# Thinking about getting a specific "biking-camping" vehicle



## BlueMountain (Nov 8, 2006)

So far, my Forester has performed admirably but the family is growing (more dogs/fatter dogs) and I'm considering picking up a used vehicle for weekend/camping/travelling duties. It HAS to have a flat floor (raised or not so seats removed or folded) so a couple of bigger dogs can sit/sleep in comfort and still leave enough room for gear. Vehicles like the Forester/Element and other smaller SUVs are simply too small and the mid-size ones are not significantly roomier. It also helps if we can sleep in the back in a pinch.

My top choices so far include:

Chevy/GMC Tahoe/Yukon or Suburban (pretty proven)
Ford Expedition (know little about Expedition reliability)
Toyota Sequoia (that V8 is bulletproof- power is not a big deal)
Toyota Land Cruiser (relatively a bit small and very pricey though has legendary reliability)

I didn't consider a van due to low ground clearance and no 4WD so that limits the places I can take it. I'd be open to it but it can't be 4" off the ground. I was thinking of buying a used one since these vehicles can be over $30K - $40K brand new. I see used ones going from $6K-$12K depending on mileage and model year. It was be an extra vehicle unless I can convince my girl to give up her sedan(she telecommutes so gas mileage isn't a big concern) and get a newer SUV.

Anyway, assuming that this will be an extra vehicle, here are some thoughts I have and I want to know what you all think.

What mileage should I stay under to maintain overall reliability? I'll be taking this vehicle fully loaded to Tahoe, Montana, Moab, etc. Reliabilty is the biggest concern. Having owned Hondas, Toyotas, Nissans for the last 15 yrs has never seen me with one broken down or out of action. I can't say the same about my Fords and Dodges at far less mileage though the newer ones are undoubtedly better so I'm much more open minded now.

What vehicle should I focus more on? Gas mileage will probably be similar so do you guys have a preference for other reasons? I mean, I can easily pick up a higher-mileage Suburban or Tahoe for $6K- $7K but they hover around and over 100K miles. Something in me says that is too much. So should I focus on something with maybe 60K - 70K miles? I have so much running through my head that I woudl really liek some outside perspective. Thanks!


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## wheelerfreak (Jul 3, 2007)

Have you considered any pick ups, or do you a a reason for only wanting an SUV? We use our p/u for what you are describing using your next vehicle for. I briefly thught of and SUV and then quickly decided a crew cab p/u would be a better overall choice. We have 4 60-85# dogs that we take with us and the thought of them inside an SUV after a trip to the mountains is scary They love to swim in rivers and splash in mud puddles, enough of a reason to want to isolate them in the bed of a truck. If you are primarily going to use a vehicle for camping and trips, a p/u would not be too bad a choice. Especially now when they are almost giving them away. Toyota and Nissan both make nice midsize crew cab 4x4 p/u's. In the fullsize market Toy, Nissan, Ford, Chevy and Dodge all make crew cab 1/2 tons and are all running big discounts on in stock trucks.


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

Ford E-250 4x4 Diesel would make a nice camper/bike hauler.










I'm holding out for a 4WD option on the Dodge (Mercedes) Sprinter.


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## Rob M. (Aug 30, 2005)

I second the Econoline. I have an E150 2wd and it has been a great adventure vehicle. I have been jonesing for one with 4wd but have never gotten myself in trouble off road with mine. Is the green one yours? If so what are you getting for mileage? I saw one recently and was intrested but questioned the mileage. Do you have much of an interior in yours?
O.P. check out the Sportsmobile, that will get you thinking.
Happy Trails


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

Rob M. said:


> I second the Econoline. I have an E150 2wd and it has been a great adventure vehicle. I have been jonesing for one with 4wd but have never gotten myself in trouble off road with mine. Is the green one yours? If so what are you getting for mileage? I saw one recently and was intrested but questioned the mileage. Do you have much of an interior in yours?
> O.P. check out the Sportsmobile, that will get you thinking.
> Happy Trails


Sh*t.. I wish that bad mofo was mine. I'd love to find an E-250 or E-350 diesel 4x4. Ford doesn't make many of them. Sportmobile's are some serious dosh, I don't think the OP wants to spend that much. Even a base Sprinter can cost quite a bit. I would take a Sprinter, but I'm holding out for the 4WD version to make it to the US.

