# black chrome goodness!



## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

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We just became the proud owners of a barn fresh 1986 Schwinn Sierra!

I've few a couple of questions for the collective wisdom:

1) What's the best way to go about attempting to clean up the few blemishes in the paint? The black chrome finish is somewhat unique...

2) If I'm running the shifters in friction, can I run a 7 or 8 speed rear cassette with the original derailluers and shifters?

3) Will a 7 speed freewheel fit without spreading the rear triangle?*

* Like this one: 
26" Rear Wheel, 5-7spd QR Freewheel Hub, Black Rim, 36 spokes - Sport Chalet

I say we, as although it was I who was watching Craigslist like a hawk for the past half a year or so, and I who paid for it and will be doing all the work on it, this vintage "all terrain" bike will be my girlfriends new touring bike, replacing her much hated Novarra Safari.

Virtually brand new, only a little bit of pad and rim wear belying any use at all. Came with an early set of SKS fenders mounted, with a mix of flat head and Phillips screws and cheap nuts and bolts for hardware, which was a little surprising. Original everything, the Viscount Terra saddle, tires, grips, all of it. Slingshot stem is still nearly black (these will often fade to a nice bronze color). Just a few blemishes on the paint, most likely from things banging into the bike or the bike being knocked over, during the past 28 years while it lived in a garage.



















Wasn't expecting this nice surprise, it's got a built-in chainstay protector, a nice industrial looking chrome one:










That line down the middle of the seat stay is actually a reflection, not any damage to the finish. So shiny! And I haven't even washed, much less waxed it yet!










I need to take another photo of these shifters from the side, they are really nice looking! Some of what looks like tiny blemishes here is actually a little bit of small rain drops. Other than oxidization on cheap hardware, 99% of this bike looks brand new!

For anyone interested in the components and specs, I've detailed them below with a few notes.

During our e-mail exchange negotiating when to meet, the seller pointed out that his copy of the 1986 catalog lists 18" as the smallest size for that year, which surprised me. Luckily, my lady says that if anything, it feels a touch on the small side from her impression on the very short little spin she took it on in front of the sellers house. He had not only an original 1986 Schwinn catalog that the sales rep had scribbled pre-tax and out the door prices next to the Sierra, but he had the original sales receipt and Schwinn manual!

The bike also struck us both as being surprisingly light. After pulling off the fenders, going with perhaps lighter pedals, most likely a lighter handlebar, probably a lighter seat and lighter seatpost, as well as perhaps lighter tires and tubes, I think it won't really gain any weight when I add a rear rack, a bell, water bottle cages, and an aftermarket mount for one of the cages. Unlike my usual builds where I add a lot of accessories, I think I will manage to restrain myself and limit this one to two water bottle cages, no fenders, no horn, and just a rear rack except on the rare occasion when she is actually going to use a front rack (when we're on a bike-camping trip).

I expected to replace the brakes and levers along with the wheels, saddle, handlebars, grips, and possibly the rear derailleur and seatpost, but from what little information I can find about these brakes on the web, they are quite good and suitable for loaded tourers, so it looks like the brakes will be staying after getting polished and getting new straddle carriers, cables and housings.

I thought I was actually going to recoup the initial outlay for the bike by reselling the stem, brakes, saddle, wheels, shifters, and the rear derailleur, but when my girlfriend saw how beautiful the shifters are, she decided that she would try out friction shifting! Between that, and her liking the stem, I'm going to end up changing a lot less than I originally expected to, but I'm very pleased she's going to learn and try friction shifting, so it's all good! :lol:

It wasn't a surprise that she likes the aesthetics of the friction shifters*, but I am surprised that not only does she like them so much she's willing to try friction shifting, but she likes most of the older styling on the bike and wants to keep it original looking in some ways that are surprising to me.

* We haven't had a chance to take the bike out for a proper spin, I'm not sure, but I think these shifters may be partially indexed ("ratcheted"?), with a friction option.

