# Brightest tail lights?



## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

I see the dinotte series and this other design shine or whatever it was as being the brightest so far. Are there any challengers?


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## h79 (Jun 27, 2012)

I'll just join your question - I'm also looking for a bright tail light …


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## vapezilla (Jan 27, 2012)

I have this light and it is super bright http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1097545_-1___400159

I originally had this light which is cheaper and just as super bright to but I lost it http://www.cateye.com/en/products/detail/TL-LD1100/

Anyways regardless of which one they are retarded bright and when I did group rides people behind me would ***** about them being way to bright

Anyways I chose the light and motion to replace the Cateye as I liked the design and how it mounts I did just find my Cateye a few weeks after I got the light and motion and I will compare brightness and get back but just to let you know out of every cyclist I have ever seen I have yet to see a light brighter then these 2 they are super bright


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## jhobert (Feb 1, 2012)

Im using the Cygolite Hotshot, I can't say that its the brightest but I'm sure its a contender plus its not as expensive as the others and not to mention built in rechargeable battery. 

Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using Tapatalk


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## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

Those aren't bright at all. I'm talking about a whole different class of light.


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## vapezilla (Jan 27, 2012)

Well i have seen the new dinotte the one that is one peice and it was just as bright as my light and motion so I went with the light and motion because it was half the price and seemed same in build quality beleive me I'm no penny pincher I only buy based on build quality


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

aBicycle said:


> Those aren't bright at all. I'm talking about a whole different class of light.


Well pretty much I think you had it nailed with your OP. Those are probably the brightest.
The RedZone 4 might come close to the output of a Dinotte 300R but I can't say for sure. Regardless, nothing is going to beat the Designshine.

As far as lesser self-contained rear lights go I'm glad to hear that more manufacturers are using brighter LED's. If the L&M Vis series has gotten brighter I might want to see if I can check one out. Currently my favorite is the Moon Shield. While probably not as bright as the DiNotte, it is smaller, cost about a fourth as much and has a very nice output and beam pattern. The Cygolite Hotshot is about as bright as the Shield but doesn't have the beam spread of the Shield. If Cygolite ever fixes that I would favor the HotShot. In the mean time I feel very safe using the Shield. The output is awesome and more than enough to satisfy my personal needs.

When it comes to rear lights more light is always welcome. More light though means more power drain. If you're looking for something capable of outputting over 200 lumen
it will have to have a much bigger footprint or use external batteries if it is to have any decent amount of run time. So far that's not something I'm willing to deal with.


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## rovert (Jul 13, 2004)

^ Can you tell me where I can purchase the Moon Shield? I have searched it on eBay and found a place in the UK to purchase from for around $50-$60. Are there any other places?


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

aBicycle said:


> Those aren't bright at all. I'm talking about a whole different class of light.


Agree. Admittedly I have only used my Dinotte 400R a few times at night, but have not had any complaints. I still need to get a 300R (someday). Dealing with the battery gets tiresome, as I use it mostly for pre-dawn road training rides, which also routes through 45mph mountain summit twin tunnels.

I like Dinotte's reliability, so am not looking for magic in my shine.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

rovert said:


> ^ Can you tell me where I can purchase the Moon Shield? I have searched it on eBay and found a place in the UK to purchase from for around $50-$60. Are there any other places?


I bought mine from the "Wheelies" UK vendor on e-bay. It only took about 5-6 days. The only problem I had was that I broke the clip on mine. When I tried to e-mail the vendor I never got a response

The Moon Shield has a sister product, the Serfas TL-60 which is almost identical to the Shield. The only difference being the menu. The shield has three steady modes ( L-M-H ) and two flash modes ( L-fast strobe, H-flash ) I consider the L-fast strobe useless. All other modes are fine. The TL-60 has 2 steady modes ( L-H ) and two flash modes ( L-H ) 
I really can't say which one is better but I'm very happy with the Shield. If you get one though don't try to use it with just the clip. The clip is very thin and brittle. As long as you use the included rubber mount you are fine.


