# Coming from a ~20y old 26in Ellsworth Truth to… something light but newer?



## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Hey all

I’ve enjoyed this Ellsworth for many years of riding on local CT trails. A few years back I rebuilt it and went to 1x10. Good times. Weighs less than 28lbs. I’ve ridden friends 27.5” and other late model bikes so I do know what I’m missing. 

I am utterly clueless as to what’s out there that would be light, maneuverable and enjoyable on the kind of XC, fire-road, rutted singletrack I ride around here. No drops, no racing. I tend to ride a few miles on asphalt to and from the trailhead so I put a premium on efficiency and weight. The 2.1in tires have never let me down. I am 5’8” 130lbs.

My usual move (cars bikes everything) is to buy good stuff used then rebuild / upgrade to suit my taste if needed. That’s what I did with the Ellsworth many years back and it served me well. Not opposed to buying brand new but those prices… 

Speaking of which I’m presuming I can get around a grand for the Ellsworth then I’d but 1-2k on top so call it a 3k budget… 

If anyone can shoot a few bike make/models my way I’d be happy to educate myself further. 

I am frame material agnostic. The alum Ellsworth never let me down and I never really bashed on it / crashed it.


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Meant also to ask - is what I’m after considered an XC / Trail / All mountain bike?


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## ctxcrossx (Jan 13, 2004)

I had the same bike... I gave it away to someone in need about 5 years ago. Personally, I don't think you'd get more than a few hundred for it. Just for the sake of planning your purchases.


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## turnerbikes (Apr 12, 2004)

A modern replacement for a bike like the Ellsworth is called ‘down country’ nowadays , basically full race XC but with a bit more travel and a dropper. A bike in this class with big wheels and modern geometry will blow your mind. Buying anyMore than a DownCountry type will bum you out due to overly stable design aimed at more aggressive riders and the weight will be huge bummer for the same reason. 

DT


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## NeedleBanger (8 mo ago)

Buy something used off pinkbike.com and then any of the following:
Rocky Mountain Element
Trek Topfuel
Santa Cruz Blur
Norco Revolver
Scott Spark
Transition Spur
Specialized Epic
Ibis Exie or Ripley
Kona Hei Hei
Pivot Mach 4

Any of those will fit the bill for a lightweight full suspension mountain bike, this is exactly the category you want if you aren't jumping the bike. These things are ridiculous for covering ground, uphill & downhill. Pedalling efficiency is the name of the game in this realm, you'll be quite pleased once you find yourself on a ride going uphill on a 25lb carbon fibre rig compared to your buddy who's slogging up the same hill on a 42lb beast


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## DeeCount (Oct 3, 2020)

ctxcrossx said:


> I had the same bike... I gave it away to someone in need about 5 years ago. Personally, I don't think you'd get more than a few hundred for it. Just for the sake of planning your purchases.


I think he might be able to get ~$1k for it if it was parted out, but it will take a lot of effort and time. It really depends on condition of the parts after they're all disassembled and cleaned up. Also, there seems to be a lot of love for the old Ellsworth frames in Canada and elsewhere around the world, just not here . My friend had me sell his 1997 Cannondale Super V900 for him last year. It had a few nice parts like Easton Monkeylite carbon bar and XTR V-brakes. The parts cleaned up well and I was able to clear $1,475 (after fees and shipping), with everything sold on eBay. There has to be hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of 26" bikes still out in the wild and in need of decent vintage parts.


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## OldMike (Apr 30, 2020)

Did the dame in 2021. Went from a 2003 Jamis Dakar XLT to a 21 SJ Carbon Comp IME buy the new bike outright and use the small funds generated by the old one for accessories.

Don't look at it in monetary value as it's tough to justify The old bike gets you on the same trails (slower) and home again. The new bike will do the same, just faster and a little more comfortable.


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## palmasi (Sep 26, 2013)

if you can try out a modern 29 inch trail or enduro hardtail, you may be shocked at its capabilities and fun factor. They are also half the price of decent full suspension so if you aren’t doing jumps all day would almost certainly fit the bill in a $3k budget.

I got a Nukeproof scout with a top build on a whim to complement my Carbon intense 951 150mm travel full sus and it’s so fast and fun I find myself riding it for everything except the nastiest terrain. Since I’m riding in the land of rocks, that’s saying something. 

