# Shimano Saint vs old Shimano XT 4 pots



## Curler (Oct 31, 2005)

I already have a set of old XT calipers i just need some levers. But then i was considering just buying a set of new saints. What should i do? I need a bigger brake then i have now in Juicy 7s and i weigh about 210 all geared up. Is there much difference between the two? They look almost identical.


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## Nick. (Dec 19, 2003)

I have stock 755 master cylinder assemblies with black Dangerboy levers that I'm not using, PM me if you're interested.


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## oldskoolbiker (Jun 2, 2005)

Nick. said:


> I have stock 775 master cylinder assemblies with black Dangerboy levers that I'm not using, PM me if you're interested.


I wasn't aware that anyone had released aftermarket lever blades for the new XT 775 yet.


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## SHIVER ME TIMBERS (Jan 12, 2004)

Curler said:


> I already have a set of old XT calipers i just need some levers. But then i was considering just buying a set of new saints. What should i do? I need a bigger brake then i have now in Juicy 7s and i weigh about 210 all geared up. Is there much difference between the two? They look almost identical.


the new Saints have smoother, easier, better lever pull and more stopping power


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

You can mix & match all generations of shimano brakes. Maybe keep your old XT 4-pot calipers and grab some newer shimano levers to pimp them up?

I've got several generations of shimano brakes and the XT 4-pots are my favorite- especially with straitline levers, goodridge hoses, and stainless hardware from the local hardware store. Go that route and save like $300.


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## hardboiled (Jun 10, 2006)

sorry for a slight derail, but what model number/year were the 4 pots? I've heard lots of praise for them. what exactly does "4 pots" refer to and how does it differ from the current gen of Shimano brakes?


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## Rb (Feb 28, 2007)

hardboiled said:


> sorry for a slight derail, but what model number/year were the 4 pots? I've heard lots of praise for them. what exactly does "4 pots" refer to and how does it differ from the current gen of Shimano brakes?


XT-M755 was the 4-piston (aka "4-pot") generation from the XT groupo. (circa 2005/6-ish)

You can indeed pair the newer Shimano masters with the older 4-piston XT calipers, effectively giving you [*close to] a newer-generation Saint M810 brake:










(* the newer Saint 810 caliper is engineered to be a bit stiffer, with more pad contact IIRC)


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## tacubaya (Jan 27, 2006)

AAAhhhhh, the good ol' Grimeca system, a friend of mine have those 4 pots and they are quite nice, but I would go for the Saints.


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## Nick. (Dec 19, 2003)

oldskoolbiker said:


> I wasn't aware that anyone had released aftermarket lever blades for the new XT 775 yet.


My typo, I meant to type 755.

BTW, that setup posted by Rb below is mine and they work great. :thumbsup:
I got those brakes in 2001 and they still kick ass.


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## weedkilla1 (Jan 1, 2009)

Wow - previous random internerd rumour was that anyone who tried new servo wave levers with old 4 pots blew the seals in the calipers due to too much pressure. Obviously you've had no probs Rb/Nick? I love my 4 pots and would love to try them with the new levers. 

If it does all go pear shaped does anyone know if caliper rebuild kits are still available for the 4 pots?


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## Nick. (Dec 19, 2003)

No problems here.


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## nnn (Feb 1, 2005)

No offense to the new Saints but the classic 755s look the business and walk the walk as well 
Keeping mine until they rust and disintegrate....or I get rich and buy Saints lol !


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## FM (Apr 30, 2003)

weedkilla1 said:


> Wow - previous random internerd rumour was that anyone who tried new servo wave levers with old 4 pots blew the seals in the calipers due to too much pressure.


Could be their 8-year old seals were going anyways? 

Another thing to ponder, current XT levers have servo-wave with adjustment, but XTR's don't.
Yet current XT and XTR calipers are nearly identical except for the finish. Perhaps cranking up the servo-wave adjustment creates too much mechanical advantage? Ever wonder why shimano doesn't put servo wave on current XTR?

