# Technique Help : Rolling off a Ledge



## DrBrewhaha (Nov 4, 2009)

I've been riding about 6 months now and have ridden trails in Moab (Moab Brand, Slick Rock, Entrepid), Phoenix (South Mountain and Red Mountain), and Cortez (Phil's World). I can see my skills improving but one this still makes me come to a screeching halt everytime - a ledge drop in the middle of the trail. I'm not talking about a 4 or 5 foot drop and I'm not talking about 8-10 incher - I'm talking about something that is about 18 in and is usually followed by a slight to moderate downhill. When I roll up to these, I can't commit. I think that these drops look even scarier because I am sitting higher on the bike and the downhill makes it look worse. When I watch others come to these, they simply roll over them.

What is the technique? How big of a drop can you just roll off without jumping? I am assuming that I need to get back behind the seat as a first step. Your advice is greatly appreciated.


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## stalker (Feb 25, 2010)

lower the seat a little mabye? (given that you WILL be going downhill


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

He can explain better than I can. Just do the search, there's a lot of good tips there. below are links to some of related skills hope it helps

http://www.leelikesbikes.com/some-fun-clinics-this-week.html
http://www.leelikesbikes.com/benefits-of-a-high-seat.html
http://www.leelikesbikes.com/rocking-with-the-bma-girls.html


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

Pull up on the bars. A little speed helps.


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

If I am going to roll something (not drop or jump), I usually slow down first, but not so much that balancing becomes difficult. On the edge, it feels like I let the bike tilt forward but I don't tilt with it. Keep my butt towards the rear and my chest low over the bike. Knees and arms bent to absorb any bumps.

Definitely no brakes at the steepest spot.

-----------------------------------
edit:
Maybe I misunderstood: you want to drop it, not roll down it.

- having some speed makes it easier. 
- I like to do a "mini-hop" on the lip to keep the front end from falling. That way I remain centered on the bike all the time, instead of trying to time big movements back and forward.

- If you can do 8 inches, find a spot with 10, 12, 15, 20 inches.


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## S_Trek (May 3, 2010)

Scared you cant stop once you go over? I experienced this back in my early dirt bike days. New GOOD tires made all the difference for me. It gave me the confidence I could stop anywhere


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## Mr Trail (Apr 4, 2010)

Go and watch a New World Disorder clip and realize how limp wristed you are for being scared of an 18inch drop (not having a go at you but it's good to be in an aggressive frame of mind, it's what I did when I riding DH with 15ft gaps)

Don't slow down, speed is your friend. Lift the bars until your back wheel clears the edge you're not jumping just holding the front up a bit , you want both wheels to reconnect with the ground at the same time.

Remember : Commit or eat ****


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## Tom93R1 (Jan 26, 2005)

It took me a long time to get the courage to do those as well, don't know why because it would take quite the effort to actually hurt yourself on something that size. But finally I just dropped a couple without giving myself the option to chicken out (scared me pretty good at the time) and that cured the problem for me.


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## harm (Mar 6, 2010)

I worked on something similar to these for a few hours yesterday until I felt really good and smooth, and confortable. Speed is definatly your friemd, you dont want to slow down too much. It took a while for me to not chicken out and commit to just doing it, once I did though I had no problems after that. Its just gettting over that initial fear.
This video helped me over combing this, hope it helps you also...


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## zebrahum (Jun 29, 2005)

You need to start by getting comfortable by riding off of smaller drops first. So slam your seat as low as it goes and give this a try.

Go find a retaining wall or ramp where you can start at a curb sized drop and move up to a couple feet tall. You can find things like landscaping in a park or a loading dock wall or something like that. If you want you can make little marks every few inches of elevation so you can take a run off each size at a time. Make sure you have a good run up and keep your speed going NO BRAKES. It should be at least a jogging speed.

