# Long Travel Dual Crown w/lockout?



## tazmetal (Aug 17, 2011)

Hey MTBR, sorry if this is an All-Mountain question, but I posted here because I don't know if AM deals with bikes over 180mm of travel, and the bike is def DH. I have a 2004 Norco A-line, and would like to keep the travel, and geo AND be able to stomp the pedals uphill. So, I need a similar length 200mm travel fork, with lockout. Does this even exist?

Thanks in advance,
Tazmetal:thumbsup:


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

tazmetal said:


> So, I need a similar length 200mm travel fork, with lockout. Does this even exist?


I could be wrong but am pretty sure an 8" fork doesn't exist with lockout. Long travel forks like the dual crown dh forks are for going downhill usually so locking out is generally not a good idea.

If you want to go uphill it has more to do with the frame itself and what type of swingarm you have than it does your fork.


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## tazmetal (Aug 17, 2011)

mtbnozpikr said:


> I could be wrong but am pretty sure an 8" fork doesn't exist with lockout. Long travel forks like the dual crown dh forks are for going downhill usually so locking out is generally not a good idea.
> 
> If you want to go uphill it has more to do with the frame itself and what type of swingarm you have than it does your fork.


I agree that the rest of the bike will certainly affect climbing ability, but I can't help that. I'm not a rich dude, and that i can't get another bike. With that in mind, I can replace A) Shock or B) fork to try and reduce pedal bob. Feels like 85% of the bob is in the front end, so I feel like fork makes more sense. As to the part not existing, I figured. I just really hope someone has heard of one


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## Lunchbox362 (Jun 27, 2009)

tazmetal said:


> I agree that the rest of the bike will certainly affect climbing ability, but I can't help that. I'm not a rich dude, and that i can't get another bike. With that in mind, I can replace A) Shock or B) fork to try and reduce pedal bob. Feels like 85% of the bob is in the front end, so I feel like fork makes more sense. As to the part not existing, I figured. I just really hope someone has heard of one


You could get a rear shock with lockout, or an air to pump it up on the way up then let some out for the downhill


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## schlockinz (Feb 6, 2009)

Or you could buy a cheap ass old steel from with a rigid fork and run a 1x1. Hell, could probably pick up a surly for less than a 200mm fork.


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## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

tazmetal said:


> Hey MTBR, sorry if this is an All-Mountain question, but I posted here because I don't know if AM deals with bikes over 180mm of travel, and the bike is def DH. I have a 2004 Norco A-line, and would like to keep the travel, and geo AND be able to stomp the pedals uphill. So, I need a similar length 200mm travel fork, with lockout. Does this even exist?
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> Tazmetal:thumbsup:


if you buy any high quality fork, you should be able to max out the compression and get next to no bob. All of the old boxxers (32mm stantions) had motion control, which had as close to lockout as I've seen. The other option would be to get an air fork, and bring a shock pump with you and just max out the air pressure. Also, most of the 180mm single crown forks out there have the same a2c as the 200mm dual crown forks. Your geo would remain the same, you would just lose an inch of travel.


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## 62kona (Mar 25, 2008)

I had a 2007 888 SL ATA that could be adjusted from 200 down to 160 I think. It is an air fork so the spring could be adjusted on the fly. It doesn't lock out, bit by turning up the LSC and turning the travel down, it really helps with climbing. You can find them for around $400 used on places like pinkbike or ridemonkey.


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## aedubber (Apr 17, 2011)

If the bike is a DH bike then leave it at that man, plus think about how heavy DH bikes usually are. You wont like going up hills with bikes that are around 40lbs +/- .. I say you just buy a used bike and use it for its purpose and the keep the DH beast for what its made for .


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## nmpearson (Aug 13, 2007)

bionicons were the closest i've ever heard of that you're describing. i think the dh bike only had the 200mm fork adjustable down to 100mm. i rode one once...felt pretty cool actually.


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## HelloMyNameIsSean (Sep 14, 2011)

It sounds like you just need a heavier spring/more air in your current fork. And it also sounds like your standing and mashing the pedals instead of sitting and spinning (correct me if I'm wrong), but that'll make your fork go crazy if you've got most of your weight on the front end when climbing.


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## crossup (May 13, 2009)

actually you can get pretty close with a 2010/11 Boxxer WC. The low speed compression setting affects motion like you get from pedal bob. Maxed out the fork basically moves too slow to respond to pedal input. 
In my experience, a light rider on a bike that resists rear end bob(Canfields, SC V10's etc) will have no big problem with fork motion in general and any tendency can be adjusted out with the low speed comp
I cant make my bike bob or respond with lost motion during pedaling unless I make a special effort to square pedal and push on the bars etc. BUT as soon as a 180 pound guy rode my bike it was the opposite, he crushed the suspension and could make the bike bounce like a pogo. Which proves to me tuning is a big factor with suspension design a close second.


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## charging_rhinos (Jul 29, 2008)

I've always been under the impression that bob in the rear end of the bike was what killed pedaling efficiency/climbing ability, not the front. The front just provides for a really awkward and inefficient body position if you're pedaling a long-forked DH bike up hills. The fork bob might be less than pleasant, but it doesn't have all that much effect on power transmission.

So if you want something that can charge down, but still be liveable going back up for more, I'd definitely look at one of the 180mm forks as suggested earlier. Try a Fox Talas maybe. You can dial the front end down and it will put you in a better position over the pedals and make climbing easier. Easier doesn't mean easy (it's still a DH bike after all). Get to the top, dial the fork back up, and you can charge down almost anything that a dual crown can (if you use good technique and don't ham-fist your way through everything, of course).


