# Rigid SS. ? 29+ up front ? Taking the edge off....



## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

Riding chunky trails with a rigid fork at speed is a handful. There are a lot of ways to set up your bike to help take the edge off but the biggest factor is the front tire.


A bigger tire up front makes a big difference. Along those lines I got thinking about a 29+ up front paired with a regular 29" out back.

Anyone out there try this?

I also know that once the front tire gets "too big" you loose a lot of overall quickness of the SS. Even without going as far as a 29+ I've found at a point the trades off between cush and sluggishness are no longer worth it. 


What are you rigid riders running up front? What are some of the bigger tires out there right now that work well?

(Rode and raced rigid SS years back but my fitness fell off and had to give it up. Now, I'm back and closer to fighting shape and want a piece of the action.)


Let's keep suspension forks out of this. That's a whole different animal.


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## SlowPokePete (Mar 27, 2006)

Currently have a Nobby Nic 2.35 up front, was always happy with a racing Ralph 2.4.

I have Niner carbon forks on both my mtb's...not sure how big I can go. Guess I've been sitting back waiting for more options for a 29+ tire.

Interested in hearing other's thoughts on this as well.

SPP


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

So I've been playing around with this the last three years. 

I've done:

Smaller rims under 24 mm internal 
Tires between 2.0 and 2.4. 
Supple sidewall tires. 
Tubless. 
Larger rims around 30mm internal. 
ESI chunky and now Extra Chunky grips. 
Carbon bar. 
29+ Krampus with Knards, Rabbit Hole rims. 
29+ Krampus with Rabbit Holes and 2.4 tires. 
29+ Krampus with 35mm rim and 2.4 tire rear, Rabbit Hole 50mm rim on the front. 

What I've found is exactly what you are thinking already. You are smarter than I since I was dumb enough to try all of this and simply came up with this:

I like the larger width rims to help balloon the tire. I use Blunt 35 from Velocity and Derby carbon 35mm rims. 
2.4 tire minimum. Using, Ardents or Racing Ralph 2.4s. Although Racing Ralph only come in 2.35 now, but my understanding is they are the same size as the old 2.4s.

I did not like the Krampus 29+ for ss rigid use. As you say, it takes away the snappiness. Many riders are having a blast, but it's a personal feel thing. Not for me. 
So, I put 2.4 tires on my Krampus. Kept the 50mm rabbit hole rims. Still felt like it was bogging. 
Tried the 50mm Rabbit Hole and 3.0 Knard front only. Nope. Still not my thing. 

I've now gone back to my old standard. Blunt 35 and 2.4 Racing Ralph! I run them under 17 psi. 

I also found the other thing that makes ss rigid tolerable is fat, soft grips like the ESI extra chunkys. 
My race face carbon bar has a good amount of flex. Love that too. 
Carbon P6 Hiflex Syntace seat post is also great. Niner RDO supposed to be great too. 

That's it! So I spent a lot of money trying 29+ plus other rims and tires. Didn't like it nor do I like the feeling of rims over 35mm or tires over 2.4.

Now, when I see some light 40 mm carbon 29er rims and 2.5 - 2.7 lightweight tires like the Racing Ralphs, you'd be talkin'! Good luck.


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## Cotharyus (Jun 21, 2012)

I haven't spent as much money as thickfog did, but I can tell you a good 2.3 or 2.4 tire (my current favorite is the Ardent 2.4 EXO) run tubeless on a set of 28mm rims at 25 PSI (I'm 215lbs or so) works really well for me, even with an AL bar. I'm looking to change that to carbon, but that's less important than replacing my frame at the moment.


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## bmreal (Jun 18, 2010)

I am on a Kona P2 (steel) fork, WTB Frequency i23 rims and Geax Gato 2.3 tire (tubeless) set at 20-22 PSI. This has been good for me so far. 
I recently switched (1 ride) from an aluminum bar to a carbon and I really can't say there is a significant difference. I am looking to switch tires to a WTB Weirwolf 2.3, but mainly for the traction/tread pattern change.


