# Eskar Elkat



## smartyiak (Apr 29, 2009)

As a sucker for DW-link, this looks pretty interesting. Now...just wait for a 29er!

https://bikerumor.com/2018/08/17/es...pension-on-all-new-150mm-elkat-mountain-bike/

https://bikerumor.com/2018/08/17/fi...sion-exceeds-expectations-on-new-esker-elkat/

https://www.bikemag.com/gear/introducing-esker-cycles-elkat/

https://eskercycles.com/pages/elkat









Anyone at Outerbike can ride this thing and report back???


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

smartyiak said:


> As a sucker for DW-link, this looks pretty interesting. Now...just wait for a 29er!
> 
> https://bikerumor.com/2018/08/17/es...pension-on-all-new-150mm-elkat-mountain-bike/
> 
> ...


I just saw the ride report on this. Sounds very promising, like the REACT suspension of Darrell voss but with less complexity. I like that it was designed around motorcycles but has instead been designed for bikes. Should be solid riding and hopefully lasting. Wish a larger company bought it and could bring it to market at a lower price point but if it is successful perhaps Esker will put out an aluminum version for us poor folks.


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## smartyiak (Apr 29, 2009)

No one at Outerbike try the Elkat? 

Can't believe there's so little interest in a brand new DW suspension!!!


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## b00001 (Dec 28, 2005)

Bike looks awesome, I also will wait (impatiently) on the 29er version...


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## Just J (Feb 14, 2005)

Looks really nice, looks like my Switchblade actually and I'm looking forward to a 29er version too...


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## Velorangutan (Aug 28, 2012)

This is certainly a sharp looking bike! I hope to be able to demo it.


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## hammersorethumb (Sep 14, 2018)

Rode one at Sedona MTB festival. I loved it. It was the best ride of the festival for me. I also rode a Devinci, Specalized, and Evil. I rode it on Sunday when I thought I would be pretty tired from 2 days of riding, but I just wanted to keep going on this bike, climbing and then bombing downhill.


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## ahkim (May 13, 2019)

I'm going to demo the Elkat next week! Mostly for trail riding in Minnesota. Curious how people would compare this to the Yeti SB130, YT Jeffsy, Ibis Ripley v4, and Salsa Horsethief?


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## Mallet21 (Sep 24, 2013)

ahkim said:


> I'm going to demo the Elkat next week! Mostly for trail riding in Minnesota. Curious how people would compare this to the Yeti SB130, YT Jeffsy, Ibis Ripley v4, and Salsa Horsethief?


Eager to hear how the demo goes. I'm also from Minny and interested in the Elkat.


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## ahkim (May 13, 2019)

Mallet21 said:


> Eager to hear how the demo goes. I'm also from Minny and interested in the Elkat.


I reached out to Esker via Facebook and they have demo bikes available this week. I just bought the Ibis Ripley so I'm going to cancel my appointment. Angry Catfish also has them in stock. I rode it around the street and it felt fine. It's 4 lbs heavier (32 lbs) than the Ibis but it has 20 mm more travel. I decided to go with the Ibis since I wanted something lighter weight and 140mm for twin cities riding is a bit much.


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## smartyiak (Apr 29, 2009)

Just returned from DirtRagFest in W.V. The terrain is ROCKY!!!! BIG giant rocks...small tiny rocks...sneaky rocks hiding in the ferns waiting to grab your pedals. 

The Elkat was one highlight of the demos for me. First it's really nice looking...the bike seems stout and well built. Also, in XL, it doesn't look bizarre. I was surprised how heavy it felt when I picked it up b/c it gets up to speed easily, was pretty easy to get into the air, and didn't "ride heavy" at all (whatever that means). 

I am firmly in the 29" camp, but I wanted to try the Orion design for when they come out with one. I think it hits a sweet spot with the DW design. It climbs like a Pivot , but descends really plush. 

The Elkat was agile and super fun to rail in tight corners. Down: it just bombs through everything. Did I mention rocks? I hate them and W.V. will judge a bike's rock garden abilities. I will say this: 29"! The rear of the Elkat was fantastic on the successive hits...just soaked them right up. BUT: the front end did get hung up on occasion when there was successive rocks or roots with a deep rut between; I'm blaming the 27.5's. I asked the Elkat guys if anyone tried a reverse mullet, but they said no. Also, regarding the rocks, I had a few pedal strikes, but nothing unexpected or surprising. I didn't experience any more pedal strikes than with other demos...and less than a few other bikes. 

The Esker guys were super cool to talk to and really knowledgeable about the bike and the Orion suspension (it's history, how it worked, and proper setup).

All-in-all, I could definitely see myself on an Esker...but not until there's a 29". The Esker guys said that a 29" was in the works (probably 150F/140R) and would prolly be out around the end of the year.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

Anybody buy an Esker and get any customer service whatsoever after the purchase? Setup, warranty, anything? My experience has not been good at all. No manuals, no info online, just basically an e-mail address that rarely produces a response and never produces a solution.


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## hammersorethumb (Sep 14, 2018)

Mine arrives tomorrow. Ill see what my experience is like and will share.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

hammersorethumb said:


> Mine arrives tomorrow. Ill see what my experience is like and will share.


Thanks. Please let me know also what you think of the compression damping custom tune if you got the DPX2. Mine seems way too slow and it's wide open. Bigger hits are harsh and I don't get full use of the travel, I've tried sag between 20-30% and different rebound settings.


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## wolsey (Apr 20, 2013)

that's not good to hear.....I also think it's hard to stray from the big brands like Yeti, Ibis, Santa Cruz when the price is really not that much less even though I will admit the build kits are pretty sweet!
I'm still going to try to demo one to see how it rides compared to the new Yeti fleet that is more stretched out


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## Esker (Sep 7, 2019)

We are around, and want to help out with any questions that you have. Recently, some responses have taken longer than we would like, and we have put in place solutions to handle these requests much more quickly.

If we have missed any messages, we apologize, and want to make sure that we get back to each question as soon as possible. If you have been waiting on a response, you should have been contacted by now. If this is not the case, please reach out to [email protected].

For setup and documentation, head to the documentation page (https://eskercycles.com/pages/documentation) on our website. We will regularly be adding additional information to this page. If you have further questions on setup, please get in touch with us at [email protected].

And lastly, if you have not yet, find us at an upcoming demo event (https://eskercycles.com/pages/demo) to get on an Esker, take a ride with us, or just drop by and chat. We hope to see you out there.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I rode an Eskat on MBar trails at Outerbike, very supple, great traction, rode like a DW but less mushy, more active, felt like it never really ran out of suspension. Trails are kinda mellow, but I'd get one.

I also tried a Trust fork and I'd love to try the two in tandem.


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## oldsklrdr (May 15, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> I rode an Eskat on MBar trails at Outerbike, very supple, great traction, rode like a DW but less mushy, more active, felt like it never really ran out of suspension. Trails are kinda mellow, but I'd get one.
> 
> I also tried a Trust fork and I'd love to try the two in tandem.


Glad you got a ride on it. I mentioned it on a different thread at beginning of the year and as i mentioned then it was high on my list after outerbike bentonville last year. I ended picking up a 140/130mm 29er at a great deal from local seller earlier this year but still eyeing a longer travel 27.5 so this bike is still in contention for me. Did you get any time on hd5 or sb140? Curious to hear your thoughts if u did...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

oldsklrdr said:


> Glad you got a ride on it. I mentioned it on a different thread at beginning of the year and as i mentioned then it was high on my list after outerbike bentonville last year. I ended picking up a 140/130mm 29er at a great deal from local seller earlier this year but still eyeing a longer travel 27.5 so this bike is still in contention for me. Did you get any time on hd5 or sb140? Curious to hear your thoughts if u did...


I'm not a Yeti fan, too much dollars, ride feel does nothing for me, and then they have issues. The HD ride fine, I like Ibis, but still just a DW bike that rides kinda chunky.

I just re-read the Bike Mag Bible review on the Elkat and it mirrors my impression: Rides like it has more suspension than it does, takes square hits better than any bike I've ridden, maybe a tad mushy for out of the seat cranking but to be honest, who the hell does out of the seat cranking on anything but an XC bike?

I didn't get chance to ride it on a serious downhill, but I don't think my impression would change, it takes square hits amazingly well, would love to see it paired with a Trust fork. The company owner said the Trust Shout was too tall for the Elkat, but then Bike Mag set theirs up with a Fox 36 160mm.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

mgs4410 said:


> Anybody buy an Esker and get any customer service whatsoever after the purchase? Setup, warranty, anything? My experience has not been good at all. No manuals, no info online, just basically an e-mail address that rarely produces a response and never produces a solution.


Update on this, Esker had an email problem that lasted a couple of months. But they sprang back to life and got in touch, replaced a shock under warranty, sent a pivot maintenance tool, some torque values, and published an online tech manual. Lesson learned hopefully, give your direct-buy customers a phone number in addition to an email address. Bike rides very nicely now.