Don't look at the edge of the drop, you should be looking out where you want to land or even better a bit farther out than that. That's the one tip that helped me get better at dirt jumps, don't look at the lip. Same thing here, don't look at the edge, look where you're going.

So start working your way up the wall, higher every time you think you have one height nailed. Keep stepping until you've reached the max, then go find something higher. Eventually you'll be comfortable enough to do dumb crap like riding off loading docks (not that I know anything about that...).


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## futurerocker1 (Sep 16, 2009)

yup lower seat, try to lean back a little as if you were going off a curb. bend your knees to absorb some of the hit.. try and get your rear wheel to hit first when your coming down


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## JCullen (Oct 20, 2009)

Berkley said:


> Pull up on the bars. A little speed helps.


:thumbsup:

The first time I hit a drop of 2ish feet, I was riding my brakes and had NO momentum. When the front hit, the fork bottomed out and OTB I went!

Like others said, work up to it, focus on the landing point, get over the rear wheel and don't psych yourself out!


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## OSOK (Jul 11, 2009)

how much of this kind of abuse can an entry level hardtail trek take u guys think?


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## zebrahum (Jun 29, 2005)

Quick answer: some
Long answer: If you're doing it right, you shouldn't be abusing anything. Land soft, you shouldn't be doing big drops to flat because that sucks, and as long as your equipment is tight and in shape, a little bit of air time won't do damage.


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## Yody (Jan 21, 2008)

You need to learn how to "manual" do some searches on youtube and here on how to manual. Basically you're putting your weight back and effectively holding up your front tire so it doesn't drop as soon as it goes off the edge, you want to hold it up so you can launch off the rear tire and land on both wheels evenly. 

You can practice this rolling off curbs, don't let your front wheel hit first.


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## CHUM (Aug 30, 2004)

like this:








(my friend jdubs12 on porcupine rim)

get your butt off and back...easy peasy....

edit: this is the way you 'roll' off a ledge.....like the OP asked....not 'manual' or to air it...


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## insanitylevel9 (Sep 23, 2009)

another thing i cant explain... when i do a drop i kinda just do it, if i think about it to long thats when i mess up.


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## DrBrewhaha (Nov 4, 2009)

Great tips here everyone. Thanks for your help. I'll find some progressively increasing drops and practice getting behind the seat and getting low. After mastering rolling off of these kinds of drops I'll tacking a wheelie drop (is that the same thing as the "manual"?)

BTW, the previous picture really helps demonstrate the technique I think. That drop looks closer to 24 in. What's the biggest drop it is safe to roll off without going OTB?


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## CHUM (Aug 30, 2004)

DrBrewhaha said:


> ....BTW, the previous picture really helps demonstrate the technique I think. That drop looks closer to 24 in. What's the biggest drop it is safe to roll off without going OTB?


depends on wheel size (26 or 29)....and amount of front travel basically....

you've got the right idea in building up....and I think others suggested don't overthink (that's why I rarely study 'techy' features on a trail)....

now...when you figure out how to roll the 'notch' on porcupine rim, please let us mere mortals know exactly 'how' to accomplish that without actually dying.....or crapping our pants....





[grabbed from youtube]

edit: to help you with your technique it really helps to actually 'push' the bike over the ledge (while your body stays in 'place'...kinda) - this will will force you lower...and your butt over your rear wheel....


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## shenny88 (Sep 24, 2009)

-unweight the front (transfer weight over the rear)
-smoothly lift up the front, dont just yank it
-guide(push) the bike forward
**focus everything on landing the bike level/parallel to the ground!**
-absorb with your knees as necessary


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## apat13 (Jun 19, 2006)

CHUM said:


> like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This. Get your butt waaaay behind the saddle (so your stomach is almost pressed against the seat) and let the front wheel roll over. Don't touch the brakes! As your rear wheel follows and lands shift your weight back to the neutral position. When you have both wheels back on the ground start pedaling again.

It can be very intimidating on approach but you need to trust your bike help it do its job by correctly positioning your mass.


