# Ghost drops at REI...discuss



## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

GHOST Riot 7 LC 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com

Pretty well speck'd, but I would have thought they would have 1x version. Looks like they have a good assortment hitting most price points.


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## Finch Platte (Nov 14, 2003)

Wow, that's pretty pricey, even by REI standards.

Never heard of Ghost. Guess I'm out of the loop. I'd wait until closeout time, I'm thinking they'll have plenty of these to off.

Or wait until their used gear sale. You'll be able to get one with shredded tires, a worn seat, a blown fork and a tired drivetrain for$175.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Yeah, they are a brand from Germany and REI has the exclusive here in the US.


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## Ronnie (Jan 17, 2004)

Ghost Bikes is a German based company and are fairly popular in Europe. I knew a few guys who rode them when I lived in Switzerland and they are pretty good.


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## Magnum Ti (Jun 30, 2011)

While I love stuff from Germany and from REI, I bet they sell "0" of them. Poor buying decision from REI. Sell a hefty priced bike that no one state side has heard about or rarely ridden..hmm


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

I think you're wrong Magnum. "0" is a pretty bold statement. They may not sell a bunch of the high end stuff, but they will sell lot of the lower end offerings, no doubt. I think it was smart of Ghost to partner with a retailer with retail outlets across the US. Plus there's always the dividend you get when you buy.


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## Tribble Me (Aug 27, 2012)

I was talking to one of the REI bike shop managers about Ghost and he was very excited about them. He said that one reason that REI wanted Ghost was that Ghost would allow them to ship to online purchasers directly and you would not have to pick it up at a store. Apparently none of the other major manufacturers will allow the direct to customer shipping. That really expands REI's sales areas.

I was in the Salt Lake store earlier this week and they have some in and they look pretty well equipped. The generous REI return policy will also be a big factor in the sale of these bikes. If I were looking for a new bike now I would certainly look hard at Ghost.


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## Magnum Ti (Jun 30, 2011)

I have nothing wrong with either company, but if the bikes are not in the stores..everyone here always says "ride before you buy". I don't have 5k to sink into a bike that I may like.


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## Thatshowiroll (Jan 30, 2009)

Here in Canada, Mountain Equipment Co-op has been selling them for a couple years. Don't know anyone who rides one, but they look nice.


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## 70sSanO (Nov 20, 2013)

I have to give REI some props for showing a weight... 26-1/4 lbs.

I don't ride FS, I think HT bikes in the $5K range are sub 20lbs.

Is that good for a FS in that price range?

Just wondering.

John


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## Finch Platte (Nov 14, 2003)

70sSanO said:


> I have to give REI some props for showing a weight... 26-1/4 lbs.
> 
> I don't ride FS, I think HT bikes in the $5K range are sub 20lbs.
> 
> ...


Ah, hell yeah. My FS Enduro weighs 34 lbs with a full water bottle.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

Magnum Ti said:


> I have nothing wrong with either company, but if the bikes are not in the stores..everyone here always says "ride before you buy". I don't have 5k to sink into a bike that I may like.


REI has a pretty amazing return policy. They'll literally take anything back at any time. That alone might get me to gamble on a brand I've never heard of, even with no test ride. 
Ride it. 
Hate it? 
Drop it off at any REI in America and say you're not satisfied. Done.

Try that at your LBS.

I don't spend a lot of money at REI because they just don't have stuff I want, but I can't deny this might make me consider it.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

ARandomBiker said:


> REI has a pretty amazing return policy. They'll literally take anything back at any time. That alone might get me to gamble on a brand I've never heard of, even with no test ride.
> Ride it.
> Hate it?
> Drop it off at any REI in America and say you're not satisfied. Done.
> ...


Exactly. You might even realize that REI has a great shop in your town.


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## Zomby Woof (MCM700) (May 23, 2004)

They just opened up a new REI 10 min from me. I went to their grand opening. I got a free Camelback water bottle. I saw the Ghosts there. They look like a very nice bike. But I'm not looking for a new bike as I just got one last Oct.


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## Finch Platte (Nov 14, 2003)

Zomby Woof (MCM700) said:


> They just opened up a new REI 10 min from me. I went to their grand opening. I got a free Camelback water bottle. I saw the Ghosts there. They look like a very nice bike. But I'm not looking for a new bike as I just got one last Oct.


Time to upgrade, it's the American way!


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## Bro (Dec 20, 2010)

Magnum Ti said:


> I have nothing wrong with either company, but if the bikes are not in the stores..everyone here always says "ride before you buy". I don't have 5k to sink into a bike that I may like.


At the two REIs that I regularly visit, there are dozens of bikes hanging above the aisle by the bike shop. More bikes on floor racks too. I'd be very surprised if they didn't keep a few Ghosts in the store. As for test riding, they only allow a parking lot ride, but REI has many loyal shoppers who wouldn't mind dropping $$$$ on a bike there. Heck, REI already deals Cannondales. I don't remember seeing any bikes from the higher ends of the Cannondale ranges in store, but it's possible to order a SuperSix Evo with SRAM Red (ProTour bike) on the REI website.

