# Stupidest lightweight parts ever made?



## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

Discuss. 
Extra points for certain death-dismemberment upon failure. 
Triple points if it were produced in the drillium/3dv years.


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## jbsteven (Aug 12, 2009)

Aluminum eggbeater spindles


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## Nels (May 18, 2004)

I'd have to go with those aluminum egg beater spindles


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

jbsteven said:


> Aluminum eggbeater spindles


That's one of the one's that got me started, SRP Ti spindles for 959's.

Or X-Pedo 3-T, hey, the bearings, suck, they barely release, AND they break!
Good thing they aren't cheap!


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

Let's go a little farther back into history:
Ti mag 21 stanchions


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## IM31408 (Dec 24, 2008)

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=74188&start=30


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

This should be a monster thread


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

Alloy nipples


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)

Andrea138 said:


> Alloy nipples


Disagree. 
Built right, maintained correctly, few problems. (and if one or two fail, well, so what) I have alloy spoke front wheels that are still going after 20 years.
I am talking truly, astoundingly DUMB.


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## jbsteven (Aug 12, 2009)

Andrea138 said:


> Alloy nipples


Never a problem with the dozens of wheel sets I have. Now that think of it I have never used a non aluminum nipple.


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

IM31408 said:


> http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=74188&start=30


I was going to post that...

The name of the company should be Zero Technology


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

I have a winner

3333€ Tune Sixpack (propietary interface) Skyline BB. Aluminium axle and full ceramic bearings...


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

Alu stem bolts. Those alu eggbeater spindles are WAY up on the list.


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## rideit (Jan 22, 2004)




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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

my favourite - Power Cordz 1.2mm derailleur cables

masses of cable drag - then sticky + stretch if clamped too tight = well worth the cost


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## 92gli (Sep 28, 2006)

Andrea138 said:


> Alloy nipples


 Another expert wheelbuilder I guess.


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## IM31408 (Dec 24, 2008)

rideit said:


>


These work surprisingly well on a road bike, even though it looks like they wouldn't last one ride. If I remember correctly, the story behind these is that they were built for show bikes, but someone actually rode them and they worked reasonably well, so they started making them for everyday usage. Not so sure about mountain bikes though.


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

rideit said:


>


Gold at 08 Olympics...

https://www.slowtwitch.com/Features/Interbike_Las_Vegas_-_Day_3_report_543.html


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

Ti spindles for Onza clipless pedals...one broke before I got to the end of my driveway ( I weigh 160lbs)
NukeProof and TNT bonded hubs....they unbonded pretty quickly.
Topline and Kooka cranks...guaranteed to break and leave a nice big jagged edge

As for new stuff: Crank Bros Cobalt SL h/s...


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## karl711 (Mar 26, 2009)

Nobu shifters. Good idea crap performance.


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

rideit said:


> Disagree.
> Built right, maintained correctly, few problems. *(and if one or two fail, well, so what)* I have alloy spoke front wheels that are still going after 20 years.
> I am talking truly, astoundingly DUMB.


The annoyance factor increases significantly when your wheels are set up tubeless.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

the mayor said:


> As for new stuff: Crank Bros Cobalt SL h/s...


I've had decent luck with the stainless version of that headset, but the regular version is total trash. My wife went through two of them on a MTB before CB gave us a stainless as a warranty replacement. She really needed the lower stack height, otherwise we'd have never even looked at them.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Andrea138 said:


> Alloy nipples


carbon nipples?

pic from here: http://www.rouesartisanales.com


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## RWGreen (Dec 5, 2004)

rideit said:


> Let's go a little farther back into history:
> Ti mag 21 stanchions


Yes! I had ti stanchions for my original Manitou fork - they didn't break, but had so much static friction since they weren't polished that the fork essentially became rigid.


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

Andrea138 said:


> Alloy nipples


Can we leave my nipples out of this, please??


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

briscoelab said:


> I've had decent luck with the stainless version of that headset, but the regular version is total trash. My wife went through two of them on a MTB before CB gave us a stainless as a warranty replacement. She really needed the lower stack height, otherwise we'd have never even looked at them.


I botched the first install...very easy to do.
some one who, ummm, should know better...did the second install....and it disintegrated in 1 ride.


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

How bout the super thin walled aluminum bars that flooded the market in the mid 90's


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## the mayor (Nov 18, 2004)

How bout the Tioga Tension Disk wheel?
Mine broke after 2 rides


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## stig (Jan 20, 2004)

Tune Gum Gum. Completely useless.


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## IM31408 (Dec 24, 2008)

http://www.afcbike.com/tr/?p=94

http://www.afcbike.com/tr/?p=139

Aluminum skewers and rotor bolts. There are some areas I just wouldn't use aluminum, and these would be some of those places.


