# Sticky  27.5+ Tires



## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

Just starting a thread to discuss the new B+ tire format that is starting to gather steam.


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## Guest (Sep 17, 2014)

interesting indeed.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

WTB Trail Blazers 650B x 2.8"

WTB Trailblazer 27.5 X 2.8" Tires: Exclusive B+ Review: First Impresions Part 2


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

My pair of WTB Trailblazers landed last week. Mounted to 40mm Derby rims they measure 60mm tread width and 70mm casing width. They fit in my Jones Ti Spaceframe with plenty of clearance.

Trying to decide if I should ride them or wait for the Vee Trax Fatty. I just heard they will be released in the next week or two, and should be wider and lighter than the Trailblazer.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

For those looking in on 27.5+ for the first time, Panaracer and Vee both have tires coming in this size as well.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

what is the name of the 27.5+ Panaracer tire?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

MMcG said:


> what is the name of the 27.5+ Panaracer tire?


Fat B Nimble, same as their fat bike and 29+ tire. They announced the 27.5+ and 29+ versions at Interbike.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

MMcG said:


> what is the name of the 27.5+ Panaracer tire?


FatBnimble. Panaracer is making that tire in a 29x3 and a 27.5x3.

Edit: Bikeny beat me to the board.


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## Guest (Sep 17, 2014)

Slow Danger said:


> FatBnimble. Panaracer is making that tire in a 29x3 and a 27.5x3.
> 
> Edit: Bikeny beat me to the board.


which makes you slow like tom brady


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

nvphatty said:


> which makes you slow like tom brady


Do I get his wife too?


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## Guest (Sep 17, 2014)

Slow Danger said:


> Do I get his wife too?


for a nominal fee sure.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

cool post on WTB's FB page. Two bikes at IB with Trailblazers. One from 44 bikes and the other a Jones Spaceframe. WTB - Rad Bikes of Interbike | WTB

On the Jones, with an eccentric BB he just rotated the BB to the top and eliminated most of the 6-10 mm BB drop that results from using the 650B/Trailblazer wheel. Pretty smart!

mike


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## mtndude23 (Apr 18, 2012)

Now, I'm going to have to hold onto my 650 wheelset for awhile!


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## Entrenador (Oct 8, 2004)

bikeny said:


> My pair of WTB Trailblazers landed last week. Mounted to 40mm Derby rims they measure 60mm tread width and 70mm casing width. They fit in my Jones Ti Spaceframe with plenty of clearance.


What's the BB height of your Jones bike with these wheels on it?
Thanks.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

senor_mikey said:


> On the Jones, with an eccentric BB he just rotated the BB to the top and eliminated most of the 6-10 mm BB drop that results from using the 650B/Trailblazer wheel. Pretty smart!


The ebb helps, but only if you aren't already riding with it set for highest position, especially since the Jones already has a low bb height. Some bikes are on the verge of being too low for certain types of riding as it is. This tire may not suit chunkier riding where riders rely on clearance, but that type of riding is not what the Trailblazer designed for so personal tastes and terrain are likely to play a bigger factor than an ebb on whether this tire will work for riders.


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

Slow Danger said:


> The ebb helps, but only if you aren't already riding with it set for highest position, especially since the Jones already has a low bb height. Some bikes are on the verge of being too low for certain types of riding as it is. This tire may not suit chunkier riding where riders rely on clearance, but that type of riding is not what the Trailblazer designed for so personal tastes and terrain are likely to play a bigger factor than an ebb on whether this tire will work for riders.


I'm actually hoping the Trailblazer will work well on low speed chunk at lower pressures. 
I will have to be pretty aware of BB height. We will see...


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

bikeny said:


> My pair of WTB Trailblazers landed last week. Mounted to 40mm Derby rims they measure 60mm tread width and 70mm casing width. They fit in my Jones Ti Spaceframe with plenty of clearance.
> 
> Trying to decide if I should ride them or wait for the Vee Trax Fatty. I just heard they will be released in the next week or two, and should be wider and lighter than the Trailblazer.
> View attachment 924165
> ...


Please.. Please.. Give 'er a try
I would love to hear your what you think about them.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

flyinmike said:


> I'm actually hoping the Trailblazer will work well on low speed chunk at lower pressures.
> I will have to be pretty aware of BB height. We will see...


Well, let us know. I'm in a position where I really can't afford loss of bb height. Low pressure will drop it even further.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

It's kind of funny that this is like the original French system of fitting tires, where you had a set outside tire diameter (600, 650, or 700mm) and several width designations (A, B, and C). Going to a fatter tire meant using a smaller rim, and your bottom bracket height and gearing would stay the same.

Maybe we should start calling these 29E tires...


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

desperate attempt to make 29'ers relevant since 27.5 is in town and will surely own the entire market shortly....

I kid I kid...now want some 650b+ but ditched my 29'er


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Entrenador said:


> What's the BB height of your Jones bike with these wheels on it?
> Thanks.


I put that in another post, forget to mention it here. My EBB is set at around the 10:00 position, and the BB height is about 11.5". Sounds like it might be a bit low for chunk.


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## Walt (Jan 23, 2004)

I am super excited about 27.5+ as it fills in one of the last gaps in choice for diameter/width (we now have 31x3, 29xanything you want up to 4.8", 27.5xanything up to 3" or so, etc) but honestly, they are not going to work that well on most 29" frames. Anything big enough to achieve the same diameter as a 29x2.3 or so is going to be too huge to fit in most frames, and a smaller tire (like the WTB) is going to cause a lot of people BB height/pedal strike problems, especially if run at low pressure where you're looking at 15+mm less BB height.

But they are still awesome and I want some.

-Walt


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I'm planning on getting a 27.5 x 3.25 tire, once they actually exist. I'm going to put it on a 40mm Derby rim and see what it looks like. If it looks good I'm going to get a 27.5 wheelset for my Mukluk and try them out. If that goes well I might have a bike made that uses that tire. I hope that more than one tire company makes tires around that size.


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Welnic said:


> I'm planning on getting a 27.5 x 3.25 tire, once they actually exist. I'm going to put it on a 40mm Derby rim and see what it looks like. If it looks good I'm going to get a 27.5 wheelset for my Mukluk and try them out. If that goes well I might have a bike made that uses that tire. I hope that more than one tire company makes tires around that size.


I am doing the same exact thing, although my frame is already done and waiting on the tires. The bike has a 73mm bb, 135 symmetrical rear, can fit 26x3.8, as shown in pics. I think a 27.5 with a 3.2 tire will be very similar in height to what I am currently running. Wheelset is being built as we speak, tires in a couple weeks I hope.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

1strongone1 said:


> I am doing the same exact thing, although my frame is already done and waiting on the tires. The bike has a 73mm bb, 135 symmetrical rear, can fit 26x3.8, as shown in pics. I think a 27.5 with a 3.2 tire will be very similar in height to what I am currently running. Wheelset is being built as we speak, tires in a couple weeks I hope.


Cool bike. Did you have it built with these new 27.5+ tires in mind?


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## Walt (Jan 23, 2004)

That thing is awesome. How much clearance is there for the crankarms?

-Walt


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

1strongone1 said:


> I am doing the same exact thing, although my frame is already done and waiting on the tires. The bike has a 73mm bb, 135 symmetrical rear, can fit 26x3.8, as shown in pics. I think a 27.5 with a 3.2 tire will be very similar in height to what I am currently running. Wheelset is being built as we speak, tires in a couple weeks I hope.


Thanks for posting that. Very inspirational. And very cool. I'm glad Walt is excited.


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Walt said:


> That thing is awesome. How much clearance is there for the crankarms?
> 
> -Walt


Thanks. Dave Wiseman is a newer builder, but was a pro, amazing to work with. Very complicated build, had it made to run fat 26, 27.5 + or even 29+. Cranks have enough clearance, crank protectors take up a little space, still room to spare


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## Walt (Jan 23, 2004)

Well, I'd probably want more room, but as long as they don't rub when you're on the gas, it's good to go! 

Freaking sweet bike. 

I'm doing a fattie (that will do 27.5+ as well) for my wife right now on an 83mm shell which allows a bit more wiggle room to fit bigger (ie ~110mm) tires and a derailleur/gears. No way is she going to ride a fat singlespeed! Now that there are more crank options in 83mm popping up, I'm a pretty big fan of that width as a compromise as it allows quite a bit shorter stays and some more flexibility with tires. Most people don't notice the Q factor difference between 73/83, but 100mm is often a bit much.

Anyway, I digress. Love the red hammertone powdercoat, too!
-Walt


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Walt said:


> Well, I'd probably want more room, but as long as they don't rub when you're on the gas, it's good to go!
> 
> Freaking sweet bike.
> 
> ...


I have a couple hundred miles on it, always on the gas and not a rub. Wet paint, no powdercoat, 7 coats to get that look. Probably a pound of paint, but soo cool in the sun.

Post a pic of your wife's bike when you are done, I have always loved your frames.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

1strongone1 said:


> Thanks. Dave Wiseman is a newer builder, but was a pro, amazing to work with. Very complicated build, had it made to run fat 26, 27.5 + or even 29+. Cranks have enough clearance, crank protectors take up a little space, still room to spare


Any pics with 29+ in there?


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

dr.welby said:


> Any pics with 29+ in there?


I don't have any pics. I put a Rabbit Hole with a Knard in, with the paragon set almost all the way back and it fit well. I will never run one though, I don't like the height of a 29+, that's why I want a 27.5+.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I'm with you on this one. I want to build a 27.5+ too.

Curious -anyone know if the WTB 2.8" tire will fit a Rockshox Revelation or Fox Float 27.5" fork? Or, is it limited to a 29er fork retrofit? 



1strongone1 said:


> I don't have any pics. I put a Rabbit Hole with a Knard in, with the paragon set almost all the way back and it fit well. I will never run one though, I don't like the height of a 29+, that's why I want a 27.5+.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)




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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I'm intrigued by 27.5+ - but I find it interesting that it probably won't clear all that many existing 650b frames........and then it will fit in 29ers but most of those will have chainstays (i.e. longer than maybe necessary) that aren't really optimal in terms of length....

Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


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## Guest (Sep 23, 2014)

MMcG said:


> I'm intrigued by 27.5+ - but I find it interesting that it probably won't clear all that many existing 650b frames........and then it will fit in 29ers but most of those will have chainstays (i.e. longer than maybe necessary) that aren't really optimal in terms of length....
> 
> Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


same applies to 26+ tires however most will fit 650b bikes but require 26" rims


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I'm suspecting the same. An article describes the outer diameter as 28.6" with 45mm wide rims. I'd like to put them on 40mm wide rims, so the outer diameter would be about the same. At 28.6", I'm pretty sure the wheel/tire combo will not fit a 27.5" Fox Float that I have on a bike right now. And if the combo is limited to 29er forks and frames, then its slightly smaller size will be harder to take advantage of in terms of head tube height (an area of focus for shorter riders) and shorter chain stays.

Perhaps these tires can be made a little smaller in outer diameter with a narrower rim, but then the tire pressure will have to be kept higher to prevent the tire from rolling and squirming, no?



MMcG said:


> I'm intrigued by 27.5+ - but I find it interesting that it probably won't clear all that many existing 650b frames........and then it will fit in 29ers but most of those will have chainstays (i.e. longer than maybe necessary) that aren't really optimal in terms of length....
> 
> Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

How about posting some diameters so we can see what will fit on our bikes?

I'm thinking a mid fat (less than 4") on a 27.5 might be a nice summer tire compliment to a fat bike 26 x 4".

Anyone have a source for less expensive rims 40-50mm, ie not Surly?


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> How about posting some diameters so we can see what will fit on our bikes?
> 
> I'm thinking a mid fat (less than 4") on a 27.5 might be a nice summer tire compliment to a fat bike 26 x 4".
> 
> Anyone have a source for less expensive rims 40-50mm, ie not Surly?


I have the Nextie 40mm carbon rims. They look really well made. Came in at 420g a piece. In the process of building them up.

Carbon Fiber 650B/27.5" MTB Rim 40mm width Clincher Hookless Tubeless Compatible Mountain Bike [NXT650BH01]


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

MMcG said:


> I'm intrigued by 27.5+ - but I find it interesting that it probably won't clear all that many existing 650b frames........and then it will fit in 29ers but most of those will have chainstays (i.e. longer than maybe necessary) that aren't really optimal in terms of length....
> 
> Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


It's the same thing with 29+, fits only a few forks, just barely. It really is a better fit with existing 29er's if you can get over a cm BB drop ( no big deal for me). The guys over there seemed to whine about it and moved it here. 650B+ is also a good fit for fatbikes for non snow/sand riding.

I'm hoping we will see a few production 650B+ bikes and, of course, the inevitable customs should start trickling out. That's what I' going to do, have my custom filet brazed 29er hardtail's seat stays replaced to give me room for 3.2" 650B+ tires. ( chainstays and fork will fit already)


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## 127.0.0.1 (Nov 19, 2013)

MMcG said:


> I'm intrigued by 27.5+ - but I find it interesting that it probably won't clear all that many existing 650b frames........and then it will fit in 29ers but most of those will have chainstays (i.e. longer than maybe necessary) that aren't really optimal in terms of length....
> 
> Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


my new XTC 27.5 just has enough mud clearance with 2.3 on it to get packed with mud and leaves and still spin somewhat. not gonna be able to fit any 650b+  therefore I hate


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

127.0.0.1 said:


> my new XTC 27.5 just has enough mud clearance with 2.3 on it to get packed with mud and leaves and still spin somewhat. not gonna be able to fit any 650b+  therefore I hate


Use a wide 26" rim like this:Velocity Wheels with as large of a tire that will work on your frame, even a 2.2/.3 will do, add 15psi and ride. Although the trailblazers are labeled 27.5 it only refers to the bead diameter and is sized to fit existing 29" frames. You can get nearly the same effect going down a bead size for your bike.

The key to + I have found has more to do with rim width than the tire itself. YMMV.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

MMcG said:


> Thoughts on that guys? Will it ever gain any traction other than a very small niche?


I'm guessing small niche. The WTB tire weighs as much as the wide, burly, 29er tires, has narrower tread, will have fitment issues with lots of frames, and your bb will drop. The only big advantage is cush/comfort, which is certainly appealing, but wide 29er tires with tall casings, like Maxxis tires, are already pretty cushy. Some folks say you will get some float in snow and sand with the Trailblazer, but anyone who rides fat bikes will tell you this tire will only bring marginal gains on soft surfaces, at least over any distance. I certainly wouldn't expect this tire to be great for snow or sand.

If you have a 29er with wider stays, and already have a wideish 27.5 wheel set, then why not give the tire a shot? I would if I were in that situation. However, I don't have the money to spend on a new wheelset that I can only use with one tire.

The wider 27.5+ tires coming out are only going to work in fat bikes. Maybe 29+ bikes? Panaracer and Vee must be banking on fat bikers using those tires to build summer wheels. Or there are bikes in the works that will be designed around these tires? I agree with another poster: the most appealing 27.5 plus tires would be 3.0-3.5 wide and have a bike that is geo specific for trail riding.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

This sounds familar:

I'm guessing small niche. The WTB Nano tire weighs as much as the wide, burly, 26" tires, has narrower tread, will have fitment issues with lots of frames, and your bb will rise. The only big advantage is cush/comfort, which is certainly appealing, but wide 26" tires with tall casings, like the Gazza, are already pretty cushy.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

dr.welby said:


> This sounds familar:
> 
> I'm guessing small niche. The WTB Nano tire weighs as much as the wide, burly, 26" tires, has narrower tread, will have fitment issues with lots of frames, and your bb will rise. The only big advantage is cush/comfort, which is certainly appealing, but wide 26" tires with tall casings, like the Gazza, are already pretty cushy.


The concept of 27.5+ has great potential. And I'm hoping/looking forward to bikes being designed around 3.0-3.5 wide tires. Can't wait. But the WTB seems like a niche tire to me. I guess there could be a lot of folks out there who already have both wheels and a frame that can use this tire though. WTB was way out ahead on 29ers. The Trailblazer is just a wide 27.5 tire...not a new bike platform.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> But the WTB seems like a niche tire to me.


Sure it is. Like the Nano before it, it's a tire to test the waters and they had to make some compromises to increase the odds of retrofit-ability.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> WTB was way out ahead on 29ers. The Trailblazer is just a wide 27.5 tire...not a new bike platform.


They weren't that far ahead. There were several big wheel 700c bikes and tires - the Bianchi Project 7, Diamond Back Overdrive, Bruce Gordon Rock N' Road for example. For tires you had the much knobbier Rock N' Road / Hakkapellita, Panaracer Smoke 700c, and the big 45mm cross tires on the Bianchi. You could just as well say the Nano was just a wide cyclocross tire, not a new bike platform.

Heck, why not just say the Endo was just a wide Gazza? I think there's a problem of perspective here, in that because the 650+ tire fits in between other sizes it's not "new".


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

dr.welby said:


> Sure it is. Like the Nano before it, it's a tire to test the waters and they had to make some compromises to increase the odds of retrofit-ability.


Well, I guess the difference is that in today's bike industry adaptation is much faster. You are reaching back 15 years or better to make a point. In fact, Vee tires 27.5x3.25 was announced by Bike's Direct before I even heard of the WTB tire. Panaracer was announced within a month of the first public news of the WTB. Bikes are likely already on the way. The public doesn't need to be "sold" on the concept of new wheel sizes these days. They just like to argue about which is best. I'm not trying to poop in WTB's punch or anything. It's a cool idea that I'm sure some people will love. And if I didn't have to spend a ton of money to make the Trailblazer work, I'd be buying one. I'm not resistant to new ideas. I'm waiting for the next logical step. If WTB moves the needle some, great.


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## Guest (Sep 24, 2014)

please no pooping in the punch bowl..:crazy:


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Well, I guess the difference is that in today's bike industry adaptation is much faster. You are reaching back 15 years or better to make a point. In fact, Vee tires 27.5x3.25 was announced by Bike's Direct before I even heard of the WTB tire. Panaracer was announced within a month of the first public news of the WTB. Bikes are likely already on the way. The public doesn't need to be "sold" on the concept of new wheel sizes these days. They just like to argue about which is best. I'm not trying to poop in WTB's punch or anything. It's a cool idea that I'm sure some people will love. And if I didn't have to spend a ton of money to make the Trailblazer work, I'd be buying one. I'm not resistant to new ideas. I'm waiting for the next logical step. If WTB moves the needle some, great.


Some of your reasoning is correct, but your timeline is way off. Panaracer announced their 650B+ this month at Interbike best I can tell. The WTB tire was first shown at Sea Otter in early April on the Rocky Mountain Sherpa prototype. The Trax Fatty was first shown at the Taipei show in early March, over 6 months ago.

But yes, adaptation happens much faster these days, and companies as well as riders are much more likely and quicker to try new things like these plus sized tires. Obviously, BD has a bike in the works for the 650b+ tire size, and I'm sure there are more in development as we speak. I also think it will be a great option for a summer wheelset for fatbikes.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

nvphatty said:


> please no pooping in the punch bowl..:crazy:


Plenty of floaters already.

Bikeny, you're right I was pretty off on the Panaracer. So it goes Trax Fatty in March. WTB in April. Panaracer in September. Still an eye blink compared to old development times.

Folks: Somebody asked opinions on whether the WTB represented a small niche. I gave a fairly non-controversial opinion. Ride what makes you happy.


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## dr.welby (Jan 6, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> You are reaching back 15 years or better to make a point.


Well, since that's when the last "This new wheel size roolz/sux" debate happened I guess I didn't have a choice to reach back to the previous century. I didn't pay attention much when the Pacenti tires came out so maybe I could have come up with something acceptably recent for you. But I'm sure there was plenty of eye rolling at that size too.



> In fact, Vee tires 27.5x3.25 was announced by Bike's Direct before I even heard of the WTB tire. Panaracer was announced within a month of the first public news of the WTB. Bikes are likely already on the way.


That still doesn't change the fact that the WTB design has some obvious compromises to achieve greater adoption.


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## nomadpop (Mar 12, 2007)

*Ti 29er 650+*















I have been pretty excited on this tire/wheel size since I heard about in January. Designed a hardtail that I can ride as my 29er ss/geared bike and have the option to slap the 650+ wheelset in for fun. I have the new WTB tires and hubs just waiting on rims to build up. Looking at 45mm wide options and currently only see the carbon options. Hoping the WTB rims are out soon or Velocity comes out with a 27.5 dually. Widened the chainstay area as wheel as the seat stays and am pretty confident that 3.0 or even 3.2s will fit in there fine. Will build it up with my regular 29er wheel set first then figure out the rest.
Roy


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Looks fantastic! And I thought I was jumping the gun to think of frames around which these tires will fit.



nomadpop said:


> View attachment 926230
> View attachment 926231
> 
> 
> ...


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## nomadpop (Mar 12, 2007)

I think the 650b+ size will be a lot of fun, I guess I need to build up some wheels and see if my thoughts are correct. Anyone have a spare set of derby rims laying around that they do not need?


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

nomadpop said:


> Hoping the WTB rims are out soon or Velocity comes out with a 27.5 dually
> Roy


I heard early Nov for the WTB rims and $149 a pop!


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

It's a waiting game now:


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## Guest (Sep 25, 2014)

is it @ a charging station??


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

Well I finally got the Trailblazer setup using Derby rims at 35mm inside width.
it wasn't even close shoving it into the Niner Air9 !! :nono: :madman:
the chain stays have full contact with the tire.. 
carcass is pretty big. I measured it out to 68mm wide. While that is only 3mm wider then a Schwalbe Rock Razor on the same rim the extra profile height gives quite a bit more volume.. I am measuring and trying the tire with 40+psi to account for tire growth which I'm sure this tire will have a lot of.

As a side note, it fits in a 27.5 Pike.. maybe 3mm-4mm clearance to the center of the arch
I'm going to run it on the front of my 27.5 Solo for awhile

Also.. Trailblazer fits with much better clearance in a 27.5 Fox 34..

I will try this wheel for fit in a Solo, Tallboy, Pivot LES, Gnarvester, etc. when I can.......


update:

I figured what the heck.......
I stuck a Derby rim setup with the Trailblazer in the back of my Santa Cruz SOLO
it is a tight fit............ :skep:
absolutely no mud clearence, maybe 3mm space across the chain stay yoke.
Far from optimal. But, it does go in there.
this is not the intended type of bike I want the B+ tire for.

sweet I'm goin' riding :thumbsup:


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

I would like to see if that vee tire will fit in my x-fusion trace 29'er fork.I really like the high volume tires on my fatty and these new 27+ tires might be a nice in between size.One thing for me is just the cushion from trail vibration.Takes longer for the hands to go numb.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

This is just the info I've been looking for - thanks!



flyinmike said:


> As a side note, it fits in a 27.5 Pike.. maybe 3mm-4mm clearance to the center of the arch
> I'm going to run it on the front of my 27.5 Solo for awhile
> 
> Also.. Trailblazer fits with much better clearance in a 27.5 Fox 34.
> ...


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

awai04 said:


> This is just the info I've been looking for - thanks!


So it doesn't hit the bottom of the crown under full compression?


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

flyinmike said:


> Well I finally got the Trailblazer setup using Derby rims at 35mm inside width.
> .....
> ....
> ..
> ...


update to da update:

There is a lot of tire growth and/or stretch on this tire. 
I rode the bike last night with 18-20psi.. There was no rubbing and clearance actually looked pretty good on the back of my Solo. 
24hrs later, I added some sealant to the back wheel, aired it up to 40psi and, shook the wheel for a while trying to get the beads to seal up a little better. Now the tire contacts the center arch on the back of my Solo. Reducing pressure to 20psi and there is less then 2mm at the center. 
This thing is a marshmallow 
this is defiantly not going to work with out plenty of clearance around the outside of the tire 
there have been numerous complaints that the Trailblazer should be a little bigger in diameter
I can see why it is a little less then 29" around.. spin this thing up and it grows
much more of a little Fatbike tire then it is a big trailbike tire.

For what I want it should work just fine.


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

mxer said:


> So it doesn't hit the bottom of the crown under full compression?


I can't spin the tire fast enough to know for sure..... See my post above.
the crown clearance would be my main concern there is a lot of arch clearance for the 27.5 Fox34
there are things you can do to prevent full travel or just run a little more air to be o the safe side
I've seen that the 29+ guys are using 29 Fox 32 forks with success. This will be the same game for the B+ bikes.
But, no way is this thing working in the back without a lot of space in the center :nonod:


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## nomadpop (Mar 12, 2007)

Ordered Derby rims today. Once I have the wheels setup with the tires I will see what bikes/forks they will work in in my travels to the bike shops I visit for work. Pretty excited for this setup!
Roy


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

*650B+ Tires*









27.5 Fox34 
WTB Trialblazer
Derby 40 rim









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Guest (Sep 26, 2014)

^ gobs of clearance


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

Thanks for the pics and info flyinmike.Now to wait and see what forks the vee tire will fit.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

If the 2.8 WTB tire barely fits the Pike, then the Vee tire probably will be too big, no? I thought about what suspension forks are going to fit a 3.25" tire and even the Fox looks like the fit will be tight. My eyeball estimate guesses that 3" width is going to be the upper limit of what works with the conventional forks. Anything wider is fat bike fork territory?? 

As far as goes Fox vs. Rockshox, too bad about the Pike. Seems like the Pike is the favored amongst the enduro crowd right now.



mxer said:


> Thanks for the pics and info flyinmike.Now to wait and see what forks the vee tire will fit.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

nvphatty said:


> is it @ a charging station??


I think you have to plug the new Trax Fatty's in. Otherwise, you'd have just a wide 27.5 tire.


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## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

awai04 said:


> If the 2.8 WTB tire barely fits the Pike, then the Vee tire probably will be too big, no?


27.5 Pike, not a chance:bluefrown::bluefrown: ..maybe a 29'er Pike



awai04 said:


> I thought about what suspension forks are going to fit a 3.25" tire and even the Fox looks like the fit will be tight. My eyeball estimate guesses that 3" width is going to be the upper limit of what works with the conventional forks. Anything wider is fat bike fork territory??
> 
> As far as goes Fox vs. Rockshox, too bad about the Pike. Seems like the Pike is the favored amongst the enduro crowd right now.


A 29 Fox32 narrowly fits a Knard29+ or the 3.0 Vee29+ tires
other then that the Bluto.. However, the Bluto introduces a whole new set of problems to overcome

the bike I want to build needs rack mounts, possibly an 83mm BB, plenty of tire clearance, a 100mm suspension fork, a wide range drivetrain, lots of stand over clearance and, be under 25lbs.. if it could double as a Fatbike with 3.8 tires and wheels that would be cool. but, I really don't want the 100mm BB and Fatbike geometry


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Sounds like you and I have similar frame designs in mind. Would be nice to go with a 27.5 fork size, which is advantageous with regard to weight and stiffness, theoretically at least. Not sure which (27.5 or 29) is better with regard to fork trail.

As for BB width, can a hard tail frame allowing rear tire width up to 3.0" and with dedicated 1x drivetrain design get away with standard 73mm mtb bottom brackets? Would be nice if it does.

I'd wish for 100-120mm travel, but on a 33-34mm stanchion fork, which makes for a less common combination(?); the 100mm Float 32 was kind of flexy (fore and aft) on my 29er.



flyinmike said:


> 27.5 Pike, not a chance:bluefrown::bluefrown: ..maybe a 29'er Pike
> 
> A 29 Fox32 narrowly fits a Knard29+ or the 3.0 Vee29+ tires
> other then that the Bluto.. However, the Bluto introduces a whole new set of problems to overcome
> ...


----------



## flyinmike (Dec 17, 2005)

awai04 said:


> Sounds like you and I have similar frame designs in mind. Would be nice to go with a 27.5 fork size, which is advantageous with regard to weight and stiffness, theoretically at least. Not sure which (27.5 or 29) is better with regard to fork trail.
> 
> As for BB width, can a hard tail frame allowing rear tire width up to 3.0" and with dedicated 1x drivetrain design get away with standard 73mm mtb bottom brackets? Would be nice if it does.
> 
> I'd wish for 100-120mm travel, but on a 33-34mm stanchion fork, which makes for a less common combination(?); the 100mm Float 32 was kind of flexy (fore and aft) on my 29er.


it would take a Bluto to be able to run the Nate's in the dunes or winter and I would think the width of that crown would interfere with the downtube. Since the main duty would be bike packing and trail riding with lots of low speed chunk, chatter, mush, and sand. I would probably be ok with having the Bluto only for Fatbike sessions and a rigid fork would not be out of the question either. 
For me and B+.. I want a slacker lower geometry then what a Fatbike really provides. So, the complexity of trying to build a single bike to do to many things keeps ringing louder and louder. I know I want a suspension fork with B+. So, I think your right. That's where the search begins--> what fork will work the best 
A 29er Pike might be the best bet for something as large as the Vee tire. But my 27.5 Fox 34 might be big enough for the Maxxis or Panaracer tires. We won't really know until we have them in our hands. Meanwhile, I just wish the Trailblazer would have fit in the back of the 29'er I have (Niner). I understand why they don't. It's just that I want to give these things a proper try..

update:

I would like to add that the 3.0 x 29'er Vee Trax has measured out to 2.7
So, the B+version may also measure out smaller then advertised. It should be fine in a 29'er fork


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

flyinmike said:


> it would take a Bluto to be able to run the Nate's in the dunes or winter and I would think the width of that crown would interfere with the downtube. Since the main duty would be bike packing and trail riding with lots of low speed chunk, chatter, mush, and sand. I would probably be ok with having the Bluto only for Fatbike sessions and a rigid fork would not be out of the question either.
> For me and B+.. I want a slacker lower geometry then what a Fatbike really provides. So, the complexity of trying to build a single bike to do to many things keeps ringing louder and louder. I know I want a suspension fork with B+. So, I think your right. That's where the search begins--> what fork will work the best
> A 29er Pike might be the best bet for something as large as the Vee tire. But my 27.5 Fox 34 might be big enough for the Maxxis or Panaracer tires. We won't really know until we have them in our hands. Meanwhile, I just wish the Trailblazer would have fit in the back of the 29'er I have (Niner). I understand why they don't. It's just that I want to give these things a proper try..
> 
> ...


Couple of questions:

Did I miss something, you mention Maxis 27.5+ tire???

The Trax Fatty measures 2.7 on what rim? I've read it's a bit smaller than the Knard, but that's a huge difference.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

bikeny said:


> Couple of questions:
> 
> The Trax Fatty measures 2.7 on what rim? I've read it's a bit smaller than the Knard, but that's a huge difference.


on Dually's the 29+ 3.0" version measure out at 2.8" according to Whit Meriwether Cycles

I've read one case on the 27.5 Trax Fatty measuring 72mm wide on Blunt 35's. I expect them t be much fatter on the new WTB or Stan's rims which are 50ish wide

mike


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

bikeny said:


> The Trax Fatty measures 2.7 on what rim? I've read it's a bit smaller than the Knard, but that's a huge difference.


VEE has a history of undersized tires, the 3.25" should measure 3" and make it a little bigger than the trailblazer, fine with me


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Cool. Now by slacker geo, do you mean a HA lower than 68?? That's what I would have in mind for a trail-oriented 650b+ hard tail that still is manageable on XC rides.

If the "3.25" " tires really measure out sub 3", then my guess is that they would physically fit within the standard 27.5" and/or 29" forks out there. Again, a 29er fork would mean 29er stack height, 29er fork weight, and (?) increased flex.

The Bluto and fat bike are together, at least in my mind at the moment, a totally different beast. I know some riders can keep up with their mtb friends on fatties, but I think I'd be doing too much work to keep it up all day long, lol! One of the thoughts I have with 650b+ is to keep the bike light enough to spend similar energy riding with friends on FS trail bikes.



flyinmike said:


> it would take a Bluto to be able to run the Nate's in the dunes or winter and I would think the width of that crown would interfere with the downtube. Since the main duty would be bike packing and trail riding with lots of low speed chunk, chatter, mush, and sand. I would probably be ok with having the Bluto only for Fatbike sessions and a rigid fork would not be out of the question either.
> For me and B+.. I want a slacker lower geometry then what a Fatbike really provides. So, the complexity of trying to build a single bike to do to many things keeps ringing louder and louder. I know I want a suspension fork with B+. So, I think your right. That's where the search begins--> what fork will work the best
> 
> A 29er Pike might be the best bet for something as large as the Vee tire. But my 27.5 Fox 34 might be big enough for the Maxxis or Panaracer tires. We won't really know until we have them in our hands. Meanwhile, I just wish the Trailblazer would have fit in the back of the 29'er I have (Niner). I understand why they don't. It's just that I want to give these things a proper try..
> ...


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

awai04 said:


> If the "3.25" " tires really measure out sub 3", then my guess is that they would physically fit within the standard 27.5" and/or 29" forks out there. .


the only way the Vee 3.25 tire will be under 3" is on a narrow rim (30 mm ID and smaller) With 45 mm ID rims it will be more like 3.1" based on the bead to bead width of 190 mm plus. That's wider than a Knard.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

It's certainly possible and I wouldn't want to buy all-new stuff and find out this is true. Then for what purpose you would want a 3.25" tire on a sub 30mm wide rim is yet another question!



senor_mikey said:


> the only way the Vee 3.25 tire will be under 3" is on a narrow rim (30 mm ID and smaller) With 45 mm ID rims it will be more like 3.1" based on the bead to bead width of 190 mm plus. That's wider than a Knard.


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

The vee looks pretty big on the fatlab components ti bike.Better pics on there fb page.


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## Entrenador (Oct 8, 2004)

bikeny said:


> I put that in another post, forget to mention it here. My EBB is set at around the 10:00 position, and the BB height is about 11.5". Sounds like it might be a bit low for chunk.


11.5" unloaded on +sized tires (at appropriate psi for such tires) might be closer to 11" when on the bike. Keep us posted.


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

TitanofChaos said:


> VEE has a history of undersized tires, the 3.25" should measure 3" and make it a little bigger than the trailblazer, fine with me


Does this help?


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

brant said:


> Does this help?
> 
> View attachment 928308


even if its 5 mm smaller... thats a big tire! Bigger than any old knard.

also mounted on a 60mm inside rim. Which rim is that?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

brant said:


> Does this help?


Thanks for the drawing, but it doesn't really help. Looks like a big tire, but it's mounted to a 60mm internal rim. Does that even exist in 27.5 size? It would be much more helpful shown on a 35mm or 40mm rim, as that's what's out there right now.

Also, any idea of release date?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

So how does the diameter of a 650b+ compare to a 24 x 4?

I had been thinking of building a 3-4" bike based on 26" wheels, but it looks like the 26+ category is dead even if Surly has a tire... so now it looks like a fat bike with a sliding drop out could be a winner.

I'm running a 26 x 4" Floater now on a Lurch, even slammed all the way forward I have 3/4" to spare, I didn't want a super tall tire like 29+, so this could work fine and make my Lurch more year round freindly.

Is there a good 50mm rim in 27.5 that doesn't cost an arm and a teste?


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## Guest (Oct 2, 2014)

Nurse Ben said:


> So how does the diameter of a 650b+ compare to a 26 x 4?


for sake of discussion a 26x3.8/4.0 equates to a standard 29er so a 650b+ will be shy of your intended target and result in BB drop.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

*sweet trax*

6.6" tall tis a lot of travel


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Yeah, and the bike is designed for a 5" tire, so I'll be dragging, might have to get some shorter cranks and a skid plate 

So then maybe it would make more sense to swing toward a 29+, I wonder if the Bluto has enough clearance...



nvphatty said:


> for sake of discussion a 26x3.8/4.0 equates to a standard 29er so a 650b+ will be shy of your intended target and result in BB drop.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> So how does the diameter of a 650b+ compare to a 24 x 4?
> 
> I had been thinking of building a 3-4" bike based on 26" wheels, but it looks like the 26+ category is dead even if Surly has a tire... so now it looks like a fat bike with a sliding drop out could be a winner.
> 
> ...


Do you mean 26 x 4?

650B+ should be almost identical diameter wise to a 26x4ish setup. Both of those will be slightly smaller than a decent sized 29er setup. A 29+ setup will be quite a bit bigger than any of these.

There are no 27.5 50mm rims out right now that I know of. Closest would the Derby and Nextie 40mm carbon offerings. In the future will be NoTubes Hugo and Velocity Dually, both aluminum.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

nvphatty said:


> for sake of discussion a 26x3.8/4.0 equates to a standard 29er so a 650b+ will be shy of your intended target and result in BB drop.


A 26x3.8/4.0 equates to a small 29er, like a 2.0/2.1, and 650B+ is almost the same. This stuff obviously depends a lot on the actual tire & rim combination.

Also, for the fat tires, the effective diameter when riding will be even smaller because of tire compression at low pressure.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

brant said:


> Does this help?


it gives hope and amusement 

by the math this tire should have a 210mm bead to bead diameter making it just over 3" even on a velocity 35 and an overall diameter of 28.99"

29er with 2.3 tires comes out to 29.09" diameter, basically no bottom bracket drop

works for me!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

bikeny said:


> 650B+ should be almost identical diameter wise to a 26x4ish setup.
> .


That's about what I was figuring, just didn't have the measurements.

Hugo is pricey for a budget build, maybe Derby or Nextie, not a Velocity fan, but WTB is generally price friendly, so I suppose I'll wait and see how much they get for their rim.

Does anyone have these in stock yet?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

TitanofChaos said:


> it gives hope and amusement
> 
> by the math this tire should have a 210mm bead to bead diameter making it just over 3" even on a velocity 35 and an overall diameter of 28.99"
> 
> ...


I'm not sure how you are calculating 210mm bead to bead, but I don't think that's right. In another thread, someone measured actual tires at 195mm bead to bead. This was pre-production, but I can't see them being that much different.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> That's about what I was figuring, just didn't have the measurements.
> 
> Hugo is pricey for a budget build, maybe Derby or Nextie, not a Velocity fan, but WTB is generally price friendly, so I suppose I'll wait and see how much they get for their rim.
> 
> Does anyone have these in stock yet?


I forgot about the WTB rims! I don't think the're available yet either though. They will probably be the most budget friendly, discounting the Dually. Why is the Hugo pricey, it will be cheaper than the Derby or Nextie? And wider.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

bikeny said:


> I'm not sure how you are calculating 210mm bead to bead, but I don't think that's right. In another thread, someone measured actual tires at 195mm bead to bead. This was pre-production, but I can't see them being that much different.


86mm casing = (60mm rim + "X" bead to bead)/3.14 solve for "X"...... 210mm


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## Guest (Oct 2, 2014)

TitanofChaos said:


> 86mm casing = (60mm rim + "X" bead to bead)/3.14 solve for "X"...... 210mm


huh?:crazy:


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

bikeny said:


> I forgot about the WTB rims! I don't think the're available yet either though. They will probably be the most budget friendly, discounting the Dually. Why is the Hugo pricey, it will be cheaper than the Derby or Nextie? And wider.


the prelim $$ estimate for the WTB Scraper was $149 retail. About the same as the Hugo. I guess big rims cost big money


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

does anyone have an ETA on any of the Rims - Dually, Hugo, Scraper?


