# Totem: is this serious?



## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

Have the 08 Totem solo air with very few rides. After Saterdays ride had a bit of oil leaking out of the right hand knobs at the top of the fork crown. Before this happened I changed the oil via the speed lube system. I think I put 20 cc's in but i could have put 25cc's. (maybe too much oil)
Is this just extra oil that has no where to go but up and out? The fork seem to be acting normal.
The fork was shipped with little to no oil in the fork.
Thanks


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## Prettym1k3 (Oct 11, 2005)

Dude... Totem is 20cc's!

Instructions, man. They are your friend. 

http://www.sram.com/_media/techdocs/AVI.SPDLUBE.INSTRT.ENG.R6.pdf

If you put in 25cc's while that doesn't sound like a lot more, it is, after all, 25% too much.


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## cdburch (Apr 25, 2007)

keep an eye on the dampening perfomance. it might be a blown mission control cartridge. i have blown two in the past two years on my lyrik...


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

I did the oil change a while ago, just havent ridden much in the last 3 months. I'm hoping its just excess oil. 
Is there anything that needs to be checked as far as tightness underneath the compression knobs? I mean, why should the oil come out there?
We rode SB in Socal so it is super rocky ie: lots of rapid suspention movement


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## Prettym1k3 (Oct 11, 2005)

Shouldn't matter. I speed lubed my fork and rode Northstar all summer and it never leaked like that.

Check for 20cc of oil. If not, may be a blown cartridge.


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## bmxconvert (May 17, 2006)

Your comment that you hadn't ridden in a while makes me wonder how you store the bike?

If the bike is stored upside down or hanging on the wall with the front wheel up it cold allow for the oil to leak out the knobs at the top. 

The speed lube only changes the oil in the lowers and has absolutely nothing to do with the Mission Control oil which is where the problem seems to be. The Totem is not an open bath system so even if you had too much oil in the lowers it would not come out your MC adjusters.

-Kevin


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

thanks bmxconvert, the bike is stored normally, rubber side down


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## pipes10 (Mar 11, 2007)

have u isolated the leak to the knobs or can it be leaking from under the top cap?


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## Teague (Jul 2, 2005)

if its riding like normal, and not leaking constantly, don't worry about it. My totem likes to occasionally burp a bit of oil out the top, though its not a regular thing. A friends does the same thing. No effect on performance.


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## chooofoojoo (Feb 22, 2007)

If you put too much speed lube in the fork legs.. then it would NOT come out by the crown / mission control... it would leak out the seals if anywhere... 25cc is no big deal since the speed lube is only semi-bath lubrication. 


If the fork is weeping oil out the top of the mission control then it could be a faulty mission control unit (wouldn't be the first.. nor the last), if it's brand spaking new it could be that the mission control seals are finally bedding in and a slight amount (no more than 1 cc of oil) should have leaked out. 

The totem is very particular to oil height. I'd have to look it up but i believe off the top of my head that it's 137cc on the nose for the damping unit. 

My bet would be to keep an eye on the performance of the fork. blown MC units are hard to spot at first (tiny leak like yours) but as soon as the oil volume depletes enough just about nothing will work. 

~Nick


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## amannil (Feb 16, 2009)

my totem also leaks a little bit on the knobs every once in a while, still performs incredibly well.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

It is bran spanking new, about 4 rides in the last 6 months. Last wknd was the first with 15-20 min. downhills.
Chooofoojoo is right, just a little oil, enough to run down the back of the crown. I'll keep an eye on it.


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## Orange-Goblin (Jan 27, 2008)

My new Totem leaked a bit of oil from under the mission control knob too last week after a days DH race. Its still working flawlessly so until it affects performance i'm not too worried. Unless someone tells me thats a bad idea? 
The guys at my LBS, a RS dealer, say its not too much to worry about, just keep an eye out for odd behaviour.

My older totem (late '07 / early '08) never did this while i had it but i bought it second hand, so didin't own it during its first few months. This one that has leaked is brand new and in its first few months. Hmmm, any RS guys online here to inform us??


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

My Domain has leaked from the rebound knob since I got it. I'm just going to rock it until it blows up I guess.


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## BillT (Dec 24, 2003)

My Totem leaks as well from the top cap area (only happens when I turn it upside down) - so far the performance is fine, but I am taking it into the shop for a rebuild as I'm now getting a good amount of oil on stanchions so it may be time for new seals.


