# Trek 29+ coming



## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

Saw a picture today. I am not sure if I can post it. Swamped at work, so I will give quick impressions.
Frame looks aluminum. Driveside chainstay is elevated. Looks like it has sliders
Rims are new to me. Never seen them before. I can't tell much detail from the pic.
Squishy Manitou fork
Geo looks short and slack.


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

The rims in question are Mulefut 50s

The bike looks sick, it should be at Sea Otter


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

you're welcome

looks like slack head angle and SUPER short chainstays, pretty sick


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## TheDwayyo (Dec 2, 2014)

Trek just won't let any fad go without testing the waters, will they? Looks cool, I'm intrigued.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

Stopbreakindown said:


> The rims in question are Mulefut 50s
> 
> The bike looks sick, it should be at Sea Otter


I thought they might be the Mulefet 50s, but I couldn't tell for sure. 
The bikes I saw were a greenish rigid one with a carbon fork, and a purple hardtail with standard seat post. It looks like they will have several options.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

I want that fork, I want that fork, I want that fork......for my Krampus. Did I mention I wanted that fork?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Interesting indeed. Elevated chainstay means belt drive compatible without splitting the frame. Also looks like some sort of sliding dropout for SS duty.

They're covering all the bases!


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

TitanofChaos said:


> you're welcome
> 
> looks like slack head angle and SUPER short chainstays, pretty sick
> 
> View attachment 981457


 The elevated CS is to accommodate the shorter CS length. Looks like adjustable dropouts is integrated with the derailleur hanger.
I wonder how much travel and the HT angle.
Great looking bike!


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## johnnyspoke (Sep 15, 2005)

I've heard that it will be a new model in the "Stache" lineup.


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## 202cycle (Dec 6, 2006)

A bunch of these already shipped. The entry level one at least with the rigid fork. They use the Stranglehold rear drop out which works very well on the Superfly SS. I'm ordering one tomorrow.


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

temporoad said:


> I want that fork, I want that fork, I want that fork......for my Krampus. Did I mention I wanted that fork?


The pic I have shows the fork from an angle that it has plenty of clearance for mud.


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## bberck (Sep 1, 2011)

LBS just posted he will have some tomorrow. Hopefully weather holds out for our weekly ride/cookout so we can test ride one.


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## Clink (Oct 29, 2006)

1. What are they called?
2. What's the bets not available in the UK, just like the Superfly ss :-(


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## 202cycle (Dec 6, 2006)

This just looks like a fun bike. I may have to part with my Superfly SS.


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

TitanofChaos said:


> you're welcome
> 
> looks like slack head angle and SUPER short chainstays, pretty sick
> 
> View attachment 981457


Looks like a Yelli Screamy!


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

This looks pretty cool. Interesting that on the current Stache, the seat tube is sculpted for tire clearance, but the tire still is pretty far back. Here, they used the clearance to slam the wheel forward. Nice! Too bad I just blew my bike fund on a new fat frame...


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## cobba (Apr 5, 2007)

Trek Stache 9 specs:

__
http://instagr.am/p/1gSgRKwU3z/


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## deuxdiesel (Jan 14, 2007)

Yawn. They had the opportunity (since they are so late to the "+" party) to create something unique, but are just following the herd now. Imagine how cool a "+" version of the Sawyer, with a swoopy steel frame plus modern geometry would have been?


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I think they did a pretty good job--the elevated chainstay and super short chainstays are new in the market. The 29+ party isn't exactly raging, so I'm glad to see a big manufacturer step up.



deuxdiesel said:


> Yawn. They had the opportunity (since they are so late to the "+" party) to create something unique, but are just following the herd now. Imagine how cool a "+" version of the Sawyer, with a swoopy steel frame plus modern geometry would have been?


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## TheDwayyo (Dec 2, 2014)

Just saw these in the computer at work... Many models are shipping now. This is the new Stache lineup, all 29+.


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## bob_m (May 17, 2013)

I don't see anything on the trek web site yet?


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

Here is a good summation of what we know so far about the Stache 29+ Lineup

http://wp.me/p5WtOq-e


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## jnroyal (Sep 25, 2008)

It's great to see another 29+ bike available as it should help guarantee tire production for us Krampus owners 5-10 years down the road. But I have no interest in PFBB's or Boost spacing so I'll pass on this one and dream of something like a Nimble 9+ with Dirt Wizards.


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## TheDwayyo (Dec 2, 2014)

bob_m said:


> I don't see anything on the trek web site yet?


Ya it's odd; they didn't update the regular website but they did update the dealer site.


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## pulsepro (Sep 13, 2007)

Anyone know what the MSRP on these will be?


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## sslos (Jan 6, 2004)

deuxdiesel said:


> Yawn. They had the opportunity (since they are so late to the "+" party) to create something unique, but are just following the herd now. Imagine how cool a "+" version of the Sawyer, with a swoopy steel frame plus modern geometry would have been?


http://forums.mtbr.com/27-29/trek-29-coming-963127.html

Sooo... A bike that weighs 40lbs.?

Los


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## mattgVT (Nov 9, 2010)

Full details are now up on Treks website...


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## Puzman (Apr 1, 2004)

Trek Stache 9 - Review - Pinkbike


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## deuxdiesel (Jan 14, 2007)

sslos said:


> http://forums.mtbr.com/27-29/trek-29-coming-963127.html
> 
> Sooo... A bike that weighs 40lbs.?
> 
> Los


Yep. The + movement isn't about the fastest XC bike, but comfort and traction. No way it would be 40 pounds, but a 30 pound steel frame front suspension 29 + is easily attainable.


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## BATRG3 (Dec 11, 2012)

Now if only they could offer a 29+ hardtail at the price point of the 29+ rigid or 29" Stache 7, I might be able to afford on in this lifetime.


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## pearl-drum-man (Sep 3, 2012)

I like the new bike, but am glad that I just got the regular 2015 Stache 7. I wonder if the regular Stache will go away now. As of now they list both versions on their site.


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## ebnelson (Oct 30, 2006)

The Pinkbike review states 28.5lbs not 40lbs.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

Aw Sh*t, 29+ jumped the shark. They'll be in WalMart next! ;-)


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

deuxdiesel said:


> Imagine how cool a "+" version of the Sawyer, with a swoopy steel frame plus modern geometry would have been?


I would like that.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

$1760 for the pretty basic spec on the Stache 5 isn't a deal that's sending me scrambling to my local Trek store. Nice looking frame, though, and 420mm chainstays on a 29+ bike is amazing.


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## AOK (Jan 25, 2004)

jnroyal said:


> It's great to see another 29+ bike available as it should help guarantee tire production for us Krampus owners 5-10 years down the road. But I have no interest in PFBB's or Boost spacing so I'll pass on this one and dream of something like a Nimble 9+ with Dirt Wizards.


+1. No interest in PF or boost.

Good to see a big player jump into 29+ though. I figured this was coming after the Chupacabra came out.

Wonder if anyone has tried 29+ in a nimble with the drops all the way back?


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Am I the only one here who thinks they should have kept the normal Stache?


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

CannondaleF9 said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks they should have kept the normal Stache?


They're still available


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## pearl-drum-man (Sep 3, 2012)

r1Gel said:


> They're still available


For now at least, remains to be seen if they will carry on into the next MY.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

I got to check out the 9 in person last night, sick bike, didn't throw it on the scale but around 28-32# sounds right


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

deuxdiesel said:


> Yawn. They had the opportunity (since they are so late to the "+" party) to create something unique, but are just following the herd now. Imagine how cool a "+" version of the Sawyer, with a swoopy steel frame plus modern geometry would have been?


I'm working on this with my sawyer, 29+ requires new dropouts, I'm going to go b+, skip machining new dropouts and keep the same geometry

Sadly I'll miss out on all the cool new forks with it's straight headtube


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## backcountryeti (May 21, 2004)

The Stache 5 is sharp! 

I do agree the Sawyer+ would be amazing! I've never ridden one, but always liked the way it looked.


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## vemeno (Nov 27, 2010)

Geo chart on the trek website shows seat angle is below 70 degrees! Is that meant to be an effective angle? If so, I wonder how is super slack seat tube combined with super short stays going to work on steep seated climbs..


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

I don't understand why they couldn't do this geo on the original Stache. That chainstay is crazy short!


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

vemeno said:


> Geo chart on the trek website shows seat angle is below 70 degrees! Is that meant to be an effective angle? If so, I wonder how is super slack seat tube combined with super short stays going to work on steep seated climbs..


I noticed that too, I think they are measuring this angle from the BB to the clamp rather than the actual angle the seat post will be at, the seat post is definitely not more straight up than the head tube in person


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

seat_boy said:


> $1760 for the pretty basic spec on the Stache 5 isn't a deal that's sending me scrambling to my local Trek store. Nice looking frame, though, and 420mm chainstays on a 29+ bike is amazing.


They are on par (I think about $100 less) with the Krampus as far a price, and I am sure it's considerable lighter. Tubeless should be easier since it comes wit tubeless ready tires and rims. I was able to get my Krampus barely under 30 lbs. with single speed conversion, Chupacabras tubeless and carbon fork. The tires alone are $120 each. It makes the 5 look like a decent deal.


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## appleSSeed (Dec 29, 2003)

I can't see why people are complaining? This is what the original Stache should have been. Amazing geometry and decent price. Hell, Yelli is pretty expensive for a frame with similar geo but not the same tire clearance.

I have a custom Walt 29+ with sub 17" chainstays and it's amazing. People are going to love this bike! Plus the suspension fork option, great rims, great tires etc. 

Only complain I see is the boost and pressfit bb, but boost is sort of necessary for short chainstays and huge tires. I did an offset frame to make it work with a 142x12 on my personal frame.

I'm stoked on these. Looks like Trek has been getting a few things right for once. All the fat tires have been great. The rims are nice and set up tubeless (WITH BEAD LOCK) and geo has been on point. Big cups! 

As for the 29+ Sawyer thing, look into custom! Oddity Cycles makes amazing frames that are steel and sawyer like.


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## SyT (Jul 27, 2005)

After spending three years on a bike whose stay length is adjustable from 16.25 to 17.25, 16.5 is shorter than I found to be (for me) optimum. Beyond that, I think this thing is killer and like the aesthetics more than those of my Krampus.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

Here is more on the Bontrager TLR 29+ wheels that were obviously designed around the Chupacabra tires. It's interesting that they didn't have these ready when the Stache line was finalized, but maybe it would have made the complete bikes cost hundreds more than they already do. 
https://ridealongside.wordpress.com/2015/04/17/more-on-the-29plus-wheels-from-bontrager-wheelworks/


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

appleSSeed said:


> I can't see why people are complaining? This is what the original Stache should have been. Amazing geometry and decent price. Hell, Yelli is pretty expensive for a frame with similar geo but not the same tire clearance.
> 
> I have a custom Walt 29+ with sub 17" chainstays and it's amazing. People are going to love this bike! Plus the suspension fork option, great rims, great tires etc.
> 
> ...


I'm complaining because most likely they won't offer a factory build 29er non plus.
I want the Stache but one that has real 29er wheels, and something that costs less than $2k and has front suspension.
I am not paying $2500 for a Stache, that's insane! I would rather buy an Instinct for a couple hundred more.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

Captain_America1976 said:


> They are on par (I think about $100 less) with the Krampus as far a price, and I am sure it's considerable lighter. Tubeless should be easier since it comes wit tubeless ready tires and rims. I was able to get my Krampus barely under 30 lbs. with single speed conversion, Chupacabras tubeless and carbon fork. The tires alone are $120 each. It makes the 5 look like a decent deal.


Agreed.


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## Dan GSR (Apr 29, 2010)

I guess if more ppl rode short stay bikes they'd be freaking out like me. This looks like the perfect hardtail to me.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

The Stache 5 looks way better in person than in the Trek stock photo!

http://wp.me/p5WtOq-o


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

Super excited about these. All my current 29+ gear is for sale.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Dan GSR said:


> I guess if more ppl rode short stay bikes they'd be freaking out like me. This looks like the perfect hardtail to me.


405mm with 29" wheels looks really short, maybe too short. 
I'll wait to see if anyone reviews this bike with standard 29" wheels, maybe it would be an okay bike. It looks like the BB is kind of high with the + tires, so maybe standard 29" tires will lower the BB a little bit and improve the handling.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I wonder how many frame sets they will sell? I can't imagine there are that many people with extra pairs of Boost wheels laying around.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

Anyway to add spacers to a 12x142 to fit the boost spacing?


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

Just had a quick test of the Stache 9. Likely a great ride for people who are people sized. At 6'6" I found the XL to very small. The demo folks also did not set it up tubeless which seemed silly. Aside from that no complaints from me. 

I was hoping it would be my 29+ SS to counterbalance my ECR but no so. Maybe a Krampus with a carbon fork is in the works?


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

seat_boy said:


> I wonder how many frame sets they will sell? I can't imagine there are that many people with extra pairs of Boost wheels laying around.


I forgot that the new Stache requires a new hub that no one makes.
That would make 29er wheel builds quite difficult.


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## Dan GSR (Apr 29, 2010)

i9 and dtswiss


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## BATRG3 (Dec 11, 2012)

CannondaleF9 said:


> 405mm with 29" wheels looks really short, maybe too short.
> I'll wait to see if anyone reviews this bike with standard 29" wheels, maybe it would be an okay bike. It looks like the BB is kind of high with the + tires, so maybe standard 29" tires will lower the BB a little bit and improve the handling.


I think the 405mm is only possible if a 650B+ wheel is installed in place of the 29+. I believe that is part of an intended modularity. That may be partly why the BB is so high.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

BATRG3 said:


> I think the 405mm is only possible if a 650B+ wheel is installed in place of the 29+. I believe that is part of an intended modularity. That may be partly why the BB is so high.


But 650+ has roughly the same outer diameter as a 29" so wouldn't they be able to have the same chainstay length?


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

I'm guessing the 29 and 27.5+ can be set as short as 405 and the 29+ at 420. Guess you could always set the smaller tires at 420 if you like the longer stays better.


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## CGrr (Aug 30, 2010)

I think the new Stache 5 looks like a hit. Read about it on Thursday and ran to the bike shop on Saturday to see if they had any yet. Not yet. If it feels right to me I'll probably get one.


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## blunderbuss (Jan 11, 2004)

TuTone T said:


> Anyway to add spacers to a 12x142 to fit the boost spacing?


No, it's a totally different standard, wider shell. Unlike 135qr and 142x12 which are actually the same, only the frame interface is different, so that switching between the two is just a matter of endcaps.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

blunderbuss said:


> No, it's a totally different standard, wider shell. Unlike 135qr and 142x12 which are actually the same, only the frame interface is different, so that switching between the two is just a matter of endcaps.


Yup. I was thinking about it some more and the real issue comes from the fact that the brakes are positioned differently. Even if you swapped axles and caps, your rotor wouldn't line up.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

Yea, 405mm is too short for me no matter what tire size. The Krampus is a bike that can climb some pretty steep loose terrain because the CS is the length it is in conjunction with the 29+. Personally, I wouldn't want to give up the ability to do crazy seated climbing....but then again I am 6'4" with a higher seat than most which brings my weight back farther. 
CS length is such a personal preference, but I think it also has to do with a person's height. With that said, there are plenty of riders on this forum who are tall and love short CSs. 
I'd be willing to try it out, but would like a shorter fork to steepen the HA and lower the BB a little. The bike does look pretty damn good!


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## jeffreyjhsu (Jun 22, 2004)

It's on the trek website now. Stache - Trek Bicycle


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Complaining about new bike prices is old hat around mtbr, but at almost $3900 for a hardtail AL bike, I got to say that top-o-the-line bike seems to me to be about $900 overpriced. The Stache 7 is about $500 over. The Stache 5 is $200-300 over. And the frame only is about $200 over. I understand that Trek has a lot of new parts/standards invested in this model, and I really love the bike on paper, but still...

If I recall right, the first year the Farley came out it was about $2700. The next year model a nearly identical Farley was $1700.


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

Hey guys I thought I'd share this video to spread the Stache 29+ stoke. First off a disclaimer, I work for Trek and have been working on the Stache 29+ project for the last couple of years so you could say I'm a little biased. I also stay out of the forum chit chat for the most part but I'm just so excited about the Stache! I'd also be happy to help answer any questions you have about the platform.

This is a video of me riding my Stache 29+ in Santa Cruz last week before Sea Otter. Just for referance everyone else on the ride was on a 5" carbon FS bike...

Enjoy!


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

Thanks for sharing [TA]. I'm super stoked on the bike. Hopefully I'll be riding mine next week.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

[TA] said:


> Hey guys I thought I'd share this video to spread the Stache 29+ stoke. First off a disclaimer, I work for Trek and have been working on the Stache 29+ project for the last couple of years so you could say I'm a little biased. I also stay out of the forum chit chat for the most part but I'm just so excited about the Stache! I'd also be happy to help answer any questions you have about the platform.
> 
> This is a video of me riding my Stache 29+ in Santa Cruz last week before Sea Otter. Just for referance everyone else on the ride was on a 5" carbon FS bike...
> 
> Enjoy!


It looks nice, sure, but just not the same as a real Stache, and for the money I would much rather buy a full squish bike.
But can you say if Trek will make a stock 29er Stache for 2016 or not?


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

As far as I know the previous Stache will no longer be produced after the 2015 model year. As mentioned earlier in this tread the new Stache can be setup with standard 29" wheels, this setup works especially well with a 130-140mm fork, making for a real AM hardtail. I do encourage you to try the new 29+ bike. The Chupacabra tire is incredibly fast rolling and the increased volume and low pressure adds capability to the Stache that would be impossible with standard 29" tires. There's no way I'd try and ride the USCS trails with a 29x2.35 tire on a hardtail. At the end of the day the goal of the 2016 Stache was to push the trail hardtail to the next level and I for one feel that we met that goal. We knew couldn't please everyone with the new bike, but perhaps it's best to try the new bike and our 29+ tire before you decide you don't like it.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

[TA] said:


> As far as I know the previous Stache will no longer be produced after the 2015 model year. As mentioned earlier in this tread the new Stache can be setup with standard 29" wheels, this setup works especially well with a 130-140mm fork, making for a real AM hardtail. I do encourage you to try the new 29+ bike. The Chupacabra tire is incredibly fast rolling and the increased volume and low pressure adds capability to the Stache that would be impossible with standard 29" tires. There's no way I'd try and ride the USCS trails with a 29x2.35 tire on a hardtail. At the end of the day the goal of the 2016 Stache was to push the trail hardtail to the next level and I for one feel that we met that goal. We knew couldn't please everyone with the new bike, but perhaps it's best to try the new bike and our 29+ tire before you decide you don't like it.


I'll certainly demo a new Stache as soon as possible, as well as some true fatbikes to see how they ride in the summer. But the biggest problem I see with it is the price. I don't want a fully rigid bike so I would opt for the 7. The thing is I could spend a couple hundred more and buy a full suspension bike. The old Stache was reasonably priced and that was a big reason why I liked it. 
And the Stache frameset is a good $100 more than the Niner ROS9 frame. 
I am no doubt a huge Trek fan but I'm disappointed, but maybe I'll like it when I ride it. If it doesn't dull out the trail feel and climb like a brick then I'll probably like it.


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## jester6578 (Mar 15, 2010)

[TA] said:


> As far as I know the previous Stache will no longer be produced after the 2015 model year. As mentioned earlier in this tread the new Stache can be setup with standard 29" wheels, this setup works especially well with a 130-140mm fork, making for a real AM hardtail. I do encourage you to try the new 29+ bike. The Chupacabra tire is incredibly fast rolling and the increased volume and low pressure adds capability to the Stache that would be impossible with standard 29" tires. There's no way I'd try and ride the USCS trails with a 29x2.35 tire on a hardtail. At the end of the day the goal of the 2016 Stache was to push the trail hardtail to the next level and I for one feel that we met that goal. We knew couldn't please everyone with the new bike, but perhaps it's best to try the new bike and our 29+ tire before you decide you don't like it.


The Stache looks like an amazing bike. Really impressive that it can be a 29er, 29+, or 27+.

Any word on a 27+ Chupacabra? Would love to see more plus sized tires like the 27.5x4 on the new Farley: wide tread, but lower profile sidewalls.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

[TA] said:


> First off a disclaimer, I work for Trek and have been working on the Stache 29+ project for the last couple of years so you could say I'm a little biased. I also stay out of the forum chit chat for the most part but I'm just so excited about the Stache! I'd also be happy to help answer any questions you have about the platform.


Thanks for coming on, TA. It's often a no-win for bike companies to comment on forums, so kudos. Thanks to all at Trek to come out with a bike a lot of folks have been hoping to see for quite some time. Looks like you all nailed it in most every way that people were wanting. I thought I read somewhere that 27.5 trimmed models would be coming out? Any word on when that might happen? Or am I mistaken?

Edit: Also, if one wanted to buy the frame only is there any way to get the rigid fork so as to avoid having to purchase the Stache 5?


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

I'm not sure when or if we'll spec it with 27.5+ I'd say we're in a holding pattern till the tires mature a bit more. I've ridden the few options that were available pre otter and so far I can say I much prefer the 29+ setup, but that's me. 29+: Lower profile tire(shorter bead to bead), less/no pedal induced bounce, weight equal or lighter than B+, faster rolling, more flotation, more traction, and crazy short stays (on our bike)... I guess I just don't see the appeal of B+ but as the tires improve that may change. I hope I'm not coming across too negative, not trying to kick anyones puppy, but I feel the tire is such an important part of the equation. 

Last I heard there are plans to sell the fork aftermarket, I actually had to check the dealer site because I thought we already were. The 5 uses the same 490mm ATC fork from the Superfly SS.


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## mhopton (Nov 27, 2005)

[TA] said:


> Hey guys I thought I'd share this video to spread the Stache 29+ stoke. First off a disclaimer, I work for Trek and have been working on the Stache 29+ project for the last couple of years so you could say I'm a little biased. I also stay out of the forum chit chat for the most part but I'm just so excited about the Stache! I'd also be happy to help answer any questions you have about the platform.
> 
> This is a video of me riding my Stache 29+ in Santa Cruz last week before Sea Otter. Just for referance everyone else on the ride was on a 5" carbon FS bike...
> 
> Enjoy!


Looks awesome! I'm anxious to get out and ride one! Makes me think hard about my Remedy 9 27.5, which I don't ride much and whether the stache could be a fid replacement.


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## jester6578 (Mar 15, 2010)

[TA] said:


> I'm not sure when or if we'll spec it with 27.5+
> 
> ... so far I can say I much prefer the 29+ setup, but that's me. 29+: Lower profile tire(shorter bead to bead), less/no pedal induced bounce, weight equal or lighter than B+, faster rolling, more flotation, more traction, and crazy short stays (on our bike)... I guess I just don't see the appeal of B+ but as the tires improve that may change. I hope I'm not coming across too negative, not trying to kick anyones puppy, but I feel the tire is such an important part of the equation.


No, I think you're absolutely right. The bike I'd like to go a little wider on is my Remedy 27.5 - my "fun" bike. But I don't want to put 3.25" Balloon tires on it. The goal is to have a larger contact patch and lower tire pressures - not to make my 27.5" into a 29" using 8lbs of rubber. Which is why a 27+ Chupacabra is so appealing.

Trek is making killer tires these days - I hope to see a 2.5, 2.8, or 3.0 options in more treads soon! (Now that I'm thinking about it, a 2.8 XR3 front and a 2.8 XR2 rear sounds dreamy.)

Keep up the good work!


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## bob_m (May 17, 2013)

[TA] said:


> I work for Trek and have been working on the Stache 29+ project for the last couple of years so you could say I'm a little biased. I also stay out of the forum chit chat for the most part but I'm just so excited about the Stache! I'd also be happy to help answer any questions you have about the platform.


Congrats on getting the new Stache out the door. Do you feel the 29+ is a replacement for a full suspension 2.3 in certain areas? Will we be seeing a Remedy in the future with 29+? Thanks


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

29+ adds impressive capability to a hardtail, but at the end of the day it's still a hardtail... The Stache is way more "flickable" than my standard 27.5 or 29" trail bike, I love bunny hopping over pretty much every log that comes my way. I also continue to be impressed just how fast the Stache will go through gnarly nasty rocks and roots. It also still climbs like a hardtail which I love. It's very satisfying to beat your buddies to the top of the climb on a "fat" bike. I think 29+ makes for the best riding trail hardtail you can get, but it's still a hardtail and that's what makes it so fun.

I did hit the deck hard riding my Stache last week, the margin of error for a hardtail is still smaller than a FS bike. 29+ tires roll over some pretty big stuff, but it's still possible for them to hang up and put you off balance. I was getting cocky on my Stache last week and made the mistake of jumping into a little rocky section with my finger on the rear brake. When I made contact with the rough trail features the rear wheel grabbed more than I was expecting tossing me forward in the cock pit, things went pretty fast from there. I haven't been tossed off a bike so quickly in a long long time. As with any new bike there's a bit of a learning curve with just how hard you can push it... and 29x3 tires on big stiff wheels with short stays just tell you to push harder and harder.

Here's a quick clip of my crash. You can here the rear tire hooking up and skipping as I'm thrown off the bike.


__
http://instagr.am/p/1jzXojHDQO/


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## sirsam84 (Sep 20, 2006)

Plus one on this! Do you know if the remedy 29 can fit 27.5+ tires?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Clink (Oct 29, 2006)

You keep referring to inappropriate ness of hard tail on those trails. The vids might well not do it justice but those look (to me) like ideal for a hardtail? I'm by no means a hard/very skilled rider - it's probably that I come from a hardtail background.

Great looking bike though!


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

That really depends on what 27.5+ tire we're talking about. I would think the WTB Trail Blazer should fit, but that tire is just a hair larger than a normal 27.5 tire. The newer true B+ tires will either be SUPER tight or not fit at all.


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

Clink said:


> You keep referring to inappropriate ness of hard tail on those trails. The vids might well not do it justice but those look (to me) like ideal for a hardtail? I'm by no means a hard/very skilled rider - it's probably that I come from a hardtail background.
> 
> Great looking bike though!


There's a very good chance that I've gone bike industry soft, a Remedy 29 is normally my go to for those trails. Most of the local Fox Shox and Santa Cruz Bicycle guys choose a 140-160mm bike to ride there, I was getting some funny looks from EndruBros on Nomads. As we know GoPro footage does a great job of making steep trails look pretty mellow, but the UCSC trails have some pretty gnarly technical sections. I'm sure plenty of people can and do ride those sections on hardtails, but a FS or Plus bike allows you to carry way more speed through the hack.


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## Clink (Oct 29, 2006)

> As we know GoPro footage does a great job of making steep trails look pretty mellow, but the UCSC trails have some pretty gnarly technical sections


:thumbsup:


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## sirsam84 (Sep 20, 2006)

How is it in the air? Can it handle 3-4 foot drops without destroying joints?


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

sirsam84 said:


> How is it in the air? Can it handle 3-4 foot drops without destroying joints?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Short stays mean the front end is super easy to get up for drops and manuals. It also give the bike a very nice pop off of jumps and lips. The increased volume of 29x3 tires will definitely help take the edge off of medium sized drops, but if hucks to flat are your thing a full suspension bike is still probably the best choice. The increased angular momentum of the 29+ tire means you probably won't be winning Whip Off Worlds on a Stache, but the bike has a very nice balanced feel in the air and I never hesitate to get mine into the air. We have a little slalom course at Trek HQ and I actually have my fastest time down the track on a Stache, faster than my Ticket S which started life as a dual slalom bike. I'm not sure if you mean your knee joints or the frame's welds, but we've definitely beaten the crap out of this design over the last few years and haven't had any issues with the sliding dropout or mid stay.


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## Radioinactive (Aug 2, 2011)

just rode the 9 today and hollllyyyy.... this is a revolution. It is efficient and very quick. I had what seemed like infinite traction on the steep rocky and rutted climbs. it absolutley flew/floated on the way back down the sketchy technical trail. it is not sluggish at all and is as fast as any modern hardtail when it gets flat. the bike was also totally down with jumping it at high speeds. the chainstays were set at 420mm. i would buy one of these if i werent already buying a 9.8 remedy =p... bottom line is GET THIS BIKE YOU WILL NOT REGRET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## mhopton (Nov 27, 2005)

TA, I'm curious if you are hitting your calfs or quads, or other part of your leg on the seat stays? The online magazine Singletracks posted a review indicating an unacceptable amount of leg rub on the frame.

I got to see the 9 in the store yesterday - the spec appears to be spot on; can't wait to ride one.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

I'll add thanks to [TA] for coming and participating on the boards.

For me I've been waiting on more 29+ frames to hit the market, been enjoying my Monkey with 29+ front and 2.4" rear on Dually45 and really would like 29+ F&R, but as others have said, while there's a good bit of "new tech" on it, $900+ for a alu HT frame is just too much, especially when you can get a alu Gnasvester for under $600. For me I'd still also prefer steel to add more compliance, because as [TA] said, when it's all done and said, it's still a HT.

As to 650B+ vs 29+, I personally think that 650B+ like the WTB TB 2.8" will win for those who already have 29er HT/Rigids and want some more plushness in the rear, but can't fit a 29+ or maybe on some shorter travel FS bikes and 29+ will take the HT/Rigid market _(I personally prefer either FS or rigid, not HT)_.

Anyways, subscribed to keep up to date on this.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

Right there with you LyNx. Those thoughts are my thoughts too. I am also running 29+ on the front of my El Mariachi and 2.4 on the rear. Running Velocity Blunt 35's instead of duallys though.


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## Radioinactive (Aug 2, 2011)

mhopton said:


> TA, I'm curious if you are hitting your calfs or quads, or other part of your leg on the seat stays? The online magazine Singletracks posted a review indicating an unacceptable amount of leg rub on the frame.
> 
> I got to see the 9 in the store yesterday - the spec appears to be spot on; can't wait to ride one.


i did a frew times but it is all about proper pedaling technique! dont ride like a clown and it wont happen its that easy!


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

I still dislike the Stache for its high price but for some reason I am becoming more interested in the Stache 5. It looks to be a perfect fully rigid bike because the extra tire volume will smooth out the jarring ride of a rigid bike. That's the one that makes sense to me.


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

mhopton said:


> TA, I'm curious if you are hitting your calfs or quads, or other part of your leg on the seat stays? The online magazine Singletracks posted a review indicating an unacceptable amount of leg rub on the frame.
> 
> I got to see the 9 in the store yesterday - the spec appears to be spot on; can't wait to ride one.


I haven't personally had any issues with heal or calf rub on the Stache, but for me a small amount of calf rub is normal on just about every bike I own. I ride left foot forward and have a habit of using my right leg to push against the seat stay as another control point while cornering. I haven't had rub while pedaling. Calf rub will vary based on calf size, leg length and pedaling style, also some people are also far more sensitive to it than others. If it's a concern I would highly recommend a test ride with your normal riding shoe/pedal setup.


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

LyNx said:


> I'll add thank to [TA] for coming and participating on the boards.
> 
> For me I've been waiting on more 29+ frames to hit the market, been enjoying my Monkey with 29+ front and 2.4" rear on Dually45 and really would like 29+ F&R, but as others have said, while there's a good bit of "new tech" on it, $900+ for a alu HT frame is just too much, especially when you can get a alu Gnasvester for under $600. For me I'd still also prefer steel to add more compliance, because as [TA] said, when it's all done and said, it's still a HT.
> 
> ...


I think it's going to be a very interesting couple of years. More high volume options is definitely a good thing, I've been sold on 29+ since my first experience on the Knard 3 years ago. 29+ will always have certain advantages (and disadvantages) over 27.5+, just like 27.5 vs 29, but just like 29" bikes not everyone will like the taller wheel. I also don't see any reason why 27.5+ and 29+ can't and won't both exist.

My only real concern is with the nebulous nature of Plus. 29+ is pretty well defined and while tire options have been slowly increasing they're all pretty much the same size. Unfortunately the same can't be said for the rapidly growing 27.5+ market. While higher volume 27.5 tire that can be retrofit on 29" frames is cool and is a great option for 29" bike owners looking for something new to try, classifying both the Trail Blazer and Trax Fatty as B+ has the potential to really confuse the market. Just because a "plus" frame will fit the Blazer doesn't mean it'll fit the Trax. I would hate to see customers get burned by early, rushed to market plus bikes and totally dismiss the concept of high volume, low psi, trail shredding bicycles. The good news is there were some pretty promising looking 27.5+ tires shown at Sea Otter and they all seem to be settling in on 71-76mm wide and 720-730mm tall, which is still a bit under the claimed 29" effective diameter, but at least it's constant.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

CannondaleF9 said:


> I still dislike the Stache for its high price but for some reason I am becoming more interested in the Stache 5. It looks to be a perfect fully rigid bike because the extra tire volume will smooth out the jarring ride of a rigid bike. That's the one that makes sense to me.


Ha! I've been watching you rage in all these Stache threads, and at some point realized you doth protest too much and were going to buy one of these and be raving about it in just a few months time.

I think the Stache 5 is likely the best deal. If you figure the price of the frame, then you're only spending $800 for a rigid fork, wheels and tires, a Deore kit, and cockpit fixings. That almost feels reasonable. Then, if you want suspension later, you can buy one of the forks a year from now for less than $500. Once the drivetrain is worn, you buy an new XT kit from overseas, and you got a lot of bike that you could run rigid or with suspension.


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## ScaryJerry (Jan 12, 2004)

That Stache 5 looks like my next bike


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Slow Danger said:


> Ha! I've been watching you rage in all these Stache threads, and at some point realized you doth protest too much and were going to buy one of these and be raving about it in just a few months time.
> 
> I think the Stache 5 is likely the best deal. If you figure the price of the frame, then you're only spending $800 for a rigid fork, wheels and tires, a Deore kit, and cockpit fixings. That almost feels reasonable. Then, if you want suspension later, you can buy one of the forks a year from now for less than $500. Once the drivetrain is worn, you buy an new XT kit from overseas, and you got a lot of bike that you could run rigid or with suspension.


I don't know for certain if I will end up buying one. I will make sure to demo one, and hopefully I don't want to buy it immediately because I won't have $1700 this summer to spend on a new bike. 
I have wanted to try a rigid bike and maybe, just maybe, the Stache 5 would be the perfect rigid bike for me. 
I wouldn't want to have suspension on it because then I might as well buy a Full suspension bike or a Niner ROS9 for a little more than the price of the Stache7.


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## lookiel (Nov 13, 2012)

I wonder how much the Stache 5 weighs?


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## CGrr (Aug 30, 2010)

If I got the Stache 5 frame I would need to build a wheelset. Who sells 148 Boost Hubs?


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

CGrr said:


> If I got the Stache 5 frame I would need to build a wheelset. Who sells 148 Boost Hubs?


I think DT Swiss and i9, maybe Sram sells one too?


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

CGrr said:


> If I got the Stache 5 frame I would need to build a wheelset. Who sells 148 Boost Hubs?


Industry 9 does now. Hope just had pics of their boost hubs. Not sure when availability is on them. I think Onyx is doing one too.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

Hope:
Wider!! | Hope Tech | Made in Barnoldswick, England


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

Well Crap.

Trek had a demo today at my local trails. I rode the Stache 29+. I was really thinking I'd hate it - I've had several 29ers (C'Dale Flash ,Redline Monocog, C'Dale Trail SSer, SC Highball) and never really liked any of them (except perhaps the Monocog). At 5'7", the 29'ers always felt 'big' to me. I converted a C'Dale Rush to 650b and fell in love with the wheelsize. 

Much to my disbelief, I was very surprised to find out how much I loved the Stache 29+. Trek really knocked it out of the park with this one. I don't know if it is the G2 geo, the short chainstays, a combo of both, or what but the wheels/tires did not feel big at all. The bike gave me the confidence of my Farley but I felt faster and it was very playful. I was only going to do a short up and back but I had so much fun riding it I ended up going further. I'm not a racer so the fun factor matters the most to me and this bike was fun. The fact that it felt faster than the Farley made it even more fun. (and I love my Farley).

The reason I say "crap" is because I was sold on getting a Bluto and a set of 27.5+ wheels/tires to run on my Farley for spring/summer/fall riding. The Stache 29+ has me seriously reconsidering. Decisions, decisions...


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

sandyeggo said:


> Well Crap.
> The reason I say "crap" is because I was sold on getting a Bluto and a set of 27.5+ wheels/tires to run on my Farley for spring/summer/fall riding. The Stache 29+ has me seriously reconsidering. Decisions, decisions...


Which model to you test ride?


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

temporoad said:


> Which model to you test ride?


It was the 9. The one thing I didn't like was that the fork didn't have a lock-out and was too bouncy when I stood up and hammered. The Trek rep said that the mid-level fork will have a lock-out but the "trail" version didn't because those riders wouldn't need/want a lockout. I don't buy it, but that is what he said. To be fair, he did say this was the first weekend they demo'd the bikes and they haven't really tuned the fork and he thought it could have used more pressure to make it more firm. I thought the fork performed really well when seated.

I'm thinking of going with a 5 and setting it up as a rigid SSer at first. Then getting suspension fork when they become available for purchase (without a bike)

The 5 was there (personal bike of a rep) and that color looks fantastic in person.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

sandyeggo said:


> It was the 9. The one thing I didn't like was that the fork didn't have a lock-out and was too bouncy when I stood up and hammered. The Trek rep said that the mid-level fork will have a lock-out but the "trail" version didn't because those riders wouldn't need/want a lockout. I don't buy it, but that is what he said. To be fair, he did say this was the first weekend they demo'd the bikes and they haven't really tuned the fork and he thought it could have used more pressure to make it more firm. I thought the fork performed really well when seated.
> 
> I'm thinking of going with a 5 and setting it up as a rigid SSer at first. Then getting suspension fork when they become available for purchase (without a bike)
> 
> The 5 was there (personal bike of a rep) and that color looks fantastic in person.


If the fork was properly tuned and set up for you then it probably would have felt better. On my 29er I never use my lockout on even the steepest and longest of climbs.


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

CannondaleF9 said:


> If the fork was properly tuned and set up for you then it probably would have felt better. On my 29er I never use my lockout on even the steepest and longest of climbs.


I think you are right.


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## CGrr (Aug 30, 2010)

I'm torn. I have really been interested in putting together a Jones and was really close to pulling the trigger on a frame and front wheel but this Stache 5 has really thrown a wrench into the works.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

sandyeggo said:


> I'm thinking of going with a 5 and setting it up as a rigid SSer at first. Then getting suspension fork when they become available for purchase (without a bike)


Keep in mind if you plan on moving to a Manitou Magnum fork your going to have to rebuild your front wheel to use the 110 mm hub.


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

temporoad said:


> Keep in mind if you plan on moving to a Manitou Magnum fork your going to have to rebuild your front wheel to use the 110 mm hub.


I didn't realize that - thanks for the info! Why can't they make rigid forks compatible with suspension forks? That certainly makes the case for getting a 5 less appealing to me. Same issue with my Farley 6 and wanting a Bluto...


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

temporoad said:


> Keep in mind if you plan on moving to a Manitou Magnum fork your going to have to rebuild your front wheel to use the 110 mm hub.


Ah, I didn't catch that either. That sucks.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Slow Danger said:


> Ah, I didn't catch that either. That sucks.


There's a saying that goes, "With unnecessary wheel sizes comes unnecessary hub widths"
Marketing is a load of bs these days. Trying to sell the newest thing just because they know that someone will buy it.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

I got to ride it before Otter and have been riding it ever since. It's not something I thought I wanted since I thought the tires were so big. But this is executed so perfectly that I've been very impressed with its agility and rowdy riding ability!!


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## mattgVT (Nov 9, 2010)

CannondaleF9 said:


> There's a saying that goes, "With unnecessary wheel sizes comes unnecessary hub widths"
> Marketing is a load of bs these days. Trying to sell the newest thing just because they know that someone will buy it.


I think you should create a new frame with whatever standards you want. Otherwise you're left with the choices provided by the people/companies that do.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

So FC, any trouble with those wide seat stays hitting your knee/thigh? That looks like the only real complaint on these _(except the PF BB and width of it, for me at least)_. Experienced this with the V1 Paradox and changed my pedaling to suit, but it's a lot nicer on the V2 now they've made that area narrower.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

LyNx said:


> So FC, any trouble with those wide seat stays hitting your knee/thigh? That looks like the only real complaint on these _(except the PF BB and width of it, for me at least)_. Experienced this with the V1 Paradox and changed my pedaling to suit, but it's a lot nicer on the V2 now they've made that area narrower.


It hit my show sole early on in the first ride. On the second ride, not so much. So it's definitely on the borderline of wide. Just the seatstay for me.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

The angry single speeder rode this bike at sea otter in this configuration and liked it. He also put 27.5+ wheels and put a 140 mm front forks and try that as well. This write up is coming up. I'm doing a full review in a couple weeks.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

CannondaleF9 said:


> If the fork was properly tuned and set up for you then it probably would have felt better. On my 29er I never use my lockout on even the steepest and longest of climbs.


But he said it performed really well when seated but moved too much while standing. Sounds like it was tuned great. Like he said, it just needs a lockout like any fork I would even consider buying. It sounds like you don't do much hard out of the saddle efforts which require a lockout. Long steep climbs generally don't.


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## threesixeight (Dec 6, 2005)

LyNx said:


> So FC, any trouble with those wide seat stays hitting your knee/thigh? That looks like the only real complaint on these _(except the PF BB and width of it, for me at least)_. Experienced this with the V1 Paradox and changed my pedaling to suit, but it's a lot nicer on the V2 now they've made that area narrower.


Does the stache have a wider BB? I thought it was 73mm. The one I test rode I kept hitting my calf on the seatstay and my heel on the elevated chainstay. I rode the 5 which is full rigid and even with low tire pressures I felt the 31.6mm seatpost was overly stiff as I felt every bump on the trail. If I were to get one I would use a shim and a carbon layback 27.2 post. Also I thought the sizing seemed to be on the small side.


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## syl3 (Apr 23, 2008)

threesixeight said:


> does the stache have a wider bb? I thought it was 73mm.


bb92


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

yogiprophet said:


> But he said it performed really well when seated but moved too much while standing. Sounds like it was tuned great. Like he said, it just needs a lockout like any fork I would even consider buying. It sounds like you don't do much hard out of the saddle efforts which require a lockout. Long steep climbs generally don't.


I do a lot of out of the saddle climbing and I actually prefer the feel of the suspension. Maybe it's because my bike has only 100mm of travel and the bob isn't too bad.
I understand why a fat tire bike will feel bad while standing and climbing because of how much the tire squishes.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

syl3 said:


> bb92


BB92 and a 73mm external are the same width. BB92 has the bearings inside the BB shell. The same cranks will work with both.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 1996)

The Angry Singlespeeder's thoughts

First Ride Review: 2015 Trek Stache - Mtbr.com


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

fc said:


> The Angry Singlespeeder's thoughts
> 
> First Ride Review: 2015 Trek Stache - Mtbr.com


I'm disappointed, there was no Anger at all in that review!


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## rushman3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Anyone know the difference between the Pro and Comp models of this Manitou fork on the Stache 29+ bike?


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

rushman3 said:


> Anyone know the difference between the Pro and Comp models of this Manitou fork on the Stache 29+ bike?


From Manitou tech - Shanan Barth.

"Different inner diameters, different materials. Pro stanchions are 7000 series aluminum, Comps are 6000 series. Due to different air systems and compression systems they are also sized differently internally. No cross compatibility whatsoever between the two forks besides the outer casting."

Also, the Comp is remote compatible while the Pro is not.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

yogiprophet said:


> From Manitou tech - Shanan Barth.
> 
> "Different inner diameters, different materials. Pro stanchions are 7000 series aluminum, Comps are 6000 series. Due to different air systems and compression systems they are also sized differently internally. No cross compatibility whatsoever between the two forks besides the outer casting."
> 
> Also, the Comp is remote compatible while the Pro is not.


What does that all mean and what are the advantages of each? I only understand the remote capabilities. Why would a manufacturer produce 2 similar products? The 29+ would have somewhat limited sales unless there are more manufacturers going to jump in.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

temporoad said:


> What does that all mean and what are the advantages of each? I only understand the remote capabilities. Why would a manufacturer produce 2 similar products? The 29+ would have somewhat limited sales unless there are more manufacturers going to jump in.


I often wonder why manufacturers make 2 similar products. There must be a cost difference or is it marketing and profit driven. 7000 series aluminum is stronger so it will be lighter since less material is needed hence the larger inner diameter of the Pro model. 6000 series aluminum creates stronger welds than 7000, but makes no sense in a part that is not welded like a stanchion.
If you look at their website, you can see the different dampers that are used on each model.


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## syl3 (Apr 23, 2008)

yogiprophet said:


> From Manitou tech - Shanan Barth.
> 
> "Different inner diameters, different materials. Pro stanchions are 7000 series aluminum, Comps are 6000 series. Due to different air systems and compression systems they are also sized differently internally. No cross compatibility whatsoever between the two forks besides the outer casting."
> 
> Also, the Comp is remote compatible while the Pro is not.


one has the ABS+ damper, the other comes with the Mattoc/Dorado internals


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

OK, now reading that "report" from ASS I have to ask, is the HTA actually different on the rigid or do they just use a much shorter A2C fork on it? Would make no sense to produce two framesets with different geo and for me 70.3 is too steep with these 29+ tyres and will produce some nasty self steer going by my results on my Monkey. 
Wondering if someone bough the V5 option if they could buy an external lower cup to help slacken it out a bit? Far as my searching goes, there is no such headset, but maybe I've missed it, largest EC lower I can find will fit a standard 1.5" lower HT.
Also, while yeah, BOOST 148 may actually have been the standard that should have came out instead of 142, the BS about without it you could not build these bikes, is utter horse shite, normal triple crank using the outside spot, maybe the middle to run the single ring and a 150 rear.


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## tppon (Jan 8, 2013)

Any chance one of you has ridden both the Stache and the superfly ss, and feels like comparing them?
Cheers


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

yogiprophet said:


> I often wonder why manufacturers make 2 similar products. There must be a cost difference or is it marketing and profit driven. 7000 series aluminum is stronger so it will be lighter since less material is needed hence the larger inner diameter of the Pro model. 6000 series aluminum creates stronger welds than 7000, but makes no sense in a part that is not welded like a stanchion.
> If you look at their website, you can see the different dampers that are used on each model.


The Comp is an OEM model offered so manufacturers can build a more affordable spec model complete bike.


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## Utahbikemike (Sep 11, 2014)

Anyone ridden these that also have a fatbike? Wondering if there is clearance for 26" fat wheels. If there is this is a tempting bike. I saw two guys with them on the trails today and it didn't look as crazy in person as i expected.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

yes, no


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

I had a '12 Mukluk for a few years before my Krampus. Krampus does everything a MTB should do better than the Mukluk. Only thing the Muk exceeds in is flotation in snow and soft sand.


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## Utahbikemike (Sep 11, 2014)

I rode a motobecane lurch all winter. (5" tire, rigid fatbike) and loved it. Whenever i rode it, it seemed like i could have ridden it on a narrower bike, though. I think the 29+ will be better for riding snowpack with footprints. I found i didnt care much for riding in more than 6" of new snow and actually mostly rode it in bad weather. 

I found it didnt destroy questionably wet trails like a normal mtb would, im curious to see if the 29+ will do the same.


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## schnapmaster (Feb 26, 2004)

*Thoughts on New Stache*

I have been riding my Stache 5 and playing around with some different configurations.
I am riding it as a single speed, with 34x22 gearing. This seems to approximate the 32x20 I usually run on a normal 29er for doing real rides with real climbing. I set it up 35x22, and there was contact between the top of the chain and the bottom of the "mid stay". Looks like there will be a limit on how big of a chainring you can run with a 1x drivetrain, but that shouldn't be a problem for most.
The rims are ready to set up tubeless out of the box, just add a valve.
I am currently running it with a 160mm Fox 34. The front tire fits, though as it has grown/stretched, there is a little rubbing from the top of the tire. At lower pressures this is minor, but I will probably shave a little from the bottom of the fork arch. Bottom brackett height is 13.3", but the handling is not so bad. I will probably shorten the travel to 130mm.
I have been running 13psi back and 11psi front, riding pretty fast on kind of rocky/rooty trails. I expect rim strikes at this pressure riding all out on rocky trails. Still fine tuning.
The stock wheels weigh about 2400 grams. This is noticeable, and I could shave 2 pounds with a new light wheelset.
On the first ride, I was hitting my heels on the chain stays and my calf/knee on the seat stays. I haven't noticed it as a problem on recent rides.
The Stranglehold geared dropout looks like it will fit on a Superfly SS. I have both frames and may switch them.
I have the 18.5" size in a Superfly AL and Superfly SS, so I ordered the 18.5" in the Stache 5. The top tube is definitely shorter on the Stache, and I may switch for a 19.5" when they are available.
So far, it is a very fun bike. It's pretty slack with the long travel fork and really hammers the descents, while still giving me the lively ride of a hardtail.


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## rushman3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Very cool SS Stache 5, was thinking about this bike as a Single Speed.


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

Loving mine so far. Not as good climbing as my 3D but a lot of fun on the downhills. Can't wait to get my Nexties laced up.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

LyNx said:


> OK, now reading that "report" from ASS I have to ask, is the HTA actually different on the rigid or do they just use a much shorter A2C fork on it? Would make no sense to produce two framesets with different geo and for me 70.3 is too steep with these 29+ tyres and will produce some nasty self steer going by my results on my Monkey.
> Wondering if someone bough the V5 option if they could buy an external lower cup to help slacken it out a bit? Far as my searching goes, there is no such headset, but maybe I've missed it, largest EC lower I can find will fit a standard 1.5" lower HT.
> Also, while yeah, BOOST 148 may actually have been the standard that should have came out instead of 142, the BS about without it you could not build these bikes, is utter horse shite, normal triple crank using the outside spot, maybe the middle to run the single ring and a 150 rear.


I don't know for sure, but my guess is the slightly different geometry is from using a shorter A-C fork. The spec. sheet for the 5 only says 100mm suspension corrected for the fork.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

lancelot said:


> Loving mine so far. Not as good climbing as my 3D but a lot of fun on the downhills. Can't wait to get my Nexties laced up.


That bike looks kinda cool. I'll have to go test ride one this year, maybe I'll like it, although I would prefer a bike that climbs really well.
Are those the new XT brakes on your bike?


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## Raumfahrer Rolf (Apr 18, 2007)

Sweet! I still have mixed feelings about the color of the Stache 5, but it looks like with the Kashima. 



schnapmaster said:


> The rims are ready to set up tubeless out of the box, just add a valve.
> I am currently running it with a 160mm Fox 34. The front tire fits, though as it has grown/stretched, there is a little rubbing from the top of the tire. At lower pressures this is minor, but I will probably shave a little from the bottom of the fork arch. Bottom brackett height is 13.3", but the handling is not so bad. I will probably shorten the travel to 130mm.


Did you re-lace the front rim to a new hub? Or does the Boost front hub fit in a regular 15 mm thru-axle fork?


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

bikeny said:


> I don't know for sure, but my guess is the slightly different geometry is from using a shorter A-C fork. The spec. sheet for the 5 only says 100mm suspension corrected for the fork.


From what I understand from one of these threads, the rigid fork on the Stache 5 is the same Trek uses for the Superfly. So it's the A-C that changes the head angle, and a way for Trek to save money. What's also unfortunate is that the rigid fork runs the non-boost hub, so you need to separate wheels if you want to swap between rigid and suspension.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

Slow Danger said:


> What's also unfortunate is that the rigid fork runs the non-boost hub, so you need to separate wheels if you want to swap between rigid and suspension.


or you look thru the pages of info out there for "knard fit forks", people have been running suspension on krampus for plenty of time now

trek did the same thing with the farley, 135 spaced rigid, 150 spaced suspension


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## Raumfahrer Rolf (Apr 18, 2007)

TitanofChaos said:


> or you look thru the pages of info out there for "knard fit forks", people have been running suspension on krampus for plenty of time now
> 
> trek did the same thing with the farley, 135 spaced rigid, 150 spaced suspension


That the Stache 5 does NOT run a Boost front hub is actually a selling point for me. It seems like it'd be much easier to find a suspended fork and you can swap at least the front wheel with another bike.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

TitanofChaos said:


> or you look thru the pages of info out there for "knard fit forks", people have been running suspension on krampus for plenty of time now
> 
> trek did the same thing with the farley, 135 spaced rigid, 150 spaced suspension


Ah, I haven't been in that thread for a long time now, but last I was there clearance seemed to be an issue. People modifying arches, trimming knobs, or only running in dry conditions. I'll go back and check it out.


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## Co-opski (Oct 24, 2013)

> Trek just won't let any fad go without testing the waters, will they? Looks cool, I'm intrigued.


I'm holding out for the Trek +7pointfive9er. think 69er x plus.2


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## MartinS (Jan 31, 2004)

Hope it doesn't end up a common problem, but my friends dt rear hub on his Stache only made it about 1 km before failing... and thanks to it being 148 he might have to wait a bit for a replacement.


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## Roblo (Apr 23, 2009)

Myself and a friend each stripped the star ratchet 6 miles into each of our respective first rides. Industry nine hub is on the way. Guessing they had a bad batch of star ratchets. Pulled one from another wheel and it has been fine.


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

CannondaleF9 said:


> That bike looks kinda cool. I'll have to go test ride one this year, maybe I'll like it, although I would prefer a bike that climbs really well.
> Are those the new XT brakes on your bike?


No. I'm running 4 piston Hope brakes from my last 29+.


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## jdgang (Oct 1, 2009)

Purchased an 54 tooth star ratchet from Trek about two months ago. It failed on the very first ride. Trek warrantied it without any issues and the new one just plain works.


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## crfnick56 (Mar 7, 2012)

Has anyone got to ride stache7+ yet? The 9 is just out of my price range but the 7 is calling my name.

Also, maybe I missed it, but what do these 29+ weigh roughly?


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## Thustlewhumber (Nov 25, 2011)

tppon said:


> Any chance one of you has ridden both the Stache and the superfly ss, and feels like comparing them?
> Cheers


I have and I will.

The Superfly SS is a super light bike with great gearing. I rode one with the 3" 29+ tire on the front and it floated over things quite well. It also climbs like you are on flat ground, meaning the climbs are effortless. However, I am more of an aggressive rider and there are a couple of things that I could not get over: 1) the stem is way too long, which puts you way out over the front, which leads the Superfly to be "turned" in corners vs. "leaned". 2) Absolutely no way to put a dropper on it, which again means you are turning and not leaning. Great bike if you are into that sort of thing, but not for me.

The Stache 9 is a phenomenal work of art. Dare I say game-changing. I test rode it as 29+ back to back with a Farley, Remedy, and a Slash. The Stache was, by far, the most fun out of all the bikes. Short chainstays mean easy wheelies and manuals, 29+ tires did not seem to hinder acceleration (unlike the Farley, which was a pig). The KS Lev dropper is very nice; I would say on-par with my Thompson Elite dropper and MUCH better than the Rockshox Reverb on the Slash. The bar/stem combo, while not as wide/short as I am used to, was not really noticed as I could drop the seat and lean the bike as much as I wanted to while cornering. Cornering - Oh. My. God. - This bike will not break traction cornering. You can literally lean over to the point of the bars touching the ground and it will not break traction. It was a dream taking corners on it. Rough stuff? I ride a Trek 69er SS through some pretty crazy stuff, and the one thing I noticed was how there was no trail chatter on the Stache vs. my 69er. All the momentum you manage to get, you actually get to keep on this bike.

The only thing I would change on the Stache is put some 785mm bars on it and a 40mm stem - That says alot because I am very picky about my bikes. The 1x is perfect. The dropper is perfect. The 29+ is perfect. The chainstay is perfect. This, to me, is the one bike that I would sell all my others for... it is that good, no joke. And, AND, you can put a Gates carbon drive on it! Icing on the cake.

Oh, I also rode the Farley... I hate fat bikes...


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

With all the positive reviews this bike is getting im holding my breath to see what specialized comes out with, you know they wont be beat at something, even though they will rush it and it will have a dozen problems. 

Anyway, once I see a tire with studs I might consider this bike. did not care much for my fatbike when I owned one.


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## Chader09 (Aug 14, 2013)

sml-2727 said:


> With all the positive reviews this bike is getting im holding my breath to *see what specialized comes out with*, you know they wont be beat at something, even though they will rush it and it will have a dozen problems.
> 
> Anyway, once I see a tire with studs I might consider this bike. did not care much for my fatbike when I owned one.


