Analysis that showed lap times for the current season, but they have either dropped it or hidden it so well you can't find it any more for older races.

That link to Analysis is available on the World Cup results pages, like so

Mountain Bike - UCI Mountain Bike World Cup presented by Shimano


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Julien said in an interview post race his preparation for did not went as he would have liked. 

And Nino, in one of his many videos in what looked like an oxygen capacity test or whatever it is called, said that it was his highest result ever....

The two of them are in a league of their own...


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Love the nerd stuff… I'm just that kind of guy, so thanks!


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Pinkbike have an article about some of the race bikes from Albstadt.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/albstadt-xc-pit-walk-bike-checks-and-crazy-tech.html

This prototype BH hardtail looks good.










In the Pinkbike photos they have a picture of a Lauf Trail Racer 29 fork but without saying who it belonged to. Did it actually get used in any of the World Cup races?

https://www.laufforks.com/lauf-trail-racer/


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## kupoo (Sep 12, 2014)

Stats are nice.

Maybe include TOP15 or TOP20 isntead of only 10 riders? To see broader results is always nice.


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## Purulento (Aug 27, 2009)

Florian Vogel shared nya's race stats on his FB page...very nice


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

kupoo said:


> Stats are nice.
> 
> Maybe include TOP15 or TOP20 isntead of only 10 riders? To see broader results is always nice.


increased the number of stuff shown, will make it look better for next world cup


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Ok...somebody explain this to me...

I was watching the race and noticed that in the call-up to the start line, the riders were positioned out of the traditional order. For example, Jaro, being ranked #1, did was not placed at the middel of the line, and instead, started at the far corner. And now, looking at pics on Pinkbike, you can see our own info-insider's wife being given the option to choose her own starting position. 

Whats up with this? Did the UCI change this? I have never seen this before...


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

carlostruco said:


> Ok...somebody explain this to me...
> 
> Whats up with this? Did the UCI change this? I have never seen this before...


The front row always gets to pick their position on the line. #1 has first choice, so on.

Jaro, picked the outside.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Ok. Its the first time I have seen this...


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

There's even a pic of it: 
in Albstadt, Germany - photo by ikeizer - Pinkbike


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## onlycrimson (Nov 11, 2008)

It was easy to tell Kulhavy wasn't going to be able to keep up just by his standing and hammering some sections to try to keep up with the leaders. Nino was strong and absalon looked to settle for 2nd, but obviously perked up once Nino was down.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

It seems like the US women might actually have a bit of a battle amongst themselves for Olympic qualifying this time around.

Lea Davison in 9th, Erin Huck in 23rd, Georgia Gould in 26th, Chloe Woodruff in 27th at Albstadt.

Lea Davison in 8th, Georgia Gould in 19th, Chloe Woodruff in 24th, Erin Huck in 25th after 2 rounds.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

How many spots will they be fighting for?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

That depends on how many UCI points they get as a country. Maximun is 3 spots, but my guess is that in London they only had 2 spots. Or maybe 1...


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> That depends on how many UCI points they get as a country. Maximun is 3 spots, but my guess is that in London they only had 2 spots. Or maybe 1...


I could be wrong, but I seem to recall that they have a smaller field for the women's XCO (40 starters versus 60 for men, or something like that?) so that the max per country for women is only 2, compared to 3 max for the men, depending on their UCI points as you describe above.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

JoelGuelph said:


> How many spots will they be fighting for?


you can check here Olympic games - Qualification points - MTBCrossCountry there is link to quali. rules as well because beside the uci points there is a rule for each continent except europe that allows the best of the continent to go as well


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> It seems like the US women might actually have a bit of a battle amongst themselves for Olympic qualifying this time around.
> 
> Lea Davison in 9th, Erin Huck in 23rd, Georgia Gould in 26th, Chloe Woodruff in 27th at Albstadt.
> 
> Lea Davison in 8th, Georgia Gould in 19th, Chloe Woodruff in 24th, Erin Huck in 25th after 2 rounds.


To make it even more interesting, where does Kate Courtney fit in? Her lap times were faster then every other than Lea in Albstadt.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

LMN said:


> To make it even more interesting, where does Kate Courtney fit in? Her lap times were faster then every other than Lea in Albstadt.


she is 59 in UCI ranking so far (Kate Courtney - MTBCrossCountry), but i fshe continues doing well in world cups, it will climb up really fast imo


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

So, do the federations pick to fill the quota or is based solely on UCI ranking?

Why are the team relay points listed, for women only, I didn't see that mentioned on the linked PDF?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Riders collect points on behalf of the country, but riders are not the ones who qualify...countries are. Riders get picked by their federations. Imagine the chaos the Swiss federation has on their hands after Nino and Neff...


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

JoelGuelph said:


> So, do the federations pick to fill the quota or is based solely on UCI ranking?
> 
> Why are the team relay points listed, for women only, I didn't see that mentioned on the linked PDF?


I think UCI reseted the men's points for this reason and forgot to reset women. But I dunno why they reseted. Anyway the relay points will be added once world/continental championships will happen, dont think it matters now. If they reset the women's or "un-reset" the mens, ill update it as well.

federations pick to fill the point based quota, the continental quota is filled by UCI afaik


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

LMN said:


> To make it even more interesting, where does Kate Courtney fit in? Her lap times were faster then every other than Lea in Albstadt.


That's a damn good question.

Unless she races up, they can't directly compare her to the others, at least at WC-level races.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

carlostruco said:


> Riders collect points on behalf of the country, but riders are not the ones who qualify...countries are. Riders get picked by their federations. Imagine the chaos the Swiss federation has on their hands after Nino and Neff...


Flo Vogel is doing a damn good job of putting his name firmly in the #2 slot. I'd imagine that the Swiss, Italians, and French will lock down three spots easily. Maybe zee Germans, too.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Ren Chengyuan and China are down in 28th, out of Olympic qualifying, I'm surprised we aren't already seeing another gonzo run by Team China at the World Cup races like they've done since 2007.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

Goran_injo said:


> I don't think Schurter was stronger.
> If he was, he would have left Absalon during 7 laps at any stage, and he couldn't and seemed content hanging on to the wheel.
> 
> He won races before on the decent, he lost this one on the descent.
> Sometimes taking risks pays off, yesterday it didn't.


What I saw was Absalon repeatedly trying and failing to drop Schurter, and Schurter waiting until the last part of the final climb to make his move, which he did convincingly. It was a good strategy and they were both extremely strong, but Nino clearly had the edge and control. He would have won the race but for his mistake on the flat gravel turn. This was probably a combination of bad luck and likely distraction/drop in focus.

Note: I don't believe Nino was "taking risks" when he crashed, at least not intentionally. He had already finished the descent and was on a flat turn towards the finish, just trying to hammer into the flat. He simply biffed it.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Le Duke said:


> Flo Vogel is doing a damn good job of putting his name firmly in the #2 slot. I'd imagine that the Swiss, Italians, and French will lock down three spots easily. Maybe zee Germans, too.


Yeah, Vogel looks super strong now. He did compete in London 2012. He led the race in the begining.

I know for sure USA and Canada are in. Colombia and Costa Rica got their spots at this years American Continental Champs. Mexico got in on the women side...and of course, Brazil is in...


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

nya said:


> I think UCI reseted the men's points for this reason and forgot to reset women. But I dunno why they reseted. Anyway the relay points will be added once world/continental championships will happen, dont think it matters now. If they reset the women's or "un-reset" the mens, ill update it as well.
> 
> federations pick to fill the point based quota, the continental quota is filled by UCI afaik


So UCI did indeed reset women as well, they just didn't update their website so it shows the old Olympic qualification points. I updated mine to reflect the points reset.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

To be honest, I'm surprised that some of the Swiss guys haven't done what Kenyan distance runners were doing about a decade ago. A bunch of them basically sold out to the highest bidders (Qatar, IIRC) and raced in the Olympics, WCs, Diamond League, etc for them.

Most prominent example of this being Saif Saaeed Shaheen, the 3000m steeplechase world record holder and multiple time world champion.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Also worth noting:

AFAIK, Scott-Odlo is the only team running 27.5 on the men's side these days. The BH guys have gone 29, and Fabian Giger's custom Colnago is rolling on 52mm Dugast 29er tires as well. 

Even more women on 29ers this year, too, from what I can tell. Neff, Gunn Rita, Maja, Irina, Helen Grobert, Lea, and Esther Suss all rolling on the big wheels. I'm sure the Liv girls will be on 27.5, though.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

Le Duke said:


> To be honest, I'm surprised that some of the Swiss guys haven't done what Kenyan distance runners were doing about a decade ago. A bunch of them basically sold out to the highest bidders (Qatar, IIRC) and raced in the Olympics, WCs, Diamond League, etc for them.
> 
> Most prominent example of this being Saif Saaeed Shaheen, the 3000m steeplechase world record holder and multiple time world champion.


Switzerland, probably the richest country in the world. I don't think the Suisse riders have the economical need to sell themselves (and they are too proud of being Suisse). As an American (or are you British) would you start for a different country?


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Le Duke said:


> That's a damn good question.
> 
> Unless she races up, they can't directly compare her to the others, at least at WC-level races.


I heard, I think in the commentary during the women's race, something about U23 racing up in elite to qualify for the Olympics. He might have been referring to something country specific.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Le Duke said:


> To be honest, I'm surprised that some of the Swiss guys haven't done what Kenyan distance runners were doing about a decade ago. A bunch of them basically sold out to the highest bidders (Qatar, IIRC) and raced in the Olympics, WCs, Diamond League, etc for them.
> 
> Most prominent example of this being Saif Saaeed Shaheen, the 3000m steeplechase world record holder and multiple time world champion.


The rules for the Olympics are different, but if they tried to do this they would be screwing themselves out of the chance to race world champs for a couple of years. A new rule effective 1 Jan this year requires that any rider who changes nationality stand down from world champs for that year and the following calendar year. The previous rule did not require the stand down to occur post-change, only that it occurred. My gf has spent the last 2 years racing non-UCI events so her stand down would be completed by the time she got her NZ passport (last month). We found out on Christmas Day about the rule change and now it's 2017 at the earliest she can race world champs. Nationals, Oceanias and World Cups are all ok (thankfully!). NZ also changed the citizenship rule from 3-5 years just as she was coming up to 3 years, so she's been pushed back 4 years!!! It's a good thing riders like GRD, Sabine Spitz and Catharine are still kicking butt at the highest level showing age doesn't matter.

It's a very frustrating rule change and I don't know why it needed to be changed the way they did, but it's specifically to prevent people from hopping from country to country to make selection for major events. Also, once nationality is changed, it is irreversible.


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

J-Flo said:


> What I saw was Absalon repeatedly trying and failing to drop Schurter, and Schurter waiting until the last part of the final climb to make his move, which he did convincingly. It was a good strategy and they were both extremely strong, but Nino clearly had the edge and control. He would have won the race but for his mistake on the flat gravel turn. This was probably a combination of bad luck and likely distraction/drop in focus.
> 
> Note: I don't believe Nino was "taking risks" when he crashed, at least not intentionally. He had already finished the descent and was on a flat turn towards the finish, just trying to hammer into the flat. He simply biffed it.


What I didn't see is Schurter trying and failing to drop Absalon during the race, so not sure how is he the stronger one. If he had the legs, he would't have waited for the final descent of the final lap - period.

He was stronger in taking the final descent, making a move and falling down. Would he had fallen if he didn't make the move? 
I am not sure anybody reading this would say yes. So the move was the crash factor. The move than is the risk he took.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Goran_injo said:


> What I didn't see is Schurter trying and failing to drop Absalon during the race, so not sure how is he the stronger one. If he had the legs, he would't have waited for the final descent of the final lap - period.
> 
> He was stronger in taking the final descent, making a move and falling down. Would he had fallen if he didn't make the move?
> I am not sure anybody reading this would say yes. So the move was the crash factor. The move than is the risk he took.


Schurter was being savvy, racing isn't all about brute force.

Nino himself said he screwed up because he was thinking about the finish line. For sure Absalon earned the win, he was in the right place at the right time, but if he was speaking amongst friends I doubt he would deny that he received a nice little gift at Albstadt.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> I've seen more and more Shimano groups in XC race bikes this year at the to level. Is there really not such of a big difference in a 10-42 cassette compared with a 11-40? Absalon climbed Albstadt with ease in a 34 x 11-40, while Nino uses a 36 x 10-42.
> 
> I know they ride what they are sponsored, but does it really make a difference?


Whenever you're wondering about gearing it's always worth putting the different options into a gear calculator to see how the combinations compare.

You have to take wheel size into account also, Julien Absalon was using 29" wheels whilst Nino Schurter was using 27.5 wheels. This affects the gearing.

I find it easiest to visualise by looking at what speed you would be travelling at in each gear combination when pedalling. The Sheldon Brown gear calculator works well for this.

Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Gear Calculator

Here are Julien Absalon (29" wheels, 34T chainring, 11-40T cassette) and Nino Schurter's (27.5" wheels, 36T chainring, 10-42T cassette) Albstadt gears alongside one another when pedalling at a cadence of 90rpm. I've used 26"x2.35 as an approximation for Nino Schurter's wheel size. A fatter 26" tyre should be fairly close to a relatively narrow 27.5" x2.05 tyre in circumference as there isn't a specific 27.5" MTB option in the calculator.










If you look at the lowest gears for both bikes they are actually very close speed wise. If they were both using their bottom gear and pedalling at the same cadence whilst climbing they would be going around the same speed of 6mph. The lowest 6 sprockets are very close for either gear setup, making them evenly matched.

If there had been any extended high speed pedalling sections Nino Schurter would have had an advantage, as he had a higher top gear, but on a tight twisty course this wouldn't come into play.


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## Commonaeros (May 28, 2015)

Le Duke said:


> Also worth noting:
> 
> AFAIK, Scott-Odlo is the only team running 27.5 on the men's side these days. The BH guys have gone 29, and Fabian Giger's custom Colnago is rolling on 52mm Dugast 29er tires as well.
> 
> Even more women on 29ers this year, too, from what I can tell. Neff, Gunn Rita, Maja, Irina, Helen Grobert, Lea, and Esther Suss all rolling on the big wheels. I'm sure the Liv girls will be on 27.5, though.


I know the sponsors would have pushed 27.5 on them last year, but my thoughts were that it would never hold in the XCO format. You accelerate a touch quicker, but it's a lot more effort to maintain speed (imo).

Absalon earning a 'free' win is a very handy bonus in terms of overall honours. He'd be pretty happy to get one over Nino that probably wasn't going to happen


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

A win is a win...


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Nino straight up pulled a Sam Hill in that corner. They both got caught off guard and screwed up in a corner. 

Not a slam against either, just an interesting coincidence ;-) 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

zephxiii said:


> Nino straight up pulled a Sam Hill in that corner. They both got caught off guard and screwed up in a corner.
> 
> Not a slam against either, just an interesting coincidence ;-)


Going balls out (with their significant skills, respectively) has won both a lot of races. Pushing the envelope also entails sometimes making mistakes, which can just as easily lose races. When one rider loses a race, another rider by definition wins it, by being close enough to take advantage of the error. There's no such thing as the "better" rider losing. Maybe the "stronger" rider can lose a race, but not the better rider since whoever comes across the line first - everything taken into account - is the better rider on the day.

It's not all about the guy in front though, since if they weren't being pushed, or worn down from the cumulative fatigue of having someone right there with them for the whole race, they might not have been pressured into the mistake.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Circlip said:


> Going balls out (with their significant skills, respectively) has won both a lot of races. Pushing the envelope also entails sometimes making mistakes, which can just as easily lose races. When one rider loses a race, another rider by definition wins it, by being close enough to take advantage of the error. There's no such thing as the "better" rider losing. Maybe the "stronger" rider can lose a race, but not the better rider since whoever comes across the line first - everything taken into account - is the better rider on the day.
> 
> It's not all about the guy in front though, since if they weren't being pushed, or worn down from the cumulative fatigue of having someone right there with them for the whole race, they might not have been pressured into the mistake.


