# Test rode Pivot Shuttle today - long review



## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Went to my LBS and they had a Shuttle built up and ready to ride. I rode it around on the street for about 20 minutes.

I've had my 2016 Levo Turbo Expert for about a year. I've never ridden any other E-bike. My impressions:

The Shuttle is like the Tesla of e-bikes. I don't mean this in a good way or a bad way but there is a lot of technology going on here.

Whereas my Levo feels like a regular bike with a little electric assist, the Shuttle feels like a machine that also happens to be a bike.

Some of the things that stood out:

- There is a lot of tech on those handlebars! You have the Di2 rear der shifter on the right, the control for the assist level is a shifter on the left (looks exactly like a der shifter), there is a screen that tells you what gear, power level, and MPH, and there is a a control for the seatpost dropper.

- I haven't ridden a new Levo with the new handlebar remote but the Shuttle's remote is essentially a Shimano shifter. You have to click it to go up or down from Eco to Trail to Boost. If you hold one of the buttons down for a few seconds there is also a Walk mode. As I ride an older Levo without handlebar assist controls I have no opinion on this although it seems more complex than it needs to be and if I recall correctly, on the Shuttle one has to press one click at a time to go up in the assist levels. It also seemed like there were more than 3 levels of assist. I.E., pressing the "upshift" button while in Trail would give more assist but remain in Trail until additional clicks would finally get it to Boost (I could be mistaken about this but that is what it seemed like).

- With the assist "shifter" on the left side of the bar, the seat dropper button is a complete fail. It is rotated forward (as it has to be) and one has to press the button down towards the ground to activate the dropper. I suppose one could eventually get used to this but having ridden 1x11s for a few years I'm used the dropper button being pushed forward - not down. And one's body is typically towards the rear of the bike to prepare for a descent - pressing down on a top button with the thumb is not compatible with a rearward body position.

- The Di2 shifter is... interesting. I've never experienced this shifter before but you can hold down (and keep holding down) the up or downshift buttons and the der will just mash through the gears (ouch! my ears!). This was quite a different feel from the typical der/cable shifter. It shifted a lot quicker than a conventional der. Though I much prefer the SRAM shifter design vs. Shimano.

- Shimano motor seemed to be slightly more powerful than the Brose on my Levo. Went up a few steep hills and Shimano seemed to be able to handle a lower cadence than the Brose. As far as the engagement and feel it didn't seem that different than the Levo. Of course, keep in mind this was a short ride on the street. One thing I did notice is that when the bike topped out at 20mph there wasn't that very noticeable drag on the bike like on the Levo. If I had this bike I also wouldn't think I would need to go more than 20 most of the time. I probably don't go over 20 on a level street on my Levo too much but there is a significant slow down when you do exceed the limit. The Shimano emits a louder whine than the Brose. There is no question to everyone around you're on an e-bike. The Brose is far quieter.

- Design and build quality are top-notch. I see what the Pivot fan bois are talking about. Everything is very well thought out. One thing I really liked is there is not an external wiring harness like on the Levo. On the Levo the harness will pop off the battery every so often on rough terrain. I've also had to replace the harness once as the connection was fried/corroded. There have also been instances of metal bits getting stuck in the magnetic connection of the Levo. Pivot completely eliminates this issue with an internal connection. There are also other nice touches such as a rubber guard to keep dirt from entering in the lower pivot area. The overall quality seemed to be superb.

- The XT brakes seemed decent. This is probably something better tested on the trail. But having ridden Guides (and always 200mm on front) for my last few bikes I'm used to their feel. The XTs seemed a little lacking but seeing as the bike was brand new and the pads were probably not even broken in not to mention riding on the street it was hard to tell which I liked better.

- Weight. Just picking up the Shuttle there was a noticeable difference. Whereas my Levo is clearly a very heavy e-bike the Shuttle reminded me more of my SC Bullit or VP-Free (both with double crown forks) from the early 2000s. It was still heavy but I could more easily lift this over a large fallen tree or throw it in my pickup. When I do this with the Levo I have to take a moment to mentally and physically prepare myself for the task. Though the ease of picking up the Shuttle may also have to do with the frame design. There really is no good place on the frame to pick up a Levo. With the frame of the Shuttle you can more easily center the weight of the bike and lift it "better" if that makes sense.

- Appearance. I read that Pivot wanted to go with a very subtle appearance for the Shuttle (probably because of all the e-haters in the US) and, wow, it definitely is subtle. Almost too subtle. The bike is pretty much completely blacked out. I am not a fan of bling but a little splash of color on this thing would have been nice. It does not make you think "wow!" Very boring. Very *yawn* inducing. It does not look like a $10K bike. I prefer the tasteful color scheme of the new Levos.

Would I buy the Shuttle? Unsure. 

I'm just a bit under 6' and I'm right on the cusp of the medium and large sizes. I rode the large today. It definitely felt bigger/longer than my large Levo. It was harder to bunny hop or take a tight turn. Though I will note that I always cut my bars down to 740mm (hate super wide bars) and the Shuttle, like every other MTB on the market today, comes with wide bars. 

I ride very tight and narrow single track and prefer a smaller cockpit. The large was just a bit big for me. Though I worry the medium may be too small. The LBS has a medium on order. When it arrives and I will revisit and do another test ride.

Without doubt the Shuttle is a serious contender to the Levo. The weight and the design details (mostly the internal harness) are the most obvious and biggest factors for me. I'd love to ride the DW link on the trail too. I had this design on an Ibis Mojo HD a few years ago but I forget if it was particularly better than the last few SC and Specialized bikes I've ridden since then.

The Shuttle has a lot of pros. But, for $11K (with tax) I'd really want to make sure I love the bike. I bought my Levo second-hand at a nice discount thus I was willing to take a risk (and was quite happy I did). Buying a new bike at the price point of a nice used car requires a lot of careful consideration.


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## fos'l (May 27, 2009)

Excellent review, thanks. I rode a 2017 Levo that had a suggested retail price (AIR) of $4500 and had a great time especially one ride of 3000' elevation gain in 8 miles with ice on the terrain at the summit. Can't imagine the Pivot being twice as good (for me).


