# Magura Marta SL Magnesium <300g!



## Light-Bikes (Apr 5, 2007)

Target under 300g!
brakelever housing and caliper made from magnesium, the lever still carbon.



https://www.light-bikes.de/website/new/2008/04/19/magura-marta-sl-magnesium

Photo taken on sea otter by tom from mtb-news.de


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## EGF168 (Aug 13, 2007)

Nice, so they can re take the lightest brake title from Hope then?


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

*wowwww*


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## Light-Bikes (Apr 5, 2007)

EGF168 said:


> Nice, so they can re take the lightest brake title from Hope then?


probably, but we have no confirmed weight so far.


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## bhsavery (Aug 19, 2004)

Nice weight, thought that lever looks a tad skimpy... wouldn't want to crash on it.


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## sonyisdope (Jul 24, 2004)

That looks awesome! And, no less fragile than other lightweight goodies I love :thumbsup:


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

bhsavery said:


> Nice weight, thought that lever looks a tad skimpy... wouldn't want to crash on it.


every lever , carbon or alu or wood or marble , never liked to hit terrain....


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## Onie (Sep 15, 2005)

Hopefully, Magura would now _re_-take the crown from Hope... With the advent of their Mg brake system...

This is interesting!


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## Baltazar (Jan 30, 2004)

the question is, is it sub 300 grams with the disc on the picture, if so, there is some room for shaving of atleast 30 grams per rotor


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## snowdrifter (Aug 2, 2006)

eliflap said:


> every lever , carbon or alu or wood or marble , never liked to hit terrain....


My Oro Puros have crashed hard many times, the lever brakes away, snaps right back into place.


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## mx_599 (Dec 10, 2005)

does anyone know when they will be available?

you can probably save more weight if you remove the powder coated finish  

mx


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

mx_599 said:


> you can probably save more weight if you remove the powder coated finish
> 
> mx


And replace it with heavily oxidized magnesium, they'll constantly get lighter the longer you own them.


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## mx_599 (Dec 10, 2005)

rockyuphill said:


> And replace it with heavily oxidized magnesium, they'll constantly get lighter the longer you own them.


i didn't think of that :thumbsup:


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## STS (Jun 24, 2004)

beat hope?
I think the lightest OEM brakes where the old formula B4SL...
my old 140mm setup was 308g with formula rotor and around 274 with stans rotor

will this magura have the same problem with magnesium making oil dirty?


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## Baltazar (Jan 30, 2004)

STS said:


> beat hope?
> I think the lightest OEM brakes where the old formula B4SL...
> my old 140mm setup was 308g with formula rotor and around 274 with stans rotor
> 
> will this magura have the same problem with magnesium making oil dirty?


Hope mono mini pro is sub 300 already


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## Some Guy (Mar 27, 2005)

Baltazar said:


> Hope mono mini pro is sub 300 already


And with a 160mm steel rotor at that.


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## amillmtb (Jun 24, 2005)

Some Guy said:


> And with a 160mm steel rotor at that.


Swap it with stans and they are even less.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Hve they been released yet?


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

From what i heard there is an issue with the magnesium caliper so its no longer magnesium just plain alloy - hence its heavier.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Wouldn't that make it just a marta sl?


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

There is some issues with the manufacturing process. Magnesium is a very tough material to work with and Magura had to go back and do some retooling. I will check with my contact but as far as I know they should be out in Feb or so.


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

EGF168 said:


> Nice, so they can re take the lightest brake title from Hope then?


Maybe lighter than Hope, but, not than Formula's new R1 at 270 gr (claimed) we will have to wait to see production real weights.


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## iClique (Oct 7, 2008)

Magura says late Feb 2009 for those...

Email from Justin at Magura:

"It sounds like your shop may have been talking about the 09 Marta Magnesium, it will not be available until late February. Have a great day!!

Thanks,

Justin Holdrieth
Sales and Rider Support"

Carlos
iClique


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## doccoraje (Jan 12, 2004)

double post


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Interesting, the Magura website is listing the Marta SL Magnesium as having a magnesium master cylinder, and an alloy caliper, where the Marta SL master cylinder and caliper are both forged aluminium. The description talks about a 295gm system but the specs talk about them starting at 312gms. It sounds like they may have changed the plan as they talked about a magnesium caliper when it was introduced.

*Marta SL Magnesium *

The completely new developed Marta generation comes with a new flagship, the Marta SL Magnesium. The name speaks volumes. *By using high-strength , forged magnesium for the master (brake lever) , the spearhead of the Marta line features a weight of just 295 grams!*

Open hydraulic disc brake system with completely integrated reservoir. New: EBT technology for superfast and convenient bleeding. Dual piston fixed caliper with automatic pad wear adjustment in a smart one piece design for maximum stiffness. Pad wear thickness can be checked without removal of the pads. Awesome looking SL rotor in a wave design for improved cooling. Featherlight 2-finger carbon fibre lever blade with integrated reach adjust. New: Improved lever kinematics and mud protection. Dual Docking: Trigger shifters can be mounted both inside and outside the brake lever.

Available in February 2009 only!

Biker profile: Enduro, All Mountain, XC Race, X-Country

Weight (in grams): from 312 grams/0.69 lbs. onwards (depending on rotor size)

Brake system: full hydraulic disc brake, open system with reservoir

*Material brake lever/caliper: Aluminium cold forged, magnesium*

*Marta SL*

When it comes to superlight disc brakes there has been one benchmark over the past six years: MAGURA Marta SL ! Minimum weight, combined with unmatched power, modulation and performance. Our word that the new generation combines all these guts again and features a bunch of finements!

Open hydraulic disc brake system with completely integrated reservoir. New: EBT technology for superfast and convenient bleeding. Dual piston fixed caliper with automatic pad wear adjustment in a smart one piece design for maximum stiffness. Pad wear thickness can be checked without removal of the pads. Awesome looking SL rotor in a wave design for improved cooling. Featherlight 2-finger carbon fibre lever blade with integrated reach adjust. New: Improved lever kinematics and mud protection. Dual Docking: Trigger shifters can be mounted both inside and outside the brake lever.

Biker profile: Enduro, All Mountain, XC Race, X-Country

Weight (in grams): from 335 grams/0.73 lbs.onwards (depending on rotor size)

Brake system: Full hydraulic disc brake, open system with reservoir

*Material brake lever/caliper: Aluminium cold forged*


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

email from Magura 08.12.08:

Hello culturesponge

the production start for Marta Magnesium is planned for february.

In the last yoear most customers used the standart straight hose for spezialized frames with brain. This year we have a new option. You may use the 90 ° hose in the bleeding opening. But keep in mind that the hose is more exposed to damage in this position. 
The weight will be around 300 g with srews, 700 mm hose and 160 mm rotor.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards 
Jörg Weyhe
HelpDesk BikeParts
Service Kundenbetreuung | Customer Helpdesk
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phone : 0900 1 648124
(41 Ct/min aus dem dt. Festnetz)

Fax : +49 7333 9626 54
Mail to : [email protected]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAGURA Bike Parts GmbH & Co. KG
Heinrich-Kahn-Straße 24 - D-89150 Laichingen
http://www.magura.com

HRA 360963 - Registergericht Stuttgart 
Persönlich haftende Gesellschafterin: MAGURA GmbH
mit Sitz Bad Urach - HRB 361171 - Registergericht Stuttgart 
Geschäftsführer: Edmund Hirth, Thomas Raith


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Does anybody know if it is going to be the beginning or the end of February?


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

Baltazar said:


> Hope mono mini pro is sub 300 already


Formula R1 is claimed to be 280g. Anyone get those on a scale yet? CRC wants something like $260 per side for them, which is about $100 more than the hopes.

$200 for 40g diff sorta sucks unless the bike is at that point.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

Light-Bikes said:


>


Uberlight levers next to gear indicators?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

dinoadventures said:


> Formula R1 is claimed to be 280g. Anyone get those on a scale yet? CRC wants something like $260 per side for them, which is about $100 more than the hopes.
> 
> $200 for 40g diff sorta sucks unless the bike is at that point.


here's some pics of the R1...both are postmount so at least the adapter for the rear is missing if i'm not wrong


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## Jerk_Chicken (Oct 13, 2005)

Can't help but to see the somewhat throwback to the B4 plastic lever/MC days in the R1's lever. I've pulled on one. Expect the flex, external, or internal.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*well...*



Jerk_Chicken said:


> Can't help but to see the somewhat throwback to the B4 plastic lever/MC days in the R1's lever. I've pulled on one. Expect the flex, external, or internal.


according to several german magazines that tested bikes with the R1 the brakes are just awesome.


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## IAmtnbikr (May 17, 2008)

Jerk_Chicken said:


> Can't help but to see the somewhat throwback to the B4 plastic lever/MC days in the R1's lever. I've pulled on one. Expect the flex, external, or internal.


Not sure what you mean there but I know the carbon fiber SL levers don't flex. Nor will any properly-made carbon fiber part. Carbon fiber is very stiff but also light and absorbs vibration when used as a frame material. Flexy? No.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

dinoadventures said:


> $200 for 40g diff sorta sucks unless the bike is at that point.


You mean they all aren't?


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## Batas (Jan 16, 2004)

Those with hope rotors (80g each) plus bolts (7g) plus rear pm adapter (25g) makes for 

Front: 255g
Rear: 290g
Total: 545g... With 140mm rear -15/20g... 525g total.... Very nice.


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## civil (Feb 13, 2008)

Does anyone know if they are they going to be selling the R1 with or without rotors?


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## bhsavery (Aug 19, 2004)

Normally Formula sells brakes without rotors/adapters.


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## chuckji (Feb 7, 2008)

Think I'm holding out for the R1's...


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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

When will a disc brake set be lighter than a KCNC or Extralite vbrake system?


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## BlownCivic (Sep 12, 2006)

sergio_pt said:


> When will a disc brake set be lighter than a KCNC or Extralite vbrake system?


I figure it won't be long now. Especially since most manufacturers are focusing their energies on the disc stuff, and forgetting about the rim brakes.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Does anybody know if it is going to be the beginning or the end of February?


apparently they will be available around February 6th, not certain about stateside.

...its the last componant needed for my S-Works Stumpjumper build - i'm fed up waiting!


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

sergio_pt said:


> When will a disc brake set be lighter than a KCNC or Extralite vbrake system?


Do not forget the extra material on the rim and studs and reinforcement on the fork and frame when comparing.


