# Bikepacking hammocks



## Ocho (Dec 1, 2009)

I've noticed that hammocks are very popular with those that like to bikepack and those that like to stealth camp as part of their tours. Hopefully this part of the forum is a good place to ask my question.

I notice that only the Hennessy models are reviewed, used or talked about. I'm just curious in wondering if anyone has used or uses a Clark Jungle hammock instead? 
http://www.junglehammock.com/models/northamerican/index.php

Weights are similar, size, etc. One is more tent like in entrance. I'm going to be purchasing a hammock and would appreciate any input. Thanks.


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## jruddusmc (Aug 15, 2008)

You might google ENO hammocks as well (Eagle Nest Outfitters) never used mine bike packing but did sleep on it all over Iraq. Its modular in design, a three part system; hammock, bug net, rain fly, so you can just bring what you need for your given conditions.


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## x-ker (Jul 12, 2006)

I use a Hennessy and enjoy it, although I didn't have any exposure to other hammock types and bought what I could find at the time.

There's quite a few reviews and discussions about the various hammock types over at hammockforums.net, although it is very hard to find any information relative to bikepacking there (most of the peeps are backpackers, although they do have very similar concerns).

Also, check out bikepacking.net to see what other bikepackers are using to sleep, although it is again a bit difficult because not many are on hammocks over there.

Hope this helps.


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## Ocho (Dec 1, 2009)

Thanks to you all for responding. I neglected to mention that I have researched bikepacking.net already and am active there. I have now checked out hammockforums.net and there is a decent amount of info but not all of it works for bicycling. Crazyguyonabike also has some info. 
I keep hearing about the weight and cost of the Hennessy being primary factors but the Clark is just as light (some models lighter) and cost is pretty much a wash. Both the Hennessy and the Clark have some nice attributes. Warbonnet, Speer and others seem less developed to me and what I'm reading or maybe they are just no frills, get the job done simplified. Its all good though. All your help has opened up some nice new reading for a cold day and helped broaden my options. 
In the end I might just go with a Tarptent, or maybe both. I've already got a nice light BA tent though and for some uses the hammock seems perfect. I've got time to figure it out.


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## trail_junkie (Jul 12, 2007)

I'll never spend another night on the ground if I can help it. Takes some getting use to, but once you get it right it's worth it.

The Warbonnet is a great hammock, don't write it off too quick. I love mine, and couldn't imagine calling it a "no frills" hammock. The foot box and shelf are pretty nice features and the fact it can be set up easily doesn't hurt either.


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## MudInMyEars (Apr 4, 2005)

I have both a Blackbird Warbonnet hammock and a Henry Shires Tarptent. I prefer the comfort of the Warbonnet, but if I am in a desert situation or where suitable trees are not available, I will take the HS tent. Total weight is slightly less with the hammock, but they are close enough.

-mud


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Ocho said:


> Thanks to you all for responding. I neglected to mention that I have researched bikepacking.net already and am active there. I have now checked out hammockforums.net and there is a decent amount of info but not all of it works for bicycling. Crazyguyonabike also has some info.
> I keep hearing about the weight and cost of the Hennessy being primary factors but the Clark is just as light (some models lighter) and cost is pretty much a wash. Both the Hennessy and the Clark have some nice attributes. Warbonnet, Speer and others seem less developed to me and what I'm reading or maybe they are just no frills, get the job done simplified. Its all good though. All your help has opened up some nice new reading for a cold day and helped broaden my options.
> In the end I might just go with a Tarptent, or maybe both. I've already got a nice light BA tent though and for some uses the hammock seems perfect. I've got time to figure it out.


What makes you think other models are no-frills?

I have hung with folks at hammockforums.net and have seen Hennesseys, Clarks, Speers, Warbonnets, Grand Trunks, home-sewn, and I hang in an ENO. None of them are "no frills" to be completely honest with you. "no frills" is sleeping in the dirt with a wool blanket a-la 1850.

the great thing about hammocks is the ease of customization. You can change the entire suspension setup simple. I hang my ENO Doublenest on whoopie slings made from 7/64" Amsteel blue and tree straps. I also have an Amsteel structural ridgeline to ensure a perfect hang every time. I use a Warbonnet Traveler bug net when I need bug protection (the ENO bug net sucks), and I can sleep under any tarp I choose.

Hennessey, Warbonnet, and others have integrated hammock-bugnet systems that reduce the amount of material. They're slick.

There are gathered-end hammocks and bridge hammocks that offer a different style of lay. The only difference is personal preference.

You only notice Hennesseys more because they're popular. If you spent more than an hour at hammockforums, you'd realize that your assessment of hammocks is incomplete.


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## Toff (Sep 11, 2004)

My experience may be an anomaly but my ENO only lasted maybe 6 months until it ripped one day when I got in it and got dumped on the ground. Luckily just soft grass.

I still need to get another hammock as I loved it.


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## moofish (May 3, 2011)

I have found Tenth Wonder hammocks on ebay the look very well designed and I am thinking of getting one. The Hornet model Im looking at have 3 layers and have a bug net that is lifted up by poles. Has any one heard of them or used them.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

I've got a Hennessy hammock. It's useful for certain situations where trees are plentiful and you don't want to sleep on the ground, but they aren't particularly light or compact and given the need for insulation under the hammock in cool climates I think a light 1 man tent is going to give it a run for it's money in space/weight. If you can split a 2 man tent with a friend you'll definitely be ahead in those areas compared to 2 Hennessy hammocks.

Ultralite Backpacker Asym Classic: Product Specs -- Hennessy Hammock

I haven't tried any other brands of hammock.

The Lazy Randonneur: Search results for hennessy

For shelters I have a bivy sack, hammock and 2 pers ultralight tent. I grab whichever makes the most sense for as given trip. My last bikepacking trip I used the bivy.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

I have a speer type hammock that I made myself, and I string a tarp over it. Works great. Much more comfortable than sleeping on the ground. Easy to set up if I just want to catch a nap in the hot part of the afternoon.


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## ImaFred (May 16, 2009)

love my ENO double....
carry the tarp and bugnet only if needed...
hammockforums.net is a great site for info


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

vikb said:


> I've got a Hennessy hammock. It's useful for certain situations where trees are plentiful and you don't want to sleep on the ground, but they aren't particularly light or compact and given the need for insulation under the hammock in cool climates I think a light 1 man tent is going to give it a run for it's money in space/weight. If you can split a 2 man tent with a friend you'll definitely be ahead in those areas compared to 2 Hennessy hammocks.
> 
> Ultralite Backpacker Asym Classic: Product Specs -- Hennessy Hammock
> 
> ...


