# E-bikes for Clydes



## masonmoa (Jul 11, 2011)

Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

Depending on which brand you buy, some come nicely spec'd and if you choose a bike lesser parts it can be upgraded with better parts as they wear.

Also Specialized has frame only options...


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

They are heavy- at least 40 lbs. Lift weights...seriously. Focus on abs and back. They are fun but don't handle near as well as regular bikes in that usual 28-32 range. I have a Pivot Shuttle and love it. It has a pretty short chain stay and with 27.5 wheels, not more nimble that most. it still does not handle as well as my Yeti, as fun as it is to ride.


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## masonmoa (Jul 11, 2011)

Flyer said:


> They are heavy- at least 40 lbs. Lift weights...seriously. Focus on abs and back. They are fun but don't handle near as well as regular bikes in that usual 28-32 range. I have a Pivot Shuttle and love it. It has a pretty short chain stay and with 27.5 wheels, not more nimble that most. it still does not handle as well as my Yeti, as fun as it is to ride.


I didn't know that about Speshy. Not sure if I'd ride one again, but good to know.

40lbs doesn't sound too bad, but I was just at my friend's shop and one of his customer's Scott XC e-bike he had sitting there was like 50lbs. And the Orbea he was building for the same customer was even heavier. He also handed me a spare battery to check out and the idea of carrying a spare in a backpack for longer rides is definitely not happening.

I just guess that when I started riding again about a decade ago, I discovered that a complete bike purchase simply would't work for me at my weight. For one thing, I needed stout wheels with a steel rear drive shell. Granted, I was WAY over 300lbs back then. I'm now 55lbs lighter, and in the upper 200s, but I still have this fear from when I got stuck like 8 miles from my car because I blew the rear hub. That walk in bike shoes sucked! But maybe e-bikes are built up a bit stouter due to the extra weight.

I'd still like to hear more if any of y'all got one. Particularly how the wheels have held up, and how the suspension has worked out with the even more weight.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

E-bikes (at least the higher end ones) have a decent spec. Mine has DT 350 hubs with stout DT alloy rims. You're not stripping a DT350 unless you're cranking out 800+ watts on sudden bursts. Just cranking out 400-500 will do nothing to the wheels. The hubs are key because the builds are usually stout. I don't have a Specialized though have ridden them. My Pivot is my e-bike while my Yeti SB 4.5 is my regular MTB. I have a fat bike but sadly, no motor there either. My Yeti has a steel drive shell but the alloy ones nowadays are tough too. 

A really light e-bike (Orbea Rise, Specialized Levo Sl) are 38-42 lbs. The rest are heavier, as far as I know. The Rise on on my target list. As you go higher in price, the wheels and suspension are far better. Do it right the first time unless you want to build frame up and then you will spend around $2K more over buying the complete bike.


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## Krapper2 (Sep 11, 2020)

masonmoa said:


> I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up.











Jones Motorbikes Plus frameset lets you DIY build your own e-bike


Jones Bikes announced Jones Motorbikes, with new Plus LWB HD/E, a heavy duty long wheel base bicycle ready for ebike conversion




bikerumor.com





good videos here:






-Blog - Jones Motorbikes







www.jonesmotorbikes.com


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

masonmoa said:


> Not old enough yet to justify it...


You're "not old enough" to have more fun than before on a bike, ride further, and get up hills faster?


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

Flyer said:


> They are heavy- at least 40 lbs. Lift weights...seriously. Focus on abs and back. They are fun but don't handle near as well as regular bikes in that usual 28-32 range. I have a Pivot Shuttle and love it. It has a pretty short chain stay and with 27.5 wheels, not more nimble that most. it still does not handle as well as my Yeti, as fun as it is to ride.


I disagree. Once you learn to ride them, they can handle just as good or better than a normal bike. I'm just as confident on my 55lb Commencal Meta vs my 2020 Specialized Enduro. Weight is a non-issue, makes it more stable and have more traction in the corners.


