# 94g Grip-Shifters



## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

I hoped to get the 10s version as well but so far only the 9s version has made it to my house...

Anyway:
9s
Shimano compatible
97g in stock trim but replacing the 2 clamping steel bolts with aluminium bolts they weigh just 94g:thumbsup: 

That's with real, grippy rubber grips.No fancy foam that will disintegrate...

Shifting in hand they feel just like the Plasmas they will replace. I still haven't mounted them though so riding impression or how they feel on the bike will take about an hour still...i will go down and set my bike up with them.

But more interesting will be the 10s version that i should get these days as well.Finally i will be able to convert to 10s.So far triggers just haven't been an option for me:nono:


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## mariosimas (Nov 30, 2009)

looks awesome!!!!!

and about the price ?


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## DavidR1 (Jul 7, 2008)

Who makes them?


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## ohadamirov (Jun 26, 2008)

Can't wait to get my hands on 10's version! 

Thanks for the post Nino! 

Ohad.


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## Batas (Jan 16, 2004)

Mmmm... I don't believe they will be that great. 

10spd in the same k7 space (shorter distance between cogs) + same ratio (1:2) (less cable pulled for each gear change) + a bit of mud = very imprecise shifting on nasty conditions...

But hey, lets wait and see.


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## damond (Sep 9, 2008)

I already have the 10's version!

It looks like they forgot to make the cable hole to switch the cable!


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## STS (Jun 24, 2004)

nino, the 10s version will be for shimano or sram RD?

in my attack 8s gripshift clicks are really close and is easy to mistake and change 2 gears instead one. son I think Batas can be right with his coment


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

STS said:


> nino, the 10s version will be for shimano or sram RD?
> 
> in my attack 8s gripshift clicks are really close and is easy to mistake and change 2 gears instead one. son I think Batas can be right with his coment


I will get both, Shimano and SRAM.

No-i don't see any problems. A click is a click.It is a defined motion.
I use 9s Plasma and never had any problems.


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

Will the sram models have the ratio of X0 or will it be the ratio of XX/Red?


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

nino said:


> I hoped to get the 10s version as well but so far only the 9s version has made it to my house...
> 
> Anyway:
> 9s
> ...


Yummy!:thumbsup:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Gotta agree with nino, you have to be a real klutz to overshift any indexed shifter. Sure you can go tooo far with a friction shifter, or an index that doesn't match the derailleur brand/geometry (suntour and shimano spacing in the 80s-90s was very close but not exactly the same, yet suntour had the lightest shifters so a lot of us run them and mix/match to other brands of derailleurs) but with matching geometry of shifters and derailleurs, there's no reason you should ever shift two cogs unless you're cable tension is way off, or your derailleur hanger is bent.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

russya said:


> Will the sram models have the ratio of X0 or will it be the ratio of XX/Red?


I should get some samples for XX together with my 10s but plan also to get 10s for "regular" X.0 later on. I am pretty much ordering them to my needs.
I am starting with Shimano since that's what i use...


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## Batas (Jan 16, 2004)

Have to disagree. In the "heat of the action", and like STS said, with sram attack closed space "clicks" it is easy to change 2 gears by mistake. They are a bit close. Now, I imagine how would it be with 10spd shifters... Not for me, thanks!

_"No-i don't see any problems. A click is a click.It is a defined motion."_

Yes, it really is. In perfect conditions it works. Now add a little mud, fast pace...

Nope. Can't see benefits from that. Lets agree to disagree.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Batas said:


> Have to disagree. In the "heat of the action", and like STS said, with sram attack closed space "clicks" it is easy to change 2 gears by mistake. They are a bit close. Now, I imagine how would it be with 10spd shifters... Not for me, thanks!
> 
> _"No-i don't see any problems. A click is a click.It is a defined motion."_
> 
> ...


I never used those 8s grip-shifters you are talking about.Maybe those are different.Attacks have a "bad" profiled rubber with too little grip which might make your hands slip but on good grips that's not the case.I am on 9s Plasmas and there is no way you accidentally can shift 2 gears.The movement is a defined one.

I had "double" shifts when using the actual XTR triggers though as pushing the triggers is much softer feeling than my grip-shifters which made for unwanted shifts but definitely not on a grip-shifter with such defined dents. I really don't see the problem at all. Every shifter feels different anyway and you get accustomed to it. I'm sure if i would have XTR triggers i would get into it but i really had a lot of misshifts when trying out my friends bikes.


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## ANTTEI (Jul 21, 2009)

As someone already asked:

What About the price?


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## Kwik (Aug 7, 2007)

Price and were to get?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Boy we got two newbies here who apparently don't know the history of nino.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Kwik said:


> Price and were to get?


google luckynino


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## erkan (Jan 18, 2004)

Nino, do you want a real homepage with shop, let me know, I can set you up


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

A pair of Sasch Quartz is missing from your collection.... 

Nino , are you going to Maremma at the Maremmacup ?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

eliflap said:


> A pair of Sasch Quartz is missing from your collection....
> 
> Nino , are you going to Maremma at the Maremmacup ?


I also have a set of the Quartz left.They did 1 ride and then they landed in a box where they still colllect dust.

Yes and no - i will go 1 week to Massa Vecchia (Massa Marittima) starting on april 24th.


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## mariosimas (Nov 30, 2009)

good price Nino


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Nice nino! And it looks like it would last longer than the ones from Nobu. Please update us with real world performance. I plan to use it with my X0 rd. Can you weigh them with full line of cable please? I plan to replace my gripshift x0. I run it at 1x9 only. Thanks.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

morrisgarages said:


> Nice nino! And it looks like it would last longer than the ones from Nobu. Please update us with real world performance. I plan to use it with my X0 rd. Can you weigh them with full line of cable please? I plan to replace my gripshift x0. I run it at 1x9 only. Thanks.


As they come with steel bolts and including the pre-installed shift wires they weigh 126g. Now you can see also those 2 main clamping bolts that can be replaced for further weight savings.

There is no additional screws or openings.For cable changes you simply pull them apart.They have a really simple and ingenius design. I was scratiching my head to look for a way to take off the wires to weight them without but finally found out they can be disassembled real easy.

I hope i can find a minute to finally install them on my own bike.My wife is in holidays and therefore i'm a temporary housemen keeping my son and myself happy in the house...but not much time left for wrenching and riding.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

What is the weight of the rear shifter only?

Thinking about revisting gripshift for a 1x9..


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Curmy said:


> What is the weight of the rear shifter only?
> 
> Thinking about revisting gripshift for a 1x9..