I will take a small increase in overall weight to have a more comfortable night's sleep anytime. Hammocks for me are not about shedding weight. They are about getting quality sleep.

A more efficient way to handle 2 hammocks would be to sleep under one tarp. i've seen several ways to do this, but the easiest would be to string up the hammocks side-by-side. I have seen them stacked before, also.


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## Funrover (Oct 4, 2006)

I hav an ENO double, it's held up geat so far. Bike have not bikepacked with it yet. This summer I hope!


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

NateHawk said:


> I will take a small increase in overall weight to have a more comfortable night's sleep anytime. Hammocks for me are not about shedding weight. They are about getting quality sleep.


I haven't found a night in my Hennessy hammock to be any better than a night in a tent. I sleep fine in either one.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

If you can sleep decently on the ground, especially without a pad, then you can come up with a tent/tarp system that is lighter than a hammock. I doubt anyone is in the mood to argue that. For me, I just sleep a lot better in the hammock, and maybe the whole homemade hammock setup weighs 1 lb more than a really expensive tent/dirtsleeping setup.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

vikb said:


> I haven't found a night in my Hennessy hammock to be any better than a night in a tent. I sleep fine in either one.


then consider yourself lucky


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## ridemtn (Aug 25, 2009)

NateHawk said:


> then consider yourself lucky


Indeed, I've met people like that, but it is definitely the exception. I've heard regularly practicing yoga really helps one to sleep anywhere on anything quite comfortably. I just haven't gotten around to testing that yet.

I guess hammocking in warm weather you don't have to deal with a pad either.

I have a Nemo backpacking 2man tent as well for when a hammock isn't practical.

Posted w/ Tapatalk via Android


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## Jason5906 (Feb 26, 2012)

hammock ftw


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## Anonymous (Mar 3, 2005)

I have a Hennessy Asym and love it. I have a tendency to sleep on my side and it's a heck of a lot more comfortable than any cot, or pad. 3 minutes to set up and take down. Best piece of camping gear I've bought in 10 years.


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## willapajames (Dec 18, 2005)

Make sure you can sleep well in a hammock before spending a bunch of money on a fancy one. I have an ENO double I've tried to camp with on numerous occasions and for me, it's less comfortable than sleeping on bare ground. I've had my ENO for 5 years now and it's held up to my big frame (6'5", 250+). I use it almost daily in the summer on my porch.
Just saying, hammocks seem like a great idea, but they're not for everyone...


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## Ironchefjon (Mar 23, 2007)

I just use a cheap fold-away nylon hammock I bought at wal-mart. Works like a charm. I can sleep all day in it.


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## ridemtn (Aug 25, 2009)

Ironchefjon said:


> I just use a cheap fold-away nylon hammock I bought at wal-mart. Works like a charm. I can sleep all day in it.


We have way too many biting, flying things here to get away without netting. 

Posted w/ Tapatalk via Android


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

A mosquito bar (net) is inexpensive, and you can spray the body of the hammock with a permethrin solution. I forget the commercial brand name of that stuff right now. But, yeah, bugs are a hassle, and prolly moreso with a hammock.


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## Ironchefjon (Mar 23, 2007)

ridemtn said:


> We have way too many biting, flying things here to get away without netting.
> 
> Posted w/ Tapatalk via Android


Oh, believe me, we have enough skeeters, black flies and horse flies to go around here in Maine. I usually I put on a healthy coating of bug spray and wrap the hammock around me. Buying a mosquito net never crossed my mind, but that's a good idea. I usually always keep a rip-roaring fire going as well, and that seems to help with the bugs.


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## Mike Brown (Mar 12, 2004)

mosquitohammock.com

Best non-biking kit I own. On the CT, it was completely covered with hundreds of mosquitos trying to get me and none did. I was happy and comfortable.


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## Toff (Sep 11, 2004)

Toff said:


> My experience may be an anomaly but my ENO only lasted maybe 6 months until it ripped one day when I got in it and got dumped on the ground. Luckily just soft grass.
> 
> I still need to get another hammock as I loved it.


Finally got around to sending my ENO in and they warrantied it. I got a new one coming in!


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Toff said:


> Finally got around to sending my ENO in and they warrantied it. I got a new one coming in!


good to hear. I haven't had any trouble with mine. I HAVE had tree straps pull apart in the past and send me to the ground, but never with the hammock.

and I dearly love my Amsteel whoopie slings


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## sherpaxc (Aug 12, 2005)

I switch between a hammock/underquilt/tarp set up and just a bivy/tarp set up. Just depends on the mood I guess...









or










That was a crazy windy night.


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## RiderInTraining (Apr 25, 2005)

trail_junkie said:


> I'll never spend another night on the ground if I can help it. Takes some getting use to, but once you get it right it's worth it.
> 
> The Warbonnet is a great hammock, don't write it off too quick. I love mine, and couldn't imagine calling it a "no frills" hammock. The foot box and shelf are pretty nice features and the fact it can be set up easily doesn't hurt either.


+1 for the Warbonnet


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

I have the Warbonnet Blackbird DL 1.1, and just got a new Dangerbird from Randy at DreamHammock.com. Both are awesome hammocks, and nice and light. I have an ENO doublenest that I take sometimes to lounge in on day rides, or one of the many hammocks I have made myself.


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## alpka (Aug 20, 2007)

Anyone tried a Byer? I ran into this one at REI the other day. I was about to pop for a hennessy exped asym zip but saw that this is much cheaper and decided to hold off...
Anyone?
Byer Moskito Traveller Hammock at REI.com


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

have not used the byer, but it looks promising, and the price is right.


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

Not a fan of the Byer myself. I have tried every company, and owned 90% of them. IMO, there is no better hammock than the Waronnet Blackbird right now. Brandon (Warbonnet owner) is a real cool guy too...


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## kent-the-hammer (Dec 9, 2011)

I like the byer mosquito hammock. I've had it for about 4 years now, and never had a problem with it. I'm a big guy at 6'2" @ 210 lbs and i've been very comfortable. However, I do own an eno doublenest deluxe and its way more comfortable, but doesn't have a bug net.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

alpka said:


> Anyone tried a Byer? I ran into this one at REI the other day. I was about to pop for a hennessy exped asym zip but saw that this is much cheaper and decided to hold off...
> Anyone?
> Byer Moskito Traveller Hammock at REI.com


I have one. It's okay. Because it's so light, it's not the most durable option out there.