Again, I can't think of a better bike hauler than the E-250 though....if you can find one.


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## Rob M. (Aug 30, 2005)

Oh I don't think they are that hard to find. Check out the link to Quigley. The part for me is do I want to pay that much and do I really need 4wd. I do think they work well as an adventure vehicle, as long as you can get past the creepy van stigma.
http://www.quigley4x4.com/


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

OP.. You could also get set up with an Earth Roamer.... http://www.earthroamer.com/tab_xpedition_vehicles/xvlt1_overview.html

http://www.earthroamer.com/tab_xpedition_vehicles/vehicles.html


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## BlueMountain (Nov 8, 2006)

First, I'm no millionaire but I appreciate the out-of-the-box thinking on that Earthroamer. 

A truck may not have the interior room I want. The dogs are short-haired and I cover the back with a rubber mat and a blanket so dirt is no issue. I'd rather have the interior room where they can lay comfortably all stretched out. However, I'll have to go check out the crew-cab or double-cabs in the trucks you guys mention. I have to keep my mind open since I have not actually been inside one of those lately.

An Econoline is an option though- I'll have to look into that now as well though I am 100% sure that the GF will not sell her beloved Jap sedan for that so it will have to be a third vehicle. Any idea if they have been relatively trouble-free in general?

Thanks for all these ideas. I'd certainly appreciate more but will start looking this weekend.


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## mtbikerTi (Jan 15, 2004)

If you get a Ford with a diesel do not get the 6.0 Powerstroke. 7.3's are good, and I haven't heard much negative about the new 6.4's, but do not get a 6.0. They're good to about 120k and then they start to fall apart. Ford did a good job with the rest of the vehicle but International made a lemon with the 6.0.


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## fastale (Jul 2, 2007)

rearviewmirror said:


> OP.. You could also get set up with an Earth Roamer.... http://www.earthroamer.com/tab_xpedition_vehicles/xvlt1_overview.html
> 
> http://www.earthroamer.com/tab_xpedition_vehicles/vehicles.html


Hot damn those things are expensive. You could get a really nice RV for the price of either of them.


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## BlueMountain (Nov 8, 2006)

Well, I killed two work hours looking at all this but look forward to letting work pile up and doing more of the same in the near future.

Thanks for the different ideas though I wish you guys had not brought up the really cool options that cost more than...well...anything I have. I also checked the tahoes and Suburbans and the dealers don't list them (used ones) at much less than blue book so I'll have to go in and see how they effectively they try to close me. I never tell them that I sold cars as a summer job for two summers and know all the silly tricks they use. It always tends to make them bring out the managers really quickly as reinforcement and a few have actually asked if I sold cars or financed before. I never tell them anything but play stupid instead and quietly focus on my side of the game.


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## Rob M. (Aug 30, 2005)

I don't know if you found this site yet, but if you really want to waste time check out the Sportsmobile site. Check out the pre owned section. It seems like most people build a $80,000. + van and then when they sell it used it's $50,000. I want to fond the $50,000. van for sale for $30somthing. I don't need all the RV crap. 4wd, poptop, bed in the back, and a few cabinets. I keep looking but never find it.
http://sportsmobile.com/
Have Fun.


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

OP.. you better jump on this flippin' sweet deal!

Link here!


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## wheelerfreak (Jul 3, 2007)

Is that the one Napolean's Uncle drove?



rearviewmirror said:


> OP.. you better jump on this flippin' sweet deal!
> 
> Link here!


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

wheelerfreak said:


> Is that the one Napolean's Uncle drove?


Yes.


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## azenthusiast (Aug 6, 2008)

I'd also recommend the Jeep Commander or the Chrysler Aspen. 5.7L Hemi with comparable gas mileage (if not better) than the vehicles you suggested. I believe they have the MDS system that runs on 4 cylinders while on cruise control. I've seen firsthand the 300C with that system return an average of 24 mpg at 70 mph. Obviously, there's a weight difference, but the system does help.


