# Going Carbon is worth it for big guys .



## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

I currently ride a Diamondback Mason Trail plus bike which has served me well during my weight loss journey (I lost 123 pounds total) I am looking at the Ibis DV9 as an Award once I get to my goal weight. I currently weigh 320 but my goal weight is 250-260. What I want to know is do you guys think it is worth it for big guys to go carbon do you notice the difference in riding. People scream about the weight difference between carbon and Aluminum. But will I notice the difference being a bigger guy. Thank you.

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## scottzg (Sep 27, 2006)

The difference between carbon and alu is minute compared to 

-shock tune
-frame geometry
-frame design wrt stiffness
-leverage ratio

The material does not determine the feel of the frame. In general carbon frames are often stiffer, which is nice, but it's not a rule that they're stiffer or that the stiffness is nice.


At 320lbs shocks are going to be varying degrees of garbage. A custom tuned shock for something approaching your goal weight is going to be DRAMATICALLY more influential than a carbon frame.


Certainly at 250lbs the weight of the bike is 98% meaningless. As a percentage of your body weight 10lbs of bike is nothing. Take advantage of that fact and enjoy!



IMO anyone over 250lbs is going to be mostly hampered by a production FS bike and a well-developed hardtail will be faster, more fun, and more reliable 80% of the time. I don't mean to evangelize, but when i was 250lbs the FS was underperforming/broken more than it was awesome.


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## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

scottzg said:


> The difference between carbon and alu is minute compared to
> 
> -shock tune
> -frame geometry
> ...


Thank you, that one of the reason I was thinking about sticking to a hardtail. Plus I like that it is easier to fix then a hardtail. FS look cool but alit more maintenance.

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## tfinator (Apr 30, 2009)

I have been sufficiently out-ridden by many sizes of people on many different frame materials. As far as performance goes, skill and style makes much more difference in performance. I'll say also that the fore-aft balance of a bike is also more noticeable to me than the overall weight.

Ibis makes bomber bikes, which should be your primary concern. Input on bikes from Clyde's such as yourself both in person and online will matter more than willing about frame materials.

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## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

Ibis makes bomber bikes, which should be your primary concern. Input on bikes from Clyde's such as yourself both in person and online will matter more than willing about frame materials.

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I definitely want a bike that last long that is my overall main concern with out a question.

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## sturge (Feb 22, 2009)

Congrats on the weight loss...that's impressive! I'm 220ish (6'4") and have had XL framed FS bikes since late 90's. Being a big guy that rides hard means sh*t breaks more often. Broken a few frames over the years so my main focus is on a proven, reliable design. Some designs will take more abuse than others but that usually means they are hefty bikes. The difference in weight between an alu frame and a carbon frame is typically less than a pound so I pass on the added cost of carbon. 

Some day I may consider a reasonably priced carbon wheel set but it would have to be a burlier 32 spoke model that is 'clyde-worthy'.


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## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

sturge said:


> Congrats on the weight loss...that's impressive! I'm 220ish (6'4") and have had XL framed FS bikes since late 90's. Being a big guy that rides hard means sh*t breaks more often. Broken a few frames over the years so my main focus is on a proven, reliable design. Some designs will take more abuse than others but that usually means they are hefty bikes. The difference in weight between an alu frame and a carbon frame is typically less than a pound so I pass on the added cost of carbon.
> 
> Some day I may consider a reasonably priced carbon wheel set but it would have to be a burlier 32 spoke model that is 'clyde-worthy'.


Thank you, that's what I am looking at hardtails. Figure they last much longer due to it simplicity. The Ibis Dv9 is a good price range for a carbon. Decent enough price that I am thinking about pulling the trigger on and start saving.

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## HAMP (Apr 3, 2012)

HELL YES IT'S WORTH IT!!!

My first MTB, the trek Marlin in my sig is aluminum. 2nd bike trek superfly and its hard tail carbon.

I was 320lbs riding both bikes. The difference from each bike was like day and night on the trail. It isn't fair giving you a comparison between the 2, because the frames are only part of the difference.

I couldn't give you an opinion of any bike if only the frame material was the difference.

I love my ole Marlin for any non trails. I mainly use it for weight loss and getting stronger for my trail rides on the superfly. I lost 85lbs, and I love the carbon when riding trails.

At 320lbs I was tired and about dead only riding 25% of a local trail(on the Marlin)
Now, I will do 1 1/2 or 2 full laps of that same trail, and go back the next day. There was no riding a trail 2 days In a row before... lol

So, if you can afford it, then get it. Especially after losing that much.


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## jonshonda (Apr 21, 2011)

I don't know if there are many carbon bikes that are designed to accommodate a rider of your size. The designer is always targeting 130-180lb riders, with consideration of a certain percentage on either side of that bell curve. 

