# What are some dj bikes that would make decent xc bikes?



## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

Something I can raise the seat up on and ride 10-15 miles on. I still want it to handle like a DJ bike though. What do ya think?

I have some thoughts on this now on what I'd do with the bike to make it work with xc:

- two seats, one with a longer seatpost, that I can swap. One probably being a smaller seat.
- tires would be trail tires that also work well in street conditions. (26 inch tires btw)
- I think I'd really like a setup with 2 gears in front and one in back (not sure how the numbers work yet, is this described as 2x1?)
- The shifter would be on the right handle simply for my convenience

The only thing I'm concerned about is the general shape/geometry of dj bikes and which frame I should choose. If there's anything else I need to consider please let me know.


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## jmmUT (Sep 15, 2008)

A lot of it depends on your size. The most important thing is that the top tube is long enough or you will be cramped and get back pain.But your best bet is either look for older DJ bikes before they got all BMX-y like Santa Cruz Chameleons or old (2004-2005) P series. Or look at AM style bikes like the Jamis Komodo. Also consider weight. As for tires, there are a lot out there that work for hard pack dirt and street such as Kenda Small Block 8s and Intense Microknobbies that will still give you some traction. 
You probably don't want to do two gears up front and one in back. You will still have to run a chain tensioner in the back but it will be more complicated. You might as well run a couple gears in back with or without a shifter.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

I see. So I'm still interested in this, but I have the issue that my main riding is xc, and I don't think it'd be a wise idea to get a bike that's just not suitable for it. Do you or anyone else have any good ideas? I'm looking for a HT bike that's good for xc, but I really want it to be something good for jumping and stuff. I suppose if I can get a high-flying xc bike I can hold off for a while and get something like a trials bike in the future.


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## ah51416 (Jul 23, 2010)

How good is the Komodo for DJ and urban riding. I wouldn't mind adding one to my stable because I can get an awesome deal. I don't think that I DJ enough to get a dedicated bike thats gonna cost me more than I need to spend. I would like something that I could hit dirt jumps and pedal around as well.


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## mattty (Feb 26, 2009)

I think your'e looking for an All Mountain hardtail... here are a few All MTN frames I (Stout Bikes) have made and here is a thread with list of other companies that make such animals

http://stoutbikes.blogspot.com/2011/01/allens-stout-phantom-all-built-up-looks.html

http://stoutbikes.blogspot.com/2010/10/blog-post.html

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=600870

Not all of them are made with jumping in mind, but the general idea is a "freerideable" trail bike


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## wisbike (May 16, 2008)

ah51416 said:


> How good is the Komodo for DJ and urban riding. I wouldn't mind adding one to my stable because I can get an awesome deal. I don't think that I DJ enough to get a dedicated bike thats gonna cost me more than I need to spend. I would like something that I could hit dirt jumps and pedal around as well.


I have an 08 Komodo 2 that I use exclusively for DJ...it is awesome geo for me. I'm 6'3" 195ish and I have a medium.

I wouldn't want to pedal it though, geo wouldn't be that great for it. If you're tall, this is an awesome bike for DJ because it's not too cramped like every other DJ is but it still has good geo.

A word of caution, the components on this bike are junk. I have a DJ 1 fork which is awesome, however the wheels/brakes/shifters/derailleurs/handlebars/grips/stem suck. literally the only thing stock on mine is the fork and frame, the rest is junk. the wheels were out of true every ride, the brakes are not something I would trust outside of DJing, shifting was sloppy and personally i'm a sram guy.

I love my Komodo, but not for pedaling.

Personally, I wouldn't get a multi-use bike. I don't think they accel and anything, they are just decent at a lot....and I don't like that.get a DJ, then get a hardtail for pedaling. It costs more, but you will get better at each type of riding because you ahve the right bike, not just one that will do.


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## ah51416 (Jul 23, 2010)

I found a used 09 eastern night train on cl for $600. Is that a good deal?


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

I'm currently building up an Arrow DSS as a 1x8 DJ/fun bike.
I've got both 24" wheels and 26" wheels for it.
While it won't make an XC race bike I dont think I'd have any problem knocking of 20+ miles of single track on it (besides maybe the tallish gearing)


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## jmmUT (Sep 15, 2008)

ah51416 said:


> I found a used 09 eastern night train on cl for $600. Is that a good deal?


If it's in good condition, then yes. They msrp between 1,000-1,400. Great bikes too. I ride one myself now and it's my favorite DJ bike so far.


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## lew242 (Aug 7, 2008)

Basically a good DJ bike will not make an ideal XC bike. The geometry is different and the low top tube on DJ bikes means you cannot raise the seat high enough for efficient pedaling. XC bikes are just not good in the air they seem to do odd stuff, also all their parts are light and weak which means they aren't ideal.

Also the DJ bike size means you will feel cramped up. Although if you want a cardio workout with what some would call trail or light AM with jumps it might be fun but inefficient. Don't expect to keep up with FS bikes on the hard steep stuff or XC bikes on the climbs.

