# XML XPG MCE Regina/Fraen FRC Narrow Beam Shots



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Remove mounting pegs. Step drill to 1/4 inch ~6.5 mm to fully set XML inside of Regina.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)




----------



## emu26 (Jun 23, 2008)

I think the fraen has it

Thanks for the comparisons:thumbsup: Any chance you can slow down the pics in the first post so we can see what they are a little easier? (Or am I just getting old and slow?)


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

Nice work OD! Thanks for the detailed pics of the Regina mods. They are looking pretty good on the XM-L. 

Now I guess I'll have start looking for some on a 10mm round MCPCB


----------



## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

odtexas said:


>


The die on the XML is smaller than the 4 on the MCE so it _should_ be tighter. The MCE die sits higher, are you correcting for this?


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

That is as slow as they go using Gickr.com. 
One reason later in the posts I added one vs one pictures. 
The four at a time is way too much info for comfort. 

If you have a combo you want to see just drop a pm and I will try to get it put together and posted.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

znomit said:


> The die on the XML is smaller than the 4 on the MCE so it _should_ be tighter. The MCE die sits higher, are you correcting for this?


The bottom of the FRC was ground flat so the bottom of the reflector sits flat even with the actual LED just as the FRC does with the MCE.
So that's a "yes".

There is that pesky view angle getting in the mix there as well. Smaller die, but larger view angle. Look at the XRE die vs the XPG. Die size is a component of the equation, but so is view angle.

View angle

125* XM-L
125* XP-G
115* XP-E
110* MC-E
100* SST-50
090* XR-E


----------



## mtroy (Jun 10, 2005)

Hmmm...sure seems like 2 XMLs with that modded Regina at 1A would be quite a decent and efficient bar light. And if you needed it, lots of room to go brighter with the right driver.

Man, just when I think I have the next light build figured, something new comes along.


----------



## SBJohn (Feb 5, 2010)

OD
Fantastic post. Thanks for your efforts.:thumbsup:


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)




----------



## emu26 (Jun 23, 2008)

Cheers OD, greatly appreciated.

I wonder what the Fraen would look like with a secondary aspheric in front of it?


----------



## troutie-mtb (Sep 20, 2007)

:thumbsup: cheers Odtexas things are not looking as bad as when the MCE arrived on the scene

I am not a reflector lover though. i am not keen on the sharp edge 
prefer the spill to fade out 

but for throw. they are looking pretty good


----------



## luminous (Sep 21, 2009)

OD.

Nice work there, many thanks for the time and effort.

What are your conclusions ?, which combination would you choose for your next light ?.

Cheers.

:thumbsup:


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Thanks guys. 

Between all of us modding, hacking, taking pictures and reporting we will find something usable for everyone. 

I do prefer the look of an optic over a reflector. Just a style thing. But lately I have been finding the reflectors giving better throw.

There is a softer mid fill with the Regina and the XML. The cut off is not near as sharp as it was with the XPG. Hard to appreciate that in the photo.

Amps, optics size, throw, fill, drivers, light size, battery capacity are all parts of deciding your light.

For me it is a light with alot of throw. Prefer twice as much intensity down range than in the 10 to 30ft range. Small light body as possible to avoid branches/brush.

Best throw is still the MCE/Fraen FRC Narrow combo. It is a narrow beam that some here do not like.

If you are not wanting the 80+ft throwing hot spot then I think the XML with the Regina will be a killer light.

A dual XML/Regina would be make 90% of riders out there very happy I think. 
Especially if you kick it up to 3+ amps.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

odtexas said:


> A dual XML/Regina would be make 90% of riders out there very happy I think.
> Especially if you kick it up to 3+ amps.


that's pretty much my next light, right there  Thanks for all the effort, I was hoping the XML/Regina would be a slightly wider version of the XPG/Regina and it looks like that's how it's panned out. I also have a Laura-RS (from Troutie's beam shots) and a Boom SS to play with for the 2nd LED - I'm thinking Regina+Laura-RS will make a good even bar light.


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

deleted..
wrong thread...
Nice work OD...you have been busy :thumbsup:


----------



## langen (May 21, 2005)

Great work, OD! Gave me just the answers I was looking for! 

:thumbsup:


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

ODtexas - if you have a moment, would you mind taking a micrometer (I'm guessing you have one?) and measuring the height of the XML modified Regina? I think the XP-G modded ones are 17.3mm off the top of my head.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

mattthemuppet said:


> that's pretty much my next light, right there  Thanks for all the effort, I was hoping the XML/Regina would be a slightly wider version of the XPG/Regina and it looks like that's how it's panned out. I also have a Laura-RS (from Troutie's beam shots) and a Boom SS to play with for the 2nd LED - I'm thinking Regina+Laura-RS will make a good even bar light.


