# All Monster Cross sized tires the market?



## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

So, there's a "true 29 inch offroad tire thread" going. How about another list for those tires worth it on commuters and monster cross bikes, and perhaps muddy XC conditions?

Let's say :
>35mm as that's the maximum for mainstream CX racing under UCI rules, and <47mm as above it, we're dealing with true MTB tires or city fatties?

As it's discussed less often, why not this time include specifics?
I'll take the liberty to borrow some valueble input GlowBoy posted on this topic before.


*Kenda Khan 700x50.* No longer available, but you might be able to find one used. Very round profile with short side knobs. Very fast rolling, though not fast accelerating due to its 800g weight. Big enough to provide a noticeably more comfortable ride than smaller tires at 60-70 psi on the road. Very durable. Iffy offroad performance (tends to wander in mud or loose gravel), but will get you through a lot more trails than a true slick will.
*Schwalbe Black Jack 1.9.* Has a raised center ridge for nearly the same rolling resistance as an ordinary semislick, but amazingly good grip offroad: by that I mean nearly as good as most full knobbies in most conditions from mud to dry sand. Amazingly horrible on wet pavement, but that's the only condition where I wouldn't heartily recommend it. 650g, $18 direct from Schwalbe North America.
*IRC Mythos Slick 700x42.* Rolls a little slower and buzzier than some, but much faster than full knobbies. Probably the best choice for mixed pavement/gravel/dirt unless you want that extra 1mph on pavement and don't mind sliding around a bit on more challenging trails. 500g-ish makes for a pretty good volume-to-weight ratio without sacrificing durability. Cheap and easy to find thanks to being OEM on the Fisher Dual Sports.
*Michelin TransWorld Sprint 700x40.* Bigger than some 700x42s, with half decent offroad performance in a variety of conditions. Cheap ($18) and heavy (650g), just like the Schwalbe, but slower rolling due to the puncture resistant casing.
*Maxxis WormDrive 700x42.* Ties with the Khan as the fastest-rolling bigger-than-cyclocross tire available, but at a faster-accelerating 450g weight. Not very capable offroad (marginally worse than the Khan) but it will get you through a trails that aren't too steep, technical or muddy.
*Kenda Kross Plus K847* and in the hard-to-find 700x42 size it looks nearly identical to the WormDrive. Nearly the same rolling resistance, but a heavier casing for more durability (and heavier 600+g weight). The biggest plus is that despite the nearly identical tread pattern it's noticeably better offroad. One of my favorite tires in this category, and super cheap at $10-15 typically..

And some tires I _haven't_ tried that may be worth considering:

*Specialized Borough.* Biggest semislick available. Classic semislick profile: minimal center tread with tall side knobs, so it should be fast rolling on pavement and grippier offroad especially with reduced pressure. Don't have firsthand experience with its performance, but based on size alone I'm considering buying one.
*Bonty XR 1.8*. One of the faster rolling full knobbies out there, but the others I've lised are not full knobbies and I'd would be willing to bet the XR is marginally the slowest of this bunch on the road. Good choice if you change your mind and decide to sacrifice a little speed for better offroad grip. In that event I'd still try the Black Jack first though.
*WTB Mutanoraptor 700x45.* Big knobs, 550g weight, reportedly pretty lousy in wet conditions so that's why I haven't even bothered. Have heard mixed reviews on the rolling resistance, but more positive than negative. Cheap ($20-ish).
*Ritchey ZED 700x42.* Those who have tried them rave about them for both grip and rolling resistance. Probably more RR than the typical semislick, but sounds like a whole lot more grip.

(Cloxxki again)
I'll name some other tires that come to mind that seem to deserve a place here.

Bontrager XR 1.8 front+rear
Bontrager Dry X 1.75 
Continental Twister 37 and 42mm
Schwalbe Black Shark 1.85 (rare, small production run, useless touring tire?)
Schwalbe Black Jack 1.6
Schwalbe Fast Fred 40mm (I found it to be surprisingly slow on-road, but could be me)
Schwlabe Hurricane 40/42mm
Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 37 and 42mm (50mm exist)
Schwalbe Marathon XR 40mm (50mm exists)
Schwalbe Smart Sam 37 and 42mm


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## Schmucker (Aug 23, 2007)

Firecross 700x45 is the only tire I can think of that you didn't list.


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## jmoote (Aug 31, 2007)

Perfect topic as I've got at least a couple events a year that require a monstercross type tire (not to mention random touring about). I'm seriously looking into the Borough XC on a recommendation that they are quite fast rolling and versatile. I have no first hand experience with any of these tires yet, but hope to try a few over the next year.

The new Hutchinson CX tires are listed as 34c but are over the UCI 35c measure - they are reported to be quite large, so they may be relevant to this thread. Actual size shown here.

I'd also like to hear of successful tubeless conversions with tires of this class. I had some luck converting my Michelin Mud2s (actually the tires were no problem really) so I'd expect other Michelins to work ok.


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

Excellent info folks, thanks!

I tried to convert the Michelin Mud 1, and was treated a shut gun type blow-off when inflating it. Shortly rode an IRC red wall cross tires around the block with some tubeless trick I tried, and that's about it. It seems getting a tire to work tubeless is harder for narrow tires. Road tubeless has also taken many years, and still doesn't seem to be a real solution.
With Stan's rims improving of the past years and even Mavic offering UST wheels, it may be worth to try it again. 
When I converted the Ritchey Z-Max 26x1.7 I ran as a front, it seemed to be more like a 2.0" to ride, in a good way.

The Hutch is interesting. For non-slush CX races I want the largest tires I can legally get. There was at one point talk of tires that were 34mm wide, but extra tall.

For those few XC races a year with wet or clayey mud, I'd love to have a tire that measures at least 45mm and works as well as a Maxxis Minotaur or a Continental Twister. No desperate grip required, but consistent mud shedding, less mud thrown up on the bike and controllable grip paired with low mud resistance, would be nice.


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## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

I'd also add the Kenda Kwick Roller EZ-Ride to the list. Available in 700x35, 38 and 45. I have the 45. Extremely fast on pavement, lightweight for its size and has a thick enough center tread to be pretty puncture resistant (without an energy-robbing puncture belt). Downside is limited offroad grip: more of a commuter tire but still OK in moderate gravel.


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## jimmythefly (Sep 10, 2005)

I did a 9 mile stage of a multi-discipline race on Bontrager's Jones Dry-X 29x1.75. (also labeled as 700x44/42). They barely fit on the Novara Randonee touring frame I used. Pictures of the bike here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimmythefly/

Very fast on the doubletrack, very fast on the pavement.


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## Davidcopperfield (Jan 17, 2007)

Which one of those are foldable?


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

Davidcopperfield said:


> Which one of those are foldable?


I suggest that for once in your life, you do the research for your own questions yourself (Google is even your friend) and then post the results in a nice table on this thread, to be helpful in return for what ohers have been learning you about bikes the past years on MTBR. At least go kill someone else's thread.
Oh, and then post on another thread the exact reasons why you feel that is such a key buying argument, folding or not, that you need it presented to you in a list of info you certainly would not do the effort for to type down.
Add useful tire listings or beat it, please.

End of DC discussion here, please talk Monstercross tires here. Omitted listings, useful riding experiences, availability, unexpected specification?


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## jmoote (Aug 31, 2007)

Of course they are larger than the 47mm we've decided on for the upper limit, but I'd like to bring Stan's Crows into this discussion. Can any of you who have tried them compare them to other MX tires listed above? I'd imagine that at the low pressures they are suited for, the grip and RR would be good on smoother surfaces (gravel, hardpack, dirt and paved road) but I don't know first hand.

I've priced out the Specialized Borough XC Pro and they are around the same price as Crows (I was hoping for a value priced tire) so I figure I might as well consider Crows instead. The main difference is lower shoulder knobs and a less slick design in the centre.


