# Bike Ray IV



## Chromagftw (Feb 12, 2009)

It appears that there are some new pictorials on the Bike Ray page of the BR4 to be released July/August:

http://www.bikeray.com/a/en/product/RAY 4/2011/0415/24.html

I cant really tell if the BR4 light head bodies are the same as the recently introduced shorter BR3s though ... based on the pics it doesn't look like it. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Now a question to Mr Bike Ray posed before but not directly answered:

*"Will you be selling light heads as individual units alone WITHOUT batteries or chargers? and if not why?"* Thanks!


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

drooling....


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

BR4 is different than BR3. Not just in Lumens, if you put pics side to side, you will notice.

About possiblity of purchasing just light head,
No offense but I must ask you, if you go to a car dealer, and ask the sales guy that you are willing to buy a new car but without transmission or gas tank,,,,,I don't think they will do that.

The outer case, it became as part of trademark for BikeRay lights. Yet you can see the differences.

Hope this answered your question~

Thank you for your interest~


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## Chromagftw (Feb 12, 2009)

That analogy is actually pretty inaccurate mate. Take a look at other industry players - Dinotte, Magicshine, Lupine as examples, light heads alone are offered as single unit purchases.

Even the BikeRay3 light head is currently being sold as is without the battery or charger:
http://www.geomangear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4_33&products_id=258

I'm sure I am not the only one here with with spare batteries and chargers that are compatible with other lightheads, BikeRay's or otherwise.

Now if you can honestly tell me that the BikeRayIV light heads are only specific to and compatible with BikeRay batteries and chargers due to whatever reason, I'm all ears...

...Unless it's a simple profit margin issue, do correct me if I'm wrong. Thanks.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Directed to BikerayUSA:
On the subject of selling separate light heads I have to agree with everything *Chromagftw* said in the above post. However I do understand that not all vendors operate the same way. It should be understood though that many people might want to operate two Bikeray's from one battery. This represents an opportunity for the vendor to make more money need I say. ( ...you've been in this business how long?.. ) Some vendors will even offer discounts for combo set-ups but I digress...

Mr. Bikeray, You did tell someone else over on the BR III thread that the BR III would become available ( at a later date ) as a separate light head. You even offered to supply Y-cables. This tells me you already understand the concept of wanting two light heads for one battery.

Concluding, there are many people who will want to run duel light heads ( *..or just want to adapt their battery to the newer light head ). Whither or not you can get extra light heads will be up to you and your supplier. We aren't telling you how to run your business, were just telling you what we want. That is want forums are for ( two way dialog ). Just keep in mind, if they can't get it from you they will try elsewhere.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Thanks for your comments and making this thread as valuable info to many others who are concidering BikeRay lights.

I agree that I made it too simple comparison to car dealer thing. Sorry for that.
I guess what I tried was to indicate buying a chevy but asking to have ford powertrain....lol.

Yes, there are many products that are compatiable to other products, not only on bicycle lights. As you said, not all are but maybe some do.

We do offer Ray-I & II light heads only. But not on Ray-III or IV., at least not yet.
Why Geoman is offering light heads of Ray-III~? Because he purchased light heads only from BikeRay manufacture. After what happended to him with low quality MS batteries & chargers,,,,,I don't blame him on that.
There are many, many manufactures of batteries with many different quality and price range. No argument on Japanese or German qualities are one of best you can buy with money. However, there are many other companies who are not too behind with lower profit margin than others., yet keeping their quality high.

And Mr Cat Man, yes we are offering "Y" connectors for 2 lights. But that doesn't mean you have to use Ray lights only. As you said, few other companies share same connectors because they are simpler to use, and bastly available even from RadioShack.

I totally agree forums purpose is 2 way dialog than anouncements. And that is reason why we are coming to mtbr. Sometimes we get hammered, but that is part of life isn't it~?

If customers can not get from us, because we are hard headed or something, I agree that I probably do samething.
What I am trying to say here is, we will do for our product within our capacity and for market demand. Not because few of commentators asks for it, even they never bought one., As manufacture & distributors point of view, we need to see the actual required volume, initial investment needed, turn around time, etc. A lot of times, to make something that will be marketed at $1, requires initial investment of $5,000 or even more. Do we have market for 5000 units or more~? These things require a lot of time investment and many studies to make right decision.

Original intension of producing "Y" connectors were not to sell individual light heads. Do we make more money by selling as a kit~? I must say NO. We will make more money if we sell individually, just like car parts or anyother parts deal. We actually make much less money by offering as a kit.