Boom SS is super floody. Fair amount of mod to get the boom to seat properly on the XML. Easy enough with a belt sander or bench top grinder. Could do the drill press and dremel cut off attachment.

I will measure the height with the micrometer when I get home later tonight.:thumbsup:


----------



## mtroy (Jun 10, 2005)

I notice that Cutter has two Reginas listed...4* and 5* IIRC....is there any significant difference for this purpose?


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

I would guess-- No --


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

odtexas said:


> Boom SS is super floody. Fair amount of mod to get the boom to seat properly on the XML. Easy enough with a belt sander or bench top grinder. Could do the drill press and dremel cut off attachment.
> 
> I will measure the height with the micrometer when I get home later tonight.:thumbsup:


thanks for that, appreciate it :thumbsup: I bought the BoomSS just because it was only a couple of bucks and I was ordering a bunch of stuff anyway, if I don't use it, it's no great loss.


----------



## luminous (Sep 21, 2009)

_I do prefer the look of an optic over a reflector. Just a style thing. But lately I have been finding the reflectors giving better throw_

I prefer optics / collumators too.

I've got a few ideas up my sleeve.

I've yet to receive my XM-Ls, but once I do, I'll set to work.
If my ideas work out, I'll post.

Once again, thanks to OdTexas for putting in the work.
Top Man !.


----------



## BrianMc (Jan 5, 2010)

Thanks for the shots, OD! Hope to add to this party in a few more days when the second XM-L and optics arrive. A regina and 3 collimators. Looking for best pair for my purposes. Had an early hunch that 2 XM-L's will do for me with likely two doublings of power to tap above 'normal'. Trouties' foursome shots with Regina's say that to me as well.


----------



## HEY HEY ITS HENDO (Feb 23, 2008)

Great stuff OD!.. just love them .gif`s


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Guess the mod doesn't take too much off.:skep:


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

neat, thanks! I just realised I was counting the thickness of the star in my previous number :blush: 

so it's really just cutting off the legs and opening out the hole I guess, sounds easy enough to me.

funny though, last night I went for a ride in the snow and forgot my light, so had to borrow my friends 200lm Minewt w/ SSC P4. Still had an absolute hoot - sometimes I think we get a wee bit too caught up in the lumen wars


----------



## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> last night I went for a ride in the snow and forgot my light.


Holy smokes, that's like going for a ride and forgetting your bike. 

That's pretty cool OD.
One of these days I'll have a go at something other than P7's

After the dust settles on all these different combo's youz guys are messin with.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

El34 said:


> Holy smokes, that's like going for a ride and forgetting your bike.


the worst thing was that I remembered my battery and, in the space of about 5s, remembered then forgot the light head. Still, after a few sniffs of rum and lots of sliding around it was all forgotten


----------



## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

> Still, after a few sniffs of rum and lots of sliding around it was all forgotten


At least you had the most important bits (rum)

I have seen guys show up at rides that forgot their shoes or front wheels


----------



## BrianMc (Jan 5, 2010)

No joy. BO'd at Cutter's. Dang.

I didn't know that rum improved night vision!  I assume it was 'Happy Trails to you'... I don't think law enforcement would buy it: "But Occifer, it (hic) helps me see bett'rin'd'dark!"


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

well, it would have been quicker to walk than ride, so I don't think rum (or lights) really made that much difference. Needless to say, I won't be forgetting my light again 

sorry for derailing the topic odtexas!


----------



## emu26 (Jun 23, 2008)

BrianMc said:


> No joy.
> I didn't know that rum improved night vision!


Of course it does, how else would something that look like this










at 11pm at night end up looking like this










when you wake up in the morning?


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

No worries.
Every decent thread needs at least one derailment for entertainment purposes, and that got pretty (or not so), entertaining.


----------



## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Oh man, contestant #1 please.
I hate having to chew off my arm to sneak off the next morning.
And now, back to our regular scheduled program.

Sorry OD


----------



## HEY HEY ITS HENDO (Feb 23, 2008)

my KD XM-L T6 drop in arrived, very bright and really floody
https://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=11106
i have a Dereelight CL1H V4
https://www.dereelight.com/cl1hv4.htm 
which has a XR-E R2 drop in ...with a very tight beam!
so i unscrewed the reflector and screwed it on the Kaidomain T6 drop in
hmmm, i was hoping for a better result :bluefrown: 
.... 17 metres to the wall, auto compact camera
.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

emu26 said:


> when you wake up in the morning?


ooh, that's a "double bagger and chew your arm off" one, for sure. She probably looks pretty good without the funny face though.

Oh, what? the thread's back on topic again? Nuts!


----------



## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

HEY HEY ITS HENDO said:


> my KD XM-L T6 drop in arrived, very bright and really floody
> http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=11106
> i have a Dereelight CL1H V4
> http://www.dereelight.com/cl1hv4.htm
> ...


