# Perfect Bikes that Never Die



## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

Some other thread about new biking inventions got me thinking about this. 

What older bikes can you think of that are so perfect that they seem timeless? What older bikes can keep up with the latest models (or even exceed them in performance)? I'm not talking about trying to huck a mid eighties hardtail. What I mean is, for trail riding, what bikes from at least five years ago still hold their own? Surely you must have an older bike in your quiver that, every time you get it out to ride, it seems perfect. My vote goes to the Fat Chance Yo Eddy. I still see people riding them on technical trails, keeping up with the rest of their group that is riding the latest, fanciest bikes (and I wish I hadn't sold mine).


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## ziggurat44 (Oct 23, 2006)

I would say almost any hardtail.
I recently resurrected my '99 fisher into a SS and have been having more fun on the trails than on my '04 fuel 100


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## KRob (Jan 13, 2004)

My Hammerhead 100x. It's been five years now since Charles came out with the HH. Working together with Alan and Chris at Titus he came up with a sweet four inch version of the classic Racer X design. I think Troy (or somebody) at OTE did the same thing even before that.

Every time I throw a leg over the HH it amazes me what a perfect bike it is. Rock solid. Quick accellerating. Sharp as a tack. Sexy. I don't think there's a four inch design out there even now that beats it. IMHO, of course.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

any santa cruz made bontrager:thumbsup:


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## Rev Bubba (Jan 16, 2004)

*IF Hardtail*

My IF must be 5-years old by now. Like someone else said, just about any well made hard tail will fit this category. There isn't much to change geometry wise on a XC hardtail. Longer forks (or any suspension fork for that matter), disc brakes, riser bars, etc., are all variations on a true classic bike. Whenever I take the IF for a ride, it certainly keeps up with my ability. In the end, it is my ability that limits me, not the bike.

I have an up-to-date FS but it just masks my lack of ability. It may let me get away with more things but it doesn't make me a better rider.


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## M.J. (Feb 23, 2004)

I have a rigid Stumpie which I bought used in 1999 for $400. I used it daily as a commuter for two years, trekked across northern Europe with it in September 2000, it's become my child carrier and occasional commuter, it remains my main mtb and performed flawlessly on the 7 Stanes in Septemer http://www.7stanes.gov.uk/forestry/achs-5rnf8m, it's also my bullet proof loaner and has been used on countless European tours by friends - most recently in Poland and Slovakia:

Day 1
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=73415
Day 2
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=73417
Day 3
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=73421
Day 4
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=73423
Day 5
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=73425


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## MC9.5 (Nov 11, 2004)

*Nothing says Classic more than......*

MC San Andreas Classic..... Been around since early 90's.... I believe it is the longest running FS design out there.:thumbsup:


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## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

MC9.5 said:


> MC San Andreas Classic..... Been around since early 90's.... I believe it is the longest running FS design out there.:thumbsup:


I was wondering when someone would get around to posting the San An. When I made the post, I was just about to mention it. It is a good design. It's the only FS I've actually ridden on the trails, though, so I didn't feel I could be a good judge comparing it to other FS designs.


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## fsp (Feb 15, 2006)

*a jumble of disconnectedness*

If you were talking about hardtails, then anything from Fat Chance, Ibis, Yeti, Mountain Goat, Klein, etc... they're still trail rockets.

But if you're talking about classic FS bikes, it'd have to be the Mantis Profloater. Probably the first FS bike that was actually done really well. Mantis had already earned the slogan "the magic ride" from their exotic steel/aluminum composite hardtails, and the profloater pretty much finished what those had started. Of the relatively small (by todays standards) number that were actually made, most are still in regular use & well loved today. A new-old-stock profloater is a pretty big deal & commands a healthy sum. After a decade to a decade and a half of hard use, a number have finally died honorable deaths and fatigued out from constant use, which, in my book, is a bit more respectable than the fate most FS bikes suffer. Getting abandoned in the rafters after a few seasons use isn't exactly telling of a well-loved classic. That the basic SP design lives on today in so many variations, and with so much success, is a testament to the Richard Cunningham's design. Good stuff. The reviews on mtbr seem to agree.

The only bikes that doen't die are those that don't get ridden.


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## MillerSHO (Sep 28, 2006)

I fail to understand how pictures of clean bikes go with this thread.


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## JM01 (Mar 29, 2005)

Guyechka said:


> Some other thread about new biking inventions got me thinking about this.
> 
> What older bikes can you think of that are so perfect that they seem timeless? .


The Balfa BB7...a few years old now but nothing comes close


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## fsp (Feb 15, 2006)

MillerSHO said:


> I fail to understand how pictures of clean bikes go with this thread.


Ah I see. Well, we're talking about old bikes that still work. To keep using a bike until it's old, means cleaning and maintain it after riding. This is the opportune time to take pictures of your bike, since you will be able to see the bike, instead of just a pile of mud. There ya go.


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## mattbikeboy (Jun 8, 2004)

MillerSHO said:


> I fail to understand how pictures of clean bikes go with this thread.


Because witha little spit-n-polish and a few hundred dollars here and there you can dress up one of these old frames to look pretty sweet. Even if it is over 10 years old.  Or with a little effort, one can redo a nice ride like new.

