# How many lumens?



## OldManBiker (Nov 5, 2016)

Let me first say that if the below questions are discussed elsewhere in this group please post the link and I'll go visit. Thank you kindly.

Like most things, I do as much research as I can before I bite the bullet and purchase something for my bike. My next big adventure is to try some night riding. Here is what I'd like to know for someone wanting to try this for the first time.

1 - Is 800 lumens ample enough light for trails that are plenty flat with some occasional non-challenging climbs, and some descents with some good curves/switchbacks along the way? 

2 - From all the articles I've read it seems that anything over 800 lumens like 1200 - 1600 is an overkill unless you have some killer climbs to make. And that a helmet light is typically needed primarily for curves which then, can be a smaller LED. My question is on this point, IS a helmet light necessary or is night riding still plausible, fun, and safe without one?


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

I think 800 is adequate for that type of riding, especially if the beam is well designed. 

It isn't for me in the sense that I feel far more comfortable with 1500-2000 due to the extra width. My trails can be fast and flowy but some are mountainous and twisty. So the descents can be a bit fast. 

Helmet light is a must for me...the turns come up fast and I have to see through them. If i use one light, it is always the helmet light. 800-1500 on the helmet and 1800-2500 on the bar for me. I could do with less but I'm used to more now and it is harder to go back. I could but it would take a few rides and I'd ride quite a bit slower on the way down.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Quick note, you have it backwards. Climbing your going slow, need less light. Coming back down is where you want more light. Faster you go, the more light you need.

1 800 lumen light is "enough" but never a good idea to go out with one light unless riding with friends. if that one light goes out your stuck in the dark. A couple of them (one helmet and one bars) is fine for leasure riding unless you know the trail well.

Im the opposite of flyer in that I found having my more powerful light on the helmet works much better. But my lumens are about the same range as his, just mounted in opposite locations. The big "plus" to brighter lights is of course more light. The more you can see the more confident you are. If you go where the rest of us are, neutral white led lights, then details being washed out, trails looking cold and such goes away. Makes a BIG difference, especially if your one that already isnt a fan of "cool white" lights in cars.

Basically, what you want or need for lumens is up to you. a couple 800 lumens will get you out for night riding no problem. I ride with bigger lumens than i need (usually stay in lower modes except the fast descents) but its fun truly, not figuratively, turning night into day.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

OldManBiker said:


> Let me first say that if the below questions are discussed elsewhere in this group please post the link and I'll go visit. Thank you kindly.
> 
> Like most things, I do as much research as I can before I bite the bullet and purchase something for my bike. My next big adventure is to try some night riding. Here is what I'd like to know for someone wanting to try this for the first time.
> 
> ...


Yes, 800 lumen is fine for moderate mountain biking. Back in the early days of night bike riding all of us used halogen lighting which was usually in the 200-300 lumen range ( for one lamp ).. Didn't take a rocket scientist to quickly figure out that having two ( one bar mounted and one helmet mounted ( with a tighter beam pattern ) made riding safer and more fun.

While bike lighting has improved immensely over the years some things don't change. Two lights are always better than one. Not just because you have more light but because if one fails you still have the other. The golden rule of night trail riding is; "Never be caught back in the woods at night without a back-up light". Crap happens. People forget to charge batteries or over-estimate their charge. Cheap lamps get wet and short out, people fall and bust the lamp...stuff happens.

