# Raleigh Tokul 24



## chavist93 (Aug 13, 2010)

Hey Guys. I picked this up for my 8 year old as a Christmas gift (yeah it's a little early) since he has pretty much outgrown his hotrock 20. For the price of $230 to my door, it just seemed like the best bang for the buck out there.

I'm just looking for suggestions of small improvements that could be done to it before I give it to him. I've already ordered a shimano rapid fire shifter to replace the twist shifter, lock on grips, and wellgo m111 pedals.


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## djork (Nov 8, 2004)

Sweet! You could add some anodized bling. 

That's a good deal! I plan to get a 24 for my 10-year-old nephew for Christmas, and I'm thinking it might be a smart idea to start shopping now. I don't want the bike I have in mind to be sold out before Christmas. Looking at the Orbea 24 disc. Was set on a Specialized Riprock, but learned from this forum about the Orbea, which seems a bit better spec'd and a tad cheaper--definitely more bang for the buck. 

Sent from my C6916 using Tapatalk


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## Negotiator50 (Apr 21, 2012)

chavist93 said:


> Hey Guys. I picked this up for my 8 year old as a Christmas gift (yeah it's a little early) since he has pretty much outgrown his hotrock 20. For the price of $230 to my door, it just seemed like the best bang for the buck out there.
> 
> I'm just looking for suggestions of small improvements that could be done to it before I give it to him. I've already ordered a shimano rapid fire shifter to replace the twist shifter, lock on grips, and wellgo m111 pedals.
> 
> View attachment 1156987


Where did you get that bike for $230? I would like to get one of those for my boy.


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## chavist93 (Aug 13, 2010)

Negotiator50 said:


> Where did you get that bike for $230? I would like to get one of those for my boy.


Directly from the Raleigh website. Google "raleigh corporate discount" Make an account and it brings the price down to $209 plus $20 shipping.


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## djork (Nov 8, 2004)

Man, that is a sweet deal! Hmmm, I'll add this to the short list. 

Is this the 2017 model and how heavy is it?

Sent from my C6916 using Tapatalk


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## SactoGeoff (Aug 11, 2017)

Sweet deal! Great find! 

Improvements list would be similar to what others do with them to drop weight:

Carbon bars - cheap ones
Carbon post - cheap one
Saddle - Trailcraft/Flow sell kids sized saddles that are reasonably light.
Perhaps a 30mm stem for sizing.
Go tubeless if you can
Shorter cranks - Trailcraft sells 140mm cranks + lower gear ratio
Believe it or not, you can buy a carbon fork for that thing really cheap too (Alibaba)
Tires are expensive but Rocket Ron folding will save some weight. So will Kenda Small Block 8's
The shock upgrade would be a little pricey @ $200-250.
Wheels are expensive too....But they're out there.


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## Szy_szka (Oct 29, 2015)

SactoGeoff said:


> Shorter cranks - Trailcraft sells 140mm cranks + lower gear ratio


On the topic of shorter cranks; I never understood why Trailcraft is still using Square Taper BB. Aren't those on the bottom the "BB hierarchy" (if there is such a thing)?

To the OP: Nice bike!


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## SactoGeoff (Aug 11, 2017)

Szy_szka said:


> On the topic of shorter cranks; I never understood why Trailcraft is still using Square Taper BB. Aren't those on the bottom the "BB hierarchy" (if there is such a thing)?
> 
> To the OP: Nice bike!


I think they offer the square tapers for the aftermarket at this point. For wider compatibility. Occasionally for the 2x setups as well. But both Spawn and Trailcraft appear to have gone to direct mount cranks for their stock offerings.


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## autoduel (Feb 2, 2004)

For kids, BB stiffness isn't as big a selling point. Many are just replacing exiting cranks for a proper length and reuse their existing BB. They do have one with a integrated BB and external cups.


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

Szy_szka said:


> On the topic of shorter cranks; I never understood why Trailcraft is still using Square Taper BB. Aren't those on the bottom the "BB hierarchy" (if there is such a thing)?
> 
> To the OP: Nice bike!


