# Best place to live and mountain bike????



## *KL* (Jul 3, 2007)

I was wondering if some of you could fill me in on where it's best to live if you love mountain biking. I'm in the process of making some changes and am planning a move, but haven't decided where to. I'm confident finding work won't be a problem. I just need to be near a city large enough for a hospital or two (I work in healthcare).

I would like to live somewhere that has access to local trails, and has a large friendly cycling community. I also enjoy racing and hope to find somewhere that has a competitive local series. I also love other outdoor activities such as camping, hiking, skiing, and would like to learn to kayak. 

If you think you have the best mountain biking trails and cycling community tell me why and help make my decision easier.


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## 98ACURA (May 3, 2007)

I would say Denver or the surrounding area would be a good bet.


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## mace2 (May 3, 2004)

Vancouver BC!


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## brado1 (Oct 5, 2004)

Western North Carolina, cuz it's good :thumbsup:


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## rip420tide (Apr 3, 2007)

Havent ridden there yet, but Portland Oregon seems to have everything you want in close proximity...


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## pdm362 (Aug 1, 2006)

According to Mountain Bike Action Magazine, the best place is Park City, Utah. Apparently everytime a company starts a housing development they have to build/add to mountain biking trails and they strictly enforce this law.


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## Arkon (Apr 27, 2004)

Southern Utah has great riding but excpect a nice pay cut. Utah health care does not pay like other places. But the riding is year round and like no where else in the country.

Phoenix also has a great riding group and health care is booming there. riding available 10 months a year- 12 if you hate yourself. All the outdoors you want within a few hours drive in any direction- mounatins, lakes, desert, Mexico, Vegas.


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## crazylax42 (Jan 17, 2007)

Fruita....wish I could move out there. AKA single track heaven


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## wayodh (Nov 13, 2004)

For me is Cusco, in Peru. Good weather, the air is pure, and lots of possibilities to live for MTB!


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## desurfer (Oct 22, 2005)

Not Tampa, FL! High prices, low wages, and flat, boring trails. Sure, it's technical, but I miss real climbs and swooping singletrack.


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## crager34 (Feb 23, 2005)

When you say "live" and "bike" I think of a few variables such as the obvious.... trails, trail access, biking community. And the lesser though of, schools, night life, weather, other activities, etc. The Western Slope of Colorado (Grand Junction area), SW corner (Durango), Denver. Salt Lake City/Provo, Utah area, Central California (cost of living issues there). Central to Western North Carolina. I would say narrow it down to a few, find yourself a couple locals to speak to and/or take a trip (best) then decided. I was born and raised in Denver, CO, so feel free to contact me with any questions about Colorado.


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## IndecentExposure (Sep 25, 2006)

I live in Golden, CO (Denver), we have riding all over.... however...

I would look into Durango (Close to Moab, Gallup, Arizona when winter hits) and you have the high country to play in during the summer.

Utah is fantastic, Can't beat it.

Can you be nomadic? You know, be in 1 place for a year and then move on? That would be ideal.


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## BunnV (Sep 7, 2005)

*Southern Cali!*

Most people wouldn't think of Mt Biking and Los Angeles in the same sentence, but we have great trails here that stretch from the mountains all the way to the beach. There are lots of bike shops from corporate giants (Performance Bike) to high-end boutique stores (Universal Cycles in Universal City) and everything in-between.

There are plenty of clubs to ride with, but I find the best rides are with a few buddies and new people we meet on the trails. Best of all, I can ride from my house to the trail head if I want to (about 7 miles on the street) and then stay off road for an epic ride or just do a two hour loop.

Look for Caballero trailhead in Encino. Take the short but technical single-track to dirt Mulholland. From there you can ride easy fire roads or super technical single-track ALL DAY LONG.

Ride to the beach, the Hollywood Sign, Malibu, or to the former site of O.J. Simpson's house in Brentwood via Sullivan Canyon trail (awesome). The possibilities are unlimited. The terrain is diverse too. There is hard-pack, sand, rock gardens, red clay, water crossings and even footbridges&#8230;all on the same ride. Add in the proximity to nightlife, world-class restaurants and great homes and you'll find it's hard to beat.

I'll admit that it's not as scenic as Peru, but it sure is more convenient!


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## aword4you (Jul 25, 2005)

I'd third the vote for Fruita/Grand Junction, especially if you're in healthcare. Hubby has wanted to move there for almost a year. The biggest job industries right now are oil drilling and nursing. 

I live in So Cal and wouldn't advocate it as a place to move. Lots of trail access issues going on currently. Not to mention incredible over population, traffic, and smog. Also, it's now summer, so unless you like riding in 100* + from July until September, think somewhere else (this would also exclude the Phoenix area, and Las Vegas). If you can afford living in OC there are a lot of trails, but also a lot of people. It hasn't happened yet, but everyone has been saying for a month or so that the national forests will most likely close to all human traffic at some point due to fire risk. We'll see what happens ,but most of the trails I ride are in NF land, so that would suck.

If you can handle Vancouver BC traffic, and don't mind the immigration stuff, go for it  That's the only place I've visited in the past 5~ years that I'd consider moving to.


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## Bubbles & Me (Apr 13, 2007)

Not that we really want anymore moving here! Might be room for a couple more bikers though.

Western Washington. You have some of the top healthcare facilitys in the country.
 For biking you have mountians in fact two mountian ranges dry forest and rain forest and in eastern part of state you have dry and even some deseret like conditions. Of course you have a lot of camping sking and all of that.
If you like to fish there is some great salmon and steelhead trout fishing.
If you want to get into kayaking why not try doing it in the San Juans with killer Whales?

Check this out


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## brent878 (Apr 17, 2007)

this is a hard question. I live in so-cal near the beaches and I love it here. Summer it gets as hot as high 70's low 80's. 90's is a heat wave. Winter it gets in the 60's high 50's.. So you can ride all year long no problem. thier are lots of trails out here and technical and fun but its not going to be as nice as some of the other places listed. So i guess you have to tell us what you are looking for? Super nice trails everywhere? Weather that you can ride any time you want? A city where you can do other stuff when your not working? Cost of living is cheap? Not too crowded? Obviously I am not living here just becuase I like mountain biking but i don't find it hard to mountain bike here at all. I have been to some of the other places and they have really nice trails and its fun but i go to the city and think that i couldn't live thier. But that is my life style and everyone's life style is different.


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## hanshananigan (May 15, 2006)

wayodh said:


> For me is Cusco, in Peru. Good weather, the air is pure, and lots of possibilities to live for MTB!


No way! I'd never bike where donkeys have the right of way.


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## pdm362 (Aug 1, 2006)

I went online and searched and now I am changing my opinion from earlier and I want to say Fruita Colo. is the place to be. The place sounds amazing and you can you ride the Fruita trails straight to Moab (its truly an epic though). I think I want to move there after reading so many articles about it. Need a roommate??


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## ionsmuse (Jul 14, 2005)

Flagstaff
Durango
Park City 
Ketchum
Fruita/Grand Junction
Moab

Can't go wrong.


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## uinta (Aug 7, 2006)

*im biased but...*

N Utah. You can ride year round in both desert and mountain terrain. In Feb. you can ride Gooseberry and in July you can ride at 10,000 ft along lakes and streams.

A four hour drive gets you to such famous places as Fruita, Moab, Zion, Jackson, and Sun Valley. Plus, there is unending terrain in between. Park City and the surrounding areas have some amazing singletrack and, its true, new housing developments are required to build new, mountain bike specific singletrack.

Also, SLC has a lot of hospitals and a very large medical research facility at the University of Utah.

And, some of the best skiing anywhere!


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## tahoedirtprincess (Jun 26, 2007)

South Lake Tahoe. We have a hospital. 

Only problem is that snow can get in the way of winter riding, but that's okay, head down the hill to Sac or the Bay Area...or just start boarding/skiing.


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## Smashley49 (May 18, 2007)

Tahoe or Reno, hands down(although Fruita or Denver don't sound too bad either)


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## dosboy (Oct 29, 2006)

*utah*

another vote for utah, i live in salt lake and in the winter i get sick of riding the low elevation trails i just take a weekend trip down to st george to ride in 60 degree weather on awesome red rock trails, in the summer nothing beats park city single track, oh and the fact that you have 5 major canyons to choose from all of which are within 30 minutes to salt lake all of which have major mt bike trails on them... oh and did i mention park city literally has 100's of miles of pristine shaded single track!!!!:eekster:


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## macaw (Feb 11, 2007)

*KL* said:


> I was wondering if some of you could fill me in on where it's best to live if you love mountain biking. I'm in the process of making some changes and am planning a move, but haven't decided where to. I'm confident finding work won't be a problem. I just need to be near a city large enough for a hospital or two (I work in healthcare).
> 
> I would like to live somewhere that has access to local trails, and has a large friendly cycling community. I also enjoy racing and hope to find somewhere that has a competitive local series. I also love other outdoor activities such as camping, hiking, skiing, and would like to learn to kayak.
> 
> If you think you have the best mountain biking trails and cycling community tell me why and help make my decision easier.


I moved to North Bend Washington and live on the middle fork of the Snoqualmie river. You get class II-IV kayaking depending on where you launch. Skiing is 15 minutes away but it's not resort-class skiing. Mountain biking is very nice with many rides leaving from my house and the hiking is everything from a day-hike to Everest training.

Oh yeah: My property taxes went from $5,000/year to $14,000/year in just three years so you may soon be able to buy my house. Apparently I'm not the only one who wants to live here.


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## rider400 (Jan 23, 2007)

Bend, OR: they have an epic trail system that can be ridden from town. They also have some really good beer. Tons of outdoors stuff like camping, rivers, fishing, hiking.

The people are pretty laid back and easy going. Some really good bike shops too.


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## Nigel 13 (Jun 5, 2005)

proably biased cause i just moved here from south florida. But northern georgia is pretty sweet. Lots of good trails close by and even more within a nice 2 hour drive. Great weather year round.


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## tahoebomber15 (Apr 23, 2007)

tahoe good we have hospitals and LOTS of trails


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Manhatten


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## mtnbkrid (Jan 30, 2004)

Not Boise, 2 Hospitals, 1 private hospital planned, lots of Doctors, not so many nurses, tons of sweet single track, lots of climbing and loads of screaming descents. Of course with all the Californians, Washingtonians, and refugees from the east coast we have increasing crime rates, bad air in the summer as well as the usual winter inversions. Soaring house prices and taxes that follow those. Traffic woes and general growing pains. I wouldn't trade it for the world, well maybe if I won the lottery and was able to quit work and dedicate the rest of my life to riding all the primo single track on the planet I would move. Yeah, Boise sucks a big one you don't want to come out here.:lol:


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## Padre (Jan 6, 2004)

I have to say it.

Southern California.

Denver and Fruita and Flagstaff etc might be incredible...but their virtue diminishes since they can't be ridden all year.

90% of our trails in SoCal can be ridden ALL year barring a 2-3 day rain delay. 

Road riding up the wazoo.
Tons and tons of trails.

We lack the ridiculous amount of singletrack of other places...but if you can only ride that singletrack a few months out of the year...


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## Guest (Jul 7, 2007)

i hope to be selling my place in socal soon. great 1100 sq foot condo for 260K. hope you like the spanish speaking, welfare collecting, non-citizens that have completely taken over because our government is too weak to close the border.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

Jayem said:


> Manhatten


I think you meant to type Peoria. Or Kansas City.


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## verve825 (Mar 16, 2005)

mechmann_mtb said:


> i hope to be selling my place in socal soon. great 1100 sq foot condo for 260K. hope you like the spanish speaking, welfare collecting, non-citizens that have completely taken over because our government is too weak to close the border.


Don't let the door slap you on your way out- we'll be only too happy to see your type gone. I hear there's still a few right-wing redoubts in Idaho you might be interested in...


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## tls36 (Dec 10, 2005)

Flagstaff, AZ


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## palerider (Jul 15, 2004)

*our trails suk*

Thats the reason nobody has listed Albuq plus its so hard too spell!


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## mtnbkrid (Jan 30, 2004)

verve825 said:


> Don't let the door slap you on your way out- we'll be only too happy to see your type gone. I hear there's still a few right-wing redoubts in Idaho you might be interested in...


Actually they got closed down and the people moved to Alabama or Pennsylvania or maybe it was so cal


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## Gila (Jul 7, 2007)

Southwestern New Mexico. (Las Cruces, Alamogordo, Cloudcroft, Ruidoso, Silver City)

1) Laid back life style.
2) Decent weather year round.
3) Variety of terrain. (Desert sand and scrub, dense forests, slick rocks, painful climbing and deadly descents.)
4) Miles and miles of trails.


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## stern112 (Jun 2, 2007)

Not even from there but Lake Tahoe seems AWESOME to me....

www.tahoerimtrail.org


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## Seltzer (Nov 1, 2006)

mechmann_mtb said:


> i hope to be selling my place in socal soon. great 1100 sq foot condo for 260K. hope you like the spanish speaking, welfare collecting, non-citizens that have completely taken over because our government is too weak to close the border.


What the....? Ironically, one of the reasons why I love living in California is its diversity (racial diversity). I meet people from all walks of life, and from all over the world. Maybe you need to travel? There are people living outside the U.S.....

Anyway, I'll cast in my vote for NorCal....great weather, different terrains, rain, sun, anything that suits your mood. Tons, and tons of trails..


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## notaknob (Apr 6, 2004)

*Second this one*



palerider said:


> Thats the reason nobody has listed Albuq plus its so hard too spell!


I'd say


Fruita
Denver
Tahoe
Reno
Bend
Flagstaff

mainly as New Mexico, with Albuquerque, Santa Fe, Taos and some other irrelevant cities, all suck.

They suck in the winter:

























They suck in the spring:

































They suck in the summer:

























They definitely suck in the fall:

























They suck going up:

























They really really suck going down:

























They suck going left:

















They suck going right:

















Even at the top:









It even sucks at night:









Apologies to the multitude of uncredited photographers images that I've used.


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## scottyperkins (Oct 29, 2006)

palerider said:


> Thats the reason nobody has listed Albuq plus its so hard too spell!


That's certainly not the Albuquerque I remember. Otero, Elena Gallegos foothills, Sandia Peak. Just a short drive to Windsor, etc.

I learned to spell it "ABQ" when I was about 4. Just remember to add the zip code on your letters so the USPS doesn't send it back for improper international postage.


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## FKMTB07 (Mar 29, 2007)

Hooksett NH has been treating me really good as of late. Bear Brook State Park is 15 minutes away, the FOMBA singletrack (amazing singletrack by the way) is 10 minutes away (used to ride there when I was too young to drive, that's how close), Highland Mountain Bike Park is 25 minutes away, the Exeter Pipeline is 30 minutes away, Vietnam (awesome techy freeride) is about an hour away, and there are countless other trail systems nearby. Boston is 50 minutes away, so there's your big city, and my town is a decent little town. No sales or income tax in NH either.


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## bullit71 (Apr 9, 2004)

verve825 said:


> Don't let the door slap you on your way out- we'll be only too happy to see your type gone. I hear there's still a few right-wing redoubts in Idaho you might be interested in...


Welfare collector, eh? So what bike did you buy off our taxes? Prolly a $4k or above bike or something I bet, huh? Can't work - yet you can sure do a good job taking our money, can't yah?

Go F yourself loser.


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## karatemonkey (Mar 9, 2007)

Park City is the shiznit but I like my beer full strength and thats not gonna happen in Utah. 

Grew up in Grand Junction and loved it. Can be a bit warm in the summer time but it makes you stronger. Don't think I need to say anything about the riding. The community is a too damn conservative too. Once we get a lot of young, active progressive people living there, it will be heaven for me.


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## DJ Lieb (Dec 21, 2005)

I'll throw a vote in for my little town of Auburn, CA. 30 miles above Sacramento and sits at about 1,500 ft, so you can ride year round. 50 + miles of great trails from downtown(5 miles away), and many trails you can access from neighborhoods. A ton of lakes and 1 hour to Tahoe, 45 minutes to Northstar, and 80 miles to Downieville. 

The town is very big into the outdoors and endurance racing.


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

rider400 said:


> Bend, OR: they have an epic trail system that can be ridden from town. They also have some really good beer. Tons of outdoors stuff like camping, rivers, fishing, hiking.
> 
> The people are pretty laid back and easy going. Some really good bike shops too.


Bend seems great but lacks challenging, technical singletrack.


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## Dwight Moody (Jan 10, 2004)

bullit71 said:


> Welfare collector, eh? So what bike did you buy off our taxes? Prolly a $4k or above bike or something I bet, huh? Can't work - yet you can sure do a good job taking our money, can't yah?
> 
> Go F yourself loser.


I hope you are being sarcastic. Welfare pays well under $1,000 a month, even with kids. You'd have to skip buying anything about half a year to afford a 4,000 bike. While you might get subsidized housing and food stamps on top of other things, you can't spend that stuff, the money is never in your hands.

Most illegals are working a heck of a lot harder than most of us.


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## pedalitup (May 30, 2007)

Health care vocation + MTB = Southern Oregon. Check out Medford or south of there. Lotsa retirees from Cali and elsewhere. . . 

Sorry to all the you locals, but the rest of those places pretty much suck, esp Utah! IMHO


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

ideal:

vancouver for june-sept
southern cal,peru,new zeland from oct-may!


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## lidarman (Jan 12, 2004)

I posted my opinion on this before. For the western USA, I vote Flagstaff. (Told my wife we are moving there in the next decade, she doesn't believe me...YET!).

Within half-day reach or less

-Flag,
-Sedona
-Durango
-Moab
-St George
-Las Vegas
-Albuquerque
-Santa Fe
-Phoenix
-Tucson 

--stuff I forgot.

Cost of living is not too bad if you can find a job. Summers are milder than other parts of AZ. All the great national parks are close. Lake Powell is close (I love the party boat thing). 

Not great ski access though.


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## MikeyMT (Apr 27, 2007)

Montana. Its the greatest place in the world.


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## carnage (Nov 17, 2005)

lidarman said:


> I posted my opinion on this before. For the western USA, I vote Flagstaff. (Told my wife we are moving there in the next decade, she doesn't believe me...YET!).
> 
> Within half-day reach or less
> 
> ...


You forgot Prescott, I had loads of fun at Thumb Butte and Granite basin. Since I'm a SoCal transplant in FL the only thing there that buged me was the elevation, and that was taken care of by the time I finished my first ride.


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## 20.100 FR (Jan 13, 2004)

Grenoble, French alps.


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## vzman (Mar 30, 2006)

I live in Southern California. there are some trails super fun trails, single track lots of long firerode rides, the coast , BUT... After visiting Utah ( Brianhead, Moab, La sal area) and Co ( Grand junction, durango, fruita), I've become Obsessed with with the four corner region. I stare at pics, read blogs of everyone from the area and plan my 3 weeks of vacation a year around this area. If I could get the Mrs. to leave sunny so cal .  I would be outta here. We have agreed on Arizona and New Mexico but I love Utah. 
www.veezeprice.blogspot.com


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## Damitletsride! (Feb 4, 2004)

You mean you only mountain bike????? How boring.

-kidding-

At least you have it easy. I want a house that has access to some where i can windsurf and if possible not too far away from the sea with good waves for sufing, and i'd like some ski resorts nearby AND some mountain bike areas. TRY THAT!!


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## Zagremel (Apr 14, 2009)

The best Place for riding and living is Grenoble (France)



















Look their homepage!


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## tjchad (Aug 15, 2009)

To "notaknob"- You are the Dr. Seuss of MTN biking!!!


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## Joeshwa24 (Sep 17, 2009)

I am highly biased but i love Southern New Mexico, its kinda nasty out today, but its still ridable. You can ride in the mountains all but a few days a year and on those days there are tons of dessert trails. My sister is a nurse in Las Cruses and makes bank... Just my 2 cents.


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## iWiLRiDe (Apr 17, 2006)

This is totally subjective and varies from rider to rider; however, I'm told that I am spoiled living in Northern California, the birth placeof mountain biking. Living in NorCal gives you fairly easy access to trails in Tahoe and Downieville and Bay Area which are I would consider premier riding areas, and that's only touching the tip of the iceberg. Other states are awesome for riding such as Utah and Colorado, but I don't think I could just live there. I think I'd get cabin fever in the winters, you can only snowboard and spin on trainers for so long before you go crazy. Good luck with your moving decision!


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## rabidchicken (Apr 16, 2009)

I am going to say Denver, CO. You get the pluses of the city life with the mountains in your backyard.


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## Russ Skinner (Oct 23, 2005)

For the last two years I had been determined to move out of Northern Michigan. After two years of research which included various threads similar to this one, many visits to different cities, reading all kinds of magazines, blah-blah-blah. I now live in Grand Junction. Less than a mile from the Lunch Loops trailhead. 

I know this is biased and rather subjective, but I must admit I'M RIGHT!!! 

BTW-I had the same criteria as you minus the healthcare thing.


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## singlesprocket (Jun 9, 2004)

feet are getting itchy also... so me an the better half are thinking about okanagan bc...
epic riding, sking and don't have to get a green card...


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## sdf1968 (Mar 7, 2007)

Russ Skinner said:


> For the last two years I had been determined to move out of Northern Michigan. After two years of research which included various threads similar to this one, many visits to different cities, reading all kinds of magazines, blah-blah-blah. I now live in Grand Junction. Less than a mile from the Lunch Loops trailhead.
> 
> I know this is biased and rather subjective, but I must admit I'M RIGHT!!!
> 
> BTW-I had the same criteria as you minus the healthcare thing.


That is funny being from Ohio I rode lower Michigan a lot and I took a few trips to northern Michigan and I love the rides up there. I just can't believe you wanted out of there so bad. The biking, the xc skiing, hiking opportunities....It is not Grand Junction but it is better than a stick in the eye. One of my favorite rides was segment a NCT. But good choice from your southerly neighbor.


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## drexlerkm (Aug 10, 2009)

aword4you said:


> If you can handle Vancouver BC traffic, and don't mind the immigration stuff, go for it  That's the only place I've visited in the past 5~ years that I'd consider moving to.


I was wondering about this. Do you know what the deal is with working there and retaining US citizenship? Is it possible? I'll do some searching on my own, but maybe someone can quickly enlighten us.

No way the traffic can be worse than Washington DC... one of the top 5 reasons I need to get out of here!


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Uncle Rico said:


> I'll throw a vote in for my little town of Auburn, CA. 30 miles above Sacramento and sits at about 1,500 ft, so you can ride year round. 50 + miles of great trails from downtown(5 miles away), and many trails you can access from neighborhoods. A ton of lakes and 1 hour to Tahoe, 45 minutes to Northstar, and 80 miles to Downieville.
> 
> The town is very big into the outdoors and endurance racing.


At only 1500 it's hot as hell in the dead of the summer and you get a lot more rain and weather in the winter compared to more desert areas. I live at 5000+' in Arizona and it never gets too hot or cold, we don't get much precip, riding is much more "year round". Decent trails in Auburn, but not all that much milege compared where I am now. Auburn doesn't suck, but it wouldn't be anywhere near the top of my list.

Of course one can ride ANYWHERE at ANY TIME of the year. Sometimes you need studded tires, sometimes you need big fat snow tires, sometimes you need to ride at 4am when it's "only" 90 degrees, sometimes you need to keep the rides short due to exposure. I'm not quite that hardcore though.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

carnage said:


> You forgot Prescott, I had loads of fun at Thumb Butte and Granite basin. Since I'm a SoCal transplant in FL the only thing there that buged me was the elevation, and that was taken care of by the time I finished my first ride.


Glad you liked it. We have riding surrounding the town on all sides now (used to just be 3 but the new technical-tracks at the lakes make "4"). Granite basin is also one of about 3-4 main riding areas that we have. We can link together these areas pretty easily too for bigger (if you thought you were already doing a big ride) rides. Literally hundreds of miles of trails and pretty much all of the bigger rides rack up the vertical quite quickly. It's easy to do 3000-5000 of vertical and the sky is the limit.


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## cobi (Apr 29, 2008)

hah, the OP never came back... but 2 years later the thread is still being updated.


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## davidarnott (Feb 28, 2007)

*finding work won't be a problem*

I'm voting for Malta Montana. That's the closest town to Hell Hole Coulee, which is the most desolate, terrifying, empty, lonely, unvisited, and deadly place I have ever been. Malta is surrounded by millions of acres of federal land, the CMR which has hundred of miles of terrain following missouri breaks double track, Bedoin wildlife refuge, the Little Rocky Mountains, The mighty Missouri river, the best radio station in Montana (88.3 FM) the Maltana Motel, an Amtrack station, lots of bars stuffed with REAL cowboys and ******, er, Natives, fistfights, rattlesnakes, wolves, cactus, nothingness, sheep, barbed wire, whiskey and the sweet sweet relief of death itself.

I'd move there myself, I'm just afraid of having it too good.


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## Atomik Carbon (Jan 4, 2004)

*Be glad.....*



desurfer said:


> Not Tampa, FL! High prices, low wages, and flat, boring trails. Sure, it's technical, but I miss real climbs and swooping singletrack.


You could be stuck in South Florida and you would really know what miserable is. BTW- I just came back from Ohio and it is not much better there either.


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## Whason (Sep 15, 2008)

Dude I lived in So Cal for 11 years when I was in med school etc. It sucks for mountain biking and road biking. I live in Nor cal where its better, but have visited moab, fruita and tahoe and think the bay area is a great compromise of amenities and biking/sports.

So Cal is a complete compromise for other things to do, but not so good for mtb.


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## CEB (Mar 17, 2005)

Looks to me like the OP posted two questions in one post. 

1) Best place to live: Wow, I like Hanalei Hawaii and I like Lake Tahoe.
2) Best place to ride. Really like central Idaho and Mexico's Copper Canyon for ride experiences.

Sometimes ya just can't combine the two and not get into an internet argument.


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## montananate (Jan 21, 2009)

MikeyMT said:


> Montana. Its the greatest place in the world.


Couldn't agree more!


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

the CA trails might be good but the state as a whole is a mess.


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## ionsmuse (Jul 14, 2005)

MikeyMT said:


> Montana. Its the greatest place in the world.


This may be true, but the best mountain biking on earth is found on the Colorado Plateau. There is no arguing that.


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## Brentster (Jun 17, 2007)

roc865 said:


> the CA trails might be good but the state as a whole is a mess.


The state is a mess? Why do you say that? Is it just the few blurbs you read about in the news or is this from personal experience.

I'm in Houston and I'm fascinated with wanting to move to CA although it'll probably never happen.


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

Brentster said:


> The state is a mess? Why do you say that? Is it just the few blurbs you read about in the news or is this from personal experience.
> 
> I'm in Houston and I'm fascinated with wanting to move to CA although it'll probably never happen.


finiancially the state is a total mess. massive unemployment, deficits as big as lots of countries (like 30 billion), super high taxes, high cost of living and super crowded (estimated 50 million by 2025), freeways clogged. but great outdoor stuff for sure.


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## buddhak (Jan 26, 2006)

Wow. I'm moving to Grenoble...

The OP wants to marry good riding, good living, and good healthcare job prospects. I suppose it all depends on what kind of healthcare job KL is looking for, but take a look at the Central PA (Rothrock SF down to Michaux). I have never lived there. Sadly, I live in Philly. However, PA as a whole has a ton of outdoorsy space (including MTB specific trails), a robust and active mountain biking population, low taxes and cost of living, 4 whole seasons, and a not-so-grand canyon! If you happen to be looking for ER work, jobs are plentiful.


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## Brentster (Jun 17, 2007)

buddhak said:


> Wow. I'm moving to Grenoble...
> 
> The OP wants to marry good riding, good living, and good healthcare job prospects. I suppose it all depends on what kind of healthcare job KL is looking for, but take a look at the Central PA (Rothrock SF down to Michaux). I have never lived there. Sadly, I live in Philly. However, PA as a whole has a ton of outdoorsy space (including MTB specific trails), a robust and active mountain biking population, low taxes and cost of living, 4 whole seasons, and a not-so-grand canyon! If you happen to be looking for ER work, jobs are plentiful.


This is indeed an interesting thread, but considering that it was started over 2 years ago, we can only hope that the OP has found a job by now - and not gotten laid off already.

:thumbsup:


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## TimT (Jan 1, 2004)

Western North Carolina. Not only great MTBing but cheap to live.

Tim


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## Dion (Oct 22, 2009)

Nobody has said Santa Cruz, Ca. 

I was born and raised, so I'm biased. Just bicycle riding in general in that town is awesome. I was 1 of 2 freestyle BMX'ers in that town back in the 80's and 90's and now there are whole parks reserved for BMX bikes. Damn kids better appreciate what they have!


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## TRIUMPH KID (Oct 25, 2009)

I pretty much hate Wisconsin winters but have to admit the mtn biking is pretty good. Best damn race series in the country (www.wors.org). Schools are pretty good overall and job market is ok. This year we have had 4 awesome months of riding and about 3 months of cold 40 degree riding with another 5 months of hell.


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## mtnbkrid (Jan 30, 2004)

Not Boise


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## azoutside (May 23, 2009)

notaknob said:


> I'd say
> 
> 
> Fruita
> ...












Hey I've ridden this place, White Mesa if I remember correctly? Kind of a wierd, almost surreal experience along that exposed slope. Some of your other pics look familiar too just can't remember exactly. It's been a while since I was in Abq. Was a good place for relatively liveable 4 season climate plus easy access to great trails. Great food too!


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## BDT (Jul 29, 2009)

I've lived in Park City, UT and Chattanooga,TN. Both are great.

Park City- Tons of trails of great variety. Short season, but not so bad if you like to ski.
Chattanooga - Year around riding. Great trails but mostly XC. Limited DH options.

My dream place to live would be the Sun Valley / Stanley, ID area.


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## rydbyk (Oct 13, 2009)

The answer is: Not where I live.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

dft said:


> finiancially the state is a total mess. massive unemployment, deficits as big as lots of countries (like 30 billion), super high taxes, high cost of living and super crowded (estimated 50 million by 2025), freeways clogged. but great outdoor stuff for sure.


not to mention the f' ked up politicans. now i know all politicians are f' cked up but CA has some real beauties. pelosi, boxer, swartzeneggar...i lived in southern california for a year and some of the hospitals are going bankrupt and a part of it has to do with the illegals problem.
it's unbelievable.. the cost of living, unless you and your wife and bringing in big paychecks or you're bill gates, it's ridiculous.
nice outdoorsy stuff and all but i couldn't live there and it's not just the cost of living.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

mtnbkrid said:


> Not Boise


what's up with boise?


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## LHdave (Jul 26, 2009)

TRIUMPH KID said:


> I pretty much hate Wisconsin winters but have to admit the mtn biking is pretty good. Best damn race series in the country (www.wors.org). Schools are pretty good overall and job market is ok. This year we have had 4 awesome months of riding and about 3 months of cold 40 degree riding with another 5 months of hell.


My math makes that out to be about 30% of the time time the riding is decent...ouch! No wonder people from Wisconsin are so tough!


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## [email protected] (Oct 17, 2009)

roc865 said:


> what's up with boise?


Nothing. It is totally down.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Nothing. It is totally down.


you mean you don't like it? 
sorry i'm out of the loop.


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## mo0se (Jul 31, 2006)

*KL* said:


> I was wondering if some of you could fill me in on where it's best to live if you love mountain biking. I'm in the process of making some changes and am planning a move, but haven't decided where to. I'm confident finding work won't be a problem. I just need to be near a city large enough for a hospital or two (I work in healthcare).
> 
> I would like to live somewhere that has access to local trails, and has a large friendly cycling community. I also enjoy racing and hope to find somewhere that has a competitive local series. I also love other outdoor activities such as camping, hiking, skiing, and would like to learn to kayak.
> 
> If you think you have the best mountain biking trails and cycling community tell me why and help make my decision easier.


 Actually there is such a place.. not where you would assume though. IMBA voted Kansas City, best urban trail system in the country. With the group www.earthriders.com maintaining the trail system, and providing a social bike community.


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## [email protected] (Oct 17, 2009)

roc865 said:


> you mean you don't like it?
> sorry i'm out of the loop.


The riding sucks. The people suck. You don't want to come here.


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## jasevr4 (Feb 23, 2005)

I'm heading to BC to find out what all the hype is about next year, but if you're looking at changing country at all, check out Canberra, Australia.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> The riding sucks. The people suck. You don't want to come here.


gotcha


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

jasevr4 said:


> I'm heading to BC to find out what all the hype is about next year, but if you're looking at changing country at all, check out Canberra, Australia.


BC is on my list of places to visit, possibly the beginning of next summer.
also, if i ever left the country i would seriously think about australia or switzerland if i had the money.


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## [email protected] (Oct 17, 2009)

roc865 said:


> gotcha


I moved here for a job. The same week I was asked to interview, MountainBike magazine listed Boise as the number one mountain biking city in the country. I didn't like the terrain as much as I liked New Mexico, but the people here make up for it. It is more of an outdoor and fitness oriented town, IMO. I am slowly finding 'more interesting' places to ride.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> I moved here for a job. The same week I was asked to interview, MountainBike magazine listed Boise as the number one mountain biking city in the country. I didn't like the terrain as much as I liked New Mexico, but the people here make up for it. It is more of an outdoor and fitness oriented town, IMO. I am slowly finding 'more interesting' places to ride.


i remember talking to a beautiful flight attendant a few years ago.  i asked her if she could live anywhere where would she want to go. she said boise.


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## Dion (Oct 22, 2009)

Damitletsride! said:


> You mean you only mountain bike????? How boring.
> 
> -kidding-
> 
> At least you have it easy. I want a house that has access to some where i can windsurf and if possible not too far away from the sea with good waves for sufing, and i'd like some ski resorts nearby AND some mountain bike areas. TRY THAT!!


Santa Cruz, Ca.

Not the skiing part, but you're pretty much busy doing all the rest of the stuff already.


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## Fischman (Jul 17, 2004)

*I've had the mixed fortune to live all over and . . .*

. . . I have seen some great spots to live and bike. It would be helpful to know more about your preferences, i.e. 
1. what type of riding do you like?
2. how big a part of the equation is mountain biking?
3. just how good should the mountain biking be?
4. how close to the trails do you want to be?
5. what other ameneties are you looking for? How important are they?
6. are you looking for a "bike scene" or do you just like to ride?
6. and the all important--what can you afford with your anticipated employment?

Some have said Denver is good. By my criteria, Colorado Springs is better. I was able to live in the SW area a mere block from singletrack. The nearby ST was not that exciting, but within a mile, it led to dozens of miles of outstanding singletrack with great climbs, bomber descents, fantastic views, and fun technical areas. Bottom line was I had over 50 miles of quality singletrack I could hit without ever getting in my car. There are also 3 major biking parks within the city limits. Palmer Park alone has over 20 miles of singletrack ranging from easy beginner trails to full-on technical fest black diamond trails to killer off-trail freeride stunts. You also have easy day trips to anything accessible from Denver to the north and possibly the greatest trail of all, the Monarch Crest, to the Southwest. There are riedeable days in the winter, and when the weather gets bad, you're only an hour from Colorado's banana belt--Pueblo is rideable pretty much year round.

There's a similar situation in Helena, Mt. Numerous trail networks easily accessible from town. Great singletrack, nice views, low crowding, and countless opportunites for fantastic adventures all within a day trip. Although it's the state capitol, Helena is still pretty small, so I'm not sure how plentiful the employment opportunities will be. Check also Bozeman and Missoula.

Someone mentioned Flagstaff. Also a good choice. Lots of great riding close to town. Flag is high elevation, so the season isn't that long, but you're only 30 miles from Sedona where you can extend your season on some of the world's most sought after singletrack.

Concur with Tahoe--if you can find employment. Hundreds of miles of great singletrack around the lake, you're a short drive from Downieville, and you can extend your season in the nearby Nevada desert.

Buffalo/Sheridan, Wy if you''re not looking for big city amenities and the you can find the job you need. Many miles of remote, undiscovered singletrack. Short season, however.

Check out Rapid City, SD. The Black Hills remain the most undererated MTB destination.

There's a big hospital in St George, Utah. This would be real hard to beat. Great riding on the trails right next to town. A short drive to some of the best riding you'll ever find anywhere (i.e. Gooseberry Mesa, Little Creek Mountain, JEM trail). When the summer gets unbearably hot, you're an easy day trip from Cedar City/Brian Head with a great variety of rides at higher altitudes.

Some have mentioned Park City. For your situation, you might want to look at Salt Lake City or Ogden. There is plenty of medical there and there are great trails next to town. You're also a short drive from Park City, so that's all accessible. The season is short, but the skiing is the best in the world--not a bad consolation. You're also within striking distance of Moab/Fruita with a longer season.

As for Fruita, it'd be worth looking at Grand Junction. In fact, the Lunch Loops area (my personal fave, even over the 18 road and Kokopelli areas) is right next to Grand Junction. I think GJ has a sizeable hospital. There are rideable days in the winter, there are nearby mountains with quality singletrack for when the summer gets hot, and you're only an hour from Moab.

Must be nice to have a portable career that gives so many options! Best o' luck and ENJOY!


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## Memo (Aug 8, 2006)

do you know costa rica?


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

jasevr4 said:


> I'm heading to BC to find out what all the hype is about next year, but if you're looking at changing country at all, check out Canberra, Australia.


You know it is not just hype.

I have ridden in a lot of the big riding places in the US (Fruita, Park City, Kingdom Trails Vermont) and have been disappointed. The riding was good, about average for any backwater town in BC.

When you go to good riding places like Vancouver Island, the Sunshine Coast, Vancouver-Pemberton (it would take months to ride 1/2 the trails there), the Interior it will blow you away.

Building trails is part of mountain biking in BC. Just about every single town has somebody in it who spends hours and hours building.


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## CanOnlyRide (Oct 27, 2005)

I need to make a trip to BC for real...


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## rancidmeat1 (Sep 1, 2009)

I love Sedona, AZ. I've lived here my whole life and the outdoor possibilities are endless. Climbing, hiking, biking year round. Swimming and cliff jumping in the summer. Snow boarding an hour away in Flag in the winter (without having to deal with living in flags severe cold and wind). Sure it gets warm in the summer, but Flag is only 45 minutes away. The single track is incredible, enough to keep you busy for a long time. Very few rainy days, blue sky's forever...... and oak creek canyon


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## jasevr4 (Feb 23, 2005)

LMN said:


> You know it is not just hype.


Can't wait man.

Also.. stoked on building too! In Aus maybe one in every 100 mountain bikers are ready to dig for somewhere to ride. Maybe even less.

Still, I'm digging for the greater good and hoping others will follow. Sounds like I might get on well with the locals.:thumbsup:


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## ilostmypassword (Dec 9, 2006)

jasevr4 said:


> I'm heading to BC to find out what all the hype is about next year, but if you're looking at changing country at all, check out Canberra, Australia.


....and then keep on going to New Zealand :thumbsup:


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

*Wales*

I don't think anybody has mentioned Wales.

8 decent mountain biking bases, and 5 full-on mountain biking centres with some of the best all-weather trails in the UK. Plus hundreds of square miles of national parks, mountains, valleys and hundreds of miles of coastline and natural singletrack. Fabulous people as well.

(Ok, so it does rain a bit...)


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## The Prodigal Son (Apr 22, 2008)

*Best place to live, ride? my manifesto*

Learned to ride in *Northern California*. Had to haul the bike to get to average trails. The economy is going to take decades to recover and the burdens on taxpayers will be enormous.

Moved to *Boise* for more trails and less people / traffic. Boise had a long cold winter season and the summers were too hot. The town sits at 2700 feet and tree line is at 5400. Summer riding means triple digit temps and no trees to provide any shade.

Traveled around North America searching for that ideal mountain biking destination.

Looked at *Durango*. Liked it but the trails were spread out just enough you had to haul your bike or shuttle rides. And look how *Colorado* gets so many huge snowstorms, even in September or late spring. I don't ski and want to be out on my bike, not shoveling 44 inches of snow off the driveway.

Visited friends in *Albuquerque* and did some rides. Way too hot. Way too much crime. Trails were below average.

Planned to spend a couple years in *Costa Rica* to see if we could make it there. Never made it. I saw where someone poked their head into MTBR and suggested riders head to Costa Rica to do the big coast-to-coast race. Those that have done it say less than 1% of it is single track. In Costa Rica, you ride muddy eroded roads, if you want to ride.

Like *St. George* in shoulder seasons, same as *Fruita*. Both have outstanding riding in the spring and fall when the weather is perfect. Big thumbs up. Also ridden in *Park City*, Brian Head and Thunder Mountain. All great weekend destinations that I would not enjoy living in year round.

Took a couple long (10,000 mile+) road trips to the *eastern U.S*. There was almost nothing worth riding from Texas to Florida, in the south. Enjoyed a couple rides in *Georgia* and *North Carolina*. Friends tell me *West Virginia *has some fine riding. We were lucky to ride in the spring, before the humidity and the insects got bad. Summer heat and humidity ruled out most of the eastern states, for me.

Swung through *Wisconsin* a half dozen times. Rode up north in Chequamegon, as well as outside Madison, on the Kettle Morraine trails. Both were fun beginner trails that may be the best available riding. When you ride trails that are one-way only or are primarily cross-country ski courses, you are not really riding mountain bike trails.

Really enjoyed riding the Womble Trail in western *Arkansas*. I bet it is unbearably hot and humid during the summer and who would want to live in Arkansas?

Rode a bit in *Montana and North Dakota*. You don't know what cold is until you've been trapped in those places in winter.

Spent a couple weeks riding in various locations in *Western Canada ( Vancouver, Deep Cove, Whistler, Revelstoke, Banff). *It was all good. Check that, it was fantastic. Beautiful sites and great trails. I could live in Vancouver, or near the ocean where it isn't quite so cold in winter.

I have had some of the best rides ever in *Washington* (Lewis River, Ape Canyon, Plains Of Abraham). Someone has posted already regarding property taxes there. I had no idea they jack you so bad up there. Deal breaker.

*Arizona*? Sure. great trails and a mix of weather. Full disclosure; I've lived in *Flagstaff *since '96. I think this is one of the top five places to live and ride. I don't care much for riding in Sedona, but I do my share when the snow gets deep (Flagstaff gets and average of 100" of snow each winter). *Sedona *is close, and 3000 feet lower in elevation, but the trails are disjointed, sometimes described as 50 different half-mile long trails, formerly laid out for hiking, awkwardly tied together. You have a lot of steps and drops and too tight turns and sandy washes and short steep ups with rock ledges, cactus everywhere. I purposely joined a group of very skilled free riders one morning to see how they endured the trails. In 2.5 hours of riding, we had barely covered 11 miles, dismounted our bikes over two dozen times to hike out of washes, and stopped to rest every 3 miles, along with the mandatory pot smoke break. In a word, BORING.

Two months ago I spent another long vacation in the northwest, riding in Washington and *Central Oregon*. It is mountain bike heaven. Trails were challenging, but well maintained and sustainable. Great local volunteer organizations. Constant additions are being made to the already huge number of system trails. Forest Service partners are more accommodating than any other place I've been. There seems to be whitewater rapids and waterfalls on every ride we went on. Spectacular scenery. And places like *Bend* only get 35" of snow each winter, while the ski resort nearby gets an average of 350"! We loved it enough to contact a real estate broker. We just have to find jobs in a place with 15% unemployment.

The answer to the question of where to find the best mountain biking destination, along with a certain job and a few other activities, is best answered with some type of compromise, where you endure some winter weather in order to have perfect summer temps.

After reading all of the suggestions posted here, I think the perfect solution, the very best choice of where to live is to either get a job that will allow you to move around during the year, or work your ass off and pay off your home and retire early. That way you can live in the perfect mountain biking destination with no compromising. You spend your summers in *North America ( BC, Bend, Flagstaff, Durango, Park City, Oakridge*) and you pack your bags and head to *New Zealand or Austrailia or South America *during our winter months. I met a man from Deep Cove, BC, a few years back who told me that he takes of around the end of November and lives in Puerto Vallarta during the winter months. The riding is below average there but I bet the ocean and coastal range and the food and temps make it all worth while.


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## rancidmeat1 (Sep 1, 2009)

[B said:


> Arizona[/B]? Sure. great trails and a mix of weather. Full disclosure; I've lived in *Flagstaff *since '96. I think this is one of the top five places to live and ride. I don't care much for riding in Sedona, but I do my share when the snow gets deep (Flagstaff gets and average of 100" of snow each winter). *Sedona *is close, and 3000 feet lower in elevation, but the trails are disjointed, sometimes described as 50 different half-mile long trails, formerly laid out for hiking, awkwardly tied together. You have a lot of steps and drops and too tight turns and sandy washes and short steep ups with rock ledges, cactus everywhere. I purposely joined a group of very skilled free riders one morning to see how they endured the trails. In 2.5 hours of riding, we had barely covered 11 miles, dismounted our bikes over two dozen times to hike out of washes, and stopped to rest every 3 miles, along with the mandatory pot smoke break. In a word, BORING.
> 
> .


Hmm.. interesting. I hear alot of complaints about sedona, something I've never really been able to understand. Sure our trails are rugged, steep, rocky, and washed out in some areas, but for the most part they are TONS of fun. You may end up walking some areas, but I guarantee that you will be a much better technical rider after a week in sedona. There are many different trails in the area, but you can literally ride around the entire town if you like, something that speaks to how interconnected they are. Maybe its because this is my home base that I love it so much . You have to work harder here, but its worth it.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

rancidmeat1 said:


> Hmm.. interesting. I hear alot of complaints about sedona, something I've never really been able to understand. Sure our trails are rugged, steep, rocky, and washed out in some areas, but for the most part they are TONS of fun. You may end up walking some areas, but I guarantee that you will be a much better technical rider after a week in sedona. There are many different trails in the area, but you can literally ride around the entire town if you like, something that speaks to how interconnected they are. Maybe its because this is my home base that I love it so much . You have to work harder here, but its worth it.


Well, there are places in AZ that have that level or much greater in terms of technical, but they are more sustained climbs and descents, which is fun and allows you to get into a climbing/descending groove IMO. I like Sedona, but I like other places in AZ better. I'm with Prodigal Son in terms of when it gets really cold (go to Sedona), but living in Prescott I don't have the same problems with the winter riding as he does. If the trails in Sedona covered a few thousand vertical at the same time as they covered the lateral distance, then I'd be all over it. The wilderness area limitations keep it from ever being on the same scale as Moab. Moab has similer riding, just on a much bigger scale, that's why Sedona will always be a nice distraction for me rather than a premier destination.


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## amillmtb (Jun 24, 2005)

The rockies/west coast have some of the best riding I have ever done. But, there have not been too many posts repping the east coast. I live in Pittsburgh, PA and the riding has greatly expanded over the last year. Some of the trails have gone through a transformation into even better riding trails and new trails are popping up in some of the parks every day. It seems like every few months there is a new riding group, and even more frequently those same groups are building and cleaning up the trails. One of the biggest riding parks in the city has been rated as one of the top 10 inner-city riding spots in the country by one of the mtb magazines (cant remember which one). Also, there is a lot of great riding in the surrounding counties too. A drive that is less than an hour from the city gets you to the chair lift aided trails of Seven Springs. Not only do they have a DH course, but about 13 miles of single track that hosts a 24 hr race every labor day weekend. Check out some of the maps of the trails on the shop's web site that I work at:

http://www.probikesllc.com/trails.html


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## rancidmeat1 (Sep 1, 2009)

Jayem said:


> Well, there are places in AZ that have that level or much greater in terms of technical, but they are more sustained climbs and descents, which is fun and allows you to get into a climbing/descending groove IMO. I like Sedona, but I like other places in AZ better. I'm with Prodigal Son in terms of when it gets really cold (go to Sedona), but living in Prescott I don't have the same problems with the winter riding as he does. If the trails in Sedona covered a few thousand vertical at the same time as they covered the lateral distance, then I'd be all over it. The wilderness area limitations keep it from ever being on the same scale as Moab. Moab has similer riding, just on a much bigger scale, that's why Sedona will always be a nice distraction for me rather than a premier destination.


I can understand that, there certainly aren't any massive dh sections. However, Flag being only 45 minutes away gives us that option, plus cooler temps in the summer. I don't think I'd travel across the country to ride here, but it kicks ass being able to ride nearly every trail system with only having to ride 100 yrds of road. I rarely, if ever, have to drive to a trailhead. I just get on my bike and go. I haven't done much riding in prescott, I'd like to get over there sometime soon. Any recommendations?


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## davidarnott (Feb 28, 2007)

*There Is No Arguing That*

Hell Hole Coulee is the most evil wicked dangerous horrible desolate empty terrifying awful snake infested wolf lion and bear guarded place on the entire planet of earth. That's why NOBODY is there. Ever.



ionsmuse said:


> This may be true, but the best mountain biking on earth is found on the Colorado Plateau. There is no arguing that.


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## insanitylevel9 (Sep 23, 2009)

Alaska never lived there but the pics of peoples ride look amazing and imagine all the places to ride with the mountains and the size of the state. secondly India with the Himalayas and stuff.


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## wickerman1 (Dec 24, 2003)

West Washington State or BC Canada. both have amazing trails, in BC here we have the North Shore, less than 2hrs from Whistler, tons of xc if that's your thing, tons of freeride if that's your thing, tons of trekking type riding if you want, hiking galore, skiing galore, kayaking, a lot of that too, anything you want it is here... not too many places on this planet that has an ocean, rain forest and mountains within a small vacinity .