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## Climber25 (Dec 19, 2006)

Exposure Lights will be introducing a new rear taillight for 2013 called the Blaze in the next couple of weeks. Stay tuned. :thumbsup:


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## mechBgon (Jan 28, 2007)

aBicycle said:


> Those aren't bright at all. I'm talking about a whole different class of light.


The Hotshot's on-axis intensity is higher than a DiNotte 300R, if you weren't aware of that. Of the existing DiNotte line, I believe the 140R still has the highest centerline intensity; it was demonstrably higher than my 300R (beamshots available if you want). I gave the 140 away after getting the 300R, and sold the 300R on Ebay after getting a couple Hotshots. They're all good lights, but the price/performance/weight mix of the Hotshot is really attractive.

I have a RZ4 too. It puts out a lot of light on maximum, and has a very eye-catching quad-burst strobe pattern as the default, but spreads the light across an extremely wide area, so I think it's at its best in a city environment where side visibility is quite valuable. The superwide pattern does create a serious ground-effect behind the bike on dry surfaces in the dark.


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## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

mechBgon said:


> The Hotshot's on-axis intensity is higher than a DiNotte 300R, if you weren't aware of that. Of the existing DiNotte line, I believe the 140R still has the highest centerline intensity; it was demonstrably higher than my 300R (beamshots available if you want). I gave the 140 away after getting the 300R, and sold the 300R on Ebay after getting a couple Hotshots. They're all good lights, but the price/performance/weight mix of the Hotshot is really attractive.
> 
> I have a RZ4 too. It puts out a lot of light on maximum, and has a very eye-catching quad-burst strobe pattern as the default, but spreads the light across an extremely wide area, so I think it's at its best in a city environment where side visibility is quite valuable. The superwide pattern does create a serious ground-effect behind the bike on dry surfaces in the dark.


Ever tried a 400r?


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

mechBgon said:


> The Hotshot's on-axis intensity is higher than a DiNotte 300R, if you weren't aware of that. Of the existing DiNotte line, I believe the 140R still has the highest centerline intensity; it was demonstrably higher than my 300R (beamshots available if you want). I gave the 140 away after getting the 300R, and sold the 300R on Ebay after getting a couple Hotshots. They're all good lights, but the price/performance/weight mix of the Hotshot is really attractive.
> 
> I have a RZ4 too. It puts out a lot of light on maximum, and has a very eye-catching quad-burst strobe pattern as the default, but spreads the light across an extremely wide area, so I think it's at its best in a city environment where side visibility is quite valuable. The superwide pattern does create a serious ground-effect behind the bike on dry surfaces in the dark.


Mech I have to agree with almost all your observations. I looked at some of those youtube videos you've done and they are spot on. The Hotshot is a gem of a rear light. Like you said though it is very intense when viewed on axis. That's the issue though, not all roads are straight. That being the case I feel you are better served having at least one light that provides a wider beam. On the other hand I think the RZ4 might have over-done the omni-directional issue a bit in their attempt to cover all the bases. As such it is not as intense as I would have hoped when viewed on axis. Regardless I'd rather have a RZ4 on my seat post simply because I feel it will be seen from wider angles better. Now if the Hot Shot comes out with a wider lens ( similar to a Moon Shield ) I will get a new one right away.

I think the main reason people gravitate towards a light like the DesignShine or the DiNotte 300R / 400R is that they want something bright enough to draw attention during the day. My way of handling that problem is to use an amber light on the rear of the bike. Something in the range of 300 lumen or more should do the trick. In the mean time I think that the current crop of rear led lights is doing very well to alert motorist of the presence of cyclist at dusk or at night. One on the seat post and one on the helmet seems to cover all the bases.

Last but not least, the Hot Shot has a feature that allows you to adjust the output on the steady mode to super low in case you want to ride with a group and not blind or annoy your fellow riders.


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## mechBgon (Jan 28, 2007)

aBicycle said:


> Ever tried a 400r?


Not in person, but a BikeForums member confirms that his Hotshot's direct beam is brighter than his 400R. DiNotte themselves say that the 400R is only a little brighter than the 300R. DiNotte canned their top taillight a few years ago, a red version of their 600L headlight. Now THAT I would've liked to see. They called it the XLS. Quote: "This is not for the faint of heart!! Please use responsibly."

