# Is there an ebike that is actually based off a DH other than the Kenevo?



## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

Hello everyone. I've been a long time reader but not much of a forum participant. Sorry about that, I always enjoy the threads here. 

I hope I can ask for some of your collective wisdom.

I am a 46 year old 6' 4" 265lb guy who is in above average physical condition and I am looking for my first e-bike. Reason for e-bike is just fun and longer rides in the PNW. 

Current bike is a 2017 specialized fuse 27.5+ XXL. This bike is less than inspiring when riding hard, and I don't feel comfortable airing it out on much more than roller with a smooth landing due to flex. It is also a "little" large feeling and I could see something with a lower TT being a better option.

I've recently decided to give up motorcycling and therefore I will be spending more time on an MTB. 

I am looking for a stout, bulletproof new ride that can handle my size at speed with some reasonable airtime thrown in for good measure. Prior to the fuse, I tried a specialized enduro in an XL size and found the rear shock geometry wasn't ideal for a person my size. I blew the shock and was considering a push upgrade but then sold it for a hardtail. Size wise, the enduro with a riser stem and tall bars felt good. 

I have been looking at the 2022 Giant Reign E+ and the Marin Alpine Trial 2 with a heavier spring, but those are more one the enduro side of things. I wish there was an option that looked something like a Norco Aurum but I haven't been able to find one. I am not worried about weight, and I would like (ideally) a triple clamp fork and rocker arm style suspension as opposed to a design that puts all the weight on the shock. 

Do you have any ideas for me? 

Thanks


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

There are probably 30 (random guess) long travel (160-180mm) ebikes to choose from other than a Kenevo. All of which will be 100x more downhill oriented than your current Fuse. A better question would be what e-bike can I find in stock right now.

I have a Commencal and love it.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

RBoardman said:


> There are probably 30 (random guess) long travel (160-180mm) ebikes to choose from other than a Kenevo. All of which will be 100x more downhill oriented than your current Fuse. A better question would be what e-bike can I find in stock right now.
> 
> I have a Commencal and love it.
> View attachment 1946602


Thanks for the reply RBoardman. I saw that Commencial but am concerned about how the rear shock geo works. Reminds me of my specialized enduro, where I blew the shock a few times. I am hoping to find one with a vertical shock and pivot linkage. Time is on my side to some extent, I have a bike to ride and would be happy getting something by next spring which is why I am starting now. I also realize that may be a bit of a challenge.


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

spec d said:


> Thanks for the reply RBoardman. I saw that Commencial but am concerned about how the rear shock geo works. Reminds me of my specialized enduro, where I blew the shock a few times. I am hoping to find one with a vertical shock and pivot linkage. Time is on my side to some extent, I have a bike to ride and would be happy getting something by next spring which is why I am starting now. I also realize that may be a bit of a challenge.


What Enduro did you have? If it was a 2017-2019 that was a very common issue. If you were running an Ohlins air shock, the shock was also to blame.

Also, the orientation of a shock (Horizontal, Vertical, Diagonal, forwards, backwards) has very little to do with the suspension kinematics. Same thing with the locations of the pivots. You can have two VPP or DW Link bikes that have the same suspension design, but to the untrained eye look drastically different. Check out this article that highlights some of the more popular designs. (There are more than this for sure).



https://www.bikeradar.com/features/the-ultimate-guide-to-mountain-bike-rear-suspension-systems/



In conclusion, I would not worry about the design of your suspension or if the bike has a dual crown or not.


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## RBoardman (Dec 27, 2014)

Also, Kenevo's have a higher chance at breaking shocks than most bikes. This was a DVO coil at the beginning of the ride.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

RBoardman said:


> What Enduro did you have? If it was a 2017-2019 that was a very common issue. If you were running an Ohlins air shock, the shock was also to blame.
> 
> Also, the orientation of a shock (Horizontal, Vertical, Diagonal, forwards, backwards) has very little to do with the suspension kinematics. Same thing with the locations of the pivots. You can have two VPP or DW Link bikes that have the same suspension design, but to the untrained eye look drastically different. Check out this article that highlights some of the more popular designs. (There are more than this for sure).
> 
> ...