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

jmoote said:


> Of course they are larger than the 47mm we've decided on for the upper limit, but I'd like to bring Stan's Crows into this discussion. Can any of you who have tried them compare them to other MX tires listed above? I'd imagine that at the low pressures they are suited for, the grip and RR would be good on smoother surfaces (gravel, hardpack, dirt and paved road) but I don't know first hand.
> 
> I've priced out the Specialized Borough XC Pro and they are around the same price as Crows (I was hoping for a value priced tire) so I figure I might as well consider Crows instead. The main difference is lower shoulder knobs and a less slick design in the centre.


Based on limited experience with them on that surface, I would scratch gravel off that list.

I've also not had the heart to test them for more than a few miles on pavement, seems like a waste of the fine, high-end tires.
On lame, firm, dry XC courses, there's no competition for the Crow, especially as a rear. But which non-29" bike will they fit?


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## dajoseph (Dec 24, 2007)

*Tires I own: Ritchey ZED, Dry X, Jones XR, Crow*

Here are comments on the tires that I own.

Ritchey XED: Great. These are fast tires with amazing grip for their size. I ride the tire mainly as a rear tire with a little larger tire up front. They are very fast on gravel roads and hard pack. For a lightweight rider they will get you through many more roots and rocks than you would expect. I have 2 of these tires and I am always looking for them on-line - its really too bad they are no longer made. I judge all "monster cross tires" relative to these.

Dry X. This tire is okay, but I have two big gripes. It is heavy (compared to the ZED), and it is very hard to get on/off my Stans 355 rims. The later killed this tire for me. It literally took me an hour to get the tire off and I scratched up my rim. Getting it on was not much easier. I've got 2 of these tires and both are hard to get on/off. For distance races I want a tire that I can remove to insert a tube if necessary. For those of you with Bonti rims - this tire went on/off my Race X-lite rim without difficulty - so it may be the tire for you.

Jones XR. I have both the front and rear version of this tire (I also have the wider front tire). I like these tires alot. Easy on/off, good grip and pretty fast. I think this tire is a little bigger and tougher than the ZED and almost as fast. I've paired the XR front with the ZED rear. The XR has one property that I don't like. It has little tiny grooves that pick up sand on gravel roads. Its not that the tire holds the sand - it just picks it up an throws it - this is particularly true when its a little damp. This slows the tire down - over the course of an hour's ride you are literally throwing buckets of sand a few grains at a time - since this is being done out on the surface of the tire, it really does slow its rotation; or make you work harder. The ZED does not have these grooves and doesn't throw sand this way.

Crow. Great tire, but Its not in the monster cross category. I like the tire a lot for riding in the woods, but it is not good on dried out fire roads or gravel roads. It lacks the bite and so a lot of energy is lost when there is a loose layer of sand/gravel over hard pack. This tire really likes to be run at low pressure and that means it will always have more rolling resistance when the trail "opens up."

Hope this helps.


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## dajoseph (Dec 24, 2007)

*Another tire to try - Ritchey Speedmax Comp 700 x 40*

Another monster cross tire to consider is the Ritchey Speedmax Comp, which comes in a 40mm. Its supposed to be light - sub500 gram. Has anyone tried these?


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## cartographer (Jun 20, 2006)

dajoseph said:


> Another monster cross tire to consider is the Ritchey Speedmax Comp, which comes in a 40mm. Its supposed to be light - sub500 gram. Has anyone tried these?


This one?









I've only used it on pavement and dry trail, but it rolls really well and has held up to quite a bit of rounded rocks. I have to keep the pressure up pretty high where I've been riding it, though; I suppose there is a reason they call it 'Rocky Flats'. I've ridden the various Marshall Mesa trails and Walker Ranch, if you're familiar with the Front Range trails near Boulder, CO.

I'm pretty timid cornering generally, and so can't really comment meaningfully on just how grippy the edge knobs are. I can say that rolling up onto them on pavement is noticeable.

They have been worn well, in my opinion.


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## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

Dajoseph, good call on adding the Speedmax 700x40. That size was just added last year, I think. I've found the SpeedMax to be a fast roller on dirt (though slower than a slick on pavement) and has on-road traction. Not as good as the Mythos CX though, but slightly faster (at least in the 700x32 size that I have). Better weight for its size than the Mythos too. Remember Ritcheys run big compared to other brands, so sub-500g is excellent.

Didn't realize the ZED was gone. Too bad, since I've heard good things, but fortunately we have a lot of good tires now.


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## mvi (Jan 15, 2004)

With a set of sharp clippers you can create a custom tire by taking for instance an (on sale) Kenda Claw. Get rid most of the knobbies , and have a high volume (~47 mm) relatively light and good quality tire.
I also clipped a conti twister 37 mm cross tire for better road use.


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## ShockStar (Mar 6, 2004)

specialized crossroads 38c...not a typical monster cross tire as its fairly pavement friendly but its a little more aggressive than the borough.


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## Guitar Ted (Jan 14, 2004)

*Schwalbe*

Trans Iowa info here: Many of the competitors in the front of this 300 plus mile gravel event run cross bikes with wider rubber. I have noticed that the various models of Schwalbe Marathon tires listed by Cloxxki are amongst the most popular choices.

It seems that the Schwalbes are quite good at resisting punctures and are fast rollers on gravel roads. At least, that is what I have observed watching racers in this event.

For what it's worth......


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## jmoote (Aug 31, 2007)

A couple more semi-slicks from Continental to add to the list: the Country Ride and Tour Ride both come as large as 47c and look somewhat promising, if not a bit heavy.


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## AlanAB (Sep 1, 2008)

*29er tires with Kevlar belt and knobs*

Hi,

I noted the discussion on useful 700x42 tires. I do a combination of road and trail riding but not technical. Recently switched to Kevlar belted tires (Bontrager Satellite 700x38) as I was tired of fixing flats almost every other week. Formerly I had Mythos semi-slick 700x42 which I enjoyed using except for the flats. The Bontragers slip a little too much in mud/sand and they are a little too narrow for my taste (not to mention slow rolling). Can anyone recommend a 700x42 Kevlar belted tire with side knobs? Thanks.

AlanAB


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## Simonster (Jun 21, 2006)

I weighed a Specialized BOROUGH XC PRO TIRE at 410 grams. The lightest 700x45 I have seen. 

WTB also has a 700x38 Interwolf which they just recently came out in a kevlar bead version. I weighed those at 400 grams a piece. They have the same "DNA" casing as the Nanoraptor. I mounted them up tubeless on my 29er tubeless wheels and they work great. They hold air tubeless just about as well as any of the other WTB tires. The casing seems pretty tough.


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## jtill (Aug 6, 2007)

Not sure if they're still being produced this year, but WTB had a 700x42 version of their Allterrainasaurus for a while. That's what I had on my bike in MX mode and I've got a pair in the closet waiting for that bike to rebuilt in a more permanent MX form.


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## ink1373 (Nov 16, 2005)

Panaracer Smoke was available in a 700x45 size for a while. As far as I know, the only tan-sidewall "monster cross" tire out there.

Possible exception being the Bruce Gordon Rock N Road tires, but nobody seems to have actually laid eyes on a pair of those.


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

There were all-tan diamond tread tires on Bigwheel's bike some years ago, I seem to remember now. Something from the North? I dunno anymore.


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## dolk (Nov 25, 2008)

*Firecross*
Excelent grip, very slow on hard. I love it as front tire in soft.









*Schwalbe Marathon racer 40mm* 
Very fast and pretty light slick. Big volume. Excellent commuter tire.









*Schwalbe Smart Sam 42*
Allround, fast on hard with good sidegrip. Not so big casing volume.









*Nokian W106 47mm studs removed*
Extremly high and square profile. Gives max volume in narrow frames. Very heavy and very tough. Allows for low pressures without flats and dented rims. Rolls fast. A rear tire that works for everything. I love it.


