# Southern Cal Tandem Teams



## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

We are about 2 months on our new ECDM and loving it. How about getting a So.Cal.ride going? We were riding Chino Hills today and saw another team for the first time up there. We ride there about 3-4 times a week in Chino Hills. Need a break, to go somewhere else. Who was up there today? Love to hook up....


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## Mtn-Tandem (Sep 11, 2008)

Hey Bill. We were in the CHSP today on our yellow Cannondale. I'd love to get some tandem rides going like the group rides we did back in the 90's


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

We passed each other on Telegraph but it was a freeway there. Did we ride together in the 90's....That was good times. Well we are back on the trail after 12 years off. Tandem and I also go solo...


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## Mtn-Tandem (Sep 11, 2008)

I saw you guys on the trail, but with all the solo riders that you had around you, it made for a bad place to stop. I don't get into CHSP much with the tandem, but ride the Fullerton loop on it often. I also ride CHSP solo, but try to stay clear of telegraph as much as possible. It'd be great to be able to get some tandem rides set up sometime. By the way that's a nice looking bike!


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Bill, let's add Mark and Cat in Simi Valley, Jeff and his wife in Redlands, Patrick and Maria in Fullerton, and myself and my wife out here in Thousand Oaks. That's all I know, but it was more than I knew about a few months ago.

Patrick mentioned looking to bring you guys out here for a city-to-sea ride in Sycamore.:thumbsup:


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

I'm a Fullerton Loop local. Our tandem is getting closer to completion. With the rest of the details and work travel, we should be hittin' the trails in about 2 months.

I've seen Jeff and his wife from Redlands ride up at Kernville - that team rocks!


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

I was checking out that Sycamore ride after we rode at Chesebrough, looks great. Let us know. We will roll


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, we were out at Sycamore canyon Riverside on Sunday and did Peters canyon on Saturday. Most all of the places around are ride able on the tandem. Most of the trails we even pull Adam on his bike.
I just rode Santiago Oaks on my single last week and the new trails look like they would be a blast on the big bikes. Some other places we've ridden are Aliso, El Moro, Turnbull, Whiting (Whiting to the Luge was a kick), Bonelli, Cheesbro, Sycamore Canyon (Pt. Mugu). 
We just set up our sitter to watch Adam one Saturday every month so we can get out on the bike and not have to pull him up some of the hills, unfortunatly our Feburary date is this weekend (the 19th) and it looks like rain......maybe next month. 
The only thing to worry about is crowds. The big bikes attract them, a group of big bikes more so.
BTW what trails do you ride out at Chino, maybe you coould show us around sometime?
Anyway keep us in mind, we'd love to meet up again.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Oh I almost forgot, 
Hey Blaster your tandem is looking nice......
Let us know when you're ready to take it out on its maiden Loop voyage!


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Patrick,sorry I forgot that there is two different Sycamore's. I was referring to the one out by Julian's, that one looks nice. Don't know much about the Riverside one. Let us know when you want to ride CHSP, it is limited unless you climb some pretty good hills. We have been doing CHSP about 4 days a week.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

*SC Tandems*

Hi All,

My stoker wife and I have a ECDM. We are in Aliso and ride many trails in our area including: Aliso Woods, Nix, Quail Hill, Laguna Wilderness, El Moro, Whiting, Santiago Truck Trail, Luge, Harding, and Maple Springs. We also do quite a few rides with the Irvine Conservancy. We would love to hook up with some other Tandem teams for group outings. :thumbsup: Let me know when the gang is getting together.

Paul


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Blaster1200 said:


> I'm a Fullerton Loop local. Our tandem is getting closer to completion. With the rest of the details and work travel, we should be hittin' the trails in about 2 months.
> 
> I've seen Jeff and his wife from Redlands ride up at Kernville - that team rocks!


Blaster, I have to ask, is that a frame you built or bought and modified for rear disc and big fork.

Just not sure what you have and will be embarrassed for not knowing.

Looks steel, probably welded and smoothed. The long diagonal wants me to say it an Ibis, but they all seem to run a full length top tube.

So what gives, did you post about it before and I didn't pay attention?

PK


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## Ciclistagonzo (Dec 10, 2001)

PMK said:


> Blaster, I have to ask, is that a frame you built or bought and modified for rear disc and big fork.
> 
> Just not sure what you have and will be embarrassed for not knowing.
> 
> ...


Take a look at this thread in the Frame Building Forum.

Post #2.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=686129

Looks like his own creation, pretty cool.


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

PMK, as Ciclistagonzo indicated, it's my own creation. The frame is fillet-brazed chromoly. I still have a few more details to finish (the braze-ons are mostly complete), but I'm leaving on a business trip, so I won't get the frame to the powder coater until the first week of April. I'm super excited to see it almost completed!


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey All, we have a sitter lined up for Saturday 3/19 and was wondering if anybody wanted to get together for a ride? We were thinking somewhere local to OC, maybe Aliso or something? Our sitter is scheduled for 8:00am and we are in Fullerton so we were thinking maybe 9:00am start time? Let me know, also Aliso isn't set in stone so if you have any ideas I'd like to hear them.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Sorry, we won't be able.Out of town, hopefully next time.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Will run it by my stoker.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Well, I'll post again next month to see if we can get a few tandems together in OC when we have the sitter.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Just wanted to say our ride yesterday was a blast. We were able to take the big bike over to Santiago Oaks and ride. Wow, this place is a blast. The new trail work has made this park very tandem friendly. We highly recommend it.


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

Ah, bummed we missed this. Haven't logged in a while, guess I need to check the forums more often! We're in for the next one assuming we're free.

Jeff & Katie


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Sorry for the last minute on this.....
We've got a sitter again for this Saturday April 16th. 
Does anybody want to get big bikes together for a ride? We were thinking about riding Santiago Oaks @ Irvine Regonial Park. We took the tandem there last month and had a blast, there is a ton of single track and you'll be able to practice your switchback turns.
This is just an idea, if you have any other ideas let us know. 
We're looking at a 8:30-9:00ish ride start. Parking would be @ IRP and cost $5.

Patrick & Maria


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Sorry again, we will be up at Sea Otter Classic. Spectating,shopping,camping and a lil pleasure riding.Any other teams going for fun?


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, I knew that you guys were going to be at Sea Otter... I wish we were going too! Maybe next year. It is a fun time, enjoy.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

On a "Guadalasco Switchbacks" rating scale, where Guad switchbacks are a 6 of 10 (10 being a definite walker), what are the IRP switchbacks like? Any idea on the trail conditions? Still LOTS of water in the crossings at Sycamore, but otherwise the trails are dry.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Julian, I'd say that the switchbacks would be a 4 (maybe 5). Compared to Guadalasco the IRP(Santiago Oaks) trails are new so they don't have all of the rocks that Guad has, also they are a hair wider. We rode there last month the trails were great. Most of the trails are either new or reworked by a trail building company so they drain properly and don't get so tore up by the rain. Check out this thread from another site, it has some trail pics.
http://www.socaltrailriders.org/forum/ride-reports/55069-rethinking-oaks.html
So how's that new rig treating you guys?


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

We are tentatively in for Saturday's ride. Only variable is our truck just sprang a CE light. If it needs something serious, I'll have to deal with it over the weekend. If it is drivable, we'll be there. Will confirm in the next day or so. Trail photos look great. Be nice to ride without the water crossings.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Julian, that sounds great. I told Maria and she is excited to see you guys and the new bike. She told me she may have a couple of single bikes from her work join us but we'll just wait and see how things go. Good luck with that CE light.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

We'll be there. Do you have a meet spot in mind? We've never been to IRP. Confirming this is the place: 1 Irvine Park Rd, Orange, CA


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Yes, that is the correct address. Lets meet at parking lot #3, 8:30-9:00am. I'll send you a message with my #.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

*Oaks Switchbacks*

I went to Santiago Oaks this AM with my stoker and some single riders from work. I thought I might run into some tandems there. I did see two going up Coachwhip trail but we were at the bottom. Some single riders exclaimed how they couldn't believe there were so many MTB tandems. That was cool.

That was my first time at the Santiago Oaks. Man there are some tough switchbacks. Granted they are smooth but many were well beyond my riding ability. The ones down Chuttes seemed impossible to me.  The rest weren't too bad. I'll need to be sure to steer clear of the Guadalasco switchbacks if they are harder and tighter.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

oc-biker, we heard there was another tandem riding there today. Julian and Sally said they saw a red Ventana as they were coming into the park. We heard from a few other single bikes on the trail that there was another tandem out and we were looking for you but no luck. Sorry we missed you. It would have been fun to have 3 tandems together. I'll post something for a tandem ride next month when we have our sitter.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Some really nice riding at IRP Saturday. And a GREAT place to practice switchbacks. They were all tandemable as the trail building was nicely done, though it was helpful to follow a tandem up as I copied lines on a couple. OC, if you are the red Ventana, we saw you with some single bikes right as we entered the park. We kept crossing trails as we rode, figuring to run into you at some point.

Zibell and stoker are the king and queen of decending switchbacks, I had to use some serious rear brake to swing the bike around a couple of 'em. We even rode down the Chutes Ridge staircase, but no one else was around to witness. For sure challenging trails, but good stuff.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

Okayfine, we were on the red Ventana. Very impressed that you guys did all the switchbacks. I have much to learn on that technique. Maybe watching someone do it correctly would help. However, I'm not very good on switchbacks on my single either. 

I did see the more direct Chuttes or Old Chuttes as I think they call it. It looked like it might have some good sized drops on it so we went the easier twisty route. I still need to rig up a bottom tube bash guard. Mine is already scared from some rock drops in Idyllwild. It sure makes a horrible grinding sound as it hits/scapes. Were there any steep drops that caused you to scrape?

The 3Bs were aptly named. They kicked up pretty steep. My Garmin topped at 25% on the 2nd B. I think the first might have been even steeper but I was blacking out so I couldn't see the Garmin.  

BTW, what brand and model of tandems were you both riding?

See you on the trails next time.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Having someone lead you through some switchbacks may help, but practice is the only thing that will definitely help. 

Lines and methods differ for everyone, and for the different types of switchbacks. The stuff at IRP, I found success with a simple high-tempo granny gear run - just powering around it, maintaining momentum. One time I followed Patrick's line where he ran the front wide and up the high side, which was difficult but made all the difference. They're all generally wide enough not to need too much finesse by your stoker, which is one way IRP switches differ from, say, Guadalasco switches. There I need more communication with my stoker so she doesn't pour on the power until we're mostly around. But Guad also has some rocky switches, and almost all of them are tighter than IRP.

IRP has the best switchbacks for tandems that I've ridden.

We didn't hit the boom tube on anything. I will stop and walk anything that would threaten the bike or its riders. I'd also be more afraid of snapping the sync chain and the long walk back to the parking lot.