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

Nice review, but for 10k you better really like it.


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## JillRide45 (Dec 11, 2015)

Great write up! Thanks for taking the time to do the write up and sharing your thoughts.

Some random thoughts and questions (it is Friday afternoon after all):

I am wondering if you have ridden the 18 Levo, I find the disengagement pretty seemless and much nicer than on the 16 I tested. But as always if you are in a high gear on flat ground pushing hard you will notice, on downhills I cannot tell the on/off. I think what I really like about the 18 Levo is how much like a regular stumpy it feels like. 

For the slower cadence uphills were you running the Levo in race acceleration? That really helps at lower RPM, but my preference is normal acceleration for a more natural feel. But I have never had turbo above 50% so cannot really comment on absolute power.

I think the left hand remote on the Levo is absolutely worth the upgrade to an 18 and I only use it a few times a ride, but when you need it, it is in the perfect place. In technical sections or deep sand areas I ride with my thumb covering the plus switch on the remote so I can change instantly. We ride in some tight canyons where I cannot turn over the pedals and must duck under overhangs, just use the walk to get through these. I have also had to use the walk button to get the bike up and over rockfalls that block the trail (6-10ft). I do like that the Levo has a dedicated walk button, no remembering to hold down some other button. I also have the Specialized Vado and to use the walk button you have to hold down the plus button, problem is I never remember this. A dedicated walk button is the best.

Sort of funny on the multi-shifting function in that on some of the Levo Specialized spec'd a custom GX shifter that can only do 1 shift at a time in an effort to prevent broken chains and stress on the drivetrain. Works great and with the remote on the other handlebar you can change power faster than gears.

On another note, are you running the updated firmware on your Levo. If not you better try an 18 before making a decision, power is limited in lower settings for longer range and better economy. Some love it some hate it. 

Have fun!


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

JillRide45 said:


> Great write up! Thanks for taking the time to do the write up and sharing your thoughts.
> 
> Some random thoughts and questions (it is Friday afternoon after all):
> 
> ...


I have not ridden the 2018 Levo. I only have experience with my 2016. Though the motor was recently replaced and is definitely a little zippier than the old motor (which was replaced due to an internal drive issue).

On the street I can definitely feel the disengagement. Particularly since the new motor was installed. On the trail I don't notice it.

I just recently starting occasionally running in Eco mode if I'm riding with buddies on conventional bikes and/or if I plan on doing a longer ride. But most of the time I ride in boost mode to just blast out my standard 12 mile ride.

Because I don't want to push my luck with the new motor, I keep my cadence pretty high on steeper climbs. So maybe it's not a good comparison when I rode the Shuttle. I don't want to blow another Levo motor. For the Shuttle test ride of course I wasn't concerned about running a higher cadence.

For the walk button - yes, I agree - a dedicated walk button is probably better. I literally took 10 minutes to try and figure out how the Shuttle walk feature is activated and still was unsure if I figured it out or not. It was either tricky or buggy. I really disliked the fact that the remote was a Shimano shifter (and thus offset the dropper lever).

Does the Levo remote cause problems with the dropper lever alignment? I really hope not.

One thing I've learned about my Levo is to religiously lube the drive train before every ride. Otherwise it makes some pretty awful noises and the drive train performance is significantly reduced.

After some more thought, though I may test the medium Shuttle to see how it rides, I'm still leaning towards the 2018 Levo (or could be 2019 seeing as Specialized so grossly miscalculated the demand for the new Levo).

On the Shuttle the Di2 der, the display, the shifter design - the entire setup on the bars may be a bit too much. I just want to ride. I don't want to have to pay attention to so many things.

I also like the SRAM 1x shifter and der action more than the Shimano. I like being able to "feel" my der and cog actions vs. the electronic Di2 der simply mashing the chain back and forth over the gears.

If I had to pick my 3 biggest issues with the Shuttle it would be:
1. Don't care for the Di2
2. Don't like the power shifter and display
3. Dropper lever is a nonstarter - hate it!

I didn't notice much difference in the motor. Though admittedly, the test ride was on the hilly paved streets around the shop. Maybe there would be a bigger difference out on the trail.


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## comtn (Jan 23, 2018)

Thanks for the review. I always wondered why pivot put substandard brakes on a 10k bike. All things considered it seems a '18 levo expert is a lot more bike for the money. I really like the near silent motor of the '18 levo.


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## fos'l (May 27, 2009)

comtn, please don't speak about poaching on this sub-forum. We frown on that activity as well as modifying systems for more power.


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## comtn (Jan 23, 2018)

Understood, edited


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

For 10k you’re getting a very high end trail bike that happens to have power assist.

Compare the Pivot Switchblade to a Specialized Fat 6, these are the base bikes for the Shuttle and Levo.

As much as a first hand review is appreciated, a ride on the road is not that meaningful. Would that not let you take it on trails?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Pivot didn't use SRAM brakes, smart decision, Shimano brakes are more reliable by far. SRAM hasn't made a good brake for many years. The replacement rate on Guides is remarkable, warranted two sets of Guides last summer, will likely end up
replacing the other two sets this summer.



comtn said:


> Thanks for the review. I always wondered why pivot put substandard brakes on a 10k bike. All things considered it seems a '18 levo expert is a lot more bike for the money. I really like the near silent motor of the '18 levo.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

What I’m waiting on is a lower spec Shuttle, GX drivetrain, aluminum parts, no Factory suspension, something in the neighborhood of $7500.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> For 10k you're getting a very high end trail bike that happens to have power assist.
> 
> Compare the Pivot Switchblade to a Specialized Fat 6, these are the base bikes for the Shuttle and Levo.
> 
> As much as a first hand review is appreciated, a ride on the road is not that meaningful. Would that not let you take it on trails?


Sure, it's a mountain bike and should be evaluated on the trail. Nevertheless, it's pretty easy to test shifting, brakes, the assist, and other items on the bike going up and down the very steep streets of the area around the shop.