Unless you go direct drive then 30T is a minimum with a 104 BCD and they are probably much more expensive to make in small runs. On the sq taper the complex parts are really in the bottom bracket which is mass produced and the cranks only really need a tapered hole. The rest. seems like it can just be cast and only the taper needs any machining and then only a fairly rough machining. The hollow tech type however have a lot of complex machining where the crank fits the spindle and it needs to be much more accurate than square taper.... I looked at just removing the spindle from some Zee cranks ... basically thinking how complex can it be and soon binned that idea ...

They now do the external BB as well but it's priced accordingly and jumps from 140 to 152 and they make their own small tooth direct mount chainrings ... I would have bought one but in the options they give I'd be throwing away the chainring now as jnr is using 32 or 34 and paying for an extra bb I don't need.


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

autoduel said:


> For kids, BB stiffness isn't as big a selling point. Many are just replacing exiting cranks for a proper length and reuse their existing BB. They do have one with a integrated BB and external cups.


Yep my kids FS has Zee cranks as they are not hollow so easier to cut and tap... however the extra stiffness is just wasted ... however by the time you switch/make cranks it's probably worth upgrading to a better sq taper than the usual kids bike... especially if you go 2/3x to 1x as the chainline can go inboard quite a bit and make shifting better and something like the $15 or so UN55 is a good 100g lighter to boot.


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## Szy_szka (Oct 29, 2015)

Steve-XtC said:


> They now do the external BB as well but it's priced accordingly and jumps from 140 to 152 and they make their own small tooth direct mount chainrings ... I would have bought one but in the options they give I'd be throwing away the chainring now as jnr is using 32 or 34 and paying for an extra bb I don't need.


Thanks for the heads-up; I just located the landing page for the cranks with an external BB. You can still get it with 140 or 152mm crank. Final cost with shipping is $177. I am not sure I can justify this expense right now. Currently sporting 165mm cranks with 32T ring on the son's Splinter 24. I am sure he would benefit from shorter cranks but... for now it will have to do.


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

Szy_szka said:


> Thanks for the heads-up; I just located the landing page for the cranks with an external BB. You can still get it with 140 or 152mm crank. Final cost with shipping is $177. I am not sure I can justify this expense right now. Currently sporting 165mm cranks with 32T ring on the son's Splinter 24. I am sure he would benefit from shorter cranks but... for now it will have to do.


There is a weight penalty for square taper but it's not as big as you might think.
If you get a UN55 BB it's already much lighter than most stock BB's... (and will outlast the bike... and the disadvantages (other than weight) of square taper don't really apply to kids... yes its not as stiff for a 200lb adult... but to a 50-75lb kid that doesn't matter.

I shortened a Zee (obviously not the lightest crank and with a Deore external BB) but compared to a shortened SRAM S600 ($40 new?) + UN55 it saves 10-20g....

Don't get me wrong it's bullet proof ... and as I said on another thread... were a meteor to strike the earth and we were all vaporised I'd fully expect this to be floating about in space... in other words it's way stronger and stiffer than could possibly matter for a kid!

I also shortened some lighter old Deore LX cranks (used form ebay) and these were a pain... I hit the hollow part and used aluminium epoxy (for repairing engines) .. this worked on the drive side but the hollow part was different on the NDS and it didn't work (pedal came out)... so I need up making a bigger hole and sticking the steel pedal insert I'd cut off the Zee's in and bonding with the epoxy.... (adding a few filings of the alloy into it and knocking it in with a 5lb hammer) hopefully that's not going anywhere but it turned out a lot more work than other cranks... even drilling it took a week as I'd drill, go into the freespace and then stick in the epoxy... wait till next morning and drill a bit more...(rinse and repeat).. would I do it again? Not for practical reasons ... but I might for curiosity...

I've also seen someone had some aluminium bar welded into some XT cranks that was then drilled and tapped... but unless you pick up a used set real cheap and have a welder who'll do it cheap the Trailcraft would end up cheaper...

On the other hand getting right-sized cranks is a HUGE difference to peddling. 
The Deore LX I just made to 145mm vs his others that are 140mm
This is because he races kids XC on the Deore's vs Trail/downhill on the Zee and he was smaller when I did the previous Alivio and SRAM sq. tapers.