We have a coupled Ventana. Of the four other SoCal teams I know about (five including yourself, OC), everyone's on a Ventana...except, of course, for the fellow who built his own bike *cough cough*


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

OC, as Julian stated switchbacks are something that you need to practice at and find out what works best for you. Riding all the switchbacks we did Saturday really worked my upper body (shoulders & arms). We found that we start wide and cut it tight and when the front wheel is pointed up the trail I let my stoker "hit it" and she pours on the gas. Once the front wheel is pointing up the trail the rear end tends to just follow. On desending switchbacks I feather the front brake and keep the front wheel rolling and brake the rear and once the front is around and pointing down I can let off the brake and the rear follows. One thing I just thought was that Julian and I both ride a single crown fork, is your fork a single crown or double crown? I don't think that you can turn a double crown as tight. 
We were thinking about giving IRP a try with our son and his tag-a-long. For sure not riding down Cutes ridgeline. 
Let us know if you want to ride there again, we're always up for riding with another tandem. Julian and Sally are both strong riders, and we are old and slow but with some skill, we enjoy riding.
As for the 3B's, now that they have all the new trails we try to avoid the 3B's. There are so many other trails that you can link together and have a nice ride without suffering up the 3B's.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

zibell said:


> Julian and Sally are both strong riders, and we are old and slow but with some skill, we enjoy riding.


To be fair, we probably get out on the bike more often. We'd ridden every weekend for the past four, and added the Cheeseboro ride mid-week last week.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Ok guys, Nanci and I are always up for a challenge and willing to learn. The ride at IRP sounded great let us know when next venture. We might sneek over and practice since so close...But can you guide me to the switchback trail you are referring to, never been there.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

OK we set up our sitter for next month. We're set for Saturday May 21st. Does anybody want to get together the big bikes for a ride? I'd like to ride somewhere near OC as I don't want to be paying a sitter for driving somewhere. Last month we got together with Julian and Sally in Irvine Regional Park and had a blast. We could ride there again or Aliso, or El Moro, or Whiting Ranch? We meet around 8:30-9:00 depending where we go. Let me know what you think.

Bill IRP is a fun place to ride we rode a lot of the trails; Chutes, Coachwhip, Cactus Canyon, and Yucca were some of the trails I think Coachwhip had some of the best trails for practicing switchbacks not a lot of incline and a little wider turns.


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

zibell said:


> Coachwhip had some of the best trails for practicing switchbacks not a lot of incline and a little wider turns.


Not sure if this may help. Like anything, practice helps. It is awesome to have the trail to practice on but sometimes that's not possible.

As much of a goofball I am to ride with, we constantly practice as much as possible on silly things like parking lot stops, weaving in and around at slow speeds. Also, use the parking stops for practice getting over logs or small fallen trees.

For things like bridges or narrow sections, I may have us practice riding the edge of a sidewalk or something similar (wood chip border at a playground).

Then of course is the old standby, going slow without trackstanding, ride figuire 8s in the parking lot. Then work it in with the parking stops. If you choose a poor line, the back tire gets hung up.

We also try and mix up the trails. Sometimes long straight epic xc rides, others tight twisty singletrack (CLJ can back me up on the definition of tight), other days when possible we just climb and descend. We will even do night rides going backwards on empty trails so we have a new trail / challenge. But again, I take every opportunity to goof off and ride stupid silly stuff in parking lots or parks. It just helps.

Don't push the speed envelope until skills are adequate, other wise you may fall down, been there done that. Now we crash.

Have fun on your group ride.

PK


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

PK - you are correct as always with your advice. You don't need to practice on a trail. So of our best practice habits are also goofing around. Trackstands, tight turns around parking stops, hopping up and down curbs, and also riding over parking stops. Also talking - let you stoker know what you need them to do.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Thanks for the tips. We will be heading over to IRP tomorrow about 10:00am.Love new trails...


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Well, we made it over to IRP this morning, great ride but unsure if we went the correct way. Not many riders so it really didn't matter.Here was our path.....Parked at lot 3 and worked our way on Egret and then Pony. Unsure at this time which way, but when in doubt, climb. So we headed up Oak Trail and turned right on Bumble Bee to Coachwhip and then a right on Barham Ridge but somehow we ended up on Chutes Trail, unsure the order...We need a lot more work on descending the switchbacks but we handled the switchback climbs...We are planning on the 21st, hopefully you will take us back to your ride at IRP...


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, your request for IRP is perfect.

*Saturday May 21st meet at lot #3 between 8:30-9:00 ride approx. 3hrs*

oc-biker, drdoak, mtn-tandem, blaster if any of you are available we'd love to meet you and have bunch of tandems together for a fun ride. Show the half bikes what a tandem can do. Julian if you guys are up for another drive we'd love to ride with you again.

Hey Bill I'm not sure of all the trail names. Did you guys do the killer climb known as the 3 B's (steep-steep-steep) Bumble Bee cuts off to the right at the start of the 2nd pitch and goes up and over the hill. Anyway we're looking forward to next months ride. Let me know if you go back out there, I can propably meet you on my single. I can meet you around 9:00 and ride for a couple of hours on weekday mornings. Let me know!


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Just want to post a reminder about the ride we're doing this Saturday May 21st.

@ Irvine Regional Park (parking $5) meet at Lot #3 8:30 and roll out @ 9:00. 

The weather should be perfect for riding 70 & sunny, and the rains should pack down any dust. 
See you there!


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Sorry to miss another ride but our plans have recently changed. We will be out of town.Keep us posted


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## Rida29r (May 26, 2009)

Heads up for this ride....SHARE is hosting a poker ride from Irvine to Santiago Oaks (the other side of the dam with the 3 B's) It begins at 8 am...and they will be in the same parking lot as your meet up spot  We might come down with our Ells.

http://sharemtb.com/2011/04/29/please-sign-up-for-the-2011-share-mountain-bike-club-poker-ride/


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Rida29r - does this mean you're bringing that pretty Ells of yours out for some dirty fun? I'm not sure what kind of turnout to expect for this ride, it looks like everybody is backing out so we'll see who shows up. If nobody shows Maria & I will still have a blast, that's what it's about! 
I know the poker ride is going on, but the oaks has a lot of trails so it should be fine. The lot we're meeting at is a large lot and the reason I chose it is because there are restrooms for the last minute pre-ride pit stop.


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## Rida29r (May 26, 2009)

Well..."someone" just pulled their back out yesterday (not good), so I'm not sure riding will be part of the weekend now....and riding it by myself is just weird. Or....is it?  We've honestly never ridden Oaks on it....and yeh, ton of trails to ride besides. We usually start from the back side of Peters and ride into Irvine. If he's better, we'll be there!


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Unfortunately for us, my stoker is just getting over a cold. We're going to try a lightweight trip to the beach on Sunday, but probably wouldn't be able to keep up at IRP on Saturday. We'll shoot for next time. 

With this number of tandems in the area, we need to get everyone together!


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

Looks like we're also out.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

What a fun time Saturday. This month we had 3 tandems together for a ride around Santiago Oaks. It started with a full parking lot #3 but there were other lots close by and we all met up at lot #4. Tim & Hope on the Cannondale and Paul & Lisa on their Ventana ECDM along with Maria and I all had a fun time. Special props go out to Tim for his first ride back from a broken collarbone and 2 sprained wrists, great job Tim & Hope! Then we also had Paul & Lisa (team Sho-Air), "we like riding up the 3 B's", you 2 rock. The weather was nice and the trails were in great shape. The ride down Chutes ridgeline was a blast. The camera however, was left sitting on the kitchen counter( sorry no pictures). Maria and I are trying to get our schedule for next months sitter and then I'll post something for next month. We hope to see you next month.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

*Tandems Invade Santiago Oaks*

Big thanks for Patrick for setting the ride up. Having three tandems out in force was very cool. The ride coincided with the Poker ride so we received no shortage of surprised comments about what an MTB Tandem can do.

The Zirbell team opened our eyes to what's possible on the tandem too. Gave us the confidence to try a few things that we never would have otherwise. The Chutes downhill was a blast. Couldn't get the smile off my face all weekend. My stoker wants to go back and ride it again. Made more switchbacks than before but we still have a long way to go to equal the Zirbell teams switchback riding ability. I think I'll leave the log riding to you guys though.

Great job to Tim and Hope on doing that ride with no rear suspension, climbing without being clipped in (Hope), and Tim for recovering from injuries. You two kept up a good pace on a difficult route.

It was a great time. We look forward to doing it again. Maybe we'll break the record of 3 tandem teams next time.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Can't wait to join in. Keep us posted


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Sorry for the late post, but we have got a sitter for our son lined up for Saturday the 16th and we're wondering if anybody wants to get together for a tandem ride? Santiago Oaks is out as they are having a race there that day. We were thinking maybe Aliso or even Whiting-Mojeska-the Luge? Let me know, we're open to where ever, just trying to keep it local in OC area.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

405 is closed that weekend, so we probably won't be able to get anywhere near OC.:madman:


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

Hi Zirbell, 10 days is quite sufficient notice. However, we won't be able to make that day since I'll be in Santiago Oaks attending the inaugural Okole Stuff Cup Mountain Bike Race. 

I'll be on the single that day wishing I had another pair of legs to propel me up the climbs.  Have a great time on the MTB tandems. We'll try to join in on the next ride.


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

zibell said:


> Sorry for the late post, but we have got a sitter for our son lined up for Saturday the 16th and we're wondering if anybody wants to get together for a tandem ride? Santiago Oaks is out as they are having a race there that day. We were thinking maybe Aliso or even Whiting-Mojeska-the Luge? Let me know, we're open to where ever, just trying to keep it local in OC area.


Hi - looks like we'd be available the 16th for a ride. My vote would be Whiting-Mojeska-Luge. Have never been to Whiting and the Luge is a blast on a single, should be great on a tandem as well. I'm off work that morning at 7:00AM so we should be able to make an 8:00AM start or later. Thanks!

Jeff & Katie
Redlands


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hi Jeff, Whiting-Mojeska-Luge sounds great. Our sitter shows up @ 8:00am so we should be at Whiting about 8:30-8:45. The parking lot @ Whiting is on Portola Pkwy and is small, we have also parked across the street in the parking lot by McDonalds.


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

zibell said:


> Hi Jeff, Whiting-Mojeska-Luge sounds great. Our sitter shows up @ 8:00am so we should be at Whiting about 8:30-8:45. The parking lot @ Whiting is on Portola Pkwy and is small, we have also parked across the street in the parking lot by McDonalds.


Sounds good! We'll be there around 8:30, either at the parking lot at Portola or at the McDonalds if full. I'll PM you my cell #. What's the approximate mileage/climbing/time just so we can plan food? Thanks and see you Saturday, I'll post on STR to see if we can pick up a couple more tandems.


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

Thanks Patrick and Maria, fun times! Looking forward to the next ride.

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/99867148


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Thanks Jeff, you and Katie tore up that ride. Great job. The margaritas were pretty good also. Maybe next time we can take you guys back to Santiago Oaks.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

We just spoke with the sitter and have August 20th on the calender. We're going to be having a Birthday ride for Maria as she is turning ? So, Saturday August 20th tandem group ride. I'm thinking maybe back to Santiago Oaks, or Aliso Woods, or maybe El Moro? What do you guys think? 
We're heading up to Mammoth the 1st week in August so I won't be able to reply until after we get home.