Already showing their version, 6Fatty

SOC15: Specialized launches Fuse, Ruze 27.5+, new Rumor 650 trail bike, Command Post & more!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Chader09 said:


> Already showing their version, 6Fatty
> 
> SOC15: Specialized launches Fuse, Ruze 27.5+, new Rumor 650 trail bike, Command Post & more!


That's 27.5+, not 29+ like the Trek. Big difference!


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## Chader09 (Aug 14, 2013)

Yes, I know it's different. But it IS there answer for now. They don't appear to be releasing a 29+ option this season.


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## bob_m (May 17, 2013)

Chader09 said:


> Already showing their version, 6Fatty
> 
> SOC15: Specialized launches Fuse, Ruze 27.5+, new Rumor 650 trail bike, Command Post & more!


Interesting, now lets see what Giant will do


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## Wish I Were Riding (Jan 30, 2004)

bob_m said:


> Interesting, now lets see what Giant will do


Seems like they have been too quiet. Either entirely missing the boat, or trying to play catch up.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

If you've followed the bike industry for long enough you'll know that Giant isn't one to rush into anything, not by a long shot, they didn't get into 29ers until they'd been offered by every other major manufacturer first and then they jumped into the 650B arena_ (also pushed the re-name/use of them to be known as 27.5")_ because they then realised how much they'd missed out on the 29er market. I'm thinking this will be a bit more like their approach to 29ers, but not as slow, maybe next year they'll catch on.



Wish I Were Riding said:


> Seems like they have been too quiet. Either entirely missing the boat, or trying to play catch up.
> 
> 
> bob_m said:
> ...


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

Chader09 said:


> Already showing their version, 6Fatty
> 
> SOC15: Specialized launches Fuse, Ruze 27.5+, new Rumor 650 trail bike, Command Post & more!


27.5+ mo bettah than 29+. Special-ed got it goin on.


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## Chader09 (Aug 14, 2013)

Yeah, for me anyway. The 650b+ seems like what I would prefer compared to 29+. Note, this is without riding either one... so pure speculation. I like a more playful bike in general for wheelies, hops, etc.

Will be interesting to try both. One rider at our shop snagged the new Stache and I hope to catch a ride soon.


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## Deep Thought (Sep 3, 2012)

bob_m said:


> Interesting, now lets see what Giant will do





LyNx said:


> If you've followed the bike industry for long enough you'll know that Giant isn't one to rush into anything, not by a long shot, they didn't get into 29ers until they'd been offered by every other major manufacturer first and then they jumped into the 650B arena_ (also pushed the re-name/use of them to be known as 27.5")_ because they then realised how much they'd missed out on the 29er market. I'm thinking this will be a bit more like their approach to 29ers, but not as slow, maybe next year they'll catch on.


I wonder whether they'll release a plus bike or a fat bike first. Are they going to skip over fat bikes completely?



newmarketrog said:


> 27.5+ mo bettah than 29+. Special-ed got it goin on.


Have you ridden both yet?


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## kwabbott (Mar 13, 2011)

I'm really intrigued by this bike but I'm wondering if it's a good fit for the XC riding we have here in SW Michigan. 

Are the winning features of this bike going to show up when riding regular XC? Does it need more technical trails in order to really experience the difference between this and a traditional 29er hardtail?

Also, anyone know what they bikes weigh roughly? Not a weight weenie, just curious.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

kwabbott said:


> Are the winning features of this bike going to show up when riding regular XC? Does it need more technical trails in order to really experience the difference between this and a traditional 29er hardtail?
> 
> Also, anyone know what they bikes weigh roughly? Not a weight weenie, just curious.


A 19.5 Stache5 is 27 stock with pedals. Tubeless will drop about a pound. Single speed it would be under 25 IMO. 
I ride a rigid Krampus that is a stupid amount of fun on XC trails. I think the Stache line will be similar, and they will be lots of fun on a chunkier trail too.


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## Thustlewhumber (Nov 25, 2011)

Stache will run 27.5+ with a 400mm(!) chainstay. I would bet a 27.5+ Remedy is right around the corner.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I'm definitely intrigued by this bike. I have to admit a little disappointment in my Niner ROS 9. Unfortunately I bought it sight unseen based on the reviews and the front end really isn't all that playful for me. I'm interested most likely in the Stache 7 because of the price. I don't think I will do well without suspension the price of the 7 allows me some room for upgrades like Guide RSC brakes, carbon bars, shorter stem, and Hope Pro 2 Evo hubs when they come available. I don't know that I would want a dropper because I am larger than the average bear and I don't want to have to worry about blowing seals constantly. The only thing that really gives me pause is the possibility of climbing being slower. I'm already a slow climber due to my size and really don't want to slow down or increase effort.


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

Im over this bike, its just a 29er hardtail with bigger tires


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

sml-2727 said:


> Im over this bike, its just a 29er hardtail with bigger tires


That's cool with everyone dude


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## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

cobba said:


> Trek Stache 9 specs:
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/1gSgRKwU3z/


Did I see $3900?


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

CS2 said:


> Did I see $3900?


Pretty economical right? If too costly just buy one with 4 rides off Craigslist in a year for $1500. Once you get to 4k, it better have a hot engine for me.


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

sml-2727 said:


> Im over this bike, its just a 29er hardtail with bigger tires


yup.


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## CS2 (Jul 24, 2007)

SS Hack said:


> Pretty economical right? If too costly just buy one with 4 rides off Craigslist in a year for $1500.


Not a bad idea.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

sml-2727 said:


> Im over this bike, its just a 29er hardtail with bigger tires


Yes it is, and a lot more. Bin ride'n 29+ for 3 years all I can say is....... awesome.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

temporoad said:


> Yes it is, and a lot more. Bin ride'n 29+ for 3 years all I can say is....... awesome.


Yup. This is my 3rd year of having a 29+ in the garage. After trying a fatbike, 26er, 650B, 29er and 29+ I'm sold on 29+ as an awesome wheel size format for a lot of my riding.


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## johnnyspoke (Sep 15, 2005)

askibum02 said:


> I'm definitely intrigued by this bike. I have to admit a little disappointment in my Niner ROS 9. Unfortunately I bought it sight unseen based on the reviews and the front end really isn't all that playful for me. I'm interested most likely in the Stache 7 because of the price. I don't think I will do well without suspension the price of the 7 allows me some room for upgrades like Guide RSC brakes, carbon bars, shorter stem, and Hope Pro 2 Evo hubs when they come available. I don't know that I would want a dropper because I am larger than the average bear and I don't want to have to worry about blowing seals constantly. The only thing that really gives me pause is the possibility of climbing being slower. I'm already a slow climber due to my size and really don't want to slow down or increase effort.


I'm a slow climber also. I got to borrow a stache 9 for a couple of days and put some miles on it. It rolls well but the gearing is pretty tall and slowed me down on steep climbs significantly. If you have long steep climbs and tend to use any of your lower 2-3 gears and spin, I'd look pretty hard at getting that front ring changed out to a 28 or perhaps 26. Only you can decide if that will leave you with enough top end.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

The 1x11 felt too tall? I'm running 1x10 with a 30t front ring and 11-36 cassette and seem to do okay on my current 29er. I'm usually in one of the 2 or three lowest gears when I climb though. What bike do you typically ride with what drivetrain?


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## johnnyspoke (Sep 15, 2005)

askibum02 said:


> The 1x11 felt too tall? I'm running 1x10 with a 30t front ring and 11-36 cassette and seem to do okay on my current 29er. I'm usually in one of the 2 or three lowest gears when I climb though. What bike do you typically ride with what drivetrain?


Remember, I'm not the best climber 

This ride has a ~600 ft climb in just over a mile. Some sections are much steeper than others but there aren't any real recovery zones. I'm normally in 24 up front and 2-3 from the bottom on a 36t cassette, but there are a few long steep sections where it's nice to drop to the granny. Without doing the gear ratios, I'm guessing the 30X42 on the stache is close to my 24 x whatever 3rd low gear is. But then factor the bigger wheel which affects final gearing... I didn't measure but it's probably close to 31" in diameter. So I'm higher than my normal highest gear on this climb with no bail-out when things really get steep. I do this ride probably 75 times a year so it's not like I'm going to suddenly pedal myself into whatever shape I need to be in to make that gearing enjoyable.

And that's hardly a big climb around here. One of my faves is 3000 feet over about 9 miles. Not terribly steep but its all up. When I get to mile 8 or so I'm really wishing for a smaller gear than what I have now.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

That makes sense. I don't have a whole lot of climbing around me in the Triangle of NC, but I would like to make a trip out to Western NC which has some pretty gnarly climbs from what I've heard.


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## Ralph (Aug 22, 2014)

schnapmaster said:


> I have been riding my Stache 5 and playing around with some different configurations.
> I am riding it as a single speed, with 34x22 gearing. This seems to approximate the 32x20 I usually run on a normal 29er for doing real rides with real climbing. I set it up 35x22, and there was contact between the top of the chain and the bottom of the "mid stay". Looks like there will be a limit on how big of a chainring you can run with a 1x drivetrain, but that shouldn't be a problem for most.
> The rims are ready to set up tubeless out of the box, just add a valve.
> I am currently running it with a 160mm Fox 34. The front tire fits, though as it has grown/stretched, there is a little rubbing from the top of the tire. At lower pressures this is minor, but I will probably shave a little from the bottom of the fork arch. Bottom brackett height is 13.3", but the handling is not so bad. I will probably shorten the travel to 130mm.
> ...


I'm debating on what size to go with and 5 versus the 7. I've read that these seem to run small...can I ask what your inseam is? Thanks!


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

The Trek factory demo truck stopped by our neck of the woods today, and I was able to demo a Stache 9:










I'm a steel guy, but I found the aluminum frame quite responsive. Not too stiff and dead feeling, like some aluminum or carbon frames I've ridden. The bike handled well, but I was a little underwhelmed by the short chainstays: yes, they made the front a bit easier to loft, but not dramatically so, and they also seemed to make the rear end of the bike a bit too vertically stiff.

Overall, I liked the bike, but with the oddball specs of Boost hubs and a PF bottom bracket, I'm leaning to the aluminum Gnarvester instead if I'm getting a new 29+ frame in the near term.

I put some pictures and details up here.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I noticed you said you measured the stays at 420mm, but even Trek advertises them as going as short as 405mm. Do you think 420 is short as they'll go with the 3.0 tires?


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

It looks like the stays were at the back of the slot, and there was still decent tire clearance all around. I would guess you could go at least 5mm shorter, maybe 10mm, and still clear a 29+.



PHeller said:


> I noticed you said you measured the stays at 420mm, but even Trek advertises them as going as short as 405mm. Do you think 420 is short as they'll go with the 3.0 tires?


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## schnapmaster (Feb 26, 2004)

Ralph said:


> I'm debating on what size to go with and 5 versus the 7. I've read that these seem to run small...can I ask what your inseam is? Thanks!


My inseam is around 32 inches, but standover is not the issue for me. I was expecting a longer top tube than 23.66 inches on the 18.5" Stache.
I'm currently running a 60mm stem and 750mm bars, as well as a setback
dropper post.
I am more comfortable on the 18.5" Superfly (2014), which has a longer top tube.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

seat_boy said:


> The Trek factory demo truck stopped by our neck of the woods today, and I was able to demo a Stache 9:


That's a nice looking bike. :thumbsup:


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

On the trek board at MTBR, a person has a nice close up of how tight you can suck in the rear wheel. I don't want to steal his thunder so here's his thread:

http://forums.mtbr.com/trek/stache-stranglehold-dropout-axle-setting-971468.html


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## EddieZ (Oct 9, 2014)

I had the opportunity to test ride the Trek Stache 9 at Dirtfest in PA last month. I did have fun on it, on the Allegripis fast, flowy terrain. Being that my primary rides are a 29er and a fatbike, I LOVED the 29+ Wheelset. In fact, I left that festival knowing that sooner or later, I'll be riding 29+ wheels. 

As for the Stache 9 itself, I was less impressed. I'm simply not interested in another hardtail in my collection. I'm too Husky, and the terrain in my normal Northern NJ parks seemed to demand FS. I'm also not a huge fan of the 1x gearing, I never had anything against a front derailleur and a second (or third) Chainring. 

Anyway, I'm holding out till 29+ FS bikes are more common and cheaper.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

EddieZ said:


> I'm also not a huge fan of the 1x gearing, I never had anything against a front derailleur and a second (or third) Chainring.


You'll get some 29+ FS options [see Mike C's Lenz 29+ thread], but I bet you won't find any that are not strictly 1x setups. Trying to fit a bike tire with the uber short CS that the market is demanding is only possible with a 1X setup.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

MrIcky said:


> On the trek board at MTBR, a person has a nice close up of how tight you can suck in the rear wheel. I don't want to steal his thunder so here's his thread:
> 
> http://forums.mtbr.com/trek/stache-stranglehold-dropout-axle-setting-971468.html


I highly recommend running the shortest chain stay as possible. The bike handles like a slot car. If you demo the bike, ask them to shorten the stay and at least give it a go.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

The one thing I do not like about this bike is you can barely get it to fit on a Thule T2 rack. See pic below, the day I brought it home.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Wow - is a close-up distortion or something??

Seems to dwarf the Subaru


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

There's about a 1-foot rise to my driveway. Pic was taken with my iPhone.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

vikb said:


> You'll get some 29+ FS options [see Mike C's Lenz 29+ thread], but I bet you won't find any that are not strictly 1x setups. Trying to fit a bike tire with the uber short CS that the market is demanding is only possible with a 1X setup.


Part of the reason I'm hesitant to run out and purchase a Gnarvester AL is because I'm confident the reason I enjoyed the Stache+ so much was because of the short stays. I'm waiting to see if someone can match those short stays (405mm!) without the Boost standards.

It's cool that Lenz will build Mikesee a bike with short chainstays and a more common hub (150mm), but not everyone can afford his stuff, either.


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## McGoon (Feb 17, 2013)

PHeller said:


> I'm waiting to see if someone can match those short stays (405mm!) without the Boost standards.


Seems like you would be giving up a big part of what makes the whole thing "work". I'm sure someone will end up doing it, but from what I've read the Boost148 made it possible to have short stays, normal Q, and a stiff wheel.

I bought one knowing nothing I already owned was going to swap over - it was time to upgrade.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It is my understanding that the same could have been accomplished with a 150mm hub and an 73mm BB, but perhaps I've heard wrong.


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## ghood (Dec 26, 2011)

jdcatnau said:


> The one thing I do not like about this bike is you can barely get it to fit on a Thule T2 rack. See pic below, the day I brought it home.


If you lean the bike away from you when bringing up the hook, then lean it back once the hook it in position, will it hook near the fork where it's supposed to?


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

ghood said:


> If you lean the bike away from you when bringing up the hook, then lean it back once the hook it in position, will it hook near the fork where it's supposed to?


I'll have to try that. Thanks ghood! 
I was going to see if I could remove a "stop" on the arm that the hook attaches to. I'd loose some security but I'm not one to leave my bike on the rack unattended.


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## MTB Pilot (Oct 23, 2010)

PHeller said:


> Part of the reason I'm hesitant to run out and purchase a Gnarvester AL is because I'm confident the reason I enjoyed the Stache+ so much was because of the short stays. I'm waiting to see if someone can match those short stays (405mm!) without the Boost standards.
> 
> It's cool that Lenz will build Mikesee a bike with short chainstays and a more common hub (150mm), but not everyone can afford his stuff, either.


You meant 420mm, right? My Gnarvester is set a 460mm now, with at least 15mm left and its as playful and easy to lift as any other short stay bike I've had.


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## zsommer79 (Aug 13, 2012)

jdcatnau said:


> The one thing I do not like about this bike is you can barely get it to fit on a Thule T2 rack. See pic below, the day I brought it home.


My yakima hold up isn't much better but if you air the tire down some and really shove it you can get it. Depending on how handy you are you could probably cut the tubing and extend the arm with some smaller tubing and a couple of pins.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I bought a Stache 9 in the Uk about two weeks ago.

Here's my thoughts on it, probably ridden about 120 miles all off road now.

Sram X1 is fine, can’t see me wanting anything else in terms of a gear set up, works flawlessly and much more intuitive. I have always been a Shimano Xt man , running 2 x 10 on my other bike, but Sram X1 is much better.

Manitou Magnum fork worked very well, will leave alone for the moment to let it settle in etc, works very well with the 3" front tyre. Sag set at 25%, but will play with settings to fine tune. Front end felt very secure with large wheel and 110mm spacing.

Tyres are now tubeless and ran at 12 psi front and rear. Sounds like a tractor at speed, wide bars at 740mm give a sort of invincible feeling.

I went for the 19.5 inch frame , look carefully at the Trek geometry, as it is actually 18.5 from centre of bottom bracket to top of seat tube. I’m 5 10 1/2 tall with a 32 “ inside leg.

Dropper post, didn't like it at first ( never used one before), but can see the benefit now.

Bit slower on the climbs , but doesn’t seem to mind, it feels nicely sedate in a relaxed sort of way - it just doesn’t want to be rushed ( which is fine my me), and the grip is impressive.

Like a bulldozer descending, sort of rolls and thunders over all sorts of things with the forks and 29 x 3 inch tyres.

I like a lot….

Very different from my Cannondale F29 lefty, which is good, didn’t want two bikes which were in any way similar.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Lean the bike over, swing the bar up, then put the hold down over the wheel at the fork.



zsommer79 said:


> My yakima hold up isn't much better but if you air the tire down some and really shove it you can get it. Depending on how handy you are you could probably cut the tubing and extend the arm with some smaller tubing and a couple of pins.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

I don't recall what model of Yak rack we have but it works with 29+ and 4" fatbike tires without much issue. :thumbsup:


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## ghood (Dec 26, 2011)

vikb said:


> I don't recall what model of Yak rack we have but it works with 29+ and 4" fatbike tires without much issue. :thumbsup:


The Thule T2 works fine with my buddy's 29+ Ventana, but you do have to lean the bike to get the hook over the high point of the wheel.


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## MTB Pilot (Oct 23, 2010)

Yeah, its always fit in my T2 with no problems getting the hook up to the fork also...


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

Thanks everyone for the rack suggestions. I'll try the leaning method this weekend.


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## adaycj (Sep 30, 2009)

My Wife's Stache 7 (29+) has been an adventure. I'm trying to have a relationship with two local stores. Both had a Stache 9, but both were too big. Both stores agreed to build smaller incoming Stache 9s in the upcoming workdays and let my Wife come in to check fit. One shop never calls (lame), so we visit the other when they call and order a Stache 7. 

Fast forward three weeks, and the order comes in. I visit the shop in the morning and ask if the bike will be prepped by early evening. It obviously has issues, brake levers pointed up, kinked cable, flat fork pressure ... And I ask for a Woman's specific seat. I pick a $40 one and the shop agrees to swap even up. They tell me it will be ready before evening.

I arrive with my wife for a quick run down and final purchase. They offer a ride in the lot, but the bike won't shift. The rear derailleur it out of whack. The limits aren't set either and the chain tries to jump into the spokes. The levers are still set sky high, and the only thing actually fixed right is the seat. I can fix all the contact point stuff, and they supposedly sort the shifting and we pay. They charge my card for $60 for a $40 seat and tried to keep the original one. I note the error and they fix it. I get home and start looking everything over. After 15 minutes of sorting things, I'm ready to start a derailleur adjust. I spin the cranks and notice a bent wheel. Not a little bent, but 10mm bent. And not out of true, but dented down. I return to the store to show them. I note that no pedals have been mounted, so the bike was not ridden since the phurchase. The employee starts with the "we will have to see if Trek can warranty the wheel". I stay calm, but can't help but have usual feeling like my bike shops can't make a sandwich, let alone handle this issue. I finally get an apology, I stay nice, I am polite. But I can't help but feel the shops nearly complete lack of setup led me to buy a defective bike that isn't ride able, and now I have to spend time and effort trying to get it fixed. I kindly tell them I won't be happy unless I get a new wheel from Trek, and that I want them to find out when that will happen tomorrow. I respectfully ask that the owner or manager call me in the morning, and verify that they still have my phone number. 

I feel like bikes are expensive. I feel like I have buyers remorse. I feel like I got hosed by being sold a bike that was not yet acceptable to sell. I fell like a shop that can't see an obvious defect won't be able to install the wheel (I know, an awfully easy thing). I feel like I'm going to have to wait a month to get all this sorted. My wife is ready to ride her 13 year old hard tail and just say screw it. Why does it have to be like this?


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

adaycj said:


> My Wife's Stache 7 (29+) has been an adventure. I'm trying to have a relationship with two local stores. Both had a Stache 9, but both were too big. Both stores agreed to build smaller incoming Stache 9s in the upcoming workdays and let my Wife come in to check fit. One shop never calls (lame), so we visit the other when they call and order a Stache 7.
> 
> Fast forward three weeks, and the order comes in. I visit the shop in the morning and ask if the bike will be prepped by early evening. It obviously has issues, brake levers pointed up, kinked cable, flat fork pressure ... And I ask for a Woman's specific seat. I pick a $40 one and the shop agrees to swap even up. They tell me it will be ready before evening.
> 
> ...


You have been blessed with a crappy LBS.
If they don't do anything about it, write to Trek directly and see if they can sort it out.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

CannondaleF9 said:


> You have been blessed with a crappy LBS.
> If they don't do anything about it, write to Trek directly and see if they can sort it out.


Yup. Sorry to hear about your troubles. That sucks. There are great LBS and terrible LBS....you at least know which one you have and can take precautions.

I've got certain LBS I wouldn't trust to sell me a jersey and others that are awesome. I give my business to the guys that know their stuff and act like pros.

If you are really feeling burned and paid by credit card take the bike back and call your credit card company from the store explaining that you were not given what you paid for and to reverse the charges. I've done that with other businesses and had my problem solved suddenly.


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

yup, return for full refund and never go back.


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## adaycj (Sep 30, 2009)

vikb said:


> Yup. Sorry to hear about your troubles. That sucks. There are great LBS and terrible LBS....you at least know which one you have and can take precautions.
> 
> I've got certain LBS I wouldn't trust to sell me a jersey and others that are awesome. I give my business to the guys that know their stuff and act like pros.
> 
> If you are really feeling burned and paid by credit card take the bike back and call your credit card company from the store explaining that you were not given what you paid for and to reverse the charges. I've done that with other businesses and had my problem solved suddenly.


I know part of this is that you get out what you put in, but there are no shortage of bad LBSs around here. I am trying. I do understand that the shop likey didn't damage the wheel in the first place.

I feel like I have a pretty good argument for a refund if things get stupid. I mean the thing is new and can't even be used for the intended purpose hours after I phurchased it. The trick is that I'm not interested in waiting many weeks to realize that it isn't going work out.


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

you shouldn't even hafta deal with any inconvenience whatsoever at this point. zilch, nada.

they couldn't even build the bike up even half correctly. then they send the thing out with a bent wheel? really?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Could you alert us to the name and location of this bike shop so we know who to avoid?


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

The leaning method worked!


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

jdcatnau said:


> The leaning method worked!


not gonna lie, that's a $ick ass looking bike!


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## ghood (Dec 26, 2011)

jdcatnau said:


> The leaning method worked!


Excellent. 
That is a sweet bike. I wish Trek would come to my neighborhood with a Demo day.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

For those on the fence about this bike, you should pick up the latest issue of Bike Mag 🏻. I believed they had the same statement as I did in the Trek Forum about short stays. I was curious what they were going to say after their "Blueprint" series on their YouTube channel.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

sandyeggo said:


> Well Crap.
> 
> Trek had a demo today at my local trails. I rode the Stache 29+. I was really thinking I'd hate it - I've had several 29ers (C'Dale Flash ,Redline Monocog, C'Dale Trail SSer, SC Highball) and never really liked any of them (except perhaps the Monocog). At 5'7", the 29'ers always felt 'big' to me. I converted a C'Dale Rush to 650b and fell in love with the wheelsize.
> 
> ...


Have you decided which way to go? It sounds like I'm in a similar position, I've not been able to give up riding my Farley as the huge traction makes it a lot of fun crashing along slippy rooty trails that always scared the crap out of me when on the 29er. The super low pressure tyres are increasingly hard work on the dry trails though and on some faster stuff, I'm finding it tough running rigid but don't think I can go back to the FS 29er. I don't want to convert the Farley 6 to suspension though as it's not a quick change so I've been keeping an eye out for a second hand Farley 8 but that looks unlikely as few seem to have been sold in the UK.

The more I read about the Stache though I'm increasingly thinking it's exactly what I'm looking for, I thought 27.5+ sounded the ideal option and was considering changing the front of the Fuel to 27.5+ but a couple of reviews comparing 27.5+ and 29+ seem to favour the latter as being closer to a fat bike in terms of feel and traction.

John


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

JohnMcL7 said:


> Have you decided which way to go? It sounds like I'm in a similar position, I've not been able to give up riding my Farley as the huge traction makes it a lot of fun crashing along slippy rooty trails that always scared the crap out of me when on the 29er. The super low pressure tyres are increasingly hard work on the dry trails though and on some faster stuff, I'm finding it tough running rigid but don't think I can go back to the FS 29er. I don't want to convert the Farley 6 to suspension though as it's not a quick change so I've been keeping an eye out for a second hand Farley 8 but that looks unlikely as few seem to have been sold in the UK.
> 
> The more I read about the Stache though I'm increasingly thinking it's exactly what I'm looking for, I thought 27.5+ sounded the ideal option and was considering changing the front of the Fuel to 27.5+ but a couple of reviews comparing 27.5+ and 29+ seem to favour the latter as being closer to a fat bike in terms of feel and traction.
> 
> John


I chose to go the Bluto / 27.5+ route. In my opinion, I chose wrong. Now, that could be because of the wheels/tire combination I bought (Vee Trax Fatty 3.25s on Stans Hugo). The largish tires on the wide rims feels too close to the the 4" fat setup on the stock Farley.

I've ridden it 5 times with this setup and I'm just not sold on it. It isn't as grippy as the fat setup and it isn't nearly as playful and fun as the Stache 29+. It feels slightly faster than the stock Farley setup but only marginally so.

If I had to do it again, I'd get the Stache. I was really impressed with the bike.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

sandyeggo said:


> I chose to go the Bluto / 27.5+ route. In my opinion, I chose wrong. Now, that could be because of the wheels/tire combination I bought (Vee Trax Fatty 3.25s on Stans Hugo). The largish tires on the wide rims feels too close to the the 4" fat setup on the stock Farley.
> 
> I've ridden it 5 times with this setup and I'm just not sold on it. It isn't as grippy as the fat setup and it isn't nearly as playful and fun as the Stache 29+. It feels slightly faster than the stock Farley setup but only marginally so.
> 
> If I had to do it again, I'd get the Stache. I was really impressed with the bike.


Thanks very much for the reply, I'm sorry to hear the 27.5+ route hasn't worked for you which seems consistent with other information I've read that 29+ seems more suitable as a faster fat bike alternative.

I went to the world cup downhill championships in Fort William at the weekend and by chance one of the bike shops demonstrating there had a Stache 9. It wasn't ridable there but I chatted to one of the guys there and this bike is going to be a demo bike at another trail centre so I'm going to find out when it's available and hopefully get a shot.

John


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

JohnMcL7 said:


> Thanks very much for the reply, I'm sorry to hear the 27.5+ route hasn't worked for you which seems consistent with other information I've read that 29+ seems more suitable as a faster fat bike alternative.
> 
> I went to the world cup downhill championships in Fort William at the weekend and by chance one of the bike shops demonstrating there had a Stache 9. It wasn't ridable there but I chatted to one of the guys there and this bike is going to be a demo bike at another trail centre so I'm going to find out when it's available and hopefully get a shot.
> 
> John


Let us know what you think after you get a chance to ride it!


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## sandwich (Sep 24, 2005)

so is the front hub on the 5 100 or 110mm? would love to grab the 5 and think about the magnum in addition/later.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

sandwich said:


> so is the front hub on the 5 100 or 110mm? would love to grab the 5 and think about the magnum in addition/later.


Let me see. You could look at the specifications on the Trek web site or I could do that for you. The 5 has a 100 mm hub.


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## mczen (Mar 9, 2008)

Sandwich, the 5 has a 100mm front hub NOT the boost 110. I got a 9 for my birthday (awesome girlfriend) and love it. I demoed the 5 and liked it but already have a fully rigid Krampus so I decided to go all out. Currently the Magnum is spaced for the boost 110, that may change or you would have to build a new front wheel (or spacer?).


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## sandwich (Sep 24, 2005)

mczen said:


> Sandwich, the 5 has a 100mm front hub NOT the boost 110. I got a 9 for my birthday (awesome girlfriend) and love it. I demoed the 5 and liked it but already have a fully rigid Krampus so I decided to go all out. Currently the Magnum is spaced for the boost 110, that may change or you would have to build a new front wheel (or spacer?).


thanks! how do you like it compared to the krampus? i had a krampus and thought it was OK. I was let down my the knards and found I preferred my FS bike more. The trek is bringing a bit of a different angle to the game, which I like. Does it pay off on trail?


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

My LBS just got the Stache 5 in so I am going to look at in it a bit. I am on the fence about the 5 vs the 7. Am I gonna be wanting the suspension fork down the road? New fork, hub and so on, that is going to add up past the price of the 7 quick, right? Intended use will be damp days, and snow, will I be safe with the 5? I know that only I can make the final decision, but what are you opinions. by the way, my local terrain is northern Illinois.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

I was on the fence too, but ended up putting my money on the 7. Better components and more versatile. Listening to fat-bikers who ride 4 seasons were the final thing to sway me.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> My LBS just got the Stache 5 in so I am going to look at in it a bit. I am on the fence about the 5 vs the 7. Am I gonna be wanting the suspension fork down the road? New fork, hub and so on, that is going to add up past the price of the 7 quick, right? Intended use will be damp days, and snow, will I be safe with the 5? I know that only I can make the final decision, but what are you opinions. by the way, my local terrain is northern Illinois.


I have a 5, and I want a suspension fork. You can carry a lot speed on DH sections and a suspension fork would be much better than a rigid fork.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

MrIcky said:


> I was on the fence too, but ended up putting my money on the 7. Better components and more versatile. Listening to fat-bikers who ride 4 seasons were the final thing to sway me.


I'm thinking a 7 with an upgrade to XT brakes is going to be the ticket for me. I don't want the dropper post, the drive train difference isn't that big, and it sounds like the fork isn't all that different. I'll upgrade the hubs eventually, it just doesn't need to be done right away.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

That's kind of what I was thinking. It has been a long time since I rode with a rigid fork on the trails, but I was thinking that the extra volume in the tire may make up a little bit for the fork but I think I should just spend the extra money and maybe have to wait to get a 7. Thanks for the input guys.


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## sandwich (Sep 24, 2005)

askibum02 said:


> I'm thinking a 7 with an upgrade to XT brakes is going to be the ticket for me. I don't want the dropper post, the drive train difference isn't that big, and it sounds like the fork isn't all that different. I'll upgrade the hubs eventually, it just doesn't need to be done right away.





> From Manitou tech - Shanan Barth.
> 
> "Different inner diameters, different materials. Pro stanchions are 7000 series aluminum, Comps are 6000 series. Due to different air systems and compression systems they are also sized differently internally. No cross compatibility whatsoever between the two forks besides the outer casting."


https://fthumb0.mtb-news.de/cache/9...E1XzA0XzIzdW0yMl8yNF8xNi1vcmlnaW5hbC5wbmc.png

Are you sure? It sounds like the forks are completely different. I've heard good things about ABS+, so it may not be worth the concern, but if yogiprophet is right, then the pro version is a significantly better fork. I doubt very much that they're using two different stanchion materials though, that's a lot of cost for such a niche product.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I looked, rode and liked. Decided to go with the 5. I was really surprised how agile it felt for such a tall tire. I'll pick it up tomorrow. Setting it up tubeless, this is my first bike set up tubeless so what do I need to carry with me?


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## mczen (Mar 9, 2008)

IMHO I do think you can feel it on the trail compared to the Krampus. Having been able to ride them back to back the Stache feels quicker, nimbler and maybe accelerates a tad faster. I do have a both bikes set up tubeless and with almost identical gearing. The fork allows you to plow thru the rough stuff without thinking about line choice to much and my save your bacon in the right instance of poor line choice and speed. I look at it this way, Krampus 29+ ver1.0 the Stache 29+ ver2.0. Both fun bikes but the Stache has a slight advantage in performance and handling as a trail bike.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Fuzzwardo said:


> Setting it up tubeless, this is my first bike set up tubeless so what do I need to carry with me?


For sure I'd carry:

- spare 29er tube
- tire levers
- patch kit
- pump

I also carry some optional stuff:

- CO2 inflater and 2 cartridges
- tubeless tire plugs


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> I looked, rode and liked. Decided to go with the 5. I was really surprised how agile it felt for such a tall tire. I'll pick it up tomorrow. Setting it up tubeless, this is my first bike set up tubeless so what do I need to carry with me?


 Carry as in the ride after tubeless? Tube and mini pump or CO2 at the most. Most the time I don't even carry a tube.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

askibum02 said:


> I'm thinking a 7 with an upgrade to XT brakes is going to be the ticket for me. I don't want the dropper post, the drive train difference isn't that big, and it sounds like the fork isn't all that different. I'll upgrade the hubs eventually, it just doesn't need to be done right away.


I'm thinking the same, the 9 is hugely expensive here (£2800, quite a bit more than my Fuel was brand new) and I don't think I'm getting much benefit for nearly a grand more than the 7.

My local bike shop can get the 7 in my size in a couple of days, tough choice as I'm concerned if I wait I might not be able to get one.

John


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## adaycj (Sep 30, 2009)

My Wife's Stache turned out fine. The bike store tried to swap a wheel from a Stache 9. It didn't go well, as some things were different. Many hours after they said it would be done, it wasn't and there was a sizable gash in the paint near the dropout. They called Trek, I called Trek. In the end Trek sent a new bike. The LBS built it, and despite a few minor issues, they bike was perfect. 

In the end I'm pretty impressed. The LBS, despite their complete inability to fix or setup anything more complicated than a glass of water, did stay positive and take steps to solve the problem. Also, despite the fact that Trek shipped the LBS a defective bike, they stepped up and made it right. 

For this thread, my contribution is to carefully check your Stache before you take delivery. I'd guess that most are fine, but I could have saved myself some hassle by looking over my Stache better before I paid.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

JohnMcL7

You are right about the 9 being expensive in the UK, I have bought one.

If you are near me in South Wales, we could arrange to meet up - you can have a ride on the 9 and make your mind up.

I am impressed with the bike, in fact it is now my go to bike for each ride.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

JohnMcL7 said:


> My local bike shop can get the 7 in my size in a couple of days, tough choice as I'm concerned if I wait I might not be able to get one.
> 
> John


Wow! I called a shop today and the earliest they can get me a 7 is late Sept.:madman: He said he can get me a 9 in about a month, and he offered me a pretty sweet deal because he said he wanted to get me in a bike faster and he wanted to see a 9 in person. I may just go for it. The deal he offered makes it worth it for all the upgrades the 9 offers. Now I need to sell my ROS 9 in order to get it by SWMBO.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

Sneak Peek: Praxis Works wide range 11-40 10-speed MTB cassette - Mtbr.com

While I have only had my Stache 5 for 2 days and haven't had much ride time, Is this a possible solution if I would need a little more low end gearing? this is my first bike running a 1x system so I am not sure what to expect .


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> Sneak Peek: Praxis Works wide range 11-40 10-speed MTB cassette - Mtbr.com
> 
> While I have only had my Stache 5 for 2 days and haven't had much ride time, Is this a possible solution if I would need a little more low end gearing? this is my first bike running a 1x system so I am not sure what to expect .


Gearing is actually not bad. I live in a place where if you want a long DH section you have a long sometime steep UH section. You just have to stand and pedal and think about your gearing more. I only ride twice a week and I'm over 200 lbs.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

Our terrain isn't too hilly. But I am currently 265lbs . I can usually get by running the middle ring on my Fuel on my local trails . Time will tell I guess. I just wasn't sure if that would be compatible with the new Stache.


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## Ralph (Aug 22, 2014)

Finally found a shop with a 5 and a 7. Ended up with the 5. Love the color. Next week I'll change out the bars to something wider, may swap the seat for an MTB Pure and will add a one-up 42t with Radr cage.


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## floorguy724 (Apr 20, 2004)

Ralph said:


> Finally found a shop with a 5 and a 7. Ended up with the 5. Love the color. Next week I'll change out the bars to something wider, may swap the seat for an MTB Pure and will add a one-up 42t with Radr cage.


Awesome! Any pics.

All of my local dealers are saying no Stache 5 until September!?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I was told no 7 until September. I brought my 5 home on Friday. I fell in love with that color when I finally got to see it in person.


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## Ralph (Aug 22, 2014)

floorguy724 said:


> Awesome! Any pics.
> 
> All of my local dealers are saying no Stache 5 until September!?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


I'm in the Sacramento area, went to 4 shops and got a lot of different info on availability. It really depends on what the LBS wants to push. I went to the shop today just to see what dates they had and, to my surprise, they had a 5 and a 7 on the floor. Generally, the more expensive 9 is available now, the 7 early July. The 5 is hit or miss. I got lucky.


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## Ralph (Aug 22, 2014)

Fuzzwardo said:


> I was told no 7 until September. I brought my 5 home on Friday. I fell in love with that color when I finally got to see it in person.


I was leaning towards the 7 because of price and components. Saw the 5 and changed my mind. The purple on the 7 didn't do it for me. I should add I have a purple fat bike and love the color.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

Denis9999 said:


> JohnMcL7
> 
> You are right about the 9 being expensive in the UK, I have bought one.
> 
> ...


Thanks very much for the generous offer, unfortunately I'm pretty much at the other end of the country in the north of Scotland. What was your main go to bike before the Stache?


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

To those who already have one of the new staches: when you climb, does it feel like the front end is going to come up on you with those ultra short chainstays?


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I was only on the trails for a lil bit today but I didn't notice the front being light during any climbs but truthfully it isn't very hilly where I ride and it was pretty wet out. For what it's worth I have a the Stache 5.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I live in South Wales and the local terrain is quite hilly.

I don't notice the front end coming up on steep climbs at all, even when the slope is very high percentage gradient.

My other bike is very different, Cannondale F29 Carbon 2 - I like the bikes to be fundamentally different, the 9 handles most things very well, only really losing out in the flat fireroad / smoother climbing performance really.


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## Mogwai77 (Dec 29, 2014)

Could somebody provide a measurement of the Q-factor? My LBS in Germany tries to find out - but this takes already too long for me.

I run currently a Felt DD30 and the q-factor with 225mm hurts my knees after an hour of riding. But I love the traction and comfort of the big tyres so my hope is that a Stache might combine the optimum of the two worlds: smaller q-factor and improved traction due to 3" tires. BIG THANKS.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

MrIcky said:


> To those who already have one of the new staches: when you climb, does it feel like the front end is going to come up on you with those ultra short chainstays?


Mine did a little bit, but I am also running 20mm riser bars and I had all but one spacer under my stem. I move my stem down one spacer and no issue. The reason for lowering my stem wasn't for climbing but getting lower for cornering.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Mogwai77 said:


> Could somebody provide a measurement of the Q-factor? My LBS in Germany tries to find out - but this takes already too long for me.
> 
> I run currently a Felt DD30 and the q-factor with 225mm hurts my knees after an hour of riding. But I love the traction and comfort of the big tyres so my hope is that a Stache might combine the optimum of the two worlds: smaller q-factor and improved traction due to 3" tires. BIG THANKS.


Pretty easy to figure this out yourself, but I just looked it up. The cranks on the Stache 7 are SRAM GX 1000, so I went to the SRAM website and looked up that crankset. There is a listing of documentation, and in the 'Frame Fit' document, the Q-factor is listed at 169mm for the Boost GX 1000 crankset. 225mm sounds like a lot!


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## Mogwai77 (Dec 29, 2014)

great - thanks - I just got the confirmation as well from another Trek dealer who measured a Stache 9 in his shop - however at first I had to explain what a q-factor is ;-)

thanks bikeny


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

So I ordered a Stache 9 today and the warehouse actually had a 19.5" in stock. I had planned on getting a 7 but I didn't feel like waiting until the end of Sept to get it. I got a great deal that I couldn't pass up. I deal that directly with the GM of the store who offered the bike at $3600 if he got to display it in has store for a few days and take pictures for his website. He then took another $200 off because I didn't want the dropper. All told for the bike, upgrading the front brakes to 203mm and moving the 180mm rotors to the back, trading the dropper for a Rhythm Pro post, and converting to tubeless, I paid just over $3400 before tax. I was planning on upgrading to upgrade the 7 to XT brakes anyway, so the approximate $400 over and above that was well worth it for all the upgrades the 9 has over the 7. 


Sent from a telecommunication device with a touch screen keyboard.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

askibum02 said:


> So I ordered a Stache 9 today and the warehouse actually had a 19.5" in stock. I had planned on getting a 7 but I didn't feel like waiting until the end of Sept to get it.


Nice you didn't have to wait. Enjoy the new bike. :thumbsup:


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

askibum02 said:


> So I ordered a Stache 9 today and the warehouse actually had a 19.5" in stock. I had planned on getting a 7 but I didn't feel like waiting until the end of Sept to get it. I got a great deal that I couldn't pass up. I deal that directly with the GM of the store who offered the bike at $3600 if he got to display it in has store for a few days and take pictures for his website. He then took another $200 off because I didn't want the dropper. All told for the bike, upgrading the front brakes to 203mm and moving the 180mm rotors to the back, trading the dropper for a Rhythm Pro post, and converting to tubeless, I paid just over $3400 before tax. I was planning on upgrading to upgrade the 7 to XT brakes anyway, so the approximate $400 over and above that was well worth it for all the upgrades the 9 has over the 7.
> 
> Sent from a telecommunication device with a touch screen keyboard.


Congrats! Looking forward to the ride report!!


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## SyT (Jul 27, 2005)

Can someone with a Stache 9 tell me the a to c measurement with the fork fully extended?


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## Pantera Rider (Nov 7, 2005)

Stopped by World Cycle in Boise a couple of weeks ago to leave my # for when they got the Stache 9 in stock. Surprised to find out they had just received 2 that were still in the box. I gave them money, they put the thing together and 2 hours later I was on my way home with my Stache. Been riding as much as I can on the local trails and Bogus Basin. All I have to say is awesome. I'm really liking the 29+.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Pantera Rider said:


> Stopped by World Cycle in Boise a couple of weeks ago to leave my # for when they got the Stache 9 in stock. Surprised to find out they had just received 2 that were still in the box. I gave them money, they put the thing together and 2 hours later I was on my way home with my Stache. Been riding as much as I can on the local trails and Bogus Basin. All I have to say is awesome. I'm really liking the 29+.


Congrats! My 7 is supposed to be at George's on Wednesday. I've been really looking forward to hitting Bogus on it, so I'm jealous of your instant gratification.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

That's basically how I got mine. The store told me that the 5 would be there the next morning. I was there a few minutes before UPS showed up so I was able to watch the bike get assembled and take it for a spin. I could not believe how light that fork was.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

To those who have a 5, do you feel that the brakes just don't have the power to stop? Some time I wonder if I am going to slow down in time before I need to look for a bail out line. I ride my 5 just as hard as my 140 mm trail bike. I'm thinking of picking up some Zee brakes to see if they will help. Just curious.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I got this from my bike shop yesterday.


They are going to display it for a week in exchange for knocking a decent amount of money off the price. I don't know if I can wait that long.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

askibum02 said:


> I got this from my bike shop yesterday.
> 
> 
> They are going to display it for a week in exchange for knocking a decent amount of money off the price. I don't know if I can wait that long.


Nice 🏻


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

Just want to give a personal experience on my bike. I have had my Stache 5 for just under 2 weeks now, and love it. I have been riding a 2014 Fuel ex7 so this is an apples to oranges comparison. With the wet conditions in my area lately, I wouldn't dare take my Fuel out, wouldn't have the confidence in the tire to keep traction. The Stache just hooks period. It's not like I am a super fast rider, I would say intermediate. Do I miss the suspension on the Fuel, yes, but the large tires do help absorb the trail. Will I be as fast on a dry trail on the Stache as the Fuel, probably not . Are both bikes fun, hell yes. I am uncertain if I want to leave the Stache 5 rigid or throw a suspension fork on it down the road. I do feel the rigidness a bit in the back, but don't know how much the rigid vs the suspension fork would change my riding experience.


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

Fuzzwardo said:


> Just want to give a personal experience on my bike. I have had my Stache 5 for just under 2 weeks now, and love it. I have been riding a 2014 Fuel ex7 so this is an apples to oranges comparison. With the wet conditions in my area lately, I wouldn't dare take my Fuel out, wouldn't have the confidence in the tire to keep traction. The Stache just hooks period. It's not like I am a super fast rider, I would say intermediate. Do I miss the suspension on the Fuel, yes, but the large tires do help absorb the trail. Will I be as fast on a dry trail on the Stache as the Fuel, probably not . Are both bikes fun, hell yes. I am uncertain if I want to leave the Stache 5 rigid or throw a suspension fork on it down the road. I do feel the rigidness a bit in the back, but don't know how much the rigid vs the suspension fork would change my riding experience.


Good stuff. 
Thanks for posting! :thumbsup:


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I picked up my new bike yesterday, but unfortunately didn't get a chance to ride it, there were scattered thunderstorms all over the area and I didn't want to take any chances. Today I did a little work. I changed out the stem of a Race Face Atlas 50mm and added a Niner YAWYD cap, bedded the brakes, added a little more air to the fork, took off the reflectors, and put my Garmin wheel speed sensor on. I can't wait to take it out later this week!!


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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

I was told by the owner of the lbs where I got my bike yesterday that his rep was a very die hard fat bike fan and the rep told him that he is selling his fat bike to get one of these. The owner couldn't believe it but that's what his rep did so that speaks a lot for the 29+ to me at least. The one the lbs has is already sold just waiting on a couple of parts to come in for the owner so he can pick it up. I can understand wanting some certain things but getting carbon pedals just because they're carbon... well oh well it's not my money! LOL


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

The power of 29+ is hard to resist.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

askibum02 said:


> I picked up my new bike yesterday, but unfortunately didn't get a chance to ride it, there were scattered thunderstorms all over the area and I didn't want to take any chances. Today I did a little work. I changed out the stem of a Race Face Atlas 50mm and added a Niner YAWYD cap, bedded the brakes, added a little more air to the fork, took off the reflectors, and put my Garmin wheel speed sensor on. I can't wait to take it out later this week!!


Take advantage and shorten those stays!


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

askibum02 said:


> I picked up my new bike yesterday


I am the HULK! With envy! 
:thumbsup:


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Bought a Stache 5 a few days ago with every intention of ripping off most the parts to upgrade it. However, even though I am damaged goods at the moment and not able to ride very much or very far, the components surprised me enough that I am no longer going to do any of that. Who knew Deore worked so well? Don't get me wrong, upgrades are coming, but it would be stupid not to use this stuff, it works that good. Really love the way it rides, and it will be a rigid bike forever. What an efficient and fun machine. Always wanted something like this. I think Trek will sell a buttload of these things, and the 5 will lead the way. Just a huge bang for the buck kind of bike, worthy of any upgrade you wish to bolt on as the miles tick by. If anyone is in doubt, or sitting on the fence, do yourself a favor and don't go test ride it, because your bank account will be missing about $1,500 shortly thereafter. But if you do make the mistake of test riding the bike and ownage shortly thereafter, go tubeless right off the bat. I am running 14 rear, 13.5 front, and it rocks. May go even lower, just need to heal up enough to put it through it's paces and find out.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Not surprised, that's mainly what I used to build my loaner/rental bikes. Modern Deore is as good as XT/XTR of 10 years ago, very smooth and precise, of course now XT is much more smooth and precise as well. If I were to spend money out the gate, I'd upgrade the shifters to XT - reason being a lot smoother shift AND the Dual click on the trigger.



litespeedaddict said:


> Bought a Stache 5 a few days ago with every intention of ripping off most the parts to upgrade it. However, even though I am damaged goods at the moment and not able to ride very much or very far, the components surprised me enough that I am no longer going to do any of that. Who knew Deore worked so well?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

I just bought a set of Shimano XTR M9000 brakes (160 rotor) and stuck 'em on my Echo, and when compared to the Deore's on the Stache with the 180 rotors, to be brutally honest, I am hard pressed to tell the difference between the two. They work that good. I am considering biding my time until Shimano decides to make Boost XTR 1X cranks. Because I am a snob, if Shimano made that specific crank set, I would go full XTR on this bike, and because of how well Deore works on it now, I have the time to wait.


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## tmbrown (Jun 9, 2007)

> Take advantage and shorten those stays!


Most likely you'll have to shorten the chain also, I slammed my 9 forward and the chain was to long&#8230;
I was going to buy a new chain&#8230; I'm new to the 11spd thing and I see they have a pc-1130 chain on this stock, is there a big difference between the X1 chain and the pc-1130?


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

tmbrown said:


> Most likely you'll have to shorten the chain also, I slammed my 9 forward and the chain was to long&#8230;
> I was going to buy a new chain&#8230; I'm new to the 11spd thing and I see they have a pc-1130 chain on this stock, is there a big difference between the X1 chain and the pc-1130?


Ah, I have the 10-speed and had no issues with the chain. I would guess weight and finish may make the chain last longer if you live in a wet climate.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

So far beyond pissed right now! I was loading my bike on the rack because I was planning on going for a ride tomorrow and I noticed the headset is loose. I paid a lot of money for a bike I can't ride tomorrow like I wanted to.


Sent from a telecommunication device with a touch screen keyboard.


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## Chader09 (Aug 14, 2013)

askibum02 said:


> So far beyond pissed right now! I was loading my bike on the rack because I was planning on going for a ride tomorrow and I noticed the headset is loose. I paid a lot of money for a bike I can't ride tomorrow like I wanted to.


Youtube *adjust threadless headset*,
Adjust headset,
ride... repeat as needed ?

Really not that hard and well worth your time to learn.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I currently ride a 2012 17.5 inch superfly. What size stache 29+ would you all recommend? I did a quick ride around the block on the 19.5 and it felt ok. My LBS suggested I buy the 17.5 version and has it on order


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

The sizing on the Stache 9 confused me, but i followed my bike shop advice.

I would normally ride a 18 or 19 bike.

I'm 5 10 tall with a 32 ince inside leg.

I bought a 19.5 frame.
Trek measure them as actual and virtual.
18.5 from centre of bottom bracket to top of the seat tube, the 19.5 is a reference to a virtual horizontal top tube.

My 19.5 is spot on for my height etc.

Just reply to this thread if you need more info, have a look at the Trek geometry charts.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

It's pretty easy really, if you were good on the 17.5", just compare the geo betwen the 2 bikes and get the one closest to the 17.5" SF. Biggest number to look at is Reach and if you have to go either side of where the 17.5" SF is, go longer and run a shorter stem. Also take into account what stem you run on your SF and think if it's 90mm> about sizing up on the Stache and running a shorter stem.



jpc111 said:


> I currently ride a 2012 17.5 inch superfly. What size stache 29+ would you all recommend? I did a quick ride around the block on the 19.5 and it felt ok. My LBS suggested I buy the 17.5 version and has it on order


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

Chader09 said:


> Youtube *adjust threadless headset*,
> Adjust headset,
> ride... repeat as needed ?
> 
> Really not that hard and well worth your time to learn.


I know how to adjust a headset. This is beyond a simple adjustment. There is about a 1/4" of play in the bottom cup. That smells of improper installation.


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## dirt-nerd (Aug 12, 2009)

LBS just got the 7 in but too small for me and I can't get the Stache 9+ out of my head!! I am ready to put my marriage to the test and order one while they are available (before I sell some of my other bikes)!! 
So, whoever has one please keep posting how awesome the bike is!!!


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

dirt-nerd said:


> LBS just got the 7 in but too small for me and I can't get the Stache 9+ out of my head!! I am ready to put my marriage to the test and order one while they are available (before I sell some of my other bikes)!!
> So, whoever has one please keep posting how awesome the bike is!!!


It will be awesome! Do it!

Tell the wife accepting the Stache is way cheaper than a divorce!


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## tadraper (Apr 14, 2010)

dirt-nerd said:


> LBS just got the 7 in but too small for me and I can't get the Stache 9+ out of my head!! I am ready to put my marriage to the test and order one while they are available (before I sell some of my other bikes)!!
> So, whoever has one please keep posting how awesome the bike is!!!


I have had my Stache 9 29+ for a few months it has about 700 miles on it, have set it up tubeless no issues and put a larger from chainring for getting to the trails!! it is my favorite bike does everything i ask it to and does it very well. I was going to wait for the 7 but when i picked it up it was the only location in lower Michigan that had one.

you wont be disappointed with the purchase and your wife will think it is great you have the bike you want!!!!

good luck


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

I am having a blast on my Stache 5 but ACK!..... I have lost two derailleurs /hangers, and one cassette in 500 miles of riding. Lost my 2nd one this morning. Granted I ride the Stache in a bit more rugged/wild terrain than my other bikes but thinking that elevated chainstay makes it easier for branches to get up in there. I have never lost a derailleur before this bike. At least with the 5 the replacement components are relatively cheap.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

dirt-nerd said:


> LBS just got the 7 in but too small for me and I can't get the Stache 9+ out of my head!! I am ready to put my marriage to the test and order one while they are available (before I sell some of my other bikes)!!
> So, whoever has one please keep posting how awesome the bike is!!!


I sit in my garage with beer frequently and admire how beautiful my new Stache 5 is. Even my wife calls it the prettiest bike she's ever seen.

Disclaimer, injured at the moment so all I can do is admire it, really can't comment on the ride much as I only have about 1 mile on it in about 10 days since I bought it. But it was a great mile.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I got out on my Stache 9 the other day after work and put in about 5 miles. The thing rips plain and simple! This bike answers every complaint I had about my 29er. I was surprised how much of a difference there was with the bigger tires and lower pressure. Running 17psi rear and 15psi front, I could fee the tires soaking up the bumps where the fork normally would have needed to do it in the front, and there was less harshness in the rear. The wheels are actually pretty darn stiff too. I have Flow EX on my 29er and I've notice a little bit of flex even at lower speed. I really only get the rear wheel flex once and it wasn't bad at all. The drivetrain performed flawlessly as it should, that one extra gear made a huge difference in the feel of the gearing. After riding 1X10 for so long I was a total fish out of water trying to figure out what gear I needed to be in.

The fork really impressed me. At 350lbs it's been hard to find anything besides a rigid fork that works well. I didn't feel the fork bottom out, it didn't pogo at all, and most importantly, it didn't fee soft. 

The traction is amazing! I was able to fee comfortable leaning into the turns, and I get more comfortable with a little more speed. I also never felt anything close to losing traction pedaling up and over rocks and roots.

Even with the chain stays at 420mm the bike is very playful. There are a few whoop dee dos on the trail I rode and even when I was trying to keep it on the ground the bike wanted to take off. I actually lifted up on a couple small jumps and it felt natural getting a little bit of air, emphasis on little. ;-). That isn't something I could say about my 29er. To be completely fair though I really think my 29er is too big for me. I was right on the lower limit for the size I bought.

I went to ride today and everything was muddy.:madman:


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## Hootbmx (Feb 20, 2012)

litespeedaddict said:


> I sit in my garage with beer frequently and admire how beautiful my new Stache 5 is. Even my wife calls it the prettiest bike she's ever seen.
> 
> Disclaimer, injured at the moment so all I can do is admire it, really can't comment on the ride much as I only have about 1 mile on it in about 10 days since I bought it. But it was a great mile.


Love it! I thought I was the only one that had a problem like this!


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Hootbmx said:


> Love it! I thought I was the only one that had a problem like this!


No. You are not alone. I keep 2 or 3 bikes in my office so I can gaze at them as I work.


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## MadPainterGrafx (Oct 3, 2014)

I keep mine and my kids bikes in my apartment between the couch and dining room but mine is the best looking especially since it's the colors of my favorite MLB Baseball team!! Orange and Black just like the Orioles! LOL


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

LyNx said:


> It's pretty easy really, if you were good on the 17.5", just compare the geo betwen the 2 bikes and get the one closest to the 17.5" SF. Biggest number to look at is Reach and if you have to go either side of where the 17.5" SF is, go longer and run a shorter stem. Also take into account what stem you run on your SF and think if it's 90mm> about sizing up on the Stache and running a shorter stem.