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## bubba888 (Mar 25, 2006)

folding Marathon XR in 35 is well oversize compared with a 37mm Conti Top Contact [or the conti is undersized], heavier/beafier than a cx tire and deals well with dry dirt conditions and general urban pothole stuff


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## Tinshield (Aug 1, 2007)

*Conti*

I am getting some Mountain Kings on my new King Kahuna. I have them on my Yeti and they are awesome. I will report in after I ride them on the 29er.:thumbsup:


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## peanutbutter (Feb 18, 2005)

i used to love the wtb mutanoraptor, but sadly, they dont offer it in 700c anymore!! i thought it rode pretty well both on and off road, though i dont have lots of tire experience on the road, and like a previous poster, dont corner too hard. i have pushed tires beyond cornering ability though, and never slipped on these, so if you can get some, do ( or send them to me!!  )


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

peanutbutter said:


> i used to love the wtb mutanoraptor, but sadly, they dont offer it in 700c anymore!! i thought it rode pretty well both on and off road, though i dont have lots of tire experience on the road, and like a previous poster, dont corner too hard. i have pushed tires beyond cornering ability though, and never slipped on these, so if you can get some, do ( or send them to me!!  )


Funny how experiences differ. I could not find a psi that got me both decent compliance and grip, AND limited rim hits. I found them low-grip and harsh most of the times. Fast in a straight line, all the time. My trails are tame, meaning I may pull more G's in corners which they might not like as much. 
Similar looking to a Nano, but due to the size, not half the tire that one is. Weight's not worth it in any way either. I'm a scrootch, but gave these away, even paid postage to get them out of my sight


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## bubba888 (Mar 25, 2006)

*marathon xr 35*

35 marathon xr on mavic t520, rolls road fast at 75-85 (old silca reading, it shows 40 when modern pumps show 29), does wonders at sub-50, overbuilt (durable) compared with much smaller "real" cx tires. it's bigger than an old green michelin mud, heavier and more puncture/pinch resistant.


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## dblspeed (Jan 31, 2006)

Hi all, I'm looking for monster cross tires for my new tricross single speed, I've narrowed it down to the Schwalbe Marathon xr 40c (42mm wide) and the Smart Sam 35c (37mm wide). 

From what I gather the first would be more monsterish, tougher and I suppose better suited for ghetto tubeless; the latter would be smaller, not as though, but half the weight and the price, probably faster rolling too. A third choice would be the smart sam 1.75(47c) front and 35c rear. 

The riding will be a 50/50 mix of pavement and trails with some tough sections, no gravel roads. Any advice?


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## ozbikebuddy (Mar 3, 2004)

*The Ritchey Zed's*

I have a pair of the Ritchey Zed's, there are a nice option, good bite on hardpack, I ran then pretty hard (I'm 120kg) and they performed really well on flat singletrack.

However this tentative clydesdale probably cant push these tyre to their limit, to really give a comprehensive review. But I can say I like them and will use them again.


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## sfuller (Jan 14, 2007)

I tried the Panaracer Firecross on my Surly LHT. In the conditions that I was riding in (damp to wet, sandy gravel roads) I found them to be slow. I'd love to see a Nanoraptor in a 2.0 or 1.9. I'd throw those on my LHT for gravel road rides in a heartbeat.


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## jmoote (Aug 31, 2007)

I just got a set of Conti Travel Contact 42c. They're a heavy wire bead semi-slick that I got for a gravel grinder type race in the spring.

The 42c size measures around 37-38c, so I'm glad I chose the bigger ones. I didn't weigh them, but I know they're heavy. Conti gives you a tube with each and guarantees no flats for 1 year (pretty funny, but it _is_ a touring tire...).

No ride report yet, but I will post once I've tried them. They look good so far.


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## dblspeed (Jan 31, 2006)

I went for the smart sam 47-40 (1.75-1.60) combo, will report back in a few weeks


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## David K in Indy (Feb 4, 2006)

*Ritchey Zed 42MM*

I have used Ritchey Zeds (42mm) on my cross bike for about a year. They roll very well on the road and are great for gravel, dirt, etc. I have actually made them a bit slower by using super thick Michelin tubes (they grey/blue tubes) - no flats in two years of riding with these thick tubes. They barely fit into my Redline frame. David K


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## dblspeed (Jan 31, 2006)

dblspeed said:


> I went for the smart sam 47-40 (1.75-1.60) combo, will report back in a few weeks


Pardon me for quoting myself, but I must report back that I really dig the Schwalbe Smart Sam combo on my Tricross single speed. 
They roll really well on pavement and hard pack, the compound seems durable, and they perform more than well at the local cx track, including muddy and rocky sections, they don't make me miss my mtb too much in corners. My only gripe is with the rear 1.6 tire, I'd rather have a bigger one, but that's how big the the Specialized Tricross Single chainstays will allow.

In short if you're looking for all around tires for your monster cross the Smart Sam is an excellent choice.


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## CLONG (Nov 2, 2006)

I thought I'd post this info found on the Schwalbe page. Two new touring tires including a Marathon Extreme in 40c.

http://www.schwalbetires.com/marathon_extreme_home


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

Quick acceleration of lighter touring tires. Uhuh...

Nice technology though.


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## madcap (May 26, 2007)

Don't know if it's been mentioned in here but CST makes a 700x42 called the Servant, a city tread with some side knobs...









Steel bead with some puncture protection, not a very light option. Looks like it would be a great commuter tire if bike paths, dirt trails, and other light offroad excursions were involved.

I'll be running some Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 700x40 on a upcoming city monster build of mine. Those Marathon Extreme tires look very nice, hmmm may have to go with those.


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## CLONG (Nov 2, 2006)

Continental has a (new?) series of tires that look tailor-made for the MX crew. Available in 35c and 42c, there's a knobby tire and a semi-slick. Looks like they would be fun to mix and match. There's the Cyclocross and the Cyclocross-Speed.

Note to Continental: calling a tire the 'Cyclocross,' does not make it easy to search...

http://www.conti-online.com/generat...s/crossquerfeldein/clinchercyclocross_en.html

I've already checked the CDN distributor and these tires aren't available in the frozen North for this year. Funny. I heard Continental changed distributors 'cuz they wanted to make their whole line-up available in Canada. Oh well, maybe next year.

Oh, also both tires are listed with a Reflex sidewall, but it doesn't show in the pics.

C.


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

dblspeed said:


> Pardon me for quoting myself, but I must report back that I really dig the Schwalbe Smart Sam combo on my Tricross single speed.
> They roll really well on pavement and hard pack, the compound seems durable, and they perform more than well at the local cx track, including muddy and rocky sections, they don't make me miss my mtb too much in corners. My only gripe is with the rear 1.6 tire, I'd rather have a bigger one, but that's how big the the Specialized Tricross Single chainstays will allow.
> 
> In short if you're looking for all around tires for your monster cross the Smart Sam is an excellent choice.


Oh wow, I think I missed these things to exist!
Could you please measure width of each tire for us, on the casing especially?
Smart Sam is a really effective mud mud, at least in the 26" sizes, even the 2.25.
I lost a race once, super muddy. me sole 29" rider, Karma 1.9's. The guy on the 26" Smart Sams was rolling really well, and not having the dificulty to track straight and have traction.
For muddy XC races, that 47mm might be quite a secret weapon. Claimed weight 610g?
In some countries, like mine, already there is a minimum tire width of 40 or 45mm, designed to keep out pure cyclo-cross bikes/wheels. Getting close to that can be worthwhile on truly messy cyclo-cross style trails.


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## madcap (May 26, 2007)

I got some of the new Marathon Extremes and I must say it does look like somebody came up with the "do it all" tire. They look great for trails, roads, commuting, whatever. Here's a pic of a 700x40 Marathon Supreme next to the 700x40 Marathon Extreme. The tread area on the Extreme is bigger and measured bead to bead while folded the Extreme is also bigger there as well. The Extreme is only about 20g heavier than the Supreme.