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*V's*



sergio_pt said:


> When will a disc brake set be lighter than a KCNC or Extralite vbrake system?


that will be hard to beat

levers: 38g
brakeset: 158g
add about 50g for cables
Total: 246g:thumbsup:

@Curmy:
you have about the same added weight for discbrakes....postmount adapters on forks and rear adapter on frames...i'd say this is about equal. BUT latest disc-rims got quite a bit lighter than V-brake rims. there's an advantage for discs now. But hubs and spoke count are still in favour of V's.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

nino said:


> @Curmy:
> you have about the same added weight for discbrakes....postmount adapters on forks and rear adapter on frames...i'd say this is about equal. BUT latest disc-rims got quite a bit lighter than V-brake rims. there's an advantage for discs now. But hubs and spoke count are still in favour of V's.


Few people if any will shave disk mounts from forks, and I have not recently seen any with V-brakes only. Same about most good frames. I will also pick a lighter, stronger rim over a lighter hub..

I like Vs, and still use them, but with the actual weight difference for a practical complete system getting into realm of negligible, I think it is time for them to go...


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

Curmy said:


> Few people if any will shave disk mounts from forks, and I have not recently seen any with V-brakes only. Same about most good frames. I will also pick a lighter, stronger rim over a lighter hub..
> 
> I like Vs, and still use them, but with the actual weight difference for a practical complete system getting into realm of negligible, I think it is time for them to go...


hmm-please explain:
you say you prefer a lighter,stronger rim??
I'd say it is pretty obvious that V-brake rims are still beefier/stronger...therefore also the added weight. i'd definitely say i prefer a stronger rim over a flimsy sub 300g disc-rim with weight limit...

V-brake hubs are lighter.period

Frames? ok-half a point to you. but we were talking about the weight difference of these systems and if we do so i also like to go full out.

i could also continue with saying that you can still use a old-school SID with V's but will have a flexy setup when mated to a disc...discs need a sturdier fork. i'd say we can agree also in here right?

anyway - V's are lighter and do a good job


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

nino said:


> anyway - V's are lighter and do a good job


No questions. I keep running them. Unfortunately with my weight above 90kg I do hit weight and performance limits on many real lightweight parts anyway, so a lot of the discussion is fairly theoretical for me. Sub 300g brake system per side makes me happy enough. 

As far as rims, I have certainly not done any FEA computations on strengths, but I would expect a rim without a need for a braking surface to be stronger and wider for the same weight. Not sure about that, but the fact is I would have never considered sub 400g rims just a few years ago..


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## ginsu2k (Jul 28, 2006)

*Disc vs V-Brake Rim Stiffness*



Curmy said:


> As far as rims, I have certainly not done any FEA computations on strengths, but I would expect a rim without a need for a braking surface to be stronger and wider for the same weight. Not sure about that, but the fact is I would have never considered sub 400g rims just a few years ago..


You don't really have to do FEA to roughly figure out if one rim is going to be stronger than another. All you need to know is the moment of inertia about the cross section. The taller the rim profile is, the larger the MOI will be and thus the rim will be stiffer. Think of an I-Beam. The reason why an I-Beam is so stiff (in the longitudinal direction) is that most of the material is located as far as possible from the axis that bisects the section.

If we are to compare a disc specific rim with a v-brake rim then we are generally looking for a taller cross-section, in conjunction with thicker sidewalls. This is going to look most like a box or rectangular cross-section.

Using the attached pictures, (I added the axes, trying to center them as much as possible).

*Section Width*

Disc Brake -> 23.2mm

Rim Brake -> 24.4mm

> -> difference of -1.2mm

*Single Sidewall Thickness*

Disc Brake -> (23.2 - 18)/2 = 2.6mm

Rim Brake - > (24.4 - 19)/2 = 2.7mm

> -> difference of -0.1mm

*Cross-Section Height*

Disc Brake -> 18.6mm

Rim Brake -> 16.9mm

> -> difference of +1.7mm
__________________________________________________

Well, I'm actually a bit surprised. I would think that the extra sidewall thickness would make the v-brake rim stiffer, but the reality is that the braking surface is located very near the center of the cross-section so it does do as much to increase it's MOI.

The way Stan has crafted the ZTR Olympic disc rim is to make it a taller section than the ZTR 355, so that it mostly likely has superior stiffness. The flat bottom (vs. curved for the ZTR 355) and the fact that the bridge is located a couple millimeters from the axis is likely to contribute significantly to the MOI.

Interestingly, the extra section width on the ZTR 355 should contribute to stiffer section in the lateral plane. This should make sense as the rim brakes do load the rim laterally so you would want to optimize the rim for that application.

In conclusion, buy rims for your application! Disc rims for disc wheels, etc. Also, remember mass does not determine stiffness, it's where the mass is located in relation to the loads encountered that determine the stiffness of a part.


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## sergio_pt (Jan 29, 2007)

nino said:


> hmm-please explain:
> you say you prefer a lighter,stronger rim??
> I'd say it is pretty obvious that V-brake rims are still beefier/stronger...therefore also the added weight. i'd definitely say i prefer a stronger rim over a flimsy sub 300g disc-rim with weight limit...
> 
> ...


Vbrakes are good when not riden in the mud. everywhere else they can beat a disc brake by performance and weight easly. but I'm geting disapointed with frame manufacturers getting lazy to produce v-brake options.  

Disco fever is contagious and I see weightweenies taking weight penalties to get a discbrake system, manufacturers leaving vbrake options.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

sergio_pt said:


> everywhere else they can beat a disc brake by performance and weight easly.


No, I do not think that V-brakes can beat strength and modulation of a 203mm front rotor on my AM bike.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I have noticed that this forum about the Magura Marta SL Magnesium has kind of leaned toward the Formula R1 recently. For all you R1 fans, you might find this forum which is specifically about the R1 interesting: http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=417405


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## DaveBis (Jan 1, 2009)

That photo Nino posted shows the Formula R1 at about 350 grams, 80 grams more than the claimed weight!

So much for me getting a set of those for my Scott Spark weenie project!


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## civil (Feb 13, 2008)

DaveBis said:


> That photo Nino posted shows the Formula R1 at about 350 grams, 80 grams more than the claimed weight!


I thought the claimed weight of 270g was for 1 brake, so add ~100g (heavy) to the 168 and you are still under the claimed 270g which is lower than almost anything (stock) out there. I'm looking forward to these brakes.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

civil said:


> I thought the claimed weight of 270g was for 1 brake, so add ~100g (heavy) to the 168 and you are still under the claimed 270g. I'm looking forward to these brakes.


You think 100g is heavy for rotor and rotor bolts and mount adapter and mounting bolts? I would say it would be a rather nice weight.


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## civil (Feb 13, 2008)

Yep, scrub rotors 

I didn't factor in an adapter because I don't use one.

And who needs bolts? 3 Al bolts should work fine.


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## Mattias_Hellöre (Oct 2, 2005)

civil: are you kidding?, 3 al bolts for one whole brake disc?, you better have a good life insurance.


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## civil (Feb 13, 2008)

Nope, sometimes I even run the front without a disc 
.
.
.
.
.
yes, I was kidding. should have put a wink/smiley


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## chuckji (Feb 7, 2008)

Batas said:


> Those with hope rotors (80g each) plus bolts (7g) plus rear pm adapter (25g) makes for
> 
> Front: 255g
> Rear: 290g
> Total: 545g... With 140mm rear -15/20g... 525g total.... Very nice.


Batas - are you saying use 140mm rotor in rear with R1's?
Interesting.....

How would you mount the caliper in the rear - whose adapter would you use?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

chuckji said:


> Batas - are you saying use 140mm rotor in rear with R1's?
> Interesting.....
> 
> How would you mount the caliper in the rear - whose adapter would you use?


Use a 160mm front caliper mounting system on the rear.


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

I would consider the Marta SL Mag's if they came in all-black and actually had some damn modulation, unlike the current Marta SL's.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

You don't find the Marta SL's modulate well? 

I've got them on three bikes and I like the range of power they have once the pads touch the rotors. They are such good one finger brakes that you can get all the range of clamping pressure you need with that one finger.


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

I've found them to be very on/off. Is there an adjustment of which I am unaware?


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## chuckji (Feb 7, 2008)

Use a 160 front caliper mount??
Sorry, I'm not getting it.

I would need to go from PM to IS and lower the caliper to get to the 140mm rotor...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

chuckji said:


> Use a 160 front caliper mount??
> Sorry, I'm not getting it.
> 
> I would need to go from PM to IS and lower the caliper to get to the 140mm rotor...


Just use any IS caliper setup (direct IS or with PM/IS adapter) that will work on a 160mm front rotor, move it to the back and presto, it's sized for a 140mm rotor.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

dinoadventures said:


> I've found them to be very on/off. Is there an adjustment of which I am unaware?


There's a lever reach adjustment but that's all. Which pad are you using, the Endurance or Performance version? The performance pads are very quiet and offer lots of modulation.


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

i rolled it with whatever came factory.

you think i should give them another go? i am really pretty pleased with the Hopes I have now, but I could move those to the Turner.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

If it's easy enough to change without having to fuss with hoses and bleeding, it's always worth a shot. Try the Performance pads out, they will wear quicker, but not diabolically so.


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

I'd have to go buy another set of Marta's to try it out. If I had them on hand I'd try the pads for sure.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

The Marta Magnesium brake is very likely to arrive in the 2nd or 3rd week in February. I would reckon that you shuold have yours, if you've already got 1 on order, in the last couple of week of February.
The small bleed kit is probaly as good a way to bleed this brake as any.

Best regards,

Drew

I just got an email from magura with regard to when the Marta Magnesiums are finally going to be released. It is the last piece to put on my custom Sewanee and am frustrated waiting for so long for them. I hope they're worth it.

Drew Coull
Innendienst | UK Sales Administration
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phone : +49 7333 9626 29
Fax : +49 7333 9626 17
Mail to : [email protected]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAGURA Bike Parts GmbH & Co. KG
Heinrich-Kahn-Straße 24 - D-89150 Laichingen
http://www.magura.com

HRA 360963 - Registergericht Stuttgart
Persönlich haftende Gesellschafterin: MAGURA GmbH
mit Sitz Bad Urach - HRB 361171 - Registergericht Stuttgart
Geschäftsführer: Edmund Hirth, Thomas Raith


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I am patiently (that's debatable) waiting for my brakes to come but have a question about them for anybody who may know/ have experience. With regard to new brakes (I have always had a set already installed come with all of my bikes) obviously the hydraulic lines need to be shortened to fit the bike. My question is in regard to the bleeding of them: do they need to be bled after the lines are shortened or is it simply cut, connect to the master cylinder/ lever and you are done?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

If you're careful you can shorten the hose without needing to bleed them, but it's best to assume that things won't go that well and you will need to bleed them after shortening them.