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## mimi1885 (Aug 12, 2006)

This should help too

http://www.socaltrailriders.org/for...bike-beginners-intermediate-skills-links.html


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## savagemann (Jan 14, 2008)

I try to envision throwing the bike forward, while my body stays put. This gets you pretty far behind the seat and puts you in an attack position to absorb impact.
It's pretty much how you start a manual. Push the bike forward and the front wheel starts to come up.........but doing drops, I'm not looking for the wheel to come up as much as I am trying to keep it from dropping straight down.


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

DrBrewhaha said:


> After mastering rolling off of these kinds of drops I'll tacking a wheelie drop (is that the same thing as the "manual"?)...
> 
> What's the biggest drop it is safe to roll off without going OTB?


- Rolling down a step is sometimes the hardest way. I usually do it if I cannot get any speed before the lip or the landing does not allow any speed. By hardest, I mean that OTB is often a real possibility. If you have a clear landing, dropping it is usually safer.

- Wheelie drop is when you approach slowly, and then pedal to keep the front up.

- What most are talking about, is a "normal" drop where you can approach with a little speed and either shift your weight or do a small hop to keep the front end of the bike from diving. The weight shift can be large enough to cause a manual: lifting the front wheel without pedaling.

-----
Size is not everything... Drops, steps, ledges, etc. come in various shapes. Frequently, the place where you land, or where the steep spots levels out, is much more important to the outcome than the height.


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## tony450x (Oct 23, 2009)

Practice, go outside and roll off the curb a bunch of times you will notice you land with the front wheel first. Then just move your weight back over the seat and pick up a little bit more pace now ride off the curb. You should start to land with both wheels or with the back wheel landing momuntarily sooner. This may sound stupid but it is actually easier to jump and land if you are going fast. the slower your goin the more effort it takes to get the bike in the right position its almost like you have to heave on the bars but as you get faster you only need to be behind the seat and give the bars a little tug


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## perttime (Aug 26, 2005)

If the drop is followed by a piece of downhill, you don't really want to exaggerate lifting the front of the bike. When you land, it is best to have the bike roughly aligned with the landing.... You don't want to fall on your back either 

edit:
here's a couple of articles:
" ... Every time I go out on the trail and there's a drop or step of about a foot, I just freeze and don't really know how to go about tackling it...."
http://www.bikeradar.com/fitness/article/skills-qa-how-to-flow-over-drops-25040

"... There's never anything that tells you how to roll a steep drop..."
http://www.bikeradar.com/fitness/technique/article/technique-first-time-freeriders-part-one-21936


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## bclagge (Aug 31, 2009)

OSOK said:


> how much of this kind of abuse can an entry level hardtail trek take u guys think?


I've been riding a Trek 4300 and it's taken some substantial hits over the last year without a problem. It amazes me how solid it is. But in the end, the frame is guaranteed for life, so if you crack it you can get it replaced with this years model - win/win.


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## DrBrewhaha (Nov 4, 2009)

perttime said:


> If the drop is followed by a piece of downhill, you don't really want to exaggerate lifting the front of the bike. When you land, it is best to have the bike roughly aligned with the landing.... You don't want to fall on your back either
> 
> edit:
> here's a couple of articles:
> ...


Great links. Thanks for digging them up and posting them.


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## hazdxb (Oct 11, 2008)

I've had the fear of going off ledges as well and what i've realized is that I often look right where im going to land and that makes your drop look HUGE a good idea is to just check out the landing to see kind of where you're guna land and then to look ahead, it helps SOOOO MUCH it makes the drop look a lot smaller and remember speed is ALWAYS your friend!


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## Shmack (Aug 16, 2006)

I got better at drops by putting flats on my bike and manualing of curbs with my kids! Even though a curb is only 6" or so, it helped me to work on my timing enough that I can roll off of higher drops at low speeds with no real issues. Add some speed and enjoy!


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