# RIgid SS advantage



## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

Just got back from riding Alafia, not bad for Florida.

Very tight course both horizontally and vertically. Meaning, the trails are very twisty, few straightaways. Very frequent 20-30 foot elevation changes, basically you swoop straight down and then straight back up, one trail was appropriately named "roller coaster" because that's what it's like. Very few roots or rocks, it would be a fast trail except you're spending the entire time digging out of one inertia hole after another.

I didn't see anybody else out there on a rigid SS but I was thinking, this seems like it might be the ideal rig for that track. Shoot, a kid on a BMX bike would rip that track to shreds. Yet everybody out there is on 30-speed FS bikes. 

Am I missing something? At what point does a rigid SS stop being an eccentric quirk and start being the right tool for the job?


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## 4SEVEN3 (Aug 12, 2007)

When there's wayyyy too many roots......that slowed me down, until I put a suspension fork on it.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

TampaDave said:


> At what point does a rigid SS stop being an eccentric quirk and start being the right tool for the job?


When you can smoke your buddies on their 30spd FS couches.


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## NWS (Jun 30, 2010)

TampaDave said:


> I didn't see anybody else out there on a rigid SS but I was thinking, this seems like it might be the ideal rig for that track. Shoot, a kid on a BMX bike would rip that track to shreds. Yet everybody out there is on 30-speed FS bikes.
> 
> Am I missing something?


Not everybody wants to buy a bike just to have one that's perfect for their least challenging trail.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

One of my teammates makes anything more than a singlespeed look like an impediment.

We were in trouble when he gave up his last geared mountain bike. That had, like, 27 speeds. His singlespeed only has "really fast."


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## Wiggs (May 11, 2006)

When you have to settle on riding in Florida...


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## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

Dunno about bicycles, on motorcycles there are certain tracks where the 600s fended off the literbikes for years, and to this day the literbikes require an unusual amount of skill to dominate the lighter bikes -- tight tracks with short straightaways, where acceleration and being able to carry speed into turns counts for more than flat-out speed. The similarity being, on some tracks, acceleration is the key. Gotta think mountain biking is similar, except that speed here refers to the ability to fly across rough terrain on the flats, where the suspension and gearing has an advantage. Or long downhills, where I guess you're less likely to break your neck on a fs. Not much of the latter where I live. Which is my point, sorta. If you have a really good fork, with good rebound damping, I could see a big advantage on some trails around here. Not sure I fully understand why people ride fs bikes in fla. I'm here to learn tho.


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## solo-x (Feb 16, 2010)

I'm pretty sure track bikes are SS rigid...


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I'm not sure I think that's the right comparison. My impression is that the change in weight from a 600 to a liter bike is quite large. And they weigh more than their riders to begin with, so it's a big change in total weight too.

The weight penalty for me to move from a 26" hardtail to a FS 29er has been 4 lb. In terms of a bicycle, I suppose that's a big proportion of what they weigh. But I weigh 143 lb. So it's a change of less than 5%, but I get more consistent traction and a much smoother ride. And I've come to think, more and more, that the terrain that really favors a full suspension bike is rocks and roots, not vert. That makes a full suspension bike on a road overkill, but I think we can all agree on that. And I think they don't do as much for me on a course where I'm always either climbing relatively slowly or it's steep enough that I get back to speed right away if I've taken a corner a little slowly to avoid losing my rear wheel or something.

I think the riders themselves are maybe a better thing to compare to different sport bike classes. XC racers are all pretty light. XC is about watts/kg, and humans seem to be more efficient when they're smaller, at least within a normal range - maybe people at least 5' tall or so. On the road, there seems to be room for more different body types, though. Lately, Nairo Quintana and Chris Froome are making a lot of noise in the mountains. They weigh 128 and 157 lb. But they don't really contest sprint finishes on flat stages. Those go to to guys like Marcel Kittel and Mark Cavendish, at 190 and 154 lb. So obviously there's some crossover going on in the intermediate weights, but Kittel is pretty terrifying if he's present. Over in the velodrome, they're even bigger. Not so many handling challenges, shorter races, and in match sprints, the accelerations are huge.

Point being, suspension is suspension and engines are engines.


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## CAPBOY (Sep 8, 2008)

Raced the Kenda Cup East #1 yesterday in Farmington CT. Not the hardest course I've ever ridden, but my control sucked being fully rigid and dealing with the roots I got tossed around like a rag doll. Looking at suspension forks as I write this.


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## WillTheGreat (Aug 26, 2010)

I think if your riding a bike and having fun, you are on the right bike.


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## Shock_Hazzard (Feb 18, 2015)

It depends on your individual skillset, riding style, and philosophy, I think. I've always been more of a "plow-through-with-brute-force" MTB rider, as I grew up racing track bikes [velodrome] and have strong legs and admittedly poor offroad handling. Even on the road, I usually find myself mashing a high gear up hills rather than downshifting.