Also, the netting only covers the top. Your underside is unprotected. Expect many bugbites on your backside in the morning.

The ENO is SUPPOSED to not have a bug net, so you can use a separate one when you want one. I use a Warbonnet Traveler bug net, as I mentioned before. I like this system since the bug net protects my underside, also.

I love my cotton Byer Amazonas for the yard, though.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

NateHawk said:


> Also, the netting only covers the top. Your underside is unprotected. Expect many bugbites on your backside in the morning.


little bit of this ought to do the trick, if you are okay with chemicals.
Sawyer Permethrin Pump Spray - 24 oz. at REI.com


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Bill in Houston said:


> little bit of this ought to do the trick, if you are okay with chemicals.
> Sawyer Permethrin Pump Spray - 24 oz. at REI.com


I dunno what planet you come from but IME permethrin is only any good for ticks. Useless for flying insects because it is a contact insecticide, not a repellent. Not enough contact time for skeeters


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## SDKmann (Apr 23, 2012)

As mentioned previously the ENO hammocks are fantastic. I have ENO's double which is very comfortable for one person. I don't have any of the ENO accessories like the rain tarp or bug net, I sourced those separately to save money. The quality of the hammock is really great, I don't know how others in the industry could surpass the quality, it seems like they have reached the pinnacle of what a hammock can be.


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## Rabies010 (Jan 20, 2011)

I am completely new to hammocks and think i want to give it a try.
Has anybody got any experiences with these : DD Hammocks - Camping & Travel Hammocks & tarps, Jungle Hammocks ?
They have a bugnet and are nicely priced and since i will be using it maybe 3 times a year i thought these could be interesting.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

NateHawk said:


> I dunno what planet you come from but IME permethrin is only any good for ticks. Useless for flying insects because it is a contact insecticide, not a repellent. Not enough contact time for skeeters


Same planet, I think.
"This insect-killing repellent for your clothing is effective against ticks, chiggers, mites and mosquitoes for up to six weeks."
Word on the streets is that they land on it and take off again right away, rather than sticking around and biting. But it sounds like your experience is otherwise.
Mosquito Net Permethrin (Camping & Outdoor Equipment / Mosquito nets, netting and repellents / Insect Netting BedNets)


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

Don't bother with the chemicals, all you need is a double layer hammock...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Rabies010 (Jan 20, 2011)

Bill in Houston said:


> Mosquito Net Permethrin (Camping & Outdoor Equipment / Mosquito nets, netting and repellents / Insect Netting BedNets)


Thank's for the link.
I think i am going to try one of these in the near future : Proforce Jungle Hammock -- Barre Army/Navy Store Online Store
It's big (i'm 6'5) and can hold 400pounds (i'm260)
And the price is right as well.
Since it will be my first go at this, i don't want to spend to much.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

For any netting-equipped hammock, the bug netting will cut down on air circulation a lot more than you might expect. Any time there are not bugs, you can flip the hammock over to allow more airflow. This may require modifying the netting support lines so that you can detach and reattach them.


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## Rabies010 (Jan 20, 2011)

How much restriction is there compared to a small 1 person tent ?


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

Rabies010 said:


> How much restriction is there compared to a small 1 person tent ?


Depends on what you mean by restriction. When it comes to finding places to camp, there is MUCH less restriction. You will find so many places that you could never put a tent, and you will get a better nights rest. As far as space, well, you are enclosed in a hammock. You can move around and all that, but it will be different than sitting on the ground. This is where your tarp will come into play. If you use a tarp with built in "doors" on the end, like a Warbonnet Superfly or a HammockGear Cuben four season, you have plenty of room to move around underneath with complete privacy. One thing you will love is waking up in the morning and being able to just swing your legs out and automatically be sitting in a chair. Cook your breakfast and get ready for the day! Hammock camping is the best 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Rabies010 (Jan 20, 2011)

Thank's for the answer, but i was actually refering to the previous post on air circulation.

Your info is apreciated, but i already knew most of it though.


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

Rabies010 said:


> Thank's for the answer, but i was actually refering to the previous post on air circulation.
> 
> Your info is apreciated, but i already knew most of it though.


Ah well in that case, there would be different variables involved, same with a tent. How close you have your tarp set to the ground, whether you set the tarp up in "porch mode", whether you even bother to use the tarp...etc etc. you have a lot more options with tarp set up than with a fixed rain fly of a tent. Some tents have vents on the ends to help with airflow, some don't.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

Air circulation in a hammock with a bug net would be better than in a one-man tent. Plus, in warm weather, you would sleep without a pad and would have air underneath you cooling you off. It makes a big difference down here when you are trying to sleep with an overnight low around 80 degrees.


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## alpka (Aug 20, 2007)

Is there anyway to sit in a Hennessy Expid Asym classic as a normal hammock?


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## alpka (Aug 20, 2007)

Nevermind, I just found a vid of Tom hennessy himself demonstrating the Hennessy "kitchen"


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## YukonLT (Apr 12, 2012)

I'm building a custom ultralight hammock right now for a guy that's doing the AT in 2013, looking really good. Based on the Warbonnet design but lightening it up for him in certain areas. Should be really sweet...


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Bill in Houston said:


> Same planet, I think.
> "This insect-killing repellent for your clothing is effective against ticks, chiggers, mites and mosquitoes for up to six weeks."
> Word on the streets is that they land on it and take off again right away, rather than sticking around and biting. But it sounds like your experience is otherwise.
> Mosquito Net Permethrin (Camping & Outdoor Equipment / Mosquito nets, netting and repellents / Insect Netting BedNets)


Yes, my experience is different. I use permethrin extensively on my clothing for ticks. It can be worthwhile to coat some gear with it to eliminate the hitchhikers that wind up biting you in the car when you're driving home (been there, done that).

But not once has Permethrin alone been of any use at all to me for mosquitoes. Some of them might get up and fly away, but it's not enough of a deterrent for quite a few of them, and you will still be bitten. It MIGHT kill most of the ones that land on you, but not until after you've been bitten.