My point though... Is that neither Nino or Sam had to push through their corners as hard as they did. It wasn't going to cost them the race. They just came in too hot which cost them more time than if they came through more carefully.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## OLx6 (Feb 5, 2011)

The beauty of racing and competition in general is that anything can happen. You have to be fit, skilled, and mentally prepared but this does not guarantee a win. This was a great race and Absalon was the winner. Who will win the next race? I am thinking Nino will be hard to beat.


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## bananajoe (May 15, 2015)

Le Duke said:


> To be honest, I'm surprised that some of the Swiss guys haven't done what Kenyan distance runners were doing about a decade ago. A bunch of them basically sold out to the highest bidders (Qatar, IIRC) and raced in the Olympics, WCs, Diamond League, etc for them.
> 
> Most prominent example of this being Saif Saaeed Shaheen, the 3000m steeplechase world record holder and multiple time world champion.


Some Swiss alpine skiers actually did just that, racing at the 2010 Winter Olympics for Moldova (New York Times); maybe it will also come one day in mountain biking...


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## team_wee (Mar 26, 2006)

Those rules are kind of silly, makes winning less of a big deal. World top 10 should automatically get in the Olympics.


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## moab63 (Dec 29, 2003)

zephxiii said:


> Nino straight up pulled a Sam Hill in that corner. They both got caught off guard and screwed up in a corner.
> 
> Not a slam against either, just an interesting coincidence ;-)
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


As a former motorcycle road racer. I can tell you, that you never think you going to throw it away. You ride at 99.9%, sometimes at 101%. But you always believe that you can save it. If not you can't go FAST, is a common trait. 
It was a awesome race, like it should be 2 warrior going at it.


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## kupoo (Sep 12, 2014)

I also made comparison of Nino/Absalon gearing in HTML5 Gear Calculator as I prefer visual representation instead of numbers much more. Also has 27.5 wheelsize option.

You can see that nino can go slightly faster due to 10 vs 11 smallest ring and climb slightly easier due to 42 vs 40 largest rings, but overall difference not so big.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

The UCI did change the rules for CX world cups. If you ranked in the top 50, you get to start, even if your countries spots are all filled (this applies mostly to the Belgians). Seems reasonable to me.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I'm surprised that the field sizes are so small. Why only 30 women? Most women racing world cups, world champs and racing with the Olympics as a goal are significantly smaller than their male peers; it's not like the start/finish line is lacking in space with 30 100-120lb women on it.

Similarly, why is the male field only 50 dudes? Make it 75 or 100 guys, based solely on UCI ranking. Use the 80% rule, pull people when they should be pulled. 

I'm not saying that everyone and their mother should be able to go to the Olympics, but you could very easily be a top 10 WC guy and miss the race because you were from a stacked country. That's hogwash.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

CX Field sizes aren't limited, you are just automatically qualified to start if you're in the UCI top 50 rank for men. There are typically over 50 starters in a men's race.


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## primoz (Jun 7, 2006)

Le Duke said:


> 'm not saying that everyone and their mother should be able to go to the Olympics, but you could very easily be a top 10 WC guy and miss the race because you were from a stacked country. That's hogwash.


I totally agree with you about this, but unfortunately it's different spirit for majority of people when it comes to Olympics. It's not so much about all the best, but it's that everyone has right to participate. And it's same in every single sport. You can be top 10 on World in xc skiing, but if you are living in Norway, there's pretty big chance you will never see Olympics or World championships, as only 4 per country are there to participate. You can be top 10 in 100m sprint, but if you are in Jamaica, you will most likely never see Olympics either. So it's everywhere pretty much same, not just mtb. 
And I agree it's not fair. I don't care if you are from Trinidad and Tobago, if you can't ski, you are not coming to Olympics. And if Norway has 10 guys in top 15 on World, then there will be 10 guys from Norway competing. But unfortunately it's not so, and someone, who can't even sit on bike and pedal, will see Olympics, while 4th Swiss rider, who is top 5 on World, will miss them. Not fair in my eyes, but I doubt it will ever change.


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## Loch (Apr 29, 2011)

kupoo said:


> I also made comparison of Nino/Absalon gearing in HTML5 Gear Calculator as I prefer visual representation instead of numbers much more. Also has 27.5 wheelsize option.
> 
> You can see that nino can go slightly faster due to 10 vs 11 smallest ring and climb slightly easier due to 42 vs 40 largest rings, but overall difference not so big.


Wonder if there would have been any difference if Absalon had chosen 2x11 like Neff did (I didn't see much pedaling downhill, but certainly we don't get to see the whole course). I thought it was interesting that Neff went with 2x11. Maybe for a course like this, it was an advantage.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Loch said:


> Wonder if there would have been any difference if Absalon had chosen 2x11 like Neff did (I didn't see much pedaling downhill, but certainly we don't get to see the whole course). I thought it was interesting that Neff went with 2x11. Maybe for a course like this, it was an advantage.


The way I see it the stronger you are as a rider the more sense 1x11 makes. You can run a larger front chainring, so that there isn't much of a loss of top end speed, whilst still being able to get up the hills in the bottom gear. On the relatively short climbs at Alsbstadt (even long current World Cup climbs only take a few minutes) Julien Absalon and Nino Schurter could blast over them without needing a lower gear than what they had available.

When you aren't as quick it takes longer to get up the climbs, and the steeper sections require greater effort, so 1x11 becomes more of a compromise. To have an acceptable climbing gear with 1x11 requires a small front chainring, which then means you have no top end gears for going fast.

nya has a comparison of the men's and women's lap times at Albstadt here:

UCI World Cup XCO 2 Albstadt / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry

Julien Absalon Lap 2: 11 minutes 6 seconds
Jolanda Neff Lap 2: 13 minutes 18 seconds

If you look at the lap times, on a climbing course, there's a difference of several minutes between Julien Absalon and Jolanda Neff. When deciding gearing that would be a consideration.

At the round before in Nove Mesto Tanja Zakelj was using a 1x11 SRAM setup. She had a 28T front chainring fitted:

World Cup XC, Pro Bike Check: Unior Tools Team Trek Superfly of Tanja ?akelj


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Bikerumor seem to be doing a series about World Cup bikes at the moment.

Here they have a look at Catharine Pendrel's Orbea Oiz from Nove Mesto:

World Cup XC, Pro Bike Check: Rainbow Orbea Oiz of World Champion Catharine Pendrel










It has 27.5" wheels, Shimano XTR Di2, Fox iCTD and a single chainring. 10.79kg (23.79lbs).

If you look at the riding position it's more standard than some XC race bikes. Where someone like Emily Batty has a custom -25 degree negative rise stem, no top cap cover etc to get the bars lower this bike still has the standard top cap cover and the bars appear to be higher than the saddle. It goes to show that there isn't one fixed rule for what makes a successful bike setup.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

WR304 said:


> Bikerumor seem to be doing a series about World Cup bikes at the moment.
> 
> Here they have a look at Catharine Pendrel's Orbea Oiz from Nove Mesto:
> 
> ...


Crazy how far off my home scale is. Need to add a 1lb to all my bike weights. No wonder by trail bike hurts so much to ride.

The angle of the picture makes the bars appear higher then they are. Her bars sit normally level or slightly below the seat below. The set-up also reflects Catharine's strengths and weakness. She is really good at steep descents, but vulnerable on low grade descents. Opposite for climbing.

BTW after racing Albstadt she is going try out a double.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> I'm surprised that the field sizes are so small. Why only 30 women? Most women racing world cups, world champs and racing with the Olympics as a goal are significantly smaller than their male peers; it's not like the start/finish line is lacking in space with 30 100-120lb women on it.
> 
> Similarly, why is the male field only 50 dudes? Make it 75 or 100 guys, based solely on UCI ranking. Use the 80% rule, pull people when they should be pulled.


The IOC puts a limit on the total number of athletes at an Olympics. When mountain biking was brought in, it replaced the TTT. The TTT had 50 men and 30 women. The only way for the mountain bike field size to grow is for other cycling disciplines to have their field size reduced.


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## jkirkpatri (Sep 16, 2008)

LMN said:


> ...BTW after racing Albstadt she is going try out a double.


Is she finding that the range isn't quite where it needs to be with the single ring up front? Just curious.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

What other reason could there be?


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## jkirkpatri (Sep 16, 2008)

Closer gear ratios, testing for Shimano, integration for iCTD; I don't know, just asking.


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

LMN said:


> BTW after racing Albstadt she is going try out a double.


Why the SGS derailleur? Convenience of switching to double on the fly? Although the double should also be covered by the GS...


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

I was just asking too. I guess I always assumed that racers set up their bikes for their own best interests, without too much sponsor influence. I would think testing could be done outside of a WC race. I figured that's why you see parts with blacked out logos.

However, I'm intrigued by the weight of Pendrel's bike. It is higher than I expected and I wonder how much the component choices are hers alone vs. sponsor desires. Maybe LMN can "weigh" in on the question?


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Yeah, I though the bike was gonna be lighter...but who we are to ask...she placed 3rd on a heavy climbing course!!!


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

Well, the question in my mind is if her bike was lighter, might she have had 2nd? 
I understand the nature of compromise, so I can see that lighter does not always equal faster or a better placing. But still, I would of expected a lower overall weight. Having sponsors certainly limits your selection of parts, but I assume the riders can ride nearly anything from the sponsor (not to mention prototypes and black box stuff) as evidenced by the comment about several other pros riding the previous M980 pedals.

Or maybe their scale is just off, as LMN hinted at.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Hope there's some extended footage from the latest BMC Cup round.
Sam Gaze got 5th in the elites and first junior by 2min.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

There is a clip of about 7 minutes on Youtube...I saw it yesterday...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Saw that. Want moar!


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## dan4jeepin (Apr 9, 2007)

Catharine Pendrel just did an article on pinkbike talking about her choice of full suspension vs hardtail.

Rider Perspective: What do you choose: Dual Suspension or Hardtail? - Pinkbike

Sounds like she picks the components she thinks will work best and doesn't worry to much about weight. I'm surprised by the weight of her bike as well considering my 29er FS weighs 22.5lbs and I feel like it could be lighter.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I've never been much of a pink bike site visitor because I think of it as purely hucking and DH which isn't my style and what I obsess over. But they have been doing some cool XC stuff that last couple years when I follow links that lead me there, I ought to visit that site more. Great article by Pendrel.


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## rallymaniac (Oct 12, 2011)

On a semi related note: does anyone know if the Baku 2015 XCO will be streaming live anywhere online? Even better if it was a rerun that could be viewed in the morning US time. 
It would be fun to see who from the top guys and girls will snatch the medals.


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## primoz (Jun 7, 2006)

Not sure if this will be locked just for Germany or not, but at least on TV, Sport1.de will be showing them. As far as link goes, try this one tomorrow 9:45am CET, it might work, but I won't say it will for sure 
Live Sport im Internet | SPORT1- Live Stream | Europaspiele Live - Baku 2015 - u.a. Mountainbike, Ringen, Karate & Triathlon


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## rallymaniac (Oct 12, 2011)

thanks for the link I'll give it a try. 
There appears to be an official Baku 2015 app that supposedly will have live streaming too. 
Hopefully the replay will be accessible somewhere next day as well as I don't know if i'll be coherent enough to watch this at 2am Central US time


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

It's related to the Pan Am Games, but it's still mainstream media coverage of MTB racing

Catharine Pendrel's ride: Not your everyday bike - British Columbia - CBC News


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## dokker (Sep 25, 2013)

https://youtube.com/user/baku2015

Mens race starts in 40 minutes!


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## bananajoe (May 15, 2015)

It's really not the same when Absalon, Kulhavy, Vogel, Fumic and co are not here...


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

dokker said:


> https://youtube.com/user/baku2015
> 
> Mens race starts in 40 minutes!


Thanks for the link. It was raining so I was in and got to watch it live. The internet stream of the race in HD was really good quality pictures.

I'm not sure if the men's race will be available to watch again? There's only 38 seconds of the women's race that I could find.






I wanted to do some screenshots but the stream wouldn't rewind.

Baku, the capital city of Azerbaijan, was in the background. Apparently 2 million people live there. It was all low rise buildings apart from the huge complex on top of a cliff in the background. I spent the race wondering what this massive building was. Whether it was soviet era or newer? A palace perhaps?

Although the race course was right next to the city there were no spectators at all. Outside of the feed zone the only people on the course were press photographers and stewards. There looked to be an army / police security presence there as dotted around the course were men in military uniforms. (The race marshals were in blue). At the end after the race had finished they were all seen marching together down the hill behind the finishing straight.

Initially I thought the course looked a lot like a gravel path but Nino Schurter managed to fall off so it clearly wasn't that easy! It was very dry and dusty with a strong wind. It wasn't clear why Nino Schurter stopped after a few laps. He had a mechanical of some sort but rejoined with the lead group. The three swiss riders in the group of five then worked together for a clear 1,2,3 result. With no Julien Absalon, Jaroslav Kulhavy etc the result was never really in doubt.

Nino Schurter had kinesio tape strapping covering up his right ankle and calf, related to his crash in Albstadt probably. It didn't seem to be slowing him down at all on the bike though.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

The Women's full race is up now!






Baku 2015


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

All the Baku stuff is "blocked in your country".


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

JoelGuelph said:


> The Women's full race is up now!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Beat me to it! I watched the women's race last night. Have kept reloading it to see if they make the Men's race available (note: they suck at not giving spoilers by having the summary videos that list the winner right next to the whole race) and at this point I see four videos, but one of them is private: 




Quite a mixed field, saw a bunch of World Cup regulars and a bunch of ladies I've never heard of. (not that that means much) The WC regulars quickly distilled out to the front. Coverage was good, even though I don't think the commentators are MTB specialists. Bikes have carbon fiber rotors and can have anywhere from 12 to over 20 speeds. ಠ_ಠ

They went a bit heavy with the slo-mo replays at first, but later on they seemed to be doing better, using the right frame rate and showing some cool stuff. Uber-steep downhill into a tight left hander was cool to see. Hope we get to see the same in the men's race.

Was curious why some of the other big names weren't there - didn't see any Germany (Sabine, etc) but it was still MTB racing and it was still fun to watch.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Still waiting for a Loic Bruni win, he's been knocking on the door!


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Mens race in full:


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

NordieBoy said:


> All the Baku stuff is "blocked in your country".


Here are the two full Baku 2015 XC races uploaded.

They're in 640x360 mp4 format and zipped. Click on the small Download arrow at the upper middle of the screen to download the files. They should play ok in VLC Media Player. There is a better 720P stream but it's 3gb file size per race.

Mens_XC_Baku_2015.zip 695mb
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6DcTKJdrf_gUm9WdktNdU1Fb0U/view?usp=sharing

Women_XC_Baku_2015.zip 738mb
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6DcTKJdrf_gNlBmWkllb3JpREU/view?usp=sharing

Did you watch the Red Bull Harescramble? It was fairly ridiculous. When the top five are forced to work together to try and drag their bikes up the hill you know it's hard!

The toughest single day off-road race in the world | Red Bull Hare Scramble at Erzbergrodeo 2015 | Red Bull TV


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Yep, watched that one live. Brutal.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

cmh said:


> Coverage was good, even though I don't think the commentators are MTB specialists. Bikes have carbon fiber rotors and can have anywhere from 12 to over 20 speeds. ಠ_ಠ.


I think the 2014 Commonwealth Games men's XCO race takes the cake for worst commentary I've ever seen. Rochelle Gilmore and some other schlub were the commentators; she's a retired road racer (owner/manager of Wiggle-Honda) and I don't think she's ever been off of a paved surface before. It was almost certainly a case of "oh, any cyclist will do, right?" by the production team.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I could make out the riders better on the 320x240 screen cap I was watching than they could...


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

I dunno - having seen the US Pro cup earlier this year was pretty painful. Really made me appreciate Rob Warner and the RedBull team's work.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

The Redbull team has far superior technical and camera coverage, but the US Cup TV coverage was in many other ways superior. In particular, they talked about and showed many riders on course, not just the lead group. They had an appropriate focus on the leader (Nino) but the Redbull focus is almost exclusively on the leader which is annoying. US Cup TV also would show, for example, a particular obstacle and how everyone would get over it (or not, as the case may be). More interesting and relevant. 