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

For the WTB Trailblazer 2.8, on their rims, I have this:-

The measurements are:
Section width - 71.4mm 
Overall width - 59mm
Tread depth (center) 3.8mm
Tread depth (edge) 5.4 mm
Diameter 726.9 mm

Not much help.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Big rims shouldn't cost that much more, it's a scam, all of rims being about the same price, though some are clearly better quality and come from more reputable companies.

I would not pay the same for a WTB rim if I can get a Hugo or rabbit hole for the same price, WTB is pricing themselves out of the game. It's kinda like Surly and their tires...

So it looks like I'm gonna build some 650b+ mid fats for my fat bike, I do love building up new wheels, I'm like a kid at Christmas


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

TitanofChaos said:


> 86mm casing = (60mm rim + "X" bead to bead)/3.14 solve for "X"...... 210mm


maybe... but this is a drawing and Vee tires tend to run small. I'll bet the actual tire is approx 8% smaller and will be closer to an 78-80mm casing width.

Which will be great to have as an option if it fits your bike!

mike


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

MMcG said:


> does anyone have an ETA on any of the Rims - Dually, Hugo, Scraper?


Around 45 days on the Scraper rim been told...not sure about the others, but guessing not far behind. Would really like to see a 55-60 mm 27.5+ rim with cut outs or TCS ready mated to a light weight 3.2 - 3.5 tire...I know I'm dreaming.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

MMcG said:


> does anyone have an ETA on any of the Rims - Dually, Hugo, Scraper?


We're planning on seeing 27.5" Duallys in about 2 weeks.


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

brant said:


> Does this help?
> 
> View attachment 928308


Thanks Brant!
Sure helped me I can't wait to get hold of these tires. I think it will be THE perfect spring, summer and autum setup for my fatbike


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

So, anyone heard any news about the 27.5+ Trax Fatty? Still waiting patiently...


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

that c_g guy at twentynineinches.com has a pair and will be mounting them up and riding them soon according to his last report on the Trailblazer.

I received my Trailblazer last night.....I set it up on the front of my rigid Inbred conversion on a 28mm wide rim and it's HUGE - I love it.  I can only imagine how awesome it must be on a 35/40mm rim!!!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)




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## Guest (Oct 8, 2014)

^^ MMcG what did you use prior to the TB?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I've used several different 650b Tires - including NeoMotos, Nevegals, I think some Maxxis offerings, Wolverines, etc. This is my first High Volume/Mid-Fat 650b tire however.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

The pics remind me of the volume in the 26" 2.4" Trail Kings~ kicked up a notch and 650b


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## Guest (Oct 9, 2014)

Deerhill said:


> The pics remind me of the volume in the 26" 2.4" Trail Kings~ kicked up a notch and 650b


yes exactly


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## Mostyn (Sep 9, 2013)

Hey you guys,
Any narrower slicker 27.5 tyres to be had? Love my Hard-Tail 27.5 (650B) but only ride on country lanes and some fire roads; so looking to reduce the tyre width and amount of tread.. have the tyre manufacture's introduced any road style tyres for a 27.5 ??

I know this is a discussion on fatty-tyres; but thought you guys might know of narrow-slick-tyres for the 27.5?


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

Mostyn said:


> Hey you guys,
> Any narrower slicker 27.5 tyres to be had? Love my Hard-Tail 27.5 (650B) but only ride on country lanes and some fire roads; so looking to reduce the tyre width and amount of tread.. have the tyre manufacture's introduced any road style tyres for a 27.5 ??
> 
> I know this is a discussion on fatty-tyres; but thought you guys might know of narrow-slick-tyres for the 27.5?


How are riders using the TrailBlazer getting along with acceleration? It's center knobs are more present than the space between them is, giving the appearance of a quick tire.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Mostyn said:


> Hey you guys,
> Any narrower slicker 27.5 tyres to be had? Love my Hard-Tail 27.5 (650B) but only ride on country lanes and some fire roads; so looking to reduce the tyre width and amount of tread.. have the tyre manufacture's introduced any road style tyres for a 27.5 ??
> 
> I know this is a discussion on fatty-tyres; but thought you guys might know of narrow-slick-tyres for the 27.5?


yes there are plenty of options Look at the Rivendell site for ideas - also google Grand Bois Hetres


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

Are you guys ordering these direct from WTB?So we have the vee 3.2 coming and i believe Panaracer and Maxxis at 3.0?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

mxer said:


> Are you guys ordering these direct from WTB?So we have the vee 3.2 coming and i believe Panaracer and Maxxis at 3.0?


I ordered mine direct from WTB, not sure about everyone else.

The Vee Trax Fatty should be available soon I keep hearing.

And yes, Panaracer announced/showed a tire at Interbike, 27.5+ Fat B Nimble.

That's it for now, Maxxis has not announced anything.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I ordered mine via the WTB site as well - it was shipped pretty fast from CA to CT as well.


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

Thank you guys!Looks like I will be doing the wtb on back of my yelli and the vee up front once it is available.

bikeny do you have the VEE on order?


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

So what suspension forks will the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5" x 3.25" fit?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Welnic said:


> So what suspension forks will the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5" x 3.25" fit?


29er forks


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## GSJ1973 (May 8, 2011)

MMcG said:


> 29er forks


Please show me pics. I want to see how a 3.25" wide tire will fit in a 29er fork. Unless it is grossly under sized, my 3.0 Knard 29er rubs the sides of my FOX fork and I still have 2mm's at the top. Thanks in advance!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Have a look in the Canfield forum for the Thread on the B+ Nimble 9 - That bike is set up with 2.8s with room to spare in the fork, and the original poster states that he should be able to run the 3.25 in there too. Remember your Knards are on a 700c rim and these tires are on 650b rims - maybe that's how there's room.

http://forums.mtbr.com/canfield/27-5-wtb-tires-2013-nimble-9=-fun-h_ll-934661.html

Also remember this new "niche" tire-size was established primarily for converting 29ers - I think mainly with an adventure bike niche in mind. However people are seeing that they can be cool conversion projects to add tire volume to other types of 29er bikes.


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## TahoeBC (Apr 11, 2006)

Welnic said:


> So what suspension forks will the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5" x 3.25" fit?


I run 29+ tires in my Bluto fork no problem, gonna need a 150mm fat bike hub though


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

mxer said:


> Thank you guys!Looks like I will be doing the wtb on back of my yelli and the vee up front once it is available.
> 
> bikeny do you have the VEE on order?


No preorder, not sure where I would even do that. I put my email on a couple of web stores stock alert list, so hopefully they will notify me when they get them. I have tried getting an answer direct from Vee, but no luck there.

I also search every couple of days...


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Crossmax Quest 2.4 rear and Trailblazer 2.8 front on 28mm wide rims. Figured I'd share as a visual.

The Crossmax Quest 2.4 seems like a really nice tire, and I'm digging the Trailblazer - although I wonder how it will be in leafy fall New England conditions. We shall see I guess. Sorry for the crappy late night post-bike work photo here.


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

bikeny said:


> No preorder, not sure where I would even do that. I put my email on a couple of web stores stock alert list, so hopefully they will notify me when they get them. I have tried getting an answer direct from Vee, but no luck there.
> 
> I also search every couple of days...


Thanks bikeny.Keep us updated please!


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

MMcG said:


> View attachment 931189
> Crossmax Quest 2.4 rear and Trailblazer 2.8 front on 28mm wide rims. Figured I'd share as a visual.
> 
> The Crossmax Quest 2.4 seems like a really nice tire, and I'm digging the Trailblazer - although I wonder how it will be in leafy fall New England conditions. We shall see I guess. Sorry for the crappy late night post-bike work photo here.


Thanks MMcG!Having raced my DB quite a bit in NE it might be a bit sketchy on the front.I am gonna try one on back of my yelli.Should the new Panaracer 3.0 fit back there I would use that but seems the TB is gonna be wide as we can go on the Yelli.Hope I am wrong.LOL


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## nomadpop (Mar 12, 2007)

Just got my 650+ build out for the first ride this evening. Went with Derby Rims and WTB TrailBlazer tires front and rear. Fun but will take a some time to see how I like it. So far, pretty fun though!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

nomadpop said:


> View attachment 931323
> 
> Just got my 650+ build out for the first ride this evening. Went with Derby Rims and WTB TrailBlazer tires front and rear. Fun but will take a some time to see how I like it. So far, pretty fun though!


 what fork?

I did a short ride on my bike with the Trailblazer up front. Found out you need to find the tire pressure sweet spot. Too much air and you bounce around - to low and tire squirms a little on my 28mm wide rims


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## Guest (Oct 15, 2014)

MMcG said:


> what fork?
> 
> I did a short ride on my bike with the Trailblazer up front. Found out you need to find the tire pressure sweet spot. Too much air and you bounce around - to low and tire squirms a little on my 28mm wide rims


very similar to what 3.8 and above fat tires do.


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

MMcG said:


> 29er forks


The twenty nine inches site says the only fork the vee fatty fits so far is the new dt swiss.So a bluto,lefty or the new rs1 fork it would be for now i suppose.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

mxer said:


> The twenty nine inches site says the only fork the fee fatty fits so far is the new dt swiss.So a bluto,lefty or the new rs1 fork it would be for now i suppose.


LInk?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

MMcG said:


> LInk?


It's mentioned at the end of the DT fork review:

DT Swiss OPM O.D.I. 29"er Fork: First Impressions

He says the WTB tire fits all his forks, but the Vee trax Fatty only fits the DT fork.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

ahhh - thanks.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Probably will still work in suspension corrected rigid forks but making it too big to fit current 29"er sus forks won't help sales I would imagine.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

bikeny said:


> It's mentioned at the end of the DT fork review:
> 
> DT Swiss OPM O.D.I. 29"er Fork: First Impressions
> 
> He says the WTB tire fits all his forks, but the Vee trax Fatty only fits the DT fork.


I don't really understand how the Vee Trax Fatty is going to fit in that fork. Looking at the specs on the DT Swiss site for that fork it says that it has 62mm of clearance. Brant's drawing of the Vee Trax Fatty has it at 86mm, but on a 60mm rim. But even on a way smaller rim I just don't see how it is going to work.

It is a nice looking fork though.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

review of the Vee Trax Fatty is up on 29inches.de VEETIRE CO. Trax Fatty Reifen in 27,5x3,25 ? Kurztest

79mm wide on the 35mm rim means this is only for a fatbike or a custom at the moment. Or as a front with a Krampus/ECR fork.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

senor_mikey said:


> review of the Vee Trax Fatty is up on 29inches.de VEETIRE CO. Trax Fatty Reifen in 27,5x3,25 ? Kurztest
> 
> 79mm wide on the 35mm rim means this is only for a fatbike or a custom at the moment. Or as a front with a Krampus/ECR fork.


I wonder how a Trailblazer rear Trax Fatty front combo would work on a rigid bike though?


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

MMcG said:


> I wonder how a Trailblazer rear Trax Fatty front combo would work on a rigid bike though?


It should work great!More traction and added cush do to the higher sidewall.Might slacken your geo a bit if you are concerned about that.I would run it!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

mxer said:


> It should work great!More traction and added cush do to the higher sidewall.Might slacken your geo a bit if you are concerned about that.I would run it!


You'd have to find the right 29er frame to do it on though. Maybe something like a Karate Monkey, or Kona Unit 29er (something that has room for decent sized 29er wheels/tires)


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

The whole idea behind b+ was compatibility with existing 29" frames and forks. While the Vee tire above will fit existing 29+ and Fat bikes, of which there are plenty of options, it seems to be creating the need for a whole new category of frames and forks. Again. 

To me the whole idea behind + and fat is the ability to run low pressure efficiently and effectively. I am running 2.1 and 2.2 tires at 15/17psi on 35mm wide 622 rims tubed in an 18 year old frame and they afford all the traction, steering control and suppleness that I need without any pinch flat problems. Leading me to believe that the key to low pressure is less about the width of the tire than the width of the rim.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Bigwheel said:


> The whole idea behind b+ was compatibility with existing 29" frames and forks. While the Vee tire above will fit existing 29+ and Fat bikes, of which there are plenty of options, it seems to be creating the need for a whole new category of frames and forks. Again.
> 
> To me the whole idea behind + and fat is the ability to run low pressure efficiently and effectively. I am running 2.1 and 2.2 tires at 15/17psi on 35mm wide 622 rims tubed in an 18 year old frame and they afford all the traction, steering control and suppleness that I need without any pinch flat problems. Leading me to believe that the key to low pressure is less about the width of the tire than the width of the rim.


What type of terrain are you riding with that set up? Rim width regardless of tire size is important for low PSI IMHO. For example I have 28mm wide rims and put a Trailblazer 2.8 up front with a tube..........it was okay but not great with a rim of that width. I suspect it would be WAY better with a 35mm wide rim all the way on up to say a 40mm Derby 650b rim. Not sure about them on something wider like the Dually or upcoming Hugo - unless it were for a mid-fat type of bike I guess. And that's not really what I was going after right now.

I'm hoping to find a good deal on some P35 or Flow EX rims/Wheels to see what the Trailblazer feels like with a rim of that width.

Cheers,

Mark


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

The area I have been riding is sand based covered with pine needles with a lot of roots. So flotation, traction and the ability to take some hard hits on the front and rear are key. This is an area I have ridden a lot on the same bike (rigid single speed btw) set up at 30 psi on narrower rims with the same tires and there is really no comparison to how much better it is at the lower pressure. I have been getting enough rim strikes, primarily in the front, that make me cringe and waiting for the inevitable pssssssss but so far so good. The rear end seems to follow much better also and not buck around. The odd thing to me is that on gravel and pave' the bike feels just as fast as it ever has.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

Bigwheel said:


> The whole idea behind b+ was compatibility with existing 29" frames and forks. While the Vee tire above will fit existing 29+ and Fat bikes, of which there are plenty of options, it seems to be creating the need for a whole new category of frames and forks. Again. .


I would sure agree with this ^^ if we were talking about the WTB 2.8" tire but the Vee and the upcoming 3" Panaracer are about new bikes to me. Sure they make sense on 26" fatbikes as they don't raise up the BB too high like 29+ wheels do. But there are ton's of bike frame builders out there who can ( and are right now) building frames for these tires.

That said, there are frames out there that these will fit.. the Singular Swift for example.
And I'll bet some Co's are planning framesets right now. It seems to me that the wheels/tires have to come 1st and frames will follow.

For me the more options out there, the better.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Obviously there is no single tire/rim setup that is going to please everybody. So you are correct that the more options there are the better. Ones that fit within existing frames or those that create a new standard, it is all good as long as it is sustainable within the industry. So at this point is the chance of ROI for a manufacturer to make a tire that fits many frames or just a few? 

The one good thing is that it does
mean more potential business for custom builders. Unless in the case of b+ you are going to be happy with the $500 Bikes Direct version or waiting for the BIC to join in, or more tire options or a certain fork etc. etc..


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## miles e (Jan 16, 2004)

nomadpop said:


> Went with Derby Rims and WTB TrailBlazer tires front and rear.


Very nice!

Sorry if I missed this elsewhere, but what is the height of the wheel with the Derby Rims/TB 2.8? Probably still a bit under 29", no?


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

*veetrax on swift*



senor_mikey said:


> I would sure agree with this ^^ if we were talking about the WTB 2.8" tire but the Vee and the upcoming 3" Panaracer are about new bikes to me. Sure they make sense on 26" fatbikes as they don't raise up the BB too high like 29+ wheels do. But there are ton's of bike frame builders out there who can ( and are right now) building frames for these tires.
> 
> That said, there are frames out there that these will fit.. the Singular Swift for example.
> And I'll bet some Co's are planning framesets right now. It seems to me that the wheels/tires have to come 1st and frames will follow.
> ...


Hello Mikey.
Are you sure that the 2gen swift can swallow veetrax fatty27.5 on rear.
that would be awesome if it would.
That would meen that gryphon would do the same and what an lovely bike that is!!
Cheers Riku


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

rikardo said:


> Hello Mikey.
> Are you sure that the 2gen swift can swallow veetrax fatty27.5 on rear.
> that would be awesome if it would.
> That would meen that gryphon would do the same and what an lovely bike that is!!
> Cheers Riku


I've seen photos of those two frames clearing a Trailblazer 2.8 - so it may be possible


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## GSJ1973 (May 8, 2011)

Bigwheel said:


> The whole idea behind b+ was compatibility with existing 29" frames and forks. While the Vee tire above will fit existing 29+ and Fat bikes, of which there are plenty of options, it seems to be creating the need for a whole new category of frames and forks. Again.


^^^This.

I still struggle to see the benefit of a 27.5 x 3.0. At what point is this any better than a 29er tire at the same height or even taller for the 29er tire?


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

MMcG said:


> I've seen photos of those two frames clearing a Trailblazer 2.8 - so it may be possible


Thank for your info.
any links to the pictures?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

GSJ1973 said:


> ^^^This.
> 
> I still struggle to see the benefit of a 27.5 x 3.0. At what point is this any better than a 29er tire at the same height or even taller for the 29er tire?


The benefit is being able to safely run low tire pressure. With a 3" wide tire, you can run pressures down around 10 to 15 psi. This allows the tire to really conform to the terrain, making for a much more comfortable ride as well as much better traction. The problem with a bigger 29er tire (29+) is that the diameter starts to get too big and effects the handling of the bike, as well as requiring some compromises in frame design, especially for smaller sizes.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

rikardo said:


> Thank for your info.
> any links to the pictures?


I have them on my phone - they were sent to me by someone on Facebook. You can also contact the US Distributor for Singular (he's the one who sent me the pics)


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

bikeny said:


> The benefit is being able to safely run low tire pressure. With a 3" wide tire, you can run pressures down around 10 to 15 psi. This allows the tire to really conform to the terrain, making for a much more comfortable ride as well as much better traction. The problem with a bigger 29er tire (29+) is that the diameter starts to get too big and effects the handling of the bike, as well as requiring some compromises in frame design, especially for smaller sizes.


bikeny nailed it - so you get the extra volume, lower pressure, and more conformation to the terrain - aka potentially more tire contact/traction.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

MMcG said:


> I have them on my phone - they were sent to me by someone on Facebook. You can also contact the US Distributor for Singular (he's the one who sent me the pics)


They have pictures of the Vee Trax Fatty mounted on Blunts35's on their FB page https://www.facebook.com/ColoradoSp...7112091013568/757111664346944/?type=1&theater


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

GSJ1973 said:


> ^^^This.
> 
> I still struggle to see the benefit of a 27.5 x 3.0. At what point is this any better than a 29er tire at the same height or even taller for the 29er tire?


As pointed out by others it is about the ability to run low pressure and the benefits as described.

Pretty much all the significant advances in tire technology to date are focused on the ability to run lower pressure. UST, sealants, fat bike tires, 29+ and b+ all are aimed squarely at just that. Diameter means less for lower pressure than overall volume of air which is more about tire and rim width.


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## bubba13 (Nov 30, 2009)

Can anyone offer insight on the 27.5+ Trailblazer vs. a 2.4/5 29 inch tire on a wide rim? Like a 29x2.5 Maxxis DHF mounted on an Ibis 41 or Derby 35 rim? Insights toward ride quality and wheel stiffness between the two.

The reason I ask is I am considering building an aggressive hard tail, but want some cushion at the back of the bike. I own a Surly ECR with 29+ Knards on 45mm Dually's and that tire/rim combo is excellent for that style of rigid bike. Decided I am not interested in 29+ for a bike with front suspension for various reasons. I am curious if a 29 2.5 DHF or 2.4 Trail King on a moderately wide rim at pressures around 20psi would offer a similar ride to what WTB is offering with the 27.5+. I am guessing a good 35mm+ carbon rim should offer decent lateral stiffness in a 29" hoop?

My last AM hard tail was an Evil Soverign with 26" 2.25 tires on 20somethingmm wide rims. Would like to get away from the harshness and wheel hang ups in rough terrain experienced with that bike. Also currently own a 27.5 fully with the 40mm Derby rims so I am on board with the wider rim trend.

Thanks.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

if it helps: WTB Trailblazer 2.8: 27.5+ revolution? | drj0nswanderings

there is no doubt that even compared to a front DHF2.5 admitedly on a 30mm enve rim, the trailbalzer is considerably more plush. wheteher this is casing related or volume related im not sure - even the single ply DHF i have is a pretty bomber tyre afterall.


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## bubba13 (Nov 30, 2009)

dRjOn said:


> if it helps: WTB Trailblazer 2.8: 27.5+ revolution? | drj0nswanderings
> 
> there is no doubt that even compared to a front DHF2.5 admitedly on a 30mm enve rim, the trailbalzer is considerably more plush. wheteher this is casing related or volume related im not sure - even the single ply DHF i have is a pretty bomber tyre afterall.


Thanks drj0n. Good info on your blog. It will be interesting to see what happens with 27.5+ and what the average tire sizes will be. It may be wise for me to hold off on this and see if 27.5+ sizing trends alternative 29 or fat bike tires. Would rather not build a bike that only has one tire choice again.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Seems to me a frame built to accept b+ tires up to 76mm on 45mm rims or so will have the capacity for 2.5 29" tires on 40ish wide rims also which gives you plenty of options now and into the future to run even 15psi. 

One thing you might look at is widening the rear end to 150/157 also.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Probably a wise idea to see how it all shakes out. I do think a frame with a 150mm rear and 83mm BB shell would be perfect for this style of bike. The components are out there, just need the frames!

I think a frame with the above 150/83 spacing could be made to accept 26x3.8, 27.5x3, and 29x2.5 without too much trouble. Maybe an EBB to adjust BB height a bit.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

See, I think about a press fit, wider bb shell matched up to an 83mm crank axle, and 150/157 rear hub and perhaps pulling the wheel in a bit more. It would run a 29 or a 27.5x3 or so. It would be ti. Hmmmmm .... ~


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Now you guys are talking about the bike I've been saying needs to be built. However, you will have to educate me. Why wouldn't a 73mm bb work? At least for the 27.5x3 tires and wide 29er tires? I only say this so as not to scare off those who think 83 is too nicheish.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

bikeny said:


> I think a frame with the above 150/83 spacing could be made to accept 26x3.8, 27.5x3, and 29x2.5 without too much trouble. Maybe an EBB to adjust BB height a bit.


One frame to rule them all.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

You could build the 27.5" x 3.25" tire magic frame with a 73mm BB, but there would probably be less compromising with tire clearance, chain line and chain stay length if you used 83mm. It would just be deciding what you think is more important. For instance I'm not having any trouble with the 100mm BB on my Mukluk, I only really notice it when I stand to pedal. For me, I would rather go with an 83mm BB if it meant that the chain stays could be 10mm shorter.


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## bubba13 (Nov 30, 2009)

Slow Danger said:


> Now you guys are talking about the bike I've been saying needs to be built. However, you will have to educate me. Why wouldn't a 73mm bb work? At least for the 27.5x3 tires and wide 29er tires? I only say this so as not to scare off those who think 83 is too nicheish.


I could see a 73mm bb and 142x12 working ok, unless the tires are wider than a 29x3 Knard. I have the 2x set up on my ECR with a 2x XT crank and two spacers on the BB. I get some tire to chain rub in low gear but my chain line is better than what the Surly 2x crank offers. I highly doubt the upcoming Dirt Wizard 29x3 will work on the back of my ECR as set up.

If I was starting from a clean slate and building a new bike. I would prefer the 83mm bb and 157x12 hub for a better chain line and clearance for an aggressive tire. This would be the case for 27.5+ or 29+. The 29 could benefit greatly in lateral stiffness from a wider hub anyway.


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

bubba13 said:


> Can anyone offer insight on the 27.5+ Trailblazer vs. a 2.4/5 29 inch tire on a wide rim? Like a 29x2.5 Maxxis DHF mounted on an Ibis 41 or Derby 35 rim? Insights toward ride quality and wheel stiffness between the two.
> 
> The reason I ask is I am considering building an aggressive hard tail, but want some cushion at the back of the bike. I own a Surly ECR with 29+ Knards on 45mm Dually's and that tire/rim combo is excellent for that style of rigid bike. Decided I am not interested in 29+ for a bike with front suspension for various reasons. I am curious if a 29 2.5 DHF or 2.4 Trail King on a moderately wide rim at pressures around 20psi would offer a similar ride to what WTB is offering with the 27.5+. I am guessing a good 35mm+ carbon rim should offer decent lateral stiffness in a 29" hoop?
> 
> ...


Being on the B+ tire I am inclined to come to a conclusion where the tire is not truly intended to be rushed onto 30mm and wider rims. The Tread is neatly matched to the profile of the casing, and the tread pattern is asymmetrical from the center tread. Having the non-stretched outer diameter of the tire-profile provides alot of methods to achieve performance and a range of performance. 
There was at first the working-impression of building a wheelset similar to my Trail Bike 35mm rim - I now don't think it is needed, so I will not be. The base rims will simply have some tighter hubs slipped in and improve just from there.
These tires specifically seem to be rooted well within the classic infrastructure of Mtn. Bike  - modern'd klunker.

So - pretty sure there's nothing to match this in 2.1-2.5" 29 tires at all.


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Haint said:


> Being on the B+ tire I am inclined to come to a conclusion where tire is not truly intended to be rushed onto 30mm and wider rims. The Tread is neatly matched to the profile of the casing, and the tread pattern is asymmetrical from the center tread. Having the non-stretched outer diameter of the tire-profile provides alot of methods to achieve performance and a range of performance.
> There was at first the working-impression of building a wheelset similar to my Trail Bike 35mm rim - I now don't think it is needed, so I will not be. The base rims will simply have some tighter hubs slipped in and improve just from there.
> These tires specifically seem to be rooted well within the classic infrastructure of Mtn. Bike  - modern'd klunker.
> 
> So - pretty sure there's nothing to match this in 2.1-2.5" 29 tires at all.


I have not a clue what you intended to say.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

shiggy said:


> I have not a clue what you intended to say.


Ditto!


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Sounds like an EAASL poster that is getting the performance he seeks out of the b+ on a narrower rim. Which kind of contradicts the prevailing concept here of the wider rims involvement overall. 

Having not ridden the b+ tire, oddly enough, on any rim I can't dispute his claim and that in fact was the original intention of the TB which was drawn for production based on an i25 rim. But I personally am finding that a wider rim has more effect on the ability to run lower pressures without the penalties associated with that, pinch flatting, increased rolling resistance and self steering issues.


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

shiggy said:


> I have not a clue what you intended to say.


Finding comfort - like mid-OP states hardly comes from cherry picking single items with the intent on them acting as a wholly matched item. How'd a concept like taking one 2.5" tire on a 40mm rim at all factor into how one 2.8" tire on a shorter rim diameter would mimic itself? 
There is an abundance of methods to enhance performance from baseline spec which do not discard the foundation of the build - rims, tires especially. Assuming every Dirty Dan, Toothy Tom, or Hung Harry for that matter is going to at all be considerable with a completely other tire and/or rim - it is troubling and Bicycling is not my profession. Does the recreation have to breed disfunction inorder to sustain itself? Use some readily available common sense! Two of the same tires first why not instead of the procreation of contraptions?



MMcG said:


> Ditto!


Blotto.



Bigwheel said:


> Sounds like an EAASL poster that is getting the performance he seeks out of the b+ on a narrower rim. Which kind of contradicts the prevailing concept here of the wider rims involvement overall.
> 
> Having not ridden the b+ tire, oddly enough, on any rim I can't dispute his claim and that in fact was the original intention of the TB which was drawn for production based on an i25 rim. But I personally am finding that a wider rim has more effect on the ability to run lower pressures without the penalties associated with that, pinch flatting, increased rolling resistance and self steering issues.


I have taken these w/ comfort to about 20 R and 15 F, rigid build, and I weigh probably 215 w/ a 12L pack. Doubtful there'd be any significant improvement with some wider wheels, first thing I would expect would be slowed acceleration - not anything hinting at more performance me thinks.


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## bubba13 (Nov 30, 2009)

Useless comment edited.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Not to interrupt the flow of the existing conversation, but I'd like to add to the database. I finally setup my 650b+ wheels tonight: 40mm Derbys with the 2.8 WTB Trailblazers.









I gotta hand it to Ray Derby for getting the rim contour just right; the tire beads went up and over without any extra fuss. Then centering the beads on the rim first, before giving the sidewalls a little tug to tighten the bead against the rim, was all it took to inflate up to 40 psi and seat the Trailblazer tires with a hand floor pump. I have no sealant in the tires and yet the wheel/tire combo has kept well inflated for the last hour.

And FYI, clearance on a 2015 Fox Float 34 27.5 is exactly 10mm -enough for playing in the dirt??


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

awai04 said:


> Not to interrupt the flow of the existing conversation, but I'd like to add to the database. I finally setup my 650b+ wheels tonight: 40mm Derbys with the 2.8 WTB Trailblazers.


Those look awesome. What frame are they going on?


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

r1Gel said:


> Those look awesome. What frame are they going on?


This may sound strange, but I have not committed to a frame as of yet. I just know that I'm on board with the fat tire thing and that this wheel combo would be the basis for a really fun bike. It's likely that I eventually will go custom and have designed around them a "short" chain stay (i.e. sub 17") hard tail with standard mtb BB width and front suspension. That said, I have another bike project that is taking priority this winter. If in the meantime, a mass-produced frame becomes available, then I may have to jump on it instead. I do think that this is the more interesting of the two projects.


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## r1Gel (Jan 14, 2004)

awai04 said:


> This may sound strange, but I have not committed to a frame as of yet. I just know that I'm on board with the fat tire thing and that this wheel combo would be the basis for a really fun bike. It's likely that I eventually will go custom and have designed around them a "short" chain stay (i.e. sub 17") hard tail with standard mtb BB width and front suspension. That said, I have another bike project that is taking priority this winter. If in the meantime, a mass-produced frame becomes available, then I may have to jump on it instead. I do have to say that this is the more interesting of the two projects.


Haha! Way to keep us in suspense 
'looking forward to the build. Do keep us posted.
cheers


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

r1Gel said:


> Haha! Way to keep us in suspense
> 'looking forward to the build. Do keep us posted.
> cheers


Lol, thanks! I will. Cheers to you too


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

@bigwheel - im sort of doing the (opposite?) experiment with my 44 bikes 29+ er... (29+er? sheesh!)

i HAD rabbit holes and 120 tpi knards set up ghetto tubeless. ive changed to 35mm derby rims (not ridden yet, just mounted) primarily to drop weight (around 600g all in) so it will be interesting to see how 15mm less rim width afects the whole shebang....

the thing im most intersted in is the effect of the tyre rolling around on the rim...as suggested by the diagram Syntace use to explain their use of wider rims....

Syntace










with the high quality rim/tyre interface im not expecting too many burps at the same or very similar pressure as i run on rabbit holes (9psi front, 10psi rear) -esp as knards go sideways pretty easily - so it will be interesting to see what the ride is like


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

dRjOn said:


> @bigwheel - im sort of doing the (opposite?) experiment with my 44 bikes 29+ er... (29+er? sheesh!)
> 
> i HAD rabbit holes and 120 tpi knards set up ghetto tubeless. ive changed to 35mm derby rims (not ridden yet, just mounted) primarily to drop weight (around 600g all in) so it will be interesting to see how 15mm less rim width afects the whole shebang....
> 
> ...


Since it should be obvious a bike like that will not be ridden as a trailbike would, just keep in mind what else Syntace suggests - that being tire selection. Going too wide with any tire having tread patterns as the WTB tire of mention in this thread - it will cause flat spotted rims. True fat bike tires however don't sound the alarm though. 
Bingo out.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

we'll certainly see!....rims have moved on since the P35, i wont be too upset if it gets trashed and i need to build it up with somethign better....i do like the bead shelf lips you get on rims these days...


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

dRjOn said:


> we'll certainly see!....rims have moved on since the P35, i wont be too upset if it gets trashed and i need to build it up with somethign better....i do like the bead shelf lips you get on rims these days...


Yep - that's a no brainer. It's the seemingly impending threads about which tire should get a ProCore having me feeling it's time to move on.
...and that's not a certain _tire_ or _size_. I mean - _which tire._rft:ut::yesnod::headphones::yawn::ihih::crazy:


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

@drjon. While we may appear to be at opposites as I am working my way up the rim width chain and you are scaling back I think we are both headed towards the same conclusion? Low pressure, no matter how you achieve it, is a good thing. But getting there without gaining rotating weight, sacrificing handling aspects and durability and tailoring it towards the terrain that we want to ride can be an expensive shot in the dark and at some point we should just quit worrying about it and ride our bikes instead of letting our bikes ride us. 

Where we are at opposites is in regards to the front tire configuration. I personally don't like the effects of a big wide fat heavy front tire and am having a much better overall experience than I had with that setup with a narrower tire on the front and a wider one on the rear that are as close as possible to the same diameter oa. But to each his own for sure and it is not like I am trying to change anyones mind about this but I doubt mine will change about it anytime soon.


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## nm13 (Jun 5, 2005)

bikeny said:


> Probably a wise idea to see how it all shakes out. I do think a frame with a 150mm rear and 83mm BB shell would be perfect for this style of bike. The components are out there, just need the frames!
> 
> I think a frame with the above 150/83 spacing could be made to accept 26x3.8, 27.5x3, and 29x2.5 without too much trouble. Maybe an EBB to adjust BB height a bit.


http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/waltworks-83mm-bottom-bracket-fatbike-build-935207.html
Interesting that they are using a 170mm hub to get a good chainline. I think it's because they also used an offset chain ring to get additional tire clearance.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

dRjOn said:


> @bigwheel - im sort of doing the (opposite?) experiment with my 44 bikes 29+ er... (29+er? sheesh!)
> 
> i HAD rabbit holes and 120 tpi knards set up ghetto tubeless. ive changed to 35mm derby rims (not ridden yet, just mounted) primarily to drop weight (around 600g all in) so it will be interesting to see how 15mm less rim width afects the whole shebang....
> 
> ...


I have not ridden the Knard on a narrow rim, but there have been enough comments posted on the forums that they feel like they want to fold over when cornering, that I am not interested in trying it. I went with the Nextie 50mm carbon rims for weight savings. They are cheaper than the Derby rims and weigh around the same or 50g more, depending on what version of the Derby rims you buy. After a couple of weeks on them, I am very impressed.

I do have Derby 27.5 40mm rims for the B+ tires, and think that's a good match for the Trailblazer. Not much else available as a rim only right now.

Sorry Haint, but I have no idea what you are trying to say in any of your posts!


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

nm13 said:


> http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/waltworks-83mm-bottom-bracket-fatbike-build-935207.html
> Interesting that they are using a 170mm hub to get a good chainline. I think it's because they also used an offset chain ring to get additional tire clearance.


That looks like a sweet build! He is using a BB30 chainring on a GXP crank, which moves the chainring out like 5mm to match up better with the 170 rear end, very smart!


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

bikeny said:


> Sorry Haint, but I have no idea what you are trying to say in any of your posts!


I am in no position to sell anything on anyone, the B+ tires I chose to build a bike around work quite well on some standard rims. ...have been on bikes for 30+ years, I am not latched onto trends. But going with these to such and such rim at a new width will be a compromise -- Syntace's website clearly makes that statement. 
I've already gone and dinged up a W35MX on a 7" bike. 
Taking these tires to that length on anything but a trekking bike will prove itself less than ideal. Take it for what it is, and do with it however you feel. I mean - this is the Internet.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Haint said:


> I am in no position to sell anything on anyone, the B+ tires I chose to build a bike around work quite well on some standard rims. ...have been on bikes for 30+ years, I am not latched onto trends. But going with these to such and such rim at a new width will be a compromise -- Syntace's website clearly makes that statement.
> I've already gone and dinged up a W35MX on a 7" bike.
> Taking these tires to that length on anything but a trekking bike will prove itself less than ideal. Take it for what it is, and do with it however you feel. I mean - this is the Internet.


I'm not discounting your opinions, I honestly am not sure what you are saying. From this post it sounds like you are saying that these tires perform better on normal width rims? And that using wider rims causes more problems like dinged rims etc.?

Also, what Syntace statement are you referring to? From the above link, it looks like they are all for wider rims, and say their 35mm rims are good for tires up to 2.5", meaning wider tires should be on even wider rims.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

awai04 said:


> Not to interrupt the flow of the existing conversation, but I'd like to add to the database. I finally setup my 650b+ wheels tonight: 40mm Derbys with the 2.8 WTB Trailblazers.


Looks very nice.

Could you measure the maximum tire width you're getting on the 40mm rims?


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

bikeny said:


> I'm not discounting your opinions, I honestly am not sure what you are saying. From this post it sounds like you are saying that these tires perform better on normal width rims? And that using wider rims causes more problems like dinged rims etc.?
> 
> Also, what Syntace statement are you referring to? From the above link, it looks like they are all for wider rims, and say their 35mm rims are good for tires up to 2.5", meaning wider tires should be on even wider rims.


Syntace is willing to address publicly each factor involved w/ altering conventional rim width offerings. Fittingly peculiar, I have had 35mm rims since 2005, but just now spreading internal dimensions has found itself progress.
Regardless - any tire will lose factional-height if taken wider from B2B (taken from another forum B+ tire thread. OP had a Dial Indicator, must be legit...). But what manufacturers consider nominal tread patterns become compromised if those migrated rim flanges become exposed to other-than-tread designated casing.

As far as this B+ tire popular in our thread here, consider the fact the maker does not have any rims able to be touted as 'wide' except that new rim. That - for me - will pretty much be an only option if available over rims spec'd like what has been fitted in my case. I cannot fit them however and instead am pleased, satisfied, content, contented, a little smug, and relieved I can just lace up some hubs once winter grime goes wherever it goes to in the Spring.

Once again, there's no information I can provide other than what works and does not contradict established fact. Should a frame be able to accommodate a 45mm rim with these tires, likely they'd work. These seem to be more ready to accept to true 29+ tires, or for other future B+ type tire.

The tire sidewall reads 30 psi min - 45 psi max. So what tire pressure is it again that you recommend? 10psi right?? The Owners Manual states 'Your tires should ALWAYS be inflated within the minimum and maximum pressure range.'

http://wtb-bike.hu/data/support/WTB_TireInstV11-EN.pdf

I am not comfortable at 15psi as I did, 20psi would still be over low. But hey if they tires don't grenade themselves off the rims then...

...inflationary-spending? Perhaps??


