# Will a Better Bike Make my wife a better rider?



## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

My wife fell and seperated her A/C joint last summer and since then she has been really scared on downhills. Her current bike is a xc hardtail with 125mm of travel in the front. I've been thinking about getting a Santa Cruz Tallboy LT Carbon for her in hopes that it will allow her to ride a little faster on the downhills.


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## inanna72 (Oct 14, 2013)

You don't say how skilled or aggressive a rider she is, but I'm going to offer an alternate suggestion: skills camp. No idea what the cause of the crash was, but after that kind of crash it's got to have done a headjob on her and eaten her confidence. guessing she's gun-shy more than equipment shy----take a clinic or camp that breaks down skills and has you build them step by step might be world more helpful than a new rig. Or, y'know....both would be nice. Camp and a bike.


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## sooshee (Jun 16, 2012)

This situation doesn't sound like the need to get "better" or "faster" but instead a need to rebuild confidence and get over mental demons from her nasty wreck. And that can be rebuilt with numerous things... skills camps, practice, and perhaps a new bike. I know personally my newest bike and tire combo have boasted my descending confidence, but I haven't been injured like your wife, either. Have you tried talking to her to see what she thinks will help? Could be something as simple as maybe finding some other girls to ride with that builds up a comfort level in a non-pressured situation, or a skills clinic, or maybe even different tires.


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## blueeyesMTB (Apr 26, 2014)

Skills camp. Three votes now. If you have skills you can ride hardtail or FS. If you lose your confidence it is hard to ride anything. 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk


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## RS VR6 (Mar 29, 2007)

Other thing is to make sure that she is set up properly on the bike she has now. When I met my GF, she was riding a bike that was just plain too big. Got her on a proper sized bike and dialed in her position. Not only did her handling improve...so did her confidence.

I've seen so many people with either their bars too high or saddle too low.

What XC hardtail has a 125mm fork?

I've seen you post a couple other threads on a bike for your wife...still not sure what to do?


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Four votes for skills camp. Why do guys always want to fix confidence issues with parts?


Sent from my iPad - Stupid autocorrect!


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## RS VR6 (Mar 29, 2007)

Because bikes or parts that are improperly set up (not saying the OP's wife's bike is) can make a good bike handle bad.

Alot of times the bike is not the issue...its the setup.


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

"XC hardtail with 125mm travel in the front" could describe a very wide variety of bikes. If it's an entry level junker with a steel stanchion/steertube fork and shimano acera parts, then yes, it could definitely be holding her back.


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## Kajjal (Dec 14, 2013)

RS VR6 said:


> Because bikes or parts that are improperly set up (not saying the OP's wife's bike is) can make a good bike handle bad.
> 
> Alot of times the bike is not the issue...its the setup.


This is the most important part understand what she wants from a bike and then get the setup / fit correct. My wife wanted an XC bike with 26" wheels and plenty of stand over height as the lack of stand over height on her previous bike reduced her confidence.


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## LyndaW (Jul 22, 2005)

Yes! Most likely..


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## bitflogger (Jan 12, 2004)

Let the decision come from her vs husband choose. Let her choose the wheel size, not you. We have them all and the wheel size doesn't matter to my wife. The bunch of mom's I see getting into or back into riding seem same where geometry geometry of the bike and tires being wide and sticky make a bid difference. Add the value of a dropper post.

My wife cut her risk taking after becoming a mother and lost some confidence in the trails too. We're same height and share bikes. What got her comfortable to ride again was not wheel size or brand. It was wide sticky tires and geometry of the bike. She hated the more XC and race oriented type bikes we used to ride together but likes the bikes that are more slack, low stand over, and what most probably call AM. Add that she used to like clipped pedals and flats with a dropper seat post did a lot to make her feel good about it again.

I would not even think about carbon as you mentioned before delaying a purchase, doing rentals and real world demos. That got my wife comfy on a bike again and gave the experience to feel differences and know what she liked. It was really important for her to decide what she liked vs what someone thought she wanted.

Some more insights are coming from our ski club's new programs to get kids and families on bikes. I've seen some husbands get their wives she versions of their setups that are often for XC racing. I'll let a mom get on my low and fat sticky tired bike and they feel more confident. It's got me thinking just get the happy family riding vs set up to win the race.


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## WA-CO (Nov 23, 2013)

No....