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

I have 2 of those CB Cobalt SL headsets. I used 1 of them for about a year before I changed it out for the KCNC Morion (weight reduction) but it worked just fine while I used it. The 2nd one has been in use on my son's bike for 2 years now and it's also fine. They were both the stainless version though.


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## jadis3 (Nov 18, 2007)

stig said:


> Tune Gum Gum. Completely useless.


Tune Pulsar magnet, completely useless too.


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## highdelll (Oct 3, 2008)

ghetto-tubeless w/ rubber cement painted on the inside of the tire


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## ginsu2k (Jul 28, 2006)

*215g XTR Seatpost!*










Shimano XTR seatpost used Easton tubing with extraordinarily thin walls. I returned it for a Thompson because it scared me.

Bike Type Mountain Biking
Brand Shimano
Colors Silver
Diameter 26.8, 27, 27.2, 30.4 (400mm length only), 30.9 (400 mm length only)
Length 330 mm
Material Aluminum
Weight *215 g*


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## fastback67 (Apr 6, 2010)

my old xtr post had a tube made of steel

absolutely useless: SEC twist shifter


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

Berkley said:


> The annoyance factor increases significantly when your wheels are set up tubeless.


Yeah, more this than anything. I'm no "expert wheel builder" by any means- it's more of a benefit vs. annoyance factor. If you don't mind the little bit of extra care they take, then, by all means, go for it.

I stand by my dislike of alloy chainring bolts, though


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## Atmos (Oct 20, 2006)

Definitely those crappy SEC Twist Shifters.


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## [email protected] (Oct 1, 2005)

Howabout Ringle seatposts from the 90's that broke into a razor sharp kinfe blade lookin to change your gender!


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## MarcoL (Jun 3, 2007)

nokon carbon cable...:nono:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

rideit said:


> Let's go a little farther back into history:
> Ti mag 21 stanchions


Hey those actually worked ! They were just too expensive though so they replaced them with the aluminium ones which had to be much thicker walled and heavier to get the stiffness the same as the Ti ones.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

the mayor said:


> Ti spindles for Onza clipless pedals...one broke before I got to the end of my driveway ( I weigh 160lbs)
> NukeProof and TNT bonded hubs....they unbonded pretty quickly.
> Topline and Kooka cranks...guaranteed to break and leave a nice big jagged edge
> 
> As for new stuff: Crank Bros Cobalt SL h/s...


Others got decent performance from the Onza Ti pedals, I've never broken any of my Topline or Kooka cranks, even my 365g 175mm Topline XLS and 405 gram 180mm 5-bolt standard pattern Kookas. As to Nukeproof hubs... the problem wasn't the bonding... it was the 7075 T6 flanges with the nice square edges of the first generation ones which tended to crack/shear in usage.

For hubs, I'd say that Tioga's 7075 T6 replacement hub axles for shimano/suntour mountain bike hubs were probably the dumbest move of all time. A 10mm rear Al axle MAYBE could work in a hardtail, but a 9mm Al front axle, in a suspension fork.... HELLO FLEX.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

USE Alien seatpost - that thing was downright dangerous - hard to set then (almost) impossible to keep at the angle needed


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

culturesponge said:


> USE Alien seatpost - that thing was downright dangerous - hard to set then (almost) impossible to keep at the angle needed


+1

I broke so many of those, I eventually just gave up on having a suspension seatpost.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

ginsu2k said:


> Shimano XTR seatpost used Easton tubing with extraordinarily thin walls. I returned it for a Thompson because it scared me.
> 
> Bike Type Mountain Biking
> Brand Shimano
> ...


And in Thomson's OWN seatpost strength tests they did when first developing/marketing their posts, the XTR Easton post was the second strongest. Syncros Hardcore 7075 post was third. Kalloy 4130 post was fourth. There seems to be a lot of nominating with little actual knowledge of the products going on in this thread. As to the USE Alien... that the things were generally available only in a 25.4 diameter shaft and ran a delrin shim to fit different size frames didn't help matters. A slipping clamp and a major flexing post? Wow what's not to love. Oh and that incredibly high price tag too....


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

rideit said:


> Discuss.
> Extra points for certain death-dismemberment upon failure.
> Triple points if it were produced in the drillium/3dv years.


No extra points for me, but the most disappointing lightweight part for me and at quite a high price point has been the Eggbeaters. I got 8 rides out of them before this happened....



Granted, Crank Bro's fixed it under warranty. However, I'm afraid to mount 'em back up and have had much better performance out of the Xpedo light weight pedals.

BB


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

Just riding along, Bruce?


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## ilostmypassword (Dec 9, 2006)

Anything made by Crank Brothers. Thread closed


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## ayjay69 (Mar 9, 2008)

BruceBrown said:


> No extra points for me, but the most disappointing lightweight part for me and at quite a high price point has been the Eggbeaters. I got 8 rides out of them before this happened....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Same situation in my CB 2 Ti. There were replaced, and after whole season of use, I'm very happy about them. In my opinion CB is the best pedal mtb system ever made.