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## adhumston (Mar 14, 2008)

One often overlooked consideration when buying a vehicle specifically for traveling, is availability of parts. If, heaven forbid, you break down in the backwoods of (insert state here), can you get it fixed? And with the vehicles I've owned, mileage hasn't been an issue. Sure everyone wants low mileage vehicles. But would you rather have a vehicle that's been drove hard by a teenager for 60k miles, or a granny driven one with all maintnence done right that has 110k? With those considerations in mind, I'd look for a 2000-2003 tahoe/yukon with around 100k that has been privately owned, and preferablly a one owner. You can buy them for reasonable prices if you're patient, any chevy dealer in any town (we all know most towns have chevy dealers) will carry parts, they're plenty big enough for what you want, are reliable, and return decent mileage (15-22, depending). Just my very specific 2 cents


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## Jerk_Chicken (Oct 13, 2005)

Man, Toyotas are tough to beat. You mostly have to try to destroy those drivetrains. Another consideration for you might be that you can either put a 2x4 in the back with those $15 fork mounts bolted up and span it across the back. Provided your rig has the room, you can put 2-3 bikes in there parallel or anti-parallel.

Is Nissan a bet? I would do a later Pathfinder or X-terra, after the changeover in the engines. The Exhaust manifolds cracked up until about 2001 or so, and Nissan is supposed to replace them, but they don't fess up to it unless you come in with an article about it. What I like with Nissan is that these engines are on timing chains, so no worries there. Even though I can change timing belts myself, I chose my current car due to having a timing chain. Essentially, it needs little to no maintenance and is liberating in that sense.

I'm not sure about the Toyota V8's, but a chain in there wouldn't surprise me. Parts are also available anywhere, and you can buy online from those OEM distributors that sell the parts made by the oe manufacturer, but not in their boxes, but their own brand boxes.


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## Lactic (Apr 18, 2004)

*Sportsmobile*

I'll vouch for the Sportsmobile. I've had one for roughly a year now. Purchased used with 36K on a V10 petrol engine. I still get around 13-14 mpg on the expressway which is pretty good considering I'm hauling my bedroom, kitchen, garage, and dog kennel around with me and driving mainly over mountain passes in Colorado.

The 4x4 conversion is by Quigley and she's gotten me in and out of some pretty crazy places. We were in Breckenridge last weekend and the only other people I saw for 2 hours on a small mining "trial" were 2 quads and 3 off road motorcycles. By the looks on their faces, they were not expecting a 10,000# extended length Ford van to come around the corner! Great riding there on the Colorado Trail!!

Expensive to buy and operate? Yes, but if it's not your daily driver and you consider the cost of saving on hotel rooms, eating out, flights, etc, it becomes _slightly_ easier to swallow. Also, a lot of the diesel owners are converting to bio-diesel and there has been some recent discussion of natural gas conversions as well.


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## Rob M. (Aug 30, 2005)

Very nice Sportsmobile. Do you know what the diesel guys claim for MPG? If you want you can post more pictures of your van.


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## Lactic (Apr 18, 2004)

The diesel Ford guys are usually running in the mid teens with a high of 16-18 mpg highway if I recall correctly. The Sprinter has been touted to get around 26 but in the real world, people are getting quite a bit less- averaging in the high teens/low 20s.

Here's a pic of our typical setup in the back. Gear in the way back and underneath, up to three dogs lounging on the bed, and still plenty of floor space in the middle of the van for another dog, cooler, groceries, etc. Guess who likes roadtrips?

Also a pic of basecamp in Fruita.


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## mattsteve (Dec 28, 2004)

Gotta love those quigleys......

Another bonus is that the 7.3L Ferd will take pretty much any fuel you throw at it.....biodiesel, veg oil, motor oil, etc. Very tough. 

If not, you can get a 1/2 ton Suburban or Tahoe with the proven (and still somewhat economical) 350 gas engine for 8k or LESS.


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

Here's another option:


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## jrm (Jan 12, 2004)

*Why not a cough..cough*

Mini Van? i had a sienna that i could stuff with everything i needed. Biggest drawback was that while it would hold everything and you could sleep in it no problem, the interior finish just wasnt very tough for camping and carrying bikes, stoves, BBQs and the rest.


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## Lactic (Apr 18, 2004)

*Hi. My name is Lactic and I own a minivan.*

Well, I DID own a minivan. My previous company car was a Chrysler Town and Country that we managed to use as a basecamp vehicle before we got the Sportsmobile. Thule rack and box on the roof, fold down Stow-N-Go seating for 7, air mattress in the back with enough room for 2 adults and 2 dogs. The minivan drove like a car, was front wheel drive so handled snow fairly well, and got fair mileage.

