# Lightweight Isis BB suggestions



## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

I just picked up a new Crank Brothers crankset at a great price and now I need an Isis BB. The crank bros. Ti BB looks great and the warranty is great however it is more than a little pricey. The AM Classic BB looks like it comes in at a great weight and price but the reviews on this BB are not promising at all. 

What are some other lighter Isis BB out there ? 

thanks in advance for your help !


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

"light ISIS" is kinda like a "light boat anchor". All things considered, the ISIS system is heavy. the CB is yer best bet IMO.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

Thanks for your reply. 

I'm just trying to get the whole set up at or below xtr weight and I know there are other Isis BB options out there, I just don't know what they are. 

Would a square tapper crank & BB have been the " better " way to go in your opinion ?


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## dhummer (Dec 27, 2005)

CB makes a non-Ti model that I have seen for much less in price. Havent seen any reviews on it though.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

Nah, nothing wrong with the Cobalt IMO. The argument goes that ISIS BB have smaller bearing, thus earing ot faster and of course ISIS is heavy. For the truw weight weenie, I suppose intergrated systems like raceface/shimano/truvativ is the lightest. I don't count grams but that's my guess. heack, I barley count pounds ... LOL. 

As for Square taper, I never ridden one of road ut they ain't light. Lots of folks use them on Single Speeds, for thier rigidity qualities I assume. I would guss they are heavier or at least comparable to ISIS BB's.

My advice, buy a decent ISIS BB from a erputable company slap on do a couple extra miles and drink one less beer tonight and you've made up for the wieght difference.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

2times said:


> I just picked up a new Crank Brothers crankset at a great price and now I need an Isis BB. The crank bros. Ti BB looks great and the warranty is great however it is more than a little pricey. The AM Classic BB looks like it comes in at a great weight and price but the reviews on this BB are not promising at all.
> 
> What are some other lighter Isis BB out there ?
> 
> thanks in advance for your help !


some light ISIS:

KCNC Scandium 68-108: 139g (i'm using this on my winterbike as well.works great)
Token Titan/Carbon 68-113 :160g

no problem to mate them to 73m shells as well by shaving off the stop on the right side cup (shown in the last pic)


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

Jwind said:


> "light ISIS" is kinda like a "light boat anchor". All things considered, the ISIS system is heavy. the CB is yer best bet IMO.


Huh?? :eekster:

Most ISIS BB and cranks are LIGHTER than the outboard stuff! :madman:

Now I don't really reccomend light weight ISIS BB for MTB. Just Road bikes.

If you MUST go with ISIS sacafice a few grams and get a FSA Mega-Quad BB or a SKS BB. SKS under 180g

Both will really last! Or maybe try a Ceramic BB from Token. Mine has been flawless on the roadie and the MTB:L

Best Token Dealer:

Ceramic:
https://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-Carbon-T...hZ018QQcategoryZ56195QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
Ernie can get/convert for MTB sizing.









Light: https://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-UltraLit...hZ018QQcategoryZ56195QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

*Get it here........*

http://cgi.ebay.com/KCNC-SCANDIUM-MTB-Pro-Bottom-Brackets-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ200118427902QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56193QQcmdZViewItem

$84USD. I've used Cycleway (Ebay store) lots. They are the real deal. They also have the Token BB. I have the KCNC Sc version in 108 on my 2x9 and it's a decent BB. Much better so far then the AC. BTW, Cycleway also has the KCNC brakeset for 559.00USD buy it now or make an offer.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

Thanks for the help everyone. Need 68 x 113 btw. 

Looks like its down to the KCNC or Token. About a $35 difference though. 

Worth the price difference ? 

Thoughts ideas ?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*well...*



Axis II said:


> http://cgi.ebay.com/KCNC-SCANDIUM-MTB-Pro-Bottom-Brackets-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ200118427902QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56193QQcmdZViewItem
> 
> $84USD. I've used Cycleway (Ebay store) lots. They are the real deal. They also have the Token BB. I have the KCNC Sc version in 108 on my 2x9 and it's a decent BB. Much better so far then the AC. BTW, Cycleway also has the KCNC brakeset for 559.00USD buy it now or make an offer.


do a search on german ebay and you'll be able to find those KCNC BBs even cheaper...
http://sport.listings.ebay.de/Radsp...1QQfsopZ1QQsacatZ22688QQsocmdZListingItemList

and the 559$ for the brakes is simply a rip-off!!! that's over 100$ over the suggested price...