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## bholwell (Oct 17, 2007)

I've used Crank Brothers pedals exclusively since 2003, and have never broken one. I don't have many pedal strikes, though. So I love them.

I also have a Cobalt 11 riser bar- love that too.


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## bholwell (Oct 17, 2007)

Has no one mentioned Al alloy cassettes???


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Not so far but not all have been terrible. As race parts they're no worse than CB pedals or Al disc rotors.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

BruceBrown said:


> the most disappointing lightweight part for me and at quite a high price point has been the Eggbeaters. I got 8 rides out of them before this happened....





ayjay69 said:


> Same situation in my CB 2 Ti.


had no end of probs with crank brothers pedals with steel wings - they are practically disposable - 1 season if your lucky to get that much useage from them. but if you stump up arm+leg for the 4Ti or now 11 version with titanium wings - those stupidly expensive pedals performed angelically (sorry) - my 2 pairs of Ti wing Candy 4Ti's have virtually no play even after 5k trail miles between them - but have been ridden 98% in the dry.

don't think CB Eggbeaters or Candy pedals are designed to sustain rock hits or serious (ab)use, a more robust pedal is needed for anything other that XC imho

*promise i will come back and update this thread if the eggbeater 11's break & eat my words :smilewinkgrin:
.....................



anyone ever use ST Lites bar ends? - small brittle plastic things that broke if you bike fell over - let's throw them on the pile

....edit...


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## rensho (Mar 8, 2004)

I use those ST lite barends. 4 years and I still love em. If you don't want yours, I'll gladly reuse/recycle them for you.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

thanks - i'll let you know in a few weeks - currently building my 1st big wheeler & might need the extra leverage again to keep riding some favourite steep trails without having an embolism 

sorry for any confusion - mine are not actually those injection-molded resin ST-Lites that can break easily - they are Serfas bar ends vintage from 2004 with about 3k trail miles - lots of crashes + bike falling over without any slippage or breaks 

cheers


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

Epic-o said:


> Just riding along, Bruce?


As a matter of fact, yes.

No pedal strike and no crash, just a rather new pedal that gave up the ghost during a routine XC race.

BB


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## customfab (Jun 8, 2008)

ilostmypassword said:


> Anything made by Crank Brothers. Thread closed


I'm glad I'm not the only one that feels this way. I wonder if they are going to send a couple of extra teeth back with stems and bars they send out on warranty replacement?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

They should be thankful mountain bikers don't sue with quite the regularity that BMX riders do. I myself stick with spd and clones where a rock strike at most pops the cage past the spring, or ejects your foot from the pedal. It amuses me though about the CBs because when they first came out, all the weenies on here were praising them and I was one of the few who pointed out that those wings looked awfully vulnerable to rock strikes and having bent Time wings...


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## Epic-o (Feb 24, 2007)

I have broken a cleat and the sole of my shoes when I hit a 6" rock with my CB 4ti pedals descending at 25mph and the wings are perfect...


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

Using three bolts only on a 6-bolt disk rotor got to be up there.


While I do believe that some of the crazy weenie parts from outfits like Ax Lightness or Schmolke may be functional - I still think that spending money on such show parts on an MTB (that you actually intent to ride.. in the mountains..) is borderline stupid.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Perhaps but several makers have quite successfully offered 3 bolt rotors (Amp/Rockshox, Hope, Cannondale/Coda, etc).


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## MessagefromTate (Jul 12, 2007)

The Coda rotors I had were 4 bolt, not three.

As for Crank Brothers-their pedals suck. I weigh 135lbs and I've broken two sets in XC environments.


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## norty_mtb (Oct 23, 2007)

Softride aluminum suspension stem
The first generation left me with a long hike back on the slick rock trail back in '94. Had to give up the steel one for the new light weight aluminum one.


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## moab63 (Dec 29, 2003)

*We broke three pedals on the same day*



BruceBrown said:


> No extra points for me, but the most disappointing lightweight part for me and at quite a high price point has been the Eggbeaters. I got 8 rides out of them before this happened....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


the real problem is that if you do it right the pedal is totally useless. CB took care of them like they always do. I have personally sent 8 pedals back over the years. I think that a few years ago they changed the alloy they were using before or something like that.:eekster: Because I went years without any problems an then a few years ago all hell broke loose.


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## ginsu2k (Jul 28, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> And in Thomson's OWN seatpost strength tests they did when first developing/marketing their posts, the XTR Easton post was the second strongest. Syncros Hardcore 7075 post was third. Kalloy 4130 post was fourth. There seems to be a lot of nominating with little actual knowledge of the products going on in this thread. As to the USE Alien... that the things were generally available only in a 25.4 diameter shaft and ran a delrin shim to fit different size frames didn't help matters. A slipping clamp and a major flexing post? Wow what's not to love. Oh and that incredibly high price tag too....


