# Helmet Persausion help!



## Arch Itech (Sep 29, 2010)

I've been introducing my friend to mountain biking, and he never wears a helmet :nono:. I've told him ( as well as other riders) to get a helmet. How should I persuade him to get one?


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

Arch Itech said:


> I've been introducing my friend to mountain biking, and he never wears a helmet :nono:. I've told him ( as well as other riders) to get a helmet. How should I persuade him to get one?


Stop riding w/him. Don't just say "pretty please" and then ride with him anyway. Put your foot down. Either he wears a helmet, or he rides without you.


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## terrasmak (Jun 14, 2011)

Smak him in the head with a rock, then ask him i would have rather been wearing a helmet. 

Does he have kids? Does he want to watch them grow up?


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## BertoManfred (Jul 5, 2011)

Show him pictures of results of not wearing helmet


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## Eckstream1 (Jul 27, 2011)

I have to play the Devils Advocate here...

It's his mellon... Let him split it open if he wants to!


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## dundundata (May 15, 2009)

He doesn't have to wear one if he doesn't want but you also don't have to ride with him either. I don't feel like being the one to explain to the cops and the person's family just how the events unfolded that led to someone's brains being scattered about.

I just hit my head the other day, first real hit I ever took to the head, cracked my helmet and everything. If I hadn't been wearing that helmet I doubt I would be typing this right now.


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## CarolinaLL6 (Apr 12, 2010)

I've been lucky so far, everyone I've ridden with has worn a helmet. The only one who gave me any inkling of resistance was a doctor and she only resisted until I showed her how silly I looked with it on. Once we were on the trail she saw everyone else wearing one, too and didn't have another thought about it.


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## Dan_AZ (Mar 24, 2007)

I agree. Tell him you feel so strongly about it you won't ride with him if he doesn't wear protection! ;-)


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## Shalom (Nov 7, 2008)

At the end of the day, it is his choice.

It is also your choice as to whether you ride with him or not. If it bothers you that much, don't ride with him unless he wears a helmet.


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## FNG RIDER (Apr 2, 2011)

I crashed head first into a rock on a drop in. beginners inexperience. Medvac,ER to ICU with concussion, compression fracture of C1 T2 and T3, 5 days in ICU, 12weeks with a neck brace. The doctors said I was lucky, could have easily been fatal, or a quad.

A helmet is a must, No helmet no ride. This is the basic requirement for all mountain bike rides.
Your friend may chose not to wear a helmet and you can chose not to ride with him.

If you invite him on a ride, he crushes his skull, then you have morally partial blame. legally partial liability that one migh cost you.


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Arch Itech said:


> I've been introducing my friend to mountain biking, and he never wears a helmet :nono:. I've told him ( as well as other riders) to get a helmet. How should I persuade him to get one?


Tell him if he suffers a head injury on a ride, you will not carry him out.

Then only ride trails with low hanging branches that can harmlessly be deflected with a helmet.


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## Dresdenlock (Aug 10, 2009)

google "Lost Thoughts" and there is an issue of Dirt Rag that is online that talks about that article...it will make you think twice about not wearing a helmet.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

Dresdenlock said:


> google "Lost Thoughts" and there is an issue of Dirt Rag that is online that talks about that article...it will make you think twice about not wearing a helmet.


Looks like this is where to begin:

KAKO | LOST THOUGHTS - LIFE AFTER TRAUMATIC BRAIN INJURY FOR DIRT RAG MAGAZINE « Levy Creative Management

Oops! Here's a better link: Dirt Rag Magazine


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## mojojojoaf (Sep 9, 2008)

Buy him a helmet as a gift. If it means that much to you (which it should) show him how much you are concerned.


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## mgv101 (Sep 6, 2010)

I would simply show my friend my helmets as I land on my head far too often.

Luckily most of such hits are just slight bumps which barely scratches the surface the helmet so it could be reused but I am pretty sure I would still be badly hurt if it was my head hitting that rock.


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## Daemon[CRO] (Jul 14, 2010)




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## mojojojoaf (Sep 9, 2008)

^^Yes this.


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## Daemon[CRO] (Jul 14, 2010)

My old helmet is on the display in the LBS. It saved my life. If I get the time, I will get some photos of it.


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## Andy Pancroft (Aug 3, 2011)

The "It's my head" defense really kinda makes me mad!! I mean, it doesn't stop with you!!! Noob to the mtb world but, been a roadie for many years. I have, a few times happened upon a bicycle accident where the rider wasn't wearing a helmet. I shouldn't have to see that kind of carnage!! If I'm on the trail, I shouldn't have to worry about coming upon an accident where some d-bag has crashed and made head to tree/trail contact with no helmet. If you don't believe your life is worth the cost of a helmet, think of those of us who have to clean up behind you!!

And, that in mind, those that buy a $20 helmet...do you have a $20 head??


