# DIY dropout alignment tool?



## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

Hi,

I'm looking for a way to bend rear facing horizontal dropouts into alignment with each other on a 4130 steel street/DJ frame. They are about 5 mm thick and are intended for typical 10 x 135 mm singlespeed hubs. I've tried a 10 mm threaded rod, but it predictably bent itself without any effect on the dropout.

I do know that Park Tool makes FFG-2 (which I don't have). Would such tool even work for 5 mm and rather compact dropouts?

Here's the frame in question, a Spank Spoon one2one:










and those dropouts










The right side dropout seems to be more misaligned, judging by wheel deflection when I tighten the hub bolts separately.


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## jay_ntwr (Feb 15, 2008)

I have the Cyclus ones. They look like this:

Cyclus Professional Dropout Hanger Alignment Tool

Mine came from England somewhere.


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## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

Thanks, that's much cheaper than Park. Do you think such a tool could handle bending those 5 mm steel dropouts?


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## jay_ntwr (Feb 15, 2008)

J. Random Psycho said:


> Thanks, that's much cheaper than Park. Do you think such a tool could handle bending those 5 mm steel dropouts?


I suppose it depends on how bent there are and what exactly is bent. If you could show us pictures of exactly what the problem is, that would be helpful.


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## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

jay_ntwr said:


> If you could show us pictures of exactly what the problem is, that would be helpful.


There you go.










It shows where hub axle points on NDS dropout when I tighten drive side hub bolt in correct chain tension position. Tire would rub NDS chainstay if I tightened the hub like this.

What I do to be able to ride is forcibly align the wheel so that tire is symmetric between chainstays and then tighten NDS bolt. Frame deforms elastically and the bolt ends up in position marked, but this leaves hub axle at stress that I'd like to avoid.


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## GrayJay (May 16, 2011)

Check first to make sure that the rear triangle is in alignment (run string from dropout, around headtube, back to other dropout and measure distances each side at seattube), and check that your wheel is dished to center (if you dont have a dish gauge or trueing stand, flip the wheel 180° in the frame and check that offsett is the same each way). If both the rear triangle and wheel are aligned, only then proceed with aligning the dropouts. You might start with a big cresent wrench or put the dropout in a bench vise to get majority of it bent, just use the dropout alignment tool for the last minor wreaking and to verify that they are parallel.


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## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

Frame alignment test.
NDS 42.5 mm, DS 41.5 mm.

Wheel is dead on, I built it myself.
Tire is straight enough, I checked it in 2 other frames.

Tried a 330 mm crescent wrench on DS dropout before, no luck.

Do you think the misalignment pictured may warrant such rough methods as a bench vise before going to specialist tools?


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## RCP FAB (Jun 15, 2011)

I would bend it a little using the bench vise, it doesn't look like it needs to go much. On drop-outs like that, I don't think the park tool would be all that happy anyway.


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## Eric Malcolm (Dec 18, 2011)

*Warrantee*

Do you think the misalignment pictured may warrant such rough methods as a bench vise before going to specialist tools?[/QUOTE]

Umm, this is a new frame right?

What happened to plan A, use the warrantee, it is a defect is it not?


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## jaredmausteller (Sep 30, 2012)

well being your nds is out 1mm from the seat tube..... 
do u know if your whole subframe isnt twisted???
a 1mm deflection doesnt seem like it would kick your rear wheel out of symetry that far...
is the dropout that far from your hub on nds when your drive side is tightened down??
if so, then the nds is only bent if not then the subframe is twisted and more than likely not fixable.
(it is but its more of a headache than its worth)..


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## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

Eric Malcolm said:


> Umm, this is a new frame right?
> 
> What happened to plan A, use the warrantee, it is a defect is it not?


Must be my post-apocalyptic mindset which says "make do right now with what you have" )

Seriously though, I bought the frame with a large discount, for a beater bike, and just wanted so badly to build and ride it. There were 2 worse (build preventing) issues with it that I promptly fixed. The frame has been dropped twice: on NDS dropout so that its pointy part was bent up and inwards, and on upper front edge of headtube, so that upper headset bearing didn't fit.

Been riding the bike for 2 weeks now, taking opportunity of the near perfect weather..

Besides, by fixing such issues I gain experience, and that's invaluable )



jaredmausteller said:


> is the dropout that far from your hub on nds when your drive side is tightened down??
> if so, then the nds is only bent if not then the subframe is twisted and more than likely not fixable.


Yes, it's pictured with DS hub bolt tightened. But I get a clear impression that it's DS dropout that is bent (well, maybe not bent, just welded on that way), not NDS. This is because when I tighten just the NDS, the wheel locates about straight. But when I tighten just the DS, the wheel sits crooked and rubs on NDS chainstay.

Besides, NDS dropout is in about the the same plane as the IS mount located on the same piece of metal. This becomes evident when I set up brake caliper. So it can be concluded that NDS dropout itself is straight, and is acceptably well aligned with rear triangle.


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## Eric Malcolm (Dec 18, 2011)

*O/K, lets straighten it out*

With the bigger picture given, I think you can tweak it that final bit.
You will need to find a large vise that is solidly mounted. Both the upper and lower dropout portions need to be clamped in the jaws of the vice, give the head tube a pull in the direction needing to move the dropout angle to correct position. 
The only reservation I have is that the design where the SeatStay comes close in over the axle will make the tweaking a little bit harder, its very strong there is this form, which is why the threaded rod method failed as would an expensive purpose built tool. A bit like farting at thunder and hoping to compete. You need leverage, the suggested Cresent was too short for the required force. You may have to readjust the vertical angle after getting the dropouts parallel horizontally, as I would expect that SeatStay to be unco-operative and leave the dropout angled off the vertical line after a pull at the headtube. You want it parallel in both axis.
These are dark secrets ehh......


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## J. Random Psycho (Apr 20, 2008)

Thanks especially for the warning about purpose made tool not being up for the task!

I'll try to find such a vise. Mine isn't that strong attached I'm afraid (will carefully attempt it first nevertheless).

The reason I'm bothering with this is that I'm going to use my precious True Precision Poacher hub on this bike and don't want to risk it.


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## bing! (Jul 8, 2010)

bike coops have large vises. i just used my locals vise ti remove a freewheel a breaker bar couldnt touch.


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