Like many people on this forum I own dozens of light sets because as the features on the light sets changed over the years I spent money to get the latest improvements. Nowadays even the cheapest of lamps will put out close to 800 lumen. The lamps I currently use output ( ea. ) 1500 lm. bars ( max ) and 2200 lm ( max ) on the helmet. That said all of these lamps are programmable and have multiple output modes. I usually use about 500 lumen off the bars and about 800 off the helmet when just riding at a normal pace on moderate trails. The only time I use more is if I'm riding faster or going over some really technical terrain. Of course if I'm poking along and the terrain is easy I'm not afraid to just use one light at a low level ( 200-300 lumen ). ( ** BTW, I'll be 63 this year. )


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

My setup is a bit of a mismatch because I have not coughed up the cash for a brighter helmet light. 2016 was the year for me to build up a cross bike and two sick road bikes, so I spent way too much. The Tesla spot has really good distance though and it is light. On the helmet, I'd prefer lightweight lights so if I were to get another one, I'd get the 1500 lumen Piko. I could ride with just that but the dual setup is kinda nice. I can run the Betty a bit dim of even off while climbing and then kick them up once I reach the top. I'm very glad bike lights have become so popular and we have these great choices.


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## OldManBiker (Nov 5, 2016)

tigris99 said:


> Quick note, you have it backwards. Climbing your going slow, need less light. Coming back down is where you want more light. Faster you go, the more light you need.


Tigris, I don't claim to know one single thing and had hopefully tried to convey that in the beginning. Below is where I learned where it was suggested about what lumen was needed where, and why. However, I will say that I am learning a tremendous amount from you guys that the article didn't even touch on. This stuff here is what I needed to hear and consider so thank you to all.

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mtb-gear/cateye-lights-review/


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## indebt (Nov 8, 2009)

OldManBiker said:


> Let me first say that if the below questions are discussed elsewhere in this group please post the link and I'll go visit. Thank you kindly.
> 
> Like most things, I do as much research as I can before I bite the bullet and purchase something for my bike. My next big adventure is to try some night riding. Here is what I'd like to know for someone wanting to try this for the first time.
> 
> ...


 If you were only going to use one light (not recommended), helmet all the way as you will have better lighting on switchbacks and tight corners. I'm basically repeating what has already been said but it's important to budget two light. Better light dispersion and a major safety improvement. If you can afford it try going twin emitter lamp heads vs single as beam quality IMO is much better.

As for output. That is subjective. With todays neutral tint emitters and wide beam angles thousands of lumens are not as bright as many suspect it would be. I'm running 8800 lumens in neutral tint and 26degree optics and as long as i dont have it diald up full blast in tight overgrown single track it is not too bright at all.

Better to have more output than not enough as there are many output setting for adjustment.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

OldManBiker said:


> Tigris, I don't claim to know one single thing and had hopefully tried to convey that in the beginning. Below is where I learned where it was suggested about what lumen was needed where, and why. However, I will say that I am learning a tremendous amount from you guys that the article didn't even touch on. This stuff here is what I needed to hear and consider so thank you to all.
> 
> https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mtb-gear/cateye-lights-review/


I see now.

The issues with that blog is that's it's all personal opinions. Every detail. Which isn't bad, it just brings the same rule to the game as the rest of cycling. It's personal preference.

Only "rules":

If going out alone, have 2 lights, never just one.

If going out alone make sure it's on trails you know and someone knows where you are, when and how long you should be. Make sure your prepared if it's a long ride.

That's it. Beyond that it's personal preference like anything in cycling.

800 is "enough" but most of use use more. It's better to have more in case you need it vs not enough.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

tigris99 said:


> ....Only "rules":
> 
> If going out alone, have 2 lights, never just one.
> 
> If going out alone make sure it's on trails you know and someone knows where you are, when and how long you should be. Make sure your prepared if it's a long ride.


IMO that second item should be called advice, not a rule.

About once a year I go somewhere for riding and do a night ride on trails I have never ridden or only ridden once every few years. Did it more before I retired. I'd leave work on Friday and drive several hours to the destination. Set up camp then go ride for a couple hours.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Remember, 8000lm=800lm for the el cheepo's(with a few exceptions). Enjoy the night ride!


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

I guess i consider it a rule because if something happens and no one knows where you are your in deep trouble, FAST! A bad crash that would otherwise be just be a hospital trip could turn into your last ride cause your laying there for hours or days and no one has a clue. If you say only advise then especially young morons will blow it all off and then you see "dead rider found" in the news. Though let natural selection do its thing, I hate to not make safety matters "rules".