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## crossup (May 13, 2009)

Unfortunately since he has the bike he's stuck with what it is. BUT keep in mind that the A2A lenght on long travel(!50mm+) forks varies far less than the increase travel. So DH bikes dont have to have a tall front. The Canfield boys will tell too that you want your stem/bars as low as you can go for DH.
So following their advice and talking about V2 "The ONE"s the front is low and feels that way climbing and in my case totally out climbs my Speccy Pitch with 150mm Uturn Rev forks. It keep the front wheel planted, has much better traction and just wont wheely unless you intend too. No one will tell you a properly equipped and setup Pitch is a slouch climbing yet it is totally spanked by my 8" travel Canfield.



charging_rhinos said:


> I've always been under the impression that bob in the rear end of the bike was what killed pedaling efficiency/climbing ability, not the front. The front just provides for a really awkward and inefficient body position if you're pedaling a long-forked DH bike up hills. The fork bob might be less than pleasant, but it doesn't have all that much effect on power transmission.
> 
> So if you want something that can charge down, but still be liveable going back up for more, I'd definitely look at one of the 180mm forks as suggested earlier. Try a Fox Talas maybe. You can dial the front end down and it will put you in a better position over the pedals and make climbing easier. Easier doesn't mean easy (it's still a DH bike after all). Get to the top, dial the fork back up, and you can charge down almost anything that a dual crown can (if you use good technique and don't ham-fist your way through everything, of course).


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## Khartik (Nov 16, 2011)

I run an old style manitou dorado with only rebound and regular compression adjustments(not high/low), and never have problems with front bob. My advise is to stop standing and mashing, it is more efficient to sit and pedal when going uphill anways. If the rear bobs while sitting and pedaling turn up the low speed compression(or spv/pro pedal on air shocks). If your rear shock does not have those options look at replacing it with one that does.


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## William42 (Oct 29, 2006)

crossup said:


> Unfortunately since he has the bike he's stuck with what it is. BUT keep in mind that the A2A lenght on long travel(!50mm+) forks varies far less than the increase travel. So DH bikes dont have to have a tall front. The Canfield boys will tell too that you want your stem/bars as low as you can go for DH.
> So following their advice and talking about V2 "The ONE"s the front is low and feels that way climbing and in my case totally out climbs my Speccy Pitch with 150mm Uturn Rev forks. It keep the front wheel planted, has much better traction and just wont wheely unless you intend too. No one will tell you a properly equipped and setup Pitch is a slouch climbing yet it is totally spanked by my 8" travel Canfield.


Nobody worth their salt will tell you that the front end needs to be as low as possible for DH. Correct bar height does not mean as low as possible. For shorter riders, it usually makes sense to have low bar heights, because the fork/wheel/tire will add x height, and so keeping everything else low is nice. For taller riders though, higher bars make sense. Your body should be comfortable and in a middle ground when you're in the attack position. You souldn't be standing like a hunchback. Its all about fit. Its also about the trail itself if you're really anal. If its a really steep trail, higher front end. If its a flat, pedally trail, lower front end. Look at gwin,minnaar, really any world cup pro. They're all in roughly the same position on the bike, and none of them are riding like a hunchback.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

I have a Rockshox Domain. It has an easily accessible compression knob on the top of the right leg. When I want a firmer platform like when I'm climbing or whatever, I crank the compression all the way over. I'm a fairly light guy at 140 pounds so it works well for me. If you're a big guy it might not work as well for you but I figured I'd mention it since they make a dual crown Domain now.


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## crossup (May 13, 2009)

Ok, I agree with everything you're saying, let me rephrase. 
Given that we all run 200mm dual crowns if were at all serious, there is no need to stack on 50mm rise stems and tall bars(unless you 6'8"), as the front end is already on the tall side. Tall enough that for most folks under 6', the Canfield bros- who are worth their salt say:
"At Canfield Brothers we are always looking for ways to make the ride better and to make you faster. Our new direct mount stem is aimed to get you lower on your bike for an aggressive riding position and lower body position for cornering. Lets face it - not all of us are 6" tall. Everyone races a 8" fork for DH, but not all of us need the same bar height. Our stem lowers your bar a full inch (25.4mm) under a tradition direct mount which all run about an inch above the crown. Our stem effectively places the center of the bar with the top of your upper crown.

If you can't get low enough or just need a edge on the competition- this is the stem for you."

So they are saying within reason, lower is better. I was trying to say you want it as low as possible that is still comfortable for you, which for many of us IS as low as possible(and again, that the point of their stem), but I guess I should have read what I wrote:nono:



William42 said:


> Nobody worth their salt will tell you that the front end needs to be as low as possible for DH. Correct bar height does not mean as low as possible. For shorter riders, it usually makes sense to have low bar heights, because the fork/wheel/tire will add x height, and so keeping everything else low is nice. For taller riders though, higher bars make sense. Your body should be comfortable and in a middle ground when you're in the attack position. You souldn't be standing like a hunchback. Its all about fit. Its also about the trail itself if you're really anal. If its a really steep trail, higher front end. If its a flat, pedally trail, lower front end. Look at gwin,minnaar, really any world cup pro. They're all in roughly the same position on the bike, and none of them are riding like a hunchback.


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