# Lupine SLF



## stu06 (Dec 8, 2012)

I'm getting one of these: https://www.mtb-news.de/news/2018/07/09/lupine-2019/


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## angerdan (Sep 18, 2017)

Make night great again


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## Flamingtaco (Mar 12, 2012)

Looks like a knockoff of the small Supernova.


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## angerdan (Sep 18, 2017)

...


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## Flamingtaco (Mar 12, 2012)

Nope.


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## radirpok (Feb 1, 2006)

Fresh info, with beamshots (!):
https://www.lupine.de/products/bike-lights/road-bike-lights/sl-af

Availability in the EU is end of Nov (2018 ), for others, who knows...


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## angerdan (Sep 18, 2017)

The Supernova M99 Pro with its 1600 lumens is even brighter and StVZO approved too. 
supernova-lights.com/en/products/e-bike-lights-45-kmh/m99-pro/
shop.supernova-design.com/shop/product/supernova-m99-pro-68?category=225


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## radirpok (Feb 1, 2006)

The Supernova M99 is an e-bike only light, isn't it? Lupine will be available in battery and e-bike versions.


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## radirpok (Feb 1, 2006)

The SL-AF is now available. 350 EUR for the lighthead only, whew, that's... ambitious.

But, it could be the "only" light one ever needs - dipped beam for the road, and full beam in the forest (combined with a helmet light of similar power, of course).

I was very tempted to finally buy one, despite the price (the last time I bought a light for this kind of money was ~10 years ago), but in the last minute, I found out about this:
https://exposurelights.com/products/bike/mtb-lights/optix-all-terrain-stvzo

Which helped me to articulate my problem with the Lupine SL-AF as it is now. The 1000 lumens dipped beam is plenty bright, I don't think anyone needs more than that, but the full brightness of 1300 lumens is disappointing. And then come Exposure who show how it's done. Too bad there is almost zero information about that light, no beamshots, no availability, etc. But still. On paper, that is the perfect handlebar light. 
And for considerably less money, if you compare it with the full SL-AF kit.

What really pisses me off is that Lupine effectively stopped making their lights upgradable. That means that all those people who buy an AF today will possibly regret their decision next year when Lupine get their act together and add a few extra LEDs to provide proper output for the full beam. Of course, 1300 lumens brightness in itself is not bad at all, but not for this kind of money, I don't think. Sorry Lupine, see you maybe next year... if the Exposure light turns out to be not so good in real life, and others don't make their move as well...


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

radirpok said:


> ...... But still. On paper, that is the perfect handlebar light....


Only if they offer a light head only version with remote battery. I bet that light will weigh more than 350 grams. Probably close to 400. Too heavy for MTB bar use IMO.


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## angerdan (Sep 18, 2017)

radirpok said:


> The Supernova M99 is an e-bike only light, isn't it? Lupine will be available in battery and e-bike versions.


It accepts any DC power source between 24-72V.
And the new M99 Mini-Pro lights can use even 5V (USB).
https://supernova-lights.com/en/products/e-bike-lights-25kmh/m99-mini-pro-25/
https://supernova-lights.com/en/m99-mini-pure-25/
https://shop.supernova-design.com/shop/product/supernova-usb-a-conection-cable-153



radirpok said:


> I found out about this:
> https://exposurelights.com/products/bike/mtb-lights/optix-all-terrain-stvzo
> 
> Too bad there is almost zero information about that light, no beamshots, no availability, etc.


Technical data and product shots are available now. 
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=...s.com/productattachments/index/download?id=33


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

radirpok said:


> The SL-AF is now available...
> ...my problem with the Lupine SL-AF as it is now. The 1000 lumens dipped beam is plenty bright, I don't think anyone needs more than that, but the full brightness of 1300 lumens is disappointing. And then come Exposure who show how it's done.
> ...
> What really pisses me off is that Lupine effectively stopped making their lights upgradable. That means that all those people who buy an AF today will possibly regret their decision next year when Lupine get their act together and add a few extra LEDs to provide proper output for the full beam.


