# 2800ma AMC7135 multi mode driver boards



## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I ordered some of these boards to test.
https://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=10995

Edit: Updated image for 105C boards from Kaidoman
(Previous image was not correct) 
Larger image link
https://www.el34world.com/Misc/bike/images/IMG_6596.png










Looks like it will save me a bunch of labor, instead of having to create 2800ma drivers from two 1400ma boards. Have to wait and see if they work out or not.

I am curious if anyone else has more info on the operation of these boards???

How do you cycle through the modes???

I am hoping that you use a NC (Normally closed) momentary switch and disconnect/reconnect ground to the star that you are currently using?

Or do you interrupt the power from the battery to the whole board assembly?

BTW, the Artic alumina thermal adhesive may work out really nice for installing heat sink slugs in the Marwi Bullet housings.
It set up really hard in a short amount of time.
I took a dremel wire wheel and removed all the red annodizing in order to get down to bare aluminum. It was fast and easy to get down to the bare metal. The adhesive is against two bare aluminum surfaces.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

The boards aren't too bad at all. The modes are (unfortunately for you) switched by interrupting the power to the whole board. The design of the board is for one of the stars to be (permanently) connected to ground, and which star is connected determines the modes which the board will cycle through when the power is interrupted. After all, it is designed to operate in a flashlight and to be set up and left.

It is designed to use a latching switch (on / off), but a normally closed would also work if you don't mind disconnecting the battery to turn it off (off isn't one of the modes the board cycles through!). Normally the full power of the LED does flow through the switch, but there is a way of wiring it such that it doesn't. The positive LED lead from the driver is connected to V+, so you can connect the LED to V+ from the battery rather than on the board. Then put the switch in the positive supply lead to the driver and it will only be switching the power for the driver circuitry, not the LEDs as well. Let me know if you need a circuit diagram for that.

Michael

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Been building with those boards over the past 6 months. No problems at all.

I always set them to high/low (star number 4 ) and use the latching switch from mouser. I just flutter the power button to switch modes. 

The low is just in case of break down while on the trail.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34,

That driver looks eerily similar to the one I bought from Illumination Supply but a couple dollars more (+shipping) and I received mine in a few days.

8xAMC7135 (2.8A) (selectable) Mode Driver - $6.75 : Illumination Supply, Dedicated to bringing you products of superior Quality and Reliability

I had them jumper mine for the low/med/high mode (see pic below). You've raised a good question about the mode selection. I will have to re-read the posts but I could have sworn that someone did a "half tap" on the switch and it changed modes. Are you saying that the original Marwi switch (in the new style Marwi) will not accept the higher amps from the 18650 2400mah cells the way they are wired?


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

It is the same, and you can also buy it from shiningbeam in the US. You can change modes by half-tapping the common type of latching switch. It is a flashlight driver and is designed to change modes upon temporary interruption to the power supply. Flashlights have a latching switch that toggles between open and closed upon a full press, just like a ball-point pen. When the switch is closed the light is on, when it is open the light is off as all power is cut. However most flashlights use what is known as a "reverse-clicky" switch, meaning it latches to the next state only when the switch is released after being fully depressed. If you only partially depress the switch it will only temporarily break the circuit, not latching into the open, or off, state. So with a reverse clicky switch you tap the switch to change modes, press fully and release to turn on / off


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Excellent replies.
Got to run out the door right now.
Will be back in a few hours to digest the info.
Thnks


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

I knew I remembered reading something about tapping the switch lightly to change modes:

http://forums.mtbr.com/8530481-post17.html


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

I used those boards from kaidomain. With my cheap and big iron it's very difficult to solder the (-)-thread from the LED to the board. Shiningbeam sells them with the threads already on I think.
The clicky switches from dealextreme break very quickly, probably because of the high current. Perhaps this big ones are better?

If someone is interested: this board is not capable to light three XR-E wired parallel from a single 18650 cell. :nono: 
But with two of those boards you can drive two XM-L's from a single 18650.  Not that I would ever try such a silly thing ....

Still haven't managed to build a very light helemet torchlight with enough throw. Has anybody ever tried to direct drive a XM-L from a 18650 LiFePO4?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> The boards aren't too bad at all. The modes are (unfortunately for you) switched by interrupting the power to the whole board. The design of the board is for one of the stars to be (permanently) connected to ground, and which star is connected determines the modes which the board will cycle through when the power is interrupted. After all, it is designed to operate in a flashlight and to be set up and left.
> 
> It is designed to use a latching switch (on / off), but a normally closed would also work if you don't mind disconnecting the battery to turn it off (off isn't one of the modes the board cycles through!). Normally the full power of the LED does flow through the switch, but there is a way of wiring it such that it doesn't. The positive LED lead from the driver is connected to V+, so you can connect the LED to V+ from the battery rather than on the board. Then put the switch in the positive supply lead to the driver and it will only be switching the power for the driver circuitry, not the LEDs as well. Let me know if you need a circuit diagram for that.


mfj197 that pretty much answers everything I needed to know.
I think I can still make it work just like it does in a flashlight.

Woke up this morning and realized that the Judco switches that fit the Marwi Bullet housings are rated 2 amp at 14 volts.
In theory they should be good to go for a higher amperage at a lower voltage. I am using parallel battery packs, so the voltage is only 3.7 to 4.2 volts.
They were used in the original 6 volt Halogen Marwi's and I have never seen one melt down.

The switches look like this









OD, thanks for the info. Yeah, I am only interested in low-high myself


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

Well, switch current rating isn't really voltage dependent so you can't trade volts for amps. Having said that, you'd be asking a 2A switch to operate at 150% of its design capacity - it would probably work fine, just in the same way as you can drive an XP-E at 1.5A although it's only rated for 1A. The only way is to suck it and see, and make sure the switch is accessible!

I forgot to mention earlier, I have two of these boards. One is great, and the other one starts to flicker a bit when the battery voltage is low. I haven't looked into why! The other thing is they are very sensitive to voltage interruptions and will change mode very readily - the merest bump on the battery pack can cause it to change mode if the batteries aren't well connected.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

mfj197 said:


> The other thing is they are very sensitive to voltage interruptions and will change mode very readily - the merest bump on the battery pack can cause it to change mode if the batteries aren't well connected.


So worse case scenario is maybe to somehow jumper it in the high mode if it is too sensitive and constantly switches modes? That would suck on a fast downhill to have it switch from high to low


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> Well, switch current rating isn't really voltage dependent so you can't trade volts for amps


Sure you can. Many switches have multiple ratings at different voltages 
example: 3 amps at 250v or 6amps at 125vac

Of course voltage is pressure and at 3.7volts there isn't much pressure.



> the merest bump on the battery pack can cause it to change mode if the batteries aren't well connected


Just one more reason why I only use and build only soldered battery packs.


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## mtnpat (Jan 12, 2004)

Interesting...I just soldered up and installed my first one of these.

I did jumper the star in position # 3 to ground, but I did NOT cut the trace from position # 1 to ground....I am however getting a low (very low) medium and high setting.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> I did jumper the star in position # 3 to ground, but I did NOT cut the trace from position # 1 to ground....I am however getting a low (very low) medium and high setting


hmm, I got that drawing off the Candle power forum. Don't really know if it is accurate, but it sounds like the correct thing to do.

Just got off the phone with Judco switches.
I asked about me wanting to run 2.8 amps through the switch.
They said that the best thing to do would be to runs some real world test. 
So, I am going to throw together a Marwi housing with a P7 and let the current limit boards cap the current at 2.8 amps. Run it on the bench for a few hours and then open up the switch to see how it did.

Off to do some test


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

El34 said:


> Just got off the phone with Judco switches.
> I asked about me wanting to run 2.8 amps through the switch.
> They said that the best thing to do would be to runs some real world test.
> So, I am going to throw together a Marwi housing with a P7 and let the current limit boards cap the current at 2.8 amps. Run it on the bench for a few hours and then open up the switch to see how it did.
> ...


The switch will need to be cycled under load to really see how it copes. The make and break of the circuit is what is hard on the contacts.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I opened up one of the Judco switches and had a look at the construction.
The contacts look better than clicky switches I have taken apart.
They look beefy enough to me, but I will be putting them through some clicking test under load.

The Judco engineer says that they test them for about 4 hours under heavy load to see if heat is a factor.
The plastic could get soft if it is too much for the switch

I actually had this happen on some cheap clicky switches I got a long time ago.
DX substituted another switch for one that was known to work just fine

All of a sudden my lights were melting switches
Had to ***** at DX and get the original clickies shipped to me
Problem fixed, so there is a difference in switch body plastics.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

If the original Marwi switches can't take it, couldn't we rig them with some remote switches instead? Leave the "dummy" switches in the plastic light bodies and tie in a remote switch that could be mounted (or zip tied) within reach of your hand?

What about a heavier duty switch with the same size and configuration that will take the load???


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

yes, I can do it with the Marwi remote switches I already have but then that means it's a bar mount only light.

Trying to put a remote switch on a helmet light won't cut it.

I am trying to make one light bar or helmet mount.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> The switches look like this


My switch is black and has 2 wires coming out of it. It has a wire coming out where the tip of the "A" is and no wire to the right of the "A" (still a wire coming out of the left side of the "A"). Does this mean my switch is Normally Open then?


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> yes, I can do it with the Marwi remote switches I already have but then that means it's a bar mount only light.
> 
> Trying to put a remote switch on a helmet light won't cut it.
> 
> I am trying to make one light bar or helmet mount.


Let's hope the original switches hold up!

I would not be opposed to going with a remote switch on a short lead using these on your website if we needed to:


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> My switch is black and has 2 wires coming out of it. It has a wire coming out where the tip of the "A" is and no wire to the right of the "A" (still a wire coming out of the left side of the "A"). Does this mean my switch is Normally Open then?


No, yours is a simple SPST latching switch

Click one = The two black wires are connected
Click two = The two black wires are not connected

The Judco switch you have is the one that I will be testing.

The extra hole in your switch body is for when they make a SPDT switch and use the same housing as the SPST switches.

BTW, I order some new SPST latching switches
Just like the ones you have in the Bullet Marwi's except they have solder tabs. They should be here next week.
I like the solder tab switches better than the ones with stranded wire leads.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

Vancbiker said:


> The switch will need to be cycled under load to really see how it copes. The make and break of the circuit is what is hard on the contacts.


So only when the switch is turned on and off is it hard on the contacts? If that is the case, how many times would it take to melt the switch. I could see if this was a light switch in a house but how often would the switch really get used? Are we getting our undies in a bunch?


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> No, yours is a simple SPST latching switch


So will these switches work with the multi mode driver by doing a "half tap" of the switch to change modes?


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

mntn-biker said:


> So only when the switch is turned on and off is it hard on the contacts? If that is the case, how many times would it take to melt the switch. I could see if this was a light switch in a house but how often would the switch really get used? Are we getting our undies in a bunch?