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## Rida29r (May 26, 2009)

If the rain lets up....we'll be out there at 130 today (peters oaks irvine)


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

We're in :thumbsup: Keep us posted on location and time.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

We just got back from Mammoth and had a blast. One of the guys in the village at the bike park ticket sales told us we couldn't ride a tandem in Mammoth as the trails were not rideable on a tandem. Well we showed them, we rode some green(easy) and blue(more difficult) trails towing our son on his trail-a-bike and rode some black diamond trails minus our son......can't ride Mammoth? Our son tore up Mammoth! 
Julian, do you want to go back to Santiago Oaks @ IRP or would you like to try something else?


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Bravo, zibell. Not too big for the gondola? Cool.

I had some betty give us the same speil..."these trails are made for full suspension mountain bikes, blahblah..." Sounds like some perception issues we can collectively work on 

Next month I'll have a stoker and will hit you guys up for some trailage if you'll have us. We're in HB. Cheers...

Mike


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

IRP was fun. If you've got something else that's as much fun, we're totally open.

Anyone else planning on Saturday?


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Julian, I haven't heard of anyone else that has said they want to join in so how about Irvine Regional Park @ 8:30-8:45 @ at the same lot #3. Santiago Oaks was such a blast with you guys last time.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Done and done. We got a bigger pack with bigger bladder just for another IRP run. :thumbsup:


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## XC Mike (Sep 26, 2004)

ok must ask how tough is Oaks/IRP on a scale of 1-10
I am just getting back into riding after a few years off the bike and for the most time I ride with my 10 year old as my Stoker on a Hard Tail C-Dale with No Fork.......... :thumbsup:


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

> on a Hard Tail C-Dale with No Fork


what happened with the Judy?


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Tough to say without having a common trail to compare. IRP is either climbing or decending, but the climbs aren't bad, and there's only two brief "downhill" sections of note. LOTS of switchbacks, but they're generally wide enough to be no issue on a tandem - but they will give you lots of practice. Very much an XC type of trail system. Lots of single riders to cheer tandems they've never seen before.

Main downside in summer is that there's very little shade.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

XCMike, I'd say its probably a 100 on a scale of 1-10. I mean riding a wheelee up and down those switchbacks on a tandem with no fork would be tough even on a level street. 
No really we rode a couple of months ago with Tim and Hope on there C'dale hardtale with front suspension and they did great. On a scale of 1-10 I'd say maybe a 7. Its all rideable but as Julian mentioned it all either up or down and summer sun will wilt you with no shade. Most of the switchbacks are wide enough for a tandem but there are a couple that are tight.


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## XC Mike (Sep 26, 2004)

JokerW said:


> what happened with the Judy?


I was just looking for something on the cheap side if not I will wait till tax time and do it right with wheels and disc


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## XC Mike (Sep 26, 2004)

Okayfine said:


> Tough to say without having a common trail to compare. IRP is either climbing or decending, but the climbs aren't bad, and there's only two brief "downhill" sections of note. LOTS of switchbacks, but they're generally wide enough to be no issue on a tandem - but they will give you lots of practice. Very much an XC type of trail system. Lots of single riders to cheer tandems they've never seen before.
> 
> Main downside in summer is that there's very little shade.





zibell said:


> XCMike, I'd say its probably a 100 on a scale of 1-10. I mean riding a wheelee up and down those switchbacks on a tandem with no fork would be tough even on a level street.
> No really we rode a couple of months ago with Tim and Hope on there C'dale hardtale with front suspension and they did great. On a scale of 1-10 I'd say maybe a 7. Its all rideable but as Julian mentioned it all either up or down and summer sun will wilt you with no shade. Most of the switchbacks are wide enough for a tandem but there are a couple that are tight.


Sounds good Guys
I need to get my team around the full 12 mile Fully Loop before I think we will be ready.
We did the half loop last week and my little one really surprised me :thumbsup:


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

XCMike, We ride the Fuly loop on Sundays with the morning group. You guys should come out and join us, its a slow and easy pace with plenty of rest breaks. Let us know if you are ever doing the loop and we can meet you there. We ride it towing our 5yr old on his trail-a-bike.
I'm not sure if we'll be there tomorrow as its Marias birthday.


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## XC Mike (Sep 26, 2004)

zibell said:


> XCMike, We ride the Fuly loop on Sundays with the morning group. You guys should come out and join us, its a slow and easy pace with plenty of rest breaks. Let us know if you are ever doing the loop and we can meet you there. We ride it towing our 5yr old on his trail-a-bike.
> I'm not sure if we'll be there tomorrow as its Marias birthday.


Cool so Dino is still putting on these rides? I just got on STR I haven't been on that site in over 3 years!!!
My Wife's Klein Won the "Best Of Show" for the 1st annual STR Vintage Bike Event sad thing is we sold that bike about two years ago...........
Next weekend my daughter has a soccer tournament so maybe the weekend after that :thumbsup:


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

A holler out to SoCal teams...

We're in OC. We'll be riding starting late November, and would be psyched to share some trail psyche. Wanting to ride technical terrain and, ideally, longer rides. Our hit list includes:

Joplin
Upper/lower Holy Jim
Los Pinos
Skinsuit
Telonics
Stairsteps
Car Wreck

Some of those I've never ridden, some only on a single. There are highly regarded local areas we've never ridden such as Santiago Oaks, Fully Loop etc.; open to those where there is tech riding involved.

Aside: Oddly, I've never seen another MTB tandem team. Last time out someone asked us if we rode El Morro the day before. We know you guys are out there!

Cheers,

Mike


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

Wow, those are some seriously technical trails on a tandem. I've done almost all of them on a single but none of them on the tandem. I think my stoker would be done with me if I took her down any one of them. "Luckily" for me in this case I have tendonitis in my knee so I'm off the bike right now. 

I'm very interested in hearing about the tandem outing on any of these trails. Make sure and post about your adventure. 

Have a great time!


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

We've done Holy Jim a few times on our tandem and didn't find it very fun, too many switchbacks for us. I imagine if you could clean them it would be a different story, or if you're looking for switchback practice, that's about the best trail other than San Juan.

I've done Pinos, Joplin, and Skinsuit on a single, I imagine they might be a bit easier on a tandem especially Skinsuit with the steeps. A healthy loop might be Blackstar/Skinsuit/Skyline/Motorway. Another trail you might check out is Palm Canyon. We've done that twice on the tandem and it's a good challenge. Sycamore Canyon in Riverside also has some fun rock tech and is a bit more local.

I'd like to set up a Noble Canyon tandem ride this winter. Anyone ever ridden that on a tandem? I've never been...


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

oc-b, thanks for the good wishes.

My feeling is that we can roll anything on our tandem that I can on a single bike, tight switchbacks and lines around obstructions excluded. If it's purely steep and rough, I actually feel more stable on the tandem with the added wheelbase and weight out back. And of course there is the added momentum which forces the bike through low-speed steps/rocks that could more easily stuff a single. Precision lines, yea forget it&#8230;but the advantages seem to more than compensate. I have a small (and gonzo) stoker, which no doubt helps.

We tried T&A on-sight a year+ ago and put a foot down a few times. It seemed about as techy as Joplin, albeit not as loose. We did Car Wreck a couple weeks ago after being off tandems for a year and got it clean down to the car. Sheesh, I've gone OTB on Car Wreck on my single when not completely focused. Not that we're _all that_, but just to say that certain terrain doesn't seem that hard to us on the big bike. It's almost like cheating in some cases. Somewhat counter-intuitive, I believe.

drdoak, we're with you on the switchbacks. Just want to tick off Holy Jim because I love the flow-y parts and the setting. We won't be cleaning most of the switchbacks (we didn't clean many on San Juan either). Thanks for the suggestions! Palm Cyn is certainly on our radar and I agree it would be fitting (the sand march notwithstanding). Noble Cyn sounds great as well, and we will definitely be game for that killer run when the time comes.

Keep riding (or resting!); hope to saddle up soon. We have some healthcare stuff on deck so will be out of the game a few more weeks. Cheers!

Mike


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## Stevoo (Mar 9, 2007)

We tend to find ourselves riding up Harding and Modjeska more than the other trails when riding the big bike. Chino north ridge to 4-corners and back out the main cyn weekdays after work is a common summer time sunset quick ride. We park out on Rose and ride over the dam and through the park proper as a warm up. Hardley ever see any other big bikes on any trails. Seen maybe 2 others in the past years. Good to know you folks are out there. We live only 3 minues from Santiago Oaks according to my Garmin when going home (downhill) from the park. For whatever reason we only have ridden singles at Santiago Oaks. Maybe we will run into some of you out on the trails. Keep on getting out there! Lots of tandem road riding as of late. Hopefully back to the dirt soon.


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

My wife and I just rode (most of) the Ride in the Rocks, in Lucerne Valley Saturday.
We suffered three rear flats, and only had two spare tubes.
Most of course was doable, save for a couple of tight, sandy single track sections, and the really deep sand in the middle of the longest climb.
The rocky sections were very rideable, and the ol' KHS has never worked better, until the flats.
Guess I'd better up the technology to include tubeless in the rear to try and avoid pinching tubes.

We'd love to meet up with some other twosomes. 
We're in the San Bernardino mtns.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

JokerW said:


> My wife and I just rode (most of) the Ride in the Rocks, in Lucerne Valley Saturday.
> We suffered three rear flats, and only had two spare tubes.
> Most of course was doable, save for a couple of tight, sandy single track sections, and the really deep sand in the middle of the longest climb.
> The rocky sections were very rideable, and the ol' KHS has never worked better, until the flats.
> ...


Hi Joker,

Careful with the tubeless setup on the tandem. I ran tubeless on our tandem for a couple months with no issues until I was coming down Mathis one day and when over a sharp water bar (like a curb) at slow speed. It pulled my front tire's bead away from the rim and burped all the air. We went down but since we were going slow we didn't get any injuries (other than my pride and my stoker's confidence in me). I went back to tubes for the tandem and Stan's for my singles. You mileage may vary but it wasn't worth another incident for me.


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

> We went down but since we were going slow we didn't get any injuries (other than my pride and my stoker's confidence in me)


Been there... only with injuries to both of us. Took quite awhile to get my wife back on the bike.
She used to use toe clip pedals, and now I have her running flat DH pedals. Took her a little while to not "slip" them, but she really likes that she can get away from the bike if she needs to.

Funny thing on the tires, our front is actually a 2.4 UST with a tube. I think the stronger sidewalls are really a benefit, even though it is a heavier tire. I'd like to put a nice fat something in the rear, but the seatstays keep me limited. We are currently using a 2.2 non UST, but I'm still pondering other ideas. I've even considered "denting" the seat tubes to add some clearance for a fatter/taller stronger sidewall tire. That will be a "last resort" option though.

Thanks for warning on tubeless burping. Tandems sure test the limits of equipment, eh?


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Mike,
When your ready to ride let us know and we'll see if we can meet you. As we have a 5yr old we need to set up a sitter for him or ride not too tech stuff as we would be pulling a tag-a-long. I think at this time we have a sitter for the 19th of November and maybe we can show you around Santiago Oaks or something? Its always fun riding with other tandems. 
Patrick


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey, Patrick,

Thanks for the holler. Good options. We'll definitely get in touch. Tagging up with the three of you might fill the bill nicely seeing how we'll both be coming off of recovery time. Keep cranking until then...