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## Andy Pancroft (Aug 3, 2011)

mgv101 said:


> I would simply show my friend my helmets as I land on my head far too often.
> 
> Luckily most of such hits are just slight bumps which barely scratches the surface the helmet so it could be reused but I am pretty sure I would still be badly hurt if it was my head hitting that rock.


I was always of the thinking that, if the helmet hit the ground, it's done!!?? At least, that's what motorcycle helmet manufacturers say and, that's kinda what I've always thought about bike helmets as well!!


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## dundundata (May 15, 2009)

My $35 helmet saved my ass. Giro Transfer, not some no-name brand from Martville. I don't believe the more expensive ones mean better protection, unless you have some facts to backup your statement?


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## RabEd Ewok (Jul 15, 2011)

The more expensive ones, I believe for the most part have a bit more protection, as in a little thicker foam. But on the same side, the more expensive ones are also lighter so go figure. I say wearing a helmet whether it be a $20 one or a $150 dollar one. No matter what that $20 one is definitely better and more protection than nothing at all on your dome.

I have learned from snowboarding that a helmet is a must if what I am doing involves something that a helmet may be used for. Did not want to get one, or wear one. then I was finally convinced, so I got a Orange Helmet from Ebay, made by RED for liek $25, and that included shipping. Needless to say the first time I wore it up there, I smacked my head on a rail. Left a nice mark on the helmet. I was sold from that point on.

Do I wear my helmet all the time when I am on my bike, no. If I am just riding a round the neighborhood a few times. (Whole neighborhood is 2 miles around total) Then I probably am not wearing it. Should I, yes I most definitely should. I just figure around the neighborhood, where we have about 20 serious speed bumps, I think I will be OK. Yes something could potentially happen, so I should definitely wear it.


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## STT GUY (May 19, 2009)

A picture is worth a thousand words.....


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## FNG RIDER (Apr 2, 2011)

Yep those lower price point helmets give you the same protection as the high end helmets, as long as they meet the US CSPS crash standards. I have always used bicycle helmets from the OG Bell helmets to the modern day Giro Ionos.

What is the difference other than the price? Probably, the style, construction, design and weight. I need a helmet that is light and flows air, the higher end models do that, They have more vent holes, and have enterior channels that allow the air to flow throught the helmet. they are lighter, and they have a stylish appearance. All of which I desire. The large vent holes will not give you the protection of the lower models, but when I'm on an extended climb my head cooks inside the lower floweing models, also the lighter weight, a mere few grams, actually help.

The higher end helmet helmet have a nicer fit an finish, some give you better coverage. I have one of each, full face coverage helmet, all mountain helmet, cross country and road helmets. I usually wear cross country helmet, it is lighter and flows air. 

I only wear Giro, they fit me the best and give me the best coverage. I like the Giro Athlon for mt. biking and the Giro Ionos and Atmos for road. 

The Fox Flux saved my life. I endowed on a downhill, flattened the top, cracked the interior foam, the visor and spoiler broke away. Still had almost catostrophic injuries but Iwouild have received much greater injuries w/o it. As soon as I healed up I went out and bought another Flux. This one also fit me well and gives great coverage, I use it on cooler days.

Ive been down more than once and know the value of a helmet.

How much is your head worth?


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## Daemon[CRO] (Jul 14, 2010)

I should really go to LBS and take few photos of my helmet.

But anyways, I crashed Specialized SWorks MTB helmet. Yes it was expensive. Yes, my head is intact.

What is good on expensive helmets is that they have some sort of binding threads (kevlar in my case) going through the foamy structure of the helm. When you crash, these hold pieces of helmet together stopping it from "chunking" away as you hit. You can see in the case of STT GUY and his black Uvex helm that it started ripping apart. One more blow to the side and huge chunk would fly of. This means that if your fall continues (you tumble a few times) that the third blow would hit your head as the helm would disintegrate by then.


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## Andy Pancroft (Aug 3, 2011)

RabEd Ewok said:


> The more expensive ones, I believe for the most part have a bit more protection, as in a little thicker foam. But on the same side, the more expensive ones are also lighter so go figure. I say wearing a helmet whether it be a $20 one or a $150 dollar one. No matter what that $20 one is definitely better and more protection than nothing at all on your dome.
> 
> I have learned from snowboarding that a helmet is a must if what I am doing involves something that a helmet may be used for. Did not want to get one, or wear one. then I was finally convinced, so I got a Orange Helmet from Ebay, made by RED for liek $25, and that included shipping. Needless to say the first time I wore it up there, I smacked my head on a rail. Left a nice mark on the helmet. I was sold from that point on.
> 
> Do I wear my helmet all the time when I am on my bike, no. If I am just riding a round the neighborhood a few times. (Whole neighborhood is 2 miles around total) Then I probably am not wearing it. Should I, yes I most definitely should. I just figure around the neighborhood, where we have about 20 serious speed bumps, I think I will be OK. Yes something could potentially happen, so I should definitely wear it.