I have heard of people having good results with 4x4 versions of the Chevy Astrovans as well.


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## Weird Joe (Apr 21, 2008)

*Outside the box!*

How about a mog? This one needs some work. Ebay had another one some had converted into a camper. That fella used an ambulance variant with a diesel motor. Good luck with the search!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Othe...8&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&timeout=1218549560275


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## axcxnj (Jun 23, 2008)

ok, those sportsmobiles are probably one of the coolest things ive ever seen


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## STinGa (Jan 14, 2004)

*Try a Land Rover*

When I was looking at Tahoes a few years ago, my wife suggested a Land Rover. I laughed but took a look anyways. I was able to find a used one with 5,000+ miles left on the factory warranty for <$19,000. I drove it hard for 4,000 miles and the local dealer took care of all of the nit-picky issues that I found and made it darn-near new. It is now pushing 95,000 miles and I wouldn't trade it for anything. :thumbsup:

STinGa


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## flipnidaho (Aug 10, 2004)

Toyota Tacoma Double Cab (available with a V8 but I have a V6 in mine). Enough room for the significant other, 2 dogs (Ridgeback and Spaniel), gear for 1 week of biking and fly fishing, and 6 bikes... Mileage is around 20 mpg (give or take)...


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

flipnidaho said:


> Toyota Tacoma Double Cab (available with a V8 but I have a V6 in mine). Enough room for the significant other, 2 dogs (Ridgeback and Spaniel), gear for 1 week of biking and fly fishing, and 6 bikes... Mileage is around 20 mpg (give or take)...


When did Tacoma's start having a V8 option? I have NEVER heard of a V8 in a Tacoma. The Tundra has a 4.7 and 5.7 option however.


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## adrenalnjunky (Jul 28, 2007)

No V8 in the tacoma, as far as Toyota's 2009 website shows.


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## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

*Well, I'm a bit biased*

Many Xterra owners sleep in them when camping. There are lots of options. The 60/40 rear bench seat folds flat, and the rear bench even comes out for a bit more room. I have some Rubbermaid ActionPacker boxes that I keep my camping gear in, then use to increase the size of the rear cargo area before blowing up an air mattress over them.

(not my pictures)

































If that isn't enough room for you for camping, they also make tents for the back of the Xterra:








https://nissanpartspeople.com/searchproduct.asp?model=Xterra&catid=3404373515710203&year=08&productdesc=Hatch+Tent
Or a smaller version:









Then there is my solution for long camping trips: I haul a popup tent trailer. My trailer has Yakima bars permanently mounted on its roof it that I use to mount cargo boxes or my kayaks to, but could also easily take a bike rack. Though with my previous SUV I had a spare tire mounted bike rack that worked with the tent trailer hitched up too. I'm looking for a solution for my Xterra that will let me use my hitch mount bike rack and tow the trailer too, something like this:


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

GpzGuy said:


>


I wish they'd make one of those pictured above w/ a double 2-inch receiver. So I could put one of those flat cargo trays below my bike rack. If anyone has ever seen a double 2-inch receiver available on-line please post up. I emailed Valley, which is now owned by Thule, they said they don't make such a product.


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## wheelerfreak (Jul 3, 2007)

rearviewmirror said:


> I wish they'd make one of those pictured above w/ a double 2-inch receiver. So I could put one of those flat cargo trays below my bike rack. If anyone has ever seen a double 2-inch receiver available on-line please post up. I emailed Valley, which is now owned by Thule, they said they don't make such a product.


They do, I swear I saw a pic of one in this very forum, poster used it for just what you want to. If you know someone who can weld it's a very easy thing to make too.


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## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

rearviewmirror said:


> I wish they'd make one of those pictured above w/ a double 2-inch receiver. So I could put one of those flat cargo trays below my bike rack. If anyone has ever seen a double 2-inch receiver available on-line please post up. I emailed Valley, which is now owned by Thule, they said they don't make such a product.


Something like this?