I personally ride a rigid singlespeed midfat [26x3" tires] and I live in New England, where everybody thinks I am nuts! To be honest, I hated mountain biking until I got the bike I have now, and now that I have it dialed, all I want to do is ride it! Geared/suspended MTB's always disappointed me.



WillTheGreat said:


> I think if your riding a bike and having fun, you are on the right bike.


This.


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Shock_Hazzard said:


> It depends on your individual skillset, riding style, and philosophy,
> ...
> I personally ride a rigid singlespeed midfat [26x3" tires] and I live in New England, where everybody thinks I am nuts!


Philosophy for me.
It feels more rewarding when it is me getting the bike over the bumps and not my gear.
I see one technical advantage in a rigid bike: rigid forks don't dive.
Most seem to like 5" FS bikes where I ride. I don't think a 3" tyre would fit in my frame. Fork certainly, yes.


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## Shock_Hazzard (Feb 18, 2015)

perttime said:


> Most seem to like 5" FS bikes where I ride. I don't think a 3" tyre would fit in my frame. Fork certainly, yes.


My bike was built for it. Gravity DeadEye (the non-monster one).


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## jonshonda (Apr 21, 2011)

I tried hardtail geared bikes for a few years before my poor technique wouldn't let my back be comfy after longer rides (decent amount of roots and rocks). I then switched to a 5" FS 29er, and the rear suspension has allowed me a lot more riding time and comfort. But I do have a rigid fatbike (not SS, sorry), and really feel like that bike is more efficient and pedaling do to zero loss from suspension. 

Riding a bike w/o suspension reminds me how poor my technique on my FS 29er allows. Learning to relax your arms to float over multiple roots/rocks, or push the bike around corners using arm/legs. I am still learning a lot and trying to be consistent, so I am just adding my 2cents.


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## Aaron1017 (Jun 1, 2010)

TampaDave said:


> Just got back from riding Alafia, not bad for Florida.
> 
> Very tight course both horizontally and vertically. Meaning, the trails are very twisty, few straightaways. Very frequent 20-30 foot elevation changes, basically you swoop straight down and then straight back up, one trail was appropriately named "roller coaster" because that's what it's like. *Very few roots or rocks, it would be a fast trail except you're spending the entire time digging out of one inertia hole after another.*
> 
> ...


WAT? Alafia is one giant pump track. Barely have to pedal.


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## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

Aaron1017 said:


> WAT? Alafia is one giant pump track. Barely have to pedal.


Yeah, that's the point, I think.

Say you swoop down 30 feet and coast back up 25 feet. On a rigid ss you just mash the pedals once and your'e at the top. Farting around trying to find the right gear is a waste of time, and stomping the pedals on an FS is a waste of energy, to the extent that the suspension soaks up a lot of effort.

Even on the flats, you barely accelerate out of one blind turn before you're setting up the next.

As opposed to say Morris Bridge, where there are plenty of places to build up speed if you can stand riding over the roots. There, the suspension bikes would have an advantage. Another way of putting it is, at Morris Bridge, speed is the key; at Alafia, acceleration is the key. And I submit that a rigid ss has the edge acceleration-wise. Not saying I'm right or anything, just trying to wrap my head around it.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

Nobody's holding a gun to your head and making you shift. I think a lot of people shift too often on lots-of-gears bikes, actually.

There's no getting around some loss with rear suspension. But with the right linkage and damper, it's pretty minimal, and outweighed by the improvement in ability to carry speed. That's a lot more subjective, though, and still depends on terrain. Highly modified surfaces on flow trails aren't exactly the killer app for rear suspension, IMO.


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## Coach417 (Jul 13, 2007)

Tampadave, there ARE a ton of SS riders in our area. Some like Aaron are fast as hell and routinely smoke the geared boys. Some are like me and just enjoy the speed and challenge of a SS. However, I also enjoy my Ripley and it's not that it is overkill for our trails, it's just different. A lot of my PR's are on my SS, but not all of them.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Im new to ss and only have 200 miles or so on a rigid ss. I rode my ss today after having been on my am bike for 170 miles in Pisgah area, NC and it was hard to transition. Not the fact of a ss but being rigid. So much so I have been searching the web all afternoon trying to figure out what kind of sus fork I want to put on it. I love to go fast on the down hills and love getting air every chance I can which is made tougher on a rigid bike. For some reason my hands hurt today at about mile 5 of 23 mile ride. I am still picking the smoothest line, but if you live in the east you are going to eat roots and rocks. I have 4 mtn bikes and I wanted to keep this one rigid, but after today I think I will have to put a sus fork with a lock out on it. Well at least my fat bike will stay rigid.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

Ever try some Ergons? Theyre nice on your hands with the rigid fork.


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

More about the rider rather than the bike. IMO Morris Bridge is prime for rigid ss.


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## mfifer (Oct 16, 2012)

The singlespeed rigid is the ultimate "all mountain" slayer for alafia and boyette. I might be moving back to Florida from Chattanooga and will most likely be swapping out the suspension fork on the singlespeed for a rigid fork.