Guess thats why I was made shift safety inspector and lead emergency first responder at work lol. I plan for the idiots which there is A LOT OF THEM


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

Always have 2 lights. always. When I first started night riding, I learned the hard way. 2 lights, always.

I prefer to have the brighter bar on the handlebar with a wide throw to create shadows. Let's me read the terrain a bit better. Weaker for narrower beam on my head to look around corners and look further out.

My first night ride was with a couple 80 lumen fishing light on my helmet and a flashlight bungee corded to my frame. It worked, but I had to go slow. More light => approaching your daytime speed. Less light, just go slower for safety. First real light was one of these Chinese cree lights. With a diffuser lense, it works great, and is a good starter to check out night riding. A second one on my helmet, and life was good. I ended up getting a $25 nightrider 350lumen light off nashbar, and I'm going to give it a shot on the helmet. Any light over 350 lumen will be adequate to ride at night, just at a lower pace.
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B009PWE6RW

If you just want to try night riding without spending a lot, I'd grab one of these $25 cree lights and strap it to my helmet. Then get a flashlight attached to my handlebar as the backup. Doesn't need to be bright, but bright enough to see you through a controlled stop.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Been nite riding since '93 regularly. I have never found a need for more than a single light (prefer head mounted). I carry a small LED flashlight for an emergency b/u. Currently running a Niterider Lumina 750, usually ride narrow and rocky New England singletrack at the same speeds I run in the daytime. I typically keep the light on it's lowest regular setting (not the superlow output hiking mode) which I believe is ~200 lumens and rarely find that I need more than that. 

Someone gave me one of those cheap Crees and I found it unreliable and cheezy overall. You can get Lunina 750 for under $80 and it's unlikely you'll find you actually need more unless you're nite DH racing, or are a mad gear geek.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

tigris99 said:


> I guess i consider it a rule because if something happens and no one knows where you are your in deep trouble, FAST! A bad crash that would otherwise be just be a hospital trip could turn into your last ride cause your laying there for hours or days and no one has a clue. If you say only advise then especially young morons will blow it all off and then you see "dead rider found" in the news. Though let natural selection do its thing, I hate to not make safety matters "rules".
> 
> Guess thats why I was made shift safety inspector and lead emergency first responder at work lol. I plan for the idiots which there is A LOT OF THEM


If I didn't go on solo night rides, regardless of location, I'd almost never get to go. It's really about each persons comfort level with being outdoors alone. Personally, I'm more concerned about safety when I go to downtown PDX at night than I ever have been about night riding in the backcountry.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

very true you live in urban areas. When Im in St Louis visting family im a lot more worried about walking to my van after dark (especially after some idiots tried to steal our bikes last time) than anything else.

Here though one of my trail sets IM extremely close (for my liking, about 8 ft) from the edge of a bluff in some sections and its steep grade towards it off the trail in many areas. Or the wooden bridges with a few foot or more fall off them that usually claims at least 1 arm or joint a year. 

I mostly ride solo too, just my wife knows what trails Im at, i text when heading in and when i get back to the trailhead. Its my wifes rules too, enough crashes as it is during the day (no broken bones and only walk out due to bent rim or flat tire) and she tends to worry.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

I don't really don't treat riding in the dark any different then riding in the light anymore. We've had a standing weekly Wednesday night ride running since ~95 and we probably get it in an average of 40 weeks a year. Working regular hours means that it's likely any after-work ride will at least end up in the dark 9 months out of the year where I live, so night riding is just something you get used to. Use some common sense, have fun. Definitely a best approached with other people and a few adult beverages, but can also be a great time solo. 