1986 Schwinn Sierra, "black chrome" finish:

- double butted 4130 main tubes, 4130 chrome-moly stays
- unicrown 4130 chrome-moly fork, with oversized blades and forged double eyelet dropouts
- 70 degree head angle
- 70 degree seat angle
- AT-50 cantilever brakes
- AT-50 brake levers
- AT-50 shifter levers
- Shimano 204 GS front derailleur
- Shimano 523 SGS rear derailleur
- black anodized Slingshot stem
- high flange Sansin hubs, model AX-10A
- original Viscount Terra saddle

I need to double check the freewheel and see if it is actually the 14-32. Everything else is as listed in the catalog, but you never know what you have for sure until you check. From what I've read, a year or two later and Schwinn seemed to be spec'ing there bikes with whatever seemed to be handy rather than sticking to the catalog description. I don't know why, but I was surprised at the range of that freewheel, somehow I had assumed that the older freewheels had a narrower range and was expecting its lowest gear to be a 28 tooth cog.

The only downsides I'm seeing for this bike, for what we want to do with it are: 
* bosses for only one water bottle cage
* no mid-fork braze-ons
* no upper rear rack mount bosses

All of which I can deal with rather easily, although a little less elegantly than if the bike came equipped with them. From my experience with other converted older MTB's I expect the geometry to be quite good for touring and handle a load well. Both of our around town and light touring bikes are converted 90's MTB's and my tourer is a converted 80's MTB, so I came into this expecting to replace everything on the frame except the front derailleur, so I'm tickled that the brakes are great, the headset and the BB probably only need new grease, and the shifters, levers, and derailleurs may well end staying.

As far as the upsides go, on top of it being pretty much perfect for our needs (once I put different grips, saddle, handlebars, and wheels on it), it was a whopping 80 dollars! On top of all that, my lady really likes the color and is enamored with the bike already.

So much win!

(I'll take some more detail photos when I get a chance in a couple of days. All the above pics taken by my partner.)


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## THE ARS (Sep 14, 2011)

Medic Zero said:


> .
> 
> 1) What's the best way to go about attempting to clean up the few blemishes in the paint? The black chrome finish is somewhat unique...
> 
> ...


1) I'd clean it up and leave it be.

2) Yes. But....

3) The wheel you posted is absolute ****, I couldn't be bothered to look at the spacing. You can still find a 7 spd freewheel if you want to stick with what you have, if you want to go 8 + you need a cassette hub, road bikes are still spaced 130 so just grab a nice used shimano hub and let your local shop build you a wheel.

On the way to MUP domination with that old girl.


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## DIRTJUNKIE (Oct 18, 2000)

Nothing to add other than I love the black chrome look.


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

Nice looking bike. I sold a bunch of those new. Sounds like a pretty good deal. 

FWIW, The stem is not a slingshot style as mentioned in the descriptive text. Slingshot style stems had double handlebar clamps that were spread apart in a "Y" configuration much like a child's slingshot.

If you can find a High Sierra from the same year, you'll find it has the mid-fork braze-ons and multiple water bottle braze-ons you are seeking along with rack and fender braze-ons.


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## cmg (Mar 13, 2012)

do not museum it...........ride it and enjoy it for what it is


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

sgltrak said:


> Nice looking bike. I sold a bunch of those new. Sounds like a pretty good deal.
> 
> FWIW, The stem is not a slingshot style as mentioned in the descriptive text. Slingshot style stems had double handlebar clamps that were spread apart in a "Y" configuration much like a child's slingshot.
> 
> If you can find a High Sierra from the same year, you'll find it has the mid-fork braze-ons and multiple water bottle braze-ons you are seeking along with rack and fender braze-ons.


Ah, sorry thanks for the education on the slingshot terminology, that makes sense.

Yeah, I know the High Sierra's had the mid fork rack mounts and dual water bottle cage bosses, but they also came with roller-cams, and that's kind of a deal breaker for us, for this bike. The Sierra has half the rack and fender braze-ons, it's got the lower ones front and rear there are dual eyelets and at least has a hole through the brake bridge so fitting an adapter there is easy.


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## mojo722 (Feb 17, 2004)

Very cool. That model is the first mountain bike I owned. I'm not sure the bars are stock. I don't remember them being that hi-rise, but that was a long time ago and my memory could be faulty.


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

mojo722 said:


> Very cool. That model is the first mountain bike I owned. I'm not sure the bars are stock. I don't remember them being that hi-rise, but that was a long time ago and my memory could be faulty.


