# Dummy and Dumber



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Got my dummy on backorder tonight, anticipated delivery is mid-november at this point, I'm guessing it'll be the straight frame, which is fine with me. Have a bin of parts in the garage, the big missing link at this point is wheels, but by November I can have that worked out as well. 

Pretty excited right about now, will try to document the build as it goes together..

Plum


----------



## Leopold Porkstacker (Apr 21, 2010)

AWESOMENESS!!! Please post pics when you receive it! For sure show us build pics too!!! I am eager to see where they skimped on quality (new, lower price = “lesser” components, according to the guys at Xtracycle). I am waiting for my 26"x2.5" Large Marge wheel build to be completed, that is going to kick some ass on my recently-acquired Big Dummy!


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

I'm still waiting to see what price I'll be getting it for. On the advise of Adam at Treefort, I put one on backorder at their currently listed price of just over $600 and if it holds, that would be sweet, but I'm not sure yet, with the redesign and all. Hoestly, I don't expect the quality of the frame to be any better or worse than other surly offerings, I don't think anybody is buying them based on their artisan qualities, moreso the economy and utility factors there.

I have basically a full XT drivetrain to put on it, with the exception that the middle ring (that needs to be replaced along with a new cassette and chain) will likely go to a surly stainless model for additional mileage. Front derailleur is an XTR 950 series with the parallel plates, not my first choice, but I already have it..

I've got a set of Magura Louise 180mm f/r hydraulics and a pair of titec j-bars (the flat bar, not the riser) waiting as well, and a thomson post. I'll need a longer hose for the rear brake, but that's still cheaper than going another route for the brake department.

I have either a King or a CC 110 headset to go in as well.

The rest of the parts are yet to be determined..

Plum



Leopold Porkstacker said:


> AWESOMENESS!!! Please post pics when you receive it! For sure show us build pics too!!! I am eager to see where they skimped on quality (new, lower price = "lesser" components, according to the guys at Xtracycle). I am waiting for my 26"x2.5" Large Marge wheel build to be completed, that is going to kick some ass on my recently-acquired Big Dummy!


----------



## bme107 (Jul 23, 2008)

Say it ain't so. Still waiting for you to complete the other one and ride report.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Yeah, yeah, I just got the spokes for that build yesterday, those wheels will get laced tonight..

Anyway, i heard from the vendor, looks like the sale price won't apply to the 'new' framesets, so not sure what the non-sale msrp on the new ones is, but my order won't go through at the sale price..

My fault for waiting too long, I'm sure it'll work out..

Plum



bme107 said:


> Say it ain't so. Still waiting for you to complete the other one and ride report.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

There may, or may not be an 18" big dummy frame and fork, complete with extracycle wideloaders, v-rack and snapdeck, with the freeloader bags out for delivery this morning..

Budget dictates that i can't finish it right away, but hopefully this fall yet.. First up, gotta get rid of that brown/green paint though..

Plum


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

It's official, I'm dumber now then when I came to work this morning..

Plum


----------



## bme107 (Jul 23, 2008)

Plum said:


> It's official, I'm dumber now then when I came to work this morning..
> 
> Plum


You too? I get that also, especially on Mondays.

gregclimbs has an awesome powder job and may be tough to top in terms of "wow" factor. What are you thinking?


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

bme107 said:


> You too? I get that also, especially on Mondays.
> 
> gregclimbs has an awesome powder job and may be tough to top in terms of "wow" factor. What are you thinking?


Probably something less "wow" than what Greg has, his is really nice, but I tend to go for more muted, matted colors. My original "supercommuter" had a dark gray "cast iron" powder finish, so it had a little texture, like a heavier orange peel finish. Was killer durable, low profile, but looked really nice. I'm thinking something along those lines.

I have a quote from the local (within 20 minutes) powder guy, around $120 to strip and recoat frame and fork. I see a bunch of people have powdered the xtracycle racks as well, might have those done too, have to see..

And yes, I still have these pink fenders and they will be going on the Dummy...

Plum


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

How are people using chariots with their Dummies, where do you mount the bracket? Looks like it would mount fine to the wideloader socket, but not if I want to use the wideloaders. Putting it on the axle mount (stock location) won't work due to the length of the trailer arm, so where are people mounting the bracket?