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## Brentster (Jun 17, 2007)

My first true mountain bike experience was in Sedona. We were there on vacation about 12 years ago and I decided to rent a full suspension bike - which I had never ridden on before. (It was a nice Marin). At the bike shop, there were a few people heading out and they let me tag along to Soldiers Pass and I had the time of my life. I've been hooked ever since.

The thing that sticks out in my mind the most was this 50 foot sink hole that a trail headed straght to. There were no warning signs that I remember and if you would have flown off the edge, you would NOT have wanted to survive.

We also took a helicopter and glider ride. I'll never forget Sedona.


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## capefear69 (Aug 9, 2006)

brado1 said:


> Western North Carolina, cuz it's good :thumbsup:


Yep, hard to beat Western North Carolina...:thumbsup:


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

CanOnlyRide said:


> I need to make a trip to BC for real...


same here but their warm season is so damn short. i could visit but for that reason alone i couldn't live there.


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## big_slacker (Feb 16, 2004)

One more vote for my home, south lake tahoe. 

Riding: World class. While there is no such thing as "best", anyone who has ridden here knows whats up. XC, downhill, whatever. Also from a convenience standpoint its hard to beat. Every trailhead is a 10 minute drive, some are riding distance depending on your location. And during the winter you can always day trip anywhere in norcal.

Other outdoor activities: Rock climbing is big, hiking, camping, fishing..... Oh yeah, and what has to be the most ski resorts per capita about anywhere. 

People/social stuff: Super friendly and down to earth. Snowboard slackers to party with if you're young, older established folks who still like to party if you're not young. Casinos and nightclubs, live music at the bars. You can find something any night of the week.

Money: Nevada side has no state income taxes. You can get a nice condo in the 1k a month range, a decent house with a garage between 1300 and 1500. If you decide you want to buy prices are lower than they been for years right now.

Jobs: A little spotty if you're a professional. It is a small town after all. But if you can work at any hospital there is barton in town, several in carson 25 minutes down the hill and reno is close as well.


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## ilostmypassword (Dec 9, 2006)

davidarnott said:


> Hell Hole Coulee is the most evil wicked dangerous horrible desolate empty terrifying awful snake infested wolf lion and bear guarded place on the entire planet of earth. That's why NOBODY is there. Ever.


That's a nice hill.


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## mealsonwheels (Mar 6, 2004)

Bend has been on my list of places to consider should we decide to leave San Diego but I've heard people complain that while the singletrack is plentiful and flowy, it lacks technical riding. While I've visited Bend I didn't ride there. Is that a valid complaint or are there technical trails in/near Bend?


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

Jayem said:


> Well, there are places in AZ that have that level or much greater in terms of technical, but they are more sustained climbs and descents, which is fun and allows you to get into a climbing/descending groove IMO. I like Sedona, but I like other places in AZ better. I'm with Prodigal Son in terms of when it gets really cold (go to Sedona), but living in Prescott I don't have the same problems with the winter riding as he does. If the trails in Sedona covered a few thousand vertical at the same time as they covered the lateral distance, then I'd be all over it. The wilderness area limitations keep it from ever being on the same scale as Moab. Moab has similer riding, just on a much bigger scale, that's why Sedona will always be a nice distraction for me rather than a premier destination.


yea, i agree. I'm kinda of a "greedy" rider. my optimal type of riding is all up, then all down (or at least setions of like 800 feet vert minimum), i love the big vertical descents. granted, i do like the technical aspects of sedona riding, but too much up/down/up/down for my tastes. i like goat camp-somo much better and think i would like elden and mingus alot also. i'm from socal, we got nice 3500 foot fireroad grind ups, then big descents. (the main reason i don't like up-down-up-down is i like to slam my seat for descents (yes i know about remote seatposts, but that still isn't that flowy))


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## wickerman1 (Dec 24, 2003)

roc865 said:


> same here but their warm season is so damn short. i could visit but for that reason alone i couldn't live there.


hehe not this year. The sun came out in late april, and was hot and sunny all summer up until about a month ago. Even now we are getting rain, but only a couple days here and there, that's it...fantastic riding year. Even when it isn't hot it's always comfortable to ride here... not too cold and not insanely hot...


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## stevesbike (Feb 26, 2009)

Santa Monica mountains in LA is superb - 365 days/year riding, 100's of miles of everything from technical singletrack to steep fireroads in 150,000 acres. Typical ride from my back door is a 20 mile loop with just over 5,000 feet of climbing (pic with singletrack in the distance).


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## wickerman1 (Dec 24, 2003)

LMN said:


> You know it is not just hype.
> 
> I have ridden in a lot of the big riding places in the US (Fruita, Park City, Kingdom Trails Vermont) and have been disappointed. The riding was good, about average for any backwater town in BC.
> 
> ...


yeah women riders here , a lot of them wear t-shirts saying" I like 8 inches in the rear". Also check out a local women's DH/FR group here www.muddbunnies.com. A lot of these women put a lot of guys to shame riding, incl myself.


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## buddhak (Jan 26, 2006)

Brentster said:


> This is indeed an interesting thread, but considering that it was started over 2 years ago, we can only hope that the OP has found a job by now - and not gotten laid off already.
> 
> :thumbsup:


Whoopsie daisies. I jumped like a lemming into that one.


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## davidarnott (Feb 28, 2007)

*True, that is a nice hill*

That is not actually Hell Hole Coulee. That is Hell Hill. Hell Hill is nice. It has buff buff singletrack and lots of college girls riding it in skirts. The weather is always fine and there are no lions bears or wolves prowling about in the trees hoping for a quick snack. The cows give organic free range cream that's just right for a dark roast of coffee. There is no problem getting work here. But beyond that people don't even work. They just ride bikes all day long and then drink all night with the college girls. The college girls milk the cows. They are coed milkmaids. And the men drink coffee, ride singletrack, breed milkmaids and drink all night. Also they sleep. And so that would be a good place to move all right except that I lost the directions to Hell Hill and now I can't find it anymore.



ilostmypassword said:


> That's a nice hill.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

big_slacker said:


> One more vote for my home, south lake tahoe.
> 
> Riding: World class. While there is no such thing as "best", anyone who has ridden here knows whats up. XC, downhill, whatever. Also from a convenience standpoint its hard to beat. Every trailhead is a 10 minute drive, some are riding distance depending on your location. And during the winter you can always day trip anywhere in norcal.
> 
> ...


it does sound nice over there minus the snow but i need top notch medical facilities cus i'm a bit f*cked up.


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## atrophy (Sep 23, 2006)

I'd definitely vote for Reno. I am in the medical profession too. Renown hospital is excellent. But after 3 months when you're bored with work, you can ride all winter except for a couple of weeks in Reno, with great trails. Then when summer hits and the snow melts, it doesn't get any better than Tahoe. Every ride is epic. The trails are endless. Enjoy a post ride burrito on the shores of Lake Tahoe watching CA girls walk by in their bikinis.
Unbelievable race schedule in Reno and Tahoe, both road and mtn bike. The skiing is great. If you have any desire to get superfit, you can race the nordic skis in the winter. The nordic race scene in Tahoe is unbeatable, and you can enjoy the same wilderness, only quieter and even more mythical. 

I ride in Flagstaff and Prescott alot. The riding is great. But nothing like Reno/Tahoe


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## zarr (Feb 14, 2008)

Your hometown, places you visit...anywhere you got your bike, a trail...and most importantly your good friends. Who could ask for more. :thumbsup:


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## longhaultrucker (Jan 24, 2007)

Jayem said:


> Manhatten


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## Reposado Man (May 31, 2005)

I'll throw in another vote for Santa Cruz. Trails are ridable 85% of the year, can surf in the morning and ride in the afternoon.. Diverse community, reasonable access to good-paying jobs over the hill. 

I'll admit the trails arent the gnarliest around, but in terms of sheer enjoyment and pleasure, they're right up there.


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## batorok (May 7, 2007)

While the original poster's long gone, I'm following this thread closely, while not hospital based I'm in the medical field and live to ride... I'm currently in New Zealand, and have to say, if you can afford to live here, the riding is varied and like north of the border the lack of lawsuits keeps the jumpers and downhillers happy, and if you don't mind mud you can ride year round most places. Given the choice, I'd probably live on the South Island, though the North Island has some awesome riding as well. 

Sadly, I probably can't afford to stay forever, so I'm looking at Denver (Golden sounds like the best for out of your door riding) or perhaps Fort Collins or Co. Springs, also Boise ID, and Salem, OR (can you say Black Rock?), and look forward to more posts!


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## Steel wheels (Oct 25, 2005)

Central New York.


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## batorok (May 7, 2007)

Steel wheels said:


> Central New York.


was that in the vein of Manahattan mentioned above? Or NY state which actually has some great riding...


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## furrykid (Feb 14, 2008)

Heck, where do YOU want to go? There are great pedal towns all over!!!


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## Gaz-Man (Feb 13, 2010)

*NorCal*

Santa Cruz, San Francisco, Marin County, Sonoma County. Ride 12 months a year, un-real natural geography, decent people, great general riding culture...or wait...nevernind - there is no good riding here...all flat in super hot weather...:thumbsup:


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## tjkm (Jun 9, 2007)

Got to get my plug in for the greater Phoenix area. Great weather all "winter" and during the summer heat, ride early or head up toward Flagstaff to cooler weather and some actual coniferous forest.


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## p8ntsean55 (Jun 14, 2005)

mace2 said:


> Vancouver BC!


:thumbsup:


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## will d s (Jun 16, 2009)

Oregon


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## gnar602 (Jan 3, 2008)

New Hampshire


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## speedmetal (Feb 28, 2007)

I currently live in Salt Lake City, Utah. The trails are great, when they're not under 2 feet of snow (or more) like right now. The culture is really vanilla, but what did you expect? Have lived here for 2 years, been to the East Coast (Maryland) and the Third Coast( Houston) and maybe now it's time to explore other places to live; I'm more of a bike rider, so a place like Northern California or Bend, Oregon sounds good. And a longer riding season sure would be nice! A place with mountains, nice people, good variety...
Keep your suggestions coming, maybe it's time for a road trip!


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2008)

*St. George, Utah*

My favorite place to ride. I live in the Portland, Oregon area and the riding is good but you have to drive at least a hour to find it.


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## jmmUT (Sep 15, 2008)

I have lived/rode on the front range in Colorado, Durango, central New Mexico, and southern Utah near Hurricane, and now live in Flagstaff. All of then have treated me right but I'd move back to Durango in a heartbeat if I could get a job there that would allow me to afford it again.


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## rydbyk (Oct 13, 2009)

*I live in sunny San Diego..*

and love the fact that I can ride/train all year and am limited to my stationary trainer very rarely.

Having said that, it seems that the BEST trails are unfortunately in areas where mountain biking has to be a seasonal affair

Where can you ride year-round and have world class trails? Does it even exist?


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## jmmUT (Sep 15, 2008)

rydbyk said:


> Where can you ride year-round and have world class trails? Does it even exist?


Central Arizona and Southern Utah minus the occasional light snow systems that go through


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## bermtastic (Feb 7, 2008)

I've lived in Whistler, Pemberton, Squamish, The North Shore and Kamloops. I can't decide which is better. Lucky I live within driving distance of them all. Kamloops and the Shore have the biggest contrast, riding wise. Tight and tech as opposed to fast trails and big booters.


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## mtbscott (May 11, 2005)

I'm going to suggest any of the major metro areas of Texas, i.e. Houston, DFW, Austin, or San Antonio. No state income tax, active mtb clubs in all of those cities, one of the biggest statewide racing organizations (TMBRA), and a huge variety of trail types. We have everything from real mountains down south, the central Hill Country, and lots of flatter, but heavily wooded trails in the east and south. You do have to rethink your ideas of driving, Texas is a BIG state, but the year round riding season kind of helps too.


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## modifier (May 11, 2007)

I'll post another vote for Kansas City. It's the type of riding I prefer which is rocky trails with lot's of short technical ups and downs ranging from easy to very hard and a lot of choices. Great local club that is always adding trails. Within 15-20 minutes of my house, which is in central KC, I have perhaps 50 miles of maintained single track to choose from. Up to 30-45 minutes 100 miles total and up to 60 to 80 minutes out likely 150 miles of single track total. It's great to have choices and not have to ride the same thing all the time. 

The only draw back it that for 2 to 3 months out of the year it get's pretty cold and wet although this year the riding was pretty good up until the end of December. Spring is hit or miss with the rain. Some years it's great some years it's seriously wet way too long.

I see lots of pictures in magazines of what is supposed to be such great riding which looks like miles and miles of basically smooth single track in a beautiful mountainous setting. Personally that looks really boring to me. The only time I want to enjoy the view is if I've stopped to rest and being out in the woods anywhere is a nice view in my opinion. Also 45 min rides up hill for 15 min ride down doesn't sound very good either.

If you could take KC and move it 200 miles south it would be mtb heaven. So far I haven't found any place that has such a high concentration of maintained trails. Vancouver and surrounding area might be better but I have never been there. It would be nice to have the option of going someplace like Whistler with a couple of hour drive.


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## bermluvr (Aug 2, 2006)

Im hoping to get out to BC this year, with my own bike or not, to check out the riding.
I'd be lying if I wasn't gonna be giving the city areas a hard look while I was there to see if its a place I could pick up and move to.


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

*Bump - does anyone have a definitive answer?*

Bumping this as I'm still trying to find the best place to live for singletrack. Hoping to be able to work from a laptop and live the dream...

Curious to know whether anyone has added up all the entries in this thread to see which is the most popular response, and therefore potentially THE BEST PLACE to live and MTB.


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## Waltah (Aug 5, 2011)

mississippi kind of sucks, luckily im here only temporarily. 

pro's- 
warm weather in winter months

con's- 
hot in summer
poisonous snakes
ticks
limited trails
limited elevation change


what is upstate new york like? thats where im headed next


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## IRONMAN1518 (Jul 19, 2008)

*God's Country Southern New Mexico*

Lived here 47 years, started road ridding in '82, mtn bikes in '95. Can ride to the Dona Ana Mountains from my house. Love it!


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## Eckstream1 (Jul 27, 2011)

It seems like the "favorites" are in the southwest...

My vote goes to Eastern Pennsylvania... I live near Reading,Pa... And I have a 5 min ride to my favorite trail system.

There are TONS of technical singletrack within 30min of Reading and quite a few lift accessed mountains... Well its not like it is out west 10k+ft in elevation but we dont have traffic, high cost of living, etc.

Also... Almost EVERY trail system is MTB friendly! 

We also have three large hospitals, 2 Dept. of Veterans Affairs Hospitals, MERK, Glaxo-Smith Klein etc... So there are PLENTY of medical jobs!

I lived in Phoenix,Az for a while... And while the riding is top notch, its too dam hot!


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## tim208 (Apr 23, 2010)

rossland, bc


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## pawa_k2001 (Jul 21, 2011)

Western North Carolina. Asheville, NC. Has almost everything you want.


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

I don't think the number of responses = the best place. Because a lot of these people haven't been everywhere. I specifically doubt that people from the West have spent a great deal trying out areas of the East, and vice versa.

Anyways i wanted to suggest Burlington VT. I don't know where i got the impression that the riding wasn't good there but i was very wrong. The small city has a really cool vibe as well. Good people, good food, and entertainment as well. Great skiing area as well.

Check out this map that shows an aerial of all the trails in the vicinity.


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## DavidR1 (Jul 7, 2008)

Harrisonburg or Staunton VA.

WOW there is tons of awesome riding in the area!!


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

Everyone has a different idea.

Has anyone out there tried more than, say, 15 states?


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## mtbcny (Aug 22, 2007)

For everyday variety Raleigh/Durham has tons of tails all within 15-20 drive. Great variety and well maintained.


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## matt sterbator (Jun 11, 2009)

Can't say if it's the best or not, but for living in a decent city, and having quick access to a variety of really nice trails, *Tucson* is certainly up there.

Year round riding. When it's hot in the summer, just go earlier or hit the trails on the mountain. Cold in the winter only really limits the mountain.


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## PAmtbiker (Feb 2, 2005)

State College, PA is where I would like to live. Great town, right next to the fantastic riding in Rothrock and Bald Eagle State Forests. 45 min from the new Raystown Lake trails. 45 min from R.B. Winter State Park (ish). A little over an hour from the Rattling Creek trails in Lykens, PA. About two hours from Michaux S.F. Seems pretty much like the perfect area to me, if you're into that kind of riding...


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## PAmtbiker (Feb 2, 2005)

State College, PA is where I would like to live. Great town, right next to the fantastic riding in Rothrock and Bald Eagle State Forests. 45 min from the new Raystown Lake trails. 45 min from R.B. Winter State Park (ish). A little over an hour from the Rattling Creek trails in Lykens, PA. About two hours from Michaux S.F. Seems pretty much like the perfect area to me, if you're into that kind of riding...

I'd agree with DavidR1 about Harrisonburg, VA though...


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## huntermos (Mar 7, 2011)

I've lived in Boulder, Frisco, Vail, Leadville, Durango, Monterey, Tahoe City, South Lake Tahoe, Sonoma, Santa Rosa and San Francisco in the last 25 years of mtb'ing. Best combo of lifestyle, trail quality, geographic diversity and access to other activities was Durango hands down. Yeah it snows, but I also love to ski and I've also ridden dry singletrack in 60 degree weather in January in an hour's drive (and can be in Sedona in about 5 hours) and you can ski in the morning and ride in the afternoon many months of the year. Good schools, good healthcare opportunities and diverse economy gave Durango the #1 spot on some recent list of "micropolitan" areas (?) in the US, but then again, that's just my opinion. I'm living in San Francisco now and so wish I was back there...


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

Waltah said:


> what is upstate new york like? thats where im headed next


Where in "Upstate NY" are you going? It's a pretty big state you know...
I'm in the Saratoga/Albany area. The riding here is typical NE rock and roots. There are several decent riding options in the area, but they are fairly spread out so riding to all the spots is not an option.


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## Waltah (Aug 5, 2011)

syracuse


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## TheMTbiker89 (Jul 11, 2011)

Colorado springs, colorado. Its Good little town and we are close to denver and good mountain biking trails!

Sent from my Droid


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## H0WL (Jan 17, 2007)

huntermos said:


> Best combo of lifestyle, trail quality, geographic diversity and access to other activities was Durango hands down. Yeah it snows, but I also love to ski and I've also ridden dry singletrack in 60 degree weather in January in an hour's drive (and can be in Sedona in about 5 hours) and you can ski in the morning and ride in the afternoon many months of the year. Good schools, good healthcare opportunities and diverse economy gave Durango the #1 spot on some recent list of "micropolitan" areas (?) in the US, but then again, that's just my opinion. I'm living in San Francisco now and so wish I was back there...


I lived in the Dolores/Cortez/Durango area for almost 20 years and economic diversity is not a word that I would use to describe that area, or Durango in particular. It is an absolutely spectacular place to engage the outdoors on every level; however, the cost of housing is astronomical. Have a rock solid source of income/a relatively high paying profession/telecommute or you will end up with a service job and 4 housemates. Either way, you WILL be happy. :thumbsup:


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

IndecentExposure said:


> <snip>
> 
> Utah is fantastic, Can't beat it.


This.


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## huntermos (Mar 7, 2011)

June Bug said:


> I lived in the Dolores/Cortez/Durango area for almost 20 years and economic diversity is not a word that I would use to describe that area, or Durango in particular. It is an absolutely spectacular place to engage the outdoors on every level; however, the cost of housing is astronomical. Have a rock solid source of income/a relatively high paying profession/telecommute or you will end up with a service job and 4 housemates. Either way, you WILL be happy. :thumbsup:


I'd disagree with you. It may not be diverse in comparison to NYC, SF, LA, or any other big metro area, but in terms of mountain towns, Durango is much more economically diverse. Instead of being based on one economic activity -such as tourism, mining, or agriculture- D-town has a college with 3500+ students, the most oil/gas development in the state (30%+ of the local economy), is the center of federal and state government offices in the Southwest of the state, is a major tourism draw in summer and winter (D&RG narrow gauge railway, river rafting, kayaking, historical downtown, San Juan and the Weminuche, Mesa Verde, skiing at Purg and Silverton Mountain, fishing, hunting and or course MTB), is headquarters to some good sized employers (Mercury Payment Systems, the Southern Utes, Mercy Med Center, Rocky Mountain Chocolate Factory, etc) and is the location of choice for a fair amount of baby-boomer retirees and the artsy-fartsy set (no insult intended). It's been in the top 10 best small metro areas in the nation in terms of economy for the past 4 years, the top 20 since they started the rankings and is #1 this year: The Durango Herald 08/21/2011 | We're small but No. 1
Original report here: http://www.policom.com/PDFs/2011EconomicStrengthsmallfilesize.pdf

Affordability is all in the eye of the beholder. Of all the places I've lived, it is second only to Leadville in terms of affordability. If I was from central Iowa or some other place that people aren't drawn to because of its amenities, I'd think it was expensive, but you pay for what you get. Rents in San Francisco are 4X what I paid in Durango Now THAT is expensive! I do agree with you that he would be happy there and have to add that he'll also have access to some really good beer!


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

Waltah said:


> syracuse


Not good. Very muddy valley. Not much rock.


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## jmitchell13 (Nov 20, 2005)

Waltah said:


> syracuse


I can't say I've ever ridden around Saracuse. It's not on my must ride list.

These guys might be able to help: CNY D.I.R.T.


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## Peter Leo (Aug 23, 2011)

Manhatten


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## big_slacker (Feb 16, 2004)

Number of votes doesn't matter if you don't like the place. Just sayin', your best bet would be to target a region you think you'll like and then try the places out.

This coming from someone that works from a laptop and lives the dream. :thumbsup:

FWIW I'm moving away from south tahoe to vegas next month. Might sound crazy for a MTBer, (actually Vegas has good MTB) but think 500/month mortgage vs 2k+ a month. What kind of freedom/gear does that buy? Situations (financial, family, etc...) might matter as much as environment.



spencerfrater1 said:


> Bumping this as I'm still trying to find the best place to live for singletrack. Hoping to be able to work from a laptop and live the dream...
> 
> Curious to know whether anyone has added up all the entries in this thread to see which is the most popular response, and therefore potentially THE BEST PLACE to live and MTB.


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## modifier (May 11, 2007)

huntermos said:


> the most oil/gas development in the state (30%+ of the local economy),


Oh no! That probably means fracking? I have property up by Mancos and have always dreamed of building there. Oil/gas pretty much rape any area they are in unless there is noto enough oil or gas there to make it worth their time. Our development fought to keep them out of our immediate area but from the sound of this others have not done the same.


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## CHUM (Aug 30, 2004)

did I mention Scotts Valley, CA? no?

good...it's not like a place you can ride miles and miles of secluded ST all year round...









thru the redwoods...

horrible place to live...horrible..

stay away....


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## bridger (Dec 7, 2010)

drexlerkm said:


> I was wondering about this. Do you know what the deal is with working there and retaining US citizenship? Is it possible? I'll do some searching on my own, but maybe someone can quickly enlighten us.
> 
> No way the traffic can be worse than Washington DC... one of the top 5 reasons I need to get out of here!


Vancouver? are you kidding? great place but all of your money will go to housing. Vancouver is outrageous for housing (rentals or to buy) . Unless you are a millionaire, or a techie , good luck.


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## Mowerman (Jan 1, 2005)

*Apparently not Los Gatos, CA*

you can't have any fun around there.

http://forums.mtbr.com/california-norcal/speeding-ticket-st-joes-yesterday-715671-post8126511.html


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## huntermos (Mar 7, 2011)

modifier said:


> Oh no! That probably means fracking? I have property up by Mancos and have always dreamed of building there. Oil/gas pretty much rape any area they are in unless there is noto enough oil or gas there to make it worth their time. Our development fought to keep them out of our immediate area but from the sound of this others have not done the same.


Mancos is north-west of the San Juan Basin, which is the gas bearing formation, so you have nothing to worry about. The northern edge of the Basin is the Dakota ridge that forms Smelter Mountain (on the south side of Durango) as well as where most of the Horse Gulch singletrack is.


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## PutSumStankOnIt (Jun 5, 2011)

*Austin*

As far as living in an amazing city with access to year round riding with lots of technical trails, and great competitive racing scene I'm surprised Austin hasn't been suggested yet. Also we have the best economy in the country.


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## KrisRayner (Apr 3, 2007)

The best places to live and ride are the ones not mentioned here....the ones you can ride from your work, do a trail, ride home, and not encounter 30 other people on the trail because it hasn't been advertised online....


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## equinox (Oct 31, 2007)

KrisRayner said:


> The best places to live and ride are the ones not mentioned here....the ones you can ride from your work, do a trail, ride home, and not encounter 30 other people on the trail because it hasn't been advertised online....


New Zealand:thumbsup:


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## TheNihilist (Apr 28, 2010)

New Zealand/Austria/Italy


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## 8valvegrowl (Mar 4, 2009)

Burlington, VT.

Great MTB culture, lots of trail access to cater to any style of riding, good music/food/beer/art scene. Little over an hour from Montreal, 4 from Boston, 6 from the Big Apple. The Green Mountains provide some great hiking, skiing/snowboarding and if you get bored you have the whole of the Adirondacks nearby. A big lake and river network for paddling/boating right from town. The atmosphere is laid-back, yet cultured. Plus, maple syrup!

There is a big teaching hospital right in town. Personally, there are few towns anywhere in the country that compare. But, I'm probably biased. ;-)

I can grab a lunchtime ride from work to a network, and pedal five minutes from my house to another.


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

bridger said:


> Vancouver? are you kidding? great place but all of your money will go to housing. Vancouver is outrageous for housing (rentals or to buy) . Unless you are a millionaire, or a techie , good luck.


Compared to most cities in the Northeast it isn't that bad. As bad as Boston/NYC/Washington, but with more outdoor activities.


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## modifier (May 11, 2007)

huntermos said:


> Mancos is north-west of the San Juan Basin, which is the gas bearing formation, so you have nothing to worry about. The northern edge of the Basin is the Dakota ridge that forms Smelter Mountain (on the south side of Durango) as well as where most of the Horse Gulch singletrack is.


Well there must be something up there because there was a fight to keep them off BLM land which borders our property. Fortunately unlike most of Colorado we still own our mineral rights. Apparently a long time ago Oil/Gas came through Colorado and bought up ( or was given) rights to most of the state that was privately owned. Now that the government is so broke and even more in bed than ever with corporate America they are selling what ever they can.


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## BetterRide (Apr 6, 2004)

Denver area is hard to beat


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## cutthroat (Mar 2, 2004)

BetterRide said:


> Denver area is hard to beat


Crowded.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

BetterRide said:


> Denver area is hard to beat


If you can work from a laptop the Denver area is EASILY beaten.


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## Rockband (May 8, 2006)

98ACURA said:


> I would say Denver or the surrounding area would be a good bet.


2nd the CO and front range suggestion. Denver's got a Large metro good for nightlife and jobs and is close to lots of trails. You do have to deal with lots of people as others have mentioned. A couple hour drive will usually help with this for some slightly more remote trails. And if you really want to get the goods, SW CO is awesome plus some Fruita mixed in.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

SkaredShtles said:


> If you can work from a laptop the Denver area is EASILY beaten.


I agree. But when it comes down to place the will offer a decent economy, weather, food, various cultural amenities, good school for the rugrats and access to trails, I can't think of many other places that can "easily" beat it.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

Jwind said:


> I agree. But when it comes down to place the will offer a decent economy, weather, food, various cultural amenities, good school for the rugrats and access to trails, I can't think of many other places that can "easily" beat it.


Neither the OP nor the most recent "bumper" were interested in that other stuff... at least not that they indicated.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

SkaredShtles said:


> Neither the OP nor the most recent "bumper" were interested in that other stuff... at least not that they indicated.


I guess i was thinking that with a title like "best place to *live* and mountain bike" it was implied...


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## MTB Pilot (Oct 23, 2010)

Sedona, AZ :thumbsup:

MTBP


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## H0WL (Jan 17, 2007)

PutSumStankOnIt said:


> As far as living in an amazing city with access to year round riding with lots of technical trails, and great competitive racing scene I'm surprised Austin hasn't been suggested yet. Also we have the best economy in the country.


Ditto. Hop on the bike and I'm at the Walnut Creek trailhead in less than 5 minutes. City Park for tech. Barton Creek Greenbelt in the middle of town. Last Saturday did a swim in icy Barton Springs and then headed out on the BCGB for a 14-mile out and back. Mellow Slaughter Creek on the south end of town. Within 30 minutes to an hour of Austin:
Rocky Hill; Lake Georgetown (27-mile loop around the lake); the trifecta of Reimers Ranch, Pace Bend, Muleshoe just west of Austin; and the fabulous new Reveille Peak Ranch (the home of Texas slickrock). These venues have at least 9 miles of singletrack each and there is potential for new trails in many places. There are enough trees to keep things shady and ridable, even in this relentlessly torrid summer. 
The Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association (TMBRA - Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association) hosts two full race seasons (Spring Series and Fall Series) at venues all over the state. Average numbers of racers at each venue is probably between 400 to 600. 
There are some great meet-up group rides and club rides if you are social or just need to learn the trails and many Texas mountain bikers have never met a stranger. :thumbsup:


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## BCgee (Aug 20, 2011)

Consider Portland, OR. With the mtns effectively blocking storm fronts you can choose a variety of riding conditions almost 24-7. Excellent ST throughout Nat'l Forests within 1-4 hrs of Portland. Some of my favorite rides have been on trails north and south of Hood River in the Snoqualmie and Mt Hood Nat'l Forests. Plus, Portland has good social life, school systems, strong economy, and a ton of commuter communities.


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## Wherewolf (Jan 17, 2004)

*A duuuh*

A duuuh. If you can't ride year round then it can not be the best place. Most of the suggested places are un-rideable for a good part of the year. And how many miles and what type of riding are you looking for? A recent post asked people how many miles they ride per week and it was about 20. In that case you could live practically anywhere. But if you want long wilderness type rides then your choices become much narrower.

I'm planing on retiring near Auburn - Grass Valley, California. Year round riding and close to Tahoe, Downieville and plenty of great places. I also visited Bend, OR and Prescott, AZ, this summer, two other great possibilities. But Auburn seemed best for me based on my riding preferences and type of climate.

Syracuse, NY was mentioned. I've lived in that area so I can say it would really suck as far as mountain biking goes. I've also lived in Kansas City and that really sucks for serious mountain biking. There are in fact no mountains within hundreds of miles. People obviously have different views as to what constitutes good mountain biking conditions and trails.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

Jwind said:


> I guess i was thinking that with a title like "best place to *live* and mountain bike" it was implied...


Sorry - Denver is easily beaten on the "living" front too.


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## BumpityBump (Mar 9, 2008)

June Bug said:


> Ditto. Hop on the bike and I'm at the Walnut Creek trailhead in less than 5 minutes. City Park for tech. Barton Creek Greenbelt in the middle of town. Last Saturday did a swim in icy Barton Springs and then headed out on the BCGB for a 14-mile out and back. Mellow Slaughter Creek on the south end of town. Within 30 minutes to an hour of Austin:
> Rocky Hill; Lake Georgetown (27-mile loop around the lake); the trifecta of Reimers Ranch, Pace Bend, Muleshoe just west of Austin; and the fabulous new Reveille Peak Ranch (the home of Texas slickrock). These venues have at least 9 miles of singletrack each and there is potential for new trails in many places. There are enough trees to keep things shady and ridable, even in this relentlessly torrid summer.
> The Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association (TMBRA - Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association) hosts two full race seasons (Spring Series and Fall Series) at venues all over the state. Average numbers of races at each venue is probably between 400 to 600.
> There are some great meet-up group rides and club rides if you are social or just need to learn the trails and many Texas mountain bikers have never met a stranger. :thumbsup:


Yea, but who the #@%* wants to live in Texas? (tongue in cheek )

I personally think the best places for someone that can work from a laptop are tucked away little gems that a buzzillion people don't live in and around (or flock to for vacation), yet still have good trails easily accessed from home without driving, low population, and a good LBS. That's what makes a perfect MTBing town in my eyes. But I don't care much about cultural amenities.

Obviously it's too personal of a choice for anyone to have the right answer for someone else without more detail from the OP. I'm seeing a lot of places you couldn't pay me enough to live in, yet alone WANT to.


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

spencerfrater1 said:


> Bumping this as I'm still trying to find the best place to live for singletrack. Hoping to be able to work from a laptop and live the dream...
> 
> Curious to know whether anyone has added up all the entries in this thread to see which is the most popular response, and therefore potentially THE BEST PLACE to live and MTB.


Telecommuting rocks, this is what I do now. You can make good money and live in an awesome place and normally you wouldn't be able to make it if you worked in the service industry.

Living in crested butte I have all kinds of great singletrack and skiing out my front door...i literally never have to use a car for a lot of my rides. It's also not very far from Moab/Fruita/Durango and Grand Junction and far away from the Denver/Front range mess so trails are never crowded (a lot of the time i see no one on them). No traffic, 70s for highs in the summer. If you can do it it's a pretty awesome place to be. Granted you have to have a love for snow to be here though since skiing is a big part of the life here.


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## cbrossman (Mar 23, 2004)

*Durango sucks*

move to Texas


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

cbrossman said:


> move to Texas


Yup. I hear Austin is really nice.


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

SkaredShtles said:


> Neither the OP nor the most recent "bumper" were interested in that other stuff... at least not that they indicated.


I know I hijacked the OP's thread by bumping, and not sure about what the OP required, but just to clarify what I'm looking for is almost year-round quality singletrack (not d/h, fireroad, doubletrack etc) - somewhere you can ride fantastic singletrack almost from your garage. Great scenery.

Thanks for everyone's responses which are really very interesting and thought-provoking.

Yes, it would be great to have a decent LBS and other facilities, but I also don't mind fairly remote places. Also good to be able to find company when you need it, but not crowds. The idea would be to generate income with an internet connection - no need for a good job market.

Although I love skiing, having only learned at the age of 40 I'm not much good, but having say 3 or 4 months when you cannot ride and have to ski sounds perfectly acceptable!

So far from all the posts Durango CO appeals the most... but what's it like living at altitude 24/7?


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

spencerfrater1 said:


> but what's it like living at altitude 24/7?


no different than living at sea level, although when you get above 6k ft. or so your V02 max will never be as high as it can be below that level. This is why many top athletes train no higher than 7k ft. usually unless they're going to be doing something really high altitude.


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## BumpityBump (Mar 9, 2008)

spencerfrater1 said:


> Although I love skiing, having only learned at the age of 40 I'm not much good, but having say 3 or 4 months when you cannot ride and have to ski sounds perfectly acceptable!


Now you're getting the picture. :thumbsup:


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

spencerfrater1 said:


> <snip>
> 
> So far from all the posts Durango CO appeals the most... but what's it like living at altitude 24/7?


Awesome. You get fully acclimatized in about 6 months.


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## chevy_jlewis (Mar 23, 2010)

Wish i had these kind of rails around me in saint louis


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## C Booty (May 26, 2011)

My vote is Spokane Wa.... Lots of singletrack in any direction... No inome tax... Great standard of living...


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## rockerc (Nov 22, 2010)

Didn't look thru all the posts, but did anyone mention Tucson? Great trails, great weather, every other building is something to do with healthcare...


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## protecthabitat (Aug 9, 2011)

*The state of NorCal of course!*

This is simple, just look at the MTBR "Regional Bike Trails and Ride Forums" . Greatest number of threads, greatest number "viewing" nearly ALL THE TIME: our dear "state" of Norcal: California. Join the fun here. You are also close to the best city in the world: San Francisco and the home of MTBing. 
Happy searching


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## sidewinding (Aug 13, 2011)

Definitely not Grand Haven Michigan!


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## modifier (May 11, 2007)

Wherewolf said:


> I've also lived in Kansas City and that really sucks for serious mountain biking. There are in fact no mountains within hundreds of miles. People obviously have different views as to what constitutes good mountain biking conditions and trails.


I don't know when you lived here or what you like to ride but 15 to 20 minutes from my house in various directions I have 50 miles of maintained single track, 30 to 45 gets me another 50 miles and if I want to drive an hour I get another 50 miles. Wait 5 years and there will probably be at least 50 to 75miles more.

No we don't have vast vistas or 2 hour climbs but for me I'd rather have short climbs with technical challenge than either of those. But I learned how to ride out on the east coast and this is very similar to what is out there.

What does suck is about 3 months of either too cold or too wet weather to deal with most years.

I see photos of what people say are such amazing trails and all it is is a basically smooth single track winding around for miles with a great view. Ok for vacation but not daily workouts.

I've seen lots of great shots of trails in Arizona. There don't seem to be that many trails in Austin even though it looks like a good town other wise. There is a lot of bike activity in Portland but a friend who lives there says the trails system close by isn't very extensive. Another friend lives in Denver and he says there is almost nothing around there.

I guess a good trail is not necessarily a good trail.


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

i.a.n. said:


> While many of the places listed are beautiful, the question asked was which is the best place to LIVE and mountain bike. Clearly this is a subjective question


+1 ...everybody has their own idea of paradise.


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## H0WL (Jan 17, 2007)

BumpityBump said:


> Yea, but who the #@%* wants to live in Texas? (tongue in cheek )
> 
> I personally think the best places for someone that can work from a laptop are tucked away little gems that a buzzillion people don't live in and around (or flock to for vacation), yet still have good trails easily accessed from home without driving, low population, and a good LBS. That's what makes a perfect MTBing town in my eyes. But I don't care much about cultural amenities.
> 
> Obviously it's too personal of a choice for anyone to have the right answer for someone else without more detail from the OP. I'm seeing a lot of places you couldn't pay me enough to live in, yet alone WANT to.


Cortez, CO comes to mind! Cortez is 40 mi west of Durango. When we lived in that area, we headed over to Durango many weekends. You are two hours to Moab, or the entrance to Canyonlands National Park.

Cortez is the home of Phil's World and also a network of trails in the McElmo Canyon, with gorgeous red rock canyons and many other trails. Doesn't usually snow in Cortez. If it is too hot in the summer, head right up to the La Plata Mountains -- these are real mountains, 12,000'. Fruita is an easy weekend trip.

On the other hand, Edward Abbey referred to Cotez as the sh*thead capital of dipsh*t county, Colorado, but things have quite improved since then.

Tourists are in Cortez on their way to Mesa Verde or SE Utah, but it is not in itself a tourist destination. A block off main street and your are in any small town. Kokopelli Bike and Board is an awesome big bike shop; I was absolutely blown away at the quality of their bikes (road and mountain) and competent, informed employees. Very together place, which I was surprised to find in Cortez.


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## ROBOLOCO (Jan 22, 2007)

Salida, Colorado.


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## BumpityBump (Mar 9, 2008)

June Bug said:


> Cortez, CO comes to mind! Cortez is 40 mi west of Durango. When we lived in that area, we headed over to Durango many weekends. You are two hours to Moab, or the entrance to Canyonlands National Park.
> 
> Cortez is the home of Phil's World and also a network of trails in the McElmo Canyon, with gorgeous red rock canyons and many other trails. Doesn't usually snow in Cortez. If it is too hot in the summer, head right up to the La Plata Mountains -- these are real mountains, 12,000'. Fruita is an easy weekend trip.
> 
> ...


Now that sounds more like it. :thumbsup:


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Anywhere in the SW US, IMO. Can hit up Utah, CO, SoCal, take a nice road trip up the coast hitting Tahoe, Northstar, Mammoth, Sandy Ridge in WA, and hit up BC for Kamloops or the many other great spots up there.

I liked some of the riding in the Hudson Valley NY, in the Catskills range and there's Diablo and Windham up there, but the west coast is def better if you like variety and are not opposed to road trips (I got myself an efficient compact car for this purpose). You don't have to ride the same trail twice. If you're willing to travel, you can ride a new trail every day of the year within about a 2-3 hour drive. Got a huge map project showing all the trailheads around the area I live in.

Main reason I didn't like NY trails is limited primo riding window. There's hunting season in the forests and winter can do quite a bit of damage to the trails with heavy snowfall taking down trees and making the trails into slosh for weeks/months. Also quite a bit of rain too.


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

Varaxis said:


> Main reason I didn't like NY trails is limited primo riding window. There's hunting season in the forests and winter can do quite a bit of damage to the trails with heavy snowfall taking down trees and making the trails into slosh for weeks/months. Also quite a bit of rain too.


A smaller window for sure, but because of winter. Hunting isn't much of an issue. If you are a 9-5 M-F worker, the hunting schedules and when you're in the woods don't much overlap. I'd be pretty surprised that there are more trails in NorCal within 2-3 hours than there is from where you were in Hudson Valley. Of course the variety in climate is pretty much the same in NY though. Except for Stewart AFB, that place looks like it is from somewhere else. I wouldn't say Hudson Valley is a best place either, but Northern NJ would be a great place to live and ride. Tons of awesome singletrack and a good job market.


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## sooner518 (Aug 1, 2007)

June Bug said:


> Ditto. Hop on the bike and I'm at the Walnut Creek trailhead in less than 5 minutes. City Park for tech. Barton Creek Greenbelt in the middle of town. Last Saturday did a swim in icy Barton Springs and then headed out on the BCGB for a 14-mile out and back. Mellow Slaughter Creek on the south end of town. Within 30 minutes to an hour of Austin:
> Rocky Hill; Lake Georgetown (27-mile loop around the lake); the trifecta of Reimers Ranch, Pace Bend, Muleshoe just west of Austin; and the fabulous new Reveille Peak Ranch (the home of Texas slickrock). These venues have at least 9 miles of singletrack each and there is potential for new trails in many places. There are enough trees to keep things shady and ridable, even in this relentlessly torrid summer.
> The Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association (TMBRA - Texas Mountain Bike Racing Association) hosts two full race seasons (Spring Series and Fall Series) at venues all over the state. Average numbers of racers at each venue is probably between 400 to 600.
> There are some great meet-up group rides and club rides if you are social or just need to learn the trails and many Texas mountain bikers have never met a stranger. :thumbsup:


disagree. year round riding is a good selling point for Austin but I dont think the trails here stack up to what you'd find in Colorado or other places with more elevation. The Greenbelt is a fun ride but there's no real prolonged downhill fun. Walnut Creek is good for a quick afterwork ride but not much else. Reimer's Ranch is fun but still, no real downhills longer than a minute or two.

Top it all off, its damn hot here. and apparently it never rains.

I like Austin, its definitely my favorite place in Texas, but there are tons better places to live for riding mountain bikes.


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## H0WL (Jan 17, 2007)

*If it is good enough for Johnny Tomac.......*



BumpityBump said:


> Now that sounds more like it. :thumbsup:


Bumpity, 
Here is the link to a recent _Bicycling _article on the trails in the Cortez area:
Crazy Good
_In the lower-left corner of Colorado, the little town of Cortez has a funky-weird vibe and some of the best new trails in the Southwest. No wonder Johnny T calls it home....._


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Phoenix AZ, only 113° today!


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## jds (Aug 27, 2007)

Padre said:


> Denver and Fruita and Flagstaff etc might be incredible...but their virtue diminishes since they can't be ridden all year.


That's what skis, snowboards, and snowshoes are for.


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## smilycook (Jan 13, 2004)

Lived in three different states and ridden in over 25 different states and three different countries. Currently I live in Boise, ID and we have fantastic trail access right from my door and 11 months of riding. Since I can't telecommute Boise is a great place to live considering you can have a high paying job and access to trails without living in a massive city like Denver or Austin. 

Not sure if I would leave town if I could telecommute, but the okanagan valley or whistler in Canada would be two of my top choices for places to move to or Hailey, ID. Durango is just too much snow for my taste and I love to ski I just hate to living in the white stuff for 4 or 5 months.


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## bkalkopf (Nov 29, 2004)

cutthroat said:


> crowded.


o mega crowded!!!


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## Crash&bern (Aug 23, 2011)

In a. Volkswagen van !!!
You can drive your ' home' right to your favorite trailhead.


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## Kalamath (Mar 23, 2010)

Only way to tell is go and vacation there. I loved the vibe in Moab but damn was it barren out on the trails, and town, while cool as hell, was too loud. Real shame the big trucks cant be routed off the main strip, but the canyon dictates I guess.

CO and GJ/Fruita was really nice! I loved Zion Curtain, Real Fun/Mary's and all that stuff, Lunch Loops was cool, as was west of Fruita..whats that stuff? Zippity and all that. Real nice trails. I think I'd lve in GJ over Fruita but they are so close it almost dosen't matter.

After 2 weeks out there, in the end I was longing for the greeness of North Georgia. Pinhotis, Bear Creek, Bull/Jake, even Chicopee. It's so personal to each of us. Sure it's more "epic" out West but I'm happier here in the Appalachians. I wish I could visit out West more often, but for me, now, this is Home.


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## nailtrail (Jul 13, 2011)

roc865 said:


> what's up with boise?


he is most likely a typical idahoan. close minded about change and outsiders coming to the **** whole treasure valley. he wants it to stay right wing and hill billy


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## bridger (Dec 7, 2010)

IRONMAN1518 said:


> Lived here 47 years, started road ridding in '82, mtn bikes in '95. Can ride to the Dona Ana Mountains from my house. Love it!


I'm going to be in Silver City in a few weeks, are you familiar with that area?


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## Boyonabyke (Sep 5, 2007)

The Prodigal Son said:


> Learned to ride in *Northern California*. Had to haul the bike to get to average trails. The economy is going to take decades to recover and the burdens on taxpayers will be enormous.
> 
> Moved to *Boise* for more trails and less people / traffic. Boise had a long cold winter season and the summers were too hot. The town sits at 2700 feet and tree line is at 5400. Summer riding means triple digit temps and no trees to provide any shade.
> 
> ...


/\ This... if my whole life was based around Mtn Biking and everything else took a backseat. But I have other interests outside of Mtn biking that involve the outdoors. I like water too, and fly fishing, and seeing and visiting new dirt, as much as possible. So, for me, where you live and work is important, and traveling is the way to fulfill my needs for new dirt and new waters. New dirt is always an adventure, and never gets old.


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## CraigCreekRider (Apr 12, 2007)

Kalamath said:


> After 2 weeks out there, in the end I was longing for the greeness of North Georgia. It's so personal to each of us. Sure it's more "epic" out West but I'm happier here in the Appalachians. I wish I could visit out West more often, but for me, now, this is Home.


Ditto. I spent a lot of time in the West when I was younger and truelly enjoyed it. Two fire seasons in Oakridge Oregon before I had ever heard of a mountain bike. One season in Idaho, some time in Wyoming, Any way, ended up back where I started in western Virginia. I've never run out of new places to ride or favorites to return to. Pretty much can ride 11 months out of the year.

Like Kalamath said, its such a personal thing as to what you like and don't like about an area or the riding there. Some people's MTB Utopia is a smooth ribbon of singletrack full of berms. Personally, that would bore me after a while as I need some gnar in my diet. But its all good.

Wonder where the OP ended up.

Bet he never thought this thread would still be hanging around.


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## Mountainfun (Feb 5, 2013)

*There are NO mountain biking trails in Portland, Oregon.*



rip420tide said:


> Havent ridden there yet, but Portland Oregon seems to have everything you want in close proximity...


Although Portland is recognized as a leader in bicycle commuting there are absolutely no single track mountain bike trails. In fact there seems to be much hostility towards mountain biking and off road riding. I moved here from Salt Lake City a year ago and was disappointed to find no available single track trails in or within riding distance of the city.


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## BigRingGrinder (Jan 9, 2013)

I have zero perspective having been born and raised in San Diego.

The beach (and surfing) is 20 min away. Coastal canyon sandstone rides to be had there.

Open space preserves and open land riding can be found inside of San Diego county proper. I have 2 16+ mile rides within 15 min of my house. Hell, i have a solid 9 mile loop i can do in 45 min during my lunch break at work. Trail head is literally across the street from our office. 

The mountains are 35 min to the east. Noble canyon is a trail people travel from the far corners to ride. That is hardly the only ride up in those mountains, just one of the well known ones.

Smooth ST in the trees to desert chunk, i have close access to all. We have 8 rides in our local rotation with out even heading up to north county (any north county rider will tell you they have better trails than we do). 

I have seen awesome pictures from other places. I have heard of epic riding in other regions. I would love to do mtb tours of new countries. I would love to see and experience all those amazing places to ride my bike.

But.... Here at home i can ride 12 months a year. Here at home i can get to a different trail within 45 min of my front door and not have to repeat rides for over 3 months if i wanted. I am content.


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## Fat Bob (Mar 5, 2004)

Mountainfun said:


> Although Portland is recognized as a leader in bicycle commuting there are absolutely no single track mountain bike trails. In fact there seems to be much hostility towards mountain biking and off road riding. I moved here from Salt Lake City a year ago and was disappointed to find no available single track trails in or within riding distance of the city.


 Visited there this summer, wife & I fell in love with the place. While there is some mountain biking there, it's a drive to the "good stuff" from what I hear. There is enough there to keep one busy for a very long time. To get my ride fix, I guess I'll deal with bike commuting (something I enjoy anyway) and will ride the good stuff on the weekends. We also visited Eugene which we both liked as much if not more than Portland, but there were limited opportunities for me there work wise. We went to Bend, and I can honestly say I didn't care for it that much, sure the elevation is great, but the town seemed very artificial to me, esp after being in both PDX and Eugene and the coast. The nice thing about Bend is that you can always go and visit when the winter darkness begins to bother you.


