# Cassette Review XTR, modded DA & Recon



## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

So I bought one of ninos 11-34 cassettes, XTR 970 11-34 and a Dura Ace 12/27 7700 with a 30t Action-Tec cog subbed in for the gap left by taking out the 15t.

All three were tested on my Scott Scale. The DA/A-Tec on my Extralite wheelset and the XTR and Recon on my Tune Mag190 wheelset. Here's my ranking with the best first.

XTR 244g $150

D-Tec 209g $??? + $26 (Cassette + Cog)

Recon 197g 180 Euros - EDITed to correct price sans shipping 

XTR had great shifts up except for chatter in the 11t. I've had this in the past where the spring in my rear der doesn't allways pull all the way to it's outer most limit. Yet, all the other cassettes were okay in this regard. Maybe my shifters are getting old or my cableset needs replacement but the XTR cassette had the best downshifts. Always accurate never needing to be trimmed with a up shift.

My DuraAce 12/27 w/15t cog removed and 30t cog worked very good too except it occasionally needed to be trimmed after a multi downshift with an upshift. What was great was I could switch wheelsets and not do any tuning on the shifting between the DA and XTR cassettes. With light tires and light wheelset I could climb anything the 34 cassettes could do! A road cassette deserves special mention for it's close ratios. At times this is very nice with perfect cadence adjustment and seamless shifting at times I don't even notice. However, on terrain that can suddenly drop away, the ratio gaps on the 34 cassettes are nice - you don't have to trigger shift rapidly to catch up. Anything with a lot of steady hills the DA is good, again, for dialing in your cadence. On rolling terrain with ups and downs a 11-32 or 34 might be better. I wonder if the downshift trimming is due to the A-Tecs slightly thicker cog by 2 hundredths of a mm per my digital caliper. But again shifting was good with zero problems going in or out of the 30t or across the 15t gap.

Finally, a really expensive disappointment, the Recon (202 euros is NOT cheap :madmax: ). Unlike the Shimanos where you essentially set the limits and go, the Recon needed alot of fine tuning with barrel adjusters in order to find a compromise. I raced twice with this cassette and it was awful. Up or down I got a bag of skipping. Shifting up (into a higher gear) was a little better but the chain was always making chatter or skipping. At first I thought it may have to do with the Scales funky chain line (??) but then I went back to the above cassettes to confirm. Rather peculiarly nino includes a set of instructions that essentially say the cogs need to be ridden a few times before they are broken in. I've put 100+ miles on it and it still stinks. It's a unique cassette that looks well made and I hope to try it on another frame that has a 68mm bb verses the Scales 73mm plus e-type bracket.

So that's that - let me know if I let anything out.


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## Bender (Jan 12, 2004)

How exactly was the 30t added to the Dura Ace? I run a stock 12:27 Dura Ace 177g and I love it.


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## Cranked (Jun 1, 2006)

Looks like you took one for the team....or make it three. Is your bike resting against a E36 M3 in the last pic?


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

So the Dura Ace Cassette has 3 cogs on one spider, 2 cogs on another spider, a 12t "cap" for the end and 3 individual cogs. Just pic one of those to remove. I actually removed the 14t not the 15t. Take the extra spacer from there and put it behind the 27t/spider with the new individual low gear cog of your choice. I've used up to a 34 successfully!

Took one for the team yes, I've got a lot of cassettes and cogs laying around but they all wear out eventually. Yup it's an E36 M3 - how'd you know :thumbsup: I have snow tires on it though. I'd like to get a used 911 carrera 4 someday for passes that require 4x4 by law after snow storms.