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

nino said:


> do a search on german ebay and you'll be able to find those KCNC BBs even cheaper...
> http://sport.listings.ebay.de/Radsp...1QQfsopZ1QQsacatZ22688QQsocmdZListingItemList
> 
> and the 559$ for the brakes is simply a rip-off!!! that's over 100$ over the suggested price...


Well now that KCNC has purged itself of the undercutting "opportunist vendors" I suspect we will see higher prices. Cycleway has the 108mm KCNC for $64USD.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

> Well now that KCNC has purged itself of the undercutting "opportunist vendors" I suspect we will see higher prices. Cycleway has the 108mm KCNC for $64USD.


I can't access Ebay here, but do they ( Cycleway ) have it in 113 ?

Am i going to be any better off spending the extra $$ on the Token ?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*well...*



2times said:


> I can't access Ebay here, but do they ( Cycleway ) have it in 113 ?
> 
> Am i going to be any better off spending the extra $$ on the Token ?


hard to answer. Titanium is for sure longer lasting than the aluminium axles. earlier scandium road BBs were much lighter and had thinner wall thickness than the actual versions. those thin ones sometimes would snap if used on a MTB. i've never heard of similar problems with the actual, thicker axles. another point you have to know is that the scandium BBs come with extra-long crank bolts. those weigh 25g/pair and don't have a self-extractor built in. the Token ISIS BBs use regular sized bolts where you can get lighter ones (21g including self-extractor).so the weight difference is getting smaller when you count the bolts as well.

then there is also ATIK which comes also with a Titanium axle and "Tiramic" bearings. ceramic hybrid bearings. Atik is a sub-division of Token.

shown below the 68-108 and 68-113mm version. not the additional seals on the cups which is the same seals also Token BBs come with.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

2times said:


> I can't access Ebay here, but do they ( Cycleway ) have it in 113 ?
> 
> Am i going to be any better off spending the extra $$ on the Token ?


Yes, they have the 73/113. They also have the Token for 87USD, if I remember correctly. I'd feel OK with both. The KCNC Sc has the extralong crankarm bolts so no worries about losing a crankarm anymore.

Nino,
I did the search as you suggested on German Ebay. The only 113 KCNC I could find was 99Euro.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*...not 113*



Axis II said:


> Yes, they have the 73/113. They also have the Token for 87USD, if I remember correctly. I'd feel OK with both. The KCNC Sc has the extralong crankarm bolts so no worries about losing a crankarm anymore.
> 
> Nino,
> I did the search as you suggested on German Ebay. The only 113 KCNC I could find was 99Euro.


not 113. i was talking about the 68-108

i wouldn't suggest the 113 scandiums! those are heavier as they have 3 bearings but those don't help much in durability. at least my own ones ran a little rough after a short period of time. i now use the lighter 68-108 with good results.

shown below a 73-113 scandium. note that this also uses the 25g crankbolts...total = 184g


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

Nino, 
If my cranks call for a 113 isn't that what I have to use ??


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## teamdicky (Jan 12, 2004)

DIRT BOY said:


> Huh?? :eekster:
> 
> Most ISIS BB and cranks are LIGHTER than the outboard stuff! :madman:
> 
> ...


I'm turned on by this BB, but I really need a 68X113mm also. I gave up searching his store as I am incompetent. Is that size an option in the ceramic ISIS BB's???


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

teamdicky said:


> I'm turned on by this BB, but I really need a 68X113mm also. I gave up searching his store as I am incompetent. Is that size an option in the ceramic ISIS BB's???


How about this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-TK876ATC-Titanium-Ceramic-ISIS-MTB-BB-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ200116226566QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56195QQcmdZViewItem

or this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-TK873CT-Titanium-ISIS-MTB-Bottom-Bracket-160g_W0QQitemZ200112100846QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56193QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting


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## teamdicky (Jan 12, 2004)

Axis II said:


> How about this:
> http://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-TK876ATC-Titanium-Ceramic-ISIS-MTB-BB-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ200116226566QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56195QQcmdZViewItem
> 
> or this:
> http://cgi.ebay.com/TOKEN-TK873CT-Titanium-ISIS-MTB-Bottom-Bracket-160g_W0QQitemZ200112100846QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56193QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting


Damn, one is the right price and the other one has ceramic bearings. Guess I better save my pennies. I really feel like ceramics could save ISIS.


