# X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!



## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

You may remember the bikes of the Santa Cruz Syndicate Team....they were using during this year a special modified X0 Trigger with a X0 Short RD and a SRAM RED cassette (Pic 1)

A small spanish company is doing a similar thing but with a GripShift....all the guys that are waiting for the SRAM XX groupset should consider this innovation. Basically, the main improvement is removing the need of using a SRAM XX or Road 10s (with a smaller max cog) RD. Using a Flat-bar shifter is actually not an option WWs and those who like the GripShift

and SRAM haven`t released its 10sp GripShift yet...

Where is the innovation?
They modified a GripShift adding one more gear but with the ability to still work with the X0 RD....much cheaper than buying all the XX groupset

They say that they can study the modification for other RDs

Link:
http://www.blackcatbonebikes.com/bl...adas/2009/12/16_Gripshift_10_velocidades.html


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

Looks like it costs 120 euro's. I'm guessing that doesn't include the shifter itself. This looks like something I'd really be interested in. Now if I could just speak spanish.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

*Gripshift 10 velocidades *

Necesitas un click más para montar tu cassette de 10 velocidades? No lo dudes, si eres tan amante del gripshift como lo somos nosotros, abrirás un nuevo mundo de posibilidades con el 2x10 sin abandonar tus mandos de cambio favoritos. Modificación disponible para SRAM X.0, consúltanos otras alternativas.

*10 speed Gripshift*

Do you need one more click to install your 10 speed cassette? Don't hesitate, if you love gripshift as much as we do, you will open a new world of oportunities with 2x10 without abandoning your favorite shifters. Modification available for SRAM X.0, ask about other alternatives.


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## COLINx86 (Apr 8, 2009)

120 euros?! 
guess I won't be doing that..


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

do you have to ship your right gripshift in Spain + 120 euro tuning ?

or in 120 euro is it included a new gripshifter ?


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

Eli, the price only includes the tuning...

I know that it isn't cheap at all but assuming that you already have a SRAM XO+GripShift groupset and you want to upgrade to 10s, there are three options:

Get a SRAM XX RD+XX Triggers (506€ in ChainReactionCyles.com!!)

Road 10s paired with Paul Thumbies or 10s flat-bar shifters....but you are limited to 32t cassetes

BlackCatBone Bikes GripShift tuning....120€

I think that right now is the best way to upgrade to 10s....expensive but much cheaper than the other options


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Epic-o said:


> Eli, the price only includes the tuning...
> 
> I know that it isn't cheap at all but assuming that you already have a SRAM XO+GripShift groupset and you want to upgrade to 10s, there are three options:
> 
> ...


WRONG !

You don't need a specific derailleur to be able to run 10s ! Every derailleur can do this: Alivio, Deore, LX,XT,XTR...every SRAM as well.

Still nice to see someone has a way to tune grip-shifters to 10s though.


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

nino said:


> WRONG !
> 
> You don't need a specific derailleur to be able to run 10s ! Every derailleur can do this: Alivio, Deore, LX,XT,XTR...every SRAM as well.
> 
> Still nice to see someone has a way to tune grip-shifters to 10s though.


I know....

But you need a heavy flat-bar shifter....not the WW choice at all


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Epic-o said:


> I know....
> 
> But you need a heavy flat-bar shifter....not the WW choice at all


BUT you can use a MUCH lighter Shimano DA derailleur instead of the heavy XX...my DA is 143g.


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## Dan Gerous (Feb 18, 2004)

DA wont work with a 11-36 cassette though... no?


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

so does that mean you can use an X0/X9 rear mech with a 10spd XX shifter?


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

nino said:


> BUT you can use a MUCH lighter Shimano DA derailleur instead of the heavy XX...my DA is 143g.


BUT the Shimano DA 7900 can´t handle properly 34t cogs...and it wasn´t designed for mountain bike purpose. You say that it is strong enough and I trust you but it´s not the perfect setup

1x10 with Shimano DuraAce 7900....nearly impossible

They say that they can study the modification for other RDs...Shimano XTR or maybe a 2x11 groupset with Campagnolo SuperRecord 11s RD

Great posibilities!!


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

RockStarRacing said:


> so does that mean you can use an X0/X9 rear mech with a 10spd XX shifter?


