# Options to ride free of hydration pack, due to some lower back pain



## mtnbkrdr98 (May 27, 2004)

The pain isn't all the time, but happens on longer ride and especially with a lot of climbing. 

I'm wanting to ride without a pack and get some of the weight off my shoulders and that loads up my lower back/lumbar area, during longer rides or a lot of climbing, and am looking at fanny pack options, like from Osprey or DaKine.

I'd like to hear from other riders using fanny to "free" yourself and especially people with some lower back pain, if using fanny style, or other solutions, has helped. I am considering a 2nd pack with much smaller reservoir and less storage, or a fanny pack, or figure out how to strap things onto my bike and not have them on me at all.

Thanks for your help and insights!


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## sptimmy43 (Jul 27, 2018)

I just got a pack from Lab Austere. It was delivered yesterday so I haven't used it on a ride yet. https://labaustere.com/collections/frontpage/products/minimize-hydration-lumbar-pack-v-2

I generally don't ride with a pack. I can make it through my after work rides with one bottle on my bike. My local trails loop around and I have a couple opportunities to refill if needed. I also have some bib liner shorts with pockets that can fit an additional small water bottle if needed.

For tools I have the OneUp EDC tool system in my steerer and a tube/CO2 strapped to the frame to take care of trailside repairs. I picked up the Lab Austere hip pack so I can add 2 more full size bottles and nutrition for longer rides in lieu of just one small bottle in the carbo bib liners.

Ultimately everything is a compromise. Riding without a pack is awesome if your trails/rides/bike setup allow it. For big rides I still think a pack may be necessary.


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## mtnbkrdr98 (May 27, 2004)

Thank you


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

Thanks from someone who didn't even know they were looking for this until I stumbled upon it. Two bottle in the carrier and one on the bike are more then enough. 

My Camelbak mule is overkill these days.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Backpacks are generally overkill, even in Texas where it's over 100° for much of summer. I have two 21oz bottles on my frame. I can carry another in my Dakine hip pack if I want, and still another Back Bottle in a jersey pocket. Most of the trails I ride are in an sub-urban area with lots of connected neighborhood parks, and most of the parks has drinking fountains where I can refill a few times.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

mack_turtle said:


> Backpacks are generally overkill, even in Texas where it's over 100° for much of summer. I have two 21oz bottles on my frame. I can carry another in my Dakine hip pack if I want, and still another Back Bottle in a jersey pocket. Most of the trails I ride are in an sub-urban area with lots of connected neighborhood parks, and most of the parks has drinking fountains where I can refill a few times.


Most bikes these days can only hold 1 water bottle though, and many areas (including mine) have no opportunities for a refill so I wouldn't consider a hydration pack overkill.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

This is a great example of people having very limited experiences and thinking it probably applies to everyone.

I am in the same boat as above. One trail set has a couple drinking fountains in the park. The good trails are further out from home, in more remote areas and a full loop can take a while. Combined with room for only one bottle on the bike.

No way 1 bottle is going to work in real heat (90+ with high humidity) which is much of the summer here.

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## waltaz (Oct 14, 2004)

I ride in Phoenix, and the only time I use a (back)pack is on 3+ hour rides in the heat, and that’s a very light, 2L USWE race pack.

For everything else, I either use bottles (1 or 2 on the bike, depending on which bike I’m riding, and 1 in a jersey pocket), or a combo of bottles and an Osprey Seral lumbar pack, which has a 1.5L bladder. It works flawlessly, and I absolutely love it. It’s comfortable, and keeps weight off my shoulders and upper back.

I highly recommend the Seral...


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## k2rider1964 (Apr 29, 2010)

I've tried (2) different Dakine models, a Camelbak and now just bought the EVOC Race 3L. The EVOC is bty far the most comfortable, doesn't slip and can carry (2) bottles IN ADDITION TO a 1.5L bladder. If there is one downside, it lacks storage space when you're using it will a full bladder.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

swat bibs, frame strap, oneup edc! I don’t need a pack for any ride less than 3hrs/4k, after that I might consider a funny pack and for that evoc is the best there is!


