# Ride Often and Ride Hard



## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

I've had some knee issues this year. Well, a knee issue since the pain is only in my right knee. 

The knee pain usually begins the last month of ski season and clears up in a few weeks. This year, it did not go away so I decided to have it checked by our family Orthopedist or more correctly, the Physicians Assistant my wife dealt with for a decade before finally needing bi-lateral knee replacement last October. (She was skiing again in February)

I arrive at the office, had a battery of x-rays and Kris, the PA, joined me. He poked and prodded and zeroed in on the pain. We discussed the cause which turned out to be mild arthritis not needing any treatment. I have options such as a lubricating injection if needed but decided I didn't want anything at this time. The pain is not debilitating. I skied five days ago and as soon as I turn the cranks, the pain disappears. 

Kris knows the family and said he could give me a list of exercises but for me it was just "ride hard and ride often."

Now when I ride, I'm just following the doctors orders.


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## MSU Alum (Aug 8, 2009)

It sounds as though my fix may not apply to you, but may for others. 
I'm 68 and I got in 82 days of skiing this season, all on telemark gear (and probably average 5 bump runs per day of skiing), and was getting some pain under both of my kneecaps but predominately the right side. It's a pain I sometimes get mountain biking as well. Fiddling around with my kneecap, it seemed as though it had very little side to side range of motion and I thought maybe that was causing it to track improperly. I started pushing the kneecap side to side and up and down before going skiing about half way through last season (and now biking) and the range of motion of the kneecap has improved considerably. Also, the pain is completely gone and hasn't returned.
Glad your pain is subsiding.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

MSU Alum said:


> It sounds as though my fix may not apply to you, but may for others.
> I'm 68 and I got in 82 days of skiing this season, all on telemark gear (and probably average 5 bump runs per day of skiing), and was getting some pain under both of my kneecaps but predominately the right side. It's a pain I sometimes get mountain biking as well. Fiddling around with my kneecap, it seemed as though it had very little side to side range of motion and I thought maybe that was causing it to track improperly. I started pushing the kneecap side to side and up and down before going skiing about half way through last season (and now biking) and the range of motion of the kneecap has improved considerably. Also, the pain is completely gone and hasn't returned.
> Glad your pain is subsiding.


I'll be 72 in June so we are about the same age. So far, I've gotten in 64 days skiing this season because of Covid restrictions. I say so far because in NJ we have one of only three indoor ski slopes with real snow in the world meaning I can ski all year (yes it's small but it keeps you in shape. The other two areas are in Tokyo and Dubai). While I have a variety of skis, none are tele though I have tried that in the past.

Last year I got 120 days biking. I'm going for 121 this year. I have to follow the doctors orders after all.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

I was riding quite a bit last year and started experiencing knee and hip pain. I made an appointment to see a doc but in the interem I started riding more at a harder intensity. Pain went away and I cancelled the appointment.


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## trulede (Sep 12, 2018)

Try this if you want ... New Zealand Green-Lipped Mussel ... got the tip from a vet, good enough for the dog, good enough for me.


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## MSU Alum (Aug 8, 2009)

trulede said:


> Try this if you want ... New Zealand Green-Lipped Mussel ... got the tip from a vet, good enough for the dog, good enough for me.


I love these caveats:

"New Zealand green-lipped mussel is used for asthma, arthritis, exercise-induced muscle soreness, attention deficit-hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), and many other conditions, but *there is no good scientific evidence to support any of these uses".*

"*When taken by mouth*: New Zealand green-lipped mussel is *POSSIBLY SAFE* for most people."


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## trulede (Sep 12, 2018)

MSU Alum said:


> I love these caveats:
> 
> "New Zealand green-lipped mussel is used for asthma, arthritis, exercise-induced muscle soreness, attention deficit-hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), and many other conditions, but *there is no good scientific evidence to support any of these uses".*
> 
> "*When taken by mouth*: New Zealand green-lipped mussel is *POSSIBLY SAFE* for most people."


Well, to be fair, its an American website ... lets say ... vested interests at play


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

*Member has removed content due to fundamental disagreement with this site owner's views favoring expanded access for electric mountain bikes (eMtb) on multiuse singletrack in public lands.*


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

D. Inoobinati said:


> What kind of knee pain are we talking about here. In the last year, I've started experiencing some knee pain as well, but only on the first few steps when going up stairs.
> 
> Mainly bent knee under load, even when going down rock gardens. Disappears after some minutes, but it's walways in the back of my mind.


 On a scale of one to ten, I would say five for the pain level. The pain is located to the outside of my right knee just above and below the knee cap. It hurts when I first bent my leg but quickly goes away when riding. Usually after two or three pedal strokes.