Kids XC races are so short he can stand the whole time.... (20 mins max in his age group) whereas we might do 6+ hours and 30+ miles on the trails so sitting and pedalling is not just nice... he can pedal seated on the 145's it's just less efficient (in that he has to move) but shifting his bodyweight forwards on climbs isn't bad on XC.

Downhill he gets the extra clearance and the saddle is dropped so the plan was to use the 145's on XC until he's ready for 150mm on XC then stick the 145mm on the trail bike etc.



> Final cost with shipping is $177.


Yep and I don't think it's outrageous... good adult cranks cost that as well except you don't need to keep changing them... and $177 is still $177... whichever way you look at it.

Given I can't use the small chainrings anymore (he's onto 34T on XC now) and I'm paying for the BB I don't need the extra $59 is kinda the breakpoint for me...

If I could buy cranks only for $100 I'd do it... but chucking away the chainring and then having to buy a new 34T NW and probably a 32T as well for specific races (as ours are all 104 BCD not direct mount) just pushes this out of what I'd pay....

A year ago 50-100g was way more significant than today... he's put on a lot of weight and almost all of it in his legs... He's slower on his FS which is 2kg heavier than his XC bike (obviously over XC not DH) but also on the trails overall... but 500g (1/2l of water) doesn't make a repeatable and measurable difference anymore...

On the oner side he *needs* the 34T on faster courses... he placed 3rd recently and simply couldn't get the top end speed the kids 2 yrs older could on a 27.5 wheel... he would pass them on climbs but his top end speed on non-tech sections they'd just pass him.

He takes it a lot more seriously than I do ... and he was really disappointed... from my personal POV I think getting 3rd against kids who are 2 years older is more than good enough... he doesn't see it that way though and he's frustrated just when we're out riding and I have a higher top speed and despite being perfectly sized for his 24ers he thinks he needs bigger wheels.


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## autoduel (Feb 2, 2004)

If he's sticking with the 34t, you might consider the redline microline 2 piece cranks at $125 on ebay. 110 BCD with integrated BB.


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

autoduel said:


> If he's sticking with the 34t, you might consider the redline microline 2 piece cranks at $125 on ebay. 110 BCD with integrated BB.


Unfortunately I think he needs the flexibility.... though the price/quality of those Redline look really good.

A lot of it seems to really be down to the cost of replacing chain rings... be it the direct drive or the 110BCD.... which is why Trailcraft look attractive...
VPACE (German) also do a fantastic 104BCD but it's 130mm or 160mm
Their site says "130, 145 oder 160" except there is no option to actually BUY the 145mm

Ultimately this comes down to the bike manufacturers.(IMHO).. if the Big 5 all specified kid sized cranks you can be sure Shimano and SRAM would make them... and then more alternatives would start to be made .. but whilst they are happy to roll em out with heavy 152-155mm cranks and make it the customers problem I don't see it changing.


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## autoduel (Feb 2, 2004)

I went with the 110bcd origin 8 cranks for my son's clash jr build. I already have plenty of chainrings and an old action-tec ti BB. Since it's a new build, I can compensate for the 34T chainring with a 42T cassette and spend the money elsewhere. But with the chainrings and chainguard included, the trailcraft and spawn is a good value. I'm going to end up spending another $25 for a chain guide that I did not consider.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

Steve-XtC said:


> A lot of it seems to really be down to the cost of replacing chain rings... be it the direct drive or the 110BCD.... which is why Trailcraft look attractive...
> VPACE (German) also do a fantastic 104BCD but it's 130mm or 160mm
> Their site says "130, 145 oder 160" except there is no option to actually BUY the 145mm


These are the same cranks that I am using for my son. Just GT branded. Unfortunately none left it appears. Definitely going for the Trailcrafts when the time/leg length comes around.



Steve-XtC said:


> Ultimately this comes down to the bike manufacturers.(IMHO).. if the Big 5 all specified kid sized cranks you can be sure Shimano and SRAM would make them... and then more alternatives would start to be made .. but whilst they are happy to roll em out with heavy 152-155mm cranks and make it the customers problem I don't see it changing.