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## rsb201 (Jan 26, 2010)

Weight savings and climbing........period. I will take a squish any day. I tried the rigid thing......what u gain with rigid is lost going downhill. I have a surly collecting dust.


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## djembe975 (Apr 12, 2008)

I have a Stooge with a 3.0 Chronicle and swept back carbon bars and can take tech downs like a champ with no fork dive and don't feel beat up. Equipment and knowing how to ride a rigid bike help quite a bit.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

djembe975 said:


> I have a Stooge with a 3.0 Chronicle and swept back carbon bars and can take tech downs like a champ with no fork dive and don't feel beat up. Equipment and knowing how to ride a rigid bike help quite a bit.


+1 I have a monocog rigid and went out for a night ride. I came down this hill that was very technical. It has insane switchbacks where I've seen riders crash multiple times just trying to ride down it. Anyways, I was 4th overall on that segment in the dark. I had one of the above times so only two riders had ridden it faster. Rigids are not slow in tech. Rocks and roots I get bounced around though.

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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Rod said:


> +1 Rigids are not slow in tech. Rocks and roots I get bounced around though.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I'M glad u think so, but I would bet the science is against that statement.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

man.cave said:


> I'M glad u think so, but I would bet the science is against that statement.


To quote an outdated book, it's not about the bike.

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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Not trying to start an argument and yes rider plays a huge part. I know that I can take a rocky rooted eroded section of trail much faster on bike with sus vs a rigid. I still love speed maybe that's my problem. I was riding a nice fast section of dh this past weekend and I ran into 3 guys who wouldn't let off the brakes. Now I didn't get mad. They just didn't like the dh as much as I did. I stopped 3 times to create space and still caught them at the bottom. Now those guys would have been about the same speed on a rigid as a sus.


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## rsb201 (Jan 26, 2010)

Rod said:


> To quote an outdated book, it's not about the bike.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Then what is this about??


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

There are a million different kinds of "technical." When I was just getting back into MTB, it was all about whether or not I could ride something. Honestly, I don't think suspension helps with that.

I think suspension helps me ride rough trails that I can already ride smoother and faster.

I put that to the test semi-regularly. My 'A' bike now is a full suspension 29er. But I have a 26" hardtail behind my desk at work that I use for lunch rides and when the new bike's in the shop. And yeah, I really can ride all the same stuff. But it's rougher and Strava tells me it generally takes longer.

Now and then, I even hit the trails on my 'cross bike. That really is harder. But I often surprise myself about what I can still do. And it makes a trail I know too well interesting again. 

Anyway, when I think technical, I mostly think of the stuff I can't consistently ride yet. And I really don't think more suspension would change that.

Magic tires, on the other hand...


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

man.cave said:


> Not trying to start an argument and yes rider plays a huge part. I know that I can take a rocky rooted eroded section of trail much faster on bike with sus vs a rigid. I still love speed maybe that's my problem. I was riding a nice fast section of dh this past weekend and I ran into 3 guys who wouldn't let off the brakes. Now I didn't get mad. They just didn't like the dh as much as I did. I stopped 3 times to create space and still caught them at the bottom. Now those guys would have been about the same speed on a rigid as a sus.


We're on the same page. You're right if the trail is rocky, rooted, and eroded a fs will be faster with all things being equal. I'm not taking a rigid to an enduro race. It's the wrong tool for the job.

I normally try to avoid taking a rigid SS to places like Pisgah National Forest where certain trails have roots everywhere. In situations like you describe above a fs with 4 or more inches of travel would be at home. Larger tires with lower pressure do help greatly though. I would have to slow down during the roots, but then I could go just as fast afterwards.

Here's a blooper. I haven't had much time to ride this year so when I do it's at a fast pace. Just last week I was flying through a rock garden, hit a big rock, and it threw me completely off the trail. With front suspension it wouldn't have been an issue.

Back on topic, I was just stating the obvious as well. If a rider has good technique they'll be fast on any bike. If they have bad technique, it cannot be hidden on the rigid bike. You could've beaten those guys down the hill if you would've been riding a rigid.

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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

man.cave said:


> I'M glad u think so, but I would bet the science is against that statement.


Rigid are not slow in techy bits and you do get shaken and bounced around in rocks/roots.

Sounds good to me.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Rigids have there place and I'm struggling because I love the stand up and pedal feel of a rigid but feel that I'm not getting rewarded on the downhill as much as I should. I honestly want to to keep it rigid due to the weight savings and pedal effectiveness. I will ride it rigid alittle more before making the decision. I have several other bikes that I do ride and I think that is messing with me even more.


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## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

So for you guys who are good athletes, and have a selection of bikes you can choose from, what kind of trail gets you thinking, "I should bring my rigid SS, that'll be the best thing and get me my fastest time." Is there such a thing?


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## coke (Jun 7, 2008)

I have 2 rigid SS 29ers, a 29er hardtail, a fs 29er, and I just sold my fatbike with bluto fork.

My rigid SS is the go to bike every time except:
When I'm not feeling 100% and need something more comfortable and forgiving
If I need to keep up with a fast group on trails with a lot of roots or big rocks
If I want to get some air


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)

Well this turned into a penis measuring contest rather quickly....