Also, it is beyond old to listen to the Redbull commentating team talk over and over about whether a particular rider is on full suspension versus hardtail. I get the sense they have nothing else to say.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

This explains why Pauline Ferrand-Prévot had the DNF in Albstadt

News shorts: Ferrand-Prévot out of Aviva Women's Tour | Cyclingnews.com


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

Oh, for sure, they're not perfect. Did you know that Sabine Spitz and Gunn-Rita are old? If not, they'll remind you.


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## PlanB (Nov 22, 2007)

For me, the funnest part of watching the US Cup races was trying to count the number of times Scott Tedro's name was mentioned. Or how many times he'd pop into the camera shot... 

Give me Rob and Bart any day! I find their personalities to be engaging and their history as athletes gives them credibility. I'd pay good money to subscribe to the Red Bull coverage. The fact that it's free, live or on demand later in the day, is amazing. I hope it lasts.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Rob has moments were I can LMAO...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

His DH commentary is the bestest 

Especially his rider interviews...
Like the one at Cairns with Eddie Masters that went along the lines of...
"You f---ing f--k, how the f--k did you get down so f---ing fast you f---er. F--K!"


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## Feideaux (Jan 14, 2004)

Because he's a top bloke, Scott Mcgrory would find it hilarious he was called a schlub on an mtb forum : ) (fyi, he won gold in the madison at the 2000 Sydney Olympics).
Agreed, though; there would have been many other better choices.

Back on topic, it would be hard to appeal to everyone with commentary. I used to love Phil & Paul but now cannot listen to more than 5 seconds of their cliches without feeling the need to throw something at the TV. 

Rob Warner and Bart Brentjans make a great team - Bart drops a lot of little insights about training, racing and technology into his commentary and Rob plays the "What's that all about, then?" card really well.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

I like Claudio, I think he's pretty awesome, however...

When it comes to the DH commentary, I prefer it be Warner and "Rich" as "Rich" complements Warner better. Claudio almost competes with Warner in comparison which is less than ideal, but understanding...not for job position but by personality.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Rob Warner *is the voice *of the World Cup.

It would never be the same without him. Kinda like Jeremy Clarkson and Top gear .


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

This is a video about Manuel Fumic at home preparing for the first two World Cups:

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/manuel-fumic-cannondale-factory-racing-video-2015.html

Whilst I'm posting Pinkbike links this 1989 Yeti C-26 still looks awesome.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/now-that-was-a-bike-yeti-c-26-2015.html


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I did get a kick out of how cold and dry thomas Frichnet (not even trying to spell it right). He made me laugh but hes no Bart!


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## spsoon (Jul 28, 2008)

Bart is awesome, but yeah Frischy had some good laughs. Would be fun to see him come back for a race or two.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

I'd love to hear a female voice from time to time... Willow and Lea have made appearances in the past for the world cups. It brings a unique dimension to the commentary when there is more 'inside knowledge'. Georgia was great at one of the US Cups (when she could get a word in). Rochelle Gilmore does a great job with road racing and appearances from Marianne Vos were also great.

Tough for an active racer to commit, but (if and) when the current top tenish crop decide to hang up their race wheels I'd love to hear their POV!

Rob Warner has a certain innocence (I think it's actually ignorance, but not in a bad way) that allows him to get away with anything. He's great for the novice viewer. A bit like Phil & Paul and road racing. They cover the basics really well, and I love that they don't ignore the scenery, but beyond a certain point I want more analysis.


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## kevbikemad (Jan 2, 2006)

I'd like to hear Tomac. Out for a long time yes, but I think he'd be good. Could kill some time talking moto as well. Brap!


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## joeduda (Jan 4, 2013)

kevbikemad said:


> I'd like to hear Tomac. Out for a long time yes, but I think he'd be good. Could kill some time talking moto as well. Brap!


Pretty sure he lost all interest in the mtb racing. All of his energy goes into Eli's career these days. But I agree, he would do a good job at it.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

The 2015 MTB Marathon World Championships was last weekend in Italy.

There are some nice pictures from the races here:

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/uci-world-marathon-championships-2015.html

If you want to see some of the marathon race power files from Strava here is Roel Paulissen's file.

4 hours 32 minutes, 
52.6 miles, 
12,884ft of climbing, 
11.6mph average speed, 
42.5mph max speed, 
265 watts average power (4.02 w/kg, 65.93 kg bodyweight)
306 watts normalized power.

https://www.strava.com/activities/334279582/overview

Here is Karl Platt's race file

4 hours 38 minutes
11.4mph average speed
300 watts average power (4.30 w/kg, 69.93kg bodyweight)
333 watts normalized power

The 2,000 watts maximum power in this file looks like it is a power spike error by the power meter. 1,000 watts plus max power seems more realistic.

https://www.strava.com/activities/333889215/overview

Look at the segments in that link for 27 June 2015 and you can see some of the other riders files too. Alban Lakata won comfortably but his race file isn't public, only some warm up rides.

It doesn't look like Jaroslav Kulhavy was riding this year. Compared to the previous year this looks like it was a tough climbing course with some big hills.


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

Very interesting, thanks WR304.

Looks like quite a few spikes on the second file, and they're all during descents. The data on the climbs seems to be accurate though. To start the race, he did 345W for a little over half an hour. Then he did 3 efforts right around 300W for 26m, 43m, and 43m. Crazy...


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

bloodninja said:


> Very interesting, thanks WR304.
> 
> Looks like quite a few spikes on the second file, and they're all during descents. The data on the climbs seems to be accurate though. To start the race, he did 345W for a little over half an hour. Then he did 3 efforts right around 300W for 26m, 43m, and 43m. Crazy...


According to this article from the Cape Epic 2015 Karl Platt uses a Stages power meter.

https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/article/pro-bike-karl-platts-bulls-wild-edge-team-29-43884/

There have been some recent threads on MTBR about frequent power spikes offroad with Stages power meters too.

The warning sign that I spotted was when looking at the power curve on Strava. If it's available I always look at that first on any Strava rides for an overview.

https://www.strava.com/activities/333889215/power-curve

If you look at Karl Platt's race power curve you can see that it says he did 2,000 watts for 1 second, 2,000 watts for 2 seconds, 2,000 watts for 3 seconds and 2,000 watts for 4 seconds. As soon as you have a straight line with no change in the numbers for several seconds like that you know something has gone wrong and it's an error in the file, not a true power figure.

The longer duration efforts should still be ok, 5 minutes plus. The power numbers when climbing and going hard on the flat are far more stable.

This picture shows where the largest power spikes occurred in Karl Platt's file. They're on the descents whilst freewheeling. I've highlighted a few of them with green arrows so that you can see the altitude profile at that point.










Everything out to around 1 or 2 minutes on the power curve is badly skewed by these 2,000 watt spikes because they repeat multiple times on the same descent. It isn't just a single bad reading. There's one descent that must have been particularly rough which has wiped out the first part of the power curve completely. There are some nasty spikes in this file!

This shows the worst descent as recorded in the race file. On the descent there is a peak power of 2,000 watts and average power of 1,000 watts at 121 rpm cadence for a full minute according to the graph. According to Strava this section is -18% gradient straight down. You would not be pedalling at 1,000 watts all the way down a -18% gradient descent offroad whilst averaging a speed of just 19.6mph. That's not possible. It appears that the entirety of this descent may be false readings from the power meter!










Roel Paulissen uses an SRM power meter (in the Strava device type it says he has a SRM PC8 head unit). His peak power outputs in contrast seem reasonable for the same route.

Here is the same -18% gradient descent as recorded in Roel Paulissen's race file. He freewheeled the entire section. That's what I think the graph above should have looked like too.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Since the power meters must be using some sort of strain gauge load cell, I wonder if those big peaks during coasting are from the body weight on the pedals and hitting bigger bumps when the rider is off the saddle? Or maybe big G outs while cornering on the descents?


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> Since the power meters must be using some sort of strain gauge load cell, I wonder if those big peaks during coasting are from the body weight on the pedals and hitting bigger bumps when the rider is off the saddle? Or maybe big G outs while cornering on the descents?


That's what I was thinking.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)




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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

rockyuphill said:


> Since the power meters must be using some sort of strain gauge load cell, I wonder if those big peaks during coasting are from the body weight on the pedals and hitting bigger bumps when the rider is off the saddle? Or maybe big G outs while cornering on the descents?


Doesn't a Stages measure only when the built-in accelometer detects rotation of the crank?

Here you can see one of my last rides with a X9 Stages. Two very technical downhills. No Spikes. No measurement at all.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

What I know about power meters wouldn't exceed the character limit of a Tweet. 

What would it show in a fast half pedal stroke to change which pedal was down, or changing which pedal was forward, if someone was standing on the pedals?


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

WR304 said:


> The warning sign that I spotted was when looking at the power curve on Strava. If it's available I always look at that first on any Strava rides for an overview.


Do you get power spikes often? I've been using my P2M 4-6 times per week since I got it in April, and I've had a grand total of one spike. 1400 watts for a single second.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

quax said:


> Doesn't a Stages measure only when the built-in accelometer detects rotation of the crank?
> 
> Here you can see one of my last rides with a X9 Stages. Two very technical downhills. No Spikes. No measurement at all.


When you're clattering down a mountain at full speed the bicycle's cranks are never completely stationary. As you hit the bumps they move small amounts up and down very rapidly. With most of your bodyweight carried through your feet these small movements also put force through the cranks. If you watch a riders feet on a rough descent you can see how their feet and cranks are never perfectly still.

Have a look at this slow motion video on YouTube and watch their feet:






These small sudden movements are picked up by the accelerometer that the crank uses to identify crank rotation. The ability to filter out this unwanted noise is down to the power meter software and how sensitive it is to movement. In theory the power meter should be able to filter out this noise and ignore it, so that it only registers genuine power and cadence readings from the rider pedalling without including any false readings, which will show up as power spikes ( a small crank movement combined with a lot of force creates a momentarily high reading).

Stages have released firmware updates over the years to try and reduce this issue.

Eg 2013:
http://www.roadbikereview.com/reviews/stages-cycling-issues-power-meter-firmware-update

April 2015:
http://forums.mtbr.com/xc-racing-training/mtb-power-meters-966161.html#post11944962

It still seems to exist. Some 2015 links with power spikes:

April 2015 (road):
http://www.titaniumgeek.com/gear-reviews/stages-power-meter-review/

June 2015 (mtb):
http://forums.mtbr.com/xc-racing-training/mtb-power-meters-966161.html#post12043742

To some extent it seems to depend upon how you ride the bike, your choice of lead leg when descending, how you weight the pedals etc might increase or decrease the likelihood of power spikes.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

bloodninja said:


> Do you get power spikes often? I've been using my P2M 4-6 times per week since I got it in April, and I've had a grand total of one spike. 1400 watts for a single second.


The reason I look at the power curve first on someone's Strava file isn't specifically to see if there are issues with the file. It's a way "into" visualising the ride to begin understanding what I'm looking at. By reading off the best power durations and the corresponding w/kg figures it's a quick way to see if it was most likely a hard or easy ride without having to wade through the smaller analysis graph screen.

If there is an exceptionally high peak power value, way above the other power bests, that often means power spikes. When you have multiple seconds at the same power value (eg: 4 seconds at 2,000 watts) that "stuck" power value often means that the power meter has dropped connection. A power value that doesn't change is where the head unit isn't receiving fresh data wirelessly from the power meter.

I don't get many power spikes with my power meter. I've had some one second spikes but it's fewer than 10 individual spikes in over a year of riding.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

WR304 said:


> Have a look at this slow motion video on YouTube and watch their feet:


Far too little movement to get picked up. Believe me, I've been riding two Stages for 1.5 years now. My ride file above includes several 1 m drops and hefty, rocky alpine terrain. Not a single measurement. And this is good because otherwise the Stages would always start when transported in the car and driving on a rough road.

For me these reports of spikes are more the exception than the norm. My second Stages shows one 1s drop out about every 1.5 hours. Not always but on about every second ride. Same head unit.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

WR304 said:


> The 2015 MTB Marathon World Championships was last weekend in Italy.
> ...
> It doesn't look like Jaroslav Kulhavy was riding this year. Compared to the previous year this looks like it was a tough climbing course with some big hills.


According to the video that nordieboy posted Jaroslav Kulhavy did start the race but was a DNF (Did Not Finish). In the video he seemed very relaxed and not too bothered about it. He said that he was concentrating on XC racing this year.

In the same video in passing Christoph Sauser mentions Jaroslav Kulhavy's weight (officially it's 76kg per his rider bio, see the link a few pages back in this thread). In this video Christoph Sauser says 78kg.








quax said:


> Far too little movement to get picked up. Believe me, I've been riding two Stages for 1.5 years now. My ride file above includes several 1 m drops and hefty, rocky alpine terrain. Not a single measurement. And this is good because otherwise the Stages would always start when transported in the car and driving on a rough road.
> 
> For me these reports of spikes are more the exception than the norm. My second Stages shows one 1s drop out about every 1.5 hours. Not always but on about every second ride. Same head unit.


In theory that's how it should always be. The small crank movements ought to be filtered out so you only see your power output from genuine pedalling. If every single small movement was registering as an input the power meter readings would be all over the place and unusable. It is possible to fool a power meter in certain circumstances though, which is why odd readings and power spikes happen occasionally.

In the Marathon World Championship Strava file above it isn't just an individual spike. The power and cadence readings are completely wrong for over a minute at a time. That's a lot more than just a 1 second power spike. Thinking about this a bit more Stages are notorious for having had battery door, battery contact and connectivity issues. It could be down to that perhaps. The CR2032 battery not being held in place properly and then the rough descent causing the battery to move against the contacts causing spikes / dropouts.

_"Update 17/05/2015

I contacted Stages about the power drops, and after sending a series of photos to the team there, they determined that I had an early batch battery door that was known to let the battery move, resulting in the drop outs. They sent me a replacement door - I honestly can't see the difference, but the manufacturing dates are different, and the older door has "A" moulded into the plastic, vs "B" moulded into the plastic on the new door. More importantly on my ride today, it appears to have cured the dropout issue!"_

http://www.titaniumgeek.com/gear-reviews/stages-power-meter-review/

Some Stages battery and connectivity links:

http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=40013&t=12953022

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/S..._Power_Meters_-_A_Worthless_Product_P5603444/


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

I just saw a video of Mathias Fluckiger training on the Lenzerhiede track on a full suspension bike. New bike from Stockli? Rough course? Lukas already posted he will be using his full suspension...


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Just noticed that Georgia wasn't on a start list from a few days ago. Not a bad plan to skip the trip and focus on the North American races coming up (she's come soooo close to winning at both venues in the past!). Assuming that is the thinking behind it... (and that it was accurate).


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

For Georgia and other Olympic contenders, they need all the UCI points they can get for Olympic qualifying for 2016. As long as her US competitors also skip the Lenzerheide race she won't be too adversely affected. Lea Davison is doing quite well this year so there will likely be a tight race for the US women's Olympic spot(s).


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

XCKiwi said:


> Just noticed that Georgia wasn't on a start list from a few days ago. Not a bad plan to skip the trip and focus on the North American races coming up (she's come soooo close to winning at both venues in the past!). Assuming that is the thinking behind it... (and that it was accurate).





rockyuphill said:


> For Georgia and other Olympic contenders, they need all the UCI points they can get for Olympic qualifying for 2016. As long as her US competitors also skip the Lenzerheide race she won't be too adversely affected. Lea Davison is doing quite well this year so there will likely be a tight race for the US women's Olympic spot(s).


In light of today's results, I'm guessing that the former quote is exactly the opposite of what Georgia Gould is thinking right now. She's now the 3rd American, behind Lea Davison and Chloe Woodruff by 286pts and 34pts, respectively. Erin Huck is only 30pts behind her, with Mary McConneloug not too far astern.

I really don't understand the "stay home and train" logic when Olympic slots are on the line.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

That was a spectacular finish for Davison, she is really upping her game. 

And again for Gunn-Rita, that is amazing, she is obviously gunning for Rio. 

Must have been a huge disappointment for Neff at her home race course to slide back that far.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

The last lap of Davison was stunning. Fastest lap of the race period.

Fairly pleased with the way Catharine raced. She started well, which is a big step for her. She felt comfortable with pace until she crashed but couldn't match Gunrita afterwards.

