# Crack (or it appears to be a crack) bottom tube - Carbon Frame



## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

I bought a used SC Nomad V3.. that portion has sticker on it, so i didn't see. Should I be worried?

I don't really mind having cosmetic nuisance, but I want to know if this is ride-able for years to come.

Thanks a lot.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Too small of a picture to tell.


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## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

It looks like it has been badly repaired with epoxy.

I want to know if the location of the *crack is a risk.

Thanks


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## Tubulardreams (Nov 27, 2021)

DYORD said:


> View attachment 1970506
> View attachment 1970507
> 
> 
> ...


I don’t think the crank arm gets close to where those marks are.


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## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

Tubulardreams said:


> I don’t think the crank arm gets close to where those marks are.


sorry.. i meant the crack!

if it will eventually grow and becomes risky to use.


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## Muddysocks (Aug 15, 2021)

Does it sound any different when you tap around the damaged area with the edge of a coin? By the look of it I would think it is mostly cosmetic but if it sounds funny that would suggest that there is some delamination going on on the inside of the tube.


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## cwoodffr (May 23, 2019)

Looks to me like a bad scrape that has been poorly painted with black paint to cover the scar....unlikely to be a crack....in that spot its not a stressed area so to be cracked would probably have to have been a very hard and sharp impact from the side (like a rock point)...which would show a "crush" and dent which would be VERY hard to hide.

That looks like a fall over in a rock garden. Certainly tons of beef in that area of the frame.

edited to say kinda shitty that it was hidden under a sticker...


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

looks nasty. you were robbed, imho

I'd disassemble and see if I can stick a borescope up in there and take a peek


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## noapathy (Jun 24, 2008)

It's definitely not just the paint and a bad epoxy job is worse than doing nothing if it makes something that's unsafe look ok. I'd stop by a good shop and get them to check it over. If they covered this up, you never know what else might be going on.

Epoxy WILL NOT make it structurally sound. The strength comes from the fibers themselves.


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## mudflap (Feb 23, 2004)

From the picture, it is too hard to tell how bad the area is impacted. From my experience, it takes a BIG hit to crack a carbon fiber lay-up. If it got hit hard enough to crack the frame, you'd know it - it wouldn't be guesswork. 
Surface blemishes from impacts can look pretty ugly, but seldom do they compromise the integrity of the carbon fiber. 
One of the issues with SantaCruz carbon fiber is surface delamination. It can spread out from any area of impact and looks ugly. But it doesn't weaken the carbon fiber. It's just the surface lacquer peeling away.
If it were me, I wouldn't worry about it. < This from viewing your picture, and no other inspection.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

you need ultrasound or xray to know for sure what, if any, laminate damage is in there


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## cwoodffr (May 23, 2019)

mudflap said:


> From the picture, it is too hard to tell how bad the area is impacted. From my experience, it takes a BIG hit to crack a carbon fiber lay-up. If it got hit hard enough to crack the frame, you'd know it - it wouldn't be guesswork.
> Surface blemishes from impacts can look pretty ugly, but seldom do they compromise the integrity of the carbon fiber.
> One of the issues with SantaCruz carbon fiber is surface delamination. It can spread out from any area of impact and looks ugly. But it doesn't weaken the carbon fiber. It's just the surface lacquer peeling away.
> If it were me, I wouldn't worry about it. < This from viewing your picture, and no other inspection.


Exactly this!!


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## dompedro3 (Jan 26, 2004)

If you're super worried and stuck with the frame, carbon fiber repair is not impossible. Here in the states these guys can do it:





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www.brokencarbon.com





I see you are in the phillipines, maybe get in touch with these guys:





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## 11053 (Sep 19, 2009)

Judging from the pics, I wouldn't worry about it.
I have two carbon SC bikes currently and have had many more over the years.
Santa Cruz carbon is typically very tough.
I've had gouges from rock strikes and damage from shuttling that look far worse than what the pics show.
Those matte carbon frames can have extensive chipping of paint/powder coat and some visible fiber damage and be completely fine in my experience.