With that being said, I would stick with aluminum or steel, and don't be afraid to consult with a custom bike builder. Their costs might be a little more, but they can design a bike that works for you.


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## Dirt Road (Feb 6, 2016)

Dude, loosing that much weight, get whatever bike you want! You will most likely be fine on that Ibis. Sweet bike. At 270 I’m on my xc hardtail more than my carbon fully.


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## Guy.Ford (Oct 28, 2009)

...


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## Uwibami (Apr 26, 2017)

Agreed, not all are equal. at 255 down from 280, I have been riding a 2018 Hightower plus bike for about a year. no issues to speak of, great bike. I'm no pro, hot shots around here say I'm an upper intermediate rider and at 55 years old, I'm happy with that. but, I love carbon bikes ( carbon anything really, started with my days on an R1.
matter of fact just bought a new carbon process 153 29. so, to wrap up. as long as it's a quality bike, you should have no trouble with Carbon


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## johnD (Mar 31, 2010)

Guy.Ford said:


> I disagree with peeps saying bigger dudes will be hampered by FS bikes. FWIW, not all FS bikes are created equal. There are quite a few FS bikes that do very well with bigger guys. Look for bikes with lower leverage ratios and you'll be fine. I'm 280lbs and ride the hell out of my FS, doesn't even flinch.
> 
> Having just bought my first FS Carbon bike, I don't personally get the hype of carbon. Then again I didn't buy my bike because it was carbon. Fact is had it been alu I would've probably been happier, but the specs and price made it a winner. My next bike will def be alu. Carbon requires too much pampering, gotta apply frame tape everywhere, have to come up with funky ways to keep your frame from chipping from rocks, etc. Alu bikes, you just ride them.


This.


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## hairymuffin (Nov 12, 2018)

I don’t think it’s worth it, it’s not like us big dudes are catching big air to crack a frame but, I think aluminum is a lot beefier. At 275 or heavier, having a lite bike is not a concern for me. Although my aluminum Niner is at 27lbs


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## cobi (Apr 29, 2008)

I'm in this boat right now and getting ready to make a decision as I just found my current frame has continued cracking on a repair (seat post dropper cable routing hole) 

Had primarily been looking at SB130 (GX) & Stumpjumper (Expert) as that is what my preferred shop has to offer, and I am a believer in supporting local businesses (which I will still do as they will service it and I will buy parts, clothes, etc from them). Can also get a sweet deal ($900 discount...) on a Rip 9 RDO 3-star build. 

But, I keep going back to a GG Trail Pistol (or Smash) and thinking that spending the "frame" savings to upgrade the rear shock, wheels, brakes etc instead makes a lot more sense (given my weight). I just think at 265 carbon isn't maybe where I should be putting my $$ (as much as I want to support my shop).

I mean for the same price.......... I can get DT1501 wheels w/ 240 hubs, instead of DT1900 on the SB or Traverse carbon w/ proprietary hubs on the SJ
Factory DPX2 instead of RT3, RC3 or regular performance DPX2
Guide RSC vs Guide R
For 5,200 on the SB130 GX you don't even get carbon bars!
I can even add in a MRP AMG guide/guard, spare hanger and frame storage option and stay below my local shop price (even after shipping).

I have broken 2 previous aluminum Salsa bikes (Spearfish and Horsethief)......., but a lot of people had the same failure as me (chainstays) not just clydes. I saw guys weighing 175 break them as well.


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## hairymuffin (Nov 12, 2018)

On another note, I have both a hardtail and a FS. My hardtail is more efficient, my logic is, I have to pump up my rear shock so hard to get the right sag, that it’s basicslly now a hard tail because it’s so stiff. My HT climbs better, 2 totally different bikes


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## askibum02 (Jul 7, 2005)

There is nothing that says a Clyde can't ride carbon. At 265 geared I was riding a 2017 Bro son CC. Granted I had to tune the shock and replace the Pike with a Fox36, but was all in all a great bike.

Here's a video





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## greenbastard (Jan 11, 2016)

Congrats on the weight loss. 
I'm 6'4" 280lb. I was once 380lbs. Intermittent Fasting was a huge help and after adjustment of 2-3 weeks felt way better (only ate between 5pm-10pm daily for about 8 months). 

I was on a Diamondback Mason 2 all summer/fall. I just finished building a Banshee Prime with DVO Topaz shock. I'd highly recommend it for a bigger rider. It is an aluminum frame. Very well built and burly. I really don't think dropping 2 lbs of bike weight is a noticeable thing for really big guys. You probably take Dumps that weigh more than that. And I got my frame new for 1/3 of a Santa Cruz/Ibis/Yeti carbon frame. Of course the other MTB men in your area might not get a boner from your bike since it is carbon. I prefer to get 'wood' from riding, not looking at other peoples overpriced bikes on the back of their new Toyota Tacoma. 
I'd put your extra money saved from buying Aluminum frame into burlier parts, or specific parts that make sense for big guys. No more Loosening of the crank arms like on my Race Face, etc). 203mm Icetech rotors front and Rear, with XT brakes. I've cooked Sram Guides and normal 203mm rotors before on some fast technical downhill. 

