# do i really HAVE to wear a mtb helmet...?



## GorillaTactics (Nov 12, 2006)

Yo guys,

I mostly hang out in the DJ/Park/Urban forum since it's my riding style of choice, but I recently picked up a Kona Dawg Primo at a retarded price-I thought it would be fun to get out on some trails other than the DJ kind. I definitely wear a helmet when I ride, my bucket of choice is just a basic skate/BMX lid. 

After going to the LBS and checking out some of the "mountain biking" helmets, I'm wondering if there's a reason I can't just wear my lid riding my AM bike-the MTB helmets are just so damn GOOFY looking. Plus they just feel kind of weird after wearing something so low profile for so long. 

Is there a MTB bucket any of you guys (or girls) recommend and love that fits comfortably and doesn't look like something Neil Armstrong would wear? Or can I just rock the skate lid on the trails?


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

By all means, use the skate lid! In some cases, it may even offer better or worse protection.

However, if you want the awesome ventilation that mtb helmets have to offer or you find yourself getting hot while climbing up hills, you'll see why mtb helmets are so cool :thumbsup:


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Wear what you like. My favorite helmet is the Giro Semi and I am your basic XC/trail rider. I also use a Bell pi##-pot from time to time as well as a road/mtb model.


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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

GorillaTactics said:


> Yo guys,
> 
> I mostly hang out in the DJ/Park/Urban forum since it's my riding style of choice, but I recently picked up a Kona Dawg Primo at a retarded price-I thought it would be fun to get out on some trails other than the DJ kind. I definitely wear a helmet when I ride, my bucket of choice is just a basic skate/BMX lid.
> 
> ...


I think it's mostly an issue of ventilation, and possibly weight. Otherwise, there is really ne reason not to use a skate lid if you like it.

I did borrow a skate-type lid once for a short road ride. The only issue I had was it dug into the back of my neck when I was leaning forward with my head up (which is most of the time on a road bike). This is more of an issue with road riding, and some xc setups, but would have been less so for me on a more upright setup like a have now on my MTB.

For a ventilated mtb helmet that might be more your style, check out the Giro Xen. It has a sort of skate helmet look about it.

I think a mountain bike helmet may be more comfortable (lighter/cooler) for long mountain bike rides once you get used to the different fit. Yeah, they are pretty goofy looking, but they are the shape they are for a reason. Sort of like spandex, but I won't go there.


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## tkblazer (Sep 18, 2005)

you can look into the fox flux helmet as well










i like my giro hex which replaced a xen that cracked in 3 different spots. I know guys that ride AM with a skate helmet, but i can only imagine how hot your head would get.


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## Dave Moore (Apr 15, 2004)

I rode some trails last year after buying my first skate lid. Up to that point I'd always wore the typical goofy MTB helmet.

It was HOT!!! 

I agree though, wear what you like. There is nothing wrong with a skate lid on the trails but do be careful if your riding a long time and its hot out. Heat exhaustion aint no laughing matter.


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

As a counterpoint, I find my Semi (a skate style helmet with slightly better venting) to be cooler than my Bell XRay.

In a hot (85*) sunny 12hr event (solo) I was swapping between the two helmets. The much more open XRay was much warmer than the Semi on the climbs as it let the sun shine directly on my scalp and only slightly cooler on the descents.

I regularly wear the Semi on multi-hour rides in all conditions including 100*+ temps with no issues.


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## Psycho Mike (Apr 2, 2006)

I'm a bit like Shiggy. I've got a Semi MX...

I find it can get warm on long climbs and I do sweat a bit more on the multi-hour rides than I did with my previous "normal" mtb helmet. That being said, the Semi also does duty for me in the winter and doesn't need a cover to keep me warm...plus I don't get my shaved head sunburnt through all the vent holes in the summer.

If you have a helmet, wear it...the best helmet is the one you'll wear.


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## GorillaTactics (Nov 12, 2006)

thanks for the replies.