Trail test ride? Unlikely. There are only 55 Shuttles at all the USA Pivot dealers. Another Pivot dealer said they weren't even selling the one they had as they wanted to use it "for leverage" or something (not really sure what they meant by this).

Even if there were plenty of these out do bike shops let people do a demo of a $10K bike? I know you can demo an entry or maybe mid-level bike but never heard of a shop bringing out their flagship for a demo day or letting someone take it out for a thrashing for the usual $100 or so demo/rental.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> Pivot didn't use SRAM brakes, smart decision, Shimano brakes are more reliable by far. SRAM hasn't made a good brake for many years. The replacement rate on Guides is remarkable, warranted two sets of Guides last summer, will likely end up
> replacing the other two sets this summer.


Meh... I've heard of people having problems with the Guides. I've had them on my last 3 bikes and never had an issue. I only keep my bikes about a year so perhaps the problems haven't had time to develop. I prefer the feel of the Guides vs the on or off engagement of Shimano.


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## fos'l (May 27, 2009)

Vitus has a fairly nicely spec FS Shimano-equipped bike for $3,600. Seems like Pivot should be able to manufacture an aluminum-frame model for $6,000 or less (please note that this is JMO, and no bean counting involved).


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## comtn (Jan 23, 2018)

camus said:


> Meh... I've heard of people having problems with the Guides. I've had them on my last 3 bikes and never had an issue. I only keep my bikes about a year so perhaps the problems haven't had time to develop. I prefer the feel of the Guides vs the on oroff engagement of Shimano.


Did the fit the pivot with larger 200mm rotors? I was more referring to the size of the disks than anything. The early reviews had 180 or 160 rotors which was puzzling. I second the opinion guides have a more progressive feel especially with the higher spec lever assembly.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Nurse Ben said:


> Pivot didn't use SRAM brakes, smart decision, Shimano brakes are more reliable by far. SRAM hasn't made a good brake for many years. The replacement rate on Guides is remarkable, warranted two sets of Guides last summer, will likely end up
> replacing the other two sets this summer.


You haven't had the current generation of Shimano brakes than. Everyone I know [myself included] with the current XTs had them fail.

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/m...ty-the-brand-is-known-for-a-long-term-review/

I'm trying some SRAM Codes on the new bike.


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## EricTheDood (Sep 22, 2017)

Nurse Ben said:


> What I'm waiting on is a lower spec Shuttle, GX drivetrain, aluminum parts, no Factory suspension, something in the neighborhood of $7500.


But then it would weigh 50 lbs.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Yeah, I've ridden Codes and they are the same design as the Guides. Better in this context is a relative term.

So here's the deal: SRAM has failed to build a reliable brake for years. I'm not sure why it's so hard for them, when others seem to have it figured out. What surprises me most is how common they are on complete bikes.

My impression is that SRAM markets their brakes to "feel good" when new, kind of like auto mfgs specing new cars with softer tires to improve tire quality; they wear out quicker.

I've run Shimano brakes off and on for years, never had a failure, price is right.

As to a lower priced Shuttle weighing five pounds simply because the parts are less costly, that's not correct. The Shuttle has Fox Factory suspension, switch to the standard Fox suspension and the weight is the same but $1000 less. Ditch the Di2 and replace with Eagle GX and save another $1000. Go with aluminum hoops on DT Swiss hubs, save another $1000. So now we're down to ~$8000 and the only weight gain is 4-6oz difference in rims.

I'd buy ^ that bike today!

Reality is, most people will flinch at dropping 11k on a bike, whether it's top shelf or not. But you take that same bike and give it quality mid grade parts, focus your $$ on the frame design and ebike function, now you have a quality package that compares with a high end non ebike.

The Pivot Switchblade outfitted like the Pivot Shuttle is an 8k bike.



vikb said:


> You haven't had the current generation of Shimano brakes than. Everyone I know [myself included] with the current XTs had them fail.
> 
> https://www.singletracks.com/blog/m...ty-the-brand-is-known-for-a-long-term-review/
> 
> I'm trying some SRAM Codes on the new bike.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Nurse Ben said:


> I've run Shimano brakes off and on for years, never had a failure, price is right.


We've never had a SRAM brake failure. So I guess it just depends how lucky you get. Literally everyone I know has XTs that had to be replaced from this last batch.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

You are wrong. Lightweight is not expensive, it's the bling that makes this bike expensive.

Change from Di2 to Eagle GX, save $1000.
Change from Fox Factory suspension to non Factory Fox suspension, save $1000.
Change from carbon hoops to aluminum hoops, save $1000.

This ^ bike would weigh ~ 4-6oz more than the current Shuttle, but cost 8k.

The only thing that the Pivot Shuttle has going for it is an all carbon frame purpose built for ebike and its a DW designed suspension. The frame is where the weight is reduced, possibly the motor or battery design. Battery and motor are not unique to Pivot.

There are already lighter weight fs ebikes out there, but they're not as well designed as the Shuttle.

Parts are parts, nothing unusual in the Shuttle build other that the Di2.

A review for a mountain bike typically involves riding on trails. I'm imagining how this review would play out if it was posted to a non ebike forum 



EricTheDood said:


> But then it would weigh 50 lbs.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> Change from carbon hoops to aluminum hoops, save $1000.


A minor correction: The Shuttle comes with alum rims. :/

But, I agree with what you're saying. I don't need special "works" Factory fork and shock. Nor do I need Di2 (and I prefer SRAM ders and shifters anyway).

If I had my druthers, I'd like the Shuttle spec'd out with carbon wheels, SRAM Eagle, and just a regular Fox fork and shock. I'd gladly pay $10K for that (assuming it would fit me).

In its current state with alum wheels and Shimano components I'm not lovin' it.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

The shuttle needs to be ridden on some hardcore trails and let it eat. Let the DW link perform. Cool review, but let’s be honest- it’s designed to rip trails. Apparently, I’ve been lucky, never an issue with XTR or XT. I would never buy another bike without Di2. Once you ride it for awhile, its awesome. Everybody has their own opinions, that’s just my experience.


