# New Bike or Take on a Project Bike?



## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Looking for some technical advice as well as opinions if a project will be worth it...

I currently own a 2017 Scott Genius 710 Contessa Plus (purchased in 2016) as well as a 2019 Bronson CC XTR (purchased in 2020 2nd hand). Since I got the Bronson, I have ridden it pretty much exclusively....its amazing. But for my local trails it's a bit overkill for my 5'5", 135 lb size. I ride New England trails, so huge mix of roots, rocks, twisty, flat, hilly...everything. The Bronson is over kill for at least 50% of the trails I ride regularly. Those trails would favor a smaller travel, more efficient climb, XC/Trail bike rather than an enduro-style bike.

So, why not just ride the Scott? Well, first off it's a 2x, which complicates the cockpit situation while having a dropper, nothing can be set up the same as the Bronson, which makes things really annoying (dropper on the wrong side being the biggest annoyance). Which comes to my first technical question, can I upgrade to a 1x11 (or 12) without changing the freehub? I seem to be finding conflicting advice online (which might be due to a difference in the answer for road vs. mtb). The Genius has a Shimano FH-M618-B CL free hub. 

Second upgrade I'd like to put on the Genius would be a new fork and shock (if this becomes cost prohibitive, I'll get both existing shocks serviced, and upgrade at a future date). Anyone have experience with putting a coil on a Genius? I know this probably won't help with the climbing aspect I'm trying to improve...but I've really liked the feel of a coil on freeride bikes in the past and am really tempted to try one out on a trail bike. 

So after changing the drivetrain and the shocks, I'm also considering a 29" wheel or wheels. Considering going with a mullet 29" front to help with rollover capabilities, but still having the rowdiness that the 27.5" provides in the back. Thoughts? Terrible idea, it'll never work. Or could be fun? I could also just switch to the "long" setting for the rear axel, and go full 29". 

Now to get to the second part of my question...will this ^^^ all be worth it, or should I just sell the Genius and buy a trail bike. Specifically, I'm looking at the Santa Crux Tallboy XT build, or the Juliana Joplin (same bike, different saddle, handlebars, grips and shock tune)...which ever becomes available at my LBS first. 

Thanks all for reading this long winded post. Looking forward to hearing some opinions and thoughts on my first world problems.


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## Mike Aswell (Sep 1, 2009)

Not to not answer most of your questions, but I would be careful with the entire premise this is based on. 150 of rear travel is right in the range I would prefer for a trail bike for NE. I'd keep the Bronson. LOL.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Mike Aswell said:


> Not to not answer most of your questions, but I would be careful with the entire premise this is based on. 150 of rear travel is right in the range I would prefer for a trail bike for NE. I'd keep the Bronson. LOL.


haha! Valid consideration. The Bronson is staying regardless. The thought has come to mind to "just keep one bike to do it all". But I think I want something a bit more efficient for longer climbs and smoother tracks as well.


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## Cary (Dec 29, 2003)

Both bikes serve similar purposes, the difference is your Bronson has a few more years of geometry evolution and is not a plus bike. If you want to experiment with your current bike you can do the following:

Get a 30 or 32 tooth narrow wide front chainring, replace the dual chainrings you have now, remove the shifter and front derailer. You will want to shorten your chain length when you do this (easy way, remove the number of links that equal the number of fewer teeth the new chainring is from your old large chainring). You now have a 1x11. Want more gear ratio, you can get an 11-46 cassette. 
Get a dropper lever to replace the front shifter. 
Service the suspension- You bike is not designed for a coil and will not perform well with it. 
Replace the tires with some 2.6s (it looks like your rims are 35mm width, but it doesn't say if that is internal or external, regardless 2.6s will work well on them). 
For not much money you will make the bike a 1x11 that feels snapper more responsive. If after you do that, you don't enjoy it, then time to start looking at something like a Tallboy, Ripley, Transition Spur, or other 120mm bike.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Cary said:


> Get a 30 or 32 tooth narrow wide front chainring, replace the dual chainrings you have now, remove the shifter and front derailer. You will want to shorten your chain length when you do this (easy way, remove the number of links that equal the number of fewer teeth the new chainring is from your old large chainring). You now have a 1x11. Want more gear ratio, you can get an 11-46 cassette.


I will need to replace the cassette in order to get a 1x11, it currently is 2x10. An 11 speed Shimano cassette will be compatible with the Deore hub I have? 

Great call on moving this around first...then dealing with shocks/wheels if it's what I want it to be. 

I actually did replace my tires with 2.6s. Definitely helped with efficiencies, and I really enjoy how they ride on that bike.


