# Best cut-beam light? Ravemen PR1600, Fenix BC35R, MagicShine RN1500, or other?



## hoffsta (Aug 17, 2010)

Hey there- I’m in the market for a new battery powered city/bike path light, and I’d prefer to get one with a cutoff beam shape. Reading through various reviews and threads here, it seems the top contenders (aside from $Lupine$) are the following:

Raveman PR1600
Fenix BC35R
MagicShine/Olight RN1500
Gloworm CX (not a true cutoff beam)

My priorities would be for a neutral color temp, even beam spread with decent side spill, runtime, mountable upside down preferred, and possibly can run while powered from external power bank.

Of those listed above which would you rand as the best for my needs, and are there any others I’ve overlooked? Thanks for the excellent forum discussions!


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

Forgot the only light that actually has a true cutoff line. 

https://www.outboundlighting.com/product/focal-series-road-edition/

All the other lights on that list just make a square-ish shaped blob, and despite the marketing materials, are not a true cutoff line optic.

We are working on an internal battery version, but some others that are "actual" cutoff line optics that I would trust (aside from ours) at various price points would be stuff from Busch & Mueller:

The Ixon Space is kind of massive, and the beam pattern has a lot of artifacts which can be removed with some light sanding of the lens, but the beam pattern isn't actually all that bad.
https://www.amazon.com/BUSCH-MÜLLER...child=1&qid=1607028017&sr=8-17&srs=8102242011

The Core line is impressive Design For Manufacturing (I've torn it down myself) and not a bad little light. Not a ton of lumens but lasts a long time and about the size of a Lumina 1200:

https://www.amazon.com/Busch-Müller...child=1&qid=1607028032&sr=8-52&srs=8102242011


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## hoffsta (Aug 17, 2010)

Wow- I hadn’t heard of Outbound. You have built a very impressive optic there! I have a couple of B&M dynamo lights and that’s where I gained my appreciation for cutoff beams, however after watching the video on your site, I think yours is more impressive. The beam spread is remarkably free from distracting artifacts!

Get the all-in-one package done and I’m sold. Any eta on when that might happen? Here are a couple of features from other lights that I’d love to see you incorporate:

1) flexible mounting options. Lights that can use GoPro or Garmin mounts are far more desirable in my opinion than a bar mount only. Also I’d love to see you include the ability to mount from the top or bottom, as I’d like to hang mine below the out-front computer mount or under my basket.

2) USB-C in and out charging. The ability to top off my phone or computer from the light itself is a very slick feature. Also, being able to keep the light running from any ordinary battery pack makes it much more appealing than proprietary packs only, or no ability to run from additional source.

3) wireless remote. Like I said, I’d like to have the light mounted out front or under the basket. Those wireless remotes on the handlebar are the future, imho.

4) incorporate a second “high beam” that I can flash at drivers or use for short durations off-road. I ride primarily on established paths, but I do like to dip into some trails and having a wide flood beam onboard in a single light would amazing.

5) Programmable settings for the buttons. Being able to specify the order of light modes would be the cherry on top. I find I only use two or three modes and detest having to cycle through the rest every-time. 

Man- if you could pack all of most of those features into that amazing optic you developed, you’d have THE best and most versatile road light on the planet.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

hoffsta said:


> Wow- I hadn't heard of Outbound. You have built a very impressive optic there! I have a couple of B&M dynamo lights and that's where I gained my appreciation for cutoff beams, however after watching the video on your site, I think yours is more impressive. The beam spread is remarkably free from distracting artifacts!
> 
> Get the all-in-one package done and I'm sold. Any eta on when that might happen? Here are a couple of features from other lights that I'd love to see you incorporate:
> 
> ...


Our goal is to launch a self-contained road light aimed at commuters/group riders that is a single low beam, about the size of Hangover that can be put in a jersey pocket or pant pocket at a lower price point. Working on that currently and hope for a late summer release.

That will have the same features as hangover. Easy to use button, flexible mounting options (top and bottom as you mentioned, along with our new quick release system), USB-C quick charge and charge-on-the-go. However the charging other items probably won't work, adds a lot of complexity and cost.