A course like that one with short power climbs is usually not a strength of hers. A top three there means her form is good.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

LMN said:


> The last lap of Davison was stunning. Fastest lap of the race period.
> 
> Fairly pleased with the way Catharine raced. She started well, which is a big step for her. She felt comfortable with pace until she crashed but couldn't match Gunrita afterwards.
> 
> A course like that one with short power climbs is usually not a strength of hers. A top three there means her form is good.


It was great race!!!


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

LMN said:


> The last lap of Davison was stunning. Fastest lap of the race period.
> 
> Fairly pleased with the way Catharine raced. She started well, which is a big step for her. She felt comfortable with pace until she crashed but couldn't match Gunrita afterwards.
> 
> A course like that one with short power climbs is usually not a strength of hers. A top three there means her form is good.


fastest women's lap indeed, here are some stats from the race UCI World Cup XCO 3 Lenzerheide / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry

seems like whoever participated in the marathon world champs had a good result here, haven't seen the races yet, but from the results and lap times it looks like the races were quite interesting


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Pinkbike has some nice pictures of the XC race at Lenzerheide. I like this one of Nino Schurter:

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/fight-to-breathe-lenzerheide-xc-2015.html










There seemed to be a lot of punctures in the men's race. It really mixed up the race. The positions on lap 1 weren't a good predictor of finishing order. Along with the punctures for Julien Absalon and Nino Schurter Dan McConnell punctured too. He had been on for his best result of the year before that.

Jaroslav Kulhavy was motoring and looked really strong. I reckon he would have won even if Nino Schurter hadn't punctured.


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## Stonerider (Feb 25, 2008)

I just watched the women's race on Redbull.TV and I was surprised how badly Neff blew up after her fast start. Evidently her excitement from racing at home was writing checks that her lungs and legs couldn't cash. It took her quite a long time to recover and start working her way back towards the front of the field. Maybe she should have stuck with her trusty hardtail...Gunn-Rita didn't have any problems on her hardtail.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

Stonerider said:


> I just watched the women's race on Redbull.TV and I was surprised how badly Neff blew up after her fast start. Evidently her excitement from racing at home was writing checks that her lungs and legs couldn't cash. It took her quite a long time to recover and start working her way back towards the front of the field. Maybe she should have stuck with her trusty hardtail...Gunn-Rita didn't have any problems on her hardtail.


It was really hot (in Central Euro terms). I just raced not far away from Lenzerheide last week end (in US terms). Many people had trouble coping with the heat. Many mentioned blowing up after the start (including me), others had no problem at all.

Heat adaption is highly individual and can be trained to a certain extent. Who knows, maybe Neff is more susceptible. Add the motivation from a home race ...


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

just did a quick check through the Suisse newspapers. They actually cover MTB quite a lot there. In one paper Neff says that she was struggeling with the heat quite in the initial phase.


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

nya said:


> fastest women's lap indeed, here are some stats from the race
> 
> seems like whoever participated in the marathon world champs had a good result here, haven't seen the races yet, but from the results and lap times it looks like the races were quite interesting


Hey, I love your site and I go there to find the streams for the WC races since they're not so easy to find on the Red Bull page. I have a request though...would you mind putting the top 3 finishers a little further down the page so it's easier to avoid spoilers? I tried to divert my eyes when I started the video yesterday, but accidentally saw the winner. Thanks!


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

bloodninja said:


> Hey, I love your site and I go there to find the streams for the WC races since they're not so easy to find on the Red Bull page. I have a request though...would you mind putting the top 3 finishers a little further down the page so it's easier to avoid spoilers? I tried to divert my eyes when I started the video yesterday, but accidentally saw the winner. Thanks!


Thanks, glad to hear that. 
I made a separate page with video streams for you  Stream list - MTBCrossCountry
Can't really move the results anyway, its kind of the main thing there. But hopefully the separate page is good enough solution.


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## bloodninja (Jul 11, 2012)

Even better, thank you!



nya said:


> Thanks, glad to hear that.
> I made a separate page with video streams for you  Stream list - MTBCrossCountry
> Can't really move the results anyway, its kind of the main thing there. But hopefully the separate page is good enough solution.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

So, Batty and Gagne won the PanAm Games...and it seems it wasn't a hotly contested race...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

A fairly small field, just 16 in the women's race and 21 in the men's race. Emily and Catharine raced pretty hard with each other but it was quite a gap to 3rd. I wonder what they saved for the Nationals this weekend?

Raph's battle with Soto sounded pretty intense in the last lap and a bit, if only they had covered the mountain bike race like they do the swimming and synchro diving.

Raphael Gagne a surprise Pan Am mountain bike champ - 2015 Pan Am - CBC Sports


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Commonaeros said:


> Pretty incredible racing in the women's and men's. I'd love to see the course in the flesh to see just how hard they are riding. Jaro & Nino just smacked the hell out of each other!
> 
> Also, a little off topic, but anyone taking any notice of Spencer Plaxon's Kona.
> It's managed to sneak under the radar being not one of the 'major' manufacturers, but I'm very interested!


Bikerumor have a more detailed look with close up photos of Spencer Paxson's Kona Hei Hei DL here:

http://www.bikerumor.com/2015/07/16...-check-new-kona-hei-hei-dl-of-spencer-paxson/

It's an aluminium frame but that might just be because it's a pre-production model. They mention in the article that it's likely there will be a carbon framed version too.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

On an odd note, Dan Mcconnel and Bec Henderson have been hanging around ontario. Hear they were at/or raced (im unsure) a weekly series . His bike has been spoted at nationals aswell.

Is it odd to just jump in to a national race for the heck of it? He stands a really good chance of winning it. Safe to assume they are getting an early start to the NA races fpr WC.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Neither Dan or Bec are at Canadian nationals, both stayed in Ontario to train. The bike you are seeing is Matt's, Emily's mechanic.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Ahhh thanks LMN. 

But while on the topic, could anyone attend and if they won a national race hold the title for the year?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

You can only win your own nations national title. 

The only odd case is for perminant residents, they can race but can't actually hold the title.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

It looks like Emily spent it all last weekend at the PanAm games, she was second behind Catharine at the Canadian Nationals today.

But Raphael Gagne repeated his gold medal performance this weekend, with both Geoff Kabush and Derek Zandstra feeling under the weather, it opened up the remaining podium spots for Leandre Bouchard and Evan McNeely.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

LMN said:


> You can only win your own nations national title.
> 
> The only odd case is for perminant residents, they can race but can't actually hold the title.


Thanks again!
Congrats to Catharine!


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## pulser (Dec 6, 2004)

Looks like Emily is on a new bike. No more 29r she's on a 27.5.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

That was kinda painful to watch. On the announcers end.

It was obvious from the beginning that a 27.5 was a better fit for her although, she busted the myth that small people cant ride 29ers.

anybody else get the feeling that shes getting tired of all the "fame".


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

I see a 6'5 guy on a 26" hardtail every other day...and he's fast!!! 

Bikes and wheel size are a personal choice...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## pulser (Dec 6, 2004)

machine4321 said:


> That was kinda painful to watch. On the announcers end.
> 
> It was obvious from the beginning that a 27.5 was a better fit for her although, she busted the myth that small people cant ride 29ers.
> 
> anybody else get the feeling that shes getting tired of all the "fame".


What there was an announcer. O I have to watch that again. Be back in 5.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

So, the 25th anniversary race at Mont Sainte Anne this year, and I am stuck on the West Coast watching it on Red Bull instead of being there in person this year. Who's going to fare better at MSA, Gunn-Rita or Jolanda? Or will the Canadian gals be on the top step of the podium?

Can Raphael Gagne get a podium finish after grabbing the PanAm games and Canadian Nats gold this year?

UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Mont-Sainte-Anne, Canada


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

Some MSA pics and commentary getting posted up from local attendees in the Eastern Canada forum;

http://forums.mtbr.com/eastern-canada/uci-mtb-world-cup-2015-a-983062.html


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Is anyone going to be using the new Fox Live Valve automatic suspension?

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/exclusive-ride-report-fox-live-valve-active-suspension-system.html

When the Fox ICD electronic lockout came out a few years ago Catharine Pendrel was one of the first to use it when she won at Mont Sainte Anne in 2012.










The Fox Live Valve looks a bit bulky at the moment, especially as it requires its own battery. In its current form it might not fit with a water bottle in a cross country frame?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

WR304 said:


> Is anyone going to be using the new Fox Live Valve automatic suspension?
> 
> Exclusive Ride Report: FOX Live Valve Active Suspension System - Pinkbike
> 
> ...


Not that I know about. I think it will be at least another year before that system starts hitting XC bikes.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

1 Hour to the women's race:

Cross Country Women | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Mont-Sainte-Anne, Canada | Red Bull TV

4 hours to the men's race:

Cross Country Men | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Mont-Sainte-Anne, Canada | Red Bull TV


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

In Canada the women's race is running live on Sportsnet TV because of Catharine Pendrel and Emily Batty being in the series (men's race is running delayed), so it might get a wider audience than just the Red Bull viewers.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The post race interview with Jolanda was surprising, she fainted this morning in her room before the race, fell and hit her head on the floor and knocked herself out for 30 seconds, she was surprised to even be able to race. 

Catharine and Emily did us proud.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

What happened to Georgia Gould on the last lap? I was watching the live timing on PinkBike; she was 19th at the last intermediate split, then more and more people kept coming in ahead of her. Flat? Crash?


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> The post race interview with Jolanda was surprising, she fainted this morning in her room before the race, fell and hit her head on the floor and knocked herself out for 30 seconds, she was surprised to even be able to race.
> 
> Catharine and Emily did us proud.


We were watching the race on the TV in the front room. When they have the call up for the lead riders one by one on the start line they got to Jolanda Neff. My dad's first comment (bear in mind the other top female riders on screen aren't exactly heavyweights):

"she looks thin".

No spoilers but it was a good race. I'm looking forwards to the men's race soon. The nice thing about the timing of these overseas races is that you have time to get get out for a ride in the morning, and then you can spend the evening watching the World Cup races.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

As they kept mentioning it throughout the commentary, here is Emily Batty's new Porsche Cayman.










More pictures here:

https://emilybatty.com/2015/06/08/up-close-and-personal-porsche-cayman/


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

My grandfather would have said: "She better be careful, those legs are so thin she could break one off and run it into herself"



WR304 said:


> We were watching the race on the TV in the front room. When they have the call up for the lead riders one by one on the start line they got to Jolanda Neff. My dad's first comment (bear in mind the other top female riders on screen aren't exactly heavyweights):
> 
> "she looks thin".


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

She was almost 2:30 slower on the last lap, so either a flat or she just blew up. She is not having the sort of season she'd want to have in an Olympic quali year. Lea Davison has been spanking her in World Cup and US Cup this year.

From Georgia's Instagram feed

_25th today at the Mont Ste Anne World Cup. Hoping I got all my crashes and flats out of the way today. Looking forward to letting my legs do the talking at the World Cup next weekend in Windham, NY. _



Le Duke said:


> What happened to Georgia Gould on the last lap? I was watching the live timing on PinkBike; she was 19th at the last intermediate split, then more and more people kept coming in ahead of her. Flat? Crash?


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Great racing. 
In Men's it was kind of the usual. Nino vs Julien with Fluckiger bad luck with the puncture. 
In Women's race shame it wasn't lap or 2 longer, Catherine would very likely get to Jolanda in that time. Good result for Emily as well. Pauline still crazy fast even in such a technical course.

Some lap time stats as usual - UCI World Cup XCO 4 Mont Sainte Anne / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry

Results / WC Standings - UCI World Cup XCO 4 Mont Sainte Anne / World Cup - MTBCrossCountry


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Great to see Batty in 4th! Happy for her result indeed, awesome. 

Haven't seen any of race but was she on her new 27.5 electronic FS? 

And what was Nino on? 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## MattMay (Dec 24, 2013)

Nino was on the Spark. Think Batty was on Procaliber HT. Seemed like more women chose HT, more men chose FS. Absalon was on FS.


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## Xilikon (May 7, 2013)

Yep, Batty is on a HT with XTR Di2.

Great day and I'll post a few videos (only mens race as I missed 3/4 of the women race when I got on the site).


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Cool, started watching it now and saw Nino had the new GoPro on his saddle...be cool to see some of that footage!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## PlanB (Nov 22, 2007)

It looked to me like Mathias Fluckiger was running a dropper post at MSA. It kind of looked like some kind of "reverse" mechanism where the larger top of the post slides down over a smaller tube. Anybody get a look at it?


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

zephxiii said:


> Cool, started watching it now and saw Nino had the new GoPro on his saddle...be cool to see some of that footage!
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


Here you go

https://video-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/h...=49688f225a826386cfe448394d34dedb&oe=55C0F3DD


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

PlanB said:


> It looked to me like Mathias Fluckiger was running a dropper post at MSA. It kind of looked like some kind of "reverse" mechanism where the larger top of the post slides down over a smaller tube. Anybody get a look at it?


You could see the dropper post when Mathias Fluckiger stopped to change the rear wheel after puncturing. It's at around 1 h 16min on the Red Bull replay.

There's a remote lever on the left hand side of the bars which looks like it must be for the dropper post and the dropper post itself is a reverse design.

There's a logo on the seatpost but the Red Bull replay makes it too blurry to read clearly.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

A quick search turns up a photo from Kingdom Trails in Vermont (stopped on the way to Windham) posted on his Facebook page. Weird looking post.



WR304 said:


> You could see the dropper post when Mathias Fluckiger stopped to change the rear wheel after puncturing. It's at around 1 h 16min on the Red Bull replay.
> 
> There's a remote lever on the left hand side of the bars which looks like it must be for the dropper post and the dropper post itself is a reverse design.
> 
> There's a logo on the seatpost but the Red Bull replay makes it too blurry to read clearly.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

You can certainly get more beef in the tubing with a USD dropper. I like.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Hes one of my favs to watch on the good decents! Kinda nuts


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Wow, the Windham women's race wasn't anything like anyone expected. That was wild stuff. And a tough day for the Canadians, but a good day for the French, Swiss, Danes and Americans. Except Georgia Gould who was quite far down as well. Watching Lea Davison's fan base cheer her on was great fun. Good result for her. Neff was amazing in the last 2 laps.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Neffs last 3 laps were ridiculous. Usually if someone is having a tough day (i.e. Pendrel), it's a tough day. Watching her come back and move through the traffic was inspiring! By far the best part of the race today.

It was tough watching Pendrel and Batty struggle, I usually cheer (albeit at my computer screen) for them along with the Americans. PFP was awesome on the climbs. She definitely won it there.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

I haven't seen Catharine ride like that in a long time. I could see on the first climb that she wasn't on her best day, but then it spiraled out of control. On the plus side she was descending really well.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

The front runners from the last few rounds all seemed to be struggling at Windham. Gunn Rita Dahle, Catharine Pendrel and Emily Batty were way off the pace and dropped back.

Gunn Rita Dahle appeared to blow badly on the last few laps. She looked really miserable on the climb towards the end. You could see it when Jolanda Neff and Lea Davison went past on the 2nd to last lap and there was absolutely nothing she could do about it. I was wondering if she had cramp because her pedalling looked quite slow.

Catharine Pendrel's race number was flapping loose at the end of the race. There wasn't a mention of a crash though.

You can get NoPinz number holders that attach to the skinsuit. It lets you put a race number on securely without needing safety pins:

http://www.nopinz.com/product/nopinz-speedpocket-retrofit/

5 minutes to the men's race on Redbull.tv.


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## Kiwi19 (Jun 23, 2008)

WR304 said:


> You could see the dropper post when Mathias Fluckiger stopped to change the rear wheel after puncturing. It's at around 1 h 16min on the Red Bull replay.
> 
> There's a remote lever on the left hand side of the bars which looks like it must be for the dropper post and the dropper post itself is a reverse design.
> 
> There's a logo on the seatpost but the Red Bull replay makes it too blurry to read clearly.


I think it just says MF (For Mathias Fluckiger I guess?) on the post. Anyone else got any info?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

She went by a lot of riders on that climb like they were parked during the first lap, did she just over do it in that attack?