With that GripShift you can use any 1:1 SRAM RD (X0, X9, X7...) with 10speeds


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## Ninko (Jul 19, 2006)

Do they also make that rigid Carbon Lefty fork? Looks like it on the pic?


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

Dan Gerous said:


> DA wont work with a 11-36 cassette though... no?


I used a Da rear derail with a 11-34 cassette on my road bike at a mountain tt.
It worked fine....although everyone said it wouldn't ( just make sure your chain, limit screws and cables are dialed)
Don't know what would happen with mud and dirt or full suspension thrown in, though.


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

So I've contacted the company. It is 120 with you supplying the shifter. 165 euro's including the shifter. So about $236. Steep, but look at how many posts with people complaining about no xx GripShift. Nows your chance


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

Interesting idea, I have thought about to modify a gripshift to work with 10 or 11 cassette.

I would investigate it anyone would need a such setup, I´m no gripshift rider though.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Epic-o said:


> BUT the Shimano DA 7900 can´t handle properly 34t cogs...and it wasn´t designed for mountain bike purpose. You say that it is strong enough and I trust you but it´s not the perfect setup
> 
> 1x10 with Shimano DuraAce 7900....nearly impossible
> 
> ...


DA on a 10s titanium cassette...both items lighter and cheaper than XX and not a single problem.
DA is the same quality than XTR...not a single issue in many,many years i use themThe shorter cages are also much less likely to get caught by brankces or bushes or in a crash.


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

Nino....You are WRONG

ChainReaction prices:

Shimano DuraAce 7900 164gr 135€
Shimano SL-R770 10s 244gr 118€ *Total 408gr/253€*

SRAM X9 Medium 227gr 67€
SRAM XO BCB Tuned 166gr 165€ *Total 393gr/232€*

Stronger RD, 15gr less, 21€ cheaper, you can run 11-36 cassetes if you want and you have GripShifts

Paul Thumbies are not an option for the 98% of the riders...and the SEC GripShift that you mounted with your 10s drivetrain can´t be bought...

What do you have to say now?


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

nino said:


> DA on a 10s titanium cassette...both items lighter and cheaper than XX and not a single problem.
> DA is the same quality than XTR...not a single issue in many,many years i use themThe shorter cages are also much less likely to get caught by brankces or bushes or in a crash.


Nino,
what size is that cassete...and is it one of yours?


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## Slim83 (Nov 2, 2006)

Epic-o said:


> Nino....You are WRONG
> 
> ChainReaction prices:
> 
> ...


Oh yeah prepare for a duel.

This started out sounding like a great option but I am poor so I will wait a while and get laughed at for only having 9spd on my bike


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.

Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:

11-13-15-17-20-23-26-30-33-36

This would also work:

11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.
> 
> Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:
> 
> ...


I'd buy a few if they were cheaper OR lighter than XX


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## tubeglower (Mar 3, 2007)

Hi all, 

I've been a bit bussy and after receiving some questions coming from people from overseas, I imagined that someone from the spanish forum had posted something here...

Just as an explanation of the tuning:

We take a gripshift, open it, clean it and smooth machine the rachet area where the "clicks" are located. Then we insert a new machined rachet with the new 9 clicks = 10 speeds. It is needed a proper equipment to do so (you know the meaning of CNC I guess), I say that because some naïve people think they maybe would manage with a dremel... And that's maybe possible if you are brain-surgeon in your spare time. Otherwise, I can not imagine other way to do it.

The reason of the high cost, is that it cost a lot, pretty obvious, (due mainly to preparation time and a lot of manual labor). So I it is a nonsense to compare it with any shifter in the market, just because what you are actually doing is artisan tuning in a gripshift that costs maybe 10$ to produce as máximun. The way of approaching it is that you are buying a specific performance, if you like gripshift and want to go 10 speed, there is no other way, unless SRAM put in the LBS the XX gripshift (that should cost similar than the X.0).

To be honest, I would prefer XX gripshift than my tuning, then I would go for the new XX group. 

I understand nino in some concepts, but for me, shimano (either road or mtb) is not an option... I am too used to sram feeling and gripshift.


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## tubeglower (Mar 3, 2007)

by the way, it is obviously working quite fine...

http://www.foromtb.com/8632183-post103.html


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

BlownCivic said:


> What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.
> 
> Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:
> 
> ...


why don't you go with a 25t instead?