I'm using my DB Mason 2 wheels currently but plan to buy a built set of Onyx hubbed wheels once i get my bonus check next week at work.

The KS-Link suspension really is great pedal platform. I don't feel any pedal bob with the current shock settings (which are highly tuneable).

My last FS bike was back in like 2004. A Giant NRS2. I really did not like that bike and there was just so much pedal bob even at max air pressure in the shock ( I was about 240lbs at that time)


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## onewheelwunder (Nov 8, 2010)

Something to keep in mind when we bigger, heavier, stronger? people stand up and mash pedals frames flex, wheels flex, and parts shriek from the pain being inflicted upon them. I recommend Carbon C model frames from Santa Cruz. I also recommend their reserve 28 spoke rims, increased the stiffness on my tallboy by a huge amount. Keep and eye on stuff and keep your wheels tensioned and you'll be good. Nothing wrong with Aluminum, but I feel like burly carbon bikes are some of the only material able to deal with our mass.

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## derek1387 (Oct 13, 2008)

Definitely notice a difference in my carbon bike (SB5.5) from my aluminum bike. Granted they are two different genres of bike.

I am down from 430lbs to 235 over the course of about 3 years. Still a clyde technically, but certainly dont feel like it anymore. 

I feel im at that weight where it could go either way on saving weight on the bike/rotating weight will help just as much as my body. So...carbon when i can!


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## HAMP (Apr 3, 2012)

derek1387 said:


> I am down from 430lbs to 235


I'm sorry, but the only thing I got from what you typed was that.... lol

Wow, Fantastic!!!! 
Great Job


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## bingemtbr (Apr 1, 2004)

IMO, carbon frames for clydes are not desirable. My 120lb wife has a Tallboy. Its frame has failed twice. Both times without warning nor explanation. 

At least with aluminum. most times you get creaking and cracking before the frame fails. Also, an aluminum frame can be repaired.


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## rynomx785 (Jul 16, 2018)

hairymuffin said:


> On another note, I have both a hardtail and a FS. My hardtail is more efficient, my logic is, I have to pump up my rear shock so hard to get the right sag, that it's basicslly now a hard tail because it's so stiff. My HT climbs better, 2 totally different bikes


You pump up the shock to correct pressure for your weight making the spring rate correct for you. That doesn't make it overly stiff.... It makes it right and you will still the same gains from rear suspension that anyone else would. It will only be overly stiff for someone that is lighter than you.


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## Len Baird (Aug 1, 2017)

You can get pretty bombproof carbon wheels these days and they are stiffer as well as being lighter, so even if a little weight isn't a big deal, it definitely doesn't hurt and there's other advantages too.


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## Sasquatch1413 (Nov 6, 2008)

Being a 330 lb clyde who's broken a lot of carbon, NO. The weight savings in a frame isn't worth it. Even carbon rims don't have enough weight savings when you get stout carbon rims. For a weekend warrior, carbon provides nothing but an expensive bill when you have to replace it.


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## Battery (May 7, 2016)

If you get yourself down to 250-260, you can ride Trek carbon bikes without stressing about weight. Their carbon frames are designed for riders up to 300 pounds in full gear. That's for road and mountain bikes. My Trek Emonda is a carbon road bike and I haven't had any issues on it. I have over 500 miles on that bike so far.


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## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

Battery said:


> If you get yourself down to 250-260, you can ride Trek carbon bikes without stressing about weight. Their carbon frames are designed for riders up to 300 pounds in full gear. That's for road and mountain bikes. My Trek Emonda is a carbon road bike and I haven't had any issues on it. I have over 500 miles on that bike so far.


250-260 is my goal weight


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## Shamis (Apr 12, 2015)

bingemtbr said:


> IMO, carbon frames for clydes are not desirable. My 120lb wife has a Tallboy. Its frame has failed twice. Both times without warning nor explanation.
> 
> At least with aluminum. most times you get creaking and cracking before the frame fails. Also, an aluminum frame can be repaired.


Um, must be doing something wrong.  I'm 240ish and have a few Carbon bikes and never a failed frame other than currently a flex yet wheel caused tire to cut a hole in the chainstay on my brand new gravel bike. Frame is being warrantied and I'm moving on to a stronger wheel set.

Carbon can most definitely be repaired and your more likely to find someone doing Carbon frame repair than aluminum. I have a local guy (spyder composites) who does Carbon frame repairs typically for $200 including X-ray

Like a dumbass I clamped my top tube in a workstand and cracked a thin portion of the frame. He repaired it and I had the frame back in a week. Can't even see where he repaired it. That was almost 2 years ago and no issues.