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

Haint said:


> Syntace is willing to address publicly each factor involved w/ altering conventional rim width offerings. Fittingly peculiar, I have had 35mm rims since 2005, but just now spreading internal dimensions has found itself progress.
> Regardless - any tire will lose factional-height if taken wider from B2B (taken from another forum B+ tire thread. OP had a Dial Indicator, must be legit...). But what manufacturers consider nominal tread patterns become compromised if those migrated rim flanges become exposed to other-than-tread designated casing.
> 
> As far as this B+ tire popular in our thread here, consider the fact the maker does not have any rims able to be touted as 'wide' except that new rim. That - for me - will pretty much be an only option if available over rims spec'd like what has been fitted in my case. I cannot fit them however and instead am pleased, satisfied, content, contented, a little smug, and relieved I can just lace up some hubs once winter grime goes wherever it goes to in the Spring.
> ...


What the heck are you trying to say?

Quit (mis)using words that you do not know the meaning of, and write simply and plainly. Then we MIGHT understand the points you are attempting to make.


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

bubba13 said:


> Can anyone offer insight on the 27.5+ Trailblazer vs. a 2.4/5 29 inch tire on a wide rim? Like a 29x2.5 Maxxis DHF mounted on an Ibis 41 or Derby 35 rim? Insights toward ride quality and wheel stiffness between the two.
> 
> The reason I ask is I am considering building an aggressive hard tail, but want some cushion at the back of the bike. I own a Surly ECR with 29+ Knards on 45mm Dually's and that tire/rim combo is excellent for that style of rigid bike. Decided I am not interested in 29+ for a bike with front suspension for various reasons. I am curious if a 29 2.5 DHF or 2.4 Trail King on a moderately wide rim at pressures around 20psi would offer a similar ride to what WTB is offering with the 27.5+. I am guessing a good 35mm+ carbon rim should offer decent lateral stiffness in a 29" hoop?
> 
> ...


I went from Maxxis Ikon 29x2.35 on a blunt 35 to the Trailblazer on a blunt 35 and noticed a fair addition of cush


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

savo said:


> Looks very nice.
> 
> Could you measure the maximum tire width you're getting on the 40mm rims?


X2, throw us a bone awai04


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Sounds an awful lot like Haint is British. 
I watch BBC too much.


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

shiggy said:


> What the heck are you trying to say?
> 
> Quit (mis)using words that you do not know the meaning of, and write simply and plainly. Then we MIGHT understand the points you are attempting to make.


There's no reason to be seeing countless posts asking about how a tire works on this rim, or this rim, or... it makes for only sheeple forum population(s). Personally I get sick and tired if I read other Forums bashing this mtbr because of those exact things.

No post or thread I make has intent to sell or profit from brand image. Membership is fun and positive when identifying locally & getting to grow outward from there; choosing to weigh common sense against stacked forum responses changes my motivation for posting from casual and laidback to being territorial and protective of core interests. Example at hand is this discovery of volume inside wider internal rims.

Manufacturers probably recognized this on the next-day at the latest. Yet, every tire mounted on my rims repeats tire pressure recommendations for minimums as the general tire audience seeks lower and lower tire pressures provided tires keep on the rim. I doubt a manufacturer revealing lower pressure as recognized as possible means 10 psi lower. 20psi - c'mon now

So - since riding once with touted and accepted tire pressures I have gouged the sidewalls. And not a start to finish ride; 6 or 7 mile single track w/ the last 2 'aired down' from 22F 30R to 19F 26R to then 15F 20R.

When checking for the default specs on the tire to take a picture, I found knicks which show cord. Nothing penetrating, something leading to failure if left unchecked. Aware what new design wide rims can do, I have to assume that exact mounting would only allow more damage to the sidewall. A 'problem' also with ProCore - forces on rim flanges and damped by the systems are mostly of the plumb vertical variety. Having those forces act when at lean angles cannot prevent contact with the rim flange.

If no other approach other than more more more! as it is to the lack of supportive tire pressures would have me as a tire maker pissed.

Pinkbike's splash page Friday AM was about biking being expensive to the point of too expensive. A local shop converted my tires as I waited and joked with them all. 3opsi R and we noted the F as slightly less. I weigh alot, ride quick; tubeless is now new to me. Weighing shop skill against common 'fact' is confusing if not counter productive, raising concern.

Even w/ tubes in my mini DH trail bike - there is just 2-3psi less than what was with my same external- but narrower internal-width rims.

Tires | Blog | Surly Bikes


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## Haint (Jan 25, 2012)

Knowledge is Good.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

yes


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Any source for 27.5 fat trax?

For those in the know..is the difference between the 72fb and the 120fb similar in the casing thickness to the Mission?


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## TooSteep (Oct 6, 2012)

Bigwheel said:


> ...
> 
> Where we are at opposites is in regards to the front tire configuration. I personally don't like the effects of a big wide fat heavy front tire and am having a much better overall experience than I had with that setup with a narrower tire on the front and a wider one on the rear that are as close as possible to the same diameter...


That sounds quite scary with any sort of aggressive riding or any any sort of difficult trail. Isn't that a recipe for losing front-wheel traction first? Moto guys go fatter in the back, but with a smaller diameter. Nobody on two wheels ever wants to lose front-wheel traction first.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Actually the config I am running takes its cue from the moto world. If you look at the attached picture, yes, the rear tire is fatter and on a smaller diameter rim. But the narrower front tire, while on a larger diameter rim, is very close to the same overall diameter as the rear.









What I want to try when I get my fs frame reworked to allow it is to use b+ in the rear to be able to drop a few more psi there for enhanced traction and flotation and maintain the same type front set up I am using now.

The single track where I live currently is not the gnarliest that I have ridden in my 30+ years of mtn. biking but it has its features, mostly roots, and the bike I am using is very familiar to me and it has never handled cornering as well as it does now which I attribute to being able to drop from my normal 28 psi to 15. I just don't like the self steering effect of fatter tires and am happy to have found a way to run low pressure without it.

I apologize in advance for straying from the 650b format this forum is intended to serve.


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## TooSteep (Oct 6, 2012)

Bigwheel said:


> ... and the bike I am using is very familiar to me and it has never handled cornering as well as it does now which I attribute to being able to drop from my normal 28 psi to 15...


What exactly is it you're doing that allows you to run your front tire at 15 psi? I thought it was a skinny 2.1" 29er tire?


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Nothing that hasn't been available for the last 6 years at least. An old center worn Kenda Klaw mounted on an old Kris Holm i35 rim, tubed.









I first used an even older 1.75 Conti Travel Master also at 15psi.









I couldn't pinch flat it either but the lack of knobs I figured would get me in trouble at some point when it got wet here.


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## alien too (Mar 4, 2008)

Is there a list of compatible 29er frames for 650 b+???

Does anyone know if a Cannondale Trail SS rigid is b+ friendly???


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

interesting article on 650B+ Trail Tech: Exploring 27.5+ - BikeRadar

all I know the WTB Trailblazer is sold out on the WTB site.

mike


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

senor_mikey said:


> interesting article on 650B+ Trail Tech: Exploring 27.5+ - BikeRadar


Money quote:

_Two product managers who agreed to speak with BikeRadar on the condition of anonymity stated that 27.5+ will be one of the most significant advancements we see in mountain biking 2015, and that many companies will be introducing complete bikes designed around 27.5x3in tyres._


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

so far, in my recent experience (ATMO?) Trailblazer is 100% ACE. really nice compromise of volume, width, weight, tread, rolling, compound. its a keeper. would be interested to try a 29+ version (sorry craigsj- its a plus for me, regardless). im running it on a P35 on the rear. i would very much like to try it on a derby 40mm.

ive also been using the knard 29+ on derby 35mm rims. down from 50mm rims. so far, no massive difference...the knards are admitedly not the gnarliest tread pattern, so i doubt the profile change (it is rounder on the smaller rim) will really be felt at all. HOWEVER, the main thing i was wondering about was the feel of my 120tpi sidewalls as they are bent round more to reach the narrower rim...(at least, thats the way i think about it)....again, perhaps its the fact that the tyre is *so* thin and flexible that i dont feel any significant difference. im runnign 1 more psi (and you fat bike riders know as the volume increases a psi can make for a real change in feel - and ill likley take it down from 10 front, 11 rear soon) other than that, not much difference. the derby rims are hookless so im guessign that knocks off a mm or 2, so we are looking at just over 12mm difference to the rabbit holes or so? maybe this is just within the toelrances of the designs. i have some chronicles coming, will nbe interesting to try these. i do have other wheels with 50mm wide alu rims so will compare and contrast....

as for the future. i strongly believe, from my limited experience so far, 27.5x3" is going to be HUGE. i said this about 27.5 DH bikes a few years ago....because that just made sense. this is the same. it just makes sense. there. im on my soap box now....

in saying that..... ~ ... there IS a place for 29+. low pressure and huge diameter = amazing rollover. i can ride up flights of steps...not like i can on a 36er (i tried a black sheep) but not far off..... 

ok rant over.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

In order to bring this thread back in line with the 27.5 nature of this forum who is going to be the first to try 26" wheels with 3" tires in their 27.5 bike? The key to a reliable low pressure riding experience is about volume after all and how you achieve that doesn't really matter as long as you find it. If you are looking for it that is.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2014)

Bigwheel said:


> In order to bring this thread back in line with the 27.5 nature of this forum who is going to be the first to try 26" wheels with 3" tires in their 27.5 bike? The key to a reliable low pressure riding experience is about volume after all and how you achieve that doesn't really matter as long as you find it. If you are looking for it that is.


that was indeed my plan when the surly DW 2.75 was released but sourcing full suss rigs capable of fitment is rare.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Bigwheel said:


> In order to bring this thread back in line with the 27.5 nature of this forum who is going to be the first to try 26" wheels with 3" tires in their 27.5 bike? The key to a reliable low pressure riding experience is about volume after all and how you achieve that doesn't really matter as long as you find it. If you are looking for it that is.


I ran 2.5 Weirwolfs on my On-One Inbred for a bit - paired up with 47mm wide Tryall Rims - it was fun - although the hubs on my wheels sucked and it was a heavy set up.

I think a lot of guys and gals here are loving the wide rim 27.5 wheels (Derby rims, P35s etc.) with Trail bike tires 2.35s and 2.4s........

I'm awaiting delivery of an Evil D.O.C. Frame - my initial plans are to go 2.4 Mavic Quest on a 28mm wide 650b rear wheel, paired up with a 2.8 Trailblazer up front on the same rim either rigid or with a 29er suspension fork. I tried to fit that combination in my existing fork and it was a no-go (Manitou Minute 26er fork which clears a 650b and 2.35 Nevegal just fine).

Stay tuned as this develops!


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

Bigwheel said:


> In order to bring this thread back in line with the 27.5 nature of this forum who is going to be the first to try 26" wheels with 3" tires in their 27.5 bike? The key to a reliable low pressure riding experience is about volume after all and how you achieve that doesn't really matter as long as you find it. If you are looking for it that is.


unfortunately some 29+ dude moved this thread here.

Even though the original thought was to convert 29ers to wide tires there are some 650B MTB's that can fit the Trailblazer. And new bikes specifically designed for these tires are in the right place.

I guess finding the right box to put these threads requires thinking outside the box, like the bright idea to create the Trailblazer in the 1st place.

mike


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I've been going back and forth between 29+ and B+ in my head on how to have a rigid, lightweight bike that can run both 29x2.1 tires for gravel roads and touring, and a B+ setup for MTB. Maybe a frame that can be run non-corrected rigid, but also with say...a 60mm suspension fork I've got laying around.

I think I may have better luck with B+ than I will with 29+.


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

Bigwheel said:


> In order to bring this thread back in line with the 27.5 nature of this forum who is going to be the first to try 26" wheels with 3" tires in their 27.5 bike? The key to a reliable low pressure riding experience is about volume after all and how you achieve that doesn't really matter as long as you find it. If you are looking for it that is.


don't a bunch of folks already run 3" tires on surly trolls and 1x1's?

I know I saw pics of some huge tires on them

not sure how many other frames are wide enough to accommodate the 3" tires, my wife has a set of 26x3 knards on her farley for summer and they are pretty darn plump


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

alien too said:


> Is there a list of compatible 29er frames for 650 b+???


Is there any?

I mean... is there any 29er frame that can take a 27.5x2.8 on a decently wide rim (I'd say 40 to 50mm) with room enough for real world riding?

I'm not so positive.


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

I've got the trailblazers on blunt 35's on my old Rockhopper. It has wishbone stays and they fit, although pretty much the max. I'm guessing if you've got straight stays you're prob good on a 40mm rim. No chance for anything bigger though


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

WTB is dropping the damn ball. I ordered Trailblazers last month and still haven't received them. Can't even get the Breakouts now. WTF? My whole project is gathering dust waiting on these incompetent asses.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Trail Tech: Exploring 27.5+ - BikeRadar


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

Does anybody have any info where the Vee traxx fatty could be purchased??
if they are not yet available is there any idea when these would be available.
How about wtb:s any source for them??
Thanks in advance!


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

That's weird. I ordered one straight from WTB and got it in a week. Had my LBS order the second one and got it in 4 days


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

rikardo said:


> Does anybody have any info where the Vee traxx fatty could be purchased??
> if they are not yet available is there any idea when these would be available.
> How about wtb:s any source for them??
> Thanks in advance!


The 27.5 Trax Fatty is not available yet, and i can't seem to get an answer on when it will be. I got my WTB trailblazers direct from WTB about a month ago, but MikenIke above seems to not be getting his. Maybe they are out of the first batch? Only way to find out is to contact them I guess.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

MikenIke said:


> WTB is dropping the damn ball. I ordered Trailblazers last month and still haven't received them. Can't even get the Breakouts now. WTF? My whole project is gathering dust waiting on these incompetent asses.


why are they incompetent? Because demand was high and they sold out of the tires?

I ordered via their web site about a month ago and got my tire from CA to CT in a week. I'm kicking myself now for not ordering 2 - but I'm glad to have the one (I'm gonna go 2.4 rear 2.8 front on my upcoming build).


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

fewg8 said:


> I've got the trailblazers on blunt 35's on my old Rockhopper. It has wishbone stays and they fit, although pretty much the max. I'm guessing if you've got straight stays you're prob good on a 40mm rim. No chance for anything bigger though


We need visuals! Pics!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

savo said:


> Is there any?
> 
> I mean... is there any 29er frame that can take a 27.5x2.8 on a decently wide rim (I'd say 40 to 50mm) with room enough for real world riding?
> 
> I'm not so positive.


There are definitely 29er frames that will take the 2.8 Trailblazer on a decent size rim. There is no list because there aren't many of the tire out there and also not many wide rims to mount them too. There are plenty of measurements posted so if you have a frame that might work, get the tape measure out!

I have them mounted on Derby 40mm rims and they fit in my Jones Spaceframe easily. I'm waiting for the Vee tire (which will be bigger) to see if I can squeeze that in.

The bigger tires that are coming out soon will not fit very many frames though.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

It seems as though the guys Guitar Ted and C_G over at twentynineinches.com have been doing the most testing for fit/performance of this new "niche" wheel/tire combination.

I know that in talking with GT - he's informed me that the Trailblazers on 35mm Blunt Rims (P35s) have cleared at least 5 different hardtail 29ers that he has access to - so that's a good sign. I'm not sure on these other larger tires coming down the pike though.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'd be curious if they fit something like the Salsa Fargo or other fat tire touring bikes.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

PHeller said:


> I'd be curious if they fit something like the Salsa Fargo or other fat tire touring bikes.


https://twentynineinches.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/P9060022.jpg


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Hey, thanks, I found the rest:


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Great - glad you found em.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

My 650b 25mm ID rims arrive today (as well as new hubs... spokes to be ordered tomorrow after verifying ERD tonight). Building up the wheelset for my Bronson.

Gonna run WTB 2.8 650b+ Trailblazers (or something similar) on these 650b wheels on my Tallboy for winter riding. Can't wait!


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## doismellbacon (Sep 20, 2007)

The growing variety of options in wheel / tire setup is really exciting! I've been looking at new school 29er hardtails to complement my 650b FS rig.... the option of slapping 650b derby wheels with super fat rubber on something like a Yelli Screamy sounds like fun!


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Found this on BTI, regarding Trax Fatty 3.25"

"Due to arrive by the end of 2014"

BTI | FatBike Tires from Vee Rubber (page 1)


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

Tor said:


> Found this on BTI, regarding Trax Fatty 3.25"
> 
> "Due to arrive by the end of 2014"
> 
> BTI | FatBike Tires from Vee Rubber (page 1)


With more sizes coming afterwards.

Met with the Vee Rubber guys yesterday. 
Smaller b+ tyre on the way. New tread patterns too.

And then there's b- but that's a different thing altogether.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

brant said:


> With more sizes coming afterwards.
> 
> Met with the Vee Rubber guys yesterday.
> Smaller b+ tyre on the way. New tread patterns too.


Do Like!


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

brant said:


> And then there's b- but that's a different thing altogether.


I hope you're joking


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

brant said:


> With more sizes coming afterwards.
> 
> Met with the Vee Rubber guys yesterday.
> Smaller b+ tyre on the way. New tread patterns too.
> ...


I don't really care what's 6-12 months out, I just want to know when the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 tire will be available. Is that too much to ask?


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

bikeny said:


> I don't really care what's 6-12 months out, I just want to know when the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 tire will be available. Is that too much to ask?


Apologies


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

TitanofChaos said:


> I hope you're joking


B-

Instagram


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

bikeny said:


> I don't really care what's 6-12 months out, I just want to know when the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 tire will be available. Is that too much to ask?


Yeah. And a 50mm rim to go with it.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

brant said:


> B-
> 
> Instagram


With that you could mount 650b wheels on lots of 26"ers.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

Bigwheel said:


> With that you could mount 650b wheels on lots of 26"ers.


And turn them into what? Hybrids?
My old 26ers would die of shame if I put those tires on them.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

So along the same lines, road and gravel bikes are to be renamed 29-?? Lol.



brant said:


> B-
> 
> Instagram


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## D_Man (Jan 7, 2004)

*650B+ Tires*

The original French 650b demi-ballon tires were all b-, just like the GB hetre of today. Maybe they should be 650b, making the trax fatties a 650++. You know, as in double plus good.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Will be interesting to see 1-3 years from now which plus size works best for most riders with the way they ride their bikes at present time. I'm really curious to see which fat-lite tire size, 2.8-3.0" or 3.25", is going to be the more fun to ride. Some of the new widths and treads may even change where folks choose to ride their bikes and also how they enjoy them.



brant said:


> With more sizes coming afterwards.
> 
> Met with the Vee Rubber guys yesterday.
> Smaller b+ tyre on the way. New tread patterns too.
> ...


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

I think even Vee rubber might agree 3.25in is biggest needed.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

brant said:


> Apologies


That wasn't directed at you, just a frustration post! Did they give yiou any idea when the Trax Fatty would be available?

I tried contacted them various ways without much success. Someone actually responded to a Facebook comment about 1.5 months ago that they were hoping to have then in a week or 2. Silence since then.:madman:


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

I'd definitely put a lightly knobbed, 42mm or so 650b tire on my 650b gravel grinder. It has Hetres on there now and they're great for mixed paved/dirt road use but I'd like some tread for more light-duty off road adventures. (2-track, unfinished railtrails, etc)


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

brant said:


> I think even Vee rubber might agree 3.25in is biggest needed.


Now who is going to make a proper trail bike that will fit them on the back?


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## Guest (Nov 6, 2014)

Slow Danger said:


> Now who is going to make a proper trail bike that will fit them on the back?


yup exactly, hell even sourcing one to house 2.8's is challenging.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

nvphatty said:


> yup exactly, hell even sourcing one to house 2.8's is challenging.


I think you guys will have to wait a bit. I think the initial idea behind these is to first "retrofit" them onto 29ers vs. having them be used on dedicated 650b+ trail bikes.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

MMcG said:


> I think you guys will have to wait a bit. I think the initial idea behind these is to first "retrofit" them onto 29ers vs. having them be used on dedicated 650b+ trail bikes.


Not the 3.25. I guess I've been wondering if those wider tires--the ones that won't fit in 29ers (aka everything but the 2.8 tire)--are being made solely for fat bikes, or if companies other than Rocky Mountain are going to put out bikes by this Spring.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

Slow Danger said:


> Not the 3.25. I guess I've been wondering if those wider tires--the ones that won't fit in 29ers (aka everything but the 2.8 tire)--are being made solely for fat bikes, or if companies other than Rocky Mountain are going to put out bikes by this Spring.


I'm pretty sure we will see some production bikes that fit the 3.25" Vee tire in the next 12 months. In the mean time here is a nice custom rigid bike with those tires, great price for the USA made frame and awesome PR bags Cycles J Bryant

mike


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

SteveF said:


> I'd definitely put a lightly knobbed, 42mm or so 650b tire on my 650b gravel grinder. It has Hetres on there now and they're great for mixed paved/dirt road use but I'd like some tread for more light-duty off road adventures. (2-track, unfinished railtrails, etc)
> 
> View attachment 936988


you can order 650B Knards right now... 41mm wide. And the BG RocknRoads in 650B are coming soon too.

mike


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

Slow Danger said:


> Now who is going to make a proper trail bike that will fit them on the back?


There's already a vast selection of fat bike frames that will do the trick. Unless you want a narrower BB/Q factor, I guess.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

SmooveP said:


> There's already a vast selection of fat bike frames that will do the trick. Unless you want a narrower BB/Q factor, I guess.


I'm sure there are some fat bikes that will ride great with the wider 27.5+ tires front and back. Besides the bb/qfactor issue on a dedicated fat bike, some of the other details are being talked about in this thread:

http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/time-slightly-less-than-fat-bike-937632.html

Edit: Here's some more variations on the theme, which I know you've likely seen SmooveP, but others might not:

http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/short-chainstay-slack-front-ss-fatty-frame-921197.html

Chain stays on most fat bikes are around 17.5 inches.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

nvphatty said:


> yup exactly, hell even sourcing one to house 2.8's is challenging.


Guess they should have anticipated the mad rush when they announced a new wheel size.


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## Guest (Nov 6, 2014)

Slow Danger said:


> Guess they should have anticipated the mad rush when they announced a new wheel size.


ya fuggen eh right mate!!


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

So here's a 29er that will be able to fit the new Panaracer fat b. nimble 27.5x3.0 tire:

https://www.facebook.com/ColoradoSp...1823947209050/795339820524128/?type=1&theater

Also noted in the comments on the picture that dedicated 27.5+ bikes are being designed/prototyped, which we kind of knew, but with the tires out soonish I hoped there would be frames quickly following.

Edit: Also turning up in the comments, _"I do know that 650b+ is in high demand for many OE guys designing 2016/2017 bikes. Plus some new ones coming in 2015."_

So I finally got my answers&#8230;the bikes I'm wanting are still likely at least a year out. Now I can quit stalking this thread.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

How's about this sweet looking bike:

Canfield Brothers Nimble 9, WTB Trail Blazer 2.8, 27.5 Wheels


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2014)

^^ sweet ride but missing rear suss.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

rear suss - you don't need no stinking rear suss!


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

mmcg said:


> rear suss - you don't need no stinking rear suss!


x2...


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## boude (Nov 18, 2010)

Tire = VEE TRAX FATTY 27,5 x 3,25 !
Rim = RYDE TRACE ENDURO
Height = 740mm / width = 74mm


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## Guest (Nov 9, 2014)

MMcG said:


> rear suss - you don't need no stinking rear suss!





MikenIke said:


> x2...


whats needed & wanted are on opposing ends


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Yup, just takes all kinds.
Is that VEE tire too fat for that RYDE rim?


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## Guest (Nov 9, 2014)

MikenIke said:


> Is that VEE tire too fat for that RYDE rim?


seems to be


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

Here is my Canfield N9 with Velocity Dually 27.5+ rims and WTB Trail Blazer 2.8 tires... Still playing with the PSI on the tires... Just waiting for my digital pressure gauge to show up.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Man that looks like a fun bike...


I've got my eye on a DB Mason frameset... I bet it would be a blast as a B+!


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2014)

rsullivan said:


> Here is my Canfield N9 with Velocity Dually 27.5+ rims and WTB Trail Blazer 2.8 tires... Still playing with the PSI on the tires... Just waiting for my digital pressure gauge to show up.


yup that's a way cool rig


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## SSBiker (Nov 12, 2012)

What's the diameter compare to a regular 29er tire?


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## shiggy (Dec 19, 1998)

SSBiker said:


> What's the diameter compare to a regular 29er tire?


Depends on the specific tire, and what you consider a "regular" 29er tire.
But mostly, smaller.


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## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

Sorry, no time to read this whole thread. I'm looking for a pretty smooth 27.5×3-3.5" tire that's gonna see only pavement use. Any suggestions? It's for a prototype bike so I can't give any more details now but smoothish tread and a supple casing are priorities as is immediate availibility. Any suggestions?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Lelandjt said:


> Sorry, no time to read this whole thread. I'm looking for a pretty smooth 27.5×3-3.5" tire that's gonna see only pavement use. Any suggestions? It's for a prototype bike so I can't give any more details now but smoothish tread and a supple casing are priorities as is immediate availibility. Any suggestions?


The closest thing I can think of is the Trailblazer 2.8 but that's sold out. The other 27.5+ tires appear to have knobbier treads than the Trailblazer.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Lelandjt said:


> Sorry, no time to read this whole thread. I'm looking for a pretty smooth 27.5×3-3.5" tire that's gonna see only pavement use. Any suggestions? It's for a prototype bike so I can't give any more details now but smoothish tread and a supple casing are priorities as is immediate availibility. Any suggestions?


Does not exist, nor has anything been announced.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> The other 27.5+ tires appear to have knobbier treads than the Trailblazer.


I'd like a 2.8 with an aggressive tread :thumbsup: Who else make's one?

Other than the 2.8 Trailblazer (which I can't get anywhere) and the 3.25 Vee TraxFatty (which may or may not fit for front use and is probably a no-go for rear use), who else makes 650b+ tires?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> I'd like a 2.8 with an aggressive tread :thumbsup: Who else make's one?
> 
> Other than the 2.8 Trailblazer (which I can't get anywhere) and the 3.25 Vee TraxFatty (which may or may not fit for front use and is probably a no-go for rear use), who else makes 650b+ tires?


Right now: nobody. This 650B+ size is very new, and the Trailblazer is the only tire available right now, or at least it was, seems to be sold out now. The Trax Fatty will be bigger (though not 3.25"), but it's not out yet. The only other tire that has been announced is the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5x3.0, also not yet available.

Patience...


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## Guest (Nov 13, 2014)

bikeny said:


> Patience...


patience you say!!!? we gotz no stinkin patience!! we want yesterday dag nab it :incazzato: that said having a FS frame to accept might be a good thing to have.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> I'd like a 2.8 with an aggressive tread :thumbsup: Who else make's one?
> 
> Other than the 2.8 Trailblazer (which I can't get anywhere) and the 3.25 Vee TraxFatty (which may or may not fit for front use and is probably a no-go for rear use), who else makes 650b+ tires?


Soon Panaracer and Vee (along with WTB)..........and then there's me........I'm willing to part with my 2.8 Trailblazer if anyones interested. I don't have the funds right now to invest in proper wide rims for it so I'd consider parting with it - would even entertain trades.

It has never seen trail use - only mounted and ridden around the block.


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

*Just found this*

Here is a bike with the Vee trax fatty


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

1strongone1 said:


> Here is a bike with the Vee trax fatty


Those have been talked about already. It's basically a fatbike frame with 27.5 wheels. 100mm BB and 170mm rear spacing, not what I would be looking for. It is cheap though!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Built up a Diamondback Mason this weekend. Took it for a snow ride with some friends yesterday (we were on regular 29er 2.25-2.3" tires) and was amazed at how much traction it had going uphill (with the 17" chainstays, the rear wheel is right underneath you). My friends were getting frustrated that I could climb hills that they were spinning out on.

Planning to run a WTB 2.8 Trailblazer rear on a WTB Frequency i25 rim (wheelset from my Bronson). Haven't decided on a front tire yet. I've got a Fox 34 29'er fork up front and it clears a huge 2.35 (on a 22mm ID rim) with plenty of room. Thinking a Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5x3.0 might just stuff in there. Not sure how the 3" tire would do on a 25mm ID rim though.


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

The only problem with running the 2.8 or 3.0 tires on narrow rims is having to run higher psi. I have gotten mine down to 14psi rear and 10 psi front using the 2.8 trail blazers and 45mm velocity Dually rims. You need to run low psi to get the benefits of wide tires. Sounds like you are on a good start though


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

rsullivan said:


> The only problem with running the 2.8 or 3.0 tires on narrow rims is having to run higher psi. I have gotten mine down to 14psi rear and 10 psi front using the 2.8 trail blazers and 45mm velocity Dually rims. You need to run low psi to get the benefits of wide tires. Sounds like you are on a good start though


Thanks. I don't mind running a bit higher PSI. I don't expect this to be a full fledged fat bike, rather simply a fun bike that can be ridden on some packed snow trails. If it's ass cold or deep snow, I won't want to ride. Rather I want a fun bike that can see DJ use with 29er wheels and light, snow trail use with 650b+ tires (on an existing wheelset).

Basically, I need a way to ride this winter without a full fledged fat bike.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Wow, BD got on that bandwagon pretty fast...hopefully other mfgs will start seeing the crossover potential for Fattys to run mid fat tires in "off season".

I have a Lurch with a Bluto, my big wheels are 26 x 4", I'm building a second set of wheel for three season use, Origin8 fat hubs and Velocity Dually, Trax Fattys when they are available. It is a suprisingly agile bike for it's weight.

As to fat bike suspension, until yesterday I was thinking hard about a Bucksaw, BUT then I rode my 140mm 650fs up the same "steep arse" hills I have been working out with my fatty and it was HARDER. It should have been easier; lighter bike and less bulky wheelset, but it was more work due to having less traction AND suspension in the rear.

I'm thinking that we (I) don't take into account the loss of power that comes with rear suspension. FS has it's place, but climbing is not it. I'm am thinking of rebuilding my Honzo with 650b+


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> I'm thinking that we (I) don't take into account the loss of power that comes with rear suspension. FS has it's place, but climbing is not it. I'm am thinking of rebuilding my Honzo with 650b+


 Fortunately MTB isn't all climbing and a high volume tire won't really do much to absorb larger hits. I think B+ will compliment full suspension frames nicely allowing for lots of traction and float while still allowing longer travel and shorter chainstays on custom or existing 29er frames.If anything I find the Bucksaws design a bit restrictive, as it can't fit 29+ but it also can't fit five inch full float tires. Not having ridden a NarrowFat id be curious to see how it rides on soft snow or sand, because I'm sure with 29x2.4 its plenty fast enough to cover the xc range of the stable.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> Rather I want a fun bike that can see DJ use with 29er wheels and light, snow trail use with 650b+ tires (on an existing wheelset).


Ok, now my brain is spinning...

How would a 2.8/3" tire on fat (35-40mm internal) rims work for DJ/pump track/urban bike park use? Dumb?

I don't have 29er wheels for my Mason... so instead of buying 29er wheels, I could build a light/stiff 650B+ wheelset for around $400 (Dually front, Blunt 35 rear... or Dually/Dually if the Mason will clear it)

I can already tell that I'm going to end up with a garage full of wheels...


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Lol, welcome to my world. It's a fun problem to have. Wheels, tires...



06HokieMTB said:


> so instead of buying 29er wheels, I could build a light/stiff 650B+ wheelset for around $400 (Dually front, Blunt 35 rear... or Dually/Dually if the Mason will clear it)
> 
> I can already tell that I'm going to end up with a garage full of wheels...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

awai04 said:


> Lol, welcome to my world. It's a fun problem to have. Wheels, tires...


Lol. I'm trying to not get too attached to this thing. The goal was to build it up from the parts bin, have fun on it in the winter and then sell this spring.

Maybe 650b+ will be the new 'cool' thing this spring?! (therefore helping my resale efforts)


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I think 650b+ has lots of potential, ranging from what can be rigged into existing 29er frames, to genuine ground-up "semi-fat" bikes with 30-50mm wide rims and 3-3.25" tires. Still too early to tell who's going to bite and how soon. Seems like fat bikes are still enjoying their popularity and ascendance within the mtb world. The fact only can help 650b+ take off.



06HokieMTB said:


> Maybe 650b+ will be the new 'cool' thing this spring?! (therefore helping my resale efforts)


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

My luck, I'll fall in love with the bike and won't end up selling it. Not the worse scenario in the world, I guess.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Had a chance to try out the Vee Rubber Fatty Trax 27.5x3.25 on my 1x1 last night. Seriously impressed with this tire.

We've gotten about 13" of snow in the past 2-3 days, and its pretty greasy and loose. Starting out this morning at 12-15psi on my floor pump gauge (reality is probably closer to 20), I had a REAL hard time. The front end was knifing everywhere, and digging in and dragging me to a complete stop several times. Would have felt more confident on a 'cross tire at 60psi, honestly.

About halfway in to my 9 mile commute, I stopped and let off what I figured to be about half the pressure. Absolute night and day difference. The tire was extremely squirmy on pavement with heavy tire steer (constantly correcting the front end) but on the snow, even through the tire and plow drifts at intersections, it was stable and true with little knifing or squirm.

When I got to work I checked it with the digital gauge and got an 8psi reading. Really, at anything above 10 psi, at 170lbs, I don't think I would be getting the full contact patch up front or the full float benefit of this tire.

Should add too it's running tubeless on a Blunt 35. Tubeless setup is amazing. Re-seated it today after adding some Stan's with one hand and a floor pump, easy on and off too. Going to try this on a Dually next for width/handling comparison, and see if I can't squeeze one into the back too.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

seely said:


> View attachment 940202
> View attachment 940202
> View attachment 940202
> View attachment 940203
> ...


Are these available to the general public yet?


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

SmooveP said:


> Are these available to the general public yet?


Haven't seen them in stock anywhere, not sure if they are sold out or not available yet.


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## neil_240 (Jan 2, 2010)

What tire/wheel are you running in the back? I'm torn between getting some 650B or 26+ wheels for my 1x1.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

neil_240 said:


> What tire/wheel are you running in the back? I'm torn between getting some 650B or 26+ wheels for my 1x1.


Right now its a Conti Trail King 2.4 on a Blunt 35, tons of clearance with the wheel less than halfway back in the dropouts. I'm fairly convinced I can get a Vee to fit if I run the wheel about 3/4" farther back. I may try it tonight just to test for fit.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

I should add too that I've got a set of Duallys with Dirt Wizards and they work commendably well in the snow, but I am convinced the extra diameter of the 27.5+ wheel would lead it perform better in most situations.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

awai04 said:


> Lol, welcome to my world. It's a fun problem to have. Wheels, tires...


Sigh... It starts. Just found a deal that was too good to pass up. Bought a Blunt 35 27.5 rim and a DT350 hub...



seely said:


> I should add too that I've got a set of Duallys with Dirt Wizards and they work commendably well in the snow, but I am convinced the extra diameter of the 27.5+ wheel would lead it perform better in most situations.


A 650b+ 27.5 x 3" Dirt Wizard would be awesome!


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## misterzin (Nov 29, 2011)




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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> A 650b+ 27.5 x 3" Dirt Wizard would be awesome!


I agree. I really like how the DW handles and rolls. If I could get my dream tire it would be a slightly less aggressive DW, high TPI casing, tubeless ready and around 800g. I'm a little baffled at the lack of 27.5+ tires with the proliferation of rim choices and amount of interest 27.5+ is getting.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone running a Trailblazer in a 27.5 Pike?

I need new tires for my full suspension 27.5, and I'm hoping to get as close to 29" in the bike as possible. I think the rear may have room.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

seely said:


> I'm a little baffled at the lack of 27.5+ tires with the proliferation of rim choices and amount of interest 27.5+ is getting.


Surprising statement from someone that works in the industry. It will be a couple of years at least before a range of b+ tires are available and that is only if the current offerings can stimulate demand. 29+ has been out for 3 years and is just now getting a few more tire options made available. 29", 27.5, fat bike and 26" tire selection for that matter were the same way. These days the internet way of things moves much faster than the bike industry way of things.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

I guess my gripe is more of a supply issue. Several manufacturers do offer 27.5+ tires, but can't seem to get them into distributors hands. Q lists a few different models, but either they went out of stock instantly or are not actually available. Got an email yesterday that my "Item Watch" on the Trax Fatty was expiring, actually. Delays happen, it happens to us too, but there's definitely already been a production run or two of some of these tires, though they still aren't readily available for order.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Hey you industry types, what is the typical production run on a new/unproven tire with no specific manufacturer spec'ing them on bikes? For example, any guesses to how many of that WTB Trailblazer were made in that first run?


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Hey you industry types, what is the typical production run on a new/unproven tire with no specific manufacturer spec'ing them on bikes? For example, any guesses to how many of that WTB Trailblazer were made in that first run?


No idea on the tire side, but I'd imagine, like us, the larger run they can make and sell, the better business sense it makes. Perhaps they were too conservative in their estimates. We underestimated demand for the Blunt SS a bit as well.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Gotcha. Does seem like the VTF is dragging its heels considering it was shown at Taipei early in the spring and not expected to get here for perhaps another month. I doubt WTB did more than the minimum run with the TB and that didn't spread very far it seems. At least the rims are covered so that won't slow things down when tires are made available!

In the meantime we all have bikes to ride so it could be worse.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

PHeller said:


> Anyone running a Trailblazer in a 27.5 Pike and have pictures of the clearances?


Bump because ignored.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Don't think it is being ignored as much as the fact that there is perhaps no evidence that it does or does not fit due to the relatively new nature of the TB? It fit in a Fox 27.5 fork that is shown earlier in this thread but didn't in an MRP 27.5 as reported to me earlier in the fall. It was expected to be used primarily in 29" forks.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

The Pike is not known for huge tire clearance


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Bigwheel said:


> Gotcha. Does seem like the VTF is dragging its heels considering it was shown at Taipei early in the spring and not expected to get here for perhaps another month. I doubt WTB did more than the minimum run with the TB and that didn't spread very far it seems. At least the rims are covered so that won't slow things down when tires are made available!
> 
> In the meantime we all have bikes to ride so it could be worse.


Yeah, I'm not losing sleep over it. The Fatty Trax on my front is pretty lonely, though, and if I did my measurements right, a rear should actually fit nicely.


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## Wish I Were Riding (Jan 30, 2004)

Feel like I'm jumping in a bit late on this thread. I'm wondering what people think is an acceptable internal width for a wheel to run 27.5+ tires. Will a 30mm internal width be enough to support a tire of 3" to 3.25"? Or should we be shooting fo a minimum of 35mm internal width?

Specifically this would be for normal mountain biking. Nothing to do with snow/sand specific rides. Just my normal dirt, that I would like to run with lower pressures on a HT. All opinions welcome. Thanks.