That's interesting, maybe under laboratory conditions they failed that way, but thin-walled Aluminum does not usually survive very long in real-world MTB conditions. I cannot see how that XTR Easton seatpost would've survived any crashes. They stopped making it anywhow, so they must've had their reason to discontinue making XTR seatposts (and it creaked a lot, anyway).


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## santacruzer (Nov 30, 2004)

A friend of mine was so pissed off about his dealings with crank brothers that he took 4 pairs of his worthless pedals, put them in a vice and cut them into pieces with a hacksaw, then FedEx’ed them back to Crank Brothers with a nasty little note. The most humorous part was when his wife came out to the garage to see what all the racquet was…”oh just cutting these pedals into little pieces” like that’s some everyone does from time to time


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

I guess I've been lucky- I've got CB candy & eggbeater pedals on all of my bikes except for the roadie & I've never had an issue other than the occasional rock-strike release. IMHO, of course, they are too good in the mud to not use.


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## whybotherme (Sep 12, 2008)

i would like to point out that it looks like there was a void in the wing in the photo on post #48

i would expect that sort of failure if a manufacturing defect like that was present.

with the way i ride, i have hit rocks harder than most here i think. had a rock strike that completely destroyed an xtr pedal. all parts break given the right circumstances. i have been fortunate with my eggbeaters it seems, and still think they are the best pedals out there. (no comment on the Joplin seatpost or the CB headsets  )


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## jadis3 (Nov 18, 2007)

Who has tried titanium brake rotors?


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## BShow (Jun 15, 2006)

There are some pretty silly things in this thread!


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## MichaelW (Jul 10, 2006)

Carbon cassettes


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

ginsu2k said:


> That's interesting, maybe under laboratory conditions they failed that way, but thin-walled Aluminum does not usually survive very long in real-world MTB conditions. I cannot see how that XTR Easton seatpost would've survived any crashes. They stopped making it anywhow, so they must've had their reason to discontinue making XTR seatposts (and it creaked a lot, anyway).


Really? And you're conclusion is based on what? Have you ever seen how thinwalled the original Answer Hyperlite bars made out of Easton EA70 were? They were among the longest lasting aluminium bars ever made. They far outperformed many carbon and titanium bars when it comes to impact strength and fatigue life.

Shimano discontinued making seatposts because they were (at the time) considered part of their component groups, and as many manufacturers had ceased buying COMPLETE groups, not to mention there were now more and more sizes of seatposts being used by various manufacturers, it no longer made economic sense for shimano to continue offering seatposts in the groups.


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## Jkuo (Feb 7, 2007)

I broke one of those, fortunately the saddle stayed on. I was going through a fast section and heard a weird sharp creak and next thing I know, the saddle moved. Luckily I didn't have it fall off. I also broke a Ringle stem going through a rock garden. One minute I'm riding along, the next my handlebars are sideways and I'm going down. It had cracked right where it clamped onto the steerer tube.

I surprisingly never broke the Kooka cranks I had even though they had thousands of miles on them and I weighed like 190 at the time.



[email protected] said:


> Howabout Ringle seatposts from the 90's that broke into a razor sharp kinfe blade lookin to change your gender!


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## ayjay69 (Mar 9, 2008)

culturesponge said:


> had no end of probs with crank brothers pedals with steel wings - they are practically disposable 1k miles if your lucky even if your ride in the desert - but if you stump up arm+leg for the 4ti or now 11 version (with a 5 year warranty) and get *titanium* wings - those pedals perform angelically (sorry)
> 
> 
> this one is mrs culturesponge's - we've a pair each for xmas
> ...


2 Ti pedal have ti body and wings


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## Wheelspeed (Jan 12, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> Really? And you're conclusion is based on what? Have you ever seen how thinwalled the original Answer Hyperlite bars made out of Easton EA70 were? They were among the longest lasting aluminium bars ever made. They far outperformed many carbon and titanium bars when it comes to impact strength and fatigue life.
> 
> Shimano discontinued making seatposts because they were (at the time) considered part of their component groups, and as many manufacturers had ceased buying COMPLETE groups, not to mention there were now more and more sizes of seatposts being used by various manufacturers, it no longer made economic sense for shimano to continue offering seatposts in the groups.


Heh heh, yeah, I still have my old Hyperlites on my commuter bike. I used them for years in the rocky northeast, and that was on a stiff-as-hell '94 aluminum Cannondale with rigid fork and tires pumped to 50psi to avoid flatting on all the rock-gardens. Bars these days have it easy compared to then.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

ayjay69 said:


> 2 Ti pedal have ti body and wings


*Crank Brothers Egg Beater 2Ti MTB Pedals* 
• Body Material: 6al/4v Titanium 
• Wings: 6al/4v Titanium

your correct, but now the new pedals have Ti wings only for the most expensive version


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

DeeEight said:


> Shimano discontinued making seatposts because they were (at the time) considered part of their component groups, and as many manufacturers had ceased buying COMPLETE groups, not to mention there were now more and more sizes of seatposts being used by various manufacturers, it no longer made economic sense for shimano to continue offering seatposts in the groups.