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

TampaDave said:


> So for you guys who are good athletes, and have a selection of bikes you can choose from, what kind of trail gets you thinking, "I should bring my rigid SS, that'll be the best thing and get me my fastest time." Is there such a thing?


I stumbled into this thread without catching that you posted it in the singlespeed forum.

So, a velodrome? 

If I bought two or three more mountain bikes, one of them would be a singlespeed. And one would be a rigid, but not necessarily the same one.

I'm basically a spinner. I actually lowered the gearing on my race bike recently, and I think it's made me faster, not slower.

When I ride my 'cross bike on trails, it's for the extra challenge, the novelty, and sometimes to practice for racing it.

I did worry, last time I killed a fork and wasn't sure if I could afford to replace it, that I might not enjoy my favorite descents, or at least not as much, without any suspension. And at least at the moment, I can't do a several minute climb out of the saddle, so there are a lot of climbs I couldn't do with clean technique on a singlespeed. My knees are a little flaky, so...


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

djembe975 said:


> I have a Stooge with a 3.0 Chronicle and swept back carbon bars and can take tech downs like a champ with no fork dive and don't feel beat up. Equipment and knowing how to ride a rigid bike help quite a bit.


What he said!


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## Birdman (Dec 31, 2003)

TampaDave said:


> So for you guys who are good athletes, and have a selection of bikes you can choose from, what kind of trail gets you thinking, "I should bring my rigid SS, that'll be the best thing and get me my fastest time." Is there such a thing?


Fire roads and doubletrack.

The only opportunity for me to ride is at lunchtime from work. There are a few trails near work that I can ride in about an hour. 14 miles of fire road, 10 miles of rolling singletrack and 9 miles of technical singletrack.

I ride with a few other guys (who ride geared hardtails and fullies), sometimes for best time, and my fireroad record was on my rigid SS. My main "work" bike is a steel hardtail SS, and it gets the nod 95% of the time. I've ridden all the aforementioned trails on my rigid bike, with not much penalty time-wise or punishment-wise between the hardtail and the rigid. SSing the singletrack though is just plain fun.

JMJ


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

A1an said:


> Well this turned into a penis measuring contest rather quickly....


Unfortunately, that's what happens on forums.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

TampaDave said:


> So for you guys who are good athletes, and have a selection of bikes you can choose from, what kind of trail gets you thinking, "I should bring my rigid SS, that'll be the best thing and get me my fastest time." Is there such a thing?


If you want the fastest time overall, a rigid SS is the wrong tool for the job. The lefty basically becomes a rigid fork, it's extremely light, and a geared bike can be built 17-18 pounds. Hit the remote lockout on the hills and open it back up when you get to the top.

As I mentioned earlier, a rigid bike can be very fast, but if I was racing I would not bring the rigid unless I just wanted to have fun or race against other SS on a smooth course.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

NordieBoy said:


> Rigid are not slow in techy bits and you do get shaken and bounced around in rocks/roots.
> 
> Sounds good to me.


There's more than one definition to technical. Anyways, I'm going to try to keep this simple because I see where this is going. Rigids are terrible, slow, and I have no idea why they exist or why I purchased one. It's ancient tech. Go and purchase the bike that's the flavor of the week. It will make you take all the Strava KOMs!


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

A1an said:


> Well this turned into a penis measuring contest rather quickly....


Mines bigger........


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

Birdman said:


> Fire roads and doubletrack.


You should see a couple of pieces of "doubletrack" that I have around...
... and I like them, too, on my rigid bike. But as my signature might suggest, I'm not all that concerned about seconds or minutes.


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## Aaron1017 (Jun 1, 2010)

TampaDave: Santos Landbridge TH 9am. Bring your biggest ruler.


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## ProEdgeBiker (Jun 24, 2004)

WillTheGreat said:


> I think if your riding a bike and having fun, you are on the right bike.


+1 
Ride what chu got!


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## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

A1an said:


> Well this turned into a penis measuring contest rather quickly....


Makes me want to come up with another term other than "rigid," although as it turns out, that's probably the correct answer, because the people who are turning in great times on rigid SS turn out to be outstanding athletes to begin with. People who could probably turn in a good time on a Big Wheel if they had to.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

TampaDave said:


> People who could probably turn in a good time on a Big Wheel if they had to.


But a fat tyred Yamaha 350 wouldn't be allowed on most MTB trails.


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## febikes (Jan 28, 2011)

TampaDave said:


> So for you guys who are good athletes, and have a selection of bikes you can choose from, what kind of trail gets you thinking, "I should bring my rigid SS, that'll be the best thing and get me my fastest time." Is there such a thing?


I pretty much switched from picking squish vs. rigid based on the course to now racing rigid all the time. I still have the squish fork but it hangs on the wall and waits for me to change my mind.