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## Flyin_W (Jun 17, 2007)

thickfog makes some great points here.
Like the others, I prefer wide (28-35mm) rims with 2.4 tires.
Have learned that most often big volume & rolling resistance wins over beefy grip. (Ra-Ra /Ardent vs. Rampage /Stout) 
If smooth & fast, Ra-Ra, if chunky, or wet Ardent. Another contender may be the huge Ikon 2.35, which I've only used as a rear. 
YMMV


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

I put a Krampus fork on my SS and would like to hear others experiences also. Currently running 29 x 2.1 Kenda Small Block 8s on skinny Alex rims since that is what I had laying around. I was thinking Knard up front and maybe the new WTB 27.5 x 2.8 in back.


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

Most recently running a Specialized Purgatory, 2.4, up front on a Flow. 2.3 Purg out back.

Oury's for the last ten years. Didn't know there was another grip?

New find... A Specialized S-Works wide carbon bar. Very flexy - in a good way. My old 25.4 Al Monkey bars were good but not wide enough, and overall no where as nice as these Spec bars. If this Spec bar dies would consider a custom Ti bar.

Thanks for the feedback.


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## arphaxhad (Apr 17, 2008)

Miker J said:


> New find... A Specialized S-Works wide carbon bar.


Aside from the tire (Ardent 2.4 @18psi) my 800m Kore Torsion bars are the best thing for control and confidence. Not carbon, but wiiiiiiide!


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## rzims (Sep 7, 2005)

RR 2.4 up front but recently went to a nobby nic 2.35 on my rigid jabber. Running Luv Handles for bars with Oury grips. Best setup I've found, but haven't tried a carbon bar yet...


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

rzims said:


> RR 2.4 up front but recently went to a nobby nic 2.35 on my rigid jabber. Running Luv Handles for bars with Oury grips. Best setup I've found, but haven't tried a carbon bar yet...


The stiffest bar I ever rode that really beat me up was a carbon bar.

The most compliant comfortable bar I ever rode was a carbon bar.


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## rusty_ss (Jan 28, 2006)

I followed a similar path to thickfog but ended up going the 29+ route. 

I started running an ardent on the front of my GF Paragon with an On One carbon fork then put P35s on it with a knard out front and Racing Ralf out back. I loved this setup. Never felt the mass of the big wheel up front. Ran it between 12psi and 18psi depending on the trail. Ran 18 to 22 on the back. 

I loved the feel so much I got a full 29+ rig (Carved Gnarvester) and am running it SS. I have to admit the whhel weight surprised me initially and I blew up on the first race I did on it but I am used to it now and have the pressures dialed and really love it. Bike weight is about 10.5 kg. 

I do race but am not a racer boy. 
I would definately suggest trying the knard on a relatively light 35mm plus rim like a blunt or dually. 

Sent from my HTC_0P6B using Tapatalk


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## rob1035 (Apr 20, 2007)

I'm on a N9 with a Krampus fork, flow and ardent, extra chunkies on a syntace carbon bar. Pretty nice! I've got a minion on a P35 to try out soon as well, significant weight increase so I'm curious about it on the trail...



Miker J said:


> New find... A Specialized S-Works wide carbon bar. Very flexy - in a good way.


Which bar?


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

rob1035 said:


> I'm on a N9 with a Krampus fork, flow and ardent, extra chunkies on a syntace carbon bar. Pretty nice! I've got a minion on a P35 to try out soon as well, significant weight increase so I'm curious about it on the trail...
> 
> Which bar?


Got it last year and not sure the bar advertised now is the exact same thing....

Specialized Bicycle Components

It is "only" 720mm wide, and wish it were a bit wider, but hey.... 12 years ago the widest DH bars I owned were 720mm.


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## borbntm (May 4, 2011)

SS: Currently rolling on a 2.4 Conti. Mt.King at 24 to 28 psi / Stan's Arch Ex / Niner carbon bar / Whiskey (clone) carbon fork on my Civilian Luddite....Great combo. 

1x10: 2.25 Nobby Nic at 24 to 28 psi / Easton Haven Carbon / Thompson carbon bar / Niner carbon fork on my Stumpy EVO ht. I will replace the front tire with the Conti. Mt.King 2.4 when the NN wears out.


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## alixta (Dec 27, 2006)

I've done the whole rigid thing a few times & sworn off it as many times, but now I'm back for another round. Used to race up to 12 hr enduros on it, so comfort was a biiiig factor. 
Fav combo a few years back was p35 with ardent 2.4 under 20psi. I didn't like any less chunky tyres as I feel you need some help when mid corner bumps skip out your tyre.
Hopefully Ibis will sell their new 40mm wide carbon rims as rims only soon, they'd be awesome combined with the new chronicle.