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## edebolt (Feb 22, 2008)

It's way off the beaten track but Chiang Mai Thailand is great. Easy to run internet business. Cheap to live. Very affordable and good health care. Tons of hot girls in miniskirts. Endless great riding in the mountains year round, Can see wildlife like Elephants and pythons. Great food. Just avoid in March/April when its hot as hell and often smokey from rice farmers burning straw.

In the states, Reno/Tahoe, Sedona, Sante Fe, Palm Springs.


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## De La Pena (Oct 7, 2008)

Albuquerque. Year round riding with real mountains. IN the winter you can go ski one day on the east side of the Sandias and ride the west side the next. There are lots of options around here. Always somewhere to ride.

Also, I saw someone mention that they rode some trails out here with some friends and found the trails to be "below average". Sounds like your friends are either uneducated on the trails in this area or they didn't think you could handle our real ones and didnt bother to take you there.


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## Salespunk (Sep 15, 2005)

BigRingGrinder said:


> I have zero perspective having been born and raised in San Diego.
> 
> The beach (and surfing) is 20 min away. Coastal canyon sandstone rides to be had there.
> 
> ...


Ditto, except I live in North County. I can do a 40-50 mile 99% dirt ride out of my garage with a ton of singletrack


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## trail-adventure (Jan 30, 2013)

copper harbor Michigan. lots of trails. not to far from Lake Superior so after riding you can take a swim. the trails stay nice and cool in the summer. in fall time the trails are full of color.


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## brentos (May 19, 2006)

Some good ones:

Hailey, ID
Ogden or Salt Lake, UT
Bend, OR (Expensive)
Copper Harbor, MI (Long Winter)

I live in Ogden and have about 75 miles of singletrack literally out the back door.


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## Drewbis1 (Feb 9, 2013)

I live in Portland, OR. Like others have said, there are no trails in Portland, other than Firelane's (about 1/4 mile of single track), and Scapoose has some XC trails nearby, but you can travel an hour in any direction and reach some killer trails.

Bend is more badass than the Portland area, but like others have stated, it's expensive and hard to find work. In the past 6 years it has become a vacation destination, and a LOT of Californian's have move there.


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## Happycoop (Feb 10, 2013)

Moved away years ago, but Boone, NC was absolutely amazing for riding of any kind. I cut my teeth on mtn biking in my youth, but when I picked up road riding it was equally great. Lance used to come up and train there before the Tour. Tons of trails, supportive community, and beautiful scenery when you're riding.


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## zgroove (Feb 10, 2009)

California hands down! We have such a diverse trail environment when you include mountain ranges like the Sierra's, Santa Monica's down south, and Santa Cruz mountains up North! If greenery and countless smooth trails are your thing then Oakridge, OR is the place! McKenzie trail system is also tops. Moab is epic and the trails along the area is choice! But again, for all around lifestyle I vote for Cali!


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## Fred Smedley (Feb 28, 2006)

nailtrail said:


> he is most likely a typical idahoan. close minded about change and outsiders coming to the **** whole treasure valley. he wants it to stay right wing and hill billy


Have you been to Boise? That's not the picture I would paint.


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## 5power (Jul 26, 2010)

Did the Moab, Sedona, Fruita, bootleg etc.... Lived in Laguna and rode Laguna trails 5 times a week. I just don't like expose riding, getting beat by the sun, snakes etc... My vote would be Seattle up to BC for the best MTB in the world. I regret moving out of Seattle but I'm on the east coast now and it's not bad.


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## cman8 (Jul 27, 2011)

Anywhere


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## dave54 (Jul 1, 2003)

The trouble with living in CA is you are living in CA. The highest taxes in the country, a fragile economy with more ups and downs than a roller coaster (lay offs when it is down), and a dysfunctional state government. If you can get a stable job before you come, then great. Do not come here believing you can always find a job unless you like part time minimum wage with frequent layoffs.


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## mountainbiker24 (Feb 5, 2007)

Happycoop said:


> Moved away years ago, but Boone, NC was absolutely amazing for riding of any kind. I cut my teeth on mtn biking in my youth, but when I picked up road riding it was equally great. Lance used to come up and train there before the Tour. Tons of trails, supportive community, and beautiful scenery when you're riding.


Where did you ride mountain bikes in Boone, other than the two ski resorts? Rocky Knob is good, but new. The mountain biking is down by Asheville/Brevard.


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## montananate (Jan 21, 2009)

5power said:


> Did the Moab, Sedona, Fruita, bootleg etc.... Lived in Laguna and rode Laguna trails 5 times a week. I just don't like expose riding, getting beat by the sun, snakes etc... My vote would be Seattle up to BC for the best MTB in the world. I regret moving out of Seattle but I'm on the east coast now and it's not bad.


Seattle to BC is definitely great mountain biking, BUT, living in Seattle, it's always a drive, thats the rub for me, I hate having to drive to the spots, makes the weekday evening rides all the less likely to happen.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

dave54 said:


> The trouble with living in CA is you are living in CA. The highest taxes in the country


Oh come on, there are places in the US that cost a lot more to live in compared to most places in CA. We may not have "as much" tax in Alaska, but we pay around 2x for many things you find in the grocery, even more for others. Then there's the sales taxes in Arizona and that it costs $600 to register your new car. It only drops off after 4 years or so. Then there's the small apres ski communities that happen to be great for recreation that are expensive to live in, and so on. Singling out CA because of the taxes is kind of ridiculous given the cost of living of other areas and other taxes around.

I've also found odd things in the middle of the US (Tx, Ok, Ks, which unfortunately I have to travel to occasionally for my job), in that you can't find a lot of the food and things you can on the coasts. There aren't any shopping options that carry decent healthy options, certain varieties of foods, etc. What's the cost of this? I'd gladly pay a little more to be able to buy some crackers that aren't loaded with sodium like it's a salt-lick, but it's amazing that you can't find some of this stuff where people are force-fed what the wal-mart and costco has to offer. I have a better selection of imported-from-the-lower-states stuff at local supermarkets in Alaska than most big towns in Texas, which blows my mind every time I go there.

There are other things besides how much something costs or the overall cost of living to consider. Quality of life doesn't quite go hand in hand with it IME.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

montananate said:


> Seattle to BC is definitely great mountain biking, BUT, living in Seattle, it's always a drive, thats the rub for me, I hate having to drive to the spots, makes the weekday evening rides all the less likely to happen.


There are a lot of places in between Seattle and Vancouver where you can live pretty darn close to the trails and not far from civilization.


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## 5power (Jul 26, 2010)

I hear you on that I lived in the city so the drive to the trails sometimes got old but it was always a better commute than being in So Cal. Plus Seattle is a great city, small but big enough and this past year we had tons of sunny days. I also have never seen a more dedicated group of riders and trail builders. Duthie park is freaking amazing I drop the seatpost and I'm off doing whips, pumping berms, riding skinnies etc when that gets old I hit up the single track off the backside. I just love that diversity to hit a well shape gap jump than go ride miles and miles of epic xc under a forest canopy. Dang I miss that need to move back to Seattle.


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## PoisonDartFrog (Jul 8, 2010)

LOL this thread cracks me up... so many are answering the question "where are the best trails?", not "where is the best place to LIVE and mountain bike?"

I mean, if you have a trust fund money is no object and you can live anywhere (or conversely, if you are ready to be a bike bum living out of your car), FTW... but if you actually are going to need something like a JOB, or gawd forbid, support a family, buy a house, etc., then some of the suggestions here are just pie-in-the-sky dreams.

If you expect to make anything like decent money, you can forget places like Fruita. You need to lokk for a metro of a certain size with a diverse base. For example, I am in tech sales - good luck finding something like that in Grand Junction, CO. At least, not at what you can get paid to do it for in a real city. (no disrespect to GJ)



> I've also found odd things in the middle of the US (Tx, Ok, Ks, which unfortunately I have to travel to occasionally for my job), in that you can't find a lot of the food and things you can on the coasts.


Throwing the BS flag on this one... where in TX do you visit, Mule Shoe? I live in the Dallas metro, and I guarantee you can find anything here you can find anyplace else in the country... FFS there are over 6M people in the N. TX region.

Houston, Austin, San Antonio are all the same way. Almost no tumbleweeds or hitchin' posts in the streets anymore, and some streets are even PAVED. We actually have stuff like electricity, too, nowadays, pardner.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

PoisonDartFrog said:


> Throwing the BS flag on this one... where in TX do you visit, Mule Shoe? I live in the Dallas metro, and I guarantee you can find anything here you can find anyplace else in the country... FFS there are over 6M people in the N. TX region.


Dallas metro area, San Antonio, Houston, places in between, etc. I will say it's only slightly better than OK since you guys have one kinda-real supermarket, HBGBs or whaever it's called, but it's only one and the lack of competition allows them to dictate what things are sold IME.

In any case, your comment about the "support a family, buy a house, etc" is funny. You make decisions and set your priorities. If your priority is fighting it out in traffic or living in a place that isn't condusive to exercise and outdoor sports, then those are the choices you make. Some people prioritize having kids or a wife more than their own health, and they let their health degrade and ultimately impact the very people that are most important to them. No, not everyone can live in Grand Junction, but there are ways and lifestyles that allow for flexibility and mix these things. You can be an airline pilot and commute as pilots do, or maybe a forest-service pilot, or maybe be in tech and work in the Bay Area or Portland, or be an engineer and also live near Seattle (or just about anywhere). Why did you choose your career? Did you consider that it might limit your outdoor opportunities? I have lots of friends that have chosen careers that allow them to live in amazing places or places that are near amazing riding. It doesn't mean they are all living in small ski-towns where the gas is $6/gal, but some smart life choices can allow you to end up in an amazing place. Those are the priorities you set. Don't be so offended that other people have different priorities and actually make them work.


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## cyclelicious (Oct 7, 2008)

The best place to live is when you can ride from your house to the trails! We have a short ride to beautiful rolling hills along the river.
When I lived in a metropolitan city (Toronto) I still could ride to a variety of trail (the Don)

For dh (my favorite type of riding) we are within short driving distance to a variety of bike parks and dh runs


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## KevinGT (Dec 25, 2012)

cyclelicious said:


> The best place to live is when you can ride from your house to the trails! We have a short ride to beautiful rolling hills along the river.
> When I lived in a metropolitan city (Toronto) I still could ride to a variety of trail (the Don)
> 
> For dh (my favorite type of riding) we are within short driving distance to a variety of bike parks and dh runs


That's the key, in my opinion. A good trail that you can ride to from your doorstep is better than a great trail you have to drive to.

I lived in Woodland Hills, CA, for many years and was a half-mile from Dirt Mullholland. That fire road led to some great singletrack riding. The ability to jump on your bike with minimum prep and planning is HUGE.

Today, in the northern suburbs of Atlanta, I'd say I have access to better trails but the four best are all about a 25 minute drive away. While it's fantastic to be able to hit some great trails within a short drive, it's far better to be able to mount up and hit dirt.

The easier topic would be what are the *worst* places to live and mountain bike. Those are places, in my opinion, that offers neither good trails you can ride to from your house nor great trails you can drive to. Call it an hour or two away?

So what places can you live and not have anything to ride within a couple hour drive? I don't know. I'd assume some cities in Florida and some of the major urban sprawl cities like NYC and Chicago. It must be tough to be a mountain biker in Manhattan -- no place to store your bike and no place to ride it other than true urban assaults. Chicago area? Not sure, but having been there on business a lot, I know you can drive for hours and not see anything but city city city.

I've lived in central Missouri and was extremely disappointed that there wasn't better riding. The area is millions of acres of forest and I couldn't find any good riding. The few trails I found were horribly maintain and not ridable most of the time unless you like miles after miles of baby head rocks. Maybe things have changed but the Mid-west seems like a general bad region for mountain biking.

That being said, I would never have imagined Atlanta being a good place for mountain biking but I'm happily surprised that it is. Even the quintessential suburb of Roswell has a very nice trail network tucked into it. And because Atlanta is in the northern part of the state, we're fairly close to the great riding in Western NC.


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## dirtdan (Jun 27, 2011)

My trip to Wilder Ranch in Santa Cruz, CA made a pretty compelling argument for a great place to mountain bike. Good temperatures year round, great scenic riding and great climbing and technical terrain... My only complaint was the trail erosion that made some of the faster portions a little sketchy...


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## AllMountin' (Nov 23, 2010)

A lot of high desert suggestions in this thread, and I can't help but wonder... 

I'm used to riding in the East, in various locales, but ALWAYS in the woods. I only ride roads when weather dictates and there is almost ALWAYS some amount of wind. I've done it enough to know that I'd rather climb an all uphill trail than ride into a headwind. 

How much of an issue is this in desert riding?


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

AllMountin' said:


> A lot of high desert suggestions in this thread, and I can't help but wonder...
> 
> I'm used to riding in the East, in various locales, but ALWAYS in the woods. I only ride roads when weather dictates and there is almost ALWAYS some amount of wind. I've done it enough to know that I'd rather climb an all uphill trail than ride into a headwind.
> 
> How much of an issue is this in desert riding?


It can be an issue but really only in the Spring. Even then given the desert geography, it's pretty easy to stay out of the wind with proper ride selection. I lived on the east coast for years. At the end of the day the number of riding negatively influenced by some sort of weather is far, far greater on the east coast than the desert SW.

I've said it before and i'll say it again, if you want perfect riding weather it's hard to beat SoCal BUT I truly think the best riding is the desert SW. If you don't care for the desert chunk, (I love it) than that's a viable objection. The thing is, there is just so much trail in this region and if you want to change it up and hit the woods or high alpine it's often a shot 40 minute ride to the mountains or a few hours to Colorado - your choice really. That being said, the 'live' part of the equation can really suck in terms of employment with the once exception being PHX.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Never been an issue for me in the SW. Just not something I ever thought about on rides. I lived there for 11 years in the "high desert" like you are describing. In the summer time it gets hot and the atmosphere is "unstable", air heats up near the surface and rises, but it keeps on rising because it ends up still warmer than the surrounding air, even after it's expanded, that "equilibrium" being out of whack is what causes the thunderstorms in the late summer when moisture comes from Mexico into AZ and NM. Without the moisture, the air is still rising (and falling when it finally runs out of energy), which creates gusts of wind. No steady wind really, but later in the afternoon you might get some relatively light gusts. I'm kind of a weather geek due to being a pilot, but when you are on the ground this kind of stuff doesn't have very much effect. You might get a little bout of wind or see a tree get blown, but it's not steady.

The only time I thought the wind was unbearable was a winter ride in Sedona while a cold front was moving through. Frontal action will hit any part of the country and cause wind, but it's not sustained for days, it's just a few hours usually. The wind was screaming that day, but it wasn't characteristic of Sedona. That's the only wind instance I can think of in 11 years. Otherwise you never think about it while riding.

It's steady in the midwest and it takes a lot out of you when riding. I ALWAYS thought about this on rides that had open sections or when riding fast against it. Forget about road riding if you like your sanity. The wind feels like opening an oven and it just doesn't cool you off. I also lived a few years out in the plains and the wind is one thing that makes it pretty bad. Sections of Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas, etc. This is the bad wind. Even though I wrote more about the wind in the previous paragraphs, the wind in the midwest is what to avoid.

I would try not to live below 5000'. That's really kind of the cutoff between a bearable summer IMO. Below that you start getting into the 100s easy and in an area of rock (Sedona, Moab, etc) it feels around 10 degrees more due to all the energy that is reflected by the rock and the lack of vegetation. At 5000' you are starting to get some good vegetation. In Prescott, AZ, the town sits near 5000' and there are forests on 3 sides with lots of trails. In some places the vegetation at 5000' is scrub, at some places it is transitioning, and at others it's ponderosa pine forest. As you climb, you get into more ponderosa pines, and eventually firs and even aspens. Around Prescott many trails get above 7000' and there's always nice shade on many of the trails with Ponderosa pines and firs. There are also many trails that are in between, which is good, because around 7000' seems to usually be the cutoff where the snow kind of stays for months on end. In other places I'd say "all winter", but it's about a month later than many and ends about a month before. It's not much snow, mainly just some ice that makes it hard to travel. Other than that, any and all snow that falls is usually gone in a matter of hours due to the lower atmospheric pressure at altitude and ample sunlight. Most of the time the temps are decent. A little chilly in the winter, most days getting into the 50s or even 60s, feels better with sunlight. In the summer, never getting more than about 90. I personally don't like riding when it's more than 90 out, it just isn't fun anymore IMO, and living at around 5000' worked nice for me in that sense. When the monsoon seasons hits you can get some awesome relief from the summer too. Sometimes it'll be 110 and relatively clear in phoenix but just a few miles up the road in Prescott it's 68 degrees and raining like crazy. Puts a new dimension in there that is pretty neat IMO. Timing your rides with the storms can be a little challenging if it's a strong monsoon pattern. It kind of comes and goes during the season, sometimes gets thrown out of whack for a few days even, but summer relief is great IMO.


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## willem3 (Apr 14, 2007)

brentos said:


> Some good ones:
> 
> Hailey, ID
> Ogden or Salt Lake, UT
> ...


I would not say that Bend, Oregon is expensive. I live there and love it. Although, we can have long winters. Better love Skiing as well!!


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2013)

Cal/Nev sierras surrounding areas are littered with ST trails, fire / jeep roads, desert riding, gravel grinders.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

Personally I think Phoenix is the best place to live and mtn bike. There are better places to mtn bike if you don't need a job or if you can move around to optimize the seasons. However for most people we have to balance riding with family/job needs. 

Phoenix has alot going for it. 

1) Trails - we have hundreds of miles of trails in and round the Phoenix metro area and these are good trails. They are mix of simple paths to super techy stuff including downhill trails where you can really exploit a DH bike and there are trails were you can get epic all day long rides. 

2) Economy - Phoenix is big city and with that comes a diversity of jobs. There are jobs for just about anyone here, both moderate income and high paying jobs. I am not saying that Phoenix has more jobs than other large cities, but it the city does provide a greater selection than any small town which means you don't need to sacrifice a good job to have good riding. 

3) Proximity - Phoenix not just has good trails in close by metro area, but also with in a short drive. Tucson trails, Sedona, Flagstaff are all easy day trips. Moab and Southern Utah are good long weekend trips and due to elevation changes you can with some driving avoid the heat. 

4) Weather- Sure it gets hot in Phx in the summer, but since is mostly dry it means very few rain out days. You can ride all winter long and in summer have two choices. Ride early in the morning before it gets hot or head north the mtns and ride. I rode all last summer long by getting up in the morning and riding at dawn for 2-3 hrs then getting home before it got hot. June at 5:30 am the sun is up and air is cool. Perfect riding weather. So this allows truly year round riding. We don't have a true off season here as even if you don't want to get up early you can drive north and ride in Flagstaff in June/July/August all day long then be home that evening. 

So while Phx may not be number 1 in each area I find it to strong in all 4 and in combination the best place to live, work and ride.


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## rydbyk (Oct 13, 2009)

I prefer areas in the USA that obviously have great trails AND year round warm/rain-free climate. I live in San Diego. Our trails are generally only a 6 or 7 on a scale from 1-10, but the thing is is that I can typically ride them any day or night I want.

Yes, places like Oregon or Utah, for example, may have 10's, but you will find yourself planning around the weather quite often.

No thanks. I will visit there, ride, then go home... Just MY opinion is all.. To each their own..


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

nvphatty said:


> Cal/Nev sierras surrounding areas are littered with ST trails, fire / jeep roads, desert riding, gravel grinders.


You'd think, but large swaths of the sierras have very limited riding opportunities. They just don't utilize the land like they do in AZ in my experience. In AZ they are more open to building trails, trails exist in many more places. To put it simply, they utilize the land much better IMO.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

JoePAz said:


> 4) Weather- Sure it gets hot in Phx in the summer, but since is mostly dry it means very few rain out days. You can ride all winter long and in summer have two choices. Ride early in the morning before it gets hot or head north the mtns and ride. I rode all last summer long by getting up in the morning and riding at dawn for 2-3 hrs then getting home before it got hot. June at 5:30 am the sun is up and air is cool. Perfect riding weather. So this allows truly year round riding. We don't have a true off season here as even if you don't want to get up early you can drive north and ride in Flagstaff in June/July/August all day long then be home that evening.


Need I remind that we have year-round riding right here in Alaska too! If you can ride in a place that gets to 110° frequently, you can surely do it in a place that gets to 5° frequently(although I think it's been in the -s only about 2 weeks cumulatively, it usually hangs in the 20s or 30s based on what I've experienced so far).

Of course, you can ride as early as you want in Phoenix and it can still be 97 degrees at the coolest point of the day, possibly not everyone's idea of "cool". Air quality is poor and it's only getting hotter each year due to the heat island effect. It takes a certain kind of person to brave that kind of weather, and more power to you for doing it. It's still extreme weather tho


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## Mr. 68 Hundred (Feb 6, 2011)

I didn't *quite* read the whole thread...

Anyway, for me the best option to get out of the vile state of Minnesota was to join the IHS (Indian Health Service). Lots of employment options in the high desert of of Arizona and New Mexico. I've only been here since January so I haven't been riding yet but Moab/Fruita is within 4 hours, Durango 3, Denver 6, Flagstaff and Alubuquerque 3. There are quite a few trails within an hour or so, I just haven't been to them yet.

galluptrails2010 has good information.

Plug for the IHS; pay is in line with national average (at least for me), benefits good, vacation time seriously good. The downside is that you oftentimes have to live in BFE.


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## Tim Easterday (Feb 2, 2013)

KevinGT said:


> That being said, I would never have imagined Atlanta being a good place for mountain biking but I'm happily surprised that it is. Even the quintessential suburb of Roswell has a very nice trail network tucked into it. And because Atlanta is in the northern part of the state, we're fairly close to the great riding in Western NC.


I'm a newbie at mountain biking but I'd agree the north metro ATL area has some good things going for it. I'm just outside of Buford and there are some good trails right here in Gwinnett County, but I haven't been to them yet. They are on the other side of the county and a bit of a pain to get there but I will go sometime. Just an easy 20-minute country drive north of me is Chicopee Woods. We had a blast there and will definitely make this a regular stop. Many, many other trails within an hour or two drive. Wish I had a trail system closer that I could ride to. The biggest negative around here is traffic and you have to plan your life schedule around it.

But after 13 years here I am itching to move somewhere else. Just waiting until my mortgage is not underwater so I don't take a big loss. I really love the western US and would love to relocate there. Besides biking/running my main interest is photography and I think the scenery out there is something I could spend the rest of my life exploring & photographing. Just need to make sure my wife is on board. She is Asian and we really enjoy all the Asian supermarkets & restaurants we have right here in our county. If we want that same convenience that pretty much pushes us to the west coast but home prices scare me there. I'm thinking anywhere from Salt Lake City, to Vegas, to Phoenix might be good.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

Jayem said:


> Need I remind that we have year-round riding right here in Alaska too! If you can ride in a place that gets to 110° frequently, you can surely do it in a place that gets to 5° frequently...
> 
> Of course, you can ride as early as you want in Phoenix and it can still be 97 degrees at the coolest point of the day, possibly not everyone's idea of "cool".


I rode all summer long and the worst day I hopped into the car and it was 95 at 8:30am. That was in August when it was 115 that day and it was a little humid which locked the heat in a bit more than usual. Most summer rides were in the 70's or 80's. That is a reasonable temp for any summer ride in most places and when you consider the low humidity very little sweating as compared to 85F and 90% humidity that you get in some places.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

JoePAz said:


> I rode all summer long and the worst day I hopped into the car and it was 95 at 8:30am. That was in August when it was 115 that day and it was a little humid which locked the heat in a bit more than usual. Most summer rides were in the 70's or 80's. That is a reasonable temp for any summer ride in most places and when you consider the low humidity very little sweating as compared to 85F and 90% humidity that you get in some places.


Ok, that's not really possible. It starts at 80 degrees or more and it's 100 or more by 10am. When you are really in the summer, it rarely gets to 70 at the coldest time of the day. Heck, it rarely gets colder than 60 degrees at night in the hottest time of the summer in Prescott. You seem to be quoting the absolute coldest start-temp and then saying that's what it is, ignoring that it quickly gets to 100 degrees. I realize you love Phoenix, but I'm sort of a weather-geek due to my job and I don't think the way you are portraying it is accurate. If I started a ride in the morning in Prescott, I may get 60 degrees for an hour, then up to 80 in the next hour, then it levels off, unless it's the hottest time of the summer when it gets to 90 or so with a few days reaching near triple digits. Add about 20 degrees to those temps for an accurate representation of Phoenix weather due to adiabatic heating and the heat-island traps it for longer too. At 10pm it can easily still be 100 degrees or more. Phoenix is absolutely extreme weather, just on the extreme hot side, not extreme cold. In any of these places you can get out and ride with enough dedication, get up at 3am, get lights, watch out for rattlesnakes, be finishing your ride around 9-10am, etc. In AK it's lights sometimes, the big hand-warmer things that go on the handlebar, and fat bikes/tires. If you are dedicated enough to deal with the extreme phoenix weather, that's cool and more power too you. It takes a lot of dedication to dealing with the extreme weather though. Phoenix does have amazing riding possibilities and a park-system that isn't matched in may places, except maybe Bay Area and a few others. This is what Phoenix has going for it and it's fun in the winter. Driving 2hrs or more in the summer to escape the heat gets a little tedious after a while, but plenty of people have no problem with that lifestyle in places like Phoenix, Sacramento/Valley, LA, etc. There are less extreme environments with outstanding riding nearby, but you have to evaluate the trade offs and your priorities.


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## kAZ (Jan 13, 2004)

Phoenix riding in the summer isn't that bad at all to me. I live right next to Usery (Pass Mtn), 10 minutes from Hawes, and 25 minutes from Gold Canyon. On the worst days of the summer, say it'll be 115° that day, I can get up around 5am and can knock out a sweet 3 hr ride. On a 115° day it'll be around 90° at 5:30. With the sun not up, 90° here is not only not bad, it's quite pleasant. I'll grant that it starts to get pretty warm by about 9am, but a high of 115° or so is the very worst of the year. We only had a few days that hot last summer. If it's only going to get to say 105°,,, well, 105° just isn't that big of a deal with our low humidity.

You can also get 60-90 minute rides in during the last light of the day. A lot of the east side of South Mtn is in the shade for the last hour+ of the day. Of course, lights multiply your options.

Phoenix is a great place to live and ride, but it's not for everyone. The heat can get tiresome. I've lived in Texas, Utah County and the southern California beach area, and I prefer this climate/environment.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

Jayem said:


> Ok, that's not really possible. It starts at 80 degrees or more and it's 100 or more by 10am. When you are really in the summer, it rarely gets to 70 ...


I was riding in early June at 5:30 am. Dawn and was experiencing in 65 deg temps on the trail. It got to 102 those days. By late June it was 75 at the start of the ride and by 8:30 it was starting to get warm and I was pulling into the trail head ready to head home. Yes by 9 or 10 am it is too hot to ride. That is why you start early. Worst days were August where it started at about 85F in the McDowells at 6am just when there was enough light to ride and was 95 by time I as done. That lasted 2 weekends.

As for heat island.. It is much less on the trails than in the city. Even trails in the city are better since the are in the open. I was on a ride once where it was cool and nice, but when turned around one mtn it got warmer because the suburbs below were radiating heat back.

Now I have never needed to get up at 3 am, not needed lights in any my summer rides, but I do need to finish up before it gets hot so that limits me to 2-3 hrs.

Look it takes some adjustment, but it is remarkably pleasant to ride early in the morning like this and the have the entire day in front of you. Even now I wish I could get up and ride at 5:30am and be done and showered by 9am. Doing that now is hard since it so cold in the mornings and dark.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

kAZ said:


> .. On the worst days of the summer, say it'll be 115° that day, I can get up around 5am and can knock out a sweet 3 hr ride. On a 115° day it'll be around 90° at 5:30. With the sun not up, 90° here is not only not bad, it's quite pleasant. I'll grant that it starts to get pretty warm by about 9am, but a high of 115° or so is the very worst of the year. We only had a few days that hot last summer. ...


Exactly. A 115F day here is about as bad as it gets. It is like when that blizzard comes in drops 3-4 feet of snow and brings temps to sub zero with -20 wind chill. It happens and it sucks, but unlike a blizzard there are times in the day you can still get out and do things. The only place with perfect year around weather is Southern California and parts of Florida. Florida is humid and flat, So- Cal would perfect if they had the trails. However in terms of Trails Az has so-cal beat hands down. It is not the terrain, but the access.


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## Wishful Tomcat (Mar 6, 2009)

Great info. on Arizona guys! -Thanks!


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jayem said:


> You'd think, but large swaths of the sierras have very limited riding opportunities. They just don't utilize the land like they do in AZ in my experience. In AZ they are more open to building trails, trails exist in many more places. To put it simply, they utilize the land much better IMO.


I bet California actually has many more trails - the problem is they're closed to bikes!


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

It's a large state with a large amount of forest land and mountains. There are trails up there, but just not as many as you'd think given the terrain. I'd expect an awesome trail network coming into Pollock Pines from the Sierras, but nope, it just doesn't exist. Same with Auburn, but nope, doesn't really exist, although Auburn has a moderate trail network in the immediate area. They are just now starting to get more going on in the Donner Lake/Truckee area and more in Tahoe, but it's fairly small localized spots. Downieville seems to be one of the few areas that is closer to a big trail network with varied opportunities. The population density in some of these places is pretty high, yet there are huge areas where it's not. I lived their for many years, then I moved to AZ. AZ just has trails in many more places. You got Prescott, Sedona, Flagstaff, Grand Canyon, Phoenix area (many many trails and ones going north-south through the entire state!), White Mountains, Tucson, Globe, and a bunch of smaller destinations like Williams, Mingus Mountain, Sierra Vista, and many others. You just don't find the trail networks in CA. Sure, there are some wilderness PCT type trails closed to bikes, but those areas do not have much of a trail network really, it's just one trail traversing or cutting through usually. I would go up to the Crystal Basin in the summers (before the big fire) with my mountain bike and family and try to figure out why there were virtually NO trails in the entire area. Some jeep type roads were fun, but the singletrack was very limited. 

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not trying to make it sound like California has a severe lack of mountain biking or trails. They don't. It's just that there are many places in CA where you can live in terrain that would be great for mountain biking, and there is a near total, if not complete, lack of mountain biking nearby. That's harder to do in AZ, nearly everywhere they got mountains or terrain that would work well, there are trails in it. It just means you have to choose more carefully in CA.


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## John Lazzara (Feb 21, 2013)

My Wife lived in Whistler for two years, many stories of gnarley adventures - very jealous!


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2013)

Jayem said:


> You'd think, but large swaths of the sierras have very limited riding opportunities. They just don't utilize the land like they do in AZ in my experience. In AZ they are more open to building trails, trails exist in many more places. To put it simply, they utilize the land much better IMO.


due to large mountain region, what it takes to create a trail system @ 9kft is exhausting to be blunt let alone the funds to build them........AZ is flat in comparison so far and away simplier. You need to ride the area more to know whats available thats all.


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2013)

Jayem said:


> Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not trying to make it sound like California has a severe lack of mountain biking or trails. They don't. It's just that there are many places in CA where you can live in terrain that would be great for mountain biking, and there is a near total, if not complete, lack of mountain biking nearby. That's harder to do in AZ, nearly everywhere they got mountains or terrain that would work well, there are trails in it. It just means you have to choose more carefully in CA.


well its not all for bikers.......MUT systems in place.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

nvphatty said:


> due to large mountain region, what it takes to create a trail system @ 9kft is exhausting to be blunt let alone the funds to build them........AZ is flat in comparison so far and away simplier. You need to ride the area more to know whats available thats all.


Az is not at all flat. Lots of mountains in Arizona. The difference is that land is and land managers are more open using the land and creating trails. The Phoenix area is nice because we have mountains in the city and most of these have been dedicated as perserve lands. So it creates a park, but that park is open to hiking and biking. Just on my drive to work I pass by 3 different mtn perserve trail systems and I can see the trails from my car. In the distance I can see the mtn where their are 3 more trail systems, but these are just too far away to actually make out the trails themselves.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

nvphatty said:


> due to large mountain region, what it takes to create a trail system @ 9kft is exhausting to be blunt let alone the funds to build them........AZ is flat in comparison so far and away simplier. You need to ride the area more to know whats available thats all.


AZ has plateaus above 9000 feet in the White Mountains and 8000 feet near the Grand Canyon. These have quickly rising and dropping terrain in them as well. Mingus Mountain, the Pinals, Tuscons, and many others have around 5000' vertical feet. Mt Graham even more, I think it's like 7000 or 8000. Prescott is very similar to Truckee, in that it's at just over a mile high and there are many peaks going up well past 7000' in the surrounding area. Places in AZ like the McDowell Mtns and South Mountain are literally hacked out of stone, amazing man-hours have went into the trails and routes down there. I'd say half of AZ is above 5000', drawing a line roughly from the NW corner to the SE corner, everything to the right of that line is above 5000' and much higher in places. There are lots of people that think AZ is flat and it doesn't snow, but I blow away people in Alaska when I show them Flagstaff is at -6 and people are skiing on the mountain (ski resort goes from over 9000 to something like 11,500').


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

AZ is not flat, but in comparison to California or CO (for that matter) the mountains are a bit little. Between Yosemite and Mt. Whitney, CA has the most spectacular trails outside Switzerland. But, they're closed more than 6 months a year due to heavy snow and mostly off limits to bikes anyway. Access is a huge issue in California and hikers and pony princesses have locked MTBers out all over the state. I live just 20 miles from SF and we have fanastic single track right out the door and it's all off limits to bikes. 

AZ must have better access and I'll give them lots of extra points for sunshine, Sedona, Mexican food, big skies and not having all the drunk drivers or cock fighting of their neighbor to the east (NM). I'd move there except they need an ocean!


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

I tend to think California now that I live there. I thought Colorado was awesome when I lived there. I guess everyone's answer is going to be biased.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I tend to think California now that I live there. I thought Colorado was awesome when I lived there. I guess everyone's answer is going to be biased.


Love where you live. The west is the best!


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## willem3 (Apr 14, 2007)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I tend to think California now that I live there. I thought Colorado was awesome when I lived there. I guess everyone's answer is going to be biased.


Agreed. Most of us make the best of any location. I think everyone just loves to ride. Although, some locations are better than others.

Gouda Cheez, you a Dutch guy? I am from Holland originally.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Jayem said:


> Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not trying to make it sound like California has a severe lack of mountain biking or trails. They don't. It's just that there are many places in CA where you can live in terrain that would be great for mountain biking, and there is a near total, if not complete, lack of mountain biking nearby. That's harder to do in AZ, nearly everywhere they got mountains or terrain that would work well, there are trails in it. It just means you have to choose more carefully in CA.


There are a lot of places in San Diego County where you can walk/bike to the trailhead in 5 minutes.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

willem3 said:


> Agreed. Most of us make the best of any location. I think everyone just loves to ride. Although, some locations are better than others.
> 
> Gouda Cheez, you a Dutch guy? I am from Holland originally.


My great-great grandparents came over from Belgium (at least that's how the story goes). Gouda was a nickname I had in HS because my last name is stupid-hard to pronounce when looked at on paper. The Cheez thing was added on a few years later.


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## frescoVA (Jul 7, 2006)

I love the place I'm currently at, cuz it's the place I can currently ride.  But, if I had my pick I'd head back to Peru and live up in Cuzco somewhere. The potential for riding there is phenomenal...


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## millsdal (Feb 27, 2013)

*Colorado*

Colorado has every type of riding you cold be looking for. I live in Aspen, CO and have miles upon miles of trials right in my backyard. Packing up the car and within 2 hrs your move from big mountian rocky terrain to desert slickrock riding. Not bad if you ask me!


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

Eckstream1 said:


> My vote goes to Eastern Pennsylvania... I live near Reading,Pa... And I have a 5 min ride to my favorite trail system.
> QUOTE]
> 
> really?? of all the places in the world, you pick where you live, in PA? talk about TINY mountains, no thanks. granted people are always heavily biased to where they live. like me in socal. year round riding, 65 in the winter. trails that drop 6000-8000 vertical plus as technical as you want, almost never cold. we have gobs of singletrack descents > 3000 vert.


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## Guest (Feb 28, 2013)

Jayem said:


> AZ has plateaus above 9000 feet in the White Mountains and 8000 feet near the Grand Canyon. These have quickly rising and dropping terrain in them as well. Mingus Mountain, the Pinals, Tuscons, and many others have around 5000' vertical feet. Mt Graham even more, I think it's like 7000 or 8000. Prescott is very similar to Truckee, in that it's at just over a mile high and there are many peaks going up well past 7000' in the surrounding area. Places in AZ like the McDowell Mtns and South Mountain are literally hacked out of stone, amazing man-hours have went into the trails and routes down there. I'd say half of AZ is above 5000', drawing a line roughly from the NW corner to the SE corner, everything to the right of that line is above 5000' and much higher in places. There are lots of people that think AZ is flat and it doesn't snow, but I blow away people in Alaska when I show them Flagstaff is at -6 and people are skiing on the mountain (ski resort goes from over 9000 to something like 11,500').


yes yes i'm well aware it has mountains but the region is far diff then the sierras. frankly i'm glad were not over run by the masses with trail systems scattered throughout.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

millsdal said:


> Colorado has every type of riding you cold be looking for. I live in Aspen, CO and have miles upon miles of trials right in my backyard. Packing up the car and within 2 hrs your move from big mountian rocky terrain to desert slickrock riding. Not bad if you ask me!


Freudian slip?


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

nvphatty said:


> yes yes i'm well aware it has mountains but the region is far diff then the sierras. frankly i'm glad were not over run by the masses with trail systems scattered throughout.


Well, it seemed like you weren't. You said building trail above 9K was exhausting, but really, only the southern sierras are going to have elevations significantly above that, and all of that is wilderness area anyways. In AZ we rode above 7K all the time and 9-10K (well, above 11 at sunrise, but that's downhill!  and didn't find it exhausting at all. It's about conditioning. If you go from the bay area and try to ride above 9K on the TRT or south of 88, as I have, it's going to feel pretty bad, but if you are used to high elevations, no problem. Depending on where you live, you get plenty of that in AZ. Starting elevation for Flagstaff is 7K, for many places in the White Mountains/Pinetop area it's 6500 or so, with locally higher starting points, the North Rim of the GC starts at 8000 or so, and so on. What AZ has a lot of are local "sky islands" with small mountain "ranges" rising vertically out of scrub/desert more than 5000' vertically, in some cases like Mt Graham, which is 20th on the list of ultra prominent peaks (57 total) in the lower 48 states, which is not bad. I think Mt Shasta and Rainier are ahead of it, but it's pretty mountainous and rough terrain. It's cool they make so much out of what they have in terms of trails. It's not as densely populated as California though, so you aren't criss-crossing trails everywhere in the backcountry, it's just that they have the trails and the mountains  I might like some areas of CA a lot, but Flagstaff and a few other places in AZ are pretty high on my list too.


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## JL de Jong (Dec 4, 2006)

The obvious answer to the question is: live in an RV and drive around. Vancouver, Oregon, Tahoe, Colorado in the summer and Arizona, Utah, the rest of California in the winter. 
Get satellite internet access and work from "home" or take that early retirement, while you can still ride the trails.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jayem said:


> Well, it seemed like you weren't. You said building trail above 9K was exhausting, but really, only the southern sierras are going to have elevations significantly above that, and all of that is wilderness area anyways. In AZ we rode above 7K all the time and 9-10K (well, above 11 at sunrise, but that's downhill!  and didn't find it exhausting at all. It's about conditioning. If you go from the bay area and try to ride above 9K on the TRT or south of 88, as I have, it's going to feel pretty bad, but if you are used to high elevations, no problem. Depending on where you live, you get plenty of that in AZ. Starting elevation for Flagstaff is 7K, for many places in the White Mountains/Pinetop area it's 6500 or so, with locally higher starting points, the North Rim of the GC starts at 8000 or so, and so on. What AZ has a lot of are local "sky islands" with small mountain "ranges" rising vertically out of scrub/desert more than 5000' vertically, in some cases like Mt Graham, which is 20th on the list of ultra prominent peaks (57 total) in the lower 48 states, which is not bad. I think Mt Shasta and Rainier are ahead of it, but it's pretty mountainous and rough terrain. It's cool they make so much out of what they have in terms of trails. It's not as densely populated as California though, so you aren't criss-crossing trails everywhere in the backcountry, it's just that they have the trails and the mountains  I might like some areas of CA a lot, but Flagstaff and a few other places in AZ are pretty high on my list too.


When I visited Flagstaff, I thought it was a nice cute town - but the the mountains and terrain are pretty boring by Sierra standards. Our local "everyday" coastal mountains look as good as Flagstaff (but often have ocean views). Sedona is another world of course!


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## Mrwhlr (Sep 16, 2006)

SS Hack said:


> When I visited Flagstaff, I thought it was a nice cute town - but the the mountains and terrain are pretty boring by Sierra standards. Our local "everyday" coastal mountains look as good as Flagstaff (but often have ocean views). Sedona is another world of course!


Amazing how real mountains aren't required for real rides, huh?

Problem w/ CA, it has the flatbillers.


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## Mrwhlr (Sep 16, 2006)

SkaredShtles said:


> Yup. I hear Austin is really nice.


He said Texas, not Austin.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

I apologize in advance for not reading all of this ginormous thread and further apologize if this has been mentioned before.

The Salt Lake City, Utah area is a great place to live and we have incredible MTBing nearby. Even if you look outside of our local area. Not only do we have a ton of nearby trails but within a 4 hour drive I can be in Moab, Fruita, St. George, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley and Vernal. 8 Hours and I could be on the Front Range, Lake Tahoe, Bend, or Boise.

Our state is run well and our finances are in the black. Foreclosure rates are low, jobs are high. Living costs are very reasonable and our taxes are very reasonable. We also have some of the lowest gas prices in the nation.

If MTBing in the winter isn't your thing, you can't beat our snow sports.

Plenty of bike industry jobs here as well with QBP, ENVE, and Fatback in the Ogden area.

Oh, and our first year as a NICA league set records for first year attendance, 250 kids/race and over 33 high schools and counting.


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

I used to look at mountains on the horizon thinking that they'd be nice for biking, but once I started working on trails, they started to look a bit too steep for decent trails. The most fun trails I've been on are on gentler grades. Not sure why people are talking about certain mountain ranges like they are nice. I consider the raw mountains far away from civilization a challenge, but would only consider it for riding once in a while. I'd imagine a majority of the nice riding in the Sierras is close to the base of the mountains.

While you can just drive to a mountain range around SoCal and find a trail on it, a lot of the steep trails in SoCal, south of the Sierras, are technically not legal and you're not allowed to say their names, as mtn bikers riding them are giving others a bad name with the land managers, and leaving evidence online is a big no-no... I highly doubt they are fooled by the vids on VitalMTB where they post vids of pros on such trails and say they're in Trinidad, Colorado or whatever.

I personally find that mtb specific trails are where it's at. I'm no fan of multi use trails. Where ever there's mostly mtb specific trails, I'm thinking Oregon, I think that would be one of the nicer places to live and mtn bike.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Mrwhlr said:


> the flatbillers.


???


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Silentfoe said:


> I apologize in advance for not reading all of this ginormous thread and further apologize if this has been mentioned before.
> 
> The Salt Lake City, Utah area is a great place to live and we have incredible MTBing nearby. Even if you look outside of our local area. Not only do we have a ton of nearby trails but within a 4 hour drive I can be in Moab, Fruita, St. George, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley and Vernal. 8 Hours and I could be on the Front Range, Lake Tahoe, Bend, or Boise.
> 
> ...


Do you get stick eye for not being well ... like Mitt? Very pretty state however.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

I know what you mean and no, not at all. Honestly the best day to ride here is Sunday because the trails are empty.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Silentfoe said:


> I know what you mean and no, not at all. Honestly the best day to ride here is Sunday because the trails are empty.


I have a relative that lives in Park City - he bikes year round and absolutely loves living there.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Silentfoe said:


> I know what you mean and no, not at all. Honestly the best day to ride here is Sunday because the trails are empty.


Cool, that's my favorite kind of church.


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2008)

Too bad the climate sucks so bad.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I have a relative that lives in Park City - he bikes year round and absolutely loves living there.


i would think about moving to utah but the whole mormon thing.


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2008)

San Diego is a cluster f*ck but the weather is perfect for riding


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Jaybo said:


> San Diego is a cluster f*ck but the weather is perfect for riding


It's not that bad after you get used to it.


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## peanuthead (May 31, 2004)

Flagstaff is hard to beat. Between Flagstaff and Sedona, you've got great all-year riding over varied terrain, and you can easily make day/weekend trips to great rides in Arizona, Utah, Colorado.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

peanuthead said:


> Flagstaff is hard to beat. Between Flagstaff and Sedona, you've got great all-year riding over varied terrain, and you can easily make day/weekend trips to great rides in Arizona, Utah, Colorado.


Flag is easy to beat if you want a good job. I have friend who used to live up there. Very hard to get a good job. He had one of the better ones, but moved back to Phoenix about 2 years ago after 4 years in flag. He is finding more time to ride in Phoenix and better employment for him and his wife.


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## zebrahum (Jun 29, 2005)

roc865 said:


> i would think about moving to utah but the whole mormon thing.


Yeah, that part sucks; unless you're ok with nice people and good neighbors, then you'd be surrounded by them. The worst part about Utah for me is how completely incapable of operating motor vehicles everyone is. 10 mph under the speed limit across all 5 lanes of the highway with no one in front of you? WTF?

Sure the church has an unreasonable influence in the politics of the state but it can be easily overlooked on the hundreds of miles of trails within 40 minutes, the over the head powder at the 9 resorts within an hour of SLC, or the world class rock climbing or hiking or proximity to so many mountain bike meccas or...

Don't tell Mitt, but we have damn good local beer too.


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## zebrahum (Jun 29, 2005)

zebrahum said:


> Yeah, that part sucks; unless you're ok with nice people and good neighbors, then you'd be surrounded by them. The worst part about Utah for me is how completely incapable of operating motor vehicles everyone is. 10 mph under the speed limit across all 5 lanes of the highway with no one in front of you? WTF?
> 
> Sure the church has an unreasonable influence in the politics of the state but it can be easily overlooked on the hundreds of miles of trails within 40 minutes, the over the head powder at the 9 resorts within an hour of SLC, or the world class rock climbing or hiking or proximity to so many mountain bike meccas or...
> 
> Don't tell Mitt, but we have damn good local beer too.


Crap! I mean... um... Utah sucks, stay away! Lots of scary ghosts! OOOOOOOOHHHHH!


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## Francis Buxton (Apr 2, 2004)

Haven't read the entire thread, but I doubt anyone has actually mentioned Kansas City.

We have +/-120 miles of mountain-biker-built singletrack in the metro, guaranteeing that you will have at least one trail within riding distance of whatever part of town you decide to live in. We have a very active mtb community, and a great reputation with local land managers for access to trails, as evidenced by recent access to begin work on two new trail systems.

We have an active cycling community that includes road racing, cyclocross (hosted nationals twice) and gravel (Dirty Kanza, etc.). We have some great local mtb promoters, and have tons of mtb races within 2 hours. Access to year-round trails within a 3-6 hour drive in the MO ozarks and Arkansas.

We do experience all four seasons, so we do have to stay off the trails when it's wet due to a lot of clay soils, but they are well designed and well built, so they dry reasonably quickly. We do have pretty good access to gravel, so you've always got other options to ride year-round.

The cost of living is pretty low, and our job market is pretty good. We don't have "mountains", but you can do plenty of climbing on our trails, and we've got all the rocks and technical trails that you'll ever want to ride. You will be hard pressed to find trails that are better designed and better built anywhere in the country, and we don't have "overcrowding" issues that a lot of areas like California have.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

One thing I've learned from this thread - everyone is biased.


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## stremf (Dec 7, 2012)

Gouda Cheez said:


> One thing I've learned from this thread - everyone is biased.


Not me. Stay away from Utah. We got intolerable smog (serious), bitter cold winters, pesky mormons, watered-down beer, apparently ghosts, worst drivers, and ugly women. And no, they can't cook, either.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

Wait...

Did someone recommend Kansas City as the BEST place to live and mountain bike? IN THE WORLD?

This thread has jumped the shark. Official-like.


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## Scottie5150 (Mar 10, 2004)

SkaredShtles said:


> Wait...
> 
> Did someone recommend Kansas City as the BEST place to live and mountain bike? IN THE WORLD?
> 
> This thread has jumped the shark. Official-like.


Werd!

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2


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## chainsmoker (Apr 20, 2004)

Maybe he thought the title was "Best place to live and mountain bike...in Kansas????"


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

stremf said:


> Not me. Stay away from Utah. We got intolerable smog (serious), bitter cold winters, pesky mormons, watered-down beer, apparently ghosts, worst drivers, and ugly women. And no, they can't cook, either.


Sounds like you're just trying to keep people away from your own corner of paradise. While we at it, northern California also sucks and is super expensive and crowded.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

San Diego sucks too. FYI.