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

The wider the better... Running narrow rims you will have to increase the PSI to support the sidewalls. Using a 40mm+ rims will open up the tire and give you the opportunity to run lower PSI making a more supple ride. I went from running 30psi on 29mm rims to 14R/10F psi on 45mm rims... Huge difference


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Also, keep in mind frame fit. I'm not sure I could stuff a Dually in the rear and still have mud clearance.

Who makes an AL rim that has a 35mm internal rim width?


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## Guest (Nov 22, 2014)

Wish I Were Riding said:


> Feel like I'm jumping in a bit late on this thread. I'm wondering what people think is an acceptable internal width for a wheel to run 27.5+ tires.


I believe 30mm is near perfect for such a tire.



> Will a 30mm internal width be enough to support a tire of 3" to 3.25"? Or should we be shooting for a minimum of 35mm internal width?


For this 35-40mm would be the sweet spot.


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

I bought a light-bicycle hookless rim with 35mm external width, with the Trax Fatty in mind. Was thinking of getting a 40 or 50mm external width rim. Is there any point of selling the 35mm and buy a 40 / 50 rim?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Tor said:


> I bought a light-bicycle hookless rim with 35mm external width, with the Trax Fatty in mind. Was thinking of getting a 40 or 50mm external width rim. Is there any point of selling the 35mm and buy a 40 / 50 rim?


30mm would be good for the 2.8 WTB

I'd go wider for the Trax Fatty.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I would put the tire on the rim before you lace it up and see what it looks like before I traded the rim in for a wider one. I do think wider would be better.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I've gotten 2 rides on the Trailblazer. Kinda cool. At 20psi it talks to you a little bit like a fat tire does on hard pack.

Definitely takes the edge off of riding a hardtail. Doesn't feel like suspension, but it actually makes me think I could ride some miles on this thing. Especially if you added a compliant carbon seatpost like the Niner RDO (I currently have my KS Lev installed). I actually just picked up an RDO seatpost from Backcountry using their 20% off coupon and $20 in credits.

I'm currently riding the bike as a 29er/650b+ and it feels relatively balanced. Haven't decided if I'm going to build just a wide 650b rear wheel, or a wide 650b wheelset.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

rsullivan said:


> The wider the better... Running narrow rims you will have to increase the PSI to support the sidewalls. Using a 40mm+ rims will open up the tire and give you the opportunity to run lower PSI making a more supple ride. I went from running 30psi on 29mm rims to 14R/10F psi on 45mm rims... Huge difference


Please clarify if you are talking internal or external width rims.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

rsullivan said:


> The only problem with running the 2.8 or 3.0 tires on narrow rims is having to run higher psi. I have gotten mine down to 14psi rear and 10 psi front using the 2.8 trail blazers and 45mm velocity Dually rims. You need to run low psi to get the benefits of wide tires. Sounds like you are on a good start though


Geez, I'm bumping this thread tonight... lol

Anyway, I agree with this statement. My i25 (internal width) is not wide enough for a 2.8 tire. It's a pretty fast rolling tire though! Fun to ride on hardpack.

I'm debating a Blunt 35 (30mm internal) vs a Spesh Roval Fatty (29mm internal) for my rear rim.

I'd like a Dually up front, but don't trust it tubeless (especially in the front) and 650g for a rim is quite portly.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

If the wallet can handle, then why not Derbys? 40mm OD and 35mm ID. I can vouch that the fit and finish is top notch. The 2.8 WTB TB's mounted up no problem with just a floor pump. No saddle time on the combo (yet), as I am waiting to build up a bike around the wheels.



06HokieMTB said:


> Geez, I'm bumping this thread tonight... lol
> 
> Anyway, I agree with this statement. My i25 (internal width) is not wide enough for a 2.8 tire. It's a pretty fast rolling tire though! Fun to ride on hardpack.
> 
> ...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I debated a Nextie 40mm as well. Just don't see the need for an expensive rim on my 'beater' 29er HT build.

With the Chinese rims, you really need to buy two to make shipping worth it.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Sure. I'm building up a different bike with Nextie rims, though "only" with 35mm OD/30mm ID and regular size 2.2/2.4" tires. They look like they will hold up well also, but I must say that I likely will have to use a compressor to get my tires to mount, rather than just a floor pump. It's all in the shape (of the rim) and interface (between rim and tire).

I hear you. There's no point in going for broke with one component when the rest is a budget build, as the performance potential of the chi chi part will be lost on the application.



06HokieMTB said:


> I debated a Nextie 40mm as well. Just don't see the need for an expensive rim on my 'beater' 29er HT build.
> 
> With the Chinese rims, you really need to buy two to make shipping worth it.
> 
> ...


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Well, I intend to use this bike as my dirt jumper and urban bike park bike, so big honking wheels & tires at low volume would probably be weird... it also leaves room for justifying a spare front wheel :thumbsup:

I'm gonna see what the i45 Scraper looks like with a 3.0" tire when it becomes available again. I'm curious to see how big of a tire my Fox 34 up front will clear. I could run my 29er KOM with a 29x2.4-2.4 as the summer front wheel and an i45 Scraper with a 650b x 3.0 as the winter wheel...


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

06HokieMTB said:


> Geez, I'm bumping this thread tonight... lol
> 
> Anyway, I agree with this statement. My i25 (internal width) is not wide enough for a 2.8 tire. It's a pretty fast rolling tire though! Fun to ride on hardpack.
> 
> ...


My Dually/ WTB TrailBlazer setup seated just fine with a floor pump. Bead locked in just fine. the only thing I needed to do was run 1 wrap with the wider Gorilla Tape. Tried using 25mm tape jus over the nipple holes but still had some leaking. Wide tape--- Perfect!!!


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

When I get some 27.5" x 3.25" Fatty Trax I'm going to mount them on a 40mm Derby rim. I won't be able to ride them, but I'll make some measurements and take some pictures.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

rsullivan said:


> My Dually/ WTB TrailBlazer setup seated just fine with a floor pump. Bead locked in just fine. the only thing I needed to do was run 1 wrap with the wider Gorilla Tape. Tried using 25mm tape jus over the nipple holes but still had some leaking. Wide tape--- Perfect!!!


Good to know. Thanks.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> Good to know. Thanks.


Glad you got the tire safe and sound.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> Glad you got the tire safe and sound.


:thumbsup:


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> I could run ... i45 Scraper with a 650b x 3.0 as the winter wheel...


Whoops... just bought a 27.5 Hugo 

EDIT: NM - delivery "TBD" said Hugo :/


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Got 'em mounted tubeless on Duallys. Can't wait to get the bike together and ride them. 
About an inch taller than the 26+ Dirt Wizards, but not as wide. 
Just barely fit in my 650b White Brothers loop fork.


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

Aaaww yeah


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

*This just in.*

Funky phone shot from the Dec. 1 issue of BRAIN.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Trax Fatty!*

So, I finally got my hands a pair of the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 tires. First, a quick disclaimer: I cannot say where I got them, and I believe them to be the same as the soon to be released production version, but I don't know that 100%. So back to the tire:

This thing is a different animal that the Trailblazer! The WTB tire is a wider XC tires, whereas the Trax Fatty is a shrunken Fatbike tire! It is also wider, beefier and has bigger knobs than the 29er Trax Fatty. First picture to show the tread patterns. This picture is with the tires unmounted, so don't look at the width, it's just to show the tread patterns:








I then measured the bead to bead distance of the same 3 tires more carefully, and came up with:

WTB Trailblazer: 168mm
Vee Trax Fatty 650B: 202mm!
Vee Trax Fatty 29er: 184mm

Weight is 961g, (120 tpi)no lightweight! By contrast, my 29er Trax Fatty weighs 851g, and my WTB Trailblazers weighs 933g & 948g. So I mounted them up to my Derby 40mm outside rims and measured. These tires were used a couple of times previously, so I measured them right after mounting. At 15psi I got 75mm casing and 74mm knob widths.

Tried stuffing one in the back of my Jones, and unfortunately it's a no-go. I have a 100mm truss fork on my Jones, and it fits in there no problem.








It does fit in a 29er Carver frame that I've had for years, which for some reason has extremely generous tire clearance. I bought it used on Ebay years ago:








Last detail that I measured is overall diameter. I included a bunch of wheels I have around. I stood each of them up against a wall and marked the diameter:







From top to bottom:
29er Knard on a 50mm Nextie at 10 psi
29er Trax Fatty on a Flow at 20psi
29x2.4 Racing Ralph on Flow at 25psi
27.5 Trax Fatty on Derby at 15psi
27.5 Trailblazer on Derby at 15psi

So now I'm waiting for the 27.5 Panaracer Fat B Nimble in hopes it will fit in the back of the Jones. I will be keeping the 27.5 Trax Fatty in the front.


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## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Pretty close to my findings with my lone Fatty Trax, though, if I measured right, it will fit in the back of my 1x1 albeit it a lil snug. 

I also found the 27.5" Trax Fatty to sit right at 29", with a width of 76.75mm on our Dually rim, 72.90mm on our Blunt 35 at the widest point in the sidewall. At the knobs, the additional rim width didn't really make a significant difference. I'm running 8psi.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Great info and measurements!


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Does Trax Fatty look good on the Derby? Do you think it would work better on a wider rim?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

What size is that Carver 29er frame? And what geometry? XCish or more relaxed/slacker angles?


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## Wish I Were Riding (Jan 30, 2004)

Welnic said:


> Does Trax Fatty look good on the Derby? Do you think it would work better on a wider rim?


I second these questions.

I also second the thanks for a great post with good info!


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I third the thanks for a great post with good info! :thumbsup:


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It would be rad if Rockshox reshaped the lowers of the Pikes to accept wider tires. Not a full on 150mm front hub like the Bluto, just to open the fork to something as wide as a 3.25


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Welnic said:


> Does Trax Fatty look good on the Derby? Do you think it would work better on a wider rim?


I forgot to include that in my post. I think the 40mm Derby is on lower limit of rims to run the Trax Fatty. I think it will work fine, but a 45mm to 50mm rim would be ideal. Of course, that will make it even wider and less likely to fit in any 29er frame.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

MMcG said:


> What size is that Carver 29er frame? And what geometry? XCish or more relaxed/slacker angles?


The Carver frame is around 18" I believe, with a 23.5" ETT. It's an older design 99er Ti frame, so round tubes, straight 1 1/8" headtube, but does have sliders. Geometry is more XC, not like a 420 or Gnarvester unfortunately. I actually don't know the angles, but my guess is 71 HTA. I bought it used many years ago and didn't realize how much tire clearance it had until these fatter tires started popping up. It can fit the 29er Trax Fatty on a Flow rim with the sliders all way forward. I'm setting it up as a Bikepacking rig, probably with Rohloff, 40mm rims and Trax Fatty's.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to bikeny again."


Thanks, Bikeny. Great stuff.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

bikeny said:


> The Carver frame is around 18" I believe, with a 23.5" ETT. It's an older design 99er Ti frame, so round tubes, straight 1 1/8" headtube, but does have sliders. Geometry is more XC, not like a 420 or Gnarvester unfortunately. I actually don't know the angles, but my guess is 71 HTA. I bought it used many years ago and didn't realize how much tire clearance it had until these fatter tires started popping up. It can fit the 29er Trax Fatty on a Flow rim with the sliders all way forward. I'm setting it up as a Bikepacking rig, probably with Rohloff, 40mm rims and Trax Fatty's.


BB width on this bike?


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## Guest (Nov 25, 2014)

Slow Danger said:


> "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to bikeny again."
> 
> Thanks, Bikeny. Great stuff.


i picked up yer slack


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Slow Danger said:


> "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to bikeny again."
> 
> Thanks, Bikeny. Great stuff.


Yep, I'm seeing the same thing. Thanks for the info and pictures, bikeny.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> BB width on this bike?


It's a normal 135mm rear and 68mm BB frame. The chainstays are not short, I think around 17.25" or 17.5" at the shortest.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Anyone got dimensions on Fat B Nimble 27.5" on Dually's?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

MikenIke said:


> Anyone got dimensions on Fat B Nimble 27.5" on Dually's?


I've not seen any measurements on that tire yet, I read there are only a few in the US right now. I believe it will be somewhere between the Trailblazer and Trax Fatty size-wise, but that's just my guess.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> I've not seen any measurements on that tire yet, I read there are only a few in the US right now. I believe it will be somewhere between the Trailblazer and Trax Fatty size-wise, but that's just my guess.


I, too, have been wondering this and haven't seen any info. Using information that's available for the WTB 2.8 and the VTF 3.25 and all of the different rim sizes, I've extrapolated the following table.

Disclaimer: this is merely an educated guess, but I tried to be as scientific as I could (I'm a Mechanical Engineer = dork). Hopefully this will help someone decide on a rim/tire combo based off of what they think will fit in their frame.


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## 505fatkid (Nov 25, 2014)

been watching this thread for a while
for what its worth the trax fatty on velocity blunts fits my vassago chupacabra in the rear, the reba took a little dremel love but it seems to work for now


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## Wish I Were Riding (Jan 30, 2004)

505fatkid said:


> for what its worth the trax fatty on velocity blunts... the reba took a little dremel love but it seems to work for now
> View attachment 941912


Ouch. I assume the Reba is a 29er fork right?

Edit: forgot to say it looks cool!


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## 505fatkid (Nov 25, 2014)

Wish I Were Riding said:


> Ouch. I assume the Reba is a 29er fork right?
> 
> Edit: forgot to say it looks cool!


you are correct its a 29er


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## Wish I Were Riding (Jan 30, 2004)

505fatkid said:


> you are correct its a 29er


That adds another hurdle for some then. At least we now have to be concerned about both frames and forks...

But anyway, please be sure to post some ride reports/impressions!!!


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## 505fatkid (Nov 25, 2014)

Wish I Were Riding said:


> That adds another hurdle for some then. At least we now have to be concerned about both frames and forks...
> 
> But anyway, please be sure to post some ride reports/impressions!!!


i will,only a few short rides so far
so far its killer
exactly what i wanted
fast stable sand slaying beast
nailing the tire pressure will be key


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Wish I Were Riding said:


> That adds another hurdle for some then. At least we now have to be concerned about both frames and forks...


Guess I'm not clear on this? Aren't most people trying to stuff 650b+ into 29er frame/forks?


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Probably like 12 years ago Doug Bradbury of Manitou fame completely cut the arch out of a 26" Manitou fork that had a through axle and rode the crap out of it. I doubt a little dremelology will make much difference on yours. The length of that seat post would concern me more . I assume there is a saddle up there somewhere. 

Pretty cool that the 3.25 fits that frame but it seems that Vassago claimed up front that it would fit 2.55/700c which at the time of it's production didn't even exist to my knowledge. Will be interesting to see what psi you end up at with the 30 inner width rim.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm really curious about what older 29er forks besides that new DT Swiss will fit a 3.25 tire, and if they don't fit, if that is because of width or height of the casings.


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## 505fatkid (Nov 25, 2014)

Bigwheel said:


> Probably like 12 years ago Doug Bradbury of Manitou fame completely cut the arch out of a 26" Manitou fork that had a through axle and rode the crap out of it. I doubt a little dremelology will make much difference on yours. The length of that seat post would concern me more . I assume there is a saddle up there somewhere.
> 
> Pretty cool that the 3.25 fits that frame but it seems that Vassago claimed up front that it would fit 2.55/700c which at the time of it's production didn't even exist to my knowledge. Will be interesting to see what psi you end up at with the 30 inner width rim.


my teeth are bad anyways 
there is a seat its a weird angle
i ride em high though


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Guess I'm not clear on this? Aren't most people trying to stuff 650b+ into 29er frame/forks?


I am going to speculate that 650+ will become a niche of its own, with some of its offerings crossing over to existing 29er frames and forks, and all of its offerings available to fat bikes, though of course with fat bike geo (i.e. 100mm BB width).


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Not sure if this has been posted, but I thought some may find useful this review of the 3.25" 650b Trax Fatty. The review is made of the Trax Fatty on front with Ibis rims, 35mm ID, which is the same as Derby:

Vee Tire Trax Fatty 27.5" X 3.25" Tires: Quick Review


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

awai04 said:


> I am going to speculate that 650+ will become a niche of its own, with some of its offerings crossing over to existing 29er frames and forks, and all of its offerings available to fat bikes, though of course with fat bike geo (i.e. 100mm BB width).


No need to speculate, read post 328. The OEM bus has left the station. But it is a pretty slow bus so don't get too excited about anything happening except for more speculation as to when it will arrive.


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2014)

06HokieMTB said:


> Guess I'm not clear on this? Aren't most people trying to stuff 650b+ into 29er frame/forks?


not i, hell i'd stuff it in a FS 26er if possible...but more likely to end up in a 650b chassis.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Lol. Yep, saw that too. Good post.

Yeah, too slow!



Bigwheel said:


> No need to speculate, read post 328. The OEM bus has left the station. But it is a pretty slow bus so don't get too excited about anything happening except for more speculation as to when it will arrive.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Anyone have an actual weight of a 650b Velocity Dually?

I ask because my Blunt 35 came in at 542g, or 28g less than advertised. (Contrasting the WTB Frequency i25, which came in almost 20g heavier).

If a Dually follows suit, that would be great!


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Anyone have an actual weight of a 650b Velocity Dually?
> 
> I ask because my Blunt 35 came in at 542g, or 28g less than advertised. (Contrasting the WTB Frequency i25, which came in almost 20g heavier).
> 
> If a Dually follows suit, that would be great!


Here you go:


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

seely said:


> Here you go:


Thanks! That is most definitely not 640g as advertised!

I'm thinking the Dually would be a better front wheel for a rowdy 650b+ AM HT than a Stan's Hugo.

To me, the Hugo looks like a great option for a fat bike, but the bead seat 'wings' don't seem very well supported (ie: would ding?)


----------



## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I felt compelled to follow up on my comment about the Nextie rims. When I set up the rims with just 18mm Orange tape, my Conti Trail Kings (2.2 & 2.4") required a compressor to inflate them. I actually had difficulty getting the 2.2" TK to inflate that way. HOWEVER, I had some 25mm yellow Stans tape and decided to wrap 1 layer around then&#8230; perfect! With just a floor pump, the beads of both TK sizes snapped into place.

It's true that I have both 1 layer of Stans yellow and 1 thin layer of 18mm Orange (I didn't see the point in removing the Orange layer), but my bet is that the Nextie 35/30mm OD/ID rims would work just fine with the yellow alone. Hopefully someone will come across this bit of information and find it useful.



awai04 said:


> Sure. I'm building up a different bike with Nextie rims, though "only" with 35mm OD/30mm ID and regular size 2.2/2.4" tires. They look like they will hold up well also, but I must say that I likely will have to use a compressor to get my tires to mount, rather than just a floor pump. It's all in the shape (of the rim) and interface (between rim and tire).
> 
> I hear you. There's no point in going for broke with one component when the rest is a budget build, as the performance potential of the chi chi part will be lost on the application.


----------



## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

505fatkid said:


> been watching this thread for a while
> for what its worth the trax fatty on velocity blunts fits my vassago chupacabra in the rear, the reba took a little dremel love but it seems to work for now
> View attachment 941912


Just stuck a pair of 2.8 Trailblazers on a bike I have here. Running just Pacenti DL31's currently, but plenty of clearance in a 27.5in XFusion Sweep fork.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

brant said:


> Just stuck a pair of 2.8 Trailblazers on a bike I have here. Running just Pacenti DL31's currently, but plenty of clearance in a 27.5in XFusion Sweep fork.


No photos? c'mon man!


----------



## Guest (Dec 4, 2014)

brant said:


> Just stuck a pair of 2.8 Trailblazers on a bike I have here. Running just Pacenti DL31's currently, but plenty of clearance in a 27.5in XFusion Sweep fork.


brant you know us bike geeks(well i am) want details, ie the bike, pics of said setup cuz we joinsin.



MMcG said:


> No photos? c'mon man!


+1


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

Measures about 10mm by the look of things.

Oh. Upsidedown fail. Ah well.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

HOw about the rest of the bike Mr. Richards? Or is that "top secret?"


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Jeez that Sweep looks like it could handle and even larger tire. Makes you wonder if the 29er forks have similar clearances relative to their specific wheel size.


----------



## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

MMcG said:


> HOw about the rest of the bike Mr. Richards? Or is that "top secret?"


I don't only ride it at night. I had fun out on it today.
Mountain Bike Ride Profile | B+ near Hebden Bridge | Times and Records | Strava


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

PHeller said:


> Jeez that forks looks like it could handle and even larger tire.


Depends on conditions where you ride I guess. I'd not want to go an awful lot bigger.


----------



## Guest (Dec 4, 2014)

brant said:


> Measures about 10mm by the look of things.
> 
> Oh. Upside down fail. Ah well.


even upside down is good :thumbsup: i wonder how fitment would be with say a wider 35-40mm rim?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

brant said:


> Depends on conditions where you ride I guess. I'd not want to go an awful lot bigger.


was there a post ride beer to recapture those 800 plus calories you burned off?


----------



## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

*Trax Fattys*

Just got these mounted up, on my Wiseman which was designed for 27.5+. I will take them out for a ride tomorrow. Not really sure how I ended up getting a pair.

First impressions are they are just a tad larger in diameter compared to my 3.8 larry mounted on a Schlick Northpaw, barely. The rim is a Nextie 40mm, which is perfect for these tires. I think the tire size will be perfect for singletrack.

They weighed 940g and 960g.

The last couple pics are with 26X3.8 for comparison.


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## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

Looks good. On wtb duallys?


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

*^^sweet trx*



brant said:


> Just stuck a pair of 2.8 Trailblazers on a bike I have here. Running just Pacenti DL31's currently, but plenty of clearance in a 27.5in XFusion Sweep fork.


How bout the chain stays in a 45650b??


----------



## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

1strongone1 said:


> Just got these mounted up, on my Wiseman which was designed for 27.5+. I will take them out for a ride tomorrow. Not really sure how I ended up getting a pair.
> 
> First impressions are they are just a tad larger in diameter compared to my 3.8 larry mounted on a Schlick Northpaw, barely. The rim is a Nextie 40mm, which is perfect for these tires. I think the tire size will be perfect for singletrack.
> 
> ...


Now that's what I'm talking about. Nice ride. Did you design the Wiseman specifically for/around 27.5+, or just so that it could be an option.


----------



## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Now that's what I'm talking about. Nice ride. Did you design the Wiseman specifically for/around 27.5+, or just so that it could be an option.


I had it built specifically for 27.5+ or 26 fatty, the diameters are almost exactly the same.


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

Deerhill said:


> How bout the chain stays in a 45650b??


Not sure sorry. And I don't have one to check.
I left OnOne in June.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

1strongone1 said:


> I had it built specifically for 27.5+ or 26 fatty, the diameters are almost exactly the same.


Ah, see I wasn't sure if it was a situation where a 50mm 26 inch rim with a narrow fat tire fit as well, but not the larger rims/tires.


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Ah, see I wasn't sure if it was a situation where a 50mm 26 inch rim with a narrow fat tire fit as well, but not the larger rims/tires.


a 3.8 on a 50mm rim will fit, but a 3.8 on a 65mm will not fit. The frame has a 73mm bottom bracket, so you can only go so large.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Nice! How long is fork's AtoC?


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

450mm


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

1strongone1 said:


> Just got these mounted up, on my Wiseman which was designed for 27.5+. I will take them out for a ride tomorrow. Not really sure how I ended up getting a pair.
> 
> First impressions are they are just a tad larger in diameter compared to my 3.8 larry mounted on a Schlick Northpaw, barely. The rim is a Nextie 40mm, which is perfect for these tires. I think the tire size will be perfect for singletrack.
> 
> ...


Nice looking bike. That paint job looks like iridescent root beer sparkle.
Is that the 72 TPI version? Advertised weights are 800-895g.


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

Nice bike. I would assume the 27.5 setup weighs less overall than the 26" due to the cf rims and under 1000g tires which is a plus. But visually they look about the same to me? It would be interesting to hear your comparison between the two wheel sets performance on the trail. 

I have to say that the TF for my needs looks a bit too plump as a front tire especially. Low psi I like but too big of a contact patch in front and I just don't like how they handle. It's a good thing to have options so that we get to ride what suits eh boys?


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

SmooveP said:


> Nice looking bike. That paint job looks like iridescent root beer sparkle.
> Is that the 72 TPI version? Advertised weights are 800-895g.


It is the 120 TPI. All of the TF I have seen are 950 ish


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

They are almost exactly the same diameter, they are narrower, which is perfect .The bike weighs 20.65 in 27.5+ mode. 23.8 in 26x3.8. I am going for a ride tomorrow, I have a feeling they will be really sweet.


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## filbike (Mar 15, 2007)

@1strongone1
Would you please measure for me, the maximum width of 3,25 VT at its maximum recommended pressure ( Think should be 20 PSI ).
I'd like to use it with same rim, on my 29er
Thank you


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## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

filbike said:


> @1strongone1
> Would you please measure for me, the maximum width of 3,25 VT at its maximum recommended pressure ( Think should be 20 PSI ).
> I'd like to use it with same rim, on my 29er
> Thank you


79.375mm


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

1strongone1 said:


> 79.375mm


Hey, that's cool!

In my extrapolated chart (post #346), I estimated that a VTF would be 79mm tread/78.3 mm casing on a Ibis 741/Nextie 40 rim.

Thanks for posting :thumbsup:


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## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

I'm trying to get Vee Rubber to produce their Speedster tread on a 27.5x3.25" casing identical to that used by the Trax Fatty. Send'em an email if you want the same for fast rolling on hardpack.


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## filbike (Mar 15, 2007)

1strongone1 said:


> 79.375mm


Uh...that would be a very tight fit with 83 mm room.:nonod:
Thanks


----------



## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

Hey folks this is a good thread been reading through and have a question on rim size. I am currently riding a kona explosif but think I am going to go to a 27.5+ setup on a slackish 29'er frame this year. 

I was planning on getting some new rims (currently running the blunt 35's) want to go carbon and think nextie is going to get the nod. How do you feel these new plus size tires would work on a 35mm rim? Should I go 40? I am not trying to make a 'fat bike' here just an agro hardtail for all year riding. I would like to keep the wheel weight down so was trying to keep the rims smaller if possible. What are your thoughts on the tire profile?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

If I were going carbon and B+, I'd be buying a Nextie 40mm or Ibis 741. Both have 35mm internal width, which seems to be working very well for people.

I could maybe fit a 35mm internal rim on the rear of my Mason, but it would be close.

Good news (for me, at least) is that I rode last night with a guy running 29+ on a Fox 34. He had 50mm (45mm internal) Nextie rims and 29x3 Chronicle tire. Width wise, he didn't have clearance problems. I'm hopefull my 34 29er fork will allow me to stuff an aggressive 3" B+ tire upfront at some point.


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## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

rikardo said:


> Does anybody have any info where the Vee traxx fatty could be purchased??
> if they are not yet available is there any idea when these would be available.
> How about wtb:s any source for them??
> Thanks in advance!


Any shop who uses QBP can get them when available, they are currently out of stock at the moment though.


----------



## Lelandjt (Feb 22, 2008)

^Yes, late January is when they expect to have them. Vee Tire's US headquarters didn't even have a set they could send us for fitment on a prototype bike. Notubes said several 650b+ tires are in development from various manufacturers. The NoTubes 650b+ rim will be out by Feb.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

manhattanprjkt83 said:


> Hey folks this is a good thread been reading through and have a question on rim size. I am currently riding a kona explosif but think I am going to go to a 27.5+ setup on a slackish 29'er frame this year.
> 
> I was planning on getting some new rims (currently running the blunt 35's) want to go carbon and think nextie is going to get the nod. How do you feel these new plus size tires would work on a 35mm rim? Should I go 40? I am not trying to make a 'fat bike' here just an agro hardtail for all year riding. I would like to keep the wheel weight down so was trying to keep the rims smaller if possible. What are your thoughts on the tire profile?


http://forums.mtbr.com/singlespeed/27-5-singlespeed-941319.html


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

My 650b Duallys arrived, 530/540gm, look like the P35 but wider, similar quality, not sure on the price as it's my buddies shop, but they were cheaper to him than the WTB.

Building these up with Origin 8 fat bike hubs 150/190, db spokes, nothing fancy, they will be my three season wheel for my fat bike, still waiting on the Vee Rubber Trax...

On an aside, I have ridden the Trax Fatty tire pattern in a narrower version on my 36er, they are a nice all around tread, decent wear, fast, suprisingly good traction.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I'm seeing some sites showing two different VTF's as able to be back-ordered.

Looks like there will be a 3.0 x 27.5 VTF as well?!?!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> My 650b Duallys arrived, 530/540gm


Wait... 530-540g for a Dually 650b?

That's what my Blunt 35 weighs.

Seely, a Velocity employee, posted a pic of a 650b Dually weighing in a 628g.



seely said:


> Here you go:
> View attachment 942062


----------



## Guest (Dec 12, 2014)

06HokieMTB said:


> Wait... 530-540g for a Dually 650b?
> 
> That's what my Blunt 35 weighs.
> 
> Seely, a Velocity employee, posted a pic of a 650b Dually weighing in a 628g.


did that include the bowl it was balancing on??


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

nvphatty said:


> did that include the bowl it was balancing on??


One would have to assume that the TARE button was pressed


----------



## 1spd1way (Jun 30, 2006)

Joined this party late.....
is there a 27.5+ rim that can be laced offset for my wife's 907.
She is too short for 29+ and wants a summer wheels set.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Unless I didn't look at the numbers right... I'll check it again when I get a chance.



06HokieMTB said:


> Wait... 530-540g for a Dually 650b?
> 
> That's what my Blunt 35 weighs.
> 
> Seely, a Velocity employee, posted a pic of a 650b Dually weighing in a 628g.


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> Unless I didn't look at the numbers right... I'll check it again when I get a chance.


Sounds about right! 540-ish sounds more like a Blunt 35, which I also have a set of. I apologize if I mixed up the two weights anywhere in the 27.5 forum!


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Nurse Ben said:


> Unless I didn't look at the numbers right... I'll check it again when I get a chance.


Had the 628g rim been drilled for nipples yet or was it a raw rim?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

The link I quoted still works and is from the picture Seely posted 2 pages back...

There are spoke holes and its a black (not raw) rim


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Anyone needing a pair of WTB Trailblazer 27.5 x 2.8, send me a PM.

Tired are sold, thanks for the interest.


----------



## palmermtb (Jan 2, 2004)

Hey Bikeny, I just saw your PM and and responded back. Sorry for the delay


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Was this posted?








_Mounted to a more conventional DT Swiss FR 570 rim with a 27.5mm internal width, The Trailblazer fits in a 27.5 Focus SAM._









_Plenty of room for this tire on a 27.5″ Pike._

DI.A 2015 Breakout Sessions | Are 650b+ Wheels the Future? | Enduro Mountainbike Magazine

I hope the tire manufacturers make more tires that just barely fit in the Pike 275, since that is the tightest clearance of the 160mm 275 forks, if it fit in those, it'd fit in anything, and I'd be tempted to hold onto my 275 bike for awhile longer.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

It's been requested I show visual proof of Trailblazers/Duallys on a Soma Bside V3 frame. Apparently I'm restricted from responding to private messages so I'll post the pic here. Been riding it for a month with no issues, and sliding dropouts only 2/3rds the way back. 
It's actually slightly narrower than my Dually/Dirt Wiz setup which was my original setup.


----------



## fewg8 (Oct 25, 2013)

need pics of clearance, Clarence


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I lied, the dropouts are only 1/3 the way back.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

what is the chainstay length range on that frame again? Thanks for posting these photos. Also what travel do you have on that Loop? And it is a 650b Loop - clearance looks tight at the arch on the fork. No?


----------



## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

I've got 2.8's working on 420mm chainstays with 1x ring clearance to 34t with a 49mm chainline. 

Not played hard with wider rims yet. Suspect it'll all be fine.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

What Rims Brant?

I think SomaFab has their geometry numbers backwards. The Reach Numbers and ETT numbers need to be reversed no?








For example if you add Axle to Crown Height - Reach decreases not increases like they show it - correct? Their numbers should be flipped I think.

Damn I should take a grinder to the seatpost and chainstay "nubs" that stick out of my D.O.C!


----------



## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> My 650b Duallys arrived, 530/540gm, look like the P35 but wider, similar quality, not sure on the price as it's my buddies shop, but they were cheaper to him than the WTB.
> 
> Building these up with Origin 8 fat bike hubs 150/190, db spokes, nothing fancy, they will be my three season wheel for my fat bike, still waiting on the Vee Rubber Trax...
> 
> On an aside, I have ridden the Trax Fatty tire pattern in a narrower version on my 36er, they are a nice all around tread, decent wear, fast, suprisingly good traction.


Looking to do something similar, but still looking for 150/197 hubs. Where did you order the Origin 8's from? See them at Jensons but not the size I need. Good to hear about an actual ride on the TF tires too....those are on the list. Thnx : )


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

About 16.7ish to 18". That's eyeballing the tape measure. It's a 100mm Loop. Very tight clearance but it's an old fork that's seen more than it's share of abuse so I've shaved the arch a few mm's and now it's fine. I believe a 29er fork would be ideal so I'm currently shopping the market for one. 
One thing about these tires, I landed a jump wrong and the rear tire almost bounced me over the handlebars. Kinda like a fat bike.


----------



## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

MMcG said:


> What Rims Brant?
> 
> I think SomaFab has their geometry numbers backwards. The Reach Numbers and ETT numbers need to be reversed no?
> 
> ...


The Reach should get smaller with a longer fork. The ETT should get longer. Since the Seat Tube Angle gets slacker that increases the ETT.


----------



## jayoutside (Mar 21, 2004)

MikenIke said:


> View attachment 949480
> 
> It's actually slightly narrower than my Dually/Dirt Wiz setup which was my original setup.


Can you offer thoughts on the dually/dirt wizard compared to the equally/trailblazer? Trying to decide what to do right now on a build up- thanks!


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

i too would like to know, also if anyone knows where to score polished dually's that'd be awesome. i didn't hold off for them in the 29 version, but i want them polished for the 650. oh one last thing, what is the actual erd of the dually? trying to get everything here ready to go


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

The Dually/Dirt combo was a thing of beauty. Point and shoot and hang on. Forgives bad lines and makes it look easy. Not bouncy or dodgy at all, just positive traction everywhere. The bad part was the low BB with these on the BSide. Pedal striker! One reason I can't get into fat bikes....too low. 
The Dually/Trailblazer combo is of course a wheel size bigger at 27.5 so immediately higher BB. Up high where I like it. The traction is good but def not DW good. No cornering side knobs to speak of but fast rolling and forgiving with direct hits on rocks. Just try not to hit the sidewalls. The Trailblazer is bouncy where Dirt Wiz is stable and grounded. 
I like both sets for different reasons. 
I might try the 26" DW on back with the Trailblazer on front next time out and see how that goes. 67er plus? 
Anyways hope that helps.


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

It just occurred to me that you may want to know what conditions I ride in to help your decision. I'm in The southern Rockies where we have rocks, clay mud, broken shale, and cactus. Steep climbs wash-outs and big drops. When I show up for a club rides I'm usually the only guy on a Hardtail, riding at the front of the pack. We ride all mountain and usually there's at least one good crash or bike broken. I'm on my second Soma frame since May. We go hard, and burn through a quart of Stans pretty quick with all the cactus. 
The Dually rim is bulletproof, always straight and takes a hell of a beating. Don't have enough time on the WTB tire to speak of it's durability but the Dirt Wizard is unstoppable. If you're clumsy and fast like me go with the Wizard. 
If you are more of a cross country rider I would recommend the Trailblazer.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

fishwrinkle said:


> i too would like to know, also if anyone knows where to score polished dually's that'd be awesome. i didn't hold off for them in the 29 version, but i want them polished for the 650. oh one last thing, what is the actual erd of the dually? trying to get everything here ready to go


Check mpgear.com

They don't specify black vs polished, but show a picture of polished


----------



## Davide (Jan 29, 2004)

MikenIke said:


> View attachment 949595


Get a 26 wheel and mount a 2.8 tire on it. It will fit much better.


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

thx hokie, but i did a quick filter of velocity rims and didnt see dually's under velocity. pro wheel builder has em for $136, but thats a lil rich, so i will wait. i have $650 to build my own and i can do it just need em to come down 20 a rim. i paid $106 for the 700's. i might just go with some swiss fr570's if i can't fight off the fiend in me.


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

fishwrinkle said:


> i too would like to know, also if anyone knows where to score polished dually's that'd be awesome. i didn't hold off for them in the 29 version, but i want them polished for the 650. oh one last thing, what is the actual erd of the dually? trying to get everything here ready to go


Pulled from Velocity's website

Dually 27.5"
27.5"+ & 29"+, Mid Fat, and Fat Race are what this thing is all about. Perfect for sand, snow, trail, and everything in between.

Double wall for increased stiffness and tubeless ready!

Specs

RIM SIZE: 27.5"

WIDTH: 45mm

HEIGHT: 18mm

TIRE INTERFACE: Clincher / Tubeless

VALVE: Presta 32 - 40mm

BEAD SEAT DIAMETER (BSD): 584

_*EFFECTIVE RIM DIAMETER (ERD): 565*_

WEIGHT: 640g

DISC ONLY DRILLINGS/COLORS:
32 spoke: Black, Polished


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

thanks sully, i read that too. i'd like an actual erd as when i built my 29 dually's the erd was smaller by 2 on the front and 3 on the back. that was averaged taking 4 measures per hoop. i'll just wait til i have em in hand.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

FWIW, my Velocity Blunt 35 ERD was off by at least 5mm


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

yeah my p-35's were under quite a bit also.


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Davide said:


> Get a 26 wheel and mount a 2.8 tire on it. It will fit much better.


Did that, it was fine but the BB was too low, hence the move to 650b+.


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Who will be producing a 275x3.0 tire? Will Surly get into the game with a 650b Knard?


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

i hope they don't waste their time with that tread pattern.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

PHeller said:


> Who will be producing a 275x3.0 tire? Will Surly get into the game with a 650b Knard?


the Panaracer Fat b Nimble is a 3" 650B+ tire in production. The Panaracer FB says early Feb 2015 availability.

mike


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I could like the Panaracer tire. Spokesperson says that the kevlar bead could be less expensive at 60 bucks a tire:

Panaracer Interbike 2014 - Mtbr.com



senor_mikey said:


> the Panaracer Fat b Nimble is a 3" 650B+ tire in production. The Panaracer FB says early Feb 2015 availability.
> 
> mike


----------



## Cody01 (Jul 23, 2014)

I'm real happy to see these B+ tires coming out. Now I wish there was some full suspension bikes to fit them. This size fits in well. I find my 4" tires to be a little much yet the 2.3-2.4" are not quite enough on loose terrain. After riding fat for so long the 2" tires feels sketchy offroad.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Cody01 said:


> I'm real happy to see these B+ tires coming out. Now I wish there was some full suspension bikes to fit them.