A 36 cassette has the gears wider apart,is heavier and needs a heavier long cage derailleur as well. I don't see the benefit.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Epic-o said:


> Nino....You are WRONG
> 
> ChainReaction prices:
> 
> ...


i'm not:
-you don't need both sides of the shifters.just the right side (115g).On the left you can take whatever shifter you like:light or cheap or both.
-Why do you compare DA to a X9?? Sure the X9 is cheaper.
-who says the XX is any stronger? Sorry - I personally haven't seen any SRAM derailleur beeing stronger than DA.
-And in your calculation you forgot the titanium cassettes which are cheaper and lighter than XX.

Anyway -the most expensive part is still the XX cassette. All i tried to say is you don't need any XX part to be able to run 10s! If those spaniards can modify SRAM compatible grip-shifters they can sure do the same with Shimano compatible grip-shifters. This would be what i want as i personally don't like SRAM rear derailleurs at all.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

nino said:


> why don't you go with a 25t instead?
> 
> A 36 cassette has the gears wider apart,is heavier and needs a heavier long cage derailleur as well. I don't see the benefit.


I'm using a tuned X0 medium cage derailleur as it stands, and have no plans to change any time soon. I am confident that the medium will handle a 36t no problem.

I don't want to go 25/40, as I already have reservations about the 26/40. I'm currently running 27/40 (my 26 is on the way from Mattias as we speak) and feel that even that is approaching the limits of the Record FD that I'm using.

I guess if you have no plans for comissioning an 11-36, then I'll just go for the slightly heavier SRAM part for the same cost ($239 US on Ebay right now).


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## Vortechcoupe (Nov 7, 2006)

tubeglower,

will you just sell the new machined ratchet? I'd pay a premium to not send my shifter to you and just do the work myself.

I too would like to run a 36 rear cog. As it is i'm running a 1x9 on my 29er race bike with a 32 up front and a 11-34 out back. I'd like to run a 32 or 34 front with a 11-36 cassette. 1x10 would be really nice.


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## Vortechcoupe (Nov 7, 2006)

tubeglower said:


> by the way, it is obviously working quite fine...
> 
> http://www.foromtb.com/8632183-post103.html


Have to register to see the pics, can you upload them somewhere else for us to see? Thanks.


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## COLINx86 (Apr 8, 2009)

Vortechcoupe said:


> tubeglower,
> 
> will you just sell the new machined ratchet? I'd pay a premium to not send my shifter to you and just do the work myself.
> 
> I too would like to run a 36 rear cog. As it is i'm running a 1x9 on my 29er race bike with a 32 up front and a 11-34 out back. I'd like to run a 32 or 34 front with a 11-36 cassette. 1x10 would be really nice.


+1.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I need to learn Spanish.


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## amillmtb (Jun 24, 2005)

BlownCivic said:


> I need to learn Spanish.


That is a sick looking bike. How does the X.0 + XX RD/cassette shift?


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

Epic-o said:


> With that GripShift you can use any 1:1 SRAM RD (X0, X9, X7...) with 10speeds


Thats not what i asked......... ;0)

i asked.............. "can you use an XX 10spd shifter with an X0/X9 rear mech"


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

No, you can't.


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

amillmtb said:


> That is a sick looking bike. How does the X.0 + XX RD/cassette shift?


Im sure thats an XO rear Mech, not XX


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

different ratios in shifting , so a XX Rear der not work with X.0 gripshifters

but HERE there are a X.0 gripshifters ( TUNED at 10 speeds)

a X.0 rear derailleur

an XX cassette ( only 10 speeds ...but A cassette )


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

BlownCivic said:


> I need to learn Spanish.


Yes...6.9kg w/ Tubulars


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

RockStarRacing said:


> if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....


different ratios !

X.0 rear der works with X.0 triggers or gripshifts

XX works with XX triggers

XTR works with XTR triggers and Sram Attack or Rocket gripshifts

3 categories of rear der , each a different ratio cable movement / rear der movement


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

Epic-o said:


> Yes...6.9kg w/ Tubulars


why you have on your R1 brakes different colors in caliper body and cup , front and rear ?

custom assembly ?


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

RockStarRacing said:


> Thats not what i asked......... ;0)
> 
> i asked.............. "can you use an XX 10spd shifter with an X0/X9 rear mech"


Although I have not tried it...XX shifters are supposed to be 1:1 pull....so I would say yes, it will work.
I used a XO rear derailer with Dura Ace shifters on a friend's cross bike this year after the DA derailuer broke....it worked fine.