I checked the specs and it indicates the 17.5 as my best bet. My dealer got in a 18.5. The stand over height was definitely too high. Looks like I was right in ordering the 17.5


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

jpc111 said:


> I checked the specs and it indicates the 17.5 as my best bet. My dealer got in a 18.5. The stand over height was definitely too high. Looks like I was right in ordering the 17.5


how tall are ya?


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

newmarketrog said:


> how tall are ya?


5' 8.5" , 30 " inseam on my jeans


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## mgftp (Jun 28, 2015)

jpc111 said:


> 5' 8.5" , 30 " inseam on my jeans


I am 5'10" w/ 30 inch inseam, local bike shop guy seemed strong opinioned on the 17 for me. With that said, I finally made a decision on my next bike, my first real bike after riding big box, decided to go with the Stache 5, now I have till wait till October :\


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I'm 5 10 tall with a 32 inch inside leg.

I was unsure of the size to go for, but my shop recommended the 19.5 inch size.

I have to say this is the right size for me without a doubt.


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

jpc111 said:


> 5' 8.5" , 30 " inseam on my jeans


17.5 good!


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

Denis9999 said:


> I'm 5 10 tall with a 32 inch inside leg.
> 
> I was unsure of the size to go for, but my shop recommended the 19.5 inch size.
> 
> I have to say this is the right size for me without a doubt.


long arms? i'd guess 18.5 for you with 19.5 generally starting around 5'11.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I think thereis some confusion over the sizing, and Trek sizes are confusing in my opinion.

The centre of bb to top of the seat tube on the 19.5 frame is 18.5 inch.

I would normally ride an 18 or 19 inch bike.

Therefore, the 19.5 inch size is a virtual size , it is (in my opinion an 18.5 inch bike).

I do have a longer body in relation to the rest of me, but not that much.

The stand over on the 9 is very generous, wouldn't have gone for a different size for me.

However, I respect that sizing can be difficult and is sometimes down to personal preference etc.


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

i look mostly at effective tt and reach. seat tube length/standover isn't nearly as important.

the 19.5's ett is not virtual, it is what it is.


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## mgftp (Jun 28, 2015)

Anyone know of a way to find a colored rim strip that would match the Stache's "Miami green"? I am new to cut rims but see a lot of people customize the color of these holes.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Yes, just find yourself some coloured Duct Tape or better yet Gorrilla Tape if they do colours.


mgftp said:


> Anyone know of a way to find a colored rim strip that would match the Stache's "Miami green"? I am new to cut rims but see a lot of people customize the color of these holes.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

Summer without new bike makes jack a dull boy.So i got 29+.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

That is one badass bike zeb. Congrats on your new toy.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

zeb said:


> Summer without new bike makes jack a dull boy.So i got 29+.


not any more. can I take it for a spin?


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

zeb said:


> Summer without new bike makes jack a dull boy.So i got 29+.


Green with envy here!
That's what I'm hoping would be my next bike.
Ride report soon please!


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

Those pedals hurt my soul.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

NickandBruce said:


> Those pedals hurt my soul.


Um, I believe you mean sole(s).

You could offer to send some replacements so your soul would feel better. Seems like a no-brainer. Nothing worse than a hurt soul.

Sweet purple nurple. I think I'd like that bike if they made an XXL.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

Matterhorn said:


> Um, I believe you mean sole(s).
> 
> You could offer to send some replacements so your soul would feel better. Seems like a no-brainer. Nothing worse than a hurt soul.
> 
> Sweet purple nurple. I think I'd like that bike if they made an XXL.


Yup I just built one for a customer last week. Its even purtier in person.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I am still waiting on my 5 to come in. I am hearing October, what are others hearing? Now that my shoulder is healed up, I want to ride!


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## mgftp (Jun 28, 2015)

jpc111 said:


> I am still waiting on my 5 to come in. I am hearing October, what are others hearing? Now that my shoulder is healed up, I want to ride!


October on my order.

Patience is hard at times.


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## Bimmer74 (Jun 9, 2013)

adaycj said:


> I stay calm, but can't help but have usual feeling like my bike shops can't make a sandwich, let alone handle this issue...


Amen to that.

No offense any professional who works in a bike shop, but...

The problem with most bike shops is that they're staffed by the kinds of guys who wind up working in bike shops.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

jpc111 said:


> I am still waiting on my 5 to come in. I am hearing October, what are others hearing? Now that my shoulder is healed up, I want to ride!


I've been hearing the sound of Chupacabras and seeing a couple pretty green Staches flying around my local trails. Looks like your sandwich artists have missed out.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Bimmer74 said:


> Amen to that.
> 
> No offense any professional who works in a bike shop, but...
> 
> The problem with most bike shops is that they're staffed by the kinds of guys who wind up working in bike shops.


Yet, we're repeatedly told to protect this outdated business model.


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## bob_m (May 17, 2013)

SS Hack said:


> Yet, we're repeatedly told to protect this outdated business model.


What would be the updated model or the better way? Thanks


----------



## chocolatemoeze (Jun 22, 2005)

Bimmer74 said:


> Amen to that.
> 
> No offense any professional who works in a bike shop, but...
> 
> The problem with most bike shops is that they're staffed by the kinds of guys who wind up working in bike shops.


I do not want to insult someone, but yet I'm going to. Just because I can and I'm not average Joe.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

bob_m said:


> What would be the updated model or the better way? Thanks


Good question and I'm not sure. But not forcing me to buy a bike or frame at a LBS (and banning internet sales) would be a good start. Let me buy stuff where I want.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

bob_m said:


> What would be the updated model or the better way? Thanks


Direct sales model. Those of us who can turn our own wrenches and have our own tools do not need the dealer assistance, and in some cases the dealer hindrance of only being able to get a new bike through our local dealer. Dealers might be necessary for warranty related issues, and I think it would be a nice compliment to the online model if you could purchase direct from the manufacturer, but visit a dealer for issues with that product.

Another benefit to the dealer is that I can test ride a bike. Honestly, I'd have no problem paying a rental fee to test ride a new bike. I don't want to feel restricted to only buying from that dealer just because I rode a specific manufacturers bike.

If a bike shop has proven quality and customer service, it should be able to build its business without limiting the choice of the consumer.

When there is only one Trek (or Pivot, or Specialized, or Kona) you better hope that its a good one or else you're stuck driving two hours away for the nearest competitor, and at that point, you're pretty much left wrenching on your bike anyway.

EDIT: I don't get me wrong, I like shops and I certainly understand the need for them, but I personally know people who have spent lots of money on a new bike from a new dealers, only to swear off both the brand and the shop/dealer because of the how they were treated.


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## mbernard71 (Apr 4, 2008)

Ordered my Stache 9 today in 17.5. Should be in by the end of the week.


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## zsommer79 (Aug 13, 2012)

jpc111 said:


> I am still waiting on my 5 to come in. I am hearing October, what are others hearing? Now that my shoulder is healed up, I want to ride!


Getting my 5 this week, but only because the manager at my shop is awesome. Already have a 9 but I couldn't resist that blue.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

SS Hack said:


> Good question and I'm not sure. But not forcing me to buy a bike or frame at a LBS (and banning internet sales) would be a good start. Let me buy stuff where I want.


Great, then the manufacturer would have to subsidize dealers (that means you pay more for the bike) to be able to keep the doors open if you have a problem...or you can mail the bike to the manufacturer and wait around a month or two for them to get it and figure out what's wrong, or we can keep the same system that's worked fine so far. Your choice.

Bike owners always want everything, but don't want to pay for it.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

All I have to say is, I love my 7. I made it up a climb I've never cleared before, and that's after a week of PM rain storms that have left the trail as loose and rutted as I've ever seen it. Then it hauled as much ass going down as my old Superfly.

It's a bike that seems to get a little better every time I ride it.


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## PretendGentleman (May 24, 2011)

askibum02 said:


> I know how to adjust a headset. This is beyond a simple adjustment. There is about a 1/4" of play in the bottom cup. That smells of improper installation.


I recommend everyone test ride their bike before they even leave the bike shop parking lot. A good shop test rides 100% of bikes they work on, no exception; many shops are not good. In my experience working at a dozen shops throughout my twenties, most shops didn't think it was particularly important to test ride bikes.

Test rides should be sloppy (shifting under load, and shifting hard up against the limits) and overly dramatic (many bunny hops to try to find any loose bolts), so you don't miss something that would bug/kill you on the trail.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

I went tubeless and did some minor changes as allways on my bikes.
Stripped my favorite stuff from Farley and put the original Stache gear on fatbike.



Answer 20/20 carbon bar.
Xtr br-m9000 brakes with original discs
Xtr p-dm 9000
RF I beam carbon seatpost
RF Atlas ibeam seat
Hope single bolt seatclamp
Park Tool showed weight numbers:12.57kg


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

zeb said:


> I went tubeless and did some minor changes as allways on my bikes.
> Stripped my favorite stuff from Farley and put the original Stache gear on fatbike.
> 
> Answer 20/20 carbon bar.
> ...


What model 5, 7 or 9?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

27.7lbs, nice. That'd make it roughly 26lbs with lighter tires. Not exactly XC race weight, but considering its got a 120mm fork and a dropper post, that's not bad either. You might even get into the 25lbs range with a carbon seatpost.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

jpc111 said:


> What model 5, 7 or 9?


7
However i am not weightweenie all the way but invest easily on quality hubs and rims.
i9 and Hadley are my favorites.Btw,Are 148 boost hubs for sale yet?Mayby + size Carbon rims to upgrade wheelset.
Mulefuts are Ok but engament is oem hubs is not what i have been used to.

@PHeller,I have no dropper post but RF carbon I beam post.

Tomorrow i get new Turbine crankset,i desperately need bash because Stache wants to roll over everything with speed but my timing is not allways perfect on rockgarden and bunnyhops over logs etc.I could not find any kind of chainring protection for Sram crankset,No bash ,no iscg tabs.Mayby RF is solution,cinch 3x spider results 51mm CL close enough to 148 boost?92bb,104 bcd bash compatible with 30 th N/W.


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## zsommer79 (Aug 13, 2012)

PHeller said:


> 27.7lbs, nice. That'd make it roughly 26lbs with lighter tires. Not exactly XC race weight, but considering its got a 120mm fork and a dropper post, that's not bad either. You might even get into the 25lbs range with a carbon seatpost.


On my 9 I went with nextie Jungle fox wheels with an i9 rear hub, lefty fork, and changed out the dropper post with a standard. That got me down to 25.8lbs with xt trail pedals.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

Any tall guys riding a Stache? I'm 6'6" and my short test ride left me thinking the XL would be too small. Looking at the numbers however it is very close to a XL Krampus which I've ridden and liked. 

I'm surprised to even be considering a Trek but the Stache 5 as an SS keeps popping into my little head.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Hi mhopton (comment #78 page 4) or anyone else, as you were involved in the development of the Stache you maybe able to explain the sizing of the frame. Looking at the sizing of this type of bike compared to a standard cross country hard tail, the top tube (TT) is generally reduced in length for this style of all mountain bike e.g. the Trek Superfly SS size 19.5 frame has a Top Tube Length of 639mm and the Stache 19.5 frame has a TT of 616mm. In addition the Superfly (cross country bike) would typically run a longer stem (100mm) and the all mountain bike (Stache) a shorter stem of 50mm.

I therefore ask is the intent of the framing size of the Stache to reduce the TT and stem length for the style of riding?

If I currently ride a 19.5 Superfly frame should I just ride a 19.5 Stache frame or should I up size the Stache frame to 21.5 to closer match the match the length of the Superfly?

I note other manufactures reduce TT/stem length for the different style of bikes, e.g. Niner has a size guide for their bikes and they have reduced the TT and stem lengths as stated above when comparing the Air9 carbon to the Ros9+.

Thanks in advance and if others want to have their say that's ok too.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

^ Was this for me?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Look at the reach: 

19.5" Stache+ has a 45.8cm Reach
19.5" Superfly has a 44.3cm Reach

Where does it hide? The seat tube angle.


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## Matterhorn (Feb 15, 2015)

Seems it doesn't hide at all.
Reach is the meaningful number here, I don't worry too much about TT length. 

I'd still like to see a 23" Farley or Stache. Big fellers like big wheels!


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Thanks all ready had seat tube angle cover and note the seat post also has a 8mm offset, but still have size questions. 

If you look at the above lengths the difference in the reach between the 19.5 Superfly and the 19.5 Stache is a size difference in the Stache. The 19.5 Superfly has the same reach as a 18.5 Stache, but a Superfly would typically run a longer stem. 

Looking at the comments on the forum it appears people are saying the Stache feels small so you should up size from your current bike, e.g if you ride a 19.5 Superfly get a 21.5 Stache. What do people think? I'm 6'1" and I'm trying to determine if I get a 19.5 or 21.5 Stache and run a short stem.

Thanks


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I'm 5 10 tall with a 32 inch inside leg.

I am riding a 19.5 Stache 9, if I were you at 6 1 then I think the 21.5 might be the better option.

The only change I am making is to shorten the stem from the stock 80mm to a 60mm .

Hope this helps.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)




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## SyT (Jul 27, 2005)

PHeller said:


> Look at the reach:
> 
> 19.5" Stache+ has a 45.8cm Reach
> 19.5" Superfly has a 44.3cm Reach
> ...


Seat tube angle has no impact on reach.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Thanks all ready had seat tube angle cover and note the seat post also has a 8mm offset, but still have size questions.
> 
> If you look at the above lengths the difference in the reach between the 19.5 Superfly and the 19.5 Stache is a size difference in the Stache. The 19.5 Superfly has the same reach as a 18.5 Stache, but a Superfly would typically run a longer stem.
> 
> ...


The Superfly has 25mm longer chainstays, so with such short chainstays, the bike needs to gain length somewhere. Even with the longer reach, the 18.5 Stache still has a wheelbase 1cm shorter than a 19 Superfly.

It's not an XC bike.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

I believe he was replying to RSG who was asking about the similar size Stache having a shorter TT and that is where STA comes into play and the same reason my XL Paradox with a 448mm reach, 2mm shorter than my Large Phantom has an inch more TT length because the STA on the Paradox is slacker than the Phantom by over 2 degrees. 
Weird thing is Trek lists the actual STA and not effective, which makes it seem the Stache is slacker, but taking the Stache5 pic into PShop and measuring the ESTA I get around 76*, which would make it about the same 2-3*+ more than the SF as my Paradox to Phantom.

Now for me, I don't like theses super steep STAs because I like my saddle so the back is 13.5" behind the BB, which requires a good bit of setback/offset to achieve, if you're shorter, then this may not be as much of an issue and/or you like to pedal at or over KOPS, but I prefer to be a couple centimeter's behind.



SyT said:


> Seat tube angle has no impact on reach.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

zsommer79 said:


> On my 9 I went with nextie Jungle fox wheels with an i9 rear hub, lefty fork, and changed out the dropper post with a standard. That got me down to 25.8lbs with xt trail pedals.


I'd love to see some pics of this. I've got a 9 frame on order and my long term plan involves a lefty supermax and a possibly jungle foxes. Might go with the Line Plus wheels if they are released soon.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

LyNx said:


> I believe he was replying to RSG who was asking about the similar size Stache having a shorter TT and that is where STA comes into play and the same reason my XL Paradox with a 448mm reach, 2mm shorter than my Large Phantom has an inch more TT length because the STA on the Paradox is slacker than the Phantom by over 2 degrees.
> Weird thing is Trek lists the actual STA and not effective, which makes it seem the Stache is slacker, but taking the Stache5 pic into PShop and measuring the ESTA I get around 76*, which would make it about the same 2-3*+ more than the SF as my Paradox to Phantom.
> 
> Now for me, I don't like theses super steep STAs because I like my saddle so the back is 13.5" behind the BB, which requires a good bit of setback/offset to achieve, if you're shorter, then this may not be as much of an issue and/or you like to pedal at or over KOPS, but I prefer to be a couple centimeter's behind.


The trek web site does have the effective TT length and if you do all of the maths using the reach, TT length and the Stach height, it appear the seat angle is 75deg (not the posted 70.8deg). This puts the seat very close to the BB (30mm closer than a bike with a 72deg seat tube angle), have you noticed this to be a issue on your Stache?

I've heard it may reduce impact on climbing ability.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

I don't have a Stache, so can't say from personal experience, but, you have it backwards, the steeper the STA, the better for climbing generally speaking as it puts you further forward, easier, however on th flats it may not make for as nice a ride OR if you are a masher on the climbs.



Rigid Single guy said:


> The trek web site does have the effective TT length and if you do all of the maths using the reach, TT length and the Stach height, it appear the seat angle is 75deg (not the posted 70.8deg). This puts the seat very close to the BB (30mm closer than a bike with a 72deg seat tube angle), have you noticed this to be a issue on your Stache?
> *
> I've heard it may reduce impact on climbing ability*.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Here are some weights for a size 21.5. Tubeless, stock except KS Lev DX dropper and fat Lizard Skin lock ons (these are 125 grams, about 90g more than stock). I'm running Deity pedals. I found out after weighing it that there was a little water in the rear tire for some reason. I didn't weigh it again, maybe drop .1.

Full bike weight:









Rear wheel (the one with some water)









Front wheel









Stock/tubeless it would be about 29.7.


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## Mountain Cycle Shawn (Jan 19, 2004)

What's the biggest ring that will fit on the 5? It looks like it would be a fun trainer for the road with some road rims and tires.


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## tadraper (Apr 14, 2010)

Mountain Cycle Shawn said:


> What's the biggest ring that will fit on the 5? It looks like it would be a fun trainer for the road with some road rims and tires.


i installed a 32 tooth on mine it may fit a 34 but not sure and mine is a stache 9 not that that should make a difference..


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

I'm seriously considering a Stache 9 29+. I'm currently riding a 2014 Fuel EX9 that's a 17.5" and it feels pretty good to me. This may sound like a silly question, but I'm wondering what 29+ looks like in a small frame. Do the wheels/tires look out of proportion to the rest of the bike? I'm also a little worried about toe overlap. Does anyone have a picture and/or experience with one of these in a 17.5"? Thanks.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

sgillmore said:


> Do the wheels/tires look out of proportion to the rest of the bike? I'm also a little worried about toe overlap. Does anyone have a picture and/or experience with one of these in a 17.5"? Thanks.












^^^^ 17" Krampus

The 17" is my bike and I rarely have anyone notice it's not a normal 29er who isn't a Surly fanboi. I don't find the wheels vs. frame look odd except when I am next to a "normal" 29er and then their tires look like pizza cutters. 

The Stache looks great. I would jump on it. I bet you'll love it.










^^^^ 15" Krampus


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

I've had a couple really short test rides on Staches, and I really liked the handling when it comes to fun stuff, but how are they on a longer haul?

Kinda considering it as an alternative to my Pivot M6 for places the M6 is just overkill and longer, but still trail-ish rides with some exploring and possibly short-ish bikecamping trips on top of that.


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

richde said:


> I've had a couple really short test rides on Staches, and I really liked the handling when it comes to fun stuff, but how are they on a longer haul?
> 
> Kinda considering it as an alternative to my Pivot M6 for places the M6 is just overkill and longer, but still trail-ish rides with some exploring and possibly short-ish bikecamping trips on top of that.


I'm eyeing the Stache 7 to be my one and only bike and am very much interested in the answer to this question as well.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

I have done a fair amount of gravel grinding on mine and find it a comfortable enough. It would not be my first choice for bike packing due to smallish triangle and lack of extra water cage mounts.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

My friend bought a Stache 5 17.5" and I enjoyed his a lot! Than his younger brother bought a Stache 9 17.5" and I took that for a spin on some very technical singletrack and fell in love. I visited the local Trek store and bought their last Stache 9 17.5". I am two rides in and looking for buyers for my 2015 Niner Air 9 RDO w/ RDO rigid fork.

The Stache makes me giggle. The photo attached was taken 7/24/15. Sorry the first one was upside down, check the second one.



sgillmore said:


> I'm seriously considering a Stache 9 29+. I'm currently riding a 2014 Fuel EX9 that's a 17.5" and it feels pretty good to me. This may sound like a silly question, but I'm wondering what 29+ looks like in a small frame. Do the wheels/tires look out of proportion to the rest of the bike? I'm also a little worried about toe overlap. Does anyone have a picture and/or experience with one of these in a 17.5"? Thanks.


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## Larsey (Jan 14, 2004)

PAID SPAM:

2016 TREK STACHE 7 29+ COMPLETE BIKE TWENTY NINE PLUS - Buy and Sell and Review Mountain Bikes and Accessories


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

What size is your Niner Air9? I ask because I'm riding the Niner Air 9 carbon in a Large and have ordered the Stache 5 in a 19.5.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I rode a L Niner ROS 9, and now ride a 19.5" Stache 9. It's a very comfortable fit.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

As I assumed, thanks for the reply. That confirms my assessment of the size. Have you changed any, e.g. stem, seat post, etc?


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

Putting on a 50mm stem is the only cockpit change I made. I never rode with the stock 80mm stem as a 50 is what I had on my Niner and I liked it.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Did you like the Niner Air 9 with the rigid fork and why did you change to the suspension?

I've been riding my Air 9 as a rigid single speed for the last 3 year and love it and that's why I'm getting the Stache 5, however I'm interested I why you changed to suspension.

Also how tall are you?

Thanks mate


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

My Niner is a small and I'm 5' 7". I loved the bike, cracked the first frame and it was replaced. I was turned off by suspension forks years ago due to them not working very well.

For now this fork is stout and smooth, time will tell. If not the geometry and the tire size has made a large improvement in my riding.

Riding fully rigid for a number of years has definitely improved my ability of picking lines.



Rigid Single guy said:


> Did you like the Niner Air 9 with the rigid fork and why did you change to the suspension?
> 
> I've been riding my Air 9 as a rigid single speed for the last 3 year and love it and that's why I'm getting the Stache 5, however I'm interested I why you changed to suspension.
> 
> ...


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

twa said:


> My friend bought a Stache 5 17.5" and I enjoyed his a lot! Than his younger brother bought a Stache 9 17.5" and I took that for a spin on some very technical singletrack and fell in love. I visited the local Trek store and bought their last Stache 9 17.5". I am two rides in and looking for buyers for my 2015 Niner Air 9 RDO w/ RDO rigid fork.
> 
> The Stache makes me giggle. The photo attached was taken 7/24/15. Sorry the first one was upside down, check the second one.


Thanks! Looks good to me.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

r1Gel said:


> I'm eyeing the Stache 7 to be my one and only bike and am very much interested in the answer to this question as well.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


I got a chance to find out for myself yesterday with a 30 mile ride on a Stache 7 rental. It was fine, awesome even. It climbs and covers level ground about as well as a normal 29'er, is a rocket on tame (non-rock garden) downhill sections and corners like you wouldn't believe. This was also with a bike that was a size bigger than I'd prefer and no dropper post (because I'm used to using one).

Front tire pressure need to be much lower than reviews say though, I ended up with 11/15psi F/R after some testing in a dirt lot before heading out on the ride, and I weigh 185lbs before gear. The fork on the 7 sucked though, after setting around 1" of sag, the fork never went much past half travel despite being pushed pretty aggressively by pumping g-outs. Messed with the ABV dial and going full (-) made no difference. I'm used to XT brakes with a 203mm front rotor and I found the SRAM brakes to be quite lacking. They'll stop you, just wanted more power out of the front and the back seemed to need quite a bit of lever effort.

For what would be considered "normal" biking, the Stache really is hard to beat, all things considered. I'm sure that there are 29'ers that can beat it in a climb, and enduro/trail/all-mountain bikes that can go faster going downhill, but neither (as the market currently stands) would be able to equal it out on a ride where you ride up, then ride down.

What it doesn't like is spinning, because it'll start to bounce, and trying to brake in really rocky downhill sections, which makes it bounce all over the place and becomes quite a handful. Just keep the RPM down at the lower end of efficient pedaling, remember that it's a hardtail and it just shines.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

11PSI? Yikes. Anything under 12.5 on mine (we weigh about the same) and I get more tire squirm than I am comfortable with. I am running tubeless FYI. As much as I think I am going to love my Stache (owned it for a month, have a whopping mile on it) I think the full boinger version will be my favorite bike ever, and I suspect we'll see that for next year.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

*My impressions and review of the Trek Stache 9 29+ [MEDIA=youtube]AcRQTGZbBsA[/MEDIA]*


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

litespeedaddict said:


> 11PSI? Yikes. Anything under 12.5 on mine (we weigh about the same) and I get more tire squirm than I am comfortable with. I am running tubeless FYI. As much as I think I am going to love my Stache (owned it for a month, have a whopping mile on it) I think the full boinger version will be my favorite bike ever, and I suspect we'll see that for next year.


12.5 had the front end pushing so much that it was downright scary. The front might have been squirming a little, as it had a tendency to slide, then grip, when really pushed. I saw that as a positive handling trait since it gave me a warning before possibly dumping me on my side. Almost all the DH sections I rode were loose over hard, so it may be more of a factor on trails with more grip available.

Even so, I was able to easily take one (very familiar) turn in particular at a speed that would have left my Pivot M6 with a DHF/DHR combo at the edge of grip.

Keep in mind that bike pump pressures aren't the most accurate, but it did take more of a spread than I saw in all the reviews.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

I run 12.5/13.5 on my 7 set tubeless. I weigh closer to 230. I chose 13.5 because it was the highest rear pressure I could run without bouncing much. That's set with a good quality psi meter.

I'm wondering if your fork issues played into your PSI needs as I don't find my 7 pushing much at all, but I get the full travel out of my fork.

I'm at about 300 miles on mine. No issues of any kind with anything really. Things have worked great all around and I've been impressed with the fork.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

10 psi in the front, 12 psi in the rear.

I weigh 185 lbs with the camelbak etc.

The front feels fine, just a little squirmy on times, but nothing too bad.

I have a calibrated digital tyre pressure gauge though.

I suspect some of the figures quoted may be off a little due to the error in the measurement device.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

MrIcky said:


> I run 12.5/13.5 on my 7 set tubeless. I weigh closer to 230. I chose 13.5 because it was the highest rear pressure I could run without bouncing much. That's set with a good quality psi meter.
> 
> I'm wondering if your fork issues played into your PSI needs as I don't find my 7 pushing much at all, but I get the full travel out of my fork.
> 
> I'm at about 300 miles on mine. No issues of any kind with anything really. Things have worked great all around and I've been impressed with the fork.


I rode it around a dirt lot for a bit while messing with tire pressure. The lot was smooth, level, but covered with loose rocks, so the fork wasn't really a factor. At 12.5 it started to wash out way too early, at 10-11 (front) both tires would slide together, so that's what I went with. Then let out just a little air at the top of the climb.

I might have been able to run the rear a little lower, but making sure that the front didn't wash out prematurely was my major concern. If it were my bike, I'd have done a lot more experimenting, but for a rental it was good enough.

The next time I ride it, I'm going to try taking all the air out of the fork and running a zip tie down the seal to make sure there isn't air pressure inside the stanchion, which will probably piss of the gf to no end. I just wasn't going to mess with it out on the trail, but it shouldn't have acted like that in the first place.


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

richde said:


> I got a chance to find out for myself yesterday with a 30 mile ride on a Stache 7 rental. It was fine, awesome even.


This is awesome. Thanks for sharing.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I'm running 15f/17r on my Stache 9, but then again I weigh 360lbs.


Sent from a telecommunication device with a touch screen keyboard.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Slightly OT, but what PSi 'devices' are you using?


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Sorry, meant pressure gauge , there are quite a few different types out there.

The one I have was used specifically for motorcycle tyres where you really did require the pressure gauge to be accurate.

A few psi difference can / could make quite a difference.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

lol - I guessed you meant gauge, but which one 

We need links


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## tmbrown (Jun 9, 2007)

^^^ 
http://www.amazon.com/Meiser-Presta...sim_263_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=10EDJSWS5J5Z43C030R4


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0051...SY165_QL70&keywords=topeak+digital+tire+gauge


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

I use one of these too.

I also have an SKS airchecker for my portable tool box.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Awesome recommendations for accurate, and most importantly, portable gauges to aid in using consistent tire pressures.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Good links


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

The latest update from my LBS has the delivery on my 5 in November. Since I already sold my Superfly, I just had him order me a 7 in a 17.5 size. I should have it next week!


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

jpc111 said:


> The latest update from my LBS has the delivery on my 5 in November. Since I already sold my Superfly, I just had him order me a 7 in a 17.5 size. I should have it next week!


Are you getting the 5 as well when it arrives?


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

no, just the 7


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## FatSpooky (Dec 2, 2014)

I'm curious about the weight of these off the floor (29+ only). Also, what is the diameter of the tire? Wondering if my Rocky Mounts Brass Knuckles arm will open far enough to clear it.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

FatSpooky said:


> I'm curious about the weight of these off the floor (29+ only). Also, what is the diameter of the tire? Wondering if my Rocky Mounts Brass Knuckles arm will open far enough to clear it.


I have a 5 that I set up tubeless, and with XTR pedals & cages it is 27.9? in a size 21.5. Not a light bike considering it's rigid, but it only cost's $1500 with tax so I am happy to make that trade off. Good enough parts kit for that money, and I am happy to spend another $1200-$1500 on it to sweet it out. Still "affordable" when compared to the last few bikes I've purchased and that should get it down to 25lbs pretty easy. .


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Go back 2 pages for some weights on a 7.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone want to take guesses on what maximum width of a 275 tire would be on the Stache Plus? Could it potentially fit a 3.5" tire?


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## FatSpooky (Dec 2, 2014)

Thanks litespeedaddict. Not bad however. My fatbike is rigid and weighs almost 35lbs. My steelhead weighs 27.5lbs. I rode a custom Spooky Darkside for years with a high bb and short chainstays. I miss that frame (headtube/top tube weld cracked). I ride tons of rocks so gaining some clearance would be nice and the short chainstays should make for lots of fun on the trails around here.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Stache 7 has arrived, should be built this afternoon!*


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Have fun building jpc!!! Is there anything more awesome than a new bike in a box??


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

When I pulled up to the dealer, the semi truck had just pulled up. I was able to unload the bike from the trailer. It was just like Christmas.

One set up question. I want to run the rear axle as far forward as possible. Do the plastic spacers in the drop out need to be in place or can they be removed?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Not sure they are plastic, but if you wish to run the rear wheel as far forward as possible, then there is a spacer to go behind the "nut" for lack of a better word. If you wish to run it as far back as possible, then it goes in front. But if I am understanding your question correctly, and we are talking about the same thing, it needs to be on there.


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## McGoon (Feb 17, 2013)

...


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## tmbrown (Jun 9, 2007)

^^^ You beat me to it... 20mm not 22mm


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Update, Stache 7 is in and built.

Several issues.
1. I attempted to go tubeless. We couldn't get the tires to seat despite the rim tape being in the right spot and lots of pressure and volume of air used. I never have had an issue on my other bikes, I am not sure what to try next, suggestions?
2. Regarding the plastic spacers in the drop outs, my dealer and I called Trek and they recommend that they are left in. With the spacers in the rear most position, the tire rubs the frame, so we put them in the front position. This forces me to run the axle in a further back than I wanted. Between the spacers and the adjusting bolts in the back, the axle shouldn't shift even of the axle nuts loosen up.
3. When the front axle is installed per the instructions, the quick release lever point down, not up. Any ideas why?

Observations:
The bars on my super fly were 26.5 " , the Stache bars are 29.5 " . I will try them in the woods this weekend and see how they feel.

I have the tires at 15 PSI and they seemed to roll real nice on a ride around the neighborhood.

The 17.5 frame has the right stand over height and bar reach for my 5' 9" and 30 " inseam body.

With tubes and egg beater pedals it weighed in at 30# 4 oz. The tubes weigh 1 # each. So by the time I figure out the tubeless issue, it should be under 29#.

The bike is very good looking.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

On #1 have you tried these steps?

1. Setting the bead on the tire with a tube in? 
2. Then breaking the bead on one side only and pulling the tube out. 
3. then laying the tire on a bucket with the broken bead side down and inflating with compressor?

On #2 the spacers don't do anything real in terms of holding your wheel in place.

On #3 I cannot help you as I have a 5 with the rigid fork and it has a different type of axle than the suspension fork.


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

jpc111 said:


> Update, Stache 7 is in and built.
> 
> Several issues.
> 1. I attempted to go tubeless. We couldn't get the tires to seat despite the rim tape being in the right spot and lots of pressure and volume of air used. I never have had an issue on my other bikes, I am not sure what to try next, suggestions?
> ...


Overall, I love my Stache.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

My 17.5" Stache 9 tubeless came in at 27.8 lbs on the bathroom scale multiple times.

The tubes weighed 1.8 lbs for the pair.

**Forgot to mention... Pedals included in weight are Shimano XT m780 and the handlebars are original length. Dropper seatpost is getting removed this week for a Bontrager alum post. Anyone want to buy a droppah?



FatSpooky said:


> I'm curious about the weight of these off the floor (29+ only). Also, what is the diameter of the tire? Wondering if my Rocky Mounts Brass Knuckles arm will open far enough to clear it.


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## tmbrown (Jun 9, 2007)

#1 Doug_ID Method should work…:thumbsup:

#2 Toss those spacers…:madman: They are sliding drop outs, you can put the rear axle where ever you like…
Don’t ride with those 20mm locknuts loose, you will get a creaking noise.

#3 You have the front axle indexed 180 off, look at the axle, it's clearly marked with an up on it…


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

twa said:


> My 17.5" Stache 9 tubeless came in at 27.8 lbs on the bathroom scale multiple times.
> 
> The tubes weighed 1.8 lbs for the pair.


Same here. My 17.5" Stache 9 also come in just under 28 lbs. The stock tubes are pretty heavy. They're as heavy as the tubes that come out of my Surly Pugsley.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

First impressions from my first ride on my 7. Didn't notice a difference in rolling resistance vs. my superfly with 2.2 specialized Captain tires. I set the tire pressure at 15 last night. After the bike sat in my car all day, the pressure was 17.5. The tires seemed "bouncy". I will try a little lower pressure next time. The bars are three inches wider than my old bike. I will try them several more times before I decide whether I want to trim them. I can't say I noticed that this bike is about seven pounds heavier than my old bike. When I coasted with my cranks in a horizontal position, once in a while I felt my heel touch the chain stay. I turned the front axle over so that after it is locked into place the lever is pointing up.... not sure this is the right thing to do.. anyone have experience with this?

By the time the ride was done I had the seat height adjusted correctly, it ended up being level with the bars.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Does anyone know the crown to axle dimension for the Manitou Magnum fitted to the Stache 9?

Is it simply a case of measuring the length between the axle centre and the bottom of the crown race?

I ask as I am considering fitting a Lauf Carbonara 29+ fork for the winter riding in the UK.
The weather tends to wear out suspension components very quickly, and an uncomplicated fork with 60mm of unsprung travel might be a good idea.

I already have a spare rim and tyre, so would just need a suitable hub and wheel build.

I like the idea of a simply fork that requires no maintenance, but the Magnum is an excellent fork.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Denis9999 said:


> Is it simply a case of measuring the length between the axle centre and the bottom of the crown race?


That's all A to C is.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Cheers,

measures ~520mm static, that is without me on the bike.

Assuming 20mm of sag, then the normal crown to axle measurement is 500mm.

The Lauf crown to axle is 500mm.

As there is only 60mm of travel, then the potential swap should be ok.

Two options here.
Fit a 29+ tyre, similar to what is already in there, or

go fat front end with a 26" wheel and 4" tyre.

prefer the fat front end as it would give a little more cushion .

I'll keep you updated.


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## tmbrown (Jun 9, 2007)

> vikb
> 
> Quote Originally Posted by Denis9999 View Post
> 
> ...


I did a quick measurement and came up with 21" (533.4mm)
I would say that the A-C of 531 is correct like JV posted.

Manitou Magnum 27.5+ and 29+ fork impressions - Page 2- Mtbr.com


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Thanks for the info tmbrown.

What effect on the geometry would this have going from a A-C of 531mm to 500mm.

I was hoping that I could make this change for the winter, but don't want to lose the slack(ish) head angle too much.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Denis9999 said:


> What effect on the geometry would this have going from a A-C of 531mm to 500mm.


The rule of thumb I use is 1 deg/20-25mm. So expect the bike to have a HTA that -1 to -1.5 deg steeper.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

forgiven_nick said:


> Here is a video we put together of my thoughts on the Stache 9 after riding it for a week.


Thanks for the video review. You appear to prefer the rigid Surly Krampus and state the Stache 9 is harder to wheelie compared to the Krampus. Do you think you would prefer the Stache 5 (with the carbon rigid fork) over the Krampus, or do you prefer the Krampus geometry over the Stache?


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Thanks for the video review. You appear to prefer the rigid Surly Krampus and state the Stache 9 is harder to wheelie compared to the Krampus. Do you think you would prefer the Stache 5 (with the carbon rigid fork) over the Krampus, or do you prefer the Krampus geometry over the Stache?


I don't see how that would be, considering how much shorter the Stache is.

It's a trail bike on some really comfy and grippy tires, not a long haul bike...although I've had a 7 out for a 4 hour ride and felt fresher than I would have on my Pivot Mach 6. Plus on mild terrain, it feels faster...hell, it IS faster.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Ride number two on the Stache 7. I rode as easy 5 miles and have the following observations:
1. I dropped the tire press to 12 psi front and rear. The bike felt less bouncy. There was no tire squirm. I will try 10 front and 11 back next time.
2. The bike turns a lot quicker than my super fly. It caught me of guard on a big banked wall and I thought I was going to fall. I also noticed it on a flat corner. I am running the axle in the rear most position that the spacers will allow. Part of the issue may be that I am just getting back on a MTB after being off injured for almost 5 months. I don't quite have my "mojo" back.
3. I am going to trim the bars from the stock 29.5" to 28". I will also be putting on a pair of Ergon grips. I had them on my Superfly and liked them.
4. I noticed a scuff on my right chain stay. It must be from my heel rubbing it. I ordered some protective tape from Amazon and it will be here Tuesday.

I like the bike better every time I ride it. I just need to slowly get used to the new bike and get my nerve back after falling and breaking my scapula back in March.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

richde said:


> I don't see how that would be, considering how much shorter the Stache is.
> 
> It's a trail bike on some really comfy and grippy tires, not a long haul bike...although I've had a 7 out for a 4 hour ride and felt fresher than I would have on my Pivot Mach 6. Plus on mild terrain, it feels faster...hell, it IS faster.


Just going off the video review post on this site, he appear to dislike the weight of the suspension fork and thinks it impacts on the wheelie when compared to the rigid Krampus. I'm just trying to confirm my understanding of the Video.


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

jpc111 said:


> Update, Stache 7 is in and built.
> 3. When the front axle is installed per the instructions, the quick release lever point down, not up. Any ideas why?


I just noticed something today. The lever has a small arrow on it that lines up with the line on the axle.

There's also a small alignment dot on the fork. If you line the white line on the axle up with the dot on the fork, then line up the arrow on the lever, it slides right in and the lever will be pointed up when closed.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

sgillmore said:


> I just noticed something today. The lever has a small arrow on it that lines up with the line on the axle.
> 
> There's also a small alignment dot on the fork. If you line the white line on the axle up with the dot on the fork, then line up the arrow on the lever, it slides right in and the lever will be pointed up when closed.


Someone else pointed that out also, I tried it and it worked.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Ride number two on the Stache 7. I rode an easy 5 miles and have the following observations:
1. I dropped the tire press to 12 psi front and rear. The bike felt less bouncy. There was no tire squirm. I will try 10 front and 11 back next time.
2. The bike turns a lot quicker than my super fly. It caught me of guard on a big banked wall and I thought I was going to fall. I also noticed it on a flat corner. I am running the axle in the rear most position that the spacers will allow. Part of the issue may be that I am just getting back on a MTB after being off injured for almost 5 months. I don't quite have my "mojo" back.
3. I am going to trim the bars from the stock 29.5" to 28". I will also be putting on a pair of Ergon grips. I had them on my Superfly and liked them.
4. I noticed a scuff on my right chain stay. It must be from my heel rubbing it. I ordered some protective tape from Amazon and it will be here Tuesday.
5. I really like the Avid brakes. Good power and modulation and quite. The XO brakes on the Superfly were not this nice.
6. The drive train works great. Shifts well and has plenty of range.

I like the bike better every time I ride it. I just need to slowly get used to the new bike and get my nerve back after falling and breaking my scapula back in March.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

I'm also finding my 7 to be more capable every time I put it to the test.

Yesterday I went on a group ride on a 14 mile loop that has 3000 feet of climbing. I normally take my superfly but decided to take the Stache. I had no problem keeping up with the 'normal' bikes and I was able to see how much energy they waste with slippage. 

The last mile and a half of climbing is on a forest service road that has lots of loose washout areas with a 9-12% grade and the Stache just ran away. Believe me, that wasn't the rider. I'm usually the slow one. 

My other bike is starting to look a little dusty these days.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

One other thing I discovered. I went to put the bike on my Thule T1 rack, I was able to get the arm over the front tire my leaning over the bike, but I can't move down the hook enough to engage the ratchet. I wonder if they make a longer arm?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Yes, they make a longer arm, but even with that you will still lean the bike over to get it over the tire. But it does ratchet down and work well.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I went out for a few miles today and it felt like I was bouncing a bit. I admit I haven't rode it for a couple weeks and didn't notice it before, been riding my road bike more unfortunately. Is my air pressure too high or low? I mainly noticed it when pedaling.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories-and-Parts/Thule/752-1272-001.html


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Cadence too high?


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

I work at a shop that sells Surly and Trek.

One of my co-mechanics bought a Trek Stache 7 after trying my Krampus and we've traded the bikes for quick bits through a local park on some simple trails people have made through the flat swampy terrain. The Trek is a really well put together machine and I'm very happy with the quality of it. I think we were both surprised at how playful the Krampus feels compared to the Stache. 

I've had the Krampus since December and have tweaked the setup a bit while she's only had her Stache for a couple extremely rainy weeks so its not fair to decide on a verdict yet.

We'll have to take them out to the real mtb trails and swap bikes some more before we can say what's what but so far I prefer my Krampus.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

I agree, so much that both of my old bikes were posted for sale after yesterday's session. I'm about 15 pounds heavier, bike is over 6 pounds heavier but Strava recorded PR's ascending, descending and twisty singletrack.



MrIcky said:


> I'm also finding my 7 to be more capable every time I put it to the test.
> 
> Yesterday I went on a group ride on a 14 mile loop that has 3000 feet of climbing. I normally take my superfly but decided to take the Stache. I had no problem keeping up with the 'normal' bikes and I was able to see how much energy they waste with slippage.
> 
> ...


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

jpc111 said:


> Cadence too high?


I was wondering that too. I did change gears when I felt it but really didn't feel like I was pedaling that fast. It may just be all in my head.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

Just ordered a Stache 9 in a 21.5 and some VP Harrier pedals to go along with it. Will post pics when it gets in!


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Mine bounces worse when my air pressure is too high. I run about 13 in the rear now and rarely bounce unless I'm spinning like crazy.


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

Stache 5 looks really awesome...Currently plowing through local singletrack on my Surly Ice cream truck with 29 plus wheels rigid! I really do love the simplicity of rigid. I actually bought Rock Show Bluto for my ICT but ended up taking it off. How are you all liking the 5 model? Now I can just keep my Surly Fat and have 29 plus bike to add to my stable. Also Have Remedy 29er that my younger son loves to ride.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

NickandBruce said:


> I work at a shop that sells Surly and Trek.
> 
> One of my co-mechanics bought a Trek Stache 7 after trying my Krampus and we've traded the bikes for quick bits through a local park on some simple trails people have made through the flat swampy terrain. The Trek is a really well put together machine and I'm very happy with the quality of it. I think we were both surprised at how playful the Krampus feels compared to the Stache.
> 
> ...


I would love to know how the bikes compare in the future. What sizes are the Stache and the Krampus and is the Krampus running a rigid fork?

I have ridden a titanium copy of the Krampus with a carbon fork in a med. size frame and it was very nice. It handled like my Niner Air 9 (similar wheel base), it turned well and could wheelie out of corners and over rocks, easy. But the seat tube was too low for my height in the med size and when I rode a standard large Krampus, it felt slow in turns and took energy to wheelie, I didn't like it.

I have since ordered a Stache 5 (without riding a Stache) and hope I've done the right thing, so I'm very interested in what you think about the Krampus and the Stache.

Also anyone who has previously been riding a bike similar to an Niner Air9 (carbon cross country 29er) with rigid fork and now rides the Stache 5, I would love to know what you think.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

Bryan1113 said:


> Stache 5 looks really awesome...Currently plowing through local singletrack on my Surly Ice cream truck with 29 plus wheels rigid! I really do love the simplicity of rigid. I actually bought Rock Show Bluto for my ICT but ended up taking it off. How are you all liking the 5 model? Now I can just keep my Surly Fat and have 29 plus bike to add to my stable. Also Have Remedy 29er that my younger son loves to ride.


I am really enjoy my 5. I have gone to SS after losing two derailleurs. I think the elevated chain stays might allow for more sticks to get up in the chain cog area.........either that or I have had some very bad luck.

I am enjoying it in SS mode and have it down below 25 pounds with carbon seat post and bars. I also rarely miss suspension and enjoy the light weight and simplicity of the carbon fork.



__
https://flic.kr/p/wNmzFT
 by Doug, on Flickr


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Thanks for the video review. You appear to prefer the rigid Surly Krampus and state the Stache 9 is harder to wheelie compared to the Krampus. Do you think you would prefer the Stache 5 (with the carbon rigid fork) over the Krampus, or do you prefer the Krampus geometry over the Stache?


Yes, as @richde mentioned, the Stache is definitely more of a trail bike, the Krampus is more of a generalist, if not more of an endurance XC/bikepacking/adventure bike. If I were to get a Stache, I would likely get the 5 with the carbon fork. I very much do not care for the weight and complexity of the axle of the suspension fork on the 7 and 9. Wheelie-ing with the 5 must be unreal. Once I got used to the weight of the suspension fork on the front, I could wheelie the Stache 9 for days, way easier than the Krampus, which is what you would expect. I would still get the Krampus over the Stache 5, but that is solely based on my intended application. I am much less attacted to trail bike style aggressive riding and much more interested in riding/exploring as much in one day as possible, even if I have to pick my way through rock gardens and techy descents a lot slower. That being said, I am much faster on techy descents since putting a 29+ front end on my 29er. Much, much faster.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Doug_ID said:


> I am really enjoy my 5. I have gone to SS after losing two derailleurs. I think the elevated chain stays might allow for more sticks to get up in the chain cog area.........either that or I have had some very bad luck.
> 
> I am enjoying it in SS mode and have it down below 25 pounds with carbon seat post and bars. I also rarely miss suspension and enjoy the light weight and simplicity of the carbon fork.
> 
> by Doug, on Flickr


Nice photo.

What SS gearing are you running? 
How much clearance do you have to between the chain stay and the chain?


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

Running an oval absolute black 30t up front and an 18 out back. The chain does get a bit close to the stay when the front ring oval is tallest. I wrapped that short section of the stay with a bit of old tube.....no issues.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

Rigid Single guy said:


> I would love to know how the bikes compare in the future. What sizes are the Stache and the Krampus and is the Krampus running a rigid fork?
> 
> I have ridden a titanium copy of the Krampus with a carbon fork in a med. size frame and it was very nice. It handled like my Niner Air 9 (similar wheel base), it turned well and could wheelie out of corners and over rocks, easy. But the seat tube was too low for my height in the med size and when I rode a standard large Krampus, it felt slow in turns and took energy to wheelie, I didn't like it.
> 
> ...


Both were about the same size: Stache 17.5", Krampus 17".

Stache was stock, the Krampus was setup split tube tubeless with Jones loop bars and a longer stem to compensate for the sweep back. Otherwise, there were no relevant changes to the stock build setup on either bike.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Doug_ID said:


> Running an oval absolute black 30t up front and an 18 out back. The chain does get a bit close to the stay when the front ring oval is tallest. I wrapped that short section of the stay with a bit of old tube.....no issues.


I didn't know you could use an oval front chain ring on a single speed. Are you just using the sliding axle for the single speed, if so how much slack is in the chain.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

Rigid Single guy said:


> I didn't know you could use an oval front chain ring on a single speed. Are you just using the sliding axle for the single speed, if so how much slack is in the chain.


Yep it works fine. I bit of variation in the chain tension but never dropped the chain.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

I've been riding fully rigid bikes for more than a few years. Went from a aluminum 26r Sette Reken to a fully rigid full carbon Niner Air 9 RDO. I rode my friend's Stache 5 and I was blown away, the low budget components work great, and for the price the Acera brakes are amazing!

The 29+ steam rolls roots and rocks, and maintains momentum like nothing I have ever ridden before. When I moved from my 26er to my 29er I had a similar experience, but this is unreal. I can even climb better with the extra weight in the front and by placing myself as far forward on the saddle as possible.

It is a really playful and fun ride, the only thing that worries me is tire cost these days. WOW are these tires pricey.

My wife wanted a one and done purchase and the Stache 7 and 9 had the components and gearing that I was looking for so I went with the 9. I've got a Bontrager post coming from ebay this week to get rid of the silly droppah post though!

Old bikes for sale, and anyone want to make an offer on the droppah post?

niner: '15 Niner Air Nine RDO Small with RDO fork and two sets of wheels
sette: Sette Reken 16" / Small mountain bike



Rigid Single guy said:


> I would love to know how the bikes compare in the future. What sizes are the Stache and the Krampus and is the Krampus running a rigid fork?
> 
> I have ridden a titanium copy of the Krampus with a carbon fork in a med. size frame and it was very nice. It handled like my Niner Air 9 (similar wheel base), it turned well and could wheelie out of corners and over rocks, easy. But the seat tube was too low for my height in the med size and when I rode a standard large Krampus, it felt slow in turns and took energy to wheelie, I didn't like it.
> 
> ...


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

Doug_ID said:


> I am really enjoy my 5. I have gone to SS after losing two derailleurs. I think the elevated chain stays might allow for more sticks to get up in the chain cog area.........either that or I have had some very bad luck.
> 
> I am enjoying it in SS mode and have it down below 25 pounds with carbon seat post and bars. I also rarely miss suspension and enjoy the light weight and simplicity of the carbon fork.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the Reply! sorry about the bad luck...glad you're enjoying the ride. Happy Trails


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

Sums up my impressions of the bike nicely and includes a good history of the design:

http://www.tetongravity.com/story/bike/the-trek-stache-2015s-most-fun-mountain-bike



twa said:


> I've been riding fully rigid bikes for more than a few years. Went from a aluminum 26r Sette Reken to a fully rigid full carbon Niner Air 9 RDO. I rode my friend's Stache 5 and I was blown away, the low budget components work great, and for the price the Acera brakes are amazing!
> 
> The 29+ steam rolls roots and rocks, and maintains momentum like nothing I have ever ridden before. When I moved from my 26er to my 29er I had a similar experience, but this is unreal. I can even climb better with the extra weight in the front and by placing myself as far forward on the saddle as possible.
> 
> ...


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## Bombin (Jul 21, 2015)

I know this has been touched on but I'm not a seasoned vet on some of the sizing issues. I want a Stache, need help with the fit because my LBS only has a 17.5 and I'm a couple hours away from any others to try. That being said:

I'm 5'10 with a 30 or 31 inch inseam. I see one guy swear 17.5 is good, the other says 19.5(18.5 is the official Trek measurement I believe). I currently ride a Surly Karate Monkey medium(18) and same for my Pugsley. I get to take out the 17.5 tomorrow but with nothing to compare to I'm wondering how the two sizes would really feel in comparison. The stand over looks to be highest on the 17.5 which bothers me, because I stood over it today (in dress shoes) and was not thrilled about the limited clearance. That's an important area. But I always hear people talk about reach etc. 

If anyone can please shed some advice on this situation I would appreciate it.


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## [TA] (Dec 3, 2008)

Bombin said:


> I know this has been touched on but I'm not a seasoned vet on some of the sizing issues. I want a Stache, need help with the fit because my LBS only has a 17.5 and I'm a couple hours away from any others to try. That being said:
> 
> I'm 5'10 with a 30 or 31 inch inseam. I see one guy swear 17.5 is good, the other says 19.5(18.5 is the official Trek measurement I believe). I currently ride a Surly Karate Monkey medium(18) and same for my Pugsley. I get to take out the 17.5 tomorrow but with nothing to compare to I'm wondering how the two sizes would really feel in comparison. The stand over looks to be highest on the 17.5 which bothers me, because I stood over it today (in dress shoes) and was not thrilled about the limited clearance. That's an important area. But I always hear people talk about reach etc.
> 
> If anyone can please shed some advice on this situation I would appreciate it.


Bombin, I'd recommend something a bit longer, the 18.5" would probably be a good bet. I'm 6' tall with a 34" inseam and ~6'1" wingspan. I'm riding a 19.5" Stache with a 110mm travel Magnum, 60mm -7* stem and a 750mm wide 15mm rise bar. My saddle height is ~183mm but this will vary a bit depending on what shoes I'm wearing and cleat positioning. I could ride a 21.5" but I prefer the slightly shorter wheelbase and smaller head tube for where I'm riding, but if I was after a bit more stability I'd be tempted to go with the 21.5... now let me try and clear up a few things about Virtual Sizing and the Stache's geo.

*Virtual Sizing:* All sizes except the 15.5" have a 1" shorter physical seattube measurement than it's actual size. Huh? A 19.5" trek has the reach, stack, and toptube length of a 19.5" frame but a seattube that measures 18.5".

*Stache Geometry (Virtual vs Actual):* Admittedly we don't do a great job on our current Geo charts of explaining this so... There's more to Stache geometry than short chainstays and big tires. The Actual Seattube Angle is 4* slacker than the Virtual Seattube Angle on the Stache. This means toptube will physically measure shorter than how the bike fits. The steep Virtual Seattube Angle helps to maintain traction on climbs and adds a bit of wheelbase, important things with short stays.

*Rigid Vs. Suspended:* As a few have pointed out the difference in axle to crown of the 110mm Magnum and the rigid fork (531mm vs 490mm) alter the bike's fit and handling. The rigid fork steepens the headangle and seatangle by 2*, this means the reach and toptube length of the Stache 5 will be a bit longer than the 7 and 9.

Hope this helps to clear things up just a bit...

Here's a crappy diagram of a static (not sagged) Stache with a 531mm axle to crown fork. As you can see the slack physical seattube makes the toptube appear shorter than how the bike will fit.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

I test rode the large (18.5) and while I normally fit much better on 17 inch frames vs 19 inch, I did not feel stretched out at all. I felt almost a little cramped at first to tell you the truth and I am exactly, yes exactly the same size as you. Stand over was not noticeable and that must have been a good thing. My own ride is a 17 in Salsa El Mariachi and the Stache 9 in the 18.5 fit better than I would have thought. I hope that helps.


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## Bombin (Jul 21, 2015)

Thank you both for those replies. That chart helped me connect all the dots. That being said, and after riding the 17.5 Stache 7 my lbs had I definitely could have used a bigger size. I was too far over the handlebar when unseated and my turning was affected.

That being said, the bike absolutely rocks in my opinion. It's such a great tire size, thats what I think it boils down to for me. For the often rooty-rocky-bumpy terrain where I live a larger tire just really helps you roll over everything and gives confidence to really bomb downhill. I think riding a Pugsley so much this summer got me to prioritize a tire with traction for really steep short climbs and in comparison to the 2.3" tires on my KM, it just was a noticeable increase in climbing ability and stability. That climbing power and rollover enhancement, at least for my local terrain, is a really great combination. This will be my next bike after I can clear out a couple others to afford a 7 build on the black frame.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Bombin said:


> I know this has been touched on but I'm not a seasoned vet on some of the sizing issues. I want a Stache, need help with the fit because my LBS only has a 17.5 and I'm a couple hours away from any others to try. That being said:
> 
> I'm 5'10 with a 30 or 31 inch inseam. I see one guy swear 17.5 is good, the other says 19.5(18.5 is the official Trek measurement I believe). I currently ride a Surly Karate Monkey medium(18) and same for my Pugsley. I get to take out the 17.5 tomorrow but with nothing to compare to I'm wondering how the two sizes would really feel in comparison. The stand over looks to be highest on the 17.5 which bothers me, because I stood over it today (in dress shoes) and was not thrilled about the limited clearance. That's an important area. But I always hear people talk about reach etc.
> 
> If anyone can please shed some advice on this situation I would appreciate it.


Sizing can depend on what you want.