Right side only is 48g


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks nino! Looks very promising.:thumbsup: I'll run them for 1x9 too. Nobus going to have to level up! Please let me know when you get to ride them already! I hope you don't accidentally pull them apart while riding though. I know the grips would be there to keep that from happening but I'm using foam grips so I hope its not going to be an issue. Will be waiting for your ride feedback! Thanks again.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Ok-it's almost midnight over here in Switzerland, the olympic super-g ski race is over (the swiss failed this time), my son asleep so i had the time to go wrenching: i installed the shifter on my winter commuter first which previously had 153g SRAM Plasma shifters and XTR rear derailleur....the lightweight shifters work great! Supersmooth shifts and slick action. i'm really impressed and can't wait to test them out on the street for real. But on the workstand shifting is just perfect. I also like the shape of the grip.It has a nice shape and good texture.

We had 7 degrees celsius yesterday which made for a big mess out on the trails. Melting snow, over night it's going to freeze again andright now it's snowing again as well...so tomorrow it will be some road-riding again with my commuter.

But i will need some more free-time to convert my 2 MTBs to these shifters...


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

nino said:


> Ok-it's almost midnight over here in Switzerland, the olympic super-g ski race is over (the swiss failed this time), my son asleep so i had the time to go wrenching: i installed the shifter on my winter commuter first which previously had 153g SRAM Plasma shifters and XTR rear derailleur....the lightweight shifters work great! Supersmooth shifts and slick action. i'm really impressed and can't wait to test them out on the street for real. But on the workstand shifting is just perfect. I also like the shape of the grip.It has a nice shape and good texture.
> 
> We had 7 degrees celsius yesterday which made for a big mess out on the trails. Melting snow, over night it's going to freeze again andright now it's snowing again as well...so tomorrow it will be some road-riding again with my commuter.
> 
> But i will need some more free-time to convert my 2 MTBs to these shifters...


We're happy here in the US with the Silver and Bronze in the Super-G.

Are you going to be selling these shifters at some point in the future? I'm curious as I've got a race weenie full suspension build to do in April and am trying to line up my goodies for the build.

Thanks.

BB


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## Zakarina (May 1, 2008)

This is very nice, a video of the shifting with your bike on the stand would be even nicer...

Is the shift feeling similar to SRAM X series or more like departement store bikes?...
Does it looks like it will hold up to abusive shifting or will it break when i'm trying to win a sprint to the finish line?

Thank you for your honest answers.


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## 2silent (Dec 19, 2008)

umm- how about prices on 10 speed gripshifts...

I'd even pay quite a bit for some heavier ones


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## adept1 (Jul 25, 2008)

How is the grip length compared to SRAM X series ones? I hope it's shorter. I love my X.0 shifters, but they'd be even better if they were about 1cm shorter.


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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Boy we got two newbies here who apparently don't know the history of nino.


Well that's really f#cking helpful


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## ionutph (May 10, 2009)

I am also interested for Sram X.0 3x9 setup. The front i think is the same ratio as shimano. Will be a dedicated Sram 9s version ? 

From picture I se the front shifter has 5 clicks between gear 1-2 and 3 clicks from 2-3 ? With my X.0 front gripshift and X.9 low mount bottom pull I have 4 clicks between 1 and 2 and from 2 to 3 only 3 click out of 4 are neded to shift. Is this normal ?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Well c'mon kapusta... everyone here knows he only posts stuff because he sells them. His signature line finally even admits to that fact (forced by Rensho as I recall). Only newbies wouldn't realize it yet. Or the truly dimwitted if they've been here over 2 years and haven't figured it out yet. I suppose being helpful I could have simply told them who to contact to set themselves up with the shifters at wholesale.


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

DavidR1 said:


> Who makes them?


Can anyone answer this one?


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

i guess Recon ... meny shop sell them with Recon cassette 10s


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

eliflap said:


> i guess Recon ... meny shop sell them with Recon cassette 10s


Bzzzzt Wrong! But thanks for playing....

Microshift. Same manufacturer that makes the drivetrain pieces for Sampson, Token, and several others.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Bzzzzt Wrong! But thanks for playing....


Dito


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

dito = nino speak for "great, now everyone's gonna end-run me..."

The fact microshift already makes 10 speed downtube, dual-control and bar-end shifters, and is one of the largest makers of twist shifters should have been clue enough for most folks. That the pictured shifter looks like other microshift twist-shifters as well should have been all the other clue anyone needed.


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## Mr. IROC-Z (Aug 24, 2006)

I just got a set of the Nobu shifters...are those also microshift? I like the way they feel and the way they look, and they are super light (90 grams), but not sure how long they will last!


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Yep. Nino made a subtle dig at the Nobu labeled ones with his "no fancy foam" comment in his first post of this thread.

Anyway for the rest of you...

www.microshift.biz

Note the nice carbon blade ten speed bar-end shifters they offer under their own name, and the nice 2/3x10 underbar shifters for flat bar bikes. 230g/pair is pretty reasonable weight given that they're cheaper than X.9s (which weigh more).

Their 27 speed thumb-tap shifter and derailleur set run less than the equivalent shimano units at the SLX level in cost, and less than XT in weight.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Yep. Nino made a subtle dig at the Nobu labeled ones with his "no fancy foam" comment in his first post of this thread.
> 
> Anyway for the rest of you...
> 
> ...


good try but still not correct

Anyway - i don't just buy them but rather have them made for me.I don't know why those companies don't do it on their own but anyway- i have them made to fit the various demands out there.


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## kroe (Mar 30, 2009)

10 speed 1:1 grip shifters to work with a XX cassette and a X.0 rear would be awesome... I think these would be popular if made available.


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## 2silent (Dec 19, 2008)

no 10 speed on their site

I would adopt 10 speed soon as it's possible- I have compatability between my cross bike and mountain bike for wheels (same used on both at different times) and currently am switching cassettes... seems like a good reason to go to 10 speed.

by reason I mean excuse


I would need shimano compatable


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

kapusta said:


> Well that's really f#cking helpful


Nah, as Nino put some disclosure in and toned down competitor bashing, he is cool in my books now.


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## Dex11 (May 4, 2005)

There is also a thread about 10 speed grip-shifters on a German forum
For those who can read german :

http://www.mtb-news.de/forum/showthread.php?t=446847

Also, this is an pic. from the thread over there


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

...and the germans got the info from here about 2 months ago:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=581678&highlight=recon

We discussed this cassette+shifter before and as mentioned already it makes absolutely no sense to run a custom spaced aluminium cassette paired to a custom-spaced 10s shifter. Both parts aren't interchangeable with other 10s parts on the market. So once the cassette is worn you can throw all in the garbage!

Aluminium cassettes on a MTB = BAD idea.


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## Dex11 (May 4, 2005)

I agree on the aluminum cassettes !

German isn't my native tongue, I can read it a bit, not all. So the discussion over there is kinda hard for me to follow. But it is a great forum without a doubt, lots off knowledge over there.

But the shifters are the same, right ? At least from the outside, on the shifters you showed I can read SEC on the outside of the grip.