Thanks.

Plum


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

*Shaving a dummy*

Worked on this last night, shaving off the cantilever bosses. I figure, I haven't used cantilever bosses on a bike equipped with discs, ever. Or, more clearly, when I have an option to go disc, I never consider cantilever/v-brakes. I'm not going to change this thinking on this bike, so why not clear off some unneccessary crap?

Hacked them off with a hacksaw, the used a combination of a cross-hatch file and a dremel with a sanding drum to clean up the remnants. Started on the fork, because if I messed up, it would be cheaper to replace than the frame. Got them pretty smooth, but you can still barely feel the old brazing, I had to resist doing 'just a little more' for fear of compromising the actual tubing, but I'm happy with how it turned out. Under powder, I don't think you'll be able to tell they were ever there..

Plum


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

At the painters now, flat gun metal gray frame and fork, xtracycle racks will be flat black.. Two weeks wait...

Plum


----------



## rkt88edmo (Mar 28, 2004)

Nice - given the reports of underspray around the cable guides and the ease of scratching the finish a matte powdercoat would be awesome.

If you are interested in the centerstand i am ready to pass on the black powder coated one I bought from Vikb - you aren't running an IGH, so if you don't plan to use wideloaders much I'll be posting it for $75 shipped in CONUS.


----------



## gregclimbs (Sep 21, 2006)

rkt88edmo said:


> ...you aren't running an IGH...


Vik mentioned that he had issues with his IGH and the stand...

I have a rohloff on my dummy and it doesn't interfere...

perhaps it is the chain tensioner that I use that solves that? Could you describe the interference? Or maybe Vik could (if he is listening)

g


----------



## rkt88edmo (Mar 28, 2004)

When in the "up" stowed position the chain rides against the bottom of the kickback. I'm running the Rohloff dual pulley chain tensioner. It looks like it may only need another 1.5 cm to clear the kickback with room for play. If I really found myself in need of a centerstand I would strongly consider carving into the kickback tube to create a pass through area and welding in a filler piece to maintain integrity.

As it is, I'm glad to have had the chance to use it and am ready to pass it along.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Haven't decided about a center stand yet, I want to use the dummy for a while to see how often I have use for the wide loaders before I buy more gear. I still have wheels and shifters to buy as well, plus some replacement drive train parts, so the center stand will have wait for now.


Plum


----------



## Leopold Porkstacker (Apr 21, 2010)

Plum said:


> Haven't decided about a center stand yet, I want to use the dummy for a while to see how often I have use for the wide loaders before I buy more gear. I still have wheels and shifters to buy as well, plus some replacement drive train parts, so the center stand will have wait for now.
> 
> Plum


I just mounted Wideloaders last week, and now engaging/disengaging the centerstand is an awkward task. I can see where slapping the stock kickstand back on my Big Dummy would make life easier.

I am hoping I won't need to cut my cantilever bosses to fit the 65mm Large Marges and Hookworms, I did see that Flickr user Biggerdummy didn't cut his to fit them:










I guess I would need to slighty deflate the Hookworms to remove/install the wheels.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Back from paint today, started in with the assembly. Cleared all the threads, pressed in the HS, installed the fork, stem, bar, etc. Need a higher rise stem, maybe a bit shorter as well. The bar is *just* below the saddle, would like them higher.

Threw on a set of wheels from my wife's bike, started with the rear fender, etc. Installed the racks to check fit, etc.

I need to get a longer hydro hose for the rear brake, swap over the drivetrain parts from another bike, replace some drivetrain parts (rings and cassette), wheels and some thumbie mounts and I'll have everything..

Anyway, has anybody ever used a set of bar ends on the v-rack uprights as footie mounts for kids? I was putting the bar plugs back in the end of the rack after painting and it occurred to me that an old set of bar ends would fit over the v-rack and be about the right height for a rugrat on the back. Slipped one on so i could get some feedback on that..

With the paint, I ended up with a gloss finish after looking at the samples. In low light, it's just gray, in sunlight there will be a little flake in it. I had the v-racks and wideloaders powdered flat black, really happy with how those turned out. Need to get a set of decals coming as well...

Couple of pics for the peanut gallery..