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## Necktie Killer (Jan 10, 2013)

Bend, Oregon is a phenomenal place, but don't tell anyone! We have endless trails nearby. Today I did a killer 12 mile loop at Horse Ridge, which is 15 miles east of Bend...so wonderful!


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

JoePAz said:


> Flag is easy to beat if you want a good job. I have friend who used to live up there. Very hard to get a good job. He had one of the better ones, but moved back to Phoenix about 2 years ago after 4 years in flag. He is finding more time to ride in Phoenix and better employment for him and his wife.


Life choices. Your friend chose a career that didn't allow for location flexibility. That's his loss. I'd take the cool (literally in the Summer) outdoor-oriented mountain-town of Flagstaff over Phoenix every day and Sunday. I think I had a nice compromise in Prescott with Flagstaff just over an hour away, Sedona just under an hour away, and Phoenix under 2hrs. Moderate temps, enough riding nearby to keep you interested and hitting up new routes and ways to connect. The riding in Flagstaff is a few levels above though, much higher quality and much more focused on mountain biking, which is nice. That's what I really like about places like Flagstaff, Durango, Lake Tahoe, and so on. The outdoor focus is there and you can always find stuff to do. Flagstaff is unique in that it's so much closer to warm temps in the winter (Sedona) and it doesn't get all that snowy compared to the places at higher latitudes. It's not terribly colder here in AK at sea level (I've only seen it 4 degrees colder here than the lowest in Flagstaff this year), but the far higher atmospheric pressure and sunlight issues keep anything frozen from sublimating off, so it just stays.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

roc865 said:


> i would think about moving to utah but the whole mormon thing.


How do bigoted people like you still exist and have any green chicklets?


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## woahey (Sep 1, 2010)

Jayem said:


> Life choices. Your friend chose a career that didn't allow for location flexibility. That's his loss.


Life choices is right. I make a half of what I did in MI living in Sedona. I also work 2 minutes from home (10 if I walk), can ride my bike in any direction and be on a trail in 15 minutes max, and overall have a lot less stressful life. I'll take this life over making more money, commuting an hour or more each way to work, having a 30-45 minute drive to a halfway decent trail and being a stress monkey. It's not perfect for most but it works for me!


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

woahey said:


> Life choices is right. I make a half of what I did in MI living in Sedona. I also work 2 minutes from home (10 if I walk), can ride my bike in any direction and be on a trail in 15 minutes max, and overall have a lot less stressful life. I'll take this life over making more money, commuting an hour or more each way to work, having a 30-45 minute drive to a halfway decent trail and being a stress monkey. It's not perfect for most but it works for me!


Agreed. I've had both experiences and made a similar choice.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

Silentfoe said:


> How do bigoted people like you still exist and have any green chicklets?


Theres nothing bigoted about that. I wouldnt live in any religion-dominated state either. Strongly religious communities are pretty intolerant of people who hold different views, ironic that you call him bigoted in that context.

Norcal is a great place to live, all in all. If you want something completely different, drive an hour or so in any direction and you're somewhere completely different. Making a decent living isnt hard here depending on where you decide to live.


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## 6thElement (Jul 17, 2006)

KevinGT said:


> ... I'd assume some cities in Florida and some of the major urban sprawl cities like NYC and Chicago. It must be tough to be a mountain biker in Manhattan -- no place to store your bike and no place to ride it other than true urban assaults...


Actually it's easy to be a mountain biker in NYC. Three different trails networks within the city, a dozen ride locations within a hours drive with several accessible by train for the non car owners. Plenty of lift assisted downhill at Mountain Creek, Plattekill or slightly further there's Highland and a few other restorts.

The tough part is the cost of living and the size of living accomodations. With five bikes in my apartment it is annoying to not have plenty of space.

Not the best place to live and mountain bike, but certainly not the worst.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

One Pivot said:


> Theres nothing bigoted about that. I wouldnt live in any religion-dominated state either. Strongly religious communities are pretty intolerant of people who hold different views, ironic that you call him bigoted in that context.
> 
> Norcal is a great place to live, all in all. If you want something completely different, drive an hour or so in any direction and you're somewhere completely different. Making a decent living isnt hard here depending on where you decide to live.


I think you don't understand what bigot or ironic means.


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## One Pivot (Nov 20, 2009)

Its pretty ironic to call someone intolerant for not wanting a part of intolerance.


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## Rock dude (May 24, 2007)

zebrahum said:


> Crap! I mean... um... Utah sucks, stay away! Lots of scary ghosts! OOOOOOOOHHHHH!
> 
> View attachment 776451


That's too funny:thumbsup:

I'm a custom home builder and have been very busy from the first day I moved to Utah from So Cal. 10 years ago.
I love it here and I don't see myself ever leaving.

By the way I'm NOT Mormon.


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## Mrwhlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Meh, Phoenix has lots of Mormons, too. The chicks look ok, but most won't put out, and if they do, they'll get all weird about it afterwards. They will help you move tough, so that's a plus. 

BTW: Flagstaff winter isn't all that snowy? ROTFLOL! I've lived there. Snowy enough to make you drive an hour away jut to ride. For me, that would be ~14 hours of driving per week. No thanks.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

Well mr wheeler, Sedona is only 30 minutes south of Flagstaff, the "snowline" in AZ is usually around 7000' in the winter, but anything in the sun usually gets barren above even that altitude, the altitude causes the snow and moisture to sublimate, which compared to where I'm at now in Anchorage, is the exact opposite due to the atmospheric pressure. You see, at high altitude, the low pressure entices the moisture to go directly from a solid to a gas, ample sunlight heating helps with this significant too. So you must remember how the streets were completely clear of snow and ice most of the time, except when there was a storm and for a few hours after that. I've been up in Flagstaff plenty of times in the winter and it's nothing compared to Tahoe and other snowier places that can get 10 feet on the ground without as much evaporation effect. You can even ride trails in Flagstaff well into November and usually December, and start riding trails again at the end of March.

There's what, like 3 days a year where it snows in Sedona anyway? 

As far as mountain towns go and winters, Flagstaff is pretty mild and the snow season is relatively short. It gets snow, but it's AZ and it's not like Tahoe or anything of that extent. Due to the sunlight and low pressure, anything that falls is off the roads fairly fast. Nothing like here in Anchorage where we've gotten about 60" of snow and ALL of it is still here, compacted, turned into ice, in a "slush" state that never goes away...well finally we are getting a couple days above freezing and the roads are drying out a bit, but it's the first time in months that we've seen that. If your idea of winter is Phoenix and 80 degrees, I guess it would seem snowy, but on the scale of mountain towns and winter, I think it's pretty mild, I always categorized it like that before I moved to Alaska, based on experiences in CA, CO, MT, and other places. Sunrise and the White Mountains get more snow than Flagstaff, due to more favorable lifting characteristics and the weather patterns.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

I've actually read this whole tread over the last week or so. Wife's parents aren't doing too well and we've talked about where we might move if they pass and we wanted to get out of one of the nicest parts of Southern California (Conejo Valley)

1) I work from home 3 weeks out of the month and travel the other week. It would be nice to be my some sort of major airport so I could get to my destination city without a ton of lay overs.

2) Wife takes care of the kid and we are going to do home school so I'm not that worried about school systems. But poor schools tend to have negative impacts on crime in the area.

3) Wife hates rain. I hate snow.

4) I want better trails. The area I live is wealthy and there is a bunch of great road biking, but I have to drive to different ends of the city for trail riding. It is mostly fire roads up and eroded single track down. Yeah I can drive further but what I really want is to live close enough to nature so that I can just jump on a trail from the driveway.

Arizona is looking pretty good from what people seem to be saying. I'm a Platinum US Airways member and their hub is in Phoenix. So I wouldn't have to worry about lay overs. Tuscon and Prescott look nice also I think Prescott is about a 2 hour drive from Sky Harbor but I'm currently driving 45 to Burbank or LAX and then doing a lay over in PHX when I fly anyways.

Utah is supposed to be amazing but probably too much snow for me. I'm not Mormon, but I've never met a Mormon I didn't like and I can really agree with their family values. Colorado would be sweet as well but I'd worry about how hard it would be to fly out of Durango or Grand Junction- and the other parts of the state look like they have too much snow or rain for us.

When we are ready I'm probably just going to have to do a bunch of vacations to see which area I like the best.


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## ZL33 (Mar 2, 2013)

new england cause we have every type of terrain and its a pretty cheap place to live


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

ZL33 said:


> new england cause we have every type of terrain and its a pretty cheap place to live


You just called New England cheap? I want whatever you are taking


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jwind said:


> You just called New England cheap? I want whatever you are taking


Maybe it looks cheap compared to California where everything is just crippling?


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Housing is pretty expensive in NY. Don't get anything remotely as nice as you would in SoCal suburban cities with the same money. Location is what you pay for though. Things are so much closer in NY. Lots of trees and greenery, with fresh air, away from the big cities. It rains enough to keep visibility high, and you can see the skyline of NYC from 100s of miles north.

There's some nice bike park areas that appear far away for an Orange County, NY resident, like Diablo/mtn creek, and Killington, but compared to a trip to Big Bear and Mammoth for an Orange County, CA resident, the actual mileage is comparable. New England has even more options, like Blue Mountain. They just seem kind of far since residents up there are used to things being close.

I don't think things are that crippling in SoCal. People just seem to live big lifestyles that they can barely afford. Never seen so many people with expensive looking bikes, cars, clothes, accessories, etc. anywhere else. It was much more modest in New England and more about actions than appearance.

I miss some of the food in NY. Macoun apples, pizza that was awesome, hmm, grocery store specials, etc. Used to go for the end of day manager specials from the deli, like their subs packed full of meat and everything. In SoCal, there's quite a variety of veggies and fresh stuff, but fruit seems kind of expensive. Well, except for oranges which sometimes pop up for 5-7 lbs for $1. Dairy is more expensive too in SoCal... think cutting back on dairy made me lactose intolerant or something anyways.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Varaxis said:


> Housing is pretty expensive in NY. Don't get anything remotely as nice as you would in SoCal suburban cities with the same money. Location is what you pay for though. Things are so much closer in NY. Lots of trees and greenery, with fresh air, away from the big cities. It rains enough to keep visibility high, and you can see the skyline of NYC from 100s of miles north.
> 
> There's some nice bike park areas that appear far away for an Orange County, NY resident, like Diablo/mtn creek, and Killington, but compared to a trip to Big Bear and Mammoth for an Orange County, CA resident, the actual mileage is comparable. New England has even more options, like Blue Mountain. They just seem kind of far since residents up there are used to things being close.
> 
> I don't think things are that crippling in SoCal. People just seem to live big lifestyles that they can barely afford. Never seen so many people with expensive looking bikes, cars, clothes, accessories, etc. Was much more modest in New England and more about actions than appearance.


California is boom and bust state - everyone lived large during the last boom and downsized somewhat after the bust. Of course, we're starting up the bubble again. The cycle goes on.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

Varaxis said:


> Housing is pretty expensive in NY. Don't get anything remotely as nice as you would in SoCal suburban cities with the same money. Location is what you pay for though. Things are so much closer in NY. Lots of trees and greenery, with fresh air, away from the big cities. It rains enough to keep visibility high, and you can see the skyline of NYC from 100s of miles north.
> 
> There's some nice bike park areas that appear far away for an Orange County, NY resident, like Diablo/mtn creek, and Killington, but compared to a trip to Big Bear and Mammoth for an Orange County, CA resident, the actual mileage is comparable. New England has even more options, like Blue Mountain. They just seem kind of far since residents up there are used to things being close.
> 
> ...


ny taxes you to death.


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## Tyler21 (Sep 16, 2012)

Speaking strictly mountain biking, Long Island, NY is actually pretty decent for it. There are multiple trails all over the island, lots with fun obstacles and whatnot. Everything is close or at least within about 40 miles distance. Some trails you can even ride your bike to, like I prefer to do. The tri-state area is also very accessible and though I've never ridden off Long Island yet, I'm sure the trails nearby would be loads of fun.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

roc865 said:


> ny taxes you to death.


Another "doner state" - we get taxed up heavily and get little in return.


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

roc865 said:


> ny taxes you to death.


Seems the same in SoCal. Similar property tax, sales tax, state income tax, etc. Gas prices are higher. Can't compare utility costs, cause I only have FL and SoCal to go off of, since my old folks paid it in NY. I believe one significant reason why some old people moved away from NY was the property tax and housing prices almost doubling in the past 5-10 years. My old folk's home is worth $150k-170k now (was like 90k in the 90s) and the house I'm in $195k and is almost 3x the size (was like 2x the price when it was built). I travel 3x the distance on average to get to places though. Cities are getting more ghetto in NY despite the taxes...

Dark Horse Cycles hosted nearby races up there in NY, with the Dark Horse 40 and Single-a-pooza, on trails close enough I could ride the pavement to. It was ~10 miles, but it isn't boring like 10 miles of SoCal pavement. There's even these underground races like the Beacon Mega Avalanche, which started after I moved away. I learned to ride tech stuff on that very mtn. Races in SoCal are pretty far away. There's the Fontana/SouthRidge races and the beginner stuff like Over The Hump and then the endurance stuff like VisionQuest. Used to be 24 hour races here, but they seemed to be phased out. Never thought about checking out Windham.

Clubs in NY seemed pretty small and tight knit. Beacon Bombers, Cats in the Hats, etc. Clubs in SoCal, I dunno. There's SoCalTrailRiders, and then smaller groups. I haven't joined any, since they seem based at least 15 miles away from me. There's so many people on the trails in OC that there's traffic issues on singletrack. I've heard of collisions in NY that are bad enough to bust bike and body, but are treated friendly like, but in SoCal I'm afraid people would probably sue and trails get closed to bikes.

I dunno, when you say "best" everything is just so subjective and very arguable. It's just one of those life choices, like money vs love. IMO, I'm tired of these multi-use trails in SoCal. All the mtn bike specific ones are illegal. I'd love to live somewhere such trails are legal and were mtb specific. Why does it seem we're a small user group than hikers and equestrians? I see more bikes than anyone else here. I just get the impression that SoCal just isn't very welcoming. Guess the taxes in SoCal are for keeping people off city property to keep it from looking ghetto.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

SS Hack said:


> Maybe it looks cheap compared to California where everything is just crippling?


I mean maybe a little. You could argue a place like Boston is cheaper than SanFran but I say you are splitting hairs.

Ya, you can the mid size city thing or small town but even there, prices are far more than they should and there is less work. I lived I. Portland ME for a while. It's a great little city but it fairly expensive and when you consider the other costs of living like food, taxes and utilities its down right expensive for the wages.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jwind said:


> I mean maybe a little. You could argue a place like Boston is cheaper than SanFran but I say you are splitting hairs.
> 
> Ya, you can the mid size city thing or small town but even there, prices are far more than they should and there is less work. I lived I. Portland ME for a while. It's a great little city but it fairly expensive and when you consider the other costs of living like food, taxes and utilities its down right expensive for the wages.


One area where California is clearly better than any of the competition is weather. I'm a 4th generation SF bay area native; but I was wrecked by my college years on the central coast and can barely handle our winters. If anything my next move will be south.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> Another "doner state" - we get taxed up heavily and get little in return.


it's tough to leave where your family is from but it seems anywhere outside ny or california, and you get more bang for your buck. ny is a rat race and i'm not crazy about living here anymore.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

JoePAz said:


> Personally I think Phoenix is the best place to live and mtn bike. There are better places to mtn bike if you don't need a job or if you can move around to optimize the seasons. However for most people we have to balance riding with family/job needs.
> 
> Phoenix has alot going for it.
> 
> ...


i have some family in the phoenix area. taxes aren't bad out there which is huge plus in my book. :thumbsup:
as far as the heat and year round sunshine, i'll take that in the second half of my life than living in colder climates or change in seasons. i live on a heating pad in the winter.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

roc865 said:


> it's tough to leave where your family is from but it seems anywhere outside ny or california, and you get more bang for your buck. ny is a rat race and i'm not crazy about living here anymore.


I couldn't careless about the family issue, my problem is I like big mountains as well as sunny beaches. It's a hard combo to leave - never mind the food, culture and everything else. I thought I'd be lynched in a few other states I've visited and I'm a clean-cut white guy!


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> I couldn't careless about the family issue, my problem is I like big mountains as well as sunny beaches. It's a hard combo to leave - never mind the food, culture and everything else. I thought I'd be lynched in a few other states I've visited and I'm a clean-cut white guy!


i see your point but i could leave for lower taxes and if i couldn't afford it.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

Jayem said:


> Life choices. Your friend chose a career that didn't allow for location flexibility. That's his loss. I'd take the cool (literally in the Summer) outdoor-oriented mountain-town of Flagstaff over Phoenix every day and Sunday.


Yes life choices. Most people don't get live their life around Mtn Biking. He loves Mtn biking and so does his wife. Yet with 2 kids under 6 at the time priorities shift. Number 1 was family. Number 2 is Job because you need good job to support the family to level they require. 3) Mtn Biking.

Now a lot of place have been suggested, but for most people they have similar priorities. Mtn biking may be one of them it is not number 1. Living in Bend would be cool. I have been there and ridden there, but to get a job there that is good enough raise a family? And to have a reasonable cost of living? It is one thing if you are single and in your 20's and can focus on biking nearly all the time, but for the rest of us...


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

woahey said:


> Life choices is right. I make a half of what I did in MI living in Sedona. ..


Since I have wife and 6 year old to support that is not an option for me. I do have 35-45 min commute to work, but only 15 min from really nice trails and about 90 min from Sedona.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

michaelscott said:


> I've actually read this whole tread over the last week or so. Wife's parents aren't doing too well and we've talked about where we might move if they pass and we wanted to get out of one of the nicest parts of Southern California (Conejo Valley)
> 
> 1) I work from home 3 weeks out of the month and travel the other week. It would be nice to be my some sort of major airport so I could get to my destination city without a ton of lay overs.
> 
> ...


North Scottsdale might be perfect for you. It is pricey, but I get the impression that you do well enough that it may be ok. The McDowells are right there and there was a 60 mile grassroots race there in December. You can get a place where you can ride right out of the house. Drive is 45 min to the airport, but there is little rain and no snow. Of course there are other places to consider as well, but it sounds like the Phx metro area is worth a look.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

JoePAz said:


> North Scottsdale might be perfect for you. It is pricey, but I get the impression that you do well enough that it may be ok. The McDowells are right there and there was a 60 mile grassroots race there in December. You can get a place where you can ride right out of the house. Drive is 45 min to the airport, but there is little rain and no snow. Of course there are other places to consider as well, but it sounds like the Phx metro area is worth a look.


what are they doing about the pollution problem out there? it's starting to look like LA.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

I don't notice much. Then again I have lived here a long time. There is dust in the air, but it is a desert afterall.


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## shamrok (Aug 2, 2012)

I'm sure there will be some Oklahoma hate - but Tulsa. You have Turkey Mtn in the middle of the city along the Arkansas River, its an assortment of about everything for trails. About an hour north you have Osage Hills in Bartlesville, 20 minutes to the west is Keystone, an hour west is Lake McMurtry. About two hours away in OKC you will have Bluff Creek/Draper/Arcadia/Thunderbird. Two hours east, you can hit Bentonville for Slaughter Pen - Hobbs State Park - Devil's Den State Park. Oklahoma Earth Fellowship has a listing of trails and maps.

Healthcare wise - Tulsa metro has St Johns/St Francis/Hillcrest/OSU Medical - with community hospitals in very close distance to the city (Broken Arrow, Owasso, Sapulpa)

Cheap cost of living, folks are pretty nice, and depending on where you live there is a pretty decent trail system that assists in reaching the rivertrail (which can be ridden to Turkey Mtn) . Downtown has exploded in the past few years, so always something going on.

edit: 6 years later I post.. hope you decided on someplace to live by now - lol


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

JoePAz said:


> I don't notice much. Then again I have lived here a long time. There is dust in the air, but it is a desert afterall.


i was out there a few months back. nice weather but my brother who's lived out there for 15+ years was pointing out the big pollution from CO and that alot of people refuse to accept it. i remember i went out there for the first time in '94 and the air was super clean. than lots of people started to move in.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

roc865 said:


> what are they doing about the pollution problem out there? it's starting to look like LA.


I think they're planning lots more development, same as Colorado. That'll help, right? They build so many houses in these states, nobody wants a used one. In California we only build houses in places with no jobs or nothing else worth noting. We've all got problems.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> I think they're planning lots more development, same as Colorado. That'll help, right? They build so many houses in these states, nobody wants a used one. In California we only build houses in places with no jobs or nothing else worth noting. We've all got problems.


i'll take a used one. the used ones i've seen tend to have alot more space in between houses. the new developments they are building or have built, the houses are on top of each other. i need my space.


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## pedalitup (May 30, 2007)

Northern California hands down.


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## guitarmark (Nov 14, 2007)

Western NC is awesome!!


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

Jayem said:


> You can even ride trails in Flagstaff well into November and usually December, and start riding trails again at the end of March.
> 
> ...based on experiences in CA, CO, MT, and other places.


I'm not sure where your MT experiences were, but that's pretty much our season here in Helena. Semi-arid, 300+ days of sun, and about 4,100 feet. If I'd really been after it this year and cutting out from work during daylight hours, I'd have been riding into mid/late December, too. Our local trails are usually shut down until mid/late March, but there are a few banana-belt places to ride pretty much year-round within 60-90 minutes of here. Excellent trails out the back door, a real economy (i.e. not a resort town), and quality breweries. Not terrible. We chuckle at riders in Missoula and Bozeman, but envy them their restaurants, concerts, skiing and whitewater.

There's give and take with everything. The SLC area has better travel connections, better skiing, a bigger economy, and easy access to the desert SW. If I ever left here, it would probably for the CO western slope.


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## Mrwhlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Some pretty optimistic estimates on average drive times to rides being tossed around. I'd suggest adding at least 20% to anything you read in here .


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

Mrwhlr said:


> Some pretty optimistic estimates on average drive times to rides being tossed around. I'd suggest adding at least 20% to anything you read in here .


That's why I prefer living where I can just go across the street. :thumbsup:


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## JaneDoeRN (Feb 21, 2013)

Tim Easterday said:


> I'm a newbie at mountain biking but I'd agree the north metro ATL area has some good things going for it. I'm just outside of Buford and there are some good trails right here in Gwinnett County, but I haven't been to them yet. They are on the other side of the county and a bit of a pain to get there but I will go sometime. Just an easy 20-minute country drive north of me is Chicopee Woods. We had a blast there and will definitely make this a regular stop. Many, many other trails within an hour or two drive. Wish I had a trail system closer that I could ride to. The biggest negative around here is traffic and you have to plan your life schedule around it.


Hi neighbor! Agree there's lots of epic riding options within a short drive of north Georgia. FATS (Augusta), Tsali (Franklin, TN), Bull Mountain (Dahlonega), & Pinhoti are all close, just to name a few. Athens, Ga is an awesome biking community!


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## Hogdog (Aug 12, 2012)

Coed-Y-Brenin and Coed Llandegla in North Wales (GB), awesome trails and facilities, very well maintained with the bonus of jaw dropping scenery.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

evasive said:


> I'm not sure where your MT experiences were, but that's pretty much our season here in Helena. Semi-arid, 300+ days of sun, and about 4,100 feet. If I'd really been after it this year and cutting out from work during daylight hours, I'd have been riding into mid/late December, too. Our local trails are usually shut down until mid/late March, but there are a few banana-belt places to ride pretty much year-round within 60-90 minutes of here. Excellent trails out the back door, a real economy (i.e. not a resort town), and quality breweries. Not terrible. We chuckle at riders in Missoula and Bozeman, but envy them their restaurants, concerts, skiing and whitewater.
> 
> There's give and take with everything. The SLC area has better travel connections, better skiing, a bigger economy, and easy access to the desert SW. If I ever left here, it would probably for the CO western slope.


helena, mt has 300+ days of day? also how is the healthcare, hospitals, local dr's, and pharmacies? reason i ask is i have some health issues and need access to these things. i don't doubt the clean air that must be there.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

guitarmark said:


> Western NC is awesome!!


i've only heard. greensboro or asheville?


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

roc865 said:


> helena, mt has 300+ days of day? also how is the healthcare, hospitals, local dr's, and pharmacies? reason i ask is i have some health issues and need access to these things. i don't doubt the clean air that must be there.


How many of the 300 sunny days are below freezing? I think it's safe to say AZ will be a lot warmer.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> How many of the 300 sunny days are below freezing? I think it's safe to say AZ will be a lot warmer.


average highs and lows don't look too bad throughout the year even though it's currently 10 degrees.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

roc865 said:


> average highs and lows don't look too bad throughout the year even though it's currently 10 degrees.


Toasty, and I was whining this morning because it'll only be low 60s here today!


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

roc865 said:


> helena, mt has 300+ days of day? also how is the healthcare, hospitals, local dr's, and pharmacies? reason i ask is i have some health issues and need access to these things. i don't doubt the clean air that must be there.


We have a pretty large health care segment here, with both a private and a VA hospital, but the former has had some management problems and a slow-motion drama has been playing out in the newspapers. We'll see if a new CEO changes anything. Among my friends here are a GP, several PTs and OTs, a dentist, a couple pharmacists, etc. - health care is a fairly large segment of the economy. I'm not in any position to comment on the quality, though, having never needed more than routine or urgent care.

edit - oh, you asked about air quality. Depends on where you are. The town is on a pediment, and rises gradually towards the hills on the south. If we get stagnant air or an inversion, it pools in the valley. Where I live is almost always clear. The county instituted an air quality district, and this winter has been pretty good. Nothing like SLC, the front range, or Missoula. Blech. Depending what happens during the fire season, smoke can get bad in the summer. Last summer was bad, as was 2007.



SS Hack said:


> How many of the 300 sunny days are below freezing?


yeah, but it's a dry cold...


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> Toasty, and I was whining this morning because it'll only be low 60s here today!


i need to check out montana. how's the healthcare over there?


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

evasive said:


> We have a pretty large health care segment here, with both a private and a VA hospital, but the former has had some management problems and a slow-motion drama has been playing out in the newspapers. We'll see if a new CEO changes anything. Among my friends here are a GP, several PTs and OTs, a dentist, a couple pharmacists, etc. - health care is a fairly large segment of the economy. I'm not in any position to comment on the quality, though, having never needed more than routine or urgent care.
> 
> edit - oh, you asked about air quality. Depends on where you are. The town is on a pediment, and rises gradually towards the hills on the south. If we get stagnant air or an inversion, it pools in the valley. Where I live is almost always clear. The county instituted an air quality district, and this winter has been pretty good. Nothing like SLC, the front range, or Missoula. Blech. Depending what happens during the fire season, smoke can get bad in the summer. Last summer was bad, as was 2007.
> 
> yeah, but it's a dry cold...


I'll take the dry heat.


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

SS Hack said:


> I'll take the dry heat.


It's all yours. I've worked in the Mojave in August. That was enough.


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## Tim Easterday (Feb 2, 2013)

JaneDoeRN said:


> Hi neighbor! Agree there's lots of epic riding options within a short drive of north Georgia. FATS (Augusta), Tsali (Franklin, TN), Bull Mountain (Dahlonega), & Pinhoti are all close, just to name a few. Athens, Ga is an awesome biking community!


Yeah I should move over to the Athens area if we plan on staying in GA for long. My old company (Cat) is setting up a big facility there.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

evasive said:


> It's all yours. I've worked in the Mojave in August. That was enough.


I was thinking more like higher elevation AZ - not Mojave hot for sure. I prefer my California weather.


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## Tystevens (Nov 2, 2011)

Interesting thread. Lots of good places to live and ride in this great country, to be sure. I need a fairly large population base, so I'm just considering larger metro areas.

My own $.02 -- I can't opine on Arizona or So. Cal, as I've only been there on vacation. But I've lived in Portland, Denver (Boulder), and spent a lot of time in Seattle, all of which are areas noted for their outdoor lifestyle and riding. IMO, SLC, Utah has them all beat pretty handily as far as trail access and variety from a million+ population center. I have lifts, bike parks, fast exercise loops and after work rides, dedicated DH trails, climbs and descents, amazing single track, and an epic 5k ft descent 25 mile ride within 15-40 minutes of my house. And I live on the west side of the valley (opposite side from most of the riding). Not to mention the other rec opportunities -- world class skiing 35 minutes away, and most people don't know that a couple wilderness areas actually border the city, which is pretty unique for a metro area this size. Great hiking, snow shoeing, and all of that -- you can be 7 miles from the city as the crow flies, and feel like you are really in the middle of nowhere. We are also just 4 hrs from all that Moab, Fruita, and St. George have to offer.

Portland and Denver have some great trails and riding areas, which are probably comparable with SLC as far as quality, but you have to drive twice as far to get to them.

SLC isn't really that cold and snowy, at least compared to a lot of places that aren't So. Cal, So. Arizona, or So. Nevada. Yeah, we get some cold and some snow, but it is usually not around too long, at least in the valley. Most years we have a solid 9 month riding season. 

I'm not saying it is the best place in the country to live and ride, but I'm not moving anywhere else!


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## 11053 (Sep 19, 2009)

"Mountain biking" means so many different things.
Depending on your definition of quality mountain biking, what's great for you could suck for the next guy.
I need to be next to a lift assisted bike park. When park season is on, I need to be able to hit the lifts for my daily ride.
Lots of places offer great pedaling and fun trail systems, but for me it needs to be a mountain town with lift accessed DH.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

roc865 said:


> average highs and lows don't look too bad throughout the year even though it's currently 10 degrees.


40 degrees in Anchorage!


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

I remember the NYT did an article about splitboarding with Jeremy Jones 4-5 years ago. He took a SLC metro bus up one canyon, hiked up to the divide, and rode down into the next canyon where he caught another bus home. Not many places you can do that.


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## Tim Kriksciun (Mar 6, 2013)

San Diego, CA is a great place to live. Some areas have trails, though not a lot of mountains there.


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## roc865 (Jun 29, 2009)

Tim Kriksciun said:


> San Diego, CA is a great place to live. Some areas have trails, though not a lot of mountains there.


if i had the money i could make the sacrifice of not alot of mountains for perfect weather all year round.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Tim Kriksciun said:


> San Diego, CA is a great place to live. Some areas have trails, though not a lot of mountains there.


Enough trails around to keep us happy though, in my opinion anyway...


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## Ninjaterratr (Mar 6, 2013)

I live in St. George UT and there is some great riding down here. You don't realize what you have until you leave. Its right next Gooseberry Mesa and it has some great downhill riding. It depends on your riding style, but St. George has it all


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## montananate (Jan 21, 2009)

evasive said:


> I'm not sure where your MT experiences were, but that's pretty much our season here in Helena. Semi-arid, 300+ days of sun, and about 4,100 feet. If I'd really been after it this year and cutting out from work during daylight hours, I'd have been riding into mid/late December, too. Our local trails are usually shut down until mid/late March, but there are a few banana-belt places to ride pretty much year-round within 60-90 minutes of here. Excellent trails out the back door, a real economy (i.e. not a resort town), and quality breweries. Not terrible. We chuckle at riders in Missoula and Bozeman, but envy them their restaurants, concerts, skiing and whitewater.


Are trails in Helena really opening up by mid to late March usually? I was born and raised in Missoula, but have since lived in Minneapolis, MN / Portland, ME / Bellingham, WA / back to Missoula for 3 years / Currently in Seattle, and am thinking about moving home (Montana) for good, but also researching other mountain biking cities. I absolutely love the riding in Missoula area, but the winter can linger and there is nowhere near 300+ days of sun, so I've been considering other options. Bozo also has great riding, but again, its a shorter season. I've always liked the riding in Helena, but didn't think the season was quite as long as you are suggesting, just didn't know I guess. In the summer, I always enjoyed a Saturday morning drive over to Helena, parking in that dirt lot by Blackfoot Brewing, some solid riding, having a pint and picking up a Growler at Blackfoot and heading home. I can't say I love the town with respect to restaurants and nightlife as you mentioned though.


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

Yeah, they are. I've ridden the Ridge in late March (2007, the year the Lochsa ran on St. Paddy's), although that's unusual. I've also ridden both the Ridge and Mac Pass in late November, both of which were remarkable. But in general, I expect some trails to open in March, depending on aspect, geology, and weather. East side of Mount Helena, for example. Others that are shaded and poorly drained take longer, obviously, and are about a month behind the drier ones. The problem with the South Hills is that they mostly face north, and have foot traffic packing the snow all winter, so the hills may be clear everywhere BUT the trails. 

I know the Blackfoot very well. It's hard not ending rides there.


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## montananate (Jan 21, 2009)

evasive said:


> Yeah, they are. I've ridden the Ridge in late March (2007, the year the Lochsa ran on St. Paddy's), although that's unusual. I've also ridden both the Ridge and Mac Pass in late November, both of which were remarkable. But in general, I expect some trails to open in March, depending on aspect, geology, and weather. East side of Mount Helena, for example. Others that are shaded and poorly drained take longer, obviously, and are about a month behind the drier ones. The problem with the South Hills is that they mostly face north, and have foot traffic packing the snow all winter, so the hills may be clear everywhere BUT the trails.
> 
> I know the Blackfoot very well. It's hard not ending rides there.


Blackfoot IPA .... and it's variations they only pour at the brewery, are my favorite beers in the state, it's a perfect cap to a hard ride for sure!

Great info, I honestly never thought about the riding season being longer there, but it makes sense. I'm back in Montana the first week of April..... I better bring my bike and hope for some early season riding!


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## McBen (Dec 29, 2012)

I think the best place to live and to mountain bike is in Romania. Check this out : Mountain bike trips - Cycling in Romania presented by mtbtrips.com - Film Dailymotion


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## Trex1955 (Nov 19, 2011)

*MSN, Redding CA makes "Top 10 mountain towns in the USA"*

That's right little old Redding CA made the list this year...One Pic says it all my fellow bikers, skiers, boat lovers, river rafting people!







​
From the overlook one can see Mt. Shasta, Shasta Lake, and Shasta Dam...below the dam on the eastside is 19 miles of single track, four trail heads, with many miles of old mining roads, and connecting trails. Best time to ride is fall, winter, spring, summer can be a on the hot side.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

I am seeing lots of Fruita/GJ stuff. Don't get me wrong the place is really cool to visit. But I just felt like I rode most of it really fast. Now each trip we have to decide which trails to ride again. I live close enough to Park City to go there a lot and there are ENDLESS trails. Even the "so-so" areas are pretty darn fun. And for the continued trail building, every year there will be new adventures. Every biking publication ranks Park City as the best in the country...they all can't be wrong.


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## Tystevens (Nov 2, 2011)

The Park City area is pretty awesome for riding, that is for sure. The only problem is a relatively short season -- most of the really good stuff may only have a 5-6 month window of availability. But there is plenty to do in the winter!

Although, I guess I can't say that I'm able to ride new trails every time I am up there -- over the last 5 years I've managed to hit most of them that I want to ride. But there is a lot of variety, with the added bonus of having lift served bike parks and a couple more "free ride" oriented trails nearby as well. Plus, Moab is only a few hours away.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

Tystevens said:


> The Park City area is pretty awesome for riding, that is for sure. The only problem is a relatively short season -- most of the really good stuff may only have a 5-6 month window of availability.


That and much of the trail is comparatively boring compared to the near by desert. If you into weaving you way up the side of mountain with relative ease grab your HT 9er and you'll be in 7th heaven. If you like a little more grit in your riding, it's really not the place.


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## Lawson Raider (Jul 24, 2006)

I been applying for IT jobs all over the place and SLC is up there as my #2 place I want to live in - Grand Junction being the first.


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## schraderlp (Apr 23, 2012)

Wherever you are.


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## AndyD66 (Mar 12, 2013)

Definitely not Park city.. Um, 

We are all full anyways.

It's expensive... Liquor and atheism are not allowed, it's to sunny in the sumer and snowy in the winter, there's way too many dogs and people just stop at every corner to clog up the trails talking about lame mountain things, and there's so many races it's like a reality adventure triathlon base camp , and and and the music is just blaring constantly from all the competing free concerts and don't even get me started on the damned distillery taking up the parking on main street all night, and the local brewery consortium keeps the good mega brews off the shelves, and it's like an entire half a day to get to Moab or Jackson, and the climbers and rafting types are stinking up the coffee shops, and christ but yoga is like the national sport for these skinny sex-ed up women and every other man and woman here is goddam ski patroller or some kind of retired olympian, ****sake they outlawed fast food restaurants within like seven miles of town and the traffic is so crazy at both stoplights every night when the Salt Lake people drive home you have to take the free city bus everywhere, even out to the commie "people's healh clinic" where you have to practically wait in line behind all the other rotater cuff and acl rehabs, and there's a whole campus resort that hosts something like three thousand wounded warriors a year just zooming around making us lazy people look soft on the slopes and trails and don't even get me started about the fly fishing nutcases, and every body who isn't and olympian is growing some organic vegetable **** or selling grass fed beef on the damn street corner between the musicians and all the kids play the violin by age 7 in this giant orchestra program or they shred backcountry pow in little screaming gangs and the whole town is covered in dog hair and there's not even a Target or any franchise chain of any kind in fact for like 37 miles and and and..as for biking the 3rd toughest stage race section in road racing is not even on the top five list of challenging rides for the average real estate agent here and sure there is some "world class" mountain biking in any five minute direction from Main Street but it's all scattered between downhill courses and long moderates and people think Strava racing up "Puke Hill" is oh so cute after a hellish saturday night at the distillery and the other dozen cheap mountain dive bars on main street and every damned trail is half uphill anyway and the lifts are only open for like six hours a day to take us old guys up to the main mid mountain trail and sure you can ride through 4 or 5 again "world class", whatever that means, ski resorts before lunch without seeing pavement in your binoculars but there's not even any jeep clubs or tourist hating local bike shop monopolies and it isn't even usually hotter then 80 degrees, and that Redford guy is always hanging around with his indie film hippie friends. so, yeah, um,

I dunno: probably best if you just stick with a Denver apartment and weekends in Boulder or try Seattle or join the Marines and try to get stationed at 29 Palms or get a nice place behind the trains in Flagstaff or something. Maybe even Vermont?

Really, you'll be happier


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## Trex1955 (Nov 19, 2011)

Funny stuff Andy D66!!!!
I think that I ran into three other bikers on Tues. Over 11 miles of the FB trail, above Keswick.


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## jrodsadventures (Mar 25, 2013)

I do not know if anyone has mentioned it but Sacramento, Ca is pretty awesome. I moved to Dallas, Tx a year ago but I lived there for 18 years. 
It's fairly temperate, you can ride year round if you can take a month of bad heat (August)and are willing to wear a little rain gear in the spring from time to time. I was a full time commuter for a few years and loved it. If you can get a place next to the bike trail (Google American River Bike Trail & check it out on Google Earth) you will have a great time.
Almost all the hospitals are within a mile or two of the trail and the public transit system has bike racks on all buses and light rail in case you are not near the trail you can get to an entry point quickly and easily. 
The trail itself was built by the Army Corp of Engineers and is top quality asphalt, smooth as a race track and there are Mountain Bike trails that run parallel. You can ride from downtown Sacramento to Folsom Lake and never have to encounter a street. You are under canopy most of the time and the distance is 23 miles one way, I believe. Once at Folsom Lake you can pick up a mountain bike trail that will take you into the Sierra's.
Tahoe is an hour away, there are numerous trail in the foothills. Legendary Downieville is a couple hours north, Napa is an hour west and San Francisco is an our and a half south west. All of these places have great riding and if you want to drive a little further you have Santa Cruz and the mid-coast.
SLC and Denver are a quick inexpensive flight of a couple of hours.
Healthcare employment is huge there and the cost of living is affordable by California standards and there is no danger of earthquakes in the valley. 
I plan to return as soon as is reasonably feasible.
*


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## Zaf (Mar 1, 2012)

Alice Springs, Australia.

The town is surrounded by the most amazing single track in the world. The real beauty is accessability, you ride for 10mins from your front door and you hit the trails. There's nowhere else like it, and it's a really hard thing to give up once you're used to it.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

This thread should have photos of trails to go along with the sale's pitch. I especially like seeing them from other parts of the world.


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## Borges21 (Mar 2, 2013)

I live in Santiago, Dominican Republic and I love it, anywhere u go there are trails and mountain areas
Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2008)

No perfect place and if there was it would have 12 million people and high taxes like California destroying its perfect status


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## ScottsdaleHokie (Mar 28, 2013)

Jaybo said:


> No perfect place and if there was it would have 12 million people and high taxes like California destroying its perfect status


Haha, every time I go to San Diego I think, boy it would be nice to live here, then I remember, oh yeah, it's California, never mind.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

It ain't that bad.


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## Scottie5150 (Mar 10, 2004)

Jaybo do you mountain bike as well? 

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

ScottsdaleHokie said:


> Haha, every time I go to San Diego I think, boy it would be nice to live here, then I remember, oh yeah, it's California, never mind.


No worries, we're all filled up anyway. It truly does suck to live in such a horrible place ...


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## 007 (Jun 16, 2005)

SS Hack said:


> No worries, we're all filled up anyway. It truly does suck to live in such a horrible place ...


Yup. It's terrible . . . everyone should GTFO.


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## BigRingGrinder (Jan 9, 2013)

The perfect weather is a lie as well. Its only perfect when tourists are here, the rest of the time its bad. Real bad.

Plus.... California is gona fall into the ocean next earthquake.

You dont wana live here.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

BigRingGrinder said:


> The perfect weather is a lie as well. Its only perfect when tourists are here, the rest of the time its bad. Real bad.
> 
> Plus.... California is gona fall into the ocean next earthquake.
> 
> You dont wana live here.


All the fit women are also paid models brought in from better states at great expensive to keep up appearances. The mountains and beaches are all fake as well. The threat of an earthquake every 25 years is very had to live with - you guys that get tornados and hurricanes a couple times a year have it so easy.


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## PerfectZero (Jul 22, 2010)

BigRingGrinder said:


> The perfect weather is a lie as well.


The weather here blows. I mean, it rained here yesterday sorta.


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## 007 (Jun 16, 2005)

SS Hack said:


> All the fit women are also paid models brought in from better states at great expensive to keep up appearances. The mountains and beaches are all fake as well. The threat of an earthquake every 25 years is very had to live with - you guys that get tornados and hurricanes a couple times a year have it so easy.


Seriously! At least with tornados and hurricanes, you see that **** coming for days!



PerfectZero said:


> The weather here blows. I mean, it rained here yesterday sorta.


Yeah . . . totally ruined my ride.


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2008)

Gouda Cheez said:


> It ain't that bad.


No California has some sweet places! San Diego is one of them. But I am just not a million people plus city kind of guy. Great weather though...


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## BigRingGrinder (Jan 9, 2013)

Living in a big city hardly means you are required to move into the downtown skyscraper district. I avoid downtown SD like the plague, no way in hell id actually LIVE there.

Every city, San Diego included, has fringe suburbs with that small town feel. Less than an hour out of downtown you can hit sections of SD where you would hear the sweet strains of deliverance being plucked from a banjo if you rolled your window down to listen (i wouldn't recommend this.... drive fast with windows up).


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

BigRingGrinder said:


> Living in a big city hardly means you are required to move into the downtown skyscraper district. I avoid downtown SD like the plague, no way in hell id actually LIVE there.
> 
> Every city, San Diego included, has fringe suburbs with that small town feel. Less than an hour out of downtown you can hit sections of SD where you would hear the sweet strains of deliverance being plucked from a banjo if you rolled your window down to listen (i wouldn't recommend this.... drive fast with windows up).


No you're wrong, all of California is just like LA. Stay away.


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## getagrip (Mar 26, 2008)

ScottsdaleHokie said:


> Haha, every time I go to San Diego I think, boy it would be nice to live here, then I remember, oh yeah, it's California, never mind.


I'm originally from San Diego. Grew up there but left over 20 years ago for Nebraska. Great weather, Mexican food, and road biking, but I hate the traffic and everything that goes with it...nice place to visit, but definitely would not want to live there!


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## getagrip (Mar 26, 2008)

BigRingGrinder said:


> The perfect weather is a lie as well. Its only perfect when tourists are here, the rest of the time its bad. Real bad.


Try living in Nebraska for a Winter. You might change your mind about that...


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

I think you might have missed his sarcasm.


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## BigwheelsRbest (Jun 12, 2007)

NOT London, UK


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## 007 (Jun 16, 2005)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I think you might have missed his sarcasm.


That was NOT sarcasm.

(shhhhhh . . . . you're ruining it!)


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

My bad. He's right. Southern California is America's armpit.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Gouda Cheez said:


> My bad. He's right. Southern California is America's armpit.


Yes, correct; now we'll recall the population control van that was on it's way to your location.


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## LaXCarp (Jul 19, 2008)

I just applied for a job in Bend, OR, really hope I get it


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

BigRingGrinder said:


> Living in a big city hardly means you are required to move into the downtown skyscraper district. I avoid downtown SD like the plague, no way in hell id actually LIVE there.
> 
> Every city, San Diego included, has fringe suburbs with that small town feel. Less than an hour out of downtown you can hit sections of SD where you would hear the sweet strains of deliverance being plucked from a banjo if you rolled your window down to listen (i wouldn't recommend this.... drive fast with windows up).


True kinda, being real close to the ocean means that morning fog and cool but not cold temps all the time. It's literally perfect (visited my brother a bunch of times, and he lived about a block from the ocean south of Coronado). Sun in the afternoon. Warmest ocean temps in CA. It's honestly great weather most of the time in that location...

But, you don't have to move very far inland before you're out of the sea-influence and it's miserable hot in the summer. You are also quite a bit further from the trails usually with those more "perfect" climate areas, yet there are obviously trails and it's not phoenix-hot either. Living in the SD area is not what I described in my first paragraph for most people that live in/around SD.


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## Exxodus1 (Apr 1, 2013)

Rotorua, New Zealand or

Queenstown, New Zealand

depending on your poison; XC or downhill


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jayem said:


> True kinda, being real close to the ocean means that morning fog and cool but not cold temps all the time. It's literally perfect (visited my brother a bunch of times, and he lived about a block from the ocean south of Coronado). Sun in the afternoon. Warmest ocean temps in CA. It's honestly great weather most of the time in that location...
> 
> But, you don't have to move very far inland before you're out of the sea-influence and it's miserable hot in the summer. You are also quite a bit further from the trails usually with those more "perfect" climate areas, yet there are obviously trails and it's not phoenix-hot either. Living in the SD area is not what I described in my first paragraph for most people that live in/around SD.


The main thing about California is that if you want to live well or even OK, be prepared to pay like no other. I know other areas of the state with near perfect weather that are very close to great trails; but you need to be committed to the cause and pay the price (money, energy and hassle). It works best for natives as we are somewhat delusional and often can't envision living anywhere else.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

SS Hack said:


> The main thing about California is that if you want to live well or even OK, be prepared to pay like no other. I know other areas of the state with near perfect weather that are very close to great trails; but you need to be committed to the cause and pay the price (money, energy and hassle). It works best for natives as we are somewhat delusional and often can't envision living anywhere else.


I'm not a native but am already delusional after 3 years of living in SD.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I'm not a native but am already delusional after 3 years of living in SD.


You're on your way to being an honorary native I think.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Hey, I'm just happy to be here.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Gouda Cheez said:


> Hey, I'm just happy to be here.


Me too, location is everything in life.


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## BigRingGrinder (Jan 9, 2013)

Ok, enough back patting for living in para*/$#@cough&$*/ I mean the worst place in the world. Where are we all riding this weekend?


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

I still need to buy a damn bike. 

One of these days... goal is to have my homework done by the time we move into our house early this summer. Then bike time... Hopefully.


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## 007 (Jun 16, 2005)

Gouda Cheez said:


> I still need to buy a damn bike.
> 
> One of these days... goal is to have my homework done by the time we move into our house early this summer. Then bike time... Hopefully.


I'll have a SC BlurLT for sale by then. Its in superb shape! :thumbsup:


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## opiate82 (Aug 28, 2012)

Now I am not exactly a world traveler when it comes to mountain biking, but I have ridden at different locations up and down the west coast, but I always settle on my home town:

Bellingham, WA

Bellingham has Galbraith Mountain, which constantly shows up on "Best non-lift-accessible trail systems in the U.S." lists in magazines, and it lives up to the billing. You could ride Galbraith every day of the season and never get board. But if you do want a change of pace there are several other awesome trail networks within a 30-45 minute drive. Also, you are close enough to Whistler (and the rest of the great B.C. riding areas) to make a day trip up there if that is your thing.

Along with that, Bellingham has a very pro-bike local government and a really awesome and proactive mountain bike club in the area. You have a hospital, major university and a lot of refineries for employment opportunities. There is also a military base less than an hour away.

The cons are that you don't get a year round riding season (but there is great skiing to keep you occupied during the winter) and even though we don't have a state income-tax, the state government has pretty much found every other way possible to tax you in WA, so cost of living still ends up being on the high end.

Housing in Bellingham never suffered the bubble-burst like the rest of the country (because it is such a popular place to live/retire) so prices are high. However, if you head out to the county or 30 minutes south to Mount Vernon/Burlington you can find great prices and are still a short drive to most of the trail networks.