Cheers,

Mike


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Stevoo,

We ride Chino 3 days a week but mostly weekdays in the mornings. We live very close to Rose and the dam. Let us know next time time you get out this way...I think we met She&I in Chino last Sun...Great to see other team...

Also, we still want to hook up for the Oaks ride. Need practice on the switchbacks.


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## Stevoo (Mar 9, 2007)

Teamburney,
That would be great. Have not been riding the mtn tandem in a while just the road tandem as we were training for the Furnace Creek 508. Now that the 508 is over (it went great by the way) maybe we will get back on the mtn tandem. Short winter days and back to std time spells the end of weekday after work Chino rides. I believe they frown on night riding there. Please correct me if I am mistaken. I will see if I can remember to ping you should we find ourselves headed to Chino on some weekend. It would be fun to ride w another tandem.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

If the weather is nice next Saturday (Nov.19th) we plan on riding Santiago Oaks again. If there is anybody that wants to join, the more the merrier. Big bikes are a blast at the Oaks. We meet at Irvine Regional Park around 8:30-8:45 in parking lot #3. Total switchback fun, if you ain't going up, you're bombing down.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Finally, we should be in on the Nov.19th ride. I just rode solo bike there with our Tues/Thurs. morning group.Great place, looking forward to following the tandem pros and learning.Keep us posted...


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, look forward to riding with you guys on Saturday, we're hardly tandem pro's but we do have fun.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Who's going tomorrow morning at 8:30 IRP??? Looks like weather is going to hold up,no rain till Sun.We are still in...


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Cheering you guys on...

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Have fun and blast it out. Hope to join youz later.

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, we're still planning on being there tomorrow morning. You're right it looks like the weather may hold out long enough for us to get a ride in, just need to bring the long sleeves. We have our sitter coming by our house @ 8:00 then we'll leave. Thats why I say we'll be there 8:30-8:45ish. Parking lot #3, see you tomorrow. We may have a couple of singles join us also, just to show them what big bikes can do. I rode there Wednesday and the trails are in primo condition.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

We will see you there. Hopefully last minute viewers will show up...Come on Big Bikes....


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Hats off to the Zibell Team, they're awesome on the big bike. Thanks again for a great ride at the Oaks and for your patience with us.It gives us a goal.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill and Nancy, thanks for coming out and riding with us. We had a fun time, and the burgers and beers post ride were not bad either. You guys did good for your first ride at the Oaks. That place is not an easy place for big bikes with all the switchbacks. You're either riding up or down and the little rain at the begining of the ride got a couple of the trails a little slick. I downloaded the video I shot of us riding down Chutes Ridgeline but the angle of the camera only got my front tire and a couple of feet in front of it, not the best. I guess we need to go back and try again.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Patrick, do you happen to know the gear ratio on the big bike? Ours has 22 front 36 rear. It just seemed like you had the ability to spin faster uphill.


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Teamburney said:


> Patrick, do you happen to know the gear ratio on the big bike? Ours has 22 front 36 rear. It just seemed like you had the ability to spin faster uphill.


Not Patrick, but FWIW, often if you can fit a 22, you can get a 20 on it.

Hoping I don't make fool of myself in regards to a Davinchi or some form of 4 bolt cranks that won't take a 20.

20/36 with a 26" wheel is some serious climbing gears...We need to come trash our sea level flat terrain legs.

PK


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Bill, we're running a 20t front with a 36t rear so we can tow our little guy up the trails we ride. Thats the lowest I could find.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

zibell said:


> Bill, we're running a 20t front with a 36t rear so we can tow our little guy up the trails we ride. Thats the lowest I could find.


You guys have given me new hope. I'm running a 22/34 and I thought that was the lowest gear possible. I ordered a 12-36 9spd cassette, and now I'm going to look for a 20t chainring. Man that's a serious low gear. I can't wait to try to make it up some of the climbs that relegate us to walking.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey, troops, we are back on our bikes, and digging the cool weather and trail conditions. We got tandem runs on Mentally Sensitive, Car Wreck and Gridley Trail, so we're feeling reasonable. We'll be bikepacking in the Santa Anas this WE (go ahead, snicker), but after that are mostly free next week and WE. Holler if you want to hook up for some fun in or around OC...no criteria other than having fun.


Mike and The Weasel


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

I know this is really late notice but Jeff's team and my team will be riding Santiago Oaks tomorrow (1-2-12) at 9:00 We will park at school located at Knoll Ranch and Serrano.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

*Once a month ride*

Ok guys, after today's ride with Tim (not Jeff) and Hope. We have decided to try and organize a once a month ride with the Big Bikes as Tim calls them. So we don't have to wait, the last Sun. Of this month is projected and then every last Sun. As we get closer we can discuss location. Let us know who is in? Anywhere in So.Cal.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Bill, how did the ride go today? Keep us informed on the last Sunday rides. If they aren't too hard we'll show up with our son in tow. We have a sitter set up for the 3rd Saturday of the month so we'll have our son on his trail-a-bike for the last Sunday.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Thanks for the call for teams. Look fwd to joining up next time.

Mike


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

So that would be Sunday the 29th for January? We are definitely interested and available.

Jeff & Katie (Redlands)


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Let's start throwing out locations so we can all plan. To make things smooth,somebody has to know the trail,so our kids in tow riders can decide. Should be fun!!


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## Stevoo (Mar 9, 2007)

Had a chance to ride the big bike the last few weekends at CHSP. We went late in the day and the trails were pretty empty. Just a couple of hikers. Temps have been real good too. The significant other had to work so I took a longtime riding buddy out. He giggled like a school girl during the ride. It was very funny. His first times on a mtn tandem.

It was interesting and a bit different. Fun none the less.

Anyone interested in, or have done the Full Moon night mtn bike rides organized by Rock and Road Cyclery? Only problem I see is they are on a school night and start late 7:30pm. Look like fun though.


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## Mtn-Tandem (Sep 11, 2008)

Ok, so tomorrow is the last Sunday of the month and I haven't heard anything about any of the SoCal Tandem's getting together for a ride! So Hope and I are planning on riding the Fullerton Loop at about 8:30 tomorrow and would love to ride with other teams. 
If anyone wants to do a little riding tomorrow, we'll be in the upper parking lot of the court house at 8:30.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Tim, we're just getting home from a party but we'll be ready to meet you and Hope at the Loop tomorrow morning. Thanks for posting this up.


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## Teamburney (Nov 21, 2010)

Sorry about this last minute reply. This week has been a hectic one, my 86yr mom fell and broke her hip so we won't be able to hook up.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Thanks to Tim & Hope for getting us home safe. Wow what a ride. We did have fun, because on the tandem no matter what you do it together. This ride was just a comedy of flat tires. First off Tim & Hope had a flat and their spare was flat. We gave them our spare tube and all was good and we had a great ride.......until......we flatted comming down Morman hill. I tried to patch it but it didn't hold. Thats when Tim & Hope rode back to their truck and came back to pick us up. I must say after all the was said and done we still had a fun ride. You know what....even a bad day on the bike is still better then the best day at work. 
Thats why we were talking about next Sunday hitting up Bonelli for a morning tandem ride. Anyone wanting to join us, the more the merrrier.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Thanks for the holler, sounds like it worked out. "even a bad day on the bike is still better then the best day at work" ...roger!

We were a little off this weekend but made some afternoon trail time. Looking good for this weekend; would love to meet up with y'all. Happy week...

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Just throwing it out there...anybody interested in riding this Sunday (2/5) we are planning to ride Bonelli Park in San Dimas. We'll meet at the park and ride lot at the 210 freeway and Via Verde exit (the lot is west of the freeway). We'll be there @ 8:30-8:45 if anybody would like to join us. Any questions let me know.
Patrick


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey, Patrick we're committed to a rest day Sunday; will be riding Holy Jim out/back from the TH near the fire station at about 9am tomorrow and ? on Monday. Anybody who wants to dismount numerous switchbacks is welcome to join us 

m&m


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## Mtn-Tandem (Sep 11, 2008)

Hey Patrick, Hope and I will be riding with you and Maria on Sunday. Hope to have some other teams show up as well.


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## xtraheat (Feb 9, 2012)

asd


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Hey MTBR, why bother with the 10-post requirement (or whatever it is) when that just forces noobs to post nonsense to reach the marker? 

And here I thought we had a new shooter in SoCal...


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey gang,

Doug "dirtvert" is having a Cholla-thon at Aliso Woods, Sunday AM at the bottom of the trail starting 8:15-8:30am. I thought it would be fun to see if we can survive some laps while doing something good for Project Rwanda and IMBA.

If any other big bikes were _inclined_  to show up, it would be pretty nutty. Anyway, we'll be there.

Happy trails wherever!

Mike


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey gang,

Doug "dirtvert" is having a Cholla-thon at Aliso Woods, Sunday AM at the bottom of the trail starting 8:15-8:30. I thought it would be fun to see if we can survive some laps while doing something good for Project Rwanda and IMBA.

Rides & Things

If any other big bikes were _inclined_  to show up, it would be pretty nutty. Anyway, we'll be there.

Happy trails wherever!

Mike


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## pinnacle10 (Sep 11, 2006)

My wife and I don't ride our tandem much, but it would be fun to ride with other tandems sometime. The last Sunday of each month sounds like a good idea. We're in Redlands, but are usually pretty free on Sundays to drive somewhere.

Jeff


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Howdy, Jeff,

We haven't gotten together yet with the other SoCal suspects, but I'll throw out a greeting to you and yours anyway. Hope to catch up with you guys for a ride soon 

Cheers,

Mike (& Moria)


PS: Hey, last Sunday of the month is this weekend...we could do either day of the weekend as it looks. Holler with your pleasure, anyone.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

We're stuck locally until summer due to workload. We have great trails close to us, but here in Newbury Park we're pretty far from everyone else.


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

My wife and I are starting to ride the tandem a little again.
I'm going to mix some road rides in with the dirt rides to help get us back in riding shape.
Somehow, we've become much older and slower...

Anyway, we're in the San Berdoo mtns, but we'll be riding down the hill for awhile. 
Rides like the paved SART, Crafton Hills, and Hulda Crooks.
We're not big on early morning starts, more like mid-day starts.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

JokerW said:


> Somehow, we've become much older and slower...


Thankfully you can do something about the "slower" part 

Mike


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

Yes, I know I've been absent from this thread. And we haven't ridden our tandem in a long time. Why? Newborn boy and girl twins last September. We look forward to when they're old enough and we can pull them around in a double stroller. Maybe when they're old enough, I'll build them a matching mini tandem.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

All in good time, Lee. Way to prioritize.

Good to have your voice on the tandem boards.

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Lee, congrats on the twins. I bet they are keeping you two very busy. You may need to build a special trailer wide enough to fit 2 car seats. We were lucky enough to have Adam in a car seat in a Burley @ 4 months, no problems, 5pt harenss on the car seat and 5pt harness on the Burley. The Loop is his now. We'll see you when we see you, best wishes.