The B+ fits great on the back of my 2012 TBa. More clearance than the back of my '13 DB Mason (that I currently have my WTB 2.8/Blunt 35 mounted on)


----------



## Cody01 (Jul 23, 2014)

So any chance the 2.8's would fit on a bike like a Trek Slash or Giant Reign? I may just skip another fat all together. I Scott bikes and Rocky Mountain has future plans for the B+ but nothing solid on release dates, no prototype pics so I'm guessing it maybe many months away yet.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

You best bet is to take pictures of the current clearances and post it, or if you're like me and have some 29er wheels/tires laying around, fit those and see how much clearance you've got.

In my case, my 150mm travel full suspension 650b bike can fit a 29x2.2 with plenty of clearance, so I think I'm safe with a 2.8 or even a 3.0 tire.


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## Atomik Carbon (Jan 4, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> The B+ fits great on the back of my 2012 TBa. More clearance than the back of my '13 DB Mason (that I currently have my WTB 2.8/Blunt 35 mounted on)


The industry and marketing gurus are setting the "standard" for 27.5+ at 45mm ID and up.... There is an article that was recently written about the Ibis 41mm and they made that distinction.....


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Atomik Carbon said:


> The industry and marketing gurus are setting the "standard" for 27.5+ at 45mm ID and up.... There is an article that was recently written about the Ibis 41mm and they made that distinction.....


Ok?


----------



## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Now that would be a wide starting "standard," given that full fat 26 rims go as narrow as 65mm presently. The idea would make sense if present "wide" mtb rims are to become the new normal. That last idea is not impossible, despite the opponents to change who argue otherwise.

Do you have a link to the article?



Atomik Carbon said:


> The industry and marketing gurus are setting the "standard" for 27.5+ at 45mm ID and up.... There is an article that was recently written about the Ibis 41mm and they made that distinction.....


----------



## Atomik Carbon (Jan 4, 2004)

awai04 said:


> Now that would be a wide starting "standard," given that full fat 26 rims go as narrow as 65mm presently. The idea would make sense if present "wide" mtb rims are to become the new normal. That last idea is not impossible, despite the opponents to change who argue otherwise.
> 
> Do you have a link to the article?


Just In: Ultra Wide Ibis 741 Carbon 27.5 Wheels

Not sure what to think.....latest twentynineinches.com article says that 30-35mm is the ideal ID for the 2.8 tires and EASILY fits most of the 29er out there. What is very confusing is that WTB is coming out with their new rim at 45mm ID and they claim that it will fit most existing 29ers. I cannot imaging that they would have done this without testing amongst several existing frames and why would they develop a wide rim that will fit new frames that have not yet been introduced ???


----------



## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Ah thanks. I've read about those wheels, perhaps even on Ibis' own website. Dimensionally, they're the same as Derby wheels, being 41mm wide in outer width, and 35mm wide on the inside. A few of us have put the WTB 2.8's on Derbys, and like how they go together.

I'm doubtful that 45mm wide rims will fit the 2.8 tires in the rear of "most" 29ers. Even stick a 2.4 x 29 tire with Stans Arch EX in the back of some 29er hardtails, and there's barely 5mm of clearance at the chainstays.



Atomik Carbon said:


> Just In: Ultra Wide Ibis 741 Carbon 27.5 Wheels
> 
> Not sure what to think.....latest twentynineinches.com article says that 30-35mm is the ideal ID for the 2.8 tires and EASILY fits most of the 29er out there. What is very confusing is that WTB is coming out with their new rim at 45mm ID and they claim that it will fit most existing 29ers. I cannot imaging that they would have done this without testing amongst several existing frames and why would they develop a wide rim that will fit new frames that have not yet been introduced ???


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

That Rocky Mountain Sherpa had a custom rear triangle, as the stock rear teiangle wouldn't clear the WTB 2.8 on the i45 rim.


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Now I only need some tires 

(50mm version)


----------



## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

Tor said:


> Now I only need some tires
> 
> (50mm version)
> 
> View attachment 952756


Nice. Thinking about doing this, too. 170mm hub? What size spokes?


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Yes the Hope 177mm hub for the salsa beargrease. I used 262 for the left and 260 for the right side. But I think they could have been 260 and 258mm. DT Swiss 2 - 1.5 - 2, total weight 980 grams.

Edit: I got this from freespoke, but I ordered some wrong sizes and tried the ones I got. Seems to be ok. Spoke length left	260.6 right mm	259.4


----------



## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Very nice. I didn't even know Nextie made 50mm x 27.5" rims until you posted this. Good to see somebody cooperating with this nascent categorical subdivision.



Tor said:


> Now I only need some tires
> 
> (50mm version)


----------



## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

Tor said:


> Now I only need some tires
> 
> (50mm version)
> 
> View attachment 952756


That's a nice looking wheel. I'm hoping that the tire selection for 650b+ materializes.


----------



## TheirOnlyPortrait (Dec 30, 2014)

1strongone1 said:


> Just got these mounted up, on my Wiseman which was designed for 27.5+. I will take them out for a ride tomorrow.
> 
> First impressions are they are just a tad larger in diameter compared to my 3.8 larry mounted on a Schlick Northpaw, barely. The rim is a Nextie 40mm, which is perfect for these tires. I think the tire size will be perfect for singletrack.


Hola 1strongone1,

What an AWESONE ride, CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Saludos,
Federico


----------



## Nicolo38 (Apr 16, 2008)

Has anybody tried to install 650B+ wheels and tires on a Remedy 29 ? I wonder if rear end is large enough for a 2.8 or 3.0 tire...


----------



## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

Does anyone out there have a 2.8 Trailblazer they can sell me, loan, me whatever...I have an entire bike being planned around this tire and can't get my hands on one to make sure it will work. If anyone can help please PM me, thanks much!


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

manhattanprjkt83 said:


> Does anyone out there have a 2.8 Trailblazer they can sell me, loan, me whatever...I have an entire bike being planned around this tire and can't get my hands on one to make sure it will work. If anyone can help please PM me, thanks much!


Where are you located? I'm not currently using my set - but A Nony Moose has em and is testing for fit in various frames he has. I don't want to sell, but maybe I could loan.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

"Must spread more rep before giving more to MMcG"


----------



## Guest (Jan 15, 2015)

06HokieMTB said:


> "Must spread more rep before giving more to MMcG"


i slapped him with some and well earned, oh and you jus cuz.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

nvphatty said:


> i slapped him with some and well earned, oh and you jus cuz.


Thanks guys!

P.S. I have an OS Bikes BlackBuck frame coming my way and the plan is to B+ it! Stay tuned as the project unfolds!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> Thanks guys!
> 
> P.S. I have an OS Bikes BlackBuck frame coming my way and the plan is to B+ it! Stay tuned as the project unfolds!


Wheelbase is 42½" with a 17¼" chainstay length.... tasty :thumbsup:


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> Wheelbase is 42½" with a 17¼" chainstay length.... tasty :thumbsup:


I think it'll rock - I have several different fork options I can utilize with it too to get different types of "feel" from the bike.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> I think it'll rock - I have several different fork options I can utilize with it too to get different types of "feel" from the bike.


Glad to see that you found a SS frame that met all of your requirements! Looking forward to seeing it built up.


----------



## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Hello from Japan.
it's Ragley BluePig X with P35 and Devinci Atlas with Nextie40mm.
both works well! The best size(wide and diameter), new experience!


----------



## rave81 (Mar 1, 2013)

Has anyone run a high rollers 27.5x2.4 as tubeless? 

Have you encountered any problems?


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

tsurun said:


> View attachment 956197
> 
> View attachment 956198
> 
> ...


That's amazing you got it to fit in the Blue Pig!


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

tsurun said:


> View attachment 956198


Makes that little XC whip into quite the beast. I always wish they had made that frame with an angleset in mind.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

PHeller said:


> Makes that little XC whip into quite the beast. I always wish they had made that frame with an angleset in mind.


That thing looks crazy cool in a weird/wild way with that small frame size and those massive wheels/tires! Love it!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Makes that little XC whip into quite the beast. I always wish they had made that frame with an angleset in mind.


No joke! The Devinci Atlas would be on my short list if you could get the HTA down around 68*... I think it's 71* stock?

If I was keeping my SC Tallboy AL (need size XL, my frame is a Large) I could get it down around 69* with a 120 SID/Reba and an offset shock bushing on the frame side mount of the shock. Adding -1-1.5* Works Components headset would make it into a short travel, B+ monster! (But I'd have to remove the offset bushing as it would lower the BB even more)


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> That's amazing you got it to fit in the Blue Pig!


You ain't kidding... I didn't realize that I Blue Pig is a 26" frameset until I just Googled it.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> You ain't kidding... I didn't realize that I Blue Pig is a 26" frameset until I just Googled it.


I knew it could be converted to 650b - I did it once with a Generation 1 Blue Pig - but didn't think there'd be a chance in hell for B+ing one!


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Love that blue pig b+ ! Now I regret that I sold mine. Do you think that the b+ tire will fit a blue pig with rear derailleur mounted?


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Tor said:


> Love that blue pig b+ ! Now I regret that I sold mine. Do you think that the b+ tire will fit a blue pig with rear derailleur mounted?


Maybe the reason it fits is because of the ENO rear hub (I'm guessing that's what he's using) allowing the wheel to sit a bit further back from those three finger chainstay dealios on the Blue Pig Frames.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> Maybe the reason it fits is because of the ENO rear hub (I'm guessing that's what he's using) allowing the wheel to sit a bit further back from those three finger chainstay dealios on the Blue Pig Frames.


Eccentric rear hub? Crazy!


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> Eccentric rear hub? Crazy!


Yep White Industries - pretty trick hubs!


----------



## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

anyone have info on any more release dates? 

WTB emailed me saying march for the 2nd batch and they are almost all spoken for before even getting off the boat

what's the word on the vee or panaracer tires?


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

And what about the maxxis chronicle in 27.5 version?


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

TitanofChaos said:


> what's the word on the vee or panaracer tires?


Don't want to make promises on anyone's behalf, but I've been in touch with Vee recently re: the 27.5 Fatty Trax and it sounds like they are on track for the end of the month. I'd bet they are almost all spoken for as well, though.... been trying to get my hands on pair for some thorough testing!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Really wish the VTF was a 3.0" instead of 3.25"... 3.25" puts it in rigid/fatbike fork only territory.


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

It's nowhere near 3.25 in real life... more like 2.9


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

seely said:


> It's nowhere near 3.25 in real life... more like 2.9


But the few reports I've read says that it won't fit in a 29er fork... RS, Fox, Manitou...


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> But the few reports I've read says that it won't fit in a 29er fork... RS, Fox, Manitou...


That may be the case, but it still runs on the very small side


----------



## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

As we know the width of the tyre depends on the width of the rim. 
I wish to use the T-Fatty on a new custom frame, and I'm in trouble about the fork.
I'm waiting for WTB Scraper rims and for now I could see only that with normal 28mm wheels fit well on PIKE 29er fork.

















The Trax Fatty 3.25" on this rims are only 73mm but I'm afraid on Scraper rims it will be much wider ! Will see ...


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Well, the Pike is not known for the best tire width clearance... so maybe the F34 guys will fair better?

Appreciate the pics. Any idea when your Scraper rims will come in?


----------



## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

06HokieMTB said:


> Appreciate the pics. Any idea when your Scraper rims will come in?


The wheels will be shipped in a few days, I hope to come soon from USA to Italy. Here in Europe they say will be available in March; cannot wait .
So stay tuned I will post the result as soon as possible. :thumbsup:


----------



## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

It's bit cheat because this is Blue Pig "X" that has Swopout Dropout of Horizontal end.
Rear brake pad touches only inner half. hahaha.


----------



## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

06HokieMTB said:


> No joke! The Devinci Atlas would be on my short list if you could get the HTA down around 68*... I think it's 71* stock?


Stock maybe the number, my one has 140mm 34 so bit more slacker like RX model. But I want bit more slacker head and reach. Sm size was too short reach and wheelbase for descent.
I like Split pivot so I'm watching Salsa Horsethief if it would fit 650B+.

This is side shot.
Atlas small LO mode, fox34 140mm,


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I noticed they came out with an RX where they put on a 140 fork... HTA is down around 68.5 in the low mode. That's getting better, I'd like it to be 67-68*


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

tsurun said:


> It's bit cheat because this is Blue Pig "X" that has Swopout Dropout of Horizontal end.
> Rear brake pad touches only inner half. hahaha.


I didn't realize they did a Swapout dropout Blue Pig! Interesting!


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

tsurun said:


> Stock maybe the number, my one has 140mm 34 so bit more slacker like RX model. But I want bit more slacker head and reach. Sm size was too short reach and wheelbase for descent.
> I like Split pivot so I'm watching Salsa Horsethief if it would fit 650B+.
> 
> This is side shot.
> ...


40mm wide internal or external rims? How much clearance all around in the rear end of that bike? is it tight up at the top?


----------



## FATlab (Jan 26, 2015)

Hi Guys,

not many people have rims and tires , luckily i have both and the measurements are :

Vee rubber trax fatty on a 55mm fatlab rim with inner tube 84mm width 

same rim and tire with tubeless milk 87mm


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

MMcG said:


> 40mm wide internal or external rims? How much clearance all around in the rear end of that bike? is it tight up at the top?


it's external.
you can see the clearance on my tumblr.
here


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

tsurun said:


> ... Fox 34 140mm...


Tons of clearance in the arch, but not a whole lot more than the Pike in terms of width. Looks like you could get the 3.25 VT Fatty on there, but barely.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Tons of clearance in the arch, but not a whole lot more than the Pike in terms of width. Looks like you could get the 3.25 VT Fatty on there, but barely.


And probably only on a narrow rim.

Take a look at how rounded the VTF is on CROPCIRCLE's 28mm (assuming outer width?) rims. Those side knobs are really far down. For best traction (and a squarer profile, to get those side knobs up where they're more usable), I'd bet the VTF needs a Dually or a Scraper i45.



CROPCIRCLE said:


> The Trax Fatty 3.25" on this rims are only 73mm but I'm afraid on Scraper rims it will be much wider ! Will see ...
> 
> View attachment 957928


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It kinda sucks that we'll be forced to choose between long travel and 3" max tire on wide rims, or going to something like the Bluto. 

Either that or everybody will be out buying the DT Swiss forks but I think they are only 120mm max travel.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

The DT Swiss forks go to 130mm for their 29" forks, and 150mm for their 27.5" forks. What I don't understand about these forks is that people say they are the ticket for 27.5+, but DT Swiss's official max tire width is 65mm for the 27.5, and 62mm for the 29" which is what I think you would want to run with a 27.5+ tire. I don't know if their official numbers are just very conservative or what. For what I want to do they are going to have enough travel, but they need to fit the Vee Trax Fatty on proper width rims.


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## downhill_B (Sep 23, 2014)

New to 27.5/650b 

How wide can i go on a 2015 specialized stumpjumper evo comp?

Also im looking for some midrange spare tires too. Something under $50 each. Thanks


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Welnic said:


> ... but DT Swiss's official max tire width is 65mm for the 27.5, and 62mm for the 29" which is what I think you would want to run with a 27.5+ tire. I don't know if their official numbers are just very conservative or what. For what I want to do they are going to have enough travel, but they need to fit the Vee Trax Fatty on proper width rims.


yea kinda hard for DT Swiss to deny "they won't fit", because twentynineinches has already proven that wrong.










And these are V Trax Fatties on Ibis 741 35mm rims.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

downhill_B said:


> New to 27.5/650b
> 
> How wide can i go on a 2015 specialized stumpjumper evo comp?
> 
> Also im looking for some midrange spare tires too. Something under $50 each. Thanks


You're best to measure the distance between the chainstays at the yoke. My guess is that a 650b Stumpjumper probably will only fit a 2.6" max tire. You're better off going with a Hans Dampf 2.4.

This discussion is for considerably larger tires (2.8 and wide) that won't fit in most 650b specific frames.


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## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

06HokieMTB said:


> And probably only on a narrow rim.
> 
> Take a look at how rounded the VTF is on CROPCIRCLE's 28mm (assuming outer width?) rims. Those side knobs are really far down. For best traction (and a squarer profile, to get those side knobs up where they're more usable), I'd bet the VTF needs a Dually or a Scraper i45.


I agree, if you want best GRIP you must use not less than 45-50mm rim. Dont' like when tyre look like a pear !


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## downhill_B (Sep 23, 2014)

PHeller said:


> You're best to measure the distance between the chainstays at the yoke. My guess is that a 650b Stumpjumper probably will only fit a 2.6" max tire. You're better off going with a Hans Dampf 2.4.
> 
> This discussion is for considerably larger tires (2.8 and wide) that won't fit in most 650b specific frames.


Thank very much.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> yea kinda hard for DT Swiss to deny "they won't fit", because twentynineinches has already proven that wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So a VTF on a Dually or a Scraper (or Hugo, but really that's more of a snow/soft surface rim than a trail rim) probably wouldn't fit?

Seems odd that Vee would go 3.25" if targeting the B+ market... Hell, the "+" market was paved by Surly and their 3.0" tires. But if your target market is summer tires for 4.8" fatties, I guess I can understand 3.25".


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## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

*650B+ Tires*



06HokieMTB said:


> So a VTF on a Dually or a Scraper (or Hugo, but really that's more of a snow/soft surface rim than a trail rim) probably wouldn't fit?


Dually 650B are available on eBay at almost half price of Scraper but... it seems if you use tubeless at low pressure sealant puff away, so better the TCS of WTB that are 5mm larger too.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Singletrack Magazine | CoreBike2015 Part1
it's coming.


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

I see that vee tire USA have them in stock on the website. Have checked a couple of times and they haven't been avaible before. Here is a link: Vee Tire Co. Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 Fat Tire


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Tor said:


> I see that vee tire USA have them in stock on the website. Have checked a couple of times and they haven't been avaible before. Here is a link: Vee Tire Co. Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 Fat Tire


Has anyone successfully ordered one from their site? Or do they list them but they are actually backordered?

Anyone?


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

I tried to order them earlier this month, but then it said " out of stock" so maybe they actually have them in stock, but I'm not sure


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I placed an order for one to run as a front tire and my order went through...........I'll keep everyone posted when I get an actual your tire has shipped email. Hopefully it won't be forever since they've already got my $$!


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I ordered a pair and should get them on Friday. I wasn't going to say anything until I actually had them in hand, but I'm taking a FedEx tracking number as enough proof that they are real. I could only get the folding bead, 120 tpi, silica compound version, which is what I wanted anyway. I ordered on 1/23, they shipped them on 1/26, and sent me an email that they had been shipped on 1/27.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Am I the only person to realize the Vee Trax will fit the RS-1s just fine ? There's nearly 4 inches of room between the uppers, plenty for 3 1/4 inch tires. Granted its an expensive way to go but it does solve the tire clearance issues nicely. There's also the Carver Suspension fork (also inverted and with clearance for 4" tires) which steers better than the Bluto and is 135mm thru-axle compatible (and usually includes the hub).


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

DeeEight said:


> Am I the only person to realize the Vee Trax will fit the RS-1s just fine ? There's nearly 4 inches of room between the uppers, plenty for 3 1/4 inch tires. Granted its an expensive way to go but it does solve the tire clearance issues nicely. There's also the Carver Suspension fork (also inverted and with clearance for 4" tires) which steers better than the Bluto and is 135mm thru-axle compatible (and usually includes the hub).


Trans-Fat 29+ Fork is only good for 90mm.


----------



## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

DeeEight said:


> Am I the only person to realize the Vee Trax will fit the RS-1s just fine ? There's nearly 4 inches of room between the uppers, plenty for 3 1/4 inch tires. Granted its an expensive way to go but it does solve the tire clearance issues nicely. There's also the Carver Suspension fork (also inverted and with clearance for 4" tires) which steers better than the Bluto and is 135mm thru-axle compatible (and usually includes the hub).


I don't know if you are the only person to realize this, but I sure didn't. This sets my mind at ease, since the RS-1 will definitely work for my 27.5+ bike. Fortunately I'm not opposed to paying too much for parts if I have to. But I'll probably try to go with something else so I don't have to run a proprietary hub.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

PHeller said:


> Trans-Fat 29+ Fork is only good for 90mm.


Officially they claim up to 110mm with 90-100 being the usable range for most riders, which basically means it largely depends on your mass/riding, but locals with them are regularly pushing past the 90mm travel mark during fat riding in this area this winter.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

DeeEight, that very may well work for folks looking to rock B+ on a XC bike, but I think the majority of us are looking for forks that will fit a wide tire with 140mm travel.


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## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

*650B+ Tires*



PHeller said:


> DeeEight, that very may well work for folks looking to rock B+ on a XC bike, but I think the majority of us are looking for forks that will fit a wide tire with 140mm travel.


Maybe the new X-Fusion REVEL:

http://www.xfusionshox.com/product/forks/revel-series/revel-hlr.html


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Yep forks will work - mega super expensive ones!


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Exactly... if you want to play with big tires, you need to stop being cheap and buy proper equipment. I do laugh at WTB's assertion though that the scraper/trailblazer combo works with "most" existing 29er frames... but they don't exactly name any. Its not like when folks started converting to 650B and there actually were hundreds of 26er frame models already in existence with the diameter room to clear a 27 1/2 inch tire because large diameter 26er tires already existed. Most 29er frames were never designed to fit more than a 2.4 width tire because their was no need for more clearance as tires that wide didn't exist for ten years (WTB's claimed size of a 2.55 not included because outside the lab it never reached that width).


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I just got my Vee Trax Fattys. I'll try to put them on a wheel this weekend to see what they look like. I need new wheelset to actually use them. Weighed them on a poor scale at work, one was 880 gm and the other 900 gm.


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

Anyone care to enlighten me on which 27.5 tires are available *now* in larger than 2.5"?

Ideally with a casing that doesn't fall apart at the sight of sharp rock.

I see Maxxis Minion DHF's in a 2.5" with DH casing, and WTB's Breakout in a 2.4 with a few casing options. Would love to get something in the 2.7" or bigger range for this customer.

Anything else?

Any help appreciated.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

i think the vee and the wtb are the only + size marketed as such...and im not seeign any availabilty anywhere *and* they dont fulfill your casing requirements probably - though my trailbalzer feels plenty solid, it doesnt to the best of my knowledge have any extra sidewall protection. its 68mm on my p35 rim...but tread is slightly narrower than max casing width. so whats that 2.67"?

other than that...2.5 would be the max afaik? just as you say really...trail king 27.5x2.4? they usually are relatively beefy?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

mikesee said:


> Anyone care to enlighten me on which 27.5 tires are available *now* in larger than 2.5"?
> 
> Ideally with a casing that doesn't fall apart at the sight of sharp rock.
> 
> ...


Pretty much what dRjOn said. Actually, I think the Vee Trax Fatty 3.25" is the only one that you can buy right now from the Vee web store, and only in 120 TPI casing. The first run of the WTB tires sold out quick and they are working on getting more out.

That said, I don't know if either would live up to your standards for sidewall strength. They are both much beefier than a 120tpi Knard, but nowhere near something like a DHF. Size wise, the Vee is more like a 3.0, and the WTB is more like a 2.7, depending on rim choice of course.

Otherwise you are looking at the normal array of 2.4 and 2.5 tires. Putting one of those on a 40mm to 50mm rim will make them around 2.6 to 2.7 wide. I've also read that the Geax Goma is pretty big.

Edit: Forgot to add that the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5x3.0 is supposed to be out 'soon'


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I've got a 650b Vee Trail Taker that seems to have decently tough sidewalls. It comes to a 2.4 on a Flow , 2.5 on a Blunt35, and still ends up very round. It would be a great fit for a Nextie40, Ibis 741, or maybe even a Dually. Going too mount it on my WTB Scraper i45 (which got delayed, again, now it'll ship 4-5 weeks past the intended ship date) and see how square it ends up at. Hell, might be perfect for snow riding?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Welnic said:


> I just got my Vee Trax Fattys. I'll try to put them on a wheel this weekend to see what they look like. I need new wheelset to actually use them. Weighed them on a poor scale at work, one was 880 gm and the other 900 gm.


I've yet to receive any shipping confirmation on my order.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I think that Trail Taker is the current take on Kirk Pacenti's Mega Moto - is it not?

I have a pair of 2.4 Mega Motos and these tires are friggin tanks! Super thick and heavy duty tires. I didn't realize they were going to be so "tough/thick" when I won the via an eBay auction. They are "unique" tires IMHO - however I'm not sure I'm the right guy to actually put them to their proper use. But I may hang onto them anyway just because they are Mega Motos and were sort of way ahead of the curve a bit back when they were designed (not sure they were ever fully executed to the way Kirk wanted them though).


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

*Front Tire Safety Comparison*

I quick look at front tires on my Blur TRc from a safety standpoint. Up first the 26 x 2.35 Kenda Nevagal.









At first glance this tire looks fine. It has plenty of clearance, especially vertically. But this is actually a very unsafe setup.









And I'm not saying this because I'm bashing on 26" wheels. When I changed to a 27.5" wheelset, I also went to a 180mm front rotor. The 160mm front rotor on my old wheelset went onto the back 27.5" wheel.









A 27.5 x 2.3 Maxxis High Roller II. This is a safe tire. Good at braking and cornering. Very confidence inspiring. And what does confidence lead to? More speed, less safety.









A 27.5 x 3.25 Vee Rubber Trax Fatty. I had to insert the thru axle, then inflate the tire. There is no way you are getting up any speed with this in the front. Clearly the safest tire.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Couple of shots of my 27.5 x 3.25 Vee Rubber Trax Fatty on a 40mm Derby rim next to a 26 x 4.0 Husker Du on 65mm Marge Lites. The VTF is 29" in diameter (736mm). I measured the bead to bead at 203mm. I didn't do anything fancy for that measurement, just measured it with a ruler the way that it came rolled up for shipment. It measured 74mm wide both at the knobs and carcass. The measurements and pictures were done at 20psi. I think i'm going to look for a 50mm rim for this tire.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Can you take a side shot vs from the top?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Welnic, is that a 26" Fox 34 fork?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I've yet to receive any shipping confirmation on my Vee Rubber order - I hate the fact that I have no clue as to what's going on with the $135 of my money they now have..........


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## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

*Ditto on Vee*

Ditto... ordered from Vee, no shipping confirmation.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I've already taken the tire off so I could put my usable tire back on. Here is a zoomed in picture that I took of the whole bike.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

It's a 26" 130mm Fox 32 fork.

I ordered mine at 11:43am on January 23 and received notice that it had shipped at 11:42pm on January 27. But it had already been picked by FedEx at Ellenwood GA at 3:40pm on January 26.


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## tundratrader (Mar 5, 2010)

*650B+ Tires*

The 650b+ fits a 26" fork?


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

No, it doesn't come close to fitting. I wanted to try it on the 40mm rims that I have to see what the tire looked like on that width of rim. While it was on the wheel I put the wheel back on the bike. I had to insert the axle before I inflated the tire in order to get it in the fork.


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## tundratrader (Mar 5, 2010)

*650B+ Tires*

Ok. That makes sense. So you are thinking that a narrow rim might allow you to run a 650b with that fork I am confused? My dad has the same fork but 650b size for his 650b so if yours fits that close should be no prob on his. Won't fit the back though. It would be cool to run that fork on my Mukluk instead of getting the bluto.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I wanted to get the tires to put on my Mukluk. I didn't know what rim I should get for the tire. 50mm is pretty much the widest rim that you can get in 27.5. So I knew I either wanted 40mm or 50mm. Since I already have 40mm rims on my converted Blur Trc, I put the tire on that rim. It fits okay, but I think it would work better on a 50mm rim, so I ordered a wheelset with a Nextie 50mm rim. I had no illusions that it would fit on my Blur.

I think even with a 650b fork there might be issues with the tire hitting the top. The tire is a full 29" in diameter.


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## tundratrader (Mar 5, 2010)

*650B+ Tires*

Would a 29er suspension fork instead of the bluto be a better route potentially if a guy is gonna go 650+?
I am gonna get nexties either 27.5 or 26" 50mm. Which nextie did you get? What hubs? Who built them?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Already discussed. Few 29er suspension forks exist with the clearance needed for 3 1/4 inch tires. Even so called 29er Plus suspension forks are really only designed around 3 width tires. Really these tires are meant for a new planned breed of fat bikes meant more for summer use and bike packing adventure bikes.


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

delete


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

tundratrader said:


> Would a 29er suspension fork instead of the bluto be a better route potentially if a guy is gonna go 650+?
> I am gonna get nexties either 27.5 or 26" 50mm. Which nextie did you get? What hubs? Who built them?


I'm getting 27.5 x 50mm Nextie rims. Hope Fatsno hubs. Mike Curiak is building my wheels. Lace Mine 29 - Big Bicycle Wheels

I think that if I was getting a suspension fork for my fat bike my mind would explode. If you get a Bluto then you can run 4", 5", 29, 29+, 27.5+ tires all on the same fork. But if you want to run those wheels on a rigid fork also, then you either need front hubs that can change from 135 to 150, or a 150mm rigid fork. You could get a suspension fork just for 27.5+ and 29, and then only run big tires on a rigid fork.

Too complicated for me. I find it simpler to get another bicycle. I'll have two wheelsets for my fat bike and a 100mm full suspension 27.5+ bike.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Welnic said:


> I think that if I was getting a suspension fork for my fat bike my mind would explode. If you get a Bluto then you can run 4", 5", 29, 29+, 27.5+ tires all on the same fork. But if you want to run those wheels on a rigid fork also, then you either need front hubs that can change from 135 to 150, or a 150mm rigid fork.


From everything I've read (and from people I've talked to), they say once you ride your fatty with a Bluto, you never want to go back to a rigid fork 

So yeah, building up a 4.8" fatty with a Bluto and an extra B+ wheelset for summer use would give you two bikes. That's my plan eventually. But I'm going to wait for a properly slack fatty frame with short chainstays and 197x12 rear axle spacing.


----------



## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

I apologize for not reading the whole thread and I am sure this has been discussed.
Which fork, Pike or 36 Fox have better clearence for 650+?


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Unless they've narrowered the 36 Fox and changed the brace clearance after they switched the dropouts to 15 from 20mm, then the Fox should have better clearance. As to the Bluto's 150mm spacing, Salsa's fats as of this season have come with rigid 150mm forks, to ease upgrading to Bluto and you can order the forks from Salsa for about $150. They're tapered steerers, aluminium alloy and less than 700 grams each.


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## ScaryJerry (Jan 12, 2004)

DeeEight, can you point me in the direction of that fork? The only thing I'm seeing available is $450...


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

On another note, I just got a response from Panaracer that the Fat B Nimble 27.5+ tires will not be available until late March . They previously said early Feb. on their Facebook page.

The wait continues...


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

you can go carbon fat fork this way...

26er Full Carbon Fat Snow Bike Fork 150 15mm thru Axle Tapered Steerer UD Matt | eBay

Or you can contact a surly/salsa or other dealer that deals with QBP to order one of the Salsa alloy forks as seen on the 2015 Mukluk 3s and Bearpaws.

Bearpaw 150 Fork | Parts & Accessories | Salsa Cycles


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> On another note, I just got a response from Panaracer that the Fat B Nimble 27.5+ tires will not be available until late March . They previously said early Feb. on their Facebook page.
> 
> The wait continues...


Sigh. The WTB 2.8 is great for rear use, but I want more pronounced knobs for front use. It looks like a proper 3.0 tire will fit in Fox 34 forks, too bad Vee went with 3.25".

On the other hand, I'm pretty happy with my B+ rear/29er front setup.


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## ScaryJerry (Jan 12, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> you can go carbon fat fork this way...
> 
> 26er Full Carbon Fat Snow Bike Fork 150 15mm thru Axle Tapered Steerer UD Matt | eBay
> 
> ...


That Bearpaw fork is unfortunately the $450 one, nothing out there from salsa for $150


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

ScaryJerry said:


> That Bearpaw fork is unfortunately the $450 one, nothing out there from salsa for $150


The Makwa carbon fork is the $450 fork. The Bearpaw is much cheaper and is aluminum. Although it looks there was a recall on the Bearpaw fork in December. Universal Cycles lists it at $250, but not in stock.


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Couple of other options:

2015 9 Zero 7 Whiteout Aluminum Fork Tapered Steerer 150 mm thru Axle 907 | eBay

26er Full Carbon Fat Snow Bike Fork 150 15mm thru Axle Tapered Steerer UD Matt | eBay


----------



## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

The Salsa fork list is confusing. The way I see it:

Makwa Carbon Fork: $500
This comes on all of their 2015 Beagreases. 135mm (142mm) front hub with a 15mm axle.

Bearpaw Fork: $250
This comes on the 2015 Mukluk 3, and all of the 2104 Mukluks. 135mm front hub with a quick release. It has three water bottle cage braze-ons on each leg. Aluminum fork.

Bearpaw 150 Fork: $450
This comes on both Blackborow models. 150mm front hub with 15mm axle. It has three water bottle cage braze-ons on each leg. Aluminum fork.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Welnic said:


> The Salsa fork list is confusing. The way I see it:
> 
> Makwa Carbon Fork: $500
> This comes on all of their 2015 Beagreases. 135mm (142mm) front hub with a 15mm axle.
> ...


You are right, confusing! Those look to be right though. $450 seems like a lot for an aluminum fork! Look at the 9 Zero 7 one I posted above.


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## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

Been trying to follow this thread pretty closely but need to ask one question I am not positive I see an answer for.

Will the 3.25" Vee Rubber fit on a Rock Shox Pike 29 fork w/ a 27.5" 35mm Blunt Rim? Should right?


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

manhattanprjkt83 said:


> Been trying to follow this thread pretty closely but need to ask one question I am not positive I see an answer for.
> 
> Will the 3.25" Vee Rubber fit on a Rock Shox Pike 29 fork w/ a 27.5" 35mm Blunt Rim? Should right?


Very hard to know. Maybe someone out there who is lucky enough to have a Vee Rubber tire can test for you/us


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## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

I don't want to open the flood gates but...well maybe i do.

The 3.25" Vee Rubber's just hit QBP's distrobution centers (just got my account alert). Have at it folks, just got myself one.


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## CROPCIRCLE (Nov 3, 2008)

*650B+ Tires*



manhattanprjkt83 said:


> Will the 3.25" Vee Rubber fit on a Rock Shox Pike 29 fork w/ a 27.5" 35mm Blunt Rim? Should right?


Yes fit. Look photos some posts above #481, on a 28mm rim. With 35mm it will be some millimeters more large, so a little difference. Enough space if you don't ride in the mud.


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## ScaryJerry (Jan 12, 2004)

That 907 fork is exactly what I need in my life, and $200 cheaper than Salsa's offering!


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

AE bike has the Vee Trax Fatty now. $90 and free shipping.

Vee Rubber Trax Fatty Fat Bike Tire: 27.5" x 3.25" 120tpi Folding Bead Silica Compound Black - AEBike.com


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Welnic said:


> AE bike has the Vee Trax Fatty now. $90 and free shipping.
> 
> Vee Rubber Trax Fatty Fat Bike Tire: 27.5" x 3.25" 120tpi Folding Bead Silica Compound Black - AEBike.com


I just got that notification too. There are also a couple of listings on Ebay already. I wish that tire fit in the back of my Jones!

Also in stock at Ebikestop to $79.45, but I don't think shipping is free:

Vee Rubber Trax Fatty Fat Bike Tire: 27.5" x 3.25" 120tpi Folding Bead Silica Compound Black @ eBikeStop.com


----------



## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

My Trax Fatty direct from Vee shipped today (took 5 days to go from order to shipped). Going to try it on a steel diamond and steel spaceframe Jones. Pretty sure it'll fit in the back of a steel Spaceframe Jones (most recent version).


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

moses667 said:


> My Trax Fatty direct from Vee shipped today (took 5 days to go from order to shipped). Going to try it on a steel diamond and steel spaceframe Jones. Pretty sure it'll fit in the back of a steel Spaceframe Jones (most recent version).


What rim will you be using? It did not fit in the back of my Thai Ti spaceframe on a 40mm outside Derby rim. Let us know how it works!


----------



## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

bikeny said:


> What rim will you be using? It did not fit in the back of my Thai Ti spaceframe on a 40mm outside Derby rim. Let us know how it works!


I'm going to try the Dually; if the Fatty doesn't fit the Trailblazer will. I measured out space between the stays at over 80mm and the Fatty should be under 80mm on the Dually if measurements I've heard here are correct. This all depends on how it ends up falling in the space of course. A friend of mine has the steel diamond Jones so I'm going to give him the tire for him to try there first while I'm building up my Dually (I believe his rim is a Blunt). He's already running a Trailblazer on the rear. Once done with my wheel I'll try it on the SF (this year's orange model) which I believe has the widest rear clearance of the Jones bunch (don't know about the new Jones Plus).


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

moses667 said:


> My Trax Fatty direct from Vee shipped today (took 5 days to go from order to shipped). Going to try it on a steel diamond and steel spaceframe Jones. Pretty sure it'll fit in the back of a steel Spaceframe Jones (most recent version).


I got email notification as well. Now I'm wondering if I should have grabbed two - oh well. Plan on a Trailblazer rear Vee Rubber front combo. And with my other trailblazer maybe I'll go Mavic Quest 2.4 rear and Trailblazer 2.8 front on another bike. .................decisions decisions.............


----------



## seely (Jan 20, 2004)

Vee's were briefly in stock at Q yesterday/this morning. As of 8 EST this morning, they had 6 left. 

That said, if anyone is looking for a pair, due to a stupid mistake on my part I may have an extra pair (had some come through from another source). Send me a PM if you're interested. 

First impressions are they are very easy to mount, easy tubeless setup. No satisfying "pop" onto the bead but seem to hold very well even without sealant. I got the front to go up with glass cleaner and a floor pump, and used my compressor on the rear. 

Weight is 935g, though the packaging clearly says 800g. I don't know why the huge discrepancy. 935 seems very reasonable for a high volume tire to me, so I'm not disappointed in the extra grams, but baffled at how they arrived at 800g. 

Overall tires are super high quality, nice sticky compound, what you would expect to see in a high-end 120tpi tubeless tire. Haven't thrown them on the bike yet, but will give more impressions later.


----------



## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

seely said:


> Vee's were briefly in stock at Q yesterday/this morning. As of 8 EST this morning, they had 6 left.
> 
> That said, if anyone is looking for a pair, due to a stupid mistake on my part I may have an extra pair (had some come through from another source). Send me a PM if you're interested.
> 
> ...


check your in box....pm sent


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

My WTB Scraper i45 shipped!


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Just another fun ride up in the woods on the big wheel.