Don't they make those bits under the Pro brand? Look like some nice parts.


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## Jkuo (Feb 7, 2007)

Yeah, and they have some aero bars that are really nice too. I've been wanting some for my tri bike, but can't justify the price tag.



Curmy said:


> Don't they make those bits under the Pro brand? Look like some nice parts.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

They do make things like seatposts under the Pro Components brand yes, but there was a definitely gap of roughly a decade between when they dropped posts from the groups and when they started their Pro parts division.


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

the mayor said:


> Ti spindles for Onza clipless pedals...one broke before I got to the end of my driveway ( I weigh 160lbs)
> NukeProof and TNT bonded hubs....they unbonded pretty quickly.
> Topline and Kooka cranks...guaranteed to break and leave a nice big jagged edge
> 
> As for new stuff: Crank Bros Cobalt SL h/s...


Had no probs with the ti. spindles weighing in at 185. Used them for many years before I gave up on them due to not being able to find the elastomers. 
A couple that i could rattle off are alu. brake post studs and the Klein stratum 90 handlebars.:nono:


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## EBasil (Jan 30, 2004)

Okay, I've got a few that come to mind:

_Kooka "Racha" brake levers._ Light! Flexy! Fragile! Not better than the alternatives!

_Real all aluminum cassette:_ Light! Minimal Life, Maximal Cost! Major degradation in performance once burred.

Apologies to any still infatuated with these items, but you're loony. Any argument on your part only confirms it.

Hey, I've been there and recovered. I still have an NOS Real cassette in the box...who knows, maybe on my son's bike for a month or two once he grows into the 8sp he's gonna get?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

EBasil said:


> Okay, I've got a few that come to mind:
> 
> _Kooka "Racha" brake levers._ Light! Flexy! Fragile! Not better than the alternatives!
> 
> _Real all aluminum cassette:_ Light! Minimal Life, Maximal Cost! Major degradation in performance once burred.


To keep things in perspective... there was no alternative 86g/pair brake levers at the time of the Kooka Racha levers. I dislike the clamp mechanism on them myself but I still use a pair on one bike.

Real cassettes were not ALL aluminium. Only the 4 largest cogs were, machined from one piece of billet, and they were nickle plated and actually wear wise, not that bad in my experience. I have two of them (the 11-28 and 11-30 sizes) and I like them.


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## EBasil (Jan 30, 2004)

:thumbsup: "to keep things in perspective"! Heh heh, heh! I expected you to differ, because that's what you do, right? You're still looony and the Racha's were still terrible.


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## Jkuo (Feb 7, 2007)

As DeeEight said, the Kooka levers weren't terrible. I got a set I think in '96. They were the lightest levers around at the time. I agreed they flexed some, but it wasn't that bad. My major problem with them was that the pivots always seemed loose (it wasn't a great design). I used them for 10 years and ended up selling them in '06 for close to what I paid for them. Apparently in Europe, vintage CNC'd stuff from the '90s is in huge demand (come to think of it, all of my old '90s era stuff was sold to Europeans). I even crashed the levers a few times and no damage.



EBasil said:


> Okay, I've got a few that come to mind:
> 
> _Kooka "Racha" brake levers._ Light! Flexy! Fragile! Not better than the alternatives!
> 
> ...


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

EBasil said:


> Okay, I've got a few that come to mind:
> 
> _Kooka "Racha" brake levers._ Light! Flexy! Fragile! Not better than the alternatives!
> 
> ...


I could only imagine how bad these alu. cassettes were. I've owned the srp and action tec ti. cassettes in the past and shifting was terrible and wearing prematurely was high at a not so cost effecient price. The racha levers were very flexy but they were very light, looked awesome, and resale value 14 years later was better than what I paid for them.


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## Patchito (Dec 31, 2003)

rideit said:


> Discuss.
> Extra points for certain death-dismemberment upon failure.
> Triple points if it were produced in the drillium/3dv years.


Cross thread/cross post. Some classic stupidity in both threads.

http://www.f88me.com/showthread.php?p=525792#poststop


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

I would like to nominate the Stan's ZTR Crest rims, at least in the 29er size. You can only tension them up to 100 kg of force and they flex substantially under my 165 lbs weight.

This is one case where I think I would have been better off with the 200+ grams heavier stock wheels, and proves that I am still capable of making stupid weight weenie mistakes after all these years.


