# Bad Back…



## fftfk (Nov 26, 2020)

Full disclosure - I’ve got a few more years until I’m in 50+ club but I’ve got something I’m sure a lot of you have dealt with - a bad back. I just bought a new bike and the reach was just a little too much for me causing some back pain. I adjusted my seat forward and ordered a short stem plus installed a high rise handlebar I already had. The seat alone plus the handlebar seem to have been enough adjustment to alleviate the pain. Is there any issue with riding with a seat this far forward?







It be nice to return the stem if I don’t need it I’m just not sure if I’m inviting an issue with the seat like this. I’ve always run pretty much in the center on prior seats.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

Look to see if, with pedals even horizontally, the knee cap is over the pedal shaft. If forward, it can cause knee pain and issues down the road.

Best to get the shortest stem you can find.

It will improve your downhill riding

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## OLDGHOST (Jul 7, 2017)

fftfk,

Before dropping $ check out the R.A.D fit system. Not specific to fore/aft seat position but overall it helped me


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## r-rocket (Jun 23, 2014)

You are within the stop lines, so you are fine. There will be a slight loss of flex in the rails, but solving the back pain is way worth the slight change in rail flex.

Backs don't care about perfect fit formula's. They never took math class. If the change worked for your pain, don't try to second guess your back too much.


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## fftfk (Nov 26, 2020)

Thanks for all of the responses!


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## danno360 (May 6, 2017)

fftfk said:


> Full disclosure - I’ve got a few more years until I’m in 50+ club but I’ve got something I’m sure a lot of you have dealt with - a bad back. I just bought a new bike and the reach was just a little too much for me causing some back pain. I adjusted my seat forward and ordered a short stem plus installed a high rise handlebar I already had. The seat alone plus the handlebar seem to have been enough adjustment to alleviate the pain. Is there any issue with riding with a seat this far forward?
> View attachment 1950761
> 
> It be nice to return the stem if I don’t need it I’m just not sure if I’m inviting an issue with the seat like this. I’ve always run pretty much in the center on prior seats.





fftfk said:


> Thanks for all of the responses!


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## danno360 (May 6, 2017)

I am 58 with back problems. I use a Thompson masterpiece setback seatpost in the reverse position. I get some funny comments but I just don’t bend the way I used to. But A more upright position takes strain off my lower back and off my hands. Numbness in my palms has been a problem.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

fftfk said:


> Full disclosure - I’ve got a few more years until I’m in 50+ club but I’ve got something I’m sure a lot of you have dealt with - a bad back. I just bought a new bike and the reach was just a little too much for me causing some back pain. I adjusted my seat forward and ordered a short stem plus installed a high rise handlebar I already had. The seat alone plus the handlebar seem to have been enough adjustment to alleviate the pain. Is there any issue with riding with a seat this far forward?
> View attachment 1950761
> 
> It be nice to return the stem if I don’t need it I’m just not sure if I’m inviting an issue with the seat like this. I’ve always run pretty much in the center on prior seats.


If it places you where _you _need to be, then good to go. Stem can place the saddle back and alter the distance to the grips to achieve the same result. If you are comfortable spinning with the seat position and it works for you, off to the races.


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## kmccune (Sep 25, 2021)

TRY a cruiser style handlebar, it will get you upright and make a difference, with my lumbar(failed) fusion couldnt ride humped over craning my neck up tp see, it amazes me people can comfortably ride like that


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

kmccune said:


> TRY a cruiser style handlebar, it will get you upright and make a difference, with my lumbar(failed) fusion couldnt ride humped over craning my neck up tp see, it amazes me people can comfortably ride like that


When I see a bike with the saddle 12" higher than the stem, I can see the chiropractor bills flowing in like a river. Scoliosis doesn't help either.


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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

I’ve got some degenerated discs in my lower back, and it was only in the past ~5 years that I really learned how to deal with it best on a bike. Here is what I have found:

The issue is not how far over I am leaning. The issue is HOW I am bending.

If I am bending at the hips (tilting my pelvis) and keeping my lower back straight, it is all good. Bending at the waist…. that’s bad.

However, it is hard to lean forward like this without some flexibility in the hamstrings, so I have spent a lot of time increasing that, so that I CAN bend deeply at the hips.

Furthermore, once I gained the ability to bend/tilt more deeply at the hips, I have found that on long climbs that pedaling while leaning over more is actually easier on my lower back than riding more upright. On my road/gravel bike, I am now finding that spending time pedaling in the drops actually feels great, like I am stretching my lower back. The main reason I don’t spend more time in the drops is that it is harder on my neck. But again, the key is to NOT be bending at the waist. That needs to stay pretty flat.

Doing this has required me to tilt the saddle more forward than most saddles I see out there.

Another benefit of bending at the hips instead of the waist (lower back) is that the top of your spine ends up being more upright, thus requiring less craning of the neck to lift your head where you need it.