----------



## HPIguy (Sep 16, 2014)

^^Is that a 29er fork, or 27.5? I have a B side also, and would love to go this route.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MikenIke said:


> View attachment 961730
> 
> 
> Just another fun ride up in the woods on the big wheel.


What rims?


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Yes sir, 100mm Reba 29er. I think 120mm would be even better, but I got a killer deal on this one. Those are 27.5 Velocity Dually's.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MikenIke said:


> Yes sir, 100mm Reba 29er. I think 120mm would be even better, but I got a killer deal on this one.


For about $30 I changed a Reba from 100 to 120. It just needed a new air spring shaft. The older RS forks might be as simple as pullin a spacer off of the air shaft.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

MikenIke said:


> Yes sir, 100mm Reba 29er. I think 120mm would be even better, but I got a killer deal on this one. Those are 27.5 Velocity Dually's.


Do you have to run the sliders all the way back to get that wheel/tire combo to fit? If so, what is your resulting chainstay length?


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

As to Salsa fork pricing...here's a crazy idea...pick up a phone and CALL a salsa dealer to check the actual pricing/availability.


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Sliders only half way back. Got more room for height but about maxed out in width.


----------



## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

mikesee said:


> Anyone care to enlighten me on which 27.5 tires are available *now* in larger than 2.5"?
> 
> Ideally with a casing that doesn't fall apart at the sight of sharp rock.
> 
> ...


Anyone found anything? Trying to find a 27.5" rear @ 2.5" - 2.7" w/ volume

Right now I'm wondering if the DHR2 has more volume than 2.4" Ardent (Maxxiss went back to their undersizing ways w/ that Ardent).


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Hans Dampf 2.4? Geax Goma 2.4?

On a wide rim the DHF 2.5 may actually be wider than 2.5", see here: Maxxis Minion dhf 29 x 2.5 or Hans Damph for 'XC' « Singletrack Forum


----------



## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

Hans Dampf 2.35" and the Magic Mary 2.35" seems to be the largest volume I have tried so far. Does the Trail King 2.4" or other Continental's have more volume?


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I'm not sure if the sidewalls would be thick enough but have a look at the Mavic Quest 2.4 27.5 tire - pretty high volume IMHO.


----------



## Beard of Power (Feb 10, 2011)

Short Travel (60mm) fork option out of Iceland.









Prototype photo posted today on their Instagram and Bike Rumor did a brief write up.


----------



## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

From the WTB site in reference to Trailblazer availability "WTB is expecting additional inventory in mid-April 2015".


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

tsurun said:


> Stock maybe the number, my one has 140mm 34 so bit more slacker like RX model. But I want bit more slacker head and reach. Sm size was too short reach and wheelbase for descent.
> I like Split pivot so I'm watching Salsa Horsethief if it would fit 650B+.
> 
> This is side shot.
> ...


Welp, you inspired me... I just bought a used, large Devinci Atlas frameset. Gonna build it up and take it for a couple rides. I bought the frame to build up with some extra parts that I have laying around, should be cool to try out as a B+. Don't think I'd end up keeping it, but might be fun to try.

I've got a Fox 34 RLC 29 fork on my Mason that I'll be putting on the Devinci. Probably will run it around 130mm unless you think 140mm is where it's at? Looks like the numbers work out well for the Devinci RX (140 Revelation):

BB Height: 342mm (13.6"), presumably 327mm (12.9") at sag
Chainstay Length: 430mm (16.93")
68.5* HTA

So with B+, my BB height will be down around 13.3" and 12.75 at sag.


----------



## HPIguy (Sep 16, 2014)

MikenIke said:


> Yes sir, 100mm Reba 29er. I think 120mm would be even better, but I got a killer deal on this one. Those are 27.5 Velocity Dually's.


Gotcha, thanks for the info. :thumbsup:


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Beard of Power said:


> Short Travel (60mm) fork option out of Iceland.
> 
> View attachment 961886
> 
> ...


Undamped rebound with big soft tires... would ride, interesting?


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Before anyone gets an idea to use a standard lauf fork, they give the maximum tire width as 2.35.


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

MMcG said:


> Do you have to run the sliders all the way back to get that wheel/tire combo to fit? If so, what is your resulting chainstay length?


Here you can see how much room is left in the sliders. Have yet to measure the chainstay length.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

thanks sir!! Sweet bike!


----------



## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

MMcG said:


> I'm not sure if the sidewalls would be thick enough but have a look at the Mavic Quest 2.4 27.5 tire - pretty high volume IMHO.


Thanks MMcG. Arts lists those 2.4" Quest casings measured as 2.25", but I'll still look into those for sure.. hard to tell only going from a pic.

Maxxiss needs a 2.7" and a 3.0" Ardent, with the tread used on the 559 tire


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Another fork that'll work, Maverick models... typically go for around $200 US on ebay.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

My Scraper finally made it!

A brand new, lightly mounted (~18 psi) 2.4 Vee Trail Taker measures 2.55" at the knobs and 2.45" at the casing. The rim squares off this tread nicely. I expect that it'll grow a little bit in width.

Obviously not ideal, but I'll work until a proper 3.0" B+ tire comes out.








Here it is compared to a brand new DHF 2.3 on a WTB KOM i25


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Svelte? Lol









Claimed weight is 650g. I have never had a single WTB rim come in close to their claimed weight. Maybe their scales are broken?

This rim weighs as much as my old 27mm (22mm internal) hookless carbon 29er wheel!


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> View attachment 962959
> 
> 
> My Scraper finally made it!
> ...


that will be your rear wheel for the Mason?

What about the 3.25 Vee Tire?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Front, winter use. Already have a WTB 2.8 on a Blunt35 on the back.

I have two front wheels for the Mason. 29er (Spank Oozy 295) and now the Scraper.

No way a VTF on a Scraper will fit in my Fox 34 29 fork.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

what about Trailblazer and Scraper? Or is there not much width diff?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> what about Trailblazer and Scraper? Or is there not much width diff?


Lol. Ok. Let's try this again.

I only have one WTB 2.8 and had to fight to get that one. (You should remember this ) Replacement WTB 2.8's are not available for months, but I still wouldn't want a WTB 2.8 on the front. The WTB 2.8 is a great rear tire, but leaves something to be desired for front cornering. So I'm waiting for a proper 650b 3.0" tire with more aggressive cornering knobs to come out. I wish the VTF was a 3.0" instead of a 3.25", it would be perfect.

My WTB 2.8 is on the rear of my Mason on a Blunt 35. I could maybe fit the WTB 2.8 on a Dually, but probably not a WTB 2.8 + Scraper. My frame is pretty tight with an aggressive 2.4" 29er tire.

Also my Blunt35 only weighs 542g, vs 622g for a Dually and 687g for a Scraper. So for a dedicated rear rim, I'm happy with the Blunt35.

My WTB Scraper i45 rim will be run on the front of the Mason. My Fox 34 can fit a tire larger (wider knobs) than the WTB 2.8... so when a properly aggressive 3.0" B+ tire comes out, I'll put it on the front. In the meantime, I bought an Intense branded Vee Trail Taker 2.5 b/c it was cheap ($15 from PricePoint) and it's one of the largest 650b tires out there. (And it's tread pattern takes really well to the super wide Scraper i45).

So, in summary:

*Front*
Summer use: 29er
Winter use (and general Tomfoolery): Scraper i45 and VTT 2.5" tire (eventually aggressive B+ 3.0" tire)

*Rear*
WTB Trailblazer 2.8 on a Blunt 35

I'll just swap front wheels depending on what trail I'm riding and what kind of mood I'm in. May seem odd to have have 2 front wheels for a bike, but I have $163 wrapped up in my Scraper front wheel, so not too too bad.

As I told my wife... A 2nd front wheel is a helluva lot cheaper than a Fat Bike!

To be honest though, Denver doesn't hold enough snow to justify a full on fat bike. I owned one last year and it didn't get ridden much. You have to drive 45-60 min west to get to trails that hold snow all winter long. If I'm driving an hour west, I might as well bring my skis and go kill myself on trees and moguls at Winter Park!

And most of the commonly available fat bikes still have somewhat XC geometry. I'll hold out for a 197x12 rear end with a long reach and slack HTA.


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone have real weights compared the Velocity Dually to the WTB Scraper? Is there any reason to choose the more expensive Scaper over the cheaper Dually?

EDIT DERP Question answered above.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Literally the post right before yours 



06HokieMTB said:


> Also my Blunt35 only weighs 542g, vs 622g for a Dually and 687g for a Scraper.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Is there any reason to choose the more expensive Scaper over the cheaper Dually?


But to answer your second question, I went with the WTB Scraper for several reasons.

1) Better tubeless design. The WTB uses their proven TCS bead shelf and rim design. The Dually can be set up tubeless, but it's not a true tubeless ready design. You have to sometimes get creative with Gorilla Tape. I didn't want to be dependent on Gorilla Tape to hold the bead to my rim.

2) If I'm going wide, might as well go the widest! And I got a good deal on my Scraper. It was only an extra $31.50 to go with the Scraper.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> And most of the commonly available fat bikes still have somewhat XC geometry. I'll hold out for a 197x12 rear end with a long reach and slack HTA.


On-One Fatty Trail soon to be released - they leaked a sneak peek on Facebook today.


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## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

Glad you post this one, I almost pulled the trigger for a parkwood and risk for the compatibility for a 27.5 trax fatty (well, which seems not possible to fit....)



MMcG said:


> On-One Fatty Trail soon to be released - they leaked a sneak peek on Facebook today.


----------



## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

TRAX FATTY on WTB Scraper, tubeless is amazing ! TCS works great !









... and fit on a PIKE fork ! :thumbsup:









Little space on the side but will see if there is rubbing during use.
For try is enough.


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## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

06HokieMTB said:


> But to answer your second question, I went with the WTB Scraper for several reasons.
> 
> 1) Better tubeless design. The WTB uses their proven TCS bead shelf and rim design. The Dually can be set up tubeless, but it's not a true tubeless ready design. You have to sometimes get creative with Gorilla Tape. I didn't want to be dependent on Gorilla Tape to hold the bead to my rim.
> 
> 2) If I'm going wide, might as well go the widest! And I got a good deal on my Scraper. It was only an extra $31.50 to go with the Scraper.


I agree. TCS works very well ! :thumbsup: 
But my friends on 29+ had problems sealing with Dually rims.


----------



## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

nvphatty said:


> which makes you slow like tom brady


hehehe, who gets the last laugh here? fast enough


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Wow, that VTF looks great on a Scraper.



MISTER HYDE said:


> ... and fit on a PIKE fork ! :thumbsup:
> 
> Little space on the side but will see if there is rubbing during use.
> For try is enough.


Yeah, not much clearance there. Curious to see how it does after some riding.


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

On one just posted a 650+ parkwood on their facebook page, not sure its a new frame or the same old parkwood they are selling. It has wtb trailblazer front and rear, and seems a lot of clearance on rear.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

If the Parkwood fits a 3.25" tire on a 45mm rim, I'm in. Or at least my wife will be getting a new bike.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> If the Parkwood fits a 3.25" tire on a 45mm rim, I'm in. Or at least my wife will be getting a new bike.


Doubtful. A 29x2.4 Ardent won't fit on the back of the Parkwood. The Facebook page says its the regular 'ole Parkwood with a WTB 2.8 in the rear. They do no specify the rims.



> 650+ Parkwood!! Thats right *standard parkwood 29* with Revs and ooodles of clearance. What do you think?
> Rim= WTB yet to be released
> Tyres= WTB Trail Scraper 2.8












The rims do not appear to be a WTB Scraper. Look at the sidewall shape of the WTB2.8's that are on there. On the Scraper the 2.8 has vertical sidewalls. That looks more like my 2.8 on my Blunt35 I'm guessing WTB is coming out with an alloy i30 to compete against the Specialized Roval Fattie's.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I wonder if they reworked the stays for more clearance? Or are just offering the Parkwood as a complete bike with WTB 2.8 tires and the somewhat narrower, yet-to-be-released WTB rim. They then posted this:



> On-One Bikes
> 
> A closer look at the clearance on the upcoming 650+ Parkwood. Plenty of space out back for fun in the mud!












Someone asked "is this a new frame or just the old parkwood?? Is it possible to run vee trax fatty 3.25????"

On-One Bikes responded:


> It's the same width back end. We don't have the Vee Trax to test.


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

I am the guy who ask them. 

well, I do think thats the scraper rims......the rim profile is exactly the same asI looked on the web.

Lets wait for the details of their Fatty trail, and I will decide which to buy. 

(well.......looked at the pics again, the WTB 2.8 is not really wide, looks more like a 2.5 to me.....the 26"x 2.5 muddy mary looks wider than it.)



06HokieMTB said:


> I wonder if they reworked the stays for more clearance? Or are just offering the Parkwood as a complete bike with WTB 2.8 tires and the somewhat narrower, yet-to-be-released WTB rim. They then posted this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

ooops I cant found the dual top tube 650b+ bike on their facebook anymore......probably dropped that design and go with the parkwood lookalike Fatty Trail??


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I wonder what BB the Fatty Trail would be. I'd like to see someone do an 83mm BB bike with short stays, 120mm fork and room for 4" or 29" tires. Doubt it'll happen from a large producer though.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> I wonder if they reworked the stays for more clearance? Or are just offering the Parkwood as a complete bike with WTB 2.8 tires and the somewhat narrower, yet-to-be-released WTB rim. They then posted this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I could send them my tire in exchange for a frame! 

I inquired on Instagram and they replied that the rim was a new 31mm wide (I'm assuming inner diameter) rim they mounted those Trailblazer tires to. So you may have i23, i25,i30,i45 options from WTB going forward?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> I inquired on Instagram and they replied that the rim was a new 31mm wide (I'm assuming inner diameter) rim they mounted those Trailblazer tires to. So you may have i23, i25,i30,i45 options from WTB going forward?


That's the width that it looks like by looking at the sidewall shape of the WTB 2.8, again, it looks similar to my WTB 2.8 mounted on a Blunt 35. Should be cool to see how it turns out. Would be a good to see more wide/strong/light-ish alloy options for someone looking for 30mm internal width.


----------



## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

As long as On-One says, the new rim is a WTB i35, 35mm inner width and asymmetric drilling.
Sounds really interesting, both for some B+ conversion and for the regular 650b AM crowd...

Instagram



MMcG said:


> I inquired on Instagram and they replied that the rim was a new 31mm wide (I'm assuming inner diameter) rim they mounted those Trailblazer tires to. So you may have i23, i25,i30,i45 options from WTB going forward?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Pinkbike has a "Ask WTB anything" page and they commented on i35 rims a couple weeks ago.

ALL DONE: Ask Us Anything with WTB -Tubeless Technology - Pinkbike



> flag wilderness-trail-bikes (Jan 22, 2015 at 10:13)
> Slate here;
> The B+ idea got started with fitting existing 29" tire bikes. Where it goes from here is anyone's guess. WTB may go beyond the 3" cross section but for now that is what we have targeted.Regarding rim inner width - the *TRAILBLAZER is 67mm (variable depending on psi) when using an i35 rim.* On a 25mm inner width rim the cross section (known as section width = SW) is 4mm less. On the i45 Scraper rim the SW is 4mm more. Wide rims certainly do support tires better especially at lower pressures. Inner width of 25mm is OK, even a 23 width works, but *i35 or i45* will give you the greater benefit of running low pressure stabilized G-force. BTW, tread width does not vary much using different width rims. Neither does diameter. It is the casing SW that varies. Really fun tire size, not too heavy or slow for flat land riding. TRAILBLAZER fits most 29" bikes running at about 28.6" diameter.


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Got my Trax Fatty from BikeBling today  Going to set them up tubeless, but mounted one tire with tube on a Nextie 50mm rim. Measures 77mm at the knobs and 80mm on the casing. 913 and 925 grams. (really pleased with customer service from bikebling btw)


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*

The WTB 2.8 doesn't look very big. I'd love to know what the overall volume is compared to the biggest normal 29er tire. Maybe someone with better math skills than me can figure? Also, what happened to On One's crazy orange bike based on the 3.25 Vee tire? Now they claim they don't even have any, even though they posted on FB before.


----------



## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> The WTB 2.8 doesn't look very big. I'd love to know what the overall volume is compared to the biggest normal 29er tire. Maybe someone with better math skills than me can figure?


I did the math, and if i did it right volume is roughly 6liters for a 29x2.4 (60mm) VS 7.5 liters for a 27.5x2.8 (68mm)


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

SS Hack said:


> The WTB 2.8 doesn't look very big. I'd love to know what the overall volume is compared to the biggest normal 29er tire. Maybe someone with better math skills than me can figure?


Like what I did in post #346 of this thread? 











06HokieMTB said:


> I, too, have been wondering this and haven't seen any info. Using information that's available for the WTB 2.8 and the VTF 3.25 and all of the different rim sizes, I've extrapolated the following table.
> 
> Disclaimer: this is merely an educated guess, but I tried to be as scientific as I could (I'm a Mechanical Engineer = dork). Hopefully this will help someone decide on a rim/tire combo based off of what they think will fit in their frame.
> 
> View attachment 941897


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

Mounted the Vee tire up on my 1X1 today. Looks like it fits! Just barely! It's mounted on a Velocity Blunt rim and there is truly no room to spare. Can't wait to try it out on the trails. I ran out of time but I'm going to try it on the same rim but on a XFusion Velvet fork. I'll report back on that and how it rides...


----------



## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

Ver Trax Fatty with a tube at left, on a WTB Scraper 27.5" rim, at ~18psi.

At right, 45N Van Helga on a Whiskey 70w, tubeless at ~18psi.


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*



savo said:


> I did the math, and if i did it right volume is roughly 6liters for a 29x2.4 (60mm) VS 7.5 liters for a 27.5x2.8 (68mm)


So about 20 percent more volume - not bad but not huge. I wonder if a 29x2.6 would be about equal.


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Svelte? Lol
> 
> View attachment 962985
> 
> ...


What do you expect from a company that invented a tire measuring system that calls for inflating to 60PSI to achieve the claimed widths.


----------



## jallll (Dec 28, 2008)

I need to ride this post... subscribed..


----------



## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> So about 20 percent more volume - not bad but not huge. I wonder if a 29x2.6 would be about equal.


Right, a 29x2.6, assuming it will be 66mm wide will have about the same volume of the 650b x 68mm, at roughly 7.4 litres


----------



## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

savo said:


> Right, a 29x2.6, assuming it will be 66mm wide will have about the same volume of the 650b x 68mm, at roughly 7.4 litres


What about the volume of a 650B x 3" like Trax Tatty ?


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*



MISTER HYDE said:


> What about the volume of a 650B x 3" like Trax Tatty ?


It's a 3.25 and it seems big. I can't wait for more companies to get involved.


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

SS Hack said:


> It's a 3.25 and it seems big. I can't wait for more companies to get involved.


It's labeled a 3.25, but is really around 3". Mine measures 76mm on a 40mm rim.


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*

I guess every company measures at 60psi on wide rims,


----------



## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> What do you expect from a company that invented a tire measuring system that calls for inflating to 60PSI to achieve the claimed widths.


More on the above.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Bigwheel said:


> More on the above.


I'm ok with the 'after 24 hours at 60psi' clause. Basically that's setting the bead and allowing the tire to fully stretch and come to size. I typically will setup a new tubeless tire to at least 45-50 psi and let it sit there over night.

Measured at 35psi seems high, but once the tire is stretched to size, you're not going to gain much more volume of an unloaded tire at 20psi vs 35psi.


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*

Aren't most tubeless rims pressure limited? I bet the new Hugo has a pretty low max.


----------



## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

SS Hack said:


> Aren't most tubeless rims pressure limited? I bet the new Hugo has a pretty low max.


30 psi stated on no tubes site.


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*



NH Mtbiker said:


> 30 psi stated on no tubes site.


Hard to fake width at low pressure.


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

curious. i just mounted my trailblazer, tubeless, to hookless nextie 50mm (external) rims: came in at 73mm casing max (at 30psi) and 61.5mm tread. im expecting the casing to shrink a little at my usual 10psi, but still.

ballooner&#8230;.

more here: https://drj0nswanderings.wordpress.com/2015/02/16/semi-fat/


----------



## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

dRjOn said:


> curious. i just mounted my trailblazer, tubeless, to hookless nextie 50mm (external) rims: came in at 73mm casing max (at 30psi) and 61.5mm tread. im expecting the casing to shrink a little at my usual 10psi, but still.
> 
> ballooner&#8230;.
> 
> more here: https://drj0nswanderings.wordpress.com/2015/02/16/semi-fat/


What bike are these going on?


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

My jones ...


----------



## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

From that angle^^^^the 29+ looks way larger. Good to know that tire will fit out back the Jones on a 50mm rim.


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

About 4cm bigger diameter iirc... The deep rims on them now seems to lessen the difference, but it's still very noticeable.


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*



Slow Danger said:


> From that angle^^^^the 29+ looks way larger. Good to know that tire will fit out back the Jones on a 50mm rim.


The rear looks like a normal tire.


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

on a 34mm deep rim:










for comparison:here is a chronicle on a 29x50mm rim:










and pre-nextie rims:


----------



## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Ah, now that's a better look. The previous pics were either of a different tire/wheel, or, if the same, the camera angle.


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

The problem for me is that the WTB is really meant for sandy dirt road expedition bikes / loaded touring contraptions like the Salsa Fargo or Rocky's new Sherpa. They're not meant for real mountain biking as evident by the tread pattern and sidewalls which are much wider than the tread. These tires are just asking for rock slashes after you drop your tread in between stuff off-road (just as Schwalbe's are prone to on their large casing / narrow tread tires, but much more so as they tend to not be more than a couple millimeters wider, not a dozen plus like the WTB).


----------



## carlo il dentista (Feb 17, 2010)

Hi, guys. I need your help. where (on line shop) can I find a WTB Trailblazer?
Thanks from Italy.
Carlo.


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

For the sake of completeness...with the nextie rims...

Carlo: no idea if there is any availability now, I think April was the month I'd noted for more to be available?


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

hopefully the selection of tires will be greater by late spring or early summer. i think the chronicle is the best looking tread but i really would like to see a more aggressive tire


----------



## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

That's awesome... do you have any room to slide the axle back for more tire clearance?



WheelieWonka said:


> Mounted the Vee tire up on my 1X1 today. Looks like it fits! Just barely! It's mounted on a Velocity Blunt rim and there is truly no room to spare. Can't wait to try it out on the trails. I ran out of time but I'm going to try it on the same rim but on a XFusion Velvet fork. I'll report back on that and how it rides...


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

seat boy how's that awesome?

hold on WW, so you're mating a allegedly 3.25 tire to a 35mm od rim? that seems silly at best. what are your intents of riding with this tire? i can understand the volume benefit, but the tire squirm is going to be ridiculous. have fun and let us know. are you using this setup, up front?


----------



## seat_boy (May 16, 2006)

It's awesome because Surly designed a frame maybe 20 years ago that is still capable, relevant, and flexible today. How many of today's carbon suspension wonderbikes will still be in use in even a decade?

And I don't see any problem running a B+ tire on 35mm rims. I run my Knards on 35mm Blunts, and they're absolutely fine at any pressure.



fishwrinkle said:


> seat boy how's that awesome?
> 
> hold on WW, so you're mating a allegedly 3.25 tire to a 35mm od rim? that seems silly at best. what are your intents of riding with this tire? i can understand the volume benefit, but the tire squirm is going to be ridiculous. have fun and let us know. are you using this setup, up front?


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

Me too that's why I went with dually


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

seat_boy said:


> That's awesome... do you have any room to slide the axle back for more tire clearance?


Here's the deal with the Trax Fatty on the 1X1. It barely fits and there's only one position at the rear of the sliders that will work. Unfortunately i can not get proper tension on the chain. I will have to mount a tensioner pulley or I may convert it to a geared bike.

Anyone have a suggestion for a tensioner??


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I've got a brand new Shimano Alfine tensioner that I don't need.


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

fishwrinkle said:


> seat boy how's that awesome?
> 
> hold on WW, so you're mating a allegedly 3.25 tire to a 35mm od rim? that seems silly at best. what are your intents of riding with this tire? i can understand the volume benefit, but the tire squirm is going to be ridiculous. have fun and let us know. are you using this setup, up front?


Yes, for more volume. It'll help give the rear of the bike more cushion... And I'll be able to bushwhack a bit more, plus ride some of the sandy trails and beaches where I live. I plan to run a Trailblazer up front on a XFusion Velvet fork. As for squirm - maybe. I don't think it will be too severe, though, with proper air pressure. We shall see.



06HokieMTB said:


> I've got a brand new Shimano Alfine tensioner that I don't need.


Thanks! I'll PM you if I need it. I'm still tossing around ideas and doing some research. 
This looks like a possibility:


Or this:


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*

Kind of sad to make the 1x1 run a tensioner. Surly ought to widen up that frame.


----------



## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

if you use that fixed gear chain length calculator you'll probablybe able to calculate a gear that gives same ratio with correct chain length give or take a couple mm...


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Running a tensioner on a 1x1 just isn't right - just say no!


----------



## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

seat_boy said:


> How many of today's carbon suspension wonderbikes will still be in use in even a decade? And I don't see any problem running a B+ tire on 35mm rims. I run my Knards on 35mm Blunts, and they're absolutely fine at any pressure.


:skep:not sure how fs got brought into this equation, but okay. i'll have to disagree with a knard on a 30mm id rim. i've done it and yeah i guess you can do it if you like rock hard tires. between the squirm and the crappiness of the tread for a front tire and the aggressive style i ride that combo equates to crashes. now put that tire on a 39mm id and yes you can rock it hard until the tire looses grip from an inferior tread design. my dirt ranges from sand/gravel, hardpack, to loam, with roots in all the above. i'm just stating my findings. just like wheelie has the trailblazers work for him cause he's riding in sand all the time by the sounds of it.


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

MMcG said:


> Running a tensioner on a 1x1 just isn't right - just say no!


I know, right? But I'm dying to try this setup so I just bit the bullet and got a cheap tensioner like this. It's green so it will match the décor... lol.


----------



## 29ger (Jan 1, 2011)

*Trax fatty fork*

I may have missed it earlier, so apologies if this has already been addressed. So far, the only fork I'd heard mentioned much that fit the trax fatty is the DT Swiss, but on Bikerumor today, there was another. It was on one of the new Zen bikes.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Got my Scraper i45 built up
Nuke proof 15mm hub
Sapim Laser spokes, 32h, 3x

1006g

Not setting any weight weenie records! lol

Like the profile of the Trail Taker 2.4 on the i45 rim!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Tons of fresh snow in Denver, maybe I'll take the dog for a snow ride/run tomorrow! :thumbsup:


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> Tons of fresh snow in Denver, maybe I'll take the dog for a snow ride/run tomorrow! :thumbsup:


Man that was fun. Took the dog for a quick 5-6 mile pedal on hardpacked snow roads and trails. The Vee TT 2.4 on the WTB Scraper i45 gives tremendous amounts of traction to the front end! Surprisingly so, really.









That's the most fun I've had on a bike in the last couple months. Felt like a 12 year old kid again. Riding a hard tail for the sake of riding and having fun.









For S&G's, here's a side by side comparison of a WTB 2.8 on a Blunt 35 vs. a WTB Scraper on a 650b, high volume 2.4-2.5 'normal' trail tire... You can imagine how it'll look with a proper 3.0" Fat B Nimble B+ tire up front.


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

That's an MRP (formerly known as white brothers) Stage fork.

Stage - MRP


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Just been reading some stuff from Frostbike. Vee announced 3 widths of their Trax Fatty in 650B+: 2.8", 3.0", and 3.25". Also, Panaracer was showing the 650B+ version of their Fat B Nimble. Weird news is it's labeled 3.5" wide, but some info floating around puts it at 2.83" width on a 40mm external rim.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> Just been reading some stuff from Frostbike. Vee announced 3 widths of their Trax Fatty in 650B+: 2.8", 3.0", and 3.25".


This is verified on Vee's website! Yay to B+ 3.0" with nice side knobs!

Trax Fatty | VEE Tire Co.



> Available in:
> 
> 29×3.0 (Single Compound) WB
> 29×3.0 (Single Compound) FB
> ...


----------



## BigHit-Maniac (Apr 13, 2004)

Does anyone have any pictures of Continental 2.4" 650B tires on "normal" rims? 

Really want to see what they're like mounted up. 

Thanks guys


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> This is verified on Vee's website! Yay to B+ 3.0" with nice side knobs!
> 
> Trax Fatty | VEE Tire Co.


The 27.5x3.0 tires showed in stock, so I placed an order for one!

I few hours later Vee cancelled the order saying there was an inventory error, tires are not available.


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

bikeny said:


> The 27.5x3.0 tires showed in stock, so I placed an order for one!
> 
> I few hours later Vee cancelled the order saying there was an inventory error, tires are not available.


Bikebling had them just a couple of weeks ago...


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

WheelieWonka said:


> Bikebling had them just a couple of weeks ago...


No, they didn't. The 27.5x3.0 size was just announced/shown a couple of days ago, it's brand new. The 27.5x3.25 has been on sale for a few week now, but that was first shown many months ago.


----------



## mxer (May 27, 2006)

bikeny said:


> The 27.5x3.0 tires showed in stock, so I placed an order for one!
> 
> I few hours later Vee cancelled the order saying there was an inventory error, tires are not available.


Bummer!I am hoping this will fit in back of my yelli screamy.I am thinking it might not as the tb is pretty tight in there from what i have seen.

They mention when they might have them?


----------



## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

I was hoping for 27.5x3.55 version.
Not sure if i am serious or not, but propably i am.


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

bikeny said:


> No, they didn't. The 27.5x3.0 size was just announced/shown a couple of days ago, it's brand new. The 27.5x3.25 has been on sale for a few week now, but that was first shown many months ago.


Oh wow. Cool! A slightly smaller tire would be welcomed...


----------



## dougmint (Oct 29, 2006)

Does anyone have experience mounting the vee trax fatty 27.5x3.25 on a 35mm internal / 40mm external rim? I'm wondering if this rim size is wide enough for this tire.


----------



## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I put a VTF 27.5x3.25 on a 40mm Derby rim. It looked okay. If I already had a wheelset with that rim width I'd give it a try. I didn't get a chance to ride it as the tire doesn't fit on the bike that has the Derbys. I just set it up with a tube since I wasn't going to ride it, but it looked like it wouldn't be a problem going tubeless. Since I had to get a wheelset made for my fat bike to run the tires, I'm going with 50mm Nexties.

Pictures of it above and below this post:

650B+ Tires - Page 21- Mtbr.com


----------



## ScaryJerry (Jan 12, 2004)




----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

ScaryJerry said:


> View attachment 967766


Looks nice! More info: Singletrack Magazine | Hot from Icebike - Genesis reveal the future today

Tires look to be a 27.5+ version of the Maxxis Chronicle, sweet!


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> Tires look to be a 27.5+ version of the Maxxis Chronicle, sweet!


:thumbsup:


----------



## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

News, news, and more good news. Can't wait until Sea Otter. Should be more prototypes by then. Curious to see how many new bikes/tires will be available by this riding season. Likely, not many. By Interbike, the 27.5+ will be ramping up for 2016 big time. I'm holding out for the right combo of rim, tire, and bike to come along.


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> News, news, and more good news. Can't wait until Sea Otter. Should be more prototypes by then. Curious to see how many new bikes/tires will be available by this riding season. Likely, not many. By Interbike, the 27.5+ will be ramping up for 2016 big time. I'm holding out for the right combo of rim, tire, and bike to come along.


Yup, I'll bet Sea Otter will have lots of 27.5+ stuff on display, and I also think at least some of it will be available by this riding season.

All I want is a tire size between the Trailblazer and Trax Fatty, is that too much to ask! And I want it now dammit!


----------



## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

bikeny said:


> Looks nice! More info: Singletrack Magazine | Hot from Icebike - Genesis reveal the future today
> 
> Tires look to be a 27.5+ version of the Maxxis Chronicle, sweet!


the world is going to be sweet place pretty soon....glad I didn't buy a 29+ bike!

mike


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> All I want is a tire size between the Trailblazer and Trax Fatty, is that too much to ask! And I want it now dammit!


With good cornering knobs and fits in a Fox 34... 



senor_mikey said:


> glad I didn't buy a 29+ bike!


No joke!


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Maxxis!


----------



## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

*650B+ Tires*



senor_mikey said:


> the world is going to be sweet place pretty soon....glad I didn't buy a 29+ bike!
> 
> mike


Not me - I think I need both for research purposes and n+1.


----------



## PCT (Jun 29, 2009)

Seems ok on a Nextie 40mm. Measures about 3" wide. Same height as a Nate on a Marge Lite...









dougmint said:


> Does anyone have experience mounting the vee trax fatty 27.5x3.25 on a 35mm internal / 40mm external rim? I'm wondering if this rim size is wide enough for this tire.


----------



## SeB-66 (May 13, 2008)

Hello. Read through about 20 pages of fitment conversation without learning much about how the 27.5+ tires handle. Pardon me if I missed it.

I can easily see their appeal for rough terrain, but how about aggressive cornering? I'm very intrigued by the idea of the 27.5+ idea, but the combination of a tall tire and low air pressure sounds like a recipe for poor cornering at speed. Not the case? 

I was thinking of perhaps getting the 2.8 tire size and putting them on the Light Bicycles carbon rim (31.6mm internal width, ~450g).

Thanks in advance for any and all input.


----------



## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

If you are wondering about whether the cornering will work, go try a fat bike on the dirt. I think most people excited about 27.5+ are coming at from the fat bike side of things. I want something that is a little smaller and lighter that you can build a FS bike around that doesn't have a big Q factor and other compromises. Fat tires have amazing traction for cornering but are a lot of work to pedal at a good speed.

There are also people with 29ers that want BBFM* tires if they can get them to fit. I don't know if they are motivated by the thought of bigger tires for bigness sake, or if they have experience with 29+ or fat tires.

*BBFM was a development product name where I work that stood for Bigger Better Faster More.


----------



## SeB-66 (May 13, 2008)

Welnic said:


> *BBFM was a development product name where I work that stood for Bigger Better Faster More.


 and thanks for the perspective.


----------



## carlo il dentista (Feb 17, 2010)

rikardo said:


> Does anybody have any info where the Vee traxx fatty could be purchased??
> if they are not yet available is there any idea when these would be available.
> How about wtb:s any source for them??
> Thanks in advance!


I founded them here:
Fat 27.5+ - Singlespeed Central - Alternative bikes and parts!


----------



## Linktung (Oct 22, 2014)

QBP says March 5th on the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 by 3.25.


----------



## SeB-66 (May 13, 2008)

Thank you  I talked with the guys at Canfield, and for now I'm going to stick with 29er wheels. Might give the b+ thing a try later in the year


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Was it in this thread that someone showed a 650b+ wheel/tire combo in the rear of one of those Hammerhead/Switchback Thumper frames?

Was clearance adequate?


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

No, I think we just discussed it as a possibility. The distance between chainstays is about 83mm. So the Trailblazer and a 3.0 tire would work on 40mm rims, but it may get awfully close on wider rims or with bigger tires.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

40mm and those tires would be enough for me.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Not sure which thread it was posted in, but it was me.

I swapped my rear wheel into a 2012 Kona Satori (essentially same rear end, except for pivot placement).

Here's the Satori with a Blunt 35 and a WTB2.8


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> Not sure which thread it was posted in, but it was me.
> 
> I swapped my rear wheel into a 2012 Kona Satori (essentially same rear end, except for pivot placement).
> 
> ...


So definitely a go with that combo - do you think a go with a Blunt35 and 3.0 tire?


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

MMcG said:


> So definitely a go with that combo - do you think a go with a Blunt35 and 3.0 tire?


Honestly? no clue. sorry


----------



## jallll (Dec 28, 2008)

*650B+ Tires*


----------



## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

^^^
What's the set-up?
Frame/Wheel ID/Tires

Cool pics!


----------



## WheelieWonka (Aug 27, 2003)

jallll said:


>


Awesome. Exactly what I'd like to have in the quiver. I haven't bought a brand new bike in many years but I'd pull the trigger on something like this. Chomping at the bit!


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Welnic said:


> If you are wondering about whether the cornering will work, go try a fat bike on the dirt. I think most people excited about 27.5+ are coming at from the fat bike side of things. I want something that is a little smaller and lighter that you can build a FS bike around that doesn't have a big Q factor and other compromises. Fat tires have amazing traction for cornering but are a lot of work to pedal at a good speed.


Yup, that seems to be the case, it's not that 26 x 3" tires are "new", so much as the evolution of 3" tires are moved to a larger rim size(s) and the quality and design of the tires have improved.

When I compare the Trax Fatty 650b x 3.25 to an Arrow or Duro or Gazz, the difference is striking: Much lighter weight (900g vs 1800gm), more resilient casing (120tpi vs 24 tpi), kevlar bead (vs steel), tubeless compatible, and the rubber composition is denser and fast roller, not to mention having far more tread choices.

This ^^^ tire sizing is a great fit for all around biking where speed is not the point and for fat bikers who want to use their bikes for other than mud and snow.

Do these tires roll over on the rim due to being fat? No, not any more than an ATV or a car has the same problem. Add pressure for aggressive riding on terrain where you can get good traction (dirt), lower pressure as need to retain traction on slippery surface.

The idea behind fat is increased footprint (traction), increased floatation, increased control, and increased comfort.

I like 4" tires, but they can be an overkill in some situations, which makes their weight and bulkiness a detractor, but if you scale down that weight and bulk just enough to retain the good stuff while minimizing the bad stuff, well then you have a nice middling tire standard


----------



## jrahm (Feb 2, 2004)

Linktung said:


> QBP says March 5th on the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 by 3.25.


I rebuilt my wheelset using Stan's Hugo rims, 650b. the bike's a Norco Sasquatch. The missing piece was the tires. I found the V Trax Fatty 3.25 online last night after searching for weeks. Some SE distributor still has a few. You can get them at extreme bike and sport. "Vee Trax fatty" 
I bought two there should be five left. Surprisingly cheap $160 including shipping. I expect I'll be dropping about 5 pounds off the bike


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> View attachment 966514
> 
> 
> Got my Scraper i45 built up
> ...


hi Hokie,

How tall is it when mounted on i45??


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

drummercat said:


> hi Hokie,
> 
> How tall is it when mounted on i45??


How tall is the 'normal' 650b Trail Taker 2.4? I'll find out tonight.

Shorter than the WTB 2.8, which is shorter than a normal 29er tire.


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> How tall is the 'normal' 650b Trail Taker 2.4? I'll find out tonight.
> 
> Shorter than the WTB 2.8, which is shorter than a normal 29er tire.


Vee rubber fluid 27.5x2.4 is 711mm tall on normal rims, I think Trail taker will be nearly same. Just wonder will it be taller on those wide rims.