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## EricTheDood (Sep 22, 2017)

Nurse Ben said:


> You are wrong. Lightweight is not expensive, it's the bling that makes this bike expensive.
> 
> Change from Di2 to Eagle GX, save $1000.
> Change from Fox Factory suspension to non Factory Fox suspension, save $1000.
> ...


I think the GX Eagle cassette alone is going to come with at least a 6oz penalty if not more, but to be a fair, e-bikes don't need Eagle so the weight comes back down by going to a 10-42.

So I see what you're saying, and I think it's only a matter of time before Pivot comes out with a lower spec'd Shuttle.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Found this video review of the Shuttle.

Unfortunately, other than showing how the Shimano motor and Di2 app works, it doesn't really provide a whole lot of info:





 (link to video where they actually start talking about the Shuttle - the first minute is the guy talking about his bike shop).


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## Harryman (Jun 14, 2011)

camus said:


> A minor correction: The Shuttle comes with alum rims. :/
> 
> But, I agree with what you're saying. I don't need special "works" Factory fork and shock. Nor do I need Di2 (and I prefer SRAM ders and shifters anyway).
> 
> ...


I'd rather have aluminum wheels on a gravity oriented bike myself, as would many people, which is why I assume it's speced so. And an aluminum frame, especially on an ebike, chasing a few ounces and spending a grand more to do it seems foolish to me.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Harryman said:


> I'd rather have aluminum wheels on a gravity oriented bike myself, as would many people, which is why I assume it's speced so. And an aluminum frame, especially on an ebike, chasing a few ounces and spending a grand more to do it seems foolish to me.


To each his own.

My first carbon wheelset was on a SC Bronson I had a few years ago. The difference in rigidity was amazing. For once when I turned a corner the bike would go exactly where I wanted it to go.

I've had carbon rims on all my bikes since then. Definitely want to check the pressure before every ride though as a heavy hit from a rock will crack a carbon rim.

Is the Shuttle considered a gravity bike? With 140mm/150mm of travel for the back/front I thought it was more of a trail bike similar to the Levo.


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## Double Butted (Jan 27, 2015)

Has anyone contacted Pivot directly about their plans to sell this bike in the US? I did and was told they weren't sure about it. Hopefully they know how much interest is out there.


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## Giant Warp (Jun 11, 2009)

Thanks for the write up. No bicycle is worth $10,000. Just saying.....I'll skip on the bling. I just like something that has a little assist on the hills and requires little maintenance.


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## Giant Warp (Jun 11, 2009)

I don't think someone will have much luck selling and upgrading something so expensive every year. Number one it would have to be mint. Number two I tried selling my 17' Levo at less than a year old and I would have had to drop over $2000 to get rid of it. Glad I kept it.


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## JillRide45 (Dec 11, 2015)

Double Butted said:


> Has anyone contacted Pivot directly about their plans to sell this bike in the US? I did and was told they weren't sure about it. Hopefully they know how much interest is out there.


The dealer in So. Cal has a medium and large on the floor for sale.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Double Butted said:


> Has anyone contacted Pivot directly about their plans to sell this bike in the US? I did and was told they weren't sure about it. Hopefully they know how much interest is out there.


Pivot spent the money to build the mold, so any Shuttles they sell helps pay off those costs.

I'm sure the geo and frame design is good enough to be worth keeping in the Pivot quiver for a couple years, though committing to a single motor and battery configuration is a risk cuz technology changes fast.

Maybe mold prices for CF frames are getting cheaper?

I'd pay $4500 for a frame, shock, motor, battery, then build my own bike. Considering the cost of a Switchblade frame and shock runs 3k, that's a pretty reasonable price... that is if they sold the Shuttle frame only.


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## Harryman (Jun 14, 2011)

There are a lot of companies selling carbon DH bikes these days, and that's a pretty miniscule market, so I think the upfront costs aren't what they were, or enough to scare people away from trying to grab market share with the image of a sexy, high end frame, that then sells their AL versions.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

BRING ON EVIL E-BIKE! Whatcha think? Never or a matter of time? How can Pivot pump one out without their rivals doing the same?


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Double Butted said:


> Has anyone contacted Pivot directly about their plans to sell this bike in the US? I did and was told they weren't sure about it. Hopefully they know how much interest is out there.


Pivot did a soft launch 2 weeks ago. They are selling them in the US. I'm in Northern California.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Giant Warp said:


> I don't think someone will have much luck selling and upgrading something so expensive every year. Number one it would have to be mint. Number two I tried selling my 17' Levo at less than a year old and I would have had to drop over $2000 to get rid of it. Glad I kept it.


I typically buy my bikes second hand when they are about a year old. I've gotten some amazing deals over the years. Employing some good marketing (great pics, description, ensuring bike is super clean) selling my old bike on Craigs and then buying the latest and greatest bike is often just a $500 or $1000 (at most) upgrade.

On the other hand, I think buying an E-bike used may not be the best idea. If the motor or battery should die prematurely, you could be in deep doo doo as the manufacturer's warranty only covers the original purchaser.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Giant Warp said:


> Thanks for the write up. No bicycle is worth $10,000. Just saying.....I'll skip on the bling. I just like something that has a little assist on the hills and requires little maintenance.


Everything is relative. If you can afford it and it brings you great joy I don't see any reason *not* to buy a new, expensive toy.

Admittedly, it is crazy that some high-end bikes are more expensive than motorcycles.


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## EricTheDood (Sep 22, 2017)

camus said:


> Everything is relative. If you can afford it and it brings you great joy I don't see any reason *not* to buy a new, expensive toy.
> 
> Admittedly, it is crazy that some high-end bikes are more expensive than motorcycles.


$10K is not a lot of money to spend on a toy for a sizable group of folks.

If it weren't for the e-bike integration, these would otherwise be pro level race bikes, minus maybe some tuned suspension, which can be had for a couple grand more.

If we're going to compare to motorcycles, make it a fair comparison. A factory pro's MX/SX bike is worth hundreds of thousands, and a Moto GP bike is in the millions.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Finally was able to do a proper trail demo of the Pivot Shuttle. About 30 miles of street and trail.

