# Shockwiz



## phantoj (Jul 7, 2009)

Anybody out there get in on the Kickstarter for this:

https://www.shockwiz.com/

??

Seems like something that a bike shop could get and rent out as a service to customers. Would you ever buy it? Would you rent it?


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## trailbildr (Dec 8, 2004)

I'm waiting on my pair. We kickstarted (?) two of them. Any day now...

Yes, we'll be renting them.

mk


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## mtlcafan79 (Sep 19, 2016)

I'd rent one for a weekend for sure.


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## russmu66 (Nov 11, 2007)

I received an email today to say mine is on its way. Kind of ironic that it will be arriving in time to connect to my Fox Float X2 that I'm not supposed to ride.


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

Showed up last night!


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## mullen119 (Aug 30, 2009)

Subscribed


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## mtlcafan79 (Sep 19, 2016)

Can you log two sensors at once? The manual leads me to believe it's only one at a time.


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

I'm not entirely sure about that yet. The first two thirds of my first ride, I had it set to log on the rear shock, but when I swapped to the fork it said it already had sufficient ride data to make suggestions.


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## trailbildr (Dec 8, 2004)

We got ours on Monday. You can log data on both (I think) but can only view one at a time with a single device. I guess you could have two phones or something...

I've yet to RTFM or even ride with them. I got so far as to hook them up to the bike and discover the bluetooth with tablet and phone but nothing else.

More later...

mk


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## jmblur (Jul 3, 2007)

Received mine last week. Posted an unboxing and a first ride review on YouTube :






It basically said my shock settings were good, which is reassuring. I haven't had time to ride since last week to try it on the fork or intentionally screw up my shock settings and see if it can fix it. So far so good though.

I'm considering renting it out, it's a cool toy but seems like its use is somewhat limited unless you're getting a new bike every year or tuning for a specific race course or something.


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

So far working great with the CCDB, but having some issues with the Ohlins fork. Cal status continues to show up red, even after swapping shockwiz units. Tried multiple times but it doesn't seem to like the fork. I know shockwiz specifically mentioned certain forks that weren't compatible, which didnt include the ohlins, but I'm not sure if the fork is constructed in the same manner as the forks that don't work like MRP and trek DRCV. Damping adjustments seem to get good suggestions, but it keeps calling for air to be taken out. I've tried taking out air far past any reasonable sag measurement and it still calls for more. The calibration seems good, as I experimented by measuring out specific points and compressing the fork to them. Every time the app displayed exactly the right %. I have an email in to quarq. Eagerly awaiting a reply.


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## trailbildr (Dec 8, 2004)

I got a chance to run mine Saturday. Said rear shock was good, just need to drop down one size volume reducer (Fox).

I didn't set up the fork correctly so that didn't work. I rode it at our local beginner trail yesterday and it didn't get enough data. That was my assumption but I wanted to be sure.

We will absolutely be renting them out so we are trying to get up to speed quickly. We have a suspension clinic here Thursday evening. We'll be showing people the interface, set-up and outputs. I think it'll be useful but it's just a tool. You'll still need some human interaction to ensure that you get the right set-up. It's data, though, so we'll be layering our experience on top of the numbers. It will help make suspension set-up way less magical and help people understand what is happening.

mk


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## Kuttermax (Sep 4, 2011)

I used mine on the rear Fox shock on my Niner RKT 9 RDO. The set up went smoothly. I rode with the shock in the open setting and the Shockwiz confirmed that the settings I had were good. The only suggestion was increasing low and high speed compression, which really isn't an option on the Fox rear shock except for changing from open to trail mode. 

Next up is testing the front fork, a Fox Factory 32 with FIT4 damper. I think this fork could still use some dialing in, so curious to see what the Shockwiz suggests. 

So far I have to say this is a pretty cool little device. 

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk


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## euro-trash (Feb 9, 2008)

If someone is ready to rent one out, please pm me. Very curious about checking it out.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

If the shockwiz says your shock settings are good, try changing your settings and go to the same course again to see if the shockwiz suggests the same settings you had before.


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## mullen119 (Aug 30, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> If the shockwiz says your shock settings are good, try changing your settings and go to the same course again to see if the shockwiz suggests the same settings you had before.


This is what I want to hear about as well. I'm curious how well it actually works and have entered seen anything that tests this. I really want the test on a shock or fork with high and low speed compression, not a 3 setting compression damper like. Let's see how accurate these things actually are.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

I'm pretty confident that this device can measure the position of the suspension as a function of time quite adequately. What to do with that information is the complicated part. I'd like to know a lot more about how it analyzes the data, presents that information, and uses it to make recommendations.


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## Jamie_MTB (Nov 18, 2004)

Subscribed


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## mullen119 (Aug 30, 2009)

Lone Rager said:


> I'm pretty confident that this device can measure the position of the suspension as a function of time quite adequately. What to do with that information is the complicated part. I'd like to know a lot more about how it analyzes the data, presents that information, and uses it to make recommendations.


That's the important part. I'm skeptical on it. Most reports show no changes needed, which I find hard to believe. Time will tell, a thorough test/review will hopefully come out.


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## mtlcafan79 (Sep 19, 2016)

Seeing that the software and the firmware are both updateable I would think any algorithm issues would be something that could be easily solved. It would be fun to see if someone can get a live data stream and overlay it with GPS, power, gear selection, etc.


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## michaeldorian (Nov 17, 2006)

Would love to give this a spin. Renting it out seems like a smart idea.


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## trailbildr (Dec 8, 2004)

I think we'll have ours available starting next week.

mk


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## Kuttermax (Sep 4, 2011)

After tuning the rear shock on my RKT 9 RDO, I ran the Shockwiz on the front. My build has a Fox Factory 32 with FIT4 damper and 100mm travel. I've only had the bike a short while and was still working on dialing in the front, so it was a good opportunity to get some feedback from Shockwiz. 

The initially report back after my first 1 hour loop on a local cross country trail with roots, a few shorter climbs, and some smaller rocks was consistent with what I was thinking. It recommended less air pressure, more rebound dampening, and adding a spacer. I didn't have an extra spacer on hand (my shock is supposed to ship with two installed but I haven't doubled checked that it did), but I did lower the pressure (down to 85 psi) and added some rebound dampening. I took an hour lap and the feel was improved but I do blow through the 100 mm travel at times. The feedback after the changes was still to add a spacer and drop psi further. Rebound was now good. 

I've ordered some Fox spacers and will add them and hopefully retest before winter hits Ohio. I spoke with SRAM and they told me it will be important to run though the calibration again after the spacers are added. 

I'm also planning to get a ride in on my Salsa Beargrease fat bike equipped with a Bluto. It will be fun seeing how the Shockwiz tunes that set up. 

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Kuttermax said:


> I've ordered some Fox spacers and will add them and hopefully retest before winter hits Ohio. I spoke with SRAM and they told me it will be important to run though the calibration again after the spacers are added.
> 
> I'm also planning to get a ride in on my Salsa Beargrease fat bike equipped with a Bluto. It will be fun seeing how the Shockwiz tunes that set up.
> 
> Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk


Yes, very curious to see what it thinks of fat bike tires.


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hello Everyone,

Just had a chance to read through the thread and figured I could add some useful information. If anyone has any specific questions please ask, I will do my best to stay on top on them.

There seems to be a little confusion as to how ShockWiz works in regards to data storage, transfer and so forth. Below is a article that we will posting to www.ShockWiz.com in the near future, but figured it was worth posting here now.

As I said, if there are any questions or concerns that pertain to ShockWiz let them fly.

[email protected]

*Data storage*: All data collection and analysis is performed within the ShockWiz device itself; no computation occurs within the app. The app is only a means to display the collected information and for you, the user, to interact with the device to perform a task such as a calibration or to start a new session. Since the data is stored directly on the ShockWiz device it is not necessary to carry your phone during a ride. However, once you have the ShockWiz app open and connected to your device you can check the results at any time. This could be at the end of a segment, the end of a ride or in three weeks time, it doesn't matter. Your data will be saved until a new session is started.

*Using two devices:* If you have a dual suspension bike, then it is beneficial, but not essential, to use two ShockWiz devices simultaneously. The process of using two devices is very similar to using one. You simply have to connect to each device individually to set them up and review the results. To switch between devices, simply tap the device name at the top of the app page and select your other device from the list. On some phones it may be beneficial to first disconnect from the current device before you connect to the other. 
There is no communication between ShockWiz devices, only from each device to the phone/App. Tuning, however, does become much faster with two devices because you are capturing twice the data at once and there is no need to swap from the front to the rear. Typically, but not always, both the front and rear of a dual suspension bike should be set up and tuned with the same Tuning Style.

*Tuning Styles*
When it comes to tuning mountain bike suspension, there is a lot of variance in how people like to ride and the different styles of bikes for different terrain and disciplines. The Tuning Styles within the ShockWiz algorithms try to account for these variances.
Some people like to use every last millimetre of travel, while others like to have a large travel buffer in reserve for any unforseen obstacles. Additionally some riders like to have the bike be lively underneath them and be able to 'pop' off small mounds and kickers, where others like the wheels to be very planted to the ground and controlled.

There are quite a few things that change between Tuning Styles, but the following descriptions give an overview of the main differences.

*Efficient *- Focused purely on pedalling efficiency. Efficient will keep you higher in your travel and minimise pedal-induced suspension bob. Efficient produces the firmest suspension tune.

*Balanced *- The middle ground that provides an overall compromise between traction, suppleness and pedalling efficiency. Balanced serves as the default ShockWiz Tuning Style.

*Playful *- Similar to Balanced but with a more lively feel to give the bike 'pop'.

*Aggressive *- Focused on a supple and active ride, caring very little about pedal-induced suspension bob. Aggressive makes sure you use all of your travel and produces the softest suspension tune.


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## 7four8 (Sep 9, 2007)

Hey Alex,

Does the shockwiz work with the new MRP Ribbon fork or the Ohlins?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

7four8 said:


> Hey Alex,
> 
> Does the shockwiz work with the new MRP Ribbon fork or the Ohlins?


Hey 7four8,

Unfortunately it looks like a 'No' for both.

I am not super familiar with the Ribbon air-spring design, but everything I can find shows that it uses the Ramp Control Cartridge which is not compatible with ShockWiz. The Ramp Control Cartridge functions by altering the air volume of the positive air spring chamber during compression, which creates a variable compression ratio making it a no go for ShockWiz. If the Ribbon where used without the Ramp Control Cartridge it would be fine.

Same goes for Ohlins. The RXF34 and RXF36 suspension forks use a 3 chamber air spring; 2 positive, 1 negative. The second, smaller positive chamber makes for a variable compression ratio in the larger air chamber measured by ShockWiz.

Compression ratio is a fundamental piece of the travel percentage calculation and must be constant.

[email protected]


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey 7four8,
> 
> Unfortunately it looks like a 'No' for both.
> 
> ...


Alex, can you explain this a little further? I've been running my shockwiz on an RXF34 since I got it and although I had some issues getting a "green" cal light at first, really cycling the fork a lot during the calibration seemed to do the trick. I've been wondering for a while if the fork is truly compatible and emailed you guys but never heard back. What do you mean by variable ratio? Since the second positive chamber is completely separate from the primary ones, doesn't adjusting it simply have the same effect as adjusting air volume on a standard fork? Or are you saying that the "ramp" chamber on the ohlins does not initiate until partway through the stroke?

Prior to cycling the fork a ton, I was getting ratios over 5.0. I'm now getting 4.2 to 4.8 depending on how I have the ramp chamber set up. This seemed pretty high, but I wasnt really sure. I did go through the trouble of "checking" that the shockwiz was reading proper travels on the fork by setting baseline air pressure fairly low and extending the fork to 50% travel and the device read perfect 50...


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

mrdirt85 said:


> Alex, can you explain this a little further? I've been running my shockwiz on an RXF34 since I got it and although I had some issues getting a "green" cal light at first, really cycling the fork a lot during the calibration seemed to do the trick. I've been wondering for a while if the fork is truly compatible and emailed you guys but never heard back. What do you mean by variable ratio? Since the second positive chamber is completely separate from the primary ones, doesn't adjusting it simply have the same effect as adjusting air volume on a standard fork? Or are you saying that the "ramp" chamber on the ohlins does not initiate until partway through the stroke?
> 
> Prior to cycling the fork a ton, I was getting ratios over 5.0. I'm now getting 4.2 to 4.8 depending on how I have the ramp chamber set up. This seemed pretty high, but I wasnt really sure. I did go through the trouble of "checking" that the shockwiz was reading proper travels on the fork by setting baseline air pressure fairly low and extending the fork to 50% travel and the device read perfect 50...


Hey mrdirt85,

Very sorry about not responding. There was an issue with our contact form on the website for a bit. When I would select "respond" it would pull our own email address in and I ended up just answering peoples questions to myself for a week or so. I went back through and forwarded everything and must have missed yours, very sorry about that.

To answer your question, as the spring compresses, the pressure inside the main positive air chamber eventually matches that of the ramp chamber. When that happens you start compressing the ramp up piston. As the ramp up piston compresses it increases the volume of the main positive chamber changing the spring curve (compression ratio). The ramp piston is essentially a air volume releif. As it compresses it changes how the pressure in the main chamber behaves. Less pressure in the ramp chamber means a more linear spring curve, more pressure means the spring curve has more ramp. When it is all said and done it basically means that, at some point in the travel, the ShockWiz travel percentage calculation is off.

The amount of pressure in the ramp chamber will also dictate how much of an impacts there is. Less pressure in the ramp chamber means more movement in the ramp up piston, which equates to a greater increase in air volume, and a larger variance in CR. Higher pressure, less movement and less variance in CR.

How much pressure do you run in the ramp chamber? Did you leave it pressurized when performing the ShockWiz calibration? If you leave it pressurized during the calibration, anything above say 60psi, then that ramp up piston probably doesn't move at all when you calibrate as the pressure (when deflated) probably doesn't get high enough when marking full compression to activate it. This means you only measured the compression ratio of the main chamber. Then when you go ride, and the fork is at operating pressure, the ramp piston starts to play a role and you are running off the wrong CR.

How have the recommendations been while using ShockWiz with this fork? If I am not mistaken we heard reports of it just asking you to keep taking air out.

I will get Nigel involved in this and see what he says, I just sent him some details about that air-spring and I am waiting to hear back.

[email protected]


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

Ah ha! Funny, right after I sent that post I found the powerpoint presentation on how the RXF fork operates on the specialized dealer website and immediately understood why the shockwiz isnt combatible. I never knew that piston was floating. Definitely explains a lot, and yes, the device constantly asks for air to be removed from one or both chambers. I have seen it occasionally read OK for one or the other chamber if I start a new session and only ride downhill type trails. I've found the rebound suggestions and low speed compression to be useable, but even with the HSC turned all the way down, the shockwiz always says its too high. I'm a bigger guy (6'3" 250lbs) and more often than not am on the high end of damping settings for factory tuned stuff. 

I had my suspicions all along that the fork wasn't compatible, but that's actually relieving to finally hear it straight from you cause it's been a struggle figuring out how to get it set up. No worries about the email thing, I figured something must have happened with the form. 

Other than that debacle, I'm totally stoked on the performance of the shockwiz. It has helped tremendously with my CCDB.

The only "gripe" that I have at this time would be: since I have climb switches, I'm really not too terribly concerned with the damping settings for uphill stuff. I wish there was a way to "pause" the shockwiz and not have to start a new session so that I could exclusively gather data on the downhill sections. I have a lot of seated climbing sections that I feel kind of skew the data.

Thanks, Alex!

Chris

Edit: Thinking more about what you said, and that you emailed Nigel about it. Are you thinking there may be some formula for a pressure to set the ramp chamber for calibration? I'll have to ponder that one after my morning coffee. Given that the volumes of the ramp and main are different, I'm not sure it would be as simple as a % difference. That, and any change to either chamber would require a totally new recalibration instead of just baseline, which would be a huge pain.


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Chris,

ShockWiz assumes that certain things are constant, or I should say, ShockWiz requires that they be constant in order for it to work properly. In the situation with the RXF air-spring, ShockWiz has no way of knowing whether or not the compression ratio is changing, how much it changing by, or for that matter at which point in the travel the change occurs. In order for it to know any of this you would need a Wiz monitoring each positive air chamber, likely have them communicate to one another, and there would probably have to be some special firmware specific to the RXF models. There are so many variables involved with that there would be no easy way to make it work. So no, this is going to work anytime in the near or distance future.

I just mentioned getting Nigel involved as he was also unfamiliar with that spring layout. I am pretty sure that you and I both have access to the same document, which I shared with him. Once he saw the layout he confirmed that it is not compatible with ShockWiz.

The whole "Press start to record" or ability to "pause" isn't a bad idea, it just opens up the opportunity to forget. I am sure you have missed hitting start on a Garmin or other head unit and understand how frustrating it is to do. What you should do is just experiment and see what happens. You should see how your suggestions are impacted if you let the session run after climbing when the switch is used; and then on the same section when it is not used. ShockWiz wants to see you pedal so just because you're trying to set things up for descending doesn't mean you can't record on the ups. I wouldn't expect it to make a huge difference, especially if you are climbing on relatively smooth trail/road.

The main thing that will change when climbing with the switch 'on' vs 'off' is pedal induced bobbing. With it off there will be more, which ShockWiz will try to correct with firmer (increase) LSC. If the switch is on, then Shockwiz might not even see enough movement (change in pressure) to make any suggestion at all. Depending how firm that shock becomes with the switch on, it may already act like a "Pause" button, as it may restrict movement enough that ShockWiz doesn't even realize you're riding.

[email protected]

P.S. It should be known that everything that I just said about the climb switch goes against what Nigel would say. And in the end he is correct, flipping on a climb switch is a damping change (ShockWiz has no idea when you make a change which is why the "New Session" feature exists) and does mean you should start a new session. However, if you able test it out and *(if in your situation)* flipping it on mid-session doesn't noticeably impact your suggestions I say run with it. If it does, then don't do it.


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## mrdirt85 (Mar 5, 2012)

Thanks again! I really appreciate all the info.


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## PUNKY (Apr 26, 2010)

I guess I'll have to wait until the new year to purchase one


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Any update on this or is it no longer available after being acquired by SRAM?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hello jacksonlui,

ShockWiz is not currently for sale to the general public. The only people with access to the device are the original Kickstarter backers. The backers have all received their devices and are actively using them, providing us with feedback along the way. We do not have any detailed information that can be shared about the availability of ShockWiz at this time. However, an announcement regarding it's future can be expected sometime this year.

Be sure to keep any eye on www.ShockWiz.com for announcements and feel free to sign up for the ShockWiz Newsletter while you're at it!

[email protected]


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

I'd like to rent one as well. I regret not doing the kickstarter when I could. 
Art


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I thought the idea of kickstarter was for the general public to provide support for products which will be made available to the general public.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey jacksonlui,

If you are someone that did not pledge to the the original Kickstarter project you currently have no means of obtaining ShockWiz. The only people who have the device, and are therefore capable of providing feedback, are the Kickstarter backers. Devices have not been provided to; anyone who is NOT a backer, or anyone who is NOT part of the development team. As stated above, an announcement regarding the future of ShockWiz can be expected sometime this year.

[email protected]


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## 7four8 (Sep 9, 2007)

Got an email that shockwiz is available to purchase. Exterior looks identical to kickstarter one but not sure if internals are the same.


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

7four8 said:


> Got an email that shockwiz is available to purchase. Exterior looks identical to kickstarter one but not sure if internals are the same.


Hello All,

Internals are the same. Only "change" is the firmware and app version, which are available to everyone anyway.

If any one has any questions I'm happy to answer.

Cheers,
[email protected]


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## Idaho (Sep 29, 2013)

Alex,

Is this DVO Diamond compatible? 

Thank you.


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## Mike232 (Mar 14, 2015)

Bought mine today. Been all over the place with setup on an RS-1. Looking forward to using Shockwiz to help dial it in.


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

I'm interested in a rental too. PM me


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

$400 is pretty expensive 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Overspeed (Jan 9, 2017)

Idaho said:


> Alex,
> 
> Is this DVO Diamond compatible?
> 
> Thank you.


Would like to know this too, also DVO topaz compatible?


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

What about Can creek shocks. DB and Inline? I am thinking about picking one of these up now they are back on the market. I want to use it for race courses over the summer. I really like nerding it up with stuff like this.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone know if you can use shockwiz is you have multiple bikes? After you tune the suspension on one bike can you put it on another and basically reset it? Also, do you need 2 of them for a fs bike or can you use 1 on the fork and then put it on the shock once you're done tuning?

$400x2 is expensive


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Ouch- Sram gets a hold of them and raises the price. Guess the Sram label is worth a little over $150.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

TwoTone said:


> Ouch- Sram gets a hold of them and raises the price. Guess the Sram label is worth a little over $150.


RIGHT!!! I know I was bummed as I found out about this about a day too late for the Kickstarter or I would have been all over it (regardless of the broken leg). Now looks like I am going to have to take it up the you know what to get one to play with.

:madman::madman:


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

dmo said:


> Anyone know if you can use shockwiz is you have multiple bikes? After you tune the suspension on one bike can you put it on another and basically reset it? Also, do you need 2 of them for a fs bike or can you use 1 on the fork and then put it on the shock once you're done tuning?
> 
> $400x2 is expensive


Its a measuring device which gives you data and a suggestion on your phone app. You can use it on any bike many times. You dont need 2 but you may need to redo a few times front and back.

For $400 I'd rather send my shock to get tuned by someone like avalanche. I'll wait for a sale or the used market. Ive never been shy about spending money on mutliple high end saddles, pedals, and carbon goodies but somehow i feel 400 is excessive. Maybe because it was lower and now they are magically higher after been taken over by sram. Maybe if you raced it may be worth it but you can say the same about carbon wheels. Idk why im hitting this mental block.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## trailbildr (Dec 8, 2004)

Go ahead and try to find any data acquisition device, let alone one that's quick and easy to set up and will talk to your phone or tablet. $400 is not overpriced for these units. Kickstarter backers had to wait 18 months to get them and they were about $190 each.

mk


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

trailbildr said:


> Go ahead and try to find any data acquisition device, let alone one that's quick and easy to set up and will talk to your phone or tablet. $400 is not overpriced for these units. Kickstarter backers had to wait 18 months to get them and they were about $190 each.
> 
> mk


Doesn't matter. Base on the guys not having the resources in place like a company as big as Sram and they were able to generate enough profit to get this produced at that price point. To me a company as large as Sram should have been able to keep the cost the same or actually bring it down.

It's my opinion, you have yours.


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## Rootsboy (Mar 25, 2013)

I guess the price may drop after a year or two, best idea is to try and get a few mates involved and spread the cost of one and share it over time. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Shockwiz claims the kickstarter price was sold at a loss. After sram took over theyve decided to sell at 110% more. Doesnt add up. Sram is probably trying to sell to those that think 400 is a reasonable price then drop it next year after year. 
A .003psi accurate pressure sensor is $1.50, accelerometer is $1, rasberry pi zero is $5. So bom is less than $15. R&D is a lot but gets amortized. Perhaps sram figured they will only sell a handful. $385 margin is a lot. But since its sram now, maybe their overhead is a lot more than when it was DD. Gotta factor in operating expenses 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

I will rent mine to whoever may want.


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## 7four8 (Sep 9, 2007)

Glad I got the kickstarter price but it did take 18 months. It is a very useful tool so either rent from a shop or go in with some friends. I can see more shops with them now that they're available.


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## ghoti (Mar 23, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> For $400 I'd rather send my shock to get tuned by someone like avalanche.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


This. Tried dialing in my suspension per recommendations but it still wasn't good. Aftermarket tune where they reshimmed fixed everything. Probably should rent it again and see what it recommends.


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hello dmo,

ShockWiz can be moved around and used on as many suspension products as you like, given that the suspension you're installing it on is compatible. 

In order to use ShockWiz it must be calibrated to the fork or shock it is installed on in order to properly analyse your suspension's performance. The calibration process requires that the compression ratio and the baseline air pressure be set. In most cases you will not know your air springs compression ratio, so this will need to be measured. The ShockWiz app features a Calibration Wizard that walks you through this process step by step. 

Once calibrated, its ready to use and you can go for a ride. While riding the device measures the pressure of the positive air chamber 100x a second, runs the data through the ShockWiz Algorithm, and outputs easy to understand tuning Suggestions. 

The data captured by ShockWiz stores on the device, not within the app, meaning it;s not required to ride with your phone. The data can be accessed at anytime by connecting to the App, and will not be erased until you select "Start New Session" within the app. 

ShockWiz devices cannot communicate with one another and using one ShockWiz, and swapping it between the front and rear suspension, is no less effective than using two simultaneously. The only disadvantage of using one device is the added time in tuning the fork and shock individually.

When using a single device to tune a full suspension bike, install and calibrate ShockWiz to the fork or shock and go ride. It does not matter which is tuned first, the end result will be the same. Using the iterative tuning process, keep ShockWiz installed until you are satisfied with the Shock Tuning Score and feel of that suspension component. Then, install and calibrate ShockWiz to the other suspension component and again, keep ShockWiz installed until you are satisfied with the Shock Tuning Score and feel of that suspension component.

As a general note, it is always recommended that you record the settings of your suspension before removing ShockWiz. This includes; Baseline Air Pressure, Number of tokens/ bands installed, and all current damper setting positions. These settings cannot be stored in the App, and it is recommend that a page for each component be created in your phone or tablets "Notes" app. 

For more information I suggest visiting Quarq.com > Support > ShockWiz Online Help. It contains many useful articles about the use and function of ShockWiz.

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Idaho,

Yes, DVO Diamond is compatible. 

Cheers,
[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Overspeed,

Yes, both the Diamond and Topaz are good to go.

Cheers,
Alex Miller


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

So no on can creek stuff since you did not answer yes like the other questions? 

In case it was missed......

Cane creek DB air and inline? 

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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey hitechrednec,

Patience sir! I "noobed" things up a bit by jumping into the middle of the thread. Cleaning up what I missed now.  

As long as you're talking about the air versions of those shocks, then yes ShockWiz is compatible. Not compatible with coil shocks for obvious reasons.

ShockWiz offers Tuning Suggestion for Baseline Air Pressure, Air Spring Ramp (Bottomless tokens and bands), Rebound (LSR), HSC, LSC, and Bottom Out Resistance. So the only adjustment that those shocks feature that ShockWiz does not have a Suggestion for is High Speed Rebound. 

[email protected]


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Awesome thanks you. I am thinking I will order one and run this and go through can creeks "Dialed" app at the same time and see how they correlate. 

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## Mike232 (Mar 14, 2015)

As Alex pointed out, lots of great info on Shockwiz site. Link:

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/categories/203983928-USING-SHOCKWIZ


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Quarq Tech said:


> So the only adjustment that those shocks feature that ShockWiz does not have a Suggestion for is High Speed Rebound.
> 
> [email protected]


Hey Alex, can you tell why that is the case? Are there any plans to add a suggestion for HSR?

Thanks Robert


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Because rock shock. .. sram, does not have that adjustment on their forks or shocks. So it is left off, to make there stuff not appear to be lacking a adjustment that other may have. Would be my guess. 

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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Robert,

The simple answer is that we consciously decided to omit HSR from the list of Suggestions. There is nothing about the device that restricts us from providing this recommendation, we just determined that leaving it in had less value than leaving it out.

The reason we left it out was largely based on how few suspension products feature this adjustment, and (probably more importantly) the added confusion it could create for those who did not. When it comes to *high and low speed rebound* the number of people that understand it's application are much fewer than those that understand *high and low speed compression. * Not sure why this is, but it's certainly what we have found. Everything about ShockWiz App is designed will intuition in mind. We want users of all experiences to navigate the app and the information being displayed with ease.

ShockWiz has had a very atypical 'coming to life' when compared to other SRAM products. The initial release to the kickstarter backers allowed us to have more or less a soft launch of the product, and gave us great insight into what is and is not needed. We have heard very few requests for HSR.

Having said that, we have discussed bringing it back. Whether or not we do will be largely based on the number of requests that we get. So if you want to see it, tell your friends and start hammering our contact form at Quarq.com with requests!

Cheers,
Alex


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## Overspeed (Jan 9, 2017)

ordered.... looking forward to trying it out on the diamond and topaz


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey hitechrednec,

Not true. See my explanation below to Robert as to why this suggestion was not included. Most air sprung RockShox products don't have external High Speed Compression or Hydraulic Bottom Out Resistance adjustments either, and we left those in. 

[email protected]


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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

Just ordered one here in the UK. Looking forward to trying it out as I tend to set up as per the manufacturers instructions and then leave it as it is. No idea if it could be set up better so hopefully this will be of great benefit to me.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Hey Alex,

thanks for the replay. I already thought that it must be possible for the device to measure HSR related data, so thanks for the confirmation.
I also agree with you, that the vast majority of riders do have a better understanding about the compression side of things.
What I don´t understand is, that of all things, exactly this knowlage brought you to the conclusion to discard this feature?! In my opinion this makes no sense cause the reason why people spent a fair amount of money for such a product is that they are estimating that this thing will help them dialing in the damper correctly because they feel that there is room for improvement or because they´ve no clue at all. As you already said yourself....HSR for sure is one of the settings most people don´t understand. Additionally it is verry difficult to monitor HSR in another way. For a verry rough judgment on HSC, one could monitor the indicator o-rings on the shock or the fork to "measure" max. used travel with different settings, but something like this, isn´t the case with HSR.
So I would say, that a device which can help me with the settings I understand least would help me the most.

It is also true that many shocks and forks don´t have the external HSR adjustment, but on the other hand, there are quiet a few. Even Rockshox has the Vivid Air (Attn. hitchredneck) in their current lineup and had this on airsprung Boxxer WC forks in the past. If I remember it right...at the time the Vivid R2C was launched, their (Rockshox) argument was, that adjustable HSR is more important then adjustable HSC which is why they went without HSC adjustment but included HSR. So if that is indeed the case, this concept should be reflected in the Shockwiz also. It´s the same company after all... 

Another thing...wouldn´t it be possible to include a inquiry in the "Calibration Wizard" where all possible adjustments of the given fork/damper are requested, which later on would cause the app to only give suggestions which can actually be carried out?! 

Or some kind of "Expert Menu"... only thinking...

Anyway...I´ve my Shockwiz already sitting on my desk and I´m verry excited about trying it out, but as I´ve a Vivid Air and 2 Doublebarrel Air, I´m a bit disappointed about the missing HSR feature because that´s the one I struggle the most!

Therefor, I would highly appreciate it, if you are deciding to bring HSR back!

Cheers Robert


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## Mike232 (Mar 14, 2015)

My Shockwiz Direct Mount arrived this evening. Un-boxed and installed on fork. Kind of apprehensive of its position on bottom cap but doesn't hang any lower than disc brake rotor. Still...makes me a little nervous. Unfortunately probably won't get to play with it until this weekend.


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Mine should be on the way via my LBS. 

Alex, did they move you to the springs for the project? 

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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Robert,

For the sake of not spending half an hour responding, I agree with everything you've said about HSR. 

There has been discussions about adding in a feature like you describe to the calibration wizard, or some sort of fork or shock profile builder. It's a bit up in the air if this will come about. There is A LOT that we can do with this device and we fully intend to, just know we're going to be a calculated about how we release things.

I will mark you down for 'Strongly Agrees' for the questions of 'HSR should be returned to the app'. 

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

hitechredneck said:


> Mine should be on the way via my LBS.
> 
> Alex, did they move you to the springs for the project?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


No, still here in Spearfish SD at Quarq HQ. Pretty great riding out here in the Black Hills of South Dakota, especially with this warm weather. Rode nearly 40 miles of mountain last weekend on actual dirt!

We do communicate with Springs on a pretty regular basis though. I personally worked closely with the technical communications department which, is out of Springs, to create the manual and how-to videos.

[email protected]


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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

Alex, A good question up there seems to have been missed (or I've missed the response) 
When I'm out riding I sometimes flick the switch on my shock into the "trail" setting for a long climb. How does that affect the data on the shockwiz? Should I just leave it open while the shockwiz is connected?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

mugstud said:


> Alex, A good question up there seems to have been missed (or I've missed the response)
> When I'm out riding I sometimes flick the switch on my shock into the "trail" setting for a long climb. How does that affect the data on the shockwiz? Should I just leave it open while the shockwiz is connected?


That's a great question, and I'm glad you brought that up.

You've got it right, leave your suspension in 'Open' when tuning with ShockWiz. There are a few reasons for this; data integrity and giving ShockWiz an unrestricted view of how your suspension is behaving.

The Data Integrity piece is fairly easy as long as you understand a few things about how ShockWiz works. First up is knowing what a 'Ride Session' is, which is simply a period of time that ShockWiz is collecting data on your suspension. The Session length can last as long as you like, the only caveat is that nothing can change during it. If ANYTHING is changed, such as adding a click of rebound, removing air pressure, or flicking a switch from open to pedal, you've changed how the suspension behaves. This makes all the data gathered up to that point no longer relevant.

While riding with ShockWiz everything needs to remain constant while you gather data. Once sufficient data is gathered, you review the data and determine what needs adjusting. You can then act on the tuning Suggestions, per the Suspension Tuning Article found here.

Once changes have been made, you select 'Start New Session' within the app to clear your data. You then go for another ride and gather a new data set to determine if the changes you made were effective.

This process of riding, analyzing and adjusting, and then riding again to test the changes, makes up the Iterative Tuning process and outlines how ShockWiz should be used. You would repeat this process as many times as necessary until you are satisfied with both the Shock Tuning Score and feel of your suspension.

The unrestricted view piece is sort of tied into the Suspension Tuning Order, but basically you don't want to mask the performance of the air spring with a bunch of compression damping. You really want all of your Compression damping to be fully open when you first start. This way ShockWiz gets the best look at how the combination of Pressure and Ramp are behaving. The combination of those are more or less the foundation of your tune and pretty much have the biggest impact on how your suspension will perform. Once you get those two correct, you move onto rebound. From there the remaining compression adjustments are just icing on the cake. You just keep working down the list of Suggestions, one at a time, until they'er as good as they can be.

Once you have your suspension dialed in 'Open', you can then use your climb switch or lockout as you see fit.

[email protected]


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

How much data will it hold? How long can I ride for to get a "overall" setup for my local trails? Will it do more then one ride? 

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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

Great response Alex and thanks for taking the time to type such a detailed reply. Really looking forward to getting mine.


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## Mike232 (Mar 14, 2015)

Alex - I think you left a step out of the following:
"Once changes have been made, you select 'Start New Session' within the app to clear your data. You then go for another ride and gather a new data set to determine if the changes you made were effective."

After you make the setup up changes I think you need to reset baseline air pressure (if air spring pressure is changed) and if air spring ramp is changed you need to re measure the compression ratio in calibration wizard. Correct?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Mike232 said:


> Alex - I think you left a step out of the following:
> "Once changes have been made, you select 'Start New Session' within the app to clear your data. You then go for another ride and gather a new data set to determine if the changes you made were effective."
> 
> After you make the setup up changes I think you need to reset baseline air pressure (if air spring pressure is changed) and if air spring ramp is changed you need to re measure the compression ratio in calibration wizard. Correct?


So depending on what is adjusted will determine what needs to be done in the app. Changes to damper settings (rebound and compression) only require that you Start a New Session. Changes to Ramp and Baseline Air Pressure have their own requirements.

To make this easier on everyone, each Suggestion has an 'information' page within the app. This page is accessed by tapping on the actual suggestion and contains everything you need to know in order to act on the suggestion.

How the adjustment is actually made.

What making that change will feel like.

How much adjustment the colored indicator equates to.

A notice which instructs you what to do after making that adjustment, such as starting a new session, marking baseline air pressure or re-measuring the compression ratio. The notice outlines what must be done after making a change to that specific adjustment.

The manual contains a lot of really great information and is worth having a look through.

ShockWiz User Manual (english)
ShockWiz User Manual (EU)

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

hitechredneck said:


> How much data will it hold? How long can I ride for to get a "overall" setup for my local trails? Will it do more then one ride?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


See my response to mugstud, specifically the part that talks about Ride Sessions and Iterative Tuning.

When you are performing a Ride Session with ShockWiz you certainly want to ensure you have sufficient data before you start making changes. So asking how long you need to ride for is kind of the wrong way to look at it. Duration is certainly a factor, but whats more important is what's required to collect data.

In order for ShockWiz to gather data on your suspension, it must see suspension movement. The more movement you can subject your suspension to during a Ride Session, the more opportunities ShockWiz has to analyze it's behavior, and the quicker it can gather data and provide quality Suggestions. So a big factor here is what you can subject your suspension to, which is why 'what you ride' is probably more important than 'how long you ride'.

This is just a scenario, but it highlights what I'm talking about. You can expect your suspension to be a lot more active when riding a rough and dynamic trail, than when riding a flow trail. The more suspension movement a trail can create, the more ShockWiz sees, and the faster you get data. In this case, if you ride each trail for 5 minutes, you'll certainly gather more data on the rough and dynamic trail than the flow trail. So there is a time component here, but it's heavily influenced by what you're riding.

There are some built in features within the App that help determine when sufficient data has been collected. See our Confidence and What To Ride Next article for more information.

When it comes to how many Ride Sessions are required to achieve a high Shock Tuning Score, you can assume that 2-4 sessions per terrain type will get you very close to where you need to be.

I will say that Air Spring Ramp Suggestions should not be skipped over. I understand that this adjustment is the most involved of the 6, but it's important to get correct early on in the Iterative Tuning process.To get the fastest results follow the Suspension Tuning Order outline in this article here.

[email protected]


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## Mike232 (Mar 14, 2015)

Got it. Thanks Alex.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

I've got a couple questions...

How do you adjust for settings that a shock doesn't have? High speed compression and bottom out resistance specifically. 

Why include HSC, but leave out the HSR? Perhaps a future update that lets the user choose which damper settings are applicable to their shock?

My initial calibration showed a travel of negative 1-4%. Is that normal? Resetting the baseline air pressure restores it to zero...

Thanks for taking time to help Alex. Im looking forward to finally getting my suspension tuned.


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Quarq Tech said:


> As I said, if there are any questions or concerns that pertain to ShockWiz let them fly.
> 
> Alex


Hey Alex, does this work with a lefty fork? Thank you for clarifying things in this thread


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## Overspeed (Jan 9, 2017)

had my first ride with the shockwiz installed on the diamond today, didn't get time to make adjustments, but most things were yellow and rebound green. 
Will make adjustments tonight and reset and ride again tomorrow, any idea how change the ramp up on a diamond, OTT adjustment? More or less? no tokens on this fork.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Overspeed said:


> ... any idea how change the ramp up on a diamond, OTT adjustment? More or less? no tokens on this fork.


OTT isn´t the correct adjustment for changing the ramp cause it´s mainly affecting the first part of the travel. To alter the ramp, some users added oil to the airspring in order to decrese the volume. When you read early reviews of pre-production Diamonds there is often a part in it which indicates that this was done to them aswell. But I don´t know if this is a tuning feature advertised as per manufactuer and I´m assuming that the amount of oil which can be added without interfering with the overall performance is certainly limited?!

I would suggest to read this: http://forums.mtbr.com/shocks-suspension/dvo-diamond-936949.html


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

I'm wanting to purchase one of these 2nd hand. If anyone wants to sell theirs, PM me and we'll talk. Thanks!


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Never mind! I just bought one!


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

the_joe said:


> Hey Alex, does this work with a lefty fork? Thank you for clarifying things in this thread


Hey joe,

Yes ShockWiz does work with Air Sprung versions of the lefty. You can either go the direct mount or standard version.

Direct mount installation will be a breeze but the device does hang quite low compared to an RS-1. Should still be fine but something to keep in mind. All direct mount versions of ShockWiz ship with a hose adapter that allows them to be used on a traditional fork and rear shock.

If you go for a standard version it can still be mounted to the Lefty, you just have to get a bit creative. If you get it right though, it will be more out of the way and is quite secure.

[email protected]


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

hitechredneck said:


> How much data will it hold? How long can I ride for to get a "overall" setup for my local trails? Will it do more then one ride?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


cough....

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

mpress said:


> I've got a couple questions...
> 
> How do you adjust for settings that a shock doesn't have? High speed compression and bottom out resistance specifically.
> 
> ...


Hello mpress,

Great question. There are two ways to handle this.

1) You either ignore the suggestions you don't have adjustments for and instead focus on getting those you do have control over right. This often corrects those you don't have control over.

2) You send your suspension back to the manufacturer or suspension specialist to have the stock tuned changed, if applicable.

As an FYI, the best way to start riding with ShockWiz is to set all your compression adjustments to full open or soft, and then go ride. This puts all the focus on the spring (Baseline Air Pressure and Air Spring Ramp). This gives ShockWiz a very unrestricted view of how the spring is working and what it's capable of. If after the ride you have Suggestions to change either Baseline Air Pressure or Ramp, make these first and retest to ensure they indicate 'OK' before adding any compression adjustments. I recommend checking out this article about Tuning Order found here.

If after following the correct tuning procedure, the adjustments you do not have control over do not move to "OK", you either continue to ignore as your suspension is probably performing very well at this point, or you can look at having the stock tune changed.

If after numerous Ride Sessions ShockWiz is always asking for softer HSC, you could have your HSC shim stack tuned softer (same goes for firmer if that's what it's asking for). This would need to be done by a professional which probably means sending it back to the manufacturer or specialty service center, but the upside is you have data to back up the need.

In the end, I wouldn't get too bent out of shape if you have a yellow indicator for something you lack an adjuster for.

A config-urator has been considered for omitting and including adjustments, it remains to be seen whether or not we will provide this.

If you saw a negative travel percentage it means you marked Baseline Air pressure, and the actual pressure in the positive chamber dropped slightly. This most commonly occurs if the negative and positive chambers did not full equalize prior to marking the baseline pressure. Re-marking to re-zero that value out is the correct thing to do.

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Quarq Tech said:


> See my response to mugstud, specifically the part that talks about Ride Sessions and Iterative Tuning.
> 
> When you are performing a Ride Session with ShockWiz you certainly want to ensure you have sufficient data before you start making changes. So asking how long you need to ride for is kind of the wrong way to look at it. Duration is certainly a factor, but whats more important is what's required to collect data.
> 
> ...


@hitechredneck Thought I already got this one. However if I missed something please be specific in what your asking for.

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Overspeed said:


> had my first ride with the shockwiz installed on the diamond today, didn't get time to make adjustments, but most things were yellow and rebound green.
> Will make adjustments tonight and reset and ride again tomorrow, any idea how change the ramp up on a diamond, OTT adjustment? More or less? no tokens on this fork.


Hey Overspeed,

Mantra is correct. OTT has nothing to do with air volume in the positive chamber. What OTT does do is increase or decrease the preload of the negative spring, effectively making it firmer or softer. These forks use a coil spring for the negative instead of an air spring like RS and FOX. Increasing the available force of the negative spring will give the fork better small bump compliance as it's job is to help overcome seal friction and essentially push the fork into it's travel.

Adding oil into the positive chamber will reduce the available volume for air and accomplish the same thing as adding a token. You just need to check with DVO first to make sure you use an oil that won't react negatively with the o-rings. You'll also want to ask what the maximum amount is you can safely add. If you over do you'll cause hydraulic lock and damage the spring.

[email protected]


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey joe,
> 
> Yes ShockWiz does work with Air Sprung versions of the lefty. You can either go the direct mount or standard version.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the info


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

In the calibration; it says to compress and hold to at least 50% of travel. This is a physical impossibility!. If pressures are reasonable, anyone would be lucky to compress and hold at 30 or 40%. Does that mean by not going through that step poperly its not working? I usually need 65-70psi and the 'balanced' suggested my try of 80psi was too low!? Hence my concerns the calibration may be wrong.


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> In the calibration; it says to compress and hold to at least 50% of travel. This is a physical impossibility!. If pressures are reasonable, anyone would be lucky to compress and hold at 30 or 40%. Does that mean by not going through that step poperly its not working? I usually need 65-70psi and the 'balanced' suggested my try of 80psi was too low!? Hence my concerns the calibration may be wrong.


Hey Lucifuge,

First off, great work reading! I mean that too, I doubt most read all the instruction in the cal wizard. I assume you're talking about the 'Cycle Suspension' step. This may require change, but it says to compress to 50% and then pull to full extension, not to hold. Either way you are not the first to get concerned about this.

So, a little word about the Calibration Wizard. The only steps that pertain to measuring the CR are: 
Mark Full Extension
Mark Full Compression
Verify Full Extension
Once you get to the 'Infalte' step, the CR has already been measured. The 50% wording was placed in there to ensure that bypass dimples from all manufacturers would be hit after inflating to ensure the positive and negative chambers are properly balance. It is not critical that you compress 50% during the Equalization step.

What fork are you trying to calibrate to? What is the measured compression ratio when you complete the Wizard? Depending on the model 80 psi might be pretty high so I wonder if there is an issue with the calibration.

If you use the compression ratio measured during calibration, how accurate is the reported travel percentage within the app when compared to the actual measured travel via the o-ring on the stanchion?

If you compress the fork in a controlled manner til the app displays 20%, does the o-ring verify this?

[email protected]


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

It's a 160 solo air lyrik with a vorsprung luftkappe and a fast rebound tune from rockshox 


Quarq Tech said:


> Hey Lucifuge,
> 
> First off, great work reading! I mean that too, I doubt most read all the instruction in the cal wizard. I assume you're talking about the 'Cycle Suspension' step. This may require change, but it says to compress to 50% and then pull to full extension, not to hold. Either way you are not the first to get concerned about this.
> 
> ...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I will have to check the CR tonight and let you know.

How does the CR relate to reported travel???



Quarq Tech said:


> Hey Lucifuge,
> 
> First off, great work reading! I mean that too, I doubt most read all the instruction in the cal wizard. I assume you're talking about the 'Cycle Suspension' step. This may require change, but it says to compress to 50% and then pull to full extension, not to hold. Either way you are not the first to get concerned about this.
> 
> ...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

OK, I went through the calibration again. When I let all the air out and go though the compression and extension parts, while I can compress fully, I can't get full extension...maybe I'm getting 80% it just feels to hard to go further. At the end of the calibration its telling me the CR is 2.0 and the that its sinking 8% into its travel when its not. Also the app's measurement vs the actual stanchions markers are off. When I put a CR manually of 2.5; it improves it almost 1-1. So that's what I left it at and went for a ride. Even after a decent ride its still on 49% wanting some jumps etc. 

Does a CR of approx 2.5 on a 160 Lyrik with an effective token installed @ 70psi sound reasonable?

Also can you please confirm if the ratio is calculated in the calibration steps prior to inflation?


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## nikon255 (Dec 27, 2015)

You got underpressure in your lowers (zip tie trick) or you let the air out of positive without equalizing negative.


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Quarq Tech said:


> @hitechredneck Thought I already got this one. However if I missed something please be specific in what your asking for.
> 
> [email protected]


Thanks, I am looking for how much can it hold as opposed to how much I need. ie. can I leave it fitted on for 20hr of local ride time over a week with different trails locally and have it suggest more of a all around tune? I do not need exact numbers but if I am only getting say 4 hours of data instead of 20 I would rather know that ahead of time. Also how do you know when it has reached its capacity for data?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> OK, I went through the calibration again. When I let all the air out and go though the compression and extension parts, while I can compress fully, I can't get full extension...maybe I'm getting 80% it just feels to hard to go further. At the end of the calibration its telling me the CR is 2.0 and the that its sinking 8% into its travel when its not. Also the app's measurement vs the actual stanchions markers are off. When I put a CR manually of 2.5; it improves it almost 1-1. So that's what I left it at and went for a ride. Even after a decent ride its still on 49% wanting some jumps etc.
> 
> Does a CR of approx 2.5 on a 160 Lyrik with an effective token installed @ 70psi sound reasonable?
> 
> Also can you please confirm if the ratio is calculated in the calibration steps prior to inflation?


Thanks for all the info Lucifage. We'll take this one at a time.

How does the CR relate to reported travel???
ShockWiz needs to know the CR in order to calculate where the suspension is in the travel based on spring pressure. When you 'Mark Baseline Air Pressure' you're telling ShockWiz what pressure equals 0% travel. Any increase in pressure from Baseline as the fork or shock compresses can then be converted into a Shock Travel Percentage using the compression ratio. There is a hyperbolic relationship between spring pressure and travel.

Compression ratio (CR) is how many times the pressure in the suspension multiplies from full extension to full compression. ie: if the CR is 3.0 and the Baseline Air Pressure (full extension pressure) is 100 psi, then the pressure at full compression will be 300 psi (all pressures are absolute, not 'shock pump' pressures).

Since pressure and volume are related, the other way to think about it is the reduction in volume. Continuing the example above, the volume inside the suspension at full compression will be one third that of full extension.​
OK, I went through the calibration again. When I let all the air out and go though the compression and extension parts, while I can compress fully, I can't get full extension...maybe I'm getting 80% it just feels to hard to go further. At the end of the calibration its telling me the CR is 2.0 and the that its sinking 8% into its travel when its not. Also the app's measurement vs the actual stanchions markers are off. When I put a CR manually of 2.5; it improves it almost 1-1. So that's what I left it at and went for a ride. Even after a decent ride its still on 49% wanting some jumps etc. 
That is really odd to me that you cannot pull the fork to full extension. When you deflate you aren't compressing the fork while the Schrader valve is depressed are you? If you are, stop doing that. If you create a vacuum in the positive chamber (fork sucking down) it will be very difficult to fully extend it and it will mean an incorrect CR.

When you Mark Full Extension is the measurement is the app reporting a negative psi?

Try deflating in steps. Let out some air, cycle the suspension to equalize the chambers, repeat. After letting some air out physically pull the fork to full extension, compress about 20%, pull to full extension, etc. You should be able to hear a very light 'hiss' when the piston passes over the bypass dimple.

When properly deflated you should have no problem pulling the fork to full extension (top out), and Full compression should be fairly easy, but you'll have to throw your weight into it. ​
Does a CR of approx 2.5 on a 160 Lyrik with an effective token installed @ 70psi sound reasonable?
I don't have a CR chart that I can reference so it's hard to say. Lets make sure you have the above correct.​
Also can you please confirm if the ratio is calculated in the calibration steps prior to inflation?Yes, Mark Full Extension, Mark Full Compression, and Verify Full Extension are responsible for measuring the CR.​
[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

hitechredneck said:


> Thanks, I am looking for how much can it hold as opposed to how much I need. ie. can I leave it fitted on for 20hr of local ride time over a week with different trails locally and have it suggest more of a all around tune? I do not need exact numbers but if I am only getting say 4 hours of data instead of 20 I would rather know that ahead of time. Also how do you know when it has reached its capacity for data?


Ah! Ok, so this is kind of half answered and half not in previous responses.

Thanks, I am looking for how much can it hold as opposed to how much I need. ie. can I leave it fitted on for 20hr of local ride time over a week with different trails locally and have it suggest more of a all around tune? I do not need exact numbers but if I am only getting say 4 hours of data instead of 20 I would rather know that ahead of time.

So what you're asking here is what we call a 'Ride Session' or 'Session'. A Session is a period of time that ShockWiz is collecting data. The start of a session is marked by selecting "Start New Session' within the app. Doing so erases all previous ride data and gives you a clean slate to start collecting data. A session can be as short as a few minutes or several hours. The only caveat is that your suspension adustments must remain unchanged during any one session. If you do make a change, such as adding a click of rebound, you need must select Start New Session within the app to clear the previous ride data, so you can collect new data on the what your suspension is now setup.

Additionally, you would want the terrain, or mix of terrain to remain consistent within a given Session as well.

Then, how do you know when ShockWiz has enough data? Check out our Confidence and What to Ride Next Article , it explains this well.

 Confidence and What To Ride Next ​
Also how do you know when it has reached its capacity for data?

It never really reached it's 'Maximum' of data. It works as a scrolling buffer that looks at your most recent event history. So if you ride long enough, new data will eventually push old data out, but it never stops taking data in.

As far as when the 'buffer' is full and you're pushing the old out with the new, it's when Confidence reaches 100%.

Based on this, 4 hours is plenty sufficient. If fact, you can probably go significantly shorter if you pin point certain sections of trails or terrain types to tune on.

It may take some 'juggling' to get the 'average tune' your looking for, but you could tune to a rough and rocky trail and get a baseline for that. Then go tune on a smoother, flowy trail and find the baseline for that. From here you would just work to blend the two together until you're happy with how your bike handles all terrain types.

It is important to understand that the 'best' tune for all terrain is never going to be 'perfect' but instead the best compromise. You'll never find a tune that works best for all terrain types. In the suspension world you're always robbing Peter to pay Paul. ​
Does that answer your question?

[email protected]


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

question for Quarq Tech:

what does pushing the bike (back up the top of a rooty trail) do for a session? is that contributing 'bad' data, or merely keeping 'confidence' from attaining useful values?

and carrying the bike (up a mountain), shockwiz probably just goes to sleep, right?

thx ...


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey ragetty,

No problem!

_"what does pushing the bike (back up the top of a rooty trail) do for a session? is that contributing 'bad' data, or merely keeping 'confidence' from attaining useful values?"
_
It shouldn't do anything at all, positive or negative. In order for ShockWiz to capture any data it needs to see suspension movement. If it doesn't see pressure change it's no different than the bike not moving at all.

Unless the section of trail is REALLY short, chances are you'll have enough data at the bottom each time allowing you to treat each decent as it's own session.

Also remember that ShockWiz needs to see you pedal the bike. So a pedal up the fire road is a good thing.​
_"...and carrying the bike (up a mountain), shockwiz probably just goes to sleep, right?"
_
More or less the same as above. Though ShockWiz will likely stay awake via the accelerometer.​
[email protected]


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Alex - I sent an email regarding my Shockwiz having massive issues with bluetooth connectivity. Was it received? (I got no email receipt if it received)


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

Quarq Tech said:


> It shouldn't do anything at all, positive or negative. In order for ShockWiz to capture any data it needs to see suspension movement. If it doesn't see pressure change it's no different than the bike not moving at all.


Thx for the reply, but you didn't answer the question for the case when the suspension IS moving marginally (pushing/bouncing the unloaded bike up over stones and roots) - specifically, is this generating 'bad' data and should be avoided (i.e. start new session at top), or will it just affect 'confidence' ... or is there something else we need to know?

Thx ...


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

... and another question .-)

when i move away from the bike and my iphone looses the BT connection, the recommendations dissappear - should this be happening, or, in other words, why aren't the values 'sticky' for the last data transfer?


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

Question for Quarq Tech

I have a Direct Mount Shockwiz which out of the box reports -792.3psi. I presume that is a DOA and I need to return it.

My other "normal" Shockwiz reports normal numbers.

Tried a firmware update and it is still the same.

thx


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

petercarm said:


> Question for Quarq Tech
> 
> I have a Direct Mount Shockwiz which out of the box reports -792.3psi. I presume that is a DOA and I need to return it.
> 
> ...


Hey Peter,

Please contact Quarq Customer Service to resolve that.

https://www.quarq.com/contact-us/

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

raggetty
_
Thx for the reply, but you didn't answer the question for the case when the suspension IS moving marginally (pushing/bouncing the unloaded bike up over stones and roots) - specifically, is this generating 'bad' data and should be avoided (i.e. start new session at top), or will it just affect 'confidence' ... or is there something else we need to know?
_
My apologies for missing this. In a perfect world you would avoid it, but I wouldn't expect it to have much of an impact. It really depends on how much the suspension is moving while you hike.

Unless your smashing around the bike while hiking the small compressions of the suspension will at most trigger a false positive for pedaling, which is mainly associated with the Bobbing detection and LSC. I would also expect any results from this to average out very quickly once you start riding again.

You could easily test this. Include the hike in a session and then another without the hike, and see if there is any change in the results.
​_ ... and another question .-)

when i move away from the bike and my iphone looses the BT connection, the recommendations dissappear - should this be happening, or, in other words, why aren't the values 'sticky' for the last data transfer?

_
Yes this is normal. I am not sure of the technical reason. We do intend to implement some form of Save feature, but for now you must resort to screen shots.​
[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey lucifage,

I did a quick sweep through the inbox and did not see it. I have sent you a private message to get this resolved. 

[email protected]


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Hello all, wonder if we can get some more feedback from the Shockwiz owner out there. Want to buy one, but I read always same everywhere:

Put it on my shock and the setup was good. 
Made the recommended adjustment and felt better. 

But what about, change this good adjustment and Shockwiz recognised even smaller changes and recommended the correct countermeasure. 

Can someone please help? 

Gesendet von meinem SM-N910F mit Tapatalk


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hello mpress,
> 
> Great question. There are two ways to handle this.
> 
> ...


Hey Alex,

first off all...I appreciate verry much what you are doing here!!! I´ve seldomly seen such a big company in this business, being that close to the customer! I hope SRAM appreciates your effort aswell and pays accordingly! If not...I would suggest to forward them a link to my post. Such great (and helpfull!!!) interaction with customers must be worth some dollars and you are doing great!

Second...I didn´t expect you going down the "factory tuning" route, thats why I didn´t mention this scenarion in my earlyer posts, but as you do....I consider this another strong argument for bringing back HSR. Seems like everybody wants to play with shims today 

In other words...It just doesn´t make any sense to leave HSR out of the this. Why that is so... you said it yourself...even if there aren´t any external adjustment options, there are internal ones (in most cases at least). Further...I think it is common sense that a suitable rebound tune is far more important (and way more user specific, given various rider weights) than the hydraulic part of compression.
I would say...1. spring weight and curve 2. rebound and than, low speed compression. Highspeed compression isn´t that important if the spring curve is already set reasonably....

just saying...


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

boblike said:


> Hello all, wonder if we can get some more feedback from the Shockwiz owner out there. Want to buy one, but I read always same everywhere:
> 
> Put it on my shock and the setup was good.
> Made the recommended adjustment and felt better.
> ...


Nobody? 
Sorry I am German, maybe my question is not clear?

Gesendet von meinem SM-N910F mit Tapatalk


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

boblike said:


> Nobody?
> Sorry I am German, maybe my question is not clear?
> 
> Gesendet von meinem SM-N910F mit Tapatalk


Hey, I must say that I indeed don´t really understand your question... I´m German aswell, so if you try it again in German, maybe I can help?!


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

mantra said:


> Hey, I must say that I indeed don´t really understand your question... I´m German aswell, so if you try it again in German, maybe I can help?!


I think what he is saying is that all of the "reviews" so far are pretty vague as far as specifics, fine tuning performance, and real world comparisons to dialed feel-based tuning.

Seems that all of the pro websites that received the units were limited to a "first impressions" type of blurb (maybe by SRAM?)... hopefully legit reviews are incoming.


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Let's try this one. 

What happens if you change the Rebound by 2 or 3 clicks. Is Shockwiz recognising exactly this change and recommends to adjust the Rebound back? Same applies for the rest of the Setup. Is Shockwiz always precisely leading you back to the initially perfect settings? 



Gesendet von meinem SM-N910F mit Tapatalk


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

boblike said:


> Let's try this one.
> 
> What happens if you change the Rebound by 2 or 3 clicks. Is Shockwiz recognising exactly this change and recommends to adjust the Rebound back? Same applies for the rest of the Setup. Is Shockwiz always precisely leading you back to the initially perfect settings?


I think we got it! Hopefully the below answers your question.

It's important to remember that there is no such thing as an ideal tune - unfortunately it does not exist and suspension tuning is always a compromise. A tune that works well on one part of your ride will not necessarily be optimal on a different portion. However, it is possible to get to a point that is a very good compromise between all the aspects we are considering. ShockWiz directs you to the point at which a good compromise is achieved, which we call the 'Window of Happiness'.

As the name suggests, the Window of Happiness has an acceptable range that we can be within. Typically, the range might be 1 or 2 clicks of damping wide and maybe 5% Baseline Air Pressure. The Window of Happiness also doesn't focus on just one aspect, such as having your sag at a particular percentage. Instead, ShockWiz takes a holistic approach and looks at the combination of all the tuning parameters available to us. ShockWiz tries to keep everything in balance so that no force is dominating over another, across all obstacles we encounter in a typical ride.

It's also important to remember that ShockWiz is merely Suggesting changes. It after achieving a high Shock Tuning Score, you are certainly within your bounds to experiment with adding or removing a click to any adjustment, or increase or decreasing baseline a 2-3 psi. Again, there is no perfect tune and there will always be a 'feel' component to tuning.

[email protected]


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

boblike said:


> Let's try this one.
> 
> What happens if you change the Rebound by 2 or 3 clicks. Is Shockwiz recognising exactly this change and recommends to adjust the Rebound back? Same applies for the rest of the Setup. Is Shockwiz always precisely leading you back to the initially perfect settings?
> 
> Gesendet von meinem SM-N910F mit Tapatalk


ok... I got this one  Sorry...I haven´t had enough time to play with it to be able to answer that one, but... In theory, given that this thing is no AI but rather follows a fixed programming, it should give you pretty similar results, given all external influences (environmentally, test-track, pace, line choice, body position etc) are the same. Otherwise the results would be guesswork and after following this product for a while, I don´t think that´s the case.
But...I´m also assuming that there are always different ways to reach a goal. Meaning that if you have a setup which results in only green bars over and over again and the next with you to are drastic changes (especially spring curve changes... probably even worse if you have the opportunity to tune positve and negative chamber independently) to every possible adjustment feature, it might be possible that you´ll end up with a different "green bar setup" afterwards?! But this is only an assumption and I could be totally wrong here...

I´ve come to the conclusion, that everything you change on a spring-damper unit, always interacts with other settings / effects other settings. Therfor it is very likely that there are different setting combinations which will lead to a similar output in the end. But I also assume that those setting combinations won´t be to similar but very different, at that most likely, in several adjustments...

But also, I´m not sure if the point of all this is, to always end up with the same amount of clicks on every adjustor?! Instead I think that a device like this is about finding the best setting-combination for the given (fringe) conditions at the time of measuring...


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Hi Alex,

this is my first post in this forum, and I only registered because you are so motivated to answer all our questions. I really appreciate that. 

I'm also considering to buy a sample, in fact, I think I definitely will do that.
But I still have some questions and requests I want to address.

First of all:
Put my name on the "HSR-list"! I want to have this setting, too. 
I would also appreciate to have the option to select the external settings of my shock and let the Shockwiz focus on these settings. I think this would improve the usability a lot, and maybe also the overall result of the optimization.
I'm thinking about a situation where the app tells me to change HSC, but if I run a Pike, I can't change that. So I will try to change something else, and maybe the app will tell me again to change the HSC. I think, if you limit the degree of freedom of the algorithm to what's actually possible, you might get a better result in the end that compensates the settings you can't change on your individual shock/fork.
Maybe you could also provide two different recommendations/modes in the app, one only with external settings, and for the advanced users, one that also includes settings that must be change by internal modifications of the damper system.

Now three questions regarding the tuning styles:

1. If I have optimized my suspension with one of the tuning styles and am not satisfied with it and want to try out another, will the app directly tell me how to change my settings (at least a rough direction)? Or do I have to start all over again?

2. Quote from your tutorial: "You can always pick and choose what you like from each Tuning Style. Eg: Tune the Baseline pressure and ramp from one Tuning Style and then switch Tuning Styles to tune the dampers."
What is the actual benefit of doing that? Can you make an example? This sounds a little bit complicated and might mess up the overall setup if you are not knowing what you are doing. 

3. Can you give a little more technical explanation about the different tuning styles? What is the criteria the suspension is being optimized to? Will it be basically LSC to reduce pedal influence or is there more to it? This is the first decision I have to make and I can't really decide if Playful or Aggressive would be best for me.
I usually suffer from arm pump and pain in the fingers very fast, so I should maybe choose Aggressive to have the best bump compliance. But I also like to have a bike that "feels light" and can be lifted good over small jumps. I also need more "safety" when going over kickers/jumps to get a good position in the air. For that, I think Playful could be better. It would be nice to have some more details about that.
PS: I'm running a 160 mm Enduro/AM with a 180 mm fork.

Thanks a lot!
Jan


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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

Alex,
Want to let you know that this thread has been really helpful in answering a lot of Q&A questions that I have right out of the gate. We just got our Wiz from Jenson and have started using it, but with 5 bikes and 8 air suspension units between them it'll probably take some time!
A little input for you; Though the packaging for the Wiz is quite nice, there is curiously no instructions at all with the packaging. Not even a note telling us to go online looking for instructions. Mind you it's not that great an intuitive leap to run a google search for "ShockWiz Instructions", but seriously even a little card saying "for setup see these three Youtube videos ........." would have seemed better thought out.
Finally, a question: What is "Bottom Out Resistance"? I've never heard of this as an adjustment on suspension, unless it refers to the bottom out bumpers that Push and Avalanche have sold in the past.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

If the Shockwiz can sync with the garmin unit which is connected to strava, there maybe a way to save notes and settings that way per session? Just a thought.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

jm2e said:


> Alex,
> Want to let you know that this thread has been really helpful in answering a lot of Q&A questions that I have right out of the gate. We just got our Wiz from Jenson and have started using it, but with 5 bikes and 8 air suspension units between them it'll probably take some time!
> A little input for you; Though the packaging for the Wiz is quite nice, there is curiously no instructions at all with the packaging. Not even a note telling us to go online looking for instructions. Mind you it's not that great an intuitive leap to run a google search for "ShockWiz Instructions", but seriously even a little card saying "for setup see these three Youtube videos ........." would have seemed better thought out.
> Finally, a question: What is "Bottom Out Resistance"? I've never heard of this as an adjustment on suspension, unless it refers to the bottom out bumpers that Push and Avalanche have sold in the past.


Hey jm2e,

Yep, that's a really great point. SRAM as a whole has gone digital with manuals and no longer includes print versions. We do however have a SRAM Digital User Manual that lists SRAM urls where product manuals can be found. This insert is currently placed in all power meters and I will have it added to ShockWiz today. Thanks for that.

Bottom Out Resistance is for rear shocks that have an actual 'Bottom Out Resistance' adjuster. I think it might be on some forks too, but not sure. The Fox DHX 5.0 air and coil come to mind.

However changing the durometer of the actual bottom out bumper could also be used to adjust BOR, though in most cases that won't be required.

In every case with ShockWiz I have seen, BOR will indicate 'OK' as long as Air Spring Ramp does too. This is also why BOR is listed as the last suggestion. Per the Tuning Order it should be adjusted last if needed.

[email protected]


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Is it possible to visualise data that's been recorded in any sense? Some sort of software that supports/visualises it for a session?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> Is it possible to visualise data that's been recorded in any sense? Some sort of software that supports/visualises it for a session?


There is nothing that currently allows you to do this. Nor have we committed to developing it yet.

[email protected]


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Quarq Tech said:


> There is nothing that currently allows you to do this. Nor have we committed to developing it yet.
> 
> [email protected]


cheers


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Sasse82 said:


> Hi Alex,
> 
> this is my first post in this forum, and I only registered because you are so motivated to answer all our questions. I really appreciate that.
> 
> ...


These are great questions that I would like to know as well. If it was posted before and I missed it, please point me to the post. I tend to skim sometimes.


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## rfxc (Oct 18, 2004)

lucifuge said:


> Alex - I sent an email regarding my Shockwiz having massive issues with bluetooth connectivity. Was it received? (I got no email receipt if it received)


I'm having a similar issue, very frustrating, straight out of the box. 
Unit shows up in phone BT menu, paired, cool. Open app wants to connect... as soon as it connects it asks about firmware update, i push yes, then it says "no device connected!" No device shows available in app connection menu. I've reinstalled app twice, tried different phones, cycled BT & phones on and off, and now changed the battery in the shockwiz.

So much for getting to know my new device this weekend.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Alex, mine connected off the get go, calibrated my fork thru the wizard, now my Bluetooth on my I6 won't even detect it? I've turned Bluetooth on and off several times. Am I missing something? If I cannot connect, it's useless. Thanks.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

The problem is allowing your phones Bluetooth to identify the shockwiz BEFORE you open shockwiz. Turn off Bluetooth, restart mobile. Create physical movement in the shockwiz to ensure its alert. Turn on Bluetooth and immediately open shockwiz apo before it starts to find your shockwiz unit. Try and connect within shockwiz only. That should work. 


rfxc said:


> I'm having a similar issue, very frustrating, straight out of the box.
> Unit shows up in phone BT menu, paired, cool. Open app wants to connect... as soon as it connects it asks about firmware update, i push yes, then it says "no device connected!" No device shows available in app connection menu. I've reinstalled app twice, tried different phones, cycled BT & phones on and off, and now changed the battery in the shockwiz.
> 
> So much for getting to know my new device this weekend.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Just tried it and it worked! Kudos man!


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

I know you should adjust your shock and fork in the "Open" position. Within the "open" position on my Fit4 there is also another micro "open" adjuster. Fox recommends starting at 18 clicks out, with shockwiz, should I also start 22 out for complete open? Is this adjustment in theory HSC? Thanks.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Here is the adjustment.


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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

Rode the last two days experimenting with ours. Was starting to get a feel for using it, but this morning it didn't want to turn on right away. Now the unit won't turn on at all. Just finished a big ride and it's dead. No light. Nothing detected by the phone. Dead.
Is this a battery thing? Or is this a Cheap-Chinese-Electronics-Rushed-Throug-Production thing?

Edit: Checked an hour later and it was working. Did the not-start-up-right-away thing again the next day, but turned on finally after a bunch of banging the bike against the ground. Maybe it's just working out the kinks. Thinking maybe it's a bad battery .......


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Quarq Tech said:


> There is nothing that currently allows you to do this. Nor have we committed to developing it yet.
> 
> [email protected]


From a development perspective that should be an easy implementation. Massage the data into JSON and feed it to any of the charting libraries.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Im starting to get scared when mine shows up that I am going to become a beta tester to find all the bug and kinks like what you guys are finding.........


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

No bugs from my viewpoint, just some counter-intuitive setup with the bluetooth. All gold now.



hitechredneck said:


> Im starting to get scared when mine shows up that I am going to become a beta tester to find all the bug and kinks like what you guys are finding.........


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

@Quarq Tech - I think the User Manual needs some clarity here, in particular for cases where (e.g due to negative spring tension coupled with low pressure) the fork naturally sits more than 3% below full extension - for example, which position is relevant when using the Wizard ('pull to full extension') and which is correct when setting Mark Base Line? UPDATE: OK this is in the video, correct is 'pull to full extension') :thumbsup:


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

Watch the videos guys, it all is very simple.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

ragetty said:


> @Quarq Tech - at which point should the Cal Status indicator turn green? I have used the Calibration Wizard 3 times (Marz 350 NCR 2015 gives CR 5.4, 5.6 & 5.5), and ridden numerous Sessions, but Cal Status stays red ...


Just discovered the answer to my problem ...

While the Wizard can apparently calibrate/recognise a Compression Ratio > 5.0, AND pass this onto the App, the maximum value that can be set manually in the App is only 5.0 - anything above this value apparently 'does not compute' and Cal Status always shows RED ...

So all those sessions hoping to find the right tune were all a waste of time, only because there is a simple warning neither in the User Manual, nor in the App and nor in the video that says 'Warning - Max. CR is 5.0'.


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

@Quarq Tech

Alex, I'm really enjoying the product and getting some positive results

When you disconnect the hose from the fork, how much PSI is released? i.e. should the fork be pumped up a tiny bit after you have finished tuning and have removed the ShockWiz?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hey Jan,

Sorry for the delay on getting back to you. Answers below.

_Put my name on the "HSR-list"! I want to have this setting, too. 
I would also appreciate to have the option to select the external settings of my shock and let the Shockwiz focus on these settings. I think this would improve the usability a lot, and maybe also the overall result of the optimization._

In respects to HSR, consider your name added. As for the settings selector, that may or may be something that appears. Unfortunately it may not be as easy as just hiding them. If you simply hide them from view, their impact on your Shock Tuning Score will still apply. You may end up in a situation where all the 'visible' Suggestions indicate 'OK' but but a 'hidden' adjustment is asking for change keeping you from that elusive Shock Tuning Score of 100. Hiding that from view would only create confusion. So at this point, including them and having the user ignore what they can't change, is no different than simply hiding them.​
_I'm thinking about a situation where the app tells me to change HSC, but if I run a Pike, I can't change that. So I will try to change something else, and maybe the app will tell me again to change the HSC. I think, if you limit the degree of freedom of the algorithm to what's actually possible, you might get a better result in the end that compensates the settings you can't change on your individual shock/fork._

I see what you're saying, but at the end of the day you're not likely to end up in a different spot. If you do find yourself in a situation where everything but HSC indicates "OK", changing your Baseline Air Pressure (or which ever adjustment you choose) probably isn't going to correct it. Or worse, making an adjustment in an attempt to correct HSC will throw something more important out of balance. Remember that just because HSC on a Pike is not externally adjustable does not mean it does not have HSC. Isn't it better to know how that internal tune is working? In the end we feel that it is.​
_Maybe you could also provide two different recommendations/modes in the app, one only with external settings, and for the advanced users, one that also includes settings that must be change by internal modifications of the damper system._

That's not a bad idea except ShockWiz is designed to be brand agnostic. And even if it were tailored to a specific brand, not all models within one brand have the same dials as the rest.​
_1. If I have optimized my suspension with one of the tuning styles and am not satisfied with it and want to try out another, will the app directly tell me how to change my settings (at least a rough direction)? Or do I have to start all over again?
_

So, if we're talking about a single ride session then you don't have to start over. Changing the Tuning Style can be done at anytime and will not erase existing ride data. All existing data will recalculate to the new style which provides a new Shock Tuning Score, Suggestions and Detections. However, as soon as you select 'Start New Session' (which should be done after acting on any one Suggestion) this data is erased. So, if your talking about multiple ride sessions you have to start over, sort of.

ShockWiz works by directing us to a place that we like to call the 'Window of Happiness'. As the name suggest (window) it's not trying to direct us to a single point. The Window of Happiness consists of an acceptable range that we can be within. All four Tuning Styles exist within this window. Then, each individual tuning style occupies it's own portion of that window. So even if you tune to a particular Tuning Style and want to switch, you won't have that far to go. You're already within the larger window and just need to shuffle from side to the other.​
_Quote from your tutorial: "You can always pick and choose what you like from each Tuning Style. Eg: Tune the Baseline pressure and ramp from one Tuning Style and then switch Tuning Styles to tune the dampers."
What is the actual benefit of doing that? Can you make an example? This sounds a little bit complicated and might mess up the overall setup if you are not knowing what you are doing. _

This is certainly a more advanced way to use ShockWiz and will not apply to most. The benefit in doing this is to simply offer greater customization.

Each tuning style has it's own set of parameters, or window, that it deems acceptable for every adjustment. Because of this, each Tuning Style will offer it's own unique tune and ride characteristics. Picking and choosing certain parts of multiple Tuning Styles just makes it that much more granular.

If you have your bike tuned to Balanced and enjoy how it feels, but think the spring is still a bit too soft for you liking, follow the Suggestion for Baseline Air Pressure and Air Spring Ramp under 'Efficient' to firm it up.

Or you really like how the bike feels in Balanced but feel the rebound is a bit to sluggish, follow the Suggestion for Rebound within Playful, the parameters set allow it to be a bit faster.

Again this will not apply to most, and in fact I don't even do this myself, just know it's possible.​
_Can you give a little more technical explanation about the different tuning styles? What is the criteria the suspension is being optimized to? Will it be basically LSC to reduce pedal influence or is there more to it? This is the first decision I have to make and I can't really decide if Playful or Aggressive would be best for me._

The app has information baked in that offers a quick explanation of this. We also have an article here that addresses it in more detail, here.

At the end of the day you might be thinking about this too much. If you buy a device the best thing to do is experiment a bit until you find what's right. Plus it's very easy to adjust the bike from one style to another once you're within the window.

Remember that there are certainly very WRONG ways to setup suspension but no 'perfect' ways. Once you're within the 'Window of Happiness' you can start experimenting with slightly increasing and decreasing certain adjustments to fine tune how the bike feels.​
_I usually suffer from arm pump and pain in the fingers very fast, so I should maybe choose Aggressive to have the best bump compliance. But I also like to have a bike that "feels light" and can be lifted good over small jumps. I also need more "safety" when going over kickers/jumps to get a good position in the air. For that, I think Playful could be better. It would be nice to have some more details about that.
PS: I'm running a 160 mm Enduro/AM with a 180 mm fork._

Balanced is a very good place to start. I would suggest starting here and tune your bike in the order prescribe here. From there you can change the tuning style and see what effect it has.

Doing some hand and forearm strengthening exercises won't hurt either!​
[email protected]


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey Jan,
> 
> Sorry for the delay on getting back to you. Answers below.
> 
> ...


I think you may have missed his point. He doesn't just want that adjustment hidden, he wants the algorithms to not consider it.

Truth be told that's the way it should be, why are you considering settings that can't be changed into your recommendations?


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

Alex

My buddy and I both have identical 140mm Fox 34's w 3 volume reducers installed. Do we need to calibrate when we move it from one bike to the other or can we just reset the baseline pressure? Compression is the same between them both, air pressures are different. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

TwoTone said:


> I think you may have missed his point. He doesn't just want that adjustment hidden, he wants the algorithms to not consider it.
> 
> Truth be told that's the way it should be, why are you considering settings that can't be changed into your recommendations?


The algorithms they are using have to be quite involved. Once you have a software solution developed around an algorithm telling it to ignore a parameter it's expecting and still do its job well is no trivial matter.

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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Thank you for the detailed answer, it helps understanding the system more and more.
But for some of the points I still have some small feedback.



Quarq Tech said:


> _I'm thinking about a situation where the app tells me to change HSC, but if I run a Pike, I can't change that. So I will try to change something else, and maybe the app will tell me again to change the HSC. I think, if you limit the degree of freedom of the algorithm to what's actually possible, you might get a better result in the end that compensates the settings you can't change on your individual shock/fork._
> 
> I see what you're saying, but at the end of the day you're not likely to end up in a different spot. If you do find yourself in a situation where everything but HSC indicates "OK", changing your Baseline Air Pressure (or which ever adjustment you choose) probably isn't going to correct it. Or worse, making an adjustment in an attempt to correct HSC will throw something more important out of balance. Remember that just because HSC on a Pike is not externally adjustable does not mean it does not have HSC. Isn't it better to know how that internal tune is working? In the end we feel that it is.​
> _Maybe you could also provide two different recommendations/modes in the app, one only with external settings, and for the advanced users, one that also includes settings that must be change by internal modifications of the damper system._
> ...


My initial thought was in fact, that some settings can compensate (partly) flaws from other settings. Maybe this doesn't apply to all of them but certain combinations could be possible (e.g. I can't change volume spacers but could increase HSC for bottoming out resistance). Including such an option might certainly involve some more R&D to thoroughly find the dependencies and develop the algorithms in that way.
For the proposed expert mode I already had in mind to have a shock configuration in which you can select which external settings are present, with that, this feature would still be brand independent.
Maybe you can just take these ideas and put them in your "collection for possible further developments". I don't expect to have that any time soon, but if your team comes to the conclusion that this might be helpful, I would be happy to see these features in one of the future app / firmware updates.



Quarq Tech said:


> _1. If I have optimized my suspension with one of the tuning styles and am not satisfied with it and want to try out another, will the app directly tell me how to change my settings (at least a rough direction)? Or do I have to start all over again?
> _
> 
> So, if we're talking about a single ride session then you don't have to start over. Changing the Tuning Style can be done at anytime and will not erase existing ride data. ...​
> ...


Okay, that sounds good. I thought initially that the styles are more different, but if changing between the styles can be done based on the optimized tune of any riding styles, I'm now motivated to try all of them out. (maybe except the XC one).
Just a pity that buying two Shockwiz is so expensive, with only one device, changing the riding style of a whole bike is a little bit more time consuming. 



Quarq Tech said:


> ...
> Doing some hand and forearm strengthening exercises won't hurt either!​


Most certainly, a Gorilla Heavy Grip is already on my desk. 

Grtz Jan


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## g.law (Apr 16, 2007)

I think I discovered the Shockwiz can fine tune sag. I set up the bike with about 20% sag to start and went for a ride. Collected data until confidence was 100%. Reviewing the suggestions Baseline air and spring ramp were green, but make HSC softer was red make LSC was yellow. Looking at Detection all were green except pogo red and bad. Since I can't adjust HSC, and LSC was fully open, I reduced baseline air to get 25% sag, reset the Shockwiz and went for another ride on the exact same course. Again collected data until confidence was 100%. Again, Baseline air and spring ramp were green, but soften HSC went to yellow and soften LSC stayed yellow. Pogo in Detections went to yellow. Increased sag to 30% and repeated. Pogo now went to green. Baseline air and spring ramp still green and soften HSC and LSC still yellow. Ran out of time, but I'm going to continue to slowly increase sag until HSC and LSC go green or yellow to make firmer or until baseline goes yellow telling me to add air. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I can fine the sag until I get green in Baseline air, spring ramp, and HSC won't that be the best setting for my weight with a shock the has no user adjustable HSC?


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Hmmm, in my opinion 20 and 30 % is a huge difference in terms of sag and pressure.
How buch psi/bar did you change? The app says to change only 5% pressure if the indicator is yellow. But I would assume to achieve 10% difference in SAG you must change more than 5% of pressure, and the the indicator is still green?
Combining that, the Shockwiz seems not to be very accurate in it's suggestions / detections, at least with your setup?


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

mpress said:


> Alex
> 
> My buddy and I both have identical 140mm Fox 34's w 3 volume reducers installed. Do we need to calibrate when we move it from one bike to the other or can we just reset the baseline pressure? Compression is the same between them both, air pressures are different.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hey mpress,

As long as everything is the same you should be able to use the same CR. However, there are some variables here to consider. Mainly the amount of grease in the spring, or more accurately the amount of grease sitting on top of the air piston. Depending on when they were built or who serviced the spring (if they have been serviced) this amount can vary and can impact CR.

In the end it probably won't be enough to matter, but measuring each individually isn't a bad idea. As long as the volume of either spring is not changed (adding or removing volume spacers) the CR value of each fork can just be re-entered and the baseline marked when re-installed.

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

rfxc said:


> I'm having a similar issue, very frustrating, straight out of the box.
> Unit shows up in phone BT menu, paired, cool. Open app wants to connect... as soon as it connects it asks about firmware update, i push yes, then it says "no device connected!" No device shows available in app connection menu. I've reinstalled app twice, tried different phones, cycled BT & phones on and off, and now changed the battery in the shockwiz.
> 
> So much for getting to know my new device this weekend.


Hey rfxc,

Apologies for the trouble you're having. You cannot connect ShockWiz to the Bluetooth menu of your phone. If you have ShockWiz connected this way, the ShockWiz app will not be able to see the device properly.

To correct this:

go to the Bluetooth menu of the phone and remove the device from the list of connected devices.

Once removed, open the ShockWiz app and try to connect, it should have no problem.

If you are unable to remove ShockWiz from the Bluetooth menu, you may have to let the device turn off first (10 minutes of inactivity) or remove and re-install the battery.​
Another thing to check is to see if your phone has a 'Bluetooth Auto-Connect' feature of some sort. If it does, turning this off should remove the need to 'immediately connect' once the device wakes back up.

Let me know if that does not correct the issue.

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

ctguru said:


> @Quarq Tech
> 
> Alex, I'm really enjoying the product and getting some positive results
> 
> When you disconnect the hose from the fork, how much PSI is released? i.e. should the fork be pumped up a tiny bit after you have finished tuning and have removed the ShockWiz?


Hey ctguru,

There should be no air loss from the spring. The valve core of the fork or shock should be closed before the seal between the ShockWiz hose and the valve stem breaks. As long as the there is not a prolonged 'hiss' when removing the hose, the only air escaping should be what's inside the ShockWiz hose and manifold.

You can ensure the same pressure is in the spring though, using the below process.

1. Prior to removing ShockWiz, connect to the app and see what the reported air pressure is within the App and write it down.

2. Then connect your shock pump to the available ShockWiz inflation valve. When the pump engages there will be a small amount of air loss (pressure inside the spring) due to the pump charging.

3. Using the reported value in the app, pump the spring back up to the pressure recorded in step 1.

4. Before removing the pump, record the value that the pumps gauge reports and write that down. You can now remove the pump and ShocKWiz.

5. Reinstall the shock pump on your fork or shocks inflation valve. Again, when thew pump engages there will be a small amount of air loss (pressure inside the spring) due to the pump charging. Now increase the pressure until the pump reads the same value that it did in step 4.​
Does that make sense? I know it's a bit manual, but that's the only way you're going to know for sure.

[email protected]


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey ctguru,
> 
> There should be no air loss from the spring. The valve core of the fork or shock should be closed before the seal between the ShockWiz hose and the valve stem breaks. As long as the there is not a prolonged 'hiss' when removing the hose, the only air escaping should be what's inside the ShockWiz hose and manifold.
> 
> ...


Cheers

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

Hello TwoTone,

_I think you may have missed his point. He doesn't just want that adjustment hidden, he wants the algorithms to not consider it._

I am not sure that I missed that. I say later in the post...

_"...it may not be as easy as just hiding them. If you simply hide them from view, their impact on your Shock Tuning Score will still apply. "_

This means that hiding the Suggestion from view is much different than re-working the Algorithm, which is what this would require. Though it may appear a simple task on the surface, the underlying needs are very complex and may not be possible at all.​
_Truth be told that's the way it should be, why are you considering settings that can't be changed into your recommendations?_

I'm going to respectively disagree here. In the case of HSC, the absence of an external adjustment does not mean an HSC circuit is not present, and simply hiding the Suggestion from view does not remove the symptom that the fork or shock has.

You either include it in the Algorithm and have the user ignore it (current), or have the algorithm ignore it which then blinds the user to how that particular aspect is performing.

Knowledge is power! Just because an adjustment cannot be made easily, does not mean it cannot be made. Granted it may mean you can't do it yourself, but I still think it's better to have that information that to omit it. With the information at hand you have actual data backing up the need for said change which, if it requires a suspension center or the manufacturer to perform, further justifies the need to send it off.​
[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

ragetty said:


> Just discovered the answer to my problem ...
> 
> While the Wizard can apparently calibrate/recognise a Compression Ratio > 5.0, AND pass this onto the App, the maximum value that can be set manually in the App is only 5.0 - anything above this value apparently 'does not compute' and Cal Status always shows RED ...
> 
> ...


Hey raggety,

My apologies for the trouble you've experienced and have alerted our App developer to get this corrected. There certainly needs to be some sort of prompt in place.

However the current CR limit, though not properly enforced at this time, is set to a maximum of 5.0 because you shouldn't encounter one that is higher. A CR of 5.4, 5.5 etc, for a fork (or shock for that matter) is remarkably high and somewhat doubt that it's correct.

I have reached out to Marzocchi (Fox) in an attempt to better understand how the AER air spring works, specifically the air pre-load adjustment. I'll let you know what I hear back to ensure there issn't something we're missing with the Calibration.

In the meantime, with the CR set to 5, and the Baseline air pressure properly set (App reports 0% when fork is fully extended and unweighted) does the reported Shock Travel in the app match the measured travel on the fork via the o-ring?

[email protected]


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## Quarq Tech (Nov 14, 2016)

hitechredneck said:


> Im starting to get scared when mine shows up that I am going to become a beta tester to find all the bug and kinks like what you guys are finding.........





lucifuge said:


> No bugs from my viewpoint, just some counter-intuitive setup with the bluetooth. All gold now.


Hey Guys,

Of course my view is a bit biased here, but let's be careful what we classify as a 'bug' and be sure that we know the difference between that and 'consumer education' or 'learning curve', as there is a big difference. Nothing like this product has existed before, so of course there are going to be some bumps in the road.

Agreed that the Bluetooth pairing issue that people are having is unfortunate, but that's not a bug. People are used to pairing Bluetooth devices to their phone in a certain way and have become more or less 'trained' to do it that way. Given the needs of ShockWiz we decided to use a process that most are less familiar with, which inherently makes it less intuitive. If there is a 'bug' present, it is in our communication / instruction of how to connect to the device, not with the device itself.

However, if there is something that you have seen that worries you please let me know and I will do my best to put you at ease.

[email protected]


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> Of course my view is a bit biased here, but let's be careful what we classify as a 'bug' and be sure that we know the difference between that and 'consumer education' or 'learning curve', as there is a big difference. Nothing like this product has existed before, so of course there are going to be some bumps in the road.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry but that is a bug. It may not be an issue with the software/hardware but it's an inherent design flaw. Any time you are dealing with systems that a user accesses through the front end and multiple people are having issues performing a certain task that's a good indicator that it's a bug. You can alleviate with better documentation but there is still a flaw in the system as the interface is not as intuitive as it could be.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

Sorted!









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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

ctguru said:


> Sorted!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


out of interest what is the fork/travel. and riders weight?


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

---


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

lucifuge said:


> out of interest what is the fork/travel. and riders weight?


110kg, RS SID, xloc damper, 120mm travel, 4 tokens, 1 custom (i.e. I drilled 4 holes in the bottom of it as I was between tokens), on a Niner Jet9RDO XL

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

Spent the day yesterday tuning my suspension with Shockwiz. Really pleased with how easy and intuitive it has all been in both set up and use on the trail.

The changes it recommended I make to the rear shock have made a noticeable positive difference to my ride. Over fast rooty sections it's noticeable better and seems to sit higher in the travel when climbing so I'm not reaching to switch to "trail" at the 1st sign of a climb. The front was pretty close already and only recommended that I add an extra spacer (which I forgot to take with me). 
Fitted the extra spacer today and re-calibrated so all ready for another ride tomorrow after work.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I'm planning to re-test with an 'efficient' tune for the fork to see the difference. mainly to see how the 27% sag 'attack mode' changes.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

Quarq Tech said:


> Hey raggety,
> 
> My apologies for the trouble you've experienced and have alerted our App developer to get this corrected. There certainly needs to be some sort of prompt in place.
> 
> ...


Well, there is some good news and there is some bad news.

The BAD news is that I have the identical fork on another bike. The GOOD news is that I have the identical fork on another bike.

Only they're not identical - the 2nd fork gave Wizard calculated CR values of 3.8, 3.5 and 3.7, so I will go with 3.7 and see if shockwiz comes up with a useful tune for that fork. This is BAD for me because I now don't know which to believe, GOOD for you because the only problem with Shockwiz is that there should be some warning when encountering CR > 5.0

I have edited my previous comments so that they give just the facts and don't mention the fork, as this is obviously a problem at my end.

Luckily I bought Shockwiz for 6 different elements on 3 different bikes, so I still have plenty to do ...


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm thinking about purchasing to keep my bikes sorted (3 for me with 5 suspension elements), plus the wife's dual suspension bike. My wife has no interest and no experience tuning her ride ("it feels fine - stop messing with it"). 

Anyways, when I look at the tuning styles it seems that they are a pretty good range, as described, for the average user. The "aggressive" one seems misnamed -- maybe "plush" would have been better? A style that I don't see in the list would be for someone who rides fast and maybe races DH and enduro. Or, would "balanced" or "playful" be the best option for that rider and they would just need to ride as fast and hard as they usually do to push the suspension to its limits to that the Shockwiz can see what the real world expectations of the suspension would be? 

Slightly different question, and acknowledging the 'window of happiness,' is there a class of high level rider who would find the recommendations far from what they currently ride and find to be fastest for racing? If the Shockwiz can help all levels of rider, which 'style' would be closest to what a pro DH rider would use? This is a thought exploration since I am not anywhere close to a pro rider. It's just that you hear that those riders use suspension setups that would be pretty unrideable for the average Joe.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

That's a good discussion. There are many aspects of a pro bike not fitting an average weekend warrior due to difference in fitness level and skill. I'd have a hard time with maybe their bar drop or gearing and probably the ability to react to a certain suspension setup. I'd imagine the shockwiz was designed more for mortals as the pros have a team to manage their every needs. Maybe an article on hiw and what the shockwiz does or makes decision might help as a lot of the questions seem to revolve around this but i dont know how much of it will give away its secrets. Or just use it and trust it, that's what i would do for the fear of hurting my brain.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

Alex, thanks for all your patience with our nagging questions. It's actually really reassuring when jumping into this new technology at a considerably high price to join the club.

Considering the Tuning Styles:
I think Efficient makes the most intuitive sense, but it's still limited.
The others seem classic "Outdoor Industry Vague". Designed to make people feel good about their showroom decisions. "Yea, I'm a pretty aggressive guy." "Me? I kind of do everything. I like an all around, all mountain kind of bike."

Actually giving us some objective styles of riding might be more helpful. Maybe with some real life examples of famous riders on specific types of trails where a style might be best reflected.
*Example 1: Downhill Racing* - This will leave the shock relatively firm, with an emphasis on absorbing countless very fast hits from small to medium bumps with the occasional big hit (i.e. drop to flat). The goal will be to keep the wheels on the ground through fast chatter and not let the suspension pack out. Outcome: "I'm so much faster with this tune" - Troy Brosnan
*Example 2: Bike Park Flow/Jump Trail* - This will leave the shock ready for the biggest hits so that you can risk casing a big gap without wrecking your body or your bike. The goal will be to allow you to pin it for high speed on fast trails with tons of micro chatter, support you through G-out berms and loading into jumps while not leaving you feeling like you're on a pogo stick landing jumps. Oh, and keep it poppy. Outcome: "Wow, the tune left the bike feeling super poppy, and definitely saved my ass when I failed to clear that table!" - Gram Agassiz
*Example 3: Technical Natural Trail* - This will give you the support you need to pick your way down steep rocky rooty uber technical trails, allowing your suspension to help you as much as possible but saving you from the dreaded fork dive. Outcome: "Wow, can't believe I made it down that trail in one piece. And I never once thought about my suspension!" -Bernhard Baumgartner
*Example 4: Balanced XC* - I'm headed out for a 3 hour XC ride/race. I have the skills to get a full rigid bike through all this, but obviously suspension helps me go faster/further/longer. I just want to make sure this thing doesn't wallow out when I hammer on the pedals. Outcome: "Help me go fast. Save my creaky joints" -Some Racer Guy
*Example 5: Balanced Enduro* - I'm headed out for a 3 hour ride in the mountains. I'll lock out the suspension for the long climbs and don't really care that much about efficiency. When I get to the downhills, there are slow techy sections, fast chunky sections and definitely some big drops to flat. I don't want to mess with my suspension today. Outcome: "I sure am glad I got the Shock Wiz" - Jerome Clementz


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Is there a noticeable difference between balanced and playful? Is it like 2 clicks of more dampening? I'd imagine these two tuning styles would be the most popular. 

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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

I had a curious run with the Wiz today (finally wrestled it away from mrs jm2e). Mostly XC riding with a few short fast rooty downhills and about a dozen small jumps mostly to flat. I bottomed hard about a half dozen times. This wasn't just noticing the travel indicator O-ring at the bottom of the shock. I could hear and feel the metal kathunk. The kind of thing where you start wondering about damage to frame and shock.
The thing that makes it all curious, is that the Wiz pretty much told me I had it dialed in. Even Bottom Out resistance was in the green!
Anyone have an experience like this?


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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

jm2e said:


> I had a curious run with the Wiz today (finally wrestled it away from mrs jm2e). Mostly XC riding with a few short fast rooty downhills and about a dozen small jumps mostly to flat. I bottomed hard about a half dozen times. This wasn't just noticing the travel indicator O-ring at the bottom of the shock. I could hear and feel the metal kathunk. The kind of thing where you start wondering about damage to frame and shock.
> The thing that makes it all curious, is that the Wiz pretty much told me I had it dialed in. Even Bottom Out resistance was in the green!
> Anyone have an experience like this?


Did you double check the calibration?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

i must admit, i was a bit suspicious of 66 psi for a 110kg rider ...


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

jm2e said:


> I had a curious run with the Wiz today (finally wrestled it away from mrs jm2e). Mostly XC riding with a few short fast rooty downhills and about a dozen small jumps mostly to flat. I bottomed hard about a half dozen times. This wasn't just noticing the travel indicator O-ring at the bottom of the shock. I could hear and feel the metal kathunk. The kind of thing where you start wondering about damage to frame and shock.
> The thing that makes it all curious, is that the Wiz pretty much told me I had it dialed in. Even Bottom Out resistance was in the green!
> Anyone have an experience like this?


Did you dial it in on the same type of sections?

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## ctguru (Dec 31, 2008)

ragetty said:


> i must admit, i was a bit suspicious of 66 psi for a 110kg rider ...


My fork (SID) is fine at 66psi and my weight for the riding I do. For comparison my Bluto runs at 130psi. Just depends on the fork/bike setup and damper etc.

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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

@Quarq Tech
I own a Monarch XX and was reading this forum:
http://forums.mtbr.com/shocks-suspension/monarch-ifp-pressure-change-524727-4.html
and was wondering if this was something that could be tuned or adjusted with the ShockWiz? 
Thanks,
Ian


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

Air pressure and ramp up are supposed to be adjusted together before adjusting rebound and compression settings, right? Any thoughts on this tuning conundrum with my 140mm Fox 34? It keeps telling me to remove air, but has conflicting suggestions on the spacers. 

Ride 1- 80psi, 2 spacers
Suggestion- remove air (yellow), add spacer (yellow)
Ride 2- 75psi, 3 spacers
Suggestion- remove air (yellow), remove spacer (yellow)
Ride 3- 70psi, 3 spacers (trail side adjustment)
Suggestion- remove air (yellow), remove spacer (yellow)

Ride 1 had the highest confidence (95%). Ride 2 & 3 scored at 79-80% and is asking to ride bumpy/footy trails. Should I keep riding for a higher confidence score before removing the spacer again? Maybe I need to split the difference and drill out a spacer...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

What tuning style are you using?


mpress said:


> Air pressure and ramp up are supposed to be adjusted together before adjusting rebound and compression settings, right? Any thoughts on this tuning conundrum with my 140mm Fox 34? It keeps telling me to remove air, but has conflicting suggestions on the spacers.
> 
> Ride 1- 80psi, 2 spacers
> Suggestion- remove air (yellow), add spacer (yellow)
> ...


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

I love the idea of this tool and will get one as soon as I can convince my buddies to go in on it with me. The potential to improve and learn with updates and more rider input is huge.
When you are tuning with the shockwiz, don't forget to feel how your bike is riding. You can check sag, how much travel you are using and help the program when you are in between settings or will be on different kinds of terrain.
Can't wait to get one.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

lucifuge said:


> What tuning style are you using?


Been tuning with the Playful style. The results were the same when I switched to balanced.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Well from a playful point of view some of it makes sense. If it were me I'd start from results from ride 1. I'd add a token but leave pressure high. When you do next session hopefully with 90% will say simply to reduce air. And go from there from


mpress said:


> Been tuning with the Playful style. The results were the same when I switched to balanced.


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

mpress said:


> Air pressure and ramp up are supposed to be adjusted together before adjusting rebound and compression settings, right? Any thoughts on this tuning conundrum with my 140mm Fox 34? It keeps telling me to remove air, but has conflicting suggestions on the spacers.
> 
> Ride 1- 80psi, 2 spacers
> Suggestion- remove air (yellow), add spacer (yellow)
> ...


I'd start with the factory recommended volume spacer setup for the fork, and only adjust air pressure until green. Once pressure is dialed, then move on to spacer tweaks until green.

As with feel tuning, maybe it's a bad idea to change more than 1 parameter at a time with the Shockwiz?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

mpress said:


> Ride 1- 80psi, 2 spacers
> Suggestion- remove air (yellow), add spacer (yellow)
> Ride 2- 75psi, 3 spacers
> Suggestion- remove air (yellow), remove spacer (yellow)
> ...


Did you recalibrate your Shockwiz/fork after making the changes?
I'm just asking because you didn't mention it and could be a reason for questionable results.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Ganderson said:


> I'd start with the factory recommended volume spacer setup for the fork, and only adjust air pressure until green. Once pressure is dialed, then move on to spacer tweaks until green.
> 
> As with feel tuning, maybe it's a bad idea to change more than 1 parameter at a time with the Shockwiz?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It doesn't work that way. Adding or removing a spacer will change the pressure requirement of the shock/fork. Those two components have to be changed together as they are interdependent.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

tuckerjt07 said:


> It doesn't work that way. Adding or removing a spacer will change the pressure requirement of the shock/fork. Those two components have to be changed together as they are interdependent.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Fair enough.. I'll stay out of it. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> It doesn't work that way. Adding or removing a spacer will change the pressure requirement of the shock/fork. Those two components have to be changed together as they are interdependent.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Instructions say, if advised, to change pressure and spacer at same time. However if pressure is not green and spacer is, then pressure only. Vice versa. It's all in the instructions.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

bogeydog said:


> Instructions say, if advised, to change pressure and spacer at same time. However if pressure is not green and spacer is, then pressure only. Vice versa. It's all in the instructions.


You can get away with changing pressure and no spacer but if you change the spacers 99% of the time you have to change pressure. That's just the way physics works.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## Pau11y (Oct 15, 2004)

Alex,

Just a quick nerd question...
If you guys are using the ideal gas law equation in your algorithm, you prob have a temp sensor in the hardware, yeah? Is there also some form of a timer in there to drop a time stamp on each of the data points? 

And, would it be possible to do a data dump to say something like a PC/laptop and pull the data into an Excel (CSV or some other form) and plot some value over time curves...pressure, temps, and maybe each of the eval'd elements being provided by the interface on the phone...for some visualization?

Apologies in advance if this has been asked...I did do a quick glance over the entire thread, and didn't see anything. TIA


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

A thermocouple in the shockwiz would only measure ambient air temperature. The air and suspension fluid temperature inside the shock does change of course.

You calibrate the Shockwiz to determine the compression ratio. I.e.
P1V1=nRT1
----- -----
P2V2=nRT2

assuming T1=T2

P1V1
----- = compression ratio (constant, not a function of temperature)
P2V2

During calibration you enter in or measure the compression ratio into the app. 
During the ride, the Shockwiz then measures P2 and then can calculate V2 to determine shock stroke position accurately. With shock stroke position and acceleration, it can uses those values in their algorithm (magic sauce) to output their recommendations.

This is how I think the device works anyways based on use and reading.
Ian


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

gte534j said:


> P1V1=nRT1
> ----- -----
> P2V2=nRT2
> 
> assuming T1=T2


Point of information:

Adiabatic compression. (P1V1)^1.4 ~= (P2V2)^1.4.

T1 <> T2


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

why would they need a temperature sensor? ... shockwiz tells you to use a (for you) ideal absolute air pressure based on the fork and selected riding style. 1. if the temperature rises so much that the air pressure in the fork changes significantly - well, you just let out the excess. 2. if you are concerned about the fork warming up during a session, i think the main problem here would be changes in oil viscosity - and considering that aspect is very probably not part of shockwiz's feature set.

as for the data dump - for the more complex analysis procedures (so not necessarily quasi DC aspects, such as dynamic sag), i imagine the p(t) line is FT'ed to reveal the 'signatures' characteristic of typical fork tuning aspects. e.g. an overall under-damped fork will show 'ringing', and amplitude, asymmetries (higher order components) will indicate the necessary fix. similarly, an over-damped fork will exhibit little to no ringing, which then also indicates the necessary fix ... like i say, i'm guessing, but the net result is that a data dump and a simple plot in excel probably won't get you very far.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

@Quarq Tech - more unusual behaviour this weekend 

the bike & hike tour over the weekend involved about 300m of climing on asphalt, fireroad and trail, then around 90 minutes of shouldering the bike to the summit. then around a 60 minute break at the summit. the descent was 900m of steep but 90% rideable (i.e. 10% still too much snow) alpine trail, so roots, rocks, hairpins, and with copious amounts of 'multiple steps' sections, then around 300m of similar with much more of a 'flow country' aspect to it. all this followed by some fireroad & asphalt back to the car. temperatures were somewhere between approx. 16C (sunny side ascent) and close to 0C at the summit (still snow up there), and absolute max. elevation was about 1800m. altogether, ride time was minimum 2 hours.

the session indicated that the fork was well tuned, which was my own impression too. you could imagine the ideal tune to be something like 'Playful/Aggressive' with a good dose of HSC/LSC to prevent brake and 'step' diving in steep terrain. tyre pressures are very low in maxxis DHF II 2.5 front /2.4DD rear, certainly sub-20 psi (for a 70kg/155lb rider) so as to help give traction on the soft slushy snow, wet roots and wet, often wooden step sections.

however, Confidence indicated only 20%. i rode the bike again today on much more moderate terrain, but no budge. shockwiz says to go ride a rocky rooty trail - but it had a good 60 minutes of that yesterday ... 

any thoughts?


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## Pau11y (Oct 15, 2004)

petercarm said:


> Point of information:
> 
> Adiabatic compression. (P1V1)^1.4 ~= (P2V2)^1.4.
> 
> T1 <> T2


I'll be honest, I had to look up "<>." More used to seeing "!="


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Pau11y said:


> I'll be honest, I had to look up "<>." More used to seeing "!="


VB for the win!!!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I've been through the calibration wizard 3 times successfully now; achieving full extension and compression as requested. I end up with calibration ratios (CR) of 2.6, 2.6 and 2.7. So the process is giving precise results. However, the physical displacement of the the forks travel compared to the travel on the Shockwiz app is very different. For example, if I displace physical travel by 30% on the stanchion, I see the app showing something like 45%. It's only when I set a manual CR of 4.3 that I get a 1-1 match between the two. My understanding is the latter is the preferable choice. 

This is inflating a 160 Lyrik to 75 psi, no tokens and possibly importantly; using a Luftkappe.

So,.... is anyone getting very different CRs from calibration to manual adjustment? Also keen to hear form Luftkappe owners for any success/issues they might have observed.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Quarq Tech said:


> Knowledge is power! Just because an adjustment cannot be made easily, does not mean it cannot be made. Granted it may mean you can't do it yourself, but I still think it's better to have that information that to omit it. With the information at hand you have actual data backing up the need for said change which, if it requires a suspension center or the manufacturer to perform, further justifies the need to send it off. [/INDENT]
> 
> [email protected]


I feel that this is a great statement to be quoted in regard to the HSR feature 

I´ve played with this device for the last 4 days in Finale Ligure. On the first 2 days, I only let it monitor my fork settings without changing anything to get a good impression on how my own setup performs against the data.

I used "agressive" and the findings/"Suggestions" were mostly as estimated as I tend to ride stiff and progressiv springs on the front. What also correlates with my personal impression is HSC statement. I somehow always under the impression that forks are verry overdamped in that department...:

- Remove Air -> red
- Remove Spacers -> yellow
- Rebound OK -> green
- HSC make softer -> yellow
- LSC OK -> green
- Bottom Out Resistance - Remove resistance -> red

Detections -> all OK -> all green
Dynamic Sag -> 28%

Does someone have a scientific opinion about the "dynamic sag"? How much should it be? What conclusions can be drawn out of this measurement e.g. what impacts on the general riding impression do smaller or larger figures have?

I tried to lower the pressure for day 3, but as I were already pretty beaten up after those two days, I got somehow scared by the increased dive and returend to the higher pressure again.

So my current conclusion is, that I might have to take a different approach to this. Maybe I shouldn´t start the tuning process with 4 tokens as the resulting ramp and bottom out resistance seems to be issue. Also I might need to rethink handlebar hight?! I absolutly don´t want the fork to bottom out but maybe I shoul try to use more travel and compensate for the lower "dynamic stack" by using more rise on the handlebar?!
Also, I now think, that there is no way arround internally retuning HSC...

Btw.: If I switch to "Playfull" all suggestion turn to green except HSC "make softer" -> yellow, so the first finding is, that there is quite a huge difference between tuning styles.

All in all, it seems to be a nice gadget and it is very intersting to get an "external feedback" about the settings. Also the fact that it confirms my own feelings is a sense of achievement 

It is also interesting to see, that it is possible to achive "all green" in "detections" with 2 to 3 red bars in "suggestions"...

After toying with it, I must say, that I´m also interested in the possibility to access more raw data and for what it´s worth... I´ve never had a single issue with the bt-connection no matter if bt was already on before I started the app or if I turned it on after the app was already started.

EDIT: Once it wanted to do a firmware update although the latest version was/is already installed. Don´t know why this happens...


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Has the shockwiz been a game changer for anyone? Most of the feedback seems to be small tweaks and confirming what they already know. It seems like a neat device.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

jacksonlui said:


> Has the shockwiz been a game changer for anyone? Most of the feedback seems to be small tweaks and confirming what they already know. It seems like a neat device.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I think it´s too early to answer that question, and I also assume that most of the people posting here, have the ability to dial in an, at least half-decent setup anyway, so "game changer" might be a bit too much?!

If you´ve read my last post, you´ve maybe understood that I´m currently under the impression that it helps you, to verify your own feelings (this somehow gives you a certain peace of mind, which I find very helpfull) and like in my case, it maybe triggers you to rethink a thing or two?! For example...during approx 20000 meters of descent, I had only 4 "deep compression events" and I´m pretty confident that I realized them all while riding cause all 4 happend in very sketchy situations where I clearly did something very wrong. If its worth anything... the fork didn´t harshly bottom out during these events and I was (maybe only therefor) able to hold on, but also due to this setup, I sacrificed a lot of useable travel during those 20000 meters of descent which I absolutly can feel in my arms right now.
The fact that I now know, that my usage of travel is kind of poor, makes me rethink my setup cause actually I haven´t got the strenght to hold on to such a stiff fork for such a long time and as you all know, this can end bad but so can a hard bottom out which rips your hands of the bars...
Now I´ve to evalute for myself if I want to ride a stiff spring to avoid occasional hard bottom outs and prevent dive, or if I want to allow the fork to use more travel, in order to reduce the permanent stress on my body.

To answer your question... Yes, I think it´s a neat device which lifts "knob-turning" to a new level, and as Alex said earlier..."Knowlage is power", but I also think I you´re able to dial in a half-decent setup, this device won´t turn an average Joe into a Pro.
If you´re the kind of guy that likes to constantly toy with settings, get one! If you´re more the set and forget type of person, borrow or rent one, evaluate your settings and go ride...

It´s worth nothing, that many people out there ride with horrible, completly wrong settings and don´t even notice it. But most of them have never thought about air pressure or damping at all. For those people, this device would probably indeed be a game changer!


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

just to add to the useful previous post:

i for one am still very much in the 'where does it fit in for me' phase. this is (only partly) due to an unfortunate mix of gaining previously unknown knowledge about the supposedly identical forks i own, and some curious behaviour of the shockwiz that still needs explanation. otherwise i'm basically still 'exploring'.

overall i can certainly see and expect potential, but so far there has been little positive gain - other than i'm riding my bikes more 

it would not surprise me if this were - right now, so soon after launch - true for a lot of the users out there ...


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

Is it a valuable option to spoof Shockwiz?

From my Shockwiz experience, the suggestions for a 165mm travel Enduro bike didn't make sense until I had ridden the bike aggressively on a steep challenging, fast, rocky, steppy trail with a couple of biggish drops. On more "trail" riding, where I spend a lot of time, the suggestions were off and didn't make sense.

If I spoofed Shockwiz with a *lower compression ratio*, Shockwiz would see the mellow trail reaching the deep end of the spoof travel range and wouldn't keep telling me to lower air pressure.

Also, the GF rides a big travel bike with less aggression (probably) than me. Might a spoof CR give good results for her?