Inside is different ?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Dex11 said:


> I agree on the aluminum cassettes !
> 
> German isn't my native tongue, I can read it a bit, not all. So the discussion over there is kinda hard for me to follow. But it is a great forum without a doubt, lots off knowledge over there.
> 
> ...


That german forum is my second "home-forum" since i'm german spoken.

Sure different - I have them made to fit regular 9s, 10s, with Shimano or SRAM.

That custom spacing is of no interest. I really don't understand how you could invest even minimal brainpower in such a custom standard at all.


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## Dex11 (May 4, 2005)

I thought so...Nino-ch.

Anyway, nice shifters. How you can give a ride-report soon....:thumbsup:

If I would like to run a 7900 DA ( triple) on the front and an XO on the back, what shifters would you advice ?


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## reformed roadie (Mar 30, 2008)

DeeEight said:


> Bzzzzt Wrong! But thanks for playing....
> 
> Microshift. Same manufacturer that makes the drivetrain pieces for Sampson, Token, and several others.


Why so surly, DeeEight?
Was this posted before or after the U.S. whupped Canada in hockey? 
That's got to sting, eh? Beaten at your own game...

How bad is it going to be up there when the Russians eliminate the Canadians and they get no medals?

ANYWAY...back on topic. Those Sach shifters...didn't realize they were that light; I have a pair of brand new 8spd ones. Can they be changed to 9spd?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

reformed roadie said:


> ANYWAY...back on topic. Those Sach shifters...didn't realize they were that light; I have a pair of brand new 8spd ones. Can they be changed to 9spd?


If you have some 8s Sachs it's not the Quartz shown above. Anyway - those old plastic shifters felt like crap. As mentioned i also got one for myself years ago as those were the lightest 9s available but i just rode around the block with them and immediately took them off. That's not what i would want on my bike.Shifting felt like crap. I was trying to see what i could do weight-wise on my bike back then but the Maxxlite semislicks and these shifters would be the items that completely ruined the perfromance of the bike. That's the first two items that got replaced immediately. Well-the bike looked good on the hangng-scale: 6,4 kilos if i remember right....

And no-you can't convert 8 to 9s since the spacing is different.


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## reformed roadie (Mar 30, 2008)

nino said:


> If you have some 8s Sachs it's not the Quartz shown above. Anyway - those old plastic shifters felt like crap. As mentioned i also got one for myself years ago as those were the lightest 9s available but i just rode around the block with them and immediately took them off. That's not what i would want on my bike.Shifting felt like crap. I was trying to see what i could do weight-wise on my bike back then but the Maxxlite semislicks and these shifters would be the items that completely ruined the perfromance of the bike. That's the first two items that got replaced immediately. Well-the bike looked good on the hangng-scale: 6,4 kilos if i remember right....
> 
> And no-you can't convert 8 to 9s since the spacing is different.


Yes, I know the spacing is different 
I haven't mounted them, but they snap from gear to gear with authority, and seem like they would work well. 
The problem is I have all Sram stuff and these are spaced for Shimano, so to test them, I need to invest in a RD. 
I have a XTR 8spd cassette. Unfortunately,it is 11-28...a bit tall of a gear for 1x8 / 32 chainring.

I can't complain, since both were free.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

reformed roadie said:


> Why so surly, DeeEight?
> Was this posted before or after the U.S. whupped Canada in hockey?
> That's got to sting, eh? Beaten at your own game...
> 
> How bad is it going to be up there when the Russians eliminate the Canadians and they get no medals?


I hate Miller. Canadians will have a tune up, and I am not sure Nabokov will stop 45.  Bad luck for Russia. Of course Russia should have taken care of Slovakianot to be in this position. 
But let's see, hope Nabby can step up.


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## gurujosh (Jul 16, 2008)

SRAM Compatible? Any expected release?


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## gurujosh (Jul 16, 2008)

(Hi everyone!)


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## hugofabreu (Sep 20, 2005)

I finally ditched the oldest components on my bike, some 10 year-old XT shifters, which never gave me any reason to swap over anything else. 
I installed these Nino's 9s-grip-shifters yesterday and tried them on today in a race and they were good! To be honest I had no experience with grip-shifters, and it felt really good to be able to shift straight into the gear I want! The shifters worked very well and not flimsy at all!


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## dragonq (Nov 5, 2006)

Kwik said:


> Price and were to get?


you can get from here http://www.r2-bike.com/MTB-Recon-Shimano-grip-shift

here some shops sell us$40 cheaper for the shifters and the cassette about us$90.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

dragonq said:


> you can get from here http://www.r2-bike.com/MTB-Recon-Shimano-grip-shift


sorry - but that price is ridiculous.


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## Zakarina (May 1, 2008)

Is there a SRAM 1:1 version coming soon?


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## xcatax (Mar 26, 2009)

Theres a lot people waiting for sram version and nino doesnt rply ...thats not good


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

Actually wanted to order them but then found a long thread on these shifters in the major German weight weenies forum (not the one mentioned previously here). Since a major regular German shop sells them, there are quite a few independent reviews available now. Actually all posters have problems with fine tuning them. The indexing does not work correctly. To sum it up, they are lightweight but function is far behind X0 twisters. Furthermore, there seems to be no sealing. Dirt may enter the shifters easily there.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

quax said:


> Actually wanted to order them but then found a long thread on these shifters in the major German weight weenies forum (not the one mentioned previously here). Since a major regular German shop sells them, there are quite a few independent reviews available now. Actually all posters have problems with fine tuning them. The indexing does not work correctly. To sum it up, they are lightweight but function is far behind X0 twisters. Furthermore, there seems to be no sealing. Dirt may enter the shifters easily there.


There is 2 guys telling about some inprecise shifting yet a lot of others that don't have any problems at all ! One of those 2 complains that he incidently shifts 2 gears at a time while all others don't have this issue.This has more to do with the habit of needed movement on a Grip-shifter to shift one gear......anyway- you will never find 100% satisfaction in a new part. Example: I couldn't get my XTR Shadow to work as i would have liked ...a part that is supposed to work 1000% bulletproof. Is my complaint worth to stay clear of the Shadow?...

My SRAM Plasma Shifters don't have any seals as well.There was no dirt ever entering inside. Those SEC shifters are no different.


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## quax (Feb 21, 2009)

nino said:


> There is 2 guys telling about some inprecise shifting yet a lot of others that don't have any problems at all !


sweet, intended or not, leaving the impression that there are actually guys recommending these shifters in that thread.

There are 5 guys commenting on their experience with these shifters (actually only 4 because 1 reports of the 9s) shifter. Not one really positive when compared to the function of other twisters. So far I've only found one postive comment on them and that's from you, well, and you're selling them. We'll se what the verdict of the long-term test of that site is.