Yeah, I tried the same thing with mine. Very disappointing to say the least. I was hoping to get a more narrow beam and it just didn't happen. I had a smooth reflector from an SST-50 drop-in that I had high hopes with. While it did produce a better center spot it also created a greenish halo around the spot. Not to my liking unfortunately. I have a KD XP-G drop-in reflector that I haven't tried yet but I will need to drill it out to fit the XML. ( Note to self: buy some small drill bits )


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)




----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

odtexas said:


>


Were they Boom SS's for the MCE? I have the P7 version that has a larger round hole for the LED..
Proberly will be crap with the XML


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Yes, MCE Booms.......


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

you know, I quite like that BoomSS shot - not quite as hot in the centre as the Regina, but much smoother transition from spot to spill


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

mattthemuppet said:


> you know, I quite like that BoomSS shot - not quite as hot in the centre as the Regina, but much smoother transition from spot to spill


Surprise You can get the MCE Boom SS from RS
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=7107583
Pack of 2 x £1.375 each

I'm begining to sound like an RS sales man..:eekster:


----------



## troutie-mtb (Sep 20, 2007)

my tuppence. on the boom. when i tried it was it ran out of oomph into the distance 
just like with the mce


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

With the LM1 optics the XML emitter base can fit entirely in the recess.
One can not really balance the optic on top of the emitter since the edges of the emitter are nearly exactly the same dimension of the optic opening.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

I missed centering over the XML by probably .2 mm. Gives that mild peripheral distortion like we got with the Carclo 10mm square optics when the XPE/XPG emitter were slightly decentered on the PCB.


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

Thanks od, I think the LM1 with mod holder is pretty good..
IS it me or is it giving a whiter light than the tina?

edit, seems to be the same for the tina with holder, using the holder is giving a more whiter light..


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

I had a feeling that SST-50 optics/reflectors may work well, as the SST-50 has a dome of 5.6mm vs XML 5mm if im not mistaken?

Looking at ledil they only have the iris and Lily which are for both the sst50/90!!!
Carlco have a fair amount for the 50 though..


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

Goldigger said:


> Surprise You can get the MCE Boom SS from RS
> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=7107583
> Pack of 2 x £1.375 each
> 
> I'm begining to sound like an RS sales man..:eekster:


thanks GD, I added a Boom SS to my Digikey order (along with a Regina and a CXP-RS) as it was only a couple of bucks. I'll have a play with a modded Regina and either the Boom or the CXP-RS to see which combo I like the most.


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

mattthemuppet said:


> thanks GD, I added a Boom SS to my Digikey order (along with a Regina and a CXP-RS) as it was only a couple of bucks. I'll have a play with a modded Regina and either the Boom or the CXP-RS to see which combo I like the most.


Does the Digikey stuff get sent from the states?
Whats their shipping costs like?

I have an RS down the road, i just pop in and get the guy to order what i need..then pick it up once its in..


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

Goldigger said:


> Does the Digikey stuff get sent from the states?
> Whats their shipping costs like?
> 
> I have an RS down the road, i just pop in and get the guy to order what i need..then pick it up once its in..


ah, sorry. I'm a Brit, but I live in the States. I wish we had RS or Maplins here as Radioshack is complete pants.

On the plus side, the peeps at Digikey are very helpful and their postage costs are pretty good (~$2 for small stuff, ~$4 for a bigger box). I just hate having to find stuff on their website, makes my head hurt.


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

mattthemuppet said:


> ah, sorry. I'm a Brit, but I live in the States. I wish we had RS or Maplins here as Radioshack is complete pants.
> 
> On the plus side, the peeps at Digikey are very helpful and their postage costs are pretty good (~$2 for small stuff, ~$4 for a bigger box). I just hate having to find stuff on their website, makes my head hurt.


Ah that explains my confusion, i checked your profile and it said bristol + your favorite trail is the 50 acre woods..but then you was quoting bucks.. 

Where abouts in the states are you? is it work that took you over there? I wish i could get some time over in arizona with work..


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Goldigger said:


> Thanks od, I think the LM1 with mod holder is pretty good..
> IS it me or is it giving a whiter light than the tina?
> 
> edit, seems to be the same for the tina with holder, using the holder is giving a more whiter light..


They look about the same in the 18ft shot. It's an older camera with an automatic "night" setting. Could be something to do with the camera processing. It can't be set to "daylight" on the color like MTBR pictures usually are. 
I would rather invest in optics and emitters than an camera.:thumbsup:


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

Goldigger said:


> Ah that explains my confusion, i checked your profile and it said bristol + your favorite trail is the 50 acre woods..but then you was quoting bucks..
> 
> Where abouts in the states are you? is it work that took you over there? I wish i could get some time over in arizona with work..


oops, that explains things. I thought it was my fabulous command of the English language/ inability to write 'merican  I haven't updated my profile in over 5 years, in which time I've lived in NZ, Australia and now here - all different postdoctoral contracts (I'm a worm biologist, for my sins). All updated now, I'm in deepest darkest Pennsylvania (Paddington Bear, anyone?), getting used to rocks and snow instead of dust and bush fires, and rocks and moss before that, all of which is better than the mud and mud of Bristol!