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## alixta (Dec 27, 2006)

Also wide bars are great for maintaining control in the chunk, I've not tried them but hear Mt Zoom bars are flexy & tough, would like them a bit wider. 

Finally body position is a big thing. Get your weight off the bars as much as possible so the big hits don't rock so hard.


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## Andy R (Nov 26, 2008)

I'm using a 2.4" Chunky Monkey at around 18psi (tubeless on Sun EQ27 rim). Works well enough for me.


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## Iamrockandroll13 (Feb 10, 2013)

My rigid front set up is:

2.2 Conti X-King Protection on a 32h Crest Rim built with DT Swiss Revolution Spokes.
Salsa Cro Moto Grande steel fork - Tapered Steerer, 15mm Thru Axle.
Thomson X4 90mm 90 degree Stem
Thomson Carbon All Mountain Bar
SRAM Contour Lock On Foam grips

This seems to be pretty nice on my hands, even on rocky rides I don't come back with sore arms. Carbon bars and soft large diameter grips seem to do wonders. If you are on a carbon fork, before switching wheels and tires out I suggest trying a good steel fork or a less stiff carbon fork. The carbon forks I've ridden really beat me up with what I feel is excessive stiffness. My steel fork tracks great and feels plenty stiff, but just doesn't seem to be as jarring as the carbon ones I've tried.


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## alixta (Dec 27, 2006)

The steel ones I've tried (avanti/raleigh xxix & voodoo) have a very harsh twang to them. Eg hit a bump and when they flex back it's harsh. Perhaps that's a function of cheaper (& very heavy) steel??


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

Started running rigid again this year. Started off on a On One Inbred 29 but felt the wheelbase was too long and the Krampus fork too long. Then I switched to a Cromoto 445 fork and mounted it to my old 2009 Rockhopper. Front wheel setup is a 27tpi Knard on a Velocity Dually w/ 9qr front hub. Now I have to say it's my favorite bike i've ever had. The BB is a little low but I am getting used to it. It corners beautifully. I tried this mainly because I am 220lb and wanting extra grip. Plus I'm getting older and could use the extra cush. I run a 2.25 RR out back.will prob try
The 2.35 Maxxis Ikon after the RR wears out. FYI I ride fairly smooth trails. Hardly any drops just rock gardens


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## cr45h (Jan 13, 2007)

i have put a lot of thought into going 29+ up front, but i can't commit. seems like not a lot of people have enjoyed the ride. maybe i'll just go 2.4 up front and rock it out that way. seems like the best bang for the buck. i enjoy a snappier, quicker ride, the rigid doesn't bother me after doing it for so many years. suspension is foreign to me.


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

cr45h said:


> i have put a lot of thought into going 29+ up front, but i can't commit. seems like not a lot of people have enjoyed the ride. maybe i'll just go 2.4 up front and rock it out that way. seems like the best bang for the buck. i enjoy a snappier, quicker ride, the rigid doesn't bother me after doing it for so many years. suspension is foreign to me.


Yup. Stay the course if you like the bike to feel snappier. That's where 29+ did not do it for me.

I was amazed that the 29+ actually felt like 1-2 inches of suspension. Even undampened like a tire is, it was pretty amazing.

I wonder if a 40mm or 45mm carbon rim and something like a 2.6-2.8 tire would be the cat's meow.


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## CCSS (Apr 6, 2004)

So I've spent a lot of time on this one myself... By way of background, I ditched suspension about 10 years ago when I really got into SS, and have been on rigid 29ers since 2007 when I got a first generation el mariachi. The el mar is long gone, and the two current rigid SSs are a Krampus and a Black Cat (yes - I'm lucky . I actually broke my first Black Cat in early 2013, and the interim period while Todd was building me a replacement frame, I ordered a Krampus (with Rabbit Holes and 120TPI Knards) to run as my SS. 

A few points to note... I was running a 2.4 RR on an Enve XC rim up front on the original Black Cat, with Easton Carbon low rise bar. I was a bit of a weight weenie, and thought that setup was the bomb.