For me, the "I should be on my rigid" answer is yes even for places with nasty gnar like Pisgah. What I found is that since I won't let lose on the descents the rigid is actually not a problem. I go slower and pick my way through the gnar because I lack guts. The rigid bike is actually better for the go slow and pick lines approach. I might lose a few minutes to guys on descents but the rigid feels better on the climbs. Unless I change my riding style, the rigid seems faster for me vs. squish regardless of course.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Well I did a small experiment this weekend. I used my geared specialized crave comp and my crave sl which is a ss. Now both are stock as far as drive train goes. There was an easy 4.4 mile loop that was smooth and has little elevation change (400 ft climb )


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Hands down the crave comp with a basic rs air fork and a 2x 10 gears. 2 places I gained speed was on the top end and some on the dh. This loop isn't tough so the sus fork wasn't a huge advantage but it did increase dh speed. If trail was rougher then it would have shown more. I rode the geared comp more like a ss just used the bigger gears when I could. But I think the ss helped me get to that point. I did this test taking 2 of my bikes out on a trail with a friend who did the same but he had much larger difference in time due to the fact he does ride a ss at all.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

I have been debating on getting a sus on my ss and I think I will get one with a remote lockout. I hate to gain the weight but I think the trade will be worth it. My crave comp is around 26 lbs and my ss is 19.8 so I don't think 2.5 lbs will hurt me that bad especially if I can ride harder.


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## khardrunner14 (Aug 16, 2010)

Sounds like the gain in speed had little to nothing to do with the fork and more to do with having top end gearing. So why use that test as a part of the decision making?


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

Because my hands didn't hurt and if the trail was rougher there was no way the rigid would hang. Although the major advantages came from more gears, there wasn't a disadvantage from the fork which was my concern


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## Mr. 68 Hundred (Feb 6, 2011)

First rigid ride in about 20 years (Mag 20 yo). Fast on flow, sucky on rock gardens, gotta be carefull pulling up on the front end as it's so light. Pay attention or rocks'll put you on your ass. Or face. I suspect its kind of like driving a Viper. Let up on your concentration for even a second, and it'll kill you.


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## onegearaddict (May 16, 2013)

I personally love riding rigid for most of the trails I ride (flowy singletrack to some moderately technical rocky/rooty trails). It forces you to select better lines by kicking your ass when you get sloppy. You really do have to stay sharp through every section. 

Riding rigid is also a great way to correct some of the ingrained flaws in your riding. Too much on the bars: Your hands will go numb. Not throwing your heels back enough and absorbing the terrain on those technical descents: You're going OTB.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

onegearaddict said:


> Riding rigid is also a great way to correct some of the ingrained flaws in your riding. Too much on the bars: Your hands will go numb. Not throwing your heels back enough and absorbing the terrain on those technical descents: You're going OTB.


Your arms feel like the muscles are being shaken off the bone: You're riding rocks.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

This past week I rode 27 miles on an intermediate trail that had a few man made rock gardens. I turned my best times ever for the trail. But at the same time I am in my best riding shape. I didn't have hand pain like I had the last ride with my rigid ss. Although I had fun, I still didn't feel like I got rewarded on the dh. 2 foot drops/jumps just are not as fun to land on a rigid so I bypass them.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

onegearaddict said:


> I personally love riding rigid for most of the trails I ride (flowy singletrack to some moderately technical rocky/rooty trails). It forces you to select better lines by kicking your ass when you get sloppy. You really do have to stay sharp through every section.
> 
> Riding rigid is also a great way to correct some of the ingrained flaws in your riding. Too much on the bars: Your hands will go numb. Not throwing your heels back enough and absorbing the terrain on those technical descents: You're going OTB.


Well said. The above is why I enjoy my rigid as well. Maybe it's the placebo effect, but I haven't ridden as much this year, but I'm not struggling with bike handling. I think that's because most of my miles are on the rigid. I take the rigid on ATV and hiking trails so I have to stay sharp, especially at night.

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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

man.cave said:


> Because my hands didn't hurt and if the trail was rougher there was no way the rigid would hang. Although the major advantages came from more gears, there wasn't a disadvantage from the fork which was my concern


I have a 20 mile loop that consists of 7-10 road miles. The rigid SS I normally average 1 mph slower. I don't know how that translates into minutes and seconds, but this loop is pretty smooth singletrack.

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## DefenderOfRock (Jul 31, 2006)

febikes said:


> For me, the "I should be on my rigid" answer is yes even for places with nasty gnar like Pisgah. What I found is that since I won't let lose on the descents the rigid is actually not a problem. I go slower and pick my way through the gnar because I lack guts. The rigid bike is actually better for the go slow and pick lines approach. I might lose a few minutes to guys on descents but the rigid feels better on the climbs. Unless I change my riding style, the rigid seems faster for me vs. squish regardless of course.


This us excactly how I feel. When I am on my bikes with gears and suspension ive been known to get stupid and start writing checks my skills cant. Breaking bones and thus not riding sucks.

I am not a good downhiller, nor will I ever be because im a wuss, nor do I care in the least. I am generally just as slow with a susy fork so rigid SS is no big deal for me. If anything It will encourage cautious riding and ensure I am still riding in 20 years.