I’ve had full suspension since 2005 and if I had a budget less than 4K I would absolutely get a modern hardtail. 

on the full suspension side near that budget the Ibis Ripley AF and intense 951 XC (at Costco!) are the best values going in full suspension downcountry bikes.


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Much appreciated all! The YT Izzo (of various trim levels) had caught my eye and I believe this slides into the somewhat nebulous Down Country category even if YT doesn’t use the term on their website. 

Riding a hardtail…. Intriguing thought. Ill have to think on that. Cost constraints removed, I am supposing you would not make that recommendation ? 

Will keep looking…


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## yzedf (Apr 22, 2014)

r-mm said:


> Much appreciated all! The YT Izzo (of various trim levels) had caught my eye and I believe this slides into the somewhat nebulous Down Country category even if YT doesn’t use the term on their website.
> 
> Riding a hardtail…. Intriguing thought. Ill have to think on that. Cost constraints removed, I am supposing you would not make that recommendation ?
> 
> Will keep looking…


Love my Izzo here in central CT


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## angerbot (5 mo ago)

NeedleBanger had some great suggestions. If made in USA is appealing to you and you can stretch the budget ($3750) or find a used one I’ll bet the Guerilla Gravity Trail Pistol would suit you quite well too.


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## NeedleBanger (8 mo ago)

I know it might be a tiny bit more money but these types of bikes on pinkbike.com are the score of a lifetime. X01 build with carbon Reserve wheels, like dude just pick up the phone instantly when you see a deal like this. The entire thing is carbon for $4000 USD, you'd be paying $10,000+ for the exact same thing brand new. These two are a prime examples, and have been for sale so long you could probably get a few hundred knocked off the asking price.


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## NeedleBanger (8 mo ago)

Keep in mind that's for "excellent" condition with a 2-3 year old bike. Just those Reserve wheels alone in Canada are $3000, and that's all Fox Performance Elite suspension. Spend an extra few hundred on some maintenance wherever needed (bottom bracket, tires, bearings, suspension service) and it'll run perfectly as new. It's literally like a high end off-roading Ferrari of bicycles.


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Many thanks! 

All above is appealing. Yes Made in USA means a lot to me and was one thing I like a lot about my Ellsworth. On that score I meant to ask - are ANY parts of the various German DTC brands (Canyon, YT) actually made in Germany? Strong sense is “no” but curious if anyone has learned more. Are basically all carbon frames Made In China these days ? 

Yes buying good stuff used is my favorite move. I have the tools, will to rebuild/replace anything in need of it. Excepting of course cracked carbon.


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

yzedf said:


> Love my Izzo here in central CT
> 
> View attachment 2003963


Very cool - hello from the Shore. Westwoods in Guilford/Branford constitutes 90% of my riding, if you are familiar. Its a very varied set of trails…


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

When "downcountry" isn't an option (such as on Pinkbike classifieds) is Trial or XC/Cross Country the closer category?


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## NeedleBanger (8 mo ago)

r-mm said:


> When "downcountry" isn't an option (such as on Pinkbike classifieds) is Trial or XC/Cross Country the closer category?


XC and then look for the bikes that have at least a 120mm fork and 100mm shock. If it's 100mm all around those are usually dedicated racing bikes. The new downcountry bikes like the '22 Rocky Element or Ibis Ripley are usually 130mm/120mm (front/rear), or 120mm/120mm like the Transition Spur & Scott Spark just to give that extra bit of cushion. If you do end up with a 100mm Fox rear shock and end up bottoming out once in a while you can add a volume spacer, I've had piles of good luck using them!


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## NeedleBanger (8 mo ago)

Another random example, in Canada but still this stuff is all over pinkbike.

2019 Rocky Element C90, says its basically mint condition. $3500 USD


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Anyone shipped a mtb x country recently? All in cost including packaging? 

(all the cool bikes are on the west coast it seems...)


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## gasmanxj (Sep 29, 2014)

r-mm said:


> Anyone shipped a mtb x country recently? All in cost including packaging?
> 
> (all the cool bikes are on the west coast it seems...)