I'll be trying this out, but any thoughts on the validity of the process? Obviously sag percentage will be perceived to be deeper but I'm not talking about massive change; just a slight change on the deepest expected travel, say 90% of full range.

e.g.
- 160mm travel spoofed as 90% of that would be 144mm
- 30% sag on 160mm would measure up at 33% of 144mm
- In CR terms a 2.6:1 CR would be spoofed at 2.44:1.16. i.e. 2.1:1

If I've got my sums right.


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

mantra said:


> Detections -> all OK -> all green
> Dynamic Sag -> 28%
> 
> Does someone have a scientific opinion about the "dynamic sag"? How much should it be? What conclusions can be drawn out of this measurement e.g. what impacts on the general riding impression do smaller or larger figures have?
> ...


I've taken to validating the suggestions across all the tuning styles rather than accepting the suggestion at face value and I've seen the same as you. Playful/Balanced match my expectations for the way I want the bike to ride and I can get "all green" with the possible exception of HSC.

For Finale you've definitely got the terrain to challenge a bike. You've got to be honest with your sessions as well. If you have an Enduro/DH bike that you aren't pushing hard, the suggestions won't match. Doesn't sound like you're doing this. Just an observation from my experience.

As regards raw data, forget about it. There isn't any.

Shockwiz does not have a massive memory buffer constantly stacking up observations and filling up a database of what happened when. It doesn't work like that. It doesn't have to. Shockwiz looks like it uses something like Bayes theorem. This is a statistical method for using multiple inaccurate observations (each of which has a known chance of fluking an accurate result) to gradually build confidence with regard to a specific question. It does this by tracking a window of the "100 samples a second" and applying various statistical techniques to that window. e.g. can I see packing? can I see pogoing? can I see bob? After the window has moved onto new data, the old observations are discarded. Only the newly calculated "confidence" is retained.

From an implementation POV, this makes perfect sense. The individual observations are inaccurate. (Motorsport suspension data logging has done this for years. For everybody except the top formulas and manufacturers, filtered statistical data is fit for purpose. The top boys gather gigabytes of data and have the analytical horsepower to number crunch it against track-specific models, cross compared with data channels for driver input and an aerodynamic model)

Other observations: The air pressure change in shockwiz takes place after most of the high frequency components have been filtered out by traversing two schrader valves and a bit of pipe. The sensor, A to D and readout will have some settling time. Everything also hits Nyquist sampling limitations, so the aforementioned high frequency filtering probably helps protect the system from aliasing. So the raw data is probably "mush" and the statistical methods take a long sequence of "mushy" observations and finds the consistent statistical patterns that have relevance for tuning suggestions.

This isn't criticism. I see Shockwiz as fit for purpose.

Dynamic sag is probably a long term average of where the suspension sits during your session. This will vary based on rider position and gradient of the slopes you are riding. The damping settings may also hold the suspension from averaging out at its static sag position. If you have aggressive compression damping and fast rebound, dynamic sag will be lower percentage than if you have open compression and closed rebound.

For my use case (170mm Lyrik, 3x tokens, 87kg rider, 9 clicks out rebound, 4 clicks LSC) I'm seeing ~20% dynamic sag and happy with this setup in aggressive terrain. My Vivid Air out back is ~35% dynamic sag.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

petercarm said:


> I've taken to validating the suggestions across all the tuning styles rather than accepting the suggestion at face value and I've seen the same as you. Playful/Balanced match my expectations for the way I want the bike to ride and I can get "all green" with the possible exception of HSC.
> 
> For Finale you've definitely got the terrain to challenge a bike. You've got to be honest with your sessions as well. If you have an Enduro/DH bike that you aren't pushing hard, the suggestions won't match. Doesn't sound like you're doing this. Just an observation from my experience.


Up front...thanks for your reply!

I don´t know if I understood you wrong?! It is absolutly possible that the "aggressive mode" suggestions would turn all green on my current setup at some point if I would push harder, but I don´t get how it is possible to draw a conclusion about how hard I´m pushing out of this assumption? I would say that the suggestion won´t match if the fork/damper isn´t setup in a way that Shockwiz likes to see, and as I said... except for a PSI drop which I corrected back, nearly right away, I did´t made any changes to my setup.

To put this into perspective:
Lyrik 170mm / 74PSI / 4 Tokens / LSR 11 clicks out / LSC 3 clicks in / between 70 and 71kg / central to reward body position

I dialed the fork in on my first trip with it last summer. We did a little trip to Pila, Verbier and Champéry. At least the last two are a bit steeper and I constantly increased PSI and added spacer to prevent it from diving. Since then, I only lowerd the PSI and the rebound a bit, but didn´t remove any spacers. Maybe it´s time to do that now 



petercarm said:


> For my use case (170mm Lyrik, 3x tokens, 87kg rider, 9 clicks out rebound, 4 clicks LSC) I'm seeing ~20% dynamic sag and happy with this setup in aggressive terrain.


Do you regularly use full travel with this setup? What does your "deep compression event" counter say?

In regard to your spoofing question... In post #144, Alex explains a possibility which might be an alternative to your spoofing idea and if it works like this, with the added benefit, that all readings are still correct...



Quarq Tech said:


> Sasse82 said:
> 
> 
> > Quote from your tutorial: "You can always pick and choose what you like from each Tuning Style. Eg: Tune the Baseline pressure and ramp from one Tuning Style and then switch Tuning Styles to tune the dampers."
> ...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

WOW, 4 tokens and you're my weight and I need none on 160mm Lyrik.



mantra said:


> Up front...thanks for your reply!
> To put this into perspective:
> Lyrik 170mm / 74PSI / 4 Tokens / LSR 11 clicks out / LSC 3 clicks in / between 70 and 71kg / central to reward body position


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

mantra said:


> It is absolutly possible that the "aggressive mode" suggestions would turn all green on my current setup at some point if I would push harder


I think you've made me think about it differently to how I started out. If I set the tuning style to aggressive, it constantly suggests to soften up the suspension ... because I don't actually ride aggressively. Put Richie Rude on it and aggressive is probably the go to setting. Richie will be exercising the suspension all the way through its travel while running a (to me) very stiff setup. I think I now understand "aggressive".



mantra said:


> I would say that the suggestion won´t match if the fork/damper isn´t setup in a way that Shockwiz likes to see, and as I said... except for a PSI drop which I corrected back, nearly right away, I did´t made any changes to my setup.


Me too. Shockwiz validated my current setup but only when I got it onto steeper terrain.



mantra said:


> Lyrik 170mm / 74PSI / 4 Tokens / LSR 11 clicks out / LSC 3 clicks in / between 70 and 71kg / central to reward body position
> 
> I dialed the fork in on my ... trip to Pila, Verbier and Champéry. At least the last two are a bit steeper and I constantly increased PSI and added spacer to prevent it from diving. Since then, I only lowerd the PSI and the rebound a bit, but didn´t remove any spacers. Maybe it´s time to do that now


I'm generally finding more spacers make the fork/shock settle with more sag. Kept thinking I needed more spacers in my Vivid Air (Morzine last summer) but all it was doing was holding the sag down at 40% i.e. less available travel and then the ramp up was insane... so you had to run it with slowest ESR and keep the pressures down, which meant it had a real struggle avoiding bottom out. Took all the spacers out and it is much better balanced. Dual Air Pike (renowned for being linear) on that bike worked really nicely at 18% sag.

I think I'm a linear fan now, but the Lyrik wanted three spacers to get good on more trail type riding.



mantra said:


> Do you regularly use full travel with this setup? What does your "deep compression event" counter say?


Not really on terrain to push it much at the weekend. Deep compression showed 1 or 2. In 15 minute sessions. Never more. Bike was balanced nicely.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

petercarm said:


> As regards raw data, forget about it. There isn't any.
> 
> Shockwiz does not have a massive memory buffer constantly stacking up observations and filling up a database of what happened when. It doesn't work like that. It doesn't have to. Shockwiz looks like it uses something like Bayes theorem. This is a statistical method for using multiple inaccurate observations (each of which has a known chance of fluking an accurate result) to gradually build confidence with regard to a specific question. It does this by tracking a window of the "100 samples a second" and applying various statistical techniques to that window ...


while i fully accept the approach as being viable, i think we had the statement here somewhere that there is a rolling set of data.



petercarm said:


> Other observations: The air pressure change in shockwiz takes place after most of the high frequency components have been filtered out by traversing two schrader valves and a bit of pipe. The sensor, A to D and readout will have some settling time. Everything also hits Nyquist sampling limitations, so the aforementioned high frequency filtering probably helps protect the system from aliasing. So the raw data is probably "mush" and the statistical methods take a long sequence of "mushy" observations and finds the consistent statistical patterns that have relevance for tuning suggestions.


surely aliasing issues could have been nailed during R&D and the algorithm/hardware set-up appropriately in the final product? defeating it from the 'get go' means that it won't crop up as spurious results in a customer's set-up.

the 'mush' theory is interesting (and oh so very obvious when one thinks about it). yes, the signal at the sensor will be somewhat damped - that's why the pipe is short ;-). the degree of mush has important consequences for how long it will take to get a good Confidence value - e.g. if your tyres pressures are low, as mine were the other day, the tyres will squish before the shock element and this will emphasise the mush aspect considerably. if true, the implication will be that shockwiz can only tolerate a certain minimum tyre squish ...

time for a test, me thinks ...


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Does this mean that you may need a different set of settings for different set of tires or if you change pressures?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

no ... well, not unless you are 'high maintenance' about things like that 

*IF* this is an issue, this would simply mean 'sessioning' with minimum tyre squish so that the shockwiz 'sees' as much of the trail/bike/rider as possible without the data being 'mushed' by soft tyres. this will probably get you a higher Confidence value, and more quickly. 

once the fork/shock is dialed - i.e. supposedly giving the best performance for the chosen style - then you can back off the tyre pressures as needed for the added performance sought (traction, braking, whatever).

at least that is going to be my *first* approach ...


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I see. I would think to test the tires at its preferred psi with the shock as one system. Different tires will contribute to a small change in the amount of rebound used. Tire pressure on a plus tire can make it feel playful or balanced. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> I see. I would think to test the tires at its preferred psi with the shock as one system. Different tires will contribute to a small change in the amount of rebound used. Tire pressure on a plus tire can make it feel playful or balanced.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


That's not how the system works though. The rebound that you feel from the tire isn't going to be picked up by the device.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## mtlcafan79 (Sep 19, 2016)

I rode rocks and roots for literally hours until my hands and a$$ were sore on a 27.5+ hardtail. Shockwiz still said I needed to ride more bumpy trail. It was happy with everything else though.


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

I would assume that it's better to ride with the tire pressure you prefer, not with a special higher pressure for the measurement. Otherwise the suggestions might be not that perfectly fitting for your regular tire pressure.
Just imagine, with a high tire pressure, the fork will need to work/move/damp more. So, the the shockwiz might tell you to remove some LSC. But with your normal tire pressure the small hits are a little bit damped by the tire, and therefore the LSC could be a little bit higher.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

what would be the reasoning to add LSC if the fork is dialed?


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

If you have a dialed fork, you don't need Shockwiz. 
I thought we were talking about the tire pressure during measurement runs (in order to let Shockwiz dial in the fork).
And for this, I would assume that it's best to apply the tire pressure you will also use later on, after the Shockwiz measurements.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

ok, so let me mix this up a little ...

i rode 3 sessions late this afternoon. the loop included a steep asphalt climb, a gentle coarse-mettled fire road gradient up a little further, a wide open short decent over medium coarse terrain, followed by a twisty single trail complete with rocks and roots, and a final aspahlt transfer back to the start. short and sweet, max. 100m vertical, certainly quick & dirty, but perhaps suffcient as a pointer ... as far as possible i rode the same lines throughout.

i sessioned the fork - its an early marz 350 NCR. all adjustments are wide open, and they stayed that way for all sessions (this is not usually the case, but its only around 10C here and i am a 70kg lightweight using 57psi in the 160mm fork). for the climbs, the lock-out was left open. the fork feels good, if a little lively.

tyres are both maxxis DHF II 2.5" 3C Terra Exo ACME E=MC^2 (so all the bells and whistles), although rear is a DD. both tubed on 29mm (inner) rims. tyres pressures were:

loops 1&2 - 16psi (what i used at the weekend for a steep alpine descent)
loops 3&4 - 30psi (i now know why DH pro bikes sound the way they do on the videos)
loop 5 - roughly 10psi (did someone say 'hovercraft'?) - here playing devils advocate, i mushed my way around the loop for a final 'mushion'.

my approach to tyre pressures is basically 'snakebite + 3-5psi', and this works pretty well - depending on the tyre, i usually run somewhere around 18-22psi, give or take, with a little less out front, and a little less still all round if glitchy (so slower). you should take the psi values given above with a small pinch of salt, but we can certainly quantify these as soft, hard and 'almost wallowing'. as i am sure you all know, maxxis have some of the better 'damped' tyres.

the first 2 sessions were both 2 loops to see if the 2nd loop changed the result - in both cases there was ZERO, NADA, NULL change introduced by the 2nd loop.

Results:






















Conclusions: none

Confusion: some

Comments: many ...

1. this quick & dirty test *suggests* that shockwiz can 'see through' the tyres, more or less independently of tyre pressure. IF true, this is great news, as it means we can toss this concern out the window. thinking about it, given the diversity of tyres, riders and air pressures, as well as the tubed/tubeless issue, it would make absolute sound business sense to build this capability into the device. only 2 questions remain - can it be done (with the current device), and did they do it?

2. soft tyres gave the better Confidence value - huh?!? ... at these levels, perhaps we shouldn't give this too much weight. however, IF 1. is true, my guess is that shockwiz needs to also gather data on the tyres so that their effect can be removed. to do this it needs to 'see' the tyres in the data too - but if they are too hard there is little 'typical tyre data', or if they are way too wallowy the data 'does not compute'. in both cases it would simply take longer to get a good Confidence value. but, run them with just enough squish, as most of us do, then shockwiz can perhaps quickly gather data, remove them from the equation, and just as quickly give high confidence suggestions for the fork/shock.

or its all just a load of BS ... YMMV


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

mtlcafan79 said:


> I rode rocks and roots for literally hours until my hands and a$$ were sore on a 27.5+ hardtail. Shockwiz still said I needed to ride more bumpy trail. It was happy with everything else though.


i seem to get a lot of that too - anyone else?


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

Your tires are part of your suspension, so the shockwiz will definitely "see" the tires and that will be part your suspension setup. Just think about it--- what would happen if you put in solid tires?


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

did anybody do the firmware update with session data in the device? if yes, did you see significant changes in the evaluation before/after?

i did, and no i didn't *phew!*

of course there should be next to no difference - otherwise, how can quarq hope to retain confidence amongst the users?

however, noting the VW fiasco, there is obviously no limit to how stupid some corporations can be ...


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Well. I see it like that.
If the old firmware was in any way buggy or had some issues with some "conditions" (or whatever), I would be happy if Quark corrects this and then I would of course expect and accept to get different results as before. But then, I would also expect Quark to communicate this to their customers.
A change of firmware with apparently random changes in results and without any explanation is of course somehow confusing and disappointing.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

I downloaded the FW update with an open ride session. There were no changes to the existing results. I'm curious to know what was in the update...


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## cgauss (Mar 28, 2007)

Question for Alex, how does the altitude adjustment work and what is it doing? I live at 5,000 feet, but many rides start there and go over 7,000, which is the next higher range on your altitude options. What is the best one to select and how much does it matter? Thanks.


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## c3024446 (Apr 16, 2010)

My direct mount shockwiz is now broken, someone I lent it to has managed to snap off the mount. Urgh.

Wasn't hit by anything too, just happened via fatigue! Hopefully I can get a refund and get the normal version.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

has anyone experienced the 'shock tuning score' remain grey? All of my previous rides the green bar increases visually. I'm not getting any green after a lot of riding, yet I'm seeing the confidence climb to say 49%. bizarre


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## Pau11y (Oct 15, 2004)

c3024446 said:


> My direct mount shockwiz is now broken, someone I lent it to has managed to snap off the mount. Urgh.
> 
> Wasn't hit by anything too, just happened via fatigue! Hopefully I can get a refund and get the normal version.


Sounds like some one owes you $400!

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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

I've skimmed this thread, and didn't see this answered.

I'm borrowing a buddy's ShockWiz (he Kickstartered), and using it on my Vivid Air. With dual chamber shocks like this, is there a suggested number of times you should cycle the shock to equalize pressures both when bleeding air out and establishing baseline pressure for the calibration process?

I ask because the first time we tried to run it on my Vivid Air, it came up with a compression ratio of 2.4, but it wasn't making any recommendations (kept saying needs more data). I recalibrated, making sure to fully equalize the chambers at least 3 times each way, and this time got a CR of 2.5. This time it immediately started giving recommendations. It also seems like for the Vivid Air I needed to balance the chambers incrementally as I filled it up.

One more question/comment: given that this is essentially a SRAM product now, is there any reason why the "more info" for each setting doesn't indicate alternative descriptions for some of the settings? Ex: Vivid Air's knob for Rebound is labeled "Compression Damping" but High Speed Compression is "Beginning Rebound".


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

Good discussion on this thread - I appreciate all the effort that's been put in here. My ShockWiz is new to me, but my initial impressions are very positive. I'll be blogging a bit about it as our DH racing team incorporates this tool into our race prep - and as I use it to help me with my 'On Trail Tuning' customers. So - my experience over time will include feedback from the full spectrum of riders: from beginners on new bikes to a suspension engineer and industry expert. Looking forward to it! Follow us here:

http://www.doubleblackbikes.com/blog/2017/3/19/quarq-shockwiz-tuning-the-pike-and-db-air

PS: I'm not a SRAM dealer. They do not work with mobile shops like mine. I'm just passionate about finding the best setup and invested in these tools to improve my service quality.

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## bbunnys (Aug 28, 2016)

So just purchased one of theses and after a bit of help. Im running a Rockshocx Pike RT3 and did 3 laps in a row of the same course. Mainly downhill over rocks and grass tracks where I live. 
Got between 80 and 100% confidence over the 3 individual runs. First two runs were much the same as below. Using setting I have in the past. Except one wanted a spacer and no air removed. Second one wanted less air and no spacer. 
All seems odd to get different results like this as doing same course one after another.

So I ended up removing 5 psi of air and did it again. (3rd picture) and all looked good for first 3. And low speed I can adjust by one click. 
But now my high speed is way to hard. Only thing is Pike has no high speed adjustment. So how do I do that.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

bbunnys said:


> ...And low speed I can adjust by one click.
> But now my high speed is way to hard. Only thing is Pike has no high speed adjustment. So how do I do that.


Tell us your air pressure, number of clicks Compression, and body weight.

You may also want to watch the Tuning videos from Vorsprung and read up on the Charger damper to understand how compression damping works with your fork.

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## bbunnys (Aug 28, 2016)

Im running 85 psi of pressure. Originally was 90 psi until it said to lower it. 2 spacers and 4 clicks of low speed compression from negative. 
Im a big rider 6ft 5 and weigh 115 kg.

Do you have a link to tuning video.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

bbunnys said:


> So just purchased one of theses and after a bit of help. Im running a Rockshocx Pike RT3 and did 3 laps in a row of the same course. Mainly downhill over rocks and grass tracks where I live.
> Got between 80 and 100% confidence over the 3 individual runs. First two runs were much the same as below. Using setting I have in the past. Except one wanted a spacer and no air removed. Second one wanted less air and no spacer.
> All seems odd to get different results like this as doing same course one after another.
> 
> ...


My readings looked pretty similar to yours. I had to add a spacer and reduce pressure from 85psi to 70psi. Shockwiz always called for less compression even though it was wide open. Shockwiz always said the rebound setting was "OK" through all the pressure changes (1-2 clicks from full closed/slow). The ride was harsh to say the least... I experimented by opening up the rebound to 6-7 clicks from full closed. This significantly smoothed the ride of my Fox 34 FIT4. Shockwiz still gave rebound the same "OK" setting, but also gave both compression settings an "OK". My question would now be, did changing the rebound setting somehow improve the compression score? I also find it odd that changing rebound by 4 clicks had such a significant impact on the ride, but no impact on the Shockwiz rebound suggestion.

Also, which tuning parameter are you using? I find that "balanced" calls for more compression than "playful" while keeping everything else the same.


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## bbunnys (Aug 28, 2016)

Yeah I wonder how accurate this system actually is. I might change my rebound as I run it pretty slow. 
Be interesting if I speed it right up if it will change suggestion. 

The fork also say on guide, for my size I should be running 110psi in it. Not 85psi. So might go back to one spacer and up PSI and see what it suggests then. 

Ive been also running on playfull.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Cool product.

Put me down for a guy that 100% requires HSR before I would purchase.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

These Tuning videos are lengthy but informative:






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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

so Quara Tech's last contribution was 2 weeks ago - if he is gone for good, that's firstly very disappointing, and secondly not a good sign ...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

ragetty said:


> so Quara Tech's last contribution was 2 weeks ago - if he is gone for good, that's firstly very disappointing, and secondly not a good sign ...


he's away at the moment


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

ragetty said:


> so Quara Tech's last contribution was 2 weeks ago - if he is gone for good, that's firstly very disappointing, and secondly not a good sign ...


Most manufacturers don't participate in online forums. He provided some good detailed information to the thread. I don't take his not posting as a "bad sign". After all, it's not like this thread is the only means of support...

https://www.quarq.com/contact-us/


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

Quarq is one of the few manufacturers that actively participates in forums, and I appreciate it. They are also active on Slowtwitch regarding their power meters.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

just to be pedantic, my exact wording was not unintentional. and i still think it would be a bad sign, because ... 

i appreciate forum support too, as this presents an opportunity to openly discuss in front of the user community. in particular with something like shockwiz, people with intelligent queries and questions deserve better than 'forget it, its just a black box' answers.

my experience with generic 'contact us' support is - 9 times out of 10 - disappointing and frustrating. with most reposnses it is obvious that either the initial message wasn't read and understood, or the respondee has no clue and replies with generic garbage. 

quarq may be different - i can't, so i won't comment - but any intelligent answer would be better served here than in a private discussion.


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

ragetty said:


> quarq may be different - i can't, so i won't comment - but any intelligent answer would be better served here than in a private discussion.


They are different. I've sent them 6-10 moderately technical issues regarding PM functions/issues and I've always received great support/answers. Half of the time I've dealt with Alex, the rep who's been on this forum.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

I've been impressed with the product - but do have one request for product improvement: 

I want to keep this tool protected during storage. This product should come with a case or nylon pouch, and rubber inserts for the hose ends to protect them while not in use. I'm assuming it's very important to keep the hoses clear of debris. Include in the design for the hose end 'inserts' something like a small string or lanyard to keep them together. I'd also like a couple spare valve caps!


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

ragetty said:


> so Quara Tech's last contribution was 2 weeks ago - if he is gone for good, that's firstly very disappointing, and secondly not a good sign ...


So you should go and design your own suspension software and spend your free time answering questions in public forums as your obviously not satisfied with the contributions Alex gave.

I get it, your smarter than everyone else.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

skinnybex said:


> So you should go and design your own suspension software and spend your free time answering questions in public forums as your obviously not satisfied with the contributions Alex gave.


... 'free time', 'you're [sic] obviously not satisfied' ...

wow, where do you forum clairvoyants spring up from? i'm always totally amazed what knowledge people like you are capable of calling up out thin air :skep:

(apologies to the rest for off-topic).


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

rijndael said:


> They are different. I've sent them 6-10 moderately technical issues regarding PM functions/issues and I've always received great support/answers. Half of the time I've dealt with Alex, the rep who's been on this forum.


sounds good :thumbsup:


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

ragetty said:


> ... 'free time', 'you're [sic] obviously not satisfied' ...
> 
> wow, where do you forum clairvoyants spring up from? i'm always totally amazed what knowledge people like you are capable of calling up out thin air :skep:
> 
> (apologies to the rest for off-topic).


I'm busy riding my bikes and using my Shockwiz which I find very helpful and am happy with the results so far.

Your just getting butt hurt because I called you out for being negative. Go ride and stop being a whiner just because you think the Shockwiz isn't what you'd like it to be.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Brb. Gonna go get some more popcorn.

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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

skinnybex said:


> So you should go and design your own suspension software and spend your free time answering questions in public forums as your obviously not satisfied with the contributions Alex gave.
> 
> I get it, your smarter than everyone else.


Please...don´t do this! I´m sorry that I´m not native English speaking, so please have leniency with my choice words, but this might be a thread where statements like "shut up an go ride" doesn´t count or even might turn against your credibility?!
Look at it this way....Shockwiz is designed to help people like you tuning in their suspension....just like this....but....this is a totally new apporoach (technically speaking) of doing it and inevitably this brings up people which have a certain interest in how this is actually done and what could be improved to do it better. This people (I´m one of them) do problably spend more time with talking and thinking about a product than actually using it?!
And you know what...I´m pretty sure that this is also a valid position because probably even the idea of creating such a product, wasn´t born during a wild ride down a moutain but more likely afterwards. Maybe even during a talk with other people?!
If you are the kind of guy who likes to just use a given product, that´s ok. In the end, this is what most products are made for, but please respect the possibilty that there might be some people who like to question things.
I highly appreciate Alex´s presence hear! And I´m pretty sure so does @ragetty, but this doesn´t mean that we aren´t allowed to disagree or post things like you quoted. I understand it this way, that @ragetty is truely disappointed about Alex being absent for a while because of the loss in direct conection and interaction with the manufacturer.... If it´s a good sign or not...don´t know...probably Alex is on vacation or something?!
And to make that also clear...I´m already said that I appreciate Alex´s efforts and insight but I also made clear that I´m not satisfied with everything he said (if intersted...read about HSR) and I´m pretty sure you can´t argue against me in regard to this specific subject!
In order to come to an end...if you enjoy the product, go out and ride but don´t try to twist someone others words just to start the next of 1 billion already existing bash post, only for the purpose of doing it...
Give us your thoughts about Shockwiz and tell us about your experience with it. This is the place where it might be possible that the manufacturer is listening. If we are lucky, even to those things where we disagree...

@petercarm: Sorry for not getting back to your last post. I´m coming of the 2nd 55+h week and I´m just tired right now. I´ll get back as soon as I´ve more time to think (and test) about it.


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

I love my Shockwiz and I appreciate Alex's contributions. My issue is with raggety and his continuance to post assumptions that the Shockwiz is faulty and support for the product is in danger.


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

Btw, having someone from Rock Shox involved in the Shockwiz discussion was a luxury that will probably no longer exist because as is usually the case a few so called "expert posters" have decided they are smarter than the engineers who designed the Shockwiz and it's no longer worthwhile for RS to continue to contribute. 

It's not like Rock Shox made the investment to acquire this technology without taking the time to streamline and fine tune the software.

Obviously improvements can be made in the future via firmware. I can only hope we continue to get valuable insight from the developers in this thread.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

my Shockwiz has done maybe 3 firmware updates. Do we have any idea of what the updates changes/added each time? What I'm getting at is maybe tuning suggestions today, might be different to what I received 2 weeks back


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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

Hi everyone,

I recently upgraded to a Yeti SB5c with Pike 150 solo's and wanted to make the most of my investment so bought the shockwiz - especially given the quantum leap from my 2007 era 26" Specialized FSR XC.

I've been riding over 20 years and thought I vaguely knew what I was doing with suspension, my initial score was 82 validating that to a degree, however after tuning with shockwiz I got it to 96% - this transformed my ride completely (for the better) - for those considering buying one I hope this helps.

Secondly, I had trouble with air leakage removing the shockwiz from my pikes and wanted to understand if shock pump pressure = shockwiz indicated pressure when re-pumping up the forks. Huge thanks to Alex for answering this in such a clever way for ctguru on page 4, I'm very impressed with your support on this forum, thanks for taking the time mate, really appreciated.

Cheers
Mutchy


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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

Hi all, 

I just followed Alex's process for calibrating shock pump to shockwiz and found a 10/20 PSI F/R discrepency between my pump and the wiz !. This is pretty significant, especially if I need to pump the shock or fork up without the wiz attached - I'd be way out ! well, 15% anyway 

Alex, this seems very important to me and could be worth including on your site or instructions somewhere ? 

Here's the process again for those who missed it

You can ensure the same pressure is in the spring though, using the below process.

1. Prior to removing ShockWiz, connect to the app and see what the reported air pressure is within the App and write it down.

2. Then connect your shock pump to the available ShockWiz inflation valve. When the pump engages there will be a small amount of air loss (pressure inside the spring) due to the pump charging. 

3. Using the reported value in the app, pump the spring back up to the pressure recorded in step 1. 

4. Before removing the pump, record the value that the pumps gauge reports and write that down. You can now remove the pump and ShocKWiz.

5. Reinstall the shock pump on your fork or shocks inflation valve. Again, when thew pump engages there will be a small amount of air loss (pressure inside the spring) due to the pump charging. Now increase the pressure until the pump reads the same value that it did in step 4.


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Are you all using Rock Shox pumps?
At least I do and I also experience this deviation between the pump and the Shockwiz measurement. Would be good to know if also other shock pumps show this deviation.

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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

Hi Sasse82,

Pretty sure mine isn't a Rock Shox pump, I've had it for years so am sure it's the problem (not shockwiz). Would be interesting to see if digital pumps have the same issue...


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

I imagine all pumps will have a variance.









Keep it recorded so you can factor that in when you restore air pressure over time without ShockWiz on.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

There was review done previously where they've looked at the accuracy of a handful od shock pumps and the rockshox digital was very accurate. The digital rockshox is the same as the performance brand one which was on sale for $45 a week ago. Im not sure what accuracy spec is for the shockwiz but a feature where it will allow you to calibrate it against your personal shock pump will be very helpful. We dont need absolute accuracy but relative accuracy is important. Just need a way to add an offset in the app.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

The displayed pressure doesn't matter. What matters is repeatability. Once you have the air pressure set right, record your shocks pressure and use that. Same for tires as long as you use the same gauge every time you can dial in the right pressure even if the gauge is off.
I have the same pump with a fox logo on it and it reads low by 6psi at 185.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

If yours read low by 6 and from oldranger's pic, his reads 7psi low...maybe the shockwiz is consistently low by 6-7psi.

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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

No it's not. There is no offset at 0 Psi, so it must be a factorial measurement failure. And without any gauged / accurate measurement process we will never find out which of the sensors is measuring the right pressure. 

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

There wouldn't be an offset at 0 psi because typical pressure sensors' operating range doesn't go that low when its max is at 300 psi. Im guessing maybe it'll work down to about 100 psi. A 7 psi offset is only about 2-5% error which isnt terrible. What im saying is allowing a user to add an offset to match their personal shock pump so it matches. 

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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

Agreed, I'm off by 15% with my old pump and made the mistake of pumping the fork up 10 psi over the shockwiz reading after I removed it - defeating the purpose entirely. So an offset would be helpful so we don't have to go through the process I posted earlier....

Cheers


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

100 Psi lower limit?
I don't believe that. Most people including me are running their forks below that, and the measurement must be accurate here.
Also think about the calibration process, the shockwiz will be calibrated at around 0 Psi when fully extended with deflated air spring.


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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

Urgent help needed! I just installed the ShockWiz to my monarch xx with the hydraulic lock out and was doing the calibration. Shock is is open mode as I did it. 

Halfway thru the calibration on the part where the app asked to pump air to manufacture recommendations (210 psi in this case) and the next step was to extend and compress the shock to 50%, my shock seized. It won't compress at all. I released the air and manage to compress it. Now even when I pump 100 psi it won't compress. What happened?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Did u try equalizing the pressure of the pos and neg chamber bu cycling the shock as you pump air in? Instead of just filling it to 210psi and then compressing it.

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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> Did u try equalizing the pressure of the pos and neg chamber bu cycling the shock as you pump air in? Instead of just filling it to 210psi and then compressing it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I did not. Am I supposed to do that? Crap


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Ive made the same mistake the first time i released all the pressure and then pump it back up. Felt hard as a rock and wouldnt compress. Figured out i should pump maybe 50 psi then equalize by boucing up and down and repeat. 

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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> Ive made the same mistake the first time i released all the pressure and then pump it back up. Felt hard as a rock and wouldnt compress. Figured out i should pump maybe 50 psi then equalize by boucing up and down and repeat.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Noted on that. Thanks alot.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

jacksonlui said:


> Brb. Gonna go get some more popcorn.


i wouldn't bother, not much is going to happen - i activated 'ignore' right after the first comment :thumbsup:


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

I've been playing around with the unit and really like the feedback it gives.
Couple things on my wish list would be.
1. HSR option for shocks that have it.
2. Ability to save a run to my phone. Right now I screenshot it but it gets cumbersome.
3. A downhill mode. it seems like its 50% up 50% down for a good confidence score.
4. Access to the data of the whole run. I would love to geek out on the data.
5. User profiles for different bikes and shocks. save the compression ratio and base air pressure so we can get repeatable results.

We did a group buy to share the cost so it's going to be on a lot of bikes and shocks. I'll share all the feedback as we play with it.
My setup
Tallboy 3 
Front Tire	17	PSI
Rear Tire	21	PSI

Fork Fox 34 130mm 
Air Pressure 78	PSI Fox Pump
Compression Ratio	2.9	ShockWiz
Volume Spacers 4	Fox Clip-on
Sag 28	mm
Rebound 6	Clicks from Open 0-10
Compression 8	Clicks from Open 0-18

CC Inline DB 184x44 
Air Pressure 185	PSI Fox Pump
Compression Ratio	2.9	ShockWiz
Volume Spacers 1, 0	Large, Small
Sag 11	mm
LSR 8	Clicks from Open 0-18
HSR 2	Turns from Open 0-4.5
LSC 4	Clicks from Open 0-18
HSC 1.5	Turns from Open 0-4.5


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

The last days I was finally able to make some rides with the Shockwiz myself.
In total I made 4 ride sessions, 1 with my fork and 3 with my rear shock.
Strangely, out of these 4 sessions only 1 produced different results/suggestions between Playful and Balanced. The other three sessions were 100% identical between the two riding styles. Did anyone experience the same on his runs?

PS: Since I was only riding on local trails (not always the same) I'm not ready to give an overall conclusion about the gadget, yet. Maybe I will visit a bikepark this weekend for more repeatable calibration runs.


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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

For the record, locked my rear shock too yesterday, thanks for the tip on cycling the shock while inflating. 

Cheers
Dave


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## pharmkid85 (Mar 29, 2017)

*my Wiz is DOA*

I lucked out and got one of the handful of defective ones on my first go around with this. The unit reports a fork pressure of -751 to -650ish psi?! On top of that the unit arrived with a dead battery. Not surprised as the thing is motion activated and ships with the battery installed and no contact blocking sticker on either side of the battery( like most electronics I get).

Quarq was very quick to offer a replacement in exchange for my unit so they could get it back to their engineers for testing though. Couldn't be happier with the support but it was a bummer to not be able to test it out when I got it home.

I'll update when the new unit arrives.


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## g.law (Apr 16, 2007)

Anyone experiencing inconsistency in measuring compression ratio? I calibrated the ShockWiz on my Pivot Switchblade with a Fox Float X2 yesterday and it measured a ratio of 2.7. After a data session the app suggested removing a bottomless band which I did. When I recalibrated the ratio was measured at 2.4. Does this seem correct?


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

If you change the air volume by adding or removing spacers, the compression ratio must change.
What I can't tell is if a change of 0.3 is expected when removing one spacer. At least it's the right direction. More air volume, less compression ratio.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Sasse82 said:


> If you change the air volume by adding or removing spacers, the compression ratio must change.
> What I can't tell is if a change of 0.3 is expected when removing one spacer. At least it's the right direction. More air volume, less compression ratio.


beat me to it


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

When I setup my bike I measured the fork and shock twice each. Both times it registered the same ratio. Seems pretty accurate to me.
I have a 2.9 ratio front and rear which makes sense to me as you want a balanced feel front to back.
What are your ratio's front to back?


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

I've had consistent readings for my C ratio on the 2 bikes I've tuned. Although it did change when I added a Volume spacer to my Float X


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

g.law said:


> Anyone experiencing inconsistency in measuring compression ratio? I calibrated the ShockWiz on my Pivot Switchblade with a Fox Float X2 yesterday and it measured a ratio of 2.7. After a data session the app suggested removing a bottomless band which I did. When I recalibrated the ratio was measured at 2.4. Does this seem correct?


You need to be very careful calibrating the Shockwiz with dual chamber shocks like the X2. I have a Vivid Air R2C, and messed it up the first time. Basically you need to make sure that you equalize the chambers as you fill it up (and empty it).

That said, I can't say how much affect adding 1 spacer would have on the ratio. It could be your change was right, or it could be that your calibration was off on 1 or both times.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Thats interesting about having similar compression ratios front and back to get a balanced feel. Does anyone know for sure that this is a valid goal to try and achieve or does it not matter.

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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

I have 3 in the front and 2.7 in the back. Shockwiz tells me all good regarding air pressure and spacers.
But I also have 180 mm in the front and 160 in the back.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

My thinking on ratio is that if you set both shocks at 25% sag then with equal weight on both ends of the bike you will bottom at the same time regardless of travel. Its a % of travel ratio. Situations where you have a difference in sag will dictate a different ratio or if you weight one end of the bike more then the other. For my riding style and bike, an equal ratio makes sense.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

You can relate sag from front and rear, but compression ratios between a fork and shock make no sense. You can't compare a long fork with small amount of air to a tiny can of much higher pressure.


alexbn921 said:


> My thinking on ratio is that if you set both shocks at 25% sag then with equal weight on both ends of the bike you will bottom at the same time regardless of travel. Its a % of travel ratio. Situations where you have a difference in sag will dictate a different ratio or if you weight one end of the bike more then the other. For my riding style and bike, an equal ratio makes sense.


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## bbunnys (Aug 28, 2016)

I did a bit more testing after my mixed results last week. Did my local trail and thought id wind rebound all the way to fast. It always say my rebound is fine. So wanted to test extremes.
Sure enough was way to fast and hard to control bike. Gave me results in picture one below. 
Interesting it still said rebound was fine.

So I then changed noting else on setup except putting rebound 3 clicks from slow. Gave results of second picture. Funny rebound is still "ok", but made all other setting look much better. 
Personally I think its still 2 clicks to slow for my riding style. 

Seems like on my Shockwiz at least. Says rebound is ok where ever I set it. But it does change results of other setting quite a bit.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

lucifuge said:


> You can relate sag from front and rear, but compression ratios between a fork and shock make no sense. You can't compare a long fork with small amount of air to a tiny can of much higher pressure.


Sure you can. Compression ratio is just that a ratio. A ratio of 3 will compress the air 3x at full travel regardless if its 100mm or 200mm. So my 130mm fork at the 50% travel will equal my 44mm shock at 50% travel. If they start at the same sag ie spring rate to support your weight. They will both end up at the same max spring rate. This doesn't factor in falling or raising rate rear suspensions.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

bbunnys said:


> I did a bit more testing after my mixed results last week. Did my local trail and thought id wind rebound all the way to fast. It always say my rebound is fine. So wanted to test extremes.
> Sure enough was way to fast and hard to control bike. Gave me results in picture one below.
> Interesting it still said rebound was fine.
> 
> ...


According to Shockwiz's tuning approach, unless you get green for the 1st two, then the remainder are irrelevant. So your'e pic1 isn't really telling you anything if you get what I mean. Pic2 is fine though.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

alexbn921 said:


> Sure you can. Compression ratio is just that a ratio. A ratio of 3 will compress the air 3x at full travel regardless if its 100mm or 200mm. So my 130mm fork at the 50% travel will equal my 44mm shock at 50% travel. If they start at the same sag ie spring rate to support your weight. They will both end up at the same max spring rate. This doesn't factor in falling or raising rate rear suspensions.


the comment that threw me was "or my riding style and bike, an equal ratio makes sense." what do you mean by an equal ratio?


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

bbunnys said:


> I did a bit more testing after my mixed results last week. Did my local trail and thought id wind rebound all the way to fast. It always say my rebound is fine. So wanted to test extremes.
> Sure enough was way to fast and hard to control bike. Gave me results in picture one below.
> Interesting it still said rebound was fine.
> 
> ...


I've noticed the same in regards to rebound tuning on my fork. Went from full closed to half open. Rebound stayed OK, but my low speed compression went from make softer to OK. That being said, it is asking for more rebound when tuning the rear shock.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

lucifuge said:


> the comment that threw me was "or my riding style and bike, an equal ratio makes sense." what do you mean by an equal ratio?


I was talking about both the front and rear of my bike have very similar spring rates relative to travel. A downhill bike on a super steep trail would move your weight forward necessitating a higher ratio in the front. An XC bike might want a higher rate in the rear. Body position on the bike will shift weight around too. I'm just thinking out loud, balanced might be best overall.
Interested to see what ratios front to rear others are running.
I'm at 2.9 front and rear on a XXL Tallboy3 130mm front, 110mm rear.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

alexbn921 said:


> Sure you can. Compression ratio is just that a ratio. A ratio of 3 will compress the air 3x at full travel regardless if its 100mm or 200mm. So my 130mm fork at the 50% travel will equal my 44mm shock at 50% travel. If they start at the same sag ie spring rate to support your weight. They will both end up at the same max spring rate. This doesn't factor in falling or raising rate rear suspensions.


I'm not sure you fully understand all the details of what is going on with these forces. While one unique bike might be best set up with a single compression ratio, that's going to be far from true for most bikes. First, you have two containers of vastly disparate shape and size, one which moves drastically further than the other. Second, you really don't need them to both compress at the same ratio, it is very rare that they will see the same level of force simultaneously. Third, most riders do not set both ends at the same amount of sag.

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I've seen pages that reference 50% more sag in the rear compared to the front. Eg 20%/30%. I notice Avalanche determined their magic numbers to be 22%/30%

How to set the proper sag


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

I do full understand that we are taking about different size air chambers with completely different strokes. I'm an electrical engineer, so I'm analyzing this from an engineering perspective. Doing the math is what I'm good at. We also have to factor in the leverage curve of the rear suspension. Compress ratio is the factor by which a given volume of air is compressed.
so my rear shock compresses the air 2.9 times in its 44mm stroke and my fork is 2.9 in 130mm of stroke. My rear suspension has a ratio of 2.5 (it's a curve but 2.5 is the average). If you look at wheel travel it might be easier to understand.
I tend to set my sag close to each other in the 23-27% range. When your on the bike lets say your weight distribution is 50/50 (it can be different from this it's just an example) then the force holding you up will be balanced front and rear and the effective wheel spring rate will be identical other wise sag would change until it is. The rear will be 2.5 times higher at the spring, but this doesn't matter. If you bonce the bike to 50% travel (65mm front and 22mm rear in my case) both springs will increase the wheel spring rate by the same amount, because the compression ratio of the spring is identical for a given travel. At full bottom out both springs will still be at an identical wheel spring rate too.
Changing the sag or weight distribution will change the ratio from front to back. Travel is factored into the CR formula.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

alexbn921 said:


> I do full understand that we are taking about different size air chambers with completely different strokes. I'm an electrical engineer, so I'm analyzing this from an engineering perspective. Doing the math is what I'm good at. We also have to factor in the leverage curve of the rear suspension. Compress ratio is the factor by which a given volume of air is compressed.
> so my rear shock compresses the air 2.9 times in its 44mm stroke and my fork is 2.9 in 130mm of stroke. My rear suspension has a ratio of 2.5 (it's a curve but 2.5 is the average). If you look at wheel travel it might be easier to understand.
> I tend to set my sag close to each other in the 23-27% range. When your on the bike lets say your weight distribution is 50/50 (it can be different from this it's just an example) then the force holding you up will be balanced front and rear and the effective wheel spring rate will be identical other wise sag would change until it is. The rear will be 2.5 times higher at the spring, but this doesn't matter. If you bonce the bike to 50% travel (65mm front and 22mm rear in my case) both springs will increase the wheel spring rate by the same amount, because the compression ratio of the spring is identical for a given travel. At full bottom out both springs will still be at an identical wheel spring rate too.
> Changing the sag or weight distribution will change the ratio from front to back. Travel is factored into the CR formula.


Interestingly enough I also have a high level engineering and mathematical background and you are looking at this incorrectly. You, for whatever reason, have chosen to go this route. This will not work for the majority of riders. Also, your front and rear "springs" do not have the same rate. That would either result in you having a rigid front or an incredibly soft rear. The front is linear and the rear has levers acting on it.

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

What you are describing would only work if the bike was static. You are ignoring that once the bikes in motion you have momentum/physics forces affecting the bike AND rider in the direction of motion. It's for these reasons that sag should not be the same. Its a great recipe for an endo if you do.



alexbn921 said:


> I do full understand that we are taking about different size air chambers with completely different strokes. I'm an electrical engineer, so I'm analyzing this from an engineering perspective. Doing the math is what I'm good at. We also have to factor in the leverage curve of the rear suspension. Compress ratio is the factor by which a given volume of air is compressed.
> so my rear shock compresses the air 2.9 times in its 44mm stroke and my fork is 2.9 in 130mm of stroke. My rear suspension has a ratio of 2.5 (it's a curve but 2.5 is the average). If you look at wheel travel it might be easier to understand.
> I tend to set my sag close to each other in the 23-27% range. When your on the bike lets say your weight distribution is 50/50 (it can be different from this it's just an example) then the force holding you up will be balanced front and rear and the effective wheel spring rate will be identical other wise sag would change until it is. The rear will be 2.5 times higher at the spring, but this doesn't matter. If you bonce the bike to 50% travel (65mm front and 22mm rear in my case) both springs will increase the wheel spring rate by the same amount, because the compression ratio of the spring is identical for a given travel. At full bottom out both springs will still be at an identical wheel spring rate too.
> Changing the sag or weight distribution will change the ratio from front to back. Travel is factored into the CR formula.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> What you are describing would only work if the bike was static. You are ignoring that once the bikes in motion you have momentum/physics forces affecting the bike AND rider in the direction of motion. It's for these reasons that sag should not be the same. Its a great recipe for an endo if you do.


Or conversely coming off a drop/jump tail heavy and sinking into a loop out.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

So the only question I was really interested in was what is your compression ratio?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

alexbn921 said:


> So the only question I was really interested in was what is your compression ratio?


I had issues with their calibration process. I ended up with CR's that were way less than what matched actual travel displacement. When I did it manually, it was fine. I ended up with something like 3.7 F and 3.2 R. This was with respect to 'Balanced'. I'm keen to re-run with 'Efficient' because I think I prefer my fork feeling bit firmer. From memory this was closer to 4.2 F, but I am re-testing on weekend and will report back. It's pretty much the difference of 55psi 'balanced' and 70psi 'efficient' for a 160mm solo air Lyrik with a Luftkappe and no tokens


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

If shock wiz can't measure your ratio right then it won't know where you are in your travel. It will also affect the its recommendations with regard to low/high speed tipping point. I have set it up on 3 different bikes and it has consistently measured CR. I even did it multiple times on my main bike to check for repeatable results. Same every time. 4.2 seems like a huge ramp up. I like my fork stiff as well.
edit
CR has nothing to do with the amount of travel you have.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

You can over-ride it in the settings, which it uses.



alexbn921 said:


> If shock wiz can't measure your ratio right then it won't know where you are in your travel. It will also affect the its recommendations with regard to low/high speed tipping point. I have set it up on 3 different bikes and it has consistently measured CR. I even did it multiple times on my main bike to check for repeatable results. Same every time. 4.2 seems like a huge ramp up. I like my fork stiff as well.
> edit
> CR has nothing to do with the amount of travel you have.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

You can set it to whatever you want, but if you real ratio is 2.6 and you set 4.2 it will never think that you used more than 61.9% travel. Your sag, ramp..... will all be calculated wrong.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

alexbn921 said:


> You can set it to whatever you want, but if you real ratio is 2.6 and you set 4.2 it will never think that you used more than 61.9% travel. Your sag, ramp..... will all be calculated wrong.


What's coming out of it with the manual settings seems to make sense and also I've heard from Quarq that my results seem to be correct. I'm not sure whether Luftkappe is a confusion point in the calibration process. Am hoping someone with one as well might pitch in and comment.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I just did a full re-calibration sequence again and got 2.7. I'm going to just run with that and see what happens. There's something a bit tricky with this Luftkappe in association with the calibration, can't put my finger on it. Anyway, 2.7 is a lot different to 4.2....so will be interesting.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

As far as I understand it, installing Luftkappe changes the cr once because of it, decreasing the volume of the positiv air chamber. Besides from that, it shouldn't have any further impact on the cr measuring.

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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

Has anyone had any problems with the ShockWiz reading negative air pressure when its not connected to a fork or shock and its not got any air in it? Mine is playing up at the minute.


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

For those of you that are using shop rental / loaner / demo units, what are you paying per day to use one of these?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

BXCc said:


> For those of you that are using shop rental / loaner / demo units, what are you paying per day to use one of these?


I think the going rate is about $25 a day. One of the shops in Santa Rosa CA has one they rent out.
I bought one with a group of guys and everyone is chipping in $50 to use it whenever they need to. Right now everyone is clamoring to use it, but once our suspensions are sorted out, it won't be in such high demand.
edit
NorCal Bike Sport


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## Bones2 (Jul 8, 2006)

BXCc said:


> For those of you that are using shop rental / loaner / demo units, what are you paying per day to use one of these?


Shop near me is asking $50 for 2 days
Or $75 if you want them to set it up and do the adjustments - another 15 for token installation


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Bones2 said:


> Shop near me is asking $50 for 2 days
> Or $75 if you want them to set it up and do the adjustments - another 15 for token installation


$15 to install tokens, are you kidding me? You should undercut that at $5 and make out like a bandit.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

It really takes a good week to get both shock and fork dialed. You need 2 to 4 runs with adjustments in between runs. Plus you want to recheck your fork after u tune the rear. 
The recommendations from shockwiz improved my fork and verified my shock. Very happy with it. Not worth $400 but for 50 it's totally worth it.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

$50 is too much. You'll end up spending $100. The lbs is making a killing. 

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

tuckerjt07 said:


> $15 to install tokens, are you kidding me? You should undercut that at $5 and make out like a bandit.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Seems fair to me. They are spending their time 'working' why shouldn't they get paid?

More relevant would be why can't even an amateur do it at home.


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

Buy a 26mm socket from Abbey Tools for $35.....yes I know that's rather ridiculous but you'll never round out your air assembly and do your own maintenance. I have 8 forks so I get my money's worth.


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

Thanks for the replies. My LBS got one in and I asked about pricing. They weren't positive yet as it just came in. They were thinking $30 per day-ish, $50 for them to read the app and make the changes. Seems reasonable then to get it fine tuned.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> Seems fair to me. They are spending their time 'working' why shouldn't they get paid?
> 
> More relevant would be why can't even an amateur do it at home.


That's the point I'm making ie amateurs, at that rate they are making about $300 an hour on that service.

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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

Is anyone looking to sell their used Shockwiz?


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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

Dvo diamond boost fork owners.. What Compression ratios did u get on the ShockWiz on calibration? I'm getting 1.8, on 170mm travel..


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

joezuri said:


> Dvo diamond boost fork owners.. What Compression ratios did u get on the ShockWiz on calibration? I'm getting 1.8, on 170mm travel..


1.8 is really low.  2.4 to 3 seems like the normal range regardless of travel.


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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

alexbn921 said:


> 1.8 is really low. 2.4 to 3 seems like the normal range regardless of travel.


Hmm... I have issues pulling the fork to full extension during calibration. Any tips from the dvo owners?


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

joezuri said:


> Hmm... I have issues pulling the fork to full extension during calibration. Any tips from the dvo owners?


Try to fully wind out OTT. Maybe that helps?!

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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

My first run out today with the ShockWizz at Surrey Hills (UK) down some suitably rooty runs.

Before we started, it was noted by friends riding with me how soft the fork damping was and how slow the rebound is. I tended to agree with them when riding their bike for comparison.

I am riding a Yeti SB6c with a 2017 Fax 36 Fit4 damper (which I have always considered harsh, so I have lowered the pressure as shown below to soften things up a little).

Anyway, I rode for about 1.5 hours then checked the ShockWizz observations and suggestions.

I am aware that when using ShockWizz and making recommended changes, you have to do one change at a time, i.e., change the pressure if suggested, mark it, then ride, then change to spring rate, then re calibrate, then make the next change and so on, i.e., iterative sessions. I have not done any of that yet, at this stage I'm simply interested in what the readings are hence I just rode for 1.5 hours.

Started out with 55psi, open position, four clicks from fully open on LSC, rebound set quite slow.

You can see the readings and suggestions in the pictures. Note it says 100% confidence level in the suggestions, i.e., it had sampled sufficient readings in the range of travel to be 100% confident in its suggestions.

Note I did use all the travel when out in the ride, but did not hit anything big, after all, it's only me riding and I don't do big jumps, ie, I used full travel on a 160mm fork on gnarly single track with a few drop offs.

Basically, it is suggesting to take some air out, about 5psi and add a token. I'm sure if I do this and re calibrate, the other things such as rebound etc will need a change.

Does it make sense to remove and AND add a token?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The dynamic sag seems low doesnt it? 

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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

I agree, for the pressure I am running, I would of thought I would easily be at 30% sag.


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

That's also why it tells you to remove air and add a spacer.
Less air -> More sag
More spacer -> less bottoming

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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

OK cool, so it is making some sense.
I will make the changes and then go riding again, probably on different terrain. It will be interesting to see what other suggestions it makes regarding the rebound etc.


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

How much do you weight?
56 Psi and 12% Sag is really strange.
I have a 180mm Fox 36 on 77 Psi with 80 kg and get 21% sag.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Yeah, I know its strange. I'm 95 Kg.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Hey db3266
Shockwiz only collects a limited amount of data. After the buffer is full it overwrites the old data. If you rode for 1.5 hours then you lost 1 hour of data.
Once you see 100% confidence the buffer is full.
The best way I have found to tune is to take screen shots after a run. This will give you the best data for that trail. If you need to make changes do it and then do another run. I like to do 2 or 3 trails and combine the data to make my changes.
If it wants me to increase LSC on all 3 runs then then I do it. Tuning is a compromise and what works on one trail might not best for another. Pick the middle ground or setting for the trail you ride the most.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

thanks man. I didn't know about the buffer. Makes more sense now.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The sag is wrong. Does that mean the calibration process was not performed properly?

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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

db3266 said:


> Yeah, I know its strange. I'm 95 Kg.


Phew, that makes it even more strange. 
You weight 15 kg more, you run 20 Psi less and you have less dynamical sag than me.
The only difference is 160 vs. 180 mm.... I must be missing something.



alexbn921 said:


> Hey db3266
> If you rode for 1.5 hours then you lost 1 hour of data.


On what information is this statement based?
It was confirmed that old data will be deleted as soon as the buffer is full, but I read nowhere that it is only 30 min... which would be way too short.
The only thing I read from the Quarq Alex is that you can ride for a very long time before the buffer is full.
And confidence is not based on the duration, it is based on how many different measurement "situations" you rode during the current session (bumpy trail, pedaling, big hits, etc..). If you don't ride a bumpy trail, you will never get 100% confidence.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

That is also how ive understood ss well. The buffer may get full but the confidence is based off of conditions being met to determine the settings. You can ride a smooth pavement for days without getting 90% confidence.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

> As far as when the 'buffer' is full and you're pushing the old out with the new, it's when Confidence reaches 100%.
> 
> Based on this, 4 hours is plenty sufficient. If fact, you can probably go significantly shorter if you pin point certain sections of trails or terrain types to tune on.
> [email protected]


So I don't have access to exactly how Shockwiz works, but I've been paying close attention. This is my understanding after reading about and using it.
All calculations are done in the unit. This is confirmed by alex.
Each parameter has its own buffer. it will do 10 or so jumps for air time. Then overwrite the first ones.


> Shockwiz does not have a massive memory buffer constantly stacking up observations and filling up a database of what happened when. It doesn't work like that. It doesn't have to. Shockwiz looks like it uses something like Bayes theorem. This is a statistical method for using multiple inaccurate observations (each of which has a known chance of fluking an accurate result) to gradually build confidence with regard to a specific question. It does this by tracking a window of the "100 samples a second" and applying various statistical techniques to that window. e.g. can I see packing? can I see pogoing? can I see bob? After the window has moved onto new data, the old observations are discarded. Only the newly calculated "confidence" is retained.
> petercarm


I agree 100% with this
Downhill is 50% confidence.
Pedaling is 50% confidence.
Its terrain based not time. A 5 minute run with jumps and bumps maxes out my downhill score. 5 minutes of hard pedaling does as well.

I've been playing around trying to find a perfect turning run.
How long, how much pedaling, how rough does it need to be.
We have a 1.6 mile, 1000 foot drop, 7 minute run with sections of pedaling, berms, rock gardens and jumps.
Gives near 100% and is a great consistent test track.

Hope that helps explain how I've been using the Shockwiz and how I think it works.
Great little tool.:thumbsup:


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

db3266 said:


> My first run out today with the ShockWizz at Surrey Hills (UK) down some suitably rooty runs.


what is your compression ratio??


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

2.3 or 2.4, Can't quite remember.

Other stuff that I have realised.

My rebound was almost locked out during the ride and has been like that for a while. No wonder I thought the fork was harsh!! Interestingly, shockwiz did not pick up on this and suggested rebound was OK.

Shockwiz measured the pressure at 56psi, but both my shock pumps read 10psi less than this when connected to the shockwiz, also, when I removed the shockwiz and attached the pump (rockshox digital) to the fork, the reading was 10psi lower, ie, is shockwiz actually reading the pressure correctly?

There are too many unknowns in all of this.


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

Pretty simple really. I wouldn't pay much attention to items that are lower in the recommendations until you get the earlier ones set. Address the #1&2 first, then follow the others in order. These likely will change as you work down the list. Of course, set the rebound to a reasonable setting now. 

Pressure numbers are irrelevant. Think of a tire gauge. 2 may read differently, but if you use one consistently, then you are ok. 

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

What are the chances your fork is suffering from some serious negative pressure issues? Could it have charged significantly,
stuck down so when you add air you're getting some rubbish readings? When was it serviced last?


db3266 said:


> 2.3 or 2.4, Can't quite remember.
> 
> Other stuff that I have realised.
> 
> ...


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

I did notice that when I went through the calibration process for the second time, the fork (when all air was released), had some weird suction thing going on and was difficult to fully extend.

My forks are in for a service as I type, so the next time I use shock wiz will be with newly serviced forks.

I wonder whether I should simply enter the compression ratio rather than go through the calibration process again and risk charging the -ve air chamber again (or whatever).


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

I would follow the calibration again.
Could be that the CR was measured false with the "unserviced" fork.
I had no problems calibrating it as described, also have a Fox 36.

Additionally, after changing pressure and spacers you have to recalibrate, no way around that.

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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

what is your compression ratio?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

You need to redo calibration when you get them back. Could be different CR.
When you let air out, use a Allen key and let air escape like REALLY slowly. It might take a few minutes. But the rate of escape will not bugger up the negative. When you do this you ensure fork should hardly move.


db3266 said:


> I did notice that when I went through the calibration process for the second time, the fork (when all air was released), had some weird suction thing going on and was difficult to fully extend.
> 
> My forks are in for a service as I type, so the next time I use shock wiz will be with newly serviced forks.
> 
> I wonder whether I should simply enter the compression ratio rather than go through the calibration process again and risk charging the -ve air chamber again (or whatever).


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

My CR is 3.0, but I have a 180mm 2017 model with factory spacer setting (don't know how many).

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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

Anybody tried to mount the ShockWiz to a lefty 2.0 fork? I can't get the schrader valve of the ShockWiz hose to screw in all the way to make contact and release the air. But I'm able to screw in a shock pump and pump as usual. Fork is new and schrader thread is fine.


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

joezuri said:


> Anybody tried to mount the ShockWiz to a lefty 2.0 fork? I can't get the schrader valve of the ShockWiz hose to screw in all the way to make contact and release the air. But I'm able to screw in a shock pump and pump as usual. Fork is new and schrader thread is fine.


You are in luck- I just got this figured out yesterday.
You need this adapter:
https://www.topeak.com/global/en/products/valve-adapters/265-pressure-rite-schrader-valve-adapter

To test that it works correctly- screw the adapter onto the schrader valve on the Lefty. Slowly unthread the black valve on the backside as shown below (for some reason the topeak image is missing this piece)

https://i.ebayimg.com/thumbs/images/g/i3YAAOSwFe5XzmSt/s-l225.jpg

You should hear a bit of air come out. If not, remove the adapter from the Lefty and then slightly unthread the valve core and try again. Once you get the black valve to release some air, then attach the shock wiz to the guard with zip ties as shown below:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ianspivack/albums/72157682215854025/with/33458019770/

Let me know if you have any other questions. It is really annoying that the threaded tubes are slightly off- but this solution works.


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## Will Fisher (May 12, 2015)

Guys, I have two ShockWiz units that I'd be happy to rent out. Already got my bikes dialed in so let me know if anyone's interested in giving it a try without having to shell out $400-800.

I'm in NC, but they're tiny and so two-day shipping is cheap.


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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

gte534j said:


> You are in luck- I just got this figured out yesterday.
> You need this adapter:
> https://www.topeak.com/global/en/products/valve-adapters/265-pressure-rite-schrader-valve-adapter
> 
> ...


Thanks alot for the tips. I would go for that toppeak valve and try it out soon. I'm running a cannondale habit and had no issues using it for the monarch xx. That lefty schrader is weird


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

joezuri said:


> Thanks alot for the tips. I would go for that toppeak valve and try it out soon. I'm running a cannondale habit and had no issues using it for the monarch xx. That lefty schrader is weird


Message me if you are having problems with setting it up on the Lefty 2.0 and I can try to help out. For some reason the schrader valve is just slightly too big on the Lefty 2.0 but the Topeak adapter fits just fine, just like a shock pump.
BTW- I got 4.0 as my compression ratio for the Lefty 2.0. I followed the recommended pressure chart on the fork and I did a quick ride yesterday and the ShockWiz said the pressure was good.

I had no problems attaching the ShockWiz to my Monarch XX rear shock either. I think that compression ratio was 2.5, but need to double check.


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## joezuri (Mar 26, 2011)

gte534j said:


> Message me if you are having problems with setting it up on the Lefty 2.0 and I can try to help out. For some reason the schrader valve is just slightly too big on the Lefty 2.0 but the Topeak adapter fits just fine, just like a shock pump.
> BTW- I got 4.0 as my compression ratio for the Lefty 2.0. I followed the recommended pressure chart on the fork and I did a quick ride yesterday and the ShockWiz said the pressure was good.
> 
> I had no problems attaching the ShockWiz to my Monarch XX rear shock either. I think that compression ratio was 2.5, but need to double check.


Yup quite close on that monarch xx cr. I got 2.4 for mine. My first ride, got a score of 92, basically everything is OK except for the last 3 suggestions, yellow marks for hc, lc and bottom out. Pretty much nothing I can do abt them wout pulling the shock apart. I'll live with it.


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

I posted 2 pics of the Topeak adapter with the Monarch XX shock.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ianspivack/sets/72157682215854025

The Shockwiz worked great, told me to lower pressure a bit and adjust my rebound (only setting on the Monarch).

The setup for the Lefty 2.0 worked great. One note- you might as well remove the valve core from the Lefty when using the Topeak adapter. Just remember to record the pressure from the Shockwiz before removing the adapter and ShockWiz so you can re-install the valve and pump up the fork to the correct pressure.


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## Mutchy (Mar 27, 2017)

Hi Db, if you go back a couple of pages the shock pump pressure difference has been discussed and Alex offered a great tip on how to calibrate. If you search my posts you'll find it. Hope this helps, I found the same thing with my pump and it worked for me.

Cheers


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

I just starting playing with Shockwiz this week and I am not a suspension expert so please excuse any "dumb" questions.

I have a 150mm Pike solo air on my SC Hightower that I am trying to tune first. I did the calibration and the compression was measured at 2.4. I rode about 11mi of trail and with 100% confidence it told me to add a volume spacer(s) and reduce air pressure. So I added another rockshox token (Had 2, now 3) and reduced air pressure from 115 to about 108. I'm 225lbs. I'm ignoring the other suggestions but I noticed after doing this that the calibration icon in the lower right went to red. So I did a calibration again and now it measures compression at 2.7 and the fork is very difficult to pull to full extension, but I can get it there. I did see some discussion about equalizing the negative/positive chambers so I did cycle the shock multiple times when filling it with air. I then let it all out and did the calibration again to the same result, just to make sure. 2.7 again and pulling to full extension was quite difficult. The first time calibrating I was able to pull to full extension with little resistance. Hence some slight concern.

Just want to make sure I am on the right path as I plan to test again today....Do I need to recalibrate after air pressure/token changes and should I be feeling challenged to pull the fork to full extension. And finally when removing all air should you compress the shock to "get it all out" or should all air be removed while it is extended?

Thanks


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Does it matter if you shockwiz the fork before the shock or are they independent of each other?

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## hardboiled (Jun 10, 2006)

dba -- yes you have to recalibrate after adding/removing tokens, and I believe after changing air pressure. the CR will definitely change when you change the tokens. now that most of the high end forks and shocks on the market have self-equalizing negative air chambers, I add and remove air the same way -- stopping every 50 psi or so to cycle through about 50% of the travel 5-10 times, in order to continually equalize the neg spring. kind of annoying but this will ensure good results. if it got harder to pull to full extension, you may have air in the neg spring. air it up and deflate as per above.


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## Will Fisher (May 12, 2015)

Euro-trash, I'd be happy to rent mine out. I have two. Just PM me


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

When I calibrate and with no air in the fork the shockwiz should read 0 psi but mine reads -0.8 psi. My shockwiz has a 1 psi offset but good thing its linear throughout the range and reproducible. A good update would be to be able to subtract this offset either by entering it manually or zero it out during the calibration process so it matches my shock pump.

My 140mm 85psi fork has a CR of 2.6

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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> When I calibrate and with no air in the fork the shockwiz should read 0 psi but mine reads -0.8 psi. My shockwiz has a 1 psi offset but good thing its linear throughout the range and reproducible. A good update would be to be able to subtract this offset either by entering it manually or zero it out during the calibration process so it matches my shock pump.
> 
> My 140mm 85psi fork has a CR of 2.6
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


The directions and video clearly say this isn't a concern. I see mine fluctuate positive and negative. The video says if beyond a certain amount..... Their probably shouldn't be a correction because it's the fork itself that is the issue. There is no way to have the fork in the same 0osition each time you look at this reading. Wouldn't be concerned about it.

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## zgxtreme (Mar 25, 2007)

Very close to having the green light to pick up two. Who has em in stock? Looked at Jenson but they're pushed out to May.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Its not a concern because everything is relative but when youre done and it says you need 90psi and the shockwiz has a 10psi offset, that can be a problem. 1psi is no big deal. 
With no pressure, it shouldn't read negative anyways. Its a few lines of code to self calibrate or offer a manual entry along with the compression ratio entry. I just want to make sure i dont confuse myself with the psi reading on the phone and the one on the shock pump. Its a minor thing.

What would be nice is to see is all this info on my Garmin as a profile. I wanna see confidence level as i ride.

I also thought it was easier setting sag with shockwiz by looking on my phone instead of measuring it with a caliper. So many applications that can be done with the existing hardware.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

zgxtreme said:


> Very close to having the green light to pick up two. Who has em in stock? Looked at Jenson but they're pushed out to May.


Someone on the forum was renting the shockwiz for $60 for a weekend. Not a terrible price considering priority mail amd insurance will cost about $20.

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## zgxtreme (Mar 25, 2007)

jacksonlui said:


> Someone on the forum was renting the shockwiz for $60 for a weekend. Not a terrible price considering priority mail amd insurance will cost about $20.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Thought about going that route but I spend half my riding time in OK where's it's flat and rooty and the other in NWA with Bella Vista and Bentonville. Going to create profiles for each location I ride so will need it for a bit. Then may rent em out it just sell them.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

It takes a good 2 weeks to setup a bike with 6 to 10 rides. Not really a weekend kind of thing. We are sharing it for a week a piece and people are still not fully tuning both shocks. Yes a day or two will help, but its not nearly enough time.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

zgxtreme said:


> Thought about going that route but I spend half my riding time in OK where's it's flat and rooty and the other in NWA with Bella Vista and Bentonville. Going to create profiles for each location I ride so will need it for a bit. Then may rent em out it just sell them.


If you want to sell them I'm in Bella Vista and would be open to purchasing them from you.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> It takes a good 2 weeks to setup a bike with 6 to 10 rides. Not really a weekend kind of thing. We are sharing it for a week a piece and people are still not fully tuning both shocks. Yes a day or two will help, but its not nearly enough time.


What would u quantify as done? When it gives you all greens on fork and shock?
I figured 3 short rides to get the confidence required in an afternoon for the shock and another afternoon for the fork . 6-8 mile loop per which has a good mix. 
I think in the.future they will embed this into the fork and shock. Autosag, sag set, maintenance, etc.. you can check psi on your phone before a ride. I never check my shock pressure, just my tires.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> I think in the.future they will embed this into the fork and shock. Autosag, sag set, maintenance, etc..
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I rented a Stumpy for the weekend not too long ago and "autosag" was autosucks for me. I didn't like it one bit.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> What would u quantify as done? When it gives you all greens on fork and shock?
> I figured 3 short rides to get the confidence required in an afternoon for the shock and another afternoon for the fork . 6-8 mile loop per which has a good mix.
> I think in the.future they will embed this into the fork and shock. Autosag, sag set, maintenance, etc.. you can check psi on your phone before a ride. I never check my shock pressure, just my tires.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


6-8 miles should do it. If you need volume changes then 1 ride is done. Then you need to dial in pressure and the rest of the settings. You also want to retest the fork after you dial in the rear shock. Not saying it can't be done, but most riders are not going to go out and get a shock tuned in 1 day.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Not saying it can't be done, but most riders are not going to go out and get a shock tuned in 1 day.


Most riders are just that, riders. If they could test and tune their suspension on their own there wouldn't be a market for this tool to begin with. Even with a tool giving them advice many will still struggle to get it right. We've all met that guy on the trail that just rides and don't know a chain break from a multi tool.


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## zgxtreme (Mar 25, 2007)

tuckerjt07 said:


> If you want to sell them I'm in Bella Vista and would be open to purchasing them from you.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk




I'll screen shot this so I remember. Should be there for two months starting here in a few weeks.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

2 questions guys:

1) Is the Shock Wiz water resistant?
2) How do you do a screenshot on your phone and find the thing later?

Thanks


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> 2 questions guys:
> 
> 1) Is the Shock Wiz water resistant?
> 2) How do you do a screenshot on your phone and find the thing later?
> ...


I would think it is water resistant and can handle splashes or light rain. As for the screenshot, what phone do you own as it's not always the same method. Most Android phones will take a screenshot if you hold the power button and the volume down button.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Calibrating the rear shock was tough. How do you extend the rear shock by hand with no air in the can with all that air in the negative chamber?

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> Calibrating the rear shock was tough. How do you extend the rear shock by hand with no air in the can with all that air in the negative chamber?
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


You don't. Both camber need to be empty. Cycle the shock past the dimple to equalize both cambers. You may need to only let out 30psi at a time. Same goes for pumping it back up. Do it in stages to get both to the same pressure.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> I would think it is water resistant and can handle splashes or light rain. As for the screenshot, what phone do you own as it's not always the same method. Most Android phones will take a screenshot if you hold the power button and the volume down button.


Samsung swipe the screen with edge of hand, who's got iOS?

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## freshturk (Aug 11, 2016)

Shockwiz definitely shouldn't take a whole week to get dialed. The key is finding a short loop that will give shockwiz high confidence. I was able to get both my front and rear dialed in under <15miles of Charlotte singletrack. Ive been pleased with it so far and have been renting it for 25/day.


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

I got mine from Backcountry. Chat with them for a discount.


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> Calibrating the rear shock was tough. How do you extend the rear shock by hand with no air in the can with all that air in the negative chamber?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Mye Monarch RT3 was super easy to pull to full extension. You must have to equalize the chambers


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dba4life said:


> I got mine from Backcountry. Chat with them for a discount.


They, or their sister company Competitive Cyclist, are good about price reduction over the phone. They cut me a deal on my Bronson.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> What would u quantify as done? When it gives you all greens on fork and shock?
> I figured 3 short rides to get the confidence required in an afternoon for the shock and another afternoon for the fork . 6-8 mile loop per which has a good mix.
> I think in the.future they will embed this into the fork and shock. Autosag, sag set, maintenance, etc.. you can check psi on your phone before a ride. I never check my shock pressure, just my tires.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I found a .8mi loop at my local trails that give it 99-100% confidence every time. When I let friends use this thing I am telling them 2 post work evening rides or 1 weekend day to get their bike dialed in. Also that assumes they already have spacer tokens and the 24mm socket to make those changes trailside.


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

hardboiled said:


> dba -- yes you have to recalibrate after adding/removing tokens, and I believe after changing air pressure. the CR will definitely change when you change the tokens. now that most of the high end forks and shocks on the market have self-equalizing negative air chambers, I add and remove air the same way -- stopping every 50 psi or so to cycle through about 50% of the travel 5-10 times, in order to continually equalize the neg spring. kind of annoying but this will ensure good results. if it got harder to pull to full extension, you may have air in the neg spring. air it up and deflate as per above.


Thanks for the reply. I def had chamber equalization issues in my Pike which frankly wasted a bunch of time. In my experience if you can't pull the fork to full extension with relative ease, you must fix that before going any further. For me it was a combo of cycling the fork with doing the "pike burp" that did it.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dba4life said:


> Thanks for the reply. I def had chamber equalization issues in my Pike which frankly wasted a bunch of time. In my experience if you can't pull the fork to full extension with relative ease, you must fix that before going any further. For me it was a combo of cycling the fork with doing the "pike burp" that did it.


Having just performed the lower maintenance on my Pike I ran into a S
similar issue. After disassembly and even removing the upper air shaft and cleaning, greasing and reassembled, I was able to correct the problem. The real fix was cycling the fork at low pressures to equalize the negative chamber. 15-20 psi and bottom it out a few times. Add another 10-15psi and cycle it again. By time I got close to my desired pressure the chambers worked in unison and it wasn't sucked down 10% in the sag.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Good info all around guys.

I used mine for the second short ride but for the 2nd time in a row my ride was cut a bit short by a lightweight drive chain (YBN). It was long enough to hit 100% confidence however.

It looks like on my stock 17 Yeti 5.5 Fox 36mm 160mm forks, all I needed was to back off 2 clicks of HSC and add 2 clicks rebound to get everything perfect. The air pressure I was already using, 63 psi 178# rider was giving me exactly 20% static sag and everything is green now and it feels good as well. That was with just one 4' vertical drop on this particular ride. I land like a cat though and don't use much travel.

I have a new Fox X2 shock arriving next week and I'm eager to get that dialed in utilizing the Shock Wiz. It's safe to say the Shock Wiz is a better tuner than I am.

PS. Can the Shock Wiz be utilized on dirt bike air forks?


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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

Can someone explain the need to re-calibrate after changing air pressure only? It is a significant PITA to empty just to fill up the Monarch Shock to 300 psi. The only adjustment I made was from 300psi to 305psi.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

dba4life said:


> Can someone explain the need to re-calibrate after changing air pressure only? It is a significant PITA to empty just to fill up the Monarch Shock to 300 psi. The only adjustment I made was from 300psi to 305psi.


Look on the settings page for "adjust base line air pressure".

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

dba4life said:


> Can someone explain the need to re-calibrate after changing air pressure only? It is a significant PITA to empty just to fill up the Monarch Shock to 300 psi. The only adjustment I made was from 300psi to 305psi.


Your Compression Ratio doesn't change, only your baseline air pressure. Go to settings and set baseline air pressure after an air change and your done.
If you add or remove spacers you need to do the full CR measurement.


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

Has anyone else noticed that the pressure reading on the shock wiz is about 8psi higher than their pump? For example, my RockShox pump reads 100 psi and the shock wiz app reads 108psi. I checked the accuracy of my RockShox pump by connecting my RockShox pump to my digital Lezyne Alloy Digital Drive pump and they both read the same value at various pressures.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> You don't. Both camber need to be empty. Cycle the shock past the dimple to equalize both cambers. You may need to only let out 30psi at a time. Same goes for pumping it back up. Do it in stages to get both to the same pressure.


What i did instead was pump to 100psi and cyle to extremes. Seems to work since CR is a relative calculation based on shock travel.

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## dba4life (Aug 26, 2011)

alexbn921 said:


> Your Compression Ratio doesn't change, only your baseline air pressure. Go to settings and set baseline air pressure after an air change and your done.
> If you add or remove spacers you need to do the full CR measurement.


Yup I feel really dumb. Never saw that in the settings. Thanks


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## rave81 (Mar 1, 2013)

has anyone used shockwiz with dvo topaz?


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## gte534j (Jul 31, 2008)

*making adjustments to shim stack based on recommendations from Shock Wiz*

I have my rockshox monarch XX on my scalpel dialed in for pressure and rebound based on the Shock Wiz recommendations. However, I do not have a low speed or high speed compression setting on the shock and could not easily make the recommendations shown below.















I found this thread on MTBR discussing tuning the low and high speed compression setting by tuning the shim stack on the rear shock.

http://forums.mtbr.com/shocks-suspension/monarch-rc3-plus-shim-stack-826666-4.html

Based on the Shockwiz, it seems that both the low and high speed compression need to be made softer. So I was thinking that I should remove one of the small shims and one of the larger shims on the compression stack side. If I remove these two shims, then that will reduce the oil flow resistance and allow the compression circuit to move faster.

Does this make sense?


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## nicoswit (Oct 26, 2009)

Could anyone please explain how the OTT on a DVO Diamond would affect Shockwiz's readings?

Thanks, cheers!!!


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## nicoswit (Oct 26, 2009)

joezuri said:


> Dvo diamond boost fork owners.. What Compression ratios did u get on the ShockWiz on calibration? I'm getting 1.8, on 170mm travel..





alexbn921 said:


> 1.8 is really low. 2.4 to 3 seems like the normal range regardless of travel.


I got 2.6 on my Diamond 29" 160mm


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## nicoswit (Oct 26, 2009)

joezuri said:


> Dvo diamond boost fork owners.. What Compression ratios did u get on the ShockWiz on calibration? I'm getting 1.8, on 170mm travel..





alexbn921 said:


> 1.8 is really low. 2.4 to 3 seems like the normal range regardless of travel.





db3266 said:


> My first run out today with the ShockWizz at Surrey Hills (UK) down some suitably rooty runs.
> 
> Before we started, it was noted by friends riding with me how soft the fork damping was and how slow the rebound is. I tended to agree with them when riding their bike for comparison.
> 
> ...


Your shock travel is at 8%, If that's what it measures with the bike static, your calibration was wrong, I think the manual says it can be 1-3%, more than that is a calibration error.

Cheers!


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## zgxtreme (Mar 25, 2007)

I have two on the way and was looking for the dimensions but have had no luck. Can anyone share these as I'm trying to decide on which Pelican case to pick up to store them.


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## nicoswit (Oct 26, 2009)

Ive been calibrating my shockwiz back and forth and can't seem to get a consistent Compression Ratio, sometimes 1.8, 2.0, 2.4, 2.6. (DVO Diamond Boost 29" 160mm)

I'm deflating completely my fork, and to get to full extension I pull the front brake, tilt the bike and hold the tire to the ground with my feet while pulling the handlebars this is the best way I've found since its quite hard to do this. 

Anyways, after finishing the calibration my travel % sometimes states 4 or 5%, should I push the mark baseline pressure option if this happens? Is this the procedure, or should it be expected that after calibration my travel % should be between 0-3%?

Could anyone please explain how the OTT on a DVO Diamond would affect Shockwiz's readings?

Lots of questions after using it for 2-3 times!!!

Please help Quark or anyone!

Thanks beforehand! 
Cheers!!!


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

4% might be due to the weight of the bike on the fork . If u pick up the bike and pull the fork, it should stay at 0%

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## Overspeed (Jan 9, 2017)

nicoswit said:


> I got 2.6 on my Diamond 29" 160mm


I only get 1.5.... :/


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## nicoswit (Oct 26, 2009)

Overspeed said:


> I only get 1.5.... :/


I've been finding that the compression ratio varies depending on how much air is left on the fork when you calibrate.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Isnt the compression ratio just the delta psi between fully extended and fully compressed? I would think you can have as much or little air as long as you can ensure that you can calibrate it at fully extended/compressed . More pressure will mean you'll need to be really strong to move the fork

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> Isnt the compression ratio just the delta psi between fully extended and fully compressed? I would think you can have as much or little air as long as you can ensure that you can calibrate it at fully extended/compressed . More pressure will mean you'll need to be really strong to move the fork
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


This. People have calibrated their forks with pressure in it. As long as you can cycle it through full travel you should get the correct CR. CR should be repeatable too. If it changes more than .1 you did something wrong.
DVO adds a spring into the equation, so you should full disengage it before measuring CR.
Travel percentage at rest might not be 0. If you pull the fork to full extension it should be, unless you have some helper spring or higher pressure negative spring that prevents it.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I still think calibrating the rear shock is a *****. Hard to extend it at 0 psi. Probably didnt equalize enough and i have the strength of an ant 

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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

Has anyone used shockwiz with a fox float DPS EVOL shock? When I connect the hose, it doesn't seem to communicate with the air chamber (there's no "whoosh" of air).


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> I still think calibrating the rear shock is a *****. Hard to extend it at 0 psi. Probably didnt equalize enough and i have the strength of an ant
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Well, technically if you had the strength of an ant you'd be ripping the bike apart ???

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## bicyclemech1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Starting to get fustrated 
Getting consistent reading from the Wiz is proving difficult. I can do esentially the same 45min-1hr ride and get different suspension score and suggestions on each ride.
The suggestions are all in the yellow range, so I am getting close, but the suggested corrections rarely produce a markedly improved tune.

I have worked with my Enduro 29 with Fox and Tracer 275c with X-Fusion. Both have been fustrating. Futhermore, repeated laps of a 20min lap that produced 100% confidence often gave me scattered results and inconsistent tune suggestions. 

I understand that a good portion of this is learning curve. I am on week three of tuning.

Has anyone got a tune for my 2016 Fox 36 that the Wiz really likes?
Sag%
Clicks out LSC
Clicks out HSC
Clicks out Rebound
???

TIA,
G.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

bicyclemech1 said:


> Starting to get fustrated
> Getting consistent reading from the Wiz is proving difficult. I can do esentially the same 45min-1hr ride and get different suspension score and suggestions on each ride.
> The suggestions are all in the yellow range, so I am getting close, but the suggested corrections rarely produce a markedly improved tune.
> 
> ...


Are you running the same trail with the same level of aggression?

What parameters are you tuning first? Air pressure and ramp should be green before you start working the other settings.

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## bicyclemech1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Yes!!
Hence the reason I am getting fustrated. 
I have tried to replicate the data input as closely as possible. 
I can say that the best scored laps I have achieved so far have been tuned to the slightly soft side of my liking (balanced tune settng) but the bike did stick like glue. 

I seem to be chasing my tail with small corrections in pursuit of a 95 or better score.


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

If you're finding it's too soft, maybe change the tuning style to something different (i.e. playful). Personal feel is more important going from yellow to green, especially on rebound/LSC/HSC. Also, if you're on the far end of the weight spectrum in either direction, you may simply not be able to do the tunes it suggests (ex: the guy whose Shockwiz I'm borrowing weighs like 140 lb, and has to run his Fox 36 rebound wide open / full slow, and it still tells him to make it softer).


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

I've wizzed two bikes now and the results have been great. One is a Jeffsy 29 with Fox 34 Factory fork and Fox Float DPS shock, and the other is a Nomad with Pike 160 fork and Fox Float X2 shock. I went for playful on both and the results have been great. I could only get to score of 94-96 but that's fine by me. I do wish that the ShockWiz had both HSR and LSR as options so that I could fine tune the X2, but I think it is pretty good where I have it. On both bikes the ShockWiz had me reduce the air spring from where I had them set before. In retrospect I had both bikes set up to 'leave a little travel just in case' but now realize that since the 'just in case' never happened in the real world' I really had them set up too stiff and was sacrificing traction. Post wiz the traction, front/rear suspension balance, and handling over rough terrain is very much improved. In particular the gain on the Nomad were huge. Due to the large amount of travel and suspension curve, it can be a tough bike to set up. It now feels lively, poppy, and balanced. The wiz settings on both bikes get me to near full travel exactly when they should be. Anyways, purchase well worth it. Sorry if this sounds too enthusiastic, but really, if you are thinking about upgrading your suspension because it 'doesn't feel great' try buying/renting a ShockWiz first. Next up will be my wife's bike.


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

bicyclemech1 said:


> Yes!!
> Hence the reason I am getting fustrated.
> I have tried to replicate the data input as closely as possible.
> I can say that the best scored laps I have achieved so far have been tuned to the slightly soft side of my liking (balanced tune settng) but the bike did stick like glue.
> ...


I just chose Playful at the outset since I like to be able to pump a bike over features and like some pop coming off jumps, so haven't tried Balanced yet. I'm not sure why you are getting various recommendations. One thing to try is to check in on the confidence score and recommendations a few times during your loop.

Speaking of the loop, how long is it and what is it like? I have been using two that have worked well for me. The first is 0.4 mile 10% grade downhill. It has a bunch of moto whoops, some rough small bumps taken at high speed, a few water bar jumps, and a few banked corners; then ride up over all of that. Takes 1:30 down and 6 min up. Gets 90-100% confidence just over that. The second loop has two parts, first is really similar in grade and features to what I described above but has more swoopy turns at the bottom. That one is about 3 min down and 12 min up.


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

gte534j said:


> Has anyone else noticed that the pressure reading on the shock wiz is about 8psi higher than their pump? For example, my RockShox pump reads 100 psi and the shock wiz app reads 108psi. I checked the accuracy of my RockShox pump by connecting my RockShox pump to my digital Lezyne Alloy Digital Drive pump and they both read the same value at various pressures.


My ShockWiz varies from my RockShox digital pump by 3 PSI at lower pressures and 6 PSI at higher pressures. I make sure to record both both the pump and ShockWiz pressures in my suspension spreadsheet when I finish the full tuning. I also have 2-4 PSI difference between cold inflation pressures and after warmed up riding pressures, which I also record. Nerdy yes.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

bicyclemech1 said:


> Starting to get fustrated
> Getting consistent reading from the Wiz is proving difficult. I can do esentially the same 45min-1hr ride and get different suspension score and suggestions on each ride.
> The suggestions are all in the yellow range, so I am getting close, but the suggested corrections rarely produce a markedly improved tune.
> 
> ...


First it doesn't need to be perfect. Second it's going to give you slightly different suggestions every time you ride even on the same trail. You never have an exact repeatable run. You are doing the right thing by finding a loop you want it to be good on. Start at the top with air and work down the list. Ride the same loop 2 or 3 times and feel the bike and relate that to what shockwiz tells you. If it's asking for more LSC 1 time and not the others try is see if you like it.
Mine would tell me air psi was good most of the time and high every now and then so I took out 1psi from my fork. It also suggested more LSC and then less. I ended up with less because I liked it more. Some times 1 click is too much.
Yellow means your within 1 click of perfect for an single run down the trail. Hopefully you are feeling how your bike is changing with each adjustment. Shockwiz is a guide to an acceptable range that meets most of the compromises you want from your suspension.
Might help if you posted you settings and weight. Compression ratio too.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

My shockwiz also told me to go softer on on hsc/lsc but i dont have those settings on my shock , everything else was green. So i just dropped the pressure from my shock from 260 to 240 and now its all green. Im running 34% sag and feels more plush. Ive always had 20-30 as a goal but now ive learned go with feel. At 34 im not bottoming out and I'm not climbing any worse. The shockwiz has me at 33% dynamic sag. Not sure if thats good or bad but mentally, getting everything green kinda helpa me justify the $400 expense. 
Im 193lb kitted and CR=2 on a 130 fox float with vorsprung can.

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## bicyclemech1 (Feb 22, 2009)

How much (if any) effect does spring ramp have on low and high speed compression?

Occasionally the Wiz will suggest an extra spacer in the air chamber, but I prefer the feel without it. The Wiz always wants less HSC and more LSC on my 2015 Fox36.

Will a bit of extra spring ramp help this?


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

jacksonlui said:


> I still think calibrating the rear shock is a *****. Hard to extend it at 0 psi. Probably didnt equalize enough and i have the strength of an ant
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Sit on the rear wheel. Push the saddle up and away from you. Phone on the floor using the "calibrate with timer" option.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Sorted my fork out very quickly with Shockwiz, but shock proving to be a 3 week nightmare. I'm getting a greenlight on everything except for 'packing' information...which my trails obviously don't have enough of. It's done this 3 times on different days, so the consistency counts for a lot. SHame is that it's sitting on 49% confidence. Might have to live with it. Rebound feels pretty right to me anyway


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

Don't you have the chance to visit a bikepark for tuning?
Last week I did it and I always got a confidence of 100% with two 2 minute descents. Most efficient way to use Shockwiz. 

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Sasse82 said:


> Don't you have the chance to visit a bikepark for tuning?
> Last week I did it and I always got a confidence of 100% with two 2 minute descents. Most efficient way to use Shockwiz.
> 
> Gesendet von meinem HTC 10 mit Tapatalk


That satisfies Shockwiz, but hardly emulates my rides


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

I don't know where you are from and what you are riding, but at my place there are also Bikeparks with "normal" trails. Not the extreme downhill and airtime stuff.

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## bicyclemech1 (Feb 22, 2009)

I have enough time to start making some generalization that might help with the decision to purchase or rent, but primarily I am looking for consensus of my findings to start generating some solid generalizations about the ShockWiz for future users.

ShockWiz likes a reasonably soft air spring/sag: 
Roughly 25% fork sag and 30% shock sag.
It seems the engineers set the parameters with the intent of using on-the-fly levers if you have them. If the rider want to "set and forget", the setting is going to be on soft and active end of the spectrum in all the tune modes except for efficient. Efficient tune feels very very efficient.


ShockWiz likes a lot of spring ramp to offset the plush sag setting and lower air pressures.
This makes the suspension feel a bit "spikey" which might be lessened if you have the tuning options.

Low speed compression: ShockWiz likes a lot of it, and it is happiest when the LSC supprts mid travel to the point of being overly firm.

High speed compression: ShockWiz likes not very much of it. I think it is due to the prference for exagerated spring ramp. 
This has proven the most challenging(and potentially most rewarding) tuning. The interplay between spring ramp firmness at the end of the travel and high speed compression firmness in the midstroke of travel is very touchy when the ShockWiz is making it's suggestions. Get it in the green and midstroke performance is spectacular. Get it in the yellow and mid stroke is pretty good. Get it wrong, and you will think about sending your fork off to a tuning shop.

Rebound: The ShockWiz will allow a very wide range and be OK with it. It seems to be the least finnicky of the tuning parameters.


My tuning thus far has been on Fox and X-Fusion suspension.
As the Wiz was developed by RockShox, I would unsafely assume that you could run it on a basic Pike and get the air pressure and tokens sorted, and the ShockWiz would love the rest of the stock valving that comes from RockShox
I suspect that will not be the case when we start working on my buddies Intense with Pike/Monarch.


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## aarfeldt (Mar 5, 2017)

bicyclemech1 said:


> As the Wiz was developed by RockShox...


ShockWiz is developed by Quarq, and now owned by SRAM.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

aarfeldt said:


> ShockWiz is developed by Quarq, and now owned by SRAM.


Quarq is a subsidiary of SRAM. It was developed by a startup that was acquired by Quarq.

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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

aarfeldt said:


> ShockWiz is developed by Quarq, and now owned by SRAM.


Much of the development was by Dusty Dynamics. It was a Kickstarter project.

https://www.kickstarter.com/project...sion-tuning-for-mountain/posts?lang=es&page=1



> While it took a little longer that initially hoped, the ShockWiz Kickstarter venture has had a very happy ending.* Thanks to the 400+ backers, ShockWiz received a lot of attention, and was swiftly acquired by SRAM and developed under the Quarq brand.* With additional resources and funds, the ShockWiz product was elevated above the initial concept in form and function, while maintaining its core values of getting the most from your bike regardless of what suspension you have and how you ride.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

For some perspective, based on tuning 7 different bikes with different suspension from Fox, Cane Creek, and Rockshox, on Downhill and Typical trail scenarios:

1) you can get high confidence (100%) Suggestions in less than fifteen minutes riding.
2) You can achieve substantial improvements in as few as two sessions if you get air pressure right after the first session and don't need to add or remove Ramp
3) The consensus from riders I have worked with is that the person calibrating the Shockwiz, interpreting the Suggestions, and tuning the suspension should have a good understanding of suspension Tuning for best results.
4) I recommend for anyone racing Downhill at a high level of proficiency - use the Balanced Tuning Style for tuning. This opinion is based on the observation that an elite rider with suspension tuned using professional telematics equipment scored a 100% in the first session without any changes in the air pressure, ramp, or damper. Note: this boosted my confidence in the device.

I have used this device working with professional mountain bike athletes, beginners, and experienced riders. It's fun to use and will likely become one of the most useful (special) tools in my toolbox. I especially look forward to the impact it has for riders on new bikes, and beginners. I'm enhancing my 'On Trail Tuning' service to add this capability and will be using these tools on race weekends as well.


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## Andrewdmizzou (Mar 18, 2016)

oldranger said:


> For some perspective, based on tuning 7 different bikes with different suspension from Fox, Cane Creek, and Rockshox, on Downhill and Typical trail scenarios:
> 
> 1) you can get high confidence (100%) Suggestions in less than fifteen minutes riding.
> 2) You can achieve substantial improvements in as few as two sessions if you get air pressure right after the first session and don't need to add or remove Ramp
> ...


So balanced for DH racers. what do you recommend for the normal trail rider?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I'm using balanced for trail riding.
Playful and aggressive pretty much require tokens which is crazy for my weight.


Andrewdmizzou said:


> So balanced for DH racers. what do you recommend for the normal trail rider?


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## hardboiled (Jun 10, 2006)

in my results on three different shocks/forks, the "balanced" and "playful" tuning styles are very similar and within a click or two of each other. the "aggressive" style sets up your suspension to use all of your travel more easily than the other styles, so it will be noticeably softer, if that is what you're after.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

Andrewdmizzou said:


> So balanced for DH racers. what do you recommend for the normal trail rider?


I recommend trail riders choose based on their preference and which of the ShockWiz tuning styles seems most fitting for their bike, suspension and typical trails. I'm a fan of the Balanced Style for starters.

It might seem like I'm dodging your question, so I'll explain that bullet point on my prior post that is specific for DH:

Based on the titles/names of the tuning Styles - I would have presumed for DH it would be best to tune with the 'Aggressive' style (or Playful). But I was surprised, and thought it noteworthy to mention that the 'Balanced' option was the preferred option for an Elite DH rider I had an unusual opportunity to test the ShockWiz (and my service approach) with. Then when he returned with a score of 100 without any changes, that seemed to validate the choice of Tuning Style, and frankly the device itself!

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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

I just got a few rides in with a Shockwiz on my Lyrik 160mm fork. I weigh 170lbs and was running 65psi with a Luftkappe, no tokens and what I thought is a lot of rebound at 13 clicks from open and no LSC. The shockwiz set to balanced seems to like my set up. Maybe it likes the Sram damping but I was surprised. I thought it would tell me I had too much rebound damping or want more air or tokens. It did ask for a few clicks of LSC and I tried it but didn't agree.

Then I switched air shafts to 170 travel this time without the Lufkappe. At 60psi I got similar high scores and more importantly finally love my fork again.

The part I don't understand is how I get tuning scores over 90% with how much sag I'm running in both travel set ups. I'm at around 30% static and a whopping 39% dynamic. I'm new to dynamic sag but am super surprised at that number.That said at 170mm I now happy with my Lyrik. I'm going to try 5 more psi next ride and see what the scores and feel is like.

What are other people encountering for dynamic sag?

I like having the shockwiz, I think it's a good tool but wonder if everyone is getting scores over 90% from the start?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Im 158lbs and use 65psi on my my Lyrik 160mm ,no tokens, with 1 click out from fully slow (but this is based on fast rebound tune), no LSC and 27% dynamic sag.

Almost done on rear shock; 40% dynamic sag

[both on Balanced]
. So this sounds very similar to yours


artnshel said:


> I just got a few rides in with a Shockwiz on my Lyrik 160mm fork. I weigh 170lbs and was running 65psi with a Luftkappe, no tokens and what I thought is a lot of rebound at 13 clicks from open and no LSC. The shockwiz set to balanced seems to like my set up. Maybe it likes the Sram damping but I was surprised. I thought it would tell me I had too much rebound damping or want more air or tokens. It did ask for a few clicks of LSC and I tried it but didn't agree.
> 
> Then I switched air shafts to 170 travel this time without the Lufkappe. At 60psi I got similar high scores and more importantly finally love my fork again.
> 
> ...


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Im at 35% dynamic sag. I need to lower another 5psi, feels a bit stiff for somw reason. 

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> Im at 35% dynamic sag. I need to lower another 5psi, feels a bit stiff for somw reason.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


..that's what she said


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

According to this article/author - dynamic sag is based on pedaling events. I would like to know the definition of 'Dynamic Sag'

http://www.mtbiking.com.au/gear/shockwiz-ridden-and-reviewed

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Good review. What i like the most is its ability to tell me my dynamic sag. I dont even care about static sag anymore and my bike seems to feel best at 35% dynamic sag. Ive also learned that setting and measuring with a digital caliper static sag was inconsistent, every millimeter off or where you measured caused the results to vary. I like the idea of dynamic sag because it includes the antisquat so its more realistic.

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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

So I've had four riding sessions with the ShockWiz so far in my Pike. Started with 80psi and no tokens, I'm now up to 2 tokens and 64psi and it still wants me to add tokens.

I'm 180lbs naked but doesn't three tokens seem like a lot?

I also find it strange it's seen zero deep compression events when I've obviously used most if not all of my travel.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Basically due to playful tune, so yes it makes sense.


Jukas said:


> So I've had four riding sessions with the ShockWiz so far in my Pike. Started with 80psi and no tokens, I'm now up to 2 tokens and 64psi and it still wants me to add tokens.
> 
> I'm 180lbs naked but doesn't three tokens seem like a lot?
> 
> I also find it strange it's seen zero deep compression events when I've obviously used most if not all of my travel.


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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

I'm having a hard time trusting this thing at all. Been using it on my new X2. And I've been bottoming a lot. A LOT. HARD. The kind of hit where you feel metal on metal, and hear it, and the person behind you hears it. Yesterday's ride started with about 8 jumps ranging from 6" kicker to dead flat to a couple gaps that are a couple bike lengths wide. I bottomed on about half of them, then bottomed a couple more times. Here's what it tells me:

Baseline Air Pressure: Remove Air (Yellow)
Air Spring Ramp: Remove Spacers (yellow)
Rebound: Okay
High Speed Compression: Make Softer (red)
Low Speed Compression: Make Softer (yellow)
Bottom Out Resistance: Remove Resistance (red)
It reported 8 Deep Compression Events!!!

This is with NO volume spacers because previous days ride gave me the same recs and I followed them blindly. 
The guy from SRAM seems to have checked out of this thread, so I'm not sure if it's even worth asking what gives?
Seems like there should be an "I don't want to bottom unless I screw up" option. Especially for DH and long travel forks. Diving in steep technical terrain can kill you. 
At this rate of constant hard bottoming, either the shock or frame will be breaking soon.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

The thing that would be most logical here is that the calibration is wrong.
Mine was very wrong initially. How sure are you it is correct? Can you replicate it consistently?


jm2e said:


> I'm having a hard time trusting this thing at all. Been using it on my new X2. And I've been bottoming a lot. A LOT. HARD. The kind of hit where you feel metal on metal, and hear it, and the person behind you hears it. Yesterday's ride started with about 8 jumps ranging from 6" kicker to dead flat to a couple gaps that are a couple bike lengths wide. I bottomed on about half of them, then bottomed a couple more times. Here's what it tells me:
> 
> Baseline Air Pressure: Remove Air (Yellow)
> Air Spring Ramp: Remove Spacers (yellow)
> ...


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> Basically due to playful tune, so yes it makes sense.


Even if I change the tuning style to balanced it wants me to add another token. Every tuning style, even efficient wants me to add a token


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Jukas said:


> Even if I change the tuning style to balanced it wants me to add another token. Every tuning style, even efficient wants me to add a token


13% dynamic sag seems very firm

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Jukas whats your CR. It should be around 2.6 with no tokens and 2.9 with 3 tokens. Sound like your calibration is messed up. With that low of a dynamic sag and your bottoming out it seems like your calibration is off. Get on your bike with the app open and see how much sag it tells you. Does this match what it is? if it doesn't match then you need to re-calibrate.
Its very hard to help with trouble shooting with listing your CR.
measure CR multiple times if you need to. Its the most important part of the setup.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> 13% dynamic sag seems very firm
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Agreed. I got on the bike today with my wifes help and the o ring indicator was around 15% sag. Waay firmer than I would normally run it.



alexbn921 said:


> Jukas whats your CR. It should be around 2.6 with no tokens and 2.9 with 3 tokens. Sound like your calibration is messed up. With that low of a dynamic sag and your bottoming out it seems like your calibration is off. Get on your bike with the app open and see how much sag it tells you. Does this match what it is? if it doesn't match then you need to re-calibrate.
> Its very hard to help with trouble shooting with listing your CR.
> measure CR multiple times if you need to. Its the most important part of the setup.


I'm running two tokens currently. CR shows 2.5 in the app, but looking at sag above I think it's way too firm. The app still shows 13% dynamic sag, but that's based on an average of compression events.

I had run through the cal wizard twice already sine adding the tokens, but I'll go through it again. Perhaps I de-pressurized the fork too fast and had an imbalance of air between the positive/neg chambers?


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> The thing that would be most logical here is that the calibration is wrong.
> Mine was very wrong initially. How sure are you it is correct? Can you replicate it consistently?


I agree. The calibration must be wrong. I have an X2 and have not had that problem. When you let out air or when you pump up I suggest cycling the shock/fork a few times at several steps along the way rather than just at the end, so that you equalize positive and negative air chambers more effectively. For example, let out half the air and cycle it a few times, go down to 25% and cycle a few times, 10% and cycle a few times, then all and cycle a few times. If you end up with ShockWiz saying your are at 0 PSI (in the positive chamber) but you can't fully extend the fork/shock then you aren't equalized and you need to add some PSI to the positive chamber. Add 20 PSI and then cycle the suspension, let some out and cycle, then go to 0.

If I were writing the calibration wizard I would have given more detail on how to equalize the positive/negative chambers since more than a few people on here are having problems when they follow the wizard's instructions precisely.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Just for reference. If your calibration is off:
A lower CR and the shock wiz will think you are using more travel than you are. higher sag% and deep compression events.
A Higher CR and the shock wiz will think you are using less travel than you are. Lower sag% and less travel used with no deep compression events.
This affects everything in the tuning section of the app.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Hi all, new Shockwiz user here! Just got it today but I am unable to connect the app to the device. I have made sure to un-pair it from the phones built-in pairing, disabled wifi, and tried rebooting, no luck. I have a Samsung galaxy note 5 with android 7.0. 

Any ideas? 

Do these things usually come with a manual? Mine came with nothing specific to the unit.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Doesn't come with a manual but they have a few videos online. Does the device show up whem you hit connect? If it doesnt, shake the unit to wake it up and close out of the app completely then launch it again. The device should be selectable when you try to connect. 

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Ah, can't believe that was it. I thought since it had a blinking red LED that it was active, just had to give it a good shaking... Would be useful to have a manual to tell us these things!


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

Sometimes the device wouldn't wake up for me by just compressing the suspension or tapping it. But I found if I picked up the tire and dropped it on the ground, it would always activate the Shockwiz.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

ok, appreciate some input here.

Shockwiz (balanced tune) seems quite satisfied to the amount of air and spacers I have in my shock. FWIW, it also feels quite correct to me. I ride a typical trail with a mix of enough to give me some concrete answers. On 3 individual runs with the same setup, everything is satisfied except 'packing'. The only way I can activate it is to ride down a 10-20 degree slope of approx 5-10m in length of cobblestones. I'm out of the saddle and I get a 'poor' for packing. Yet, the rebound seems spot on for everything else. What does packing really matter in a shock if I'm out of the saddle anyway??


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> ok, appreciate some input here.
> 
> Shockwiz (balanced tune) seems quite satisfied to the amount of air and spacers I have in my shock. FWIW, it also feels quite correct to me. I ride a typical trail with a mix of enough to give me some concrete answers. On 3 individual runs with the same setup, everything is satisfied except 'packing'. The only way I can activate it is to ride down a 10-20 degree slope of approx 5-10m in length of cobblestones. I'm out of the saddle and I get a 'poor' for packing. Yet, the rebound seems spot on for everything else. What does packing really matter in a shock if I'm out of the saddle anyway??


Short answer, quite a bit.

Long answer, it's independent of if you're in the saddle or not. It's the act of the suspension sinking into its travel over quick repetitive hits without rebounding quickly enough to keep this from happening. Over extended sections you will eventually be sitting at the bottom of your travel and will have no suspension. This can/will happen regardless of position on the bike.

In your case if it is not packing on the type of terrain you ride then adjusting it just to get a perfect score may be counter productive.

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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

I'll add to Tucker's nice response on the question of "what does packing really matter if I'm out of the saddle": 

ShockWiz's detection that your suspension is 'Packing' is very useful information - especially to riders that are just getting into high speed (Gravity) riding. In my experience with our customers - some of them misinterpret a harsh feeling as 'compression damping is too high', or 'air pressure is too high'. When actually what is happening is their suspension is packing over repetitive hits and remaining deep in travel where the spring rate is high(er). So it feels harsh. Backing off compression damping or decreasing air pressure or Ramp may actually be counterproductive. Seeing through that with data from ShockWiz is where the value of this device starts to shine.

So - if ShockWiz detects packing you may actually need to decrease rebound damping to help your suspension extend in scenarios like this. OR if that Detection occurred once during a rare, extended downhill session with repetitive hits - maybe you don't take any action. This is where experience combines with the data and why we think its good to have expert help when using the devices.

To further complicate the topic: proper Downhill riding technique can help reduce packing. 


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

*Capture your Tuning Sessions*

So after a couple months building experience with the device, its Suggestions, and how to best organize Tuning Sessions, I decided to offer up the DoubleBlackBikes Tuning Report to the market. It's a simple, one-page template that is very useful for organizing your Tuning Sessions, capturing changes along the way, and keeping that information for future reference. At this point - I consider it indispensible when I'm working with our riders or customers and the ShockWiz. I hope some of you are interested in this idea and check it out on our website:

ShockWiz Tuning Report ? DoubleBlack Bikes


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

alexbn921 said:


> Jukas whats your CR. It should be around 2.6 with no tokens and 2.9 with 3 tokens. Sound like your calibration is messed up. With that low of a dynamic sag and your bottoming out it seems like your calibration is off. Get on your bike with the app open and see how much sag it tells you. Does this match what it is? if it doesn't match then you need to re-calibrate.
> Its very hard to help with trouble shooting with listing your CR.
> measure CR multiple times if you need to. Its the most important part of the setup.


So I ran through the calibration wizard three times tonight, in all cases with 2 tokens installed. Before I started I noted it showed the CR of 2.5

Calibration #1 CR 2.3
Calibration #2 CR 2.4
Calibration #3 CR 2.4

Some things I'll note that I'm not sure if are normal. In the stage when it said to deflate the shock, each time I down to 30psi and cycled 10x, then down to 20psi and cycled 10x, then down to 10psi and cycled 10x then to fully deflated and cycled 10x. In each of these cases at fully deflated the shockwiz was still reporting between .8 - 1.1 psi with the fork pulled to fully extended.

I'm not sure if that's normal and nothing on the shockwiz site states it's either ok or abnormal. The closest I could get to thinking it's probably a variance is in their video very briefly you see their calibration wizard example at 0.6psi.

Anyone with more experience with this device that can chime in?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

With 70% confidence on today's ride:









...pogo AND packing issues. W T F


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

lucifuge said:


> With 70% confidence on today's ride:
> 
> View attachment 1134254
> 
> ...


Very low pressure and no rebound??

Gesendet von meinem Moto G (4) mit Tapatalk


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mantra said:


> Very low pressure and no rebound??
> 
> Gesendet von meinem Moto G (4) mit Tapatalk


The pressure is spot on, I can verify this on many rides. The rebound had been on slower side so all I did was speed it up. How can it be packing AND pogo?? That's impossible to resolve lol


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## brennenhuff (Oct 2, 2016)

Did my first calibration last night and going to donit again this morning before my ride. When using the wizard my CR comes out to 2.9. It is a 7.5x2 Fox Rear with the fourth largest spacer installed which according to the Fox chart should yield a CR of 3.1. 

Should I just go with the number from the chart and manually enter/change it or go with what the calibration wizard comes up with?


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> The pressure is spot on, I can verify this on many rides. The rebound had been on slower side so all I did was speed it up. How can it be packing AND pogo?? That's impossible to resolve lol


Pogo: High speed rebound (deep travel rebound) is too fast
Packing: Low speed rebound (shallow travel rebound) is too slow

If your shock does not have independent adjusters for those then you will have to find a happy compromise.

But I think the big problem here is the cobblestones. That doesn't simulate real trail conditions, and I doubt you want your bike set up for cobblestones since they will likely induce packing for most suspension. I suggest sticking to real trails and search out rock gardens and roots.


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

Jukas said:


> So I ran through the calibration wizard three times tonight, in all cases with 2 tokens installed. Before I started I noted it showed the CR of 2.5
> 
> Calibration #1 CR 2.3
> Calibration #2 CR 2.4
> ...


I don't know if I qualify as 'more experienced' but my understanding is that a small amount of variance in the compression ratio is okay (I have also had a 0.2 difference calibrating the same fork on one of my bikes). The CR is used to the amount of suspension travel. I also have similar ~2 PSI differences at end extension and I don't think it matters. I would worry if you are bottoming repeatedly but the wiz says you are okay or the opposite, it says you have all all good but you are clearly not using much of your travel.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Sometimes when my hsc and lsc is yellow (i dont have these knobs) and wants to be softer while everything else is green, i can remedy that by dropping the air pressure a little to soften everything and can get all greens. Not sure if thats viable if your goal is 100%. 

Having said that, shockwiz in both balance and playful seems to be only a 2 click rebound difference for my rear shock. AND the shockwiz seems like like more sag than im use to. It has me at 34% dynamic sag when im usually trying for 28% (pre shockwiz era). Its not as pedal friendly but more active. Almost seems like shockwiz wants you to utilize most of the travel as a goal rather than put you at a targeted sag number. Not sure how i feel about that. It would be helpful if i had a remote switch to activate the propedal which i currently never use.

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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

So I went to check my calibration again and I discovered something. Fully extended my 150 pike was right at the bottom of the 10% mark on the stanchion. I wasn't able to find a zip tie small enough to get past the dust wiper and burp the drive side stanchion, so I completely depressurized and then repeatedly cycled then kept hitting the Schraeder valve to let a little air out.

After 10 or so cycles I was able to finish the calibration wizard and now have what looks like full extension. In the picture below that's fully expended with my finger pointing to where fully extended was prior.