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## YamaLink (Jun 23, 2010)

Esker said:


> We are around, and want to help out with any questions that you have. Recently, some responses have taken longer than we would like, and we have put in place solutions to handle these requests much more quickly.
> 
> If we have missed any messages, we apologize, and want to make sure that we get back to each question as soon as possible. If you have been waiting on a response, you should have been contacted by now. If this is not the case, please reach out to [email protected].
> 
> ...


Is end of 2019 still a go for a 29er?


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## Wazzou (Jul 20, 2004)

*Esker Elkat Large in Purple!*

New Eskar Elkat owner here and I am excited that there is some discussion about this great bike. I just finished building my bike up 2 weeks ago, and it is quickly changing to winter here in Colorado, so I have only put in 3 rides on my new rig: 1 full day at the Navajo Rocks area in Moab, and then 2 rides locally on my local favorite trail area here in Western Colorado.

Just a quick backstory. I finally broke my 2012 Turner Burner 27.5 this summer. I have been riding my steel hardtail with 27.5x2.8 tires since, and have really enjoyed the old school aspects of the HT. But, for some reason the fire was lit this fall to find my 27.5 full suspension replacement. After about a week of online research and some conversations with the bike shop guys, I decided to stick with the 27.5" platform, because of the nature of the trails that I ride around here in Western Colorado and SE Utah. The trails that I ride in these areas are basically slower-riding tight twisty technical chess matches, with lots of steep technical climbing. To me, despite the major resurgence of 29ers on the scene, 27.5 bikes still have their place in this type of mtb environment.

I chose the Esker for a few main reasons. I loved my Turner burner - it was definitely ahead of its time when it came out in 2012. With my new bike I wanted a bike that seems like a modern take on the Turner Burner - a 27.5 that has a little more travel and the slacker/steeper geometry. Also, I was very interested in another Dave Weagle designed rear suspension, since my experience with DW Link on my Burner has been so great. Climbing efficiency is very important to me. I was also compelled by the great reviews on this bike and for some reason I'm always drawn to the underdog brand. It can be beer, trucks, bikes or bike components; I'm always going to be interested in the company that has a different view and spin on things.

So as a new Esker Elkat owner I would like to be part of any effort to create an information resource for owners of this bike and prospective owners who want to learn more about this bike.

It's getting late and I'm fading big time. For now I will post a picture of my bike as it is built now. I have a few changes to make still. When I get a chance to post again in the next couple of days, I will post my experience riding this bike.


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## YamaLink (Jun 23, 2010)

There are two never built Elkats with headset and Fox forks on eBay. Screaming deals. One medium. One small.
Not affiliated with seller in any way.


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## churchij (Apr 22, 2007)

*New Owner of Brick Red Elkat*

i'm surprised this bike isn't more popular. I never heard of Esker until I rode one at Outerbike in Bentonville. It was easily my favorite bike. I like how active the suspension is and how easily it rolls over rough stuff. The owners gave me a killer deal and included a Rockshox Pike ultimat free with frame purchase. I was a little worried about going from 29 to 27.5 wheels but found I didnt miss the 29 wheels at all. The frame is burly and not light weight but doesnt ride that way. I only notice the weight when I pick the bike up. So far the reviews I've read have been spot on.


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## westin (Nov 9, 2005)

churchij said:


> i'm surprised this bike isn't more popular. I never heard of Esker until I rode one at Outerbike in Bentonville. It was easily my favorite bike. I like how active the suspension is and how easily it rolls over rough stuff. The owners gave me a killer deal and included a Rockshox Pike ultimat free with frame purchase. I was a little worried about going from 29 to 27.5 wheels but found I didnt miss the 29 wheels at all. The frame is burly and not light weight but doesnt ride that way. I only notice the weight when I pick the bike up. So far the reviews I've read have been spot on.


If I was to guess, it's probably a case of marketing budget, crowded trail bike field, Dave Weagle's newest and least known suspension design, 29ers more popular (arguable) and minimal forum presence.


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## Relayden (Jun 15, 2005)

Heard 29er is on the way!! The Elkat has been an awesome bike so far!!! Damn.. I think it's Dave Wagle best suspension design so far...


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## YamaLink (Jun 23, 2010)

Relayden said:


> Heard 29er is on the way!! The Elkat has been an awesome bike so far!!! Damn.. I think it's Dave Wagle best suspension design so far...


Mind me asking who you heard that from? Direct from Esker?


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## Relayden (Jun 15, 2005)

Yep! Before summer I heard...


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## WHALENARD (Feb 21, 2010)

Really interested to see what Esker comes up with in 29'r. If it's a 150/160 with geo inline with others in category it will be the bike imo. Fingers crossed, I want one.

Sent from my moto g(6) forge using Tapatalk


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## westin (Nov 9, 2005)

Emailed Esker last week. No reply as of this post regarding any April-ish 29er release.


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## westin (Nov 9, 2005)

Don't hold your breath. Reply from Esker: We will release some information through our email list and out on social media when any new bikes are released. April may be a bit soon but stay tuned. At this point, we have not seen any significant delays due to the Coronavirus situation.


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## Tara-blyHappy (Aug 10, 2018)

Well, not sure if this is the best time to be buying a bike, but after riding the Elkat down at the Sedona Bike Festival, I went ahead and picked up an Elkat yesterday. Of course, it may be awhile before it shows up, but it is something to look forward to. Ordered the E3 build in Rust with XT group. 

I was wondering what some of you have thought after spending some time on your bikes? Wazzou, your story seems to just about mirror mine. I am currently riding a 2014 Turner Burner. I still love this bike. Last year I found a crack on the rear triangle at one of the welds. Luckily, a friend of a friend had the exact bike break in a different spot and gave me his old bike. It was a different color, but switched out the rear and it is riding just as well as ever. I wish Turner was still going. I also kind of like supporting the smaller guys. I know the big brands are where they are at, because they make great bikes, but there are a lot of smaller companies making some good stuff.

The Elkat was the bike I really wanted to demo at the festival, and it did not disappoint. As I say, I have loved my Turner, and was looking forward to riding the new Weagle suspension. It turned out to be quite amazing. I'm not a huge numbers person, but I have been riding a long time and know what I like, and this bike just seemed to fit me. I have tried a few 29's over the last year, to see if it was something I might be interested in, but I think the 27.5 just fits my type of riding and the trails that I enjoy.

Anyway, I hope that some of you that have bought one have continued to enjoy them and they are making you smile whenever you get on them. In these times, that is something we all need. Hope everyone stays healthy and safe.


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## Wazzou (Jul 20, 2004)

Tara, congrats on your purchase of the Elkat! I think the Orion suspension design is very good. The bike climbs like a goat and is perfectly plush on the downs. I rode mine on the "Hog" trails in Sedona in early February and I swear I was smiling from ear to ear the whole time! For anyone that hasn't ridden Sedona or the Hogs, the trails are tight technical short loops that require some real concentration and finesse to choose the right line on so many sections throughout the trail system. I felt so confident on the Elkat, maybe sometimes too much so! I felt kinda unstoppable! 

That said...I drank the 29er Koolaid...and bought a Forbidden Druid, and so now I'm riding that. I've put my Esker up for sale on PB and eBay, which I'm a little torn about selling. The 29 platform is great overall, especially when the trails get less technical, but I can't quite throw this bike around to pull of every technical move like I could the Elkat. It will probably get better as I get more miles in. So each platform has its pros and cons of course. If I can't get a reasonable offer on the Elkat, I'm going to build it back up and keep it has my ride for the super tech trails.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Anyone had luck fitting a bash guard to the Elkat?

Due to the suspension design, the lower link replaced the frame section that typically houses the bottom rear ICG mount, so there’s only the upper and front lower mounts.

I saw a review where they mentioned a modified e13 badhguard, but no model or pictures available.


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## oldsklrdr (May 15, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Anyone had luck fitting a bash guard to the Elkat?
> 
> Due to the suspension design, the lower link replaced the frame section that typically houses the bottom rear ICG mount, so there's only the upper and front lower mounts.
> 
> I saw a review where they mentioned a modified e13 badhguard, but no model or pictures available.


Frameset and builds should come with bashguard already. At least mine did...i think just not clarified correctly on website...


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## oldsklrdr (May 15, 2012)

Wazzou said:


> Tara, congrats on your purchase of the Elkat! I think the Orion suspension design is very good. The bike climbs like a goat and is perfectly plush on the downs. I rode mine on the "Hog" trails in Sedona in early February and I swear I was smiling from ear to ear the whole time! For anyone that hasn't ridden Sedona or the Hogs, the trails are tight technical short loops that require some real concentration and finesse to choose the right line on so many sections throughout the trail system. I felt so confident on the Elkat, maybe sometimes too much so! I felt kinda unstoppable!
> 
> That said...I drank the 29er Koolaid...and bought a Forbidden Druid, and so now I'm riding that. I've put my Esker up for sale on PB and eBay, which I'm a little torn about selling. The 29 platform is great overall, especially when the trails get less technical, but I can't quite throw this bike around to pull of every technical move like I could the Elkat. It will probably get better as I get more miles in. So each platform has its pros and cons of course. If I can't get a reasonable offer on the Elkat, I'm going to build it back up and keep it has my ride for the super tech trails.