My first photo is my '95 profloater with a few newer parts to make her pretty and increase functionality. Idon't know how many miles are on her -- several thousand maybe.

My second photo is my '04 Litespeed Tuscany that I rebuilt a couple of months ago with Dura Ace parts (9 speed shifters and cogs, and new 10 speed era brakes, derailleurs, cranks since not every innovation really is). This Litespeed has in the neighborhood of 7,000 miles on her now.

mbb


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## MillerSHO (Sep 28, 2006)

Ya but a clean bike would imply that it might have been hardly used.


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## *rt* (Jan 15, 2004)

MillerSHO said:


> Ya but a clean bike would imply that it might have been hardly used.


see, that's a misconception. a clean bike implies that its owner loves it dearly and has the time and desire to keep the bike in perfect condition desipte riding the snot out of it.

unfortunately, while i have the desire, since i quit my job at the bike shop and got a "real" job i only have time once every couple months to do a full clean and overhaul of my bikes.

rt


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## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

My very first "real bike", a 97 Cannondale M600 complete with Kore and Control Tech parts. Of all my bikes it's the one and only that I plan to never get rid of. I admit to being hesitant to take an old, abused, thin-walled, rigid, aluminum out for a hard trail ride but last year when my FS was down I felt re-born when I took my feather light and tight handling rigid out on the smoother trails.

But mostly I love it for the fail-safe commuter that it's become. All aluminum means I don't worry about rain and snow corrosion. No suspension and simple v-brakes means there's not much to go wrong (sorry, I'll never turn it into a SS). SKS fenders, studded tires (and my slew of foul weather clothes) and lights mean it's my only ride that gets ridden anytime, all year long. 

That old bike probably gives me more smiles and groovy feelings than my 06 Stumpy and road bike combined just becuase it gets back to the most pure use of a bicycle - transportation. I swear I get as much enjoyment passing cars backed up at stoplights on snowy or rainy days on my commute to work as I do railing the singletrack or finishing a century.

I just wish I had a pic to post.


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## wooglin (Jan 6, 2004)

This whole concept of 5 years being the cutoff for a "classic" just blows me away. Maybe I'm just used to longer timelines, or maybe its just the young age of MTBing, but if a frame doesn't last 5 years, in my eyes its a POS and not worth buying in the first place. 

I've got a 90 Stumpjumper that, if I ever bought a custom frame with 26" wheels, I'd duplicate exactly (with the exception of the 1" headtube). Then I'd hang the original DX parts from the Stumpy on the new frame and call it done.


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## DashRipRock (Jul 20, 2004)

My '99 ARC and my '79 Mongoose do it for me. The ARC is mainly my 18 Road bike now, although it sees some of the ledgy stuff on the other side of the highway every now and then. The 'goose, while not exactly sporting the geometry for smoothing through the modern track rhythm sections, is still really fun to boost off curbs on the way to the mailbox.


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## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

wooglin said:


> This whole concept of 5 years being the cutoff for a "classic" just blows me away. Maybe I'm just used to longer timelines, or maybe its just the young age of MTBing, but if a frame doesn't last 5 years, in my eyes its a POS and not worth buying in the first place.
> 
> I've got a 90 Stumpjumper that, if I ever bought a custom frame with 26" wheels, I'd duplicate exactly (with the exception of the 1" headtube). Then I'd hang the original DX parts from the Stumpy on the new frame and call it done.


Yep, blows me away too that people seem to think anything a few years old is in need of replacing. That's exactly why I brought the subject up. Put your bike up against a Nomad. Tell me it is better. The thread that got me thinking was about the need for design changes yearly and the subsequent super inflated price tags. Personally, I don't think it's the bikes that need to change but the riders. For your average trail rider, you can't beat a Yo Eddy. It will still blow 99% of all new rides out of the water. But most people buy new bikes every three to five years. The question is, Are they buying something better or perhaps abandoning the best bike ever made?


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## Plummit (Jan 14, 2004)

For me... It's my Santa Cruz Bullit... Rode it just today while I was supposed to be working... Sweet reliable rig, kind trails, seasonably cool temps and poached time make the riding all the sweeter!


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## ferday (Jan 15, 2004)

JM01 said:


> The Balfa BB7...a few years old now but nothing comes close


damn straight! all the balfas are classics...


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## fat_weasel (Jan 9, 2005)

what about the SC Tazmon? There are still quite a few of those around, not to mention all the older Superlights and Hecklers.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

My '96 Klein Pulse. It's been resurected with all new comonenets, and it kicks ass.

Pictures aren't working.


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## lebikerboy (Jan 19, 2005)

Agree with the Santa Cruz Tazmon, built from '93 to '98 discontinued 'cause it cost too much to build! I still ride mine and like it better than any of my other 4 bikes.


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## palerider (Jul 15, 2004)

*simple*

My Ibis silk ti.


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## AndrewTO (Mar 30, 2005)

I can't vote one just one. That's unethical. :skep:

1) As with MC9.5 - San Andreas get's my top pick. It's received only minor tweaks here and there, mostly about improving strength and longevity. Truly, there is _nothing_ out there with a badge as old as this. It still got great reviews even 10 years after it was made.