Just as .... who will need a nice case or nice gift wraps~? not many. But we must make them to sell what we have to offer. And that is translated as extra cost. We try to keep things to minimum level, to save on unneccessary costs., and that translates into better pricing and savings on customers end.

WOW~!
I am sorry again. I guess I talked too much and probably will cause more attacks.....
Please, we are not here to kill someone or make any false arguments etc
We will offer whatever we can within our capacity. Just like the "Y" connector, we invested significant amount of money to produce this simple divice. Will we ever get investment out of this unit~? I don't think so.
Whole intention of it was to provide extra manageability of Ray lights and the batteries for Ray light customers to have tail lights operating with same battery pack. Well, we haven't finished making tail light yet.....lol.

Well, hopefully I made some of questions cleared. Forums can be friendly, if we try. But it also can be deadly by simply misunderstandings~!

Anyway, thank you guys and hope to serve you better in very near future.


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## Chromagftw (Feb 12, 2009)

bikerayusa said:


> If customers can not get from us, because we are hard headed or something, I agree that I probably do samething.
> What I am trying to say here is, we will do for our product within our capacity and for market demand. Not because few of commentators asks for it, even they never bought one., As manufacture & distributors point of view, we need to see the actual required volume, initial investment needed, turn around time, etc. A lot of times, to make something that will be marketed at $1, requires initial investment of $5,000 or even more. Do we have market for 5000 units or more~? These things require a lot of time investment and many studies to make right decision.


Thanks, I appreciate the reply bikerayusa.

I've actually owned a BRI, a BRII and currently have a BRIII that is on loan. I can't fault any of the light heads thus far and am a happy repeat customer hence my question regarding the availability of the BRIV as a light head only option. I know for a fact that I will be purchasing at least 2 - 3 lightheads if an option for that opened up. I do recall mentioning that specifically when I contacted you through the BR website.

Anyway, how you go about marketing is entirely your perogative and I do understand you cannot cater to every individual out there. All I am saying is that IF offered as an lighthead only option, your potential clientele base will be significantly expanded. Absolutely nothing additional or different is being done with respect to the design or manufacturing process of the product itself.

My 2 widgets.


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

a bit off topic, but will the ray3 and ray4 be available in colors like the ray1 and ray2?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Chromagftw said:


> Thanks, I appreciate the reply bikerayusa.
> 
> I've actually owned a BRI, a BRII and currently have a BRIII that is on loan. I can't fault any of the light heads thus far and am a happy repeat customer hence my question regarding the availability of the BRIV as a light head only option. I know for a fact that I will be purchasing at least 2 - 3 lightheads if an option for that opened up. I do recall mentioning that specifically when I contacted you through the BR website.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your kind words.
as from a customers point of view, you may be right. It well could expand and reach many more people.
In other hand, we had thoughts that we might be in risk to supply just light heads, not a complete set.
Not all specs are compartiable, even they look same. What if end user mis uses light head with wrong charger or battery~? If things don't match right, we can be in trouble as long as warranty, safety goes.... How can we protect that part~?
Not all users will follow its comparability. I didn't in many ocasions.

Offering an extra light head to same BikeRay customer is possible. But if others use Ray head with MS or Gemini or anyother light heads, batteries & chargers and causes damage, which is very possible, how can we be protected from those mis uses~?

We will risk too much on our end if something wrong happens by end users.
By selling a complete set will eliminate that risk. Yes, any customer will and may do something like I used to do. But that will be up to the customer.
It was our though, offering just light head is asking trouble of mis uses.
And if we do offer them as to be purchased separately, it might be without warranty., and that may cause a bad image to our company.
Do we have to make a special connector like many other companies do~? well, it is somewhat a little late for that.

These are the main reasons why we try to stay away offering separate sale.

Yet, as Cat Man asked and you too, we will come up with some solution for this matter. And If you have any suggestion for it, please let us know. And let make this forum worthed to be in.
Your kind understanding on this issue is highly appreciated.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

nick d said:


> a bit off topic, but will the ray3 and ray4 be available in colors like the ray1 and ray2?


Hi Nick~!

Market for higher lumens gets narrower due to higher cost and limited users.
And as manufacture and as an investor, we have to think involving cost and not having too many left over stocks.

New Ray-III is Charcoal(Carbon) Grey but shinny, to match most handlebar's color.

As Ray-I & II, we had many colors, but black was best seller. While we sold over 500 blacks, we only sold 200 or so Reds and less than 100 blues.

You will like New color of Ray-III.

And Ray-IV will be black as you see on the pictures. We though about having silver and red but on actual sample, it didn't look that good.

Any suggestion on colors~?

Appearance is important, but that is translated as an extra cost to customers.