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

Just plan on bleeding them. If you're lucky/good enough you won't have to, but if you're planning on bleeding the brakes and don't have to you'll be happy. If you were planning on not bleeding them and have to, you'll be pissed.

I love the feeling of recently-bled brakes anyway....


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## Robin v Berkel (Aug 19, 2008)

i get marta SL Magnesium in 2/3 weeks shop where i go buy them wil get them this week onlye need w8 on money from my work then i can go get them when i get them i wil post weight of breaks


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## civil (Feb 13, 2008)

Sweet, I'm really interested in seeing some real weights. Trying hard to decide between these and some R1's.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I will hopefully get mine around the same time, but we will see. Are you getting them online or what? USA or Europe? Supposedly they are already out in Europe and on the way to the USA as we speak.


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## Robin v Berkel (Aug 19, 2008)

mtbnozpikr said:


> I will hopefully get mine around the same time, but we will see. Are you getting them online or what? USA or Europe? Supposedly they are already out in Europe and on the way to the USA as we speak.


i get from dutch bike shop


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## dennis rides Scott (Mar 3, 2005)

> I would consider the Marta SL Mag's if they came in all-black


Yes, what's up with al these brake manufacturers. I looks like they all want the most striking brake. I simply want a realy light AND black brake :madmax:

It turns out there isn't any. Yes I know I could use the older Marta and buy some carbon levers, but none of the recently released brakes comes in simple black. I could life with the extra grey of the new Marta but if I need to buy carbon levers separate, these brakes would be freaky expensive! The closest I could find is the R1. BUT, how many people want red bolts? I shure don't!

If every part manufacturer wants to be the most striking, whe will get screaming bikes with all the colors of the spectrum!


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## dinoadventures (May 2, 2008)

Quick question... diff between Marta and Marta SL non-magnesium is just the lever, or is there something else?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

dennis rides Scott said:


> Yes, what's up with al these brake manufacturers. I looks like they all want the most striking brake. I simply want a realy light AND black brake :madmax:
> 
> It turns out there isn't any. Yes I know I could use the older Marta and buy some carbon levers, but none of the recently released brakes comes in simple black. I could life with the extra grey of the new Marta but if I need to buy carbon levers separate, these brakes would be freaky expensive! The closest I could find is the R1. BUT, how many people want red bolts? I shure don't!
> 
> If every part manufacturer wants to be the most striking, whe will get screaming bikes with all the colors of the spectrum!


i upgraded my old black Stans edition Marta's with Goodridge carbon thin wall hoses + alloy connectors, 08 Marta carbon SL levers, TH Ti bolts, Scrub 180mm + 160mm metal matrix rotors and Swiss Stop pads. stopping power/modulation is brilliant + they are probably alot lighter than the 09 Marta's.

...seems like beyond bikes still has some Stans Marta's with aluminum rotors.

i'm chuffing bored waiting for the white/red Magnesium Marta's to be released so i can finish my Stumpjumper build - i have a can of 500º matt black enamel engine paint (normally used for rotors) ready incase they are too pretty.


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## dennis rides Scott (Mar 3, 2005)

> Quick question... diff between Marta and Marta SL non-magnesium is just the lever, or is there something else?


 I believe also titanium bolts for the SL.



> i have a can of 500º matt black enamel engine paint (normally used for rotors) ready incase they are too pretty.


Yeah, I'm thinking of simple paint the borecap and unreplacable bolt of the R1 black, but this could turnout ugly as well.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

For the normal to the SL, it's just the carbon lever. No Ti bolts included. Pretty stupid for the extra money. But, worth it if you want/need one of the fancy colors


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> i upgraded my old black Stans edition Marta's with Goodridge carbon thin wall hoses + alloy connectors


That seems interesting - few questions :

- where did you get the hoses and what is the difference between the Thin wall hoses vs the regular Goodridge hoses? 
- Is the hose stainless steel?
- Any difficulties installing them?
- Noticeable difference in performance?

Thanks :thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> That seems interesting - few questions :
> 
> - where did you get the hoses and what is the difference between the Thin wall hoses vs the regular Goodridge hoses?
> 
> ...


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

culturesponge said:


> apparently they will be available around February 6th, not certain about stateside.


WRONG!

Competitive Cyclist today moved their availabilty date for the Marta Mags from tomorrow back to 18/03/09.

...i should have tried harder to buy the Marta SL World Cup Ltd Ed.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

After they are released in Europe it takes 4-6 weeks to get to the US, since it arrives by boat!


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

A local dealer has a set of the worldcup edition's. Personally, not my cup of tea. The WCS flag gives the brakes a cheap look. On the other hand, these should be the lightest config as they have magnesium caliper's & oil reservoir. Due to production problems, the regular magnesium series only have a magnesium oil reservoir, caliper is aluminum.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

madskatingcow said:


> A local dealer has a set of the worldcup edition's. Personally, not my cup of tea. The WCS flag gives the brakes a cheap look. On the other hand, these should be the lightest config as they have magnesium caliper's & oil reservoir. Due to production problems, the regular magnesium series only have a magnesium oil reservoir, caliper is aluminum.


I know that the first batch will be Al calipers, and it will be interesting to see if they can get the tooling corrected so we can have Mag calipers!

Yes, those colors on the WCS are way to much!


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

According to Magura USA, they are set to arrive in the states in the beginning of March.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> A local dealer has a set of the worldcup edition's. Personally, not my cup of tea. The WCS flag gives the brakes a cheap look. On the other hand, these should be the lightest config as they have magnesium caliper's & oil reservoir. Due to production problems, the regular magnesium series only have a magnesium oil reservoir, caliper is aluminum.


madskatingcow please PM with info on your dealer - i'd be insanely happy with the "WCS Pride Edition" brakeset.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Go figure, the "special limited world cup edition" is out before the regular production version. I am lost.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Go figure, the "special limited world cup edition" is out before the regular production version. I am lost.


Maybe they think that people will not feel bad about paying extra for early availability if it has some garish kooky graphics on it.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Curmy said:


> Maybe they think that people will not feel bad about paying extra for early availability if it has some garish kooky graphics on it.


They're likely committing the initial production run to the World Cup teams who will be building bikes about now for training for the first race in April, so those 150 kits are likely the surplus from the World Cup runs, just for the keeners. :skep:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Curmy said:


> Maybe they think that people will not feel bad about paying extra for early availability if it has some garish kooky graphics on it.


looks like my payment went though for a set...

i know my bike will look like i sella de nice icey creams, but i think all the waiting made me softer in the head + looser in the wallet area than usual. its not so bad anyway - my other bike (an S-Works Epic) has 15 Worlds emblems: 3 on the frame, rest on the componants.

matt black with gloss black graphics + carbon composite levers would be my ideal choice - but at least these are made of magnesium.

...my thinking is, get the brakes then i can order plain (non WC Pride) 2009 Marta black res covers - when i get my mits on the brakeset i can finally build my bike.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I am so jealous as I am still waiting for my set. Please let us know how they perform though.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> I am so jealous as I am still waiting for my set. Please let us know how they perform though.


thanks, but please don't be jealous. apparently the Mag Marta's should be available in the next week or so - i'll probably be waiting longer for mine to arrive in the post from Belgium.

i've some upgrades ready for mine lined up, Goodridge hoses + alloy connectors, Scrub 180+160 rotors & Swiss Stop pads - so braking won't be the exactly same as factory issue.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Ha, so you ordered them from my local dealer? :thumbsup: 

Enjoy the brakes, you'll love them for sure - Marta's are the best!


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Ha, so you ordered them from my local dealer? :thumbsup:
> 
> Enjoy the brakes, you'll love them for sure - Marta's are the best!


yes! massive thanks for your help.

lucky for us Roald's a very patient man, next time your there please give him regards from alex & flavia.

Marta's are brilliant (we'll have 3 brakesets soon 07/08/09) but they really come into their own when you upgrade the brake hose.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> WRONG!
> 
> Competitive Cyclist today moved their availabilty date for the Marta Mags from tomorrow back to 18/03/09.
> 
> ...i should have tried harder to buy the Marta Magnesium World Cup Ltd Ed.


Those are just Marta SL's and not the Marta SL's Mags. Just spoke with US Magura and they still hope to have a full Mag set sometime! Until then the first run of Marta SL Mags will have an alloy caliper.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Any information from them on when they will be available?


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Any information from them on when they will be available?


No definite time as yet, but should be in the next couple of weeks, at least I hope!


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

pastajet said:


> Those are just Marta SL's and not the Marta SL's Mags.


eh?

09 Magura Marta SL Mag Ti Disc Brake @ $365.00 .

https://www.competitivecyclist.com/...ra-marta-sl-mag-ti-disc-brake-5132.508.0.html

as i said CC changed the availability date from 27.02.09 to 18.03.09 on the 26th.

CRC (UK) currently have a due date of 31.03.09 for the brakes (Magnesium Marta's)


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Yes, I know all of the listed availability dates and everything else but obviously things change. Just looking for information from the source (Magura USA) if any is available. Hopefully they are a better source than the online bike shops for information on these especially considering that all brakes imported into the USA go through them first before heading off to the bike shops. I do appreciate your information and help though.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Yes, and I am getting a test pair as soon as they come in, so I will ping everyone when I hear from them, until then it's an ambiguous date.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Yes, I know all of the listed availability dates and everything else but obviously things change. I do appreciate your information and help though.


things change - Magura keeps changing the date, retaillers keep changing the date. i'm just posting to this thread updates to what shops are telling customers - not daft speculation or hype.

chill


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, I talked to Magura USA today and they told me that there are 60 sets arriving in the states next week. It seems as if the long wait is finally over.


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## vwvoodoo (Dec 4, 2005)

I called this last week and verified the shipment to my shop - 2 pair of Mags that will be leaving Ohio by the 17th out of that 60 pair. Sorry, but they're both sold (one to myself =)). 

I'll keep everyone posted on the progress one I get them (maybe I'll even weigh them...)
They will match up nicely on my new Durin SL on a new DW Flux - it will be a light fast build that is still squishy. The second set is going on a new DW 5Spot.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

The Mag SL's are available NOW in a shop here in the UK. Trouble is you have to buy a Magura Fork with them too


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## Robin v Berkel (Aug 19, 2008)

i stil w8 on my set and i live in holland next to germany


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*good news boppers*

from earlier today....

"I should have the Magura brakes here on the 24th! I show the UPS tracking number where Magura, USA has shipped them to us! I would suggest getting in contact with me on the 24th and I should be able to put them in my hands.

Mike
Universal Cycles"

...wiggle.uk currently has an expected stocking date for the Mag Marta's at the end June!