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## gratiflying (Sep 21, 2006)

Appreciate the write up slobberdoggy! i also have and am experimenting with all these cassettes (M960/M970 XTR, DA and Recon) except on completely different bikes. my short term findings were also slightly different than yours.

on the 12-27 DA, i pulled the 14 and replaced it with an 11 for my DH bike. The 11T came from a M960 11-34 set. Every shift except up from 13-15 was REALLY crisp and tight. since i pulled the 14, the ramps aren't aligned and the chain wanders a bit shifting up and sometimes requires and additional up shift then a down to get it on the 15T cog. without this problem, this setup would be the best shifting of the 3 - primarily due to the tight ratios, which also rock for DH. Since you didn't mention anything in your write-up, i presume you didn't have any problems from the pulled 14 or 15T cog? How'd you do it?

i found both M960 and M970 XTR to be reliable and quick everytime. not the lightest or necessarily the tightest ratios but definitely the fewest problems shifting. too bad they don't make 11-30 XTR. 

i've only had one 2 hour ride on the Recon - a cycle king branded 11-32 from ebay - and overall it was pretty good. no missed or ghost shifting just more noise and a bit of hesitation compared to the DA and XTR. it's on a 2x9 24/36 setup (soon to be 1x9). Only complaint is the stupid 2 thread alloy lockring that almost stripped my freehub body. time will tell how bad the individual Ti cogs eat the freehub splines. 

If it makes a difference, i'm using X9 1:1 shifters, 991 hollowpin chains and XOand X9 shorty derailleurs.


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## Strong Ti (Jun 1, 2005)

*Thanks for the reviews!*

Well done on the reviews, I've taken the 14T out of a 12-27 DA and added an 11T from XTR but also had issues with 13- 15T gap, it didn't shift well and I put the 14T back in.

I'm 2x9 now with 11-34 XTR, I do miss the 'right' gear at times, and do end up pushing a higher gear than I'd like. Some times the micro drive setup is perfect for some courses other times 2 x 9 comes into its own.


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## limba (Jan 9, 2004)

Cool info. Thanks.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

In your pic the cassette on the left - what is that? The top cog appears to have some serious wear on the teeth.... Can't be good for your chain etc.

I was going to buy some Ti cogs and swap the steel ones on XTR cassette's out for the Ti ones - giving a reduction in weight along with the good performance of XTR's big cogs.


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## Cranked (Jun 1, 2006)

How'd I know? Come on dog. Sorry for road content.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*strange...*

well - i'm really surprised by your comments on my cassette. i have ridden them on my own bikes (different bikes with Shimano STI and Grip-Shift) and they performed flawless. They need a short break-in to unsharpen the rather sharp edges on the machined Ti-cogs. after this they shift great. i have sold many of them and so far only one guy had problems but there it seemed the chain was the problem. anyway - lots of positive feedbacks.

now i'm not saying it can't be BUT XTR and DA should work 100% flawless so reading you have minor adjustements and glitches with them already tells me there must be something "wrong" with your setup. maybe just worn cables as you already guessed, a streched chain, bent derailleur hanger...etc.

by looking at your picture i see you compare brandnew cassette with those broken-in cassettes. those cassettes were used with the chain on your bike. maybe i'm wrong but the chain you show there doesn't seem to be a new one, right? a new cassette definitely needs to be run with a brandnew chain to insure perfect performance. that's what i also say in the instructions. a streched chain will perform flawless on its counterpart when they have been used together BUT not if you use it on a brandnew cassette. and the fact that you need some up-or down-shifts on XTR and DA to have the correct gear in tells me your cables really, really need replacement.

you definitely need to use a NEW chain on a new cassette, have your cables lubed or better install new ones and check about the derailleur if it is straight or maybe bent slightly and also check the B-tension screw for correct positioning.

and last but not least: did you install the spacers in the correct order? there's spacers with different thicknesses so it might also be that you have mixed them up while installing the cassette which could cause the troubles...a wrong spacer in the middle of the cassette will ruin all shifting for sure.

it's correct that these cassettes need more precise adjustements than your 0815 shimano but once adjusted they will perform on par.

anyway - it's hard for me to judge form the distance but your comments above, the picture and my experience together with the feedback i get from people using my cassettes tell me there might be something wrong with your current setup. definitely don't hesitate to get in touch with me as i'm sure we can solve the problems you have!


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

Tiffster, what you see is how action-tec profiles their teeth.

Very nice Crankster - I gotta find a picture of my coupe wheel deep in snow.