LMN said:


> I haven't seen Catharine ride like that in a long time. I could see on the first climb that she wasn't on her best day, but then it spiraled out of control. On the plus side she was descending really well.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Wow the analysis tells the tale. Look at how much faster Neff was in those last laps


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Manuel Fumic needs to be up front in more World Cup races. It was great seeing him putting Nino Schurter under pressure on the descents at Windham.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

rockyuphill said:


> She went by a lot of riders on that climb like they were parked during the first lap, did she just over do it in that attack?


No, looking at her power file there was nothing special about that effort. Even the effort to follow Pauline up the first climb was well within her normal capacities. She just didn't have her normal capacities today.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Fumic's riding on the DH rock/root gardens was mind blowing. When he flew past riders in those tech sections…man that was scary! If he had climbing legs the WC picture might look a bit different over the last couple years. I suppose that could be said about every other rider as well, which just goes to show how Nino and Julian are such complete riders.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

WR304 said:


> Manuel Fumic needs to be up front in more World Cup races. It was great seeing him putting Nino Schurter under pressure on the descents at Windham.


Yes, it was.

And thanks to that, he saw the line to take to pass Absalon in that rock garden. Freaking insane line!


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

How about the ride by Ralphael Gagne. That was impressive. His best world cup by a significant margin.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

The men's race was similar to the women's race in that respect. The first two places were predictable but the rest of the top ten saw a shake up, most of the usual suspects from the earlier rounds were way back. Along with Raphael Gagne there were riders such as Sergio Mantecon Gutierrez, Dan McConnell (at last! ) and Nicolas Carlos Coloma up there getting decent top 10 placings.

Florian Vogel on his hardtail looked to be climbing ok but he was really struggling on the descents. On the first few laps he was losing lots of time to the lead group. The commentators said it was a full suspension course and it did seem that way.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Raph has had a breakthrough year. He definitely wants to get Olympic qualified. And considering the rough luck that Kabush and Zandstra have been having for not being healthy at the right time, he's looking good for an Olympic spot.



LMN said:


> How about the ride by Ralphael Gagne. That was impressive. His best world cup by a significant margin.


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## serious1 (Jan 11, 2013)

I'm surprised Schurter is sticking with those tubulars. It seems he flats every race. Great World cup so far.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

By far the best race ive seen since 2011 (last years world champs was pretty good) I want fumic to win so bad. Seems like an awesome guy who eould really appreciate it. And damn, can he decend!


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Lap time statistics from the World Cup in Windham - UCI World Cup XCO 5 Windham / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry

Fastest lap was done not by Elite Men, but by U23 Victor Koretzky and Titouan Carod . 
Jenny Rissveds would do really well in the Elite category this time. Almost all her lap times would be among the top elite women's lap times. She also had the most consistent lap times out of all women. Women's race was exceptionally inconsistent lap-time-wise.
Luca Braidot and Jan Nesvadba both jumped 28 positions. In women's category Adelheid Morath jumped 24 positions to the final great 5th place.
Most consistent rider was Ryan Standish of Men U23 category.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Is it me, or did Absalon lost the race because of a tactical mistake? You can see that on the last lap, on the super rocky descent, he took the outside line coming in, giving enough space for Nino to bomb trough. On a couple of previous laps you could see the leader at the moment use that inside line, and if I remember correctly, Absalon used that same line on the penultimate lap when he was leading. 

Mayor shake up at the Top 10. Fumic had superb race, bombing the descents like a madman. I think he was faster than Nino on the downhills. DMC and Mantecon put up a great fight chasing the leaders. WOW for Gagne!!! And that race proved the JA and NS are a couple of level above everyone else. Is Kulhavy back to his old tricks? 

One question...last two races, we have seen women favor hardtails while men FS. Why? Could it be that the women do not take that many risks on the descents? Because some of them could drop a ton of the guys like a bad habit!!!


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

carlostruco said:


> One question...last two races, we have seen women favor hardtails while men FS. Why? Could it be that the women do not take that many risks on the descents? Because some of them could drop a ton of the guys like a bad habit!!!


The lower your power output is the important bike weight is. For a rider who can climb at 250 watts (typical climbing power at the front of the women's field) the extra kilo a FS adds cost about 40s in a race.

Obviously the majority of women don't feel they can get that back on the descents. which for many is true. When you are stuck in traffic you can't really exploit the advantage of an FS.

For men it is different. The front of the field is climb at 350watts or more. At that power output the FS only cost 25s Through out the race, and there is less of a variance in descending skills. Even poor descenders are relatively quick. The FS makes a lot of sense.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

It's also harder to set up a FS for a 105lb woman than it is for a 145lb man.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> It's also harder to set up a FS for a 105lb woman than it is for a 145lb man.


Who ever told you this didn't know what they are talking about.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

LMN said:


> Who ever told you this didn't know what they are talking about.


Ol' Bart Brentjens has said this many times over the years while providing commentary for the WCs.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Le Duke said:


> It's also harder to set up a FS for a 105lb woman than it is for a 145lb man.





Le Duke said:


> Ol' Bart Brentjens has said this many times over the years while providing commentary for the WCs.


And I shake my head every time he does. Back in 96 this was true but now it is no problem what so ever.


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## iheartoregon (Apr 23, 2013)

The commentators don't seem real up to date on technology. They couldn't even figure out how much travel an xc fs bike was running in the rear.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Yeah, I always thought it might be a bit outdated. I mean, there are dozens of threads on MTBR alone from home mechanics talking about altering their shim stacks, air cans, oil volumes/weights, etc.

No reason a professional team mechanic with a direct line to RS, Fox, DT Swiss, Magura, etc. wouldn't be able to get a custom setup, or do it himself with a little bit of research.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Some of that is Rob acting as the audience asking questions. Since that same feed is also used by several TV networks around the world, they have to have someone explain the basic stuff no and again. I think they actually have a director now that prods them to mention or ask certain things.



iheartoregon said:


> The commentators don't seem real up to date on technology. They couldn't even figure out how much travel an xc fs bike was running in the rear.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Take into consideration that they have to explain our tech stuff in a way that people not invloved in our sport are able to understand and can relate to. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

This is the second race in a row in which Rob asked Bart how much rear travel the XC riders have on their full suspension bikes, and the second race in a row in which Bart responded that he did not know. Not impressive. Regarding tech, they appear to be behind the times (or don't care enough to follow these issues). Bart is good at providing insights on rider strategy and stamina issues but doesn't share enough of his knowledge for me. Overall a great race and good commentary though. This is a must-watch for me.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

I actually tweeted at Warner bout Nino's bike having 120mm in the rear since they were all clueless...would have made for good discussion during the race. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

rockyuphill said:


> Some of that is Rob acting as the audience asking questions.


Yeah, and I think he was a little surprised when Bart didn't have an answer about his rear travel question, he kind of ended up answering himself.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Great mens race btw, the best one I've seen.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

zephxiii said:


> I actually tweeted at Warner bout Nino's bike having 120mm in the rear since they were all clueless...would have made for good discussion during the race.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


But it...doesn't.

Nino rides a Spark, but it's set at 100mm front and rear. With custom, non-stock geometry, too.


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## kevocastro (Sep 23, 2011)

Le Duke said:


> But it...doesn't.


I can't recall any XCO elite racer on a 120mm rear travel bike


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Damn didn't realize his was not going to be 120mm like the ones they sell. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## scottg (Mar 30, 2004)

I find Brentjens comical much of the time. 

Warner seems much better informed, but he's clearly supposed to let Brentjens be the exepert - unfortunately Brentjens is either not that bright or just woefully unprepared.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Pinkbike have some good pictures from the Windham races.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/iron-lung-windham-xc-world-cup-2015.html

The rock garden photos were the best I thought but there are lots of nice ones at the link above.

Manuel Fumic overtaking Nino Schurter through the rocks:










Catharine Pendrel at full speed:


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## Surfdog93 (May 30, 2005)

Some different commentators, please.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Maybe they should be given fact sheets. It was pretty appalling that they didn't mention PFP as CX elite champ during the MSA race - and it was obvious they didn't know because they kept marveling that a road champ could transition to MTB. They'd obviously been told between races as they did cover that off during Windham.

Also, for those interested, Neff's 'crash' on the start loop was the result of her pinning in to a line that was announced had been closed to repair the netting but would be open for the race. It wouldn't surprise me if Howard Grotts had the same problem. It caught a few riders out.

Move of the day for me was Catharine leap-frogging 3 positions in one of the few multiple line sections - she's pulled a move like that in at least 3 world cups this year! And had to love Lea Davison confirming on FB that she did indeed have pancakes with maple syrup for breakfast (c'mon, she's from Vermont!).


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## Kiwi19 (Jun 23, 2008)

The problem Bart has about the rear travel question is that he actually knows a lot. He is still racing and he is a team manager. For instance, what front travel was Jaroslav Kulhavy running? If you said 100mm you would be wrong. He runs anything down to 80mm or so. Bart knows that even though officially most of these bikes (if you bought them at a shop) should have 100mm rear travel but these guys run all sorts of set ups, custom set ups. As someone alluded to here Shurters geometry is not what you can buy. This is especially true of the 650b hard tail he rides. It has a steeper head angel and BB30 amongst other changes. They actually did sell small run of these frames (17" only).


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

We're at the end of another World Cup season this weekend, that didn't take long. Next weekend are the World Champs and then we'll have nothing new to post about for months.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Of course we do...we will banter and argue about next season, Olympics, who will Jaro race for next season, who will be the other two Swiss riders at Rio, etc. 

Like with this thread, it will reach 8 pages without the season even starting!!!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Is Kulhavy not signed with Specialized for next year? 

I wonder if he's considering making a move to the road still.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

I could be mistaken, but that is what I read...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Does that look like it might be an USD dropper post? This was on Magura's Facebook page with a Eurobike teaser.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Was that what Matthias Fluckiger was riding?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

That's my guess.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

21 Woodruff, Chloe 331 WC/743 UCI
22 Gould, Georgia 328 WC/710 UCI

I said it earlier in this thread, and I'll say it again: I don't understand how/why you would skip a WC race, unless you were seriously ill, in the run up to the Olympics. Ouch.

Georgia was better than Chloe, head to head, in every WC they raced. Chloe simply toed the line and had a mid-pack finish in one more race.

In theory, USAC can select whoever they want for their two slots. Obviously Lea gets top billing, but would they take Georgia over Chloe? Chloe has more WC points, but Georgia has done better, sometimes significantly so, in the races she's attended. I just don't know how you'd be able to look Chloe Woodruff in the eye and say, "You earned more points, but we're taking Georgia instead."

Correction, and a slight complication:

Apparently the qualification period runs until May 25, 2016.

"_The UCI Olympic Qualification Ranking is a combination of the UCI ranking by nation Cross-country as of 25 May 2015 and 25 May 2016.

The UCI ranking by nation of 25 May 2015 is based on results from 25 May 2014 to 24 May 2015. The UCI ranking by nation of 25 May 2016 is based on results from 25 May 2015 to 24 May 2016."_


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The women's race was likely the one this year with most surprising results and some of the closest racing of the year


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Congrats to Nino!

I was pulling for Julien, but Nino had the answer yet again.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Duke you can look up U.S. Cycling Olympic selection criteria. There is a lot more to it then World Cup ranking. I am not sure World Cup ranking is even a criteria.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

That's how you take the lead in a World Cup with style:


__
http://instagr.am/p/6uhpaTGt9u/


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

That was a cool pass


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Nowdays, if you don't make jumps or have the tech skills like Nino, Fumic and coulple of those other guys, you can loose a race pretty easily. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

Absalon didn't lose the race by not jumping over the BMX-4X section, nor did Schurter, Fumic or Kulhavy win it by jumping over.

Schurter was clearly stronger throughout the season. 
Reason - years adding up, multiplied offspring taking toll, or something else? Who knows.

Looking forward to the Worlds, although Schurter looks unbeatable in this period.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

I think Nino has been racing very smartly, riding behind people to conserve energy etc...and not doing so completely unfairly either as he'll work together with Absalon to get away from the others. 

If there are any little gains in descending quicker, taking the riskier line, or jumping through the air...those are all things Absalon has to make up for in power output. That over time can put a little extra wear on him.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Georgia seems to be a long way off the pace she was riding at in 2012, where she was keeping up with Katarina and Catharine, just missed a win in Windham and of course managed a bronze at the Olympics. It's like she's either lost the drive or has had very bad luck or timing, and I would have to think that US Cycling would look at that change as much as points.



LMN said:


> Duke you can look up U.S. Cycling Olympic selection criteria. There is a lot more to it then World Cup ranking. I am not sure World Cup ranking is even a criteria.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

LMN said:


> Duke you can look up U.S. Cycling Olympic selection criteria. There is a lot more to it then World Cup ranking. I am not sure World Cup ranking is even a criteria.


2016 Games MTB Selection Criteria for US Women:

https://s3.amazonaws.com/USACWeb/forms/selection/16 SOG CYC ATH (MTB) W.pdf

Seems like there is still plenty of fighting left to be done. WC races next spring, and the World Champs as well. Hopefully the US women all improve a bit between now and then. Seems like Lea is knocking on the door.


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## OLx6 (Feb 5, 2011)

Just an observation. The racers, especially at the top level always display a high level of sportsmanship. They shake hands before and after the race. When discussing race tactics they will review how they plan to use a specific strength or strategy. I have yet to hear any bad mouthing of fellow competitors. Yes they are professionals, but I have seen professional athletes in other disciplines (road cycling, triathletes, football, etc) use negative comments (trash talking) about their competition. Am I being naive to think the racers genuinely respect their competition?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Likely because there aren't millions of dollars at stake, MTB racers can afford to keep it real and be friendly with each other.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Rob is good at catching racers while they are still trying to catch their breath after crossing the line


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

the riders are a pretty close group. Most of them get along really well. Those who don't get along have the respect to keep it to themselves.

At the core of it racers are mountain bikers. mountain biking is a very inclusive sport.



OLx6 said:


> Just an observation. The racers, especially at the top level always display a high level of sportsmanship. They shake hands before and after the race. When discussing race tactics they will review how they plan to use a specific strength or strategy. I have yet to hear any bad mouthing of fellow competitors. Yes they are professionals, but I have seen professional athletes in other disciplines (road cycling, triathletes, football, etc) use negative comments (trash talking) about their competition. Am I being naive to think the racers genuinely respect their competition?


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

I added couple of features to the Lap Times Stats from World cups. Filter and once filtered you can compare individual riders as well. Hope it is interesting to anyone. UCI World Cup XCO 6 Val di Sole / World Cup Statistics - MTBCrossCountry


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Well no as it turns out, the Magura post is conventional in construction, it's just wireless. Likely someone at Eurobike will be able to spot an USD dropper post.

Magura's Wireless Electronic Dropper Post - Eurobike 2015 - Pinkbike



Le Duke said:


> Was that what Matthias Fluckiger was riding?


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## Low_Law (Aug 4, 2014)

A little late here but Windham was definitely one of my favorites to watch this year. Fumic was on form and I loved how the race was decided on the downhills ultimately. Those passes were incredible!


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

Why does Nino race with a Garmin? Its not like he races with a PM. Heart rate? Isn't maxed out chasing Julien on the climbs? 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

He has a camera on board also, he doesn't need that for training either 

That is one of the reasons why when Schurter and Absalon cross paths, I root for Absalon. 
No fancy hip hop style promo videos, heroic statements, do or die, train hard play hard, strava posting mentality. No tail whipping, showoffs, sweat dripping or pinnacle snowboarding footage.

He has a few kids, seems like a nice family guy that also is the most successful athlete XC has ever seen, and is aging like a good wine.

Not taking anything from Schurter though, he is as tough as they come, but character wise (character as seen on tv disclaimer), Absalon is much closer to my heart. 

A bit offtopic, this post was better suited for long autumn/winter period.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> Why does Nino race with a Garmin? Its not like he races with a PM. Heart rate? Isn't maxed out chasing Julien on the climbs?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


It's to record the race data to look at and analyse afterwards. Even without heart rate or power the race would still go in his training diary towards his annual totals.