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## Blaster1200 (Feb 20, 2004)

I'm still usually out on the loop at least once a week on my single bike, and my wife gets out every couple weeks. We trade off, which has been really nice. All things considered, the twins have been real easy (sleeping through the night since the second month).

I'll probably wait until they're at least 12 months or so before we start hitting the river trail. We'll be moving houses soon (same area), but I have to do a full remodel before we move in, so that may limit my riding time. I know it's going to be so much fun getting the kids out on the trail. I'm really looking forward to that. Maybe eventually, I'll build a quad mountain bike, like that white roadie quad often spotted around Fullerton.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey guys & gals, Maria & I have a sitter this coming Saturday the 21st for our son and are looking to get out and do a ride. If anybody would like to join us that would be great. A word of caution we haven't been riding much so we're kind of slow. Haven't yet picked a trail, we're open to suggestions. Our sitter shows up about 8am and we're in Fullerton so we can meet around 8:30ish. Hit us up and lets plan a fun ride.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

zibell, we would be happy to meet up for something. Open to trails/areas. The Luge would be a hoot, not too long a day. We've not ridden Whiting or Sant. Oaks, so anything at either would be great. The beach areas are fun too. No problem with any pace 

Mike/Moria


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Mike, how about we do the Oaks? Lets meet in lot #3 in Irvine Regional Park around 8:30. There are fun trails there. And if we get out early we should beat the heat. Let me know what you think?
Patrick


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Sounds like a winner, Patrick. :thumbsup:

Looking at their map 
www.ocparks.com/uploadgraphics/lbirvbrocv8.pdf 
I'm guessing "P3" is where we meet.

I'll PM you my cel number.

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Well, just sending it out one more time. Come out and ride with us (Patrick/Maria & Mike/Moria) at Santiago Oaks this Saturday @ 8:30. We are meeting in parking lot #3 in Irvine Regional Park. If you haven't had a chance to ride with other tandems, this is your chance. There is dirty fun to be had.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hear hear, fun will be #1 on the agenda.

Woot!!

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Thanks Mike & Moria for the fun ride today. Maria and I had a blast with you guys. Here are a couple of pictures that Maria took. Can't wait to ride with you guys again.
Patrick & Maria
Fullerton

p.s. If you feel like riding tomorrow we're riding the Fullerton loop. Hit us up.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Three cheers for Patrick and Maria!

It was a nice survey of a sweet area and super fun ride. Thanks for hosting! 

We're off to Idy this AM; hold down the OC fort and we'll ride again. Cheers...

M/m


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

So we're doing our Sunday morning run to the beach and back. On our return, we come across another tandem! :eekster: Very surprising, to say the least. We've heard of this team, they're based in Simi Valley, but this is the first time we've seen them out on it. They're leading another couple on single bikes, but that couple also has a tandem and are based in Big Bear. Too excited about seeing another tandem and two tandem teams, I forgot to get names of Team Big Bear. Anyone on here? :thumbsup:


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## tsetsaf (Oct 20, 2009)

Argh I should have not hit this forum you folks are killing me. We are currently in Simi now too. The tandem is "on blocks" for service while my wife is carrying our first child. It is amazing how much I miss having her to ride with. The great thing is how much she misses riding too; already planning a trip down the coast when the baby is about 8 months old (we will see on that one).

Anyways have fun on the tandems it really is a special opportunity to enjoy cycling together.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey tandem people, we've got a sitter again for this Saturday the 19th. So we're heading out for another ride and checking the boards to see if anyone wants to join us? We're open to suggestions, Santiago Oaks is always fun. We can leave Fullerton around 8:00am when our sitter arrives and meet wherever. Its time to get out and ride!
Patrick & Maria


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Wish we could hook up with the Big Red Train, Patrick, but my stoker is away for a spell and I have a few balls in the air 'til June. I hope you get a good crew out or have a sweet time alone/together 

Yo, please note: Patrick and Maria are super fun to ride with! They crank hard, have skills and are very easy-going. Couldn't imagine a nicer couple to ride with.

Thanks for the call...have fun!

M (+m)


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Mike, Thanks for the nice reply. When you and Moria are able to ride again let us know we'd love to join you two on another ride.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

We only really have time for a local 7:30 ride...and we didn't even get out last weekend. :madman: School's out in June, however.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Well, the sitter just called and canceled for this Saturday so we won't be riding Santiago Oaks. We are thinking about still doing a ride. Towing Adam and doing something like Peters Canyon, Turnbull Canyon, or Bonelli, maybe Aliso. If anybody wants to join us you're welcome to join we'll just be slow towing a tag-a-long.


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## balldoc54 (May 16, 2012)

OMG, when I saw the forum's title, I thought it was a joke until I saw this picture. How the hell do you guys mountain bike on a tandem bike!? The turns, bumps, climbs!


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Teamwork.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

balldoc54 said:


> OMG, when I saw the forum's title, I thought it was a joke until I saw this picture. How the hell do you guys mountain bike on a tandem bike!? The turns, bumps, climbs!


Don't feel alone. Lots of folks, experienced riders included, sort of balk at the notion of a tandem on real MTB trails. Tight switchbacks/maneuvering between obstacles and mandatory wheel lofts are the downfalls. Other than that, you can tandem down any trail you can ride on a single. You can actually descend steep terrain with less likelihood of an endo. The core workout is phenomenal. Wanna make single biking seem easy? Get hot on a tandem :thumbsup:

Cheers,

Mike


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

I'll add:

You may think you know how to ride a bike, and then you try a tandem.
It's kind of like learning to ride all over again...


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## your uncle jim (Jun 26, 2012)

She&I said:


> Don't feel alone. Lots of folks, experienced riders included, sort of balk at the notion of a tandem on real MTB trails. Tight switchbacks/maneuvering between obstacles and mandatory wheel lofts are the downfalls. Other than that, you can tandem down any trail you can ride on a single. You can actually descend steep terrain with less likelihood of an endo. The core workout is phenomenal. Wanna make single biking seem easy? Get hot on a tandem :thumbsup:
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Mike


I'd like to see some dh on one of those!


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Plenty on YouTube.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Man I can't believe it the summer is over and its still well over 100 degrees here. The board here has been quiet all summer so I hope everybody has been doing some riding. I just wanted to post here to say hey to all our friends out there in tandemland.....we miss riding with you. Keep the rubber side down!
Patrick & Maria


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

P+M,

Nice sentiment, thanks 

We've been out of the game with the wife on assignment elsewhere. Our grandiose plans for this year are again waylaid, but no dampener on enthusiasm. I re-purposed one of the frame bags for my single full squish and rode the CO Trail in attempt to pacify the tandeming jones (admittedly close, but no cigar). 

Hope to share some saddle time with you guys and any other fun-loving teams later this year or next. Thanks for the ping...crank on!

m&m


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey all so cal tandems.......summers over and we have a sitter for Saturday the 17th. We're going to go ride, weather permitting. If you'd like to join we'd love to have you. We haven't decided where we are going yet. If you want to join and have an idea let me know.

Patrick & Maria


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## rhxpro (Oct 9, 2006)

Hey All,
I just found this site specific to Tandems awesome... I live in San Fernando Valley area and am interested in putting together some Tandem Rides once a month or so.( MTB of Course and maybe some road if we have too lol?) If there are any Tandems or rides out there please throw your 2cents in.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Rene, 
We are down in OC, but know of a few tandems up your way. Where do you guys ride? We've been over to Sycamore canyon w/ Okayfine ( very fun couple to ride with) and also been to Chesebro but that was on a hot summer day ( not too fun). We have some trails down here if you ever like to go on a little road trip. Next Saturday we have a sitter so we're doing ride if you're interested. 

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton, CA


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## rhxpro (Oct 9, 2006)

Definitely... a big group Tandem ride would be great... I can travel anywhere in So Cal on the weekends...


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Team Zibell does group ride invites frequently (as shown above). We ride the Santa Monicas 99% of the time (when we don't travel to visit Team Zibell). Mostly Sycamore since we live close, but also Cheeseboro (but only in non-summer due to temps and lack of water and shade), with the occasional Backbone out-and-back.

I think most of the SoCal teams have ridden with Team Zibell, since they put out invites more than anyone else.:thumbsup:


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Rene, a big tandem group ride would be a blast. But life happens and it's a hard to get people together on a set time and place. We found that if we just put it out that we're doing a ride then whoever wants to join us does. The most tandems we had show was 3, counting us. No problem because we always have a blast. 
Thanks Julian for the nice words. Hope you and Sally are doing well.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

Been lurking here for a while and thinking of getting a MTB tandem. We've been mountain biking since the mid 80's and riding a road tandem for 3yrs, so we thought we would like to give it a try off road. 

Okay the deal is done, closed on a 2010 Ventana ECDM!!! Some highlights are; Sram XO code hyd discs front and rear, Fox Talas RC 36 150 mm fork, Sram X9 3x9 speed drive train. Should be delivered by Monday!

Thanks for all the good info and motovation to see this thru.  Hope to meet with some of you soon for a tandem ride!


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

Where in SoCal?


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*SoCal tandem*



Okayfine said:


> Where in SoCal?


We're in south Orange County.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*First trail ride*

There is a large group doing Blackstar and the Motorway at 0800 this Saturday the 22nd of Dec. If some other tandems are going we would join in (but not do the motorway part)other wise we will be riding the Bell Ridge Trail from the waterfalls at Dove Canyon in Rancho Santa Margarita to Caspers Park and back, approx 20 miles. We would love company if anyone wants to ride. 

Posted some pics in the ECDM thread of the new ride. But here's another


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

DonP. said:


> There is a large group doing Blackstar and the Motorway at 0800 this Saturday the 22nd of Dec. If some other tandems are going we would join in (but not do the motorway part)other wise we will be riding the Bell Ridge Trail from the waterfalls at Dove Canyon in Rancho Santa Margarita to Caspers Park and back, approx 20 miles. We would love company if anyone wants to ride.
> 
> Posted some pics in the ECDM thread of the new ride. But here's another


Nice ECDM, that is almost identical to ours. Can't join this weekend but we'll keep our eyes open for future rides. We have done Motorway a few times on the tandem, it is actually not a bad trail except the numerous water bars are a PITA. Just curious where you would come down if you didn't end up riding Motorway?


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

drdoak said:


> Just curious where you would come down if you didn't end up riding Motorway?


You could just turn around at the golf ball at Beaks Peak or continue on the main devide to Maple Springs and come out Silverado Canyon road and back to Black Star.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don, thanks for the invite. We have to pass this time as we are heading to a family Christmas function on Saturday. I heard it may rain, I hope it holds off for you to get a ride in. Love the bike, very nice. Even if you don't have any takers at this time, go ahead and post future rides. We'd love to join you guys on a ride. Have fun.

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton, CA


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*First dirt ride on the Ventana*

We decided to do the Bell View ridge trail from home with friends from our road club. Only about 12 miles on an out and back along the ridge but beautiful clear skys and mid 50 temps. Helped some other riders fix a chain on the way back and had to use 2 new pins to get him going. As luck would have it Ali snapped his chain near the end and had to push about a half mile! 