And for members, that 10% dividend is a really good deal for a brand-new top-line bike. You get $500 back on a $5k bike, and you can take that in cold cash if you want.


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## Spec7 (May 3, 2000)

Just a note on REI's return policy, it was changed a couple of years ago to 1 year for returns. They still cover manufacturer defect without time limitation, but their previous policy of return it any time for any reason got axed. Seems that there were lots of people abusing ther really generous return policy. 

That said, I've had my eye on Ghost and Cube bikes for a few years. I'm glad I'll finally get to see one of them in person.


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## Zomby Woof (MCM700) (May 23, 2004)

Finch Platte said:


> Time to upgrade, it's the American way!


I upgraded from my 15 y.o. Cannondale to a 2015 Cannondale.


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## formica (Jul 4, 2004)

Spec7 said:


> Seems that there were lots of people abusing ther really generous return policy.
> .


That is an understatement.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Spec7 said:


> Seems that there were lots of people abusing ther really generous return policy.


Return Every Item.

yeah, people abuse it like crazy. I have heard of people buying hiking boots, wearing them for hundreds of miles until there is no tread left, then returning them for a full refund several years later claiming they were not comfortable, then use the refund to buy a new pair of the same boots. I guess they had to crack down on that.

there's zero risk in buying a bike that is the wrong size or does not suit your needs from REI. return it within a reasonable amount of time and buy something else.

my only concern with Ghost and a few other brands is that they are willing to send bikes direct to customers and 95% of the public does not know how to properly assemble and tune a bike. so after they slap it together and promptly shift the read derailleur into the spokes, they can return it as "defective." selling bikes online where it's so easy to return them could end up biting REI in the ass.

I have seen a few Ghosts and they look pretty solid. full XT kits, including hubs, on many of the bikes. good value. my only complaint is that the middle-range bikes ought to have a thru-axle fork for the price of those models.

you are probably not going to see any of the high-end Ghost models in any stores, but the low- mid-range bikes should give you an idea of how they fit you you can check one out and order something nicer. if you really look around in an REI store, none of their bikes are "high-end." my local REIs rarely have any bikes that cost over $1200.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Any bike you buy from REI will be professionally built. REI's distribution center has a whole area just for the professional building of bikes then they are re-boxed in larger boxes and then adjusted again at the individual store they are shipped to. Bikes ordered online can be shipped to a store for free. No customer will put together their own bike. The most is put the front wheel and bars on.

And yes the higher end models will be in stores. This one here is in the Ft. Collins store right now.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

Spec7 said:


> Just a note on REI's return policy, it was changed a couple of years ago to 1 year for returns. They still cover manufacturer defect without time limitation, but their previous policy of return it any time for any reason got axed. Seems that there were lots of people abusing ther really generous return policy.


I actually can't be upset about that. Abuse is a pretty gross understatement. I've even been guilty of it in a way. I bought a framed backpacking backpack, wore it once, loved it but always wished it was a little bigger volume. It hung on a wall hook for 2 years, used twice, I ended up taking it back after just over 2.5 years post purchase. They were not impressed, but gave me credit.

That said, I'd have no hesitation taking back a $2-5k bike if after a few weeks (2-3?) it wasn't working out like I wanted it to.


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## Magnum Ti (Jun 30, 2011)

Guess you all have bigger REI's out west. Here in Maryland they tend to be on the smaller side with a scaled down bike section.


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## Sunnyb (Nov 9, 2011)

Hi All;
I am in the market for a "beginner" mountain bike and test rode the Ghost Lanao 3 (size small) and a Cannondale Tango (x-small) on Saturday. The Ghost specs are very similar to the Cannondale. The salesperson said that the derailleur on the ghost is a little nicer than the one on the cannondale. I like the Ghost but am hesitant since they are new to this market. What do you think?
Thanks in advance for your opinion.


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## Bro (Dec 20, 2010)

Ghost isn't new to the market at all. They're an established German brand that, until they distributed with REI, was only in the European market. 

That said, the dérailleur is one of the last things that I would look at when comparing bikes. How do the forks/suspension compare? Wheels? Brakes? Cockpit -- do they use house-brand stuff or is it established quality components? What about the shifters? The dérailleurs will nearly always be spec'd at a different level than the shifters because that's cheaper for the manufacturer to do. The shifters are the ones doing the actual shifting, so you should compare those, rather than the dérailleurs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

Sunnyb said:


> Hi All;
> I am in the market for a "beginner" mountain bike and test rode the Ghost Lanao 3 (size small) and a Cannondale Lexi (x-small) on Saturday.


so far as I can tell, the Lexi is a full-suspension bike (front and rear suspension) and the Lanao is a hardtail (front suspension only). is that correct or is there a Lexi bike that I can't find on Cannondale's website?

these are very different bikes that will accommodate different riding styles for different riders. they are not apples and oranges. you have to ask yourself- hardtail or full suspension? that is a topic for a whole other thread because it's not a question specific to Ghost or Cannondale.

I would not let the "new" status of Ghost in the American market stop you. the usefulness of a specific style of bike for your needs is the question to ask.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

Sunnyb said:


> Hi All;
> The salesperson said that the derailleur on the ghost is a little nicer than the one on the cannondale.