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## TheRedMantra (Jan 12, 2004)

loggerhead said:


> and the Klein stratum 90 handlebars.:nono:


I have been riding a Klein Stratum 90 on my SS for half a decade and I trust it fully. I have a few NOS ones in my parts hoard because I like these bars so much. I read an article a few years back that said that these bars are quite strong compared to what was available when they were released (mine say 1996 inside the bars). Maybe owning 4 Kleins makes me biased, but I love these bars.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

When Bicycling magazine tested a dozen bars, the Stratum 90 was the best in test for fatigue... all three bars went 100,000 cycles plus, one was past a quarter million when the operator grew bored and turned off the machine. To put that in perspective, the Bontrager Titec 118g Ti bar (whose weight didn't include the shims you needed to fit the stem clamp) failed at an average of 25,567 cycles. The load applied was 200 pounds @ 9.5 inches from the bar center, bending it up and down 2.5 times a second until it failed. They arrived at 200 pounds after a half hour descent by a 170 pound rider on a mountain bike with an instrumented handlebar. There was ONE spike at 200 pounds and every other measured load fell below that. For a straight impact load to failure, the stratum 90 needed 490 pounds and the Titec 118 failed at 350 pounds. The aforementioned Answer Hyperlite bar with 144g of EA70 aluminium, 595 pounds. 

The cheapest bar on test, a Zoom 170 Al, made from butted 6061-T6, averaged a bit over 7k cycles and failed on the impact test at 315 pounds and I mention that because its a good example of the sort of handlebar that came stock on a lot of mountain bikes in the mid-90s.


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## CactusJackSlade (Apr 11, 2006)

*never mind...*

oops...:


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## CactusJackSlade (Apr 11, 2006)

*Drilled Campy seatpost*

Man, good thing I only weighed a buck and a quarter when I was 14 years old... back in 1978ish drilling was the rage.

I worked all summer long to buy a full Campy Le June... Thank goodness I didn't drill anything else!... and I rode this bike for at least 4 or 5 years.

You'd see guys with drilled cranks, calipers, levers you name it 

My seatpost might not have been life threatening if it failed.... but ouch! :eekster:


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

TheRedMantra said:


> I have been riding a Klein Stratum 90 on my SS for half a decade and I trust it fully. I have a few NOS ones in my parts hoard because I like these bars so much. I read an article a few years back that said that these bars are quite strong compared to what was available when they were released (mine say 1996 inside the bars). Maybe owning 4 Kleins makes me biased, but I love these bars.


I do remember that article. This is why I bought the bars. They had the best fatigue rating of all the bars tested from what I remember and they were stupid light. Unfortunately, you had to treat them with kids gloves. They split in two riding over a downed tree that was ramped. I owned two Kleins from the early 90's and would love to say that these were good despite the crack, but, they weren't.:nono:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Treat them with kid gloves? I think not. Only reason carbon bars split in two riding over a tree as you described would be if you overtightened any of the clamp bolts involved (the stem clamp in particular). Also as memory serves, the Stratum 90 was specifically NOT approved for bar ends and the Stratum 110 was. So... any other details you'd care to share with us?


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## bholwell (Oct 17, 2007)

FishMan473 said:


> I would like to nominate the Stan's ZTR Crest rims, at least in the 29er size. You can only tension them up to 100 kg of force and they flex substantially under my 165 lbs weight.
> 
> This is one case where I think I would have been better off with the 200+ grams heavier stock wheels, and proves that I am still capable of making stupid weight weenie mistakes after all these years.


I disagree. I weigh 165 lbs and I also have a set of 29er Crest rims laced to ZTR hubs w/ a 15mm thru axle, and they actually have less lateral flex than my set of 26" Crests / ZTR hubs with 9mm QR (steel bolt-on skewer). This tells me that most of the flex is coming from the hub/fork interface, not from the rim.

Also, I don't have a tensiometer, but I think I tensioned my Crest rims above 100 kgf- probably around 110-120. Been riding the 26" set for over a year, no problems.

My $.02- get a 15mm thru axle fork and the hub conversion if you're able.


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## BillT (Dec 24, 2003)

While not necessarily a weight weenie part, here's my vote for stupidest bike part ever...the Cannondale Coda 502 CNC'd crankset. The all three chainrings were cnc'd from a single peice of aluminum. Really nice cnc work for the time, but if you wore out a single ring, you had to replace all 3...brilliant!


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

At least you could replace the rings... Caramba had a crankset where the rings and spider were machined one-piece to the right crankarm... meaning wearing out a ring and you'd need a whole new right crankset.


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Howabout Ringle seatposts from the 90's that broke into a razor sharp kinfe blade lookin to change your gender!


Yep, remember those. Cracked in half my purple one on a slight bounce. Real garbage. My ringle rear hub that also bent. So much for a true wheel.


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## nathanbal (Jan 30, 2007)

BillT said:


> While not necessarily a weight weenie part, here's my vote for stupidest bike part ever...the Cannondale Coda 502 CNC'd crankset. The all three chainrings were cnc'd from a single peice of aluminum. Really nice cnc work for the time, but if you wore out a single ring, you had to replace all 3...brilliant!


the XX cassette would then have to go into the same bucket then right?