----------



## emu26 (Jun 23, 2008)

mattthemuppet said:


> ....... getting used to rocks and snow instead of dust and bush fires, and rocks and moss before that, all of which is better than the mud and mud of Bristol!


Haven't you heard Matt, it's not dust and bush fires down here at the moment, it's floods and bush fires.

Bush fires in South west WA and flooding of sort or another across 5 states. Gotta love the "lucky country"


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

The IMS 20.5 looks the tightest on the garage door, but in person and in the 80ft pictures the Modified Regina still looks to best to me for throw.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Dual MCE vs Dual XML











Single MCE vs Single XML


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Looking at intensity here.


Central intensity vs Central intensity. The intensity is what gives the down range punch.
The MCE Fraen single appears to have a slightly more intense center, so should have greater throw.:skep: 
Of coures the MCE is running 800mA over maximum recommended drive current.


----------



## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

odtexas said:


> Looking at intensity here.
> 
> 
> Central intensity vs Central intensity. The intensity is what gives the down range punch.
> ...


They look pretty close for throw but the XML has much much better coverage.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

emu26 said:


> Haven't you heard Matt, it's not dust and bush fires down here at the moment, it's floods and bush fires.
> 
> Bush fires in South west WA and flooding of sort or another across 5 states. Gotta love the "lucky country"


yep, it's a crazy place, that's for sure. When we were in Melbourne during the King Lake bush fires (200+ dead?) people were drowning in floods and being eaten by crocodiles in Queensland. My folks are pretty relieved that we're now in safe USofA


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

znomit said:


> They look pretty close for throw but the XML has much much better coverage.


I agree, I'd much rather have the XML, bar or helmet lamp.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

emu26 said:


> Haven't you heard Matt, it's not dust and bush fires down here at the moment, it's floods and bush fires.
> 
> Bush fires in South west WA and flooding of sort or another across 5 states. Gotta love the "lucky country"


yep, it's a crazy place, that's for sure. When we were in Melbourne during the King Lake bush fires (200+ dead?) people were drowning in floods and being eaten by crocodiles in Queensland. My folks are pretty relieved that we're now in safe USofA


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Arrow Electronics  has the Fraen Frc Narrow back in stock............ :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

can also get it here if you not state side.. 
uk and eu
http://www.led-tech.de/en/High-Powe...ctor-for-Cree-MC-E-13,5°-LT-1492_106_110.html


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

Any suggestions on more optics to try with the XML's?
I'm just going to RS shortly to get some switches and LC1's, will get any good suggestions while im there..


----------



## Toaster79 (Apr 5, 2010)

I've tried the LXP-RS and gives a nice beam pattern, just needed to enlarge the hole on the holder so the dome fits in, since it's XP-E optic. The light is a bit more concentrated than with the modified Boom-SS reflector. But if you want some serious throw, go for the Fraen FRC-N. With no mods it throws even better than MC-E. I've also tried the Iris wich works pretty good with no holder and projects the square pattern of the die, but it's huge even with no holder.


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

Any beam shots toaster?
The LXP-RS and LC1 look identical, i wonder if they are the same just with a different holder?
LC1 http://www.ledil.com/datasheets/DataSheet_LC1-TAPE.pdf
LXP http://www.ledil.com/datasheets/DataSheet_LXP.pdf


----------



## Goldigger (Nov 6, 2009)

LC1's im picking up tomorrow along with some nice little IP67 momentary tactile switches
black one bottom left 10x10mm 6.4mm high









xml's have been shipped from cutters yesterday


----------



## Toaster79 (Apr 5, 2010)

No beam shots yet. Still working on a housing


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Aluminum Square Tubing, 1" SQ {A} x 3/4" ID {B} x .125" Wall Sq. Tube , from  Speedymetals.

Aluminum Rectangular Tubing, 1" {A} x 2" {B} x .125" Wall {C} Rect. Tube  Speedymetals.

Aluminum Square Tubing, 3/4" SQ {A} x 5/8" ID {B} x .063" Wall {C} Sq. Tube 6063-T52 Aluminum, from  Speedymetals.

Rip the ¾ inch tube length wise to give 2 halves or U channel. Then cut U channel to appropriate length to fit into light body.

In the 1 inch square tube the Regina outside edge can be sanded to remove the small lip. It will then fit into the 1 inch square tube without distorting the reflector.