Thanks!

The Schwinn specs list on Mombat shows the bike coming with a handlebar that is "cro-mo 50mm of rise". I haven't measured it, and at a glance it looks like a bit more than that, but it does appears to be original to the bike, and everything else on the bike appears to be exactly as specified in the catalog and parts list for that year. I'll take a pic of the catalog page I have and put that up here too, although it's up on the web somewhere I think...

I'm thinking those bars are going to end up on my off-road MTB, if I ever find a replacement frame for the one that was stolen. Damn my esoteric tastes, the frame I want was only built one year.

Schwinn Specs

My lady surprised me again and said that she'll give the original grips a try! I think they are a little funky looking, (hopefully I'll take cleaned up pics tomorrow) but she says that her first impression of them is they are "cushy". This looking like this bike will end up a lot more stock than I first expected! :thumbsup:


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## supersedona (Dec 17, 2012)

Black chrome looks cool on a frame. It's a pretty easy finish to make, I used to paint car wheels that way. The catch is the silver topcoat is pretty pricey.


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

THE ARS said:


> 1) I'd clean it up and leave it be.
> 
> 2) Yes. But....
> 
> ...


Thanks!

That crappy wheel was just an example to ask a question about hub spacing. I'm used to 7,8, and 9 speed freewheels, and that's about it. Despite riding for about a decade (with a hiatus in the middle) I'm still a very novice home mechanic. Maybe shadetree.

After thinking it over, I've decided to have my LBS spread the rear triangle all the way to 135mm. My thinking goes like this:

1) I know she's going to hate a freewheel (the noise).

2) Thanks to you, I now know I could go with a road hub (I know literally zero about road bikes!), but I'd need to spread the triangle anyway, I can't see sticking her with trying to squeeze a rear wheel that is a little too big in there when she has a flat. I haven't measured it yet, but the spacing is either 126mm or maybe even 120mm, given that it is only a 5 speed.

3) If I'm upgrading to a freewheel anyway, I might as well have it spread to accept 135mm mountain hubs, particularly since this is going to be her touring bike. If her rear wheel was somehow totaled while we are out touring, I'd like to be able to put any 26" rear wheel in there as a replacement, not have to wait for random LBS to build us up a 26" wheel based around a road hub, during their busy season.

I do appreciate the insight, I'll keep that option in mind if I find myself in a similar conundrum with another build.
:thumbsup:


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

cmg71 said:


> do not museum it...........ride it and enjoy it for what it is


That's the plan! It's going to keep a fair number of the original components and then be built up as her tourer. It seems to fit her even better than her converted '96 GT Pantera that she uses around town and for light touring, so she may well end up riding this one around town some of the time too.


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## Scoutergtg (Feb 20, 2014)

That is a great find! I would only change the seat and tires due to age and ride it the way it is. The derailers and shifters look like the Suntour AT group which has always been great to me. I would definitely not replace them. If the freewheel is the 14-32 then I would not touch that either. Just lay it on its side, drip some heavy oil into the grooves and spin it to work the oil inside where the ratchets are. You will notice that it will be a lot quieter and smoother. If the freewheel is a Suntour then it is considered to be very good. There is no real need to change the wheels and spreading the frame because the stock setup will easily serve your stated needs flawlessly and look great! Good luck and enjoy!


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

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A couple of updates and some more pics.

Although most of the component specs line up with the catalog listing for this model and this year, I did spot that the the rear derailleur is a Suntour Mountech (not the Shimano 523 SGS). My understanding is that these have a reputation for going into the spokes, so I'm on now the hunt for a nice chrome or aluminum pie plate dork disk. Maybe this means it's got the spread to cover 7 or 8 gears?

I haven't taken a look at the bottom of the BB yet, if the serial number isn't there, where should I look? I did notice a handful of (four?) numbers stamped on the headbadge, but I could only make out the last two.