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## FJSnoozer (Mar 3, 2015)

Agree with SWAT bib and bottles. Or the right race cut jersey. 

I ride with 2-3 24 oz large bottles and am considering getting a larger one. 


In heat, my needs are not linear. 
1- 1h
2- 90 min
3- 2hr
6- 3hr
8- 4hr but a lot of that is consumed on the stop to refill so technically I am rollling with 3 bottles with 1 stop.

Planning stops on your route can be tricky and annoying at times, but not climbing with 4 hours worth of water on your back is so much nicer. You will be faster and fresher later in the ride. And so much less hot. 

I had to work for about 6 months to really get used to drinking from bottles (mid ride/race) and make the switch from camelback. It’s so worth it. 

Anything over 90 minutes I always try to have liquid nutrition/ electrolytes in 1-2 bottles. Pick your poison. 

I know this is more than you asked for, but it’s important.


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## tigris99 (Aug 26, 2012)

Swat bibs ARE A BAD JOKE. They are only useful if your short regardless of size you order. I'm 6 1 and pockets are middle of my lumbar so no way to reach them.

Was actually pretty pissed about that after paying the money for a set that came with shorts (love the shorts). Whoever designed them was a dumbass and thinks the world is 5'6 or shorter.

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## FJSnoozer (Mar 3, 2015)

tigris99 said:


> Swat bibs ARE A BAD JOKE. They are only useful if your short regardless of size you order. I'm 6 1 and pockets are middle of my lumbar so no way to reach them.
> 
> Was actually pretty pissed about that after paying the money for a set that came with shorts (love the shorts). Whoever designed them was a dumbass and thinks the world is 5'6 or shorter.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


They are higher than a jersey pocket. You do need good arm flexibility. I also stretch out all my Spesh bib shoulder straps to "lengthen" the torso

Voler makes a set too. I can let you know which pockets sit lower if you want. I have both.

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## sptimmy43 (Jul 27, 2018)

tigris99 said:


> Swat bibs ARE A BAD JOKE. They are only useful if your short regardless of size you order. I'm 6 1 and pockets are middle of my lumbar so no way to reach them.
> 
> Was actually pretty pissed about that after paying the money for a set that came with shorts (love the shorts). Whoever designed them was a dumbass and thinks the world is 5'6 or shorter.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


I'm 5'10 and they work for me, barely. Better yet are the ZOIC Carbon storage bib liners. The pockets are lower.


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## mfa81 (Apr 1, 2011)

I've also been using Cuore line bibs with storage, but I think in general storage bibs have a pretty high pocket line, definitely not the easiest to reach


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## sptimmy43 (Jul 27, 2018)

mfa81 said:


> I've also been using Cuore line bibs with storage, but I think in general storage bibs have a pretty high pocket line, definitely not the easiest to reach


The ZOIC storage bibs' pockets are sewn on a flap. The flap is pretty low on the back and since it's a flap it can go on top of the waist of your shorts. This allows much better ergonomics in actually using the pockets.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

here's a pretty exhaustive list of ways to mount additional water bottle cages to your bike: https://bikepacking.com/index/add-cage-mounts-bike/

you can mount them to your fork, handlebar, seatpost (if you have space there), under the frame, and all over.

I have also had luck with a 2L bladder inside a Jandd frame bag that happens to fit my CX bike. I used it on a long, hot gravel ride and didn't need to carry any additional bottles. I just fixed the drink hose end to the handlebar with a velcro strap and a "retractable badge reel."