I have had better luck with a number of other repellents for mosquitoes, but using them on gear has been met with mixed results. I haven't encountered too many repellent sprays that are worth anything for more than a couple hours. That won't get you a whole night's undisturbed rest without bites.

A physical barrier is really the only way to go. A double layer hammock with an integrated bug net will do the job. So will a hammock with a separate bug net that encompasses the whole hammock (like the ENO bugnet (even though it's heavy) and the Warbonnet Traveler bugnet - it's relatively easy to make one of these for yourself, too).

The Byer moskito hammock won't be enough to stop bites through the bottom. if you use one, you'll have to have something underneath you like a sleeping pad even when it's hot to stave off the bites.

As for circulation, it's an interesting thing. I used my hammock in Costa Rica in March and I had a nice hanging spot on a hill overlooking the Pacific in the distance. It got pretty durned windy at times. The bugnet blocked an awful lot of the heavy wind. But even with a light breeze, I could feel air circulation around me. The conductive heat loss through the bottom of the hammock is a huge advantage on hot nights, but it requires special attention with an underquilt or pad when it's cool. There are folks who hammock even in the dead of winter, and a huge tarp can really help with that. You can pitch the tarp like an a-frame tent with the edges on the ground, and with the right tarp cut, you can even close off the open ends to block even the light breezes.


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## rb_daniel (Aug 25, 2005)

I made my own for half the price. Got a lot of info from hammockforums. The bug net zips almost completely off and goes in a stuff sack at the foot when not needed.


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## GrumpyOne (Jan 7, 2004)

YukonLT said:


> You will find so many places that you could never put a tent, and you will get a better nights rest.


I had never thought about the flexibility of where you can put a hammock until I started looking at photos at hammockforums.net of people hanging over water, rocks, etc. 
In the photo below, there were 30+ Boy Scouts in a field 50ft behind me when I took the photo. There would have been no way for them to tent in the woods due to the lack of clear flat ground. And they roasted all night while I was comfy and cool with just a slight breeze.



RiderInTraining said:


> +1 for the Warbonnet


+2 - I'm digging my Warbonnet Blackbird setup. I started down the hammock road due to a backpacking trip. But around here and for me, I can't think of a better setup for bikepacking.

jw


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## petey15 (Sep 1, 2006)

Great thread! I hope to start getting into bikepacking in the next year or so (I've been drooling over the Salsa Mukluk and like the idea of using it for this purpose and winter riding). I've been particularly interested in hammocks, but wasn't sure how their banana shape would agree with my back. I saw a great video review of this on Backpacker.com. Has anyone else had any experience with this product?
Bear Mountain Bridge Hammock - Deluxe | Jacksrbetter


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

will it actually lay flat with a person in it? interesting design. i don't trust it. 

my back feels better after a night in a hammock than after a night on the ground. do you live around here? i'll let you borrow one.


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## Mojoe (Jan 29, 2004)

Love my Blackbird Warbonnet and Grand Trunk Ultrlight!!!!


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## DavyRay (Apr 13, 2012)

petey15 said:


> Great thread! I hope to start getting into bikepacking in the next year or so (I've been drooling over the Salsa Mukluk and like the idea of using it for this purpose and winter riding). I've been particularly interested in hammocks, but wasn't sure how their banana shape would agree with my back. I saw a great video review of this on Backpacker.com. Has anyone else had any experience with this product?
> Bear Mountain Bridge Hammock - Deluxe | Jacksrbetter


I have not tried the bear mountain bridge. I do have a homemade bridge hammock, which works well. All I can tell you is that the jacksrbetter guys are quite serious, do good design, and make good products.


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Seems like every additional year I spend on this dirt ball, someone else I know succumbs to back injury. It was my turn in 2005 when my daughter was (reluctantly) born. I've now got some SI disk and nerve damage that causes sciatia that comes and goes. I used to be able to sleep anywhere on minimal padding, but these days even a BA air pad on the ground can result in very little (if any) sleep and severe pain the next morning.

Experiments so far indicate my back is waaay better after a night in the hammock than in my own bed. This is a HUGE breakthrough, as I'd thought that my days of camping might be terminated. I have a Grand Trunk for experiments, on the back porch, etc but a few weeks ago got a Blackbird.

I'm all for simple and light, but biking hard + getting no sleep + tying to get screaming body parts to function before I've even had coffee is a fekking torture. Since my PTO is measured down to 2 decimal points I'm not gonna waste it on that action. I'll gratefully carry the hammock and all its bits.


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## RiderInTraining (Apr 25, 2005)

petey15 said:


> ... I've been particularly interested in hammocks, but wasn't sure how their banana shape would agree with my back. I saw a great video review of this on Backpacker.com. Has anyone else had any experience with this product?
> Bear Mountain Bridge Hammock - Deluxe | Jacksrbetter


I can't comment on the Bear Mountain Bridge really, but it seems overkill. I use the Blackbird Warbonnet for years and even though you're not laying completely level, I sleep better in it then anywhere else. That includes my own bed as well. If I sleep to long in my bed my lower back hurts in the morning, not so in my hammock. I would actually hang one in my bed room if it wasn't for my wife.


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## petey15 (Sep 1, 2006)

Wow - lots of great information - thanks! Here in the east, our abundance of trees shouldn't make a place to hang one a problem. Does anyone have experience with hammocks in very windy conditions? Has anyone ever staked them to the ground to help stabilize them? It seems that most prefer the more traditionally shaped hammocks to those like the Lawson that have more flat bottoms (though they do seem very tippy).


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

The Blackbird has stake-outs to keep it from swinging around if you choose to deploy them. Having a little bit of swing is oddly mesmerizing though.

I suspect the shape of the bottom is more dependent on how you've rigged it up and how diagonally you're lying.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

I love combining two hobbies like hammock camping and bikepacking.

Lunchtime bikeride, lunch, and nap.










Overnite


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

petey15 said:


> Wow - lots of great information - thanks! Here in the east, our abundance of trees shouldn't make a place to hang one a problem. It seems that most prefer the more traditionally shaped hammocks to those like the Lawson that have more flat bottoms (though they do seem very tippy).


If you look at SingleTrackLovr's "overnight" photo, you can see that the sides are pretty high. Mine has a similar shape. Rolling out of mine would require a serious effort, and isn't a problem when you move around at night or when you get in or out. Would you agree, STL? I have had all kind of kids and uncoordinated grownups in and out of mine, and have never had someone get dumped on the ground.