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## crux (Jan 10, 2004)

bikerayusa said:


> Hi Nick~!
> 
> Market for higher lumens gets narrower due to higher cost and limited users.
> And as manufacture and as an investor, we have to think involving cost and not having too many left over stocks.
> ...


Had one customer turned off on the Bike ray lights as they could not buy just the light head. Then again there are no real universal connectors between mfg's so he would be slicing and dicing to get the set up to work in the end anyway.

As for ano colors red is nice, but fades quick to pink in many cases. Black is standard and done for pretty much any component. What about a dark grey or blue that is nearly black? Think that would appeal to a wider market....


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

bikerayusa said:


> Hi Nick~!
> 
> Market for higher lumens gets narrower due to higher cost and limited users.
> And as manufacture and as an investor, we have to think involving cost and not having too many left over stocks.
> ...


i totally understand, the last thing you want is to be sitting on a bunch of odd color anodized ray3 or ray4 lights when the ray5 comes out in a year or two 

if given the choice ill usually pick something with red over black or grey, but it doesnt really make much of a difference, doesnt change its performance, and your right, most people will pick black.

i just thought the color option was cool on the ray1 and ray2 so i had to ask


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

crux said:


> Had one customer turned off on the Bike ray lights as they could not buy just the light head. Then again there are no real universal connectors between mfg's so he would be slicing and dicing to get the set up to work in the end anyway.
> 
> As for ano colors red is nice, but fades quick to pink in many cases. Black is standard and done for pretty much any component. What about a dark grey or blue that is nearly black? Think that would appeal to a wider market....


Hi Crux,
Thank you for your comments on color choice. Yap, we are making Ray-III in Dark Grey or Carbon Grey, which ever way you want to call it. It was choice of many excisting user of Ray lights.
About that unhappy customer, our New Ray-III is not in the market yet. How can he be upset with something is not on sale yet~?
Are you refering about Ray-I or II~? We do offer light head only purchase on those.

Please let us know if we can do anything for your friend.

Thank you~!


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

crux said:


> Had one customer turned off on the Bike ray lights as they could not buy just the light head. Then again there are no real universal connectors between mfg's so he would be slicing and dicing to get the set up to work in the end anyway.
> 
> As for ano colors red is nice, but fades quick to pink in many cases. Black is standard and done for pretty much any component. What about a dark grey or blue that is nearly black? Think that would appeal to a wider market....


Forgot to ask...sorry.
Are you one of the dealers of BikeRay, who doesn't want to be published on our site~?
If so, please let me know the details of this customer. I want to help.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

nick d said:


> i totally understand, the last thing you want is to be sitting on a bunch of odd color anodized ray3 or ray4 lights when the ray5 comes out in a year or two
> 
> if given the choice ill usually pick something with red over black or grey, but it doesnt really make much of a difference, doesnt change its performance, and your right, most people will pick black.
> 
> i just thought the color option was cool on the ray1 and ray2 so i had to ask


h h h~!
I will need much more cash flow to get more color choice and be ready to sit on many odd colors ~  
It is our hope to open more doors (bikeshops), and to be able to offer more choices. Who knows, maybe a pink or purple~????


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

bikerayusa said:


> Thanks for your kind words.
> as from a customers point of view, you may be right. It well could expand and reach many more people.
> In other hand, we had thoughts that we might be in risk to supply just light heads, not a complete set.
> Not all specs are compartiable, even they look same. What if end user mis uses light head with wrong charger or battery~? If things don't match right, we can be in trouble as long as warranty, safety goes.... How can we protect that part~?
> ...


After reading what you have said about the potential misuses I can understand your concern. As far as potential misuses go I think the only real issues pertaining to running duel light heads that might have fall-back repercussions that _might_ be problematic for the vendor would be the following:
1) If the BR standard 4-cell battery does not have a PCB capable of outputting ( at least ) ~6A max this might be considered the major concern as it could damage the PCB on the battery. I don't know the specs. of the BR battery but on other comparable 4-cell batteries I don't recall this being an issue that has ever warranted concern.
2) Connector compatibility. Someone using connectors that aren't really designed to work with the BR's. If a connector is too tight it could damage the connector which could cause an open circuit. I've had this happen before with other companies connectors but I've not heard of it happening with BR or MS for what it's worth.
3) Lastly there are typical customer "idiot mistakes". Things like, trying to run the light heads off a different ( higher voltage ) battery....or using the wrong charger designed for another voltage/chemistry. I could add more but the list would be almost endless. I think all can agree there is no limit to human stupidity.

