# non disc 135mm rear hubs?



## lighty (Mar 26, 2016)

I thought I would ask you people about this since you trash a lot of rear hubs. If you were looking for a non disc 135mm rear hub, that will work with 10 and 11 speed sram (after attaching the proper freehub body. Prefer to have options), will last as long as possible, and costs definately less than $300, preferably less than $200, what would you be looking at? I am hoping for dt swiss/chris king reliability and ease of maintenance too.


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## enregistree (Oct 4, 2012)

Buy disc version and use it with rim brakes. DT350 is OK and in your price range.

There is no benefit from non disc other than few grams and maybe esthetics. Flange distance is also often the same (not better) for non-disc hubs.


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## Anthem1 (Feb 9, 2008)

We have had a Hope pro 3 on our Fuji tandem for 5 or 6 years, never think about it.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

Dt swiss road hubs come in 135. Id suggest a disc hub anyway, same spacing and you'll be ready if you ever want discs. But still, dt does come in 135 non disc.

The 16pt dt ratchet is one of or the strongest out there. Them or king, but 350s are quite a bit cheaper. 240s are light enough for a road race bike and strong enough for a downhill bike.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

enregistree said:


> Buy disc version and use it with rim brakes. DT350 is OK and in your price range.


Yep. 16T star and you're good. It's limited to 32H though. since this is a Tandem, if you want a 36 or 40H version, DT swiss also has their 540 hub. Just get the disc hub though. Nothing gained by going non-disc. Plus, I'd rather have a disc brake on a tandem in principle.


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## lighty (Mar 26, 2016)

Are you sure the flange distances are the same on the dt hub, between disc and non disc?


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

Technical manual for the 350 hub showing flange offset for non-disc and disc rear hub. They are different, but does that 2.6mm difference really mean all that much? When you look at the different flange distances on all the various disc brake hubs, 2.6mm isn't that much.
31/19.3 non-disc
33.6/20.3 disc

Also, I've normally measured flange distance from the center of the hub, as centered in the dropouts. The above measurements indicate the disc version actually locates the flange further from the hub center, which would build a stronger wheel for side loads. Anybody know if DT Swiss measures there hubs differently? 
https://www.dtswiss.com/Resources/Support/HUBS/DT-Swiss-Hubs-350-Technical-Manual


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

32H is fine is the build is good. We have 32H CK hubs on MTX rims and are a >360lb team. No issues.


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## Sandman29 (Jan 22, 2009)

You should be able to find someone on MTBR that can sell you a nice used Chris King or Hope hub for rim brakes. Since everyone use to run rim brakes 10 years ago.


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

I would be hesitant to run a 540 rear DT hub off-road. Sunday I was replacing the axle in our Co-Motion road tandem that uses a 540 only on the road. The axle was bent. Heard of it happening with others and also have heard about them breaking. Go with something off-road intended by DT or King. What you spend up front will probably save you big over time provided you accomplish proper maintenance.


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## 202cycle (Dec 6, 2006)

I have a nice NOS Chris King I will make you a great deal on PM me if you are interested.


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## lighty (Mar 26, 2016)

WTF? The 540 is meant to be used off road I thought.
Also, what is the difference between the 240 and 350 other than weight and cost?

I am going to have to pass on the king for now. The build will be long in the making when I start it, and that is a LONG way off.

I am not actually building a tandem, but a light touring bike. I just wanted to know what hubs couldn't be trashed.



PMK said:


> I would be hesitant to run a 540 rear DT hub off-road. Sunday I was replacing the axle in our Co-Motion road tandem that uses a 540 only on the road. The axle was bent. Heard of it happening with others and also have heard about them breaking. Go with something off-road intended by DT or King. What you spend up front will probably save you big over time provided you accomplish proper maintenance.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

touring bike, yea, DT swiss 350's with sunringle MTX33 rims. For less money, I would consider Shimano Zee or SLX. Not as bulletproof as DT Swiss, but they are some sturdy hubs for less.

240 vs. 350 is mostly a weight issue. I don't know of any difference in the freehub design. The 350 front hub doesn't have a swap able axle (QR to 15TA). No idea why though. The rear 350 hub can have the axle type swapped.


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## Acme54321 (Oct 8, 2003)

Sandman29 said:


> You should be able to find someone on MTBR that can sell you a nice used Chris King or Hope hub for rim brakes. Since everyone use to run rim brakes 10 years ago.


Try again... time flies. More like 15 years ago!


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## lighty (Mar 26, 2016)

Why does Rodriguez keep touting rims brakes if everyone likes discs so much? And what size discs are you dudes running?