Then came the Krampus. Two big modifications that I did to that bike that made (I think) a HUGE difference in the ride were running a Carver XC470 carbon fork and a Carver Prybar 730mm Ti bar. The carbon fork is about 13mm shorter than the stock Krampus fork and really snaps up the handling (and drops over a pound). The wide bar, coupled with a shorter stem was also a great change. As everyone above has said, the 3.0 tires offer *major* cush and traction, which I love. BUT, beware the durability of the 120 TPI tire. Check my MTBR thread called "busted a knard." I ride pretty aggressively in super rocky Austin, and let's just say that I've become an expert at trailside knard plugging... People have said the 27 TPI tire is more durable, but I can't confirm. I've also heard that it's 200-300 grams heavier....

Flash forward to today, and I have the new Black Cat back, specifically designed for running rigid with a nice, tapered, non-suspension corrected fork. Running a Carver Prybar on it, too. As a compromise I decided to ditch my weight weenie ways (since the Krampus was/is so much fun) and run Blunt 35s with a Minion 2.5 up front and an Ardent 2.4 out back. And it's awesome! These tires can be run at super low pressure, and because of the added tread and sidewall burliness, they're much better damped and a million times more durable than the Knards. Put it this way, I have some serious rim dings already, but have never pinched or punctured either tire.

Sorry for the long winded story. The moral is, don't be afraid of a heavier tire on a wider rim on your rigid 29er SS. The Blunt 35/Minion 2.5 combo rocks on the front...


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

All good stuff....

The last 2 posts were on with what I'm thinking - Wider carbon rims and something like the 2.5 Minion. Maybe a 2.6-8" if invented. The heavier duty 2.5 Minion, is probably most practical due to sidewall support/toughness as you'd be running this at very low pressures. Though it is a lot of tire to haul around - can't get something for nothing.

The carbon rims I've used so far on my FS bikes are LBs and Derby's. Both good, but did kill a LB early on. The Derby's at 35mm are nice for 29er.

Keeping the bike simple and tough are a big draw to me. I've got high end carbon FS bikes. But living in the wet, mucky NE I also like a bike I can throw in the back of the pickup and not worry about.


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## CCSS (Apr 6, 2004)

@Miker J - I'm pretty certain that the single ply Minion 2.5 I'm running weighed in at just about 1000g - very similar to the actual weight of the 120 TPI Knard. So yes, it's a lot to lug around, but no more than a 29+ tire, and not that much more than a 2.4 Ardent. 

And a question for you since you've run the Derby rims. I'm thinking about them for next time, but wondering/worried about their durability with rim hits? As I mentioned, I like to run low pressures and I'm not afraid to bottom out my tire suspension... Are the Derby rims pretty durable?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Interesting discussion here, and right up my alley! I have been riding mostly rigid 29er singlespeed for the last 6 years or so. My current singlespeed is a custom Ti Blacksheep frame and fork, Ti Groovy Luv Handles; tires are 2.4 RR on the front and 2.35 NN on the back mounted on Flows. I have been riding this setup for years and have been pretty happy with it. I am always on the lookout for higher volume tires that don't weight a ton though.

I was really intrigued when Surly announced the whole 29+ thing, and knew I had to try it. I also knew I wouldn't be happy with a Krampus frame, so kept my eye open for other options. I even got a set of Jeff Jones 29 x 50mm rims laced up before the Surly stuff was available. Whn I finally got my hands on some 120 TPI Knards, I stuffed them into an older Carver frame I had around (with 'reworked stays'). That setup was not ideal, but rom the first ride I knew 29+ would be a keeper! A little over a year ago I sent Davis Carver an email asking if they could make a Ti 420 with room for a Knard, and he sent me pictures of a frame they just had built! So I ended up with the very first Carver Gnarvester frame and transferred everything over. I am running it 1x6 right now on a SS hub, and from the first ride, I was hooked! Yes it's a bunch heavier than my SS, but the traction and comfort of those 3" tires is amazing! It is a bit sluggish, but that may have to do with the 490 AC fork Davis recommended, so I'm thinking about trying a 470 fork instead. I am also patiently waiting for new rims, either Notubes 50mm rims whenever they release them, or some Chinese carbon. I'm sure someone is working on 29" 40mm - 50mm carbon rims, but nothing out yet. That change alone would take a take 1 to 2 lbs off my bike, as the JJ rims are, in MikeC's words, super burly! 