2) close second is another i've ridden - ProFlex. While these came in a few flavours there are enthusiasts (nut jobs?) that still crave these bikes. The location of the pivot was, and still, classic ..... and copied.

Funny, both SPs. :skep:


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## JmZ (Jan 10, 2004)

Sometimes it isn't always the bike that you expect it to be either.

Bought a Univega while in college. Abused that hardtail for a few years, gave it to my little bro when he went to college, and after _trying_ to replace it for a couple of years... snagged it back. (He got an upgraded bike as a replacement) First bike that ever had the right geometry and fit right.

Still got it.

Added a Ventana El Feugo to the stable about a year ago.. and think it's gonna join the Univega as one that's gonna stick around.

JmZ


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## 29Colossus (Jun 4, 2006)

*Weasel*

I don't know about timeless, but this bike has been perfect in every way. When she was young, she used to ride trails like no other. The smoothness that the bike exhibits is undescribable. She then put on her cold weather legs, and THAT is when she really shined. In her current form, she is a rocketship that can cut your organs up and push them into your bowels with one sweeping, high-speed, cordoroy carve. Take her into the park, and she will fly as far and as long as you have the satchel to do so.

Do I like the old Foes Weasel 2? Yes I do.


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## mudpuppy (Feb 7, 2004)

Ever since I first saw one in the shop I have had a woody for the Fat Chance Yo Eddy....what a beautiful bike. I want one in my collection:


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## Frozenspokes (May 26, 2004)

Cannondale M500 resurected as a SS. This bike gets more miles than my '02 Fuel.


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## PAmtbiker (Feb 2, 2005)

*This is a good thread*

Unfortunately I have no special classic bike that is dear to my heart to tell you about... i'm to young for that... although I can see myself keeping my current Spec. Epic for a long, long time. I just really like the bike and the way it rides. It's been to Moab and done some downhilling (ish) and it is still ticking... I love the bike.


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## MillerSHO (Sep 28, 2006)

*rt* said:


> see, that's a misconception. a clean bike implies that its owner loves it dearly and has the time and desire to keep the bike in perfect condition desipte riding the snot out of it.
> 
> unfortunately, while i have the desire, since i quit my job at the bike shop and got a "real" job i only have time once every couple months to do a full clean and overhaul of my bikes.
> 
> rt


I'm just playing around.

But you will find my drivetrain 100% clean and lubed maority of the time and other moving parts pretty clean as well.
For some strange reason I love getting my bike dirty but I can't stand to leave my drivetrain dirty, it just eats away at me.


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## TrailNut (Apr 6, 2004)

my 1998 Kona Lavadome steel HT...every part has been replaced at least once


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## finger51 (Jul 21, 2006)

91 GT Zaskar. Full XT group. averaged 300 commuter days per year since I bought it. thousands and thousands of miles. replaced the rock shox mag 20 (yes 20!) and front brake about 6 years ago. great bike.


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## Tanis (Sep 13, 2006)

mudpuppy said:


> Ever since I first saw one in the shop I have had a woody for the Fat Chance Yo Eddy....what a beautiful bike. I want one in my collection:


Now this here is like a MILF. Is that a 1st gen RS Judy and is that a Ringle' seatpost? Slap a Syncro's stem and Kooka cranks with Onza grips and your talking super retro.

Nice bike!


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## xjbebop (Jul 14, 2005)

KRob said:


> My Hammerhead 100x. . Rock solid. Quick accellerating. Sharp as a tack. Sexy. I don't think there's a four inch design out there even now that beats it. IMHO, of course.


..not but a few years old now, but you should try a Turner Flux......it ROCKS!


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## SHAHEEB (Dec 4, 2004)

*Turner RFX*

It was made ahead of its time, back when there were semi-proper forks for it.

Nowdays, 6 years later the forks have finally caught up. The bike is riding better then ever before with5" in the rear&6 up front with the help of a pushed vanilla RC and a fox 36.

Its a classic, simple do anything bike, anywhere, for a long time to come.

Also polished finishes will never go out of...


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## *rt* (Jan 15, 2004)

wooglin said:


> This whole concept of 5 years being the cutoff for a "classic" just blows me away. Maybe I'm just used to longer timelines, or maybe its just the young age of MTBing, but if a frame doesn't last 5 years, in my eyes its a POS and not worth buying in the first place.
> 
> I've got a 90 Stumpjumper that, if I ever bought a custom frame with 26" wheels, I'd duplicate exactly (with the exception of the 1" headtube). Then I'd hang the original DX parts from the Stumpy on the new frame and call it done.


LOL woog. i'm with ya on that one! i've got a 1976 motobecan roadie that's still functional (after a summer doing restoration). a 5 yr old bike (which describes 2 out of my 5 current rides) is just a bike IMO.

but then again, i also drive a 15 yr old car. 

rt


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## Dan0930 (Oct 25, 2005)

The Schwinn Homegrown has to be another modern classic. Bassboat blue. damn that's pretty


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## kid4lyf (Aug 8, 2006)

The poster child for "Ahead of it's time"

AMP Research B5

Horst Leitner's crowning achievement. 
5" (OK, maybe 4.5" actual) of rear travel that actually _worked_, on a sub 5lb frame. My size medium weighed 5lbs dead-on with Risse shock.
Had an unfair rep for breaking because it was so ahead of it's time. People figured a 4" travel bike _had_ to be for downhill racing.