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## Kitakeng (Oct 29, 2006)

*Anybody?*

Anyone tried these??

108mm Alu axel 
2 ceramic bearings

These are seriously light...


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

teamdicky said:


> I'm turned on by this BB, but I really need a 68X113mm also. I gave up searching his store as I am incompetent. Is that size an option in the ceramic ISIS BB's???


Any Token BB can be upgraded to ceramic bearings. I did that on one bike. Ernie has everything.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

Axis II said:


> http://cgi.ebay.com/KCNC-SCANDIUM-MTB-Pro-Bottom-Brackets-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ200118427902QQihZ010QQcategoryZ56193QQcmdZViewItem
> 
> $84USD. I've used Cycleway (Ebay store) lots. They are the real deal. They also have the Token BB. I have the KCNC Sc version in 108 on my 2x9 and it's a decent BB. Much better so far then the AC. BTW, Cycleway also has the KCNC brakeset for 559.00USD buy it now or make an offer.


Cycleway are a good ebay vendor as well. I have bought several items as well with very fast shipping and service.


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## teamdicky (Jan 12, 2004)

DIRT BOY said:
 

> Any Token BB can be upgraded to ceramic bearings. I did that on one bike. Ernie has everything.


Did you have to "arrange" that around ebay? I figure I'll wait till I get my new frame and figure out if I can run a 108 first. Yummy ceramic.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*no 113 for me...*



2times said:


> Nino,
> If my cranks call for a 113 isn't that what I have to use ??


i also use a triple crankset with the shorter roadie lenght 108mm BB. i prefer the narrower q-factor and lighter weight of the 108mm BB. the chainline has never been an issue.

just a reminder:
i personally would stay away of so-called "ceramic" bearings unless it's really ALL ceramic. but most just have balls out of ceramic. these balls indeed are much harder than steel ones BUT on the other hand these wear through the steel races faster! steel on steel usually works longer than ceramic on steel.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

teamdicky said:


> Did you have to "arrange" that around ebay? I figure I'll wait till I get my new frame and figure out if I can run a 108 first. Yummy ceramic.


Buy the BB on his site. Then buy the ceramic upgrade with a note to install them and send the original ones with the bb. That's it!


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

2times said:


> Nino,
> If my cranks call for a 113 isn't that what I have to use ??


Not always. Some frames CAN handle shorter BB widths and some can't.
Check your frame or contact the builder. My frame could.

Some will only handle the smaller size with 2x9 drive train due for chainstay clearance or chainline issues.


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## CB2 (May 7, 2006)

2times said:


> Nino,
> If my cranks call for a 113 isn't that what I have to use ??


I tried to use a road crank on a singlespeed mtb w/ a 113 mm Crank Bros. Cobalt cromo BB and I only had about a mm of clearence with the stays.
So now I have a brand new Cobalt bb without a home...


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

On both of my Pedal Force MT builds, I am using a 68 X 108 BB. I have a Token on order for one of the bikes and I will be putting a Kult on the other. Since one of the builds is a SS a 68 X 108 was a must but I am going with a 2 X 9 on the XC build and the 68 X 108 will work perfectly. Both are ISIS.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

DIRT BOY said:


> Cycleway are a good ebay vendor as well. I have bought several items as well with very fast shipping and service.


DirtBoy,

I'm just about ready to pull the trigger on the Token Ti BB and a KMC chain from cycleway

...but who is Ernie you spoke of above in reference to a BB w/ ceramic bearing upgrade ?

Maybe i should check there as well.


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## bdc88 (Sep 27, 2005)

Ernie is from Professional Cycling Discount on Ebay. He is a great guy. I just bought a lot of Token stuff off Ernie and he is a great guy to deal with and ships the same day. I emailed him at around 2 pm and he shipped the same day. 

He also is the guy behind OmniRacer which is skewers and seat post clamps that are the exact same design as M2 Racer. I have 2 pairs of his skewers (40g for the pair) and 2 of the seat post clamps (34.9 @ 9g) 

You can not go wrong at all.