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## adrenalnjunky (Jul 28, 2007)

Amazon has 2 listed:
http://www.amazon.com/Buyers-Dual-H..._1?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1219519708&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.com/Bicycle-Recei..._2?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1219519708&sr=8-2

Or you can google "dual receiver hitch" and find dozens of listings that sell them:

http://www.google.com/products?q=du...a=X&oi=product_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title


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## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

It occured to me that I would have to modify one though. With the double receiver the whole thing would wobble. My Thule hitch mount rack has a captured nut welded inside it that you use a bolt as the hitch pin and tighten it down so the entire rack doesn't wobble in the receiver. I wonder if the tongue weight of the trailer would prevent some of the wobble...


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## wheelerfreak (Jul 3, 2007)

I was looking at that and the simple answer would be to drill the new hitch extension and tack weld a nut on the inside just like the Thule mount. I don't think just the weight would keep it form rocking around, then add two items mounted on an extension and the slop magnifies.


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

GpzGuy said:


> Something like this?


YES! Thank you! That's what I am looking for. I am going to mount a cargo tray UNDER my Sportworks rack so I can carry shoes and dirty clothes and what not on there. Cool... going to order one now.


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## jkoebel (Feb 3, 2008)

I'd love a Sportsmobile on a Sprinter platform, although the 4x4 van looks pretty amazing also.

And coming in less than $100k for most of them, it looks like something I could reasonably afford in my lifetime.


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## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

wheelerfreak said:


> I was looking at that and the simple answer would be to drill the new hitch extension and tack weld a nut on the inside just like the Thule mount. I don't think just the weight would keep it form rocking around, then add two items mounted on an extension and the slop magnifies.


That's exactly what I was thinking. Only it would have to be more than a tack weld I think. That nut would be under tension, and welds don't take tension well, often shearing off that way. It would need a full weld bead around the nut on all sides... unless the nut was put on the side nearest where the bolt screws in. You'd have a lot longer to screw the bolt in until it tightens up with a regular bolt, but that welded on nut would be under compression and the welds less likely to break.

I wonder though. With about 200 lbs of tongue weight from my tent trailer, it would be adding downward force on the receiver extension, in essence pulling against the flat portion of the inside of the receiver. The Thule and Yakima anti sway bolts add tension to pull the rack against the flat side of the side of the reciever. I don't think its that much clamping force as the bolt is only hand tight. With just tongue weight, the problem wouldn't be side to side rocking I don't think, but the slop from when starting or stopping / pushing or pulling on the trailer tongue. Lets see, with 200 pounds on the tongue, figure the force is applied to the centerline of the reciver, and one inch to the corner edge of the reciever, and ignoring any potential influence by the left and right sides of the receiver, I estimate what, 16 ft. lbs of torque as a righting moment due to the tongue weight? ..... hmmm, you're probably right, the tongue weight alone isn't enough considering the longer momemt arm of the bikes on the rack.... OK, back to welding a nut on the inside of the adapter.


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## GpzGuy (Aug 11, 2008)

rearviewmirror said:


> YES! Thank you! That's what I am looking for. I am going to mount a cargo tray UNDER my Sportworks rack so I can carry shoes and dirty clothes and what not on there. Cool... going to order one now.


My Xterra has a gear box on the front of the roof rack for that


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## wheelerfreak (Jul 3, 2007)

GpzGuy said:


> That's exactly what I was thinking. Only it would have to be more than a tack weld I think. That nut would be under tension, and welds don't take tension well, often shearing off that way. It would need a full weld bead around the nut on all sides... unless the nut was put on the side nearest where the bolt screws in. .


 The weld would just be to keep the nut from spinning while you tighten the bolt down. A good weld on one side would suffice. I've done that before on a swing out tire carrier and never had an issue. I'd have to go outside and take a look at it, but I don't think the nut on the thule rack is welded all the way around. The also sell nuts that are mounted onto tin "extensions" that are meant to be used in enclosed areas (mainly I've seen them in receiver hitch mounts) where you can't get a wrench in to hold the nut. That type of nut is a whole lot less sturdy than a nut welded onto the inside of the extension.
Back on topic though. My wife and I have been looking at the Sportsmobile 4x4 vans. That is the only type of RV that I would buy. From roughly 70k new is not too bad. We are thinking maybe in a year or two as retirement gets close we may do this. I am really tired of sleeping on the ground when we camp, and the Sportsmobile would allow us to setup base camp out in the boonies away from everyone else. Heck even now if I had to I could even commute in it since I only work 5 miles from home. I usually ride my bike, but when the weather sucks I drive.


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