So the bad news is I have not ridden my beautiful Black Sheep at all this year, just don't want to go back to those skinny tires. And then I saw pictures of that Rocky Mountain Sherpa sporting 27.5 x 2.8 WTB tires and knew what to do! I just ordered a pair of Derby 27.5 x 40mm carbon rims (backordered, so it will be a few weeks) and will be eagerly awaiting those beefy 27.5 tires. Also, someone else posted pictures of a Vee Rubber 27.5 x 3.2 tire that might work for the front.

I'm thinking the 27.5+ might be a great middle ground, not as sluggish as 29+, but more cushy than regular 29.

All I can say is, it's good to have these kinds of options!

Edit: Forgot to mention the Surly Dirt Wizard 29 x 2.75 that is also coming in the fall. Sounds like it will be lower volume but bigger knobs than a Knard, might be a good option for some.

Mark


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## randyharris (Jul 1, 2009)

thickfog said:


> I like the larger width rims to help balloon the tire. I use Blunt 35 from Velocity and Derby carbon 35mm rims.
> 2.4 tire minimum. Using, Ardents or Racing Ralph 2.4s.


thickfog, can you by chance try and indicate the improvement of running say a 2.4" Ardent on wider rim like a Blunt as compared to a more standard 29er front wheel.

I ask because I rode rigid for maybe a year and a half, 2.4" Purgatory up front, 2.2" Purgatory rear in rough and rocky Phoenix on a 2011 UNIT with Carbon Niner fork, carbon Easton bar. Longer rides would wear me out and leave my hands feeling like raw burger.

Recently I had the need to throw my P2 fork on for a few rides and was very much enjoying the rigid ride over suspension fork. This got me to thinking again about maybe going rigid, but I have a scared memory of those longer rigid rides from before.

Trying to assess how much better it may be with a wider rim as opposed to running a 2.4" on my 'standard' 29er front rim.

Thanks.


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

Might be hard to give a good answer. P35 or Blunt 35 really increases tire volume it seems. I can run to 14 psi front 17 rear with minimal rim denting and minimal tire side roll. I say minimal as I get some of both even here in easy terrain Michigan. 

On my stan's arch rims, I need to stay at mid to low 20s to prevent bad rim strikes and tire side roll on the rim.

Also the squaring of the tire tread on a wide rim gives incredible traction. But, go to wide on a narrow tire and turns pull you in. It's like self steer. I find I like 2.4 tires minimum for use on 35 mm or more rims.


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## brianW. (Nov 15, 2010)

If you want more cushion up front, how about putting a Salsa enabler fork. 
Enabler Fork | Parts & Accessories | Salsa Cycles


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

CCSS said:


> @Miker J - I'm pretty certain that the single ply Minion 2.5 I'm running weighed in at just about 1000g - very similar to the actual weight of the 120 TPI Knard. So yes, it's a lot to lug around, but no more than a 29+ tire, and not that much more than a 2.4 Ardent.
> 
> And a question for you since you've run the Derby rims. I'm thinking about them for next time, but wondering/worried about their durability with rim hits? As I mentioned, I like to run low pressures and I'm not afraid to bottom out my tire suspension... Are the Derby rims pretty durable?


Regarding the Derby's....

Only had a few rim hits so far at most. Its been a super long winter here. Killed a LB rim early on and don't even remember dinging it. The other LB rim I have has quite a few miles on it.

While I can't confirm this I'm pretty sure the same place manufactures Derby and LB rims, but Derby has his own design.

My highly anecdotal opinion on the rims are that they are probably as strong as a Flow, ding-wise. And that is pretty good because I never killed a Flow. Problem is, you kill a carbon rim and it is a lot of cash to replace. However, for the weight savings and the wider print I find it worth it. The Derbys are both wider and lighter than Flow/Flow EXs. As far as stiffness goes, I can't really say I find it that much different that a Flow and always found them plenty stiff laterally. (BTW, I have both Flows and Flow EXs).