I have also bought from Yan Kelly @ Cycleway. Again a great person to deal with on the KMC X10SL chains as well as KCNC product. I bought 4 of the Ti Pro Lite posts from them as well as my new KCNC brake set but I was able to get a better deal than what they list on the site since I have bought a lot of items from them.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

BDC88 -- thanks for the info. Iam going to check with Ernie's Ebay store tonight. ( I can't access Ebay here at work )

Any idea what the ceramic bearing upgrade kit runs ?


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

2times said:


> DirtBoy,
> 
> I'm just about ready to pull the trigger on the Token Ti BB and a KMC chain from cycleway
> 
> ...


Ernie is a great guy and I get stuff from him when I can't. I also send people his way when I don't carry something.

The Cermaic BB upgrade is $64.99










I can also handle KCNC stuff as well.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*64$ ?????*



DIRT BOY said:


> Ernie is a great guy and I get stuff from him when I can't. I also send people his way when I don't carry something.
> 
> The Cermaic BB upgrade is $64.99
> 
> ...


OUCH!

that's 64$ for a couple ceramic balls. are we kidding or what?


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

Ceramic bearings are NOT cheap. I don't know the quality of the TOKEN, but _ceramic speed _bearings are very expensive!


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*no ceramic!*



DIRT BOY said:


> Ceramic bearings are NOT cheap. I don't know the quality of the TOKEN, but _ceramic speed _bearings are very expensive!


as alraedy mentioned these are NO CERAMIC bearings!!

we are talking about regular bearings with ti-Nitrite coated steel races and ceramic balls. that's a looooong shot from real ceramic bearings.

and once again:
i know from bearing manufacturers that ceramic balls alone are not a very good idea as those wear through the steel races faster than regular steel balls. so you will get play in the races which is not what we are looking for , right?

FULL ceramic bearings are great but those cost a fortune. but then these have ceramic races as well and are much more durable.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

Thank you everyone for your help. 

I ended up ordering the Token BB and a KMC x10 sl chain from Yan_kelly.

:thumbsup:


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## elephant (Mar 21, 2006)

Nino:

Where does one get "real" ceramic bearings?

Bye.


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## tolleyman (Mar 5, 2006)

American Classic Bottom bracket in ISIS is nice, my is 158 grams in 113x68.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Kitakeng said:


> Anyone tried these??
> 
> 108mm Alu axel
> 2 ceramic bearings
> ...


Where can they be sourced and what do the reviews say about this BB? It's new to me. It looks too fast to be hidden inside a bottom bracket shell.:thumbsup:


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## rockman (Jun 18, 2004)

can't say what the weight is but keep in mind the crankbrothers bb has a 5 year warranty. from experience I've gotten about 6 months (500 miles) out of titanium race face signature bb and 1 yr or a little more out of the FSA Ti bb.

I picked up the crankbros crankset and it is mated to a FSA ti bb. The only hitch is that you have to have CB send you the M14 bolts for it. And getting the self extracting ring off. Had to take a hammer and punch to that. There's no spanner wrench alive that could budge it. They sent me new ones as well. Good company to deal with:thumbsup:


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

*Oh great..*

So I'm bringing this thread back up because my sweet look'n Token TK873ct BB took a dive on me yesterday halfway through a 20 mi. ride from my house. I've owned this thing for 4 months! I took it off the bike and the thing roles like its got beach sand in its teeth. Makes me wish I would have gone with the Crank Bros. BB with their 5 year warranty and all.

Anyway, what do you guys suggest as a replacement ? Any of the other manuf. offer a warranty such as C.B. ? I like the C.B. BB ( Ti ) except for the crazy high cost. What do you guys think ?


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## tolleyman (Mar 5, 2006)

I have put almost 1000 miles on my American Classic ISIS (158g) with absolutely no problems. Think I paid $58 for it last year.


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## knef (Jan 26, 2007)

2times said:


> Anyway, what do you guys suggest as a replacement ? Any of the other manuf. offer a warranty such as C.B. ? I like the C.B. BB ( Ti ) except for the crazy high cost. What do you guys think ?