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## XJman07 (Apr 17, 2007)

When the mission control cartridge or dampening blows, is it the actual cartridge or the seals? Mine also leaks a little oil from under the mission control knobs.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

BillT said:


> My Totem leaks as well from the top cap area (only happens when I turn it upside down) - so far the performance is fine, but I am taking it into the shop for a rebuild as I'm now getting a good amount of oil on stanchions so it may be time for new seals.


I've never set this bike upside down.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

Ok. I just got a chance to look at the fork for the first time since Sunday. I looks like oil has continued to flow out of the fork and run all the way down the stantions and there is more now than before. Sorry no pics. So I'm gonna conclude that its blown. Oil shouldent be oozing out, it points to a blown seal in the Mission control system. I'll call SRAM today.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

Just got off the phone with Sram. Defininly blown seal in the mission control system they will warranty it through my lbs. They referred to a seal being unseated. It's a good thing I'm not riding a lot right now otherwise this would suck.


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## XSL_WiLL (Nov 2, 2004)

Jim311 said:


> My Domain has leaked from the rebound knob since I got it. I'm just going to rock it until it blows up I guess.


It might just be a crush washer. It's a simple (but annoying) fix.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

XSL_WiLL said:


> It might just be a crush washer. It's a simple (but annoying) fix.


To be honest my solution was to goob some RTV on the bolt. So far so good, which either means it leaked all of the oil out, or the RTV is holding. Like I said.. I'll probably just rock it until it blows up at this point. It's been working fine for a while so who knows?


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## Freerydejunky (Sep 21, 2006)

Just look at this situation as caring for a baby. 

If your baby's ear was leaking purple goo there is probably something wrong. So just wipe up the goo and throw it back in the crib!


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## sq225917 (Dec 28, 2008)

mine did the same thing first ride out, about 1/2 cc out of the top, nothing since though and i was nailing it all weekend..


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## sq225917 (Dec 28, 2008)

Back to the old routine today, leaking again, just enough to make it onto the back on the stanchion, no more than a few drops. 

Annoying though, as i know this means it will blow out at some point.


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## saturnine (Mar 28, 2007)

motormonkeyr6 said:


> Just look at this situation as caring for a baby.
> 
> If your baby's ear was leaking purple goo there is probably something wrong. So just wipe up the goo and throw it back in the crib!


let the wife do it :thumbsup:


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## Ginolanza (Apr 2, 2009)

*maintenance oil*

Careful, when you untight the two small bolts to change the oil most often it will look like there is no oil coming out, this is because you have to push slightly the fork sleeves, this is not said in the manual. You have to remove all the oil and replace it with no more than 20cc, if you do not remove all oil pressure will build up inside the fork and the excess oil will eventually find its way out.
hope this will help


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## sq225917 (Dec 28, 2008)

yeh but out at the seals on the sliders not out of the top.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

Jim311 said:


> My Domain has leaked from the rebound knob since I got it. I'm just going to rock it until it blows up I guess.


 at this post.

It finally blew up. I sent it back to SRAM and it was in their hands for a day before it was back in the mail and headed my way. SRAM has super fast turnaround time and good people to deal with. They have my business in the future. Rebound cart was blown, so they replaced it, and added fresh oil and cleaned it. We'll see how she rides


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## Swell Guy (Jan 20, 2005)

Demodude said:


> Have the 08 Totem solo air with very few rides. After Saterdays ride had a bit of oil leaking out of the right hand knobs at the top of the fork crown. Before this happened I changed the oil via the speed lube system. I think I put 20 cc's in but i could have put 25cc's. (maybe too much oil)
> Is this just extra oil that has no where to go but up and out? The fork seem to be acting normal.
> The fork was shipped with little to no oil in the fork.
> Thanks


I have the coil Totem, so my experience may not be applicable. I had oil leaking out the top after about 3 rides. Turns out the cartridge had gone bad, it was replaced under warranty.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

mine is hopefully going to be back from SRAM soon.


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## meskasiaurej (Feb 20, 2009)

Hello everyone,

I also would like to join your Totem-Care Club. Yesterday something weird happened while riding in the woods. After one descent I've noticed that the flood gate (low speed compression) knob is poped out and there is a small patch of oil on the crown. I pushed it back in even tho I haven't touched it that day and it should of been down all the time. I noticed that it spins absolutely freely without any resistance or "clicks". Then I tried adjusting high speed knob. No luck there. I wasn't able to turnit at all - it was dead-stuck. When I've pushed and turned low speed knob to enable lockout it pop up in some weird manner but fork was moving through it's travel as it did before.