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## Baulz (Sep 16, 2005)

DeeEight said:


> At least you could replace the rings... Caramba had a crankset where the rings and spider were machined one-piece to the right crankarm... meaning wearing out a ring and you'd need a whole new right crankset.


They never made a crank like that.


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## Jkuo (Feb 7, 2007)

I thought Caramba's Sidewinder(?) was similar to the Coda's in that the rings were all one piece. But they weren't a part of the crank arm and you did have the option of putting a regular spider on there.



Baulz said:


> They never made a crank like that.


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## Baulz (Sep 16, 2005)

Jkuo said:


> I thought Caramba's Sidewinder(?) was similar to the Coda's in that the rings were all one piece. But they weren't a part of the crank arm and you did have the option of putting a regular spider on there.


That is correct. The sidewinders were a less expensive option compared to the double barrels, so being all one piece would make no sense.


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## Slim83 (Nov 2, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> thanks - i'll let you know in a few weeks - currently building my 1st big wheeler & might need the extra leverage again to keep riding some favourite steep trails without having an embolism
> 
> sorry for any confusion - mine are not actually those injection-molded resin ST-Lites that can break easily - they are Serfas bar ends vintage from 2004 with about 3k trail miles - lots of crashes + bike falling over without any slippage or breaks
> 
> cheers


Never had a problem with the bar ends breaking, that doesn't mean it didn't happen to someone else. I have 3 sets and several people I know have numerous sets with countless miles and crashes. The only problem I had was the mold was not consistent and I had to use a hack saw to cut some away so they would actually clamp down on he bar without bottoming out and slipping.


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## norm (Feb 20, 2005)

the mayor said:


> How bout the super thin walled aluminum bars that flooded the market in the mid 90's


That's what I was going to post also.....I bent 3 bars back then. I'm even fatter now, and still can't bend bars like I could.


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

DeeEight said:


> Treat them with kid gloves? I think not. Only reason carbon bars split in two riding over a tree as you described would be if you overtightened any of the clamp bolts involved (the stem clamp in particular). Also as memory serves, the Stratum 90 was specifically NOT approved for bar ends and the Stratum 110 was. So... any other details you'd care to share with us?


What a moronic explanation from a know-at-all.The split was two inches away from the stem. The bars were under no stress as I was practically crawling over the log and the split occured as I was peaking at the top of the log. Oh yeah, I didn't have bar ends. 

And, if you knew anything about the bars besides what you probably just read for the first time as you did a good job of bringing out all the details that only somebody with total recall could, the center alu. clamping area was wide enough that there was about 1" of alu. sticking out on both sides of the stem. Soooo, overtightening the stem would hardly affect the bars failure in my case. Bottom line, these bars are garbage. I know of two others who had them fail for similar reasons. You would probably be able to figure out as to why this happened Now, go read elsewhere on bar fatigue and get back to me as to why these failed. Now I see why so many others on this site bash you.


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## EBasil (Jan 30, 2004)

Okay, one more for the fans to defend: The _OnZa lightweight canti brakes_: light, cool-looking, and came with bonus snapping feature if one cinched the brake pads hard enough to hold them in place...


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## olibabe (May 28, 2004)

culturesponge said:


> my favourite - Power Cordz 1.2mm derailleur cables
> 
> masses of cable drag - then sticky + stretch if clamped too tight = well worth the cost


I really dont agree! I've used Powercordz on my MTB for 2 seasons without any issue! I've replaced them recently by precaution but they were still working fine.

I've used them with I-Links + Gore Ride On Grub to seal the liner and it's the best combination I've ever ridden.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

olibabe said:


> I really dont agree! I've used Powercordz on my MTB for 2 seasons without any issue! I've replaced them recently by precaution but they were still working fine.
> 
> I've used them with I-Links + Gore Ride On Grub to seal the liner and it's the best combination I've ever ridden.


well jolly good for you! :thumbsup:

the Power Cordz 1.2mm front & rear derailleur cables on the wifes bike have been working great for 18 months now with the original Jagwire 5mm housing that came with her bike + lashings of tri-flow dry. have some new/lighter 4mm housing to go on so will install fresh PC at the same time

biggest probs i've had with PC's is at derailleur clamps - slightly too loose, the cable slips & stretches, & just slightly too tight the casing crushes easily & stretches-out in a few acutations. PC are *very* unforgiving if you have to make an adjustment or re-clamp the cable - 80%(ish) of the time they will stretch & be ruined 

i'll be using them again on a new build soon, but i'll get a few rides in with regular steel cables first so the components can settle-in - then i'll install the Power Cordz - & leave them well alone!


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## facelessfools (Aug 30, 2008)

my powercordz tore the plastic wrap between the cable housings so i just heat shrinked it and its better now but its still no fix for it..