Yep, that sounds just like almost every REI. Attempting to sell a bike based on essentially disposable 'bling' parts that have buzz-words attached to them, while totally ignoring the big-ticket questions like frame construction, fork and wheels. Nevermind they're totally different bikes built for totally different purposes.

I bet if you were looking at a jacket, he'd have pointed out the zipper pulls and ignored the type of insulation.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

ARandomBiker said:


> Yep, that sounds just like almost every BIKE SHOP. Attempting to sell a bike based on essentially disposable 'bling' parts that have buzz-words attached to them


fixed. Not all REI stores are like that, although most of the staff is there to sell memberships and are not cyclists and not trained to sell bikes. An awful lot of independent bikes shop are similarly under-staffed. I have a hundred stories about the stuff I have seen going on at LBS locations and at big stores like Performance.


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## Sunnyb (Nov 9, 2011)

Thanks for the reply Bro! What I meant was that Ghost is new to the American market. The forks are the same wheels are comparable. I'll check the brakes & shifters to see how they compare. I'm new to this so I don't always know what I'm looking at brand-wise.


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## Sunnyb (Nov 9, 2011)

You're right mack_turtle, I'm stuck on it. I tried the Lexi, but the xs standover was too tall. I wasn't in the market for full suspension but it was a REALLY NICE bike on a killer closeout deal!!

What I'm looking for is a hardtail w/ 27.5's. Right now it's between the Cannondale Tango 4 ( Tango 4 - TANGO - MOUNTAIN - WOMEN'S - BIKES - 2015 )and the Ghost Lanao 3 ( GHOST Lanao 3 27.5 Women's Bike - 2015 - REI.com ). $50 difference between the 2 and specs look similar, but I'm new to this so I'm not familiar with all of the different brands of components.

I'm going to go ride them both tonight in the same size. The xs in the Ghost hadn't been built so I tested the small.

What are your thoughts on the Cannondale Tango 4?

Thanks for your input!


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

brakes and shifters are not the issue. that's like shopping for a car and choosing between a pickup truck and a sedan based on what the horn sounds like. the issue is: _do you want a full-suspension bike or a hardtail_?

don't get too caught up in the details. any bikes in the same price range are going to have similar quality components, except when it comes to hardtail vs full-suspension. a FS bike is typically going to cost twice what a similarly-equipped hardtail would. ride several bikes and choose based on which one fits you best and is most comfortable to ride and control.

the salesperson (some bicycle salespeople at REI don't know a headset from a bottom bracket) will pick up on what they hear from the true bike nerds and go on and on about a specific component because it makes them sound smart. when you go in, ask if anyone on the sales staff is an avid mountain biker. pull the mechanic out of the shop if necessary and ask him/her to assess a bike based on what best suits you, your fitness and ability, and your budget.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

based on the components alone, I would go with the Lanao. I am a big fan of Shimano brakes (shimano > all when it comes to hydraulics) and those cheesy Hayes Dyno brakes would be a deal breaker for me. the rest of the components on the Lanao are a step above everything on that Cannondale. however, in the end, what matters is which bike is comfortable and controllable for you!

I checked, and if you're an REI member who just got a 20% off coupon with your dividend, the coupon does NOT apply to Ghost and Cannondale bikes.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

also, standover is almost irrelevant on mountain bikes. you should be able to straddle the middle of top tube without touching it. other than that, REACH is everything. how tall are you?


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## Sunnyb (Nov 9, 2011)

The problem with the Lexis was that I couldn't clear the top tube. It was too tall. I'm 5'2" (inseam 28"). Standover on the Lexi is 28.7. 

Thank you so much for all of your advice and for checking on the coupon. I figured there'd be some caveat w/ bikes and bigger ticket items.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

In that case, yeah, standover is an issue. I would spring for tye Ghost in that case.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

mack_turtle said:


> fixed. {RE: bike shops}


I'm not trying to be contentious, I think we're saying the same thing- REI staff don't know jack when it comes to bikes and what matters. They're employed to sell memberships, and promote the 'lifestyle' of faux-adventure. That said, I've not had the same experience with bike shops- most shops in my area know their stuff, they just do their best to upsell the **** out of everything. Mavic wheels? Why? You want ENVE. It gets old, but at least they know that wheels matter and Derailleurs don't.



Sunnyb said:


> The problem with the Lexis was that I couldn't clear the top tube. It was too tall. I'm 5'2" (inseam 28"). Standover on the Lexi is 28.7.


That's a solid reason to pass on the C'Dale. I briefly had a bike with a standover that was about 1/2 less than my inseam. "the boys" rested on the toptube when standing flatfooted. (Over-share, I know) It made me a timid rider and I never got comfortable on the bike. I ended up taking a financial hit on it to get a bike that fit.
Good call on your part to have the foresight to recognize this.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

You guys, c'mon, you cannot generalize so much about REI staff. I've worked at REI on and off several times over a 20 year period and I have found incredibly knowledgable people working in the bike shops. Don't generalize! I am sure the most in tune customers can "school" any sales person at any bike shop.