The downside is that the Hotshot is very focused, so aiming it properly is really important, whereas the DiNottes have a very wide beam and aim's not critical. Some people also like the larger physical size of the DiNottes, on the grounds that a larger target may be easier to notice. If you're a fan of DiNottes, the 300R is your best bet, I think... less weight than a 140R, bright enough for daytime visibility, easier to move from bike to bike than a 140 or a 400, and I think they lowered the price since I bought mine.

If you want something beyond the norm, the DesignShine does look great. Here's a comparison video between the DesignShine and a DiNotte 400R: DiNotte 400R and DesignShine DS-500 Comparision 1 - YouTube



> That's the issue though, not all roads are straight.


In my various favorite routes, there aren't many places where this could actually matter. At 500 meters, a 10-degree beam is about 85 meters wide. A road with a sufficiently-tight sweep that the viewer is outside the hot spot until panic range, and yet not obstructed from seeing me by a hill or building... nothing's coming to mind here. I think a better argument for wide beams is the one NiteFlux uses... someone in an adjacent lane at very close range, in a visually "noisy" environment, could conceivably miss a light with a narrow beam. But I'm reaching a bit, since I personally find strobing lights catch my eye very well, and particularly in peripheral vision.



> Now if the Hot Shot comes out with a wider lens ( similar to a Moon Shield ) I will get a new one right away.


Well, there's the NiteRider Solas coming out, looks like a Hotshot-alike but with the rippled beamspreader from their Cherry Bomb. I think these are supposed to be out in a month or two.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I was looking the other night on Youtube and found a video of a guy from Texas who had a DiNotte 300R on a recumberant. He was comparing it to his previous Cateye rear light which I thought was doing a very good job. It turned out that the 300R thru most of the video was pointed somewhat *downward. ( * He said he does this so it doesn't blind on coming traffic... ) ( **tell me this guy doesn't look like he could be G. Bush's brother... )

Afterward he points it upward and there is a world of difference. The mixed pulsed flash/steady on the 300R is a nice setting and is very "attention getting", IMO. If the 300R wasn't so expensive I might have considered buying one. I sure would like to see a comparison of the 300R to the Moon Shield.


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## mechBgon (Jan 28, 2007)

Cat-man-do said:


> I was looking the other night on Youtube and found a video of a guy from Texas who had a DiNotte 300R on a recumberant. He was comparing it to his previous Cateye rear light which I thought was doing a very good job. It turned out that the 300R thru most of the video was pointed somewhat *downward. ( * He said he does this so it doesn't blind on coming traffic... ) ( **tell me this guy doesn't look like he could be G. Bush's brother... )
> 
> Afterward he points it upward and there is a world of difference. The mixed pulsed flash/steady on the 300R is a nice setting and is very "attention getting", IMO. If the 300R wasn't so expensive I might have considered buying one. I sure would like to see a comparison of the 300R to the Moon Shield.


The 300R's beam pattern is a massive flood, so he must've had it aimed REALLY badly.










As for blinding traffic, my DiNottes, my Hotshot and my Nova BULL emergency-vehicle strobe have all gotten unsolicited praise from motorists. They like me showing up well and from long distances, is the general theme.


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## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

The 400r is about 250 lumens if anyone is wondering.


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## OldAusDigger (Apr 8, 2008)

Climber25 said:


> Exposure Lights will be introducing a new rear taillight for 2013 called the Blaze in the next couple of weeks. Stay tuned. :thumbsup:


Do you know any more details yet?
I hope Exposure review their pricing for 2013. They make really good stuff, but I don't think people really want to pay such a premium for their exquisit machining etc. Most people who want to throw their dollar at the high end of the market want performance!
If I payed three times as much on a tail light as I did on say a Moon Shield, I'd expect it to be at least three times as powerful.


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## OldAusDigger (Apr 8, 2008)

I just remembered that there was a guy here on mbtr a few years back that made a 750 lumen tail light. 
I think he went by the name of "Hahntronix" or something similar to that.
Can anyone remember the details?