I'm 5'10" with a 32.5 inseam (so slightly shorter upper body than you), and have ridden the large 19.5 a few times. That size is a little big for trail bike type riding, but was great for standard XC riding. Not to say it was a tank, but it wasn't as nimble as I'd like, still quicker than a 29'er Fuel EX though.

I usually ride a Pivot which is a relatively short (length-wise) bike, so that probably has something to do with it.

I'm probably going to order a medium 18.5 (the only size the shop I work for doesn't have as a rental) soon. But not before putting some more time on the 19.5 and doing some measurements like stem length and exposed seatpost length. I could be happy with either one, but if there's not enough exposed seatpost to allow the use of the dropper on the 9, that puts the 19.5 out of the running automatically.

Using official Trek sizing, not the "actual size" on the geometry chart.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Went for my first ride on the my new stache 5 yesterday. totally awesome and i am in love. the grip while railing corners felt like it was limitless. just lean it, trust it and let it rip. trek did a really really nice job on this bike. the geo and characteristics of the bike just felt 100% right for me, i felt comfortable on it right away. it knew what i wanted it to do and i knew what it wanted to do and we just meshed. still figuring out air pressure, got a little bob/bounce when pedaling hard, certain times i was reminded that i was on a rigid but overall the bike did a superb job of sucking up whatever the trail had to throw at it. i found it extremely easy to maneuver tight switch backs, pick my way through rock gardens and it was so efficient when putting the power down. i have an easton haven 35 bar and stem combo on it and i set it up tubeless. weight is 24.5lb w/diety comounds. i am 5'9" and feel like the 18.5" frame was built just for me, fit is spot on. i plan on adding a carbon bar to help absorb some of the shock/vibration and a nicer set of brakes. other than that this bike simply shreds. on a trail ive rode at least 12-15 times i was 1 minute off of a 1 hour and four minute pr. i was pretty impressed seeing as how its a bike i never rode and was not familiar with, as well as being rigid where as my trance is fully dialed in to my liking and has nice travel. if you are on the fence about this bike just jump right on over, you wont regret it


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## nitrousjunky (May 12, 2006)

Anyone with a Stache 5 that has used theirs on a NorthShore rack? Curious if the rigid fork crown works with it.


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

Going to pull trigger on New Stache 5 this week! After riding my Ice Cream Truck built up 29 plus I just love the tire size. Will end up probably just keeping my truck fat for bushwacking with my fellow fat riders. How are the stock rims? I have WTB scrapers also. Wondering if I should just swap out the stock rims for the scrapers. I'll also have some Maxxis Chronicles for extra tires.


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

obs08 said:


> Went for my first ride on the my new stache 5 yesterday. totally awesome and i am in love. the grip while railing corners felt like it was limitless. just lean it, trust it and let it rip. trek did a really really nice job on this bike. the geo and characteristics of the bike just felt 100% right for me, i felt comfortable on it right away. it knew what i wanted it to do and i knew what it wanted to do and we just meshed. still figuring out air pressure, got a little bob/bounce when pedaling hard, certain times i was reminded that i was on a rigid but overall the bike did a superb job of sucking up whatever the trail had to throw at it. i found it extremely easy to maneuver tight switch backs, pick my way through rock gardens and it was so efficient when putting the power down. i have an easton haven 35 bar and stem combo on it and i set it up tubeless. weight is 24.5lb w/diety comounds. i am 5'9" and feel like the 18.5" frame was built just for me, fit is spot on. i plan on adding a carbon bar to help absorb some of the shock/vibration and a nicer set of brakes. other than that this bike simply shreds. on a trail ive rode at least 12-15 times i was 1 minute off of a 1 hour and four minute pr. i was pretty impressed seeing as how its a bike i never rode and was not familiar with, as well as being rigid where as my trance is fully dialed in to my liking and has nice travel. if you are on the fence about this bike just jump right on over, you wont regret it


Very good to hear...great feedback


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## Davidcopperfield (Jan 17, 2007)

What FS 29+ is coming from Trek? Fuel EX?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Bryan1113 said:


> Going to pull trigger on New Stache 5 this week! After riding my Ice Cream Truck built up 29 plus I just love the tire size. Will end up probably just keeping my truck fat for bushwacking with my fellow fat riders. How are the stock rims? I have WTB scrapers also. Wondering if I should just swap out the stock rims for the scrapers. I'll also have some Maxxis Chronicles for extra tires.


Rims are a pleasant surprise. Weight is very reasonable considering the width and if the tape was properly applied, they are already set up tubeless. At least mine were right off the floor. Only one was done correctly and I had to re-do the other, but the bottom line is, they are good rims and I doubt you'd go through the trouble once you get your hands on them.


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

litespeedaddict said:


> Rims are a pleasant surprise. Weight is very reasonable considering the width and if the tape was properly applied, they are already set up tubeless. At least mine were right off the floor. Only one was done correctly and I had to re-do the other, but the bottom line is, they are good rims and I doubt you'd go through the trouble once you get your hands on them.


Thanks...I'll just keep my other set handy for my fat bike!


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

twa said:


> I've been riding fully rigid bikes for more than a few years. Went from a aluminum 26r Sette Reken to a fully rigid full carbon Niner Air 9 RDO. I rode my friend's Stache 5 and I was blown away, the low budget components work great, and for the price the Acera brakes are amazing!
> 
> Thanks for the review, it makes me feel better about ordering a Stache 5 without riding one. However I have been reading some bad reviews recently and hope you could expand on your comparison of the Stache and the Niner Air 9 rigid.
> 
> ...


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

Ended up ordering Stache 7 today! Can't wait


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Have a look at the carbon copy of the Stache

Products_Shenzhen ICAN Sports Equipment Co., Ltd.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Have a look at the carbon copy of the Stache
> 
> Products_Shenzhen ICAN Sports Equipment Co., Ltd.


Best part is the price is listed as $0. I'll take three!


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Has anyone put a gates belt drive on the Stache?


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Have a look at the carbon copy of the Stache
> 
> Products_Shenzhen ICAN Sports Equipment Co., Ltd.


It isn't a complete copy. The Stache has one elevated chainstay. Both chainstays on this bike are elevated.


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## lancelot (May 24, 2006)

That is one ugly mo fo!


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

You don't say. The term FUGLY was coined just to describe that thing ut:



lancelot said:


> That is one ugly mo fo!
> 
> 
> Rigid Single guy said:
> ...


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

took my stache 5 out just a bit ago and it felt amazing today. It seems to just boost my confidence every time out. One section of trail is a downhill that you can build some good speed up and a large banked left hand turn, I hit that today just flying and it carved thru it like a knife. In fact, cornered so hard and that I am a clyde, I felt and heard the tire fold over a bit and the lugs hit the frame. I decided to bump up the air pressure a couple of pounds after that. It is hard to judge but I am not sure that I ever hit that section that hard on my Fuel. Absolutely no regrets buying the Stache 5.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

vikb said:


> Best part is the price is listed as $0. I'll take three!


It's worth $0.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

Finally got my Stache build where I want it... for now.

Built from a frame up, fork from a Stache 5, Nextie 52mm rims


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

^^^^ very nice


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

mpolka said:


> Finally got my Stache build where I want it... for now.
> 
> Built from a frame up, fork from a Stache 5, Nextie 52mm rims


So what is its weight?


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

Rigid Single guy said:


> So what is its weight?


Oh yeah, forgot that. It's 26 lbs even, I figure with a rigid seatpost and chupacabras over the chronicles it would probably dip below 25. But what fun would that be, I ran chupacabras on my old krampus and they got punctured a lot.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

mpolka said:


> Finally got my Stache build where I want it... for now.
> 
> Built from a frame up, fork from a Stache 5, Nextie 52mm rims


Did you have any problems getting the next cranks to fit the wider boost system?


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Did you have any problems getting the next cranks to fit the wider boost system?


Excellent question. At first I had xtr M985 race cranks with the narrow q-factor, I used the wolftooth chainring which gave a chainline of about 51.6mm. This is very close to the recommended 52mm chainline for boost cranks. I found this setup to be unsatisfactory for 2 reasons; first being the narrow q-factor gave me no more than 3mm of clearance to the non-drive side chainstay, the other reason was that the drivetrain didn't perform well with the chainline. In the 40t cog when back pedaling the chain would derail to the next smallest cog, I take this as a sign that the chainline is too far out board. I swapped cranks and BBs with my full susp bike and it turns out the next cranks work better on the Stache with a 49mm chainline, they also have more clearance to the stays. The other bike works fine with the wider chainline but it is a 10 speed drivetrain so 1st gear doesn't sit so far inboard. My guess for the whole situation is that the recommended chainline is not optimized for 11 speed drivetrains.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

And on the topic of boost and what not. My next fork will be a Fox 34 with boost 110. I was assembling a 2016 Fuel EX 9 29er at work the other day (this bike comes boost 110/148.) We've got a couple Stache 7's on the sales floor so i couldn't resist test fitting the Stache front wheel on the Fuel. It clears no problem, I didn't get a chance to check full compression though.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Thanks for the pics and info, good to know. How long have you had the Stache's sitting there, long enough for the tyres to have grown? Not sure how much the CHupas grown, but the Maxxis Chronicles grew quite a bit for me, enough from having sufficient clearance in the rear of my Phantom for smooth dirt to not being able to spin after a couple months use on my Monkey.



mpolka said:


> And on the topic of boost and what not. My next fork will be a Fox 34 with boost 110. I was assembling a 2016 Fuel EX 9 29er at work the other day (this bike comes boost 110/148.) We've got a couple Stache 7's on the sales floor so i couldn't resist test fitting the Stache front wheel on the Fuel. It clears no problem, I didn't get a chance to check full compression though.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

LyNx said:


> Thanks for the pics and info, good to know. How long have you had the Stache's sitting there, long enough for the tyres to have grown? Not sure how much the CHupas grown, but the Maxxis Chronicles grew quite a bit for me, enough from having sufficient clearance in the rear of my Phantom for smooth dirt to not being able to spin after a couple months use on my Monkey.


I hadn't thought about tire growth, the Stache's had been around for a week or two before the Fuel came in and they also ship with the tires inflated so I'm sure they had some time to stretch out a bit. Do you think tires grow at a different rate when there is an inner tube in them compared to tubeless? Another thing to consider is the chupacabra in the picture was inflated to nearly 20 psi.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

For me it is hard to say if the frame alone is harsher than the RDO. My Air 9 RDO was fully rigid with 2.3s and the 3.0s alone provide a comfier ride and then you throw the Manitou Magnum with the slacker geometry and I have been a much been rider since.

On steep punchy climbs I am better with the stache vs the air 9 RDO. I'd say the air 9 did steer a little quicker but I had skinnier handlebars and that RDO rigid fork is stupid light.

The Niner is now sold and and the stache is my single bike arrow in the quiver. I replaced the droppah post with a Bontrager fixed post and recently swapped the stem from the 70mm Bontrager to a 50mm Thomson. Photos attached.









































Rigid Single guy said:


> twa said:
> 
> 
> > I've been riding fully rigid bikes for more than a few years. Went from a aluminum 26r Sette Reken to a fully rigid full carbon Niner Air 9 RDO. I rode my friend's Stache 5 and I was blown away, the low budget components work great, and for the price the Acera brakes are amazing!
> ...


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

twa said:


> For me it is hard to say if the frame alone is harsher than the RDO. My Air 9 RDO was fully rigid with 2.3s and the 3.0s alone provide a comfier ride and then you throw the Manitou Magnum with the slacker geometry and I have been a much been rider since.
> 
> On steep punchy climbs I am better with the stache vs the air 9 RDO. I'd say the air 9 did steer a little quicker but I had skinnier handlebars and that RDO rigid fork is stupid light.
> 
> ...


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## Trailice (Oct 30, 2009)

*This made me do it!*

Well that was enough for me! $847 for a 110 hope hub and the 27.5+ fox from Universal cycles.


mpolka said:


> And on the topic of boost and what not. My next fork will be a Fox 34 with boost 110. I was assembling a 2016 Fuel EX 9 29er at work the other day (this bike comes boost 110/148.) We've got a couple Stache 7's on the sales floor so i couldn't resist test fitting the Stache front wheel on the Fuel. It clears no problem, I didn't get a chance to check full compression though.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Look forward to hearing how this works out. Keep us posted.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

The fork MPolka was talking about is the 34 29er fork. The 34 27+ works also, maybe with even more clearance for 29+


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

TuTone T said:


> The fork MPolka was talking about is the 34 29er fork. The 34 27+ works also, maybe with even more clearance for 29+


Good catch. Luckily I'm stuck on the Pike 275 until it gets sold, but I don't think I've been so excited to buy a fork before actually buying a fork. If that 27.5+ model fits 29+ like they say, I'm so in.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

zeb said:


> Summer without new bike makes jack a dull boy.So i got 29+.
> View attachment 1001186


What and how long the stem? matching with the frame color, beautiful.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

TuTone T said:


> The fork MPolka was talking about is the 34 29er fork. The 34 27+ works also, maybe with even more clearance for 29+


I'm not sure that two different forks exist, they might be using a 27.5+ fork with boost as oem for the 29er boost bikes. The fox website shows an option to have a 27.5+ with 110 axle but no 110 option for 29er. Also the 2016 Rockshox line includes forks they are advertising as 27+/29. All this makes me think it's the same fork.


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## LFJ (Dec 6, 2004)

I think you are right. Trek bikes come stock with Fox Performance Forks and on the fox webpage if you check off the Performance box on the Fox fork builder page there are no options for 110 boost spacing in 27.5 or 29" for a performance fork. 


mpolka said:


> I'm not sure that two different forks exist, they might be using a 27.5+ fork with boost as oem for the 29er boost bikes. The fox website shows an option to have a 27.5+ with 110 axle but no 110 option for 29er. Also the 2016 Rockshox line includes forks they are advertising as 27+/29. All this makes me think it's the same fork.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

mpolka said:


> I'm not sure that two different forks exist, they might be using a 27.5+ fork with boost as oem for the 29er boost bikes. The fox website shows an option to have a 27.5+ with 110 axle but no 110 option for 29er. Also the 2016 Rockshox line includes forks they are advertising as 27+/29. All this makes me think it's the same fork.


Sorry shouldn't have spoken for you. I was talking about the Fox Factory series
29 no boost, 100mm. Saw some pictures of the clearance in another thread which I can't find now. Looked good to go On 29+ also. Can't remember what tire either.
Ha Ha getting old I guess...


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## dtygard (Aug 26, 2015)

Hey Jim, what did you end up doing for the spacing on the front hub when you put the Fox fork on your Stache 5? I was talking to some mechanics about doing something similar to what you did with your bike and the told me I would need to get a new wheel in addition to the new fork because of the 110 hub. Thoughts? Thanks.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

dtygard said:


> I was talking to some mechanics about doing something similar to what you did with your bike and the told me I would need to get a new wheel in addition to the new fork because of the 110 hub. Thoughts? Thanks.












Sam W from Naked Cycles machined a new right end cap for his 100mm hub so it would work in a 110mm fork and redished the rim to centre. No issues that he has reported. :thumbsup:

I'll end up going this route when I have to buy a Boost fork one of these days. I've got way to many nice 100mm hubs that aren't going to wear out this decade.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

What are you peoples running for fork setup on the magnum? I was going to start fiddling with the volume spacers and such, and wanted to know if there were any good starting points.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

briantortilla said:


> What are you peoples running for fork setup on the magnum? I was going to start fiddling with the volume spacers and such, and wanted to know if there were any good starting points.


On my Stache 7 I am running 70 PSI (I weigh 210) and the rebound clicker half way out. Works for me......also the tire pressures are 9 PSI front and 10 PSI back. I just converted to tubeless and will have my first tubeless ride tomorrow. I am interested to see if the 9/10 PSI combo works for tubeless also.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

jpc111 said:


> On my Stache 7 I am running 70 PSI (I weigh 210) and the rebound clicker half way out. Works for me......also the tire pressures are 9 PSI front and 10 PSI back. I just converted to tubeless and will have my first tubeless ride tomorrow. I am interested to see if the 9/10 PSI combo works for tubeless also.


Wow that seems low. I'm running 12 front and 13.5 rear. Curious to here how the tires hold up. I'm about 215 geared up.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

jpc111 said:


> On my Stache 7 I am running 70 PSI (I weigh 210) and the rebound clicker half way out. Works for me......also the tire pressures are 9 PSI front and 10 PSI back. I just converted to tubeless and will have my first tubeless ride tomorrow. I am interested to see if the 9/10 PSI combo works for tubeless also.


210 & you get by with 9 & 10 psi? Yikes. I am currently 192 and I feel more squirm than I like at anything under 12.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Just remember Peeps, unless you're all using the EXACT SAME gauge, looking at what anyone else is running is pointless, your gauge might read high, theirs low, who knows.



litespeedaddict said:


> 210 & you get by with 9 & 10 psi? Yikes. I am currently 192 and I feel more squirm than I like at anything under 12.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

LyNx said:


> Just remember Peeps, unless you're all using the EXACT SAME gauge, looking at what anyone else is running is pointless, your gauge might read high, theirs low, who knows.


Excellent point. BTW, I use a SKS "Air Checker" digital gage. I started at 15 PSI and after several rides got to 9/10 combo. I ride a hard packed trail with lots of roots. At this pressure I don't feel any squirm or feel any rim hits.

I checked Bontragers web site and they recommend 12-30 PSI.

I converted to tubeless today and will have my first ride in the morning. I am curious to see if there is a ride difference with no tubes.

I weighed my bike at the bike shop today (again not all scales are the same either), with no tubes, 5 OZ of stan's sealant in each tire, ergon grips and Egg Beater chrome moly pedals, my 17.5" 7 model weighed in at 29# 0 oz.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

jpc111, I for one will be interested to know if you still like the 9/10
combo without the tubes.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

I'm going to guess that you'll want to add some PSI since the tyre will no longer have support from the tube and you're already at optimal low pressures for the tyres. After seeing that numerous of the pro teams are using the Topeak digital gauges, I decided to give mine a go again, despite the readings seeming super low compared to those from my Topeak JoBlo mountain floor pump and if it's right, then a lot of people's impressions of pressures are most likely WAY off and I myself have been running really low pressures than I thought.



jpc111 said:


> Excellent point. BTW, I use a SKS "Air Checker" digital gage. I started at 15 PSI and after several rides got to 9/10 combo. I ride a hard packed trail with lots of roots. At this pressure I don't feel any squirm or feel any rim hits.
> 
> *I converted to tubeless today and will have my first ride in the morning. I am curious to see if there is a ride difference with no tubes.*


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

TuTone T said:


> jpc111, I for one will be interested to know if you still like the 9/10
> combo without the tubes.


I set the pressures at 11 front and 12 back. Seemed to work OK, no detectable tire squirming. Seems like the bike accelerated from a stop faster and felt more lively on the hills.

The riding conditions were dark and wet this morning. The tires seemed to handle the damp soil and roots very well.

Over all, I like the bike more every time I ride it.


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

There's some good great info here.....thanks for sharing 
Looking for opinions from newer Stache owners with the Stranglehold drop outs.

Looking for a "playful" xc/trail bike that I won't look foolish racing on the weekend. 
Love the Stache's geo but at this time, i have no interest in the plus size tires. Stranglehold allows you to switch it up.

How do you the Stache would do for me ditching the plus wheels and tires and replacing them with some "regular" 29er tires and wheels?

Thanks all!


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

toddre said:


> There's some good great info here.....thanks for sharing
> Looking for opinions from newer Stache owners with the Stranglehold drop outs.
> 
> Looking for a "playful" xc/trail bike that I won't look foolish racing on the weekend.
> ...


Just buy the normal stache.


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## NickandBruce (Sep 18, 2014)

jdcatnau said:


> Just buy the normal stache.


Yeah, and throw on some old rubber to see how you like it with smaller tires before spending more money. You might like it, and if you don't, you can always make the switch down the road. Your BB will be a little lower but I don't think it should be a problem.


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

NickandBruce said:


> Yeah, and throw on some old rubber to see how you like it with smaller tires before spending more money. You might like it, and if you don't, you can always make the switch down the road. Your BB will be a little lower but I don't think it should be a problem.


Sorry if I was confusing. I don't have a Stache. Rode one last year a small bit, but I like the numbers of 2016...


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## Bryan1113 (Feb 21, 2013)

Just want to say i'm really loving my Stache 7! Bike is jack of all trades...The 1x11 is flawless and bike can climb like a billy goat. So my bike set up tubeless and 21.5 is 29 lbs with Dmr vault pedals. Can't wait for another epic adventure


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

toddre said:


> There's some good great info here.....thanks for sharing
> Looking for opinions from newer Stache owners with the Stranglehold drop outs.
> 
> Looking for a "playful" xc/trail bike that I won't look foolish racing on the weekend.
> ...


Foolish idea, go + anything else is just a road bike.


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

temporoad said:


> foolish idea, go + anything else is just a road bike.


ha!


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## Tincup69 (Sep 5, 2012)

What are everyone's thoughts on a Stache 5 or 7 for bikepacking? I'd like to pick up a new bike and I'm leaning towards a 5 or 7 or possibly another fatbike. Too many awesome bikes out right now!


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Tincup69 said:


> What are everyone's thoughts on a Stache 5 or 7 for bikepacking? I'd like to pick up a new bike and I'm leaning towards a 5 or 7 or possibly another fatbike. Too many awesome bikes out right now!


The main problem is the small area inside of the front triangle, which shouldn't be that big of a deal since people run F/S bikes with the shock and linkage inside of the triangle as well.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

richde said:


> The main problem is the small area inside of the front triangle, which shouldn't be that big of a deal since people run F/S bikes with the shock and linkage inside of the triangle as well.


People do, but small triangles are a PITA for bikepacking as that's the best place to carry heavy items where it affects the ride the least.

Having said that it's rare these days to see a MTB without an ankle height TT! 

If you are going to bikepack a lot try and buy the biggest frame you can ride. I can typically fit onto two frame sizes with a tweak of the stem/bars. When you get your frame bag make it as wide as you can while still pedalling comfortably.

If I owned a Stache I'd bikepack with it. Looks like a fun bike. 

BTW - if you are looking for more storage on the Stache you can do the following:

- 1.5L water bottle/cage under the DT using hose clamps or anything cage
- water bottle/cage to each fork leg with tape
- stem mounted water bottle/cage

These are all proven reliable ways to mount extra cargo where there are no mounts on the bike.


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## tominpinson (Jul 1, 2008)

Has anyone installed an oval chainring in the 1x9 set up? I have a Stache 5 and was thinking of ordering one. I worry about the elevated chainstays.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

tominpinson said:


> Has anyone installed an oval chainring in the 1x9 set up? I have a Stache 5 and was thinking of ordering one. I worry about the elevated chainstays.


I run an Absolute Black 30T oval but in SS mode with 19t out back on my Stache 5. It is somewhat tight with the chain stay but works fine. What tooth count do you have on your front ring now? If 32t maybe go to a 30t in the oval.


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## Fatnsingle (Sep 4, 2015)

Anyone having problems with the rear hub? I was climbing a short steep hill and felt the something in the drive train slipping. The shop said it's the ratchet ring spinning in the hub body.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Fatnsingle said:


> Anyone having problems with the rear hub? I was climbing a short steep hill and felt the something in the drive train slipping. The shop said it's the ratchet ring spinning in the hub body.


I haven't been able to ride mine yet so no, but I am curious what kind of hub it is? It looks like, and I am basing it on the font of the word "Boost" a Sram hub. If so, I would be very disappointed if they have an issue. Having said that, rear hubs on floor bikes (non sweet DT Swiss or Chris King or I9) seem to be failing more than they used to these days on a lot of mountain and fat bikes.


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## Fatnsingle (Sep 4, 2015)

litespeedaddict said:


> I haven't been able to ride mine yet so no, but I am curious what kind of hub it is? It looks like, and I am basing it on the font of the word "Boost" a Sram hub. If so, I would be very disappointed if they have an issue. Having said that, rear hubs on floor bikes (non sweet DT Swiss or Chris King or I9) seem to be failing more than they used to these days on a lot of mountain and fat bikes.


I'm not sure who makes the hub but it is disappointing to have a failure with less than 250 miles.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Now you know what it feels like to have owned a SpecialED bike with their HiLo hubs over the last 5 years, those freehub bodies usually crap out in that sort of time frame and despite them knowing they're bad they still spec and install them on their bikes with the hope they won't give trouble or the person won't ride too much and they'll go outside of warranty.

Hopefully it's just a bad hub and not something worse.



Fatnsingle said:


> I'm not sure who makes the hub but it is disappointing to have a failure with less than 250 miles.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Aren't some the Stache+ bikes fitted with the DT Swiss hubs with the Star Ratchet Internals and 54t rachets that were recalled or defective or something?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

PHeller said:


> Aren't some the Stache+ bikes fitted with the DT Swiss hubs with the Star Ratchet Internals and 54t rachets that were recalled or defective or something?


I know the top of the line Stache has the DT 350 rear hub, but I think that's the only one. All the others are something else, like I said, I thought they were Sram. But I am basing that on similar font they used on a different hub, I could be totally off base on that.


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## Fatnsingle (Sep 4, 2015)

I saw it disassembled at the shop. Definitely spring loaded pawls that engage the inside of the ratchet ring. The problem was the outside of the ring was spinning in the hub. I'm not sure if the ring is threaded or pressed in to the hub but either way that's where it failed. BTW I have the Stache 5.


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## Fatnsingle (Sep 4, 2015)

Trek doesn't have any wheels or hubs for warranty replacement.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Fatnsingle said:


> Trek doesn't have any wheels or hubs for warranty replacement.


Get an I9? I'd be tempted.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

Fatnsingle said:


> Trek doesn't have any wheels or hubs for warranty replacement.


I've been really happy with my Hope Pro 2 Evo boost rear hub. If your LBS uses BTI as a distributor you can get them already, QBP still doesn't have them because they are slow to pick up new hotness.


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

Has anyone built a 27+ Stache? How does that work without scraping the BB on the ground?


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

that guy again said:


> Has anyone built a 27+ Stache? How does that work without scraping the BB on the ground?


Why? Just get a dedicated 650b frame. If you go 29+er you my never consider a smaller wheel size again.


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

Why? Trek says it is compatible so I'm wondering how that works.


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

Nevermind. Here's the answer. Longer fork adjusts BB drop.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I had the star ratchets fail on a climb on my Stache 9 after only 150 miles.

Took the star ratchets out of the freehub and there was evidence of some blurring on the mating surfaces.

Already had a spare set for my road bike, popped them in and everything has been fine.

I sent the defective star ratchets to my bike shop who organised a free of charge replacement set.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

that guy again said:


> Why? Trek says it is compatible so I'm wondering how that works.


I am sure it may also accommodate 26" wheels as well.


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

temporoad said:


> I am sure it may also accommodate 26" wheels as well.


Oh I'm sure it will fit 20 inch wheels too, but Trek specificity states the Stache frame is desingned for 29+, 27+ and standard 29 inch wheels, so I'm curious to know if anyone has built/ridden one with 27+ wheels yet?


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## FatSpooky (Dec 2, 2014)

I am still riding my 26" steel hardtail. I'm getting tired of watching 29er full suspension guys roll over all of the roots and small rocks while I have to pick through all of it. I'm considering the Stache as a replacement for both my hardtail and my full rigid fatbike. How much more difficult is it to bring these wheels/tires up to speed with the larger diameter? Lots of rocks, roots, and climbs on my regular rides.


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## mhopton (Nov 27, 2005)

I'm running a 3.0 Chupacabra on my superfly ss with a standard 2.3 on the back. The chupa feels good at 12psi but definitely takes more effort to get up to speed. 

The traction is like crack though....so awesome. 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I call marketing BS on this claim from Trek. Any 29+ frame could also fit 27.5+, or 26+, or anything that is smaller. Slapping on a longer fork doesn't really adjust for the smaller wheel size, since it also changes the seat and head tube angle, and bottom bracket drop.



that guy again said:


> Oh I'm sure it will fit 20 inch wheels too, but Trek specificity states the Stache frame is desingned for 29+, 27+ and standard 29 inch wheels, so I'm curious to know if anyone has built/ridden one with 27+ wheels yet?


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

It definitely takes a little bit of extra energy to spin a 29+ up over a regular 29er. It would probably be pretty noticeable coming off a 26. 

The flip side is that it's harder to slow them down so you don't have to re-accelerate every time you hit a rock. And the 29+ is "more" of everything there is to say about a 29er. Spins up even slower, maintains momentum better, gets hung up on things less, etc.


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

seat_boy said:


> I call marketing BS on this claim from Trek. Any 29+ frame could also fit 27.5+, or 26+, or anything that is smaller. Slapping on a longer fork doesn't really adjust for the smaller wheel size, since it also changes the seat and head tube angle, and bottom bracket drop.


I agree. That's why I'm curious if anyone has actually done it.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

I posted under the Niner ROS 9 Plus and I am posting here also.

I own both the Niner ROS 9 Plus and a Trek Stache 5. The 29+ or midfat in general might not be for everyone. However, I really enjoy riding these midfat bikes, and I haven't really ridden my regular 29ers since I got the 29+.

The way I ended up with two 29+ bikes is that I live in Florida, but spend some time in Illinois, so I wanted a bike for Illinois also.

I can't really pinpoint which bike I like riding better, the Trek Stache or the ROS 9 Plus. The ROS 9 Plus is a 1x11 vs the Trek Stache 5 which is a 1x10. I paid $2550 for the ROS 9 Plus from an online store shipped free to my home in Florida. I paid $1600 with tax for the Trek Stache 5 from an LBS in Illinois. 

So, owning each bike and not be able to really pinpoint which bike I like better, I would say that if someone wants to try out the midfat bike technology; that maybe a Trek Stache 5 is an easy decision at around $1600 if they can live with a 1x10 rather than a 1x11.

Somethings I have noticed about the 2 bikes:

1.) I was worried that the Aluminum Trek Stache 5 would be a harsh ride as I have only ridden steel for years. I found this not to be true. With the 3" inch tires and Carbon Fork, the Stache seems just as smooth as the steel Niner ROS 9 Plus.

2.) I was worried that the Stache only has a regular Deore rear derailleur and how would it shift. I found that the Deore shifts great. I am sure the Deore derailleur is heavier than my Sram derailleur on my Niner, but they seem to both shift great and both are extremely quiet.

3.) I wasn't sure if I was going to like the color of the Stache 5, but I do. In fact, people stop me to tell me how much they like the color of my bike.

4.) The 29+ is not only fun in the woods it is fun for urban riding also with either bike.

5.) I am just under 6'2" and I bought XL frame size in both these bikes. I know Niner recommends XL for guys over 6'3" and I would imagine that Trek is the same, however the XL seems to fit me. I even added riser bars on both bikes, so I could keep my hands about even with my seat height. I may shorten my stem on my Trek later on, although it's probably fine for now. (The XL trek comes with a 90 stem and 1/4 inch set back seatpost and the EFF is a little longet on the Trek. The Niner has a straight seatpost and an 85 stem)


29+ bikes are different from regular 29ers, I think some people like me are really going to love them, but maybe some better technical riders and or lighter riders may not like them over their regular 29er. But if a person wants to try 29+ and see if it is right for them or they already have 2,3 or more bikes; I think they would be happy with a Stache 5. This is not to say that the Niner is not a great decision, also (I do like them both, it's just the Trek is less expensive).


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Great info. Thanks

Can you link the Niner post?


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Sandman that's a great write-up right there. Interesting you specify the Deore rear derailleur. When I first got the 5 I wondered if I could "live with" the brakes and derailleur, Turns out my concerns were unfounded, those things work amazing which means you don't HAVE to really upgrade anything. The bang for the buck is amazing on this bike. What I would do, if I was going to ride a lot of trails with it, is get the Praxis 11-40 cassette, that is a worthy "upgrade", & as I type this I remembered I switched to a 30 ring up front as well. Stock 32 was a lot more gear than I would want, at least where I live and ride anyway, everyone's mileage will vary on that of course. As far as the color goes, it's my favorite bike from an aesthetic standpoint I've ever owned, love that color, whatever it's called.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

The stache 9 comes with DT Swiss 350 hubs. The hubs come with a 18 tooth star ratchet. This is 20 degrees of engagement. I just bought the 36 tooth replacement star ratchet w/ DT swiss grease for about $90 shipped.

The engagement is reduced to 10 degrees. The upgrade takes about 5 min. It is completely tooless. You can pull the freehub body off with the cassette after removing the wheel just by pulling up. The end cap is press fit and will pop up. In the freehub body you'll have a spring, than in the hub is the two piece star ratchet and another spring on the other side of the ratchet.



PHeller said:


> Aren't some the Stache+ bikes fitted with the DT Swiss hubs with the Star Ratchet Internals and 54t rachets that were recalled or defective or something?


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/niner-ros9-how-come-bike-gets-little-no-attention-love-986234.html

post #17 and #19


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

bonesetter,

Here is the link on the Niner ROS 9 Plus forum:

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/niner-ros9-how-come-bike-gets-little-no-attention-love-986234.html

My comments are #17 and #19, I believe.

litespeedaddict,

The things I changed on both bikes, but are not nessacary for eveyone is that I like Fizik saddles, Riser bars and Ergon grips. But, the stock saddle, flatbars and grips were perfectly fine.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

bonesetter,

Here is the link on the the ROS 9 Plus. I am comment #17 and #19.

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/niner-ros9-how-come-bike-gets-little-no-attention-love-986234.html


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

twa said:


> The stache 9 comes with DT Swiss 350 hubs. The hubs come with a 18 tooth star ratchet. This is 20 degrees of engagement. I just bought the 36 tooth replacement star ratchet w/ DT swiss grease for about $90 shipped.
> 
> The engagement is reduced to 10 degrees. The upgrade takes about 5 min. It is completely tooless. You can pull the freehub body off with the cassette after removing the wheel just by pulling up. The end cap is press fit and will pop up. In the freehub body you'll have a spring, than in the hub is the two piece star ratchet and another spring on the other side of the ratchet.


Is there an actual machining problem with the ratchet or do they just need a little more lube?

Had the same problem with some Kings pop up after a few hundred miles. Dripped some King lube in and haven't had the problem since.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

When mine failed, I thought they didn't have enough grease on them.

Prior to them failing, they made a lot of the angry bee noise when freewheeling.

When I replaced them , I put enough grease on the mating serrations, which did make the freehub much quieter.

No problems since doing this.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

stache 5 is a 10 speed bro


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Sandman29 said:


> I posted under the Niner ROS 9 Plus and I am posting here also.
> 
> I own both the Niner ROS 9 Plus and a Trek Stache 5. The 29+ or midfat in general might not be for everyone. However, I really enjoy riding these midfat bikes, and I haven't really ridden my regular 29ers since I got the 29+.
> 
> ...


Hi
Thanks for the review of your bikes, how does the handling of the two bikes compare, do you think the Stache turns better than the ROS9+? Is the Stache a faster bike, etc?

I know both are designed to be fun all mountain bikes, but you most think one is better than the other for different types of riding. Which do you prefer to ride in different conditions, e.g. down hill conditions, cross country conditions, etc?

thanks mate


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Sandman29 said:


> 29+ bikes are different from regular 29ers, I think some people like me are really going to love them, but maybe some better technical riders and or lighter riders may not like them over their regular 29er. But if a person wants to try 29+ and see if it is right for them or they already have 2,3 or more bikes; I think they would be happy with a Stache 5. This is not to say that the Niner is not a great decision, also (I do like them both, it's just the Trek is less expensive).


I've had great luck riding a Stache in low speed technical stuff. The short chainstays and wheelbase makes maneuvering it a breeze.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

I agree. In fact, for guys like me who are technically challenged the 29+ is great, it makes it a lot easier on technical stuff. 

In my comment, on who might not want to give up their 29er for a 29+ are those people who are lighter weight guys and who might not get the benefit of incresing their technical ability because they already have unbelievable technical skills.

But who knows maybe just like when fatter tennis rackets came out and fatter golf club heads eventually most players and the those industries went in a fatter direction, no matter if they were highly skilled or not.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

Rigid Single Guy,

I can't really compare the 2 bikes on the same trail. In Illinois, with Trek Stache 5, I ride trails which are more hilly than in Florida. Florida is more roots and sand, with some short climbs and maybe steeper drops, but not as long. After I ride each bike I think "Wow, that was a lot of fun and a great workout". So, I don't see a noticable head to head difference.

I came from riding a lot of Single Speed 29er, so since both of these bikes are rigid, I ride them a lot like a single speed. So, in both cases I am out of the saddle a lot and moving my body in different positions. Maybe, I am moving different on the different bikes but I don't notice it.

One of the things I like about both of these bikes is that even though they are 1x11 and 1x10 bikes, I still do get that thrill like I am riding a single speed. These fatter tires get your endorphines flowing just like on a single speed because you have to push them harder and since they are rigids you have to work them that way as well. I end the ride alway thinking, that was a great workout.

I originally wanted a 29+ in a single speed, because I love single speeds. But I am glad that I went with the 1x11 or in this case the 1x10. The new derailleur are smooth and quiet; and with the fatter tires I like having some gears to help me out. 

So, back to your question, I don't think one bike is faster than the other and I think they ride about the same. If you think you are going to eventually go Single Speed, priced at around $1600 on the Stache 5, you can take the gears off and convert the bike to SS and you still have a great value. The Stache has that sliding rear drop out, so I think it would be easy to adjust tension on the bike as a single speed.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Sandman29 said:


> Rigid Single Guy,
> 
> I can't really compare the 2 bikes on the same trail. In Illinois, with Trek Stache 5, I ride trails which are more hilly than in Florida. Florida is more roots and sand, with some short climbs and maybe steeper drops, but not as long. After I ride each bike I think "Wow, that was a lot of fun and a great workout". So, I don't see a noticable head to head difference.
> 
> ...


Thanks mate, your write up and reply are constructive and useful. As you may have guessed I currently ride a rigid single speed (Niner air9 carbon) and love it, however I have a Stache 5 on order.

I ride my current bike as you described single speed riding and I'm planning to convert the Stache 5 into a single speed with a gates belt drive system.

i previously owned the ROS9+ for a few weeks, but was unable to ride it on the track, it had a significant tyre/wheel problem (which may have been due to the pressure the bike shop inflated the tyres to at installation). The result was i returned it to the shop to get my money back as it was unsafe to ride. However I did like the feel of the ROS9+ so it is good to hear you like both bikes.

Have you had any problems with dirt getting into the Stache wheels via the cutouts in the rim?

thanks mate, happy riding.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

Rigid Single Guy,

I ruined a rim on my Niner ROS 9 Plus as well. Stan's replaced the rim, but I still had to pay my LBS to put it on. Stan's actually sent me the 2nd generation of the Hugo 52. The 1st generation is what shipped with the bike. The 2nd generation is the same basic design, but it weights more as they had to beef up the Aluminum. 

The only problem I had with the Mulefut rims on the Trek Stache was that I spent time and money getting them set up tubeless by my LBS in Illinois and they never did seal very well because of the weight relief holes in the center of the rims, so I went back to running tubes in them. But actually, since these tire have so much volume in them, the tubes feel pretty good. 

Some people have had some success with sealing the Mulefut, but I was not one of them. So, I would recommend sticking with tubes for awhile, have fun with the bike and then at some later date switch to tubeless if you want.

I think if I were to build a Krampus or a Carver, I would try out the Velocity Dually rim which is about 42mm internal compared to 49mm. Although 7mm narrower I think 42mm would be plenty wide for a midfat tire. The Dually is double walled all the way to the side wall, just like traditional rims. The Stan's Hugo 52 rim is only double walled in the center, but in order to save weight not all the way to the side wall. I think this is what contributed to my ruining the Hugo 52. The Mulefut is single walled but they use more material, so they weight relief with those center holes. The Dually seems to control the weight by making it about a 1/4 of an inch narrower. On my current bikes I don't plan to swap out the shipped rims, unless I continue to ruin the Hugo 52s on the Niner. 

I love single speeds as well, but you may want to try the 1x10 system shipped with the bike - I found it to shift extremely well, quiet and you still get the great workout because the of the tire size.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Sandman29 said:


> The only problem I had with the Mulefut rims on the Trek Stache was that I spent time and money getting them set up tubeless by my LBS in Illinois and they never did seal very well because of the weight relief holes in the center of the rims, so I went back to running tubes in them.


I've had my Krampus 29+ Rabbit Hole rims tubeless for 2yrs with zero problems. If anyone is having tubeless issues drop in on the Krampus thread or the fatbike forum. There is lots of experience getting tubeless to work with rim cut outs. :thumbsup:


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

Still hoping to find someone whose ridden the Stache + with standard wheels and tires for those weekend warrior xc races.... anyone?


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## mrh372 (Aug 9, 2013)

Sandman29 said:


> The only problem I had with the Mulefut rims on the Trek Stache was that I spent time and money getting them set up tubeless by my LBS in Illinois and they never did seal very well because of the weight relief holes in the center of the rims, so I went back to running tubes in them. But actually, since these tire have so much volume in them, the tubes feel pretty good.
> 
> Some people have had some success with sealing the Mulefut, but I was not one of them. So, I would recommend sticking with tubes for awhile, have fun with the bike and then at some later date switch to tubeless if you want.


My front I had issues staying sealed, rear did not. I just ran gorilla tape over top of the stock crappy sealing strip and now the front holds air just fine. A quick five minute fix.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Sandman29 said:


> Rigid Single Guy,
> 
> I ruined a rim on my Niner ROS 9 Plus as well. Stan's replaced the rim, but I still had to pay my LBS to put it on. Stan's actually sent me the 2nd generation of the Hugo 52. The 1st generation is what shipped with the bike. The 2nd generation is the same basic design, but it weights more as they had to beef up the Aluminum.
> 
> ...


Hi sandman29

As I haven't ridden the Stache before I ordered it, I'll try the bike geared to see if I like how it rides, but I fully anticipate changing it to single speed. I like simple and haven't ridden a suspension bike or geared bike for the last 3 years.

Single speed has enough gearing options for me (sitting down, standing up and free wheeling). Single speed makes me ride harder, as i can not crawl up a climb in a low gear.

A lot of people on the forums have said the chain rubs the bottom of the chain stay if you run single speed with a 32t chain ring and a 20t sprocket. I'm not sure why this happens as the bike comes factory with a 32t chain ring and the 10 speed cassette has a 19t and 21t in the middle of the cassette. I would assume a straight chain from the front chain ring would line up with either the 19t or 21t and you could replicate that with a single speed setup, without the chain rubbing the frame.

Can you please advise if the chain is straight when it is in either the 19t or 21t gears, and does the chain rubs the frame in the factory setup? Also what is your typical go to gear, is it the 21t? My current gearing on a standard 29er is 32t/18t and due to the larger wheels I assume I would have to change this to 32t/20t, what do you think?

Thanks mate


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## PretendGentleman (May 24, 2011)

vikb said:


> I've had my Krampus 29+ Rabbit Hole rims tubeless for 2yrs with zero problems. If anyone is having tubeless issues drop in on the Krampus thread or the fatbike forum. There is lots of experience getting tubeless to work with rim cut outs. :thumbsup:


I haven't heard a solution to sticks going through. Had this happen twice in two years. Also, I've had gorilla tape push through after running 30 psi for road riding. Trying to find a minimal setup doesn't help, but some of the weight lost to the holes is gained back with tape and strips, which is annoying. I hope to never own cutouts rims again.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Rigid Single guy said:


> Hi sandman29
> 
> As I haven't ridden the Stache before I ordered it, I'll try the bike geared to see if I like how it rides, but I fully anticipate changing it to single speed. I like simple and haven't ridden a suspension bike or geared bike for the last 3 years.
> 
> ...


I've always been a single speed guy myself. I always rode a Monocog and was a "SS till I die" kinda guy. I recently bought a Stache 5 with the intentions of making it a SS but after 3 rides and only using two gears I am actually quite content. I don't like easy pedaling and I make sure I don't switch between those two gears often.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

toddre said:


> Still hoping to find someone whose ridden the Stache + with standard wheels and tires for those weekend warrior xc races.... anyone?


Why on earth would you do that?
Nothing but gains with those 29+.


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

Gambit21 said:


> Why on earth would you do that?
> Nothing but gains with those 29+.


Yeah, the more I think about it you might be right, but i like the short cs idea....we'll see.... actually got to see a 7 today but didn't get a chance to ride it... still not sure if its the way I want to go.....
Thanks!


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## that guy again (Oct 6, 2006)

Gambit21 said:


> Why on earth would you do that?
> Nothing but gains with those 29+.


It's a valid question and I'd like to know as well. 29+ is great but other wheel/tire sizes have advantages too. Like I said before, Trek specifically markets the Stache as versatile enough to run different sizes so why shouldn't someone at least try it?


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

that guy again said:


> It's a valid question and I'd like to know as well. 29+ is great but other wheel/tire sizes have advantages too. Like I said before, Trek specifically markets the Stache as versatile enough to run different sizes so why shouldn't someone at least try it?


Yes!!! I finally got a valid question on here!


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

Here are a few pics of my 5 in ss mode with 19T rear and oval 30T in front. I have the oval with the longest section in the vertical position for these pics so should be aprox = round 32T ring in that position. The clearance is close but I still have room to wrap the chain stay without rubbing. I think the issue is to maintain a straight chainline the sprocket has to be further out than you might expect. I wish Trek had put a slight arch shape in the chainstay but it works fine with the setup I have.

Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr

Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr


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## Dan GSR (Apr 29, 2010)

yes a boost chainring is 3mm more outboard


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Need some zsizing help. 17.5" will be on stock but 18.5" need to wait for at least three weeks. I´m 175cm or ~5´8". Should I take the smaller one or wait for next size bigger?


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

FreeZ,

I would wait for the 18.5". These bikes in my opinion seem to run a little small anyways.

I am just under 6'2' and I bought mine in an XL.

I saw some guy selling his Stache 5 so he could buy the next larger size as he felt his orginal Stache was too small.

This is a great bike, it will be worth the wait.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Sandman29 said:


> FreeZ,
> 
> I would wait for the 18.5". These bikes in my opinion seem to run a little small anyways.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info. It seems that 18.5" has taller standover than 19.5". Will 19.5" be drivable with short stem for my length? However I will ride with approx. 45mm stem.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

FreeZ,

That's strange that the standover is more on the 18.5 than 19.5. Maybe they wanted to keep 2 water bottle cage on the 18.5.

My XL came with a 90mm stem, I haven't tried anything shorter, but I would think it would handle fine.

Hopefully, there is someone on this post that is closer to your height and can give you some better insight. I have a friend that I ride with and he is about 2 inches shorter than me so he is about 6', and I think my XL is too big for him. So, I think he should be an L (19.5). Therefore my guess is that at 5'8" an 18.5 would be a better fit.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

FreeZ,

Hopefully someone else your size can respond. I own an XL Niner ROS 9 Plus in addition to my 21.5" Stache 5. And according to the fitting Specs on the both bikes, my ROS 9 Plus in size XL had a 31.6 inch standover as does the Stache 5 in size 18.5 and my 21.5" Stache 5 has a half inch shorter standover than the 18.5. So, I see your dilemma.


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

I'm 5'7" and looking to build a custom off a similar frame from Workswell (WCB-M-078 27.5+/ 29 /29+-workswellbikes) and am trying to figure out whether to go 17" or 18.5". With the exception of the strange standover on the 18.5" Stache, the Workswell seems to run just a dot bigger on their 18.5. It's difficult to get a test ride on these Stache's as they're so rare so I'm worried about just pulling the trigger on the wrong size. I fit on a 18.5" Marlin quite well which has a slightly smaller TT and reach than the Stache. I might have to just take a 17" Marlin for a ride and see how that works out...please let us know if you figure anything out Freez.Thanks!


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

FreeZ said:


> Thanks for the info. It seems that 18.5" has taller standover than 19.5". Will 19.5" be drivable with short stem for my length? However I will ride with approx. 45mm stem.


Depends on what you want to do with it. I would stay away from a 19.5 though. It has an 80 or 90mm stem, btw.

The shop that I work for has every size but the 18.5. I'm 5'10" and the large (19.5) feels like a traditional XC bike, a little cumbersome when things get sporty. The small (17.5) is an all mountain beast and much easier to move around, although slightly cramped for just riding around. I have an 18.5 Stache 9 on backorder and they're due in at the end of October.

The 17.5 will hold two large bottles, but not the biggest 24oz insulated ones...but you aren't stuck with 16oz bottles either.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

I'm 5'11" and ride a 19.5 and it feels perfect.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

*bike size*



FreeZ said:


> Need some zsizing help. 17.5" will be on stock but 18.5" need to wait for at least three weeks. I´m 175cm or ~5´8". Should I take the smaller one or wait for next size bigger?


I am 5' 9 and the 7 model in the 17.5 fits perfect


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## agu (Jun 22, 2007)

I'm 5'8" and test rode the Stache 9 in 17.5 and the 18.5 sizes earlier this year. I could fit both with a few tweaks, but I found the 17.5 a bit more nimble. Personally I'd go for the 17.5.


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

Awesome, thanks all for the info!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## DrMekon (Jun 13, 2015)

My Stache 09 is currently back in the shop with the Magnum Pro being sent back to the distributor to be assessed for warranty replacement - 4cm vertical scratch appeared on the stanchion on a dry ride. Looks like something has gotten behind the seal.

In the meantime, I've ordered one of the 110x15 29+ rigid carbon forks from ICAN. They are $140 including the through axle. They sent over the CAD drawings and my mechanic agreed they looked worth a punt given it saves getting a different wheel, and we couldn't find anyone else doing a carbon boost110 rigid fork for 29+. Delivery will be a month or so.

It's the fork off this - 2016 carbon 29+ bike - Shenzhen ICAN Sports Equipment Co., Ltd.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Thank you for sizing help. Now it´s between 18.5" and 19.5". Does anybody have real world comparison with the standover? Geo chart says something but in real life what the difference between these two different sizes and front triangles. It´s also nice to know what part of top tube the standover is measured?

Thanks in advance. Tested today 17.5" with stock setup and it felt good but I prefer shorter stem so need to size up one or two sizes. Still struggling but need to choose tomorrow. It´s difficult. I have had lot of bikes and different types of bikes with lot of different top tube, reach, stack etc but it´s always so difficult....


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## montana_ben (Oct 26, 2010)

Doug_ID said:


> Here are a few pics of my 5 in ss mode with 19T rear and oval 30T in front. I have the oval with the longest section in the vertical position for these pics so should be aprox = round 32T ring in that position. The clearance is close but I still have room to wrap the chain stay without rubbing. I think the issue is to maintain a straight chainline the sprocket has to be further out than you might expect. I wish Trek had put a slight arch shape in the chainstay but it works fine with the setup I have.
> 
> Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr
> 
> Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr


Ouch that's really making me sad...I'm jonesing for the 5 pretty hard and one of the reasons is that i'd be able to set it up SS any time I felt like it with any combo I wanted...which in my neck of the woods would include 32:20 or even 32:21. But if 30 oval (effective 32 as you say) and 19 barely clears 32:20 or 21 does not look promising. Aargh... Anyone run it 32:20 or 21 with success?


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## Drumlin roll (Sep 17, 2015)

FreeZ said:


> Now it´s between 18.5" and 19.5". Does anybody have real world comparison with the standover? ... It´s also nice to know what part of top tube the standover is measured?


The standover is measured at the midpoint of the top tube.

The 17.5", 19.5", and 21.5" have the same top tube location. The 2 larger sizes have a brace to the seat tube. Due to the slope, the longer tubes will be a bit higher at the midpoint.

The 18.5" has the seat stays and top tube higher up the seat tube, with no brace. The front end is the same height as the 19.5", as they both use a 100mm head tube. Reach and wheelbase are 15mm different.

The 15.5" has a 60mm stem, the 17.5" has a 70mm, 18.5" and 19.5" have 80mm, and the 21.5" has a 90mm.

I bought an 18.5" last week. I'm 5'10", with a 33" inseam. Long legs, short torso. The standover works for me, but there's not much extra room. I wouldn't recommend it for shorter legs, unless you have unusually thick soled riding shoes. Overall fit is good for me. I also took a short ride on a borrowed 19.5" a month before. I was mostly focused on general ride impressions and didn't pay much attention to actual fit. Nothing caught my attention as being a poor fit. There is only 15mm difference in the reach, same length stem, so the difference probably wouldn't make much impression on a short ride.

I'd been debating and researching which size to get between the 18.5" and 19.5", and I bought the 18.5" because it was available. I also think it looks better without the seat tube brace. Not sure how much different the bottle clearance is, but I can put a regular 24 oz. in the seat tube holder no problem.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

FreeZ said:


> Thank you for sizing help. Now it´s between 18.5" and 19.5". Does anybody have real world comparison with the standover? Geo chart says something but in real life what the difference between these two different sizes and front triangles. It´s also nice to know what part of top tube the standover is measured?
> 
> Thanks in advance. Tested today 17.5" with stock setup and it felt good but I prefer shorter stem so need to size up one or two sizes. Still struggling but need to choose tomorrow. It´s difficult. I have had lot of bikes and different types of bikes with lot of different top tube, reach, stack etc but it´s always so difficult....


If you're planning on using a dropper post, the larger sizes might not have enough exposed post due to the longer seat tubes.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Went wih 18.5" Stache 5. Now waiting for some weeks. Are rims already taped for tubeless? Need to get stuff ready to make it work for me.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I've had the Stache 9 for a while now and need a little advice on service etc.

I have sent the Manitou Magnum forks off to my fork specialist, but would appreciate any information on performing routine oil bath servicing to keep them in top condition.

When removing the forks, the bottom headset bearing is very rough.

The stock headset is FSA IS 2 , E2.

I would like to upgrade to a better quality headset to seal out the debris etc.
Does anyone know if a Chris King IS 2 headset will fit, or suitable alternative?


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

Denis9999 said:


> I've had the Stache 9 for a while now and need a little advice on service etc.
> 
> I have sent the Manitou Magnum forks off to my fork specialist, but would appreciate any information on performing routine oil bath servicing to keep them in top condition.
> 
> ...


Chris King does not make an IS headset... Cane Creek 110 would be your best bet...


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## Vespasianus (Apr 9, 2008)

Denis9999 said:


> I've had the Stache 9 for a while now and need a little advice on service etc.
> 
> I have sent the Manitou Magnum forks off to my fork specialist, but would appreciate any information on performing routine oil bath servicing to keep them in top condition.
> 
> ...


The Magnum most likely will be like the Mattoc and use 7-15 mL of 10-40 synthetic motor oil per side. Manitou is now using an oil seal on their new forks and this will keep the oil in the fork. Thus, you should be able to get away with 3-6 months without worry. you can also put grease between the oil seal and the dust seal, which helps. Just make sure to wipe away any grease that comes up in the beginning.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Thanks for the info ref the forks. Been using the bike for the last 4 months, just getting them serviced prior to the winter in the UK.

The headset info is good, but I will have to talk with my local bike shop, the amount of choice is bewildering


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

FreeZ said:


> Went wih 18.5" Stache 5. Now waiting for some weeks. Are rims already taped for tubeless? Need to get stuff ready to make it work for me.


Rims will be taped by dealer. But I had many problems. It took me 8 tries to get it to work. Hopefully you will have better luck.

My issues are in this thread.http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/29-trek-stache-9-tubeless-problems-979500-2.html If you have problems I will try to help you out.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Anyone weighed stock Stache 5 and also some components? Just thinking what upgrades will give best money / gram ratio. So far ordered Truvativ Noir carbon bar, ESI chunky grips, Syntace P6 Hiflex post. Also going to make tubeless.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

FreeZ,

My XL Stache 5 weighed in at about 1/8th of my body weight.


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Sandman29 said:


> FreeZ,
> 
> My XL Stache 5 weighed in at about 1/8th of my body weight.


Is that before or after you have been to the bathroom?:thumbsup:


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

Rigid Single Guy,

Oh after, when your just under 240lbs you want the best reading on the scale as possible.


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## mrh372 (Aug 9, 2013)

Freez,

My 19.5 Stache weighs in at 26# even. Stock, tubeless, no pedals


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## tubbnation (Jul 6, 2015)

FreeZ said:


> Anyone weighed stock Stache 5 and also some components? Just thinking what upgrades will give best money / gram ratio. So far ordered Truvativ Noir carbon bar, ESI chunky grips, Syntace P6 Hiflex post. Also going to make tubeless.


My 19.5 Stache 5 is tubeless, has Crampon Mag pedals, but otherwise is stock, weighs just over 26lbs.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Does anyone else have severe bottom bracket creaking on their Stache 5? 