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## Cary (Dec 29, 2003)

If you want1x11 you will also need to change the derailleur and shifter. Double check to make sure you have 10 speed as Scott says that bike is 2x11. It is much cheaper and easier to use a wide range 10 speed cassette. Sunrace and Shimano make 11-42 10 speed cassettes.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Yup, it's definitely a 10 speed cassette. Must be a typo from Scott.

So I could change the 10-speed "normal" cassette to a wide range 10-speed cassette, change out the front chain ring, remove the front shifter, move my dropper lever to the "correct" side, and call it good...

If I want to use an 11 speed cassette, I need to add a new cassette, change rear shifter, and new derailer to the mix.

Service the shock and fork...and I think that's a solid first step to determining if I want to keep or sell the bike.


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## eshew (Jan 30, 2004)

If you want to go 1X if you have a shimano 9 or 10 speed you can use a Shimano 11 speed on your existing wheel/hub. As stated above, just need 11 speed shifters adn rear D

If you're going to upgrade the fork & shock look at the used market. Will be much less expensive.

Don't go Mullet.

Is it worth it? Depends, it's your money & your bike... Honestly I'd just jump to 11 speed & service the front and rear shocks and maybe do a fresh retune of the suspension settings.


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## Cary (Dec 29, 2003)

tugboater said:


> Yup, it's definitely a 10 speed cassette. Must be a typo from Scott.
> 
> So I could change the 10-speed "normal" cassette to a wide range 10-speed cassette, change out the front chain ring, remove the front shifter, move my dropper lever to the "correct" side, and call it good...
> 
> ...


You have it. With the 10 speed wide and chainring, you will be in less than $120 or so. Suspension service depends on who does it.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

eshew said:


> Don't go Mullet.


Just curious...why not? 

(I have no baseline as I've never actually ridden a mixed wheel)


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Cary said:


> Sunrace and Shimano make 11-42 10 speed cassettes.


When digging around and exploring this option, I see a few options for 46T or even 48T...Shimano or Microshift. Any experience with going that wide of a range with only 10 speeds? Seems like it might create some huge jumps in gears, but curious on real-world experience (they seem to get good reviews).


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## Cary (Dec 29, 2003)

tugboater said:


> When digging around and exploring this option, I see a few options for 46T or even 48T...Shimano or Microshift. Any experience with going that wide of a range with only 10 speeds? Seems like it might create some huge jumps in gears, but curious on real-world experience (they seem to get good reviews).


You need to have a derailleur compatible with that large of a cassette, yours is probably not.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Reading into derailleur's maximum cassette size, I found this in regards to the model on my bike (from Shimano's website):










Does this essentially mean that a 36T is the maximum size I can go with that derailleur? Is there any wiggle room in manufacturer's spec here?


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## eshew (Jan 30, 2004)

tugboater said:


> Just curious...why not?
> 
> (I have no baseline as I've never actually ridden a mixed wheel)


Sorry, it would be fine.... missed the fact that it was a 27.5+ bike. Was thinking it was just a regular 27.5 with my initial comment


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## dllawson819 (Feb 22, 2019)

tugboater said:


> Yup, it's definitely a 10 speed cassette. Must be a typo from Scott.
> 
> So I could change the 10-speed "normal" cassette to a wide range 10-speed cassette, change out the front chain ring, remove the front shifter, move my dropper lever to the "correct" side, and call it good...
> 
> ...


I think you're onto a good plan. Unless you have new bike fever, updating an older bike is probably the best bang for the buck.

Regarding 1x10: My previous bike was a converted 1x10 and my current bike is 1x11. You shouldn't notice much difference as long as you set your gearing up correctly. There are calculators online that will help determine the best cassette and chainring combo for your riding. I ran a Wolftooth Giant Cog and Goatlink. You may still be able to find one, if you can't find a 10 spd cassette with the range you like.

Regarding suspension service and mullet conversion: Have you looked at the Scott sub-forums to see what other riders have done to your bike? Ibis riders can't seem to leave well enough alone, so there is an abundance of information on those bikes, but I'm not sure about Scott. Is there a different shock that people claim "brings the bike to life?" Do people prefer the slacker geometry of a 150mm fork and/or an angleset? Has anyone done a mullet conversion and do they like it? 

If you can't find any information on the sub-forum, I would start with a proper service on the shock. 

If you have the money and like to tinker, I would probably look for a decent deal on a used 130mm 29" fork and front wheel to try the mullet set up. If you buy used and don't like it, you should be able to get most of your money back out of it.
If you don't want to fool with a mullet conversion, I would get a proper service on the fork and try to get the travel extended to 150mm.