...Now with all that said, that is the dilemma that all vendors face when selling their products. You can add disclaimers to your warranty but that still won't protect the seller 100% from the idiot/ jack-a**es that might file a warranty issue on something that was totally their fault. Need I add, even if you chose not to offer separate light-heads the issues I mentioned above still are in play.

My take on all of this is forget the idiots and stock a handful of extra light heads. Having happy customers is always a good thing as long as the extra expense is not too much.


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## S.O.B. (Mar 17, 2008)

FWIW I too would be interested in a separate BRIII light-head. I have the original version of the light along with two batteries (love the light). I would be interested in the newer version of the BRIII with the 15 degree lens (when available) for a helmet light (currently using an XPG torch on the helmet). I am sure there is a market for the separate light-head.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Cat-man-do said:


> After reading what you have said about the potential misuses I can understand your concern. As far as potential misuses go I think the only real issues pertaining to running duel light heads that might have fall-back repercussions that _might_ be problematic for the vendor would be the following:
> 1) If the BR standard 4-cell battery does not have a PCB capable of outputting ( at least ) ~6A max this might be considered the major concern as it could damage the PCB on the battery. I don't know the specs. of the BR battery but on other comparable 4-cell batteries I don't recall this being an issue that has ever warranted concern.
> 2) Connector compatibility. Someone using connectors that aren't really designed to work with the BR's. If a connector is too tight it could damage the connector which could cause an open circuit. I've had this happen before with other companies connectors but I've not heard of it happening with BR or MS for what it's worth.
> 3) Lastly there are typical customer "idiot mistakes". Things like, trying to run the light heads off a different ( higher voltage ) battery....or using the wrong charger designed for another voltage/chemistry. I could add more but the list would be almost endless. I think all can agree there is no limit to human stupidity.
> ...


Hi Cat Man,
Thanks for addressing the issue to where I wanted to take, but I was little "timid" to mention. Since I was a target on many issues. ( this is lack of my Spanglish and more)....lol
Anyway, we have no issues on #1 & #2. All tests were done and we got very good results of them.
However, we are very concerned on #3. And you are absolutely right about they will do it anyway.
SInce very same connectors are available even at Radio Shack or any electronic store, anyone can play around with different lights and specs which will damage either components for sure.

Yet, I will take your advise, and will try to make it possible in very near future.
And hope nothing like #3 happens.... hope. :skep:


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

IMHO said:


> FWIW I too would be interested in a separate BRIII light-head. I have the original version of the light along with two batteries (love the light). I would be interested in the newer version of the BRIII with the 15 degree lens (when available) for a helmet light (currently using an XPG torch on the helmet). I am sure there is a market for the separate light-head.


Hey IMHO;
Yes, we will take it seriously now. And will try to make it available for you.
The way things are going with engineering and so on, Ray-IV will be coming out sooner than 15degree lens for Ray-III.

Our projected release date on Ray-IV should be around late June or early July,.

Ray-IV has 15 degree lens. If you combine Ray-III on handlebar and Ray-IV on helmet, you will have one of very best lighting for most type of ride., Yet at a fraction of high cost brand name lights with similar brightness.

Thank you for your quote~!


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## crux (Jan 10, 2004)

bikerayusa said:


> Forgot to ask...sorry.
> Are you one of the dealers of BikeRay, who doesn't want to be published on our site~?
> If so, please let me know the details of this customer. I want to help.


Sent a PM.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

crux said:


> Sent a PM.


:thumbsup:


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Cat-man-do said:


> After reading what you have said about the potential misuses I can understand your concern. As far as potential misuses go I think the only real issues pertaining to running duel light heads that might have fall-back repercussions that _might_ be problematic for the vendor would be the following:
> 1) If the BR standard 4-cell battery does not have a PCB capable of outputting ( at least ) ~6A max this might be considered the major concern as it could damage the PCB on the battery. I don't know the specs. of the BR battery but on other comparable 4-cell batteries I don't recall this being an issue that has ever warranted concern.
> 2) Connector compatibility. Someone using connectors that aren't really designed to work with the BR's. If a connector is too tight it could damage the connector which could cause an open circuit. I've had this happen before with other companies connectors but I've not heard of it happening with BR or MS for what it's worth.
> 3) Lastly there are typical customer "idiot mistakes". Things like, trying to run the light heads off a different ( higher voltage ) battery....or using the wrong charger designed for another voltage/chemistry. I could add more but the list would be almost endless. I think all can agree there is no limit to human stupidity.
> ...


Sent you pm.


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## bncrshr77 (Jun 19, 2007)

Anyone know the dimensions of the Ray-III lighthead and lens?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

bncrshr77 said:


> Anyone know the dimensions of the Ray-III lighthead and lens?