I did a very cursory wash and light wax job on the frame, basically just to see if any of the blemishes were superficial enough for this to take care of (nope!), and went ahead and Armor-All-ed the front tire to see what that did for it. The sidewalls aren't badly dry rotted at all, but they do show some discoloration from age. I was surprised at how much of a difference the Armor All made in the appearance of the front tire. I actually applied it the night before these pics were taken. The bike'll be getting touring tires (Vittoria Randoneur Pros, 26 x 1.5"), but I was curious to see how well these cleaned up.










A little hard to make out, but these pics are after I've washed and waxed it, so anything that you can see here is imperfections (damage) in the finish. That white line along the fork I suspect is paint transfer, normally I wouldn't be too concerned about that, but I'm afraid of being too aggressive polishing and waxing it, as my understanding is that the black part of the finish is a super thin coating on top of the regular chrome, and easily removed. Which is line with at least one of the spots of damage I saw on it. I used the gentlest wax I have, normally I'd start out with one of my more abrasive ones...



















My girlfriend really likes the design of this cable stop. At first I didn't think this bike had any provision for upper rear rack mounts, but I just noticed those two holes on the sides of this structure while I was going through my photos. I'm thinking that those just might be designed for the rear rack struts to attach there. If that doesn't work, or we don't like the way it looks, I've got an adapter plate that will bolt into that hole in the seatstay bridge. Is it fair to assume this is up to mounting a loaded touring rack here, or would we be risking a weld failure?










My girlfriend really digs the look of these shifters, so much so that she's going to try out friction shifting for the first time and see if it suits her! I am going to polish them a little and see if I can't replace the mounting hardware with something that will stay shiny.










I assumed that I'd be replacing the grips, but after giving it a short test ride, my lady surprised me and said she'd give the grips a try as well. She said they felt "cushy". Hopefully they'll come off easily and without any damage! (We're putting on different bars) I thought they were a little funky looking, but if she likes them, it'd be cool to keep another original component. These are totally mint looking, and the material they are made out of (latex rubber?) is still soft, it hasn't hardened or stiffened over the past 28 years.
.



















She's asked me to remove or black out any of the logos on the components that we are going to add to it, and I'll be removing to the two lawyer stickers (near the headtube and rear drop out), but I'll be leaving the chromoly sticker. I did a really half-assed job of washing and waxing the bike, I just wanted to get a closer look at most of the finish. Once I'm done photo-documenting it, I'll break the bike down and clean it very thoroughly and then start in on the polishing.










These nice high flange hubs will need to find a new home!










I was surprised to see that the tires not only had "Schwinn" branded on them, but they also have the bike model (Sierra) on them too. Not a great shot of the AT-50 brakes to be sure, but I was pleased to discover after poking around on the web quite a bit that these were used to outfit some high end touring bikes of this era, so I don't think these will need to be replaced. They should be up to the job, and aren't bad looking.










Mombat lists a Shimano 204 GS front derailleur on its Schwinn specs page, but all I'm seeing on the unit so far is "Shimano". I forgot to take a pic of the 1986 Schwinn catalog that came with the bike. I'll have to do that tomorrow.

She wants all black components, the 175 cranks are probably a bit long for her, the gearing is too high for her for loaded touring (48/38/28) and I can't for the life of me remove the pedals, so this crankset is going to get replaced with something black, and either 170 or 172.5mm cranks and I'll set it up with black chainrings (probably 22/34-ish/44).

Sorry about some of the pics being blurry. I cleaned the lens on my phones camera beforehand, I don't know what's up with that, I might have been a little shaky. I'll probably try reshoot a couple of these photos tomorrow.

I'm feeling like I hit a home run with this one. Seems to be a sweet and solid ship, looks good, well suited to what we are going to use it for, and just the right size for her. It feels light, and it feels like it has spirit. We're pretty stoked.

.


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

sgltrak said:


> Nice looking bike. I sold a bunch of those new. Sounds like a pretty good deal.
> 
> FWIW, The stem is not a slingshot style as mentioned in the descriptive text. Slingshot style stems had double handlebar clamps that were spread apart in a "Y" configuration much like a child's slingshot.
> 
> If you can find a High Sierra from the same year, you'll find it has the mid-fork braze-ons and multiple water bottle braze-ons you are seeking along with rack and fender braze-ons.