Any time a switch is cycled there is an arc produced. The size of the arc is proportional to the voltage and current being switched and the time that the contacts are within the arc distance that the voltage and current can generate. The arc causes erosion on the contacts. Switches are typically designed to "snap" the contacts open and closed to minimize the arcing time. This prolongs the contact life. Switches are usually designed to operate at their max rating for 100,000+ operations. Running it above the max rating will reduce that life. If a bike light switch survived a few thousand cycles, most people would be OK with that.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> So only when the switch is turned on and off is it hard on the contacts


I have never seen one of the Judco switches fail in all of the Marwi halogens I have taken apart. It's not even an issue for me. We are switching very low voltages.

Arcing happens when a high voltage tries to jump a gap and leaves a burnt carbon trace.

If you start talking about switching 120vac, then you see arcing of the switch contacts. My 240 vac well pump has 4 contacts and it does some serious arcing.

You are not going to see arcing on 3.7 volt switch contacts. The voltage potential is just not high enough to want to jump a gap.
If you do the old compare electricity to water deal and think of a water hose
Voltage = The water pressure
Amperage = the amount of water (current) flowing through the hose.



> So will these switches work with the multi mode driver by doing a "half tap" of the switch to change modes.


Yes, all you need to do is depress the rubber boot just a tad and then let go.
Enough to disengage the contacts without clicking the switch. 
It's easier to do on the big Judco switches found on the older bell shaped Marwi lights, but it works on bullet Marwi switches also.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I was able to build a test Marwi this afternoon.

I set up the Marwi bullet housing with two 1400ma board in parallel (because I don't have the new multi mode boards yet)

I turned on the light at 4 something this afternoon.
The total current being drawn into the light went to 2.8 amps and then settled in at about 2.7 amps.

I switched it off and on several times over a 30 minute period while I was still at my shop.

Then I left the shop and let it run for 3+ hours
I went back to my shop to check on it a while ago.
The light is still running right at 2.7 amps and still switches on and off perfectly.

Had to shut it off for the evening, but I will turn it back on when I get to my shop in the morning and continue testing.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

mfj197 said:


> ...The other thing is they are very sensitive to voltage interruptions and will change mode very readily - the merest bump on the battery pack can cause it to change mode if the batteries aren't well connected.


Actually, the NANJG drivers are more amune to transients due to the mode switching design. It takes two very close events to switch modes. If you have a solid connection to power, this should never happen. I run 18650 flashlights with springs on both ends of the batteries and never get a mode-change due to a glitch. ...And these are mounted right to my axles.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 - Your testing sounds promising! Thanks for the testing and results! I'm just gonna run with my switch for what little use it will get during the fall season as we keep losing daylight. I ride mostly trails so once the snow flies and gets too deep to ride, I switchover to XC skiing.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

mntn-biker said:


> So worse case scenario is maybe to somehow jumper it in the high mode if it is too sensitive and constantly switches modes? That would suck on a fast downhill to have it switch from high to low


I had a flashlight do this with this driver when mounted on the bars (but not on the helmet) due to the weight of the battery moving around and causing a momentary loss of connection. There are various ways of getting round it - capacitor in the supply line to the microcontroller on the board for example, and of course mounting the batteries correctly prevents this being an issue in the first place as El34 says.


El34 said:


> Sure you can. Many switches have multiple ratings at different voltages
> example: 3 amps at 250v or 6amps at 125vac


The vast majority of switches do not have multiple ratings - they have a maximum current rating and a maximum voltage rating. This is because they are describing different things - it is voltage across the terminals that causes an electric arc to start as a switch is closed or opened, ionizing the air and forming plasma. It is however current that maintains this arc and the power and heat produced both whilst the arc is present and also in steady state switch contact is dependent upon the current (not voltage). But as I say, best thing to do is to give it a go and see if the switch handles it, exactly as you are doing.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

'BentRyder said:


> Actually, the NANJG drivers are more amune to transients due to the mode switching design. It takes two very close events to switch modes.


That's true enough, but I've found this particular NANJG driver to be more susceptible to transients than other flashlight drivers I've had with mode memory. It could be because the other drivers have had a more substantial input capacitor to drive the microcontroller for a short while when power is interrupted (that's how they determine whether to change mode or not).

Incidentally I prefer the operation of the latter type of driver described above, as they only require one tap on the switch to change modes. With the NANJG 2800mA driver you have to tap it twice. The first tap effectively gets it into "mode switching" mode, the second tap will change mode, and subsequent taps immediately afterwards will continue changing mode. Leave it for a couple of seconds and it will lock into the current mode and you will need to do the first tap to get it back into "mode switching" mode again.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Ok, it takes two taps, did not know that.
I had searched the web and found the 2800ma board on many sites
Not one had a spec sheet or set of operating instructions.

Does such a thing exist?


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

El34 said:


> Ok, it takes two taps, did not know that.
> I had searched the web and found the 2800ma board on many sites
> Not one had a spec sheet or set of operating instructions.
> 
> Does such a thing exist?


Not that I've ever come across! The diagram earlier in this thread is the closest I've seen, and that goes for all the NANJG drivers. Indeed I seem to recall I found the stars gave slightly different combinations of modes than specified in the aforementioned diagram.

Could you use an LFlex in your design, which only requires a low current switch to change modes and gives you other functions such as temperature monitoring and battery monitoring?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I could, but all taskled drivers are way too expensive.
Last time I looked they were $25 each?

I am trying to keep the cost as low as possible on the lights.

There's $40 magic shines out there now.

I have had excellent results with the AMC7135 chips in my lights, so I am not ready to give up on them just yet.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I was able to find a bit more info on this forum posting
Review: NANJG 105A 2800mA driver | BudgetLightForum.com

There is no mention of cutting the trace to star #1


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

El34 said:


> I was able to find a bit more info on this forum posting
> Review: NANJG 105A 2800mA driver | BudgetLightForum.com
> 
> There is no mention of cutting the trace to star #1


Good little review. That review is confusingly of the sister board to the one in the first post here, although they are virtually identical. The board reviewed is the NANJG105A which uses a PIC microcontroller and the one in the first post here is the NANJG105 which uses an Atmel ATtiny microcontroller. The microcontrollers are not interchangeable as they have different pin-outs, but as I understand it the boards operate pretty much the same. Usually with Kaidomain and DX you don't quite know which one you will receive until it turns up - frustrating if you (like me) are trying to reprogram the microcontrollers!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> Usually with Kaidomain and DX you don't quite know which one you will receive until it turns up


You got that right!

DX screwed me by substituting crap clickie switches one time, the bodies melted.

The original Li-On chargers I used had high quality boards.
Now they send the same exact exterior with different guts.
Some of the parts don't even have any solder around them.

Just when you think you have a part nailed down and you are good to go, they throw a wrench into the works.

BTW, that review on the forum said this


> This one runs with a MCU PIC12F629 instead of the NANJG 105's ATtiny13


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

mtnpat said:


> I did NOT cut the trace from position # 1 to ground


Well, after closer observation, the driver that I ordered was not jumpered as I requested so I will need to jumper it myself. I will probably jumper the 4th star for only a low and high setting. I am guessing the "trace" jumpers star1 to ground giving the multi-mode setting by default? So I simply cut out a section of that area under the green plastic with an exacto knife then and then tin my star4 to the outer ring (negative)? Almost sounds like we do not need to cut this trace based on what mtnpat says from his experience. Guess I could solder the star4 and try it without cutting the trace?

Here's the image of my driver with the jumper in place. It is hard to tell if the trace is cut in this image:


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I am thinking that you don't have to undo Star #1 at all

ground star one after you connect star 4 and see what happens.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

mntn-biker said:


> Well, after closer observation, the driver that I ordered was not jumpered as I requested so I will need to jumper it myself. I will probably jumper the 4th star for only a low and high setting. I am guessing the "trace" jumpers star1 to ground giving the multi-mode setting by default? So I simply cut out a section of that area under the green plastic with an exacto knife then and then tin my star4 to the outer ring (negative)? Almost sounds like we do not need to cut this trace based on what mtnpat says from his experience. Guess I could solder the star4 and try it without cutting the trace?


Your process for cutting the trace is quite correct, but as El34 says give it a go without and see what happens. I seem to remember the mode stars operating slightly differently to what was in the original diagram.

Interestingly you have yet another flavour of the board - the NANJG105C. Which microcontroller does it use, a PIC or a ATtiny?

This link gives a quick rundown on some of the NANJG drivers available, and this link at Aqualab provides the definitive solution for anybody trying to find a particular driver for their needs.


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## mtnpat (Jan 12, 2004)

El34 said:


> hmm, I got that drawing off the Candle power forum. Don't really know if it is accurate, but it sounds like the correct thing to do.


I don't know either, but thanks for the drawing! Does seem like the correct thing to do if there is a jumper.

I ran the light with this driver last night for the first time and while I did have 3 distinct levels of light, and no strobe or other, it seemed to me that the setting (current level) for high would drift.....or not stay on high. Not sure that is the behavior that was happening but I am thinking it was.

Gotta do some more testing.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

If you are into doing your own 2.8amp, or even a 3.15amp mod to a NANJG driver, I can highly recommend the 16-mode (17-mode, actually) from oth DX or KaiDomain. The nice thing about this driver is the mode groups. It has 3-mode - hi/med/low; 5-mode - hi/med/lo/strobe/SOS; and 9-mode - lo/med/hi/strobe/police/.33hz/1hz/.1hz/SOS. This allows you to easily modify the function of your light to what you need. Nighttime, you just use the 3 mode while in the day, for being seen, you can get more attention. I really like the police strobe. Groups are switched when set on low mode and the light flashes once. Turn off the light and back on, and you are in the next group.

You can stack AMC7135's on top of the exiting regulators. Each is good for 350ma. Or you can scavenge the MP from this driver and put it on the 2.8A unit.

Here is the video of the modes; WARNING... its really borring the second time.
NANJG 16-Mode Flashlight Driver - YouTube

Here is the regulator stacked for an additional 350ma output; it is glued on using Arctic SIlver Epoxy


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

mrradlos said:


> But with two of those boards you can drive two XM-L's from a single 18650.  Not that I would ever try such a silly thing ....
> 
> Still haven't managed to build a very light helemet torchlight with enough throw. Has anybody ever tried to direct drive a XM-L from a 18650 LiFePO4?


You may want to take a look at the single and double I built last winter. Both use the 7135 boards and would be inexpensive to build. I can't imagine needing more throw (or spill) than the double has. I used the poorman setup to drive both LED's at 2.8A using a single 7135.

http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-diy-do-yourself/another-first-build-xml-677053.html


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## thwang-01 (Jul 5, 2008)

el34 i,ve been using one of your Judco switches with a 2.8 amp driver for well over a year and still going strong.
thwang


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Thanks for the update
I think you are talking about the regular big bodied switches that look like this?
They have a 5 amp current rating at 14 vdc










I am testing the flat bodied switches that look like this


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> I am testing the flat bodied switches that look like this


How's the testing going Doug? Inquiring minds want to know


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Over 8 hours run time on the bench
Current remains stable just under 2.8 amps the whole time.

I am calling it a sucess at this stage.

I am waiting on the 2.8 amp mutli mode boards to arrive so I can create a finished unit.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> Over 8 hours run time on the bench
> Current remains stable just under 2.8 amps the whole time.
> 
> I am calling it a sucess at this stage.
> ...