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

mtnbkrdr98 said:


> The pain isn't all the time, but happens on longer ride and especially with a lot of climbing.


getting weight off your back, especially your shoulders, is certainly a good idea. but have you spoken with a physician of some sort about this? I started getting debilitating lower back pain a few years ago and tried every imaginable bodge on my bike to fix it. I was only able to really fix the _problem_ by working with a physical therapist who helped me strengthen my body and keep it strong enough to ride by working out at home.


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## AP-123 (Nov 24, 2004)

Fascinated by this thread and the thought of riding without a pack. But I can't help but think about what happens if you fall with tools strapped to your body. Wouldn't that be painful? 

Perhaps I'm not understanding what tools go where.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

AP-123 said:


> Fascinated by this thread and the thought of riding without a pack. But I can't help but think about what happens if you fall with tools strapped to your body. Wouldn't that be painful?


Tools like chainsaws and shovels? That would be painful,


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## AP-123 (Nov 24, 2004)

J.B. Weld said:


> Tools like chainsaws and shovels? That would be painful,


I'd love to know what tools go where?

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## sptimmy43 (Jul 27, 2018)

AP-123 said:


> I'd love to know what tools go where?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk


OK I'll bite. The tools get strapped or stored on/in the bike. There are many solutions to this but a popular one is the OneUp EDC tool system.

Generally speaking, riding packless means you aren't bringing the kitchen sink. Only the bare minimum makes it along for the ride. For me I can do this on a lot of rides but for big days out or riding in unfamiliar places I still wear a backpack.


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## SoDakSooner (Nov 23, 2005)

sptimmy43 said:


> OK I'll bite. The tools get strapped or stored on/in the bike. There are many solutions to this but a popular one is the OneUp EDC tool system.
> 
> Generally speaking, riding packless means you aren't bringing the kitchen sink. Only the bare minimum makes it along for the ride. For me I can do this on a lot of rides but for big days out or riding in unfamiliar places I still wear a backpack.


Same here. I run the one up edc system as well. Multitool goes in the stem along with a tire plug kit. Phone in shorts, keys in shorts, bottle in offset cage with pump on the other side. Don't run a tube typically but will add to my kit shortly, strapped under the seat. Also adding an extra bottle with a strap on cage soon as well.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

AP-123 said:


> Fascinated by this thread and the thought of riding without a pack. But I can't help but think about what happens if you fall with tools strapped to your body. Wouldn't that be painful?
> 
> Perhaps I'm not understanding what tools go where.


what tools to you carry on a ride? I have more more than:
•one or two folding mini-tools in one shorts pocket
•one spare tube, tire lever, CO2 and inflator, and a plug kit wrapped up and strapped under my saddle
•a mini pump strapped to my seat tube.

I am not carrying anything that could impale me or go up my butt.


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## AP-123 (Nov 24, 2004)

mack_turtle said:


> what tools to you carry on a ride? I have more more than:
> •one or two folding mini-tools in one shorts pocket
> •one spare tube, tire lever, CO2 and inflator, and a plug kit wrapped up and strapped under my saddle
> •a mini pump strapped to my seat tube.
> ...


Apologize for hijacking the thread but very much appreciate the responses.

I probably need to get over the fact that I just turned 50, don't care much about getting to the bottom first anymore, and haven't come off the bike hard in years. Still, I'm in better shape now than in my 20s.

With an mx background, I still have flashbacks. Gear and tools have come a long way.

Regarding tools I carry, all the same except no mini pump. A folding tool, C02/inflator, a couple of tire irons, gel, bar, phone, and H2O. Don't forget the dollar bill in case you have a sidewall tear 

All my races were canceled this year. That slowed down my training and my lower back suffered more than I can ever remember. Glad I found this thread. I'm getting back after it and looking for some new gear to inspire me. Thanks again


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## eugenenine (Aug 2, 2018)

A good backpack shouldn't be putting weight on your shoulders, the weight should be mainly on the waist strap. Sounds like yours doesn't fit right.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

eugenenine said:


> A good backpack shouldn't be putting weight on your shoulders, the weight should be mainly on the waist strap. Sounds like yours doesn't fit right.


this is 100% true, but often misunderstood. however, even when it fits right, it's a lot of weight on your body. I only wear my pack when I want to carry some tools for trail work or I am going on a LONG ride on a HOT day and I want a single way to carry 3L of water.