I vote you should Keep it. I switch back and forth between my 29er (Jamis Portal) and the Elkat depending on where i choose to ride. The elkat is so much fun and gives a different experience compared to the 29er. One park in particular which is very tight and technical with a ton of switchbacks i can pull away from my 29er friends cause it so easy to carve up the trail with it.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

*Damage-prone design*















Anyone else seeing their Esker Elkat rear triangle shredding apart at this location? I have maybe 100 trail miles on the bike and now have severe wear into the carbon fiber structure from rocks being kicked up from the front wheel.

This is the side not protected by the "bash guard." I wrote to Esker with images and they said yeah, no problem that's just cosmetic.. try helicopter tape! I don't think so. It's obviously going right into the structural material, and this location is too small, rounded and fiddly for helicopter tape. It peels right off. They also said they're working on frame protection for this area. Too late for me.

Beware, early adopters! This looks like a significant weakness of this frame design as currently spec'd and the company response was dismissive.


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## rockcrusher (Aug 28, 2003)

mgs4410 said:


> View attachment 1336635
> View attachment 1336637
> 
> 
> ...


This looks like of like chain damage? is it possible that your chain is hitting it? It is quite close to the chainring from the looks of it. Not saying that that is justification for the damage, just wonder if it is something that they didn't consider maybe or some combination of shifter, chain, and chainring is causing a problem specific to your bike.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

rockcrusher said:


> This looks like of like chain damage? is it possible that your chain is hitting it? It is quite close to the chainring from the looks of it. Not saying that that is justification for the damage, just wonder if it is something that they didn't consider maybe or some combination of shifter, chain, and chainring is causing a problem specific to your bike.


Yeah, no. This is the non-drive side. There is no chain on this side of the bike.


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## roma258 (Apr 20, 2012)

What do people think about this build? Seems like an interesting mix of Shimano groupset and high quality suspension. Though the Cane Creek forks seem pretty unproven. I am a big fan of the Cane Creek shock on my smuggler.
https://www.jensonusa.com/Esker-Elkat-SLX-Jenson-USA-Exclusive-Build?_br_psugg_q=esker


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## churchij (Apr 22, 2007)

I just checked my bike and there is zero damage to that area. I have a few hundred miles on my bike and ride in the CO front range. There are plenty of rocks in this area and so far no issues. That being said that pivot is pretty low. Lower than the BB. It will be interesting to see what they come up with for frame protection.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

My son in law chipped his the same, not quite as bad, but I'd say it's something Esker should look into ...



mgs4410 said:


> View attachment 1336635
> View attachment 1336637
> 
> 
> ...


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## roma258 (Apr 20, 2012)

Thoughts on the new E1 build? Shimano Deore groupset, Fox Rhythm 36 upfront and DPX2 out back. Seems like a solid, functional build for a reasonable $4k?


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Wazzou said:


> New Eskar Elkat owner here and I am excited that there is some discussion about this great bike. I just finished building my bike up 2 weeks ago, and it is quickly changing to winter here in Colorado, so I have only put in 3 rides on my new rig: 1 full day at the Navajo Rocks area in Moab, and then 2 rides locally on my local favorite trail area here in Western Colorado.
> 
> Just a quick backstory. I finally broke my 2012 Turner Burner 27.5 this summer. I have been riding my steel hardtail with 27.5x2.8 tires since, and have really enjoyed the old school aspects of the HT. But, for some reason the fire was lit this fall to find my 27.5 full suspension replacement. After about a week of online research and some conversations with the bike shop guys, I decided to stick with the 27.5" platform, because of the nature of the trails that I ride around here in Western Colorado and SE Utah. The trails that I ride in these areas are basically slower-riding tight twisty technical chess matches, with lots of steep technical climbing. To me, despite the major resurgence of 29ers on the scene, 27.5 bikes still have their place in this type of mtb environment.
> 
> ...


How are you liking it thus far? Are you having damage in the same place that others are noticing?


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

roma258 said:


> Thoughts on the new E1 build? Shimano Deore groupset, Fox Rhythm 36 upfront and DPX2 out back. Seems like a solid, functional build for a reasonable $4k?


Yes, I agree.


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## roma258 (Apr 20, 2012)

Welp, I took the plunge on the Jenson US build. Bike should be arriving some time next weekend. Can't wait!


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

roma258 said:


> Welp, I took the plunge on the Jenson US build. Bike should be arriving some time next weekend. Can't wait!


congrats! Mine arrives tomorrow: E1 build from the Esker site.


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## danK (Jan 15, 2004)

mgs4410 said:


> View attachment 1336635
> View attachment 1336637
> 
> 
> ...


With the release of their Rowl, wondering how your Elkat's damage is months after your post. Did you remedy the situation?


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Subbed


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

How are Elkat folks liking the reach? I noticed that even though my current frame is a 2017, the Elkat has a 5mm shorter reach. They must be sticking to their guns on the reach #s because the Rowl is only 10mm further out. I have short legs for my height, so sizing up comes at the cost of seatpost height (aka, a shorter dropper).


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

Anyone have any feedback on the Orion vs Ripley v4 ability to handle rock gardens? Pedeling and down

Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Tapatalk


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

bogeydog said:


> Anyone have any feedback on the Orion vs Ripley v4 ability to handle rock gardens? Pedeling and down
> 
> Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Tapatalk


You thinking about picking up a Rowl?
I was told Feb for frame only.


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

TwoTone said:


> You thinking about picking up a Rowl?
> I was told Feb for frame only.


Maybe. I was told Feb for frames and the R3 build. They are having difficulty sourcing parts too.

I spoke to Trailflo Bikes, a dealer in Pittsburg. They ride Big Bear, WV a lot. Said the Elkat does great there and they ride Squamish, etc and it did great too. Says the leverage ratio is good for what I asked. Spoke about the v1 and v2 Ripmo and Ripley v4 platform too.

Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Tapatalk


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

Started a Rowl thread.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/to...&share_fid=23347&share_type=t&link_source=app

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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

bogeydog said:


> Started a Rowl thread.
> 
> https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/to...&share_fid=23347&share_type=t&link_source=app
> 
> Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Tapatalk


https://forums.mtbr.com/29er-bikes/esker-rowl-1153289.html


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Considering a Rowl, for those with an Elkat, if someone created something like a crank boot for the rear triangle lower link area, is there enough room there at full extension and around the link?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I just joined the Esker Entourage (they should TM that if they haven't yet). This one came from one of the guys at the factory and this is what he was using to cover the NDS stay.

Also, I'm about 6'0" and the XL fits great, although my dropper length will likely be limited to 140-150mm. But for me, much beyond 150mm doesn't make a ton of difference to be honest.

Taking it out on a 26 mile shuttle this weekend and while the coil might be a pinch heavy for me I'm pretty stoked.


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## hammersorethumb (Sep 14, 2018)

*Loving my Esker more and more*

Hi Just want to post that I'm loving my Elkat. Just got back from a trip to Downieville CA. The Elkat really shined out there. It felt like the perfect bike for those fast and technical trails with lots of rock gardens. I felt so comfortable at speed and in slower sections climbing or descending rocks. Love my Elkat


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

B. Rock said:


> I just joined the Esker Entourage (they should TM that if they haven't yet). This one came from one of the guys at the factory and this is what he was using to cover the NDS stay.
> 
> Also, I'm about 6'0" and the XL fits great, although my dropper length will likely be limited to 140-150mm. But for me, much beyond 150mm doesn't make a ton of difference to be honest.
> 
> ...


Definitely looks like it would be easy to catch on stuff.

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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

bogeydog said:


> Definitely looks like it would be easy to catch on stuff.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Tapatalk


It's a big reason I'm not so sure about it.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

First ride in the books - 26 mile shuttle w/ about 6500' descending. Solid mix of fast and loose, janky rocks, and finished with some purpose built dh mtb trails. There was a flat stretch in the middle with a bit of techy climbing and some flowy climbing, just for good measure. Overall a pretty good test. The spring on it is too heavy for me so that may have kept things high in the travel but pedal strikes weren't an issue, and the NDS chainstay came out unscathed even though I did catch the bashguard on the drive side. Not sure if I'll keep the coil or switch to air. It definitely felt like it needed the progressive spring that was on it.

Overall as a comparison to the HD5 I demo'd a couple weeks before (as the closest bike I could find to compare to, and what I suspect folks may be cross shopping it with) I'd say it's a pretty strong equal overall. The HD5 might have it on the descents, but it's not by a huge margin. And the Elkat has it on the climbs. Again, possible bias with the 450 lb progressive mrp spring when I should probably be on the 400lb version. Both are very stiff, stout frames - there's no mistaking that either bike was built to handle abuse. The head angle might be the biggest difference between the 2 but a works headset could make up for that, however it's not like the bike necessarily needs it. And, the reason I went with the elkat - you can find them for sub $4k, whereas the HD5s are all still seem to be $6k+. Plus I'd say the finish on the Elkat is holding up better. Time will tell how the Orion suspension holds up but it gets points in my book for an overall great feel both up and down, and a pretty kickass name (plus probably the best Metallica song ever).