Does the switch get hot at all?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Yeah probably, no way I can feel it cause it's inside the housing.
Switch works perfectly at highest light body temperatures tested.

Here's a couple pics of my test rig with the light on the rig.
The body runs mid 80 Degrees F with cooling fan on.
Body temp will run up to 112 F with fan off

Note that cooling fan is 12 volt fan running at about 10 volts on AT computer supply. 
Light is being supplied 4.2 VDC like a fully charged 18650, from the 5 volt AT supply. 
The AT power supply is running through a Variac so that I can bring the voltages down where I want them

The meter on the left is showing 2.79 amps
Meter on the right shows 83 degrees F


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

Very nice testing setup Doug!!! I think you should have used one of those Corona boxes instead of the fancy osb box you made


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Haaaa, I figured someone whould call me out on the Corona boxes.
That's how I cool down the lights if they get too hot!!! :cornut:

BTW, here's a picture of the SPST switches I will be stocking and using with the 2.8 amp multi mode boards.
I ordered them with solder terminals because it's easier to solder on smaller diameter wires at the angle than to bend the big black wires around and try and stuff everything into the back of the housing.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

If anyone is looking for a quality switch for their project, these are pretty nice. They are -not- compatable with a lot of lights listed in the ad unless you reduce the OD of the PCB, but they are true KAN-028's which have been used in the Ultrafire 980L XM-L T6 flashlights running at 4.5 amps:

Manafont.com | $5.99 UltraFire Replacemnet Tailcap Switch Component (5pcs/set)

You can read my review on the site. For replacements, or upgrades, just replace the switch on the original PCB.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

'BentRyder said:


> If anyone is looking for a quality switch for their project, these are pretty nice. They are -not- compatable with a lot of lights listed in the ad unless you reduce the OD of the PCB, but they are true KAN-028's which have been used in the Ultrafire 980L XM-L T6 flashlights running at 4.5 amps:
> 
> Manafont.com | $5.99 UltraFire Replacemnet Tailcap Switch Component (5pcs/set)
> 
> You can read my review on the site. For replacements, or upgrades, just replace the switch on the original PCB.


And these would work in our Marwi lights how???


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

BentRyder, Those are for flashlights.  

What does that have to do with the Bullet shaped Marwi housings we are discussing here? 

----------------------------------------------------

The SPST Judco switches for the Marwi bullet housings just arrived.
See picture above
I'll be adding them to the catalog ASAP.


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

It looks like he is giving a switch option that can handle the hight draw current needed for the marwi build. 
Considering most of our abilities to modify, a switch like this might be usable in the Marwi lights.
Just an option I suppose.
I think the one El34 has should be fine, but options are always good.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I guess I did not state this anywhere up above

Only one type of switch will fit into the Bullet shaped Marwi's
The flat style switches that look like this.
There is no way to mount any other type of switch.
I would have already done that if it was possible. 

This page shows how these switches fit into the housings
Marwi Bullet Housing switches


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## mtroy (Jun 10, 2005)

Curious about the 7135 boards...how are you guys 'mounting' these or are they just sitting in the case of the light isolated from any contact(s)? I assume they do not need to be heat sinked, but rattling around does not sound good either


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

My plan is to cut some 1/32" thick round copper boards that are larger in diameter than the driver boards

The copper boards give you a much better place to solder connection wires. 

Picture a small circle inside a large circle and all the external solder points are on the perimeter of the big circle with lots of copper area to solder to.

The driver board is heat sinked/glued to the bigger copper board.
The small pads on the driver board connections are made from the driver board to the copper board with 20 gauge solid core buss wire. No need for wire with a jacket actually.

This dual board assembly is glued to the big heat sink wall to keep it in place.

The Switch/Battery -, Battery +, Led + and LED - connections are the four connections that need to be made on the outer ring of the large diameter copper board.

I cut these very thin copper boards all the time.
I use something similar in the Bell shaped P7 Marwi's I build.
This is a picture of the one I use in the old style Marwi housings.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

I'm willing to bet the KAN-028 will fit easily in the Marwi. This is after all a DIY mod to begin with. You pull the switch off the included PCB. That salvaged circuit board sound exactly what El34 is describing. 

Switches and high power lights are one of my pet peeves. That Marwi stock switch is driving current through the actuation spring. This is not preferred. It is much better to draw the current across the fixed plates where the center contact closes the circuit bypassing the spring completely. That is the reason I like the KAN-028 switches. 

But you guys know better obviously... so do what you want. I personally prefer a more reliable switch solution when I'm out in the dark. Good luck.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The Marwi rear tail housing was desinged for the Judco switches.
I have never seen another switch that will fit

That switch body looks too tall - Do you have exact body measurements?
It has to be .60 x .66 x .25 Tall - measurements are in inches

There are only PC connections - It needs bigger solder connections.

Do you have pictures of the contact points - internals?


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

A simple search on the web will give you all the dims...
And the terminals are plenty big for making a reliable connection.
It just happens to be soldered to a PCB.

kan-28 Flashlight switch or Electric torch switch Sales, Buy kan-28 Flashlight switch or Electric torch switch Products from alibaba.com

The insides work the same as the Marwi switches but it doesn't tap the center plate... it is simply used as a shunt.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I looked at the dimentions, it won't fit
The current is listed as 1.5 amps, but at 250vac


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

The KAN-28 will fit easily... .02" of the sides of the housing and a nice snug fit. Are you a DIY guy or not? Seriously... you're modding to include a driver board and a reflector but a little switch is to much for you to handle? LOL!!! If you have doubts, just send me one of the ends and I'll do it for you.

As stated before and which seems to be willfully ignored, Ultrafire puts these switches in their 980L flashlights with an XM-L very overdriven to 4.5 amps. They also offer a 180 day warrantee on their lights so they know something we don't. The "equivalent" budget Omron swithes on the other hand will fail at the rated 1.5 amps. I tried to be clear about why I posted my post but it seems you have an agenda, so I really dont expect you to even try to understand or acknowledge my perspective. Maybe someone else will get the drift, however.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

'BentRyder said:


> The KAN-28 will fit easily... .02" of the sides of the housing and a nice snug fit. Are you a DIY guy or not? Seriously... you're modding to include a driver board and a reflector but a little switch is to much for you to handle? LOL!!! If you have doubts, just send me one of the ends and I'll do it for you.
> 
> As stated before and which seems to be willfully ignored, Ultrafire puts these switches in their 980L flashlights with an XM-L very overdriven to 4.5 amps. They also offer a 180 day warrantee on their lights so they know something we don't. The "equivalent" budget Omron swithes on the other hand will fail at the rated 1.5 amps. I tried to be clear about why I posted my post but it seems you have an agenda, so I really dont expect you to even try to understand or acknowledge my perspective. Maybe someone else will get the drift, however.


No need to be brash. Are you fitting this switch to the old bell style Marwi housing or the new bullet style Marwi housing?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

LOL 

Look, I'll help you out all I can.

If I run into anyone that needs a switch like that, I'll send them your way.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

I just started looking at these interesting components. Not sure how well they would work compared to what we have been working on. Would save half the wiring involved with wiring a driver and mcpcb sep. I see a note about an xml setup coming soon.










lux-rc


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

El34 said:


> ...
> Have to wait and see if they work out or not. There are a few issues such as the 2 amp current limit on the switches that fit into these housings.
> 
> ...


Please remember that you asked... And I answered and got trashed because I tried to help. The 2.8a NANJG driver are limited to 6V input max (4.2V rated) which means that you are running the full 2.8A thought the switch (you can easily and safely go 3.15A on an XM-L for maximizing the XM-L output). You were concerned, and rightfully so, as to the capability of the original switch which is rated at 2 amps, and I explained -why- you should be concerned. I posted an alternative and people here seem to think I'm just a noob that knows little when in fact I've been working with these issues for some time. Always good fodder for a little clique of DIY'rs on MBR, right? FO! I tried to help you make a fully driven XM-L out of a Marwi with a good chance of working reliably. I have contacted the manufacturer on this switch; I have worked on these issues on flashlights; I am fully familiar with the driver, the emitter, the options, and the capabilities for making this simple little mod. If you people weren't so thick-headed, maybe you could learn something instead of watching your heads swell in the mirror.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

'BentRyder said:


> Please remember that you asked... And I answered and got trashed because I tried to help. The 2.8a NANJG driver are limited to 6V input max (4.2V rated) which means that you are running the full 2.8A thought the switch (you can easily and safely go 3.15A on an XM-L for maximizing the XM-L output). You were concerned, and rightfully so, as to the capability of the original switch which is rated at 2 amps, and I explained -why- you should be concerned. I posted an alternative and people here seem to think I'm just a noob that knows little when in fact I've been working with these issues for some time. Always good fodder for a little clique of DIY'rs on MBR, right? FO! I tried to help you make a fully driven XM-L out of a Marwi with a good chance of working reliably. I have contacted the manufacturer on this switch; I have worked on these issues on flashlights; I am fully familiar with the driver, the emitter, the options, and the capabilities for making this simple little mod. If you people weren't so thick-headed, maybe you could learn something instead of watching your heads swell in the mirror.


I will ask the question again, are you fitting this switch to the old bell style Marwi housing or the new bullet style Marwi housing?


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

mntn-biker said:


> I just started looking at these interesting components. Not sure how well they would work compared to what we have been working on. Would save half the wiring involved with wiring a driver and mcpcb sep. I see a note about an xml setup coming soon.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think for the money you would be better off with separate components, especially if you're saving some $ using a Nanjg driver. Those lux-rc boards are constrained in many ways by having to fit within a 20mm form factor, which isn't an issue with what you're working on.

For that money, I'd rather go for a separate LED and an lflex - more functions, more upgrade options, more optic/reflector choices (the main achilles heal of lux-rc boards).


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

mntn-biker said:


> I will ask the question again, are you fitting this switch to the old bell style Marwi housing or the new bullet style Marwi housing?


The KAN-28 will fit in the new style shell that El34 is modding.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> I think for the money you would be better off with separate components


Yes, I agree. For what I am working on anyway.

I believe that the 20mm XML boards will actually be able to fit down inside the back of my reflectors. (with a bit of CNC machining.

As it is now, I remove all the threads for P7 use, but if the reflector is not able to sit pretty on the XML, I may just have to remove some of the threads.
The reflector would then sit right on the heat sink and be raised up a bit enough for the XML.

The amount of threads I remove determines how close the XML dome is to the opening on the reflector.

This is all just talk at this point
Waiting on some XML's to arrive before I can sort it all out.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

'BentRyder said:


> Please remember that you asked... And I answered and got trashed because I tried to help. The 2.8a NANJG driver are limited to 6V input max (4.2V rated) which means that you are running the full 2.8A thought the switch (you can easily and safely go 3.15A on an XM-L for maximizing the XM-L output). You were concerned, and rightfully so, as to the capability of the original switch which is rated at 2 amps, and I explained -why- you should be concerned. I posted an alternative and people here seem to think I'm just a noob that knows little when in fact I've been working with these issues for some time. Always good fodder for a little clique of DIY'rs on MBR, right? FO! I tried to help you make a fully driven XM-L out of a Marwi with a good chance of working reliably. I have contacted the manufacturer on this switch; I have worked on these issues on flashlights; I am fully familiar with the driver, the emitter, the options, and the capabilities for making this simple little mod. If you people weren't so thick-headed, maybe you could learn something instead of watching your heads swell in the mirror.