I'll probably try out the lid and see if I get way too hot-if so I can always look into one of the spaceship models. Not that it really matters how I look-meeting ladies while I'm out riding is a struggle since I'm usually sweaty and bleeding...

Either way, I'll have something on. I've stacked hard enough times riding street to know that I want a helmet on pretty much full time.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

I'm not going to preach what helmet to wear, just that I think something is better than nothing. But just so you know, the test standards for skate helmets and bike helmets are different.

I know that one of the design dilemmas of bike helmets vs. skate helmets is that they figure falling and possibly hitting your head is felt to be a regular occurance when skating or skateboarding so they design skater helmets to be good for more than one crash. But, they may not offer the same level of protection that a bike helmet would in a typical cycling type crash.

In case you really do want to know more:

http://www.helmets.org/dualcert.htm

http://www.smf.org/

http://www.smf.org/standards/n94/n94.html

http://www.bhsi.org/testing.htm

Do a search and you can find enough reading material to bore you to tears, but it's good to be an informed consumer.

Regards,
Jeff


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## bigpedaler (Jan 29, 2007)

i personally wear bell (retiring my influx to go to a slant), but if you want the lesser ventilation of a skate helmet, roll it! 4x champ brian lopes does.


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

jeffj said:


> I'm not going to preach what helmet to wear, just that I think something is better than nothing. But just so you know, the test standards for skate helmets and bike helmets are different.
> 
> I know that one of the design dilemmas of bike helmets vs. skate helmets is that they figure falling and possibly hitting your head is felt to be a regular occurance when skating or skateboarding so they design skater helmets to be good for more than one crash. But, they may not offer the same level of protection that a bike helmet would in a typical cycling type crash.
> ...


Well, the OP wrote


> my bucket of choice is just a basic skate/_*BMX*_ lid.


Which tells me it is a bike helmet.









This $21 "skate/BMX" helmet is marketed for bicycle use so it must meet the same impact standards as a $130 Xen. It may even provide more protection as it covers more of the skull and in areas that are not tested for impact.


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## dusthuffer (Nov 30, 2006)

shiggy said:


> ... In a hot (85*) sunny 12hr event (solo) ...


I wonder what it would be like to live where 85 is considered hot?
It felt like 85 in Brentwood this afternoon and this is supposed to be winter.
I couldn't wear my fullface for more than 2 minutes without a waterfall of sweat pouring out of it.


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## Sixty Fiver (Apr 10, 2006)

I have two helmets...A Bell Relay for road riding and a Garneau BMX helmet for off road adventures and commuting.

The Garneau is weightier and not as well vented as the Bell but I love the spider lock, the perfect fit, and the sense of security it offers.

The Bell sees use when I'm road riding and I used it off road on a few occasions last year when it was really hot.


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## updownride (May 17, 2006)

semi mx or a pro tec ace dig - I like a visor to help keep sun out of eyes or rain off my glasses.


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## frisky_zissou (Jun 4, 2006)

I ride my skate helmet for everything i dont use a full face for. Its more comfortable (my opinion), doesnt move around an wobble and i dont feel like i look funny (also my opinion).

It does get hot but then i just take it off for a minute. pour some water on my head and im ready to go for another hour.

I like the look of that fox helmet alot


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## akashra (Dec 30, 2006)

GorillaTactics said:


> After going to the LBS and checking out some of the "mountain biking" helmets, I'm wondering if there's a reason I can't just wear my lid riding my AM bike-the MTB helmets are just so damn GOOFY looking. Plus they just feel kind of weird after wearing something so low profile for so long.


I'd rather look goofy wearing whatever than look goofy with the top half of my head flapping open, and/or lying on the ground dead.

Wear what you have to, but choosing to wear nothing is just proving how silly the helmet law is - a law designed to protect a brain functioning so poorly, it's not even trying to stop the cracking of the head that it's in.