It's 2008 Totem SoloAir ridden for about a week. What would be your diagnosis? Should I contanct bikeshop for warranty service?


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## mr.niles (Feb 5, 2007)

*here's what's wrong...*

last week i nailed the problem of leaky mission control dampers on my own. out of the blue my lyrik started spooging oil out of the top caps. specifically, the oil leaks out underneath the lo-spd compression knob around its shaft. so, being a mechanical dude, and wanting to use the fork during the coming weekend instead of "warranty," i dismantled the mission control. there is a snapring underneath the lo-spd knob. when you take that off you pull out a tube with a needle-like rod protruding from the bottom of the tube. on the tube there's an o-ring - this prevents oil from leaking out where the tube goes into the damper. now pull the needle-like rod out the bottom of the tube - there's a VERY small o-ring on the rod that prevents oil from leaking out the top of the tube.

so, if you look at these parts and how they interact with each other, you see that the two o-rings are what prevents oil from spewing out from under the damper knobs. if these o-rings aren't fitting tight enough you have spewage. on mine i found that the VERY small o-ring was crapped-out and loose, so i put on a SLIGHTLY thicker one to get a tighter fit, then very gently shoved the rod back into the tube. before i put on the thicker o-ring, the rod was very loose, the original o-ring clearly was not sealing. while i was at it, i lovingly cleaned and greased the oring on the tube. something i forgot - when you pull-out the tube assembly from the top of the damper, DON'T LOOSE THE LITTLE DETENT BALL! you can actually re-install the little detent ball back into place from the outside of the tube. so, i put it back together and VERY CAREFULLY measured out the exact amount of damper oil - putting in to much might be what blows the o-rings!

then i went to northstar that weekend and absolutely hammered the hell out of my lyrik on livewire - casing, landing flat, cramming into the turns, all the damn rocks, the usual for me. not one drop-of-a-leak. go figure.

so i'm going to be an ******* - no pictures - if you are up to the task, it will be self-explanatory when you take it apart. sorry it's such a long post. and no more posts from me about it - i just hate all this damn typing. but i thought this might be helpfull to all you mechanical types out there that aren't afraid to tear apart your forks and rush it.


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## ryan_daugherty (Oct 8, 2006)

BillT said:


> My Totem leaks as well from the top cap area (only happens when I turn it upside down) - so far the performance is fine, but I am taking it into the shop for a rebuild as I'm now getting a good amount of oil on stanchions so it may be time for new seals.


That sounds exactly what my 07 did this year and it was a blown mission control - sram sent a new one through my shop free of charge.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

*thanks*

I might give that a try next go-around. I love to tinker, well most of us do. Is there a reliable site or store to buy "o" rings?

By the way, after the warranty service from sram and my Lbs. the fork is flawless. Just finished a few days in Whistler. I slapped that fork silly!


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## BillT (Dec 24, 2003)

ryan_daugherty said:


> That sounds exactly what my 07 did this year and it was a blown mission control - sram sent a new one through my shop free of charge.


Mine is sitting at the shop right now waiting on a new damper from SRAM (free of charge).


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## meskasiaurej (Feb 20, 2009)

Just came back from my local authorized Sram service. Bottom part of Mission Control unit was floating in the oil... I think there is no other way except to ask for replacement under warranty.


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## 606cyn (May 2, 2009)

The air piston went on my totem 09 three weeks old. made terrible noises let the air out no noise. It has been out for warranty for 1 week now. I hate waiting. It at least lasted 8 days in Downievill for the festival.


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## Huck Pitueee (Apr 25, 2009)

Mine leaked after 12 rides.I did a basic seal rebuild and it holds oil after 30 rides.I never fiddle with the adjustments or lock out any more.


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## Gruntled (Jul 7, 2008)

My 08 Solo Airs blew the MC unit after a few rides. Oil came out of the top right knobs. SRAM replaced it no probs. The new unit has lasted a few months and is working very well, yay! It took 4 months to get a replacement part because they had run out of them. That sucked.