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

the mayor said:


> Although I have not tried it...XX shifters are supposed to be 1:1 pull....so I would say yes, it will work.


it's 1:1.3 ... not 1:1


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

eliflap said:


> it's 1:1.3 ... not 1:1


Hmmm...I got the XO rear to work with the Dura Ace 10 speed shifters shifters with no problem....have you actually tried the XX shifter with a XO rear?


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## Slim83 (Nov 2, 2006)

RockStarRacing said:


> if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....


This is from Bike Magazine it is a good explanation

"The basis of SRAM's entire drivetrain philosophy is the 1:1 actuation ratio. The amount of cable pulled by the shifter is exactly the same as the distance that the derailleur moves for each jab of the thumb. Shimano, by contrast, utilizes a 2:1 ratio where the rear derailleur moves twice as far as the cable pull for every click on the shifter"

That being said, Sram labeled their mountain and road/XX 1:1 but from what I was told only their road and XX are true 1:1 where the XO, X9, etc, mountain derailleur moves a little more than the actual cable pull.


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

RockStarRacing said:


> if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....


It sounds like everyone is guessing...and haven't actually tried it.
I have the XX groupo coming....I'll have to give it a try.
I have been told that a lot of stuff won't work together over the years...and found out it was often far from true ( sometimes the mismatched stuff worked better!)


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## tubeglower (Mar 3, 2007)

As far as I know:

SH: 1:2 (1mm pulled cable is 2mm movement darreleur cage), that's the reason it is so smooth and so "weak" on keeping the synchronism
SRAM (X.N): 1:1 (1mm pilled cable is 1mm movement darreleur cage), that's the reason they are "tougher" feeling and more reliable keeping synchronism
SRAM XX: 1:1.3 (so they have changed the ratio, but still quite close to the original 1:1). To me there is no technical reason, but an important commercial and marketing one, it is the number 1 gruppo today, "let's keep it isolated!" so who want it must pay for it...


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

the mayor said:


> It sounds like everyone is guessing...and haven't actually tried it.
> I have the XX groupo coming....I'll have to give it a try.
> I have been told that a lot of stuff won't work together over the years...and found out it was often far from true ( sometimes the mismatched stuff worked better!)


That would be great, and your second statement is so true! hopefully your right again.....


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

top work tubeglower

...did you change the gripshifter to display 10 in the window?


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## vikingboy (Nov 5, 2008)

Are you planning on modifying the X0 pod shifter as well? id like to run 10 speed with a x0 short (? 1x10) rear cage mech and not have to run the xx shfter and associated xx rear derailleur.


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## aussie_yeti (Apr 27, 2004)

vikingboy said:


> Are you planning on modifying the X0 pod shifter as well? id like to run 10 speed with a x0 short (? 1x10) rear cage mech and not have to run the xx shfter and associated xx rear derailleur.


X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.


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## tubeglower (Mar 3, 2007)

culturesponge said:


> top work tubeglower
> 
> ...did you change the gripshifter to display 10 in the window?


not on the "normal production", it is already a hassle...

Now we are puting efforts on SH and XX versions, hopefully very soon available.

Regarding display, I am thinking on a solution, but it will take some time....


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## Vortechcoupe (Nov 7, 2006)

Again, will you just sell me the machined part to convert my 9 speed xo grip shift to 10 speed?

I just want to convert it myself as much as poss. I'd rather pay you a fair price for the 10 speed click part and install it myself.


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## Vortechcoupe (Nov 7, 2006)

aussie_yeti said:


> X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.


Any idea on max cog size a red/force derailleur can handle? Sram says ~28 but i bet it can take more in a 1x10 setup, maybe 32?? But I doubt it would take a 36 rear cog, which i want to run, also 1x10.


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## Ninko (Jul 19, 2006)

Vortechcoupe said:


> Any idea on max cog size a red/force derailleur can handle? Sram says ~28 but i bet it can take more in a 1x10 setup, maybe 32?? But I doubt it would take a 36 rear cog, which i want to run, also 1x10.


The derailleur just hits the cog... So it has nothing to do with the ability to handle the different in chain length...
The angle of the parallelogram is different than at a mtb derrailleur. So it won't work... I believe with a 10T upper pulley you can take a 30T cog?