Couple pics as proof:


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## roma258 (Apr 20, 2012)

B. Rock said:


> First ride in the books - 26 mile shuttle w/ about 6500' descending. Solid mix of fast and loose, janky rocks, and finished with some purpose built dh mtb trails. There was a flat stretch in the middle with a bit of techy climbing and some flowy climbing, just for good measure. Overall a pretty good test. The spring on it is too heavy for me so that may have kept things high in the travel but pedal strikes weren't an issue, and the NDS chainstay came out unscathed even though I did catch the bashguard on the drive side. Not sure if I'll keep the coil or switch to air. It definitely felt like it needed the progressive spring that was on it.
> 
> Overall as a comparison to the HD5 I demo'd a couple weeks before (as the closest bike I could find to compare to, and what I suspect folks may be cross shopping it with) I'd say it's a pretty strong equal overall. The HD5 might have it on the descents, but it's not by a huge margin. And the Elkat has it on the climbs. Again, possible bias with the 450 lb progressive mrp spring when I should probably be on the 400lb version. Both are very stiff, stout frames - there's no mistaking that either bike was built to handle abuse. The head angle might be the biggest difference between the 2 but a works headset could make up for that, however it's not like the bike necessarily needs it. And, the reason I went with the elkat - you can find them for sub $4k, whereas the HD5s are all still seem to be $6k+. Plus I'd say the finish on the Elkat is holding up better. Time will tell how the Orion suspension holds up but it gets points in my book for an overall great feel both up and down, and a pretty kickass name (plus probably the best Metallica song ever).
> 
> ...


Great write up. Wanna see some side profile shots with that coil!


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Here's from the day I got it. Wasn't sure what else to clamp to and figured the spring itself was a good spot.

Also, I'll add that somehow the suspension had a good amount of traction on the uphill but if you put the power down it stiffened up and away you went. Haven't figured out how it does both of those so well yet but it was pretty impressive.

Built up it's right about 32-33lbs, that's including dropper, saddle, pedals, bottle cage, and spare tire strapped to the frame.

Edit: 2 other details worth noting. The XL frame fits a large water bottle + piggyback shock but just barely. Also, I can fit a 150mm oneup dropper despite my shorter legs (30" pants inseam), although long term may look into some shorter cranks and shave a little off of the seat tube.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Got a chance to try an X2 instead of the coil. I'm a little torn on which one to keep. Has anyone else run a coil on an Elkat?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Mostly for my own record keeping - the 'goldilocks' solution seems to be a progressive coil. If I didn't enjoy high-er speed rock gardens it'd be the X2, but the coil has just a bit more mid stroke support and at the same time plushness in the rough that I couldn't seem to find with the X2 (2020 model, not sure about the 2021s). The progressive coil keeps a fair amount of pop on jumps as well.


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## hammersorethumb (Sep 14, 2018)

Hi, I've been loving my Elkat since I got it in the summer of 2019. Took it out to Downiville where I feel like it really shined. I'm still in love with it.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

danK said:


> With the release of their Rowl, wondering how your Elkat's damage is months after your post. Did you remedy the situation?


Sorry for the slow response. Yeah, so not really. I tried applying helicopter tape to that rounded and curved area per Esker's suggestion, on top of the damaged and pitted raw carbon. It kind of stuck but looks awful, will trap dirt and moisture and obviously isn't a real solution. Unfortunately with the Wuhan pandemic, I have not been able to ride much this past year to give you a good answer (the bike is in a country I am not allowed to travel to).

I looked at the "Rowl" 29er online and I noticed that Esker went out of their way to avoid showing the side of the bike with this issue in any of the photos. I would caution anyone to avoid investing in either of these designs until this issue is addressed (which does not seem to be a priority for them so much as putting out new bikes is a priority). What really bothers me is _not_ that there is an issue with a new design from a small company, but the fact that they take no responsibility, offer no solution, nor warranty coverage, nor even crash replacement options for this potentially dangerous design flaw.

I think many potential buyers for this Weagle platform will have owned frames from other beloved DW brands like Ibis and Turner, and so we are accustomed to great customer service and quick implementation of clever solutions to unforeseen problems that come up in their boutique designs. Still holding my breath for a better outcome, because I do like the way this bike handles.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

B. Rock said:


> I just joined the Esker Entourage (they should TM that if they haven't yet). This one came from one of the guys at the factory and this is what he was using to cover the NDS stay.
> 
> Also, I'm about 6'0" and the XL fits great, although my dropper length will likely be limited to 140-150mm. But for me, much beyond 150mm doesn't make a ton of difference to be honest.
> 
> ...


Oh dear. Did he tell you what material he was using? This looks like some kind of hand-moldable plastic/glue like Suguru from Japan. It also looks like he suffered considerable frame damage before he applied it, if you zoom into the photo and look around the edges of whatever that material is. If this is what they're using in the factory in Taiwan, then it would seem like there isn't a real solution in the works at all.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Our difference of considerable must be different. It was basically enough to take the paint off. He said it was just an adhesive backed rubber, I can find out if you want though.


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## mgs4410 (May 4, 2011)

B. Rock said:


> Our difference of considerable must be different. It was basically enough to take the paint off. He said it was just an adhesive backed rubber, I can find out if you want though.


I don't mean to refute anything a professional salesman told you. But in my case, in the exact same location there is damage that appeared on a new $2850 frame after only a few rides on XC/trail terrain that went through all layers of paint and into the structural CFRP leaving a jagged surface remaining. Maybe I'm not a good judge of this on bikes. My field is aviation, and if I saw this kind of damage on structural carbon, I would be writing it up and would not be carrying you and your family until it were addressed. And I don't see how riding a bike on technical trails adjacent to ledges and cliffs is of _considerable_ difference. On other carbon frames from similar small companies, I have not seen anything like this, personally. And they have normally placed custom-designed frame protection on similar exposed areas or used metal for the material in those vulnerable structural locations. If possible, I would like to know what the material and adhesive is that they are using. Thanks.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Ok, I pinged him and here's that he used: https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company...Mastic-Tape-2228/?N=5002385+3290583904&rt=rud

The delta in our purchase price might be a factor in our reactions here. However I've had other carbon frames with some surface/superficial damage with no issues, and that's all this seems to be (at least on mine). I've seen some carbon repair and that could be an option and then protect it afterwards?


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Guys, 

I'm 5'9" and went with a size large based on the Bikemag reviews and another review I can't remember the name of, but I wanted to get your input. The stock 50mm stem was very untenable, but I put on a 32mm stem and it worked well. Do you think that a medium frame would have worked fine? The reviews all say that one should size up if one is on the cusp.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

That's an 18mm difference in stem length. There's a 22mm difference in TT length and 20mm difference in reach length between the frames, so yeah - you likely could have gotten away with it. If it works with a 32mm stem though, why bother with the switch? For aggressive riding I'd take a bigger frame w/ a shorter stem.

Anyone running a 170mm fork on their Elkat? I'm switching forks and debating between 160 and 170.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> That's an 18mm difference in stem length. There's a 22mm difference in TT length and 20mm difference in reach length between the frames, so yeah - you likely could have gotten away with it. If it works with a 32mm stem though, why bother with the switch? For aggressive riding I'd take a bigger frame w/ a shorter stem.
> 
> Anyone running a 170mm fork on their Elkat? I'm switching forks and debating between 160 and 170.


Can one even run a 170mm fork on it?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Why not? It's only a 7mm increase in axle to crown between the 160mm ribbon and the 170mm 36.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Why not? It's only a 7mm increase in axle to crown between the 160mm ribbon and the 170mm 36.


Learn something new everyday!


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Ha it's all available on their respective websites. I'm just a pinch worried about stack height - the front end can get a little bit floaty on the really steep climbs already, and my stem is already slammed. Of course an angleset would mitigate that but that's another extra $100


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Ha it's all available on their respective websites. I'm just a pinch worried about stack height - the front end can get a little bit floaty on the really steep climbs already, and my stem is already slammed. Of course an angleset would mitigate that but that's another extra $100


Well, try it out and tell us how it works for ya!


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Yeah, I think I'm just going to go right for the 170 and add in an angleset. This takes it to pretty much identical geometry as the HD5 that I demo'd and loved.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Yeah, I think I'm just going to go right for the 170 and add in an angleset. This takes it to pretty much identical geometry as the HD5 that I demo'd and loved.