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## FA-Q (Jun 10, 2008)

Are there ANY current forks on the market that don't spontaneously explode? Seems like all I hear about Rockshox is that their warranty service is great, but you'd better have a backup fork for all the downtime during repairs, and I used to think Marzocchi was the $hit, but all I hear is the new ones are crap and the warranty service is a nightmare! I tried Fox, and their "service" was a pathetic joke (we sat on your fork for SEVEN MONTHS before sending it back UNTOUCHED and told you that you were S.O.L., don't you want to buy another OVERPRICED, OVER-RATED P.O.S. from us?). Mani-poo? Don't make me laugh... Should I just give up mountain biking and buy a motocross bike?:madman:


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## MTB-AHOLIC (Oct 8, 2005)

FA-Q said:


> Are there ANY current forks on the market that don't spontaneously explode? Seems like all I hear about Rockshox is that their warranty service is great, but you'd better have a backup fork for all the downtime during repairs, and I used to think Marzocchi was the $hit, but all I hear is the new ones are crap and the warranty service is a nightmare! I tried Fox, and their "service" was a pathetic joke (we sat on your fork for SEVEN MONTHS before sending it back UNTOUCHED and told you that you were S.O.L., don't you want to buy another OVERPRICED, OVER-RATED P.O.S. from us?). Mani-poo? Don't make me laugh... Should I just give up mountain biking and buy a motocross bike?:madman:


Lets face it we all demand a lot from our forks (bigger drops and harsher terrain then ever before). If you don't send it in for service every year or so then problems happen because the fork is designed to take a certain amount of punishment with the internal parts their designed with. Most people don't understand how complex these forks are becoming and fail to keep maintenance up on them. Its like a car...if you never get the oil changed and fail to do any maintenance on it...it will break...and you will wait. Consumers are too demanding of these products because most (including myself) don't have the tools to open one up and fix it themselves. The way to solve all of these problems for the company to simplify the design (which lowers these outrageous prices!)...so that the average joe can open it up and fix it himself (let alone the lbs...It should be like any other part on your bike) Perhaps the suspension company should send kits and directions on how to service it with the fork. This eliminates the shipping and waiting.


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## Datalogger (Jul 5, 2008)

Fock U, I mean FA-Q, Lol.-

My 09 Coil Totem Has 15 rides on it and so far so good.


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## Jim311 (Feb 7, 2006)

FA-Q said:


> Are there ANY current forks on the market that don't spontaneously explode? Seems like all I hear about Rockshox is that their warranty service is great, but you'd better have a backup fork for all the downtime during repairs, and I used to think Marzocchi was the $hit, but all I hear is the new ones are crap and the warranty service is a nightmare! I tried Fox, and their "service" was a pathetic joke (we sat on your fork for SEVEN MONTHS before sending it back UNTOUCHED and told you that you were S.O.L., don't you want to buy another OVERPRICED, OVER-RATED P.O.S. from us?). Mani-poo? Don't make me laugh... Should I just give up mountain biking and buy a motocross bike?:madman:


It has been my experience over the years that if you want reliability, avoid air. I have had the least problems with coil shocks, but everyone I know who owns anything air (especially with travel adjustment) has had problems. There is reliability in simplicity.


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## snow-man (Aug 19, 2004)

Excellent post MTB-Aholic :thumbsup: 

Most consumers are looking for a fork that is zero maintenance yet perfect in reliability and ride quality.
Not possible

I've had my Totem Coil for over 2 years now and absolutly love it. 
I have it tuned about once a year by my local wrench who does a sick job on it and takes the time to show it some love. In return this fork rides like no other, I weigh about 190lbs and have it on a Demo 7 which is ridden often on dry, rocky terrian locally and is treated to Whistler once a year for 4 days of harsh banging.
My wrench just installed the Enduro seals on it and I was blow away on first impression on how plush this fork feels now, plus it will be sealed up better than the stock SRAM fittings. Whistler here I come!
Show it some love from time to time and it will show you some back....


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## MTB-AHOLIC (Oct 8, 2005)

snow-man said:


> Excellent post MTB-Aholic :thumbsup:
> 
> Most consumers are looking for a fork that is zero maintenance yet perfect in reliability and ride quality.
> Not possible
> ...


Nice! yea me too..I have had a totem coil for 2 years and just got back from whistler no probs. Sending it to suspension experts in Ashville, NC for a tune up. They do a great job.