I gave the new saints a squeeze on a buddies bike and wasn't too impressed honestly. They were nice but not $550 per set nice. Not enough modulation compared to the old XT's in my opinion. Could have been the set-up though, or the 8" rear rotor. Also, I have new XTR's on my trailbike, honestly my old 4-pots smoke them, no contest (203/160 rotors and metalic pads on both bikes). The XTR's power is OK but 4-pots rule for modulation and feel.

I think Nick's got the ultimate set-up.
Now we just need straitline to make some wider lever blades for them!


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## sundowner (Mar 13, 2007)

I love my old/new M755 on my trail bike, I used them with M975 XTR level and Goodridge lines. I got the caliper brand new on E-bay earlier this year for $65 a piece. The power compare to the XTR caliper are like night and day. I just got new RT76 rotors for them.:thumbsup:

















I been thinking about getting the XT levels for the selvo wave and free stroke and now that I see them been use I probably will get them. But when this die I will get the Saints, unless Shimano comes out with new 4-pot XT.


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## Fuel53 (Nov 1, 2006)

Can you tell me what kind of hoses and fittings you used for this? I want to do the exact same thing.


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## weedkilla1 (Jan 1, 2009)

I did this conversion to my old 4 pots - nothing special with the hoses. Just 90 degree banjo on one end and straight fitting on the other. They look like fibrax hoses in the photo, Goodridge are nice too , but I just used shimano hoses.


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

Hey bro , I just found some XT 4 pot 755 that I am gonna build up. I am super stoked to find this thread. How are they holding up? Any thoughts on regular shimano hose vs braided hose. AND I see you have the XT servo wave levers are on your brakes, How much of difference do you personally feel is enhanced vs standard new DEORE non servo levers. I have a set of newer generation XT's w/ no sevo levers, I was thinking of just maybe switching over to those.


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## weedkilla1 (Jan 1, 2009)

I've used 755 calipers with various shimano levers, including all the types you mention. They are a bit more powerful with the servo wave levers, but they feel a bit nicer to use (to me) with the standard levers - there is a more "solid" lever feel.I wouldn't worry about it, just build themwith whatever you have. As for hose, I cant feel a difference with different hose types. As for holding up? I've never had to rebuild the calipers so thats pretty amazing after 10(?) years!


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## daisycutter (Sep 18, 2005)

You can use magura as well. I have saint levers linked with Gustavs. Now that stopping power.


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

One more question...I bought the complete brake, " Shimano style m755 4 pot" , all chrome (no paint or decal) for 70.00 on Ebay. w/ braided cable and No ADAPTERS. Anyone know who carries the adapters for these brakes. I have a 2010 BOXXER WORLDCUP? I remember what a nightmare it was to find all the brackets to mount the Gustavs with the same style side mounting design. Also, I was curious if I could just screw a compression fitting without the 90dgree banjo strait into the caliper? I am sooo stoked to try this set up. Sorry, I dont mean to be a pest.


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

I remembr back in 2001 , my buddies Balfa had these 755 brakes with braided cables and the old XT levers back when Hayes were in the height of popularity. I also remembr thinking, " HOLY ****....Am I crazy or is this brake like the most powerful brake on the planet. How can Hayes call themselves a reliable brake company compared the engineering on this caliper and lever?" The quality was literally nite and day compared to the Hayes system. He ended up selling those brakes for 100.00 because the modulation was non existent. Literally ON/Off. Power added from the braided liners I think. I remeber being pissed that I passed on them because I thought they were too heavy. Kicking myself now. I just thought I'ld share some nostalgia.


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## ridewithchucky (Apr 1, 2007)

http://cgi.ebay.com/RARE-SHIMANO-XT...Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5645243e31


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## aerius (Nov 20, 2010)

bryantaber said:


> One more question...I bought the complete brake, " Shimano style m755 4 pot" , all chrome (no paint or decal) for 70.00 on Ebay. w/ braided cable and No ADAPTERS. Anyone know who carries the adapters for these brakes. I have a 2010 BOXXER WORLDCUP? I remember what a nightmare it was to find all the brackets to mount the Gustavs with the same style side mounting design.


The M755 is a standard 51mm IS mount brake so all you'll need is an IS to Boxxer adapter. This is what it looks like, see who has it in stock for the best price and order away.

