# Anyone else notice how ridiculous some Strava Segments have now become?



## kiwijames (Apr 1, 2008)

We've all seen the definitions for what a Strava$$hole is. On occasion, I've been guilty of expressing some of those unsavory qualities.
While back home in NZ, riding around Karapoti and Makara, it struck me, for the plethora of trails, with obvious starts and ends, there isn't the constant segmentation of strava segments I find here in Ca.
Riders here in the Bay Area have sliced and diced up trails (and roads), many less than 1km, into mini segments for pure KOM puffery. In my neighborhood we have people clocking segments on Cul De Sacs, roads within cemeteries, some incorporating a route through a parking lot, just idiotic stuff. On occasion you'll stumble upon these and see you've inadvertently made the top 2...because there is only 2 or 3 riders. So someone created it to fill the KOM pages? Comical.

BTW, a KOM  is for climbing. When did it get bastardized so as to apply to anyone faster than the other guy? It's getting diluted.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

I've seen it on occasion. Dude has a personal route he does regularly through parking lots, a MUP, and some sidewalks to the local mtb trails and makes a public segment out of it. wtf? I don't mind spring segments on a flat stretch of road. But I do find it bizarre when segments get stacked. So one guy creates a segment for a given climb, and then the next guy decides that segment isn't good enough so "his" segment adds to the beginning or end a short bit. Then someone else makes another with what they think is a better segment and on and on. And this in an area where there might be a half a dozen or fewer people riding the segments.

I think it would be better if Strava created its own algorithm that averaged trails and roads and identified segments itself based on slope/distance, rather than allowing people to create them. Maybe have a "recommend a segment" section where it automatically goes to a moderator who can review and get rid of stupid ones, downhill segments through intersections and on two-way trails, public segments that start in people's houses, etc. Cut down on "segment spew".


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

The "hide" function only goes so far. 

They need a "segment ranking" feature where if a segment gets enough negative rep, it becomes a private segment of the creator and disappears for everyone else.


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## jan_nikolajsen (Oct 28, 2011)

I like Strava. It's an excellent motivator to get out there and the competition in our rather small local community is friendly and fun. But the segments, as mentioned, are sometimes oddly located, overlapping each other and impossible to predict the first time one does a ride due to inconspicuous starting and ending points. But mostly they are too short for my taste. I've only created 3 or 4 with none under 40 miles. An out and back or loop segment of considerable distance can also remove the 'wind advantage' of choosing a brisk tailwind day to chase down a KOM.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Out-and-backs segments often still pick up when they are short-turned.

The only windproof segments are loops (which can still be ridden in a group for drafting), bumpy or technical climbs in the woods, and freak-show-steep climbs on the road. 

Everything else is basically presumed to be ridden with a tail wind push.


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## t0pcat (May 7, 2012)

I think it would be nice if they would ask what type of bike your riding too, i ride a segment that is on a dike with my mtn bike and think the bikes in front of me are roadies but have no way of knowing at least i haven't found a way yet


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## kiwijames (Apr 1, 2008)

ghettocruiser said:


> Out-and-backs segments often still pick up when they are short-turned.
> 
> The only windproof segments are loops (which can still be ridden in a group for drafting), bumpy or technical climbs in the woods, and freak-show-steep climbs on the road.
> 
> Everything else is basically presumed to be ridden with a tail wind push.


Strava on many loops lacks the logic to rank a clockwise vs counter-clockwise route, something that can have a huge impact on total segment/loop time. Loops also need a pretty clear break in the segment to even catch properly.


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## nachomc (Apr 26, 2006)

ghettocruiser said:


> The "hide" function only goes so far.
> 
> They need a "segment ranking" feature where if a segment gets enough negative rep, it becomes a private segment of the creator and disappears for everyone else.


If you flag a segment as "Dangerous" it immediately gets tanked and while visible will no longer rank anyone


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

nachomc said:


> If you flag a segment as "Dangerous" it immediately gets tanked and while visible will no longer rank anyone


Yes. But I remain very hesitant to use that button to wipe out someone's "victory"(however inane) under most circumstances. Unless I am already the leader, I guess.

As the summer comes on and the segment insanity grows, I may change my mind.


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## nachomc (Apr 26, 2006)

ghettocruiser said:


> Yes. But I remain very hesitant to use that button to wipe out someone's "victory"(however inane) under most circumstances. Unless I am already the leader, I guess.
> 
> As the summer comes on and the segment insanity grows, I may change my mind.