That and to pick up Strava KOMs. Here's Nino Schurter's race from Val di Sole on Strava: 

https://www.strava.com/activities/376294477

He's made Training Peaks files with race power data available in the past, such as this one from 2014:

http://home.trainingpeaks.com/athlete/workout/JH5YYBD2GFBGANFSVEARKY5REA

.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

WR304 said:


> It's to record the race data to look at and analyse afterwards. Even without heart rate or power the race would still go in his training diary towards his annual totals.
> 
> That and to pick up Strava KOMs. Here's Nino Schurter's race from Val di Sole on Strava:
> 
> ...


Given that a ton of this guys race with the lightest set up possible, I don't see why put on a Garmin or a GoPro on race day. Manual entries can be made on Strava and/or Garmin Connect.

Video footage for sponsors? If he's getting paid, well maybe. Same goes for roadies on climbing stages...It just does not make any sense for me to record a race...It's not that different than a training ride with your mates...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I think that's a reflection of the difference in fitness level that Schurter has being 6 years younger than Absalon, that extra weight on the bike doesn't have that big an impact on him now and he's got some savvy marketing people behind him that give him a way to capitalize on those KOM posts and GoPro videos. 

Much like Emily Batty is leveraging the daylights out of her popularity and visibility on the sponsorship and endorsement side with Trek, Red Bull and an Ontario Porsche dealer. Any pro athlete has to make hay while the sun shines.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

carlostruco said:


> Given that a ton of this guys race with the lightest set up possible, I don't see why put on a Garmin or a GoPro on race day. Manual entries can be made on Strava and/or Garmin Connect.
> 
> Video footage for sponsors? If he's getting paid, well maybe. Same goes for roadies on climbing stages...It just does not make any sense for me to record a race...It's not that different than a training ride with your mates...


It looks like Garmin are a minor sponsor of the Scott-Odlo MTB team:

http://www.scott-odlo.com/sponsors/

By having the Garmin on his bike it gets noticed and commented on. I think it probably comes into the same category as the Oakley sunglasses and Sidi shoes that he uses.

GoPro sponsor the UCI World Cup series.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I think any top pro is looking to make smart business decisions in marketing their image. Being savvy with social media is part of that self promotion. Riders offering GoPro clips and GPS data get noticed more, thus attracting more visibility to their sponsors and enhancing their market value.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

ewarnerusa said:


> I think any top pro is looking to make smart business decisions in marketing their image. Being savvy with social media is part of that self promotion. Riders offering GoPro clips and GPS data get noticed more, thus attracting more visibility to their sponsors and enhancing their market value.


Truth be told, I think Claudio Caluori does more for Gstaad-Scott than any of his team's racers.


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## Tips-Up (Sep 22, 2009)

Jolanda Neff is one heck of a racer and great biker. She seems unstable and nuts. Her tactic seems to be go out way too hard, totally blow up, and hope she's got a big enough lead to hold on for a win. She's all over the place. Makes for entertaining races. She's also cute, which helps, but totally crazy!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Go Sam Gaze!
U23 rider on the XCE podium!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Oh, and UCI, cut the "not available in your country" crap on YouTube.
It's not being broadcast here. Online is the only way to see it!


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

NordieBoy said:


> Oh, and UCI, cut the "not available in your country" crap on YouTube.
> It's not being broadcast here. Online is the only way to see it!


Couldn't agree more! It must only be available in Europe (if it's not in the US or NZ). Could hear Rob Warner on the 'best moments' clips so presume they are using Red Bull cameras, so it's weird it wasn't on RBTV. Frustrating!


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

I wouldn't be surprised if it is shown at a later date on Universal Sports in the U.S. I have our directv dvr set to record anything cycling and it has recorded several World Cups...a week or more after they happened. Universal sports is channel 625 I think. 
I'll be trying hola vpn again and hope for the best. It has worked great so far. 

Sent from my KFTHWI using Tapatalk


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## RS VR6 (Mar 29, 2007)

I see this weekends events coming up with a countdown timer on Redbull TV. I have a Roku.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

NordieBoy said:


> Oh, and UCI, cut the "not available in your country" crap on YouTube.
> It's not being broadcast here. Online is the only way to see it!


Here's a link to the 2015 XCE race from 01 September 2015 at Vallnord. Download the file to your computer. It's a 543mb zip file and the 3 hour video is a 360p mp4 format that will play in VLC media player.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6DcTKJdrf_gcmFMMHYtbXRGcU0/view?usp=sharing

The first two hours of the youtube video are there but it is just a UCI technical error broadcast message. Fast forward past the error message to get to the actual race footage.


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## bananajoe (May 15, 2015)

Le Duke said:


> Was that what Matthias Fluckiger was riding?


Some images of his dropper post *here* after 11'33''.

He actually explains that he developed it himself!


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

WR304 said:


> Here's a link to the 2015 XCE race from 01 September 2015 at Vallnord. Download the file to your computer. It's a 543mb zip file and the 3 hour video is a 360p mp4 format that will play in VLC media player.
> 
> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6DcTKJdrf_gcmFMMHYtbXRGcU0/view?usp=sharing
> 
> The first two hours of the youtube video are there but it is just a UCI technical error broadcast message. Fast forward past the error message to get to the actual race footage.


THANK YOU!!! That will do nicely for my Friday evening


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Good one Anton! Sam in 4th too!
Not shabby.


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

Well, taking three WC titles in a "single" year. 

Taking three different discipline WC titles in ones lifetime is a truly extraordinary achievement, but - this, this is beyond talent.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

And at altitude that really hurt everyone else. Frischie was criticizing the UCI for having one lap too many in the women's race with the 1:52 race length, and they did shorten the men's race by one lap.



Goran_injo said:


> Well, taking three WC titles in a "single" year.
> 
> Taking three different discipline WC titles in ones lifetime is a truly extraordinary achievement, but - this, this is beyond talent.


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

I think all the races should average 2 hours, they are getting too short.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

Nino might have won... but Julien has way better hair 

Seriously Nino.... just shave it.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Impressive ride by Pauline. Her technical skills were the class of the field. She was riding stuff that top guys were walking and the guys had a drier course.

Pretty cool to see that technical skills were the deciding factor in both the men's and women's race.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

Awesome ride by Pauline, she was really above the other ones both technically and physically. And having 3 world champs titles at the same time is something that might never repeat again. Nice battles for other positions as well. Shame Catharine couldn't outsprint Gunn-Rita.

Men's race was fun, but the Nino vs Julien battles are starting to get boring to be honest. Glad Cink was there (as a czech fan).

results and lap time stats as usual - UCI MTB WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS - XCO/XCE/XCR/DHI - MTBCrossCountry


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I always thought the last 30 minutes in the 2 hour World Cup races shook up the pack and it made the last lap really interesting as the people that went out too hard would tend to blow up and there could be a lot of lead changes.



rupps5 said:


> I think all the races should average 2 hours, they are getting too short.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

Goran_injo said:


> Well, taking three WC titles in a "single" year.
> 
> Taking three different discipline WC titles in ones lifetime is a truly extraordinary achievement, but - this, this is beyond talent.


Pauline picking out kit every race day morning for the next year, "Hmmm, should I wear the rainbow jersey, or the other rainbow jerset, or maybe this rainbow jersey?" Must make for tough decisions. 



rockyuphill said:


> I always thought the last 30 minutes in the 2 hour World Cup races shook up the pack and it made the last lap really interesting as the people that went out too hard would tend to blow up and there could be a lot of lead changes.


Agreed. It seems no one well and truly blows up any more. Instead, blowing up means dropping a minute on the last lap or two, rather than a spectacular bonk and implosion. That being said, this is a subtle thing for the average spectator who doesn't race themselves. For casual viewers, it is probably more exciting to see the racers going full bore on everything for 90 minutes as opposed to measuring out their energy just a shade more conservatively for another half hour of racing. Lap times - for anyone who doesn't bonk - would probably only fall slightly, especially among the upper tier.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Yeah, in the 90 minute races even when Neff blows up she recovers and comes back. PFP just has established a whole new category for bike riding super heroes with this finish. 

Irina Kalentyeva did very well, and even Sabine Spitz held her own with the youngsters. And of course Gunn-Rita had an amazing performance. Really surprising to see Yana Belomoina take the bronze, that's an amazing jump forward for her season. 

Catharine and Emily were further back than they would have expected I'm sure, their lap times dropped off a minute per lap after lap 1. Georgia Gould was also way off her form of 2012, back in 22nd. And racers that were the first wave of U23 wunderkind racing elite like Elizabeth Osl were way back in 32nd. It looks like the altitude really juggled the finishing order.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

What happened to McConnell?


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

alphajaguars said:


> What happened to McConnell?


Perhaps more importantly given results from earlier in the year, what happened to Kulhavy?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

And Rebecca Henderson DNF'd as well, not a good day for the Aussies.

But Raphael Gagne had a career best 18th place, top North American man. Geoff Kabush was back in 42, not a day he was hoping for either.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Circlip said:


> Perhaps more importantly given results from earlier in the year, what happened to Kulhavy?


They were saying he crashed earlier in practice and had hurt his shoulder and ribs, so he pulled out.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

alphajaguars said:


> They were saying he crashed earlier in practice and had hurt his shoulder and ribs, so he pulled out.


he posted on facebook that the altitude got him and that he enjoyed having beer while watching the men's race


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Having a heck of a time trying to watch the replay. I watched a bit of each race live, but cannot get the replay to play so I can watch the whole race. Anyone else running into issues?


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## CptSydor (Sep 20, 2007)

khardrunner14 said:


> Having a heck of a time trying to watch the replay. I watched a bit of each race live, but cannot get the replay to play so I can watch the whole race. Anyone else running into issues?


Yes, with visitors over this morning, I couldn't watch live, so I stayed away from all media throughout the day and have been trying for the past 8 hours or so to watch the replay with no luck. Have managed to stay unspoiled so for (I carefully looked at this thread to see if anyone else is experiencing problems as well).


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

My dvr recorded the ladies race and I'm watching it now. Universal Sports channel 625 on Directv.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I finally found a note on the Red Bull site to say that the online replays will be available on Sunday Sept 6.

I see Sports Net in Canada is running the XCO men and women's race tonight on cable at midnight and 2AM PDT, so Red Bull likely has a deal where they have to wait until the TV channels can run it first before they can post a replay


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## CptSydor (Sep 20, 2007)

rockyuphill said:


> I finally found a note on the Red Bull site to say that the online replays will be available on Sunday Sept 6.
> 
> I see Sports Net in Canada is running the XCO men and women's race tonight on cable at midnight and 2AM PDT, so Red Bull likely has a deal where they have to wait until the TV channels can run it first before they can post a replay


Thanks.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Makes sense then. Thanks!


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Sounds like they're working on it, but at the moment I can't watch via browser, but have everything except commentary on the Redbull TV app on my TV (sans commentary isn't all bad...)


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Canadian Cyclist World Champs XCO interviews





 Catharine





 Emily





 Raphael


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> I finally found a note on the Red Bull site to say that the online replays will be available on Sunday Sept 6.
> 
> I see Sports Net in Canada is running the XCO men and women's race tonight on cable at midnight and 2AM PDT, so Red Bull likely has a deal where they have to wait until the TV channels can run it first before they can post a replay


The World Championship XC races are available to watch on Redbull.tv now.

Women's Race
Cross Country Finals - Women | UCI MTB and Trials World Championships 2015 | Red Bull TV

Men's Race
Cross Country Finals - Men | UCI MTB and Trials World Championships 2015 | Red Bull TV

Watching Nino Schurter ride that wet muddy off camber roots and rock section on the descent is mind blowing, especially on lap two. It's pure poetry. I could watch just that one bit of the race on repeat all afternoon, it's that good.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Just watched the DH & XCO. Some brilliant stuff there.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Can't believe Nino was the only person I saw clear that off camber section all afternoon. Even other solid tech guys like Fumic and M. Fluckinger fell hard!


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## Low_Law (Aug 4, 2014)

khardrunner14 said:


> Can't believe Nino was the only person I saw clear that off camber section all afternoon. Even other solid tech guys like Fumic and M. Fluckinger fell hard!


it was the highlight of the race! watching him maneuver that bike over those wet roots and rocks flawlessly was a treat. I remember 2nd lap he gapped cinky and abby by a ton just in that couple meter section.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

khardrunner14 said:


> Can't believe Nino was the only person I saw clear that off camber section all afternoon. Even other solid tech guys like Fumic and M. Fluckinger fell hard!


yana belomoina and pauline both cleared that as well, but only once each


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

nya said:


> yana belomoina and pauline both cleared that as well, but only once each


Kalentieva did too I think - maybe not the corner, but she was the first I saw to ride the rest of it. There's a great photo in the pinkbike photo epic of the XC that shows clearly why it was near impossible to ride the low line.

The impressive thing about Nino was getting on to that high line no dabs. He tries things others dismiss, then uses them to win races.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

XCKiwi said:


> Kalentieva did too I think - maybe not the corner, but she was the first I saw to ride the rest of it. There's a great photo in the pinkbike photo epic of the XC that shows clearly why it was near impossible to ride the low line.
> 
> The impressive thing about Nino was getting on to that high line no dabs. He tries things others dismiss, then uses them to win races.


the front wheel handling nino had on this section was amazing, saw some other guys trying, but they almost always ended up on the ground

2 years ago I was spectating on the andorra world cup and it was not technical at all even some riders complained...they managed to make it proper xc track this year, together with the altitude there it is a good one I wouldn't mind seeing more often


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Wonder if Nino running tubular dugasts had anything to do with it?


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

nya said:


> the front wheel handling nino had on this section was amazing, saw some other guys trying, but they almost always ended up on the ground
> 
> 2 years ago I was spectating on the andorra world cup and it was not technical at all even some riders complained...they managed to make it proper xc track this year, together with the altitude there it is a good one I wouldn't mind seeing more often


It sure was spectacular to watch! Even MSA, while still wickedly, severely brutal, isn't what it used to be. It's become more about 'features' while it used to be a crazy tough course everywhere (having ridden 2008 and 2015 courses). Courses are much more weather-proof than they used to be. It makes sense in many ways, but at the same time it's nice to mix it up a bit. It really allows the best to rise to the top. Last years World Champs course was a lot like that. Very natural, easy for the course to interrupt the rhythm of the riders, even the best.

Re tubulars - lower pressure would definitely have helped, in many parts of the course. But there are quite a few riders on tubs. Nino does have that something extra when it comes to riding a bike. He is actually not my favourite rider, but man, respect where it is due!


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Pinkbike pictures:

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/world-championships-xco-andorra-this-is-it-2015.html

In the comments below the article apparently Jaroslav Kulhavy had a broken rib from a practice crash before the race, which was why he started the race but pulled out and didn't finish.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

WR304 said:


> Pinkbike pictures:
> 
> Photo Epic: This Is It - XCO World Championships Vallnord 2015 - Pinkbike
> 
> In the comments below the article apparently Jaroslav Kulhavy had a broken rib from a practice crash before the race, which was why he started the race but pulled out and didn't finish.


he posted on his website and facebook page in czech that he always had troubles with altitude and that he just didn't care enough to race when he is not fighting for top spots


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Yeah, that twisty loamy Coup de Monde singletrack at the east end of MSA, with the drop down and those big elevation changes on the wood bridge have all been bypassed lately in favour of just using the bermed descent out of the woods, that stretch of twisty trail in the woods was really greasy when wet, but I bet the big problem was shooting video for TV in there in varying light conditions, so they deleted it. Too hard to get spectators into it and cameras.

I'd rather see this kind of natural surface challenge than the man made TTF's, especially rock gardens as they are just a way to cause injuries if there's a mistake, you make a mistake on the natural trail surface and you lose time and places, but much less likely to crack a rib or collarbone. Toward the end of the women's race at Vallnord there were lots of non-fatal errors along that little ridge at the top just from racers being tired.



XCKiwi said:


> It sure was spectacular to watch! Even MSA, while still wickedly, severely brutal, isn't what it used to be. It's become more about 'features' while it used to be a crazy tough course everywhere (having ridden 2008 and 2015 courses). Courses are much more weather-proof than they used to be. It makes sense in many ways, but at the same time it's nice to mix it up a bit. It really allows the best to rise to the top. Last years World Champs course was a lot like that. Very natural, easy for the course to interrupt the rhythm of the riders, even the best.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

nya said:


> he posted on his website and facebook page in czech that he always had troubles with altitude and that he just didn't care enough to race when he is not fighting for top spots


I hate when he says stuff like that. Sounds like he is ready to make the move to road riding. He should be very grateful for his sponsors taking his crap.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

nya said:


> he posted on his website and facebook page in czech that he always had troubles with altitude and that he just didn't care enough to race when he is not fighting for top spots


In the Red Bull commentary they said that Jaroslav Kulhavy pulled out due to injury. Perhaps it was just saving face?