We plan on developing a remote in conjunction with a higher-end road light that has a low and high beam, but that honestly is 2022 goals. Not immediate as we know we need to get a lower-priced true cut-off optic with a self-contained battery out there first to expand our customer base.

Have lots of friends who did group rides before the pandemic where they would ride to a bar, but they actually wouldn't use the Road edition because they didn't have the space to put the battery pack and lighthead in their pockets, so I totally get that. Same with riders who are commuting and lock up their bikes outside, they just want something to pop off easy and take inside with them.


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## hoffsta (Aug 17, 2010)

Awesome what you’re doing, you’ve gained a new fan. Sounds like I need to get a temporary cheap light to fill the time before you release yours. I will absolutely buy it and your 2022 light! Thanks for the reply.


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## hoffsta (Aug 17, 2010)

Actually, I was so impressed with what you’re doing and your optics that I just purchased the road edition partly because it’s the best light I could find for my use and partly just to support your company. Looking forward to buying the self-contained unit when it’s released. Thanks!


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

hoffsta said:


> Hey there- I'm in the market for a new battery powered city/bike path light, and I'd prefer to get one with a cutoff beam shape. Reading through various reviews and threads here, it seems the top contenders (aside from $Lupine$) are the following:
> 
> Raveman PR1600
> Fenix BC35R
> ...


None of those have a real cut-off as sharp as the B&M Lights (or other StVZO lights or the Outbound Focal Road) do have.
The best of all the Raveman lights with regards to cut-off is probably the CR1000.

I am always looking for new cut-off lights, but the high-power cutoff light market is still pretty small (at least if one looks for dedicated battery lights, not e-bike lights).

Besides Lupine there is
Busch&Müller with its Ixon Space, there is cateye with the new GVolt100, Sigma Aura 80 is pretty solid, the Lezyne 115 (StVZO) is bright but has a more narrowish beam pattern.

None of those have really a neutral or warm color temp, with outbound being the most on the neutral side.

There is a cheap but solid chinese light with 4000K LED: Lumintop B01. If properly adjusted, the light is really glarefree, but for this light an "off-the-shelf" reflector was combined with a unfitting LED, so the beam pattern has definitely room for improvements. There is too much light in front of the bike (in the range 18-30 ft) and too little at the cut-off, making it hard for the eye to adapt to the darker area beyond 30 ft. Still for ca 30 USD (+shipping) it's a fair deal.


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

Outbound said:


> We plan on developing a remote in conjunction with a higher-end road light that has a low and high beam, but that honestly is 2022 goals.


That sounds very interrrrrresting :drumroll: 
Please keep the color temp as much on the neutral to neutral-warm side as you can do, there are enough off this type of ligts with cold beam color on the market!
Drop me a line if you need a critical guinea pig for testing on roads and gravel roads, i'll be happy to help. If i like it, i even buy it then


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

What BuMM manages to do with relatively low-powered dies/low power draw circuitry is pretty much black magic [ie, excellent engineering]. I have an IQ-X on one bike (that's regulated to 6 volts, 3 watts of power), and while it is definitely underpowered compared to an Outbound Focal on high, it has throw equivalent to the medium-high mode, with about half-as-narrow beam pattern to the sides. That's enough light to ride the bike (with a helmet light--I don't have a death wish) even on singeltrack.

If these things were available 30 years ago, I doubt battery-powered lights would have taken off. As it is, it's taken a long time for generator-driven lights to become viable. I think the first REAL powerful one that could totally replace a battery driven light was the Cyo or Edeluxe. The hubs have definitely improved over their contemporaries, too. OP, if you have the mechanical aptitude, you can get a BuMM Cyo, a basic-ish Shimano generator hub, and spokes to re-lace a wheel for ~$250. A wired taillight or higher-level headlight might bump the price up to $300 or a bit more. I know that when I was commuting by bicycle, I came to appreciate not having to charge front/rear lights all the time when it started getting dark.


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## wschruba (Apr 13, 2012)

What BuMM manages to do with relatively low-powered dies/low power draw circuitry is pretty much black magic [ie, excellent engineering]. I have an IQ-X on one bike (that's regulated to 6 volts, 3 watts of power), and while it is definitely underpowered compared to an Outbound Focal on high, it has throw equivalent to the medium-high mode, with about half-as-narrow beam pattern to the sides. That's enough light to ride the bike (with a helmet light--I don't have a death wish) even on singeltrack.