More riding will make your wife a better rider. I suspect this is not bike, but ability. Since she biffed it a good one, go back to basics. 

How was it you determined you wife should ride a Santa Cruz Tallboy LT Carbon? If you're going that route, I think you should have decided on a Bronson with Enve wheels, your size for your wife....Yea, that's it.


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## cleopatra999 (May 9, 2012)

I actually disagree with the majority of women here because I actually think this may very well help her out. This comes from experience, I started off on an 100mm XC full suspension race style bike with a very steep head tube angle. I always felt it was holding me back despite people saying I just needed more time in the saddle. I did a lot of research looking for a bike that I liked on paper then demoed. The one I loved on paper was the I fell in love with once I rode it too. It made me a better rider with almost the first ride. I attribute this to the slacker head tube angle, wider wheel base and increased travel. The changes gave me more comfort and increased confidence on the downs. That being said a tallboy may not be the better choice. A 29r can feel steeper and harder to handle (twitchier) on the downs. I don't like the feeling of being up high off the trail when descending. Being low gives me more confidence and makes me faster.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

Maybe, maybe not. A new bike brings out the best and worst in us. For me, my new bike highlighted and emphasized my strengths and weaknesses. I had issues with fast, smooth single track at high speeds due to a previous crash (mental hurdle - give me the gnarliest chunk in the world, anything over easy, smooth, fast slow! There's nothing quite like washing on on a loose berm going 25+...ehh, I was picking rocks and sand out my side for weeks:eekster. I had previously blamed those issues on not having a slack enough bike. I bought a new slack bike. Guess what - new bike really highlighted these issues and made them impossible to ignore. Luckily, I've got a great group of guys and ladies who push me every ride (we're working on it). It also exposed other strengths (yea steep techy, rocky downhill!) and a few flaws in my skills (I really need to get more control on jumps).

New bikes are fun, but they won't make you a better rider. They will give you better tools that may allow your skills to shine in new ways, but nothing will make up for a loss of confidence or a lack of skill. No new bike will magically create skill. 

Skills camp. Skills camp. Skills camp.

Then, get her riding with someone who makes riding fun againl Be patient. Let it build up.

I started on a cheap xc bike. It was great for what it was. If i would have bought myself a new bike several years ago, I wouldn't have appreciated it. I was still learning, discovering what I love and what drives me. I was still building skills. Once I had those skills, I focused on what I loved about riding and began to build my dream machine. It took several years until she became mine. But it was worth the wait. Everything about her is perfect - exactly what I need to grow into the rider I want to become.

A true AM bike can be amazing (yea for 160mm suspension, slacker head angles, grippy tires, a 50mm stem, wide bars, etc.!), but those same assets can also be difficult to handle for a rider without the skills or confidence to control said bike. Same with most long travel 29ers. 

Skills camp (I said it again). Then, riding with fun people. Then, ask her what she likes about her bike, about lots of bikes. Demo a few. Have her build up her dream bike - the frame it would have, the brakes, the head angle, the tires, the gearing. Then buy something. Note: this may take time.

Good luck to her. Recovering from a bad fall is hard and takes serious time and a lot of fun love. There's a great skills camp happening in CB this summer that I can't wait for - awesome ladies, awesome trails, and full face helmets/5-7 inches of travel highly recommended. If you happen to wander back to Colorado, it might be worth looking into :thumbsup:


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## p4nh4ndle (Oct 11, 2012)

Yeah, +1 on the skills camp suggestion. You're throwing good money after bad if you try to treat the symptoms instead of the actual disease, so to speak.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

p4nh4ndle said:


> Yeah, +1 on the skills camp suggestion. You're throwing good money after bad if you try to treat the symptoms instead of the actual disease, so to speak.


+1
To clarify what I was saying earlier about fix the rider not the bike... sure a nice new plush fs that fits perfectly will help a lot and maybe even a whole lot. I've seen plenty of frankenbike setups created to fix confidence/riding issues. Long travel forks on old xc frames and weird stem lengths are two things that come to mind. Then, sometimes the rider gets so used to hanging on for dear life on the monstrosity created by their spouse in the name of love that getting them to move to something appropriate can be a challenge.


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## p4nh4ndle (Oct 11, 2012)

formica said:


> Why do guys always want to fix confidence issues with parts?
> 
> Sent from my iPad - Stupid autocorrect!