Period, just sharing that. This is still a discussion forum and not a market place.


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)




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## dragonq (Nov 5, 2006)

nino said:


> sorry - but that price is ridiculous.


take a look the price in taiwan's evil bay
http://search.ruten.com.tw/search/s000.php?c=001900080001&k=recon&=%A6A%B7j%B4M

and use this to save your time
http://finance.yahoo.com/currency-converter?u#from=TWD;to=USD;amt=3400


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## SmilMick (Apr 9, 2006)

nino said:


> There is 2 guys telling about some inprecise shifting yet a lot of others that don't have any problems at all ! One of those 2 complains that he incidently shifts 2 gears at a time while all others don't have this issue.This has more to do with the habit of needed movement on a Grip-shifter to shift one gear......anyway- you will never find 100% satisfaction in a new part. Example: I couldn't get my XTR Shadow to work as i would have liked ...a part that is supposed to work 1000% bulletproof. Is my complaint worth to stay clear of the Shadow?...
> 
> My SRAM Plasma Shifters don't have any seals as well.There was no dirt ever entering inside. Those SEC shifters are no different.


This is very revealing to your basic philosophy where weight is held in higher regard than function.

besides, on this site, 2 out of "alot of people" actually ride their bikes hard. Could it be that these two incidents are riders that uphold a higher set of expectations with shifting and performance? Could it be that your needs and expectations are actually SET LOWER than average for the sake of light weight? hmmmmm


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

nino said:


> Example: I couldn't get my XTR Shadow to work as i would have liked ...a part that is supposed to work 1000% bulletproof.


It is bulletproof.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

nino said:


> ... SRAM Plasma Shifters don't have any seals as well.....


Of course you think the SEC are precise when you still ride shifters from 15 years ago 

Your statement ist WRONG !
Or simply another example for your poor technical understanding (or pseudo argument for your gain).

Plasmas have rubber grips which contacts overlapping to the plastic shifter body.
At the SEC shifter is no rubber, and more worse: no contacting overlapping. 
Between the grey (white) ring from the SEC twister grip and the shifter body is a small gap where I can look into the shifter.
Next is: with every shifting act the gap increases for the shifting moment because the shifter grip has a lot play against the shifter body (and the shifter body also to the clamp)
Don't know exactly the impact, but I guess its not really beneficial on a MTB and its typically use.

btw: all of three shifter sets the same.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

checky said:


> Of course you think the SEC are precise when you still ride shifters from 15 years ago
> 
> Your statement ist WRONG !
> Or simply another example for your poor technical understanding (or pseudo argument for your gain).
> ...


I have no idea what you did to your shifters but mine don't have any gap like yours. None of them! Yours must have been stored or transported wrong so that they got out of shape. Or you didn't re-install the white back part correct after you opened them. There is a snap-in part which when in place keeps the parts attached to each other.On your shifters this is obviously not the case and therefore that opening. Such a gap is definitely bad and will let dirt and water enter...but that's definitely NOT what the shifters usually look like. I rode mine in dirt, on salted roads in heavy rain and even in snowfall....i washed my bikes several times...the shifters still work as slick as new. No dirt or water in there at all!


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## d.janci (Feb 11, 2010)

Could anyone post a picture of internals?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Yeah yeah.... its always the other guy's fault... he musta tampered with them or something, it couldn't possibly be he's telling the truth about the SEC shifters.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Yeah yeah.... its always the other guy's fault... he musta tampered with them or something, it couldn't possibly be he's telling the truth about the SEC shifters.


The shifters don't have such an opening! So i tried to find an explanation of what could have caused it. I know he opened them so i guess he didn't re-install that one internal part correctly which then could have caused this opening.


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## xcatax (Mar 26, 2009)

a.m said:


> Nino, any Sram X0 compatible 10s shifters yet?


No response :skep:


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

quax said:


> sweet, intended or not, leaving the impression that there are actually guys recommending these shifters in that thread.
> 
> There are 5 guys commenting on their experience with these shifters (actually only 4 because 1 reports of the 9s) shifter. Not one really positive when compared to the function of other twisters. So far I've only found one postive comment on them and that's from you, well, and you're selling them. We'll se what the verdict of the long-term test of that site is.
> 
> Period, just sharing that. This is still a discussion forum and not a market place.


Ding ding ding. We have a winner.

Nino, stop using the forum as a venue to peddle your stuff. Last warning.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

nino said:


> The shifters don't have such an opening!


They have and its a constructional issue. Has nothing to do with environmental effects, storage, temperature, latitude, phase of the moon, wind direction, a great good morning bowel movement or something else.


nino said:


> So i tried to find an explanation of what could have caused it. I know he opened them


Thats right.


nino said:


> so i guess he didn't re-install that one internal part correctly which then could have caused this opening.


Thats BS ! (and you know that)
and if you (or others here?) want, I make later some pics from NEW shifter out of the box which shows the same gap.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

checky said:


> Thats BS ! (and you know that)


Dito!

Shown below the shifter as it is when new.

Second image shows the inside of the shifter with that white plastic part installed correctly.That's what is holding everything in place.

In the third image you see the white plastic removed which allows the shifter to be opened. With that white part installed correct the parts *can't move out at all*.

The last pic shows the installation of that white part. Only if that part is not correctly inserted and snapped into place the shifter can form such an opening you showed above. Otherwise it must have been deformed badly during storage or transportation.


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

xcatax said:


> No response :skep:


Well, why don't you and _a.m. _read the entire thread to see if the 10 speed twist shifter will work with a SRAM X.0 rear derailleur or not. :madman:

Now, if you want to talk about SRAM XX which is an entirely different rear derailleur.....

Again - read the entire thread as no response was needed with regard to X.0 and a 10 speed twist shifter.

BB


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## xcatax (Mar 26, 2009)

BruceBrown said:


> Well, why don't you and _a.m. _read the entire thread to see if the 10 speed twist shifter will work with a SRAM X.0 rear derailleur or not. :madman:
> 
> Now, if you want to talk about SRAM XX which is an entirely different rear derailleur.....
> 
> ...


People asking for news , theres one month without any response of sram versions .
We can ask for news or not?

*Compatible with "Shimano" 3 x 9 / 2 x 9 drivetrains
(for SRAM drivetrains available soon)*

soon ?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

BruceBrown said:


> Well, why don't you and _a.m. _read the entire thread to see if the 10 speed twist shifter will work with a SRAM X.0 rear derailleur or not. :madman:
> 
> Now, if you want to talk about SRAM XX which is an entirely different rear derailleur.....
> 
> ...


I am trying to get 10s Grip-shifters for both XX AND X.0 rear derailleurs.

BUT the problem is that with the current shifters there isn't enough meat to have the wider notches done needed for SRAM.So they need to have a different mold/shifter to adapt for SRAM.I'm still trying to find a lightweight solution but it isn't as easy as i had thought at first.