Personally I'd get a SC Chameleon or a Ragley Blue pig/mmbop etc, with longer 140-150mm travel AM/FR forks and run it on XC/AM/ light DJ. Those FR hardtails will always jump better than an XC bike.


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## one piece crank (Sep 29, 2008)

Size and geometry have everything to do with it. About two years ago I built this type of bike. I had been dreaming of a Banshee Scratch for a couple years and was lucky to pick-up probably the last '08 Large frame. I built it up SS, with 24's and DH tires. I'm 6'4"/230 and get proper leg extension via a Thompson post. I run a ~80mm stem and 3" bars.

Let me tell you, this is my goto bike. I love it! I've ride everywhere from the skatepark to 40-milers. Is it a trade-off, yes. Do I miss anything from an XC bike, no. This is like a big BMX bike without the cramped feeling, comfort for all day comfort, or drop the seat to play.

Tom P.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

Actually I saw a banshee frame while googling that looked like it had a lot of potential for what I want. Do you have any more information on this? I wouldn't want a large frame though, but it sounds like it might be hard for me to get one of these, and I didn't see the frame I found for sale.


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## pebbles (Jan 13, 2009)

This is great for XC! Not as efficient, but way more fun in twisty stuff. I'm always smiling on this bike.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

Cool, but I'd want to go with a HT.


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## j.les (Jun 8, 2008)

Shayne said:


> I'm currently building up an Arrow DSS as a 1x8 DJ/fun bike.
> I've got both 24" wheels and 26" wheels for it.
> While it won't make an XC race bike I dont think I'd have any problem knocking of 20+ miles of single track on it (besides maybe the tallish gearing)


I used to own that frame. One of the best bikes I have ever ridden (met the owner Gus at Interbike as well - nice guy). The thing railed, and was so stable. It rocked on the single track, I had a 50mm stem and a full length seatpost. Raising the seat all the way up to get proper leg extension made it just the right reach to the bars for trail riding. I ended up selling it because the 23.6" top tube was just a bit too long for dirt jumping.

O.P. - you should look into the Transition Bank. It's what I ride now and I love it. It can be set up as a SS or geared. 16" chainstay length is what I prefer - I really don't whip the bike around or ride skateparks.


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## mattty (Feb 26, 2009)

Again, i can make a frame with the same geometry out of steel, but here is the frame Brian Lopes has raced 4X on, and is an excellent, super-light option...

http://www.ibiscycles.com/bikes/tranny/


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## mattty (Feb 26, 2009)

3.1 lbs is light... I have seen racers jump really big dirt jumps on carbon fiber frames, but if your doing serious gaps (8-15ft by 10-15 high) carbon's obviously not the best choice.

heres a pic of lopes' actual bike:

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/_CAXB2T0FEzk/SMFQDWst2HI/AAAAAAAABJc/ST0XSIz5Jm4/s1600-h/ibisfront1.png


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

sick, but I don't want to spend that kind of money on a frame alone. Can anyone link me to anything that Shayne is talking about?


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## kamikazee ideki (Jul 2, 2007)

What you really want is something along the lines of this:








This bike charges....
BTW, 10 to 15 mile xc rides are nothing, you could most likely do them without sitting if you wanted. As for the bike, pretty much take your preference of alloy dirt jump frame, (mines a Giant STP - light and decent geo) add a sensible parts spec and your set. For tires go for something like crossmarx - fast rolling but still have decent grip on dry xc trails.


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## mattty (Feb 26, 2009)

+1 STP

That seat angle is steeper than most DJ bikes: 74 deg (allows the post higher and not undesirably far back like most other dj frames)

Ive ridden the 23"TT and they're super roomy


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## washingtonripper13 (Jan 23, 2011)

yah the stp is a great bike and it will climb like mad(for a DJ)


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## Fungazi (Mar 31, 2005)

Mountain Cycle Rumble is pretty much exactly targeted at this purpose. I like mine a lot.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

hm... how is the 2010 model of that MCR? there's one up for ...

http://www.adrenalinebikes.com/storeg.cfm?do=DetailProduct&productid=78942

If it's still up does that sound like a good buy?


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

oh i see, that's for the frame alone. didn't make it sound like it.


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## eauxgod (Jun 15, 2004)

*MC Rumble*

:thumbsup:


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## alexhusby12 (Aug 17, 2007)

you need a santa cruz chameleon


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## Monkey Balls (Feb 21, 2011)

I have ridden 40 miles on my black market 357(2009) I run a 330mm post and slam it for dj and raise it all the way for distance.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

The Steely looks pretty sweet actually. If I got a dj bike of some kind it'd probably be that. (kona)


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## cmc4130 (Jan 30, 2008)

This 2010 DK Asterik for example is jumpable, but still has a decently tall seat tube:









https://shop.dkbicycles.com/2010-DK-Asterik-Cyan-Blue/dp/B004EK8LWQ?traffic_src=froogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_source=froogle

typical setup on a Blackmarket MOB:


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## Clifton (Feb 24, 2006)

I'm looking for the same sort of thing. I am 5'10" with a 30" inseam (32" from crotch to ground). 