Also again, I've found the Niterider Luminas to be a great little lights. Super dependable, rugged, and I can't say I've ever felt I've really needed anything brighter for trail riding. No matter what light you chose, definitely carry some sort of back-up, preferably with at least enough light and burn time to let you walk out of wherever you're riding if it comes down to it.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

For the "worried wife" issue, roadID has an app that tracks where you are on a map and sends a text message if you are stationary for a set time limit. I figure it's a simple app to use at night riding by myself to add a little peace of mind. Plus it doesn't really take any extra battery or data over running strava at the same time.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Have have droids so we have something similar called loop, preinstalled app. Like it cause when she goes to see family I can check to make sure she's safe on the highway if she doesn't answer the phone. She uses it if I don't answer either to make sure I'm still alive and moving or if I'm headed back from riding if I forget to text or call (cause Im talking to friends at trailhead lol)

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

How many lumens, you ask? How bout 25,000 lumens. Mount it on the helmet or bars!
Olight X9 $400.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Omg NICE!!!! Have vanc make a mount to bolt it to the stem!

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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

Yeah, riding 30mph ought to keep it cool!

-Garry


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

Dirt Road said:


> View attachment 1116468
> Mount it on the helmet


Definitely want to see that!
Mole


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## mb323323 (Aug 1, 2006)

Beam shots????


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

Something I think about- At some point, it becomes too much and too white and too reflective (for me). I do like more amber light and LEDs tend to be more blue on the spectrum. I started with the Jet Lites Phantom halogen which is very amber and lends this warm color to the trail in front of me. I like that a lot though it was maybe 570ish lumens and not the brightest. Doable and nice on a slow grind or easy night ride. While I have all these other LED lights, I recently picked up a Jet Lites off eBay just for that warmth on certain trails where it takes me back to the old days in a way...quiet night ride with a warm amber glow lighting up the trail in front. Sounds silly to most, I am sure. It's kind of like lighting candles on a dark night in a cabin. Let me live in my bubble sometimes.:blush:


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Flyer

The too white is "LEDs of old". Except most of the brands don't get it.

Neutral white LEDs which very few offer, gives your more of that incandescent/halogen bulb appearance to the light. So much nicer.

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## Stark (Apr 29, 2008)

Cool White (Magicshine MJ-858, max power):








Neutral White (KDIGHT BL70s, second of third available levels):


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

My custom HD-016 modded with XM-L2 5B1 tint (4000 to 4200k - neutral white but on the verge of warm white) - the most realistic color rendering tint I have found (click to enlarge):



Warmer tints of LEDs have been around for years. As tigris99 said above, the manufacturers just don't listen and force cool white on us as their only option (probably because cool white emitters are always the cheapest).

-Garry


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

You guys are really thinking about light tint while you're riding?

This is a bizarre subforum.


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## garrybunk (Feb 12, 2014)

slapheadmofo said:


> You guys are really thinking about light tint while you're riding?
> 
> This is a bizarre subforum.


Absolutely! It has a direct connection to your brain interpreting what your eyes are seeing! It's the difference between seeing details of roots, rocks, etc. . . versus looking at blurry objects. In fact it's similar to riding with 20/20 vision versus say 20/50 vision. You're going to see more detail from further away thereby allowing you to make better decisions quicker thereby allowing you to ride faster. (Well in theory anyway.)

-Garry


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> You guys are really thinking about light tint while you're riding?
> 
> This is a bizarre subforum.


Actually...no. We think about it when off the bike. Most of us got our start night riding back in the days of halogen lighting. Halogen light ( as most people know is much warmer in tint ) than standard LED cool white lighting. Some years after LED bike lighting became mainstream some folks began to claim that the "warmer tints" of available LED's were better for seeing detail on natural surfaces. Most people ignored this claim because "cool white" lighting was just brighter. Fast forward to today; All LED's are better and brighter than they were when first introduced, including the warmer tints. Neutral and warm white LED's started to make inlays into mountain bike lighting. Once you start using the warmer tints you begin to see the advantages. The major advantages of warmer LED's are ; less reflective glare from trailside flora and from lighter colored trail surfaces. This aids in seeing things in the distance better. You also see trail features better because the warmer tint brings out more of the natural color of the objects and/or trail features. I still use the cooler tints for paved road use because on roads it is not as much of an issue.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

Those cool blue tint lights are definitely cheaper though. For someone starting out, they're better than nothing, and most riders can justify spending $30 for some lights that let them ride at night. If they get serious about it and do night riding 3 or more times a week, definitely worth upgrading to warmer lights.