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## coldawg (May 19, 2006)

the problem i had w/ my Giro Semi MX was that although it fit, it relied only on teh chinstrap to hold it in place, and could wobble around a bit and come displaced on a hard crash

My Specialized Instinct helmet, similar to the Flux and the Xen in terms of a more stealthy, all-mountain design that is between a roadie/xc helemt and a skate helmet, is far more protective in my opinion.

The fit systems on those helmets relies on a retension device that wraps around your head, as well as a chinstrap, and will keep the helmet in place during a crash

Also the in-mold design of the shell is said to be safer than the polystyrene foam of a skate helmet for mountain bike crashes.

They also provide about as much coverage as a skate helmet and are far more ventilated.

I love my Instinct, check it out at specialized.com

Everyone's head is different though, so try on the various all-mountain kind of helmets before you buy, seeing as each brand will fit differently


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## Psycho Mike (Apr 2, 2006)

I've got a larger head and I find that the Semi fits me perfectly. 

Though....if I keep pushing myself (I actually armor up sometimes when I figure I'll be pushing it a bit more), I may go to a Pryme A1...supposed to be farily cool (temp) for a full face.


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

coldawg said:
 

> the problem i had w/ my Giro Semi MX was that although it fit, it relied only on teh chinstrap to hold it in place, and could wobble around a bit and come displaced on a hard crash.
> 
> My Specialized Instinct helmet, similar to the Flux and the Xen in terms of a more stealthy, all-mountain design that is between a roadie/xc helemt and a skate helmet, is far more protective in my opinion.
> 
> The fit systems on those helmets relies on a retension device that wraps around your head, as well as a chinstrap, and will keep the helmet in place during a crash.


The Semi fits my head well enough it does not NEED a "head clamp" to stay in place. Most other helmets designs are cut so high a clamp is _*required*_ to keep them on even if you just nod your head.



> Also the in-mold design of the shell is said to be safer than the polystyrene foam of a skate helmet for mountain bike crashes.


News to me. Both types of helmets use polystyrene foam for shock absorption. The main difference is the outer shell. The thin shell used for the in-molded designs is mainly for weight reduction, protection of the foam from minor bumps and lastly helps hold the foam together in a crash impact. The thick hard shell of a skate/BMX piss pot is heavy, spreads the impact more broadly to the foam and reduces the change of objects penetrating (there is a reason motorsport helmets use thick hard shells).



> They also provide about as much coverage as a skate helmet and are far more ventilated.


Wrong! Not even close. Shows you have not tried them on back-to-back. Nearly any piss pot helmet extends several inches lower than a helmet with a "head clamp." In fact they extend lower than the "head clamp" itself!



> I love my Instinct, check it out at specialized.com
> 
> Everyone's head is different though, so try on the various all-mountain kind of helmets before you buy, seeing as each brand will fit differently


BINGO! Fit is ALL important. And for a helmet to fit well and perform properly it needs to fit your head without needing a lot of added pads or tightening the "head clamp" too much.


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## TrekJeff (Oct 12, 2006)

Just wear something that gives your skull a chance. Other wise you may get the first hand knowledge of the definition of _subdermal hematoma, inner cranial hemmorage, stage 2 comma_ Been there done all that. I wear a helmet changing a tire in my garage...ok, not to that extent, but I'm an advocate.


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## RED5 (Jan 4, 2004)

Cool thread, but all this talk about *Semi's* has reminded me I need to refill my Viagra prescrition. (jk)

Seriously, wear what you want and feel most comfortable in. If it works for you that all that matter. As long as your wearing a helmet, that's all that matters, Like others have pointed out, there are alot of good skate styled MTB helmets being made now, so you may want to check them out. Here's a couple others that may not have been posted...

ProTec Ace Dig









Giro Xen


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## romar (Sep 16, 2006)

shiggy said:


> BINGO! Fit is ALL important. And for a helmet to fit well and perform properly it needs to fit your head without needing a lot of added pads or tightening the "head clamp" too much.