Around $120-$150 via Bikeflights for shipping. If they drop off at shop to break down and pack up, probably another $100-150 for that.


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Thanks


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## Valhalla (Mar 30, 2004)

DeeCount said:


> I think he might be able to get ~$1k for it if it was parted out, but it will take a lot of effort and time. It really depends on condition of the parts after they're all disassembled and cleaned up. Also, there seems to be a lot of love for the old Ellsworth frames in Canada and elsewhere around the world, just not here . My friend had me sell his 1997 Cannondale Super V900 for him last year. It had a few nice parts like Easton Monkeylite carbon bar and XTR V-brakes. The parts cleaned up well and I was able to clear $1,475 (after fees and shipping), with everything sold on eBay. There has to be hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of 26" bikes still out in the wild and in need of decent vintage parts.


I sold my 2010 Ellsworth Epiphany for a little more than $1000 in 2021 but maybe the market has changed


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## Taroroot (Nov 6, 2013)

I kinda want to thank the homeless person who stole my Truth 10 or so years ago, forced me to get new bike, which was prob the best thing ever! For a super short while i was on a used Santa Cruz Blur SL, then got a new Yeti SB66. Eye opener! Im now on a SB140. Just got back from a trip where a rented a Revel Rascal, also a great riding bike. So much so that id consider getting one, more active on the small and moderate stuff, the Yeti does better the harder you push it. Curios about the WAO as that is one of few bikes made in North America. Hope makes theirs in UK. I think some of Ibis’ are being done in house now. But these are out of your budget range.


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## Chris Pringle (Oct 28, 2003)

r-mm said:


> (all the cool bikes are on the west coast it seems...)


So, did you buy something or narrowed down your search?


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## parkmeister (Feb 2, 2004)

Another thumbs up!!! for Pinkbike Buy/Sell. I found my last two bikes on PB: in 2020 I bought a 2017 YT Capra 27.5 and last month I bought a 2018 Santa Cruz Hightower LT.
I think I paid a 'fair' price for the bikes I got, which is way, way, way less than buying new. Be prepared to do (or have someone) prep and maintain the bike: my Capra came spotless, prolly cuz the previous owner pressure washed the bike. Therefore, ALL the bearings were trashed. There was also some shipping damage (bent der. hangar, broken wheel thingy on the der.) that had to be addressed. The Hightower came with a Fox X2 shock which had air in the oil damper system and required a rebuild. 

The performance, technology, and complexity of today's bikes are orders of magnitude higher than a 20 y.o. Ellsworth, and require far more work to maintain the designed level of performance, but the fun you will have on these new machines: man, o man, you are in for a treat!!!


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

Hi all

I got busy then it became cold. Then I got some cold weather gear, the vortex went away and now I'm riding and excited to kick this search back off. After realizing I kept my Ellsworth for fifteen years I'm okay increasing the budget for this to ~4k. 

Since I am lucky enough to be able to ride to the trails I really do want something light, fun and efficient when pedaling. Suspension travel is really the last concern. I want it to feel great riding and encourage me to push harder, ride more. 

I am liking the YT Izzo a lot and see the "Pro Race" below $4k often such as


https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/3497954/




https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/3274345/



The transition spur seems like its a cut above, with a price to match. There are a few for sale just over 4k - 


https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/3508158/



So: Still looking but ready to go...


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## r-mm (Jul 6, 2019)

As I'm reading various recaps of the "downcountry" segment I'm wondering if I really want a just plain XC bike. I really do not spend much time descending / gravity riding. Navigating technical single track and having fun is kind of my sweet spot, and even then I think most of the XC full suspension bikes would let me push my descending past what I do now. 

The Blur and Wilder are both very pretty and light. 

Because they seem to refuse to come out and say it: is the Wilder (and Julianna line) explicitly designed for women, whatever that means?


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## DeeCount (Oct 3, 2020)

Have you checked out the new Trek Fuel EX? I'm not a big Trek fan but they really seemed to have nailed it with this one.


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## ShakyDog (Oct 24, 2019)

No matter what you get it will never be a cool as your vintage Ellsworth, that is a work of art. They may not ride as well as the new ones, but they sure were badass.

Best bet, get as much seat time with new bikes and decide which one speaks to you.

Steve


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