Speaking of the HD5, how does the Elkat compare? What did you love about the HD5?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

post #61 has some brief thoughts on it. But the HD5 had a 'magic carpet' or 'hover bike' sensation that I've been chasing a bit on the Elkat. Some of it I think I've traced down the the fork - I'm swapping over to a 36 (which is what was on the HD5 demo) to see if that's the ticket. Talking with the Esker guys they seem to say the DPX2 that comes on the bikes is about a perfect match for the frame (also what was on the demo HD5) and I've been mostly using a progressive coil. So that could be a factor too.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Also, mods - can we get the title changed to 'Esker' as it should be?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Huh. Putting on a 170mm Fox 36 and a -1* angleset puts it within a few mm of most of the HD5 large frame dimensions. Looks like reach/stack should stay about where they are along with bb height, just head angle gets slacker and the wheelbase grows. Looking at the #s before I put in the -1 headset, I wouldn't run the frame at 170mm without it (personally).


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Just wanted to drop in here since I just got my Elkat! I've been waiting a whole year to get it since I rode one at the Sedona Mountain Bike Fest. First test ride is soon to see how a Manitou Mara Pro pairs with the frame. Rolling around the neighborhood already felt pretty good, but it really needs to taste the regular diet of chunk it will be eating. One note about the geo chart for prospective buyers is that the seat tube insertion isn't accurate. On a large I can fully insert a 200mm PNW Loam dropper. I shortened the travel to 185 because my legs aren't long enough. The seat tube is a straight shot all the way down to the upper pivot.










PS the new Malbec color is even better than I expected!


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> How are Elkat folks liking the reach? I noticed that even though my current frame is a 2017, the Elkat has a 5mm shorter reach. They must be sticking to their guns on the reach #s because the Rowl is only 10mm further out. I have short legs for my height, so sizing up comes at the cost of seatpost height (aka, a shorter dropper).


I'm 5'9" and I opted for a large based on the reviews stating that those on the fence should size-up. Esker HQ also recommended it, given that the reach is a bit shorter than other bikes. I've always bought mediums so this was a new one for me.

What's your opinion on sizing up on the Elkat? Did you try both size before choosing the larger? Pluses/minuses? (I had to trade in the longer dropper for a shorter one as well.)

Thx!


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Cdal1770 said:


> I'm 5'9" and I opted for a large based on the reviews stating that those on the fence should size-up. Esker HQ also recommended it, given that the reach is a bit shorter than other bikes. I've always bought mediums so this was a new one for me.
> 
> What's your opinion on sizing up on the Elkat? Did you try both size before choosing the larger? Pluses/minuses? (I had to trade in the longer dropper for a shorter one as well.)
> 
> Thx!


I'm also 5'9" and opted for the large. I have always ridden large frames and they fit, but standover was always a little high. The large Elkat fits great, and I must have longer legs than you Cdal. 185mm drop is at the perfect height for me with 170mm cranks.

Plus for me on the large has been more stability with the slightly longer wheelbase than what I rode before. Also there's a little more seat mast to allow more room for the seatpost bag that I'm getting to go along with a bag in the upper half of the front triangle.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Cdal1770 said:


> I'm 5'9" and I opted for a large based on the reviews stating that those on the fence should size-up. Esker HQ also recommended it, given that the reach is a bit shorter than other bikes. I've always bought mediums so this was a new one for me.
> 
> What's your opinion on sizing up on the Elkat? Did you try both size before choosing the larger? Pluses/minuses? (I had to trade in the longer dropper for a shorter one as well.)
> 
> Thx!


I couldn't find a local Elkat demo, so instead I demo'd a L HD5 which was within a few mm of the XL Elkat. It fit right, so I went with the XL and have been happy. I can only run 150mm of dropper and I might try to cut down the seat tube at some point in the future, but that's my only complaint. As a reference I'm just under 6' and 32" pant inseam - I'm top heavy in terms of body length.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Evil_Bun said:


> .... Also there's a little more seat mast to allow more room for the seatpost bag that I'm getting to go along with a bag in the upper half of the front triangle.


Where are you getting the bag made? I have my tube stashed in that area but every time I look at it, I can't help but think it'd be a great spot for a little bag a la the Pork Chop bag from Ibis.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> I'm also 5'9" and opted for the large. I have always ridden large frames and they fit, but standover was always a little high. The large Elkat fits great, and I must have longer legs than you Cdal. 185mm drop is at the perfect height for me with 170mm cranks.
> 
> Plus for me on the large has been more stability with the slightly longer wheelbase than what I rode before. Also there's a little more seat mast to allow more room for the seatpost bag that I'm getting to go along with a bag in the upper half of the front triangle.


Thx for your input. I had to use a 120mm dropper.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> I couldn't find a local Elkat demo, so instead I demo'd a L HD5 which was within a few mm of the XL Elkat. It fit right, so I went with the XL and have been happy. I can only run 150mm of dropper and I might try to cut down the seat tube at some point in the future, but that's my only complaint. As a reference I'm just under 6' and 32" pant inseam - I'm top heavy in terms of body length.


I couldn't find an Elkat demo either given COVID last year. I compared the numbers on the large Elkat to the medium Ibis Mojo 4 and, surprisingly, the numbers were very (and I mean VERY) similar. This was ex post facto.

I did replace the 50mm stem on the large Elkat with a 32mm stem from i9 and it worked very well. I also replaced the longer dropper with a 120. Me happy.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> I'm also 5'9" and opted for the large. I have always ridden large frames and they fit, but standover was always a little high. The large Elkat fits great, and I must have longer legs than you Cdal. 185mm drop is at the perfect height for me with 170mm cranks.
> 
> Plus for me on the large has been more stability with the slightly longer wheelbase than what I rode before. Also there's a little more seat mast to allow more room for the seatpost bag that I'm getting to go along with a bag in the upper half of the front triangle.


By the way, did you replace the 50mm stem with something shorter, as you're also 5'9"? I replaced it with a 32mm.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Cdal1770 said:


> I couldn't find an Elkat demo either given COVID last year. I compared the numbers on the large Elkat to the medium Ibis Mojo 4 and, surprisingly, the numbers were very (and I mean VERY) similar. This was ex post facto.
> 
> I did replace the 50mm stem on the large Elkat with a 32mm stem from i9 and it worked very well. I also replaced the longer dropper with a 120. Me happy.


For what it's worth, I pinged Esker on trimming the seat tube and they said there were a few mm to work with. I've also seen vids where they use a 37.1mm seat collar and go down even further on a yeti. I haven't pulled the trigger yet but it's on my 'to do' list at some point. Warranty wouldn't be voided unless the damage was on the seat tube area.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Where are you getting the bag made? I have my tube stashed in that area but every time I look at it, I can't help but think it'd be a great spot for a little bag a la the Pork Chop bag from Ibis.


I'm getting a pair made by someone local in Colorado, Rocky Mountain Toast. There are a lot of custom bag makers to choose from. Mostly based on what you want and what they offer. Currently I am using a Blackburn Outpost Corner Bag and it fits well. Can fit all the tools I need on a ride in there plus a tubolito for emergencies. I just want a more custom setup with another bag to carry what I want. I got the blackburn bag here: Outpost_Bag


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Cdal1770 said:


> By the way, did you replace the 50mm stem with something shorter, as you're also 5'9"? I replaced it with a 32mm.


I built mine from a frameset and used the 40mm stem from my last bike. Also using these bars and it fits great for me. About 23mm of spacers under the stem too.

I have a 34 inseam, probably why I can cram a bit longer dropper in there.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Evil_Bun said:


> I'm getting a pair made by someone local in Colorado, Rocky Mountain Toast. There are a lot of custom bag makers to choose from. Mostly based on what you want and what they offer. Currently I am using a Blackburn Outpost Corner Bag and it fits well. Can fit all the tools I need on a ride in there plus a tubolito for emergencies. I just want a more custom setup with another bag to carry what I want. I got the blackburn bag here: Outpost_Bag


 As someone else also in CO, let me know if they want to make a 2nd one. I was looking at Evergreen Threads or something like that right here in Evergreen but have a camper van project on my hands at the moment so I hadn't reached out just yet. Good tip on the Outpost bag though, thanks.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> I built mine from a frameset and used the 40mm stem from my last bike. Also using these bars and it fits great for me. About 23mm of spacers under the stem too.
> 
> I have a 34 inseam, probably why I can cram a bit longer dropper in there.





Evil_Bun said:


> I built mine from a frameset and used the 40mm stem from my last bike. Also using these bars and it fits great for me. About 23mm of spacers under the stem too.
> 
> I have a 34 inseam, probably why I can cram a bit longer dropper in there.


Right, my inseam is about 32.

What do you feel you lost with not going with a medium? I feel I lost better climbing ability and agility, in addition to adding a bit more weight.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> As someone else also in CO, let me know if they want to make a 2nd one. I was looking at Evergreen Threads or something like that right here in Evergreen but have a camper van project on my hands at the moment so I hadn't reached out just yet. Good tip on the Outpost bag though, thanks.


She would totally be down to make another, but since you're on an XL the dimensions would be off. You would have to send her info so it comes out right. She runs orders through instagram DM's right now. Super accommodating with requests for extra features and willing to order certain fabric colors if she doesn't already have them.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Ah ok, that explains why I couldn't find a website. Thanks.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Cdal1770 said:


> Right, my inseam is about 32.
> 
> What do you feel you lost with not going with a medium? I feel I lost better climbing ability and agility, in addition to adding a bit more weight.