----------



## Chupathingee (Jul 9, 2013)

Dirt Rag did a writeup on the Panaracer Fat B Nimble on WTB Scraper rims, they say it comes in at 2.8" (71mm) wide, quite a bit off from the listed 3.5". Although I find it annoying that they are almost 3/4 of an inch off their advertised width I am also pleased because I want to put those tires in a 29er frame I have and now I know they will fit:

Introduction to Project 27Plus - WTB Scraper rims and Panaracer Fat B Nimble tires


----------



## Sourdough (Oct 14, 2005)

*Turner Sultan with 27+*



Stopbreakindown said:


> ^^^
> What's the set-up?
> Frame/Wheel ID/Tires
> 
> Cool pics!


Here's David Turner talking about the set-up he's riding - "Optimum rim size will be 35mm or wider inside dimension. I am using ENVE AM rims with the Vee Tires, not full width, but I don't think the tires would fit if I had proper width rims. Tire factories are all using 45mm ID for tire shape drawings whatever that is worth. I can run under 15psi with 'skinny' rims no problem so 35 should be good, 45s better. Keep in mind that fork clearance with skinny rims and 3.25 is MINIMAL. Plenty on top, not much on side."

So, Frame = Turner Sultan (29) size Med
Rims = ENVE AM
Tires = Vee


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> Keep in mind that fork clearance with skinny rims and 3.25 is MINIMAL. Plenty on top, not much on side."


Ugh. 3.0" B+ tire, please.


----------



## drummercat (Jul 10, 2011)

Chainreaction listed a sun ringle mulefut 50 rims for 29+ and B+, without photos.......I searched the web for any info but no luck.... anyone know more about it??


----------



## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

I would love to see a B+ WTB Vigilante 2.8 or 3.0 tire.... It would make my Yelli "mo betta"


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

dustyduke22 said:


> I would love to see a B+ WTB Vigilante 2.8 or 3.0 tire.... It would make my Yelli "mo betta"


Don't get me all hot and bothered with the thought of a 3.0 WTB Vigilante!

WTB has 'hinted' that more B+ tire options are forthcoming. Patience, I guess?

A front tire is something I'm willing to wait a bit to get right. It takes me a while to wear out a front tire, so I'll probably have it for several years. Especially seeing how this is a 2nd wheel for my 2nd bike. (I have a 29er front wheel that I run on the bike as well.)

I'm happy with my WTB 2.8 Trailblazer as a rear, but would like a more aggressive tire up front.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

dustyduke22 said:


> I would love to see a B+ WTB Vigilante 2.8 or 3.0 tire.... It would make my Yelli "mo betta"


Don't get me all hot and bothered with the thought of a 3.0 WTB Vigilante!

WTB has 'hinted' that more B+ tire options are forthcoming. Patience, I guess?

A front tire is something I'm willing to wait a bit to get right. It takes me a while to wear out a front tire, so I'll probably have it for several years. Especially seeing how this is a 2nd wheel for my 2nd bike. (I have a 29er front wheel that I run on the bike as well.)

I'm happy with my WTB 2.8 Trailblazer as a rear, but would like a more aggressive tire up front.


----------



## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

I'm anxious to try a Trailblazer Rear and Fat B Nimble front combo on my OS Bikes BlackBuck that I plan to turn into a B+ Rigid Single speed. I just need to make a damned decision on a wheelset for it. Do I go the safe route and just get some inexpensive Blunt/P35 wheels - or do I splurge a little bit more, and if so, what hub/rim combo to go with? That's the question I am pondering - for what seems like ages. I guess partly due to the fact that we had a brutal winter here in New England.

But I gotta get on it. I don't think my 28mm external width rims are ideal for this particular set up. But I do think P35 width would get the job done.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Blunt35/P35 is a safe bet for the rear. I could maybe squeeze a Dually on the rear of my Mason, but went with a Blunt35 b/c I knew it would fit and it is a touch lighter.

Really happy with my Scraper front, but as a 2nd wheel. It's a heavy mofo!

The new LB 38mm carbon rim would be cool as would the Nextie 40mm or even the Nextie 50mm "+" rims. But my budget didn't include carbon hoops.


----------



## Chupathingee (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm considering just getting a Stan's Hugo wheelset (can be found for sub $600 online), then I can ride it and upgrade to a custom built wheelset next year, ideally i9s with carbon rims. I don't know that I'll actually be happy with all the stuff I can find for cheap in the meantime (blunt, arch ex, other not true fat rims), having come from a 29x3.0 tire on a 50mm rim.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

aand... here comes the first 650b+ fork...
FOX Announces 2016 FLOAT 34 For 27.5+ - Pinkbike


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

i went from a p35 rear to a nextie 50mm rear and the difference in width of the tyre took it from easy clearance to 'wouldnt want less'...but functionally the wider rim was better - in terms of more stable feeling at lower pressure.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

i went from a p35 rear to a nextie 50mm rear and the difference in width of the tyre took it from easy clearance to 'wouldnt want less'...but functionally the wider rim was better - in terms of more stable feeling at lower pressure.


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## AOK (Jan 25, 2004)

dRjOn said:


> i went from a p35 rear to a nextie 50mm rear and the difference in width of the tyre took it from easy clearance to 'wouldnt want less'...but functionally the wider rim was better - in terms of more stable feeling at lower pressure.


Similar experience here with my 29+ setup going from 35mm Derbys to 50mm Nexties.


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

savo said:


> aand... here comes the first 650b+ fork...
> FOX Announces 2016 FLOAT 34 For 27.5+ - Pinkbike


oh sweet another hub standard, meh


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

drummercat said:


> Vee rubber fluid 27.5x2.4 is 711mm tall on normal rims, I think Trail taker will be nearly same. Just wonder will it be taller on those wide rims.


So people go back and forth on if a wider rim makes a tire taller or shorter. IMO, a wider rim will spread the sidewalls and make a tire tread flatter (more square) and nominally shorter... Mainly because you're taking an arc shape and turning it into more of a square shape.

To the best of my measurement abilities: (accurately measuring the height of a wheel/tire by yourself is a bit difficult... and I'm too lazy to have my wife hold the wheel and level against a wall and mark a line and measure that. lol)

my Vee Trail Taker measures 708-709mm tall on a WTB Scraper i45 rim


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

PSA: A sliding door makes for a handy wheel dimension caliper.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Great idea. I'll add that to the list of things I need in our upcoming home purchase! Lol


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

Wow thought all homes had a door wall or a pocket door


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Ha. You said sliding door.

Fine.... Ill pinch the wheel between the basement door and the wall and meaure the distance. Lol


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

Chupathingee said:


> Dirt Rag did a writeup on the Panaracer Fat B Nimble on WTB Scraper rims, they say it comes in at 2.8" (71mm) wide, quite a bit off from the listed 3.5". Although I find it annoying that they are almost 3/4 of an inch off their advertised width I am also pleased because I want to put those tires in a 29er frame I have and now I know they will fit:
> 
> Introduction to Project 27Plus - WTB Scraper rims and Panaracer Fat B Nimble tires


That is a very nice looking tire!
Thanks for posting the link.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Got an hour of hardpacked dirt & rocks (and some mud) on my B+ Mason with the WTB Scraper front and 2.4 Vee Trail Taker.

In short: Damn B+ is fun!


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

06HokieMTB said:


> In short: Damn B+ is fun!


I would have to agree  I am stuck at work wishing I could be riding this morning. Trails are near perfect right now in northern Utah!

Figured I would throw a pic of my B+ rig in case anyone else is at work too and wishing they were riding.

Yelli Screamy with Scraper i45's and Trailblazers.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

Innova has a new 27.5+ tire for 2016.

Here is a link to their catalog - http://www.innovatires.com/download/INNOVA-2016-BC.pdf

It's a new tread.http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=973165&d=1426460758&thumb=1&stc=1


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

yogiprophet said:


> Innova has a new 27.5+ tire for 2016.
> 
> Here is a link to their catalog - http://www.innovatires.com/download/INNOVA-2016-BC.pdf
> 
> It's a new tread.http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=973165&d=1426460758&thumb=1&stc=1


After using their 29+ tires, this is welcome news. It'll provide 90 percent of the performance at a third of the price of the competition.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

yogiprophet said:


> Innova has a new 27.5+ tire for 2016.


Where can the Innova tires be bought, other than amazon?
I'm in europe and amazon.com doesn't ship them overseas.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

savo said:


> Where can the Innova tires be bought, other than amazon?
> I'm in europe and amazon.com doesn't ship them overseas.


I've looked everywhere here and Amazon is the only place I've seen the 29+ Gravity Vidar. I was telling a guy who works at BTI when we were riding together the other night and he didn't know if they stocked them, but I looked on their site and they do not. I will ask him if they can start carrying them as he thinks the 3.0 tire size is a great idea.
Other than that I would email Innova at [email protected] and ask them where you can get them. Put a bug in their ear and ask them to make the + tires with a Kevlar bead. If they get enough requests, they just may do it.



SS Hack said:


> After using their 29+ tires, this is welcome news. It'll provide 90 percent of the performance at a third of the price of the competition.


Where do you get 90%? Other than it being a wire bead, the Gravity is so much better than any other tire I have ever used on the front. So good in fact I think it deserves its own thread.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

yogiprophet said:


> I've looked everywhere here and Amazon is the only place I've seen the 29+ Gravity Vidar. I was telling a guy who works at BTI when we were riding together the other night and he didn't know if they stocked them, but I looked on their site and they do not. I will ask him if they can start carrying them as he thinks the 3.0 tire size is a great idea.
> Other than that I would email Innova at [email protected] and ask them where you can get them. Put a bug in their ear and ask them to make the + tires with a Kevlar bead. If they get enough requests, they just may do it.
> 
> Where do you get 90%? Other than it being a wire bead, the Gravity is so much better than any other tire I have ever used on the front. So good in fact I think it deserves its own thread.


It's a great tire and I don't see a problem with the wire bead other than weight and at 955 grams it is not too bad. These tires hold air better than the "tubeless ready" Rocket Rons I have on another bike.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Another WTB 27.5+ tire coming:

WTB Launches Bridger 27.5 x 3.0 MTB Tires, New SL8 Saddle & Carbon Rims


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Slow Danger said:


> Another WTB 27.5+ tire coming:
> 
> WTB Launches Bridger 27.5 x 3.0 MTB Tires, New SL8 Saddle & Carbon Rims


Great to see more 27.5+ tires, but these tires are aimed squarely at the Enduro crowd. 1235g for the 'light' version, and 1510g for the 'tough' version!

I am not the target market for these, that's for sure!


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

Here is another link to the 3.0 WTB tire.

Also of interest, a i29 and a i35 rim... I am more stoked on those rim options than the heavy tires to be honest.

Inside Line: WTB more 27.5+ tires and rims, plus new lightweight saddle


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

At those weights, why not just go full fat?



bikeny said:


> Great to see more 27.5+ tires, but these tires are aimed squarely at the Enduro crowd. 1235g for the 'light' version, and 1510g for the 'tough' version!
> 
> I am not the target market for these, that's for sure!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

awai04 said:


> At those weights, why not just go full fat?


Ditto. But those tires sound like they're aimed squarely at the EWS/Enduro crowd. Who care more about finishing the race than rolling weight?


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

awai04 said:


> At those weights, why not just go full fat?


Yep they need to be lighter.Full fat or go home at this point!LOL


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

dustyduke22 said:


> Here is another link to the 3.0 WTB tire.
> 
> Also of interest, a i29 and a i35 rim... I am more stoked on those rim options than the heavy tires to be honest.
> 
> Inside Line: WTB more 27.5+ tires and rims, plus new lightweight saddle


Drooling over the thought of a lightweight i35 Asym rear rim for B+ use on existing 29er frames! Good alloy option for people that don't want to drop the coin for a Nextie 40mm or an Ibis 741.

An Asym i29 could easily become a beautiful rim for AM/Enduro bikes on 'regular' 2.3-2.4 tires.

Options are good to have!


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## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

awai04 said:


> At those weights, why not just go full fat?


The difference of a FAT tyre is more lateral flex and rebound that this new tyre don't have for sure. 
Anyway those weight are more than a DH tyre 2ply ! Not good


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

*Maxxis and CST*

Hey are a few shots from the Taipei show itself.

Maxxis and CST bringing some B+ options to the table


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

Nice ! CST make maxxis right? The chronicle 29+ is a nice tyre - esp as exo tr!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Maybe I'm just used to seeing DHF like tires, but why are all of these so round? No defined shoulder or side knobs to load up against in a corner.


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

06HokieMTB said:


> Maybe I'm just used to seeing DHF like tires, but why are all of these so round? No defined shoulder or side knobs to load up against in a corner.


maybe it is the rims they have em mounted to?


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

I especially like that CST - but I don't like paying car tire prices for bike tires.


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## Coloradoxj13 (Sep 9, 2009)

SS Hack said:


> I especially like that CST - but I don't like paying car tire prices for bike tires.


I was just thinking about how I could buy a new motorcycle for the same price as the next bike I want to build...does seem ridiculous.


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## FloriDave (Jul 15, 2009)

Are there ANY B+ tires actually available now? 27.5x3 or 27.5x2.8. Seems like anything I've looked at is supposed to be available in the summer. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

FloriDave said:


> Are there ANY B+ tires actually available now? 27.5x3 or 27.5x2.8. Seems like anything I've looked at is supposed to be available in the summer.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


The Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 is available at a bunch of places. It's closer to a 3.0 size wise, but still too big for most 29er frames. The WTB Trailblazer was available but sold out quickly. There may be some floating around, not sure. The Panaracer Fat B Nimble will be available in a couple of weeks.


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## FloriDave (Jul 15, 2009)

bikeny said:


> The Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 is available at a bunch of places. It's closer to a 3.0 size wise, but still too big for most 29er frames. The WTB Trailblazer was available but sold out quickly. There may be some floating around, not sure. The Panaracer Fat B Nimble will be available in a couple of weeks.


Thanks. That's what I thought. I think the Vee Trax is a little too big,

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Still wish the VTF was 3.0 instead of 3.25, so it would fit in a F34 29! But, with the "new" 110mm spacing, I guess it'll fit. ("New" being tongue in cheek... How many 20x110 fans almost threw up in their mouths when they heard RockShox was releasing a fork with a 15x110 axle.)

But:
With WTB announcing new rims and B+ Enduro/DH tires and Fox & RockShox buying in with "new" forks... Sounds like we're going to learn A LOT about the B+ size in the next 3 weeks. Someone, and someone big, is about to release a 150mm AM/Enduro B+ slayer!


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

FloriDave said:


> Are there ANY B+ tires actually available now? 27.5x3 or 27.5x2.8. Seems like anything I've looked at is supposed to be available in the summer.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I'm not sure when they'll ship, but there are a couple sites taking pre-orders for the 27.5x3.5 Fat B Nimble's. Panaracer indicated via their facebook site that they were going to have a limited quantity flown in to bypass shipping backlogs and they'd be available before the end of the month.

I'm just hoping they mount up smaller than Trax Fatty's...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

mothertruckinsteve said:


> I'm just hoping they mount up smaller than Trax Fatty's...


From everything I read, they do. About halfway between the WTB TB2.8 and the VTF.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

06HokieMTB said:


> From everything I read, they do. About halfway between the WTB TB2.8 and the VTF.


That's what I've read as well, but the number of sources is pretty limited and that 3.5 on the carcass is unsettling for use in a 29er frame. Oh well, I'll find out if they fit soon enough.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Dirt Rag showed a pic of it fitting nicely into a fork. Mine will be for the front on a WTB Scraper, so that was comforting to see.


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## Chupathingee (Jul 9, 2013)

*Fat B Nimble 27.5 on Stan's Hugo*

Picture of calipers measuring a Fat B Nimble 27.5 on a Stan's Hugo rim (49.9 inner width, for those that don't have it memorized).









Photo shamelessly copied from Panaracer's facebook page, with credits to Chris Murray for the photo.


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## slower_than_u (Sep 28, 2008)

Maybe I should have done more research or maybe I should have been more patient with 27.5+ tires?

The 27.5 x 3.25 Vee Trax Fatty in 120tpi finally became available and as I pulled them out of the box I noticed the weight listed as 800g on the side of the box. I set them on my scale and was very disappointed to see 990g and 1015g. Anybody else see similar numbers?

I'm no weight weenie but early reports of 27.5x3.5 Fat B Nimble in the 700g range have me wishing I would have held out a little longer.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I saw the same 800g on my boxes. The scale I used sucked but mine seemed to weigh 880g and 900g. I'll finally get to try them when my wheels show up tomorrow.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

My bare WTB Scraper rim weighs 687g by itself... which is more than my last 29er front wheel (27mm hookless LB carbon rim on an AM Classic 15mm front hub - yes, I know the Scraper is alloy and is literally twice as wide as the LB 27mm hookless carbon rim. lol)

Moral of the story? B+ ain't gonna be light. But damn its fun.


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## Slow Danger (Oct 9, 2009)

Welnic said:


> I saw the same 800g on my boxes. The scale I used sucked but mine seemed to weigh 880g and 900g. I'll finally get to try them when my wheels show up tomorrow.


I'd be pretty jazzed to have an 880gram Vee TF. If the 3.0 FBNimble comes in under 800 grams, that's pretty impressive too.

Sorry to hear that slowerthanU got a 1000 gram tire. That puts me off a bit.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

slower_than_u said:


> Maybe I should have done more research or maybe I should have been more patient with 27.5+ tires?
> 
> The 27.5 x 3.25 Vee Trax Fatty in 120tpi finally became available and as I pulled them out of the box I noticed the weight listed as 800g on the side of the box. I set them on my scale and was very disappointed to see 990g and 1015g. Anybody else see similar numbers?
> 
> I'm no weight weenie but early reports of 27.5x3.5 Fat B Nimble in the 700g range have me wishing I would have held out a little longer.


Yeah, that 800g is obviously wishful thinking! Most of the weights I've seen posted are in the mid 900 range. Mine is 968g. The reports I've seen on the Fat B Nimble are that it's a bunch lighter. Also, the Trailblazers are around the same weight as the Trax Fatty, and that's a much smaller tire.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Ahem... given my lightest fat tires are still over 1100 grams for 3.8 actual width on i75 rims that weigh over 800 grams each... I'll happily take 900 grams for a 3.25 on an i49 rim that's under 700 grams.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

06HokieMTB said:


> My bare WTB Scraper rim weighs 687g by itself... which is more than my last 29er front wheel (27mm hookless LB carbon rim on an AM Classic 15mm front hub - yes, I know the Scraper is alloy and is literally twice as wide as the LB 27mm hookless carbon rim. lol)
> 
> Moral of the story? B+ ain't gonna be light. But damn its fun.


The WTB website lists the weight of the i49 rim at 565 grams. WTF, can't anyone get the weight right?

Scraper | WTB


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Manufacturers pull the lightest example from a pile usually and use that as the claimed weight in advertising. There's always some variation in production when it comes to materials.


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## Coloradoxj13 (Sep 9, 2009)

You guys catch this?
27.5+ Tires - Taipei Show 2015 - Pinkbike


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Coloradoxj13 said:


> You guys catch this?
> 27.5+ Tires - Taipei Show 2015 - Pinkbike


Yes, I catch the pinkbike user community losing their marbles (which is the polite word I have to use over the actual word I prefer but that mtbr would censor) over anything new every damned day. The site really needs moderators who actually MODERATE discussions. and to get rid of that stupid prop feature which lets users anonymously shoot messengers (or reward their fellow morons). MTBR's rep voting thing works much better.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Some of these are heavier than 29+ tires and smaller.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

thats ok though, as some of them are DH casing style, 2 ply hardcore tyres (wtb bridger). if i was bashing around Downieville - those would be my choice of tyre. if i was nipping around santa cruz, id be on lighty light thin casing minimal tread jobs. its ACE to have choice already with this....how long was it before there was even a chocie in 29+...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

AZMB'er said:


> The WTB website lists the weight of the i49 rim at 565 grams. Scraper | WTB













AZMB'er said:


> WTF, can't anyone get the weight right?


I agree! So much so, I started this rant thread a little while back. lol.

http://forums.mtbr.com/general-discussion/i-think-wtb-needs-buy-new-scales-941706.html


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Coloradoxj13 said:


> You guys catch this?
> 27.5+ Tires - Taipei Show 2015 - Pinkbike


Wow. That Duro Miner 3.0 looks awesome for an aggressive B+ front tire!









(pic credit to paulaston on PinkBike)


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## Bigwheel (Jan 12, 2004)

*Kenda Havok 3.0*









(Bike Rumor)


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

oh hot damn! that miner sure does look purdy and i'd throw the crux out back too. i want them now!!! oh wait, prolly won't happen until 2017


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

BTW: if anyone was wondering how B+ is in tech and rocks... In a word, AMAZING.

I rode Dakota Ridge and White Ranch this weekend. Both are known for tech and chunk (and a lot of fun!) Basically, with that big of a tire, riding fast over rough terrain becomes a matter of point and shoot. Obviously it's not as smooth as a full suspension bike, but my B+ HT can keep up with my buddies on 6" AM bikes.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

mothertruckinsteve said:


> I'm not sure when they'll ship, but there are a couple sites taking pre-orders for the 27.5x3.5 Fat B Nimble's. Panaracer indicated via their facebook site that they were going to have a limited quantity flown in to bypass shipping backlogs and they'd be available before the end of the month.


BikeBling just told me June 2nd is the expected ship date from their distributor for the Panaracer Fat B Nimbles :-/


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

06HokieMTB said:


> BikeBling just told me June 2nd is the expected ship date from their distributor for the Panaracer Fat B Nimbles :-/


Sigh, they just told me the same. I'd cancel my order, but I'm getting increasingly skeptical that any other B+ options will be available before June.


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## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

mothertruckinsteve said:


> Sigh, they just told me the same. I'd cancel my order, but I'm getting increasingly skeptical that any other B+ options will be available before June.


Have you checked with them on their Facebook page? They may sell you some...


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 are available.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

Welnic said:


> Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 are available.


That's true, unfortunately I've tried VTFs and while they fit in my frame (Gen 1 Nimble 9) and fork (xfusion slide) there is absolutely no clearance, and I get rub even under light load. Tires were mounted on Blunt 35s at 20psi, for anyone interested....I have messaged Panaracer, and it looks like they may be able to hook me up.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

mothertruckinsteve said:


> That's true, unfortunately I've tried VTFs and while they fit in my frame (Gen 1 Nimble 9) and fork (xfusion slide) there is absolutely no clearance, and I get rub even under light load. Tires were mounted on Blunt 35s at 20psi, for anyone interested....I have messaged Panaracer, and it looks like they may be able to hook me up.


Hopefully they can hook you up. They got me a tire shipped out, it's on Brown Santa's sleigh for delivery today, can't wait! Hopefully I will get it mounted up tonight and first ride tomorrow.


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## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

bikeny said:


> Hopefully they can hook you up. They got me a tire shipped out, it's on Brown Santa's sleigh for delivery today, can't wait! Hopefully I will get it mounted up tonight and first ride tomorrow.


They were very helpful and contacted me when the tires came in. Mine are scheduled to arrive today as well. I just need my hubs to show up to complete the build. Bummed I couldn't give them a test run on my White Rim bikepacking trip this weekend.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

bikeny said:


> Hopefully they can hook you up. They got me a tire shipped out, it's on Brown Santa's sleigh for delivery today, can't wait! Hopefully I will get it mounted up tonight and first ride tomorrow.


They were able to hook me up, shipping out today. I've got nothing but good things to say about dealing with them. Hope you enjoy yours.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I think I'm getting some FBN love too. I may end up with a spare FBN tire. I got two as my buddy wanted to try B+ and now is waffling.

Would anyone here be interested in a FBN mounted to a Scraper i45 laced up to a 15x100 front hub? Complete would be around $315 (+/-) with shipping.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Fat B Nimble in!*

Finally received my 27.5 Fat B Nimble yesterday, after what seems like months of waiting. Actually, it was months of waiting! I forgot to take pictures of the tire itself, but did weigh it and take some measurements. The weight is an impressive 726g, much lighter than the Trax Fatty and Trailblazer. Sidewalls seem adequate to me, not as thick as the above tires, but much more substantial than a 120tpi Knard. Tread design looks good, knobs are smaller and shorter than the Trax Fatty, but still looks pretty aggressive. The bead to bead measurement is 184mm, exactly what I read somewhere. That puts it nicely between the Trailblazer(168) and the Trax Fatty(202). It's obviosly not a 3.5" as labeled, I would call it 3.0. Mounting tubeless on my Derby rim went pretty smooth. I had to pull the beads up onto the shelf as much as possible, and then aired it up with a floor pump until the beads made a reassuring pop around 20 psi. Deflated, added sealant, and then inflated to 35psi(stated max). I measured the width right after inflation, and at 35 psi: Casing 75mm, knobs: 74mm. I expect it to stretch some, and also to shrink at riding pressure, so I'm thinking it will end up in the 73mm to 75mm range. I stuck the wheel in the back of my Jones, and even at 35psi it spins with a couple of mm clearance at the tightest spot, which is the chainstays. Early indications are this is a perfect fit, any bigger would be a problem. I was hoping to get a ride in later today, but I don't think it's going to happen. Trails are finally emerging from snow/ice, but we got a crap load of rain last night. I may do a neighborhood shakedown though, as this bike is a complete new build and has not been ridden yet.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

bikeny said:


> Finally received my 27.5 Fat B Nimble yesterday, after what seems like months of waiting. Actually, it was months of waiting! I forgot to take pictures of the tire itself, but did weigh it and take some measurements. The weight is an impressive 726g, much lighter than the Trax Fatty and Trailblazer. Sidewalls seem adequate to me, not as thick as the above tires, but much more substantial than a 120tpi Knard. Tread design looks good, knobs are smaller and shorter than the Trax Fatty, but still looks pretty aggressive. The bead to bead measurement is 184mm, exactly what I read somewhere. That puts it nicely between the Trailblazer(168) and the Trax Fatty(202). It's obviosly not a 3.5" as labeled, I would call it 3.0. Mounting tubeless on my Derby rim went pretty smooth. I had to pull the beads up onto the shelf as much as possible, and then aired it up with a floor pump until the beads made a reassuring pop around 20 psi. Deflated, added sealant, and then inflated to 35psi(stated max). I measured the width right after inflation, and at 35 psi: Casing 75mm, knobs: 74mm. I expect it to stretch some, and also to shrink at riding pressure, so I'm thinking it will end up in the 73mm to 75mm range. I stuck the wheel in the back of my Jones, and even at 35psi it spins with a couple of mm clearance at the tightest spot, which is the chainstays. Early indications are this is a perfect fit, any bigger would be a problem. I was hoping to get a ride in later today, but I don't think it's going to happen. Trails are finally emerging from snow/ice, but we got a crap load of rain last night. I may do a neighborhood shakedown though, as this bike is a complete new build and has not been ridden yet.
> 
> View attachment 976306
> View attachment 976307


Sweet lookin' rig!


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## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

Very nice! I'm looking to do much the same thing on my steel spaceframe. Though I'm looking at using a Dually or Blunt rim. I've got a Trax Fatty 3.25 mounted on a Blunt which a friend of mine says fits on his diamond Jones, but just barely, not enough clearance. I'm going to try that on mine, but am hoping for a wider rim. What's the internal width on your Derby? Maybe a Dually and Fat B will be the perfect combo for me...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Derby's should be around 34mm internal.

I'm running a Blunt35 rear and would like a wider rim. No way I can fit a Scraper, not sure on a Dually (39mm internal). The new WTB Asym i35 would be a great option!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

06HokieMTB said:


> Derby's should be around 34mm internal.
> 
> I'm running a Blunt35 rear and would like a wider rim. No way I can fit a Scraper, not sure on a Dually (39mm internal). The new WTB Asym i35 would be a great option!


Didn't realize the Blunt 35 was only a 30mm internal. Derby's are 34mm internal. I guess the i35 will be...35mm internal. Good to know.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

nice!...re clearance: couple mm on the ok side or couple mm = a bit tight? looks good!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Didn't realize the Blunt 35 was only a 30mm internal. Derby's are 34mm internal. I guess the i35 will be...35mm internal. Good to know.


It gets pretty confusing trying to decipher which companies state internal (WTB) and which companies state external width (Blunt35)!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> It gets pretty confusing trying to decipher which companies state internal (WTB) and which companies state external width (Blunt35)!


I think WTB is the only one that uses the inside measurement.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

dRjOn said:


> nice!...re clearance: couple mm on the ok side or couple mm = a bit tight? looks good!


I won't know for sure until I start riding, but I think it's on the OK side. We usually stay off the trails when it's muddy around here, so that's not an issue for me, although it might be for others.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

bikeny said:


> I won't know for sure until I start riding, but I think it's on the OK side. We usually stay off the trails when it's muddy around here, so that's not an issue for me, although it might be for others.


What is the outside diameter of the FBN as mounted on your Derby rim? How did it affect your BB height?

726 grams is impressively light! Hope it works great for you!


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## dougmint (Oct 29, 2006)

Got my Vee tire fatty trax 27.5 x 3.25 yesterday from my LBS. 920grams and 980 grams. Hope to mount them up to my 40mm nexties soon.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Frankenbike!









Mounted to a WTB Scraper i45... just enough clearance in a Fox 34 29er fork









74mm casing, 71mm tread

I think it was approximately 71mm casing, 71mm tread on a Blunt35

Here it is compared to a 2.3 650b Minion DHF on a KOM i25 rim









BTW: About as wide of a tire/rim that a Thule T2 XTR rack can handle...









Sorry, Pike 27.5 users need not apply :nonod:


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Edit: NM. It found a home


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

Diameter??


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Taller than 27.5, shorter than 29? lol

Dunno, didn't measure


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

AZMB'er said:


> Diameter??


Quick measurement looks to be around 28 5/8" - 28 3/4" tall on a Scraper i45


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

06HokieMTB said:


> Quick measurement looks to be around 28 5/8" - 28 3/4" tall on a Scraper i45


Thanks Hokie! The Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 on the Scraper wheel is 29.25" Dia for comparison.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Holy tire! Let me double check that dimension tomorrow


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## manhattanprjkt83 (May 31, 2005)

I have an extra 3.25 vee rubber brand new here. $60 buyer pays shipping if anyone needs one! Just pm me.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone know the cheapest, shortest chainstay frame that'll fit a Bx3.0 tire on a wide rim?

I'm looking at getting a Parkwood in size small for my wife, and thinking that the short chainstays would be nice, although I'm also thinking that it would be fun for her to be able to ride on snow and sand as her skills progress. I'm not sure the Parkwood has the clearance for anything more than a 2.8 though.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

AZMB'er said:


> Thanks Hokie! The Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 on the Scraper wheel is 29.25" Dia for comparison.


How wide are these? Assuming they fit a 29er, they keep the BB height about right.


----------



## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

*Clearance Clarence...*

















A friend of mine mounted my 3.25 Trax Fatty on his Blunt 35 and, after it stretched out, it no longer fit on his diamond Jones. It does fit on my 2014 steel Jones Spaceframe with about 2mm on either side. However, I like my triple front, and in granny gear, the front derailleur just *barely* bumps on the outer treads.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

SS Hack said:


> How wide are these? Assuming they fit a 29er, they keep the BB height about right.


Have seen reports of 3.06" width @20psi on Scraper wheels. I am looking at putting them on a Bucksaw so more concerned with height and BB than width as I know they will fit.


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## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

AZMB'er said:


> Have seen reports of 3.06" width @20psi on Scraper wheels. I am looking at putting them on a Bucksaw so more concerned width height and BB than width as I know they will fit.


Right, my Vee TF 72 TPI after 2 months of use (tubeless) on Scraper i45 rims are 78mm wide.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

How about Trax fatty 2.8" bead to bead?


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

AZMB'er said:


> Have seen reports of 3.06" width @20psi on Scraper wheels. I am looking at putting them on a Bucksaw so more concerned width height and BB than width as I know they will fit.


I just ordered a pair of Nextie 50mm rims for a Bucksaw 650B+ summer wheelset. I am also concerned with overall diameter, as I'd like to keep the BB height as close to stock as possible. I've read all 33 pages in this thread but am still not sure which tires to go with. I like the looks of the WTB Trailblazers but based on the bead to bead measurement it seems like they may be too short. The Trax Fatty weights are discouraging but I think the size is about what I'm looking for.

If anyone has accurate diameter measurements (for any tire/rim combo) please post up or PM me.

Thanks


----------



## PCT (Jun 29, 2009)

Tried a 650b 40mm Nextie with Vee Trax Fatty on the rear of the Bucksaw. Plenty of clearance. In fact the diameter is a little taller than Nate on a Marge Lite. I do not have measurements but they do abound on these threads. Surprisingly I didn't enjoy how the B+ rear made my Bucksaw feel. Might have something to do with a Supermax 130 up front. FWIW, my friend tried the same rear tire/wheel combo on his Bucksaw with a Bluto 100 and did like it a lot. I might revisit the experiment with a Trailblazer to bring the back end and bb height down a little.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Deerhill said:


> How about Trax fatty 2.8" bead to bead?


Does not exist yet.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

StinkyP said:


> Tried a 650b 40mm Nextie with Vee Trax Fatty on the rear of the Bucksaw. Plenty of clearance. In fact the diameter is a little taller than Nate on a Marge Lite. I do not have measurements but they do abound on these threads. Surprisingly I didn't enjoy how the B+ rear made my Bucksaw feel. Might have something to do with a Supermax 130 up front. FWIW, my friend tried the same rear tire/wheel combo on his Bucksaw with a Bluto 100 and did like it a lot. I might revisit the experiment with a Trailblazer to bring the back end and bb height down a little.


Appreciate your input. I did see a few diameter measurements scattered throughout the thread and wish I had written them down or at least written down the page number. Which size Trax fatty did you run?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Cut my Trailblazer 2.8 today :-/

It's in the center of the tread, so hopefully a vulcanizing patch will take care of it. If not, then I don't have a bike to ride for a month :-/

I will say, I rode a chunky, rocky trail with my Scraper i45 and Fat B Nimble on the front... I'm kinda on the fence. The extra volume was appreciated going through the rocks, but the tire is sluggish to change direction. Seems like you can't make quick changes, rather you have to just plow through.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

06HokieMTB said:


> Cut my Trailblazer 2.8 today :-/
> 
> It's in the center of the tread, so hopefully a vulcanizing patch will take care of it. If not, then I don't have a bike to ride for a month :-/
> 
> I will say, I rode a chunky, rocky trail with my Scraper i45 and Fat B Nimble on the front... I'm kinda on the fence. The extra volume was appreciated going through the rocks, but the tire is sluggish to change direction. Seems like you can't make quick changes, rather you have to just plow through.


I'm assuming you're running the Trailblazer in the rear. 
I am very curious about how a tire this size handles the rear duties when bombing rocky trails. On the one hand, the extra float and cush would be very nice and on the other hand a tire this size may have to weigh a ton for it not to easily cut with all the extra forces the rear tire has to endure. 
I wonder if this was an isolated incident. Personally, if I did get a 650b+ it would go on my all mountain bike where it would not only fit but make plowing through rock gardens at warp speed that much smoother. 
How much air pressure did you have in it when it cut?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

25psi (ish)

To be fair, I probably could cut any tire there. Coming down the end of a rocky section, boofed off of a rock and landed on a pointy one... On a hardtail.

It was fun until the tire cut.

Still on the fence on the B+ front wheel/tire combo. I expected to love it and to blown away. Honestly, I came back feeling "meh?"


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

06HokieMTB said:


> 25psi (ish)
> 
> To be fair, I probably could cut any tire there. Coming down the end of a rocky section, boofed off of a rock and landed on a pointy one... On a hardtail.
> 
> ...


I'm wondering if the rounder profile you'd get from running a narrower rim than the scraper will result in better steering characteristics. Think I remember seeing a comment from mikesee about him preferring a narrower rim than 45mm ID with 27.5+. It may also vary with the tire as the sizes are all over the place.

What were you running for tire pressure up front? Could a little more pressure change that sluggish feeling without loosing the traction and cush we're all hoping for?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I think it's arpund 20 psi up front. Maybe closer to 18-19 psi.

I'm thinking it would be good for slower, snow rides, where you can appreciate the extra volume (and presumably extra traction at super low PSI?)

But I think I'm keeping my Spank Oozy 29er front wheel (25mm internal) with aggressive 2.4 tire for dry, summer use.


----------



## carlo il dentista (Feb 17, 2010)

Please help an old italian boy: where can I find a 2.8" rubber?


----------



## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

06HokieMTB said:


> I think it's arpund 20 psi up front. Maybe closer to 18-19 psi.
> 
> I'm thinking it would be good for slower, snow rides, where you can appreciate the extra volume (and presumably extra traction at super low PSI?)
> 
> But I think I'm keeping my Spank Oozy 29er front wheel (25mm internal) with aggressive 2.4 tire for dry, summer use.


That sounds like very high pressure for B+. I'm running a hans damph 2.35 at 19psi on a derby as my front tire, 21psi rear. I think you need to drop the pressure substantially to see what benefits the B+ really has to offer. FWIW I'm 190lb and riding aggressive, rocky terrain and regularly airborne. I love the low pressures that the wide rims allow. Looking forward to seeing if the big tires further improve that.


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

RPK3 said:


> I'm wondering if the rounder profile you'd get from running a narrower rim than the scraper will result in better steering characteristics. Think I remember seeing a comment from mikesee about him preferring a narrower rim than 45mm ID with 27.5+. It may also vary with the tire as the sizes are all over the place.
> 
> What were you running for tire pressure up front? Could a little more pressure change that sluggish feeling without loosing the traction and cush we're all hoping for?


I have a 29+ Innova Vidar on the front end 2 of my 4 bikes and love it so much I am looking at a 3rd. 
Personally, I am loving the + size front with a 2.2-2.4 in the back. It only feels sluggish on very tight smooth twisty singletrack (which makes up so little of what I ride anyway) where a super light hardtail shines.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

RPK3 said:


> That sounds like very high pressure for B+. I'm running a hans damph 2.35 at 19psi on a derby as my front tire, 21psi rear. I think you need to drop the pressure substantially to see what benefits the B+ really has to offer. FWIW I'm 190lb and riding aggressive, rocky terrain and regularly airborne. I love the low pressures that the wide rims allow. Looking forward to seeing if the big tires further improve that.


I agree that your pressure sounds high. I am running the same Derby rims with a Trax fatty front and Fat B Nimble rear. Last ride I started at 14psi rear and 12psi front. I actually stopped and let a bit more out of the front during the ride. I will try to lower the rear a bit for the next ride as well. Me = 190lb, full rigid bike, so I'm not bombing the downhills though!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Ok, I'll try dropping the front PSI and report back to the group.