Its on our webste. It weights 4.0g.

Thank you.


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

are you guys going to be at any other MTB events this year? I hear OMBA is doing a night of the living dead ride or something later in the year...


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

nick d said:


> are you guys going to be at any other MTB events this year? I hear OMBA is doing a night of the living dead ride or something later in the year...


Hi Nick~!

We will be at OMBA for sure.
Other MTB races, we wish we could be there, but we need more reps to help us attend those events.
Do you know anyone or shop who wants to work with us~? :thumbsup:


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## bncrshr77 (Jun 19, 2007)

I've been to the website several times looking for the actual dimensions of the bikeray III.....I must just be missing the info somewhere?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

bncrshr77 said:


> I've been to the website several times looking for the actual dimensions of the bikeray III.....I must just be missing the info somewhere?


Oh God~!
I am sorry~!

I thought we uploaded them long time ago. Please accept our sincere appology.
Here are some of pics from my pc.

By the way, this one is with original version color.
The new Ray-III will have Hard Army-III Anodizing procedure which will be harder and uv resistant.
The color will be dark grey.


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## bncrshr77 (Jun 19, 2007)

Thanks! Just what I was looking for!


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

nick d said:


> are you guys going to be at any other MTB events this year? I hear OMBA is doing a night of the living dead ride or something later in the year...


Hey Nick;

There is one more race that we are participating in very near future.
Its called Race Across America.
http://www.raceacrossamerica.org/raam/raam.php?N_webcat_id=1

We got couple of racers who are going for it and we will pay for all fees and lights they need.
Putting BikeRay name out is one thing, but I think they are crazy to do such race like this.
It got me so amazed by this event, we are just wondering how they will be able to walk after the event~! I thought 12 hr was crazy and 24hr is insane.
I ride 2 hrs, and I am basically dead for a day or two.


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## sdacman (Oct 13, 2008)

tick tock???


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

h h h h ~!
Yes. Just give us few more days.....
We are angry on ups as you may be....


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## sdacman (Oct 13, 2008)

*Waiting in so cal*

Not pissed just frustrated as I'm sure you are.to say waiting to fill a plane from china sound like someone is shoveling a line of bs. Already looking forward to br4 but is this what to expect? I need some illumination, some satisfaction


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## sdacman (Oct 13, 2008)

Whats the word on the BR4?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

sdacman said:


> Whats the word on the BR4?


The limited number of Ray-IV are coming too.
Will be tested and go from there.

I will be sending you one as 'Demo" unit for a week. So you can try it and give us your honest feedback.
Thanks for asking~!


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

bikerayusa said:


> The limited number of Ray-IV are coming too.
> Will be tested and go from there.
> 
> I will be sending you one as 'Demo" unit for a week. So you can try it and give us your honest feedback.
> Thanks for asking~!


are the 'test unit' ray4s coming in the same shipment as the production ray3s?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

nick d said:


> are the 'test unit' ray4s coming in the same shipment as the production ray3s?


Hi Nick;
Yes, they are in the same shipment.
That is another reason why we are so anxious. Cause I want them to be used and tested by actual racers not just by lab and us. Honest test by 3rd party will be more than manufacture spec or our testament.

You are on the list too~!


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## pangpang77 (Aug 5, 2011)

I contacted BikeRay today and they told me that they will be shipping the BikeRay IV in about 10 days with a new 12v 6-cell battery that should make the BikeRay IV last 3.5 hours. They will also be putting out a water-proofed version, given the previous water issues identified on this site.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

pangpang77 said:


> I contacted BikeRay today and they told me that they will be shipping the BikeRay IV in about 10 days with a new 12v 6-cell battery that should make the BikeRay IV last 3.5 hours. They will also be putting out a water-proofed version, given the previous water issues identified on this site.


I just looked on BikerayUSA's web site and I see nothing added to the product description that would indicate there is going to be a water-proofed version. I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying...

If true it will once again make the BR IV a light worth owning. I saw nothing wrong with the 4-cell battery they were using which ran for over 3 hrs. . If they are offering a 6-cell that would be fine but not a big issue. Voltage should still be 7.2 volts unless they are using a different driver. Sure would be nice if they made the new one's with a mid-mode and just do away with the flash. The low was fine but not quite as bright as a good mid-mode.

Anyway, I'll send Mr. Pat an e-mail to see what he says about the new versions.


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## Azra (May 20, 2011)

pangpang77 said:


> I contacted BikeRay today and they told me that they will be shipping the BikeRay IV in about 10 days with a new 12v 6-cell battery that should make the BikeRay IV last 3.5 hours.