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## Circlip (Mar 29, 2004)

Vortechcoupe said:


> Again, will you just sell me the machined part to convert my 9 speed xo grip shift to 10 speed?
> 
> I just want to convert it myself as much as poss. I'd rather pay you a fair price for the 10 speed click part and install it myself.


It sounds like there is more involved than simply opening up the shifter body and dropping in the new ratchet, from tubeglower's original note I've copied below. Unless you can accurately machine away the stock ratchet material to allow the new ratchet to seat itself in the proper position and alignment, then it probably won't work, or at least won't work very well. They probably have their CNC machine all programmed up to just pop the existing shifter in and let it go to work removing the existing ratchet material. Trial and error could be expensive. 



tubeglower said:


> ...We take a gripshift, open it, clean it and smooth machine the rachet area where the "clicks" are located. Then we insert a new machined rachet with the new 9 clicks = 10 speeds. It is needed a proper equipment to do so (you know the meaning of CNC I guess), I say that because some naïve people think they maybe would manage with a dremel...


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## tubeglower (Mar 3, 2007)

Circlip said:


> It sounds like there is more involved than simply opening up the shifter body and dropping in the new ratchet, from tubeglower's original note I've copied below. Unless you can accurately machine away the stock ratchet material to allow the new ratchet to seat itself in the proper position and alignment, then it probably won't work, or at least won't work very well. They probably have their CNC machine all programmed up to just pop the existing shifter in and let it go to work removing the existing ratchet material. Trial and error could be expensive.


yep, I see you have got it... We have tried and "errored" destroying some shifters here... :madman: It is no no :nono: for dremel enthusiasts or diy people. It is 99.9% possibilities to fail. Sorry for that. We do the job, tune the shifter and make sure it works before send it back to the owner, There is no new parts involved, we modify the case of the shifter, where the ratchet is located. By the way, case and ratchet is the same part and material (to make it easier...):madmax:


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## Vortechcoupe (Nov 7, 2006)

I was afraid of that. I guess i'll just pay the $140 for a XX rear trigger shifter or wait for the XX grip shift which hopefully will cost less then the trigger shifter. Dang, then i'll have to buy the rear derailleur too! versus using my current XO. doh!


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

I just thinked of a way to CNC some new parts to a X.0 gripshifter but if BCB did it good, so why should I do it?


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## A-Hol (Dec 31, 2005)

Maybe an obvious answer on this, but will a standard front X.0 gripshifter work on the XX front der? 

If so, I spend $175 US to get gripshift XX...that's good! New XX gripshift display windows (10 and 2) would be the final touch.


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## RockStarRacing (Dec 30, 2006)

aussie_yeti said:


> X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.


im sure i have seen an X0 pod working with a Red rear mech, so if that works, surely a XX pod works with an X0 rear mech...........


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

arrived mine :thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

nice

that's only slightly much more than standard spec weight (with cables), not sure about those alloy adjusters though

is the BCB graphic a lighter shade of green now, also how does the blacked out window look?

...finally how different does it look inside?


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...


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## Jake Pay (Dec 27, 2006)

eliflap said:


> oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...


:lol: Get those puppies tested :thumbsup:​


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Naaah - too much money!

I should get 10s Grip-shifters soon


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*medium cage XO RD works fine with XX 11-36*



eliflap said:


> oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...


...meaning you've already installed it? (!!)


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

installed today !! :thumbsup: 

on my Flash 29er 

11-36T cassette Sram XX

right gripshift from Blackcatbonebikes


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## legsrburnin (Mar 25, 2007)

TubeGlower, What's the turnaround time for the mod if you supply the shifter?


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## klaas_vm (Feb 3, 2010)

eliflap said:


> installed today !! :thumbsup:
> 
> on my Flash 29er
> 
> ...


How does your transmission work? I have a BCB shifter as well, but I'm facing some problems outlining the RD. I can see the RD moving up a little too much toward the higher cogs, which eventually causes the chain to always skip the second largest cog...


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## JaLove (Dec 24, 2006)

This looks like it might be a worthy mod. What's the smallest SRAM rear derailleur you can get away with using in an 11-36 and 42-28 setup?


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## klaas_vm (Feb 3, 2010)

JaLove said:


> This looks like it might be a worthy mod. What's the smallest SRAM rear derailleur you can get away with using in an 11-36 and 42-28 setup?