Well, being a guy, I'm going to blame one too many of those male enhancement ads for that one XD


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## girlonbike (Apr 24, 2008)

unrooted said:


> My wife fell and seperated her A/C joint last summer and since then she has been really scared on downhills. Her current bike is a xc hardtail with 125mm of travel in the front. I've been thinking about getting a Santa Cruz Tallboy LT Carbon for her in hopes that it will allow her to ride a little faster on the downhills.


I totally don't comprehend how the solution to her being scared on downhills translate to your hope for allowing her to ride faster? Does she want to ride faster downhill or do you?

I say she may just need time and miles under her belt to improve. Or get a slow riding buddy to relieve the pressure of somebody trying to push you too hard before you're confident.


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## stacers (Oct 29, 2012)

I broke my wrist last summer and got really nervous on descents when I got back on the bike. I was practically standing still going downhill because my confidence was shot. The thing that helped me most was what everyone else is recommending - skills clinics. 

I took a couple of great skills clinics working on body positioning and basics. I was getting so tense on the downhills that I was making things worse, and a few hours work on proper attack position and how to move around my bike made a HUGE difference. I haven't been consciously trying to go downhill faster, but my times have drastically improved on the descents I normally ride. And I didn't have to get a new bike. 

I also switched over to flats while I was getting back into things. Is she riding clipless? Knowing I could put a foot down even a touch quicker gave me a little boost in confidence too.

That said, if she's on a hardtail, switching to full suspension might make her feel better if the trails she's riding a really rocky. But even on a FS she's got to know proper technique to have confidence.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

stacers said:


> I broke my wrist last summer and got really nervous on descents when I got back on the bike. I was practically standing still going downhill because my confidence was shot. The thing that helped me most was what everyone else is recommending - skills clinics.
> 
> I took a couple of great skills clinics working on body positioning and basics. I was getting so tense on the downhills that I was making things worse, and a few hours work on proper attack position and how to move around my bike made a HUGE difference. I haven't been consciously trying to go downhill faster, but my times have drastically improved on the descents I normally ride. And I didn't have to get a new bike.
> 
> ...


She is riding flats, which I also switched back to (after 16 years on clipless), and Five Tens. I know for me I have increased my DH ability significantly because of going from a hardtail xc bike to a full suspension AM bike with just a little bit of increased ability.

I already decided to get her a Tallboy LTC, and I would love to get her into some skill clinics, unfortunately there aren't any in the nearby area, except one that is the same week she is visiting her sister. We'll see, I think just getting on the bike a lot more often will increase her abilities.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

unrooted said:


> I think just getting on the bike a lot more often will increase her abilities.


The big question is does she want to increase her abilities and get on the bike more? Is she excited about that amazing tallboy? It's not really what you want or think but what she wants, thinks, etc. that will make the biggest difference in her riding, confidence, and overall joy when she rides.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

snowgypsy said:


> The big question is does she want to increase her abilities and get on the bike more? Is she excited about that amazing tallboy? It's not really what you want or think but what she wants, thinks, etc. that will make the biggest difference in her riding, confidence, and overall joy when she rides.


She wants a new mattress, but that's f-ing stupid, so she gets a new bike instead.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

New mattress? Stupid? You have no idea how a good/new mattress can improve your sleep.


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## bitflogger (Jan 12, 2004)

unrooted said:


> She wants a new mattress, but that's f-ing stupid, so she gets a new bike instead.





formica said:


> New mattress? Stupid? You have no idea how a good/new mattress can improve your sleep.


That too, but I was just thinking of the marriage advice from my mother and the 25+ years I've been with my awesome wife.

Get the mattress.



P.S. My apologies if I missed the OP posting his wife's explicit request to get a Tall Boy model bike.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

I wouldn't say she doesn't want a new bike, but it isn't a high priority for her. Unlike me she would rather just learn how to become a better rider, while I will take the quick path through improved technology. She is riding a 2011 Motobecane Fantom 29sl.


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## p4nh4ndle (Oct 11, 2012)

unrooted said:


> We'll see, I think just getting on the bike a lot more often will increase her abilities.


That's half of it, but the other half is getting on the bike more the right way. I'm definitely a walk-it-off/get-back-on-the-horse person, but I can appreciate how others, male or female, might get gun shy after a wreck. It's important not to push another rider, who might have a different comfort level, too hard.