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## SVO (May 25, 2005)

Great topic. I need all the cush I can get. My set-up is custom Quiring Ti with Niner RDO fork, P35 rims, Conti X-King 2.4s, Ti Moots bar (more recent model- not the noodle of years back), Ergon grip/bar ends, run SS. This REALLY works for me in CO. The bike is very light and zippy. Run 22/18 PSI summer, less in winter. Tubeless, of course. I'm 200# without gear.

The Niner fork was a revelation after Carbon White Brothers was destroyed: It soaks up far more chatter. Not cheap, yeah. The large surface area of the Ergons is much more effective than cushy grips IMHO, but it can test your hand strength in rough stuff. Last changes would be to rebuild the wheels with carbon rims and sub an Eriksen Ti seatpost- bling and function!

Looking forward to 2.7 front/2.5 rear tires one day, fingers crossed.
View attachment 931348


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## Iamrockandroll13 (Feb 10, 2013)

*update*

I've changed my set-up to this:








I'm now running a Whisky No. 9 carbon fork and a Knard set up tubeless on a Flow EX rim up front and Maxxis Ikon 2.35 on a Flow EX rim rear. It's everything I ever wanted out of a rigid bike for riding rocky PA trails. I highly recommend this set up to anyone thinking about trying it. The only thing I might change is ditching the Flow Ex rims for Hugo's when they are released.


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## fixgeardan (Aug 20, 2004)

Minion 2.5 front and rear,29" heavy duty Ti bar,Ti post, Jones space frame and unicrown
fork.Not light but smooth!


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## wrecognize (Dec 30, 2013)

I have a Steel Misfit Dissent rigid with Velocity Blunts. Knard in the front and Geax Saguaro in the rear. Really liking the setup so far. Adds just enough cush. Adds a decent amount of weight but worth it, still 23lbs or so..


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I tried a Krampus with full 29+, and didn't really care for it: too stiff, heavy, and long. This, though, worked pretty well:










The carbon frame is light but still smooth and responsive, and the Knard combined with the 2.4" Mission Vee in back (on Velocity 35mm rims) feel about as cushy as the full on 29+.

The Oury grips, though, were complete garbage.


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## wrecognize (Dec 30, 2013)

Seat boy, curious what conditions your normally riding in with the Mission Vee's and your opinion on them? I had them on my fat bike and liked them on the dry singletrack but anything else was a disaster. Thanks.


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## wrecognize (Dec 30, 2013)

Also sweet looking ride, really like that frame.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

seat_boy said:


> I tried a Krampus with full 29+, and didn't really care for it: too stiff, heavy, and long. This, though, worked pretty well:
> 
> The carbon frame is light but still smooth and responsive, and the Knard combined with the 2.4" Mission Vee in back (on Velocity 35mm rims) feel about as cushy as the full on 29+.


Writing off 29+ after riding a Krampus is like writing off 29ers after riding a Surly Karate Monkey. There are other options that are more comfy, lighter, and shorter. Not going to be as light as the carbon Sette, but much better than a Krampus. Keep an open mind!

And no, a 2.4" Mission and a 35mm rim is not as cushy as a full 29+, not even close!

Can't comment on the Oury grips, never tried them. I am about to try some ESI Extra Chunky, which get a lot of praise here as well.

The Sette does look like a nice ride though! How is the clearance in the back with the 2.4 tire and 35mm rim?


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## wrecognize (Dec 30, 2013)

Give Odi Rogues a try, have them on a few of my bikes. Excellent grip.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

Pretty much the same opinion--they do OK on dry hardpack, but slip pretty easy when it gets damp. Every now and then I get the rear to kick out under cornering load, and that feels pretty cool! As a positive, though, the rear will always break loose before the front, which is a good thing.

The Sette has pretty impressive clearance. Lots of room around my Mission Vee, I may try a 2.4 Ardent next.

I certainly would like a full 29+ frame with the attributes of the Razzo (light, cheap, smooth, handles well), but I won't find that in my price range. This works well enough for now.



wrecognize said:


> Seat boy, curious what conditions your normally riding in with the Mission Vee's and your opinion on them? I had them on my fat bike and liked them on the dry singletrack but anything else was a disaster. Thanks.


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## SVO (May 25, 2005)

bikeny said:


> Writing off 29+ after riding a Krampus is like writing off 29ers after riding a Surly Karate Monkey. There are other options that are more comfy, lighter, and shorter. Not going to be as light as the carbon Sette, but much better than a Krampus. Keep an open mind!
> 
> And no, a 2.4" Mission and a 35mm rim is not as cushy as a full 29+, not even close!
> 
> ...