'BentRyder, your input into this thread is valuable and your effort very much appreciated. You've been around MTBR long enough to hopefully know it is usually a friendly and welcoming place! Thanks for your research - a flashlight switch for a flashlight driver would seem to be eminently sensible.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

Not to hijack your thread but I just had an issue with my driver similar to the one in this thread..... See this thread


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## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

Out of curiosity, can anyone tell me what the numbers are on the PIC that this uses?


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

HuffyPuffy said:


> Out of curiosity, can anyone tell me what the numbers are on the PIC that this uses?


If indeed they have a PIC - depends on which flavour of NANJG105 people have. Why, are you considering reprogramming? I'm doing exactly that to the 1.4 amp versions of the board with the ATtiny13 microcontroller that many of these boards have.


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## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

mfj197 said:


> If indeed they have a PIC - depends on which flavour of NANJG105 people have. Why, are you considering reprogramming? I'm doing exactly that to the 1.4 amp versions of the board with the ATtiny13 microcontroller that many of these boards have.


I was thinking it may be possible to toggle modes using a simple low voltage switch.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

HuffyPuffy said:


> I was thinking it may be possible to toggle modes using a simple low voltage switch.


Indeed it should be. Simply put the switch in the positive supply from battery to the driver board but have LED +ve going straight to the battery +ve not the +ve on the board, bypassing the switch. That way the switch is only switching the power for the microcontroller and AMC7135 chips, not the main LED current.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

H.P. you can use a low power momentary N.C. switch in place of, or in series with the diode next to the purple outlined IC. This would allow you to interupt power to the microprocessor without interupting the main power to the LED. This would change modes while the main on/off switch turns the light on and off.

You can also bypass the blinkie modes by shorting out the lower right 2 legs of the IC. This will leave you with the 5%, 30%, and 100% solid modes. This is a reversible mod (or yet another switch option).

This is a picture of the current "105C" version of the 2.8A board. The IC is a ATMEL TINY13A


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## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

'BentRyder said:


> H.P. you can use a low power momentary N.C. switch in place of, or in series with the diode next to the purple outlined IC. This would allow you to interupt power to the microprocessor without interupting the main power to the LED. This would change modes while the main on/off switch turns the light on and off.
> 
> You can also bypass the blinkie modes by shorting out the lower right 2 legs of the IC. This will leave you with the 5%, 30%, and 100% solid modes. This is a reversible mod (or yet another switch option).
> 
> This is a picture of the current "105C" version of the 2.8A board. The IC is a ATMEL TINY13A


Awesome thanks for the info, I think I will order a couple to try out. I may pick up a reverse clicky too since it may work for well the modes with the ability to latched off (so only one switch necessary).


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

mntn-biker said:


> Well, after closer observation, the driver that I ordered was not jumpered as I requested so I will need to jumper it myself. I will probably jumper the 4th star for only a low and high setting. I am guessing the "trace" jumpers star1 to ground giving the multi-mode setting by default? So I simply cut out a section of that area under the green plastic with an exacto knife then and then tin my star4 to the outer ring (negative)? Almost sounds like we do not need to cut this trace based on what mtnpat says from his experience. Guess I could solder the star4 and try it without cutting the trace?
> 
> Here's the image of my driver with the jumper in place. It is hard to tell if the trace is cut in this image:


So, I jumper the 4th star for a low and high setting, not the 3rd as shown for low/med/high but I still have low/med/high settings when I run thru the light settings. Interesting..... Curious to see if my next identical driver does the same thing on my next Marwi upgrade.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

mntn-biker said:


> So, I jumper the 4th star for a low and high setting, not the 3rd as shown for low/med/high but I still have low/med/high settings when I run thru the light settings. Interesting..... Curious to see if my next identical driver does the same thing on my next Marwi upgrade.


Yes, as I mentioned back in post #32 the functionality of the stars does seem to vary between boards. The original post showed a diagram of the NANJG105 but the board you have is a NANJG105C. Best to try them and see!


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Had the same issue with all boards from Shining Beam. I have jumpered at least four of them to attempt to rule out repeated stupidity on my part, but every single time I ended up with the same 3 mode driver. 

The 5 mode drivers from Kaidomain always works as the jumper diagram indicates.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

odtexas said:


> Had the same issue with all boards from Shining Beam. I have jumpered at least four of them to attempt to rule out repeated stupidity on my part, but every single time I ended up with the same 3 mode driver.


So you are saying no matter how you jumpered the Shining Beam boards, you wound up with a 3 mode driver?


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

yep, YMMV


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

odtexas said:


> yep, YMMV


My next driver I get in the next few days (from the same source) I will be jumpering the different stars to see what different modes I get, if any.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Just got a shipment of the 105C boards in from Kaidoman.
Very nice soldering and build quality.

I did a pinout with a meter and made a color coded grayscale image so that the colors stood out.

My previous color coded image is wrong as far as where all the B+ and LED+ plus are. Don't use that image.

The TINY13A is controlling the Plus Leg of the AMC7135 chips, and so they are not tied to B+ like in the stand alone AMC7135 boards.

I used Violet to indicate that all the + legs on the AMC7135 chips go to a leg on the TINY13A

The yellow numbered squares show where all the stars go
There are only 3 mode stars, but I numbered them 2 to 4 because there is a ground star which we were calling star #1 
The #1 star is just a ground soldering point for the other 3 stars.

Have not had time to fire one up on the bench and test the modes.

Here's a larger version link
https://www.el34world.com/Misc/bike/images/IMG_6596.png


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

*Modes*










I fired up one of the Kaidoman 105C 2.8 amp multi mode boards on the bench this morning.

Hooked it up to a Marwi P7 in the new style Bullet housing with the Judco Flat SPST latching switch (that I now stock).

Here's the results
The amperage was what was being drawn from the power supply.

Think I am going to give Star #3 a go in my first XML light build


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

that's a very diligent piece of work 

It's a shame that there's not a slightly higher mid mode (1.4-1.8A), but .9A should still be pretty decent for climbing at the like. 

Nice looking drivers too!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Yeah,

I am thinking the 3 modes will work out good for my type of riding

.146 amps for standing around BS-ing while waiting for people to catch so we can re-group

.88 amp mode will be perfectly for long slow climbs.

2.8 amps for the fast stuff


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

El34 said:


> Yeah,
> 
> I am thinking the 3 modes will work out good for my type of riding
> 
> ...


I like the 2 mode low/high beam personally. Low for bs'ing/trail repair and I like to keep it on high when riding since I like to light up the woods for everyone else riding with me


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## Andy13 (Nov 21, 2006)

These drivers look like a good cheap alternative to the L-Flex. I like the basic 3 modes. It doesn't have the great bells and whistles of the L-Flex. Is there any problem w/ heat? Since the L-Flex has heatsinking, why does this one not requre it? Also assuming it doesn't have low voltage protection or temperature protection. 
I am thinking of using one of these and a judco SPST clicky w/ a single XML for a cheap light. Thanks for all the info in this thread.
Andy


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

I'm guessing that, as it's a torch driver, it's designed to be heatsinked to the inside of the torch walls, which also provides the -ve path to the battery. Low voltage protection you'd have to deal with at the battery end, either using protected cells or a PCB. Temperature protection - you'd just have to use what's between your ears for that 

btw, finally found a willing donor for that housing you gave me, he'll be very happy once it's done!


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

The 105C has a low voltage warning but not exactly a cutoff.
The two resistors to the left of the MP is a voltage divider. The alarm kicks in at about 2.9V.
The alarm is a low output slow flash.


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## mntn-biker (Sep 12, 2010)

mntn-biker said:


> My next driver I get in the next few days (from the same source) I will be jumpering the different stars to see what different modes I get, if any.


Just got my new driver yesterday and it's odd since I jumpered my last driver (from same purchase point) and this one the same using the no. 4 star for low/high mode and I have different results. My previous driver gave me low/med/high using no. 4 star. This new driver gave me the expected low/high mode using the no. 4 star which was my desired result. Interesting......


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

'BentRyder said:


> The 105C has a low voltage warning but not exactly a cutoff.
> The two resistors to the left of the MP is a voltage divider. The alarm kicks in at about 2.9V.
> The alarm is a low output slow flash.


that's pretty decent actually, I'm pleasantly surprised


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

Andy13 said:


> These drivers look like a good cheap alternative to the L-Flex. I like the basic 3 modes. It doesn't have the great bells and whistles of the L-Flex. Is there any problem w/ heat? Since the L-Flex has heatsinking, why does this one not requre it?


It doesn't need heatsinking because the heat generated is being shared across 8 separate ICs rather than just 1 as in the LFlex. Each AMC7135 passes 350mA whereas an LFlex passes 3A in the one chip. Therefore, dropping 1V from a freshly charged cell to an XM-L the AMC7135s are producing 0.35W each but the transistor in an LFlex is producing 3W of heat.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> It doesn't need heatsinking because the heat generated is being shared across 8 separate ICs rather than just 1


Yeah, no heatsinking needed.
They are just glued to the back of a Judco switch on all my P7 Marwi's
Then they are slid inside the metal heat sink which is really hot.

Never had a chip failure
The AMC7135 chips have been very reliable.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

mattthemuppet said:


> Temperature protection - you'd just have to use what's between your ears for that


The AMC7135 chips have built-in thermal protection. Nothing quite as fancy as an LFlex but if it gets too hot it turns off to protect itself from damage. Thus when one or more shut off the light output would drop proportionally and overall heat as well - quite a good example of graceful degradation as they wouldn't all shut off at the same time. Plus when one or two do shut down the LED heat output drops proportionately as well, reducing the chance of the others shutting down. The only thing is the ICs thermal shutdown is at approximately 150 degrees C, which I'd imagine is a bit hot for an XM-L!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I had forgotten all about that.
The last time I looked at the AMC7135 data sheet was a year go

I have seen a couple different datasheets on the web.
Some mention the thermal protection, some don't

No external component required.
350mA constant sink current.
Output short / open circuit protection.
Low dropout voltage.
Low quiescent current
Build-in thermal protection
Supply voltage range 2.7V ~ 6V
2KV HBM ESD protection
Advanced Bi-CMOS process.
SOT-89 and TO-252 package


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

mattthemuppet said:


> that's a very diligent piece of work
> 
> It's a shame that there's not a slightly higher mid mode (1.4-1.8A), but .9A should still be pretty decent for climbing at the like.
> 
> Nice looking drivers too!


Idea I have had, but not able to pursue it just yet.

If we knew which 7135 boards were on/off in each of the three modes, then we could jumper 7135's to add to the lowish medium output.

I have already randomly removed 7135's to reduce maximum output on high.

I can't tell much of a difference between 2100 mA and 2800 mA, but my battery packs can.