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## Tristan Wolf (Oct 21, 2019)

I am not particularly big (193cm, 86kg), shoe size 46. But I do have a funny problem.

I ride XC HT bikes. And the best ones, besides being made of carbon, also have super-short chainstays (mine are 425mm on 29” frame). I love the handling, but here is the issue: I rub my rear mech with the heel of my shoe. I cannot simply use smaller cranks than 175mm (I wish I had 177.5mm), I cannot have smaller feet, or move rear mech, and moving cleats is also not a good option. Therefore, I can only minimize problem by riding in shoes with thin rounded heel (those shoes usually have no grip when walking).

I know this is not directly carbon-frame related problem. But carbon allows HT frames with super short chainstays. So if someone does have big feet, and wants modern carbon HT frame, that is one thing to be considered.


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## matt4x4 (Dec 21, 2013)

Way easier to repair alum or steel then carbon fiber.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

matt4x4 said:


> Way easier to repair alum or steel then carbon fiber.


Oh?

Who is going to heat treat and repaint your AL bike for less than the cost of a carbon fiber repair ($300)?

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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Yes, Carbon is easier to repair than aluminum. Steel is also more easily repaired than aluminum. I've had two areas of impact (not insignificant)damage to my Fuel EX repaired. Two different incidences, one for $380 another for $270. admittedly, the $380 was because I needed the frame back in less than a week (rush charge) for a Sedona trip. 

Local Carbon Composite repair. Southwest Composite Works. No issues.


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## bingemtbr (Apr 1, 2004)

bingemtbr said:


> IMO, carbon frames for clydes are not desirable. My 120lb wife has a Tallboy. Its frame has failed twice. Both times without warning nor explanation.
> 
> At least with aluminum. most times you get creaking and cracking before the frame fails. Also, an aluminum frame can be repaired.


Well. An update, before the I posted my original reply, my aluminum duallie had just broke. It was sent in to be refurbed-crack repaired, new rear swing arm, new heat treat, new bearings, new powder. Then in March, it failed again.

I started talking to a bunch of other big guys. One of whom is 320lbs+ (6'5" so he's giant sized). I'm 260lbs. He's beein on a carbon frame since 2012 with zero issues.

Longstory short, I'm taking the plunge and switching to carbon (with a lifetime frame warranty) this winter. In 2019, I lost 7 weeks of riding during PRIME conditions due to my aluminum frame failing. 7 weeks is a big disappointment.

Fingers crossed.


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## Tristan Wolf (Oct 21, 2019)

bingemtbr said:


> Well. An update, before the I posted my original reply, my aluminum duallie had just broke. It was sent in to be refurbed-crack repaired, new rear swing arm, new heat treat, new bearings, new powder. Then in March, it failed again.
> 
> I started talking to a bunch of other big guys. One of whom is 320lbs+ (6'5" so he's giant sized). I'm 260lbs. He's beein on a carbon frame since 2012 with zero issues.
> 
> ...


Carbon frame can also be repaired if damage not extreme. But its very expensive, so unless you run top of the line relatively new carbon frame, it begs the question is it worth it to repair?

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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

2017 Fuel EX carbon frame - $3300

Total cost of two repairs to frame from impact damage - $650
$540 if I didn't need the bike right away after the second incident.

Frame was 1 year old when first repair done, 3 years old when second repair done.


Frame was good as new. Was even able to sell it after customer reviewed the repaired areas and looked into the company that did the repairs


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## matt4x4 (Dec 21, 2013)

Prices are reasonable for a weld job and heat treatment as there are shops everywhere, from welding shops, to bicycle frame shops to fabrication shops, to roll cage shops. Not so with carbon fiber.

I got work done on my cracked bike for a very reasonable price, a bit lower then the price in this article.
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/article1117.html


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## mlx john (Mar 22, 2010)

Cool link. Pyrobike has it dialed. Would trust having an alloy frame repaired by them.

Not so sure about your everyday welding shops, to bicycle frame shops to fabrication shops, to roll cage shops.

There are quite a few professional composite companies throughout the US, such as Calfee Design, carbonrepair.com, Kirklee Carbon Frame Repair, Broken Carbon, the aforementioned Southwest Composite works to name a few. Broken Carbon gave Velonews a quoted price of "$175 to repair our broken top tube, with a turnaround time of 1-2 weeks."

Frame repair is a good thing to have access to.


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## Alias530 (Apr 1, 2013)

Stiffness is worth a lot. I went from an alu stumpjumper to a carbon evil following to an ibis Ripmo. The SJ had 2200g tank wheels with DT champ spokes and the evil had teeny DT revs and 1500g light wheels and WOW it was stiffer. It actually went where I pointed it. The Ripmo was another improvement but not as dramatic.


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