You mean 11.1 volts? The BR IV was very close to 3.5 hr with the 4-cell battery. It ought to last much longer than 3.5 hr with 6 cells. Somewhere somebody's math is wrong, I would think.



Cat-man-do said:


> I saw nothing wrong with the 4-cell battery they were using which ran for over 3 hrs.


Oh, I see a lot wrong with that battery. Mine has a big hole where the cable exits. Maybe it is waterproof, maybe it isn't, I don't know. But it sure doesn't look confidence inspiring. Not at all. Let's put it this way: I would *not* want to dump that battery in a bowl of water like I did with my two DesignShine batteries.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Azra said:


> You mean 11.1 volts? The BR IV was very close to 3.5 hr with the 4-cell battery. It ought to last much longer than 3.5 hr with 6 cells. Somewhere somebody's math is wrong, I would think.....
> .....Oh, I see a lot wrong with that battery. Mine has a big hole where the cable exits. Maybe it is waterproof, maybe it isn't, I don't know. But it sure doesn't look confidence inspiring. Not at all. Let's put it this way: I would *not* want to dump that battery in a bowl of water like I did with my two DesignShine batteries.


Yes, with 6 cells I would think it would go another 1.5hr. Really not a big issue for me but for people doing 24hr events the extra 1.5 hr should come in handy.

About the battery: I was referring to run time performance. Yes, there is a gap where the wire exits the shrink wrap. To tell the truth I never really thought about it before. Nothing though that a quick dab of "Plastic Dip" shouldn't fix...and speaking of such I need to buy me some as I have other batteries that could use a quick touch-up as well.


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## Azra (May 20, 2011)

Here we go again, you and your DIY projects...


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Azra said:


> Here we go again, you and your DIY projects...


Well...actually not my idea. Someone else came up with the idea to Plastic Dip batteries at least a couple years ago. Like I said before I never ride in rain anyway BUT if I did I would likely just use a small plastic bag to protect the battery. My 4-cell 18650 holder has no outer covering at all, except for the pouch it sits in which of course is not water proof. I do carry a small plastic bag, just in case. Believe it or not, very few of my older bike lights had water-proof batteries and for the most part I never thought about it. At least for batteries it is super easy or to put another way....a slam dunk.


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## Azra (May 20, 2011)

Cat-man-do said:


> At least for batteries it is super easy or to put another way....a slam dunk.


Famous last words.

If you're not careful, you gonna plastic dip your tail, cat man.


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

Funny you mention the plastic-dip, cause i got a light from Rob and he plastic-dipped the battery. It looks cool and appears to be fully waterproof, but as far as the rest of the light, connectors etc, even if the improved ray4 is more resistant to water I would not want to dunk it. I think If somebody wants a truly waterproof light they should expect to shell out some more cash and get something like a Baja Design light. It might not be as bright but they are clearly marketed and designed to take that kind of abuse -which in my opinion no magicshine or bikeray light is.

Me, i never ever ride at night in the rain, so its a no brainier, get the brightest light i can for the money. If that day comes when i get caught in one of those south florida rainstorms at night, I guess we will see what happens.

Looks like either a ray 4 or an 872 will be in my future


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## Azra (May 20, 2011)

nick d said:


> I think If somebody wants a truly waterproof light they should expect to shell out some more cash and get something like a Baja Design light. It might not be as bright but they are clearly marketed and designed to take that kind of abuse -which in my opinion no magicshine or bikeray light is.


The DesignShine is *a)* brighter than any MS or BR that I know of, including the BR IV, *b)* totally waterproof (and I mean it - I've tested it personally), *c)* very well built and designed to last, *d)* not that much more expensive than the BR IV.

Yes, I know, I bought two of those lights so I may be inclined to like them, but I really see no reason why anybody serious about night riding would want to buy a MS / BR when there is a good alternative that does not cost an arm and a leg. The fascination you guys have for MS / BR really amazes me. 

Now, if BR would get their act together and fix their design/waterproofing/final assembly issues, that would be another story. But for now, my opinion of MS / BR is not very high (to put it mildly). Basically, just a toy.

_BTW, a big *thank you* to whoever mentioned DesignShine first on this forum, that's how I found out about those lights and decided to check them out._


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## nick d (May 25, 2007)

Azra said:


> I really see no reason why anybody serious about night riding would want to buy a MS / BR when there is a good alternative that does not cost an arm and a leg.


I cant speak for anyone else, but depending on the light and battery choice its almost $100 more, for a feature (full waterproofing) that I would not get much benefit from. That $100 could then be used to get a helmet light (with money left over for some fat tire ale  ).