My approach to dealing with back pain - and in particular my posture while riding - was heavily influenced by learning Esther Gokhale’s approach to posture and back pain. It has changed the way I sit, walk, and cycle.

I also focus a lot on core strengthening.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

kapusta said:


> I’ve got some degenerated discs in my lower back, and it was only in the past ~5 years that I really learned how to deal with it best on a bike. Here is what I have found:
> 
> The issue is not how far over I am leaning. The issue is HOW I am bending.
> 
> ...


You are right, hinging at the hip is the way to go.
It also works on the down. If the back is rounded, the discs are punched on the front side. With the back straight, there is no pinching.

Hinging on the down again distributes the right evenly between the front and rear, assuming you keep your butt down and elbows way bent. 

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## hsakkire (Mar 6, 2010)

kapusta said:


> I’ve got some degenerated discs in my lower back, and it was only in the past ~5 years that I really learned how to deal with it best on a bike. Here is what I have found:
> 
> The issue is not how far over I am leaning. The issue is HOW I am bending.
> 
> ...


I have a ruptured cervical disc (non-surgical candidate)and degenerative disc disease in my lumbar and cervical regions.

I do physical therapy daily with a lot of focus on core strength. As for bike setup, mine is very non-traditional but it works for me. Do what works for you and not what others tell you. Listen to your body.

I haven't been able to sit and apply power for well over a decade. It's fine as I only single speed so I stand and climb and despite the issues I'm doing fine. 

I'll say it again, listen to your body and do whatever works for YOU.

Best of luck. I'm sure you'll figure it out even of it causes stares at the trailhead 



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## kosmo (Oct 27, 2004)

If that small of a change did the trick, don't ask the internet and start doubting yourself!

If you asked this in a more -- ahem -- youthful forum, you'd already have 15 responses telling what exercises you need to do.

That you're probably already doing. 🙃


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## kmccune (Sep 25, 2021)

Thank you, my bike riding started on a "Western Flyer' Girls bike, that worked fine until I was doubling a brother up a steep hill and twisted the crank off, now its the only posture I am comfortable with.-Kevin


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## kmccune (Sep 25, 2021)

hsakkire said:


> I have a ruptured cervical disc (non-surgical candidate)and degenerative disc disease in my lumbar and cervical regions.
> 
> I do physical therapy daily with a lot of focus on core strength. As for bike setup, mine is very non-traditional but it works for me. Do what works for you and not what others tell you. Listen to your body.
> 
> ...


Thanks, my problem is I cannot bend my back like others,My family history is scoliosis and injuries from falls and heavy lifting, the back doctor told me not to worry about "fusing" my back will it on its on( my L5 bone graft"reabsorbed, of course now its gone)-Kevin


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

rod9301 said:


> Look to see if, with pedals even horizontally, the knee cap is over the pedal shaft. If forward, it can cause knee pain and issues down the road.
> 
> Best to get the shortest stem you can find.
> 
> ...


The patella over the pedal spindle is waaay old school roadie set up. Mountain bikers have quite a bit more flexibility when it comes to seat to pedal position due to variations in frame design and the amount of body movement we use when riding varied terrain; roadies just sit and spin.

Setting up a bike should start with the seat centered, height at a comfortable position (use old bike to get a base measurement), then work on stem length and bar height.

Balance comfort with handling. I tend to prefer a high bar set than most folks and a lower seat with less leg extension.

There's no way for any of us to comment on how the OP fits a bike because we can't see you, watch you ride, know what you fit previously, or how you fit what you ride now.

I have empathy for folks trying to a fit a bike without the experience to do so on their own, but there's only one way to learn...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

kmccune said:


> Thanks, my problem is I cannot bend my back like others,My family history is scoliosis and injuries from falls and heavy lifting, the back doctor told me not to worry about "fusing" my back will it on its on( my L5 bone graft"reabsorbed, of course now its gone)-Kevin


None of us bend well when we're old, that what happens when you get old.


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## rod9301 (Oct 30, 2004)

I still maintain that you need to hinge at the hip joint, instead of rounding the back.
Binging at the hip joint allows to to maintain a straight back, which should prevent back pain.
This is even more important in the downhill because of the bigger forces involved. 

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## kapusta (Jan 17, 2004)

kmccune said:


> Thanks, my problem is I cannot bend my back like others,My family history is scoliosis and injuries from falls and heavy lifting, the back doctor told me not to worry about "fusing" my back will it on its on( my L5 bone graft"reabsorbed, of course now its gone)-Kevin


Forget about how well your back bends. You should not be bending your back.

Bend at the hips. Tilt your pelvis.

Seriously, the difference really matters.

I not going to claim this will solve all your problems (I still end some rides with some pain afterwards) but it gets you looking in the proper direction.


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