I have tried both a long and a medium cage X0 derailleur in that setup. I don't see much difference and the reach of the medium cage seems to more than enough!


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

No one has given a clear cut answer yet to the question of if a XX shifter pod will run nicely with an X0 RD and XX cassette. I run on a 1x9 and it would be nice to get a 36T on the back for those days when my legs aren't in the mood to play. I have an X0 gripshift, X0 RD, and XTR cog and I think there's weight to be saved in having an XX cog and shifter pod (around 30-40g i guess).


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

It has been answered. The answer is no, you can not run the XX shifter with the old X0 RD. Old meaning 2010 and older. XX shifter pod only will work with derailleur's that are exact actuation. If it doesn't say exact actuation on the derailleur, then chances are it won't work.


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## scooter916 (Jan 2, 2006)

morrisgarages said:


> No one has given a clear cut answer yet to the question of if a XX shifter pod will run nicely with an X0 RD and XX cassette. I run on a 1x9 and it would be nice to get a 36T on the back for those days when my legs aren't in the mood to play. I have an X0 gripshift, X0 RD, and XTR cog and I think there's weight to be saved in having an XX cog and shifter pod (around 30-40g i guess).


take an 11-32 XTR cassette, remove the 11t and lockring, get a 12t lockring and a 36t Action tec rear cog and spacer and now you have a 12-36 XTR cassette
The actiontec cog is about $65

http://www.actiontec.us/prices.htm


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## JaLove (Dec 24, 2006)

Would a short cage x.0 work with an 11-36 and 2x up front?


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks for the responses guys. Having an 11t cog is nice for those fireroad descents and road riding. So I guess it's XX all the way or no play.


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## scooter916 (Jan 2, 2006)

morrisgarages said:


> Thanks for the responses guys. Having an 11t cog is nice for those fireroad descents and road riding. So I guess it's XX all the way or no play.


agreed but you could also drop your 13 or 14 and keep an 11-12-14 or 11-12-13-15


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Thanks scooter. But one reason I want the XX cog too is coz of the weight savings compared to my XTR.


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## jack likes bikes (Jun 12, 2008)

while we are on the topic of asking with derailleurs work or not.

Will a Short cage X.O or DA work with an 1x 11-36t with a 34t chain ring?


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

scooter916 said:


> take an 11-32 XTR cassette, remove the 11t and lockring, get a 12t lockring and a 36t Action tec rear cog and spacer and now you have a 12-36 XTR cassette
> The actiontec cog is about $65
> 
> http://www.actiontec.us/prices.htm


I guess the thin Ti cog will damage every alu freehub body. I think the FRM solution with the "thick" Alucog is the more durable choice.


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## bikemaniack (Feb 6, 2010)

I think it won't work,beacouse the biggest cassette ring for that derailleur is 28t,and full olume is 33t

Here you have information from polish shop:

Pojemność całkowita 33T, maksymalna koronka 28T 

In English:

Full volume 33T max (cassette) ring 28t


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

I asked Nino that question before and he a DA will not work with a 36T or even a 34T cog.

I run a DA7700 with a 34T.


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## jack likes bikes (Jun 12, 2008)

I just found these photo about the troy lee flash.
How did they get a DA to work with the 36t?


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

I think it's about having the b screw turned upside down or something. That's an electronic DA btw so maybe it has something to do with that too? I would really like to make a DA work with a 36t cog since the xx rd is I think too heavy. I don't understand why sram would make such a nice and light cog then go out and match it with a piggy rd.


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## jack likes bikes (Jun 12, 2008)

yeah i know it is an electronic DA but how different is it to the normal DA.

Would turning the B screw u side down on an normal DA work?


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

I'm not really sure if it would work. Haven't personally tried it yet or seen someone try it. I do hope someone does though! I really want to find out too. I don't want to go out and buy a DA then find it out that it doesn't work.


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## russya (May 3, 2007)

They used a custom hanger that is longer than normal.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Just to throw it out there, IRD offers 10speed shimano cassettes already, 11-32, 12-32 and 11-34, the 4 largest cogs are on an alloy carrier, and you can get them for about $125 shipped from ebay.