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

Yes, Magura US got them on Monday. Now I get to wait until they can get me a review sample for a MTBR.com ProReview! Better then Formula on the R1 (mid summer if I was lucky) or Hope (nothing). Magura US rules! Give us updates when someone gets a pair!


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## mrhand (Oct 30, 2005)

In stock at Competitive Cyclist


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

my Champions' Edition Marta's arrived in the post today on the slow boat from Europe - looks like my bike will be built by this time next week!

sorry no scales here, or time to take a pic, but might have more time tomorrow.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

That's still pretty fast. The other way around, US to Europe takes ages due to the Belgian customs. Average : 3 weeks. I'm still waiting for my S-Works cranks :madman:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*Magura Marta SL WCS Ltd Edition Brakes on scales*

just managed to catch Helen's Cycles just before they closed this afternoon and borrow their scale (thanks folks).

hurried to get these pics, but the weights look good!

...they have SwissStop Disk 21 pads and the bolts for bar mount are trimmed down Schmolke carbon M5x20mm.

(edit for typo)


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> That's still pretty fast. The other way around, US to Europe takes ages due to the Belgian customs. Average : 3 weeks. I'm still waiting for my S-Works cranks :madman:


sorry to hear that, i didn't know i had any patience till i started the current bike build.

i very nearly ordered the S-works MTB Crankset for my S-Works Stumpjumper (back in November when i bought my frame), the price was killer, a few hundered off the Specialized price and i would have had it in just 3 days - only trouble it wouldn't fit!

...if i can ever help you out please let me know - i owe you one.

massive thanks

alex
culturesponge


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Wow, despite the rainbow master cylinder covers, they are hot. Mine are supposedly going to be shipped on Thursday of this week. Anyway, have fun with those, and let us know how they feel/perform and any other interesting tidbits about them.:thumbsup:


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

Are the champion editions the same as the magnesium version? If so, I would've thought they would've been lighter. 

2009 Hope X2 Pro 

Front w/ 2x Ti M6x20mm screws for front mount and uncut hose was 219g
Rear w/ 4x Ti M6x20mm screws w/ IS to PS adapter and uncut hose was 248g

and the hopes are a lot less money.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I hear that the hopes are lacking in power when compared to the martas. For me, the martas fit my color scheme, and the hopes don't (tried, but didn't work).


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

mtbnozpikr said:


> I hear that the hopes are lacking in power when compared to the martas. For me, the martas fit my color scheme, and the hopes don't (tried, but didn't work).


hear?


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I have read reviews and talked to people (I can't say positively that they are weak because I have never tested them) about them, but the fact that they didn't work with my colors (orange and white) was just more motivation to go for the marta sl magnesiums despite the fact that they have been on order since October.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Cheers! said:


> Are the champion editions the same as the magnesium version? If so, I would've thought they would've been lighter. and the hopes are a lot less money.


i wouldn't trust Helen's Cycle shop counter scales to be spot-on.

no, these are the WCS pride version - extra heavy on the paint work.

lol, every componant i've ever bought i've wished was alot lighter when i'm grinding uphill.

if i get the chance/time i'll weigh them again with shorter Goodridge hoses and alloy connectors.

to be honest Cheers i don't give a wet fart if these are the world's lightest brakes or not - i really like Marta's, they work for me - but keep buying British by all means!

chill, have a beer.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Did you put in the SwissStop pads yourself? If so, why (I really like the OEM pads). ?


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Im not complaining or anything - they are nice brakes but im a little suprised at the weight too. 

My Avid Ultimate Front WITH bolts is 220 grams and the Rear is 260 grams with adapter and bolts.

These Marta SL's are pritty heavy in fact. Do they have the magnesium caliper ?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Did you put in the SwissStop pads yourself? If so, why (I really like the OEM pads). ?


Chris @ Scrub advises against using Magura pads with his SL metal matrix rotors - i think these are the best organic pads in the world so here they are.

had no probs with Magura organics, but will save them for when i'm running Marta SL steel rotors.

i hope you crankset arrives today.


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## zooford (Dec 20, 2006)

^agreed. for a brakeset that should be competing with the R1 from formula, or the hope pro's...that's a pretty disappointing weight...


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

With a rotor that is supposed to weigh around 100 grams, this does put it over the top of the claimed weight doesn't it.


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

FYI: the champion version is only the Marta SL's and not the SL Mags. Also the first version of the SL Mags have AL caliper's, the full version is still in the process of being tooled, so no word of the final weights


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Are you serious!? Just the normal marta sl's for the world champion version? Wow, I did not do that. I have heard about the non-magnesium caliper though for the first generation brakes. Just out of curiosity (depending on weight difference, I may opt for it) after the magnesium calipered version comes out, will the caliper be available to buy separately from everything else?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

Considering the difficulties they have had with getting the magnesium calipers into production, it might be wise to wait for V0.1 just in case.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> to be honest Cheers i don't give a wet fart if these are the world's lightest brakes or not - i really like Marta's, they work for me - but keep buying British by all means!
> 
> chill, have a beer.


I didn't know they were not the same as the Marta SL Mags. I assumed so since they were being posted in this thread. So my first reaction was a bit of a shock as everyone has been hyping these brakes up for the past 6+ months.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

pastajet said:


> FYI: the champion version is only the Marta SL's and not the SL Mags. Also the first version of the SL Mags have AL caliper's, the full version is still in the process of being tooled, so no word of the final weights


No that's not correct - they are the magnesium's and for now the only ones with magnesium calipers & brake levers. The SL mag's being released right now have an aluminum caliper.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

madskatingcow said:


> No that's not correct - they are the magnesium's and for now the only ones with magnesium calipers & brake levers. The SL mag's being released right now have an aluminum caliper.


If that's the case they are heavier than my current IS mount Marta SL's which weighed 228gms rear and 214gms front without the rotor and mounting hardware.


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## eliflap (Dec 13, 2007)

what a bad commercial , this thread !!!

one year ..... and not on shop yet ....

ahhh ... a delay is possible ... but now it's incredible


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Do you have the old model or 2009 ?

Maybe off topic, but apparently the Specialized Factory riders seem to have Avid Juicy Ultimate's mounted for the Cape Epic, or am I mistaken? These guys have been Magura riders for so long.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

madskatingcow said:


> Do you have the old model or 2009 ?


I've got the old model Marta SL's.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Cheers! said:


> I didn't know they were not the same as the Marta SL Mags. I assumed so since they were being posted in this thread. So my first reaction was a bit of a shock as everyone has been hyping these brakes up for the past 6+ months.


seems like alot longer than 6 months of hype for those Magnesium's.

your totally right, sorry folks, posting 09 Marta SL pics + comments on a 09 Marta SL Magnesium thread is abit lame, it was nice to contribute to the discussion though!

...can someone please post pics of Mag Marta's on a scale?


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Yeah those specialized riders are using Avid Ultimates.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, I guess that is a relief: to know that the marta sl magnesiums should be lighter yet.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Well, I guess that is a relief: to know that the marta sl magnesiums should be lighter yet.


i hope so! (my WCS LTD Edition Marta brakeset are on ebay tomorrow).

i'm more than abit miffed that Magura put aside the heaviest "SL" brakes for the LTD Edition, especially after the Durin Race forks recall.

...wouldn't be that suprised if the total weight difference is less 40g between the 09 SL and the Magnesium's - damn this weight weenie virus i've caught!


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## KERKOVEJ (Jan 23, 2004)

madskatingcow said:


> Maybe off topic, but apparently the Specialized Factory riders seem to have Avid Juicy Ultimate's mounted for the Cape Epic, or am I mistaken? These guys have been Magura riders for so long.


The Specialized Factory Team might have a 'SRAM parts only' clause in their contract this year. SRAM might be requiring them the run their shifters, derailuers, chains, cassettes, and brakes in '09. I know that Shimano and SRAM are starting to go this route now with sponsorships.....especially those requesting $$$ along with product.


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## Cheers! (Jun 26, 2006)

KERKOVEJ said:


> The Specialized Factory Team might have a 'SRAM parts only' clause in their contract this year. SRAM might be requiring them the run their shifters, derailuers, chains, cassettes, and brakes in '09. I know that Shimano and SRAM are starting to go this route now with sponsorships.....especially those requesting $$$ along with product.


A sticker solves the problem.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Too bad that the information is no longer available on Magura's (new) website.

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=35906










Marta SL Magnesium Brake Set:

The completely new developed Marta generation comes with a new flagship, the Marta SL Magnesium. The name speaks volumes. By using high-strength, forged magnesium for the master (brake lever), the spearhead of the Marta line features a weight of just 295 grams.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*here's some 09 Magura Marta Magnesium brakes on Cynergy Cycles counter scales.*



culturesponge said:


> ...can someone please post pics of Mag Marta's on a scale?


rear brake was snapped with wedgie so approx -10g on that weight?

...all i can say in their defence is the hydro line was very, very long compared to the WC Ltd Edition brakeset.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

And that's without the PM to IS adapter for the rear brake. Those aren't that light.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

However with the ten grams or so subtracted for the clip they were weighed with (also I assume that the lines will be shortened), they should be about what Magura said they would be, if not less.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

The Magura yellow wedgie clip is only 4gms (just weighed one of mine).


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

when i get my new bike back i'll measure the hose (its not needed), WC edition Marta lines are 80cm front, 150cm rear.

i'm just happy that Magura is having a go at lighter weight Marta's without compromising their dependability, but the best is yet to come. 

....hey Magura! it would be really handy to have a Matchmaker type mount on the next version of these brakes!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

It would also be nice to the see the weight of the Magura rear IS to PM adapter.

The SL rotor and bag of hardware weigh 135gms, so that puts my old IS mount Marta SL at 214gms front and 228gms rear with the hose trimmed to length and no caliper mounting adapters needed. I'd really have hoped to see a noticeably lighter Magnesium version.


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## Limon (Jan 26, 2004)

*marta mag weight*

just got this today and here you go, hose lenght on front and rear is the same at 1630mm.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Disappointing weights - still heavier than my avid ultimates with mounting bolts.


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## Limon (Jan 26, 2004)

Tiffster said:


> Disappointing weights - still heavier than my avid ultimates with mounting bolts.


you mean stock or tuned?, bolts, pads, other tunning? please tell


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Mine are bog standard.

Front Ultimate - With pads, Ti lever bolts, Ti mounting bolts no tuning aside from triming about 5cm of hose is 226 grams - BUT im using the Avid matchmaker clamp. The stock clamp is 5 grams lighter so like for like it would be 221 grams.

Same setup for the rear - but with two extra ti bolts and the mount adapter is 259 grams


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## Guest (Mar 28, 2009)

*Stans AL Rotors*

One set, no bolts 'NEW' Yes, they were on my bike for a two rides with organic pads but that was it. They are in perfect condition. $100.