Is it something I should go see the dealer about?


.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I have the same issue with my 7 model. My dealer tried to correct the issue, to no avail. He is ordering me a new bottom bracket.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

You sure its the bottom bracket? Did you try lubing the chainring bolts?


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I can check those. I was able to put pressure on the non drive side pedal and get the creak to happen.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

And yes we greased the threads on the pedals. They are egg beater 3 pedals.


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## mhopton (Nov 27, 2005)

If you've been riding it for 3-4 months with any regularity, it's probably due for a new GXP bottom bracket. I ride a 6 month old Superfly SS and just replaced my 2nd BB. The drive-side was creaking and crunchy. 

I would buy the Chris King....next time I will.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

I am pretty sure it is due to the press fit type and not the bb itself. I swapped out to chris king bb and still have creaking from the get go. I just ignore it now.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I replaced the original bottom bracket with a Chris Kung . No problems since fitting the CK.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

More questions about Stache... Anybody measured stock brakehose lengths from Stache 5?


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Size 19.5 Brake hose length 56in rear and 33in front. Thats about 98% accurate.


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

Doug_ID said:


> I am pretty sure it is due to the press fit type and not the bb itself. I swapped out to chris king bb and still have creaking from the get go. I just ignore it now.


No need to ignore it. There is a cure! Wheels MFR and Praxxis Works both now have PF BBs that thread into each other. This is supposed to be the best cure for the dreaded PF creak as it locks the two halves together.

I inserted my last PF30 BB before those were available but had success using a retaining compound which is effectively a threadlock like substance made for press fit bearings. It's supposed to help most when the PF hole is not to spec and the press fit is too loose after several pressings but I did it on a new S-works frame and never got any creaking. Specialized manual called for epoxy but I wanted something that could be removed without damaging the frame.


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## nitrousjunky (May 12, 2006)

RPK3 said:


> Wheels MFR and Praxxis Works both now have PF BBs that thread into each other.


Hope also has one of these.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

RPK3 said:


> No need to ignore it. There is a cure! Wheels MFR and Praxxis Works both now have PF BBs that thread into each other. This is supposed to be the best cure for the dreaded PF creak as it locks the two halves together.
> 
> I inserted my last PF30 BB before those were available but had success using a retaining compound which is effectively a threadlock like substance made for press fit bearings. It's supposed to help most when the PF hole is not to spec and the press fit is too loose after several pressings but I did it on a new S-works frame and never got any creaking. Specialized manual called for epoxy but I wanted something that could be removed without damaging the frame.


Thx, I did use some thread lock on the BB when I pressed it in the frame. It really only creaks when I am standing and pushing hard.


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

Anybody using this as a Single Speed in the midwest? I'm interested in what gearing folks are using. I usually use 32/18 where I live. I'm not sure if I need a slightly easier gearing due to the larger wheels?


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## 1x1clyde (Oct 5, 2005)

32/18 should be fine. I'm about 2.5 years in on the 29 plus platform - krampus SS and now gnarvester SS- and in southern CA I use 32/19 and suffer
I'm from MN originally and loved 32/18 on 29er SS.


Sent from a over priced hand held device


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Is anyone running a belt drive on the Stache?


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

RPK3 said:


> No need to ignore it. There is a cure! Wheels MFR and Praxxis Works both now have PF BBs that thread into each other. This is supposed to be the best cure for the dreaded PF creak as it locks the two halves.


These and Hope still require a press on one side. Also, Praxxis does not make a tHreaded BB92 yet.

Enduro TorqTite is the only one so for a BB92 that doesn't require a press. Been waiting for a Boost Chainring for my XX1 crank before swapping the BB, but the crunchy sound is starting to get to me...


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## Rigid Single guy (Jul 12, 2015)

Thrawn said:


> These and Hope still require a press on one side. Also, Praxxis does not make a tHreaded BB92 yet.
> 
> Enduro TorqTite is the only one so for a BB92 that doesn't require a press. Been waiting for a Boost Chainring for my XX1 crank before swapping the BB, but the crunchy sound is starting to get to me...


Not sure if this will help with a stache bottom bracket, but i had the same noise problem with the Niner EBB and found high temp bearing grease (old school thick grease) fixed the problem.

None of the recommend products to lock the EBB in place stopped the noise for very long. It appears there will always be some minor movement between the BB and the frame and the grease stopped the metal on metal noise.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

I picked up a 7 yesterday. I only had time for a spin around the neighborhood. I noticed when I put pressure on the drive side to perform a wheelie drop the BB would creek. Today I found this forum and it seems this is a chronic issue. From reading the thread it seems the jury is still out on how to best remedy.

If anyone has any definitive tried and tested on the stache solutions please post. I have a 30 day money back guarantee so I'd like a remedy as I'm guessing this noise is going to annoy me after just dropping $2,200 on a new bike.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Rigid single guys post above seems like a good start.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Dropout33 said:


> Rigid single guys post above seems like a good start.


His post seems to make the most sense.

The problem is that the BB tube is flexing, the bearings themselves aren't going to flex or cause any problem on their own, but they will move when the clearances aren't tight enough on the frame and/or if there's too much flex. Anything that's going to try and lock the bearings in the frame just isn't going to work because the BB tube is still going to flex and eventually break whatever is trying to lock the bearings to the frame. I have a PF on my carbon bike and haven't gotten a single creak out of it in 1600+ miles, or on the previous AL bike from the same manufacturer in the 3+ years I rode it.

Sadly, Trek (among others) doesn't seem to make the highest quality of frames, which looks to be pretty crucial when using a PF BB.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

richde said:


> His post seems to make the most sense.
> Sadly, Trek (among others) doesn't seem to make the highest quality of frames, which looks to be pretty crucial when using a PF BB.


My EX 8 creaks like a SOB from the PF BB. Always gets quiet after I repack the BB.

I had my new Stache out on the trail for the first time last night. I did not hear the creak but this may be due to all the other noise you get from riding on trail and being very focused on the differences of the new bike.

I absolutely love the ride of this bike. I have been riding a 26" EX 8 with 142x12 Hope hubs on Arch EX rims. The Stache completely out handles the EX especially in corners and even very tight uphill switchbacks. As long as momentum is kept constant it just keeps moving uphill. If I had to make a slight peddle check to avoid catching the crank arm I found the momentum is lost and then it's very tough to get going again on hills. This is obviously more the fault of the user and i'll learn to adjust.

I was surprised how much it rode like my EX 26". I did not expect it to be that playful and agile, it gave me back what I put into it.

If anyone has any specific questions reply and i'll give you my thoughts. Still a little worried about BB issue but if there is a remedy I'm going to have an absolute blast on this bike.


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

anyone ever try one of these?
http://www.praxiscycles.com/conversion-bb/

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Website says not compatible with BB 93. This would be a potential fix for my EX 8.

Couple more observations.

The brakes at first seemed under powered however after a while I realized I the handling in corners is so good I did not need to slow down as much. I hardly needed to tap the brakes once I became more comfortable carrying more speed into the corners.

I did feel the rear wheel flex 2 or 3 times. I had not felt this type of play in my previous wheel set but I'm guessing this is common with larger rim wheels.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Anyone know of a down tube guard I could fit to the frame.


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## YORK25 (Mar 13, 2013)

So on the BB issue on my Stache 7 I had to have mine replaced, then brought it home rode it 1.5 miles on the trails and blew up the rear hub not real happy.


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## ebgb68 (Aug 29, 2015)

Has anyone switched to the grip shift shifter ? Thought about trying the SRAM GX GripShift just need some feed back Please.


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

SMP1971 said:


> Website says not compatible with BB 93. This would be a potential fix for my EX 8.
> 
> Couple more observations.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the feedback. Would you race xc with it?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Still need to wait few weeks for Stache 5 to arrive. All upgrade parts are almost delivered so it´s quite difficult to wait.. So far swapping stock parts to Truvativ Noir carbon bar, Ritchey Trail Stem, Shimano XT M8000 brakes with Yumeya hoses, Syntace P6 HiFlex seatpost, ESI Chunky grips etc. Also ordered Fox Float 34 fork to use with that. Really hope that the bike is fun to ride because it been taking so much...


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Skywalker29 said:


> Thanks for the feedback. Would you race xc with it?
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I bought this bike because I do not race anymore and I wanted a bike that suited my more placid riding style these days. It's simply not as fast as a Superfly or most race rigs because it will be slower on the uphill sections.

Having said that because of the handling and depending on the course you I would race cx on this bike. I'm considering coming out of retirement and racing this weekend. It is a Cat 2 division 19 miles total and about 1750 ft of total elevation on smooth trail with off camber sections and three short rock gardens. It's not a technical trail so I doubt I will push for a podium but I guarantee i'll have more fun than the 99% of the riders.

If you like to race because of the personal challenge then this rig will do the trick if you want to podium you will probably need a different bike.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

FreeZ said:


> Really hope that the bike is fun to ride because it been taking so much...


Sorry you are still waiting cause you are going to love riding this bike. As adults there are few things in life that can take you back to your childhood, this bike is one of them. 
On your upgrades, the brakes and grips should be a nice addition. I thought I would need a shorter stem but so far I'm really impressed with how the 80mm handles (I think the 5 comes with a 90mm). I really like the seat post on the 7. I'm very interested to hear your thoughts on the Fox shock once you have ridden with it.


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

Smp1971 what are your thoughts on the front shock


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Skywalker29 said:


> Smp1971 what are your thoughts on the front shock
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


So far so good. I've ridden it fully open and half closed and I'm very happy with the ride. I did not get any dive when cornering and never felt over whelmed when in the rough. It still has about 3/4" to an inch of travel when fully locked which with my riding (Midwest) is acceptable.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

SMP1971 said:


> If you like to race because of the personal challenge then this rig will do the trick if you want to podium you will probably need a different bike.


Bah! Riders have won and placed on the podium with fat bikes - Stache should be no problem. It's about the engine.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Gambit21 said:


> Bah! Riders have won and placed on the podium with fat bikes - Stache should be no problem. It's about the engine.


A field of weak riders doesn't hurt either.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

Aye


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

SMP1971 said:


> I bought this bike because I do not race anymore and I wanted a bike that suited my more placid riding style these days. It's simply not as fast as a Superfly or most race rigs because it will be slower on the uphill sections.
> 
> Having said that because of the handling and depending on the course you I would race cx on this bike. I'm considering coming out of retirement and racing this weekend. It is a Cat 2 division 19 miles total and about 1750 ft of total elevation on smooth trail with off camber sections and three short rock gardens. It's not a technical trail so I doubt I will push for a podium but I guarantee i'll have more fun than the 99% of the riders.
> 
> If you like to race because of the personal challenge then this rig will do the trick if you want to podium you will probably need a different bike.


That's why I was asking earlier how some of you guys think it might do with normal 29" wheels


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## 29ger (Jan 1, 2011)

ebgb68 said:


> Has anyone switched to the grip shift shifter ? Thought about trying the SRAM GX GripShift just need some feed back Please.


I wouldn't try any of the SRAM 10 or 11 speed grip shifts anymore. I started out with 9 speed ones, and they worked great. Went to 10 speed (same design as the 11 speed in my understanding), and had to get it warrantied 6 times. Now I'm out of luck. Plus they don't shift as crisp as the 9 speed design, so it's easier to accidentally shift when you are going through the rough stuff. I've never broken any of my 3 9-speed grip shifters in years of riding.


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## ebgb68 (Aug 29, 2015)

29ger said:


> I wouldn't try any of the SRAM 10 or 11 speed grip shifts anymore. I started out with 9 speed ones, and they worked great. Went to 10 speed (same design as the 11 speed in my understanding), and had to get it warrantied 6 times. Now I'm out of luck. Plus they don't shift as crisp as the 9 speed design, so it's easier to accidentally shift when you are going through the rough stuff. I've never broken any of my 3 9-speed grip shifters in years of riding.


Thanks for the reply I'm having troubles with the height of the stock shift lever. The bike I demoed had a grip shifter and it seemed to work well but I didn't have much time to push it.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

I'd be concerned about peddle/crank arm strikes with the lower height when riding in the chunk.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Quote: "Bah! Riders have won and placed on the podium with fat bikes - Stache should be no problem. It's about the engine."

The engine needed a serious upgrade about 3 years ago  I have not got close to a podium for three years and I do not expect to on this rig but I will have a blast riding.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

ebgb68 said:


> Has anyone switched to the grip shift shifter ? Thought about trying the SRAM GX GripShift just need some feed back Please.


I have an XX1 grip shifter on a Mukluk. I haven't had any issues with it. I like the shifting and how much cleaner it looks. It a slight negative that you have to think about not twisting that part of the grip when you are in full descending mode, but I haven't had any unintended shifts. I don't like that I can't swap grips around with my other bikes. I'm getting the same setup on my next bike.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

ebgb68 said:


> Has anyone switched to the grip shift shifter ? Thought about trying the SRAM GX GripShift just need some feed back Please.


Gripshift rulez! You simply cannot dump or grab as many gears in such a short amount of throw with any other system.


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## ebgb68 (Aug 29, 2015)

Welnic said:


> I have an XX1 grip shifter on a Mukluk. I haven't had any issues with it. I like the shifting and how much cleaner it looks. It a slight negative that you have to think about not twisting that part of the grip when you are in full descending mode, but I haven't had any unintended shifts. I don't like that I can't swap grips around with my other bikes. I'm getting the same setup on my next bike.


Thank you for the replies I think I'm going to order one. Shram has three models I can't figure out the main difference?
Thanks Guys

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

SMP1971 said:


> Quote: "Bah! Riders have won and placed on the podium with fat bikes - Stache should be no problem. It's about the engine."
> 
> The engine needed a serious upgrade about 3 years ago  I have not got close to a podium for three years and I do not expect to on this rig but I will have a blast riding.


Yep - fun is all that matters.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

ebgb68 said:


> Thank you for the replies I think I'm going to order one. Shram has three models I can't figure out the main difference?
> Thanks Guys
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


They make three grip shifts that fit a 1x11 drivetrain. They would all work, some cost more and maybe work better. Or longer. Or something. They all weigh the same. GX -> X01 -> XX1, ordered by cost. I've only used the XX1 on my bike extensively, I don't think I've even ridden with a grip shifter other than that. I've demoed a bike or two with SRAM trigger shifters and there was something about those I didn't like, but I don't remember what it was.


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

toddre said:


> That's why I was asking earlier how some of you guys think it might do with normal 29" wheels


How did you do?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

SMP1971 said:


> I bought this bike because I do not race anymore and I wanted a bike that suited my more placid riding style these days. It's simply not as fast as a Superfly or most race rigs because it will be slower on the uphill sections.
> 
> Having said that because of the handling and depending on the course you I would race cx on this bike. I'm considering coming out of retirement and racing this weekend. It is a Cat 2 division 19 miles total and about 1750 ft of total elevation on smooth trail with off camber sections and three short rock gardens. It's not a technical trail so I doubt I will push for a podium but I guarantee i'll have more fun than the 99% of the riders.
> 
> If you like to race because of the personal challenge then this rig will do the trick if you want to podium you will probably need a different bike.


How did you do?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

hey someone in here might know.

the magnum fork that the Stache comes with. Is it travel adjustable(internally)? If so to how much. Manitiou list 100/120/140 on their website but the 140 is no where and I was wondering if the fork can be adjusted with a different air spring or just by removing a spacer or adding a spacer.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I emailed manitou about this and according to the person I talked to the travel is fixed at 110mm.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Skywalker29 said:


> How did you do?
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


When I arrived at the race I found out it was actually a 24 mile three lap race. I did great for the first 20 miles then unfortunately I hit the wall. The bike performed fantastically and I attribute my strong lap times to the machine. Unfortunately the rider bonked on the third lap and it was a rough last 4 miles.

Had a blast although I was cussing myself on the last lap.

The bike draws a lot of attention on the trail and I really have nothing but positives to say about it so far. I've cleaned a couple of sections on my local trail that I have never cleaned. These are steep uphill loose rocky sections one of them with a very tight switchback. The bike has released a new boost of enthusiasm. Love this bike.


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

SMP1971 said:


> When I arrived at the race I found out it was actually a 24 mile three lap race. I did great for the first 20 miles then unfortunately I hit the wall. The bike performed fantastically and I attribute my strong lap times to the machine. Unfortunately the rider bonked on the third lap and it was a rough last 4 miles.
> 
> Had a blast although I was cussing myself on the last lap.
> 
> The bike draws a lot of attention on the trail and I really have nothing but positives to say about it so far. I've cleaned a couple of sections on my local trail that I have never cleaned. These are steep uphill loose rocky sections one of them with a very tight switchback. *The bike has released a new **boost **of enthusiasm*. Love this bike.


I found this very appropriate considering the rear hub of this bike. :thumbsup:

Seriously though, it is an incredibly fun bike to ride; I'm really loving mine!


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## Dan GSR (Apr 29, 2010)

18.5" frame too big for 5'7" ?


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## sandyeggo (Mar 6, 2011)

Dan GSR said:


> 18.5" frame too big for 5'7" ?


I'm 5"6 and a 1/2 (on a good day) and I'm on a 15.5. I also favor smaller bikes. My gut says it is a bit too big, but you may like a bigger bike and have different measurements than me. Best way is to throw a leg over it and test ride it if you can.


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## BushwackerinPA (Aug 10, 2006)

Dan GSR said:


> 18.5" frame too big for 5'7" ?


with the right size stem no. I am 5'9 and going to ride a 19.5. If the seat tube on 21.5 was short enough to run a 150 dropper I would go with that.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I am 5' 8" and ride a 17.5. (Stache 7). I agree with sandyeggo, try it out first.


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## JustRon (Nov 20, 2009)

Dan GSR said:


> 18.5" frame too big for 5'7" ?


I'm 5'7" and have a 17.5 Stache 5... the size fits me, but I couldn't go any bigger. A 15.5 would have been too small (I checked one out). The standover is pretty high, though.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

Today was the first time that I questioned staying with the rigid fork on the Stache 5. I went to a new trail system and feel a little beat up afterwards. I love the handling of the 5 with the rigid fork but am I missing out?

My question is has anyone rode a 5 back to back with a 7 or 9 on the same trail? Will the benefits of the suspension fork equal out or surpass the handling of the rigid fork? 
Besides the Manitou fork, is there any other 29+ suspension forks worth looking at?

I just don't want to spend the money on a suspension fork and it not agree with me.


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## BATRG3 (Dec 11, 2012)

I don't have a Stache, but I was wondering myself if it would really be sufficient to have a rigid fork on one. I occurred to me that with the huge price jump for the model with suspension fork, when other forks come out they stand a good chance of being less expensive than the difference. At which point you would then have two forks to choose from.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

BATRG3 said:


> I don't have a Stache, but I was wondering myself if it would really be sufficient to have a rigid fork on one. I occurred to me that with the huge price jump for the model with suspension fork, when other forks come out they stand a good chance of being less expensive than the difference. At which point you would then have two forks to choose from.


I have not rode the 5 but have rode the 9 and I own the 7. You make some valid observations about up grading and the cost savings. I have ridden with my fork fully locked, half locked and fully open. I prefer ridding it half locked as the combination of handling and forgiveness is right for me. I'm heavy 215 pounds. If I were a lighter rider (200 or below) I believe I could get away with the rigid fork and like you mention I would have two options.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

If I didn't own a Stooge already, I would be all over a 5 (with rigid fork)

Rigid FTW!


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes I got a deal on a Stache 5 so went with that having demoed the 9 on my trails.

Will give the rigid a try but can easily upgrade to a Magnum pro or fox/pike if there coming.
The 7 has the Magnum comp not pro, plus I like the colour of the 5 better than the 7's purple. 
But the seven has 11 spd hub and boost front hub, so good deal if you like purple.

The 9 felt perfect for me so will give comparison to the 5 in a few weeks when mine gets here.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I just put some bontrager 2.0-2.5 tubes in my Stache 9 XL and dropped the weight from 30lbs 2oz to 29lbs 1oz. Descent weight savings for 10$ and no problems so far with the slightly smaller tubes. I think I could have even put in a 1.75-2.125 tube but I didn't want to stretch them too thin.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

It's called tubeless


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

obs08 said:


> It's called tubeless


The standard tubes provide nearly the same weight savings. I tried tubeless on the mule fut rims and it was not worth the headache to me. The tape that came on the rims was not applied correctly and leaked profusely. Re-taping the rims was a pain in the ass due to the numerous breather holes around the bead area of the rim. Additionally, if sealant gets in those holes it is never coming out. I don't want to risk weighting down my rims with dried sealant. If the breather holes were not there I would go tubeless in a heartbeat.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

I agree with briantortilla, tubeless was such a pia on these wheels. I got the back wheel after 8 attempts and won't even bother with the front.


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Build my Stache 5 last night. Swap some parts and made tubeless.

Total weight with pedals is below 25lbs. Still little tweeks to be done.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

My Stache 5 weighed in at 23.75 lbs after swapping everything but the crank... Waiting on SRAM to release Boost chainring to mate with a XX1 crank...


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

Thrawn said:


> My Stache 5 weighed in at 23.75 lbs after swapping everything but the crank... Waiting on SRAM to release Boost chainring to mate with a XX1 crank...


What did you swap?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

Thrawn said:


> My Stache 5 weighed in at 23.75 lbs after swapping everything but the crank... Waiting on SRAM to release Boost chainring to mate with a XX1 crank...


1x10/11 works fine with boost. Pretty sure the issue is the crank and frame clearance also, not the chain rings per say. They make a fat bike xx1 crank that offers more clearance (and then maybe you can run 2 or 3 rings up front). I believe it just has a longer spindle to spread the crank legs out further away from the frame, but maybe someone can chime in who has experience.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## mrh372 (Aug 9, 2013)

Dropout33 said:


> I agree with briantortilla, tubeless was such a pia on these wheels. I got the back wheel after 8 attempts and won't even bother with the front.


I had issues at first as well but just ran one layer of std gorilla tape around and it works like a charm tubeless.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Boost cranks are the same width (q factor). The only difference is the chain ring is a few millimetres further out.
Not like the true fat bikes that have the wider cranks.

Lets see these light weight Stache 5's. post some pictures please "Thrawn" "Freez".

If the smaller tubes work then thats good news. Even if running tubeless, means I can carry a lighter back up tube in my pack


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

yamaha46 said:


> Boost cranks are the same width (q factor). The only difference is the chain ring is a few millimetres further out.
> Not like the true fat bikes that have the wider cranks.
> 
> Lets see these light weight Stache 5's. post some pictures please "Thrawn" "Freez".
> ...


Wow, i wonder I'm going to have a problem then, or is this a factor for only 2 and 3 rings up front? The 9, 7 and 5 Stache's run an X1, GX, and Race Face Aeffect cranks (with 30t, 30t, and 32t single rings), and I've never seen any mention of special cranks being used in all the Stache reviews I read and watched. I don't think this is usually an for single chain ring setups. In fact, if I remember correctly, the use of a 1 by setup (as opppsed to a 2 or 3 by) was specifically mentioned in many reviews as being used because of the clearance issue, and that the frame was designed around that setup, and ultimately it's a preferred setup for most people anyway nowadays.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

The 1x gives more Clarence due to no iner ring and front mech. That's how they got the wheel in so close for the short chain stay. The crank arms are the same.
Boost is hubs/fork/drop out spacing & the chainring a few Mil further out. Putting a single ring on the outer of a double chainset is pretty similar, or on the outside of a triple chainset.


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

yamaha46 said:


> The 1x gives more Clarence due to no iner ring and front mech. That's how they got the wheel in so close for the short chain stay. The crank arms are the same.
> Boost is hubs/fork/drop out spacing & the chainring a few Mil further out. Putting a single ring on the outer of a double chainset is pretty similar, or on the outside of a triple chainset.


Cool, thanks. Got a Stache "carbon copy" waiting to build up here soon, just need a few final parts. 1x ftw!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Carbon copy, interesting, post some pics up when your done.


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

yamaha46 said:


> Carbon copy, interesting, post some pics up when your done.


Will do! Follow here:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=985951

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Thrawn said:


> My Stache 5 weighed in at 23.75 lbs after swapping everything but the crank... Waiting on SRAM to release Boost chainring to mate with a XX1 crank...


I switched to a non boost chainring and the chainline seems better imo. It has not caused any issues.

The boost chainring is a 3mm offset. That's the only difference for a boost compatible crankset set up. Only 0 and 6 are available right now from SRAM. At least, thats what SRAM told my shop.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

On the tubeless thing, I wonder if there was a bad batch or something. I have never had a tube in mine. The rear wheel was warranty replaced because of the hub so I've done tubeless 3x on the mulefuts. The original tape was never quite straight, but it was never an issue to fix and run tubeless. No issues with that since June. I'm not doubting anyone's proficiency with set up, i'm wondering if there was a set of bad welds or incorrectly cut strips- something like that.

The issues I've had:

The rear wheel wasn't set up straight in the dropouts. It was close enough that you wouldn't notice. But my hub broke, and when my hub broke I noticed an uneven wear pattern on my cassette. 

And the rear hub- the store replaced my whole rear wheel from another bike on the floor. Long story there, but great shop to work with except they need some more experienced mechanics. The slightly crooked wheel may have contributed to the issue.

Otherwise, it's been great. Got those resolved pretty quickly and no problems since.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

What hubs are on the 5 & 7?
Are they the sun ringle SRC?
Looking at the xd drivers (freehubs) for the 5.
Has alloy & cromo versions.
Does the alloy get marked up with the SRAM cassettes? I notice it's only splined at the big cog end so may not be an issue.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

has anyone put a set of 27.5+ on the stache yet?


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## montana_ben (Oct 26, 2010)

yamaha46 said:


> What hubs are on the 5 & 7?
> Are they the sun ringle SRC?
> Looking at the xd drivers (freehubs) for the 5.
> Has alloy & cromo versions.
> Does the alloy get marked up with the SRAM cassettes? I notice it's only splined at the big cog end so may not be an issue.


I'd also like to know this--have a 5 on order and some xx1 stuff that needs a bike to go on, so was hoping an xd driver would be available for the usual descent into upgrade lunacy to begin.


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## shaneroy (Mar 8, 2007)

not sure why you would, everything I've read and heard is that trek is all in with 29+, stache specifically designed with that in mind (chain stays etc)


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

the stache is actually designed to run 29, 29+ or 27.5+. i would becuase 27.5+ with a 120mm fox 34 would be an absolute ripper. im ordering 27.5+ rims today to start my winter project on my stache 5. just havent seen any pics yet


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Heres a 27.5 build:
City Cycle cycling and fitness

Not ridden 27+, but they look like there higher profile from the side. (higher side walls).
More towards a fat tyre. I have ridden a fat bike.
Think they have found the sweetspot with the 29+, but when the chupacapras come out in 27.5 it would be an interesting comparison.

Don't know about the USA but here in the UK everyone is into the 27.5 sizing and not much interest in 29ers, Not many have tried them. And the 27.5 marketing has been much grater. so will be same with the plus here. But the 29+ felt so right to me I can't see the advantage in down sizeing.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I expect Trek will spec the Stache with 27.5+ here in the UK next year.
Hopeing the 29er market is better in the US. They didn't even sell the Remedy 29 in the UK this year.

"obs08" update us on the difference when you try it.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Will try standard 29 tyres sometime, to see how it compares to a standard bike.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

nice find yamaha46, those are some big ass 27.5 tires lol. i will keep updates, this is a long winter project though. i considered standard 29 tires but i think for me that it would defeat the purpose of the stache. how did valentino do this year? i havent watched moto gp in some time now


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Vale's doing great. Looks like his on for his 10th title. 18 points ahead with a few races remaining. Don't know whats happened to Marquez this year? his not been on the pace.

Funny because I guess i've always wanted my bike to handle like a Motorbike. And the Stache gives me that feeling, the way you can lean it in to the corners with so much grip


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

How can I slow down some twitchy steering on my Stache5?


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## euro-trash (Feb 9, 2008)

Dropout33 said:


> How can I slow down some twitchy steering on my Stache5?


Wider bars


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## FreeZ (Mar 24, 2010)

Mine was exactly 11,20kg with pedals.

But it will be +12kg when swap fork to Fox 34. Need to lowering it first.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Do you know the weight of the carbon fork?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Was in the shop yesterday. Comparing the 5 to the 9.
The 5 ships with race face aeffect cinch cranks (UK). They do not have boost spacing as far as I can see. The chainring on the 9 was definitely 3mm or so further outboard (boost).

As I see it non boost chainline is preferable. The boost would be aimed at the centre of the cassette. But having it slightly inboard towards the big cog makes more sense to me. Less angle to the 36+ big cog is better, the angle to the small 10/11 cog is less of a problem. What do you think?

Also the magnum pro fork was around 542mm a2c from my Tape measure, so little more than the 531mm stated.

The colour of the 5 is nice. I think it's more green in the low light, but nice and light outdoors in the sun.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> Do you know the weight of the carbon fork?


In August I bought and built a stache 9 frame and bontrager Bowie pro fork to throw some older parts on. I was very impressed to see the fork weigh in at under 600g!!


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

i have a 5 which came with sram boost cranks. i think it just depends on what it ships with.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes all the forum pictures seam to have sram cranks.
On the Trek site it is Raceface. Think the UK are getting raceface.
I like the look of the cinch cranks anyway.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

i actually saw someone out on the trail in the US that had raceface cranks on his, totally stock bike. i guess it just must have been what trek had access to at that point. id like to switch to 170mm eventually as the BB is low on this bike and will get lower when i go 27.5+


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Have you had any pedal strikes though?
On my demo ride on trails where I've had pedal strikes before, it was fine. That was on the stache 9 though.
No rear suspension to lower the height, plus the short chainsets keep it tucked in to the rear tyre, wouldn't think it would be a problem. Though yet to ride the 5.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> Have you had any pedal strikes though?
> On my demo ride on trails where I've had pedal strikes before, it was fine. That was on the stache 9 though.
> No rear suspension to lower the height, plus the short chainsets keep it tucked in to the rear tyre, wouldn't think it would be a problem. Though yet to ride the 5.


I built up a stache 9 frame with bontrager bowie fork, and the BB is quite low. It is manageable for my midwest trails, but low enough that i notice it and have to be careful over some roots etc.

Due note, the geo and feel of the front suspended stache completes vs the full rigid stache 5 is pretty different. the 540mm axle to crown of the Manitou magnum is much longer than the 495mm a-c of the bontrager bowie rigid fork.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Have you had any pedal strikes though?
> On my demo ride on trails where I've had pedal strikes before, it was fine. That was on the stache 9 though.
> No rear suspension to lower the height, plus the short chainsets keep it tucked in to the rear tyre, wouldn't think it would be a problem. Though yet to ride the 5.


i have had quite a few, mainly when im leaned over in a corner yet still pedaling. the pedal will hit the dirt. i get a normal amount of strike while just negotiating the gnar


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

OK, sounds like it's just with the rigid fork then.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

most like because the axle to crown is so low, i think its like 495. i plan on going to a 120 fork for 27.5+ wheels and tires, the a2c on the new fork will be about 30mm higher. im hoping to retain same BB height and not go lower


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Is it not better to get a 29+ fork (Manitou magnum) than the 27.5+ version?
Then you could run either 27.5+ or 29+.
With the 27+ version you limit yourself to that size.

Only advantage I can see, is you can get more travel with the 27+ version.
Personaly i'd get the 29+ 120mm.

Have you seen this chart?
The 29+ 110mm fork is actually more like 542 a2c though.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

The 29+ 120mm is around 550/555 a2c so would have the same angles as the 27+ in that chart.
With 29+ wheels the BB would be higher.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Think my bike may end up looking like this :thumbsup:


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

If he gets the Fox 34 27.5+ fork he can use both 27.5+ and 29+.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

TuTone T said:


> If he gets the Fox 34 27.5+ fork he can use both 27.5+ and 29+.


I really wish Fox would formally endorse this fork for 29x3.0 tires. I'm tempted but I ride hard and don't want to buy a fork only to experience rubbing (or worse)


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

TuTone T said:


> If he gets the Fox 34 27.5+ fork he can use both 27.5+ and 29+.


Any chance you have axle to crown measurements for this 120mm or140mm fork? Fox website is no help.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

There's a thread on here with info on the fox, titled "2016 Fox 29+ Fork" has a2c.
It looks like tighter clearance than the magnum in the pictures. The magnum is fair bit cheaper also, and worked really well.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Magnum is also like 300g heavier than the fox which is s big turn off for me


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## Trailice (Oct 30, 2009)

rfxc said:


> I really wish Fox would formally endorse this fork for 29x3.0 tires. I'm tempted but I ride hard and don't want to buy a fork only to experience rubbing (or worse)


I Have had ZERO problems with anything even close to rubbing, And the fork crown WILL NOT hit a Dirt Wizard on a 50mm rim. I have bottomed out the fork more than a few times.







I can spin the wheel with the fork full compressed.







Sorry bad pix, but you get the drift.
Also I got mine from Universal for $743.75.
Magnum is $688.50


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## richulr (Jan 27, 2010)

I thought buying the Stache 5 and then swapping the rigid fork for the suspension was a great idea, until I read the head angle was much steeper on the 5. Why would they do this? I'd really rather have the five's color than a purple bike.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

I have 2 question,
is Stache5 genuine fork with 100x15mm, not Boost 110mm?
is its headset IS42(41)/52 or ZS44/56?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Don't know about the head set.
Rigid fork is not boost. Would have to change hub to put on a boost fork.

The stache 5 frame is exactly the same as the 7 & 9. Same head angle.
The head angle is steeper when running a shorter fork (rigid).


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

so if put Fox27.5+ or Magnum, need to build new front wheel!
I thought that it's easy to mix 29+,27.5+,rigid,suspension,SS,geared but it's almost unable...


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

richulr said:


> I thought buying the Stache 5 and then swapping the rigid fork for the suspension was a great idea, until I read the head angle was much steeper on the 5. Why would they do this? I'd really rather have the five's color than a purple bike.


head angle is steeper because it has a shorter fork on it. if you change the fork to a longer one it will change the head angle to be slacker


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## richulr (Jan 27, 2010)

that makes sense then, thanks


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

For tubeless I highly recommend the use of gorilla tape. The tape that is included does not tend to hold.

I've ridden with gorilla tape on numerous rides and it has held perfectly. I'm glad to know I can use a regular tube for a spare. This will save carrying the very heavy tube in my water pack.

Trailice what tire ar you running in your picture and do you like it?


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Dropout33 said:


> How can I slow down some twitchy steering on my Stache5?





euro-trash said:


> Wider bars


Have you seen how wide the Stache5 bars already are?


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Took delivery of mine today. Stache 5. 

Plan to do tubeless when I get a little time. Put my Gravity dropper on and have carbon bars and a 60mm stem on order. 

Just riding around my driveway and yard was a blast. I was bombing wheelies through a leaf pile making my son crack up. 

Can't wait to hit some trails.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

Trailice said:


> I Have had ZERO problems with anything even close to rubbing, And the fork crown WILL NOT hit a Dirt Wizard on a 50mm rim. I have bottomed out the fork more than a few times.
> View attachment 1023245
> 
> I can spin the wheel with the fork full compressed.
> ...


Cool, thank you! I'd be running chupas (which are slightly bigger?) But looks like plenty of clearance regardless. Thank you!!


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Obs08 where have you seen the weight of the magnum fork?
Would like to confirm the weight of the pro 29+ 120 version.
Here the trek 110 pro with axle is 2050g:Manitou Magnum 34 Pro 110 mm - Amortyzatory przednie - Rowerowa waga


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Obs08 where have you seen the weight of the magnum fork?
> Would like to confirm the weight of the pro 29+ 120 version.
> Here the trek 110 pro with axle is 2050g:Manitou Magnum 34 Pro 110 mm - Amortyzatory przednie - Rowerowa waga


A friend of mine who works at a trek store gave it to me. New fox is right around 1800g. Based of your 2050 figure you can see how it is close to 300g. 3/4 of a pound is a lot of weight when building up a bike that is already going to have heavier wheels and tires on it. Plus, I prefer fox. I had a mattoc that was a nice fork but I like my fox stuff


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

The difference appears to be 226.55g/8 ounces - a half pound. 27.5+ Fox is 1823.441g.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

As anyone had luck sticking with the tubeless tape the factory did?

I'm debating on giving that shot or buying more gorilla tape to re-tape them before I set them up tubeless.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

I've been using the factory tape for a few months and about 100 miles with zero issues. Barely loses air and this is my #2 bike so it does get used all that often


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

sternomac said:


> As anyone had luck sticking with the tubeless tape the factory did?
> 
> I'm debating on giving that shot or buying more gorilla tape to re-tape them before I set them up tubeless.


I had to redo mine. Rim was to "slick" on the inside and factory tape wouldn't stick. After stripping the tape and rim strip I scuffed it up with 220 grit sand paper, cleaned with Acetone & then 409 and then some new tape held fine. Now the bike hangs in the garage as I am to effed up to ride it anyway, so in the end it was a small waste but I got a night's worth of entertainment out of it, so I got that.

Edit-I also trimmed the rim strip about 1/8th of an inch on each side to give the new tape more metal to grab onto. Those factory rim strips are just a tad wide IMO.


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

sternomac said:


> As anyone had luck sticking with the tubeless tape the factory did?
> 
> I'm debating on giving that shot or buying more gorilla tape to re-tape them before I set them up tubeless.


No issues with factory tape on mine.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I have only had to add air once since June to mine.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

sternomac said:


> As anyone had luck sticking with the tubeless tape the factory did?
> 
> I'm debating on giving that shot or buying more gorilla tape to re-tape them before I set them up tubeless.


My rear is still factory tape but on my front I removed the tape and rim strip and used gorilla tape right on the rim. They are both holding fine after100+ miles.


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## Supernormal (Dec 19, 2005)

Does anyone know if there is already a rigid carbon fork available with the boost 110 standard? I own a Stache 7 and would like to try it rigid...


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Supernormal said:


> Does anyone know if there is already a rigid carbon fork available with the boost 110 standard? I own a Stache 7 and would like to try it rigid...


Would a fat fork work with spacers?


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## DrMekon (Jun 13, 2015)

Supernormal said:


> Does anyone know if there is already a rigid carbon fork available with the boost 110 standard? I own a Stache 7 and would like to try it rigid...


I am using a ICAN boost 110 fork, but there's a Workswell one too.

My ICAN fork arrived with a poorly machined dropout, and a thru axle that required further machining. Melody at ICAN was very quick to respond when I was buying. Now, not so much.

Notwithstanding the poor Q&A, the ICAN fork is pretty nice - the bike feels great with it. I'm in no rush to go back to suspension over winter.


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## YORK25 (Mar 13, 2013)

Have been tubeless for 2 months on factory tape and no problems.


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

Still trying to find some one who might have tried a Stache with regular 29er wheels/tires for a weekend racer set up..... anyone hear anything?


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

Just ordered one of these Topeak fat pumps, anybody have any experience with it? It looks great for dialing in under 15psi without needing an extra pressure gauge. There is even a purge button and I've read elsewhere it can handle tubeless setup.

Amazon.com : Topeak Joe Blow Fat Floor Pump : Sports & Outdoors


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I was on a ride where I rode 15 miles on the beach and then rode back on pavement. I was in a campground when I pulled off the beach and started blowing my tires up with my hand pump. A guy in a nearby RV loaned me his Joe Blow pump. It seemed pretty perfect for fat tire use. I didn't pay much attention to the gauge since I was inflating my tires for pavement, but it seemed to work fine.


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## McGoon (Feb 17, 2013)

toddre said:


> Still trying to find some one who might have tried a Stache with regular 29er wheels/tires for a weekend racer set up..... anyone hear anything?


My guess is most anyone who has ridden a Stache5,7, or 9 has no intention of ever going back to 29-.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

For regular 29 wheels on a stache for a race day set up, you'd probably have to change the forks as well to keep the bottom bracket from getting too low-so you'd have a pretty high front end. I know you CAN do a regular 29er set up with the Stache, but with a fork and 2 wheels, you'd just be better off buying an x-caliber or a carve or something if you want a racer 29.

If you wanted to do something like a Trek version of a Honzo/ROS then it might make more sense because the jacked front end would play to that style.

If I wanted to race my Stache, I'd just get some lighter 35mm rims and just go for it with the + set up.


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## euro-trash (Feb 9, 2008)

Dropout33 said:


> Have you seen how wide the Stache5 bars already are?


The ones I've seen have 720s and 750s. Crazy to say, but those don't count as wide bars anymore. 780s on a + bike make a lot of sense. Other options would be to run a longer stem or drop the bars slightly. I'm not a fan of the latter 2 options unless there is a bike fit reason to do so.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Obs08 where have you seen the weight of the magnum fork?
> Would like to confirm the weight of the pro 29+ 120 version.
> Here the trek 110 pro with axle is 2050g:Manitou Magnum 34 Pro 110 mm - Amortyzatory przednie - Rowerowa waga


Sorry for late reply. If you go to bti-usa.com and look up the magnum there it's actually 2130g. The oem trek fork lacks all the adjustment of the aftermarket model and is only available on the bike and not for purchase. I think the expert is the one that's available aftermarket


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Thanks. That sounds about right.
I think the aftermarket pro version is same as the stache 9 but in 120mm.
The stache 7 has the comp version (heavier, less adjustment).


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

I'd go 100mm if staying with 29 wheels. The a2c is really high on them


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Was thinking that. But checked the a2c on the stache 9 in store and it was around 542mm. So the 120 at 555 a2c would only slacken it out by 0.5degree I'd think.

The 27.5+ with 140mm in the chart I put up earlier has a degree slacker angle, so the bike can take it.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Was thinking that. But checked the a2c on the stache 9 in store and it was around 542mm. So the 120 at 555 a2c would only slacken it out by 0.5degree I'd think.
> 
> The 27.5+ with 140mm in the chart I put up earlier has a degree slacker angle, so the bike can take it.


You have the 5 right?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes I have the 5. So will be allot slacker than the rigid fork. But I demoed the 9 with the 110mm fork and liked it allot.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

i have the 5 as well and i really enjoy the geo of it. a 120 magnum with a 550 a2c would be quite a difference from the 495 on the rigid fork. the fox at 120mm would be 525 if i remember right. i do want a fork but i rode mine the other day, set 6 prs and grabbed a 15 of 987 on a fairly long segment. the rigid is just fast, direct, precise and light. i may just end up going carbon 29+ wheelset and leaving it rigid. id hate to add 3lb to the front end by going from the rigid to the magnum. with a carbon wheelset i bet i can get it down to about 22lb as a rigid


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

MrIcky said:


> If I wanted to race my Stache, I'd just get some lighter 35mm rims and just go for it with the + set up.


Great solution.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

has anyone weighed the front and rear wheels off the stache w/o tires or rotors?


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Has anyone tried to stuff a RS Bluto 120 on the front of their Stache? Would like to move mine over, but concerned if the top of the fork will clear the down-tube or not. Just love the stiffness gained by the 150mm thru axle and plan to re-build it better for the spring, hopefully on a new Stache frame! Oh and to be able to keep my carbon B+ wheels would be great too!


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

obs08 said:


> i have the 5 as well and i really enjoy the geo of it. a 120 magnum with a 550 a2c would be quite a difference from the 495 on the rigid fork. the fox at 120mm would be 525 if i remember right. i do want a fork but i rode mine the other day, set 6 prs and grabbed a 15 of 987 on a fairly long segment. the rigid is just fast, direct, precise and light. i may just end up going carbon 29+ wheelset and leaving it rigid. id hate to add 3lb to the front end by going from the rigid to the magnum. with a carbon wheelset i bet i can get it down to about 22lb as a rigid


Yes it sure is light considering it's a 29+.
Bit of a weight weenie myself, so it does appeal, just not sure it will be enough on the terrain I ride. 
Where do you ride obs08? What's it like there?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Yes it sure is light considering it's a 29+.
> Bit of a weight weenie myself, so it does appeal, just not sure it will be enough on the terrain I ride.
> Where do you ride obs08? What's it like there?


im in north east usa. a couple flow trails but mainly we get rocky rooty terrain, fair amount of climbing. ive taken it through a decent amount of gnar. just have to pick your line right and stay loose on the bike. its also not my only bike, i generally use this bike for the fun flow type stuff and my trance for the more tech type stuff


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

ok, sounds similar to here. Interesting you find it ok on the rocky, rooty stuff so I will see what it's like. This will be my only bike though.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> ok, sounds similar to here. Interesting you find it ok on the rocky, rooty stuff so I will see what it's like. This will be my only bike though.


i can turn almost the same segment times on the stache i can on my trance, its just a difference riding style. on the stache im more focused on my line, keep momentum up as much as possible, use the wheel size and low weight of the bike to my advantage. on the trance i ride it to pop off rocks and roots and clear the next obstacle, used ledges and drops to my advantage. both bikes teach me skills to use on the other bike. basically two different kinds of fun!


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

i think as an only bike this thing would be an absolute blast with 27.5x3.0 and a 120 fork on the front


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## toddre (Mar 1, 2004)

MrIcky said:


> For regular 29 wheels on a stache for a race day set up, you'd probably have to change the forks as well to keep the bottom bracket from getting too low-so you'd have a pretty high front end. I know you CAN do a regular 29er set up with the Stache, but with a fork and 2 wheels, you'd just be better off buying an x-caliber or a carve or something if you want a racer 29.
> 
> If you wanted to do something like a Trek version of a Honzo/ROS then it might make more sense because the jacked front end would play to that style.
> 
> If I wanted to race my Stache, I'd just get some lighter 35mm rims and just go for it with the + set up.


Good point about the BB. Thanks!


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## Ranger Pride (Jan 21, 2005)

Has anyone tried the Stache with 29er wheels yet? I have a 2016 Trek Top Fuel and am thinking about dumping my current hardtail and grabbing a Stache 5 for fun. When I want a pure hardtail in 29er format I could swap the rear wheel from the Top fuel over and use one of my current from 15mm thru axle 29er wheels for the front. Supposedly this is not an issue with this frame but I wonder how it would ride.


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## twa (Dec 6, 2006)

I just came back to say that I love my stache so much. Best hardtail evah. #207


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Another happy Stache 7 owner.*

I have had my Stache 7 almost 3 months and like it better every time I ride it. I have made the following mods: tubeless, eggbeaters, Ergon grips, Bontrager computer, Garmin sensor on the rear hub and cut the bars down to 26.5". I weigh 210 and run the fork pressure at 70 and the tires at 11 F and 12 R. These pressures give the best feeling in the rooty trails I ride in SW Michigan. As described above the bike weighs 29 lb.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> Yes it sure is light considering it's a 29+.
> Bit of a weight weenie myself, so it does appeal, just not sure it will be enough on the terrain I ride.
> Where do you ride obs08? What's it like there?


I finally got my 9 after riding shop 7's once every week or two in addition to my Pivot Mach 6 (6" AM/enduro 27.5 bike)....

A Stache has a wide range of things it's good at, and it falls between something like a pure race XC 29'er and an enduro 27.5.

Is it as ultimately fast as either of those bikes at what those bikes excel at? No, but it's pretty good, and does do the job better than using one of those two extremes for a job at the other extreme.

It's as close to a quiver killer as I can think of, and seems like an excellent addition to a long travel 27.5 because it doesn't require you to drastically change your riding style, you just use it where the long travel bike is overkill.

(I live in Las Vegas with the typical SW conditions of loose over hard with sharp edged rocks step ups/downs, gravel and some sand)


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)




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## zeb (May 21, 2006)




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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Question for all Stache (and 29+) riders

How much do you agree/disagree with Alex Cogger's remark (he's the director of product for Rocky Mountain):

_"There is no getting around the fact that 29+ is a lot of rubber far from the hub. Sure, it's squishy and grippy and fun. But man is it slow, and heavy and cumbersome."_


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Question for all Stache (and 29+) riders
> 
> How much do you agree/disagree with Alex Cogger's remark (he's the director of product for Rocky Mountain):
> 
> _"There is no getting around the fact that 29+ is a lot of rubber far from the hub. Sure, it's squishy and grippy and fun. But man is it slow, and heavy and cumbersome."_


Translation..."We haven't made one yet, so we'd appreciate it if everyone could hold off buying one until we do".


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I take it from that his not ridden a Stache.

Non of that really applies in reality.

This is a try it and see bike.
I tried fat bikes before and thought this would be similar.
It is not. It is so agile, light and playfull.

Get a demo.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

litespeedaddict said:


> Translation..."We haven't made one yet, so we'd appreciate it if everyone could hold off buying one until we do".


Yes like all the manufacturers were saying 27.5 was a no go, even a month or so before every single one of them changed there whole range to 27.5!!!


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Question for all Stache (and 29+) riders
> 
> How much do you agree/disagree with Alex Cogger's remark (he's the director of product for Rocky Mountain):
> 
> _"There is no getting around the fact that 29+ is a lot of rubber far from the hub. Sure, it's squishy and grippy and fun. But man is it slow, and heavy and cumbersome."_


Coming straight off my Superlight 29 one day then right onto my new Stache 9 the next, I'll somewhat agree.
But that's just physics isn't it?
Can't expect it to be as light handling and obviously it's relative to what we are accustomed to riding.

In the short 3 days I've owned it I find my average speed on timed 6-7 mile loops to be down 3-4 tenths avg mph but I find I'm climbing and clearing more than I was on narrower tires.
Simply, the 29+ is making me a better (albeit a bit slower) rider.
I did find out today that the stock Bontrager Chupacabra's aren't the best on wet obstacles. That's for a different thread though.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Ride 1 report and breakdown.

Intro:

The trails I tested on are work in progress trails near my house. Windy. Not much straight away. Only 1 or 2 climbs that require a lot of effort. It's pretty bumpy because it's all fresh cut in the last few months. Nothing really technical either. There are two loops and if you just stack them onto each other it's about 2.5 miles. I did both loops twice and then the inner loop once giving me 7.5 miles total.

Overall ride impressions: I'm on the stache 5 and it's a ton of fun. I demo'd the 9. I knew I wanted the 5 all along though because I wanted the rigid fork.

The 5 is that fun too and it will be even more fun once I have the fit dialed. I have the bike down to about 25 pounds.

Cockpit:

I swapped the bars to the Bontrager Race Lite XL bars of the same spec as the stock bar. I also swapped the stem out for a 60mm from the stock 80mm. The carbon bars are my first and it is nice and light and definitely felt comfortable on my hands soaking up some of the small bumpy stuff. It'll get better once I figure my tire pressure.

Wheels:

Took the tubes out and added Stans. Did not re-tape from factory and they mounted up quick. I don't have an electric tire pressure gauge so I'm using the one on my Bontrager floor pump. Started the day at about 15 and it was way too much. Stopped two different times to air them down a little but just went by the squeeze test. More experimenting is needed with pressure. The tires gripped better on the off-cam stuff once I lowered down and the small bump compliance was also better of course. Never slid out unless I wanted to roost around a turn or something.

Contact Points:

I swapped out my seat post for my Gravity dropper that I brought over from a different bike. Saddle is stock. I had the saddle too far back for the entire ride and felt very hunched over. Didn't think to check the saddle position until the ride was over but I have since pushed it forward. I have SLX trail clipless pedals on and the stock grips.

Final thoughts:

I can see myself upgrading to carbon hoops one day when I have the cash just to really push this bike towards it's full potential. I'm not pressed on doing it and it would merely be a luxury.

I may also consider a fork if I happen to have some spare change and see a killer deal on the Fox fork that wouldn't require a new hub. Again, it's not needed but would be a luxury.

The next thing I will upgrade though is the deore brakes. There is plenty of stopping power when used together but when trying to shave speed with just the rear they lack the stopping power I'm used to with the slx or xt brakes, despite having 180mm rotors compared to 160 on my other bikes.

Forgot to mention, calf-bang factor 1/10.

Demographic info:

I'm an occasional Endurance rider when I have the time to train. Mostly I just ride for fun. I ride Patapsco State Park or Rosaryville State Park most often. Other trails are Little Gunpowder, Allegrippis, Rothrock, and Loch Raven. East coast flow and east coast chunky stuff.

I am 6'2'' and bought the 18.5 frame and if you've read the whole thing have noticed I've pushed the seat forward and moved the bars in. So there's a wrench for all you people looking for sizing advice. I like a slightly smaller bike in general but I feel great with my size choice.

Other bikes are my SS Jabberwocky weighing in at 25lbs and an On-One Parkwood at about 28lbs.

Side note: No idea why my bike shop would put a dork disk and reflectors on a nearly $2,000 mountain bike.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

18.5 at 6'2"??? Your shop did you dirty. I'm 5'9" and sometimes fins an 18.5 to be a little tight


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

I'm looking at a Stache 5 and find the sizing confusing

eg a '18'5' could be Trek's 19.5 which has a ETT of 24 1/4"

just to add to the mix i'm 6'2 and ride a Stooge rigid with an ett of 23.5


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

obs08 said:


> 18.5 at 6'2"??? Your shop did you dirty. I'm 5'9" and sometimes fins an 18.5 to be a little tight


On the contrary my son. They did exactly what I asked. I demo'd a 9 in 21.5 and 18.5 and the 18.5 was much more comfortable for me.

It's all about body proportions, riding style, and preference. My parkwood is 19.5 and my Jabber is 20.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Looks good sternomac.

I'm trying to set the tyres tubeless.
Rear looks like it is holding up. But front is deflating straight away through the rim joint.
This is with the fitted Tape. Lots of air escaping through the joint.

Should the rim joint be air tight? Tried adding some extra Stan's tape I have up the sides of the rim but not helping.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Think I've found the answer in another thread. Looks like I have to cover any pin holes, all around the rim.

From other thread:
"What I found was the holes in the bead shelf (used in the mfg process) allowed are to escape and exit out the rim joint. Covering the holes and more of the rim joing w/ tape made them work very well"


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> Looks good sternomac.
> 
> I'm trying to set the tyres tubeless.
> Rear looks like it is holding up. But front is deflating straight away through the rim joint.
> ...


A few days into ownership and three rides in, having the exact same problem with my 9. I just make sure to check the pressure before i go ride and I'll probably add a little more sealant soon. It's not going to leave me with a mid-ride flat, so I'll just let the sealant attempt to do it's job and let it ride. It's easier than redoing the tape, and all the work that goes along with it, which I'll do when I eventually replace the tires.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

@ sternomac what is your inside leg measurement?

I prefer a smaller bike and can't get a demo, but like you prefer a smaller bike and have similar measurements


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

bonesetter2004 said:


> @ sternomac what is your inside leg measurement?
> 
> I prefer a smaller bike and can't get a demo, but like you prefer a smaller bike and have similar measurements


Pants I wear are typically 30 or 32 inseam.

Where are you located? If anyone were ever near me and wanted to throw a leg over it, I'd be happy to oblige. I worry about all these people a few pages ago asking for sizing advice with ETT's and height and what not. The only way to know for sure is to sit on it and if you're going to drop that kind of coin, it's worth it.

When I was looking for a Jabberwocky I went on the local mtbr room and just asked if anyone owned one that would be willing to let me take it for a spin. Someone said yes, we did a ride together and he rode one of my bikes, and he (several months later) ended up selling me that very same frame.

Basically, exhaust your options to find one before you buy one. Just my two cents.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Better to ride one than just sit on it also.
You only really start to get that cramped feeling when you actually ride a bike (especially climbing), if it's to small.
I'm 5'11" and went for a 19.5 but in the knowledge i will use a 60mm stem or shorter. After demoing the 18 & 19.
So take preffered stem length into account.
But ridder preference is important.

Also if you go in a shop and sit on one, magically that will be the ideal size for you according to the salesman. I went in a shop that had the 17.5 and was told that it's my size so... 
I think you need to get forward on the saddle and low over the bars to mimick your climbing position to see if you still have enough room to breath.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

yamaha46 said:


> Better to ride one than just sit on it also.
> You only really start to get that cramped feeling when you actually ride a bike (especially climbing), if it's to small.


Totally agree. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

I was told over and over to get a 21.5 on the original stache a year ago which I didn't buy. I only rode that on the street around the shop and I knew it wasn't right.