It was a 2015 expert. Admittedly I hadn't taken the time to research suspension and I really appreciate you sharing that article. I had attributed the issue on the enduro to my weight and aggressive riding style along the appearance that the shock had to take all the load whereas the Horst link design and Giants marketing of the maestro had me thinking about the reign&#8230; this really helps and I'll do some more reading.

Appreciate the pic below too. Definitely going to try a new brand this time!


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## Danzzz88 (Jun 10, 2020)

husqvarna extreme cross - Google Search


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

What about the Intense? That husky is badass!


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## SDMTB'er (Feb 11, 2014)

Santa Cruz Bullit


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

Danzzz88 said:


> husqvarna extreme cross - Google Search


That definitely looks the part. I have a fair amount of experience with Husky motorcycles and they are very nice. It seems like it's a bit hard at the moment to get their ebikes in the US, but I am sure they will develop their dealer network here. We have two Husky MC dealers nearby.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

SDMTB'er said:


> Santa Cruz Bullit
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I am probably off base here too (please feel free to flame me) but I am a bit skeptical on carbon fiber frames.

I work in an industry where we build machines to destroy various materials for recycling and the carbon fiber is very strong but also very easy to destroy once it has any kind of crack. Alloy / steel / titanium is a better solution for longevity. We've destroyed all of those materials too and it takes far more energy.


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## Tickle (Dec 11, 2013)

Checkout the emtb eurobike randoms on Pinkbike, that Nicolai is noiiice. Probably cost more than that 15k Spechy tho and unobtanium


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## The Squeaky Wheel (Dec 30, 2003)

If concerned about shock durability (I am), and if budget allows, consider a bike that is PUSH 11.6 compatible - Kenevo and Bullit are excellent choices. I'm pretty darned happy with my YT Decoy which handles Rowdy rocky mtn terrain quite well. Zero shock or fork issues to report on my PUSH springers


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## CRM6 (Apr 7, 2021)

im 6'3 and 235 and I have the Intense Tazer MX. I've upgraded the coil to my weight and love the bike!


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

SDMTB'er said:


> Santa Cruz Bullit
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I concur!


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

CRM6 said:


> View attachment 1946762
> 
> im 6'3 and 235 and I have the Intense Tazer MX. I've upgraded the coil to my weight and love the bike!


That intense does look like a blast, thanks for sharing!


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## stevenfallover (Jun 5, 2004)

I have a Bullit and before that I had a Kenevo. The Kenevo frame was beat up so I am very scared when I ride the Bullit. I think metal is the way to go if you ride an E bike and especially if you are going to ride it hard.

[QUOTE="spec d, post: 15411899, member: 545820"

I work in an industry where we build machines to destroy various materials for recycling and the carbon fiber is very strong but also very easy to destroy once it has any kind of crack. Alloy / steel / titanium is a better solution for longevity. We've destroyed all of those materials too and it takes far more energy.
[/QUOTE]


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

stevenfallover said:


> I have a Bullit and before that I had a Kenevo. The Kenevo frame was beat up so I am very scared when I ride the Bullit. I think metal is the way to go if you ride an E bike and especially if you are going to ride it hard.
> 
> [QUOTE="spec d, post: 15411899, member: 545820"
> 
> I work in an industry where we build machines to destroy various materials for recycling and the carbon fiber is very strong but also very easy to destroy once it has any kind of crack. Alloy / steel / titanium is a better solution for longevity. We've destroyed all of those materials too and it takes far more energy.


[/QUOTE]
Thanks for this reply stevenfallover.
At the moment I am somewhat focused on what Husqvarna will be doing in the next few months. Their website states that they have some big announcements coming for 2022 and they are growing their US dealer network. It seems like they have models that are priced very well and come with a good motor battery combo for the $. Their bikes look well done and the range is pretty complete. I do have to admit the commencal bikes also have my interest and they were not on my radar at all until this thread got going. I appreciate you guys and your thoughts. Commencal videos are well done.


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## CRM6 (Apr 7, 2021)

spec d said:


> That intense does look like a blast, thanks for sharing!











Intense has an Ohlins version with a dual crown fork. This is the MX version and sold at motorcycle shops.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

You can get a haibike downhill bike, 203/203.