We sound quite similar at times.



autoduel said:


> I went with the 110bcd origin 8 cranks for my son's clash jr build. I already have plenty of chainrings and an old action-tec ti BB. Since it's a new build, I can compensate for the 34T chainring with a 42T cassette and spend the money elsewhere. But with the chainrings and chainguard included, the trailcraft and spawn is a good value. I'm going to end up spending another $25 for a chain guide that I did not consider.


The nice thing about the Trailcrafts is that you can run a much smaller ring, and then go a little smaller on the cassette as well. Lighter all around and more chainring choices.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

I got my son (10) the same bike over the summer. I got mine for $250 that included professional assembly and calibration. I kept it stock because in a few months he should be ready for a 27.5. The only thing I added was a kickstand. One common issue with this model is that the dust cover on the fork tends to slip up, we do mostly beginners and intermediate trails, so no huge jumps, also the XCT fork is not rated for that anyway. I finally had to glue down the dust covers cause it was getting annoying. Another issue is the handle bar grips keeps on sliding out and had to glue those down as well. The bike is pretty noisy on trails especially if you are doing small jumps or going over roots, rocks, curbs, etc but can't complaint since its under $250. Other than that its a great looking bike, very decent disc brake, tires grips very well but not fast. Great mtb for beginners.


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## chavist93 (Aug 13, 2010)

Jvis24601 said:


> I got my son (10) the same bike over the summer. I got mine for $250 that included professional assembly and calibration. I kept it stock because in a few months he should be ready for a 27.5. The only thing I added was a kickstand. One common issue with this model is that the dust cover on the fork tends to slip up, we do mostly beginners and intermediate trails, so no huge jumps, also the XCT fork is not rated for that anyway. I finally had to glue down the dust covers cause it was getting annoying. Another issue is the handle bar grips keeps on sliding out and had to glue those down as well. The bike is pretty noisy on trails especially if you are doing small jumps or going over roots, rocks, curbs, etc but can't complaint since its under $250. Other than that its a great looking bike, very decent disc brake, tires grips very well but not fast. Great mtb for beginners.


Good to hear that it's holding up for you. Raliegh customer service is great. The rear wheel was out of true, which I know Is fairly common with buying a bike online. I contacted their customer service and was told to take the wheels to any local shop, send them a picture of the recipt, and they would reimburse me.

I think I'm going to hold of until his birthday (6 months)to give it to him. After trying on a few 24" bikes locally, he's borderline too small. I ordered the rowdy 20 for $150. Then threw his heavy 2003 steel frame hotrock 20 on craigslist for $100 and it sold in a day. So I'm into a new 20" Bike for $50 and it weighs under 20lbs.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

Rowdy 20 is a nice bike. I think Raleigh has done a great job with their color choices for both their kids and adults bikes. My son gets so many compliments on his Tokul 24 (orange). Can't miss him on trails especially when he's wearing his neon shirt and pants. LoL.


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## jreed3 (Feb 12, 2004)

I just bought my daughter the Eva 24 which is the girls version of the Tokul. Im really excited to get it...she's been riding a cheap 20" bike from Walmart that isnt meant to be taken anywhere but a flat paved driveaway, lol. But she's been holding her own with it on some easy/moderate mountain bike trails.

Ill also be ordering a Lily 20 (girls version of the Rowdy) for my 7 year old. She's riding a barbie bike with a basket 

Pretty impressed with Raleigh's lineup of kids bikes. Looks like theyve done a great job with selection and builds.


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## AK Happy (Jul 22, 2011)

The Tokul 24 is $185 on Amazon right now.

Hopefully someone takes advantage of this, lowest price I’ve seen.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

jreed3 said:


> I just bought my daughter the Eva 24 which is the girls version of the Tokul. Im really excited to get it...she's been riding a cheap 20" bike from Walmart that isnt meant to be taken anywhere but a flat paved driveaway, lol. But she's been holding her own with it on some easy/moderate mountain bike trails.
> 
> Ill also be ordering a Lily 20 (girls version of the Rowdy) for my 7 year old. She's riding a barbie bike with a basket
> 
> Pretty impressed with Raleigh's lineup of kids bikes. Looks like theyve done a great job with selection and builds.