I don't feel I really lost anything.

With how well it fits, I think climbing would feel a little cramped for me with a shorter reach.

The extra weight is negligible for me. 65g doesn't make much of a difference with the other components I'm running. The bars are cromoly (a little heavier than my previous alloy descendent bar). Wheels are 1800g despite being carbon, tires are 2.6 tough casing vigilantes and I have cushcore front and rear. The shock is heavier than the stock dpx2. Plus I don't like riding with a pack, so all my tools and water are also on the bike.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Ah ok, that explains why I couldn't find a website. Thanks.


Yeah, they were working on a website. They did just move to a new space, so it probably pushed the website back a bit.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> I don't feel I really lost anything.
> 
> With how well it fits, I think climbing would feel a little cramped for me with a shorter reach.
> 
> The extra weight is negligible for me. 65g doesn't make much of a difference with the other components I'm running. The bars are cromoly (a little heavier than my previous alloy descendent bar). Wheels are 1800g despite being carbon, tires are 2.6 tough casing vigilantes and I have cushcore front and rear. The shock is heavier than the stock dpx2. Plus I don't like riding with a pack, so all my tools and water are also on the bike.


Thx for breaking it down. Incidentally, I'm loving the new Elkat colors!


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Cdal1770 said:


> Thx for breaking it down. Incidentally, I'm loving the new Elkat colors!


No worries, I tend to put a lot of thought into what I end up using. The bike loaded up is probably around 33 or 34 pounds. Haven't weighed it yet, but my old alu bike was 36-ish loaded up.

The new colors are super nice.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> No worries, I tend to put a lot of thought into what I end up using. The bike loaded up is probably around 33 or 34 pounds. Haven't weighed it yet, but my old alu bike was 36-ish loaded up.
> 
> The new colors are super nice.


Is 33-34 pounds about average for the 150mm 27.5 mtb?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

The Elkat frame isn't a lightweight despite being carbon - it's burly. If I took off the pedals and spare tube, my XL is pretty close to about 31lbs last I checked. Ready to ride, about 33-34 sounds right. I'm also running 2.6 tough casing tires at ~1150g each, plus another ~150g in the rear for a Tannus insert. Carbon wheels + bars, fox 36 up front, X2 in rear. 203mm front rotor, 180mm rear rotor, and 4 pot brakes all around. Could definitely be sub 30 if you kept the stock DPX2 and ran a 34 (or similar), ran lighter tires, etc. I'll probably shed 200g per tire when the Terrene's die, but that day hasn't come yet. Still on the fence on the X2 but I just got a shockwiz to help dial that in.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> The Elkat frame isn't a lightweight despite being carbon - it's burly. If I took off the pedals and spare tube, my XL is pretty close to about 31lbs last I checked. Ready to ride, about 33-34 sounds right. I'm also running 2.6 tough casing tires at ~1150g each, plus another ~150g in the rear for a Tannus insert. Carbon wheels + bars, fox 36 up front, X2 in rear. 203mm front rotor, 180mm rear rotor, and 4 pot brakes all around. Could definitely be sub 30 if you kept the stock DPX2 and ran a 34 (or similar), ran lighter tires, etc. I'll probably shed 200g per tire when the Terrene's die, but that day hasn't come yet. Still on the fence on the X2 but I just got a shockwiz to help dial that in.


The upside of the frame being so burly is it is so stiff. My vigilante's are supposed to be 1270g each. Cushcore Pro is 250g per wheel. It's not worth it for me to build for lightweight at 200lb. The bike hides its weight really well with how good the suspension is.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Oh, I wasn't complaining. I'm only 160 lbs but I generally build for reliability/durability. It's no fun snapping a chain stay or a seat tube 15 miles into the middle of nowhere. Plus, lifetime warranty usually doesn't mean lightweight either. It's still lighter than the aluminum bike it replaced, and climbs just as well despite having more travel.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Oh, I wasn't complaining. I'm only 160 lbs but I generally build for reliability/durability. It's no fun snapping a chain stay or a seat tube 15 miles into the middle of nowhere. Plus, lifetime warranty usually doesn't mean lightweight either. It's still lighter than the aluminum bike it replaced, and climbs just as well despite having more travel.


Lol, I didn't think you were. Just expressing how I like to build my bikes.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> Just wanted to drop in here since I just got my Elkat! I've been waiting a whole year to get it since I rode one at the Sedona Mountain Bike Fest. First test ride is soon to see how a Manitou Mara Pro pairs with the frame. Rolling around the neighborhood already felt pretty good, but it really needs to taste the regular diet of chunk it will be eating. One note about the geo chart for prospective buyers is that the seat tube insertion isn't accurate. On a large I can fully insert a 200mm PNW Loam dropper. I shortened the travel to 185 because my legs aren't long enough. The seat tube is a straight shot all the way down to the upper pivot.
> 
> View attachment 1929337
> 
> ...


Just a follow up after 4 rides so far. The bike is as good as I remember from Sedona. The mara pro pairs well with high speed compression almost full open and low speed about half way. Super supple and very supportive combined with support from the linkage. The mezzer pro up front keeps up well with the rear end. The 36 on the front of the demo I rode in Sedona felt like it struggled to keep up. This bike is a bad influence and I'm already smashing my PR's only a couple rides in. Technical climbing feels like cheating as long as I stay on my line.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Interesting, I find the fox 36 plays pretty nicely but the weight difference could be a big factor there. I also like supportive forks that stay up higher in their travel unless I really screw something up.

Good feedback on the Mara Pro. I'm putting the shock wiz on the X2 this weekend to see if I can get it dialed in, otherwise that was on my radar as a possible alternative. Wasn't sure if the spring curve would work well with the Orion. Also missed that you were running 2.6 WTBs. How are those working in CO for you?

Side note on the Orion - if you look at it on paper, it should act kinda similarly to the gen 2 VPP based on the leverage ratio. But I can't say it pedals or descends like one. There's something funky going on with that BB centric pivot (in a good way).


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Interesting, I find the fox 36 plays pretty nicely but the weight difference could be a big factor there. I also like supportive forks that stay up higher in their travel unless I really screw something up.
> 
> Good feedback on the Mara Pro. I'm putting the shock wiz on the X2 this weekend to see if I can get it dialed in, otherwise that was on my radar as a possible alternative. Wasn't sure if the spring curve would work well with the Orion. Also missed that you were running 2.6 WTBs. How are those working in CO for you?
> 
> Side note on the Orion - if you look at it on paper, it should act kinda similarly to the gen 2 VPP based on the leverage ratio. But I can't say it pedals or descends like one. There's something funky going on with that BB centric pivot (in a good way).


Any specific remarks on the gen 2 VPP vs. DW-Link(ish)/Orion systems?


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Potentially, but I also just really like how Manitou's damping feels. The Mezzer is very good at staying high in it's travel until it needs to work. I think a lot of that is due to how the air spring and IRT interact. When you do screw up HBO is there to help catch you. Between IRT and HBO I don't think I have bottomed hard on the fork yet after riding it for a year and a half. A lot of the features that come standard on the Mezzer Pro are ones that are bought aftermarket by people who are unhappy with their 36 (DSD Runt, Push ACS3 air bump stop, Vorsprung Smashpot hydraulic bottom-out).

The spring curve seems to work well with Orion. I got one mainly to get similar damping characteristics front and back. Plus service is very user friendly. Definitely worth a shot if the X2 ends up not working out. The 2.6 Vigilantes have been super nice so far. Things have been mostly wet to moist lately. What small, completely dry sections I've ridden they dig in really well. They feel like there is grip for days on corners because there's no gap in the knobs when leant over.

I think it's down to the concentric pivot. You get a touch of rearward axle path at the beginning of travel. You don't really get that on gen 2 VPP or on dw link.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Huh, I didn't know that it actually had any rearward axle path - good to know.

I have only spent about ~3 rides on 2nd gen VPP and wasn't a huge fan. Seemed efficient enough but not really compliant when you wanted it. If you look at the 2nd gen Bronson and the Elkat spring curve, they have a very similar shape. However, I can't say they pedal or descend terribly similarly. I asked Esker about this and they kind of just said it was Weagle magic.

I don't really have the budget to be swapping my fork at the moment, but have only heard glowing reviews about the Mezzer. The Fox stuff is user serviceable, it just takes a few extra steps and being creative with finding or making tools. Full damper bleeds take a bit of time no matter which one they are.

Yeah, it's been wet here for a change. When it all inevitably turns to dust, that'll be the test for the tires. I'll keep my eyes out for another Elkat on the trails, so far I haven't seen another one.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Yeah, and I mean just a touch. Just looking at the linkage I'd say you get a path that is very slightly rearward until the upper link is level.










If you get the chance, the Mezzer Pro is 100% worth the price.