12-32
http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shimano-Road-HG-10-speed-12-32-Cassette-/390190744525

12-30
http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shimano-Road-HG-10-speed-12-30-Cassette-/390190744511

11-34
http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shimano-Road-HG-10-speed-11-34-Cassette-/370374729847

11-32
http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shimano-Road-HG-10-speed-11-32-Cassette-/390190744389

Add some DuraAce 10speed bar-end shifters on a pair of Paul's thumbies mounts and any shimano rear derailleur and you can be converting your bikes to 10 speed setups now for under $300.


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

but... what a weight ... double than a stock cassette


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

by an 10 speed Ultegra 11-28 and a deore 12-36 cassette, take the 11t cog away, strip the deore and mount the 36t cog with a spacer behind the 12-28 of the Ultegra and you have a solution like above mentioned, but for cheap and lighter and with a higher range.
Should work at steel and titanium rotors ;-)


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

eliflap said:


> but... what a weight ... double than a stock cassette


How exactly is 355g double a stock cassette?


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

DeeEight said:


> How exactly is 355g double a stock cassette?


in this way :


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Agree with Eli. Those are heavy a** cogs.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

In no way are Recon 9speed cassettes... STOCK. And you're comparing them to the weights of 10 speed cassettes also. Could you get it anymore apples and oranges?!?


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

eliflap said:


> in this way :


oh no, these cassettes are only good on scale. shift like **** and if you put some watts on your pedal the big cogs flex and in worst case they fold like a papersheet.


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

I do have 10s cassettes from same source as Eliflap, they work good for me in the dirt.
If you are a big watt guy so choose a another forum, most WW stuf don´t hold up for big watters.


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

ok, think i understand: authentic weight weenie = chicken legs (dont think so, but thats what you say).
serious watts = not welcome in this forums because some weight weenie stuff could break down.
But comparison between men stuff and weight weenie stuff is ok and a welcome way for argumentation ?

please correct me if i am not right.


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

fastback67: It depends on how many watts you put


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

just enough to fold a cog of a recon ti cassette (never had something like this with shimano). details about my watts is a little bit foolish ;-) hope you allow me nevertheless to use some weight weenie stuff and tell about my experiences?


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

fastback67: you are then forbidden to use WW stuff 

WW stuff is for us chickenlegs


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

ok :thumbsup: 

my X.0 works with XX cassette 11-36T

and 36T oval Rotor ring in a 1 x10 set up


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## morrisgarages (Jan 25, 2009)

Eli you're using the modified to 10spd. sram x0 gripshifts?


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

morrisgarages said:


> Eli you're using the modified to 10spd. sram x0 gripshifts?


yes , since february 2010


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## mad dog26 (May 1, 2007)

Anyone else tried the 10 sp gripshift?

Nino, do you have 10speed gripshift for sram yet?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

mad dog26 said:


> Anyone else tried the 10 sp gripshift?
> 
> Nino, do you have 10speed gripshift for sram yet?


No - the SEC 10s at the moment are for Shimano derailleurs only. However i just got the news that SRAM compatible shifters could be available soon.


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## xcatax (Mar 26, 2009)

Soon = 20 or more days ? ............


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## LCW (May 5, 2008)

any news on SRAM 10sp gripshifts?

in any case, I'm running X0 grips, with X0 rear d, and the new XG999 cassette... think of it as a 9-speed XX cassette... SO awesome... I don't need the 36 cog, so don't need XX, at least not with current setup (running 22/34 front... If I had 26/39, then I could use the 36)... will keep on chugging with the 9-speed until they are too hard to find.... hopefully this won't happen any time soon


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## mad dog26 (May 1, 2007)

MI_canuck said:


> any news on SRAM 10sp gripshifts?
> 
> in any case, I'm running X0 grips, with X0 rear d, and the new XG999 cassette... think of it as a 9-speed XX cassette... SO awesome... I don't need the 36 cog, so don't need XX, at least not with current setup (running 22/34 front... If I had 26/39, then I could use the 36)... will keep on chugging with the 9-speed until they are too hard to find.... hopefully this won't happen any time soon


Yes i looked at this option but the cost of 999 is about the same as XX.....
With a modified grip shift one gets the best of both.

Any reports from anyone using this setup (other than eliflap, who seems happy....)?????


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## mad dog26 (May 1, 2007)

*Black Cat Bone bikes*

Anyone had any contact with Black cat bone bikes re 10 speed conversion in the last month or so?
I have sent them emails and PM from here with no reply.
I am keen to get some 10 speed shifters......