REI doesn't just hire shills to sell memberships. Yes, that's a requirement, but first and foremost they want employees who have a passion for the outdoors, whatever that may be...camping, cycling, climbing...etc.

There is NO other store that will replace a whole bike because of a cracked frame (Cannondale), let you ride a bike or use any other item for a year to decide if it works for you and return it if it doesn't.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

While your experience has not been parallel with mine, maybe I'll have to give REI another chance. I'm reasonable. I will admit the one in Paradise Valley, AZ has an impressive selection of bike parts- especially tires. It's pretty legit, honestly. they've got a huge wall full of WTB, Maxxis and Conti's. 

I know the one in Colo Springs is full of freds that have zero clue, and the one employee I met at the above-mentioned PV store tried to sell me a Road helmet when I went in looking for a Bell Super. He got really hung up on selling me a well vented helmet, dismissing my telling him that I had done my homework and was looking for an 'enduro' MTB helmet with protection.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Well I've worked at both the Tempe store (in the bike department) and at Ft. Collins. Ft.Collins has an amazing staff with very knowledgable employees who all ride! I've also known people who work at Paradise Valley. REI doesn't hire hacks! Like I said before, people in the know can school most at any bike store. 

Funny story. Yesterday I was at Performance bike in Chandler. They had a GT carbon blah blah blah 27.5 with dropper for 4k and change. The employee (who asked 6x if I needed help) proceeded to tell us that it was "Super light" at "25lbs" and that it was "11 speed." Well said bike had an SLX rear derailleur and a OneUP cog, so not 11 speed and when he said, "here feel how light." I told him it was at least 30 lbs. He said he would go weigh it. Didn't see him for a few min and when I did I asked how much it weighed. He said 32#. 

Don't blow smoke up my a$$ and don't make claims that are not true! Cause I probably know more than you about the product you're selling! That's why I will never buy a bike from Performance.


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## falconpunch79 (May 30, 2012)

We just got an REI up here in FBX (likely the northern-most REI in the country) last spring. It was a big deal, 2 day grand opening with lines almost around the block. The staff there is really cool and I've always had a good experience with them. 

I went and checked out the Ghost bikes this weekend (while I was there for the garage sale) and I think they were pretty well spec'd for the price. That being said, as someone pointed out, I think most in the American market don't know much about how well the frame is built. Come to think of it, I wonder what kind of warranty you get? Either way, its worth checking out.

Oh, don't quote me on this, but I believe that the 1 year return policy doesn't apply to bikes, I want to say it's a matter of days.


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## grandsalmon (Oct 24, 2005)

For statistics... my son-in-law became head of the bike section of one REI in the PNW quickly. He did just get into the sport of cycling, but it was headlong, both MTB and Road (he borrowed a mess of my bikes!). Anyway, the wrenches we're good, out of sight mainly, so always cool -they deal w a broad mix of bike problems & repairs. Diehard patrons depend on the church.

Talking w him on rides, he always had stories about gear issues at work. Which is good. The marketing membership crap is also not his style -ssshhhh...


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

falconpunch79 said:


> Oh, don't quote me on this, but I believe that the 1 year return policy doesn't apply to bikes, I want to say it's a matter of days.


Everything in REI is backed by the same guarantee. So Ghost will fall into that as well.


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## borabora (Feb 16, 2011)

REI is a great company. I am sure Ghost is a wonderful company. Am I the only one who thinks that buying a German mountain bike in the US is like drinking California wine while visiting France, going to a Starbucks while in Vienna, or going to an Olive Garden in Florence (if there were one).

I know, it's all made in Taiwan/China/Vietnam but US brands still generate US jobs. I understand buying German cars, kitchen appliances or power tools. But mountain bikes...?
Niner, Specialized, Yeti, Trek, Ibis, Santa Cruz, Cannondale, Felt...


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

So what you're saying is Germans shouldn't buy "Niner, Specialized, Yeti, Trek, Ibis, Santa Cruz, Cannondale, Felt..."

Ghost is trying to grow their brand on the world market just like any of the brands mentioned above. I think partnering with REI was a smart move by Ghost. Now they have their product in a respected retailer that has a 75+ year track record and over 100 stores in the US.


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## borabora (Feb 16, 2011)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> So what you're saying is Germans shouldn't buy "Niner, Specialized, Yeti, Trek, Ibis, Santa Cruz, Cannondale, Felt..."
> 
> Ghost is trying to grow their brand on the world market just like any of the brands mentioned above. I think partnering with REI was a smart move by Ghost. Now they have their product in a respected retailer that has a 75+ year track record and over 100 stores in the US.


I am not telling anyone what they should or should not do. But, making the origin of the manufacturer a factor in the buying decision seems rational when products are very performance and price competitive. The Germans certainly act that way which is why Japanese cars have not caught on there in the same way as in the US. Germany also has a trade surplus while the US runs a huge trade deficit.

If I where running Ghost or REI I wouldn't do anything differently. Just because I think that consumers should make choices that involve local jobs amongst other factors does not mean that I think REI or Ghost are doing anything wrong.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

American exceptionalism!