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## xcatax (Mar 26, 2009)

nino said:


> I am trying to get 10s Grip-shifters for both XX AND X.0 rear derailleurs.
> 
> BUT the problem is that with the current shifters there isn't enough meat to have the wider notches done needed for SRAM.So they need to have a different mold/shifter to adapt for SRAM.I'm still trying to find a lightweight solution but it isn't as easy as i had thought at first.


 Thank you


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

And remember kids, the new SRAM compatible shifters will be made out of high-grade spamdium whenever nino gets around to posting about them.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> And remember kids, the new SRAM compatible shifters will be made out of high-grade spamdium whenever nino gets around to posting about them.


Absolutely correct!
I sure will post them in here as this will be an item people are eagerly waiting for. If YOU would have something useable to contribute for us weight-weenies feel free to do so...


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> And remember kids, the new SRAM compatible shifters will be made out of high-grade spamdium whenever nino gets around to posting about them.


*ALSO* don't forget that Nino doesn't like/care for SRAM XX or X-series dérailleurs..:nono: 
I'll wait for SRAM to come out with a 10 speed grip-shifter that performs at the 
quality level of the current XO 9 speed...Performance 1st...Weight 2nd...:thumbsup:​


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

nino said:


> Absolutely correct!
> I sure will post them in here as this will be an item people are eagerly waiting for. If YOU would have something useable to contribute for us weight-weenies feel free to do so...


Ignoring of course you've just gotten your last warning not to do that crap again. And you'll then act all shocked and surprised when they suspend your account for couple months.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Ignoring of course you've just gotten your last warning not to do that crap again. And you'll then act all shocked and surprised when they suspend your account for couple months.


You're only input is about some BS regarding regulations and others...why not just keep it topic related? I already contacted the moderators about your concerns and i don't see where i made any faults-sorry! But i'm sure you will continue now and explain us in all details what it is all about but honestly-we would prefer the topic continues on the shifters not on your personal flamewar against me, ok? peace.

Back to topic-as soon as i get to know more about a possible solution regarding 10s shifters for SRAM i'll let you guys know for sure.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Regulations you refuse to follow, or even acknowledge that they apply to you. Regulations the rest of us can follow however. I am gonna laugh my head off for weeks when mtbr's mods finally say "enough" and kick your arse to the curb. But yeah, keep complaining about others posting actual facts about SEC's production and quality control, and keep going on and on about how I'm not contributing anything that's helping you sell your products on this forum. I'm sure there will always be fools in here eager to be parted from their money.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

> Actually wanted to order them but then found a long thread on these shifters in the major German weight weenies forum .


Have you seen the picture in post 109 of the forum ?
I think the adjuster is broken and as I understand it right in post 121 someone told about the same problem.


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

Rumor mill says SRAM is coming out with their own 10 speed twisters FWIW.


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

AZ.MTNS said:


> Rumor mill says SRAM is coming out with their own 10 speed twisters FWIW.


Yeah, I'm hearing the same..They may weigh a bit more (than SEC whatever) but if they have the performance of the XO's...Well that's all a good thing...Much better than these lighter units with iffy performance...Plus the SEC look like something off a Wally World bike.

If Nino wasn't selling the SEC shifters, he'd still be knocking them as he did with there original attempt with 10 speed grippers a few years back.

Get ready for the stomping of midget feet.​


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

checky said:


> Have you seen the picture in post 109 of the forum ?
> I think the adjuster is broken and as I understand it right in post 121 someone told about the same problem.


Checky-serious question:
are you sure you guys got the correct 10s shifters? Might it not be possible that you got those special "Recon" 9s/10s shifters? I have no idea why you guys have such problems and it would be an easy explanation to your shifting issues. The "Recon" shifters have 9s spacing but 10 gears...so it won't be exact for most of the gears on regular 10s cassettes. Reading your comments and also that of the guy "georgyj" on the Light-Bikes forum might have to do with having the wrong style shifters...don't you think that might be possible? If you guys have those "wrong" shifters it would only be logical that some gears work and some not.

That a guy breaks the adjuster is not really the shifters fault.If you unscrew the adjuster completely it might happen that the last bit of thread comes off....But if you have to tension your cable that much you should have tensioned it more while installing it, don't you think? Anyway - the positive comments from guys like Tailor-ch that did 600km during their biking vacations in italy go unnoticed. It just shows that some have great experience while only a couple have issues which i really think might have to do with having the wrong set of shifters. If those shifters are from the same german source we would have an easy explanation... Maybe even the problem with that opening in the casing might have to do with that?? I have no idea why you would have such a weird opening because it is just not possible when i look at the ones i have here. BUT if they have a special design for those Recon shifters it might differ slightly which might be the reason that they don't fit well. Anyway- i am just trying to figure out what might be wrong there.

An easy test would be to try them on a 9s cassette. If they do good on 9s then that would be proof they are the wrong set of shifters for regular 10s cassettes...


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## STS (Jun 24, 2004)

as user of the SEC shifters, I can say I don't apreciate any difference in performance with the sram attack I have in my other bike.

I don't have any gap as shown in the picture some post ago

They work and weight almost 100g less than sram gripshifters
that's enough for me

the only downside is they look cheaper than sram ones


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

nino said:


> I* already contacted the moderators* about your concerns and *i don't see where i made any faults*-sorry! .


This might just bite you in the ass...

"_*i don't see where i made any faults*_".....Maybe you'll get the full size picture this time!!!


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

where can i by this shifter ?


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

fastback67 said:


> where can i by this shifter ?


google luckynino


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

Thanks, but find it at a real shop in the meantime.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

nino said:


> Checky-serious question:
> are you sure you guys got the correct 10s shifters? Might it not be possible that you got those special "Recon" 9s/10s shifters?


Nino, serious question: are you kidding me ? :yesnod:



nino said:


> I have no idea why you guys have such problems


 As mentioned before: I know that: you have no idea how exactly current shifting systems work, because you ride shifter from 15 years ago and thats not enough: you ride recon cassettes which also perform very bad compared with XTR.
Its not your fault, its just your nescience.



nino said:


> ...and it would be an easy explanation to your shifting issues. The "Recon" shifters have 9s spacing but 10 gears...so it won't be exact for most of the gears on regular 10s cassettes.
> ...


If you mean that really serious is that another demonstration of your technical incompetence (or like always: your typical blah blah for your own profit).


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

checky said:


> Nino, serious question: are you kidding me ?


I on the other hand really doubt about some peoples wrenching capabilities. It's as simple as that.

We can leave it this way - i can live with it.

Maybe have a quick look here. My own Winterbike with the 9s shifters...


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

Missing arguments and always the same old story.