I don't get to night ride as much as I like, but when I do, I still have fun with the bright white lights. Getting into my car afterwards is a shock though. Headlights look so yellow.


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

Cat-man-do said:


> Actually...no. We think about it when off the bike. Most of us got our start night riding back in the days of halogen lighting.


My first Niterider was 1994. I probably do 60 nite rides a year. I can't say I've ever put a single second's thought into light tint, ever. If it turns on and stays on, it's all good.

"Reflective glare from trailside flora"?

.....slowly backs away....


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Actually what cat said about that is fact not opinion or anything personal. Cool white lights can also put a lot of strain on the eyes.

But like anything it's personal preference. In this case more of whether it bothers you or not

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## Staypuft1652 (Oct 8, 2016)

I only have the 1 light which is some iteration of neutral white.... With that said, I will freely admit to where it is less straining on the eyes, verses the bright, but dead looking white of all of my other lights. It does pain me to admit this though lol. The difference between say, office building flourecent lighting, and old school incandescent bulbs. The one singular advantage that incandescent bulbs had was they didn't give you a headache just from normal use.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

That right there is why I can't use cool white lights. Or "daylight" led bulbs in my house. Headaches.

I understand it's painful to admit, that's why so many haven't transistioned yet. But we are slowly corrupting everyone, we've already got you thinking 

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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

I have no serious problems with them...I just find the color cold and reflective at much higher lumens, and I feel that less blue illuminates the trail obstacle better. For some reason, I like the amber maybe because we had these tall old amber streetlights everywhere where I grew up and it kinda takes me back. 

In the house, she keeps replacing lights with the LED lights. I hate them. We are careful about turning lights off everywhere but now the damn place feels like a hospital when things are all lit up.


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## offroadcmpr (Apr 21, 2012)

Something else to keep in mind is the shape of the light. More narrowly focused optics will throw the beam out further, thus making it seem like it is brighter.

For example, on my handlebars I have fairly floody optics. It doesn't go very far, but it lights up a very wide path in front of me. My helmet is a much narrower beam to see further out. At lower brightnesses especially, my helmet light appears to be brighter even though it puts out the same number of lumens. If I only had one 200 lumen light, the shape of my helmet light might be workable, but the handlebar one would not.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

slapheadmofo said:


> My first Niterider was 1994. I probably do 60 nite rides a year. I can't say I've ever put a single second's thought into light tint, ever. If it turns on and stays on, it's all good.
> 
> *"Reflective glare from trailside flora"? *
> 
> .....slowly backs away....


I'm taking you didn't understand what I was saying so I'll explain. Some very narrow single track trails can be lined with tall bushes or trees. Depending on how thick the brush and the color of the leaves, when you are passing through these sections _there can be a bit of reflective glare_ because your lamps are very close to said flora. LED's with brighter, cooler outputs will tend to reflect more light ( back to your eyes ) even if you are not consciously aware of it. The end result is that your eyes make an automatic adjustment and constrict the pupils. When this happens your eyes lose some of their ability to gather light from farther/distant objects or trail surfaces. ( with warmer LED's the leaves absorb more of the warmer light spectrum so there is less close in reflective glare ) Just how important all this is depends on the opinion of the person, the acuity of their vision, the types of trails they normally ride and how much of a nit-picker they are. ( Me'sa big on nit-picking )

Like you I rode for years with cool white LED lights, was thrilled to have the brighter light and really had no complaints. When people started talking about "neutral white and warm white" LED's I decided to buy a couple cheap Chinese lamps that were supposedly "neutral white", just so I could see for myself if there was any real notable difference. My conclusion was that when I compared the different tints ( warm vs. cool ) I found I could actual see way more trail detail than I could with the cooler LED's that were outputting in the 6500K (Kelvin) temp range.