I am a downhiller originally, but there aren't any good trails nearby. I'm wanting something I can take to the local skatepark but ride comfortably to and from work (3 miles each way). I don't know of any local dirt jumps but hope to find/build some. 

I was looking at a 2008 Jamis Komodo 2, 2009 Kona Five-0 (14" size), or a 2009 GT Ruckus DX. All three bikes were $700-$750. I was about to buy the GT because I found a coupon code but didn't because it was a 12.2" seat tube. I was afraid it would pedal to and from work horribly. I want to make sure it'll do well on the trail because that may be all I get to use it for.


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## d_wrek (Apr 16, 2009)

The Kona Steely or Kona Shred would both be decent choices. I have a Kona Shred mostly for hanging out at Ray's, but I can raise the seat and ride it comfortably.


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## mmik (Oct 17, 2009)

Test ride a steely if you can, I think the bike's got a lot of potential.


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## madtorker (Feb 3, 2010)

Extra long seat post + Commute by bike FTW.


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## 918biker (Jan 23, 2011)

i have a Gary Fisher OPIE 19 inch and it works great for any thing XC/AM/DJ, the 19 inch has a effective TT length 24.4 mine has been upgraded quit a bit heres a pic


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## Clifton (Feb 24, 2006)

I was looking at a 15.5" or 17.5" Gary Fisher Mullet. I'd rather have the better parts first than go with the Opie. Seems like I'd save money that way. I just can't decide.


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## 918biker (Jan 23, 2011)

I built my Opie with new and used parts, I got the LX cranks, XT rear der. and Deore fr. der. for 60 bucks and got the 2003 Marz. DJ2 20mm. axle and the Sun Ringle Big fat Mammoth Front Rim for 75 bucks. My BB7's and SD7 Levers are new along with the rhino lite rear wheel w/XT hub that was about 240 all total the bike and parts is around 800 bucks


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## batorok (May 7, 2007)

ns surge frame/core bikes can pedal and jump. Though I have to agree if you can afford a trail hardtail and jump hardtail...


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## JohnByrd (Jan 25, 2004)

this is what i got and i use it for both.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

mmik said:


> Something I can raise the seat up on and ride 10-15 miles on. I still want it to handle like a DJ bike though. What do ya think?
> 
> I have some thoughts on this now on what I'd do with the bike to make it work with xc:
> 
> ...


I haven't read any other posts so if I'm repeating info I apologize, but one thing you will need is a place to keep water bottles, dj frames don't braze-on bottle cage mounts. And for xc riding water or hydration in general is a must. Some larger dj frames like the dk xenia make great small/medium sized xc frames because they are essentially a 16" xc frame with a longer top tube, and slacker headtube. As long as you aren't freakishly tall, a larger dj frame will make a great all around bike.

*edit* Dk xenia is the exact same frame as the Dk asterik..buy used and save a ton :thumbsup:


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## alexrex20 (Dec 20, 2005)

does sasquatch not use a Camelbak?


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

Nope, makes my back sweat too much, or I should say doesn't let my back vent well enough, and never could afford/ justify buying one. I like using bottles.


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## JohnByrd (Jan 25, 2004)

no need for a bottle holder, complete waste for dj'ing. bring a jug or a camel back. and leave it by the jumps.


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## False (Feb 18, 2011)

For something short like 10-15 miles I don't carry water with me. I just drink before I head out and when I get back/to my destination. Not really the best way to go about it, but it gets the job done in anything under 90* weather.


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## HungarianBarbarian (Jul 24, 2008)

The biggest difference between most DJ bikes and XC bikes in terms of geometry seems to be the chainstay length. I don't ride my DJ bike uphill but I would think that a bike like the Eastern Nightrain with a 15" chainstay would have very little weight on the front wheel when climbing with the seatpost fully extended. No XC frame that I know of has a chain stay anywhere near that short. So, I would think that a bike like a Kona with a 16.7" chainstay would handle just like a heavy XC bike but personally I wouldn't want to ride a bike that long on steep jumps.


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## mattty (Feb 26, 2009)

There is nothing wrong with 16" stays for both trail riding and dirt jumping. A 15" chainstay makes manualing circles easier, 540 taps easier, ... but is actually less stable on _big_ dirt jumps than a 16"

One can rock larger knobby tires with 16" stays as well.


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## HungarianBarbarian (Jul 24, 2008)

16" would probably feel pretty good for everything. My point was that I think that 15" with a tall seatpost and 72 degree seat angle might feel weird riding uphill. Maybe someone who has tried this setup can give a better opinion. I have ridden a 16.7" bike on DJs and felt it was too long for me on steep tight jumps that are designed for a 20".


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## Shayne (Jan 14, 2004)

*Short Chainstays are Desirable for Climbing*

As short as possible. There have been a few sub 16" XC bikes.
Its hard to go shorter than 16" with traditional frame design and still be able to fit a decent size tire.


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