Here's a pic of us enjoying the sunshine and catching our breath after the first steep climb of the day. Thats Ali on the left with his wife Helen and my wife Terri on the right. We were very impressed with the Ventanas ride and ability to absorb some big hits that we usually jump on our singles. I think we're going to like this! :thumbsup:


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

With backdrops like that, moving to Florida will be a culture shock! It's really flat. I mean almost pool table flat. 

Looks inviting and fun.  Glad you enjoy the new bike, off-road tandeming is so much fun. Possibly mountain bikings best kept secret.

PK


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*Trail ride*



PMK said:


> With backdrops like that, moving to Florida will be a culture shock! It's really flat. I mean almost pool table flat.
> 
> Looks inviting and fun. Glad you enjoy the new bike, off-road tandeming is so much fun. Possibly mountain bikings best kept secret.
> 
> PK


We're going to run it again! This Wednesday JAN 2nd.

If anyone can get away we would love company :thumbsup:

Meet between waterfalls at Plano Trabuco and Bell Canyon Dr in Rancho Santa Margarita at 9am Wednesday morning.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*Bell Ridge Trail to Caspers Park Jan 2nd*

Looks like editing doesn't post as a new date entry so.....I'll make a new post.

We're going to run it again! Trail was still too muddy for the last attempt.

This Wednesday JAN 2nd.

If anyone can get away we would love company :thumbsup:

Meet between the waterfalls at Plano Trabuco and Bell Canyon Dr in Rancho Santa

Margarita at 9AM Wednesday morning.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

We will be riding Aliso Wood Canyon Saturday at 11:00 on the Ventana.


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## rhxpro (Oct 9, 2006)

Thanks for the heads up... My Tandem is in pieces right now getting a new facelift, tuck, firmed up etc... Should be back on the dirt in a couple weeks...

Keep me posted


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

DonP. said:


> We will be riding Aliso Wood Canyon Saturday at 11:00 on the Ventana.


Have fun,

Wish we lived closer so we could ride there also.

PK


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Don, what route are you riding tomorrow? If I can get the team up for a ride Aliso sounds fun. We haven't been riding much lately and we will be towing a tag-a-long, so we may be a little slow. The route we ride starts at the ranger station and up the main trail to cholla and we exit the park and run thru the neighborhood to the top of cholla. From there we take the ridge up to top of the world. Then thru back thru the neighborhood to meadows and down and out.
If you wouldn't mind a slow team to ride with we'd like to join.

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton,CA


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*Aliso Wood*



zibell said:


> Hey Don, what route are you riding tomorrow? If I can get the team up for a ride Aliso sounds fun. We haven't been riding much lately and we will be towing a tag-a-long, so we may be a little slow. The route we ride starts at the ranger station and up the main trail to cholla and we exit the park and run thru the neighborhood to the top of cholla. From there we take the ridge up to top of the world. Then thru back thru the neighborhood to meadows and down and out.
> If you wouldn't mind a slow team to ride with we'd like to join.
> 
> Patrick & Maria
> Fullerton,CA


Sorry I didn't catch your post earlier but it was nice meeting you at the park Patrick! Wish we had more time to talk with you and your wife but we had a large group of singles from work doing a ride too. Great day for a ride there, we also went out around the neighborhood to the top of Cholla then up the ridge to top of the World where I got a pic of a friend and his 13 yr old son on his first ride there. You can just see Santa Catalina Island off to the right. We came back down Mathis with some of the group and the rest went to Meadows.

We'll hook up again for a tandem ride!

Take care

Don&Terri


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don, 
It was very nice seeing that beautiful Orange Ventana in person. Oh, it was also nice to meet you and Terri. We ended up running into some friends on our way in/their way out. Then we saw a herd of deer I the meadow on the way up the canyon. When we made it thru the neighborhood and up the ridge line we loved the views of Catalina Island. We made it up that killer clime up to Mathis and decided it was straight down Mathis and back to the car. 
We'll keep you posted on when we ride again.

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton, CA


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

Sounds like a dry weekend coming up, anyone up for a tandem mtb ride? We're open for either day.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

DonP. said:


> Sounds like a dry weekend coming up, anyone up for a tandem mtb ride? We're open for either day.


Hey, Don, we've been hankering for Joplin and want to ride it from Holy Jim and back down Doc Edgar fire road (Rose Cyn). If that sounds fun, holler. Cheers...

Mike


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey guys, Maria and I have a sitter for our son on Saturday and we're up for a ride. Our sitter arrives at 8am so we can meet around 8:30-8:45. I've been sick with the flu last week and we've been off the bike for about a month, but I'm ready for a ride. We haven't thought about where to ride, maybe Santiago Oaks or El Moro or something fun. 

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton, Ca


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey, P&M,

Hoping you get some good trail time in this WE. We're set on Joplin so will likely miss you this time. Have fun, here's to honing your edge...

M/m


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

zibell said:


> Hey guys, Maria and I have a sitter for our son on Saturday and we're up for a ride. Our sitter arrives at 8am so we can meet around 8:30-8:45. I've been sick with the flu last week and we've been off the bike for about a month, but I'm ready for a ride. We haven't thought about where to ride, maybe Santiago Oaks or El Moro or something fun.
> 
> Patrick & Maria
> Fullerton, Ca


Okay, we're up for either one. We have never done Santiago Oaks so would need directions. El Moro is more familiar but it's been a few years. 

Don&Terri


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Don & Terri, nice to hear you're up to ride. Well as for destinations, El Moro is a lot like riding @ Aliso very similar with mostly fire road with a small amount of single track mixed in. Santiago Oaks is located in the Irvine Regional Park and its a little more technical as its mostly single track with a bunch of switchbacks. If you're up for it we'd love to show you around Santigo Oaks. Let us know what you think.

Patrick & Maria


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

zibell said:


> Hey Don & Terri, nice to hear you're up to ride. Well as for destinations, El Moro is a lot like riding @ Aliso very similar with mostly fire road with a small amount of single track mixed in. Santiago Oaks is located in the Irvine Regional Park and its a little more technical as its mostly single track with a bunch of switchbacks. If you're up for it we'd love to show you around Santigo Oaks. Let us know what you think.
> 
> Patrick & Maria


Santiago Oaks sounds like fun, meet Sat around 8:45 then?


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Sounds great. Parking is $5, and park in lot #3. There is a restroom close by and it's close to the trail. See you Saturday.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*Tandem ride*



zibell said:


> Sounds great. Parking is $5, and park in lot #3. There is a restroom close by and it's close to the trail. See you Saturday.


Do you enter at Irvine Regional Park off Jamboree?

Okay found parking lot 3 at Irvine Regional on the map below, see you on Sat! :thumbsup:

http://ocparks.com/civicax/filebank/blobdload.aspx?BlobID=15633


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Yes Don, enter IRP off the top of Jamboree. Lot #3 is the 3rd lot after you enter you make the 1st left and drive around to the 3rd lot, it will be on the right. 
If there are any other tandems out there that would like to join us we are always happy to ride with more of the big bikes. This is a fun ride!

Patrick & Maria


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Just a reminder if anybody would like to join Don & Terri and Maria & I on a ride tomorrow morning we'd love to have you join us.

Patrick & Maria


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

zibell said:


> Just a reminder if anybody would like to join Don & Terri and Maria & I on a ride tomorrow morning we'd love to have you join us.
> 
> Patrick & Maria


Had a great ride today with Patrick and Maria at Santiago Oaks! They are amazing on climbing switchbacks! We have a lot to learn from you two. The weather was sunny and warm and the views from the top all the way out to Catalina Island were fantastic. Lunch at the Cronic Taco after the ride was excellent.

Looking forward to the next ride.

Have a few pics at the bench.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don & Terri, We had a blast yesterday with you guys @ Santiago Oaks. It is always a fun place to ride and challenge ourselves. It was a perfect day for a ride and you're right the views were beautiful. Lunch after a good ride is always the best ever.
When we get another nice Saturday maybe we can come down your way with our son and ride some of your local trails.

Patirck & Maria
Fullerton CA


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

Sure, give me a heads up when you think you can do it and I'll pre run it to be sure the tag along bike won't have any problems.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

How does this Sunday look for a tandem ride along the Bell Ridge trail to Caspers Park, anyone free to ride?


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don, We'd love to ride with you and Terri again. We'll have our son with us, do you think we could do this toying a tag-a-long? We can ride most trails toying him as long as they aren't too steep or too tight. Last weekend was our date Saturday but Maria was sick so we haven't ridden in a couple of weeks. Let us know. 

Patrick & Maria
Fullerton, CA


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

zibell said:


> Don, We'd love to ride with you and Terri again. We'll have our son with us, do you think we could do this toying a tag-a-long? We can ride most trails toying him as long as they aren't too steep or too tight. Last weekend was our date Saturday but Maria was sick so we haven't ridden in a couple of weeks. Let us know.
> 
> Patrick & Maria
> Fullerton, CA


The ridge trail would be fine for the tag along, no worse that Aliso Wood you ran with it a few months ago. There is one rough spot from the last bad rain we had that you may want to walk it up though. We could meet at the trail head between the two waterfalls/fountains at Plano Trabuco and Dove Canyon Drive at about 08:30 Sunday? 
We have a long road tandem ride to Seal Beach planned with our road group on Saturday.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don, that sounds great. We'll see you & Terri Sunday @ 8:30, and anyone else who wants to join us.....you know you want to.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*Bell View Trail*

:thumbsup:We had another great ride today with Patrick, Maria and their son Adam. Also along was Mike and April on single bikes. We explored the whole ridgeline and a few trails in Caspers Park on the Ortega Highway. We got 22 miles with just over 3000ft of climbing. We finished off the ride and had lunch at Friends Sports Bar, and some 1/2lb burgers! Yum!!!


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Don, Thanks for showing us your local trails. We had a fun time. Adam really had a blast checking out all the plants, flowers, and creatures. He enjoyed the fact we rode by Starr Ranck. It was a blast riding with you & Terri and Mike & April. It was a long ride and when we got home we all passed out. Those were nice pics. Here are the pics I took.


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## DonP. (Dec 4, 2012)

*MTB ride Sunday*



zibell;10274253 Hey Don said:


> Sorry for the short notice but we will be doing a portion of the recent Rwanda 25/50 mile ride on Sunday. It will be about 15 to 16 miles as we will not be starting at the Oakley building but at the waterfalls at Dove Canyon Drive and Plano Trabuco in Rancho Santa Margarita. (The same start place of our last ride but a different trail) Start time is 0830 Sunday morning and should be about a 2 1/2 hour ride depending on stops.
> 
> All are welcome to join in the fun!
> 
> ...


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Don, thanks for the invite. We're going to pass on it this time. It's railroad days in Fullerton and we're taking Adam to see the trains. You & Teri have fun. 
Thanks 
Patrick


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

On Saturday 10-12, we were taking our old beast to Hulda Crooks to get in some climbing and some techy singletrack. As we were driving up Mt View, and crossing Barton Rd., we saw three tandem teams at the light. At least two were on full suspension rigs. We honked and pointed towards Hulda Crooks as we went through the intersection, but I'm sure that they were probably on the end of their ride.
Anyone out there know who they are?
We'd like to hook up with some other teams out here in the IE.