You might not see one for a while. I'm usually riding around Fort Collins. Would be nice to see another out on the trail. Be nice to see what another owner thinks in person.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> Yeah, and I mean just a touch. Just looking at the linkage I'd say you get a path that is very slightly rearward until the upper link is level.
> 
> View attachment 1931390
> 
> ...


I love their new colors.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

As a follow up to an earlier post...really digging the 170mm fork with the -1* wolftooth ZS headset. They say 170 in the front matches 150 in the rear and it definitely feels nicely balanced. I've been cleaning a lot of techy climbs recently so I can't say that it's negatively impacted climbing, it helps add confidence for getting the weight over the front of the bike on the downs, and the fork has a 37 offset so there's no wheel floppage. The only drawback so far is that the extra wheelbase on the XL frame means it JUST barely fits on my roof rack.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> As a follow up to an earlier post...really digging the 170mm fork with the -1* wolftooth ZS headset. They say 170 in the front matches 150 in the rear and it definitely feels nicely balanced. I've been cleaning a lot of techy climbs recently so I can't say that it's negatively impacted climbing, it helps add confidence for getting the weight over the front of the bike on the downs, and the fork has a 37 offset so there's no wheel floppage. The only drawback so far is that the extra wheelbase on the XL frame means it JUST barely fits on my roof rack.


Do you feel like you got that "magic carpet" feel you were chasing? I had to remove a click of rebound front and rear recently to finally get that feel.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I'm getting pretty close with the help of a shockwiz. Turns out my shock pump was off by 20 psi, so when I kept thinking I had 50 psi in the fork, I had 70. That alone has made a huge difference. I had been trying to make forks more linear so I could actually use the travel, when in reality they were just over pressurized.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Dang, that's super off. How much did all your settings end up changing?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Since I backed pressure down nearly 20 lbs, I took a few clicks out of both LSC and HSC, I think only 1 out of rebound. Still playing with spacers - with the fork at 170mm I have added 1 spacer, I'm in between adding a 2nd. Could always cut one in half to make an 'in between' spacer. I'm definitely finding the bottom of the fork but it's not harsh. It's close enough that I'm moving it over to the shock for the time being. The X2 has more mid stroke wallow than the coil, but for techy climbs that oddly seems to be helping? The shock compresses and the wheel is able to find grip almost anywhere. Feels almost reminiscent of Knolly 4x4 in that regard, while being much more efficient elsewhere.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

That's not too bad. Have you looked into something like a DSD Runt to make the fork more linear?

Does it feel like you're stuck in your midstroke now? I feel like the Orion linkage is very good at staying just above midstroke. But that might just be how I have it set up.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Actually I'm enjoying the fork as is. It's more that for some trails, 1 spacer is perfect. For others, 2 would be better. Although something like the Runt (or IRT) would mean on the fly adjustments.

If you're just pedaling along, it doesn't feel like it's sitting in its midstroke like some of the bikes I've had in the past. If you put the power down you can feel it stiffen up and go forward, but also track over the terrain. I did Dakota Ridge on it recently and still got some pedal strikes (as always there) but actually had one of my better days there ever.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Interesting - even though the X2 I got came from an orbea rallon and has the light compression tune, shockwiz wants me to keep taking out low speed compression. Has anyone else run into this on their shocks w/ shockwiz?

However, I did get a chance to take the Elkat to Trestle and get it up to some fairly high speeds - definitely glad I went with the XL frame and raked the fork out. It's not a full on park bike, nor should it be, but it was still a ton of fun out there. That snappy rear end can bite you if you're not careful and let your weight slowly slide backwards though.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Huh, weird. I am a little over halfway from open on my Mara Pro. Haven't used a shockwiz, but it all feels very balanced and controlled front and rear. That being said I do really like having some damping to push into.

Nice! I still need to get up to Trestle with mine at some point.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Has anyone else had trouble with the bb lockring tool? The one I got with my frame was aluminum and doesn't look like the one they show on their website. Dang thing deformed and can't hold onto the lockring anymore. Tempted to machine a better one out of steel, but broaching the square hole for a ratchet might be a task all its own.


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## TwoTone (Jul 5, 2011)

Evil_Bun said:


> Has anyone else had trouble with the bb lockring tool? The one I got with my frame was aluminum and doesn't look like the one they show on their website. Dang thing deformed and can't hold onto the lockring anymore. Tempted to machine a better one out of steel, but broaching the square hole for a ratchet might be a task all its own.


Can you just weld a cheap shorty extension on it for the ratchet?


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

TwoTone said:


> Can you just weld a cheap shorty extension on it for the ratchet?


I could, but I want to keep the ratchet as close to the lockring as possible. Probably going to mill square hole and drill out the corners to remove any radius left.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I haven't taken mine apart yet but is it just a standard hex size? Could always get a socket and then flatten the tip (like some folks do to take off the air caps on their forks).


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

It is a standard 48mm size, but good luck finding a tight fitting socket in that size. I found an impact 48mm socket and machined it to fit and be flat. Unfortunately it was too loose of a fit to work.

I ended up just modeling my own so I can ask the machinist at my job to run it on the cnc out of steel.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Oh strange. So too big for a 47 but too small for a 48? Also, what made you take it apart? I thought they were sealed bearings and wasn't planning touching mine for at least a year, likely longer.

Side note, looks like we have a project going at one of the breweries up in your neck of the woods. If I can time it to bring the bike I'll shoot you a PM.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Yeah, it's a nominal 48mm and measures up very slightly undersize. I was having some creaking and thought it could be the the lockring being slightly loose. I undid it with the original tool and tightened it back up after cleaning and re-applying. Recently I wanted to take it apart to clean out some grit I can't get to. I crashed recently and had the bb area stripped down waiting for replacement cranks. Decided it wasn't worth waiting any longer just for some dirt after the socket failure and put the bike back together when I got the new parts.

Sounds good!


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

New cranks? Goddamn that's a heck of a crash. Frame took it OK? With the frame's weight and lifetime warranty, they seem quite stout.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Lol, I know. I bent my NDS crank arm and pedal spindle. I caught my pedal super hard trying to air over some rocks into a dip. That spun me around while I fell 6 feet to the ground. The frame is fine since the cranks and I took the brunt of the hit. There is a scuff on the top tube protective tape, but that's all I could find. I rode it again last night for the first time since the crash and the bike feels no worse for wear.

PS It was shimano cranks, but this probably would've bent or broke any other crank except maybe eeWings.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Eh, indestructible cranks just mean that something else will break/snap first instead of them. Always good to have a weak link in the system that isn't the frame. I noticed that one of my crank boots took a hard enough hit to put a hole in it, might look into some 170mm cranks (which is what I would have spec'd if I built it new myself). Although having had to find a cassette and chain recently - maybe the crank swap will wait until parts suppliers catch back up.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Lol, true. Also the reason I can't justify ever buying fancy cranks or alloy flat pedals. I have had good luck with 170mm cranks on this build. Definitely have far less accidental crank/pedal strikes. I did have to search around a bit to get my replacement cranks. I think I ended up having to order off competitive cyclist. Universal Cycles had pulled through several times for me since they are a little less known. They also tend to have some of the more esoteric parts you might be looking for.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I've used both of those sites before. I ground a pin off of a pedal good enough this past weekend on Unkle Nazty that my buddy riding behind me said it was a molten spark that flew off and sat on the trail for a few seconds. Didn't realize that was a thing, and might bump up the plan to find shorter cranks - at least it's been moist around here.

However, about 40 miles and 6k' vert this weekend on a pretty diverse range of trail and the Elkat felt like the right tool. Never really locked out the shock either - played with it a little on a doubletrack climb but I opened it back up when it got chunky and loose. It acts like it was designed to be in the mountains, which makes sense.


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## oldsklrdr (May 15, 2012)

Was doing a thorough cleaning and maintenance of the bike and while doing so I came up with a solution for protecting the non drive side lower link. Not sure why I didn't think of this sooner but I had these crank boots hanging around and it worked!

1) pick up race face crank boots for alloy crank arms
2) modify by cutting with razor as shown in pic
3) remove lower link rear axle and bolt
4) slip on boot
5) reinstall axle and bolt and torque to 10Nm

It will work without removing the bolt but this looks cleaner and edge of bolt compresses against edge of the boot and keeps everything snug.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

That inner lip doesn't rub on the bottom bracket? Good idea, looks better than I would have guessed.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Dang that looks nice. Might have to get a crank bootie and do one myself.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

oldsklrdr said:


> Was doing a thorough cleaning and maintenance of the bike and while doing so I came up with a solution for protecting the non drive side lower link. Not sure why I didn't think of this sooner but I had these crank boots hanging around and it worked!
> 
> 1) pick up race face crank boots for alloy crank arms
> 2) modify by cutting with razor as shown in pic
> ...


That's ingenious!


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## oldsklrdr (May 15, 2012)

B. Rock said:


> That inner lip doesn't rub on the bottom bracket? Good idea, looks better than I would have guessed.


Plenty of clearance.