Plum


----------



## bme107 (Jul 23, 2008)

Very envious of your continuous builds. Don't know how you guys keep doing it since I've probably only been able to put $500+/- into bike related activities in the past 2 years. I do know that you can fetch at least $85 for that Kettler in the background on CL. 

The lighting and camera are not doing much for the frame color. The bar end foot pegs are ingenious. Could add some old used bar tape for a bit of grip if they are slick under the kid's feet.


----------



## Leopold Porkstacker (Apr 21, 2010)

WOW! The bar end footpegs—what a resourceful idea! :thumbsup:


----------



## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

rkt88edmo said:


> When in the "up" stowed position the chain rides against the bottom of the kickback. I'm running the Rohloff dual pulley chain tensioner. It looks like it may only need another 1.5 cm to clear the kickback with room for play. If I really found myself in need of a centerstand I would strongly consider carving into the kickback tube to create a pass through area and welding in a filler piece to maintain integrity.
> 
> As it is, I'm glad to have had the chance to use it and am ready to pass it along.


Ya that's the same problem I had, but we have the same IGH/tensioner setup so no surprise I guess.

What was your impression of the Kickback?...it seems to have lasted even a shorter durration in your arsenal than mine.



Leopold Porkstacker said:


> I just mounted Wideloaders last week, and now engaging/disengaging the centerstand is an awkward task. I can see where slapping the stock kickstand back on my Big Dummy would make life easier.


Ya that gets old very fast. I had actually thought about leaving the side kickstand on my BD to use when I needed to swap in the Wideloaders, but that doesn't work as the side stand and the Kickback interfere with each other. It also seems a bit stupid to need a second stand to make your main stand easier to use.


----------



## rkt88edmo (Mar 28, 2004)

vikb said:


> Ya that's the same problem I had, but we have the same IGH/tensioner setup so no surprise I guess.
> 
> What was your impression of the Kickback?...it seems to have lasted even a shorter durration in your arsenal than mine.


I liked the kickback, like I said, I am somewhat torn between passing it on and modding it so the chain passes through.

My most often carried load is my two kids and I don't need a centerstand to load them. I keep the front brake locked out and that keeps the bike from rolling so I only need to keep it upright which is pretty easy. And 90% of the time I am near a wall, pole, or tree which makes loading even easier.

So at the end of the day the center stand is far more a convenience than a necessity, and as low on my list as weight is, that stand is heavy. With the chain dragging, it just makes me crazy, not sure what the efficiency loss is, but the sound and knowledge of it dragging makes me nuts.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

bme107 said:


> Very envious of your continuous builds. Don't know how you guys keep doing it since I've probably only been able to put $500+/- into bike related activities in the past 2 years. I do know that you can fetch at least $85 for that Kettler in the background on CL.
> 
> The lighting and camera are not doing much for the frame color. The bar end foot pegs are ingenious. Could add some old used bar tape for a bit of grip if they are slick under the kid's feet.


I'll have to see how the pegs work after I get it all together. Seems like a good location though, as my kids aren't tall enough yet to reach a set of footsies (nor do i have a set). Might be a moot point, as my kids may not be old enough yet to ride on the back anyway, have to see how they do in the spring. Bar tape or grip tape is a good idea, I'll have to see how they work.

As for the finances, I tend to turn things over pretty frequently. I sold a SIR9 frame/fork and wheelset to fund this build, and I'm reusing the drivetrain off my older bike on the Surly. I'm recycling the drivetrain off the SIR onto the other bike, so my actual out of pocket isn't too bad. Plus, it's a hell of a lot cheaper than having a car hobby or something. The other recent tandem project was under $1,000 all in, probably closer to $800 or so, since I got the rolling chassis so cheap and am using (essentially) all the original drivetrain components.

Plum


----------



## SelfPropelledDevo (Oct 2, 2005)

as to the kickstand deal:

I simply zip tied some old road tyre to the wideloaders
and I lay the bike on the wideloaders.
its a much faster transition, like when you were a kid and you'd come skidding into your buddy's yard, dumping your bike.

as to loading the bike, I use BOB trailer dry saks, which happen to work well on the wideloaders.
while the BD is laying on its WideLoaders, its in the opportune position to most easily receive cargo.

that is, when the BD is laying diagonally on its side, laying cargo onto it, puts the weight right into the intersection of V-Rack and WideLoader. Like laying weight into a "V".