Here are some screenshots showing Nino Schurter on Lap 2:

Instead of taking the lower line he stays high and hops the bike over the first roots.










In one movement he then turns the bike in mid air, you can see it on the replay but I couldn't get a screenshot, and rides back onto the lower line, skipping the low section through the corner itself.










The low section through the corner was where everyone else was coming unstuck. Here you can see how Ondrej Cink and Julien Absalon both took that lower outside line into the corner. They had to put a foot down and stop whilst Nino Schurter was able to keep pedalling and open a big gap.


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Ondrej Cink is on Strava. He doesn't have much in the way of rides that are public, the serious training sessions and races aren't available unfortunately.

From the short practice rides with power data at Vallnord you can still get a few insights into how strong he is though. eg:

https://www.strava.com/activities/383473777/power-curve/51

This was mostly a steady warmup but he did do a few short sharp efforts, including up what I think was the steepest climb (the long straight one just after the offcamber descent). Bear in mind this probably wasn't full gas, only somewhere close to it so he would have gone up there harder in the race itself. Ondrej Cinq did it in 51 seconds at an average power of 704 watts / 10.83 w/kg.

For a 1 minute effort (the climb finished after 51 seconds) 10.83 w/kg on a power profile chart would put his short term 1 minute power output in the World Class (International Pro) category. Which is what Ondrej Cink is of course.


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## alphajaguars (Jan 12, 2004)

Hory clap!!!!!!


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Currently there's the Schurter & Absalon show, next great rivalry might be Koretzky & Cooper.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Speaking as a proud Kiwi... that would be AWESOME!!! (geez, how young does Anton look in that first pic?)


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## targnik (Jan 11, 2014)

Nino was awesome in that race!!

Riding a 1x, 650b to boot!!

-------------------------------------------------------------------
'GET OFF MY LAWN!! YA DIRTY HIPPIE!!'


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

NordieBoy said:


> Currently there's the Schurter & Absalon show, next great rivalry might be Koretzky & Cooper.


True...both of them have a year left in U23...

Now, looking into the future, there are two kids who have locked horns also but in the Juniors...Simon Andreassen from Denmark has won twice while Egan Bernal from Colombia has chased him furiously...


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Ever wonder how grueling XC training is at the pro level?.. check out this video. Makes my stomach turn seeing the hell these guys go through.

This was some tech training before worlds. tough job.
Just kidding, they have the best job in the world!




__ https://www.facebook.com/manuel.fumic/posts/886252614762215


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## chewsta (Dec 22, 2009)

Are there full replays available of the world champs XCO and DH races? 
Not sure if its a rights issue, but RedBull.tv doesn't have them available unlike the World Cup races. 

The UCI YouTube channel only has the full replay of the XCE race.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

go to redbull tv. then click live at top , then scroll down abit and click replays.

They still cant make a website that navigates well.

I always go to mtbcrosscountry and select all the vides from there. he has direct links and its an awesome site!


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

They're all there for me - are you on the 'live' tab, and then click the replays button.

Women XC Cross Country Women | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Val di Sole, Italy | Red Bull TV
Men XC Cross Country Men | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Val di Sole, Italy | Red Bull TV
DH (women and men were separate but now consolidated) Downhill Finals | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Val di Sole, Italy | Red Bull TV

XCE is only on youtube.


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## chewsta (Dec 22, 2009)

machine4321 said:


> go to redbull tv. then click live at top , then scroll down abit and click replays.
> 
> They still cant make a website that navigates well.
> 
> I always go to mtbcrosscountry and select all the vides from there. he has direct links and its an awesome site!


That was the first place I looked. Usually it will show the date of the race/events. The last available replace was the round at Val Di Sole. Going to the direct stream page also doesn't show the replay, which it normally does with the WC races.


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## chewsta (Dec 22, 2009)

XCKiwi said:


> They're all there for me - are you on the 'live' tab, and then click the replays button.
> 
> Women XC Cross Country Women | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Val di Sole, Italy | Red Bull TV
> Men XC Cross Country Men | UCI MTB World Cup 2015: Val di Sole, Italy | Red Bull TV
> ...


Those are there, I'm after the replays of the World Champs races at Vallnord Andorra


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

chewsta said:


> Those are there, I'm after the replays of the World Champs races at Vallnord Andorra


Oh sorry!!! I saw 'val' and copied the link with right click.

They were all up there - I've watched them all as replays during the week.

They had some problems in the first couple of days. Maybe they're offline being fixed again or something... I'd check back later.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

It was hard to find. I had to use the search function and "Andorra" would not pull it up but "Championship XCO" did. Shocking that Redbull has such terrific content and then makes it so hard to find on their site.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

So true. I have all the world cup links bookmarked (and offline copies of as many as I've been able to find). It used to be a bit easier, and they used to show a lot more on the page than they do now. Seemed like it went back forever, now it only shows thumbnails of the last 3 months!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I hate HTML 5 websites, and the pandering to cell phone browsers. Navigation of websites has become a horrible mess.

Did you actually find the 2015 Champs, I found the 2014 replays from Norway


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

Here is the address for the women's from my bookmarks. It's not playing for me at the moment though. Men's will be 568 in the address, and dh 565/566 (I think, if nothing else was live in between).

Cross Country Finals - Women | UCI MTB and Trials World Championships 2015 | Red Bull TV


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Yep, no replay offered. Maybe they have to give TV broadcasters a week to run it.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Is there any video of the Trials competition?


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

chewsta said:


> That was the first place I looked. Usually it will show the date of the race/events. The last available replace was the round at Val Di Sole. Going to the direct stream page also doesn't show the replay, which it normally does with the WC races.


not sure why you couldn't find them, but they are either on the main page, or the event's page or here Stream list - MTBCrossCountry


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

zephxiii said:


> Is there any video of the Trials competition?


there are a few 2-3 min videos on uci youtube channel


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

Your links are good, but when i go to the Redbull pages, the video doesn't load. Perhaps there is a regional blocking going on? I'm in Canada. 

I managed to watch the Women's race on the Tuesday and Wednesday and but I haven't been able to get the Men's race and it seems the Women's race is no longer available to me either.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Yeah, something appears for a couple of moments while the page is loading and then it goes blank.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

I'm in NZ and they were playing for me during last week, but weren't when I looked when it came up in the thread on Friday. Still not playing now either.

I've had similar trouble with the 2014 Cairns races. It doesn't load on the redbull.tv site, but I found replays on the redbull.com site. I can't find anything like that for Andorra (just pics, articles, results, short clips).

I presume they'll get it sorted eventually. I hope so!

Usually the races go up on cyclingtorrents pretty quick and I download them from there to have permanent access to them (unlike races from freecaster days that I can no longer watch and haven't found downloads of...). I'm going to have to figure out how to record them as they are streamed.


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## nya (Oct 22, 2011)

I tried to find out why the replays are gone, but without success. 
I know there is a working replay on czech tv - 
Women: MS horských kol 2015 Vallnord: Cross country - ?eny ? iVysílání ? ?eská televize

Men: MS horských kol 2015 Vallnord: Cross country - mu?i ? iVysílání ? ?eská televize

but you might need to use some czech proxy to watch and the commentary is in czech obviously


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## rallymaniac (Oct 12, 2011)

nya said:


> I tried to find out why the replays are gone, but without success.
> I know there is a working replay on czech tv -
> Women: MS horských kol 2015 Vallnord: Cross country - ?eny ? iVysílání ? ?eská televize
> 
> ...


I was able to watch reply of women Championship race on Redbull TV on Roku few days ago. I will try and see if the men's race is there as well but I thought I remember seeing it.


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## jet9rdopilot (Nov 10, 2012)

Cz thread will not play in the US. Still cannot view Vallnord races.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

When I watched that race several weeks ago there was a prominent bolt print statement saying that the race would only be available to watch as a replay for 6 (I think) days.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I wonder how many riders are sweating the retest of older samples

Blaza Klemencic tests positive for EPO | Cyclingnews.com


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

The girl who was constantly tried to cheat at starts (she would hang onto the fence and have both feet clipped in) tests positive, no surprise really. Cheats are cheats. She is not well liked on the circuit, very dirty racer. I suspect there are a lot of WC racers with a bit of smile on their face.

The retesting of old samples is awesome. I don't think there is a stronger message then busting people who thought they got away with it.



rockyuphill said:


> I wonder how many riders are sweating the retest of older samples
> 
> Blaza Klemencic tests positive for EPO | Cyclingnews.com


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## euro-trash (Feb 9, 2008)

rockyuphill said:


> I wonder how many riders are sweating the retest of older samples


No kidding, if they do enough retrospective testing (including the new vitamin T test that nabbed Tommy D) the olympic grid could look a lot different than we are currently envisioning.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Marga Fullana never really returned after her EPO bust in 2010.

Fullana positive for EPO | Cyclingnews.com

Klemencic is 35, this may dent her sponsor appeal.



LMN said:


> The girl who was constantly tried to cheat at starts (she would hang onto the fence and have both feet clipped in) tests positive, no surprise really. Cheats are cheats. She is not well liked on the circuit, very dirty racer. I suspect there are a lot of WC racers with a bit of smile on their face.
> 
> The retesting of old samples is awesome. I don't think there is a stronger message then busting people who thought they got away with it.


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## OLx6 (Feb 5, 2011)

Personally I like the idea of strict testing and reviewing old samples with new technology. IMHO when it comes to performance enhancing drugs you should strictly ban and test staying up to date with the best practices. My concern would be that specific teams could find a way to beat some test and win with an unfair advantage. I would hate to see the racer with the best doctor winning.


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## moab63 (Dec 29, 2003)

If you know anything human performance, you know many of this 35+ year old performances are suspect. Yes a few people can, because they were exceptional to begin with. What I really dislike, is that they take away the opportunity from the young kids coming up. Getting sponsor deals to cheat.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

I'm all for catching cheaters, but using old samples requires a very clear chain of custody of the samples covering the entire period of storage and eliminating any possibility of tampering/switching/contamination of samples. Old samples create more opportunity for screw-ups or monkey business, and it would be much, much more difficult for an innocent athlete to defend against a false positive result from an old sample.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

J-Flo said:


> I'm all for catching cheaters, but using old samples requires a very clear chain of custody of the samples covering the entire period of storage and eliminating any possibility of tampering/switching/contamination of samples. Old samples create more opportunity for screw-ups or monkey business, and it would be much, much more difficult for an innocent athlete to defend against a false positive result from an old sample.


Beyond some ridiculous tin foil hat theories that were (unsuccessfully) put forward in a scattershot approach by the defendants in some very high-profile doping cases in the past, I'm not aware of any instance in which it was actually proven that samples were maliciously switched or tampered with. Feel free to post up if you can cite anything to contradict this - I'm always up for learning something new.

While chain of custody issues were more problematic in the past, I suspect in recent years procedures have been tightened up considerably. My only reason for saying this is that my casual recollection of cases in which chain of custody and integrity of samples was challenged seemed to be much more frequent in the past, but rarely seems to come up any more.

I'll go with the concept to retest as much as is practical, and run the dopers out of the sport. Good riddance.

One also might suspect that most retesting isn't necessarily random, and instead that some other evidence/information has come to the attention of a NADO which gives them some reason to suspect an athlete. A bit of random retesting might be a good deterrent also, but that's probably too expensive to do on a large scale.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

Circlip said:


> Beyond some ridiculous tin foil hat theories that were (unsuccessfully) put forward in a scattershot approach by the defendants in some very high-profile doping cases in the past, I'm not aware of any instance in which it was actually proven that samples were maliciously switched or tampered with. Feel free to post up if you can cite anything to contradict this - I'm always up for learning something new.
> 
> While chain of custody issues were more problematic in the past, I suspect in recent years procedures have been tightened up considerably. My only reason for saying this is that my casual recollection of cases in which chain of custody and integrity of samples was challenged seemed to be much more frequent in the past, but rarely seems to come up any more.
> 
> ...


I wish I had your faith in the system. UCI hadn't exactly won any medals (pun intended) for its anti-doping program prior to its recent shaming by USADA. I don't have any specific citations for you but just have to note that chain of custody/sample integrity is an issue with using old samples in particular. This is not an idle concern; the issue comes up with some regularity in police crime lab cases. Of course we all remember Mark Furman and the bloody glove. And every so often a seemingly well-run crime lab/evidence room turns out to be a sh!t show. I just hope they manage to run an airtight program with precise procedures so that when they finger an athlete as a doper, there is no room for doubt.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

J-Flo said:


> I wish I had your faith in the system. UCI hadn't exactly won any medals (pun intended) for its anti-doping program prior to its recent shaming by USADA. I don't have any specific citations for you but just have to note that chain of custody/sample integrity is an issue with using old samples in particular. This is not an idle concern; the issue comes up with some regularity in police crime lab cases. Of course we all remember Mark Furman and the bloody glove. And every so often a seemingly well-run crime lab/evidence room turns out to be a sh!t show. I just hope they manage to run an airtight program with precise procedures so that when they finger an athlete as a doper, there is no room for doubt.


I wouldn't trust anything about the UCI's anti-doping measures. It's all up the the NADOs, national federations, and WADA now to see if anti-doping gets a better foothold. Unfortunately, the national federations may have varying levels of motivation or intent, from one country to another, so there's no guarantee it's a level playing field for the athletes. That's not an excuse though, if an athlete decides they can't reconcile with the lack of level playing field, they should find something else to do with their lives (unfortunate, but realistic). If they choose stay in sport, but choose the darker path to performance then I hope they get the book thrown at them.

Your point about integrity of evidence in crimincal/police cases is well taken, but if you think about this more carefully, the process in anti-doping sample collection and testing is orders of magnitude more controlled and defined, compared to criminal evidence which has many more variables to deal with.

As I asked before, if anyone can cite an athletic anti-doping case that had an element of verified or proven malicious, or even accidental, switching or tampering of samples, I'd like to hear about it. The only issues of contamination I've ever heard of in this context are related to commercial products that were not produced in a "clean" process by the manufacturer. In these cases, the WADA code of strict liability is clear. Professional athletes know they are responsible for anything they ingest, even if the manufacturer had some cross-contamination in production.

A few select companies guarantee no cross-contamination. if being a pro rider was my vocation, you can be sure these would be the only products I would use. Anyone who chooses to go off script in terms of the products they use, that's their problem. That being said, there have been a couple of cases in which the athlete was given a reprieve when they were able to secure sealed samples of the suspect product from the same marked production run, and prove that the offending substance was not on the list of contents i.e. cross-contamination. With retroactive testing that is certainly more difficult for the athlete to do, but again these rare were exceptions and the status quo is strict liability even if it's manufacturer cross-contamination.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

moab63 said:


> If you know anything human performance, you know many of this 35+ year old performances are suspect.


Blaza is dirty that is obvious.

Blaza's results were all over the place, but so are results of riders who I know are clean. Her pedaling technique is awful but other girls who are as fast and clean also have horrible technique (few as bad as her though).

By any measure I am an expert on women's XC racing. What is that you know about human performance that makes her stand out as a doper?


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## Low_Law (Aug 4, 2014)

This is a great topic. I also am very curious about this kind of thing.

You have to wonder about guys like Absalon and Hermida who are 35 and 39 and think about when they'll be retiring. Obviously Absalon doesn't have the snap in his legs that he used to, as he just cannot respond to Nino's attacks. It's the same story - he eventually bridges to Nino and then Nino puts out an insane attack that he can't answer to. 

Then guys like Hermida - does he realize he's getting older? He's obviously still able to compete in the top 20 but I don't see him cracking the top ten again. Naef did it right - retiring at 35, and leaving on a pretty high note with a podium and some top tens. I also wonder about Todd Wells too, he's 40 and still doing ok at a national level (he probably would have won STXC nats if he didn't flat) but he'll probably bow out shortly as well.