As my PA said, it is mild arthritis and not yet in need of any treatment. I went to him just to be on the safe side in case I had a muscle tear or some other injury. My RN wife predicted arthritis. Riding loosens it up and builds muscle strength. When I ski the pain lasts a bit longer but that sport is not really effected either.

My goal is to ski and/or bike a combined total of 180 days a year and at this point, I have no trouble reaching that level of activity. To put it in prospective, I turn 72 next month which I mentioned in a reply to someone else.

I hope this info helps.


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

I have a reoccurring left knee issue that probably stems from a broken knee (BMX) and torn ACL (Skateboarding) when I was in my teens. I comes and goes, and I kind of know how play around it. Skiing too hard all day will make it a one day trip. Skiing hard half a day with 600 mg ibuprofen prior to skiing then icing the knee after (while sipping a beer) I could do for a week. Walking down hills will swell it up good. Riding up hill, descending the steeps over rock gardens (I'll walk that section ), gap jumps (I'll go around), 20 -30 miles of bumpy dirt trails... no swelling.. no ibuprofen required.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

That advice makes me wary, but maybe it's arthritis-specific. I've had recent pain in a leg adductor or other muscle in that area, and doubt pushing things harder that I currently ride would help.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Crankout said:


> That advice makes me wary, but maybe it's arthritis-specific. I've had recent pain in a leg adductor or other muscle in that area, and doubt pushing things harder that I currently ride would help.


I'm not saying that advice is for everyone but we know the PA very well, he is young and athletic and understands exactly what I am talking about when I describe how and how often I ski and ride. He also had plenty of x-rays to back up his opinion so nothing was broken, pulled or otherwise injured. By riding often and hard, I will continue to build up the muscles around the knee and it keeps the arthritic joints loose too. As we age, we loose muscle at an ever greater rate.

Its a win-win for me. It's almost as good as the time many years ago when my chiropractor told my wife I really needed to get a full suspension bike if I wanted to avoid back injury*. That doc also happened to be one of my skiing and riding buddies.

_I listened and took up a standing offer*_ from my local Giant rep to get a Trance at dealer cost. 
** That offer was a result of all the posting I did on MTBR in the early two thousands and the articles I had published in Dirt Rag (May they RIP).


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## ddoh (Jan 11, 2017)

I'm 70 and have a very similar issue. The knee rarely bothers me while riding, but hurts other times. Icing it in the evening really helps. I've also had good results with topical CBD for other arthritis issues.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

ddoh said:


> I'm 70 and have a very similar issue. The knee rarely bothers me while riding, but hurts other times. Icing it in the evening really helps. I've also had good results with topical CBD for other arthritis issues.


I've thought about topical CBD and have tried something we got in Alaska called Devils Club which is supposed to sooth and protect but doesn't seem to make much difference. It makes no claims about working on arthritis though. I should try icing this evening.

I find the biggest pain issue comes when I get into the driver's seat of my wife's VW Golf. It seems I have to bend my leg in just the wrong way. I'm 5'11" these days so not exceptionally tall.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

I like CBD too but only if it also contains a healthy amount of THC.


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## ddoh (Jan 11, 2017)

J.B. Weld said:


> I like CBD too but only if it also contains a healthy amount of THC.


I like my CBD external and my THC internal.


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## Crankout (Jun 16, 2010)

Rev Bubba said:


> I'm not saying that advice is for everyone but we know the PA very well, he is young and athletic and understands exactly what I am talking about when I describe how and how often I ski and ride. He also had plenty of x-rays to back up his opinion so nothing was broken, pulled or otherwise injured. By riding often and hard, I will continue to build up the muscles around the knee and it keeps the arthritic joints loose too. As we age, we loose muscle at an ever greater rate.
> 
> Its a win-win for me. It's almost as good as the time many years ago when my chiropractor told my wife I really needed to get a full suspension bike if I wanted to avoid back injury*. That doc also happened to be one of my skiing and riding buddies.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info. I too switched to FS way back when to save my back.

It turns out that in my case (tight and sore adductor), a simple saddle change alleviated it on yesterday's ride. I tipped the nose down slightly and no pain today.


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## bitflogger (Jan 12, 2004)

This might resonate with this group. One physician wanted to do surgery right away for age and wear related. Another told me to put off that fancy metal in the body and enjoy it in all the sports technology I can now.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

bitflogger said:


> This might resonate with this group. One physician wanted to do surgery right away for age and wear related. Another told me to put off that fancy metal in the body and enjoy it in all the sports technology I can now.


That resonates with me. Years ago, a doctor told my wife she needed both knees replaced - at once. The Physicians Assistant we deal with (same office) said he had an option she could try. Injections to lubricate her knees. Ten years later, that PA (who treated me) told her the time had finally come that knee replacement was the only thing left to get rid of her pain. She had them both done last October and is doing fine. Even skied a few months after the surgery.