I have never known anyone who had one of those suspension bridge hammocks.

And you are right about it being easy to find a spot to hang. You can hang on all kinds of sideslopes and rocky places where a tent would be miserable. Plus, you don't squish all the vegetation, so if you like the LNT stuff, hammocks are good at that.


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

FWIW the GT Ultralight is really narrow, and the one time I slept overnight in it I just threw in the BA square pad + Marmot Helium sleeping bag. My back loved it but the whole ginormous pile of bag & pad threatened to ooze out over the side/end, lol. I probably could have mitigated this effect somewhat by raising the foot end more, but realistically a kit that bulky probably needs more than 54" wide. 

I threw the exact same lashup into a borrowed ENO doublenest and had leftover fabric floating around at 74" wide. No escape issues however.

The Blackbird is 65" wide and from what I've seen and heard it should be a happy medium. A bug net is mandatory for most of our mountain travels anyway.


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## petey15 (Sep 1, 2006)

This is so cool! I hadn't heard of camping hammocks before checking out this forum. They seem to have so many more benefits to regular tent camping. Not that I have to worry about this much in the NE, but what about when camping in bear or mountain lion territory? Does anyone feel more secure in their hammock? Obviously you undergo the same precautions you would whenever you camp. I think I read somewhere about it being the perfect "bear toy", LOL, something to bat at between the trees...


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

people have suggested that a hammock looks like a giant burrito to a bear. 

i expect that a tent might be microscopically safer than a hammock in bear country.


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## petey15 (Sep 1, 2006)

Bill in Houston said:


> people have suggested that a hammock looks like a giant burrito to a bear.
> 
> i expect that a tent might be microscopically safer than a hammock in bear country.


I had a friend suggest to me today that a hammock is a lot more ergonomically correct for the animals that wish to dine by putting you at mouth level


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

petey15 said:


> I had a friend suggest to me today that a hammock is a lot more ergonomically correct for the animals that wish to dine by putting you at mouth level


Have you pointed out to him that carnivores typically eat their meal off the ground?!?

Here in central Wa we have a LOT of cats and they tend to be fairly densely populated due to the sheer quantity of game they have available, and I usually run across cat tracks on my lunch hour rides a few times a year on the ridge behind town. A few years ago I tangled up with a cougar while running my dog team at night, which got a little 'invigorating' but was resolved with a lot of cussing and rock-chucking. Washington state allows cougar hunting and biologists in the region have used hounds to tree quite a few for studies (tree-tanq-drop-record-collar). IMO this probably mitigates human/cat conflicts to at least some degree and allows the overall population to thrive, but that's another topic....

Our prolific black bears take town-trolling a step further and dine on apples, prunes, pears, etc. right from people's yards, usually at night. If you see one in daylight it's always just a very large hairy butt running away. They get hunted as well and tend to stay out of trouble on their own.

I am *NOT* worried about these critters. It's people that concerns me, hence my drive to get the heck away from them.

And to answer the eternal question... yes, the pope is catholic.


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## thesergeant (Jun 1, 2006)

I love hammock camping but the dirty little secret that hammockers won't tell you about from the outset is bottom insulation. Sure, you technically "can" use an pad and many have, with varying degrees of sucess, but the reality is at somepoint you're going too realize you need/want an underquilt. Here's the bummer, they start at around $175 for a good down model. Keep that in mind before you jump into it. Also, when you get down to it, they're heavier than their ground dwelling counterparts. So I suggest that you try and sleep a few nights in a cheap, single layer hammock before you jump all the way into it.

That being said, here's my DIY hammock setup. I had a Hennessy Hammock but didn't like it. My recommendation would be a Warbonnet Blackbird or a Switchback.


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## DavyRay (Apr 13, 2012)

I have to agree with most of what thesargent says.

My Warbonnet Yeti underquilt is my good buddy in any temperature below 60 degrees F. You can use a sleeping bag as a top quilt, but the under-quilt is not very negotiable if you are going to be comfortable.

I disagree slightly about weight. With lightweight suspension and down gear, a complete cold-weather hammock rig is about the same as an ultralight ground-dwelling tarptent.

Oh, and make sure you add the high-power flashlight to the cost. The astute hammock camper always surveys the upper canopy to check for dead limbs.


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## hunter006 (Jan 20, 2012)

These are both more generic hammock questions, but there's a distinct lack of in-store places selling hammocks so I haven't had a chance to find out for myself.

I find that my feet get very, very cold if I have them too elevated above my heart. I'm 5'11.5" tall but 210 lbs; given the sag factor of hammocks I am a little cautious on looking in to hammocks lest I end up with a comfortable sleep but frozen feet. Thoughts/comments/anyone else have this issue?

Second question related to this is regarding what DavyRay and thesergeant say, the underquilt is there to provide under-body thermal insulation. Most emergency blankets (the reflective kind) pack down really light and small, but reflect body heat back. Could something like the heavy duty Sol Emergency blanket be a suitable alternative?


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

hunter006 said:


> ...Second question related to this is regarding what DavyRay and thesergeant say, the underquilt is there to provide under-body thermal insulation. Most emergency blankets (the reflective kind) pack down really light and small, but reflect body heat back. Could something like the heavy duty Sol Emergency blanket be a suitable alternative?


It can be part of a solution, but isn't nearly enough insulation by itself.

I've been trading ideas on line with a local backpacker who like me discovered his back preferred the hammock so much that he started with some experiments to get it to work. It's a handy relationship since he's got more money for gear and time to fiddle with it, I just take what he's learned and go from there, lol. Anyway, he has a downmat 7 and added an underquilt this summer, and unlike a lot of other folks he went back to the downmat- less fiddle, less bulk, and can throw it on the ground if he has to. BUT, he modded his Blackbird with a pocket in the footbox to shove the mat into so it stays in place.

This fall I tore apart a SOL thermal bivy, turned one side upside down so the tapered foot is next to a head end, and duct taped it together to make a big rectangle blanket. I also used fabric repair tape to make some loops on the edge of my BA pad. Next spring I'll be doing some experiments with this lashup in multiple configurations, the idea being that the thermal bivy blanket + maybe some extra clothing that's always along can provide some shoulder insulation/windblock if needed. And if I get caught out in our vast sagebrush 'desert' without suitable trees, I can throw the blanket down under the pad as a ground sheet.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

I've used a hammock with a closed cell pad as my bottom insulation down to about 30 degrees without taking any heroic measures, and I'm not some kind of cold weather tough guiy, either.



hunter006 said:


> I find that my feet get very, very cold if I have them too elevated above my heart. I'm 5'11.5" tall but 210 lbs; given the sag factor of hammocks I am a little cautious on looking in to hammocks lest I end up with a comfortable sleep but frozen feet. Thoughts/comments/anyone else have this issue?