I think I found the perfect tire for my city monstercross frame that will be done in a few months.


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## dbo43867 (Aug 27, 2007)

I'll add the Bontrager Dry X/XDX 1.75 and XR 1.8


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## RacerX.29 (May 14, 2007)

I like and use the Kenda Small Block 8 - I've only used the 29x2.1 version but according to their website, they make both a 700x32 and 700x35. The 29er version is one of the lighter tires available, accelerates quickly and you can pump the pressure to 80psi which makes it a fast rolling tire. The 700 versions are both lighter (<350g) and per specs can go as high as 85 psi. Given they've got the same tread design, I'd think they be good on pavement and light off-road/hardpack.


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## sean salach (Sep 15, 2007)

i've got a conti vapor that has to be right around the fat end of the monstercross spectrum. it's definitely narrower than 2.0". good mud tire.


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## CLONG (Nov 2, 2006)

Bontrager's got the LT3 700C in 38c. Looks like a nice dirt road blaster. Photo's of the 26" tire, but it looks like a nice tread.

http://bontrager.com/model/08316


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## Holmes (Jun 23, 2008)

Thumbs up for the Kenda Kross Plus K847 (700x42c). I have these on my Surly LHT and they are great tires for the $$. Perfect for fire roads and moderate jeep trails, that sort of thing.


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## scu98rkr (Mar 21, 2006)

Hi I have a specialized borough XC's on one of my bikes.

I more of a MTBiker so not really sure on road size but I measured the borough XC's and they are definetely not 45mm wide, more like 37mm if I remember rightly.

I really want to get some thick tyres are the conintenal tyres really 42mm wide.


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## intheways (Apr 19, 2004)

I've been scouring the web for a few weeks trying to find some MX tires. To this point, I have used Schwalbe Marathon Extremes, but found them too heavy. More recently, I've been using some Fyxation Sessions. They are marketed as 28c tires for fixies, but the seem to do really well on the street and okay on the trails. They are narrow at a measures 29cm width. I'm interested in trying some Conti TopContacts, but they are really expensive. Nokian has some cool looking tires, but no one stocks them in N America (http://www.suomityres.com/tour.html). I especially like the Rollspeed Ws.

I'm also building up some whees with Stans Rims and hope to go tubeless.


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

29mm, I hope? ;-) Not really monstercross as it is monster-road, I suppose?

Getting a <40mm tire to work tubeless though, you've got yourself a project there!
Hint: you want high pressure in a narrow tire, but tubeless doesn't want that. Stans rims will help, but do take care. Last time I tried to make a 30mm tire tubeless, a sincere efort, my hand was nearly broken by a 55psi bang while clamping the tires with said hand.


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## intheways (Apr 19, 2004)

Cloxxki said:


> 29mm, I hope? ;-) Not really monstercross as it is monster-road, I suppose?
> 
> Getting a <40mm tire to work tubeless though, you've got yourself a project there!
> Hint: you want high pressure in a narrow tire, but tubeless doesn't want that. Stans rims will help, but do take care. Last time I tried to make a 30mm tire tubeless, a sincere efort, my hand was nearly broken by a 55psi bang while clamping the tires with said hand.


I'm already thinking bigger! That would be a pretty wide tire!

Sounds like I may have an interesting project. I'm planning on using something in the 35mm region. Hopefully, I don't break any bones.


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## kide (Mar 25, 2008)

intheways said:


> Nokian has some cool looking tires, but no one stocks them in N America (http://www.suomityres.com/tour.html). I especially like the Rollspeed Ws.


I agree the Rollspeed W thread looks good and versatile. But that tire really is designed to be super tough in order to resist this sharp crushed stone debris they use to cover icy roads. It is hard and heavy but one of the few non-studded tires that doesn't flat every ride. I haven't tried it personally but have heard it is pretty much like a Schwalbe Marathon Plus with some thread.


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## 65Matt (Feb 6, 2004)

Here is some more info I found from Glowboy in this thread. 
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=192307
Some of this info will be duplicate, but he does list alot of weights, which is useful.

"Here are the non-slick tires I know of in this size range. I'm including Euro-"trekking" tires if they have some actual usable tread to them. Comments added for the ones I've actually ridden:

* Avocet Cross II SL 700x38, 445g.
* Bontrager Jones XR 1.8, 550g.
* Club Roost Terra 700x38, 500g.
* Conti CountryRide 700x37, 605g.
* Hutchinson Acrobat 700x37/700x42, 660g/810g.
* IRC Cross Country 700x38, 495g.
* IRC Metrocross Duro 700x38, 502g.
* IRC Mythos CX Slick 700x38/40/42, 495/510/550g. The 700x42 is ubiquitous and stocked on the GF Dual Sport bikes, last I checked. A bit buzzy and slightly slower rolling than some of the other semislicks, it's still an excellent all-rounder. Not to be confused with a full knobby of course, it still seemed to work decently everywhere I've tried it offroad. A bit sketchy on wet pavement for you commuters.
* Kenda Kross Plus K847 700x38/42, 630g/650g. Not to be konfused with the Kenda Cross or the Kenda Kross Supreme. Believe it or not, this tire (for which I paid $6.50 at Nashbar) is my favorite tire in this class if you want something that is still fast on pavement. Rolls ultra-fast and has decent grip everywhere from gravel to wet pavement and even mud. Worth the weight.
* Maxxis WormDrive CX 700x42, 445g. I have two of these. Looks a lot like the K847, so you'd think it would perform similarly. It rolls just as fast (and is much lighter) but has much less grip offroad. Oddly, better in snow and ice than in mud.
* Michelin TransWorld Sprint 700x40, 640g. Bigger than the K847 or the WormDrive, this sucker grips well offroad, including mud, snow and ice. Not great if you plan to include a lot of road work: sketchy on wet pavement, and rolls slower than you'd think given the low diamond center tread. I'm starting to think that Kevlar puncture belts incur a pretty huge cost in terms of rolling resistance. Seems like thick center treads (like on the K847 or the Karma) give just about as much protection against glass punctures, with about the same weight penalty and much less rolling resistance.
* Panaracer FireCross 700x45, 690g.
* Panaracer Smoke 700x45, 550g, out of production. The classic monster-'cross tire. More like 700x42. Oodles of grip. Oodles of rolling resistance.
* Ritchey Mount Cross 700x38, Pro/WCS 425g/370g. Round carcass and lots of closely spaced flat-topped knobs. Light, smooth, fast and easy-cornering on pavement. Good offroad too, rocks, gravel or even slimy mud. Haven't ridden it in sticky mud, but I bet it would pack up like crazy.
* Ritchey ZED Race 700x42, 520g. So many rave reviews, I really need to get around to trying this one.
* Schwalbe Black Jack 700x45, 650g. Raised smooth center tread gives you low rolling resistance, yet still gave me amazing MTB-level traction everywhere I've tried it, from the dry sandy trails of central Oregon to the mudbogs of Western Oregon. Commuters be warned about the worst wet-pavement traction of any tire I've ever ridden, as bad as the old Conti Goliath. Probably scary on wet rocks too.
* Schwalbe Marathon Cross 700x38, 630g.
* Schwalbe Marathon XR 700x40, 680g.
* Schwalbe Hurricane/Hurricane Sport 700x40, 740/630g.
* WTB Interwolf 700x38, 450g.
* Tioga Bloodhound 700x38, 473g.
* WTB Mutanoraptor Comp 700x45, 550g(?).

Edit: I suppose 35mm tires might qualify too, especially the Kenda Kross Supreme bogblasters. Too many of those for me to list here though."