It's a great bike, My son has the Tokul 24 and rides hard on it. I would consider getting a decent chainstay protector or you can DIY with a tube, especially on intermediate trails or pretty much any jumps. I also got a set of Diamondback K905 tires for pavement and indoor track riding which rolls much faster. I replaced the shifter with a rapid fire shifter and put on some grips with locks because the stock grips tends to slip. The brakes works well but the rear tend to need readjusting now and then. The Suntour fork dust cover tends to slip up but I glued mine down. Overall, I am very impressed with this bike for the price. Happy riding.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

AK Happy said:


> The Tokul 24 is $185 on Amazon right now.
> 
> Hopefully someone takes advantage of this, lowest price I've seen.


It's a no brainer


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## jreed3 (Feb 12, 2004)

Great deal!

The Eva24 i ordered direct from Raleigh yesterday is already out for delivery today. Thanks for the tip on the grips. Is bar on these strandard diameter so that any lock on will work?


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## AKHappy (Aug 28, 2015)

Yes, standard lock on grips will work


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## natepac (Dec 5, 2007)

Any idea on how much the Tokul 24 weighs? One reviewer said on Amazon said it was 31lbs.


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## GSJ1973 (May 8, 2011)

natepac said:


> Any idea on how much the Tokul 24 weighs? One reviewer said on Amazon said it was 31lbs.


Strong. Light. Cheap. - - Pick 2. It's not going to have very much aluminum aside from the frame at $185.00.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

natepac said:


> Any idea on how much the Tokul 24 weighs? One reviewer said on Amazon said it was 31lbs.


Mine weight around 29lbs but it has a bell, lights, lock on grips, different set of tires, chainstay protector, etc. The truth is that people get too caught up in the weight. Your kids are not carrying it on their back. They will NOT notice a lot of difference in riding between 2-3 lbs unless they are competing. This is a great starter bike and I emphasize on starter. If you are looking for a light bike, go carbon but you will spend at least 10x's the price of this bike.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

Jvis24601 said:


> The truth is that people get too caught up in the weight. Your kids are not carrying it on their back. They will NOT notice a lot of difference in riding between 2-3 lbs unless they are competing.


I don't agree. We're talking kids here, rolling on 24" hoops. They're working quite a bit more to keep those hoops rolling than we are riding next to them on our 29. Add to that the percentage in additional bike weight (a good chunk is in the wheels no less, rotational mass) comparable to their body weight and general leg strength and stamina...and the only thing you're helping is your wallet...not their riding experience...in the least.

If that extra weight doesn't matter, go make your bike weigh half as much as you.


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## AKHappy (Aug 28, 2015)

Amazon claims the Tokul 24 weighs 28.1 lbs


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

jochribs said:


> I don't agree. We're talking kids here, rolling on 24" hoops. They're working quite a bit more to keep those hoops rolling than we are riding next to them on our 29. Add to that the percentage in additional bike weight (a good chunk is in the wheels no less, rotational mass) comparable to their body weight and general leg strength and stamina...and the only thing you're helping is your wallet...not their riding experience...in the least.
> 
> If that extra weight doesn't matter, go make your bike weigh half as much as you.


I was referring bikes that are in this price range. Of course you can build one that is less than 20lbs but the amount you will be spending would be at least 10x's the amount of this bike. This is a beginners bike. Most of the mtb in this price range are about 26 (+/-3) lbs. You simply can not compare an adult with a 29er to a kid (probably age 7-12) riding a 24. Also if the kid is pretty experience, I doubt they would be riding an entry level bike. You can do some minor upgrades to improve the ride. My son's been riding his since the beginning of summer and rides hard. This is his "learning bike", he is trying to learn proper riding techniques and skills so he drops his bike every now and then. This bikes has held up to lots of abuse and Raleigh's done a great job with it. I rather him learning on his $250 vs $2k+ bike. I never said that extra weight doesn't matter, however you should not let that hinder your riding experience. Riding techniques and components matters more in that sense. After all most of your fat bikes and full suspensions are 30+ lbs. Happy riding.