First of all, i am a user of the SL F and there is no point in discussion that it is pretty pricey. being a mostly (gravel) road cyclist (no trails), i do think the high beam at 1300 lm lights up the roads and the surrounding area up to approx 5 m hight quite well. Have to admit though that i have never used a light with more than this amount of light before.

i read quite a lot in the lupine forum before getting that light and i want to add something on the comparison between SL F and Exposure STVZO all terrain. The Lupine consumes 16 W in either full power dipped beam (delivering 1000 lm) or in full power high beam (1300 lm). The only difference is that 12 instead of 6 LEDs are powered at high beam. Their CEO once stated in their forum, that Lupine initially wanted to power the SL with 20W, but e-bike manufacturers (the ones with motors up to 16 mph/25 km/h) were reluctant with such a high power consumption, that is why the went for 16 W.
Now the exposure light at full power is rated for 2hrs runtime with the 11.6 Ah battery, which gives an estimated power consumption of 40 W. Clearly there was no consideration regarding power .

i do not see the point why the SL or SL F should not be upgradeable, once better LED chips are available. (Unless it is hindered by german authorities due to STVZO K-Mark issues...) Nonetheless Lupine announced a light for e-bikes (up to 45 km/h/28 mph), which will probably have higher power consumption (maybe similar to the 27W of the Supernova M99Pro) and therefore higher output.


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## radirpok (Feb 1, 2006)

Well, the Exposure will have a top brightness of around 4000 lumens (according to their spec sheet), but will also have their "Reflex" technology which automatically dims the light according to your speed. (I'm a bit baffled as to why Lupine don't have something like this, it would be a nice feature). And why would I care about what e-bike manufacturers say?  Lupine could just have another driver board for their battery lights (maybe they have already), I don't think this is an acceptable excuse.

It also makes more sense to have a separate high beam without a cutoff, if you wanted to use your light off-road, where you do want to send those photons in the air, lest you catch a tree branch or something up high... Or just for general orientation. Even if you are on gravel, unless there are no forests where you ride. 

Looking at the beamshots in the forum I also think the bright stripe in the middle of the dipped beam is not very elegant - maybe this is not something that you notice on the road?

And for the upgrades, I thought about this and have to say that it is pretty much impossible to make such a light upgradeable - because you'd have to change the lens as well, to match the leds exactly. So no minus points to Lupine on this one, but it only makes the current output a bit more lacking to me.

I'm currently in the enviable position of not needing a light instantly, unless I find one that fits my needs perfectly I can wait, and wait, and wait... it's a bit strange to have two Lupine batteries lying around without a lighthead that could be connected to them, but I still have hopes that they will be put to good use in the future


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

of course the exposure is much brighter than the lupine (no point for discussion) and their reflex+ technology sounds nice. However, It's not a feature i miss, as the lupine comes with a bluetooth remote control. but you're right, lupine could, given their prices, implement something alike. The exposure seems to have 3 LEDs with rotational symmetric lenses above the lense for the dipped beam. For the Lupine CEO this light is probably too big and ugly... he focuses IMO unfortunately too much on design and appearance of the lights instead on function(the SL A had a screw thread on each side the SL F has only one, reason "two threads don't look nice"....),
The bright stripe is indeed not very elegant and due to the high beam feature, as it does not appear on the SL (they couldn't manage to remove this and still obtain the STVZO certification). However you do not notice it much when riding and it disappears at high beam. In my riding experience even the high beam with the cut-off illuminates every branch which might hit your body, at least on gravel roads and if the lamp is not tilted too much downward (see here https://forum.lupine.de/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=5048&start=330#p36323).

i'm really looking forward to see beamshots of that exposure lamp (and maybe even be able to compare it to the SL F), but i do have some concerns that the Optix all terrain really will get an STVZO K-Mark/certification, i do not think that rotational symmetric lenses for a high beam are within regulations for official "high beam". And we germans like to regulate everything...I do guess that a different driver with higher output might have changed the beam pattern of the SL-F, which probably would have screwed the STVZO certification for the given lenses. i do also guess that the majority of SL lamps are sold for e-bikes, the battery version is only a bonus...
The rules for (STVZO) light distribution for bikes are ridiculous and from what i understood much stricter than for car headlights regarding residual light above the cutoff... (legally speaking on roads/bikepaths in germany you are not even allowed _to mount_ (we're not talking about operating, only mounting!) a light on your bike which does not have an STVZO certification)

I discovered the outbound lights too late, that would have been my first choise, even before the exposure lamp. I'd be very much interested in a nice comparison between exposure optix (all terrain), outbound road, lupine SL F and the new supernove lights


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## radirpok (Feb 1, 2006)

Thanks, really informative. I missed out on Outbound Lighting completely, judging by the website the guy really knows his business, and the road light is _very_ competitive for the price. I'm really happy to see that ~10 years after the LED revolution lamp designs are finally catching up 

However I'll try and test out the Exposure if and when it becomes available (they are kind of local to me), because I don't mind ugly lights, as long as they are functional!


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

radirpok said:


> ...
> However I'll try and test out the Exposure if and when it becomes available (they are kind of local to me), because I don't mind ugly lights, as long as they are functional!


I don't mind ugly but functional lamps either . Please give a short review and some beamshots once you'll have tested the exposure!


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