And when I was demoing the new stache 9 this spring, again, the basically forced me to ride the 21.5. I rode the 21.5 on trails at Patapsco and I knew it wasn't right.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Hi
I recently bought a Stache 9 in Chile and whilst i absolutely love the bike, I'm having an annoying problem. After the bike has been ridden for a bit, i get a creaking/clicking noise coming from the bike at irregular intervals but this only happens when i'm pedalling. Its been back to the Trek dealer in santiago, they couldn't pin point the problem but said they'll do a full service for $50. After the service, hey presto the noise disappears but gradually it returns after i've ridden the bike for a few days...back to the dealer i go, they charge me $50 again for a full service and bingo! no more noise for a few days again. The noise seems to be coming from the chain/chain ring/rear derailleur. Any idea what could be wrong?
Thanks
Psycho


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

psychopomp1 said:


> Hi
> I recently bought a Stache 9 in Chile and whilst i absolutely love the bike, I'm having an annoying problem. After the bike has been ridden for a bit, i get a creaking/clicking noise coming from the bike at irregular intervals but this only happens when i'm pedalling. Its been back to the Trek dealer in santiago, they couldn't pin point the problem but said they'll do a full service for $50. After the service, hey presto the noise disappears but gradually it returns after i've ridden the bike for a few days...back to the dealer i go, they charge me $50 again for a full service and bingo! no more noise for a few days again. The noise seems to be coming from the chain/chain ring/rear derailleur. Any idea what could be wrong?
> Thanks
> Psycho


Sounds like a bottom bracket creak to me


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

obs08 said:


> Sounds like a bottom bracket creak to me


That's what I'm having. I checked the torque spec on everything, and it's definitely coming from the BB. I have a TorqTite BB from Enduro to install. Hopefully, that will do the trick, permanently...


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

Check the chainring bolts. That will be $50.00 please


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## Skywalker29 (Nov 24, 2012)

psychopomp1 said:


> Hi
> I recently bought a Stache 9 in Chile and whilst i absolutely love the bike, I'm having an annoying problem. After the bike has been ridden for a bit, i get a creaking/clicking noise coming from the bike at irregular intervals but this only happens when i'm pedalling. Its been back to the Trek dealer in santiago, they couldn't pin point the problem but said they'll do a full service for $50. After the service, hey presto the noise disappears but gradually it returns after i've ridden the bike for a few days...back to the dealer i go, they charge me $50 again for a full service and bingo! no more noise for a few days again. The noise seems to be coming from the chain/chain ring/rear derailleur. Any idea what could be wrong?
> Thanks
> Psycho


I think it is the seat post or seat itself. The clicking is irregular because your weight is shifting irregularly. Rock it back and forward when riding to verify.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Does anyone have the details on the Stache 9 wheels? Curious about spoke gauge and max tension for the rims.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

TuTone T said:


> Check the chainring bolts. That will be $50.00 please


A way to separate the causes is to hold the bike, lean it away from you and push the pedals to the inside to put stress on the BB but not the chainring bolts.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I'm in the UK with a much wetter environment than Chile, but I have replaced the bottom bracket due to creaking with a Chris King bb.

Also had to replace the headset bearings as the bottom bearing fell apart.

Seatpost is also an area of creaking, take it out and give it a clean, very light layer of grease and re insert.

Always difficult to diagnose creaks etc, could even be the saddle on the rails etc.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Thanks folks, definitely can't be the seat as the creaking only happens during pedalling. if it is the bottom bracket, i guess i will need a 30mm bracket, correct? Would this be suitable:
Chris King PressFit 30mm Ceramic | Backcountry.com


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

I have been loving this bike from the very first ride on it. I made a few changes: changed the XT brakes to Guide Ultimates, changed the KS dropper to RS Reverb, and change the grips to Ergon GE1s. I am running the wheels tubeless on the factory tape with no issues thus far...and have found 13front/14rear to be the perfect psi for my fat ass (6'-185lbs). I am pretty much running the fork with all settings set to minimum except for rebound that is set to mid-way....75psi although I may bump that down to 70. I find myself riding through stuff at speeds that border on scary! Have not found anything the bike won't simply eat up. I have also found myself hanging with little issues behind guys I used to get dropped by on descents. I have a 21lb Superfly Pro HT and a 26lb Remedy 9.9 27.5....as much as I love my remedy, this bike just takes fun to another level. To anyone that say's it's handling is slow and clumsy, I'd say that until they ride one, that statement is false!


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

^^I'm noticing a few posts suggesting some pretty low pressures in the fork.
I haven't owned my Stache 9 for a week yet but I completely agree that lower pressures are necessary.
I started out with the recommended fork pressure on the decal on the fork and 16 psi in the tires. Wow. It was immediately apparent that lower pressures were needed!
At 85 psi the fork is still nowhere near bottoming, and I've tried. I'll drop to 75-80 for today's ride.
14.5 psi in the tires seems about right but I could have sworn I hit rim yesterday. I'll keep an eye on that.
Just for reference I'm 6'6" 205 on an XL.

On another note about the fork settings.
It seems that whatever position the compression and rebound are set I'm not feeling much difference and I really can't hear a lot of the normal "oil squeezing through an orifice" noises that are typical of the settings at max.
Any tricks I need to know or did someone forget to put oil in this one?


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Barman1 said:


> ^^I'm noticing a few posts suggesting some pretty low pressures in the fork.
> I haven't owned my Stache 9 for a week yet but I completely agree that lower pressures are necessary.
> I started out with the recommended fork pressure on the decal on the fork and 16 psi in the tires. Wow. It was immediately apparent that lower pressures were needed!
> At 85 psi the fork is still nowhere near bottoming, and I've tried. I'll drop to 75-80 for today's ride.
> ...


I'm almost 190lbs and went with 63psi (Fox digital pump) on my 9, which was about what I was running on the rental 7's I had been riding on and off for the last couple months. There's a lot of big dips on the trails where I use the Stache and haven't bottomed the fork with any aggressive pumping.

It has 60 miles on it now and I just put some slick honey on the fork legs, so I'll check preload after another ride or two to see if the fork needs breaking in or if it's simply not a very plush fork. (I've been riding 150-160mm forks for the last 4 years, so "plush" is relative) The smaller diameter grips than I'm used to probably also contribute to a slightly harsher feel.

Might also remove a spacer from below the stem, since the bars are so high...even my enduro bike has the bars slightly below the saddle.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

For those with creaking, check the rear hub.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

richde said:


> I'm almost 190lbs and went with 63psi (Fox digital pump) on my 9, which was about what I was running on the rental 7's I had been riding on and off for the last couple months. There's a lot of big dips on the trails where I use the Stache and haven't bottomed the fork with any aggressive pumping.
> 
> It has 60 miles on it now and I just put some slick honey on the fork legs, so I'll check preload after another ride or two to see if the fork needs breaking in or if it's simply not a very plush fork. (I've been riding 150-160mm forks for the last 4 years, so "plush" is relative) The smaller diameter grips than I'm used to probably also contribute to a slightly harsher feel.
> 
> Might also remove a spacer from below the stem, since the bars are so high...even my enduro bike has the bars slightly below the saddle.


I released all of the air and worked the fork through its range while adjusting the rebound and compression. Did it upside down then right side up and I did get some resistance changes through the adjustment range. I guess I'm just accustomed to a fork almost locking out with the adjustments maxed.
I aired it up to 80psi and always lose around 3psi unscrewing the pump. Had good luck with it on my ride today, really tried to get it to bottom but came up just a little short. Perfect.


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Mine is creaking and I think it is the rear hub. Do you have a fix?

Thanks



MrIcky said:


> For those with creaking, check the rear hub.


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

MrIcky said:


> For those with creaking, check the rear hub.


just curious whats wrong with your rear hub?


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

Drive side end cap becomes loose.


----------



## zeb (May 21, 2006)

Magnum Comp compression side rod with DIY tool.Air piston not shown in pic.
Mayby it is that steel spring that makes dinging sound sometimes?


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

zeb said:


> Drive side end cap becomes loose.


Awesome thanks, I will double check that


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

Note tightening direction.It is printed on end cap. I think it was 17mm cone spanner on DS end cap and use large hex key (10 or 12mm) on non drive side to hold axle.
Check out that cassete is tighten.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Ya what he said, drive side regrease/tighten. It creeps up every so often.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

Psychopomp1, My creaking problem was resolved with a Bottom bracket disassemble and re grease. Courteous of the dealer. 

Couldn't be the seat post as it was happening out of saddle on climbs. Pedals I re greased and wasnt that.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Dropout33 said:


> Psychopomp1, My creaking problem was resolved with a Bottom bracket disassemble and re grease. Courteous of the dealer.
> 
> Couldn't be the seat post as it was happening out of saddle on climbs. Pedals I re greased and wasnt that.


Thanks, will take the bike back to the dealer and ask him to do a dis-assembly & re-grease on the bottom bracket. If the problem gradually returns guess it means i need to replace the bb, can anyone recommend one from here? What size of bb does the stache 9 take?
TorqTite | Enduro Bearings

Or should i go for a Chris King one?
https://www.chrisking.com/bicycle/mountain/?producttype=bottombracket

Talking of saddles, can anyone recommend a comfy & stylish saddle for the stache 9? The stock saddle (Bontrager Evolve) isn't the worst but neither is it the best and my fat flabby arss does get sore after a while. Whilst home in UK i bought a green/black Charge Spoon saddle and whilst its slightly comfier, its looks a bit naff on the Stache 9 so gone back to the stock saddle. Don't mind spending a bit of cash on the decent saddle (up to $200). What about the Specialized Phenom Expert saddle, it seems to get good reviews?
Specialized Bicycle Components

Cheers
Psycho


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Well i've ridden my Stache 5 a few times now.
Demoed the Stache 9 before i got it, so can compare.

The 5 is alot different with the rigid fork. It does feel steeper and steering is more twitchy, less stable. Don't get the invincible ride through anything I got with the Suspension fork. Is good on the more mellow trials, but think I will get a fork for it sometime. Wheels also felt heavier as I was running tubes.

Will set it up tubeless next so that will make a difference. Couldn't get them tubeless with stock tape.
I found the air gets out of the manufacture holes on the rim (at the valve and 3,6 & 9oclock position). It goes into the rims edge cavity and gets out at the rim joint. Don't want to get the sealent in that cavity, so have ordered some tape to redo it.

Also not sure on tyre pressure as I don't have an accurate gauge. What pressure gauge are you guys using?









Moved a few parts over from my other bike (slx brakes, 50mms stem/780mm bar). It's a size 19.5 and i'm 5'11"


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Also with the steeper head angle & twitchy steering I was wondering if the offset is actually 51mm on these forks. I'd assume so being Trek but not sure. Certainly feels different to the Magnum.
And of course it's a bumpier ride, being rigid.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Well i've ridden my Stache 5 a few times now.
> Demoed the Stache 9 before i got it, so can compare.
> 
> The 5 is alot different with the rigid fork. It does feel steeper and steering is more twitchy, less stable. Don't get the invincible ride through anything I got with the Suspension fork. Is good on the more mellow trials, but think I will get a fork for it sometime. Wheels also felt heavier as I was running tubes.
> ...


I run like 13ish and I'm about 175lb geared up. Some people like the float, I like the tires a hair harder. Roll faster and really seem to compress into berms and rip


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

psychopomp1 said:


> Thanks, will take the bike back to the dealer and ask him to do a dis-assembly & re-grease on the bottom bracket. If the problem gradually returns guess it means i need to replace the bb, can anyone recommend one from here? What size of bb does the stache 9 take?
> TorqTite | Enduro Bearings
> 
> Or should i go for a Chris King one?
> ...


Bontrager saddles have a 30day 100% money back guarantee....not sure if that applies to the ones that come on bikes. That being said, you can go by a dealer...sit on the butt gauge and determine your sit-bone stance...then order a different saddle with the proper width. Putting other bike brand saddles on a bike (i.e. Spec on Trek) is a huge pet peeve of mine....whereas if it was a wtb, or fizik or something like that, then its ok...kinda. Still though, there are lots of different shaped Bonty saddles out there....and you get 30days to figure out which you like or not...since you can!
-r


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Also not sure on tyre pressure as I don't have an accurate gauge. What pressure gauge are you guys using?


I bought the new bontrager pump for mtb's...it has a much more granular gauge and so I can dial in exactly 13psi or 14psi....
-r


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

yamaha46 said:


> Also with the steeper head angle & twitchy steering I was wondering if the offset is actually 51mm on these forks. I'd assume so being Trek but not sure. Certainly feels different to the Magnum.
> And of course it's a bumpier ride, being rigid.


My Stache 9 is incredibly stable compared to my Superlight 29.
I haven't endo'ed yet! A significant claim from me. 
Also handles tight trails better.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

If i wanted to replace the stock bottom bracket on the Stache 9, is this what i would need?

TORQTITE BB86/BB92 BOTTOM BRACKET w/ANGULAR CONTACT
XD-15 CERAMIC HYBRID BEARINGS

FOR BB SHELLS MEASURING 41mm I.D. X 86-92mm WIDE, RUNNING SRAM GXP CRANKS

ENDURO TORQTITE BB92 FOR SRAM GXP


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

oclvframe said:


> I bought the new bontrager pump for mtb's...it has a much more granular gauge and so I can dial in exactly 13psi or 14psi....
> -r


Which model pump is this?


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Which model pump is this?


Look up the topeak mountain joe. Jenson has it for sale there, killer pump, real accurate and easy to read each individual psi


----------



## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> Also not sure on tyre pressure as I don't have an accurate gauge. What pressure gauge are you guys using?


Pure accuracy isn't really necessary, just the ability to read low pressures and consistency.

I run 11/14, but that's on my (old topeak, I think) gauge and feels different from the 11/14 I was using on shop-owned Staches with the shop's digital gauge.

Cliff notes:
Find a digital gauge and always rely on that gauge. You thought you were getting a simple bike, didn't you...yeah, me too.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes a digital gauge would be good. But they are all for shrader valves aren't they? 
Any that work with presta?


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Which model pump is this?


It is the Bontrager Turbo Charger MTB.








it has a very gradual gauge so you can get fairly precise...plus it has a blow-off button to dial it back to an exact amount.

-r


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## kyle_craig (Oct 29, 2015)

I have demoed the Stache 9 three times now. Twice at a local trail and once at Trek's private trails in Wisconsin. Each time riding it, I have been thoroughly impressed. Fun bike, solid geometry, amazing grip. I liked the concept of the '16 Stache and decided to give the Stache 5 a try.


After a two month wait, I received my new Trek Stache 5 yesterday. I had a chance to put it together today and I must say I'm pretty stoked! I'm 5'8" with a 30" inseam---I got the 17.5" and the fit is fantastic. Compared to my Superfly Comp, I really like the geometry. The top tube length is comfortable and the steering has a nice, nimble XC-bike feel. 

I was very pleased that included inside the box were tubeless valves and Sun Ringle tubeless tape was pre-installed on the rims. With ~3.5oz of Bontrager sealant I think they're finally all sealed up (after quite a bit of seepage). 

Immediate changes include the following:
-Tubeless Conversion
-Installed Shimano Deore M615 brakes
-Installed Bontrager RL lock on grips
-Narrowed the bar 15mm on each side
-Slammed the rear wheel forward (running ~407mm chain stay length...wheelies for days!)
-Bontrager RL cage (placid blue)
-Bontrager Trip 100 computer
-Shadow Thermalite pedals

The bike (set up tubeless w/ deore brakes and RL grips, w/o pedals or accessories) weighed in at a not-too-shabby 25 pounds 8 ounces! All set to ride with $20 pedals and other accessories, it weighs in at a respectable 26 pounds 9 ounces. I can't wait to get out and ride this beast on some dirt! Happy trails!


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

1strongone1 said:


> Mine is creaking and I think it is the rear hub. Do you have a fix?
> 
> Thanks


I cleaned and greased the freehub/cassette interface, and . . . . the noise is gone, at least for the time being. I mostly heard it when pedaling uphill, or really pouring the coal to it.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Can people with a stache 7 or 9 measure your suspension a2c (axle to crown) please.
It's listed as 531mm but on a shop bike I got 542mm so would like to check.
Looking at maybe getting the fox fork.
The stache 5 rigid is the 490mm as stated.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

is it 531 for a 100mm?


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

oclvframe said:


> Bontrager saddles have a 30day 100% money back guarantee....not sure if that applies to the ones that come on bikes. That being said, you can go by a dealer...sit on the butt gauge and determine your sit-bone stance...then order a different saddle with the proper width. Putting other bike brand saddles on a bike (i.e. Spec on Trek) is a huge pet peeve of mine....whereas if it was a wtb, or fizik or something like that, then its ok...kinda. Still though, there are lots of different shaped Bonty saddles out there....and you get 30days to figure out which you like or not...since you can!
> -r


I just asked the shop I got my Stache from and they confirmed it's only after market saddles.


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

sternomac said:


> I just asked the shop I got my Stache from and they confirmed it's only after market saddles.


Well...there's a good chance that all you need is a wider or narrower version of the same...or that other newer mtb saddles they're selling now like the Kovee or Montrose....


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## mrh372 (Aug 9, 2013)

yamaha46 said:


> Also not sure on tyre pressure as I don't have an accurate gauge. What pressure gauge are you guys using?


I'm about 195# right now and I've been running 12/14.5

It's a little bit on the high side bit I want to lose minimal power due to tire bobbing and am paranoid about slicing sidewalls on my rocky PA trails (unrepairable sliced sidewall only 30 miles in with the stock chupacabra front and a decent slice in my rear that I was able to patch.) I replaced the front with a Bomboloni and its sidewalls seem much more durable than the Chupacabra

I use this gauge.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004XISIK4?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

If i wanted to get the bottom bracket replaced on my Stache 9, would this be suitable:

TORQTITE BB86/BB92 BOTTOM BRACKET w/ANGULAR CONTACT
XD-15 CERAMIC HYBRID BEARINGS

FOR BB SHELLS MEASURING 41mm I.D. X 86-92mm WIDE, RUNNING SRAM GXP CRANKS


----------



## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

yamaha46 said:


> Yes a digital gauge would be good. But they are all for shrader valves aren't they?
> Any that work with presta?


This is what I have 
Price Point Digital Air Pressure Gauge | Price Point


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Good lookin out. Only 8 bucks right now. Purchased.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

sternomac said:


> Good lookin out. Only 8 bucks right now. Purchased.


It's been great so far. It measures in 10th's for the super picky folks


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Misc Notes on my 7 after 500 miles. I'm 6' 2" 225#. It's size 21.5:

When I first got it, tires used to bounce at over 13 PSI when I was pedaling. Either they've stretched or my technique is better- bounce is no longer an issue up to 17 PSI.

Now without bounce, I prefer 13.5/15. I'll drop down to 12/13 if it's really sandy and loose.

The only time I feel the wheel weight is long steep climbs on buff trails. When the trail is steep enough that you slow down between every pedal stroke- that's when you know these are heavy ass wheels. If a climb is loose at all, the wheel weight is no longer an issue. I've got a little over 69,000 feet in elevation gain per Strava on the Stache now. It's a great climber anywhere you can keep up a decent pedal stroke. 

Overall, I've set PRs over my previous Superfly FS on pretty much every trail I ride except for the long super-grindy climbs. It flat out flies on the flowy stuff. I'm not finding the wheel size to be any issue on the downhill. If it's held back at all, it's by the lack of suspension. The tires will eat up some stuff, but it's still a hardtail.

The tire tread seem to be lasting pretty well. I'd guess the rear has another 500 miles in it. Probably more if I rotate them, the front looks almost new.

I had a rear hub break early. The store replaced my rear wheel. I have had no problems since. I've done multiple 25 to 35 mile rides and I feel confident enough in the toughness of this rig to take it bikepacking, etc.

The bike is under-braked for the wheel size and weight. I don't think it's the avid's fault either. It just needs the extra leverage of a 200 up front.

The only creaking issues I have had have been resolved with rear hub maintenance.

The way the cables are routed makes a racket though. Use of zip ties and tape helped that a lot. 

The dropout slider standoffs were a little off when purchased. Do yourself a favor and double check that your rear wheel is tracking straight. 

At my weight on the comp fork, 72psi is perfect. It rarely bottoms, but it bottoms just often enough to know I am getting my full travel.

This fork bottoms very softly- you often don't realize it happened until you get to the bottom and see the rubber band up to the crown. I'm pleasantly surprised by the fork- although it is a little heavy.

My bike was 30.12 lbs bone stock tubeless with deity composite pedals. The rear wheel with tire set up tubeless was 6.53. The front is 5.60.

Looking closely, I'd say 1 lb of the weight difference between the 7 and 9 is in the hubs and the cassette. 

The bike sure gets a lot of attention. I'm surprised. I figured it was pretty muted but the huge tires stand out. I've been with my bro-n-law on his new bright orange b+ fatty stumpjumper and they ask me about my tires. Which is irrelevant except that the 29+ must be a lot more noticeable.

/info dump over/


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

MrIcky said:


> Misc Notes on my 7 after 500 miles. . . .
> 
> /info dump over/


Excellent summary IMHO, and mostly consistent with my own findings on the Stache 9.


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Nice review. Ya know you brought something to my attention. When I first got my stache I did notice a fair amount of bounce while pedaling, but now it's all gone. Maybe the tires has to break in a little who knows


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I notice the same thing if my cadence is too high when pedaling on a flat surface. I don't notice it while climbing.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)

Has anybody had a chance to ride one of these in 3-5" of snow yet? I am thinking of selling a niner ros 9 for a stache 5.. Thoughts on that?


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## josephjosephson (Aug 19, 2015)

AaronJobe said:


> Has anybody had a chance to ride one of these in 3-5" of snow yet? I am thinking of selling a niner ros 9 for a stache 5.. Thoughts on that?


Not unless you're way up in the mountains! We'll know soon though 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

jpc111 said:


> I notice the same thing if my cadence is too high when pedaling on a flat surface. I don't notice it while climbing.


True to that too. When I spin fast it bounces but if I stay at a nice solid rythm it's smooth


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

obs08 said:


> True to that too. When I spin fast it bounces but if I stay at a nice solid rythm it's smooth


Mine was doing a lot of bouncing as well.
Didn't really have much of a problem with that though as much as getting back on a HT.
I have back issues and my L4/L5 vertebrae are fused together so HT's give me a pain but I thought the plus sized rubber would give me the little extra cushioning I need.
Nope.
I kinda geeked out and picked up a Thudbuster with a firm elastomer.
Yep. 
Not only has my back issue cleared up, the cadence bounce is reduced. Must negate one another and provides a smooth ride, almost as smooth as my Superlight 29 on a firmer setting.
With the firm elastomer there's not a lot of bounce and other than the smoother ride I can't even tell it's there.

Now to replace those Chupacabras....


----------



## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Barman1

Replace the goat suckers why?>>>>>>


----------



## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

jpc111 said:


> Barman1
> 
> Replace the goat suckers why?>>>>>>


The knobs just aren't beefy enough to get a grip on roots and want to wipe out on muddy turns.
And they don't really want to grip slick rock, even dry. I skidded all the way down a face yesterday and barely slowed enough to make the turn at the bottom. Sure left a pretty distinct skid mark in my chamois though.
They're great on dirt and even loose conditions though. I'm making some crazy climbs in those conditions.


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## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

What tires will you be going to?


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

jpc111 said:


> What tires will you be going to?


Great question.
I've been wracking my brain over the few choices we have.
I narrowed it down between the Vee Trax Fatty or Maxxis Chronicles but I'm thinking the Vee's might be better in the snow with the heavier lug??
Really close to pulling the trigger.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

psychopomp1 said:


> If i wanted to replace the stock bottom bracket on the Stache 9, is this what i would need?
> 
> TORQTITE BB86/BB92 BOTTOM BRACKET w/ANGULAR CONTACT
> XD-15 CERAMIC HYBRID BEARINGS
> ...


Come on guys i'm sure some of you have had your BB replaced on the Stache 9. Would the above BB be suitable?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

vee tires are ****. nothing but problems. go maxxis, reliable and they just plain work.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I have replaced the bottom bracket with a Chris King unit, expensive, but hopefully ease of greasing will make it a long term item.

Also just about to put a new Maxxis Chronicle on the front for more winter grip in the UK.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Denis9999 said:


> I have replaced the bottom bracket with a Chris King unit, expensive, but hopefully ease of greasing will make it a long term item.
> .


May I ask which particular Chris King bb & size of bb you purchased? is the original bb on the stache 9 a press fit type, BB92, 24mm wide? where in uk did you purchase it from?
cheers
psycho


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

My UK stache 5 with race face cranks has a shimano bb it. So assume it's the standard bb92 24mm spindle.


----------



## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Yamaha 46 is correct.

Have a look on the King website for full details.
Been faultless so far, had its fair share of wet rides.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Denis9999 said:


> Yamaha 46 is correct.
> 
> Have a look on the King website for full details.
> Been faultless so far, had its fair share of wet rides.


Thanks. So looking at the King website I guess i will need a Chris King press fit 24 bracket along with conversion kit # 6 for the Stache 9, is that correct? where in UK did you buy it from? The cheapest i see it in UK is from chainreactioncyles website. Also do i need to buy any special tools to install/service the King bb?

Cheers
Psycho


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

I used my local bike shop, they fitted it for free.


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## psychopomp1 (Oct 26, 2015)

Denis9999 said:


> I used my local bike shop, they fitted it for free.


Thanks mate, will purchase a CK pressfit 24 bb & conversion kit #6 from blighty next time i go to Chile, where my dearest is stored.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Thought I would post up re Stache 5 sizing as it seems to come up a fair bit, especially for folks who can't try before buying, plus the 5's ETT makes it different to the other Stache line-up and makes for a slightly more tricky decision process

I'm 6'3" with 33" (rider's) inseam, not pants 'inside leg' so slightly more longish in the body

I usually go for a large size, but in the end decided on a 'XL' 21.5 (a demo was a right faff so ditched that). 

There's no way I would want the smaller frame having got the bike now

I have changed out the stem for a 60 (may try the 50 even), the bars for Salsa Bend 2's and also have fitted a lay back seat post. I find this helps balance my weight back a little more over the rear, lightening up the front on a rigid bike for a more 'riding off the back wheel' especially as you lift yourself up on the pedals into an attack mode

Without the lay back post I found myself wanting to slide back over the back of the saddle a tad

I think Trek have done a stellar job on the 5. It does everything right. I was concerned the front might be heavy and low, but it's just fine

I'm not 100% convinced by the whole 29+ thing yet (I have a 27.5+ rigid which is uber fun) but that's another thread


----------



## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Thought I would post up re Stache 5 sizing as it seems to come up a fair bit, especially for folks who can't try before buying, plus the 5's ETT makes it different to the other Stache line-up and makes for a slightly more tricky decision process
> 
> I'm 6'3" with 33" (rider's) inseam, not pants 'inside leg' so slightly more longish in the body
> 
> I usually go for a large size, but in the end decided on a 'XL' 21.5 (a demo was a right faff so ditched that).


I am pretty much in the same boat. On paper I should be on a 19.5. After testing a friend's 21.5 5 I ended up getting a 21.5 7. I think the 19.5 would have been too small. I will get a chance to ride it Thursday. Looking forward to it.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Let us know how you get on


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## jakehogg450 (Aug 10, 2015)

I too have noted a clicking/creaking coming from the rear hub. I was under the impression the axle end caps were just a push fit though into the end of the freehub body and non drive side. I dont believe there's any means for tightening them with cone spanners as you described? anyone confirm this?


----------



## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

I had a bad creaking issue. It ended up being in the rear drop out area. I disassembled, cleaned and greased the joint. The noise is gone,,,,, for now.


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## sgillmore (Mar 11, 2013)

jpc111 said:


> I had a bad creaking issue. It ended up being in the rear drop out area. I disassembled, cleaned and greased the joint. The noise is gone,,,,, for now.


+1. Same issue, same fix.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

jakehogg450 said:


> I too have noted a clicking/creaking coming from the rear hub. I was under the impression the axle end caps were just a push fit though into the end of the freehub body and non drive side. I dont believe there's any means for tightening them with cone spanners as you described? anyone confirm this?


If you have the DT 350 hubs then you are correct. Then end caps just press on. I think the hubs on the 7 and 5, however, have screw on end caps that can be tightened.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

Since there has been a lot of talk about sizing, I thought I would share my setup. I am an honest 6'2" with a 34-35" inseam. I was riding my 21.5 frame with a 50mm stem and felt just a bit cramped. I just switched to a 70mm 0 degree rise stem and it feels much better. I am a very aggressive rider (I jump off everything) and prefer a shorter stem, but the 50mm was not comfortable for more than a mile in the saddle. The 70mm also puts me in a much more centered position on the bike and my cornering traction has improved.


----------



## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Have you tried a lay back seat post?


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I did try a lay back seat post but there were two problems. I was too far over the rear wheel for steep climbs and the front end would pop up way to easily, and the positioning of the seat post does not help with the short reach of the bike. Even while standing I was always wishing for a bit more room in the cockpit.


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## jakehogg450 (Aug 10, 2015)

has any one taken the X1 cassette off a dt 350 hub (stache 9). I hear they can be difficult to remove from the taperd freehub base, unless well greased. Pretty sure this'll be where the click noise stems from.


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## Denis9999 (Feb 17, 2013)

Yes, was a little tight on first removal.

Applied some light anti seize to make removal easier etc.

Comes off quite easily now.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

briantortilla said:


> I did try a lay back seat post but there were two problems. I was too far over the rear wheel for steep climbs and the front end would pop up way to easily, and the positioning of the seat post does not help with the short reach of the bike. Even while standing I was always wishing for a bit more room in the cockpit.


Interesting. I use one and that is on my 5 which has a longer reach

I like it as predominantly it makes the front 'lighter' with my weight further back and off the bars

You have the forks of course


----------



## LeonOfBristol (Oct 4, 2006)

Anyone using a Stache for fooling about on really steep switchbacky trails? My gut feel was that big wheels would be no good, but the wheelbase suggests otherwise!


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

LeonOfBristol said:


> Anyone using a Stache for fooling about on really steep switchbacky trails? My gut feel was that big wheels would be no good, but the wheelbase suggests otherwise!


i have. it rides great. its significantly more nimble/agile than i was expecting. my first ride i was blown away at how it handle the tight and tech stuff. if i know im going to a trail where there is going to be technical sections (at lower speeds) ill take the stache over the trance


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Let us know how you get on


If this was directed at me, the 21.5 was the right choice. I rode 16 miles on Friday, and the fit was perfect. I am looking forward to riding this bike in some chunk to see how it handles it. The squishy fork has been a nice upgrade over the Krampus. Still trying to get it dialed. I set at the factory recommended PSI, and I only got 80-90mm travel. I will lower it a bit prior to the next ride.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Captain_America1976 said:


> If this was directed at me, the 21.5 was the right choice. I rode 16 miles on Friday, and the fit was perfect. I am looking forward to riding this bike in some chunk to see how it handles it. The squishy fork has been a nice upgrade over the Krampus. Still trying to get it dialed. I set at the *factory recommended PSI*, and I only got 80-90mm travel. I will lower it a bit prior to the next ride.


Ignore the factory recommendation.
For my weight it recommends like 20-25 psi too much?? On my 21.5 Stache 9 at 205lbs I'm running between 75-80psi and with the right settings I'm getting perfect sag and full travel on the hard hits but I've never felt it bottom. :thumbsup:


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

Barman1 said:


> Ignore the factory recommendation.
> For my weight it recommends like 20-25 psi too much?? On my 21.5 Stache 9 at 205lbs I'm running between 75-80psi and with the right settings I'm getting perfect sag and full travel on the hard hits but I've never felt it bottom. :thumbsup:


That's the plan going forward. I didn't have much time to mess around with it prior to the first ride.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

I demoed a Stache 7 on a 19 mile xc ride in Red Rock Canyon (Vegas) last week. Definitely a fun bike and very comfortable. The only issue I had was a propensity to lose traction climbing out of the saddle.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

SeaBass_ said:


> I demoed a Stache 7 on a 19 mile xc ride in Red Rock Canyon (Vegas) last week. Definitely a fun bike and very comfortable. The only issue I had was a propensity to lose traction climbing out of the saddle.


Chupacabras?
They're a good tire on certain surfaces but the lack of heavy lugs limits traction. Also on slick rock, wet or dry, hang on tight. 
I rode mine for less than a week before mounting new rubber. All better now.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

TuTone T said:


> Sorry shouldn't have spoken for you. I was talking about the Fox Factory series
> 29 no boost, 100mm. Saw some pictures of the clearance in another thread which I can't find now. Looked good to go On 29+ also. Can't remember what tire either.
> Ha Ha getting old I guess...


Sorry to bring up such an old post, but any chance you can recall the thread/pics? I'm looking into the Factory 34 Float 29 100mm to run on my 29+ bike and can't find any pics or info on tire clearance. I'd rather not buy a boost hub so I can still switch back to my rigid fork.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Sorry to bring up such an old post, but any chance you can recall the thread/pics? I'm looking into the Factory 34 Float 29 100mm to run on my 29+ bike and can't find any pics or info on tire clearance. I'd rather not buy a boost hub so I can still switch back to my rigid fork.


Not an answer to your question but have you considered the + fork with the 3 dollar spacer kit? Just making sure you're aware of all the options.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

sternomac said:


> Not an answer to your question but have you considered the + fork with the 3 dollar spacer kit? Just making sure you're aware of all the options.


$3 spacer kit?


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> $3 spacer kit?


http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/2016-fox-29-fork-984094-2.html#post12189567

MTB Tools Adapter Set For a 15mm x 100mm Front Hub To a 15mm x 110mm Fork


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

sternomac said:


> http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/2016-fox-29-fork-984094-2.html#post12189567
> 
> MTB Tools Adapter Set For a 15mm x 100mm Front Hub To a 15mm x 110mm Fork


I'm aware of that spacer kit...not $3 though...


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> I'm aware of that spacer kit...not $3 though...


That's weird. Maybe it's been cheaper before. I don't remember it being 25 bucks. Either way though...cheaper than a new hub.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Sorry to bring up such an old post, but any chance you can recall the thread/pics? I'm looking into the Factory 34 Float 29 100mm to run on my 29+ bike and can't find any pics or info on tire clearance. I'd rather not buy a boost hub so I can still switch back to my rigid fork.


Sorry no link but the pics are in this thread " My new full suspension 29+ rig" in this forum. He's using a Banshee Prime frame with dirt Wizards and a newer Fox 34, 29 fork.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

TuTone T said:


> Sorry no link but the pics are in this thread " My new full suspension 29+ rig" in this forum. He's using a Banshee Prime frame with dirt Wizards and a newer Fox 34, 29 fork.


Do you recall if it was the boost fork or not? I'll research deeper once I'm off work.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

SeaBass_ said:


> I demoed a Stache 7 on a 19 mile xc ride in Red Rock Canyon (Vegas) last week. Definitely a fun bike and very comfortable. The only issue I had was a propensity to lose traction climbing out of the saddle.


Pretty standard at Cottonwood, staying seated to keep weight on the tire and applying uniform power is the only thing that works. Even DHRs spin when out of the saddle in the same places where Chupacabras do.


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

sasquatch rides a SS said:


> Do you recall if it was the boost fork or not? I'll research deeper once I'm off work.


It looks like a regular 29" 34, The clearance shots show it to be a lot tighter than the 27+ fork but still enough clearance I think. At least for a Dirt Wizard on ? rim.


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## sasquatch rides a SS (Dec 27, 2010)

Trailice said:


> I Have had ZERO problems with anything even close to rubbing, And the fork crown WILL NOT hit a Dirt Wizard on a 50mm rim. I have bottomed out the fork more than a few times.
> View attachment 1023245
> 
> I can spin the wheel with the fork full compressed.
> ...


What exact fork is this and how wide is the tire measured from knob to knob?


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

richde said:


> Pretty standard at Cottonwood, staying seated to keep weight on the tire and applying uniform power is the only thing that works. Even DHRs spin when out of the saddle in the same places where Chupacabras do.


I'm used to my Jones Plus which has longer stays and Chronicles mounted. I really don't get any slip when I'm out of the saddle on climbs.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Just a followup on removing the rim tape on the Mulefut 50's and returning to tubes.
The issue I was having is getting the tire off the bead. Insane levels of aggravation were reached and finally had to resort to prying them off as carefully as possible without dinging the rim.
My concern was about trailside flat repair with tubeless. As it was I probably wouldn't even attempt it and just hoof it out.
The stock rim tape is installed right up into the bead seat with small gaps for the tire bead to drop into. Not ideal for ease of dismounting seeing as the tire has to be pried up over the thick rim tape in order to break the bead.
I'm not really a weight weenie obviously...but I didn't want to add much on these plus sized wheels. 
The stock tape is 100g and the Sun Ringle strips I installed are less than a third of that. Maxxis welterweight tubes come in a bit less than 200g. Vee Fatty weight is pretty close to the stock Chup's and without the recommended amount of sealant I'm guessing I didn't add much weight to each wheel. I'll bug someone for the stock wheel weight sometime for a comparison.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

First off, I absolutely love my Stache 5. With that being said, I think my 40 year old body is needing a suspension fork. I am able to ride a lot more aggressive than I thought because of how badass this bike is. Starting to add up the totals on what I think I will need and the numbers are getting pretty high.

Fork: whether i go with a Manitou or try the Fox 34 27.5, looks like plus of minus $800, right? Clearance on the Fox is pretty close and in the back of my head I am wondering what happenings if a stick somehow gets stuck between the tire and the arch(?).

Front wheel: do I just get a 110 hub and get the wheel relaced or a whole unit so I can swap forks back and forth if I get the urge( most likely wouldn't ever do it) and leave the stock fork and wheel together?
$216 for wheel assembly plus $120 for the tire vs just getting a new hub and relacing which would be $200+ probably? and I am sure there are other little tidbits I am forgetting.

My other thought is to sell the 5 and go to the 7 or really go crazy and go for the 9.

I know I am over thinking this but what would you do?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I was lucky in getting a second hand manitou pro.
I have just relaced the rim to a new 110 hub (sun ringle SRC).
So the expense was not to much. New forks are the most overpriced bit of bike tech, so it is a problem. More Manitou's should come up second hand eventually.

Just need to check my spokes tension now. First time i've built a wheel, but can always get it checked by a shop. Was relatively easy once you have the right spokes. The wheel looks close to straight. Think building with a big stiff rim probably makes it easier.

I may sell the carbon forks now also. As I won't be using them, and there are quite a few that like the rigid front.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Fuzzwardo said:


> First off, I absolutely love my Stache 5. With that being said, I think my 40 year old body is needing a suspension fork. I am able to ride a lot more aggressive than I thought because of how badass this bike is. Starting to add up the totals on what I think I will need and the numbers are getting pretty high.
> 
> Fork: whether i go with a Manitou or try the Fox 34 27.5, looks like plus of minus $800, right? Clearance on the Fox is pretty close and in the back of my head I am wondering what happenings if a stick somehow gets stuck between the tire and the arch(?).
> 
> ...


The geometry on the 5 is different than on the 7&9. Dare I say it was designed around a full rigid configuration?? How will it behave after installing a new fork?
Personally I'd grab a 7 or 9.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Geometry is different as the rigid fork is shorter.

The frame is exactly the same.
So with the same length fork as the 7 or 9 then the 5 will have the same geometry.

Trek did not make a totally separate frame just for the 5.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

yamaha46 said:


> Geometry is different as the rigid fork is shorter.
> 
> The frame is exactly the same.
> So with the same length fork as the 7 or 9 then the 5 will have the same geometry.
> ...


Ah. Makes sense now.
I that case Fuzzwardo I'd go with the fork and wheel option then. There's always a market for the used bits when you're through with them.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> The frame is exactly the same.
> 
> Trek did not make a totally separate frame just for the 5.


You sure?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

100% positive. The Frames are all the same. 5/7/9

I'll post this table again. Shows the change in geometry with a specific fork length/wheelsize.
531mm fork at top of table as on the 7 & 9.
490mm fork next down as on the 5.

Longer fork equals slacker angles, shorter fork equals steeper angles.
Think about the bike rotating around the rear axle, with different fork lengths.









That table is for the 2016 Stache Frame. 
Showing different builds. It is not specific to a 5/7 or 9 as all are the same.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I really have to sit down and start really pricing stuff seriously and go from there. On top of that I have considered getting the Praxis 11-40 cassette also, so I would have to factor that in too.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Just wanted to update based on my rides over the past two weekends.

The first two rides I rode the Stache 5 on were at new trails that are not worn well. Lots of chatter, even in the dirt. I was starting to worry about the stiffness of my cockpit/fork combination. 

The next ride (two weekends ago) was a punishing loop at Rothrock State Park. The leaves covered everything so I took a ton of jarring hits and it was just absolutely brutal. Full disclosure: I forgot all my bike stuff so my tire pressure was too high and I was using flat tester pedals off my dads bike. Either way, I noped out of that ride early.

I left this trip seriously considering moving to a suspension fork. Instead, I swapped the carbon bar over to my SS and moved the Carver Prybar over to the Stache. Also put my Ergon grips on the Stache. The stock grips on the Stache are too thin for my hands, especially rigid. 

I did a quick spin on the trails in my neighborhood and I felt a world of difference. The carbon bar and the carbon fork on the Stache are just way too stiff. The Prybar is far more comfortable. I was optimistic about my changes and that they may keep me from having to save up for another heavy investment.

Finally I hit Patapsco state park which is probably where I ride most often. The bike performed like a champ. I felt indestructible again like when I demo'ed the 9 with suspension. Of course, there were a few spots where picking the right line saved my skin but it really didn't slow me down much. 

I finally feel like I have a good feel for how this rides in comparison to other bikes I've ridden and the only real negative is that it does feel sluggish going up. A huge part of this might be present fitness levels. My 8 week old isn't being super supportive of my bike habit. I also think carbon hoops could help the spin up when pointed upwards. But I'll cross that bridge once I'm back up to full strength.

Anyway...hope this helps someone out there.


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## Deep Thought (Sep 3, 2012)

yamaha46 said:


> Geometry is different as the rigid fork is shorter.
> 
> The frame is exactly the same.
> So with the same length fork as the 7 or 9 then the 5 will have the same geometry.
> ...





bonesetter2004 said:


> You sure?


He's right. Think about it ... to make a separate frame with different geo, would be to open up a whole new project in regards to design, engineering, testing, etc. For the same bike? Naw, man. That's ridiculous. The difference in geometry is only due to the different fork A-C length.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

Fuzzwardo said:


> My other thought is to sell the 5 and go to the 7 or really go crazy and go for the 9.
> 
> I know I am over thinking this but what would you do?


I am roughly your age as I will be 40 next year. I decided to sell my rigid Krampus, and get a Stache. I was OK with the Krampus being rigid. I rode it like a rigid bike, and didn't get too crazy on it. I demoed a friends 5. It was set up single speed, and it was awesome. I was debating between the 5 and 7, but Trek/LBS made the decision for me. Trek has no more until early next year, and the shop had a 7 on the floor. I got the 7 2 weeks ago, and it's amazing. Stupid amount of fun. The suspension fork has made me consider the Stache on trails I would normally ride my full suspension. The suspension fork is a very nice addition to the 29+ format for me.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

Captain_America1976 said:


> I am roughly your age as I will be 40 next year. I decided to sell my rigid Krampus, and get a Stache. I was OK with the Krampus being rigid. I rode it like a rigid bike, and didn't get too crazy on it. I demoed a friends 5. It was set up single speed, and it was awesome. I was debating between the 5 and 7, but Trek/LBS made the decision for me. Trek has no more until early next year, and the shop had a 7 on the floor. I got the 7 2 weeks ago, and it's amazing. Stupid amount of fun. The suspension fork has made me consider the Stache on trails I would normally ride my full suspension. The suspension fork is a very nice addition to the 29+ format for me.


That is similar to where I am. I am so much more confident than I thought I would be so I am hitting stuff faster and harder. Talked to the LBS and they gave me an idea what my 5 would be worth so it may be going on Craiglist tonight. Then I can put that money towards a 9, sounds like the 7 will take a while to get.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

Check the availability of 9 prior to selling the 5. 5's and 7's are out of stock in 21.5.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

That is what my LBS said. He can get a 9 in my size (19.5) in a couple of days he said but the 7 is way out. Bike is up on Craigslist now, first offer, want to trade for a zero turn mower? I guess if I had a bigger yard I would have been tempted.


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## CdaleTony (Jun 21, 2005)

Fuzzwardo said:


> That is what my LBS said. He can get a 9 in my size (19.5) in a couple of days he said but the 7 is way out. Bike is up on Craigslist now, first offer, want to trade for a zero turn mower? I guess if I had a bigger yard I would have been tempted.


How was that on the local trails...?
CDT


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

CdaleTony said:


> How was that on the local trails...?
> CDT


How was the stache 5 or the zero turn mower on the trail? The 5 is great, not sure that the zero turn would fit on the trails.


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## CdaleTony (Jun 21, 2005)

grrr
How does 29+ ride on our local trails....Trying to decide


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I haven't been disappointed at all. The 29+ has built my confidence up where I can lean into corners harder and the traction is great. I would say I am just an average rider.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Although fun to ride I've found it requires more input to control that big front wheel.
Not a complaint, just an observation from my cramped and sore hands.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

Barman1 said:


> Although fun to ride I've found it requires more input to control that big front wheel.
> Not a complaint, just an observation from my cramped and sore hands.


I felt the same way on my fat bike and Stache 5. I did some experimenting and found a 40mm stem with a 780mm bar to do the trick on the Stache. The Farley has a 35mm stem and 800mm bar. Snappy steering to be had...


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

I'm in need of a new rotor already...
I bought the bike used and the brakes were upgraded to Hope Tech 3 E4 180mm.
Boost hubs are center lock right?
Only reason I'm asking is that the Hope 2 piece rotors I'm running have 6 holes in them and the center lock rotors I'm looking at are splined.
Did the original owner install adapters or something?


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Boost hubs just need to be a certain width, there isn't a specification on the rotor mount. Most hub and rotor manufacturers make both types of rotor mounts. I think Shimano is about the only big player that only makes only center lock hubs.


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## tadraper (Apr 14, 2010)

The dtswiss hubs on the Stache 9 are center lock but the original owner may have added an adaptor.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Welnic said:


> Boost hubs just need to be a certain width, there isn't a specification on the rotor mount. Most hub and rotor manufacturers make both types of rotor mounts. I think Shimano is about the only big player that only makes only center lock hubs.





tadraper said:


> The dtswiss hubs on the Stache 9 are center lock but the original owner may have added an adaptor.


Cool, so I can use either?


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Well, if has 6 bolt rotors on there now you can replace them with a 6 bolt rotor. But if there is an adapter, I would go with a center lock rotor if you find one you like.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Welnic said:


> Boost hubs just need to be a certain width, there isn't a specification on the rotor mount. Most hub and rotor manufacturers make both types of rotor mounts. I think Shimano is about the only big player that only makes only center lock hubs.





Welnic said:


> Well, if has 6 bolt rotors on there now you can replace them with a 6 bolt rotor. But if there is an adapter, I would go with a center lock rotor if you find one you like.


I think that's what I'll do seeing as the 6 bolt front rotor loosened on its own after being torqued to spec with the adapter.
I found the rattle. :skep:


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Barman1 said:


> I'm in need of a new rotor already...
> I bought the bike used and the brakes were upgraded to Hope Tech 3 E4 180mm.
> Boost hubs are center lock right?
> Only reason I'm asking is that the Hope 2 piece rotors I'm running have 6 holes in them and the center lock rotors I'm looking at are splined.
> Did the original owner install adapters or something?


How do you like your Hope disc's? What did you use before this and how do they compare?


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

litespeedaddict said:


> How do you like your Hope disc's? What did you use before this and how do they compare?


At 183mm it takes a little shimming to get the proper spacing so there's no contact with the rotor edge but otherwise they're good rotors except for a minor warp that I can't seem to tweak out. Any brake drag drives me insane. Good stopping power though especially with the new gold compound pads I installed yesterday.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)

Has anybody had their stache in the snow yet? Results?


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I just rode mine thru the yard this afternoon goofing around. About 6 or 7 " of snow and it did well.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Fuzzwardo said:


> I just rode mine thru the yard this afternoon goofing around. About 6 or 7 " of snow and it did well.


Cool.
I was on some dirty ice today and it was better than expected. A little slippy with the Vee Fatties but not too shabby.
Snow will be here too soon for me but I'm excited to see how it performs.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

Lol get a fat bike. From a twenty nine plus rider.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Nooope.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

temporoad said:


> Lol get a fat bike. From a twenty nine plus rider.


I agree to a point. The Stache will get the job done if you already have one but it isn't a replacement for a fatty.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

Barman1 said:


> Cool.
> I was on some dirty ice today and it was better than expected. A little slippy with the Vee Fatties but not too shabby.
> Snow will be here too soon for me but I'm excited to see how it performs.


I wonder if dirt wizard tires would do better on 3-4" of snow than the chupas. Bigger knobs for more bite?


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## Walt (Jan 23, 2004)

IMO 29+ is about as good as 26x4 tires on the older side (ie 3.8 Nates, Larrys, Endos). So pretty darn good on packed snow, pretty mediocre/bad on looser stuff as compared to modern ~4.5" fatbike tires. 

I was going to build myself a new fatbike for this winter but I decided the 29+ is enough for me, since I ski on big snow days and ride trails that tend to get packed by snowshoers/hikers/BC skiers. 

-Walt


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

My Stache 9 was picked up pre-owned and the original owner installed Hope V3 E4 brakesets F&R with a 183mm front rotor.
It got kind of warped so I pulled a 160mm out of the parts bin and went to install it but there's no 180mm adapter on the fork so obviously a 160mm won't fit.
Seeing as I got this used and original spec isn't familiar to me outside of the spec sheet on Treks site which as far as I can see doesn't list the rotor size, what size front rotor comes stock? 180mm? 
If so that's some good insight on Manitou's part producing a fork for this big wheel that doesn't need an adapter to run a proper sized rotor.


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## CannondaleF9 (Nov 17, 2012)

Barman1 said:


> My Stache 9 was picked up pre-owned and the original owner installed Hope V3 E4 brakesets F&R with a 183mm front rotor.
> It got kind of warped so I pulled a 160mm out of the parts bin and went to install it but there's no 180mm adapter on the fork so obviously a 160mm won't fit.
> Seeing as I got this used and original spec isn't familiar to me outside of the spec sheet on Treks site which as far as I can see doesn't list the rotor size, what size front rotor comes stock? 180mm?
> If so that's some good insight on Manitou's part producing a fork for this big wheel that doesn't need an adapter to run a proper sized rotor.


203mm is a proper size rotor... geez.

But in all seriousness I wouldn't run anything below a 180 on a bike like the Stache.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Proper rotors, proper answers.
Still looking for one.


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## YORK25 (Mar 13, 2013)

So has anyone put a carbon crankset on a Stache 5,7, or 9 if so which did you put on.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

180 is stock on the 9.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

YORK25 said:


> So has anyone put a carbon crankset on a Stache 5,7, or 9 if so which did you put on.


I'm running an xo carbon crank with a north shore billet xx1/76bcd spider and 32t xx1 ring. May switch to boost direct mount ring in future.


__
http://instagr.am/p/-fMVkWsv_d/


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

well, i ordered a 130mm yari 27.5+ fork and a 27.5 mulefut wheelset. converting the stache 5 to a 27.5+. havent seen any yet but considering how awesome this bike is rigid 29+, i really think the fork and 27.5+ is going to make this bike an total ripper


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Haven't come across anyone yet who is running B+ so interested to see your impressions


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Haven't come across anyone yet who is running B+ so interested to see your impressions


me too! i was really hoping someone would do it before me but oh well, someone has to bite the bullet and be the first!


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Have you ridden the 7 or 9 with suspension?
So you can see how the suspension 27.5+ compares to the suspension 29+.
Or have you only ridden your 5?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Have you ridden the 7 or 9 with suspension?
> So you can see how the suspension 27.5+ compares to the suspension 29+.
> Or have you only ridden your 5?


have only rode the 5. the idea of b+ being more nimble and playful than 29+ really appealed to be. im super pumped, just got to pick out some tires now


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Post some pics and review when your done.
If the a2c is 522 with that 130 fork you may find your BB is a bit low when sagged.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Post some pics and review when your done.
> If the a2c is 522 with that 130 fork you may find your BB is a bit low when sagged.


its actually 541, you have to look at the measurements for 29" becuase the fork is 27.5+/29 boost


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bottom bracket should be pretty close to where it is stock, maybe a few mm lower but nothing im concerned about. this is my flow trail bike, not my gnar bike


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

OK should be good then.
So does this fork work for 27.5+ and 29+?
Are you relacing a boost front hub, or have you got another wheel?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

it works with regular 29" wheels or 27.5+ wheels. i ordered a new wheelset, i got the 27.5 mulefut wheelset which is 110/148. did some black friday shopping and got he wheels and fork for $950 total which i think is a pretty good price


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Nice one. Do you have tyres as well?
Waiting for pics now


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

no tires yet, still trying to make a decision. i really want the maxxis rekon/ikon but they arent out yet. never been a huge fan of schwalbe, i was looking for a 2.8 but most likely will end up getting the specialized purg and ground control in the 3.0 for now


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Yari came in today. Weighs just under 2100g, a little heavy. Im hoping a stealth axle and cut steerer will get it under 2000g. Forks looks the biz! Just for shits I tried to put the 29+ in it, no go. Plenty of side clearance but tire hits the crown. Maybe a 29x2.8 might clear but 3.0 is def a no go. Anyway, wheels are in transit as well as tires. Should have pics of the first 27.5 plus stache up next week sometime


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## daniel harvey (Jul 23, 2007)

I've been riding a Faux Stache (Chi Carbon Workswell)for a few months now 27.5+, and it's my favorite bike to date.

I describe it as the feel of a Yelli Screamy with a 120 fork, but with a 140mm fork, carbon stiffness, and 3" rubber. 

I did this to have a place to hang my parts on while waiting for the 2016 Salsa suspension frames to become available. And while I still want a full suss mid-fat, the WW isn't going to be unwound.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

daniel harvey said:


> I've been riding a Faux Stache (Chi Carbon Workswell)for a few months now 27.5+, and it's my favorite bike to date.
> 
> I describe it as the feel of a Yelli Screamy with a 120 fork, but with a 140mm fork, carbon stiffness, and 3" rubber.
> 
> I did this to have a place to hang my parts on while waiting for the 2016 Salsa suspension frames to become available. And while I still want a full suss mid-fat, the WW isn't going to be unwound.


Got any pics?


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## daniel harvey (Jul 23, 2007)

https://picasaweb.google.com/103924498342645180548/20151124

Not very good pics, but something. Bottom bracket it low @ 12.25", but I love it.


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## daniel harvey (Jul 23, 2007)

try again on the photos:

https://picasaweb.google.com/103924498342645180548/November242015


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## daniel harvey (Jul 23, 2007)

My only complaint was the 27.2 seat tube as I must have a dropper. I have a Lev, but in this diameter the action isn't very good, and 100mm is all the drop one can get. Thomson gives you 125 in 27.2" and so far the action is excellent.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

daniel harvey said:


> My only complaint was the 27.2 seat tube as I must have a dropper. I have a Lev, but in this diameter the action isn't very good, and 100mm is all the drop one can get. Thomson gives you 125 in 27.2" and so far the action is excellent.


Look good man. 27.2 is def a bummer but I guess ya gotta compromise somewhere. Looks like a fun bike, can't wait to get mine together and ride it


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

With the sale of my 5 pending, I am starting to get butterflies whether or not I am making the right choice. I will own a Stache in one form or another. Really looking at the 9, but don't want to drop that much and not like it. Talk me into or out of the 9 please.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> With the sale of my 5 pending, I am starting to get butterflies whether or not I am making the right choice. I will own a Stache in one form or another. Really looking at the 9, but don't want to drop that much and not like it. Talk me into or out of the 9 please.


why are you selling your 5?


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

obs08 said:


> why are you selling your 5?


Was thinking about going to a suspension fork but by the time everything adds up I would be near the price of a 7 and I have fell in love with the 1x11. With hitting 40 and being able to ride a lot harder than I expected with the 29+, I need a suspension fork.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

Fuzzwardo said:


> With hitting 40 and being able to ride a lot harder than I expected with the 29+, I need a suspension fork.


I'm 57, been riding 29+ rigid for 3 years. I think rule 5 comes into play here. That being said I just put a Lefty on the bike and now I am to the next level of riding.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> Was thinking about going to a suspension fork but by the time everything adds up I would be near the price of a 7 and I have fell in love with the 1x11. With hitting 40 and being able to ride a lot harder than I expected with the 29+, I need a suspension fork.


i hear ya. i am almost 34. i love my rigid 5 but thought a fork would make it more fun. so i ordered a fork, 27.5 wheelset and tires for less than a grand. still think its a better deal than buying the 7. i like to change and customize, so for me getting the base model actually saves money in the long run.