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## robtre (Apr 9, 2008)

I re-affirmed my personal preference for SS, and rigid this past weekend. I find it necessary to try new things, over the weekend I demo'ed a FS Specialized Stumpjumper 650B. The trail I rode is my least favorite on my bike because of the 23462362 roots, so I thought it would give me the best perspective on the Stumpy. I HATED IT> and I couldn't wait to get off the bike. The only advantage I can see, was charging through the rooty downhills with reckless abandon. The bike was heavy, chain slap was awful, I really am too stoopid to shift. 

The biggest thing is for me, I am a masher and not a spinner. The rear shock had auto-sag, and when I wanted to mash, the rear end "bobbed" and took away my power. I tried to sit and spin, and it really was painfully boring to me. 

I do plan on building a new SS with a fork though to have in the quiver. I dont ever see myself getting a FS bike, for XC riding anyway.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

It is hard to switch back and forth especially to a bike that isn't set up like u want it to be. I got my rigid ss and rode it for 200 miles then I had a mtn bike trip scheduled for pisgah so I got back on my stumpy and I hated it. Buy once I got back into it and rode it over 300 miles and got back on my rigid I hated the rigid, not the ss part. The adjustment btw them isn't easy, but I love hitting trails hard and fast, but I'm still in control with my stumpy not with reckless abandonment.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

man.cave said:


> It is hard to switch back and forth especially to a bike that isn't set up like u want it to be. I got my rigid ss and rode it for 200 miles then I had a mtn bike trip scheduled for pisgah so I got back on my stumpy and I hated it. Buy once I got back into it and rode it over 300 miles and got back on my rigid I hated the rigid, not the ss part. The adjustment btw them isn't easy, but I love hitting trails hard and fast, but I'm still in control with my stumpy not with reckless abandonment.


This is exactly what has happened to me. I just switched to the geared bike that had the suspension fork and I got use to it. Going downhills with reckless abandon on old atv trail and hiking trails. I recently switched back to the rigid and I hit a big bump and it caught me off guard. There's definitely an adjustment period.


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## max-a-mill (Apr 14, 2004)

conversely i think a lot of people never give a rigid fork enough of a chance before they take it off and say they hate it. luckily i got into riding rigid when my full-sus broke and i had nothing to ride but a rigid moncog ss for 6 months. i will admit i wasn't sold on it the first month or two but after a while you learn to loosen up the shoulders, pick better lines, learn how/when to unweight to float over chunky stuff , and slowly learn the way to properly ride a rigid bike. you'd think it's easy; but it takes a long time to figure out all the subtleties involved in the getting the sh!t kicked out of you every ride and it takes even longer to build up your shoulders to be able handle the added workload so eventually it doesn't not feel like your getting the sh!t kicked out of you every ride.

on my favorite local trails i doubt i would be much faster with suspension even if i got a chance to get used to it. the trails are really twisty with lots of quick little ups and downs; you need to be on the gas all the time.


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## jbass (Oct 29, 2014)

max-a-mill said:


> &#8230;&#8230;...it takes even longer to build up your shoulders to be able handle the added workload so eventually it doesn't not feel like your getting the sh!t kicked out of you every ride&#8230;&#8230;..


That's an added benefit I wasn't really considering when I started riding rigid ss. Due to a few non-biking related injuries, I hadn't been doing much upper body-focused exercise for the last couple years. I'm skinny anyway and was getting pretty scrawny up top. But since I've been riding rigid ss, my upper body and arms are definitely stronger--it's visible, even the Missus has commented on it


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## sxr-racer (Nov 17, 2005)

I use to ride a Titus FTM 26" and also a Gary Fisher Rig SS 29er. I had no issue going from one to the other. My rear triangle broke at the dropouts on the Titus. Scratch that one. Picked up a Niner MCR and set it up as a rigid 1x9. It has taken a bit to get use to. I do have to pick better lines with it. But I have some AC Joint damage. Pain comes and goes. I can handle the roots and such. But the sudden jolts that you sometimes hit are really doing a number on me. At times it will be bad enough to take the fun out of that ride. I have a suspension fork on order now. But plan to swap back and forth when I feel like it. Just picked up a Trek Ex 27.5 yesterday. I enjoy all riding different bikes on the same trails. It is a different experience with each. Just ride and enjoy.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

I started doing pushups in January and now do 5 sets of 30, 3x a week and it has definitely helped with my SSing as this was the first spring in years that my lower back hasn't hurt in the early season. Good stuff!


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

sxr-racer said:


> I enjoy all riding different bikes on the same trails. It is a different experience with each. Just ride and enjoy.


That sums it up for me. The good thing about bike specific sections on a forum is u can learn a lot from the die hards, but the down side is a lot are dead set that their chosen bike because its the best or purist or what ever. I ride a hard tail with sus fork, 2 different full suspension bikes, a rigid ss and a rigid fat bike. Also 2 different Rd bikes. More bikes more ways to ride the same trails.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

man.cave said:


> That sums it up for me. The good thing about bike specific sections on a forum is u can learn a lot from the die hards, but the down side is a lot are dead set that their chosen bike because its the best or purist or what ever. I ride a hard tail with sus fork, 2 different full suspension bikes, a rigid ss and a rigid fat bike. Also 2 different Rd bikes. More bikes more ways to ride the same trails.