----------



## SelfPropelledDevo (Oct 2, 2005)

I've lamented over kickstands and the BD.
after breaking my 3rd Greenfield, I decided to quit trying to keep the bike propped up, and go with gravity, letting it rest on its side.

as it turns out the wideloader with tyre zip tied actually works out to work pretty well.

when the bike is without the WideLoaders, I tend to use the kickstand much more. And as a pain as it is, it seems to be a bit of a hassle to load the BD with any substantial weight, which brings up the topic of simply using FreeLoaders, and how effective/convenient they are compared to adding WideLoaders.

the biggest convenience of riding without WideLoaders, is the narrow profile of the bike.

if it were a matter of a kickstand(s), it seems that integrating into the WideLoaders would be the answer.
???

that is to say...
a new version of WideLoader would/could simply have a hole in the edge
thereby alowing a rod to go thru the BD frame at the point where the WideLoader attaches closest to the bb
just put the kickstand furthest outboard vs in the center.

the same could be done for the rear of the bike too.

the idea, being that a rod would go thru the BD at the attachment points for WideLoaders.
new WideLoaders would have holes to allow a rod going thru.
at the ends of those rods, a kick stand could be attached

thereby creating at least 2 kickstands per rod
which would bring the BD to having 4 kickstands going thru the WideLoaders.
with adjustable legs to compensate for uneven ground....

but the whole thing takes on this giant complex operation/contraption to hold a bike up...

something as simple as a kickstand, becomes a big pain 

which goes right back to laying the BD onto the wideloaders... add old tyre to the sides, and be done.
use something to hold the brake(s).


----------



## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

SelfPropelledDevo said:


> as to the kickstand deal:
> 
> I simply zip tied some old road tyre to the wideloaders
> and I lay the bike on the wideloaders.
> its a much faster transition, like when you were a kid and you'd come skidding into your buddy's yard, dumping your bike.


That's a smart solution. I don't ride with Wide Loaders installed all the because the bike is too wide for my tastes, but when they are on it certainly makes sense to lay the bike over on one.

A cheap $7 kickstand works when you don't have Wide Loaders installed.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Well, sold the 2nd car, time to get going on the Dummy. Will be looking for deals on parts over the next week or so, hoping to get it wrapped up by early in the year.

Plum


----------



## mkoskinen (Apr 9, 2009)

Leopold Porkstacker said:


> I guess I would need to slighty deflate the Hookworms to remove/install the wheels.


Sorry kinda off topic but who make that front rack:thumbsup:


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

So I'm pretty much done. No pictures yet, but I was bleeding the brake tonight, mounting cages, etc and got to thinking about the centerstand. 

I picked up the kickback that has passed through a few forum members, and thought I understood that it didn't work with the wide-loaders mounted. I couldn't see why, so I mounted a wide loader to check for issues.

As far as I can tell, the wide-loader works with the kickback, but you just have to fish it out from under the wide-loader with your foot. Am I missing anything here?

Main reason for going with the kickback was a worry that the bike was going to tip over onto a kid while they were climbing on it. Doesn't completely solve that problem, but it goes a long way..

Pictures soon. Maybe tomorrow..

Plum


----------



## gregclimbs (Sep 21, 2006)

yes, you have to "fish it out" with your foot, but I do not find this so hard to do.

for kids loading and unloading, I really like the kickback. Also since I pretty much leave the wideloaders on full time, I don't have issues with it either.

it would be more a PITA if you swapped the wides on and off regularly.

someday I might move to a rolling jackass, but for now, the kickback works well (for me).

but then again, when I am no longer hauling critters on the dumb dumb, I will probably just go the way of the devo and eschew a kickstand altogether.

g


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Good to get real-use feedback. I'm happy with the kickback, but then I haven't used it yet either. So far though, it seems very stable for the kids to climb on and off the bike without the imminent danger of it tipping onto them.

I can fully see Devo's method being more convenient, and I agree, once I'm not moving actual persons, it'll probably get the nod. Through the goodness of other forum members, I don't have a lot invested into the kickback, so if I'm not happy with it, I think I can resell at not much of a loss.