[email protected]


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Mine I think were shipped yesterday so I should have them shortly, but for everyone who has them already, how are they? How do they perform? I would love to hear some first impressions.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Mine I think were shipped yesterday so I should have them shortly, but for everyone who has them already, how are they? How do they perform? I would love to hear some first impressions.


about time! i think you'll like them.

mine are great, using bedded-in Marta SL rotors they do exactly what i want them to do.

you really can tell the difference with the new larger Julie/Louise pads, modulation and stopping power is significantly better, that was probably the best thing Magura could do to the Marta brakes to really improve them.

the levers are better, a much better design with more "heft" + they have more front and back movement so abit less likely to be smashed in a crash.

next week when i get another set of res covers in, i'll be removing the paint to expose the raw carbon underneath (to match my bike) red is too flashy for my taste - shame i can't do the same with the red on the caliper....

(edit to add pic of hydro line)


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

About time is right. Thanks for the information on them. They are going to be in on Monday, and I will waste no time installing so I can ride again. Glad to hear that the WCS business all got resolved. Thanks again for the information.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, it has been since October but I am pleased to report that the waiting is over. My brakes arrived today and need I say more. I installed them, shortened the lines, and went off to begin the break in process. They definitely look and feel better than my previous Hayes Stroker Trails. It took forever, but I am happy with where I ended up.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

looking good, how are your impressions of the brakes so far?


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, I have not had much opportunity to go out and ride on them yet but will be heading out on Friday and Saturday of this week. In what I have ridden I have been very impressed. I broke them in in a couple rides on the pavement and was pleased with power and modulation. I am running 160 mm rotors front and rear and find more than enough power. To consider that these brakes are running just slightly over 300 grams per pair, it is amazing how much power they have when there is so little to them. I am coming from Hayes Stroker Trails, and like these much better and think that they perform better as well.


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Well, it has been since October but I am pleased to report that the waiting is over. My brakes arrived today and need I say more. I installed them, shortened the lines, and went off to begin the break in process. They definitely look and feel better than my previous Hayes Stroker Trails. It took forever, but I am happy with where I ended up.


Nice. Those Maxxis Maxxlite 310s are fast- but scary too. Keep us updated!


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

I'm confused. My Hope Mono Minis have to weigh just as little as these Marta Mags and I've had them for 2 years. What's the big news here?

Guess I will have to tear them off my bike tomorrow to get the exact weight, but at this point I just don't see the big deal. The Hope's have a ton of power, great feel, and are readily available....


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Confused huh? Well I am almost certain that when your Hope Mono Mini Pro's came in, you were pretty excited to install them and try them out. They are beautifully machined brakes, the rotors are works of art, light, and I'll take your word for it with regard to power although I have been told they have much less of it than the Maguras (I am not going to argue that point though as I have not tested them myself).

The big deal is that Magura made a brake comparable to the Mono Mini Pro's, and I think that everybody was and still is excited to get them and test them out. They are also beautiful, light, and very powerful. Sure they took a long time to get but now that most people participating in this forum have them, the frequency of new posts here has slowed down which suggests positive results and few problems with the new brakes. I am very happy that you like your Hope's and even happier about my Marta SL Magnesium's. Excitement about a beautiful new successful product is not confusing.


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Confused huh? Well I am almost certain that when your Hope Mono Mini Pro's came in, you were pretty excited to install them and try them out.


You are correct. I was excited to install them and try them out because they were lighter than anything I had ever tried. I was excited to see if the light weight would sacrifice performance. Luckily it did not.



mtbnozpikr said:


> They are beautifully machined brakes, the rotors are works of art, light, and I'll take your word for it with regard to power although I have been told they have much less of it than the Maguras (I am not going to argue that point though as I have not tested them myself).


I have used a few different sets of Marta SL's (though not the 2009 version) and think my Hopes are MUCH better. I can't compare the 2009 Marta SL's, but my Hopes feel better, have better braking, and look much nicer (my opinion on the looks of course).



mtbnozpikr said:


> The big deal is that Magura made a brake comparable to the Mono Mini Pro's, and I think that everybody was and still is excited to get them and test them out. They are also beautiful, light, and very powerful. Sure they took a long time to get but now that most people participating in this forum have them, the frequency of new posts here has slowed down which suggests positive results and few problems with the new brakes. I am very happy that you like your Hope's and even happier about my Marta SL Magnesium's. Excitement about a beautiful new successful product is not confusing.


But that's what I am confused about. Magura made a brake COMPARABLE to the Hope, but years after the Hope came out. Wouldn't you think after years of development the Marta SL Mags would be either significantly lighter or have significantly more power?

From what I have read, these brakes have neither. They cost more (since you have to pay full retail), don't weigh any less, and are tough to get.

I'm confused because I feel there is a product just as good if not better that's readily available and has been for years.


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## tolleyman (Mar 5, 2006)

2006 Magura Marta:

Lever, hose, and caliper for front 160mm, with Hope 160mm Mono Mini Pro rotor weighs in at 285 grams on my scale, with Ti rotor bolts.

I haven't weighed the rear, I will next time I have it off , I suspect it'll be about 15-20 grams more due to the longer hose, maybe not though since I'm using 140mm rotor.

This indicates to me that the Marta is lighter weight than the Mono Mini Pro, the advertised Hope weight is 295 for the 140mm size, that's without adapter or rotor bolts I bet too.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

I can assure you the Marta's have a lot more power than the Hope's. I've had Mini's before, and it is a day and night difference.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

madskatingcow said:


> I can assure you the Marta's have a lot more power than the Hope's. I've had Mini's before, and it is a day and night difference.


Especially with the Performance pads, they stop so much better than the Endurance pads, with all the modulation you could want. I have Hopes Mono Minis on one bike and the older Marta SL's on three bikes. :thumbsup:


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

I'd have to check my weights and/or scale if I were you. I'm not saying yours is wrong and mine is right, but I just weighed a 2008 Marta SL front, no rotor or bolts (since those can be changed to anyone's rotor) and I got 263g for the Marta lever (carbon) body, hose, and caliper and caliper mounting hardware.

Something tells me the Hope rotor and bolts weigh more than 22g.

Either way, I measured a 2008 Marta SL and a 2009 Hope Mono Mini Pro. I only weighed caliper, hose, lever, and all caliper mounting hardware (to IS style mounts). The Hope needed an adapter, the Marta I have did not. Here are the weights of the two on the same scale:

2008 Marta SL - 263g
2009 Mono Mini Pro - 248 g (with IS adapter)

This is front only.

I say Hope is the "weigh" to go! Now if I only had a set of Magnesium SL's to weigh to compare.


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> I can assure you the Marta's have a lot more power than the Hope's. I've had Mini's before, and it is a day and night difference.


Are they bled properly? I have Mono Mini Pros on 2 bikes now and have 2 bikes that have (soon to be removed) Marta SL's. I think the Mono Mini's are as good if not better than the Martas.

Just my opinion.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Sure, but I'm comparing to the 2009 SL's :thumbsup:


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## brandonecpt (May 7, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Sure, but I'm comparing to the 2009 SL's :thumbsup:


I'd love to, just dont have any. Magura USA just told me today they got in a shipment of Marta Mags on Friday, but they are damned expensive!

Anyone want to buy a set if I get them to weigh?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*09 Magura Marta SL Magnesium + raw carbon res covers*

i finally got around to removing the red paint on the carbon resovoir covers on my mag marta's, not sure how much weight i've saved doing it (2g perhaps?) but i'm happier with them looking like that & thought i'd post a pic.

peace & go ride yer bikes!

(edit to change pic)


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

This doesn't look like an improvement to me :skep:


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

culturesponge said:


> i finally got around to removing the red paint on the carbon resovoir covers on my mag marta's, not sure how much weight i've saved doing it (3g perhaps?) but i'm happier with them looking like that & thought i'd post a pic.
> 
> peace & go ride yer bikes!


Those ultra-thin levers look like they will fold, on the very first crash. I thought my Marta SL levers were flimsy!


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> This doesn't look like an improvement to me :skep:


really? my S-Works Stumpjumper frame is mostly raw unidirectional carbon the lipstick red res covers looked flashy before.

raw carbon is better + i've saved some weight.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Zachariah said:


> Those ultra-thin levers look like they will fold, on the very first crash. I thought my Marta SL levers were flimsy!


more negatives?

the new levers are apparently stronger/better than the 08's.

http://www.velonews.com/article/76981

"Both Marta SL Magnesium and Marta SL are produced using the company's new carbon molding technology. In the past Magura used a common "pre-preg" carbon manufacturing method in which layers of pre-preg carbon were hand laid into lever molds. The new method incorporates a machine that stitches the shape of the lever into the carbon before resin is introduced, this allows Magura to lighten and stiffen the carbon brake lever for the 2009 models."

...i have both kinds of levers on different bikes & would expect the older carbon levers to be more fragile as they are visibly thinner/abit flexy.

(edit to add link and quote)


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

culturesponge said:


> really? my S-Works Stumpjumper frame is mostly raw unidirectional carbon the lipstick red res covers looked flashy before.
> 
> raw carbon is better + i've saved some weight.


You've gone way too granular about weight, mate. I agree the black looks slightly better.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Better to take a dump before you go out riding, saves you from having to remove the paint


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Better to take a dump before you go out riding, saves you from having to remove the paint


no problem with that, if i'm not careful there's associated paint removal!

on my predominantly monochrome bike carbon (black) + white those pretty red covers really looked out of place, however an S-Works Epic has alot of red - so lipstick red res covers suits your bike far better than mine.

...this is a weight weenie forum?


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> ...this is a weight weenie forum?


almost forgot


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, that's an interesting modification. I understand your reasoning behind doing it. Anyway, did you do anything about the red on the calipers?


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## Megaclocker (Sep 28, 2005)

Do you guys remove the plastic thingy at the end of the hose. (mine always fall)
I don't want crap to get in...

Anyone got a spare Torx T7, I've lost mine  (I am ready to pay for lettermail shipping)


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Well, that's an interesting modification. I understand your reasoning behind doing it. Anyway, did you do anything about the red on the calipers?


thanks, not yet! i waited (weeks) for a spare set of res covers to arrive from BTI before doing any modifications at all.

calipers are not such a high priority as the res covers were, but i'll write to Magura to see if 09 black caliper covers are available for purchase as a spare part, and then hopefully get them switched out at my LBS.


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## IPA Rider (Aug 24, 2008)

*Progress?*



brandonecpt said:


> I'm confused. My Hope Mono Minis have to weigh just as little as these Marta Mags and I've had them for 2 years. What's the big news here?