I guess I just figured the more expensive ones may have performed a little more R&D??? Not that that accounts for everything, just sayin'!!


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

yeah, my policy for mtb rides is that they wear a helmet or I don't ride with them.

No persuasion. No nagging.

Just, "I only ride with people who wear helmets."

It's a real problem for me locally. My local trails are on university property, so a lot of people who ride there are college students on beaters. Most college students never wear a helmet under any circumstances, so when I advertise that I want to have a group ride, I need to specifically state my personal rule about riding with people with helmets only. The university trails have a lot of jumps, a good number of drops, and a good chance of encountering low branches (I've clobbered a few out there). 

Thankfully when the university rents out a mountain bike, they make the rider take a helmet.


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## Andy Pancroft (Aug 3, 2011)

'Nuff said!!! LOL


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## Hotrodvw (Aug 23, 2006)

I crashed on Sunday. If you look closely, you can see the helmet imprint via road roash on my left forehead area. Had I not been wearing a lid, well....


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## 53119 (Nov 7, 2008)

i try not to step into someone else's gene pool. i just ride around it if i need to.


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## Arch Itech (Sep 29, 2010)

Thanks everyone! Ive already gotten one of my other friends to get a helmet. The guy Im trying to convince is an idiot and still hasn't gottend one...


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## Daemon[CRO] (Jul 14, 2010)

OK, went to the LBS where they showcase my helmet as THE reason to buy helmet and took some photos.

This is me after the fall, you can see helmet imprint on my forehead and lots of bruising.










This is the helmet. You can see the cracks, they are everywhere as the helmet broke diagonally from left site to the back-right. Almost every bridge snapped and absorbed the energy. What more you can see is how the back side is crunched. My neck wanted to twist backwards, but the helmet prevented it.

I WOULD NOT BE ALIVE IF I DID NOT WEAR IT (or I would be an ugly vegetable screwing up lives of my parents, girlfrind and friends around me).





































Wear a helmet. Seriously.


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## Fix the Spade (Aug 4, 2008)

Managed this in 2007 
My thick skull VS the upslope of a double.









I can't find any of the other pictures, but notice that there is a freaking great hole in the helmet where the foam just sort of shredded.

I remember hitting the ground, getting up and yelling _What the **** was that??!_, then I was in hospital.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

Arch Itech said:


> Thanks everyone! Ive already gotten one of my other friends to get a helmet. The guy Im trying to convince is an idiot and still hasn't gottend one...


Don't ride with him. That's really all you can do. At least then you won't be part of the picture if he crashes and and it goes bad for him.


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## JSumner13 (Apr 26, 2006)

On a bike path right up the street from my house a man fell off his bike and died......he'd be alive today if he was wearing a helmet. Tell your buddy that he's an idiot.

Man dies after fall from bicycle in Warwick - Projo 7 to 7 News Blog | Rhode Island news | The Providence Journal


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## adroit 96' (Sep 16, 2011)

Went on a group ride back in 94' and we all insisted that a co-worker wear a helmet for our trip since we noticed he never wore one riding to work and wouldn't ya know it he wrecked his bike riding to meet us and split his helmet on a curb....he NEVER went without a helmet again! And btw he was right behind me two years later and witnessed when I screwed the pooch on a jump and split my helmet 10 miles from the trail head


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

shiggy said:


> Tell him if he suffers a head injury on a ride, you will not carry him out.


that is so lame shig 
No humanity over a fukkin helmet?

"yeah, just die there, shoulda worn a helmet - I'm outta here - gotta catch some gnar before the sun fade - on my SOOPER WICKED DROP BARS!!! :thumbsup:"


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## hedgeboar (Jun 28, 2011)

It is mentioned above that more expensice helmets offer more protection than cheaper ones. In fact, the opposite is generally true. The following is based on my experience working in the crash helmet test industry:

The more expensive helmets generally sacrifice protection for better ventilation and weight. They still meet the appropriate standard for whatever country they are sold in, but often only just. Their energy absorption properties are often only just adequate. This means their manufacturing process needs to be more consistent, so that the worst example of a helmet from the process can pass the test.

Cheap helmets need to be cheap to manufacture, obviously. It is much cheaper to slacken the consistency requirements for the manufacturing process, and design a helmet that far exceeds the protection required by the standard. Therefore, the average cheap helmet actually offers better protection than the average expensive helmet.

The above only applies comparing apples to apples -- a full face DH helmet will obviously offer more protection than a cheap, standard helmet.

The above also implies another important factor to consider -- the amount of damage required to render an expensive helmet inadequate is lesser than that required to damage a cheap helmet. Of course, you should always replace a helmet after a crash, but a cheap one will likely handle being knocked around a little better.

For the record, I don't wear cheap helmets. Expensive helmets meet safety standards, and offer much better ventilation and comfort. I just wanted to point out that if money is an issue, a cheap helmet is perfectly adequate to protect your head.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

@hedgeboar, thanks for a very interesting and educational post.


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