If these things were available 30 years ago, I doubt battery-powered lights would have taken off. As it is, it's taken a long time for generator-driven lights to become viable. I think the first REAL powerful one that could totally replace a battery driven light was the Cyo or Edeluxe. The hubs have definitely improved over their contemporaries, too. OP, if you have the mechanical aptitude, you can get a BuMM Cyo, a basic-ish Shimano generator hub, and spokes to re-lace a wheel for ~$250. A wired taillight or higher-level headlight might bump the price up to $300 or a bit more. I know that when I was commuting by bicycle, I came to appreciate not having to charge front/rear lights all the time when it started getting dark.


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## Vancbiker (May 25, 2005)

wschruba said:


> ......If these things were available 30 years ago, I doubt battery-powered lights would have taken off..........


For hardcore commuting or bikepacking, maybe. For recreational night riding, not a chance.

Increased cost every time you get a new bike or wheelset. Increased weight that you ride with all the time unless you have a spare wheel. Adding 3-6+W of drag to the bike while night riding. All downsides for the recreational night rider.


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## tacoma22 (Feb 27, 2020)

Outbound lights are awesome. I thought my nite rider lights got the job done (1200 on bars 850 on helmet) but I rode with a buddy with the outbound set up..needles to say I am ordering the new trail evo. 

It was a huge difference in color, spread and range. The outbound lights were just that much better. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## angerdan (Sep 18, 2017)

Outbound said:


> self-contained road light
> aimed at commuters/group riders
> a single low beam
> about the size of Hangover
> ...


Thats good news!

6) How do you define a lower price point?
7) What makes a button easy to use?
9) does this mean the light can pe powered by a powerbank during use?
10) remote sounds very good. What functions do you plan, how to switch them and how about the construction and connection of the remote?

What about the colour temperature, will it be neutral white 3300K - 5300K ?
I do hope that it will be at least below the 5900K of the sun: 
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature#Categorizing_different_lighting

How will the beam be designed?
Will it consider to be usable for speeds >25km/h (15.5mph), meaning that the farest point ogf the beam has a higher illuminance than the nearest point?



biking_tg said:


> I am always looking for new cut-off lights, but the high-power cutoff light market is still pretty small (at least if one looks for dedicated battery lights, not e-bike lights).
> Besides Lupine there is
> Busch&Müller with its Ixon Space,
> cateye with the new GVolt100,
> ...


At first i have to mention the missing Supernova M99 Mini Pro B54:
supernova-lights.com/en/m99-mini-pro-b54/
dropbox.com/s/u0sjn8db1zpw2c7/Supernova-M99-MINI-PROB54_Preisliste.pdf
/shop.supernova-design.com/de_DE/shop/product/m99-mini-pro-b54-231

Second the not named flagship model from Lupine:
lupine.de/products/bike-lights/road-bike-lights/sl-ax

The Supernova M99 Pure has a warmer color temperature.


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

angerdan said:


> At first i have to mention the missing Supernova M99 Mini Pro B54:[....]
> The Supernova M99 Pure has a warmer color temperature.


i was listing "low beam only" lights. Since Lupine was already noted as too expensive, there was no point in mentioning the 520 EUR Supernova battery version.
Outbound is still a bit warmer than the supernova lights (at least warmer than the M99 Mini Pro 25 i have seen)


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

wschruba said:


> What BuMM manages to do with relatively low-powered dies/low power draw circuitry is pretty much black magic [ie, excellent engineering]. I have an IQ-X on one bike (that's regulated to 6 volts, 3 watts of power), and while it is definitely underpowered compared to an Outbound Focal on high, it has throw equivalent to the medium-high mode, with about half-as-narrow beam pattern to the sides. That's enough light to ride the bike (with a helmet light--I don't have a death wish) even on singeltrack.
> 
> If these things were available 30 years ago, I doubt battery-powered lights would have taken off. As it is, it's taken a long time for generator-driven lights to become viable. I think the first REAL powerful one that could totally replace a battery driven light was the Cyo or Edeluxe. The hubs have definitely improved over their contemporaries, too. OP, if you have the mechanical aptitude, you can get a BuMM Cyo, a basic-ish Shimano generator hub, and spokes to re-lace a wheel for ~$250. A wired taillight or higher-level headlight might bump the price up to $300 or a bit more. I know that when I was commuting by bicycle, I came to appreciate not having to charge front/rear lights all the time when it started getting dark.