The driver in both lights are the 3-mode regulated Circuit Boards from  Shiningbeam. 
In the Dual XML light I am using the Poormans 7135 Driver Setup, brought to our attention by  rlouder  via CPF. Thanks rlouder&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.
So cut the outside corners of the tube at 45 degrees. Slots were also cut using table saw. 
Makes for a tidy 3 mode light. 


















I recut the 1 inch square to have only four slots, three fins. 
The originals were cut with five slots, four fins, each side and the fins came out a little too narrow on some of the housings.


----------



## Itess (Feb 22, 2009)

odtexas said:


>


What are you doing with all these lights, odtexas? 

Very good work! :thumbsup:

Your table saw work is really inspiring!


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Will build a few here and there. 
Nice to have a reserve in case one of my riding buddies needs a light. 
About half of the first batch has one really thin fin. 
I have some Gun-Kote on order. A few coats and bake in the oven might thicken the fin up enough to keep it from breaking off. :skep:


----------



## rvrat (Jan 26, 2011)

odtexas - you build some great stuff, always a pleasure to see whats nest!


----------



## biketuna (Mar 28, 2008)

odtexas, you selling xml lights


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

It's just a hobby for me., but I do appreciate the interest........
I will leave the sales to the professionals here.  
You know who they are.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Same information posted to the 
DIY Light Database 
Update to a more step by step process.

The cut bodies will have some edge overhang so take a knife and trim/bevel the edges.









The ¾ inch slug will need to have edges rounded and some sanding to fit inside the light body. Sand and round edges enough to be able to push the slug in with a mild/moderate amount of force.









Tin the leds. Much harder to tin when star has been thermal epoxied to the slug.









Prepare driver. This is the 2800 mA, 3 mode from Shining beam. Remove spring and solder positive wire on.









Attach negative to outer gold colored ring either top or bottom. Top was done here to make attachment to switch easier.









Thermal epoxy 7135 chips to slug. Channel locks used to hold together until epoxy sets. Velcro wrapped around grips to hold driver in place.









Used dremel grinding stone to remove lip from the Regina optic.









Step drill Regina out to ¼ inch.









Use a slug to trace the front and back plate of the light on 1.2 mm polycarb and cut out with scissors.









Used 5 minute epoxy to fix Regina to led star after soldering driver wires to the star pads.









Regina, slug, and driver ready to be pushed into light body.









Light body gets thermal epoxy.









Slide slug into body.









Take front and back polycarb 1.2 mm plates. Stack both and continue pressing slug into light body. 









Wires can be threaded out through switch hole and end of light can be tapped with soft faced hammer.









Remove the polycarb plates.









Leaves about 1 mm to work 5 minute clear epoxy around to seal the polycarb in place over the reflector.









Getting ready to mix.









Mixed with one toothpick. Discard that one. Use tip of clean toothpick to work epoxy around polycarb/light body junction.









Driver and switch connected.









Negative wire connected and Marine shrink tube placed over wires. * If you plan to use a bolted/screwed on mount this area behind the driver is the area the hole will need to be drilled for installation. I use Velcro or Dual Lock on my lights. *









Polycarb plate with center drilled ready for JB Weld Kwik.









Mix a little more black than grey to get darker epoxy color. 









Epoxy worked into back of light body and feathered against internal body edges. Place light on flat surface and heat body and epoxy with heat gun so it self levels.









Used a little less epoxy than needed to completely fill back cavity to flush. Prefer a little droop so dried epoxy has slight recessed look to it.









Mini Tamiya connectors








Another section of Marine heat shrink tubing place on wiring and shrank with heat gun.








Use Velcro or 3M Dual lock on my light. *A mount could be drilled and screwed/bolted in before polycarb rear plate was installed.*

Lights done with both Rustoleum Fine Texture paint and Gunkote. 









Light bodies cleaned with Dawn dish soap to remove oils. Then dipped in rubbing alcohol and wiped dry. Next light bodies are heated to 150 degrees F and sprayed with the paint/coating product.
Let dry for 30 minutes and then bake in oven for 1 hour at 350 degrees F.
Rustoluem Left, Gun-Kote Right.









Brass brush used to test scratch resistance of both products after baking and cooling.









The Rustoleum resisted better against scratching.








The bare stripe on the Rustoleum was from the wire rack the light was dried and baked on. The bottom could be resprayed and baked, but it is getting covered in 3M Dual lock so not worth the effort for me.


----------



## Whitedog1 (Feb 3, 2009)

omg, amazing work!! :thumbsup: 
are you selling these?


----------



## znomit (Dec 27, 2007)

Fantastic writeup! :thumbsup:


----------



## El34 (Jan 11, 2009)

Nice job OD


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

od, your last post deserves a separate thread as a DIY tutorial!