Well said man cave.


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## mrsa101 (Jul 19, 2011)

I've had a couple rides on my SS rigid jabberwocky now. and coming from a 6" bike its not as big of an adjustment as I would have thought. I guess the biggest difference is that there are some trails that I wouldnt even consider on this bike, but it works both ways, trails that i would have hated on the 6" bike are now fun. a small rock garden or some roots are now a big moment, where on the 6" bike I wouldnt even notice features like that because they'd be the smooth part of the trail between virtual boulder fields and big drops.

the biggest adjustment so far is knowing how far I can push the bike when the trail turns rough, and how big the rocks/roots need to be to pay attention to them. its so easy to build up ridiculous speed when the trails smoother, but it just takes a small rock in the middle of a corner to get the front end out of whack. 

The best part so far has been catching people on their 5000$ carbon race bikes and them pulling over to see a rigid steel SS bike go by. and its not that im some great rider, i really think that on the smother trails i've been riding, a rigid SS is the ideal bike for going as fast as possible. the fun factor is just a nice bonus.


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## redwarrior (Apr 12, 2007)

SeaBass_ said:


> I started doing pushups in January and now do 5 sets of 30, 3x a week and it has definitely helped with my SSing as this was the first spring in years that my lower back hasn't hurt in the early season. Good stuff!


I've been doing the same thing -sometimes 4 days if I'm not able to ride as much. Added 4 sets of 50 crunches, too. I have a screwy back & blew it out on my spin bike of all things so no pushups for 3 weeks. Started up again this week & I didn't lose as much as I thought I would have, thankfully. Any kind of core strengthening will help one's riding quite a bit.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

redwarrior said:


> I've been doing the same thing -sometimes 4 days if I'm not able to ride as much. Added 4 sets of 50 crunches, too. I have a screwy back & blew it out on my spin bike of all things so no pushups for 3 weeks. Started up again this week & I didn't lose as much as I thought I would have, thankfully. Any kind of core strengthening will help one's riding quite a bit.


Amazing how quick you lose it, huh?


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

mrsa101 said:


> The best part so far has been catching people on their 5000$ carbon race bikes and them pulling over to see a rigid steel SS bike go by. and its not that im some great rider, i really think that on the smother trails i've been riding, a rigid SS is the ideal bike for going as fast as possible. the fun factor is just a nice bonus.


The best is when you're with a new group and someone asks you to start in the rear so you don't hold anyone up on your rigid SS. That lasts until the first hill.......


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)




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## sxr-racer (Nov 17, 2005)

a1an said:


>


roflmao


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

SeaBass_ said:


> The best is when you're with a new group and someone asks you to start in the rear so you don't hold anyone up on your rigid SS. That lasts until the first hill.......


This is funny because I passed 3 ss riders today on my sus geared hard tail, but I kinda rode it like a ss, never dropped into the 5 largest cogs.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I've never even SEEN a single speeder on the trails until one day, I was riding mine to try a Strava climbing segment after work. 2 other rigid single speeders were also going for the same segment 
Didn't see any other bikes all day.


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## jas76 (Oct 23, 2014)

Rigid SS advantage is massive street cred in the car park. 
Most riders think you are some kind of powerhouse, sadomasochistic wizard. 
Truth is I'm just to retarded to change gears and figure out how to set up suspension.


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## shupack (Nov 28, 2012)

man.cave said:


> That sums it up for me. The good thing about bike specific sections on a forum is u can learn a lot from the die hards, but the down side is a lot are dead set that their chosen bike because its the best or purist or what ever......
> 
> 
> > kind of like religion.
> ...


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## CoyoteNW (Oct 27, 2012)

NWS said:


> Not everybody wants to buy a bike just to have one that's perfect for their least challenging trail.


Three years ago I did exactly this- bought a rigid SS- for the trail network closest to my house, trying to keep it interesting...
...now it gets 90% of my ride time and the squishy geared rig is gathering dust in the shed. And this is on the rainy side of the Cascades, which is not exactly known for being smooth. 
There is no denying the fun of a rigid singlespeed!


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

I'm on the rainy side of the Cascades too. I see rigid singlespeeds on the trails somewhat frequently.


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## SeaBass_ (Apr 7, 2006)

man.cave said:


> This is funny because I passed 3 ss riders today on my sus geared hard tail, but I kinda rode it like a ss, never dropped into the 5 largest cogs.


They were doing it wrong! ;-)


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

SeaBass_ said:


> They were doing it wrong! ;-)


I think any time u get passed u r doing it wrong.


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## solo-x (Feb 16, 2010)

jas76 said:


> Rigid SS advantage is massive street cred in the car park.
> Most riders think you are some kind of powerhouse, sadomasochistic wizard.
> Truth is I'm just to retarded to change gears and figure out how to set up suspension.


eggzackery. I'm with this guy.