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I totally understand, the 5 is great. What fork did you get Obs08? I always can fall back to my fatbike if I want to ride rigid.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> I totally understand, the 5 is great. What fork did you get Obs08? I always can fall back to my fatbike if I want to ride rigid.


i got the new rockshox yari. fork was $500 on sale, i went mulefut 27.5 wheel set for $400 and two specialized tires for $100. i could have got a reba for cheaper but the 32mm stancions were just to puny, i like the 35 on the yari


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

and thats sweet you have a fat bike too. i think after i fork my stache i am going to look in to the 27.5 farley


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

obs08 said:


> and thats sweet you have a fat bike too. i think after i fork my stache i am going to look in to the 27.5 farley


The 27.5 Farleys are great. That is another reason I can let the 5 go.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> The 27.5 Farleys are great. That is another reason I can let the 5 go.


what fat bike do you have?


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## Fuzzwardo (Oct 16, 2013)

I ended up with the 9.8. That thing is crazy.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Fuzzwardo said:


> I ended up with the 9.8. That thing is crazy.


Dude that is a bad ass ride!


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## dEOS (May 25, 2009)

I'll leave this here:
Farley 9.8 with 29+ wheels
Stache vs Farley: 29 plus | DANOS MODERN(ER) LIFE


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

obs08 said:


> it works with regular 29" wheels or 27.5+ wheels. i ordered a new wheelset, i got the 27.5 mulefut wheelset which is 110/148. did some black friday shopping and got he wheels and fork for $950 total which i think is a pretty good price


With a combination of being a little lazy, and bump your conversion enthusiasm (should you be be needing any!) what width are the B+ Mules?

I'm really looking forward to trying my 5 in this format. Don't mind a little wait however as December is max mud and don't want to buy mud specific tyres


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Same, 50mm 27+ 29+

Mulefüt 50SL | SUNringlé

I'm really happy with 29+ and don't want to go down in size. Went from a standard 29er to 27.5 and regretted it. 29er fan, the bigger the better for me.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> With a combination of being a little lazy, and bump your conversion enthusiasm (should you be be needing any!) what width are the B+ Mules?
> 
> I'm really looking forward to trying my 5 in this format. Don't mind a little wait however as December is max mud and don't want to buy mud specific tyres


Fork is in my living room and wheels are at my work just waiting to be taped. Hope those tires come in today!


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

obs08 said:


> Fork is in my living room and wheels are at my work just waiting to be taped. Hope those tires come in today!


Hope that all comes together for you

What tyres did you go for in the finish, and what conditions are they intended for?

And, what CS position/length are you going to go with?


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> same, 50mm 27+ 29+
> 
> mulefüt 50sl | sunringlé
> 
> i'm really happy with 29+ and don't want to go down in size. Went from a standard 29er to 27.5 and regretted it. 29er fan, the bigger the better for me.


YMMV


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Hope that all comes together for you
> 
> What tyres did you go for in the finish, and what conditions are they intended for?
> 
> And, what CS position/length are you going to go with?


Went with spec purgatory and groundcontrol for now until maxxis release the rekon and ikon. I really want 2.8 tires on this. I've been running the chain stay in max short in 29+ mode and will most likely do the same to begin with in 27.5 mode


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Didn't realise you could get max short with the big wheels in

Any reason you went Mulefut, over say a Scraper? The Sun rim is very light isn't it?


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Didn't realise you could get max short with the big wheels in
> 
> Any reason you went Mulefut, over say a Scraper? The Sun rim is very light isn't it?


On the subject of max short...
I was messing around with the adjusters on the dropouts today. Just cleaning and lubing.
How do the spacers(?) come out? I adjusted the dropouts all the way to the rear and tried pushing those little spacers out and they seemed to be slotted to prevent removal or something.
I was in a hurry to get a ride in and didn't want to mess them up so I left them alone till I could ask you guys.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Didn't realise you could get max short with the big wheels in
> 
> Any reason you went Mulefut, over say a Scraper? The Sun rim is very light isn't it?


By max short I meant as short as I could get them with the big wheels. I went mulefut wheelset cause I got them for a killer price and I like the mulefuts I have now. I got a flat on a super rocky trail and walked/pedaled for 5 miles and my mulefut has no bends or flat spots. It's a very durable rim. Side note, yari is bolted up to bike and 27.5 rims mounted. The mulefut wheelset comes pre taped, each wheel includes a tubeless valve and a bottle of sealant. The src hubs look extremely high end and are very very loud. Put hopes to shame. Overall I am impreased with the wheels, especially for what I paid. Not much to report on the yari yet as I have not rode it. The 35 stanchions compared to the fox 34 on my other bike look massive. At 130mm the fork just looks like a tank on the front of the bike. Turns out the spec tires are on back order so I will be mounting up a set of trail boss tires today


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Thanks for taking the time to clear those

Just ordered mine


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

*Stache 27.5+*

Well, here she is. the pics suck, im a horrible photographer but you get the idea. bike looks much more proper, wheel size just looks right, i think the 130mm fork with the 35mm stanchions just looks mean on the front end, looks like a proper trail bike now. havent got a chance to ride yet. some quick specs are 28lb even, 11.75 bottom bracket height, the trail boss tires weighed 1075 and 1106. id like to get the bike at 26/27lb range with a dropper, tires will be a big part of the weight loss as tire tech in this category progresses. 170 cranks are next on the list, with a bb that low i need any type of clearance i can get. cranks and some kind of a iscg bolt on taco bash.

2016 Stache 5 18.5"
rock shox yari
27.5 mulefut wheelset
wtb trail boss 3.0
gx/x9 10 speed drive 
avid db5 203/180 ashima rotor
whisky carbon bar and seat post


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

So sad to see a Stache frame emasculated like that. 

Enjoy it.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

obs08 said:


> Well, here she is. the pics suck, im a horrible photographer but you get the idea. bike looks much more proper, wheel size just looks right, i think the 130mm fork with the 35mm stanchions just looks mean on the front end, looks like a proper trail bike now. havent got a chance to ride yet. some quick specs are 28lb even, 11.75 bottom bracket height, the trail boss tires weighed 1075 and 1106. id like to get the bike at 26/27lb range with a dropper, tires will be a big part of the weight loss as tire tech in this category progresses. 170 cranks are next on the list, with a bb that low i need any type of clearance i can get. cranks and some kind of a iscg bolt on taco bash.
> 
> 2016 Stache 5 18.5"
> rock shox yari
> ...


Looks sweat! I think it deserves some bigger tires though, like the Duro Crux 3.25. Might raise up the BB a bit too.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Stache frame looks even better now! I may go bigger tires later, the 3.0 trail boss don't look as big as I was expecting. Nice and large none the less. I have to ride it and tweak it a little, I'm really hoping 2016 brings a slew of plus tires


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Surprised how small those wheels look compared to the 29+, considering the gap to the seat tube with the drop outs fully forward.

would of gone with a 2cm longer fork on there myself to keep the BB height and slacken the head angle. I know you said that you wanted to keep the geo of the rigid fork though.
But the slacker seat tube would have worked for you considering your seat is all the way back on there.

It will be fun to ride for sure, but think that having the fork will make a bigger difference than the wheels. Enjoy.:thumbsup:


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Surprised how small those wheels look compared to the 29+, considering the gap to the seat tube with the drop outs fully forward.
> 
> would of gone with a 2cm longer fork on there myself to keep the BB height and slacken the head angle. I know you said that you wanted to keep the geo of the rigid fork though.
> But the slacker seat tube would have worked for you considering your seat is all the way back on there.
> ...


i never adjusted the drop outs, they are where they were when i had the 29+ wheels on there, just got lazy but ill get to it this weekend. even if i went with a 140 fork, it would have only raised the bb one or two mm, i have a 140 bike and wanted something a little less on the hardtail. i agree i think the fork will make a bigger impact than the wheels, the 29+ with a fork just looked like a lot of bike to lug around and the idea of having it be more nimble and playful really appealed to me. i havent had the chance to ride it yet. saturday ill be going for a ride and bringing my multi tool and shock pump to make adjustments on everything and get it dialed in. ill report back with strava times for comparison


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

obs08 said:


> i never adjusted the drop outs, they are where they were when i had the 29+ wheels on there, just got lazy but ill get to it this weekend. even if i went with a 140 fork, it would have only raised the bb one or two mm, i have a 140 bike and wanted something a little less on the hardtail. i agree i think the fork will make a bigger impact than the wheels, the 29+ with a fork just looked like a lot of bike to lug around and the idea of having it be more nimble and playful really appealed to me. i havent had the chance to ride it yet. saturday ill be going for a ride and bringing my multi tool and shock pump to make adjustments on everything and get it dialed in. ill report back with strava times for comparison


I really think you should pull the dropouts all the way forward. Actually, it would be great to ride a lap of your local trail with the dropouts where they are now, then adjust them as far forward as you can and ride the same loop. I would like to hear you thoughts after that!


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bikeny said:


> I really think you should pull the dropouts all the way forward. Actually, it would be great to ride a lap of your local trail with the dropouts where they are now, then adjust them as far forward as you can and ride the same loop. I would like to hear you thoughts after that!


thats kind of my plan. i wanted to see how the bike rode with a longer wheel base, than shorten it up just to see the effects. it looks like the fork is offset more than the rigid fork too so i thought making the front end long and also making the back end shorter might feel a little funny. but yea i plan on doing some riding and tinkering and testing.


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## sirsam84 (Sep 20, 2006)

Looks very nice! Any chance of a 29+ fitting in that Yari?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

sirsam84 said:


> Looks very nice! Any chance of a 29+ fitting in that Yari?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


not even close, at least with the chupacabras. i tried it out, tire not just hits the crown but is wedged against it and wont spin. maybe if they come out with a 29x2.8 it may clear. the 27.5x3 has plenty of room though and should have no problem clearing a 3.25 as well


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## sirsam84 (Sep 20, 2006)

Or a 26 4 inch?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

sirsam84 said:


> Or a 26 4 inch?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


hmmm not sure how the width on a 4" would fit. i dont have a fat bike to test it out unfortunately


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

I don't know if anyone here is interested in a fat bike, to add to their collection.

I was thinking about getting a Farley, but I wanted 3.8 tires not 4.8 tires. The least expensive Farley at 27x3.8 is the 9.6 carbon bike at about $3K. So, as I was searching info on Farleys and an ad came up for the Surly Ice Cream Truck Ops. Surly is running a special on these bikes, normally $1875; but I guess until they run out of their 2015 inventory they are $1199.

So, I ordered one at my LBS. The Ice Cream Truck Ops is 26x3.8 not 27.5x3.8 like the Farley 9.6. The Ice Cream Truck is also sold as a 26x4.8 bike, but that one is not on sale and I think 4.8 inches is too fat for Florida anyways. However, since this frame fits 26x4.8, I would think at a later date that I could put 27.5x3.8 tires if I wanted to.

I went with the large, which is about the same ETT as my XL ROS 9 Plus. My XL Stache 5 is a little bit longer ETT. My Stache 5 is in Illinois, I'll have the Ice Cream Truck in Florida with my ROS 9 Plus.

I'll see how this works out, but I might make the fat bike in to SS, as I am running the 29+s 1xXX.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

dEOS said:


> I'll leave this here:
> Farley 9.8 with 29+ wheels
> Stache vs Farley: 29 plus | DANOS MODERN(ER) LIFE


Yep!
All the abilities of the Farley, plus fat capable.
I just ordered a set of 29+ for my Farley 7.

You can go either way with the Farley, but you can't put fat tires on the Stache.
The wheel set means in effect I'll have 2 different amazing bikes for a total investment of $3200.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Gambit21 said:


> Yep!
> All the abilities of the Farley, plus fat capable.
> I just ordered a set of 29+ for my Farley 7.
> 
> ...


But the farley is a fat bike where rhe stache is a trail bike. Boost hubs are whatever but not alot of people want giant specific cranks and silly monster width hubs. The stache I plenty for a ride in the snow too, builds up skill as opposed to cheating and using tires bigger than a honda civic lol


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

obs08 said:


> But the farley is a fat bike where rhe stache is a trail bike. Boost hubs are whatever but not alot of people want giant specific cranks and silly monster width hubs. The stache I plenty for a ride in the snow too, builds up skill as opposed to cheating and using tires bigger than a honda civic lol


I can tell by this post that you haven't been at this that long. Every point is invalid (or inane) and it would take me 15 minutes to type the correction you deserve. In short, "Trail" bike is arbitrary for starters, and the stays on the Farley are the same length as last years Stache and many other "short" stay bikes, just not as short as the 16 Stache. That one I can chalk up to ignorance, the comments about hubs, cranks and skill in snow are just plain ignorant and silly.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Gambit21 said:


> I can tell by this post that you haven't been at this that long. Every point is invalid (or inane) and it would take me 15 minutes to type the correction you deserve. In short, "Trail" bike is arbitrary for starters, and the stays on the Farley are the same length as last years Stache and many other "short" stay bikes, just not as short as the 16 Stache. That one I can chalk up to ignorance, the comments about hubs, cranks and skill in snow are just plain ignorant and silly.


lol ok dude, i can tell you have nothing to add since you resort to insulting people. a bike like a stache, which although it runs boost, can swap wheels and cranks etc with 95% of mountain bikes around. a bike like a farley is a specific bike. i cant swap parts onto my trance from it can i? are you going to run standard 29er wheels on a farley? nope, got those big old hubs there. i believe you my friend are the one who is ignorant. i want a bike that i can easily find and purchase parts for, use parts from other bikes in the event of breakage. idc about chainstay length honestly, good for your farley, its running chainstays from a bike built a few years ago. thats not what makes a trail bike. you should probably work on responding with facts or opinions instead of just insults. i would put money on it that you wear spandex too


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

No seriously, some people don't want yet another set of wheels in their garage that can't be used on any other bike. 

And some people get knee pain from the wider q-factor of 100mm cranks.

Personally, I'm avoiding a fat bike (and Boost hubs) for as long as possible simply because I like moving parts from one bike to the next. I've got cranks that are 10 years old and still work fine, I just used a straight steerer fork on a build for my wife, but I've got to buy a whole new set of wheels for her bike even though I've got a garage full of quick release 29er wheels that cant be converted.

Some people are cool with having a quiver of bikes in their garage spanning the decades, but me, I limit myself to 4 bikes total, and a fat bike is a bit too specific in its purpose.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

PHeller said:


> No seriously, some people don't want yet another set of wheels in their garage that can't be used on any other bike.
> 
> And some people get knee pain from the wider q-factor of 100mm cranks.
> 
> ...


thank you, that is exactly the point i was getting across. fat bikes are very specific, i dont want to have a bike that i have to have specific parts for


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

And yea sure you could build two wheelsets for a fat bike and get a carbon frame that'll rip during the summer, bikepack, race, etc, and have your winter wheels with big tires for snow riding, but you've then go two sets of pretty expensive wheels (and a 100mm crank) that are limited to current and future fat bikes. 

Now, if you've got a Race Face Cinch crank, you could swap spindles to run on a trail bike. I wouldn't buy any other crank for a fatbike. 

It's why I'm waiting and hoping (and watching Walt) for a bike that utilizes an 83mm crank, 148 rear hub (with modular drops for 142), and has clearance for 27.5x4.0 tires. The Advocate Hayduke is soooo close, but I want 29+ compatibility.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

PHeller said:


> No seriously, some people don't want yet another set of wheels in their garage that can't be used on any other bike.
> 
> And some people get knee pain from the wider q-factor of 100mm cranks.


The Q-factor thing happens, but is not that common really.
I'll be going to one bike, the Farley with a 29+ wheel set for summer. It's the most versatile thing I could have done while going to one bike. That's the point really.
While it may not work for everyone, for me it will amount to 2 bikes, and all the garble about hub width, snow, cheating etc from above...well I'll just leave it at that. Reminds me of certain customers from back in the day. Always good for a chuckle.

You can't argue with 4.8" tires, 3.8" tires, 3" tires all one one capable, "trail" bike.
That said, the Stache is a GREAT bike, I've ridden it several times. The Farley is similar enough that I'm not going to lament a tiny amount of chain stay length difference.

The point - it's a great one bike solution if you have desire/need for a fat bike as well. Max versatility. If you don't need that versatility then great, many don't. Trying to say that 3" tires are as capable in various (other than packed) snow and that fat tires are a "cheat" is just dumb.

That green 5 is sweet - that's the one I'd pull the trigger on. Almost did.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Turns out the Stache is a not-bad XC race bike, although I got a little too aggressive on a technical section and caused myself tire problems for the next 3.5 hours. 

I did a 6-hour event (my first XC race) this weekend and finished pretty much where I belong as far as I can tell from the Strava data about how much people ride. I took 5th out of 13, and the guy who took 4th has ridden three times further than me so far this year. Better than expected if I eliminate the time wasted messing with my rear tire twice a lap because I would have been very close to the 4th place guy.

The course was pretty tame for the first half and then turned a little more "all mountain" for the back half. The bike just flew through softer XC sections (sand or gravel), cruised up short or gentle climbs, and handled the tech sections very well...just not as well as my Mach 6 would have. I was out on the course for ~5:20 (no need to start another lap that you can't finish before the time cutoff), moving for 4:48 of that and felt very little pain other than still having a slight dislike for the skinny grips that came stock on the bike.

Felt pretty damn fast, although I don't have much experience on real XC bikes, and when I do it again I'll just put a little more pressure in the tires and swap the grips for something with a slightly bigger diameter (which were on order at the time). Just have to remember which bike I'm on next time.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

PHeller said:


> And yea sure you could build two wheelsets for a fat bike and get a carbon frame that'll rip during the summer, bikepack, race, etc, and have your winter wheels with big tires for snow riding, but you've then go two sets of pretty expensive wheels (and a 100mm crank) that are limited to current and future fat bikes.
> 
> Now, if you've got a Race Face Cinch crank, you could swap spindles to run on a trail bike. I wouldn't buy any other crank for a fatbike.
> 
> It's why I'm waiting and hoping (and watching Walt) for a bike that utilizes an 83mm crank, 148 rear hub (with modular drops for 142), and has clearance for 27.5x4.0 tires. The Advocate Hayduke is soooo close, but I want 29+ compatibility.


A 148mm hub and 4" tire is not going to work. At least not while using a full cassette. A Boost 148 hub only pushes the cassette out 3mm compared to a 135 or 142 hub. If you are talking singlespeed or IGH, than sure.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

If I had snow around here i'd have got a farley instead of the Stache and run 29+ on it in the summer. 
With the same fork length and 29+ wheels i'm sure its very close to the same head angle with the only difference being 2cm longer stays & slightly wider q factor.

Trail,enduro, xc it's all nonsense really.
Thankfully the bike industry has finally started to experiment with different wheel/tyre sizes after 50 years or so of near zero innovation. Be thankful we are now getting a choice.

And plus size would never of happened if it wasn't for fat bikes. You don't find the best solution by making tiny millimeter changes, you go max short/small & max long/big and see the effects and then find where the happy medium is. Fat bikes gave us the Max big so that the happy medium could be found.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

I'm trying to find that Trek video about the R&D that went into the Stache so I can show a friend, but I'll be damned if I can find it using search, or even Google. Anyone have the link?


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

*Someone's Request*

Someone asked for pics of my build awhile back... 23.75 lbs...

Sorry, crappy pic...


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## Bikeabout (Nov 27, 2007)

Gambit21 said:


> ... but I'll be damned if I can find it using search, or even Google. Anyone have the link?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Thrawn:
Nice weight.
What are the specs of your bike?

Just noticed the spokes, did you paint them yourself?


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

yamaha46 said:


> With the same fork length and 29+ wheels i'm sure its very close to the same head angle with the only difference being 2cm longer stays...


I just want to politely point out that it is in fact "slight" changes to these measurements that make SIGNIFICANT differences in how a bike handles and feels. Maybe less aggressive riders on moderate terrain can't tell a difference; maybe a parking lot test isn't revealing.

For example: world cup XC machine? head angle, 69-71deg
Enduro race bike: 65-67.5 deg head angle

Farley- 445mm ish chainstays
my '16 Stache: max chainstay is 420mm, but I run it at 405mm (shortest possible) with a 2.2" tire on the back, and will likely race it in this configuration.

Small numerical differences on paper make a BIG differences in feel of a bike. 
I have a carbon SF100, remedy 29 9.9, and a '16 stache, wife has a superfly hardtail and remedy 9.9 650b... the "couple centimeters" difference in chainstay length of my stache is my favorite feature of the bike!


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Hello, last week, finally Stache5 has come! but I'm facing with a problem.
17.5 size has only 90mm head tube length and fox34 steer tube has 80mm for tapered part, so headset compression ring touches steer tube of tapered part before it is secured enough.

FORK- 2016 34mm User Specification Drawings | Bike Help Center | FOX
Stache 5 29+ | Stache | Trail | Mountain | Bikes

no one happen like this?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Well yes geometry is important.

But categorising bikes head angles as XC/Trail/Enduro/Downhill is not definitive.
Because every year or so all of those angles get slacker. Yesterdays Downhill bike was 71deg Head angle!!!
So todays XC bike is yesterdays downhill bike.

As regards the Farley vs stache at 29+ 110/120 Magnum fork.
Putting a Stache 110 fork on the Farley would probably get rid of those "slight" angle differences and leave you in near enough the same geometry, is what I was getting at.

And yes i'm not skilled or fast enough to tell the difference in some aspects. But the Stache 2016 is the first bike where I can actually notice the short chainstays in a big way. So I think that may be the only real change i'd notice.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

My intent was not to definitively categorize bikes for all time, but merely to show that small numerical differences mean big differences in terms of intended use (for a given time period in the evolution of mountain bikes- do I really have to type that?). 

If you want a bike that "begs a rider" to pop and jump off trail obstacles, move it around in the air, steer quickly with your hips, wheelie and manual over rough stuff... there is a big difference between a 420mm chainstay (at the longest) stache frame and a 445mm chainstay farley. (Wheel weight also plays a factor in this, of course.) 

The '16 stache strikes me as possibly revolutionary, and 1x drive trains should only encourage more manufacturers to make very short chainstay hardtails for big wheels.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes I agree with you.
I have the Stache and love the short chainstay. So going to a farley as a year around bike would sacrifice this but if you had a lot of snow then it would save having 2 bikes £$$£.

The Stache 16 is really well thought out in all aspects. Love it.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

tsurun, That is a problem, normally i'd say to use external cups but the Stache doesn't use cups so i'm stumped.
Either swap it for a 18.5 frame or change to a Manitou magnum. Unless anyone can come up with some solution.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

Bikeabout said:


>


Thanks - yeah I found that one. It was different one that I'm thinking of.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

tsurun said:


> Hello, last week, finally Stache5 has come! but I'm facing with a problem.
> 17.5 size has only 90mm head tube length and fox34 steer tube has 80mm for tapered part, so headset compression ring touches steer tube of tapered part before it is secured enough.
> 
> FORK- 2016 34mm User Specification Drawings | Bike Help Center | FOX
> ...


It will fit, the, tapered part goes in the head tube as well


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

yamaha46 said:


> Thrawn:
> Nice weight.
> What are the specs of your bike?
> 
> Just noticed the spokes, did you paint them yourself?


Custom Industry Nine Wheelset (turquoise/pink spokes and hubs, laced to WTB i45 Scraper rims)
Stock Chupacabra tires
Syntace Megaforce 2 stem, 40mm flipped at -6*
Syntace Carbon bar, 780mm with 20mm rise
Ergon GA2 grips
M9000 XTR Race levers with M9020 XTR Trail calipers
Ice-Tech Rotors: 180mm front and 160mm rear
11-speed XTR shifter, rear der and chain
11-speed XT cassette, 11-42t
Stock X1 crankset with Raceface crank boots
Look S-track pedals
66sick El Flaco saddle
Thomson Masterpiece seat post and binder
K-Edge Gravity Garmin mount

Pushed the rear wheel forward a touch - 415mm center hub to crank.

Such a blast to ride! Has eaten everything I've thrown at it. Just wish I had a dropper for the techy descents. Kept getting hung up behind the saddle.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Gambit21 said:


> Thanks - yeah I found that one. It was different one that I'm thinking of.


There's an article about the evolution of the Stache: http://www.tetongravity.com/story/bike/the-trek-stache-2015s-most-fun-mountain-bike

Don't remember seeing a video about it.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Thrawn said:


> Custom Industry Nine Wheelset (turquoise/pink spokes and hubs, laced to WTB i45 Scraper rims)
> Stock Chupacabra tires
> Syntace Megaforce 2 stem, 40mm flipped at -6*
> Syntace Carbon bar, 780mm with 20mm rise
> ...


Are you from north carolina?


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

obs08 said:


> Are you from north carolina?


No, sorry. SoCal resident...


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

Okay I hate when people ask should I buy a particular bike, but I'm going to do just that.

I've been riding a Krampus for 3 years (love this 29+ format). I put a lefty on it this summer (super love this now). I really like what Trek has done with the Stache, taking the Krampus to the next level for tail riding. I am thinking of getting the Stacke 5 putting the Lefty on it (rebuilding the front wheel). Has anyone ridden both? Is it worth the investment in the Stache? Will I notice a significant amount of improved trail riding to warrant the investment? I don't have access to a Stache to demo one.

thanks


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Thrawn said:


> No, sorry. SoCal resident...


i went to pisgah this year and man, every tom dick and harry had the ugliest brightest i9 wheelset on their bikes. figured with wheels like that there was a good chance lol


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

temporoad said:


> Okay I hate when people ask should I buy a particular bike, but I'm going to do just that.
> 
> I've been riding a Krampus for 3 years (love this 29+ format). I put a lefty on it this summer (super love this now). I really like what Trek has done with the Stache, taking the Krampus to the next level for tail riding. I am thinking of getting the Stacke 5 putting the Lefty on it (rebuilding the front wheel). Has anyone ridden both? Is it worth the investment in the Stache? Will I notice a significant amount of improved trail riding to warrant the investment? I don't have access to a Stache to demo one.
> 
> thanks


Why not just get a bare frame and do a full swap? You would need a new rear hub and cranks, but at least you'd get higher quality parts than the 5 has.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

richde said:


> Why not just get a bare frame and do a full swap? You would need a new rear hub and cranks, but at least you'd get higher quality parts than the 5 has.


A Stache 5 in Canada is 1999$ the raw frame is 1129$, for 870$ I am getting a lot of new components. New tires which are 150$ ea on there own, rear wheel with the boost hub (can't swap over, as you say). True I can swap over the front wheel which I may at first but the mulefut rim is tubeless ready, etc. But then again is it worth it?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

temporoad said:


> A Stache 5 in Canada is 1999$ the raw frame is 1129$, for 870$ I am getting a lot of new components. New tires which are 150$ ea on there own, rear wheel with the boost hub (can't swap over, as you say). True I can swap over the front wheel which I may at first but the mulefut rim is tubeless ready, etc. But then again is it worth it?


Jeez what kind of tires are you getting for $150


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

obs08 said:


> i went to pisgah this year and man, every tom dick and harry had the ugliest brightest i9 wheelset on their bikes. figured with wheels like that there was a good chance lol


LOL... That's what I was going for...


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

obs08 said:


> Jeez what kind of tires are you getting for $150


Bontrager Chupacabra 150$ cdn, 120$ usd ea.

Bontrager Chupacabra MTB Tire | Bike tires & tubes | Cycling components | Equipment


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

richde said:


> There's an article about the evolution of the Stache: http://www.tetongravity.com/story/bike/the-trek-stache-2015s-most-fun-mountain-bike
> 
> Don't remember seeing a video about it.


It's the video where the Trek engineers are sitting there talking about why they went 29+ instead of 27.5+, and they show the digital image of the contact patch of the 2 plus sizes, the slow motion of the Stache/Chupie going over a bump...ring a bell? I'd think it would be easy to find again but I can't seem to locate it.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

temporoad said:


> Bontrager Chupacabra 150$ cdn, 120$ usd ea.
> 
> Bontrager Chupacabra MTB Tire | Bike tires & tubes | Cycling components | Equipment


I'll sell ya a whole 29+ wheelset with chupas for the price of those tires lol


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

All the lol'ing aside, this stuff is expensive - no way around it.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Gambit21 said:


> It's the video where the Trek engineers are sitting there talking about why they went 29+ instead of 27.5+, and they show the digital image of the contact patch of the 2 plus sizes, the slow motion of the Stache/Chupie going over a bump...ring a bell? I'd think it would be easy to find again but I can't seem to locate it.


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## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

Ahh...I'd forgotten that it was the video with started with that guy in the hat.
Thanks


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

I just threw a Fox 34 29er boost 140mm fork on the Stache. It is BAD!!! I'm not sure if I'll keep it at 140 yet but the first couple rides have been a blast, so much more fun than the rigid setup. Tire clearance is adequate with about 5mm between the center of the tread and the hoop. I think the clearance is tighter for the rear wheel due to the single speed axle position. For reference, I've running a Chronicle on a Nextie Jungle Fox 52mm with 45mm internal width and the Fox part number for the fork is 910-01-954.

House pic








And a pic in the wild


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

mpolka said:


> I just threw a Fox 34 29er boost 140mm fork on the Stache. It is BAD!!! I'm not sure if I'll keep it at 140 yet but the first couple rides have been a blast, so much more fun than the rigid setup. Tire clearance is adequate with about 5mm between the center of the tread and the hoop. I think the clearance is tighter for the rear wheel due to the single speed axle position. For reference, I've running a Chronicle on a Nextie Jungle Fox 52mm with 45mm internal width and the Fox part number for the fork is 910-01-954.
> 
> House pic
> 
> ...


Sweet!! How is the clearance on the sides of the fork lowers, by the seals bulge etc?


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

It's solved by shorten compression ring.







Anchor nut is dead!







Compression ring scrached steer tube.







and finally at LBS.

I hope this helps.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Hello, that problem solved, so I went 1st ride!!




















It has monster traction tires but super nimble! incredible (descend)trail bike!
After a long time of alloy hardtail, I was tired thighs and knees.

far from Japan.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

rfxc said:


> Sweet!! How is the clearance on the sides of the fork lowers, by the seals bulge etc?


There's plenty of clearance, the most limiting spot is definitely in the middle of the tread.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Must.not.EP.140mm.fork.for.three.month.old.bike.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

tsurun said:


> It's solved by shorten compression ring.
> View attachment 1037543
> 
> Anchor nut is dead!
> ...


what was the problem?


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

read here.
Trek 29+ coming - Page 39- Mtbr.com


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

B+ 5

Me likey


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

bonesetter2004 said:


> B+ 5
> 
> Me likey


I've run my rigid stache with 29x2.3" tires, and the bb was quite low... I have to believe it's REALLY low with b+! Of course, it's not that big of a deal in certain terrain.


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## Ranger Pride (Jan 21, 2005)

*Stache with 29er 2.3 tires*



rfxc said:


> I've run my rigid stache with 29x2.3" tires, and the bb was quite low... I have to believe it's REALLY low with b+! Of course, it's not that big of a deal in certain terrain.


Did you build up a separate wheel set to run the 2.3 tire? If so what hubs did you use?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> B+ 5
> 
> Me likey


What kind of chain stay protector is that? My oem one fell off after about 5 miles


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

Ranger Pride said:


> Did you build up a separate wheel set to run the 2.3 tire? If so what hubs did you use?


Yes, different wheels. I had boost roam 40 wheels, boost i9 hubs to lb38 carbon rims, and boost hope hubs with Easton arc 30 rims.

I also have a 2015 remedy 29 (boost rear) so I swap wheels between the two bikes.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

Winter made it to southern New Mexico, the Chronicles did okay with most of the air let out of them but about 5 inches of powder was tough to ride in.


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## temporoad (Jul 27, 2006)

mpolka said:


> but about 5 inches of powder was tough to ride in.


Just for information, I suspect you usually don't get much snow there, but that isn't powder snow. It wouldn't stick to signs, poles and your rims like that. If you can make a snowball it is called wet snow no matter how fluffy it is. Tough to ride in as there is a lot of weight to the snow with the high water content. Enjoy it while you have it.

best of the new year


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## floorguy724 (Apr 20, 2004)

I'm riding a Stache 5 right now. It's been converted to tubeless and single speed. This thing weighs 23.75 lbs. and is an absolute rocket! I love the climbing of it but it rides a little rough for me. I'm currently running 10psi front and rear but don't want to go any lower since I'm 215lbs ready to ride. 









With all that being said, I'm just starting a Surly Krampus build as a Christmas present to myself. It will also be built up SS but will be all steel which I think would ride a little better given my weight? However it will have carbon rims laced to hope pro 2's, Ti bars, and Thomson bits.

I hope to have it built up by the end of January and will sell off whichever one I like the least. We shall see....

Sent from my Samsung Tablet


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

rfxc said:


> I've run my rigid stache with 29x2.3" tires, and the bb was quite low... I have to believe it's REALLY low with b+! Of course, it's not that big of a deal in certain terrain.


BB has certainly lowered - I'll have to measure the height as it is now

Sure makes for a planted ride


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

obs08 said:


> What kind of chain stay protector is that? My oem one fell off after about 5 miles


CS protector is a fabric wrap around (Renthal)

Seems to work fine


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Here's my obligatory riding in the snow picture. I went when it was fresh too but didn't take a picture. The trick is to get some sucker who bought a full fatty to go first .

It did OK with some drifts up to about a foot. It did about like you'd expect, better than a normal tire but it isn't a true fat tire.


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## Ranger Pride (Jan 21, 2005)

MrIcky said:


> Here's my obligatory riding in the snow picture. I went when it was fresh too but didn't take a picture. The trick is to get some sucker who bought a full fatty to go first .
> 
> It did OK with some drifts up to about a foot. It did about like you'd expect, better than a normal tire but it isn't a true fat tire.


Is it set up tubeless? I have the Stache 7 also and need to get it set up tubeless. Looking forward to trying it in the snow.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

Yes, it's tubeless.


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## GMONEY80 (Jun 18, 2006)

Needless to say I have upgraded/changed a bunch of things. Since the below picture i have added a full 1x11 xt group and a ks lev integra post.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)

Sick!


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

rfxc said:


> I've run my rigid stache with 29x2.3" tires, and the bb was quite low... I have to believe it's REALLY low with b+! Of course, it's not that big of a deal in certain terrain.


Measured BB height it's coming in at 11 3/4" which by my reckoning is 13mm lower than OE 29+


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Measured BB height it's coming in at 11 3/4" which by my reckoning is 13mm lower than OE 29+


That's where my 27+ stache sits. About hAlf inch lower but haven't noticed any negatives yet


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

obs08 said:


> That's where my 27+ stache sits. About hAlf inch lower but haven't noticed any negatives yet


Yeah, me too - I've only noticed lots of positives :thumbsup:


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

tsurun said:


> Hello, that problem solved, so I went 1st ride!!
> View attachment 1037547
> View attachment 1037548
> 
> ...


Can you show a picture of a head on shot to show clearance of the tire in the fox fork arch?


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

forgiven_nick said:


> Can you show a picture of a head on shot to show clearance of the tire in the fox fork arch?


happy new year, mtbr!

It's mounted on previous frame but same fork(2012 34 talas) and wheel&tire.
When it puts 30psi(2bar) tire rubs fork arch, and it easily stacks fallen leaves. Usually I go with 10PSI.








\Ride on/


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Any advice on cog for going SS. Is there a particular spec cog I need to run. I'm not talking teeth number if that makes sense.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

SMP1971 said:


> Any advice on cog for going SS. Is there a particular spec cog I need to run. I'm not talking teeth number if that makes sense.


i think most of the cog kits comes with spacers so you can move the position of the cog left and right to make a nice chainline


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

SMP1971 said:


> Any advice on cog for going SS. Is there a particular spec cog I need to run. I'm not talking teeth number if that makes sense.


Depends on which bike you have. The 5 will take any splined Shimano style cog. I like Surly. They are inexpensive and durable. Drivetrain | Parts and Accessories | Surly Bikes

If you have a 7 or a 9 you will need a new freehub body. As far as I know there are no single speed cogs that work with the XD freehub. This is part of the reason I haven't converted my 7 to single speed yet.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)




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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

Captain_America1976 said:


> Depends on which bike you have. The 5 will take any splined Shimano style cog. I like Surly. They are inexpensive and durable. Drivetrain | Parts and Accessories | Surly Bikes
> 
> If you have a 7 or a 9 you will need a new freehub body. As far as I know there are no single speed cogs that work with the XD freehub. This is part of the reason I haven't converted my 7 to single speed yet.


Thank you. I have the 7 also so I guess I'm not going to convert to SS.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)

I'm in KC also.. Shred KC!


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

Those with tubes and Chupacabras, what is the lowest pressure you've run with success?

I got a snake bite in the front with a 5mm tear that Stan's couldn't seal. Figured I'd put a boot on the tire and run it with a tube in the rear. So much tread left...

Oh... Loving all the pics of the Stache 5. Keep them coming!


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

SMP1971 said:


> Thank you. I have the 7 also so I guess I'm not going to convert to SS.


Go to your trek dealer and order part #435903, it's the shimano freehub body for the duster boost rear hub. MSRP for it is $39.99


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I would assume the 5 has the same hub with the 10spd driver?
So is it a shimano Duster hub? Can't find it online.
Is it the same as a deore/slx or xt hub?


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

mpolka said:


> Go to your trek dealer and order part #435903, it's the shimano freehub body for the duster boost rear hub. MSRP for it is $39.99


I just built a new set of carbon hoops with Hope hubs. A new freehub for me will be closer to $100


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Captain_America1976 said:


> I just built a new set of carbon hoops with Hope hubs. A new freehub for me will be closer to $100


Might as well get the steel freehub right away, it's about the same price.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

yamaha46 said:


> I would assume the 5 has the same hub with the 10spd driver?
> So is it a shimano Duster hub? Can't find it online.
> Is it the same as a deore/slx or xt hub?


They both use the duster compatible freehub body, the 7 comes with the actual duster hub, the 5 has a bontrager approved hub. The biggest difference between them is the duster is a 6 bolt brake and the other is a centerlock. You'll need the bontrager specific part, it's not compatible with a shimano brand freehub body. Unfortunately trek isn't selling service parts through their online store.


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## twenty6black (Jan 12, 2009)

floorguy724 said:


> I'm riding a Stache 5 right now. It's been converted to tubeless and single speed. This thing weighs 23.75 lbs. and is an absolute rocket! I love the climbing of it but it rides a little rough for me. I'm currently running 10psi front and rear but don't want to go any lower since I'm 215lbs ready to ride.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I did the same thing...converted to Single Speed right off the bat!

Stock, my medium weighed 25lb 12oz at the shop the day I bought it. Since then I have swapped: xtr brakes, XX1 crankset with 32T (rear 21T), 700mm bar Turvativ foam grip, XTR 180mm disk up front, 160mm in the rear. Tubeless setup was too easy, rims already taped and came with Stems (Stan's i think). One and a bit Stan's sealant and a floor pump. MEC 31.6 carbon post - check these new ones they are carbon one piece with some setback, approved. Specialized Roman saddle. My guess with pedals (XTR) it is about 22lbs and 12oz....removing the 10sp cassette and the rear deraile make the rear end wonderful light!

Tubes were 400g !!! thats 800g removed in 10mins. (add 100g worth of sealant 

This STACHE 5 is my go to FALL and WINTER riding bike.

All I can say is, on dirt, on snow, climbing or decending - this is a FUN BIKE. Thanks to TREK for making it SS compatable. I heart SS.

cheers all


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## rushman3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I think I found my next SS....thanks for posting your SS conversions.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

How are the sliding dropouts for single speed?

Theres 15cm of range in them but with the 29+ tyres you can't use all of that.
Looks like you can only use half of that 15cm and then you have clearance issues.
How did you find it for setting up your single speed and chain tension?

Also how do you find your gearing set up for climbs/flat/downhill?


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> How are the sliding dropouts for single speed?
> 
> Theres 15cm of range in them but with the 29+ tyres you can't use all of that.
> Looks like you can only use half of that 15cm and then you have clearance issues.
> ...


You can use more than half. I'm almost using all the adjustment.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

30,5mm BB height.


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)




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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

27.5?
Looks good.

Hows it riding? 27 vs 29?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Thanks for the pic. 
I'd be a bit worried of getting stones/sticks/mud stuck in there with only that gap though.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> Thanks for the pic.
> I'd be a bit worried of getting stones/sticks/mud stuck in there with only that gap though.


I've never had anything get stuck.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

You might regret that CS length when you come to sell and see all the scratches


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

Yes guess it depend on your riding conditions a bit.
Might be worth putting some heli tape behind the seatpost though.


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> You might regret that CS length when you come to sell and see all the scratches


Clear-bra


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

jdcatnau said:


> Clear-bra


 Cool

As you like 'em short have you considered going 27+ ?

I have on my 5 and it's a whole heap of fun


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

bonesetter2004 said:


> Cool
> 
> As you like 'em short have you considered going 27+ ?
> 
> I have on my 5 and it's a whole heap of fun


I've thought about it only because of the lack of tire choices. I know the pics don't show it but I do have some rocky trails in my area. If I went 27.5+ if be afraid of smacking my cranks or BB and really doing damage.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

BB gets lowered 13mm

Don't know if this too much for you?

Perhaps you might even be better sticking with the bigger dia as you are in chunk?


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## HEMIjer (Jul 17, 2008)

*Maiden Voyage (for me at least)*

My 7 size 17.5 weighed 31 pounds setup with the small frame bag that had spare tube, pump, multi-tool, and tire lever (I didn't weight without). lt also includes pedals and water bottle cage. Likely look for a full size frame bag at some point. Only one tire was setup tubeless since I only had one spare valve laying around, setup super easy though with 6oz stans and compressor. I bought used and feel I got a great deal.

I do need to slightly lower bars maybe slightly longer stem and continue to adjust tire pressure, ran 15 front 17 rear to start, way too much especially in rear. I was surprised fork seem to work so well I weigh around 175 geared up and ran 45 psi in fork and that seemed good.

Has anyone else put a longer stem on do you think it slowed down the steering too much with these big tires?


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## HEMIjer (Jul 17, 2008)

View attachment 1041822


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

jdcatnau said:


> I've thought about it only because of the lack of tire choices. I know the pics don't show it but I do have some rocky trails in my area. If I went 27.5+ if be afraid of smacking my cranks or BB and really doing damage.


im 27+ and havent had an BB issues yet. its really no lower than it is when sagged on a full sus


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

Why did those who swapped to 27.5+ do it? Because you can? I think you take away from the stache going away from 29+.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

HEMIjer said:


> Has anyone else put a longer stem on do you think it slowed down the steering too much with these big tires?


I started with a 70mm stem, and worked may way down to a 40mm stem in 10mm increments, using a 780mm bar. The 40mm stem brought the steering to life. Everything else was sluggish...


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

jdcatnau said:


> Why did those who swapped to 27.5+ do it? Because you can? I think you take away from the stache going away from 29+.


because its more of a fun trail bike now than an xc bike, and it was my plan all along


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

AaronJobe said:


> I'm in KC also.. Shred KC!


I think I've ridden with you a time or two. Landahl ride with two stache riders this Sunday 8am.


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

I have an opportunity to purchase a barely used (two rides) Stache 9 wheel set. I have the 7 currently. I understand the DT Swiss hub is superior and I believe the rims are exactly the same. I'm also aware that the DT Swiss hub ion the 9 can be upgraded for around $100 to increase the engagements. My current7 rear wheel is slightly out of true but still has plenty of life left in it.

At $350 for the wheel set would you consider this a good deal?


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

Yes...with Trek PN 436413 you can get 54 tooth star ratchets that change your normal 16 point engagement to 54. I have them on my stache 9....love them. I am, though, trying to figure out if I want to either build a new wheelset or just rebuild the set I have with the Light-Bicycle 50mm rims. The total weight reduction just by going to those rims would be around 3/4lbs. Dang rims are $210 each plus shipping puts me at $500 before even doing anything else....ugh...hate these first world problems!


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## SMP1971 (Jan 20, 2012)

oclvframe said:


> Yes...with Trek PN 436413 you can get 54 tooth star ratchets that change your normal 16 point engagement to 54. I have them on my stache 9....love them. I am, though, trying to figure out if I want to either build a new wheelset or just rebuild the set I have with the Light-Bicycle 50mm rims. The total weight reduction just by going to those rims would be around 3/4lbs. Dang rims are $210 each plus shipping puts me at $500 before even doing anything else....ugh...hate these first world problems!


Do you think $350 for a set of the Stache 9 wheels is a good deal. They currently have the original 16 point engagement ratchets.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Yes. By comparison I paid $300 for a DT350r/E13f hubs laced to Stans Flows Ex 275 and so far they have been straight and true and I expect will remain so throughout their life. Just yesterday I got a $250 set of DT Swiss X1700 28h wheels for my wife. I could've gotten cheaper wheels, but I trust the DT star ratchet system.

I see wheels as an investment, hence why I hate the idea of buying a fat bike with very specific wheels/hubs. I like to be able to be able to reuse hubs with different rims and bikes later down the road. Boost 110/148 has impacted that ability, but I'm confident that adapters will at least allow me to put some miles on a Boost frame with my current wheels until the time comes to upgrade hubs.


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

SMP1971 said:


> Do you think $350 for a set of the Stache 9 wheels is a good deal. They currently have the original 16 point engagement ratchets.


I agree with SMP1971...for $350 they're a good deal. I've been talking to Richard Craig at ProWheelBuilder.com about either rebuilding my wheels using a carbon rim (keeping the investment in the hub) or just a whole new wheelset, but again with DT Swiss 350s because I too feel those are a pretty good bang for the buck. They're even better when you use the 54 tooth star ratchets!!!!!

-r


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

Stache 9 19.5'', Bowie Fork, SS.... 22.88lbs


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## GMONEY80 (Jun 18, 2006)

has anyone changed out the rear thru axle for something different than the stock bontrager one? like a dt swiss or maxle? that the only part on my stashe i dont like


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

GMONEY80 said:


> has anyone changed out the rear thru axle for something different than the stock bontrager one? like a dt swiss or maxle? that the only part on my stashe i dont like


I hate it too, but the fork QR bugs me more... The only one I've found is a rear bolt-on by Robert Axle Project... I have their hitch axle for my Farley and it has been great! Might try their boost hitch axle at some point...


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

Fox makes their Kabolt that will work for he fork. Industry Nine has their Matchstick also that they make in 148 I believe, however not yet available.


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## mpolka (Mar 8, 2013)

GMONEY80 said:


> has anyone changed out the rear thru axle for something different than the stock bontrager one? like a dt swiss or maxle? that the only part on my stashe i dont like


Rockshox makes one that fits, I tested it out at work today. I'd been thinking of upgrading mine because the bontrager ones are crap and we happened to have a brand new Deadwood in that comes with the maxle. I'll be ordering one for my Stache soon.
The part description: 
Maxle Ultimate Rear MTB Boost, 12x148mm: Length 180mm, Thread Length 20mm, Thread Pitch M12x1.75, Black


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

RaleighX said:


> Stache 9 19.5'', Bowie Fork, SS.... 22.88lbs


Great looking bike! What wheels/rims are those?


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

rfxc said:


> Great looking bike! What wheels/rims are those?


Sun Ringle Complete wheet set, so.... Mulefut hoops, Wheelsmith DB spokes, brass nipples, and Sun Ringle SRC alloy sealed bearing hubs, 10deg engagement


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

RaleighX said:


> Sun Ringle Complete wheet set, so.... Mulefut hoops, Wheelsmith DB spokes, brass nipples, and Sun Ringle SRC alloy sealed bearing hubs, 10deg engagement


Tubeless? Nicely done


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

rfxc said:


> Tubeless? Nicely done


yes, wouldn't have it any other way


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

RaleighX said:


> Sun Ringle Complete wheet set, so.... Mulefut hoops, Wheelsmith DB spokes, brass nipples, and Sun Ringle SRC alloy sealed bearing hubs, 10deg engagement


hey what do you know about src hubs? mainly do you know how many POE? i have a set on a 27.5+ wheelset. they sound killer, just always wondered about POE. emailed SR and they didnt have an answer for mr


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

RaleighX said:


> Fox makes their Kabolt that will work for he fork.


Nice piece, but doubt it works with Stache 5 rigid fork.

I'll have to try that Maxle in the rear. Good find!


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

obs08 said:


> hey what do you know about src hubs? Mainly do you know how many poe? I have a set on a 27.5+ wheelset. They sound killer, just always wondered about poe. Emailed sr and they didnt have an answer for mr


poe?


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## tadraper (Apr 14, 2010)

RaleighX said:


> poe?


Points of engagement


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

Thrawn said:


> Nice piece, but doubt it works with Stache 5 rigid fork.
> 
> I'll have to try that Maxle in the rear. Good find!


It will.....Stock Fox Thru Axle works... picture from my '15 Superfly SS (same Bowie fork)


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## GMONEY80 (Jun 18, 2006)

thanks a ton everyone, i want to upgrade the front and rear axles and this will work perfectly


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

tadraper said:


> Points of engagement


3 pawl hub, 10 degrees of engagement, 360/10= 36 points.....


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)




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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

oclvframe said:


> I am trying to figure out if I want to either build a new wheelset or just rebuild the set I have with the Light-Bicycle 50mm rims. The total weight reduction just by going to those rims would be around 3/4lbs. Dang rims are $210 each plus shipping puts me at $500 before even doing anything else....ugh...hate these first world problems!


CB has a 35/30 rim that works out to $340/pr shipped. Easy to build. I've got 2 seasons without any problems. You can request rims at the lower end of the weight range.
Hookless all mountain carbon rim 35mm wide for 29er &27.5er mountain bike - carbon rim (hookless) - Carbonfan|Carbon Rim|Carbon Wheel|Carbon Bicycle|Carbon Frame|Carbon Bike Part|Mountain bike
They also have 40/35s for $44 more.
Imi both LB and CB rims are made by the same third party.


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## Team Honeybadger (Dec 15, 2011)

Floorguy, by any chance, did you weigh the Stache 5 before you converted to ss? Also, I will be very interested in your experience comparing the krampus and stache 5. I have been considering both bikes for the spring/summer rides. Fall and winter I love the fatbikes but this winter so far (NEPA - no real snow yet ) could be done with 29ers let alone 29 plus lol! Thx


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## RaleighX (Mar 30, 2011)

Team Honeybadger said:


> Floorguy, by any chance, did you weigh the Stache 5 before you converted to ss? Also, I will be very interested in your experience comparing the krampus and stache 5. I have been considering both bikes for the spring/summer rides. Fall and winter I love the fatbikes but this winter so far (NEPA - no real snow yet ) could be done with 29ers let alone 29 plus lol! Thx


My girlfriends 19.5'' Stache 5 weighs 26.00lbs bone stock, set up tubeless with heavy Shimano M520 pedals


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## floorguy724 (Apr 20, 2004)

Team Honeybadger said:


> Floorguy, by any chance, did you weigh the Stache 5 before you converted to ss? Also, I will be very interested in your experience comparing the krampus and stache 5. I have been considering both bikes for the spring/summer rides. Fall and winter I love the fatbikes but this winter so far (NEPA - no real snow yet ) could be done with 29ers let alone 29 plus lol! Thx


Yes. It weighed 26.6lbs (18.5") with factory pedals.

Just going tubeless and still geared without pedals, I was around 25.3 lbs.

Once converted to SS and tubeless, it came in at 23.75lbs without pedals.

With CB eggbeaters, SS, tubeless it was 24.36lbs.

The Krampus now setup SS and tubeless is right at 25lbs. So it will be a fair comparison imo. I only have 1 ride on the Krampus now, so I'll wait for a few more rides to give my opinions. Thanks.


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

The 5's are very lightweight bikes indeed

Their wheelsets are 'lighter than average' too


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

RaleighX said:


> It will.....Stock Fox Thru Axle works... picture from my '15 Superfly SS (same Bowie fork)


Oh my! That just opened so many options. Thanks!


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## jdcatnau (Feb 22, 2007)

yamaha46 said:


> View attachment 1043345


Yamaha, how much travel? How do you like the squish over the rigid?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

There the 120 travel magnum pro.
I love the bike like this. It's perfect, the fork is nice and stiff, suits the bike perfectly. I've not really started playing with the settings yet so I should be able to get it even better.

Rigid vs suspension is two different bikes.
The rigid feel's steeper & lower at the front. Very light though as the rigid is about 1.5kg lighter. Really good bike for mild trails & gravel roads.

With the longer slacker front suspension the bike is a monster truck, you can just ride through anything. So much grip. And the big wheels just carry so much momentum. I love this bike.

I will probably build up a cheap frame with the rigid Forks & spare parts I have for family rides.

I've ridden most bikes now, rigid, hard tail, fs, 27,29,fat etc... And the 29+ stache hard tail is the best by far.
It does everything I want. It manages to be both the most stable yet the most agile bike at the same time. It is just so much fun.
Only thing I'd like to try is a deeper tread front tyre for the winter.


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## Ranger Pride (Jan 21, 2005)

Love my Stache 7 but I'm picking up a Farley and having a 29+ wheel set built so I will have 2 bikes in one. The Stache 7 will go on the chopping block after a very short marriage. It was a good test though.


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## oclvframe (Dec 8, 2007)

Ranger Pride said:


> Love my Stache 7 but I'm picking up a Farley and having a 29+ wheel set built so I will have 2 bikes in one. The Stache 7 will go on the chopping block after a very short marriage. It was a good test though.


Blasphemy!!! Stache rüls!!!!


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I've tried most bikes but i've only had a short ride on the full fat so need to try some more.
If you want a full fat then having a 29+ wheel set to swap out makes sense.

I'd like to see the actual difference in ride from a stache to a farley 29+. Use my stache at 420 chainstay so if using the farley at 440 then I think that would be the main difference.
Head angle would be similar with the same fork.
Ranger let us know how it rides compared to the stache.


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## Ranger Pride (Jan 21, 2005)

oclvframe said:


> Blasphemy!!! Stache rüls!!!!


I know! I know! Can't believe I even said it but I am looking at the flexibility of wheel sizes on the bike as my deciding factory. I still have love for the Farley.


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

GMONEY80 said:


> has anyone changed out the rear thru axle for something different than the stock bontrager one? like a dt swiss or maxle? that the only part on my stashe i dont like


As RaleighX said, the Fox Kbolt works (or their 15mm QR) and a Boost Maxle would work in the rear. DT makes some thru axles for Trek (our Factory Team) but not sure if Trek sells them. There is a fine thread and course thread thru axles, you will need the course which is the 12 x1.75 on the rear.

We use the Kbolts on the forks and Italian company FRM thru blots on the rear. Very nice quality and lightweight. Untitled Document

I finally got a Stache frame and have been building if up from my scrap pile of parts this week. Thank you all for the ideas on your builds. Keeping mine rigid for the moment. I'll post some pics when it is done. That Trek logo is actually red like the rest, but looks pink in the picture?


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## Deep Thought (Sep 3, 2012)

Whatever, Matt. You're probably building that bike with pink graphics to match that pink prom gown you like to prance around in. 

Not that there's anything wrong with that.


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

haha, well, my Bonty Line+ rims have pink and purple graphics, so will match my gown just fine!

:crazy::cornut:


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

How about some more info on those new Fox "Boost" forks you guys are running, Matto.

Please?


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

Whatever are you talking about?  We ran Boost iRD forks all 2015 :thumbsup:


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I mean the forks all over Dan, Sergio, and Kohei's IG accounts...


__
http://instagr.am/p/BBJtAIpBuwA/

With the all-black uppers and the high sculpter (lower) lowers.


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## juan_speeder (May 11, 2008)

Le Duke said:


> I mean the forks all over Dan, Sergio, and Kohei's IG accounts...
> 
> 
> __
> ...


That's not even blurry :/

375 Ranger 91-93. You?


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

Even blurred out, the black stanchions on a Fox 32 are apparent (everything high end from Fox comes with Kashima). You can see the inside of the bottom part of the lowers is more or less gone, too. 

1-87 IN at Fort Drum most recently. A few of our old CDRs have been 75th BN and RGT commanders. A few CSMs, too, IIRC. 

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

I converted my Stache 7 to a SS.. Recently changed out the rear wheel because of skipping issues. For the initial conversion, we removed the XD drive freehub and switched it out for a Shimano freehub. The Shimano freehub we installed required a specific spacer to even work with the axle and hub body. Found the correct spacer and all seemed to be cool....until I put some decent torque to the pedals. I tried changing out the rear cog to a 1 tooth larger (Surly) to lessen some of the torque stress on climbs. That helped, but still had skipping. Had some SS riders check the chain tightness and alignment. They said everything looked good.
I purchased a second Mulefut 50 with a Shimano/Shimano hub/freehub setup. Worlds better, but had a skip this last weekend. I'm trying a 9 speed chain for next ride to see if that changes anything. I'm hoping that maybe I had a chain issue and not a freehub "pawl" issue.
I'm still loving the 7 regardless! That thing hauls..