With the right set-up it's kind'a like comparing an old style cathode-ray tube color T.V. to a more modern HD color flat screen TV. Sure, you can enjoy watching video on an older T.V but once you experience an HD screen it's like, "Wow, this is great". _Hey, if you like your lights and are satisfied with how they work than stay with what you like ( if that's what you want to do ). I'm not trying to sell you new lights_, I'm just talking about what options are available if you ( or someone else ) are in the market for a new light set and want a good setup for mountain biking. Everyone's got an opinion so I thought I'd post up my own conclusions (**But what the hell do I know...:cornut: )


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## slapheadmofo (Jun 9, 2006)

My nitpicking pretty much stops at "not dark".


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## OldManBiker (Nov 5, 2016)

I appreciate all the magnificent and extraordinary information about how many lumens might be needed and, it appears that like most things there is a smorgasbord to choose from based on one's preferences, likes/dislikes, utilization, climate, vision, et al. 

I was really enjoy reading this Thread and learning a lot, and well quite honestly taking my time as I was in no hurry. (sometimes I tend to get just a tad over analytical and will research something to death!) And then last Thursday happened to me! Me and my riding buddy got a little oh....froggy I guess you'd say and tried to squeeze in ONE MORE trail before leaving and as luck would have it 1) it's the first time we had been on this trail and 2) by the time we were about a mile from the entrance it was I could do to see the trail in front of me due to darkness. THANKFULLY I saw a rider coming towards me and I swear it looked like a helicopter or UFO coming straight at me! He was able to point us out and it was that epiphany that made me realize just how much trouble we could have been very soon WITHOUT night lights. 

So I am now getting a 1500 lumen (highest output) for my handlebar and an 800 lumen for my helmet. No more darkness for this old Marine! lol


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## Staypuft1652 (Oct 8, 2016)

Glad the folks here (more knowledgeable than myself) were able to help you. They're a helpful bunch.


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## Flyer (Jan 25, 2004)

That will be more than enough. It will be fun too!


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## gsmith462 (Feb 14, 2015)

Just started night riding last year, picked up a Light and Motion Taz 1500 in the gray color on clearance for $145 and I love it. The beam pattern is very wide and the LEDs would be considered somewhat neutral I would say. The drawbacks are it runs hot especially on the brightest setting although I generally run it on medium which is around 750 lumens and it's only intended to be bar mounted. I intend on picking up a light for my helmet but I'm trying to stay on the cheaper side so the Niterider Lumina 750 seems like a decent option, a ton of great reviews on that light.

Outside of the idea that it's good to have a backup light I had no problem running the single 1500 lumen light on fairly technical trails with some fast switchbacks and a mix of flat and hilly terrain. I don't race so for me it's more about just getting out and having fun. At night I enjoy pushing myself but am not out there to run my best time more so then to just have a good time, it's really a cool experience being out there in the "off hours". I can say that some of the less traveled trails can have their moments when riding alone at night. A lot of sounds when it's nice and quiet such as animals walking that can send one's imagination running. Fortunately I haven't had to stop to fix a flat or anything in the dark but I could see how it could be a bit nerve racking if you're by yourself in the middle of nowhere with no one around for a few miles. 

That being said, having that backup light would be great in a moment when you have to do a trial side repair. I always thought I could just strap my bar light to a tree branch and have plenty of light on the low setting to get the job done but then what happens when the repair takes longer and now your battery is about to die with 5 miles to go until your done....not cool!!