But there is a huge difference between 900mA and 1400 mA.

(these are all round about current figures. )


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

All 8 7135 chips are on all the time.
They are not on separate PC traces
I pined out the whole board, see my diagram.

The TINY13A chip is pulsing the + connection to the chips as far as I can tell

mfj197 seems to have a better idea how the TINY13a works in this circuit

If I had an O-scope, I could watch the pins
I sold my scope a few years ago


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Thanks El. This chip thing isn't my strong suit. 
You just saved me probable hours of frustration trying to figure out which chips are on and off.
I will continue just removing them for now as needed.


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

Yes, El34's spot on with his explanation. The TINY13a uses pulse width modulation to turn the AMC7135s on and off at high frequency for the lower modes. That PWM was at a low enough frequency to be audible on the earlier boards, don't know if it is on the NANJG105C.


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## thwang-01 (Jul 5, 2008)

hi chaps
what the max voltage in put on these boards. i have a couple of them and was going to use a 7.2v battery.
cheers si


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

So let me see if I have it all correct also. 

The TINY13A pulses the AMC7135 chips Battery + terminals
It acts like a transistor


It allows a small current to control a latge currevt
The large current flow is from the 7135 chips LED - pin to the center pin, which is Battery ground.

How's that 

Thwang,
I posted the specs a couple post back on page 1


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

:-D They're actually logic driven, a HI voltage on the control pin turns the AMC7135 on and a LO voltage turns it off. When it is on it sinks 350mA from the LED -ve terminal to the ground terminal, when off it acts like an open circuit. 

The TINY13a microcontroller is providing the logic drive, either high or low. For lower levels of light output it pulses between high and low very fast, and the LED switches between full on and off at the same speed, far faster than our eyes can react. And thus it looks dimmer. More 'on' time compared to 'off' time and the light looks brighter, reduce the duration of the 'on' pulses and it looks dimmer.

Regarding operating voltage, the AMC chips will only handle 6V Max on either their control input or the one used to sink current from the LED. The microcontroller is only 5v from memory. Therefore as they are you can't use a 2S li-ion. I'm trying a simple modification to allow them to work from higher voltages though.

Michael


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> The microcontroller is only 5v from memory


Yeah, I think I found that out by mistake
I was bench testing one of the boards with a P7 attached.
The bench power supply got bumped up higher than I normally test with.

I looked at the ammeter and the current was dropping 1/10 volt every second.
By the time I spotted it, the high setting was only running 1.9 amps.

I dialed the bench voltage back down to 3.7 volts and up came the current again to 2.78 amps


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## Andy13 (Nov 21, 2006)

OK, another question. The pre-soldered LED leads look to be very thin gauge wire. Do these need to be replaced w/ thicker LED + & - lead wires prior to use? It seems like if these boards are designed for 2800mA that the wires should be OK, but I'm just asking. Some people are selling these w/o wires so I know it's possible, but I don't want to change the leads unless you guys think it is necessary.
thanks,
Andy


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

You can hardwire the 7135's to output 350ma each regardless of mode. Just move the gate to the output side of the diode. So if you want at least 1 amp output at all time, latch 3 of the 7135's gate to plus(+) , and the normal output is added to this for the remaining 5-7135's. You will loose the alarm feature and if you like the blinkie mode, it will blink on top of the constant output.

In the above example, 3x 7135 latched, you would have lo - 1.14A; med - 1.58A; and Hi would still be 2.8A.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

^^^^^^ That's a good idea.



thwang-01 said:


> hi chaps
> what the max voltage in put on these boards. i have a couple of them and was going to use a 7.2v battery.
> cheers si


Can't use the 7.2 with a single LED. However, it should work using 2 LEDs (poorman setup). Stick an LED between the BAT and 7135 to reduce the voltage across the 7135.


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## Andy13 (Nov 21, 2006)

will the poormans give 2800mA to each LED? Whoa that's hot.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

Andy13 said:


> will the poormans give 2800mA to each LED? Whoa that's hot.


Yep.

http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-diy-do-yourself/another-first-build-xml-677053.html


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

'BentRyder said:


> You can hardwire the 7135's to output 350ma each regardless of mode. Just move the gate to the output side of the diode. So if you want at least 1 amp output at all time, latch 3 of the 7135's gate to plus(+) , and the normal output is added to this for the remaining 5-7135's. You will loose the alarm feature and if you like the blinkie mode, it will blink on top of the constant output.
> 
> In the above example, 3x 7135 latched, you would have lo - 1.14A; med - 1.58A; and Hi would still be 2.8A.


Thanks.....:thumbsup:


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Late this afternoon I threw together a XML in a Marwi Bullet housing with the 2800ma board set to star 3. (low-medium-high)

I took it with me on our last road ride of the season up to the blue ridge parkway. (next week we switch over to off road with lights)

I took a 9600mah 4x18650 3.7v parallel battery pack.

We needed lights about half way home coming down from the parkway
A buddy of mine also had one of the P7 Marwi's in the older bell housing so we had two lights and 8 riders

The XML/reflector combo was really nice!!!!
Especially at 40+ miles an hour in a pace line. (going down hill of course) 

I took some pics of the build that I will upload in the morning

I CNC'd a new design heat sink slug and it worked out great!!

The Marwi Bullet housing / XML / 2800ma multi mode board combo looks like a weiner to me so far.

Here's a couple pics of the light I took with me.


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## joebreez (Sep 10, 2005)

'BentRyder said:


> You can hardwire the 7135's to output 350ma each regardless of mode. Just move the gate to the output side of the diode. So if you want at least 1 amp output at all time, latch 3 of the 7135's gate to plus(+) , and the normal output is added to this for the remaining 5-7135's. You will loose the alarm feature and if you like the blinkie mode, it will blink on top of the constant output.
> 
> In the above example, 3x 7135 latched, you would have lo - 1.14A; med - 1.58A; and Hi would still be 2.8A.


Bentryder, I'm not understanding the moving of the gate to the outside of diode.
I love the idea you just threw out though, if I could understand this directive I might have the perfect driver I'm looking for.
Can you please elaborate?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I believe what he is saying is to hotwire the AMC7135 + pins to battery + full time by disconnecting the pins from the TINY13A chip.

3 x 350ma = 1050 full time current regulation

You would have to disconnect the traces from the TINY13A to 3 of the chips, then jumper those 3 chips over to Battery +

The pink color (Right hand leg) of the 7135 chips is what you would connect to battery +

As it is now, the TINY13A chip is controlling all 8 of the 7135 chips by pulsing the right hand leg (pink in the picture) 

Looks to me like the board half on the right in my picture is the easiest to do that to. Chips 1,2,3 can be isolated by curtting the trace line in red to the upper left of the spring. Then join that dissconnected trace to the spring, which is battery +.

The small round red circles I have drawn is where the trace from one side of the board gets passed to the other side and so you have to find a spot where 3 chips can be cut free from that network

I don't have a chip in front of me to test it and the ony real way is to cut the trace and then do a continuity check to see if the 3 chips have really been isolated.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

Yes, I am bypassing the "control lead" of one of the AMC7135's (cutting the trace to it) to a protected positive source on the output side of the diode. For every AMC7135 you bypass, you will add 350ma to the LED whenever the light is turned on. On top of this are the normal modes. Most of the NANJG drivers deliver 5%, 30%, and 100% of the remaining MP controlled AMC7135s.










I did learn that the strobe is significantly softened by doing this. If you use the strobe mode for being seen, You might give this some thought.


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## joebreez (Sep 10, 2005)

Bentryder, just finished rigging my driver as discussed. Not as complicated as thought although a magnifying glass helped.
Cut the trace to 2-7135 chips and soldered to power source.
Very nice trick.
Had to swap out from amomentary to a clicky switch and finished the poormans driver setup for the 2 XML's I'm driving.
Only thing is the driver is a 3 way driver purchased from Shiningbeam.com.
Rating originally were ;
Low=140ma
Med=1000ma
High=2.8amp

So now theoretically I should have; 840ma, 1.7amp, 2.8amp.
I just don't see huge steps in the power settings. high is damn bright and low is still usable for most riding. Medium is somewhere in between.
I almost wish it was a high low setting, that would make it close to perfect.

I also noticed that the drivers purchased from Shiningbeam didn't have a jumper, I wonder if it's using other power settings without the strobe effect you spoke of.

I'm going to try and do a jumper on star 3 and see if this makes a difference.

Good work though guys on all the posts

Edit: just got back from trying to do a jumper to star 4-hi-lo setting. not working.
I cut the trace to star 1 but it doesn't make any difference.
So for now it goes back together for a test ride this week to see how it compares to my other lights. If I can work out the hi-lo thing it would be great but it's pretty impressive the way it is.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

You're close... you have 700ma constant + 100% (high) of 2100ma... 30% (med) of 2100ma so 630ma plus the 700, is 1330ma in medium, and low is 5% of 2100ma 105ma + 700ma = 805ma in low mode.
2.8A
1.33A
0.8A
Sounds like a great combination for a bike light.

if your dirver is stuck on only 3 modes, someone may have bypassed the stars on the Tiny13A chip by shorting the lower right 2 legs together (by D1).


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> someone may have bypassed the stars on the Tiny13A chip by shorting the lower right 2 legs together


Funny you should mention that.

That is exactly what I have been doing on my 105C boards
It's way faster and easier than soldering a small wire across star # 3

A quick solder blob and you are done.


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## joebreez (Sep 10, 2005)

Bentryder, the legs on the chip are soldered together so I assume I don't get any other options with it configured that way.I may try and desolder one to see what happens with them.Don't want flasher mode just a high low arrangment.

The boards I got were these;
3-Mode Regulated Circuit Board for XML, MC-E, SST-50 and SSC P7 (2.8A Max.)

Preconfigured as a 3 way with 140ma,1000ma,2.8amps.

I wish there was a way of limiting the output to about 2 amps max. That is the sweet spot for the XML's, not a huge difference in light above that setting without diminishing returns on heat and power consumption.

All in all very happy so far, a quick and cheap way of doing it.
I love the Task LED boards and may still use them in further builds because they are fully configurable by the user and are more polished than these 7135 units.
I feel like I'm kinda cheaping out using the 7135 boards but as long as they work I can justify using them.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Remove two of the 7135 chips
6 x 350ma each 7135 = 2100ma

Nothing wrong with the 7135 chip boards
I prefer simple and cheap things that work well and these fit the bill nicely

Been using them a couple years now with excellent results.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

Not much to not like about these boards. With the mods these guys have come up with, it looks as configurable as the more expensive boards.

How bout this for a 2.1A, 2-mode board. Might be ideal in a double poorman.

.......


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

Yep, disable 2 of the AMC7135 devices and you remove 700ma. You can cut the gate leg, cut the trace, or remove the device. When cutting traces, be sure you don't accidentaly disable devices on the reverse side. There is one hole that goes through the PCB that power the gates to the battery side.


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

That is really a superb thread about this driver. Thank you very much for sharing all your knowledge. I've used two of these drivers so far, but have problems with my third. Perhaps someone out there might have an idea, how to rescue the driver.