Yeah, but there are few 29+ options today- what, 2 tires and 4-5 frames? Limit that to sub $1k frames and I'm not sure drawing that conclusion is totally unreasonable.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

SVO said:


> Yeah, but there are few 29+ options today- what, 2 tires and 4-5 frames? Limit that to sub $1k frames and I'm not sure drawing that conclusion is totally unreasonable.


I'm just saying that all 29+ bikes will not ride the same as the Krampus. But you're right, not a lot of options out there yet. As for frames, this might work for you:

Aluminum 29+ Frame In Testing - Carver Bikes

Not out yet, but I believe the price will be around $500, and the handling should be more to you're liking.

Edit: Projected price is $500 according to FB


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

[QUOTE

The Oury grips, though, were complete garbage.[/QUOTE]

You must be the only person alive that's ever hated Oury grips - almost calls into all your other recommendations.


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## SVO (May 25, 2005)

The Carver is very interesting- I like their products generally. Conventional threaded BB/crank. With a 1X I guess it works barely, like Krampus. For SS use the weight at the tire/rim is critical. Still thinking things will migrate over the next couple years towards 35-50mm carbon rims and light, 2.5-2.8 tires for SS, 29x3.0 or 27.5x3.5-ish will be geared towards geared.


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## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

I call 'em like I see 'em.

They wouldn't stick to the bar, even with hairspray--which I've never had to resort to in 20 years of frequently changing grips and bars.



SS Hack said:


> The Oury grips, though, were complete garbage.
> 
> You must be the only person alive that's ever hated Oury grips - almost calls into all your other recommendations.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

seat_boy said:


> I call 'em like I see 'em.
> 
> They wouldn't stick to the bar, even with hairspray--which I've never had to resort to in 20 years of frequently changing grips and bars.


User error or weird bars perhaps. These are used on bikes, motos, snowmobiles and everything in between without issue. I don't use anything and they never come off.


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## Crave SL (Apr 12, 2016)

Good old thread. Im thinking 27x2.6/2.8 or 29x2.6 on the front.


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

Crave SL said:


> Good old thread. Im thinking 27x2.6/2.8 or 29x2.6 on the front.


If you are on a Crave SL just go with a 29x3.0 I'm running a Chupacabra on mine.


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## mr_chrome (Jan 17, 2005)

2.4" on both my rigid SS 29er and my FSR - running on a set of I-9 wheelsets........better grip, more comfortable, etc....but especially the 29er......


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

seat_boy said:


> I call 'em like I see 'em.
> 
> They wouldn't stick to the bar, even with hairspray--which I've never had to resort to in 20 years of frequently changing grips and bars.


I only have 4 years of experience changing grips but I also hate Oury, can't get them to stick to my bars. They always turn during rides. The price reflects the quality... except ESI grips cost the same and work way better.

Won't use Oury anymore.


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## joshhan (Apr 1, 2011)

Running a 29x3.0 on my Chinese CF.

It does slow the steering down a bit but it's still a blast!

This was taken at Raystown Lake. 20+ miles of FUN FUN FUN.


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## Raybum (Apr 16, 2009)

I seem to ride this 9 out of every 10 rides...just so much fun.


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## fixgeardan (Aug 20, 2004)

Hey Ray what width rims are those?


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## coke (Jun 7, 2008)

Crave SL said:


> Good old thread. Im thinking 27x2.6/2.8 or 29x2.6 on the front.


That's my plan. Waiting on my Nobby Nic 29x2.6 tires to be delivered. On my race bike, I plan on running this on the front with a 2.35 on the rear. On my trail bike, I'm going to try these front & rear.


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## Raybum (Apr 16, 2009)

Both are Nextie Carbon rims...front is 30mm internal, rear is 22mm internal.


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## fixgeardan (Aug 20, 2004)

The big tire is good on the 30mm rim? I like big tires just not the super fat rims.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

The industry and MTBR keyboard-shredders will say that a 3.0 tire can't work on anything less than a 50mm rim, but I personally ride with a bunch of dudes on 3.0 tires on rigid singlespeeds. I don't think any of them have wheels wider than i30 or the LB external 38s. I'm one of 3 SS'ers that have front suspension and non-plus front wheels, which actually might change after xmas when I can find a deal on a rigid fork. 