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

Jvis24601 said:


> I was referring bikes that are in this price range. Of course you can build one that is less than 20lbs but the amount you will be spending would be at least 10x's the amount of this bike. This is a beginners bike. Most of the mtb in this price range are about 26 (+/-3) lbs. You simply can not compare an adult with a 29er to a kid (probably age 7-12) riding a 24. Also if the kid is pretty experience, I doubt they would be riding an entry level bike. You can do some minor upgrades to improve the ride. My son's been riding his since the beginning of summer and rides hard. This is his "learning bike", he is trying to learn proper riding techniques and skills so he drops his bike every now and then. This bikes has held up to lots of abuse and Raleigh's done a great job with it. I rather him learning on his $250 vs $2k+ bike. I never said that extra weight doesn't matter, however you should not let that hinder your riding experience. Riding techniques and components matters more in that sense. After all most of your fat bikes and full suspensions are 30+ lbs. Happy riding.


Why not just get a nice rigid? They are about 5lbs lighter. Those spring forks for kids are garbage anyways. If your kid is riding hard, you want a bike that won't hold him back. You don't have to spend 2k at all to get a nice 24" bike. Every bike is a learning bike for the youngsters.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

svinyard said:


> Why not just get a nice rigid? They are about 5lbs lighter. Those spring forks for kids are garbage anyways. If your kid is riding hard, you want a bike that won't hold him back. You don't have to spend 2k at all to get a nice 24" bike. Every bike is a learning bike for the youngsters.


I agree that bikes at this price range all have garbage forks. I didn't get a rigid because he like going on intermediate trails. Another reason why I didn't splurge on this bike is that he will outgrow this within the year. He wants a 27.5 full suspension for his next bike. Yes you don't have to spend 2k on a decent 24", I was referring to if you want it under 20lbs, you will need to go full carbon.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

Jvis24601 said:


> I was referring to if you want it under 20lbs, you will need to go full carbon.


My son's whip is full aluminum with a suspension fork. It weighs 22 right now because the wheels are pigs. If I built some modest wheels for him it would be at 19.5, and that's a solid build. Could be lighter if I ditched the HG50 cassette, Deore derailleur and shifter. I'm no where near 2k.

There are pretty light, yet affordable parts out there. Just gotta search them out.


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## Jvis24601 (Sep 19, 2017)

Cool. That light for a 24 hardtail


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

Its not bad! All I'm trying to say is there are ways to shave weight and not break the bank. You don't need to get anywhere near 2k if you like to build, or have extra parts from your own builds, or like to search. (All of the above is best!) 

I'm at about 1060 on my sons hardtail. Includes the bike at 569. I already had the bars, and the Judy. I plan to build a set of Stans hoops with DT350 hubs/Lasers that'll weigh in at about 1250gr and cost about 400. They'll be transferable between his hardtail and cross bike.


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## natepac (Dec 5, 2007)

For $185 bucks it seems like a good base to start with. Changing to a rst f1st and getting new bb and crank seems like good places to upgrade and stay around $500.


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## Staktup (Jan 21, 2016)

My son didn't want to ride his Splinter 24 in the street and I don't blame him, so I bought one lightly used / open box from Amazon for $185 shipped. Since he didn't want a BMX, this will be his street / bike path ride and his trail / park bike will remain the Splinter.

Edit: I thought it was open box/ gently used but it isn't, it's brand new. Rear tire was mounted backwards but other than that, it was packaged well.


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## Staktup (Jan 21, 2016)

Pix of both bikes as size comparison - post 485

http://forums.mtbr.com/families-rid...n-road-bike-ride-picture-thread-788480-5.html


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

What is the appeal of this bike over a MUCH lighter rigid?


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

svinyard said:


> What is the appeal of this bike over a MUCH lighter rigid?


It's a kids bike so .... you can ask why not get a kids CX bike or road bike etc.
At the price it's not badly specced considering a set of semi decent wheels or set of brakes would cost the same

It really just depends what you expect from riding ...