I have the Enduro version, 180/180, fantastic bike, bosch

Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk


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## Salespunk (Sep 15, 2005)

A few thoughts here, first off there are plenty of choices. Scott, Specialized, Santa Cruz, YT, Commencal, Norco, etc to name a few. Most companies are using off the shelf HW/SW motor setups so you can just compare battery size and geometry. 

I would not consider anything less than 630 wHr's on the battery side. 500 wHr batteries will severely limit your distance and elevation. Next thing to consider is company/warranty and availability. Think really deeply about this one, especially if you are considering something brand new to the market like Husky.

The standout for me is Specialized. The customize their SW and it has a big impact on both how the bike rides and battery consumption. Power delivery is much smoother and their range is really impressive. One rider in our group did 60 miles and 7K of elevation on a single charge with their 700 wHr battery. Also keep an eye on the comparison that is dropping this week on another very popular MTB website. They are comparing four long travel eBikes and it might help clarify things for you.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

Salespunk said:


> A few thoughts here, first off there are plenty of choices. Scott, Specialized, Santa Cruz, YT, Commencal, Norco, etc to name a few. Most companies are using off the shelf HW/SW motor setups so you can just compare battery size and geometry.
> 
> I would not consider anything less than 630 wHr's on the battery side. 500 wHr batteries will severely limit your distance and elevation. Next thing to consider is company/warranty and availability. Think really deeply about this one, especially if you are considering something brand new to the market like Husky.
> 
> The standout for me is Specialized. The customize their SW and it has a big impact on both how the bike rides and battery consumption. Power delivery is much smoother and their range is really impressive. One rider in our group did 60 miles and 7K of elevation on a single charge with their 700 wHr battery. Also keep an eye on the comparison that is dropping this week on another very popular MTB website. They are comparing four long travel eBikes and it might help clarify things for you.


All good points Salespunk, and I'll look forward to the video. After scouring the web on the Husky I am off that train now mainly because they have a "max user" weight of 130kgs / 270 lbs. I am in the low 260s before any gear so that is really my problem now. That may just be conservative manufacturers versus aggressive, but the Marin Alpine trail also tops out at 270 on their suspension chart. The Giant reign is claiming 156 kg / 340 lbs and that is the bast I've been able to find on a class 1 top tier manufacturers spec list.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

Upon further google searching, I have learned:

Specialized Levo & Kenevo are "designed to withstand 130kg but max recommended rider weight is 109 kg or 240 lbs".

Scott is 110kg / 243 lbs

Commoncal meta (from their manual) is 120 kg or 264 lbs

YT Decoy max is 127 kg or 280 lbs

Marin Alpine Trail (from their manual) is 300 lbs

Trek Rail is 300 lbs

Giant Reign is 156kg / 343 lbs << update: this is "total permissible weight which when you deduct the bike weight of 25kg means there is 290 lbs of rider weight left....

Couldn't find info on the Norco range

These are not "verified", only what the internet has produced based on my searching for "max user" and "max rider" weight limit by model. I hope these help others. If you know of any others in the 300lb + range, please advise.

It sucks to be the size of an outside linebacker sometimes. Thanks again everyone for all of your help in this quest!


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

Anyone of those bike I believe would be zero issues, but they gotta protect themselves. Trek Rails are nice


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## MX9799 (Feb 11, 2018)

I've been on a 2020 Giant Reign E+1 for almost 2 years now and it's been solid.

I'm around 220 lbs geared up, and the XT brakes with 203 mm rotors that came on it left a little to be desired.

IMO, it's hard to beat the Giant ebike's value. If I were looking to get a new emtb, I'd go with the 2022 Reign E+2 for $5600 USD. It's got a bigger front rotor and Code R brakes, so really the only thing I would want to do with it right away is upgrade the wheelset to something more suited to aggressive riding. Then I'd just upgrade/replace components as they break or wear out. 

Based on the list you posted above, the Giant and Trek would be at the top of my list. I'd really look hard for a Giant if I could find one though, before considering the more expensive Trek.


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## spec d (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks MX9799, that is a similar conclusion to what I keep coming back to as well. For the price it seems hard to beat the package the reign offers. I appreciate your experience and feedback!


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## Gutch (Dec 17, 2010)

My brother loves his reign.