Here's another very helpful post by Glowboy:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?p=4896832

"Stewie, I've commuted on both the Kross Plus K847 and the WormDrive in the 700x42 size, and done a bit of mud riding with both as well.

The two tires appear very similar, with a smooth or smooth-ish center section and substantial side knobs. But there are differences. Performance notes:
- Weight. Kenda is about 630g, Maxxis is 450g. Maxxis will feel snappier in acceleration as a result. Also, the Maxxis is a folding tire; the Kenda is not.
- Rolling resistance. Slight edge to the Kenda. Once up to speed, the Kenda rolls a bit faster due to its smoother center tread (despite the fact that the center tread is thicker). And it will roll noticeably faster than that CST Servant due to the smoother tread and lack of an energy-sapping Kevlar belt.
- Puncture resistance. Kenda is MUCH better in this regard. Not flat-proof like a Kevlar belted tire, but the thick center tread will prevent almost all flats while rolling faster. How flat-resistant? I've commuted over plenty of glass shards with the Kenda as my primary rear tire through two dark, wet Portland winters and have yet to get a single flat.
- Hard-surface traction. Again, Kenda gets the edge. Very grippy on wet pavement.
- Offroad grip. You'd think there would be little difference given the similar tread patterns -- maybe an edge to the Maxxis given its directional side knobs -- but in practice I've found the Kenda to be noticeably better. You won't mistake it for a knobby, but I've taken the Kenda on plenty of trips through muddy Forest Park and gotten through just fine. I've done that with the WormDrive too, but it was trickier and I had to slow down more to keep the rubber side down.
- Snow and ice. Snow gives a similar performance margin as Mud to the Kenda. Oddly, the Maxxis excels on ice. I can't really explain it, but my experience with the Maxxis from at least 2-3 icy occasions is it's one of the best tires I've tried on ice. Of course if you ride on ice a lot you need studded tires, but there it is FWIW.
- Cornering. Sorry. Although I have run both of these tires in front, I have a lot more experience with them as rear tires and can't really judge the cornering. It's possible the directional side knobs on the Maxxis could give it the edge, but that's just speculation. For commuting ONLY without respect to offroad performance, I strongly prefer a tire WITHOUT side knobs, because you can corner a lot faster and with more confidence on wet pavement. I've crashed on wet pavement when side knobs failed to hold, and that's no fun. Currently a big fan of the Maxxis OverDrive, and will be running the 700x38 version as my winter commute tire.

Bottom line is that the Kenda is overall a better tire for commuting and moderate offroading UNLESS the lighter weight or foldability of the Maxxis tilts the balance the other way for you. Also, IMO a semislick with side knobs is nowhere near as good for commuting as a round tire once the pavement gets wet. Check out the Kenda Kwick Roller EZ-Ride as an in-between alternative up front: available in 3 sizes up to 700x45, lighter than the Kross Plus even in its biggest size, faster rolling than either of the other two tires discussed above, smoother on the sides and better cornering than either (but not a true slick and not quite as round as the OverDrive)."


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## BruceBrown (Jan 16, 2004)

65Matt said:


> Here is some more info I found from Glowboy in this thread.
> http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=192307
> Some of this info will be duplicate, but he does list alot of weights, which is useful.
> 
> ...


Nice list!

How does that Kenda Kwick Roller EZ-Ride do for pavement riding/training in terms of flats? The weight looks good and I would give them a shot at tubeless.


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## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

BruceBrown said:


> How does that Kenda Kwick Roller EZ-Ride do for pavement riding/training in terms of flats? The weight looks good and I would give them a shot at tubeless.


Just saw this.

For a tire with a smooth center tread, the EZ-Ride's tread is very thick (I'd guess at least 3mm), about the same as the K847. It was also made both with and without a puncture belt, but even without the belt I would expect them to be pretty flat resistant. Unfortunately it looks like Kenda dropped it for this year: the only Kwick Roller model they show anymore is the Sport, which maxes out at 700x32.


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## bolandjd (Jul 23, 2008)

How have I missed this thread all this time?! Great info here. I have a set of the Bonty Jones XR 1.8" front and rear that I run occasionally on my LHT. Great tire. I concurr with the other reviews of the tire in this thread - easy to mount and take off, grippy on the trail (saved me from going down more than once - the Trucker is not the most agile beast in the woods ), decent but not great on the road. Perfect MX tire for a cross or touring bike with the clearance, IMHO. They'd probably work really well on a massive-clearance 26er like the 1x1 too. I noticed the dirt throwing thing too, but I guess it just didn't bug me. I like the Jones' so much, I'm real tempted to get a dedicated MX bike like a Cross Check or something. But if I do that, I might as well get a "real" 29er. Awe well, can't afford another bike right now anyway. 

My only real beef is that to mount the tires, I have to remove my fenders. Not the tires' fault. I'd be real interested to try the Schwab Marathon Extreme which looks to have the right mix of on-road, off-road, fit-under-fenders-ablity.


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## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

I'm attracted to the Marathon Extreme too. I have the Marathon Winter (studded) in 700x40 and am extremely impressed with the tread, which appears to be the same as the Extreme. But I'm put off by the Extreme's near-$80 price, no cheaper than the Winter.

At the moment I'm considering the Marathon Cross. Appears to be a very similar tread to the Winter and Extreme (maybe slightly less aggressive) but half the price, though slightly smaller at 700x38.


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## Bounty Hunter (Nov 22, 2006)

I just got done riding my Surly CC with my extra wheelset (Mavic Aksiums with 700x23c tires). I just cannot ride on those tires. I don't feel stable (I'm a 5'10" clyde at 235 lbs). I still have my other wheelset with Maxxis Raze 700x35c and they feel much better to me. 

I'm thinking I might have to go Monster Cross with this bike. I need some tips/FAQ on how to do this. I just feel more comfortable/stable on bigger tires.


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## bolandjd (Jul 23, 2008)

The Cross Check, like the LHT, will fit up to a 45mm tire. The Jones XR 1.8" measured in right at 45mm on my calipers on the stock 18mm rims. They would be a decent choice for probably 75% or more dirt/offroad, 25% or less on road. Any more roadriding than that (or trips longer than a few miles), and I think you'll want something less knobby. But they rock on dirt roads and buff singletrack!


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## c_m_shooter (Mar 8, 2007)

I've been running a Marathon Extreme on the back of my Tricross SS for a month or so now and it is a pretty good tire. It rolls smooth and is quieter on the road than my Small Block 8s. Traction is good except on rooty climbs, but there aren't many better alternatives, so just hit them with plenty of momentum. It has worked perfecly with a 29er stanz strip, and I plan on putting one on the front just because the Mutanoraptor is too loose on the rim to run tubeless.


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## Bounty Hunter (Nov 22, 2006)

bolandjd said:


> The Cross Check, like the LHT, will fit up to a 45mm tire. The Jones XR 1.8" measured in right at 45mm on my calipers on the stock 18mm rims. They would be a decent choice for probably 75% or more dirt/offroad, 25% or less on road. Any more roadriding than that (or trips longer than a few miles), and I think you'll want something less knobby. But they rock on dirt roads and buff singletrack!


What kind of wheels do I need to go with that wide of a tire? Can I use my Easton Vistas or Mavic Aksiums?

Am I the only person that prefers off road > road riding that feels weird on road tires in 700x23c?


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## jimgskoop (Apr 13, 2006)

700x38 WTB All-Terrainasarus. Good fire road tire and rolls quite well on pavement, also works OK on fast pavement cornering.


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## Bounty Hunter (Nov 22, 2006)

New tires for the Cross Check. Specialized Crossroads Armadillo Elite 700x38c. Wanna-be Monster Cross.


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## deuxdiesel (Jan 14, 2007)

Stan's Raven 2.0, really about a 1.75 
Geax Barro Race 2.0, really about a 1.7 
Conti Race king 2.2, really about a 1.8 (older version maybe)

I have all three of these, and they all make great monster-crosser tires. I'll be using the Stan's on 355's (with rim brakes) this fall- low pressure, light weight!