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

We live in Redlands and have a full suspension Ventana. There is another couple Jeff and Lisa who ride a tandem. I've never seen a group of mountain tandems here but would definitely be interested to meet up for a group ride either at Hulda, Crafton, Loch Leven etc.


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

We are pretty undisciplined when it comes to keeping a schedule, especially early morning rides. We're more mid-day to afternoon kind of riders.

We've been gearing up to make it to the "Ride in the Rocks" out in Lucerne in a couple of weekends. We've done this ride three times, and we're the only tandem there. It would be great if there were others!

There isn't really a tandem "entry fee" on their list, but we usually pay the family rate.
2013 Ride in the Rocks | Annual Fundraiser | Educational Foundation | Mitsubishi Cement Corporation

From the top of Crafton


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## drdoak (Feb 7, 2005)

Hi,

We're looking to organize a ride around Redlands/Yucaipa either Sunday, November 17 or November 24. Thinking of riding either Crafton Hills, Hulda Crooks, or Loch Leven (maybe Thomas Hunting Grounds). If you have a preference on date and location, please let us know! 

I think we prefer Loch Leven, because of the scenery and we could also grab lunch at the cafe in Angelus Oaks before the descent back to our cars.

Jeff & Katie


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## pinnacle10 (Sep 11, 2006)

The ride is set. We'll meet at Loch Leven at 9:00am. Loch Leven is about 15 minutes outside of Redlands. There is a good amount of singletrack, but most of it is pretty wide singletrack and tandem friendly. No tight switchbacks. We have 5 groups of tandems who've said they are likely to make it.

Route will be similar to this ride - Mountain Bike Ride Profile | Loch Leven + a little SART near Mentone | Times and Records | Strava

More details on the facebook events page - https://www.facebook.com/events/177139225813210/

Or post up here and Jeff (drdoak) or I will reply.

Jeff and Lisa


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

We're going... to suffer. That's a lot of climbing for us old folk.

Jon & Teresa


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Sounds like a fun ride. I'm picking up my stoker(Maria) from the airport that afternoon. Let us know how the ride goes, sounds like a fun time with 5 teams going. Keep us in mind for future rides. I might even break out my new stoker(my 7yr old son) and make Maria ride her single.
Patrick & Maria
Fullerton


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## pinnacle10 (Sep 11, 2006)

I'm sure we'll look to do this a few times a year, probably at different locations.


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## oc-biker (Mar 9, 2004)

Hi Pinnacle10, looks like a great ride. It's a long drive for us from Southern OC but I'm going to try to talk the Stoker into going. It would be cool to see some new tandem friendly trails and get the tandems out in mass. 

Thanks,

Paul and Lisa


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

From last Saturday's Ride in the Rocks, Lucerne Valley


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## pinnacle10 (Sep 11, 2006)

Between here and Facebook it looks like there are 6 tandems that are in, and at least another 3 I know of that are possible. My wife and I went out and did the first and last 5.5 miles of the ride. For anyone not familiar with the area, this is where most of the elevation is, after about 6.5 miles there's a lot more up and down and the elevation tends to come easier.

Here's the ride we did - Mountain Bike Ride Profile | Up and down Loch Leven near Mentone | Times and Records | Strava

Once we get to Angelus Oaks at 6.5 miles we'll regroup. There's a store and restaurant and you can usually fill up water there without any problems. We'll hop on the fireroad just past the Post Office and continue towards Thomas Hunting Grounds. I think we'll skip the first sections of the SART (it gets a little narrow with exposure in areas), but if some want to do it we can meet back up at the next section. I think the SART through Thomas Hunting Grounds will be great on a tandem. After THG we'll head back up the fireroad and back towards Angelus Oaks.

If people want we can stop and eat at the Restaurant on the way back down so bring some money if you think you might want to. If not, the ride back to the cars is the same way we came up to start.


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

We'll probably skip eating at the resturant... saving our money for beers at Brew Rebellion in Yucaipa!


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## JokerW (Nov 5, 2004)

Sunday's ride was great. 7 tandem teams, and the fabulous Loch Leven area to ride.
More photos here also: https://www.facebook.com/#!/bikeforbender

Thanks to Jeff S. (pinnacle10) for getting us together. We had never met any of these teams before, and now we have an extended IE tandem family to ride with


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey all how have you all been? We took a year off as my 8yr old got his own 26" mtb. We've been doing rides on the singles but are now starting to get back in shape and ready for some summer fun on the big red bike. Just trying to relieve this thread and get the local bikes talking again.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

Anyone interested in a tandem ride out of Julian? We just got ours up and running. Be nice to ride with some other teams.


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## pinnacle10 (Sep 11, 2006)

My wife and I haven't ridden our tandem since the group ride over a year ago. I've had some knee problems and we now also have a 3 month old baby. We are, however, helping to organize a new ride Bike for Bender will be putting on and I'm posting about it here as it'd probably be a great ride for tandems and there is already 1 that is signed up.

It starts and finishes at Pioneertown and is primarily fireroad. There is a 35 and a 50 mile option. The ride is free. For more details you can go here - Pioneertown Gravel Grinder | Bike for Bender

Or sign-up on our Facebook Events page - https://www.facebook.com/events/935381463160987/

Jeff and Lisa


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Great to hear the chatter of riding going on here. It getting me stoked to get off my rear and get back in shape and get big red back on the trails. We had a drunk driver rear end us over the holidays and totaled out our tandem hauler :-( now were looking for a new bike hauler, until then were stuck at home riding the Fullerton loop.


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Hey, Patrick and all, great to hear everybody is thinking big bikes.

We too have been off ours since the Divide in August, but are now set up for trail riding and have it in mind to sweep away some cobwebs.

We did sign up for Bike for Bender (thanks, pinnacle10), but we hope to hit some OC stuff before then. My hitch is my studious wife, who loves to hit the books all day. Thus, lots of single bike riding...

Thanks for bringing this thread back to life, P. Best wishes to Maria and for getting your car situation dialed. Glad you guys were not hurt! Cheers...

Mike/Moria


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## Mendobikesprite (Nov 19, 2009)

Hey Tandem teams! My Stoker's mom and sister live in San Diego we get down there fairly often, would love to hook up with some you guys and Ride. We have ridden with Mike and maria they rock! We live in Mendocino where we have miles of cross-country singletrack great for tandems and it never gets too hot in the summer to ride. We are thinking of doing a tandem rally up here wondering how many people would like to go? Mike get a list the names let's do this!
Happy trails Jesse and Sojo


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Jesse & Sojo a tandem ride/rally up in Mendocino sounds like a blast. I'll need to bring a couple of single bikes for my stoker and mini stoker(my 8 yr old son) so all 3 of us can ride i will just need to switch between stokers. Let us know when and well need to schedule time. 
Patrick & Maria


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

Jesse and Sojo! Great idea!

I made it up there last November, wow...they have the goods in spades, and Jesse is an ace guide and captain. Wish my stoker had made it...

What I rode was very tandem friendly; redwood forests with loamy trails, not too twisty. Just beautiful, including some riding right on the coastline. Worth the trip up, but a guide is pretty much mandatory in Jackson Demo Forest (zero signage).


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

Here is a picture from our ride on Saturday. Part of the Charlie Kelly Borrego weekend with a movie, talk and book signing Friday and a 14 mile mostly downhill ride down Grapevine Canyon. Fun!
The tandem handled the sand just fine and unlike others we never crashed!


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## radsmd (Mar 31, 2009)

Bringing this thread back to the top.

Just picked up a used ECDM and looking to do some mtb tandem rides. In Carlsbad (North County San Diego), but travel up to OC quite often since we have family there. Have ridden Whiting on the tandem and had a great time. 

Just rode Santiago for the first time on the single and not sure if we can handle it on the tandem. However it may be the particular trails that we were on. 

Planning on hitting the Fullerton loop soon, maybe Aliso as well.

Are the “big-bike” group rides still going on?

Tan


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey Tan, let us know when you plan on hitting the Fullerton loop, it's our local trail and we would love to join you.
Patrick n Maria


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## Stevoo (Mar 9, 2007)

Next time you get to the OC ride up Harding truck trail all the way past the upper gate to the towers atop Saddleback Peak. It is a fun ride and tandem friendly.
Also Modjeska to Old Camp is good and tandem friendly. You can even come down The Luge trail on the way back. That option is a bit more advanced though.
Great to hear there are others out there riding the big bike.
Have not been on ours in a while as I just built up a new single bike and need to get the newness ridden out of it.


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## Hurricane Jeff (Jan 1, 2006)

Back in the late 90's, early 00's, we used to have a group of 5 tandems that we would regularly ride Chino Hills, Fullerton loop, Marshall Canyon, Santiago canyon, Big Bear, etc. Used to race the tandem class then also, used to be usually 10-12 tandem teams then
I since have sold our tandem( wife didn't have any interest after our son was born)
I sure miss those days, those were some of funniest riding days that I've had.


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## radsmd (Mar 31, 2009)

zibell said:


> Hey Tan, let us know when you plan on hitting the Fullerton loop, it's our local trail and we would love to join you.
> Patrick n Maria


We sure will.


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

I am a longtime MTB'er but wife doesn't ride her bike at all (but does enjoy her spin classes). So I recently bought a used hardtail tandem to see if we could ride together without her being left behind. Our maiden voyage up Aliso Creek trail to Cook's corner and back (all pavement) from Laguna Hills went well and without any complaints. Based on that, I installed wider rims and tires, put a suspension fork on the front and stoker post on back to make it more dirt-friendly. Ride #2 was down Aliso Creek trail and around Laguna Niguel lake and back. Mix of smooth hard pack and pavement. Again no complaints other than some seat adjustments. Now we need to try some more fire road / relatively tame single track to test out the bike (and wife) to see how they get along. We are open to ideas about stuff that isn't too crazy up or down. Would like to be able to clean everything and not have to get off or push or spook the stoker into not liking this. I've been riding so long I only know the more tech stuff around here so I have to dig out my old notes or check Geoladders for some ideas in OC.


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

Maybe we will try this weekend: Geoladders -- Coto - Caspers West Ridge


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Maybe try the Fullerton loop, not too techy but a few little climbs and nice singletrack. We live local and would be happy to guide you in a little 10+ mile 1 1/2he ride.
Patrick n Maria


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

Thanks Patrick! I assume you mean something like this: Geoladders -- Fullerton Loop

I recall riding this once many years ago with my son on single bikes.

If we ever get up in that direction with the bike we may give that a shot with the tandem.

Regards,

David


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## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

unikid28 said:


> Maybe we will try this weekend: Geoladders -- Coto - Caspers West Ridge


That is not a very exciting route. Nor is it a difficult route.

Drop down Star Rise and do a loop in Caspers will make it better.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Yes David, thats it. We do a shorter version with our 11yr old son on his single bike. And it's still a good fun ride. Let us know if you want to come up and would like a guide.
Patrick n Maria


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

mtnbikej said:


> That is not a very exciting route. Nor is it a difficult route.
> 
> Drop down Star Rise and do a loop in Caspers will make it better.


Thanks - If it were just me I would be all over Caspers for sure. However I want to make sure the wife is okay with the distance/climbing and overall dirt experience first. If she enjoys it I will look for harder stuff next. Would rather hit a home run with something easier than to risk having her turned off after only our 3rd ride ever on the tandem.