Much agreed. You are probably better off with a less protective helmet that fits correctly than "better" helmet that bounces around on your melon. Not to mention that an improperly fitted helmet is quite annoying on rides. I had a tough time finding a good fitting MTB helmet until last season one of my LBS introduced me to the Bell Faction. BTW Shiggy thanks for the url tip!:thumbsup:


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## GorillaTactics (Nov 12, 2006)

akashra said:


> I'd rather look goofy wearing whatever than look goofy with the top half of my head flapping open, and/or lying on the ground dead.
> 
> Wear what you have to, but choosing to wear nothing is just proving how silly the helmet law is - a law designed to protect a brain functioning so poorly, it's not even trying to stop the cracking of the head that it's in.


Huh? Did you even read this thread?


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## SuperNewb (Mar 6, 2004)

Like others said wear what you like. As for myself on the trails I wouldnt want to feel just how hot an egg lid would get my head compared to my Giro E2.


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## Karupshun (Jun 13, 2006)

I quit using regular mountain bike helmets a while ago. I stopped feeling like the helmet was actually going to do something

I've been riding with a Giro Remedy FF mostly. I've had really good luck with my Remedy's flow through ventilation so far. Thinking about getting one of these for the city/hot days. 









from Pricepoint description
New designed heat sucking ventilation system pushes the air from the front to the back to pull the heat away from your head. TSG have added pre-molded padding for easy adjustment and insane comfort.

I think the Evel Knievel/Super Dave theme is


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## jp3d (Oct 9, 2004)

Anyone know if you can still get the Giro Semi MX anywhere? I'd like to get one or something similar for commuting with (hard plastic shell for durability and good venting).


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

jp3d said:


> Anyone know if you can still get the Giro Semi MX anywhere? I'd like to get one or something similar for commuting with (hard plastic shell for durability and good venting).


The Semi has been discontinued but it is basically the same helmet as the Nine.9 snow helmet (seem to have dropped the MX version, though). Just detail differences.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

What do you care what other people think about what you wear?


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## campisi (Dec 20, 2004)

Wear whatever you like or don't wear any helmet at all - just remember the most important thing is how cool you look out there.


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## Karupshun (Jun 13, 2006)

Jim311 said:


> What do you care what other people think about what you wear?


c'mon you can't tell me you don't like to look decent when you ride and are seen?

my first helmet as a kid came years before they were mandatory here in B.C. It didn't help it was a *LIME GREEN* spaulding unit. Lots of pointing and laughing

Now they don't laugh as much


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

Karupshun said:


> c'mon you can't tell me you don't like to look decent when you ride and are seen?
> 
> my first helmet as a kid came years before they were mandatory here in B.C. It didn't help it was a *LIME GREEN* spaulding unit. Lots of pointing and laughing
> 
> Now they don't laugh as much


Typically I'm out in the woods riding with my friends anyway, and anybody who judges me based upon what I'm wearing is no friend of mine. Aesthetic appeal is entirely secondary to me. Maybe you value other people's opinions a bit more than I do.


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## Karupshun (Jun 13, 2006)

Jim311 said:


> Typically I'm out in the woods riding with my friends anyway, and anybody who judges me based upon what I'm wearing is no friend of mine. Aesthetic appeal is entirely secondary to me. Maybe you value other people's opinions a bit more than I do.


after reading a few of your other posts and your build, I smell a hint of hypocrisy


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## Derrie (Sep 7, 2006)

Wearing a skate lid is no problem, it may be a bit hot (depending on where you live) Heat is not exactally a big problem in Edmonton, Canada where i live. I ride with my Giro Remedey. its white so it doesn't absorb heat and is nice and breezy. If you want to look cool while riding AM try out a full face. Do Not Buy A Black One, You Will Overheat Very Quickly!


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

Karupshun said:


> after reading a few of your other posts and your build, I smell a hint of hypocrisy


I'd like an explanation for this, especially based on my posts here at MTBR.


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## SnowMongoose (Feb 18, 2007)

helmets are a good idea.