*Short version:*

*Pros -* Awesome suspension, handling, very stiff wheels and frame, DW link great for climbing and technical riding, can easily pedal the bike without the motor on, fork and shock can be locked out to make bike ultra efficient on the road or smooth climbs
*Cons - *Motor is super loud, dropper lever is a goofy design that takes some getting used to, and personal preference on components (I prefer SRAM shifters and brakes)

I've had a Specialized Turbo Levo S-Works on order since December of last year and the delivery has been delayed until June. In the meantime, the Shuttle has been introduced to the USA and many are lauding it as one of the best e-MTBs out there.

Thanks to Pivot and my LBS I was able to finally ride one on my local trails.

Pivot did a Shuttle-specific demo and there were about 10 of us total. A lot of waiting around for everything to get going so I was able dial my bike perfectly - sag, rebound, lever position and engagement, etc. - before we departed.

The ride consisted of a 10-mile trek on surface streets to get to the trails. It was a beautiful, sunny 65-degree day. I got the chance to speak to the guy from Pivot in charge of the demo fleet. He offered a lot of good info about the bike and said that many people who had purchased a Levo experienced regret after test riding the Shuttle.

On the ride the to trails I was really impressed with the Shuttle. The motor was strong and engaged well (though I should mention I kept it in eco or trail mode as I didn't want to run out of juice on the trails). I got used to the Shimano Di2 and motor controls and overall the bike felt great. Nice, crisp, and stiff. Being able to lock out the fork and shock really helped.

I pedaled a few times with the motor off and it actually wasn't too hard. Reminded me of my DH bikes from the early 2000s. Much easier to pedal without the juice on than my Levo. I suppose ~10lbs and the locked out DW link suspension really helped.

At this point in the ride I was seriously considering canceling my Levo order and getting the Shuttle. But the trails were yet to come.

We eventually reached the trailhead. I was quite pleased to be riding here as I know these trails very well and had just bombed them last weekend - one day on my Levo another day on my Hightower. I was anticipating a great test ride and being able to really evaluate the bike already knowing the trails/terrain.

First part of the ride is mostly climbing. Windy single track with a number of switchbacks, rooty sections, and some rocks. The Shuttle did quite well and felt very planted. Very stiff frame and wheels. I kept the motor on trail and the power seemed to be about right. I didn't overshoot any uphill switchbacks or suffer any misdirected lurching. The Shuttle kept its line through any rocky or rooty sections.

One thing that really got my attention is the noise of the motor. This thing really howls! I'm used to my Levo being practically silent. With the ambient trail noise I hardly ever hear the noise of my Levo motor. The Shuttle motor was a screamer! Here is a short video I took. If anything this doesn't even show the higher volumes as I was holding my phone and pedaling on flat ground at the same time. But at higher cadences and going uphill the thing really whined!

Hate to say it but the loudness and pitch of the motor is a serious issue. For me, riding the trails is the way I escape the busy, chaotic environment of my regular life. I want to be out on the trails and hear nothing but the wind, maybe some bike noises, and the gravel/dirt below my tires. The whine of the Shimano motor was just too much.

However, some of the other guys didn't mind the noise and a couple even said they liked it as it reminded them the bike was turned on or it made the bike feel a bit like a moto. So, different perspectives on this. I don't think I could get used to this. Not only is it bothersome to my ear but it announces to everyone around that you are riding an e-bike. Hardly anyone notices the motor noise on my Levo.

As far as the handling goes the DW link and the Fox suspension were top notch. It was very stiff and went where you wanted it to go. The wheels felt very solid. My old 2016 Levo has some wear on her (I just discovered yesterday the spokes are pulling through/cracking the rear alum rim) and the Shuttle felt much stiffer all around. The bike simply went where you pointed it.

There is one part of the trail where it is smooth and fast riding though some pine trees. There are mostly downhill sections with roots, switchbacks, and small jumps and root kickers. This is the section I was waiting for. I hit it very hard and the Shuttle really did well. The tight switchbacks were noticeably easier on the Shuttle than the Levo. Turns were more easily railed. Blasting through rooty off-camber sections was no issue for the Shuttle. Super fun.

I rode some of the trail in Boost mode - the most powerful setting. There definitely was some herky jerky feeling when the motor engage and disengaged. On Eco and Trail you didn't feel this at all. Can't say I'm a fan. Again, I think the Levo motor does a lot better job and is more subtle.

In all the Shuttle is an incredible e-MTB. Great frame and suspension. The Di2 works well and I had no complaints about the XT brakes. The battery was in the red just as we'd finished the ride. Pretty good battery life. According to Strava we did 31.8 miles and 2500ft of elevation. I had it in Trail about 80% of the time and in Boost for a short while on the trail and then on the road ride back to the bike shop. The last couple miles the bike automatically reduced power from Boost to Eco and was in the red zone.

Loved the bike over all. But that motor... I'm afraid it could be a deal-breaker for me. It's just too damn loud. If only the Shuttle had the Brose and not the Shimano.  The only other complaint I have is the dropper lever is sort of goofy in that you have to press it down and I prefer SRAM shifters over Shimano.


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## Zinfan (Jun 6, 2006)

Thanks for the write up. I'll have to pay more attention to the motor noise on my E8000 equipped Jam2 but it hasn't bothered me yet. Did the reps go over the different assist settings for the trail and boost modes? I test rode my bike on surface streets and felt there was just a small difference in assist between eco and trail with the boost mode really adding in the power. Once I got the bike home and used the Shimano E-Tube app to connect to the bike I found that my bike was in Dynamic mode that set trail mode to low assist and boost mode to high assist. A bit more research and I found out that the trail and boost modes have three different levels of assist each (i.e. medium assist in trail mode is not the same as medium assist in boost mode) and I used the custom menu to set my trail mode assist to medium and left boost in high. Eco mode assist level cannot be adjusted.