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## partswhore (Dec 17, 2004)

Flyer said:


> E-bikes (at least the higher end ones) have a decent spec. Mine has DT 350 hubs with stout DT alloy rims. You're not stripping a DT350 unless you're cranking out 800+ watts on sudden bursts. Just cranking out 400-500 will do nothing to the wheels. The hubs are key because the builds are usually stout. I don't have a Specialized though have ridden them. My Pivot is my e-bike while my Yeti SB 4.5 is my regular MTB. I have a fat bike but sadly, no motor there either. My Yeti has a steel drive shell but the alloy ones nowadays are tough too.
> 
> A really light e-bike (Orbea Rise, Specialized Levo Sl) are 38-42 lbs. The rest are heavier, as far as I know. The Rise on on my target list. As you go higher in price, the wheels and suspension are far better. Do it right the first time unless you want to build frame up and then you will spend around $2K more over buying the complete bike.


I'm curious if the DT pawl system is up to the task. The 2021 Bullit was reviewed on PB recently and he did have a failure:

"DT Swiss 350 hubs: I've said lots of good things about DT Swiss' hubs in the past, and their Star Ratchet design is usually very reliable...usually. In this case, some of the teeth became slightly rounded and started slipping past each other, which meant it was impossible to put any pressure on the pedals. In other words, ride over. One I scooted my way home I swapped out the teeth and didn't run into any further issues. This incident did make me thing that there might be room for a beefier start ratchet, possible with larger, and fewer teeth."

Review: 2021 Santa Cruz Bullit - The Electrified Freeride Machine - Pinkbike

Likely best to have a pair on hand. Could be done trailside very easily.


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## TwoThirtySeven (Aug 29, 2020)

masonmoa said:


> Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


You can still get your cardio in; you'll just do more laps or ride further in the process.

They are heavy but you don't feel it when you're rolling.


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

partswhore said:


> I'm curious if the DT pawl system is up to the task. The 2021 Bullit was reviewed on PB recently and he did have a failure:
> 
> "DT Swiss 350 hubs: I've said lots of good things about DT Swiss' hubs in the past, and their Star Ratchet design is usually very reliable...usually. In this case, some of the teeth became slightly rounded and started slipping past each other, which meant it was impossible to put any pressure on the pedals. In other words, ride over. One I scooted my way home I swapped out the teeth and didn't run into any further issues. This incident did make me thing that there might be room for a beefier start ratchet, possible with larger, and fewer teeth."
> 
> ...


The 54t ratchet is known for having failures. The less engagement, the bigger each ratchet is, the less likely it is to fail. So I would guess the most reliable set up is to swap in an 18t into the 350. You will lose some engagement, but on an ebike I think that is less of an issue. And you can find the 18t for nearly free used.


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## scatterbrained (Mar 11, 2008)

masonmoa said:


> Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


Just to throw it out there, but most of the people I encounter on E-bikes are "heavier" guys. These bikes can handle it. 
.
Yeah, they are heavy, but you get used to it pretty quick. If it's that much of an issue, use your legs and not your back. Squat down, grab the bike at the bottom of the downtube with one hand and at the fork leg with the other, and stand up. 
.
I have a Specialized Levo carbon and find it handles quite well. Very agile and grounded. There are some trails where I even prefer the quick handling of my Levo over my Yeti. 
.
I've never felt a need to get a backup battery, but for how I ride I would get about 20 miles in before gettting the low battery warning. That usually involves about 3k of singletrack, switchback climbing as well with the motor set between 25 and 45% power. If I was planning a large backcountry (out and back) style ride I would definitely want a backup battery.


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

I’m a big guy and just got a Trek Rail 7, the bike is heavy and took me some time to get used to it, but after a little while it felt normal, I’m still having trouble getting the front to go up when I approach a downed tree, but the bike is a beast and runs over everything, climbing is actually fun, a hill that normally took me 8mins only took me 3:40 (emtb mode).


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## Decoy20 (May 26, 2021)

masonmoa said:


> Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


The weight is what it is, and it's worth it - ride one you'll see. Only the Levo SL, Orbea Rise and some of the new-Gen "lightweight" e-bikes come close to coming back to normal Enduro/DH weights. But for a Clyde? Stay away from those. They're too heavy to treat like analog bikes and make some compromises for heavier guys that may not make sense. Some mfgs, do frame-only, but honestly, MOST of the parts on an ebike aren't going to fail because of your weight (exc. perhaps air shocks, spokes/rims). Many mfgs are using more robust e-rated parts with the higher load expectations.