And yeah, I had much the same reaction when they first came out. I was a bike shop mechanic back then and we were stuffing Hayes brakes on every bike since it was the only widely available brake that worked (some people had Hopes, but they had to jump through flaming hoops to get them). Then the M755 came out, me and the head mechanic installed the first set our store got on a customer's bike and we were just blown away by the quality and performance. The next set our store got went straight to my bike, 11 years later and it still works like new. Wore out a rotor and a half dozen sets of pads but everything else is still original and in great shape.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

aerius said:


> The M755 is a standard 51mm IS mount brake so all you'll need is an IS to Boxxer adapter. This is what it looks like, see who has it in stock for the best price and order away.
> 
> And yeah, I had much the same reaction when they first came out. I was a bike shop mechanic back then and we were stuffing Hayes brakes on every bike since it was the only widely available brake that worked (some people had Hopes, but they had to jump through flaming hoops to get them). Then the M755 came out, me and the head mechanic installed the first set our store got on a customer's bike and we were just blown away by the quality and performance. The next set our store got went straight to my bike, 11 years later and it still works like new. Wore out a rotor and a half dozen sets of pads but everything else is still original and in great shape.


Wrong. That's for the old Boxxer. The new one uses a normal post mount.


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

Yup HTAB is correct. this would work on the back IS mount on my frame but the Worldcup fork is a post mount. The guy who has the ones in the pic where he is holding it next to his brake lever has the one I am looking for.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

bryantaber said:


> Yup HTAB is correct. this would work on the back IS mount on my frame but the Worldcup fork is a post mount. The guy who has the ones in the pic where he is holding it next to his brake lever has the one I am looking for.


It actually wouldn't work in back either, at least on most bikes. The old Boxxers had an extra large offset on the brake tabs and thus required a special adapter, or some careful shimming.


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## Hardtails Are Better (May 4, 2005)

Here's the adapter you'd need. Dunno if you can find a cheaper one anywhere or not.

http://www.joyride-cycles.com/shop-...adaptors-1/shimano-f203s-p-disc-brake-adaptor


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

I orderd thru my LBS the adapter in the photo after zooming up the model number. Hopefully it's the correct one. I tried to order one on various sites but every one showed a standard IS mount adapter as the picture under the model number . Im not sure if they were just showing a "standard 203mm adapter" or what but it was enough tomake me think twice about ordering it myself. I had the Lbs do it after I brought in the caliper and he looked it up on the Shimano website. fingers crossed. My XT m800 "older" saint on the front brake is paired with a braided line and old style lever and is an absolute "Beast. " Cant wait til my servo levers come in so I can finally build up the m855's. I have been driving myself nuts with this project. I first tried finding just an o-ring and bleed screw and that took me 2 weeks. .


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## aerius (Nov 20, 2010)

Hardtails Are Better said:


> Wrong. That's for the old Boxxer. The new one uses a normal post mount.


Huh...I didn't know they changed them. Learn something new every day.


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

thanks for all the input guys. I finally got the o-ring and bleed screw rebuild for the older m755 caliper I found on PB and rebuilt. It has the standard older XT lever and original shimano hoses. Installed some new pads and was easy to bleed.Ran it for the first time at Hiland MT. It is so 1 finger strong I am starting to think that I didnt need to buy the servo levers (that still havent come in yet). I am still waiting for my Fork adapter to install the Ebay OEM front one. I know this is a lot of info to add over some brakes but when I started this project I remeber how starved I was for ANY info at all about such an older model caliper. Sorry for the rants..


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

The adapters related the m755 are discontinued. You are essentially going to have to shop for leftovers and the bike shops are really charging for them. The model number is SM MS F(203 or 180 or 160) S/P
Just input the appropriate size of the rotor.


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## Bordershy (Jan 29, 2004)

*Sm-ma-f180 s/p*

I'm looking for this adapter. Find any in your search for the 203 one?


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## clockwork (Dec 9, 2006)

Glad I got all the adpaters I will ever need for my sets


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## bryantaber (Nov 20, 2006)

pretty sure that there is no difference between the one you are looking for and this one

LINK: Shimano Disc Brake Adapters..

I think (sm ma) and (sm ms) is the same. In fact I ended up using it for my 203's with some spacers. It's alot cheaper.


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