Nino, the anodized gold spacer go on first then the thinner silver spacer correct?

The XTR cassette was brand new too and I was really surprised by it's good downshift performance. You could almost feel it in the shifter. The downshifts were simply accurate to the click whereas with the others I had to learn to be a little more gentle with the downshift then occasionally trim.

The ti cassette worked in the it's highest and lowest gears best and a few gears in between but not many. I'll try it again eventually on a different bike, wheel and new chain. If it still shifts like poop I'll send it back to you just so you can try it too I guess. I think I may put it on my new touring bike now that I think about it . . . .


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Of course Nino's had nothing but positive reviews...RIGHT... till now... so of course... it must be something wrong with your derailleurs/shifters when brand new xtr and dura ace cogs shift great on what's obviously a shimano drivetrain bike, but nino's overpriced titanium cassette shifts poorly.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Of course Nino's had nothing but positive reviews...RIGHT... till now... so of course... it must be something wrong with your derailleurs/shifters when brand new xtr and dura ace cogs shift great on what's obviously a shimano drivetrain bike, but nino's overpriced titanium cassette shifts poorly.


c'mon D8 - read his initial statement and it's obvious that it isn't shifting 100% as it should when using XTR...

i am giving honest advise because i know once broken-in the cassettes do perform well.


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

nino said:


> c'mon D8 - read his initial statement and it's obvious that it isn't shifting 100% as it should when using XTR...
> 
> i am giving honest advise because i know once broken-in the cassettes do perform well.


XTR shifts the best except there is chatter in the highest gear (11t). Down shifts and ups shifts are perfect. Regardless of chain and cableset on my bike the Recon worked the worst.

I'll put the Ti cassette on the touring bike today and ride it tomorrow or maybe tonight for a final test perhaps it will work perfectly . . .


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## Upandatem (Apr 11, 2004)

nino said:


> c'mon D8 - read his initial statement and it's obvious that it isn't shifting 100% as it should when using XTR...
> 
> i am giving honest advise because i know once broken-in the cassettes do perform well.


Am I the only one sick of seeing this D8/Nino argument in almost every single WW thread?!? Give it up already guys, just agree to disagree and save us the time we waste filtering out these pointless posts!


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Upandatem said:


> Am I the only one sick of ...


no you aren't !

Slobberdoggy:
-did you use a NEW chain?
-did you adjust the endstops accordingly as my cassette might need a slightly different setup than XTR


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

Nino,

I've been using the 11-30 cassette I bought from you for a couple months now. I installed it with a brand new chain (X10SL Gold). The chainrings in the front were brand new as well (Extralite Octaramps). The shifting has been really good, until recently. Now from time to time, the downshift from the 8th cog to the 7th cog takes some effort. Sometimes from the 7th to the 6th as well. Everything else shifts fine. I didn't mention anything because I have not take the time to take a really good look at what is going on. This all started after the 1st real offroad ride for the bike a couple weeks ago. It is possible that the RD hanger has bent slightly. It's possible that the derailleur cables or housing have some dirt in them. 

Once I have looked at all this, I will know what the reason for the problem is. If everyone else took the time to do the same, I'm sure they'd see that there's likely nothing wrong with the actual cassette itself. I'm about to start using the 11-34 that I have, and it will be installed with brand new everything (shifters, derailleur, cables, chain, etc...). That will be the real proof.


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

nino said:


> Slobberdoggy:
> -did you use a NEW chain?


The XTR and DA+ActionTec did not have a new chain either and shifted better! The XTR was brand spanking new - see pic.



nino said:


> Slobberdoggy:
> -did you adjust the endstops accordingly as my cassette might need a slightly different setup than XTR


Absolutely. FWIW the Recon shifted better on the stand than in the field so perhaps flex is an issue.

My touring bike is almost brand new so the chain should be good.