Also there are 3 local breweries that will blow away anything you can find national/regionally. (Beer is a big concern of mine when it comes to choosing a place to live  )


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

opiate82 said:


> Now I am not exactly a world traveler when it comes to mountain biking, but I have ridden at different locations up and down the west coast, but I always settle on my home town:
> 
> Bellingham, WA


Never been to bellingham, but it looks freakin awesome. Just watched the movie "Pedal-Driven" which is on netflix and there is a segment on Bellingham, definitely a good movie.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

For the point about San Diego: 
I grew up there and LOVED it. Best city in the country. BUT they don't get mountain biking at all. A large number of official trails are fire roads. A good amount of the in town ST are just cut by locals off those roads. The dirt there trends from sand to hard-pack with little ball-bearing-like pebbles that make traction murder. SD has HUGE potential if the city would get off their butts about it. Right now, it's a great city that you can drive to good trails.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

That's the truth right there.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

opiate82 said:


> Now I am not exactly a world traveler when it comes to mountain biking, but I have ridden at different locations up and down the west coast, but I always settle on my home town:
> 
> Bellingham, WA
> 
> ...


Sounds great, hopefully global warming will fix the weather up.


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## Earthpig (Jan 23, 2004)

Boise. No contest. High desert climate (dry, no humidity, but not southwest hot), 130+ miles of trails literally out the back door, affordable housing, low unemployment, 2 hours from Sun Valley (site of the last 2 XC nationals), little to no traffic (I commute 15 miles in 20 minutes or less), a vibrant and growing music scene, arts/culture (if that's your thing), a new whitewater park in downtown (if that's your thing), a decent airport, an 8 hour drive to Moab/Fruita, a local ski hill with 1700 feet of vertical and three high speed quads that sells passes for $229 and is developing a quality singletrack trail system of its own, nearly year-round mountain biking conditions (sometimes time-of-day dependent in the winter), a committed group of trail builders (SWIMBA), a community that values open space and trails, the only state in the nation with a specialty vehicle license plate with a mountain biker on it (sales go to trail building), low-ish taxes, low utility rates, a top #10 1-A college football team, good schools (Boise school district), oh....I could go on and on. There may be better places to live and better places to ride, but there is no better place to live AND ride in the US. So, sorry to the rest of the US.

Ridge to Rivers - City of Boise
Our Mission | SWIMBA - Southwest Idaho Mountain Biking Association
Home | Mountain Bike Idaho
Boise Valley Economic Partnership - Attracting, Expanding and Relocating Businesses to Southwestern Idaho

Disclaimer- I'm on the board of the local chamber of commerce and economic development group. And I ride 5 days a week. Because that's how Boiseans roll.


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## johnlh (Aug 16, 2008)

If you can tolerate the windy season that spans from early January to late December, then Wyoming is pretty nice. No state income tax, remote trails with no people, and some decent offerings for skiing.

I have taken several trips to Bellingham, and would much rather have cold, windy conditions than 40 degree, rainy conditions. 

There are a number of pretty good threads on this subject if you do a search. Are you unhappy in Washington?


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## Earthpig (Jan 23, 2004)

johnlh said:


> If you can tolerate the windy season that spans from early January to late December, then Wyoming is pretty nice.


Just re-read this. That's funny stuff right there!


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## GnarBrahWyo (Jun 4, 2012)

Maybe not the BEST place to live, but an often forgotten prime location is southeastern Wyoming. Curt Gowdy State park and Vedauwoo are within 40 miles of Laramie and Cheyenne and feature more than 100 miles of singletrack. Most of the northern Co people come up here and admit Cheyenne>Ft. Co in terms of LOCAL trails.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Earthpig said:


> Boise. No contest. High desert climate (dry, no humidity, but not southwest hot), 130+ miles of trails literally out the back door, affordable housing, low unemployment, 2 hours from Sun Valley (site of the last 2 XC nationals), little to no traffic (I commute 15 miles in 20 minutes or less), a vibrant and growing music scene, arts/culture (if that's your thing), a new whitewater park in downtown (if that's your thing), a decent airport, an 8 hour drive to Moab/Fruita, a local ski hill with 1700 feet of vertical and three high speed quads that sells passes for $229 and is developing a quality singletrack trail system of its own, nearly year-round mountain biking conditions (sometimes time-of-day dependent in the winter), a committed group of trail builders (SWIMBA), a community that values open space and trails, the only state in the nation with a specialty vehicle license plate with a mountain biker on it (sales go to trail building), low-ish taxes, low utility rates, a top #10 1-A college football team, good schools (Boise school district), oh....I could go on and on. There may be better places to live and better places to ride, but there is no better place to live AND ride in the US. So, sorry to the rest of the US.
> 
> Ridge to Rivers - City of Boise
> Our Mission | SWIMBA - Southwest Idaho Mountain Biking Association
> ...


Excellent PR and image. Have they reduced the number of militias yet?


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## Earthpig (Jan 23, 2004)

SS Hack said:


> Excellent PR and image. Have they reduced the number of militias yet?


Good one. Wrong time zone and part of the state. (North Idaho has two seasons - winter and July.) The only "militia" you'd see in Boise is a horde of happy mountain bikers. Pic is on one of the newer singletrack trails on the ski hill, a 20 minute drive from town.


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## modiolus (Sep 16, 2008)

Disregarding the realities of a job and economics that may make the below irrelevant to any particular individual, to me there are 5 components that help objectify (as much as possible) a truly great mountain biking town:

1. Trail accessibility (from one's house, for example)
2. Trail content (variety, scenery, trail mileage, "fun-factor")
3. Ready accessibility to other good mountain bike towns (within 2 hours/3 max)
4. Climate/COMFORTABLE year-round riding (of the majority of the area's trails, not just it's foothill floor)
5. Town characteristics and vibe

A great mountain biking town, while perhaps not scoring at the very top in any one area, scores high in all of them, and I think I can count on one hand the number of towns that qualify and most are in the Southwest.


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## dfiler (Feb 3, 2004)

I ain't say it's best but I'm really enjoying riding in Pittsburgh, yes Pittsburgh.

Within a few blocks of my house exists ludicrously good single track and a bar with 1000 beers. On the daily I ride out my door after work and then head to the bar with whatever bikers I came across.

Here's some video from my ride on Tuesday. This all within city limits! And there are many other parks as well. 
Frick Sampler - April 23rd 2013 - YouTube


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## rustybkr (Mar 30, 2010)

Pittsburgh looks like fun.


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## Jamesm925 (Apr 17, 2013)

i grew up in pittsburgh. no thanks. drinking/tail gaiting is the local sport. people throw bottles at you if they see you riding in lycra.

can't really say much about mountain biking other than the fact that 1,000ft does not = a mountain (and that's assuming you drive 70+ miles to the hidden valley/7 springs area).

pittsburgh is the land where clouds go to die. nuff said.


Boulder, Colorado or anywhere along the front range (springs, boulder, golden, fort collins) is pretty rad. you can easily ride 40-50 miles of single track across a wide variety of trail types.

with the exception of this past month, the snow typically melts the next day and doesn't linger in that dirty eastern seaboard slush.

the sun is hotter at 5300ft. so 40F in the sun feels about 10-15F warmer.

%4.3 flat state income tax rate.

outdoor adventure land without the mormon influence/annoyance. dry, but we still have grass and green trees and flowing rivers/streams along the trails.

you're actually riding real mountains with several miles of descents and climbs.


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## dfiler (Feb 3, 2004)

Funny, I grew up in Colorado and moved to pittsburgh and prefer the terrain here. To each their own. 

I lived a block off of north table in golden for a year, a block off of south table for two, and a few blocks from lookout mountain for a few. Before that I lived in alamosa for many years and suffered from having no hills higher than the river dike. The trails are great but I prefer the technicalness of rocky rooty twisty trails littered with log overs and log skinnies surrounded by sight line blocking trees and bushes. 

In both locations bigger mountains were less than an hour away. But here there are amazing trails that vary every few feet. On the weekends I go Downhilling but during the week there is a freeride trail in north park along with a dirt jump park, all officially authorized. Our indoor park opened this year too so I don't have to drive to rays in Cleveland. Dirtrag is based here and last night I was riding with one of their guys reviewing a decked out Bronson. Dirtrag's dirt fest is already sold out and should draw at leat two thousand people this year. 

Rain can be annoying but the silver lining is that my dermatologist doesn't have to keep lecturing about exposure after giving my latest biopsy results. 

But like I said, tastes vary. Most people tend to excel and prefer the trails they are used to. Colorado is great for riding so please don't think I'm insulting it. It is just a matter of preference. 

Both places have changed greatly. Golden now has a mountain bike park too if you're into jumping. Pittsburgh is no longer all about tailgating and throwing bottles at riders. It's now a medical, university and high tech industry town. We've got on-street bike corals, a bike bar, an outdoor velodrome, and bike greenways along every riverfront. Another bike bar is opening this year. Trails now stretch unbroken from dowtown to Washington DC! The bike share program should start next year. One of the two hot metal bridges is now a multi million dollar pedestrian bridge and the rankin hot metal is scheduled for that as well. East end brewery's keg rides now tow four kegs through the streets and limits that ride to 650 riders. 

Amazing changes are happening for bikers all across the country!

(Edited to insert more detail)


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## dfiler (Feb 3, 2004)

To illustrate the different tastes... If you can ride 40 or 50 miles of single track in a day, that single track is too sanitized for my tastes. I prefer technical trails that ruin people before they get to 40 miles. 

But for people used to smooth trails, they'd be rightfully annoyed by getting beat up over shorter distance. They would prefer to haul ass over a greater distance, never slowing down for rock gardens, log stunts or twisting around tight tree lined trails. Picking your line through morain littered terrain isn't appealing to some.


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## joebike (Oct 11, 2004)

East Tennessee has a lot to offer, great trails and mild weather that lets you ride year round. We have both dam controlled rivers like the Ocoee and free flowing creeks as you progress in the sport. Close to North Georgia and North Carolina trails and rivers. Last but not least, you can drive over to West Virgina and run the Gauley and New River, just to name a few.

Sorry for sounding like the Chamber of Commerce.


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## pow77 (Aug 5, 2010)

Great thread,
Im planning to spend a year somewhere different and am looking for somewhere that has great mountain biking but also good skiing and snowboarding. Instead of hijacking this tread I have started a new one to get some ideas of good areas with biking and skiing/snowboarding. So if your a skier/snowboarder I would love some ideas. Thanks
http://forums.mtbr.com/passion/great-mounatin-biking-sking-locations-852885.html


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## highrustler (Jul 27, 2004)

pedalitup said:


> Northern California hands down.


Where in NorCal? I've been in Boulder for too long...


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## 5power (Jul 26, 2010)

Mint video!!! I dig Pittsburgh spent some time working there last year and the trails are a awesome. What's great is the distance to other trails, state college, raystown, WV, even OH has some dope trails. Rays is sooo much fun, DH at seven springs, snow shoe. I also love the forest of the east coast, the rocks, the seasons.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

This thread went dead. We need more submissions. What about places outside of the USA? 

I think there are lots of places in Europe, South America and New Zealand, but does anyone think it's easy to get a job in those places?


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Crumbling eastern cities ... don't we need "mountains" for "mountain biking"?


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## MTBNate (Apr 6, 2004)

PHeller said:


> This thread went dead. We need more submissions. What about places outside of the USA?
> 
> I think there are lots of places in Europe, South America and New Zealand, but does anyone think it's easy to get a job in those places?


I'm in Stuttgart, Germany. Not much single real single track locally (hella bike roads & beer gardens though), but - excellent riding within 2-3 hrs in the Alps.


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## Island20v (Apr 22, 2013)

From the places I have lived:
Honolulu, HI
San Diego, CA
Portland, OR
Bellingham, WA

I'd really like to get up into the Vancover, Cananda area and spend some more time up in Big Bear, CA.


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## uglyguy2 (Jun 20, 2012)

Funny thing about this thread, I don't think anyone ever heard from the OP ever again, haha.


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## ucdengboss (Apr 4, 2012)

DJ Lieb said:


> I'll throw a vote in for my little town of Auburn, CA. 30 miles above Sacramento and sits at about 1,500 ft, so you can ride year round. 50 + miles of great trails from downtown(5 miles away), and many trails you can access from neighborhoods. A ton of lakes and 1 hour to Tahoe, 45 minutes to Northstar, and 80 miles to Downieville.
> 
> The town is very big into the outdoors and endurance racing.


^^^+1... From Sacramento


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

This place hasn't been bad so far.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

Alaska?


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

michaelscott said:


> Alaska?


Yup. Summer has been off the charts.


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## 90minIPA (Apr 13, 2010)

I live in Phoenix and yes, we have great metropolitan riding but I spend quite a bit of time in Colorado in the summer and really enjoy the towns of Crested Butte and Telluride for their vibes and riding. I am kinda sick of clear melanoma skies and relentless heat, especially since I have many of these days off. Don't plan on spending one day here when it is above 80 when I retire ... came down to town to buy some building supplies and was rudely reminded of the heat and traffic ... and rise in blood pressure ... love riding in the aspens and long brutal mountain climbs...... love walking/riding bikes to stores/businesses and parking the truck. So if you're working in a big city yea Phoenix has good riding but if you have a choice ... I like riding in the Aspens........ for year round ridin' I would pick somewhere on the central coast .. Santa Cruz ...(big redwoods blocking the sun) others ... Western North Carolina is definitely on my bucket list. So if you're retired would you pick Phoenix????? Nah ............ If you're working Phoenix is great for a metro area ... don't know another with such great access and variety .... makes for community of skilled riders..


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## steelhmr (Sep 30, 2011)

Obviously not going to say it's the best, but Pittsburgh, PA is very solid. You can enjoy city living while still being a stone throw away from great trails. In the center of the city is Frick Park and there are 15+ miles of trails. My avg ride is 90 minutes with 1500' of climbing. Short, fast downhills and technical terrian for an overall aggressive XC classification (probably). Within a 30 min drive are at least 8 parks with awesome trail networks in each. Within 45-60 minutes you can get to some more mountainous, rocky terrain out east. 90 minutes and you get even better trails further east and also into WV. As for Pittsburgh itself, it's a great, affordable city to live in with lots of academic and professional opportunities. Also, all of the riding here is in the forests under the cover of foliage.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

I was in Pittsburgh a month or so ago for work. Took a taxi from the airport to downtown at around 5pm ish and the driver asked if he could take the side roads because the freeway would have lots of traffic.

Probably passed half a dozen trail heads and they had a bunch of cars/trucks with bike racks on all of them. Downtown looked pretty nice too. I was really surprised at how much riding it looked like there was and locals were telling me that there was a big push to revitalize downtown and the government was trying to focus on bike culture.


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## Ivan67 (Aug 23, 2013)

I was medically retired out of the Army back in 2004, and the best place I have found to live in on my bike just traveling. Barely any bills, no address and pure fun. Been in Europe since then.


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## AMjunky (Apr 29, 2013)

I would say anywhere west of the Rockies. Used to live in SoCal in OC, within biking distance of the Holy Jim trail. Also had the Santiago truck trail and Whiting ranch real close, Aliso Woods in Laguna Beach. However hands down the best trail there was the San Juan trail – 12 mile single track climb and descend, nothing short of heaven on earth. 

It seems that the west coast has amazing riding just about everywhere. Now that I live in the east I still have good fun riding but it does not even compare, I have wet dreams of riding in the west again.

As far as outside the US, I would have to say the Alps and the Dolomites in Italy. Although I read UK mtb mags sometimes and the trails in good ole England look great too.


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## seandm (Mar 18, 2004)

90minIPA said:


> like riding in the Aspens........ for year round ridin' I would pick somewhere on the central coast .. Santa Cruz ...(big redwoods blocking the sun) others ...


Having lived in the bay area for most of my life and moving here to phoenix metro during the dotcom boom, I would pick phoenix any day of the week. Yes it is hot for 5-6 months of the year, but phoenix doesn't have the congestion, pollution, crime, high cost of living, etc that the bay area has. It would take 2-3 hours to get to santa cruz on the weekend from San Jose.

Besides Phoenix tends to have a slower pace of life and one can go 45 min from the edges of town and be in complete wilderness and not see a single soul.

Of course if the mountains of Colorado were an option, I would take that over phoenix in a heartbeat.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

seandm said:


> Having lived in the bay area for most of my life and moving here to phoenix metro during the dotcom boom, I would pick phoenix any day of the week. Yes it is hot for 5-6 months of the year, but phoenix doesn't have the congestion, pollution, crime, high cost of living, etc that the bay area has. It would take 2-3 hours to get to santa cruz on the weekend from San Jose.
> 
> Besides Phoenix tends to have a slower pace of life and one can go 45 min from the edges of town and be in complete wilderness and not see a single soul.
> 
> Of course if the mountains of Colorado were an option, I would take that over phoenix in a heartbeat.


Phoenix has the 2nd worst air quality in the nation after LA. The Bay Area is somewhere around 25. Crime is also higher in Phoenix. It is cheap!


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

SS Hack said:


> Phoenix has the 2nd worst air quality in the nation after LA. The Bay Area is somewhere around 25. Crime is also higher in Phoenix. It is cheap!


And at least you can drive to places in relatively short order that are radically different than the city in the Bay Area. Cactus and rock is all that phoenix is, but in the bay area you can get to redwoods, scrubby oak, open grassy areas, coastal cliffs, wetlands, etc, all within the city area, vs driving 2+hrs north or 4hrs east from Phoenix. Hey, phoenix does have some good riding 5ish months out of the year, even though it's already 80 degrees during much of that, but I don't think people move to Phoenix to get away from congestion or bad air quality...hehe.


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## seandm (Mar 18, 2004)

Jayem said:


> Hey, phoenix does have some good riding 5ish months out of the year, even though it's already 80 degrees during much of that, but I don't think people move to Phoenix to get away from congestion or bad air quality...hehe.


I am not necessarily referring to the city of phoenix, rather the metro area. I live out on the outskirts in the desert, and rarely venture into Central Phoenix.

I moved here to get away from the high cost of living in the bay area and slowdown a little as i was getting on in my years. Sure i could have moved to Turlock or Tracy, but that would have been even worse IMHO.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

seandm said:


> I am not necessarily referring to the city of phoenix, rather the metro area. I live out on the outskirts in the desert, and rarely venture into Central Phoenix.
> 
> I moved here to get away from the high cost of living in the bay area and slowdown a little as i was getting on in my years. Sure i could have moved to Turlock or Tracy, but that would have been even worse IMHO.


117° 

Well yeah, but if you lived on the edge of the bay area more towards a rural area, the same would apply, right? The cost of living is much cheaper in Arizona, no contest there. The air quality is going to be "better" on the edge, but I can't tell you how many mornings I took off and saw a huge brown cloud extending from the phoenix area and far to the west/east, well past the city areas. (I flew out of Prescott) Big time inversion, it's dust, particulates, pollutants like ozone, and it's just nasty, especially when you see it from a ways off. Not as easy to "see" when you're in it, from experience. Just be careful, they recommend you do not exercise on some days and my dad picked up Valley Fever down there and it's been hard for him to shake completely, my parents moved away after just 2 or so years down near Apache Junction.

Saying that one has to drive 3hrs to mountain bike in santa cruz in the bay area is like saying one has to drive to flagstaff or the white mountains to mountain bike in phoenix, which is not the case, there are multiple city/municiple parks around both cities with lots of trails, in fact they are very similar in that way.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Jayem said:


> 117°
> 
> Well yeah, but if you lived on the edge of the bay area more towards a rural area, the same would apply, right? The cost of living is much cheaper in Arizona, no contest there. The air quality is going to be "better" on the edge, but I can't tell you how many mornings I took off and saw a huge brown cloud extending from the phoenix area and far to the west/east, well past the city areas. (I flew out of Prescott) Big time inversion, it's dust, particulates, pollutants like ozone, and it's just nasty, especially when you see it from a ways off. Not as easy to "see" when you're in it, from experience. Just be careful, they recommend you do not exercise on some days and my dad picked up Valley Fever down there and it's been hard for him to shake completely, my parents moved away after just 2 or so years down near Apache Junction.
> 
> Saying that one has to drive 3hrs to mountain bike in santa cruz in the bay area is like saying one has to drive to flagstaff or the white mountains to mountain bike in phoenix, which is not the case, there are multiple city/municiple parks around both cities with lots of trails, in fact they are very similar in that way.


Yep, except where is the ocean down there?


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## AZ (Apr 14, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> Yep, except where is the ocean down there?


Big Surf.


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## woahey (Sep 1, 2010)

seandm said:


> Having lived in the bay area for most of my life and moving here to phoenix metro during the dotcom boom, I would pick phoenix any day of the week. Yes it is hot for 5-6 months of the year, but phoenix doesn't have the congestion, pollution, crime, high cost of living, etc that the bay area has. It would take 2-3 hours to get to santa cruz on the weekend from San Jose.
> 
> Besides Phoenix tends to have a slower pace of life and one can go 45 min from the edges of town and be in complete wilderness and not see a single soul.
> 
> Of course if the mountains of Colorado were an option, I would take that over phoenix in a heartbeat.


Wow. Do you work for Phoenix Chamber of Commerce?


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## seandm (Mar 18, 2004)

woahey said:


> Wow. Do you work for Phoenix Chamber of Commerce?


Why yes I do, what gave it away?


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## seandm (Mar 18, 2004)

Jayem said:


> 117°
> 
> Well yeah, but if you lived on the edge of the bay area more towards a rural area, the same would apply, right?


Where does this rural area exist? It takes about 2-3 hours of driving just to get out of the metro bay area and then pretty soon you are in stockton/sacramento area. Out here you can ride from your door in some parts and be in some pretty remote areas within 30 minutes.

Not trying to argue which is better, just saying that Phoenix metro area is not all that bad having lived in the Bay Area for 27 years and here for 16. I was against it when i first moved here, figured it was just tumbleweeds and tweakers.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

seandm said:


> Where does this rural area exist?


Do you realize how much of a generalization "the bay area" is? There are lots of places up North of SF, East, SE and in other places that are "rural" enough that you don't have to drive into SF or pass over a bunch of bridges for anything. Whether or not you can find work might be somewhat of an issue, but it's a huge area with lots of nooks and crannies as far as places to live. You can easily live more on the "outskirts", maybe more towards the coast, maybe more towards the northern areas, SE foothills, maybe more towards Los Gatos, etc. I mean seriously, you're going to tell me you can live on the "outskirts" of Phoenix where you don't have to drive through the city and deal with that stuff all the time, but not the Bay Area? Sure you can. It just takes the same imagination to do so. And again, the Bay Area is one of the few places that has an amazing amount of "parks"/open areas in the area for riding, which is a pretty nice thing to have.

I'm not one for fighting it out with thousands or millions of people that want to do the same thing, but wait until you ride South Mountain in Phoenix on a winter sunday, lol. It's really no different IMO, and yes, I've ridden several places around the Bay Area.

But, Phoenix does have some great places to ride nearby, which is nice in the short winter-time. I find the riding season is too short there, whereas places at moderate altitude are more "year round" Milder in the summer, not as cold as ski destinations in the winter, long "in between" seasons that allow for lots of riding, no real times of the year when you can't go out. If you have to live in a huge city or near one, at least you can get up to Flagstaff or the White Mountains.


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## seandm (Mar 18, 2004)

Jayem said:


> Do you realize how much of a generalization "the bay area" is? There are lots of places up North of SF, East, SE and in other places that are "rural" enough that you don't have to drive into SF or pass over a bunch of bridges for anything. Whether or not you can find work might be somewhat of an issue, but it's a huge area with lots of nooks and crannies as far as places to live.


Have you lived there? I have and I know the area like the back of my hand. I knew the nooks and crannies and it takes alot of time just to get anywhere in that town. Some weekends it would take 5-6 hours or maybe more to get to the Sierras. Take the 101 any day of the week to go from Palo Alto to South San Jose and then tell me Phoenix has worse traffic. Go to East Palo Alto or downtown Oakloand and then go to south Phoenix and then tell me which area is worse.

I find it funny that you are fighting me over the Bay Area vs Phoenix when you lived in Prescott and now you reside in Alaska.


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## woahey (Sep 1, 2010)

seandm said:


> Why yes I do, what gave it away?


Talking about how Phoenix is not congested, low pollution, low crime... I haven't spent a hell of a lot of time in the bay area, but every time I go to PHX, I can see the orange haze from a good ways away, especially at night. My wife and I went to buy her car from a dealer in the Chandler area (I think...can't keep all the 'burbs straight) and it took us 3 hours to get from 101 and 60 to 101 and 17. Thankfully, I haven't witnessed or been a victim of any crime down there...

Having said that, it seems as a lot of people like it there. It is one of the fastest growing metro areas in the nation. In the 10 years that I have been in AZ, I've witnessed a huge amount of growth, new highways being built, and open desert becoming another ticky-tacky boxed community.


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## someoldfart (Mar 14, 2013)

I live ride and ski in Whistler. End of thread.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

seandm said:


> Have you lived there? I have and I know the area like the back of my hand. I knew the nooks and crannies and it takes alot of time just to get anywhere in that town. Some weekends it would take 5-6 hours or maybe more to get to the Sierras. Take the 101 any day of the week to go from Palo Alto to South San Jose and then tell me Phoenix has worse traffic. Go to East Palo Alto or downtown Oakloand and then go to south Phoenix and then tell me which area is worse.
> 
> I find it funny that you are fighting me over the Bay Area vs Phoenix when you lived in Prescott and now you reside in Alaska.


Visited my grandma all the time there, and from there we'd launch into SF and other places. Frequented Oakland and then later Napa. I used to live in Dixon, so we'd go to the bay area quite frequently. Later when we lived a little higher up in the foothills, we'd go down on the weekends to go fishing on our boat, so yes, I have spent quite a lot of time there 

BTW, it takes 4hrs 20 minutes to get from Phoenix to Sunrise ski resort and that's if everything is perfect and for "mid-valley" locations.  Don't even get me started on how bad Snowbowl can be when it's crowded from everyone in Phoenix and NAU, it's not unrealistic to wait for 45min-hr to get on the lift, but Sunrise is further away, so you're kind of damned either way.

You are right though, living in the Bay Area to ride in the sierras is stupid. You simply can't get out of the metro area that easily and it's not worth it for a short weekend usually. That's why you stay more local and have fun in the local parks. That's why it's a metro-area for people that like to ride, rather than the many big metro areas across the country that had pathetic or no riding available. Then there's Mendicino and Santa Cruz with some places in between, and that's what you ride outside of your local parks, but you've got all sorts of great places to ride nearby, you don't have to drive 4hrs, just like someone in Phoenix doesn't have to drive 4hrs to get up in the high country, unless you just can't deal with 117°.

Wait till you're on the I-17 and it's just stopped/shut down for hours due to some accident or situation.

The thing I find amusing is that all the things you're claiming are an issue with the Bay Area are all significant issues with Phoenix, and all the things that are supposedly "better" are available in the Bay Area too, as long as you're not living in some ghetto apartment in the middle of the city, but I wouldn't do that in Phoenix either.


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## djyoung4 (Dec 29, 2012)

I've lived in Phoenix my whole life. The trails here are great but when summer comes I usually end up getting up at 4 am to go riding. Its just so hot otherwise. When it monsoons though its nice and there's great nightlife areas. Driving isn't really that big of a deal and you can get to empty desert within a half hour. I live in Tempe though which is a pretty friendly biking area. The Green Belt is great to just go mess around on. South Mountain has endless miles of trails it seems too. Its got technical downhilll or flat fast trails. 
The two to four months of non-stop heat and the growing pollution are really the only issues I feel. I remember as a kid being able to see for miles but now its tough to see anything. Sedona is only a two hour drive away though and there is world class riding there unlike anywhere else.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

We keep talking about the Bay Area like its all just like San Jose during the Friday rush hour at 5pm. The Bay Area is pretty diverse in terms of towns and cities. I live 22 mile from San Francisco and I can ride out my door to near wilderness and beaches are just 30 minutes away. There is vast open space and empty beaches 30 to 45 minutes from Facebook HQ. You can also ride all year here. The main problem is in the Bay Area you really must "pay to play"; you're best off pulling down major money to live well here. AZ seems more affordable. The future will only bring higher costs along with more traffic and pollution as they continue to build more and more houses down in AZ. So, don't worry you guys in AZ will catch up to us! Off course your weather will only get hotter and I doubt you'll be building any beaches soon. I'm not at saying the Bay Area is the best place to live and ride. It's not bad if you need a high paying job, however.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It's the type of place you move to when you get offered a job there, you get really picky about where you live, and when the job dries up, you bolt and regret leaving for the rest of your life.


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## In-Yo-Grill (Jul 19, 2011)

Dwight Moody said:


> I hope you are being sarcastic. Welfare pays well under $1,000 a month, even with kids. You'd have to skip buying anything about half a year to afford a 4,000 bike. While you might get subsidized housing and food stamps on top of other things, you can't spend that stuff, the money is never in your hands.
> 
> Most illegals are working a heck of a lot harder than most of us.


Then let them contribute to the tax system.

Thanks to God I live in Texas although we are slowly giving more "rights" to illegals every year. Sorry I can't continue this conversation folks, I've got a lot of people on welfare depending on me.


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## dfiler (Feb 3, 2004)

In-Yo-Grill said:


> Then let them contribute to the tax system.
> 
> Thanks to God I live in Texas although we are slowly giving more "rights" to illegals every year. Sorry I can't continue this conversation folks, I've got a lot of people on welfare depending on me.


Seriously? You're restarting an off-topic argument from six years ago?

Take deep breaths and instead tell us about how awesome the trails are where you live.


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## HTswede (Sep 19, 2013)

dfiler said:


> I ain't say it's best but I'm really enjoying riding in Pittsburgh, yes Pittsburgh.
> 
> Within a few blocks of my house exists ludicrously good single track and a bar with 1000 beers. On the daily I ride out my door after work and then head to the bar with whatever bikers I came across.
> 
> ...


I have to agree. I just moved here and have been pleasantly surprised by quality trails so close to the city. Frick Park is excellent; quality trails inside the city. I just need to learn how to string the trails together.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

In-Yo-Grill said:


> Then let them contribute to the tax system.
> 
> Thanks to God I live in Texas although we are slowly giving more "rights" to illegals every year. Sorry I can't continue this conversation folks, I've got a lot of people on welfare depending on me.


You do have a lot of welfare case down there don't you?


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

*Auburn, CA.*

Def Auburn!

My Orthopedic surgeon loves the confluence and he doesn't ride... 



ucdengboss said:


> ^^^+1... From Sacramento





DJ Lieb said:


> I'll throw a vote in for my little town of Auburn, CA. 30 miles above Sacramento and sits at about 1,500 ft, so you can ride year round. 50 + miles of great trails from downtown(5 miles away), and many trails you can access from neighborhoods. A ton of lakes and 1 hour to Tahoe, 45 minutes to Northstar, and 80 miles to Downieville.
> 
> The town is very big into the outdoors and endurance racing.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

*Stuttgart, Germany*

I lived there in the early 90s, great riding in the Swabish Alb, decent from our apartment in Leinfelden, awesome in Kitzbuhl, St Anton and Lake Garda (Italy)

Lots of lift serviced riding back then in Zell am Zee and crazy downhill in Kaprun.



MTBNate said:


> I'm in Stuttgart, Germany. Not much single real single track locally (hella bike roads & beer gardens though), but - excellent riding within 2-3 hrs in the Alps.


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

I like the title of this thread. It's simple and basic. It also creates a good thread to read for anyone who travels and considers exploring other areas to ride as vacation destinations.

The other cool thing (from reading just a few recent posts) is many people are impressed with the areas they live and ride. That's pretty cool; Kind of like we all win. 

I'll put a plug in for Colorado as for rigorous terrain, serious uphill battles and for a nice mix of multi-season riding weather and scenery. Most of my local rides begin at 6800 feet and I'll admit to not having done much riding at temps below 25 f.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

This is not 1 ultimate place. Weather changes and prohibits ridding in some. Some seasons are better than other depending on where you are. Do you desire to ride the whole time or do you have other sports - winter, water? Other "ideal" places come with $$$ baggage.

An online job, RV and the desire to move around is the best place to live & MTB year round.


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## Mr. D (Jun 1, 2008)

how does one look for potential online employment.


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

Mr. D said:


> how does one look for potential online employment.


I've been in software development for awhile, plenty of jobs, and I'm full telecommute. Live in Crested Butte, but take "working vacations" so basically I can travel, live in different locations and don't have to take time off. I must say, Sedona/Flagstaff is probably one of the best spring locations for mtn biking that I've been to. Hoping to spend some time up in Bend, OR this summer.

Like others have said, there isn't just 1 ultimate destination, but many really cool places out there to experience. I still have yet to experience a place that is as good as Crested Butte in the summer though.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

BDKeg said:


> I still have yet to experience a place that is as good as Crested Butte in the summer though.


You just gave it away. There aint anything better in the summer, but I'm sure there are places in Mexico or Belize that are pretty nice in the winter.

That's the rub. All the places that really truly have "California Weather with Mississippi Prices" are either not in this country, are hours away from the nearest job, or flat.

I'd love to live in Florida, if it had mountains.

I'd love to live in Puerto Rico, if it were safe.

I'd love to live in Belize, ya know...I just might. Haha.


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## CodeJockey (Dec 23, 2013)

First off, this thread has been a blast to read. A lot of really insightull contributions over the YEARS (!)

I'm 36 and was born and raised in Columbus, Ohio. We have some good organizations in the area and the state as a whole has some great trails. But as I get older and get more and more tired of getting shut indoors from mid November through early April (with occasional relief in March that might last a day or two), I've decided it's time to move. This is actually a battle I've been "fighting" with my wife for almost 15 years, and one I thought I'd lose. But the last several years she's started to really recognize the toll the cycling off season has on me (depressed, grumpy, etc).

So a few months ago we set out to decide where we're off to. We literally pulled up Google maps and started searching.

Our requirements:

- Good schools
- Job opportunities for a teacher (her) and a Software Engineer (me - I currently telecommute, but I need the security of local backup).
- 365 cycling (in other words, weather that doesn't go to absurd extremes)
- MTB variety within reasonable driving distance, strong local trail presense

That about sums it up. Our short list (some of which violate one or more requirements):

- Phoenix, AZ
- Denver/Boulder, CO
- Ft. Collins, CO
- Salt Lake City / Park City, UT
- Dallas, TX
- Austin, TX
- Greensboro, NC
- Sacramento, CA
- Boise, ID
- Seattle/etc, WA

Phoenix was my top choice until I came to terms with the pollution problem and the fact that, of the four of us, I'm the only one who'd really be able to tolerate the heat. CO is amazing, but skiing is no substitute for cycling for me and the cost of living gets pretty nuts when you get near the good schools. WA won't cut it in the winter. Western NC has some amazing trails (really want to ride Wild Turkey), but job opportunities for me are a little thin unless we go to the Raleigh or Charlotte areas (in which case, we're no longer in Western NC). The Bay Area is just too expensive and Boise has squat for IT jobs.

We applied our criteria harshly. I mean, we're starting with a blank slate so we may as well be picky little eaters.

We were left with Austin and Dallas. Certainly not the most impressive trail systems in the country, but with very tolerable winters (it's 70 degrees all week this week!) the riding is virtually 365 days/year. Unlimited job opportunities for me (and presumably for her), and a lot of riding diversity within a day's drive.

Austin is allegedly a bit more laid back (although a bit more expensive) and the climate is a bit more consistent. It also bases us in the closer to the San Antonio, where the trails start showing variety from "woods riding."

So that's where our thinking is at the moment. We're prepping the house to put it on the market in the next month or two, and once the kids are out of school, we're outta here. Probably to Austin, but always open to suggestions!


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## Mookie (Feb 28, 2008)

CodeJockey said:


> Our short list (some of which violate one or more requirements):
> 
> - Phoenix, AZ
> - Denver/Boulder, CO
> ...


SLC was on your list. Did you fully investigate IT jobs there? I'm not in iT but I think there are some to be had in the area.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'd add Santa Fe or Los Alamos/White Rock areas. Most would steer clear of those areas but with your backgrounds in technology and hers in teaching, you might have an easier time finding something in New Mexico's "intellectual" capital.


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## CodeJockey (Dec 23, 2013)

Mookie said:


> SLC was on your list. Did you fully investigate IT jobs there? I'm not in iT but I think there are some to be had in the area.


I looked very hard at SLC, but the short-ish riding season was a deal breaker. It's a great city for IT, though.



PHeller said:


> I'd add Santa Fe or Los Alamos/White Rock areas. Most would steer clear of those areas but with your backgrounds in technology and hers in teaching, you might have an easier time finding something in New Mexico's "intellectual" capital.


I looked at ABQ and Santa Fe, but there isn't a very string job market for me.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

I'm in IT and we live near Folsom Lake. We moved here primarily for schools and to be "closer" than the Bay Area to Tahoe for skiing. I was 80/20 road/MTB then and now I'm 80-90% MTB and only ski on BIG powder days (not since xmas 2012). Decent MTB "training" around Folsom Lake, very good in Auburn, Downieville and all of Tahoe in the summer. We still make trips to the Bay Area for MTB; Demo, Skegs, etc... It does get hot in summer but in 1hr I can be at the HITG trailhead... 

We ride 365 and ski when it dumps...



CodeJockey said:


> I looked very hard at SLC, but the short-ish riding season was a deal breaker. It's a great city for IT, though.
> 
> I looked at ABQ and Santa Fe, but there isn't a very string job market for me.


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## Jwind (Mar 1, 2006)

CodeJockey said:


> CO is amazing, but skiing is no substitute for cycling for me and the cost of living gets pretty nuts when you get near the good schools.


I'm in software as well. I was in your shoes not terribly long ago. I love, love, LOVE the riding in the desert SW. Sadly, the tech economy just isn't that great down that way anywhere. PHX is about as good as you are going to get. I ended up in Denver. Lots of work here and the cost of living is way reasonable when compared to other tech economies of size.

The weather in CO is vastly misunderstood and likely the last remaining reason why the front range isn't the size of LA . The mountains have a pretty long Winter, but the front range is a whole different story. It'll snow but it very rarely hangs around. It'll get cold but again, it'll very rarely stick around. There's no real "off season" as much as there is a "slow season". You'll be faced with a very similar situation in a place like PHX due to the heat FWIW.

This was made over the last few days in December. Not typical weather but not terribly atypical either.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

CodeJockey said:


> I looked very hard at SLC, but the short-ish riding season was a deal breaker. It's a great city for IT, though.


We ride Mountain bikes from March through late October here. Not sure how that's a short riding season. Many many mtb'ers live here and love Utah. Plus in SLC you're 4-5 hours from St. George (should be independently on your list), Moab and Fruita. Lots of easy weekend getaways in the Winter.

Micron/Intel and Adobe are big companies with a major presence here.

Our public schools are ok. We have our kids in local charter schools and they are amazing. Lots of those around.

You really should check out St. George Utah. Not sure about IT jobs there.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Silentfoe said:


> You really should check out St. George Utah. Not sure about IT jobs there.


I applied and interviewed for a job out in St. George. As I got deeper in reviewing aspects of the town, I found more and more residents disappointed with lack of gathering places that were not churches or chain restaurants. The area seemed to lack brew-pubs and micro-breweries, bars or community activities. Some residents felt a constant underlying LDS presence in politics, some felt that town had "less spiritual diversity" than say SLC, just because it was a smaller city. I plan to spend a few nights there and form my own opinions this spring.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

^^^^ Brew pubs? I thought Utah did not allow any brews over 4%. Deal breaker for me.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Alright, I"m going to say it, MA, North of Boston. I have 15 miles of trails 200 yds from my driveway. 60 miles of trails within 20 minutes pedaling distance. Many more with 20 - 40 minutes driving. Big mountains, no, world class trails, yes. 45 minutes drive to Boston, 1 hour to beach 2 hours to skiing. Great beer and cultural scene, world class hospitals, schools and great employment opportunities. Active mt biking scene and clubs. Are there better places to just mt bike, by far. Best place to mt bike and best place live, this works for me, YRMV.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

leeboh said:


> Alright, I"m going to say it, MA, North of Boston. I have 15 miles of trails 200 yds from my driveway. 60 miles of trails within 20 minutes pedaling distance. Many more with 20 - 40 minutes driving. Big mountains, no, world class trails, yes. 45 minutes drive to Boston, 1 hour to beach 2 hours to skiing. Great beer and cultural scene, world class hospitals, schools and great employment opportunities. Active mt biking scene and clubs. Are there better places to just mt bike, by far. Best place to mt bike and best place live, this works for me, YRMV.


^

all it is missing is big mountain climbs and extended downhills. but the riding around i-495 toward beantown, and generally all of eastern mass, is 100% grade A beef gristle. and you can link up a bunch of spots with 4-8 mile road hops. I mean most MTB rides for me are 35 miles so kicking 8 miles of pavement between riding spots is no big deal...if you can hammer here you can hammer anywhere. for hills though and hill fitness, we gotta do a patented roadie loop through Arlington which can supply the thousands feet of climbing needed in a series of steeps. that or out to Harvard Ma and loop the apple orchards

many riders have left the area, moved away, and lamented the loss of serious fun and varied MTB riding this place provides. many famous spots elsewhere become bore fests because variety and technical skills needed is lacking.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

Fort Collins (where I live w/ my family) would be real strong for schools (Poudre Schools District) and IT with riding most of the year.
Fat tire bikes now used when there is snow on the ground.

Better riding in the Fruita, CO area however and year round but schools and IT not as solid.

Sedona/Flagstaff/Prescott, AZ has amazing year round MTB. You just move up or down in elevation depending on time of year and weather. It doesn't get closed out in the winter like alot of Colorado. You need to be picky with schools in AZ as a whole.

I'd say you need to do a trip in the winter and check the areas then to get a feel for the worst vrs when the weather is great.


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

127.0.0.1 said:


> ^
> 
> all it is missing is big mountain climbs and extended downhills. but the riding around i-495 toward beantown, and generally all of eastern mass, is 100% grade A beef gristle. and you can link up a bunch of spots with 4-8 mile road hops. I mean most MTB rides for me are 35 miles so kicking 8 miles of pavement between riding spots is no big deal...if you can hammer here you can hammer anywhere. for hills though and hill fitness, we gotta do a patented roadie loop through Arlington which can supply the thousands feet of climbing needed in a series of steeps. that or out to Harvard Ma and loop the apple orchards
> 
> many riders have left the area, moved away, and lamented the loss of serious fun and varied MTB riding this place provides. many famous spots elsewhere become bore fests because variety and technical skills needed is lacking.


as long as people enjoy where they live. i couldn't do the east coast as i'm a cold weather wimp and like the big mountain riding (live in socal). 
socal really is a great spot, year round warm riding and big descents (dozens, probably hundreds of descents > 3000 vertical, some as high as 8000. i really like all up, then all down rides and we got alot of those. and also very technical terrain. but ain't MB great, so many good spots to explore.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

Bend OR has year round riding. Mtns in the summer and desert in the winter.



brentos said:


> Some good ones:
> 
> Hailey, ID
> Ogden or Salt Lake, UT
> ...


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

*St. George Smith*

St George isn't named after St George of Dragon fame, it's named after St. George Smith. Great place to ride and visit, I hear.



PHeller said:


> I applied and interviewed for a job out in St. George. As I got deeper in reviewing aspects of the town, I found more and more residents disappointed with lack of gathering places that were not churches or chain restaurants. The area seemed to lack brew-pubs and micro-breweries, bars or community activities. Some residents felt a constant underlying LDS presence in politics, some felt that town had "less spiritual diversity" than say SLC, just because it was a smaller city. I plan to spend a few nights there and form my own opinions this spring.


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## 29er4ever (Jan 8, 2013)

I have had to make vigorous exercise a regular part of my life, as heart-disease and diabetes are rampant in my family. Mountain biking is one of the few things I can do 3-4 times a week and not get bored with it, so for me, year-round accessibility to interesting trails is vital. I live in the Phoenix area, and 10 months out of the year I take my bike to work with me in my vehicle and then hit trails on the way home in the early evening. My comfort level is between 50° and 95° (low humidity makes all the difference in the world), and there are only a few times a year I have to cancel due to weather. June or September may require picking the evenings in the week with “cooler” temps to avoid riding in 100° heat. During July and August I still get in weekend rides at sunrise, or I head north to Prescott, Sedona, or Flagstaff. 

I have ridden in the St. George area as well, and they have some great trails in the area. I grew up in a very small town, so the small-town attitudes are something I have lived with. The accessibility to the whole southern Utah area would be very appealing if employment were less of a concern. Although I would not have thought weather there was that much different from much of AZ, I was a little surprised at how much weather affected trail accessibility and ridability. Accumulated snow would take a long time to melt off and dry before some of the trails could be ridden. Other trails were just inaccessible because of muddy or washed out roads. 

I have ridden a few trails in SLC and Denver areas, but the older I get the less tolerant I am of the cold weather (having lived a few miles from the Arctic Circle in the 80’s). If you are into winter sports as well, then either of those would let you choose your activity based on the season.

For me Phoenix has been ideal because there are so many trails within the metropolitan area. Another 10 or years and I will be thinking about where to retire, and if I don’t stay in Phoenix I would look in the Precott/Sedona/Flag area. As others have stated, you just change your elevation with the season.

I am glad that so many people find their respective areas the best place to be, so that we don’t all have to fight over the same trails.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

leeboh said:


> ^^^^ Brew pubs? I thought Utah did not allow any brews over 4%. Deal breaker for me.


You can fine bars and breweries in UT plus there is higher % beer to be had. it usually cost more. Devestator is a great bottle example. Moab has a sweet brewery w/ higher alcohol pours. Still very restricted for the most part however, and most all people visiting to ride bring their own hooch.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

i spent some time their 2 weeks and would agree. for it's size, it's dead. no downtown action at all. of course Cafe Rio restaurant was packed. alot of retirees live in the are but don't mind the quite. kinda a bummer that UT has such amazing country and riding yet is locked down by the church. Park City and Moab seem to be the only loose cities in the state and they were both mining camps.



PHeller said:


> I applied and interviewed for a job out in St. George. As I got deeper in reviewing aspects of the town, I found more and more residents disappointed with lack of gathering places that were not churches or chain restaurants. The area seemed to lack brew-pubs and micro-breweries, bars or community activities. Some residents felt a constant underlying LDS presence in politics, some felt that town had "less spiritual diversity" than say SLC, just because it was a smaller city. I plan to spend a few nights there and form my own opinions this spring.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

Sayulita, Mexico is an amazing town and amazing place to live for the winter months. Almost zero rain, 80s day, 60s night. Jungle riding all over the place.
2 years ago, I spent the whole winter there.
MTB, hiking, dirtbiking or going to the beach every day.
Had solid fast Internet for work back in the US.

I'm working on dialing in my life (i'm a contractual/seasonal tour guide & work online) so I spend every winter there. Summer in the Colorado mtns. Fall on the California coast and Spring in Moab or Sedona.

It's not rocket science, but you have to completely control your debt and bad spending habit. Stop spending B.S. $ on B.S. things you don't need that the stupid TV tells you need. Be content with older gear and maintain it well. Driver an older & paid for vehicle and maintain it yourself or barter to have it maintained. Shop for used clothing and stuff; let someone take the huge depreciation hit. "The latest" = no $ in your pocket. Make coffee at home, ditch cable TV, share wifi cost w/ a neighbor, learn to barter, don't drink like a fish at the bar $$$, closely watch your restaurant budget, ride your bike to save on gas $... Take that $ and invest in yourself: see the world, ride your bike more & work alot less! If you don't, you then need to work your whole life and give it up to someone else for their control over you.



PHeller said:


> You just gave it away. There aint anything better in the summer, but I'm sure there are places in Mexico or Belize that are pretty nice in the winter.
> 
> That's the rub. All the places that really truly have "California Weather with Mississippi Prices" are either not in this country, are hours away from the nearest job, or flat.
> 
> ...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

eakins said:


> I'm working on dialing in my life (i'm a contractual/seasonal tour guide & work online) so I spend every winter there. Summer in the Colorado mtns. Fall on the California coast and Spring in Moab or Sedona.
> 
> It's not rocket science, but you have to completely control your debt and bad spending habit. ...Take that $ and invest in yourself: see the world, ride your bike more & work alot less! If you don't, you then need to work your whole life and give it up to someone else for their control over you.


You could be debt free and have minimal spending and still not have two months every year to run away from a job. Unfortunately, most American employers are slow to give vacation time. 2, 3, 4, hell even 6 weeks isn't enough for some, but unfortunately the vast majority don't get any paid vacation.

This means that you either retire early, are self employed, or take a salary hit working contract job 8 months out of the year.

Personally, I live pretty frugal, but I also make just slightly below the national average full-time salary (you can find it with a good search).

I could be debt free and putting half my income into retirement and I'd still be waiting 20 years before I could retire early.

That's 20 years of searching to find a place to ride year round, 20 years of hoping you keep your job, 20 years of hoping you last 20 years.

I'd rather live in paradise today than hope and dream for 20 years. The trick is getting the job, the flexibility, the safety, missing the family, and doing it.


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## CraigCreekRider (Apr 12, 2007)

29er4ever said:


> I am glad that so many people find their respective areas the best place to be, so that we don't all have to fight over the same trails.