Speaking from experience, you can sometimes get new-ish riders down a trail that's a little above their skill or comfort level in one piece (and even several times). But you're basically just waiting for their inexperience to catch up with them, at which point their lack of skill becomes a big liability. A bad enough wreck to a new enough rider is enough to put them back on training-wheels type mtb'ing. Having a slacker, more forgiving bike isn't an excuse to go faster than one is comfortable.

My point is that you might be better off leaving the ride choices to your wife for a while until her comfort level comes back. This isn't obviated at all by the fact that she'll be riding a new full squish bike, either. Ride alternate, parallel trails of different difficulty if you can/have to. Keep it fun.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

If the bike doesn't work, well I guess I'll have to upgrade the wife. . . She is getting a bit old, she's a 1982 model.


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## bitflogger (Jan 12, 2004)

unrooted said:


> If the bike doesn't work, well I guess I'll have to upgrade the wife. . . She is getting a bit old, she's a 1982 model.


Don't get rid of a good one. Mine is 1967 vintage and the high school boys she teaches like her for more than learning.

I'll rest my case after one more reminder. Get the mattress she wants, get the bike she wants (and when she wants it). Only then can you look in the mirror and call yourself a sufficiently smart husband.


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## cleopatra999 (May 9, 2012)

Can I tell this to my SO? I have been requesting a snow bike for months!! 


bitflogger said:


> Don't get rid of a good one. Mine is 1967 vintage and the high school boys she teaches like her for more than learning.
> 
> I'll rest my case after one more reminder. Get the mattress she wants, get the bike she wants (and when she wants it). Only then can you look in the mirror and call yourself a sufficiently smart husband.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

bitflogger said:


> Don't get rid of a good one. Mine is 1967 vintage and the high school boys she teaches like her for more than learning.
> 
> I'll rest my case after one more reminder. Get the mattress she wants, get the bike she wants (and when she wants it). Only then can you look in the mirror and call yourself a sufficiently smart husband.


I'm going to also share this inherit wisdom with the hubby. A dropper post and new dh elbow/knee pads would be just groovy


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

Talked about this topic during the first few minutes of JRA last week. Click if you want to listen: How Women Get Shafted - Mountain Bike Radio


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

Shafted??? I wish I could ride with someone better than me on every ride. I also wish my S.o. Bought me a carbon FS.


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## Andrea138 (Mar 25, 2009)

unrooted said:


> Shafted??? I wish I could ride with someone better than me on every ride. I also wish my S.o. Bought me a carbon FS.


Did you actually listen?!?


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

Andrea138 said:


> Did you actually listen?!?


I'm listening now. . .I "make" my wife ride a 740mm handlebar and I try to put the proper amount of air in her fork, but she prefers it with 5-10 psi more than recommended.

The biggest problem is that a lot of women, my wife included, don't know or care to learn about bikes and/or technology.

I do put 2.10 tires on her bike (she weighs 115 lbs) because bigger 29er tires are super heavy and I figure that if I can run 2.4 tires at my weight (195 lbs) then 2.1 is proportionally bigger for her, she refuses to lean her bike over in turns anyways!

Her current hardtail is probably good enough for her, but it isn't what anyone would consider an all-around bike, which I think is good for where we are riding now a days. Back in when we rode a lot in Bend her bike was perfect.

I definitely think a lot about how to make her bike is properly set up, but getting her to participate is f-ing hard to do, mostly because she doesn't notice any differences. Her bike can be skipping gears, squeaking, saddle too low, etc-and she won't even notice. I try to do just as much maintenance on her bike as I do on mine, but I HATE squeaky bikes that don't shift well. I also get personally embarrassed if her bike is f-cked up and other people notice.

I can't say I really enjoy listening to you and your friend chatting. Reminds me of this podcast: PodClimber LIVE on USTREAM: The World's #1 downloaded climbing Podcast. Interviews, Comentary, Events, Video Reviews and more... . Other Sports

Also there are multiple companies that make the 42t rear hack cog: oneupcomponents, wolftooth, hope, and the cheapest option: e.thirteen ($60).

OneUp Components - OneUp Components 42T Sprocket is not 1UPUSA.com :: Home

Also it's cheaper to buy a 42t, xt cassette 11-36, chain, derailleur, shifter and chainring than a SRAM 11 speed cassette. I haven't had any issues (except for the jump from 15t to 19t) with shifting on my bike.