Last weekend we went with some friends to a set of trails with 2 8yr olds and 3 x 24" bikes from rigid to full suss...

They all performed differently and though even the FS is nowhere near as heavy as the Tokul some kids we saw did have similar bikes and mostly ride the 2000' climb we did on sat am.

The rigid was a lot slower going down technical reds and even parts on fire trails and not really faster going up when technical climbs were added in.. when Jnr did the climb on his HT he ended up unlocking his forks and then was faster than his friend on a rigid...

Probably the biggest difference was that we did the route, grabbed some lunch then did it again...this time with the heavier FS and next day did a different route with 3000' of climbing where we didn't see any kids on Tokul priced bikes. (Or any other kids come to that)

I guess the point is what can you expect from a bike that costs half what a half decent fork costs or the same as a half decent dropper or higher end cranks ??

Something has to give depending what you are riding... the rigid fork will save a bit of weight but lose out in other places and still by necessity have trash components at < the price of a half decent group set

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

I hear what you are saying and agree but the Tokul is basically an extra heavy Rigid Bike. Those cheap spring shocks are useless boat anchors. I could see buying this and then dumping some money into it. But beyond that I don't see the appeal over just buying a much lighter rigid.


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## AKHappy (Aug 28, 2015)

I hope someone will post a link to a better $185 bike. 

According to some of the comments, this thing is basically child abuse. Lol


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

Steve-XtC said:


> It's a kids bike so .... you can ask why not get a kids CX bike or road bike etc.
> At the price it's not badly specced considering a set of semi decent wheels or set of brakes would cost the same
> 
> It really just depends what you expect from riding ...
> ...


There is always volume and pressure. (In regards to tires)

Suspension isn't the be all, end all, of bike handling.

Proper setup, pressure etc, skill and guts is.

That is all.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

AKHappy said:


> I hope someone will post a link to a better $185 bike.
> 
> According to some of the comments, this thing is basically child abuse. Lol


Yup. You're getting reported.


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

There are a few things in kids recreation life where a little extra investment goes a long way. A bike is one of those hands down imo. Heck don't we all ride 2k$+ bikes anyways? You'll get that cash bake in resale value anyways.


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

AKHappy said:


> I hope someone will post a link to a better $185 bike.


Better is subjective... and it depends what the intended use is. That said a friend picked up a used Orbea 24 for UK £80 (so say $95) and is considerably lighter

However by the time he puts in decent wheels that will be +$400-500 and a half decent fork another $200-$600 then brakes and drivetrain another lot of $$$$ depending what he picks up.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

jochribs said:


> There is always volume and pressure. (In regards to tires)
> 
> Suspension isn't the be all, end all, of bike handling.
> 
> ...


That will be why those losers on the DH WC and EWS all ride rigids then ??? They just need proper setup, pressure (I guess their mechanics are just dumb) and learn how to ride a bike. I guess then they can chuck out the FS and be much faster on a rigid down an EWS stage of DH ???

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## thesmokingman (Jan 17, 2009)

svinyard said:


> There are a few things in kids recreation life where a little extra investment goes a long way. A bike is one of those hands down imo. Heck don't we all ride 2k$+ bikes anyways? You'll get that cash bake in resale value anyways.


You never get what it's worth in resale. Bikes are always a losing proposition, they're not investments. And this bike is a fantastic deal, it's good enough to past the time until they are large enough for a real build. It's silly cheap and only has to last a couple years until they can fit a 26 or 27.5. Having been thru a couple kids and bikes now and if I had to do it all again, I'd spend as little as possible till they are out of 24in bikes.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

*Directed at Steve's last post. Smoking snuck in before me.*


Taking things to the extreme, no? 

We're talking about hardtails in this thread Sir XTC.

Not to mention, my post was somewhat meant humorously. That said, all the gadgetry in the world won't make a shitty rider worth a fart in a bag.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

thesmokingman said:


> You never get what it's worth in resale. Bikes are always a losing proposition, they're not investments. And this bike is a fantastic deal, it's good enough to past the time until they are large enough for a real build. It's silly cheap and only has to last a couple years until they can fit a 26 or 27.5. Having been thru a couple kids and bikes now and if I had to do it all again, I'd spend as little as possible till they are out of 24in bikes.