Still only 2.6 CR, wish sram published compression ratio and how much it changed with tokens so I'd know if this is normal or not for 2 tokens at 60psi. One thing I can't help but wonder is during the calibration if I'm not getting enough compression through travel while pressurized causing an artificially low CR to be reported?


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Jukas said:


> So I went to check my calibration again and I discovered something. Fully extended my 150 pike was right at the bottom of the 10% mark on the stanchion. I wasn't able to find a zip tie small enough to get past the dust wiper and burp the drive side stanchion, so I completely depressurized and then repeatedly cycled then kept hitting the Schraeder valve to let a little air out.
> 
> After 10 or so cycles I was able to finish the calibration wizard and now have what looks like full extension. In the picture below that's fully expended with my finger pointing to where fully extended was prior.
> 
> Still only 2.6 CR, wish sram published compression ratio and how much it changed with tokens so I'd know if this is normal or not for 2 tokens at 60psi. One thing I can't help but wonder is during the calibration if I'm not getting enough compression through travel while pressurized causing an artificially low CR to be reported?


You shouldn't need to go through the travel while pressurized.

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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

tuckerjt07 said:


> You shouldn't need to go through the travel while pressurized.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


It's a step during the calibration wizard immediately after inflating the fork. You cycle between 50% travel and fully extended 3-5x.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Jukas said:


> It's a step during the calibration wizard immediately after inflating the fork. You cycle between 50% travel and fully extended 3-5x.


Ah, I was reading that as doing the bump to bump calibration.

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## Dude! (Mar 5, 2004)

Do folks find the shockwiz recommendations lead to overly damp settings? I have been tinkering with the shockwiz a bit. I was impressed with the way it guided me in erasing the roots and bumps, but I find at the expense of playfulness. Maybe I just prefer a different set-up, but I tend to like my suspension a bit springy. By no means am I pro rider, but I am no slouch either. With the current settings, I feel like I am more monster trucking than skipping the trail. I know the shockwiz is just a guide, but I guess I wish it had more style settings as the current playful setting doesn't feel playful. It is not horrible and it leans toward erasing bumps, which allow you to go faster, but I want a little more skip and pop.

This is both a question as well as feedback to the shockwiz folks.

Cheers!


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## djb_rh (Nov 29, 2009)

Jukas said:


> So I went to check my calibration again and I discovered something. Fully extended my 150 pike was right at the bottom of the 10% mark on the stanchion. I wasn't able to find a zip tie small enough to get past the dust wiper and burp the drive side stanchion, so I completely depressurized and then repeatedly cycled then kept hitting the Schraeder valve to let a little air out.
> 
> After 10 or so cycles I was able to finish the calibration wizard and now have what looks like full extension. In the picture below that's fully expended with my finger pointing to where fully extended was prior.
> 
> Still only 2.6 CR, wish sram published compression ratio and how much it changed with tokens so I'd know if this is normal or not for 2 tokens at 60psi. One thing I can't help but wonder is during the calibration if I'm not getting enough compression through travel while pressurized causing an artificially low CR to be reported?


FWIW, I literally went through hell with a Pike because I *thought* something must be wrong because it seemed stuck at 10% sag like that. I could pull it out manually some amount that SEEMED like going to 0%, but it retracted right back to 10%. It had just been serviced by Suspension Experts and I thought for sure something must have been put back together wrong. I tried everything I could find as far as equalizing pressure including taking the thing apart myself. Nada. Sent it back. They took a look and figured out that it was simply the sag graph on the stanchion is just "off" on them and I was feeling a bump stop in there.

So you can't really trust the screen printing is what I'm saying. Or what they said, anyway.

--Donnie


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

djb_rh said:


> FWIW, I literally went through hell with a Pike because I *thought* something must be wrong because it seemed stuck at 10% sag like that. I could pull it out manually some amount that SEEMED like going to 0%, but it retracted right back to 10%. It had just been serviced by Suspension Experts and I thought for sure something must have been put back together wrong. I tried everything I could find as far as equalizing pressure including taking the thing apart myself. Nada. Sent it back. They took a look and figured out that it was simply the sag graph on the stanchion is just "off" on them and I was feeling a bump stop in there.
> 
> So you can't really trust the screen printing is what I'm saying. Or what they said, anyway.
> 
> --Donnie


Now that I've looked at the picture again that's 10% on the 160mm scale not the 150mm.

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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

Dude! said:


> Do folks find the shockwiz recommendations lead to overly damp settings? I have been tinkering with the shockwiz a bit. I was impressed with the way it guided me in erasing the roots and bumps, but I find at the expense of playfulness. Maybe I just prefer a different set-up, but I tend to like my suspension a bit springy. By no means am I pro rider, but I am no slouch either. With the current settings, I feel like I am more monster trucking than skipping the trail. I know the shockwiz is just a guide, but I guess I wish it had more style settings as the current playful setting doesn't feel playful. It is not horrible and it leans toward erasing bumps, which allow you to go faster, but I want a little more skip and pop.
> 
> This is both a question as well as feedback to the shockwiz folks.
> 
> Cheers!


How many Tuning Styles have you tried? I'm interested to hear back if you find the 'Balanced' style more "playful" based on what you're looking for.

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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Dude! said:


> Do folks find the shockwiz recommendations lead to overly damp settings? I have been tinkering with the shockwiz a bit. I was impressed with the way it guided me in erasing the roots and bumps, but I find at the expense of playfulness. Maybe I just prefer a different set-up, but I tend to like my suspension a bit springy. By no means am I pro rider, but I am no slouch either. With the current settings, I feel like I am more monster trucking than skipping the trail. I know the shockwiz is just a guide, but I guess I wish it had more style settings as the current playful setting doesn't feel playful. It is not horrible and it leans toward erasing bumps, which allow you to go faster, but I want a little more skip and pop.
> 
> This is both a question as well as feedback to the shockwiz folks.
> 
> Cheers!


I found that it increased the rebound dampening quite a bit (so, slower rebound) on front and rear of my full sus bike. I was skeptical of doing this because i prefer to ride high in the travel but made the recommended adjustments to see how it would perform. In the end i left it that way because i felt much smoother over successive bumps and way less "bucking" when landing small drops, jumps, etc.

I would recommend playing with the different riding styles. At the end of the day, the shockwiz settings are just a recommendation. I had a lot of fun with it. Glad i rented one instead of buying, though.


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## fresh tracks (Feb 25, 2005)

I had a good tinker with a shockwiz yesterday. It's a great tool and worthwhile at least renting for a few days. I have a pike 160mm, fast suspension damper, luftkappe mod.

I was lucky that I'd done plenty of ride time with this fork. Shockwiz gave it green on air pressure, air spring ramp and HSC. So the scope for change was higher levels of LSC and rebound damping. I worked mainly on balanced mode and tried playful as well.

I found it was fast to get confidence up to 100% and did about 4 - 5 new sessions during a day with tweaks in between. It was quite sensitive to the trails I chose, with different recommendations depending on how rough the trails were. I could optimise for the roughest trails or for something a bit smoother, more pedally. In the end I chose the tuning that worked best for the roughest and live with any compromises. 

The one thing I couldn't move away from red is the bottom out resistance, which is I think the effect of the luftkappe, which gives a very strong ramp near full travel. I am happy with having about 15mm of travel in spare for the oh **** moments. I have a techie double black run that I didn't do with the shockwiz, that uses every mm of fork travel. Again how specific did I want to be with the tune - shockwiz will give each trail slightly different recommendations.


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## Dude! (Mar 5, 2004)

the_joe said:


> I found that it increased the rebound dampening quite a bit (so, slower rebound) on front and rear of my full sus bike. I was skeptical of doing this because i prefer to ride high in the travel but made the recommended adjustments to see how it would perform. In the end i left it that way because i felt much smoother over successive bumps and way less "bucking" when landing small drops, jumps, etc.
> 
> I would recommend playing with the different riding styles. At the end of the day, the shockwiz settings are just a recommendation. I had a lot of fun with it. Glad i rented one instead of buying, though.


Thanks I agree - it is just a guide and even with this, I can sort of back calculate to a common bad score. The shockwiz guidance was cool it how it made the bike more supple and traction did improve. It is balanced front and rear.

I do like the shock wiz. I think I and others can benefit from it as it will help to dial bikes in similarly and get the front and rear balanced. However, it needs more options and what I feel are more aggressive options.

Here's example...for the fork, it wanted less air pressure and I scored a near perfect today. However, I am running much less air pressure, as a result I was not pushing corners as hard as could, and cased a few of the hard jumps, where you have to nail it just right because the run in is tight or out of a corner.

In general I run my fork similar to the review article below. And when I do this, I get a poor score. Since Balance and Playful are so close, aggressive is uber plush, efficient is pedaling, than I am back to dialing it myself.
Here's an article about the Lyrik...
https://nsmb.com/articles/review-rockshox-lyrik-rct3/


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Dude! said:


> Thanks I agree - it is just a guide and even with this, I can sort of back calculate to a common bad score. The shockwiz guidance was cool it how it made the bike more supple and traction did improve. It is balanced front and rear.
> 
> I do like the shock wiz. I think I and others can benefit from it as it will help to dial bikes in similarly and get the front and rear balanced. However, it needs more options and what I feel are more aggressive options.
> 
> ...


I love the way the mrp cartridge allows me to use the lower pressures without having the fork become overly soft. The speed sensitive bottom out resistance makes a big difference on bigger hits. Unfortunately it cant be used with the shockwiz.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Now that I've looked at the picture again that's 10% on the 160mm scale not the 150mm.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Yup, that's after I worked at cycling it at 0 and then releasing tiny bits of pressure that gets re-equalized. Before that "fully extended" showed at the 10% mark on the 150 side where my finger is in the picture.


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## brennenhuff (Oct 2, 2016)

So I completed a tuning on my Yeti 4.5C and made a few observations. I felt my bike was setup pretty good before but now it is a much better ride. Overall a better feel and more stable at speed.

I went with the balanced option for both front and rear. Bike is setup with a Factory 34/Factory DPS rear. The rear required the most adjustment with the options it has on it. Changed both the air, ramp and rebound. Open mode adjust in the "1" setting. The 34 took bit more tinkering with and other than the HSC which I can't adjust everything else is in the green.

I found that even though the user info/videos say changes can be made anytime after 50% confidence I got better and faster results waiting until 100% and the what to ride next indicated 'all good'. Very happy with this so far and will use it one the Hightower and my wife Specialized next. Obviously every trail networks is a little different so some adjustments will probably be needed from time to time but as a base setting my bike rides much better now. I will probably rent it out once I am finished with the other bikes I guess but a worth while tool to have.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

What dynamic sag did u ended up with on your shock?

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## brennenhuff (Oct 2, 2016)

I think it was right around 30% I didn't take a screen shot of it and lost it when I re-calibrated and did my 34.

I did just run a calibration on my Monarch RT3 for my Hightower to take out in the morning. I was surprised by a 2.5 CR with 4 bands installed. I expected it to be closer to 3.1 like my Fox Factory. Going to run it again in the morning to verify I did cock something up when going through it.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The device calculates compression ratio based off of the psi at full and no travel but how does it take into actual the actual shock curve when measuring dynamic sag? The response isnt linear and it seems to assume that it is linear between 0 and 40%. Wouldn't it be more accurate if the calibration process allows you to take 5 data pts along the curve/travel? Or is the sag data being reported just not believable?

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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> The device calculates compression ratio based off of the psi at full and no travel but how does it take into actual the actual shock curve when measuring dynamic sag? The response isnt linear and it seems to assume that it is linear between 0 and 40%. Wouldn't it be more accurate if the calibration process allows you to take 5 data pts along the curve/travel? Or is the sag data being reported just not believable?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Compression ratios are basic curves that are easily calculated. It only appears linear at the beginning of the stroke but if you looked more closely it isn't. There is no need to collect multiple data points as long as you cover the min/max range and ratio. From there the only data point needed is your pressure at 0 mm travel which it asks for during calibration.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Anyone know how to.determine compression ratios?

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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> Anyone know how to.determine compression ratios?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I believe Fox publishes some of their ratios for the rear shocks as wells as the effect of different spacers. However, unless you know the initial and final volume of the shock it is hard calculate yourself. That is why shockwiz simply asks for a calibration where it basically says with your initial pressure of 0 and your final compressed pressure of X it means your ratio is Z. It works backwards to find your ratio and create a scale for % compression or sag. Because of that the volume no longer maters which is why you can use it on various forks and shocks so long as the change in volume in linear.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

nobody here is trying to divide by zero, right? shockwiz is certainly not doing that when it determines CR.

i have been tryjng to understand why it is important to let out all the (excess) air - surely a few psi above 1 atm should be fine too as long as full compression can still be reached? or am i missing something - perhaps it is just the easiest common baseline for all the different fork innards?


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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

ragetty said:


> nobody here is trying to divide by zero, right? shockwiz is certainly not doing that when it determines CR.
> 
> i have been tryjng to understand why it is important to let out all the (excess) air - surely a few psi above 1 atm should be fine too as long as full compression can still be reached? or am i missing something - perhaps it is just the easiest common baseline for all the different fork innards?


.5 or 1 psi wont make a difference for the most part. It all depends on whether or not the shockwiz "zeros" based on the initial pressure. The easiest way to test this would be to try if you get the same ratio when you have 5 or 10 psi during calibration. Also you are never dividing by 0, what you call 0 psi is actually 1 bar atmosphere or 14.7 psig. It's effectively the pressure of the atmosphere created by Earths gravity.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I guess what im wondering is how they are determining CR based off two psi readings at 0 travel and full travel. Coil springs are linear but air shocks are progressive meaning it requires more and more pressure to move the shock as the air volume decreases. Using two psi data points will only allow you to create a linear curve. However, the dynamic sag info may be accurate enough if the curve near the sag point is fairly linear. This may also explain the difference i see in the sag being reported by shockwiz versus physically measuring it. 

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

tgandrews87 said:


> .5 or 1 psi wont make a difference for the most part. It all depends on whether or not the shockwiz "zeros" based on the initial pressure. The easiest way to test this would be to try if you get the same ratio when you have 5 or 10 psi during calibration. Also you are never dividing by 0, what you call 0 psi is actually 1 bar atmosphere or 14.7 psig. It's effectively the pressure of the atmosphere created by Earths gravity.


Ive tried calibrating with some some pressure in the rear shock and came up with the same CR.

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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> I guess what im wondering is how they are determining CR based off two psi readings at 0 travel and full travel. Coil springs are linear but air shocks are progressive meaning it requires more and more pressure to move the shock as the air volume decreases. Using two psi data points will only allow you to create a linear curve. However, the dynamic sag info may be accurate enough if the curve near the sag point is fairly linear. This may also explain the difference i see in the sag being reported by shockwiz versus physically measuring it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Negative ghost rider...The shockwiz isn't basing it off a linear line even though it is only capturing two points. It knows that based on the compression ratio there is a standard curve created. So if you base pressure is 50 psi and your CR is 3 then you can assume your max pressure will be 150 (300%). So while your air chamber contracts or expands linearly the air pressure builds or drops exponentially. At 50% stroke the volume in your fork will be half of what it was fully extended but your air pressure may be 100 psi or 100% higher than your baseline. This is why more manufactures are moving to linear rear suspensions....because an air shock is very progressive on it's own and takes care of that part of the equation.


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## Tim-ti (Jul 27, 2005)

Does anyone know if the volume of air in the hose and traducer significantly affects the spring progressivity? 
It will be negligible compared to the volume of a fork token, but I wonder if I should remove a bottomless band in the rear shock when I remove the Shockwiz.


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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

Tim-ti said:


> Does anyone know if the volume of air in the hose and traducer significantly affects the spring progressivity?
> It will be negligible compared to the volume of a fork token, but I wonder if I should remove a bottomless band in the rear shock when I remove the Shockwiz.


The volume in the hose is too short and small in diameter to make a measurable difference for an application like this. The transducer even less so than the hose. The rear shock has the smallest volume and would be the most effected but it also has the shortest hose so again not important.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I usually run my fork at 20% sag. But the SW got me to 34%. Surprised. Now both front and back dynamic sag is 34%. It feels pretty good. More traction, didnt really seem to make my climbs worse.

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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

I can't figure this thing out sometimes. It keeps wanting me to decrease air pressure. I'm currently at 60psi with two tokens @ 183lb naked so probably 195-200 ready to ride. Last ride it wanted me to decrease air pressure but was happy with two tokens. Today's ride was the same loop and now it wants me to remove a token.

What's also odd is it's detecting zero deep compression events while I've used almost all my travel. In addition to all the smaller features I hit one hip jump that is a lateral 4' huck to flat and he end of the run had a 3-4' huck to flat. If neither of those trigger deep compression events what does?

I have a lufkappe on order so I won't be making any changes until I get that installed.


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## tgandrews87 (Mar 21, 2016)

Jukas said:


> I can't figure this thing out sometimes. It keeps wanting me to decrease air pressure. I'm currently at 60psi with two tokens @ 183lb naked so probably 195-200 ready to ride. Last ride it wanted me to decrease air pressure but was happy with two tokens. Today's ride was the same loop and now it wants me to remove a token.
> 
> What's also odd is it's detecting zero deep compression events while I've used almost all my travel. In addition to all the smaller features I hit one hip jump that is a lateral 4' huck to flat and he end of the run had a 3-4' huck to flat. If neither of those trigger deep compression events what does?
> 
> I have a lufkappe on order so I won't be making any changes until I get that installed.


I'd be very careful when you are setting up your calibration for your shock. If you are bottoming out but it is saying that you aren't you either have a bad unit or your not calibrated properly so that it can see that peak pressure caused from the bottom out event. What is it claiming you CR is?

Also it can give different recommendations even on the same trail. If I'm lazy on a certain day it will grade me differently because I'm not pushing aggressively into my shock as much.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Doesn't look like you are using all of your travel. On my fork it wants 90-95 travel used or it will ask for less air.
Double check you CR and since you are not bottoming out based on your o-ring drop some psi.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

tgandrews87 said:


> I'd be very careful when you are setting up your calibration for your shock. If you are bottoming out but it is saying that you aren't you either have a bad unit or your not calibrated properly so that it can see that peak pressure caused from the bottom out event. What is it claiming you CR is?
> 
> Also it can give different recommendations even on the same trail. If I'm lazy on a certain day it will grade me differently because I'm not pushing aggressively into my shock as much.


Compression ratio as measured is 2.6. I haven't bottomed out but I am using most of the travel. Today I definitely rode harder than the last ride so I'm not suprised as some differences.



alexbn921 said:


> Doesn't look like you are using all of your travel. On my fork it wants 90-95 travel used or it will ask for less air.
> Double check you CR and since you are not bottoming out based on your o-ring drop some psi.


I have half an inch of stanchion left on the fork according to the o ring. That's gotta be close to 90% used no? Nothing I hit today should be enough to use all of my travel. Sram doesn't publish factory CR anywhere I can find, so I'm just going by what I get out of the calibration wizard, which I've gone through probably 8x total now.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Im about your weight and im using 80psi on my 140mm fox34 with a cr of 2.6
The dynamic sag says 34% but static sag measured with a caliper is 25%.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Drop some psi and see if you like it. It's all about finding the right balance. Sounds like you have the shockwiz setup correctly. dynamic sag is low at 20%. 25-33% seems like the normal range.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

tgandrews87 said:


> .5 or 1 psi wont make a difference for the most part. It all depends on whether or not the shockwiz "zeros" based on the initial pressure. The easiest way to test this would be to try if you get the same ratio when you have 5 or 10 psi during calibration. Also you are never dividing by 0, what you call 0 psi is actually 1 bar atmosphere or 14.7 psig. It's effectively the pressure of the atmosphere created by Earths gravity.


oh, wasn't all of that already implicit in my post? :thumbsup:


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## ButtersNZ (Jan 15, 2014)

I have a Fox 36 Fit4. Is there much to gain from using Shockwiz? How about after I get an MRP ramp Control Cartridge? 

I've heard MRP forks aren't compatible with ShockWiz, but that may just be the old one. With the Ramp Control Cartridge I can adjust pressure in the pos and neg chambers.


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Ramp control cartridge in a fox fork wont work with the shockwiz. Mrp forks with ramp control wont work either. To use shockwiz with your fox, you have to be using the stock air cap and volume spacers.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

I'll add some food for thought for Jukas and others in that same scenario:

- Expect Suggestions may be contradictory from one Session to the next. Remember that the 'yellow' suggestions are only indicating 5% changes. These are fine tuning changes - so yours may flip back and forth across 'OK'. In fact, they often do when you change Tuning Styles.

- A rider could test on the same loop, on the same day and get a different set of recommendations. This logical and should be expected. Gather all of these suggestions and then put them all in context for deciding what the ideal tune is. Again, a 92 Score from one Session maybe be optimal for you

- ShockWiz will also give you different Tuning recommendations when you ride on different trail segments. Expect that and learn how to fine tune your pressure and dampers when you ride areas with differing terrain.

- ShockWiz doesn't have judgement - only data and a keen program that produces valuable input into your tuning choices

- Air Springs, combined with the flexibility of volume reducers is a very flexible system. You can set up your suspension in more than one way and produce similar ShockWiz scores - by using different combinations of pressure and volume reduction. It is making the choices on volume (spacers/reducers) AND getting a setup that is balanced front/rear takes judgment.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## djb_rh (Nov 29, 2009)

Dear SRAM: A Garmin ConnectIQ app would be wonderful. Even if all it did was show you the confidence level and maybe let you start a new session. Pretty please.


--Donnie


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Any pointers on balancing from front to rear? Ive always struggled with knowing exactly the best way to go about this. 

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## bicyclemech1 (Feb 22, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> Any pointers on balancing from front to rear? Ive always struggled with knowing exactly the best way to go about this.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


25% front / 30% rear for sag. 
Be consistent and accurate re-check it often with your corrections. 
I found it to be a bit softer than I have been accustomed to over the years of all mountain riding, but having stuck with a 92-95% Shockwiz score for the last month, It has really grown on me. 
It is well balanced and compliant. 
Moderate corrections of everything (except hsc) affected static sag. When I made suggested corrections and double checked sag to 25/30, I started making great headway with tuning and stopped chasing my tail with fluctuating scores and suggested corrections.


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

jacksonlui said:


> Any pointers on balancing from front to rear? Ive always struggled with knowing exactly the best way to go about this.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I recommend carefully setting sag front and rear with a tape measure and the o-rings, and confirming you don't have anything abnormal for volume reducers.

Long answer, plus additional lessons learned:

I think ShockWiz can help with this - since in concept it can help get the right amount of sag and spring rate/ramp dialed in. That's a great step in the right direction towards balance

But, since the ShockWiz devices do not exchange data front/rear - then it comes down to the rider and tuner making the suspension balance out by feel. (and maybe some math could help...doh!)

Example: Just yesterday I worked with a customer on his Yeti SB4.5. He has what Fox indicates is a 'XC Tune' on the shock. Whatever that is...it has a high compression ratio, ShockWiz calibrated at 3.9 (!). That is the maximum value on their chart. Off the charts for a 2" stroke shock. I was tempted to stop and check for spacers - but setup had already taken more time than usual so we headed out. The rider mentioned the rear felt too progressive so we set off to prove that.

Three hours later (with no change to Ramp) we had a Score of 96 for the shock and the rider was using about 90% of travel bars on the o-ring indicator. The fork still needed some work, but we had scores of upper 80s and were getting recommendations on both sides of 'OK' depending on choice of Tuning Style. We still had about 20% of travel unused and a recommendation to reduce air pressure and continue tuning.

Then I hopped on. Immediately I noticed the rear was substantially more progressive than the front, and it didn't feel balanced. I make this 'judgement' based on experience; ShockWiz wasn't telling us this. Had I done this at the beginning of the ride I would have stopped and done something to balance out the 'Ramp' before we left. (Note: the customer did not know how many volume reducers he had in, the bike was used and new to him)

Lessons Learned: 
1) I will create a tool (set of calculations) that helps me assess front / rear balance before I set out. 
2) I will take a gut check (bounce test) before setting off on a tuning session in the future.

I know this will not be precise, but I want to identify major inconsistencies with Ramp front / rear before a 4-hour test session.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

the_joe said:


> Ramp control cartridge in a fox fork wont work with the shockwiz. Mrp forks with ramp control wont work either. To use shockwiz with your fox, you have to be using the stock air cap and volume spacers.


Regarding Ramp Control Cartridges (RCC): I just take them out when I'm tuning, and re-install them aftewards. I run them on all of our bikes.

Per MRP: the RCC takes up about the same volume as 1 RockShox token.

Per Me: Based on my riding weight and style - I tune my forks with 2 tokens, then put the RCC back in. I love the way the RCC allows me to fine tune how the air spring is working when I go to different trails. Normally I keep the damper settings the same as ShockWiz suggested (with two tokens), but when I ride on the extreme edge of my ability (i.e. a DH race) and I add clicks of RCC, then I also make some changes in the damper tune as well. Seems to work great.


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## jm2e (Mar 26, 2012)

Do we think there's any reason to believe the guy from SRAM/ShockWiz will ever return to this thread? It was nice having him around, but maybe he got frustrated by the relentless bitching?


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## skinnybex (Aug 5, 2015)

jm2e said:


> Do we think there's any reason to believe the guy from SRAM/ShockWiz will ever return to this thread? It was nice having him around, but maybe he got frustrated by the relentless bitching?


He will more than likely never return and I think rightfully so due to the continuance of a few forum members who constantly challenged everything about the shockwiz and it's operation and design choices. I also know that if you email them "SRAM" directly they will answer questions fairly quickly regarding your questions.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Anyone know where to find the firmware revision update change logs? Ive upgraded to the latest which is 3.2.1 i think and seems to make connecting to the unit flakey

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

This morning when I was on this forum there were 9 pages and now there are only 5, what happened to the other 4 pages?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtb4190 said:


> This morning when I was on this forum there were 9 pages and now there are only 5, what happened to the other 4 pages?


holy ****. maybe they were fake news!~


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

seems to have switched to 100 posts per page form 50.


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## gate (Jan 27, 2015)

On one of my bikes I have a 2016 Fox 34 Factory fork, 140 mm on a 29er with a pretty light wheelset and light tires currently on the bike for an upcoming XC race. When I set up for Balanced tune the ShockWiz has me slow the rebound completely closed. I weigh 155 lbs, and am getting 22% dynamic sag. Overall score is around 84, with OK for air pressure, air spring ramp, rebound, and bottom out resistance. I am thinking that part of the issue here is that the fork internal tune is set up with the expectation that I would be running 800-1000 gram tires but I am running 630g tires currently (wouldn't that affect rebound speed?). Anyways, I guess it is as good as I can get it on this XC setup and I will probably have to revisit things when I set things back up with my normal 850-900g tires. Anyone encounter this issue with swapping different weights of tires?


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

Did a little write up on the shockwiz. Pretty cool little tool

https://evolutiontrainingcycles.wordpress.com/2017/06/02/quarq-shockwiz/


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

I seem to have a lot of trouble waking the unit up, does anyone else suffer from that or have any suggestions? Twice now I have had to take the battery out and reinstall to get it to wake up


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Yes! Thought it was the battery initially.
Turns out, on mine anyway, that the battery needs to be almost fully inserted but not fully. The contact point is weird. So try inserting it until it holds enough AND you can see its working.


mtb4190 said:


> I seem to have a lot of trouble waking the unit up, does anyone else suffer from that or have any suggestions? Twice now I have had to take the battery out and reinstall to get it to wake up


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

You need to pick up the front end of bike and drop it. Check the unit to ensure the red light flashes. Then open app. You may need to kill app and open again.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## kanetrader (Dec 10, 2006)

Just bought the Shockwiz (have to wait some weeks, it is out of stock).. and i read all the posts here.
Im riding a XC bike (full susp) with a lefty. My riding is also XC. My questions are.
Which of the 4 options is the best for xc riding.
How do you set all the setting when you only can add pressure and or change rebound?
Doe any of you here used the shockwiz ad an Cannondale Scalpel SI? 
Many thanks....
Kane


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

kanetrader said:


> Just bought the Shockwiz (have to wait some weeks, it is out of stock).. and i read all the posts here.
> Im riding a XC bike (full susp) with a lefty. My riding is also XC. My questions are.
> Which of the 4 options is the best for xc riding.
> How do you set all the setting when you only can add pressure and or change rebound?


Which of the 4 riding styles you use comes down to personal preference. In order to adjust compression damping on a lefty, you send it back to cannondale for internal adjustments. One of the many joys of owning a lefty. I have used the wiz on a buddy's bike with a lefty. It is a pain to get the thing calibrated and sealed because of the type of schrader valve they use, but it does work well once its set up.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

jacksonlui said:


> You need to pick up the front end of bike and drop it. Check the unit to ensure the red light flashes. Then open app. You may need to kill app and open again.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Yeah I do all that. Sometimes it doesn't even wake up after a solid 2 hrs or more of solid riding. I think I may have purchased a dud but if anyone has any ideas I would be most grateful. Its the kind of thing you cant even send back to the shop because most of the time it works. Its just occasionaly it wont wake up and its a bloody nuisance to have to cut the zipties and take the battery out


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

kanetrader said:


> Just bought the Shockwiz (have to wait some weeks, it is out of stock).. and i read all the posts here.
> Im riding a XC bike (full susp) with a lefty. My riding is also XC. My questions are.
> Which of the 4 options is the best for xc riding.
> How do you set all the setting when you only can add pressure and or change rebound?
> ...


My scalpel si was set up to almost all green. My riding style is xc race and the shockwiz was set to balanced. I did take out the stock 20mm of volume reducers and add a 5mm reducer in the lefty. Didn't have to do any revalving. Also did not need to use the direct mount hose.


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## kanetrader (Dec 10, 2006)

rupps5 said:


> My scalpel si was set up to almost all green. My riding style is xc race and the shockwiz was set to balanced. I did take out the stock 20mm of volume reducers and add a 5mm reducer in the lefty. Didn't have to do any revalving. Also did not need to use the direct mount hose.


Thanks... but why did you swob the 20mm reducer for the 5mm what is the result/benefit of this?
When having the shockwiz, i will check what it suggests and see how my SI performs ...


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

I change the volume reducers to get the ramp up I liked. With the stock reducers I had to run to low pressure and would sag pretty far into the travel under normal riding. Taking out all the reducers and the dog bone reducer I had to increase pressure by 50 pounds and it didn't ramp up quick enough. With the dog bone and 5 millimeter reducer everything seems to be just right.


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## Joel Fitzgerald (Feb 4, 2014)

Overspeed said:


> Would like to know this too, also DVO topaz compatible?


Did you ever find out if worked with the Topaz? I was thinking of loaning one to try.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

Coupla questions:

Does the Shockwiz store suspension travel as a function of time, suspension "events", or derived suspension performance parameters, and how does this proceed as you do a test ride?

Are the suggestions specific for your riding style, or are the generic for each of four modes?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

It stores data and the old data replaced with new data when memory runs out. I believe there is data for each event. The suggestions are just calculated from the data depending on the style of riding youvr selected. You can cycle through the styles and it will recalculate on the fly.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

I weigh 215lbs RTR and don't consider myself overly agressive. My Shockwiz seems to like me running very low pressure for my weight. Pressure is so low that its off the bottom end of Fox's suggested starting point for any weight...

2017 Fox 34 FIT4 @ 140mm- Started at 85psi w one reducer. Tuned to 55psi w/ three reducers. Dynamic sag is ~25% with all tuning parameters showing green. 

2017 Fox 36 FIT4 @ 160mm- Started at 78psi w one orange reducer. Tuned to 50psi w/ two blue and one orange reducer. Dynamic sag is ~11% w Shockwiz suggesting less air pressure and more reducers.

I don't think its a calibration issue. Compression ratios are between 2.5-2.7 depending on the number of reducers. The fork extends easily when calibrating and I always cycle the fork when filling with air to avoid any negative chamber issues.


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

mpress said:


> I weigh 215lbs RTR and don't consider myself overly agressive. My Shockwiz seems to like me running very low pressure for my weight. Pressure is so low that its off the bottom end of Fox's suggested starting point for any weight...
> 
> 2017 Fox 34 FIT4 @ 140mm- Started at 85psi w one reducer. Tuned to 55psi w/ three reducers. Dynamic sag is ~25% with all tuning parameters showing green.
> 
> ...


I'm also close to your weight, same Fox 34, 2 spacers and like 57psi from shockwiz. I don't think you can compare shock pump pressure with the shockwiz. My new pump reads 75psi. Rides great.


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## mpress (Jan 30, 2012)

Gutch said:


> I'm also close to your weight, same Fox 34, 2 spacers and like 57psi from shockwiz. I don't think you can compare shock pump pressure with the shockwiz. My new pump reads 75psi. Rides great.


Thats helpful though my shock pump reads ~1.5psi below the Shockwiz. The Fox 34 feels good and the 36 is still a work in progress. I just can't get over how little pressure I got to run...


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## Kuttermax (Sep 4, 2011)

mpress said:


> Thats helpful though my shock pump reads ~1.5psi below the Shockwiz. The Fox 34 feels good and the 36 is still a work in progress. I just can't get over how little pressure I got to run...


It seems common for Shockwiz to recommend lower pressures. Its been a bit of an eye opener for me as on many of bikes that I have tried Shockwiz on its recommended going lower on pressure, especially the rear shock. I use the Balanced setting and the generally recommendations I most commonly get are lower pressure and more spacers/tokens. Makes sense, softer with better small bump compliance and then ramping up progressively for the bigger hits.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk


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## g.law (Apr 16, 2007)

Using the Shockwiz for the couple of months has been very educational. I pretty much ride with it on every ride mostly on my fork. I settled on a playful setting after about two weeks of testing and haven't changed the setting since, so I'm just checking with the Shockwiz to see what it would suggest I change on different rides. It's been a very good learning experience. The biggest thing I've learned is that there is no perfect setting. The recommendations change with different trails (no real surprise) but also how I ride the same trail. On one particular trail I ride a lot I have tried riding with different styles, sometimes looking to pump and jump as much as possible and other times pushing for the fastest time possible. The Shockwiz seems very adept at figuring out your style and making recommendations to improve it. It also seems pretty good at figuring how aggressively you are riding and making recommendations accordingly. In most situations, Shockwiz always recommends softer pressure and very little LSC and HSC. Only when I push myself to my absolute limits does it tell me to add any HSC or pressure. What this tells me is that even on my best day I'm not anywhere close to pushing my bike and suspension to it's limits. Humbling.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Good info.

I find that when I don't ride my best or hardest I can get too soft of settings. Even when I charge during the ride at first, then say I'm climbing, walking, resting later on it will alter my settings. Since I prioritize the more down rowdy sections, I always do a screen shot once I hit the bottom of my trails.

One issue I have is that I tend to lift the front end up over every trail obstacle, then my front end doesn't get used much, and so Shockwiz then recommends softer overall fork settings, then when I screw up or ledge drop it's now too soft. Not exactly sure how to overcome this issue, maybe just plow in to everything for a day?


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Do you guys "trust" the ShockWiz to give you optimal settings? 

I have found that the settings it recommends for me are a little on the soft side for the terrain in my neck of the woods. If I set my fork as soft as it is suggesting, I would have major fork dive in the steep techy stuff. 

I already have 3 tokens in my pike and it is suggesting more, which is a little odd, but whatever. But then it is suggesting significantly less PSI. And less LSC. Not sure I agree with where it is taking me. I may end up in the hospital running my fork as soft as it is suggesting.

Lots and lots and lots of fun though. Wow. I have run it on 8 rides so far - twice for each of my fork and shock, as well the fork and shock on my daughter's bike. Very interesting and fun, regardless of whether I buy into all of the suggested settings.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Do you guys "trust" the ShockWiz to give you optimal settings?
> 
> I have found that the settings it recommends for me are a little on the soft side for the terrain in my neck of the woods. If I set my fork as soft as it is suggesting, I would have major fork dive in the steep techy stuff.
> 
> ...


What tuning style are you using to get such feedback??


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> What tuning style are you using to get such feedback??


Balanced.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Balanced.


What is your approx riding weight, exact Pike fork, and compression ratio from shockwiz?


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## Joel Fitzgerald (Feb 4, 2014)

Do all pikes have the same Commission ratio?

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk


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## Joel Fitzgerald (Feb 4, 2014)

Compression

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Compression ratio changes when you add or subtract tokens or spacers. 

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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> What is your approx riding weight, exact Pike fork, and compression ratio from shockwiz?


190 lbs, 2015 160mm RC Solo Air, 3.2 measured.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

mtnbkrmike said:


> 190 lbs, 2015 160mm RC Solo Air, 3.2 measured.


Have you looked at the Vorsprung Luftkappe? The Pike seems to be binary, either too soft or too firm, for heavier riders. At 200ish lbs I've been riding mine firm but will probably be investing in a Luftkappe soon.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Have you looked at the Vorsprung Luftkappe? The Pike seems to be binary, either too soft or too firm, for heavier riders. At 200ish lbs I've been riding mine firm but will probably be investing in a Luftkappe soon.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Yeah. I was just looking at that.

My Pike has been horrible from Day 1. The way you describe it is precisely how mine is. I opted to sacrifice plushness for a full set of teeth and have been running mine on the firm side for 3 seasons now. Yeah - I may now have detached retinas but at least my smile is still intact. I HATE that fork.

I am also thinking about an Avy cartridge and am on the cusp of also replacing my Monarch Air (another POS component in my view) with either a CCDB Coil CS or an X2. The problem is that once I drop all that cash, I may as well just ride my Range as is for the rest of the season, pray for a carbon Process for 2018 and use that money to get back to where I should have been all the time with the Process.

Decisions...


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtnbkrmike said:


> 190 lbs, 2015 160mm RC Solo Air, 3.2 measured.


How much travel are you not using afer these rides? Becuase CR of 3.2 seems a little on high side to me and wonder if its correct.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I'd also add I gave up on my Pike and now have a 160mm Lyrik with a Luftkappe which is amazing. The mid-stroke support in particiular with small bump sensitiviy is awesome.


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## henry_z4 (Feb 20, 2013)

Hi everyone, just got the shockwiz that we are sharing with some friends.
I got an Evil Insurgent with Monarch Plus Debonair MM and a Fox 36 HSC/LSC. Tried to set up the Monarch plus debonair MM in first instance.
These are the result of the first two rides.
I will adjust the rebound of 1-2 clicks as suggested by the Shockwiz app.
But the question is how can I set up lsc and hsc on the Monarch? Specific tuning is needed?
Thanks in advance for the suggestions.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Apology if this question was asked before. Just ordered a Shockwiz. Should I start with the Fork or shock first? I am using Fox 36 Fork and X2 shock. Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

chris9888 said:


> Apology if this question was asked before. Just ordered a Shockwiz. Should I start with the Fork or shock first? I am using Fox 36 Fork and X2 shock. Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I went for the shock first. But I guess it depends on which one you feel could use the most help.


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## ac1000 (Jan 2, 2014)

henry_z4 said:


> But the question is how can I set up lsc and hsc on the Monarch? Specific tuning is needed?
> Thanks in advance for the suggestions.


You can play with the internal shims inside the Monarch.
Basically you can add/remove/rearrange and put different sized thin washers inside the shock to adjust the damping.
There are some threads here "Monarch RC3 shimstack" and "Monarch RT3 shimstack".
Also if you can buy a new piston from Rockshox that is already setup with the desired shim stack arrangement. Like changing your MM to a ML or whatever you want.
But hopefully since your rebound was way too fast that was the big problem and you won't have to go down that rabbit hole.


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## henry_z4 (Feb 20, 2013)

ac1000 said:


> You can play with the internal shims inside the Monarch.
> Basically you can add/remove/rearrange and put different sized thin washers inside the shock to adjust the damping.
> There are some threads here "Monarch RC3 shimstack" and "Monarch RT3 shimstack".
> Also if you can buy a new piston from Rockshox that is already setup with the desired shim stack arrangement. Like changing your MM to a ML or whatever you want.
> But hopefully since your rebound was way too fast that was the big problem and you won't have to go down that rabbit hole.


Yeah I suspected that.I'll ride tomorrow with 2 click slower in the rebound and check again! Thanks for the suggestions!


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## henry_z4 (Feb 20, 2013)

here I am with this morning ride.
Same trail, same style, same tyre pressure.
Modification: 2 click slower rebound
Still have the Pogo problem. No more rebound problem.
Tomorrow I'll ride a trail with some more jumps and make the rebound slower (2 clicks?) to see what happens.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

I loved the ShockWiz (I had to return it yesterday). I may actually buy one. Better yet, if I can find two used, I may do that. But for me, I don't necessarily agree with what the ShockWiz suggests are optimum settings. 

Now...I did only use the "balanced" mode". Perhaps I should have gone for something more aggressive. 

I think I may prefer my suspension on the firmer side, with my bike riding higher on the climbs, and skipping over the top of the chunk on the downs and flats (as opposed to living deep within it). At speed, the softer settings on my suspension feels like they cause me to get hung up a little in the roots and rocks. And climbing is significantly more tiring for me. 

I will leave the settings as is for a few more rides but not sure if I agree with the ShockWiz's suggestions for the terrain I ride. 

That said, love the ShockWiz. Lots of fun, and very interesting. Plus it was instrumental in setting up my daughter's suspension on her Process. Great product.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Efficient mode would almost certainly have given you what you describe.


mtnbkrmike said:


> I loved the ShockWiz (I had to return it yesterday). I may actually buy one. Better yet, if I can find two used, I may do that. But for me, I don't necessarily agree with what the ShockWiz suggests are optimum settings.
> 
> Now...I did only use the "balanced" mode". Perhaps I should have gone for something more aggressive.
> 
> ...


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## Terp (Jul 25, 2013)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Do you guys "trust" the ShockWiz to give you optimal settings?


I think you're asking the wrong question. Here is my take after being the first customer to use my LBS's shockwiz (yay LBS!)...

I see the shockwiz as a data acquisition tool that's like a second set of hands and feet telling you whats going on with your bike. Personally I'm too distracted by the rock gardens, adrenaline, deer, scenery, etc to really know what % of the time my back tire is skipping or rolling. I know it does both and sometimes its jittery and sometimes kinda blah. Sometimes I don't notice at all and go really fast and have a ton of fun which probably means its just right.

The shockwiz notes all that stuff for me so I don't need to worry about it as much. These past few days I've noticed myself riding harder because I really want to work the suspension and see whats up. That alone has helped me out a lot. On top of that I have a log that tells me if I pogo'd or packed or bottomed out 5 times, etc. AND, I also get a few suggestions that are pretty general but are surely worth investigating because now there is this neat new toy that quantitatively tells you exactly what that adjustment did...and how it affects everything else. 2 extra clicks took my fork from mostly green to mostly yellows and reds!

Another thing many people will tell you, suspension is always a compromise. A trail that starts kinda flowy showed me everything was well adjusted and in balance. Then after a .75mi rocky decent everything was out of whack! More air, more ramp, more compression, less rebound, etc. Going back to how often it feels jittery vs blah vs just right apparently has a LOT to do with what I'm riding. So to those worried about it telling you to take too much air out, first of all, give it a go! It might work for you. Or not. Or sometimes. But now we all have an extra set of extremities to help us figure it out.

Oh and this is a no brainer for enduro and DH racers.

Also, please add a "save session" feature!!


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Terp said:


> I think you're asking the wrong question. Here is my take after being the first customer to use my LBS's shockwiz (yay LBS!)...
> 
> I see the shockwiz as a data acquisition tool that's like a second set of hands and feet telling you whats going on with your bike. Personally I'm too distracted by the rock gardens, adrenaline, deer, scenery, etc to really know what % of the time my back tire is skipping or rolling. I know it does both and sometimes its jittery and sometimes kinda blah. Sometimes I don't notice at all and go really fast and have a ton of fun which probably means its just right.
> 
> ...


I'm not sure what you are suggesting the "right" question is, but I was out today (and yesterday) and did some further tweaking, not exactly consistent with where the ShockWiz was taking me. I got some very nice riding in.

I love the ShockWiz. It's super fun and interesting. But I don't necessarily think it is the be all and end all in terms of setting my suspension. Or maybe I just disagree with what the programmers believe are the optimum settings. Or maybe I just like slightly firmer settings. Or maybe this is all terrain driven. Or maybe my frame and linkage are screwy and don't really conform to any norms. Not sure.

But yeah - love the ShockWiz. I'm just not at the point of believing that it will necessarily spit out by way of suggestions what are TO ME the optimum suspension settings for my bike, the terrain I ride, my conditioning, desired speed, etc. But it sure is a lot of fun. And it helped me dial in my daughter's bike, so I am delighted about that.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Is there any way to focus the bits of trail that shockwiz looks at? If I were to set one up on a usual route that involved some tarmac or fire road, would it try to alter the setting to accommodate that, when in reality, what I really want it to focus on is the fast, Rocky, droppy section where I'm working hardest.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

^^^That's kinda the crux of the question I asked a number of posts ago and am still curious about: "Does the Shockwiz store suspension travel as a function of time, suspension "events", or derived suspension performance parameters, and how does this proceed as you do a test ride?"

e.g. If I ride 1/2 hour on a road to trails that I ride for an hour, and return via that 1/2 hr road ride, how is Shockwiz analyzing that data? Does the 1 hour on roads affect what the Shockwiz reports?

Of course I could start a new session at the trails, save the data after the trail ride and before the 1/2 hr ride back.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Shockwiz uses all the data it sees until the buffer fills up and then it over rights old data.
The road ride is calculated into your score. If you want a section of trail you need to restart it before riding that trail. 
Shockwiz also doesn't store suspension travel or speed, only the derived data from those events.

I trust the Shockwiz to help me dial in trails and settings, but I also don't blindly follow it. Nothing wrong with trying it's suggestions and thinking about the effects it has related to your riding style. Suspension setup is bike, rider and trail dependent. Sometimes it's worth compromisin one area for another. Overall it's made me think more about my setup and pushed me in a derection that I'm happy with.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Shockwiz uses all the data it sees until the buffer fills up and then it over rights old data.
> The road ride is calculated into your score. If you want a section of trail you need to restart it before riding that trail.
> Shockwiz also doesn't store suspension travel or speed, only the derived data from those events.
> 
> I trust the Shockwiz to help me dial in trails and settings, but I also don't blindly follow it. Nothing wrong with trying it's suggestions and thinking about the effects it has related to your riding style. Suspension setup is bike, rider and trail dependent. Sometimes it's worth compromisin one area for another. Overall it's made me think more about my setup and pushed me in a derection that I'm happy with.


This sums up my thoughts quite nicely.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

alexbn921 said:


> Shockwiz uses all the data it sees until the buffer fills up and then it over rights old data.
> The road ride is calculated into your score. If you want a section of trail you need to restart it before riding that trail.
> Shockwiz also doesn't store suspension travel or speed, only the derived data from those events.


If I know I'm climbing fireroads for a bit, I restart a new session after the climbs. I don't know how big the buffer is, nor when it starts to overwrite, nor how the algorithm works but I know the sections and style of trail that I want to tune for. So multiple restarts of the shockwiz during a 15-25mi ride aren't uncommon. Yeah it's a little more work, but I consider it my anti-garbage collection routine.



mtnbkrmike said:


> I loved the ShockWiz (I had to return it yesterday). I may actually buy one. Better yet, if I can find two used, I may do that. But for me, I don't necessarily agree with what the ShockWiz suggests are optimum settings.
> 
> Now...I did only use the "balanced" mode". Perhaps I should have gone for something more aggressive.
> 
> ...


If you prefer your suspensino on the firmer side you won't want to go playful or aggressive. Basically the farther to the right you go, the softer shockwiz wants your setup and will continually tell you to add tokens and remove air.

I started out with playful on my pike and the shockwiz had me down to 50psi and 3 tokens, and I'm about 200lbs ready to ride. I found at those settings I hated the fork on everything but the chunkiest downhills and was having a hard time clearing technical rock/root sections on climbs that I always cleared in the past. I noticed at those settings even on fast trail I was feeling noticeable fork dive that was distracting me. Basically all those settings want the fork to be using most of it's travel aggressively, which unless you are constantly mucking with lockouts makes for a not fun ride

I ended up getting a luftkappe and settled on 70psi and 1 token, the fork stays nicely on the firmer side during trail even with the pike left wide open and it's still supple at the top, and nicely progressive.

I don't remember who's channel, but one of the youtubers was reviewing the shock wiz and had the same experience I did, it kept wanting the fork softer and with more tokens and they were finding the fork divey as well. someone from SRAM commented on the video suggesting tuning the first two options (PSI and Tokens) in Efficient, and then doing the rest of the tunning in one of the other options like playful or aggressive.

I've only played with this a little bit, as I forgot the shock wiz at home, but so far I'm liking this theory as it doesn't feel like I'm blowing travel on every little thing, but I can still do rollers, huck to flats, small pop offs etc without feeling like I'm super stiff.

The nice thing is, if Quarg/Sram keeps some focus on the shockwiz, we'll continue to see improvements via firmware, and hopefully the ability to capture a session, save to csv or json and sms/email it to ourselves.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Has anyone seen any significant improvements via firmware?

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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Jukas said:


> ...I don't remember who's channel, but one of the youtubers was reviewing the shock wiz and had the same experience I did, it kept wanting the fork softer and with more tokens and they were finding the fork divey as well...


For what it's worth, that was, precisely, my experience as well.

I have wondered whether there is a little irony involved in all of this...

Quarq designs the ShockWiz. SRAM acquires Quarq. The ShockWiz makes suggested changes to suspension settings of SRAM products in furtherance of certain objectives that the SRAM products may be incapable of achieving (or incapable of achieving without significant compromises -- including EXCESSIVE fork dive), thereby identifying shortcomings in the SRAM products.

Not saying this is the case at all. Just that the thought has gone through my mind more than once.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

alexbn921 said:


> Shockwiz uses all the data it sees until the buffer fills up and then it over rights old data.
> The road ride is calculated into your score. If you want a section of trail you need to restart it before riding that trail.
> Shockwiz also doesn't store suspension travel or speed, only the derived data from those events.


Does riding along a relatively smooth flat section add data overwriting previous data, or is there no or very little data generated on the smooth flat section?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Lone Rager said:


> Does riding along a relatively smooth flat section add data overwriting previous data, or is there no or very little data generated on the smooth flat section?


The Shockwiz seems to be split 50/50 on pedal/DH. Riding on smooth will only overwrite that position of the matrix.
The best way to use the unit is to start a new session at the point you want to capture and record it at the end of the segment. I will also take screenshots at various points along a ride to get a feel for the different portions of trail.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> The Shockwiz seems to be split 50/50 on pedal/DH. Riding on smooth will only overwrite that position of the matrix.
> The best way to use the unit is to start a new session at the point you want to capture and record it at the end of the segment. I will also take screenshots at various points along a ride to get a feel for the different portions of trail.


Not that I am anything remotely close to an expert on the topic, but this is what I did. Screenshots of the home page and suggestions page at various intervals of rides, especially before fire road portions of the ride, so that the data did not become tainted by averaging in the lame stuff.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

Why doesn't Quarq explain this explicitly rather than users having to speculate what's going on? It'd be a more valuable tool if they did, IMO.


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## Terp (Jul 25, 2013)

mtnbkrmike said:


> I love the ShockWiz. It's super fun and interesting. But I don't necessarily think it is the be all and end all in terms of setting my suspension. Or maybe I just disagree with what the programmers believe are the optimum settings. Or maybe I just like slightly firmer settings. Or maybe this is all terrain driven. Or maybe my frame and linkage are screwy and don't really conform to any norms. Not sure.


Yeah that's the point I was trying to make. Its not about "trust" its just another tool to help you make your own decisions. The programmers make compromises just like everyone has to in suspension. They were nice enough to give us 4 targets ranging from XC to DH but there are infinite points on that scale and the "best" is going to be different for every rider on any given trail.

If you have a few yellows on "playful" (like I did) but are riding fast and the bike feels good, then you're done! I think the detections might be more helpful than recommendations once you've done a few runs. If you're close but not really sure and it picks up 10 bottom out events then you know what to do.

On a different topic, I had it for 4 days and that was probably the worst amount of time to use it. I got a basic setup on a normal trail (not too rocky or too smooth) on the first run. Probably a fine setting for everything I ride. But the ideal setup changes for every trail and I didn't have time to characterize everything else. So I know what works well enough (done in 30 min) but I also know that there is a different ideal setup for each trail but don't know what it is!

Its probably best to use it real quick to get a good starting point or really dive in for a few weeks to fully understand how everything is related. The middle ground may leave more questions than answers...


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

So i used the shockwiz on my sb6c evol x for the first time. I have a medium spacer in it. Open setting at 1. Sag 35%

How do i adjust the compression suggestion? Smaller spacer? I also want ro get sag ro 30% so if i add psi to do so how will that affect?

Thanks for the suggestions










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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

you should adjust the rebound damping and retest with the wiz before making changes to compression damping. 

you can make compression damping firmer by using the open mode adjuster (turn it up), or if that doesnt work, try running the blue lever in the medium position.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

the_joe said:


> you should adjust the rebound damping and retest with the wiz before making changes to compression damping.
> 
> you can make compression damping firmer by using the open mode adjuster (turn it up), or if that doesnt work, try running the blue lever in the medium position.


Thx

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## ideal world (Jul 23, 2011)

has someone already tryed with a manitou mattoc and a mcleoud? 
thx!


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

the_joe said:


> you should adjust the rebound damping and retest with the wiz before making changes to compression damping.
> 
> you can make compression damping firmer by using the open mode adjuster (turn it up), or if that doesnt work, try running the blue lever in the medium position.


Did like you said and adjusted rebound only and viola!!

Best ill get from a evol x...

Thanks









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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Nice! Youre right on the money. I was amazed at how much better my bike rode after tuning in the shock with this gadget. Even after i thought i had it set up pretty well, much better now.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

the_joe said:


> Nice! Youre right on the money. I was amazed at how much better my bike rode after tuning in the shock with this gadget. Even after i thought i had it set up pretty well, much better now.


Yeah me also. Shock feels different. Ill get to get use to riding it with this settings.

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## ritchief (Sep 23, 2010)

Hi all quick question,

Just acquired a shockwiz and mounted it to my CTD fork. 

I was under the impression that it didnt matter which way the hoses were connected between the fork and shockwiz. 

On my unit I can only attach the hose assembly to one of the air inflation valves and not both without letting all the air out of my fork. 

Is this normal or do I have a defective unit ?

Thank you.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

ritchief said:


> Hi all quick question,
> 
> Just acquired a shockwiz and mounted it to my CTD fork.
> 
> ...


One end connects to the fork other to one of the ports in the shockwiz. Shockwiz port not used keeps the air cap on it..

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## ritchief (Sep 23, 2010)

yeti575inCA said:


> One end connects to the fork other to one of the ports in the shockwiz. Shockwiz port not used keeps the air cap on it..
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


Does this mean I can use either connector on the shockwiz to connect to the fork and shock pump, or is it only on one connection
?


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

You can use either end. But, I had a leaking valve on one side of the Shockwiz. If I attached the other side to the shock, the leaking valve would let all the air out. I pulled the Schrader core, cleaned it, stuck it back in and it quit leaking.


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

ritchief said:


> Does this mean I can use either connector on the shockwiz to connect to the fork and shock pump, or is it only on one connection
> ?


do you have the direct mount version or the standard version? the direct mount is mountable on one side only. the standard one goes either way.


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## ritchief (Sep 23, 2010)

the_joe said:


> do you have the direct mount version or the standard version? the direct mount is mountable on one side only. the standard one goes either way.


I have the standard mount. I will try Lone Rager suggestion.

Tks.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I broke down and ordered a Shockwiz last night. I don't care nears as much about whether it will improve my suspension setup as I do knowing how close my feel for suspension setup is. Then too, I'm just a numbers/details geek. So I look forward to playing with this toy in hope that I can learn something from it.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> I broke down and ordered a Shockwiz last night. I don't care nears as much about whether it will improve my suspension setup as I do knowing how close my feel for suspension setup is. Then too, I'm just a numbers/details geek. So I look forward to playing with this toy in hope that I can learn something from it.


Awesome. Congrats, and have fun. It truly is an interesting, informative, fun, and easy to use device. If I weren't in the market for a new shock, fork and bike (lmao), I would spring for one too.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Awesome. Congrats, and have fun. It truly is an interesting, informative, fun, and easy to use device. If I weren't in the market for a new shock, fork and bike (lmao), I would spring for one too.


For me, suspension cares started when I couldn't get my rear shock to play well. It was either too soft and bottomed out when set to handle rock gardens and HSC stuff, or too stiff and bouncing me offline in the HSC sections if set so that it didn't bottom out on the jumps. So I studied up and opted for a DVO Topaz rear shock. That darn thing made my 150MM Pike RC feel a bit stiff so I dropped a Vorsprung Luftkappe inside the fork. Now I'm smoothing over the ugliest stuff I can find and loving it.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> For me, suspension cares started when I couldn't get my rear shock to play well. It was either too soft and bottomed out when set to handle rock gardens and HSC stuff, or too stiff and bouncing me offline in the HSC sections if set so that it didn't bottom out on the jumps. So I studied up and opted for a DVO Topaz rear shock. That darn thing made my 150MM Pike RC feel a bit stiff so I dropped a Vorsprung Luftkappe inside the fork. Now I'm smoothing over the ugliest stuff I can find and loving it.


Awesome you found a solution to your suspension woes. I am still on the cusp of springing for a CCDB Coil CS and the Luftkappe. The other alternative is hammering my current bike until a carbon Process is released and then using the $$$ I would have spent on the suspension upgrades, to start over with a Process.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I'm really pleased with the Luftkappe. The DVO Topaz and DVO as a company is a match made in heaven for home mechanics. While all suspension components require maintenance, DVO will gladly talk you through something as deep as shim stack adjustment. I doubt any other manufacturer will offer that kind of support. It's dirt simple to change the damper oil in the Topaz too. I did that last week, going with Red Line 2.5W Extra Light. I opted to try a less viscous oil despite Ronnie at DVO telling me to just call him on shim stack work when I got inside.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Shockwiz confirmed I was spot on with my fork, but my shock was WAY out. For both reasons, it has been very helpful



IRBent said:


> I broke down and ordered a Shockwiz last night. I don't care nears as much about whether it will improve my suspension setup as I do knowing how close my feel for suspension setup is. Then too, I'm just a numbers/details geek. So I look forward to playing with this toy in hope that I can learn something from it.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> Shockwiz confirmed I was spot on with my fork, but my shock was WAY out. For both reasons, it has been very helpful


So which fork and what settings for your weight? I'm super happy with my fork after the Luftkappe. My DVO Topaz is heads and shoulders above my old Fox Float Evolution shock and I can't wait to know what the Shockwiz thinks about my setup. One of the lbs mechanics who's also one of the area's best riders told me he had his suspension dialed to his liking and expected it to be good. The Shockwiz agreed although it suggested a tad lighter damping. He said it was as light as it could be. Although we didn't discuss if he'd tweaked shim stacks already or he was just talk I about the knob adjustments were as far as they'd go.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

IRBent said:


> So which fork and what settings for your weight? I'm super happy with my fork after the Luftkappe. My DVO Topaz is heads and shoulders above my old Fox Float Evolution shock and I can't wait to know what the Shockwiz thinks about my setup. One of the lbs mechanics who's also one of the area's best riders told me he had his suspension dialed to his liking and expected it to be good. The Shockwiz agreed although it suggested a tad lighter damping. He said it was as light as it could be. Although we didn't discuss if he'd tweaked shim stacks already or he was just talk I about the knob adjustments were as far as they'd go.


Riders weight: 72kg
65psi (at shock pump)-> (72.0/1.12) = 64.3 on Shockwiz
Lyrik 27.5 160mm (Rockshox fast rebound tune)
Rebound: 1 click from fully slow
LSC: none


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Bought a normal Shockwiz online from CRC but was given a Direct Mount version. Really pissed off! Need to courier back via international shipment, not forgetting the wait and import duties payment. Looks like have to wait few more weeks again! Argh...!


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## Kiwiplague (Jul 22, 2011)

ideal world said:


> has someone already tryed with a manitou mattoc and a mcleoud?
> thx!


Won't work with the Mattoc due to the design of the air spring, but should be fine with the McLeod.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Bought a normal Shockwiz online from CRC but was given a Direct Mount version. Really pissed off! Need to courier back via international shipment, not forgetting the wait and import duties payment. Looks like have to wait few more weeks again! Argh...!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


By chance did you ask them about cross shipping? They offer free returns and supplying them with tracking on the shipment they developed should suffice as proof that you're really returning the product they screwed up. Once they have confirmation that their package is on the way back they should be nice enough to send out the proper item.


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## russmu66 (Nov 11, 2007)

Kiwiplague said:


> Won't work with the Mattoc due to the design of the air spring, but should be fine with the McLeod.


I can verify this (the Mattoc part)... I've tried it. Fork just loses all resistance/pressure and collapses.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> By chance did you ask them about cross shipping? They offer free returns and supplying them with tracking on the shipment they developed should suffice as proof that you're really returning the product they screwed up. Once they have confirmation that their package is on the way back they should be nice enough to send out the proper item.


CRC has a standard process to return the item without involving their customer service. Their online customer service only has option for non-delivery or partial delivery. Absolutely no option to contact them if they sent you the wrong item. 
Well, let's see what they can do when they received the tracking number. I am not hopeful!

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> CRC has a standard process to return the item without involving their customer service. Their online customer service only has option for non-delivery or partial delivery. Absolutely no option to contact them if they sent you the wrong item.
> Well, let's see what they can do when they received the tracking number. I am not hopeful!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've only returned one item to them and didn't care how soon they got it, nor did I need a replacement item. I ordered two stems, same model just different lengths, with an idea that the 35mm length was my desired length. Once I confirmed it, I sent the longer back.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I've only returned one item to them and didn't care how soon they got it, nor did I need a replacement item. I ordered two stems, same model just different lengths, with an idea that the 35mm length was my desired length. Once I confirmed it, I sent the longer back.


That is a good plan.

Well, getting a replacement item is different story. They screwed up, and we have to wait, in addition to the cost and effort to return the item.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I hate that this happened to you. I know what it's like thinking the next toy will arrive soon. But something goes wrong and delays the fun. I recently received a small Bluetooth speaker that I could wear on my backpack while riding. It never made the first ride and had to be returned. Its replacement has made 2 rides now much more enjoyable. My Shockwiz is scheduled to be here tomorrow. Hopefully yours won't take too long. Oh, I'd give em hell and see if they won't at least give you a credit on this purchase, a gift card, or a future discount.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Will do just that! Thanks mate 


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

My Shockwiz just arrived and the first thing I did was compare pressure readings between it, my Lezyne Shock Digital Drive floor pump and a second digital gauge that reads to the tenths place. I connected my pump to one side of the Shockwiz and my digital gauge to the other side. The Shockwiz was reading 0.4psi while the other two read 0. But as I increased the pressure I found the Shockwiz to stay on track with my Lezyne within 1psi. Once I was up to @ 200psi things still looked good but the small digital gauge read 2-3psi higher than the Shockwiz and my pump. So if this holds true once on the shock I should see my pump and the Shockwiz reading really close.


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## sbonvallet (Jan 31, 2011)

I've noticed variation in suggestions based on terrain. Did a less technical ride today with a lot of gravel roads and everything was yellow having been almost all green 2 days ago on a much more technical ride.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

sbonvallet said:


> I've noticed variation in suggestions based on terrain. Did a less technical ride today with a lot of gravel roads and everything was yellow having been almost all green 2 days ago on a much more technical ride.


So long as the yellow was saying that you needed to soften your suspension all is well.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

I have been using the shockwiz since 5/20/17 and I love it!!! However ***Warning*** Do Not Leave Shockwiz attached to your bike sitting in the sun for extended periods.... Example: I took my bike to work and left shockwiz attached all day sitting in the sun on my bike rack. When I got to the trail that evening Shockwiz started reading crazy random numbers. It never recovered had to warranty it. No problems from sram sent an email they asked a couple question. Sent me a return label and sent me a new one it was that simple.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

My Shockwiz experience:
Me: 6'3 195lbs
Bike: Salsa Bucksaw 
shock: RS Monarch RTC
Fork: Bluto 120mm

Bluto Setup Balanced:




















I actually settled on 60 psi and 3 tokens. The trail I was tuning the fork on was not an aggressive trail. All I can say is that it was very surprised at the psi. However the biggest surprise was how well the bike performed after the changes. I have since taken the bike to quite a few aggressive trails and the bike has just shined. 
I found it better to tune the bike on an aggressive trail with good climbs, descent and at least 1 rock garden. I can reach 100% confidence in a short distance on an aggressive trail.

Suggestion for tuning:
1. Start with Air pressure No tokens and everything else set to 0. Do not make any other changes until air pressure reads green.
2. Move on to tokens, adding tokens automatically means subtracting air pressure. I found on my bluto it was about 10lbs per token.
3. Rebound, only after 1 and 2 are green

My thoughts on the shockwiz:
Buying one definitely not necessary but really nice luxury if you can. Renting one is probably the better option. Choose a good rough trail to do your tuning. The rougher the trail the quicker you will get enough confidence reading to make a adjustments 85% or better is good enough for your first adjustment. After that it should be at 95 - 100% confidence for all other fine tuning.

Who benefits from this tool? A newbie great tool for learning about suspension, riders who have lost confidence in their bike is it the bike or your tune, riders considering new forks or shocks can definitely help you understand what you are looking for in a new shock, anyone who just wants to know if their shocks are working correctly.

No amount of tuning will make you love a shock you already hate. If you are not a RS, Fox or whatever shock is on your bike person. You will just end up with a well tuned shock you hate.

The best bike = (sum of it's components)/(owners love for said components)

Wish this was around a few years ago!!!!


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## john85D (Aug 1, 2006)

*Suggestion Confusion*

Stupid question, which after reading most of the posts here, seems like no one else is confused about.

In the suggestions page, when the slider is on the left side of let's say the "Baseline Air Pressure" bar, do I add air to bring it towards the right side ("Add Air" side)? Or do I remove air being that the slider is on the "Remove Air" side of the bar.

Basically, if I want to move the slider to the right, do I add air, compression damping, rebound damping, etc or remove? And vice versa.

Thanks in advance.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

VladConnery said:


> My Shockwiz experience:
> Me: 6'3 195lbs
> Bike: Salsa Bucksaw
> shock: RS Monarch RTC
> ...


Great comments..

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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

john85D said:


> Stupid question, which after reading most of the posts here, seems like no one else is confused about.
> 
> In the suggestions page, when the slider is on the left side of let's say the "Baseline Air Pressure" bar, do I add air to bring it towards the right side ("Add Air" side)? Or do I remove air being that the slider is on the "Remove Air" side of the bar.
> 
> ...


Not a stupid question at all I had wondered the same thing but experimenting has taught me that if the slider is to the left it requires you to remove air


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

john85D said:


> Stupid question, which after reading most of the posts here, seems like no one else is confused about.
> 
> In the suggestions page, when the slider is on the left side of let's say the "Baseline Air Pressure" bar, do I add air to bring it towards the right side ("Add Air" side)? Or do I remove air being that the slider is on the "Remove Air" side of the bar.
> 
> ...


If the slider is on the left, you would remove air to bring the slider towards middle.

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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Anyone else experience this sleeping issue I have.
Every now and again my shockwhizz just refuses to wake up now matter how much I bash the thing, eg even after a ride full of rockgardens jumps and dropoffs it will remain sound asleep.and I need to remove and reinstall the battery to bring it back to life. What I think is happening is that the battery can sometimes move and therefore lose contact and has to be physically pushed back into place, which is a pain.
Anyone else strike a similar issue or got any suggestions as to how to hold the battery in place more securely. I am reluctant to use loctite or superglue as I dont want to impact on potential warranty


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtb4190 said:


> Anyone else experience this sleeping issue I have.
> Every now and again my shockwhizz just refuses to wake up now matter how much I bash the thing, eg even after a ride full of rockgardens jumps and dropoffs it will remain sound asleep.and I need to remove and reinstall the battery to bring it back to life. What I think is happening is that the battery can sometimes move and therefore lose contact and has to be physically pushed back into place, which is a pain.
> Anyone else strike a similar issue or got any suggestions as to how to hold the battery in place more securely. I am reluctant to use loctite or superglue as I dont want to impact on potential warranty


see my post from 3 weeks ago (post 505)


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

lucifuge said:


> see my post from 3 weeks ago (post 505)


Yes I thought I was doing that and yes it works for maybe 3 or 4 rides then somehow just switches off and wont wake up. In saying that I have never had it fall asleep on a ride, its just that it occasionally wont wake up after being left standing for a day or two so I really dont know whats going on.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

mtb4190 said:


> Yes I thought I was doing that and yes it works for maybe 3 or 4 rides then somehow just switches off and wont wake up. In saying that I have never had it fall asleep on a ride, its just that it occasionally wont wake up after being left standing for a day or two so I really dont know whats going on.


Sounds like you are good case for contacting Quarq. Might need to send it back to be assessed.


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## john85D (Aug 1, 2006)

mtb4190 said:


> Not a stupid question at all I had wondered the same thing but experimenting has taught me that if the slider is to the left it requires you to remove air


Thanks guys!! Big help!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*Shockwiz Results - SC Bronson DVO Topaz*

I finally got to test my Shockwiz out on my rear suspension that I setup based on gut instinct and feel. My first run yesterday ended with a tune score of 92 at 100% confidence. But the Shockwiz also agreed with me that the compression damping was a bit too firm and suggested that both the high and low speed compression be made softer as well as the bottom out resistance be reduced. I knew if my compression was made lighter the bottom out resistance would be effected so I only concerned myself with the compression damping on today's run. I dropped 5psi off of the oil bladder on my DVO Topaz and ran the very same trails again. At the end of the run my tune score improved from 92 yesterday up to 96 today with the 100% confidence level still intact. The Shockwiz suggestions page improved as well with only one of the last 3 categories claiming I need to make adjustments. The low speed compression was still in the yellow just like yesterday, claiming that I needed to make it softer, but the high speed compression and bottom out resistance had both moved into the green. It might be tough getting that last bit tweaked out but I'll give it a stab and see what happens.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

SW always wants u to make it softer from my experience. I had to increase pressure 10psi because i feel my bike rides better at 25-30% sag versus SW's 35%. SW is a good tool to get you in the ballpark butnl u need to fine tune it yourself. I had originally thought the SW was going to do that for me but ive learned that it cant. The lower pressure caused me to hang up too often on square edges and increasing the pressure helped with that and pedal strikes. In the end im back to what i had originally. Its still a good tool to get you really close. 

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I guess it might be bike specific then as the Stats page shows my dynamic sag at 26% when pedaling. It pretty much shows the same thing on the home page if I just sit down on the bike. 
Here's the Stat page after the end of my ride that included a somewhat smooth fire road, uphill section with roots and rocks, back down that ugly rock infested section for high speed compression purposes, followed by our flow trail to catch some air or big jumps.


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## findbuddha (Jul 17, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> SW always wants u to make it softer from my experience. I had to increase pressure 10psi because i feel my bike rides better at 25-30% sag versus SW's 35%. SW is a good tool to get you in the ballpark butnl u need to fine tune it yourself. I had originally thought the SW was going to do that for me but ive learned that it cant. The lower pressure caused me to hang up too often on square edges and increasing the pressure helped with that and pedal strikes. In the end im back to what i had originally. Its still a good tool to get you really close.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


If we choose to ignore the Shockwiz's recommendation for air pressure, are the remaining suggestions still valid? I assume so but want to make sure.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I'd imagine everything will scale but im not exactly sure

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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

This may have been asked before but i dont feel like sorting through 600 or so posts.

Im thinking of buying a shockwiz but dont have the time or patience to spend hours messing around with it trying to make sense of the data it records. How steep of a learning curve is there and how much time do you need to get it to work and make changes to your suspension?

Is it something just for tech savy gearheads?

Thanks in advance...

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> This may have been asked before but i dont feel like sorting through 600 or so posts.
> 
> Im thinking of buying a shockwiz but dont have the time or patience to spend hours messing around with it trying to make sense of the data it records. How steep of a learning curve is there and how much time do you need to get it to work and make changes to your suspension?
> 
> ...


It's dirt simple if you understand suspension setup in general. I just got one and in two rides already have my rear shock at a tune score of 96. But know I'm not new to suspension tuning exactly and had already made changes to my DVO Topaz that my feel for tuning said I needed. The Shockwiz just agreed after I finally got one and used it. 4.5 miles of varying terrain, fire road climb, rooted/rocky uphill and back down, then a flow trail with jumps. That's all it took to get my tune at 100% confidence and there's a chance I could have ridden even less and still got suggestions at 100% confidence. So, it boils down to, if it says adjust your suspension's ramp or high speed compression, would you know what they're suggesting? If so, it's pretty darn simple to follow.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

IRBent said:


> It's dirt simple if you understand suspension setup in general. I just got one and in two rides already have my rear shock at a tune score of 96. But know I'm not new to suspension tuning exactly and had already made changes to my DVO Topaz that my feel for tuning said I needed. The Shockwiz just agreed after I finally got one and used it. 4.5 miles of varying terrain, fire road climb, rooted/rocky uphill and back down, then a flow trail with jumps. That's all it took to get my tune at 100% confidence and there's a chance I could have ridden even less and still got suggestions at 100% confidence. So, it boils down to, if it says adjust your suspension's ramp or high speed compression, would you know what they're suggesting? If so, it's pretty darn simple to follow.


Ok. I can deal with that.

How reliable is it, does it break?
Do you need to spend alot of time setting it up or calibrating it?

Thanks again

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> Ok. I can deal with that.
> 
> How reliable is it, does it break?
> Do you need to spend alot of time setting it up or calibrating it?
> ...


I think it's very sturdy so long as you strap it to your bike with decent zip ties. As for calibration, it does take a bit of patience until you understand the process. You let all the air out of your fork/shock then follow the instructions where you cycle the suspension through it's full travel a few times. You also have to hold it at full extension so it can detect zero travel. Then do the same for completely compressed which isn't too bad since there's no pressure in your fork/shock. The one thing it doesn't explain that's crucial. The cal wizard will tell you to pump you fork/shock up to recommended pressure. If you do that on a fork or shock that has a negative chamber and don't go through the small incremental adds of air and cycle the fork or shock to equalize the positive and negative chambers, the calibration will be all jacked up. I tried to make certain my fully extended my pressure read as close to 0psi as possible. Otherwize any positive or negative pressure in the suspension system when setting the zero travel mark would cause minor error in the calibration. By doing so I can sit on my bike and the Shockwiz read 25-26% sag and my o-ring will measure exactly that. You should find some pressure changes to take place though during your ride. Say you start out with 200psi in your shock. As it heats up due to heavy use the pressure could climb a few psi. Or set it up outside where you plan to ride and then bring it indoors and the pressure could drop a few psi as the air cools inside. If you take the leap I'm sure folks here will be glad to help you out if you run into something you don't understand. Quarq/Shockwiz have videos on YouTube that show you how to calibrate it.

https://www.youtube.com/user/QuarqTechnology


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent said:


> ...I tried to make certain my fully extended my pressure read as close to 0psi as possible. Otherwize any positive or negative pressure in the suspension system when setting the zero travel mark would cause minor error in the calibration...


I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

Where is the best place to rent a Shockwiz?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Lone Rager said:


> I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.


You may be dead right. Fully extended to fully compressed lets the Shockwiz calculate your compression ratio. But I couldn't help but wonder if when you press the okay button while fully extended if it didn't also tell the Shockwiz that the pressure inside equals zero travel and zero psi. I've read numerous complaints that the pressure shown on the Shockwiz doesn't match that of the user's shock pump. Mine on the other hand is within 1psi most of the time. So either my Lezyne Digital gauge is on the same plane as the pressure transducer used in the Shockwiz, or my zero setting may have made the difference. I was just thinking, no air inside and fully extended means zero, not +/-1psi.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Lone Rager said:


> I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.


you can. I fact if you have a fork with a coil negative spring you have to leave 30psi in it our it's impossible to top it out.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> you can. I fact if you have a fork with a coil negative spring you have to leave 30psi in it our it's impossible to top it out.


Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Anyone bought Shockwiz from bikeinn.com? Price damn good, legit?


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.


I don't think that's true. The shockwiz only uses pressure to determine where the shock/fork is in its travel. You could do the same with a linear transducer, which is what most data acquisition systems use. As long as there's nothing that messes with the pressure as a function of travel or speed (e.g. MRP ramp control) then it should be fine. A negative spring doesn't.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone know if they ever go on sale? I tried a jenson coupon but it wouldn't apply

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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

dmo said:


> Anyone know if they ever go on sale? I tried a jenson coupon but it wouldn't apply
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


Sometimes you can get them from a site wide sale. I got one like that for 10% off over the fourth from worldwide.

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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Nope, the pressure at a given travel% is independent of the leverage curve of the bike. If the air chamber has a volume of 500 at full extension, it will have a volume of 250 at 50% travel, with a resultant doubling of the pressure compared to the pressure at full extension (this is oversimplified since the air chamber doesn't go to zero at bottom out, but you get the idea). The leverage curve of the bike will affect how much force it takes to get to 30% travel, but it won't change the pressure in the air chamber at 30% travel.

To answer your question, yes, if the O-ring says 30%, the shockwiz should be reading 30%. If not, the compression ratio calibration is off.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

IRBent said:


> Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.


The negative spring doesn't factor into the compression ratio, but is impossible to compress without some help. 30 psi on an older fox 34 seem perfect. Since it only cares about how much you compressed the air, the starting psi doesn't matter.



Lone Rager said:


> I don't think that's true. The shockwiz only uses pressure to determine where the shock/fork is in its travel. You could do the same with a linear transducer, which is what most data acquisition systems use. As long as there's nothing that messes with the pressure as a function of travel or speed (e.g. MRP ramp control) then it should be fine. A negative spring doesn't.


This. It's only concerned with the starting and ending volume of the fork or shock.
On forks with an air negative you need to have them balanced with the air in the main chamber. I find that close to zero works pretty good. Anything under 30 should work too, as long as you can full compress and extend the fork.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Yes and no.
Forks always or something is wrong.
Shocks can have different leverage ratios depending on travel. For example if you have a 2-2.5 then in the beginning the shock will move 1 for every 2 of wheel travel. The end will be 1 to 2.5. 
Some like a DW link bike will move the shock more then settle down in the sag zone.
So rear shock sag does not equal rear wheel sag, but it is close. Unless it's off by a large amount (5-10%) I wouldn't worry about it.


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Yes and no.
> Forks always or something is wrong.
> Shocks can have different leverage ratios depending on travel. For example if you have a 2-2.5 then in the beginning the shock will move 1 for every 2 of wheel travel. The end will be 1 to 2.5.
> Some like a DW link bike will move the shock more then settle down in the sag zone.
> So rear shock sag does not equal rear wheel sag, but it is close. Unless it's off by a large amount (5-10%) I wouldn't worry about it.


But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Sid Duffman said:


> But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?


In my opinion, yes. The Shockwiz has no input for suspension linkage design and don't distinguish between shocks with linkage vs forks with linear travel. All it knows it fully extended pressures vs fully compressed. It then calculates your sag based on those two points alone. At 50% travel, per the O-ring on the shock or fork, the pressure should double. Then at 75% it should double pressure again. Nothing more than Boyle's gas law reversed engineered to give you travel/sag.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Sid Duffman said:


> But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?


Yes your right.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
thanks


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtb4190 said:


> Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
> Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
> thanks


Sounds like you're probably a bit lighter than the shock tune was designed for. Before I got a Shockwiz my gut said I was in the same boat based on feel. I went with a lighter weight oil, or a lower viscosity oil. I rode with the Shockwiz and it agreed with me, giving me all green on the top 3 items and all yellows on the bottom 3, high/low speed compression and bottom out resistance. Unlike the Fox X2, my DVO Topaz allows me to adjust the pressure on the oil bladder system. I dropped 5psi out of it and everything moved into the green BUT low speed compression. It's still in the yellow for now. Bottom line, I'm not real familiar with the X2 but it sounds like you may need to adjust your compression shim stack to get a lower amount of resistance on the oil flow.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

mtb4190 said:


> Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
> Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
> thanks


Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.

If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.
> 
> If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


I agree with the idea, if it feels good to you. Yeah, I'd love to have a test score of 100 with 100% confidence, but I'm smart enough to know that those numbers would only be good for that very same trail I tested on with outside temps pretty much the same. Conditions don't stay the same and I'm not going to test tune my suspension before every ride. I'm really happy with my score of 96 at 100% confidence right now and if taking a few psi out of my air can doesn't do, I'll settle on close enough.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.
> 
> If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


 Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
Thanks for the reply


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtb4190 said:


> Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
> Thanks for the reply


High speed in the red to me screams the shock is not active enough. A softer shock moves faster. How's your sag? Do you use all of your travel now? If sag and overall travel is decent, I'd might be more inclined to add a tuning band on the positive then lower the air pressure. High speed compression has to be affected by air pressure to some extent. Lowering the pressure should allow things to move faster which could improve high speed compression results. Adding another spacer would help make up the pressure loss and prevent bottoming out. You could try both scenarios, adding air and removing a spacer as previously suggested, then right the opposite and see which works out best. I'm in the same boat but with low speed compression in the yellow and my adjustment wide open. I plan on dropping a few psi and seeing how the Shockwiz reacts on low speed compression and hope that it doesn't kill any of the other settings that are all in the green.


mtb4190 said:


> Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
> Thanks for the reply


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> High speed in the red to me screams the shock is not active enough. A softer shock moves faster. How's your sag? Do you use all of your travel now? If sag and overall travel is decent, I'd might be more inclined to add a tuning band on the positive then lower the air pressure. High speed compression has to be affected by air pressure to some extent. Lowering the pressure should allow things to move faster which could improve high speed compression results. Adding another spacer would help make up the pressure loss and prevent bottoming out. You could try both scenarios, adding air and removing a spacer as previously suggested, then right the opposite and see which works out best. I'm in the same boat but with low speed compression in the yellow and my adjustment wide open. I plan on dropping a few psi and seeing how the Shockwiz reacts on low speed compression and hope that it doesn't kill any of the other settings that are all in the green.


That could work as well. X2 is tricky without knowing the details. Some configurations allow for quite a few spacers, while others, 200x57, only allow two.

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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Thanks guys that gives some direction. I will start playing around with bands. Sag is currently at 33%. dynanamic sag generally around 35-36%. seems to be using all the travel going by the O ring on the shaft but big hit or whatever it is called is on zero


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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.

I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?

Shockwiz is only part of the overall information the tuner should consider. Imagine the complexity in the program related to distinguishing between a HSC issue and an Air Spring Ramp issue. That could be very nuanced. Then realize the Shockwiz doesn't know if the trail conditions for that Tuning Session actually demanded full travel.

In concept a tuner can use a combination of baseline air pressure, ramp, and compression damping to help control compression scenarios. I'm not an Engineer, nor do I want to quibble with one, but the big difference is that a spring stores energy (and returns it), while the damper absorbs the energy. Pulling all information from the rider, tire pressure, Shockwiz, and understanding the demands of the trail should factor in to how you approach minor deviations from 'OK' in the HSC settings.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

oldranger said:


> This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.
> 
> I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?
> 
> ...


Very well put and I whole heatedly agree.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

oldranger said:


> This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.
> 
> I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?
> 
> ...


I'm glad to hear that others are having the same issues with HSC.

I have Avalanche suspension and Shockwiz really doesn't like Craig's HSC choices, front and rear. Shockwiz will be in the red for HSC telling me to soften it, then I will hit a great 5' drop, and it puts me right back in to the green. The thing is that I only do 1-2 drops maybe every other ride.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

My issue isn't with HSC as it's in the green with everything else. My LSC is saying to make it softer. Heck, the shock already feels great so if I can't get everything into the green, I'll happily settle for a tune score of 96 with the LSC in the yellow.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

It does that to me as well. Like you I don't worry about it. Once I know the shock is performing correctly. It's all about feel and personal preference. The shockwiz was never meant to remove the human element only the mechanical.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

You see my issue is that if I didn't have the shock whiz I would be adding more compression. probably 2 clicks of LSC and at least one of HSC but with HSC already in the red and LSC in yellow it makes me think I am on the wrong path to getting the feel I am looking for. You know super plush but with good support and able to take the big drops


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

IRBent said:


> My issue isn't with HSC as it's in the green with everything else. My LSC is saying to make it softer. Heck, the shock already feels great so if I can't get everything into the green, I'll happily settle for a tune score of 96 with the LSC in the yellow.





mtb4190 said:


> You see my issue is that if I didn't have the shock whiz I would be adding more compression. probably 2 clicks of LSC and at least one of HSC but with HSC already in the red and LSC in yellow it makes me think I am on the wrong path to getting the feel I am looking for. You know super plush but with good support and able to take the big drops


If those affe the type rides you are doing when you tune your shock. SW should definitely get you in the ball park. The rest is going to be personal preference.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

^^^^

Not sure why it double quoted but my reply was @ mtb1940.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

This weekends riding will be totally different terrain ie lots of roots but not so many large hits so I probably wont change too much for that but I will get back to this forum after further experimentation.cheers


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Hi guys, I've been trying to tune my fox float 36 rc2 180mm fork but have experience quite a bit of issues. First of is the calibration wizard which fails but suggests that the compression ratio is between 5.6-5.9. I emailed SRAM and they said that this seems wrong and that I should measure the actual travel on the fork. I did and it actually seemed correct so I ran with that. 

On the trail shockwiz keeps telling me to remove air and make HSC softer, after reading this thread I guess that's due to me not using the full travel. Alas on the flow trail I'm riding this isn't possible. Is there a way to get around this setting? Maybe by decreasing the CR so that it thinks I'm using the full travel when I'm not?

Last question concerns setting the baseline air pressure. The calibration wizard suggests to fully extend the fork but since it has a negative air pressure chamber the fork sits a bit in the travel. If I use the calibration wizard to set the baseline air I get something like 8% sag which from the manual is wrong. Kind of confusing why the calibration wizard tells you to fully extend the fork when measuring the baseline air pressure.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tkaszuba said:


> Hi guys, I've been trying to tune my fox float 36 rc2 180mm fork but have experience quite a bit of issues. First of is the calibration wizard which fails but suggests that the compression ratio is between 5.6-5.9. I emailed SRAM and they said that this seems wrong and that I should measure the actual travel on the fork. I did and it actually seemed correct so I ran with that.
> 
> On the trail shockwiz keeps telling me to remove air and make HSC softer, after reading this thread I guess that's due to me not using the full travel. Alas on the flow trail I'm riding this isn't possible. Is there a way to get around this setting? Maybe by decreasing the CR so that it thinks I'm using the full travel when I'm not?
> 
> Last question concerns setting the baseline air pressure. The calibration wizard suggests to fully extend the fork but since it has a negative air pressure chamber the fork sits a bit in the travel. If I use the calibration wizard to set the baseline air I get something like 8% sag which from the manual is wrong. Kind of confusing why the calibration wizard tells you to fully extend the fork when measuring the baseline air pressure.


Based on your negative air chamber comment, try this. When you first start calibration, let the air out then cycle the fork nice and slow several times to let the negative air pressure bleed into the positive chamber, then let it out through the Shockwiz. This might help with the negative chamber causing the suck down sag. Also when it asks you to pump it up to manufacturer's recommended pressure, go at it maybe 10-20psi at a time then cycle the fork the let the negative and positive chambers equalize.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

If your compression ratio is off, Nothing will work! If you have a coil negative spring you need to leave 30 psi in the main chamber to help you compress the coil. And friend to help hold the fork at full top/bottom.


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Ok, I tried as suggested but that didn't change anything. Maybe I rephrase the question. Can the shock travel show more than 0% when the fork is at rest (because of the negative air chamber) or should I reset it to zero?

I couldn't find this information in the manual.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tkaszuba said:


> Ok, I tried as suggested but that didn't change anything. Maybe I rephrase the question. Can the shock travel show more than 0% when the fork is at rest (because of the negative air chamber) or should I reset it to zero?
> 
> I couldn't find this information in the manual.
> 
> View attachment 1146799


The manual plainly states that any shock travel greater than +/- 3% means something went wrong in the calibration process.


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Yes, I saw that and in the calibration step it shows 0% with a base pressure of 70 psi (since it's fully extended manually by me when taking this measurement) but when I get back to the home screen it shows 6-7% with the correct pressure of 74 psi.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

tkaszuba said:


> Yes, I saw that and in the calibration step it shows 0% with a base pressure of 70 psi (since it's fully extended manually by me when taking this measurement) but when I get back to the home screen it shows 6-7% with the correct pressure of 74 psi.


And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06


Where's this 1.06 factor coming from?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Where's this 1.06 factor coming from?


70psi = 100%
74psi = 106% (we were provided with 6%)

106% corresponds to a factor of 1.06


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> 70psi = 100%
> 74psi = 106% (we were provided with 6%)
> 
> 106% corresponds to a factor of 1.06


I understand the math. But where does the Shockwiz say you get a 6% variation?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

It's like I get 72psi on my Lyrik and that' s at 12% natural sag. 
So 72psi/1.12 = 64 psi which is correct at the shock pump with 0 sag


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I understand the math. But where does the Shockwiz say you get a 6% variation?


No, re-read that guys response. He provided the 6%


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Awesome, thanks for this info. Not sure why SRAM doesn't include this in the manual.

Now getting back to measuring the compression ratio, I guess when you measure the travel used you need to take this initial sag into consideration as well? The thing is when you do it the old fashioned way you don't. I'm guessing that shockwiz uses that 1.06 factor to adjust the travel used so that it's inline with manual measurements?



lucifuge said:


> And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

I've used my shockwiz to tune my first bike over the course of a month or so. I'm happy with the unit. I'm now on to my second bike. I wanted to share some of my experience with this unit. First off, the default fox suggested settings for my fork and shock on the first bike were pretty much spot on for the "balanced" tune. I did maybe 1-2 clicks here and there to get as close to perfect as it would tell me over the course of many runs. However, in case people want to try and get crazy and try to get 100% on your tune, just forget about that. I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I rode a dozen or two times on each, fork/shock, to measure and tune. What I found is that even without changing a single thing (except start new session on shockwiz) and riding the same trail, it would suggest slightly different things each time. If you get just a yellow, what I would call a "suggestion", in the tuning, take it with a grain of salt. It's very likely to be different if you rode the trail again. I found eventually, if I just kept resetting the shockwiz and riding the same trail I eventually would hit 100% tune by chance! I don't think this is any kind of downside to the unit at all. It makes perfect sense that no two runs are going to be exactly the same. What it does seem to mean though, is that when you get into the yellow zone with the suggestions you're really getting into a very subjective and unrepeatable area. There is not much need to try and get 100%, don't waste your time... or just keep riding until you get it if it makes you feel better


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> I've used my shockwiz to tune my first bike over the course of a month or so. I'm happy with the unit. I'm now on to my second bike. I wanted to share some of my experience with this unit. First off, the default fox suggested settings for my fork and shock on the first bike were pretty much spot on for the "balanced" tune. I did maybe 1-2 clicks here and there to get as close to perfect as it would tell me over the course of many runs. However, in case people want to try and get crazy and try to get 100% on your tune, just forget about that. I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I rode a dozen or two times on each, fork/shock, to measure and tune. What I found is that even without changing a single thing (except start new session on shockwiz) and riding the same trail, it would suggest slightly different things each time. If you get just a yellow, what I would call a "suggestion", in the tuning, take it with a grain of salt. It's very likely to be different if you rode the trail again. I found eventually, if I just kept resetting the shockwiz and riding the same trail I eventually would hit 100% tune by chance! I don't think this is any kind of downside to the unit at all. It makes perfect sense that no two runs are going to be exactly the same. What it does seem to mean though, is that when you get into the yellow zone with the suggestions you're really getting into a very subjective and unrepeatable area. There is not much need to try and get 100%, don't waste your time... or just keep riding until you get it if it makes you feel better


Perfect summation. So, were you seeing a tune score of 96 often and without any changes it finally blipped up to 100% on that one perfect ride? I had 2 out of 4 rides clock in at 96 and was very happy with the feel. One more tweak and bam, 80. But that 80 didn't feel any worse than the two 96 scores. I'm just about ready to move to the fork but I want to test the settings that gave me the higher score another time or two first.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Perfect summation. So, were you seeing a tune score of 96 often and without any changes it finally blipped up to 100% on that one perfect ride? I had 2 out of 4 rides clock in at 96 and was very happy with the feel. One more tweak and bam, 80. But that 80 didn't feel any worse than the two 96 scores. I'm just about ready to move to the fork but I want to test the settings that gave me the higher score another time or two first.


Yes, exactly, the scores were always very close to perfect, but not quite. I kept having a couple of things come up yellow and kept adjusting. After a while I realized I kept adjusting things one way and then back again based on what it was saying.... so I then just kept everything the same to see if it would repeat the same, and it didn't. However, it did always come back very close to perfect, except for one or two rides, which in all fairness I did ride slightly differently on.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> Yes, exactly, the scores were always very close to perfect, but not quite. I kept having a couple of things come up yellow and kept adjusting. After a while I realized I kept adjusting things one way and then back again based on what it was saying.... so I then just kept everything the same to see if it would repeat the same, and it didn't. However, it did always come back very close to perfect, except for one or two rides, which in all fairness I did ride slightly differently on.


I had two rides clock in at 96 with 100% confidence. It was only after I tried to eek out that last 4 points that all hell broke loose. I'm well satisfied with the feel at 96. For that matter I was pretty darn happy with the 92 I got based in gut instinct and feel obtained on my first Shockwiz run. I'm a tweaker so I just couldn't let it lie. Between my personal experience and what you've shared, I'll be happy if I can repeat those 96 scores.


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

On my formula thirtyfive fork I got 96 with 100% confidence but then went further down the trail that had loose rocks and it went down to 82. From there I realised that it's impossible to have the fork tuned for everything and it's better to pick the section of trail that matters the most to your riding.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Is it possible to pause a session so you can just analyse the sections of trail that matter to you?


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

I do this by taking a screenshot of my phone of the different shockwiz pages and review them later.


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Yes, you can turn off bluetooth. 



onzadog said:


> Is it possible to pause a session so you can just analyse the sections of trail that matter to you?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Won't it just upload all the data once it comes on again?


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Since it's streaming data as it comes I doubt that the device stores the data if it can't connect to the phone but maybe somebody can correct this.



onzadog said:


> Won't it just upload all the data once it comes on again?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Not got mine yet so I'm just going off what I've heard from others, but I thought you didn't need to take the phone riding with you. You could download the data at the end of the day and run the analysis.


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## Sasse82 (Mar 2, 2017)

onzadog said:


> Not got mine yet so I'm just going off what I've heard from others, but I thought you didn't need to take the phone riding with you. You could download the data at the end of the day and run the analysis.


That's absolutely correct.
The device works independently without a phone.
The phone is only necessary to display the results.
Pausing therefore is not possible.

Gesendet von meinem HTC 10 mit Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tkaszuba said:


> On my formula thirtyfive fork I got 96 with 100% confidence but then went further down the trail that had loose rocks and it went down to 82. From there I realised that it's impossible to have the fork tuned for everything and it's better to pick the section of trail that matters the most to your riding.


I'm sure that's the case too. The section of trail I picked starts out with a long and pretty smooth fire road climb where the data is useless. I break off the road for a slow more technical rocky uphill section and eventually turn around to bomb back down that same section. By then the Shockwiz is pretty happy but asking for jumps. Once back down to the fire road another flow trail is ahead with the jumps it's asking for. I've done screenshots throughout the ride and watched the score and confidence levels both climb and the detections and suggestions go from bad to all green. I'd imagine if I kept on riding smooth trails thereafter my score would slide since my suspension wouldn't be working the full gamut.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Had a bit of stiction in one of the pivots. Got that sorted and HSC went to green.Felt a lot better


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## doezel (May 22, 2013)

Just updated Shockwiz to firmware 4.0.0.

Does anyone know what is changed in this (presumably major) firmware release?


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

As did I and wondering the same.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

And there is nothing to be found on their website that discusses firmware history and changes. Looking through the software after updating yesterday, I saw nothing different. Although I'm not sure that it had anything to do with the update but I was able to find and connect to my Shockwiz much easier and quicker. Usually it's an ordeal that requires me to kill the app a time or two and wait minutes while watching the red LED blink before my software finds my unit.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Anyone have trouble with droid phones? sees the shockwiz but won't stay connected.


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## crfnick56 (Mar 7, 2012)

Is the Shockwiz worth it if I dont have the top of the line suspension with high/low speed adjustments? I'm trying to get the most out of what I have but am wondering if it wouldn't be money well spent towards upgrading the suspension itself first? 

I'm referring to 2016 Stumpjumper 29 with FOX FLOAT Performance DPS rear and FOX 34 Plus Performance front.


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## fathomer (Apr 24, 2012)

Does a compression ratio of 2.0 sound low for a 150mm Pike with a Luftkappe and no tokens? It measured dynamic sag at 26% which is maybe slightly low but I don't think to far off.

Unfortunately I only have the unit until tomorrow and that's for sorting the shock but I'd like to know!


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

I'm not 100% sure on how the ratio is figured but I do know that as I increased tokens in my fork the compression ratio increased as well. I'd venture to guess that since you have no tokens in there then 2.0 probably isn't low. When I make adjustments to mine, I typically will go through the calibration process twice to confirm the compression ratio is the same both times and it always seems to be.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

fathomer said:


> Does a compression ratio of 2.0 sound low for a 150mm Pike with a Luftkappe and no tokens? It measured dynamic sag at 26% which is maybe slightly low but I don't think to far off.
> 
> Unfortunately I only have the unit until tomorrow and that's for sorting the shock but I'd like to know!


2.0 seems low but not unreasonable. I would redo your calibration with a friend to help full extend and compress the fork. Also you need to make sure your negative camber is empty along with your main camber.
Stock 150mm 27.5 pike was 2.6.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> And there is nothing to be found on their website that discusses firmware history and changes. Looking through the software after updating yesterday, I saw nothing different. Although I'm not sure that it had anything to do with the update but I was able to find and connect to my Shockwiz much easier and quicker. Usually it's an ordeal that requires me to kill the app a time or two and wait minutes while watching the red LED blink before my software finds my unit.


It completely changed the Playful setup on mine. Was at a score of 88 and dropped it to 76. Also went from OK on packing to Poor.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> It completely changed the Playful setup on mine. Was at a score of 88 and dropped it to 76. Also went from OK on packing to Poor.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Holy. Maybe that's why mine went from all green with a score of 96 @ 100% confidence down to either 80 or 84. I busted into the shock and with Red Line Like Water and my run today scored 92 and asked to firm up HSC a click or 2 but LSC was still in the yellow and wanting it softer.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Holy. Maybe that's why mine went from all green with a score of 96 @ 100% confidence down to either 80 or 84. I busted into the shock and with Red Line Like Water and my run today scored 92 and asked to firm up HSC a click or 2 but LSC was still in the yellow and wanting it softer.


Yeah it went from lots of green and couple yellows to wanting everything but tokens made softer/slower.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I'm still at odds with the machine though. I can make a rough rocky downhill section and it score 88 but the suggestions will be totally opposite of my 92 score after I continue on through our flow trail. My usual test loop has fire road climb followed by technical rocky section. I then turn around and bomb that rocky section to get HSC data. I finish it out with a flow trail with big jumps.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*How Do You Prefer To Tune Full Ride or Section Specific?*

So how do you guys tune? Do you tune for the full gamut, or do you key in on a single aspect such as big jumps or rocky rooted sections?
The Shockwiz gave my shock a score of 88 @ 100% confidence after my rocky downhill section with a red suggestion to make HSC softer, and both LSC and bottom out resistance were yellow asking to be softer or remove resistance. But after I hit my flow section with jumps it came back with a better score of 92, all in the same session as the rocky downhill but this time it gave opposite suggestion to firm up HSC. I can't do both, make HSC softer and firm it up too.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

That's going to be a tricky one. What bike and shock? 

Maybe the rocks aren't big enough or there is room to charge a bit harder through them? Just throwing our theories. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

Shockwiz always gives you best settings for a particular style of riding. I always tune on a tough trail. That way I am good no matter where I go. There is not one setting for all disciplines enduro, AM, XC, Trail. Each discipline combined with riders style is going to net you a different settings. Rocky sections are continuous hits and deflections are one of the best places to get an all around tune. Unless you ride mostly flowy smooth trails. Jumps are 1 time big hits. SW almost always ask for a softer LSC I wouldn't worry about that. I wouldn't worry to much for any section section that appears in yellow. To me yellow readings are where rider preference starts to come into play. I think you are doing it right. 1. air pressure 2. tokens 3. rebound.. Once you get green on these 3 it's rider preference. Anyone of these 3 can be yellow also if you like your bike stiffer or softer. You may start out tuning for efficient but after concluding your tune may decide you want a lil more/less air depending on what you like this can change the air pressure to yellow. SW eliminates the mechanical guess work of tuning. However it can never eliminate the human element which rider preference. My SW currently is telling me to add more air for my efficient setting however I like the suppleness it currently has so I left it as is. If a change the setting to playful my air pressure would turn green. I've been using SW for a couple months now and have tuned 4 shocks with it Pike, Bluto, Monarch and a Fox float CTD. It definitely improved how each shock felt and worked.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

I'm using Shock wiz to tune the suspension on my Scott Spark with the "twin lock" lock out lever. Do I start tuning with the lever fully open? That's what I've done so far. 

If I tune with the suspension fully open and then I try riding with lockout engaged 1 click will the tune be all off? Should I ride with the suspension fully open all the time? Or should I tune the suspension in the setting I use the most, which is 1 click toward lockout?

I only fully lockout if I'm racing and sprinting on flat ground. Any help is appreciated.

Thanks

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

IRBent said:


> So how do you guys tune? Do you tune for the full gamut, or do you key in on a single aspect such as big jumps or rocky rooted sections?
> The Shockwiz gave my shock a score of 88 @ 100% confidence after my rocky downhill section with a red suggestion to make HSC softer, and both LSC and bottom out resistance were yellow asking to be softer or remove resistance. But after I hit my flow section with jumps it came back with a better score of 92, all in the same session as the rocky downhill but this time it gave opposite suggestion to firm up HSC. I can't do both, make HSC softer and firm it up too.
> 
> View attachment 1147904


Sounds like your tuning for 2 completely different trails, but they are linked together. I would try both suggestions and see which one you like the best. Somewhere in the middle might be the best too. The great thing is that you are trying different settings and learning what you like based on the trails you ride. I tune for the rougher sections of trail and acept that the smooth areas won't be ideal. If I'm riding mostly smooth I will change my settings to suit the terrain.

Make a couple runs and only adjust 1 setting like lsc. Get a feel for how it changes the bike and see what you like. How you ride is just as important as what you ride. No two people will have the same setting even on the same trail.



dmo said:


> I'm using Shock wiz to tune the suspension on my Scott Spark with the "twin lock" lock out lever. Do I start tuning with the lever fully open? That's what I've done so far.
> 
> If I tune with the suspension fully open and then I try riding with lockout engaged 1 click will the tune be all off? Should I ride with the suspension fully open all the time? Or should I tune the suspension in the setting I use the most, which is 1 click toward lockout?
> 
> ...


Shockwiz only works if all your setting stay static. No lockouts, air, knob changes. If you change anything you need to start a new session. Also it doesn't work with platform suspension like Brian or teralogic.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

I understand that. Once I finish the tune what happens when I engage a lockout? Does the suspension no longer retain any of the properties that you set when shockwiz was used earlier?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

dmo said:


> I understand that. Once I finish the tune what happens when I engage a lockout? Does the suspension no longer retain any of the properties that you set when shockwiz was used earlier?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


That depends on how the manufacturer of your suspension implements their lockout.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I'm a bit beside myself after this morning's run. Same loop as usual but when I got to the top of the rocky section and was ready to bomb back down it, I checked the Shockwiz app to find an error. I don't recall exactly what it said, something about not initializing/starting up correctly and was telling me to to the battery and start over. So I started a new session, bombed the rocky stuff and did screen shots. I then went down the flow trail to hit the jumps. Once back to my starting point the Shockwiz still wanted more, basically it wanted the climb data that I deleted earlier when I found the error. The data I did collect still wants things softer so I think I'm going radical. I'm about to toss 2 more tuning bands into both the positive and the negative chambers and set the air pressure to obtain @ 25% sag. I'll go back out later this afternoon and ride my test loop and see what gives.
Bottom line, I want a very active shock that will eat up the rock gardens and I'm willing to loose efficiency and such to obtain it. When I started a new session before bombing the rocky section today there wasn't enough data to make the Shockwiz happy. But what was there suggested softening things up. The feeling coming down it was that the shock was occasionally bouncing over rocks rather than giving to them. So my feel says it's too firm as well. Adding tuning bands should allow me to lower the pressure while maybe maintaining my bottom out resistance. My thinking is the lower pressure at the top will allow the shock to move out of the way quicker. Either way, I'll learn something by going so radical.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

I wouldn't add spacers to the negative spring. Since is makes your initial stroke softer and mid stroke more linear.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> I wouldn't add spacers to the negative spring. Since is makes your initial stroke softer and mid stroke more linear.


The negative chambers adds softness early on, not the spacers in the negative chamber. That's what you're saying, right? While I understand that, I added the negative spacers to keep the suspension from sagging too much. Adding positive spacers allow you to run lower pressure and still not bottom out. Lower pressure would have me sagging over 30%. Let's see how this setup feels. I now have 3 positive and 2 negative spacers and was able to drop 15psi and keep sag the same.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

IRBent said:


> The negative chambers adds softness early on, not the spacers in the negative chamber. That's what you're saying, right? While I understand that, I added the negative spacers to keep the suspension from sagging too much. Adding positive spacers allow you to run lower pressure and still not bottom out. Lower pressure would have me sagging over 30%. Let's see how this setup feels. I now have 3 positive and 2 negative spacers and was able to drop 15psi and keep sag the same.


Exactly. I tune my suspension for bottom out and then see where my sag is. Once you have a good setup that uses 95% on most rides getting the sag to the happy point is the next goal. This is personal and different from bike to bike.
Sounds like you have a good handle on what the bands do and what kind of feel you want.
I ended up with a compression ratio of 2.9 front and rear on my Tallboy 3. I don't have a lot of travel and needed a stiff ramp up to prevent bottom out.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I'm riding a 2015 Bronson and tuning a DVO Topaz shock. I've yet to move the Shockwiz to the Pike. I guess I'm a bit different than you. I don't want to bottom out but my trails don't offer real big jumps or drops either. Our flow trail has numerous table tops so I have a smooth downhill transition to land. I want super plush rock and root crushing suspension. When I sag @ 30% I tend to get a lot of peddle strikes. So my goal is to tune soft with @ 25% sag. Per the Shockwiz my dynamic sag has been 26%-28%. With only one tuning band on the positive side my compression ratio was 2.8. Adding the extra bands jumped it up to 3.0. I'd love to keep the negative bands away but I won't if pedal bob and strikes are too much.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

If I remove 1 shock spacer, and adjust air pressure back to my 30% sag, will that effectively reduce HSC?
Thanks. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> If I remove 1 shock spacer, and adjust air pressure back to my 30% sag, will that effectively reduce HSC?
> Thanks.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Actually, I think that is opposite of what you'd want to do possibly. First of all, HSC & LSC isn't a function of air can pressure. It's how fast or slow your suspension can move which is controlled by your damper system. Now to discuss how air pressure theoretically could somewhat affect HSC. Imagine a shock or fork with low air pressure. You could push fast and hard and make it move through its travel quickly, hence HSC or high speed compression. Add more pressure and you won't be able to move it as fast. If you want to try to compromise because your shock doesn't have separate compression knobs, I'd say ADD a spacer and drop pressure instead of the other way around. Actually, I just did this same thing this afternoon in attempt to soften my HSC and LSC. I've yet to get home to analyze the data but I broke my PR on the ugly rocky downhill section. The rear felt very active and planted after adding two more tuning bands to both positive and negative chambers and dropping the air can 15psi.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

I would be interested to hear what your data had to say about those changes


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Finally got my Shockwiz!

Going to tune my X2 tmr

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

lucifuge said:


> OK, I went through the calibration again. When I let all the air out and go though the compression and extension parts, while I can compress fully, I can't get full extension...maybe I'm getting 80% it just feels to hard to go further. At the end of the calibration its telling me the CR is 2.0 and the that its sinking 8% into its travel when its not. Also the app's measurement vs the actual stanchions markers are off. When I put a CR manually of 2.5; it improves it almost 1-1. So that's what I left it at and went for a ride. Even after a decent ride its still on 49% wanting some jumps etc.
> 
> Does a CR of approx 2.5 on a 160 Lyrik with an effective token installed @ 70psi sound reasonable?
> 
> Also can you please confirm if the ratio is calculated in the calibration steps prior to inflation?


I think getting the full compression/extension during calibration is critical to get the right CR. I ran into the same issue as you did... basically trying to pull a vacuum when trying to extend the fork after compressing it and letting out all the air. What I found is that the pressure (or lack thereof) during calibration is not important. What is important is to get full compression and extension when it asks to. My solution was to keep adding just a little bit of air until I could both fully compress and fully extend the fork by hand.... which can be a very small range of pressure which allows it! Good Luck!

PS, I DO NOT mean that you should CHANGE the air pressure during the calibration! It needs to stay the same, it just doesn't matter what that value is.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Just calibrated my Fox X2 on Hightower 29er (Balanced style). Does the shock compression ratio of 2.4 looks ok? Thanks!

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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent said:


> ...Now to discuss how air pressure theoretically could somewhat affect HSC. Imagine a shock or fork with low air pressure. You could push fast and hard and make it move through its travel quickly, hence HSC or high speed compression. Add more pressure and you won't be able to move it as fast. ..


Not exactly. Damping is a function of shock speed and independent of the spring or air pressure. The optimal amount damping will depend on a number of factors, including pressure. So, changing pressure won't change damping, but it could change the amount of damping needed.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> Just calibrated my Fox X2 on Hightower 29er (Balanced style). Does the shock compression ratio of 2.4 looks ok? Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


2.4 is what my X2 read. My fox 36 forks are 2.8 I believe.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Suns_PSD said:


> 2.4 is what my X2 read. My fox 36 forks are 2.8 I believe.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Awesome! Thanks.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtb4190 said:


> I would be interested to hear what your data had to say about those changes


I'm not going to take the data off a single run and consider it golden. I've come to learn after running the same loop many times that the Shockwiz is capable of giving me mixed results. Then too you have to take into consideration what you want out of your shock and the Shockwiz. I've never had much of a problem with bottoming out because my trails don't offer anything that would cause a lot of force to be imparted. My goal was to get a more compliant and active suspension for ugly rock gardens. But when I run my loop the rock garden downhill section follows behind a long uphill climb. When I finish the rocky section the Shockwiz is begging for big jumps. If I compare the data after the rock garden to the data after the big jump section I often get contradictory results. For instance, after the rocky downhill yesterday the Shockwiz had a suggestion for my HSC, red make softer. However after I finished the big jumps it went from red make softer to yellow make firmer. Now we know I can't do both and since my goal was to smooth out the rough stuff I'd be more inclined to follow the make softer suggestion I got from the rocky downhill section. The one thing I will add, numbers off the Shockwiz are one thing but personal feel and the fact that I beat my Strava PRs on both the rocky section and the big jump section makes me feel better about the direction I'm headed. I'll make more runs before I make a decision though.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Lone Rager said:


> Not exactly. Damping is a function of shock speed and independent of the spring or air pressure. The optimal amount damping will depend on a number of factors, including pressure. So, changing pressure won't change damping, but it could change the amount of damping needed.