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## Bro (Dec 20, 2010)

For modern, mass-produced bikes, there's very little difference in quality for a given $$$ level. Most bikes are objectively pretty good, and final bike choice comes down to personal choice and whatever is locally available.


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## borabora (Feb 16, 2011)

mack_turtle said:


> American exceptionalism!


Is an exceptionally stupid and offensive notion. Though, I don't know what that has to do with the thread.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

borabora said:


> I am not telling anyone what they should or should not do. But, making the origin of the manufacturer a factor in the buying decision seems rational when products are very performance and price competitive. The Germans certainly act that way which is why Japanese cars have not caught on there in the same way as in the US. Germany also has a trade surplus while the US runs a huge trade deficit.
> 
> If I where running Ghost or REI I wouldn't do anything differently. Just because I think that consumers should make choices that involve local jobs amongst other factors does not mean that I think REI or Ghost are doing anything wrong.


I would bet that Ghost bikes are NOT imported from Germany. In fact they are most likely drop shipped from manufacture in Taiwan or wherever straight to the REI distribution center. While I would agree with you that buying products and services manufactured in our own country is ideal. I would say that the bike industry is not the one.

As for cars, buying Toyota is making a choice that involves local jobs. Most Toyota's best selling models are built here in the US.


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## BikeIntelligencer (Jun 5, 2009)

Well that explains the name. "Ghost bike" has an entirely different connotation here in the states...


Ronnie said:


> Ghost Bikes is a German based company and are fairly popular in Europe. I knew a few guys who rode them when I lived in Switzerland and they are pretty good.


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## VTSession (Aug 18, 2005)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> Exactly. You might even realize that REI has a great shop in your town.


My local REI has a great mechanic and with the membership the labor prices are dirt cheap.


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## Bradym77 (Nov 22, 2011)

It's odd that the local REI has some great riders who bikepack cross country and who know pretty much anything you could ever want to know about bikes. But they don't work in the bike dept.


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## Dirk Ross (Jun 13, 2014)

Just received the May issue of Bike magazine and they review the Ghost Riot 9 version. They like it overall but at $8k retail it better be good!


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## Crankyone (Dec 8, 2014)

$8K is a lot of moolah! I'd probably go for the Spot Cream SS reviewed in Outside. I am not sure if I would bash it through the woods, mostly just hang it on the wall next to a scowling picture of my wife!


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## She&I (Jan 4, 2010)

I'll bet REI would move a few bikes if the yearly 20%-off-one-item could be applied to bikes.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

She&I said:


> I'll bet REI would move a few bikes if the yearly 20%-off-one-item could be applied to bikes.


Lots of times when there are 20% off events there are markdowns in bikes as well.

REI Visa plus regular dividend adds up to be 15% off full price bike.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

She&I said:


> I'll bet REI would move a few bikes if the yearly 20%-off-one-item could be applied to bikes.


It does, I just checked. 20% off a Novara or Diamondback Bike. I would guess that Ghost is too new to their catalog to discount them just yet. Cannondale ans Scott are not included.


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## Thrawn (Jan 15, 2009)

If only REI brought Canyon over instead...


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## big_papa_nuts (Mar 29, 2010)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> I would bet that Ghost bikes are NOT imported from Germany. In fact they are most likely drop shipped from manufacture in Taiwan or wherever straight to the REI distribution center. While I would agree with you that buying products and services manufactured in our own country is ideal. I would say that the bike industry is not the one.
> 
> As for cars, buying Toyota is making a choice that involves local jobs. Most Toyota's best selling models are built here in the US.


Ghost is distributed, and possibly owned by, Accell North America. They also handle/own Diamondback, Raleigh, Redline, Seattle Bike Supply, and a few other brands.

The funny bit of the story is that bike shops are all POed at big companies like REI for using "unethical" business practices. In all fairness REI, at least their bike department, isn't very guilty of this practice. At least not any more then a average shop, but they are an easy target. So to keep the IBDs happy Accell pulled some of their brands from REI, but gave REI the rights to Ghost to keep REI's business.

These distros and conglomerates are just playing both sides of the field and laughing all the way to the bank.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

big_papa_nuts said:


> Ghost is distributed, and possibly owned by, Accell North America. They also handle/own Diamondback, Raleigh, Redline, Seattle Bike Supply, and a few other brands.
> 
> The funny bit of the story is that bike shops are all POed at big companies like REI for using "unethical" business practices. In all fairness REI, at least their bike department, isn't very guilty of this practice. At least not any more then a average shop, but they are an easy target. So to keep the IBDs happy Accell pulled some of their brands from REI, but gave REI the rights to Ghost to keep REI's business.
> 
> These distros and conglomerates are just playing both sides of the field and laughing all the way to the bank.


This!

I worked for GT/Riteway Products in the early 90's. Riteway being a subsidiary of GT and their distribution network to bike shops. We shipped from Riteway everything from GT bikes (bmx and mtb) as well as everything else needed to build bikes: tires, wheels, brakes...etc.

I doubt they were like BTI or QBP today but we had a very extensive warehouse. We stocked shocks (Rockshox) and all Shimano bits.