I'm 270-275lbs clothed with hydration and ride a YT Decoy 29 and it's been totally fine with the exception of ridiculously-high 330psi required in the FoxDPX2 air shock. Decoy a stout bike. I'm right on the edge of the 'max permissable' weight. This is a statistic you'll definitely want to look into w/ each manufacturer as they're all different. See this article for some good details. Excess Baggage: I weigh 90 kg - am I too heavy for my bike? | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine

Max. allowable weight limits kept me from Spec Levo, Trek Rail and a few others. With a maximum payload of 131 kg, the Giant Trance X E+ 1 is probably the highest allowed weight among those I've looked at.

I did have to upgrade my hitch-rack to allow 50+ lbs of bike (x 2 if needed). You may want to consider a hitch rack instead of 'throwing' your ebike into the pickup. You're not going to just lift this bike up anymore, but you can roll it up onto things. I lift the front end onto my hitch tray, roll the front wheel into the cradle and then lift (standing very close to the frame) the rear triangle onto the rear tray. You might be able to 'wheelie' it up into your truck bed using "WALK" mode on the motor. You'll figure out a system that works. No roof racks obviously....

I _CAN_ say without hesitation that I've_ doubled or tripled _the amount of hours and miles that I've been biking. I still break a sweat and now I can bike back-to-back days without knee issues. ebikes are major fun and put a smile on your face each ride. You won't look back. If you need even more cardio, lower your power output to ECO, or turn it off on some flats.


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## TNC (Jan 21, 2004)

RBoardman said:


> I disagree. Once you learn to ride them, they can handle just as good or better than a normal bike. I'm just as confident on my 55lb Commencal Meta vs my 2020 Specialized Enduro. Weight is a non-issue, makes it more stable and have more traction in the corners.


I agree with this^^^. The weight disappears and stability replaces it. I think guys who have ridden dirt motorcycles know that this is the case. And I don't mean emtb's are exactly like dirt motos, but that issue of weight on the ebike becomes a non-issue with pedaling assist. It's quite impressive.


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## geardoc (Jan 15, 2004)

What they said - the weight disappears when you are riding. 

Pushing or carrying the bike over obstacles is another matter.


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## cunningstunts (Sep 1, 2011)

Decoy20 said:


> The weight is what it is, and it's worth it - ride one you'll see. Only the Levo SL, Orbea Rise and some of the new-Gen "lightweight" e-bikes come close to coming back to normal Enduro/DH weights. But for a Clyde? Stay away from those. They're too heavy to treat like analog bikes and make some compromises for heavier guys that may not make sense. Some mfgs, do frame-only, but honestly, MOST of the parts on an ebike aren't going to fail because of your weight (exc. perhaps air shocks, spokes/rims). Many mfgs are using more robust e-rated parts with the higher load expectations.
> 
> I'm 270-275lbs clothed with hydration and ride a YT Decoy 29 and it's been totally fine with the exception of ridiculously-high 330psi required in the FoxDPX2 air shock. Decoy a stout bike. I'm right on the edge of the 'max permissable' weight. This is a statistic you'll definitely want to look into w/ each manufacturer as they're all different. See this article for some good details. Excess Baggage: I weigh 90 kg - am I too heavy for my bike? | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine
> 
> ...


exciting to hear. i'm awaiting my eeb (Marin AT2), which is now into it's 6 month. hoping for a July delivery but the radio silence from the dealer and Marin makes me wonder if they are going to make it. my interest in epic climbs has really waned in the last few years. at 53 (and 220) my knees just don't care for it and local terrain is very technical and often slippery and frankly, miserable to climb unless you're really fit and 'on'. by all accounts, the eeb is going to totally revitalize local riding and turn the climbs into fun times and unlock more descents than ever. i can't wait. now that summer is here (and about to get hot) it's prime riding season and i couldn't be more keen to get the eeb. i'll still be riding my regular bike, which is also amazing, but i won't be getting to the best trails as they are epic to reach requiring a 2 hour brutal climb. as the heat intensifies, going up will become a total sufferfest. Marin, deliver my bike!!!!


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## Decoy20 (May 26, 2021)

@cunningstunts - RE: Slippery/technical - it takes some getting used to emtb in the wet/slippy stuff though.