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## MX9799 (Feb 11, 2018)

spec d said:


> Thanks MX9799, that is a similar conclusion to what I keep coming back to as well. For the price it seems hard to beat the package the reign offers. I appreciate your experience and feedback!


I forgot to mention the Intense Tazer MX as well. I've not owned one, but this past weekend I did demo a Tazer MX Pro model at a kinda-local self shuttle DH park.

That bike handled great. Seemed like it had tons of front wheel traction. The ohlins dual crown and fork and coil shock felt great. I was, however, not blown away by the EP8 shimano motor. It felt about on par with the Yamaha motor in my reign. I guess I expected more since it's the new/hyped motor, but it didnt feel like much of an upgrade to the 2020 Yamaha motor.

I've no idea what the max rider weight for that bike is though. It was also a full carbon frame with only a 540 wh battery, which kinda kills it for me. If I'm buying a bike that I'm going to abuse, I'm looking for an aluminum frame and a bigger battery.


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## ricerooster (Mar 13, 2013)

Niner wfo e9 180mm f/r travel 29f/27.5r. Underrated bike that plows when going downhill.









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## CRM6 (Apr 7, 2021)

MX9799 said:


> I forgot to mention the Intense Tazer MX as well. I've not owned one, but this past weekend I did demo a Tazer MX Pro model at a kinda-local self shuttle DH park.
> 
> That bike handled great. Seemed like it had tons of front wheel traction. The ohlins dual crown and fork and coil shock felt great. I was, however, not blown away by the EP8 shimano motor. It felt about on par with the Yamaha motor in my reign. I guess I expected more since it's the new/hyped motor, but it didnt feel like much of an upgrade to the 2020 Yamaha motor.
> 
> I've no idea what the max rider weight for that bike is though. It was also a full carbon frame with only a 540 wh battery, which kinda kills it for me. If I'm buying a bike that I'm going to abuse, I'm looking for an aluminum frame and a bigger battery.


You do the demo ride at Kanuga last weekend? I have the Tazer Expert,wish id bought the Pro with the Ohlins! However,I'm very happy with my purchase. I can get 6-10 laps at Kanuga on the 500 watt battery. Plus, an extra battery on Amazon is $500 or less and easy to change out or tote in a backpack. Several upgrades have been added mostly because of mistakes (backing into a telephone pole). Resulted in upgrading wheels,cassette,brake rotor& derailluer. Added Hayes Dominion brakes because the TRP's were ****! Bought a Fox 36 Grip 2 fork because the factory DVO Diamond's damper was damaged. DVO wanted the fork back and after a month they told me they were waiting for the part to be manufactured in Germany. So,I bought the only available fork in Hendersonville-Brevard area. DVO sent me a brand new Diamond fork after 2 and a half months.


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## MX9799 (Feb 11, 2018)

CRM6 said:


> You do the demo ride at Kanuga last weekend? I have the Tazer Expert,wish id bought the Pro with the Ohlins! However,I'm very happy with my purchase. I can get 6-10 laps at Kanuga on the 500 watt battery. Plus, an extra battery on Amazon is $500 or less and easy to change out or tote in a backpack. Several upgrades have been added mostly because of mistakes (backing into a telephone pole). Resulted in upgrading wheels,cassette,brake rotor& derailluer. Added Hayes Dominion brakes because the TRP's were ****! Bought a Fox 36 Grip 2 fork because the factory DVO Diamond's damper was damaged. DVO wanted the fork back and after a month they told me they were waiting for the part to be manufactured in Germany. So,I bought the only available fork in Hendersonville-Brevard area. DVO sent me a brand new Diamond fork after 2 and a half months.


Yeah, I did the demo at kanuga last Saturday. I only did one lap on it, and since it wasn't my bike, I just came down the green trail with it. I didn't want to risk crashing on one of the black diamond trails and be liable for something that got broke. Hahaha. I think the green trail from the top at kanuga is still a pretty fun trail if you stay off the brakes though.

I thought it was a great bike. Had I bought it instead of the reign E+, I likely would've been just as happy.

I can get 5 laps to the top and about 5 laps on tortuga with the 500wh battery in my reign. Probably could get a few more if I climbed in eco mode instead to the trail mode. I bought a spare battery for it too, so I can pretty much wear myself out at kanuga in a day.


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