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Thanks guys. 
As always though I will leave the selling to the professionals. 
This is just a hobby/obsession for me.:madman:

I have learned alot of these tricks from fellow builders here. Came up with a few on my own. 
There are many more tricks and tips on mtbr and cpf. 
Here is one of the best threads I have ever come across.  This guy, wquiles, is meticulous and shares years worth of experience. 
It is where I decided the 5 minute clear epoxy could handle any abuse I threw at it.
Long read but worth it. 
He uses a thermal tape and some nonconductive tape on the back of an aluminum reflector. 
Not my style, but someone here could probably benefit from those tips.
I added this to the DIY Database. 
That is the best place to point Noobs. No excuse now that they can't figure out how exactly to build a light. :thumbsup:


----------



## Whitedog1 (Feb 3, 2009)

This guy you linked is really insane lol....
nice photo story tough!


----------



## HEY HEY ITS HENDO (Feb 23, 2008)

thats a superb step by step `how to` guide od !
thanks for sharing :thumbsup:


----------



## JezV (Oct 31, 2009)

HEY HEY ITS HENDO said:


> thats a superb step by step `how to` guide od !
> thanks for sharing :thumbsup:


+1

Excellent write up od :thumbsup:


----------



## troutie-mtb (Sep 20, 2007)

Echoing what the others are saying cracking writeup 

Just had a go at grooving a bit of box using my chop saw but it is very inconsistant due to flex in the arm so the grooves can vary by over 1 mm deep so not happy with that method .
and dont have a table saw .


----------



## luminous (Sep 21, 2009)

Yeap !, nice work there Od, again. :thumbsup: 

Taking the time to work through and catalogue all the different stages, and then presenting them in an easy to follow post.
Even researching and testing the finish coatings. Very thorough.

I bet you are enjoying the fruits of you labour too. Its nice to ride with lights you've made yourself, imo.

Good Man !.


----------



## BrianMc (Jan 5, 2010)

Thanks, OD. By the time I figure out how I make one light it's too late to document!

Question: How would you size up DIY anodizing, gun kote, and the textured paint finsihing for ease/cost?


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

BrianMc said:


> Question: How would you size up DIY anodizing, gun kote, and the textured paint finsihing for ease/cost?


Ano
Battery Acid ..............................................................$10
Battery Charger ..............................................................$50
Aluminum Dye ..............................................................$30
Aluminum Wire ..............................................................$10
Wire Brush Stainless steel ................................................... $10
Various Plastic Containers ....................................................$20
Metal Pots for boiling water or 130 degree F dye...................... $20
Dual burner electric hot plate for boiling water and hot dye ........$40
Lead .....................................................................................$5
Sodium Hydroxide/Lye ..........................................................$8
Wondering how many of your neighbors
think you are cooking meth in your back yard ........................ *Priceless*

Coating

Dawn dish soap. ..................................$3
Rubbing Alcohol .................................. $1
Toaster Oven .......................................$39
Rustoleum ..........................................$5

Total time for 1 batch (12) of Ano 3-4 hours
Total time for 1 batch (12) of Rustoleum 2 hours
No stress with watching times and temperatures of acid and dye bath.
No caustic/dangerous chemical with Rustoluem.

Hardness Ano being a 10 Rustoleum solid 7 and can be touched up.
Personal usage. Rustoleum.
Selling. Ano or Raw for maximum durability.

The ano process will be cheaper in the long run. Acid bath and dye can last neary forever as long as it isn't cross contaminated. Worst part is having multiple gallons of these chemicals around your house. :skep: :madmax:

Personally I will paint my lights from now on for ease. :thumbsup:


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

odtexas said:


> Ano
> Battery Acid ..............................................................$10
> Battery Charger ..............................................................$50
> Aluminum Dye ..............................................................$30
> ...


Well you have convinced me that the $50 minimum charge at the local ano shop is a pretty good deal. Last time I inquired about that was with my dual MC-E light. They said that their minimum would cover about 10-12 housings that size.


----------



## P220C (Jan 31, 2011)

Very nice write-up/photo work.


----------



## BrianMc (Jan 5, 2010)

+ a gazzillion! Wow! Absolutely what I wanted to know. Have the hot plate so ano'd be a bit cheaper, BUT....

Yeah, Farming out ano for a few heads does seem to be a good idea if you want ano. 

My helmet light says I need easy repair!:thumbsup:


----------



## rvrat (Jan 26, 2011)

*WOW - Thanks!*

odtexas, damn, this is an excellent and very much apprecaited photo documentary of your light! This is very helpful, thanks much. 