After riding the bike a bit I think I will continue with trail mode in medium and change boost over to medium as I find the high assist is not needed for anything I'm riding. I think Shimano could do a better job of getting the information out about the settings for their E8000 motor as the guys at the shop I bought it from didn't know some of this stuff and to be fair unless you connect the bike to a phone you can't get to it. I really liked the way the bike rode in trail mode set to medium and I spent most of the time in that setting. It wouldn't take long to use the E-Tube app to change the settings out on the trail if you brought your phone along but I have yet to do that.


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## Zinfan (Jun 6, 2006)

Back from a ride and I was listening to the E8000 motor this time. For me while I would like a totally silent motor the Shimano was more of a hum or whirring sound not a high pitch whine or howl and I wasn't overly bothered by it. It should be noted that I worked in some loud environments over the years and have some high frequency hearing loss so if the motor is sending out high pitched noises I may not be hearing them fully. I'd say I can get the motor to sound a bit like your video if I take off from a standing start and give it max effort so the motor adds max assist but that only lasts until I reach my intended speed and the motor quiets down from there, I don't think mine is ever louder than what you have recorded.


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

camus - 

I think you’ll love your S-works Levo once it arrives. The Brose motor is improved over your 2016 model, and the handlebar controls are very nice to have. The 11m carbon frame, carbon rims, and a light groupo should put the weight close to the Shuttle. My Large Levo and Mrs levity’s Small Comp Carbon models with carbon wheels and light 3.0 tires weigh 47 and 45 lb ready to ride (pedals, pump, swat stuff, bell). The lighter wheels and tires make a big difference in handling.

You might also take a look at the Manitou McLeod shock. We run it on our Stumpjumpers and Levos and find that it is a big improvement over any Fox or Rockshox shock we’ve tried. We also find a bar mounted remote for the shock to be very handy.

Cheers, L.


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## Giant Warp (Jun 11, 2009)

I can't remember, does the carbon levo have a beefed up skid plate on the motor? I seem to be hitting my aluminum frame quite regular now.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Rode a Shuttle over the weekend. It’s a real nice bike, the extra weight is there, but far less of hindrance than you’d find with a comparable Levo. COG is lower, the bike feels more balanced, less of a sense that it wants to fall over.

It’s the first ebike I’ve ridden that “could be ridden” sans motor without giving yourself a hernia. I could even manual the bike a bit; though nowhere near what I can do on a non ebike.

Never heard the motor, it was as quiet or quieter than my wife’s Levo. Pedal clearance and handling are excellent.

It’s a very expensive bike, but for those who can afford it, it’s a very nice bike.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> Rode a Shuttle over the weekend. It's a real nice bike, the extra weight is there, but far less of hindrance than you'd find with a comparable Levo. COG is lower, the bike feels more balanced, less of a sense that it wants to fall over.
> 
> It's the first ebike I've ridden that "could be ridden" sans motor without giving yourself a hernia. I could even manual the bike a bit; though nowhere near what I can do on a non ebike.
> 
> ...


That's crazy you didn't hear the motor. I've ridden 3 different Shuttles and that motor screams - especially going uphill at high cadence. Check your hearing lately? 

I will agree it's easier to pedal with the motor off. I'm sure the DW Link suspension helps with that. Nevertheless, one would never want to do that thus negating Pivot's claim that the bike is still fun to ride with the motor off.

Didn't really notice any significant difference in weight or handling on the trails between the two bikes. Picking the Shuttle up it seemed a few pounds lighter.

Coincidentally, I finally got my S-works Levo Turbo today. Zero regrets.

I know that for my preferences it's a better bike than the Shuttle. I'll take the Brose and SRAM any day over Shimano.

They're both great bikes. I would encourage anyone to ride them both before dropping the big bucks to own.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

There’s really no comparison between the Levo and the Pivot. The Levo is quite heavy, awkward handling, and a very low B.B.

Full disclosure, I’m a skilled non ebike mountain biker who supports his wife’s ebike habit. I typically climb 10-15k per week and ride three to four times a week on single track, mileage varies from ten to forty miles per ride.

So what I look for in an ebike is very different from what an ebiker looks for in an ebike.

I don’t believe in throttles or high output motors. I support ebikes to improve access and to level the playing field between varying rider abilities.

I’d like to see more emphasis on quality vs quantity, reduced motor output and battery capacity; a leaner and more efficiently ebike, versus the heavy high output bikes that have become the standard.

A Pivot Shuttle with a 50% reduction in the drive system, a five pound reduction in weight, would be very appealing to me.

I think Pivot failed to understand their target population. The person who buys a Shuttle is more likely to be a skilled rider and have some modicum of fitness, whereas the person buying a lower end bike like the Levo is buying their fitness with hopes of building their skills. Sorry for the stereotype, but if the shoe fits.

I’m waiting on the release of a 250w ebike with 140-150mm travel, modern geo, and weighing <40#. I’d say my wish will be granted by 2020.

As much as I appreciate what Pivot has done with the Shuttle, it’s still too heavy and awkward. If I had 10k to burn, I’d buy a used Levo FSR and save the balance for a couple years.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> There's really no comparison between the Levo and the Pivot. The Levo is quite heavy, awkward handling, and a very low B.B.
> 
> Full disclosure, I'm a skilled non ebike mountain biker who supports his wife's ebike habit. I typically climb 10-15k per week and ride three to four times a week on single track, mileage varies from ten to forty miles per ride.
> 
> ...


Meh. I disagree. I think the bikes are very comparable and it seems that the rest of the biking world does as well.

To say there is no comparison between the Levo S-works and the Shuttle pretty much ruins your credibility in my eyes as I have extensively ridden both and they are very similar in most respects with some differences. But they are very comparable.

I can say this because of my decades of experience riding and wrenching bikes. Yet, I don't want to bore other readers by bragging of stories of my daily rides, my riding acumen, or how long I've been riding.