Plum



gregclimbs said:


> yes, you have to "fish it out" with your foot, but I do not find this so hard to do.
> 
> for kids loading and unloading, I really like the kickback. Also since I pretty much leave the wideloaders on full time, I don't have issues with it either.
> 
> ...


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

*Much Success!*

I have ridden it, and it is good.

I got home a little early from work yesterday, so I quickly bolted the chariot bracket to the frame using the rohloff boss location (need to get a nut to back that up with) and towed the kids over to pick up my wife. She jumped on the back and rode a little over a mile back to the house with us.

Also needed to return some movies last night, so I took the dummy for that too.

Initial impressions are that it rolls better/easier than I anticipated for such a long/heavy bike, and that my position should be good on it.

Still to do is re-bleed the rear brake, it works but is spongy, and I ran out of patience with it the other night, so that's stilll on the list. I want to get a backup nut on the bolt for the chariot bracket, and a larger rear tire, which is currently a 2.0 continental leader pro (I had it laying around when my 2.4 Motoraptor didn't fit).

It seems I trimmed my rear fender enough, didn't hear anything rubbing, and the shifting seems fine at this time. I'm using DA bar end shifters on paul thumbie mounts, in friction mode as this particular set of shifters the indexing ring (with the indents) has gone to hell and doesn't work. At least they were cheap.

I still need to get some pictures, we're still kinda short on daylight around here, so getting them before dark is tough. I was going to take some at the outdoor ice rink last night, but the lights were off by the time I came back by there.

I'm pretty pleased overall, and think that it's going to get used quite a bit. I'm sure I'm not done with mods and custom stuff, but I'll do that as I find I need it.

Plum


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

*First Commute*

Pulled the kids into daycare this morning, then continued my way into work for the day. As I mentioned earlier, we sold our 2nd vehicle and are a 1 car family. My wife needed to use the car this afternoon, so preparations were made and we rode in this morning.

I re-bled the rear brake last night, just took it off the bike, put an old handlebar in the work stand, hung the caliper from a lanyard and got it done. Feel is right back to where it was from the factory, so I'm happy with that. I also replaced a slow leaking tube in the rear wheel and threw it in the v-rack bag as a spare.

I've got a 3 y.o. and a 2 y.o., and their daycare is about 3 miles from the house on the way to my office, which is another 2 past daycare. It's a pretty hilly route, plus 70 lbs of kids and trailer, plus a little bit of mushy snow on the road from yesterday, so I don't break any records, all told it takes about an hour to drop them off, finish the ride, get locked up and be at my desk. Meh, not too bad.

Anyway, I took a few pics of the full setup locked up this morning at work. They're camera phone pics, so they suck, but I figured they're (marginally) better than nothing. The front wheel is locked to the frame, the chariot is locked through it's frame and the dummy frame to the bench behind. I need to get some more long cables for locking duties.

Plum


----------



## SelfPropelledDevo (Oct 2, 2005)

wow! looks great.
I'm jealous of those J Bars
how does the snapdeck work out?
typically they like to de-snap out of position. a solution is to since the V-racks towards each other. The upshot, is that if you end up tying it, the whole of the assembly easily comes off of the BD as one unit, when you need to do maintenance.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

No issues with the snapdeck so far, I have it 'clipped' over the nylon for the slings, which gives it a little more friction (maybe). I'll probably do some Devo 'ring' mods this summer when my garage warms up.

J-bars are nice, had this set from the bike i sacrificed for this one, have a set of h-bars on the tandem. The grip area on the j-bars is ever so slightly longer..

This was the first true outing, and so far so good. No mechanical wiggles, no rubbing anywhere = happy Plum.

My daugher can't wait to ride on the back, but it was only mid-20's this morning, a little cold for little ones outside of the chariot. I put hot water nalgenes (inside old wool socks) inside the chariot with them, it is usually about 70 degrees in there!

JP



SelfPropelledDevo said:


> wow! looks great.
> I'm jealous of those J Bars
> how does the snapdeck work out?
> typically they like to de-snap out of position. a solution is to since the V-racks towards each other. The upshot, is that if you end up tying it, the whole of the assembly easily comes off of the BD as one unit, when you need to do maintenance.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

The weather has been pretty non-conducive to actually getting a lot of use in, other than the odd trip to the store or home depot, things have been kinda slow.