The output is about 800 lumens wtih this guy, and what is the durration wtih your battery pack?:thumbsup:


----------



## P220C (Jan 31, 2011)

The XML neutral white exhibits the following, according to the Cree datasheet:

3.35 Volts forward
3.00 Amps
877 lumens _(270 lumens @ 700mA x 325% @ 3.0A)_

Cree: Product Family Datasheet: XM-L LEDs. Cree, Inc: 2010. Pg 2, 4, and 5. Online. http://www.cree.com/products/pdf/XLampXM-L.pdf (accessed 22 Feb 2011).

So at a 10 Amp draw, you will get 877 lumen at the emitter. Figure 92% efficiency through a Lexan lens cover, and 90% efficiency through an optic or reflector, and you might have 726 lumen out the front.

One of Panasonics 18650 2,900 mAh rated batteries will probably give you 2500 to 2700 mAh at a 1C+ discharge rate (i.e. 3.0 Amps). So, if you went full throttle, *you would deplete one battery in ~0.83 hours (50 minutes)*. (50 grams of battery weight at $20)

Two 18650s in parallel will give you a discharge rate of 0.5C, which will probably give you 2,600 to 2,800 mAh. So, if you went full throttle, *you would deplete the pair in ~1.73 hours (104 minutes).* (100 grams of battery weight at $40).

Three in parallel will probably give you close to the full use of the rated 2900 mAh on a new battery, if they are kept cool

The more batteries you add, the longer the run-time, but at an additional expense and weight.

Later Edit: my calculations do not factor in losses from drivers (5 to 12% depending upon battery voltage.)


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

P220C summed it all up nicely. :thumbsup: 
Two 18650's in parallel at 3.7 volts gives 1.5 to 1.75 hour run time at full tilt.
I run two dual 18650 battery packs since I mount the battery packs on the helmet. If you keep your batteries in your gear/water pack then a bigger battery would be a good idea for longer run times.
I usually velcro a spare battery to the seatpost just for emergency back up when I ride.


----------



## OldMTBfreak (Apr 8, 2006)

Nice write-up there ODT. Thanks for the coating tips. I'm gonna try the baked Rustoleum, I liked the way it looked. You have have convinced me to buy some round tubing and hack on it with the table saw. I STILL have all my fingers...for now. I bought some 2" OD X 1.5" ID tubing. An Iris optic fits inside perfect or a tripe XML board. More shavings are coming. James


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Bumping for people gearing up to build with the XML this fall.......


----------



## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

OD's build log (Posting #76) should really have its own thread. I was looking for it a while ago, but didn't find it.

Thanks for reviving it.


----------



## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

Thanks OD, I was just re-reading this thread and there is a ton of info here, got it bookmarked.

Also noticed you have the MET parachute, I was close to buying one but they are not available in the US due to liability or some nonsense like that. How do you like it?


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Love the Parachute.  
Have crashed and abused the heck out of that lid and its saved my lower jaw a few times. It also covers more on the back of your head and stopped a chainstay from knocking me silly one time. 

Got thrown OTB/endo down a small ravine. The bike launched ballistic upwards until the cleats release. Bike landed on back of my head hitting with the side of the chainstay near the quick release. Hurt alot and got dent in the back of the MET. Dusted myself off, reaimed the lights and off I went for the last 8 miles. Good times. 

I get the Parachute from Chain Reaction and it ships to the US.

Rumor was that the MET helmet line hasn't been submitted for US safety standards testing. 

The MET does meet European standards which possibly exceeds US standards. 

I would never give up rolling in a Parachute if I have a choice. :thumbsup:


----------



## shirk (Mar 24, 2004)

Thanks for the bump, it's inspired my to build new lights for this fall.

A question. How would the single sled design handle the heat of XML driven by the 7135 without the fins. Would the round 22mm design you have also used be any better at handling the heat? 

Eventually I'll have more workspace and table saw, but for now it's not really an option.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

shirk said:


> Thanks for the bump, it's inspired my to build new lights for this fall.
> 
> A question. How would the single sled design handle the heat of XML driven by the 7135 without the fins. Would the round 22mm design you have also used be any better at handling the heat?
> 
> Eventually I'll have more workspace and table saw, but for now it's not really an option.


Without finning I would use the square housing and thermal epoxy a small heat sink to it.

The round works great with the finning. If you go round though be real careful. Fingers are very close to the blade and the round houing can snag and spin.

Slotting the square extrusion is much safer.


----------



## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

shirk said:


> Thanks for the bump, it's inspired my to build new lights for this fall.
> 
> A question. How would the single sled design handle the heat of XML driven by the 7135 without the fins. Would the round 22mm design you have also used be any better at handling the heat?
> 
> Eventually I'll have more workspace and table saw, but for now it's not really an option.


You can always use square tubing and attach some of this heat sink material:
Heat Sink Heasink 39x39x7.5mm 1.5x1.3x0.3in Adhesive | eBay

Cut to width and use the thermal tape included.