Cons:

You'll have much more power than traction, takes some care applying the torque... just like driving in snow
You're going much faster than analog, and you get pushed offline a lot and not be able to ride 'your line' in the wet since you just are going too fast for conditions
Pros:

You don't _have to _carry momentum to keep your speed up the next section....you can brake to a near stop if you need to and get back up to speed with the help of your motor (slow-in/fast-out)
Powering through loose loamy stuff or mud is way way easier of you manage traction carefully.


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## shreddr (Oct 10, 2009)

Decoy20 said:


> @cunningstunts - RE: Slippery/technical - it takes some getting used to emtb in the wet/slippy stuff though.
> 
> Cons:
> 
> ...


Spot on!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## gramr (Jun 15, 2021)

It depends.

Do you want a bike that's a bit easier to lift up? Or do you want a bike that takes away everything that sucks about riding and leaves in everything that's fun?

I had no problem climbing up all the way up a mountain several times in a single day and getting some fast runs with nice air on the way down, even on my street bike with fenders and fat slicks. Despite being a strong, lean rider, it would have been a brutal grind to get up on my non-electric enduro bike (the lift wasn't running that day); I had _way_ more fun with the electric though this one is far from optimized for serious trail riding. I can't imagine what it would have been like on a long-travel e-bike with proper off-road tires. 

Once you try climbing with a good electric drive system, you'll never go back; it eliminates the suffering and makes every part of the ride enjoyable.


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## matt4x4 (Dec 21, 2013)

You can buy a frame and build an ebike, you can use any frame you wish, theres even mid drive frames you can buy. I was eyeballing the Taiwan Cyclone Elite for awhile, as compared to numerous Enduro frames. Maybe 5-10 yrs down the line when the lbs bought batteries are to expensive to replace or no longer for sale, someone will figure out how to operate the proprietary motor with generic batteries and controllers. Remember the BionX ebikes of yore, they were a pretty easy proprietary bypass, but there's so much better stuff out there now with thinner lams, alum internals for better heat shedding, heck some motors came with curved magnets but still dont know the advantages of those, or the double set of sensor wires, mxus.

Some people have multiple ebikes they build up, one for technical single track like say a BBSHD, or Cyclone to keep the weight down low, rather then a heavy hub motor in the rear or front. Another cruiser ebike for the pathways, say a QS hub motor for cruising.

If you want light, you got to go ultra low power, like 250-500W low power geared motor, which means less heat shedding ability, more moving parts to potentially break.
Normal power depending on where your at for legal purposes is 750-1kw, could be anything from a geared MAC motor to a 9C type 20-25H direct drive.

But figuring as your on the mtbr forums you'd probably want to look at Luna Cycle's website, they are based out in California and have some nice ebikes, Sur Rons and their mail order frames they build up to their own spec.



masonmoa said:


> Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


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## BigJZ74 (Jul 18, 2010)

I don't even feel the weight of my Trek Rail 7 on trail. ~54lbs. I really depends how strong you are. No issues throwing it over the tailgate of my lifted truck either. I actually enjoy climbing but like taking 20+ mile rides so i tend to ride in eco most of the time, jump to trail (eMTB lite) if trail is super steep. I really just picked it up to ride with my normal human sized friends so I can climb at their pace. I'm also the fastest descender in the group so now I can lead the descents as opposed to being completely dead after a 1500ft climb while they are fresh waiting for me to get there. Since I never use full power I just ordered an Orbea Rise H15 to add to the stable but upgraded to factory suspension and battery extender to see how that feels. With the extender I'll have close to 800wh of battery so I should get more ride time out of it compared to the Rail. It's due to arrive by the end of the month supply chain willing. I still run the regular bikes when I ride solo when climbing slow doesn't matter.


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## BigJZ74 (Jul 18, 2010)

and my second eMTB....


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## CRM6 (Apr 7, 2021)

I’m 6’3” 238 and my Intense Tazer MX is rated for 300lb max. It’s a carbon frame and I’ve added a custom wheel set with Factor hubs and DT Swiss EX511 rims. The wheels are bulletproof! Bike comes in at just under 50lbs. Trust me when I say ride one! The weight is negligible!


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## mtbbiker (Apr 8, 2004)

CRM6 said:


> View attachment 1976492
> 
> I’m 6’3” 238 and my Intense Tazer MX is rated for 300lb max. It’s a carbon frame and I’ve added a custom wheel set with Factor hubs and DT Swiss EX511 rims. The wheels are bulletproof! Bike comes in at just under 50lbs. Trust me when I say ride one! The weight is negligible!