If anyone else out there has used the Recon their experiences are appreciated. I have provided my experience. Another poster here used his Cycle King with no problems. So lets see if anybody else materializes.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Im getting a bit annoyed with Dee VS Nino too - just keep your opinions to yourself instead of continually moaning on here about it.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Slobberdoggy said:


> The XTR and DA+ActionTec did not have a new chain either and shifted better! The XTR was brand spanking new - see pic.
> 
> Absolutely. FWIW the Recon shifted better on the stand than in the field so perhaps flex is an issue.
> 
> ...


i don't care what the others shifted like. i just say that my cassettes should be used with a brandnew chain. we all know that shimano sets the benchmark and that those shift flawless. mine do as well but need a NEW chain to start with. they need perfect adjustement as well. you can have 2-3 clicks margin on shimano casettes and they still shift good...not so with mine. they need to be adjusted very precisely. i don't care if it shifted better on the stand - it has to shift good under load so you might readjust 1 click at a time out in the field until it shifts good up and down.

i just installed a new rear derailleur since my shifting seemed a little off as well lately. i had a slight rattle when up-shifting the last rides. i changed cables first but no better. when i inspected my bike closer i discovered that the B-Tension screw was all bent and the Dura Ace derailleur had moved slightly forward as the bolt missed it's stop position on the derailleur hanger....i couldn't remember any crash but it was pretty obvious that something had bent the hole thing back there. anyway- the derailleur wasn't in the adjusted position anymore and i wasn't able to adjust the B-tension anymore since all was bent. now with the new derailleur shifting is again as perfect as it can be. just a minor change in position of the derailleur and all rattling is gone. i mention this because it shows that something a little out of the ordinary can have impact on the shifting performance.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

nino said:


> no you aren't


Good for you, I and others are already well past sick of seeing you put down others setups when it presents alternative options to the products you're flogging... the fact slobber got an modified DA cassette within 12 grams of yours with better shifting at a lower price says a lot to most of us. And that's... don't waste the 202 euro.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Tiffster said:


> Im getting a bit annoyed with Dee VS Nino too - just keep your opinions to yourself instead of continually moaning on here about it.


I don't particularly care what a fanboy thinks.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

nino said:


> i don't care what the others shifted like. i just say that my cassettes should be used with a brandnew chain. we all know that shimano sets the benchmark and that those shift flawless. mine do as well but need a NEW chain to start with. they need perfect adjustement as well. you can have 2-3 clicks margin on shimano casettes and they still shift good...not so with mine.


So people should just happilly pay more for the lightness and they'll just have to live with the fact the shifting and setup is gonna be worse? RIGHT. If that's the case, I think they should order the cycleking branded ones and save themselves 50 euros.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> nino said:
> 
> 
> > no you aren't !/QUOTE]
> ...


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

nino said:


> 1: the cassette doesn't cost 202 euro.and i don't see a reason to sell them for "nothing as well. i worked longe nough on this project...and i sell an upgrade as well which makes them even lighter which noone else has.


That's what slobber posted the price as to him, and well... I think i'll believe him over you.



> 2: the modified DA is a 12-30, not 11-34


Not hard with ActionTec's available pool of cogs to build an 11-34 with the DA 12-27 to start with.



> 3: read his comments above about the modified DA and you would see it's also not as good as it needs to be. by taking out cogs on a DA you get bad shifting. i used DA cassettes the last 7 years and tried about all setups possible...i know them in and out. that's why i made my own 11-30


There you go again, trying to rewrite/spin what someone just said... He said its not as good as the XTR but its still better than yours.

*


Slobberdoggy said:



The XTR and DA+ActionTec did not have a new chain either and shifted better! The XTR was brand spanking new - see pic

Click to expand...

*


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> That's what slobber posted the price as to him, and well... I think i'll believe him over you.
> 
> Not hard with ActionTec's available pool of cogs to build an 11-34 with the DA 12-27 to start with.
> 
> There you go again, trying to rewrite/spin what someone just said... He said its not as good as the XTR but its still better than yours.