Amen. No place is perfect for everybody.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

CodeJockey said:


> We were left with Austin and Dallas. Certainly not the most impressive trail systems in the country, but with very tolerable winters (it's 70 degrees all week this week!) the riding is virtually 365 days/year. Unlimited job opportunities for me (and presumably for her), and a lot of riding diversity within a day's drive.
> 
> Austin is allegedly a bit more laid back (although a bit more expensive) and the climate is a bit more consistent. It also bases us in the closer to the San Antonio, where the trails start showing variety from "woods riding."
> 
> So that's where our thinking is at the moment. We're prepping the house to put it on the market in the next month or two, and once the kids are out of school, we're outta here. Probably to Austin, but always open to suggestions!


Ouch, methinks you need to expand your horizons a bit. Oppressive heat and humidity are the common theme in the summer, winter means an occasional storm blasting down from Canada to drop temps and snow/ice (I was caught in the ice-storm in December that dropped 3-6" of ice around Dallas, it was insane, warmer back in my home state of Alaska at the time). Don't forget about the ticks in the summer time. I could never get past that part riding in that part of the country, but to each his own I guess. My parents live around Austin and besides being stationed near that area in the Army, I've been pretty much all over Texas. It's a huge state, but no "varied" riding within reasonable riding distance. No big mountains (again, within any reasonable distance), no way to easily get out of the climate during those oppressive summers or the winter ice-storm. If you haven't ridden there in the heat of summer, think about when you open the oven and that hot air rushes out, it's kind of like that. Phoenix is similar, but it at least doesn't carry the humidity most of the year. You also get the severe thunderstorms to deal with part of the year too, and so on. I know a lot of people like Texas, but I've never found any redeeming quality that has made me want to go back. I have to travel back there for work every few months, but it's depressing ending up in a sea of flat with few real pristine areas.

Some of those other suggestions aren't great of course, like Sacramento, mentioned earlier, kind of a "no-man's-land", pretty much anywhere that you are locked in a big city and not near riding, Phoenix possibly due to how oppressively hot it is and the pollution, and so on. But maybe you can expand your horizons a bit? What about communities away from these cities, but not quite in "nowhere"? What about Santa Fe? What about Front Range? Many of these do not get snow like in Tahoe or other places where it just piles up, the more arid high altitude places have much more sublimation and the snow just doesn't really "stay around" at the lower altitudes. There's the foothill cities in California, the Bay Area stuff that is a little away from the main population areas, but closer to riding, Bend, heck even the Seattle area where there are various rain-shadows to choose from and riding on the backside of the Cascades closeby (so you can get away from rainy seasons), and that's just West Coast stuff. On the East Coast there are amazing places from Maine down the coastline, places with decent sized mountains and amazing riding.

Texas isn't hell, you can ride a bike there, but it's no place to enjoy the outdoors and be physical growing up IMO. Quality of life will be so much better in many places, even if you make a little less and don't have access to 11venty billion super-walmarts nearby.


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

best of luck on your excuses why your life is not working for you today.
the need for "safety" holds you back on living. it's bull **** as life is not a safe experiment.



PHeller said:


> You could be debt free and have minimal spending and still not have two months every year to run away from a job. Unfortunately, most American employers are slow to give vacation time. 2, 3, 4, hell even 6 weeks isn't enough for some, but unfortunately the vast majority don't get any paid vacation.
> 
> This means that you either retire early, are self employed, or take a salary hit working contract job 8 months out of the year.
> 
> ...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

eakins said:


> best of luck on your excuses why your life is not working for you today.
> the need for "safety" holds you back on living. it's bull **** as life is not a safe experiment.


What do you do for a living that gives you so much time off?


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

Rural Northeast....

Most of my life I've lived in the rural, small town, NE. Trips out West do leave me longing for the big moutains and wide open spaces. When I wind-down professionally I'd like to move to the Rockies. For now however, the rural NE has a lot to offer that other areas may not.

Employment - distances are not as great between where to work and where to play. For example, my home in my small town is two blocks from the Hospital where I work. Trail systems are anywhere between a 5 and 20 min drive from my house. As distances are close, there is good job opportunity, especially in healthcare. The volume of older, sicker, Americans out East is greater and there is plenty of work in that field (as long as taxpayers and the middle class will continue to fund it!) Healthcare is in need of IT workers so that is an opportunity as well.

Home/land prices... Very reasonable. 20 minutes from my home we have 20 plus acres next to a huge piece of public land. It was cheap to buy and is my home base for riding from on long weekends. My wife and kids camp on it.

Woods.... Most of us call the "outside" the "woods". Anyway, there is a lot of room to play in the woods. The last place I lived in PA, I was in 325,000 acres of state forest which was connected to 3 or 4 other forests. Right now I'm in far north NY on the edge of the Adirondacks. In small town, rural NE, there is minimal sprawl, so there is not a "desert of suburbia" to drive through whenever I want to get out.

Access... Virtually no "access" issues. The rural NE is not a mecca for the young, active, outdoorsie type. So, overuse is rarely an issue. Biggest problem is mtb trails being poached by quads. You'll have a bigger proportion of hunters and "motorheads" to deal with but its not all bad - I hunt, and I find the quads help beat in the underutilized trails.

Trails - here is the biggest issue. I'm the first to say that mountain biking is all about the trail. With the shortage of young, active, bikers, there are fewer epic-type trail system. The flip side is this... With minimal to no restrictions I can go out and build and maintain whatever I want within reason. As long as I do it responsibly I get no grief or hassle. Since I like building trails as much as riding them, this is a huge plus. In the 5 years since I moved to this area, a small group of riders have rallied, and we've now got a nice trails system. If someone told me I couldn't take my Pulaski or Stihl for a walk in the woods whenever I wanted, I'd be pretty bummed. There are some amazing trails in the Adirondack but they have limited acces to bikers. In the NW corner, many miles are underutilzied and poorly maintained, and if opened to bikers you'd likely see that improve. But that's another topic...

Weather... mixed bag. Water and mud is a frequent issue. Seasons are nice. Winter is still OK as get enough snow to ski. Spring is sloppy. Summer is nice, hot, but muggy and buggy. Fall in the NE can't be beat.


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## socalMX (Oct 31, 2009)

If Southern California wasn't so fun YEAR ROUND I would say central Cali. Santa Cruz area!?


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## eakins (Mar 8, 2004)

PHeller said:


> What do you do for a living that gives you so much time off?


self employed. have part time online work i do that can be done from anywhere and any time of the day. so many hours of work need be done per month. i complete it how i want to. professional tour director w/ a large operator. pays several K per week. still expanding that job potential but the goal is to work 10 weeks a year. i also do computer repair here and there for extra $. besides my set tour schedule for the year, I have no set schedule. If you have a 9-5 job you get $ security, but also get a measly 2 weeks a years for yourself a year. no thank you. like i said before, i've got my living expenses to a minimal and that is the key. ultimate goal is to live in an RV (boondock to save even more $) and travel (between tour jobs) and ride (MTB & motorcycles) all over the country and in Mexico. i'm far from the 1st person to have figured out this plan nor will I be the last. i have meet alot of people who ditched the "normal life" of 9-5 and have never been happier.


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## CodeJockey (Dec 23, 2013)

Silentfoe said:


> We ride Mountain bikes from March through late October here. Not sure how that's a short riding season.


"Short" is subjective, of course - for me, losing 1/3+ of the year creates a riding season that's too short for me.



Silentfoe said:


> You really should check out St. George Utah. Not sure about IT jobs there.


We actually looked at St. George (very cool place), but IT jobs are slim to none 



Jayem said:


> Don't forget about the ticks in the summer time.


I agree that ticks are devilish little heathens, but many of the places you mentioned have tick problems every bit as nasty (if not nastier) than Austin. I'm not married to Austin by any stretch of the imagination though; just throwing that out there.



Jayem said:


> Texas isn't hell, you can ride a bike there, but it's no place to enjoy the outdoors and be physical growing up IMO. Quality of life will be so much better in many places, even if you make a little less and don't have access to 11venty billion super-walmarts nearby.


Good feedback. We're taking another look at options in Colorado (C.S. and F.C to be specific). We might take a trip there for a week in the near future and hook up with a realtor to get a better sense of things.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

Jayem said:


> . Don't forget about the ticks in the summer time. I could never get past that part riding in that part of the country, but to each his own I guess. My parents live around Austin and besides being stationed near that area in the Army, I've been pretty much all over Texas. It's a huge state, but no "varied" riding within reasonable riding distance. No big mountains (again, within any reasonable distance), no way to easily get out of the climate during those oppressive summers or the winter ice-storm. If you haven't ridden there in the heat of summer, think about when you open the oven and that hot air rushes out, it's kind of like that. Phoenix is similar, but it at least doesn't carry the humidity most of the year. You also get the severe thunderstorms to deal with part of the year too, and so on. I know a lot of people like Texas, but I've never found any redeeming quality that has made me want to go back. I have to travel back there for work every few months, but it's depressing ending up in a sea of flat with few real pristine areas.


I live in So Cal. Worked in Austin last summer from Aug to end of Oct which were the worse possible months. I promised never to say anything positive about the riding there. So I will say that the heat was quite miserable during those months.

If I wasn't tied to family here in So Cal (which I've been told is a great place to ride by people that have probably never ridden anywhere else) I'd gladly move to Austin. Well, okay, that is probably not entirely true. I'd check out Eugene, Oak Ridge, Durango, Grand Junction, Prescott, Sedona, and (maybe) Bend, before deciding where to live- but Austin would be on that short list as well. I work remotely and just need an internet connection. so one day I'll be making the pilgrimage around the country.

I personally really liked Texas.

Last second post Edit:

One city that I don't believe discussed on this long thread was Baltimore.

Yes Baltimore.

I was there for a few weekends and they have some great bike parks, and riding that combined a good amount of flowy downhill stuff with technical aspects. The trails I went on were crazy fun. The locals said they can pretty much ride year round and from those friends I maintain a loose contact with on FB- it looks like they do. Not sure how the job market is there but my company does well with their sales arm in that territory. I don't know if I would move there but it could be something to consider for peeps looking.


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## socalMX (Oct 31, 2009)

Texas over So Cal? Hmmm... I could show you around.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

socalMX said:


> Texas over So Cal? Hmmm... I could show you around.


I'm in the Conejo Valley. It is a great place to live and _road _bike ride. I used to think we had awesome trails until I rode other places- then I realized that mountain bike riding could be so much more than an hour or two of fire road climbs and then quick singletrack downs- like 95% of the trails out here are. The MTB riding in Texas, Baltimore, and hell- even Florida is better IMO (those are the only other places I have ridden).

The weather in So Cal is amazing though. It has been 65-80 degrees everyday for the last 2 months. The cost of living reflects that.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

michaelscott said:


> I'm in the Conejo Valley. It is a great place to live and _road _bike ride. I used to think we had awesome trails until I rode other places- then I realized that mountain bike riding could be so much more than an hour or two of fire road climbs and then quick singletrack downs- like 95% of the trails out here are. The MTB riding in Texas, Baltimore, and hell- even Florida is better IMO (those are the only other places I have ridden).
> 
> The weather in So Cal is amazing though. It has been 65-80 degrees everyday for the last 2 months. The cost of living reflects that.


So when you are saying "so cal", you are including the trails in Santa Barbara, Big Bear/mountains near, mountains above San Diego, Kern County, and everywhere in between, right?


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

Jayem said:


> So when you are saying "so cal", you are including the trails in Santa Barbara, Big Bear/mountains near, mountains above San Diego, Kern County, and everywhere in between, right?


I'd say Ventura/Los Angeles county- since that is where I live and ride. So Cal is pretty big. I don't get out to Kern, OC, or San Diego because it is 2-3 hours from me. So I will admit I don't have much experience riding in those. From our So Cal forums San Diego sounds like a complete mess right now :-(.

I now you've been around Jayem- where did you live in So Cal, for how long, and which trails did you visit? How about when you were in Austin? I'm just trying to see where you opinion is coming from. I ride with guys all the time that tell me we the best riding in the country. When I ask them what other states and cities they have ridden in they admit that they haven't ridden anywhere else. I think it is because MTB Action is in Valencia and always has tons of pictures and write ups of our trails in their mag.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

michaelscott said:


> I'd say Ventura/Los Angeles county- since that is where I live and ride. So Cal is pretty big. I don't get out to Kern, OC, or San Diego


Oh, so not really then...

I was born in SoCal btw. It's an incredibly diverse area if you get around a bit. If not, it's not going to be very diverse obviously. SoCal kind of mirrors the entirety of CA in that respect. Incredibly diverse riding, yes, you have to travel a bit if you don't live "in the thick of it", and even if you do, you'll need to travel a bit to do more deserty riding, or alpine riding, but the great thing is that they are all contained in the state and relatively close by.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

Jayem said:


> Oh, so not really then...
> 
> I was born in SoCal btw. It's an incredibly diverse area if you get around a bit. If not, it's not going to be very diverse obviously. SoCal kind of mirrors the entirety of CA in that respect. Incredibly diverse riding, yes, you have to travel a bit if you don't live "in the thick of it", and even if you do, you'll need to travel a bit to do more deserty riding, or alpine riding, but the great thing is that they are all contained in the state and relatively close by.


The earlier poster said he was thinking about Austin. You said he could do better. I said Austin is good riding- way better than I have here in So Cal. Now you are pointing out there is plenty of diverse riding if I am willing to drive and perhaps you are inferring I don't really know what I am talking about.

I'm not really down to drive 2+ hours for good riding and that is not the point of this thread. Perhaps every city could have awesome and diverse riding if you were willing to drive to find it.

Where did you ride in Austin? You didn't answer my earlier question. Not trying to pick a fight with you. This thread is very detailed and you've been one of the best posters in it. I'm just kinda confused as to why, besides the summer heat, anyone that had spent time on the trails would have a problem with that city.


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## socalMX (Oct 31, 2009)

M Scott, your sig says "gotta pay to play" so drive a bit. You are judging So. Cal. trails based on what you have in the Valencia area and stating some Texas area is better than So. Cal!? You clearly need to get out more. Obviously you don't have enough passion for the sport to drive a few hours to hit the good trails.


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## bpressnall (Aug 25, 2006)

I'm curious, did the original poster ever say where he moved to?


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## oilnewby (Jan 13, 2011)

Not sure of the best place but I can be confident in saying that the desert is not friendly if you take a dive; This is the result of my ride last weekend.

I have never ridden on dirt and am jealous of those in Colorado and SoCal for their dirt trails.


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## mces (Apr 12, 2011)

bpressnall said:


> I'm curious, did the original poster ever say where he moved to?


t
The recent replies are to post 494 which was just made four days ago.


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

michaelscott said:


> Where did you ride in Austin? You didn't answer my earlier question. Not trying to pick a fight with you. This thread is very detailed and you've been one of the best posters in it. I'm just kinda confused as to why, besides the summer heat, anyone that had spent time on the trails would have a problem with that city.


2yrs ago, although the last time I was in Texas was last month, around Ft. Worth, I go there every 3 months or so for work. I don't have a problem with the city of Austin, it's a nice city, it's just not a great place for mountains, elevation, pines, snowboarding, hiking, wilderness, the ocean, etc.


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## Salespunk (Sep 15, 2005)

On the Socal topic I live in San Diego and it is not nearly as bad as it looks online. Yes there are a few places that have been shut down but it is not the end of the world. I can do a 60 mile loop from my house with less than 5% pavement and minimal fire road. There is a ton of riding down here if you go and explore. 

In terms of places to live I could not do Texas. I would look at Denver and Oregon personally. 

Sent from my HTC6500LVW using Tapatalk


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## BigDriveLittleWedge (Jan 2, 2014)

I have lived all over Colorado, and am currently living in the Colorado Springs. It's pretty much perfect here (biased). If I had to pick another place it would be Cortez/4corners area.


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## NordieBoy (Sep 26, 2004)

I'd go for anywhere in New Zealand.


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## fattirefreak (Jun 7, 2008)

Granted, I'm slightly biased, but anywhere along the Front Range of Colorado -- Denver, CO Springs, Fort Collins, Loveland.


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## michaelscott (May 23, 2011)

BigDriveLittleWedge said:


> I have lived all over Colorado, and am currently living in the Colorado Springs. It's pretty much perfect here (biased). If I had to pick another place it would be Cortez/4corners area.


What do you think of Grand Junction and Durango?


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## Island20v (Apr 22, 2013)

Salespunk said:


> On the Socal topic I live in San Diego and it is not nearly as bad as it looks online. Yes there are a few places that have been shut down but it is not the end of the world. I can do a 60 mile loop from my house with less than 5% pavement and minimal fire road. There is a ton of riding down here if you go and explore.
> 
> In terms of places to live I could not do Texas. I would look at Denver and Oregon personally.
> 
> Sent from my HTC6500LVW using Tapatalk


Agreed. Yes Mission Trails is a mess but south county and eastern county are wide open. If you don't mind driving a bit you can find empty trails that go on for days!


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Island20v said:


> Agreed. Yes Mission Trails is a mess but south county and eastern county are wide open. If you don't mind driving a bit you can find empty trails that go on for days!


Agreed. There's not too many quality suburban areas around where you can leave your house and be on the trail in 5 minutes.


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## -Chainslap- (Apr 9, 2009)

If income wasn't a issue, I would do like I am doing temporarily: Live in AZ (Flagstaff) during the summer, and become a hemisphere snowbird and head to New Zealand when it gets cold. If you can get residency, you'd be set.

But that's not likely, so if I were to pick one spot for year round it would be Prescott or Flagstaff for me still. I might be a bit biased being an AZ native, but I still haven't found anywhere else I would like to call home long term.

I dug Auburn, CA and could do Durango I bet, although it's pretty touristy. Or Colorado in the summer, and Baja in the winter. I could just ride the dirt bike then...that would be pretty rad too..


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## Island20v (Apr 22, 2013)

Gouda Cheez said:


> Agreed. There's not too many quality suburban areas around where you can leave your house and be on the trail in 5 minutes.


I live in Eastlake. I ride about 1.5 blocks down and catch a fire road to Otay Lakes. From there I can ride Otay Mountain, Rockhouse, Sweetwater... The list goes on. I have a huge network of trails out behind me in the Eastlake/Otay Lakes area.


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## skimmo87 (Jan 22, 2014)

I used to be a whitewater rafting instructor/ bike guide up in West Virginia. Right on the New River/ Gauley River. All class IV's and V's. Tons of history of coal mining. Trails that go FOREVER. There are state parks all over, the mountains are plateau'd off due to strip mining (WV's biggest income producer). The state is beautiful and downright addictive. Showshoe Ski Resort (north) during the summer months turns into a pretty awesome downhill riding place. I was living out near Beckley, WV (south) and working for a whitewater rafting company. They hired me as a raft guide, but needed bike guides to give customers tours of the trails, we had about 15 different trails all based on different difficulty levels. the company sponsored huge events as well for single track. I would recommend checking out areas in West Virginia. I lived in a cabin in the mountains on the company's property. best time of my life. 

There are hospitals nearby, (for obvious reasons) we contracted with search and rescue units/rangers for medivac. There is a HUGE market for WLFR opportunities. I was swift water rescue certified, but there are a lot of companies out there that look for qualified people in healthcare.


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## CodeJockey (Dec 23, 2013)

Jayem said:


> 2yrs ago, although the last time I was in Texas was last month, around Ft. Worth, I go there every 3 months or so for work. I don't have a problem with the city of Austin, it's a nice city, it's just not a great place for mountains, elevation, pines, snowboarding, hiking, wilderness, the ocean, etc.


He's asking you what trails you've ridden in Texas.


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## H0WL (Jan 17, 2007)

Yup, Cortez is an often overlooked town, with some great riding close by.


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## Wherewolf (Jan 17, 2004)

*Really?*



June Bug said:


> Yup, Cortez is an often overlooked town, with some great riding close by.


Is there really good riding near Cortez? My sister lives in that area but I've never visited her since she moved.


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## schmed (Feb 22, 2004)

Cortez is really a great MTB town. I was just there yesterday.

>Phil's world
>Trail of the Ancients / Sand Canyon
>Dolores - forget what it's called

Moab is 2.5 hours away ish
Durango is 1 hour away

Kokopelli bikes is a great shop. Very good sushi restaurant, decent brewery. Rideable much of the winter. Mesa Verde is just out of town, too.

Definitely worth the trip.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Any opinions on life in Santa Fe, NM?
-Fairly large city
-Politically progressive
-City is close to lots of public land

What about other outdoor activities like swimming/aquatics clubs and kayaking?


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## kq100 (Apr 4, 2013)

Jackson, Wy / Victor/Driggs, ID 
With over 2 million acres of mostly unexplored national forest trails spread out over 3 different mountain ranges you have your all day single track adventures. Then for the dirt road bikepacking lover there is direct access to the CDT along with the option for and easy long weekend adventure from your front door. And now with the boom of fat biking the winter options are almost as endless. Check out the Jay P's fatpursuit course map for an idea of the possibilities. 
But as I have always believed the best trail to ride is the one your on.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

PHeller said:


> Any opinions on life in Santa Fe, NM?
> -Fairly large city
> -Politically progressive
> -City is close to lots of public land
> ...


Friend lives there and loves it. Houses are affordable by California standards, he'd recommend bringing your job with you. Wrong state for water activities except trout fishing, careful of the drunk drivers. Great food down there too and elbow room. Cock fighting is still legal if you're into that too!


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## brightride (Jul 27, 2013)

Love visiting Santa Fe and could live happily there. You can camp in beautiful state park and national forest campgrounds and ride the Windsor trail from your camp site. A quick, easy drive and your in downtown Santa Fe. Start with a silver coin margarita in the Dragon Room and from there on to world class new Mexican food and art. A unique combination I've yet to match...


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## uglyguy2 (Jun 20, 2012)

Man, I'm going to have to sit down and just go over this whole thread from start to finish and do some research. I was supposed to transfer to Reno area last year for my job, pretty much had the rug pulled out from under me after getting my hopes up so high. I'm beyond miserable where I am, to the point I just can't take it any more. So many awesome places out there, wish I could experience them all. 

I've decided I'm leaving this summer. With no job lined up and no place to stay. I'll just have to figure out things on my way. If I said I wasn't scared shitless about this I'd be lying. I'm a very financially minded individual, very thrifty and save all I can on what little I make. Thinking about how I'll probably be taking a pay cut of about half of what I make now makes me cringe. 

Don't know if this is going to be the right decision, but currently I'm just wasting my life away being miserable in a place that has no proper mountain biking, and nowhere even close to any proper mountain biking at that. 

On a side note, it's crazy to see a thread that has spanned 7 years.


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## Rockrover (Jul 4, 2012)

PHeller said:


> Any opinions on life in Santa Fe, NM?
> -Fairly large city
> -Politically progressive
> -City is close to lots of public land
> ...


I moved to SF over 20 years ago from the SF Bay area in California where I was born and raised. After college I worked in Cali for about 4/5 years before being sent to Los Alamos NM on a contract that was supposed to be 3 months. We'll that was 20 years ago.

I found that if you're into the outdoors, culture, art and food, then Santa Fe is an awesome choice. I've always been into outdoor sports and northern NM fits the bill. Kayaking is excellent in the spring, but the window is short. Skiing used to be awesome, but is hit and miss and/or mediocre by central Co. standards.

As far as mtn biking is concerned there are a plethora of trails (hidden and well known) for you to explore from Albuquerque to Taos. Angle Fire resort has a world class DH scene and is only about 1.25 hours north, and the Los Alamos ski area has a pretty trick DH scene in the summer as well (LA is only about 40 minutes north).

Normally I keep my enthusiasm about NM to myself, cuz I don't want the world to notice and spoil it...so just don't tell anyone how awesome this state is okay?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Rock rover said:


> I found that if you're into the outdoors, culture, art and food, then Santa Fe is an awesome choice. I've always been into outdoor sports and northern NM fits the bill.


I was just out in NV/UT/AZ and really impressed with Flagstaff. 1.5 hours south and you're in the desert, snow on Humphrey's. Big city in Phoenix, solitude in southern Utah.

I bet Santa Fe is similar, but drier. More difficult to fly into and out of Santa Fe, though. Phoenix is a major hub and close to Flagstaff, I hear Albuquerque requires connecting flights or a trip to Denver.


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## Island20v (Apr 22, 2013)

Santa Fe has a huge brew and bike festival coming up soon. Might have to check it out.


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## MTBNate (Apr 6, 2004)

I prefer to live in ABQ and visit SFe if the mood strikes (rarely if ever). The Sangre de Christo Mts on the other hand...


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## Rockrover (Jul 4, 2012)

PHeller said:


> More difficult to fly into and out of Santa Fe, though. I hear Albuquerque requires connecting flights or a trip to Denver.


That's why NM is still cool! People have to really want to come here!


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## mudforlunch (Aug 9, 2004)

I've had the chance to ride all over a lot of the country, and from my personal experience it would be a near-tie between the Pacific Northwest and New England, with New England barely getting the nod, preferably somewhere in northern MA, southern ME, or VT/NH. Without any family considerations if I was single and unattached, I would move to the Northwest: Vancouver, BC if I could pull it off. 

I lived and rode in Fort Collins, Colorado for 4 years, and I know its blasphemy to say this, but I prefer riding on both the East Coast and Northwest much more. Riding on flowy, chunky, techy trails under canopy just suits me a lot more than the either/or (climb/descend) riding of Colorado on dry, constantly sun baked trails. 

I live north of DC right now, and the riding here is better than most people expect when they move out here, I know it definitely surprised me. My go-to trail system here is just as much (kinda more, actually) fun as my old shoreline/maxwell/horsetooth run back in FoCo, it does lack the beautiful views of the front range though. The worst thing about living here is just the sheer amount of people you have to deal with, so I certainly wouldn't put it near my top places, mainly due to non-riding factors, but its not terrible either.


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## raisingarizona (Feb 3, 2009)

Bellingham or Flagstaff would be my two picks.


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

mudforlunch said:


> I've had the chance to ride all over a lot of the country, and from my personal experience it would be a near-tie between the Pacific Northwest and New England, with New England barely getting the nod, preferably somewhere in northern MA, southern ME, or VT/NH. Without any family considerations if I was single and unattached, I would move to the Northwest: Vancouver, BC if I could pull it off.
> 
> I lived and rode in Fort Collins, Colorado for 4 years, and I know its blasphemy to say this, but I prefer riding on both the East Coast and Northwest much more. Riding on flowy, chunky, techy trails under canopy just suits me a lot more than the either/or (climb/descend) riding of Colorado on dry, constantly sun baked trails.
> 
> I live north of DC right now, and the riding here is better than most people expect when they move out here, I know it definitely surprised me. My go-to trail system here is just as much (kinda more, actually) fun as my old shoreline/maxwell/horsetooth run back in FoCo, it does lack the beautiful views of the front range though. The worst thing about living here is just the sheer amount of people you have to deal with, so I certainly wouldn't put it near my top places, mainly due to non-riding factors, but its not terrible either.


Interesting to hear. I'm a NE rider who likes it but loves to visit the Rockies/West.

Any trail networks in particular in the VT/NH area? Kingdom?

Biggest issue I have with the NE is the frequency of rain. Plan a mtb weekend and there's almost a 50/50 chance you'll get rained out. Bugs can be really bad at times. Trail work is never ending - downed trees, leaves, encroaching branches (damn Beeches)... That said, the tight, twisty, chunky, technical riding sure is fun and quite different than what I've ridden out West.


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## jamescbrennan (Dec 21, 2007)

Cairns Australia. 

I just moved here and its amazing. 9 months of perfect weather, 3 months of sticky/wet/hot where you can still ride if you don't mind sweating to death. Riding in the tropical rainforest, steep, rooted, rocky, technical. One of the best bike parks in Australia just 10 minutes away. Held the World Championships here in 1996, whole park just redone for the World Cup Round in April. Awesome XC, trail, AM, and DH trails. Another massive park just on the other side of the mountains, an hour away, which has received a few $m in funding for expansion. Epic 50km+ XC rides though pristine rainforest where you will not see another person, ever. Plus local built DH/AM trails through the rainforest.

Also, great BMX race scene (my son is really into BMX and I ride as well). And supposedly good road riding, if that's your thing.

Some of the greatest Australian MTB and BMX legends live here. Great local clubs.

Oh, and there is this little thing called the Great Barrier Reef just 30 minutes off the coast.

Not bad.


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

OK, I've been watching this thread for a while now. I gotta get out of Wisconsin. I do not like my current employer, after 11 years at this job, it's time to go. Where do I find good mountain biking, road biking, gravel grinding with an MBA, Bachelors degree in Mechanical engineering, and a professional engineering license? I've all but given up trying to get into Trek here in WI. I have not gotten any responses from any of the other bike companies I've applied to, so now the search is on for a new region to target job searches. A few requirements besides biking though. Must have good schools and be family friendly, must have a decent Korean population and restaurants, prefer to be near a dragstrip for racing my hotrods.


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## socalMX (Oct 31, 2009)

So. Cal. for sure! Plenty of Korean people (great restaurants too), some nice drag strips, beaches, have I mentioned mountain biking yet? Oh yea, plenty of that too! Road biking, yes it is a dream for the lycra gangs that terrorize the canyon roads! As for a job, that's a question I can not answer but one thing I do know is most companies do there R & D work here. Babes, beaches and year round biking might get you in trouble with the family though so maybe not a great idea for you! :smilewinkgrin:


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## far raider (Oct 4, 2004)

socalMX said:


> So. Cal. for sure! Plenty of Korean people (great restaurants too), some nice drag strips, beaches, have I mentioned mountain biking yet? Oh yea, plenty of that too! Road biking, yes it is a dream for the lycra gangs that terrorize the canyon roads! As for a job, that's a question I can not answer but one thing I do know is most companies do there R & D work here. Babes, beaches and year round biking might get you in trouble with the family though so maybe not a great idea for you! :smilewinkgrin:


I'm leaning that way too (SC) but am kind of stuck on the crowds, cost of living and wife is worried about earthquakes. What to do, what to do...


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## Elduder (Jun 7, 2004)

Brevard NC. Best riding in the east coast and 5 hours from the beaches. Can ride most of the year and just great weather most of the year.


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## LittleBitey (Nov 10, 2012)

North central Iowa


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## ou2mame (Apr 23, 2010)

I live in long Island and the trails here aren't very long. Most land is developed or really far away from me. I'm looking into moving to Colorado, hopefully there are more than 10 mile trails lol 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

slowride454 said:


> OK, I've been watching this thread for a while now. I gotta get out of Wisconsin. I do not like my current employer, after 11 years at this job, it's time to go. Where do I find good mountain biking, road biking, gravel grinding with an MBA, Bachelors degree in Mechanical engineering, and a professional engineering license? I've all but given up trying to get into Trek here in WI. I have not gotten any responses from any of the other bike companies I've applied to, so now the search is on for a new region to target job searches. A few requirements besides biking though. Must have good schools and be family friendly, must have a decent Korean population and restaurants, prefer to be near a dragstrip for racing my hotrods.


Seriously consider Utah. Best variety of biking in the whole county. I grew up in So Cal, living for two years in Colorado (mostly Grand Junction) and Utah is hands down, far and away better. So Cal thinks a dirt road is a rad Mtb trail and refuses to build ST. Colorado is underdeveloped for what it COULD be. Utah has Moab, Saint George, and PARK CITY! New trails are constantly being built all over the state. The cities are building paved trails for roadies and our mountain pass rides are up there with anywhere else. I can drive 15 minutes from my house and be in high mountain pine forests or an hour the other way and be in the desert. Even with the big three, every other city is focused on building their own bike park. I know of two (less than a 15 minute drive apart) that are building their own network of trails right now. Due to the culture here there are tons of family frienly activities. Most major companies have a distribution hub in SLC or Ogden and more businesses continue to move here. The housing is very affordable. Scott bikes just moved here in fact. Specialized has a hub. And lots of other smaller bike manufactures are based throught the valley. I have met tons of people who have moved here just for the biking.seriously, check out Utah!


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## Endoismynamo (Mar 5, 2014)

I've really enjoyed reading this thread from top to bottom over the past 24 hours. One thing to take into consideration is how much singletrack has been added throughout the country since this thread was started, so many places that wouldn't rank when this thread was started might have some merit now. But I'll get back to that...

I will put my comments into context by admitting that I am a relative newbie to the sport and have limited experience with MTBing in different parts of the country. However, I have lived all over the world (grew up in L.A. and have lived in London, Madrid, central N.C., Boston and spent 6 months off/on in Park City, UT) and actually have some experience living in many of the places listed here even though I did not MTB at the time I lived in those places. Since this thread is about the best place to live and MTB, not just "where are the best trails"?, I think my overall life experience brings some value to the conversation. Also, it should be noted that folks supporting a family probably have different priorities than a 20 year old who doesn't mind sleeping on a buddy's sofa 6 months of the year. Also, if your spouse is serious about her/his career, then that must be taken into account as well. Someone earlier in this thread was busting on someone else for living a "safe" life, but the reality is that when you are married and have kids, you've got responsibilities that extend beyond feeding your desire to go out and shred singletrack all day. Anyone who feels otherwise should have their spouse/parent card revoked.

For many years I expected to move from SoCal to Park City, but it did not come to pass for a variety of reasons. Nevertheless, I am an avid skier and I would live there in a heart beat. I used to spend 2 weeks every winter skiing there and 2 weeks every summer fly-fishing the Provo river. So I loved P.C. even before I caught the MTB bug. The fact that I could enjoy something great in every season makes P.C. a no-brainer. Plus, it's a great town and anyone worried about the local religious influence doesn't know much about the history of P.C. compared to the rest of the state. P.C. has little Mormon influence, but even it did, I would be fine with it as I have several Mormon friends. I have only mountain biked one time in UT, but it was 6 years ago and even though it scared the piss out of me, it planted the seed for what would come later...

So I now live in Bentonville, AR and while y'all can crush me with telling me how lame it is, I think if you visited, you would be in for a big surprise. I came here kicking and screaming, but my wife swore to me that I would like it and she had a great opportunity in a new role with her company (she works for a major WalMart food supplier). I was fortunate in that I can do my work from home (I am a real estate developer and can work from anywhere that I can catch a plane to my projects) and when I moved here I only had that one MTB experience in UT. I quickly noticed that there was a super vibrant endurance athlete scene here. Running is big in the area (U of Arkansas 1/2 hour south has more NCAA running titles than anyone) and many of those athletes settled in the area. Also, there is a rapidly growing network of trails throughout the area. Now how did this come to be? Here's the good part:

As much as I knocked WalMart my whole life, I can say that I am forever thankful for what the Walton family has provided for this little town. We have tremendous amenities for such a small town: one of the best art museums in America (Crystal Bridges - look it up), great live theater in Fayeteville at the Walton Arts Center) and last but but not least, miles and miles of well-maintained singletrack. Essentially, what has happened is the Walton family wants to make Bentonville an appealing place for WM executives and vendor executives to move to, so they spent zillions of dollars creating whatever they need to draw them here. As such, a few of them were MTBers and basically bought a bunch of land next to downtown and paid for the trails to be built and then gave it to the city. So we have about 26 miles of ST (Slaughter Pen Hollow) that is accessed immediately off the town square, where you can also find a great LBS (Phat Tire), the number one rated new boutique hotel in America (21c Museum Hotel) and several restaurants and gastropubs to meet your needs for rocket fuel and suds. A paved bike path connects the 3 phases of SP Hollow to another 7 miles of ST at Blowing Springs. All of this is a mix of smooth ST and some technical rocky/rooty stuff depending on what you want. I admit, the climbs won't kill you (typically 300' of climbing at a time), but the riding is mostly fast and flowy in a beautiful forest with lots of creek crossings, plus several sketchy bluff-edge sections for those who like a little spice. We also have some north-shore style skinnies, seesaws, elevated bridges etc. that have been lovingly built by Progressive Trail Design. Oh yeah, there's also several short DH trails and a full DJ/pump track park right in the middle of Slaughter Pen.

30 minutes to our east is Hobbs State Park and about 25 miles of additional singletrack. Very smooth and fast, but with plenty of gravel to keep you on your toes in the corners. Near Fayeteville is Devils Den State Park with another network of trails and then there is also Lake Leatherwood in nearby Eureka Springs for gnarly technical riding. Further afoot, both the Womble Trail and Syllamo are IMBA Epic trails. Lastly, living in Bentonville means living in a place that digs riding and promotes it at every opportunity. We may be the only city in the country that has a mandate to build a flow trail/pump track contiguous to every middle-school and junior high in the district. Yes, that's right, MTBing is officially part of P.E. for school kid here and the schools have 100's of brand-spanking new MTB's that were donated and kids can take classes in becoming a bike mechanic. My 8 year old son just finished a weekend MTB camp this weekend on the local trails and he's hitting me up for more.

With weather than is conducive to riding 10 months out of the year and a community that is "all-in" for MTB, I would say there's more here than meets the eye. Low unemployment rate, cheap cost of living and good public schools with a growing restaurant/nightlife scene (new outdoor music venue "The AMP" just kicking off inaugural season) and there's a lot to like.

BTW -for all you SoCal folks, I don't miss the smoggy slog at all and I recently did the dirt Mulholland thing and while I enjoyed the screaming downhill section, I really missed feeling like I was by myself in the woods under the canopy.


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## WA-CO (Nov 23, 2013)

slowride454 said:


> ...Where do I find good mountain biking, road biking, gravel grinding with an MBA, Bachelors degree in Mechanical engineering, and a professional engineering license?...Must have good schools and be family friendly, must have a decent Korean population and restaurants, prefer to be near a dragstrip for racing my hotrods.


Hands down, PNW, Seattle area, specifically. Very high-tech city. Really strong economy. Substantial Korean populations in each major area. Good road, and mountain biking. OK gravel grinding. Pretty good schools (depending upon area, of course) PIR is a local race track/drag strip. No real pollution.

House prices are stupid, and it rains quite a bit. Traffic is nasty. High earthquake risk.


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## crewjones (Aug 24, 2007)

criscobike said:


> Seriously consider Utah. Best variety of biking in the whole county. I grew up in So Cal, living for two years in Colorado (mostly Grand Junction) and Utah is hands down, far and away better. So Cal thinks a dirt road is a rad Mtb trail and refuses to build ST. Colorado is underdeveloped for what it COULD be. Utah has Moab, Saint George, and PARK CITY! New trails are constantly being built all over the state. The cities are building paved trails for roadies and our mountain pass rides are up there with anywhere else. I can drive 15 minutes from my house and be in high mountain pine forests or an hour the other way and be in the desert. Even with the big three, every other city is focused on building their own bike park. I know of two (less than a 15 minute drive apart) that are building their own network of trails right now. Due to the culture here there are tons of family frienly activities. Most major companies have a distribution hub in SLC or Ogden and more businesses continue to move here. The housing is very affordable. Scott bikes just moved here in fact. Specialized has a hub. And lots of other smaller bike manufactures are based throught the valley. I have met tons of people who have moved here just for the biking.seriously, check out Utah!


Hey Crisco,
are you in Southern Utah? Planning on taking a vacation there this year. One of the few parts of the country I've yet to visit. When is the best time to go weather wise?
I want to visit all the parks and do some hiking, biking and camping


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## Lenny7 (Sep 1, 2008)

I live in Dallas and it would be a stretch to say it is the best place to live for mountain biking but the overall package is not too bad. We have a really good trail system, dorba.org, for such a"flat" big city. A few actually have some climbs that might surprise you. 

Cost of living is a big benefit. My house in SoCal would cost 7 figures but low 6's here.

Now the summers are a beast. I'm off in the summers so I'm on the trail by 7am and done before it gets deadly. You can empty a 3L camelbak on a 1 hour ride sometimes.
However I wouldn't trade it for long winters elsewhere. We get some cold weather but for the most part it's year round ridding.

I would love SoCal's weather but not their cost of living. And I'll take tornados over earth quakes. 
Texas is a good balance for ME. Other people have a different balance.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Earthquakes come like only once every 20 years and don't tornadoes come all the time? They seem to hit the same towns all the time too.


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## David R (Dec 21, 2007)

Not sure if it is the "best" place to live for riding, but I love the proximity of my house to the trails;









Currently 1.8km drive (don't like wearing out my tyres on tarmac, or local idiots in cars!), but the red line shows where we are planning on cutting a sneaky track to link up with the trails, meaning there will only be a couple of hundred metres of road between my driveway and the trails!


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## Endoismynamo (Mar 5, 2014)

SS Hack said:


> Earthquakes come like only once every 20 years and don't tornadoes come all the time? They seem to hit the same towns all the time too.


You've got a point there. I hate to disagree with Lenny from Dallas, but having lived in Los Angeles and Arkansas, I would say that I find tornadoes 100x more terrifying than earthquakes. So even though I vigorously pumped up Bentonville, I would say that the spring weather can e a bit dicey. But when it's not dicey, spring is absolutely gorgeous here.

BTW - earthquakes actually happen constantly (literally all day long every day - but they are too small to notice), it's just that the really big ones might be once every few years.


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## Lenny7 (Sep 1, 2008)

Tornado season is roughly March till June. How long is earthquake season?


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## Endoismynamo (Mar 5, 2014)

Lenny7 said:


> Tornado season is roughly March till June. How long is earthquake season?


I spent my childhood with a pair of hiking boots next to my bed and a tennis racket leaning nearby because I had some misguided notion that I could hold the racquet over my head for protection when the roof started coming down on me (this was back when none of us used helmets for cycling or skateboarding so I didn't have those options available). Over time I stopped stressing about it because there's just not that much you can do until it hits and by then you are pretty well screwed. After Northridge, I did make an effort to avoid getting stuck under or on top of overpasses, but there's only so much you can do in that regard when you are stuck in that miasma known as L.A. gridlock.

I installed a shelter in the slab below my garage last year here in AR and so now I really don't care if the house blows away as long as my family is underground. It gave me peace of mind when I travel to know that my family is safe no matter what else happens. Prior to the shelter, I found the long, dark, loud, spooky, lightning/thunder filled nights in the pantry somewhat terrifying what with text alerts from the national weather service constantly reminding me that my house was about to be razed to the ground.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Lenny7 said:


> Tornado season is roughly March till June. How long is earthquake season?


All the time of course. But they don't wipe out the same towns on a yearly basis. Fire and floods are more of a concern on a ongoing basis. My house is subject to both, but I can ride out the front door to trails.


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## criscobike (Feb 21, 2013)

crewjones said:


> Hey Crisco,
> are you in Southern Utah? Planning on taking a vacation there this year. One of the few parts of the country I've yet to visit. When is the best time to go weather wise?
> I want to visit all the parks and do some hiking, biking and camping


I don't. I live in Northern Utah closer to the ski resorts. Saint George is a great little town with plenty to do for sure. I get down there a couple times a year. October-November can be some of best conditions you see anywhere. It is still desert riding, so come prepared. Let me know if/when you go and I'll give you some trail suggestions. There is a IMBA classic loop down there.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

SS Hack said:


> All the time of course. But they don't wipe out the same towns on a yearly basis. Fire and floods are more of a concern on a ongoing basis. My house is subject to both, but I can ride out the front door to trails.


SoCal is on fire right now. Hopefully it's not getting any good single track.


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## Endoismynamo (Mar 5, 2014)

SS Hack said:


> SoCal is on fire right now. Hopefully it's not getting any good single track.


I spoke to some buddies who live in North County and it sounds like everything is burning up there so my guess is that plenty of singletrack just lost whatever little shade canopy existed.


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## Gouda Cheez (Feb 18, 2013)

Endoismynamo said:


> I spoke to some buddies who live in North County and it sounds like everything is burning up there so my guess is that plenty of singletrack just lost whatever little shade canopy existed.


I'm sure there are a few trails around the area burned, but no major trail systems as far as I know. La Costa, Elfin, Calaveras, Daly Ranch... all untouched.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Stay safe down there; we have a long fire season ahead of us and it could NorCal next or at any time.


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## cmac_spartan (Jan 14, 2015)

If you want to get the most out of your free time move to Dillon colorado, you have your choice of bike parks to choose from in the summer and then in the winter you can ski or fat bike or downhill ice skate or whatever you want to do. If you want to make money in healthcare and maximize fun move to Denver. If you want the most mountain biking and don't care about healthcare money move to Moab. If you want everything always move to Vancouver. You can ride coast gravity park and whistler bike park during the summer, you can ride coast gravity park all winter and there are a **** ton of sweet trails to be rode everywhere all year in Vancouver.


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## BikeIntelligencer (Jun 5, 2009)

Santa Cruz winter/spring because you can roll out your back door in 60/70 degree sunshine and be on world class trails in 10 minutes. Sun Valley summer because you can ride all day at 8-10k feet in real mountains. Moab fall because there's just no place like Moab in the fall.


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## granitematt (May 8, 2009)

It may sound crazy to some and others probably cannot even locate it on a map, but I recently moved to Spokane and am really digging the bike scene. PROXIMITY! Spent 9 years on and off in Bend and was looking for close access to a legit bike park (Check = Silver Mountain), riding in town (Check = Beacon Hill, Riverside State Park), uncrowded trails (Check), hour drive to big ups and downs (Check = Mt. Spokane, Tower Mt., Caribou Ridge area, Canfield Mt., Bernard Peak…), under 2 hour drive to some ridiculous riding (Check = Sandpoint/N. Idaho, Kettle Crest), proximity to interior BC (Check = 2.5 hours to Rossland, 3 hours to Nelson, 4.5 hours to Fernie, plus Revolstoke, Kelowna…). Not to mention Whitefish, Missoula, Leavenworth and Hood River are under 4 hours away. For the most part you can ride in town trails year round and if snow is on the ground a short jaunt to the Washington desert is always an option (Vantage, Tri Cities…) 

Looking around on the internet won't really get you psyched on the area, not many videos or beta. Just find Spokane on a map and look at all the fantastic riding destinations in close proximity.

Cheers!


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## ermporshe (Jan 7, 2015)

Lousa in Portugal, the capital of the portuguese Btt.






Just for you to know more about it


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

We moved to Wenatchee last year. We could have moved anywhere including BC; we work in health care, kids are grown.. We were living in the Eastern TN, about all I can say about that place is the riding is short, sweet, and humid year round. The only reason to live in the Southeast is if you like the humidity, otherwise it sucks.

I've ridden in mos tree of the state's, lived longer stints in CA, OR, VA, TN. There is something to be said for year round riding; I'm missing it right now. But, if you live within driving distance to year round riding, it can be tolerable living where there is snow. Granted, right now we have mostly rain, but when we had snow I'd go snow biking. This weeken I'll head East to ride in the Coulee. What's nice about a place like Wenatchee, and the reason we chose this place over Bend, is that Wenatchee is place where people live and raise families. It doesn't have the tourism vibe or the second home population. 

You may like to ride, but you also have to live there.

Come Summer, the riding here is to die for


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## CoyoteNW (Oct 27, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> What's nice about a place like Wenatchee, and the reason we chose this place over Bend, is that Wenatchee is place where people live and raise families. It doesn't have the tourism vibe or the second home population.
> 
> You may like to ride, but you also have to live there.
> 
> Come Summer, the riding here is to die for


Nurse Ben- it seems, from the outside, that Wenatchee has a really bad youth drug problem, mediocre to poor schools and really zero of the after school and weekend outdoor programs for youth that you might find in a place like Bend or Durango. Both of which also have good school systems.
My wife and I have been tossing the idea of relocating our family out of Seattle, to someplace smaller. Wenatchee was on the short list for a time, but the more I looked into it, the less attractive it appeared as a place to raise a family.
Then there are the politics...
Thoughts?
All of that said, Wenatchee in in a pretty idyllic location!

For me, Bend has landed at the top of my list every time I've entertained my relocation fantasy. Love that place.
Except, maybe, the politics...

I have heard great things about Spokane.

And I am indelibly drawn to my childhood home in the Colorado front range.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> We were living in the Eastern TN, about all I can say about that place is the riding is short, sweet, and humid year round. The only reason to live in the Southeast is if you like the humidity, otherwise it sucks.


I always thought southeastern TN near Chatty, or someplace in the Coosa Valley (eastern Alabama) might be a nice spot for East Coast riding if you didn't care for snow. Unfortunately its the Bible Belt and yea, humidity.

My family is slowly disappearing, just Mom, aunt and uncle, grandparents these days, and when I no longer have anyone to visit I will head west and stay there.


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## Clyde250 (Oct 18, 2013)

I live in Draper Utah. Ran into the mayor on his new fat bike, on a night ride, and asked him about future plans. He said Draper had bought both sides of Suncrest and would have 80 miles of trails around the mountain in the next few years and a crew to maintain them.

The south slopes can be ridden almost year around. With Moab, St. George, PC, and Brianhead so close, I am quite content.


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## buildakicker (Jan 19, 2014)

While everyone has their favorite, I really like the Reno-Tahoe-Auburn area. Loads of great trails, huge bike (and other) community and the climate is awesome!


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## RiceBrnr (Oct 13, 2014)

Kansas City, MO.& KS.


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## ACLakey (Jul 7, 2012)

Central Oregon is tough to beat.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

CoyoteNW said:


> Nurse Ben- it seems, from the outside, that Wenatchee has a really bad youth drug problem, mediocre to poor schools and really zero of the after school and weekend outdoor programs for youth that you might find in a place like Bend or Durango. Both of which also have good school systems.
> My wife and I have been tossing the idea of relocating our family out of Seattle, to someplace smaller. Wenatchee was on the short list for a time, but the more I looked into it, the less attractive it appeared as a place to raise a family.
> Then there are the politics...
> Thoughts?
> ...