I wouldn't say the Shuttle is better than the Levo. Different, yes. Better, no. Like I said, it's a matter of preferences. But you've already proven yourself to be a Pivot fanboi so I'm sure this discussion is closed and you've clearly made up your mind:

The most discerning, experienced rider with a modicum of fitness would choose the Shuttle. All the rest of those lazy, fat, newbie bikers will, without question, go for the cheaper Levo.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Nurse Ben said:


> There's really no comparison between the Levo and the Pivot. The Levo is quite heavy, awkward handling, and a very low B.B.
> 
> Full disclosure, I'm a skilled non ebike mountain biker who supports his wife's ebike habit. I typically climb 10-15k per week and ride three to four times a week on single track, mileage varies from ten to forty miles per ride.
> 
> ...


Exact same buyer as me. That is why I bought the Focus Jam2 Pro for $5500. Di2, Shimano STEPS, lyrik fork and light. Can't beat the value and functionality.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Gutch said:


> Exact same buyer as me. That is why I bought the Focus Jam2 Pro for $5500. Di2, Shimano STEPS, lyrik fork and light. Can't beat the value and functionality.


Focus looks like a cool bike. If I were on a budget I'd probably consider it. Then again, if I had money problems I probably would just keep riding my 2016 Levo Expert as it's in great riding condition. Motor was recently replaced under warranty and just last week I put a new wheelset on her, greased all the pivots, and did a complete tune-up. She's quick, tight, and silent.

That said, I love having an e-bike in my quiver and having had a great year financially I wanted a new one with top of the line components. I've been riding SRAM XX1/carbon hoops/Guide brakes on my last 3 bikes. No question these components make a difference in how the bike performs.

Moreover, I prefer the Brose motor (especially the new version) over the Shimano. Also don't care for the Di2 or Shimano brakes. Thus the S-works Levo was my choice for a new steed.

But it's all good. To each his own. There are a lot of great E-MTBs out there. I ride several times a week on both my E and my Hightower. Everyone should have a bike they enjoy riding (and that will fit their budget) as it will encourage them to ride more often. More riding = more fun and better health.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Right on! I’m a Shimano Guy, so yeah. I’ve owned 3 Levo’s and just wanted to try something different. I agree, a good mix of bikes is fun.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I'm not saying folks are lazy because they buy a Levo, my wife has one ... of course my wife is not exactly an athlete (insert eye roll).

Specialized is a house hold name, they brought out a decent product, tried to bump the "level" by adding in a carbon option, but the bike remains essentially unchanged from the first offering.

So much needs to change in the ebike world. There needs to be a differentiation between ebikes and motorbikes; they have classes of ebikes, but that's all become so blurred as to be worthless.

Camus was irked by my "rant", but I didn't really say anything out of spite or to insult folks. Below is an edited version of my response to him from a PM:

"I can see the desire for high powered ebikes, just as I can see the desire for motos and ATV's, BUT those things don't belong on pedestrian and bicycle trails and more than motorcycles belong in bike lanes.

When people ask for high powered ebikes, they are essentially asking for a motor to replace their legs. That is why so many non ebikers oppose ebikes.

If the industry could step away for a moment and think more about the ultimate goal, they'd see the hole they are digging for themselves and ebike users.

When I read posts about ebikes and the comments emphasize motor engagement, power, and motor noise, versus rideability and weight, it's not hard to see what certain ebikers are looking for: A trail legal motorcycle.

If you support ebiking and want to see trail access increase vs decrease, you/we will need to embrace the idea that adding a motor to a bike is not a replacement for poor fitness. An ebike is a supplement for lesser fitness, diminished fitness, and physical disability.

Think about it this way: Is there a quantifiable limit as to how much power is enough for all users? The question begs the answer.

So instead of allowing the tail to wag the dog, we need set a limit that is reasonable, then the end user decides whether the available ebike is enough for their needs. If the end user is not satisfied with say 200w of power, then they can ride less challenging trails, they can get in better shape, or they can buy a high powered ebike and use it on trails designed for motorbikes.

So I'd say the Pivot is the closest step yet to a sustainable ebike ... if only they'd had the nerve to oppose the trends and go with a lighter weight/lower power system."

In a video interview, the owner of Pivot gave an example of a lower powered ebike that evolved from a university research project in Germany.



camus said:


> Meh. I disagree. I think the bikes are very comparable and it seems that the rest of the biking world does as well.
> 
> To say there is no comparison between the Levo S-works and the Shuttle pretty much ruins your credibility in my eyes as I have extensively ridden both and they are very similar in most respects with some differences. But they are very comparable.
> 
> ...


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## Zinfan (Jun 6, 2006)

Just because you find it confusing to tell an ebike from a motorcycle/moped dosen't make it true for the rest of us. It is pretty clear (in California at least) that a Class 1 bike is pedal assist, 20 mph max assist speed and 750w (I do wish they had gone for a 250w limit but there were apparently statutes on the books about 750w motors for something that I don't know what it was). Class 2 has the same limits as Class 1 but is throttle assist not pedal assist. Class 3 has the max speed raised to 28 mph before assist is turned off. 

I don't want a motorcycle, I already have two but I do love having a bike that allows me to ride 11 miles to the trails, get in 10 miles of riding and then ride back home. Of course this puts me way out of your level of riding but I really don't care what other riders do with their time, knock yourself out but I get more riding in on an ebike than on my normal bike and I have fresher legs for the downhills and hence more fun there as well. 

The industry isn't digging themselves a hole other than a few outfits pedaling (hehe) high power as a selling point. The Pivot, Focus, Trek and Specialized offerings are all in the 250w power range. Again and again the argument about out of shape (I raise my hand for that) are the only ones wanting or needing an ebike ignores the fact that they are popular with many riders in Europe and as far as I've seen or read don't seem to be causing havoc on the trails either due to excessive speed or damaging the trails themselves.

As far a Pivot needing to improve their ebike offering I'll just say that unless you have the ability to develop your own motor ( Rocky Mountain did I believe and if they ever go on sale in the U.S. you might want to give it a look) there won't be any low power/lightweight motors to develop a bike around so Pivot will have to wait for Shimano or Brose or Bosch to make one for them. Pivot did do work to get the battery more in line with the frame and moved the motor a bit to allow for short chain stays so they could have a faster handling ebike.