But you are right: We can leave it this way - I can live with it.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

nino said:


> I on the other hand really doubt about some peoples wrenching capabilities.


Says a man who could not setup XTR shadow properly  - over Dura Ace on a mountain bike.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

If he's so happy with what he uses... why does he insist on trying to sell it to everyone else?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Curmy said:


> Says a man who could not setup XTR shadow properly  - over Dura Ace on a mountain bike.


I had DA for years, tried the Shadow, didn't like it and went back to DA - lighter and cripser shifting. To each his own.

The video above should be proof enough that the shifters and cassette ( and DA components) perform great up and down.


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

nino said:


> Maybe have a quick look here. My own Winterbike with the 9s shifters...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A video of your *"9"* speed shifters being demonstrated on a stand hardly shows the real world 
performance of the 10 speed version that you're trying to sell....









Granted your knowledge of bikes is to be commended in high regards...But your salesman BS 
needs a lot of work...

Only time will tell if these cheap looking shifters can hold up in the real world of riding








Good luck​


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## a.m (Jun 15, 2009)

BruceBrown said:


> Well, why don't you and _a.m. _read the entire thread to see if the 10 speed twist shifter will work with a SRAM X.0 rear derailleur or not. :madman:
> 
> Now, if you want to talk about SRAM XX which is an entirely different rear derailleur.....
> 
> ...


You know, i think you shold learn some mannors and start reading the whole thread yourself! In post 11. there already is mentioned that it will be an X.0 10s shifter avalibe sooner or later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by russya
Will the sram models have the ratio of X0 or will it be the ratio of XX/Red?

I should get some samples for XX together with my 10s but plan also to get 10s for "regular" X.0 later on. I am pretty much ordering them to my needs.
I am starting with Shimano since that's what i use...

So shut the f... up! LOL


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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

Does SEC have any webpage with more details?


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Any long term reports/reviews about these SEC shifters guys? I'm looking into getting the 9sp and mate them with DA rd as what nino did.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

They shifts horrible compared to Sram shifters.
No precision in any way. You have always two or three gears which does not fit exactly. 
You are able to get exactly the same result when you deform your RD hanger a little bit :thumbsup: 
In my assemply-stand everything works nearly OK, but out on the trials very often a gear does not fit, That is very nerving. I went back to Sram.
Shifting down goes with very low power, so low, that I often shifts two gears when I want to shift only one gear. Trimming of the steel spring in the shifter makes this issue a little bit better, but cannot solve it. Additional to my other statements in this thread: After some weeks the spring damage the plastic part where the spring is positioned. Can't shift on the 22T ring anymore (edit: pics).
In german forums some people test these shifter (http://www.forum.light-bikes.de/showthread.php?t=12490&highlight=drehgriffe&page=3) and as far as I know everyone through them away after some day's or week's, both 9 and 10sp. At two shifter broke the plastic cable trimmer.

For light weight and less precision: go for them, 
for function and reliability: better by other shifters.


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks checky. Well how about the one's nobu is selling? The modified microshift shifters. Any of you guys have any long term experience with them?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Microshift is generally more reliable but as some have commented, the foam grip covers aren't the most durable. I say if they covers fail just wrap a couple layers of bar tape around it instead (cork or cloth at your own discretion). Really the LIGHTER you go on grip shifters the more fragile/less precise they often become, which is why the current X.0 shifters are about 40g/pair heavier than the all plastic (other than the metal spring, and the bar clamp bracket) and rather fragile SRT-800 X-ray shifters that SRAM marketed 16 years ago.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

my Nobu shifters worked okay for about 500 trail miles before i sold them. shifting action was not as dynamic as SRAM, quite abit lighter - so easier to miss-shift when stomping out of saddle + pulling on the bars when charging up climbs

the mechanism is quite similar to the SEC pics above but i think the quality of Microshift is higher

if i was running 10 speed now i would purchase a set of Nobu's 10 speed SRAM compatible twistshifters - for casual trail riding - not racing


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Are nobu's 10speed SRAM the exact actuation compatible cable pull, or the 1:1 compatible?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

yes, according to his text

looks like Nobu is only selling Shimano 9 speed right now but did see new 10 speed twist shifters on his ebay a short while ago

they do look alot like SEC - i would'nt recommended them for hard riding:thumbsup:



...edit to add pics + revise blah..


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I'd like to find SEC's website.


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

i eliminate my sec's: they collect mud like a hoover. cleaned the right shifter two times and i have had enough now. not worth the money for me.


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks fastback! Those pics made me lose all interest on SEC shifters.:skep: Culturesponge, were the nobus really that bad? Can't you just be conscious of them and try to avoid them when yanking on the bars? Has anyone found a mechanical solution to this? I'm planning to get the ones he's offering now on ebay and they come with rubber grips so I'm hoping they'll last longer. Still waiting for his response on shipping charges though.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Nobu's tuned 9 speed Shimano Micoshifters are alright - about the same as SRAM Attack - only problems i had was when i was riding like a spazz (racing against the clock)

alas Nobu's new 10 speed shifters look exactly like those SEC's that are open to whatever muck comes off your front wheel + have a shifting mechanism like a childs toy

best!

...edit for iphone typo(s)...


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks culturesponge! If you don't mind what was your exact rear drive setup? Cassette and RD. Thanks again! Btw, great work on your parts on scales! They've been a very useful source of info for me and I'm sure to others. Keep 'em coming!


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

might be some time before more new scales pics - sorry 

still have the tuned XTR M-972 Shadow RD, was also using an XTR M-970 11-32

no major grumbles with Nobu's 9 speed Micoshift Shimano tuned superlight twistshifters - just cannot recommend them for serious riding (racing)

best


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks again culturesponge! So the only issue with them was they were just shifting too light right? No reliability or bad shifting/skipping or smoothness problems?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

morrisgarages said:


> Thanks again culturesponge! So the only issue with them was they were just shifting too light right? No reliability or bad shifting/skipping or smoothness problems?


correct, they have a light actuation - but shift reliably

SRAM XO (or Attack) are light years ahead for performance & durability - but Nobu's 9 speed microshifters are massively lighter! :thumbsup:

best


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Oh man.:???: Decisions, decisions... Thanks again culturesponge.:thumbsup:


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

morrisgarages said:


> Oh man.:???: Decisions, decisions... Thanks again culturesponge.:thumbsup:


Go with what performs and eat the weight penalty...

You'll find somewhere else to shave grams


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Hmmmm, put the SEC shifters / recon cassette on the uberlite hardtail and knock it down to about 18.3 pounds, or put them on the Rasta 29er with the other gold annodized bits. decisions, decisions.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

morrisgarages said:


> Oh man.:???: Decisions, decisions... Thanks again culturesponge.:thumbsup:


how about this solution

use a Nobu tuned Microshifter for the front derailleur - it will work with 2 or 3 chainrings SRAM or Shimano + SRAM Attack twist shifter with some tuning mods for the rear - best of both then! :thumbsup:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Or just use thumbshifters and get flawless reliability and light weight at the same time?