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## Demodude (Jan 27, 2007)

*Whaa?*



snow-man said:


> Excellent post MTB-Aholic :thumbsup:
> 
> Most consumers are looking for a fork that is zero maintenance yet perfect in reliability and ride quality.
> Not possible
> ...


Dude, yer 190#,,,, no way!!!!


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## Bikesair (Feb 20, 2006)

MTB-AHOLIC said:


> Lets face it we all demand a lot from our forks (bigger drops and harsher terrain then ever before). If you don't send it in for service every year or so then problems happen because the fork is designed to take a certain amount of punishment with the internal parts their designed with. Most people don't understand how complex these forks are becoming and fail to keep maintenance up on them. Its like a car...if you never get the oil changed and fail to do any maintenance on it...it will break...and you will wait. Consumers are too demanding of these products because most (including myself) don't have the tools to open one up and fix it themselves. The way to solve all of these problems for the company to simplify the design (which lowers these outrageous prices!)...so that the average joe can open it up and fix it himself (let alone the lbs...It should be like any other part on your bike) Perhaps the suspension company should send kits and directions on how to service it with the fork. This eliminates the shipping and waiting.


I totally agree. Almost every fork requires some special tool to ease maintenance. I am more than willing to tear into my shocks but not without the right tools. And do I really want to give my $600+ piece of expert engineering to a LBS dude who has barley passed calculus? Not really. With that said do they really expect us to wait two weeks for them to push new seals in with some special introducer?

If you do proprietary at least include some plastic tools (bushing press, oil syringe, IFP depth etc.) with the fork/shock so were not left dead in the water.


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## Gruntled (Jul 7, 2008)

MTB-AHOLIC said:


> \If you don't send it in for service every year or so then problems happen because the fork is designed to take a certain amount of punishment with the internal parts their designed with.....so that the average joe can open it up and fix it himself (let alone the lbs...It should be like any other part on your bike)


1. Suspension sometimes fails when it is in new condition and well within maintenance requirements for the product. For example my Totems blew after about 5 rides- brand new. I could offer many more examples. We are not discussing worn-out unserviced forks here.

2. Suspension is already pretty simple and an average Joe can open it, clean and lube it and put it back together. Take the Totem speed lube system. And even if you have to loosen TWO WHOLE BOLTS OUT of Boxxers to lube and service them, they're goddam easy too. So are 40's.

Setting things like IFP will always take a little care and knowledge, but it sure ain't rocket science for the "average Joe".


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## FA-Q (Jun 10, 2008)

*For as much as they cost, they should hold up better...*

I've got no problem with doing maintenance, I just don't want my fork to explode in between reasonable maintenance intervals, or have to deal with not being able to get parts or service for something that costs as much as these new forks. Fox are some of the most expensive forks out there, but my experience with their "service" was a joke, and I know more than one person who agrees. My bike shop guy is a great mechanic- he had to do repairs on my friend's 36 after Fox sat on it for many months and then sent it back all completely effed up and not even working! I still have and love my '06 Marz 888RC2X, (and in great shape, cause I haven't gotten to ride it as much as I want:madman: ) but I'm afraid to buy any of their new stuff- hopefully the 2010's are much better, at least the graphics aren't fugly anymore...
I keep hearing that Rockshox work great when they're actually working, and that SRAM is usually great about service and warranty, but that they explode and puke oil very often, so I sure hesitate to buy one...


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## 8664 (Oct 17, 2005)

i got a 10 totem and she works very smooth!!


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## Binford (Oct 4, 2008)

FA-Q said:


> I've got no problem with doing maintenance, I just don't want my fork to explode in between reasonable maintenance intervals, or have to deal with not being able to get parts or service for something that costs as much as these new forks. Fox are some of the most expensive forks out there, but my experience with their "service" was a joke, and I know more than one person who agrees. My bike shop guy is a great mechanic- he had to do repairs on my friend's 36 after Fox sat on it for many months and then sent it back all completely effed up and not even working! I still have and love my '06 Marz 888RC2X, (and in great shape, cause I haven't gotten to ride it as much as I want:madman: ) but I'm afraid to buy any of their new stuff- hopefully the 2010's are much better, at least the graphics aren't fugly anymore...
> I keep hearing that Rockshox work great when they're actually working, and that SRAM is usually great about service and warranty, but that they explode and puke oil very often, so I sure hesitate to buy one...