I forgot to say, I conflated the stem we have with the Y shaped one, probably because Mombat's spec page lists the SR Slingshot as the issue stem for these. I'm under the impression you could special order any of three stems for your Sierra in 1986, but from all the pictures I've seen, it seems pretty even split between the Y shaped Slingshot stem, and the one we ended up with, which fades to a pretty bronze color like this:










I'm curious about the finish and material of these stems, they start out near black. I'll try and take decent close-up of it, it's even harder to photograph than the Black Chrome finish! I'm wondering how we should take care of it, or if I should take any special care in polishing it. For now, I just plan on giving it a thorough, but light coat of wax after thoroughly cleaning it with soap and water. No reason dish soap should be bad for it right?

In the next day or two, I'll snap and post a (clear!) pic from the catalog that came with the bike, IIRC, it's got a page listing the stems, as well as the spec page for the bike (for what that's worth).

.


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## Medic Zero (Jun 8, 2011)

Scoutergtg said:


> That is a great find!
> 
> I would only change the seat and tires due to age and ride it the way it is.
> 
> ...


Thanks!

A lot of it is staying original; the shifters, front derailleur, brake units, stem, grips even, most likely the levers and rear derailleur are staying too, probably the headset and bottom bracket, and the kick stand is getting replaced with an identical one that is the two legged model. She needs the handlebars closer to her, and we don't want to change the nice stem, so the handlebars are getting switched out, particularly since they are way too wide for her.

As far as I can tell, the shifters and brakes are indeed AT-50, the brakes look like other AT-50's I've seen pictures of online, and those are the brakes and shifters the catalogs say it should have come with. Appreciate the confirmation that that is what they appear to be! 
:thumbsup:
The front derailleur only appears to be labeled "Shimano" and the rear derailleur is actually a Sun Tour Mountech.

I doubt the wheels are up to loaded touring, sometimes light off-road with a load and an Athena aboard. I also suspect the braking surface isn't very good (I could be wrong here). Besides, she wants all black components, and I've already got a good nearly new front wheel with black hubs, black spokes, and a black rim sitting in my build pile for our fleet. She surprised me again and said she'd like to keep the original seatpost skewer, and so I've already sourced and received Schwinn branded wheel skewers that match the original seatpost one in styling (that one is actually marked Suzue). We'd prefer to go with quick release wheels, and we live in a very hilly area of a very hilly Seattle with a lot of good touring near us that is all either hilly or hilly _and_ mountainous. We both struggle with 22T small chainrings and 32-34 tooth big cogs on our 7 and 8 speed cassettes and always struggle to find good gears on the never ending hills. I strongly suspect she'd prefer to have 7, 8, or 9 speeds, particularly on long grades.

All that said, I'll definitely take your advice regarding rehabbing the hub and consider giving her a crack at trying out the 5 speed, but I'd kind of like to have the triangle spread while I've got it all apart for the detail clean and BB+headset bearing repacking, and it's going to need new handlebars, cables, housings, and brake pads before she could give it enough of a whirl to determine that yes indeed, 5 gears in the rear isn't enough. On top of everything else, my understanding is some of these this year came with a weird and rare hub, that may require a special tool and I may not be able to find another new cassette for on the road. If so, that's a pretty big strike against the original rear wheel as well, particularly since this bike will be used for touring.

Sitting here looking at the black/black/black front wheel with the shiny vintage chrome skewer in it, it looks surprisingly good. My first inkling was to replace whatever components we needed to with very shiny silver colored ones, and wasn't sure that her desire to have an all black bike (which I've already thwarted once before! :lol was the way to go, but I'm starting to come around. I'm thinking that instead of being really bright and "blingy" with silver components, the understated black wheels, bars, tires, and cranks will put the focus on the black chrome frame for those who look at it, and maybe stay below the radar of thieves. That, and these days, lots of folks don't know Schwinn (like GT) doesn't necessarily equal a box-store, bike-shaped-object manufacturer, or crappy 10 speeds. Worst comes to worse, and she decides shiny would be better, I move the black QR wheels over to her Pantera (which she wants all black too), and do a resto-mod on at least the original front wheel, manage to get the old pedals off the cranks somehow (which I'll need to eventually anyway and may well have by that time), and get the size chainrings she needs for it in silver.

.


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