The sad part about it is that instead of emailing support to ask them to unblock the segment, most will just create another one with the same (or slightly different) name and carry on. So you then end up with the same segment a bunch of times


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## Noclutch (Jun 20, 2010)

The most ridiculous Stravatard encounter for me was the PM I received from an anonymous Stravist who proceeded to berate and chastise me for not actually doing the ride I'd recorded (over a year prior, mind you).....which included a ho-hum 20 miles or so of trail ( then forgetting to turn off my GPS) followed by 10 miles of driving back to my house at 55 mph, thusly seriously upping my average speed and crushing all the roadies by 30 mph on a paved segment! I responded that the 200 rpm cadence was killing me but my new tires were what really made the difference. LMFAO


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Noclutch said:


> The most ridiculous Stravatard encounter for me was the PM I received from an anonymous Stravist who proceeded to berate and chastise me for not actually doing the ride I'd recorded (over a year prior, mind you)


No one wants to go back and edit rides from years ago. If he just flagged the ride, you probably would have never noticed, unless you had meaningful times on the leader boards when you were actually riding.

Or you can just flag your own rides. I do that too sometimes, when I draft a truck or something else shady.


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## kiwijames (Apr 1, 2008)

ghettocruiser said:


> Or you can just flag your own rides. I do that too sometimes, when I draft a truck or something else shady.


That would make you less ego centric than 99.9% of the Strava users! I love the KOMs when the rider titles the ride as "Moto Paced" and blow us away by a 10% margin. Oh, the growing recumbent crowd add to the melee too. 
Strava reminds me of the disclaimer found in Jim Kramer's Mad Money...it's "for entertainment purposes only", that may help explain the growing number of stacked segments and those that incorporate cul de sacs, in and out onto a route.


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## Gundam168 (Dec 19, 2012)

When I first read this thread 2 weeks ago, I can hardly relate to anything written here. However, when I joined Strava and saw my name suddenly ranked in a particular downhill run when I uploaded a track.....Boom! 

Strava**hole.


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## Pedalfaraway (Jan 19, 2004)

*Why does it matter to you where people put segments*

If you don't want to see a segment there is an option to hide it and it will not show up on your subsequent uploads.

Strava is not a replacement for racing. Its a given that its accuracy is poor. When doing a long climb where my average speed is below 4mph its easy to see that the guy who has the KOM on a 1 min section of the climb with an average speed of 15 MPH was not riding the whole thing at that pace. He took it easy and then sprinted like mad for the segment. So what?

Strava is part tool, and part game. Do you get upset when someone (who you probably don't even know) uses a screwdriver differently then you? Do you get mad at children because then play go fish with rules that nobody seems to understand? Its Just for fun. If strava is not making your riding more fun then don't use it.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Pedalfaraway said:


> Strava is part tool, and part game. Do you get upset when someone (who you probably don't even know) uses a screwdriver differently then you? Do you get mad at children because then play go fish with rules that nobody seems to understand? Its Just for fun. If strava is not making your riding more fun then don't use it.


1. Where I ride, land managers, journalists, and other non-cyclists are also using strava as a tool to monitor the behavior of cyclists in their communities. High-speed descents on off-road trails that are not set up for DH, and stop sign-red-light containing segments are very poor optics and could get stuff shut down, maybe even Strava itself. The fact that I have stuff hidden in my profile doesn't change what anyone else sees most of the time.

2. I personally don't want to run over while climbing by someone going for some kind of descent record on a trail that is intended for anything but. To use your example, I don't want to hit get in the face with a "screwdriver" every time I go in the "workshop" that someone else is using "differently".


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## Pedalfaraway (Jan 19, 2004)

Both of these conditions have existed long before Strava. 

1. Strava has made where people are riding a little more transparent. This can be a good thing or a bad thing. Have you considered contacting the users you are concered about who are riding illegal trails? Strava is a much easier way for trail ambassadors to identify and contact users. 

2. People riding downhill at high rates of speed is not a problem unique to strava segments, nor was it created by strava. When you get hit in the face with a screwdriver who do you blame for the damage? The screwdriver or the person who threw it.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

Strava did not create bad behavior but it enables people to behave badly. The developers' intention was not to encourage bad behavior on the trail but that is what happens when jerks take it too seriously.


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## ziscwg (May 18, 2007)

I got a PR recently because I got behind a big dump truck and got pulled along. It sucks now as I doubt I will be getting anywhere with that segment again.

I do think there should be some kind of ranking or "complaint" button. I have seen more than a few segments that seem to start late or end way to early for their "stated" route.

Strava is a motivator for me. I have some loops around here that are public segments, but I only show "my results" on it. I also set out on rides to get PR on certain segments. Sometimes it's a climb, sometimes a decent. 

I have some KOMs but they seem hollow if there's less than 10 riders. I actually feel somewhat accomplished on some segments when I'm in the top 50 and there's like 1200 people that have ridden it.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Pedalfaraway said:


> Both of these conditions have existed long before Strava.


I'm not familiar with too many ways that, back in the day, a land manager could easily view where people are riding in a particular area, when they are riding, how often, and at what speed they are riding it without leaving his desk. I was using garmin connect as far back as 2008 or so(?) but I don't recall too many people loading cycling metrics on the internet before then.

And you've completely changed your question on the screwdriver metaphor.



Pedalfaraway said:


> Do you get upset when someone (who you probably don't even know) uses a screwdriver differently then you?





