# We are going to give it a go



## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Recently while at a MTB festival we met a couple riding a tandem on the trails. Not that this is all that unique as I've seen other tandems, but this pair made me really look into getting one.

The wife and I are both experienced long time off road riders. Trying to add a new twist and have fun together I convinced her we might try it. 

We had ridden a rental, cheap road tandem in DC last year and it wasn't too bad, so we knew we could at least get around.

Time will tell for us on the trails. 

I did pick up a used Cannondale Mountain Tandem, being real careful about fitting the frame size for her. Being friends with the old C'dale rep, I called and spoke to him about how the frames fit certain builds. We both figuired she was on the bubble for between a small and medium.

The bike we got had the small, but so far seems to fit pretty good. Leg extension is good, stoker stem is slid to the forward oem stop but I can trim the telescopic stem to slide further forward if needed.

The oem seats are horrible and will go away ASAP. It does have front suspension and a rear suspension seatpost. I'm pretty certain if this works out I will upgrade this to a Thudbuster for her.

We rode a while around the neighborhood just to get a feel of how we each react and need to adjust, so I ask.

Is there any "standard" methods, techniques for mounting and commincating for, starting, stopping, coasting. And more importantly, how are trail issues dealt with, in regards to maybe getting over small logs or roots, or tighter corners with minimal flow.

The one big problem I already see and feel, is she is sometimes trying to naturally turn the bike, and I immediately feel the weight shift as she leans in, but obviously can't steer from the back.

Thanks folks and if there is more you might add I appreciate it all, both good and bad.

Thanks
PK


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## TandemNut (Mar 12, 2004)

PK,
Congratulations on getting a tandem. You're in for some great fun!
Find a copy of "The Proper Method" by Bill McReady of Santana. http://www.gtgtandems.com/tech/propmethod.html
It offers a good method for mounting and dismounting that will work well until you come up with something individual that works better for you.
I wouldn't worry about the sizing too much right now, since there's so much adjusability built into the stoker compartment. Just make sure she's comfortable.
As for communication on the trail, you'll gradually develope your own code of words to communicate with each other. We use "bump, log, go harder (for steep pitches), go easy (for iffy technical stuff), shift, hold on, oh sh*t!" etc etc. Fewer words make it easier to keep breathing while riding, plus it's less noisy on an otherwise peaceful trail.
I always tell new stokers to try to be "neutral" on the back, and to relax. If they're tense, they'll telegraph that through the stoker stem to you. If they try to steer, their movements are nearly in the ceter of the bike and will influence the bike. So it's best for them to think "light & neutral" when stoking. 
If possible, it helps to have her captain once with someone smaller on the back, so she can feel how the movements on the rear telegraph through the frame.
The most important thing to remember is that "the stoker makes no mistakes". 
You, the captain, are responsible for making the ride good for the stoker, including pace, duration, terrain, etc etc. Keep her comfort uppermost in your thinking, and it will pay huge dividends. 
Also, start slowly on relatively easy terrain, and get a feel for what the bike can do. As your comfort level grows, you can tackle more technical stuff. On the Cannondale, your biggest issue will be low bb height and a slackish head tube angle, but those shouldn't keep you from enjoying many a trail.
Have fun! Pictures and a ride report would be very welcome here on this board!


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

Thanks for the info and advise. 

We rode today, and did one of the trails we normally ride on our other bikes. Some sections are tight and technical with others more flowing. We had a few timing concerns but had the best time riding.

A few corners were just too tight to "get around", we walked / rolled the bike to see if it was possible, maybe with another line. Some maybe, others no, so we dealt with each as needed.

Day one we had a blast, no blood or injuries to mention. Best part is we are already planning a few more local rides this week after work.

I made a few changes from some stuff I had laying around. I had a bunch of semi vintage stuff, some even new, other parts were pulled from another bike. Swapped the Magura HS11 Master Cylinders to some John Tomacs, installed Curve brand brake boosters and Salmon pads. Replaced all the hydraulic hose compression ends to the new style and bled the brakes. Other things were more for rider fit, Coda riser front bars, Flite front / Terry rear, new grips. Put on tires more specific to where we ride.

Oddly this bike we got used and it was basically new. The only thing out of place was it had the front derailiuer replaced to a 9 speed XT with the wrong type mechanism (bottom pull / top swing), so I swapped it to a correct vintage XT, granted it is for smaller chainrings but seems fine with our 48 tooth.

After our ride, went by the shop today and ordered a 2008 Thudbuster. That should be it for a little bit.

Only other thing I'm considering is getting a set of rear cranks in 175 for her. OEM is Sugino so replacement 175's aren't to much money. I also need to spend some time aligning the brake calipers. No braking issues yet, even on some hills, but they do need to be aligned better.

You asked for a photo, here it is a 98 MT3000. I hope the photo posts.

Thanks
PK


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## PMK (Oct 12, 2004)

BigNut said:


> PK,
> ...
> 
> On the Cannondale, your biggest issue will be low bb height and a slackish head tube angle, but those shouldn't keep you from enjoying many a trail.
> Have fun! Pictures and a ride report would be very welcome here on this board!


I appreciate the reply, we have several rides now. Seems I've created a monster as this is possibly the wifes favorite bike to ride.

Honestly, we both are enjoying it and the making or breaking of technical challenges as a team.

I quoted a portion of your reply as I want to ask more about these topics.

You mention the C'Dale having a slack head angle, prior to buying ours, I pulled out some of my old catalogs and did some comparing. Our bike having rim brakes seems to, per the specs, has a steep head angle (73ish), while disc frames are slacker (71ish). Am I overlooking something here, from my first test ride this thing felt steep and light in the steering.

I've added preload and gotten the fork decent, though I haven't removed the spring to check its rate. Maybe this weekend I'll explore this as I wouldn't mind upping the rate and dropping some preload, which should help push the head angle out a little and help with clearance.

As for the BB height, on a tandem what is normal, low vs high. Clearance is a definite concern. Is it worth it to use smaller say 34 tooth timing chainrings vs the 38's we have or just not bother.

Thanks for the reply
PK


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## Fleas (Jan 19, 2006)

I am watching for the response here...

We have a '98 MT1000.

The head angle seems kinda steep. The addition of a susp. fork should drop it a few degrees and up the BB ht. (however slightly), right? Just curious.

Also, I've been toying with the idea of a slider under the 2 BB's. The C'dale rep. said if we anchor it to the BB shells and don't put a point load on the main beam, it would be OK. Smaller chainrings would help, too.

And yes, conquering those technical obstacles as a team is very rewarding! We find ourselves doing maneuvers that we normally wouldn't even try.
We trimmed our stoker bars a bit narrower just to keep my wife's knuckles off the trees. And as much as people say that they like the stoker to remain "neutral" or "quiet", my wife can almost steer from the back. :thumbsup: She knows how to shift her weight at the entrance of a turn which makes turn-in really quick. One of these days I will try to ride no handed.
And the 2 words I use the most are "power!" and "duck!"
Have fun out there. And if you fall, make sure your wife lands on something soft.

-F


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