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

oldsklrdr said:


> Plenty of clearance.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


At least plenty if you're using a shimano sized bb.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Has anyone replaced their frame bearings yet? I have a strange creak that shows up when only I'm putting down power. I can replicate it by pushing on the seat tube and pulling on the seat stay. I suspect either the dropper post needing re-greasing or a bearing on its way out. I also noticed that the bearing kits are out of stock so I guess you'd have to piece together your own.

As an aside for those wondering on size, I'd keep in mind your local riding area. I spent some time in new england last week and the XL felt a little long in some of the twisty/tight turns. Not bad, just took a little extra effort to toss around that quickly. At 5'11 I'd probably downsize if I lived around trails like that (granted I'd probably also run a lower travel bike). Could also be due to the angleset + 170mm fork too. Granted, the larger frame and slacker fork paid dividends at Highland bike park (what a gem) and some steep stuff up in Conway.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Evil_Bun said:


> At least plenty if you're using a shimano sized bb.


Just a follow up on the crank bootie hack. I made one for myself and was "fortunate" enough to test it on a trip to Moab. I caught that spot on a ledge up and the bootie definitely saved my frame. The bootie did get pulled off, but it has stayed on since I put it back. I did not sandwich mine underneath the bolt head.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Hm. What about some silicone sealant or similar material to help hold it in place, but not necessarily permanently? 

I have dinged mine exactly once and have ridden all of the tech trails up and down the front range, as well as some new england tech. The little rubber sticker-thing the factory guy put on is still in place, I can just see a little divot in it (and I felt it at the time too). Maybe the X2 is more supportive in the mid stroke than the DPX2? Or 175mm cranks w/ flat pedals mean I get a pedal strike before hitting that area, I've definitely taken some metal off of my pedals this year.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

I dunno, it stays on just fine and I can always just sandwich it like oldsklrdr.

Yeah, I'm not worried about it out here. Definitely an edge case. Weird ledge plus tired equals hit.

How is the X2 after spending more time on it?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Still digging the X2. I keep taking out rebound and it's still not quite as fast as I would like, although my riding has definitely been getting faster this year too. Probably get it re-shimmed during the winter rebuild and decrease both compression and rebound, basically shooting for the 'ultra light' tune that Ibis uses on their Mojos. Esker said their also big fans of the new Float X, I just get nervous with a shock that doesn't have HSC/LSC as a separate adjustment. 

Separate topic, how are people finding derailleur tuning in the stand vs on the trail? On the stand, the chain buzzes the bash guard in granny. But once the suspension sags, it doesn't seem to rub while on the trail. I had a Lenz Lunchbox with a 157 rear end and similarly short chainstays and didn't have this issue, but the bash guard was also a bit more forward.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Nice, sounds like everyone is trending towards lighter tunes as shocks get better. I had to speed up my Mezzer significantly to keep up with the Mara Pro I have on the back. It was paired with a float x on my old trance and had to be much slower to feel balanced. Definitely agree with more adjustments. I don't think I could go back to a shock without separate adjustment anymore. I've heard a lot of great stuff about the new Kitsuma. Would probably be wanting to switch if I was still on the stock DPX2.

I haven't noticed any weirdness on my end with derailleur tuning. What setup are you using? I have all shimano 12spd and haven't had that problem.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I'm also running Shimano 12 speed. Pic attached of what I'm talking about in granny gear. At the sag point that bash guard isn't nearly as in the way, but in the stand (or on the ground in this case) it's very much in the way and rubbing.

Also, got the compression tune lightened up a bit on the X2. Hot damn do these bikes like light compression tunes. Much more active and a bit more playful too.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> I'm also running Shimano 12 speed. Pic attached of what I'm talking about in granny gear. At the sag point that bash guard isn't nearly as in the way, but in the stand (or on the ground in this case) it's very much in the way and rubbing.
> 
> Also, got the compression tune lightened up a bit on the X2. Hot damn do these bikes like light compression tunes. Much more active and a bit more playful too.


That is pretty weird. Are you sure your bashguard isn't bent outwards? Maybe your chainring is the wrong spacing or your hub driver body sits more inboard?


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I know the chainring is the correct one since I'm the one that sourced it and put it on (30T snaggletooth). The drivetrain is due for servicing, including the hubs, so I'll just take it all apart and see what I can deduce. When I swapped the chain ring I noticed that the bolt for the crank arms was incredibly tight upon removal and then again on reinstallation so something might be askew.


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## Cdal1770 (Mar 20, 2019)

Pertaining to the issue of the lack of protection of the non-drive side’s BB. Is this something I should worry about? I put some Lizard Skin on it.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Late reply...but I'd just paint it and send it. Looks cosmetic.

Also, the crank boot tip is excellent - I just did that before a big trip and it's already paying dividends. I also put some 3M mastic tape on the BB past where the frame protector ends - noticed that area on the non drive side got a couple scuffs. Guess the chainstay rotates out of the way during compression and exposes it.

However, I noticed that Esker lists the maximum insertion length at 250 for every single frame size. I was looking at a oneup 180mm dropper and it has an insertion length of 267. Fox transfer 175mm dropper is the same. Seems like every 170 and up dropper will have an insertion length longer than 250mm, heck Esker even specs the Tellis at 170mm for M - XL frames which is 282mm. Has anyone inserted their dropper longer than 250mm?


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

B. Rock said:


> Late reply...but I'd just paint it and send it. Looks cosmetic.
> 
> Also, the crank boot tip is excellent - I just did that before a big trip and it's already paying dividends. I also put some 3M mastic tape on the BB past where the frame protector ends - noticed that area on the non drive side got a couple scuffs. Guess the chainstay rotates out of the way during compression and exposes it.
> 
> However, I noticed that Esker lists the maximum insertion length at 250 for every single frame size. I was looking at a oneup 180mm dropper and it has an insertion length of 267. Fox transfer 175mm dropper is the same. Seems like every 170 and up dropper will have an insertion length longer than 250mm, heck Esker even specs the Tellis at 170mm for M - XL frames which is 282mm. Has anyone inserted their dropper longer than 250mm?


The insertion depth is definitely incorrect on the website. I have a 200mm Loam Dropper in my large frame. Full insertion length of the dropper is 290mm and I have it fully inserted. The seat tube is basically a straight shot down to the upper pivot location.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Ok, sweet. I'm trying to modify a few things here and there and get my dropper length up to 180mm. Since I grabbed an XL frame and have somewhat shorter legs I've only been running a 150mm dropper. 

On a separate note - I just looked on their website and they now list a 162mm rear travel option if you up the shock travel to 65mm. They also list a standard 170mm fork in 27.5 configuration, or a mullet configuration with a 150mm fork.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Sounds like fun! I got the Loam dropper because its super quick to adjust in 5mm increments. I ended up at 180 with it fully inserted. 

Interesting that they put up official long travel numbers. Would be fun to try when it's time to service suspension again.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

It would also make the bike a bit more progressive, so could be worth revisiting a coil shock in the long travel configuration. Or - a 65mm coil shock for rowdy days and a 60mm light weight air shock for pedally days. Although to be honest...I'm not entirely sure it needs it, but it's always fun to experiment.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Using the #s and leverage ratio graph on linkage design's website, it looks like an extra 10mm of travel will likely reduce the leverage ratio by another .05. So, that means the overall progressiveness of the frame goes from 18.8% to 20.7%. Considering it's actually a 12mm increase in travel, call it a nominal increase of another 2%. Not game changing on its own, but the extra 5mm of shock travel will also let you get deeper either into the windings on a progressive spring or an air can so its a win-win. 

I had switched over to an X2 from coil because it just wasn't quite progressive enough but it was close. Looks like I'll be trying to hunt down a coil setup this off season. I'm a stickler for mid stroke support and while the X2 is the best air shock I've ridden, it's still not as great as a coil.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

Update for anyone following or thinking about long stroking the bike. I replaced the 60mm stroke X2 with a 65mm stroke Float X with some massaging by Fluid Focus. Never ridden a stock Float X to compare to, but either with the damper work and/or the extra travel from the longer stroke, it's finally the goldilocks shock for the bike. It has the traction/composure of the X2 through the chunder but without being as syrupy on the jumps, and a bit more support on the climbs. Has a good bottomless feel on bigger drops. Was worried that the extra travel would make it a little lazier/slower on the climbs but honestly don't feel like I've lost anything (except 140g in shock weight). I could still see a progressive coil (or a HBO or big bottom out bumper) being a good fit for the bike, but with the weight penalty (my last coil was about 400g heavier) - it'd basically just be for shuttle or lift served days. Worth mentioning that I am running 170mm on the front btw. Might feel a little different with 150 or 160mm.

TL,DR: do it.


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## Evil_Bun (Sep 9, 2019)

Nice, definitely want to do the same with my Mara Pro when I send it in for service next.


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## B. Rock (Mar 9, 2011)

I don't know about the snow levels up north, but now's a pretty good time to get things serviced around here. 

Also worth mentioning - Fluid Focus put in a pretty big bump stop that takes the place of any tokens/spacers. Not sure how that works with the Mara Pro, but you can run the shock a little more progressive if you want since you have more travel to play with.


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