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## pethelman (Feb 26, 2011)

mechBgon said:


> Not in person, but a BikeForums member confirms that his Hotshot's direct beam is brighter than his 400R. DiNotte themselves say that the 400R is only a little brighter than the 300R. DiNotte canned their top taillight a few years ago, a red version of their 600L headlight.


Another interesting taillight "intensity comparison" video on youtube:
DesignShine DS-500 versus various - YouTube


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

Cat-man-do said:


> I was looking the other night on Youtube and found a video of a guy from Texas who had a DiNotte 300R on a recumberant.


Thanks for the great vid.

You might recall there was a discussion a few weeks ago concerning the efficacy of Dinotte's Flash mode, where the light goes into an "ultra low power setting" keeping the light on between strobes.

That video corresponds with my visual sense that as a single rear light user, the Dinotte feature of a strobe mode which does not blink completely off, has some definite advantages.

ymmv


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## pethelman (Feb 26, 2011)

pigmode said:


> Thanks for the great vid.
> 
> You might recall there was a discussion a few weeks ago concerning the efficacy of Dinotte's Flash mode, where the light goes into an "ultra low power setting" keeping the light on between strobes.
> 
> ...


Very true... steady on with slightly higher power "pulsing" at night is good to help garner attention but not totally destroy depth perception.

In the day, however, on/off flashing is preferable, at least to my eyes.


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

pethelman said:


> Very true... steady on with slightly higher power "pulsing" at night is good to help garner attention but not totally destroy depth perception.
> 
> *In the day, however, on/off flashing is preferable, at least to my eyes.*


Very good point in regards to daylight use. :thumbs up:

I would guess another potential advantage of "steady on" flash mode would be a lessoning of the disorienting effect often attributed to strobe lights. I continue to be impressed with the thought and care put into the Dinotte design.


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## pethelman (Feb 26, 2011)

pigmode said:


> Very good point in regards to daylight use. :thumbs up:
> 
> I would guess another potential advantage of "steady on" flash mode would be a lessoning of the disorienting effect often attributed to strobe lights. I continue to be impressed with the thought and care put into the Dinotte design.


I agree. Dinotte is definitely one of the pioneers in the bike lighting world... to be commended at every level.

With the new customizable flash modes available in the latest version of the TaskLED family of drivers, I'm finally able to do something similar. Optimized patterns for day and night in the same light. Here's a short video showing the default standards that I came up with, but the firmware allows the end user to define a flash pattern however they like.

DesignShine_Flash_Patterns.mp4 - YouTube


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## MS150Rider66 (Feb 10, 2010)

Cat-man-do said:


> Mech I have to agree with almost all your observations. I looked at some of those youtube videos you've done and they are spot on. The Hotshot is a gem of a rear light. Like you said though it is very intense when viewed on axis. That's the issue though, not all roads are straight. That being the case I feel you are better served having at least one light that provides a wider beam. On the other hand I think the RZ4 might have over-done the omni-directional issue a bit in their attempt to cover all the bases. As such it is not as intense as I would have hoped when viewed on axis. Regardless I'd rather have a RZ4 on my seat post simply because I feel it will be seen from wider angles better. Now if the Hot Shot comes out with a wider lens ( similar to a Moon Shield ) I will get a new one right away.
> 
> I think the main reason people gravitate towards a light like the DesignShine or the DiNotte 300R / 400R is that they want something bright enough to draw attention during the day. My way of handling that problem is to use an amber light on the rear of the bike. Something in the range of 300 lumen or more should do the trick. In the mean time I think that the current crop of rear led lights is doing very well to alert motorist of the presence of cyclist at dusk or at night. One on the seat post and one on the helmet seems to cover all the bases.
> 
> Last but not least, the Hot Shot has a feature that allows you to adjust the output on the steady mode to super low in case you want to ride with a group and not blind or annoy your fellow riders.


 I went out on a road bike group ride with my LBS guy and the all complained about my DesignShine 500 blinding them. I pulled over and used the supplied allen wrench and aimed it to the ground and was very visible to motorist. got compliments from drivers also saying they looked cool hitting the pavement.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

MS150Rider66 said:


> I went out on a road bike group ride with my LBS guy and the all complained about my DesignShine 500 blinding them. I pulled over and used the supplied allen wrench and aimed it to the ground and was very visible to motorist. got compliments from drivers also saying they looked cool hitting the pavement.