I think we're saying the same thing but you may have stated it better than I. There's no doubt that changes in air pressure to affect the compression damping results you get from a Shockwiz. But as you stated, you're not truly changing the damping at all. As I mentioned, it's all theoretical.

Actually, I think that is opposite of what you'd want to do possibly. First of all, HSC & LSC isn't a function of air can pressure. It's how fast or slow your suspension can move which is controlled by your damper system. Now to discuss how air pressure theoretically could somewhat affect HSC. Imagine a shock or fork with low air pressure. You could push fast and hard and make it move through its travel quickly, hence HSC or high speed compression. Add more pressure and you won't be able to move it as fast. If you want to try to compromise because your shock doesn't have separate compression knobs, I'd say ADD a spacer and drop pressure instead of the other way around. Actually, I just did this same thing this afternoon in attempt to soften my HSC and LSC. I've yet to get home to analyze the data but I broke my PR on the ugly rocky downhill section. The rear felt very active and planted after adding two more tuning bands to both positive and negative chambers and dropping the air can 15psi.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

chris9888 said:


> Finally got my Shockwiz!
> 
> Going to tune my X2 tmr
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You've probably already checked this but make sure that you have the zip ties set where they won't interfere with the reservoir. They would not clear on mine.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

tuckerjt07 said:


> You've probably already checked this but make sure that you have the zip ties set where they won't interfere with the reservoir. They would not clear on mine.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Thanks mate. All good when deflated the X2 and compressed it fully during calibration. The cable ties did not get in the way.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Did 3 runs on my usual trails and max out the softer end of my X2 HSC. The Shockwiz still shows RED on HSC! According to Shockwiz website, I am probably too light and the Factory tune X2 is on the firm side. My total weight is about 150 lbs. I have the habit of riding off saddle and tend to float over rocks and roots. Any advise what should I do next before getting someone to tune my X2? Thanks!

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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

chris9888 said:


> Did 3 runs on my usual trails and max out the softer end of my X2 HSC. The Shockwiz still shows RED on HSC! According to Shockwiz website, I am probably too light and the Factory tune X2 is on the firm side. My total weight is about 150 lbs. I have the habit of riding off saddle and tend to float over rocks and roots. Any advise what should I do next before getting someone to tune my X2? Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


How many spacers are in it? Maybe look at that...

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Did you take any big jumps or attempt to use all the travel on some big hits? I see you have 0 deep compression events. Maybe because of this it's saying to soften up the HSC? Just guessing, I really have no idea... 

I'll be tuning my X2 soon hopefully... still working on my fork.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> Did you take any big jumps or attempt to use all the travel on some big hits? I see you have 0 deep compression events. Maybe because of this it's saying to soften up the HSC? Just guessing, I really have no idea...
> 
> I'll be tuning my X2 soon hopefully... still working on my fork.


I've yet to have any deep compression events detected and wondering exactly what that takes. I've nearly pushed the O-ring off, 0 deep compressions.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Yes I find exactly the same issue with deep compression 0 readings but have tested with shock set really soft. i wonder if I should maybe remove spacers in the X2. Although I dont even know for sure if there are any in it but presume there would be


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I say, ignore deep compression events. They're not part of the tune suggestions.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Has anyone updated their firmware and noticed any big changes?

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

yeti575inCA said:


> How many spacers are in it? Maybe look at that...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


2 spacers in it. Wonder if I should solve the HSC issue first before removing one spacer from the X2 as suggested.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Did you take any big jumps or attempt to use all the travel on some big hits? I see you have 0 deep compression events. Maybe because of this it's saying to soften up the HSC? Just guessing, I really have no idea...
> 
> I'll be tuning my X2 soon hopefully... still working on my fork.


No big jump, just few foot drop

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I say, ignore deep compression events. They're not part of the tune suggestions.


Agree

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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

Maybe obvious, but how do I know the designed *compression ratio* for my Fox Float DPS on my SB4.5 without doing the manual measurement?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Has anyone updated their firmware and noticed any big changes?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I know that I read a post or two where users said they were scoring in the 90's but after updating to the 4.0 firmware that came out last week, their scores dropped into the 80's. The same thing happened to me and it seems to hinge mostly around HSC/LSC compression as they're the only things that have consistently been off. That is, if you ignore the fact that I didn't use most of my travel a few times and each time that happened the Shockwiz suggested removing bottom out resistance. I'm opting to ignore that as I've come close to bottoming it out a few times at the pressures I've been testing. It's just some times I ride smoother than others.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> 2 spacers in it. Wonder if I should solve the HSC issue first before removing one spacer from the X2 as suggested.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The manual and I think a page on the Shockwiz website says to solve each issue from top to bottom in order. Don't jump down and worry about spacers until you've done all you can do to correct HSC/LSC issues. Here's a copy/paste out of the manual:

"Make each suggested adjustment, as is available, to
your suspension in the order listed in Suggestions.
Move on to the next adjustment when the previous
Suggestion indicates 'OK' after each ride Session.
If Air Spring Ramp is adjusted, you must complete the
Calibration process again.
If Air Spring Ramp is not adjusted, Baseline Air
Pressure can be adjusted individually.
Adjust Rebound damping next, followed by High
Speed Compression and Low Speed Compression.
Repeat the entire process for each suspension
component until you are satisfied with the Shock
Tuning Score and ride quality."


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Simplemind said:


> Maybe obvious, but how do I know the designed *compression ratio* for my Fox Float DPS on my SB4.5 without doing the manual measurement?


Maybe one day users will collect enough data to create a spreadsheet, but for now you'll most likely HAVE to do the calibration wizard to get the compression ratio. Tuning bands raise the compression ratio so unless someone feeds you info on the same shock length and tuning band config, you'd be wasting your time to use their ratio. I found that each band on the positive side of my Topaz appears to change the ratio by 0.1 I started out with 1 band and using the wizard I was getting a ratio of 2.8 I dropped two more bands on the positive side and got a ratio of 3.0


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

IRBent said:


> Maybe one day users will collect enough data to create a spreadsheet, but for now you'll most likely HAVE to do the calibration wizard to get the compression ratio.


Jeez, that's way above my pay grade. I thought it would be a known value based on Fox's tuning for that particular bike suspension. Only having gone thru the manual calibration a couple of times, and getting different values, it seemed like a rather crude way of getting the comp ratio...no?


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Questions:
1. Should the Rebound and LSC be adjusted at the same time before start a new session?

2. If not, should the Rebound be adjusted first and make sure the indicator becomes green before proceed to tune LSC?

3. My Fox X2 has HSR and LSR, which should be adjusted if Shockwiz suggest Rebound adjustment?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Simplemind said:


> Jeez, that's way above my pay grade. I thought it would be a known value based on Fox's tuning for that particular bike suspension. Only having gone thru the manual calibration a couple of times, and getting different values, it seemed like a rather crude way of getting the comp ratio...no?


When hours at the beginning of the cal process, make sure after you let all the air out to cycle the shock several good times, nice and slow, to allow the chambers to equalize. Then check to see if you can release any more air before starting the process. Near the end when it tells you to air the shock up to recommended pressure, do it in small increments, cycling the shock again to equalize the pressure. Don't proceed with the next cal step until you're up to the pressure you plan to ride at. The hardest part for me is the next step where it asks you to compress the fully pressurized shock to at least 50% and fully extend it. I've been mounting and bouncing really hard and hoping I get close to full extension. My compression ratio has been consistent at 2.8 but did change after putting tuning bands in.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Questions:
> 1. Should the Rebound and LSC be adjusted at the same time before start a new session?
> 
> 2. If not, should the Rebound be adjusted first and make sure the indicator becomes green before proceed to tune LSC?
> ...


Always work your way down, solving each as you come to them. The LSC suggestion seems to be something the Shockwiz tells everybody to soften. If you have knobs to adjust that, great. Otherwise I've yet to find an easy solution outside of shim stack adjustment. As for bottom out resistance, it seems to give me the same answer if I don't air it out and use just about all of my travel. Sunday's test loop left me maybe 5mm before my O-ring came off or I bottomed out. Shockwiz liked that. Yesterday's run was a bit smoother, I stayed low and dropped my air time a bit, scored a higher overall tune score but had maybe 8-10mm of travel left on the shock. Shockwiz suggested removing bottom out resistance. So, I'm going to ignore that last suggestion knowing some times I may need that last little bit of travel.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> My compression ratio has been consistent at 2.8 but did change after putting tuning bands in.


Yes, my X2 compression ratio change from 2.4 to 2.3 after removing one spacer.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Always work your way down, solving each as you come to them. The LSC suggestion seems to be something the Shockwiz tells everybody to soften. If you have knobs to adjust that, great. Otherwise I've yet to find an easy solution outside of shim stack adjustment. As for bottom out resistance, it seems to give me the same answer if I don't air it out and use just about all of my travel. Sunday's test loop left me maybe 5mm before my O-ring came off or I bottomed out. Shockwiz liked that. Yesterday's run was a bit smoother, I stayed low and dropped my air time a bit, scored a higher overall tune score but had maybe 8-10mm of travel left on the shock. Shockwiz suggested removing bottom out resistance. So, I'm going to ignore that last suggestion knowing some times I may need that last little bit of travel.


Working down the order one at a time...hell lots of run to ride!

Yes, Shockwiz seems to prefer softer side even though I chose the Balanced Style. Dropped the pressure from 160psi (recommended by Fox) to 140psi (suggested by Shockwiz), have to say the ride feel so much better. The ride was so plush that Shockwiz keep recommending me to ride rock garden although I have been riding it many times. Before the adjustment, Shockwiz did not recommend me to ride rock garden (I have been riding the same trails).

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Working down the order one at a time...hell lots of run to ride!
> 
> Yes, Shockwiz seems to prefer softer side even though I chose the Balanced Style. Dropped the pressure from 160psi (recommended by Fox) to 140psi (suggested by Shockwiz), have to say the ride feel so much better. The ride was so plush that Shockwiz keep recommending me to ride rock garden although I have been riding it many times. Before the adjustment, Shockwiz did not recommend me to ride rock garden (I have been riding the same trails).
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Come to think of it, I've been seeing the same. My test loop is a mile fire road uphill, then a tech climb. At the end of the tech climb Shockwiz used to ask for rocky terrain. After I bombed back down the tech rocky stuff it was happy but asking for big jumps. That's when I'd hit my flow trail. Now that I've softened things up it's asking for big jumps at the top of my tech climb. It's still asking for big jumps after bombing back down the rocky section though. Either way, I've been getting results with 100% confidence. I've yet to get a score better than 88 after the rocky downhill.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Come to think of it, I've been seeing the same. My test loop is a mile fire road uphill, then a tech climb. At the end of the tech climb Shockwiz used to ask for rocky terrain. After I bombed back down the tech rocky stuff it was happy but asking for big jumps. That's when I'd hit my flow trail. Now that I've softened things up it's asking for big jumps at the top of my tech climb. It's still asking for big jumps after bombing back down the rocky section though. Either way, I've been getting results with 100% confidence. I've yet to get a score better than 88 after the rocky downhill.


If you are tuning for both big jumps and rock gardens that is not a surprising score. All of suspension tuning is a compromise as those two have drastically different optimum setups.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> If you are tuning for both big jumps and rock gardens that is not a surprising score. All of suspension tuning is a compromise as those two have drastically different optimum setups.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


I'm not really tuning for both, just taking screenshots of the data after both sessions. I've put the results in a spreadsheet and can analyze the data to better understand how a change affects both ends. My main goal was to smooth out the rough stuff. I'm betting if I get my shock to a point that Shockwiz loves my rocky stuff, it will also ask me to firm things up for the big jumps.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

*ShockWiz Rentals at FeelTheBerm.com*



IRBent said:


> Maybe one day users will collect enough data to create a spreadsheet, but for now you'll most likely HAVE to do the calibration wizard to get the compression ratio.


I'm actually trying to gather data from my users to do just this. I think it would be a great resource, even just to know you are in the right ballpark with your compression ratio and settings for your bike/rider setup and tuning style.

If anyone wants to contribute, feel free to fill in my form. I'll post back once I have something usable up.

ShockWiz Setup and Results Survey

UPDATE: I have now posted a rough database of the results I've collected so far (not many!). So if you have results, please add your results!

Check out the tuning results database



Simplemind said:


> Where is the best place to rent a Shockwiz?


Rent from me!  I ship nationwide and have several units available. Plus 7-day rentals for TWO (2) devices so you can tune both your front and rear at the same time and make sure you have enough time to dial it in.

Reserve a set at www.FeelTheBerm.com


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

If its any use to anyone else, I've just set up a 160mm 2016 27.5" non boost Pike with no tokens and got a compression ratio of 2.5.

Either other people got similar or I've ballsed it up and people will tell me.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

onzadog said:


> If its any use to anyone else, I've just set up a 160mm 2016 27.5" non boost Pike with no tokens and got a compression ratio of 2.5.
> 
> Either other people got similar or I've ballsed it up and people will tell me.


FWIW, I've got a 2014 160mm Pike Solo Air, no tokens, but with Vorsprung Luftkappe and got 2.7.

Edit: Oops, I had the CR swapped with my shock, so the actual CR for my Solo Air Pike w/Luftkappe was 2.9.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

bryanus said:


> I'm actually trying to gather data from my users to do just this. I think it would be a great resource, even just to know you are in the right ballpark with your compression ratio and settings for your bike/rider setup and tuning style.
> 
> If anyone wants to contribute, feel free to fill in my form. I'll post back once I have something usable up.
> 
> ...


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

IRBent said:


> ShockWiz Setup and Results Survey
> 
> I think there's a minor flaw in your data gathering tool. The online form requires you to go through the fork settings to get to what I'd assume will be the shock settings. I've yet to use the Shockwiz on the fork which means I can't help you with the shock either. You might want to separate the two, one link for fork and another for the shock.


Thanks, Bent. I removed the required fields and now you can just skip through to get to the Shock part. Let me know if you think I should add any more fields or if you have any other suggestions for useful data to collect. Thanks again!


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Finally got my Fox X2 tuned.










































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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Got my Fox 34 Fork tuned too!










































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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

I got a MY17 Hightower S build. I'm already starting to have shock envy reading about these nice upgrades but I just don't have the money to spring for one at the moment. I'm wondering if renting a Shockwiz will have some real benefits for me.

This will be my first bike where I'm really trying to tune things and get every unit of performance I can out of the bike and at this point, after all the reading I've done, I understand what to do but I just don't know what should feel right and what should feel wrong.

I can rent it for 100 bucks for a week and a buddy of mine are considering just splitting the rental so it would be 50 each. 

Will I be able to get the bike feeling tip top even though my Pike and Monarch are at the lower end of the Pike and Monarch hierarchy and don't have as much adjustability as the higher tier models?


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

chris9888 said:


> Finally got my Fox X2 tuned.





chris9888 said:


> Got my Fox 34 Fork tuned too!


Good work, and thanks for all your posts!


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

sternomac said:


> I got a MY17 Hightower S build. I'm already starting to have shock envy reading about these nice upgrades but I just don't have the money to spring for one at the moment. I'm wondering if renting a Shockwiz will have some real benefits for me.
> 
> This will be my first bike where I'm really trying to tune things and get every unit of performance I can out of the bike and at this point, after all the reading I've done, I understand what to do but I just don't know what should feel right and what should feel wrong.
> 
> ...


Maybe? I hated the Monarch and went with the Float X2. I am 200lbs geared up so I think that was part of the issue. The Pike I actually liked until I switched out the shock and now it is under gunned. The Shockwiz might help you reach a good compromise on the Monarch though and the Pike should be able to be dialed in pretty closely.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

sternomac said:


> I got a MY17 Hightower S build. I'm already starting to have shock envy reading about these nice upgrades but I just don't have the money to spring for one at the moment. I'm wondering if renting a Shockwiz will have some real benefits for me.
> 
> This will be my first bike where I'm really trying to tune things and get every unit of performance I can out of the bike and at this point, after all the reading I've done, I understand what to do but I just don't know what should feel right and what should feel wrong.
> 
> ...


Tucker may have a point. I think it will be unrealistic to expect a Shockwiz will be able to tune your suspension in a few days, especially if you know nothing about suspension tuning or what feels right vs what feels wrong. I think you'd be better off asking people on the Hightower, Pike and Monarch forums about their weight, riding style, trails and suspension setups. Then work off their tunes to find what you think feels best to you on the trails you ride. Only then would I consider renting a Shockwiz, otherwise you'll be overwhelmed and under the gun to get it dialed in a few days. I've spent weeks with my Shockwiz so far and while my personal feel netted me a tune score of 92, followed by my first Shockwiz results helping me achieve a score of 96, I've yet to settle in on what I think is the best compromise. Remember, suspension tuning is more than just a score. While 96 felt good overall, my rocky rooted sections were not as smooth as I wanted them. So I started monitoring Shockwiz results for that section along with final results and then comparing both to total times per Strava. I'm back up to a score of 92 and my rocky rooted sections are feeling super plush. For me it's been a slow and methodical approach, taking notes and putting everything down from the Shockwiz for each run so I could compare results prior to making adjustments. For what it's worth, I'm on a s build Bronson from 2015 and like Tucker said, my Pike was awesome until I changed out my rear shock to a DVO Topaz. The buttery smooth shock forced me to drop a Vorsprung Luftkappe in my Pike, the Pike I've yet to even connect the Shockwiz to after weeks of testing. So, no 3-4 for days of Shockwiz work won't tune both ends without a lot of knowledge up front.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Maybe? I hated the Monarch and went with the Float X2. I am 200lbs geared up so I think that was part of the issue. The Pike I actually liked until I switched out the shock and now it is under gunned. The Shockwiz might help you reach a good compromise on the Monarch though and the Pike should be able to be dialed in pretty closely.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk





IRBent said:


> Tucker may have a point. I think it will be unrealistic to expect a Shockwiz will be able to tune your suspension in a few days, especially if you know nothing about suspension tuning or what feels right vs what feels wrong. I think you'd be better off asking people on the Hightower, Pike and Monarch forums about their weight, riding style, trails and suspension setups. Then work off their tunes to find what you think feels best to you on the trails you ride. Only then would I consider renting a Shockwiz, otherwise you'll be overwhelmed and under the gun to get it dialed in a few days. I've spent weeks with my Shockwiz so far and while my personal feel netted me a tune score of 92, followed by my first Shockwiz results helping me achieve a score of 96, I've yet to settle in on what I think is the best compromise. Remember, suspension tuning is more than just a score. While 96 felt good overall, my rocky rooted sections were not as smooth as I wanted them. So I started monitoring Shockwiz results for that section along with final results and then comparing both to total times per Strava. I'm back up to a score of 92 and my rocky rooted sections are feeling super plush. For me it's been a slow and methodical approach, taking notes and putting everything down from the Shockwiz for each run so I could compare results prior to making adjustments. For what it's worth, I'm on a s build Bronson from 2015 and like Tucker said, my Pike was awesome until I changed out my rear shock to a DVO Topaz. The buttery smooth shock forced me to drop a Vorsprung Luftkappe in my Pike, the Pike I've yet to even connect the Shockwiz to after weeks of testing. So, no 3-4 for days of Shockwiz work won't tune both ends without a lot of knowledge up front.


Thanks to both of you for your input. Would this be a fair statement?

If I hook up the Shockwiz and get a pretty decent score based on my settings as I have them now, I would feel better with the knowledge that I at least part way know what I'm doing and I got it close just based on feel. Now I have a little more confidence in knowing what I'm feeling when I ride.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

sternomac said:


> Thanks to both of you for your input. Would this be a fair statement?
> 
> If I hook up the Shockwiz and get a pretty decent score based on my settings as I have them now, I would feel better with the knowledge that I at least part way know what I'm doing and I got it close just based on feel. Now I have a little more confidence in knowing what I'm feeling when I ride.


I think that's indeed a fair statement. But know the Shockwiz likes to tune for an entire ride and will offer suggestions on what to ride next to make it happy. so overall you may score well but that one section of trail can still be a pain in the arse to tune out. Once you get it tuned out odds are you will lose something elsewhere. It's all a big game of compromise with you deciding which is more important, overall score or that nagging section to your liking.


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

IRBent said:


> I think that's indeed a fair statement. But know the Shockwiz likes to tune for an entire ride and will offer suggestions on what to ride next to make it happy. so overall you may score well but that one section of trail can still be a pain in the arse to tune out. Once you get it tuned out odds are you will lose something elsewhere. It's all a big game of compromise with you deciding which is more important, overall score or that nagging section to your liking.


Ok. Most of the trails I ride are the same. Average tech...no drops higher than 2-3 feet I'd say. A little flow. A decent amount of pedaling.

I'd be aiming to get the fork and shock feeling good for that. If I were heading somewhere with large features, I would have to make adjustments but that just doesn't happen all that often at the moment.

Side note: I was glad to hear you liked the DVO. Everyone is talking Fox in the Hightower upgrade thread and they are just considerably more expensive.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Took mine out for its first play today. Not even trying to tune yet, just playing with the shockwiz. Pleased to see mostly greens, especially pressure and ramp up. Couple if ambers in the damping. Interestingly, it thinks the slow speed compression on the pike is too slow. I thought the same and it's one of the reasons I bought the shockwiz. All compression settings were at minimum though so it looks like I might need to tinker with the shim stack.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

sternomac said:


> Ok. Most of the trails I ride are the same. Average tech...no drops higher than 2-3 feet I'd say. A little flow. A decent amount of pedaling.
> 
> I'd be aiming to get the fork and shock feeling good for that. If I were heading somewhere with large features, I would have to make adjustments but that just doesn't happen all that often at the moment.
> 
> Side note: I was glad to hear you liked the DVO. Everyone is talking Fox in the Hightower upgrade thread and they are just considerably more expensive.


Sternomac,

So, you set things up for your trails, keying in on personal feel and make sure you're using practically all of your travel on those drops you mentioned. The Shockwiz can help you from there. As for the DVO vs Fox argument, the Fox indeed is more costly but also offers separate LSC/HSC and separate rebound adjustments that you won't find in the DVO Topaz. But you'll also find that no matter which shock riders are testing with the Shockwiz, they all get the same results, LSC/HSC need to be softer. so either all the manufacturers have their damping too firm or the Shockwiz has its stuff too soft. The great thing about the DVO stuff is you can call them up and they'll talk to anybody about their products, offer tech advice, and are happy to know that you are doing all of your own maintenance. You can totally rebuild the DVO Topaz with common tools as well. The only thing you need is a vice with soft jaws, an 18mm open end wrench, a maybe 2mm hex wrench and a small dental pick. In attempt to soften my LSC I've changed the stock oil out, going with the lightest weight oil made. Ronnie at DVO told me to call him when I got inside and wanted to adjust the shims. Fox wouldn't dare talk you through anything maintenance wise. They will however give you a tech manual. If you want to scare yourself, compare the full rebuild manual for the Fox X2 against the DVO Topaz. DVO has made things as simple as possible yet still very functional.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

onzadog said:


> Took mine out for its first play today. Not even trying to tune yet, just playing with the shockwiz. Pleased to see mostly greens, especially pressure and ramp up. Couple if ambers in the damping. Interestingly, it thinks the slow speed compression on the pike is too slow. I thought the same and it's one of the reasons I bought the shockwiz. All compression settings were at minimum though so it looks like I might need to tinker with the shim stack.


I've yet to try to tune my Pike. Although after swapping to the DVO Topaz rear shock I realized my Pike was probably like you found yours, a bit too firm on the LSC. I dropped in a Vorsprung Luftkappe which really made things so much more plush. I still feel like my LSC/HSC may be a bit too firm. I think i'm running 2 clicks from full open of LSC and 82psi on my 150mm fork. I weigh close to 180lbs with gear. Before the Luftkappe I ran 72-74psi to get a similar ride but had 2 tokens up top to eliminate bottoming out. I might still have 1 token inside but I think I removed it too.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Chris, On the X2 tune...

So how did the before/after feel, seat of the pants? Did you notice an improvement?


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Sternomac,
> 
> So, you set things up for your trails, keying in on personal feel and make sure you're using practically all of your travel on those drops you mentioned. The Shockwiz can help you from there. As for the DVO vs Fox argument, the Fox indeed is more costly but also offers separate LSC/HSC and separate rebound adjustments that you won't find in the DVO Topaz. But you'll also find that no matter which shock riders are testing with the Shockwiz, they all get the same results, LSC/HSC need to be softer. so either all the manufacturers have their damping too firm or the Shockwiz has its stuff too soft. The great thing about the DVO stuff is you can call them up and they'll talk to anybody about their products, offer tech advice, and are happy to know that you are doing all of your own maintenance. You can totally rebuild the DVO Topaz with common tools as well. The only thing you need is a vice with soft jaws, an 18mm open end wrench, a maybe 2mm hex wrench and a small dental pick. In attempt to soften my LSC I've changed the stock oil out, going with the lightest weight oil made. Ronnie at DVO told me to call him when I got inside and wanted to adjust the shims. Fox wouldn't dare talk you through anything maintenance wise. They will however give you a tech manual. If you want to scare yourself, compare the full rebuild manual for the Fox X2 against the DVO Topaz. DVO has made things as simple as possible yet still very functional.


They are also coming out with a Float X2 competitor in the near future. That's something I will be very interested in unless I have pulled the trigger on a Rallon by that point.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> They are also coming out with a Float X2 competitor in the near future. That's something I will be very interested in unless I have pulled the trigger on a Rallon by that point.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


DVO is coming out with an X2 competitor? For real? I've yet to hear about that. Might be time to start saving up. LOL


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## Steezus (Jul 25, 2007)

IRBent said:


> Sternomac,
> 
> So, you set things up for your trails, keying in on personal feel and make sure you're using practically all of your travel on those drops you mentioned. The Shockwiz can help you from there. As for the DVO vs Fox argument, the Fox indeed is more costly but also offers separate LSC/HSC and separate rebound adjustments that you won't find in the DVO Topaz. But you'll also find that no matter which shock riders are testing with the Shockwiz, they all get the same results, LSC/HSC need to be softer. so either all the manufacturers have their damping too firm or the Shockwiz has its stuff too soft. The great thing about the DVO stuff is you can call them up and they'll talk to anybody about their products, offer tech advice, and are happy to know that you are doing all of your own maintenance. You can totally rebuild the DVO Topaz with common tools as well. The only thing you need is a vice with soft jaws, an 18mm open end wrench, a maybe 2mm hex wrench and a small dental pick. In attempt to soften my LSC I've changed the stock oil out, going with the lightest weight oil made. Ronnie at DVO told me to call him when I got inside and wanted to adjust the shims. Fox wouldn't dare talk you through anything maintenance wise. They will however give you a tech manual. If you want to scare yourself, compare the full rebuild manual for the Fox X2 against the DVO Topaz. DVO has made things as simple as possible yet still very functional.


Fox has great guides on how to do full rebuilds accessible to anyone on their website. They are step by step pictures. You don't need special tools outside of what is usually required to work on bikes. I'm sure DVO is awesome, but while Fox might not talk you through reshimming, DVO sounds like the only company that would actually do this anyways. Fox definitely makes it easy as possible to service your suspension though. I'm not sure why people like to claim otherwise about Fox.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Steezus said:


> Fox has great guides on how to do full rebuilds accessible to anyone on their website. They are step by step pictures. You don't need special tools outside of what is usually required to work on bikes. I'm sure DVO is awesome, but while Fox might not talk you through reshimming, DVO sounds like the only company that would actually do this anyways. Fox definitely makes it easy as possible to service your suspension though. I'm not sure why people like to claim otherwise about Fox.


Do as I suggested though, compare the two manuals. For giggles I looked through the X2 full rebuild last week. Very complicated compared to the DVO Topaz. I'd assume too it takes I nitrogen charge that I bet Fox will not help you with plus takes special tools. Not knocking Fox products, just saying DVO is more user friendly and simpler.


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## Steezus (Jul 25, 2007)

Yeah I'm not sure about the manuals because the only thing I would use is a guide so I don't risk messing it up. Fox guides are simple step by step with pictures, which is quite an undertaking for a full rebuild guide. I've ordered damper upgrades over the phone and overall I just don't need to send my suspension parts to anyone, I can do it myself and I'm just learning bike mechanics as I go. 

You are right that some Fox shocks use nitrogen, but it's like $15-20 to get recharged and I've never actually needed it anyways. I usually use my shocks for 3-4 years then upgrade before that is necessary. I'm pretty sure the new DPX2 no longer uses Nitrogen, but I could be wrong. 

I am pretty interested in a Topaz, but kicking back and forth between that and the DPX2. Neither require me to send them off for maintenance, which is my top requirement really.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

sternomac said:


> I got a MY17 Hightower S build. I'm already starting to have shock envy reading about these nice upgrades but I just don't have the money to spring for one at the moment. I'm wondering if renting a Shockwiz will have some real benefits for me.
> 
> This will be my first bike where I'm really trying to tune things and get every unit of performance I can out of the bike and at this point, after all the reading I've done, I understand what to do but I just don't know what should feel right and what should feel wrong.
> 
> ...


Sternomac,
I think you would benefit from renting the shockwiz. However with splitting a week you need to definitely get 3 complete rides in a short period of time or you're wasting your time and money. The shocks on your bike are the shocks on your bike. Some will love the very same shocks on your bike that you hate. You do not need high end shocks to have a good riding and performing bike. You probably are not going to get the perfect tune that you're seeking but you can definitely walk away with knowledge of shocks and a good working tune. What I mean by that is a decent tuning score in the probably low 90's which is pretty good.

SW is simple and that's the beauty of it. Always tune from top to bottom 1. air 2. ramp 3. rebound etc... if you don't have HSC or a LSC or whatever forget about it back to rule #1 tune from top to bottom. SW has a habit of asking for a softer LSC anyway.

Plan your ride and do the same trail each time it should be the roughest you ride regularly. SW always wants to see rock garden, climbing, descending if you have a trail that has all of those you're in business.

You sound enthusiastic about the bike and using a SW go for it if you can get those 3 rides in.

I loved my monarch on my Bucksaw so much that I replaced the fox float on my Camber with another monarch.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> DVO is coming out with an X2 competitor? For real? I've yet to hear about that. Might be time to start saving up. LOL


It's in their AMA on Pinkbike

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Chris, On the X2 tune...
> 
> So how did the before/after feel, seat of the pants? Did you notice an improvement?


I noticed almost all the X2 travel has been used ( rubber ring almost reached the end). The new setting makes the ride very plush and well controlled, especially rock garden, drop and downhill berm. The climb was not compromised. In fact, I ride better on rocky climb. Super thrilled!

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*New Shockwiz Software Update*

Just in, Shockwiz software update.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> I noticed almost all the X2 travel has been used ( rubber ring almost reached the end). The new setting makes the ride very plush and well controlled, especially rock garden, drop and downhill berm. The climb was not compromised. In fact, I ride better on rocky climb. Super thrilled!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I assume this means you had a better tune store too?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Is nitrogen really necessary? Its suppose to be cleaner and lack moisture but seems overkill though. I dont know, probably a worthwhile research topic.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I assume this means you had a better tune store too?


Yes, tune score 96%. Confidence 100%

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Yes, 96%
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sweet. That makes it all worth it when it feels great and the Shockwiz agrees.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*DVO Topaz Final Tune?*

On today's run I was able to net a total ride score of 96 with the rocky section coming in at 92, both at 100% confidence. I'm not sure I can get it any better.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> On today's run I was able to net a total ride score of 96 with the rocky section coming in at 92, both at 100% confidence. I'm not sure I can get it any better.
> View attachment 1148806


Nice! How come your Statistic more details than mine? Upgrade firmware?

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Nice! How come your Statistic more details than mine? Upgrade firmware?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Look back a few posts earlier today. Not firmware, new software update. Go to Google Play or Apple's software site.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Got it, thanks!


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## sternomac (Jun 7, 2013)

VladConnery said:


> Sternomac,
> I think you would benefit from renting the shockwiz. However with splitting a week you need to definitely get 3 complete rides in a short period of time or you're wasting your time and money. The shocks on your bike are the shocks on your bike. Some will love the very same shocks on your bike that you hate. You do not need high end shocks to have a good riding and performing bike. You probably are not going to get the perfect tune that you're seeking but you can definitely walk away with knowledge of shocks and a good working tune. What I mean by that is a decent tuning score in the probably low 90's which is pretty good.
> 
> SW is simple and that's the beauty of it. Always tune from top to bottom 1. air 2. ramp 3. rebound etc... if you don't have HSC or a LSC or whatever forget about it back to rule #1 tune from top to bottom. SW has a habit of asking for a softer LSC anyway.
> ...


Great input. Thanks a lot! I think I'm going to go for it.


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## VanillaEps (Aug 24, 2010)

I picked one of these up at my LBS. First one at the shop to purchase one. They're eager to get my feedback on these. 

Rode twice with it attached to my Float X on rocky, rooty trails. Thought it was the perfect set of trails to have the Shockwiz provide information. After the two runs I was sort of perplexed with the lack of information and figured I needed more mileage......and then I realized I neglected to calibrate the device before riding. 

Took some time to calibrate the device last night and now I'm trying to decide where to run it to make sure I get a good mix of rocks, roots, climbs, and descents.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

As suggested by Shockwiz, added one more volume spacer onto my Fork. Now my fork has 3 spacers. Compression ratio changed from 1.8 to 2.7. The landing impact has become more controlled. Finally got the Air Spring Ramp Green. Unable to adjust HSC as my fork does not come with compression adjustment. For now, live with it and wait for my new 2018 Fox Factory Series Fork. Look forward to tune it again


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

It seems that the Shockwiz has a thing against HSC. Most everybody gets that same result, yellow softening needed.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Agree with you IRBent. Let's see if my new 2018 Fox Factory Series fork has the same issue.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Agree with you IRBent. Let's see if my new 2018 Fox Factory Series fork has the same issue.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've yet to connect the Shockwiz to my Pike with a Vorsprung Luftkappe installed. But I've learned a thing or two about the Shockwiz in general. My goal was to tune my suspension to handle the rough stuff and the larger drops on my trail. While netting scores of 92&96 respectively in the playful setting, scores thoroughly suck on the tame trails. However, if I do my run and get sucky results for tame trails in playful, then flip it to the efficient tune style, I get 92 rather than 80 on the playful mode. In other words, I think I'm doing well. Efficiency on the light stuff and high scores on the ugly. I'm not sure what else I could ask for. Mind you, this is for my rear shock alone as l mentioned previously that I've yet to start looking at my fork.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

*ShockWiz Tuning Results Database*

Hey guys, I wanted to let you know that I've posted the ShockWiz tuning data I've collected from other riders so far. There aren't many yet, but hopefully others will contribute their results and the database will become a more usable reference.

Check out the tuning results database!

If anyone wants to contribute, feel free to fill in my form.

ShockWiz Setup and Results Survey


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Simple question here...

If the only thing you change is fork pressure do you need to repeat the shockwiz calibration again or can you just reset the baseline pressure and start a new session?

Thanks

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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

Reset baseline and start new session. 

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## gfourth (Apr 12, 2009)

Any one tune for a digressive shock? (re:aktiv on my Fuel EX). I'm debating on renting and not sure how I should go about tuning with the shock wiz. Would I tune with the shock completely open even though I plan on riding in medium/trail 90% of the time?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

gfourth said:


> Any one tune for a digressive shock? (re:aktiv on my Fuel EX). I'm debating on renting and not sure how I should go about tuning with the shock wiz. Would I tune with the shock completely open even though I plan on riding in medium/trail 90% of the time?


you can't use the wiz on that shock. On DRCV shocks the compression ratio changes during the stroke.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

gfourth said:


> Any one tune for a digressive shock? (re:aktiv on my Fuel EX). I'm debating on renting and not sure how I should go about tuning with the shock wiz. Would I tune with the shock completely open even though I plan on riding in medium/trail 90% of the time?


AFAIK, ShockWiz should always be tuned in the fully open position, and you shouldn't change the compression at any point during your ride, either.

For your specific shock, you may want to contact Quarq directly. They usually respond within a day:

[email protected]


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gfourth said:


> Any one tune for a digressive shock? (re:aktiv on my Fuel EX). I'm debating on renting and not sure how I should go about tuning with the shock wiz. Would I tune with the shock completely open even though I plan on riding in medium/trail 90% of the time?


As others have said, the Shockwiz won't work with some shocks on Trek bikes. See the Shockwiz compatibility list in the link below:

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/227843747-Known-incompatibility-list


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## gfourth (Apr 12, 2009)

My re:aktiv shock isn't DRCV. It loooks like it's compatible. Thanks guys

Edit: also I'd like to experiment with a playful or aggressive tune and then running the shock on medium. The idea being I'd have a firm pedaling platform but the shock would use full travel once opened up. Just an idea


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## VanillaEps (Aug 24, 2010)

Rode with the Shockwiz for about 15 miles and got a shock tuning score of 84. Its suggesting adding baseline air pressure, adding spacers, making HSC and LSC firmer. 

From what I've read, you should attack the first suggestion before anything else. So, if the SW is suggesting I add more air to the shock, are people adding air in 5 PSI increments? or 10?

Also, if I'm adding air pressure Fox suggests I also increase the rebound dampening. For SW tuning, so I should be adding air pressure and leave rebound alone and just see what the tuning score is on the next session?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

VanillaEps said:


> Rode with the Shockwiz for about 15 miles and got a shock tuning score of 84. Its suggesting adding baseline air pressure, adding spacers, making HSC and LSC firmer.
> 
> From what I've read, you should attack the first suggestion before anything else. So, if the SW is suggesting I add more air to the shock, are people adding air in 5 PSI increments? or 10?
> 
> Also, if I'm adding air pressure Fox suggests I also increase the rebound dampening. For SW tuning, so I should be adding air pressure and leave rebound alone and just see that the tuning score is on the next session.


Yeah, work your way down, top to bottom handling each separately as like you mentioned, sometimes one effects the other. More pressure requires more rebound damping. Find yourself a short 30 minute ride that covers everything, unless you prefer tuning for a specific type trail. For instance. My biggest complaint was that my shock was a bit harsh on rocky sections. So I tuned for plush rock gardens in the playful mode and scored 92, while scoring 96 with the same tune on bigger jumps. But riding smooth trails with the same tune nets a stinking 80 in the playful mode. However switch it to the efficient mode and that same 80 becomes a 92. So bottom line, riding long rides over varying terrain will net you varying results. I like my plush rocky trail score of 92 and also like the idea that I get an efficient score of 92 on smooth trails. I think you can't tune for all conditions and have a good score in a single mode setting.


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## VanillaEps (Aug 24, 2010)

Actually, I think I'm confused with how to read the suggestions. 








I read the above as I need to move the indicator to the right and that means adding more air. Does the above actually read that since the indicator is on the remove air side that it's suggesting I remove air?

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

VanillaEps said:


> Actually, I think I'm confused with how to read the suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Backwards. Do as it says, "Remove Air" to move the slider to the right. You can click the arrow pointer to the right of each suggestion to get tech hints on what to do.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

I've had a go with the Shockwiz and would say that you should follow the calibration routine as per the app instructions.. I definitely would not be compressing the fork or shock to try and release more air... as long as you can physically fully compress and extend your fork/shock for its irrelevant what the initial pressure is and taking it too low and negative could cause errors (division by zero etc). Personally I'd leave 1-2 psi in there at least, the calibration process takes into account equalising the +ve & -ve chambers anyway.

I think its simply using P1V1 = P2V2 ==> P1/P2 = V2/V1 hence its calculating the compression ratio (Volume ratio V2/V1) from pressures as its equivalent to volumes.

I've only had a little time with it but it's instantly obvious to me that chasing 100 % is pointless even on the same trail due to variable rider input. I'd say it's a tool to get you close then you can tweak to what feels right and monitor those changes with measurable effects.. I certainly won't be keep something in the green if it doesn't feel good and would say i'd be happy with anything from 80-90 for my baseline local trail and some different settings for an uplift day.

Also not to sure how useful a spreadsheet of CRs and settings is other than for comparisons/interest .. I certainly wouldn't use any of the values or settings from someone else even with identical forks and definitely not for the shock. The calibration process is simple and quick so why assume 2X forks/shocks of the same make/model have identical internal volumes.. yeah they should they may not have even considering volume spacers so with such a quick and simple calibration process i'd say just do it.
So could someone who has not got a SW use a spreadsheet to dial in their fork/shock.. possibly but unlikely IMO... even Fox can't do that but just put it somewhere close for the average rider.

One thing I did have an issue with is the Shockwiz isn't compatible with my Syncros 1.0 Digital pump. Pump works fine on all my forks and shocks but leaks air when connected to the Shockwiz.. an old Giro and Fox pump work fine however. Anyone else had this issue or is it just my pump?

I don't think it's a tool that you can set up your shock/fork in an afternoon unless you put in some serious leg work. Long term rental or buying IMO due to the incremental nature of the tune changes (Ride .. change one thing only then ride again.. I'd say don't be tempted to try and shortcut and do a few things simultaneously).

Overall really impressed with the SW, very clever simply using rate of change of pressure changes to infer shock tune.. really cool. The app could use some work and a little birdy tells me SW are looking into allowing you to save/store data instead of the slightly awkward screen shot method.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone selling a used Shockwiz or know where I can find one cheaper than full price? I have one but a 2nd would be useful so I can tune front and rear suspension at the same time. I just don't have the funds for another brand new one right now.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*Shockwiz - Lessons Learned After 1 Month of Use*

I'm with RocketMagnet, this tool is not a one time use tool that will make everything perfect in a day or even a weekend. The algorithm and use of the Shockwiz is a bit complex and it will take some working knowledge of both the Shockwiz and suspension tuning to get either end close to a proper and balanced tune. By balanced, I mean a compromise tune that can do well under all trail types but you may have to loose a bit on either end of the spectrum to gain on the opposite end.

When I got my Shockwiz I assumed a few rides and all would be well. But I noticed the same trail, the same tune, the same pressures, etc. all could net varying scores. One day I'd get a final score of 92 at the end of my ride, the next day I'd get a 96. While I was happy with both scores I was still getting suggestions to make things better. I eventually tweaked things until I was getting a score of 92 on the ugliest rocky section followed by a score of 96 on the biggest jumps. I was running the rocky section and tuning for the playful mode, taking screenshots, then moving on during the same session and taking on the bigger jumps using the same playful mode. However that very same tune I was using on the ugly rocky sections and big jumps truly sucked if I rode a smooth trail and looked at the results in the playful mode. I found that when I looked at my scores after riding a smooth trail, high 70's or maybe even 80 was as good as it got in the playful mode. But if I looked at those same test runs under the Efficient setting my scores would jump up into the 90's. So I think I've found a balance where I've gotten the ugly trails smoothed out but when riding the easy trails I still score high on the efficient tune mode.

Here's what I've learned:

1. It seems when tuning in playful mode, the Shockwiz is only happy if you're using all of your travel and everything is super plush. Otherwise you'll have low scores. Expect it to scream that High Speed Compression needs to be softer, at least that's what most here have posted and I found to be true on my end.
2. You can select a single tune style and get a great score for any given trail type.
3. You will not get high scores under any single one of the 4 given tune modes while riding trails of varying terrain. You need to use only one tuning mode for a given trail type.
4. Finding a good balance between high scores on one trail type, while still getting high scores on another trail type is possible, but only if looking at data from two different tune modes for the two different trail types.
5. Yes, lesson 2 - 4 say similar things, but it is the key to making the most of your Shockwiz tune.
6. How do you accomplish this? Pick the one trail type, preferably something really rough, that your suspension seems to be suffering the most on and try to tune to correct that issue. Then hope the correction doesn't ruin the feeling of other trail types.
7. Once you've tuned to correct your worst trail, ride an easier trail and see how the tune for the easier trail scores in a balanced or efficient tune setting, especially if you were tuning in the playful or aggressive modes on your worst trail.
8. Tuning is a balancing act where you're trying to get the most out of your suspension for all type trails. Otherwise you'll have to develop individual tunes for every trail you ride and keep a log so you'll know how to tune your suspension for each ride. Way too much work. Finding a balance/compromise is the best option.
9. It seems the Shockwiz may prefer dynamic sag results closer to 30%. At least the closer I got to 30% the higher my overall scores were.


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## sbonvallet (Jan 31, 2011)

I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to adjusting my shock beyond sag. I have a Fox 32 Float Fit4 120 mm shock on a 27.5 RM Thunderbolt. I weigh 165#. I don't know how to post the screen shots but bottom line I am consistently getting the suggestion of adding spacers (in yellow) and the HSC always being to the far left in red despite the fact that my fork is cranked down as firm as it can go. Because of this I distrust the data and am hesitant to add spacers which I have never done before (looks easy). Would this improve the HSC values noting I understand making adjustments from top to bottom.
SB


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

sbonvallet said:


> I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to adjusting my shock beyond sag. I have a Fox 32 Float Fit4 120 mm shock on a 27.5 RM Thunderbolt. I weigh 165#. I don't know how to post the screen shots but bottom line I am consistently getting the suggestion of adding spacers (in yellow) and the HSC always being to the far left in red despite the fact that my fork is cranked down as firm as it can go. Because of this I distrust the data and am hesitant to add spacers which I have never done before (looks easy). Would this improve the HSC values noting I understand making adjustments from top to bottom.
> SB


Indeed do add spacers, maybe 2 and then lower pressure to keep the sag you currently use or a bit more sag. Less air will help the suspension move quicker which might help with your HSC, provided it doesn't have a knob to lower it. Then the extra spacers will keep you from bottoming out. I assume you're not bottoming out now, right?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

sbonvallet said:


> I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to adjusting my shock beyond sag. I have a Fox 32 Float Fit4 120 mm shock on a 27.5 RM Thunderbolt. I weigh 165#. I don't know how to post the screen shots but bottom line I am consistently getting the suggestion of adding spacers (in yellow) and the HSC always being to the far left in red despite the fact that my fork is cranked down as firm as it can go. Because of this I distrust the data and am hesitant to add spacers which I have never done before (looks easy). Would this improve the HSC values noting I understand making adjustments from top to bottom.
> SB


Add a spacer.

Everyone focuses on sag and it's important, but has a large range. 20-30%+. I tune by bottom out and they see where sag is. You should use 95-99% of your travel on the hardest hit on the trail. 
Once you have your air pressure set for this, check sag. If it's less than 20% add a spacer and reduce pressure. If it's more than 30% remove a spacer and increase pressure.
20% sag will give a firm efficient ride and 30% will be plush stuck to the ground.

Work your way down the suggestions and see if the HSC corrects itself.


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## MAGPIE!!! (Aug 26, 2013)

Can any one explain the minus reading on my shock travel? (2018 fox 36). The score and suggestions are all good except for needing less psi. Did about an 8 km ride of varying pedalling and descending from roots to flow trail. Apologies if the minus thing has been explained before.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

sbonvallet said:


> I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to adjusting my shock beyond sag. I have a Fox 32 Float Fit4 120 mm shock on a 27.5 RM Thunderbolt. I weigh 165#. I don't know how to post the screen shots but bottom line I am consistently getting the suggestion of adding spacers (in yellow) and the HSC always being to the far left in red despite the fact that my fork is cranked down as firm as it can go. Because of this I distrust the data and am hesitant to add spacers which I have never done before (looks easy). Would this improve the HSC values noting I understand making adjustments from top to bottom.
> SB


Do you have your HSC fully open or fully closed, clockwise vs counterclockwise. You say it's cranked down as firm as it can go and Shockwiz is to the left. Those are the opposites of each other. It's wanting softer which will move the blip back to the middle towards green.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

MAGPIE!!! said:


> An any one explain the minus reading on my shock travel? (2018 fox 36). The score and suggestions are all good except for needing less psi. Did about an 8 km ride of varying pedalling and descending from roots to flow trail. Apologies if the minus thing has been explained before.


If the minus % travel is greater than 3-4% I think the Shockwiz says you need to recalibrate.


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

VanillaEps said:


> Actually, I think I'm confused with how to read the suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yiu would remove air to move mpre to the right..

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## MAGPIE!!! (Aug 26, 2013)

Ah ok, that sucks, wish it would have told me during calibration to recalibrate! Haha


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## Dagonger (Dec 8, 2011)

If u click on each setting it will tell u what to do and approx how much adjustments..

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## sbonvallet (Jan 31, 2011)

Wow, now I feel like an idiot. My mindset was to turn towards making firmer. That should solve my problem, thank you. I will also add a spacer. Not sure why this intimidates me as the videos show it should take about 5 minutes. Really appreciate everyone's input.
SB


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

MAGPIE!!! said:


> Ah ok, that sucks, wish it would have told me during calibration to recalibrate! Haha


A couple of possibilities for the -ve Sag.

1. You lost some air from the fork - Resetting the baseline pressure may be enough to correct it or do the "quick" calibration where you manually enter the compression ratio.
2. You performed the calibration incorrectly - possibly did not fully extend the fork correctly or didn't equalise the +ve and -ve air chambers?.

The SW is telling you that the calibration is wrong but if you didn't then i'd guess you lost air somehow.. your fork is leaking or the SW wasn't on correctly or you done it by connecting a shock pump. I'd attach the SW screenshot or note the air pressure and leave it overnight and check its the same in the morning. Remember when you connect a shock pump even the really good lossless ones you'll lose some air pressure so you'd need generally to re-baseline (I'd just do the calibration but manually enter your Compression Ratio this way is really quick to account for a simple pressure change).

Setting sag on long travel slack angled bikes for forks is actually quite tricky as you need to stand and adopt the same position and not press down on the bars each time and due to the fork angle possibly overcome some slight sticktion. The SW is really great with the dynamic output in letting you see how all this stuff affects your sag instantaneously on your phone.


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## karpiel (Aug 27, 2010)

Now that ShockWiz has a high speed rebound suggestion on the new firmware update has anyone with a X2 recalibrated and found any useful differences ?


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

karpiel said:


> Now that ShockWiz has a high speed rebound suggestion on the new firmware update has anyone with a X2 recalibrated and found any useful differences ?


No I haven't re calibrated do they suggest you should?


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## karpiel (Aug 27, 2010)

mtb4190 said:


> No I haven't re calibrated do they suggest you should?


Well, you have the adjustment on the shock and the reccomendation on the SW itself so try it out and let us know ? Only curious as I hired a SW just before the new firmware update so I'm curious for myself more than anything.


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

unfortunately just blew a hub apart yesterday so my first priority to get that sorted. SW experimenting is off the table for now but when I get back into it I want to see if I can make any adjustments to get HSC out of the red in playful and balanced. I will re- calibrate and then I plan to take tokens out and add air and see what that does


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## nikon255 (Dec 27, 2015)

Adding air and taking out tokens - it should be even worse in HSC


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## mtb4190 (Dec 31, 2014)

Maybe. We will see.To be honest I am very happy with the shock at the moment, its just the red in HSC really annoys me so I will experiment just to see what happens and have a bit of fun with it. I am pretty sure I will end up going back to the setup I have now but you have to try these things right


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

nikon255 said:


> Adding air and taking out tokens - it should be even worse in HSC


Yes, I removed one volume spacer and reduced 10psi on my X2. The red HSC becomes green.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Yes, I removed one volume spacer and reduced 10psi on my X2. The red HSC becomes green.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The original suggestion was to add tokens and reduce air. By removing tokens and reducing air you essentially doubled down. By doing both, removing spacers and air, you made things move easier. The more freely your shock can move the more it will change the HSC recommendations from the Shockwiz.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Talking about pressures, you also have to consider temperature changes. A sealed shock or fork can change pressure without loss or addition of air. As temperature goes up, so does the pressure, and vice versa. Set your bike up inside an air conditioned house then go out and ride in 90+F temps and you can see the pressure registered on your Shockwiz a few psi higher than while inside the house. Bomb a long rough downhill section with jumps and the shock will heat up, increasing the pressure another psi or 2. I've also seen my digital Lezyne pump and the Shockwiz show different pressures. By that I mean, usually the Shockwiz shows 2-3 psi more than my pump. But oddly enough, the last time I changed the baseline pressure the Shockwiz was showing less pressure than my pump. The pressure sensors in the Shockwiz and our pumps are not super accurate certified gauges. All that matters is you find that tune that nets lots of green results and the highest scores and you note the pressures on the Shockwiz and pump and attempt to keep those readings the same. It's been nearly two weeks since I last changed my shock pressure and right now the Shockwiz is reporting that it's 1psi lower than two weeks ago. But I bet that 1psi may be due to it's not but 73F outside right now instead of the 90+ it was when I changed the air pressure. A few psi difference isn't a big deal but as little as 5psi indeed changes Shockwiz results for me.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> The original suggestion was to add tokens and reduce air. By removing tokens and reducing air you essentially doubled down. By doing both, removing spacers and air, you made things move easier. The more freely your shock can move the more it will change the HSC recommendations from the Shockwiz.


Absolutely. Next, going to observe if changing 140mm fork to 160mm will affect my shock setting suggestions by Shockwiz.

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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

FWIW: The force due to air pressure is insensitive to speed. Air pressure won't change the speed with which the suspension moves but rather the distance it will move. Damping depends on only speed and not displacement. It too will affect how far the suspension moves, but in response to speed. Of course net suspension behavior is a combination of these. IDK how Shockwiz deconvolves these over a given ride to make its recommendations.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Lone Rager said:


> FWIW: The force due to air pressure is insensitive to speed. Air pressure won't change the speed with which the suspension moves but rather the distance it will move. Damping depends on only speed and not displacement. It too will affect how far the suspension moves, but in response to speed. Of course net suspension behavior is a combination of these. IDK how Shockwiz deconvolves these over a given ride to make its recommendations.


I assume you like others ran into issues where the Shockwiz wanted you to soften the HSC? I changed my shock oil twice, dropping the viscosity each time and improving scores and HSC results with each successive lighter oil. But still, that didn't make the wiz happy. Lowering air pressures by adding tuning bands finally, coupled with the oil changes, did the trick. I'm sure I could have kept the stock oil and tweaked the shim stack to get the same results.


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

IRBent said:


> I'm with RocketMagnet, this tool is not a one time use tool that will make everything perfect in a day or even a weekend. The algorithm and use of the Shockwiz is a bit complex and it will take some working knowledge of both the Shockwiz and suspension tuning to get either end close to a proper and balanced tune. By balanced, I mean a compromise tune that can do well under all trail types but you may have to loose a bit on either end of the spectrum to gain on the opposite end.
> 
> When I got my Shockwiz I assumed a few rides and all would be well. But I noticed the same trail, the same tune, the same pressures, etc. all could net varying scores. One day I'd get a final score of 92 at the end of my ride, the next day I'd get a 96. While I was happy with both scores I was still getting suggestions to make things better. I eventually tweaked things until I was getting a score of 92 on the ugliest rocky section followed by a score of 96 on the biggest jumps. I was running the rocky section and tuning for the playful mode, taking screenshots, then moving on during the same session and taking on the bigger jumps using the same playful mode. However that very same tune I was using on the ugly rocky sections and big jumps truly sucked if I rode a smooth trail and looked at the results in the playful mode. I found that when I looked at my scores after riding a smooth trail, high 70's or maybe even 80 was as good as it got in the playful mode. But if I looked at those same test runs under the Efficient setting my scores would jump up into the 90's. So I think I've found a balance where I've gotten the ugly trails smoothed out but when riding the easy trails I still score high on the efficient tune mode.
> 
> ...


This post nails everything I would say about my experience of having the wiz for a couple months and playing with it constantly! I couldn't have said it any better! The best part about it for me has been everything listed above as well to educate me on how suspension works and to become more in tune with how the suspension feels when I make any adjustments. Great post, should be a sticky!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Jakeg1999 said:


> This post nails everything I would say about my experience of having the wiz for a couple months and playing with it constantly! I couldn't have said it any better! The best part about it for me has been everything listed above as well to educate me on how suspension works and to become more in tune with how the suspension feels when I make any adjustments. Great post, should be a sticky!


I'm flattered. Trust me, I too have learned a lot whole using the Shockwiz. I wish I knew more about each brand and model of suspension components out there so I could better elaborate in my attempt to help others tune their suspension. I dabbled in MX racing years ago as well as suspension tuning. But only in the last couple of years have I really started to dig deeper after picking up mountain biking. So while jakeg1999 thinks a lot of my post, I must admit I don't know near as much as I'd like to know.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Lone Rager said:


> FWIW: The force due to air pressure is insensitive to speed. Air pressure won't change the speed with which the suspension moves but rather the distance it will move. Damping depends on only speed and not displacement. It too will affect how far the suspension moves, but in response to speed. Of course net suspension behavior is a combination of these. IDK how Shockwiz deconvolves these over a given ride to make its recommendations.


That's not 100% accurate. The lower the pressure, the less resistance there will be for the shock to move against. The less resistance there is there will be a slight increase in shaft speed up until right around previous max travel. Will the difference be as marked as changing compression settings, no, but it will be there.

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## jaqkar (Apr 15, 2016)

Great thread. I am a bit confused with the open mode whilst testing thing. Lets say I wanted to test an XC bike rear shock like a FOX DPS while the shock was in Medium mode to test a efficient tune for pedaling. Can I set the tune to efficient and start a new session to test this?


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

jaqkar said:


> Great thread. I am a bit confused with the open mode whilst testing thing. Lets say I wanted to test an XC bike rear shock like a FOX DPS while the shock was in Medium mode to test a efficient tune for pedaling. Can I set the tune to efficient and start a new session to test this?


Short answer yes. Long answer modes change the rebound and compression characteristics, how much and which settings vary damper to damper, so in effect all you are really doing when selecting a mode is making changes to your compression and/or rebound settings, ultimately the same as spinning a knob.

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## jaqkar (Apr 15, 2016)

Thanks yes I understand what the lever actually does to the shock internally I was not sure of the modes efficient/balanced/playful etc. and if you could use efficient on a adjusted shock at lets say medium or pedal to test how much of a "platform" it provides.


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## sbonvallet (Jan 31, 2011)

Jakeg1999 said:


> This post nails everything I would say about my experience of having the wiz for a couple months and playing with it constantly! I couldn't have said it any better! The best part about it for me has been everything listed above as well to educate me on how suspension works and to become more in tune with how the suspension feels when I make any adjustments. Great post, should be a sticky!


I agree. There was a period of time that I thought this was simply a gadget and not of any real utility. I'm glad others have taken the time to work with it and provide feedback. IRBent is right, there is no way renting it for a weekend will be long enough to get dialed in and if you are that lucky you need to buy a lottery ticket!


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

The one thing I'd like to highlight is the fact you have something telling you what he best setting is. You have to think for yourself as well and feel what you believe the best setting is for you. The human element is very important as suspension feel is very personal so a computer telling riders this is the ideal setting wont yield the same result for everyone as everyone likes a different feel.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jaqkar said:


> Thanks yes I understand what the lever actually does to the shock internally I was not sure of the modes efficient/balanced/playful etc. and if you could use efficient on a adjusted shock at lets say medium or pedal to test how much of a "platform" it provides.


Jackar, let me expand on your question. So if I understand correctly you're more concerned with efficiency on an XC bike and maybe racing. Efficiency is indeed needed and while I tuned for ugly trails and big jumps using the Playful mode, when I rode XC type trails using the very same tune settings but told the Shockwiz to look at my tune in the Efficient mode, I still got a score of 92. So my advice would indeed be to tune for efficiency in the efficient mode with your rear shock in the middle position. Then if you had to ride rougher trails than XC, open the shock lever. My playful tune uses pretty much all of the shock on the ugly trails with the lever wide open. Still with it wide open, smoother trails only had me using half or a tad more of my shock travel. So travel used plays a part in the tune score depending on the mode. If I'd only used half of my travel on the ugly trails in the playful mode my scored would have sucked.

Edit: I must add. They recommend only tuning with the shock wide open. You may be able to find a good balance like I did even with it open.


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## sohl (Jul 3, 2016)

I have rented a shockwiz and have played around with it today. it giving me some odd result so I would like to take it of and check the pressure inside the fork (RS pike) on the fork and then but the shockwiz back again, do I need to calibrate it again in that case? 

It tells me to lower the pressure in the fork after each run, I have lower it but still get the same result.


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## jaqkar (Apr 15, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Jackar, let me expand on your question. So if I understand correctly you're more concerned with efficiency on an XC bike and maybe racing. Efficiency is indeed needed and while I tuned for ugly trails and big jumps using the Playful mode, when I rode XC type trails using the very same tune settings but told the Shockwiz to look at my tune in the Efficient mode, I still got a score of 92. So my advice would indeed be to tune for efficiency in the efficient mode with your rear shock in the middle position. Then if you had to ride rougher trails than XC, open the shock lever. My playful tune uses pretty much all of the shock on the ugly trails with the lever wide open. Still with it wide open, smoother trails only had me using half or a tad more of my shock travel. So travel used plays a part in the tune score depending on the mode. If I'd only used half of my travel on the ugly trails in the playful mode my scored would have sucked.
> 
> Edit: I must add. They recommend only tuning with the shock wide open. You may be able to find a good balance like I did even with it open.


Sounds good mate, thanks will give it a go. Another question, do you know what the check marks are in the app where it does suggestions.










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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

sbonvallet said:


> I agree. There was a period of time that I thought this was simply a gadget and not of any real utility. I'm glad others have taken the time to work with it and provide feedback. IRBent is right, there is no way renting it for a weekend will be long enough to get dialed in and if you are that lucky you need to buy a lottery ticket!


I also agree that it's tough to really get the full benefit from a weekend of use. I would say it takes a certain number of rides to wrap your head around it and dial things in and that number is different for everyone. Reading this thread and especially the post I quoted would be a huge help in preparation before a rental. While the purchase price is certainly steep and more than I wanted to pay, I do not regret it one bit. I've since sold the bike I had when I bought it and got a new FS and an HT bike and I will use it with them. I think it's a pretty good investment actually UNLESS you are a suspension wiz. If anything I really like being able to just look at my phone and I can see the exact current psi in my fork/shock. I pretty much just leave it on all the time. I think it would be great to have one for each fork and each shock, or have them built in!!!!! Certainly not a miracle tool but a very beneficial one at that!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jaqkar said:


> Sounds good mate, thanks will give it a go. Another question, do you know what the check marks are in the app where it does suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, those check marks can be clicked and it will remove them from your suggestions. That's for folks who's shock or fork don't support those options.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Jakeg1999 said:


> I also agree that it's tough to really get the full benefit from a weekend of use. I would say it takes a certain number of rides to wrap your head around it and If anything I really like being able to just look at my phone and I can see the exact current psi in my fork/shock. I pretty much just leave it on all the time. I think it would be great to have one for each fork and each shock, or have them built in!!!!! Certainly not a miracle tool but a very beneficial one at that!


 I cut some of the above quote down prior to responding, but I agree, having a Shockwiz built into your suspension components would be grand. Until it died and you found out it's an integrated part that couldn't be changed out. That would suck. Then too you'd hope if Rockshox ever opted to integrate them, not only would they be user replaceable but also only add maybe $150 to the shock/fork price.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

How are you guys handling marking the base pressure with a luftkappe installed?
Are you marking base pressure at the static sag point or are you fully extending the fork?
If I extend the fork all the way when marking the base pressure the app shows 6-8% sag without any weight on the bike, so double the suggested max of 3%


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Matt116 said:


> How are you guys handling marking the base pressure with a luftkappe installed?
> Are you marking base pressure at the static sag point or are you fully extending the fork?
> If I extend the fork all the way when marking the base pressure the app shows 6-8% sag without any weight on the bike, so double the suggested max of 3%


Matt116, while I have the Pike with Luftkapee I've yet to start using the Shockwiz on the front end. But my rear shock has a large negative chamber too. Here's what I did to lessen the impact of the negative chamber during calibration. First I let all of the air out as the cal wizard suggested. But then I slowly cycled the shock back and forth to equalize the lower negative chamber with the positive. I then made certain the pressure was as close to zero as possible and my shock was fully extended before I started the next step. By fully extended I mean, I did not allow the weight of the bike to compress the shock at all. At the end of the calibration when it asks you to fill it back up to recommended pressures, do the same. Bump up the pressure maybe 10-20psi at a time and cycle the fork to equalize. Keep up that process until you reach full running pressure. I'd love to know that once you've done this you find the fork with 0-2% sag while resting on its own weight. I know my fork sits idle at what physically looks like 0% sag but as I mentioned, I've yet to move the Shockwiz to the front.
Let me know the outcome of the calibration process.


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

Matt116 said:


> How are you guys handling marking the base pressure with a luftkappe installed?
> Are you marking base pressure at the static sag point or are you fully extending the fork?
> If I extend the fork all the way when marking the base pressure the app shows 6-8% sag without any weight on the bike, so double the suggested max of 3%


You should only extend it until you feel the equalisation dimple as thats your forks travel.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Rick Draper said:


> You should only extend it until you feel the equalisation dimple as thats your forks travel.


You might be onto something there since the Luftkappe install calls for removal of a top out bumper stopper. I do suppose that it's very possible to extend the fork beyond zero travel without the pressurized pneumatic bumper that keeps the Luftkappe from topping out. Thanks for reminding me of that as I'm sure it will be something that has to be worked around during calibration.


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

IRBent said:


> You might be onto something there since the Luftkappe install calls for removal of a top out bumper stopper. I do suppose that it's very possible to extend the fork beyond zero travel without the pressurized pneumatic bumper that keeps the Luftkappe from topping out. Thanks for reminding me of that as I'm sure it will be something that has to be worked around during calibration.


It does as otherwise you don't get a true consistent compression ratio. Likewise when you fill it with air you will over extend the fork, before you hit set air pressure you have to be sure to have balanced the air chambers.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Rick Draper said:


> It does as otherwise you don't get a true consistent compression ratio. Likewise when you fill it with air you will over extend the fork, before you hit set air pressure you have to be sure to have balanced the air chambers.


Also if you don't equalize the negative chamber properly, the fork will ride like crap. Speaking from ignorance, I mean, experience.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

Rick Draper said:


> You should only extend it until you feel the equalisation dimple as thats your forks travel.


So your saying when marking the base air pressure only extend the fork to the dimple?
I can't tell where the dimple is once I have the fork at full pressure and equalized. I can hear and feel it when pumping up/equalizing the fork though.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

IRBent said:


> Also if you don't equalize the negative chamber properly, the fork will ride like crap. Speaking from ignorance, I mean, experience.


I'm pretty sure I equalize the fork properly. I do it in 4 steps and I always get a consistent 7mm stack sag with the front tire off the ground, zero weight on it.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Matt116 said:


> So your saying when marking the base air pressure only extend the fork to the dimple?
> I can't tell where the dimple is once I have the fork at full pressure and equalized. I can hear and feel it when pumping up/equalizing the fork though.


It might be just as good to mark the bottom, zero travel, and make sure you don't extend beyond that. I've had my lowers off numerous times but never paid attention to whether or not the uppers have a mark at zero. I think the first mark I can recall is maybe 10% on my 150mm Pike.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

IRBent said:


> It might be just as good to mark the bottom, zero travel, and make sure you don't extend beyond that. I've had my lowers off numerous times but never paid attention to whether or not the uppers have a mark at zero. I think the first mark I can recall is maybe 10% on my 150mm Pike.


Mark the bottom zero? I don't know what you mean. Not extending the fork all the way? 
Yes 10% is the first mark.
Since the rubber topout bumper has been taken are we now able to extend the fork beyond what you can when the bumper is installed?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Matt116 said:


> Mark the bottom zero? I don't know what you mean. Not extending the fork all the way?
> Yes 10% is the first mark.
> Since the rubber topout bumper has been taken are we now able to extend the fork beyond what you can when the bumper is installed?


Yes, that's what I'm guessing. Since the bumper was removed we should be able to extend the fork below 0%. I'm theorising here and assuming we should be able to go below 0%. Maybe I can find time to check into it later this week if you can't.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

IRBent said:


> Yes, that's what I'm guessing. Since the bumper was removed we should be able to extend the fork below 0%. I'm theorising here and assuming we should be able to go below 0%. Maybe I can find time to check into it later this week if you can't.


That's what I'm thinking too. If I remember at lunch I'll measure the top out bumper and see how close it is to the 7mm sag I get with the luftkappe.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I've been out all weekend collecting data on my new shockwiz. Seems I have my Pike set up pretty well. The only amber I'm getting is low speed compression. I need to make it softer but the adjuster is already on the softest setting. Has anyone done any fine tuning to the cartridge.

The other thing I've noticed is that while I measure 25% sag setting up the bike, the shockwiz tells me that my dynamic sag is more like 15%. Does anyone else find this? With everything else performing well, I don't see any reason to adjust for sag.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

onzadog said:


> I've been out all weekend collecting data on my new shockwiz. Seems I have my Pike set up pretty well. The only amber I'm getting is low speed compression. I need to make it softer but the adjuster is already on the softest setting. Has anyone done any fine tuning to the cartridge.
> 
> The other thing I've noticed is that while I measure 25% sag setting up the bike, the shockwiz tells me that my dynamic sag is more like 15%. Does anyone else find this? With everything else performing well, I don't see any reason to adjust for sag.


I'm pretty much just the opposite but I'm also running a Luftkappe.
Comp 5 clicks open, Rebound 4 clicks open, static sag 6% and dynamic is 29%


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I'm tempted by the luftkappe in the hope that it would give a little more sag but also offer a little more ramp up. The shockwiz isn't asking for it but I think that's more because I do long rides that incorporate techy sections. Obviously, I'm willing to sacrifice some trail performance for improved techy performance.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

IRBent said:


> Yes, that's what I'm guessing. Since the bumper was removed we should be able to extend the fork below 0%. I'm theorising here and assuming we should be able to go below 0%. Maybe I can find time to check into it later this week if you can't.


My fork is a 130mm pike. With the luftkappe, negative chamber equalized and fork at 80psi I measure 133mm of exposed stanchion which leads me to believe if you extend the fork all the way you are going below 0% travel.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

i'm getting no deep compression events in 'balanced' and 'playful' modes.

the 'tuning styles explained' page seems to indicate the reason (bit.ly/2wpsFnF):









anyone else getting / not getting DCEs below 'aggressive'?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

ragetty said:


> i'm getting no deep compression events in 'balanced' and 'playful' modes.
> 
> the 'tuning styles explained' page seems to indicate the reason (bit.ly/2wpsFnF):
> 
> ...


Just my opinion, I think the words "deep compression events" ate the same as bottoming out. I personally don't care to have a count of them. I'd prefer to straddle the edge and only ALMOST have one. It's nothing to be concerned about.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

For those of us running a Luftkappe I don't think you should pull the fork to full extension during calibration.
Here's why. I have a 130mm pike and with the negative chamber equalized and the fork air up to 85psi I have 133mm of exposed stanchion. If I extend the fork all the way I get 148mm. The stock topout bumper is 20mm and the base of the Luftkappe is recessed, I think 5mm so theoretically we only removed 15mm of top out bumper.
So if I subtract the fully extended exposed station from the static exposed station I get 15mm (148-133=15mm) same as the removed top out bumper.
To calibrate the fork I tapped a rod to the side of the fork and marked full extension on it so I could use it as a reference during calibration. Worked perfectly and now the wiz shows a static sag of 0% at the end of calibration.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

That's one worth remembering!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Matt116 said:


> For those of us running a Luftkappe I don't think you should pull the fork to full extension during calibration.
> Here's why. I have a 130mm pike and with the negative chamber equalized and the fork air up to 85psi I have 133mm of exposed stanchion. If I extend the fork all the way I get 148mm. The stock topout bumper is 20mm and the base of the Luftkappe is recessed, I think 5mm so theoretically we only removed 15mm of top out bumper.
> So if I subtract the fully extended exposed station from the static exposed station I get 15mm (148-133=15mm) same as the removed top out bumper.
> To calibrate the fork I tapped a rod to the side of the fork and marked full extension on it so I could use it as a reference during calibration. Worked perfectly and now the wiz shows a static sag of 0% at the end of calibration.
> ...


Excellent. Apparently you have a sound mechanical mind that can logically reason out solutions. I may have to follow your lead once I move the Shockwiz to my Pike. I'd love to know you weight and tune once you get things ironed out. Not that it will work for me since I'm on a 150mm travel Pike/Luftkappe fork.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Hmm I thought the calibration process accounted for this (the rider unweighted sag just the bike weight) or am I misunderstanding the above?. It must do or it would always read a +ve sag without you on the bike and the bike sags unde rits own weight...?.. I was wondering if it was using recorded pressures lower than unweighted sag to calculate air time and/or sever pogoing i.e. the pressure drops below the unweighted sag value your... bike is off the ground etc
Maybe if the bike sag is too severe it causes an issue though and that's what your on about?

After a few rides I've been really impressed with the Shockwiz and its completely transformed my bike, what I thought was good actually turns out it was simply slower. My bike carries so much more speed using the SW recommendations. No way would I ever have dropped my fork pressure to 75 PSI from 90 as I thought I liked it that way with good support in compressions.. turns out I was wrong and the bikes much more fun and the times definitely don't lie. Always been a big proponent of the "don't fkin guess.. measure" and generally what you think is happening often isn't, I never shy away any try and support something the data doesn't support, I just swallow my pride and say well there you go the numbers don't lie .. move on... 

I found that the recommendations for Balanced = Playful for me.. no difference for the fork. Still to do the rear shock and very interested to see what it reveals.

All it want me to do now is add a volume spacer but i'm moving onto the shock now.. happy as it stands.. then just my other bikes to do next. I may even do some efficient setups based on air pressure, LSC/HSC and rebound .. easy and quick to change between the modes dependant on what kind of course/riding I fancy.

Yep seriously impressed.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

RocketMagnet said:


> Hmm I thought the calibration process accounted for this (the rider unweighted sag just the bike weight) or am I misunderstanding the above?. It must do or it would always read a +ve sag without you on the bike and the bike sags unde rits own weight...?.. I was wondering if it was using recorded pressures lower than unweighted sag to calculate air time and/or sever pogoing i.e. the pressure drops below the unweighted sag value your... bike is off the ground etc
> Maybe if the bike sag is too severe it causes an issue though and that's what your on about?


The manual says if your static sag is greater than 3% you did something wrong in the calibration.
In my previous post I talk about the full extension difference between stock and luftkappe as being about 15mm. When I calibrate the fork using the recommended method of pulling the fork to full extension the wiz would register a few bottom outs and deep compressions yet the travel o-ring would still be ~0.5" (12mm) down the fork. 12mm is pretty close to 15mm.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

I'm curious what people's experience has been with the playful and aggressive tuning options? I've tried both just a little and it seems playful keeps you from using full travel. SW wants me to keep lowering air pressure with both tunes. Not sure which direction to go.

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## ungod (Apr 16, 2011)

dmo said:


> I'm curious what people's experience has been with the playful and aggressive tuning options? I've tried both just a little and it seems playful keeps you from using full travel. SW wants me to keep lowering air pressure with both tunes. Not sure which direction to go.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Aggressive is intended for downhill use. It seems a little counter-intuitive, but there's really no reason to use all your travel. The best performance you can possibly expect out of your suspension is when you are riding in the mid-travel range. If you are using all of your travel that means you are frequently at the harsh end of your suspension range (where the shock is trying to prevent a bottom-out).

I typically use about 60-70% of my travel on a good downhill run on my enduro bike. If i do a bigger drop or screw up a line, i might hit 90%. That extra 10% is for a really bad day.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

IRBent said:


> Just my opinion, I think the words "deep compression events" ate the same as bottoming out. I personally don't care to have a count of them. I'd prefer to straddle the edge and only ALMOST have one. It's nothing to be concerned about.


fwiw, i'm not at all concerned. it is just interesting reading the assorted posts here re. bottoming out (or not), mostly seemingly without the knowledge that the chosen tune and associated recommendations might actually be trying to avoid it.

that is, if the statement still holds.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

ragetty said:


> fwiw, i'm not at all concerned. it is just interesting reading the assorted posts here re. bottoming out (or not), mostly seemingly without the knowledge that the chosen tune and associated recommendations might actually be trying to avoid it.
> 
> that is, if the statement still holds.


I'm a little slow. Can you tell me what difference it is I'm supposed to explain. Despite my typo, my original statement was that I thought the words "deep compression events" ARE the same as bottoming out.


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## sohl (Jul 3, 2016)

Matt116 said:


> For those of us running a Luftkappe I don't think you should pull the fork to full extension during calibration.
> Here's why. I have a 130mm pike and with the negative chamber equalized and the fork air up to 85psi I have 133mm of exposed stanchion. If I extend the fork all the way I get 148mm. The stock topout bumper is 20mm and the base of the Luftkappe is recessed, I think 5mm so theoretically we only removed 15mm of top out bumper.
> So if I subtract the fully extended exposed station from the static exposed station I get 15mm (148-133=15mm) same as the removed top out bumper.
> To calibrate the fork I tapped a rod to the side of the fork and marked full extension on it so I could use it as a reference during calibration. Worked perfectly and now the wiz shows a static sag of 0% at the end of calibration.
> ...


I Will try that tomorrow, have a 140 mm pike with luftkappe!


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Porch said:


> Aggressive is intended for downhill use. It seems a little counter-intuitive, but there's really no reason to use all your travel. The best performance you can possibly expect out of your suspension is when you are riding in the mid-travel range. If you are using all of your travel that means you are frequently at the harsh end of your suspension range (where the shock is trying to prevent a bottom-out).
> 
> I typically use about 60-70% of my travel on a good downhill run on my enduro bike. If i do a bigger drop or screw up a line, i might hit 90%. That extra 10% is for a really bad day.


Excellent post.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

ragetty said:


> i'm getting no deep compression events in 'balanced' and 'playful' modes.
> 
> the 'tuning styles explained' page seems to indicate the reason (bit.ly/2wpsFnF):
> 
> ...


I'm using playful for both forks and shocks on two bikes and I get a few DCE's on the forks if I do my bigger jump lines or overcook into something. The shock on my shorter travel bike gets lots of DCE's, a dozen or more per a ride. I get one yellow suggestion to add a token, but I like it how it is.... I'm riding it harder than the travel was meant for.

Based on what I've seen comparing my O-rings to the DCE's, it looks like anything close to a bottom out triggers it, like maybe 90% travel use or more. I get DCE's without bottoming out the O-rings at times, but it's always pretty close.

I am guessing maybe the DCE's are used as a factor (among many others) in determining if you should run more air pressure and/or use more tokens. I'm glad to have them counted so I don't have to monitor my travel use with the O-ring every time I do a jump. Personally, I do want to use as much of my travel as I can, otherwise what's the point in having the capacity! That said, I do prefer my forks to run slightly stiffer to help prevent dive/OTB when I screw up... so they don't use all the travel as often. So much of this, if not all, is just personal preference, there is no one right or wrong way...


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

will the shockwiz work with a 160mm 27.5 Avy Open Bath Pike? 
It has rebpund and LSC settting

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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

jazzanova said:


> will the shockwiz work with a 160mm 27.5 Avy Open Bath Pike?
> It has rebpund and LSC settting
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk


Don't see why it wouldn't the AV cart doesn't change the air spring

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/227840247-Is-ShockWiz-compatible-with-my-suspension-?mobile_site=true


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

Matt116 said:


> Don't see why it wouldn't the AV cart doesn't change the air spring


I was under the impression that the software had predefined different shocks and forks...

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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

jazzanova said:


> I was under the impression that the software had predefined different shocks and forks...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk


No it doesn't. You calibrate it to your suspension to come up with a ratio. 
In simplest terms It just measures the change in air spring pressure through out the travel to make suggestions on what to change.


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

Matt116 said:


> No it doesn't. You calibrate it to your suspension to come up with a ratio.
> In simplest terms It just measures the change in air spring pressure through out the travel to make suggestions on what to change.


cool. Thanks!

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Matt116 said:


> No it doesn't. You calibrate it to your suspension to come up with a ratio.
> In simplest terms It just measures the change in air spring pressure through out the travel to make suggestions on what to change.


I realised during calibration process, when asked to compress the fork/shock beyond 50% travel after pumping air to the recommended pressure, the compression ratio varies according to the way you compress the fork. Sometime I have problem pushing the fork beyond 50%, I jerked at high speed to achieve that and Shockwiz showed a compression ratio of 2.2. Once I am able to push the fork slowly beyond 50% travel, and Shockwiz reading was 2.3. Wonder which is the correct reading to take. Both have the same number of volume spacers and air pressure.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I had issues with that part of the calibration when doing my rear shock. I eventually opted to mount and bounce. Not sure if that was optimal but my tune scores seem to be liking it.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Tuning session from today SC Nomad with X2. 174psi (cold), riding weight ~180lbs.

I noticed one full travel jump and two very close to full based on the O-ring on the shock.

The X2 was funny with adding pressure, I would add 20psi at a time and cycle to balance, but still it would keep dropping psi for another 20min of riding around beating on it. It finally did level off though. Now the pressure ranges from 174-177 depending on the temp of the shock from use (cold-warm)

Ride was flat out for 2hrs, 3000ft+ vertical climb, maybe around 10miles, all the down was single track, 3/4 of it pretty rough.

I have to agree with the suggestion to add air, the sag when riding seemed a bit much, but static it was per suggestion on Fox's site. I will be adding air for the next session.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> I have to agree with the suggestion to add air, the sag when riding seemed a bit much, but static it was per suggestion on Fox's site. I will be adding air for the next session.


How many spacers inside your X2? Looks like you need to add more spacers.

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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

IRBent said:


> I'm a little slow. Can you tell me what difference it is I'm supposed to explain. Despite my typo, my original statement was that I thought the words "deep compression events" ARE the same as bottoming out.


no, your not slow - i first mis-read your post, then realised my error almost immediately and edited my post ...


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

SonomaBiker said:


> ... Based on what I've seen comparing my O-rings to the DCE's, it looks like anything close to a bottom out triggers it, like maybe 90% travel use or more. I get DCE's without bottoming out the O-rings at times, but it's always pretty close ...


quarq should take the guess work out of this for user and make the threshold for a DCE count user-definable.


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

Based on my experience the DCE mark must be somewhere around 90%, probably even a bit more, but def. less than 100%

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

ragetty said:


> quarq should take the guess work out of this for user and make the threshold for a DCE count user-definable.


That would be cool!


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> How many spacers inside your X2? Looks like you need to add more spacers.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm using the default supplied, which is two I believe?

Since the recommendation is for air pressure, and the shock is riding low in it's travel, isn't adding air the logical first step?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> I'm using the default supplied, which is two I believe?
> 
> Since the recommendation is for air pressure, and the shock is riding low in it's travel, isn't adding air the logical first step?


Not only is adding air the logical step, but also what the Shockwiz manual or FAQs state. Start with suggestions at the top first and work your way down. Adding a bit of air will affect your HSC/LSC compression too despite theoretically it shouldn't. I say add 5psi and run the very same loop as the one where you got the results that you posted above. Otherwise you won't be comparing apples to apples. Everything right now is pointing to a suspension that's too soft. If 5-10psi tosses some of the suggestion off to the left of good, you indeed may need to find a compromise by adding spacers.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> I'm using the default supplied, which is two I believe?
> 
> Since the recommendation is for air pressure, and the shock is riding low in it's travel, isn't adding air the logical first step?


From your Shockwiz readings, it seems like the Bottoming and Bobbing are poor, and you have 3 Deep Compression Events. Your Dynamic Sag is 29%, seems to be just right for pressure. Besides, you ride quite aggressively (84 jumps). Based on all these indicators, I thought it will be worthwhile to add more spacers onto your X2.

Well, you can add pressure first before considering to add spacer base on Shockwiz suggestion. Just have to do more runs


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> From your Shockwiz readings, it seems like the Bottoming and Bobbing are poor, and you have 3 Deep Compression Events. Your Dynamic Sag is 29%, seems to be just right for pressure. Besides, you ride quite aggressively (84 jumps). Based on all these indicators, I thought it will be worthwhile to add more spacers onto your X2.
> 
> Well, you can add pressure first before considering to add spacer base on Shockwiz suggestion. Just have to do more runs


Adding pressure probably will fix the bobbing. But adding spacers without adjusting air will most likely do very little for the bobbing since spacers mainly affect ramp up.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Adding pressure probably will fix the bobbing. But adding spacers without adjusting air will most likely do very little for the bobbing since spacers mainly affect ramp up.


Right. Let's see what he gets after adding pressure. Keen to know 

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Anyone know if Shockwiz can be used on MRP Ramp Control Cartridge?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Anyone know if Shockwiz can be used on MRP Ramp Control Cartridge?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


No, it's not compatible:

See the compatibility list:

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/227843747-Known-incompatibility-list?mobile_site=true


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> No, it's not compatible:
> 
> See the compatibility list:
> 
> https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/227843747-Known-incompatibility-list?mobile_site=true


Oh, that sucks! Well, I can live with that. Thanks for the info mate.

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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

chris9888 said:


> Oh, that sucks! Well, I can live with that. Thanks for the info mate.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If youre using it in a non-MRP fork, you can put the stock air cap back on there when using the wiz.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

the_joe said:


> If youre using it in a non-MRP fork, you can put the stock air cap back on there when using the wiz.


I will be using 2018 Fox Factory Series fork. Will check it out, thanks!

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> Right. Let's see what he gets after adding pressure. Keen to know
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Added 6psi (174->180) and cut my ride from yesterday in half (same trails, but only half of them). Got exactly identical results. Going to up it another 6 psi and -try- to ride tomorrow... legs are starting to complain a bit! ;-)

Not concerned about the bobbing. I'm not using he lockout on the climbs per SW instructions. When I use the climb switch again after tuning the bobbing will go away.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Added 6psi (174->180) and cut my ride from yesterday in half (same trails, but only half of them). Got exactly identical results. Going to up it another 6 psi and -try- to ride tomorrow... legs are starting to complain a bit! ;-)


If next 6psi still show the same result, suggest you add one more spacer.

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## sohl (Jul 3, 2016)

I have a rockshox pike 140 mm with a luftkappe installed and have played with a shockwiz for 6 days now, I know its short time but so far I'm happy. 
I'm 185ibs with gear and ended up with: 
78 psi
1 token 
0-2 lsc (depending on trail) 
4-5 rebound from fastest (depending on trail)

it still complains that the HSC is a little hard otherwise all good. 

I have rid it on local trail and 1 day in a bike park.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Interesting find today. I looked up the tune code for my X2 on the Nomad and it's a medium tune. I'm wondering if this is why my mid-range has no support, maybe it's too soft of a tune.... I'm getting conflict with static sag range and mid range wallowing.... having a hard time finding a pressure that gets both in an acceptable range.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

I finished tuning my Rockshox Pike 150mm rct3. I'm pretty happy with it but should I be trying to get a score of 100? My fork doesn't have HSC adjustment. Should I try tuning for just a segment of trail or the entire loop I ride?


















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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> I finished tuning my Rockshox Pike 150mm rct3. I'm pretty happy with it but should I be trying to get a score of 100? My fork doesn't have HSC adjustment. Should I try tuning for just a segment of trail or the entire loop I ride?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Here's my opinion based on tuning my rear shock and asking myself those same questions you asked, then testing multiple ways.

My original goal was to get my rear shock capable of doing what my OEM shock couldn't do, smooth out the ugliest of terrain. Based on everything I had read about what the Shockwiz would ask, I chose a 30 minute loop that took me up a smooth fire road, then turned off to a really rough uphill section. Once at the top the Wiz was saying I had a poor score but was begging for rough trails. So I'd turn around, bomb the ugly and check my score thereafter. My results were very much like what you just posted and the Wiz was asking for big jumps next. So I'd finish off with our flow trail and my scores would go from 92 up to 96. Bottom line, rough trails score 92 and big jumps added to my score, netting 96. All testing done in the Playful mode like yours. So in my mind I had accomplished my original goal. But further testing on smooth trails and looking at the results in the same Playful mode, my smooth trail results were in the high 70's to low 80's. However, I could flip from Playful after the same run and look at the results in the Efficient mode and my low scores would be 92. So the way I see it, smooth trail efficiency and smooth ugly trails, scoring 92-96 separately and somewhat together, I've accomplished the best of both worlds. So tune in playful to achieve good scores on the ugliest of trails and let the loose end drag on smooth trails.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

I had the ShockWiz for a week. I have no doubt I didn't use it properly (although I did read the online instructions -- twice -- and did my absolute best to comply with them). The ShockWiz led me down a path to hell. I went back to my seat of the pants original settings and things have been MUCH better since. In my opinion, among other things, the ShockWiz had virtually ALL my settings WAAAAAAAAAY too soft for any kind of technical terrain at speed. I have since firmed up my suspension, front and back, and things are back to normal Strava-wise. 

Like I said, I probably mis-used it. Or maybe the suspension linkage designs of some bikes (including mine) are completely whack and don't like being deep in the travel. 

I did love the ShockWiz though. It was fun and interesting, and it made me think about my suspension lots. I think I understand things much better, now that it made me think about things.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

mtnbkrmike said:


> I had the ShockWiz for a week. I have no doubt I didn't use it properly (although I did read the online instructions -- twice -- and did my absolute best to comply with them). The ShockWiz led me down a path to hell. I went back to my seat of the pants original settings and things have been MUCH better since. In my opinion, among other things, the ShockWiz had virtually ALL my settings WAAAAAAAAAY too soft for any kind of technical terrain at speed. I have since firmed up my suspension, front and back, and things are back to normal Strava-wise.
> 
> Like I said, I probably mis-used it. Or maybe the suspension linkage designs of some bikes (including mine) are completely whack and don't like being deep in the travel.
> 
> I did love the ShockWiz though. It was fun and interesting, and it made me think about my suspension lots. I think I understand things much better, now that it made me think about things.


Instead of just measuring my strava timing, I measured my average speed, top speed and maximum heartbeat before and after tuning my shock/fork with Shockwiz. Great improvement after the suspensions were tuned.

Rode the same trails, my average speed improved from 10.9km/h to 12.2km/h; maximum speed increased from 29km/h to 32km/h; and maximum heartbeat reduced from 177bpm to 162bpm.

My ride before tuning the shock/fork: https://www.relive.cc/view/g13176271685

My ride after tuning the shock/fork: https://www.relive.cc/view/g13343483778


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Instead of just measuring my strava timing, I measured my average speed, top speed and maximum heartbeat before and after tuning my shock/fork with Shockwiz. Great improvement after the suspensions were tuned.
> 
> Rode the same trails, my average speed improved from 10.9km/h to 12.2km/h; maximum speed increased from 29km/h to 32km/h; and maximum heartbeat reduced from 177bpm to 162bpm.
> 
> ...


Trust me - everything improved when I went back to my own intuitive settings. As crazy as that may sound.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I saw my first score of 100 today but chose not to screenshot it since my confidence was only at 99%. I took on an extra CX type trail prior to my typical tuning loop and was part way up the last climb when my cellphone rang. I chose to check the Shockwiz app while I had the phone out and saw the 100 score. The last bit of that climb is the rough technical trail I usually bomb down to satisfy the Shockwiz' need for rough stuff. Climbing up that last bit ruined my Efficient mode score. I started a new session before bombing back down the rough stuff and then taking on the jumps. A bit of extra trail riding to satisfy the Shockwiz for pedaling and climbing and I netted a 92 in the Playful mode for the ugly stuff. At least I know that my tune is about as good as possible when tuning for my typical trails and looking at the tune on the Efficient mode after the smoother trails. Then looking at scores for the ugly trails in Playful mode still nets me 90's.


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

IRBent said:


> I saw my first score of 100 today but chose not to screenshot it since my confidence was only at 99%. I took on an extra CX type trail prior to my typical tuning loop and was part way up the last climb when my cellphone rang. I chose to check the Shockwiz app while I had the phone out and saw the 100 score. The last bit of that climb is the rough technical trail I usually bomb down to satisfy the Shockwiz' need for rough stuff. Climbing up that last bit ruined my Efficient mode score. I started a new session before bombing back down the rough stuff and then taking on the jumps. A bit of extra trail riding to satisfy the Shockwiz for pedaling and climbing and I netted a 92 in the Playful mode for the ugly stuff. At least I know that my tune is about as good as possible when tuning for my typical trails and looking at the tune on the Efficient mode after the smoother trails. Then looking at scores for the ugly trails in Playful mode still nets me 90's.


Glad to hear I know it takes time to get it tuned in just right. I agree if you are scoring in the 90's you are real close. especially for anyone doing a quick hit rental.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Today I upped my X2 shock on the Nomad to 187psi. I did a different trail system, but just as long 3k ft / 10miles or so. This is a much more chunky trail system but with lower/less big bottom out jumps. I got a 100% tune with everything perfect. The mid-stroke wallow was way better, totally acceptable. Everything really felt great. Oddly the psi dropped to 185 when I was done and shock cooled off. I had zero deep compression events, and the number of jumps and air time were both down about 20% from my first session. Dynamic sag went up just slightly to 28%. I'm going to leave it at 185 (assuming the can absorbed that after it cycled a few times) and reset my baseline air pressure and then take it down the original trail system. Looks like I might have this puppy tuned! The extra 10psi has really made a big difference.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> Today I upped my X2 shock on the Nomad to 187psi. I did a different trail system, but just as long 3k ft / 10miles or so. This is a much more chunky trail system but with lower/less big bottom out jumps. I got a 100% tune with everything perfect. The mid-stroke wallow was way better, totally acceptable. Everything really felt great. Oddly the psi dropped to 185 when I was done and shock cooled off. I had zero deep compression events, and the number of jumps and air time were both down about 20% from my first session. Dynamic sag went up just slightly to 28%. I'm going to leave it at 185 (assuming the can absorbed that after it cycled a few times) and reset my baseline air pressure and then take it down the original trail system. Looks like I might have this puppy tuned! The extra 10psi has really made a big difference.


Sounds like you're all over a great tune for your trails.


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Forgot to add one bit about the tuning session today... I'm amazed at the sensitivity of the Shockwiz. After I had just ridden for 2hrs 3k ft / 10miles pretty hard (even punctured my rear tire) and got the 100% score I then shed some gear (5-10lbs) and just casually rode on the street for about 10min and then I went back into SW and it was telling me to soften my low speed compression already! I thought maybe since I had ridden so much that just a short playing around in different conditions wouldn't affect it much, but it did, and rightly so! Amazing... that's also why I now don't have a 100% tune to screen shot and post here.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Today I upped my X2 shock on the Nomad to 187psi. I did a different trail system, but just as long 3k ft / 10miles or so. This is a much more chunky trail system but with lower/less big bottom out jumps. I got a 100% tune with everything perfect. The mid-stroke wallow was way better, totally acceptable. Everything really felt great. Oddly the psi dropped to 185 when I was done and shock cooled off. I had zero deep compression events, and the number of jumps and air time were both down about 20% from my first session. Dynamic sag went up just slightly to 28%. I'm going to leave it at 185 (assuming the can absorbed that after it cycled a few times) and reset my baseline air pressure and then take it down the original trail system. Looks like I might have this puppy tuned! The extra 10psi has really made a big difference.


Looks like you found the sweet spot for the chunky trail system. All is worth as long as it offer better riding experience. Have you tuned your fork yet?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I saw my first score of 100 today but chose not to screenshot it since my confidence was only at 99%.


Wow! 100% tune score. Well done dude.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> Looks like you found the sweet spot for the chunky trail system. All is worth as long as it offer better riding experience. Have you tuned your fork yet?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yep, did the fork first, Fox 36 RC2 - 170mm. It's base tune suggestion from Fox was only 1-2 clicks off from perfect, no issues there.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Yep, did the fork first, Fox 36 RC2 - 170mm. It's base tune suggestion from Fox was only 1-2 clicks off from perfect, no issues there.


Awesome! Looks like X2 needs more effort to tune, but once you get it right it will be awesome 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> IRBent said:
> 
> 
> > I saw my first score of 100 today but chose not to screenshot it since my confidence was only at 99%. /QUOTE]
> ...


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> Awesome! Looks like X2 needs more effort to tune, but once you get it right it will be awesome
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes, the key here was that Fox did not put a recommended PSI in the shock instructions (unlike for all their other shocks), only a sag measurement. It was too soft with their suggestion of 19mm for the 8.5 x 2.5 version with medium tune. After getting the good tune with the shockwiz I've got a PSI close to my riding weight (+5 psi over) and the static sag is more like 15mm.

However, I am using their HSC/LSC, HSR/LSR suggestions and not having any complaints from the shockwiz on those.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

chris9888 said:


> Awesome! Looks like X2 needs more effort to tune, but once you get it right it will be awesome
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


A shock is almost always going to have a larger delta from the manufacturer suggestions. Forks are linear progression rates and react nearly the same with minuscule differences due to head angle. Shocks are a whole different story. Different bikes have wildly different progression rates in the rear. As such it is much harder to accurately predict settings.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## pharmkid85 (Mar 29, 2017)

chris9888 said:


> Agree with you IRBent. Let's see if my new 2018 Fox Factory Series fork has the same issue.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


My 18 factory DPX2 has the same issue. It always wants HSC softer. I'm currently sourcing a spacer set to try dropping the pressure some.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

There was a firmware version that had everyone being told to lighten HSC. Once the firmware was updated about 3 weeks ago that issue disappeared for me, with no changes to settings. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

tuckerjt07 said:


> A shock is almost always going to have a larger delta from the manufacturer suggestions. Forks are linear progression rates and react nearly the same with minuscule differences due to head angle. Shocks are a whole different story. Different bikes have wildly different progression rates in the rear. As such it is much harder to accurately predict settings.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Right, totally agree with you.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

pharmkid85 said:


> My 18 factory DPX2 has the same issue. It always wants HSC softer. I'm currently sourcing a spacer set to try dropping the pressure some.


Sometime the HSC issue maybe caused by factory tuning. The only way to solve is to get the workshop to revalve the shock one level down. If this is not the case, playing around with spacers may help.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> There was a firmware version that had everyone being told to lighten HSC. Once the firmware was updated about 3 weeks ago that issue disappeared for me, with no changes to settings.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Not sure if this is in response to my post above but I have *almost* decided to pull the trigger on an Avy cartridge for my Pike Solo RC, and an 11-6 shock. With both being custom tuned, little should be left to chance for me to screw up by way of user error. Lol.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Suns_PSD said:


> There was a firmware version that had everyone being told to lighten HSC. Once the firmware was updated about 3 weeks ago that issue disappeared for me, with no changes to settings.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Quite sure I installed the latest version, not the firmware. Just in case, good to check it out 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Suns_PSD said:


> There was a firmware version that had everyone being told to lighten HSC. Once the firmware was updated about 3 weeks ago that issue disappeared for me, with no changes to settings.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Not surprising, most factory HSC is unbelievably restrictive, as they tend to rely on the low speed controls to attempt to adapt the suspension to different weight riders. Revalve and different pistons are fixes for this.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I had a first run on the rear with my Fox DPS yesterday. Base settings were good but it wanted hsc & lsc softer, both are already fully open.

The other interesting thing I noticed, my air pressure is 210 psi but after a particularly full on descent, it had risen to almost 230 and Shockwiz wanted some air out despite getting 30% sag and several deep compression events. I think it screwed it up a bit as the increase in air pressure due to temperature made it think it was deeper into the travel than it really was.


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## rave81 (Mar 1, 2013)

To those who tuned heir fox 36 hsc/LCs with shockwiz, could you please post ur settings here


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## LCW (May 5, 2008)

If you run 2 Shockwiz, do they work in tandem to provide tuning suggestions based on a balanced setup front to rear?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

LCW said:


> If you run 2 Shockwiz, do they work in tandem to provide tuning suggestions based on a balanced setup front to rear?


No, they will work independently. The software can only read one unit at a time and all data is stored on the Shockwiz. You read one unit, disconnect from it and connect to the 2nd Shockwiz to get readings from it.


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## jet9rdopilot (Nov 10, 2012)

Have about 6 rides on the Wiz. The last two it did not record anything. Flipped the battery and ground it, then installed + up, as instructed, then re calibated the fork again. Have not ridden yet. When calibrating it, it says to remove air then cycle fork to equalize pressure. 2017 Fox SC 100 mm with 3 position twin loc. Do they want all psi out of both chambers or just let some out cycle then start? Also, when adding or removing air you simply can not do it, you must establish a new air base line psi, correct? 
It is something that you have to play with a while to understand what it wants you to do.


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## chet wright (Oct 30, 2005)

My LBS is telling me they're not available till Sep. I see you can order direct, but my LBS is great, I like to support them by buying through them. Even though the SRAM rep was there (that's how I found about them) I'm not sure the shop will buy and rent. They also would be a great resource when renting out.
Are they available now?
Chet


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

rave81 said:


> To those who tuned heir fox 36 hsc/LCs with shockwiz, could you please post ur settings here


I don't have mine written down and handy, but on my 170mm the Fox recommended settings came in at 100%. I have a second one on another bike set to 150mm and just a couple clicks off the recommended settings got me a 100%. So far the Fox recommendations are pretty solid for all but the psi/sag on my X2 shock. My DPS came in perfect at Fox recommended settings too.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Has anyone had any thought on how to deal with air shocks getting hot and the effect on the shockwiz?

I've noticed the air pressure increase after a hard run which is to be expected. However, that extra pressure makes the shockwiz think that it's deeper into the travel than it really is.


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

chris9888 said:


> I realised during calibration process, when asked to compress the fork/shock beyond 50% travel after pumping air to the recommended pressure, the compression ratio varies according to the way you compress the fork. Sometime I have problem pushing the fork beyond 50%, I jerked at high speed to achieve that and Shockwiz showed a compression ratio of 2.2. Once I am able to push the fork slowly beyond 50% travel, and Shockwiz reading was 2.3. Wonder which is the correct reading to take. Both have the same number of volume spacers and air pressure.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


According to Quarq Tech here on MTBR that part of the calibration process has nothing to do with computing the ratio.

"So, a little word about the Calibration Wizard. The only steps that pertain to measuring the CR are: 
Mark Full Extension
Mark Full Compression
Verify Full Extension

Once you get to the 'Infalte' step, the CR has already been measured. The 50% wording was placed in there to ensure that bypass dimples from all manufacturers would be hit after inflating to ensure the positive and negative chambers are properly balance. It is not critical that you compress 50% during the Equalization step"


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

onzadog said:


> Has anyone had any thought on how to deal with air shocks getting hot and the effect on the shockwiz?
> 
> I've noticed the air pressure increase after a hard run which is to be expected. However, that extra pressure makes the shockwiz think that it's deeper into the travel than it really is.


Air pressure rise from heat is a dynamic change and there is no way for the shockwiz to know and compensate for it.
You have two options, one is to just run it normal and it shouldn't effect your shock too much. It might want psi less but shouldn't effect any of the dampening scores.
The other is too do a run and find the after baseline sag. If its 6% at full top out then before your next run compress your fork to 3% and reset the baseline air pressure to split the difference.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Matt116 said:


> According to Quarq Tech here on MTBR that part of the calibration process has nothing to do with computing the ratio.
> 
> "So, a little word about the Calibration Wizard. The only steps that pertain to measuring the CR are:
> Mark Full Extension
> ...


Good to know. Thanks for sharing Matt 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

ShockWiz inventor, Nigel Wade: "There's a temperature sensor on board the micro-controller that compensates for the heating and cooling of the gas in the suspension as you go between different environments. If you are quickly and dramatically changing elevation or riding really, really hard (or both) then there can be a bit of a thermal lag where the reported pressure (and therefore travel) can be off by a couple of percent.

From here: Quarq ShockWiz first ride review - BikeRadar


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

There's a new Shockwiz app update out that adds ride profiles. Not sure yet what that means.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Thanks for the heads up IRBent.

Basically allows us to save out a profile for each ride with everything from Bike Make Model / Date time / Shocks pressures and Modes, Volume spacers, rebound & compression clicks / Tyres F/R (Make/Width/Pressure) / Trail location/ weather etc etc etc a data loggers wet dream really.

So you can load up profiles for specific trails / weather conditions etc then set up your bike to match.... no more screen shots or writing stuff down.

Looks like you can upload and download profiles also so theoretically you could D/L someone else's profiles for specific trails to guide you for your settings for any trail your planning to visit etc? 

Far exceeded my expectations.. great stuff.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

RocketMagnet said:


> Thanks for the heads up IRBent.
> 
> Basically allows us to save out a profile for each ride with everything from Bike Make Model / Date time / Shocks pressures and Modes, Volume spacers, rebound & compression clicks / Tyres F/R (Make/Width/Pressure) / Trail location/ weather etc etc etc a data loggers wet dream really.
> 
> ...


Once I got home I glanced over the rider profile page. I was a bit unsettled when I realized the lack of thought that went into it. Everybody's suspension does not have the same knobs and methods of adjustment. My rear shock offers both positive and negative chamber tuning bands, yet the profile only allows me to note positive bands. I'm betting there were more things but that was the one that stuck out in my mind. Also the upload/download to maybe save these profiles wasn't too clear. Where is it being loaded? The icon made it look to me like it was being sent to the Shockwiz or downloaded from it rather than to email or an online database. Has anybody used the function yet and can clarify what it really does?


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

You could always stick any additional info in the Notes section on the shock tab etc?
Either way it looks simple to add additional data fields as you can remove them if you select edit at the top...

Anyway after looking closer it seems like its not uploading profiles to a server or anything .. seems like its ul/dl to/from the shockwiz. Not sure what use this is though? maybe so you can switch between bikes and do no calibration at all ?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

RocketMagnet said:


> Anyway after looking closer it seems like its not uploading profiles to a server or anything .. seems like its ul/dl to/from the shockwiz. Not sure what use this is though? maybe so you can switch between bikes and do no calibration at all ?


Yeah, if it would export that data to email, text file, or anything that could be saved and shared it would be more useful. I ride pretty much the same trails always so saving setup notes for me would not be very useful. Sharing them with others would be nice though.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

I feel that this is a big step in the right direction. It seems that they are making it better on a daily basis. I do wish that they would let us know what they are changing from version to version though.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Sorry, I'm trying to understand exactly what you did to measure full extension. Are you saying you measured out a used travel of 133mm and taped it up at that point? Only then marked full extension?

I have a 160mm Lyrik with a Luftkappe, so without doing what you did maybe my full extension is more like 180mm?? which is a problem?

UPDATE:

I actually measured 177mm. When I go through normal process I determine CR = 2.8. When I use your method above and limit travel to 160mm I get CR = 2.6. Not sure if these CR's make sense, but will try riding it tomorrow.



Matt116 said:


> For those of us running a Luftkappe I don't think you should pull the fork to full extension during calibration.
> Here's why. I have a 130mm pike and with the negative chamber equalized and the fork air up to 85psi I have 133mm of exposed stanchion. If I extend the fork all the way I get 148mm. The stock topout bumper is 20mm and the base of the Luftkappe is recessed, I think 5mm so theoretically we only removed 15mm of top out bumper.
> So if I subtract the fully extended exposed station from the static exposed station I get 15mm (148-133=15mm) same as the removed top out bumper.
> To calibrate the fork I tapped a rod to the side of the fork and marked full extension on it so I could use it as a reference during calibration. Worked perfectly and now the wiz shows a static sag of 0% at the end of calibration.
> ...


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Watch this for the new profile creation video. Best upgrade so far, very excited to hit the trails again!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Watch this for the new profile creation video. Best upgrade so far, very excited to hit the trails again!


Indeed, that video helps. I'm still a tad unclear on rear shock travel though. Would we enter 57mm for the actual shock travel or 150mm for the bike rear wheel travel? Based on the fork example in the video I'd assume 57mm would be the correct entry.


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

IRBent said:


> Indeed, that video helps. I'm still a tad unclear on rear shock travel though. Would we enter 57mm for the actual shock travel or 150mm for the bike rear wheel travel? Based on the fork example in the video I'd assume 57mm would be the correct entry.


57mm


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## t-stoff (Jan 20, 2012)

But the info doesn't do anything besides being a profile for future reference right? I think there are not that many forks/shocks/brands/models that would prevent the software developers to narrow down what items could be changed on a predetermined shock/fork/brand that you've selected, like "rear X shock only has rebound adjustment".
On other note I was counting the clicks for the profile and broke my rebound knob on my fox 34:|


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

t-stoff said:


> But the info doesn't do anything besides being a profile for future reference right? I think there are not that many forks/shocks/brands/models that would prevent the software developers to narrow down what items could be changed on a predetermined shock/fork/brand that you've selected, like "rear X shock only has rebound adjustment".
> On other note I was counting the clicks for the profile and broke my rebound knob on my fox 34:|


My rear shock allows tuning bands in the negative chamber. A profile would be useless without knowing the proper tuning band count. I hate hearing about your broken rebound knob.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> My rear shock allows tuning bands in the negative chamber. A profile would be useless without knowing the proper tuning band count. I hate hearing about your broken rebound knob.


Just insert the positive negative split somewhere in the comments.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

t-stoff said:


> But the info doesn't do anything besides being a profile for future reference right? I think there are not that many forks/shocks/brands/models that would prevent the software developers to narrow down what items could be changed on a predetermined shock/fork/brand that you've selected, like "rear X shock only has rebound adjustment".
> On other note I was counting the clicks for the profile and broke my rebound knob on my fox 34:|


It's a non-essential function of the software. The most effective and best working software is built on input from actual users not what the engineers think. The easiest way to achieve this is to release what is known as a Minimum Viable Product as quickly as possible and collect feedback to act on as quickly as possible. Releasing small pieces and then acting on it helps shorten the new feature, feedback, new feature/fix/enhancement loop.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Just insert the positive negative split somewhere in the comments.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Yeah, I'm sure I can work around being treated like the red headed stepchild. My fork only has LSC and rebound, none of the other fancy knobs, and my rear shock has a rebound knob and a oil reservoir bladder pressure that can be adjusted. Maybe I should have bought one of the suspension components that it seems the Shockwiz software is catering to. LOL


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Yeah, I'm sure I can work around being treated like the red headed stepchild. My fork only has LSC and rebound, none of the other fancy knobs, and my rear shock has a rebound knob and a oil reservoir bladder pressure that can be adjusted. Maybe I should have bought one of the suspension components that it seems the Shockwiz software is catering to. LOL


It all depends on the effort you want to put in. You can adjust LSC, HSC, LSR, and HSR on any mid range and up suspension component. The Shockwiz will also pick up the oil bladder just not explicitly. Also, if you remember it did not have seperate rebound settings but it was asked for and delivered.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> It's a non-essential function of the software. The most effective and best working software is built on input from actual users not what the engineers think. The easiest way to achieve this is to release what is known as a Minimum Viable Product as quickly as possible and collect feedback to act on as quickly as possible. Releasing small pieces and then acting on it helps shorten the new feature, feedback, new feature/fix/enhancement loop.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


I agree. The manner they've gone about optimizing their offering is the most expeditious way to do things. Eventually we early adopter will help them develop a system that's as good as it can be. I've seen the software change 2-3 times myself and it's only getting better. Now if they'll make it possible to share profiles and settings or have each profile auto upload to an online database anybody could peruse.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> It all depends on the effort you want to put in. You can adjust LSC, HSC, LSR, and HSR on any mid range and up suspension component. The Shockwiz will also pick up the oil bladder just not explicitly. Also, if you remember it did not have seperate rebound settings but it was asked for and delivered.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Exactly. Not that adding the multiple rebound settings helped us with a single rebound knob. But at least they gave us the option to hide the extra addition. As for effort to adjust HSC/LSC settings or performance, I'm all for doing that despite not having built in knobs. I've lowered the viscosity in my shock oil twice now to soften the LSC that everybody is plagued with. I've seen a score of 100 with 99% confidence and regularly hit 96 @ 100%. So while my rear shock may not have ALL the bells and whistles, the Shockwiz data has allowed me to tweak the shock's performance to achieve what I think is near its maximum capability.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Exactly. Not that adding the multiple rebound settings help us with a single rebound knob. But at least they gave us the option to hide the extra addition. As for effort to adjust HSC/LSC settings or performance, I'm all for doing that despite not having built in knobs. I've lowered the viscosity in my shock oil twice now to soften the LSC that everybody is plagued with. I've seen a score of 100 with 99% confidence and regularly hit 96 @ 100%. So while my rear shock may not have ALL the bells and whistles, the Shockwiz data has allowed me to tweak the shock's performance to achieve what I think is near its maximum capability.