1: he might have paid as much with airmail shipping from Switzerland but NOT for the cassette itself!! 
2: he has a 12-30. just the 30 was added and 15 removed. (please read better next time-thanks!)
3: he is telling about the problems he had. (again-read better next time)
4: he has problems with my cassettes but as several others show it might not be a problem of the cassette but rather a problem with his setup. (again: read better next time as it is written this way above)
5: just stop it - we are talking about 9 gear cassettes which is to new for your - thanks
6: i'm out of it as well as i have given honest advice. there's nothing more to say.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

nino said:


> 1: he might have paid as much with airmail shipping from Switzerland but NOT for the cassette itself!!


You don't read your own prices do you?

$309US buy-it-now, at today's exchange rate is nearly 196 euro. And that's at the official national monetary exchange level between governments and the like... banks...to individuals... he's not getting that favourable of an exchange rate.



> 2: he has a 12-30. just the 30 was added and 15 removed. (please read better next time-thanks!)


I read what he has... now read what I SAID... "Not hard with ActionTec's available pool of cogs to build an 11-34 with the DA 12-27 to start with. "

And its not, take out three of the smaller steel cogs to add an 11T, a 30T and a 34T. Its not rocket science though its obviously too intelligent a solution for you to think of.



> 3: he is telling about the problems he had. (again-read better next time)
> 4: he has problems with my cassettes but as several others show it might not be a problem of the cassette but rather a problem with his setup. (again: read better next time as it is written this way above)


Yes, and he's telling us what a disappointment your cassette is, we all understood that. You decided however to attack his setup rather than own up to the fact that your cassettes shifter POORER. If a NEW XTR cassette shifts next to perfectly with the same chain as he used your NEW cassette on, and it shifted poorly... well... then that's the end of the discussion. Now yer just trying to spin some damage control. And if people MUST use brand new chains with your cassettes to "wear them in", well... that's an expensive additional requirement there boyo. So now its even more a case of paying a lot of money for less weight and crappier shifting.



> 5: just stop it-thanks


Soon as you stop yourself there won't be any need for us to step in and stop you ourselves all the time.


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

here is 11-32 gold aluminium


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

i forgot pic ... sorry 

here is pic


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> You don't read your own prices do you?
> 
> $309US buy-it-now, at today's exchange rate is nearly 196 euro. And that's at the official national monetary exchange level between governments and the like... banks...to individuals... he's not getting that favourable of an exchange rate.
> 
> ...


it's so funny i just HAVE to answer:

309 is indeed the buy it now price BUT - that's for the "SL" version, including the lighter upgrade parts (again - if you would read better you would have noticed)
the auction starts much lower though and that's about what Slobberdoggy paid as well.

as for the rest i think it is clear to everyone what we are talking about.

@Eliflap:
152g is nice - 141g is even nicer
that's the aluminium cassette with my SL-kit. cheaper than the Ti  but less durable as well.


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

XTR 11-32 is 223g on my scales


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

And as usual he never misses a beat to flog his products....


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

> never misses a beat to flog....


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Slobberdoggy said:


> XTR 244g $150
> 
> D-Tec 209g $??? + $26 (Cassette + Cog)
> 
> Recon 197g 202 Euros -


just for clarification - may i still correct the prices given by Slobberdoggy:

the Titanium cassette didn't cost him 202 Euro.

he paid 202 for the Ti-Cassette, 2 Eclipse valves for the Tubelesskit and registered airmail shipping from Switzerland.


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Of course Nino's had nothing but positive reviews...RIGHT... till now... so of course... it must be something wrong with your derailleurs/shifters when brand new xtr and dura ace cogs shift great on what's obviously a shimano drivetrain bike, but nino's overpriced titanium cassette shifts poorly.


Hey there tiger, chill it out a little.


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

Slobberdoggy, is that a 960 or 970 cassette?

Also, please report back when you can if the loose 30T digs into the cass body. It is loose right? I couldn't keep all the changes straight in my head.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

GUYS PLEASE!

There is some good information in this thread if you have the time to sift through the bullsh!t that DeeEight is slinging and of course in return you have Nino defending himself or trying to prove D8 wrong. ITS TOO MUCH!

Please take it out of the threads. It is way past done!