This one's fully carbon/ti - ed out for an honest 22lbs.
I'm 190lbs and ride hard. This bike has survived several 24hr races without a hitch.


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## sgltrak (Feb 19, 2005)

These are my daily riders. The YBB is a 17 year old design that still sells and rides well, and many riding friends only see my rigid '93 Paramount from behind.


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## Arkon (Apr 27, 2004)

You know one i see every blue moon- the Trek Y bike. I had a 98 Y-33 naked carbon model and loved that bike. You really had to use the lockout on that stratos shock though. And everyone on the hill would hear it when you'd shift. I sold mine but with an spv shock and fork that bike would still rock. What a great ride.


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## BizProf (Oct 19, 2006)

Perfect? Don't know about that, but I can't find much fault with my '99 Ventana Marble Peak FS.


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## DWF (Jan 12, 2004)

8-years old and still going strong after untold neglect & abuse! 

The one below it is twice its age and still going strong!


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## *rt* (Jan 15, 2004)

MillerSHO said:


> I'm just playing around.
> 
> But you will find my drivetrain 100% clean and lubed maority of the time and other moving parts pretty clean as well.
> For some strange reason I love getting my bike dirty but I can't stand to leave my drivetrain dirty, it just eats away at me.


LOL. sorry, i'm a little sensitive on that topic. when i worked at the bike shop my bikes glowed in the dark they were so clean. i once posted a couple pics of my bikes and promptly got accused of never riding them because they were so clean.  add that to being one of the only female employees at the bike shop and often getting asked by moron customers "do you EVEN ride a bike?" and i guess i'm a little touchy about the subject.  :blush:

rt


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## DaveX (Feb 10, 2004)

9 years old and just got a new coat of paint for it's b-day


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## Johnny Hair Boy (Jul 11, 2004)

*Go Horst*

The Amp gets my vote. To this day I don't think there is a better more versatile suspension design.


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## seenvic (Sep 9, 2003)

Steel hardtails are classics.

I got an '89 Fisher Pro Caliber. Rode it up 'til a few years ago. It's probably still fine, but I convinced myself that I had 2 other steel hardtails and didn't need to see if this old gal would ever break (with me on it).

1996 IF Steel Deluxe. I sold it to a friend w/ few resources (he wouldn't just take it). I saw it last week on the trails.


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## ecibis (Mar 11, 2004)

*mid-90's Kona's*

For me, the Kona Hot from early to mid '90's was perfect. Loved the Geometry and feel of the steel Kona's as well as the Voodoo Bizango-the original orange one. Joe Murray was right on the mark with his designs....

This photo isn't mine...I stole it from http://adamgent.fotopic.net/


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## minus9 (Oct 7, 2005)

I never want to get rid of this one


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## finger51 (Jul 21, 2006)

minus9 said:


> I never want to get rid of this one


so you like the sibex? I've got one for sale if you want a 29er version


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

DWF said:


> 8-years old and still going strong after untold neglect & abuse!
> 
> The one below it is twice its age and still going strong!


you wouldnt want to sell the orange one by any chance, would you? :thumbsup:


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## EscourtU (Aug 15, 2006)

That Paramount is kick a$s. I would have to agree with you on that one. I had a 94-95 model and still miss it. I know I may get a thrashing for this but my TREK 830 Antellope is still going strong. I also got that smooth riding Miyata that I finally took on a descent cruise tonight and it will be a great commuter.


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## romar (Sep 16, 2006)

AndrewTO said:


> I can't vote one just one. That's unethical. :skep:
> 
> 1) As with MC9.5 - San Andreas get's my top pick. It's received only minor tweaks here and there, mostly about improving strength and longevity. Truly, there is _nothing_ out there with a badge as old as this. It still got great reviews even 10 years after it was made.
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more. I promised my wife I'd sell my 857 frame to help fund the purchace of my San An. Can't bear to let the ProFlex go. This bike used to fly through light fast singletrack. As you can see, steep technical downhills are another story. Eventually I'm going to build it back up. Nothin' wrong with having more than one bike..


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## Dwayne Johanho (Sep 9, 2006)

Paramounts are the stuff of legend, they will never go out of style. My buddy just let me steal his PDG90 for $500, a price I would gladly pay again, especially for the hot Pink/Purple color combonitation it sports; dead sexy. And after replacing the original front end (the headset had never been taken apart after thousands of miles, a testimonial to its durability) with some carbon parts, bike tackles hills like an alcoholic tackles a tumbler-full of scotch.


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## DD1 (Oct 17, 2006)

Nine years on a Moots YBB, just gave it up this month for a Flux.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

mine really isnt as old as most of the bikes on here, but its like ...for the amount of abuse that this frame gets put through, it should have cracked in half almost 3 years ago. 

bought it in august of 2004 the front wheel is fine, just not on there. only stock things that have really been changed since then; fork and tires. its a full season bike too. XC/Trail/Park/street in the winter, then DH/FR/DJ/AM in the summer.