You could play with the shim stacks too. Shockwiz makes that subconsciously less scary for me.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> You could play with the shim stacks too. Shockwiz makes that subconsciously less scary for me.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Yes. I spoke with DVO about shim stack adjustment but opted to try the oil change first. I may have solved my issue without their help. Although they did say, just open it up and call us so we can talk you through shim stack adjustment. That may have been before the Shockwiz but the data helped me confirm I was on the right track.


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## kanetrader (Dec 10, 2006)

Im having a real basic question and maybe this is already been answered, but with so many pages it is almost imposaible to check.. sorry for that.
My question is, I dont know which way to change the setup e.g. 
Airbase pressure is orange to the right side of the bar. Here states "add air" (so it is on the add air side of the slde/bar. When I add air and ride it becomes red... so I had to lower air pressure... 
Is this correct and workin for all slides to go the opposite?
Many thanks... Jan


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## mantra (Feb 28, 2006)

kanetrader said:


> Im having a real basic question and maybe this is already been answered, but with so many pages it is almost imposaible to check.. sorry for that.
> My question is, I dont know which way to change the setup e.g.
> Airbase pressure is orange to the right side of the bar. Here states "add air" (so it is on the add air side of the slde/bar. When I add air and ride it becomes red... so I had to lower air pressure...
> Is this correct and workin for all slides to go the opposite?
> Many thanks... Jan


Add air slider to the right means add air, so something went wrong here...

Gesendet von meinem Moto G (4) mit Tapatalk


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## redmr2_man (Jun 10, 2008)

Bought one a few weeks ago and I've been loving it. Really was able to dial in my pike, have yet to use it on my Evol rear, but that's next. This thread has some pretty good insight for the initial issues I was having with setup, so thanks!

Just got another one for my birthday from my wife.

If anyone wants one new, for cheap(er), send me a pm!


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

Version 5.0.0 of the app is released. Added "profiles" where you can store settings


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I guess I'm not clear on toggling back and forth between Shock & Fork in the profile section and I seemed to lose a lot of info that I had typed in. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> I guess I'm not clear on toggling back and forth between Shock & Fork in the profile section and I seemed to lose a lot of info that I had typed in.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


While I've only used the new profile section once, today. Here's the way I think it works. You have to set up individual profiles for your shock and your fork. You may also need to setup individual profiles for different trail types and tunes. Any time you start a new session, you need to upload the profile you intend on using during that ride. Also uploading the profile to the Shockwiz all start a new session. Meaning you'll need to ride enough variation in that ride to satisfy the Wiz. Say for instance you're riding your typical trails that lead to the top of a mountain where you plan on bombing down ugly rocks, drops and jumps. You'll probably need two different profiles, the first set for the trails and climb and the profile using either a balanced of efficient tuning mode. Once you're ready to start the downhill you'll need to download the data for the session, then upload the profile for the ugly downhill. The ugly downhill profile will still be using the same tune, meaning you're not going to tweak your suspension before heading downhill. However your profile should be using a playful or aggressive tuning mode. Once your at the bottom or end of your ride you can download the data for the second profile. A good tune for your suspension when taxed, like the latter half of the ride detailed above, will allow your suspension to use nearly all of your travel, eat it up and beg for more, and give you lots of green middle of the tune suggestions in an aggressive or playful tuning mode. But when riding that same tune on smoother easier trails the suspension obviously won't move as much and will report low scores with lits of yellow or possibly even some red suggestions in the same tuning mode as your downhill run. But set it to either efficient or balanced and the Shockwiz all give you decent scores. Finding a tune that allows the better scores on all trail types is the goal.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone know if you have profiles for different bikes if you still need to calibrate every time you hook sw up to a new fork?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> Anyone know if you have profiles for different bikes if you still need to calibrate every time you hook sw up to a new fork?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


If the fork is the very same brand, model, travel and has the same pressure settings and same number of tokens, you shouldn't have to recalibrate. The profile will hold the compression ratios and you could use the same profile across multiple bikes if those mentioned in the first sentence are true.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent, that was helpful, thanks. 

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Oh, but know this only holds true of forks.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Can anyone confirm if a CR of 2.6 for a 160mm 27.5 Lyrik with no tokens sounds about right.


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

there's just no way this $299 device can be effective on *any* air spring. there're so many physical variables between brands and models which the makers can't account for. I'm saying this an an engineer. 

invest time in understanding what these suspension devices actually do and what aspects you can control. don't rely on a magic black box.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

schnellmann said:


> there's just no way this $299 device can be effective on *any* air spring. there're so many physical variables between brands and models which the makers can't account for. I'm saying this an an engineer.
> 
> invest time in understanding what these suspension devices actually do and what aspects you can control. don't rely on a magic black box.


So as an engineer I assume you understand Boyle's gas law and are smart enough to know that this magic black box measures pressure, speed of travel, temp, and uses it all to help explain to those who apparently aren't as brilliant as you how they can better set up their suspension. Don't spend your money on this black magic. Those less fortunate may need the help. I bought it because I may be even as smart as you but love numbers, spreadsheets, and analyzing both to solve problems. By the way, I scored 92 setting up the suspension without it's help and a minor pressure adjustment the Shockwiz recommended got the score up to 96. Oddly enough too, that better score translated into a better ride, feel and faster STRAVA times. Keep your negative naysayers comments to yourself.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

schnellmann said:


> there's just no way this $299 device can be effective on *any* air spring. there're so many physical variables between brands and models which the makers can't account for. I'm saying this an an engineer.
> 
> invest time in understanding what these suspension devices actually do and what aspects you can control. don't rely on a magic black box.


Lol. Do mass. BTW I'm an electrical engineer and it makes complete sense to me. I also tuned suspension on race cars in college.

I'm liking the new profile setup. It gets all your screen shots and you can load settings when you switch front to rear. The app is getting better fast and I bet that the device is getting smarter every firmware update. Got a 96 with only a slow to rebound yesterday. It likes 1 click every now and then depending on my run.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

In fact, Shockwiz empowered lesser mortal riders like me to better appreciate how various shock and fork function according to the terrain. It makes us more informed and better riders. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Dont engineers drive trains and go TootToot?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Lol. Do mass. BTW I'm an electrical engineer and it makes complete sense to me. I also tuned suspension on race cars in college.
> 
> I'm liking the new profile setup. It gets all your screen shots and you can load settings when you switch front to rear. The app is getting better fast and I bet that the device is getting smarter every firmware update. Got a 96 with only a slow to rebound yesterday. It likes 1 click every now and then depending on my run.


Between rainy weather, work and family life I haven't been able to ride much. I'm out of shape and if I take a week or more off my ride shows it and the Shockwiz reports it too. Same trails as usual yesterday, same tune, but the shock didn't use almost all of the travel like it usually does, I didn't come close to my usual STRAVA times, and my scores fell 4-8 points depending on which section of trail we're talking about. So even human factors are a part of the equation.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Dont engineers drive trains and go TootToot?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Are you trying to say he was just blowing off some steam?


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

Congratulations. 

No black box can possibly have knowledge of the valving and dampening nuances of every shock and model. The peeps writing the firmware/back end analysis wares will always be behind the curve. Just sayin' don't believe the hype, though it can probably get you in the ballpark.

You could also get yourself in the ballpark for free by learning how the various shock systems work together and how the parameters you can change alter the shock performance.

Sorry you don't like hearing you didn't need to spend $300 ($400??) on "the wiz."


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

Its $400


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

One thing I'm going to enjoy using it for is setting up the wife's suspension. She knows when she's happy with the bike and when she's not but can't explain to me what changes are needed.

Data logging is the only real answer then.


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

That's a fair point, actually. 

It's a lot harder dialing in others' suspension when they ride really differently and/or have a very different rider weight than you. Especially when they can't describe precisely what they don't like about how it's working.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

schnellmann said:


> Congratulations.
> 
> No black box can possibly have knowledge of the valving and and dampening nuances of every shock and model. The guys writing the firmware will always be behind the curve. Just sayin' don't believe the hype, though it can probably get you in the ballpark.
> 
> ...


I agree, I didn't need to spend money on a Shockwiz, I CHOSE to. I also didn't need to buy a $6,000 bike, but I did. Lastly, you didn't need to jump in the middle if a forum and impart your unwanted opinion. I'm glad you're smarter than the majority and your bike suspension is tuned better than mine. I didn't buy it to be like you. I brought it because the engineering mind wanted data to prove the changes I thought my shock needed were in the right direction. I changed the oil in my shock to a lower viscosity before even owning a Shockwiz, all because I thought the dampening was a bit too firm. It made me feel better when I got the Shockwiz and it agreed, the damping was still a tad too firm. One lighter viscosity oil change later and things felt better and the Shockwiz agreed as well. Yes, I could have kept the same oil in the bike that came with it and adjusted the shim stack. Who knows, I may do that some day as I've already disassembled the shock several times now to the point where the shim stack was right there. But like you pointed out, I was learning how my shock really worked rather than relying on my magic box. The box is only validating my changes, not the other way around.


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

That's a good thing... seriously. But from what I'm reading that's definitely not the way it's getting used (analysis of specific changes) by most. 

And I guess I missed the sticky post about which opinions are wanted in a public forum.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

I posted similar comments a few times previously. 

Similar to onzadog, it was awesome to use the ShockWiz to set up my daughter's Process, because she can't convey what tweaks would be of benefit to her. 

And it was super interesting trying it on my own bike -- it forced me to think about every single component of my suspension, and how they interact. I came away understanding things much better. 

It was incredibly easy to use, intuitive, fun and interesting. 

But on my bike, there were numerous areas of suggestions that I 100% flat out disagree with. 

I have since removed all the tokens from my fork, bought an MRP Ramp Control (that is set on 4 of 16), increased my PSI and use my LSC on the fly, depending on how steep, slow speed and techy the downs are on a given trail. 

As for my shock, I increased the PSI by 50 from where the ShockWix had me. YES - 50 psi!!! Which is somewhere between 25 and 30% SAG. Once again, it is now floating through the double black gnar at dangerously high speeds. No more "hooking" on roots and rocks. 

The suggested settings were WAY WAY WAY too soft for my riding style and terrain. And probably for the kinematics of my bike (2015 Norco Range C7.2 - 27.5, 160mm front and back). The geo on my bike went completely screwy. I recently replaced my tried and true 2.3 DHF front tire with a 2.5WT DHF on a 24id Enve rim. I was convinced it was flopping around, because my front tire was washing out on high speed cornering. That wasn't it at all. After I firmed up my shock from where the ShockWiz had me, my bike became much more balanced, with more weight over the front. No more washing out. ZERO. Climbing returned to its former incredible self. Everything -- and I mean everything -- improved when I went back to my pre-ShockWix settings.

Whatever. It's not a knock against the ShockWiz. I had so much fun with it that I may buy a used one out of my LBS's rental pool at the end of this year. I had a blast with it. But I do not think for a second that I am best served by slavishly following its suggestions. I do what works best for me. And that was NOT the ShockWiz's suggested settings, front or back.

PS -- how long before RockShox has the ShockWiz gadgetry integrated into its suspension? I bet not long. A few years and it'll be there.

PPS - do the techs of any pros use the ShockWiz? I don't know the answer to that, but it may be interesting to know.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

schnellmann said:


> That's a good thing... seriously. But from what I'm reading that's definitely not the way it's getting used (analysis of specific changes) by most.
> 
> And I guess I missed the sticky post about which opinions are wanted in a public forum.


If you don't own a Shockwiz there's only one reason to bust up into a forum and impart your negative comments and wisdom, and that's to stir the pot. While there may not be a post stating that what you're doing is bad, common sense should tell you that. Start a forum about why you should NOT own a Shockwiz and see how many people follow it. You'd probably do nothing but yet again stir the pot as folks who own the tool would be trying to tell you that you're wrong. I was taught, if you don't have anything good to say, don't say anything at all.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> If you don't own a Shockwiz there's only one reason to bust up into a forum and impart your negative comments and wisdom, and that's to stir the pot. While there may not be a post stating that what you're doing is bad, common sense should tell you that. Start a forum about why you should NOT own a Shockwiz and see how many people follow it. You'd probably do nothing but yet again stir the pot as folks who own the tool would be trying to tell you that you're wrong. I was taught, if you don't have anything good to say, don't say anything at all.


IRBent - I hope my comments are not being perceived in a bad way. I respect your opinion -- you clearly are a master of the ShockWiz. And maybe it was user error in my case. But again, despite not agreeing with the ShockWiz's suggestions, I still loved it, and may buy one. So, all good I hope.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtnbkrmike said:


> I posted similar comments a few times previously.
> 
> Similar to onzadog, it was awesome to use the ShockWiz to set up my daughter's Process, because she can't convey what tweaks would be of benefit to her.
> 
> ...


Posts like this I can agree with. Rather than just arguing the Shockwiz can't help, he explains his use, the outcome and more. There's more than one way to achieve full suspension use. High pressure and no tokens/bands could have you using nearly all of your travel, as well as lower pressure with more tokens/bands. Which you use indeed depends on your trails, your riding style and definitely the bike's particular rear linkage design. Most people can't feel the tiny nuances between the two and the Shockwiz might better help them decide which setup to use.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> Posts like this I can agree with. Rather than just arguing the Shockwiz can't help, he explains his use, the outcome and more. There's more than one way to achieve full suspension use. High pressure and no tokens/bands could have you using nearly all of your travel, as well as lower pressure with more tokens/bands. Which you use indeed depends on your trails, your riding style and definitely the bike's particular rear linkage design. Most people can't feel the tiny nuances between the two and the Shockwiz might better help them decide which setup to use.


Thank you for all your invaluable contributions in this thread and elsewhere. SRAM should be paying you royalties, and retaining you to assist with a revised online manual, user tips and R&D. Maybe they already have...


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtnbkrmike said:


> IRBent - I hope my comments are not being perceived in a bad way. I respect your opinion -- you clearly are a master of the ShockWiz. And maybe it was user error in my case. But again, despite not agreeing with the ShockWiz's suggestions, I still loved it, and may buy one. So, all good I hope.


mtnbkrmike,

No harm, no foul. I agree with your post. I'm also far from a Shockwiz master. I've just used it on every ride for nearly 2 months and all of its data has gone into a spreadsheet. I can look at my changes from ride to ride and back from the beginning to see if they helped, had no real effect, or possibly made things worse. The more I play with it the more I will learn. I imagine too that if you get one you'll find out what I did, using it a time or two will only leave you confounded and tired. Even my ride yesterday left me perplexed when my same tune didn't use nearly all of my suspension and my trail times sucked. I realized the Shockwiz' report card wasn't reflecting low scores because of the tune that hadn't changed, but because the rider didn't ride as hard/fast as usual.


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

You actually made my point better than I did... I was overly snarky.

I'm just saying bike suspensions are now very complex elastic systems where the F and R suspensions have a performance interaction with each other on a given terrain at a given speed with a given rider's weight and F/R weight bias.

Hooking up a black box to one air spring, making changes, then hooking up the other air spring and making changes usually does alter how the first spring performs and CAN lead to a special kind of data-driven feedback loop. Endless tweaks without real gain in speed or enjoy-ability of the ride. Or worse, riding just to gather data (Strava Syndrome is well documented in the literature, lol). 

Enjoyment of the actual ride (or optimizing for competition) is what it's all about in my book. Only understanding of how these springs work can make you say "hey... maybe this ain't right" about a wizard's advice.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

I meant to say as well (which IRBent pointed out) that here is more than one way to skin a cat. I preferred to do things a little differently than where the ShockWiz was taking me, but that's me, with my bike, riding style and terrain. 

I do think that RockShox will ultimately be incorporating the ShockWiz gadgetry in its suspension. Digital readouts. Sweet.

Anyone know the answer to my earlier question -- are any techs of factory/pro riders using the ShockWiz as part of their tweaking process? Maybe not exclusively, but as one of many tools (including those in their head)?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

schnellmann said:


> Hooking up a black box to one air spring, making changes, then hooking up the other air spring and making changes usually does alter how the first spring performs and CAN lead to a special kind of data-driven feedback loop. Endless tweaks without real gain in speed or enjoy-ability of the ride. Or worse, riding just to gather data (Strava Syndrome is well documented in the literature, lol).
> 
> Enjoyment of the actual ride (or optimizing for competition) is what it's all about in my book. Only understanding of how these springs work can make you say "hey... maybe this ain't right" about a wizard's advice.


You're so right. If my ailing ride yesterday and it's results had me thinking I had to change the suspension tune, I'd be like you said, chasing my tail. That's why a weekend use of something like this can't do what riders want it to do, make everything better. If they had the best run of their life it will give the results for that. But you can't tune for a single perfect day, you have to hit that same run many times and make adjustments based off the whole rather than a single run. One thing I have noticed, my rear shock may be loosing 1 psi every week or two as the baseline pressure has dropped 3-4 psi over the last 2 months without me adjusting it. The only other logical answer would be that temps are falling which would reduce pressure. But I don't think temp is the answer here.


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## schnellmann (Oct 24, 2008)

Well I'd say there's good discussion here as a result of this post. 

Some peeps are jumping in with their wiz experiences and peeps are learning new things as a result - as you can see further down the pages. And that's the point.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtnbkrmike said:


> I meant to say as well (which IRBent pointed out) that here is more than one way to skin a cat. I preferred to do things a little differently than where the ShockWiz was taking me, but that's me, with my bike, riding style and terrain.
> 
> I do think that RockShox will ultimately be incorporating the ShockWiz gadgetry in its suspension. Digital readouts. Sweet.
> 
> Anyone know the answer to my earlier question -- are any techs of factory/pro riders using the ShockWiz as part of their tweaking process? Maybe not exclusively, but as one of many tools (including those in their head)?


My memory sucks but I'm sure that I read or saw maybe on Red Bull TV/youtube where indeed some factory riders or pro riders have used the Wiz.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> My memory sucks but I'm sure that I read or saw maybe on Red Bull TV/youtube where indeed some factory riders or pro riders have used the Wiz.


Why not, right?

That is what I suspected the answer would be. It's a very useful, fun and interesting tool. Plus any RockShox/SRAM sponsored rider would likley have the ShockWiz at his or her disposal. Who, other than an idiot, dislikes free information?

Anyway, thanks guys for tolerating my candid comments.

Back to the technical pointers...*

PS - "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to IRBent again."

Maybe one/some of you guys who feel you are benefitting from all of IRBent's expertise and generosity can do me a favour and give him some well deserved rep. If I could, I would. Thanks.

*this forum is incredible -- the absolute best source of reliable information for the biking enthusiast, ANYWHERE


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## LCW (May 5, 2008)

schnellmann said:


> there's just no way this $299 device can be effective on *any* air spring.


**** if only it was 299!! Lol


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Why not, right?
> 
> That is what I suspected the answer would be. It's a very useful, fun and interesting tool. Plus any RockShox/SRAM sponsored rider would likley have the ShockWiz at his or her disposal. Who, other than an idiot, dislikes free information?
> 
> ...


I'm a newbie here pretty much and have only been riding a couple of year. I rode MX in my earlier years and making the move to mtb brought skills over many riders don't have in both riding and mechanics. But when it comes to reputation and kudos, I could care less. I'm not the one who likes to be patted on the back but I am the guy who will stop on the trail, fix your bike and move on without expecting anything in return. I see your reputation may be maxed out whereas 2 plus years here has me at 4 little green thingies. All that means to me is that either you have lots of friends or have put out a lot of valuable information over the years and people praise you for that. Having my reputation maxed means nothing to me but it might help others decide if I'm competent to share my opinion. Thanks for the kudos mtnbkrmike.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

IRBent said:


> I'm a newbie here pretty much and have only been riding a couple of year. I rode MX in my earlier years and making the move to mtb brought skills over many riders don't have in both riding and mechanics. But when it comes to reputation and kudos, I could care less. I'm not the one who likes to be patted on the back but I am the guy who will stop on the trail, fix your bike and move on without expecting anything in return. I see your reputation may be maxed out whereas 2 plus years here has me at 4 little green thingies. All that means to me is that either you have lots of friends or have put out a lot of valuable information over the years and people praise you for that. Having my reputation maxed means nothing to me but it might help others decide if I'm competent to share my opinion. Thanks for the kudos mtnbkrmike.


Sorry to have derailed this everyone. Didn't mean to change the vibe to one of holding hands and singing Kumbaya. Carry on with the technical discussions, all of which are very interesting and enlightening.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

schnellmann said:


> there's just no way this $299 device can be effective on *any* air spring. there're so many physical variables between brands and models which the makers can't account for. I'm saying this an an engineer.
> 
> invest time in understanding what these suspension devices actually do and what aspects you can control. don't rely on a magic black box.





schnellmann said:


> Congratulations.
> 
> No black box can possibly have knowledge of the valving and dampening nuances of every shock and model. The peeps writing the firmware/back end analysis wares will always be behind the curve. Just sayin' don't believe the hype, though it can probably get you in the ballpark.
> 
> ...





schnellmann said:


> You actually made my point better than I did... I was overly snarky.
> 
> I'm just saying bike suspensions are now very complex elastic systems where the F and R suspensions have a performance interaction with each other on a given terrain at a given speed with a given rider's weight and F/R weight bias.
> 
> ...





schnellmann said:


> Well I'd say there's good discussion here as a result of this post.
> 
> Some peeps are jumping in with their wiz experiences and peeps are learning new things as a result - as you can see further down the pages. And that's the point.


Congratulations, in your efforts to make yourself seem overly intelligent you made yourself seem like an illiterate buffoon. You obviously cannot comprehend how this device works, at all. It could not care less if you are on a shim stack or poppet valve setup, if there are three ports or twenty, it just does not care.

As an extension of this you've also shown that you have below a layman's understanding of how any given dampening device achieves its results. The intervals of the device do not matter. For any single person, on any single bike, there will be at least two constants, shaft speed and the shaft's position in its travel, regardless of internals. So yes, the device can measure exactly what it needs to measure to give accurate results.

Furthermore, your claims of not achieving balance are laughably incorrect. Due to the aforementioned characteristics the device measures to achieve its suggestions, it is going to result in the same exact parameters front and rear as it does not see the different leverage curves between the two and just focuses on the dampening forces imparted on the shaft. (Some may like a stiffer fork than the device tunes for but that is neither what you said or were attempting to say.)

You may act like you were attempting to drive conversation now but in reality it started with an overly arrogant attitude, thinly veiled insults and a laughably underwhelming attempt to impress with your knowledge. Only when your arguments were shown to be false or fall flat did you change the purpose and tone of your posts.

I responded in kind with your tone so that those that are thinking of buying one of these devices would have an equally "loud" counter argument to keep your uneducated, incorrect advice from dissuading them of buying a useful product.

By the way, I'm saying all of this as an engineer.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I think an issue with the shockwiz, is if you take a smoother ride than your preferred Trails, or you're just not riding well one particular day, or maybe you haven't worked up the nerve to do the drops, it can steer you to a very soft suspension setup. I don't know how to get around that, maybe you just click on cross-country for that day and it will not expect you to use all of your suspension?

I have learned not to make adjustments every time I ride just based on the Shockwiz, I just keep an eye on what it's suggesting and tuning for the days that represent how I want to ride and the sort of terrain that I really care how my bike is performing on.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Suns_PSD said:


> I think an issue with the shockwiz, is if you take a smoother ride than your preferred Trails, or you're just not riding well one particular day, or maybe you haven't worked up the nerve to do the drops, it can steer you to a very soft suspension setup. I don't know how to get around that, maybe you just click on cross-country for that day and it will not expect you to use all of your suspension?
> 
> I have learned not to make adjustments every time I ride just based on the Shockwiz, I just keep an eye on what it's suggesting and tuning for the days that represent how I want to ride and the sort of terrain that I really care how my bike is performing on.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


I agree. It wanted me to soften my rear up dramatically after my ride yesterday but I was far from on my game and was riding nowhere near as fast/hard as I usually do so I just ignored it for that day.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> I agree. It wanted me to soften my rear up dramatically after my ride yesterday but I was far from on my game and was riding nowhere near as fast/hard as I usually do so I just ignored it for that day.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


Hey guys. While I agree with the last two posts, easier rides or smoother trails than you usually ride typically toss back suggestions to soften things and give lower scores. Especially if looking at the same tune for your aggressive rides. I've been tuning in the playful mode on rough, rocky, rooted trails followed by a trail with maybe 10 table top jumps. Scores range from 88 to 96 with most rides at 92 or 96. But if I use the same tune and ride smoother trails I usually get the same kind of scores if I look at those rides in the efficient tuning mode.

Now for the oddity. After this latest software update my same tune is scoring in the 90's on smooth trails and in the playful mode. If I select balanced or efficient modes my scores drop into the upper 70's and 80's. This has happened on my rides yesterday and today so far and has made me change my smooth trail profile to look at the playful mode. It seems like they've spread the efficient tune and the playful tune further apart. Of course, further testing/playing is required.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Hey guys. While I agree with the last two posts, easier rides or smoother trails than you usually ride typically toss back suggestions to soften things and give lower scores. Especially if looking at the same tune for your aggressive rides. I've been tuning in the playful mode on rough, rocky, rooted trails followed by a trail with maybe 10 table top jumps. Scores range from 88 to 96 with most rides at 92 or 96. But if I use the same tune and ride smoother trails I usually get the same kind of scores if I look at those rides in the efficient tuning mode.
> 
> Now for the oddity. After this latest software update my same tune is scoring in the 90's on smooth trails and in the playful mode. If I select balanced or efficient modes my scores drop into the upper 70's and 80's. This has happened on my rides yesterday and today so far and has made me change my smooth trail profile to look at the playful mode. It seems like they've spread the efficient tune and the playful tune further apart. Of course, further testing/playing is required.


I was not riding smoother trails, rougher actually if anything, I just was not charging as hard or popping off of stuff as I usually do because I had some weird upper body weakness/shakiness going on.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Just bought a 2018 Fox 36 Factory Series Fork, can't wait to tune it with Shockwiz!










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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> I was not riding smoother trails, rougher actually if anything, I just was not charging as hard or popping off of stuff as I usually do because I had some weird upper body weakness/shakiness going on.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk


I was the same way yesterday, riding under my usual level. But today was another subject that I can't explain just yet.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

BTW, always enjoy IRBent posting. Learns heap, and minimise my guessing work. Haha 


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Just bought a 2018 Fox 36 Factory Series Fork, can't wait to tune it with Shockwiz!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You should have bought two, that way I could tune one and we could compare notes. LOL

All jokes aside, I supposedly won a SunTour Auron but SunTour has yet to contact me to ask which version I'd prefer.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> BTW, always enjoy IRBent posting. Learns heap, and minimise my guessing work. Haha
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You know I call that at my work? The blind leading the blind. LOL


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> You should have bought two, that way I could tune one and we could compare notes. LOL
> 
> All jokes aside, I supposedly won a SunTour Auron but SunTour has yet to contact me to ask which version I'd prefer.


Wow! Lucky you dude! Can't wait to see your new toy and Shockwiz tuning suggestion and your analysis.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Wow! Lucky you dude! Can't wait to see your new toy and Shockwiz tuning suggestion and your analysis.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Don't hold your breath. It's been a month now and no real correspondence. Then two, not so sure it would be an upgrade over my Pike with a Vorsprung Luftkappe already installed. It will have a few extra knobs over my RC2 Pike that might help dial in things. But I may never open the box, but rather offload it in favor of some other toy.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> You know I call that at my work? The blind leading the blind. LOL


LOL!

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

Got another session in on the Nomad with X2. Did an ultra epic ride, 4k vert, 15mi. I rode as hard as I could, the very edge of control, for me anyway. Unfortunately I had my climb switch on for the first few hundred feet of climbing/10-15min, which seems to have brought down the dynamic sag number a bit... was 29 before. I'm surprised out of that many miles that it still had an effect for such a short period of time. I don't always ride that hard so I'm thinking my settings are just fine. Seat of the pants the shock feels pretty perfect to me.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker said:


> Got another session in on the Nomad with X2. Did an ultra epic ride, 4k vert, 15mi. I rode as hard as I could, the very edge of control, for me anyway. Unfortunately I had my climb switch on for the first few hundred feet of climbing/10-15min, which seems to have brought down the dynamic sag number a bit... was 29 before. I'm surprised out of that many miles that it still had an effect for such a short period of time. I don't always ride that hard so I'm thinking my settings are just fine. Seat of the pants the shock feels pretty perfect to me.
> 
> View attachment 1153127


Wow, still not to shabby for such a long ride. 111 jumps, that's more than my trail system offers if I ride it 8-10 times. Since you, as you said, were riding at the seat of your pants and still got suggestions to increase air and ramp, I'd consider adding maybe 2psi more and see if things get even better. If not, you're near golden already. Good work on such a tough ride.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

SonomaBiker said:


> Got another session in on the Nomad with X2. Did an ultra epic ride, 4k vert, 15mi. I rode as hard as I could, the very edge of control, for me anyway. Unfortunately I had my climb switch on for the first few hundred feet of climbing/10-15min, which seems to have brought down the dynamic sag number a bit... was 29 before. I'm surprised out of that many miles that it still had an effect for such a short period of time. I don't always ride that hard so I'm thinking my settings are just fine. Seat of the pants the shock feels pretty perfect to me.
> 
> View attachment 1153127


I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure dynamic sag isn't something that needs to be set like static sag. Static sag is a measurement of how hard it will be to compress the damper, like preload on a coil.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> Got another session in on the Nomad with X2. Did an ultra epic ride, 4k vert, 15mi. I rode as hard as I could, the very edge of control, for me anyway. Unfortunately I had my climb switch on for the first few hundred feet of climbing/10-15min, which seems to have brought down the dynamic sag number a bit... was 29 before. I'm surprised out of that many miles that it still had an effect for such a short period of time. I don't always ride that hard so I'm thinking my settings are just fine. Seat of the pants the shock feels pretty perfect to me.
> 
> View attachment 1153127


That's hell lot of ride!

You are an aggressive rider. Would you consider adding more spacer on your X2 if you have not done so?

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

SonomaBiker, I fixed my comment. Sorry for getting it backwards. I'm trying to multitask with half a brain. Maybe I should stick to licking windows. LOL


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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

IR, Didn't see the comment, all good either way brother.

tucker, yea, I just thought someone might have noticed my last tuning showed a bit higher dynamic sag and comment about it. Also the fact that I have a mid/shorter sag, I have no deep compression events, yet it still wants me to add air/spacer. Might have looked odd. Pretty sure having that climb switch on for a little while climbing brought the average dynamic sag down a few percent.

chris, I don't think I can ride my bike any harder than that, and I certainly didn't feel like I was maxing out the shock, I didn't feel a single top out. I had about 1/8" to go, LOL! Sag and pedal strike are very good, for this bike, so I think I'm going to leave things how they are. This way on more casual days the suspension isn't too tight to just have a more relaxing ride...without having to adjust pressure per ride (I'm lazy).

I'm pretty stoked on this shock, it's a very good compliment to the Fox 36. They are very balanced together. This bike has never felt so good! Love me some Nomad!


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

SonomaBiker said:


> IR, Didn't see the comment, all good either way brother.
> 
> tucker, yea, I just thought someone might have noticed my last tuning showed a bit higher dynamic sag and comment about it. Also the fact that I have a mid/shorter sag, I have no deep compression events, yet it still wants me to add air/spacer. Might have looked odd. Pretty sure having that climb switch on for a little while climbing brought the average dynamic sag down a few percent.
> 
> ...


If you climbed more than usual that may have played a part as well. Depending on the bike climbing can cause you to ride much higher than even flat pedaling due to more force, just a thought.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Just did calibration on my new 2018 Fox 36 (160mm) Factory Series 29 Fork. Got CR 2.2. Anyone has the same reading? 

PS: 1 spacer 

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## SonomaBiker (Dec 14, 2013)

chris9888 said:


> Just did calibration on my new 2018 Fox 36 (160mm) Factory Series 29 Fork. Got CR 2.2. Anyone has the same reading?
> 
> PS: 1 spacer
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


My two 2017 RC2's with default # spacers... 150mm = 2.3, 170mm = 2.9


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

*shockwiz on Cane Creek DBAIR IL*

I had to do a non-approved MacGuyver install in order to get the shockwiz to mount on an inline. The IL schrader adapter is inline with the shock and too close to the shock body for the SRAM provided connection hoses to thread on. Also the provided SRAM hose vavle orientations are not conducive to an inline schrader connection.

I had to buy a schrader valve extender at the autoparts store and then was able to thread the hose onto it. It then just BARELY cleared the shock head. I could no orient the hose to be able to mount the shockwiz to the shock and had to use a "sliding zip-tie" methodology in order to allow the shockwiz to mount the frame but also travel with the shock as it moved.

Hope this helps.










hitechredneck said:


> What about Can creek shocks. DB and Inline? I am thinking about picking one of these up now they are back on the market. I want to use it for race courses over the summer. I really like nerding it up with stuff like this.


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

*Can Creek Install*

I had to do a non-approved MacGuyver install in order to get the shockwiz to mount on an inline. The IL schrader adapter is inline with the shock and too close to the shock body for the SRAM provided connection hoses to thread on. Also the provided SRAM hose vavle orientations are not conducive to an inline schrader connection.

I had to buy a schrader valve extender at the autoparts store and then was able to thread the hose onto it. It then just BARELY cleared the shock head. I could no orient the hose to be able to mount the shockwiz to the shock and had to use a "sliding zip-tie" methodology in order to allow the shockwiz to mount the frame but also travel with the shock as it moved.

Hope this helps.



hitechredneck said:


> So no on can creek stuff since you did not answer yes like the other questions?
> 
> In case it was missed......
> 
> ...


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

I use one of these on the IL shock:
Topeak Pressure-Rite Connector | Chain Reaction Cycles


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

Regarding "not changing settings" during ride sessions...

This did not really hold true for me with a Cane Creek DBAIR IL. I started in the "open setting" The shock wiz quickly got me into the right tuning range for shock pressure, HSC and HSR. However it of course said I needed more LSC due to bobbing while pedaling. As soon as I started utilizing the shock to how I would normally ride it, engaging the climb switch when climbing and opening it when descending, I started getting the 100% confidence and the suggestions all came into "OK" status.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

laksboy said:


> Regarding "not changing settings" during ride sessions...
> 
> This did not really hold true for me with a Cane Creek DBAIR IL. I started in the "open setting" The shock wiz quickly got me into the right tuning range for shock pressure, HSC and HSR. However it of course said I needed more LSC due to bobbing while pedaling. As soon as I started utilizing the shock to how I would normally ride it, engaging the climb switch when climbing and opening it when descending, I started getting the 100% confidence and the suggestions all came into "OK" status.


What tune mode was you utilizing and what kind of score did you get at 100% confidence? Also, did you stay in the same tune mode? My past experience has been, I could ride ugly stuff and look at the results in the playful mode. If I used nearly all of my travel my score would be in the 90's @ 100% confidence. However leave the switch in the open mode and ride smoother trails and like you, pedal bob and pogo would exist, lowering my scores. I also would use but maybe half my travel which in playful mode would tell me I needed to lower my air and ramp. But if I switched from playful to efficient tune mode, the less travel used would meet the criteria the efficient mode preferred and I'd get scores in the 90's on the smooth trails. So I could see where flipping the switch could do the same, but maybe only if you swapped tuning modes to analyze the data. Now with that said, it seems this latest app update with profiles may be negating all of what I just said. My rough trail tune scored in the 90's yesterday on smooth trails with the switch wide open looking at the results in the playful mode. But it dropped into the 80's if I looked at it in the efficient mode. The last few rides after the app update has given me data that didn't seem to fit the trends I've been seeing during my two months of use. I have no answers just yet as to why things have changed.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SonomaBiker said:


> My two 2017 RC2's with default # spacers... 150mm = 2.3, 170mm = 2.9


Thanks Sonoma biker.

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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

laksboy said:


> I had to do a non-approved MacGuyver install in order to get the shockwiz to mount on an inline. The IL schrader adapter is inline with the shock and too close to the shock body for the SRAM provided connection hoses to thread on. Also the provided SRAM hose vavle orientations are not conducive to an inline schrader connection.
> 
> I had to buy a schrader valve extender at the autoparts store and then was able to thread the hose onto it. It then just BARELY cleared the shock head. I could no orient the hose to be able to mount the shockwiz to the shock and had to use a "sliding zip-tie" methodology in order to allow the shockwiz to mount the frame but also travel with the shock as it moved.
> 
> ...


Thanks for this info. I use it with the db inline (not air) and the canister rotates so I haven't had any issues with mounting the shockwiz.

I'm surprised the inlineAir is so tight that it won't allow the hoses to thread on; I have some shock pumps with heads wider than the shockwiz hoses, so I think they would have accounted for clearance.

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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

Playful mode. 96% score, 99% confidence. I did not switch modes. Brand new enduro bike and I was quickly trying to get it "close" before riding Breck Epic. I ended up adding another 5psi to the shock during the event to try and get a bit more efficient due to the nature of the event and all the guys on xc bikes... I have not used the shockwiz yet on my home trails now that I'm back. But I'll be tuning for playful


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

Yeah. I have one older shockpump that does not fit the Cane Creek shock and a newer RS pump that does. Go figure that the fittings on the Shockwiz would be fatter than the fittings on my RS shockpump...


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

That look perfect and would solve both problems. I picked up the new bike en-route to Downieville and Breck Epic and was glad to have found a solution while on the road.


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## hitechredneck (May 9, 2009)

Just borrowed a shock wiz. Any advice or tips for first time user? 

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

hitechredneck said:


> Just borrowed a shock wiz. Any advice or tips for first time user?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


Don't expect miracles in a few rides. Your best tune will come with maybe 10-20 rides while you learn how each ride, trail change, and rider effects the results. Stick to the same trail for tuning. Pick a route with plenty of variability if you want to tune for across the board results. If you want to tune to maximize the ugly trail, tune for as much of it as possible, then start another session for smoother stuff. It's hard to get great scores on rough stuff and expect great scores riding roads to be the same. The Wiz expects your suspension to move and while that will be the case on ugly trails, roads won't move the suspension much. That's why it's hard to get good results on each section independently without looking at different tune modes. I think if you scroll back a few days, maybe 2 weeks, you find a discussion about this.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Awesome advice IRBent!

Hitechredneck, make sure you do the calibration properly and get the compression ratio right. During calibration, ensure you fully extend and compress the fork/shock when asked to do so.

Happy tuning!


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## SofaKing Fast (Nov 30, 2005)

I have a 2018 36 27.5 boost and have a 2.7CR.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

SofaKing Fast said:


> I have a 2018 36 27.5 boost and have a 2.7CR.


How many tokens in your fork? 
I added one more token (total 2 tokens) in my 2018 fox 36 29er boost and strangely the CR remains at 2.2.

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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Do you guys use the dynamic sag number that shockwiz reports as your sag measurement?

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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Sort of. My pike came back with a dynamic sag of 12% while static was 25%. Everything else was spot on except the compression which shockwiz says should be softer (i thought the same even before shockwiz) so I'm going to try the luftkape but at the same pressure. That should give more dynamic sag and less initial compression. Hopefully without spoiling my currently spot on air pressure and ramp up readings.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

onzadog said:


> Sort of. My pike came back with a dynamic sag of 12% while static was 25%. Everything else was spot on except the compression which shockwiz says should be softer (i thought the same even before shockwiz) so I'm going to try the luftkape but at the same pressure. That should give more dynamic sag and less initial compression. Hopefully without spoiling my currently spot on air pressure and ramp up readings.


I've yet to use the Shockwiz on my Pike with the Luftkappe, but the Luftkappe made a pronounced difference in initial compliance and plushness. I'm on a 150mm Pike and loving the extra negative volume.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

When I first bought the Shockwiz I assumed I'd ride 1-2x, have my bike set up, and no longer use it. Boy was I wrong!

I tried out trail tires for the hot summer but due to a lack of traction, they slowed me down a fair bit. Shockwiz told me to reduce compression damping from the standard Avalanche recommended settings, a lot.

So I just put some proper enduro tires on and rode hard, now Shockwiz wants me to tighten up rebound while leaving compression at the standard settings.

You can't just jump in and start turning knobs.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

Suns_PSD said:


> Do you guys use the dynamic sag number that shockwiz reports as your sag measurement?


i think DS only matches static sag if you ride well mixed *level* terrain at the start of a session, and then check DS before the terrain changes for only up or only down. that is, anything that has you predominantly over the front (decending) or rear (climbing) of the bike will lead to a mismatch between static and dynamic values.

so yes, i check it, but it's value to me varies depending on the terrain (and on the order of flat, up or down components of that terrain) ridden for the current session.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> i think DS only matches static sag if you ride well mixed terrain at the start of a session, and then check DS before the terrain changes. anything which has you predominantly over the front (decending) or rear (climbing) of the bike will lead to a mismatch between static and dynamic values.
> 
> so yes, i check it, but it's value to me varies depending on the terrain (and on the order of flat, up or down components of that terrain) ridden for the current session.


Dynamic sag is a measurement taken while pedaling. You actually want it to be less than your static sag number as most bikes are going to ride "much" (we are talking a few millimeters here) higher when pedaling due to how the suspension functions, if talking the rear.

The other aspect is that static sag is akin to the preload on a coil. It's a great indicator of the amount of pressure, ie force, 25% four times greater, 30% ~3 times greater, it will take to compress the damper to full travel.

That is why so many people run different numbers front and rear for static sag. Plush in the rear and a little firmer up front to prevent dives and OTBs.

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

99 degree celcius? Almost boiling point. I need a heat sink! Must be software glitch. Haha!










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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> 99 degree celcius? Almost boiling point. I need a heat sink! Must be software glitch. Haha!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, I'd say the thermistor in you Wiz took a wiz. Someone posted the built-in temp was used to correct the algorithm on pressures and aid in scores. With your shock temp showing probably twice what it really is makes me wonder how accurate your results are if it actually takes temp into consideration.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Yeah, I'd say the thermistor in you Wiz took a wiz. Someone posted the built-in temp was used to correct the algorithm on pressures and aid in scores. With your shock temp showing probably twice what it really is makes me wonder how accurate your results are if it actually takes temp into consideration.


Right. My Shockwiz recorded temp average 28 to 30 degree in this part of the World. Will write off the suggestion if anything exceptionally more or less.

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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

chris9888 said:


> 99 degree celcius? Almost boiling point. I need a heat sink! Must be software glitch. Haha!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hast sink, nur only for the shock

https://fotos.mtb-news.de/p/2190092


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

boblike said:


> Hast sink, nur only for the shock
> 
> https://fotos.mtb-news.de/p/2190092


Lol! They need to make one for Fork version

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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

I'm a bit late to the shockwiz party. Been using a borrowed one for the past week or so. Fascinating so have gone all in and brought my own.

I think I might have uncovered a problem with my rear shock as a result. That's still being worked through

As well as my own Strive I have my wife's bike to process and my intention is to help a couple of mates out too

I've created a sheet to help with this to keep track of changes made

Have a look via this dropbox link and let me know what you think

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cygiobp3syayljx/Shockwiz Tuning Sheet.docx?dl=0

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

iggs said:


> I'm a bit late to the shockwiz party. Been using a borrowed one for the past week or so. Fascinating so have gone all in and brought my own.
> 
> I think I might have uncovered a problem with my rear shock as a result. That's still being worked through
> 
> ...


What type of problem do you think you've uncovered? I've been using the Shockwiz for several months and keeping track of ally of the data in an Excel spreadsheet. I've seen my own results meander from excellent to acceptable while tracking data on the same trail. From my viewpoint the results a Shockwiz gives is very useful but not exactly the ends all some might think it is. You can get perfect results today and less than perfect results tomorrow, same trail, same bike, same suspension setup. It is what it is, a tool to get you close.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

IRBent said:


> What type of problem do you think you've uncovered? I've been using the Shockwiz for several months and keeping track of ally of the data in an Excel spreadsheet. I've seen my own results meander from excellent to acceptable while tracking data on the same trail. From my viewpoint the results a Shockwiz gives is very useful but not exactly the ends all some might think it is. You can get perfect results today and less than perfect results tomorrow, same trail, same bike, same suspension setup. It is what it is, a tool to get you close.


The rear shock seems to need more pressure than other people of the same weight using the same frame shock combo

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sh...tbr.com/showthread.php?t=1055331&share_type=t

I spoke to the fox distributor yesterday and it may be caused by the piggy back cartridge having lost some pressure. Need to go to them for warrantee evaluation.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

iggs said:


> The rear shock seems to need more pressure than other people of the same weight using the same frame shock combo
> 
> https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sh...tbr.com/showthread.php?t=1055331&share_type=t
> 
> ...


That indeed could be a problem. My shock uses a bladder that is user adjustable rather than the old school nitrogen charge set at the factory. It surely makes customization user friendly.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Has anybody considered the volume in the hoses or the Shockwix itself and how it plays into the overall compression ratio? I could imagine even the smaller hose and the Wiz holding as much air as a the volume a tuning band on a rear shock would take up. So while we're all tuning with extra volume added by way of the hoses and the Wiz, what happens when we disconnect everything?


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Must be insignificant however easy test would be to calibrate your fork with the long and short hose and see if there is any difference in the CR.

If there is maybe it's assuming your using long on the fork and short on the shock and compensating. Though there are scenarios where you can use the short on the front fork and it doesn't ask you to specify which hose your using so probably as initially said it's insignificant.


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## Picard (Apr 5, 2005)

Is shockwize worth it?
does it help you to tune shocks?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Picard said:


> Is shockwize worth it?
> does it help you to tune shocks?


Let's say this. If you don't know anything about suspension tuning, yes, the Shockwiz can help you. But to get a real good feel for the best tune, you'll need maybe 10-20 rides on both shock and fork. My experience took me over a month to get a handle on my rear shock alone. Even though I had a good idea about tuning, the Shockwiz helping me hone in on the best setup overall.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Picard said:


> Is shockwize worth it?
> does it help you to tune shocks?


Bahahahaha! This thread has now officially been Picarded. Good luck guys.


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## Picard (Apr 5, 2005)

mtnbkrmike said:


> Bahahahaha! This thread has now officially been Picarded. Good luck guys.


I am glad to help you guys out. the world would be boring without me eh.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Picard said:


> I am glad to help you guys out. the world would be boring without me eh.


lol. please do.


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## Picard (Apr 5, 2005)

alexbn921 said:


> lol. please do.


I have blessed this thread. You don't need to fear evil spirits from haunting you guys. I will protect all of you.

No fear. the captain is on the job


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Picard said:


> I have blessed this thread. You don't need to fear evil spirits from haunting you guys. I will protect all of you.
> 
> No fear. the captain is on the job


Now I am scared. LOL


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## Picard (Apr 5, 2005)

IRBent said:


> Now I am scared. LOL


Don't be scared. Do you have a sister? I will watch out for her.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Picard said:


> Don't be scared. Do you have a sister? I will watch out for her.
> 
> Sent from my F3213 using Tapatalk


Dude, you done lost yo mind. My sister is big, ugly and a basket case. I wouldn't wish that on anybody.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

Went to use my new shockwiz for the first time and the air value is not working correctly

Holds air when connected to a pressurised shock but stick open at the low pressures required to calibrate the shock. I can hear the air sucking in and blowing out when fully and compressing the shock. Means it won't calibrate 

Couldn't find my Schrader valve tool earlier. Will dig it out after I've eaten and see if removing and reinstalling the valve core helps.

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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

iggs said:


> Went to use my new shockwiz for the first time and the air value is not working correctly
> 
> Holds air when connected to a pressurised shock but stick open at the low pressures required to calibrate the shock. I can hear the air sucking in and blowing out when fully and compressing the shock. Means it won't calibrate
> 
> ...


Seems to have worked. Holding pressure now

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## fdes (Apr 16, 2014)

Ok, just had my first ride with the shockwiz. In the suggestions it is recommending that I speed up my rebound, but in the detections it is telling me that my bike is pogoing. If it is pogoing, doesn't this mean that I have not enough rebound damping and should slow down the rebound?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

fdes said:


> Ok, just had my first ride with the shockwiz. In the suggestions it is recommending that I speed up my rebound, but in the detections it is telling me that my bike is pogoing. If it is pogoing, doesn't this mean that I have not enough rebound damping and should slow down the rebound?


Two things. Don't take a single ride's results as a definitive answer as your next ride even if on the very same trail could give you different results. Secondly, always try to solve the puzzle by fixing at the first thing at the top, ride again, then check the next results.


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## fdes (Apr 16, 2014)

IRBent said:


> Two things. Don't take a single ride's results as a definitive answer as your next ride even if on the very same trail could give you different results. Secondly, always try to solve the puzzle by fixing at the first thing at the top, ride again, then check the next results.


 Thanks good to know. I won't play speed up the rebound then, I will work on one thing at a time.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Agree with IRBent don't look down the list and change everything.. work stepwise down from Air Pressure changing one thing only at a time. Pretty sure it says this in the manual but its easily missed.

IMO all the other "results" below a red/amber value are meaningless until you sort the highest "problem" in the list. There are exceptions but right out of the box just work down.. get it sorted then tweak away trying different things to see what you like knowing you can always go back to a "calibrated baseline tune".


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I still don't really get how to use the profiles, do you select one after your ride, or before beginning?

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## fdes (Apr 16, 2014)

Ok guys, can't figure out what the shockwiz is suggesting. Let's start with baseline air pressure. It has a slider bar, that on the left side says Remove air, in the middle ok, on the right it has Add air. My suggestion is a red bar all the way to the left over the Remove air. Am I supposed to remove air, or to bring the slider to the right am I supposed to add air?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Follow the instructions. It says to remove air. Amber is a 5% adjustment, red is 10%.


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## fdes (Apr 16, 2014)

onzadog said:


> Follow the instructions. It says to remove air. Amber is a 5% adjustment, red is 10%.


That's just it, the way I read the instruction is that to move the slider to the right I had to add air. Interestingly enough I added 5% air and now the slider went from amber to red, which is what prompted me to figure out that I had used opposite logic.

The odd thing, the bike felt much better adding air, cornered like a champ and took 15 secs off my time yesterday. I think I am looking for the wrong profile for my riding. I set it for aggressive, but it is asking for about 40% sag and less ramp up.

Based on how the bike rode today and cycling through the profiles I get an OK on air pressure and ramp up on the playful profile. Somit looks like a playful profile is what I am looking for in terms of feel.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Dynamic sag is a measurement taken while pedaling. You actually want it to be less than your static sag number as most bikes are going to ride "much" (we are talking a few millimeters here) higher when pedaling due to how the suspension functions, if talking the rear.


my experience has shown that, assuming sessioning over level-ish but not necessarily smooth terrain, then static and dynamic sag are more or less equal.

rather than an 'i think ... ' guess here, we have to assume that quarq has enough data to know how to set up the algorithm to achieve this - at least *for the majority of mainstream suspension types*. or put another way - i cannot imagine any scenario during the design stage which would have led to a decision like 'oh yeah, lets screw with the users and make sure dynamic sag is different' ...

that said, then more or less i think you have a point. that is, there are likely a few suspension designs which cannot be easily included. my maverick, for example ... any terrain requiring body english means you are off the saddle, and a static (sitting) sag of 30% then turns into a dynamic sag of (on average) 20% (so much too firm). i always knew this, but shockwiz lets me quantify it - more realistic is 35%/25% or even 40%/30%.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> my experience has shown that, assuming sessioning over level-ish but not necessarily smooth terrain, then static and dynamic sag are more or less equal.
> 
> rather than an 'i think ... ' guess here, we have to assume that quarq has enough data to know how to set up the algorithm to achieve this - at least *for the majority of mainstream suspension types*. or put another way - i cannot imagine any scenario during the design stage which would have led to a decision like 'oh yeah, lets screw with the users and make sure dynamic sag is different' ...
> 
> that said, then more or less i think you have a point. that is, there are likely a few suspension designs which cannot be easily included. my maverick, for example ... any terrain requiring body english means you are off the saddle, and a static (sitting) sag of 30% then turns into a dynamic sag of (on average) 20% (so much too firm). i always knew this, but shockwiz lets me quantify it - more realistic is 35%/25% or even 40%/30%.


First, dynamic sag should be different, it even states as much in the description, especially for the rear, if you understand suspension kinematics. Riding over level static and dynamic sag may approximate each other but as soon as you begin a prolonged climb on a pedal efficient bike the dynamic number will start to decrease.

Second, the Shockwiz is black boxed away from all of those factors, kinematics, body positioning, etc. The simplistic version is it only cares about what is going on with the air pressures inside the damper. It's designed in that way because that's how it must function to give good quality feedback.

Third, Dynamic Sag is "likely" included with the novelty stats for a reason. It shouldn't play a large role in tuning unless it is at an extreme.

Finally, setting suspension rate off of Dynamic Sag is not going to get you a pleasant or efficient tune. Static sag is what decides the rate, same as preload in a coil. Simplisticly, for x amount of air to give y percent of sag it is going to take y times body weight of force to body the fully compress the damper. You should be riding higher in the travel when pedaling hard, that's what helps the bike be efficient. Your spring rate is the same however, Dynamic Sag has nothing to do with that, as if you hit a bump hard enough to bottom you are almost guaranteed not to pedal through it. Riding higher also allows the rear to be slightly more sensitive as you are pedaling since there is less force needed at the smaller number to get the damper moving.

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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

this response is intended to be taken as 'neutral' - snark free, nothing written between the lines ...



tuckerjt07 said:


> First, dynamic sag should be different, it even states as much in the description, especially for the rear ...


can you point out where that appears?



tuckerjt07 said:


> Riding over level static and dynamic sag may approximate each other but as soon as you begin a prolonged climb on a pedal efficient bike the dynamic number will start to decrease.


i stated as much in my previous 2 posts.



tuckerjt07 said:


> Second, the Shockwiz is black boxed away from all of those factors, kinematics, body positioning, etc. The simplistic version is it only cares about what is going on with the air pressures inside the damper. It's designed in that way because that's how it must function to give good quality feedback.


agreed ... good quality AND useful, common sense feedback - across varying rider styles, different suspension types, varying lever rates, etc. etc.. this is why i assume quarq would have generally aimed for what makes the most sense to the greatest number of users, across the largest number of common (modern) suspension designs.



tuckerjt07 said:


> Finally, setting suspension rate off of Dynamic Sag is not going to get you a pleasant or efficient tune. Static sag is what decides the rate, same as preload in a coil. Simplisticly, for x amount of air to give y percent of sag it is going to take y times body weight of force to body the fully compress the damper.


i didn't follow you in your previous post, and neither do i here. are you assuming the air shock behaves linearly?



tuckerj said:


> You should be riding higher in the travel when pedaling hard, that's what helps the bike be efficient. Your spring rate is the same however, Dynamic Sag has nothing to do with that, as if you hit a bump hard enough to bottom you are almost guaranteed not to pedal through it. Riding higher also allows the rear to be slightly more sensitive as you are pedaling since there is less force needed at the smaller number to get the damper moving.


i'm not sure i buy that, as e.g. some suspension designs are designed to keep the travel @sag when you are pedalling, e.g. to reduce bob, but remain supple for other inputs. however, this topic is probably a minefield of potential counter-arguments, so i make no generalistic claims.

on my maverick, however, moving weight off of the saddle (onto the pedals) does change the kinematics (different leveraging). this aspect of the monolink design is well known, and much loved/hated. the dynamic sag in this case is worth more TO ME than the static value.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> this response is intended to be taken as 'neutral' - snark free, nothing written between the lines ...
> 
> can you point out where that appears?


Reread the portion of the quote that you edited out.



ragetty said:


> i stated as much in my previous 2 posts.
> 
> agreed ... good quality AND useful, common sense feedback - across varying rider styles, different suspension types, varying lever rates, etc. etc.. this is why i assume quarq would have generally aimed for what makes the most sense to the greatest number of users, across the largest number of common (modern) suspension designs.


No, they didn't design it in this manner. The beauty of a blackbox is that it will work with any design, kinematics, or rider input, regardless of how out of the box the variable is as long as the air spring is what Shockwiz expects.



ragetty said:


> i didn't follow you in your previous post, and neither do i here. are you assuming the air shock behaves linearly?


Don't take my word for it. If you're pressed for time watch from 1:15 - 1:30.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/tuesday-tune-ep-7-less-obvious-aspects-of-sag-2016.html



ragetty said:


> i'm not sure i buy that, as e.g. some suspension designs are designed to keep the travel @sag when you are pedalling, e.g. to reduce bob, but remain supple for other inputs. however, this topic is probably a minefield of potential counter-arguments, so i make no generalistic claims.
> 
> on my maverick, however, moving weight off of the saddle (onto the pedals) does change the kinematics (different leveraging). this aspect of the monolink design is well known, and much loved/hated. the dynamic sag in this case is worth more TO ME than the static value.


As a general rule as the anti-squat number decreases bobbing will increase. High anti-squat values will result in the suspension "growing" under power.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Reread the portion of the quote that you edited out.


i still don't see it. please show us where this statement about the dynamic sag being less than static sag can be found. i don't see it in the definition in the app.



tuckerjt07 said:


> ... as long as the air spring is what Shockwiz expects.


agreed. your caveat is exactly my point.



tuckerjt07 said:


> Don't take my word for it. If you're pressed for time watch from 1:15 - 1:30.


ok, at that point in the video he is talking about linear springs, or more exactly a linear rate in the overall kinematic - so, yes, i now understand your numbers, but naturally, and as noted in the video, this only works approx. for real bike kinematics.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> i still don't see it. please show us where this statement about the dynamic sag being less than static sag can be found. i don't see it in the definition in the app.
> 
> agreed. your caveat is exactly my point.
> 
> ok, at that point in the video he is talking about linear springs, or more exactly a linear rate in the overall kinematic - so, yes, i now understand your numbers, but naturally, and as noted in the video, this only works approx. for real bike kinematics.


Show me where I said it should be less and that it was verbatim in the app. I said if you read that and understand how kinematics work that static would be different than dynamic.

They could have went with the Suss My Bike model but the numbers would not have been as precise by the nature of the way the measurements are taken. There are quite a few popular damper choices, front and rear, that are currently excluded.

It is always possible to accurately discuss fully extended to fully compressed suspension in linear terms, just plot a line between the two points, you just can't have accuracy on the points between with this method.

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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

tuckerjt07 said:


> Show me where I said it should be less and that it was verbatim in the app. I said if you read that and understand how kinematics work that static would be different than dynamic.


you wrote this a week a go:



tuckerjt07 said:


> Dynamic sag is a measurement taken while pedaling. You actually want it to be less than your static sag number as most bikes are going to ride "much" (we are talking a few millimeters here) higher when pedaling due to how the suspension functions, if talking the rear.


and then this earlier today:



tuckerjt07 said:


> First, dynamic sag should be different, it even states as much in the description, especially for the rear, if you understand suspension kinematics.


maybe i'm reading too much into those statements, but the suggestion is that there is a description somewhere that infers that dynamic sag should be different, and apparently less than static sag ...


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> you wrote this a week a go:
> 
> and then this earlier today:
> 
> maybe i'm reading too much into those statements, but the suggestion is that there is a description somewhere that infers that dynamic sag should be different, and apparently less than static sag ...


Again, show me where I told you where it should be less and that the manual says as much. Not where you are straw manning me by saying I made implications that I did not.

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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

ok, if you say that inference is incorrect, that's fine.

so the net result is that quarq does not make a statement about dynamic vs. static sag.

naturally, rider position, only ascending/decending, kinematics, etc. etc. can lead them to be different, but properly chosen conditions (more or less level terrain, no mashing the pedals, little body english) might mean that the difference could be small.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

ragetty said:


> ok, if you say that inference is incorrect, that's fine.
> 
> so the net result is that quarq does not make a statement about dynamic vs. static sag.
> 
> naturally, rider position, only ascending/decending, kinematics, etc. etc. can lead them to be different, but properly chosen conditions (more or less level terrain, no mashing the pedals, little body english) might mean that the difference could be small.


Quarq says that dynamic sag is measure of the past x pedaling events. It's a basic part of suspension kinematics that unless the anti-squat is 100% that pedaling will change the sag measurement. Apply both of these together with some basic logic and it's clear to those that read the manual and understand basic suspension kinematics that pedaling will get you a different value.

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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone know if shock wiz can be used to tune a Lefty Supermax? Any tips for tuning?

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> Anyone know if shock wiz can be used to tune a Lefty Supermax? Any tips for tuning?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Start here for answers:

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-...iz-Suspension-Compatibility-?mobile_site=true


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

dmo said:


> Anyone know if shock wiz can be used to tune a Lefty Supermax? Any tips for tuning?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


It appears from the manual that it is a single air fill location so that is promising. However, I'm not sure what Lefty travel is so I'm not sure. If it makes air volume dynamic similar to MRP then no.

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## Jesse Hill (Dec 29, 2006)

So curious to try one of these and see what it thinks I should need. Does anywhere rent them that anyone knows of?


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## outlaw (Oct 3, 2004)

just finished dialing in my new 2018 fox x2, at 92% in balanced mode everything is green but bouncing? what to change since every adjustment is green? anyone have same problem...


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

shockwiz

IMHO










or do a number of proper shakedown rides with a scratch pad and shock pump


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## VladConnery (Dec 2, 2014)

outlaw said:


> just finished dialing in my new 2018 fox x2, at 92% in balanced mode everything is green but bouncing? what to change since every adjustment is green? anyone have same problem...


When is it bouncy?

successive hits
drops
jumps
all the time
rock gardens


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

127.0.0.1 said:


> shockwiz
> 
> IMHO
> or do a number of proper shakedown rides with a scratch pad and shock pump


Thanks for your informed opinion I'm sure we all found it useful. :thumbsup:
Now you can go post on the dropper threads about how they suck too.


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## outlaw (Oct 3, 2004)

VladConnery said:


> When is it bouncy?
> 
> successive hits
> drops
> ...


sorry for my bad post earlier what I meant was,

In the detection section of the app, it just says bouncy is poor but everything else is good and doesn't tell me to change anything, thats why I am asking, and by the way both my 2018 fox 36 rc2 and float x have been pro tuned and just used the shockwiz to see what it would tell me which confirmed they are tuned within 92% good on both ends, and for what its worth go with the balanced tune or playful the aggressive tune is a joke "to soft" anyway just curious what would cause "bouncy" and all settings are good?


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## outlaw (Oct 3, 2004)

127.0.0.1 said:


> shockwiz
> 
> IMHO
> 
> ...


sounds like your having financial difficulties, I can get you a real paying job if you need one


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

outlaw said:


> sorry for my bad post earlier what I meant was,
> 
> In the detection section of the app, it just says bouncy is poor but everything else is good and doesn't tell me to change anything, thats why I am asking, and by the way both my 2018 fox 36 rc2 and float x have been pro tuned and just used the shockwiz to see what it would tell me which confirmed they are tuned within 92% good on both ends, and for what its worth go with the balanced tune or playful the aggressive tune is a joke "to soft" anyway just curious what would cause "bouncy" and all settings are good?


Just curious, what pressure and how many tokens in your fork? Don't mind share your HSC, LSC and rebound setting. What is your weight?

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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

outlaw said:


> sorry for my bad post earlier what I meant was,
> 
> In the detection section of the app, it just says bouncy is poor but everything else is good and doesn't tell me to change anything, thats why I am asking, and by the way both my 2018 fox 36 rc2 and float x have been pro tuned and just used the shockwiz to see what it would tell me which confirmed they are tuned within 92% good on both ends, and for what its worth go with the balanced tune or playful the aggressive tune is a joke "to soft" anyway just curious what would cause "bouncy" and all settings are good?


I wonder how much of the 'bouncing' might be down to pedalling style. I've had similar on my Strive with Fox 36 and Float x. I think it happens when I'm standing up sprinting to get a bit of pace for a jump or something. Bike is set up for varied trails with lots of technical rocky sections and some drops. It's not set up for XC so isn't super pedal friendly in Open but I have the shapeshifter for climbing etc so don't worry about it

After all it has to be a compromise somewhere

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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

This is mine with a score of 86 after some runs at Greenvalleys. (Uplift and jumps)

Still work to do obviously but steadily zeroing in



















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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I seem to have mine pretty well set up now apart from it wanting the low speed compression to be softer which I thought before trying the shockwiz. However, it's as soft as it can be on the pike in terms of external adjustment.

Does anyone know which shims I should be looking to remove or reposition to achieve this?


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

iggs said:


> This is mine with a score of 86 after some runs at Greenvalleys. (Uplift and jumps)
> 
> Still work to do obviously but steadily zeroing in
> 
> ...


Did you set Aggressive style?

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

onzadog said:


> I seem to have mine pretty well set up now apart from it wanting the low speed compression to be softer which I thought before trying the shockwiz. However, it's as soft as it can be on the pike in terms of external adjustment.
> 
> Does anyone know which shims I should be looking to remove or reposition to achieve this?


Occasionally I was having the same suggestion despite maxing out the HSC and LSC limit (soft). The rest were green most of the time. The suggestion varies according to the trails and the way I ride. Overall, very happy with the ride.

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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

chris9888 said:


> Did you set Aggressive style?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


No that's on balanced. Aggressive will be too soft for my needs. Balanced or playful will be where I look for a setting that suits what I want

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## outlaw (Oct 3, 2004)

*Settings*



chris9888 said:


> Just curious, what pressure and how many tokens in your fork? Don't mind share your HSC, LSC and rebound setting. What is your weight?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I am about 170# before any riding gear. balanced tune

fork is at 77 PSI, 8 low speed comp, 1 high speed comp, and 11 rebound, 
2 air tokens, all from fast or open.

shock is 175 PSI, low speed rebound 9, high speed rebound 7, low speed comp 9, high speed comp 4, 2 volume bands "thats all my shock will take" all from fast or open.

FWIW, Bike is 2017 Santa Cruz Bronson


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

outlaw said:


> sounds like your having financial difficulties, I can get you a real paying job if you need one


how'd you know I was poor ? plz fax me 20 bucks so I can Uber yer mom home


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## outlaw (Oct 3, 2004)

127.0.0.1 said:


> how'd you know i was poor ? Plz fax me 20 bucks so i can uber yer mom home


lol 😮


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## Matt116 (Mar 30, 2012)

fdes said:


> Ok, just had my first ride with the shockwiz. In the suggestions it is recommending that I speed up my rebound, but in the detections it is telling me that my bike is pogoing. If it is pogoing, doesn't this mean that I have not enough rebound damping and should slow down the rebound?


I think of pogoing happing after a deep compression and bobbing happing at the very begging of travel like when peddling. Bobbing is usually a result of too little low speed compression and pogoing is a result of too little rebound damping.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Ever since they added the profiles, I'm sort of lost on how to use my Shockwiz correctly.
Do I choose a profile before beginning my run, or after? If I choose it after, which is what seems like works, how can shockwiz know my compression ratio and travel? It doesn't know which end of the suspension I'm working on?
Please advise. 

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Suns_PSD said:


> Ever since they added the profiles, I'm sort of lost on how to use my Shockwiz correctly.
> Do I choose a profile before beginning my run, or after? If I choose it after, which is what seems like works, how can shockwiz know my compression ratio and travel? It doesn't know which end of the suspension I'm working on?
> Please advise.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


The Profile is just a record book for you to store information so that you can refer in future. It has a download function for you to populate the suggestions onto the profile so that you need not manually screen capture it. You can create as many Profiles as you want (use copy function), be it before or after a ride. After all, you would want to download the suggestion data that is relevant to the Profile you created.

The Profile also has an upload option for you to populate the suggestions from the Profile back to shockwiz. You may want to do this in order to continue from the point you stop tracking the ride data.

Hope I did not confuse you more.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

iggs said:


> This is mine with a score of 86 after some runs at Greenvalleys. (Uplift and jumps)
> 
> Still work to do obviously but steadily zeroing in
> 
> ...


Is this a rear shock or fork result? Here's my thought on bobbing with everything else showing good.

There's two ways to achieve full stroke without harsh bottom outs. Either run higher pressure and less tokens/tuning bands, or run less pressure and more tokens/bands. If you're running low pressure with extra tokens or bands to keep you from bottoming out, the low pressure may not be enough to support you during pedaling. This would've cause the bobbing effect. My rear shock can accept tuning bands on both positive and negative chambers sides and I found less pressure with bands on the negative side offered me support on the initial travel end, thus reducing pedal bob.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

IRBent said:


> Is this a rear shock or fork result? Here's my thought on bobbing with everything else showing good.
> 
> There's two ways to achieve full stroke without harsh bottom outs. Either run higher pressure and less tokens/tuning bands, or run less pressure and more tokens/bands. If you're running low pressure with extra tokens or bands to keep you from bottoming out, the low pressure may not be enough to support you during pedaling. This would've cause the bobbing effect. My rear shock can accept tuning bands on both positive and negative chambers sides and I found less pressure with bands on the negative side offered me support on the initial travel end, thus reducing pedal bob.


This is my forks. 170mm Fox factory 36 Float rc2 on my Strive

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## barefootdan (Oct 6, 2008)

Hi, I am setting up my Shockwiz on my 2018 Rockshox Lyrik RCT3 with 170mm of travel. The first run, I had 1 token with 60PSI and received a Compression Ratio of 2.7. I then rode and got a confidence score of 100% to remove a token and lower PSI by 5%. Done. I re-calibrated and got a Compression Ratio of 2.6 now. This makes sense. I rode again and received a score of 99% confidence to further lower my PSI and Token count. This is where I got confused. I looked up the trouble shooting and saw that the Compression Ratio may be incorrect. So I sat on my bike and compared sag between the app and the forks O-Ring. They were off by about 10%. I then manually entered a Compression Ratio until they were within a 1% difference. My new compression ratio for the Lyrik RCT3 and 0 tokens is 2.1. Does this sound right? Or should I be trusting the Cal-Wizard over my manual enters?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

barefootdan said:


> Hi, I am setting up my Shockwiz on my 2018 Rockshox Lyrik RCT3 with 170mm of travel. The first run, I had 1 token with 60PSI and received a Compression Ratio of 2.7. I then rode and got a confidence score of 100% to remove a token and lower PSI by 5%. Done. I re-calibrated and got a Compression Ratio of 2.6 now. This makes sense. I rode again and received a score of 99% confidence to further lower my PSI and Token count. This is where I got confused. I looked up the trouble shooting and saw that the Compression Ratio may be incorrect. So I sat on my bike and compared sag between the app and the forks O-Ring. They were off by about 10%. I then manually entered a Compression Ratio until they were within a 1% difference. My new compression ratio for the Lyrik RCT3 and 0 tokens is 2.1. Does this sound right? Or should I be trusting the Cal-Wizard over my manual enters?


Im on a 160mm Lyrik with a Luftkappe. Im running 65psi with no tokens and thats 2.6 compression ratio. 2.1 sounds way wrong


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## barefootdan (Oct 6, 2008)

lucifuge said:


> Im on a 160mm Lyrik with a Luftkappe. Im running 65psi with no tokens and thats 2.6 compression ratio. 2.1 sounds way wrong


Yea, I agree it sounds off. I did the Calibration Wizard process twice to confirm the 2.6. It just doesn't seem to match up with the app and the forks O-Ring


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## Millennial29erGuy (Feb 5, 2017)

^^^ You should be making only one setting adjustment at a time, then retesting. Work from the top down starting with air pressure. Adjust until you have green, then move down the list.


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## barefootdan (Oct 6, 2008)

the_joe said:


> ^^^ You should be making only one setting adjustment at a time, then retesting. Work from the top down starting with air pressure. Adjust until you have green, then move down the list.


Okay Ill try that out and put back the original token. I was under the assumption that PSI and Tokens can be done at the same time, while all others are separate.


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## Jon31 (Sep 21, 2017)

Hi all,
has anyone tried to fit a shockwiz to a fox x2 fitted on an evil insurgent?
I'm really struggling to get it mounted in a location that does not link the hose, twist, or potentially cause damage to something. 
Pictures would be much appriciated .


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Ive seen it mounted on the piggy shock

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## kanetrader (Dec 10, 2006)

Very strange, I hope you can help.......
Shockwizz worked very well with my rear shock, but my front shock causes issues...
I did the calibration correct and all data from this is correct.....
When start riding I gave the app a “new session” order and start riding... 
after a one hour ride, no raeding... very strange... second, third and fourth attempt, no reading...
The shokwizz is connected and sees my pressure. 
I have a lefy fork, but this should not be a problem...
Hope you can help....
Many thanks....


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

kanetrader said:


> Very strange, I hope you can help.......
> Shockwizz worked very well with my rear shock, but my front shock causes issues...
> I did the calibration correct and all data from this is correct.....
> When start riding I gave the app a "new session" order and start riding...
> ...


Try downloading the profile.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I was having some issues with my ShockWiz recently and just followed their online troubleshooting guide and it walked me right through correcting it. It was easy and really only took about 5 minutes.


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

IRBent said:


> Try downloading the profile.


What does downloading the profile do? (where is it downloaded to?)

I think the profiles feature is a great addition, but I'm not totally grasping the downloading/uploading. When I want to record a run, I start a new session at the beginning, ride, save the profile, then hit start new session again.

I noticed that if you don't start a new session after saving the profile, it continues to write data to that profile. So it altered the profile recommendations by using data gathered while the bike was bouncing around on the rack on the drive home.


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## cheezwhip (Aug 6, 2004)

Sid Duffman said:


> What does downloading the profile do? (where is it downloaded to?)
> 
> I think the profiles feature is a great addition, but I'm not totally grasping the downloading/uploading. When I want to record a run, I start a new session at the beginning, ride, save the profile, then hit start new session again.
> 
> I noticed that if you don't start a new session after saving the profile, it continues to write data to that profile. So it altered the profile recommendations by using data gathered while the bike was bouncing around on the rack on the drive home.


Downloading to profile essentially captures the results of the recommended settings and events to that profile so you can reference it later.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Anyone know how to get your shockwiz to work with the newer cane creek in line shock? The fitting doesn't screw on all the way so the shockwiz won't read. Anyone figure out a work around?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

dmo said:


> Anyone know how to get your shockwiz to work with the newer cane creek in line shock? The fitting doesn't screw on all the way so the shockwiz won't read. Anyone figure out a work around?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


You could get a hose with a smaller outside diameter female fitting and it might work.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

dmo said:


> Anyone know how to get your shockwiz to work with the newer cane creek in line shock? The fitting doesn't screw on all the way so the shockwiz won't read. Anyone figure out a work around?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Can you post a pic of the interference? The hose connector measures ~15mm in diameter, which is in between the diameters of my two shock pump connectors. If it doesn't fit the Shockwiz, I'm thinking it probably won't fit some shock pumps either, which would be a big goof on CC's part.

I would also contact Quarq at [email protected] and see what they have to say.

One thing you could try is this Topeak pressure-rite adapter, which has been mentioned previously to adapt the standard mount Shockwiz to work in direct-mount scenarios like RS-1 and Cannondale lefty's.

https://goo.gl/KLiJ8S


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Hello, I have a new Lyrik 170mm & Super Deluxe 2018, and I have seen that this device makes a very good adjustment of the fork and the shock absorber.

Is it worth your purchase to leave the bike perfect?



Thanks!.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Hello, I have a new Lyrik 170mm & Super Deluxe 2018, and I have seen that this device makes a very good adjustment of the fork and the shock absorber.
> 
> Is it worth your purchase to leave the bike perfect?
> 
> Thanks!.


My experience says the Shockwiz is a great tool, especially for someone who doesn't know much about suspension tuning or doesn't have a feel for what's right. While I had a good idea of a proper tune, I still bought a Shockwiz just for fun. Chasing a score of 100 and what the Shockwiz calls a perfect tune is practically impossible to achieve more than maybe one out of a week's worth of rides though. So, if you're clueless about shock or fork tuning the device is great. Just don't expect a perfect score with every ride.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I am sort of proud of this one. It's my forks, on my main trail and I got this several rides in a row. I have since made some chassis changes and have not checked to see if my score was negatively effected. 
My shock is close but but just about always shows in the yellow on high-speed compression.









Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> I am sort of proud of this one. It's my forks, on my main trail and I got this several rides in a row. I have since made some chassis changes and have not checked to see if my score was negatively effected.
> My shock is close but but just about always shows in the yellow on high-speed compression.
> 
> 
> ...


There's nothing more satisfying than getting all of those right down the middle and with a high 90's score at 100% confidence.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

This week I will receive my Shockwiz and I have the following doubts:

- Is it necessary to remove all the pressure currently I have in the fork/shock and inflate them again through the Shockwiz?
- When do I have to start the Shockwiz, when I leave the house or when I ride in the single tracks only?


Thanks!.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

Yes, to calibrate.
No, just when you want the fork/shock to perform, ie trail selection.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Okey, then, only when start the single tracks?.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

gontxo_nos said:


> Okey, then, only when start the single tracks?.


Yes, just where you want to have it take readings, ie the type of trail you ride. Remember you have to choose the type of shock response you want in the app.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Simplemind said:


> Yes, just where you want to have it take readings, ie the type of trail you ride. Remember you have to choose the type of shock response you want in the app.


Yes, I am impatient to prove the Shockwiz . I'll put the results here.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Really doesn't matter if you start recording early because old data will be replaced with new data.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## BigWeetBix (Oct 16, 2017)

I had a similar issue with my Fox Float X. I removed the valve core during tuning. It's a workaround that works.



bryanus said:


> Can you post a pic of the interference? The hose connector measures ~15mm in diameter, which is in between the diameters of my two shock pump connectors. If it doesn't fit the Shockwiz, I'm thinking it probably won't fit some shock pumps either, which would be a big goof on CC's part.
> 
> I would also contact Quarq at [email protected] and see what they have to say.
> 
> ...


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

jacksonlui said:


> Really doesn't matter if you start recording early because old data will be replaced with new data.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Well, yes it does matter because it will include that data in it's calculations. As an example, suppose you have a 5 mile ride on the street to get to your trail. If you start recording at home it will include the street data in the trail data thereby skewing the results. No?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Simplemind said:


> Well, yes it does matter because it will include that data in it's calculations. As an example, suppose you have a 5 mile ride on the street to get to your trail. If you start recording at home it will include the street data in the trail data thereby skewing the results. No?


Exactly. You'll find too that if you ride easy CX style trails on the way to calibrate for the gnarliest downhill trails you have, those tame trails will skew your results. I eventually decided to tune mainly for the ugliest trails and ignore the poor results I'd receive on the tame trails. It's like, you can't have a single tune that satisfies both trail types and still receive high scores on both. At least not if you're looking at the results under the same tune style. I chose playful for the ugliest and tuned to get a 90+ score @ 100% confidence. I then found that my tame trails would score high but only if I looked at them under the balanced of efficient tune modes. Playfully mode wants to see your suspension move throughout its full range often. That just can't happen on a tame trail without releasing air pressure.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I often ruin scores on the climbs back out of a fun run. Since I don't prioritize that riding, I now save my ride before the long climb out begins.

Now to clarify I already had an hour or so of riding which is plenty to develop a score.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Don't wait until after your bike has been on the back of a trailer for an hour to check shockwiz, that doesn't work either.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I guess it depends on the length and type of trails. If you ride long enough it'll have enough data. I usually start ot at home and stop it when i get home after 3hrs.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

onzadog said:


> Don't wait until after your bike has been on the back of a trailer for an hour to check shockwiz, that doesn't work either.


Ha, I bet that bouncing around is just enough to f up the results for sure.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> I guess it depends on the length and type of trails. If you ride long enough it'll have enough data. I usually start ot at home and stop it when i get home after 3hrs.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Well sure. Your tune will be across the gamut, all trails included. Bet if you looked at the results along your ride you'll see varying answers.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I must admit, I've started using my only on the types of decents where I want my suspension optimised. Everything else, I'll take the compromise is produces.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

onzadog said:


> I must admit, I've started using my only on the types of decents where I want my suspension optimised. Everything else, I'll take the compromise is produces.


And I agree with that use. On tame trails who really cares if their suspension is optimized? But when the going gets ugly, proper suspension can make you or break you. So while I fire my Shockwiz up at the start of my ride, I look at the trail and uphill results once I'm at the top of the mountain. But then I reset unit and try to hone my setup based on the downhill rowdiness that follows.


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## coddog (Jan 29, 2010)

Anyone know the compression ratio on a 8.5x2.5 float X2? I am getting 2.8 with 1 spacer installed. I'm not getting any "deep compressions events" even though I have bottomed the shock at least once on each ride.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Then, where I start use the Shockwiz?. When I leave my home or only when I start the trails?.

And, when I finish the trails, I stop the Shockwiz?.


I see that some one lights it from home until arriving at his house again, that is to say, a complete route. But others say that this pollutes the results obtained in the trails...


So, what is the correct use to optimize the suspensions better?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

It's up to you, what do you want to optimise it for? Do you want the best average for your whole ride or do you want to focus on a particular section?

It takes as long to learn to get the most put of the shockwiz as it does out of your suspension.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IMO, the ideal would be to use it in trails, right?.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> IMO, the ideal would be to use it in trails, right?.


Yes, I say key in on trails, especially those trails that you think your suspension isn't doing a good job on.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

coddog said:


> Anyone know the compression ratio on a 8.5x2.5 float X2? I am getting 2.8 with 1 spacer installed. I'm not getting any "deep compressions events" even though I have bottomed the shock at least once on each ride.


Mine is also 2.8 with one spacer. I usually get 1-3 deep compression events on a ride, only occurring on drops over about 4'.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Yes, I say key in on trails, especially those trails that you think your suspension isn't doing a good job on.


And don't use the climb switch at all cause shockwiz will have you loosening everything up trying to get the suspension to move.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> And don't use the climb switch at all cause shockwiz will have you loosening everything up trying to get the suspension to move.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


You know? At one point I set my suspension up for the ugliest trails using the Playful mode. Then I dabbled in easy trails with my rear shock switch in the middle position and tuning results were really good in the efficient mode. It was like the best of both worlds. Super active and playful on the ugly trails, while really efficient and supportive on easier trails with the shock partially locked out.


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## coddog (Jan 29, 2010)

Suns_PSD said:


> Mine is also 2.8 with one spacer. I usually get 1-3 deep compression events on a ride, only occurring on drops over about 4'.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


Thanks, I'll just ignore deep compression events. Everything else is good.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Food for thought. The way we ride affect the Shockwiz readings significantly. My Shockwiz is installed permanently on the fork of the Hightower. I almost always get 96% score and all green when I ride fast and aggressive, and 82% score with 1 or 2 yellow when I ride slow and rollover most features. The Shockwiz is set at Balanced Mode, and I was riding the same trails. My conclusion is that Hightower is meant to ride fast and aggressive. Shockwiz not only empowered us to tune our suspension scientifically, but also enable us to determine the characteristics of our bikes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

chris9888 said:


> Food for thought. The way we ride affect the Shockwiz readings significantly. My Shockwiz is installed permanently on the fork of the Hightower. I almost always get 96% score and all green when I ride fast and aggressive, and 82% score with 1 or 2 yellow when I ride slow and rollover most features. The Shockwiz is set at Balanced Mode, and I was riding the same trails. My conclusion is that Hightower is meant to ride fast and aggressive. Shockwiz not only empowered us to tune our suspension scientifically, but also enable us to determine the characteristics of our bikes.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


There's a chance too that if you rode easy, got that 82 score in the balanced mode, you might get a higher score if you swapped modes to the efficient mode. You can indeed make a run in one mode, see the score and results, then change modes to see results. Efficient prefers less travel used than balanced, hence the reason I'd expect your score to go up some.


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

IRBent said:


> There's a chance too that if you rode easy, got that 82 score in the balanced mode, you might get a higher score if you swapped modes to the efficient mode. You can indeed make a run in one mode, see the score and results, then change modes to see results. Efficient prefers less travel used than balanced, hence the reason I'd expect your score to go up some.


You are right, another approach on how we see the benefits of Shockwiz. A great tool to have 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Any tips for the first steps? :thumbsup:.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> View attachment 1164076
> 
> 
> Any tips for the first steps? .


Tip 1: Don't expect one ride miracle tunes.
Tip 2: Don't expect a perfect tune even after your 3rd ride.
Tip 3: Know what you want out of the device and tune before making any major changes.
Tip 4: This forum has tons of knowledgeable users with months of Shockwiz use who should be able to better help you tune your suspension.
Tip 5: Ask your next 5-10 questions after a few rides and after you sorta understand how the thing works. If after 3 rides or so you're still baffled. Message me.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Tip 1: Don't expect one ride miracle tunes.
> Tip 2: Don't expect a perfect tune even after your 3rd ride.
> Tip 3: Know what you want out of the device and tune before making any major changes.
> Tip 4: This forum has tons of knowledgeable users with months of Shockwiz use who should be able to better help you tune your suspension.
> Tip 5: Ask your next 5-10 questions after a few rides and after you sorta understand how the thing works. If after 3 rides or so you're still baffled. Message me.


Hello, today I made my first ride with the Shockwiz. I want to know how to get the key data from a particular trail.

I do the following:

1. Before starting the trail, I give "Start" in the App.
2. When I finish the trail, I take out the mobile and directly save the profile with the name of that trail.

I am doing it right?. I'm looking data for certain trails...

How do I know that the Shockwiz has analyzed the data of the entire trail?

Thanks!.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Hello, today I made my first ride with the Shockwiz. I want to know how to get the key data from a particular trail.
> 
> I do the following:
> 
> ...


Here's the best thing to do in my mind. Carry your phone and look at the data after each trail section. The results will constantly change during your ride. Let's say you're tuning in the playful mode. The Shockwiz will want to see your shock moving freely through its entire stroke often in order to get a high score. But if you're pedaling up a dirt road that's smooth to get to the top of the mountain, your shock won't move much and your score will be low. But too, you don't want your shock moving much on a climb. Same will hold true for easy trails even if downhill. Playful wants jumps, bumps and lots of shock movement. So do you easy stuff and ignore the results. You may even want to start a new session before you head down the ugliest trails you ride so the Shockwiz isn't polluted with smooth trail data. Once you've completed the ugliest trails, stop and look at your data. By analyzing the data during your ride you'll slowly begin to understand more about how it tunes.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Here's the best thing to do in my mind. Carry your phone and look at the data after each trail section. The results will constantly change during your ride. Let's say you're tuning in the playful mode. The Shockwiz will want to see your shock moving freely through its entire stroke often in order to get a high score. But if you're pedaling up a dirt road that's smooth to get to the top of the mountain, your shock won't move much and your score will be low. But too, you don't want your shock moving much on a climb. Same will hold true for easy trails even if downhill. Playful wants jumps, bumps and lots of shock movement. So do you easy stuff and ignore the results. You may even want to start a new session before you head down the ugliest trails you ride so the Shockwiz isn't polluted with smooth trail data. Once you've completed the ugliest trails, stop and look at your data. By analyzing the data during your ride you'll slowly begin to understand more about how it tunes.


I get it.

What I do is what I told you.

Before starting the trail, I start a new session and when I finish the trail, I save the profile, it would be the right thing for analyze the data of this trail?.

I just want to analyze the trails because that's where I want to adjust my fork/shock absorber.

The paths or climbs to the trails, I'm not very interested, apart, contaminate the results of the Shockwiz surely.

Thanks!.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> I get it.
> 
> What I do is what I told you.
> 
> ...


Yes, but if you look at the results along your ride you'll get a better understanding how the Shockwiz tunes and how each trail affects the results. I've ridden my hardest trails and saw very high scores with 100% confidence, only to continue my ride on easier trails and my score drop at the end.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Yes, but if you look at the results along your ride you'll get a better understanding how the Shockwiz tunes and how each trail affects the results. I've ridden my hardest trails and saw very high scores with 100% confidence, only to continue my ride on easier trails and my score drop at the end.


Yes, I have seen that in easy areas the score goes down. I guess it will be because the configuration I have in Playful mode and the terrain has nothing abrupt, ie is a flat terrain where nothing affects the fork/shock.

That's what you mean? .

I suppose if the Shockwiz activated it from the moment I leave the house until I returned, the result would be very varied due to the maginitud of variation of the terrain and the mode selected in the App.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Yes, I have seen that in easy areas the score goes down. I guess it will be because the configuration I have in Playful mode and the terrain has nothing abrupt, ie is a flat terrain where nothing affects the fork/shock.
> 
> That's what you mean? .
> 
> I suppose if the Shockwiz activated it from the moment I leave the house until I returned, the result would be very varied due to the maginitud of variation of the terrain and the mode selected in the App.


Yes, you understand. If you ride hard on bumpy trials in playful mode and score high scores, job well done. If you reset the Shockwiz the ride easier trails and the score is low, swap over to balanced of efficient mode and look at the scores go up. So you can get the best of both trails. High scores on rough trails in playful mode then good scores on easier trails in balanced/efficient mode.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Yes, you understand. If you ride hard on bumpy trials in playful mode and score high scores, job well done. If you reset the Shockwiz the ride easier trails and the score is low, swap over to balanced of efficient mode and look at the scores go up. So you can get the best of both trails. High scores on rough trails in playful mode then good scores on easier trails in balanced/efficient mode.


That's what I meant .

Once calibrated the Shockwiz, it is not necessary to calibrate it more times if no changes are made, no?.

For example, I used it today, it has suggest me to make some adjustments but I have not changed anything. If I want to continue testing tomorrow, I plug the Shockwiz again and test more, right?.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> That's what I meant .
> 
> Once calibrated the Shockwiz, it is not necessary to calibrate it more times if no changes are made, no?.
> 
> For example, I used it today, it has suggest me to make some adjustments but I have not changed anything. If I want to continue testing tomorrow, I plug the Shockwiz again and test more, right?.


Yes. You can ride the same trails over and over and get different results. So do just that and adjust based on the majority of the answers. Temps can affect oil, you can preload a few bumps, rocks or jumps or just not ride the exact same line and end up with odd results. So ride, test, look at a lot of results and only adjust if most results say you need to. A single ride screaming adjust will run you bat **** crazy trying to make it right.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Yes. You can ride the same trails over and over and get different results. So do just that and adjust based on the majority of the answers. Temps can affect oil, you can preload a few bumps, rocks or jumps or just not ride the exact same line and end up with odd results. So ride, test, look at a lot of results and only adjust if most results say you need to. A single ride screaming adjust will run you bat **** crazy trying to make it right.


My idea is to do several rides with the same configuration. Testing trails and comparing the result.

Once I see the values approach each other, that's when I'll start making adjustments.

For the moment I'll test like this config because I have many paths here .


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> My idea is to do several rides with the same configuration. Testing trails and comparing the result.
> 
> Once I see the values approach each other, that's when I'll start making adjustments.
> 
> For the moment I'll test like this config because I have many paths here .


If you're like me, trying to remember results from yesterday, last week, or longer is impossible. So I made myself a spreadsheet and kept up with all the data. That way I could look at trends and adjust based only on multiple data points. As an owner, you're in no rush. You can take your time and get it as get as possible.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Another question, if I want to raise the PSI of the fork, I just put more pressure through the Shockwiz and in Settings, edit the Baseline pressure, right?

Don't need to calibrate again, right?.


Thanks.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Another question, if I want to raise the PSI of the fork, I just put more pressure through the Shockwiz and in Settings, edit the Baseline pressure, right?
> 
> Don't need to calibrate again, right?.
> 
> Thanks.


Yes, just reset the baseline air pressure and go.


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## jaqkar (Apr 15, 2016)

So lets say I want to do a playful tune where I will ride with all settings open but I need to climb some in between to get to the playful stuff and cannot really with my shock open as it will bob like mad. What do you suggest I do?


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

A question. When I swell the fork/shock, what do I pay attention, to the PSI of the pump or to the PSI of the App?.

It is that the PSI differ somewhat from the pump compared to the App.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

gontxo_nos said:


> A question. When I swell the fork/shock, what do I pay attention, to the PSI of the pump or to the PSI of the App?.
> 
> It is that the PSI differ somewhat from the pump compared to the App.


Initially while working in a good setting I use the psi in the app. Once I have a good setting I let some air out of the shock/fork then pump it back up to the correct psi in the app and note what the shock pump says

In my settings notes I keep I record both the shockwiz app pressure and the shock pump pressure.

I have a feeling that there may be differences in the calibrations of the 3 shock pumps I have but I haven't tested this yet. I do have them all marked with coloured tape (red/blue/green) but the red one is the one I mostly use and carry

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jaqkar said:


> So lets say I want to do a playful tune where I will ride with all settings open but I need to climb some in between to get to the playful stuff and cannot really with my shock open as it will bob like mad. What do you suggest I do?


I had the same issue and decided that I'd check the Shockwiz app during my ride. My scores were low going up the mountain due to pedal Bob and smooth trails. So I eventually started ignoring the smooth trails and uphill results and decided to start a new session once I was ready to really test the suspension downhill.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Hello, once the fork is adjusted with the ShockWiz, If I'm going to adjust the shock absorber, first I have to calibrate it, right?, that is, I perform the calibration assistant.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

The calibration process is just to measure the compression ratio. If that doesn't change, you don't need to recalibrate


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

I just adjusted the fork, nothing more. Now I want to adjust the damper and I would like to know if I have to perform the calibration assistant first of all.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Provided the adjustment doesn't alter the volume of the air spring, you'll be fine. Just start a new session after the adjustments.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> I just adjusted the fork, nothing more. Now I want to adjust the damper and I would like to know if I have to perform the calibration assistant first of all.


I think there's a touch of language barrier here. Originally you said fork had been done. Now you want to check your damper. If you move the Shockwiz to the rear shock, then yes, you must calibrate the shock with the assistant as you called it.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Ah, by damper, you mean rear shock. Then yes, if moving the shockwiz to a new shock, you'll need to recalibrate or input the compression ratio if known.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Yeah, in the end you have understood me .


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Hello, in the area where I do enduro we have many trails of varied terrain.

For example, there are stair trails, trails faster, others more technical...What advice can you give me to adjust the fork/shock correctly with the Shockwiz in this case?. 

What I have thought is to do all the trails several times with the Shockwiz and collect all data obtained by Shockwiz and then make the average of the results.

It would be the right thing?


Thanks!.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Hello, in the area where I do enduro we have many trails of varied terrain.
> 
> For example, there are stair trails, trails faster, others more technical...What advice can you give me to adjust the fork/shock correctly with the Shockwiz in this case?.
> 
> ...


I would agree with that idea. Unless you find that adjusting the suspension for all your trails makes your bike ride really bad on the roughest trails. Then I'd tune to make the roughest trails feel good.


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## ban (Jul 24, 2004)

Hi there, i've been using borrowed Shockwiz for a couple of rides and I've ended dialing my Fox 34 '17 fork more or less....I'm using 85 psi, and 3 volume spacers. Everything appears in green color in the trail sections I'm interested in going fast, apart from the LSC which is yellow. The shockwiz wants it softer but I'm already running in the softest position...in this case; can anything be done to better tune the LSC?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

ban said:


> Hi there, i've been using borrowed Shockwiz for a couple of rides and I've ended dialing my Fox 34 '17 fork more or less....I'm using 85 psi, and 3 volume spacers. Everything appears in green color in the trail sections I'm interested in going fast, apart from the LSC which is yellow. The shockwiz wants it softer but I'm already running in the softest position...in this case; can anything be done to better tune the LSC?


I'd imagine shim stack adjustment might be your only option.


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## ban (Jul 24, 2004)

IRBent said:


> I'd imagine shim stack adjustment might be your only option.


i don't think this could be done...at least w/o sending the fork to Fox or similar?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

ban said:


> i don't think this could be done...at least w/o sending the fork to Fox or similar?


Shim stack adjustment is definitely not something most home mechanics need to be doing. While it probably isn't hard to do, it's probably hard to get right without some guidance of a knowledge suspension expert.


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## outlierrn (May 15, 2006)

Anybody have advice on calibrating a Cane Creek DB? I got wildly different numbers trying to set the compression ratio


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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

ban said:


> Hi there, i've been using borrowed Shockwiz for a couple of rides and I've ended dialing my Fox 34 '17 fork more or less....I'm using 85 psi, and 3 volume spacers. Everything appears in green color in the trail sections I'm interested in going fast, apart from the LSC which is yellow. The shockwiz wants it softer but I'm already running in the softest position...in this case; can anything be done to better tune the LSC?


You might try changing to a lighter weight oil. Or reducing air psi a small amount, you might find an overlap where you can get air psi and lsc to both be green.


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## ban (Jul 24, 2004)

jspyderr said:


> You might try changing to a lighter weight oil. Or reducing air psi a small amount, you might find an overlap where you can get air psi and lsc to both be green.


Yes I remove a small amount of air and it seems to do the trick as now everything is green. Cheers!


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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

Anyone has experience checking-in your bike with Shockwiz installed on your suspension at the airport? Any issue? Thanks!


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

chris9888 said:


> Anyone has experience checking-in your bike with Shockwiz installed on your suspension at the airport? Any issue? Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I travelled recently with mine attached to my rear shock both directions between Sydney & Dubai. It won't get looked at/noticed at all and wouldn't be a problem anyway.

We travel with our bikes a lot. Zero problems

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## chris9888 (Feb 27, 2011)

iggs said:


> I travelled recently with mine attached to my rear shock both directions between Sydney & Dubai. It won't get looked at/noticed at all and wouldn't be a problem anyway.
> 
> We travel with our bikes a lot. Zero problems
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks!

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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

Just a couple of mistakes I made when I first started using the shock wiz:

Using the calibration wizard. It may seem quicker to hook up your shock pump, use it’s deflate button, run through the calibration process and then re-inflate your shock. If you do that, your shock chamber and your shock pump chamber will be measured. My shock pump made my compression ratio 0.2 less than it should have been.

If you go on a ride and the shock wiz recommends an air psi change. Changing the air psi does not require you running the calibration wizard again, as your compression ratio stays the same. But it does require you to re-mark the baseline air psi. It uses this baseline air psi to determine 0% travel. If you watch your shock wiz app while adding air, you will notice your travel % going up as air psi goes up. Just re-mark the baseline when done, so the shockwiz knows 0% again.


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## DriverB (Apr 29, 2014)

If all the SW does is tell you to change stuff until you use all of your travel, how useful is it for people? Honest question here reading back through the thread. How complex are the outcomes? 

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## Kartwheel68 (Jun 14, 2015)

I think the SW is probably good for people who have never tuned suspension before or do not really understand what effect each adjustment has on the suspension, or dont know how their suspension is supposed to feel. I've been tuning motorcycle and then MTB suspension for 35+ years and I know exactly what I want from my suspension so a SW is of no use to me. I do admit I would be curious to try one just to see what it says about my settings, my local enduro series has them for rent on race weekends, but I would never buy one outright.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

DriverB said:


> If all the SW does is tell you to change stuff until you use all of your travel, how useful is it for people? Honest question here reading back through the thread. How complex are the outcomes?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


It does far more than just that. I consider myself a suspend nerd, coming from an auto racing background and the shockwiz really helped me dial in my settings. It's not a week long endeavor to get your settings perfect and perfect is always different, even on the same trail. Rider, dirt conditions and even suspension service all play a big roll.
One of the great things too, is that I can put it on my wife's bike and get her setup, when she knows nothing about how it should feel.


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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

With enough experience airing up tires a bet you could get pretty close without a tire gauge. It’s really nice to have a tire gauge to confirm your psi or if your just not that good. But ya, you can get by without it. Heck, you can even ride your bike without getting the most out of your suspension. It’s just a tool, that gives you data. You don’t want or need that data, that’s fine too. I rather like my tire gauge, ymmv.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jspyderr said:


> Just a couple of mistakes I made when I first started using the shock wiz:
> 
> Using the calibration wizard. It may seem quicker to hook up your shock pump, use it's deflate button, run through the calibration process and then re-inflate your shock. If you do that, your shock chamber and your shock pump chamber will be measured. My shock pump made my compression ratio 0.2 less than it should have been.
> 
> If you go on a ride and the shock wiz recommends an air psi change. Changing the air psi does not require you running the calibration wizard again, as your compression ratio stays the same. But it does require you to re-mark the baseline air psi. It uses this baseline air psi to determine 0% travel. If you watch your shock wiz app while adding air, you will notice your travel % going up as air psi goes up. Just re-mark the baseline when done, so the shockwiz knows 0% again.


Very good advice. While I understood the part about not calibrating with my shock pump attached, I still did it. But my pump has the device that you thread inward to depress the Schrader valve. I'd inflate, back the screw out until the pressure forced the pump connection to release the valve, the proceed with calibration. Since I use a floor pump type my pressure shown on the Shockwiz drops a ton as soon as I engage the valves and the pressure equalizes into maybe 3 feet of pump hose.


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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

DriverB said:


> If all the SW does is tell you to change stuff until you use all of your travel, how useful is it for people? Honest question here reading back through the thread. How complex are the outcomes?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


It does tell you quite a bit more than that.

But if I just talk about your air psi:

Do you know what your dynamic sag is? That happy place your shock returns to after a bump while riding. Your real sag? You will with the shock wiz.

An o-ring will tell you that you used all your shock. But not how many times you did (you can see this # with sw). Sw is monitoring how fast your shock was traveling when it bottomed out (all the time really). It also sees how many times it uses 99%, 80% or 87% ect. Based on those live readings it recommends air psi and or tokens based on your riding style (4 user choices).

And that's just talking about air psi.


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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

I wonder how it knows peddle bob vs uneven surface? It does, I just don’t know how. Is it the speed of the shock, slow being peddle bob and fast being rough surface.


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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

1 more thing...

When manufacturers are working on a new bike. They hook up a whole bunch sensors and gather data to dial in a bike. And it’s not because they don’t know how suspension works.


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## Kartwheel68 (Jun 14, 2015)

I didnt say not to use it, I even said I am curious and would like to try one out. But I hold by what I said, *I* dont need one and would never buy one.


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## DriverB (Apr 29, 2014)

But is the end result a set up that just tells you to use all of your travel? If so how much does the data really matter? 

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

DriverB said:


> But is the end result a set up that just tells you to use all of your travel? If so how much does the data really matter?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


nothing to see here. move along please.


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## DriverB (Apr 29, 2014)

Kartwheel68 said:


> I think the SW is probably good for people who have never tuned suspension before or do not really understand what effect each adjustment has on the suspension, or dont know how their suspension is supposed to feel. I've been tuning motorcycle and then MTB suspension for 35+ years and I know exactly what I want from my suspension so a SW is of no use to me. I do admit I would be curious to try one just to see what it says about my settings, my local enduro series has them for rent on race weekends, but I would never buy one outright.


I agree here but would also be curious to try one. I'm not skeptical of advanced analytics, but I am a bit skeptical of this device given some of what I've read

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## jspyderr (Apr 8, 2014)

DriverB said:


> But is the end result a set up that just tells you to use all of your travel? If so how much does the data really matter?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


Ok I'll try one more time:

Yes it tells you how to adjust your air psi. The amount of travel it recommends is based on your selected riding style. Based on deep compression events ect. Efficient will use more air psi than balanced and will therefore have less shock travel.

It also tells you to adjust:
# of tokens
Low speed rebound
High speed rebound
High speed compression 
Low speed compression

I'm not quite sure what else you need to be told, what other adjustment does your shock have?

If your interested, it also tells you:
# of jumps
Average jump in ms
Longest jump in ms
Total air time in ms
Dynamic sag %
# of deep compression events

I hope you got more out of that than use all your shock travel....


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## DriverB (Apr 29, 2014)

jspyderr said:


> Ok I'll try one more time:
> 
> Yes it tells you how to adjust your air psi. The amount of travel it recommends is based on your selected riding style. Based on deep compression events ect. Efficient will use more air psi than balanced and will therefore have less shock travel.
> 
> ...


That is certainly helpful appreciated.

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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

I'm at about 25% sag on my fork and Just under 30% sag on my shock. Everything feels good but I'm just shy of getting full travel. I feel like I could go either way, but is it generally better to remove air or remove a spacer? 

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> I'm at about 25% sag on my fork and Just under 30% sag on my shock. Everything feels good but I'm just shy of getting full travel. I feel like I could go either way, but is it generally better to remove air or remove a spacer?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Loaded question. Maybe hit bigger stuff or ride harder and you'll use the rest of your suspension. But I'd suggest dropping a few psi first. It may increase your sag which could be good or bad. If reducing pressure doesn't do the trick you could try spacers but if your close, that will alter everything a fair amount. You'll end up bumping pressure up after removing spacers. That could make things a bit more harsh on the small and slower bumps.


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

IRBent said:


> Loaded question. Maybe hit bigger stuff or ride harder and you'll use the rest of your suspension. But I'd suggest dropping a few psi first. It may increase your sag which could be good or bad. If reducing pressure doesn't do the trick you could try spacers but if your close, that will alter everything a fair amount. You'll end up bumping pressure up after removing spacers. That could make things a bit more harsh on the small and slower bumps.


I know it was a simple question to complex problem. I'll try dropping a few psi first.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

dmo said:


> I know it was a simple question to complex problem. I'll try dropping a few psi first.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


That's indeed the easiest test. Just remember, sometimes we have to settle for a compromise. It may be darn good, just not perfect.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Loaded question


I see what you did there :winker:


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

dmo said:


> I'm at about 25% sag on my fork and Just under 30% sag on my shock. Everything feels good but I'm just shy of getting full travel. I feel like I could go either way, but is it generally better to remove air or remove a spacer?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


If the quality of the suspension and the feel is good then why is it important getting full travel? Are you willing to compromise the quality and feel just to get full travel?


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Rick Draper said:


> If the quality of the suspension and the feel is good then why is it important getting full travel? Are you willing to compromise the quality and feel just to get full travel?


I heard somewhere you should get full travel once during your ride. I'm learning that's not necessarily the case.

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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

Rick Draper said:


> If the quality of the suspension and the feel is good then why is it important getting full travel? Are you willing to compromise the quality and feel just to get full travel?


Totally agree with this. I find the end of travel to feel harsh and uncontrolled, so I'd rather not go down there very often. My preference is to leave about 10mm of travel in reserve for the oh-**** moments.

I'm hoping a future shock wiz update will allow to user to specify how deep into the travel they would like to go.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Sid Duffman said:


> Totally agree with this. I find the end of travel to feel harsh and uncontrolled, so I'd rather not go down there very often.
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If the end of your travel is harsh you might want a different bike or suspension. Plush throughout is da bomb.


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## ac1000 (Jan 2, 2014)

What exactly is "bouncing"?
I've read the shockwiz definition but I've never heard this outside of shockwiz.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

ac1000 said:


> What exactly is "bouncing"?
> I've read the shockwiz definition but I've never heard this outside of shockwiz.


I'd like to know this myself. A riding buddy who is also a Shockwiz user said it is related to poor pedal stroke. I've never had it be less than green before, but on my last ride it changed to yellow for the first time after months of using the shockwiz. I was initially thinking it was a new software update as I hadn't recalled seeing it before.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Bouncing is when you hit a bump and the suspension rebounds past sag. Think of throwing a a super ball into the ground. You need more rebound to deal with this.

Bobbing is pedaling weight shifts compressing the suspension down. You need more low speed compression to fix this.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

So I’ve read most all this thread and tons of great info...:so I ordered a SW and it should be here in a few days...I do have three questions (apologies if I missed this somewhere)

1). Im currently running 4 spacers in my fox 34 (I’m 260 and after experimenting it seems it works better with lower psi and more tokens for me)...when I begin tuning with SW, should I revert the fork back to stock and begin anew or leave as is and start tuning and doing sessions?

2). Since my shock doesn’t have separate lsc and hsc adjustments (grip dampener), if it says I need more lsc or hsc, could I use the blue grip dampener dial and turn it a bit to add compression? 

3). Rear shock - I have a fuel ex with fox dps evo and the reactik tuning...I normally leave the 3 position dial in the middle (trail) mode...should I do all my tuning from there or in open mode? (I am thinking open mode?)

Thanks for any advice you can give!


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> So I've read most all this thread and tons of great info...:so I ordered a SW and it should be here in a few days...I do have three questions (apologies if I missed this somewhere)
> 
> 1). Im currently running 4 spacers in my fox 34 (I'm 260 and after experimenting it seems it works better with lower psi and more tokens for me)...when I begin tuning with SW, should I revert the fork back to stock and begin anew or leave as is and start tuning and doing sessions?
> 
> ...


1. If you think your tune is close as is, leave the spacers the way they are and see what the Shockwiz says.

2. Don't start looking for answers to problems you may not have yet.

3. This one is a bit more tricky. I'd say tune in the wide open "descend" mode unless you ride CX type trails and plan on tuning to maybe the efficient mode. If you want to use all of your shock then descend mode on the shock and playful mode on the Shockwiz.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

gtsum2 said:


> So I've read most all this thread and tons of great info...:so I ordered a SW and it should be here in a few days...I do have three questions (apologies if I missed this somewhere)
> 
> 1). Im currently running 4 spacers in my fox 34 (I'm 260 and after experimenting it seems it works better with lower psi and more tokens for me)...when I begin tuning with SW, should I revert the fork back to stock and begin anew or leave as is and start tuning and doing sessions?
> 
> ...


For 1) Revert to stock and run in Open mode while tuning. You need to start from a stock setup so ShockWiz has a baseline. If you need tokens, ShockWiz will tell you to add them.
For 3) Tune only in open mode. ShockWiz won't give you accurate results outside of open mode. Changing the compression to "trail" or Locked" mid-ride/tune will change the compression ratio, and mess up the results for that session.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

IRBent said:


> 1. If you think your tune is close as is, leave the spacers the way they are and see what the Shockwiz says.
> 
> 2. Don't start looking for answers to problems you may not have yet.
> 
> 3. This one is a bit more tricky. I'd say tune in the wide open "descend" mode unless you ride CX type trails and plan on tuning to maybe the efficient mode. If you want to use all of your shock then descend mode on the shock and playful mode on the Shockwiz.


Thanks for the info. I started it at 120psi in the fork and 1 token...I have worked my way to 4 tokens and 108psi now and the fork feels better than ever...I can still bottom it if I come up short on a jump or don't clear a tabletop (small one). 
But for all I know, it can be lots better. We will see soon! Thanks again!

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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

bryanus said:


> For 1) Revert to stock and run in Open mode while tuning. You need to start from a stock setup so ShockWiz has a baseline. If you need tokens, ShockWiz will tell you to add them.
> For 3) Tune only in open mode. ShockWiz won't give you accurate results outside of open mode. Changing the compression to "trail" or Locked" mid-ride/tune will change the compression ratio, and mess up the results for that session.


