# 853 Hardtails



## tantrum007 (May 4, 2017)

Forgive me if this has been asked recently or often but does anyone have a list of companies that use 853 on their frames? I know Niner and maybe Cotic do? Anyone know some others? I'm in the market for a new frame. Thanks for your time.


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## Mk3Rider (Dec 7, 2008)

I ride the niner sir 9 that you mentioned, it is very satisfying.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

Stanton.


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## palerider (Jul 15, 2004)

Jamis dragon is a really nice frame imo.


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## nemesis256 (Aug 16, 2014)

Curious, what's the reason you want an 853 frame? How is it better/different over other steel frames?


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## Mk3Rider (Dec 7, 2008)

Stronger, smaller tubes, potentially lighter.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

nemesis256 said:


> Curious, what's the reason you want an 853 frame? How is it better/different over other steel frames?


I am wondering the same thing. There are a lot of nice quality steel options, and not all of them are specifically 853.


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## knl2stl (Jan 7, 2011)

I think that most 853 frames have 853 for the main triangle only and that the stays are usually 4130. True Temper had their (XO?) Platinum for front and rear triangles but I think that they got out of the bike tubing game. Gunnar used to make a 853 frame with True Temper stays until they went full True Temper. Not sure what they use now. I don’t even know if they make 853 stays.


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## GKelley (Sep 4, 2018)

nemesis256 said:


> Curious, what's the reason you want an 853 frame? How is it better/different over other steel frames?


The difference on steel properties also rely on how skilled the builder is in using the steel tubing to its fullest potential. Different manufacturers will use different butting and shaving techniques to get the ride feel they are pursuing. Stanton for example puts a lot of thought into their steel butting and tube width based on what the bike is being built for. 

Reynolds 853 is a higher quality steel than your typical 4130 Chormoly, but it still relies on the builder to bring the most out of it.


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## tantrum007 (May 4, 2017)

Yeah sooo anyone know of more builders that use Reynolds 853? I don't get on with Stanton geo


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## BadgerOne (Jul 17, 2015)

The list is short. I think all of the currently available ones have already been covered. Your other option is to go custom.

853 is great stuff, the strength to weight ratio is about as good as it gets for non-stainless tubing and the fact that it air hardens is a nice feature for the builder. That being said any decently made steel frame from any grade of 4130 is going to outlive us all, so I wouldn't overthink it too much.


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## KobayashiMaru (Apr 25, 2020)

knl2stl said:


> I think that most 853 frames have 853 for the main triangle only and that the stays are usually 4130.


My '09 Sir9 is 853 throughout. Sometimes old stuff is good stuff.


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## knl2stl (Jan 7, 2011)

KobayashiMaru said:


> My '09 Sir9 is 853 throughout. Sometimes old stuff is good stuff.


I doubt it. (But I could be wrong.)


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## Gilarider (Jul 13, 2009)

853 has better dent resistance. Supposedly.


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## KobayashiMaru (Apr 25, 2020)

knl2stl said:


> I doubt it. (But I could be wrong.)


Two seconds looking on google.











I tried to highlight the sentence that says every tube uses 853, but my phone photo editor changed it's software and I don't want to spend 2 seconds on google looking up how to do it the new way.

It's in there if you can read it.


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## knl2stl (Jan 7, 2011)

So says Bikeradar. Bikeradar also says my Box Prime 9 shifter can go up 4 shifts at once when the manufacturer says only 3 and in fact only 3. If you want to be certain, ask Niner. I have that sticker on lots of bikes, and the bottom right says ”main tubes.” Maybe look at your sticker. The one in the pic looks like it might say “butted main….” Can’t see the rest as it wraps too far.


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## KobayashiMaru (Apr 25, 2020)

I'd ask Niner, but they never answer their phone, or return emails. They used to, but once Covid happened I haven't been able to reach them at all.

In searching forums about the bike in the past, I've come across lots of people asking about the newer designs of the SIR9 compared to the older ones and the full frame vs main tube change is always mentioned at some point. It seems to be common knowledge, but maybe it was a bad press release or an incorrect article somewhere responsible for that.

Some printings of The Bible had Jesus with horns coming out of his head instead of rays of light because of poor translation or poor printing, so there are actually lots of paintings of him from that time with horns on his head.


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## KobayashiMaru (Apr 25, 2020)

KobayashiMaru said:


> Some printings of The Bible had Jesus with horns coming out of his head instead of rays of light because of poor translation or poor printing.


Oops. Might have remembered that wrong. It was Moses. At least examples of art survive with Moses with horns. I'm pretty sure an art documentary or something like that I watched one time said the same thing happened with Jesus, but I guess most of those works of art were destroyed after the translation error was figured out, if it did indeed happen.


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## Jake From State Farm (Oct 1, 2021)

Pace cycles, RC529 main triangle is 853 w/ sliding dropouts
Curtis cycles fancies 853 aswell


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## MattiThundrrr (Jul 6, 2019)

nemesis256 said:


> Curious, what's the reason you want an 853 frame? How is it better/different over other steel frames?











Reynolds Technology


853 is heat-treated to give high strength and damage resistance, and the steel properties allow thin walls to be used, so that lower weight but fatigue-resistant structures can be made.




www.reynoldstechnology.biz


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## MattiThundrrr (Jul 6, 2019)

Note how Reynolds 853 outperforms titanium in testing:


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## Little_twin (Feb 23, 2016)

MattiThundrrr said:


> Note how Reynolds 853 outperforms titanium in testing:
> View attachment 1979595


There is a reason larger tubes are used on titanium frames. That chart is missing some very critical data to be used as anything more than a sales pitch. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## *OneSpeed* (Oct 18, 2013)

Is this thread about bikes or frame materials?


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## MattiThundrrr (Jul 6, 2019)

*OneSpeed* said:


> Is this thread about bikes or frame materials?


Yes.


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## Chris the wrench (Jun 22, 2015)

853 air hardens when its welded(vs other steels that weaken from the welding process) making the joints stronger allowing thinner gauge tubes to be used. Ive owned probably 20 steel frames(2 853 frames(niner and a custom)) only one of those 20 steel frames broke(seattube/seatstay junction).


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