Generally, I have to agree with this sentiment on brakes (and not only the models/makes mentioned explicitly). There is sooooo much discussion, lots of smack talking, and all sorts of disparate numbers quoted on weights on this forum. I'm not seeing much evidence in terms of clear winners, or real sources of progress, in the last couple of years (either that, or there is progress, and it is being obscured by lots of false reports, delusional bias, and nostalgia).


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*dragonplate carbon veneer on mag marta front caliper*



mtbnozpikr said:


> did you do anything about the red on the calipers?


last night i dug out some cabon fibre veneer from:http://www.dragonplate.com/ecart/categories.asp?cID=12 that i'd bought to try and modify the res covers on my trusty olde 07 Stan's Marta's with no luck though as its not flexible enough.

anyways, two 25mm circles of self adhesive carbon fibre veneer now cover the red on the calipers - well at least till the brakes get hot enough to melt the glue and they fall off!

...does anyone know when the magnesium calipers will be available?


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

You could cut those adapters in half in the mean time to save some weight :thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Tiffster said:


> You could cut those adapters in half in the mean time to save some weight :thumbsup:


not a bad idea! there's alot of excess metal there if your bikes just for XC riding/racing.

Formula seem to have a much weenier range of PM adapters than Magura.

...that dragonplate self adhesive veneer is also good for a making thin light, real carbon chainstay protectors


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Check out my blog - i did it with my Avid ones. As far as i know the avid one is the lightest available at 20 grams stock.

Mines 15 grams now.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Oh man, you are ruining a great set of brakes


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Oh man, you are ruining a great set of brakes


lol, keep your hair on dad! it's just abit of fun.

(its not permenant) i'm happy that i finally found a use for the sheet of self adhesive carbon veneer i bought a while back.

...are your precious (semi) mag marta's working better now then?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*pic*

i didn't follow this thread at all.so i don't know if there was a pic of them posted already...anyway - they aren't nowhere as light as announced. For me Magura is a No-go anyway.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> ...are your precious (semi) mag marta's working better now then?


Still waiting for the postal service to deliver them at my door. Right now they are at the customs :sad:


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## nathanbal (Jan 30, 2007)

nino said:


> i didn't follow this thread at all.so i don't know if there was a pic of them posted already...anyway - they aren't nowhere as light as announced. For me Magura is a No-go anyway.


does anyone have off the top of their head the R1, Hope X2, XTR and Avid Elixr CR weights to compare to the 228g of the marta?


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## nino (Jan 13, 2004)

*R1 weights*



nathanbal said:


> does anyone have off the top of their head the R1, Hope X2, XTR and Avid Elixr CR weights to compare to the 228g of the marta?


R1 front 168
R1 rear 183g

the carbon levers on the R1 would save an additional 10g...so forget about the Magura Magnesium.


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## nathanbal (Jan 30, 2007)

wow... that is a big difference. especially given the marta mag sl's are the same price as the R1s...


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Still waiting for the postal service to deliver them at my door. Right now they are at the customs :sad:


sorry to hear that madskatingcow, i was climbing the walls waiting for my brakeset to finish my build - i hope they arrive intime for the weekend.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

nathanbal said:


> wow... that is a big difference. especially given the marta mag sl's are the same price as the R1s...


not so! where are you looking, all i can say is shop around - there's killer bargains to be had.

09 Marta SL Magnesium $276.25 (free postage + no tax) (online)

is there a European bike mag review out yet that directly compares R1's and the new 09 Mag Marta's with other brakesets????


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

As far as I know Formula said they were not going to release the carbon levers? What is the length of the R1 hose? 

The Marta SL Mags front and rear both are sized with 64 inch (1625mm) hose length, which was much to long, I cut mine to 31 and 52 inches, here are the weights (includes pads):

Marta SL Mags (Al caliper) w/ full hose - rear 224.1g (64 inch hose) and front 225g (64 inch hose)
Marta SL Mags (Al caliper) w/ cut hose - rear 207.9g (52 inch hose) and front 197.7g (31 inch hose) 

Extra stuff:
2 Ti caliper bolts - 7.3g
IS/PM adapter for rear - 19.6g
2 Ti adapter bolts - 6.5g 
160mm Marta SL rotor 111g


NOTE: the adapter would be needed for the R1's also, I also don't use Ti rotors bolts, damn heads strip to much, above full weights are for caliper, hose, pads and master cylinder, and clamp bolts 

Yes, they are not the lightest, but after using them for a couple of weeks, they are pretty sweet brakes, and I happen to like the color combination, fits well with my bike since it has lots of red and white on it. Not sure how much of a weight drop will happen when they have the magnesium calipers available? The new design of the Marta's and the larger Louise pads that they use make the new 160's feel like the old 180's, an amazing upgrade IMHO.

Going to try them with the after market rotors next.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*Magura Marta SL (fully) Magnesium brakes are great!*

i find it pretty hilarious that Sauser snapped both his new Avid brakes during a WCS race on 26.04.09, apparently he was in second place at the time.

http://www.sauserwind.com/diary.asp

"My race was very disappointing. I could not finish!
With two laps to go, I crashed out in second position, and broke both brakes off my handle bar. I am alright though, but my head gets always so "sore" when I can not cross the finish line of a race!"

he NEVER did anything close to that using his 09 Magura Marta SL (fully) Magnesium brakes - saving a few grams on brakes is not always better.

....does anyone know when Magura will have Magnesium calipers in production?


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

No final date as yet...


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Could be cause the XX brakes he had were prototypes ?

Did i not read that he endo'd on the bike ? Im fairly certain most brakes would have been damaged in the same instance.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*I'm fairly certain also*



Tiffster said:


> Could be cause the XX brakes he had were prototypes ?
> 
> Did i not read that he endo'd on the bike ? Im fairly certain most brakes would have been damaged in the same instance.


!BS! they were prototypes so they break more easily? - i'm not buying that (literally.)

i read it differently to you - i think that's exactly what you get when you compromise weight over performance.

Sauser was probably expecting Magura Marta SL Magnesium performance from the new XX/XXX (?) Avid brakeset - but instead crashed out and did not finish the 1st race defending his WCS title.

...at least those expensive F1 brakes have a weak point on the levers to help prevent the fragile mastercylinders from breaking - perhaps those wonderful new Avids need a re-design already?


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

culturesponge said:


> ...at least those expensive F1 brakes have a weak point on the levers to help prevent the fragile mastercylinders from breaking - perhaps those wonderful new Avids need a re-design already?


From the quote - I am not sure if it was the levers, or the clamp breaking..

Kinda hard to break both at the same time...


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I see Magura is selling these brakes and the Durin SL forks directly to the end user


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I agree with the functionality over weight principle as well. I read your review culturesponge, and could not agree more. Recently there has been a lot of stuff on here about parts so light, they are not functional at all (certain handlebars, cranks, brakes...). I am glad that people are out there researching such parts and how to make stronger, lighter parts. That is obviously how we progress, but again, I agree with you and would also choose reliability over weight any day.

I also wonder when the magnesium calipers will be available. I love the brakes but it would be nice to have a full magnesium brakeset as originally advertised. I guess we'll see what happens. Hopefully the calipers will be available for purchase separately rather than as a part of a full system.


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## michaelharsh (Jan 6, 2009)

Wow, those are good deals on the Durin SL and Marta SL Magnesium. About half off retail.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

rockyuphill said:


> I see Magura is selling these brakes and the Durin SL forks directly to the end user


Are they really selling them directly to the end user?

They ask you to complete "store name" and "store address" on the order form.

The sale price is very tempting.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Culturesponge - you sound like a man blinded by faith that Magura are the bestest most wonderfull brakes ever ever ever and that no other brake can come close....

The whole point of prototype testing is too see how things break, then you make it better/stronger etc. So whilst it was a sht result for him i reckon Avid were probably fairly interrested.

On your theory is the R1 just a disaster seeing as it's lighter than everything else ?

Anyway IMO these Marta's are too heavy for the price tag. These non mag ones are a waste of time if you ask me.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

I don't give a rat's ass about the Marta SL's. If I spent money on new brakes, they would be the Formula R1's, which are considerably lighter.

Let's focus on what matters here. Apparently, Magura is selling the Durin SL for the insanely low price of $425 (it retails for $869). If it's true, it's one hell of a deal.


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

That's just an EP form that someone put on the web. That's why it asks for "store name" and address.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*yet more bias and hype?*



Tiffster said:


> Culturesponge - you sound like a man blinded by faith that Magura are the bestest most wonderfull brakes ever ever ever and that no other brake can come close....
> 
> The whole point of prototype testing is too see how things break, then you make it better/stronger etc. So whilst it was a sht result for him i reckon Avid were probably fairly interrested.
> 
> ...


as expected you completely missed my point regarding Sauser being used to Marta's then racing with different brakes and crashing out.

lol, i wouldn't expect anything from you but bias and hype regarding anything about avid/sram/truvative/...are they your sponsors/employers?

so you really believe all those riders competing in the MTB WCS with XX/XXX (?) were testing prototypes, and not (pre)production compontant?

were they the same componants at sea otter? if so i did not read anything mentioning prototypes.

not sure what you were regurgitating back to me about R1 brakes? Formula have designed in a structural weakness into the levers to help protect the master cylinders in the advent of a frontal crash, that is fact i read it in an interview with the designer Giancarlo Vezzoli. i suggested that the new avid brakes might be better if they did something similar.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

You need to chill out - it's just a mtb forum so if you want to slag then by all means go ahead i'll let rip at you.

If you knew what you were talking about, ALL of Avids brakes have a similar system protect the MC system. The levers can be pulled out of the socket etc without damaging the MC so you loose the lever but at least the brake itself is saved.

Your the one who is being bias. How does riding a different brake warrant him crashing ? I test out new parts all the time - i don't crash? Hands in the air Sauser is a better rider than me so i'd expect he could manage just ok with trying some new brakes ? Or is it because the Magura's are SOOOOOO much more better than the Avids ?

I made a genuine mistake with your username apologies.


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## Broccoli (Jun 11, 2008)

Tiffster said:


> I made a genuine mistake with your username i thought it was spoon not sponge. Although from the way you react it may as well be cultureprick.











(since this is a weight weenie forum, pillows seems appropriate...  )


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Tiffster said:


> You need to chill out - it's just a mtb forum so if you want to slag then by all means go ahead i'll let rip at you.
> 
> If you knew what you were talking about, ALL of Avids brakes have a similar system protect the MC system. The levers can be pulled out of the socket etc without damaging the MC so you loose the lever but at least the brake itself is saved.
> 
> Your the one who is being bias. How does riding a different brake warrant him crashing ? I test out new parts all the time - i don't crash? Hands in the air Sauser is a better rider than me so i'd expect he could manage just ok with trying some new brakes ? Or is it because the Magura's are SOOOOOO much more better than the Avids ?.


both Sausers XX/XXX (?) brakes broke and he was unable to finish a WCS race defending his title - is that not a fact?

