# Ceramic coating a polished aluminum frame possible?



## AC/BC (Jun 22, 2006)

I'm looking for a no-maintance way to protect polished aluminum. I'm worried about the duribility of clear coat and the dullness of clear powder coat. Wondering if anyone has had ceramic coating applied to their frame and what their experience was.




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## zahgurim (Aug 12, 2005)

You could try anodizing it after it's fully polished. No dye/coatings needed. Just hit it and seal it.


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## AC/BC (Jun 22, 2006)

Interesting. I didn't know there was a clear anodizing process. Maybe that is something i'll look into.




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## Mr.Magura (Aug 11, 2010)

AC/BC said:


> Interesting. I didn't know there was a clear anodizing process. Maybe that is something i'll look into.
> 
> .


Clear anodizing is sure the way to go. Anything else will cause issues when scratched/damaged.

If you are a bit handy, you can anodize your frame yourself.

Magura


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## crazy8 (Apr 21, 2009)

I'm interested in how anodizing won't have the same issues as any other finish if scratched through. Anodizing unless class 3 mil spec is not a very durable finish. What issues are you referring to btw. It's not like the alum will begin to rust.


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## Mr.Magura (Aug 11, 2010)

crazy8 said:


> I'm interested in how anodizing won't have the same issues as any other finish if scratched through. Anodizing unless class 3 mil spec is not a very durable finish. What issues are you referring to btw. It's not like the alum will begin to rust.


The difference being that an anodized finish, does not allow oxidation to travel under the surface layer, contrary to just about any other coating on aluminum.

Anodization is just as durable as paint. Ceramic coatings do however get close to the durability of type 3 anodizing, AKA hard anodizing. 
Ceramic coating on soft aluminum alloys though does tend to crack and chip.

Magura


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## crazy8 (Apr 21, 2009)

You need to do a bit more research on ceramic coatings. If the surface of the coating is broken through, rust or oxidation will not run under as it does on powder or paint which merely envelope the substrate. Due to the properties of adhesion for ceramic it's not possible for it to crack or chip with the flexing of the substrate. Ceramic is comprised of nano particles that bond to the surface on a molecular level. You are right about ceramic having the hardness of type 3, hard anodize, but there is no comparison between the protective value of type 3 and standard anodize. These are not merely my opinion rather facts.


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## Mr.Magura (Aug 11, 2010)

crazy8 said:


> You need to do a bit more research on ceramic coatings. If the surface of the coating is broken through, rust or oxidation will not run under as it does on powder or paint which merely envelope the substrate. Due to the properties of adhesion for ceramic it's not possible for it to crack or chip with the flexing of the substrate. Ceramic is comprised of nano particles that bond to the surface on a molecular level. You are right about ceramic having the hardness of type 3, hard anodize, but there is no comparison between the protective value of type 3 and standard anodize. These are not merely my opinion rather facts.


For that to hold water, you need to define exactly which type of ceramic coating you are referring to.

For the relatively cheap solutions, as CrN and the like, cracking and chipping is an issue.

I am aware that solutions that does not suffer those issues exist, but they come with a hefty price tag.

As you seem to be in the know, by all means prove me wrong. I'd love to find a cheap and viable solution, in particular for bearing faces and the like.

The above advice was based on, that to have a frame type 3 anodized, is like 100$
Any ceramic coating solution I know of, would be a few times the cost of that.

Magura


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## edoz (Jan 16, 2004)

STB performance coatings~Home

This is the guy you need to ask. He does a bunch of bike parts work and I've got two steel frames getting coated right now. I know he does clear ceramicoat on cranks, and will polish them before coating.


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## Mr.Magura (Aug 11, 2010)

edoz said:


> STB performance coatings~Home
> 
> This is the guy you need to ask. He does a bunch of bike parts work and I've got two steel frames getting coated right now. I know he does clear ceramicoat on cranks, and will polish them before coating.


That looks interesting.

Any details on the long term durability?

How much did it cost you to have a frame coated?

Magura


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## edoz (Jan 16, 2004)

Mr.Magura said:


> That looks interesting.
> 
> Any details on the long term durability?
> 
> ...