You will probably want some booties or loose very fluffy socks of some kind. A guy I know who has poor circulation admits that booties are a must for him.

And, yeah, in a race to super-ultralight, hammocks probably lose. I have seen pics of an ultralight rig that was a silnylon poncho rigged to enclose 3 sides of a tyvek groundcloth, using a narrow quilt as cover, and no pad to sleep on. So, yeah, if you can sleep like that, then, yeah, you will beat a hammock. OTOH, if you are looking for a little more comfort and can afford a underquilt and bag, you'll be competitive with lightweight groundsleepers pretty quickly.


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## Syb (Oct 23, 2012)

thesergeant said:


> I love hammock camping but the dirty little secret that hammockers won't tell you about from the outset is bottom insulation. Sure, you technically "can" use an pad and many have, with varying degrees of sucess, but the reality is at somepoint you're going too realize you need/want an underquilt. Here's the bummer, they start at around $175 for a good down model. Keep that in mind before you jump into it.


Our secret is out and yes, most of the population requires some sort of under insulation. My first underquilt was $100 and I combined that with my already-purchased sleeping bag and that got me down to 30 degrees. Full-length underquilts will cost you more money but just like our bikes, it's all personal preference. All this said, thesergeant brings up great points to keep in mind when/if you jump in to a hammock. And thesergeant, I really like that DIY Hennessy you made. I'm jealous of those thread-injecting skills.

Me personally? **I pee on the ground, I don't sleep on it 



thesergeant said:


> Also, when you get down to it, they're heavier than their ground dwelling counterparts. So I suggest that you try and sleep a few nights in a cheap, single layer hammock before you jump all the way into it.


Hammock rigs can be lighter than a comparable tent in my experience but where I find you really save is the bulk. My hammock is 9 ounces, tarp is 13, underquilt is 24 ounces and top quilt 22. 4.25 pounds. This all fits nicely in my 2300 TNF bag with room to spare as the down compresses at the bottom of my pack and I throw heavier things on top. My tent is _just_ under that weight but I'm still sleeping on the ground and need to find a way to fit it all in my pack. Yes, there are lighter/different tent setups out there but this is what I happen to have. See ** above.



Bill in Houston said:


> I've used a hammock with a closed cell pad as my bottom insulation down to about 30 degrees without taking any heroic measures, and I'm not some kind of cold weather tough guiy, either.
> 
> You will probably want some booties or loose very fluffy socks of some kind. A guy I know who has poor circulation admits that booties are a must for him.
> 
> And, yeah, in a race to super-ultralight, hammocks probably lose. I have seen pics of an ultralight rig that was a silnylon poncho rigged to enclose 3 sides of a tyvek groundcloth, using a narrow quilt as cover, and no pad to sleep on. So, yeah, if you can sleep like that, then, yeah, you will beat a hammock. OTOH, if you are looking for a little more comfort and can afford a underquilt and bag, you'll be competitive with lightweight groundsleepers pretty quickly.


Very well said. I once saw a guy who carried two 6" X 6" pads, 1 for his shoulder and one for his hip. That, combined with his ground cloth and a sleeping bag and very small bivy was his sleeping/shelter rig. Was it light? Absolutely. Was it comfortable? Prolly not.

Check out hammockforums.net and you'll get more information than you can imagine about all things hammock.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

I just added a 3rd hammock to my camping kit. 
This one is for winter and has a breathable top cover to block wind. 
Tarp and quilts are still required to stay dry and warm.

It was custom built to my spec's. Made in the USA from here:
Dream Hammock


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> I just added a 3rd hammock to my camping kit.
> This one is for winter and has a breathable top cover to block wind.
> Tarp and quilts are still required to stay dry and warm.
> 
> ...


One of Randy's Dangerbirds! I ordered tree straps, whoopies, and adjustable ridgeline from him. REALLY nice guy doing some very interesting things. His hammock sock is intriguing since we deal with a lot of wind.

The zip-on Dangerbird cover is really clever. What did you have customized?


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## Syb (Oct 23, 2012)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> I just added a 3rd hammock to my camping kit.
> This one is for winter and has a breathable top cover to block wind.
> Tarp and quilts are still required to stay dry and warm.
> 
> ...


Schweet!


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

verslowrdr said:


> One of Randy's Dangerbirds! I ordered tree straps, whoopies, and adjustable ridgeline from him. REALLY nice guy doing some very interesting things. His hammock sock is intriguing since we deal with a lot of wind.
> 
> The zip-on Dangerbird cover is really clever.* What did you have customized?*


I started with his netted RomingGnome 11'x60" (1.8 tafata) and had him put a 1.0 ripstop cover vs netting on it. So no net this is a winter hammock.
I had a second zipper pull added to one side so I could set a condensation vent at the top and be able to enter/exit on seperate zipper pulls. 
Randy names it The WinterGnome


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## TriAdX (Dec 12, 2012)

These are pretty cool. I might have to try and look into getting one. About how much?


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

$20 tops if you make your own.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Bill in Houston said:


> $20 tops if you make your own.


2X 
If you're a DIY guys making your hammock camping kit can be a blast and for little money.

Check out this post for a great DIY gathered end hammock.

Instruction: Gathered End Hammock - Hammock Forums - Elevate Your Perspective

The hammock pictures I posted above with the cover is a gathered end.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

deteted dup post sorry site is acting weird
I keep getting 501 gateway time outs but then I see the post went thru.

Bill from Houston I sent you a PM but got the same 501 error. Afraid to send it again 
don't want to spam your inbox.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

i got it, thank you. 

need to watch that video on how to make the hammock later. i use a design with no sewing at all and want to see how similar the geometry is.


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## ltyoungster (Dec 18, 2012)

I use the ENO DoubleNest System. It does great for bikepacking, car camping and just general laziness around the house. I usually keep the hammock in the car and have used it at a friends house when he ran out of couch space. I know everybody loves to save a few ounces on an exetended tour, but I always prefer gear that fits into the rest of my life also.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> 2X
> If you're a DIY guys making your hammock camping kit can be a blast and for little money.
> 
> Check out this post for a great DIY gathered end hammock.
> ...