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

deuxdiesel said:


> Stan's Raven 2.0, really about a 1.75
> Geax Barro Race 2.0, really about a 1.7
> Conti Race king 2.2, really about a 1.8 (older version maybe)
> 
> I have all three of these, and they all make great monster-crosser tires. I'll be using the Stan's on 355's (with rim brakes) this fall- low pressure, light weight!


Would they fit a Cross-Check type frame? That for me is a basic indication of being "small enough" to be demoted monster cross from MTB.


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## DocAltie (Feb 7, 2006)

Sounds crazy, but Continental Vapor 28x2.1 tires...

I have a pair, and I have measured them. They are more like 1.9's. Not even close to 2.1.


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## deuxdiesel (Jan 14, 2007)

I ran Fire Cross 45's in my old Cross Check, so maybe a look-see on Shiggy's site will let you know if they are in the ball park.


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## Climber999 (May 2, 2009)

A good tire is Bonti 29-3 rear. It is advertised as 2.0" but it is on the narrow side: 1.85"

It has a LTR version for those who wish to run tubeless. 
I don't think it is the best tire for cross terrain (i.e., paved and unpaved) but is shines for strictly off road.


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

*Borough XC was a little dissapointing*

Old thread, but lots of good info here so I'll add to it. My Bruce Gordon BLT touring bike can take up to a 50mm wide tire, so I'm basically looking for the largest volume tire with a fast rolling tread and robust build for off-road touring.

I already have a couple tires that I'm not totally satisfied with and I was hoping that the 45c Specialized Borough XC would be a bit larger and more robust. Unfortunately, the build doesn't seem much if any "tougher" than my IRC Mythos CX, based on the sidewall and tread thickness and overall stiffness. Furthermore, they are actually only 40 mm wide, making them the narrowest "monstercross" tire in my quiver. Actually, they're not going in my quiver, they're going back to the store.

So below are the specs for a touring tire and three MX tires. These were measured on a Salsa Delgado Cross rim. I also measured my Conti Top Touring tire on my Sun CR18 front rim and I was surprised to see that the same tire (model and size anyway) measured a full 1.5 mm both shorter and narrower. In short: YMMV.

Tire | Size | Bead | Width (mm) casing/tread | Height (mm) casing/tread | Weight (g)

Continental Top Touring | 37c | wire | 35.4 | 33.3 | 574

Maxxis Worm Drive | 42c | Kevlar | 38.9 / 42.9 | 36.5 | 427

IRC Mythos CX Slick | 42c | wire | 40.7 / 42.7 | 37.2 / 39.1 | 512

Spec. Borough XC Comp | 45c | wire | 37.4 / 40.3 | 35.8 | 576

The Mythos CX has a little road buzz, but its the biggest and toughest MX tire I have. I am going to go to another shop and look at the Conti tires, see if they have any in stock that they can air-up for me. The tread I am afraid might hold more mud in wet conditions, but they should be tough and aggressive enough for my purposes. I think I will also shoot Bruce Gordon an email about the Rock 'N' Road tires. The Scwables look good, although narrower than what I want, but no-one carries them locally.

In the attached photo, from top to bottom: 
Maxxis Wormdrive
Specialized Borough
Continental Top Touring
IRC Mythos CX Slick


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

Tire | Size | Bead | Width (mm) casing/tread | Height (mm) casing/tread | Weight (g)

Continental Country RIDE| 47c | wire | 44.5 | 43.4 | ~800

This is a winner for me.


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## agu (Jun 22, 2007)

I'm using Continental Cyclocross tires (wire bead). 700x42c. So far so good on various trails here, though I've pinch flatted twice (was running 35psi or lower!). Gotta keep it at 40psi I guess.

Could use a wee bit of volume but on the VooDoo Wazoo it leaves some space for mud clearance.


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## 29erWannabe (May 20, 2010)

Wow!

Great discussion here...

Aw my nick implies, I ride a Trekking bike on both asphalt and off road mountain biking. Not wet though...

I use the 700x40c Smart Sams which I find great for both conditions and still great on wet asphalt... 

I think Schwalbe will not support these for 2011 though, since they have gone off their website. Only 26" versions appear.

I want a wider front for improved off - road traction without slaughtering on road performance...

Would the Jones XR fit the bill? or maybe the Conti Race King maybe?


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## Cloxxki (Jan 11, 2004)

I may have mentioned in earlier in this thread, but 2.0 Big Apples (and thus likely also the more off-roadable Marathon Supremes), fit nicely. 
A buddy runs a Supreme on his 29"er in the back, too lazy to swap it out for off-road rides. It just works on out tame trails. Even the steep stuff.

I have come to the conclusion for myself though, that life's too short to deal with road drops. Get really good dirt drops, of just mount a really long stem and a ~40d swept trekking bar. Oh, the comfort! Oh, the control! Anyway, I never got to try it on a short top tubed bike, but I should. Come to think of it, my CC is a size too long for me.

Of the recent editions of weenie XC 29"er tires, some are bound to fit the monstercross tag. Furious Freds?


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## FR hokeypokey (Feb 6, 2009)

I have been using the Continental Twister(37mm) for the last two years. Pretty good tire. Predictable and durable. Rolls fairly well. Personally, I like my tires to have a larger tread on the edges for cornering. These tires do a above average job of that. 

I am over 200lbs. and regularly use them for SW Denver pavement, dirt roads and singletrack. The rockier it gets the better lines I have to pick is the only trade off. 

Recently ordered a pair of Kenda SB8(32mm). I am going to try a more cyclocross feel for awhile. I have used the 2.1 SB8's before and really liked tthem as long as it did not get too chunky on the trail. Lookiing forward to trying out the new tire size.


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## kide (Mar 25, 2008)

Cloxxki said:


> A buddy runs a Supreme on his 29"er in the back, too lazy to swap it out for off-road rides. It just works on out tame trails. Even the steep stuff.


Marathon Supreme is quite offroadable in my experience too. I had the 26x2.0 on a rigid MTB and it was suprisingly grippy. Just watch out for any loose gravel when cornering if you have in the front  .



Cloxxki said:


> Of the recent editions of weenie XC 29"er tires, some are bound to fit the monstercross tag. Furious Freds?


Not exactly WW @ 650g, but I recently installed a Continental Mountain King 29x2.2 on a standard 15C road rim. 44.5 mm at the casing and 51 mm at the side knobs.

I've heard the Furious Fred is very prone to punctures. I'm still tempted to try it out...


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## johnnypecans (Jan 5, 2009)

*Kenda Kross Plus 42c review*
Picked up some 42c Kenda Kross Plus tires off Nashbar for $9/each. I've had them for a few weeks now but I hadn't pulled off my 50c Big Apples until last night. Took the Kross Pluses for a little muddy rail trail/road ride. On-road manners are decent, they seemed a little slower than my Big Apples, but they're also smaller and so reduced my gearing (the bike is fixed) so they're probably about the same. The Krosses definitely bring less on-road grip to the table- they feel pretty slick, and it's easy to skid the back tire and backpedal on asphalt. The side lugs make on-road cornering feel a little odd, but they seem to grip pretty well on asphalt.

Offroad, the cornering traction is pretty good. Better in slippery conditions than 50c Big Apples. They clear mud decently, and although this is really mostly relevant to my frame and available tires, the smaller Krosses don't jam the caliper brake full of mud like my 50c Apples do, so I can go further than I could in the past. Also, at around 600g, they're quite a bit lighter than my thigh-slaying Big Apples are, so that combined with the slightly shorter gearing means I can accelerate much more quickly and without as much effort. Being that the trails are muddy from rain the past few days, it'll be a bit before I can speak to their dry cornering, and the route I took is mostly a straight shot offroad, so I might have more to say on their direction changing abilities later on.