Obviously it's all personal/sponsoral preference and genetics, because even guys like Naef and Hermida (and obviously Absalon) are outliers. Also, it seems to me that XC ability really peaks at around 30-31. Nino's about in that zone, and you gotta wonder if he'll be a long laster like Absalon. 

Then, of course: do they dope? I've always sort of wondered about Absalon, as he seems like more of peloton grand tour rider than a mtb'r. Nino as well... he's just so so so so so so consistent. The only time he lost this year due to fitness was Nove Mesto, and even then he may have been "sick" (or Jaro could have just been the better man that day). 

Anyway, there's a swath of factors to consider and it's all conjecture on my part. Any insight from anyone? I'd love to hear some from more experienced/knowledgeable people.


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## moab63 (Dec 29, 2003)

Well is already answered. Many racers at the world level seem to have up and results. I suspect is due to the stress of traveling, foods and many other variables. I know you are an expert, on women XC. The Chinese come to mind?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

moab63 said:


> Well is already answered. Many racers at the world level seem to have up and results. I suspect is due to the stress of traveling, foods and many other variables. I know you are an expert, on women XC. The Chinese come to mind?


I didn't like this line"If you know anything human performance". Statements like that paint clean riders as dirty riders for the crime of being crazy fast. Really very few know anything human performance. And even fewer know about elite female mountain biker performance

-Vo2 max to win?
-Average watts/kg to win?
-Technical skill level?
-Tactical skill level?
-Role of equipment?

Very few, like probably three people in North America actually know that information.

The effect of age is another one we know very little about. Traditionally late 20s and early 30s was peak and I think for an athlete who has been racing since they were a teenager this is still true. But those who entered the sport a little bit later, often have later peaks and can go for quite a bit longer. Everybody talks about Gunrita's age, but what they miss is she has been racing for less then 20 years. For many they by the time they turn 35 they are at 20 years of racing.

I have a pretty good idea of what the top possible clean level of performance is for female racers. Catharine has been riding near the front or at the front of the world cup fields since 2009. IMHO there hasn't been a single race in which the win was "out of this world"

All of us were suspicious of the Chinese, they would be so fast and then so slow. And China doesn't have a great reputation, but then again neither does, Canada, US, France, Italy, Germany, Austria, Britain, Australia, Russia, ...... But I know in Houffalize 2009 Catharine climbed away from Ren, when Ren was full on the gas (Catharine was later dropped by Marga FYI). The Chinese were probably poorest trained riders in the entire field. There massive variation in form can be easily be explained by their horrible training.

Despite Blaza, I still think that the women's field mainly clean. I think those who are winning are doing it clean. I could be wrong, but for me there isn't anything that stands out.

Honestly, I think the same about the mens. I don't have nearly the knowledge of mens racing that I do of women racing. However, Kabush won one clean, and had a lot of very good results in his prime. Guys like Nino and Absalon have just massive engines, I am sure their Vo2 are all over 85. Engines like that are rare, and they can dominate. Especially since many of riders of similar talent level get pulled over the road, Sagan for example.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Take a look at Catharine's thoughts on this:

Catharine Pendrel LUNA


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Certainly there's been examples in the not too distant past where some nation's teams have supported doping (all sorts of sports, not just cycling). Unsanctioned sanctioned doping. And the debacle of organized roadie doping showed how deep it can go when there's big money and or sponsor prestige involved.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

LMN said:


> Take a look at Catharine's thoughts on this:
> 
> Catharine Pendrel LUNA


Nice. We need as many athletes as possible coming out publicly with strong and unambiguous statements against doping.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Quite a few racers are saying it straight on Twitter

@GeoffKabush Sep 19
Saving samples for future improved testing is great deterrent. Anyone else nervous? Not me. #RaceCleanOwnYourVictory

‏@gouldgeorgia Sep 19
Good to hear that old samples are being re-tested. I hope all the cheaters are caught.

@KatieFnCompton Sep 19
So glad to hear they're testing past samples. Wonder how many will get caught now? 

‏@AlisonSydor Sep 19
Retrospective EPO test: approx 400 bucks - a pro sports career raced with a clear conscience: priceless 

@adammorka Sep 19
I get criticized for posting anti-doping messages but once you know limitations of physiology, you immediately realize how many are....

@adammorka Sep 19
This is stealing from other racers. It's brutal and low life. Blaza tests positive for EPO


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Quite good coverage.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Well they finally talked about Neff in the road race... failing to mention her 2x World Cup Overall etc. Someone had to tweet at the commentators to educate them about how her and Pauline battle it out etc. lol.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Man what awesome races!!! 

The women's race was awesome and worrisome... Pauline gets crashed out but gets back on and up front again. Then her and Neff get left behind in the Peloton for what seems like forever...but then the Peloton charges back and reels the lead group back in...and then Neff and Pauline end up in the final breakaway group and sprint. 

I was just freakin happy to see Neff up there in that final sprint with her full finger gloves (ha) along with Pauline (and ironically right behind her), awesome!

And Peter Sagan's charge was pretty awesome!! I watched the replay and was not even expecting this kind of finale! 

MOUNTAIN BIKERS REPRESENT !! 


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Im sorry, did i miss a mtb race? I thought the season was done


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

It's just some people trying to push the 29- wheel size for skinny bikes.


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Probably wont catch on. If i know one thing about the bike industry, it hates new trends.


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## Tips-Up (Sep 22, 2009)

Any links to watch the world championships?

Still not getting the MTB worlds to work either. Anyone had success?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Just highlights













Tips-Up said:


> Any links to watch the world championships?
> 
> Still not getting the MTB worlds to work either. Anyone had success?


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Was it covered by redbull.tv?


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

It was, but they pulled it after the event. I'm assuming due to NBC Universal having TV rights and the UCI being douches in general.


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## J-Flo (Apr 23, 2012)

It was pretty exciting. On the last lap as breakaway after breakaway was getting caught, I asked "What about Sagan? Isn't he in this race too?" The commentators did not notice him until he blasted into the lead on the final climb. What a machine he is.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

J-Flo said:


> It was pretty exciting. On the last lap as breakaway after breakaway was getting caught, I asked "What about Sagan? Isn't he in this race too?" The commentators did not notice him until he blasted into the lead on the final climb. What a machine he is.


That was awesome race.

The win by Sagan was sweet. Attack at the hardest moment of the race, grow the gap on the descent and the hang on for dear life at the end. Watching him die a thousand deaths in the last 600m was priceless.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

LMN said:


> Watching him die a thousand deaths in the last 600m was priceless.


He looked like he was hurting really badly in the finale, but hey that's what it takes to win a world championship. He'd already done the necessary damage, and the riders coming back to him at the front of the chase were no doubt in their own world of hurt by that time too. Usually a bit more luck involved in how the race plays out between the various national squads and individual ambitions, but Sagan riding with virtually no team manufactured his own luck in this edition. Nicely done. I suspect all that pain was nothing but a fleeting memory as soon as he crossed the line.


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

Absalon racing EWS this weekend at Finale Ligure!


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Grapevine is the EWS this weekend is hilly. Like XC race hilly.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Remy, not Julien

ABSALON, Remy : MEN : FRA : St Nabord : Scott SR Suntour Enduro : FRA.RABS

http://www.enduroworldseries.com/downloads/italy/Seeding List.pdf



Circlip said:


> Absalon racing EWS this weekend at Finale Ligure!


It does look madly hilly on Day 1

Enduro World Series


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

rockyuphill said:


> Remy, not Julien
> 
> ABSALON, Remy : MEN : FRA : St Nabord : Scott SR Suntour Enduro : FRA.RABS
> 
> http://www.enduroworldseries.com/downloads/italy/Seeding List.pdf


No...

Julien

Photo Epic: Tornado Waiting - Enduro World Series, Round 8 - Finale Ligure - Pinkbike

Who, unlike bro Remy that is a regular on the EWS circuit, will not be on the seeding list.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Well there ya go. Schurter would likely be damn good at Enduro as well, the rivalry could expand. 

I see Rocky has one of their factory XC racers there as well, Andréane Lanthier Nadeau, she finished 4th overall last week in Ainsa


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## WR304 (Jul 9, 2004)

Did Julien Absalon ride the EWS round? How did he do? I couldn't see his name in the results:

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/results-enduro-world-series-round-8-finale-ligure-2015.html

Mathias Fluckiger was 45th


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

WR304 said:


> Did Julien Absalon ride the EWS round? How did he do? I couldn't see his name in the results:
> 
> Final Results: Enduro World Series Round 8, Finale Ligure - Moseley and Barel Announce Retirement - Pinkbike
> 
> Mathias Fluckiger was 45th


Looks like (Julien) Absalon decided to take a pass after spending some some out on the course on the practice day. Absalon has always struck me as a very efficient descender in the XC context, although conservative in the sense of staying within his own boundaries. You don't win as much as he has without being pretty capable on the downhill too, even if that's not one of his primary tools for winning races.

Another XC racer Evan Guthrie (not as accomplished in XC - yet - as Fluckiger) squeaked into top 25 of those EWS results, plus Adam Craig a few places ahead of that although I'm not sure we can refer to Craig as an active XC competitor at this point in time.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

With the weather conditions, I don't blame any of the non-regulars if they pulled out.


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## carlostruco (May 22, 2009)

LMN said:


> That was awesome race.
> 
> The win by Sagan was sweet. Attack at the hardest moment of the race, grow the gap on the descent and the hang on for dear life at the end. Watching him die a thousand deaths in the last 600m was priceless.


Isn't this what Nino does?


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Sagan's attack was dramatic and pretty freakin' awesome. My GF even got into it and she thinks I'm a big dork for being into cycling lol.


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## csteven71 (Jan 15, 2009)

Looks like Nino became a dad this week! Maybe this is the relief that Julien needed.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Another World Cup champ has been born


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

WADA report says Russian government complicit in doping, coverups - CBC Sports - Track and Field

I'd be surprised if this was limited to track & field only...


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

zippinveedub said:


> Looks like Nino became a dad this week! Maybe this is the relief that Julien needed.


Maybe the playing field is leveled out abit more lol.


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## ewarnerusa (Jun 8, 2004)

So I suppose this should be for a new World Cup 2016 thread, but Eva Lechner has signed with Luna Chix for 2016. 
Lechner signs with Luna, thanks Colnago Team for past support - News Shorts | Cyclingnews.com
I've always liked her, particularly because she rides such high level cyclocross as well. Does this mean she'll be spending more time in the US?


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## NóiNPO (May 21, 2014)

Does anybody know were i can find the Replay of world champs in Andorra?


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Redbull has been very stingy this year with the replays. I think WC might have some replay rights issue as it hasnt been available for awhile.

I was hoping to watch from the beginning but only a couple later races were working.

But if looking for any races, I always use MTBCrossCountry. Really great site and he makes it super easy to find the races. Redbulls site is STILL brutal.


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## euro-trash (Feb 9, 2008)

NóiNPO said:


> Does anybody know were i can find the Replay of world champs in Andorra?


50 minute highlight show:


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## NóiNPO (May 21, 2014)

machine4321 said:


> Redbull has been very stingy this year with the replays. I think WC might have some replay rights issue as it hasnt been available for awhile.
> 
> I was hoping to watch from the beginning but only a couple later races were working.
> 
> But if looking for any races, I always use MTBCrossCountry. Really great site and he makes it super easy to find the races. Redbulls site is STILL brutal.


Forgot to mention i'm talking about the DH race ️

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Whats DH.......I kid. No idea where to find them. If you are patient, you can go to the live tab on redbull and go back on replays as far as they will let you, might find it in there.


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## JoelGuelph (May 20, 2010)

Is anyone leaving Luna? That's a strong team!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Likely replacing Katerina Nash for the World Cup series, since she wanted to stay closer to home.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Aw I met Nash at Iceman last month...she is cute. 

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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

JoelGuelph said:


> Is anyone leaving Luna? That's a strong team!


Nope. I even think Katerina is going to be racing World Cups again this year.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

WC races beyond the two North American races? That's cool. She was just hitting her stride when she retired and then has been doing well in CX races.



LMN said:


> Nope. I even think Katerina is going to be racing World Cups again this year.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

ewarnerusa said:


> So I suppose this should be for a new World Cup 2016 thread, but Eva Lechner has signed with Luna Chix for 2016.
> Lechner signs with Luna, thanks Colnago Team for past support - News Shorts | Cyclingnews.com
> I've always liked her, particularly because she rides such high level cyclocross as well. Does this mean she'll be spending more time in the US?


Here is Eva's release - it sounds like she will be basing herself in the US. I think this is such an exciting move, both for Eva and Luna.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

machine4321 said:


> Redbull has been very stingy this year with the replays. I think WC might have some replay rights issue as it hasnt been available for awhile.
> 
> I was hoping to watch from the beginning but only a couple later races were working.
> 
> But if looking for any races, I always use MTBCrossCountry. Really great site and he makes it super easy to find the races. Redbulls site is STILL brutal.


I wondered if anyone else had noticed the older races are no longer working. I have them all bookmarked for when I feel like rewatching a race. Fortunately I have a lot downloaded, but it's hard to get many of the older ones. There are a few races (XC and/or DH) that have a full replay link through the 'stories' pathway, but it's hard to find them. Here is Cairns 2014 if anyone was planning to watch again before the World Cup in April Replay: UCI XCO World Cup from Cairns - Video | Red Bull Bike
Both XC and DH are on there.

I would LOVE to find a copy of 2015 worlds. Highlight shows just don't do it for me.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Red Bull's website navigation looks like it was designed by someone on waaaay too much Red Bull. Here's the links to the 2015 World Cup series (no World Champs). If you search for 2014 on their redbull.com website you can find some stuff but it is all hit or miss.

UCI MTB World Cup XCO 2015 | Red Bull TV

UCI MTB World Cup DH 2015 | Red Bull TV


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## Goran_injo (Jul 4, 2007)

They offer the highlights on your links, which are not as good (or the same) as live replay.

They need to get their act together and offer a link repository. Cycling fans page tries to assemble them, but sometimes even red bull does not provide them at all.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Yeah, even the replays have turned into just highlights. This likely means that they keep an eye on the viewing stats of the full replays and if the demand isn't high they just dump the full replays. Which is sad, the least they could do is offer a year end DVD collection of all the races in the season, as there's no other video history of these races.

The UCI Youtube channel only has highlight clips too

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7NFlV830crNw76ewQr7CrCAl5MIKtYBW


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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

Weird, I figured I, alone would keep the viewing numbers up as I normally watch it when I go to bed. but they messed it all up for me this year.


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## zephxiii (Aug 12, 2011)

Not DVD, bluray. I saw some high bitrate footage of some of the races and it was awesome. 

I want that. 

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## machine4321 (Jun 3, 2011)

I have valde sole and world champs on my pvr. Its way better. But have to get through commercials and they do edit abit for time. 

In canada, sports net carries them but they are at weird times and dont repeat. I will have to male an effort to remember to record them all next year.


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

machine4321 said:


> Weird, I figured I, alone would keep the viewing numbers up as I normally watch it when I go to bed. but they messed it all up for me this year.


I thought I would too!!! I watched them so much I organised the bookmarks (year, round, location, gender).


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

rockyuphill said:


> Yeah, even the replays have turned into just highlights. This likely means that they keep an eye on the viewing stats of the full replays and if the demand isn't high they just dump the full replays. Which is sad, the least they could do is offer a year end DVD collection of all the races in the season, as there's no other video history of these races.
> 
> The UCI Youtube channel only has highlight clips too
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7NFlV830crNw76ewQr7CrCAl5MIKtYBW


I think freecaster used to do that, didn't they? Just highlights, but I do remember seeing DVDs for sale.

Why can't they just make downloads available, user pays? (Or at the very least, put a note on the pages where replays no longer work so we can see it's not a glitch.)


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## XCKiwi (Jan 26, 2010)

machine4321 said:


> I have valde sole and world champs on my pvr. Its way better. But have to get through commercials and they do edit abit for time.
> 
> In canada, sports net carries them but they are at weird times and dont repeat. I will have to male an effort to remember to record them all next year.


If you able/inclined to upload/make available a digital copy of Worlds I would be ETERNALLY grateful!!!


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