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

Well.... Not too hard. Came off a jump wrong today, and landed with my rear tire off the side of the landing ramp. Instant highside and over the bars. Tasted blood in my mouth along with dirt. This was the hardest fall I've taken in quite a while. It felt like a car crash. Didn't puncture, rupture or brake anything, but trail rash head to toe, sprained wrist and torn intercostals up and down my right side. Doctor said I was his third mountain bike injury today. He said 3 per Saturday is about the average Still smiling... but hurting..









Need to cool it on the jump lines......


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

Found this.... More of us older guys taking cycling risks due to COVID,,,,,








New CDC Report Finds More Adults Are Dying from Bicycle-Related Accidents; CPSC Says it Highlights the Importance of Helmets


New CDC Report Finds More Adults Are Dying from Bicycle-Related Accidents; CPSC Says it Highlights the Importance of Helmets




www.cpsc.gov


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

Tall BMX'r said:


> Found this.... More of us older guys taking cycling risks due to COVID,,,,,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


BTW, I'm recovering..... This was a bad fall.... OUT OF SERVICE for a while.


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

Tall BMX'r said:


> BTW, I'm recovering..... This was a bad fall.... OUT OF SERVICE for a while.


Ouch. What was the final verdict? Healing vibes.


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

stripes said:


> Ouch. What was the final verdict? Healing vibes.


I'll recover and get back to riding soon enough. But this was a wake up call. I don't bounce. No more big jumps.


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Tall BMX'r said:


> Found this.... More of us older guys taking cycling risks due to COVID,,,,,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This report is just one part of the discussion.

How many more adult males over 40 are living longer because they actively take part in strenuous exercise such as cycling? Do the risks outweigh the gains? I feel they do but am I trying to justify cycling? I know I can't justify a $5k bike over a perfectly rideable $500 one. My buddy who rides a $500 bike may be getting more benefit then me because he has to work harder but he rides less because he has to work harder so maybe I did justify a $5k bike.


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## ZX11 (Dec 24, 2020)

It is what the article doesn't say. Increase of adults in our age range dying while biking is from more careless adults and less helmet use? It is implied but not supported. Increase of adults in our age range dying is from an increase in adults in our age range riding bikes.

In a way, the increase in bike trails has caused an increase in adult deaths.


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

Not sleeping at night because I can't find a comfortable position do to my torn intercostals on multiple ribs and two sprained wrists. Almost done with the wound socks that have been covering my arms at night so I don't bleed all over the bed. All of this is due to me jumping at 58 years old. I just don't react as fast as I used to. Being out of commission just sucks. A friend of mine was riding yesterday and said they had to heli-vac a mountain biker who had crashed very near where I crashed last weekend. I was able to ride out , but just barely. 
Like my doctor said, he sees about 3 mtb patients a day on the weekends. I told him "it won't happen again to me because I usually ride on the weekdays"😄


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

Tall BMX'r said:


> Not sleeping at night because I can't find a comfortable position do to my torn intercostals on multiple ribs and two sprained wrists. Almost done with the wound socks that have been covering my arms at night so I don't bleed all over the bed. All of this is due to me jumping at 58 years old. I just don't react as fast as I used to. Being out of commission just sucks. A friend of mine was riding yesterday and said they had to heli-vac a mountain biker who had crashed very near where I crashed last weekend. I was able to ride out , but just barely.
> Like my doctor said, he sees about 3 mtb patients a day on the weekends. I told him "it won't happen again to me because I usually ride on the weekdays"


Healing vibes. Torn intercostals suck. I've done both sides a few years ago and my left serratus still tries to overcompensate. I'm 47 and I did that 3 years ago. Being out of commission does suck.

What type of jump did you mess up on?


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

It's like a steep gap jump that's filled in in the middle. A steep pop up ramp level top about 10' long then a steep down ramp. the whole thing is a mound built off of a flat trail. I usually pop it and wheelie the flat and just pump down the ramp. This time I was messing with more fork pressure 110 psi Fox 36 one token and didn't increase the damper. Plus my front tire was too low. It squirmed on take off. Then the big spring from the high pressure fork and a little too much speed. All added up to off balance take-off which caused me to land on the side of the mound. It just crossed me up and I did a highside face plant landing. I think it was the low pressure front tire that cause it. It only had about 15 psi and I'm 230lbs. Plus compressing against the steep ramp. 
Here a picture of me on the same jump line trail. It's a series of jumps. The jump I crashed on is about 50 yards past this one.


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## Tall BMX'r (Jan 11, 2021)

Jumping is in my DNA, but I am almost 60...... Time to keep the wheels on the ground and no more Jump line.


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