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## big_papa_nuts (Mar 29, 2010)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> This!
> 
> I worked for GT/Riteway Products in the early 90's. Riteway being a subsidiary of GT and their distribution network to bike shops. We shipped from Riteway everything from GT bikes (bmx and mtb) as well as everything else needed to build bikes: tires, wheels, brakes...etc.
> 
> I doubt they were like BTI or QBP today but we had a very extensive warehouse. We stocked shocks (Rockshox) and all Shimano bits.


And now GT is owned by Dorel, who owns Cannondale, Schwinn, Mongoose, etc, and they are doing the same thing as Accell.


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## KevinGT (Dec 25, 2012)

New billboard on I-85 near the Atlanta REI proclaiming "Ride a Ghost, exclusive at REI". Pretty cool to see a MTB billboard in Atlanta.


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## nauc (Sep 9, 2009)

x2 on REIs return policy, its one year. that's pretty damn nice, esp if you're buying an expensive bike


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

She&I said:


> I'll bet REI would move a few bikes if the yearly 20%-off-one-item could be applied to bikes.


Just got a REI mailer, 15% off Ghost, Novara, Scott, and Diamondback. That plus the 10% dividend for members is looking good!  May 15th thru 25th.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

You won't get a dividend on sale priced items unless you use REI Visa (5%).


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

The Paradise Valley, AZ has like 5 of them in stock. I very seriously considered asking to spin one around the parking lot last time I was there. There's a few curbs and a rock or two that I could test it out on.


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> You won't get a dividend on sale priced items unless you use REI Visa (5%).


Yeah just saw this on their site

"Non-Dividendable Purchases from REI

The following are not eligible for the REI member dividend: sale items, items discounted 15% or more"


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

ARandomBiker said:


> The Paradise Valley, AZ has like 5 of them in stock. I very seriously considered asking to spin one around the parking lot last time I was there. There's a few curbs and a rock or two that I could test it out on.


I have seen those at the PV store as well. I might be in line for a new bike over the next 12-18 months so this might be something to look at.

So who know about the actual bikes, vs REI? REI is REI and strangly they have more parts for my bike there on hand (PV store) than most bike shops. Once I was looking for a Chain ring for my 3x9 M750 XT crankset and 3 bike shops had nothing. REI had what I needed on the shelf. Easy.

Now back to the bikes.. What is the skinny on the Ghost? Suspension design concepts, feel etc?


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Joe there's probably not too many in the states riding them yet. I have a few friends in NoCo who have them. I'll inquire.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

The great thing about buying Ghost is the risk free purchase. Man what a great way to get into a new brand! I'll be seriously looking at Ghost.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Find me a better deal:
GHOST Kato FS 7 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

All-in-all a pretty amazing build for a shade over 2 grand. I actually pulled a very nice looking orange Kato(?) off the rack and straddled it. It was impressive.

There are some curiosities in the spec though: full XT drivetrain -and brakes-, but a Deore cassette and chain? 

Also, the Alex MD21 hoops seem an odd choice. Especially around XT hubs. It's also curious they'd choose a fairly narrow rim (by modern standards) A 23 or 25 would be nicer, methinks. Just my opinion. Not asking for 30's or 35's but I moved from an 18 to a 23 and the difference was immediately apparent. 
Maybe the upper end Alex rims are nicer, but I was not impressed with the DM model I had experience with. 

I agree, it's a great bang-for-buck if you're OK with not having a 'big name' splashed on the downtube.


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## crewjones (Aug 24, 2007)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> Find me a better deal:
> GHOST Kato FS 7 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com


I was just looking at that . No kidding, That's a good deal. I think REI is gonna sell a ton of these


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

Yeah a little odd to not just add the cassette and chain but an easy enough upgrade. I agree with you about the wheels but once again easy enough to lace those hubs to something else. 

I imagine we'll be seeing more Ghost on the trails soon enough.


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

I'm going to check out the Kato hardtail this weekend, almost pulled the trigger on a Giant Talon until I started looking into Ghost. Either way will be a huge upgrade from my old GT Timberline lol. :yesnod:


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

:drumroll:



All set up to hit some dirt tomorrow morning! :thumbsup:
GHOST Kato 5 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com
I know it's not the best of everything but it's like night and day to the bike I've been riding.


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

tip for the new bike: slide the brake lever over so there is a space between the grips and the lever. 15-25mm should do it. for some reason, a lot of mechanics build bikes with the hydraulic brake lever slammed into the side of the grip, but you will get better power and modulation with a space there.


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## big_papa_nuts (Mar 29, 2010)

ARandomBiker said:


> All-in-all a pretty amazing build for a shade over 2 grand. I actually pulled a very nice looking orange Kato(?) off the rack and straddled it. It was impressive.
> 
> There are some curiosities in the spec though: full XT drivetrain -and brakes-, but a Deore cassette and chain?
> 
> ...


At least they are Shimano. Lots of companies will sneak in a KMC chain and Sram cassette to save some pennies, and that will make a noticeable difference.