He's still got them, and he's never done a frame before so I'll have to wait and see how much they cost. (I'm not gonna post his estimate, just in case it costs more)

As to the durability, I won't know for a while. He says it's better than powdercoat.


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## zank (May 19, 2005)

I have a crankset that RD put a brushed finish on and then clear ceramic coated. A few mud rides so far and not a scuff in sight, and my heels tend to rub the crank. His username here is crazy8. Drop him a PM.


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## edoz (Jan 16, 2004)

zank said:


> I have a crankset that RD put a brushed finish on and then clear ceramic coated. A few mud rides so far and not a scuff in sight, and my heels tend to rub the crank. His username here is crazy8. Drop him a PM.


Oh hell, I dropped his website in this thread after he'd already commented. I didn't know he was a forum member.


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## zank (May 19, 2005)

And oh hell, I didn't notice that he already posted in this thread either! Doh!


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## crazy8 (Apr 21, 2009)

Hey guys I appreciate your comments and support of my biz. Really made my day :thumbsup:


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## jay_ntwr (Feb 15, 2008)

crazy8 said:


> Hey guys I appreciate your comments and support of my biz. Really made my day :thumbsup:


Ok, so you're the guy...

I've had a project on my list for a while that I wanted to discuss with you and perhaps this is a good place to do it as I'm sure others would like to know.

I have a set of XTR cranks that I cut up and polished and didn't do anything to. I started with 600 grit, then 1,000, then 2,000, then Mother's and an old T-shirt, so they were really shiny right when they went on the bike--and still look incredible, but they don't look as amazing as they did when I first did them.

Do you have a clear coating that will adhere to something that polished? What is the coating and how durable is it? Should I just keep polishing them every now and then instead?


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## zerodish (Jun 17, 2006)

You are going to break your frame if you do this. Just search the web for cracked rims.


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## herbn (Sep 17, 2005)

fork legs are hardcoated with teflon ,or ceramic ,very durable. i made a set of longer forklegs for an old hanebrink fork (a long time ago) i bought the 6061 t6 tubing cut it to length and had them hardcoat anodized with teflon, no problems.They're about the same color as the old mavic ceramic rims. I used a set of the tubes two years ago when i made my own set of emotion style rollers for winter training.


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## steadite (Jan 13, 2007)

Alodine EC²


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## crazy8 (Apr 21, 2009)

*Coating Highly Polished Surfaces*

Jay, sorry for the slow response to your question. As far as I know there's no coating that will adhere to a smooth highly polished surface and that includes ceramic. Ceramic is unique to other coatings that rather than enveloping the surface it actually forms a molecular bond and for this to happen the surface needs to be prepped and one other steps is to blast with a fine media. The ceramic is made using nano particles which fill and bond to the most minute irregularity in the surface. I've modified a lot of 960 cranks and offer ceramic coating applied but even though I don't offer a protective coating for the polished I still have many request for this finish. The only solution I can think of is to polish them up and apply a clear laminate on the face where most scratching is. Something like crankskins or even better 3M's protective film, but you would have to cut your own pattern. The 3M film is used to protect the leading edges of composite helicopter blades and on winged aircraft. It's really tough stuff and I think they have a new material that's what they call self healing, if it's scratched it will slowly rebound to it's original state.

I'd like to see a couple more photo's from different angles of your bike if you have any.



jay_ntwr said:


> Ok, so you're the guy...
> 
> I've had a project on my list for a while that I wanted to discuss with you and perhaps this is a good place to do it as I'm sure others would like to know.
> 
> ...


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## o1marc (May 31, 2012)

I have powder coated polished chrome plating, polished aluminum and polished stainless steel with candy colored powder coating. In 5 years I have not had one item come back to me because of chipping or flaking. It's an on going discussion on the durability of coating polished surfaces. While I will agree it is not as durable as a media blasted surface who can say to what degree. It a blasted surafce has ,for numbers sake, a 100% durability factor does the polished surface have a 90%, 75%, 50% , 25%, 5% durability factor? Who can say. Will the polished surface that was coated flake off tomorrow, next week, next year or possibly never? Again, who can say? I can only go by my experiance of not having any failures in 5 years. That being said I would not subject a part that would see common abuse like wheels and such that get battered by stones and debris all the time.Common sense should prevail on your decision.


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