TL;DR: i30s are probably just fine for the average dude on a rigid bike wanting 3.0 tires. Again, I'm not an expert just a guy who rides with a lot of guys and gals on rigid bikes. None of them have ever. (To my knowledge) ever suffered ill-effects from this combo.


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## socal_jack (Dec 30, 2008)

ARandomBiker said:


> The industry and MTBR keyboard-shredders will say that a 3.0 tire can't work on anything less than a 50mm rim, but I personally ride with a bunch of dudes on 3.0 tires on rigid singlespeeds. I don't think any of them have wheels wider than i30 or the LB external 38s. I'm one of 3 SS'ers that have front suspension and non-plus front wheels, which actually might change after xmas when I can find a deal on a rigid fork.
> 
> TL;DR: i30s are probably just fine for the average dude on a rigid bike wanting 3.0 tires. Again, I'm not an expert just a guy who rides with a lot of guys and gals on rigid bikes. None of them have ever. (To my knowledge) ever suffered ill-effects from this combo.


That and both DWs and Minions I've used come with a recommendation from the manufacturer of 40mm inner width minimum. I think that gets more important as rider weight and aggressive riding style goes up. As always YMMV.


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## fixgeardan (Aug 20, 2004)

The pisser is I just had a new wheel built with an Arch mk3 so 26.5 inside. Im running a Minion 2.5 witch is great but I would like to try something bigger but really don't want to build another wheel. There lies my delema. Always something


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

Nah, I can see why they'd say 40mm inner, 40-50mm is probably optimal. I don't argue that 30 is the far end of narrow and might not work for everyone.

my post was only meant to offer examples that people are riding 3.0s on i30s and it works; but as you pointed out, we're not getting big air or riding super aggressively, I mean these are rigid single speeds, after all. I don't know if any of them are far north of the 200# mark, either, so that's a consideration too.

I chose 30's because based on others' advice, it works "ok" for 3.0, but also allows for 2.25's as well. In fact, the only tires I've found that i wouldn't ride are some weight-weenie XC racer 2.2 RaceKings. I had an old one, I mounted it; it looked like a car tire it was so square. (I exaggerate, but it never left the garage anyway.)

2.3 to 3.0 seems to be a good range for a typical guy riding typical trails on a typical rigid.


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## socal_jack (Dec 30, 2008)

I'm north of 220# easily suited up so even on i45s especially on the Knards that came on my ROS9+ they squirmed as bad as 2.4-2.5 tires(WTB dissents, Gomas) on my Halo Freedom i20s. On the DWs and DHFs I can go sub 15 psi but don't push it much lower really as there's a real breakover point. I do like to go fast and catch some occasional air. Current setup.


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## azjonboy (Dec 21, 2006)

I'm running a 29x3.0 Chupacabra on the Flow MK3 which is 29 internal 32 external. It's on the front of a rigid 29er. Love the combo way better than the 29x3.0 Knard on a P35.


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## hardmtnbiker (Feb 22, 2005)

*Rigid Seven SS w/ 29+ up front*

Here is my fully rigid Seven with ENVE fork set to forward tab and i40 WTB Scraper and 3.0 Surly Dirt wizard tires.
I've rode it like this and with an i35 rim and 2.5 tires too. True the 29+ does take more abuse and makes landing more forgiving. But you do feel the weight, and it needs to be muscled around tight switch backs. I've been on fully rigid SS bikes for about 10 years and actually my first mtn-bike was a rigid geared bike. 
For me it's up to your priorities if you choose a 29+ you'll really enjoy the cushioning and extra traction on loose turns and sandy sections. But if your hitting a lot of tight switchbacks you may just want keep an i30-35 rim with a HD or DHF up front. I use both those tires too


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## mdilthey (Dec 15, 2014)

hardmtnbiker said:


> Here is my fully rigid Seven with ENVE fork set to forward tab and i40 WTB Scraper and 3.0 Surly Dirt wizard tires.


Gonna have to ask my GF to add this sentence to her dirty talk repertoire...


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## hardmtnbiker (Feb 22, 2005)

Lol


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