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## 93EXCivic (Mar 12, 2018)

I use a Osprey 2 bottle hip pack plus one on the bike. I also have a Wolftooth B-rad system with a mini bag (CO2, multitool, small knife, tire plug kit, KMC Missing link lever, master link and valve core) for tools. I can strap a Bedrock Honaker under the downtube to carry a Nalgene if I need more water.


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## FJSnoozer (Mar 3, 2015)

AP-123 said:


> Fascinated by this thread and the thought of riding without a pack. But I can't help but think about what happens if you fall with tools strapped to your body. Wouldn't that be painful?
> 
> Perhaps I'm not understanding what tools go where.


I run the Swat tool pictured here. It goes inside the steerer tube, though you can get one that clips to your bottle cage. Scott and Specialized both make these.

I carry dynaplugs, regular and Mega. The purple one you see is for racing and is faster to plug. I recommend just the Megapill if you aren't racing. I don't need or carry a tube.

Chain tool and links (I carry links for a few different chains to help people out.

I have a CC and or a $20

Other odds and ends, zip ties. I don't need a spare hanger, but it's possible

C02 and a head.

ALL of this goes in this tiny neoprene pouch in my back pocket.

The pump goes in the pocket beside a bottle. Could be buoyed under the bottle cage with provided mount.










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## matadorCE (Jun 26, 2013)

I've ridden a few years now with a Raceface stash tanktop, with a large water bottle in the middle pocket. I used to always ride with a pack even in the high heat/humidity of TX but for rides about 1hr long a bottle is fine; obviously individual experiences may vary. I stopped carrying tools unless I'm on a unfamiliar trail system or will be ridding for a long time (2hrs+) with no easy way to get back to the car. I recently rewore my Highline pack and man did it feel cumbersome and restrictive in comparison.


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## eugenenine (Aug 2, 2018)

mack_turtle said:


> this is 100% true, but often misunderstood. however, even when it fits right, it's a lot of weight on your body. I only wear my pack when I want to carry some tools for trail work or I am going on a LONG ride on a HOT day and I want a single way to carry 3L of water.


3L of water isn't that heavy. Also I fill mine about 1/3 of the way up and lay it flat in the freezer so I have a nice big ice cube on my back.

I carry a small toolkit, a couple of protein bars and added one of those cooling towels.


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## plummet (Jul 8, 2005)

Drink big before the ride and dont take water. Works if its a sub 2 hour ride. 

Couple of my buddies use bumbag hydration packs which they like compared to the back pack.


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## eugenenine (Aug 2, 2018)

Someday you may want to go on a longer ride. I try to carry the same gear on short rides that I would on a long ride so my weight/balance/etc is the same.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

The past 6 months or so I've been using a Camelbak Chase vest which will hold up to 50 oz. The thing that's good and maybe relevant here is that the "vest" part has front pockets which counterbalance the H2O to a degree: Phone, small wallet, keys, multitool, levers, plugs, lightweight JIC tube, nutrition... It's short, sits high, has wide straps over the shoulders and doesn't feel like it's dragging me down or back like my previous hydration packs did, even including a small lightweight Rogue pack which is what I was using previously. For my typical rides I only fill the bladder about 2/3 full. It's also nice that I can quickly and easily access my phone to take pix, the multi tool, the nutrition and car keys without taking it off.


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## eugenenine (Aug 2, 2018)

Mine is a Camelbak Transformer. With the two removable sections removed its pretty slim and light, just the bladder and a small pouch at the bottom where I carry tools, spare camera battery, etc.