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## misctwo (Oct 24, 2004)

rkonindustry said:


> You know one i see every blue moon- the Trek Y bike. I had a 98 Y-33 naked carbon model and loved that bike. You really had to use the lockout on that stratos shock though. And everyone on the hill would hear it when you'd shift. I sold mine but with an spv shock and fork that bike would still rock. What a great ride.


a merlin titanium is pretty much a personification of infinity.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> it should have cracked in half almost 3 years ago.....
> 
> bought it in august of 2004


So it should have broken before it existed? That dosn't make sense.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

fsp said:


> But if you're talking about classic FS bikes, it'd have to be the Mantis Profloater.


Isn't that the bike that was stolen from I-Bike last year? And what's going on with the seatpost clamp? And the front brake? Looks like that one has some assembly issues.....


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## KRob (Jan 13, 2004)

xjbebop said:


> ..not but a few years old now, but you should try a Turner Flux......it ROCKS!


Yep. If the HH got stolen or breaks that's the 4 inch bike I'd choose to replace it. Looks like a great bike. Destined to be a classic.


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## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> So it should have broken before it existed? That dosn't make sense.


You're getting to be as curmudgeony as Shiggy.


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## fsp (Feb 15, 2006)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> Isn't that the bike that was stolen from I-Bike last year? And what's going on with the seatpost clamp? And the front brake? Looks like that one has some assembly issues.....


Yep, that she was. Someone elses baby now. Good eye though, HT. The front brake was just dangling there before I had spaced it out & clamped her down. That was an issue though. Mavic Xmax XL's + Marz Shiver + XTR960 discs = about 5 mm of spacers. What you're seeing in the seat collar is actually a 28.6-27.2 shim, so we could use the Easton carbon post to match the rest of Eastons carbon accessories on both show bikes. Ideally, it would have been a Thomson stem and post, but... Also, Avid gave us the uberb!tchin Saago stem, which is still one of my favorite stems of all time, so the easton model came off, just because. All that kinda made a weird build. The qr lever is flipped around backwards purely because for a few minutes there, I thought it'd look kinda sexy, like a whip cracking under the riders sweaty, straining, reddened buttocks... ...anyway, none of it mattered, cause it all walked out the door thanks to interbang's first-rate lack of security. If I'd kept it, I would have swapped the Noleen for a Risse Terminator unit, and ridden it in Moab, Froootie, the Colo Trail, & the Sporesucker on the way home. But I didn't, and we lost the company shortly afterward anyway. Oh well. You win some, you lose some.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

Guyechka said:


> You're getting to be as curmudgeony as Shiggy.


I try.


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> So it should have broken before it existed? That dosn't make sense.


1. I said ALMOST as in not completly 3 years ago
2. 2004 = almost 3 years ago.
3. read the post next time.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> 1. I said ALMOST as in not completly 3 years ago
> 2. 2004 = almost 3 years ago.
> 3. read the post next time.


I can read. January 2004 is almost 3 years ago. August 2004 is a little more than 2. You said you got the bike in August of 2004, therefore it isn't really anywhere close to 3 years old.

I have no idea why I'm even bothering to argue about this


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> I can read. January 2004 is almost 3 years ago. August 2004 is a little more than 2. You said you got the bike in August of 2004, therefore it isn't really anywhere close to 3 years old.


plenty close. also especially since its gone through 5 seasons of riding, instead of probably most of the bikes from 2004


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## EliM (May 6, 2006)

*C-dale Super V*

C-dale super V. Fairly tough and they can keep up with the some of the latest bikes.

lets see if the pic works


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## slowrider (May 15, 2004)

*my "perfect bike"*

3 or 4 years old and still the best of th 12 + fs frames I've owned.


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## Pomegranate (Oct 28, 2006)

Guyechka said:


> I'm not talking about trying to huck a mid eighties hardtail. What I mean is, for trail riding, what bikes from at least five years ago still hold their own? ... My vote goes to the Fat Chance Yo Eddy. I still see people riding them on technical trails, keeping up with the rest of their group that is riding the latest, fanciest bikes ...


Fat Chance's Yo Eddy came out about 15 years ago, closer to the tail end of that mid-eighties era than to the present.

Anything that was built before suspension jacked up everyones head tubes out-handles anything since. It's pretty hard to go wrong with a Mountain Goat (west coast riding) or a Fat Chance (east coast riding), and to a lesser degree, a Klein or Merlin. Be prepared to spend some quality $. There are a growing number of collectors driving the prices past original MSRP for these things used 15 years later. Fat Chance Big One Inch forks alone have gone for $500 & $700on occasion...


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## Sideknob (Jul 14, 2005)

For me it's my '93 Klein Pinnacle.

Still light.

Still stiff.

Still climbs and accelerates like a terrified cat.

Still carves singletrack.

Still turns the heads of those who "know."


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> plenty close. also especially since its gone through 5 seasons of riding, instead of probably most of the bikes from 2004


That isn't possible.


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## Maddog (Jul 4, 2004)

I had a '92 Paramount Series 70. Great bike. Never should have sold it. Indestructible thumb shifters and handled tight singletrack like it was on rails! Maybe I can buy it back but the guy I sold it too is now a vice principal at a high school and I'm just a teacher so he'd probably charge me $1000 for it! Steel is real!