I got a chance this afternoon to take my daughter down to the local park for some sledding. She rode on the back, felt comfortable, used the footrests (used bar ends on the v-rack uprights) and rode there and back without issue, plus a lap around the block.

I can't really feel her weight on the back, so that's kinda cool, and she liked riding back there. The footrests worked well, she can stand up on them and put all her weight (all 30 lbs) on them with no slipping. They'll come in handy to help her self correct while riding..

Plum


----------



## fatchanceti (Jan 12, 2005)

No heated grips yet? Poor effort.


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

No, but my hands don't usually get cold anyway, oh you meant for the passenger? She's learning to HTFU, so no heated grips for her.



fatchanceti said:


> No heated grips yet? Poor effort.


Plum


----------



## mosovich (Apr 19, 2004)

*Funny you should..*

say that.. My 4 year old soon to be 5, and went went for our first official big dummy ride yesterday.. After about a half hour he starts the "my hands are cold".. I said "Ian you'll soon be 5, time to take it like a man".. He didn't get it..:madman: So I gave him my gloves.. 5 minutes later.. "dad, my hands are still cold"...


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

Yeah, little kids don't generate hardly any heat on their own. Everything has to be double warm, usually we do two pairs of wool mittens, which aren't waterproof, but are warmer than the store-bought ones.. We had my mom leave off the thumbs too, so there's no a single digit out there on it's own freezing. They lose a little dexterity, but they don't have a lot in mittens anyway..

It was above 30 today, so not too cold. We were out for about an hour and a half all told.



mosovich said:


> say that.. My 4 year old soon to be 5, and went went for our first official big dummy ride yesterday.. After about a half hour he starts the "my hands are cold".. I said "Ian you'll soon be 5, time to take it like a man".. He didn't get it..:madman: So I gave him my gloves.. 5 minutes later.. "dad, my hands are still cold"...


Plum


----------



## SelfPropelledDevo (Oct 2, 2005)

freaking cold!


----------



## Welsh Dave (Jul 26, 2005)

SelfPropelledDevo said:


> I've lamented over kickstands and the BD.
> 
> if it were a matter of a kickstand(s), it seems that integrating into the WideLoaders would be the answer.
> ???
> ...


I'm just lurking here, but I wondered if anyone had seen the kickstands with "training wheels" that German, French & Dutch postal services use on their delivery bikes... then Devo pretty much described the same idea (at least I THINK he did...)

Using the widest part of the frame (in this case wideloader tube) as the basis for a "through-frame" stand that gives the widest footprint.

The postal bikes use a double-sided, spring-loaded stand attached to the fork. You just kick it forward and down as you step off the bike. Only a small section at the bottom of the stand actually pivots. So when it springs back up, the arm doesn't pivot up/back far enough to interfere with steering or cause toe overlap... if that makes sense?



















The kick-down stand probably gets used a hundred times per day & needs to be totally stable on irregular sidewalks (no chance of all that weight toppling onto a civilian) AND fast to use. You can see they don't worry about overloading those things. The newer ones have electric-assist, Magura hydro discs and tow a detachable hand-cart/trailer. 








They're quite a sight when fully loaded.

Could that approach be adapted to the Dummy, maybe?


----------



## FastFix (Sep 29, 2007)

SelfPropelledDevo said:


> freaking cold!


HA ha we had a heat wave today of 40!! I Big Dummied it over to my buddies today:thumbsup:


----------



## Plum (Sep 14, 2004)

We had a quite tropical 50 degrees yesterday, had to work, so I rode the dummy in, then a few quick errands afterwards. Lots of melting snow, lots of puddles.

Looks like it didn't get much below 40 all night, with some light winds. Smells like spring around here, if we get the rain we're supposed to later this week, we'll be out of snow in a hurry.



FastFix said:


> HA ha we had a heat wave today of 40!! I Big Dummied it over to my buddies today:thumbsup:


Plum


----------



## SRALPH (Jun 27, 2008)

mkoskinen said:


> Sorry kinda off topic but who make that front rack:thumbsup:


BiggerDummie here

Rack was made by Leah Stargartner (Rack Girl on Flickr)


----------