MODs - can we please have this sorted out by one of you.


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## bhsavery (Aug 19, 2004)

bdc88 said:


> GUYS PLEASE!
> 
> There is some good information in this thread if you have the time to sift through the bullsh!t that DeeEight is slinging and of course in return you have Nino defending himself or trying to prove D8 wrong. ITS TOO MUCH!
> 
> ...


second that


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

rensho said:


> Slobberdoggy, is that a 960 or 970 cassette?
> 
> Also, please report back when you can if the loose 30T digs into the cass body. It is loose right? I couldn't keep all the changes straight in my head.


CS-M970 cassette.

No damage yet but I have a feeling it will eventually - especially being thee lowest cog ratio. I will say the part of the cog that mates with the cassette is slightly different than shimanos. Shimano's bend inwards slightly while A-Tec has a 90 degree edge. See pic. One might theorize that Shimano would cut easier into the cassette. We'll see anyway.

EDIT - I should say this is a Dura-Ace cog we are looking at with the Action-Tec not an XTR. I think XTR is about the same though.


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

Strong Ti said:


> Well done on the reviews, I've taken the 14T out of a 12-27 DA and added an 11T from XTR but also had issues with 13- 15T gap, it didn't shift well and I put the 14T back in.


I'm curious, why pull out one of the middle gears to run an 11t, when you could arguably just ditch the 12t and lockring for the 11t and matching lockring? That way you'd have an 11-27 with a somewhat goofy 11-13 jump between the two tallest gears, but decent spacing in the "meat" of the cassette.

I was thinking of putting a 12-27 on the wubbie's bike since she only got faster when I quietly pulled her 11-34 for an 11-32.


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

So I put the recon on my new touring bike with new chain, cableset etc.

I find I can either tune the barrel adjuster for positive upshifts but with reluctant downshifts all across the cassy (worse at the smaller cogs) or positive up and down except for cogs 3-5 (lowest-highest).

Ultimately it did shift a little better than on the mtb. It would probably be perfectly okay for friction shifters and for that I think I will save the cassette for another build.


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## Cranked (Jun 1, 2006)

Well thats kind of a depressing end to a pretty pricey piece of kit. Unfortunately giving up shifting performance on a high end bike can really destroy the ride and make your expensive bike feel like a Walmart equivalent. I suspect that most of us have less time to ride and maybe cherish the good miles. Sorry to hear it wasn't all good. 
Ps....when is the full suspension bike coming? haven't you been rambling about that for some time?


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

Cranked said:


> Well thats kind of a depressing end to a pretty pricey piece of kit. Unfortunately giving up shifting performance on a high end bike can really destroy the ride and make your expensive bike feel like a Walmart equivalent. I suspect that most of us have less time to ride and maybe cherish the good miles. Sorry to hear it wasn't all good.
> Ps....when is the full suspension bike coming? haven't you been rambling about that for some time?


Yeah, there's some places on my bike I can deal with idiosyncrasies as long as I know about them and can control them but even if a cassette works right it's no good if it requires "very precise" adjustment compared to a shimano. Perhaps it works perfectly for others and I'm just not a good enough wrench 

The full suspension is not happening anytime soon. I was tempted to get a "cheapy" full suspension for a downhill series. I've got to go (supposed to) on a trans usa bike tour in June and I'm trying to move. However, I'm really excited about Ibis and Cannondales offerings plus tubular wheels  Unlimited wants - Limited resources


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

bhsavery said:


> second that


I'll third that, especially since you see them arguing in almost all of the weight weenie threads.


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

Rod said:


> I'll third that, especially since you see them arguing in almost all of the weight weenie threads.


+++fourth. I'm not a regular and only check occasionally when time allows and it seems like these battles happen in almost every thread. Maybe the new name for the forum should have been D8 and Nino's battleground with occasional discussions about weight? (otherwise I think the WW name is perfect)

Back on subject, still wondering why everyone pulls the 14 or 15t on the DA cassettes instead of just swapping the 12t for the 11t with the right lockring...