David


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## ChargersWI (Nov 9, 2016)

radsmd said:


> Just picked up a used ECDM and looking to do some mtb tandem rides.


Awesome! Where did you end up getting it from? We have a basic mountain bike style tandem and would like to upgrade to an ECdM.

And share pictures. :>)


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## radsmd (Mar 31, 2009)

ChargersWI said:


> Awesome! Where did you end up getting it from? We have a basic mountain bike style tandem and would like to upgrade to an ECdM.
> 
> And share pictures. :>)


Picked up from a fellow mtb'er in San Luis Obisbo. Like it so much, we are having a new one built up by Ventana, di2 and everything. This one will go on the chopping block when the new one is done.


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## ChargersWI (Nov 9, 2016)

Ah, you bought Jeff's. Hope it continues to work well for you. And let all here know how the new build goes.


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## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

My wife and I bought a used ECDM from our friends earlier this year.....we get out in the OC a couple times a month.


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

unikid28 said:


> Thanks - If it were just me I would be all over Caspers for sure. However I want to make sure the wife is okay with the distance/climbing and overall dirt experience first. If she enjoys it I will look for harder stuff next. Would rather hit a home run with something easier than to risk having her turned off after only our 3rd ride ever on the tandem.
> 
> David


Well the wife and I ended up doing the Coto ride last weekend. Only completed about 2/3 of it though before the wife wanted to turn around. Although the trail has some fun fast sections, there were a couple of steep climbs where we had to stand up and crank together to make it to the top. Based on others comments it looks like our stock granny gear isn't going to cut it for some of the hills around here. Our bike is a 3x8, with the small ring 28 in front, with 34 in back. I plan to grab a 22 laying in the garage from one our single bikes and try swapping that in before our next ride. Also the front derailleur was struggling to move onto the small and big chainrings during the ride. It shifts fine on the stand but not out in the trail. Not sure if the added pressure of 2 people pushing is an issue or I need to look at changing the cable and/or cheap derailleur for something better. Maybe a sticky middle ring? I will examine closer when I put the 22 on there.

Happy new year to all!

David


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

22T on a triple is pretty standard since 9spd. 28T is nearly my middle ring (32T) and there are lots of places in the local hills we couldn't get up with 28T granny. SoCal has much more hills than flats.

You will have to let up on the pedal pressure when changing down chainrings. I will call out "Down!" when I'm changing down front chainrings, both to let my stoker know to expect the jolt and so that she'll let up while the front mech does its thing. If we hammered the cranks and I clicked the front shifter down, we could keep the chain on the bigger ring just with pedal pressure.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

zibell said:


> We do a shorter version with our 11yr old son on his single bike.


He's 11? When did this happen?! :skep:


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

Okayfine said:


> 22T on a triple is pretty standard since 9spd. 28T is nearly my middle ring (32T) and there are lots of places in the local hills we couldn't get up with 28T granny. SoCal has much more hills than flats.
> 
> You will have to let up on the pedal pressure when changing down chainrings. I will call out "Down!" when I'm changing down front chainrings, both to let my stoker know to expect the jolt and so that she'll let up while the front mech does its thing. If we hammered the cranks and I clicked the front shifter down, we could keep the chain on the bigger ring just with pedal pressure.


Unfortunately our tandem came with 28/38/48 in front. I agree not what one would normally find on an MTB single. I had read somewhere that tandem teams can push higher gears, so was hoping the set up that came on our bike might be sufficient. Obviously it's not for some of the trails we are hoping to do. I since found a complete triple ring set in my garage that got taken off a single MTB after minimal use several years back. I now have that installed, with a 22 in front. We plan to hit up the same trail again this weekend to compare the changes we've made.

Thanks for the tip about calling out the down shifts. Although I did find a cable issue that was the likely cause of the sticky shifts, this communication tip will come in handy going forward. Since the surprising jolts were another thing that the stoker didn't care for on our last ride. I can avoid startling her as well as get her to ease off a bit to facilitate the shifts.

David


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## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

unikid28 said:


> Unfortunately our tandem came with 28/38/48 in front. I agree not what one would normally find on an MTB single. I had read somewhere that tandem teams can push higher gears, so was hoping the set up that came on our bike might be sufficient. Obviously it's not for some of the trails we are hoping to do. I since found a complete triple ring set in my garage that got taken off a single MTB after minimal use several years back. I now have that installed, with a 22 in front. We plan to hit up the same trail again this weekend to compare the changes we've made.
> 
> Thanks for the tip about calling out the down shifts. Although I did find a cable issue that was the likely cause of the sticky shifts, this communication tip will come in handy going forward. Since the surprising jolts were another thing that the stoker didn't care for on our last ride. I can avoid startling her as well as get her to ease off a bit to facilitate the shifts.
> 
> David


Our ECDM cam with 3x9 (44/34/22). After a couple rides.....I swapped it all out for 1x11 (32x11/46).


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

mtnbikej said:


> Our ECDM cam with 3x9 (44/34/22). After a couple rides.....I swapped it all out for 1x11 (32x11/46).


Did you keep the same crankset and simply use the middle ring?

Even after doing all that, the 32:46 combo is not quite as low as the 22:34. And the top end of 32:11 is obviously not as strong as the 44:11.

It's apparent we need the lower gears to deal with steeper/longer climbs. And I don't think we want to be spinning out when commuting to/from the trails or on long downhills.

At some point I might consider switching our tandem to a 2x or even 1x once once we know exactly the range we require. However I really want to get a feel of our capabilities first and determine what kind of riding we end up doing (and even how often we ride) before investing in more significant ($) changes.

At this point I will consider it a victory if we finish the entire Coto ride tomorrow with a happy stoker on the smaller front chainring setup. And if things go really well, maybe I can convince the stoker to venture down Star Rise into Caspers as you suggested last time 

David


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## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

unikid28 said:


> Did you keep the same crankset and simply use the middle ring?
> 
> Even after doing all that, the 32:46 combo is not quite as low as the 22:34. And the top end of 32:11 is obviously not as strong as the 44:11.
> 
> ...


Nope....I ditched the Middleburns it came with since they were old 5 bolt ISIS cranks. Put on a pair of Truvativ Stylo's and just used the middle ring position. Also swapped the complete drivetrain over to the drive side, including the timing chain.


























The 32x46 bailout gear is only about 1/2" from the 22/34 we had on it.


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

Looks good - thanks for the pics! 175mm front and rear?


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## mtnbikej (Sep 6, 2001)

unikid28 said:


> Looks good - thanks for the pics! 175mm front and rear?


yup


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## dodger (Feb 10, 2004)

Ventana ECDM Superdust 19/16 for sale in So Cal. Sadly it doesn't get ridden anymore...Sure was fun to ride with my wife and then with my daughter...

2003 model with long travel rockers give it 5.3" travel.
RP23 shock
Marzocchi Junior T fork with 6" travel
Wheels are White Industry Hubs laced to Sun Rhyno Lite rims, 36 hole, 14 gauge spokes
Shimano XT 9 speed drivetrain
Front brake is an Avid Juicy with 203 rotor
Rear brake is a Shimano XT 755 with stainless braided line.
IRC Kujo DH tires. I have 3 new DH tires I will throw in with it.
Easton Monkey carbon handlebar - captain. Titus branded Answeer protaper bar - stoker
Captain seatpost is a telescoping slider so you can drop the seat via QR without dropping the stoker's bars.

$3,000 OBO


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

Anybody we know? https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2380077/

Am slightly tempted by this bike but realize this must be an early generation with the horizontal shock mount, etc.


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

radsmd said:


> Picked up from a fellow mtb'er in San Luis Obisbo. Like it so much, we are having a new one built up by Ventana, di2 and everything. This one will go on the chopping block when the new one is done.


how is the new bike coming along? pictures yet?


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

unikid28 said:


> Anybody we know? https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2380077/


Can't see getting into a Ventana any cheaper, that's for sure. Very much an older frame, but the horizontal shock design isn't as much of an issue as parts availability for that rear shock. Also not thrilled with the rear rim brakes/no rear disc mounts. ISIS BBs are also pretty thin on the ground (ask me how I know), but that bike could serve as an upgrade and gateway to something more modern down the road. And the asking price is less than the trade-in value if you bought a new ECdM frame from Ventana.


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Okayfine said:


> Can't see getting into a Ventana any cheaper, that's for sure. Very much an older frame, but the horizontal shock design isn't as much of an issue as parts availability for that rear shock. Also not thrilled with the rear rim brakes/no rear disc mounts. ISIS BBs are also pretty thin on the ground (ask me how I know), but that bike could serve as an upgrade and gateway to something more modern down the road. And the asking price is less than the trade-in value if you bought a new ECdM frame from Ventana.


Frame parts might be available as Sherwood keeps parts for his older frames. We have an '01 with the horizontal shock and the rear triangle has disc mounts. You can contact Sherwood and replace the rear triangle with something disc compatible.


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## laksboy (Sep 4, 2007)

Ditto what everyone else said. You might be able to get a swingarm from Ventana for Disks. But certainly a great "gateway" bike especially if your stoker is a kid.
You can also still order a Fox 36 with a 1.125" straight steer tube in the 26" wheel size at whatever travel size you want. I put a DPX on my recent Testigo rebuild and it just revolutionized the rear end.

https://www.thebikedads.com/ventanas-full-suspension-tandem-el-conquistador-de-montanas/


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

laksboy said:


> https://www.thebikedads.com/ventanas-full-suspension-tandem-el-conquistador-de-montanas/


Nice article!


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey So Cal tandem riders. Its time again to get back out and ride. If there are any tandem teams in So Cal that would enjoy riding with other tandems post up when and where and let's see if we can get this thing going again. We had a ton of fun in the past and looking for more


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

zibell said:


> Hey So Cal tandem riders. Its time again to get back out and ride. If there are any tandem teams in So Cal that would enjoy riding with other tandems post up when and where and let's see if we can get this thing going again. We had a ton of fun in the past and looking for more


Hi-

Once we have a few more rides under our belt I will hit you guys up and maybe we can do the Fullerton loop with you.

-David


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## zibell (Apr 13, 2007)

Hey David, sorry for the late reply. That sounds fun. Let us know and we can meet you. There are tons of fun trails locally to ride.
Patrick n Maria


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

FYI there is a newish ECDM listed on Craigslist in Tustin: https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/bik/d/tustin-ventana-tandem-mtb/6904212152.html

Looks like the ad from the prior owner in Huntington Beach is still up on Pinkbike if you want more details: https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2572934/

There was a similar ad on Craigslist HB for a bit before it came down and this new one came up in Tustin.

It appears like the Tustin party bought it and then they (or stoker!) changed his mind and had to put back up for sale.

Unfortunately that is more tandem than the wife and I need. Though it is quite tempting.

Perhaps others on here can help it find a new home.

David


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

They've re-posted it with a lower price now: https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/bik/d/tustin-ventana-tandem-mtb/6913647441.html


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## unikid28 (Oct 11, 2017)

The ad is gone now. So somebody got it. Let's see if they show up here on MTBR to talk about it.


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