That's why you ride carbon? nope, that's why you ride steel or Ti.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

He didn't listen. 
That was an awesome rant. I see this so much. 

It's not the bike. It's how the bike fits the rider and it's the rider. My first bike wasn't the best. It was the nicest thing I could afford, but it wasn't a fancy carbon fs. The attitude from many of my guy friends (who I was trying to learn from) was that I would simply upgrade later to a better bike in a year and become a better rider, etc. The attitude that the bike makes the rider - so to speak. The attitude was that that bike, my bike, didn't really matter. Something is creaking? Cheap, bad bike. Something doesn't feel right? Ignore it. Can't go faster? Don't feel comfortable at speed or in that rock garden? Cheap fork, etc.

I didn't learn how to take care of that bike and actually developed a negative attitude about it. I would be so much better, have so much more fun, if only I had a nicer bike... I had the wrong attitude. My set up was completely wrong, the shocks were wrong, the brake pads were literally falling off. No wonder I was having a hard time! Then, I went to my lbs (best place in the world). They took me and my bike seriously. They fitted it, tuned it, showed me how to do it, what to look for. Low and behold, when I learned some skill, took my bike maintenance into my own hands, and started loving that cheap, aluminum FS, she took me up and down just about everything that my so fs carbon yeti did - sometimes even a little faster.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

unrooted said:


> The biggest problem is that a lot of women, my wife included, don't know or care to learn about bikes and/or technology.


Now that's the biggest bit of @#[email protected]#% that I've ever heard. Why don't you stop by my garage some time...you might learn a thing or two.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

I said a lot of women, I know a few women that do know and care, but the majority just let their Boyfriend/girlfriend/spouse or bike shop employoyee pick for them. My wife is proud that she was able to help her friend fix a flat, but she still doesn't understand what tubeless is (which her bike has).


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

> The biggest problem is that a lot of women, my wife included, don't know or care to learn about bikes and/or technology.


 You really have a lot of balls posting that here in the WL.

The biggest problem is that a few men don't know how to inspire mountain biking passion in the women they'd like to get into the sport. Never mind condescending attitudes.


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## snowgypsy (Jun 5, 2011)

unrooted said:


> I said a lot of women, I know a few women that do know and care, but the majority just let their Boyfriend/girlfriend/spouse or bike shop employoyee pick for them. My wife is proud that she was able to help her friend fix a flat, but she still doesn't understand what tubeless is (which her bike has).


So teach her. Every gal that I've ever worked with has been hungry to learn. Most simply don't because learning takes time - and often times its easier for their s.o. to do it for them. They are so afraid of slowing things down and being "that girl" that they stay quiet. Rather than asking questions and learning, they sit in the background.

The greatest thing my so ever did for my riding was teach me how to work on my bike - and not do it for me, but show me on his bike and then, wait and have patience while I did it on my own. It's self-reliance, confidence, and joy that inspire passion for mountain biking - not new gear. If she's letting you do everything for her, that's a bad sign.

Passion for mountain biking is contagious if you share it. Thanks to the amazing guys at my lbs, I'm doing my first downhill race this weekend and I can't wait. Maybe it's CB, but I've never encountered a guy who has been anything but supportive and inspiring.

And based on your attitude here, that's something for you to work on.


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## catsruletn (Dec 7, 2013)

I do not know you or your wife obviously so I could be completely off base here but the overall impression I get from reading your comments is that she really doesn’t care about what kind of bike she has and is just kind of going along having a good time and you are wanting to push her to be a better rider and faster and more aggressive etc. This will never work and in fact will most likely backfire on you entirely. Let her ride however she wants to ride, on whatever bike she wants to ride on, even if you think it’s a POS and just let her have fun. The more fun she has (without pressure to be better/faster/whatever), the more she will want to ride and the better she will get in the long run. It’s not about what you want. It’s about what she wants. My apologies in advance if I am reading the situation wrong.


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## unrooted (Jul 31, 2007)

After reading your pis$ed off posts (i was asking for, or goading you. . ) I've decided that even though it may take a lot longer time I'll have my wife put her bike together, maybe even true her own wheels??? maybe I'll even strip all the parts to seperate pieces (except for the wheels. . .) and teach her to put it all together. . .that should teach me some patience!!!!


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