Spokane here, lived here since 91 - what do you want to know?

I will venture to add that almost ANY small city that's not affiliated with a larger metro area has a youth drug problem. That's not going to be specific to Washington state, that's for sure.


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## VTSession (Aug 18, 2005)

I still think Boston is one of the great mountain bike towns that you can live in and have a career. Local trails are extensive and well maintained, even better riding 2-3 hours away in NH and VT, lots of riders, lots of great shops, long season (Jan.-March are usually the only off months) not to mention the strong economy and housing market.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

Iowa.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

VTSession said:


> I still think Boston is one of the great mountain bike towns that you can live in and have a career...long season (Jan.-March are usually the only off months) not to mention the strong economy and housing market.


Is Boston currently under a few feet of snow?

And I'd say that 2-3 hours for the nearest riding destination isn't exactly my ideal spot.


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## VTSession (Aug 18, 2005)

PHeller said:


> Is Boston currently under a few feet of snow?
> 
> And I'd say that 2-3 hours for the nearest riding destination isn't exactly my ideal spot.


Yes it is, but we've had winters here where you can pedal right through the winter. This winter is very unusual for Boston. We usually average 30-40 inches of snow per year. We're up to 75 inches now.

There are about 30 different riding spots within 30 miles of Boston. Mostly large state parks with miles and miles of well developed trails. Even more, within an hour's drive. Additionally, you can access real world class riding when you venture further north - Kingdom Trails, North Conway, Highland bike park, Killington, Mt, Snow, Ascutney - the list goes on.

The options for a Saturday ride are endless. Also the options for a quick after work ride are extensive.

I'm not concerned if you agree but this is a top notch bike town.


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## big_slacker (Feb 16, 2004)

buildakicker said:


> While everyone has their favorite, I really like the Reno-Tahoe-Auburn area. Loads of great trails, huge bike (and other) community and the climate is awesome!


I was just back home (zephyr cove) for a week and I have to agree. Although where I currently live is great from a jobs and year round riding perspective tahoe is magic.


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## CoyoteNW (Oct 27, 2012)

formica said:


> Spokane here, lived here since 91 - what do you want to know?
> 
> I will venture to add that almost ANY small city that's not affiliated with a larger metro area has a youth drug problem. That's not going to be specific to Washington state, that's for sure.


I'll take a bike tour with you this summer, if you're game!

True enough about small towns and drugs. That and economy are why I have to keep my eyes on more medium sized places; Spokane, Bend, Ft.Collins...

Truth is, I'm probably stuck here in Seattle, the best city I can imagine being stuck in, that's for sure!


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Certainly. Our local group, Evergreen East, (chapter of EMBA) is really getting the trail info together on their website, too.

Evergreen East - Evergreen Mountain Bike Alliance Eastern Washington Chapter


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## RobZona (Dec 12, 2008)

Sure you want to live/ride/work in a BIG city? :/ Research Prescott, AZ and PM me want you do in healthcare, etc., and I can probably get you on at Yavapai regional medical center. Great place to work, lots mountaibikers, trails, and close to Sedona, Flagstaff, and 1.5 hrs to Phoenix. Live in the cool pines, very communte, ride from home.....we love it!


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## honez1414 (Jan 11, 2011)

Any Indian Health Service locations in Prescott?


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## dft (Apr 9, 2004)

i'm glad you like it and in the end that is what its all about, there is no right/wrong!
but i'll add the trails there are still a ways from the world class stuff out west, trails in the high country/mountains with huge vertical descents, etc.



VTSession said:


> Yes it is, but we've had winters here where you can pedal right through the winter. This winter is very unusual for Boston. We usually average 30-40 inches of snow per year. We're up to 75 inches now.
> 
> There are about 30 different riding spots within 30 miles of Boston. Mostly large state parks with miles and miles of well developed trails. Even more, within an hour's drive. Additionally, you can access real world class riding when you venture further north - Kingdom Trails, North Conway, Highland bike park, Killington, Mt, Snow, Ascutney - the list goes on.
> 
> ...


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## JUNGLEKID5 (May 1, 2006)

http://http://www.hlmp.org/page9/downloads/files/HLMPTrifold-PDF.pdf

Rapid city Sd has some really dope riding right in town. Down town is a sweet little spot as well. Also check out skyline and bone collector


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## zrm (Oct 11, 2006)

What does "dope" mean in this context?


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

zrm said:


> What does "dope" mean in this context?


Well played... well played indeed. :lol:


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

I don't know the best place, but it's on the west no matter what.


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## AllMountin' (Nov 23, 2010)

SS Hack said:


> I don't know the best place, but it's on the west no matter what.


Too many cougars and too much Rocky Mtn Spotted Fever.


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

I wish the jobs market was better so I could find something that fits my skill set and interests in the suggested locales. I've been applying for a year now and haven't even gotten a phone interview.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

slowride454 said:


> I wish the jobs market was better so I could find something that fits my skill set and interests in the suggested locales. I've been applying for a year now and haven't even gotten a phone interview.


SF Bay Area could work. Not the best riding, but the economy is once again on fire. It never seems to go down the drain like everyone hopes. Weather in the low to mid 70s for the next five days.


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## LaXCarp (Jul 19, 2008)

What is everyone's take on Asheville, NC? I have a solid job prospect there. Internet research indicates its either completely awesome, or completely crappy. I know about the mountain biking of course. But what about actually living there?

My wife is an RN, how would work be for her to find?


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## atrophy (Sep 23, 2006)

not boise. really unimpressed with the trails. very crowded lower trails. uninteresting terrain. the hills are tree-less, root-less, and basically rockless unless you get up to bogus or onto the ridge 3000k-ish ft above the valley. looks like i will get re-aquainted with my road bike. major disappointment from northern az and reno-tahoe areas


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

LaXCarp said:


> What is everyone's take on Asheville, NC? I have a solid job prospect there. Internet research indicates its either completely awesome, or completely crappy. I know about the mountain biking of course. But what about actually living there?
> 
> My wife is an RN, how would work be for her to find?


She'd be alright. Employment is tough in Asheville as its an isolated city without the job market of a larger city. Seems like healthcare is always a safe bet.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

atrophy said:


> not boise. major disappointment from northern az and reno-tahoe areas


Good to know, I've been thinking of Boise high on the list of places to relocate to, along with Tucson, SLC, Reno, Albuquerque or Santa Fe.

Basically we want dry, good job market, compact enough to ride to work, ride to trails.


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## atrophy (Sep 23, 2006)

i can't comment on the new mexico riding or SLC. but reno for mtb reasons alone is in my opinion a far better choice. trails are better, far less crowded, and the summer riding offers shade and tahoe access. winter riding in reno also much better than boise. not as muddy/clay and much much sunnier. boise gets inversions that can limit visibility to 20 feet and last for over a month. 6 weeks long this winter. reno has none of that. it can get very windy in reno, but the trees block that up off mt rose highway in southern reno. no state income tax is nice too


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

I accepted the challenge and read the entire thread. I like hearing everyone's stories.

I am also preparing to move specifically for better access to nice riding. I've lived in Sierra Madre / Southern California, Santa Fe, Durango, Vegas, and Boston. The best, by far, was Sierra Madre Ca, a foothill town, no need to use my car. Bike can be used for everything life requires. Literally hundreds of miles of every variety of riding was available to me there...from 3 hour climbs, to 30 mile epic / remote single track loops complete with swimming holes, and also knarly down hill fire road as well as tough, technical single track in deep woods. Boston, so far, is the absolute worst. The winter is absolutely rotten, and even in the summer, what I consider 'fun' riding absolutely requires an hour car ride out west or up to New Hampshire. I forget who said it here, but they're right : Being able to ride the bike from your door to the trail is a major necessity for anyone who truly wants to live-the-life. Living the life is only possible if you love it enough to place all else secondary. You will only do this if you simply can not help choosing to do so. It is not really a choice, it is who you are. My entire life is kind of adjusted to accommodate low cost of living, ironically, when I lowered my cost of living, my creativity went up, and I end up making more money because less stressed. It sounds foolish but for me its true.

I am now moving to Oregon, in between Bend and Eugene. It is just right there. Winter snow occurs where I am going, but it is ride-able 9 months. For me, I'll gladly take a 3 month winter in exchange for the ability to live in a place where the only time I might use my Truck is if I want to drive an hour in the dead of winter for a weekend of mountain biking...which I will likely do on occasion. The other 9 months make available incredible riding, some of it at least as beautiful as North Shore B.C. Oregon has little sweet spot towns that no one talks about, and that is where I am deciding to drop anchor at this point.

Santa Fe had some fair riding, but it required too much driving to access, plus, the winter is a bit of a drag because I really don't like the bitter cold. Snow is ok sometimes, but bitter cold kills me for some reason. Boston winter is bitter cold / Pain in the ass irritating to me. Plus, its more expensive living here than it was for me in Southern Ca when I left, ...which I didn't think was possible. I don't care for Bend to live in, but visiting it is nice. Oregon is not all rainy like some people think. Certain sweet spots exist, and if you can earn money through alternative / creative means...your cost of living is very low in these sweet spots. Having a variety of skills also can be of major benefit.

I am buying a very small piece of land and putting up a wood walled Yurt on my property with Solar and composting. For me, I had to think long and hard about where to go this time out, because, once my money is spent and I am committed, I want to stay. I've experimented with living in all the places I mentioned. Only Southern Ca / Sierra Madre offered me access to 'the life' I need to live in order to 'feel' myself honorable to 'life'. So why did I leave? Here is why : Expense. Aggressive law enforcement due to high crime / drugs. Did I say expense? Sick of the long / hot / arid summers. I like more green, more rain, more temperate summers, better State management and government.

Vegas was kind of nice, but the use of the car was essential, and the heat was awful / unbearable in the summer. Though the cost of living was pretty low for me. Durango was really really nice in the late spring and summer, but again, the Long winter with deep snow wears me out. I must not be built for it or something. Otherwise I'd definitely live in Durango OR Park City better yet. Yeah, yeah, Vancouver is really nice, but I don't really want to leave the United States, and if I did, it would be for someplace like France.

So I have chosen Oregon for the reasons : 9 Months of incredibly rich, varied riding with 100's of miles of trails which I can access with my bike. Cheap rent compared to Boston / Southern California. Sheer beauty / Healthy Air Quality. Small community, but quite a few medium to big cities within 40 minute--to--2 hours drives. Still close enough to hit Moab or even closer : B.C. in summer. Affordable land. Not crowded / no hostility like I always saw going on in Southern California and though it can be very beautiful in New England, the Winter kills it for me. [No, I don't like winter sports at all---but I do in fact like a 4 season climate that doesn't pummel you.]

So off to Oregon I go. Nice reading everyone's thoughts.


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## sbeedy01 (Nov 7, 2014)

Skrool said:


> I accepted the challenge and read the entire thread. I like hearing everyone's stories.
> 
> I am also preparing to move specifically for better access to nice riding. I've lived in Sierra Madre / Southern California, Santa Fe, Durango, Vegas, and Boston. The best, by far, was Sierra Madre Ca, a foothill town, no need to use my car. Bike can be used for everything life requires. Literally hundreds of miles of every variety of riding was available to me there...from 3 hour climbs, to 30 mile epic / remote single track loops complete with swimming holes, and also knarly down hill fire road as well as tough, technical single track in deep woods. Boston, so far, is the absolute worst. The winter is absolutely rotten, and even in the summer, what I consider 'fun' riding absolutely requires an hour car ride out west or up to New Hampshire. I forget who said it here, but they're right : Being able to ride the bike from your door to the trail is a major necessity for anyone who truly wants to live-the-life. Living the life is only possible if you love it enough to place all else secondary. You will only do this if you simply can not help choosing to do so. It is not really a choice, it is who you are. My entire life is kind of adjusted to accommodate low cost of living, ironically, when I lowered my cost of living, my creativity went up, and I end up making more money because less stressed. It sounds foolish but for me its true.
> 
> ...


Funny thing I'm from New England originally (VT) the winters are brutal, but is very beautiful. Expensive to live there then moved to Tacoma, WA and loved the PNW and plan move back some day. Southern Oregon is beautiful from what I've seen. I didn't pick up MTB until I moved to the Gulf Coast and I can tell you it is flat as all crap and boring lol still love it wish I could of picked it up in VT or in the PNW. Good luck on your move you'll love it!


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## Swissam (Apr 8, 2008)

Not in the U.S but.....Zurich, Switzerland. Great trails that are only a few minutes away from the city center then you have the Alps within 30 minutes. Great job market and wages are some of the best in the world, minimum 4 weeks paid vacation which can go up to 8 weeks as you gain senority. Low\ almost no crime rate. Clean and orderly. Did I mention the Alps are right there in front of you?
In the U.S I found Denver and Colorado Springs to be really good. If I move back to the U.S it might be there but it looks like I will stay here for awhile........until retirement.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Why is it when I hear "clean and orderly", I imagine it being said in a German accent.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

sbeedy01 said:


> _Funny thing I'm from New England originally (VT) the winters are brutal, but is very beautiful. Expensive to live there then moved to Tacoma, WA and loved the PNW and plan move back some day. Southern Oregon is beautiful from what I've seen. I didn't pick up MTB until I moved to the Gulf Coast and I can tell you it is flat as all crap and boring lol still love it wish I could of picked it up in VT or in the PNW. Good luck on your move you'll love it!_



Some people have suggested other places to me....like Fruita, CO, so I went there for a few weeks : The riding was very nice, but I myself couldn't see myself living there. I'd rather live in Santa Fe than Fruita, but that is my own personal feeling. Everyone differs in terms of what 'vibe' they pick up, and for me, I very much require a certain 'feeling' for a place...and Fruita did not have it for me....It felt like a 'stepford wives' kind of town. Santa Fe, on the other hand, is a VERY cool place....LOTS of cultural stuff, LOTS of Art, chili cook-offs, Art festivals...and VERY VERY beautiful. I think that a persons decision can't help but be biased because everyone has different preferences. Like, for me, the older I get, the MORE I prefer riding in the midst of tall trees which offer shade and a 'presence' of life. But when I was in my twenties, I couldn't get enough of desert riding. I still like desert riding, but I don't want to live in it anymore. So that's a personal thing. But with all the riding I've done, so far, for me, Southern California gave me 'the life' for nearly 15 years before it pushed me out. Living in the foothills is the only way I can tolerate 'Los Angeles', but when everyone got greedy with their rents the Artists all got pushed out. When all of a sudden your rent 'doubles' or 'triples' that kind of kills it, and that is what literally happened to 'me' and ALL of my group of like-minded brethren in the years of 2007--2009. So I left because the foothill property got too expensive to pay for, and yes, I could have worked more hours and stayed there, but then what for? I would no longer have time to ride---so it would have defeated the entire purpose of my being there. I call this the 'trap' of death. And I will never fall into the 'trap' of such a deathly approach to life. I've witnessed certain friends succumb to the trap---and now they're so fat and unhealthy that they don't even ride anymore, and that's a very sad thing to me. Since then, Boston has been my base of operations, but the harsh winter is not something I can tolerate any more.

As far as Switzerland---wow---must be beautiful. But I prefer to go down with the sinking ship of my own country for now. Though I have to admit, 'France' is very appealing to me.

Take care.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

That's very funny Bro! I like clean and orderly myself, and though I am in fact Scottish / Italian, I very much lean into 'German' ideology perhaps because I was trained as an Engineer when in college for Product Design.... I've been to a few places in Austria, and the towns were in fact very much 'clean and orderly', then I come back to the US, to all the grime and clutter...and it is a fantastic difference in how one culture treats the land and approaches 'society', and how another can be so incredibly more 'refined' in their relationship to 'all' things.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Skrool,

Sounds like Flagstaff or Reno might have worked for you as well, although I'm not sure Reno offers "ride-out-the-door" kind of lifestyle. 

I've heard that Boise offers a great mix of urban living along with trails within riding distance of the city, but also that the trails are rather mellow. 

I'm with you though, I think I could tolerate a winter environment so long as I had enough time to ride (not super expensive) and the I could live life and ride without using a car.

I've lived in Pennsylvania my entire life and after some recent travels out west, I've learned that I'm completely ok with cold, just not cold/long commute/long drive to trailhead/lack of mountains.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

PHeller said:


> Skrool,
> 
> Sounds like Flagstaff or Reno might have worked for you as well, although I'm not sure Reno offers "ride-out-the-door" kind of lifestyle.
> 
> ...


I actually considered Reno, but Flagstaff is no good for me. Too much snow, plus, 'I' myself didn't get the 'feeling' for the place that I seem to need. Reno turned out to be a 'no' because the land for sale was too high. Compared to Souther Oregon, the land prices in Reno were far too high for what you get. In South-middle Oregon, you can purchase a few acres of land for less than 20 grand...and it is PRISTINE and plus, the amazing riding is literally right outside your door...and the snowy season is very tolerable, with less than 10 inches of snow for the entire three months of true winter that they get.

I would have really liked to go to a place like Santa Cruz, or even some other place in California...but the cost of living is 'wacky' now, unless you're a slave to some large corp who WILL 'steal' your entire life in exchange for big $$$. Been there / done that. Never do it again. Rather be dead than a slave.... In Oregon, I can grow my own vegetables, brew my own beer, participate in trail building, own my own land, and ride as many hours a week as most people are forced to WORK in a place like Southern Cal....or anywhere else for that matter. Boise is also a nice place, did some riding there once. But I guess the main thing it came down to for me was the 'feel' as well as the ability to ride my bike to the trail-heads. The less I am required to use my Truck, the more pleasant I find life to be.


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## buildakicker (Jan 19, 2014)

@Skrool, ditto that area of Oregon. Awesome. @Swissam on my bucket list!


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

What part of Oregon are you talking about? Ashland? That's not exactly cheap. Some parts of the state haven't had an economy in decades other selling homes to Californians.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

SS Hack said:


> What part of Oregon are you talking about? Ashland? That's not exactly cheap. Some parts of the state haven't had an economy in decades other selling homes to Californians.


Oakridge area. I earn my income through an agent who sells my Art, so I can live anywhere I please. I am also a master wood-crafsman, as well as a degree'd Industrial Designer...so whatever I earn 'in town' is just a bonus for me, as I am always inclined to perform work for appreciative people, even if they don't really have the income to pay me what my skills are worth. Oakridge area has lots of small lots for sale, and taxes average less than a grand per year. With 15 to 50 grand you can pretty much purchase really nice land ready to go...with electric, sewer and water already up to the property. I myself would not hook up to city electric, but I might in fact hook up to sewer. I plan on putting in a wood walled 'Yurt'...a 30 footer, with 20 foot ceilings...solar powered, with compost and drip system for reclaiming water and such. I don't like Eugene, nor Bend. Also, in New Mexico, land is also quite abundant. Ca. is wacky. Colorado is too harsh of a winter. Arizona holds no interest for me unless to visit. It really came down to Oregon or Santa Fe area for me. And I spent a year really looking hard and taking everything into consideration.


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

for the guys "living the life", what are you doing about health insurance, life insurance, schooling for your children, etc... Does your significant other help out with all of the chores required when living off the land?

I haven't lived anywhere outside Eastern Wisconsin, so I need to travel a bit more to see what I like. I've vacationed in SC, FL, and NV. I had a phone interview with a company in Colorado Springs a couple days ago, but that is a long shot. I also don't know if I can afford to live there given I can barely afford my modest home I have now.


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## sbeedy01 (Nov 7, 2014)

slowride454 said:


> for the guys "living the life", what are you doing about health insurance, life insurance, schooling for your children, etc... Does your significant other help out with all of the chores required when living off the land?
> 
> I haven't lived anywhere outside Eastern Wisconsin, so I need to travel a bit more to see what I like. I've vacationed in SC, FL, and NV. I had a phone interview with a company in Colorado Springs a couple days ago, but that is a long shot. I also don't know if I can afford to live there given I can barely afford my modest home I have now.


I'd visit Colorado Springs if you are considering it. It is beautiful up there! My brother lives there and visit there frequently. It is expensive as crap though, but there are some surrounding areas that aren't to bad. The weather up there is super unpredictable. I drove there last April it was snowing and then the next day was like 60 degrees! It also hails there a lot, but all that weather doesn't bother me I have been contemplating between moving back to WA or CO, but I now have my heart set on WA. Also the south is very cheap. I live in MS now not my speed at all definitely am looking forward to leaving! lol

Skrool: I have always wanted to check out Santa Fe planning on riding there next month when I'm up in CO. I always had this fascination with the desert I don't know why and can't wait to actually ride there!


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

slowride454 said:


> for the guys "living the life", what are you doing about health insurance, life insurance, schooling for your children, etc... Does your significant other help out with all of the chores required when living off the land?
> 
> I haven't lived anywhere outside Eastern Wisconsin, so I need to travel a bit more to see what I like. I've vacationed in SC, FL, and NV. I had a phone interview with a company in Colorado Springs a couple days ago, but that is a long shot. I also don't know if I can afford to live there given I can barely afford my modest home I have now.


As 'odd' as it may seem to most people, 'I' have zero interest in 'health insurance'. I am 48. Take no medication. Have never had any illnesses. Eat two meals a day, mostly vegetarian, with the occasional addition of 'eggs'. On the rare occasion I might take penicillin for the once a decade infection. If I ever go cancer or the like, I'd have no interest in going through all the hoops to 'stay alive' beyond my 'fate'. The way I see it, human beings existed for 100's of thousands of years without EVER having felt the need for 'insurance' of any kind. Sure, many likely died young, but so be it. I have no problem with being reclaimed by Nature's Will...whenever She deems it's my time to 'go'...so be it. So I guess that makes me some kind of ludite? I don't care what people think. I don't concern myself with the socially ingrained 'worries' of the modern day's 'idea' of what life 'is'---how it should be 'approached'....etc.

Regarding 'significant other' ? I have none. I do have a 25 year old son. Who is kind young person living in San Diego. But I've yet to encounter a female who shares the same 'spartan' / hollistic / Naturalistic approach to life that 'I' most especially require and obey. I have been this way my entire life...excluding a bery brief 'high dollar' income lifestyle as an Automotive Designer / Product Designer. Wasn't impressed. Money is not the answer for me. Relationship to Nature is the answer for 'Me' personally...the more pure the relationship to 'Life'---the better I feel, the more 'alive' I feel.

Regarding 'living off the land' ? I don't per say 'live off the land' entirely, I buy organic food at the store, and supplement by growing stuff too---like dark greens, berries, tomatoes....sometimes a little 'weed' [for medicinal purposes mainly]. I wouldn't mind having a companion, but not at the expense of a boatload of stress and seemingly unavoidable 'drama' which---for me---seems to have always somehow 'crept into' my life whenever I've attempted to conjoin myself with another person in terms of living together. I like my solitude, and require MUCH of it. This latter fact always seems to 'put off' the female persuasion. So I've just opted to stay single and enjoy my uncluttered companionship with Nature...and riding buddies...some of whom are female, most of whom are male.

I would not trade ANYTHING for 'living the life' of communion with the Mountains and the Bike and Good / wholesome food----and a few good / loyal friends. Still---I am not 'closed' to the prospect of encountering a significant other...if it happens, I will know it, if not, I'm wholly fulfilled as it is.

Regarding work / income in relation to 'living the life' ? It helps to have a network of people, it also helps to have 'skills' and 'talents'...of which...I have both in ample measure. And I DO have ample skills and talents because I have spent my entire life acquiring New skills and refiniing them ongoingly thereafter. You'd be amazed at how much skill you can acquire in many areas if you've NEVER spent a single hour in front of a television. And I have never owned a television. Ever. So my entire life has been a source a mixture of Joy, and Self Refinement....with ZERO immersion in 'social programming'. I make my money selling a diversity of Art, and in addition, I am a master woodworker, pinstriper, and quite a few other things. I tend to ride the moutainbike no less than 30 hours a week, on occassion, sometimes double that. Sometimes I might be utterly consumed with a painting or sculpture...in which case, I might not ride for much, other than that, mountain biking is my hearts highest joy...with Art a close second.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

sbeedy01 said:


> I'd visit Colorado Springs if you are considering it. It is beautiful up there! My brother lives there and visit there frequently. It is expensive as crap though, but there are some surrounding areas that aren't to bad. The weather up there is super unpredictable. I drove there last April it was snowing and then the next day was like 60 degrees! It also hails there a lot, but all that weather doesn't bother me I have been contemplating between moving back to WA or CO, but I now have my heart set on WA. Also the south is very cheap. I live in MS now not my speed at all definitely am looking forward to leaving! lol
> 
> Skrool: I have always wanted to check out Santa Fe planning on riding there next month when I'm up in CO. I always had this fascination with the desert I don't know why and can't wait to actually ride there!


Hi Sbeedy! Yes, Colorado Springs is a nice place...in the Spring, summer and early fall. But I would never, ever live there. The winter is too harsh for me, and the city itself is not my style of 'feel'. Regarding Santa Fe : It is a very unique place, especially if you like Culture, Art, and Artsy type feeling towns. I has, however, gotten a heck of a lot more 'commercial' in the last 15 years time. But the town itself 'old town', is still intact and as nice at its always been. Riding can be nice, but you have to drive to get to it. Taos is also nice, but the winter is brutally cold. If you rely on your surrounding for income...don't even consider Santa Fe...it is fiercely competitive---even for minimum wage type jobs, but IF you make your money other ways, then it can be really cheap to live there. For me, the main turn off for ALL of Colorado is the winter. It's too harsh and long for my taste. But places like Phoenix hold zero interest for me...I LIKE trees and do NOT like to feel like I'm being 'assaulted' by the sun for months on end with no relief. It gets old after a while. I need the mountains and trees. Santa Fe has both. But income is the clincher there.

Perhaps the most essential ingredient for being able to have a healthy heart and mind, for me, is LOW COST OF LIFE. The higher the cost of living, the less likely it will be that your heart and mind will have true health and wealth. I simply can not tolerate the artificial / contrived pressure cooker of high-cost of living in crime ridden cities which offer very little in way of TRUE access to quality of life / person / spirit. But that's just my own feeling. It is personal. Others might feel the exact opposite...and be just fine. So I guess you must just strive to 'Know' and be 'true' to your own person.


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## Magnum Ti (Jun 30, 2011)

I'll say Maryland, Pennsylvania, or West Virginia. But then again, I am just lying to myself because I don't live in any of the other sweet places mentioned.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Skrool said:


> The higher the cost of living, the less likely it will be that your heart and mind will have true health and wealth. I simply can not tolerate the artificial / contrived pressure cooker of high-cost of living in crime ridden cities which offer very little in way of TRUE access to quality of life / person / spirit. But that's just my own feeling. It is personal. Others might feel the exact opposite...and be just fine. So I guess you must just strive to 'Know' and be 'true' to your own person.


Even in cities that don't have crime, or clean and safe suburban areas, that pressure to keep up with your neighbors consumerism, to take that job with an hour commute, to be hours away from "real" open space, and to recoil from community because of a hatred of differing ideas. That is not the type of place I want to be.

PA/MD/WV are all great low costs areas, and the Pittsburgh riding community is quite active, but it seems like lately the winters have been a muddy mess that alternate between frigid temps and cold rain, with the occasional blizzard mixed in. I always say "if Pittsburgh were in Southern Colorado or Northern New Mexico, I'd be there in an instant." Great job market, great cost of living, great communities and lots of history, but weather that makes enjoying all of that very difficult if you're an outdoor person.


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## Surfdog93 (May 30, 2005)

Skrool said:


> Oakridge area. I earn my income through an agent who sells my Art, so I can live anywhere I please. I am also a master wood-crafsman, as well as a degree'd Industrial Designer...so whatever I earn 'in town' is just a bonus for me, as I am always inclined to perform work for appreciative people, even if they don't really have the income to pay me what my skills are worth. Oakridge area has lots of small lots for sale, and taxes average less than a grand per year. With 15 to 50 grand you can pretty much purchase really nice land ready to go...with electric, sewer and water already up to the property. I myself would not hook up to city electric, but I might in fact hook up to sewer. I plan on putting in a wood walled 'Yurt'...a 30 footer, with 20 foot ceilings...solar powered, with compost and drip system for reclaiming water and such. I don't like Eugene, nor Bend. Also, in New Mexico, land is also quite abundant. Ca. is wacky. Colorado is too harsh of a winter. Arizona holds no interest for me unless to visit. It really came down to Oregon or Santa Fe area for me. And I spent a year really looking hard and taking everything into consideration.


Skrool, thanks for doing "the/my" research, lol. I have been contemplating a move as well and appreciate your input. You mentioned some locations with winters too harsh, but wouldn't Oakridge be pretty chilly/wet from say, Nov-Feb ? Coming from FL, I'm looking for trees and prefer more up/down XC, as opposed to 1-2 hr climbs with 20 min descents. The heat does not bother me, but am not into riding much under 45 deg F....well not currently anyways. I work from home via remote desktop, so as long as I have internet, my options are open.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

*The Discussion trogs along....*



Surfdog93 said:


> Skrool, thanks for doing "the/my" research, lol. I have been contemplating a move as well and appreciate your input. You mentioned some locations with winters too harsh, but wouldn't Oakridge be pretty chilly/wet from say, Nov-Feb ? Coming from FL, I'm looking for trees and prefer more up/down XC, as opposed to 1-2 hr climbs with 20 min descents. The heat does not bother me, but am not into riding much under 45 deg F....well not currently anyways. I work from home via remote desktop, so as long as I have internet, my options are open.


Hello Brother. Indeed, I [have] done quite a bit of hands-on research concerning this most crucial [for some] topic. Having lived in Las Vegas, Southern California [San Diego, as well as Pasadena foothills / Angels Crest National Forest], Durango, Santa-Fe, Boston, New Hampshire, Florida, I indeed do have 'actual' knowledge from direct experience.

Truly, what it comes down to, before a person can even begin to access / ascertain a bona-fide answer to such a question concerning 'where' to drop-anchor in order to make 'riding' a main / pivotal priority, it must be answered, truthfully : WHAT--kind of rider are you? A person who enjoys BOTH climbing and descending equally, WILL need access to challenging mountainous terrain...otherwise...you will simply NOT have any rides nearby which offer any type of challenge or enjoyment when it comes to 'climbing'. For 'me', this is very important. If I have no way to start a ride with at least a hour or two 'climb', then it's not a ride I will EVER be inclined to favor doing very often. To 'me', a ride doesn't get going until the 2-3 hour mark. For others, 'climbing' is a chore, and they prefer to ride short rides of an hour or less...with an occassional 3-4 hour ride. This is not sufficient for 'me'. MY idea of a 'ride' is no less than 4 hours, preferably 4-10 hours long. And if I am going to move to a place where riding is one of my 'main' / core priorities, then this type of riding MUST---be prevalent as an offer right from my house. I mean, I EXPECT to be able to ride to the trail head directly from---my residence.

When you mention Oakridge having a 'winter' : Yes. It does. But it ALSO has ample access to TRUE mountain country, full of TRUE trees [as compared to 'scrub']. I am willing to accept a 3 month winter. No more. The problem with Aridzona, is the rides are not really all that impressive to me. Sure, here and there are some good rides...but they are scattered, and, there is very little in way of 3 hour climbs...and where there ARE a few such trails, there is ALSO a bitter winter, and or, it is a crappy place to live. Aridzona is no interest to me. Fruita Colorado is a great option for all around riding, but again, there is not much in way of epoch climbs..there are few, but not ample many. Plus, the 'town' itself is kind of drab, and yet, the cost of land / housing is just as expensive as it is in other places which offer FAR MORE in way of culture, feeling, and resources.

Moab is no good. The town sucks. And there are NO trees. Santa Fe NM is very nice in terms of 'feel', however, the Winter can be pretty damn cold, and, it tends to last 4 1/2 months or so. Plus, though there is good riding, you have to drive to access it...and even then, the best trails are under snow until late April...and are 40 miles north near Taos. The east coast is the absolute WORST because of the crappy / depressing / grey winter, not to mention the EXPENSE. If I were filthy rich, hands down, it would be Southern California, because right from your doorstep you have access to 12 hour rides...some with half that consisting of epoch climbs, and the other half a mixture of epoch / technical single track, and wide open down-hill type fun. It's a shame it's gotten so out of hand expensive to live in a foothill community in Southern California...and to attempt it solo---by yourself---with no 'family' network in the vacinity, well, you've got to be Mr. Moneybags.

There are little sweet spots tucked in here and there in a few states, and Oregon has a few little niche places where the weather patterns diverge from areas that are even 50 miles away. For me, 'Bend' is no interest. Nor do I like 'Eugene'. In both cases, the weather is not all that great / and or, the winter is not appealing.

Take a place like Park City Utah : GREAT rides, but CRAPPY winter, and by crappy, I mean the trails are buried until mid may. I myself do NOT like being pummeled by snow. In fact, the older I get, the less I am willing to put up with it. But neither is it ANY joy to live in places like 'Phoenix', or 'Vegas'....and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. For the fact of the matter is this : When it's over 100 degrees outside, I don't care HOW little humidity is in the air, the LAST thing you feel like doing is going outside to do ANY-THING...least of all 'riding a bike'. It SUCKS...and this 'suckage' holds on for 4 months! So screw that bro. Been there, done that } .... Ok to visit these places, but living there as a Mountain-Biker is a thumbs down. Again, I'm not 'guessing', I DID it. And that---is my own conclusion.


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

it's just a trick question, there is no "perfect" place for mountain biking. 

while living in Crested Butte has some of the best riding in the US 4-5 (June-Oct) months out of the year, in a perfect world I would love to have a second house in Sedona to extend the season out those other 7 months out of the year (Nov-May) when snow conditions aren't great for skiing and when the desert isn't too hot. To me that is perfection.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

PHeller said:


> Even in cities that don't have crime, or clean and safe suburban areas, that pressure to keep up with your neighbors consumerism, to take that job with an hour commute, to be hours away from "real" open space, and to recoil from community because of a hatred of differing ideas. That is not the type of place I want to be.
> 
> PA/MD/WV are all great low costs areas, and the Pittsburgh riding community is quite active, but it seems like lately the winters have been a muddy mess that alternate between frigid temps and cold rain, with the occasional blizzard mixed in. I always say "if Pittsburgh were in Southern Colorado or Northern New Mexico, I'd be there in an instant." Great job market, great cost of living, great communities and lots of history, but weather that makes enjoying all of that very difficult if you're an outdoor person.


 Hello Brother. I know what you are saying. But in my view, here is how 'I' feel about your statements : I don't give a rats ass what my so called 'neighbors' think of me regardless of WHERE I am living. I make no pretense about who I am, or what I value / don't value. My values, I have found, are utterly 'baffling' to most so called 'neighbors'. 'I' place exceedingly higher value on my time on a bike out in Nature..than most people would / could ever 'understand'. I myself would NEVER 'commute' to anything...LEAST of all 'working' at a 'job' for some-one else...who benefits from MY labor--at the direct expense of MY life-force. I'd rather live in a tent than commit myself to a high-mortgage / paycheck chasing routine.

Regarding the East Coast Winter : It SUCKS. And I mean : it is DEPRESSING and RELENTLESSLY SUCKAGE. I will never live here again....ever. Sure, there are some nice trails that eventually open up mid to late may, but even then, it's a gamble on whether or not it's going to 'rain' for 4-5 days strait, and turn your plans for 'riding' into a MUDDY no-go. ...And 'this' latter scenario happens more frequently than not. So, even when it IS the season for riding on the east coast, you never able to 'bank' on whatever plans you make for 'riding'. I can't tell you how many times I'd made plans to ride...in New Hampshire, Vermont...only to get there and be utterly rained out....with the only thing to do at that point, is to find a pub and drink away my sorrows... No thanks. Again, 'job' market? Screw job-markets. I've totally adjusted [myself] to avoid...at all cost...ANY type of 'job-market'. ...And mind you, I had, for a time, been a 'corporate' trog with the best of them. Earning upwards of 2-3 grand a week was normal for me for a time. But guess what : I had NO LIFE. My 'Life' was NOT my own....I 'belonged' to / and was the 'property' of OTHERS. So with ALL that money, I RARELY ever found time or energy to do anything more than an hour long ride...once or twice a week, alas, IF----I was 'lucky'. Never again. Slavery to corporate usurpation is a mind-stealer and a heart-killer...and I will never, ever, again participate in that 'chase' to no-where land.

The abosolute key for 'Me' is this : Make your life as SIMPLE as you possibly can. REDUCE ALL extrainious expenses to absolute essentials, and LEARN to 'appreciate' doing things that matter : Like reading good books about great people in history. Learning new skills...like sculpting, woodworking, making things, designing things, welding. And of course : BIKING. Since the age of 20...I have not owned a television. I am now 49. ...ALL of the time I MIGHT have spent watching the idiot box---I have spent reading and learning and mastering NEW skills and developing NEW talents. THIS---in turn, has culminated in allowed me to 'make money' at things no matter WHERE I throw down anchor. ...But IF--you are dependent on cookie cutter type 'jobs', well then, I guess you're kind of going to be 'stuck' kissing the a-s-s of some major commute, or worse, living directly IN a dirty / crime-ridden metropolis where everything is counter to health and well being and the societal approach to self and life in general is completely assinine. I myself would rather be DEAD than be in this boat. ...And Brother, I'm not kidding here. I would--in fact--rather be DEAD than live in such a way. But I do in fact empathize with people who are 'stuck' in this modality, for, it is assuredly difficult to 'squirm out of'. ...And for anyone who 'attempts' to make the 'Great Escape'---well---it can be tough. It can take years to accomplish. But even so, it is WORTH it.


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## mudforlunch (Aug 9, 2004)

PHeller said:


> PA/MD/WV are all great low costs areas


Maryland has one of the highest costs of living in the entire country. Unless you live on the eastern shore, or in western maryland near WV, it is by no means low cost.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

BDKeg said:


> it's just a trick question, there is no "perfect" place for mountain biking.
> 
> while living in Crested Butte has some of the best riding in the US 4-5 (June-Oct) months out of the year, in a perfect world I would love to have a second house in Sedona to extend the season out those other 7 months out of the year (Nov-May) when snow conditions aren't great for skiing and when the desert isn't too hot. To me that is perfection.


Crested Butte indeed DOES have some nice riding. I've ridden the trails there, enjoyed the town. I've even camped high-up in late September and froze my a-s-s off. Still, it is very beautiful place to visit. Sedona? It's also quite nice to visit. I myself could never live there, but it is nice to visit. There IS in fact the 'perfect' place to live for year-round mountain biking fun, and that is IN FACT : Southern California. I know this because I lived there for almost 14 years, and NO PLACE offers year round riding with EPOCH climbs, EPOCH single track and EPOCH downhill right outside your door. No place. No place even comes close, at least, not int the United States. There is no other place in the United States that allows you access ALL varieties of riding ALL---YEAR---ROUND. Period. It is a FACT. Sedona is a bit of rip-off for land / housing. And the winter can be pretty cold and not rally nice for riding. I've been there in the dead of winter, and the last thing on my mind would be riding.

Fruita would be the absolute best bet for a moutain biking life-style in terms of Colorado. Very little snow each winter. Many trails accessible year round...if a bit cold here on occassion. But the town is kind of meager and somewhat 'drab' / uninspiring.

A foothill town in Southern California is 'thee' perfect bet for riding year round, but its getting harder and harder to find places to live because of the fact that the secret is out now...and all of the filthy rich people have been buying up all the foothill land and property, and then turning around in renting it out for double or triple what it once was. This is the problem which has really ruined foothill living in So Cal. Up until 2005-2009, you could still find places to rent in the foothills right up against the base of the Mountains for $500 to $800 / month....but now those same places are renting for $1,500 to $2,500 / month. So the rich have utterly 'stolen' the entire foothill type community 'feel' and converted it into their own territory....and the sad thing is, most people who NOW live in these areas, don't even spend ANY time in the mountains or on the trails. So it is very sad that this happened. I TRULY loved living there. Living in a foothill community is 'thee' greatest place to live if you're a mountain biker. Perhaps this might even hold true for hidden gem areas in Arizona, but as of yet, I do not know of any.

I would say, the one TRUE way to over-come all of these dilemma's, would be to have a small / medium size 'Airstream' travel-trailer, and hunker down one part of the year in Colorado, then hit the road with it and hunker down somewhere in Arizona or So Cal for the winter. I myself am still pondering this possibility. It is very doable. And in this way, you are NEVER 'stuck' anywhere....you can pack up and move around at will.


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

This word, "epoch" does not mean what you think it does...


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

SkaredShtles said:


> This word, "epoch" does not mean what you think it does...


Don't 'school' me on your technicalities. A well know fact is this : People in general are utterly acclimated to using certain terms which have long since been 'hijacked' for use within certain domains / creedo's of thought. 'Epic' / Epoch'---whatever matters not, is one such word for Mountain bikers. Why waste your time schooling people on technicalities which offer zero input to the point of the discussion...???

If you have something to offer that actually 'matters'---say something. ...IF not----abstain.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

> 'Epic' / Epoch'---whatever matters not, is one such word for Mountain bikers. Why waste your time schooling people on technicalities which offer zero input to the point of the discussion...???


Sorry, can't help myself as the terms are not even close to synonymous.

*Epic* 2. Surpassing the usual or ordinary, particularly in scope or size
3. Heroic and impressive in quality

*Epoch *a period of time in history or a person's life, typically one marked by notable events or particular characteristics. More commonly, a geologic term: a division of time that is a subdivision of a period and is itself subdivided into ages, corresponding to stratigraphy as in "the Pliocene epoch"


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## SkaredShtles (May 13, 2007)

Skrool said:


> Don't 'school' me on your technicalities. A well know fact is this : People in general are utterly acclimated to using certain terms which have long since been 'hijacked' for use within certain domains / creedo's of thought. 'Epic' / Epoch'---whatever matters not, is one such word for Mountain bikers. Why waste your time schooling people on technicalities which offer zero input to the point of the discussion...???
> 
> If you have something to offer that actually 'matters'---say something. ...IF not----abstain.


And what's with all the single-quotes?


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## BDKeg (May 19, 2011)

Skrool said:


> There IS in fact the 'perfect' place to live for year-round mountain biking fun, and that is IN FACT : Southern California.


forgot about soco, damn your perfect climate. So essentially it's impossible to live somewhere with seasons and mountain bike year round


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## Surfdog93 (May 30, 2005)

Skrool said:


> Hello Brother. Indeed, I [have] done quite a bit of hands-on research concerning this most crucial [for some] topic. Having lived in Las Vegas, Southern California [San Diego, as well as Pasadena foothills / Angels Crest National Forest], Durango, Santa-Fe, Boston, New Hampshire, Florida, I indeed do have 'actual' knowledge from direct experience.
> 
> Truly, what it comes down to, before a person can even begin to access / ascertain a bona-fide answer to such a question concerning 'where' to drop-anchor in order to make 'riding' a main / pivotal priority, it must be answered, truthfully : WHAT--kind of rider are you? A person who enjoys BOTH climbing and descending equally, WILL need access to challenging mountainous terrain...otherwise...you will simply NOT have any rides nearby which offer any type of challenge or enjoyment when it comes to 'climbing'. For 'me', this is very important. If I have no way to start a ride with at least a hour or two 'climb', then it's not a ride I will EVER be inclined to favor doing very often. To 'me', a ride doesn't get going until the 2-3 hour mark. For others, 'climbing' is a chore, and they prefer to ride short rides of an hour or less...with an occassional 3-4 hour ride. This is not sufficient for 'me'. MY idea of a 'ride' is no less than 4 hours, preferably 4-10 hours long. And if I am going to move to a place where riding is one of my 'main' / core priorities, then this type of riding MUST---be prevalent as an offer right from my house. I mean, I EXPECT to be able to ride to the trail head directly from---my residence.
> 
> ...


Great thread and many thanks for the valuable insight. My (current) rides are much shorter, 1-2.5hrs on average 5x / week, but that's due in part to what our local trails offer. A good friend of mine has a place in Park City and loves it, but then again, he only spends the summer out there and the other months in FL.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Just offered a job out in Flagstaff. Good pay, good benefits, new trails. I think I'll take it. Worst that could happen is the town is too expensive to settle, but as long as my student loans are paid down with relatively ease, we'll survive. 

Housing prices aren't ideal, but I've got debts that need paid before I can live in a yurt. Might as well enjoy where I'm living while I pay those debts.


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## Fred Smedley (Feb 28, 2006)

Grants pass OR, Bend OR, Moscow ID, Boise, ID, Spokane WA, CDL ID.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

trailboy said:


> Unbelievable single track, no crowds, affordable for regular people, and the great wide open...
> Check us out: Home


And not a job in sight - could be a good retirement spot.


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Skrool

Have you spent a summer in OR/PNW? I've gathered you're not a fan of winter but I can assure you fire/smoke is worse. The last 3-4 seasons in Oakridge have seen at least one month of unrideable conditions due to smoke/fire. If it gets dry the forest service will close huge tracts of lands to boot. There is an impending apocalyptic fire season this summer due to record low snow pack on the entire western continent. Aint gonne be pretty...no sir.

I say we have a lot in common with world view/philosophy & have led quasi parallel lives. I have a love/hate relationship with society & plan to gradually lead a life of self subsistence. I've been prepping for a such a move my entire life living large chunks of time alone in the wilderness eating only what I could find. Though that's fairly easy with a net in an AK summer. Idaho is front runner for me when I buy a piece of property. I've considered Oakridge as well. I love snow though & like extremes in general, weather or otherwise. A simple lifestyle is an interesting concept as not sure subsistence living = simple.

Maybe we could get ride in together in Oakridge. Good luck....GREAT THREAD!


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

Skrool said:


> As 'odd' as it may seem to most people, 'I' have zero interest in 'health insurance'. I am 48.


Skrool's probably trolling, but... I'll bite.

Broke my wrist in December, over the bars on a moderate descent, slow speed... rock hiding in a poison oak bush, distal radius/ulna shattered, 5.5 hours in surgery...


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Yikes, I busted a tooth bedding crappy Avid brakes and thought that was bad. Hope you recovered! Did you get ti parts?


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

SS Hack said:


> Yikes, I busted a tooth bedding crappy Avid brakes and thought that was bad. Hope you recovered! Did you get ti parts?


Steel Is Real!!!

Back to riding my Rigid SIR9, a bit more cautiously...


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## k2rider1964 (Apr 29, 2010)

Not to be argumentative because I agree with a lot of what you have to say and you summarize with "that is my conclusion" but you talk about all these TOWNS that you say "suck". Now I love the riding in Oakridge and I'll be back this year as well but the town of Oakridge ***SUCKS***!!!! Probably the worst single town of any MTB destination I've been to and I've been to most out West. When I asked the guys at the local bike shop (which is the best part of the town) where they get a good breakfast, I was told the locals go to Dairy Queen! Really?



Skrool said:


> Moab is no good. The town sucks. And there are NO trees. Santa Fe NM is very nice in terms of 'feel', however, the Winter can be pretty damn cold, and, it tends to last 4 1/2 months or so. Plus, though there is good riding, you have to drive to access it...and even then, the best trails are under snow until late April...and are 40 miles north near Taos. The east coast is the absolute WORST because of the crappy / depressing / grey winter, not to mention the EXPENSE. If I were filthy rich, hands down, it would be Southern California, because right from your doorstep you have access to 12 hour rides...some with half that consisting of epoch climbs, and the other half a mixture of epoch / technical single track, and wide open down-hill type fun. It's a shame it's gotten so out of hand expensive to live in a foothill community in Southern California...and to attempt it solo---by yourself---with no 'family' network in the vacinity, well, you've got to be Mr. Moneybags.
> Take a place like Park City Utah : GREAT rides, but CRAPPY winter, and by crappy, I mean the trails are buried until mid may. I myself do NOT like being pummeled by snow. In fact, the older I get, the less I am willing to put up with it. But neither is it ANY joy to live in places like 'Phoenix', or 'Vegas'....and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. For the fact of the matter is this : When it's over 100 degrees outside, I don't care HOW little humidity is in the air, the LAST thing you feel like doing is going outside to do ANY-THING...least of all 'riding a bike'. It SUCKS...and this 'suckage' holds on for 4 months! So screw that bro. Been there, done that } .... Ok to visit these places, but living there as a Mountain-Biker is a thumbs down. Again, I'm not 'guessing', I DID it. And that---is my own conclusion.


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## LaXCarp (Jul 19, 2008)

I am moving to Asheville NC with a job lined up, so I hope it is there!


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

patski said:


> Steel Is Real!!!
> 
> Back to riding my Rigid SIR9, a bit more cautiously...


Be very careful beading brakes.


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## gnome ad (May 11, 2011)

Also, it's a good idea to consider where are you going to ride within say 4-5 hours if the weather isn't cooperative, trails get stale, or you just need to mix it up. 

I pound the trails around SLC, UT (home base) and escape to St George, UT and Moab, UT year round. But once spring/summer/Fall hits I have SW Montana (Bozeman/Big Sky), Idaho (Ketchum and Teton Valley), Wyoming (Jackson) all within a 5 hour drive away to keep things interesting. Then again, I like the snow so don't mind if I have to mix in a powder day here and there.


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## rshalit (Oct 27, 2006)

90minIPA said:


> I enjoy the towns of Crested Butte and Telluride for their vibes and riding.