Sauser won the WCS title with Magura Marta SL Magnesium brakes (3 Ti bolts with Stans Alloy Rotors!) pretty much exactly the same bike that he crashed out - except for XX/XXX (?) brakes - is that also not a fact?

read what you like into those two facts, me i found it funny at the time.

iam not biased, but do happen to own a set of the (semi) magnesium brakes and are able to comment on their excellent performance - if you did not care to notice this thread is about the Magura Marta SL Magnesium!

Magura have recently revised the advertised weight to 313g for Magnesium master cylinder/Carbon lever + Alloy caliper +160 SL rotors + Ti fasteners - which i think is probably correct.

they are currenty on offer @ $199 a set which is practically a give-away.

its normally fun chatting with you Tiffster, but your presence on mtbr sometimes seems to be to hype + promote + defend products by avid/sram/truvative ...wasn't your signature until a day ago "Coming Soon - Sram Red Top Pull Adapters PM if Interrested" ?

!peace out!

Alex 
aka
culturesponge

(edit to correct spelling/correct info)


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Curmy said:


> (since this is a weight weenie forum, pillows seems appropriate...  )


very appropriate

i'm currently 1/2 way re-reading "Fight Club" by Chuck Palahniuk, great book - it would have been very different with pillows instead of fists


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Have you found out anything with regard to the full magnesium calipers Culturesponge?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Have you found out anything with regard to the full magnesium calipers Culturesponge?


nothing yet. it seems pointless writing and asking Magura directly - after the debarkle of constantly changing expected marketplace dates for those (semi) Magnesium Marta's.

i can only speculate that like (almost) everyone else Magura has been hit hard by this "2nd great depression" and they have had to scale back plans.

hopefully the re-launched 2010 Mag Marta's will be back to 299g - just like the small 1st batch of fully mag Marta's that was available in limited numbers back in October/November last year. then more than likely the magnesium calipers will be available seperately for peeps wanting to upgrade.

.... hey Magura! - it would be nice for Semi Mag Marta customers to have a discount on them!


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Let's hope so on both fronts: 1) Magura makes them available with the next iteration in 2010 and 2) Magura does something to alleviate the cost with regard to the people who bought the semi-magnesium version, so ours can be fully magnesium too.

On another note, I was not aware that the fully magnesium version was available in September or October or whenever it was.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Competitive Cyclist had a few for sale over here stateside - if only i knew then what i know now!


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

rockyuphill said:


> I see Magura is selling these brakes and the Durin SL forks directly to the end user


The article was removed. Was anyone able to order anything at the special sale price?


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Pictures of the Marta SL Magnesium's on my bike :thumbsup:


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## briscoelab (Oct 27, 2006)

sfer1 said:


> The article was removed. Was anyone able to order anything at the special sale price?


That was not legit, that is why they pulled it. It was an EP order form that someone put online.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

You're right: slightly frustrating.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Very frustrating. I really wanted a cheap Durin SL.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Well, I just got off of the phone with Magura USA, and asked about the magnesium caliper. The guy I spoke with told me that there are no plans to put out a magnesium caliper even in 2010. I hope that this changes, but considering it came from the source, it probably won't.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*nice one*



madskatingcow said:


> Pictures of the Marta SL Magnesium's on my bike :thumbsup:


at long last! those red res covers match your bike perfectly.

are those your old Formula rotors? let me know how they are working - i think they would be better/lighter than the thin braking track ABS Marta rotors on my training wheels.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Well, I just got off of the phone with Magura USA, and asked about the magnesium caliper. The guy I spoke with told me that there are no plans to put out a magnesium caliper even in 2010. I hope that this changes, but considering it came from the source, it probably won't.


don't take anything the bloke who answered the phone told you as gospel - we've been there before!

if other manufacturers can have SL Magnesium calipers on the market - there really can't be any reason other than manufacturing costs that is preventing Magura from also doing so.

i'd expect things to change when this recession is behind us, that might be late 2010/2011 though.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I hope you're right.


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## sfer1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Well... where else can I get a Durin SL for $425?


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Sorry for a delay in response, my internet went down. Seems when it breaks down it REALLY breaks down. 10 days without it :skep: 

Anyway - to clarify i am not employed, sponsored or in anyway associated with Sram. Granted i do use there products and have my personal opinion on that but i don't go out of my way to endorse them etc.

If you read my blog - you would see what i meant with the Top pull adapters. This is not a Sram designed part and is something i am doing off my own back for my own use and to help fellow WW's use a light weight front mech on bikes which have Top pull routing.

As for your point on Sausers bike, i still think it's ridiculous but i don't want to get involved in an argument here so lets be done with it.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Tiffster said:


> As for your point on Sausers bike, i still think it's ridiculous but i don't want to get involved in an argument here so lets be done with it.


okay.

...if Magura continues treating its customers like stupid cattle my next brakeset purchase will probably be the those new SL Avids, my 1st set of Stan's Marta brakes were really only great after i upgrade the brake hose anyway.


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

culturesponge said:


> ...if Magura continues treating its customers like stupid cattle my next brakeset purchase will probably be the those new SL Avids, Marta brakes are really only any good for where i ride - after i upgrade the brake hose anyway.


Shine some light on that please? Nothing wrong with Magura Marta SL brakes in my opinion, except for the wave rotors that cause juddering (solved by installing Formula R1 rotors). Power & modulation are up to par :thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

madskatingcow said:


> Shine some light on that please? Nothing wrong with Magura Marta SL brakes in my opinion, except for the wave rotors that cause juddering (solved by installing Formula R1 rotors). Power & modulation are up to par :thumbsup:


nothing's wrong at all with the performance of 09 Marta's! i was thinking about that on my ride today & went back and made an edit to clear up my foggy post. but my 06/07 Stan's Marta's did need help with less spongy hydro lines to cope with long mountain descents then (for example) sudden emergency stop to avoid a dog running ahead of its owners.

but, i'm peeved at Magura for launching a fully Magnesium Marta brakeset last year with terms like "Benchmark!" and "a new flagship", then when muggins here actually gets his mits on a set - i find i'm cheated as they are only partially Magnesium.

seems only very recently that the information on the Magura website and vendors of the (semi) Magnesium Marta's have updated their information about the brakeset with a more factual revised weight and spec.

Magura are a joke if they can only be bothered to manufacture Magnesium master cylinders and not calipers for their flagship product - i'm no expert, but the calipers look less complicated and perhaps easier to cast?

glad your happy with your brakes, R1 rotors are on my list now.


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

I bet that they discovered that preventing corrosion was harder than they expected on the calipers.


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## p_shep (Jan 12, 2005)

I had a pair of B4SL's back in the day... lasted about 2 years before it disolved to the point it no-longer worked.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

The trouble with magnesium is it is a biatch to work. It can ignite and cause no ends of trouble if your machines burst into flames obviously. So possibly with the design they are having issue's. 

It does corrode too but for what it's worth i chipped my Avids which are mag and so far (fingers crossed) it hasn't caused any issues. Bearing in mind a lot of fork lowers are magnesium too and you see how beat up those get.


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## p_shep (Jan 12, 2005)

It's not corrosion in the air that's the main problem... it's the brake fluid!


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Ah right i see what you mean.

Yeah that would be a bugger too. I wonder how they solved that on other brake systems.


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## p_shep (Jan 12, 2005)

Finding a conformal coating which is durable, and resistant to the brake fluid I guess!


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

At least it's mineral oil in Maguras, just like fork oil. This was an issue with the older Magura fork lowers too that had the stainless steel anti-corrosion shields at the dropouts, so maybe these are issues related to the magnesium alloy being used.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

madskatingcow said:


> Nothing wrong with Magura Marta SL brakes in my opinion, except for the wave rotors that cause juddering (solved by installing Formula R1 rotors).


I have heard about this problem with the wavy rotors; however, I have been using mine for a couple of months now and do not have a problem (I'm pretty sure that my hands/arms aren't numb but I can't feel the juddering at all). When are you feeling it?


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## rockyuphill (Nov 28, 2004)

If they're still shipping them with the Endurance pads, switch them to Performance pads, less noise, better stopping and less rotor vibration issues. They also have better modulation.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

maybe its the very long shadow of their 5 year leaky/breaky warranty that's preventing the Magnesium calipers from being made publicly available?

on the Magura website one staffer said that Magnesium cannot be powdercoated and was painted - perhaps the same problem with the baked on protective coatings used in motorsport/industrial/medical/ect?

my semi's were shipped with 5.1 performance pads

(edit for typo)


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## madskatingcow (May 23, 2006)

Standard the peformance pads are mounted, not the endurance.

At first, when riding dry conditions I didn't have the issue, it only started after I rode under very muddy conditions. The issue is the rotor design - no doubt about that.

You can find the thread and other users experience with this issue on Magura's support forum here


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

If Magura use miniral oil then what's the issue with internal damage ? I was thinking it would be DOT fluid damaging the magnesium but miniral oil should leave it undamaged no matter how old it gets ?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

Magura Royal Blood (aka mineral oil also aka baby oil!) should be totally inert, air bubbles in the system would only react to exposed Magnesium in a worse case scenario.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium

in my parts bin i have some 10 year old Bontrager Race Lite Magnesium Bar Ends (90g pr. untuned) which appear to have been anodized and not painted. there's been no surface degredation (or spontanious combustion!) apparently they are easier to fracture than alloy bar ends - although the set on my wifes Stumpjumper have survived 2 good crashes now!

(edit to add the 2 good crashes)


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## nikoli8 (Mar 23, 2008)

Baby oil, really...


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Baby oil is simply mineral oil with a fragrance in it and since magura uses mineral oil (minus the fragrance) for their brakes...


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

For what it's worth, the new Sram XX brakes come with a two piece magnesium caliper. They seem to have no problem making the caliper out of magnesium (get with it Magura!). Also, I think that everything is available in the beginning of July or so which is only a few weeks away. It took Magura a year to bring theirs to market. I guess we can still hope and wait on the full magnesium version.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> For what it's worth, the new Sram XX brakes come with a two piece magnesium caliper. They seem to have no problem making the caliper out of magnesium (get with it Magura!). Also, I think that everything is available in the beginning of July or so which is only a few weeks away. It took Magura a year to bring theirs to market. I guess we can still hope and wait on the full magnesium version.


the SRAM machine really has its act together.

i don't regret buying my Marta semi Magnesium brakeset, especially with a rebate that made them cheaper than the regular alloy 09 Marta's.

but i do think Magura have done a trully terrible job bringing their flagship brakeset to the marketplace - very, very late and incomplete with only the master made of Magnesium.

let's hope Magura get back on track ASAP or someone buys them out and does it.