Jim: the winking smiley means he is kidding.


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## GorillaTactics (Nov 12, 2006)

Went on a particularly badass ride today on some local trails and rode with the lid. Didn't even notice it was there, which is the point I guess. 

Of course, it was 65 degrees and perfect outside today, I may be singing a different tune when summer comes and it gets super hot. I tried on a few MTB helmets at my LBS, none of them seemed to fit as comfortably as my lid-although that Fox helmet looks promising. I will have an opportunity to check one of those out soon-i may have to pick one of those bad boys up before summertime (not to mention I sweat even more riding trails than street/DJ-I bet the pads on my lid will be quite funky before too long. 

Thanks for the feedback guys.

Oh yeah, as a side note, everybody cares on some level what they look like riding, no matter whether they admit it or not. There are certainly varying degrees- but if it weren't for caring what people thought, we would still be riding around in Day-Glo spandex. Wear watcha like. For me it's a DJ lid, baggies, and some kind of dri-fit layer that is NOT a tight-ass "cycling jersey".


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Derrie said:


> ... Do Not Buy A Black One, You Will Overheat Very Quickly!


It has been shown that the helmet color makes little difference in heat gain. The styrofoam is a insulator and prevents the heat transfer to the head.


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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

"Do Not Buy A Black One, You Will Overheat Very Quickly!"
*Ahhh its all in your "head".........:*D


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## Warp (May 24, 2004)

As others mention, use whatever you'd like to wear and fits comfortably.

The cheaper the better... All helmets have to pass the same impact tests. If you like a Xen or something "cool looking" it's fine... but it will protect you just as fine as a cheapo 20 bucks one.

I for one, have to give another vote to the Semi-MX from Giro... it'd be selling very good would they be still making it. They should feel a bit dumb for pulling it outta the market right when people started asking for a similarly spec'ed helmet.

BTW... I live and ride in Mexico City where we have no temps under 30F and it easily hits over 100F.

As others have mentioned, "vents" expose your head to sunlight, while styrofoam isolate it from sun. The Semi-MX has a nice balance being somehow "closed" for some people, but it let's your head cool while still being properly protected from sun.

When I looked for it, I wanted something with more protection than a regular MTB helmet and it had to look cool. The Semi-MX was a no-brainer. The other option was the twice as expensive Xen.

Also, the fact that a helmet has lots of "vents" doesn't mean air will flow through them... My former helmet (Vigor, don't ask) had far more vents than the Semi-MX, but air would flow through it just if I had my head aiming at an inclination that would not allow to see the trail ahead just right.

Oh... And a buddy of mine swears by his sk8/BMX lid... his point is that those are made tougher and the visor rests you visibility when you're pointing DH and you need to see far ahead (when you're hauling arse down a hill)... He may have a point, but I still prefer the Semi-MX.


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## jeffj (Jan 13, 2004)

Warp said:


> As others mention, use whatever you'd like to wear and fits comfortably.
> 
> The cheaper the better... All helmets have to pass the same impact tests. If you like a Xen or something "cool looking" it's fine... but it will protect you just as fine as a cheapo 20 bucks one.
> .


They pass the same tests, but that is a minimum standard. We really have no way of knowing it offers the "same" level of protection. For all I know it may offer more protection, then again, maybe not. However, the certification only guarantees a minimum standard.

Regards,
Jeff


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## Warp (May 24, 2004)

jeffj said:


> They pass the same tests, but that is a minimum standard. We really have no way of knowing it offers the "same" level of protection. For all I know it may offer more protection, then again, maybe not. However, the certification only guarantees a minimum standard.
> 
> Regards,
> Jeff


There's a whole argument about it, where not even standard-makers agree...

Just an example, Snell is trying to push a standard that "offers more protection" but some specialists believe that making the helmet so hard to accomplish these standards may lead to brain damage as the energy of the impact would be transferred to the brain.

As this link states, a higher price doesn't mean more/better impact protection... Check it


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