There is a discussion between Gratch and I about improving the performance of our Focus Jam2's and there is no talk about motor power or noise.


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## camus (Apr 21, 2004)

Zinfan said:


> Just because you find it confusing to tell an ebike from a motorcycle/moped dosen't make it true for the rest of us. .


Agreed.

It is simply mind-boggling that there are so many people who don't ride or own an e-bike but claim to experts on the subject. They know the profile of the average e-biker, what bike is the best, what a multi-million dollar bicycle manufacturer should change on their e-bike, and so on.

Then there is the second puzzler: Why do these people even come to the E-bike forums? I don't ride a fatbike so I'm not going to go over to the fatbike forum wasting my and others' time claiming to know everything about fatbikes. I'm not a clydesdale thus I have no reason to head over the clydesdale threads and start talking out my ass.

Sometimes I think I just need a break from the internet.


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## Harryman (Jun 14, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> So I'd say the Pivot is the closest step yet to a sustainable ebike ... if only they'd had the nerve to oppose the trends and go with a lighter weight/lower power system."


It'll be interesting to see if this is successful on the road, I could definitely see it as a category in emtb, but I'd suspect the makers would target the xc/marathon sort of market, not the endorobros.

Bafang enters the e-road market with new M800 motor | electric bike reviews, buying advice and news


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## honkinunit (Aug 6, 2004)

Harryman said:


> It'll be interesting to see if this is successful on the road, I could definitely see it as a category in emtb, but I'd suspect the makers would target the xc/marathon sort of market, not the endorobros.
> 
> Bafang enters the e-road market with new M800 motor | electric bike reviews, buying advice and news


The Fazua system is much better since the battery and motor are made to be removed in seconds, dropping 10lb.

https://ebike-mtb.com/en/first-review-focus-raven-fazua-e-mtb/


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

People come to this forum for many reasons, some are curious, some are frustrated, some have an agenda, some have ebikes, some want an ebike, some support an ebike.

I will someday have an ebike, I support limited use of ebikes, and my wife has an ebike that I maintain; it's her second one.

As my wife has advanced from a Levo hardtail to a Levo FSR, I have kept track of her skills, fitness on and off season, and her e-assist needs.

Even after a hard ride today, 2.5k climbing, four hours of riding, mix of single and double track, tech, flow, all at 7-9k elevation, off season fitness, she only used 30% of her battery running up to 40% assist.

This ^ is why I don't see the need for bigger and heavier systems. If she had half as much batter/motor on her Levo it would be easier to ride and likely more fun.

I think ebike designers using the Daniel Pinkerton measure to build ebikes, ie one size fits all or should I say one size that is powerful enough to satisfy the majority of potential users.

The problem is, most people really don't need a v-8, but if it's the only choice, then we're back in the sixties until reality strikes. Good luck selling people a 10k bike that weighs 45#. But drop 5# and a couple grand, now you got s winner.



camus said:


> Agreed.
> 
> It is simply mind-boggling that there are so many people who don't ride or own an e-bike but claim to experts on the subject. They know the profile of the average e-biker, what bike is the best, what a multi-million dollar bicycle manufacturer should change on their e-bike, and so on.
> 
> ...


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

My focus Pro 29er (XL) weighs 46#. I have shed 2# with a higher end wheel set, but beefed up with a Topaz Shock, and 150 Lyrik fork. This is sporty for an aluminum frame. 378wh in the downtube is really all you need for short 10-18 mile rides.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

And has zero issues manualling and small bunny hops ~3’. (JK)


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

Great thread. I'm getting ready to review the Pivot Shuttle which I've been riding for a few months. Any other feedback? Anyone buy it?

I also have the Mondraker e-crusher and Focus Jam2 in the stable. I've ridden the Levo and Kenevo a bit.

fc


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## ron t (Jun 15, 2018)

Mentioned earlier, I can't help being intrigued by the new Fazua drive bikes coming out in 2019:https://fazua.com/en/evation/bikes/?page=1

Particularly the Lapierre eZesty. The website is still showing a fuzzy picture, but the price of 6K Euros might convert to $7K in USD (I hope): https://shop.lapierrebikes.com/ezesty-am-90-ultimate. I hope these become available in the US.

I have my Haibike with a powerful motor for bombing around on my normal rides, but something I could remove the motor and battery from for non E-Bike trail riding would be awesome.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

caught this ride review. the fun factor is quite appealing, as is recovery ride, but no way I could swing the price passed the boss.






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Pivot should offer the Shuttle with a price point option (aluminum, no DI, no Eagle) and a frame only option; they'd be the first on a frame only.

The 10k price tag is more expensive than most people will spend on a high end non-emtb.

It's the best ebike made, but it's still very heavy. I'd reduce the motor and battery size/weight, cut the cost by 30% by going aluminum frame and components, use the KISS principle vs building a show/demonstration bike.



fc said:


> Great thread. I'm getting ready to review the Pivot Shuttle which I've been riding for a few months. Any other feedback? Anyone buy it?
> 
> I also have the Mondraker e-crusher and Focus Jam2 in the stable. I've ridden the Levo and Kenevo a bit.
> 
> fc


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

I’d personally rather gave my focus and $2500 in my pocket. I also have the benefit of Carbon wheels being 29ers. Same motor, di2, I have better brakes and same weight. I owned a Pivot Trail and really this Focus rear end handles awesome with the DVO Topaz Shock. I think if you don’t need a huge battery, it’s over rated for the $.


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## brownpownow (Jul 19, 2018)

Nurse Ben said:


> high end non-emtb.


Normal folks call those things high-end MTBs.


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## Giant Warp (Jun 11, 2009)

There is a review for the Pivot on the MTBR home page. It says $10K, no water bottle and battery changes take 10 minutes. NO THANKS! I am very happy with my Levo at 3000 miles. Honestly, who cares about a couple of pounds of weight saving on an ebike. For more than epic rides I steal the battery off of my wife's Levo and throw it in my Camelbak. 

Don't take my post wrong. If you think the Pivot is better than by all means go for it. Just stating that at double the price plus what the article said, it is not for me. Cheers


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