Pedalfaraway said:


> When you get hit in the face with a screwdriver who do you blame for the damage? The screwdriver or the person who threw it.


I never said I was blaming Strava. I'm been a paying member since 2011 and heavy user. I was stating why it's mis-use might concern me, which I read as your initial question.


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## dereknz (May 3, 2011)

Strava also automatically create segments based on your activities so I found out on Easter Sunday. Strava automatically added 5 new segments on Sunday after I saved my ride.


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## Gundam168 (Dec 19, 2012)

I was just wondering, I noticed this segment ranking feature in MapMyRide way before I discovered Strava but thought none of it. Now I notice, I'm pushing myself near the limits of my health and the limits of road and trail safety just to get a good PR or ranking on certain segments.


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## herrhaus (May 29, 2009)

Gundam168 said:


> I was just wondering, I noticed this segment ranking feature in MapMyRide way before I discovered Strava but thought none of it. Now I notice, I'm pushing myself near the limits of my health and the limits of road and trail safety just to get a good PR or ranking on certain segments.


Well, I'm not sure what you're wondering about....regardless, it's totally your decision to push yourself beyond your capabilities. In 10-years will it matter? Keep your cool and enjoy being out in the fresh air.


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## deadhead1971 (Apr 24, 2013)

ghettocruiser said:


> The "hide" function only goes so far.
> 
> They need a "segment ranking" feature where if a segment gets enough negative rep, it becomes a private segment of the creator and disappears for everyone else.


Like that idea 

I wrote a blog post summarising the issues with bad segments.
*
7 reasons why some Strava segments suck (do yours?)*


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

I reported a segment the other day on a paved MUT with a 20mph speed limit and the whole first page of people were exceeding it.

Not thrilled with the agreement Strava and USA Cycling announced.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

NateHawk said:


> a paved MUT with a 20mph speed limit and the whole first page of people were exceeding it


Word. There are a fair number of MUP segments around here that are reasonably safe in the winter with low traffic and no leaves, and VERY sketchy in the summer when all the corners are blind and... well, everyone is actually riding them.

But I may not be the most objective observer. Climbing is pretty much my only talent, so it's easy for me to ramble on about the "safe" climb segments and "dangerous" DH and sprint segments, knowing I will probably never crack the top 10 in the latter without a hurricane tailwind or something.


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## millertm (Jul 20, 2012)

t0pcat said:


> I think it would be nice if they would ask what type of bike your riding too, i ride a segment that is on a dike with my mtn bike and think the bikes in front of me are roadies but have no way of knowing at least i haven't found a way yet


It does, you can choose Mtn or Road, it also asks for your bikes weight to compile power. This is found on the on-line setting menu. Oh, I just re-read your post. I do not believe that you can have Mtn only or Road bike only segments. I choose Mtn riding but I know by power ratings that I am being ranked with road bikes as well.

Mark


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## motmcd (Apr 26, 2013)

ghettocruiser said:


> The "hide" function only goes so far.
> 
> They need a "segment ranking" feature where if a segment gets enough negative rep, it becomes a private segment of the creator and disappears for everyone else.


Bingo


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## doodoobaby (Jun 19, 2012)

I am a strava *******. I think its fun so I use it. My motto is do what you like. **** it.


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Strava wins dismissal of civil suit over Berkeley death

It seems, for now at least, they're off the hook.


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## jesse101 (May 23, 2011)

Pedalfaraway said:


> If you don't want to see a segment there is an option to hide it and it will not show up on your subsequent uploads.
> 
> Strava is not a replacement for racing. Its a given that its accuracy is poor. When doing a long climb where my average speed is below 4mph its easy to see that the guy who has the KOM on a 1 min section of the climb with an average speed of 15 MPH was not riding the whole thing at that pace. He took it easy and then sprinted like mad for the segment. So what?
> 
> Strava is part tool, and part game. Do you get upset when someone (who you probably don't even know) uses a screwdriver differently then you? Do you get mad at children because then play go fish with rules that nobody seems to understand? Its Just for fun. If strava is not making your riding more fun then don't use it.


That's the way I have always viewed it, like a live action video game. I will monitor my garmin if something seems unreal, and I always upload my Info into strava just to see who has ridden similar trails. Also, I have met co-workers unintentionally through strava as I would see there name pop up in certain segments. At that point our group riding has increased and the **** talking at work has gotten to a whole new level, which to me is no different than playing COD online, except now we are out and about getting healthy.

I agree, if you don't like the segment, then block it, it's pretty simple to do actually.


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## beshannon (Oct 14, 2012)

Might be irrelevant since Strava pushed buggy code and broke their app. Not working now with no announcement of a fix :nono:


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## ghettocruiser (Jun 21, 2008)

Today they have quietly added the ability to "star" your favorite segments.

Which hopefully leads us down the road to getting rid of all the segments that suck.


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## quiggs1974 (Nov 22, 2007)

One way to overcome the dangers of strava, is use digitalepo.com get back all those Koms that have been stolen. 

A lot safer too!


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