Me, personally, have never cared about resale. Keep em for memories, loan em out. Whatever.


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## svinyard (Aug 14, 2017)

thesmokingman said:


> You never get what it's worth in resale. Bikes are always a losing proposition, they're not investments. And this bike is a fantastic deal, it's good enough to past the time until they are large enough for a real build. It's silly cheap and only has to last a couple years until they can fit a 26 or 27.5. Having been thru a couple kids and bikes now and if I had to do it all again, I'd spend as little as possible till they are out of 24in bikes.


I guess it depends on how big your kids ride or want to ride. My 5yro rides diamonds (the easier ones) with me like a few other dads here that live on some legit trails. No way in hell he is doing that if I'm spending as little as possible on a bike. We are only on a 20" let alone 24". But we mountain bike as a family and invested in it. Part of their progression is the bike not holding them back and being a safe platform.


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

svinyard said:


> but we mountain bike as a family and invested in it.


x 1000


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## Steve-XtC (Feb 7, 2016)

> Taking things to the extreme, no?


Always when it comes to cycling 

Though last weekend we would have done the same descent as the Welsh National Enduro except they were using it...



> We're talking about hardtails in this thread


He's done it on a HT as well... though the fork needed a service after 3 days on downhill



> Me, personally, have never cared about resale. Keep em for memories,


I've spent more on the kids bikes than my own but putting it in context that's a fraction of the cycling bill when you consider fuel and accommodation etc.

Other than the wheels that can re-sell any part of the group set that survives can be put onto the next bike anyway... though I doubt any of it will and he has gone through several chains, chainrings and cassettes that probably add up to more than the Tokul already.

And that's before the theoretical cost of my time... Life's to short to drive 4 hours to spend a weekend with a kid who' riding a bike to heavy to enjoy the ride or keep up... and when he's racing I'm giving up my riding time usually to get up at 4-5am and drive for 2-3 hours... then grab a ride after before driving back...



> loan em out. Whatever.


Yep he has loaned out bikes, wheels out on loan at the moment and sold on a set of brakes and gave away a 10sp shifter .. and loaned some 140mm cranks and gave away another set...


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## jochribs (Nov 12, 2009)

I'd say for the most part we're all birds of a feather in here. Regardless of how much we spend, or don't spend on our kids bikes. 

We're all in good company.


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## Quadracer01 (Jan 8, 2018)

My son got this bike for Christmas and absolutely loves it. It's really kick started his love for mountain biking. I managed to get the 185 deal on Amazon so score there. So far we put some 2.35 tires on it, trigger shifter, and lock on grips. Looking to shed some weight next. Any recommendations? Budget is key until he moves to a more std wheel size....


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## AK Happy (Jul 22, 2011)

Awesome, glad you got it for $185. That is a lot of bicycle for that little money, and it leaves some room for upgrades. Seriously, that bike doesn’t need much. I think you covered it with tires and shifter upgrade. It could use an air fork, but that’s not a budget purchase. It’ll be more than you paid for the bike.


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## Nurburgringer (Jan 16, 2021)

hi all - my 6yr old son is close to outgrowing his Raleigh Rowdy 20" so looking at either the Rowdy 24 or Tokul 24" as a replacement. Any bad experiences with the mechanical disc brakes on the Tokul? I haven't been super impressed with the V-Brakes on the Rowdy 20. Front has always been tougher to engage than rear due to the cheap 90 elbow routing the cable to the brake, they squeak, rims needed truing etc.
Other than that no complaints with the Rowdy 20, esp for the $199 I paid 1.5 yrs ago. Did replace the tires and grip twist shifter with a thumb/button one, that turned out to be more of a pain for him to use... 
Raleigh webpage says they weigh 22 and 26.5lbs so decent weigh penalty for the Tokul. 
Prices are currently $330 and $400 on Amazon for Rowdy and Tokul resp, but I've put in a camelcamelcamel alert if they prices drop. 
Thanks for any feedback/advice!


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