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## brodare45 (Dec 30, 2020)

DYORD said:


> View attachment 1970496
> 
> 
> I bought a used SC Nomad V3.. that portion has sticker on it, so i didn't see. Should I be worried?
> ...


I have heard from a LBS that has Santa Cruz that they had someone get a warranty approved even though he was not the original owner so you might be able to get it warranted if it is cracked


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## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

Great! Thanks for the replies. Knocked it with coin.. doesn't really sound different from the rest of bottom tube.


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## Muddysocks (Aug 15, 2021)

No guarantee of course but thats promising. A spot with laminate damage has typically a more muffled, less sharp sound than the healthy laminate around it.


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## bingemtbr (Apr 1, 2004)

Contact SantaCruz and share this photo. I've had outstandingly wonderful service from SC on my wife's TB3. Its been warrantied twice: Once fully covered for a clear coat issue and once covered under crash replacement from being punctured with an object (likely a bullet) while in transport on the highway. 

The bike may be an even better deal with a crash replacement--you'd get a new front triangle.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

still, get a borescope... up from the BB or down from the HT if there are openings allowing it,
to see from the inside. [no borescope ...dental mirrors, flashlight, and luck....]

can't guarantee laminate is sound, but you'll see any exposed shredded fiber that way or see an epoxy blob/patch

but I haven't see a santa cruz cut open so don't know if there are any paths to view that area from inside

35 bucks can get a borescope that uses wifi and your smartphone for a display
20 bucks can get one that works on USB and windows PC


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## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

127.0.0.1 said:


> still, get a borescope... up from the BB or down from the HT if there are openings allowing it,
> to see from the inside. [no borescope ...dental mirrors, flashlight, and luck....]
> 
> can't guarantee laminate is sound, but you'll see any exposed shredded fiber that way or see an epoxy blob/patch
> ...


Thanks.. I'll give it a try. I happen to have an endoscope form ebay. I really don't know then why I bought it.


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## D. Inoobinati (Aug 28, 2020)

Even if it's cracked, it's an easy $30 DIY carbon fiber repair. Tubes are stupid-easy to fix.


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## DYORD (Mar 11, 2021)

127.0.0.1 said:


> you need ultrasound or xray to know for sure what, if any, laminate damage is in there


this sounds like it would cost me a new frame. 


Thanks for the suggestion anyway.


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## Stahr_Nut (Nov 7, 2006)

cwoodffr said:


> Looks to me like a bad scrape that has been poorly painted with black paint to cover the scar....unlikely to be a crack....in that spot its not a stressed area so to be cracked would probably have to have been a very hard and sharp impact from the side (like a rock point)...which would show a "crush" and dent which would be VERY hard to hide.
> 
> That looks like a fall over in a rock garden. Certainly tons of beef in that area of the frame.
> 
> edited to say kinda shitty that it was hidden under a sticker...


Agree. Looks like a bad scrape to me that was touched up with a Sharpie marker. Given its proximity to the shock mount I suspect that area of the downtube it pretty stout. I wouldn't hesitate to ride it.

None the less if I purchased it used and this wasn't disclosed I would be quite upset. Also, even if it is a crack I highly doubt SC will warranty it for you nor would I expect them to. They may offer a decent crash replacement deal but not likely a full warranty replacement.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

brodare45 said:


> I have heard from a LBS that has Santa Cruz that they had someone get a warranty approved even though he was not the original owner so you might be able to get it warranted if it is cracked


SC will not warranty crash damage. They might off crash replacement at a cost.


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## Muddysocks (Aug 15, 2021)

Looks like the frame took a good hit from sth. sharp like a rock. Took out a good chunk of topcoat and exposed the underlying carbon. Afterwards somebody filled up the damage with epoxy or similar and sanded flat. You can still see scratchmarks from the sanding. Structural damage or not, if the seller did not disclose the damage and even hid it under a sticker I would definately be back to him for a chat and renegotiations.


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## Cleared2land (Aug 31, 2012)

Baring some enhanced photos, I'm betting you're fine to go ride. Taking the ethical component out of the transaction, I would prolly be comfortable with riding that frame.


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