# Wow, thought I was a stong rider (Alfine related)



## Leopold Porkstacker (Apr 21, 2010)

Recently upgraded my 2009 11th Anniversary Edition Surly 1x1 to an 8-speed internally-geared Alfine rear hub. I also replaced the smooth 24"x3.45" cruiser-centric tires (3GBikes.com "Hoggy-G" tires) to some knobby-as-f*ck WOW, holy mother of crap 24"x3.0" Arrow Racing _Wide Bite_ tires.

Of course, I went from a single speed setup with 36t x 17t gearing, to an Alfine with the same 36t chainring up front and a 16t sprocket on the Alfine. I dunno where exactly the power robbing is from, either the knobbies, or the internal gearing&#8230; but something ain't right, as my average speed is down by 3.4% with this setup (verified by 6 Garmin-logged rides-identical to previous rides with said 36t x 17t gearing), and I feel incredibly tired after riding the same rides as I used to.

Wow, it's almost like having gone from my 15.2 pound Ridley Damocles road bike to my 27 pound Marin front-suspension 29er mountain bike!

So, anyone else experience any new "riding lessons" being served to them when upgrading to an Alfine, or is it just my imagination (or am I finally an old man??!?!? :eekster: )


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## zombinate (Apr 27, 2009)

well I would try swapping the tires back first, and see if that makes the difference.


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## byknuts (Aug 9, 2008)

really?
you went from slicks to full knobbies, (insert snarky accent here)
well THAR'S yer problem!  


arrows no less! between my 2.7 arrow, my 2.65 .243 racing tire, and my 2.7 maxxxis highroller, the arrow's the slowest (AND the heaviest by far)
GREAT for serious earth churning traction, but wow, they are slow tires under power. if you're REALLY lucky and have great connections at your lbs, try to get them to search out the coveted single ply 2.7 highroller! so light, so compliant... 

(might be some 3" kujos floating about too! check them out!)

EDIT: you could always get clipping, i shaved all the center knobs on my nevegal, took me about an hour and a cramped wrist but BIG difference in rolling resistance... don't know if you'd want to do it up front, but out back it's not a bad idea.


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## Leopold Porkstacker (Apr 21, 2010)

Well, actually I hadn’t yet tried the Alfine setup with the slick tires. I think I’ll just accept this upgrade as a more fitness-oriented upgrade; heavier + increased rolling resistance = harder workout = stronger rider.


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## byknuts (Aug 9, 2008)

that's certainly one perspective, but keep an open mind.
my end result with my arrow was: arrow=crazy drag+heavy=slow acceleration+obstacles slow me down WAY more=less fun.

gearing can compensate, but if you're huffing for the sake of huffing and not getting down the trail...
give it a bit, but I'd start looking elsewhere. for me, those damn tires were just the best thing I removed. 
(trying to look past the amount of tire levers I snapped trying to get them on my atomlabs rims)


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## danthesoundman (Jun 29, 2006)

byknuts said:


> that's certainly one perspective, but keep an open mind.
> my end result with my arrow was: arrow=crazy drag+heavy=slow acceleration+obstacles slow me down WAY more=less fun.
> 
> gearing can compensate, but if you're huffing for the sake of huffing and not getting down the trail...
> ...


I agree. My Arrow wide bite, slow react 24 x 3 - even after shaving all the tread off both of 'em, even running ghetto tubeless, are the most painfully slowest, heaviest, hardest to pedal things I've ever experienced.

What are your recommendations for a decent 24 x 3 tire? I like the looks of the Felt Thick Brick (in cream), but the name implies it may be heavy, like a thick brick... plus, no weights are listed on their site. Has the Highroller "light" and compliant tire you recommend been discontinued? And who makes the Kujos?

Leopold Porkstacker, yes, that Internal Gear Hub isn't as mechanically efficient as the Single Speed rig you had before, plus I know first hand how tough it is to pedal those Arrow WB tires. (Did you ride these tires on your SS set-up? Or did you go to the IGH and Arrows all at once?)

I'm really interested how this pans out, but then I think I read on another post you are selling this, to get a "real" fat bike? Let us know how it works out.

I think I'm going with those creme Felt Thick Bricks, but if they're going to be beasts, I might go with the 24 inch Hookworms.


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