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## alixta (Dec 27, 2006)

rdbandkab said:


> I converted my Stache 7 to a SS.. Recently changed out the rear wheel because of skipping issues. For the initial conversion, we removed the XD drive freehub and switched it out for a Shimano freehub. The Shimano freehub we installed required a specific spacer to even work with the axle and hub body. Found the correct spacer and all seemed to be cool....until I put some decent torque to the pedals. I tried changing out the rear cog to a 1 tooth larger (Surly) to lessen some of the torque stress on climbs. That helped, but still had skipping. ......
> View attachment 1047144


Wild guess, but I've had skipping issues with a surly cog before. Changed it out for another brand with same tooth count & issues went away.

Heaps of people run then no issues so no idea what the problem was with my combo/setup.


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

I had an aluminum Wolf Tooth 19t(smaller cog) on before the Surly 20t.... It was quicker to skip because it required more torque in some situations. _*Steep switchbacks._


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## Deep Thought (Sep 3, 2012)

mattomoto said:


> haha, well, my Bonty Line+ rims have pink and purple graphics, so will match my gown just fine!
> 
> :crazy::cornut:


That is going to be stunning!


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

Does the 7 only come in that purple? think about buying one, but the purple kind of kills it.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

jammin said:


> Does the 7 only come in that purple? think about buying one, but the purple kind of kills it.


Yep, purple only for the 7. I'll admit I'm not keen on it either but the 9 is just too big a price jump for me to justify and I doubt the colour will bother me much in reality.

John


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

You guys are nutz, that purple is pretty cool in the flesh.


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

*Don't call her Fat! She's just a little Chubby... +Sized*

My build couldn't have come at a better time. Just received 15" of white stuff to play in. I'll let the real Fatties pack some lines in today and go out tomorrow since she is not such a big girl.

I used many old parts I had on an old Superfly bike I had plus some new Bontrager Line+ 44mm wheels on DT hubs. Will try it rigid for a while and see how it goes, but have a Fox 120mm fork for it if I want to get really rowdy on her.

Weight came in a feathery 22.44 lbs with 11spd XX1 which was pretty surprising to me. Not2bad


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

litespeedaddict said:


> You guys are nutz, that purple is pretty cool in the flesh.


I would agree. I'm not a real fan of purple, but I would have one of these in purple. Would really look sweet with the Bontrager Line+ wheels.

Anyone know what their stock Stache 9 wheels weigh in at? Just wondering what the Line+ wheels are in comparison since they have the same hubs.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I weighed my weels and can't remember the exact numbers, but the whole set was only about 200g heavier than the listed weight of the line plus wheels.


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

Thanks briantortilla. My Lines came in right at 2000g for the pair without tape. Pretty good and seems to be a pretty bomb proof wheel. I did ride some 50mm carbon rimmed/DT 240 based wheels earlier in the year that were dam light too. Might have to visit that option if I start riding the Stache more. I have done a couple long XC days with a couple of our Engineers that were on Stache's. Amazing how fast they were going over the rough stuff and I was on a Top Fuel! Cool bikes.


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

jammin said:


> Does the 7 only come in that purple? think about buying one, but the purple kind of kills it.


It looks better in person. I wasn't a big fan until I saw it in person.


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

Thx. for the Purple info guys, Still trying to decide on this or the C-dale beat of the east 27.5. just getting back into mountain biking, always rode full susp. mostly . i want a hardtail with a little plusher ride.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

mattomoto said:


> My build couldn't have come at a better time. Just received 15" of white stuff to play in. I'll let the real Fatties pack some lines in today and go out tomorrow since she is not such a big girl.


Cool build... Would love to hear how she does in the snow...


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

briantortilla said:


> I weighed my weels and can't remember the exact numbers, but the whole set was only about 200g heavier than the listed weight of the line plus wheels.


Taped for tubeless or raw?


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

Raw, I think. The tubless tape that come on the rims weigh nearly nothing anyways. Tubless on the mulefuts is way too much work besides. Gorilla tape is the only reliable method that works for me, and I found that using a normal 29er tube gave me almost the same weight savings as tubeless.


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## HEMIjer (Jul 17, 2008)

I bought used so when I found the 7 at a great price I did not hesitate because of the color, but ended up actually liking it.

The mulefats set up really easily for me tubeless, might be because the taped was set really well since the previous owner ran tubes. I did have one spot where sealant leaked through the tape and rim cutouts but nothing stans did not take care of within a minute (ok maybe 2 it was quick though). Overall I would say the Mulefats with Chuppacabra's have setup easier than Stans's Archs or I9 Wheels I have used In the past (mainly with Schwalbe SS or Maxxis EXO tires).


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## stlburner (Dec 20, 2004)

What did I miss? Is this a carbon Stache 29+ frame?


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## TuTone T (Dec 12, 2012)

You talking about Mattemoto's frame? Could be new but looks welded to me.


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## stlburner (Dec 20, 2004)

I am talking about mattomoto's frame. The lack of logos/stickers/head badge and the shiny black color has me curious. My alum Stache frame is matte black.


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

stlburner said:


> What did I miss? Is this a carbon Stache 29+ frame?





TuTone T said:


> You talking about Mattemoto's frame? Could be new but looks welded to me.





stlburner said:


> I am talking about mattomoto's frame. The lack of logos/stickers/head badge and the shiny black color has me curious. My alum Stache frame is matte black.


Yes, correct, just an alloy frame same as all of yours. A few of us at Trek ordered frame/fork only and they came black gloss no decals. Our paint department is so busy, this was a good option plus I just add and change stickers to my liking from one of our sponsors Custom Stickers, Decals and More at Victory Circle Graphix. I have had a few frames like this over the years and it's fun to mix it up kinda like the old original Bontrager frames were if any of you remember that or did I just date myself? :lol:


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

stlburner said:


> What did I miss? Is this a carbon Stache 29+ frame?


Pretty easy to spot the welds in the photos


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

Thrawn said:


> Cool build... Would love to hear how she does in the snow...


Thanks! Came out pretty nice for sure.

I could not resist temptation of a new bike and snow on the ground yesterday and took her out.
First off, It is not a really fatbike as many of you have found. No problem on packed snow and ice, in fact, super fun and way better than a standard mtb. However, in virgin deep snow, we have 15-18" on the ground, it was not good at all. Super hard to keep the momentum up and I could not keep a very good line through it. I'm new to this and am a good bike handler and strong Cat 1 racer, but I had a pretty impossible time through the deep stuff. I had my tires at 10 psi front, 12 rear. 
Tomorrow I am meeting up with a friend and we are going snow riding. She is on a true fat bike and we will be on trails that hopefully have had fatty traffic on them otherwise I will be sucking her wheel. haha. Going to give the rigid fork another ride, but may be putting my Fox 120 on it just to change the geometry on the front. We'll see.

Yesterday:


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

Got a call from my local bike shop to say my Stache has arrived (and seems to be the right one) so hopefully can pick it up tomorrow.

I may have missed this in the thread, is it possible to change to a Shimano XT shifter and derailleur whilst keeping the Sram 10-42 cassette?

John


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## mattomoto (Jan 12, 2006)

JohnMcL7 said:


> Got a call from my local bike shop to say my Stache has arrived (and seems to be the right one) so hopefully can pick it up tomorrow.
> 
> I may have missed this in the thread, is it possible to change to a Shimano XT shifter and derailleur whilst keeping the Sram 10-42 cassette?
> 
> John


Yes it is possible to do that. I do that on my personal xc bikes to get the 10/42 range.


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

Pulling the trigger tommarrow, Just need to decide 7 or 9 lol. the purple of the 7 is making me sway to spend more and get the 9.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

jammin said:


> Pulling the trigger tommarrow, Just need to decide 7 or 9 lol. the purple of the 7 is making me sway to spend more and get the 9.


I've got the 9 and highly recommend the upgrades if it's in your budget.


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## stlburner (Dec 20, 2004)

*The Welds*

Well your eye is much better than mine, or I just don't know what I'm looking for. Can you be more specific? I'd like to learn. What photo? What joints? How can you tell? Just by some sort of raised bump between the two tubes or something? Surely you can't actually see the ripples of the weld can you? Thanks.



the mayor said:


> Pretty easy to spot the welds in the photos


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## stlburner (Dec 20, 2004)

I see the welds now. You're right, pretty easy actually.



stlburner said:


> Well your eye is much better than mine, or I just don't know what I'm looking for. Can you be more specific? I'd like to learn. What photo? What joints? How can you tell? Just by some sort of raised bump between the two tubes or something? Surely you can't actually see the ripples of the weld can you? Thanks.


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## JohnMcL7 (Jul 26, 2013)

mattomoto said:


> Yes it is possible to do that. I do that on my personal xc bikes to get the 10/42 range.


Excellent, the price of an XT derailleur and shifter seems quite reasonable so I'm wondering if I should change it now and be able to sell the existing derailleur and shifter as unused. I've not used Sram shifters aside from on demo bikes but the design seems odd as the smaller front paddle only seems to go forward whereas on Shimano SLX and above it goes either way so you can push it back with your finger whereas on the Sram shifter you can only use your thumb with it?

John


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## trhoppe (Sep 3, 2008)

Figured this was as good of a place to ask as any. I haven't been able to find anything through searching. Guess my Google Fu ain't that great. 

Has anyone experimented with really wide rear 27.5 tires? There is that Bontrager Hodag 27.5x3.8, and a Fat B Nimble 26.5x3.5. Any idea if these sort of tires will squeeze in the back of a Stache? 

My fat bike just got stolen and instead of replacing it with another, I was thinking of a Stache with a 27.5x3.8 front and rear could fit the bill pretty well. Then could run my 29x3 dirt wizard/fat b nimble combo for rowdy trails, or just regular 29x2.35 IKONs for bikepacking. 

Thoughts?


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## darkhorse13 (Jun 20, 2011)

trhoppe said:


> Figured this was as good of a place to ask as any. I haven't been able to find anything through searching. Guess my Google Fu ain't that great.
> 
> Has anyone experimented with really wide rear 27.5 tires? There is that Bontrager Hodag 27.5x3.8, and a Fat B Nimble 26.5x3.5. Any idea if these sort of tires will squeeze in the back of a Stache?
> 
> ...


The Fat B Nimble 3.5 measures out closer to 2.8-3.0 on 50mm rims... should fit fine.


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## trhoppe (Sep 3, 2008)

Ahh ok, I didn't realize that it was so undersized. Kind of like my 29x3.0 that comes out to 2.7" on my 35mm rims. So will "actual 3.0" be more the limit for the Stache? Or will something in the 3.5" range in a 27.5 work?


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## darkhorse13 (Jun 20, 2011)

trhoppe said:


> Ahh ok, I didn't realize that it was so undersized. Kind of like my 29x3.0 that comes out to 2.7" on my 35mm rims. So will "actual 3.0" be more the limit for the Stache? Or will something in the 3.5" range in a 27.5 work?


Sorry I don't have a Stache and I would hate to give you incorrect info.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I think the spacings quite tight in the back.
So don't think it will take more than a 3.0 Chupacabra.
You might need to get a fat frame and a set of 3.0 wheels for it, if you want the option of bigger than 3.0.


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## trhoppe (Sep 3, 2008)

Hmm, so even in the 27.5" size with the wheel scooted back in the dropouts, there isn't the clearance for moar than 3.0"?


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I'll look at mine later to check the Clarence, but it's the width that's tight not the diameter.


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## trhoppe (Sep 3, 2008)

Thanks a lot, I appreciate it. I figured it would be the width for sure, but was hoping that by moving the sliders back and also having a smaller diameter tire, it would open up a bit more room for a fatter tire.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

the chainstay actually sweeps in tighter as you go back.
This picture is with th 29+ chupacabra all the way back in the sliders.
The 27+ slid forward would be in the same place.
Think even the 27+ would be a bit tight if you slid it back, looking at this.


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## yamaha46 (Jul 17, 2009)

I think it's tight because they wanted to keep a standard q factor cranks.
Thats the difference with fat frames. Wider q factor.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Unfortunately the only way I can foresee getting larger than 3.25 tires in any of the current Plus offerings is to go a wider BB. 

I've never seen a Gnarvester with the VTF 3.25 in the rear, and I've never seen the Fuse with that tire combo either. 

The Airborne Griffin might be an outlier in that regard as they tout possible space for a 3.5 wide tire. It does however ship from the factory with a 3.0" tire, and utilizes Press Fit GXP BB.


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## trhoppe (Sep 3, 2008)

Thanks for that top down shot. That sort of confirms it, that 3.25", or even a knobby 3.0 is about as wide as you can go. 

Guess maybe the Stache isn't quite for me and I might have to drop the coin and wait on a Waltworks.


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## juan_speeder (May 11, 2008)

Took my 5 out for a shakedown ride yesterday. It's bone stock except for some XT cranks with an AB oval ring, tubeless, and my saddle of choice. Man oh man, is that thing fun! The thing I like most in mountain biking is technical climbing (yeah, I'm an odd duck) and with this bike, for the first time every, the thing stopping me on stupid hard loose ledgy climbs is my fitness instead of traction (or that 32:36 low ). The thing rails our kitty litter over hardpack corners like nothing I've ever experienced too. 

6 stars!


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

Ordered a 7 today, should be here beginning of march. Wanted to order a 5 but they will list as not being available till mid May. Purple does look much better in person.


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

So now that i have my 7, what kind of bike racks are you guys using with the bigger tires? I just bought a 2016 colorado and don't want to drill holes in it at this point.


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## AaronJobe (Sep 20, 2009)

Kuat NV


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## Desert Diesel (Aug 9, 2014)

Who comes up with these colors? Trek needs to enlist the help of a focus group or something before they roll out more silly ass colors...


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

Need to get a seatpost clamp, Says the seatpost is 31.6mm, is that the clamp size also or would it be 31.8mm?


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

jammin said:


> Need to get a seatpost clamp, Says the seatpost is 31.6mm, is that the clamp size also or would it be 31.8mm?


34.5 mm to 35 mm clamp to fit a frame with 31.6 mm post.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

anyone on the fence about going 27.5, dont be. its pure awesomesauce


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## HEMIjer (Jul 17, 2008)

jammin said:


> So now that i have my 7, what kind of bike racks are you guys using with the bigger tires? I just bought a 2016 colorado and don't want to drill holes in it at this point.


1UpUSA racks work great with 3" tires. I use the roof top rack but the hitch rack is probably the most popular, best racks I have used, they stay looking new forever it seems.

https://www.1upusa.com/


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

jeffj said:


> 34.5 mm to 35 mm clamp to fit a frame with 31.6 mm post.


For this bike, you need a 36mm clamp. Just measure the seat tube diameter to verify.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

CannondaleF9 said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks they should have kept the normal Stache?


That was my first thought when I heard they were glomming onto the Stache name. Having owned the 2013 Stache 8, and really liking it, it made no sense to call it a Stache.

Call it something else for cryin-out-loud.

Leave the original Stache alone.

And then I got the chance to ride the Stache 9 29+.

I have only rode the Stache 8 once since last summer. That was a couple weeks ago, just to see if I really won't miss it. I won't. The Stache 8 pedals up a relatively smooth hill a little easier, and I will miss not having a 2x crankset on some rides that I do occasionally. Other than that, I'm not going to truly miss the Stache 8 enough to keep it. The Stache 9 covers most of the same needs (wants) for me, and mostly does it better.

A year ago, I thought the Stache 8 would be the cornerstone of my quiver for quite a while. It's for sale now.


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

> _"Call it something else for cryin-out-loud."_


I call mine "skipper"....on account of the freehub skipping I have since making it a SS.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

rdbandkab said:


> I call mine "skipper"....on account of the freehub skipping I have since making it a SS.


Welcome to my world. Due to my clydeness, I make skippers out of most common freehubs on 'regular sized' mountain bike wheels. All of my current mountain bikes have DT Swiss star ratchet freehubs. None of them are skippers.

I think this is one of those things that will take a bit of time to get right. Kind of like geometry, wheel builds, tire technology, and gearing did when 29ers really took hold. Seems like freehub issues seem to be more common with fat bikes and plus bikes.


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## TheKaiser (Feb 5, 2014)

obs08 said:


> View attachment 1051712
> 
> 
> anyone on the fence about going 27.5, dont be. its pure awesomesauce


Any reports on the pros/cons vs. the 29+ wheels? Also, did you happen to take any measurements on how much the 27.5+ dropped the BB? It looks like you are running WTB tires, but their + range can vary from an overbilled 2.6 to a true 3.0, so I am curious how much you reduced the radius.

Maybe I am a bit behind the times, but I just noticed that Trek now pitches this bike as being 29+/27.5+/29 now, whereas at launch it was billed as a dedicated 29+ platform as far as I could tell.


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

jeffj said:


> Welcome to my world. Due to my clydeness, I make skippers out of most common freehubs on 'regular sized' mountain bike wheels. All of my current mountain bikes have DT Swiss star ratchet freehubs. None of them are skippers.
> 
> I think this is one of those things that will take a bit of time to get right. Kind of like geometry, wheel builds, tire technology, and gearing did when 29ers really took hold. Seems like freehub issues seem to be more common with fat bikes and plus bikes.


I think the 3 pawl freehubs aren't going to work if heavily torqued... I actually purchased another wheel that was a different hub manufacturer (or maybe not....seems like everyone buys a hub and rebadges it as their own!), and it started skipping also. There goes over $300! It had a Shimano "3 pawl" freehub as well. Same skip. 
I'm waiting on a 6 pawl freehub to come in at the moment.... 
If the 6 pawl freehub skips, I will be looking seriously at a Carver Gnarvester. 
I'll order it with a DT hub spec'd wheel. And as their bikes do not require "boost" sized, they can probably get a hub easily. It seems as thought DT star ratchet style hub in the Boost size are hard to come by. 
It looks like Trek isn't willing to do an upgrade at this time. *My HiFi had hub issues, and Trek took care of me. I guess not this time.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

rdbandkab said:


> I think the 3 pawl freehubs aren't going to work if heavily torqued... I actually purchased another wheel that was a different hub manufacturer (or maybe not....seems like everyone buys a hub and rebadges it as their own!), and it started skipping also. There goes over $300! It had a Shimano "3 pawl" freehub as well. Same skip.
> I'm waiting on a 6 pawl freehub to come in at the moment....
> If the 6 pawl freehub skips, I will be looking seriously at a Carver Gnarvester.
> I'll order it with a DT hub spec'd wheel. And as their bikes do not require "boost" sized, they can probably get a hub easily. It seems as thought DT star ratchet style hub in the Boost size are hard to come by.
> It looks like Trek isn't willing to do an upgrade at this time. *My HiFi had hub issues, and Trek took care of me. I guess not this time.


According to my 'sources' (the QBP online catalog), the XD Driver 32h version of the DT Swiss 350 centerlock hub with 148 Boost spacing is due in around the middle of March.


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

So that's more $$$ for me to get it to work as a single speed. 
I'm not sure I'll be putting any more money into the project...


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

I have the stache 7 , Anybody else do tubeless on the stock wheels? Can't get mine to hold air, they deflate slow. I used stans valves with the stock rim tape that is suppose to be tubless ready, I used 3oz of stans. Should i try adding more? or will i need to get the stans rim strips?


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## TheKaiser (Feb 5, 2014)

jammin said:


> Anybody else do tubeless on the stock wheels? Can't get mine to hold air, they deflate slow.


It's not a very sexy answer but, if all else fails, good old fashioned detective work may help to answer that question. Try dunking in a tub of soapy water and looking for bubbles. If it is a rim strip or valve failure you should see bubbles at the valve stem or spoke holes. If it is simply the tire casing or tire/rim interface, then bubbles should be from the rim edge outward. If the leak down is reaaaaalllly slow though it can be such a small and slowly inflating bubble that it takes a lot of patience, but it usually pays off for me in the end.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

I had to add small layer of additional tape at the valve stem hole. Fixed my problem. Might be the same for you...


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## rain100 (Sep 12, 2014)

jammin said:


> I have the stache 7 , Anybody else do tubeless on the stock wheels? Can't get mine to hold air, they deflate slow. I used stans valves with the stock rim tape that is suppose to be tubless ready, I used 3oz of stans. Should i try adding more? or will i need to get the stans rim strips?


When I set up the mulefut rims for a friend with a Stache, the stock rimtape was applied terribly. I would recommend getting the Mulefut rimtape from your LBS, cleaning the rim, and reapplying the rimtape.


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## litespeedaddict (Feb 18, 2006)

Stock rim tape on the Mulefuts is hit or miss, though I think it works for most people. I had the same problem on one of my rims. Problem I encountered was the inside of the rim was a little "slick" and the tape just wouldn't grab it. I pulled everything off, wire brush on a high speed air drill to scuff it up, wiped with acetone, and used a little wider tape when I reapplied. It worked great.


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## HEMIjer (Jul 17, 2008)

I bought a 7 used that was ran tubed for a couple months prior to me setting up tubeless. I really think that helped the tape create a better seal. I did have a couple of the rim cutouts need the shake and dance to let stans help with but it was minor.

Note: I had a roll of wide gorilla tape ready to apply over any troublesome spots but didn't need it. I also used 5-6 oz of stans per tire on chupas, I use 3-4 oz on new 29x2.2 tire and 2oz when I refresh, so I would recommend more, it might not be your problem but will help possibly down the road. Also taking a soapy wet rag and running around the spots you need to check can help find where the leaks are, that will tell you for sure if it is the cutouts.


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## rdbandkab (Dec 31, 2010)

rdbandkab said:


> So that's more $$$ for me to get it to work as a single speed.
> I'm not sure I'll be putting any more money into the project...


Single speed project money going elsewhere.

The Stache 7 has been replaced with a Carver Gnarvester 29+. The Gnarvester runs perfectly as a single speed. No skipping as with the Stache 7 as a single speed.
Plus, no more bass boat jokes!


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I tried another attempt at tubeless with the mulefut rims with no success. I have tried the stock tape, normal gorilla tape, and clear gorilla tape multiple times but always end up with leaks! The largest leak is always at the join seam on the rim, and there is also air escaping from the cutouts in the rim. No air is ever coming from the spoke holes. Anyone have any ideas what I am doing wrong?


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

briantortilla said:


> I tried another attempt at tubeless with the mulefut rims with no success. I have tried the stock tape, normal gorilla tape, and clear gorilla tape multiple times but always end up with leaks! The largest leak is always at the join seam on the rim, and there is also air escaping from the cutouts in the rim. No air is ever coming from the spoke holes. Anyone have any ideas what I am doing wrong?


Have you sanded or at least taken the "shine" off the taped surfaces.
I've read of some success with some tougher sealing jobs around here somewhere.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

I have sanded the interior of the rims. I think that the leak is coming from the small vent holes along the bead seat area of the rim. There are 12 of them and a few are butted way up against the sidewall of the rim making them hard to seal with tape. These rims are poorly designed when it comes to tubeless. I have set up other wheels tubeless with absolutely no issues. Other than the tubeless issues thought, the rims are great. Lightweight and durable from what I have experienced.


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## tfinator (Apr 30, 2009)

rdbandkab said:


> Single speed project money going elsewhere.
> 
> The Stache 7 has been replaced with a Carver Gnarvester 29+. The Gnarvester runs perfectly as a single speed. No skipping as with the Stache 7 as a single speed.
> Plus, no more bass boat jokes!


I won't be running SS, but am looking at these two bikes and I'm interested in your thoughts


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

briantortilla said:


> I have sanded the interior of the rims. I think that the leak is coming from the small vent holes along the bead seat area of the rim. There are 12 of them and a few are butted way up against the sidewall of the rim making them hard to seal with tape. These rims are poorly designed when it comes to tubeless. I have set up other wheels tubeless with absolutely no issues. Other than the tubeless issues thought, the rims are great. Lightweight and durable from what I have experienced.


Check out my post in this link, it worked for me.
29+ Trek STache 9 Tubeless Problems - Page 2- Mtbr.com


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

Dropout33 said:


> Check out my post in this link, it worked for me.
> 29+ Trek STache 9 Tubeless Problems - Page 2- Mtbr.com


Thanks for the tip. I have seen that tape at lowes. I just think that a "tubeless ready" rim should be way easier to set up. I see that it took you 8 tries. I think I am on attempt number 5. Just seems a bit ridiculous to me. The stans wheels that I have set up are always good to go on the first attempt.


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## Mr Pink57 (Jul 30, 2009)

jammin said:


> So now that i have my 7, what kind of bike racks are you guys using with the bigger tires? I just bought a 2016 colorado and don't want to drill holes in it at this point.


I have a Saris Superclamp 4 that fits them just fine. I even emailed Saris about it and they said it would be no problem. The rack can fit a 4in fat tire bike no problem without the fat bike kit also.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

briantortilla said:


> Thanks for the tip. I have seen that tape at lowes. I just think that a "tubeless ready" rim should be way easier to set up. I see that it took you 8 tries. I think I am on attempt number 5. Just seems a bit ridiculous to me. The stans wheels that I have set up are always good to go on the first attempt.


That was for just the rear wheel. I need to tackle the front this weekend as I flatted the tube in there. Fingers crossed

Edit: Update I am 2 attempts in on making the front tubeless, still not good. I will keep trying.


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## briantortilla (Jun 18, 2009)

Here is my Stache 9 21.5 stuffed in my 2014 Mazda 3. It actually fits quite well with the dropper post down and the front passenger seat moved up a bit. The bike is stock except for a WTB Pure saddle, 50mm stem, and a Reverb Stealth. The KS post crapped out on me and KS said it was too bad.


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## jammin (Dec 9, 2005)

My 7, Had it for couple months, hope to be able to get the first ride on it tommarrow.
Just changed stem,bars,grips and thompson seat post clamp.


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## GMONEY80 (Jun 18, 2006)

Just got mine running again, also just got mt ks lev back from warranty and installed it last night ugh. Sorry about the indoor pic, weather is terrible and its a lazy day.


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## Chowder Head (Sep 26, 2010)

Very nice, what's she weigh with the dropper? How's the clearance on that fork?


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## hybris (Sep 30, 2015)

briantortilla said:


> I think that the leak is coming from the small vent holes along the bead seat area of the rim. There are 12 of them and a few are butted way up against the sidewall of the rim making them hard to seal with tape.


Had a similar issue with holes in the bead setting my fatties up tubeless. I used a hot melt glue gun to seal them. Carefully trim any hot glue off the bead area when it has hardened. Think the holes are there to let the anodising chemicals out of the rim cavity during finishing and they serve no useful purpose after that.


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## Dropout33 (Apr 9, 2007)

jammin said:


> My 7, Had it for couple months, hope to be able to get the first ride on it tommarrow.
> Just changed stem,bars,grips and thompson seat post clamp.


What bars, and stem did you go with? What are you doing with the stockers?


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## zeb (May 21, 2006)

Does anyone have had manufacturing issues with Stache frame yet?
How long it might take usually to get reply from Trek on frame warranty claims?
I started process ten days ago concidering headtube/IS headset and no news since pics were taken at LBS.

I have had 2 Trek 69ers, GF Rumblefish29 and 2 Farleys but never had any frame problems before ,so no idea what to expect from Trek.
History.My 3 frame failures ever 
1.Worst warranty expieriece was with Ellsworth (no warranty at all). 
2.Santa Cruz replaced cracked frame within 2 weeks=OK
3.Planet X was pain because of all time the case took .It has been my first and so far last carbon frame.


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

Normally there is a very fast turnaround time with Trek. Trek agreed to replace my old GF Paragon frame the same day the LBS sent the photos and a replacement frame was in hand the next week. Perhaps they are still trying to figure out exactly what happened with your frame. Why not call and see what the deal is?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

anyone know the weight of a frame only?


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## Epic_Dude (May 31, 2010)

obs08 said:


> anyone know the weight of a frame only?


10 seconds using a Google search, found on BikeRadar:

_"According to Ted Alsop, the Trek engineer who designed the Stache, a large frame with all associated hardware weighs 2,025g (4.46lb)."_


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Four weeks since the last post, guess everyone is happy with their Staches.

Broke a couple non-drive side spokes the other day so I think I'm going to upgrade to the Line Plus Boost wheelset and keep the repaired DT Swiss/Mulfut wheels as spares. Been looking on the Trek VIP site and I can't figure out which replacement freehub is the Xd driver for the Line Plus. What gives here?


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## teamplayr (Nov 22, 2005)

Just ordered a pair for mine and put them on/rode this w/e. They are nice and light. not that I mind but they are a lot louder than the stock wheels. Not a dealer so cant get in to VIP site but I know the shop I got them from ordered the XD driver for me so I know they have them, just dont know the part number


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## teamplayr (Nov 22, 2005)

Also, in case you didnt know, you will need new rotors as the wheels are 6-bolt. Wish they were centerlock but wasn't a deal breaker


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Got a few rides in with the line plus wheels. I thought the frame was flexing since I'd bought my bike in October, but it must have been just the stock wheels (rims).

Stiff, fast engagement, definitely an upgrade. Pricey at retail though, and the freewheel is indeed pretty loud. Not as bad as the high engagement Bontrager star drive parts in the DT 350 hubs though.

They came in at 2060 grams without tape, btw.


----------



## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

Slightly OT but does anyone know if the Bontrager front hub (that comes stock on the 5) can be easily converted to 9mm QR with end caps or something?

EDIT: Answer has been confirmed...negative.


----------



## Axel-MX (Apr 13, 2016)

Any rumours/news about the 2017 specs?


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

Axel-MX said:


> Any rumours/news about the 2017 specs?


https://www.12gobiking.nl/trek-stache-9-8-2017

There's some talk about it in the Trek forum in the Stache thread.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

yogiprophet said:


> https://www.12gobiking.nl/trek-stache-9-8-2017
> 
> There's some talk about it in the Trek forum in the Stache thread.


That's got some nice parts, but $5K for a trail hardtail?

Dunno if I'll be able to resist a frame and a F34 fork.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

richde said:


> That's got some nice parts, but $5K for a trail hardtail?
> 
> Dunno if I'll be able to resist a frame and a F34 fork.


How about $1000 less because that price includes VAT.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

eb1888 said:


> How about $1000 less because that price includes VAT.


With the carbon frame surcharge and carbon rims? Doubt it'll be just a few hundred more than the current 9. A carbon Farley frame on it's own is ~$2,100, double the price of a Stache frame.

Making the Stache was a huge gamble, making it carbon and even further upscale (since it's not quite a bargain in the first place) is an even bigger one. I hope it works out and can't wait for the raw frame to become available, but that doesn't change anything.

Retail on a carbon Farley is $4,800 with a rigid fork and pretty similar parts, expect the Stache to be more.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

From another post-

9.6: $3000.00 USD
-OCLV Frame
-Rock Shox Yari RL 120mm Fork
-Bontrager Hubs/ Sun Duroc 50 wheelset
-SRAM GX Drivetrain
-KS e30 dropper post
-SRAM Guide R brakeset

9.8: $4700 USD
-OCLV Frame
-Rock Shox Pike RC 120mm Fork
-Bontrager Line Pro 40 OCLV Wheelset
-SRAM X1 drivetrain
-Bontrager Dropper Line 125 Dropper Post
-SRAM Guide RS brakeset 

So with reasonable negotiating and a 60% no refund deposit a 9.8 will be about $4k and 2500 for a 9.6.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

eb1888 said:


> From another post-
> 
> 9.6: $3000.00 USD
> -OCLV Frame
> ...


Just checked, and those prices are correct. It's a very far cry from $5K minus the 17% VAT.

It's nice to believe that an LBS would be willing to forego almost half of their profit margin to the general public, but it's not really realistic. If you're getting that sort of discount, you're either a very special friend, or they make it from you in other ways...like buying a new bike every year, and letting you eat the losses on your old bike.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

I spoke with 6 shop managers to find a couple who would work with me to get a deal done. So it is dependent on your negotiating skills and patience in finding a mtb nerd rider manager.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

How did this: 


eb1888 said:


> How about $1000 less because that price includes VAT.


Lead to this:


eb1888 said:


> I spoke with 6 shop managers to find a couple who would work with me to get a deal done. So it is dependent on your negotiating skills and patience in finding a mtb nerd rider manager.


Sure you did, good for you, point being that retail is far in excess of your horrible VAT estimation, which is 17%, not 25%.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

Who cares what an 'estimate' is now that we have the suggested retail price in the US.
And the likely out the door price for good negotiators.
You're a pessimist and I'm an optimist, that's all.
You whine.
I look for a solution and execute it.

"In Denmark, VAT is generally applied at one rate, and with few exceptions is not split into two or more rates as in other countries (e.g. Germany), where reduced rates apply to essential goods such as foodstuffs. The current standard rate of VAT in Denmark is 25%."
Taxation in Denmark - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

My solution is EP. 

I'm just pointing out the ridiculousness of your price guestimate and your continued assertion that people can easily convince a dealer to forego almost half of their profit. I can't wait to see photos of yours come September.

.nl is The Netherlands, btw. Certainly, and seemingly obviously, not Denmark.


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

Easy is in the estimate of the doer. Easy for me with a positive attitude may be a f**in pain for a you with your negative outlook. Things often seem too difficult when you don't do them.
VAT is 21% in the Netherlands which on 4,499 euros is $1039.26, or around $1000, seemingly obviously what I estimated.
Getting past this, I agree that a frame build will be the best option....with a discount on the frame for me, of course.
And there you see my positive attitude.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Those of you who've converted to a non-boost suspension fork - what did you choose and why?


----------



## jpc111 (Jun 30, 2004)

Update

I bought my Stache 7 this time last year. I have loved the bike but have suffered with a creak that couldn't be solved with seat post clamp torque, dry vs grease vs carbon prep on the seat post and switching out seats. I also started to experience the problem with the Avid brakes where the free play in the levers goes away when the bike sits in the sun and the brakes warm up.

The good news, a new blue 2017 warranty frame showed up today at the shop and new brakes will be in next week. I will miss the purple frame, but the new blue one looks cool also.

Shout out to Mike Jones at Cycle and Fitness in St Joe Michigan for pursuing these fixes!


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## WrenchP (Aug 29, 2013)

My 17' Stache has level tl brakes. I wonder if they fixed the problems from the old model brakes. Does anyone have any input on that, or is it a "wait to see if you have any problems" game?


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## adaycj (Sep 30, 2009)

Personally if I still owned anything with SRAM brakes I would park it in the hot sun for an hour or two and then go for a ride. That should uncover the worst of the latest round of problems with SRAM brakes without putting a ride day at risk.


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## TheKaiser (Feb 5, 2014)

Drumlin roll said:


> The standover is measured at the midpoint of the top tube.
> 
> The 17.5", 19.5", and 21.5" have the same top tube location. The 2 larger sizes have a brace to the seat tube. Due to the slope, the longer tubes will be a bit higher at the midpoint.
> 
> ...


This is an older post, but I just want to say a public thank you to Drumlin Roll for that thorough level of detail :thumbsup:. I searched for over an hour on a wide range of sites including Trek's website, trying to make sense of what the deal is with the measurements and seat cluster design, and this is the only place I have found the above info. This was brought about because there is a lot of mislabeling going on in the used Stache market, with people calling both braceless and braced seat tube frames 19.5", or simply "Large", when the braceless ones are apparently actually 18.5". Trek bears some of the blame here, because while it is nice to have 1" increment sizes, they label every frame with both a "virtual" and "actual" size, and on top of that they don't even use consistent terminology on their geo chart, instead calling the "virtual" measure "frame size number". With 2 different figures which overlap between sizes, and 2 sets of terminology, once someone pulls the sticker off I can't really blame them for forgetting the exact details.

Needless to say though, it can be difficult to figure out if a used model is really the size you desire without Drumlin Roll's awesome info.


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## ghetto (Apr 11, 2013)

jpc111 said:


> Update
> 
> I bought my Stache 7 this time last year. I have loved the bike but have suffered with a creak that couldn't be solved with seat post clamp torque, dry vs grease vs carbon prep on the seat post and switching out seats. I also started to experience the problem with the Avid brakes where the free play in the levers goes away when the bike sits in the sun and the brakes warm up.
> 
> The good news, a new blue 2017 warranty frame showed up today at the shop and new brakes will be in next week. I will miss the purple frame, but the new blue one looks cool also.


Interesting. I have this problem too. On what grounds did they decide a frame replacement was the fix? Thanks.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

TheKaiser said:


> This is an older post, but I just want to say a public thank you to Drumlin Roll for that thorough level of detail . I searched for over an hour on a wide range of sites including Trek's website, trying to make sense of what the deal is with the measurements and seat cluster design, and this is the only place I have found the above info. This was brought about because there is a lot of mislabeling going on in the used Stache market, with people calling both braceless and braced seat tube frames 19.5", or simply "Large", when the braceless ones are apparently actually 18.5". Trek bears some of the blame here, because while it is nice to have 1" increment sizes, they label every frame with both a "virtual" and "actual" size, and on top of that they don't even use consistent terminology on their geo chart, instead calling the "virtual" measure "frame size number". With 2 different figures which overlap between sizes, and 2 sets of terminology, once someone pulls the sticker off I can't really blame them for forgetting the exact details.
> 
> Needless to say though, it can be difficult to figure out if a used model is really the size you desire without Drumlin Roll's awesome info.


I always called my 18.5 a medium. Trek invites confusion by listing both numbers.


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## bataleon (Jun 28, 2015)

ghetto said:


> Interesting. I have this problem too. On what grounds did they decide a frame replacement was the fix? Thanks.


Damn, so the Thomson didn't help mate? It's a strange issue!


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## Lookbiker (Dec 4, 2016)

I'm 5' 10" with 31.6 " inseam. Looking at 18.5 and 19.5 Stache 7 but LBS doesn't have them in stock. The standover on the 19.5 is lower, which might be better. Suggestions as to sizing?
Thanks


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## rx4mtb (Jul 20, 2012)

I'm about the same size and ride the 17.5 ('16), but I prefer a tighter cockpit over being stretched out. I would think the 19.5 would be too much.

I'm actually about 1/2" shorter w/32.5 inseam.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Lookbiker said:


> I'm 5' 10" with 31.6 " inseam. Looking at 18.5 and 19.5 Stache 7 but LBS doesn't have them in stock. The standover on the 19.5 is lower, which might be better. Suggestions as to sizing?
> Thanks


Depends on what you want as far as reach goes.

Probably the 19.5 and swap in a shorter stem. I'm 5'10" and went from an 18.5 9 to a 19.5 9.8 and there really is something to this stubby stem thing. I didn't like the alloy 19.5 stock, too stretched out and leaned forward. The 17.5 was fun, but obviously a little small.


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## TheKaiser (Feb 5, 2014)

"I'm 5'10" and went from an 18.5 9 to a 19.5 9.8"


And in case anyone has missed it, the carbon frame used on the 9.8 has a longer reach than the same stated size aluminum bike. You not only went up a size, but essentially went up the rough equivalent of 2 sizes once you factor in the new geometry of the carbon bikes.


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## bataleon (Jun 28, 2015)

richde said:


> Probably the 19.5 and swap in a shorter stem.


Great advice.

I'm also 5'10" (32 inseam). I bought a 19.5 and swapped the stem for a 50mm. I didn't even ride it with the stock stem. Not once


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## bataleon (Jun 28, 2015)

TheKaiser said:


> "I'm 5'10" and went from an 18.5 9 to a 19.5 9.8"
> 
> 
> And in case anyone has missed it, the carbon frame used on the 9.8 has a longer reach than the same stated size aluminum bike. You not only went up a size, but essentially went up the rough equivalent of 2 sizes once you factor in the new geometry of the carbon bikes.


Correct sir, but...

It's worth noting that although the reach on the Carbon bike has been lengthened, the stem has been shortened. So the distance from seat to handlebar is the same on the stock 19.5 Carbon as a 19.5 Aluminium with a 50mm stem fitted, down to the exact millimeter 

19.5 Carbon: 451mm + 35mm = 486mm
19.5 Aluminium: 436mm + 50mm = 486mm


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## Ne1son (Dec 21, 2016)

First time poster here... I recently got a trek stache 9 frame and I have a few questions which I haven't been able to find answers to yet.

Has anyone run this with 2.6 x 29 tyres such as the Nobby Nics? Maybe with a 130 or 140 fork?

Can the 29 Yari take a 2.6 or 2.8 x 29 tyre?

Where can you buy the 29 x 3.0 minion Dhf tyres? 

Thanks


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## CBaron (May 7, 2004)

bataleon said:


> Great advice.
> 
> I'm also 5'10" (32 inseam). I bought a 19.5 and swapped the stem for a 50mm. I didn't even ride it with the stock stem. Not once


Just another data point for whomever...

I too am 5'10" but have long legs. I run 781 cm from BB to top of saddle. I've got a Stache 9 and chose the 18.5 (with 24" ETT). I prefer a little more stretch than most people (nowadays). I was attracted to the bike due to its fairly short WB. Bought it as an experiment and have been pleasantly surprised and how nimble its felt. So much so that I've thought I could prolly run the next size up (19.5") and then swap to a little shorter stem. But overall, I'm pleased and don't have to really change anything....except maybe a lighter wheel set. 

Later,
CJB


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## bataleon (Jun 28, 2015)

CBaron said:


> But overall, I'm pleased and don't have to really change anything....except maybe a lighter wheel set.
> 
> Later,
> CJB


It's such a blast riding this bike isn't it! I'd love a lighter wheel set too, however it'll have to wait for now. I don't deserve one anyway as my lazy ass still hasn't got around to setting up tubeless. With tubes this size it should've been done before my first ride!


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## aquamogal (Aug 20, 2015)

hi wondering if a 27.5 hodag mounted on 45mm or 50mm would fit a stache ? Any feedback out there ?


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## CBaron (May 7, 2004)

bataleon said:


> It's such a blast riding this bike isn't it!


It has definitely exceeded my expectations.

As a former frame builder, I've probably designed about 150 custom frames. However, its been about 4 yrs since I last brought anything to fruition. During this time away, I've watched the market move in a direction that I've been fairly suspect about. About 3 mos ago my favorite bike was stolen from me. Thus I decided to buy the Stache as an experiment into a progressive 'new school' design. I was prepared to punt it if I didn't like it. I'm still working on developing my opinions of it. But I can say for sure that I've been pleasantly surprised on a variety of levels.

Thanks
CJB


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

TheKaiser said:


> "I'm 5'10" and went from an 18.5 9 to a 19.5 9.8"
> 
> 
> And in case anyone has missed it, the carbon frame used on the 9.8 has a longer reach than the same stated size aluminum bike. You not only went up a size, but essentially went up the rough equivalent of 2 sizes once you factor in the new geometry of the carbon bikes.


Yes, but the 9.8 has a stubby little 35mm stem, so the seat to bar distance actually shrinked slightly.

The wheelbase is longer than my ex-Stache, but it's still a relatively short bike and where the front contact patch is in relation to the rear isn't as important as the actual position of the grips in relation to the BB and saddle.

Trust me, I agonized over the geometry differences for a while, and as overall packages they're not much different...and probably add to the forgiving nature of Staches in general.


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## Lookbiker (Dec 4, 2016)

Thanks for the sizing advice. Leaning toward the 19.5/18.5 (virtual). The 18.5/17.5 (virtual) has a higher standover than the larger model with the additional reach.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

aquamogal said:


> hi wondering if a 27.5 hodag mounted on 45mm or 50mm would fit a stache ? Any feedback out there ?


I really doubt it -- that's a huge tire.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

I just took ownership of a Stache 7 frameset. Their site calls out a PF92 BB.

I is ignorant when it comes to PF BB's.

Looking on QBP (for starters) I see that Wheels Mfg has a PF92 thread-together BB, in both SRAM and Shimano options.

If I were to get the SRAM version, does that then mean I can run any SRAM GXP cranks on this frame?

Be gentle -- I don't even know what I don't know.


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## pdxfixed (Feb 18, 2016)

That's correct, it uses legit 22/24mm bearings, no funky adapters. Those thread together jammers from Wheels Mfg are the jam, they successfully quieted some noisy projects in the past for me.

Now do me a favor and try smashing a Hodag in the back of that Stache? I'm looking at picking one up and would have to grab a 27+ wheelset for it if so.


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## tfinator (Apr 30, 2009)

mikesee said:


> I just took ownership of a Stache 7 frameset. Their site calls out a PF92 BB.
> 
> I is ignorant when it comes to PF BB's.
> 
> ...


Mike when you get this figured out and have some rides in I'd like to hear your review on the bike. I'm getting ready to pull the trigger on it myself.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

mikesee said:


> I just took ownership of a Stache 7 frameset. Their site calls out a PF92 BB.
> 
> I is ignorant when it comes to PF BB's.
> 
> ...


Any GXP crank will fit in the bottom bracket. Not sure if you can get away with a non-boost chainline though, so your crankset should likely have the extra 3 mm offset for the chainring. If your frameset came with the crankset, you should be fine. That bike came with an X-Sync crankset, which should have the 3 mm offset chainring on it. You can get the boost compatible spider (which is itself offset) and then run any regular 11 speed 94 mm BCD chainring, with a 30t being the smallest that will fit the spider.

Any direct mount chainring should have the offset. The smallest 3 mm offset direct fit chainring anybody makes that I know of is a 28t. Absolute Black makes an ovalised 28t, which they claim is like a 26t through the part of the stroke where you're mashing down, and more like a 30t as you go through the bottom and top of the stroke.

I put the Wheels Mfg thread-together BB (I went with the version with angular contact bearings) on mine a few weeks ago. Very easy install, but you do need a park Tool BBT-29 or equivalent. A regular external bearing BB tool won't fit the thread-together BB. One will work, but two would be better because mine didn't have enough friction fit to hold the one side in place while tightening the other side as the instructions suggest.

BB86/92 Thread Together Angular Contact BB for 24/22mm (SRAM) Cranks - Black

Bottom Bracket Tool | Park Tool


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

I have a Stache 5 with lots of miles on it and the original BB in it. Several times I thought the BB was going out on it because of noises but they were from the rear and then the front Manitou through axels.
It came with the Race Face AEffect crank which I run most of the time, but for bikepacking I needed a lower gear. A double deore crank slid right in and I put 22 and 32 rings on it. Had to grind down the spider a bit for the 32 to keep the chain on but all is good now. I shift by hand.
I thought about going to some sort of adaptor but my doubts about the press in bearings have pretty much been erased.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

Thanks Jeff. Hadn't considered tools when pricing the BB. Just did some digging and measuring and am not entirely surprised to find that of the 7 BB-specific tools I have here, none will work with the Wheels BB. Pft.

That gives me a different conundrum -- buy the Wheels BB and 2 of their tools, or buy the SRAM press-in BB for 1/4 the price, and install it with a bearing press I already have.

I've heard the whining and griping about creaking PF BB's for years. Are they still that bad?


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## Doug_ID (Feb 22, 2009)

I cannot speak to all PF BB's but all the noises on my stache I thought were BB I now think were pretty much entirely the rear axle / stranglehold dropout interface. I really snug the axle and stranglehold bolts down now more than I had originally and the bike is dead quiet.


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## ghughes.hesinc (Jun 10, 2009)

mikesee said:


> I've heard the whining and griping about creaking PF BB's for years. Are they still that bad?


I've had years of problem free use out of PF30 and PF GXP adapters...yrmv...


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

mikesee said:


> Thanks Jeff. Hadn't considered tools when pricing the BB. Just did some digging and measuring and am not entirely surprised to find that of the 7 BB-specific tools I have here, none will work with the Wheels BB. Pft.
> 
> That gives me a different conundrum -- buy the Wheels BB and 2 of their tools, or buy the SRAM press-in BB for 1/4 the price, and install it with a bearing press I already have.
> 
> I've heard the whining and griping about creaking PF BB's for years. Are they still that bad?





Doug_ID said:


> I cannot speak to all PF BB's but all the noises on my stache I thought were BB I now think were pretty much entirely the rear axle / stranglehold dropout interface. I really snug the axle and stranglehold bolts down now more than I had originally and the bike is dead quiet.


This was my experience as well in that it turns out that the rear axle area needs to have everything lubed and tightened 'properly', and then the noise has gone away for me. At the same time, I now have some peace of mind that it is not going to be the BB going forward, and I have a better quality bearing system with no plastic interface.

I don't tend to change bikes very often, and feel good about having what I feel is a good long term system in place. YMMV depending on your own unique set of circumstances.

So nice to have a quiet running bike again.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

mikesee said:


> Thanks Jeff. Hadn't considered tools when pricing the BB. Just did some digging and measuring and am not entirely surprised to find that of the 7 BB-specific tools I have here, none will work with the Wheels BB. Pft.
> 
> That gives me a different conundrum -- buy the Wheels BB and 2 of their tools, or buy the SRAM press-in BB for 1/4 the price, and install it with a bearing press I already have.
> 
> I've heard the whining and griping about creaking PF BB's for years. Are they still that bad?


I agree with others, the creaks I thought I were my BB weren't.


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## MrIcky (Oct 2, 2007)

I have run both boost and non-boost corrected chainrings and there were no problems either way. If you're doing a lot of climbing I think the non-boost may even be a tad better since it shifts the chain slightly toward the climbing side of the cassette.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

mikesee said:


> I've heard the whining and griping about creaking PF BB's for years. Are they still that bad?


It's not a press fit problem, it's a frame problem. Some can't get it right, some can, and some don't even try.


Doug_ID said:


> I cannot speak to all PF BB's but all the noises on my stache I thought were BB I now think were pretty much entirely the rear axle / stranglehold dropout interface. I really snug the axle and stranglehold bolts down now more than I had originally and the bike is dead quiet.


Pretty much.


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## 1robclark (Feb 18, 2017)

Anyone found a well fitting frame bag for the 19.5? Or will I have to go custom? 

Also, first time post.


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## jfaust97 (Oct 1, 2004)

Doug_ID said:


> Here are a few pics of my 5 in ss mode with 19T rear and oval 30T in front. I have the oval with the longest section in the vertical position for these pics so should be aprox = round 32T ring in that position. The clearance is close but I still have room to wrap the chain stay without rubbing. I think the issue is to maintain a straight chainline the sprocket has to be further out than you might expect. I wish Trek had put a slight arch shape in the chainstay but it works fine with the setup I have.
> 
> Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr
> 
> Trek Stache SS by Doug, on Flickr


Have you had any issue with the freehub slipping during intense climbs? I set my Stache 5 up as SS like this too. I've had the hub skip a few times when I'm nearing the top of a steep climb and I'm barely moving and putting a ton of torque on the pedals. Other times it's just fine.
Thanks!
jfaust97


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## Captain_America1976 (Mar 15, 2005)

jfaust97 said:


> Have you had any issue with the freehub slipping during intense climbs? I set my Stache 5 up as SS like this too. I've had the hub skip a few times when I'm nearing the top of a steep climb and I'm barely moving and putting a ton of torque on the pedals. Other times it's just fine.
> Thanks!
> jfaust97


There is a lot of discussion on this topic. It's frame flex due to the elevated stay. Search this forum and the Trek forum for the threads.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Thread resurrection!

Trek Full Staches = 33.4 lbs - 130mm rear travel - 430mm chainstays!

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/trek-full-stache-first-ride.html

If anyone cares?


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

NH Mtbiker said:


> Thread resurrection!
> 
> Trek Full Staches = 33.4 lbs - 130mm rear travel - 430mm chainstays!
> 
> ...


Stock out of the box, it's about a pound heavier as shown in this video:


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

The chainstays are impressively short too. 7mm longer than the hardtail Stache that has that big wagon wheel completely tucked!


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Now Trek needs to make the Full Stache with a carbon frame, lighter tires (850 gr), carbon hoops and upgraded spec. Or just sell a carbon frameset and let us do the build! Nice design and homework on their part, but just would want a lighter one....like in the 26-28 lb range. Sweet trail bike for sure!


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## Bikeabout (Nov 27, 2007)

Dear God: 

I would like one of those monster trucks with huge tractor tires that rolls over all the other cars at the demolition derby during the county fair and crushes those cars into wreckage. And I would like it to get 45-50 mpg on regular gas. And to fit in my small garage. And to be quiet enough that it doesn't wake the kids.

And to be lighter. 

----

I'm sure there are things one can do to lighten this bike somewhat. But that's not really the point.*

I rode one for a couple hours last night on one of the roughest, toughest trails in my neighborhood. Steep, tight, chunky non-flow climbs and jagger-rock descents at speed. Chunder. I guess it takes a bit of juice to get it going but then it doesn't really stop for anything. The bike excelled, even when I did not. Lunging up oversized stair-steps? Yes. Finding traction on ragged rubble? Yes. Smoothing the path through lumpy piles of human bodies? Er, no. But something like that on slickrock shaped like that. And an awesome planted feel at speed on rough, loose-ish descents in slightly-bermed-by-use corners. A solid "What? Me worry?" feeling? Yes.

It's possible that I would weep openly if I had to race it up a long fire road, but that, again, doesn't seem to be the point of this bike. 

I'd say that fans of this bike will probably be riders who like to ride hard trails. Meaning, trails that are hard in ways that can't be measured only by a heart-rate monitor. 

Sign me up. 



*I'll totally try it with the 850g-ish Chupacabra tires (a.k.a. Bontrager XR2 29 x 3.0). Why not?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

This new Trek has it's own thread already, why not discuss there?


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## formula4speed (Mar 25, 2013)

Hey Stache owners. When Trek says the wheels are tubeless ready do they mean they are taped and I would just need some valves and sealant, or are they just tubeless compatible? Looking at the 2018 Stache 5 with Duroc 40s if it makes a difference.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Any Stache or new Full Stache owners planning on running a 2.6 to 2.8 xc tires instead of the stock 1100 gram Bonty tires? Light wheels and tires would be the 1st priority for me on this bike. Should make the bike much more nimble for climbing without losing its ability to monster truck over and down trails imo.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Light weight plus tires arent XC tires. Still heavier and knobbier.

And chupas are between 8 and 900g, not 1100 and stache comes with durocs, rather light plus wheel unless your going carbon fiber.

2.6" tires will fit many newer 29ers and their forks, being lighter that might be more what your after. Get a bit more grip and other benefits of plus without trying to shave weight off a more stoutly built trail bike. 29+ definitely isnt for ones that are serious about keeping weight down.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Deep Thought (Sep 3, 2012)

formula4speed said:


> Hey Stache owners. When Trek says the wheels are tubeless ready do they mean they are taped and I would just need some valves and sealant, or are they just tubeless compatible? Looking at the 2018 Stache 5 with Duroc 40s if it makes a difference.


Looks like you just need sealant.


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## clydeosaur (Apr 13, 2010)

I'm wondering how much weight you are going to save on tires. The Chupas seem pretty light for their size. I'd think most 2.8's are pretty close by comparison?


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## clydeosaur (Apr 13, 2010)

formula4speed said:


> Hey Stache owners. When Trek says the wheels are tubeless ready do they mean they are taped and I would just need some valves and sealant, or are they just tubeless compatible? Looking at the 2018 Stache 5 with Duroc 40s if it makes a difference.


The rims come taped. Sun Ringle also sends a bag with valves & instructions. All you need is sealant.


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## Barman1 (Jan 8, 2014)

clydeosaur said:


> The rims come taped. Sun Ringle also sends a bag with valves & instructions. All you need is sealant.


The rear Duroc wheel/Sun Ringle hub I got last October for my 9 lasted about a month on the trail.
The engagement ring broke loose from the hub and just spins inside the body.
For a quick second I thought I was Superman and spinning that rear Minion DHR 3.0 like a boss.
The walk/coast 2 miles home brought my usual level of humility back to reality.
Looking to replace it with a Hope.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## le_pedal (Jul 10, 2018)

Tried searching the thread but couldn't find a definitive answer (sorry if I missed it) - Setting up Stache 7 as SS, the Sram XD driver is an issue. Someone mentioned that to get around this, they ordered the Shimano freehub that comes on the Stache 5 - can anyone add any further information to this? 

The xd driver is the final hurdle keeping me from going SS on the Stache 7. I know enough to be dangerous, but am not sure of a way to identify for sure what part from Shimano would be compatible to swap out directly with the current sram xd body, and not encounter any compatibility issues.


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## Wombat (Jan 25, 2004)

Problem Solver has its "Zinger" to to convert SRAM XD drivers to singlespeed: https://problemsolversbike.com/products/drivetrain/zinger so this may be simpler.

Tim


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