My thoughts exactly,
I have an 05 888, have only had to change the oil.

Want to buy a 180mm SC fork, but the 08 & 09 66's seem to be crap for the most part.

So I was looking at the Totem, which doesn't look so good after reading this either.

Hopefully the 2010 66's are good.
I wish I could find NOS Marzocchi, nothing else seems to last these days, at least going by the forums.


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## tombate911 (Jun 29, 2009)

Just noticed my 5 week old totem was pissing through the dials last weekend, sent the forks to my LBS and fisher sent out a cartridge, thought great managed to get the forks fixed within 24 hours, turned out the disributors has sent out a duff cartridge, the low speed adjuster wouldnt turn and the flood gate wouldnt pop up, great, waiting for the problem to be resolved, waiting till tomorrow to speek to the head mechanic who is dealing with it,

hopefully i will have them back tomorrow or beginning of next week,


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## Iggz (Nov 22, 2006)

Pull out the Mission control cartridge, take out the c-clip on the bottom, pull out the golden floodgate button and pour in 137ml of 7wt.... 

It will be buttery and no leakage


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## NorcoRider (Dec 30, 2004)

Even though it shouldn't be this way, if people are not wanting to wait the 2 weeks to get service done they should man up and buy some shaft clamps, oil, snap ring pliers some sockets and allen keys. Maybe a couple good crescent wrenches and cone wrenches as well. All of that stuff would cost about $300 max and would allow you to service any fork you have for the next ten years.


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## tombate911 (Jun 29, 2009)

Iggz said:


> Pull out the Mission control cartridge, take out the c-clip on the bottom, pull out the golden floodgate button and pour in 137ml of 7wt....
> 
> It will be buttery and no leakage


to be honest mate i cant see how that is going to help when its the o ring on the lowspeed section of the cart thats causing it to leak, will be removing the floodgate once i get these forks back and working properly anyway, will do it try and increase oil flow,


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## handsomedan (May 12, 2009)

Just wondering how you got the detent ball back in place? I noticed a little hole on the tube - can you get it in there?

Thanks!


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## handsomedan (May 12, 2009)

mr.niles said:


> last week i nailed the problem of leaky mission control dampers on my own. out of the blue my lyrik started spooging oil out of the top caps. specifically, the oil leaks out underneath the lo-spd compression knob around its shaft. so, being a mechanical dude, and wanting to use the fork during the coming weekend instead of "warranty," i dismantled the mission control. there is a snapring underneath the lo-spd knob. when you take that off you pull out a tube with a needle-like rod protruding from the bottom of the tube. on the tube there's an o-ring - this prevents oil from leaking out where the tube goes into the damper. now pull the needle-like rod out the bottom of the tube - there's a VERY small o-ring on the rod that prevents oil from leaking out the top of the tube.
> 
> so, if you look at these parts and how they interact with each other, you see that the two o-rings are what prevents oil from spewing out from under the damper knobs. if these o-rings aren't fitting tight enough you have spewage. on mine i found that the VERY small o-ring was crapped-out and loose, so i put on a SLIGHTLY thicker one to get a tighter fit, then very gently shoved the rod back into the tube. before i put on the thicker o-ring, the rod was very loose, the original o-ring clearly was not sealing. while i was at it, i lovingly cleaned and greased the oring on the tube. something i forgot - when you pull-out the tube assembly from the top of the damper, DON'T LOOSE THE LITTLE DETENT BALL! you can actually re-install the little detent ball back into place from the outside of the tube. so, i put it back together and VERY CAREFULLY measured out the exact amount of damper oil - putting in to much might be what blows the o-rings!
> 
> ...


Just wondering how you got detent ball back in place? I see a little hole in the tube, can it fit through there and into place? Thanks,


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## whoda*huck (Feb 12, 2005)

Dood, posting twice probably won't help. Don't reply to a 5 year old post and expect a quick response (if any.)


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## handsomedan (May 12, 2009)

Sorry about that, forgot the previous quote for reference the first time around and then wasn't sure how to delete… 

I figured it out. For others who are taking it apart for the first time and are momentarily stumped: save the detent ball until last (put it all together), then slide the partial ring around until you can see the hole, then line up one of the indents and push in the ball, then slide the ring around to keep the ball in place.


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