I'm a little behind on the whole wide rim craze, mostly because I think it's a bit silly, but are comparable bikes coming with wider options? I think it's just nice to see something tubeless ready. Alex actually makes Stan's rims so they should be ok.


big_papa_nuts said:


> Ghost is distributed, and possibly owned by, Accell North America. They also handle/own Diamondback, Raleigh, Redline, Seattle Bike Supply, and a few other brands.
> 
> The funny bit of the story is that bike shops are all POed at big companies like REI for using "unethical" business practices. In all fairness REI, at least their bike department, isn't very guilty of this practice. At least not any more then a average shop, but they are an easy target. So to keep the IBDs happy Accell pulled some of their brands from REI, but gave REI the rights to Ghost to keep REI's business.
> 
> These distros and conglomerates are just playing both sides of the field and laughing all the way to the bank.


I found out that Accell is actually a Belgian conglomerate, if anyone cares.


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

mack_turtle said:


> tip for the new bike: slide the brake lever over so there is a space between the grips and the lever. 15-25mm should do it. for some reason, a lot of mechanics build bikes with the hydraulic brake lever slammed into the side of the grip, but you will get better power and modulation with a space there.


Thanks for the tip and you are correct! I'll have to slide them over a bit, right now I can't even shift gears without my hands being on the very very end of the grip! I wonder why builders do that... 

On a good note just got back from a couple hours ride and I'm lovin it! Even the Suntour air forks feel good, and I'm pretty sure I used all of it's 120mm of travel a couple times too lol.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

big_papa_nuts said:


> At least they are Shimano. Lots of companies will sneak in a KMC chain and Sram cassette to save some pennies, and that will make a noticeable difference.


I love KMC chains. I wouldn't consider that a bad thing at all.


big_papa_nuts said:


> I'm a little behind on the whole wide rim craze, mostly because I think it's a bit silly, but are comparable bikes coming with wider options? I think it's just nice to see something tubeless ready. Alex actually makes Stan's rims so they should be ok.


 I'll partially agree with you. I think 35mm internal channel wheels are overkill for the vast majority of riders and all but the burliest of tires, but I'm 100% sold on moving away from narrow rims. A 2.4 tire on a 25mm internal channel rim is magical. I'm not even a 'good' rider and can tell you it is a positive move.
That interesting to learn about Alex making Stan's rims. Maybe I'll reconsider my opinion. I do know that the DM18s I had were garbage, but they were cheap rims to begin with.


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## Ronnie (Jan 17, 2004)

big_papa_nuts said:


> I'm a little behind on the whole wide rim craze, mostly because I think it's a bit silly, but are comparable bikes coming with wider options? I think it's just nice to see something tubeless ready. Alex actually makes Stan's rims so they should be ok.


I don't know where you get that from. As far as I know Stan's gear is made for them by SUNringlé. In return SUNringlé use Stan's BST on their Charger and Black Flag wheel sets. Parts and tools are interchangeable. My Charger Pro wheels have NoTubes labels. From their site:

" Designed by SUNringlé with Stan's NoTubes™ BST technology,"


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

I thought I heard somewhere that Alex was manufacturing Stan's rims as well. Can't verify that. I am under the impression that Alex makes a lot of rims based on others' designs and labels them for those companies, just like a lot of other things that are all made in the same Taiwanese factories. I could be wrong.


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## big_papa_nuts (Mar 29, 2010)

ARandomBiker said:


> I love KMC chains. I wouldn't consider that a bad thing at all.


I have no experience with KMC's more spendy chains but their cheap ones at terrible. I often have to replace them, on brand new bikes, because the shifting simply wont work. It's amazing how much of a difference even a cheap Sram or Shimano chain can make.



Ronnie said:


> I don't know where you get that from. As far as I know Stan's gear is made for them by SUNringlé. In return SUNringlé use Stan's BST on their Charger and Black Flag wheel sets. Parts and tools are interchangeable. My Charger Pro wheels have NoTubes labels. From their site:
> 
> " Designed by SUNringlé with Stan's NoTubes™ BST technology,"


Interesting. I had thought I had seen that on Stan's site, but that was likely a while back because I can't find that now. If you have evidence otherwise I'd be interested in seeing it. I will do some research to see what I can dig up. I know Stan's cores are the same as WTB, and a few others so it must be one company making them all.

It funny because if Alex isn't using Stan's tech, IDK what your supposed to use to setup their tubeless rims.


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## JoePAz (May 7, 2012)

So the Ghost FS designs... Seem to use horst link. Hmm... I wonder this was made possible by the Spesh patent expiring? 

Saw a write up for Ghost Riot in Bike Mag. Seem reasonable, but I am not looking for a "big bike". 100 mm of rear travel max or possible HT (27.5 or 29). Seems like the Kato FS is a 120 mm rear.


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## BigDweeb (Dec 2, 2005)

mack_turtle said:


> tip for the new bike: slide the brake lever over so there is a space between the grips and the lever. 15-25mm should do it. for some reason, a lot of mechanics build bikes with the hydraulic brake lever slammed into the side of the grip, but you will get better power and modulation with a space there.


Curious - why do you get better power and modulation with a space...?