After soldering Battery and LED side on the driver, the LED didn't light up. I tried to test the connections: The Battery side sees the 4.2 V from the cell, but on the LED side I could only measure 0.2 V. All the LED- (Black square with white dot on the picture) points are connected. I accidently made a connection between Battery - outside ring and LED- while the battery was still connected and the LED light up.

Can I solder this connection or would that leave the light direct driven?

And can anybody explain the function of the (switch bit?) to the right of the big TINY13A chip?


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

mrradlos said:


> That is really a superb thread about this driver. Thank you very much for sharing all your knowledge. I've used two of these drivers so far, but have problems with my third. Perhaps someone out there might have an idea, how to rescue the driver.
> 
> After soldering Battery and LED side on the driver, the LED didn't light up. I tried to test the connections: The Battery side sees the 4.2 V from the cell, but on the LED side I could only measure 0.2 V. All the LED- (Black square with white dot on the picture) points are connected. I accidently made a connection between Battery - outside ring and LED- while the battery was still connected and the LED light up.
> 
> ...


Connecting the battery -ve to the LED -ve would as you guessed leave the LED direct driven from the battery. The driver works by interrupting and controlling the current flow from the -ve terminal of the LED (the +ve LED is just tied to battery +ve).

The "switch bit" to the right of the microcontroller is a protection diode, protecting the ATTiny13A and the AMC7135 chips from connecting the battery up the wrong way round. Necessary in a flashlight as it's possible to put the battery in back to front.


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

Thank you for the answer mfj197. Still haven't found out, what's wrong though ...


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## mfj197 (Jan 28, 2011)

No, I'm afraid I don't know what the specific problem would be. The positive is obviously getting through to the LED through the board, so the interruption must be either in the power to / from the microcontroller itself or the connection to the AMC7135 chips. I'd start off (as you probably have done) by doing continuity checks on all the traces as per the diagram above.


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

hi,

I did this mod and shorted those 2 TINY13A pins.



El34 said:


> Funny you should mention that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Should I cut the trace to star #1 also?

I didn't do that and the light sometimes turns on in mode 3 and sometimes in mode 1 ( the one with the flashing )


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Hi, Star one does not do anything, it is just attached to ground
I do this mod to all my boards and it stays on mod 3
Just a quick dab of solder to bridge the two pins without overheating anything 

All the stars on the other side should not have any jumpers
Do you have this same exact board?


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

Kaidomain has a new driver now: KD 8x7135 V2 LED Driver 3040mA 17mm

Wow: 3040mA must drive the XM-L from those webpages to well over 1000 lumens (2.8A used to be 1000 lumens ...).  I orderd one ...


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Cool but I have no idea how they are getting that 3040ma figure
AMC 7135 chips will not exceed 350ma each and I only see 8 of them

Even if you add one more 7135 it comes out to 3150ma

Unless that picture is not the 3040ma version?
I do see 6 empty solder pads on the spring side, so maybe some other device goes there?


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

El34 said:


> Hi, Star one does not do anything, it is just attached to ground
> I do this mod to all my boards and it stays on mod 3
> Just a quick dab of solder to bridge the two pins without overheating anything
> 
> ...


Tks for the reply.

I may have a dodgy driver or, maybe I didn't weld it right. I will do another one in the next days and I will be more careful with the welding.


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

Nice the new driver at KD. And on the same note, output, the old driver, I have 2 and they outputted both, about 0,05A, 0,5A and 1,7A . Shouldn´t they output the full 2.8A on high?

More confusing is that side by side with another light using an lflex, the light output seam pretty close..


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Don't weld them, solder them


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

El34 said:


> Don't weld them, solder them


I'm going to try hot glue next time


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> the old driver, I have 2 and they outputted both, about 0,05A, 0,5A and 1,7A . Shouldn´t they output the full 2.8A on high?
> 
> More confusing is that side by side with another light using an lflex, the light output seam pretty close..


Yes, you should be able to get 2.8 amps if your battery voltage is high enough.

I posted a chart on page one of this post showing all the modes
Here it is again


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

tks El34

sorry, didn't see that chart :madman:

I must be doing something wrong... I'm going to check everything again.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Not a problem
I tried to go back and edit post 1 to add this info but the forum does not allow editing after a certain amount of time.


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## joebreez (Sep 10, 2005)

Looks like an updated 105c driver but with better current options in the menues.
Low and Medium settings would be just about perfect for bike applications.
Would kill the need to do all the modifying we've all been doing to these to configure them to our liking.
I just got 2 of mine to finally run the way I wanted last week, seeing these makes me kinda sad I just spent all that time desoldering, resoldering and putting jumpers in a few spots.
These look like they'd be the new choice of many builders out there.:thumbsup:


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## jbflyfshr (Jul 24, 2006)

Looks good to me also. pulled the trigger already. I like my H6Flex but it is too complicated for me since I am the worst when it comes to electrical stuff. Nice and simple just like my abilities!

Anyone need and H6Flex...?

JK....maybe

JB


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

How do we mount these things in the housings, so they have thermal contact?
One thing I like about the L-flex is the ability to mount it flat to the housing, as all the circuitry is on one side. I can't see how to mount the KD one unless it's on a close-fitting ring type mount on the perimeter.


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

that's the intent, although the 7135 chips do benefit from the fact that each one is only dissipating a fraction of the total voltage burnt off by the driver, whereas the lflex only has one component doing all the burning and dissipating.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

So the question remains- how do we mount this in a sled light or an Easy2DIY housing?


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

Ofroad'bent said:


> So the question remains- how do we mount this in a sled light or an Easy2DIY housing?


Desolder the spring, and solder all the wires from LEDs and cell to the other side of the driver (HFlex style ...). Then use some thermal glue on all the AMC7135 on the side where the spring used to be and glue them to the housing. That's half of the heat taken care of ...


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

mrradlos said:


> Desolder the spring, and solder all the wires from LEDs and cell to the other side of the driver (HFlex style ...). Then use some thermal glue on all the AMC7135 on the side where the spring used to be and glue them to the housing. That's half of the heat taken care of ...


I get you. Thermal tape should work too from the sounds of it.

Will the AMC7135s transfer the heat through the top of their cover OK? I would think it would work better from the metal of the PCB.


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

Ofroad'bent said:


> I get you. Thermal tape should work too from the sounds of it.
> 
> Will the AMC7135s transfer the heat through the top of their cover OK? I would think it would work better from the metal of the PCB.


People have mentioned mounting them both ways. With chips on both sides, I'm inclined to agree with you. Mounting them at an angle so that opposite sides of the pcb touch a horizontal and vertical side might be ideal. These chips don't produce a great amount of heat.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

Thre AMC7135's are thermally protected. If they get to hot, they will shut down.

http://www.micro-bridge.com/data/ADD/AMC7135.pdf


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## rlouder (Jun 26, 2007)

*Poorman setup*

Someone asked about the poorman setup. Decided to post it here instead of reviving an old thread.

For a 4x xpg, just place another LED in parallel with each one shown.

Battery pack is a 2s (8.4v on a fresh charge).

.....


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I can tell you from using 100's of the AMC7135 boards that you do not have to get all worked up about thermal management with these chips.

I have 8 of them inside a very hot tubular heat sink in all the P7 Marwi's and not one has failed

In the P7 Marwi's , all I do is glue the chips to the back of a SPDT plastic switch to keep them from moving around.

On the new XML multi mode boards they just free float in the air. I stick a small piece of electrical tape on each side to make sure they don't short out on any metal.

And on the new multi mode boards, I don't remove the spring because it's way easier to solder the Battery+ wire and LED+ wire to the spring. All I do is make sure the spring is soldered good to the board.

Below is a couple shots showing the P7 Marwi setup and the New XML setup using AMC7135 boards. Note, no heat sinking going on in either with zero failures.


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## joebreez (Sep 10, 2005)

I would suspect that the copper in the wires is acting as a way for heat to migrate away from the driver. You'd be gluing a heat sink to the same ground location so to a certain extent the wire is serving a similar purpose, not as effective as a heat sink for sure but think how hot a wire gets when soldering it and you're holding the other end-Copper is an excellent conductor of heat.
I'm glad to hear no failure's due to heat but I fried one of mine by plugging in an 11.1v (not 7.4v) battery while testing and didn't catch it 'till I smelled burning wires. :madman:
This happened just before a night ride and left me scrambling for another helmet light, I was very annoyed with myself. Poorman's setup wasn't enough to save me.
This is my only complaint with these, all my other drivers can take up to 20v so no fear of frying-pun intended:thumbsup:
I may also order the new Kaidomain drivers just to see what's up and compare them to others I already have.They're cheap enough to order a few for no apparent reason, just hope they send me the right ones.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The AMC 7135 spec sheet says a range of 2.7 to 6 volts
The TINY13 has a different range (don't have those specs here right now)
Not sure why KD does not print the input range

DX says 3.6V~4.5V range on most of their AMC7135 boards
These boards lend themselves to simple parallel 18650 battery packs

This is very desireable to me personally because you carry half the batteries at twice the MAH. 
4 x 18650's at 2400 ma = a 9600 mah battery pack at 3.6 volts

On the P7's the LED voltage was 3.6 volts
On the XML's it 3.3 volts (if I remember correctly)

The XML's should maintain a stronger beam for a longer time on the same exact battery packs, which is another thing I like about the XML's and this driver.

As far as heat sinking the AMC7135 chips, the belly of the chip has a broad metal base. It sinks heat down to the copper circuit board and disperses it through the copper network. (according to some data/info I read on the AMC7135 chips somewhere on the web)

I have pulled 7135 chips off the boards and they do indeed have a broad metal pad which doubles as the ground (middle terminal)


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

Suprise here: Someone with more knowledge than me (which is really not difficult) made a little review about the new driver from kd - and it really should deliver 3A, because the AMC7138 bords are "38K-bined". The low is very, very low!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

ah, ok, that splains that
8 x 380 = 3040


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

I just got one of these KD 8x7135s, and banged together a sled light using an XM-L and an inline switch from Batteryspace. I set it up for Hi-med-low.

I have to say it's pretty basic and clunky when you're used to an L-flex.
The High and Med are fine, but the low is barely adequate for reading a map, as I had seen online.

What I really dislike is the low-off-med-off-high-off path. What a pain to change modes, especially on the fly.

I am used to my L-flex set up on multi-mode, where you just click once at any time to go up a level, or press to go down. I use this to get much better battery life, as I don't need full-on much of the time, and dropping up or down a level is instant.

I guess if you just turn on your light once for the whole ride, this is a simple and cheap way to do it. Probably going to give this one away though for parts cost...



mrradlos said:


> Kaidomain has a new driver now: KD 8x7135 V2 LED Driver 3040mA 17mm
> 
> Wow: 3040mA must drive the XM-L from those webpages to well over 1000 lumens (2.8A used to be 1000 lumens ...).  I orderd one ...
> 
> ...


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I find the low on Mode 3 quite usable for off the bike stuff. 
Rumaging through the car, waiting in the dark to regroup with other riders, taking a leak, looking at other riders without blinding them, etc
To each his own I guess on that one

Also, not sure why you describe going through the modes like this 
low-off-med-off-high-off 
Maybe you are clicking the switch off between mode changes?