No, you don't use a lamp like the D-shine 500 for group rides. For group rides you need a rear light that can be operated at a very,very low level. Even the new self-contained lights ( 1-2 watts )are too much to deal with if you are following someone very closely. Right now the only rear light I have that could be used for a group ride is the cheap D/X frog type light ( coin cell battery ) or the Cygolite Hotshot ( which in the last mode ( steady ) can be adjusted ( +/- ) for brightness ( zero to max intensity ).

As long as you stay with the group your ( low level ) rear lamp should be enough to get you seen. That said, be sure to only use a low "steady mode" or an extremely slow/dim flash. The Hotshot can operated in extremely slow flash but it is still bright when in that mode. Aim it down and it should be fine. For added safety wear some reflective clothing.

Okay to operate a brighter rear light as long you are bringing up the rear. :thumbsup:


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## MS150Rider66 (Feb 10, 2010)

Cat-man-do said:


> No, you don't use a lamp like the D-shine 500 for group rides. For group rides you need a rear light that can be operated at a very,very low level. Even the new self-contained lights ( 1-2 watts )are too much to deal with if you are following someone very closely. Right now the only rear light I have that could be used for a group ride is the cheap D/X frog type light ( coin cell battery ) or the Cygolite Hotshot ( which in the last mode ( steady ) can be adjusted ( +/- ) for brightness ( zero to max intensity ).
> 
> As long as you stay with the group your ( low level ) rear lamp should be enough to get you seen. That said, be sure to only use a low "steady mode" or an extremely slow/dim flash. The Hotshot can operated in extremely slow flash but it is still bright when in that mode. Aim it down and it should be fine. For added safety wear some reflective clothing.
> 
> Okay to operate a brighter rear light as long you are bringing up the rear. :thumbsup:


 Yes,I agree it is very bright on low. But that was my first group ride and my LBS Shop owner who is a good friend has been wanting me to try it out. And at that time I had gotten the lights, so I tried them on the ride and soon changed the angle. But I was the newbie slowest and stood in the rear to mark the group ride. I kept the 80 lumen Serfas for my helmet,so I guess too bright...what about the Blackburn Flea on the helmet? too much for group ride?


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## rearviewmirror (Jun 14, 2006)

I have a 400R, it's the brightest I've ever seen. As others have posted though, it's too bright for group rides. I wish DiNotte would offer two things, a lower power setting and/or a quick release type bracket so the angle can be changed with a push of a button. It's still plenty bright being angle toward the ground, and in this configuration it's not offensive to other cyclists in the group. Because neither of the options I've posted is available, I've gone back to using a Planet Bike Superflash on the seat post and helmet, while the 400R is sitting in a box at home. I may put it on my commuter one day, it too uses Superflash, which for all intents, is awesome taillight that just works.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

I'm just glad I don't do group rides. If I did though I have something that would work. Once again a low, low output rear light and reflective bits on the clothing for group night rides. If I ever did go on a group night ride and saw people using the super bright rear lights I think I'd just forgo group night rides after that. It's one thing to discuss something on a forum but it's another if you try to politely tell someone face to face that their rear light is too bright for the group ride. Sometimes people who are confronted face to face take offense and cop an attitude when they're told they're doing something that is not such a good idea. :nonod:

I think most people know that when you're in a group that you have to consider the group dynamic. Nice to have bright lights ( front or back ) but in a group ( because people can be right behind you ) you don't want to cast shadows with too bright a front light or blind people right behind you with too bright a rear light.


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

Why do people use taillights on group trail rides anyway. We all have head lamps on group trail rides. I can clearly see you. Hell, with the current crop of super bright cheap lights, it's getting brighter than day time out there at night. 
I find the tail lights distracting regardless of brightness. Simply not needed.


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

^ I assumed these group rides are being conducted on the road.


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## Cat-man-do (May 16, 2004)

Yes, pretty much talking about the road. 