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## Spec44 (Aug 17, 2013)

For longer mostly XC type rides I run one bottle on the frame and one or two more in a pair of Revelate feed bags, depending on the ride plans. The feedbags have pockets to hold other stuff and they come right off for shorter sportier rides. They work for me, very little steering interference, but yes they make the front end a little heavy with the extra water weight.


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## Lone Rager (Dec 13, 2013)

eugenenine said:


> Mine is a Camelbak Transformer. With the two removable sections removed its pretty slim and light, just the bladder and a small pouch at the bottom where I carry tools, spare camera battery, etc.


Yeah. That's like what I used to use. The key with the vest type is it distributes weight to the front to help balance the water weight on the back so it's not pulling your shoulders back. It's also much more stable dynamically when riding rough stuff.


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## eugenenine (Aug 2, 2018)

Lone Rager said:


> Yeah. That's like what I used to use. The key with the vest type is it distributes weight to the front to help balance the water weight on the back so it's not pulling your shoulders back. It's also much more stable dynamically when riding rough stuff.


With a decent backpack the hip belt distributes the weight so its not on the shoulders.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

eugenenine said:


> 3L of water isn't that heavy. Also I fill mine about 1/3 of the way up and lay it flat in the freezer so I have a nice big ice cube on my back.
> 
> I carry a small toolkit, a couple of protein bars and added one of those cooling towels.


3L is almost 7 pounds or about 5% of my body weight. I'd say that's quite a bit of extra weight in the end. you can decide if it's worth carrying on your back for a given effort, but it's nothing to sneeze at.


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## fly4130 (Apr 3, 2009)

The saddle to bar height also has a major effect on how your pack affects your back. I have a fairly upright position on my mountain bikes so I don't mind the pack at all and it only causes me back issues when I don't have my core in shape and am on longer rides. I am a sweaty pig so the extra water capacity helps and I still run a bottle with Gatorade in a cage to boot. 

When I ride any bike with a lower bar or less upright riding position the angle of my back makes any pack a pain. The kit goes on the bike/pockets at that point. I usually feel pretty naked until I get used to it, but then it is quite nice to have nothing on your shoulders.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

fly4130 said:


> The saddle to bar height also has a major effect on how your pack affects your back. I have a fairly upright position on my mountain bikes so I don't mind the pack at all and it only causes me back issues when I don't have my core in shape and am on longer rides. I am a sweaty pig so the extra water capacity helps and I still run a bottle with Gatorade in a cage to boot.
> 
> When I ride any bike with a lower bar or less upright riding position the angle of my back makes any pack a pain. The kit goes on the bike/pockets at that point. I usually feel pretty naked until I get used to it, but then it is quite nice to have nothing on your shoulders.


Weird, it's almost the opposite for me. The more upright, the more the weight is supported just by the straps which dig into the shoulders. When leaned over the weight is evenly distributed across my back with little tension on the straps.


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## fly4130 (Apr 3, 2009)

There is likely a body-specific sweet spot where the weight is distributed at the right angles for comfort. My super-sciencey precise term "fairly upright" was definitely not great at describing the angle, but even when totally vertical on foot hiking with a pack and bladder I have no issues. Its only when I try to ride with a pack on my drop-bar gravel bike that I start to feel the back get angry.

Bodies are weird man. My main riding buddy had his Camelback start causing him some nerve discomfort on our last ride as the straps were hitting his armpit area in an odd way. This was the same pack he has been using for way too long and to my eyes his body size and posture has not changed a bit so we had no idea as to "why now". Time has passed for sure so I suppose age is a factor even for strap comfort/placement.

Back on topic, do the larger-bladdered hip packs hold enough water for the thirsty or longer rides? I only have braze-ons on my downtube so I can only hold one bottle without alternative mounts and would need at least three to hold the liquids I need. I would love to go completely pack-less but for some reason I like having a kitchen sink with me every where I go. Is a frame bag for normal trail rides overkill?


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