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## dllawson819 (Feb 22, 2019)

tugboater said:


> Reading into derailleur's maximum cassette size, I found this in regards to the model on my bike (from Shimano's website):
> 
> View attachment 1986773
> 
> ...


This is were a Wolftooth GoatLink comes in: GoatLink


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

Awesome thoughts dllawson on checking the Scott forum…last I checked it wasn’t very active…but that was years ago now. I’ll dig around and see what I can find.

I’m regards to the mullet conversion, it is a plus bike. So theoretically, I can slap a 29er on there as it is…should be easy to find out if I like it or not. I can probably steal my husband’s wheel for a ride and see how it goes. It’s definitely the least expensive trial and error of the changes I’m considering.

Thanks for the Wolftooth link…I’ll probably end up there so I can expand my gear range. I’m liking the coverage of a 30T chainring and a 11-48T, but it the gears do have a decent jump between them…not sure if I’m trying to cover too much range on 10 speeds or not.


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## FrankS29 (Oct 23, 2019)

I think the gear jumps is a legit concern in the Northeast. A lot of our riding is so varied and rolling terrain that I've noticed large gear jumps pretty easily before. 

If you live in an area that most of your riding is winching up a fire road and bombing down trail, gear jumps are not as big of a deal, IMO. 

Personally, I think an efficient mid travel (120-130) bike is darn near perfect for the North East. Sure, some trails can benefit from a larger bike, but unless you happen to live near those trail systems a modern geo mid travel trail bike will probably serve you better.


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## dllawson819 (Feb 22, 2019)

I found some additional info on the gearing for my 1x10 conversion if your thinking about going this route. I bought the bike used and rode it the first year with Shimano XTR 3x10 components and an 11-36T cassette.

For the 1x conversion, I used a new XT 11-36T cassette with a Wolftooth 40T GC, 16T cog*, and GoatLink. I also used a Wolftooth 32T oval chainring on my existing crankset. *The 16T cog replaces two cogs in the XT cassette to ease shifting jumps. Wolftooth no longer has all of these parts on their website, but you should still be able to find them for sale at various sites online.

I used an online gear calculater to determine the ratio for the largest cog I regularly used in the 3x10 setup. In my case, I rarely used the two largest cogs because I couldn't generate enough power to complete a technical climbing move. 

I was very pleased with the 1x10 conversion and regularly used all of my gears on a ride - or - there were very few times I wished I had a larger or smaller cog. I didn't really have a bail out gear, but knew I could have put on a 30T chainring if I needed to.


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## tugboater (Apr 14, 2013)

I ordered some parts last night after analyzing lots of gearing calculators over the past couple days (I liked this visual representation best...Bicycle Gear Calculator (gear-calculator.com) ). Purchasing individual cogs with a cassette was not on my radar. Great thought, and definitely something I'll look at further if I'm not pleased with my current planned conversion. 

I decided to go for a wide range 10 speed...between the options I found available (Microshift, Sunrace and Shimano) I liked the gear ratios of the Shimano best, so ended up ordering an M4100. I'm pairing that with a Race Face 30T chainring and a Goatlink which seems like it'll get a good compromise in gearing.

I'll make these changes, ride the Genius more and make a decision on selling the bike or making more changes. For about $100, even if I end up selling the bike, I think it will be much more attractive on the market as a 1x.


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## prj71 (Dec 29, 2014)

I'm disappointed with all of you guys. N + 1 should have been everyone's answer. Rule #12.


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## ashwinearl (Jan 2, 2004)

I think a -1 or -1.5 angleset is a fun experiment. I did it on my 2018 Rocky Mountain Altitude XS (5'4" very short torso, riding in upstate NY so some similarities in terrain). 

You get small amount of the benefits of the modern geos w/o the downside of the long reaches. Which I think are a real concern for people our size. The benefit is longer front center/slacker head tube w/o significnat slackening of seat tube.

If you could though, new bike seems better choice given the gearing issues you are trying to overcome. I'd also be concerned with any change of the front ring, as this impacts the suspension curve the bike was designed around. 

There are few bikes on my radar in XS/S. New 2023 Trek Fuel EX in XS looks very promising, XS Trek top fuel with long shock, XS or S Pivot Shadowcat, new Juliana in mullet as stock form, Stumpy Carbon in S1 (29er), Rocky Mountain instinct in 27.5


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

tugboater said:


> Just curious...why not?
> 
> (I have no baseline as I've never actually ridden a mixed wheel)


Your bike isn’t built for it, and you’ll need a new front wheel, a new shorter fork, and a new front tire. It’ll most likely throw off the geometry of the bike (specifically the seat angle) that makes it not fun to climb. I know because i did this. If you want a mullet, buy a bike designed for a mullet set up.


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