The way I fold my hammock body material, I make the material on the sides a couple of inches shorter than the material at the centerline. For yours, do you do anything like that? Or is your material a big rectangle before you sew the sleeve in the end?


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## kaakku (Nov 14, 2010)

I'm planning to purchase DD Frontline Hammock from DDHammocks. Any thoughts on that? All I've heard have been praise. Price is decent 67 euros / 89 USD delivered to Finland. 

Next summer it's going to be some serious bikepacking-time!! I'm also planning to craft DIY framebag and seatbag for my Salsa Spearfish.

Any thoughts on DIY-tarps?? DDHammock has some, but 48 euros / 64 USD for a tarp seems quite expensive for me..


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

$64 for a lightweight tarp is CHEAP! The least expensive silnylon I've been able to find was on Campmor, and I'd want at least 10' longways.

Someone warned me about silnylon absorbing water though so I've held off on going that route. For right now I'm just trying a chunk of tyvek I bought off ebay... if I really get into this I might break down and get a cuben fiber tarp next year, but it's a hella chunk of change.


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## kaakku (Nov 14, 2010)

Well, whats lightweight for a tarp? I really have no clue.
DDHammock tarp should weight about 720 grams. Thats 3 m x 3m (9 ft x 9 ft).

It says on their website: "The fabric is PU (3,000mm) coated polyester. Seams are taped."

The DD Frontline Hammock is 820 gr + tarp 720 gr + webbing 230 gr = ~1770 grams.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Bill in Houston said:


> The way I fold my hammock body material, I make the material on the sides a couple of inches shorter than the material at the centerline. For yours, do you do anything like that? Or is your material a big rectangle before you sew the sleeve in the end?


Hi Bill, I am banded from the family thread injector after attempting to sew two tree straps and broke the machine. It cost me 125 bucks to get the machine fixed. 
So i now have to rely on the mom and pop shops around the U.S. to do my sewing.

More to your question. I believe the hammocks I have are cut to a rectangle 11'x60" and a channel is sewn in the ends for the rope (whoopie) to tree straps.

Does your cutting of the corners help with a flatter lay when lying diagonal?


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

kaakku said:


> I'm planning to purchase DD Frontline Hammock from DDHammocks. Any thoughts on that? All I've heard have been praise. Price is decent 67 euros / 89 USD delivered to Finland.
> 
> Next summer it's going to be some serious bikepacking-time!! I'm also planning to craft DIY framebag and seatbag for my Salsa Spearfish.
> 
> Any thoughts on DIY-tarps?? DDHammock has some, but 48 euros / 64 USD for a tarp seems quite expensive for me..


I've never heard of anything negative on DD hammocks. If you'd like to do a little reading on DD's give this link a look. 
Does this hammock have a bug net? Do you need one for where you ride?

DD Hammocks - Hammock Forums - Elevate Your Perspective


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> More to your question. I believe the hammocks I have are cut to a rectangle 11'x60" and a channel is sewn in the ends for the rope (whoopie) to tree straps.
> 
> Does your cutting of the corners help with a flatter lay when lying diagonal?


Hmm, okay. I have never made one without shortening the sides, so I can't really comment on the flatness question. I lie right down the middle, as far as I know. Shortening the sides might make anything else impossible.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

verslowrdr said:


> $64 for a lightweight tarp is CHEAP! The least expensive silnylon I've been able to find was on Campmor, and I'd want at least 10' longways.
> 
> Someone warned me about silnylon absorbing water though so I've held off on going that route. For right now I'm just trying a chunk of tyvek I bought off ebay... if I really get into this I might break down and get a cuben fiber tarp next year, but it's a hella chunk of change.


Tyvek sounds like a great way to go. Light weight and inexpensive. 
The only down side I could see is if it would hold up in heavy winds. 
If you selected your camp site for the best wind protection your tyvek should last for many years.

I have 4 sylnylon hammock tarps different sized depending on the time of year and a cuben. 
After owning a cuben for 2 seasons I am no longer a fan of this wonder material. 
It's negatives out weigh it light weighness (hope that's a word)

If weight is not too much of an issue the best deal I've found is a Kelty Noah's Tarp 9'x9' hung diamond shaped. This gives you 12' under the hammock.

Syl nylon tarps do adsorb a small amount of water if it's really raining. 
You get an effect called misting under it. Where hard rain hitting a soaked tarp 
causes some mist to form under the tarp. It's very minimal and has not been a issue for me and I've been in some real downpours.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

And buy your wife a machine with metal gears!!


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Bill in Houston said:


> Hmm, okay. I have never made one without shortening the sides, so I can't really comment on the flatness question. I lie right down the middle, as far as I know. Shortening the sides might make anything else impossible.


Hi Bill,
In the hammocking world that is called laying banana style. 
Next time you are in your hammock try laying feet left or right about 18"s and head about 18" opposite your feet. (feet right head left) 
You body should flatten out quite a bit and reduce the hyper extension of the knees.

In my 11' hammocks I can lay almost flat when I lay a little asym. 
This also allows me to sleep on my side as well. 
If I want to lay on my left side my feet go right of center line and head goes left.

Give it a try I'd love to hear if that works for you.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> Syl nylon tarps do adsorb a small amount of water if it's really raining.
> You get an effect called misting under it. Where hard rain hitting a soaked tarp
> causes some mist to form under the tarp. It's very minimal and has not been a issue for me and I've been in some real downpours.


Sometimes they go a little thin with the "sil" part of the silnylon. you can fix it by repainting it with a thin coat of caulk/spirits. of course that makes it weigh more...

tyvek seems risky. all those stitch holes look too much like perforations to me.


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## kaakku (Nov 14, 2010)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> I've never heard of anything negative on DD hammocks. If you'd like to do a little reading on DD's give this link a look.
> Does this hammock have a bug net? Do you need one for where you ride?
> 
> DD Hammocks - Hammock Forums - Elevate Your Perspective


Thanks for the tip. I live and ride in Finland, so I definitely need a bug net. Mosquitos here can be a real pain in the ass. Last summer was hideous.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> Hi Bill,
> In the hammocking world that is called laying banana style.
> Next time you are in your hammock try laying feet left or right about 18"s and head about 18" opposite your feet. (feet right head left)
> You body should flatten out quite a bit and reduce the hyper extension of the knees.
> ...