And speaking of such, last night I saw something driving home late at night that I almost couldn't believe. I got passed on a lonely stretch of highway by an 18-wheeler
that had a display of rear red led lights that I couldn't believe. The guy had three complete ( end to end ) rows of very bright Red led lights on back of his trailer. One complete row on the very top and two complete rows on the bottom. When he first passed me he got right in front of me for a moment. When that happened I was like, "WTF"! No way I would of been able to follow closely behind something that bright shining in my face for any amount of time! Thankfully he was moving at a good clip and was soon down the road beyond my "Major Annoyance" range. If I had to sit behind something like that in stop and go traffic ( at night ) I think I would have to pull off the road...seriously. I can't believe that it is even legal to do something like that. I've seen bright rear lights on trucks before but NOTHING like what I saw last night. Un-Freaking-believable ! :eekster: :bluefrown:

(**note, I was going to take of picture of the display with my phone camera but he was moving fast that I had no desire to try to catch up on a section of highway that I knew was heavily enforced with radar.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

I am not saying anything other than I rock an RZ4 carbon on all my bikes day and night


I have owned a bunch before landing on the RZ4. 
------------------------------------------------------
solid high in day, solid low or medium at night

and you can see me from miles away daytime or nighttime and side visibility is unmatched 

in fact you can see me coming from the front very easily...two slivers of bright light that keep expanding as you get closer and into the field of view

-------------
are there brighter tails, yes

do you need brighter tails, not in my testing

is the RZ4 style and build absolute genius ? YES

mounting is the best of anything ever
integrated 18650 makes a tidy small light

silicone lens and diffuser sounds whacked on paper but in real world use visibility is off the charts

super easy to charge, immune to water and mud. this thing is absolutely the pinnacle of taillights. 

one little spray of silicone lube on the charging end and I can pop it on and off with a simple push of my thumb. the ends are easy to remove if you push up...almost impossible if you pull. I lubed it once when I got it, have not needed to re-apply it yet. that is about 80 charges and 100 rides so far


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

In the real world, how long does the charge last on the rz4


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

I still can do 4hr rides with an RZ8 at high power flash.


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## Old Ray (Sep 5, 2010)

I'm pretty happy with my USB-chargeble, $35 Origin8 tail light. It puts out a claimed 60 lumens on high power, and I believe it. I use it in flash mode, as the 'strobe' mode looks like a seizure-producer, for sure. 

My night rides are usually between 2-3 hours in length, and there have been times when I have not charged the light between rides, but it has still performed at the high setting in flash mode without running low.

The rubber-band attachment has worked well over around 200 cycles of on/off the bike. So, for 35 bucks, it is IMO a good deal and provides all the tail illumination I need on the road.


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## car bone (Apr 15, 2011)

Anyone tried the new Dinotte quads yet?? Seems to have good battery life and juice.


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## Gharddog03 (Sep 25, 2013)

Finally got a hold of one. Let me tell you this is top notch quality. Stephen created a bad ass light. Tests to follow along with siome vids. I will also compare it to my dinotte daytime.


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## johnD (Mar 31, 2010)

Gharddog03 said:


> Finally got a hold of one. Let me tell you this is top notch quality. Stephen created a bad ass light. Tests to follow along with siome vids. I will also compare it to my dinotte daytime.


what are we looking at here ?


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## Gharddog03 (Sep 25, 2013)

http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-night-riding/designshine-938171.html


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

rupps5 said:


> In the real world, how long does the charge last on the rz4


I am getting over 6 hours (two 3 hour rides) on medium solid mode on rz4 carbon.


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## johnD (Mar 31, 2010)

Very nice !


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## pigmode (Nov 15, 2009)

car bone said:


> Anyone tried the new Dinotte quads yet?? Seems to have good battery life and juice.


Has the Quad superseded the 300R? Did a quick look checking for re-sale pricing, and didn't see the 300R.


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## car bone (Apr 15, 2011)

I think they are phasing out the old models and maybe will have one low end and one high end with separate battery. Looks like that at least. Their site really sucks too so you may have to click around to to get to see everything that they actually sell. I had to at least.


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