Yep, B&M does stuff right with their engineering. They are fond of using the OSRAM Black Flat series of chips. I prefer the Lumiled Altilon or CREE XD16/XQE but they all have the same concept. Small emitter for superior beam control and thus more efficient.

B&M could improve a little with their actual beam pattern "finishing", aka the small artifacts from their outer lenses but overall are a great choice.

Just a note on the "if these were available 30 years ago" quip. The only reason we can get this kind of beam pattern and small power draw is the newest generation of LED chips, it's why now every new car is LED headlights because the dies got small enough to actually properly control the beam. 30 years ago would have been stuck with H11 bulbs that would take 55W to generate 1000 lumens. Now it only takes around 8-10W to generate the same power. Combine that power efficiency with the tiny emitters that lets us downsize the reflector size into something compact and that's why the latest generation of headlights for bikes are miles ahead of what was available even 10-15 years ago.


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## Outbound (Aug 23, 2017)

angerdan said:


> Thats good news!
> 
> 6) How do you define a lower price point?
> 7) What makes a button easy to use?
> ...


6. About the same price as Hangover
7. Same button as Hangover (large, easy to locate without looking, easy to use with gloves on)
9. Yep, just like Hangover and Evo. By then should have our DC5521 to USB adapter out letting people use old powerbanks too.
10. We've got some tricks up our sleeves for remotes. Going to stay quiet on that one. 

Beam pattern is designed for road riding. The Road Edition beam pattern had to work around some constraints to make the beam pattern for Trail work in the same housing. So focal length, depth, etc was fixed so it wasn't as optimized as I'd like. In this case we've developed this new Road optic to use 1/2 the lumens of the original Road but still have higher peak intensity. It's a little narrower but of course plenty of spill around the bike and off to the side.

I developed a new "supercomputer" this summer to help with our thermal and optical simulations and letting us make a LOT more revisions a lot quicker using some seriously intense rayfiles. Combine that with some algorithms we are using to essentially machine-learn the most optimal optic for actual on-road performance, the results should be super impressive.


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## lostplaces (Aug 21, 2019)

hoffsta said:


> Of those listed above which would you rand as the best for my needs, and are there any others I've overlooked? Thanks for the excellent forum discussions!


Lumintop B01. ~30$

excellent workmanship "like all lumintops"
~110 gramms
free choice of li-ion battery from 18650-21700 size fit, anythink can be used.
fast swap a empty to full battery."no glues in battery **** what you see in junk stuff"
full regulated brightness modes."only turbo have a timer and can be used for 3 minutes"
high delivers 500 Lumen and with a 5000mah battery in you get ~4 hours 15 minute runtime
pefect selected 4000K tint for streed uses.
sharp cut-off but not jumping beam like in other allot of stupid construted lights about the cut..
you think that is not possible, the beam will always jump ugly before your bike? try it out.

the light delivers additional to all that a homogeneous smooth wide overall beam that will impress you.

for me its not importand, i charge batterys in external chargers but its possible that it will be for you.
it have a USB charge port, so any li-ion iside the light can be charged, so you can abuse the light to be a single li-ion charger.
power the light over USB without a battery inside same like run it in hybrid mode charge battery inside+ run the light at once is also normal.

you like to power the light with a powerbank? why not, and will not carry the extra li-ion in the light?
the remove it.
any other lights gives you this option?

you have no limitations in anythink on serious lights.

the next step up to the B01 comes from acebeam BK10 with near all similar aspects, only the output is in much much bigger"2000 lumens" range.
the runtimes higher in siimlar brighness settings and the beam is tigher but longer.
to this date the best product i ever have seen in this chategory but much more expenive"130$".

if you will get the best for your money take the lumintop B01, you will *lol *if you see outbound. lupine or others in compare to it, all a joke.

smooth but clean eyefriendly great looking beam with a sharp cut off but no jumping beam before your eye all off them will not deliver you.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Outbound said:


> ...*We plan on developing a remote in conjunction with a higher-end road light that has a low and high beam, but that honestly is 2022 goals.* Not immediate as we know we need to get a lower-priced true cut-off optic with a self-contained battery out there first to expand our customer base.