Nah... too simple a solution.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

not a solution at all - not everyone likes/wants thumb shifters!

(this is a thread about Grip Shifters aka twist shifters)


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Well while Nino was always Anti-Sachs Extreme and Quartz shifters, I found they work as well as the Plasma shifters and are also damn light (about 120g/pair). They were available in 8 and 9 speed varieties. They come up on ebay now and then.


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## facelessfools (Aug 30, 2008)

so we just have to hope that the new sram stuff will be lighter?...


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

perhaps there should be a new sticky thread listing all the lightest shifter options - thumb - twist - trigger - whatever? :thumbsup:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

That would be a good idea. Either that or whoever maintains the light bikes website could like... UPDATE IT.


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## STS (Jun 24, 2004)

I'm still using the SEC 10s shifters

it's true they are not crisp and precise, but mine are still usable
the problem is there is not other 10s twist shifter compatible with shimano RD...


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks guys! I'm actually considering this set-up:
A thumbshifter for the front (like the one Mattias showed on the other thread I started) since you don't really need indexing for the front + a nobu for the rear. Sorry but I don't think I can stand using thumbies for the rear too.
Culturesponge, I'm pretty sure the left shifter of nobu is still heavier than the thumbies that Mattias has right? I like your idea of starting a sticky thread for the lightest shifter set up. Better yet, let make it the lightest drivetrain setup thread. No SS of course.


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

> morrisgaragesI like your idea of starting a sticky thread for the lightest shifter set up. Better yet, let make it the lightest drivetrain setup thread. No SS of course.



NO 1x9s/10s :nono:.............I lost 220 grams when I converted my Squishy...


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Well yes that too jake. It has to be 2x9/10. I don't think any ww uses 3 rings upfront.


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## COLINx86 (Apr 8, 2009)

morrisgarages said:


> Well yes that too jake. It has to be 2x9/10. I don't think any ww uses 3 rings upfront.


Then it's not 'lightest drivetrain setup' it's 'lightest 2x drivetrain'.

I still think 1x9/10 will continue to become way more popular now that we have 36t cassettes. I would not be surprised, if in 10 years when 11 speed xtr comes out, if the race group is 1x11 and the trail group is 2x11.


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

You are correct, for simplicity and longevity a unindexed front shifter is the best choice.

31 grams + cabling + front derailleur adds about 110 grams.

The lightest and reliable rear derailleur will be a XX and XX trigger?

XTR M980 and trigger?


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks Mattias. So what would be the best lightest unindexed front shifter out there to use with Paul's adapters? For the rear I'm thinking of the Sram XG-999 cassette, a tune dura-ace RD (like the one nino is using), and a light indexed rear shifter like the ones from nobu. What do you guys think?

PS. Mattias, I'm still waiting for a response for the email I sent about the final weight of a titanium 104bcd 4 hole 38T chainring with a chain stop "stub". Thanks.


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

morrisgarages: 
I would say Campagnolo Nuovo Record, from 70s bikes, easily found NIB in ebay för peanuts.
Then be a little creative with a lathe.
I may should make some sets for you WW guys?


PS. The chainring, the stub is easy done, I can do it, Oscar will mail you.


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## checky (Jan 13, 2006)

Magura Lock Out Lever has 18g (RS Poplock 29g). But worked only with a to TP converted race FD cause you have to play a little bit with the lenght of the adaptor to get a setup that works correctly.

Here a setup with Poplock and selfmade Matchmaker to shift 2 gears at the front:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I've thought about using my RS poplock remote that way. It would likely ok with a bottom pull road derailleur setup (they require less cable pull than mtb models). I don't bother with the lockout on my Reba at all.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

You guys crack me up. Unindexed shifting to save a few grams? That's right up there with drillium parts.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Technically left side bar end and downtube shifters, thumbshifters and most grip shifters aren't indexed. 

As to the right side shifter... those of us who road bikes pre-index shifting don't have a problem riding bikes without it. I don't need no gear display either to tell me what gear I'm in.


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## NVIbex (Sep 18, 2006)

Yeah, I sure want one of those :madman:


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

DeeEight said:


> Technically left side bar end and downtube shifters, thumbshifters and most grip shifters aren't indexed.
> 
> As to the right side shifter... those of us who road bikes pre-index shifting don't have a problem riding bikes without it. I don't need no gear display either to tell me what gear I'm in.


Pfft. Road bikes. Road bikes need one gear only at most anyway. 

I ain't hunting for proper gear while bouncing on the rocks..


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

sorry typo on my part... that should have been RODE bikes.... 

I started biking in the era before indexing, and my first mountain bike had friction thumbshifters. There's no hunting involved... you shift until your legs tell you you're in the right gear. And you listen to the noise the chain is making. To those of us who learned this way, its just instinctive to get the shifts off as fast as indexed setups.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

DeeEight said:


> . To those of us who learned this way, its just instinctive to get the shifts off as fast as indexed setups.


No it is not, not even close - I have done plenty of miles with thumb shifters - and I will go terminaly demented before I use'em again. Absolutely no reason whatsoever.

Unless of course you ride paved bikes paths or restore musuem quality bikes.


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## snowdrifter (Aug 2, 2006)

Curmy said:


> You guys crack me up. Unindexed shifting to save a few grams? That's right up there with drillium parts.


Friction front would be cool, allows for nice trim:thumbsup:


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

snowdrifter said:


> Friction front would be cool, allows for nice trim:thumbsup:


+1 You don't need indexing for the front. It's a different thing for the rear though. I love my indexing and want it to stay on my bike.:thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*thumbs down*



Curmy said:


> No it is not, not even close - I have done plenty of miles with thumb shifters - and I will go terminaly demented before I use'em again. Absolutely no reason whatsoever.
> 
> Unless of course you ride paved bikes paths or restore musuem quality bikes.


+1 ...i really don't want to resurrect "nostalgic" memories of the merdé anchient (pre & post WW2!) steel frame rigid bikes with thumbies + sturmy archer internal 3 gear rear hubs that we used to ride on farm trails when i was a bored kid stuck in the sticks

...but if makes your ego feel better that your shifters are lighter than my trusty old twisters - then power to you :thumbsup:


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Guys, from what I've researched in other forums and here. It seems that no one has ever really trashed/destroyed a pair of nobus. Never seen a pair in the same state at the secs filled with mud that are posted here. They (users of nobus) all seem to say that you either live with it or just sell it. So can this be an indication that they're pretty tough (with the rubber grips of course) to be used out in the real world of rocks, mud, and sticks?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

g'wan then! 

i really missed my old set of Nobu's when i realized here that i could've mixed 'n' matched them with an XO R/H twister & saved about 30g-40g :smilewinkgrin:

Nobu is a nice peeps too, he'd probably use the money to weenie his sl mtn bikes


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks culturesponge! I'm really doing my research first and thinking about it hard coz my bike budget is really tight as of the moment. Saving up for some Lightning Cranks!