----------



## shirk (Mar 24, 2004)

odtexas said:


> Without finning I would use the square housing and thermal epoxy a small heat sink to it.
> 
> The round works great with the finning. If you go round though be real careful. Fingers are very close to the blade and the round houing can snag and spin.
> 
> Slotting the square extrusion is much safer.


If I was to fin the round stock I'd make a jig to bolt to it.

The round ones look really pro.









This little guy was round one.

The square tube will be round two.

I think I'll save the round tube for round three.


----------



## odtexas (Oct 2, 2008)

Looks like copper. If you are making a round out of copper then I don't think slotting would be needed. Copper is very good at handling heat flow. So if that triple isn't giving you any issues I doubt the XML single would either.


----------



## shirk (Mar 24, 2004)

Yes that is copper pipe on my 3x XPG. I forget who but I copied it from the old DIY Dinotte thread.

Would the thin copper plumbing pipe deal with the XML heat better than non-finned alum?


----------



## yetibetty (Dec 24, 2007)

Can someone please tell me the thickness of the 20mm MCPCB that the XM-L comes on? and also the thickness of the 14mm. Are they the same thickness?

The last time I bought LEDs they were XP-G on 10mm squares that were very thin so I assume that the bigger ones are thicker.

I am going to do the Regina mod(I think) for the XM-L.

Made a start but can't go any further without those numbers. Thanks in advance.


----------



## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

I only have the 14mm ones handy (from Cutter) and they are 1.55 to 1.6mm thick. FWIW, the 32mm triple boards are 1.55mm thick.


----------



## yetibetty (Dec 24, 2007)

Thanks Huffy, that was one quick response.


----------



## HuffyPuffy (Jun 9, 2008)

yetibetty said:


> Thanks Huffy, that was one quick response.


I just happened to check my email and saw the thread update 

I re-checked with another vernier and it is the same 1.6mm however there some variation depending on where I measure, with a range from 1.55 to 1.7mm, close to 1.6mm was pretty consistent however. That is pretty much splitting hairs though.


----------



## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

shirk said:


> Would the thin copper plumbing pipe deal with the XML heat better than non-finned alum?


No, for the purposes of LED lights, aluminum or copper really makes no difference. The important factors are design and surface area. 2 sq. Inches per watt is a pretty good rule of thumb to follow for a light to not get hot while going slow or stopped for several minutes. You can go lower but you have to remember to turn it down when stopped.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

HuffyPuffy said:


> I just happened to check my email and saw the thread update
> 
> I re-checked with another vernier and it is the same 1.6mm however there some variation depending on where I measure, with a range from 1.55 to 1.7mm, close to 1.6mm was pretty consistent however. That is pretty much splitting hairs though.


I concur  The ones I've had through my hands are 1.6-1.7mm.

Yeti - I'd also seriously consider trying the Laura RS (Or LXP RS for your round wells). I'm sure I come across as a bit of a scratched record about them, but having lights with both REginas and Lauras, I think the Laura wins hands down. Unless you have something against optics (one stole a girl friend once, that sort of thing), give it a go.

Plus with all that electromechanical trickery, you should be able to machine a lip for the bare optics to sit on, so you won't even have to worry about the holder


----------



## yetibetty (Dec 24, 2007)

matt, I'm open to suggestions.

What in your opinion makes them better than the Regina?. I have only used the Reginas on the XP-G and would like that sort of beam but with the XM-L.

Oh & don't expect too much accuracy from the machinery..... very bad eyesight and fingers like garden spades!


----------



## troutie-mtb (Sep 20, 2007)

yetibetty said:


> mat, I'm open to suggestions.
> 
> What in your opinion makes them better than the Regina?. I have only used the Reginas on the XP-G and would like that sort of beam but with the XM-L.
> 
> Oh & don't expect too much accuracy from the machinery..... very bad eyesight and fingers like garden spades!


Yetibetty in my experience I prefer the Laura to the Regina for the XML it throws as far without the sudden cutoff at the edges which I dont like 
and I believe the lxp is a similar beam but have no experience of that optic yet.

Nice looking piece in the mill there :thumbsup:


----------



## yetibetty (Dec 24, 2007)

Ok, I've ordered some LXP-RS, they are a bit big after the 19mm Reginas. But must take advice when it's given. Thanks Mattthemuppet & Troutie.

Also ordered a couple of Reginas, just in case.


----------



## mattthemuppet (Jul 16, 2004)

bit late as you've already ordered them, but I like them for the same reason as Troutie - very smooth transition from spot to spill compared to the SPOT > spill of the Regina. They seem to throw as far as each other, although I haven't done an apples to apples comparison, and the only downside in my mind is the projection of the die-wire cut outs, although that's only really noticeable close in.

Troutie - I thought that the LXP-RS were the round equivalent of the Laura RS in terms of angle etc?


----------