Many thanks! I'm looking forward to seeing what results I get. I would like to get the best ride I can from the bike, and maybe that will delay me changing rides for a bit (yeti turq 4.5 keeps calling me)....although I would still need the SW for the Yeti also

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> Thanks for the info. I started it at 120psi in the fork and 1 token...I have worked my way to 4 tokens and 108psi now and the fork feels better than ever...I can still bottom it if I come up short on a jump or don't clear a tabletop (small one).
> But for all I know, it can be lots better. We will see soon! Thanks again!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Which fork are you riding? Vorsprung Suspension has this awesome upgrade for the Pike, Lyrik, Fox 34/36 called the Luftkappe. It allows you to run higher pressures while maintaining the small bump compliance by making the negative chamber larger. It made my great Pike and Awesome Pike. It's relatively inexpensive and can be user installed if you're mechanically inclined.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

IRBent said:


> Which fork are you riding? Vorsprung Suspension has this awesome upgrade for the Pike, Lyrik, Fox 34/36 called the Luftkappe. It allows you to run higher pressures while maintaining the small bump compliance by making the negative chamber larger. It made my great Pike and Awesome Pike. It's relatively inexpensive and can be user installed if you're mechanically inclined.


Fox rhythm 34. Basically same as (heavier than) the performance 34. I'll keep the vorsprung in mind and see how things go. Thanks again!

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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

Got the ShockWiz yesterday and hit the trails today. Calibrated it beforehand and it said my CR was 2.7...that's with 4 spacers in the Fox 34...after riding a varied loop for about a mile I checked it and I was close....










It asked me to ride some more downhill and rougher stuff...did that and got score up to 88 with 90% confidence...it asked for less air so i reduced that but forgot to start a new session. No wonder the calibration thing was red when I finished..even though things looked good...will have to remember that for next time




























Overall, I like it. I was pretty close on my fork and it's still asking me to add another spacer and I had about 5psi too much air....that would be 5 (the max allowed in the Fox 34). Likely because of me being 260lbs? I'll redo it again before adding another spacer and then on to the shock.

Glad I bought it..it will be fun to play around with and make it a lot easier and quicker to setup a new bike.

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

gtsum2 said:


> Overall, I like it. I was pretty close on my fork and it's still asking me to add another spacer and I had about 5psi too much air....that would be 5 (the max allowed in the Fox 34). Likely because of me being 260lbs? I'll redo it again before adding another spacer and then on to the shock.
> 
> Glad I bought it..it will be fun to play around with and make it a lot easier and quicker to setup a new bike.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I wouldnt be chainging anything in the setup. If I were you I would be riding it as is again but doing some more jumps. You only did 2. More will give a far more definitive answer specifally in answer to the spacer/air adjusmtnets. My point is you might find they actually become green and all is actuall spot on now, you (and your Shockwix) doesnt yet know it.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

lucifuge said:


> I wouldnt be chainging anything in the setup. If I were you I would be riding it as is again but doing some more jumps. You only did 2. More will give a far more definitive answer specifally in answer to the spacer/air adjusmtnets. My point is you might find they actually become green and all is actuall spot on now, you (and your Shockwix) doesnt yet know it.


Thanks for the info. I was thinking same thing. The next set of trails I will ride have 2 flowy jump lines with doubles and tabletops (these are small ones...not a bike park)...then the latter half of the same trail has the typical singletrack with some roots and stuff. I can bottom the fork pretty easily if I dont clear the table tops (even with 4 spacers), but I am guessing I will need to compromise on my settings and what I want the fork to do on the trails...its asking a lot of a Fox 34 to be all green in all areas and then handle 2 ft drops and tabletops, etc with 260lbs on board But thats what will make the shock wiz cool to mess around with I think.

I should have a pretty good idea where I am at after that (I went to ride those trails today and the park was closed for a management deer hunt so I had to switch gears a bit). But, I like the SW...pretty cool little tool and fun to work with I think


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## tkaszuba (Dec 16, 2010)

Hi everyone, while riding the little retaining ring holding the hose connector together fell out. Does anyone know the size of a replacement ring? I'm not too keen to spend 50 euro for a replacement kit.

The hoses are a real weakness of the shockwiz. Has anyone experimented with different hoses? Preferably more flexible ones like you have on the fox shock pumps?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> Got the ShockWiz yesterday and hit the trails today. Calibrated it beforehand and it said my CR was 2.7...that's with 4 spacers in the Fox 34...after riding a varied loop for about a mile I checked it and I was close....
> 
> [


You may need to recalibrate the Shockwiz as the -7% travel is out of the range for quality results. I seem to recall the info stating the travel % needed to be +/- 3% max.

I agree with one of the previous comments too that a single ride or two is insufficient to get a definitive answer. I found using my Shockwiz for several months that testing on the same trails gave varied results depending on air temps, the line I chose, my mood which determined how aggressive or how well I rode, and more. So a few rides on a 1 mile loop is far from a tell all. Decide what you want to tune to, such as, my suspension doesn't handle this too well but everything else is good. So ride what it doesn't handle well and/or tune to the ugliest trails. When the Shockwiz tells you REPEATEDLY with 100% confidence that your scores are in the 90's with an occasional 100, you'll know your suspension is as close to perfect as it will get without internal component mods.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

IRBent said:


> You may need to recalibrate the Shockwiz as the -7% travel is out of the range for quality results. I seem to recall the info stating the travel % needed to be +/- 3% max.
> 
> I agree with one of the previous comments too that a single ride or two is insufficient to get a definitive answer. I found using my Shockwiz for several months that testing on the same trails gave varied results depending on air temps, the line I chose, my mood which determined how aggressive or how well I rode, and more. So a few rides on a 1 mile loop is far from a tell all. Decide what you want to tune to, such as, my suspension doesn't handle this too well but everything else is good. So ride what it doesn't handle well and/or tune to the ugliest trails. When the Shockwiz tells you REPEATEDLY with 100% confidence that your scores are in the 90's with an occasional 100, you'll know your suspension is as close to perfect as it will get without internal component mods.


Hmmm...I didn't notice the -7%. Thanks for catching that!! All good info!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> Hmmm...I didn't notice the -7%. Thanks for catching that!! All good info!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Yeah, a negative sag percent means your calibration never reached full extension. During testing it apparently did reach full extension, causing a negative travel result. 7% of say 150mm fork means your travel distance was off by .07*150=10.5mm. In English measurements, that's over 3/8" (inch). If you don't think 3/8" is a lot, just ask my wife. LOL


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

I can use the ShockWiz with this?:

https://www.sram.com/rockshox/products/super-deluxe-coil-rct


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

gontxo_nos said:


> I can use the ShockWiz with this?:
> 
> https://www.sram.com/rockshox/products/super-deluxe-coil-rct


No.


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## hbar314 (Apr 7, 2006)

Ok....My shockwiz has my Low Speed Rebound yellow towards the "slow down" side. 

This is on my cane creek rear shock which calls each direction of the dial "plush" and "firm". 

Is plush or firm going to slow down the LSR?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

hbar314 said:


> Ok....My shockwiz has my Low Speed Rebound yellow towards the "slow down" side.
> 
> This is on my cane creek rear shock which calls each direction of the dial "plush" and "firm".
> 
> Is plush or firm going to slow down the LSR?


I would think slowing down your rebound would make things firmer. Typically this requires your adjuster to be turned clockwise.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I would think slowing down your rebound would make things firmer. Typically this requires your adjuster to be turned clockwise.


was about to write similar


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> was about to write similar


Yeah, basically it's like closing a valve. The more you close the valve the slower the flow has to be. The slower the oil moves through the opening, the slower your shock rebounds.


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## hbar314 (Apr 7, 2006)

IRBent said:


> Yeah, basically it's like closing a valve. The more you close the valve the slower the flow has to be. The slower the oil moves through the opening, the slower your shock rebounds.


Awesome, that makes sense. I was thinking that this would do it but that description helps seal the deal. Thanks!


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Do you upload a profile b4 a ride to set the travel and CR of the particular suspension component you want to tune? And then do you download it after your ride with a new name so that you can review it at your convenience?

Do you set your travel for your shock for the suspension travel, or just the shock travel?

Thanks. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## we78 (Nov 6, 2009)

Will shockwiz work with Super Deluxe - https://www.sram.com/rockshox/products/super-deluxe-rc3?


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

we78 said:


> Will shockwiz work with Super Deluxe - https://www.sram.com/rockshox/products/super-deluxe-rc3?


Yes it will work fine.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

Finally got back out on the trail (closed due to weather) and redid the shock wiz. This was old school singletrack so not many jumps, but the fork is close. I used all but 7-10mm of travel (no big jumps on these trails). Aside from reducing air pressure a bit (I bet I could of dropped another 1-2 lbs and brought up the hsc reading?). I was right on with rebound and spacers (running 4 as I'm a bigger guy). The rear will be interesting as I have a trek with reAktiv rear shock...





































Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> Finally got back out on the trail (closed due to weather) and redid the shock wiz. This was old school singletrack so not many jumps, but the fork is close. I used all but 7-10mm of travel (no big jumps on these trails). Aside from reducing air pressure a bit (I bet I could of dropped another 1-2 lbs and brought up the hsc reading?). I was right on with rebound and spacers (running 4 as I'm a bigger guy). The rear will be interesting as I have a trek with reAktiv rear shock...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The way I read your results it's asking you to make the HSC softer, which would require the fork to move more freely on high speed events. I see too your dynamic sag is at 17%, so I'd drop a few PSI and ride the same run several more times to get a good idea of where you're at.


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## Noclutch (Jun 20, 2010)

Seems like this might be a good tool to rent out. 
Significant deposit for risk. “Profile” your potential users. Charge them like 1/4 of the purchase price. 
Reasonable proposition?
I’d pay that for that. 🤷🏻*♂ LOL apple emoticon translation 


Sent from my iFern using Tapatalk while not riding, dammit!


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Suns_PSD said:


> Do you upload a profile b4 a ride to set the travel and CR of the particular suspension component you want to tune? And then do you download it after your ride with a new name so that you can review it at your convenience?
> 
> Do you set your travel for your shock for the suspension travel, or just the shock travel?
> 
> ...


Typically for your first profile, you would create one and then set up all of your details like the fork travel (mm), rebound/comp. clicks, etc. Then you would do your ride and when you are ready to record the results, you would go back to that profile and click the button to download the data form the SHockWiz (looks like a shockwiz with the arrow pointing downwards). This will then populate the profile with your results data.

On your next ride, assuming you hit the same trail, you would clone the profile into a new one (file copy icon), make any adjustments and update the settings accordingly. You would then do your ride and download the data agin at the end.

If you continue to create profiles each time you ride, you will now have a log of results to refer to. This is how I use the Profile feature. I have set up profiles for different trails, so now I can simply update my fork settings based on the profile when I go back to that particular trail.

And I'm happy to report I've achieved the elusive 100 score on my Pike:


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Noclutch said:


> Seems like this might be a good tool to rent out.
> Significant deposit for risk. "Profile" your potential users. Charge them like 1/4 of the purchase price.
> Reasonable proposition?
> I'd pay that for that. 路*♂ LOL apple emoticon translation
> ...


I rent them out. No deposit! Just a hardcore rental agreement. ;-)

Only $100 for a week, for 2 devices. Tune front and rear during the same ride.

Check out www.FeelTheBerm.com for more info or to reserve.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Today I went to try the ShockWiz with the fork to configure some things, and when I turned on the APP told me that it has not connected correctly with the ShockWiz and I need to short-circuit it to be able to connect correctly, is this normal?.

Still, I disconnected the ShockWiz from the APP and I reconnected again and don't receive anything alert and hasn't given me problems.

Anyway, I've done this just in case: https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115003148253-ShockWiz-Reboot-Process

What could this small problem have been due to?

Thanks!.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Has anyone been able to update the latest v5.0 firmware that was just released? Mine seems to be stuck on "downloading" with no further progress. Can anyone comment on any bug fixes or new features in it?

Update: Tried a different phone and they're updating now. Checking for anything new...


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

bryanus said:


> Has anyone been able to update the latest v5.0 firmware that was just released? Mine seems to be stuck on "downloading" with no further progress. Can anyone comment on any bug fixes or new features in it?
> 
> Update: Tried a different phone and they're updating now. Checking for anything new...


Please do report back. I've not used my Shockwiz since maybe last summer or fall.


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## useport80 (Mar 6, 2008)

bryanus said:


> Typically for your first profile, you would create one and then set up all of your details like the fork travel (mm), rebound/comp. clicks, etc. Then you would do your ride and when you are ready to record the results, you would go back to that profile and click the button to download the data form the SHockWiz (looks like a shockwiz with the arrow pointing downwards). This will then populate the profile with your results data.
> 
> On your next ride, assuming you hit the same trail, you would clone the profile into a new one (file copy icon), make any adjustments and update the settings accordingly. You would then do your ride and download the data agin at the end.
> 
> ...


i tried shockwiz on my fox x2 a few times and it said to increase volume spacers, but i already have a max of 3 spacers installed. have you seen this before?


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

IRBent said:


> Please do report back. I've not used my Shockwiz since maybe last summer or fall.


So far, all I can see is that the status LED now blinks green vs red.

I was hoping there would be a way to zero out the ambient air pressure reading on the unit, but I don't see anything like that.

Edit: Actually, this may be new for the app, but there is a new Custom Tune mode, so that you can define the stiffness and liveliness to your own personal preferences now:

https://www.quarq.com/shockwiz-custom-tuning-mode/#sm.001ksndktdvud0w11kq11a4lhkutl

Seems there is no Efficient and Aggressive modes anymore - only Balanced and Playful. To get the Efficient and Aggressive back, you need to tune those in Custom Tune mode now:

For Efficient, choose 'Firmest' and 'Planted'
For Aggressive, chose 'Softest' and 'Poppy'

They are now defining Balanced vs Playful, too:

Balanced - Provides an overall compromise between traction, suppleness and pedaling efficiency. Balanced serves as a great baseline tune and is a favorite with ShockWiz users.

Playful - Allows for a perfect combination of traction, suppleness, and pedaling efficiency but with a livelier feel to give the bike 'pop'.

I've only used ShockWiz in Balanced and have gotten pretty great results, but after reading their definitions above, I may try for Playful now.

Interesting.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

useport80 said:


> i tried shockwiz on my fox x2 a few times and it said to increase volume spacers, but i already have a max of 3 spacers installed. have you seen this before?


If everything else is green, then you may have hit the limits of the shock itself.

If not, I would try adding more Air pressure, with the 3 bands installed, then see what results you get.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

I ran into an interesting problem with my shock wiz. I'd had it off the bike for half a season and just put it back on when I was planning on riding Santa Cruz. The shockwiz and the app are both up to date, when I log in I can connect to the shockwiz and it sees the air pressure and the % of travel used.

However no matter how many times I tell it to start a new session, it always acts like I haven't done any riding. I've tried full loops where I've basically bottomed out my fork and when I look at the shockwiz immediately afterwards it still shows 0 confidence and to start riding. 

Has anyone run into this before?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Jukas said:


> I ran into an interesting problem with my shock wiz. I'd had it off the bike for half a season and just put it back on when I was planning on riding Santa Cruz. The shockwiz and the app are both up to date, when I log in I can connect to the shockwiz and it sees the air pressure and the % of travel used.
> 
> However no matter how many times I tell it to start a new session, it always acts like I haven't done any riding. I've tried full loops where I've basically bottomed out my fork and when I look at the shockwiz immediately afterwards it still shows 0 confidence and to start riding.
> 
> Has anyone run into this before?


You're scaring me. I haven't used mine in maybe 6 months and just updated the firmware this evening. Maybe mine will work once I put it back on the bike.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Tomorrow I will try the ShockWiz on my bike with the new version.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Any idea on the changes the new version incorporated? I've installed it but yet to use it myself.


Yesterday I tried the new version of ShockWiz and it worked perfectly without problems


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Yesterday I tried the new version of ShockWiz and it worked perfectly without problems


Any idea on the changes the new version incorporated? I've installed it but yet to use it myself.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

IRBent said:


> Any idea on the changes the new version incorporated? I've installed it but yet to use it myself.


Yesterday I was tried that the new version works well. You have more settings for the fork, now you can make more adjustments than before.


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## amtiskaw (Feb 24, 2018)

*Tuning Help*

Hi

I'm after some advice on how to tune my shock. It's a Fox Float Factory 140mm on a 2017 Giant Trance. I'm running the new firearm on balanced mode.

The Shockwiz is telling me to soften my high speed compression. But my dynamic sag is at 30%, and if I reduce the baseline air pressure the Shockwiz tells me to add air. The compression adjuster is already on open mode. Low speed compression is also saying to reduce slightly, but that's on the softest of the three setting already.

Low speed rebound says to slow down slightly, but that's not available on my shock. HIgh speed rebound is in the green.

Any ideas on my options here?


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

amtiskaw said:


> Hi
> 
> I'm after some advice on how to tune my shock. It's a Fox Float Factory 140mm on a 2017 Giant Trance. I'm running the new firearm on balanced mode.
> 
> ...


Drop psi by 1-2 psi and see if that brings it inline

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## amtiskaw (Feb 24, 2018)

I'll give it a try this weekend. I dropped by 13 psi (5%) the last time, as per the recommendations, so I'll try smaller increments.


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## Mike Tee (Mar 27, 2013)

I've just started using my Shockwiz yesterday. Only for about an hour so may be a bit early to make any judgements. One thing that seems odd to me is the one size fits all approach from the shockwiz. It is probably a decision by SRAM but why don't they have profiles in the software for specific forks/dampers that would give more specific advice for the characteristics fo that particular fork? I know time and budget probably have a lot to do with it but it would make a lot more sense. Any thoughts?


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## BigWeetBix (Oct 16, 2017)

Mike Tee said:


> I've just started using my Shockwiz yesterday. Only for about an hour so may be a bit early to make any judgements. One thing that seems odd to me is the one size fits all approach from the shockwiz. It is probably a decision by SRAM but why don't they have profiles in the software for specific forks/dampers that would give more specific advice for the characteristics fo that particular fork? I know time and budget probably have a lot to do with it but it would make a lot more sense. Any thoughts?


I had the same thoughts. From the user's perspective it could provide a quicker setup. From SRAM's end.. the database of results would be invaluable.

Maybe.. that's where SRAMid is headed?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


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## Mike Tee (Mar 27, 2013)

BigWeetBix said:


> I had the same thoughts. From the user's perspective it could provide a quicker setup. From SRAM's end.. the database of results would be invaluable.
> 
> Maybe.. that's where SRAMid is headed?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


As a Fox36/floatX2 user I hope they wouldn't limit it to just SRAM products


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## BigWeetBix (Oct 16, 2017)

Mike Tee said:


> As a Fox36/floatX2 user I hope they wouldn't limit it to just SRAM products


That would be a stupid move. How better way to keep an eye on competitor performance than crowd source it.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

BigWeetBix said:


> I had the same thoughts. From the user's perspective it could provide a quicker setup. From SRAM's end.. the database of results would be invaluable.
> 
> Maybe.. that's where SRAMid is headed?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


If the setup had you enter rider weight, bike year and model, as well as shock or fork year/model, then the app phone home or allow users to upload results, indeed a massive database could be built.


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## Mechie (Oct 31, 2017)

Could use some advice from the group. 

Tuning a CCDB Air and having some trouble getting it dialed in. 

Getting a harsh feel when hitting roots,rocks,drops. 
All the data is green except for HSC that still shows max as make softer.

I have my HSC adjustment maxed out full soft already and cant seem to get any changes.

Any suggestions?

This is set with the new firmware as Neutral-Poppy

Sag at 27% with no spacers


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## g.law (Apr 16, 2007)

Mechie said:


> Could use some advice from the group.
> 
> Tuning a CCDB Air and having some trouble getting it dialed in.
> 
> ...


Try lowering the air pressure by 5lbs and start over. If it gets you closer keep lowering pressure slowly until you get there.


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

I have a similar issue to Mechie. I'm using a friend's Shockwize to check my tune on my 2018 Fox 36 RC2, which generally feels pretty good. I have tuning style set to Neutral - Planted.

It's all green except it wants HSC slightly softer and LSC slightly firmer (100% confidence).

I'm already running HSC wide open and LSC 3 clicks from open. It's my understanding though from some of the Vorsprung videos that increasing LSC will also affect HSC.

So what should I actually do? Lower pressure, add a token, and add a click of LSC? I'm already running pretty low PSI (62) for my weight (165 without gear).


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Andeh said:


> I have a similar issue to Mechie. I'm using a friend's Shockwize to check my tune on my 2018 Fox 36 RC2, which generally feels pretty good. I have tuning style set to Neutral - Planted.
> 
> It's all green except it wants HSC slightly softer and LSC slightly firmer (100% confidence).
> 
> ...


I would suggest riding without making any changes but keep track of every detail Shockwiz suggests. You may find that multiple rides over the same set of trails will give you multiple different suggestions. Don't try to make changes to hone in on a perfect score. Be happy with scores in the 90's and a suspension that feels good. I drove myself silly trying to make 100 only to find those exact setting didn't always net me 100 even on the same trails under similar temps and such.


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

Fair enough.

Just to be clear, "Planted" should be what I'm using if I'm trying to have my fork feel balanced with my coil shock (DHX2), right? I've tuned the shock to keep my rear wheel glued to the trail, especially over high speed bumps, but still provide enough support to push off small trail features. I'm looking for the fork to also glide through high speed bumps without feeling harsh, but also swallow up big square edged hits (water bars, rocks) while not feel dive-y.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Andeh said:


> Fair enough.
> 
> Just to be clear, "Planted" should be what I'm using if I'm trying to have my fork feel balanced with my coil shock (DHX2), right? I've tuned the shock to keep my rear wheel glued to the trail, especially over high speed bumps, but still provide enough support to push off small trail features. I'm looking for the fork to also glide through high speed bumps without feeling harsh, but also swallow up big square edged hits (water bars, rocks) while not feel dive-y.


They've changed the tuning styles since I last used my Shockwiz. "Planted" was not an option last summer. "Efficient, Balanced, Playful, and Aggressive" were the tuning styles last summer with the most firm option being efficient and the most active being the aggressive tune. What are they now and how does "Planted" fit in the range of options now?


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

So, if you chose a custom profile, you can set stiffness (softest, soft, neutral, firm, firmest) and liveliness (planted, poppy, active).

The old Efficient = Firmest / Planted, and Aggressive = Softest / Poppy.

I may well have effectively chosen the same thing as Balanced. I can't find anything defining what Balanced is on the new scale.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

This link describes the old tuning styles but I couldn't find anything on their website about the new tuning modes.

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115002489868-Tuning-Styles-Explained


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Just calibrated my Fox Float X2 on my SB6c.

CR was measured at 3.1 does that sound right?

Also, the pressure on the ShockWiz app reads 206psi which gives me 30% sag according to the reading on the app.
But, the pressure on my Rockshox digital pump was reading 190psi. That’s a big difference! When I’m done tuning, I will obviously recorded air pressure on the app and on the pump. Is it usuall for the two to be so different? I presume I use the pressure reading on the pump and use that going forward when setting pressure before I ride?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

2.7 to 3.3 seems to be the normal range for an air suspension.
Just like tires, actual pressure doesn't matter, consistency is the key. Record both but use your pump to find the same psi every time.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I agree with alexbn. The real measurement doesn't matter near as much as repeatability. I do think I read early comments though that said there was often 10psi or so of pressure differential between the Shockwiz and some pumps. Luckily my digital Lezyne pump and the Shockwiz register maybe within 2psi of one another. Still, I make notes of the Shockwiz pressure and pump pressure, only to repeat the pump pressure when adding air.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

I get quite a big error between different shock pumps and the shockwiz too. 

Even bigger for tyre pressure readings. 30psi on my park track pump is 26psi on my digital Topeak gauge, a 14% difference 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

I updated and so far it's not been too bad.. seems a bit more temperamental connecting to my phone (Note 8) when before it was 100%.
I wonder what the difference is between the light flashing Red or Green is.. pretty sure I've seen it both colours since the update (Calibration status or is that just app side?).. just leant it to a friend so can't check if this is the case.

Anyone know what the minimum Voltage is for the battery?

As for Shockwiz Vs Shock pumps, mine all tie up to within +/- 1-2 PSI with the shockwiz... pretty sure the digital Syncros 1.0 I've got was giving the exactly same value of 250 PSI on my rear shock at sea level.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Had a look at the Shockwiz and think the Red/Green flashing light is now if the calibration is ok (Green = Calibrated). Was definitely flashing Red and after connecting it to the Shock and calibration it started flashing Green.

As for SW accuracy.. as long as it doesn't drift then it doesn't matter other than it makes setup more cumbersome as you'll need to account for the discrepancy between your pump and SW. Obviously you'll need to remember the offset when setting your shock without the SW attached. I was wrong above and my SW reads 250 and my pump 245 so I need to account -5 PSI when I set my shock off just the pump... made a note on the profile.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

hmm. Ages ago I can see I got a CR =2.8 in RS Reba 120mm. Today, I added 3 tokens and re-did the calibration and it camer up with CR=4.1. Is that possible...or seem a bit weird?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Not sure about the numbers, but it makes sense that when you add tokens, you decrease the volume and increase the ratio of maximum to minimum volumes.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Jukas said:


> I ran into an interesting problem with my shock wiz. I'd had it off the bike for half a season and just put it back on when I was planning on riding Santa Cruz. The shockwiz and the app are both up to date, when I log in I can connect to the shockwiz and it sees the air pressure and the % of travel used.
> 
> However no matter how many times I tell it to start a new session, it always acts like I haven't done any riding. I've tried full loops where I've basically bottomed out my fork and when I look at the shockwiz immediately afterwards it still shows 0 confidence and to start riding.
> 
> Has anyone run into this before?


Mine was initially ok after the update but it's also started not recording any data with rough terrain, medium drop off and jumps and fast rock gardens so the odd bottom out... so yeah it seems to respond ok set up wise and measuring correct sag etc

Wondering if mine and your SWs are faulty and the update is a coincidence as initially mine was ok with the update other than connectivity issues with Android.. battery voltage is fine @ 2.7V.

So yeah possibly faulty.. may pull the battery and check the manual for factory reset etc..


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

Been using sw to get my new ripley dialed in...had both fork and shock at 96 score, but felt the shock could be a bit better. Switched out a volume spacer and slowed down rebound a click and upped psi 4-5 lbs and after about 45 minutes of spirited riding, checked it and got this




























I'm a little puzzled at the lack of deep compression events as there were a couple of 2 foot to flat drops and numerous tabletops...but the bike felt excellent in all areas from chunk, to flow, to roots and rocks.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gtsum2 said:


> Been using sw to get my new ripley dialed in...had both fork and shock at 96 score, but felt the shock could be a bit better. Switched out a volume spacer and slowed down rebound a click and upped psi 4-5 lbs and after about 45 minutes of spirited riding, checked it and got this
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I suggest selling the Shockwiz now. Otherwise when you get 94 on the next ride you'll be forever trying to figure out how to fix it.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

IRBent said:


> I suggest selling the Shockwiz now. Otherwise when you get 94 on the next ride you'll be forever trying to figure out how to fix it.


Lol. How true! I already took it off and put it in the toolbox. It has served its purpose and helped me get my rig dialed in

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

gtsum2 said:


> Lol. How true! I already took it off and put it in the toolbox. It has served its purpose and helped me get my rig dialed in
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Your never buying another bike again?


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

lucifuge said:


> Your never buying another bike again?


Certainly. Just no need for me to keep the sw on the bike full time. I still have it and am keeping it...just not going to keep it on the bike. Maybe when weather warms up dramatically and or I ride different areas, then I'll put it back on. But I've already experienced the sw effect of constantly looking at the app, trying to keep making tweaks to get another few points higher score, etc. I knew within a few miles yesterday my tune felt better than the "96" score I had previously and the sw agreed (at least this time!).

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

I've still got issues with my SW not recording rides anymore. Seem to be working fine.. reading pressure changes but select start new ride but now get no data recorded.

My SW did work ok after the update for a couple of rides so unsure if the update has caused the issue, it is measuring the pressure ok so it must be a software or data storage issue.. corrupted ROM?

Took the battery out to see if that fixes it (OFF Reset) and checked it with a Multi-meter and its reading 2.934V so that's not it (btw SW says it's 2.7V).

I did notice the LED flashed 4 times rapidly on boot up.. either an error code or just the boot up sequence?.. sometimes it flashes Red but no idea what this means either.

Anyway I've emailed SW to ask their opinion.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I had a strange issue with mine in so far as the sw would only work when the battery was not slid into the metal cupping fully. If left it a half a centimeter out from fully recessed it worked!?


RocketMagnet said:


> I've still got issues with my SW not recording rides anymore. Seem to be working fine.. reading pressure changes but select start new ride but now get no data recorded.
> 
> My SW did work ok after the update for a couple of rides so unsure if the update has caused the issue, it is measuring the pressure ok so it must be a software or data storage issue.. corrupted ROM?
> 
> ...


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

Seems like a tight fit but yeah if it kept loosing power.. but it's in there nice and snug and the connections look good.
I'm on App Version 8.0.0 (Android) and Firmware 5.0.0.

Just tried downloading from the SW to a profile and it writes down the no data to it.. it wont upload any previous rides though .. says success! but it's still says no data.

I may try the Beta Firmware (hmm you need to request Beta access  )after that looks like it's gone faulty.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Had my first couple of rides with the SW on my SB6c.
Shock is a Fox Float X2.
Setup to factory spec for my weight 95kg
210 psi giving me 30% sag
HRS 14 from slow
LSR 15 from slow
HSC 15 from slow
LSC 17 from slow

Part way through the first ride SW recommended a reduction in reassure, so went down to 200psi

At the end of the first ride, recommendation was to make HSC softer (it was red) and make LSC softer (it was yellow). Everything else was green.

I made HSC softer by 3 clicks and LSC softer by 2 clicks.

I rode again today on very similar trails. Wet, roots, rocky. (White’s Level at Afan forest in Wales).

This time at the end of the ride, the recommendations are to make HSC softer again (in the red) and reduce air pressure. If I make HSC softer by another three clicks (currently on 18 from slow) it will be fully open.

I’m not sure why HSC needs to be softer? Is it because I am not using all of the travel? I’m also not sure why it suggest less air? The current pressure of 200ps (after changing from th first ride from 210 to 200)i is giving me 35% dynamic sag.

I tend not to jump, I tend to roll over most stuff of technical single track, which is what I Ride the last two days.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Forgot to add that also after the second ride, everything other then pressure and HSC was green.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

End of first ride









After todays ride


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

Can anyone tell me if I've lost weight (10lb) since riding last year do I need to change much of what I tuned through the shockwiz last year? I'm guessing maybe just pressure needs to change to get the correct sag or will everything need to be retuned?

Thanks



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

How much is that 10lbs as a percentage of your total weight plus that of the bike?


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## dmo (Apr 21, 2006)

onzadog said:


> How much is that 10lbs as a percentage of your total weight plus that of the bike?


It's about a 7% change from before. Is that significant enough to make a difference?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

You and the bike now weight 133 lbs? If so, you could drop 5% from your air pressure but I'd imagine that would only be a couple of psi. My forks change that much at the bottom of a downhill run so I'd not bother.


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## gtsum2 (Jun 28, 2017)

db3266 said:


> End of first ride
> 
> View attachment 1190622
> 
> ...


I'd try dropping psi a couple lbs and ride the same trail and see what you have. Sw seems to like lower air pressures and open adjustments with volume spacers...at least that's been my experience

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

*DVO Topaz shockwiz results*

What's everyone's thoughts on these results? I'm 190-195lbs and I'm running 200psi in the positive, 185psi in the negative, 8 clicks of rebound and one band in the positive chamber. It feels pretty good but a little more compliance over stutter bumps would be good.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

robmac48 said:


> What's everyone's thoughts on these results? I'm 185lbs and I'm running 200psi in the positive, 185psi in the negative, 8 clicks of rebound and one band in the positive chamber. It feels pretty good but a little more compliance over stutter bumps would be good.
> 
> View attachment 1190702
> 
> ...


 I'm assuming your riding a Topaz rear shock and have 200psi in the main can and 185psi in the bladder, not the negative. What's your tuning band setup looking like right now?


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

IRBent said:


> I'm assuming your riding a Topaz rear shock and have 200psi in the main can and 185psi in the bladder, not the negative. What's your tuning band setup looking like right now?


Yeah sorry, Topaz with 200 main and 185 in the bladder. One band on the positive.

Also adjusted my initial post with a confirmed weight...seems I am a little heavier than I thought! (Between 190-195lbs)


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

robmac48 said:


> Yeah sorry, Topaz with 200 main and 185 in the bladder. One band on the positive.
> 
> Also adjusted my initial post with a confirmed weight...seems I am a little heavier than I thought! (Between 190-195lbs)


My brain is fighting itself over your HSC & LSC issues. It's asking for low speed to be firmer and high speed to be softer. My initial thought would be to add one more tuning band to the positive and drop maybe 5psi out of the main can. The extra band should keep you from bottoming out and the lower can pressure should make things more compliant, offering a bit more small bump compliance. But the excessive pogo has me puzzled. You said 8 clicks of rebound. Is this 8 clicks closed from full open? I'm thinking it only has 9 clicks total. I've swapped my Topaz oil to Red Line Like Water to make it more active and I'm running only 2-3 clicks from full open and I don't have pogo issues at all. I'm at 3 bands in the positive, 2 negative, main can pressure @ my riding weight with gear and the bladder pressure at my body weight without clothes.


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

Adding to IRBent's post, there's a good Vorsprung Tech Talk on LSC & HSC, with the TLDR version being that LSC affects your HSC.

I've run into a similar issue with Shockwiz recommending conflicting HSC & LSC changes (softer HSC, firmer LSC). At that point, you have to think about what's going on and use logic rather than just blindly following the app. My 36 RC2 is running with HSC wide open, so obviously can't go any softer. Under detection, it lists "bobbing" as the only issue. So what's going on is when I am pedaling uphill, especially out of the saddle sprints, I see a bit of bob on the front end. So in my case, the solution is to either crank LSC closed 2-3 clicks for climbs, or just live with the bob and not have to worry about remembering to back it off for the descents.


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

IRBent said:


> My brain is fighting itself over your HSC & LSC issues. It's asking for low speed to be firmer and high speed to be softer. My initial thought would be to add one more tuning band to the positive and drop maybe 5psi out of the main can. The extra band should keep you from bottoming out and the lower can pressure should make things more compliant, offering a bit more small bump compliance. But the excessive pogo has me puzzled. You said 8 clicks of rebound. Is this 8 clicks closed from full open? I'm thinking it only has 9 clicks total. I've swapped my Topaz oil to Red Line Like Water to make it more active and I'm running only 2-3 clicks from full open and I don't have pogo issues at all. I'm at 3 bands in the positive, 2 negative, main can pressure @ my riding weight with gear and the bladder pressure at my body weight without clothes.


My rebound is 8 clicks from fully closed so I'm almost out of adjustment. I had a bit of a think about it last night and I'm trying a fairly different set up later today, 3 positive bands, 1 negative, 180 bladder and 190 main, I'll report back what data it produces.

Will definitely consider changing the oil too. Thanks for the feedback IRBent and Andeh.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

robmac48 said:


> My rebound is 8 clicks from fully closed so I'm almost out of adjustment. I had a bit of a think about it last night and I'm trying a fairly different set up later today, 3 positive bands, 1 negative, 180 bladder and 190 main, I'll report back what data it produces.
> 
> Will definitely consider changing the oil too. Thanks for the feedback IRBent and Andeh.


That sounds like a good starting place. Once you get the tuning bands in place set your main can pressure, a bit at a time equalizing as you go, until you get to @ 30% sag. Even if it ends up at 185 or 195psi. Then adjust based on SW results. But know too, 3-4 rides on the same trail with the shock settings will give different answers in SW. Work off of the majority rather than trying to adjust after every single ride. You'll end up chasing your tail and driving yourself batshit crazy if you adjust after every ride.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

IRBent said:


> That sounds like a good starting place. Once you get the tuning bands in place set your main can pressure, a bit at a time equalizing as you go, until you get to @ 30% sag. Even if it ends up at 185 or 195psi. Then adjust based on SW results. But know too, 3-4 rides on the same trail with the shock settings will give different answers in SW. Work off of the majority rather than trying to adjust after every single ride. You'll end up chasing your tail and driving yourself batshit crazy if you adjust after every ride.


One other thing, go to YouTube and look for the rebound curb test if tours not familiar with it. That should get you within a click or 2 of trail settings.


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

*Topaz with changes*

Ok, second stab with the shockwiz. First time I ran 200psi main, 185psi bladder and rebound 8 from fully closed and one positive band. Felt like it was a little harsh on the chatter and the shockwix showed it wanted firmer HSC and softer LSC and said that bouncing was 'poor'.

This time I ran 190psi main, 180psi bladder, rebound 8 from fully closed, 2 postive bands, 1 negative bands. This time shockwiz was happy with my HSC but still wanted softer LSC and the bouncing remained the same at 'poor'.

The biggest change was how it felt. Way more supple and so much more feel from the back end, really liked this set up.

Thinking I might try 185psi main, 190psi bladder, 3 positive bands, 2 negative bands and leave the rebound at 8 out to see how that feels next.

Redline oil change is looking likely too in the future.


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## springs (May 20, 2017)

IRBent said:


> One other thing, go to YouTube and look for the rebound curb test if tours not familiar with it. That should get you within a click or 2 of trail settings.


I did mean to do this before my ride but totally forgot! I'll have a look before the next one and see what it looks like. It'll be interesting to see if something so simple is a useful tool.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

robmac48 said:


> Ok, second stab with the shockwiz. First time I ran 200psi main, 185psi bladder and rebound 8 from fully closed and one positive band. Felt like it was a little harsh on the chatter and the shockwix showed it wanted firmer HSC and softer LSC and said that bouncing was 'poor'.
> 
> This time I ran 190psi main, 180psi bladder, rebound 8 from fully closed, 2 postive bands, 1 negative bands. This time shockwiz was happy with my HSC but still wanted softer LSC and the bouncing remained the same at 'poor'.
> 
> ...


I bet if you closed your rebound knob 1-2 rounds clockwise, your pogo issue in Shockwiz would go away. Your experience so far sounds like mine. I found lower main can pressure made for a more supple ride, eating up the small bumps. I ended up with 3+ and 2- on the tuning bands. But at times the rear starts to pack down on successive hits. Makes me wonder if I had a tad more pressure in the main can if it would help it rebound faster. If I add pressure to the main can I won't use as much travel unless I remove a positive band. It also won't sag to @ 30% unless I remove a negative band. Maybe we need some bands half as wide as the stock bands so we can meet in the middle. LOL


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## floatingbadger (Apr 9, 2018)

Hi I’m running 2018 Factory 36’s and it’s recommending to add air and remove spacers but it’s bottoming out surely I need to add spacers if it’s bottoming out


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Delete


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

You should only do one thing at a time. So add Air then ride and see what it says after that. Work down the list from top to bottom individually. It can't work out if you need spacers correctly unless you get your air pressure correct first etc..


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## floatingbadger (Apr 9, 2018)

Ok thanks


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## AlpineM3 (Apr 13, 2018)

Hey Fellas, I own 3 Shockwiz devices and been testing since they released to the public with mixed results. Have gone back and forth between using it and all the while also improving as a rider thus my preferences have also shifted. Current bike is a 2017 Bronson CC with a 160mm Fox 36 fork and 150mm Fox X2 shock. Generally lock out the rear only on the climbs or when pedaling to the trail head and that tends to give me a good enough ride (harsh, but doable) to get up the steep stuff and the top of the mountain at which point I start a new session and proceed to descend which brings me to my question. Have read all 13 pages related to the Shockwiz and it's recommendations and still don't have a clear indication about how to properly use it or even worth using. Much of the feedback is strictly descend driven thus not very helpful to get an all around Enduro tune. I've fought the suggestions at times and most of the time end up splitting the difference from what it says to how it feels to me on the trail. How does it benefit you guys and what are your thoughts in general? How do you use it? Strictly descend driven or goal is to achieve something that pedals well also?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

AlpineM3 said:


> Hey Fellas, I own 3 Shockwiz devices and been testing since they released to the public with mixed results. Have gone back and forth between using it and all the while also improving as a rider thus my preferences have also shifted. Current bike is a 2017 Bronson CC with a 160mm Fox 36 fork and 150mm Fox X2 shock. Generally lock out the rear only on the climbs or when pedaling to the trail head and that tends to give me a good enough ride (harsh, but doable) to get up the steep stuff and the top of the mountain at which point I start a new session and proceed to descend which brings me to my question. Have read all 13 pages related to the Shockwiz and it's recommendations and still don't have a clear indication about how to properly use it or even worth using. Much of the feedback is strictly descend driven thus not very helpful to get an all around Enduro tune. I've fought the suggestions at times and most of the time end up splitting the difference from what it says to how it feels to me on the trail. How does it benefit you guys and what are your thoughts in general? How do you use it? Strictly descend driven or goal is to achieve something that pedals well also?


Interesting points. I've been questioning similar. My main thoughts are:

1. The main thing for me which I dont think comes up much is: the overall balance of the bike. I'm not convinced you achieve a good balance unless you tune (i) rear (ii) front, and then repeat that a few times. I just dont beleive it can determine the harmony between front and rear until its repeated at least once.

2. I'm reverse-engineering it with my Lyrik! My Lyrik has a Luftkappe and Ive been told (and actually now think its true) that an extra 10% from recommended is optimal. So I ride with that air pressure and see what tune is bes matched to that ride. Invariably its a form of 'balanced'. Which was my prior preference anyway. All that remains is fine tuning the rebound+LSC. Its been great for that.

3. (Way) Too much time can be spent SW-ing! detracts from your rides.

4. Finally, I find the quality of the travel used is better than all of the travel used at least once.


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## jbhkhc (Jan 14, 2018)

So yesterday I (80kg dh rider/enduro rider) added my new shockwiz to my 2018 lyrik 170mm and spent the day shuttling. I started with a score of 86. Air pressure (60psi) and ramp up (2 tokens) were spot on from the start.

All my suggestions were based upon slowing rebound down (yellow marker). I slowed the rebound down 2 clicks and the bike felt worse. Got a score of 74 and was still getting the same suggestions. Started my new session after another 2 clicks of rebound damping and i got a lower score, yellow in a lot more fields, and was STILL told to slow rebound down.

Fork went from feeling great to feeling awful over rocks and roots. I started with 6 clicks rebound from fully open and went to 11 clicks, with the fork feeling worse every time.

The calibration was done right, so....am I missing something?


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

I'd be interested to hear an answer on that also. I'm running Shockwiz on a 34 Grip, and it's doing the same thing so far. Every time I run it, it says make rebound softer (yellow). I've now dialed it down probably about ~8 clicks from where I started. I'd thought it was a function of the fork being on a hardtail, but maybe not?


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## jbhkhc (Jan 14, 2018)

Andeh said:


> I'd be interested to hear an answer on that also. I'm running Shockwiz on a 34 Grip, and it's doing the same thing so far. Every time I run it, it says make rebound softer (yellow). I've now dialed it down probably about ~8 clicks from where I started. I'd thought it was a function of the fork being on a hardtail, but maybe not?


I'm on a 2018 Nomad so I'm guessing not relating to being on a hardtail. I was doing practice race runs with the shockwiz settings and my normal strava times (which have always been around consistant to around 4 seconds) suffered massively. I'm also riding with a TFCC tear in my wrist so I'm quite sensitive to changes in set up. The rebound speed I got to with SW suggestions had the fork packing like a MOFO and left me in agony.

Anyone other than us two had similar, or a fix?


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## fdes (Apr 16, 2014)

jbhkhc said:


> So yesterday I (80kg dh rider/enduro rider) added my new shockwiz to my 2018 lyrik 170mm and spent the day shuttling. I started with a score of 86. Air pressure (60psi) and ramp up (2 tokens) were spot on from the start.
> 
> All my suggestions were based upon slowing rebound down (yellow marker). I slowed the rebound down 2 clicks and the bike felt worse. Got a score of 74 and was still getting the same suggestions. Started my new session after another 2 clicks of rebound damping and i got a lower score, yellow in a lot more fields, and was STILL told to slow rebound down.
> 
> ...


I had an issue reading the suggestions originally when I started using my shockwiz. I had assumed that if I wanted to move the slider to the right I had to follow the advice on the right.

Then I was getting the opposite results. So what I found is that if the slider is to the left you need to follow the advice that is on the left. If the slider is to the right follow the advice on the right.

Not sure if you are doing the same that I did.


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## amtiskaw (Feb 24, 2018)

I'm starting to not trust the Shockwiz. It want's me to run 37% sag on my shock (Fox Float DPS Evol on a 2016 Trance Adv 1), and while the small bump compliance is great, even small drop offs feel like it's blowing through the travel way too much.

I've gone back to 28% sag and just went with the Shockwiz's rebound recommendations, which feel spot on.

Any other Trance riders using a Shockwiz?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

The biggest differentiator would be the tune setting. What are you using? Try Firm + Planted and see what that yields.


amtiskaw said:


> I'm starting to not trust the Shockwiz. It want's me to run 37% sag on my shock (Fox Float DPS Evol on a 2016 Trance Adv 1), and while the small bump compliance is great, even small drop offs feel like it's blowing through the travel way too much.
> 
> I've gone back to 28% sag and just went with the Shockwiz's rebound recommendations, which feel spot on.
> 
> Any other Trance riders using a Shockwiz?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

One thing that I gleaned from shockwiz is that even as a lighter rider sub 160lbs,was that my shock needed the largest spacer. I had none previously. Shockwiz shocked me! But it's perfect, and, needed!


lucifuge said:


> The biggest differentiator would be the tune setting. What are you using? Try Firm + Planted and see what that yields.


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## jbhkhc (Jan 14, 2018)

No, I thought I might have been misreading the suggestions and tried going the other way, they went from yellow to red.

So still stuck


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I would next be questioning your calibration. What is your travel and what ratio did it derive?


jbhkhc said:


> No, I thought I might have been misreading the suggestions and tried going the other way, they went from yellow to red.
> 
> So still stuck


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## amtiskaw (Feb 24, 2018)

Travel on the shock shaft is 51mm, which translates to 140mm at the wheel. Ratio shows as 1.5 at 280 psi.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

amtiskaw said:


> Travel on the shock shaft is 51mm, which translates to 140mm at the wheel. Ratio shows as 1.5 at 280 psi.


1.5 ! Can't be correct. I would expect somewhere between 2.3 and 3.2


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I agree. A CR of 1.5 is quite a way below what I would expect.


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## StumpedUpKiwi (Aug 13, 2017)

*Progressive Shock Tune*

Long time lurker, first time caller.

I'm running a RS Monarch RC3 with the Debonair can on my 2013 Stumpjumper EVO 29. As Specialized has recently admitted, the suspension set up is quite linear and has a tendency to blow through all the travel irrespective of what or how I am riding. I have previously tuned the rear shock with a firm + planted setting. It felt good. No bands added to the air can.

I've recently firmed up the air spring (275psi) which now puts me on 30% sag. I want to retune the shock in an attempt to get it to sit a bit more in the middle of its travel and to make it a bit more progressive. But I'm unsure what tune specifically on the Shockwiz I should be after? Firmest + Active?

Currently most of my riding is bike park - blue and occasional black. Chairlift uplift. Though some climbing. I don't want the shock set too harsh, but then I don't want it spongey and eating all the travel even quicker.

Any thoughts on the firmness/liveliness settings to use?

Cheers in advance


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

If I'm reading this right you may not be able to practically increase the air spring beyond what you have now. I would be adding a spacer. if you are a heavy rider, put in the largest you can and stick with firm+planted and then re-tune. That could be exactly what you want.



StumpedUpKiwi said:


> Long time lurker, first time caller.
> 
> I'm running a RS Monarch RC3 with the Debonair can on my 2013 Stumpjumper EVO 29. As Specialized has recently admitted, the suspension set up is quite linear and has a tendency to blow through all the travel irrespective of what or how I am riding. I have previously tuned the rear shock with a firm + planted setting. It felt good. No bands added to the air can.
> 
> ...


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## StumpedUpKiwi (Aug 13, 2017)

Spacer = Band??

Agreed re: air spring. The firm tune set me at about 250psi (I'm probably 85kg on the bike with a pack). I've bumped it up to 275psi. It felt ok on a cratered black run. Sat up in berms better. Just hoping to make it even slightly progressive.

What does the "active" tune net you on the liveliness setting (versus planted and poppy)?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

StumpedUpKiwi said:


> Spacer = Band??
> 
> Agreed re: air spring. The firm tune set me at about 250psi (I'm probably 85kg on the bike with a pack). I've bumped it up to 275psi. It felt ok on a cratered black run. Sat up in berms better. Just hoping to make it even slightly progressive.
> 
> What does the "active" tune net you on the liveliness setting (versus planted and poppy)?


good question, I had to open up my canister and insert a spacer. The bands are external on the canister I'm not familiar with them. hopefully someone will chime in here.

Active is probably the goldilocks setting between the two (at a guess). But would probably require less air than normal and/or spacers(tokens/bands) so its more progressive


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## amtiskaw (Feb 24, 2018)

onzadog said:


> I agree. A CR of 1.5 is quite a way below what I would expect.


Yeah, I just re-calibrated and it came out at 2.8. That explains a lot. Be interesting to see what sag it recommends now. Thanks, guys


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

As one of the guys with the rebound problem:
I'm running a 34 at 140mm, 2 tokens. CR measured to be 2.3 at 72.6 psi. 

Seems about right because my 36 170 with no spacers was 2.6 at 60.8 psi.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

*SRAM ID syncs up your Profiles to the cloud!*

Hey guys, I just found out what the new SRAM ID setting in the ShockWiz app does!

I noticed the SRAM ID login in the ShockWiz settings, created an account, but it didn't "do" anything, so I didn't think much about it.

Well, I just upgraded to a new phone, which didn't have any of my old profiles in the newly installed app.

But after logging into the SRAM ID account on the new phone, all of my profiles (even Archived ones) appeared!

Quarq is syncing/backing up our profiles to the 'cloud'! Sweet feature!


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## Raikzz (Jul 19, 2014)

Sorry if it's answered somewhere before, but i couldn't even google the answer to my question.

When using shockwiz for XC-bike , should i ride with normal training pace, or race-pace ?

Logical mind tells me if you want the bike to handle the best in race you have to ride with race-pace ? Or isn't it necessary ? 

Because when i set the air pressure when riding slower pace , and everything seems fine , then with race-pace, when i'm attacking downhills and root sections , the suspension is going to blow it's travel isn't it ?


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

Raikzz said:


> Sorry if it's answered somewhere before, but i couldn't even google the answer to my question.
> 
> When using shockwiz for XC-bike , should i ride with normal training pace, or race-pace ?
> 
> ...


You ride how you want to tune your suspension for.

Long term you might want to create a training list of settings and a race list of settings.


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## Raikzz (Jul 19, 2014)

Well that's what i always thought, but shop owner said it's not important how fast you ride , you just have to ride variety of trails , which seemed not logical at all.


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## iggs (Oct 18, 2007)

Raikzz said:


> Well that's what i always thought, but shop owner said it's not important how fast you ride , you just have to ride variety of trails , which seemed not logical at all.


How you ride has a huge effect on your suspension and therefore the settings that are needed. I think its one of the problems people have with interpreting the results they are getting from the shockwiz sometimes. The trail might be the same, the shock set up might be the same but the way the rider has ridden it can vary quite a lot and this will give very different data


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I always tune for the worst. Find the ugliest gnarliest section with the most rocks, roots and jumps. Ride it over and over and watch the results change with each ride. Then adjust suspension setting based on the majority of the recommendations. Once you've done that and achieved high scores, ignore the lower scores on the smooth and easier trails.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

iggs said:


> How you ride has a huge effect on your suspension and therefore the settings that are needed. I think its one of the problems people have with interpreting the results they are getting from the shockwiz sometimes. The trail might be the same, the shock set up might be the same but the way the rider has ridden it can vary quite a lot and this will give very different data


This.

I have to ride consistently hard to get consistent readings.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## StumpedUpKiwi (Aug 13, 2017)

*Compression and Calibration Issues*

I'm trying to tune my RS Monarch Debonair Plus shock on my Stumpjumper EVO. I have gone through the calibration process multiple times and get a compression ratio of 1.6. As soon as I ride, the app says the calibration is out. But no matter how many times I calibrate, the ratio is the same.

Has anyone come across this problem? Is 1.6 for such a shock correct?


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## StumpedUpKiwi (Aug 13, 2017)

I've answered my own question. Swapped the unit around so that I'm using the other valve. Compression ratio now 2.3 (the same as the very first round of tuning), and calibration is holding.


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## BigWeetBix (Oct 16, 2017)

StumpedUpKiwi said:


> I've answered my own question. Swapped the unit around so that I'm using the other valve. Compression ratio now 2.3 (the same as the very first round of tuning), and calibration is holding.


Beat me to it! I was about to suggest removing the valve core.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


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## StumpedUpKiwi (Aug 13, 2017)

BigWeetBix said:


> Beat me to it! I was about to suggest removing the valve core.


Is this a common problem? What does removing the core do?


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## BigWeetBix (Oct 16, 2017)

It was necessary for the Float X2. End of the day it's just measuring pressure not volume of air.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


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## Andeh (Jul 30, 2014)

I fixed my issue with Shockwiz always asking me to back off rebound - had bad calibration initially. Originally I got a CR of 2.3. I recalibrated it 3 more times, getting 2.5, 2.5, and 2.6. After talking to the guy who owns the Shockwiz I'm borrowing, he said he always runs the calibration wizard a few times, then picks the most common ratio.

I manually set CR to 2.5, reset baseline pressure, and went for a ride, checking on the suggestions at a few midpoints. The first couple times it suggested making rebound softer still, which concerned me, but when I got done it said everything was good except LSC. I'm fine with that though, because HSC is fine and my 34 doesn't have independent adjusters. I know Shockwiz tends to ask for more LSC due to my climbing style (frequently out of the saddle, which puts a lot of bob on the fork).


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## javiergutz (Sep 28, 2017)

Anyone knows if the Shockwiz is compatible with the Öhlins STX22 air shock?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

javiergutz said:


> Anyone knows if the Shockwiz is compatible with the Öhlins STX22 air shock?


I think it is compatible. Checkout their compatibility section here:

https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/categories/204347088-COMPATIBILITY?mobile_site=true


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

I finally decided to pull my Shockwiz off the shelf and play with the new software. I also decided to tweak my rear shock tune while I was at it. I ride a 2015 Bronson with a DVO Topaz that I was setup with 3 positive and 2 negative tuning bands inside. That was a radical tune I tried after moving from a single tuning band on the positive side. I really like the 3+ / 2- setup and ran low pressures so the shock was super supple on the top and never bottomed out harshly. But repetitive HSC hits occasionally caused the rear to hang up. I toyed with the idea of a rebound shim adjustment to see if I could speed up the HSR as I was pretty sure the rear was packing up on HSC events, especially going down stairs. So rather than bust into the shim stack I decided to see if a bit extra can pressure would help the HSR issue. So I pulled 1 tuning band from both positive and negative sides and set my main can pressure to achieve 30% sag. I calibrated the Shockwiz and took out. Throughout the ride the slow speed rebound felt a bit pogoish, often kicking my ass up a tad over slow speed roots and rocks. But in the end the Shockwiz liked the setup, giving me a score of 96 with everything in the green except HSC which was yellow and asking me to soften it. This is a single run though and I rarely start tweaking based on such. Although I did add one maybe mush/click to the rebound to see if that would make me feel better about the setup next time around.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*Shockwiz Air Volume and Tuning Bands*

Pardon me if we've discussed this before on this forum before. If we have, I don't remember it.

When we connect a Shockwiz to a shock or a fork, the connector hose and the Shockwiz itself has some volume of air that each holds or adds to the volume of the shock. I can't help but logically consider this extra volume becomes part of the calculations that the Shockwiz makes. For instance. Tuning my rear shock the Shockwiz came up with a compression ratio of 2.8 for my shock when I had a single tuning band on the positive side. With 2 bands it came up with a CR of 2.9, and with 3 bands the CR was 3.0. So it appears that a single tuning band changes my compression ratio by 0.1. If you measure the dimensions of the tuning band and calculated its volume I could imagine that volume being similar to the amount of volume that could be in the Shockwiz and hose. The longer hose meant for the fork might even take up more volume than a single tuning band. So if the Shockwiz says you're golden at say 200psi, the effect of removing the Shockwiz and hoses could essentially remove enough volume that it would be like adding another tuning band. Have any of you considered this, experimented with it or attempted to measure the volumes added by the hoses, the Shockwiz itself and compared them to the volume a tuning band would take up?

My point being, we're tuning with the Shockwiz attached, taking it's input then most likely removing the Shockwiz and running a setup based based on info we gathered with the Shockwiz attached. But everything changes once the Wiz is removed.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

You are correct. The volume is added to your air chamber, but it is very small. You are also calculating the ratio with the shockwiz attached. Now if they where smart and they seem to be, it would be easy to compensate for the small extra volume in the calculations.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> You are correct. The volume is added to your air chamber, but it is very small. You are also calculating the ratio with the shockwiz attached. Now if they where smart and they seem to be, it would be easy to compensate for the small extra volume in the calculations.


I'm tempted to calculate the volume of the hoses and a tuning band for my shock. I could pipette water into the hoses and get an exact volume based on millimeters of water. But I won't dare try that with my Shockwiz. LOL. As for the tuning band, I could either use a mic to measure it then calculate its volume, or submerse it in a beaker and measure the amount of water it displaces.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Hi everyone. I've had the SW on my SB6c for a few weeks now. Been riding some good technical descents (mostly at a Afan in Wales)..

I'm using the SW on my Fox Float X2.

The pics above show the SW readings and detections.

Everything looks perfect other then compression settings.
I have the compression for both high and low fully open yet SW still wants to make them softer.

What would you suggest? I think the bike rides great.
Should I remove a spacer? Currently setup with 2 spacers.
Should I just leave it alone?
I don't do big jumps so I really don't do any hard hitting stuff.
For those that know it, Happy Life is probably the most technical descent I have done whilst using the SW. but generally, the SW has been on the bike whilst I've ridden most of the trails at Afan.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

db3266 said:


> View attachment 1196904
> View attachment 1196905
> View attachment 1196906
> View attachment 1196907
> ...


How much do you weigh with gear? My first guess would be to add tuning bands on the positive side and lower your can pressure.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

95kg. 210lbs.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

db3266 said:


> 95kg. 210lbs.


Looking at Fox' site it appears the max number of tuning bands that can be put in your 2.5" stroke shock is 3. You're at 2 already. If you add one more band and lower your main can pressure it will allow the shock to move a bit more freely, and possibly help with the compression issues. But I bet it will sag too much. It's your only option outside of sending the shock off for a special tune. Are you certain the compression ratio and base air pressure set in the Shockwiz is correct? I'd suggest, if you haven't done so already, go through the calibration wizard another time or two, making certain that when it tells you to air the shock up to operating pressure that you add maybe 50psi at a time and cycle the shock 10-15 times between adding more pressure. Do the calibration like that several times from scratch to confirm the compression ratio is correct. The Shockwiz seems to tell us all that our HSC/LSC is too firm and needs to be softened up. That why I went with a lower viscosity oil in my rear shock.


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## Granda (May 6, 2018)

Hi guys,

Tech issue I would appreciate some help with. I recently purchased a Wiz with the updated software/firmware which works fine with my fork but didnt with my shock. Hired another out which worked perfectly with shock but uses previous generation software. The shock in question is a RockShox Deluxe RT3 which does not appear on the Wiz website as being incompatible. Anybody any ideas? The shop is suggesting completing a warranty claim however this might take months.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

IRBent said:


> Looking at Fox' site it appears the max number of tuning bands that can be put in your 2.5" stroke shock is 3. You're at 2 already. If you add one more band and lower your main can pressure it will allow the shock to move a bit more freely, and possibly help with the compression issues. But I bet it will sag too much. It's your only option outside of sending the shock off for a special tune. Are you certain the compression ratio and base air pressure set in the Shockwiz is correct? I'd suggest, if you haven't done so already, go through the calibration wizard another time or two, making certain that when it tells you to air the shock up to operating pressure that you add maybe 50psi at a time and cycle the shock 10-15 times between adding more pressure. Do the calibration like that several times from scratch to confirm the compression ratio is correct. The Shockwiz seems to tell us all that our HSC/LSC is too firm and needs to be softened up. That why I went with a lower viscosity oil in my rear shock.


Thanks for the info. I did setup the site pressure as you have suggested. I did do it a couple of times.

I can try another band.
Why would it sag too much? Surely I should set the air pressure to set the correct sag just like I normally would do?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

db3266 said:


> Thanks for the info. I did setup the site pressure as you have suggested. I did do it a couple of times.
> 
> I can try another band.
> Why would it sag too much? Surely I should set the air pressure to set the correct sag just like I normally would do?


Let me rephrase the "sag too much" comment for better understanding. Your current sag is at 32% and per your Shockwiz screenshots you had no deep compression events. With only 4 jumps I'd assume you are simply not using all of the shock's travel. So if you set your sag at 32% now you will still use even less of your travel due to the extra tuning band. The only way to get more travel used would be to ride at more sag than 32%.

One thing I do with the Shockwiz is, ignore it. That is, I ignore what it says on the majority of my trails and set my rear shock up to handle the ugliest of the ugly. So I might bomb down the ugly stuff and get a great score with everything in the green. But if I leave the wiz to capture data for the rest of my ride through the smooth trails, it ends up telling me I need to soften everything. So you may want to pay attention to the Shockwiz results as you go. Quality results for "Balanced" on a smooth trail system will not be quality results for "Balanced" on the ugliest trails you ride. It's up to you to decide what's the most important to you. I can live with scores in the 80s on the smooth trails if the ugly rocky rooted sections are butter smooth and the scores are in the 90s. Suspension tuning is a compromise. Not too often will you have the best of the best under all conditions.


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## db3266 (Nov 7, 2014)

Thanks.
I do use just about all the travel with the current setup, but, as you say, only on the gnarliest trails.
I may leave it as it is until I go somewhere challenging.
The results I posted above are from my last ride which is more of a smooth single track, certainly no drop offs or anything that would induce deep compression events.

But. When in Wales, I did get extremely similar results.
Will ride more and see how it goes over time.


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## Granda (May 6, 2018)

Hi guys,

Before sending the unit back to the shop, I tried the long coupling which works! Anyone any idea why the short coupling doesn't provide readings from the shock to the Wiz?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Granda said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Before sending the unit back to the shop, I tried the long coupling which works! Anyone any idea why the short coupling doesn't provide readings from the shock to the Wiz?


If the fittings leak the pressure wouldn't get to the Shockwiz correctly. Also if the shorter hose had something blocking the air from getting through. Try blowing through the hose and holding a finger over the other end and see if it flows air.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

db3266 said:


> View attachment 1196904
> View attachment 1196905
> View attachment 1196906
> View attachment 1196907
> ...


I get basically identical results with my Yeti 5.5 with an X2 tuned by Avalanche. with 3 shock bands.

I spoke to Craig at Avy and he basically told that due to the suspension curve on the Yeti that he already has the compression circuit essentially as soft as it will go. I just about have both HSC & LSC backed all of the way out. My riding is often (maybe half the time) consists of very chunky terrain and will often indicate 30+ jumps on the rear (way more in the front) with 2-4 substantial drops of 2.5' - 5'. I also would add that I think it felt a bit better with the HSC a bit slower even with Shockwiz a bit unhappy, but not totally sure. Maybe my shock is just right when seated, but when I stand the shock is not loaded nearly as hard and therefore SW wants me to soften it up?

Every other shock setting indicated perfect, on every ride I do. All trails and conditions. even if I do a trail ride that I don't use all travel on?

Someone else had mentioned running a lighter weight oil. How did that work out? details please.


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## Granda (May 6, 2018)

IRBent said:


> If the fittings leak the pressure wouldn't get to the Shockwiz correctly. Also if the shorter hose had something blocking the air from getting through. Try blowing through the hose and holding a finger over the other end and see if it flows air.


Thanks mate


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

amtiskaw said:


> Travel on the shock shaft is 51mm, which translates to 140mm at the wheel. Ratio shows as 1.5 at 280 psi.


140/ 51 = 2.75 Shock Ratio

Basically the rear wheel moves 2.75x as far as the shock moves.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

IRBent said:


> The Shockwiz seems to tell us all that our HSC/LSC is too firm and needs to be softened up. That why I went with a lower viscosity oil in my rear shock.


Please tell me all the info about this lower shock oil viscosity. Like what happened. with your settings that were reading to harsh, and what happened to your settings that were already perfect and didn't need to be changed.

Also can shock oil be changed with basic hand tools?

Thanks.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Suns_PSD said:


> 140/ 51 = 2.75 Shock Ratio
> 
> Basically the rear wheel moves 2.75x as far as the shock moves.


That's not the ratio it is measuring. It's measuring the compression of the air inside the chamber.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Suns_PSD said:


> Please tell me all the info about this lower shock oil viscosity. Like what happened. with your settings that were reading to harsh, and what happened to your settings that were already perfect and didn't need to be changed.
> 
> Also can shock oil be changed with basic hand tools?
> 
> Thanks.


Suns_PSD, I lowered my shock oil in a 2 step process, going a bit lighter each time. I'm currently running Red Line Like Water shock oil which is as light as they come. My theory was, a lighter weight/thinner oil would be able to move through the shim stack easier than a thicker oil. Imagine pushing water through a syringe vs honey. My 1st oil change went from stock to Red Line 2.5 Extra Light. While it did help some per my Shockwiz, it wasn't enough. So I went on down to the lightest made and it helped even more. 
As for how to go about changing your oil, I can't support you unless you have a DVO Topaz. Fox is notorious for building complex but really good shocks in their high end offerings. They also make shocks that require special tools, some of which not even my LBS mechanic who is Fox certified happen to own. Rockshox is a bit easier so I've heard. I' suggest going to the manufacturer's site of your particular shock and download the manual to rebuild it. It should walk you through the process but I bet it will be complicated. Typically people have their shim stacks adjusted by a qualified suspension mechanic to solve the problems that cause low oil flow which result in HSC/LSC, or even HSR issues. Some shocks like the Fox X2 have knobs and adjustments to change and the above which should make things easier to tune. But I'm sure I've seen posts here by Fox X2 owners who have said they have both their HSC and LSC opened wide open and the Shockwiz is still asking for them to soften both up. At that point it becomes a shim stack adjustment issue or possibly a lighter oil. I opted for the lighter oil knowing that I don't ride hard enough to ruin the oil quickly, and because I wanted to explore that option before doing a shim stack adjustment.


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

Hey Shockwiz users!

I just got one. I'd like to post some results soon, but real quick question first, I lost some air pressure on my first ride because I didn't have the hose threaded on all the way, realized this halfway in. Can i just add air and then mark baseline pressure again or do I have to recalibrate?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Yesterday I went to test out my Topaz after making a minor adjustment to the main can and bladder pressure. I bombed through my test section feeling positive I had beat my best Strava time. Once I was back to the truck and uploaded my GPS data to Strava, I found out Strava didn't agree with me riding the section. It showed me riding parallel to the trail, which is impossible. In the end, I only have a gut feeling that I did well and a decent Shockwiz score.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

monts said:


> Hey Shockwiz users!
> 
> I just got one. I'd like to post some results soon, but real quick question first, I lost some air pressure on my first ride because I didn't have the hose threaded on all the way, realized this halfway in. Can i just add air and then mark baseline pressure again or do I have to recalibrate?


I suggest running the calibration wizard another time or two and confirming your compression ratio is good. If you get a couple repeat compression ratios, then you'll be good to ride. I'm sure you were leaking pressure during your initial calibration so I wouldn't trust anything it says. Start fresh.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

Okay, thanks, it wasn't that hard to calibrate so no big deal. Pretty impressed overall as I had it up and running in a few minutes.


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## gontxo_nos (Jun 12, 2013)

Between what values the compression ratio is good? .


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

gontxo_nos said:


> Between what values the compression ratio is good? .


That's partly what Shockwiz is for is to help you set that. You change that ratio by adding or subtracting tokens, bands, fluid, etc. from the air chamber.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

gontxo_nos said:


> Between what values the compression ratio is good? .


The compression ratio is specific to your shock make, model, size, etc. My DVO Topaz (size 200mm x 57mm) has a compression ratio of 2.8 with 1 tuning band in the positive chamber, 2.9 with 2 tuning bands, and 3.0 with 3 tuning bands.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## Lowball (Sep 1, 2006)

Really curious to see if the wiz would make any changes to my PUSH factory tune'd settings. Has anyone used the wiz with an 11/6 or ACS-3 setup?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Lowball said:


> Really curious to see if the wiz would make any changes to my PUSH factory tune'd settings. Has anyone used the wiz with an 11/6 or ACS-3 setup?


The Shockwiz only works on air forks and air shocks, no coils.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> The Shockwiz only works on air forks and air shocks, no coils.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


I'm getting an ACS-3 soon and I am going to try it. 99% chance I get nonsense numbers but since the ACS-3 system runs an air bump the engineer in me wants to see what the output is.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tuckerjt07 said:


> I'm getting an ACS-3 soon and I am going to try it. 99% chance I get nonsense numbers but since the ACS-3 system runs an air bump the engineer in me wants to see what the output is.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Do tell the outcome.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> Do tell the outcome.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


If the compression ratio isn't too high it makes sense from a purely academic sense that one might get meaningful data. At that point the bump should be acting as an air spring in minature. However, in the real world I'm not expecting anything but nonsensical output.

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## Lowball (Sep 1, 2006)

yeah forgot about that air deal! LOL thanks guys! please post up anything from the ACS-3 test though. LB


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

Lowball said:


> yeah forgot about that air deal! LOL thanks guys! please post up anything from the ACS-3 test though. LB


Will do, may be a bit. Need to let the wallet recover from the ElevenSix first.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

The push kit uses the air in the bottom out bumper and that is what you would be hooking to. Basically it would see nothing until you top out and then wouldn't have a clue what was really happening. If you could use the air in the main chamber it could possibly work, but then you are counting on the lower seals to be air tight. I give you a .0000001% chance of getting usable data.

edit
top to bottom out


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

alexbn921 said:


> The push kit uses the air in the top out bumper and that is what you would be hooking to. Basically it would see nothing until you top and then wouldn't have a clue what was really happening. If you could use the air in the main chamber it could possibly work, but then you are counting on the lower seals to be air tight. I give you a .0000001% chance of getting usable data.


No, it uses it in the bottom out bumper.

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## wheelzqc (Aug 31, 2016)

Any ideas ? I mount it to the front and it's good. The rear shock I can't get it to read. Note : I'm probably missin something obvious here ...


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

wheelzqc said:


> Any ideas ? I mount it to the front and it's good. The rear shock I can't get it to read.  Note : I'm probably missin something obvious here ...
> View attachment 1197209


What shock did you mount it to and why isn't it showing any pressure in the shock? If you calibrated the Shockwiz on the shock to get the compression ratio, did it show pressure during that process?

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## wheelzqc (Aug 31, 2016)

No it didn't show any pressure and I tried many times with the 4 different hose that came with the rental. I'm mounting it to a FOX Float Elite DPS from a BMC Fourstroke. I'd like to say it should work since my mechanic had the same bike and used the Wiz.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

It sounds like one of the Schrader valves isn't opening, either the shock or the Shockwiz. Are you connecting the shock to the same side of the Shockwiz that worked on the fork? If so, can you add remove air to the shock by connecting a pump to the shock?


wheelzqc said:


> No it didn't show any pressure and I tried many times with the 4 different hose that came with the rental. I'm mounting it to a FOX Float Elite DPS from a BMC Fourstroke. I'd like to say it should work since my mechanic had the same bike and used the Wiz.


Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## jbhkhc (Jan 14, 2018)

If it didn't register, how did you get the riding suggestions/confidence score of 49%?

Looks like it's been ran with the fork then switched to the shock without clicking 'start a new session' and recalibrating?


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## wheelzqc (Aug 31, 2016)

IRBent - I've thoght about that as well.... but I'm sure i tried both valves many times and the 4 hoses that's in the box. I still think it coulld be that because I can't remove air if I press the valve (or add air). On the other side, all is well for the front.

@jbhkhc - You're right I initially switched front to back and had that error. After I'm pretty sure I tried start new session at least 15 times . Calibrating I always get the error that there was not pressure difference between extended and pushed.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

wheelzqc said:


> IRBent - I've thoght about that as well.... but I'm sure i tried both valves many times and the 4 hoses that's in the box. I still think it coulld be that because I can't remove air if I press the valve (or add air). On the other side, all is well for the front.
> 
> @jbhkhc - You're right I initially switched front to back and had that error. After I'm pretty sure I tried start new session at least 15 times . Calibrating I always get the error that there was not pressure difference between extended and pushed.


Do this. Remove the Shockwiz and the hose from the bike. Connect the hose you intend on using to the shock by itself. If the hose connects properly, all of the air should exit out the open end of the hose provided air is in the shock. That would confirm the hose is good. Connect your shock pump to the side of the Shockwiz that you plan to use the pump on. Pump some pressure into the pump hose and Shockwiz. Connect one of the unused hoses to the other side of the Shockwiz and all of the pressure should escape. That would prove air pressure is moving through the Shockwiz. If that works, remove the extra hose from the Shockwiz and connect the Shockwiz to the hose attached to the shock. Try to run the calibration wizard and see what happens. Once you get to the part where the wizard asks you to pump the shock up, make sure it takes numerous pump strokes to get up to @50psi. If it doesn't, odds are the air isn't going into the shock and only pressuring the shock pump hose. If air does go into the shock, cycle the shock numerous time slowly to equalize the shock. Continue adding 40-50psi increments to the shock while cycling each time.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## wheelzqc (Aug 31, 2016)

Thanks for the steps, I'll try that tonight. Just to note; the shockwiz and hose worked fine for the front fork. My shock pump also works with my rear shock.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

wheelzqc said:


> Thanks for the steps, I'll try that tonight. Just to note; the shockwiz and hose worked fine for the front fork. My shock pump also works with my rear shock.


There's a chance for whatever reason that the hose is not depressing the Schrader valve on the shock, thus not allowing the shock pressure into the Shockwiz. So if you connect the hose to nothing but the shock first and all or the air escapes out the hose, your problem may be solved. If it doesn't, then I'd try replacing the Schrader valve.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## torepuma (Feb 20, 2012)

My problem is that the ShockWiz does not register anything.

I have completed the calibration and I get no results after riding










After a three hour ride yestarday, the ShockWiz still says start riding and has no results.

I have a DPX2 shock. The same ShockWiz has been used by a friend with a X2 shock.

What can be the problem?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Bluetooth definitely still on? Battery OK? What battery voltage is it showing?


torepuma said:


> My problem is that the ShockWiz does not register anything.
> 
> I have completed the calibration and I get no results after riding
> 
> ...


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

torepuma said:


> My problem is that the ShockWiz does not register anything.
> 
> I have completed the calibration and I get no results after riding
> 
> ...


The last few posts before yours give troubleshooting advice for the same problem. If you ran through the calibration wizard multiple times and clicked "Start New Session" the Shockwiz should have gathered data. One thing mine does that wasn't mentioned above, I have to kill the Shockwiz software, open it again and tell it to connect to the Shockwiz.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## torepuma (Feb 20, 2012)

lucifuge said:


> Bluetooth definitely still on? Battery OK? What battery voltage is it showing?


Yes, the Bluetooth was on. I dont remember the battery voltage, I will check that and revert.

I am thinking that it can be a hose problem. With both the short and the long hose no air came out of the ShockWiz when i pressed the valve fully down. I had to depress the valve just a little to let the air out when I did the set up. Am I on to something?

I did press start a new ride several times yesterday, but nothing happened.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

torepuma said:


> Yes, the Bluetooth was on. I dont remember the battery voltage, I will check that and revert.
> 
> I am thinking that it can be a hose problem. With both the short and the long hose no air came out of the ShockWiz when i pressed the valve fully down. I had to depress the valve just a little to let the air out when I did the set up. Am I on to something?
> 
> I did press start a new ride several times yesterday, but nothing happened.


There's a post above that talks you through checking for hose, Schrader valve and air flow.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## torepuma (Feb 20, 2012)

IRBent said:


> There's a post above that talks you through checking for hose, Schrader valve and air flow.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


Thanks, I will check that before I test it on my fork.


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

torepuma said:


> Thanks, I will check that before I test it on my fork.


Hey I'm using shockwiz on the DPX2, mine calibrated at 3.0 compression ratio. (206 psi), My Fox code says I have 0.6 spacer installed (not exactly sure what 0.6 means but I assume it's 1 spacer). I have some results so after you get it up and running I'd be interested to compare. I'm sure you just have to play around with your BT connection or check air flow. i did notice I had to tighten mine on there pretty good (I lost some air on first ride), make sure it's threaded on there good.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

monts said:


> Hey I'm using shockwiz on the DPX2, mine calibrated at 3.0 compression ratio. (206 psi), My Fox code says I have 0.6 spacer installed (not exactly sure what 0.6 means but I assume it's 1 spacer). I have some results so after you get it up and running I'd be interested to compare. I'm sure you just have to play around with your BT connection or check air flow. i did notice I had to tighten mine on there pretty good (I lost some air on first ride), make sure it's threaded on there good.


I hate it but I've had to use pliers to snug my hoses up enough to ensure no leaks. I had something odd happen yesterday too that's indicative of an air leak. My digital pump historically has read 2-3psi less than the Shockwiz pressure. Yesterday they were both spot on, reading the same pressures. 30 minutes later the Shockwiz was reading 3psi lower, as if it had leaked air out. I keep record of my pressure, especially while tuning, and once I'm happy with the tune I always pump to that same pressure. So if my Shockwiz says I've lost more pressure since yesterday, that means I've got a connection problem or need to rebuild my shock.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

IRBent said:


> I hate it but I've had to use pliers to snug my hoses up enough to ensure no leaks. I had something odd happen yesterday too that's indicative of an air leak. My digital pump historically has read 2-3psi less than the Shockwiz pressure. Yesterday they were both spot on, reading the same pressures. 30 minutes later the Shockwiz was reading 3psi lower, as if it had leaked air out. I keep record of my pressure, especially while tuning, and once I'm happy with the tune I always pump to that same pressure. So if my Shockwiz says I've lost more pressure since yesterday, that means I've got a connection problem or need to rebuild my shock.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


yeah my PSI stayed very exact after I tightened it on, I didn't wanna break out the pliers, but let's just say my fingers are little sore! haha


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## torepuma (Feb 20, 2012)

monts said:


> Hey I'm using shockwiz on the DPX2, mine calibrated at 3.0 compression ratio. (206 psi), My Fox code says I have 0.6 spacer installed (not exactly sure what 0.6 means but I assume it's 1 spacer). I have some results so after you get it up and running I'd be interested to compare. I'm sure you just have to play around with your BT connection or check air flow. i did notice I had to tighten mine on there pretty good (I lost some air on first ride), make sure it's threaded on there good.


Thanks, it turned out that the hose was not tight enough. I did a ride yesterday and GOT the results.

I will recalibrate and do another test since the first calibration was done when the hose was not tight enough.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Lowball said:


> Really curious to see if the wiz would make any changes to my PUSH factory tune'd settings. Has anyone used the wiz with an 11/6 or ACS-3 setup?


SMB FLow works with both coil and air.

Get the SMB Flow and have more fun and flow on your ride!

Note that the list price (249 GBP)includes tax, so if you are in the US, you get to take about 15% off that


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

My Shockwiz has been exhibiting strangeness the last few rides. I can inflate my shock and per the Shockwiz lose 3 psi in 30 minutes. But days later the pressure still holds true. My shock has less than 80 hours on it and my sag seems to be holding true despite the supposed pressure loss. The temp the Shockwiz is reading is impossible. Ambient temps in the 80's yet the Shockwiz register maybe 180F when the bike hasn't been ridden.


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## tuckerjt07 (Nov 24, 2016)

IRBent said:


> My Shockwiz has been exhibiting strangeness the last few rides. I can inflate my shock and per the Shockwiz lose 3 psi in 30 minutes. But days later the pressure still holds true. My shock has less than 80 hours on it and my sag seems to be holding true despite the supposed pressure loss. The temp the Shockwiz is reading is impossible. Ambient temps in the 80's yet the Shockwiz register maybe 180F when the bike hasn't been ridden.


Same for me

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

When you pump your shock up from zero you create heat compressing the air. This could be the problem of a small 30 minute drop in psi.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> When you pump your shock up from zero you create heat compressing the air. This could be the problem of a small 30 minute drop in psi.


Rarely do I pump from zero unless I'm calibrating my Shockwiz. Usually it's only pumping it up from the pressure lost due to filling the hose when connecting the pump. I've been known to thread my pump on, pump it up to the pressure the shock is supposed to have in it, then scree in the engagement barrel to depress the shock's Schrader.

I've seen odd crap with my digital pump pressure too of late. Typically my pump reads within 2psi of the Shockwiz where the pump has always been lower than the Shockwiz. But at least twice lately my pump has read as much as 5psi higher than the Shockwiz. This makes me think the Shockwiz pressure sensor is acting stupid, especially since my static sag seems to be holding true.

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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

*Shockwiz - Things Learned*

I've owned a Shockwiz for a year or so now and don't use it all of the time. Last year I hooked it up to my rear shock long enough to learn how to use it and to maximize my settings. Once I was happy I took it off and put it away. Recently a buddy asked me if he could use my Shockwiz. I wanted to be able to help support him and answer questions I was sure that he'll have. I also knew the software had changed and decided to tweak my rear shock tune so I could learn the new software before handing it off to him. For a week or so I battled with the Shockwiz, making small adjustments. But the results I kept getting just seemed very erratic. So this weekend I tore my rear linkage down to inspect, clean and grease everything. I found one of my upper linkage bearings had seized. I fixed everything and went back out yesterday. Using the same pressures I had bracketed over the past few weeks, riding the same trails, I finally got results like I would have expected. I was beginning to think my Shockwiz was the problem. Remember to do your maintenance or your ride won't be what it should be.


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

Anyone with an Avalanche open bath fork here using shockwiz?

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## monts (May 24, 2011)

Hey all, 

Do I have to be connected to shockwiz to access my profiles? I saved some and thought I could access them without being connected but there is nothing there.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

monts said:


> Hey all,
> 
> Do I have to be connected to shockwiz to access my profiles? I saved some and thought I could access them without being connected but there is nothing there.


nope mine show up.


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

then i guess mine aren't saving? So i just tried again and made a test profile and it saved, restarted phone and it's still there... but all my other ones from last couple of weeks are gone? any ideas?


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## tkm16 (Apr 27, 2009)

Once your confidence is 100% is it safe to say the suggestions won’t change? I did a ride the other week, checked half way through the ride and had a confidence of 100% although I had the biggest hits coming towards the end of the ride, would the suggestions still change even though the score was 100%? Or is it a case of achieving 100% then adjust.. and repeat?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tkm16 said:


> Once your confidence is 100% is it safe to say the suggestions won't change? I did a ride the other week, checked half way through the ride and had a confidence of 100% although I had the biggest hits coming towards the end of the ride, would the suggestions still change even though the score was 100%? Or is it a case of achieving 100% then adjust.. and repeat?


Each ride varies even on the very same trails. I keep track of my results throughout my ride by making screenshots, then at 100% confidence I only make adjustments based on the majority that say make the same adjustment.

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## tkm16 (Apr 27, 2009)

IRBent said:


> Each ride varies even on the very same trails. I keep track of my results throughout my ride by making screenshots, then at 100% confidence I only make adjustments based on the majority that say make the same adjustment.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


Ah ok I'll try that. I don't know why they based it on a confidence level instead of acting in the data collected throughout the whole session. It was telling me to adjust my HSC right down but yet I had the biggest jumps/drops still to do.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tkm16 said:


> Ah ok I'll try that. I don't know why they based it on a confidence level instead of acting in the data collected throughout the whole session. It was telling me to adjust my HSC right down but yet I had the biggest jumps/drops still to do.


That's one of issues we have to learn to work through. I look at my results along the way, screenshot them, and take into consideration what I've ridden and what's yet to come. For instance, you've got a long fire road to pedal up to get to the wicked rough downhill. But on your way to the top that's a few downhill sections that are fast, rough and have a few jumps. Theoretically you could see a confidence of 100% and the Wiz give you suggestions. Acting on them before you've ridden everything could be premature. I tend to key in on getting quality results after I've hit the ugliest stuff I'll encounter. So what if my score falls off after I'm riding smooth trails back to the truck? The most of us want our suspension do perform its best over the gnarliest of gnarly. If you're tuning to get high scores on the smooth stuff, you're surely to get bad results suspension wise and score wise on the gnarly trails. The Wiz wants you to use all of your travel in order to get high scores. You can't use it all on smooth trails and not beat yourself senseless over the rough stuff. On the other hand, if you use most of your travel in the rough, you're surely not going to use it all on the smooth trails. So, tune to what pleases you on your ride.

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

The perfect tune is dependant on the trail and your riding. You will get different results riding the same trail back to back. This is because you didn't ride the trail exactly the same each time.
The whole idea is to bracket your rides. Once your tune is close to perfect for your style and terrain it shouldn't vary more than 1 click in any direction. Don't be afraid to play around with all the various tuning options on your shock. Decrease rebound just for the hell of it and see what the Wiz tells you.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

Mine has been acting weird for a bit. It stopped actually recording data. Would always say start a new session then never record.

I followed the steps to reset it (insert batter backward for 3-10s) per the quarg website. Now it won't even turn on. 

Naturally 2 months past the 1yr warranty. I'll contact quarg but I'm guessing I have a $400 paper weight


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Jukas said:


> Mine has been acting weird for a bit. It stopped actually recording data. Would always say start a new session then never record.
> 
> I followed the steps to reset it (insert batter backward for 3-10s) per the quarg website. Now it won't even turn on.
> 
> Naturally 2 months past the 1yr warranty. I'll contact quarg but I'm guessing I have a $400 paper weight


And you're darn certain the battery is good?

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Hi All. I have owned a shockwiz now for 2 weeks and clocked over 130km’s. I have tuned the rear float x Evol as best as I can, as now I am I onto the 170mm Lyrik. 

I am confident I have done that calibration process correctly, and have logged over 50kms of tech trails on the forks. 

I’ve gone from 106psi and x2 tokens to 80psi and x3 tokens. It is still asking me to reduce air and add more tokens. 

Should I add a further x1 token and reduce air, or just reduce air by 5% and see how it goes? I am very happy with th changes it has suggested so far, made a big difference. However going to x4 tokens and less psi makes me a little suspicious!

Any advice appreciated. I’ve read the entire thread and utilised all the advice given. Same trail, similar pace/aggression etc. Confident I am running it all as I should. 

Cheers. Dave.


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## RocketMagnet (May 22, 2008)

IMO the 100% Shock Tuning Score is a guide not a perfect setup and unlikely to be everyone's ideal. For me having the front fork at 100% significantly harmed my DH times.. especially on courses with fast railed turns and high g berms as it sets the fork too low a pressure and it hence doesn't offer enough support even with spacers its not enough support to help you spit out of the railed turns. So I'd follow it's advice then your free to tune away and try different things as it will indicate packing and you have a known baseline etc... this is the real use of the tool IMO hence why I don't think using it for a few days is enough....

For those with non recording rides for me it was a poor connection to the shock, was working loose a bit and just measuring the pressure trapped in the line and not the shock.. easy to check mid ride to see it its responding to pressure changes...


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Thanks RocketMagnet. I aim to tune the bike to my local trails (steep, techy, rooty and rutted) then spend time at local trail centres which predominantly are fast, undulating and jumpy. I just wanted to know if I should follow it’s advice for my local trails, and add a further fourth token, or just remove air. I will go with your advice thanks. 

I have to purchase the last 4th token as the fork only came with x3!?

My legs are starting to ache too, so looking to maximise shockwiz time before the local
trails start to overgrow with the usual brambles and ferns. I’ve probably only got a few weeks left, and these trails are perfect as a general representation of where I ride. (It’s all on my doorstep!)

Just to add I am 225lbs without riding gear and camelbak etc.


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## Jesse Hill (Dec 29, 2006)

Check to see if yours is having issues with the battery position. Mine was just doing something kind of similar and it had to do with the battery placement. If I slid the battery all the way to the stops then the shockwiz would turn off, so it seemed to be doing this during rides. I got it warranties and new one has been working fine.


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Quick question please - if it’s asking me to add a token AND remove air, do I do both, or keep air the same psi and add a token and try again? If so, how much air do I remove if adding another token? 5psi? Cheers.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Medrep said:


> Quick question please - if it's asking me to add a token AND remove air, do I do both, or keep air the same psi and add a token and try again? If so, how much air do I remove if adding another token? 5psi? Cheers.


The way I recall it, the manual suggests that you perform the changes from top to bottom. If add air is the first thing, do that first. But too, I seem to recall it also said you can do the first and second suggestions at the same time. So if add a token is second, then yes, do both together. I hope that answers your question.

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Thank you. I’ll add a token and just remove 5psi. I am shocked (excuse the pun) how much more cushioned the forks feel and also not diving or harsh under compression/drops etc. Hence my willingness to add a further token out of curiosity. 

Cheers


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Medrep said:


> Thank you. I'll add a token and just remove 5psi. I am shocked (excuse the pun) how much more cushioned the forks feel and also not diving or harsh under compression/drops etc. Hence my willingness to add a further token out of curiosity.
> 
> Cheers


Just out of curiosity, which fork and have you done any mods other than tokens?

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

It’s a 2016 Lyrik 170mm RCT3. Was at 106psi and x2 tokens. No mods and had just been full serviced, front and rear. Now it’s at 80psi and x3 tokens. Reduce psi and add token is in Amber. 

I’ve always ran circa 100-110psi. Tried 1/2 and 3 tokens in the past but did not reduce psi enough. I’ve struggled to make the rear soft enough (going by Yeti’s recommend 18/19mm sag) and it sat very upright. This caused me to over compensate with stiffer forks. The whole bike felt great on fast smooth trails but sketchy on the rooty rutted stuff. Now I’ve ignored Yeti guidelines the rear feels more planted and so far so do the forks.

Even if I stopped now I would be happy. 

I intend on putting the wiz back on the rear once the forks are as good as I can get, then I’ll start playing with a trail centre optimised tune.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Medrep said:


> It's a 2016 Lyrik 170mm RCT3. Was at 106psi and x2 tokens. No mods and had just been full serviced, front and rear. Now it's at 80psi and x3 tokens. Reduce psi and add token is in Amber.
> 
> I've always ran circa 100-110psi. Tried 1/2 and 3 tokens in the past but did not reduce psi enough. I've struggled to make the rear soft enough (going by Yeti's recommend 18/19mm sag) and it sat very upright. This caused me to over compensate with stiffer forks. The whole bike felt great on fast smooth trails but sketchy on the rooty rutted stuff. Now I've ignored Yeti guidelines the rear feels more planted and so far so do the forks.
> 
> ...


If the forks don't come around the way you'd like, I've found adding a Vorsprung Luftkappe to my fork allows me to run higher pressures, @ 10% more, and still have a super subtle top end without any harsh bottoming issues. Pretty inexpensive mod that most can do at home too.

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

I’ve read about this on the thread and not heard of it before. Last night searching for another token I can see one available in the UK for approx £65 iirc. 

Will the wiz still work with this mod?

Thanks again.


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Just reading about it now and supplier states @170mm it does not
clear? ??



Medrep said:


> I've read about this on the thread and not heard of it before. Last night searching for another token I can see one available in the UK for approx £65 iirc.
> 
> Will the wiz still work with this mod?
> 
> Thanks again.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Medrep said:


> I've read about this on the thread and not heard of it before. Last night searching for another token I can see one available in the UK for approx £65 iirc.
> 
> Will the wiz still work with this mod?
> 
> Thanks again.


Indeed. The Luftkappe replaces the stock piston and adds more negative volume while at the same time takes up the space of 1-2 tokens. Go to the manufacturer's website and read all about it, especially the notes at the bottom.

https://vorsprungsuspension.com/pro...pgrade-air-piston-kit-for-rockshox-pike-lyrik

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

I’ll call supplier to check. Maybe I’m reading it incorrectly. 

Thanks again!


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

I’ve checked with supplier and 170mm is fine. 

I’ve installed the 4th token now and will ride soon to see what it makes of it and how it rides. Interestingly, the CR for 2 was 3.1, CR for 3 was 3.4, and now the CR for 4 is 4.2! I tested it twice and was reasonably consistent reading 4.1. I took the higher reading. 

I would have thought the increase in CR would have been more consistent with the others?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Medrep said:


> I've checked with supplier and 170mm is fine.
> 
> I've installed the 4th token now and will ride soon to see what it makes of it and how it rides. Interestingly, the CR for 2 was 3.1, CR for 3 was 3.4, and now the CR for 4 is 4.2! I tested it twice and was reasonably consistent reading 4.1. I took the higher reading.
> 
> I would have thought the increase in CR would have been more consistent with the others?


While I have not used my Shockwiz on my Pike, I do find a linear CR change with each tuning band. 1 band = CR of 2.7, 2 bands = CR 2.8,and 3 bands equals CR 2.9.

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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

I've had one of these since April and have been working on perfecting the tune on my rear shock (DB Inline on a Tallboy LT). Right off the bat it had me add a ton of air, which made a huge positive difference. Since then I have been trying to get it to 100% with frustrating results.

A couple days ago I rode a trail system with a pretty wide variety of terrain - climbs, descents, chunky tech and was pleased to see a score of 96%, the best I've ever had, with this suggestion:








Yesterday I changed my HSC by only 1/8 of a turn and rode about twice as far on a trail system nearby, that I would say is very comparable to the first. I wound up with a score of 80 with these results:








I made some mistakes early on with trying to change everything at once, but I haven't done that in the last few sessions and am still seeing results all over the map. At least air pressure and spring rate are usually listed as ok, and I don't plan to touch either of those.

I typically run it for a whole ride, check at the end, and adjust before the next ride. Is this what's throwing me off? Should I be checking it frequently throughout the ride and adjusting along the way?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Hillridge said:


> I've had one of these since April and have been working on perfecting the tune on my rear shock (DB Inline on a Tallboy LT). Right off the bat it had me add a ton of air, which made a huge positive difference. Since then I have been trying to get it to 100% with frustrating results.
> 
> A couple days ago I rode a trail system with a pretty wide variety of terrain - climbs, descents, chunky tech and was pleased to see a score of 96%, the best I've ever had, with this suggestion:
> View attachment 1203055
> ...


I like checking results as I go, trail to trail, easy to more difficult. But my tune is only based on the results on the worst trails I encounter. Like your previous ride where you rode the ugly stuff and netted a 96. Knowing how the Shockwiz pretty much tells EVERYBODY their HSC needs to be soften, I would have ignored that one time suggestion and rode more times without making any adjustments at all. The only thing I'd suggest is hone back in to where you were on the previous ride, check the pressure in the Shockwiz app to confirm you haven't lost air, and ride again and again with the same settings. Don't try to adjust based on every ride especially when you're as close as you were. The elusive 100 score can be had, but it's not repeatable enough to try. Oh, if you open the Wiz app before you ride and see you pressure is off from the previous ride especially if low a few psi, that's an indicator you're leaking air somewhere. It will be even harder to hone in on your settings with a leak.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

Thanks for the advice. Pressure has been pretty solid, definitely within a psi or two of the initial set point ride to ride with no need to add more. I'm going to go write down the current settings on my shock just to see how they compare with what I started with, and so I have something to go back to if I mess it up tweaking.

It will be interesting to try this on my wife's bike that has a shock on which really only pressure and rebound is adjustable. The DB Inline has easy adjustments for all 6 suggestions.

Is it common to get a really high score on chunky stuff, then go ride a fire road and get a lot of suggested changes based on the more mellow ride?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Hillridge said:


> Thanks for the advice.
> 
> Is it common to get a really high score on chunky stuff, then go ride a fire road and get a lot of suggested changes based on the more mellow ride?


Oh, most definitely on the results varying from ugly trails to smoother trails. That's why I tune to achieve high scores after the ugliest trails I ride. The way I see it the Shockwiz wants you to use most of your travel especially if tuning in a playful mode. So the ugliest trails do just that, use your travel and you get a decent score maybe in the 90's. You fine tune only after several rides that give you similar results. Then you might tighten your score into the upper 90's or even nail that 100. But once you ride that same tune on a smoother trail it will be suggesting that you make everything softer, take air out, etc. I set up a spreadsheet and keep track of everything. Once I get close I do repeat rides without adjustments. Only if I see results repeating that all suggest the same thing will I consider changing the setup. But too, I take into consideration how I felt about the ride, how I felt physically, temperature and trail conditions. I also try to relate those scores to Strava times especially if I see where a certain change produced some of my fastest rides and my notes say the ride felt great.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

Watching Strava is a good idea. After the ride that netted me a 96%, I had PR'd every single trail I rode there, and I wasn't even pushing it. I'm heading out today without changing anything and will try to check results after the chunky downhill trails to see what it suggests. Things are definitely way better than when I started tuning.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Hillridge it's common for it to vary from ride to ride, section to section. Chunk places very different demands on the shock then fire roads. As irbent said check it after the sections you want to focus on. I will also reset mine before sections I want to focus on.
Once your close to perfect like you are, you need to bracket 3 or 4 rides before you should make a change. Let's say you ride your main trail after a reset and save the results. At the end of the week check all of the rides for trends. If 2 out of 4 want more LSC and your HSR is +-. Try more LSC ignore HSR. 
Also think about what it's asking, HSC helps prevent bottom out. Where you pushing it? Or do you want a little extra cushion for a full on balls out run.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Hillridge said:


> Watching Strava is a good idea. After the ride that netted me a 96%, I had PR'd every single trail I rode there, and I wasn't even pushing it. I'm heading out today without changing anything and will try to check results after the chunky downhill trails to see what it suggests. Things are definitely way better than when I started tuning.


Here's another secret. You can change modes while looking at results and see how that affects the score.


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## ragetty (Jul 9, 2006)

are there clear definitive descriptions of what one is tuning for between the custom liveliness modes planted, poppy and active?

planted is perhaps supple damping all round, so the wheel tracks the ground?

poppy then firms up the LSC so that trail features can be used for airtime?

and active is then what? active wheel (see planted, so no) or active rider, meaning that the damping settings are all 'firmer' for the 'pro' rider?

does anyone have more information, or at least better guesses?... thx


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

So I’ve added a 4th token and dropped 5psi as the wiz told me. Took it down the same trails and it still wants more air reduced and add a further token. Which is not possible to do as I’m at maximum tokens for the fork. 

I decided to ride a trail today, which is renown for technical climbing and very technical rock garden descents, roots, berms, it’s all there basically. 

It’s the first time I’ve rideen the magic Mary on bone dry hardpack, but something just didn’t it feel right. The wiz is still telling me to drop more air and add a spacer. In the chunk it felt ok, but in the fast berms it was nervous. I am not sure if some of that was attributed to the Mary not gripping as well as my long standing DHF use. 

Does anyone have any suggestions on what the next steps should be. I am running no LSC as per suggestions, it’s green, as is rebound. EDIT: it’s LSR and HSR that are green. LSC says make softer, which it is already open. 

Dynamic sag is fluctuating between 6-15%. 

I have had dynamic sag at 24% once but only at 49% confidence. 

All other suggestions are at 79-100% confidence. Im taking screenshots immediately after every DH run

I’d like to blame the tyre, but I’m not sure where the wiz is taking me?

It’s suggestions are consistent. There is some fire road pedalling in the mix, but not much. 

Thanks again. 

Just to note, my psi increased at one point from the base 75psi to 81.6 on a long DH run, although that may have been me slightly resting on the bike. I was knackered 


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

I would also like to know this, and also is it not recommended to run a different tune from front to rear. 

Sorry to hijack slightly.


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

The more I think about this, the more I am realising the balanced tune does not suit me with the way it’s going. I’ve appreciated the suggestions so far, but now the elusive score is making the ride more squishy than I would like. 

‘If’ active means more suspension travel used, then I think I will try Firm and Active, or Firm and Planted.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

IRBent said:


> Here's another secret. You can change modes while looking at results and see how that affects the score.


I will definitely take a look at this tomorrow. I was wondering if you could do this, and I'm curious if another tune style might be closer to what I have.

I was able to get 3x 100% confidence sessions in during today's ride. The first result was identical to the last one I posted above, but the terrain was pretty tame.

Second one moved the LSR to OK and HSC to yellow from red.

Third moved the LSR back to yellow.

I noted all of my settings and they still seem reasonable, not too extreme from the factory default tune. LSR was the farthest out at 15 clicks in the + direction (default is 10, max is 18). A high LSR isn't too surprising given the pressure I need to run the shock at for my weight.

Tomorrow I'll be riding at the same place I was yesterday, so I may make some minor tweaks and see what I get.


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

I just installed a piston with a larger negative air chamber on my '17 Fox 36. It's definitely more supple on the small stuff, and seems to still do okay on the larger stuff, after adding about another 5-7 psi. I didn't adjust the LSC/HSC or rebound. Would I benefit from hooking a ShockWiz on to further dial in the compression? Or should I just go by feel?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

askibum02 said:


> I just installed a piston with a larger negative air chamber on my '17 Fox 36. It's definitely more supple on the small stuff, and seems to still do okay on the larger stuff, after adding about another 5-7 psi. I didn't adjust the LSC/HSC or rebound. Would I benefit from hooking a ShockWiz on to further dial in the compression? Or should I just go by feel?


1-3 clicks softer on the LSC should bring everything back to perfect with the new more supportive spring curve. I didn't need to touch my rebound on my 34 with the same mod. The extra mid-stroke support also let me take out 1/2 a spacer. 1 was to much so I cut it in half.

How long has it been since you tuned with the wiz? Do you still ride the same or are you better/faster now?


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

Yesterday was my first ride with the new piston, and I was following a more timid rider, so I was quite a bit slower. I plan on getting out more this week and weekend at more my normal speed. I am riding a little more confidently than when i tuned with the ShockWiz, but it hasn't been all that long, maybe a month and a half.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> 1-3 clicks softer on the LSC should bring everything back to perfect with the new more supportive spring curve. I didn't need to touch my rebound on my 34 with the same mod. The extra mid-stroke support also let me take out 1/2 a spacer. 1 was to much so I cut it in half.
> 
> How long has it been since you tuned with the wiz? Do you still ride the same or are you better/faster now?


Are you guys riding with the Luftkappe in your Fox forks? If so, do you think it's as awesome in your Fox as I do my Pike?

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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

IRBent said:


> Are you guys riding with the Luftkappe in your Fox forks? If so, do you think it's as awesome in your Fox as I do my Pike?
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


Fox has a 2018 upgraded air shaft for $40 that gives a much larger negative chamber. Also getting the 10-15cc of grease they stuff in there during assembly gives a much more supple feel.
Yes, I like it a lot better.


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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

Does anyone understand the definition of Active, in relation to Playful and Poppy. 

Just trying to work out the best custom tune to try. 

And is it frowned upon to use different tunes front to rear, eg front Firm/Firmest, rear neutral. 

Thanks again.


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

alexbn921 said:


> Fox has a 2018 upgraded air shaft for $40 that gives a much larger negative chamber. Also getting the 10-15cc of grease they stuff in there during assembly gives a much more supple feel.
> Yes, I like it a lot better.


But the 2018 airshaft is not compatible with older forks.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Rick Draper said:


> But the 2018 airshaft is not compatible with older forks.


I have a 34. your right about the 36.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Fox has a 2018 upgraded air shaft for $40 that gives a much larger negative chamber. Also getting the 10-15cc of grease they stuff in there during assembly gives a much more supple feel.
> Yes, I like it a lot better.


Adding more negative space seems to be the trend. Rockshox did the same thing. Vorsprung Suspension developed their Luftkappe for the Pike fork in late 2016. It essentially replaces the original piston, adds more negative space while also reducing positive space. Most of the reviews that I've read comparing the Luftkappe and the new airshaft assembly tend to say the Luftkappe does a better job than the new airshaft. I added the Luftkappe prior to Rockshox following Vorsprung's lead to develop the new airshaft and I'm totally happy with the outcome. No reason for me to consider the OEM product. You're right too, liberal use of SRAM Butter, Slick Honey, or Slickoleum will make everything smoother.


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

Mine is on the UPS truck today, and I'm getting the app setup so i can attach it and go riding. Super excited for this thing - I have a ton of bikes and am looking forward to the tuning.

Question: For the baseline air pressure, the manufacturer recommendation sticker on the side of my fork (Lyric 170mm) reads 80psi. I run it at 60psi with one air token. Am I better off starting from scratch at 80psi with no tokens at all, or should I start with the fork profile in the app configured to where I think it feels good?

Also - compression ratio - that's determined when I actually do the calibration, right? There's an option to put it in the fork profile manually, but I've no idea what it is yet.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Run the compression ratio 3 or 4 times and don't inflate after each time. You can set the baseline psi latter. Remember that TOP out with an air negative is not the same as pulling on the fork as hard as you can. This will over extend it.
I like to start with 20 psi on initial calibration and subtract 5 each time I do it. You will have 4 values that should all be within 0.1 of each other.
Time to test. Put 40ish psi in the fork and set baseline pressure. Compress the fork exactly 50%(or an easy to measure amount) and verify the the wiz sees the same travel. A lower compression ratio will make the Wiz think you are using more travel than you are and higher less. If you want a stiffer fork pick the lower of the average numbers during calibration.
My fork has a compression ratio of 2.8-2.9. I like the results better with 2.8 as they leave 5% of travel for oh **** moments.


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

Thanks! 

Just did a 10 mile ride with it, trying to session everything it recommended. Definitely addicting, I kept stopping every 5 minutes to check the stats on my phone (while getting annihilated by mosquitoes).

Couple of noob questions. Apologies if these are answered already, I plan to finish RTFM-ing and going through the thread this evening.

- About 3 miles in, I checked the app and it said to add air pressure. I added 10lbs, and it turned the calibration indicator red. I assume this is because something changed while the bike was idle? I had to restart the session, but am not 100% sure why it made the calibration unhappy.

Edit: RTFM'd a bit - looks like that's it. Don't change things on the fly, got it.

- Are profiles mostly just fancy notepads? I assumed that I would have to load one when starting a new session (eg: so it would know that I'm tuning my fork on my Nomad instead of the shock on my Scalpel). Is the idea basically to calibrate with the wizard, then save those into profiles so you can enter them later and skip calibration?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

Seventh-777 said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Just did a 10 mile ride with it, trying to session everything it recommended. Definitely addicting, I kept stopping every 5 minutes to check the stats on my phone (while getting annihilated by mosquitoes).
> 
> ...


When you added air mid ride it changes everything about the shock. The red indicator is to let you know that you needed to reset the baseline air pressure and start a new session. So after adding air and riding more, did the Shockwiz ever make it to 100% confidence and if so, did it still suggest adding air?

As for the profiles, this season I've yet to completely use them or see how they're useful. I understood them last year when they first came out, but quit using the Shockwiz for 6-9 months and forgot. Maybe someone will help us both with that part of your question.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

As IRbent said you need to reset your baseline air pressure after a change. Changing spacers will require getting a new compression ratio too.
profiles are like a snapshot of all the screens. I will save a profile at several spots on the ride and reset before strategic sections.


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

You guys are awesome, thanks for the replies. I just went through the manual, and went to the part where it addressed exactly the question I asked, so thanks for not making fun of me too much about it, lol.

I never made it to 100% confidence but I did a lot of stopping/starting/resetting the session, just dicking around with it. I don't want to admit how many times I made small changes and had to reset the session because of calibration, but it was, uh... more than one lol.

I was just so stoked to go riding with it I just slapped the thing on and pedaled off into the woods immediately.


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

It's all good. Doing what you did is an excellent way to better understand how the thing works. Rather than saving profile data, I stop periodically after finishing the suggested type of trail and take screenshots. Later I download all the screenshots for each section of trail, compare them with one another and their suggestions, make record of each in a spreadsheet, then proceed to make suggested changes. But only make changes if multiple rides all suggest the same thing. At least that's the way I manage it once I get close to honing in on final results.

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## Medrep (Jan 23, 2011)

I’ve now changed the tune from balanced to Firmest and Planted, and am happy with where it’s now taking me. Everything is green except add air Amber and add spacer amber. Maybe balanced just was not working for my trails/bike/riding?

Hopefully a slight increase in psi may turn add spacer green also. 

I will then try a trail centre with fast berms etc and see how that goes. 

I am still surprised I’m all the way out on LSC and it’s not telling me to increase. I’m kinda hoping it will on faster trails, as I stil suspect some dive. 

Thanks again.


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

This is getting annoying, my profiles are wiped out again. I contacted Quarq and they said they are getting some reports of this happening and that an update might be out soon. So last night I was getting messages for an update, but when i did the firmware didn't download all the way and timed out. Tried again and then it said my firmware is up to date, just looked now and all my profiles are gone. WTF. 

I am using version 8.0 is that the most updated version?


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

Does anyone know how the tune styles differ?

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## jjc155 (Aug 9, 2011)

This seems like a pretty cool concept. The shop that I just got my new bike at rents them for $50 for a weekend. I may take them up on it to fine tune my fork/shock. Seem like it couldn't hurt. 

For those that have used it does it seem to do the trick and get ya finely tuned?

J-


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jjc155 said:


> This seems like a pretty cool concept. The shop that I just got my new bike at rents them for $50 for a weekend. I may take them up on it to fine tune my fork/shock. Seem like it couldn't hurt.
> 
> For those that have used it does it seem to do the trick and get ya finely tuned?
> 
> J-


I like the direction the tool has carried me, but if you expect it to dial either end in perfectly, you're in for disappointment. Each ride even on the very same trail is different. So your results will vary. Trying to nail that perfect score is the holy grail. Repeating it over several back to back rides is probably impossible. If you're totally clueless about suspension setup, it will indeed help you get close and maybe even as good as possible. Just don't expect miracles in a few rides. In my opinion, it takes months of riding to get a firm grip on the results and how they correspond to your needs and recent setup changes. It's great for numbers geeks and fun to play with.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

IRBent said:


> I like the direction the tool has carried me, but if you expect it to dial either end in perfectly, you're in for disappointment. Each ride even on the very same trail is different. So your results will vary. Trying to nail that perfect score is the holy grail. Repeating it over several back to back rides is probably impossible. If you're totally clueless about suspension setup, it will indeed help you get close and maybe even as good as possible. Just don't expect miracles in a few rides. In my opinion, it takes months of riding to get a firm grip on the results and how they correspond to your needs and recent setup changes. It's great for numbers geeks and fun to play with.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


I agree with all of this. IMO it's not worth $50 for a weekend, especially not with a brand new bike. I'd get used to riding the new rig first, dial it to where you think it should be, and then if you really want to get into it use the SW to check/verify your sweet spots.

I bought mine from Amazon and intended to keep it - I have 5 full suspension bikes, ride a lot of different styles/terrain, and am a stats kind of guy so this thing is right in my OCD wheelhouse. I ended up returning it all the same, because after two weeks of riding the hell out of it I still wasn't convinced that it was really telling me anything that I couldn't feel from just knowing my bike anyway.