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

argh! i understand the frustration now - hold on till you've bagged the Lightning's (sans graphics?) then you'll be able to breathe easier :thumbsup:


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Exactly what's keeping me from clicking on the Buy It Now of the nobus! Yup, I hate those tacky Lighting logos on their cranks. I actually even requested if they can make one with UD carbon optics. Too bad they don't make it. Lightning cranks are light and stiff and made in the USA but they sure look like some cheap Taiwanese carbon copies.:skep: Sorry for the OT. Anyway, will continue researching and losing sleep over the best lightweight shifters out there. I'm pretty sure if sram comes out with the new xx gripshifts they'd still be a lot heavier than what nobu is offering.


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## facelessfools (Aug 30, 2008)

morrisgarages said:


> I'm pretty sure if sram comes out with the new xx gripshifts they'd still be a lot heavier than what nobu is offering.


but i believe they will be lighter then the current x0 and offer better performance... i hope :yesnod:


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## jlalou (Jun 1, 2007)

I've been looking at the Recon 10 speed shifter option (as posted on the Recon thread), read through this thread, and looks like I'll stay far away from the Recon shifters!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but for a cheap 10 speed option, I can get the Recon 10 speed 11-36 cassette (to work with 9 speed drivetrain) and modify my X.0 shifters by drilling an extra notch in the casing?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

You are correct.


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## jlalou (Jun 1, 2007)

Thanks DeeEight. 

{Will the durability on the titanium cassette be a lot better than the aluminium? The alu cassettes sound scary. Maybe I should just stick to 2x9. But that 11-36 looks so tempting!}

Ok, forget about it, I checked all the details properly already now.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Well the Al cassettes are really racing only, figure you'll get a few months of competition usage out of the thing, depending on how much/what sort of conditions you race in. Sand or mud with a high clay content would be bad. Also depends what gear you tend to park in a lot on the cassette. SRAM's XX cassettes use a Al granny cog and the 36T ones I've seen on a friend's 29er has actually shown less tooth wear than the rest of the steel cogs on the cassette. 

Titanium cassettes typically need replacing every couple seasons, depending of course on your mileage. If you're a 10k/year rider, you're better off using a steel cassette for everything except racing, and only then switching to the lighter one. Also depends on the extent you might be a bike whore. If you're like me, with 10 bikes to pick from, nothing ever amasses more than 500kms of usage a season.


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## stig (Jan 20, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> You are correct.


So, you have had hand's on experience with these shifters? Can you offer a more detailed review of their performance?


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

well after reading all four pages of this, I would say the SEC's are out. It's now a toss-up for 9 speed between the nobu's and the attack's. pretty much more reliable and a little heavier with the attack's and lighter for the nobu's but less precise. Hmmm...isn't this always the case when looking to lighter other components 

B.T.W. where can you purchase these nobu shifters as googling them only turns up picks of them on bikes.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

http://myworld.ebay.com/nobu335/

i've Nobu's & Attacks

Attacks were a better fit for my hands with XO shifter grips rather than the "Amy" they come with & the springs in the Attacks were flimsier than in XO shifters

Nobu's Microshifters i think work best with rapid rise rear derailleurs - still alright though with a SGS Shadow RD

SEC shifters need a re-design to keep muck out!


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## 1415chris (Mar 21, 2009)

Look for nobu335
https://cgi.ebay.com/Light-Weight-G...Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item20b4638408

I bought my ones with foam and rubber grips.

The rubber ones used with gloves only since Apr this year:



With foam came with 92g ish, after replacing for alu bolts 91.2g and I have treated not good looking grey plastic by black spray.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

1415chris said:


> The rubber ones used with gloves only since Apr this year




looks like you need some fresh grips - Nobu's current batch have black rubber on a black plastic shifter - much better

how are the Nobu Microshifters?


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## 1415chris (Mar 21, 2009)

They were nice and lighter 





The black ones look better indeed.

As was said above do not recommend them for racing, plenty of miss schifting, during the fast descent you shift down and have to correct gears when you need to push the pedals.
Slightly better performance when adjusted the 'spring', but still nowhere even close to the shifters I was ridding before xtr rf.

Now I'm going to switch to xx with huge weight penalty of 50g for the shifters, cassette and r dlr


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

1415chris said:


> Now I'm going to switch to xx with huge weight penalty of 50g for the shifters, cassette and r dlr


:eekster: blimey!

but once you've weight tuned everything i bet you can get that 50g into almost nothing

really dissapointed at how long its taking sram to get 10 speed twistshifters on the market - they don't normally drag their knuckles as badly (spring apparently?) - so at the rate your going through grips they might be on the market just in time 

.
.



here's a pic i took comparing sram '09 Attack with '09 sram XO twistshifter springs - not so clear really, but the XO spring is thicker/stiffer


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

Thanks for the link, however, from reading the post from chris, they don't seem too convincing to spend the money. I'm just so used to my xt trigger shifter that is tuned and weighs like 102 grams. I think I would be very disappointed if the shifting was not even close to this. I mean I could deal with accidentally shifting but not when the gears shift by themselves. NOT GOOD:nono:


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## opodden (Oct 27, 2004)

*My experience with SEC 9 speed XTR and 10 speed XX*

I first got the SEC 9 speed SEC for my XTR Shadow equipped bike. It was very easy to adjust the cable tension for very, very crisp and precise shifts. The same was the case for the front 3 speed shifter. I also liked that I could see which gear I had chosen without looking at the cassette, and that I could jump across several gear to the one I wanted.The weight was 96-97 grams on my scale including cables.
Then I bought a new bike with Sram XX. I bought SEC shifters for this bike as well, because of the advantages mentioned above. But the shifters I got were a bit differen. They lacked the grey band and , most importantly, there wasn't any indexing with numbers. And the weight was up to 27. I couldn't get the shifters exchanged in a hurry, so I mounted them anyway. Unfortunately, they were nowhere as good as the other type. The whole shifter is more flimsy, and twisting hard will create a gap between the two halves. I have not been able to get the rear derailleur to shift well, and it will skip gears when shifting and jump a gear when pedalling out of the saddle. I don't think the difference in shifting is very noticeable between XX and XTR rear derailleurs with trigger shifters.

So my conclusion is:
The SEC 9 speed Shimano shifter with grey band and indexing from 1-9 is very good.:thumbsup:
The SEC 10 speed Sram XX in all black with only H and L indexing is not good at all.


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