My lights work like this: 
Click switch to turn the light on
The light starts in whatever the last mode was when you shut it off

The modes cycle like this
Tap-Low1 -> Tap-Low2 -> Tap-High ->
Tap-Low1 -> Tap-Low2 -> Tap-High -> 

Repeat this sequence forever untill you click the switch to turn the light off

All I do is tap the switch and it changes modes
The switch points disengage without turning off the light


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## zemike (Sep 3, 2007)

Ofroad'bent said:


> What I really dislike is the low-off-med-off-high-off path. What a pain to change modes, especially on the fly.


What is the MCU on this driver? If it's an Attiny13A, then I know a guy who can reprogram it to use a tact switch and change the firmware to any mode configuration.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> Originally Posted by *Ofroad'bent*
> _What I really dislike is the low-off-med-off-high-off path. What a pain to change modes, especially on the fly._


The boards I use have a TINY13A and they work just as I described above
All you have to do is have a switch that responds to a tap and disengages


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## rschultz101 (Oct 5, 2009)

7135 linear LED driver, couple of thoughts

2.8A -3A for my taste is too high , mostly heat, little extra light,
would recommend 2- 2.5 A max
since the driver is linear, that means it has to burn off extra voltage,
this is for driving 1 led, from 1 li-ion cell,
1S li-ion, 4.2V start, 3.6V nominal 3.6V - LED Vf ( 3.1V XML) = .5V * 2.8A = ~1.5W,
so heatsinking required, but with components on booth sides, and wires,
it gets messy.
really don't like, running stuff with 1S battery configuration !!!

question / suggestion 
since I do like at least a 2S battery
running 2x XML of the driver would be logical,
-> anybody tried it ? 
driver probably too hot, at 4W with fresh batteries....
should be possible, lfex is linear too.
take 2S lifepo4, what should get you 6.6V nominal, with 2x XML in series, 
should be fine, down side, different charger, and the 18650 are low capacity,
but once you move up to 26650 , should be good.
------
need help
anybody have info on Atmel chip and modes/ pwm,
please email me
thanks, Rob


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

Ofroad'bent, El34 are you both talking about the new driver?

Ofroad'bent, what inline switch are you using?


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

bravellir said:


> Ofroad'bent, El34 are you both talking about the new driver?
> 
> Ofroad'bent, what inline switch are you using?


I'm not sure about EL34, but I'm talking about the new KD 7135x8 driver.
Maybe I need to play with it more, and try "tapping" the switch. It would be much better if it just went to the next mode.

Here's the switch I happened to have in stock:
Component - Switch: on-off switch with LED Indicator (1' long) with Male & Female Trail-Tech coaxis connector


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I am talking about the 105C 2800 ma boards, which is what this post is about

See the pictures at the top of this post on page 1

Which board are you talking about?


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

I have some off the new boards that I didn't had the chance to try yet. I will try them tonight.


Ofroad'bent, does that switch turns the led on when you are pushing it down or only when you are releasing it up?

These drivers work best with a switch that turns on only when the button is almost on top off its travel.
That means that a gentle tap breaks the connection. The drivers sense that and switch mode without the need to turn off.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

El34 said:


> I am talking about the 105C 2800 ma boards, which is what this post is about
> 
> See the pictures at the top of this post on page 1
> 
> Which board are you talking about?


I was talking about this driver from KD as per post 130 :https://kaidomain.com/product/details.S020073


















The posting #130 quoted on my message above, but the pics didn't come up.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Ah, ok
I can't say if that one operates ddifferently than the 105C KD boards

I imagine it's the same

The switch makes all the difference in getting the modes to operate in a loop without shutting off the light between moe changes


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

bravellir said:


> These drivers work best with a switch that turns on only when the button is almost on top off its travel.
> That means that a gentle tap breaks the connection. The drivers sense that and switch mode without the need to turn off.


OK, I got it going with a light touch on the switch. That's definitely better. 
I still wish there was a way to toggle up and down at will.

A slightly brighter low setting would be a big help too- there's no problem looking straight at the LED on Low. I'll have to poke around with it in the dark.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Ok, cool
That board works the same as the 105C model
Good to know

I have gotten really fast with tapping the switch on the bike

Sometimes I go through the cycle twice because I have to see the very low mode to know where I am in the cycle


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

OK you genii, anyone know some fancy solder job to get the low to something like 100ma instead of 5ma?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

It's 146ma on the 105C boards
Here's my chart again


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

El34 said:


> It's 146ma on the 105C boards
> Here's my chart again


Yes, I saw that chart before. I was hoping for a solution like "solder a bridge from xyz to abc", not "replace with 105C board", but I may go that route anyway.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The lowest you can set with some of mod to the board is to make one of the AMC7135 chips stay on all the time by connecting the right hand + leg to battery +

That will be 350ma


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

El34 said:


> The lowest you can set with some of mod to the board is to make one of the AMC7135 chips stay on all the time by connecting the right hand + leg to battery +
> 
> That will be 350ma












Thanks EL, I knew you'd have an idea for me.
Which leg would that be on this pic? Perhaps the bottom one on the chip to the right of the spring?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The Orange leg in post #122

There was another post where (I forget who) described how to do this mod

It was going on the same time as this thread
had some good pics of how to do this to the chip closet to the LED+ pad

Basically, you have to cut the trace that feeds the Orange leg
(The orange leg is connected to the TINY13A chip normally)
Then you connect the Orange leg to Battrty + full time


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

http://forums.mtbr.com/8661769-post116.html

Be careful of which trace you cut as this driver is a bit more complex in gate circuit routing.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

OK, how does this look- the red is where to cut the trace, the white will be a solder joint


From Lights
While we're at it, can I get a link to buy a 2800ma AMC7135 105C board if I botch this mod?
I couldn't find it on KD.


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

Ofroad'bent said:


> OK, how does this look- the red is where to cut the trace, the white will be a solder joint
> 
> 
> From Lights
> ...


I would probably do this on the reverse side so you can pick up the output of the diode rather than the straight BAT(+) to drive the gate. If you are driving an XM-L, driving the emitter at 760ma is a nice minimum (Lo) output meaning that I would consider bypassing 2 of the AMC7135 devices. I am not sure yet what the medium would be though, or what you are looking for. Personally, I like running XM-L's between 1 and 1.4 amps.

edit: Medium at 35%, w/ 2 bypassed 7135's will give you just over 1.5A
380ma * 2 = 760ma (min in low mode plus ~3ma)
380ma * 6 = 2280ma (remaining 7135's driven by the MP)
2280ma * 35% = 798ma (med mode output from the MP driving 6x 7135's)
760ma + 798ma = 1558ma (medium mode)
High mode, of course wil remain all 7135's being driven 100% or 3040ma.

105C - 8xAMC7135 (2.8A) (selectable) Mode Driver - $6.75 : Illumination Supply, Quality Flashlights and More!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The red line looks like you are cutting the traces to two of the chips, not one chip

Find a chip on the tail end of a trace if you want to isolate just one chip


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

'BentRyder said:


> I would probably do this on the reverse side so you can pick up the output of the diode rather than the straight BAT(+) to drive the gate. If you are driving an XM-L, driving the emitter at 760ma is a nice minimum (Lo) output meaning that I would consider bypassing 2 of the AMC7135 devices. I am not sure yet what the medium would be though, or what you are looking for. Personally, I like running XM-L's between 1 and 1.4 amps.
> 
> 105C - 8xAMC7135 (2.8A) (selectable) Mode Driver - $6.75 : Illumination Supply, Quality Flashlights and More!


I am happy with the medium as-is. A low of 350ma would be OK along with a medium of 35% + 350ma.
Would you mind illustrating where to cut and bridge the trace on this particular chip? I don't see the diode output.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I can't tell for sure from here

Here's two possible solutions
The yellow lines are cut marks
The red lines are jumpers to Battery +

Looks to me like the diode is on the other side of the board and the feed to this side of the board is all on the other side of the diode, so you get diode reverse protection

I favor the chip above the TINY13A 
The upper right leg of the TINY13A chip is Battery +, so that makes a close by connection point

*EDIT:*
*Looks to me like the TINY13A chip is reversed from the 105C boards*
*Hard to tell in that image*
*Better make sure you have the correct Bat + leg on the TINY13A chip before using the chip above the TINY13A chip*


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

Thanks a lot, El.

You have marked the lower connection to the LED+ contact. Is this correct? If so, it's an easy connection to make.

Not sure how to ID the Bat+ leg on the TINY 13A.



El34 said:


> I can't tell for sure from here
> 
> Here's two possible solutions
> The yellow lines are cut marks
> ...


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

You do continuity check with a meter 
Mine beeps which makes it nice

You attach one probe to the other side of the diode, not the spring side of the diode.

Then you probe the TINY13A chip leg and listen for the beep

If yours does not beep, you would be looking for a resistance of 1 ohm or less on the meter.
The meter leads sometimes have a tiny bit of resistance when you touch them together. You can zero that out, or just go with what you have.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

El34 said:


> You do continuity check with a meter
> Mine beeps which makes it nice
> 
> You attach one probe to the other side of the diode, not the spring side of the diode.
> ...


Umm, which one is the diode?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

This looks like the diode to me - Yellow box

The B+ travels from spring to diode
Through diode to traces marked in red
Through the board to the other side

All parts on the other side are on the protected side of the diode


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## 'BentRyder (Sep 17, 2011)

The diode is by the Tiny13A chip.... just below the little dimply/dot.

The one EI34 marked is a capacitor.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

That's what I get for not having one of the boards in front of me here

Looks like they route the + the same way as they do on the 105C boards 
The + goes thought the diode, (below the TINY!#A chip), then under the chip to the upper right leg

It will still work out the same if you want to direct drive the 7135 chip above the TINY13A chip

Cut the yellow line and add the red line

I would still do a continuity check first to make sure that is actually + on the upper right leg
Looks to me like the chip is the mounted in the opposite direction as the 105c boards


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

Well, no continuity from the diode to the pin indicated. There is continuity to the pin with the little dot beside it, at the bottom right of the TINY chip.

Any suggestions now for cutting and jumpering?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

ok, this board is not laid out like the 105C board
It probably should have it's own thread since it is different
People (like me) will get confused reading all the info that conflicts


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

El34 said:


> ok, this board is not laid out like the 105C board
> It probably should have it's own thread since it is different
> People (like me) will get confused reading all the info that conflicts


Agreed. I've ordered a 105C from Shiningbeam. This KD V2 board's not for me- the low is just too low.


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## Alinvanc (Nov 15, 2011)

Hello EI 34, I just got a pair of old style marwi bell housings with mount and remote switch. I want to mod them with XPG, seting one up for on, H/L and the other with strobe. I ride primarily in the city. I wanted to use two separate drivers, running less than 1,000 mAh, as I'm not as concerned about lumen output, more about longer light time. Please recommend a heat sink and driver. I prefer optics, carclo, how would I set my lights up ?
Thanks for your posts


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

found this on BLF which looks pretty cool, if the more adventurous tinkerers want to check it out..