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## Happy Trails (Jun 29, 2004)

*Brakes*

As a rule I never comment just like to watch. I have resisted disc brakes as I think I am a true weight weenie and use Extra-Lite brakes and levers and find them to stop and work flawlessly, also use Stans wheels with AC hubs (no problems with AC for years) I was going to go disc because a new frame choice dictated i do so. I was going with the R1 or the Mag SL. with the Stans disc wheels, It seems every time i read about disc there is nothing but problems everyone goes on and on about this hose, spongy, drag, air, etc. I think I'll keep my v-brakes and still ride my 18lb carbon NRS thank you very much, Central Florida dont need no stinking disc.


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## IAmtnbikr (May 17, 2008)

Happy Trails said:


> As a rule I never comment just like to watch. I have resisted disc brakes as I think I am a true weight weenie and use Extra-Lite brakes and levers and find them to stop and work flawlessly, also use Stans wheels with AC hubs (no problems with AC for years) I was going to go disc because a new frame choice dictated i do so. I was going with the R1 or the Mag SL. with the Stans disc wheels, It seems every time i read about disc there is nothing but problems everyone goes on and on about this hose, spongy, drag, air, etc. I think I'll keep my v-brakes and still ride my 18lb carbon NRS thank you very much, Central Florida dont need no stinking disc.


I love the Marta SL's on my carbon NRS (sub-21 lbs too)


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

culturesponge said:


> the SRAM machine really has its act together.
> 
> i don't regret buying my Marta semi Magnesium brakeset, especially with a rebate that made them cheaper than the regular alloy 09 Marta's.
> 
> ...


Don't get me wrong. I don't regret it either and I also got a great deal on them ($275 a brake).

I agree: announcing one thing, and then delivering a different product a year later is not my idea of good business. Let's hope they get with it and fulfill commitments/promises. Never actually used a SRAM product minus a Rock Shox Judy, but at least they know how to stay profitable and in business.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*Marta Magnesium Calipers!*

(might be old news but... ) looks like Magura are now manufacturing Magnesium Calipers for their flagship brakeset, well according to the spec on the website

http://www.magura.com/en/products/disc-brakes-2009/prod/marta-sl-magnesium-1.html

"Technical features: Dual piston fixed caliper made of forged, high strength magnesium with automatic pad wear adjustment in a smart One Piece Design for maximum stiffness."

Magura! ...any chance of a discount on Magnesium Calipers for early adopters lumped with Alloy Calipers??


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

culturesponge said:


> Magura! ...any chance of a discount on Magnesium Calipers for early adopters lumped with Alloy Calipers??


Intriguing but fat chance.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*Magnesium Marta Calipers ...finally available?*



mtbnozpikr said:


> Intriguing but fat chance.


i wrote to Martin @ Magura and asked him very nicely - i'll take a fat chance rather than continue to be peeved about my semi Mag Marta's

other options

BTI has 09 Mag Marta calipers listed but not in stock (or perhaps not yet stocked) might be worth checking back every now & then

http://www.bti-usa.com/public/item/MU8601


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## pastajet (May 26, 2006)

The only Mag calipers that ever existed were on a few beta models, which were not released to the general public, we can still hope for a full mag set, but for now there isn't any. I will broach the subject at Interbike and see what I can find out from German HQ people.


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

It will be interesting to see what happens but I'm just not too optimistic about it. Let us know what the response is though.


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## Tiffster (Jan 30, 2008)

Did you guys buy them under the impression they are mag ? If so im suprised the yanks having sued Magura bankrupt :thumbsup:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

pastajet said:


> The only Mag calipers that ever existed were on a few beta models, which were not released to the general public, we can still hope for a full mag set, but for now there isn't any. I will broach the subject at Interbike and see what I can find out from German HQ people.


i thought a few made it stateside? Competitive Cyclist appeared to have a few on sale for a short time Sep/Oct last year

let us know what they say

Magura recently changed the blurb on their websites Mag Marta page from "Aluminium cold forged" to "Dual piston fixed caliper made of forged, high strength magnesium"

also the newest Mag Marta brakeset product photos now have Magnesium on the calipers in red which was missing (with good reason) from the first few months production.... fully Magnesium brakeset now?


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

I hope they are willing to work with us assuming the full magnesium calipers come through like they were originally supposed to, but still am not holding my breath. New calipers are not cheap, and then what to do with the old ones.


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

*>>>Magura are lying to their customers!<<<*



mtbnozpikr said:


> I hope they are willing to work with us assuming the full magnesium calipers come through like they were originally supposed to, but still am not holding my breath. New calipers are not cheap, and then what to do with the old ones.


around $107 for 09 alloy calipers (with pads) - which is pretty steep

if i ever got my mitts on Magnesium calipers, i'd use the semi Mag 09 calipers re-painted black to upgrade my 06 NoTubes Marta's or sell them on fleabay with the unused performance pads & use the cash to upgrade the mrs red ano 08 Marta calipers...

.........................................

i had a response from Magura

From: [email protected]
Subject: Magura: Marta SL Magnesium Calipers
Date: 8 September 2009 01:25:37 PDT

Hi there,

thanks for your mail. Please note that the caliper of Marta SL Mag is made of aluminium, both my 2009 and also in 2010, no changes then.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards

Martin Schäfer
Marketingleiter | Head of marketing

....................................

no explanation why Magura had changed the Mag Marta webpage Product Feature text from "Aluminium cold forged" (calipers) in March to the current "Dual piston fixed caliper made of forged, high strength magnesium with automatic pad wear adjustment in a smart One Piece Design"

http://www.magura.com/en/products/disc-brakes-2009/prod/marta-sl-magnesium-1.html

>>>Magura are lying to their customers!<<<

...my next bike will have XX Avids + Scrub rotors

.......edit to correct typo.......


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

Just the misinformation in and of itself is frustrating:madman:


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

mtbnozpikr said:


> Just the misinformation in and of itself is frustrating:madman:


Magura changed the (semi) Mag Marta's product description to Magnesium calipers without actually changing the product... it's more than just frustrating - it's blatant fraud!!

..................................
Subject: Re: Magura: Marta SL Magnesium Calipers
Date: 8 September 2009 09:54:23 PDT
To: [email protected]

Hallo Martin

thanks for the reply

so why does the Magnesium Marta Product Features new text describing them as "Dual piston fixed caliper made of forged, high strength magnesium with automatic pad wear adjustment in a smart One Piece Design"

when i bought my Mag Marta's in March, the Product Features description was "Aluminium cold forged" (for the calipers)

why change the description for the calipers if they are the same??

thanks + warmest regards

alex
(owner of '06 Magura Marta NoTubes, '08 Magura Marta, '09 Marta SL World Cup LTD Edition (sold), '09 Magura Marta SL Magnesium)

....... the response......

From: [email protected]
Subject: Magura: Marta SL Magnesium Calipers
Date: 9 September 2009 00:18:07 PDT

Hi there,

"all specs are subject to change without prior information" is clearly mentioned on all our printed matters. Sorry that the caliper is and will remain in aluminium then.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards

Martin Schäfer
Marketingleiter | Head of marketing

.......final reply.....

Subject: Re: Magura: Marta SL Magnesium Calipers
Date: 9 September 2009 09:37:00 PDT
To: [email protected]

Martin

then you should change the product feature information on your website regarding the Marta SL Magnesium - because now it clearly states that the calipers are made from forged Magnesium!

it makes me very sad that Magura are not the brilliant company i thought you were

regards

alex 
(owner of '06 Magura Marta NoTubes, '08 Magura Marta, '09 Marta SL World Cup LTD Edition (sold), '09 Magura Marta SL Magnesium)

...........edit to include correspondence...........


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## timbuktu (Nov 9, 2008)

Nice addition to the Magura Marta SL Mags.

Not sure what the original cap/covers weight is, whereas these supposedly are 7 to 8 grams. Regardless, they look very cool. Plan to get a couple.

Can be had on Ebay. 
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130381050585#ht_1687wt_1167
<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130381050585#ht_1687wt_1167>


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## mx_599 (Dec 10, 2005)

they kind of look like crap...i hope it is just the picture?


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## mtbnozpikr (Sep 1, 2008)

For $90 a pair, they had better be worth a heck of a lot more than their weight in gold...


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## timbuktu (Nov 9, 2008)

mx_599 said:


> they kind of look like crap...i hope it is just the picture?


One man's cool is another man's crap. Beats the red ones.


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## mx_599 (Dec 10, 2005)

timbuktu said:


> One man's cool is another man's crap. Beats the red ones.


it looks better on your bike

the holes just didn't look like they were "machined" nicely?


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## culturesponge (Aug 15, 2007)

spare pair of original 09/10 magura Marta SL res covers with red paint removed weigh 12g

if you like carbon weave and have the dosh they might be a good purchase, i have something in very similar carbon on my 07 Marta's from the same seller, fit was great had no problems with them at all since install.

this is what res covers look like naked, ud carbon (removing the red paint cost nothing)


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## timbuktu (Nov 9, 2008)

Actually, I don't know whose bike they are mounted on (taken from ebay ad). Does look good, though, once the screws have it mounted. I'm considering a purchase, but $90 bucks? For me it would just be a cosmetic purchase, rather than the red covers. Could buy a light weight tire or something else for that amount. Will see.


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## Mr. IROC-Z (Aug 24, 2006)

Wow...$90 a pair! People have lost their goddamn minds.


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## timbuktu (Nov 9, 2008)

It's all relative, but then again, the component at this link, makes me wonder "Where will it all end?" I just have a hard time justifying $940 for this:

http://fairwheelbikes.com/ax-lightness-zeus-mtb-stem-p-2185.html

http://fairwheelbikes.com/ax-lightness-zeus-mtb-stem-p-2185.html


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## Mr. IROC-Z (Aug 24, 2006)

Wholly crap! $940 for a stem! I bought my Extralite Stem for $200 and I thought I was getting ripped off. My Extralite wights 81grams, but this Ax-Lightness is at 59 grams. That is very impressive, but not sure if it's worth another $740 for just 22grams savings.
That $740 can get you a nice used Stans ZTR race wheelset!


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## nikoli8 (Mar 23, 2008)

*Shifter set up*



timbuktu said:


> One man's cool is another man's crap. Beats the red ones.


More shifter set up picks.. I've never seen that before..


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