Now if you like to (or have to) ride in monsoon conditions, or if you wash your lights off in the shower when your done riding, or in some other way cannot avoid getting your lights wet, that extra $100 would be a no brainer.

Hey to each his own, a little competition is sure to make everyone's product better! :thumbsup:


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## pceval (Oct 8, 2009)

pangpang77 said:


> I contacted BikeRay today and they told me that they will be shipping the BikeRay IV in about 10 days with a new 12v 6-cell battery that should make the BikeRay IV last 3.5 hours. They will also be putting out a water-proofed version, given the previous water issues identified on this site.


I noticed the specs noted on this site (bikeray.com/a/en/product/RAY%204/2011/0415/24.html) include waterproof IPVI, 6x18650 battery and 4.5 hrs runtime on high so I assume its been recently updated?? Can BikeRayUSA confirm or deny if you are now selling a revised version of the BR4 from bikerayusa.com, and possibly what the updates are to previous verison? Many thanks!


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

pceval said:


> I noticed the specs noted on this site (bikeray.com/a/en/product/RAY%204/2011/0415/24.html) include waterproof IPVI, 6x18650 battery and 4.5 hrs runtime on high so I assume its been recently updated?? Can BikeRayUSA confirm or deny if you are now selling a revised version of the BR4 from bikerayusa.com, and possibly what the updates are to previous verison? Many thanks!


I've been wondering about the same. I've been busy lately and haven't had as much time to look into this. If I hear anything I'll post up.


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## randyharris (Jul 1, 2009)

saw this on bikerayusa's web pate:


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

*New Bikeray IV being released*



randyharris said:


> saw this on bikerayusa's web pate:


Yep, I just received an e-mail from Mr. Pat ( Bikerayusa ) that the new improved Bikeray IV will be out shortly. They are apparently going to debut the light at a show on the west coast. I'm being told the battery is 6-cell and 12volt. More than likely it is a 11.1volt 6-cell Li-ion battery. Peak voltage would be close to 12 volts. I'm also being told it is water-proof ( and this time I think BR is going to test it first .. ). I was promised a sneak peek so I might have a photo by tomorrow ( no promises though). I had more questions for Mr. Pat on whither there would be any additional modes but those questions were not answered. Anyway, with 2 more cells I'm told the weight is only increased < 2 oz. ....we'll see. Can't wait to see what the new version will look like but with 6 cells I figure at least 4hrs on high. If the new light includes a mid-mode I will certainly tip my hat to BR.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Continued from above:

Okay, here's a sneak peek at the new ( improved ) Ray IV: Basically it looks the same from the outside ( at least from looking at the back plate ) BUT...notice the circle of notches. These are used to tighten the plate now. The button hole has been modified and is now smaller. The rear plate is using an O-ring and silicon to enhance it's ability to shed water. I'm told it is water-proof and has been tested. Please note, these are not my claims but what I am being told by Mr. Pat.

There are improvements in the alignment of the optics as well. More on that when I get my hands on one.


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## Rakuman (Oct 30, 2004)

*Cat your link does not work *


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## Chromagftw (Feb 12, 2009)

Rakuman said:


> *Cat your link does not work *


Cat napping again 

Here you go: *NEW* BikeRay-IV - Customer satisfaction, transparent and committed to make a faithful relationship.

Appreciate the update Cat. A solid contender for sure if all the issues have been addressed.

Nice work BR :thumbsup:


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Rakuman said:


> *Cat your link does not work *


Sorry, was sent a file that won't copy. I'll get back to you. 

*Chromagft*w, those pictures are the old ones.


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## Chromagftw (Feb 12, 2009)

Is that right? Oops, I was taken by the "new redesigned title" available 30/9. K will wait for the relink then.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Rakuman said:


> *Cat your link does not work *


Sorry for the delay folks but I had to go to work. My fault for not completely downloading the file first before copying. You will notice 6 little notches on the back plate...other than that it looks the same. I was told these will become available sometime near the end of the month. At the moment I have no other information on price but with a bigger battery I'm assuming the cost will go up.

Here is the picture of the improved Bikeray IV:


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## Tripower (Jan 4, 2011)

*Retrofit*

I hope they offer a retrofit "kit" for those of us that bought the original IV. My expectations are a bike light is reasonable water tight.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Tripower said:


> I hope they offer a retrofit "kit" for those of us that bought the original IV. My expectations are a bike light is reasonable water tight.


Since the new ones are using a different battery/driver, a trade in upgrade option would be best. On the other hand it should be possible to increase the water-proof abilities of the current set-ups. Whither the Bikeray people will offer either remains to be seen. Your best bet would be to send the BR people an e-mail with the question.