It's definitely a clever gadget, but $50 is too much for a rental, and the $300+ they get for it retail is (again, just IMO) too much.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

If you are prepared and have all the tools, spacers and know how to set it up you can dial in a suspension in about 7 to 8 rides. That's a week of riding everyday. If your new to suspension setup and have to learn the shockwiz then 2 to 3 weeks minimum.
I like to run it now and again just to check setting and make small changes for spacific trails. I was riding a lot for 3 weeks straight to get the best possible setup and learn the best way to test with the wiz.
Make sure you have the shop walk you through the calibration on the shock and fork.


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## jjc155 (Aug 9, 2011)

Seventh-777 said:


> I agree with all of this. IMO it's not worth $50 for a weekend, especially not with a brand new bike. I'd get used to riding the new rig first, dial it to where you think it should be, and then if you really want to get into it use the SW to check/verify your sweet spots.
> 
> I bought mine from Amazon and intended to keep it - I have 5 full suspension bikes, ride a lot of different styles/terrain, and am a stats kind of guy so this thing is right in my OCD wheelhouse. I ended up returning it all the same, because after two weeks of riding the hell out of it I still wasn't convinced that it was really telling me anything that I couldn't feel from just knowing my bike anyway.
> 
> It's definitely a clever gadget, but $50 is too much for a rental, and the $300+ they get for it retail is (again, just IMO) too much.


Only reason I would consider it is that this is my first FS bike after riding HT for years so I'm kinda even more behind the 8ball than most would be, lol.

J-


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

jjc155 said:


> Only reason I would consider it is that this is my first FS bike after riding HT for years so I'm kinda even more behind the 8ball than most would be, lol.
> 
> J-


Sounds like you'll be in for a treat in FS, as well as a lot of confusion in tweaking the suspension. I agree with the previous post. Ride your bike a lot, tweaking the suspension and seeing how it reacts. Adding to that, make heavy notes on each setup and what you thought of it, good and bad. Then do the same after each tweak. It's a lot of help to be able to go back through those notes. Once you think you're close to the right setup, ask a buddy who's of similar weight and who's familiar with FS. Consider their input before you spend money on renting a Shockwiz.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## jjc155 (Aug 9, 2011)

IRBent said:


> Sounds like you'll be in for a treat in FS, as well as a lot of confusion in tweaking the suspension. I agree with the previous post. Ride your bike a lot, tweaking the suspension and seeing how it reacts. Adding to that, make heavy notes on each setup and what you thought of it, good and bad. Then do the same after each tweak. It's a lot of help to be able to go back through those notes. Once you think you're close to the right setup, ask a buddy who's of similar weight and who's familiar with FS. Consider their input before you spend money on renting a Shockwiz.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


copy thanks

J-


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## grobi666 (Jun 28, 2018)

Hey guys,

does anyone have a pic of a ShockWiz mounted on a Float X2 on a Nomad 4?

Thanks


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## russmu66 (Nov 11, 2007)

I'm having issues with the configuration process on a Fox X2. When I let the air out of the shock, I then can barely (lots of swearing and straining) get the shock to full extension as the App asks. I've tried cycling the shock while slowly letting air out... no difference. It feels like a suction lock. The X2 is on a Merida eone-sixty 900e ebike. Any suggestions?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

You're further ahead than me. I'm struggling to mount it on an X2 on my mojo hd3.


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## tkm16 (Apr 27, 2009)

russmu66 said:


> I'm having issues with the configuration process on a Fox X2. When I let the air out of the shock, I then can barely (lots of swearing and straining) get the shock to full extension as the App asks. I've tried cycling the shock while slowly letting air out... no difference. It feels like a suction lock. The X2 is on a Merida eone-sixty 900e ebike. Any suggestions?


Are you pressing the schrader valve in when you are extending the shock? If not you will be pulling a vacuum within the shock..

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## oldranger (Apr 14, 2011)

russmu66 said:


> I'm having issues with the configuration process on a Fox X2. When I let the air out of the shock, I then can barely (lots of swearing and straining) get the shock to full extension as the App asks. I've tried cycling the shock while slowly letting air out... no difference. It feels like a suction lock. The X2 is on a Merida eone-sixty 900e ebike. Any suggestions?


With Fox shocks and forks (more so than others), when you are releasing air from the valve:
1) always use the shock pump to release air slowly
2) release about 20 psi incrementally - and slowly cycle the fork or shock to equalize the negative spring. If you do this slowly enough you can hear it on some models or feel it
3) if the air spring is collapsing when you are letting air out, stop and cycle the suspension until it can be easily fully extended

Patience here will save time and prevent you from having to re-pressurize the air spring to resolve it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

There is a bypass port for the negative chamber. If you not drain both chambers then the shock will get suck down. Also when you put air in without cycling the shock it will top out and get stuck there.


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## MTB_MOR (Jul 4, 2018)

I have it mounted on the outside of the fork in parallel with it. I am using several zip ties to keep it up away from the movement. I was unable to place it behind the fork without it hitting the frame.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

I've spent the last week riding a wide variety of stuff in VT - a lot of it technical, but with some buff stuff thrown in, and even a day of downhill at Killington. My results have still differed a bit ride to ride, but some of that can be explained by the type of riding I was doing (I got a yellow on "bobbing" after doing a few buff downhill runs where I was standing 100% of the time). 
The suggestions for rebound usually stay in the green, but occasionally show up as yellow on either side (speed up/ slow down), so I'm calling those good.

HSC still often comes in as a red "make softer", and LSC is sometimes green and more often yellow "make softer".

How close to the limits should I go with adjusting these? I'm 5 clicks away from full - (out of 20) on my LSC, and ~5/8 of a turn away from full - (out of 4.5 turns) on HSC. 

I do notice that when ripping down a washed out fire road at 30mph, I can feel the hits more than I would like, so maybe it's telling the truth.


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## MTB_MOR (Jul 4, 2018)

I think it is supposed to all be in the green. I was told to add a spacer and did. Then, it was telling me the same thing with 100% confidence on several rides. I added another spacer and now it is in green. I did notice minor differences in feedback based on the terrain I ride, but the spacer recommendation was always the same. Now I am needing to slow rebound. I think we should aim for all green.


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## tkm16 (Apr 27, 2009)

Does anyone know if it’s possible to achieve 100% confidence by just going DH runs? If so how does it calculate pearling/climbing performance?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

If you ride is varied enough, I don't see how it could ever be all greens.

Personally, I tune for the terrain where I need to suspension the most. I just suck up the compromise in other areas.

I could tune for what is most common time wise, but that would then compromise th dh sections.


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

tkm16 said:


> Does anyone know if it's possible to achieve 100% confidence by just going DH runs? If so how does it calculate pearling/climbing performance?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I always get 100% confidence at a bike park. However, there are some pedal sections on a few of the trails I ride but mostly DH


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## Kamao (Mar 31, 2013)

How in the world do I adjust HSC and LSC on a Rockshox Super Deluxe shock? Everything else is spot on, but SW tells me to make HSC and LSC softer?!


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## jjc155 (Aug 9, 2011)

I was thinking about this and how some people are having back and forth kind of readings with the Shockwiz (maybe its been discussed already) but would ambient temp, baro pressure etc effect the way the shock responds say on the same trail but different days?

Like one day its 90degs and the next its 75, seems like just the temp difference is going to change the pressure of the air in the cylinder(s) and fool the Shockwiz into thinking that something has changed? Or does the Shockwiz somehow account for that?

Seems to me that if that is changing the pressure the day to day recommendations are going to change or is there not enough possible ambient temp swing to create enough of a pressure change to matter?

J-


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## jdaigneault (Oct 18, 2013)

Installed a shockwiz on a 2019 fox 36 fit 2. I am running around 25% sag, and rarely bottom out, however shockwiz is suggestion to add a volume spacer. Does anyone have any input on this? I am running on the playful setting, I'm 185lbs running a pivot firebird 29.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Is it happy with your air pressure setting? Or is it asking for lower pressure and a token?


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## MTB_MOR (Jul 4, 2018)

*Dipping*

I get the same thing. In fact, I added a spacer, then was told to add another, and now I get that suggestion sometimes. After talking to two different sources, I believe it is noticing the fork is dipping during braking and throwing off the geometry. I noticed the last suggestion to add a token came only after slowing down the rebound two clicks which makes me believe the fork is staying too compressed for extended periods of times during the ride. I spoke with a tech who suggested trying some of our local trails (Orange County CA) with the fork in the middle compression setting instead of open. MTB MOR


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## MTB_MOR (Jul 4, 2018)

It likes my air pressure 70-80 psi, but wants me to slow down the rebound. I am two clicks on the slower half of rebound. I am scoring 82-86 right now.


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## jdaigneault (Oct 18, 2013)

onzadog said:


> Is it happy with your air pressure setting? Or is it asking for lower pressure and a token?


It is happy with air pressure.


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## tatchle1 (Oct 13, 2016)

*a bit of help*

Help! This forum is too deep to find what I'm looking for. When it gives suggestions, do I make the adjustment the yellow or red tab is closest to, or make the adjustment it is farther from to "bring it back" to the middle? (For example, if the adjustment rec shows a yellow tab closer to the remove air recommendation, do I remove air, or add air?)

The reason I ask is because it recently had the yellow tab closest to remove air. I did this, rode a bit to get confidence to 100, and it said it again. I repeated it over and over until I was down to 60 psi (on a 130mm Pike and I weight 205lbs geared up) and my dynamic sag was 35%. I just fell like that air pressure is too low.

I've gone back to a higher psi, and here's what I've got: What do I do? 
Just to make sure, I don't have high speed compression or high speed rebound adjustments on a Pike, right? They're both low speed adjustments?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tatchle1 said:


> Help! This forum is too deep to find what I'm looking for. When it gives suggestions, do I make the adjustment the yellow or red tab is closest to, or make the adjustment it is farther from to "bring it back" to the middle? (For example, if the adjustment rec shows a yellow tab closer to the remove air recommendation, do I remove air, or add air?)
> 
> The reason I ask is because it recently had the yellow tab closest to remove air. I did this, rode a bit to get confidence to 100, and it said it again. I repeated it over and over until I was down to 60 psi (on a 130mm Pike and I weight 205lbs geared up) and my dynamic sag was 35%. I just fell like that air pressure is too low.
> 
> ...


When the indicator is on the "remove air" side, you should remove air. In your pic, you'd remove air.

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## tatchle1 (Oct 13, 2016)

IRBent said:


> When the indicator is on the "remove air" side, you should remove air. In your pic, you'd remove air.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


That's what I figured, but with a dynamic sag of 35% and getting my psi down to 60, I started to feel that something wasn't right. . . What dynamic sag should I be shooting for, and for anyone else that wants to answer, what psi are you running for your body weight?


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

tatchle1 said:


> That's what I figured, but with a dynamic sag of 35% and getting my psi down to 60, I started to feel that something wasn't right. . . What dynamic sag should I be shooting for, and for anyone else that wants to answer, what psi are you running for your body weight?


Another thing to consider. The tuning mode you select in comparison to the trails you ride will also dictate the type of results you get. For instance. If you select the Aggressive tuning style then ride smooth rides, it will have you lower your pressure in attempt to use all 130mm of travel. If you never use half of your travel, it will keep asking you to remove air. Pretty much the same with the playful mode, but it won't be as aggressive. So if you rode smooth trails and set the tuning style to aggressive or even playful, it will continue to ask you to remove air.

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## sandy771 (Feb 8, 2012)

just got a shockwiz and tried the initial setup ready to go out later. Not sure I have it right though 

Setup said to connect shockwiz and remove air form shock (Pike RTC3 160) which I did, I compressed the fork as i did it.

The next step was to pull the fork to full extension - I tried that but there was no way I could pull it all the way up (I am no weakling  ) I guess I could pull it to about 50/60% of travel is this normal?


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

You let out all the air *very fast*. This means the travel dropped below the equalisation port between the negative air and positive air. You now have a lot of negative air pressure and no balancing positive air, so the fork sucks down and doesn't want to extend.

There are two ways to fix this:

1. pull to extend the for really hard - it will suddenly give as the travel reaches the equalisation port position

2. reinflate the positive and this time deflate it while also holding the fork a little bit extended.


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## sandy771 (Feb 8, 2012)

Thanks peter

I'll give that a try


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## sandy771 (Feb 8, 2012)

More newbie questions

OK - recalibrated and went for my first ride, couple of hours with the guys doing all sorts 

Confidence was 100% at the end and I got the following:









The issue I have is what do I adjust - As I understand it the pike (RCT solo 160)has adjustment for low speed compression (inner small knob on the top of the fork) and rebound using the knob at the bottom of the stanchion.

My questions are therefore

How do I adjust high speed compression - the biggest of my issues according to the screenshot above.

2. Is the rebound adjustment at the bottom of the fork low speed or high speed and how can adjust both low speed and high speed.

the calibrartion figures for the pike where compression ratio 2.4 and baseline pressure 79 psi (I am about 225lbs kitted up)

cheers


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

@sandy771
To slow down your rebound you'll need to turn the knob on the lower fork clockwise. That's clockwise when looking at it from the bottom, or with the bike upside down. "Righty-tighty" either slows things down or makes them firmer. So for your compression issues, righty-tighty/clockwise looking down at the knob will make it firmer. The opposite direction will make it softer. If you don't have separate knobs for all 3, a compromise will have to be met. Also know the tuning mode you choose and the amount of travel you used will play a key role in what the Shockwiz suggests. If you chose aggressive or playful tuning modes, it expects you to use practically all of your travel. If you ride today did not use it all, it will tell you o make things softer. It seems too that the Wiz tends to tell us all that our compression is too stiff. Make several rides, same trails and see if your results change from ride to ride. Only then should you consider making adjustments if all results point you to making the same adjustments.


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## sandy771 (Feb 8, 2012)

Thank You - I understood which way to twiddle the knobs though  

It was more about what can I do about the high speed compression?


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## SpeshulEd (Oct 29, 2013)

Keep in mind that you should only change one setting at a time (with the exception of air/air ramp, which should be done together) and work your way down from the top.

Making changes to your rebound and compression at the same time could mean that you continue to get bad readings. When I use the Shockwiz, I ride the same loop over and over and go down the list one setting at the time.


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## GH28 (Jun 16, 2014)

Does anyone know what the logic is that this thing uses to suggest changes by?

For example, is it just taking an average of the rebound stroke speeds and compression stroke speeds and comparing them to what they have as a pre-determined "ideal" value? Or are they roughing out the natural frequency from the data somehow, and taking compression/rebound ratios into account at different points in the travel and getting correct values of zeta?

In simple terms - how does the software define "good", "better", and "best"? What metrics are used?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

This is the general consensus on how it works.

The Wiz uses a matrix to store values. It collects 100 samples a sec on position and velocity. It then continuously uses an algorithm on the last 100-300 samples it holds in memory. If it see something wrong like bob it adds to the matrix in the bob spot.

We know that it does NOT data log. There is no way to download your complete run.
Once is happy with the amount of data stored in the matrix it will give you suggestions. 

As soon as you see 100% confidence the matrix is FULL. Old data will be pushed out in a first in, first out fashion.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

After months of riding with a Wiz on my Cane Creek DB Inline, I finally had an accidental breakthrough that got me a consistent tune of 96 across a couple similar riding styles.

I had been away for a couple weeks, and my pressure was around 5psi low. Instead of getting out the pump and setting it back to where the wiz had previously told me to do it, I was curious and just reset the baseline to see what happened.

I guess with that shock a little extra air pressure can also mask as a need to reduce compression damping, because it stopped recommending I do that and didn't say that I needed to bring the air back up. At no point has it ever recommended that I remove air.

I also decided that 96 was close enough after realizing how amazing the suspension on my bike felt compared to the rental High Tower I had been on a few days ago.

I switched to the fork yesterday and got a 92 right away (I was pretty confident in my fork settings, so I wasn't too surprised). It's recommendation was to add a spacer and reduce compression damping. I don't really want to bother with the spacer, and I can't change the damping, so I guess it's good!


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## si_uk (Aug 29, 2018)

> As soon as you see 100% confidence the matrix is FULL. Old data will be pushed out in a first in, first out fashion.


Ah - that's interesting. It does mean that it's worth looking at recommendations during a ride. I'd assumed it just kept adding more data and a better result would come from riding longer even if it was at 100%

I borrowed a SW for a few weeks to tune a Fox 36RC2 and Float X2 (so lots of easy adjustment).

Float X2. SW wanted me to lose a bit of air pressure but I was running at 30% static sag and with a low BB I already get more pedal strike than I'd like so I ignored this. It means I'm never bottoming out the shock (5mm or so on a 57mm shaft leaves me some 'get out of jail free' travel).

SW had me wind off all the HSC (and was still saying I should have less) and very little LSC (but within the range Fox suggest)

HSR was slightly faster than Fox's recommendations. LSR slightly slower than Fox.

36RC2. Had me add a token (went from two blue to one blue/one orange). Air pressure unchanged from what i was riding at. 
Rebound - 2 clicks faster than Fox, but smack on what TF Tuned recommended after last service. 
HSC - full open
LSC - two or three clicks

Set up as 'playful' (balanced wanted even less compression damping) and while the adjustments from my previous settings were only a few clicks it has made the bike feel significantly better. With all the compression wound off the bike is responding better to small chatter and feeling poppier and more playful over the big stuff.

On the X2 I'd known something wasn't as good as it could be on the rebound but had struggled to improve it (not really knowing whether it was a HSR or LSR issue). The fork

I just went out an rode our normal all day ride with mates and tweaked settings when we were hanging around (and had hit 100% confidence).

I did get some odd results on the fork on the last day of riding (on some very rocky trails). The first half of a rough descent got me to 100% confidence and all green. After a reset a further bit of riding got 100% agin but with recommendations all over the place (I ignored that sample).

Borrowing again soon to try to set up my wife's bike. That will be more of a challenge has her Fox 34 and DPS have far less easy adjustment.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Interesting to to hear about the FIFO arrangement in the data matrix. That makes me wonder if there's any way to pause the recording without starting a new session.

I've recently being doing some riding that is short sharp climbs with steep fast descents. The shockwiz is giving some funny results which I think are due to wallowing about in the punchy climbs. If I could pause recording, I could then just look at the mean results for the downhill as I'm happy to sacrifice the climbing.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

onzadog said:


> Interesting to to hear about the FIFO arrangement in the data matrix. That makes me wonder if there's any way to pause the recording without starting a new session.
> 
> I've recently being doing some riding that is short sharp climbs with steep fast descents. The shockwiz is giving some funny results which I think are due to wallowing about in the punchy climbs. If I could pause recording, I could then just look at the mean results for the downhill as I'm happy to sacrifice the climbing.


Is that due to a lower sag point with a number of tokens and lower psi?


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

Hey, not to change the subject but was wondering if anyone else has experienced this. I had Shockwiz on my fork and it seemed to get stuck at 49% confidence no matter what I rode. I seriously rode at a bike park for a couple of hours, hitting everything from drops to jumps, steeps, rocks you name it no change at all. Fork traveled all the way through according to the indicator. I hit all of the same trails that easily gave me 100% confidence before but now it seems to be stuck.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

monts said:


> Hey, not to change the subject but was wondering if anyone else has experienced this. I had Shockwiz on my fork and it seemed to get stuck at 49% confidence no matter what I rode. I seriously rode at a bike park for a couple of hours, hitting everything from drops to jumps, steeps, rocks you name it no change at all. Fork traveled all the way through according to the indicator. I hit all of the same trails that easily gave me 100% confidence before but now it seems to be stuck.


Well two things come to mind. At 49% it should be suggesting you ride a certain way to proceed with it's calcs. I.e "climbing/pedalling" etc. If you havent done sufficient for that style of riding it wont progress.

If you feel you have done all it's asking, then reassess your CR. Could it be wrong? Has anything else changed on your bikes suspension?


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## monts (May 24, 2011)

lucifuge said:


> Well two things come to mind. At 49% it should be suggesting you ride a certain way to proceed with it's calcs. I.e "climbing/pedalling" etc. If you havent done sufficient for that style of riding it wont progress.
> 
> If you feel you have done all it's asking, then reassess your CR. Could it be wrong? Has anything else changed on your bikes suspension?


Nothing changed on my suspension, since this post I finally got it up to 79% but that's as high as it will go. I guess I should have mentioned this is my DH bike (Fox 40). The next suggestion is "Pedaling (climbing/downhill)," I've pedaled plenty going down. I guess it wants me to climb, which isn't going to happen on a DH bike! So I guess I just ignore it and be happy with 79%? Seems like there should be tuning style more DH specific, I'm already set on Playful.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

You might not have to climb up much for it to calculate what it needs. Worth a try. But, yes, maybe you have gleaned as much as you need for that bike.


monts said:


> Nothing changed on my suspension, since this post I finally got it up to 79% but that's as high as it will go. I guess I should have mentioned this is my DH bike (Fox 40). The next suggestion is "Pedaling (climbing/downhill)," I've pedaled plenty going down. I guess it wants me to climb, which isn't going to happen on a DH bike! So I guess I just ignore it and be happy with 79%? Seems like there should be tuning style more DH specific, I'm already set on Playful.


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## eco-air (Oct 3, 2018)

*eco*

Have a Fox Float Evol Re-Aktive rear shock 2017 with no lockout, seems lever has moved forward and wont go back due to valve rod moving up. (damper pressure on valve raising rod )
Trying to get cutaway drg to show shaft/valve rod seals to cap, as will need to undo top cap away from valve rod to reposition levers back into place.
Anyone done a Damper top cap rebuild.
Any suggestions on a suitable replacement shock 210x55


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## michaelz23 (Oct 14, 2018)

Hi, I ride the yari rc solo on my canyon torque al5. Shockwiz likes all settings but gives me a red flag at my highspeed compression telling me to soften it. It is already turned all the way left to minus. Any ideas?


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

I am getting consistent recommendation after the ride. The Air Pressure is in RED and based on the recommedation and add Ramp is in yellow, I was advised to release 10% of air, the Air Pressure was 66 at the time, I reduced it to 59 and added 1 token. After the changes, went for another and still getting the same reading, reduce air in red and Ramp in yellow.

Using fox 36 Grip2 and from fox recommendations, my weight 70kg is 67 psi. Would it be too soft that if I reduce the AP to 55 or even 50?




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## michaelz23 (Oct 14, 2018)

I had the same thing. I reduced further and further and now it feels really good. The manufacturer recommendations seem always on the high side, probebly to avoid bottoming out. I'd go lower and try. As long as you don't start bottoming out too much...


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

michaelz23 said:


> I had the same thing. I reduced further and further and now it feels really good. The manufacturer recommendations seem always on the high side, probebly to avoid bottoming out. I'd go lower and try. As long as you don't start bottoming out too much...


Thanks mate. Will fine tune as suggested. That was my second ride anyway

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

How much travel are you not using as at your last ride when it was still unhappy?


Keithyk said:


> I am getting consistent recommendation after the ride. The Air Pressure is in RED and based on the recommedation and add Ramp is in yellow, I was advised to release 10% of air, the Air Pressure was 66 at the time, I reduced it to 59 and added 1 token. After the changes, went for another and still getting the same reading, reduce air in red and Ramp in yellow.
> 
> Using fox 36 Grip2 and from fox recommendations, my weight 70kg is 67 psi. Would it be too soft that if I reduce the AP to 55 or even 50?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> How much travel are you not using as at your last ride when it was still unhappy?


I think that about 25-30% of unused travel.

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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Keithyk said:


> I am getting consistent recommendation after the ride. The Air Pressure is in RED and based on the recommedation and add Ramp is in yellow, I was advised to release 10% of air, the Air Pressure was 66 at the time, I reduced it to 59 and added 1 token. After the changes, went for another and still getting the same reading, reduce air in red and Ramp in yellow.
> 
> Using fox 36 Grip2 and from fox recommendations, my weight 70kg is 67 psi. Would it be too soft that if I reduce the AP to 55 or even 50?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You always get the air pressure to green before proceeding with any other adjustments.

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

That's heaps. Definitely lower the pressure. I'm assuming there is some jumping occurring as well on your tuning rides?


Keithyk said:


> I think that about 25-30% of unused travel.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> That's heaps. Definitely lower the pressure. I'm assuming there is some jumping occurring as well on your tuning rides?


On the jumping, not really, as I don't do jump. Just drops and roots

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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Keithyk said:


> On the jumping, not really, as I don't do jump. Just drops and roots
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I hear you, but you'll never get a satisfactory Shockwiz conclusion without some significant deep compression events. So you might have to live withe results are getting now.


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> I hear you, but you'll never get a satisfactory Shockwiz conclusion without some significant deep compression events. So you might have to live withe results are getting now.


Thanks. Will ride for another few round and see what is the suggestion

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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

I've been playing around with using different spacers in my rear (Fox DPS) shock and, when calibrating, the measured compression ratio is consistently a few tenths lower than the value given in tables from Fox. For instance, right now I'm using a 0.4 in^3 spacer that the Fox tables show as having a CR of 2.3, but the Shockwiz calibration measures it as 2.0. I've been using the measured value. Anybody know if this is correct, incorrect, or is the difference small enough it won't affect the tuning outcome all that much anyway?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

That sounds very low. When you have emptied all air, are you definitely replacing the valve cap prior to calibration?


wayold said:


> I've been playing around with using different spacers in my rear (Fox DPS) shock and, when calibrating, the measured compression ratio is consistently a few tenths lower than the value given in tables from Fox. For instance, right now I'm using a 0.4 in^3 spacer that the Fox tables show as having a CR of 2.3, but the Shockwiz calibration measures it as 2.0. I've been using the measured value. Anybody know if this is correct, incorrect, or is the difference small enough it won't affect the tuning outcome all that much anyway?


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

I released the air to 53psi with 1 spacer and gotten the compression ratio as 2.2

Is this ok? Was 2.2 also without volume spacer but the Air Pressure was 65psi and at 2.3 with AP 59 with 1 volume spacer 


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Keithyk said:


> I released the air to 53psi with 1 spacer and gotten the compression ratio as 2.2
> 
> Is this ok? Was 2.2 also without volume spacer but the Air Pressure was 65psi and at 2.3 with AP 59 with 1 volume spacer
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I dont understand "released the air to 53psi". Arent you removing all the air? Where does 53psi factor in to anything?


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## Keithyk (Feb 3, 2016)

lucifuge said:


> I dont understand "released the air to 53psi". Arent you removing all the air? Where does 53psi factor in to anything?


Mean I am removing air from original state of 59 to 53. Then I did the calibration and gotten 2.2 CR

And yes, I remove all air first before the calibration

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## wayold (Nov 25, 2017)

lucifuge said:


> That sounds very low. When you have emptied all air, are you definitely replacing the valve cap prior to calibration?


Yes, I am fully emptying the air (down to about 1 psi, as indicated in the Shockwiz app). Measured compression ratio ranged from 2.2-2.3 with a 0.8 in^3 spacer in the shock to 2.0 with a 0.4 in^3 spacer. I have a 7.25x1.75 2017 DPS FLOAT shock. Specified compression ratios from the linked FOX data sheet with these spacers are 2.5 and 2.3, respectively, so only 10-15% higher than what Shockwiz measures.

Edit: I just recalibrated and made sure to put the valve cap on through the whole process. I got a measured CR of 2.1 (vs. 2.0 earlier when I'm not sure if the cap was on). Regardless, still a similar variance from the published CR spec.


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## rockman (Jun 18, 2004)

Has anyone come up with a solution to adapt the hose to a Cane Creek Inline IL? The knurled knob contacts the air can but just slightly. 

It will work on 7.25 x 1.75 but not 7.875" x 2.25. It might work with a bit of material filed off the hose. Thought I'd see if anyone had a solution first.


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## 294037 (Jun 30, 2006)

rockman said:


> Has anyone come up with a solution to adapt the hose to a Cane Creek Inline IL? The knurled knob contacts the air can but just slightly.
> 
> It will work on 7.25 x 1.75 but not 7.875" x 2.25. It might work with a bit of material filed off the hose. Thought I'd see if anyone had a solution first.


You can get Schraeder valve extenders that might step it out enough to get clearance?


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## rockman (Jun 18, 2004)

JohnnyC7 said:


> You can get Schraeder valve extenders that might step it out enough to get clearance?


I ended up taking a file to the knurled knob on the hose. Only needed to take a mm off gain the necessary clearance. Pretty easy fix for what Shockwiz lists as an incompatible shock.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

I'm having some problems with calibration. I'm following all the instructions (especially in regards to balancing both chambers) but I think I'm still having negative air chamber issues. When I finish I have a CR of 2.3/64.9psi/8%Shock Travel. I have re-calibrated three times and I get the same results. If I manually extend the fork with my hands the shock travel goes to 0%. I assume this is because of an unbalanced negative chamber but I am being pretty careful about cycling the fork when doing the calibration. Anyone have a foolproof way to get this fixed?
It's a Fox 34 Rythm.


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

It sounds like you are pulling it past the pneumatic top out point during calibration.

You should only pull the fork out to the point that is normally “zero” travel when it is inflated and equalized. Pulling past that point will skew your results.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I've owned my Shockwiz since the product was first available. 

At first I thought it was a bit silly with limited practicality and was going to sell it but then I bought a new bike, then my wife's bike, and next my kid's bike and i'm finding it invaluable for setting proper air pressure in particular, but also other settings. Especially for my wife and kid that are unable to express how their suspension is behaving. But for me too. 

I hope to keep it for many years and use it to assist with set up on many bikes. 

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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Ganderson said:


> It sounds like you are pulling it past the pneumatic top out point during calibration.
> 
> You should only pull the fork out to the point that is normally "zero" travel when it is inflated and equalized. Pulling past that point will skew your results.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


It's a hard stop. The instructions say full extension. 
If you had to guess at a point before the hard stop, it would be incredibly difficult to guess at where that point was.

I took my air spring cap off and looked down at the piston. It can't be seen because there is so much grease packed down there. I'm thinking that all this grease is messing with the bypass valve and preventing proper equalization. OR, I read somewhere else that air can get pushed down into the lowers and the only fix is a service. 
I'm going to give Fox a call today to figure this out.


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## tkm16 (Apr 27, 2009)

Ganderson said:


> It sounds like you are pulling it past the pneumatic top out point during calibration.
> 
> You should only pull the fork out to the point that is normally "zero" travel when it is inflated and equalized. Pulling past that point will skew your results.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Ive always pulled my fork out until it stopped, then zero'ed the shockwiz! So I'm supposed to zero the shocwiz with 10-15mm of travel used due to the negative spring?


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

tkm16 said:


> Ive always pulled my fork out until it stopped, then zero'ed the shockwiz! So I'm supposed to zero the shocwiz with 10-15mm of travel used due to the negative spring?


Not necessarily, it depends on how far from the mechanical hard-stop top out the fork settles when pressurized/balanced.

The easiest way to check your calibration accuracy is to compare the movement of the fork/shock to the percentage displayed by shockwiz.

For instance, slowly press the fork to the 30% marker on the stanchion and look at the shockwiz display.. it should read 30%. This is all that matters.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Ganderson said:


> Not necessarily, it depends on how far from the mechanical hard-stop top out the fork settles when pressurized/balanced.
> 
> The easiest way to check your calibration accuracy is to compare the movement of the fork/shock to the percentage displayed by shockwiz.
> 
> For instance, slowly press the fork to the 30% marker on the stanchion and look at the shockwiz display.. it should read 30%. This is all that matters.


Fox forks do not have sag markers.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

rstark18 said:


> I'm having some problems with calibration. I'm following all the instructions (especially in regards to balancing both chambers) but I think I'm still having negative air chamber issues. When I finish I have a CR of 2.3/64.9psi/8%Shock Travel. I have re-calibrated three times and I get the same results. If I manually extend the fork with my hands the shock travel goes to 0%. I assume this is because of an unbalanced negative chamber but I am being pretty careful about cycling the fork when doing the calibration. Anyone have a foolproof way to get this fixed?
> It's a Fox 34 Rythm.


Just a followup to my original post about this. It was air trapped in the lower air side that was giving me the problems. after burping that and cleaning out a TON of grease from inside the air stanchion, it calibrates normally. I'm now at CR of 2.3/68psi/1%Shock Travel.


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

rstark18 said:


> Fox forks do not have sag markers.


Well measure and mark with masking tape then. 

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## Guy.Ford (Oct 28, 2009)

...


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Looking for some advice on these results. This is for a Fox Float DPS with ONLY single rebound adjustment. It says my packing is bad but says my LSR is good.


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## 294037 (Jun 30, 2006)

rstark18 said:


> Looking for some advice on these results. This is for a Fox Float DPS with ONLY single rebound adjustment. It says my packing is bad but says my LSR is good.


Not surprising, packing is from too much HSR and most factory shocks come with very stiff rebound valvinig, so it might feel good bouncing up and down and using the single (low speed) adjuster, but when you hit bumps deep in the travel it will be returning much slower.

A rebound retune is the best solution, or else you have to find a balance of faster LSR than you would prefer or packing up in rough ground


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## IRBent (May 11, 2015)

JohnnyC7 said:


> Not surprising, packing is from too much HSR and most factory shocks come with very stiff rebound valvinig, so it might feel good bouncing up and down and using the single (low speed) adjuster, but when you hit bumps deep in the travel it will be returning much slower.
> 
> A rebound retune is the best solution, or else you have to find a balance of faster LSR than you would prefer or packing up in rough ground


That totally describes what I found on my DVO Topaz. Looking into the HSR shim stack I found 2 identical shims that were about as small as possible in thickness and diameter. Meaning there wasn't much that could be done to the stack without pretty much changing it to half, or less than half of the resistance. So I opted to go with the thinnest shock oil I could buy. It helped tremendously but did not totally eliminate the occasional packing.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

If I'm ever able to ride again(or use my right arm at all), I'd like to try using a ShockWiz. I think the reason I destroyed my right arm was due to too little rebound damping sending me flying superman style off a fairly small high speed jump. Will it tell me where to set compression and rebound settings? My suspension bike always had a tendency to kick me and land scary nose heavy on table tops. I added more than a few clicks to help, but it certainly wasn't enough. All my other bikes are rigid so tuning is not my thing.


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

Just got a 2019 Fox x2 to replace my Super Deluxe.

For some reason the calibration wizard is giving me way too low of a ratio.. 2.4 - 2.5. Maybe its the new progressive bottom out bumper they are using in these shocks, tough to get full compression by hand.

I think I’m officially switching to a Move-and-Measure method of calibration. It’s fast, easy and seems accurate.

1. Air shock up to at or near your riding Air pressure.

2. Fully equalize pos and neg air chambers.

3. Boot up ShockWiz and mark baseline air pressure. Travel % should read 0% with the bike at rest and upright.

4. Manually set calibration ratio to 2.5 (for shocks anyway)

5. Zero o-ring and a slowly compress rear suspension until shockwiz displays 25% then release.

6. Measure o-ring travel distance.
-if less than 25% of your shocks travel, increase calibration ratio by .1 or more.
-If more than 25% of your shocks travel, decrease calibration ratio by .1 or more.

7. Repeat until 25% movement on shockwiz consistently equals 25% actual shock movement.

8. Verify by checking at 30 and 35% or whatever % you want.



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## mab411 (Mar 10, 2019)

Just got mine...seems stuck at confidence level 49%. Wants me to hit some big jumps/drops. I’ve done several drops of around 12-18”, is that just not big enough, or is there another issue?

It’s a Fox Float DPS, and I did run the calibration. Measuring the comp ratio gave me 2.8.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

mab411 said:


> Just got mine...seems stuck at confidence level 49%. Wants me to hit some big jumps/drops. I've done several drops of around 12-18", is that just not big enough, or is there another issue?
> 
> It's a Fox Float DPS, and I did run the calibration. Measuring the comp ratio gave me 2.8.


I'm thinking you have pretty smooth trails over all.
That's only happened to me when I ride pretty tame terrain.
You are gonna have to I just find rougher trails to ride, or if that is as rough as they get, just keep riding them.

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## Rock Climber (Jul 25, 2007)

I've been playing with my shockwiz for over a year on my fox 36 and I think I have it set up much better lately, but what I've found is that I can be between 55 and 65 psi and shockwiz will say air pressure is ok. At the lower end of the air range though my high speed compression is sometimes yellow instead of red. Is it worth trying to get high speed compression to not be red? I even sent my fork to vorsprung and had the shim stack changed and shockwiz is still showing red.

Also, at the end of a ride with 1,00 feet of climbing and descent shockwiz will still want me to pedal. The only way I can get it to register on the fork is if I pedal out of the saddle and purposely bob a lot. I'm worried by doing that it will suggest more low speed compression to counteract the bobbing I have to do to get it to register. Any thoughts?

Thanks!


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Rock Climber said:


> I've been playing with my shockwiz for over a year on my fox 36 and I think I have it set up much better lately, but what I've found is that I can be between 55 and 65 psi and shockwiz will say air pressure is ok. At the lower end of the air range though my high speed compression is sometimes yellow instead of red. Is it worth trying to get high speed compression to not be red? I even sent my fork to vorsprung and had the shim stack changed and shockwiz is still showing red.
> 
> Also, at the end of a ride with 1,00 feet of climbing and descent shockwiz will still want me to pedal. The only way I can get it to register on the fork is if I pedal out of the saddle and purposely bob a lot. I'm worried by doing that it will suggest more low speed compression to counteract the bobbing I have to do to get it to register. Any thoughts?
> 
> Thanks!


First thing to note is that you should take note of the higher air pressure as being "OK". I.e the 65psi. For that ride, it was obviously needed which supercedes the 55psi (unless it was a different trail?)

If you stand over the bike and give a few really hard compressions, what % travel is used? Unless you are running a shitload of tokens, 40% is a really good marker. What I'm wondering here is whether you can compress more than 40% and in fact you need even more air. You must sort the air out first and then worry about the rest. Reply back with what you can compress %-wise.


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## Rock Climber (Jul 25, 2007)

lucifuge said:


> First thing to note is that you should take note of the higher air pressure as being "OK". I.e the 65psi. For that ride, it was obviously needed which supercedes the 55psi (unless it was a different trail?)
> 
> If you stand over the bike and give a few really hard compressions, what % travel is used? Unless you are running a shitload of tokens, 40% is a really good marker. What I'm wondering here is whether you can compress more than 40% and in fact you need even more air. You must sort the air out first and then worry about the rest. Reply back with what you can compress %-wise.


Thanks! I'll test that tonight and let you know. The last 20 rides have all been the exact same trail so I could get consistent results. It's a long climb with a hairy descent (lots of roots, drops and jumps) then a pedal section at the end.


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> First thing to note is that you should take note of the higher air pressure as being "OK". I.e the 65psi. For that ride, it was obviously needed which supercedes the 55psi (unless it was a different trail?)
> 
> If you stand over the bike and give a few really hard compressions, what % travel is used? Unless you are running a shitload of tokens, 40% is a really good marker. What I'm wondering here is whether you can compress more than 40% and in fact you need even more air. You must sort the air out first and then worry about the rest. Reply back with what you can compress %-wise.


40%?! You like a really firm spring, eh? If I pump as hard as I can, I usually get about 70-80% of travel used, and that's with what feels like a nice and firm spring (to me).

This video says you should get about 90% of travel doing (not saying this video is gospel, but seems reasonable enough):


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Sid Duffman said:


> 40%?! You like a really firm spring, eh? If I pump as hard as I can, I usually get about 70-80% of travel used, and that's with what feels like a nice and firm spring (to me).
> 
> This video says you should get about 90% of travel doing (not saying this video is gospel, but seems reasonable enough):


That test is a very good one, but it's a DIFFERENT test. I said if you stand over the bike. Not ON the bike.


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## Sid Duffman (Oct 5, 2015)

lucifuge said:


> That test is a very good one, but it's a DIFFERENT test. I said if you stand over the bike. Not ON the bike.


Ah, I misunderstood. My mistake.

Objection withdrawn.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Rock Climber (Jul 25, 2007)

lucifuge said:


> First thing to note is that you should take note of the higher air pressure as being "OK". I.e the 65psi. For that ride, it was obviously needed which supercedes the 55psi (unless it was a different trail?)
> 
> If you stand over the bike and give a few really hard compressions, what % travel is used? Unless you are running a shitload of tokens, 40% is a really good marker. What I'm wondering here is whether you can compress more than 40% and in fact you need even more air. You must sort the air out first and then worry about the rest. Reply back with what you can compress %-wise.


I did the test last night. I get 70mm of 170mm so almost exactly 40%. That's at 55psi. (I did it a couple of time just to verify and it was consistent)


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## jdang307 (May 30, 2015)

2015 Santa Cruz Bronson, Manitou Mcleod with king can full volume. I'm 135 naked on a scale. Just did the calibration and I get:

2.3 CR
71.7 baseline (it was 75 when I started it and somehow it lost 3 psi lol)
3% shock travel.

Did I do this right or did I screw it up?


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## Rock Climber (Jul 25, 2007)

Anybody have thoughts on the fork issue while climbing? Am I not riding out of the saddle hard enough? Am I too smooth of a climber


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

I also have a question regarding calibration. 

Doing calibration on a FOX DPX2 shock. At some point he tells me to inflate the shock to the manufacturers pressure (i opt with about 200 psi). The next step he says go through 3-5 extensions/50% compressions into the travel. When i complete this, the air pressure will always drop about 20 psi (to about 180 psi). 
Is this normal? 
Cheers


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## Shartist (Aug 15, 2018)

freyrida said:


> I also have a question regarding calibration.
> 
> Doing calibration on a FOX DPX2 shock. At some point he tells me to inflate the shock to the manufacturers pressure (i opt with about 200 psi). The next step he says go through 3-5 extensions/50% compressions into the travel. When i complete this, the air pressure will always drop about 20 psi (to about 180 psi).
> Is this normal?
> Cheers


It's because you aren't equalizing the positive and negative chambers during your initial inflation of the shock. While pressuring up initially, cycle the shock a few times every 20ish psig. Do this every time you need to pressure up your shock, shockwhiz or not


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

Ah, Cheers, cool - Thanks!!


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## davidsthubbins (Dec 14, 2009)

Basic adjustment question. If the slider is to the left of center I assume you do whatever the suggestion on the left says? Or do you do the suggestion on the right to “pull” the slider in the direction it needs to go?


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

davidsthubbins said:


> Basic adjustment question. If the slider is to the left of center I assume you do whatever the suggestion on the left says? Or do you do the suggestion on the right to "pull" the slider in the direction it needs to go?


Your first assumption is correct. If the slider is on the left, do the left suggestion.


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## olao (Aug 17, 2017)

Manitou MARS Air is not listed as incompatible by Shockwiz, but isn't it? The combination of coil acting on the air piston ought to make the compression ratio in the air chamber vary during compression. Or am I thinking this wrong? Has anyone succeeded in setting up a MARS fork with the shockwiz?


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

Is there any sort of compression ratio database out there? It would be nice to compare readings against type of shock for sanity checks.

I just got a brand new Factory 34 (haven't even ridden it yet), hooked up the wiz, and did a calibration.

The first weird thing was that the fork sucked down hard as I let the air out. I damn near gave myself a hernia pulling the fork to full extension when so instructed in the calibration routine. That time I got a compression ratio of 2.1

That didn't sit right with me, and this morning I decided to redo it. This time when I let the air out, the fork did not suck down. I ran through calibration again, much easier and got a compression ratio of 2.6

I let the air out again, and it sucked down like the first time. I pumped it back up about halfway, cycled the fork a few times, then let the air out one last time and it was ok. I ran the calibration for a third time and got a compression ratio of 2.5

I suspect that fork has some kind of valved chamber that needs to be equalized to prevent the suck down. Is there anything I should do beyond cycling the fork a few times as I let the air out?

I'll probably run the cal one more time to see if I can match 2.5 or 2.6, but it would be nice to know if there's a better way to do this.


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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

Hillridge said:


> Is there any sort of compression ratio database out there? It would be nice to compare readings against type of shock for sanity checks.
> 
> I just got a brand new Factory 34 (haven't even ridden it yet), hooked up the wiz, and did a calibration.
> 
> ...


To prevent suckdown, let air out of the shock or fork slowly using a shock pump. If you let it out too quickly, then you'll get a vacuum in the negative air chamber that will cause suckdown. If it happens again, fill the positive up again, then slowly let the air out and pull it to full extension ever 15-20psi drop.

As for compression ratios, I've found a ~.1 variance in the calibration ratio to be fairly normal. That said, your ratio will vary depending on how many tokens are in the fork, which is why you need to re-calibrate if you change the volume of an air chamber.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Hillridge said:


> Is there any sort of compression ratio database out there? It would be nice to compare readings against type of shock for sanity checks.
> 
> I just got a brand new Factory 34 (haven't even ridden it yet), hooked up the wiz, and did a calibration.
> 
> ...


You need to advise of your fork size. is it 29?27.5? 140mm, 150mm, 160mm??

If it helps, I have a 29 Fox Float Perf Elite 140mm. With no tokens, 2 and 3; I get CRs of 2.2, 2.7 and 2.9 respectively via Shockwiz.

Just make sure you initially let air out slowly AND you replace the valve cap so that's on during the initial calibration process. Leave it off and you will get incorrect readings.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

29, 140mm, and I think it came with 2 tokens in it (haven't opened it to check).
I did 3 sessions during a ride tonight and got mostly comparable results.
#1: Yellow Remove air, Yellow add a spacer, rebounds ok, yellow make softer for both compressions

#2: first 4 all green, red make softer HSC, yellow make softer LSC

#3: Same as #1, but air pressure is green and make softer HSC is red

Scores of 86-88 in playful style for all 3, so I'm decently close.

The trail was very rocky and rooty with plenty of climbs and downs. Only a couple jumps/drops of any size so no real data on big hits. I think I'll ride a few more before changing anything.

Still felt miles better than my old broken fork!


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Hillridge said:


> 29, 140mm, and I think it came with 2 tokens in it (haven't opened it to check).
> I did 3 sessions during a ride tonight and got mostly comparable results.
> #1: Yellow Remove air, Yellow add a spacer, rebounds ok, yellow make softer for both compressions
> 
> ...


Then a CR of 2.7 is what I got for your exact setup.


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## jdang307 (May 30, 2015)

Shockwiz on a bronson v1 with manitou mcleod (mid-king can).

I had the PSI set at 80 psi. Lots of pedal strikes, bike wasn't acting all that well as it sat in the travel big time. Shockwiz said pressure was good. In fact said everything was good. But Lots of bobbing. Added 10 psi. A lot better, still some pedal strikes on very small obstacles, blew through mid stroke a little. But more supportive. Now shockwiz says pressure is still good, just speed up the rebound a little. 

Wondering why such a large window for pressure being good. I can set air spring on my own and really want the wiz for telling me about rebound but now I'm not as confident in it. What am I missing?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

What level of confidence is it displaying for the first assessment? Also, what style are you viewing on shockwiz. It sounds maybe more on the playful side. I find better answers for me anyway with more neutral /active in the style settings.


jdang307 said:


> Shockwiz on a bronson v1 with manitou mcleod (mid-king can).
> 
> I had the PSI set at 80 psi. Lots of pedal strikes, bike wasn't acting all that well as it sat in the travel big time. Shockwiz said pressure was good. In fact said everything was good. But Lots of bobbing. Added 10 psi. A lot better, still some pedal strikes on very small obstacles, blew through mid stroke a little. But more supportive. Now shockwiz says pressure is still good, just speed up the rebound a little.
> 
> Wondering why such a large window for pressure being good. I can set air spring on my own and really want the wiz for telling me about rebound but now I'm not as confident in it. What am I missing?


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## jdang307 (May 30, 2015)

It said 99% and I'm in balanced mode.


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## Hillridge (Jan 22, 2010)

I've been riding a lot of different terrain without changing much to see how the results vary. One thing that remains fairly consistent is a suggestion to make High Speed Compression MUCH softer (red indicator all the way left). I'm running a Fox Factory 34 and all testing has been with compression dampening full off (blue dial all the way counter clockwise). Is there anything else I can do to address this, or do I just ignore it as something I can't change?

Other than that, the only regular suggestion I get is to add a spacer. I already added one (for a total of 3) and am reluctant to add another, but may try it our just to see what the results are. It rides really nice, though that's not saying much as my old fork was a 2013 CTD, which were notorious pieces of crap.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Hillridge said:


> I've been riding a lot of different terrain without changing much to see how the results vary. One thing that remains fairly consistent is a suggestion to make High Speed Compression MUCH softer (red indicator all the way left). I'm running a Fox Factory 34 and all testing has been with compression dampening full off (blue dial all the way counter clockwise). Is there anything else I can do to address this, or do I just ignore it as something I can't change?
> 
> Other than that, the only regular suggestion I get is to add a spacer. I already added one (for a total of 3) and am reluctant to add another, but may try it our just to see what the results are. It rides really nice, though that's not saying much as my old fork was a 2013 CTD, which were notorious pieces of crap.


You cant change high-speed compression on your fork, like mine. So ignore.


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## SimonNewbMechanic (Nov 1, 2018)

Hi guys, is anyone aware of a chart that shoes the compression ratio for fox x2 shocks vs spacers ? 

I have an sb150, haven’t opened the air sleeve yet but I hear it comes stock with 2 spacers. ShockWiz calibration gives me about 2.2-2.1 but I find the sag value measured a bit high so I was wondering what the actual ratio was 

Thanks !


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

SimonNewbMechanic said:


> Hi guys, is anyone aware of a chart that shoes the compression ratio for fox x2 shocks vs spacers ?
> 
> I have an sb150, haven't opened the air sleeve yet but I hear it comes stock with 2 spacers. ShockWiz calibration gives me about 2.2-2.1 but I find the sag value measured a bit high so I was wondering what the actual ratio was
> 
> Thanks !


hmmm, can't find an exact page but this may help if you have a gander

https://forums.mtbr.com/ibis/ripmo-...d-dpx2-fit4-settings-welcome-too-1091721.html


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

Does a CR of 1.8 seem weird for a 2020 29 Fox 34 Factory 130mm fork? I had it calibrated using the wizard multiple times and it seems to always arrive at this value.

The fork was valved for my 140lbs weight before and is running 2 volume spacers instead of the stock configuration of 3.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

Rivers2648 said:


> Does a CR of 1.8 seem weird for a 2020 29 Fox 34 Factory 130mm fork? I had it calibrated using the wizard multiple times and it seems to always arrive at this value.
> 
> The fork was valved for my 140lbs weight before and is running 2 volume spacers instead of the stock configuration of 3.


Yes that is way too low. it should be in the 2.5-2.7 range.
Try doing the calibration with 5-10psi in the fork.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Rivers2648 said:


> Does a CR of 1.8 seem weird for a 2020 29 Fox 34 Factory 130mm fork? I had it calibrated using the wizard multiple times and it seems to always arrive at this value.
> 
> The fork was valved for my 140lbs weight before and is running 2 volume spacers instead of the stock configuration of 3.


From Quarq:

"The compression ratio is incorrect. To check the accuracy of the compression ratio, go to the Home page of the app to view the Shock Travel percentage. Verify that the measured sag (measured via the o-ring on the stanchion) matches the reported Shock Travel percentage within the app. If there is a significant difference it indicates the compression ratio is not correct."


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Rivers2648 said:


> Does a CR of 1.8 seem weird for a 2020 29 Fox 34 Factory 130mm fork? I had it calibrated using the wizard multiple times and it seems to always arrive at this value.
> 
> The fork was valved for my 140lbs weight before and is running 2 volume spacers instead of the stock configuration of 3.


When you are initially going thru calibration, do you definitely have the Shrader cap screwed in on the Shockwiz?


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## SimonNewbMechanic (Nov 1, 2018)

I added an extra spacer (the sb 150 has 2 stock) for a total of 3 and measured the sag with caliper and adjusted the CR until the sag reading on the shockwiz read correctly. The number I got was 2.5


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

rstark18 said:


> From Quarq:
> 
> "The compression ratio is incorrect. To check the accuracy of the compression ratio, go to the Home page of the app to view the Shock Travel percentage. Verify that the measured sag (measured via the o-ring on the stanchion) matches the reported Shock Travel percentage within the app. If there is a significant difference it indicates the compression ratio is not correct."


When I have the bike standing up without any rider weight, shock travel is at 0%.


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

lucifuge said:


> When you are initially going thru calibration, do you definitely have the Shrader cap screwed in on the Shockwiz?


I have the Shrader cap off since the first part of the calibration is to release all air from the fork.


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

SimonNewbMechanic said:


> I added an extra spacer (the sb 150 has 2 stock) for a total of 3 and measured the sag with caliper and adjusted the CR until the sag reading on the shockwiz read correctly. The number I got was 2.5


What CR number were you getting when you had 2 volume spacers in there?


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## SimonNewbMechanic (Nov 1, 2018)

The cal wizard measured 2.1-2.2 but I didn’t measure it with a caliper, I think the real number might be a bit higher than that


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## root_0x54 (Jul 15, 2019)

Hi, new user here. I have tried to look around but didn't find answer. So here I am.
After first ride Shockwiz on fork showed all suggestions green except LSC (that was yellow). Confidence was 100%. So I have added two clicks of LCS +. And started new session.
I was on ride yesterday, it was longer ride but terrain conditions remained pretty much the same. 
First half of ride(~90 min) it was mostly uphill, only one time short downhill section with only rock garden. No jumps or drops. When I was resting I checked on mobile and saw what I uploaded. I had 100% confidence and suggestions made. I left it like that didn't change anything on the fork. 
Second half or ride started where I had fast descends, jumps, drop, roots everything. When I came home I had the same result, same suggestions as in first half of the ride.
Finally my question. During the ride when you reach 100% confidence, does the Shockwiz takes into consideration terrain which comes after you reach 100% confidence? Does it make suggestions from it even you reach 100% confidence? Maybe stupid question, but it looks to me that after you reach 100% confidence Shockwiz doesn't care anymore what you ride until you reset it with start new session. I might be wrong.

Thanks.

Martin


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## SpeshulEd (Oct 29, 2013)

It should continue to update as you continue to ride. I do believe it reaches a point where it starts to dump old data tho.

One thing, I always reset mine when I ride on the road to a trail or do a lot of hike-a-bike. Not sure if it matters that much, but it seems like those might throw out some false positives/negatives.


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## petercarm (Nov 5, 2007)

SpeshulEd said:


> It should continue to update as you continue to ride. I do believe it reaches a point where it starts to dump old data tho.


The Shockwiz does not remember individual data samples; it does a statistical assessment of new data compared against the most likely proposition derived from past observations. Does this new data agree with the old data? Yes? ... confidence increases. No? ... confidence data is adjusted and possibly presents a new proposition. If the method is what I think it is (Bayes theorem) it never reaches 100% and the math allows for new observations to always revise propositions. But the math also shouldn't tell you something is nigh-on 100% likely and then find a sufficient number of observations to materially disagree with the established proposition unless the data is unusually screwy.

But this is a product. An academically pure implementation of an algorithm might not have been deemed appropriate for a "product", so the software may have arbitrary rules to massage the presentation and make it consumer friendly. e.g. if the math says >90%, then present it as 100% because 9 times out of 10 it is the right thing to do. This doesn't make Shockwiz less clever. It makes it thoroughly appropriate as a consumer product.

Some observations (dynamic sag%) do get continually revised but they are the special case.



> One thing, I always reset mine when I ride on the road to a trail or do a lot of hike-a-bike. Not sure if it matters that much, but it seems like those might throw out some false positives/negatives.


I think this is right. Learning algorithms can be thrown off by a mass of unrepresentative data if they have no way of telling that the data is unrepresentative. FWIW, I reset for short sessions consisting of single race runs (enduro stages). Confidence may not reach 100% but I look for consensus across multiple runs agreeing with what my ride feedback is telling me before I change anything.


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## root_0x54 (Jul 15, 2019)

Thanks for detailed answers. Couple of more questions;

From Shokwiz manual "Riding with Shockwiz" page 61,
3. Do not lock the suspension out, and do not adjust threshold, or pedal platform, during the Session.

Does that mean, even I have Shockwiz installed on fork, do I need to have rear shock in open mode (no pedal) even when I'm climbing steep hill? Or the above point is talking only about fork/shock on which you have Shockwiz isntalled?

Second. If I have to deflate air from fork/shock 5%, do I take 5% from Baseline Pressure I can see in Shockwiz application or from pressure I have inflate fork/shock with during calibration set up?


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

No need to calibrate after reducing or adding air. Just unweight bike and click reset baseline air.

When tuning fork, changing rear shock from open to pedal shouldn't effect your tune much. Atleast not from my experience. Someone will tell me I'm wrong though.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Also I might add that I don't even bother calibrating the shock wiz anymore. I could care less about what it gives as static and dynamic sag since I know how to measure an o ring. I've gotten the same results with just setting baseline air pressure as when I did the full deflate inflate deal. We all can look at the o ring and measure sag and see how much travel we are using. 

Also shockwiz will generally give a same score if you like less pressure and more token (creates dive) vs less tokens and more air pressure (less supple on small bump but more controlled on steep stuff and at speed)

Also what it doesn't do, is balance front and rear. So make sure to hop up and down on your bike and it should feel even front and back. Should not feel front or rear squat more than the other.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

I must say that even when I get a calibration done, the rebound to me is always slightly derived to be too slow.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Why do you think your rebound is too slow? Do you notice packing or harshness? 

Alot of people left to their own devices usually run it too fast, because it makes the bike feel more "Poppy and playful"


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Got a ShockWiz for my birthday, used it in my XC bike, then moved it my enduro bike, really appreciate the results, made some changes and both bikes ride better. Though, with the Fix36 Fit4 I ended up zeroed out on everything, wierd, but unthinkable that’s the problem with the FIT4 damper; I’m 200#.

One thing I did to make trail side swaps easier was to junk the zip ties and pull some narrow Velcro straps (used for fenders) through the holes, now it’s a quick swap front to rear or share with a friend.


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## mtnbkrmike (Mar 26, 2015)

Nurse Ben said:


> Got a ShockWiz for my birthday, used it in my XC bike, then moved it my enduro bike, really appreciate the results, made some changes and both bikes ride better. Though, with the Fix36 Fit4 I ended up zeroed out on everything, wierd, but unthinkable that's the problem with the FIT4 damper; I'm 200#.
> 
> One thing I did to make trail side swaps easier was to junk the zip ties and pull some narrow Velcro straps (used for fenders) through the holes, now it's a quick swap front to rear or share with a friend.


I borrowed 2 ShokWizes from my LBS to set up my Druid. I have a 36 Fit4 on it as well. 185 out of the shower.

I hate tokens/spacers. I removed all but 1 (my 36 is 150mm). 72.5 psi. 7 clicks of rebound. LSC 5 from open. Works well, although the problem was that when I got around to working on my fork, we had **** weather and I had to dial my speed way back on the trail. I suspect riding normally I should be closer to 75 psi, 5 clicks of rebound and 5 clicks of LSC.

Fortunately I got my shock DIALLED before the **** weather hit (DPX2). My God is it dialled. It's like cheating blasting through square edged hits. All this from 130mm.

PS - great idea using velcro straps. The zip ties are a complete PITA.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

Just got my shockwiz this week and got 2 rides in with it. Before I mess everything up, I have some questions for you guys:
- Do I do my typical 3hr ride with a large variety of trails, or do I tune to the most demanding trail as suggested? A "trail" where I ride is only like 1/2 - 3 miles long. 
- Do I remove ALL damping when starting out...similar to standard tuning methods. Tune air spring, then LSR, then HSR, then LSC, and finally HSC in that order. Or do I keep the settings I have right now, and tune from there.
- I did a slow flat pedally ride yesterday and it asked me to add air. I added 3 PSI, and felt kinda stiff today and dynamic sag is only 8%. SW says that air pressure is OK after todays ride, and asking me to add a token. Todays ride was more like my typical ride. Still pedally because I live in Florida, but riding more aggressive trails and faster. I like a firm fork, but felt a bit beat up today. Should I just keep moving forward with suggestions, or take the pressure back down to 95. The 3 PSI were very noticable on my fork 2020 Fox SC 120. I am not a fan of this fork, and its the main reason I got the SW. Hoping I can make it feel better. Just seems harsh. With my Pikes on other bikes, even if I haven't tuned them, they feel better than this.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

- I generally try to find a section that has a good mix of terrain and use that to get my data. I then make an adjustment and repeat that section and repeat. 2 miles is generally enough to get a high confidence score. 
-No need to remove all damping. Leave it where it is and adjust from there.
-I would set air pressure to get you the right static sag and disregard dynamic sag. 

Also Fox is notorious for having too much grease from factory in the negative chamber of the air piston. Might be worth doing a lower service, pull out the piston and clean off excess grease. That helped on my 34, quite a bit.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Quick side not, the Fox tuning guide almost was dead on for my weight for air pressure and rebound. Ended up with a few more clicks of low speed compression and 2 volume spacers vs 3 that came installed.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

Kamkam said:


> - I generally try to find a section that has a good mix of terrain and use that to get my data. I then make an adjustment and repeat that section and repeat. 2 miles is generally enough to get a high confidence score.
> -No need to remove all damping. Leave it where it is and adjust from there.
> -I would set air pressure to get you the right static sag and disregard dynamic sag.
> 
> Also Fox is notorious for having too much grease from factory in the negative chamber of the air piston. Might be worth doing a lower service, pull out the piston and clean off excess grease. That helped on my 34, quite a bit.





Kamkam said:


> Quick side not, the Fox tuning guide almost was dead on for my weight for air pressure and rebound. Ended up with a few more clicks of low speed compression and 2 volume spacers vs 3 that came installed.


Thanks for the pointers!

After the second ride on the fork I took it apart and removed all the excess grease. I took out all the volume spacers and increased the air pressure because it had zero midstroke support the way it came from factory. I'm running the higher end of pressure (95 PSI @ 190 lbs), Zero Spacers, 4 clicks from OPEN of rebound, and 8 clicks from OPEN of LSC.

I added 3 PSI air based on first SW ride suggestions, but plan on taking it back down to 95 and adding the recommended spacer. It will be a much faster process knowing I don't need to ride 15 miles to get a good reading.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I've been playing with my Shockwiz for a few weeks now, two different bikes, just forks so far. It is fun to see how a suggested change impacts ride quality. I wouldn't say it's the "fix" for a poorly functioning suspension as sometimes it just points out the defects in a damping system. for example, I knew the Fit4 sucked, but when it cannot be adjusted to address the Shockwiz suggestions, you know it's a problem.

I don't think I'd rent one, for $50 and a weekend you will not get anything worthwhile.

It's worth buying and sharing with friends 

Protip: Get some skinny velcro strips like what you'd use to attach a fender, thread it through the holes in the Shockwiz, then you can swap bikes or swap ends mid ride.


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## floatingkiwi (May 11, 2006)

Nurse Ben said:


> I've been playing with my Shockwiz for a few weeks now, two different bikes, just forks so far. It is fun to see how a suggested change impacts ride quality. I wouldn't say it's the "fix" for a poorly functioning suspension as sometimes it just points out the defects in a damping system. for example, I knew the Fit4 sucked, but when it cannot be adjusted to address the Shockwiz suggestions, you know it's a problem.
> 
> I don't think I'd rent one, for $50 and a weekend you will not get anything worthwhile.
> 
> ...


Thats why the Fractive tune made such a difference for me. I can actually tune the Fit4 to what I need now and it feels so much better than the factory shim stack ever did. 75kg ready to ride.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Has anyone got a CR measurement for a 160mm Lyrik with 2 tokens and a Luftkappe?


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## JimF777 (Sep 23, 2018)

I just secured a rental of two units for my Tahoe trip next week. Looking forward to seeing what it can do for my set up!


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## Marc2211 (Aug 6, 2013)

I have an interesting puzzle on my Lyrik 2018 RC that came on my YT Capra.

I followed instructions on the shockwiz, removing air, tokens, making changes etc. It also had a debonair fitted. It's now at around '95%' according to the app. The one change it recommends is removing 2 clicks of LSC... But I'm already at 0.

Bike feels great, no complaints from me, so I've left alone... But wondering what others would do in this position?


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Don't get too caught up in trying to get 100% on the shock wiz. It is a tool but not an end all be all for setup, and sometimes points you in the wrong direction. I have set up a few bikes with mine now and sometimes the best you can get his high 80s. Don't stress if you are maxed out on LSC.

I will give an example. On my 19 Lyrik on a pole evolink, have a 92 score. But in reality my bike performs better 2 clicks faster rebound than it suggests and lowers the score. 

Also the shockwiz is dumb. Sometimes it will tell you HSC is too high if you actually have too high pressure or too many volume spacers and its not using enough travel. The reduce LSC might be due to stiction? When was the last lower service on your fork done?

The more important thing is how the bike feels. For most riders the shockwiz will put you in a good spot not to blame bike setup on riding performance.


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## JimF777 (Sep 23, 2018)

Kamkam said:


> Don't get too caught up in trying to get 100% on the shock wiz. It is a tool but not an end all be all for setup...


I think this will be the perfect fine print for it. I'm noticing that I am riding harder down the same chunky trails, getting down faster, and using less fork travel. Point is, as the rider progresses, things will need adjustments too.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Kamkam said:


> Don't get too caught up in trying to get 100% on the shock wiz. It is a tool but not an end all be all for setup, and sometimes points you in the wrong direction. I have set up a few bikes with mine now and sometimes the best you can get his high 80s. Don't stress if you are maxed out on LSC.
> 
> I will give an example. On my 19 Lyrik on a pole evolink, have a 92 score. But in reality my bike performs better 2 clicks faster rebound than it suggests and lowers the score.
> 
> ...


FYI, this is why you always start at the top of the adjustments and go down. So that air and air volume gets adjusted first as they impact the valving results.

It's a great tool imo but if course it has limitations. My wife rides too softly so SW tells me to keep softening compression up and reduce air pressure, too the point where she has way too much sag and everything is turned all of the way out. Still though, it really helped me identify not nearly enough rebound control where my wife would not have known better.

For me, I get nearly 100% with Avy tuning and just a few small adjustments. And truly I've never had such well working suspension. My friend who rides very well who is also large and goes big, was straight green across the board with no changes at all dead stock on SW, at both ends on a new SB130 with stock Fox suspension. Go figure.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Suns_PSD said:


> FYI, this is why you always start at the top of the adjustments and go down. So that air and air volume gets adjusted first as they impact the valving results.


Yes I am aware you start with air and volume adjustments first. But the shockwiz will have a large window for acceptable air and volume spacers. It gave the same score for 3 volume spacers and 75psi as one spacer and 90 psi in a fork.

The three spacers and less air had crap for mid stroke support and it suggested less HSC. The one spacer and more air had same score for air and spacers yet was good on HSC.

The shockwiz was great for letting me play around with settings and find what works for me and my riding. I am not discounting the value by any means. Great tool to get you to the ball park and allows you to mess with everything while giving you a means to get back if you stray too far. It gave me the confidence to play around with settings and understand how each adjustment translates to the trail. It definitely cuts down on tuning time.

I just don't think people should be focused on getting 100% on it. For instance my Fox 34 I usually get 92% and it feels great. I can not get higher if I wanted to. My lyric got 92% but, I prefer 2 clicks faster rebound on the trail with a couple clicks less lsc. That puts me at 88% but the bike handles better according to feel and strava.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

So been messing with my SW for a few weeks, and I think I must be doing something wrong. I thought this tool would save time setting up my suspension, but I'm 3 weeks/rides in (only able to ride 3-4 hrs once a week) and can't make it past air setup.

What confidence do you guys look for? It takes me 2 hrs of riding to get high confidence, so its almost like I can only make one adjustment per ride (which is per week for me).

I thought I was close with my setup and got the SW just to fine tune, but suggestions seem to be all over the place. Like today, I was at a 96 score after a demanding short 2-3 mile loop, but confidence was at like 60. Rode a bit longer to get confidence up on more mellow trails, and now it wants me to add more tokens and slow down my rebound.

I got a Fox SC 34 and it feels like garbage with a bunch of tokens. I added one based on last ride's, but don't want to add anymore because mid stroke support disappears. 

Do I just ignore the add more tokens suggestion?

Do I disregard the confidence rating? Just ride a demanding 2-3 mile loop and tune to that.

Do I tune to most demanding trail ridden the hardest, or more typical trail?

What do you do when you move onto the next suggestion, but then you ride and it wants you to adjust air or ramp again?

I'm kinda bummed that in 10 hrs of riding my fork doesn't feel any better than it did before. That's why I think I must be using this tool wrong.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

I would just use it on the most demanding sections of trail assuming you get the same suggestions each time and disregard confidence score. 

The data over writes itself and mellow trails use slower rebound damping than rougher trails.

Controversial to some but I am a firm believer in using the least amount of volume spacers and more air pressure. At 200lbs in kit I used only one spacer in my fox 34 and two if I went to the bike park. Every one is stoked on coils for their linear spring rate, yet jam all the volume spacers to get weak mid stroke and super progressive end stroke in an air fork. As long as you have a decent static sag and not bottoming out frequently, disregard token suggestion.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

Kamkam said:


> I would just use it on the most demanding sections of trail assuming you get the same suggestions each time and disregard confidence score.
> 
> The data over writes itself and mellow trails use slower rebound damping than rougher trails.
> 
> Controversial to some but I am a firm believer in using the least amount of volume spacers and more air pressure. At 200lbs in kit I used only one spacer in my fox 34 and two if I went to the bike park. Every one is stoked on coils for their linear spring rate, yet jam all the volume spacers to get weak mid stroke and super progressive end stroke in an air fork. As long as you have a decent static sag and not bottoming out frequently, disregard token suggestion.


Thanks for the help. I am of the same mentality about volume spacers. The only reason I added one is I was bottoming out and it felt harsh when I tried adding more air. I'll disregard confidence and tune to smaller 2-3 miles section of trail


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## alfanut (Jun 4, 2011)

First sorry for the English .... google.

Does anyone know if the Suntour Auron RC2 is compatible?
The calibration gives error if I remove all the air at start, if I leave even if it is only 1psi if the calibration advances to the end.

Thank you


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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

alfanut said:


> First sorry for the English .... google.
> 
> Does anyone know if the Suntour Auron RC2 is compatible?
> The calibration gives error if I remove all the air at start, if I leave even if it is only 1psi if the calibration advances to the end.
> ...


Yes, it will work, I had one on mine for a while.

The challenge with the Auron and any fork with a coil negative is that you have to overcome the pressure from the negative spring to calibrate. Normally, on other air forks, that spring auto equalizes with air or you have some other adjustment that's similar. What I did, and I confirmed with SRAM that this was fine, is add about 30-40 psi to the main (the amount required will depend on the negative spring rate installed), which allowed me to easily pull the fork up for the calibration process, but wasn't so much that I couldn't compress it fully.

I can't say why it's advancing the calibration process with only 1psi, you should be able to have some air in there and calibrate all the same, according to SRAM. I think the calibration process is just a ratio calculated from full compression and top out, indicating x/psi of change represents y % of travel change. Having air in there won't change that calculation as long as you don't let any out or add any during the process. You can add air once the process is completed, of course


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## alfanut (Jun 4, 2011)

Adodero said:


> Yes, it will work, I had one on mine for a while.
> 
> The challenge with the Auron and any fork with a coil negative is that you have to overcome the pressure from the negative spring to calibrate. Normally, on other air forks, that spring auto equalizes with air or you have some other adjustment that's similar. What I did, and I confirmed with SRAM that this was fine, is add about 30-40 psi to the main (the amount required will depend on the negative spring rate installed), which allowed me to easily pull the fork up for the calibration process, but wasn't so much that I couldn't compress it fully.
> 
> I can't say why it's advancing the calibration process with only 1psi, you should be able to have some air in there and calibrate all the same, according to SRAM. I think the calibration process is just a ratio calculated from full compression and top out, indicating x/psi of change represents y % of travel change. Having air in there won't change that calculation as long as you don't let any out or add any during the process. You can add air once the process is completed, of course


Thank you!!


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## das recht (Apr 22, 2008)

I am running into a weird issue with my Shockwiz on my sb150 (shock). I weigh 245lbs and, according to the yeti setup guide, I should be running ~252psi (with compression damping). 

Yet, the shockwiz keeps telling me to add air (285psi, ~15% static sag) and reduce compression damping. Not surprisingly, on a recent downhill run, I had 24 deep compression events. And, more surprisingly, despite the high pressure, my "dynamic sag" is supposedly >40%. 

Any idea what is going on with the shockwiz? This applies to various soft/neutral and poppy/active targets.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Seems like the yeti setup guide would be off as well if you are running 30psi more and bottoming out.

Do you have any volume spacers installed? At your weight you will likely need to install a few. A basic starting point should be what ever pressure and spacers required to get the correct sag and not bottom out then you can start tuning. 

Also be aware that you are quite a bit above the weight of most suspension is designed for. You may need to have custom dampers.


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## das recht (Apr 22, 2008)

Kamkam said:


> Seems like the yeti setup guide would be off as well if you are running 30psi more and bottoming out.
> 
> Do you have any volume spacers installed? At your weight you will likely need to install a few. A basic starting point should be what ever pressure and spacers required to get the correct sag and not bottom out then you can start tuning.
> 
> Also be aware that you are quite a bit above the weight of most suspension is designed for. You may need to have custom dampers.


I am suspecting that the shockwiz is not well set up for heavier riders (rather than the Yeti setup). By suggesting almost no compression damping, it wants me to rely almost solely on the air spring for damping. 
As a result, I am blowing through the travel (even just pedaling) and have extremely low sag. Has anyone else encountered this issue with heavier riders and shockwiz?


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Set air spring first. The readings are not accurate at this point. What we do know is you are bottoming out consistently with 15% sag. Add volume spacers and set air pressure to get the 30ish percent sag and not bottom out first. Then you play with compression and rebound.


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## JimF777 (Sep 23, 2018)

I just calibrated the units on the forks and shock. With the bike sitting on its own, if not fully extended very close, the app says the fork is at 53% of fork travel.

Is this normal?


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

yes, if you didn't set baseline air pressure after adding air. 

Simple fix. Lift up bike and click on the shock travel and select reset baseline air pressure. Should read 0% plus or minus a percent at full extension.

Make sure to cycle suspension a few times after adding air to equalize the positive and negative chambers.

Note: when bike is sitting under its own weight it will likely sag a couple of percent based on the bikes weight and the negative volume. My lyric sits at 5-7% under just the bike weight.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Rivers2648 said:


> I have the Shrader cap off since the first part of the calibration is to release all air from the fork.


Yes, you initially need to take it off. But you need to put it back on when you go through the extension/compression calibration.


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## JimF777 (Sep 23, 2018)

Kamkam said:


> yes, if you didn't set baseline air pressure after adding air.
> 
> Simple fix. Lift up bike and click on the shock travel and select reset baseline air pressure. Should read 0% plus or minus a percent at full extension.
> 
> ...


THANKS!
Going out in the garage to try it now. Hitting the Sierras starting tomorrow and hoping to get some direction out of these.


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## alfanut (Jun 4, 2011)

Hello again ... I can't find an answer to a question ... when the shockwiz starts, the LED is red, it turns green, but several times on the road it turns red, is it logical? Thank you.


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## barefootdan (Oct 6, 2008)

Does anyone have a Wiz laying around that they would be willing to let a stranger borrow for a week? I sold mine when I went full coil but just picked up a trail bike that I need to tune. I'd be willing to pay for all shipping costs and toss in a few extra bucks for your time!


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## Granda (May 6, 2018)

I dont think so, sounds like the unit needs re-calibrating, possible due to an air leak.



alfanut said:


> Hello again ... I can't find an answer to a question ... when the shockwiz starts, the LED is red, it turns green, but several times on the road it turns red, is it logical? Thank you.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

So need a little help with tuning via Shockwiz.

Bike info: 
- 2019 GG The Smash Size 3
- 2018 RS Lyrik RC 160mm w/ Charger2 recently did lower service and added PUSH wipers 
- Rider weight 190-195 fully kitted

















Problem is I am running LSC/HSC fully open with 1 token. Not sure what to do to soften up LSC/HSC.


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## s-master (May 15, 2018)

I am not an expert on shockwiz, but you are asking how to soften it up and it is telling you, that you have to make it firmer. What am I missing?


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## BCBlur (Nov 23, 2004)

Also, work top to bottom. So address the rebound settings first


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Shartist (Aug 15, 2018)

s-master said:


> I am not an expert on shockwiz, but you are asking how to soften it up and it is telling you, that you have to make it firmer. What am I missing?


^agreed. What s-master is saying is that you have the compression backed all the way out (counterclockwise) providing the least damping and shockwhiz is saying to increase damping to make it firmer by turning the hsc/ lsc clockwise to increase damping to make it firmer.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

Ok wait... so have I been doing this backwards? 
For the rebound...since the line is on the "Slower" side of middle (so 1-click to the right of center "ok") then do I need to speed it up or slow it down? 
I have been interpreting it, in this case, that I need to Speed up the Rebound to bring it closer to center, but from what I am understanding you guys say I need to do the inverse of that????


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## cheezwhip (Aug 6, 2004)

gregnash said:


> Ok wait... so have I been doing this backwards?
> For the rebound...since the line is on the "Slower" side of middle (so 1-click to the right of center "ok") then do I need to speed it up or slow it down?
> I have been interpreting it, in this case, that I need to Speed up the Rebound to bring it closer to center, but from what I am understanding you guys say I need to do the inverse of that????


More Turtle


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

cheezwhip said:


> More Turtle


Ok so inverse of what I was originally thinking. Will go out for a short ride tonight and make adjustments.


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## Shartist (Aug 15, 2018)

gregnash said:


> Ok wait... so have I been doing this backwards?
> For the rebound...since the line is on the "Slower" side of middle (so 1-click to the right of center "ok") then do I need to speed it up or slow it down?
> I have been interpreting it, in this case, that I need to Speed up the Rebound to bring it closer to center, but from what I am understanding you guys say I need to do the inverse of that????


It's probably easier to think about what is physically going on when you turn a knob. The following is an oversimplified explanation of the damper's contribution only.

Oversimplified explanation 
Rebound is how fast the shock returns from compression and is controlled by how fast oil is allowed to move back down through the piston in the damper following a compression event. Adding rebound damping (clockwise turns) restricts the flow and slows down how fast the shock springs back after the compression event.

Compression is how easily the shock is allowed to use its travel and in the damper is controlled by how easily the oil is allowed to move past the damper piston as it is compressed downward and the oil is forced up through the damper piston. Turning your dial clockwise adds compression damping making it harder for that oil to flow through up the piston as the shock is compressed providing support.

In either case adding damping (clockwise), resists (slows down) the effect of its namesake while opening makes it easier for compression or rebound to occur.

The above is a oversimplified way of illustrating the concept and does not take a lot of the shock / damper architecture, function, and additional flow circuitry into account. It's just a way of explaining the concept of damping using a piston because it was convenient.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

Shartist said:


> It's probably easier to think about what is physically going on when you turn a knob. The following is an oversimplified explanation of the damper's contribution only.
> 
> Oversimplified explanation
> Rebound is how fast the shock returns from compression and is controlled by how fast oil is allowed to move back down through the piston in the damper following a compression event. Adding rebound damping (clockwise turns) restricts the flow and slows down how fast the shock springs back after the compression event.
> ...


Correct, I get that but was confused as to why the ShockWiz is telling me I need "faster" rebound (moving towards the middle where OK is) and when I have done so nothing happens (yellow usually means 1-2 clicks). But from what the above is saying, I need to actually slow down the (turtle) the rebound, which would be the inverse of what it is saying.


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## Huliblus (Jun 23, 2019)

gregnash said:


> So need a little help with tuning via Shockwiz.
> 
> Bike info:
> - 2019 GG The Smash Size 3
> ...


Hey there everyone! Been watching these conversations for some time now and I thought I could give my opinion here too. As what I can read here, Shockwiz is telling you what to do. As if that slider is on the right side of the middle OK sign, it is telling you to "Make compression Firmer" or "Slow Down" rebound. Opposite thinking would be if it said "Firm" or "Fast".

I actually think everyone already got how it really is working, but thought that this could maybe help someone having same situation with Shockwiz as you did have.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

Huliblus said:


> Hey there everyone! Been watching these conversations for some time now and I thought I could give my opinion here too. As what I can read here, Shockwiz is telling you what to do. As if that slider is on the right side of the middle OK sign, it is telling you to "Make compression Firmer" or "Slow Down" rebound. Opposite thinking would be if it said "Firm" or "Fast".
> 
> I actually think everyone already got how it really is working, but thought that this could maybe help someone having same situation with Shockwiz as you did have.


Ok so what you are saying is to take it at face value... If it is moving towards the "Slow Down" for rebound for instance. Then I need to be actually SLOWING DOWN the rebound to make it move to the left, towards the middle. Is that correct?

If that is the case, then for the LSC/HSC I should be ADDING compression (moving clockwise or adding '+') to each.


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## Huliblus (Jun 23, 2019)

gregnash said:


> Ok so what you are saying is to take it at face value... If it is moving towards the "Slow Down" for rebound for instance. Then I need to be actually SLOWING DOWN the rebound to make it move to the left, towards the middle. Is that correct?
> 
> If that is the case, then for the LSC/HSC I should be ADDING compression (moving clockwise or adding '+') to each.


Yes! Exactly! Atleast that is how I read that information Shockwiz is giving there. Atleast I think it is worth a shot.


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

First thing is you need to reset baseline air pressure since you are reading -18%. Just lift up bike and click on shock travel and select reset baseline air pressure. should be 0 + or - 2psi. 

Yes make suggestions that are under the slider. Shows you should slow rebound and make compression firmer. 

Also I believe you might be running too low of air in your lyrik. I am 10lbs heavier than you and I run 95psi. Sag is almost useless on today's slack bikes. the head angle creates binding in the bushings.


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## floatingkiwi (May 11, 2006)

The first thing you need to do is reset that baseline air pressure. It'll change everything else.


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

Ok went through yesterday and messed with it using the inverse of what I previously thought and now all is good! Fork is doing great and psi seems to be spot on for me. Still needs a bit of rebound according to the shockwiz but other than that I really liked the feel yesterday. Going to ride again today, same track, and see how thing go.

Did randomly lose connection during the ride yesterday but that could have been my fault as I had walked around the side of a rock (thought I was still in line of sight) to pee and was no more than 20' away.


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## BCBlur (Nov 23, 2004)

You don't need to be constantly connected to tune. The ShockWiz has a pretty healthy buffer that will be read when you do connect. I only really check at the end of runs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## gregnash (Jul 17, 2010)

BCBlur said:


> You don't need to be constantly connected to tune. The ShockWiz has a pretty healthy buffer that will be read when you do connect. I only really check at the end of runs.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ok well it actually gave me an error that said "ShockWiz disconnected unexpectedly" or something to that sort and said to reset it by removing and reinstalling the battery. Ran again today without doing that and all seems good.


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## BCBlur (Nov 23, 2004)

gregnash said:


> Ok well it actually gave me an error that said "ShockWiz disconnected unexpectedly" or something to that sort and said to reset it by removing and reinstalling the battery. Ran again today without doing that and all seems good.


Ahh. Cool.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

Quick question: is the flashing LED in RED an indicator that the battery is almost dead? Because in the main menu it shows the correct 2.7 volts.... can't find anything in the manual about this


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## alfanut (Jun 4, 2011)

freyrida said:


> Quick question: is the flashing LED in RED an indicator that the battery is almost dead? Because in the main menu it shows the correct 2.7 volts.... can't find anything in the manual about this


Yes, it is the battery used up.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

Pulled out the ShockWiz to put in the rs super deluxe ultimate on my Bronson v3. Got a couple quick questions. 

Does rock shock publish compression ratios anywhere? I got 1.8 from the calibration wizard but no idea if it’s accurate. 

Has anyone else with a v3 Bronson or another lower link Santa Cruz found the best way to mount the ShockWiz? No matter where I’ve tried mounting it I’m getting contact interference between either the ShockWiz or the cable. Somethings always contacting.


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## Ganderson (Nov 27, 2006)

Not sure about the mounting on that bike.. looks tricky.

As far as verifying your CR... with SW reading 0% with the bike at rest, push down on the seat until SW reads 30%. Measure the o-ring movement on the shock, if it measures 30% your CR is correct!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

alfanut said:


> Yes, it is the battery used up.


That's not totally true. Red can also be indicative of a calibration error, boot error or some other issue, but not necessarily the battery. Sometimes it can be cleared with a new session battery pull (hard reset).

Also, the battery is good to 2.5v.

Source: I work with a lot of these in my rental fleet and have also verified the battery level with quarq.


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## rscecil007 (Apr 7, 2007)

I've ran into something I could use some thoughts on if anyone might be able to help

Recently installed a Rock Shox Super Deluxe Air Ultimate with a Vorsprung Tractive tune on my SC Megatower. I'm not sure how many (if any at all) volume tokens it has, I didn't crack it open when I got it back. My Shockwiz measured CR is 2.2 on the shock (230x 57.5). Baseline PSI is 235.

The few times I've tried it, things go well for a while, but at some point the Calibration status in the bottom right corner goes from green to red, and the PSI on my shock goes way up, about 30 PSI. I do realize the PSI will go up as the shock is worked due to temperature, but 30 PSI sounds excessive? I have tried a reboot and a new battery, same result.

A week or so before I used the SW on the Fox 36 that came with my Megatower, that has a Vorsprung Luftkappe installed. This worked fine, no issues at all, etc.

Any thoughts or suggestions on what might be going on? Thanks for any help!


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

Anyone run into their ShockWiz not recording anything?

After two 7 mile rides this is all it shows.










The first ride where I saw it didn't record any data I sat on the bike made sure it saw shock usage changes and then reset statistics.

I started with a 1.8mi fireroad climb and verified it shows 10% confidence at the end of the climb. But it never changed across multiple climbs, rock gardens and downhills with at least one 3' drop and several good sized rolls.

Maybe four rides in total on a new battery, and the device wakes up and connects normally.


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## forealz (Dec 12, 2016)

Also not sure if mine is working.

Hightower LT DPX2

I really struggled during the calibration portion and it errored the first time and I had to redo. Pulling to full extension was incredibly difficult.

It came out with 2.3 Compression Ratio
Baseline air pressure of 302 psi

Road for 5 miles and took a break and took a look at the app.
It suggested to keep riding and to do roots and rock gardens.

I did not start a new session per the instructions. (only start a new one when you change things)

I then road another 5 miles and it's unchanged! It still says rock gardens and roots even though I definitely hit more roots and rocky patches...












Nurse Ben said:


> Protip: Get some skinny velcro strips like what you'd use to attach a fender, thread it through the holes in the Shockwiz, then you can swap bikes or swap ends mid ride.


would these work : https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0057563UO/ref=ox_sc_act_title_5?smid=A21IULW0FD6NPA&psc=1


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I get multiple deep compression events according to SW per ride. 8 today for instance, although I am unable to feel them. But SW does not recommend increasing the number of volume reducers.
Thoughts?

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

If you're not feeling them and SW isn't suggesting adjustments, then I'd just take it as FYI.

I had similar at the weekend. No adjustments suggested but it detected "bouncing". Reading the description, it talked about rock gardens. As I'd just ridden down a daily lengthy one, I wasn't too worried.


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

I'm having problems with part of calibration process. When asked to fully compress the fork, I am unable to fully compress it. There is about 1/4" gap from the top of the stanchions to the bottom of the fork crown. If I bounce on it with all my weight I can almost close that gap but I can not hold it at the fully compressed position. It's almost as it there is still some air trapped even though I have released all of it. 

The fork is a 2020 lyric. 

Is there something I am doing wrong. It doesn't help that I only weigh 130 lbs so pushing with all my weight maybe isnt enough.


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

alfanut said:


> Hello again ... I can't find an answer to a question ... when the shockwiz starts, the LED is red, it turns green, but several times on the road it turns red, is it logical? Thank you.


Just saw the same thing on mine just today. Noticed that it the Shock Tuning Score was stuck at 0 when this started happening. A pop up appeared at one point saying that the shockwiz failed to boot properly and instructed me to do a hard reset by taking out the battery and reinserting backwards then reinserting the correct way. It seemed to fix the red flashes, so I suspect that your unit may need a hard reset well.

It's too bad that you couldn't do a hard reset through the app instead of taking everything apart.


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## root_0x54 (Jul 15, 2019)

wizard604 said:


> Just saw the same thing on mine just today. Noticed that it the Shock Tuning Score was stuck at 0 when this started happening. A pop up appeared at one point saying that the shockwiz failed to boot properly and instructed me to do a hard reset by taking out the battery and reinserting backwards then reinserting the correct way. It seemed to fix the red flashes, so I suspect that your unit may need a hard reset well.
> 
> It's too bad that you couldn't do a hard reset through the app instead of taking everything apart.


I had the same just few days ago. Red light was flashing all the time. I have tried to reset it, but didn't help. Then I noticed that voltage in app shows 2.3 V. I have replaced battery, now it shows 3.1 V and red light is gone.


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## jdang307 (May 30, 2015)

wizard604 said:


> I'm having problems with part of calibration process. When asked to fully compress the fork, I am unable to fully compress it. There is about 1/4" gap from the top of the stanchions to the bottom of the fork crown. If I bounce on it with all my weight I can almost close that gap but I can not hold it at the fully compressed position. It's almost as it there is still some air trapped even though I have released all of it.
> 
> The fork is a 2020 lyric.
> 
> Is there something I am doing wrong. It doesn't help that I only weigh 130 lbs so pushing with all my weight maybe isnt enough.


Measure it. I don't think the stanchions are supposed to touch the crown.


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

jdang307 said:


> Measure it. I don't think the stanchions are supposed to touch the crown.


Just measured and it's 170mm from top of lowers to base of crown, so it should touch on full compression.

I just got a reply from Alex at Quarg which should be of help to others who are experiencing this:

Hello David,

I am sorry for the late reply. Is the travel of this fork greater than 160? If it is, it just means you're going to need a bit more force to fully compress the fork. We see this issue with Boxxers as well.*

To help make full compression easier to achieve, be sure that when the fork is fully extended, that you're as close to 0 psi in the spring as possible. Do not get it so low though that ShockWiz reports a negative PSI. If you still can't get full compression, you'll just have to get a friend to help you out.

Regards,

Alex


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## philstone (Mar 14, 2011)

Is it possible to use the dynamic sag reading for static sag when first setting up a shock? Ie once the calibration wizard has been finished? I know that it records ride data, but what about the figure it gives before you’ve ridden?


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

philstone said:


> Is it possible to use the dynamic sag reading for static sag when first setting up a shock? Ie once the calibration wizard has been finished? I know that it records ride data, but what about the figure it gives before you've ridden?


Want to know as well...

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

philstone said:


> Is it possible to use the dynamic sag reading for static sag when first setting up a shock? Ie once the calibration wizard has been finished? I know that it records ride data, but what about the figure it gives before you've ridden?


Shockwiz's dynamic sag is defined as "...the average sag taken from the 20 most recent pedalling events.."

So if you are trying to achieve a measure of static sag however then you would need to ride a short distance to get a reading by that definition. If it was me, I would do this 5 or 6 times over the same ground and get a feel for the variation about the estimates. If it is not too wild then the average would be a pretty good overall figure.

But at the end of the day, if you get a solid result from Shockwiz w.r.t the tuning style you have chosen, then it is irrelevant what the sag (dynamic or static) is.


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## autosmith (Jan 16, 2012)

philstone said:


> Is it possible to use the dynamic sag reading for static sag when first setting up a shock? Ie once the calibration wizard has been finished? I know that it records ride data, but what about the figure it gives before you've ridden?


Once you get it set up it will show you real time travel. So sit on the bike while looking at your phone and you'll see a travel percentage. If its not what you want change air pressure accordingly then press the zero button and try again. It works amazingly well for initial setups.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## philstone (Mar 14, 2011)

autosmith said:


> Once you get it set up it will show you real time travel. So sit on the bike while looking at your phone and you'll see a travel percentage. If its not what you want change air pressure accordingly then press the zero button and try again. It works amazingly well for initial setups.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Of course! Travel usage never occurred to me!

Thanks.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## philstone (Mar 14, 2011)

Setting up the DPX2 on my offering. I'm getting a 90 score. Shock feels good, but SW is asking for more air and spacers.. have pushed the o-ring off on a couple of jumps, so I get it, but the small bump feels good. Should I add 5psi and see how it goes? My gut says to ignore pressure and bump the spacer up one..



















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

philstone said:


> Setting up the DPX2 on my offering. I'm getting a 90 score. Shock feels good, but SW is asking for more air and spacers.. have pushed the o-ring off on a couple of jumps, so I get it, but the small bump feels good. Should I add 5psi and see how it goes? My gut says to ignore pressure and bump the spacer up one..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


what Shockwiz tune exactly?


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## philstone (Mar 14, 2011)

Soft/Poppy


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

philstone said:


> Soft/Poppy
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ok, then based on that I'd simply add air as you said. 5-10psi more. u may need a little more rebound damping as well. I would expect both the baseline + air spring ramp to be happy


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

I thought I would share one of my experiences with everyone with a stuck down fork while attempting to calibrate my SW with my 2020 Lyric rc2 170mm. What happened was during the calibration process where you are asked to fully compress the fork, I noticed I was unable get full compression just using my bodyweight. So I enlisted the help of a buddy to help push down on the fork to get full compression where the top of the lowers touches the bottom of the lower crown. What happened was this ended up pushing out the wiper seal on the air side of the fork! I'm not sure what happens internally but it appears that fork is not meant to be compressed so deeply.

I reseated the seal and pumped everything back up and repeated the process and sure enough it happened again where it pushed the wiper seal out of the fork lowers. So I re-did the calibration but only compressed the fork with my bodyweight only and it worked fine without displacing the wiper seal.

Has anyone encountered this before. Is it possible to over compress a fork? I measured the travel from the top of the lowers to the bottom of the crown and is 170mm , so technically it should compress fully.

The otherside effect was I ended up with a parially stuck down fork after reseating the seal. I guess I ended up creating a vacuum when I re-extended the fork after reseating the seal. It took me awhile to get everything back to normal. The usual re-airing in small increments with pumping of the fork to equalize positive and negative chambers did not do the trick. Ended up having to insert a zip tie between the seal and stanchion to release the vaccum, after which everything was fine


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

philstone said:


> Setting up the DPX2 on my offering. I'm getting a 90 score. Shock feels good, but SW is asking for more air and spacers.. have pushed the o-ring off on a couple of jumps, so I get it, but the small bump feels good. Should I add 5psi and see how it goes? My gut says to ignore pressure and bump the spacer up one..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You always start the adjustment at the top of the page. That's why the air pressures listed 1st, ignore everything else until that is dialed.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## AF360 (Nov 3, 2019)

Great to see this 3 year-old thread is still alive and active. 
I just recently purchased 2 ShockWiz units and found this thread here a great source of information. Looking forward to exchanging ShockWiz tips and tricks with you guys. :thumbsup:


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## unerlaubt (Aug 2, 2019)

Just an endorsement for this wonderful device.
I was not very thrilled at the idea of spending $300+ on it, but I’ve been struggling for weeks on dialing in my new bike with a bikepacking setup. I never had this kind of difficulty on my old mtbs or dirtbikes. The RockShox tuning recommendation are a joke compared to where I am now with the help of the ShockWiz, kind of like they are trying to increase the sales of this magic device 

Anyhow, RockShox recommended 163 psi and -2 from full slow on my fork since I am a big guy. I fussed around with it w/o the Shockwiz for weeks with poor results. Talked to two LBSs about how to setup the fork and got nowhere. Now, after a week of running the same trail a few times a day and adding some drops and small jumps to my repertoire, I finally feel like it’s dialed in. I’m down to 115 psi, -6 from full slow, and inserted 3 tokens.... which is a pretty serious departure from the stock recommendation IMHO. After this whole process, I now have a very good understanding of how the various settings are impacting what I am feeling with the additional weight added to the bike with my camping gear. I got great results by simply following the instructions, making small changes in the order recommended, and being observant of what I was feeling instead of focusing on the tuning score. So glad I bought a shockwiz instead of renting one, was nice not being pressured to get the tune done quickly in order to return a rental and having the flexibility to retune as conditions change. Wish it didn’t set me back so much cash though!


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

Hi - For a couple months now I've been unable to use my ShockWiz as the app crashes the moment I tap the connect button in the iOS app (this happens on of both my phones - iPhone 7 on iOS13 and iPhone 6 on iOS12). I'm running the latest version of the app which I note has not been updated for a year now. I've uninstalled it and reinstalled, but it is the same.

I have contacted support but just got a response which made out the issue is news to them and they have passed it the the software team, but I've found a number of others who are also having this issue (on Facebook).

Has anyone else here had this issue? Is there a fix?

That lack of updates to the app make me worried I'll be stuck with this for a long time and I'm considering where I stand returning the Shockwiz to the store I bought it from. I do love the device, but it is useless if I can't use it.

Thanks.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

MJW75 said:


> Hi - For a couple months now I've been unable to use my ShockWiz as the app crashes the moment I tap the connect button in the iOS app (this happens on of both my phones - iPhone 7 on iOS13 and iPhone 6 on iOS12). I'm running the latest version of the app which I note has not been updated for a year now. I've uninstalled it and reinstalled, but it is the same.
> 
> I have contacted support but just got a response which made out the issue is news to them and they have passed it the the software team, but I've found a number of others who are also having this issue (on Facebook).
> 
> ...


I'm on a iPhone X and have never had the app crash and don't remember anyone having that issue in this forum.

To start troubleshooting:

- hard reset the phone.

- force quit all open apps.

- close all open Safari tabs.

-verify how much storage is available.

Let us know if you don't know how to do any of those procedures.

After doing all that let us know if it's still crashing. I'm thinking it's a memory issue, either ram or storage.

If that doesn't work then do a Reset Network Settings. I've seen some pretty strange behavior from corrupt network settings. You'll lose WiFi settings and Bluetooth settings but those are easy to re-enter.


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

rstark18 said:


> I'm on a iPhone X and have never had the app crash and don't remember anyone having that issue in this forum.
> 
> To start troubleshooting:
> 
> ...


Hi - cheers for helping. However, none of this helps (I did all this on both phones). The iPhone 7 is still pretty capable and runs fast, I can't imagine there is a RAM issue. Plenty of storage available on both phones. However i did notice when I turn on Airplane mode and click connect, it doesn't immediately crash out - although with Airplane mode enabled, I can't use Bluetooth to connect anyway!

To clarify, it crashes when I click 'connect' which takes you to the connection page. Not when I select the device itself (I can't even get to that point). It does it both with the Shockwiz on or off - or miles away from it. As such, it can't be an issue with the Shockwiz itself.

Not that I'm going to take an iPad for a ride with me, but I thought I install the app on my iPad Air2 and give it a try - it did the exact same thing!

As mentioned above, I have come across at least 2 others reporting this - this was on Facebook groups not on this forum. There is also this review on the iOS store (I'm sure the name of the reviewer is a coincidence).


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

MJW75 said:


> Hi - cheers for helping. However, none of this helps (I did all this on both phones). The iPhone 7 is still pretty capable and runs fast, I can't imagine there is a RAM issue. Plenty of storage available on both phones. However i did notice when I turn on Airplane mode and click connect, it doesn't immediately crash out - although with Airplane mode enabled, I can't use Bluetooth to connect anyway!
> 
> To clarify, it crashes when I click 'connect' which takes you to the connection page. Not when I select the device itself (I can't even get to that point). It does it both with the Shockwiz on or off - or miles away from it. As such, it can't be an issue with the Shockwiz itself.
> 
> ...


Two ideas. 
Turn on airplane mode then just select Bluetooth to turn only Bluetooth on.

Does it crash when you select "Firmware Update"?


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

rstark18 said:


> Two ideas.
> Turn on airplane mode then just select Bluetooth to turn only Bluetooth on.
> 
> Does it crash when you select "Firmware Update"?


Tried it - same thing when clicking either 'connect' or 'firmware update'.

When it crashes, it does show the connection page for a short moment before kicking me out to the home screen.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

MJW75 said:


> Tried it - same thing when clicking either 'connect' or 'firmware update'.
> 
> When it crashes, it does show the connection page for a short moment before kicking me out to the home screen.


And just to confirm, you did do a Settings>General>Reset Network Settings?

Also, have you removed the battery from the Shockwiz to do a reset. Or tried a new battery in the ShockWiz?


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

Anyone have a recommendation for a strong reusable zip tie or something similar? I'd rather have something I can use more than once and don't need to carry side-cutters in my pack when swapping positions.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

I wrap some inner tube around to protect the shock or fork crown and secure the shockwiz with Velcro strips.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

onzadog said:


> I wrap some inner tube around to protect the shock or fork crown and secure the shockwiz with Velcro strips.


I thought about Velcro. Ended up buying these rubber lined removable zip-ties. They're pretty beefy!
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PXF43NG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

I just use generic cable ties personally. 

I do love my Shockwiz, partly because it helps gives me the right settings, but also because it's now given me a greater understanding of 'feel' on a bike, which generally means if i set-up a bike now, i'm pretty close to where the Shockwiz recommends after using it. 
I don't begin to say i understand all aspects and all contexts of suspension, but jumping on a bike and being able to get it in the right ball-park is very useful indeed.

I've just bought a new Whyte G-160 and did the front at the weekend, i'll be doing the slightly more complicated Monarch rear this weekend as i was waiting for some volume spacers.


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## unerlaubt (Aug 2, 2019)

hidperf said:


> I thought about Velcro. Ended up buying these rubber lined removable zip-ties. They're pretty beefy!
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PXF43NG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


Unfortunately, that particular model does not fit in the ShockWiz holes


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

Verboten said:


> Unfortunately, that particular model does not fit in the ShockWiz holes


It fits the ShockWiz case holes just fine. It's mounted to my fork right now.

But yes, it will NOT fit the holes in the ShockWiz itself.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

MJW75 said:


> Tried it - same thing when clicking either 'connect' or 'firmware update'.
> 
> When it crashes, it does show the connection page for a short moment before kicking me out to the home screen.


You jinxed me!!!
I now have the same problem. Did you get this resolved?
on a side note I think it's not booting correctly as I get some red lights for a minute then it turns green. Don't think this was happening previously. Did a battery out reset to see if that would help but no luck.

**update**
I spoke too soon. When I did the reset I had forgot to reverse the battery. After doing that all is good.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

rstark18 said:


> You jinxed me!!!
> I now have the same problem. Did you get this resolved?
> on a side note I think it's not booting correctly as I get some red lights for a minute then it turns green. Don't think this was happening previously. Did a battery out reset to see if that would help but no luck.
> 
> ...


I put a battery in mine, thinking it might be bad, even though the app showed it was fine the last I had it working.

I ended up removing the saved paired device from my phone and it eventually found it in the app and connected.

It must've been a recent Android update because it broke my brand new Garmin Edge connection to and I had to do the same thing.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

hidperf said:


> I put a battery in mine, thinking it might be bad, even though the app showed it was fine the last I had it working.
> 
> I ended up removing the saved paired device from my phone and it eventually found it in the app and connected.
> 
> It must've been a recent Android update because it broke my brand new Garmin Edge connection to and I had to do the same thing.


WAIT!! A new Gamin Edge? Me too. That is too coincidental. THis has to be something to do with those to conflicting with each other. I'm clearing out my Garmin now to see if that helps but I can't clear out the SW as it's not in the Bluetooth list.


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

rstark18 said:


> Did you get this resolved?


Good that you've fixed yours, but just to answer part of the question - sort of. I think the issue is actually something in my house causing interference, so when the app opens the Bluetooth channel it sees something it doesn't like and crashes. I've found that it works when I'm away from the house and even in the far corner of my kitchen. As soon as I move to the middle of the house, it crashes. Strange, but now I know the issue, I can work around it. I also can't figure out what changed in the house at the time when the crashing started, so it is possibly down to an iOS update that the app hasn't taken account of yet. (The app is well over due an update!).

I've pretty much got all the use out of mine that I need now so have just bought a digital shock pump which I'm going to check pressures against the ShockWiz, and I'll probably sell the ShockWiz in a month or so now. I've learnt a lot from owning it and feel I can now manage without. Plus I only have the one bike to use it on.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

MJW75 said:


> Good that you've fixed yours, but just to answer part of the question - sort of. I think the issue is actually something in my house causing interference, so when the app opens the Bluetooth channel it sees something it doesn't like and crashes. I've found that it works when I'm away from the house and even in the far corner of my kitchen. As soon as I move to the middle of the house, it crashes. Strange, but now I know the issue, I can work around it. I also can't figure out what changed in the house at the time when the crashing started, so it is possibly down to an iOS update that the app hasn't taken account of yet. (The app is well over due an update!).
> 
> I've pretty much got all the use out of mine that I need now so have just bought a digital shock pump which I'm going to check pressures against the ShockWiz, and I'll probably sell the ShockWiz in a month or so now. I've learnt a lot from owning it and feel I can now manage without. Plus I only have the one bike to use it on.


Actually it's crashing again. I have exactly the same symptoms. If I go away from my garage it's fine. If I get closer it crashes. 
On the iOS App Store there's a few reviews saying it crashes. 
I think they need an update.


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

rstark18 said:


> Actually it's crashing again. I have exactly the same symptoms. If I go away from my garage it's fine. If I get closer it crashes.
> On the iOS App Store there's a few reviews saying it crashes.
> I think they need an update.


Yeah, over a year since the last update. The UI could do with being updated to make things more straight forward and clearer. Please update this thread if you find a specific item causing your interference (assuming that is what it is).


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Just bought a second one from CRC. I hope they've not clearing them out cheap just because SRAM are about to stop supporting them.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

onzadog said:


> Just bought a second one from CRC. I hope they've not clearing them out cheap just because SRAM are about to stop supporting them.


They must have blown them out pretty quick. I don't see them listed at all on their website.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

As far as the crashing goes, I started troubleshooting it and for me it only happens on one side of my property (the garage side). I turned off all power to the property and it still crashes when I get close to that side of the house. It must be my neighbor which is a little strange as nobody lives there and they are remodeling.
Regardless, I was told there should be an update/fix in a week or so.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Oddly, I've just upgraded my 6 year old mobile that topped out at android 5, to a new pixel 3a running Android 10, and the new phone seems to have more connection issues than the old one. There was even a warning on the screen about possible issues when I installed the app in the phone.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

An update was released (for iOS at least) that fixed the crashing issue for me.


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## MJW75 (Jul 5, 2018)

rstark18 said:


> An update was released (for iOS at least) that fixed the crashing issue for me.


Yes, fixed it for me too. Saying that, I've now packed my ShockWiz up to put on eBay as I don't think I can get much more benefit from it than I already have.

Oh, there was a firmware update recently, so check for that too.


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

MJW75 said:


> Yes, fixed it for me too. Saying that, I've now packed my ShockWiz up to put on eBay as I don't think I can get much more benefit from it than I already have.
> 
> Oh, there was a firmware update recently, so check for that too.


Don't you pass around your buddies ? Try on the next new bike ? Whilst i'm happy my bike is now sorted, with 3 bikes in the house and plenty of friends, there's always more to Shockwiz


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

When you guys are setting your sag do you go by static sag using shockwiz or dynamic sag? Thanks

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

Neither... I don't use Sag and more... I set to roughly where i think it should be based upon weight and experience. I then let Shockwiz decide from there.

Generally i am not far off from where it ends up suggesting.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Good to know. SW definitely liked where I had my settings at. 
I wonder what range of air pressures SW will continue to like for sag numbers?

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Kuttermax (Sep 4, 2011)

Has anyone tried the SW with the new Trek Supercaliber? 

I've had a Shockwiz since day 1 and it has been great for setting up my XC bikes. With the new rear suspension design of the Supercaliber with flexing seatstays, I wonder how the Shockwiz will work with it.


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## SuperUltraKel (Sep 18, 2018)

Jukas said:


> Anyone run into their ShockWiz not recording anything?
> 
> After two 7 mile rides this is all it shows.
> 
> ...


I know this is old, but figured others might have the same issue so wanted to share my experience and solution. I ran into the exact same issue. I spent a day at a local park doing repeats of the same loop while shockwizzing trying to tune up my Pike. In the beginning, everything was going good. I had dropped pressure, slowed my rebound, softened my compression and when it said to add air volume spacers, I turned my MRP Ramp Control knob to "firmer". Kept riding, kept adjusting. Finally it said to add more volume spacers, so I turned my Ramp Control some more and went for a ride. Came back and ....nothing. It simply said "start riding". It still showed current pressure, sag, etc. I thought maybe I just didn't hit the "start new session". So I made sure I hit it, went for another loop, came back and nothing. I thought maybe I forgot to set my baseline air pressure, so I did that, started a new session, rode a loop and nothing. I kept trying more and more stuff trying to get it to record and kept riding the same loop over and over and over again and it simply would not record. I tried uninstalling and reinstalling the app. Resetting the Shockwiz. Turning off my phone and restarting. Turning off my Garmin and my watch so that they wouldn't interfere. Nothing worked. I was getting frustrated. I searched online for a solution but really never found one ... I finally went to bed last night bewildered and when I woke up, I had an epiphany. I needed to recalibrate. I TOTALLY forgot that step when I was adjusting my volume reducers. The first couple times I adjusted them, I guess it was such a gradual change that the Shockwiz didn't really pick up on it (especially since I did it in conjunction with a slight air pressure decrease) but after my last adjustment, it was probably just more than the Shockwiz could cope with. After checking the app, it was confirmed. You do indeed have to recalibrate after adjusting volume reducers (or tokens)








So I started the process of recalibrating now that I had a good amount of Ramp Control on ..... and I was alllllll over the place. ERROR, ERROR, ERROR I couldn't get the compressed PSI to ever be consistent. It would not work at ALL with no air in the fork so I added a little. It would go from 11 PSI at full extension to 16 at fully compressed ... ERROR: Not enough pressure difference. Then the next time would go from 11 PSI to 34 PSI. But that jump made me decide to try again and then the next time would go from 11 to 26. I realized that the final pressure was really dependent on how hard I pushed it down. Forcefully, and it showed 16. Slowly, it would go to 34. After looking into it, I found that it was my MRP ramp control module that was the issue. With it fully open, it really caused no issues at all so it calibrated fine and worked great for most of my Shockwiz suggestions, but once you start adding ramp to it, it creates a variable compression ratio which is absolutely NOT compatible with the Shockwiz. It is not as simple as it just adding volume reducers ... it essentially dampens the air flow into the cartridge with more dampening the more you turn it. The volume itself remains the same. I am not sure why I didn't pick up on this sooner. I did see that certain forks weren't compatible but must have missed the fact that it won't work with the Ramp Control add on. So with all that said, my suggestions are to recalibrate after adding volume reducers (bands, tokens, etc) and that the MRP ramp control is not compatible (at least while actually using it)


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## Camstyn (May 15, 2018)

Having an issue with my shockwiz, after calibrating on my shock everything looks good, I’ll go for a short ride And then when I’m off the bike, it is reading that the bike is at 5-8% shock travel with the suspension fully extended. It does the same thing on two different bikes and I’m following instructions correctly as far as I can tell during initial setup/calibration. 

Fox X2 and DPX2, and cycling the suspension up/down 10x at each 50psi interval during inflation like you’re supposed to.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Camstyn said:


> Having an issue with my shockwiz, after calibrating on my shock everything looks good, I'll go for a short ride And then when I'm off the bike, it is reading that the bike is at 5-8% shock travel with the suspension fully extended. It does the same thing on two different bikes and I'm following instructions correctly as far as I can tell during initial setup/calibration.
> 
> Fox X2 and DPX2, and cycling the suspension up/down 10x at each 50psi interval during inflation like you're supposed to.