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## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

Pomegranate said:


> Fat Chance's Yo Eddy came out about 15 years ago, closer to the tail end of that mid-eighties era than to the present.
> 
> Anything that was built before suspension jacked up everyones head tubes out-handles anything since. It's pretty hard to go wrong with a Mountain Goat (west coast riding) or a Fat Chance (east coast riding), and to a lesser degree, a Klein or Merlin. Be prepared to spend some quality $. There are a growing number of collectors driving the prices past original MSRP for these things used 15 years later. Fat Chance Big One Inch forks alone have gone for $500 & $700on occasion...


I got mine in '91 or '92. I had it for only one year before I sold it for a ridiculous price. But it had to go, since it was at least 2 inches too small for me. I tried in vain to sell it to my dad, for whom it would have been perfect. Even though it was too small and even though I had it for only one year, I could tell it was something special.


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## misctwo (Oct 24, 2004)

Maddog said:


> I had a '92 Paramount Series 70. Great bike. Never should have sold it. Indestructible thumb shifters and handled tight singletrack like it was on rails! Maybe I can buy it back but the guy I sold it too is now a vice principal at a high school and I'm just a teacher so he'd probably charge me $1000 for it! Steel is real!


CHRIST that bike was sick(for it's time). that bike, the fisher ProCaliber and the SuperCaliber were the BRIZZBOMB. i remember back then it was $850 or something close to that. I barely had $100 to my name, livin' in Phila, was dr00000Ling over that shizzle.....did you have the black with red paint splashes?

...go stick it to that vice principal and buy it back for less than you sold it.


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## AndrewTO (Mar 30, 2005)

romar said:


> Couldn't agree more. I promised my wife I'd sell my 857 frame to help fund the purchace of my San An. Can't bear to let the ProFlex go. This bike used to fly through light fast singletrack. As you can see, steep technical downhills are another story. Eventually I'm going to build it back up. Nothin' wrong with having more than one bike..


Hey look, another nut job! Oh, oops, I mean _enthusiast._  

Uhhh, let me know if you wanna upgrade those shocks. :thumbsup: Think air.  (scroll down the page a little)


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## todd_freeride (Aug 9, 2005)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> That isn't possible.


how ?
MTB "season" is like 6 months. and its a all year bike. Winter season, summer season, winter season, summer season.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

todd_freeride said:


> how ?
> MTB "season" is like 6 months. and its a all year bike. Winter season, summer season, winter season, summer season.


I don't think that counts. But whatever.

I was going by one season per year.


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## romar (Sep 16, 2006)

AndrewTO said:


> Hey look, another nut job! Oh, oops, I mean _enthusiast._
> 
> Uhhh, let me know if you wanna upgrade those shocks. :thumbsup: Think air.  (scroll down the page a little)


Upgrade?!?! Ya think I need to? That was some sweet fab work you did there AndrewTO.


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## Stregone (Aug 26, 2004)

EliM said:


> C-dale super V. Fairly tough and they can keep up with the some of the latest bikes.
> 
> lets see if the pic works


I've got one of those. '98, white frame, black swingarm. Its super stiff for how light the thing is.


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## dankilling (Feb 24, 2004)

minus9 said:


> I never want to get rid of this one


Now if you only rode it!!!


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## aliensporebomb (Feb 2, 2004)

Wow, some real dream bikes in this thread. I remember seeing many of
these in bike mags and catalogs and drooled for what I couldn't afford 
back then.

For my own thoughts, probably my old Mongoose Surge which became a
hardtail commuter bike several years ago. I don't ride it much anymore 
but I have sentimental attachment to it since it got me back to riding 
again.

I think my Specialized Epic is too new to be consider a perfect bike 
that never dies but I like it a lot.


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## zrm (Oct 11, 2006)

I rode a fat chance wicked for ten years, couldn't kill it. I got one of the last Yo Eddys before they closed up shop in 02'. That bike will probably outlive me! Any quality steel HT bike will last for years and years; simple, functional, reliable, easy to maintain and for me at least, classic geometry never goes out of style.


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## kid4lyf (Aug 8, 2006)

Glad to see someone mentioned the C-Dale Super V.
Talk about innovative design.
Probably the first widely available bike to reinvent the components of a bicycle frame, eschewing the standard double triangle design.
Possibly the most copied design of all time.
It was THE must-have bike for a lot of us; myself included.


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## DaveX (Feb 10, 2004)

kid4lyf said:


> I'm suprised no one has mentioned the C-Dale Super V.
> Talk about innovative design.
> Probably the first widely available bike to reinvent the components of a bicycle frame, eschewing the standard double triangle design.
> It was THE must-have bike for a lot of us; myself included.


Somehow I'm not surprised. If it was a such a great an innovative design they'd still be making them today. IMHO novel design does not save that bike from having run of the mill single pivot rear suspension. They may have looked cool but do you see people riding them 8, 9, or 10 years later?