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## mack_turtle (Jan 6, 2009)

dweeb- it is partially personal preferennce, but a brake lever is a _lever_. a pushing a lever at a point further away from its fulcrum gives you more power and control. (some "engineer" is probably going to nitpick that statement, but we all know how a lever works.) so if you squeeze a brake lever at the end of the lever rather than at the middle, you get more power with the same amount of effort from your finger. slamming the lever clamp right into the edge of the grip usually puts your braking finger(s) right in the middle of the lever rather than toward the end.

If you don't believe me, try it. ride with your brake lever slammed into the inside end of the grip. then slide it out 1/2" to 1" so than your middle indle easily and naturally wraps around the end if the lever. what works better?

hand size plays a role, but I tend to put a gap of 25mm between a grip and lever for men and 15mm for women with the brake levers pointing down at a 45 degree angle (yes, I use an angle finder.) that's a good starting point and it can be customized from there.

putting the shifter too close to the grip also puts the shifter paddles at an awkward place to access them, so I like to see the shifter clamp just inside the brake clamp. in the end, just put the controls on the handlebar wherever they are most natural. slamming the controls into the edge of the grip is almost never (edit: usually not, but can be) natural feeling or efficient.


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## Impetus (Aug 10, 2014)

Definitely personal preference and depends on hand size. I have pretty narrow hands so I abut my levers right against the lockring. If I gapped them I'd have to move my hands inboard on the grips to get my fingers aligned on the brake, typically with the lateral edge of my middle finger right against the little bend at the tip, and my index finger somewhere next to my middle finger on the outer 1/3 of the lever. With one-finger modulation I use my middle finger so I can hold the bars with index and thumb, plus ring and pinkie. That's just what works for me personally.
I prefer to move my hands to the outer 2/3 of the grip so I'm actually using all the handlebar I paid for.

OP: my apologies for the thread-drift. Nice ride! Update us with how well you like it after a few rides!


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## BigDweeb (Dec 2, 2005)

mack_turtle said:


> dweeb- it is partially personal preferennce, but a brake lever is a _lever_. a pushing a lever at a point further away from its fulcrum gives you more power and control. (some "engineer" is probably going to nitpick that statement, but we all know how a lever works.) so if you squeeze a brake lever at the end of the lever rather than at the middle, you get more power with the same amount of effort from your finger. slamming the lever clamp right into the edge of the grip usually puts your braking finger(s) right in the middle of the lever rather than toward the end.
> 
> If you don't believe me, try it. ride with your brake lever slammed into the inside end of the grip. then slide it out 1/2" to 1" so than your middle indle easily and naturally wraps around the end if the lever. what works better?
> 
> ...


Got it. I wasn't sure if it was this or some magic wrt the gap with the grip.

Molto Grazie


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

HitmenOnlyInc said:


> Find me a better deal:
> GHOST Kato FS 7 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com


Jump on it Hitmen sale ends in a few days! :thumbsup:


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

EugeneTheJeep said:


> Jump on it Hitmen sale ends in a few days! :thumbsup:


Haha! Not this year!!! I just can't justify a whole new ride right now or I would!

I'll get some feedback from some of my REI friends after they've put some time in on them.


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## Mark_BC (Sep 19, 2012)

GHOST Riot 7 LC 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com

That's ridiculous, I could 3D print a bike cheaper than that.

BTW, Ghost bikes are the only brand sold at Mountain Equipment Co-op (MEC), Canada's version of REI. They have been for a while. I was never impressed with them, firstly why should Ghost have exclusive offering at MEC? Secondly, I'd try to find out the differences between the various models and all I got was glossy pictures and videos of riders in the mountains, seemed like more hype than substance. But they are probably good bikes, they've been carrying them for a while now so they must be good.


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## HitmenOnlyInc (Jul 20, 2012)

That does seem excessive compared the Kato I linked to.


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## big_papa_nuts (Mar 29, 2010)

Mark_BC said:


> GHOST Riot 7 LC 27.5 Bike - 2015 - REI.com
> 
> That's ridiculous, I could 3D print a bike cheaper than that.


Just for reference, what are some cheaper comparable bikes?

A quick look at Treks show that their $4800 offering has an aluminium frame and Deore brakes. Though it has a few more "hip" features.


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

May 25th tomorrow last day for 15% off sale. I'm lovin mine so far! :thumbsup:


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## Combobulator (May 24, 2015)

I bought the Kato FS 7 from the website yesterday. Will pick it up from the store on Wednesday. I tried to apply for the REI mastercard but unfortunately didn't get immediate approval. Would have been 5% cash back.


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

Combobulator said:


> I bought the Kato FS 7 from the website yesterday. Will pick it up from the store on Wednesday. I tried to apply for the REI mastercard but unfortunately didn't get immediate approval. Would have been 5% cash back.


Cool post up some pics when you get it  I was in REI on the last day of the sale for a few odds and ends, and all the Ghost bikes were sold out except a couple hybrid models. Guess the sale went well!


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## Mojave G (Jan 30, 2015)

Well after two weeks my chain broke! :madman: On a positive note I took it back to REI and they replaced the cheap Shimano chain with a better quality/more expensive SRAM chain. And covered it under warranty. :thumbsup: reading some reviews of the original chain I guess they break alot lol.


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