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## Scooby74 (Sep 21, 2011)

*bikeray iv*

Hi all, have just orderd a bikeray iv, im now thinking it is the old version? :-( 
is the only diffrence the backplate on the light itself? or are there internal changes aswell? :-\ 
Thanks guys. ;-)


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Scooby74 said:


> Hi all, have just orderd a bikeray iv, im now thinking it is the old version? :-(
> is the only diffrence the backplate on the light itself? or are there internal changes aswell? :-\
> Thanks guys. ;-)


Hi Scooby74;
It is hard for me to understand why you are asking that qustion here, rather than to us if you have any taughts...
First, Ray-IV is watersealed, to prevent any accidental water or moisture peneteration from any angle.
Second, It is 12V system rather than 7.4V. this step makes Ray-IV to have over 4.30 runtime on high.
Third, The lens is Computer aligned for best focus as possible.

If you are unhappy in anyway, I mean in anyway, please ask for full refund. We will gladly refund you no questions asked.


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## Scooby74 (Sep 21, 2011)

Hi BikeRay, 
Yes you are right i could of emailed yourselves before i ordered, but untill i came on this forum, i did not know there was an updated version, im sure i have ordered the old version as i am based in uk, all i was asking is for the diffrences between the old and new specs? if it is only the backplate as shown in('Cat-man-do)above picture and the rest of/electric components are the same then thats fine.
Regards Steve.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Hi Steve;
I had no idea where you are from. Sorry, it was totally my misunderstanding.
Tell me one thing, your battery pack is 4 or 6 cells~?
We are based here in USA, and there are some differences sold to UK and here. All BikeRay lights sold here, we recheck and modify them as needed.
If you have any concerns, we are here to support you in anyway we can, even you are in UK.
We have customers sending their lights from all over the world for services. We don't charge for any repair or parts, just shipping fees.
Who even sold BikeRay light to any customer, we will repair them for free of charge. We even did for geomangear too.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Tripower said:


> I hope they offer a retrofit "kit" for those of us that bought the original IV. My expectations are a bike light is reasonable water tight.


Hi,
Sorry,
we were very busy last month or so for InterBike show in Las Vegas.
Any older version of BR-IV(4cell battery 7.4V), you can ship the light head to us for upgrades. We will then make all neccessary upgrades and ship it back to you by Priority Mail. No charges at all.


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Cat-man-do said:


> Yep, I just received an e-mail from Mr. Pat ( Bikerayusa ) that the new improved Bikeray IV will be out shortly. They are apparently going to debut the light at a show on the west coast. I'm being told the battery is 6-cell and 12volt. More than likely it is a 11.1volt 6-cell Li-ion battery. Peak voltage would be close to 12 volts. I'm also being told it is water-proof ( and this time I think BR is going to test it first .. ). I was promised a sneak peek so I might have a photo by tomorrow ( no promises though). I had more questions for Mr. Pat on whither there would be any additional modes but those questions were not answered. Anyway, with 2 more cells I'm told the weight is only increased < 2 oz. ....we'll see. Can't wait to see what the new version will look like but with 6 cells I figure at least 4hrs on high. If the new light includes a mid-mode I will certainly tip my hat to BR.


Thanks Cat;
Here is actual photo of BR-IV's weight.
Complete kit is right on 1 LBS.


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## Scooby74 (Sep 21, 2011)

Hi Bikeray.
Thanks for reply. i have the 4 cell battery.?


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Tripower said:


> I hope they offer a retrofit "kit" for those of us that bought the original IV. My expectations are a bike light is reasonable water tight.


Well, I couldn't find right cup or something...... But hope you can see the water level, and the light is completely submerged.... But remember, It is meant to be water resistant, not waterproof. Please don't try this at home~! :nono:
We are aware of acciddental falls, and all that. But not to play under water. Do not disassemble it in anyway, Please~!!!!!!


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## bikerayusa (Oct 5, 2010)

Scooby74 said:


> Hi Bikeray.
> Thanks for reply. i have the 4 cell battery.?


I am not sure which is yours. If you open the battery bag, you will be able to feel how many cells are there. If there is only 4 round cells you feel, it means its 7.4V battery pack. Not 12V system. Each cell is about 1.85V. If you feel 6 round cells, it is 12V system.
The differences are weight(-2oz), and other is its runtime. 7.4V will run 3 hrs, and 12V will run 4.30,

You let me know what you have, and I will guide you step by step how to make best out of BR-IV you have.


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## Scooby74 (Sep 21, 2011)

Thanks BikeRay for your help will drop you an email.
Thanks again steve.


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