What the... ( _THUMP,_ me falling out of my chair )....A road lamp with remote!........Now who in hell would want something like that? ( extreme sarcasm implied )...😜


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## u2v2w2 (Feb 6, 2021)

biking_tg said:


> None of those have a real cut-off as sharp as the B&M Lights (or other StVZO lights or the Outbound Focal Road) do have.
> The best of all the Raveman lights with regards to cut-off is probably the CR1000.
> 
> I am always looking for new cut-off lights, but the high-power cutoff light market is still pretty small (at least if one looks for dedicated battery lights, not e-bike lights).
> ...


Well in other forums it has been said that beam pattern of Fenix bc35r reminds of Busch and Mueller. Seems like Fenix bc25r has smoother and and more appropriate beam than bc35r (should be brighter at the top while gradually decrease and the bottom). Fenix bc35r should be better one for it's price and gimmicky features, but looks like bc25r has turned out better despite some more apparent tint shift in the beam. Both are more or less 4300k - 4500k when testing with Light Spectrum Pro Evo app.


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## u2v2w2 (Feb 6, 2021)

biking_tg said:


> None of those have a real cut-off as sharp as the B&M Lights (or other StVZO lights or the Outbound Focal Road) do have.
> The best of all the Raveman lights with regards to cut-off is probably the CR1000.
> 
> I am always looking for new cut-off lights, but the high-power cutoff light market is still pretty small (at least if one looks for dedicated battery lights, not e-bike lights).
> ...


Well in other forums it has been said that beam pattern of Fenix bc35r reminds of Busch and Mueller. Seems like Fenix bc25r has smoother and and more appropriate beam than bc35r (should be brighter at the top while gradually decrease towards the bottom, more noticeable IRL than photo). Fenix bc35r should be better due to it's high price and gimmicky features, but looks like bc25r has turned out better despite some more apparent tint shift in the beam. Both are more or less 4300k - 4500k when testing with Light Spectrum Pro Evo app.

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/l68cfu


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## biking_tg (Dec 27, 2018)

Yes, the BC25R has the better cut-off. However there is for both lights too much light in the middle of the beam. It reminds of a B&M (or other german StVZO approved bike light), but both lights lack the layered brightness distribution required to obtain usable glare free throw.


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## u2v2w2 (Feb 6, 2021)

biking_tg said:


> Yes, the BC25R has the better cut-off. However there is for both lights too much light in the middle of the beam. It reminds of a B&M (or other german StVZO approved bike light), but both lights lack the layered brightness distribution required to obtain usable glare free throw.


After reflowing and dedoming/shaving SST-20 95cri 2700k (measured 3300k) in Fenix Bc25r the horizontal upper layer got narrower and brighter, while the foreground layer seems to have become slightly less bright.
Dedoming (shaving) XHP50A 90cri 3000k (measured 3200k) in Fenix bc35r didn't made any overly noticeable changes, so it might be useful as a high beam and for flashing oncoming vehicles only.
The Fenix bc25r currently is mounted on the fork crown, but probably will have to mount it higher to reduce any possible foreground glare since as I understand it's designed for handlebar mounting height only. The possible distraction due to wheel shadow is another aspect.


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## u2v2w2 (Feb 6, 2021)

Forgot to mention that I had to add


biking_tg said:


> Yes, the BC25R has the better cut-off. However there is for both lights too much light in the middle of the beam. It reminds of a B&M (or other german StVZO approved bike light), but both lights lack the layered brightness distribution required to obtain usable glare free throw.


Unfortunately forgot to mention that I had to add some upper and lower 2-3.5cm long hoods/shields for reduction of nearfield illumination. Since sideways reflection from those shields also serves as a conspicuoty light then then wastage is minimal.
Someone on candlepowerforums said that many car headlights also have bad nearfield illumination.


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