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

cmh said:


> Back on subject, still wondering why everyone pulls the 14 or 15t on the DA cassettes instead of just swapping the 12t for the 11t with the right lockring...


Two different purposes. Swapping the 12t for an 11t won't let you put in a lower LOW (climbing) gear.

Does anybody sell individual 11t caps? I know where to get the lockrings . . .


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

ActionTec sells them... they're not on the price list but they have them and they're the same price as the 12 and 13T sizes.


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## Slobberdoggy (Sep 26, 2005)

DeeEight said:


> ActionTec sells them... they're not on the price list but they have them and they're the same price as the 12 and 13T sizes.


Thanks.


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> ActionTec sells them... they're not on the price list but they have them and they're the same price as the 12 and 13T sizes.


I get the real DA or XTR 11T caps through mailorder places like universalcycles.com. They're about $12.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*11t*



Slobberdoggy said:


> Two different purposes. Swapping the 12t for an 11t won't let you put in a lower LOW (climbing) gear.
> 
> Does anybody sell individual 11t caps? I know where to get the lockrings . . .


i have both:
steel = 9,0g
titanium = 4,5g


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

Slobberdoggy said:


> Two different purposes. Swapping the 12t for an 11t won't let you put in a lower LOW (climbing) gear.


Ah, right, of course... you're *removing* a cog so you have room for another, vs swapping. (duh) No reason you couldn't swap the 12 for the 11, lose the 14 and add the 30, right? Guessing that's your question about the individual 11t cog. (I catch up slowly)

Heh, used to be the two choices you had were 11-28 and 12-30... and the granny gear I had at the time was a 28-28... hell I can get lower than that ratio now with my 32-34!


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Hell he could use a 32 instead of the 30 for that matter easily enough... sure its a 5T jump from the 27 to the 32T but that's actually well within the capability of shimano derailleurs. Even nearly 20 years ago shimano had 7 speed cassette offerings up to the HG90 (Deore XT) level which had a 5T jump. The 13-34 cassette went 13-15-18-21-25-29-34. So a 2T jump, then two 3Ts, two 4Ts, and a 5T.


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## cmh (Jan 30, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Hell he could use a 32 instead of the 30 for that matter easily enough... sure its a 5T jump from the 27 to the 32T but that's actually well within the capability of shimano derailleurs. Even nearly 20 years ago shimano had 7 speed cassette offerings up to the HG90 (Deore XT) level which had a 5T jump. The 13-34 cassette went 13-15-18-21-25-29-34. So a 2T jump, then two 3Ts, two 4Ts, and a 5T.


I've got an older SRAM 9.0 cassette laying around which does just about that. It's an 11-34 like my XT cassettes, but the intermediate gears are tighter and there's a BIG jump to the 34. The Shimanos go 26-30-34, but the SRAM jumps 24-28-34. Looking at a new 990 cassette yesterday I see they've gone to the same spacing as Shimano. That 6t jump at the end probably didn't shift too well!


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> Hell he could use a 32 instead of the 30 for that matter easily enough... sure its a 5T jump from the 27 to the 32T but that's actually well within the capability of shimano derailleurs. Even nearly 20 years ago shimano had 7 speed cassette offerings up to the HG90 (Deore XT) level which had a 5T jump. The 13-34 cassette went 13-15-18-21-25-29-34. So a 2T jump, then two 3Ts, two 4Ts, and a 5T.


There's something wrong with this post. Something's missing. I'm not quite sure what it is :arf: .


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## Soya (Jun 22, 2007)

What, discrediting someone?


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## DIEDERICHO (Apr 15, 2006)

Slobberdoggy said:


> Nino, the anodized gold spacer go on first then the thinner silver spacer correct?
> 
> .


Hi, you did not get an answer to your question, where does the thin silver spacer goes??


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## satanas (Feb 12, 2005)

Actually, the 13-34 7 speed XT cassette is 13-15-17-20-24-29-34; I have a new one in a box in the garage. The Megarange (cheap) cassettes have bigger gaps still, with 24-34 at the bottom end.


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