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## mad dog26 (May 1, 2007)

Well i finally got a reply from black cat bones who are no longer making 10 sp GS due to a machine breakdown.

Too bad i had just ordered 2 XX cassttes :madman: 

Anyone have 2 10sp gripshifters they want to sell me???
If so please PM me.

thanks


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## herve (Jun 13, 2005)

some racers asked to sram 10 speed twister and some people have seen Julien Absalon testing a pair on a race 

just wait and see .

sorry for my poor english ....oops


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## Sheigor (Aug 5, 2009)

Can anyone modifed gripshift to 10 sp.? And black cat bone didn't make it now?


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

nino said:


> No - the SEC 10s at the moment are for Shimano derailleurs only. However i just got the news that SRAM compatible shifters could be available soon.


Will those work with my current 9 speed SRAM rear derailleur, or will I need to get a new 10 speed rear to go with the cassette and the SEC when it is available?

TIA.

BB


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## jasonub (Apr 23, 2010)

here you go

http://cgi.ebay.ph/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130497407750&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

I took the liberty in asking the seller to translate his wares in english so we non german readers could understand what he is selling.


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## Iwan (Jul 18, 2007)

Just received this from BCB:


Hi there,

Yes, modified Grip Shifts have been one of the first products we developed and we still sell them.

Our tuned GS are manufactured under tight tolerances using advanced materials to ensure a long term reliable service life. We use high strength plastic for the notch thread for a long lasting, accurate indexing, and special ABS glue plus interference attachment for a trouble free joint between the original Sram mechanism and our indexing ratchet. 

The price for a modified Sram XO set is 185€. Includes left (unmodified) and right (10 speed moded) plus the original cables and box. Payment can be done by PayPal or bank transfer.

Lead time is a maximum of 5 working days counting from the day of the order, plus shipping time, which varies from a country to another. Usually, it takes 5 days to Europe and some 15 days to other continents.

Best regards, 
David Díaz Blanco


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## josliver (Oct 5, 2007)

Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.
Do they modify X0 grip shifters that we can use to replace the XX 10 sp trigger shifters ( keeping the XX 10 sp rear dérailleur and 10 sp cassete)? 

Are the item sold on ebay by www*fantic26*de the same thing?

Thank you .... JOliveira


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

On a related tangent, those Recon Al cassettes that came out a couple years ago, the ten speed ones that ranged 11-36 and were machined out like the XX ones, that they advertised as being 9 speed spacing (across a 10 cog range, and thus compatible with 9 speed rear derailleurs and chains) and packaged with a set of 10 speed SEC twist-shifters... turns out...they were NOT 9speed cog spacing. They were in fact ten speed spacing.

I had setup the one I got on a super light build project but never really used it because the bike is too small for me to ride comfortably. Well I was stealing the wheelset off it this weekend to put on my gf's bike, and when I pulled the cassette off I took a set of calipers to it and the cog-center to cog center spacing is identical to 10 speed shimano/sram cassettes. That and the fact that for a supposedly wider cassette (10 cogs with 9sp spacing should be wider by the additional cog and spacer afterall) the fact than any 9 speed shifter would shift across from the biggest to smallest cogs, but never once really matching up to any cogs in between... kinda makes it obvious that they were never really nine speed spaced... and that the SEC shifters I got are also 10sp compatible (with 2:1 ratio rear derailleurs). The cassette is 160g including the lockring for the 11-36 size, and I'm putting mine on my Salsa Mukluk 2 project (going with a black/red/gold colour scheme).


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## mmmaaaiiikkk (Aug 10, 2009)

josliver said:


> Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.
> Do they modify X0 grip shifters that we can use to replace the XX 10 sp trigger shifters ( keeping the XX 10 sp rear dérailleur and 10 sp cassete)?
> 
> Are the item sold on ebay by www*fantic26*de the same thing?
> ...


I don't think they are the same. And this is probably not the forum for this, but I have a set of *fantic26* grip shifters for XX 10sp rear derailleur and XX 10sp cassette. They have worked perfectly for me for a few months now.
You can contact the maker, Sven, directly:
[email protected]
They are also cheaper than the BCB ones.


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## Iwan (Jul 18, 2007)

*Black Cat Bone*



josliver said:


> Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.


Black Cat Bone <[email protected]>


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## josliver (Oct 5, 2007)

Thank you.
Do you know which is better, the www*fantic26*de or the BCB convertion?

Thanks.


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