I get something similar when I fully deflate the shock (having just removed a spacer). But after few adjustment inflations it seems to hold tight.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

Camstyn said:


> Having an issue with my shockwiz, after calibrating on my shock everything looks good, I'll go for a short ride And then when I'm off the bike, it is reading that the bike is at 5-8% shock travel with the suspension fully extended. It does the same thing on two different bikes and I'm following instructions correctly as far as I can tell during initial setup/calibration.
> 
> Fox X2 and DPX2, and cycling the suspension up/down 10x at each 50psi interval during inflation like you're supposed to.


aren't you adding more air after the calibration or compression ratio is calculated? after the step to inflate to your baseline air pressure you can't add more air if for somereason you didn't got the pressure right for the sag you want or something like that.

travel % means it's reading a higher pressure than it believes it's the pressure for a 0% sag, it happened to me when I setup my shock for the first time then I realized my baseline air pressure must be the right pressure without later adjustments


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## Camstyn (May 15, 2018)

No, it calculated baseline pressure before riding the bike and didn’t add any air after, so the actual pressure settled a bit lower from the recorded baseline pressure after some cycling of the suspension, which it always seems to do like during the 50psi increments during inflation.


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## SuperUltraKel (Sep 18, 2018)

Camstyn said:


> No, it calculated baseline pressure before riding the bike and didn't add any air after, so the actual pressure settled a bit lower from the recorded baseline pressure after some cycling of the suspension, which it always seems to do like during the 50psi increments during inflation.


I certainly don't want to come across as too simplistic but it helps to cycle way more frequently than only at 50 psi increments. Basically, there is a small port between your positive and negative chamber that equalizes the pressures at a certain position of travel. If you only cycle it at 50 psi increments, then when it cycles the first time, you will lose a LOT of pressure from the positive chamber and gain a LOT in the negative chamber. I don't really like Shockwiz's directions on this because it is not really explaining what is happening inside the chamber. I tend to cycle it frequently through the airing up process and a lot before setting it as a baseline pressure. That said, even just the weight of the bike while sitting statically will cause you to have a few percentage points of sag unless you are physically extending the travel to its longest point.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Guys my Shockwiz app had a flashing battery light, so I replaced the battery taken care it is in the correct orientation. And it would not turn back on. I then tried another brand new battery and I still cannot get it to turn on. I then just rode the bike with the SW attached for some time seeing if that would activate it but nothing seemed to work. Suggestions for getting this thing up and running again?
I know a lot of people consider these a 1x use then you remove them and you're done. But for me I'm always tinkering and I have two bikes to set up for family members that don't understand suspension. And it's taught me so much, really offers me a lot of guidance that I enjoy.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Suns_PSD said:


> Guys my Shockwiz app had a flashing battery light, so I replaced the battery taken care it is in the correct orientation. And it would not turn back on. I then tried another brand new battery and I still cannot get it to turn on. I then just rode the bike with the SW attached for some time seeing if that would activate it but nothing seemed to work. Suggestions for getting this thing up and running again?
> I know a lot of people consider these a 1x use then you remove them and you're done. But for me I'm always tinkering and I have two bikes to set up for family members that don't understand suspension. And it's taught me so much, really offers me a lot of guidance that I enjoy.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


Try flipping the battery for 30 seconds then putting it back in the right way. This is supposed to reset it. I was having some issues that went away after I did that.


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## digev (Mar 7, 2019)

Suns_PSD said:


> Guys my Shockwiz app had a flashing battery light, so I replaced the battery taken care it is in the correct orientation. And it would not turn back on. I then tried another brand new battery and I still cannot get it to turn on. I then just rode the bike with the SW attached for some time seeing if that would activate it but nothing seemed to work. Suggestions for getting this thing up and running again?
> I know a lot of people consider these a 1x use then you remove them and you're done. But for me I'm always tinkering and I have two bikes to set up for family members that don't understand suspension. And it's taught me so much, really offers me a lot of guidance that I enjoy.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


Try a brand new «Panasonic» CR2032 not Energizer or any other brand! It worked for me a while ago. (Same symptoms, same troubleshooting and that was the solution).

I even left a post on PB a year ago to help others fix that issue!

https://m.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=212245

https://www.amazon.com/Batteries-Panasonic-Lithium-Battery-Blister/dp/B002U00ZNK


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I'll try both guys, thanks. 

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

rstark18 said:


> Try flipping the battery for 30 seconds then putting it back in the right way. This is supposed to reset it. I was having some issues that went away after I did that.


This worked like a charm. Thx

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## SimonNewbMechanic (Nov 1, 2018)

Hi guys, I noticed that a beta 6.0.0 firmware has become available. I can't seem to find any release notes. 

Anybody knows what's included with that release ?


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Here is a fun fact: I used SW to dial in my forks LSC and it always reads the same, 'green'. This fork has an Avalanche damping cartridge. 

Then I added Push fork seals and then SW said that my LSC was too soft with no other changes. That's how much friction was reduced. 

Pretty cool I thought. They have no breakaway force. 

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

This is the real deal:

https://motioninstruments.com/

MI helps you tune the entire bike's performance, not just one component, and it works with coil setups, not just air shocks/forks.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

SimonNewbMechanic said:


> Hi guys, I noticed that a beta 6.0.0 firmware has become available. I can't seem to find any release notes.
> 
> Anybody knows what's included with that release ?


Where are you seeing the update?


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## SimonNewbMechanic (Nov 1, 2018)

Got the notification in the app, my unit is now upgraded to firmware 6.0, I am not sure what version I was running before

Oh and the app asked if I was willing to update to a beta, first time this happened as far as I can tell


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## s-master (May 15, 2018)

People with shockwiz and GRIP2 fox 36:
How different are the default settings from FOX and the ones that shockwiz suggest?
What do you prefer?


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

s-master said:


> People with shockwiz and GRIP2 fox 36:
> How different are the default settings from FOX and the ones that shockwiz suggest?
> What do you prefer?


I've got the 150mm Fox 36 with GRIP2 on my Jeffsy. Before I bought the ShockWiz, I spent time dialing in the sag and both compression and rebound settings to where I felt best.

Original default setting, where I felt it was dialed in:

20% sag
2 volume spacers
HSR 1
LSR 2
HSC 10
HSR 6

First tuning session, same trail as above:

20% sag
2 volume spacers
HSR 2
HSC 3
LSR 12
LSC 6

What I notced most about the Fox 36 with GRIP2 is how noticable the compression and rebound changes are. The little changes above were enough that I could feel the difference immediately. I did not change any volume spacers, as it wasn't recommended by ShockWiz.

I'm slowly putting together different tunes for each trail I ride. 
That tune above is a very easy trail with no technical section, and is what I consider a cardio workout.

For another local trail, that's more technical than the trail above, I run this setup, based on the ShockWiz tuning:

25% sag
2 volume spacers
HSR 2
HSC 1
LSR 11
LSC 7


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

s-master said:


> People with shockwiz and GRIP2 fox 36:
> How different are the default settings from FOX and the ones that shockwiz suggest?
> What do you prefer?


That's a really loaded question - totally depends how you ride, what you ride, and the suspension design/leverage ratio.

That said, in general Fox forks and shocks perform best on the stuff I ride (roots and rocks) with the compression clickers much more open and maybe a click or two more rebound than spec, and usually 1-2 spacers. Overall, I think the HSC/LSC recommendations are too high.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

One thing I would say is that I noticed my Fox 34 perf elite which came default with 2 tokens felt a hell of a lot more controlled with none. I am a lighter rider, yes, but if you don't need them remove and re-test. So for me, 80 psi + 0 tokens smashed the recommended 70psi +2 tokens. Shockwiz confirmed.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

I have a question about the initial setup of the compression Rate. The App guides you through to a point where you will have to inflate the fork to a psi recommended by the manufacturer (I suppose related to one‘s weight?). Then it asks you to compress the fork further than 50% of its travel, do I recall this correctly?
I have a hard time doing this, am I too weak or doing something wrong?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

freyrida said:


> I have a question about the initial setup of the compression Rate. The App guides you through to a point where you will have to inflate the fork to a psi recommended by the manufacturer (I suppose related to one's weight?). Then it asks you to compress the fork further than 50% of its travel, do I recall this correctly?
> I have a hard time doing this, am I too weak or doing something wrong?


OK, by the time you have hit this point the CR has actually been calculated. This final part is simply getting you back to the point of using the bike. In short, don't worry. I agree it's confusing.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

lucifuge said:


> OK, by the time you have hit this point the CR has actually been calculated. This final part is simply getting you back to the point of using the bike. In short, don't worry. I agree it's confusing.


this is I guess when it calculates baseline it's a little confusing the calibration wizard


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

Ok and would it be possible to just look up the compression ratio for any shock on the web (taking into consideration how many tokens are being used) e.g. Lyrik 2017, 2 tokens >>compression ratio 2.5 (or whatever)?


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

freyrida said:


> Ok and would it be possible to just look up the compression ratio for any shock on the web (taking into consideration how many tokens are being used) e.g. Lyrik 2017, 2 tokens >>compression ratio 2.5 (or whatever)?


For some forks, but not very combo. What exactly is yours?


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## crfnick56 (Mar 7, 2012)

RickBullottaPA said:


> This is the real deal:
> 
> https://motioninstruments.com/
> 
> MI helps you tune the entire bike's performance, not just one component, and it works with coil setups, not just air shocks/forks.


For more than double the cost of the Shockwiz..... Maybe if you are a pro racer looking for tenths of a second I could see that but for the other 98% of people I think the Shockwiz does a good enough job.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

crfnick56 said:


> For more than double the cost of the Shockwiz..... Maybe if you are a pro racer looking for tenths of a second I could see that but for the other 98% of people I think the Shockwiz does a good enough job.


It's not targeted for consumers to buy, nor is it really something you need to own (nor do you really need to own a Shockwiz). The MI rig is something you'd either rent or work with a tuner/coach to do a setup/tune on your bike. Shockwiz really doesn't do a great job on tuning the bike's suspension as a whole system, and a Shockwiz doesn't work with coil spring forks or shocks.

Think of the Shockwiz as the equivalent of the built-in heart rate monitor on a smartwatch vs using a KardiaMobile device. The built-in one is better than nothing, but isn't all that accurate and is very limited in what it can tell you.

If you want to buy a ShockWiz, I'll give you a sweet deal. ;-)


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## Ogden (Apr 18, 2020)

Hi Guys

I've got a Shockwiz that is showing a solid orange/red led constantly. I've tried rebooting it and I've also tried several new batteries to no avail. 

I have had a look online and I cant find any information regarding a solid LED.

Anyone else had this issue?


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Ogden said:


> Hi Guys
> 
> I've got a Shockwiz that is showing a solid orange/red led constantly. I've tried rebooting it and I've also tried several new batteries to no avail.
> 
> ...


Sounds like a booting issue if it's solid (not blinking). Are you able to connect to it in this state? If you've done the reset (flipping battery upside down for a few seconds to no avail), you may need to contact Quarq for help. Let us know what you end up finding out!


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## Ogden (Apr 18, 2020)

bryanus said:


> Sounds like a booting issue if it's solid (not blinking). Are you able to connect to it in this state? If you've done the reset (flipping battery upside down for a few seconds to no avail), you may need to contact Quarq for help. Let us know what you end up finding out!


No, it wont connect at all. I've emailed quarq but not had a response yet.

Cheers. I'll let you know what they say.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

freyrida said:


> Ok and would it be possible to just look up the compression ratio for any shock on the web (taking into consideration how many tokens are being used) e.g. Lyrik 2017, 2 tokens >>compression ratio 2.5 (or whatever)?


Measuring accurate compression ratios is a frustrating thing for me. I can get the same number every time on a shock but I get a different number every single time I measured the forks. In reality it was only a 1 or 2 tenths off which is only 5 or 10%.
I feel like it would be very helpful on this forum if we had a list of every measured compression ratio for the different set ups.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

When it comes to suspension set up, i can feel what's working well, but I have a hard time getting there. And when riding I don't think about my suspension at all unless it does something really bad. 
So for me, the SW is really handy, particularly at setting sag but really all aspects of suspension performance. 
I've also found that you can alter parts of your suspension curve, in ways I never considered. Imagine that on a fork that has no external HSC or HSR adjustment, SW is consistently telling you to soften HSC & HSR. So in my case a change of the negative volume, which effects my needed air pressure to hit sag, combined with new low friction fork seals, gets HSC & HSR exactly perfect in the 'green' but now your previously 'green' LSC & LSR are too soft, but those are adjustable with external knobs and easily correctable. It's an interesting round about way to get all 'greens' on SW and not something I could have ever worked thru without SW. And most importantly, the fork feels phenomenal.

That said, SW recommended to add a token, which I did and got all 'greens' and it felt very good, but then I struggle to utilize all of the travel. So I decided to try half of a token to see if that kept my ramp up rate in the 'green' while utilizing all or very close to all of my travel.

Will update when I get a good ride in with the fork like this. 









Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

Don't knock yourself out trying to achieve the ultimate settings. You'll drive yourself crazy as it will keep changing depending on the trail and how you're riding that day. If you're able to get it close and it feels good then you've achieved your goal. You can tweak according to the trail you're riding that day if it feels a bit off. I've found that cooler vs warmer temperatures will also affect your suspension behavior drastically too. I initially tuned late fall when it was cooler, now had to alter the settings for the warmer weather.


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

wizard604 said:


> Don't knock yourself out trying to achieve the ultimate settings. You'll drive yourself crazy as it will keep changing depending on the trail and how you're riding that day. If you're able to get it close and it feels good then you've achieved your goal. You can tweak according to the trail you're riding that day if it feels a bit off. I've found that cooler vs warmer temperatures will also affect your suspension behavior drastically too. I initially tuned late fall when it was cooler, now had to alter the settings for the warmer weather.


But the shockwiz said the setting are right....


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## 294037 (Jun 30, 2006)

Cutting tokens in half is the surefire sign you are way too deep in the rabbit hole!

Easy fix - you need to use all the travel, there is no point in it. If the fork is working well at 90% stroke then leave it there, it is effect


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

As a intermediate user of the shockwiz i have some basic questions:

- when calibrating the wiz to find out what the compression rate is (e.g. 2.5), after running the shockwiz on another bike and returning it to the one where i measured 2.5: will it be enough to enter the compression ratio Manually?
- which are the variables that would chance this ratio, adding tokens i guess?
- when calibrating and it tells you to inflate air as suggested by the manufacturer, wouldnt it be clever to just inflate like 50 psi or so to get the next step of compressing down to at least 50% done easier? Afterwards one would inflate more air to get the sag correct...

Thanks for help


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

you need to inflate to the pressure you are gonna be using otherwise the sag % will be completely wrong when you add more air.

not sure about what could change the rate, maybe someone else can help you with that


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

If you haven't changed anything like # of token, you don't need to redo the calibration. Just set manually. 

What I do is save a Baseline Profile after calibrating and just load it when I reconnecting the SW.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

JohnnyC7 said:


> Cutting tokens in half is the surefire sign you are way too deep in the rabbit hole!
> 
> Easy fix - you need to use all the travel, there is no point in it. If the fork is working well at 90% stroke then leave it there, it is effect


Lol.

It's fun playing.

That said I get shockingly consistent results from SW as long as I'm not riding (slowly) with my wife and kid. It reads the same thing every time if no changes have been made. I essentially leave it on all of the time as I feel it's never exactly right. Altering any thing on either end effects balance and requires retuning at both ends.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

When setting your baseline pressure, do you do it with the bike on the ground or in a stand?
If doing it on the ground then the suspension is very slightly loaded and give a different reading than if it’s in a stand and at full extension.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

rstark18 said:


> When setting your baseline pressure, do you do it with the bike on the ground or in a stand?
> If doing it on the ground then the suspension is very slightly loaded and give a different reading than if it's in a stand and at full extension.


On the ground. You're going to need to cycle the fork during calibration anyway, so you'll to do that on the ground. You unweight the fork or shock manually during calibration to capture the maximum extension though.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

*ShockWiz Tuning Results Database*



Suns_PSD said:


> Measuring accurate compression ratios is a frustrating thing for me. I can get the same number every time on a shock but I get a different number every single time I measured the forks. In reality it was only a 1 or 2 tenths off which is only 5 or 10%.
> I feel like it would be very helpful on this forum if we had a list of every measured compression ratio for the different set ups.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


I actually started to collect Shockwiz tuning information on my website. If you or anyone else has results to share, please add your results! Anyone can submit!

https://www.feeltheberm.com/pages/tuning-matrix


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

bryanus said:


> I actually started to collect Shockwiz tuning information on my website. If you or anyone else has results to share, please add your results! Anyone can submit!
> 
> https://www.feeltheberm.com/pages/tuning-matrix


This is awesome! I'll have to go through my info and add it.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

still confusion..... when this screen shows up during the final steps of calibration, which PSI value would i have to use when calibrating the Fox X2? The one where it says in the manual „start with your body weight in pounds"? I recon this will not get my desired sag or is it ok to add/remove air afterwards in order to get the sag dialed?
Having trouble with the initial PSIs the ShockWiz wants here......


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Any psi you want. The calibration is to work out the compression ratio. So long as you don't add or remove spacers, you can adjust the air pressure and just start a new session.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

onzadog said:


> Any psi you want. The calibration is to work out the compression ratio. So long as you don't add or remove spacers, you can adjust the air pressure and just start a new session.


isn't that gonna mess with the sag % that shockwiz shows? adding or removing air while it doesn't change the compression ratio it would change the baseline pressure at 0% sag, does that get reset with a new session?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

The key is to start a new session after the air pressure adjustment.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

After any air adjustments tap the Shock Travel box and it will have you reset the baseline pressure and that will by default start a new session.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

But wouldn’t it make a huge difference in the measured compression ratio if I‘d inflate 80 vs 250 psi? 
The other problem is the higher the psi the more difficult is to get the travel „to at least 50%“ in the last steps...


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Compression ratio isn’t measured by pressure, it is volume. That’s why if you add a volume spacer you have to recalibrate. 
As far as the 50% goes. Many suspensions have a bypass dimple in the lower part of the stanchion that allows the negative air chamber to equalize with the positive air chamber. The goal of the “50% compression” is to equalize these. In many cases it’s less than a 50% compression that does this. Grab a load of brake and press hard on the handlebar. Use the lowest pressure on the suspension chart for the lightest rider to get your compression ratio. After that’s set figure out your sag.


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## flash4092 (Aug 11, 2010)

Is there any value in using Shockwiz to optimize the suspension on a Pivot Mach 4 SL BEFORE activating Live Valve?


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

On the fork it may be easier, doing this to the rear shock I find it quite hard to get it to 50%.....


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## s-master (May 15, 2018)

flash4092 said:


> Is there any value in using Shockwiz to optimize the suspension on a Pivot Mach 4 SL BEFORE activating Live Valve?


Live valve is just electronicly controled lockout. You should use shockwiz to set up the suspension, when it is in open mode.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

Has anyone experienced a leaking ShockWiz? Until few minutes ago i thought my x2 was losing air pressure but at 200 PSI underwater you don't see any bubbles at all...

So new theory is that the air line or one of the valves loses it


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

A light spray of soapy water should help diagnose it.

Solution might be as simple as new o-rings in the connectors.


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## freyrida (Aug 28, 2016)

onzadog said:


> A light spray of soapy water should help diagnose it.
> 
> Solution might be as simple as new o-rings in the connectors.


Do you know the type of o-Rings needed?


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

freyrida said:


> Do you know the type of o-Rings needed?


The o-rings in the connection hoses are US Standard 105.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

JohnnyC7 said:


> Cutting tokens in half is the surefire sign you are way too deep in the rabbit hole!
> 
> Easy fix - you need to use all the travel, there is no point in it. If the fork is working well at 90% stroke then leave it there, it is effect


Rabbit hole you say?

It's pretty dialed and I'm pleased with the forks performance.

I've had this exact same result for 5+ rides.

LSC on the Avy is turned all of the way in so no more changes are planned. 








Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## floatingkiwi (May 11, 2006)

I find my rides have been changing a lot lately. I do one hard track and get (consistently) a really bad score, then the slightly (not much) easier part of that track brings me up to like 90%! weird. The same ride with the HSC at soft and the next day with it at medium get the same score!! hmm.


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

floatingkiwi said:


> I find my rides have been changing a lot lately. I do one hard track and get (consistently) a really bad score, then the slightly (not much) easier part of that track brings me up to like 90%! weird. The same ride with the HSC at soft and the next day with it at medium get the same score!! hmm.


You'll get varying results depending upon the type of trail you ride and how aggressively you ride it. You probably wont find a tune that will give you the best scores for all conditions. That's why I like to run it under multiple mixed trails over several days and settle on what feels the best for the types of trails that I ride the most.


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## daniel366940 (Sep 23, 2017)

when using the shockwiz on my front fork which is a 2020 34 fit 4 i get all the tuning windows in the green apart from the hsc which is always saying i need to make softer .
my hsc is wide open 
Is there any way to get over this or does it mean i have to adjust shim stack for a softer tune ?
No matter what i do with volume spacers and air pressure it always says hsc is to stiff .
i am running the neutral poppy tune


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## Rick Draper (Dec 1, 2009)

daniel366940 said:


> when using the shockwiz on my front fork which is a 2020 34 fit 4 i get all the tuning windows in the green apart from the hsc which is always saying i need to make softer .
> my hsc is wide open
> Is there any way to get over this or does it mean i have to adjust shim stack for a softer tune ?
> No matter what i do with volume spacers and air pressure it always says hsc is to stiff .
> i am running the neutral poppy tune


How does the fork feel?


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

daniel366940 said:


> when using the shockwiz on my front fork which is a 2020 34 fit 4 i get all the tuning windows in the green apart from the hsc which is always saying i need to make softer .
> my hsc is wide open
> Is there any way to get over this or does it mean i have to adjust shim stack for a softer tune ?
> No matter what i do with volume spacers and air pressure it always says hsc is to stiff .
> i am running the neutral poppy tune


This isn't unusual. Unless you truly don't like the way it feels, or maybe if HSC is showing in the red, I probably wouldn't worry about it.

Really the sag, the ramp up, then the LSR and then the LSC are the most important parameters imo in that order. HSC is pretty low on the priority list.

What I have found with HSC is that when I ride easier, SW says HSC is too stiff. But when I ride my best on challenging terrain, SW says the HSC is perfect.


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## daniel366940 (Sep 23, 2017)

fork feels ok . to be honest i dont think it needs to be softer was just seeing if there was a way around this . I will check the shockwiz app after riding down a really rough section hard and see what it says then


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

I'm dumb, just realized I edit the fields out since I don't have those in my shock and want to declutter the screen!  Top right corner Edit button let you choose the fields you want to see in case anybody else is as dumb as me!



> does anybody know how shockwiz detects if I'm running on a fork or shock? somehow when using shockwiz on my shock it knows not to show what isn't available shows only air/tokens low speed compression and rebound. but when I used before on my fork I also had hsc and hsr in the suggestions
> 
> this is from my shock suggestions page no hsc or hsr, my fork suggestion page was just like the one a few posts before this


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

I've been using it for about 3 hours....AMAZING. wow. I never thought it would be this GOOD. But damn. My friend let me borrow his and its wow......highly recommend it.


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

*Any Shockwiz deals?*

Looking to buy a Shockwiz 'cause I'm horrible at suspension tuning. :madman: Anyone have leads on where I can get a deal? Feel free to PM me if needed.

Thanks in advance.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

RacerLex said:


> Looking to buy a Shockwiz 'cause I'm horrible at suspension tuning. :madman: Anyone have leads on where I can get a deal? Feel free to PM me if needed.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


I'd suggest renting rather than buying. Google and you'll find a number of options.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

sroc3 said:


> I've been using it for about 3 hours....AMAZING. wow. I never thought it would be this GOOD. But damn. My friend let me borrow his and its wow......highly recommend it.


Are you talking about a Shockwiz or a sex toy?


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

RickBullottaPA said:


> I'd suggest renting rather than buying..


I considered renting but decided I'd be better served buying one.


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## RickBullottaPA (Mar 4, 2015)

RacerLex said:


> I considered renting but decided I'd be better served buying one.


I bought one, used it for a week, it sat around for 18 months gathering dust, then I sold it. YMMV.


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

I really only frequent a few trails here - mostly the same. I'm lucky to be able to borrow one from a friend who is letting me use it for a couple of days. So - i love it but I'm sure if I bought one for $350, the novelty would wear off in a few weeks. I have to say - It did get me to tweak my suspension to where it is really nice and supple feeling. Seeing as I do have a hardtail, this is very imperative for me. IF I had a full Suspension bike as well, then I would DEFINITELY buy one.


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## crashing_sux (Aug 11, 2006)

Does anyone know if shockwiz uses air pressure for anything besides determining where you are in the travel? The reason I ask is I am curious if I could mount an air piston beside my actual shock/fork hooked up to shockwiz and use it to tune a coil shock/fork as it wouldd still have the bump force information produced by the device itself, plus travel information from the auxiliary air piston.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

crashing_sux said:


> Does anyone know if shockwiz uses air pressure for anything besides determining where you are in the travel? The reason I ask is I am curious if I could mount an air piston beside my actual shock/fork hooked up to shockwiz and use it to tune a coil shock/fork as it wouldd still have the bump force information produced by the device itself, plus travel information from the auxiliary air piston.


That progressive air spring would not send info back to your SW that corresponded with the way your linear metal spring would. 
There is proper hardware for what you want to track.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Symion (Feb 6, 2009)

Has anyone tinkered with the compression circuit? Especially the Low Speed Part.
After optimizing the friction of the air spring even closed lsc is to less.
Is the needle to thin or to far away from the hole.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

I just received a Shockwiz and pretty excited to give it a go. Shocks are something ive just put in the middle and forgot. Almost had a big over bars moment on weekend and Shockwiz says I have 70PSI in front shock which is super low for my 200lb 6 foot 3 body!

Anyhow calibration went fine but was wondering what rebound and open/closed valve setting should be. Just in middle for both? Or does it not matter for calibration?


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Chris Putnam said:


> I just received a Shockwiz and pretty excited to give it a go. Shocks are something ive just put in the middle and forgot. Almost had a big over bars moment on weekend and Shockwiz says I have 70PSI in front shock which is super low for my 200lb 6 foot 3 body!
> 
> Anyhow calibration went fine but was wondering what rebound and open/closed valve setting should be. Just in middle for both? Or does it not matter for calibration?


To make calibration easier when it's time to push and pull to full extension, open up rebound and compression all the way.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Ok so it doesnt affect the calibration in any way? I did find hard to push down ha with it in middle for rebound and fully open.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

No it doesn’t effect calibration. Calibration is only measuring compression ratio and the only thing that effects that is volume.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

Chris Putnam said:


> Ok so it doesnt affect the calibration in any way? I did find hard to push down ha with it in middle for rebound and fully open.


no calibration is just to check the ratio of pressure change vs travel. only spacers will affect calibration since they change the air spring curve.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Great thanks. I understand. Im sure i need some spacers but lets see what Shockwiz officially reports after a ride. Excited!


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Chris Putnam said:


> Great thanks. I understand. Im sure i need some spacers but lets see what Shockwiz officially reports after a ride. Excited!


Just don't think it's a one ride tells all sort of process. It will most likely take a few rides and even with that there is some wiggle room with adjustments that will still give acceptable feedback.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Back after 2 x 1.5hr rides on exactly same route, temperature, albeit much muddier for second ride. 

I had great feedback upon calibration and realizing I was at 70PSI in fork when it should have been 100! I calibrated several times and found 2.4 was my average fiugure and was happy. I rode on this with Shockwiz recording and I found it too hard for me, but easier to do little bunny hops. Super reactive in front end and I actually got PRs. The Shockwiz told me to take 5% PSI out and one spacer and 1 click on slow rebound. It said I had to do major change to High compression but I don have this adjustment. Overall I was very happy with this feedback and it matched what I found and thought

I did my second ride today after dropping to about 90PSI and adding one volume spacer and adjusting rebound one click slower. As I was riding I noticed my phone had gone up in shock score to 84 from 72. Which is great. Then I finished my ride and it was back to 74. It told me to take out 10% PSI and again add another spacer. Personally the bike felt great so im not sure i want to make those changes. Ill go softer again in PSI and ride again.

Just a bit frustrating. But i guess its only two rides and 3hrs


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Chris Putnam said:


> Back after 2 x 1.5hr rides on exactly same route, temperature, albeit much muddier for second ride.
> 
> I had great feedback upon calibration and realizing I was at 70PSI in fork when it should have been 100! I calibrated several times and found 2.4 was my average fiugure and was happy. I rode on this with Shockwiz recording and I found it too hard for me, but easier to do little bunny hops. Super reactive in front end and I actually got PRs. The Shockwiz told me to take 5% PSI out and one spacer and 1 click on slow rebound. It said I had to do major change to High compression but I don have this adjustment. Overall I was very happy with this feedback and it matched what I found and thought
> 
> ...


Don't forget, after adding volume spacers you need to recalibrate. As your compression ratio will change.


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## crashing_sux (Aug 11, 2006)

It's almost like he is saying volume spacers change volume.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Only change the top listed item, air pressure. Once it's dialed then move to volume and so on. Top to bottom. 
Air pressure changes require a reset. Volume changes require a recalibration and reset and going back to dialing in your air pressure all over again as typically you'll need a lower pressure. You can take a few shortcuts. For instance if you need more rebound damping AND air pressure you can reasonably assume that more air pressure is only going to exasperate your lack of rebound damping (higher air pressure will naturally speed up your suspension) and therefore can adjust both at once to be closer. 
Then you have to ride consistently, I'd suggest the type or even exact trail that best performance is most important to you as your test loop. On my local trails SW gives me the exact same result 9/10 times. 
I find it to be a fabulous tool that combined with some decent suspension parts has gotten my suspension to feel amazing. 
Good luck.









Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Thanks so much for the advice. Yep i did recalibrate. It went from 2.4 to 2.6 for me after spacer. The other thing is that the trail had gone from tackey to pretty sloppy for a lot of it so wasnt able to throw the bike around as much. Ill go a bit softer in PSI (as it feels nicer) and leave it at that. I doubt i need another volume spacer logically speaking.

So i get the rebound being Low only if no high. Obviously for low and high compression nothing can be changed if not the option? Rhythm 34 fork on a Stumpjumper. So pretty basic, but still nice


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Chris Putnam said:


> Thanks so much for the advice. Yep i did recalibrate. It went from 2.4 to 2.6 for me after spacer. The other thing is that the trail had gone from tackey to pretty sloppy for a lot of it so wasnt able to throw the bike around as much. Ill go a bit softer in PSI (as it feels nicer) and leave it at that. I doubt i need another volume spacer logically speaking.
> 
> So i get the rebound being Low only if no high. Obviously for low and high compression nothing can be changed if not the option? Rhythm 34 fork on a Stumpjumper. So pretty basic, but still nice


I have a Rhythm 34 also and always have left it open. I had been getting SW telling me to firm LSC so I started playing with the adjuster dial. I printed and cut to fit a label so that I could repeatedly tell where the dial was set and found a spot that made the fork feel better and satisfied SW. The problem with that is the dial wanders back towards open during a ride. So I ordered the top cap from a Performance 34 that will allow me to position the dial where I want with an indent.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

rstark18 said:


> I have a Rhythm 34 also and always have left it open. I had been getting SW telling me to firm LSC so I started playing with the adjuster dial. I printed and cut to fit a label so that I could repeatedly tell where the dial was set and found a spot that made the fork feel better and satisfied SW. The problem with that is the dial wanders back towards open during a ride. So I ordered the top cap from a Performance 34 that will allow me to position the dial where I want with an indent.


Nice. I should check that out too. I too have fully open. At moment everything saying to go a bit softer. PSI, rebound etc.


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## root_0x54 (Jul 15, 2019)

Hi, 
I have requested a year ago to be in BETA access for FW. It wasn't granted at that time. Now after a year I have turned on shockwiz and got beta access and update to 6.0 version. But cant find any changelogs. Anyone knows what is the real difference between BETA FW and LIVE FW? 

Thanks


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

Don't make changes wither until the BIG "%" (Confidence score) goes above 75%. This means you've given the processor enough data to give you meaningful suggestions.


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

Don't make changes either until the BIG "%" (Confidence score) goes above 75%. This means you've given the processor enough data to give you meaningful suggestions.


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## ehayes (Jun 25, 2019)

I am thinking of buying a Shockwiz. Do most folks that have used one think it improved their suspension and their riding? Is it worth the investment. I would probably lean to buying one rather than renting. My skills are progressing and I get more and more aggressive as time goes on. I would think given my progression, I would want to re-setup the fork and shock every few months, as I start to hit more and more aggressive trails.

I am trying to dial in a newish SC 5010 (Fox 34 Fit4, DPX2). This is my first new mountain bike in ~20 years, so the technology is all new. I am an engineer and very mechanically inclined, but still failing to get the suspension close to 100%. I also have a hard time telling what/where the limits of the bike are with regard to how it should be feeling. Sometimes it feels great, sometimes it feels like the suspension could be better.

For example, I have never used more than 2/3 the travel on either the fork or shock. I can use a bit more on the shock. I am 165 lbs ready to ride. I have the sags set per the Fox manual, and the recommended other settings. It seems to me like the front is too harsh (seems to be the Fox 34 in general somewhat based on other threads here) and the rear soaks up things nicely, maybe too nice as the front seems more poppy than the rear. Some of this could be my riding though.

Anyway, the shockwiz seems like a good idea. Thoughts?


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

For someone that doesn’t have a lot of suspension setup experience (like me) it does a really good job at teaching you what to do. 
I’m about the same weight as you but on my Rhythm 34 I’m running 60psi, a little comp.damp, and 4 clicks of rebound from closed. That’s not too close to Fox’s settings but feels MUCH better and puts me at about 20% dynamic sag. 
I do need to take out a volume spacer. Ever since I added a little comp damp I haven’t been using all my travel and I’ve been hitting the biggest jumps I’m ever going to.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

I have Fox Rhythm 34 fork (maybe same). When i got bike it was 70PSI and setup for average person id presume. It felt great I must say but really got a lot of travel (not bad). The Fox settings on shock are 100 and it felt very hard. Still I started at that with Shockwiz and its just asked me to go softer everytime. 4 times ive been out (very patient at 6hrs of riding!) im now down to 76PSI. I added a volume spacer early on as I had ready about this being a requirement plus getting told by Shockwiz.

I have nopticxed that the way you ride will affect things a lot too. I went aggressive one time and got a score of 82. The its been wet and ive backed off a bit and now im on 74 Shock score. I suspect (hope) my further drop of PSI will be just right and at least get that right before I touch any more spacers and rebound.

I have it in my head however that going into 70s PSI for 200lb rider seems soft. But if im not landing big jumps etc, or simply have weight back more, then IO wont be using much travel and can go softer


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

ehayes said:


> I am thinking of buying a Shockwiz. Do most folks that have used one think it improved their suspension and their riding? Is it worth the investment. I would probably lean to buying one rather than renting. My skills are progressing and I get more and more aggressive as time goes on. I would think given my progression, I would want to re-setup the fork and shock every few months, as I start to hit more and more aggressive trails.
> 
> I am trying to dial in a newish SC 5010 (Fox 34 Fit4, DPX2). This is my first new mountain bike in ~20 years, so the technology is all new. I am an engineer and very mechanically inclined, but still failing to get the suspension close to 100%. I also have a hard time telling what/where the limits of the bike are with regard to how it should be feeling. Sometimes it feels great, sometimes it feels like the suspension could be better.
> 
> ...


After almost 3 weeks with one my friend let me borrow.....I caved and bought my own on PInkbike.com. They are on the forum classifieds and ranged from $230 to $250 2nd hand.

I think it's totally worth it for you, even at a brand new price, since you have a full suspension and more settings to dial in. (I only have a hardtail).

And to directly answer your Q - YES, it totally helped me dial stuff in and also understand what different settings on your suspension make the bike do. Very very cool piece of tech . I really like knowing the EXACT pressure that's in my fork at all times.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

I just took out the one volume spacer out of my Fox Rhythm 34 and recalibratied. I got the exact same compression ratio as when I had the spacer in which is 2.3.
Everything appears to be correct as when I compress the fork the shockwiz's 30% is the actual 30% on the fork.
Why would the CR stay the same?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

It shouldn't. Perhaps you didn't get the fork to full bottom out during calibration.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

*Shockwiz App now Zero's the ambient air pressure*

Have you guys noticed that the latest version of the app now zero's the Shockwiz ambient air pressure to 0.0psi? I hated that my Shockwiz would always show a few psi when not mounted to a fork or shock.


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## floatingkiwi (May 11, 2006)

rstark18 said:


> I just took out the one volume spacer out of my Fox Rhythm 34 and recalibratied. I got the exact same compression ratio as when I had the spacer in which is 2.3.
> Everything appears to be correct as when I compress the fork the shockwiz's 30% is the actual 30% on the fork.
> Why would the CR stay the same?


I find the same at times. Potentially you're at, lets say 2.86 with the first setup and 2.94 with the next. Both round to 2.9 but are slightly different. I think the system needs to be more accurate than that - but it's not. Try some deep compression events with both numbers (while you still have minimal air in the fork), and see which works better (more accurately).


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

A few weeks into having the Shockwiz and its an interesting device. I still struggle to get tuning scores above 80 but a few reasons. The main riding in different areas, although similar terrain. To get that shock tuning score perfect you have to keep variables the same as much as possible, including riding style. Even getting tired for me, means i dont push the shock as hard and it wants me to let air out. But I have managed to get air pressure green, but more importantly Im understanding the ranges and what I need to do in different terrain and how it makes sense. I like that. Unbelievably Im still just on front shock as im trying to get the air and spacers right. Took me ages to find a Rhythm 34 spacer once, and then twice damn. But will be settling around 78PSI (200lb rider) and 2 shock spacers at this point. Look forward to trying rear out and expect that to need changes...which might affect the front.

I guess the moral of the story is that while ive been frustrated at times ive learn to one, pay attention to my suspensiuon which I never did before. Two actually begin to understand what it does and how i need to change it from when im doing singletrack with the kids, or going to a semi Enduro park.


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## crembz (Feb 25, 2019)

I just got a shockwiz installed yesterday. I've been reading up (must confess I haven't read this entire thread, and I've calibrated and created profiles for the shock and fork.

I noticed when you create a profile it prepopilates the baseline air pressure and compression ratio. when saving a new profile though these things seem to not change from the original, even if psi has been adjusted. Is the normal?

Am I correct in understanding that to switch profiles you select the profile and hit upload? I'm not sure I understand the purpose of download though.

has anyone else experienced air loss when disconnecting the shock. Disconnecting the fork gives a very small release of air but the shock is much more significant. on reconnecting the shockwiz I noticed I had in fact lost air (less on the fork than the shock)


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

*Fox 34 FIT4 HSC LSC*

First attempt at Shockwiz and got these results for my 2020 Fox 34 FIT4. I had the 3-Position Lever set to "Medium" (not Open) with two tokens.

To achieve "softer" High Speed Compression and Low Speed Compression, should I just switch the 3-position Lever to "Open"?


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

Yes, try open mode. 

Assuming factory fork, Open mode then allows the use of “open mode adjust” (black dial 22clicks). Fully clockwise firmest and fully counter-clockwise more plush. 

Fox recommends 18 clicks from closed. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

junior77 said:


> Yes, try open mode.
> 
> Assuming factory fork, Open mode then allows the use of "open mode adjust" (black dial 22clicks). Fully clockwise firmest and fully counter-clockwise more plush.
> 
> Fox recommends 18 clicks from closed.


Thanks, fork is Performance Elite so same as adjustments as Factory.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

RacerLex said:


> Thanks, fork is Performance Elite so same as adjustments as Factory.


Great...let us know how you get on with the adjustments. Looks like you didn't need the shockwiz if you got all green on the first go.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

junior77 said:


> Great...let us know how you get on with the adjustments. Looks like you didn't need the shockwiz if you got all green on the first go.


Beginner's luck! This is for an Ibis Ripley v4 which I couldn't get sorted out using Ibis' or Fox's recommended settings. I ended up trying Pivot's recommended settings for the Trail429 and it felt so much better! Part of Pivot's recommendation is to put the 3-Position Lever in the Medium setting for heavier riders (200lbs here). But I'll try Open and see what Shockwiz says.

Next up will be the rear shock which is really what I'm hoping to improve.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Does Shockwiz seem to suggest too slow rebound?
I had my settings pretty dialed in according to SW. But I was listening to some interviews with some team mechanics and especially with Fox's Jordi Cortes and something I heard a few times is that a lot of people set rebound much too slow.
On my fork I have 62psi and rebound at 3 clicks from closed. If I deviate from that too much then SW starts complaining. Today I ran 8 clicks from closed to see how it felt. It definitely felt different (not sure if it's good or bad)
My shock is similar with rebound (190psi @ 4 clicks). I chaged that to 6 clicks.


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

rstark18 said:


> Does Shockwiz seem to suggest too slow rebound?
> I had my settings pretty dialed in according to SW. But I was listening to some interviews with some team mechanics and especially with Fox's Jordi Cortes and something I heard a few times is that a lot of people set rebound much too slow.
> On my fork I have 62psi and rebound at 3 clicks from closed. If I deviate from that too much then SW starts complaining. Today I ran 8 clicks from closed to see how it felt. It definitely felt different (not sure if it's good or bad)
> My shock is similar with rebound (190psi @ 4 clicks). I chaged that to 6 clicks.


I ride EVERYDAY, literally. Same trails too. The SW isn't an exact science. It a good guide to help you understand how your shock works and to give you good suggestions on what may come close. Even if all the measurements are in the "green," I find that depending on the trail and outside temperature, the settings can vary. It gets me close to where I want to be then i just go on feel. In the end - it's all about how your hands feel, trail type, speed, your experience, etc.....so many factors. It's a really good way of getting you to the proper "middle ground" - then just adjust your Pressure/comp/reb with a psi/click or two to dial it in to your preference :thumbsup:


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

sroc3 said:


> I ride EVERYDAY, literally. Same trails too. The SW isn't an exact science. It a good guide to help you understand how your shock works and to give you good suggestions on what may come close. Even if all the measurements are in the "green," I find that depending on the trail and outside temperature, the settings can vary. It gets me close to where I want to be then i just go on feel. In the end - it's all about how your hands feel, trail type, speed, your experience, etc.....so many factors. It's a really good way of getting you to the proper "middle ground" - then just adjust your Pressure/comp/reb with a psi/click or two to dial it in to your preference :thumbsup:


What this person said...minus the "I ride everyday" part. I wish I could.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I really haven't had that experience. I get the exact same read out on SW 9 out of 10 times. 

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Kamkam (Feb 25, 2019)

Does Shockwiz recommend to slow rebound?
Generally yes in balanced setting. Probably fine if you are a slower rider. Found neutral, poppy custom setting matches rebound when I bracket for fast, choppy terrain.

Consistency?
I usually get same reading 9/10 times. Usually rebound will say slow down if I am going very slow vs my normal speed. And may say add compression or token if I bottom out from poorly executed drops/jumps. Very rare though since I have gotten pretty consistent with my riding.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I don't expect the rear to be this easy.
32mm Fox F29 100mm CTD


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## ehayes (Jun 25, 2019)

NordieBoy said:


> I don't expect the rear to be this easy.


I rented a couple of Shockwizs last week and had similar results with both my fork and shock. The suggestions were minor. A click slower rebound on both and a click in different directions on the LSC for each. I was hoping for more changes in volume spacers, etc, but nope.

BTW, I rented the two Shockwizs from FeelTheBerm. I recommend them. Their rental period is a full week.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

ehayes said:


> I rented a couple of Shockwizs last week and had similar results with both my fork and shock. The suggestions were minor. A click slower rebound on both and a click in different directions on the LSC for each. I was hoping for more changes in volume spacers, etc, but nope.


I've only got air pressure and rebound to play with each end, so fingers crossed 
Not worried about bobbing as as I climb out of of the saddle and that's going to skew the results.

After getting the rear working in in open, I'll try again in trail mode (with firm/planted) as that's where I spend most of my time.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

NordieBoy said:


> I don't expect the rear to be this easy.


It was easy.
A quick air can service and ended up dropping the pressure from my normal 190 to 170 and closing the rebound a click.
In trail mode, 5 more psi and another click of rebound was all it took.
Rebound is is now 2 clicks from closed and should be fine open or climbing.

I've ended up 5psi more each end than recommended for open mode mode as it was using almost all the travel in a normal trail ride and I'd prefer a safety margin.

Short track XC today should give trail mode a good test.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

NordieBoy said:


> I don't expect the rear to be this easy.
> 32mm Fox F29 100mm CTD


On my 2019 Jeffsy 29 CF Pro Race, I always felt the Fox Float DPX2 in the rear was pretty dailed in using the Fox recommended settings.

This was the first time testing on one of my favorite local trails that has a bit of everything.








It took me a bit to dial in the 150mm Fox 36 Grip2 fork, but I eventually got there.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

hidperf said:


> On my 2019 Jeffsy 29 CF Pro Race, I always felt the Fox Float DPX2 in the rear was pretty dailed in using the Fox recommended settings.


I didn't hold out much hope that 2012 suspension that's never been serviced until I lubed the air can on the shock and replaced the dust seals on the fork would work remotely close to the way it was meant to.

Now I can't use that as an excuse for being as slow as I am


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## bstat918 (May 9, 2020)

I just started using mine today and got a good amount of runs in but its telling me to add more lsc when I only have 1 more click till lsc is fully closed. I'm guessing having lsc completely closed can't be the right setup. I ride pretty aggressive and have it setup as neutral-planted.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

bstat918 said:


> I just started using mine today and got a good amount of runs in but its telling me to add more lsc when I only have 1 more click till lsc is fully closed. I'm guessing having lsc completely closed can't be the right setup. I ride pretty aggressive and have it setup as neutral-planted.


Wow! That seems crazy. Never heard such a tune result from Shockwiz.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

bstat918 said:


> I just started using mine today and got a good amount of runs in but its telling me to add more lsc when I only have 1 more click till lsc is fully closed. I'm guessing having lsc completely closed can't be the right setup. I ride pretty aggressive and have it setup as neutral-planted.


You've gone through each suggested setting from top to bottom, resetting after you've made a change (if recommended) at each point? 
And the very last thing it's telling you is to add more LSC?


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## bstat918 (May 9, 2020)

hidperf said:


> You've gone through each suggested setting from top to bottom, resetting after you've made a change (if recommended) at each point?
> And the very last thing it's telling you is to add more LSC?


What do I reset after the change? Do I start a new session after every adjustment?


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

bstat918 said:


> What do I reset after the change? Do I start a new session after every adjustment?


Every time you change anything you should start a new session.

First runs you'll be looking at air pressure. Did you need to add or remove air pressure? Reset the session until you get a green on air pressure.

Once that's green, then you move to volume spacers. If you need to change those at all, you need to do the entire compression ratio setup procedure again and start a new session. 
Each time you change volume spacers, you MUST do the compression ratio setup procedure and start a new session.

Make sure you put the same air pressure in that got you to the green air pressure setting too. 
You might notice the air pressure isn't green anymore after you change volume spacers, so you may need to start over with air pressure again.

When you've finally gotten green on air pressure and volume spacers, start a new session and keep moving down the line, starting a new session each time you make any adjustment to compression or rebound, even if it's just one click. Although I recommend following the guide when adjusting compression and rebound and going at least 2 clicks so you can work your way to the correct setting.

Also, you should have at least two profiles created and stored. One for your fork and one for your shock (if you have one). 
Each of these will have a different compression ratio, which is most important, and other details. 
When you switch from fork to shock, upload the shock profile so you're working with the correct compression ratio. 
When you move it back to the fork, upload the fork profile so you have the correct compression ratio to start with.


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## kodo28 (Apr 21, 2012)

Shouldn't the Baseline be adjusted in pair with Volume spacers ?


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

Direct from SRAM:

Anytime you add or remove spacers you need to recalibrate the compression ratio. Anytime you change air pressure, compression or rebound you need to start a new session. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## kodo28 (Apr 21, 2012)

What I mean is that on video from SRAM ( 4:03 ) they are telling that Baseline and Air Spring should be tuned as a pair.






That means, if I need to tune the baseline and the air spring. It should be done at same time ? Or I can start with baseline and than calibrate and then do the air spring.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

kodo28 said:


> What I mean is that on video from SRAM ( 4:03 ) they are telling that Baseline and Air Spring should be tuned as a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You have to start with some token (or no tokens), but you have to start somewhere.

Say your fork has 2 tokens.

Get your air pressure to green. Then if your tokens still needs to be adjusted, add or remove tokens...recal and go ride. You will probably have to adjust your baseline air pressure after changing tokens. And continue this process and until both are green.

Does that make sense? You only need to recal when adding/removing tokens.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## kodo28 (Apr 21, 2012)

Sounds good :thumbsup:, by the video from SRAM I thought that I should do both adjustment at same time.

Tuning SD ultimate shock. Actually shock has one gnar dog 2.5. So I should remove some air check for green and than check for removing gnar dog and replace it maybe for 1 token.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

kodo28 said:


> Sounds good :thumbsup:, by the video from SRAM I thought that I should do both adjustment at same time.
> 
> Tuning SD ultimate shock. Actually shock has one gnar dog 2.5. So I should remove some air check for green and than check for removing gnar dog and replace it maybe for 1 token.


I don't see how both can be done at the same time. They are dependent on each other. If you change one, the other will be effected. The key is to have those both green with high level of confidence before moving on to any of the other settings.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## kodo28 (Apr 21, 2012)

Well this is the doubt I had by watching that video. 
On the video they are telling you, that both should be done first and as a pair and then proceed to the others. 
So this would tell, I should remove air and token at same time and than do a recalibration like told on video and not making adjustment on baseline and then after green on baseline check for air spring.


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## MTB_MOR (Jul 4, 2018)

*shockwiz*

Do you have the steps above the lsc set up correctly first and did you reset your shockwiz after making the changes? I don't know if you have to completely recalibrate it after making changes, but I do know there was something like this. Even after using the shockwiz and making it happy, I made changes to my fork. I run 12 clicks from open out of 18 on my fork, but I doubt closing it is appropriate...


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

I just got a ripmo v2 with a 36 grip2 and a float x2. I only have one ShockWiz. Last time I used it I was running an elevensix so I only had the fork to worry about. Should I try and get the fork dialed first or the shock?

My plan was to get one pretty much dialed, then do the other, then spot check the first to see if recommendations change. But I’m not sure which to start with and I’d rather not buy a second ShockWiz.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

Jukas said:


> I just got a ripmo v2 with a 36 grip2 and a float x2. I only have one ShockWiz. Last time I used it I was running an elevensix so I only had the fork to worry about. Should I try and get the fork dialed first or the shock?
> 
> My plan was to get one pretty much dialed, then do the other, then spot check the first to see if recommendations change. But I'm not sure which to start with and I'd rather not buy a second ShockWiz.


You don't need two of them. I would recommend starting with the base recommended setting from Fox on both. 
After you take it for a few rides, whichever seems like it needs the most adjustment, start there. Once it's dialed in, switch the ShockWiz to the other and continue tuning.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Yeah takes a lot longer to setup with one obviously but remember once we have each end dial theres limited use for Shockwiz unless we go somewhere new of course. 

Question I have is even after you guys have shocks dialled do you keep on gathering data? I can see my leaving it on but of course a bit unsightly


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

Chris Putnam said:


> Question I have is even after you guys have shocks dialled do you keep on gathering data? I can see my leaving it on but of course a bit unsightly


I've been setting up tuning profiles for every local trail I ride. We have enough variations that I can create fork and shock tunes for each of them, although I've been finding the rear shock tunes seem to be the same for all.


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## Chris Putnam (Aug 4, 2014)

Funny you say that. My rear shock was easy top get right. 94 tuning score. Just needed to get PSI right and other settings were pretty much green. Front shock much harder. Would have done 10 outings to get to 88


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

I assumed there was a way to save "session suggestions", but I can't seem to find it! Maybe there is no way, would just be convenient and leave a trail as to what has been done.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Simplemind said:


> I assumed there was a way to save "session suggestions", but I can't seem to find it! Maybe there is no way, would just be convenient and leave a trail as to what has been done.


Screenshots. That's what I do.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

Hi All, need some help here.

I've been using my Shockwiz and got my SB100's DPS Factory tuned. I was able to get high confidence with all recommendations after about 45 minutes of riding.

Now I'm tuning my Ripley V4's DPS Performance. Calibrated it and started riding. I got 49% confidence after about 30 minutes of riding, and it got stuck on 49% even after about an hr of riding. I started a new session, rode for an hr, and no score, as if no data was collected.

How long does it usually take for Shockwiz to collect sufficient data? Not sure what I'm missing here. It worked just fine when I was tuning the SB100, pretty straight forward at that time, but not anymore now that I'm on my Ibis. Any suggestions? Thanks.


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

rstark18 said:


> Screenshots. That's what I do.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Same. I wish it would allow you to save the session suggestions though. 
Does anyone know if they have a customer feedback contact for ideas like this?


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

onlybirdman said:


> Hi All, need some help here.
> 
> I've been using my Shockwiz and got my SB100's DPS Factory tuned. I was able to get high confidence with all recommendations after about 45 minutes of riding.
> 
> ...


Umm...screen shots?

Figure 30 minutes of riding should give you something, unless you're on smooth pavement or something.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hidperf (Jul 14, 2011)

onlybirdman said:


> Hi All, need some help here.
> 
> I've been using my Shockwiz and got my SB100's DPS Factory tuned. I was able to get high confidence with all recommendations after about 45 minutes of riding.
> 
> ...


I think it really depends on the trail you're riding and if you hit everything ShockWiz is looking for.

I've personally never hit a completed tuning session in under 90mins of riding my local trails. But I assume that's because the type of terrain ShockWiz needs is spread out across the entire length of the trails.


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

onlybirdman said:


> Hi All, need some help here.
> 
> I've been using my Shockwiz and got my SB100's DPS Factory tuned. I was able to get high confidence with all recommendations after about 45 minutes of riding.
> 
> ...


Yea that seems odd, I can get to 95% in 15 minutes usually (maybe that's just my local trail). Maybe check the battery?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

Thanks for all the replies.

- my trail is fairly diverse, steady climbs, rocks, roots, jumps, drops... etc. I can hit all that within 30 minutes.

- battery is good, less than 3 weeks old.

The weird part is that it was able to get up to 49% confidence at one point, and then it just stopped taking data after that. It got stuck at 49%, and the next new session stays at zero, see screenshot. I rode for about 1 hr after new session started.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

onlybirdman said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> - my trail is fairly diverse, steady climbs, rocks, roots, jumps, drops... etc. I can hit all that within 30 minutes.
> 
> ...


Cal status is red, needs to be green.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

junior77 said:


> Cal status is red, needs to be green.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yeah I was already messing with it before I took the screenshot. But yeah it was calibrated, it was green. I'm reinstalling everything, air up, re-calibrate, see if that helps.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

onlybirdman said:


> Yeah I was already messing with it before I took the screenshot. But yeah it was calibrated, it was green. I'm reinstalling everything, air up, re-calibrate, see if that helps.


I was gonna say it wasn't making sense since it's only showing 1% travel. But, it needs to be green.

Definitely start with a fresh calibration and hope that works, otherwise send SRAM an email as something isn't right.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

Before calibrating do a reset. To do that, take the battery out, flip it over and leave it in flipped for 10 seconds. After that put the battery in the right way. That will do a reset.


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

rstark18 said:


> Before calibrating do a reset. To do that, take the battery out, flip it over and leave it in flipped for 10 seconds. After that put the battery in the right way. That will do a reset.


Yeah totally, thanks for that.


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

by the way, something weird. I was just about to reset and re-calibrate everything, and the cal status is back to GREEN again, before I touched it any further. I haven't touched it since I posted that screenshot with the RED calibration. 

Anyway, I'll be resetting it and re-calibrate it just for fun before my next ride.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

onlybirdman said:


> by the way, something weird. I was just about to reset and re-calibrate everything, and the cal status is back to GREEN again, before I touched it any further. I haven't touched it since I posted that screenshot with the RED calibration.
> 
> Anyway, I'll be resetting it and re-calibrate it just for fun before my next ride.


It does that. Just do a reset anyway like you said.


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## onlybirdman (Feb 12, 2015)

Issue resolved. Reset last night, re-calibrated again this morning at the trail head. Got 3 back to back sessions at 100% confidence within an hour. All is good. Thanks all.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Simplemind said:


> I assumed there was a way to save "session suggestions", but I can't seem to find it! Maybe there is no way, would just be convenient and leave a trail as to what has been done.


Use the app's Profile feature! It saves all the data from your session for easy lookup later. I title sessions like "JMP trail 96 Balanced [date]). If you create a SRAM ID and login, it will also save your profiles to the cloud, so you can sync them to other devices or when you get a new phone, etc.

I wrote up a short blog post about it:
https://www.feeltheberm.com/blog/shockwiz-now-supports-tuning-profiles


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## kodo28 (Apr 21, 2012)

Super Deluxe Ultimate tuned





















Very happy with the shock feeling :thumbsup:


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## MaksK (Oct 30, 2019)

bryanus said:


> Use the app's Profile feature! It saves all the data from your session for easy lookup later. I title sessions like "JMP trail 96 Balanced [date]). If you create a SRAM ID and login, it will also save your profiles to the cloud, so you can sync them to other devices or when you get a new phone, etc.
> 
> I wrote up a short blog post about it:
> https://www.feeltheberm.com/blog/shockwiz-now-supports-tuning-profiles


Does the profile hold calibration? Meaning you can switch from fork to shock on the trail without doing calibration wizard all over again?

Also, one feature that I would like to see is to be able to pause logging on part of the trails, like pavement road, bike hiking on some sections, etc, basically eliminating non essential data for shockwiz to be logged...


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

MaksK said:


> Does the profile hold calibration? Meaning you can switch from fork to shock on the trail without doing calibration wizard all over again?


That's what the Profiles are all about.

Click on the shock profile and upload it to the ShockWiz and you're ready to do a session.
At the end, go into the shock profile again and download from the ShockWiz and it'll store the settings/suggestions etc.

Then upload the fork profile, and you're away doing that one, etc.

I had climbing and descending fork and shock profiles I'd switch between.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

I’ve never used profiles except initially and didn’t like the hassle. 
But with the mention of them I thought I’d give them another shot. 

My issue is after creating one and going through all the bother of filling in all the information, I figured I could just hit the duplicate button and all that info would be copied into a second file. I thought that would make it easy to log each ride into a new profile. BUT, it doesn’t duplicate all the info. It looks like it just duplicates the title. That is not useful at all. I might as well not duplicate and just create a new one. But then I just don’t see an advantage to use profiles for logging ride data. 

I can see where profiles would help when uploading back to the SW for quick setup. But for logging each ride it seems like a lot of work whereas screenshots take all of 10 seconds for all the screens. 

I don’t see anywhere to view these profiles online. I know they are backed up there but it would be nice to see them. Maybe that will be an addition to their AXS website.


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## Lance Clifford (Aug 25, 2020)

Hey guys, I've been playing with the Shockwiz for a couple of days now. It works perfectly on my son's Stumpy with Rockshox fork with about a score of 96. 

However I'm having some issues on my Firebird 29 with Fox 36. It's not giving me a shock tuning score at all, and the confidence score will not go over 49% no matter how long/rough the ride is. It gives me detections and suggestions, but why am I not getting a score or a better confidence rating?


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## Lance Clifford (Aug 25, 2020)

onlybirdman said:


> Hi All, need some help here.
> 
> I've been using my Shockwiz and got my SB100's DPS Factory tuned. I was able to get high confidence with all recommendations after about 45 minutes of riding.
> 
> ...


I'm having the exact same issue on my Fox 36 on my Pivot (worked perfectly on my son's Stumpy with Rockshox). I see you did a reset and recal and it fixed the issue. I'll give that a shot!


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## csf (Apr 28, 2007)

just used the shock wiz last night for the first time on my yari. went really well and pretty much confirmed my settings. I've read through all these pages, watched the videos, and read the manual. Lots to digest!

My question, i didn't see in the settings a place to set altitude. Did that go away and is autonomous now? My rides typically start between 4k and 8K.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

I'm running into a problem where I can't complete the calibration wizard on my 2021 fox float x2. No matter what it always tells me not enough of a pressure change.

I've tried no less than 10x tonight using the timed feature for extensions and compressions. It's a pita to get full extension at 0psi but I've been sure to do it.

Anyone else run into this before?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Can I just sense check something with you guys? I'm planning on installing an Avalanche coil hybrid damper. This is an open bath damper with a coil spring that all sits in the damper side. It makes no changes to the air spring side mechanically, it just means you run a lower pressure. To my understanding, shockwiz will still work with this as all it needs is top, bottom and the compression ratio between which it can still get.

Anyone have any other thoughts?


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## bikedrd (Jul 8, 2004)

Jukas said:


> I'm running into a problem where I can't complete the calibration wizard on my 2021 fox float x2. No matter what it always tells me not enough of a pressure change.
> 
> I've tried no less than 10x tonight using the timed feature for extensions and compressions. It's a pita to get full extension at 0psi but I've been sure to do it.
> 
> Anyone else run into this before?


Try it with 10 psi instead of 0.


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## bikedrd (Jul 8, 2004)

Onzadog, I think you are right.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

:thumbsup:


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

bikedrd said:


> Try it with 10 psi instead of 0.


There's definitely something going on between the shockwiz and the x2. It works normally on my Fox 36, but on the x2 it'll only let a tiny amount of air out and then reads 0 psi, when I put a shock pump on I'm still at 235psi so it only let out about 15.

I've emailed sram, so we'll see what they have to say.


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## Jukas (Mar 30, 2016)

Jukas said:


> There's definitely something going on between the shockwiz and the x2. It works normally on my Fox 36, but on the x2 it'll only let a tiny amount of air out and then reads 0 psi, when I put a shock pump on I'm still at 235psi so it only let out about 15.
> 
> I've emailed sram, so we'll see what they have to say.


So if anyone else runs into this, turns out the hoses I have when seated weren't deep enough to engage the valve core completely, so I was getting odd results. Seems a semi known problem as SRAM forwarded me a KB article https://shockwiz.zendesk.com/hc/en-...-Installation-Hose-Does-Not-Engage-Valve-Core. on it. So with the valve core pulled everything is working normally.


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## nermol (Jan 14, 2004)

I have no more tokens to remove.

Shockwiz is asking for more air pressure on my fork and less tokens. I'm currently @ 135psi and 0 tokens. Any thoughts?
2020 Lyrik Select +


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## wizard604 (Jul 10, 2011)

You have it backwards.. it's asking you to drop your air pressure and add a token...


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## nermol (Jan 14, 2004)

wizard604 said:


> You have it backwards.. it's asking you to drop your air pressure and add a token...


I do t think so.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## geek_inside (Sep 3, 2020)

wizard604 said:


> You have it backwards.. it's asking you to drop your air pressure and add a token...


+1


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## wishiwasbiking (Nov 10, 2019)

nermol said:


> I do t think so.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Inhad the same issue as you when I fist got the shockwiz. Assumed that if I wanted the slider to move to the right I had to follow the direction on the right side, but it isn't how it works.

it is asking you to remove air and add spacers, you have to follow the instruction on the side of the slider.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

Anyone got any feedback as to whether the new FW changed the tuning "style/algorithm" of the SW? I've had mine for a year, used it for a few months getting fork diled, got good consistent scores, but absolutely HATED the tuning style of the thing. Tried different settings, but all of them felt similar...

Shockwiz's Tuning Style:
Very progressive spring
High pressure
Bunch of tokens
Rebound cranked way up (slow/overdamped)
Wanting less HSC (not possible)
LSC cranked way up (overdamped)

My personal preference:
Linear spring feel
Med/High pressure
Faster rebound
Light controlled compression
Low LSC

FWIW its a 2020 SC 34 on a Ripley. Was able to get fork to feel OK by feel, but never like what I think a $900 fork should feel like. Bought SW to see if tuning to it would "fix" the fork...made me hate it. Mezzer is on the way to remedy the situation.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

nermol said:


> I do t think so.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yep, lower pressure and add a token.


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## nermol (Jan 14, 2004)

wishiwasbiking said:


> Inhad the same issue as you when I fist got the shockwiz. Assumed that if I wanted the slider to move to the right I had to follow the direction on the right side, but it isn't how it works.
> 
> it is asking you to remove air and add spacers, you have to follow the instruction on the side of the slider.


Well crap.....I've had the shockwiz for 3 years and interpreted the sliders that way the whole time. Even been able to get to 90's scores with all greens.

Thx all who chimed in.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## evan9r (Oct 21, 2012)

I wonder how much is just a product of the Fox fork and how much is the Shockwiz? You'll love the Mezzer. I have one on my Ripmo.

So would you say the Shockwiz utilizes the 'use all available travel on every ride' method of tuning suspension? I just ordered one and I hope not. I was hoping to tune my McLeod with it and maybe a few buddies suspension as well.



GatorXman said:


> Anyone got any feedback as to whether the new FW changed the tuning "style/algorithm" of the SW? I've had mine for a year, used it for a few months getting fork diled, got good consistent scores, but absolutely HATED the tuning style of the thing. Tried different settings, but all of them felt similar...
> 
> Shockwiz's Tuning Style:
> Very progressive spring
> ...


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## mevnet (Oct 4, 2013)

Wow, tons of info thanks for sharing guys. 
Just got the new toy, assume firmware update and RTFM are the first couple of steps on getting to use it?


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

Forgive me if this has been discussed before, but is it safe to assume air pressure recommendations are based on the amount of “dynamic sag” you’re getting and the “stiffness” you select?

For example, if I want to run 26% sag on the rear of my Ripley, I should put in medium stiffness, but for a fork with closer to 20%, I should maybe put in firm?

I suppose what I’m getting at is that I feel you should be able to tell the shockwiz whether you’re on a fork vs. a rear shock, and what the prescribed sag is for that given suspension product.

Any thoughts on this?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## magnil (Apr 28, 2013)

GatorXman said:


> Anyone got any feedback as to whether the new FW changed the tuning "style/algorithm" of the SW? I've had mine for a year, used it for a few months getting fork diled, got good consistent scores, but absolutely HATED the tuning style of the thing. Tried different settings, but all of them felt similar...
> 
> Shockwiz's Tuning Style:
> Very progressive spring
> ...


Not a direct answer to your finfints but it seems that something definitely changed. Earlier I got some help from the ShockWiz, now it seems that it is happy with most things. 10 psi (80-90 psi in fork) and it still thinks it is perfect. From three clicks to nine clicks open on LSC and it think both settings is perfect. Seems like it should accept most settings now. Anyone experienced the same?


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## TX_CLG (Sep 14, 2010)

I've been really happy with my shockwiz, but now that I'm mostly dialed in, I'm debating about keeping it, renting it out, or selling it. It has been great for learning more about what changes do for sure.


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## GatorXman (Jun 23, 2014)

evan9r said:


> I wonder how much is just a product of the Fox fork and how much is the Shockwiz? You'll love the Mezzer. I have one on my Ripmo.
> 
> So would you say the Shockwiz utilizes the 'use all available travel on every ride' method of tuning suspension? I just ordered one and I hope not. I was hoping to tune my McLeod with it and maybe a few buddies suspension as well.


Sorry I missed this reply...

My theory is that the Shockwiz is designed for mountain riding...extended (seated) climbs followed by long descends. I'm in Florida, so we do not have either. We short punchy (standing) climbs followed by short descends (chutes). I think it senses me standing and jamming up climbs and tries to nullify the "bob" by overdamping everything.

This is just a theory tho. All I know is that I did not like the recommended tune at all.


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## Daipew (Sep 3, 2017)

*Onyx*

Has anyone used Shockwiz with a DVO Onyx fork. This fork has a setting called Off the Top. I am wondering how this is going to effect using Shockwiz?


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

Can someone let me know if it is normal for my fork travel to be at 7% when I am not seated on my bike?


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## mevnet (Oct 4, 2013)

And the fork is....


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## Rivers2648 (Jan 8, 2019)

mevnet said:


> And the fork is....


Ah forgot to mention fork is a Fox 34 130mm.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

It's why you lift the fork so it's unweighted during calibration. Depending on the spring force in the fork, how much stiction is in it and how heavy the bike is (head angle can also have an impact) then it's not unrealistic to see that.


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Daipew said:


> Has anyone used Shockwiz with a DVO Onyx fork. This fork has a setting called Off the Top. I am wondering how this is going to effect using Shockwiz?


I contacted SRAM about this and they said:



> Yes, forks with OTT are compatible with ShockWiz. This adjustment works by increasing or decreasing the pre-load on the coil negative spring and does not affect the volume of the positive air chamber. The only thing that may be required is to set the OTT adjustment to its least amount of pre-load when performing the Full Extension Step of the ShockWiz calibration process. Have a lot of pre-load on the negative coil during this step will make it very difficult if not impossible to pull the fork to full extension. Other than that, you should be good to go!


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## phantoj (Jul 7, 2009)

hidperf said:


> This was the first time testing on one of my favorite local trails that has a bit of everything.


Bluffview/Zombie is "one of my favorite local trails" as well. :thumbsup:


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## elko8 (Sep 22, 2019)

This has been asked before, but I didn't see an answer: has anyone found a good way to mount the shockwiz to a lower link Santa Cruz VPP bike? I'm particularly interested in info about the Tallboy V4. Thanks!


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

elko8 said:


> This has been asked before, but I didn't see an answer: has anyone found a good way to mount the shockwiz to a lower link Santa Cruz VPP bike? I'm particularly interested in info about the Tallboy V4. Thanks!


Assuming it's the Fox DPS shock, seems like there should be enough space to mount with the short hose directly onto the air can, no? The way the linkage moves through its travel, the air can is pretty isolated from the swingarm movement so it doesn't look like there would be any interference issues to me. Would love to see any hurdles you've run into.

Update: Had a recent renter with a 2020 Tallboy send me some photos of his mounting solution. He said as full compression the linkage was hitting the Shockwiz when mounted to the air can, so he had to mount it on top of the reservoir. Hope that helps!


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## cpenacoba (Nov 24, 2020)

*High Speed or Low Speed for simpler suspension components*

Hi,

My bike´s suspension elements are Fox Performance Elite Fit4 and Performance Elite DPX2.

Both fork and shock do have compression adjustments on the open position of the lever, as well as rebound adjustment.

However, those compression and rebound are unique, they do not have separate adjustments for high speed or low speed.

Therefore, when ShockWiz tells me, for instance, to increase HSC and to reduce LSC, should I increase or reduce my compression?

In other words, to which speed my unique adjustments correspond to, to the High Speed or to the Low Speed?


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

cpenacoba said:


> Hi,
> 
> My bike´s suspension elements are Fox Performance Elite Fit4 and Performance Elite DPX2.
> 
> ...


That's a good question, and it's really incumbent on the software developer to change the way one inputs their parameters. You should be able to check the boxes of the parameters your shock or fork has, and the software should take that into account when it gives a conclusion. [rant off]


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## cpenacoba (Nov 24, 2020)

*Update on speed match*



cpenacoba said:


> Hi,
> 
> My bike´s suspension elements are Fox Performance Elite Fit4 and Performance Elite DPX2.
> 
> ...


I have contacted Quarq service and they have confirmed that if you only have a single adjustment for compression or for rebound, they most closely match their recommendations for Low Speed. So I will simply ignore whatever result I get for HSC or HSR.

I have a DB Inline Shock on an older bike. I will try all the settings with that, as that shock has much more controls that the DPX2 of my new bike.


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## EJ_92606 (Jul 11, 2004)

So what's the verdict on shock whiz? Is it worthwhile? Is it really improving the suspension and providing greater speed/confidence or is it simply giving a different flavor according to what shock whiz thinks is right?


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## crembz (Feb 25, 2019)

I kinda feel it's a bit line chasing your tail with shockwiz. I had conflicting recommendations on the same trail on different runs. Also it seems to want to turn your bike into a dead squishy lump regardless of tuning style. I set mine to custom firmest/active and the bike still felt too soft and dead.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

In the beginning with SW I'd get pretty good variance on the same trail but in time I became faster and able to charge more consistently and then it would give the exact same results everytime, even on different trails as long as they weren't wildly different.

Sent from my KYOCERA-E6920 using Tapatalk


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## Saiones (Feb 10, 2021)

Hi.
I used shockwiz to tune my Fox 36 Grip 2 180 mm fork.
The fork is installed on a NDURO 8.0 Flyon ebike.
After 5 rides I setup up the fork to have all suggestions "green" and that's fine. 
The only problem is that I'm using only 70% of the travel of the fork. CR is 2.2 and pressure in the fork is 73 PSI.
I was never able to achieve 3% of compression in neutral postion but more.
Should I repeat the entire calibration ensuring the full extension, full compression is achieved?
The fork was very hard to compress and extend at full.
Thanks


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## jeremy3220 (Jul 5, 2017)

Saiones said:


> Hi.
> I used shockwiz to tune my Fox 36 Grip 2 180 mm fork.
> The fork is installed on a NDURO 8.0 Flyon ebike.
> After 5 rides I setup up the fork to have all suggestions "green" and that's fine.
> ...


You may just not be hitting big enough stuff to bottom out a 180mm fork. If there's any volume spacers it would probably help to remove them. Other than that you should set your air pressure and compression damper settings to whatever feels best, not based on how much travel you use.


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## Saiones (Feb 10, 2021)

jeremy3220 said:


> You may just not be hitting big enough stuff to bottom out a 180mm fork. If there's any volume spacers it would probably help to remove them. Other than that you should set your air pressure and compression damper settings to whatever feels best, not based on how much travel you use.


Noted thanks. There was a volume spacer inside and I remouved it just after the first run with shockwiz as per its suggestions. 
I will try to calibrate again the fork: 2.2 compression ratio and 7% of compression with no weight do not seem to me a correct calibration.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Double checking calibration is a worthwhile endeavor as it's easy to make a mistake.
However SW is aiming to dial in the rate the suspension moves. The goal is not to simply use all travel as in some cases, that would require a very light tune that moves poorly controlled.
That said, fork sag should be close to 20%. 
Be sure to always reset the session with the suspension unloaded anytime a change is made to air pressure.

Sent from my KYOCERA-E6920 using Tapatalk


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## bryanus (Jun 1, 2008)

Can anyone share their Shockwiz mounting solution on the 2020-2021 Specialized Enduro with the X2 rear shock?

I am wondering if you could use the long hose to place the Shockwiz at the very bottom-end of the air can, perhaps a bit off to the side to allow more frame clearance. Sort of like this, but on the Enduro the valve is rotated up. Would there be enough frame clearance at full compression? TIA.


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## evan9r (Oct 21, 2012)

Anyone know what to do when it asks for a firmware update but the green bar never moves and the yellow light stays flashing no matter what? Tried removing battery and inserting upside down, new battery, different phone, rebooting phone etc. no luck.


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## evan9r (Oct 21, 2012)

Figured it out thanks to tech support. I had to use the SRAM AXS app instead of the ShockWiz app and it updated just fine with no problems.


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## BIke N Gear (Sep 27, 2004)

Anybody know it a Shockwiz will work properly on a fork with a Vorsprung Secus installed?


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

BIke N Gear said:


> Anybody know it a Shockwiz will work properly on a fork with a Vorsprung Secus installed?


Yes, I've done it with good results.

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## daniel366940 (Sep 23, 2017)

Can you guys recommend the best shockwiz tune for enduro riding Fox 38 / x2 
Want to keep the suspension fast and lively ?


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## angieri918 (Apr 1, 2020)

Has anyone heard if shockwiz will work with dual chamber air springs? I have an ERA and was Curtis about this


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

Definitely not, unfortunately. You’d have to go with Motion Instruments.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

Any thoughts on alternate fork mounting locations? Putting it in the standard location prevents me from loading my bike onto my North Shore bike rack as the rack holds the bike by the back of the fork.


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## 2supple (Aug 29, 2020)

GatorXman said:


> Anyone got any feedback as to whether the new FW changed the tuning "style/algorithm" of the SW? I've had mine for a year, used it for a few months getting fork diled, got good consistent scores, but absolutely HATED the tuning style of the thing. Tried different settings, but all of them felt similar...
> 
> Shockwiz's Tuning Style:
> Very progressive spring
> ...


I'm having exact same results, so no it doesn't seem to have changed. For reference i'm on a Fox 34 Grip 2 (130mm travel) and using the new "balanced - playful" as opposed to just "balanced". Although it lets me toggle between the two profiles and suggestions are very similar.

I still don't have it completely dialed - current score is 84 after 4 rides, continues to ask to reduce HSC (now fully open), add LSC, and slow down both rebounds. I'm a little worried shockwiz is telling me to go too slow on rebound and too damped on LSC. I almost lost traction on the front tire of my last ride, wonder if it is because LSC is getting high (about halfway 8/16 clicks). I'm consistently told I have too much "pogo", meaning add LSC and slow rebound. Wonder if climbing out of the saddle is contributing to this. I'll probably avoid out of the saddle climbing unless needed on my next ride and see which type of score I get.


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

I’d hesitate reading into what the ShockWiz is telling you too closely. It’s important to see what it’s telling you (e.g. sag, big compression events, etc), but then compare that to what you feel on the trail, then decide on your settings.

I found I was looking way too into what the ShockWiz was telling me, and ignoring what I felt. It’s a combo…


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I tend to agree. 
For me, SW is a great tool particularly when it comes to sag.
But sometimes I prefer the settings slightly different, usually more air pressure. 

Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Will the shockwiz work with the mezzar pro? Is their app written specifically for their settings?

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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> Will the shockwiz work with the mezzar pro? Is their app written specifically for their settings?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


Will not work with Mezzer with its three air chambers.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

jacksonlui said:


> Will the shockwiz work with the mezzar pro? Is their app written specifically for their settings?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


No, for 2 reasons:
1) you have 2 different positive air chambers meaning the rate of change calculation SW uses is inaccurate. 
2) when you connect to the Schrader valve on the bottom you are also engaging the negative chamber and the fork will just collapse while attached. 

Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Has anyone any suggestions for alternate fork mounting locations other than the 1 recommended by Quark? Heading to the bike park later this week and the gondola's there carry the bike like some of the northshore racks--bar below the fork and downtube. Was trying to figure out a way to attach to the side of the crown where the stantions attach but zip tying there is challenging due to all the angles preventing you from cinching them down securely.


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

What about just flipping it around the front?


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

It would get destroyed by the arch at full travel.


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## johnsogr (May 31, 2009)

Oh **** good call


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## 6thElement (Jul 17, 2006)

Looks like Mountain Creek? 

Load last and hold your bike up on its rear wheel?


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Yep, its Creek. Was it the shitty gondolas that gave it away?  

True, i can hold it up but It's kinda nice to just relax for a few on the ride up to let the old foreams pump back down.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Was able to use the short hose and some creative ziptie-ery to lash it down to the left side of the CSU. Seemed to stay clear of the gondola bar as long as the bars were turned to the right.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Question about the firmness and liveliness settings during a tuning session... Can these values be changed during an active session and have that session instantly reflect different results? Let's say for example you start out with a soft and planted setting and do a bunch of riding in your session and reach 100% confidence. The app then gives you some suggestions to tweak air and compression a little bit. But then you decide well maybe I want it to be more neutral and poppy so you change them inputs in this session after collecting all of this ride data. Will the app dynamically recalculate with all the data it's captured and give you a different set of suggestions or do you have to start a whole new session again? Seems like you're only asking it for it's a recalculate based on all the information that currently has and wouldn't need to but I'm not sure about this.


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## onzadog (Jan 6, 2008)

Yes. I'll often flick through the style options after a ride and see the score change.

That's just an interpretation of the data. Changing pressure or rebound setting for example, will affect the data set.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Are people still using the shockwiz? I figured by now most of them will be forgotten in drawers.

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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Still using mine. Spent quite a few sessions on 1 bike to get the front and rear dialed, now moving over to the other bike. I find it can take a while to get things where you want to be for several reasons.

1. You may not have the tools and supplies with you to make the air sping changes it suggests. Doing air and token changes trailside isn't practical and you may not even have those items yet since you didn't know it would suggest changing them. now you wait a week for those to come in...
2. you thought you knew how you wanted to set the damper up (soft planted or firm poppy, which do i like better...) and so you try a ride/session on both. Multiply that by 2 of you have a damper with multiple settings (eg. DPS trail and open, Mara IPA switch, etc) and you're going to need even more time to find the right balance.
3. user error. Oops, hose wasnt tight and the original battery went dead.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Use mine all the time. It's a fantastic tool, although not the final word. 
4 bikes in the garage plus a few suspension component changes make it always useful for something. 

Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Yeah, if you're a perpetual tinkerer/upgrader, you'll never put this down!


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Are the profiles saved only locally or is there a way to store them in the cloud somewhere? I'm finally upgrading my 4y/o phone and not sure how to move the SW data over. Definitely dont want to loose that...


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> Are people still using the shockwiz? I figured by now most of them will be forgotten in drawers.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


I bought mine for our group of riders and it's been in non stop use for the last 3 years. In fact I just got a new bike and then upgraded the rear shock, so it back on my bike right now. 10 of us split the cost and it's the best $40 i have ever spent on bike parts.

Just remember that it's a tool and can be setup wrong, give bad data....but I find it extremely helpful and it almost always pushes me in the right direction. Just getting out and turning dials is the first step to a better setup.


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## RacerLex (Jan 20, 2010)

Since I've discovered Manitou suspension my Shockwiz isn't used as much. Primarily because Shockwiz is not compatible Manitou forks using Dorado or IRT such as the Mezzer fork. I can use it with the rear Mara shock though.


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## Satanpez (Sep 16, 2007)

RacerLex said:


> Since I've discovered Manitou suspension my Shockwiz isn't used as much. Primarily because Shockwiz is not compatible Manitou forks using Dorado or IRT such as the Mezzer fork. I can use it with the rear Mara shock though.


Why is that? You can't just hook the Shockwiz up to the low pressure side of the air spring? It would assume you have tokens/spacers but you have the IRT. I would think it would make suggestions for more or less spacers which would mean adding or removing air to the high pressure chamber.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

It requires the entire system be fairly constant after you perform the air spring calibration and those devices introduce too much variability for it to make reliable calculations and suggestions. One of the calibration steps is measuring the compression ratio of the air spring which requires depressurizing and running through range of motion so it can analyze the internal pressure change. If you make any change that would affect the internal static pressure curve, it requires re-calibration and those types of devices dynamially alter the pressure curve on the fly which is why it can't really cope with them. Perhaps it could be used if the dynamic effect is small, but i could understand that its hard for the manufacturer to know what does what out there and just makes the blanket statement.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Satanpez said:


> Why is that? You can't just hook the Shockwiz up to the low pressure side of the air spring? It would assume you have tokens/spacers but you have the IRT. I would think it would make suggestions for more or less spacers which would mean adding or removing air to the high pressure chamber.


I have 2 models of Manitou forks and it just doesn't work.

On the Mezzer there are 2 problems, on the R7 1 problem.

The Mezzer has a variable spring rate because of the 3 chamber system. I certainly considered setting both positive chambers at the same pressure to try and get an accurate CR, and that might work.

Which brings us to problem 2 that both forks have: When you thread on to the shraeder valve both the main positive chamber and the negative chamber are engaged and filled up simultaneously. In fact if you have a pump attached, you can easily move the fork anywhere in it's travel and it'll just sit as air can easily pass between the 2 chambers with fork movement. Which means it would be impossible to actually ride with a SW attached to a Manitou fork.

I tried screwing on the SW very lightly so as not to engage the negative chamber, but couldn't get that to work either.

On a good note my Manitou stuff essentially requires hardly any set up, as it works so darn well. SW is helpful but it's not everything.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I was an early adopter of the shockwiz but ever since converting to a push shock and acs fork, I sold it. Prior to that the shockwiz was a permanent fixture on my bike. Just has been out of the loop on any app improvements. The price has gone up quite a bit.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Should the SW measured compression ratio align with that of the manufacturers' published value (if any)? I was tuning a DPX2 with a .9 spacer which Fox claims should have a CR of 3.32 for that model but the SW calculated out a ratio of 2.0. It's so far off, its concerning.

Even more concerning is that previously i had a .6 spacer in there and it calculated a 2.1 CR. This combo should have been a lower value (or conversely, the larger spacer should have calc'd a higher ratio. 

Is anyone else seeing a large divergence in published CR of a damper vs what SW calc's? Or is this normal and the published charts are wrong or calculated differently between the two? I'll have to experiment with recalibrating and pay attention to the hi and lo psi values during the process to see if its calculating the ratio correctly.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

You are making an error with your compression ratio calculation using shock wiz. Try again.

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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

How so? At the step where CR is measured, you deflate the shock, then compress and extend fully 3 or more times. i did intend to try this again and make note of the hi and lo pressures it dynamically displays and see if its own measurements and calculation jibes.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Something is wrong, that's all I know.

Replace the battery from your SW, then double check the hoses are on tightly enough, and try again. If you are still getting whack numbers your SW, or technique for measuring are broken.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

I'll add those to my list to check. Looking back at the profile i made for my other bike with a DPS, the CR didn't match for that one either so something is definitely not correct.

In your usage, did the SW measured CR accurately line up with the published CR from the manufacturer?


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

The best way to check that your CR is correct is put 10-30psi in the shock and sit on the bike with the app open. At 50% travel the app should show 50% and at bottom out it should show 100%. If it doesn't then adjust it until it does. This is my default way to set CR.

Also if you don't have good compression on the shock wiz hose it won't open the valve the whole way. This will give you weird readings as the SW can't see the shock in real time.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

JonF1 said:


> I'll add those to my list to check. Looking back at the profile i made for my other bike with a DPS, the CR didn't match for that one either so something is definitely not correct.
> 
> In your usage, did the SW measured CR accurately line up with the published CR from the manufacturer?


SW measured CR is within .1 of what Fox publishes, for me. 

Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Suns_PSD said:


> SW measured CR is within .1 of what Fox publishes, for me.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk


Thanks for the affirmation.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

I think i may have found where the calibration went wrong. During the step where you fully deflate the damper, you need to make sure it is truly and fully deflated (that means pos and neg chambers) and that the shock is reading 0 psi and still fully extended (so it doesnt go negative int vacuum on extension). Any deviation from that seemed to make the calculation wrong since it seems to want 0 psi as the floor reference value for calculating the ratio. Doing that i was able to get it to read 3.2 CR (Fox specifies 3.3 for this combo) so its close enough. Not having 0 as the reference value sent my CR well down into the 2's.

****, now i have to re-test 2 whole bikes again.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

I've never found that I actually have to be exactly at 0 psi to get accurate pressures. Mine usually reads 1-3 psi cause that's about as low as I can get it.

What's critical is that you truly extend & collapse the suspension fully. Ultimately it's all about the measured pressure change from one extreme to the other. That's all that matters.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Now that i'm having better success with my CR's straightened out, i'm going down the rabbit hole with one particular bike. The LR of this bike is pretty progressive and the original token (0.9) in the DPX2 shock was pretty large--so much so that quite a number of media reviews commented on the ramp up making it difficult to make use of the travel. Further, when stepping down a spacer to the 0.6 (there's a big volumetric jump between these two compared to between other available spacers), it unlocks some of the travel but the midstroke suffers a bit. With my weight and height i'm running a fairly high pressure (~300psi) to keep sag at a reasonable level for the travel here so i also found the 0.6 spacer a bit lacking in support. Lots of deep compression events with smaller 3' jumps/drops and the DC count was almost 1:1 with the jump count. I also found the .9 spacer perhaps a bit too progressive so i thought i would try an in-betweener size. .75 is about half way so i'm aiming for that. Seems silly at first to obsess over such specifics, but i think there's definitely some improvement to be made with the spacer issue with tools at hand.

I weighted out the .6 and .9 spacers to get a rough idea of the mass to volume of the spacer material. I don't have any way to accurately measure by volume so getting in the ballpark going by weight of material per known volume will have to suffice.

Stock 0.86 spacer: 13.97-14.19 g (i had 2, this was the variance). Shockwiz calculates a CR of 3.2 for this.
Custom 0.75 spacer, aim for ~12 g to be in-between. Shockwiz calculates a CR of 2.9 for this.
Stock 0.6 spacer, 9.8 g. Shockwiz calculates a CR of 2.7 for this.

I then chucked up a stock .9 spacer in the lathe and turned off some material from the back side (the smaller spacers use a similar taper to reduce volume.










After a few cuts, we have a .9 reduced to an estimated .75 spacer (~12g target weight)










After installing and running through the calibration, the CR falls right in-between the .6 and .9.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Good work.

I rather like my SW and find it to be a very important tool for me to optimize things, in spite of all it's shortcomings.

Ps. the easiest way to calculate volume of irregular/ water proof objects is to submerge them and measure water displacement.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Thanks. I have a number of tools and scales on hand, but nothing that can do precision volume. I think i'd have to have some scientific cylinder to measure ML to that degree. But ultimately i think it worked out well enough since the CR measured out to be pretty much in between the 2 existing sizes.


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## tatchle1 (Oct 13, 2016)

This may be buried in this thread somewhere, and I've tried googling it: 

What is the difference between planes, poppy, and active? 

Planned and poppy seem intuitive, but active? How is it different?


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

tatchle1 said:


> This may be buried in this thread somewhere, and I've tried googling it:
> 
> What is the difference between planes, poppy, and active?
> 
> Planned and poppy seem intuitive, but active? How is it different?


Here's my take: In the tuning style section, there's 2 settings to independently tune for your bike. Stiffness relates primarily to the air spring and liveliness relates primarily to the damping. They may be more interconnected than that internally, but it seems this is how you separate out how you want to independently tune the spring vs the damper. You'll also notice that both on on a scale of less to more, softest to firmest, slowest to fastest, etc. The spring tune is fairly clear in that on the left is very soft and the right is very firm. Same goes for the damper, the left would be the plushest setting with increased (closed) damping whereas the right would be the most active (more open) with much less damping. To your point, on the right for "Active" you'll generally have less compression damping and a more open rebound so the damper will be reacting very fast, perhaps even faster than most would want in a trail setting as it may not provide the most amount of grip and control. Rather, it would be to make the suspension very "Actively" involved in making it feel jumpy, twitchy, bouncy and just very quickly to react with possibly some additional assist for someone looking for those specific traits. Just think about how Poppy takes Planted to a more lively feel and Active takes Poppy up a notch as well.


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## angieri918 (Apr 1, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> Here's my take: In the tuning style section, there's 2 settings to independently tune for your bike. Stiffness relates primarily to the air spring and liveliness relates primarily to the damping. They may be more interconnected than that internally, but it seems this is how you separate out how you want to independently tune the spring vs the damper. You'll also notice that both on on a scale of less to more, softest to firmest, slowest to fastest, etc. The spring tune is fairly clear in that on the left is very soft and the right is very firm. Same goes for the damper, the left would be the plushest setting with increased (closed) damping whereas the right would be the most active (more open) with much less damping. To your point, on the right for "Active" you'll generally have less compression damping and a more open rebound so the damper will be reacting very fast, perhaps even faster than most would want in a trail setting as it may not provide the most amount of grip and control. Rather, it would be to make the suspension very "Actively" involved in making it feel jumpy, twitchy, bouncy and just very quickly to react with possibly some additional assist for someone looking for those specific traits. Just think about how Poppy takes Planted to a more lively feel and Active takes Poppy up a notch as well.


No. If you increase the damping ie turning knobs clockwise you will not increase plushness more like the exact opposite. When they say active they mean your suspension is moving freely and not so much damped. So more active means less damping. Thatwill most likely mean opening up the clickers (lefty loosey) hope that clears things up


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

angieri918 said:


> No. If you increase the damping ie turning knobs clockwise you will not increase plushness more like the exact opposite. When they say active they mean your suspension is moving freely and not so much damped. So more active means less damping. Thatwill most likely mean opening up the clickers (lefty loosey) hope that clears things up


I was only commenting on the relationship of the SW terminology and how it relates to general damping settings. Not which direction you turn the knobs for some desired effect or which way the toilet bowl flushes in your respective hemisphere.


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## stelloy (Dec 18, 2021)

Hey guys, stupid question.

So my friend and I have a bit of a different take on the shockwiz when it's asking to remove air or add air.

My shockwiz is currently on the left side (remove air (red)), from my understanding is that I need to remove air. But, from his understanding is that I should add air to go closer to the OK sign. 

What should it be?


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

stelloy said:


> Hey guys, stupid question.
> 
> So my friend and I have a bit of a different take on the shockwiz when it's asking to remove air or add air.
> 
> ...


That’s my understanding as well. If it says ‘remove air’, do just that. Remove/reduce air pressure. 


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

stelloy said:


> Hey guys, stupid question.
> 
> So my friend and I have a bit of a different take on the shockwiz when it's asking to remove air or add air.
> 
> ...


Logically it should show it on the right side if it's got too much air. But it doesn't...


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## utmtbrider (Dec 8, 2020)

NordieBoy said:


> Logically it should show it on the right side if it's got too much air. But it doesn't...


The further to the left/red the bar is the more you need to take it of wether its air rebound or compression.


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## fluidmotion (Apr 15, 2008)

Anyone else have a bricked Shockwiz with a "DFU file not found" error. This error is in the AXS app btw. In the Shockwiz app it fails to load the firmware but no error.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

fluidmotion said:


> Anyone else have a bricked Shockwiz with a "DFU file not found" error. This error is in the AXS app btw. In the Shockwiz app it fails to load the firmware but no error.


Have you tried inserting the battery with reverse polarity for 10 seconds?


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## fluidmotion (Apr 15, 2008)

rstark18 said:


> Have you tried inserting the battery with reverse polarity for 10 seconds?


Yep, many times. No changes.


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## alex.k (Feb 12, 2021)

IRBent said:


> That totally describes what I found on my DVO Topaz. Looking into the HSR shim stack I found 2 identical shims that were about as small as possible in thickness and diameter. Meaning there wasn't much that could be done to the stack without pretty much changing it to half, or less than half of the resistance. So I opted to go with the thinnest shock oil I could buy. It helped tremendously but did not totally eliminate the occasional packing.
> 
> Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


-


alex.k said:


> Expansion of the positive canister-to-sleeve port to four adjacent slits from the tiny hole that massive pressure had to flow through in both directions.
> 
> View attachment 1951903
> 
> ...


Try this^ if it still bothers you. I used a thin angle grinder, you can also use a dremmel but no drill bits as the hole is the seal limit so stay on the lip.


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

I haven't had my SW on for a while so thought I'd do a few runs to see what it had to say.
On a '21 Fox 36 it's telling me to run firmer LSC and softer HSC. My HSC is already fully open so that's that. But my LSC is 5 from closed which seems fairly firm already. I'm pretty light at 155lbs and my air spring is at 73psi.
Anyone else have seemingly over firm LSC suggestions?


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

Tuning an old Manitou Machete Boost 29+ fork for XC racing and general riding.
SW does like it's LSR doesn't it.


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## stolenteg (Aug 16, 2017)

Is this about the best i can do with this 2022 Fox Float X performance without LSC and HSC?


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## cscsw (May 29, 2011)

I just started with SW. I found that the compression ratio varies from 2.3-2.9 every time I run the process. I never get a consistent value. How can I validate the value?


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

stolenteg said:


> Is this about the best i can do with this 2022 Fox Float X performance without LSC and HSC?


If you click the 3 ... you can remove the high speed stuff... which will make it greener  

I'd take that though, looks good.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

cscsw said:


> I just started with SW. I found that the compression ratio varies from 2.3-2.9 every time I run the process. I never get a consistent value. How can I validate the value?


Pick a compression ratio, put 10psi with the shock/fork off the ground and set the baseline air pressure.

With the app open on your phone compress the suspension to bottom out and make sure that it ready 100%. You can also go to 50% and double check it.

If it's less than 100 lower the ratio. if it's more than 100 raise the ratio.


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## stolenteg (Aug 16, 2017)

The recommended rebound setting on MY2022 Fox 36 Grip2 160mm StEvo seem way too slow?

160-165lbs riding weight

79 psi
HSC Fully opened
LSC 3 Clicks from fully opened
HSR 1 Click from fully closed
LSR 2 Clicks from fully closed


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## angieri918 (Apr 1, 2020)

stolenteg said:


> The recommended rebound setting on MY2022 Fox 36 Grip2 160mm StEvo seem way too slow?
> 
> 160-165lbs riding weight
> 
> ...



Does it feel awesome? Or subpar?


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## Sentenza (7 mo ago)

To @ Quarq tech
My shockwiz turn into red Light cal status in the middle of my ride, is it because that my calibration was not good at the beginning ?


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

Something doesn't seem right with mine. It keeps telling me to remove air. I had to go down to 86 PSI before I got it to go green. My riding weight is about 235 pounds, which according to Fox should put me around 113 PSI if I remember correctly. It also is always telling me make the high speed compression softer, but it's already set to wide open. I know I need to dial in the pressure first, but I figured I'd mention it.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

Its probably trying to maximize your travel. It is a longer travel fork on a long and slack bike by chance? We dont often use all travel on setups like that unless ridden pretty damn hard.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> Its probably trying to maximize your travel. It is a longer travel fork on a long and slack bike by chance? We dont often use all travel on setups like that unless ridden pretty damn hard.


Yeah, it's a 150mm fork. Not super slacked out but at a 66° HTA. I'm probably a bit over-biked, but at my weight, I wanted a pretty beefy bike. Does that mean the Shockwiz won't be much help to me?


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

cpercival said:


> Yeah, it's a 150mm fork. Not super slacked out but at a 66° HTA. I'm probably a bit over-biked, but at my weight, I wanted a pretty beefy bike. Does that mean the Shockwiz won't be much help to me?


Not at all. The SW will certainly help get you dialed in, however, you man need to hit some bigger features to use up more of your travel. If that's not how you usually ride, you can pick a point where you decide to stop making further adjustments as long as you like the way its ridings. The SW helped you get things dialed in to that point and now you have a little left in reserve (travel wise). If you find yoursefl riding a bit harder and using more travel, revisit hte SW and see if you need to adjust again to your new riding pattern.

Also, what tuning style were you using? If you were trying to go for a plusher style, that may explain why it kept going softer in settings. Maybe goign to a middle setting (more supportive and more firm damping) for both tuning selections may result in it not suggesting so little air and compression.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

I've been using balanced. And yeah, a lot of my riding is probably more XC type riding as that's what I have closest to where I live. It's typical New England terrain with punchy rolling hills and short descents over rocky and rooty terrain. Thrown in are a few drops and jumps, but nothing more than a couple feet high. 

If the SW is still useful, I'm not sure how to use it then if I'm to kind of ignore the air pressure suggestions. Would picking the poppy setting or a custom firm setting help? Should I just split the difference and go with somewhere around 100 PSI?


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

cpercival said:


> I've been using balanced. And yeah, a lot of my riding is probably more XC type riding as that's what I have closest to where I live. It's typical New England terrain with punchy rolling hills and short descents over rocky and rooty terrain. Thrown in are a few drops and jumps, but nothing more than a couple feet high.
> 
> If the SW is still useful, I'm not sure how to use it then if I'm to kind of ignore the air pressure suggestions. Would picking the poppy setting or a custom firm setting help? Should I just split the difference and go with somewhere around 100 PSI?


At the current air pressure, what is the static and dynamic sag as reported by SW? Any deep compression events? The suggestions from the fork manufacturers aren't the best baseline because the actual value will depend on a lot of other factors (rider weight/height, seating position, riding style, bike frame geo, etc). Frame manufacturer suggested settings are a better starting point but still subject to error due to the same factors. Luckily the SW can instantly tell you the sag to get that dialed in initially, then further tune in a session. If you're happy where its at, leave it be. You can try choosing other tuning modes while in a session and it will automatically adjust the suggested changes on the fly.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> At the current air pressure, what is the static and dynamic sag as reported by SW? Any deep compression events? The suggestions from the fork manufacturers aren't the best baseline because the actual value will depend on a lot of other factors (rider weight/height, seating position, riding style, bike frame geo, etc). Frame manufacturer suggested settings are a better starting point but still subject to error due to the same factors. Luckily the SW can instantly tell you the sag to get that dialed in initially, then further tune in a session. If you're happy where its at, leave it be. You can try choosing other tuning modes while in a session and it will automatically adjust the suggested changes on the fly.


I'll have to check on that later and report back. Quickly, can you change tuning modes while in a session without starting a new session? I didn't know that


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

put 10 psi in the fork and set the baseline air pressure with the fork off the ground.

Then fully compress the fork with the app open and check that it sees 100%.

This verifies your CR ratio. If it wrong nothing will work right.


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## dolface (Apr 5, 2007)

Saw a rumor that there's a new version coming out, does anyone have more info? (Apologies if this has already been discussed, I wasn't able to find anything).


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

dolface said:


> Saw a rumor that there's a new version coming out, does anyone have more info? (Apologies if this has already been discussed, I wasn't able to find anything).


I wouldnt be surprised if it was something more integrated into the damper like the new Flight Attendant stuff. Perhaps something that replaces the topcap on a fork for example. But that is just my speculation.


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## mtnbikerva1 (Feb 4, 2008)

I am thinking about trying to rent a Shockwiz to use on my new 2021/2 Pivot Trail 429 enduro with Fox Factory float x and 36. Any reason it is a bad or not so good idea? 
I know it is a SRAM product meant to be used with SRAM products. I am curious to find out/learn more about how to take full advantage of my suspension.
Thank you.
Actually it had been a while since I went through this thread. It looks like it would be a good idea.


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## weeksy950 (Jan 11, 2012)

You can use a Shockwiz on any compatible fork mate. I like them myself. I've used lots


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## dolface (Apr 5, 2007)

mtnbikerva1 said:


> I know it is a SRAM product meant to be used with SRAM products. I am curious to find out/learn more about how to take full advantage of my suspension.


That's not true; it was developed independently (funded on Kickstarter IIRC) and then SRAM bought it. You can use it on any compatible suspension component.

SRAM could (and probably will) integrate it into their products but I'd be surprised if they ever make it SRAM-only as that would leave a market gap (and a bunch of money on the table).


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

mtnbikerva1 said:


> I am thinking about trying to rent a Shockwiz to use on my new 2021/2 Pivot Trail 429 enduro with Fox Factory float x and 36. Any reason it is a bad or not so good idea?
> I know it is a SRAM product meant to be used with SRAM products. I am curious to find out/learn more about how to take full advantage of my suspension.
> Thank you.
> Actually it had been a while since I went through this thread. It looks like it would be a good idea.


Don't expect to "tune" your shock or fork in a day. It takes weeks to dial in a good setup. Aka minimum 3-4 on both ends of the bike.


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## junior77 (Jun 19, 2015)

alexbn921 said:


> Don't expect to "tune" your shock or fork in a day. It takes weeks to dial in a good setup. Aka minimum 3-4 on both ends of the bike.


3-4 weeks?? Or 3-4 rides?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rstark18 (Apr 10, 2006)

The best way to use these is to ride a trail section over and over. Then every time you run it tweak your settings and start a new session on the SW. 
That is exactly how I DIDN’T use it. I would just do my complete ride and check and tweak after the ride. By doing it this way it takes a lot of rides to dial things in. 
Don’t expect miracles. On my old Giant Trance the SW dialed in the Fox Rhythm/DPX really great. I felt like it was absolutely nailed when all the settings were green. 
On my next bike (Orbea Occam) the green settings never felt right and I eventually gave up and tweaked by feel. I might throw it back on to see if I can get things dialed as my Occam still doesn’t feel as dialed in as my Trance.


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## alexbn921 (Mar 31, 2009)

junior77 said:


> 3-4 weeks?? Or 3-4 rides?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


3-4 rides on the fork, 3-4 rides on the shock, 1-2 rides on the fork again. Front and rear effect each other.
So 7-10 total rides of 10-15 miles
Have volume spacers and a shock pump handy.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> At the current air pressure, what is the static and dynamic sag as reported by SW? Any deep compression events? The suggestions from the fork manufacturers aren't the best baseline because the actual value will depend on a lot of other factors (rider weight/height, seating position, riding style, bike frame geo, etc). Frame manufacturer suggested settings are a better starting point but still subject to error due to the same factors. Luckily the SW can instantly tell you the sag to get that dialed in initially, then further tune in a session. If you're happy where its at, leave it be. You can try choosing other tuning modes while in a session and it will automatically adjust the suggested changes on the fly.


Currently sitting at 29% sag on level ground, but only 14% dynamic sag with no deep compression events. Not sure why there's such a difference between my static sag and dynamic sag. Only thing I can think of is that this session was over the course of a couple days of doing laps on a small downhill run that involves an 8 or 9 minute seated climb followed by a 2 to 3 minute downhill. Maybe the longer seated uphill biases my weight rearward and throws off the tune for the part I care about? Or maybe this is normal??


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

cpercival said:


> Currently sitting at 29% sag on level ground, but only 14% dynamic sag with no deep compression events. Not sure why there's such a difference between my static sag and dynamic sag. Only thing I can think of is that this session was over the course of a couple days of doing laps on a small downhill run that involves an 8 or 9 minute seated climb followed by a 2 to 3 minute downhill. Maybe the longer seated uphill biases my weight rearward and throws off the tune for the part I care about? Or maybe this is normal??


It very well could be responsible for the lesser dyn sag value. IIRC, you mentioned your normal mode being more XC oriented whereas this ride seemed more DH centric. They are very different types of riding and ideally you want to choose the type of riding you normally do to tune with the SW. You can ride different types of terrain within a SW tuning session to get a more rounded overall reading but you really need to keep things the same when recording sessions between damper setting changes. You can ride DH exclusively but do so in a separate session with separate tune mode to develop DH-specific damper settings for days when this is the type of terrain you exclusively ride.

What actual bike/fork is this and how many tokens are installed? In your DH riding, did the o-ring get maxxed out? If it did and SW claims no deep compression events, then maybe the CR isn't correct. if CR is wrong, the SW calcs will be completely wrong. You can quickly verify your CR by letting all by about 5 psi from the fork. Fully extend the fork by hand and hit the air pressure reset on the SW app to zero out the psi/sag at this 5psi point. Fully compress the fork and hold and look at the static sag on the SW app--it should read %100 sag at this point. If not, CR is wrong and you can either re-do the calibration or adjust it manually up or down in the app until full compression reads %100.


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> It very well could be responsible for the lesser dyn sag value. IIRC, you mentioned your normal mode being more XC oriented whereas this ride seemed more DH centric. They are very different types of riding and ideally you want to choose the type of riding you normally do to tune with the SW. You can ride different types of terrain within a SW tuning session to get a more rounded overall reading but you really need to keep things the same when recording sessions between damper setting changes. You can ride DH exclusively but do so in a separate session with separate tune mode to develop DH-specific damper settings for days when this is the type of terrain you exclusively ride.
> 
> What actual bike/fork is this and how many tokens are installed? In your DH riding, did the o-ring get maxxed out? If it did and SW claims no deep compression events, then maybe the CR isn't correct. if CR is wrong, the SW calcs will be completely wrong. You can quickly verify your CR by letting all by about 5 psi from the fork. Fully extend the fork by hand and hit the air pressure reset on the SW app to zero out the psi/sag at this 5psi point. Fully compress the fork and hold and look at the static sag on the SW app--it should read %100 sag at this point. If not, CR is wrong and you can either re-do the calibration or adjust it manually up or down in the app until full compression reads %100.


Yeah, that's a good point about the XC vs downhill. I've been spending more time in this spot as it's fairly new and is totally different than the typical stuff around me. It makes sense that you'd want different tunes for different types of riding. I had been lowering the pressure over the course of a handful of the more XC outings per SW recommendation, but did start a new session for the couple days I spent at the DH area without making any adjustments to the fork. I wonder if I just need more time in this area before the SW starts telling me to add air. But then I am not using all my travel either. I'd say the o-ring is still probably 3/4 - 1 inch from maxing out. This new area doesn't have any jumps or drops yet, it's just fast somewhat smooth singletrack with decently sized bermed corners. I'll pop off anything I can find on the way down, but definitely nothing big enough that would max out the fork. I'm riding a 2021 XXL YT Jeffsy with a Fox 36 Grip 2 fork.


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## JonF1 (Oct 2, 2019)

cpercival said:


> Yeah, that's a good point about the XC vs downhill. I've been spending more time in this spot as it's fairly new and is totally different than the typical stuff around me. It makes sense that you'd want different tunes for different types of riding. I had been lowering the pressure over the course of a handful of the more XC outings per SW recommendation, but did start a new session for the couple days I spent at the DH area without making any adjustments to the fork. I wonder if I just need more time in this area before the SW starts telling me to add air. But then I am not using all my travel either. I'd say the o-ring is still probably 3/4 - 1 inch from maxing out. This new area doesn't have any jumps or drops yet, it's just fast somewhat smooth singletrack with decently sized bermed corners. I'll pop off anything I can find on the way down, but definitely nothing big enough that would max out the fork. I'm riding a 2021 XXL YT Jeffsy with a Fox 36 Grip 2 fork.


For reference, my XL intense primer has the same fork (though the 2019 version without VVC) and i tested a few spacer combo's to get the CR. You can compare your CR to these to see if its in the ballpark. I currently run 3 spacers and when riding the local trails with jumps and drops, i get close to bottoming but not quite (and no deep CR from SW detected). With 2 spacers i was bottoming so 3 is the sweet spot for me to maximize travel and support. Techically i have a little left over (i forget how much) for big hits and riding more XC type trails with no drops i probably have well over an inch in reserve. That's the balance i struck to eek as much out as a can (just trying to give you a reference point for how to approach it). I use normal-poppy mode for this bike since its fun to play around on.

2019 Fox 36 Grip 2 Compression ratios with installed spacers :
2 spacers, factory config, 2.5 CR
3 spacers, 2.7 CR
4 spacers, 2.9 CR
5 spacers, 3.1 CR


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## cpercival (Dec 7, 2020)

JonF1 said:


> For reference, my XL intense primer has the same fork (though the 2019 version without VVC) and i tested a few spacer combo's to get the CR. You can compare your CR to these to see if its in the ballpark. I currently run 3 spacers and when riding the local trails with jumps and drops, i get close to bottoming but not quite (and no deep CR from SW detected). With 2 spacers i was bottoming so 3 is the sweet spot for me to maximize travel and support. Techically i have a little left over (i forget how much) for big hits and riding more XC type trails with no drops i probably have well over an inch in reserve. That's the balance i struck to eek as much out as a can (just trying to give you a reference point for how to approach it). I use normal-poppy mode for this bike since its fun to play around on.
> 
> 2019 Fox 36 Grip 2 Compression ratios with installed spacers :
> 2 spacers, factory config, 2.5 CR
> ...


Forgot to mention the spacers. Currently using 2 tokens with a 2.4 CR. Confidence is 100% and tuning score is 96. Current suggestions are to add a token and make HS compression a click or 2 softer even though it's fully open. I'm really not sure where to go from here. I feel like 86 PSI has to be too low. Does it feel good? I guess, but could it be better? No clue. I'd toss the SW, but the real problem is that I just don't know what a well-tuned (for me) fork should feel like, and I was hoping the SW could show me. Using the SW, the only conclusion I've come to is that I should set my pressure to somewhere between 86 and 113 PSI. Without being able to rely on the pressure recommendation, it doesn't seem like I can rely on any of the rebound or compression suggestions as they are dependent on the pressure and ramp settings being correct. What am I missing?


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