Telluride really? Lift serve maybe. I love it there but very little singletrack.


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## d3ftone (Oct 20, 2015)

What are the thoughts on Spokane? Looks like it gets way less rain than Seattle and has a decent sized population. How's the riding there? I'm considering Bend as well but I'm scared it will be too small and I'll get bored. Any other suggestions? Are there any affordable areas of Cali with plenty of trails? Any input would be appreciated, thanks.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Spokane- lots of discussion on the WA board.
But...

Super vibrant bike community. 10+ local bike shops
Tons of local riding with a huge variety of trails 
Riding season is 3.5., 4.0 if you have a fat bike.
Good schools
Affordable cost of living
I live in town - Riverside State Park, Mt Spokane State Park, Beacon, High Drive, Iller Creek, Liberty Lake, Saltese --- all within 1/2 hour of my front door. Well, 45 for Mt Spokane.
Active organization Evergreen East - Evergreen Mountain Bike Alliance Eastern Washington Chapter
World class singletrack, off the radar (Kettle Crest, Bonners Ferry etc) within 100 miles.
BC singletrack, just over the border
Like wintersports? 5 ski areas within 90 miles.

I've lived here since 91.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Depends what bores you I guess.


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## d3ftone (Oct 20, 2015)

Thanks for the info. When you say the riding season is 3.5/4.0 are you referring to the four seasons? When I say bored I'm referring to how much there is to do in the city (and that's just based on looking at the population cause I've never been to either city), not the cycling/outdoor activities. I'd be willing to sacrifice some outdoor activities for a larger city (Spokane has 3x the population of Bend). If a city had the best riding in the world but only 1000 people lived there then I couldn't consider it. Ian why do you think Spokane would be boring?


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

3.5/4.0 I mean it depends on how much it snows in town. Last year, we all biked year round. It might be that way again this year if El Nino has its way. Other years, there are maybe 2-3 months when most folks don't get out on bikes unless they fat bike. This changes from year to year. Most folks do some sort of snow sport (alpine/nordic/backcountry/snowmobile/snowshoe) so only the sofa surfers stay inside all winter.

If you are looking for ultra metropolitan, this is not the place. We have all that stuff (symphony, plays, art walks, etc) and I'm sure it's good quality but not the same as you'd get in a big city.

We picked this town in 91 due to proximity to national forest, mountains, whitewater and snow sports. We added mt biking to the mix once we got here.

I do hear it sucks if you are young and single but I wouldn't know about either of those things.


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## LMN (Sep 8, 2007)

Spokane is a cool city. The best thing about it is it's proximity to Canada. Particularly the Kootenays; Nelson, Rosland, Fernie. Those places have some of the best mountain biking and skiing on the planet. And best of all, there is no one there.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

If it makes you feel any better, no one has vandalized my Bernie stickers. Certainly it's not as liberal or hipster as Seattle or Portland, but it's also changed a lot since kids who left years ago are moving back with families and have changed things.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Spokane is cool in a working class, gritty, best times behind but poised for a comeback, sort of way. I really like it, the architecture, and the affordability, plus location within a near day's drive to endless wilderness and outdoors opportunities that I consider better than those near Bend.

Bend is cool if you have lots of money, and want to live in a "smaller" city that is very white, outdoorsy, monied-centric, and has way too much action/fun/opportunity compared to most towns with similar population. Bend is a white person's, craft beer drinking, foodie-cultured, outdoorsy, sunny-all-the-time, yoga inflected, gated community in the mountains. 

If I had a ton of money and wanted a "safe" outdoorsy lifestyle that is easy to come by and as convenient as changing clothes, I'd go with Bend. Just walk out the door, and everybody is just like you. And you can be doing something outdoorsy in minutes.

If I wanted a bigger city with an edge to it, with easy affordability and homeownership, and was adventurous about my outdoorsmanship, I'd go with Spokane. Might have to work a little harder to find like-minded people, but that's because not everybody is the same. Outdoor opportunities every direction, but you will be in the car 20-30 minutes minimum.

Bend is already bought and sold and will/should only become more exclusive. Rich people will keep buying up the prime area. Poor folk/working folk will be in modular homes in the desert east of town.

Spokane will be the "hot" PNW city in the next 20 years. Real estate in prime areas is still easily approachable. Won't be in 15 years, so long as the economy stays relatively stable.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Just curious, I've heard a lot that the Phil's system is really pretty boring; fellow spokanites have called it "Riveside on steroids". I've only ridden up in the mountains in the Bend area, never in town. Comments?


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Outdoor opportunities every direction, but you will be in the car 20-30 minutes minimum.


Really nice comparison write up, but I beg to differ on the the above. It all depends on where you are located. I can be to three different trailheads in 15 minutes. That's pretty darn convenient.


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## d3ftone (Oct 20, 2015)

Great info guys, really appreciate it. Based on a lot of reading I was starting to come to the same conclusion as your post Slow Danger. Probably going to book a flight to Spokane soon and stay within bike riding distance to Beacon Hill, even going to check out a house for sale that's basically in Minnehaha Park. How's this area of Spokane for living?


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

d3ftone said:


> Great info guys, really appreciate it. Based on a lot of reading I was starting to come to the same conclusion as your post Slow Danger. Probably going to book a flight to Spokane soon and stay within bike riding distance to Beacon Hill, even going to check out a house for sale that's basically in Minnehaha Park. How's this area of Spokane for living?


I've only visited both Spokane and Bend a number of times. Never lived either place. Spokane has lots of rough areas where I wouldn't want to live, but I can't identify them. Maybe Formica will be of some help? I know lots of people prefer the area South of the freeway, up in the hills above the downtown area.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

formica said:


> Just curious, I've heard a lot that the Phil's system is really pretty boring; fellow spokanites have called it "Riveside on steroids". I've only ridden up in the mountains in the Bend area, never in town. Comments?


Depends. For a xc rider who likes a hard tail, single speeding, or short-suspension bike then Phil's allows a rider to disappear into miles and miles of single track. Most of it pretty tame, sure, but you can go forever. Excellent for after work exercise, or to hop on your bike and follow your whims. There are a few challenging/fun rides, but, for the most part, the appeal is to riders who like to pile up the mileage.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

The tricky thing about proximity to trails, cost of living, and job opportunity is that smaller mountain towns have higher cost of living, less job opportunity, and closer proximity to trails. 

Here in Flag I can ride endless amounts of singletrack less than a mile from my house. I can get on the 750 mile AZT without a vehicle. 

Downside? Housing is more expensive than just about anywhere in the mid-west and east coast aside from very popular cities or mountain towns like Asheville.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

PHeller said:


> The tricky thing about proximity to trails, cost of living, and job opportunity is that smaller mountain towns have higher cost of living, less job opportunity, and closer proximity to trails.
> 
> Here in Flag I can ride endless amounts of singletrack less than a mile from my house. I can get on the 750 mile AZT without a vehicle.
> 
> Downside? Housing is more expensive than just about anywhere in the mid-west and east coast aside from very popular cities or mountain towns like Asheville.


Gotta pay to live in good places.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

While I agree, I think it also highlights the difficulty of many cities to implement the green belts to an acreage that allows for long and diverse rides. 

Rather than millions of people moving to mountain towns like Flagstaff, Jackson Hole, Park City, Tahoe, Bend, etc, I think it would be more awesome if popular cities strove to have more natural surface trail systems and green belts.


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## roccoeight (Oct 1, 2007)

Park City, UT


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## Robert Barker (Jul 27, 2014)

Okay, so I know this is probably too far for you....but Hawke's Bay, New Zealand. Incredible mountain biking, hiking varies from the local mountains to the epic Tongariro National PArk or Abel Tasman, Kayaking is easily accesible as we're on the sea, and camping is too easy to get to. Skiing, travel 3 hours and you're on top of a volcano in powder. The mtb park is amazing, lovely people and scenery, cracking bike shops, one of the best places in the world I reckon.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Can you get resident permits for Yanks?


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Salt Lake City, UT


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## Jing (Sep 4, 2013)

Bend, lots of outdoor options and a perfect size town


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

I commented a while back. Update :

I finally made my mountain bike move. I settled here in 'Bellingham, WA.' I was originally thinking about Oakridge OR, but when I got up there to take a look, I realized just how 'dead' the town kinda was. Good riding, but kinda limiting because of its utter lack of anything in town.

So I ended up taking 4 months to actually drive around the upper corner of the country, and when I got into the Bellingham area, I realized that 'this' was the place. The sheer amount of trails here is staggering during the riding season [mid April to late November]. For the dead of winter, close to town you can ride Mt. Gilbraith trails, which include some really nice man-made free-ride type trails with built berms and jumps if that's your thing, or quite a bit of old-school 'natural' type trails which are also in abundance. The place has lots of natural beauty and tree's. And the rent is dirt cheap compared to what I was paying in Massachusetts.

Vancouver is only a hour and some change away from here, and further east and southeast less than a half hour drive are some amazing ranges for late spring, summer, fall riding. I only just this last week stopped riding the local trails every day due to the cold weather which rolled into town. I've been told that it heats up again in March when it gets back into the 50's, but midway through January to middle of February I'm told that its the coldest part of the year, and by cold, I mean as low as mid thirties to mid fourties, with an occasional three day blast of mid thirties. But no where NEAR as rotten ice cold as what I was putting up with in the Boston area, and alas, zero snow here in town. I ride to the trail head from where I live. But come spring, I'll certainly be heading up to Vancouver on the weekends.

The 'rain' here is more like 'drizzle' than rain like south of here. And riding in drizzle I've found to be pretty appealing. The soil here does not get 'muddy' like it did back east. The soil seems to suck up the water and is not the 'clay' type soil but instead is 'peat' based. The bright emerald green moss that covers a lot of the tree trunks and rocks is dazzling to the eye....it looks fake it's so green.

I make my income selling Art and doing product design so I don't need to rely on this place for income. This area doesn't really have much of an industrial sector or high-tech sector to speak of. It's pretty laid back and an amazingly different feel than say 'Seattle', which I did not like at all.

I'm just under two hours north of Seattle, and the weather 'here' is actually somewhat 'different' here than in Seattle. There is a 'pocket' type weather pattern here up on through Vancouver that keeps the winter here quite mild considering how far north it is. It very rarely snows in town here, and when it does, it is usually fully melted before afternoon time. I feel I made the right choice for my likes, which is to have access to massive amounts of trails for the riding season, along with a winter I can 'tolerate' instead of being pummeled to death by. In truth, the greatest place for mountain biking that I've had the privilege of living, was Pasadena CA. Massive trail network with access to 6,000 ft climbs right from my living room. Too bad it got so blisteringly expensive, otherwise I'd have never left there. But so far, I'm really feeling like 'Bellingham' was a great choice.


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## jim c (Dec 5, 2014)

You sir have inspired my jealousy! I ride a Kona and they are who put Bellingham on my map. Just imagine a 'Banana Belt' in the north. It sound awesome.


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## shishono (Jan 10, 2016)

I think everywhere has its own fascination to ride. sometime when I watch MTB video then I want to have mountain or jungle trails near my home but I might miss a lot of urban trails here.


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## 772268 (Jun 8, 2014)

*Yup.*



jim c said:


> You sir have inspired my jealousy! I ride a Kona and they are who put Bellingham on my map. Just imagine a 'Banana Belt' in the north. It sound awesome.


Yup, the Kona building is right down the street from me, as well as 'Transition' bikes headquarters. Also, oddly enough, 'Canfield' bikes also relocated here from Arizona too.

I'm actually headed out in a few hours to put my new 'Exposure SixPack' light to the test. It's warmed up again today [49 deg. F].


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

Checked out your youtube channel, looks awesome! BKK's a bit hot and humid for us northerners.... 



shishono said:


> I think everywhere has its own fascination to ride. sometime when I watch MTB video then I want to have mountain or jungle trails near my home but I might miss a lot of urban trails here.


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## shishono (Jan 10, 2016)

patski said:


> Checked out your youtube channel, looks awesome! BKK's a bit hot and humid for us northerners....


Thanks  It's too hot even for thais.


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## a.d.85 (Aug 14, 2007)

Lots of western towns on the list... wondering who has experience w/ some places east of the Mississippi: 

Chattanooga, TN (has been recently featured in Outside & Bike mags)
Brevard, NC
Burke, VT
Duluth, MN
Traverse City, MI
Bloomington, IN

etc...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

No personal experience but I've got family and friends in upper midwest (Michigan and Wisconsin) and know some folks who lived in Vermont and Asheville/Brevard.

Chattanooga, TN (has been recently featured in Outside & Bike mags) - Humid Summers, occasional but rare snow, muddy winters, southern culture (good and bad). Not a ton of jobs in Chatty. I've often thought if I moved to the Smokies I'd go to Chatty. Poor mans Asheville.

Brevard, NC - Same as Chatty, more expensive to live, less jobs, more snow.

Burke, VT, Duluth, Traverse City - Good for snow biking?

Bloomington, IN - No idea, never researched it and don't know anybody from there.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

a.d.85 said:


> Lots of western towns on the list... wondering who has experience w/ some places east of the Mississippi:
> 
> Chattanooga, TN (has been recently featured in Outside & Bike mags)
> Brevard, NC
> ...


I've pedaled the KT trails( Burke mt., VT) a few times. Work opportunities? The riding is great, with some other trail areas near by. But it does get crowded on the weekends. Like crowded. And VT has a great vibe, Heady Topper anyone? And very popular with the Great White North on some weekends.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Gonna say it. MA, north of Boston. Great riding opportunities. Work, schools, hospitals, cultural, mts nearby plus beach. World class destinations, not so much. I can pedal to 150 miles of trails from my driveway. And 15 miles of trails at the end of my street. Great and active mt bike clubs and trail work. Great beer. And it's where I live. Not all great mt biking has to have giant mountains in the boonies.


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## ryguy79 (Apr 12, 2007)

slowride454 said:


> I had a phone interview with a company in Colorado Springs a couple days ago, but that is a long shot. I also don't know if I can afford to live there given I can barely afford my modest home I have now.


I know this was a while back, but did you ever make it out here?

Personally, I'm quite happy in Colorado Springs. I don't find it all that expensive and the winters are not 'harsh'. Compared to the Midwest it might seem expensive I suppose.

I lived near Lake Superior in the western UP for 5 years and know harsh winters. As you're from Wisconsin, winters here would seem very mellow.


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## Low Pressure (Nov 27, 2006)

Bloomington is a very nice college town, with some of the best biking in the midwest, road or MTB. 
I attended IU my freshman year and rode in the Litttle 500.
Yes, I was a roadie. But in 1976, we didn't have much of a choice.


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## White7 (Feb 9, 2015)

Sacramento here,,Base of the Sierra Mountain range
trails all over,,Folsom,,Auburn,,Northstar bike park,Kirkwood and a short hop to Downieville


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

White7 said:


> Sacramento here,,Base of the Sierra Mountain range
> trails all over,,Folsom,,Auburn,,Northstar bike park,Kirkwood and a short hop to Downieville


It's not out of the question to make a day or weekend trip to the Bay Area, Annadel, Tamarancho, or Santa Cruz trails either. Not to mention all of the pump tracks.

Tons of trails that are rideable nearly year round.... Except in El Niño years. :/


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## ElBorracho62 (Nov 6, 2014)

Have not really read the whole thread, I'm fairly certain that Charlotte NC has been mentioned. Awesome place to live and ride... 20 something awesome breweries... Great cycling community... US National white water center.... Appalachian mountains few hours away and reasonable living costs.... Not to mention plenty of diverse job opportunities.


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## hiro11 (Dec 29, 2011)

Places I've lived (for longer than a year) ranked by mountain biking quality:
1. *The San Juans, CO*. Huge variety, looooong trails, great climbing. I could be on single track within 200 yards of my front door, ride all day and never touch pavement. Within a half hour drive you could go do some seriously gnarly desert rides, again all day. Huge scene of world-class riders but the area is big enough to never be crowded.
2. *The Berkshires, MA*. Again, limitless options. Mud, rocks, snow, singletrack, fireroads etc. You could go do small rolling forest trails in southern Vermont, you could go very technical climbing in the Taconics. Incredibly beautiful area. No one ever hassled you about having a bike on the trails anywhere (if you actually saw anyone). Endless, empty trails to enjoy with your friends.
3. *Amherst, MA*. Not as many options as 1 and 2, but still a number of trails in the area. Many more options within a 20 mile radius. It's a college town so it had a big mountain biking scene. Lots of friendly people and a relaxed atmosphere. Just a cool place to be a bike rider. The Connecticut River valley also features some of the best road riding I've seen anywhere.
4. *Washington, DC*. Nothing to ride in the city except MUPs. Saving grace was that outside of the city there are a ton of good options. If you're willing to drive a bit into VA, there are some epic rides available.

And the absolute worst place I've lived to mountain bike:
5. *Chicago*, where I live now. Flat, ugly topography. There are a lot of riders but a tiny handful of middling bike-legal trails. All trails packed on any weekend. New trail building is actually banned in most Chicagoland counties. Better options are all at least an hour away. The road riding is mostly pretty bad as well. I love this city and the people that live here but it has to be one of the worst mountain biking areas in the country.

I've lived a few other places but only briefly and can't comment.


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## socalMX (Oct 31, 2009)

Move back to the San Juans NOW! Or come on out to California with the rest of half the country...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I imagine the cities in the San Juans probably are lacking jobs.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

White7 said:


> Sacramento here,,Base of the Sierra Mountain range
> trails all over,,Folsom,,Auburn,,Northstar bike park,Kirkwood and a short hop to Downieville


It's a terrible place, don't come here!!!


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## hiro11 (Dec 29, 2011)

PHeller said:


> I imagine the cities in the San Juans probably are lacking jobs.


Ding! It turns out that my kids like to eat. Annoyingly.


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## NOBLwheels (Nov 25, 2014)

Auburn from memory of 2003 was a great place for a rip. When I there last the locals were saying that there was a pretty strict area you could and couldn't ride. From memory it was something about a park I think.
All I remember was on the north side of the river just south of that insane bridge was some fun short single track riding!!
Cannot wait to come back!!!


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## Jayem (Jul 16, 2005)

White7 said:


> Sacramento here,,Base of the Sierra Mountain range
> trails all over,,Folsom,,Auburn,,Northstar bike park,Kirkwood and a short hop to Downieville


True, but significant time to get to everything. In sac, it still takes considerable time to get to Auburn or El Dorado Hills, unless you happen to live right on the freeway, which I wouldn't recommend. Unless you are fortunate enough to live in Natomas or Folsom, the chances of having something ridable close to where you live are low and living somewhere that has access to wilderness is pretty nonexistant. You have to live higher up to do that, but then you run into the problems with the 50 and 80 corridors, the problem being that there simply isn't that much riding down low, Salmon Falls and Sly Park on the 50 side and Auburn on the 80 side. Most everything in Auburn can be ridden in one day, so while it's nice to visit, I would get bored with the trails. The other perspective though is that it makes a "not so bad" place to stage out of, Tahoe is not too far, Grass Valley not too far, Salmon Falls not too far, and of course you got some trails right in town to ride. Knowing how suburban it gets heading down highway 80 from Auburn, I'd just be very apprehensive about living in that direction. Traffic can be murder depending on the location, in addition to highway 80 on weekends.

Downieville and Tahoe are obviously options from Sac, as you mention, but the deeper you live in suburbia, the harder it is to make those trips every weekend IME.

To this extent, some place like Reno would be a better option for riding, or Colorado Springs, Fort Collins, etc. These aren't without their disadvantages too, but much closer to more riding options IMO.

The good thing about the Bay Area is that there are multiple places to ride around the Bay, but getting out of the Bay Area to go to Tahoe or something is a feat that will be unlikely to be replicated every weekend, it can be a good 4hrs to ski resorts or the lake with traffic and depending on where you are starting. Sac gets you out of this choke-hold, but not enough riding nearby IMO to really make it worth it.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Somebody will have to put up some pretty incredible arguments to prove to me somewhere is better than Salt Lake City, UT.


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## andytiedye (Jul 26, 2014)

The best argument against it is that it is a city.

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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

andytiedye said:


> The best argument against it is that it is a city.
> 
> Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk


You don't necessarily have to live in the City. Still some of the worlds top trails within hours.

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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

LCBooger said:


> Somebody will have to put up some pretty incredible arguments to prove to me somewhere is better than Salt Lake City, UT.


Brevard, NC.


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## cbrossman (Mar 23, 2004)

LCBooger said:


> Still some of the worlds top trails within hours.


Top trails within hours does not sound appealing to me. Of course, you may only be talking about getting from one side of SLC to another.
Much like getting from one side of Durango to another, only the units are minutes, not hours.


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## MOJO K (Jan 26, 2007)

I live in Burke VT now. Pure awesome...Fat Bike Poker Run this weekend


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

cbrossman said:


> Top trails within hours does not sound appealing to me. Of course, you may only be talking about getting from one side of SLC to another.
> Much like getting from one side of Durango to another, only the units are minutes, not hours.


Show me better diverse terrain most within 20-30 min at a maximum 4hrs apart.


















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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

LCBooger said:


> Somebody will have to put up some pretty incredible arguments to prove to me somewhere is better than Salt Lake City, UT.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


City, Mormons, bad beer? Start there. I jest. The best riding is where anyone lives.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

leeboh said:


> City, Mormons, bad beer? Start there. I jest. The best riding is where anyone lives.


What do Mormons have to do with riding? I'm Mormon by the way.

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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

The title of this thread is "Best Place to LIVE and ride", and part of living someplace is dealing with the region's culture. 

Lots of riders are very adamant about getting an overpriced microbrew easily after riding. It is commonly believed that SLC has a lack of breweries (and ABV), and therefore getting beers after riding can be challenging. 

I can't drink after riding (only before) so it doesn't bother me none. 

Also, there is a belief that Mormons are the most proselytizing of religions, and that simply living in Utah as a non-church member will put you in the cross hairs (get it, Cross hairs!?!) one way or another. I had a good Mormon buddy in highschool who tried to get me to go to church a few times, I politely declined, and that was that. We were (and are) still friends. There is however a prevalent belief that not being a church member also makes you less likely to get a job, you won't make friends in local politics, and you might find that all your neighbors are LDS.

Me? SLC sounds pretty sweet. It's a safe city thats fairly progressive, it's the most liberal city in Utah, its surrounded by awesomeness, and the cost of living is fairly low. 

Boise seems very similar to SLC without such an LDS influence. Biggest city in an awesome state, within riding distance of trails anywhere in the city, and decent cost of living.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

I have a few non Mormon friends who live SLC area. Evidently there's a whole separate outdoors culture that thrives just fine.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

Here's a challenge: Draw a 6 hour driving day trip line out from any city. See what cycling destinations it takes you to or through. You'll find that if you start from Salt Lake City, no other city comes close. For a quick weekend you could be in Moab, St. George, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley, Steamboat Springs, Fruita/Grand Junction , Vegas, and Boise. Of course there's the riding around home in Park City and Ogden and the myriad canyons lining the valley. The cost of living is great. There are actually several microbreweries and if you know how to get your beer, the low alcohol content is a non-issue. But hey. Keep knocking it. More for us.


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## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

Silentfoe said:


> Here's a challenge: ...


I have to agree with everything you said although SLC is too big of a city for me to want to live in or even very near.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Silentfoe said:


> Here's a challenge: Draw a 6 hour driving day trip line out from any city. See what cycling destinations it takes you to or through. You'll find that if you start from Salt Lake City, no other city comes close. For a quick weekend you could be in Moab, St. George, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley, Steamboat Springs, Fruita/Grand Junction , Vegas, and Boise. Of course there's the riding around home in Park City and Ogden and the myriad canyons lining the valley. The cost of living is great. There are actually several microbreweries and if you know how to get your beer, the low alcohol content is a non-issue. But hey. Keep knocking it. More for us.


Bam.

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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

dir-T said:


> I have to agree with everything you said although SLC is too big of a city for me to want to live in or even very near.


SLC is one of the smaller metro cities in the US.

Go 40 miles outside and you're in about as desolate land you can find.

You clearly aren't as familiar with SLC as you're professing.

As was stated above, keep knocking it. More to us.

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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

LCBooger said:


> SLC is one of the smaller metro cities in the US.
> 
> Go 40 miles outside and you're in about as desolate land you can find.
> 
> ...


He's not knocking it. He's agreeing with all the positives that silentfoe laid out. You can be plenty familiar with a city and still not want to live in a city. FWIW, I completely agree with him. I've lived in big cities, and don't care to do it again. If I had to for some reason, SLC would be at the top of the list.

You may not be familiar with life in Montana.


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## cbrossman (Mar 23, 2004)

I guess you are right, there are no decent trails near Durango.


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

Silentfoe said:


> Here's a challenge: Draw a 6 hour driving day trip line out from any city. See what cycling destinations it takes you to or through. You'll find that if you start from Salt Lake City, no other city comes close. For a quick weekend you could be in Moab, St. George, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley, Steamboat Springs, Fruita/Grand Junction , Vegas, and Boise. Of course there's the riding around home in Park City and Ogden and the myriad canyons lining the valley. The cost of living is great. There are actually several microbreweries and if you know how to get your beer, the low alcohol content is a non-issue. But hey. Keep knocking it. More for us.


Fortunately with that kind of radius you can enjoy nearly ALL of California, most of Nevada and half of Oregon which translates into WAAAY more diversity, trails, lifestyle options, jobs and culture. lol

I think you're going to find it tough to compete with California's Bay Area/Sacramento when it comes to available trails and overall diversity or living. But as a guide I see why you have skin in the game. I'm sure you know a lot of really cool places that are not even on our radar.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

I agree it's a good radius but to say it translates into way more diversity of trails complete horsesh!t. Utah alone has more diversity of trails than any other state. Look at Park City vs. Moab. I'll agree that California has awesome trails. But if you start from LA, name me some amazing trails you can ride on within 10 minutes of downtown? 20?


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

Silentfoe said:


> I agree it's a good radius but to say it translates into way more diversity of trails complete horsesh!t. Utah alone has more diversity of trails than any other state. Look at Park City vs. Moab. I'll agree that California has awesome trails. But if you start from LA, name me some amazing trails you can ride on within 10 minutes of downtown? 20?


Ohh I wasn't advocating for LA. I said the Bay Area/Sacramento. You get desert (and high desert), temperate rainforest, oak woodlands, redwood forests, grasslands, high mountain alpine rocks, etc.. Within 2-2.5hrs I can hit all of that (except low desert) from the Sacramento area.  I also meant diversity of lifestyle options although diversity of trails is extremely high too.


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## cbrossman (Mar 23, 2004)

Utah has incredible diversity in trails, and I can get to many of them faster than one could from SLC, at least the ones I care about. I can also get to Sedona, Gallup, the San Juans, Tuscon, Phoenix ...
But more importantly, I can ride my bike, from my house, nearly in downtown, to many top trails.

Diversity is great, and that is usually part of my Durango Sales Pitch, but most of the time, I want to be on dirt within 15 minutes and not have to fire up my truck.


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## zrm (Oct 11, 2006)

cbrossman said:


> Utah has incredible diversity in trails, and I can get to many of them faster than one could from SLC, at least the ones I care about. I can also get to Sedona, Gallup, the San Juans, Tuscon, Phoenix ...
> But more importantly, I can ride my bike, from my house, nearly in downtown, to many top trails.
> 
> Diversity is great, and that is usually part of my Durango Sales Pitch, but most of the time, I want to be on dirt within 15 minutes and not have to fire up my truck.


15 minutes? Hell, here in Breckenridge you can ride to something like a dozen trail portals from downtown in about 5 minutes or less.


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## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

LCBooger said:


> SLC is one of the smaller metro cities in the US.
> 
> Go 40 miles outside and you're in about as desolate land you can find.
> 
> ...


I'm not knocking you at all and I never professed to be familiar with SLC - although I have visited occasionally for the past 22 years, particularly while I had a friend living in Ogden.

All I'm saying is that "the smallest metro city in the US" is still just too crowded and busy for me and plenty of others. Sure, I could live in SLC and drive 40 miles to get "as desolate as I can find", or I can stay up here in Bozeman and get just as desolate in 20 miles. AND I can safely bike commute to literally every place in town within 20 minutes. There's also no threat of a helicopter full of skiers crowding me during a backcountry ski trip.

Quit being so sensitive.

While I'm at it, I'm also not impressed with how overly salted The Blue Iguana's food is.


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Silentfoe said:


> Here's a challenge: Draw a 6 hour driving day trip line out from any city. See what cycling destinations it takes you to or through. You'll find that if you start from Salt Lake City, no other city comes close.


Can you ride year round, without using a fatbike? Guaranteed, any day you want?


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

No. But why is that cool? Fat bikes and riding in the snow is awesome. There is something to be said for riding in the dirt year round but that is why we have St. George and Hurricane 4 hours away. A quick weekend or day and you get your dirt fix. I think it's cool to have seasonal options and not just have the same thing all of the time.


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## MOJO K (Jan 26, 2007)

http://http://www.bikemag.com/news/bible-of-bike-tests-at-kingdom-trails/#EscYQQBk5qgW9hCu.97

good enough for these guys...less than a mile from my place...even closer to work.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

MOJO K said:


> http://http://www.bikemag.com/news/bible-of-bike-tests-at-kingdom-trails/#EscYQQBk5qgW9hCu.97
> 
> good enough for these guys...less than a mile from my place...even closer to work.


Your link contains a warning when I click on it. And I REALLY want to click on it!


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## richde (Jun 8, 2004)

Silentfoe said:


> No. But why is that cool? Fat bikes and riding in the snow is awesome. There is something to be said for riding in the dirt year round but that is why we have St. George and Hurricane 4 hours away. A quick weekend or day and you get your dirt fix. I think it's cool to have seasonal options and not just have the same thing all of the time.


Because the thread is about mountain biking, not about mountain biking in the summer and skiing(or snowboarding) in the winter...so if you can't mountain bike year-round, it's obviously not the best place to do it.

It's like saying a restaurant has great food...half of the time.


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## Singletrackd (May 3, 2015)

Has living in a van been suggested yet because that's one of my life goals right now


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

There's no one right answer. One person's metro area is another's nightmare. Some of us LIKE winter sports in addition to biking.


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## Jing (Sep 4, 2013)

^^ what she said

Why all the haten on this thread? Its just a matter of perspectives.


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

Silentfoe said:


> Your link contains a warning when I click on it. And I REALLY want to click on it!


2016 Bible of Bike Tests at Kingdom Trails | BIKE Magazine


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## slowride454 (Jan 11, 2014)

I did not get an in person interview. The job was at SRAM in road braking. So yeah it would have been a dream job. I'm still looking. I got yet another rejection notice from Trek(it feels like the 100th) just the other day. Lot's of phone interviews, but no in person interviews yet. I was e-mailing back and forth with Chris Cocalis a while back, but my background and skills didn't match any current career opportunities at Pivot. The same scenario has been playing out over and over for the last 2 years whether I'm interviewing within the bike industry or not. Eventually I'll find a new job.



ryguy79 said:


> I know this was a while back, but did you ever make it out here?
> 
> Personally, I'm quite happy in Colorado Springs. I don't find it all that expensive and the winters are not 'harsh'. Compared to the Midwest it might seem expensive I suppose.
> 
> I lived near Lake Superior in the western UP for 5 years and know harsh winters. As you're from Wisconsin, winters here would seem very mellow.


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## MOJO K (Jan 26, 2007)

patski said:


> 2016 Bible of Bike Tests at Kingdom Trails | BIKE Magazine


Thanks...


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

richde said:


> Because the thread is about mountain biking, not about mountain biking in the summer and skiing(or snowboarding) in the winter...so if you can't mountain bike year-round, it's obviously not the best place to do it.
> 
> It's like saying a restaurant has great food...half of the time.


Fat biking is mountain biking...


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

Silentfoe said:


> Fat biking is mountain biking...


I'd say. Then again it almost looks like skiing. LOL

I watched this video and kept hearing "I want my 2 dollars!" - Better of Dead quote.

[video]http://www.pinkbike.com/video/435747/[/video]


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

dir-T said:


> I'm not knocking you at all and I never professed to be familiar with SLC - although I have visited occasionally for the past 22 years, particularly while I had a friend living in Ogden.
> 
> All I'm saying is that "the smallest metro city in the US" is still just too crowded and busy for me and plenty of others. Sure, I could live in SLC and drive 40 miles to get "as desolate as I can find", or I can stay up here in Bozeman and get just as desolate in 20 miles. AND I can safely bike commute to literally every place in town within 20 minutes. There's also no threat of a helicopter full of skiers crowding me during a backcountry ski trip.
> 
> ...


It's all about the Red Iguana.

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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

LCBooger said:


> It's all about the Red Iguana.


Wow, they're still in bidness? It was the late '80s go to spot in SLC....


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## Curveball (Aug 10, 2015)

I think the scoring criteria should be:

Good/great trails next to town (riding distance).

Great trails within two hours.

Strong local advocacy/trailbuilding club.

Good selection of top-notch breweries.

Good Mexican food.

Maybe not in that order.

Using that criteria, Bellingham, WA is appealing. Perhaps not the best place right now, but it would certainly be up there. With a whole bunch of new riding opportunities in the pipeline, it may reach the top. Oh, North Shore and Whistler are a hop skip and jump away.

BTW - The SLC arguments are very persuasive.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Singletrackd said:


> Has living in a van been suggested yet because that's one of my life goals right now


Down by the river under the bridge?


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## Sparky302 (Jan 27, 2016)

First post...I love this site!!

-NORTHERN DELAWARE-I'm not surprised at all to see that no one has mentioned my neck of the woods. It's one of the best kept "secrets" on the East Coast. You aren't going to come here anyway, so I'm not really breaking any news. 

Pros: 

I have over 130 miles of trails within a 25-minute usually low-stress drive of my place

It's pretty easy to find a decent job if you aren't a total dope. Health care and legal are pretty much the big things here now that DuPont has downsized to next to nothing.

Not much to do here entertainment-wise (malls, movies, etc., etc.), but Philly is a 30 min. drive, Baltimore 50 mins., NYC 2 hours, DC 2hours.

I can ride some of the best singletrack in the Mid-Atlantic at White Clay and Middle Run (especially if you have a single-speed), and it's rarely crowded. Fair Hill, MD is 25 minutes away from me, and has enough singletrack to keep you busy for a couple days )a few really, over 80 miles)

There are probably at least 8 bike shops within 20 minutes...enjoy not paying sales tax while you're there too!!

Active racing scene in the spring and summer with the M.A.S.S. races, etc.

A great, very active local club (TrailSpinners) that maintains, builds, and advocates.

Cost-of-living is pretty decent. I pay about $1100 a month for a 2-bedroom apartment that is in a safe neighborhood. The vice president lives right down the road from me.

I can be at many of the best places to ride in MD, VA, PA, NY, and WV in 4 hours or less. Usually less.

Want to go to the beach - Delaware and Jersey beaches are approx. a 90 min. drive. Dogfish Head is at the Delaware beach!!

CONS:

Oh, it's called mountain biking? Yeah, no mountains here of any kind. Sorry. Terrain does vary though between the broom-swept trails of White Clay and Middle Run to the more gnarly rocky, rooty stuff at Brandywine.

Weather is crappy in January and February w/ some snow, and a lot of freezing/thawing/re-freezing mucky crap. It can get hot as balls and humid in the summer, but that's why they make hydration packs. 

You don't want to live in Wilmington...within the city. Think gunfight at the OK Corral, and you're on the right track.

Oh, you have a DH bike? Sell that thing tomorrow for the lightest XC hardtail you can afford.

Definitely not saying it's like the best place in the world, but what it does is comprise between a lot of different things well. It gives you a kind of happy medium regarding basically everything. Delaware is like your buddy that says "I don't have it, but I know where to get it".


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

JCWages said:


> Fortunately with that kind of radius you can enjoy nearly ALL of California, most of Nevada and half of Oregon which translates into WAAAY more diversity, trails, lifestyle options, jobs and culture. lol
> 
> I think you're going to find it tough to compete with California's Bay Area/Sacramento when it comes to available trails and overall diversity or living. But as a guide I see why you have skin in the game. I'm sure you know a lot of really cool places that are not even on our radar.


You've got to b kidding. Does that 6 hours include sitting in traffic?


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

formica said:


> You've got to b kidding. Does that 6 hours include sitting in traffic?


Depends on the time of day you decide to go through areas. Otherwise yes.  I.e. just don't be silly and try to go through Sacramento, the Bay Area or LA during peak commute times. Works for me. Since I live in Auburn I have access to most of the trails I want and don't have to suffer traffic. If I want to hit the southern or western trails I would just leave earlier in the morning or after 10am.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

To me, the best place to live and ride is someplace you can live comfortably, save for the future, and put in some decent mileage on dirt without getting in a car. 

Bonus points for year round riding and lower cost of living. 

I look at someplace like Tallahassee, Florida more favorably than someplace like Philadelphia simply because Philly area trails are mud-fest in Winter, and most are not accessible without a car, where as even though Tallahassee doesn't have much technical riding, it almost nearly surrounded by public land that you can ride year round (if you can deal with the summer humidity).

I'm sure if you could work remotely, Puerto Rico would be awesome. 

My current residence in Flagstaff is pretty awesome March-November, with nearly 100 miles trails all pretty much right out my back door. I can ride to work in the morning on dirt, and ride dirt right from behind my office. Unfortunately when the snow starts to fly riding gets cold, icy, and messy pretty quick. If I could have this quality of life on an island, I'd be set.


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

Curveball said:


> I think the scoring criteria should be:
> 
> Good/great trails next to town (riding distance).
> 
> ...


Helena comes pretty close to that for me. We have a longer season than most places in Montana, and a solid trail network within 100 yards of my door. Plans are in development for a couple new trails that will dramatically improve the local scene. Four to five hours will get you to Targhee/Teton Pass, Silver, or Fernie.

We have two excellent breweries and one that will probably improve with time. Mexican food is pretty mediocre, but we have a great southwestern/New Mexican BBQ place with amazing salsa.

Signs of cycling culture are everywhere here. Stickers and bikes on cars, bikes on racks, logos on clothing. That translates into broad local support for trails and trail access. My (late) financé's family lives near Jackson (CA) and on shopping trips to Folsom, I have never seen a single sticker, bike, or bike rack while driving around. Obviously that doesn't mean they aren't there, but the density is pretty low by comparison.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

> You've got to b kidding. Does that 6 hours include sitting in traffic?





JCWages said:


> Depends on the time of day you decide to go through areas. Otherwise yes.  I


Having escaped the Bay Area 27 years ago, I can't possible imagine choosing to live in a place where monitoring traffic to avoid the crush for a bike ride is even on the radar.


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

formica said:


> Having escaped the Bay Area 27 years ago, I can't possible imagine choosing to live in a place where monitoring traffic to avoid the crush for a bike ride is even on the radar.


I can understand that. Which is why I don't live there. However, some MTBrs still enjoy city life too. It's all about balancing your needs. I have it all where I live so.... Go Auburn!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Curveball said:


> I think the scoring criteria should be:
> 
> Good/great trails next to town (riding distance).
> 
> ...


Kinda leaves out the whole cost of living, job availability, crime, etc.

Mexico would be a great place to live and ride if not for the crime.


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## ryguy79 (Apr 12, 2007)

Sparky302 said:


> CONS:
> 
> Oh, it's called mountain biking? Yeah, no mountains here of any kind. Sorry.


As far as I'm concerned, that disqualifies it from any 'best' list when it comes to mountain biking.


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## Curveball (Aug 10, 2015)

evasive said:


> Helena comes pretty close to that for me. We have a longer season than most places in Montana, and a solid trail network within 100 yards of my door. Plans are in development for a couple new trails that will dramatically improve the local scene. Four to five hours will get you to Targhee/Teton Pass, Silver, or Fernie.
> 
> We have two excellent breweries and one that will probably improve with time. Mexican food is pretty mediocre, but we have a great southwestern/New Mexican BBQ place with amazing salsa.
> 
> Signs of cycling culture are everywhere here. Stickers and bikes on cars, bikes on racks, logos on clothing. That translates into broad local support for trails and trail access. My (late) financé's family lives near Jackson (CA) and on shopping trips to Folsom, I have never seen a single sticker, bike, or bike rack while driving around. Obviously that doesn't mean they aren't there, but the density is pretty low by comparison.


Unfortunately, a lot of trails in MT are under the gun for possible Wilderness designation. It appears that the riding situation there may be in serious jeopardy.

Hopefully, the efforts of the STC will change that.


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## Curveball (Aug 10, 2015)

PHeller said:


> Kinda leaves out the whole cost of living, job availability, crime, etc.
> 
> Mexico would be a great place to live and ride if not for the crime.


I think the quality of Mexican food would make up for crime risk. ;-)

I have doubts about brewery quality in Mexico.


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## evasive (Feb 18, 2005)

Curveball said:


> Unfortunately, a lot of trails in MT are under the gun for possible Wilderness designation. It appears that the riding situation there may be in serious jeopardy.
> 
> Hopefully, the efforts of the STC will change that.


There have been some high-profile closures, but the STC's professed goal wouldn't necessarily have helped in those cases, since they were decisions made at the Forest level. Many of the Forests are currently drawing up their Wilderness inventory areas, but that's happening across the country. In short, the circumstances in Montana aren't much different than anywhere else. And at least here, MTB advocates around the state marvel at how we've avoided the rancor generally found in Bozeman and Missoula. We have cordial relationships with the backcountry horsemen and Wilderness advocates, and representatives from all three communities come together in a formal group here.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Case in point... UTAH.






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## andytiedye (Jul 26, 2014)

formica said:


> Having escaped the Bay Area 27 years ago, I can't possible imagine choosing to live in a place where monitoring traffic to avoid the crush for a bike ride is even on the radar.


I live in the coastal mountains, so most rides don't involve any traffic or even the use of the car. 
Where were you living?
You left about 3 years before I came here.



LCBooger said:


> Case in point... UTAH.


I'm sure Utah is perfect... for you. You are Mormon so you fit in perfectly there.
I fit in a lot better in California, best of all in the parts of it that were settled by old hippies going "back to the land", e.g. the Santa Cruz Mountains and Mendocino.

Those who do snow sports may prefer a place like that with a real winter, for them it might be "best place to live and ski and mountain bike". For me the question is more like "best place to live and dance and mountain bike".

It is just as well that there isn't any one perfect place for everyone, because we couldn't all fit there and the prices would just become astronomical from all of us trying.

Come to think of it, isn't that pretty much what happened in the Bay Area?


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

California is a very big place. We were in eastern Bay Area, Contra Costa area. Hub had 1.5 hour commute, schools were falling apart, all we could afford was a hovel. At that time, EBMud trails were all fire roads; I don't know if that's changed.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Once again case in point, Utah.






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## dir-T (Jan 20, 2004)

LCBooger said:


> It's all about the Red Iguana.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Whatever it is, I could barely finish my meal. The mole we brought home was good though.


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## dgw2jr (Aug 17, 2011)

LCBooger said:


> Case in point... UTAH.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





LCBooger said:


> Once again case in point, Utah.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


More like "Case in point... Las Vegas". Access to the trails you are posting are 4 to 5 hours away from the major population centers of Utah versus the 2 hour drive from Vegas.


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

dgw2jr said:


> More like "Case in point... Las Vegas". Access to the trails you are posting are 4 to 5 hours away from the major population centers of Utah versus the 2 hour drive from Vegas.


Except that biking in the summer sucks in Vegas, plus their trails are sub-par.

SLC/Park City in the spring/summer/fall and Moab/St George in the winter.

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## dgw2jr (Aug 17, 2011)

LCBooger said:


> Except that biking in the summer sucks in Vegas, plus their trails are sub-par.
> 
> SLC/Park City in the spring/summer/fall and Moab/St George in the winter.


Biking in Vegas sucks period lol. SLC only really has the BST which is meh. The canyons are always too busy. Park City is ok I guess. Definitely gets more praise than it deserves.

The only thing we got going for us is ease of access, which is a double edged sword. Our recreational resources are stretched to their limit as it is and we don't need to invite any more people to exacerbate the problem.

Edit: I forgot to mention the extraordinary amount of dog crap that plagues this state.


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## Silentfoe (May 9, 2008)

dgw2jr said:


> SLC only really has the BST which is meh. The canyons are always too busy. Park City is ok I guess. Definitely gets more praise than it deserves.


You need to get out more


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

Are other SLC natives this pushy and aggressive? Just curious? Doesn't really make me want to ride there if so.


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## dgw2jr (Aug 17, 2011)

Silentfoe said:


> You need to get out more


I get out more than most. I'll toss out a compliment to our glorious state and say that the fat biking in winter is excellent. I'm actually dreading the end of winter.


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## dgw2jr (Aug 17, 2011)

JCWages said:


> Are other SLC natives this pushy and aggressive? Just curious? Doesn't really make me want to ride there if so.


Wait until you drive here! :eekster:


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

dgw2jr said:


> Wait until you drive here! :eekster:


LOL worse than California drivers? We're hated in Oregon.


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## dgw2jr (Aug 17, 2011)

JCWages said:


> LOL worse than California drivers? We're hated in Oregon.


They are the same people. You'll see a lot of California plates here. From March through October the state is overrun with tourists from Nevada, Colorado, and California. If you're going to visit the National Parks or ride any of the awesome trails in Moab and St. George, as a resident, you'll have to do it from November to February.


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

A California-plated SUV almost hit me WHILE BACKING UP AROUND A SWITCHBACK in Zion NP. 

I had to swerve into the oncoming lane, and still hit the rear view mirror. 

I'm not sure who are worse; CA drivers or coal-rolling TX pickup drivers.


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

Le Duke said:


> A California-plated SUV almost hit me WHILE BACKING UP AROUND A SWITCHBACK in Zion NP.
> 
> I had to swerve into the oncoming lane, and still hit the rear view mirror.
> 
> ...


The worst is a California coal-rolling pickup driver! We have a ton around here in the foothills. Decked with "Prius Repellent" and "Global Warmer" stickers....


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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

Wide and easy to drive on roads don't create many sharp drivers.

I think there's some sort of survival of the fittest thing going on, on CA roads. Can't survive with your poor driving skills? Then get a SUV/truck. Can be pretty oblivious and inconsiderate, and call it normal... "sharing the road"... hah, others on the road are just obstacles that inconvenience them.


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## andytiedye (Jul 26, 2014)

When I moved out here I found the drivers in California very considerate compared to those in Boston, where I was moving from.

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## Curveball (Aug 10, 2015)

JCWages said:


> LOL worse than California drivers? We're hated in Oregon.


And Washington.


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## johnnyspoke (Sep 15, 2005)

JCWages said:


> Are other SLC natives this pushy and aggressive? Just curious? Doesn't really make me want to ride there if so.


Nah. 

I think it's a great place, but then I think there are a lot of great places. Good thing too, we wouldn't all want to live in the same place!


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## patski (Dec 12, 2005)

andytiedye said:


> When I moved out here I found the drivers in California very considerate compared to those in Boston, where I was moving from.


For sure, DC also, people who complain that Cal drivers are aggressive haven't lived in too many urban places..


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## Le Duke (Mar 23, 2009)

I'm not sure that "aggressive" = bad. Spent plenty of time in Chicago traffic. Meh. It's predictable. 

Oblivious and/or self centered? Yeah, those are bad qualities, and more dangerous.

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## Varaxis (Mar 16, 2010)

A lot of posts to point out that you're much more likely to run into stupidity in areas surrounding big cities with poor transportation management.

For example, the NYC problem pretty much ends not too far beyond the GW Bridge on the upstate NY side, but extends quite a bit towards the NJ side. NY drivers were way more courteous. Better management systems in place on the NY side or bad NJ drivers? Most would say bad NJ drivers, without giving credit to the NY management systems.


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## PureMX (May 5, 2009)

I'm partial to central California. Here is a video I made of a local favorite.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

Le Duke said:


> A California-plated SUV almost hit me WHILE BACKING UP AROUND A SWITCHBACK in Zion NP.
> 
> I had to swerve into the oncoming lane, and still hit the rear view mirror.
> 
> ...


MA has both of you beat, no problem.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

People actually drive to their rides? I just pedal to 100 yds to the end of my street.


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## CoyoteNW (Oct 27, 2012)

leeboh said:


> People actually drive to their rides? I just pedal to 100 yds to the end of my street.


That's a really short ride.


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## leeboh (Aug 5, 2011)

CoyoteNW said:


> That's a really short ride.


The street is 100yds of pavement. Dude. Then the dirt singletrack starts. Ya know, rocks, trees and such. 15 miles on my local. Can pedal to 75 miles from there. In MA, go figure.


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## k2rider1964 (Apr 29, 2010)

JCWages said:


> LOL worse than California drivers? We're hated in Oregon.


I think that era is generally over as Californians have essentially taken over the state and enforced the necessity for all things Californian. Besides, what they hated about Californians was all of them moving up there with tons of equity from their homes in CA and overpaying for housing in OR which drove up the housing costs for them. It's still that way in Bend.


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## Crankyone (Dec 8, 2014)

Everyone loves to hate Californians! i read somewhere that 4-5 Coloradans were born in California! The rest are mostly Texans!


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## LCBooger (Apr 7, 2014)

Thank you Singletracks for clearing this up.

http://www.singletracks.com/blog/mtb-trails/the-51-mountain-bike-capitals-of-the-united-states/

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