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## A1an (Jun 3, 2007)




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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

CoyoteNW said:


> Three years ago I did exactly this- bought a rigid SS- for the trail network closest to my house, trying to keep it interesting...
> ...now it gets 90% of my ride time and the squishy geared rig is gathering dust in the shed. And this is on the rainy side of the Cascades, which is not exactly known for being smooth. There is no denying the fun of a rigid singlespeed!


Yep.

Now if I could just find a fender for that Niner Crabon Fork.


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

At this point I still see it as more of a training tool than it being the most fun. Of my mtn bikes it ranks 4 as the most fun. Granted my rigid ss doesn't have a dropper. The biggest plus is the crazy light weight, has responsive handling, and efficient pedaling.


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## Mojo Man (Sep 1, 2007)

*Racing a Full Squish SS, who would have imagined*

I consider myself a big time SS'r, I train on the road with a SS and I race solely on a SS, XC as well as 8 hr solos.

I was racing a hard tail with sus forks and this year went totally ballistic with a full squish bike as pictured. When I lockout the rear and front it gives me just enough compliance for comfort and it hasn't hurt my lap times. One big thing is that it is a ball to ride, especially on root and braking bump infested downhill's which our area is noted for. It really put the fun factor back into racing and riding for me, especially since I love SS riding.
I did spend a lot of $$ making it as lite as possible because of the sus frame. I'm very happy with my experiment going full squish with SS

David


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

That's cool. What is the frame make?


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## Mojo Man (Sep 1, 2007)

man.cave said:


> That's cool. What is the frame make?


Black Sheep, made in Colorado. I'm a Moots guy but wanted to try something different, can be set up as belt too, maybe next year.

David


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## haloblue (Aug 22, 2012)

jas76 said:


> Rigid SS advantage is massive street cred in the car park.
> Most riders think you are some kind of powerhouse, sadomasochistic wizard.
> Truth is I'm just to retarded to change gears and figure out how to set up suspension.


There is an astonishing amount of truth here. Lol.


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## DefenderOfRock (Jul 31, 2006)

jas76 said:


> Rigid SS advantage is massive street cred in the car park.
> Most riders think you are some kind of powerhouse, sadomasochistic wizard.
> Truth is I'm just to retarded to change gears and figure out how to set up suspension.


This. Me too for sure. In my case, I needed a new bike but couldnt afford one with gears or suspension. So, its rigid SS for me until... well im a 2nd grade teacher so not sure gears and shox are in the budget for a long time. If anything, im getting a drooper post first...


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## have2ride2day (Nov 7, 2009)

max-a-mill said:


> conversely i think a lot of people never give a rigid fork enough of a chance before they take it off and say they hate it.


Exactly right. I never buy new rigid forks. The market is flooded with ones that have been ridden just a handful of times and put up for sale.


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## Rod (Oct 17, 2007)

jas76 said:


> Rigid SS advantage is massive street cred in the car park.
> Most riders think you are some kind of powerhouse, sadomasochistic wizard.
> Truth is I'm just to retarded to change gears and figure out how to set up suspension.


Best post in this thread.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## numbnuts (Apr 20, 2006)

have2ride2day said:


> Exactly right. I never buy new rigid forks. The market is flooded with ones that have been ridden just a handful of times and put up for sale.


Agreed,

Gave mine 2 full seasons. I love it because I am faster on it than my race bike, but a SID XX goes on this week, just LOVE the SS, but want a little more speed on the downs. The ups wont suffer much with a SID XX with lock out.


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## TampaDave (Mar 20, 2015)

haha you gotta pick your battles. Out at Alafia I figure I can run say Rock Garden faster on my current bike than I could have on my old 26er. But I got tangled up on Twisted Sister the other day thinking, man I need more gears. Dusting off my old bike as we speak. 

I kind of have this thing in my head where 29" wheels, fat tires, rigid fork and ss all go together. Currently am not 100% convinced that combo is going to be much slower than my 26er on a flat trail with lots of roots, not if I set it up right and ride it right. Time for an experiment. Invested in an old Marzocchi fork for the 26er, that's as far as I'm willing to go at this time. Soak up the roots vs trying to fly over them, hmmm. Need chunky grips. Extra chunky. That should do it.

Starting to explain to wife how a man needs more than one bike. More than two maybe. Got my eye on a Soma Wolverine. Yeah... that's the ticket....


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## man.cave (Nov 8, 2014)

TampaDave said:


> Starting to explain to wife how a man needs more than one bike. More than two maybe. Got my eye on a Soma Wolverine. Yeah... that's the ticket....


Lol I have 4 mtn bikes thar I use 2 that I don't and just ordered another one this week. My wife is kind to me. Although I do need to sell one or 2.


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## AndrwSwitch (Nov 8, 2007)

man.cave said:


> I think any time u get passed u r doing it wrong.


I think racing Cat. 6 is doing it wrong.


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