I live in Murrieta, next door to Intense. Lots of Tazers and I use to own one. This ebike can take a lot of abuse and keep coming back for more. I’ve heard from sources that this ebike is built to DH standards. The only downside is the 500wh battery. I had to buy 2 batteries. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CRM6 (Apr 7, 2021)

mtbbiker said:


> I live in Murrieta, next door to Intense. Lots of Tazers and I use to own one. This ebike can take a lot of abuse and keep coming back for more. I’ve heard from sources that this ebike is built to DH standards. The only downside is the 500wh battery. I had to buy 2 batteries.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I love it! I ride it at a no shuttle park and it is fantastic! The battery life is dwindling after a year of hard riding. I can’t find a battery at a decent price.


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## wigston (May 3, 2006)

What we have found from building electric mountain bikes (titanium hardtail so far) for heavy riders is that the Onyx Racing products hubs hold up the best. We are also getting some OEM hubs made in Taiwan for our production eMTB on our Clydesdale brand, and they do well, but not as solid and reliable as the onyx hubs. 
Nick Wigston
Zinn Cycles and Clydesdale Bicycles


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## MikeTowpathTraveler (Aug 12, 2015)

masonmoa said:


> Curious to hear if any of you big guys, like over 250, have an e-bike. They're so damn heavy. I mean, my bikes are built like tanks and land ~33lbs, so now I feel like even 35 is heavy. But like 50lbs? Throw my back out putting it in the back of my pickup! And also I hate that you can't buy a frame and build it up. You gotta buy a complete, which is why I'm curious how it's worked out if any y'all have one. Also still trying to figure out how I feel about them. Not old enough yet to justify it cuz I gotta get my cardio in. But when I go from sea level to 7000ft to ride, they're really tempting.


It's been said here already but I'll say it again: the pedal assist system on an ebike erases any worries about the bike being heavier than an analog bike. 

As far as getting your cardio in; power down on your assist. Trust me, you'll get all the cardio you ever asked for. There no age cut off when an ebike becomes permissible. If you want one in your bike collection, you buy one. Only problem I found is after you buy it, the increased range opens up more riding possibilities not possible with your other bikes. Buy an extra battery or two like I did and suddenly, going a century on a fat tired Haibike becomes reality.


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## _CJ (May 1, 2014)

I can't image the average class 1 bike not being able to handle even a 300 pound rider.

As for the weight of the bike, you get used to it. Only time I notice mine is getting it in and out of the bed of my truck.

You can buy frame only ebikes online from SE Asia suppliers. Some allow you to pick which motor/battery you want. This will probably be my next bike. I'm really liking the looks of the offerings with a Bafang M620 motor and 1000wh battery.

.


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## wigston (May 3, 2006)

MikeTowpathTraveler said:


> It's been said here already but I'll say it again: the pedal assist system on an ebike erases any worries about the bike being heavier than an analog bike.
> 
> As far as getting your cardio in; power down on your assist. Trust me, you'll get all the cardio you ever asked for. There no age cut off when an ebike becomes permissible. If you want one in your bike collection, you buy one. Only problem I found is after you buy it, the increased range opens up more riding possibilities not possible with your other bikes. Buy an extra battery or two like I did and suddenly, going a century on a fat tired Haibike becomes reality.


yes for sure. It's nice from a handling perspective to have it as light as possible but the motor definitely makes the weight less of an issue. Our titanium hardtail are just over 40lbs with Bosch Gen 4 motor and 500wh battery which I feel is pretty good for an e bike. We'll see what happens when we get to make a full suspension.


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## Oldmantrails (Oct 16, 2019)

partswhore said:


> I'm curious if the DT pawl system is up to the task. The 2021 Bullit was reviewed on PB recently and he did have a failure:
> 
> "DT Swiss 350 hubs: I've said lots of good things about DT Swiss' hubs in the past, and their Star Ratchet design is usually very reliable...usually. In this case, some of the teeth became slightly rounded and started slipping past each other, which meant it was impossible to put any pressure on the pedals. In other words, ride over. One I scooted my way home I swapped out the teeth and didn't run into any further issues. This incident did make me thing that there might be room for a beefier start ratchet, possible with larger, and fewer teeth."
> 
> ...


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