For $20/pair, I would recommend these tires. For more like $40/pair I don't know if they're a good buy.


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## Holmes (Jun 23, 2008)

I've had the 42c Kenda's on my LHT for quite awhile (likewise I got them cheap from Nashbar). For the $$ they are pretty hard to beat - definitely a good cheap tire for a bike that sees a lot of mixed road surface use.


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## thegreatchiweenie (Mar 3, 2010)

What about Schwalbe Little Albert 28 inch? Just came on a bike I bought, haven't gotten to ride them yet.


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## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

SmartSam 47c on Surly cross check: Initial impressions are faster rolling on road than Conti Twister 42c (and lighter!) plus they grip and clear pretty well in mud (even the nasty clay round here!)

Looking forward to more miles on these.

SSP


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## Guitar Ted (Jan 14, 2004)

Singlespeedpunk said:


> SmartSam 47c on Surly cross check: Initial impressions are faster rolling on road than Conti Twister 42c (and lighter!) plus they grip and clear pretty well in mud (even the nasty clay round here!)
> 
> Looking forward to more miles on these.
> 
> SSP


Hey Alex, what do those Smart Sams measure out at and what rims are you using? I am considering these tires for my Black Mountain Cycles cross frame build. Thanks!


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Guitar Ted said:


> Hey Alex, what do those Smart Sams measure out at and what rims are you using? I am considering these tires for my Black Mountain Cycles cross frame build. Thanks!


GT- I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts.

Smart Sam 28x1.75
tread width: 44.6
casing; 40.9
radius to widest/outside: 345/358

Narrower/lower tread and slightly higher volume than the FireCross 700x45.

I like them a lot, road, gravel, trail.


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## Singlespeedpunk (Jan 6, 2004)

Ted, my Sam's measure up as 44 casing / 47 across the tread when mounted on Mavic A119s at about 40PSI.

HTH

Alex


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## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

shiggy said:


> GT- I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts.


Yes you have. We should make you stand at the blackboard and write 500 times

_I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts
I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts
I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts
I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts
I have been neglectful in updating my spec charts_

... and not let you ride a bike until it's done.....


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## Guitar Ted (Jan 14, 2004)

shiggy, Singlespeedpunk, thanks guys! This is what I wanted to hear. I had been checking on-line for anything on these, and what I have gleaned is that they should be a great gravel road tire. I was just concerned about the width, but if they are no bigger than a Panaracer Fire Cross 45mm than I will be golden.

Thanks again guys!


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## Climber999 (May 2, 2009)

The glaring problem with the Smart Sam 47c is it's not available in the USA (only 35c). To compound the problem they offer them only in wire beads, so shipping from Europe is quite prohibitive.


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## Mr Pink57 (Jul 30, 2009)

^^ You can snag them on ebay for a good price plus free shipping. They're labeled as 28x1.75 if I remember correctly. This is were I snagged my set, they took almost a month to get here though.


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## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

Mr Pink57 said:


> ^^ You can snag them on ebay for a good price plus free shipping. They're labeled as 28x1.75 if I remember correctly. This is were I snagged my set, they took almost a month to get here though.


Have a link? Google and eBay gives me nothing except Petra Cycles in England. Not a bad price, but then shipping bites ya.


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## juansevo (Nov 3, 2005)

Marathon Extremes remind me of the old TiogaFarmer Johns. Kinda want a set just for that, and well the Firecross rubs a hair in the rear of my Crosscheck....think they need to double check "fatties fit fine" because it's a great frame meant to be mated to these tires. 

Smart Sams are really intriguing....dig the knob style. Too bad on wire bead though. 

FYI Kenda is offering the happy medium in a 42c I believe soon too.


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## rr (Dec 28, 2003)

Hey for those that can fit 45's I have a lightly used(5 rides) set of Bontrager XDX 1.75's I bought for my La Cruz. They are really nice tires with great traction and are tubeless ready, unfortunately for me they are a tad too big and slightly rub. 

I looked around everywhere for some 42's but no luck, went with Ritchey Speedmax 40's


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## PetraCycles (Jun 30, 2011)

slocaus said:


> Have a link? Google and eBay gives me nothing except Petra Cycles in England. Not a bad price, but then shipping bites ya.


Hey guys, This is Peter from Petra Cycles, just to let you know if you have a shipping issue, then let me know, cause our system may or may not have got the price right. We try to do it by weight per category but its so complex and sometimes things are in the wrong place. We don't want to make any money out of shipping. We like to be fair!

Sorry about that one . Cheers

Peter


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Climber999 said:


> The glaring problem with the Smart Sam 47c is it's not available in the USA (only 35c). To compound the problem they offer them only in wire beads, so shipping from Europe is quite prohibitive.


My set of Smart Sam 47s came from Schwalbe NA.


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## jimmythefly (Sep 10, 2005)

Link to my flickr pic
Shown above L to R
Specialized Borough CX Pro 700x42: 42.5mm actual width on 26mm rim. New and barely ridden.
Bontrager Dry-X 29x1.75: 47.5mm actual width on 26mm rim. Plenty of miles.
Bontrager XR-1 29x1.9: 48mm on 24mm rim. New, never ridden (only mounted for this photo).
Bontrager XDX 29x2.1: 56mm on 26mm rim. Plenty of miles.









Link to flickr pic

Let me reiterate how much I would like the Ritchey Megabite Overdrive WCS 700x38 to be reproduced. Fantastic tire, quite fast on pavement, great in the dirt or gravel, very light, very supple side wall.


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

Since this thread has been resserected, has anyone had any luck running the Mythos CX 42c tires tubeless? I can't get a bead seal and so I can't get them to air up.


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## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

FishMan473 said:


> Since this thread has been resserected, has anyone had any luck running the Mythos CX 42c tires tubeless? I can't get a bead seal and so I can't get them to air up.


No. 

I have setup many tires tubeless, and I tried every trick I know. I even tried putting a tie down strap around the tread to bulge the beads and seat, like they to on car tires. Nada.......

I know someone who uses this technique on tough 29er tires / rims. He will use a tube, use rubber cement to glue the bead to the rim, and inflate. Come back a few hours later, break about 4 inches of bead, reach in and cut the tube to remove it. Pop the bead back and the rubber cement should stick it back as soon as you hit it with air. Add Stans through the valve stem with injector.

I did not want to go to that much trouble, so I used tubes to try them on my Rock Lobster and found I did not want to run that tire on this bike.


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## GTscoob (Apr 27, 2009)

juansevo said:


> FYI Kenda is offering the happy medium in a 42c I believe soon too.


Looks like it'll be fall before these are in stock in that size. I'm anxiously awaiting throwing one on the back of my new Soma Double Cross. I'm thinking Kenda Karma 1.9 up front and 700x42 Happy Medium in the back should make for a good monstercross tire setup.


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## agu (Jun 22, 2007)

I should have a pair of Schwalbe Smart Sams 700x40c in 2 weeks' time. Should be interesting to compare to the Conti Cyclocross 700x42c I have on. Contis are wearing down.

Shame both sets are wire bead though.


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## nateknutson (Mar 15, 2008)

Hey, has anyone tried Halo Twin Rail 700x38s? Versatile and awesome or mediocre at everything and heavy?


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## kide (Mar 25, 2008)

I just noticed Schwalbe's site now includes Smart Sam 47-622 (29 x 1.75) in Evolution Line. Folding and 435 g!


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## GlowBoy (Jan 3, 2004)

Thread bump! I've got gravel grinding on the brain for this spring, and since I contributed a lot of the earlier content of this thread I thought it was time I posted an update.