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## heatstroke (Jul 1, 2003)

I used one for 6 yrs.. Finally the clamp debonded from the tube. I reglued it and used it for another year . Detected a crack then retired it.


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

how about some of the lightweight tubes made in the late 90's like panaracer's greenlight, air b's pink tube (whatever the name was) and some other blue tube that I used to buy frequently that usually almost failed after one or two rides. :nono:


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I have a dozen Air-Bs in the boxes still, I got tired of pinch-flats resulting in tube detonations. They used to advertise with them being stretched over a broken beer bottle without cutting/puncturing... which is all fine and good for riding over glass, but if you pinched the tube.... they detonate and then split LENGTHWISE around usually half the circumfrence, and let me tell you, that's not something you can patch after. They also leaked air out a lot faster (it was not usual to lose 5-8psi per day out of your tires). On the plus side I only paid $1 each for them. Eventually I'll figure out something useful for the things. Maybe for paint grenade slingshots or something. 

The Panaracer polyurethane tubes were better in that they didn't detonate on pinch flats, and they held air pretty good, but you needed a special patch meant for polyurethane (air mattress / water bed mattress repair kits are basically the same) which isn't something you'd likely find at your average bike store. They also didn't exactly stretch the same way as regular (or AirB) tubes did so it was vitally important to have the correct size tube for your tires. You couldn't just "cheat" and run a 26 x 1.5 tube in a 26 x 2.25 tire.


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## TheRedMantra (Jan 12, 2004)

loggerhead said:


> overtightening the stem would hardly affect the bars failure in my case. Bottom line, these bars are garbage. I know of two others who had them fail for similar reasons. You would probably be able to figure out as to why this happened Now, go read elsewhere on bar fatigue and get back to me as to why these failed. Now I see why so many others on this site bash you.


Perhaps you damaged the carbon in transport or storage? The bars don't have a clear coat, they can be damaged if not taken care of properly or from an impact. Maybe you hit a rock in a crash before the bars failed? Can you say for sure that the bars broke because of poor manufacturing? I bought a used bar, cut it down, used it for two seasons with no issues, parted out the bike and sold it. The guy I sold it to never contacted me to tell me it failed and I sold it to him a few years ago. In my experience these bars have been safe. Are they Enve Composites bars? No... Are they a budget-light option that you should have confidence in? Sure. And yes, D8 is a douche. He knows a lot about bikes but not a lot about interacting with people. Now watch, he'll tell me how he has a box of medals that the mayor of Canada gave him (at a huge discount) for being such a people person (seriously, try to take a joke people).


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## loggerhead (Mar 8, 2009)

TheRedMantra said:


> Perhaps you damaged the carbon in transport or storage? The bars don't have a clear coat, they can be damaged if not taken care of properly or from an impact. Maybe you hit a rock in a crash before the bars failed? Can you say for sure that the bars broke because of poor manufacturing? I bought a used bar, cut it down, used it for two seasons with no issues, parted out the bike and sold it. The guy I sold it to never contacted me to tell me it failed and I sold it to him a few years ago. In my experience these bars have been safe. Are they Enve Composites bars? No... Are they a budget-light option that you should have confidence in? Sure. And yes, D8 is a douche. He knows a lot about bikes but not a lot about interacting with people. Now watch, he'll tell me how he has a box of medals that the mayor of Canada gave him (at a huge discount) for being such a people person (seriously, try to take a joke people).


I would like to think that the bars failed due to some defect that I caused. This is possible. I do crash alot due to the area that I ride. It is very rocky and technical. At the time, I didn't recall ever crashing the bars that would result in their failure prior to them 'failing'. But hey, sometimes you can't see a crack or it is possible to overlook them. Who knows? All I know is they failed in a very soft situation. And, from all the riding that I do and all of the crashes that I have sustained, these are the only bars that have ever snapped on me.


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## mechBgon (Jan 28, 2007)

I "third" the nomination for the infamous Air-B tubes. When they failed... wow. 

Back in those days, when I first was infected with WW disease, I used the thin Panaracer Smoke Lite Comp tires, nominally a 1.9" but more like a 1.7" inflated, and would use ultralight 700x18-23 tubes in them, folded over themselves to reduce the circumference. That made for some wicked climbing, especially on 360-gram Matrix MT AERO rims with light spokes, but the tubes weren't reliable for some reason


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I usually only find frame cracks when cleaning my bikes after a ride. The only time I found a crack WHILE riding was on one of my titanium frames when the back end started flopping sideways. I thought my QR was loose so I stopped and got off the bike. Nope, driveside chainstay had cracked apart halfway around. Pretty impressive given that it was an Alpinestars Ti-Mega frame and the tube in question is ONE INCH in diameter.


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## GlazedHam (Jan 14, 2004)

Ringle Bazooka Stem milled from aluminium and anodized in an array of dazzling colors.

Kooka Seatpost.


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

Who still has a pic of that busted AX-Lightness Carbon saddle?


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