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Hi Alinvanc,
Don't know anything about optics or XPG's

The only style I build is the ones you see on my web sites
Each Marwi housing has it's own heat sink you can find on my web store
I only use P7's and XML's and the driver methods explained on my web site


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## Alinvanc (Nov 15, 2011)

Hi EI34, thanks for your reply.


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## Alinvanc (Nov 15, 2011)

EI34 - I assume your heat sinks are very effective since you are pushing a lot of power through your LED's. Thanks


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Well sure, I designed them and tested them before having them made in bulk

There are 100's of P7 and XML Marwi's out there running at 2.8 amps without any failures.


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

BTW, one of the guys of that BLF luxdrv thread is thinking about setting up a small enterprise doing custom programming for these Atiny13 controllers. There's lots of fancy stuff that can be done as well as basic stuff like power levels, PWM frequency, UI, and so on. If anyone's interested, PM me and I'll send you his email.


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

I have been following this thread with great interest and have appreciated a lot of the expert knowledge regarding using and modifying this driver.

One small query, would it be feasible to do without an on/off switch and switch the light on and off by unplugging the power? You could include a momentary normally closed switch for changing the modes.

I ask because I can't find any nice, small clicky switches but have some momentary switches.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

What type of switch do you want?
I stock many different styles and also an external handlebar mounted thumb switch.

But to answer your question
Yes, you could just plug the light in and it would come on in the last mode that you had on before you shut off the light.
Then you can just interrupt the power with a momentary switch to change modes

This is the 105C board I am talking about
Have to specify because another type of board got mixed into this thread.


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

Blimey! You took your time Doug! 

I'm in the UK and I would imagine that your postage rates will be (understandably) prohibitive for such a small item.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Yes, unless you have several items, it does not makes sense to order one small item.



> Blimey! You took your time Doug


I am in front of a computer all day long and get instant email notifications


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

Thanks for your help anyway, I'm sure it will work with the other board as well. That's the one I'm going to go for because the 105C board isn't available from Kaidomain any more.


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

OverTheHill said:


> ... can't find any nice, small clicky switches but have some momentary switches.


I have been using successfully those 16mm cliky switches that are usually used on flashlights together with a silicone tailcap (the green glow-in-the-dark is nice)

I use 5m epoxy to glue the switch inside the housing and I glue the tailcap on the outside. That makes the switch waterproof.

You will probably find them both at the same place where you are getting the driver board.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I stock clicky's, tail caps, 105c boards and other switches.

So now it make be worthwhile to have those items shipped

Plus, you may need other items like silicon wire, etc
Never know till you look at all the goodies on my store


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## kcalvano (Feb 14, 2007)

El34, stoked to try your XML kits, I DIY'ed a pair of your P7's a couple years ago and they were awesome, thanks for all of your hard work! Props to your kick arss prices and great diy write-ups!


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

bravellir said:


> I have been using successfully those 16mm cliky switches that are usually used on flashlights together with a silicone tailcap (the green glow-in-the-dark is nice)
> 
> I use 5m epoxy to glue the switch inside the housing and I glue the tailcap on the outside. That makes the switch waterproof.
> 
> You will probably find them both at the same place where you are getting the driver board.


Those switches are only rated at 0.5A on DX bravillir. I don't think they would last very long with an XM-L pulling 2A-3A but others may disagree. El34 was discussing switches earlier in the thread, on Page #2 I think. Thanks for the help anyway.


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## bravellir (Nov 24, 2008)

@OverTheHill

humm... Never even wonder about that. I use those switches as lot. The contacts and the contact "bridge" inside look wide enough so I never give it a thought. Well.. I did a couple of XML's so I will soon know if they can take the 2,8A or not 

If you need all those parts, EL34 it's a good option. As you said, other than the clickys that I mentioned I could never find a nice switch. I almost pulled the trigger on EL34 website a couple of times...


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> El34, stoked to try your XML kits, I DIY'ed a pair of your P7's a couple years ago and they were awesome, thanks for all of your hard work! Props to your kick arss prices and great diy write-ups!


Wow, thanks
The P7's are still in the game
My XML setup is just a tad brighter, not much.
But I do like the 3 levels of brightness better and the 105C driver boards in the new XML Marwi's



> Those switches are only rated at 0.5A on DX bravillir


Some of those clickies will surprise you. I have a mod on my site where you can take two of them apart and double the contacts. Twice the contact area doesn't hurt.

The ones I sell are very rugged, but I tested another type and the plastic housings actually melted when running a P7 at 2.8 amps

The Judco clickies are really nice.


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

I got the AMC 105C board, (not on KD any more) and changed the KD V2 board for it, set up in 3-mode.
I like it much better, as the low is actually useable for hiking and such.
Got the hang of the switch tap vs click.

Here's the quickie sled light I made up with the Batteryspace switch, which just plugs inline.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

nice, glad the new board worked out


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## jbflyfshr (Jul 24, 2006)

K.I.S.S. right!

Well done, I need to do one like this for a helmet light, when I can get the time anyway...you may just have put the fire under me butt with this one!!

JB


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## ktm520 (Apr 21, 2004)

Does anyone know approximately the voltage drop across the protection diode in between V+ and the microcontroller?

I'm using two 105C's to drive a dual XML sled bar light. I currently have two independent switches to control each led/driver. I would like to wire it up so that there is only one switch controlling both drivers. Would this be as easy as cutting the gate leg on the slave driver MC and jumper'ing to the MC gate on the primary driver? Of course, I would still have to run power/gnd to the slave driver.

I'm afraid that running both drivers in parallel off one switch could cause problems keeping the driver modes sync'ed.


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

I know El34 has stuck two 4xAMC7135 drivers together to make a 2.8A driver and plenty of the torch/ flashlight modders use a slave board without the aTiny chip to boost the current, but that's not really what you're after. I do vaguely remember someone ganging 2 7135 boards off one switch and I think it worked fine for them - I don't think they bothered with modifying the boards in any way either. I guess you'd just have to make sure that they were both in the same last mode (if they have memory) when you wire them up.


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## mrradlos (Sep 3, 2010)

AMC7135 Master-Slave mod


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## ktm520 (Apr 21, 2004)

Thanks mrradlos. That confirms what I said in not so many words.

Still looking for some info on the protection diode voltage drop. Trying to run a single xml helmet of a 26650 A123 pack (LiFe) and don't have a lot of voltage overhead.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

The 105C boards are gone at KD.

My link to the boards results in item not found

Does anyone else have a link to the 105c boards?

I want to grab a bunch of these and keep them in stock.


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## OverTheHill (Dec 3, 2004)

The Illumination Supply ones that mntn-biker pointed to in post #4 of this thread are marked up as 105C but have green masking rather than black so I don't know if they are exactly the same.

8xAMC7135 (2.8A) (selectable) Mode Driver - $6.75 : Illumination Supply, Quality Flashlights and More!


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Yes, it does look to be the same
Thanks, forgot about that post

Way more expensive and not free shipping at Illum supply

I have 30 or so stashed, so not an emergency
Think I will keep looking for a chinese source in the mean time


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

OverTheHill said:


> The Illumination Supply ones that mntn-biker pointed to in post #4 of this thread are marked up as 105C but have green masking rather than black so I don't know if they are exactly the same.
> 
> 8xAMC7135 (2.8A) (selectable) Mode Driver - $6.75 : Illumination Supply, Quality Flashlights and More!


That's the one I used when I couldn't find any 105Cs at KD. See posting 206 above.
KD seems to only have their new 3.1A driver with the useless low mode, rather than the nice usable modes on the 105C.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Crapp, that's what_ I was thinking and afraid of._

_WTF?_

_How could a board be sold at one place in china and be gone in so short a time?_

_Usually, you see the same board on 10 diiferent Chinese web sites._


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## gurpurdy (Jul 2, 2004)

Would I need one of these for each LED or can I use one to drive 2 LEDs at 2800?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

This board has a max of 2800 ma - 2.8 amps

You could drive two led's in parallel at 1400ma each


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> I'm using two 105C's to drive a dual XML sled bar light. I currently have two independent switches to control each led/driver. I would like to wire it up so that there is only one switch controlling both drivers. Would this be as easy as cutting the gate leg on the slave driver MC and jumper'ing to the MC gate on the primary driver? Of course, I would still have to run power/gnd to the slave driver.
> 
> I'm afraid that running both drivers in parallel off one switch could cause problems keeping the driver modes sync'ed.


How about just piggy backing 8 more AMC 7135 chips to one driver board?

You don't need two TINY13A chips controlling two separate groups of 7135 chips.

In other words, one driver board contrsols 16 AMC7135 chips

Not sure what kind of 7135 chip limit there is as far as the TINY13A goes?

I have a bunch of the 4 x 7135 (1400ma) chip boards left in stock in case anyone wants to experiment with adding more 7135 chips to the 105C type driver boards


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## jprescott7 (Oct 11, 2011)

cant you drive two leds at 2.8amps off of a 105C using the poormans setup?


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

I don't know what poor mans setup is?

But, no, you can't drive two at 2.8 amps
The board is a current limiter board
It is a 2.8 amp max board, so it will not put out any more than 2.8 amps

2 x 2.8 amps is 5.6 amps

You would have to add 8 more AMC7135 chips to the driver board to get 5.6 amps


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## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Can do the same thing with 2 LEDs. Just use two batteries instead of three.
Works fine with the multimode from Shining beam.


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## Rich_SC (Oct 10, 2009)

I've been using a Poorman's circuit with the single AMC7135 on a couple of different lights. One is to run 2 XML's each at 2.8A with a 7.4v battery (as shown above). The other light is 4 XPG wired up 2S2P so each LED gets 1.4A off of a 7.4v battery (image below shows this). These both work great.


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Hmm, I see you are putting the LED's in series and the batteries in series

The voltage that the driver board see can be no more than 6.5 volts, but there is a voltage drop across each led, so the driver board ends up seeing the correct voltage range

Interesting.

Have you guys tried this?

That's not at all what I thought was being asked.
I thought he was asking if a single board could provide nmore than 2800ma of current.


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## Rich_SC (Oct 10, 2009)

This thread at CPF explains how it works:

Poorman Mutli-Lux setup method


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## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

yes, thanks, I see just by looking at it how it works


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## Ruimsr (Jan 18, 2011)

That´s possible modify this board so she support one battery of 8.4V 4400mAh??

Can you tell me one circuit board that support 8.4V and has 3/5 modes??


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## Toaster79 (Apr 5, 2010)

Ruimsr said:


> That´s possible modify this board so she support one battery of 8.4V 4400mAh??
> 
> Can you tell me one circuit board that support 8.4V and has 3/5 modes??


How many LEDs do you want to drive?

1 LED - buck driver
2 LEDs- linear driver
3+ LEDs- boost driver

Assuming you're wiring LEDs in series.


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## Ruimsr (Jan 18, 2011)

That´s for 1 LED (XML-T6).

I want replace the circuit board from a replica of Magichine 808-E who is fried. The battery is from 8.4V.


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## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

then you need a buck driver (this thread is about a linear driver). There are plenty of buck drivers that would suit you on DX and KD and they're not very expensive either.


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