I've even been doing some unscientific coast-down testing of rolling resistance on the tires in my pile, since the "feel" of a tire isn't always indicative of how fast it actually is. Since a lot of gravel racers are choosing tires smaller than 700x40 these days, I wanted to see if the wider tires really are slower. Some interesting findings:

- Several of my semislicks are virtually identical in rolling resistance when run at 80psi: *Ritchey SpeedMax* 700x35 (this one's worn down enough that the center tread is pretty smooth), *Maxxis WormDrive* 700x42, *IRC Mythos CX* 700x42 and *Kenda Kwick Roller EZ-Ride* 700x45. Each of these has different strengths in terms of traction, weight, volume and durability, so it's nice to know that I can choose among them for those attributes without any real consequence to speed. Although most gravel riding would be at lower pressures, for speed testing I used high pressure to see how fast the tires are capable of being on paved stretches or very smooth dirt.

- The *Kenda Kross Plus K847* (700x42 size), which many of us picked up for cheap at Nashbar) was substantially slower than the above group. At least consciously this was a surprise to me, but maybe not subconsciously: although in the past I've reported it as a fast roller, I do have to admit that after a couple years I discontinued using it because it sometimes "felt" a little slow. Part of the reason it was slower than the others is that I ran it at its max 65psi, but even then it was almost as slow as the SpeedMax at 40psi -- which is palpably more sluggish at that pressure than at 80. It is still far more durable than the 4 above tires and also very long-wearing, so it still has its place if you want something bulletproof.

- The *Kenda Khan* 700x50, which hardly anyone else has anymore, turned out to be as fast or perhaps just slightly faster rolling at 65psi than the 4 fast tires I mentioned above were - at 80 psi. This was a bit of a surprise since it is quite heavy and feels slow as a result. But the sucker really does roll once up to speed, supporting Cloxxki's old adage that fat tires aren't always slower. It's like a 29x2.0 Big Apple with side knobs. Too bad this historic, first 29" semislick has been out of production so long that it is now almost forgotten.

- All these tires were measurably a LOT faster than knobbies (no surprise). I still need to test my Maxxis Cross+Mark, which at least _feels_ like one of the fastest real knobbies I've tried, to see how it compares with the monstercrossers. For rougher non-singletrack terrain, I might pair a front Cross+Mark with the Khan in back.

Tires I have my eye on:
- Schwalbe Smart Sam 700x45. Great reports on this guy in terms of both all-around grip and rolling resistance. Probably a bit slower than the semislicks, but this looks like it would be a bit better in the corners. Schwalbe NA has them for about $30.
- Ritchey SpeedMax 700x40. The smaller sizes wear like iron: I swapped my rear K847 in favor of the faster SpeedMax several years ago, and it has been one of the most durable and long-wearing tires I have owned. If I didn't already have the WormDrive, I'd definitely grab one of these, and the price is great.
- Geax Evolution 29x2.0. Whoa, my LBS is overflowing with these. Heavy, but with its round profile and aggressive invert tread it looks like a great-cornering gravel tire that would provide a lot of cush and still roll pretty well. And it's under $30. I would be very tempted to pair this up with the Khan for loaded dirt touring.
- Kenda Happy Medium 700x40. Semislick with a similar look to the SpeedMax, and also a good price.
- Schwalbe Marathon Extreme, if they ever make a cheap Comp version (there's no way I'm going to pay $80 for a non-studded tire). I do have the Marathon Winter, which is an identical tread with studs in it, and it's great on and off road, with a round profile and even knobs that make it a really good cornering tire.
Anyone got more reports on any of these newer tires?


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## hogprint (Oct 17, 2005)

I just took my new happy mediums out for a short spin today. At 80psi they felt quite fast. Certainly comparable to my old weatherchecked irc mythos xc 42's. It was an asphalt ride and I had a few other changes to notice but initially they are a thumbs up.


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## fastpath (Aug 27, 2004)

The new Conti XKings are coming out in 42c.

BTW, If anyone is interested in trying out some Bontrager Jones XRs in 1.8, let me know. I gambled on them, but they won't clear my stays. They measure just a tad over 45mm.


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## GreenLightGo (Oct 24, 2006)

I'm interested in the Jones, plenty of clearance on my Soma. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## fastpath (Aug 27, 2004)

I've got a trade pending for some Twister Pros, but I'll let you know if it falls through.



GreenLightGo said:


> I'm interested in the Jones, plenty of clearance on my Soma.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## GreenLightGo (Oct 24, 2006)

fastpath said:


> I've got a trade pending for some Twister Pros, but I'll let you know if it falls through.


Ok. No worries, been looking at the new Vee Rubber offerings too. Something 1.75-1.8 would be awesome for my DoubleCross.


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## puddletown (Jan 30, 2011)

Great Thread! Thanks All


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

The Bruce Gordon Rock n' Road is back!:

Bruce Gordon Cycles - The Unofficial Official Blog: The Unicorn Has Landed - the Rock n' Road Tire is Back!


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## slocaus (Jul 21, 2005)

Skinwalls! Sah-weeeeeet. Want for my Lobster.


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## SurlyCalvin (Sep 28, 2007)

*Newer from Specialized*

A few more from Specialized that fit my Crosscheck with room to spare.

Renegade 1.95
Renegade 1.8

Ground Control 1.9

As I said, room to spare, all of these are pretty light as well.


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## surf2summit (Apr 12, 2012)

My favorites forn my SS cross check
Panaracer firecross 700x45 front
Kenda happy medium 700x40 rear
WTB all-trainasorous 700x38 rear


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## BluesDawg (Apr 8, 2007)

Vee Rubber 12, 1.95 measure 47mm mounted on A23 rims and fit well on my Black Mountain Cycles Monster Cross. Roll fast and smooth with 50psi rear 40 front. More traction than I expected on damp dirt and roots and good float on sand. I have not tried them on pavement yet.


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## girlscantell (Oct 19, 2008)

I too have a Black Mtn Cross with the Vee 12's. I love those tires - they float over gravel while maintaining traction and aren't too bad on the road. I switched over to the 700x35 Conti Cyclo X-Kings for a gravel race. I gained a bit of speed but lost out on comfort, as expected. That bike is so comfortable that it really didn't matter.


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## vaultbrad (Oct 17, 2007)

I've been eyeballing those Vee 12's online. Where did you guys get yours? Vee has some very sweet looking 700c x 1.75 tires coming out or already available. Might have to talk to the lbs about finding me some.


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## BluesDawg (Apr 8, 2007)

I got mine through my LBS. Not sure which distributor had them, but it was one of the ones they commonly use, probably QBP or Hawley.

I have done a few rides on paved roads with the Vee 12s now and they are better than I expected there. They make a faint high pitched howl at speed, but nothing really annoying. I'm sure they slowed me down a little compared to normal street tires, but not so much. I managed to hit 38 mph coming down one big hill last week. That's not a lot slower than what I get on my road bike there.

They were great on dirt and gravel roads. They really soak up the bumps. I was going 25 mph on a smooth dirt road downhill when I suddenly hit a long stretch of the dreaded stutter bumps. Glad I was in the drops at the time, but the bike tracked straight and true and the jackhammer effect was very muted, not comfortable but also not painful like similar situations had been on my Salsa Casseroll on 37mm Conti Contacts.


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## NEPMTBA (Apr 7, 2007)

Please...

..."Sticky" this super thread!


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## FishMan473 (Jan 2, 2003)

do these Vee 12's 1.75's work tubeless? What's the cost? What's the weight?


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## BluesDawg (Apr 8, 2007)

FishMan473 said:


> do these Vee 12's 1.75's work tubeless? What's the cost? What's the weight?


I don't think the Vee 12 1.75 is available yet. Keep in mind that the actual width of the 1.95s mounted on A23 rims measured 47mm (1.85").

I don't know about tubeless and I didn't weigh mine. Here is some good info :
Black Mountain Cycles: Vee Rubber...

Mike just did a ride report on the Vee 12 tires. 
Black Mountain Cycles: First ride Vee 12...


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