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## Pomegranate (Oct 28, 2006)

kid4lyf said:


> 1. Glad to see someone mentioned the C-Dale Super V.
> 2. Talk about innovative design.
> 3. Probably the first widely available bike to reinvent the components of a bicycle frame, eschewing the standard double triangle design.
> 4. Possibly the most copied design of all time.
> 5. It was THE must-have bike for a lot of us; myself included.


1. Me too. They were pretty cool.
2. Very innovative from a fabrication standpoint
3. Not even close
4. You can't be serious
5. Myself as well


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## kid4lyf (Aug 8, 2006)

DaveX said:


> Somehow I'm not surprised. If it was a such a great an innovative design they'd still be making them today.


That may be one of the dumbest statements I've heard.
How many of the bikes in this thread are still being made?
The Horst Link is, without a doubt, one of the most influencial suspension designs ever made. It's still being licenced today.
When's the last time an AMP rolled off the assembly line?



DaveX said:


> IMHO novel design does not save that bike from having run of the mill single pivot rear suspension. They may have looked cool but do you see people riding them 8, 9, or 10 years later?


How many Yo Eddies do you see?
How many AMPs do you see?
How many Mantises?
How many Yeti ARCs?
These must have been run of the mill bikes too, right?

BTW, there are still tons of single pivot bikes being made by companies like Intense, Foes, Santa Cruz, etc.



kid4lyf said:


> 1-Glad to see someone mentioned the C-Dale Super V.
> 2-Talk about innovative design.
> 3-Probably the first widely available bike to reinvent the components of a bicycle frame, eschewing the standard double triangle design.
> 4-Possibly the most copied design of all time.
> 5-It was THE must-have bike for a lot of us; myself included.





Pomegranate said:


> 1. Me too. They were pretty cool.
> 2. Very innovative from a fabrication standpoint
> 3. Not even close
> 4. You can't be serious
> 5. Myself as well


2. Actually, from a design standpoint. Fabrication is just making jigs.
3. Really? Who else was mass producing a design like this? I'm not talking small run, boutique brands. I mean readilly available, large companies.
4. Thoughout the years I've seen similar designs on everything from stratos-priced boutiques to Wallyworld specials.
Check out the POS bikes being sold to kids at Sportmart.
Look familliar?


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## DaveX (Feb 10, 2004)

kid4lyf said:


> How many Yo Eddies do you see?
> How many AMPs do you see?
> How many Mantises?
> How many Yeti ARCs?
> These must have been run of the mill bikes too, right?


I think the point of this thread eludes you. It's not what bikes where cool back in the day. It's what old bikes are still being riden by mtbr forum members.

Check out the vintage forum, bunch a dudes there still riding Yo Eddies.


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## kid4lyf (Aug 8, 2006)

DaveX said:


> I think the point of this thread eludes you. It's not what bikes where cool back in the day. It's what old bikes are still being riden by mtbr forum members.
> 
> Check out the vintage forum, bunch a dudes there still riding Yo Eddies.


Exactly how, then, does this post belong?


DaveX said:


> If it was a such a great an innovative design they'd still be *making* them today.


My point was that almost none of the bikes in this thread would meet your criteria, would they?
I think to dismiss a bike as "run of the mill single pivot design" is foolish given the nature of this thread.
Is an ARC or Klein a _run of the mill aluminum hardtail_?

BTW, I do see far more Super Vs than Yo Eddys on the trails.
I believe the fact that it was an innovative design makes it timeless.


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## Pomegranate (Oct 28, 2006)

kid4lyf said:


> T
> 2. Actually, from a design standpoint. Fabrication is just making jigs.
> 3. Really? Who else was mass producing a design like this? I'm not talking small run, boutique brands. I mean readilly available, large companies.
> 4. Thoughout the years I've seen similar designs on everything from stratos-priced boutiques to Wallyworld specials.
> ...


2. Then no. From a design standpoint, this bike was not innovative. It didn't innovate the mid single pivot. It didn't innovate non-diamond frames, it didn't innovate tube & sheet froming, it didn't innovate anything. All that was being done for several years by the actual innovators. What Cannondale did was take those aspects and mass produce them. That was innovative. No other large builder was so willing to retool for unconventional. In those days innovation _was _in the boutique brands. Not sure why they suddenly don't count in your book. The statement that "Fabrication is just making jigs" borders on offensive.
3. The actual innovators were... nearly everyone else making bikes at that time. The SuperV was cool in its own way, but it followed the Mantis Flying V & Profloater, Yeti's Interbang & O'show bike, the Mt Cycle San Andreas, the Kestrel Nitro concept rig, the Monolith, the Fox, Trimble, etc... the list would be enormous. Not that Cannondale was totally unimaginitive. Their innovation back then came in being able to mass produce unusual designs efficiently when the rest of us weren't able to.
4. Yes. And if you look closely, you'll see they're URT's. I'm not going to get into the design history of URT's, but I will say that the particular design you're seeing everywhere predates the SuperV by 4 years, and those wallyworld specials (the legit ones, anyway) are indeed licensed from the original patent holders. ...one of whom was my boss at the time.

That was more time than I was looking to spend writing. Any further notions can be cleared up by simply posting your original post in the "vintage, retro, classic" forum. You will get a lot more and better input than what I've been able to remember off the top of my head.