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

gsmith462 said:


> Just started night riding last year, picked up a Light and Motion Taz 1500 in the gray color on clearance for $145 and I love it. The beam pattern is very wide and the LEDs would be considered somewhat neutral I would say. The drawbacks are it runs hot especially on the brightest setting although I generally run it on medium which is around 750 lumens and it's only intended to be bar mounted. I intend on picking up a light for my helmet but I'm trying to stay on the cheaper side so the Niterider Lumina 750 seems like a decent option, a ton of great reviews on that light.
> 
> Outside of the idea that it's good to have a backup light I had no problem running the single 1500 lumen light on fairly technical trails with some fast switchbacks and a mix of flat and hilly terrain. I don't race so for me it's more about just getting out and having fun. At night I enjoy pushing myself but am not out there to run my best time more so then to just have a good time, it's really a cool experience being out there in the "off hours". I can say that some of the less traveled trails can have their moments when riding alone at night. A lot of sounds when it's nice and quiet such as animals walking that can send one's imagination running. Fortunately I haven't had to stop to fix a flat or anything in the dark but I could see how it could be a bit nerve racking if you're by yourself in the middle of nowhere with no one around for a few miles.
> 
> That being said, having that backup light would be great in a moment when you have to do a trial side repair. I always thought I could just strap my bar light to a tree branch and have plenty of light on the low setting to get the job done but then what happens when the repair takes longer and now your battery is about to die with 5 miles to go until your done....not cool!!


Yes, you need to pick up something for a helmet light for the reasons you stated (backup light). Your also going to end up with a much better setup for night riding because while your Taz1500 has a wonderful wide beam it's also lacking a lot of throw (I own one too). The beam on the Lumina 750 you mentioned will reach out noticeably further. I also want to mention a couple things about that Lumina 750 you might want to consider. Most on this forum don't run self-contained lights on their helmets because of weight and limited placement options. Limited runtimes on the Lumina are something to consider too. While it has similar runtimes @ max power to your Taz it only makes half the amount of power the Taz does so I would expect you'll be running it harder and it will probably be the one that runs out of juice first. A similar priced light-head/battery setup might work better for you. Whatever you decide you'll be better off with an additional light.
Mole


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## gsmith462 (Feb 14, 2015)

MRMOLE said:


> Yes, you need to pick up something for a helmet light for the reasons you stated (backup light). Your also going to end up with a much better setup for night riding because while your Taz1500 has a wonderful wide beam it's also lacking a lot of throw (I own one too). The beam on the Lumina 750 you mentioned will reach out noticeably further. I also want to mention a couple things about that Lumina 750 you might want to consider. Most on this forum don't run self-contained lights on their helmets because of weight and limited placement options. Limited runtimes on the Lumina are something to consider too. While it has similar runtimes @ max power to your Taz it only makes half the amount of power the Taz does so I would expect you'll be running it harder and it will probably be the one that runs out of juice first. A similar priced light-head/battery setup might work better for you. Whatever you decide you'll be better off with an additional light.
> Mole


I appreciate the input Mole, will definitely keep that in mind when searching out a helmet light :thumbsup:


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## kevinboyer (Jan 19, 2012)

OldManBiker said:


> I appreciate all the magnificent and extraordinary information about how many lumens might be needed and, it appears that like most things there is a smorgasbord to choose from based on one's preferences, likes/dislikes, utilization, climate, vision, et al.
> 
> I was really enjoy reading this Thread and learning a lot, and well quite honestly taking my time as I was in no hurry. (sometimes I tend to get just a tad over analytical and will research something to death!) And then last Thursday happened to me! Me and my riding buddy got a little oh....froggy I guess you'd say and tried to squeeze in ONE MORE trail before leaving and as luck would have it 1) it's the first time we had been on this trail and 2) by the time we were about a mile from the entrance it was I could do to see the trail in front of me due to darkness. THANKFULLY I saw a rider coming towards me and I swear it looked like a helicopter or UFO coming straight at me! He was able to point us out and it was that epiphany that made me realize just how much trouble we could have been very soon WITHOUT night lights.
> 
> So I am now getting a 1500 lumen (highest output) for my handlebar and an 800 lumen for my helmet. No more darkness for this old Marine! lol


OMB, if you don't mind me asking, what lights did you end up purchasing? I'm in the same boat as you were.


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