This isn't even possible in mine. I bend my knees and lay over to the side and it works great. I need to try a hammock like yours sometime.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Bill in Houston said:


> This isn't even possible in mine. I bend my knees and lay over to the side and it works great. I need to try a hammock like yours sometime.


If you have a 11'x60" piece of 1.5-1.9 ripstop nylon laying around you can sew one up pretty fast. My latest hammock was made from 1.8 tafata or if your ever in the Denver area and can spend a nite in the woods I'd be glad to show you around. The Colorado Trail seg 1-3 are great places to bikepack. 
I have 3 complete hammock kits with tarps and under quilts. You'd just need to bring a sleeping bag for the season.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

thanks for the offer. I'll have to find some material and try it out. although colorado does sound like a lot of fun...


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Bill in Houston said:


> thanks for the offer. I'll have to find some material and try it out. although colorado does sound like a lot of fun...


For me bike packing is best Summer to Fall in Colorado. 
It's really nice escaping the heat at 10,000 feet.

That said I hammock hang year round and have a group hang scheduled Feb 1,2,3 at Kenosha Pass if you want to play in the snow come join us.
This hike/snowshoe hang is open to all hangers with winter gear.

Planning and additional info thread;

CO > Front Range > Jan-Feb: Fourth Annual Colorado Winter Hang Planning Thread - Hammock Forums - Elevate Your Perspective

Photo's of last years Kenosha winter hang. Should have snow this year.
If there is no snow mtn biking seg 6 of the CT is very do able...

Kenosha Winter Hang 2012 - a set on Flickr


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## Central Scrutinizer (Aug 30, 2005)

SingleTrackLovr said:


> After owning a cuben for 2 seasons I am no longer a fan of this wonder material.
> It's negatives out weigh it light weighness (hope that's a word)


STL, curious what you didn't like about cuben...


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Bill in Houston said:


> ...tyvek seems risky. all those stitch holes look too much like perforations to me.


DO NOT SEW TYVEK- that's an invitation to disaster, just as you describe! Use carpet tape or tyvek tape on it. Stuff supposedly bonds w/ adhesives super well. One of my last steps in getting my kit together will be getting some tyvek tape and making loops for tying off, they're supposedly a whole lot sturdier than attempting grommets.

It's reasonably light but is hard to pack down small. But for the price.....


> ...Sometimes they go a little thin with the "sil" part of the silnylon. you can fix it by repainting it with a thin coat of caulk/spirits. of course that makes it weigh more...


Interesting.
The beef I heard w/ silnylon was that it tends to absorb water and become much larger/heavier. And packing up a large water soaked piece of fabric would seem sub-optimal.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

verslowrdr said:


> The beef I heard w/ silnylon was that it tends to absorb water and become much larger/heavier. And packing up a large water soaked piece of fabric would seem sub-optimal.


I had not ever heard that. But, it's been about 4 years since I really followed backpacking forums. If it's true, yeah, that is no bueno.


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Bill in Houston said:


> I had not ever heard that. But, it's been about 4 years since I really followed backpacking forums. If it's true, yeah, that is no bueno.


I think it's fair to point out that I'm from Washington state and you're apparently from Houston... "different horses for different courses" may apply.

Recently there was a thread on a local hiking board about using a poncho as shelter. Apparently it worked for some other folks until moving to Washington, where our infamous storms that roll in off the ocean killed that notion pretty quickly.


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

ya, i hear ya. i had the same thought on the poncho as a shelter around here. in a storm the only hope would be to roll up like a burrito and hope you don't suffocate.


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## SingleTrackLovr (Apr 25, 2007)

Central Scrutinizer said:


> STL, curious what you didn't like about cuben...


*Cuben Pros:*
1/2 the weight of sylnylon.
No stretch when wet. Retensioning during a rain storm not required.

*Cuben Cons:*
Very noisy in wind and rain. I always pack ear plugs when using my cuben.
Rain drops hitting the tarp sounds like little fire crackers.
Provides very little shade in fact it lights up when sun light hits it.
Longevity is not proven yet. I've seen one AT thru hiker report/post picts of delamination with continued use.

Note sunglasses worn under cuben...
I hope these P/Cs help you in your research into cuben YMMV of course.


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

NateHawk said:


> then consider yourself lucky


Why does VikB need to consider himself lucky?


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Dusto said:


> Why does VikB need to consider himself lucky?


Let's go back to the original statement:


vikb said:


> I haven't found a night in my Hennessy hammock to be any better than a night in a tent.* I sleep fine in either one.*


Note added bold emphasis. There are some people that DO NOT "sleep fine in either one". I have a back injury that has made laying out on the ground even on a BA insulated aircore a non-sleeping torturefest, whereas the hammock is actually better on me than my own bed.

If you can "sleep fine in either" it means you have a whole lot more options open to you. I used to be one of those folks, and now I'm not, and I never knew how lucky I was until I was introduced to a whole new world of pain.


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

Maybe VikB is just normal and you are a special needs person.


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Dusto said:


> Maybe VikB is just normal and you are a special needs person.


Well since reading comprehension doesn't seem to be your strong suit... join the special club!


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## Bill in Houston (Nov 26, 2011)

Probably he just got back from some time away. Cut him some slack until he reacclimates.


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

verslowrdr said:


> DO NOT SEW TYVEK-


Why are you yelling? You should take a time out and ride your bike.


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

verslowrdr said:


> Let's go back to the original statement:
> 
> Note added bold emphasis. There are some people that DO NOT "sleep fine in either one". I have a back injury that has made laying out on the ground even on a BA insulated aircore a non-sleeping torturefest, whereas the hammock is actually better on me than my own bed.
> 
> If you can "sleep fine in either" it means you have a whole lot more options open to you. I used to be one of those folks, and now I'm not, and I never knew how lucky I was until I was introduced to a whole new world of pain.


What a drama queen. Seriously, do you even ride your bike(s)?


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

Just kidding. You are probably really cool.


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## verslowrdr (Mar 22, 2004)

Dusto said:


> Just kidding. You are probably really cool.


I'm not very cool today, my apologies.


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## Guest (Dec 29, 2012)

I accept and am sorry if I came off funny. It was not my intention for sure. I try to be aware of the fact that my words can hurt others. I am still open to some sort of friendship. Life is too short. Plus the list of dedicated bicyclists is really short. Do you know what I mean?


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