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## kid4lyf (Aug 8, 2006)

Pomegranate said:


> 2. Then no. From a design standpoint, this bike was not innovative. It didn't innovate the mid single pivot. It didn't innovate non-diamond frames, it didn't innovate tube & sheet froming, it didn't innovate anything. All that was being done for several years by the actual innovators. What Cannondale did was take those aspects and mass produce them. That was innovative. No other large builder was so willing to retool for unconventional. In those days innovation _was _in the boutique brands. Not sure why they suddenly don't count in your book. The statement that "Fabrication is just making jigs" borders on offensive.
> 3. The actual innovators were... nearly everyone else making bikes at that time. The SuperV was cool in its own way, but it followed the Mantis Flying V & Profloater, Yeti's Interbang & O'show bike, the Mt Cycle San Andreas, the Kestrel Nitro concept rig, the Monolith, the Fox, Trimble, etc... the list would be enormous. Not that Cannondale was totally unimaginitive. Their innovation back then came in being able to mass produce unusual designs efficiently when the rest of us weren't able to.
> 4. Yes. And if you look closely, you'll see they're URT's. I'm not going to get into the design history of URT's, but I will say that the particular design you're seeing everywhere predates the SuperV by 4 years, and those wallyworld specials (the legit ones, anyway) are indeed licensed from the original patent holders. ...one of whom was my boss at the time.
> 
> That was more time than I was looking to spend writing. Any further notions can be cleared up by simply posting your original post in the "vintage, retro, classic" forum. You will get a lot more and better input than what I've been able to remember off the top of my head.


I am a fabricator.
I find that fabrication statement to be largely true and without offense (perhaps I'm thick skinned).
Innovating fabrication means a change in the manufacturing process. I know of no such changes incorporated by C-Dale here, cetainly none I'm referring to.
To me, C-Dale was the first to make this design widely available. They were the first large scale company to have the balls to create and market somthing out of the ordinary.
It left the Treks, Schwinns, GTs, and Giants in the dust.
Was it their own, completely new design?
Probably not.
Let's face it, almost nothing is ever truly _new_, anymore.
There is always going to be someone who thought about it earlier.
I don't think that was the direction of the thread. It was, as I saw it, supposed to be about those bikes that have been ridden and are still out there being ridden, not the early semi-prototypes.
It that context, I stand by my statement that the Super V was an innovative design.
There were very few bikes like it and none being built and sold on that level.
At the very least, it was the most successful and I believe it deserves to be included here.
Sorry, really didn't mean to start a $hit storm.


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## MK_ (Nov 15, 2004)

SHAHEEB said:


> It was made ahead of its time, back when there were semi-proper forks for it.
> 
> Nowdays, 6 years later the forks have finally caught up. The bike is riding better then ever before with5" in the rear&6 up front with the help of a pushed vanilla RC and a fox 36.
> 
> ...


I couldn't agree more. 5in in the rear and 6in up front is indeed the ticket, too. Pushed Vanilla RC, indeed, but a 66SL up front. In my case.


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## watchman (Jul 21, 2006)

Yeti PRO F.R.O. was a perfect bike for its intended use and I have a Diamond Back Ti hardtail frame will always be ridden in some form or another.


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## cobym2 (Apr 11, 2005)

From the more "modern" bikes, I think the Heckler will go a long long way. its still in production after how long?


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## poff (Dec 23, 2003)

Both are not mine...


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## Maddog (Jul 4, 2004)

Mine was black with kind of an intermitent fade to purple then back to black. It looked great! It was $1,000 bucks with a Manitou 2 upgrade fork at a long gone LBS. The V.P. may end up evaluating me someday so it may not be wise to stick it to him. Besides, he's probably so busy at meetings which always take V.P.'s off campus all the time, that the bike is probably rusting away in his back yard!


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## helexia23 (Jul 26, 2006)

I vote my 1998 Heckler. See photo attached. Everything on it has been replaced a few times but the frame keeps going strong.


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## zrm (Oct 11, 2006)

Fat Chance Yo Eddy. One of the finest mountian bikes ever made. I still ride mine all the time.


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## scorpionwoman (Jul 7, 2006)

The paint job on that second one is absolutely gorgeous. Wow.

But it's such a work of art, I'd be afraid to use it.


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## Guyechka (Jul 19, 2005)

scorpionwoman said:


> The paint job on that second one is absolutely gorgeous. Wow.
> 
> But it's such a work of art, I'd be afraid to use it.


And the welds! Don't forget those! You're right, though. I would just hang it up over my mantle and admire it.


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## hollister (Sep 16, 2005)

*sweet jesus!*



poff said:


> Both are not mine...


then who's are they?
dont get me wrong,i would sell my soul for p.i.s.s off, but that fat ti with morati cranks, first gen ultimates, and a white industries LMDS


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## cj2a11713 (Oct 19, 2006)

the san andreas has always been my dream bike and now i'm building one. it's a 1993.


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## kornholyo_1968 (Jul 23, 2006)

*Marin Mount Vision 2002*

Roughly four years old but it still looks sharp on the trail.


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## zrm (Oct 11, 2006)

Another loving and satisfied Yo Eddy owner. I have a FS epic, but the Fat still gets plenty of use.


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