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

I'd go with 180 if your fork/frame has clearance and can handle them. Not much gained by going to the 200mm range, and 180 doesn't cost anything more than 160mm. Only thing I don't like about the bigger rotors is the occasional oscillations that can occur because they are larger. Once a little oscillation starts, it is noticeable, while in the smaller rotors, not as noticeable.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

watts888 said:


> I'd go with 180 if your fork/frame has clearance and can handle them. Not much gained by going to the 200mm range, and 180 doesn't cost anything more than 160mm. Only thing I don't like about the bigger rotors is the occasional oscillations that can occur because they are larger. Once a little oscillation starts, it is noticeable, while in the smaller rotors, not as noticeable.


We still talkin' tandems here, or the OP's single touring bike?


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## lighty (Mar 26, 2016)

The shimano hubs now have a disintigration issue.


watts888 said:


> touring bike, yea, DT swiss 350's with sunringle MTX33 rims. For less money, I would consider Shimano Zee or SLX. Not as bulletproof as DT Swiss, but they are some sturdy hubs for less.
> 
> 240 vs. 350 is mostly a weight issue. I don't know of any difference in the freehub design. The 350 front hub doesn't have a swap able axle (QR to 15TA). No idea why though. The rear 350 hub can have the axle type swapped.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

lighty said:


> The shimano hubs now have a disintigration issue.


Link/description?

I've heard of their freehubs breaking (commonly under heavy load), but most bike shops have replacment freehubs for relatively cheap and readily available.


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## watts888 (Oct 2, 2012)

Okayfine said:


> We still talkin' tandems here, or the OP's single touring bike?


Either/Or/All of the above.

Even on a tandem, unless you're doing a full suspension fatbike tandem with two 250lb riders doing downhill runs, I still think a decent brake caliper with 180 rotors would be fine. 200mm+ rotors will work, but IMO the rotors seem to go out of true easier and can develop oscillations when braking. It's more of an annoyance factor when riding, so unless they're needed, why use them. 180 can still get these problems, but not as bad.

Comparing 160 to 180, unless you want to keep down rotational weight, nothing gained by going 160, and they cost about the same. More braking power for free, go 180.


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## Harold (Dec 23, 2003)

watts888 said:


> Either/Or/All of the above.
> 
> Even on a tandem, unless you're doing a full suspension fatbike tandem with two 250lb riders doing downhill runs, I still think a decent brake caliper with 180 rotors would be fine. 200mm+ rotors will work, but IMO the rotors seem to go out of true easier and can develop oscillations when braking. It's more of an annoyance factor when riding, so unless they're needed, why use them. 180 can still get these problems, but not as bad.
> 
> Comparing 160 to 180, unless you want to keep down rotational weight, nothing gained by going 160, and they cost about the same. More braking power for free, go 180.


Since OP is talking about a touring bike with drop bars, and hasn't decided on anything, there's a good chance it will be a road frame. Those typically have a max rotor size of 160mm. My Salsa Vaya maxes at 160mm rotors. 200mm rotors WILL NOT work. Nor will 180's, unless I want to void some warranties and maybe hurt myself. If OP chooses a mtb frame/fork, then your statements might apply. But OP is all over the damn place, so don't get ahead of yourself.


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## Okayfine (Sep 7, 2010)

watts888 said:


> Even on a tandem, unless you're doing a full suspension fatbike tandem with two 250lb riders doing downhill runs, I still think a decent brake caliper with 180 rotors would be fine.


Well, it won't be fine. Most everyone here runs 203 F/R, and people that propose to run smaller, even just smaller in the back, are generally convinced otherwise.

We've been running 203 F/R from the beginning, and have had zero issues with rotors going out of true or harmonics issues with the rotors themselves (and we've had Hope, generic, and now Shimano ICE Tech rotors). Ventana tandems can set up a harmonic in the rear with certain combinations of brake parts, but I solved our issue by switching from sintered to organic pads in the rear, no other changes.

We're a near-400lb team with gear, and our trails are either up or down, so I use the brakes all the time. Most here will concur. Certain descents I've had brakes on the entire time to checks speed, can be two miles, or more, of downhill, 90% brake engagement, trying to whoa-up 400+lb with bike.

Now, we also have a road tandem, and that's fine with rim brakes except for long descents when I engage the drag brake, so whatev.


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## ds2199 (Sep 16, 2008)

I think there are so many qualifiers here that this discussion does not answer the questions appropriately.

1) How much weight will you be riding with?
2) What type of terrain will you be riding?
3) How aggressive to you ride?

These things will certainly change the answer. 

I can only speak to my experiences on tandems (both road and mountain). For a 270 lb team we have successfully toured in the Colorado Rockies on a road bike with the bike loaded to 100 lbs (so over 370 lbs). This setup had a rear 203 rotor and front v brakes. We have also ridden with front and rear 203 rotors on the mtb tandems and gotten the rotors to turn blue and fade to "nearly" not working.

We destroyed a 203 rotor on Mt Ventoux in France (actually melted the core of the Shimano Ice tech rotor) and managed to limp our way down the mountain.

So the answer is, it depends...

I will say that I will not ride our mtb tandem on smaller than 200mm rotors (at least in the mountains).


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