SKF makes very durable ISIS bb's. They offer a 10 year (!) warranty. They weigh a bit more (260gr I think), but they last.
http://www.skf.com/portal/skf/home/industries?contentId=517218&lang=en


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## elephant (Mar 21, 2006)

I ride AC, also. Cheap and easy to get replacement bearings and easy to install them. Mine has 18 months and I replaced the bearings after 12 months because they were getting a little rough. And it is steel and light.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

2times said:


> So I'm bringing this thread back up because my sweet look'n Token TK873ct BB took a dive on me yesterday halfway through a 20 mi. ride from my house. I've owned this thing for 4 months! I took it off the bike and the thing roles like its got beach sand in its teeth. Makes me wish I would have gone with the Crank Bros. BB with their 5 year warranty and all.
> 
> Anyway, what do you guys suggest as a replacement ? Any of the other manuf. offer a warranty such as C.B. ? I like the C.B. BB ( Ti ) except for the crazy high cost. What do you guys think ?


2nd winterseason on a 139g KCNC scandium BB on my winterbike and still going smooth. i'm also surprised but the light roadie BB has hold up much better as previous 3 bearing MTB-BBs of the same manufacturer.


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Nino,
It seems KCNC and Token are about the same price and weight, so which do you recommend? Do either of them have warranty, if bought from you?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

EuroMack said:


> Nino,
> It seems KCNC and Token are about the same price and weight, so which do you recommend? Do either of them have warranty, if bought from you?


i have never used a Token Titanium. the Token has 113mm axle, the KCNC scandium i use has 108mm and i prefer the narrow q-factor and lower weight.

get a Crankbros BB if you are looking for a warrantied ISIS BB - there you pay the price for it as well.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

Look at the offerings from SKF, more spendy, but they supposedly last longer.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*ahem...*



Jwind said:


> Look at the offerings from SKF, more spendy, but they supposedly last longer.


sorry - this is the save some weight forum


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## EuroMack (Jan 15, 2007)

Jwind, 
I am a big fan of SKF products at work, but I would like something a little lighter. However, when the time comes for new bearing cartridges, I'll likely choose SKF.

Nino,
As I recall, KCNC requires that you use their special extra-long bolts. What is the weight of the KCNC 68x108 with the included bolts?
I see other sellers have 68x108 Token. Is there a reason to go with Token instead?

Does anyone know about this?
http://cgi.ebay.de/Chin-Haur-CH-95-...ryZ77607QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*bolts...*



EuroMack said:


> Jwind,
> I am a big fan of SKF products at work, but I would like something a little lighter. However, when the time comes for new bearing cartridges, I'll likely choose SKF.
> 
> Nino,
> ...


KCNC bolts weigh 25g. not much heavier than regular, aluminium bolts for ISIS as well (21g)

complete with bolts the 108-68 KCNC weighs 164g

Token buys the BBs from KCNC...same BB.


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## 2times (Jul 14, 2006)

elephant


> I ride AC, also. Cheap and easy to get replacement bearings and easy to install them. Mine has 18 months and I replaced the bearings after 12 months because they were getting a little rough. And it is steel and light.


Where do you pick up the bearings from if I go the AC route ?

Thanks for your help everyone !!


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## elephant (Mar 21, 2006)

2times said:


> elephant
> 
> Where do you pick up the bearings from if I go the AC route ?
> 
> Thanks for your help everyone !!


I think I got them from Cambria (cannot remember) but lots of stores carry them and your LBS should be able to get them easily.


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## Patriot222 (Dec 16, 2007)

I'm riding on a 73x118 American Classic. It's unique in that it uses a tough cro-mo spindle but remains lightweight (157 grams) due to the split ring design. I'm very happy with it. It's ultra-smooth and was easy to install and set-up.


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## Axis II (May 10, 2004)

Patriot222 said:


> I'm riding on a 73x118 American Classic. It's unique in that it uses a tough cro-mo spindle but remains lightweight (157 grams) due to the split ring design. I'm very happy with it. It's ultra-smooth and was easy to install and set-up.


I've had three AC BBs. They all went south fast with the bearings but I was too lazy to overhaul the BB on my SS 29er so I just kept riding it and it "cured" itself somehow. The others always developed a horrible knocking/clicking sound after a few months so I tore them down and replaced bearings or the entire BB altogether. My advice would be to ignore the noise and just keep riding out this BB, FWIW.


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