Unfortunately, it is clear that I have to run my WTB 2.8 really firm on my Blunt35... Whatever pressure I had in last night wasn't enough. The tire got pinched :-/


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Ok, I'll try dropping the front PSI and report back to the group.
> 
> Unfortunately, it is clear that I have to run my WTB 2.8 really firm on my Blunt35... Whatever pressure I had in last night wasn't enough. The tire got pinched :-/


Now I'm confused! Was it a pinch flat, or a cut in the middle of the tread? Very different types of flat tires!

A pinch flat from running the pressure too low would be on the sidewall, often 2 small holes. A cut in the tread would be from a sharp rock, and might be avoided by running lower pressure.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Sorry, to clarify: my WTB 2.8 (running on the rear, mounted to a Blunt35) got a hole last night. Last night I thought it was a cut in the tread. So this morning I patched that hole (vulcanizing patch kit, with the glue and foil backed patch) and remounted the tire this AM. Upon airing up the tire, I found the 2nd hole... My 2.8 WTB TB was definitely pinched by a rock when I landed :-/

The Fat B Nimble is mounted up front on a WTB Scraper i45 and was running about 20psi... that's the one I'll try dropping the pressure to see if I like it.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Sorry, to clarify: my WTB 2.8 (running on the rear, mounted to a Blunt35) got a hole last night. Last night I thought it was a cut in the tread. So this morning I patched that hole (vulcanizing patch kit, with the glue and foil backed patch) and remounted the tire this AM. Upon airing up the tire, I found the 2nd hole... My 2.8 WTB TB was definitely pinched by a rock when I landed :-/
> 
> The Fat B Nimble is mounted up front on a WTB Scraper i45 and was running about 20psi... that's the one I'll try dropping the pressure to see if I like it.


If you're pinch flatting the Trailblazer at 25 psi maybe you shouldn't be dropping the front pressure!


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

06HokieMTB said:


> ...The Fat B Nimble is mounted up front on a WTB Scraper i45 ...


Any chance you can post a diameter measurement of that front wheel/tire combo? Inches or mm, either is fine

Thanks!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

radair said:


> Any chance you can post a diameter measurement of that front wheel/tire combo? Inches or mm, either is fine
> 
> Thanks!


You mean like I did on the previous page? (post 790) 



06HokieMTB said:


> 74mm casing, 71mm tread


EDIT:

It was post 794 (on the previous page) that has the height



06HokieMTB said:


> Quick measurement looks to be around 28 5/8" - 28 3/4" tall on a Scraper i45


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

bikeny said:


> If you're pinch flatting the Trailblazer at 25 psi maybe you shouldn't be dropping the front pressure!


Yeah. I'm heavy (192 lbs this AM) and tend to beat the hell out of rear wheels. :madman:


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## yogiprophet (Jan 9, 2006)

bikeny said:


> If you're pinch flatting the Trailblazer at 25 psi maybe you shouldn't be dropping the front pressure!


Not a good sign of pinching a big tire like that at 25 ppsi. I mean not a good sign in that tire may not be a good choice for rocky conditions.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

06HokieMTB said:


> You mean like I did on the previous page? ...It was post 794 (on the previous page) that has the height


Thanks! I started over at the beginning of the thread looking for overall diameter and am only up to page 13. Appreciate the reply. Now where to find a pair of these....


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I think I salvaged the WTB 2.8... Yay vulcanizing patches. We'll see if it's still holding air tomorrow, but it seems to be fine.

BTW: I've decided to sell my WTB Scraper i45/Fat B Nimble front wheel. I've got it listed on Craigslist and PinkBike if anyone is interested.

Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5 on WTB Scraper i45 wheel

EDIT: Asking price dropped to $325 shipped :thumbsup:


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

That's about how mine measure out at 20psi after a week of heavy tandem use. I'd expect 3.25" after a solid six months of stretching.

They end up being about 1/2" taller than a Nate, so close enough to a 26 x 4" to be compatible in most fat bike frames. I wouldn't run these on a 29er, the BB drop woudl be significant.

The Fatty Trax is a great tire, super durable, super resilent, takes a pounding and comes back for more.

Last week we rode our Fatty Trax on a tandem, 350# team, six hours of Klondike at Moab, drops onto sharp rocks, steamrolling everything in our path, and other than burping a bunch, they look new. The Ardents on my 29er have more abrasion damage from similar riding.

Any tire that can handle tandem riding on slick rock is worthy.

I wouldn't look twice at a tire that gets filleted landing on rocks, that would be suicide; all we do is land on rocks!



AZMB'er said:


> Have seen reports of 3.06" width @20psi on Scraper wheels. I am looking at putting them on a Bucksaw so more concerned with height and BB than width as I know they will fit.


----------



## PCT (Jun 29, 2009)

Running Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25
Would like to try a Trailblazer or Fat B Nimble rear tire to see if it lowers the bb enough to feel right when paired with the Supermax up front.



radair said:


> Appreciate your input. I did see a few diameter measurements scattered throughout the thread and wish I had written them down or at least written down the page number. Which size Trax fatty did you run?


----------



## 1strongone1 (Jan 13, 2004)

StinkyP said:


> Running Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25
> Would like to try a Trailblazer or Fat B Nimble rear tire to see if it lowers the bb enough to feel right when paired with the Supermax up front.


I just put a Fat B nimble on my rear and it is about a half inch lower than the Trax Fatty. I measured the tires mounted on a Nextie 40mm, rim to rim around the tire and the fat B was 6.75" and the Trax Fatty is 8"

The Fat B weighed in at 725, and seems pretty thin compared to the Trax Fatty.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Adding to confirmed trax fatty 3.25 weight... 934 and 948 grams for a new pair 120tpi foldable silicas. Still a good 600 less than my snowshoes. And squeezed onto a rim with a 20.2 internal width it inflated to 69.9 casing / 72.2 tread width (i am currently planning to ride them on nextie 50s).


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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

I've got my carbon B 36/30.8mm rim but have had tough times finding any B+ tires from EU area. WTB has shop here but no stock for Trailblazer like in US. Anyone hints ?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

ebay


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## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

Specialized just announced Pergatory and Ground Control in 27.5+ Bontrager as well. Lastly, saw a pic of a Jamis with Vittoria "Bombolini" tires on it today


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Linky?


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## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

06HokieMTB said:


> Linky?


Sorry, just a bit excited... Specialized Fuse and Ruze 27.5+ hardtails, and Rumor 650b - BikeRadar USA


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

More tires, this time from Schwalbe! Rocket Ron and Nobby Nic, both available in 27.5x2.8" and 27.5x3.0".

Sea Otter 2015 | Schwalbe presents Plus-Size Rocket Ron & Nobby Nic | ENDURO Mountainbike Magazine


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

bikeny said:


> More tires, this time from Schwalbe! Rocket Ron and Nobby Nic, both available in 27.5x2.8" and 27.5x3.0".
> 
> Sea Otter 2015 | Schwalbe presents Plus-Size Rocket Ron & Nobby Nic | ENDURO Mountainbike Magazine


Now that's exciting news!

I've been running the new version of the nobby nic on the back of my Canfield Balance. Unlike the previous nic and Schwalbes in general, it is holding up great. I've always liked the way their tires performed, they just lacked durability. My nic is the same age as the Hans Damph on the front of that bike. Side nobs on the front are already failing but the nic looks almost new.

Considering the extra traction from plus sized tires, this could be a great front tire once it arrives.


----------



## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

Great to see sidewall protection offered


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Yeah this was the reason I switched to Conti on my trail bike. I ran Nobby Nic for years on 26 & 29er bikes I've had. Loved the performance and weight but got tired of getting new tires every 2/3rds of the way into the riding season.



RPK3 said:


> Now that's exciting news!
> Unlike the previous nic and Schwalbes in general, it is holding up great. I've always liked the way their tires performed, they just lacked durability.
> 
> Considering the extra traction from plus sized tires, this could be a great front tire once it arrives.


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## RenoRacing (Aug 12, 2010)

Wow! I feel like yesterday was the final push that 27.5+ needed.... It's clear now that it's not just hype and that it's not going anywhere! 
I really liked the idea of this size tire on my 29er's from the get go when Rocky Mountain/WTB teased us last year, and it's great to see the other tire manufacturers getting on board! My WTB TB 2.8's are on their way, and I look forward to trying some of the other offerings down the road!


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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

mhelander said:


> I've got my carbon B 36/30.8mm rim but have had tough times finding any B+ tires from EU area. WTB has shop here but no stock for Trailblazer like in US. Anyone hints ?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk





DeeEight said:


> ebay


No luck. Then these are in stock when ordering spokes to that wheel from bike24... Now both are on their way.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Update: Who needs boost. ...Meet my Carver "Surly" 



r1Gel said:


> Haha! Way to keep us in suspense
> 'looking forward to the build. Do keep us posted.
> cheers


----------



## tundratrader (Mar 5, 2010)

awai04 said:


> Update: Who needs boost. ...Meet my Carver "Surly"


That is awesome!


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Thanks!



tundratrader said:


> That is awesome!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

A guy at the local bike co-op let me test out his Krampus yesterday. My first impression was that it was fun, but not in a nimble, wheelie, manual, kinda of way. It was fun in a just point it at things and see what stops it, kind of way. 

I still think that B+ will be a far more versatile tire for those who want the high grip-high volume of the "plus" format, but they still want long travel full suspension. 

The Trek Stache+ really puts a wrench into things with its 420mm chainstays and the ability to go as a short as 405mm with B+. I bet that thing is a whole lotta fun.


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## mxer (May 27, 2006)

I agree PHeller!That new Stache will be incredible with 29+ and short stays.I love my Yelli but having that same basic geo with the 3.0 tires has me eyeing a new ride!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

One thing that isn't attractive is the boost crap. 

I wonder if I couldn't get a chinese titanium frame builder to use the raised chainstay idea to do something similar, with a 142 rear and 73mm BB.


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## SS Hack (Jan 20, 2012)

Copying is what the Chinese do best.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> I wonder if I couldn't get a chinese titanium frame builder to use the raised chainstay idea to do something similar, with a 142 rear and 73mm BB.


X2

(68mm would be even better)


----------



## bubba13 (Nov 30, 2009)

PHeller said:


> A guy at the local bike co-op let me test out his Krampus yesterday. My first impression was that it was fun, but not in a nimble, wheelie, manual, kinda of way. It was fun in a just point it at things and see what stops it, kind of way.
> 
> I still think that B+ will be a far more versatile tire for those who want the high grip-high volume of the "plus" format, but they still want long travel full suspension.
> 
> The Trek Stache+ really puts a wrench into things with its 420mm chainstays and the ability to go as a short as 405mm with B+. I bet that thing is a whole lotta fun.


Set a Krampus up like mine and the "nimble, wheelie, manual, kinda way" is the way. :thumbsup:

Short stem (60mm Thompson) riser bar (Deity CZ38) and suspension fork (MRP Stage 130mm)

Sorry for the non 650 b+ content.


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Anyone tried order the trax fatty 27.5 x 3" from http://shop.veetireco.com/?
I see that it's possible to put it in the cart now. This wasn't an option earlier.


----------



## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

Tor said:


> Anyone tried order the trax fatty 27.5 x 3" from http://shop.veetireco.com/?
> I see that it's possible to put it in the cart now. This wasn't an option earlier.


huh... I tried two days ago and got an "out of stock" message. Seems like a good time to order. The 3.25 rubs the stays on my bike, been waiting for the 3!


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

When I was waiting on getting my 27.5 x 3.25 tires once I could put them in the cart I had them within a week. There weren't any signs that they were available other than being able to put them in the cart. Obsessive checking for the win!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

I also ordered the Vee 3.0 and a 2.8 the other day. I will update if they actually ship or if my order gets cancelled.


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## moses667 (Sep 8, 2014)

*The Trax Fatty's Should Be Shipping...*

Just received the Vee 27.5+ announcement saying come buy 'em, all widths, so should be shipping...


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

Contemplating selling my B+ tires - a pair of Trailblazers, and One Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 tire. Trailblazers have been mounted to test for fit, Trax Fatty is brand new.........I also have a 16.5" OS Bikes Blackbuck frame that I was going to B+ that I'd also consider selling. PM me if interested and maybe we can work out a deal. I have a torn rotator cuff in my right shoulder and a bad left shoulder that has kept me off the bike for quite a bit........I may be better off with some type of front suspension or full suspension rig to help take some of the edge off the old shoulders. I can also be emailed at mmcg25 AT gmail DOT com

Cheers,

Mark


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I do like my 3.25's, but a set of 2.8's might be nice...

Isn't interesting how Vee Rubber, a virtual unknown, is able to create tires that fill more than one niche (microniche) 

I have a 36er tire that Vee Rubber made on a commission, it uses the same tread design and it works great, so it's no surprise that the Trax Fatty is a good tire.

I'd like to see something like the Floater in a 650 x 3".



moses667 said:


> Just received the Vee 27.5+ announcement saying come buy 'em, all widths, so should be shipping...
> 
> View attachment 984695


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## phantom_309 (Jan 12, 2007)

*Banshee Paradox v2 27+ is a go!*

Posted this in the 27+ compatible thread, but i'll post here too for any with this frame thinking of building (plus I'm super proud on it!:thumbsup
Carbon cycle hookless rims 35mm (very happy with these, seal up so smooth) - tons of space in frame.
Fork is RS 29er sektor 130mm


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

So I sold my Scraper i45/Panaracer FBN fromt wheel... I'm going to run 29er front/B+ rear on my Mason for the summer. When the WTB Asym i35 comes out later this year, I may consider selling my 29er front wheel and go full B+ on the Mason.

I'm really happy with how the Mason rides with an aggressive 2.4 29er tire/Spank Oozy Trail295 up front and a WTB 2.8/Blunt35 rear.

My backup plan: my HD3 will have 29mm internal rims. So I can swap one of the upcoming, more aggressive 2.8-3.0" B+ tires on to the HD3's front wheel and use that as my winter front wheel on the Mason. I'm basically looking for something that will help extend the riding season.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

So, I got my 27.5 x 3.5 FBN's and test mounted them to my Nextie 50mm rims. The width came out to 74mm (just under 3") @ 20psi. I'm a little disappointed in the actual vs. stated size. Diameter is virtually identical to my 26 x 4 Escalators. Weight is 720g each.


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## Tonggi (May 4, 2013)

Is it just me or can you order those Vee Rubber Trax Fatty off their site? Doesn't show as out of stock? Was thinking of doing the 27.5*3.00 as a front tire. Curious how itll fit on a nextie rim on a Pike. The rear will have a trail blazer to play it safe with fitment.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Smaller Trax Fatty tires arrived!*

My Vee Trax Fatty 3.0 and 2.8 tires arrived yesterday! I imagine others who ordered will get theirs soon as well. I have not even unpacked them, so have no idea on the actual sizes or weights yet, hopefully in the next day or 2.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

bikeny said:


> My Vee Trax Fatty 3.0 and 2.8 tires arrived yesterday! I imagine others who ordered will get theirs soon as well. I have not even unpacked them, so have no idea on the actual sizes or weights yet, hopefully in the next day or 2.
> View attachment 986465


^ Tease. ^

Hey - when you do post more, I'm also hoping to hear your thoughts regarding the FatBNimble on your Spaceframe. (Unless you already discussed this, and I missed a post somewhere.) I'm still curious how it compares to 2.4 29er wheel as much as these other B+ tires, and I got the feeling that this one was a good happy medium, clearance-wise, between the 2.8 WTB and 3.25 V tires. Now that you've had time to ride it, is the height adequate, or does it feel too short, and does it change the handling noticeably? I get the feeling you're pretty committed to the switch to B+, but still appreciate hearing your impressions.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> ^ Tease. ^
> 
> Hey - when you do post more, I'm also hoping to hear your thoughts regarding the FatBNimble on your Spaceframe. (Unless you already discussed this, and I missed a post somewhere.) I'm still curious how it compares to 2.4 29er wheel as much as these other B+ tires, and I got the feeling that this one was a good happy medium, clearance-wise, between the 2.8 WTB and 3.25 V tires. Now that you've had time to ride it, is the height adequate, or does it feel too short, and does it change the handling noticeably? I get the feeling you're pretty committed to the switch to B+, but still appreciate hearing your impressions.


OK, quick update time: It turns out that the Fat B Nimble is little too big after all. It fit fine at first, but as expected, after some riding it has grown by a couple of millimeters. I have about 100 miles on it, and really like the tire overall, but I can get it to rub during hard cornering or standing climbing. That's actually why I ordered the smaller Vee tires, to see how they compare size wise. I am currently running a Vee 3.25 on the front, and both are mounted to Derby 40mm wide(outside) rims. The Vee and Panaracer are very different tires: The Vee has thicker sidewalls and chunkier knobs, whereas the Panaracer is thinner with smaller wider spaced knobs. Traction on both has been great; I actually think as tires get up to this size, the tread pattern makes less of a difference than size and pressure.

As far as the ride goes, it's pretty much what I expected. They don't have the awesome rollover of a full 29+ tire and get hung up a bit more in rock gardens and such. On the flip side, they are quicker to react in the tight techy stuff: easier to change direction and accelerate. Traction and comfort are almost as good as 29+. The only downside on the Jones is BB height. With the Vee and Panaracer and the EBB pretty close to 12:00, BB height is right about 12". That's with no weight on the bike, so while riding it's a bit lower. For my local riding, that's a bit too low and I have to be mindful of crank position in the rocky sections.

I am actually getting a 29er wheelset ready to mount on the Jones to compare to the 27+. Rims are Nextie 50mm wide(outside), and tires are the biggest I can fit. Front is a Fat B Nimble 29+, which is one of the smaller 29+ tires and seems to fit my older 100mm spaced truss fork well(a Knard did not fit with this rim). Rear tire is a NOS 2.4 Schwalbe Racing Ralph (one of the biggest 29er tires around), which just about maxes out the rear as well. No rides yet on this setup, hopefully tomorrow I can get out. I'm interested to see how this setup compares, as it's somewhat between 29+ and 27+ and will get my BB a bit higher.

In the meantime, I will also see how the new Vee tires measure out compared to the others.


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## smudge (Jan 12, 2004)

bikeny said:


> OK, quick update time: It turns out that the Fat B Nimble is little too big after all. It fit fine at first, but as expected, after some riding it has grown by a couple of millimeters. I have about 100 miles on it, and really like the tire overall, but I can get it to rub during hard cornering or standing climbing. That's actually why I ordered the smaller Vee tires, to see how they compare size wise. I am currently running a Vee 3.25 on the front, and both are mounted to Derby 40mm wide(outside) rims. The Vee and Panaracer are very different tires: The Vee has thicker sidewalls and chunkier knobs, whereas the Panaracer is thinner with smaller wider spaced knobs. Traction on both has been great; I actually think as tires get up to this size, the tread pattern makes less of a difference than size and pressure.
> 
> As far as the ride goes, it's pretty much what I expected. They don't have the awesome rollover of a full 29+ tire and get hung up a bit more in rock gardens and such. On the flip side, they are quicker to react in the tight techy stuff: easier to change direction and accelerate. Traction and comfort are almost as good as 29+. The only downside on the Jones is BB height. With the Vee and Panaracer and the EBB pretty close to 12:00, BB height is right about 12". That's with no weight on the bike, so while riding it's a bit lower. For my local riding, that's a bit too low and I have to be mindful of crank position in the rocky sections.
> 
> ...


How wide are your FatBNimbles now? I've got one (a 3.5) on a Derby rim that's been inflated to 35psi and after a week it's still at 2.8" wide. I'm trying to get a good handle on how wide this thing is going to be before I finalize the chainstay design on this next bunch of frames.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

smudge said:


> How wide are your FatBNimbles now? I've got one (a 3.5) on a Derby rim that's been inflated to 35psi and after a week it's still at 2.8" wide. I'm trying to get a good handle on how wide this thing is going to be before I finalize the chainstay design on this next bunch of frames.


My tire has a little over 100 miles on it, and now measures about 74mm casing & 72mm knob width. That's at 14psi on a Derby rim. From my experience, tires don't come up to full width just sitting on a rim inflated, they need to be ridden.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

smudge said:


> How wide are your FatBNimbles now? I've got one (a 3.5) on a Derby rim that's been inflated to 35psi and after a week it's still at 2.8" wide. I'm trying to get a good handle on how wide this thing is going to be before I finalize the chainstay design on this next bunch of frames.


Mine are at 76 Casing/71 knobs @ 12psi after a coupla rides. They're on 50mm Nextie rims.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

SmooveP said:


> Mine are at 76 Casing/71 knobs @ 12psi after a coupla rides. They're on 50mm Nextie rims.


Pretty much same size here on same rims. Not sure where the 3.5 designation comes from..... maybe because when you ride they squish out that much?!

I like the tires though, nice ride.


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## smudge (Jan 12, 2004)

woah, that's a pretty substantial change. Thanks for the Beta guys.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

smudge said:


> woah, that's a pretty substantial change. Thanks for the Beta guys.


70 - 72 is about where you are to outside of knobs.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

radair said:


> Pretty much same size here on same rims. Not sure where the 3.5 designation comes from..... maybe because when you ride they squish out that much?!
> 
> I like the tires though, nice ride.


Yeah, half an inch is pretty far off. That said, I like them too. Traction is good, no weird handling quirks, and they're fast. I do miss the cush of my 4" tires, though. I've run them between 10 and 12 psi, but I feel like I could go lower. What pressure is everyone else using? I'm around 155 lbs for reference.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

I'm about the same weight as you. I like that 10-12 psi range also. Ran my rear tire higher on last night's ride and it was fine but like the climbing traction at 10 or so.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

SmooveP said:


> Yeah, half an inch is pretty far off. That said, I like them too. Traction is good, no weird handling quirks, and they're fast. I do miss the cush of my 4" tires, though. I've run them between 10 and 12 psi, but I feel like I could go lower. What pressure is everyone else using? I'm around 155 lbs for reference.


I am only running the FBN in the back, and I settled on 14psi, but I weight around 190. The Vee 3.25 in the front is down to 10.5psi, and I think I can go a bit lower still.


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## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

WTB is expecting additional inventory around the end of June 2015.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Are the Trax Fatty 2.8s a REAL 2.8 (in tread and casing) or are they a conversion tire like the Trailblazer that's a 2.8 casing with a narrower tread ?


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## sarah morin (May 8, 2015)

I'm planning on getting a 27.5 x 3.25 tire, can you give me alittle advice to have best one please ?


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I have a Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 and I would consider it a 3.0 tire. When I first mounted them on Nextie 50mm rims they measured around 75mm wide at both casing and knobs, I haven't measured them again after riding them. I would imagine that the 2.8s would be proportionally smaller.


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## Tonggi (May 4, 2013)

anyone looking for Trail Blazer tires? I did an impulse buy and bought two. (without wheels yet) but have decided to sell my trans am 29er for a 650b hard tail. I can't deny it anymore how much I love riding 650b compared to 29. I want to be on a proper bike in the future in case the 650b+ doesnt work out.

PM me if interested, no biggie otherwise. Ill have to put on ebay. : (


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

DeeEight said:


> Trailblazer that's a 2.8 casing with a narrower tread ?


Trailblazer is well under 2.5" on i25 rim


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

The price drops have begun... found a store on ebay in the USA that had the Trailblazers listed for $44US each. Ordered a pair and with USPS priority shipping to canada it came out to be about $120USD.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Any suggestions on what's currently (or to be released soon) best 2.8 B+ tire for sandy, dry and loose conditions? Just recently moved to Flagstaff, AZ and my old Neo-Moto 2.3's aren't cutting it on these trails.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

The Panaracer Fat B Nimbles are proving to be a good choice. They come out to an even 3" on a 50mm rim. Light, fast and great traction.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

SmooveP said:


> The Panaracer Fat B Nimbles are proving to be a good choice. They come out to an even 3" on a 50mm rim. Light, fast and great traction.


What do you have them on? Outer diameter? They are still tough to find. Looking to build a B+ setup for my Bucksaw. What hubs did you use?


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

AZMB'er said:


> What do you have them on? Outer diameter? They are still tough to find. Looking to build a B+ setup for my Bucksaw. What hubs did you use?


Nextie rims. 50mm outer, 45mm inner. I used Hope hubs. I lucked out and scored the tires from some dude on the Fatbike Trader FB group.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

SmooveP said:


> Nextie rims. 50mm outer, 45mm inner. I used Hope hubs. I lucked out and scored the tires from some dude on the Fatbike Trader FB group.


Sorry, I wasn't clear. Are they on your Bucksaw? What is the outer tire dia and how did it affect your bottom bracket height? I may have found a couple also, supposed to ship Mon, we'll see.


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

AZMB'er said:


> Sorry, I wasn't clear. Are they on your Bucksaw? What is the outer tire dia and how did it affect your bottom bracket height? I may have found a couple also, supposed to ship Mon, we'll see.


They're on my hardtail: http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/twenty2-cycles-ti-bully-27-5-trim-967182.html
Diameter is nearly identical to my 26 x 4 tires (Escalators).


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

AZMB'er said:


> Sorry, I wasn't clear. Are they on your Bucksaw? What is the outer tire dia and how did it affect your bottom bracket height? I may have found a couple also, supposed to ship Mon, we'll see.


I have the same tires & rims as SmooveP on my BS. Slightly smaller (3/16" to 1/4" max) diameter than new Nates on ML rims. No noticeable difference in BB height; no pedal strike issues. I think these are really good tires for a variety of conditions.


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

radair said:


> I have the same tires & rims as SmooveP on my BS. Slightly smaller (3/16" to 1/4" max) diameter than new Nates on ML rims. No noticeable difference in BB height; no pedal strike issues. I think these are really good tires for a variety of conditions.


Good to know, thanks for the info! Could always use the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 to raise the BB a little also. What hubs are you using? Looking into options.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Any suggestions on what's currently (or to be released soon) best 2.8 B+ tire for sandy, dry and loose conditions? Just recently moved to Flagstaff, AZ and my old Neo-Moto 2.3's aren't cutting it on these trails.


I'd wait for the upcoming Specialized Purgatory 2.8. That'll be my next B+ front tire (along with their Ground Control 2.8 rear).

Hell, if the Big S made a 2.8 Butcher I'd buy it!


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## qsysuser (May 3, 2015)

06HokieMTB said:


> Good to know, thanks for the info! Could always use the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 to raise the BB a little also. What hubs are you using? Looking into options.


Same thing here..Trying to decide between FBN vs VTrax 27.5+ while waiting for my Nextie 27.5+ 50mm. I will be using I9 hubs.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

AZMB'er said:


> Good to know, thanks for the info! Could always use the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x3.25 to raise the BB a little also. What hubs are you using? Looking into options.


Sorry, missed this question. I went with I9 hubs, figuring if you're going to go with high zoot carbon rims you might as well go all out. Nicest wheels I've ever owned. The FBNs are sweet tires, light & tacky.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anybody know if the 3.0" tire will fit a 15x100 Pike 275 on a narrower rim?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

FBN was no where close to fitting in my Pike 27.5, due to height, not width. Tire hit the arch, and wheel wouldn't roll.

EDIT: that was on a Scraper i45, but a narrow rim will affect width way more than it affects height.

(sorry for the sideways picture. don't know how to change it)


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Ok, 2.8 it is then, I suppose. Just sucks because most of the good tires seem to be in the 3.0 range.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Depends on the 2.8... so far only the trailblazer is specifically known as a conversion tire, because its 2.8 in casing width, NOT tread width... that's why it fits into 29er forks that were only designed for 2.5 width tires. But if the other tire makers do their 2.8s in full tread widths, then they won't fit either because again the brace clearance won't be there for the majority of 29er forks. If you want actual good width tires then you either track down one of the handful of 29er fork models that accept them, play the rim profile game to change how it inflates, or wait for the B+ forks to go into production and reach dealer showrooms, but those will all require new hubs.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone know the outside diameter of a 29x2.5 vs B+ in 3.0? For instance, on these upcoming "Plus" forks like the Marz 350+, could I run a 29x2.5 tire?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

PHeller said:


> Anyone know the outside diameter of a 29x2.5 vs B+ in 3.0? For instance, on these upcoming "Plus" forks like the Marz 350+, could I run a 29x2.5 tire?


I have no idea about your fork questions, but the Trailblazer is not the only 2.8 tire available. The Vee Trax Fatty is now available in 3.0" and 2.8". I don't know the actual width or height, but they will be smaller than the 3.25" version. They can be ordered from the Vee web shop.


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## IvanMTB (Sep 28, 2007)

bikeny said:


> I am only running the FBN in the back, and I settled on 14psi, but I weight around 190. The Vee 3.25 in the front is down to 10.5psi, and I think I can go a bit lower still.


Would you mind checking what is actual diameter of 3.25 Vee tire?

Toying with idea of putting it onto my Whyte T-129S but not sure if 140mm forks is not going to rise front end too much...

Cheers!
I.


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Is there a list of standard 29er forks which takes a 3" wheel. I need to buy a new fork for my 29er I have a pike and now thinking which one I should take for the 2nd bike. B+ is planed soon so I want to be prepared, but I don't want to pay the new standard now.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

PHeller said:


> Ok, 2.8 it is then, I suppose. Just sucks because most of the good tires seem to be in the 3.0 range.


Started this so riders will get a much closer idea of tire compatibility -

http://forums.mtbr.com/wheels-tires/bead-bead-mtb-tire-measurement-959767.html#post11855777


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Thanks Deerhill.


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## AZDUSTER (Apr 8, 2014)

Any measurements on the Vee trax fatty 27.5x3.0 tire mounted on 35mm internal width rims. Width and Total circumference.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I just got my set of Trailblazers, on the same 20mm internal rims as I used to check my Vee T-F 3.25s on (which inflated to 2.8 casing/2.9 tread) they've now stretched to 61.9mm casing after 2 hours at 35psi. Initially they were 59.8mm casing when I first inflated them. However in diameter they went from the initial 28.25" down now to about 28.15", so as they widen they definitely shrink. I'm building some 24mm internal carbon rims up so I'll see how they do in the wider rims but I suspect while they might pick up another tenth of an inch in casing width, its going to come with another tenth of an inch reduction in diameter. I'm starting to wonder if there's any real point to these tires other than in actually being amongst the only WTB models to achieve the rated tread section width in practical riding terms (the tire is stamped as a 57-584 tread section width, and you don't need 60PSI to get that tread width) and using them in regular 650B frames/forks as they're shrinking down to the diameters of existing 650B x 2.35/2.4s from Maxxis and Schwable and Kenda (among others).


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

20-24mm internal rims are too narrow. WTB says i25 is the minimum. Having ridden that, really something like 29-30mm internal should be considered the minimum.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

I am aware of what WTB recommends for their NOT actually a 2.8 tire, but 20mm is actually well within the realm of inside rim width to tire width ratios. I run 19mm rims with actual 2.4 29er tires and that works fine.


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## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

DeeEight said:


> I am aware of what WTB recommends for their NOT actually a 2.8 tire, but 20mm is actually well within the realm of inside rim width to tire width ratios. I run 19mm rims with actual 2.4 29er tires and that works fine.


At 19mm internal rim width, you are not getting the real benefit of the B+ tires. No one said you couldn't run 19, but its not going to be the same ride quality as a 30mm or 45mm internal width rim.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

What's the weight comparison between the Trailblazer 2.8 and the Hans Dampf or Magic Mary 2.4's? I want the lightest/tallest 650b high volume tire I can get without being paper thin casings. 

I was thinking of getting the Trailblazer but it looks like on paper there are several tougher/lighter options out there in roughly the same height range.


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

bikeny said:


> My Vee Trax Fatty 3.0 and 2.8 tires arrived yesterday! I imagine others who ordered will get theirs soon as well. I have not even unpacked them, so have no idea on the actual sizes or weights yet, hopefully in the next day or 2.
> View attachment 986465


Did you ever get around to inflating these to measure actual sizes ?


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## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

My TBs were 909g and 857g each. Hans's typically run in the 850g range for virtually the same diameter and tread width, when mounted to things like Blunts. I'd much rather fit a Hans to a wider rim than a trailblazer. WTB should have been more honest and labeled these things as 2.5s or something. I didn't mount the TBs to anything other than my spare wheelset because I don't intend to run them myself. My VTF 3.25s are for my fat bike, not for a B+ bike. I simply fit them, stuck the wheels in my spearfish and took it for a quick spin to see how much the BB drop affected the bike as far as pedal strikes/clearing logs was concerned. The wheels have already come off the spearfish after one ride because its pointless to me to go up 2 pounds in tire/wheel weight just to get a tiny bit of air volume gain. If I ran wire-bead 29er tires and heavy wheels maybe the conversion swap could be justified, but I don't.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Did you ever get around to inflating these to measure actual sizes ?


Unfortunately, no I have not. Some travel for work and other projects have gotten in the way. I'm hoping to mount the 3.0 this weekend.


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## Deerhill (Dec 21, 2009)

QUOTE=PHeller;11990000]What's the weight comparison between the Trailblazer 2.8 and the Hans Dampf or Magic Mary 2.4's? I want the lightest/tallest 650b high volume tire I can get without being paper thin casings.

I was thinking of getting the Trailblazer but it looks like on paper there are several tougher/lighter options out there in roughly the same height range.[/QUOTE]

At that weight you might have to choose between less volume w/ taller tread vs more volume w/ short tread.. MM front, TB rear has been doing ok on hard tail rocky dh. It takes a few runs to figure safe rim psi, you can see the "travel" used when the rocks mark the sidewall. Personally I would not want the sidewalls out past the side lugs so these are staying on the i25

QUOTE=DeeEight;11990271]My TBs were 909g and 857g each. Hans's typically run in the 850g range for virtually the same diameter and tread width, when mounted to things like Blunts. I'd much rather fit a Hans to a wider rim than a trailblazer. WTB should have been more honest and labeled these things as 2.5s or something. I didn't mount the TBs to anything other than my spare wheelset because I don't intend to run them myself. My VTF 3.25s are for my fat bike, not for a B+ bike. I simply fit them, stuck the wheels in my spearfish and took it for a quick spin to see how much the BB drop affected the bike as far as pedal strikes/clearing logs was concerned. The wheels have already come off the spearfish after one ride because its pointless to me to go up 2 pounds in tire/wheel weight just to get a tiny bit of air volume gain. If I ran wire-bead 29er tires and heavy wheels maybe the conversion swap could be justified, but I don't.[/QUOTE]

It feels like a smoother climbing option for 650b bike.. does well to take the edge off low speed


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

boblike said:


> Is there a list of standard 29er forks which takes a 3" wheel. I need to buy a new fork for my 29er I have a pike and now thinking which one I should take for the 2nd bike. B+ is planed soon so I want to be prepared, but I don't want to pay the new standard now.


No one has a recommendation?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

boblike said:


> No one has a recommendation?


Sorry boblike, I don't own any suspension forks. There is a thread call 'Krampus with front suspension' or something like that that should give you some leads.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

So I finally got some time to play around with the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.0 and 2.8 ties, and was a little surprised by what I found.

Quick recap: I'm running B+in a Jones Ti Spaceframe and trying to find the biggest tires that safely fit. I an running Derby rims that measure 40mm outside width and 34mm inside width. I'm running a Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 in the front, and that fit's fine. That tire is way too big for the back though. I originally tried the WTB Trailblazer which fit with room to spare, so I was searching for something bigger. Next I tried the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5 x 3.5 (really more like a 3.0). When I first mounted it, it looked like the perfect fit, but after some ride time, it stretched quite a bit and would rub the chainstays during hard cornering and standing climbing. So when I saw the Vee 3.0 and 2.8 were available, I bought one of each to try out.

First up, the 3.0. Put it on the scale, and it weighs 1003 grams! Wow, that's heavier than the 3.25 version I have on the back, which is 963g. Next I laid it out flat and measured the bead to bead distance at 194mm, bigger than everything except the 3.25 Vee. Seems that is also going to bee too big for the Jones, bummer.

Next up was the 2.8 version. On the scale it measures 857 grams, much better. B-B measurement is 187mm. This one seems to have a better chance of fitting the Jones, so I mounted it on the Derby rim. After inflating to 30 PSI, it measures 71.5mm at the casing and the knobs.

Couple of other notes: The Panaracer initially measured 184mm B-B, but when I took it off last night I remeasured it and came up with 190mm! That's after about 100 miles of trail time. It is also quite stretchy, so if I pull it it gets even bigger. I assume that's why it grew so much after some ride time. Also, the sidewalls are much thinner than the Vee tires, so I expect them to stretch less.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

boblike said:


> No one has a recommendation?


This thread http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-frame-compatibility-thread-post-your-setup-957906.html is also a good place to look. But it's hard to make fork recommendations without a specific wheel and tire you plan to use. I've used an X-Fusion Slide with an FBN 27.5x3.5 mounted on a Velocity Blunt 35 which hasn't had rubbing issues, but the same fork and wheel did not have enough clearance for a VTF 3.25. The guys at twentynineinches.com fit a VTF 3.25 into a DT Swiss OPM ODL (could not fit it into the Fox, Rock Shox, or Magura Forks they tried) and I think I've seen a picture of the VTF in an MRP Stage, so I'd start with those two if looking for forks with big clearance.


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## vikb (Sep 7, 2008)

PHeller said:


> What's the weight comparison between the Trailblazer 2.8 and the Hans Dampf or Magic Mary 2.4's? I want the lightest/tallest 650b high volume tire I can get without being paper thin casings.
> 
> I was thinking of getting the Trailblazer but it looks like on paper there are several tougher/lighter options out there in roughly the same height range.












I have been using HDs for a year now. I can measure the height if you need that. They weight ~800g. Awesome grip when new, but I am finding even using the hard compound meant for rear tires that I am ripping the cornering knobs off on the back tire too early. Given that it's an expensive tire a short lifespan makes them unaffordable.

I'm going to put Conti Trail Kings in 2.4" width on there next. They are more like a 2.%" tire and definitely the tallest/widest of the "normal" trail tires I've used/seen. They are very durable, roll well and provide great traction. But they'll come in ~950g so they are not crazy light if that's what you are after.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Vik,

I'm tempted to try the Ardent based On One Chunky Monkey 650b or I may hold out for the Trailboss based WTB Riddler 2.4.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Ya all need to stop talking at 29er and Ardents and the like, this thread is getting long and we need some focus!

So, can anyone help recap what tires are available in a 27.5 B+ format and provide time frame for new tires in the pipeline?

Available:
Fat B Nimbler, 3.5, B2B - 190mm, Wt - 850 gms
Vee Rubber Trax Fatty 3.25, B - B?, Wt - 950-1005 gms
Vee Rubber Trax Fatty 3.00, B2B - 194mm, Wt - 1000 gms
Vee Rubber Trax Fatty 2.80, B2B - 187mm, Wt - 900 gms
WTB Trailblazer 2.8, B - B?, Wt - 950gms

Expected:
Bontrager
Specialized
WTB
Maxxis
Continental
Surly
Schwalbe
Others?


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## PCT (Jun 29, 2009)

Think I saw a 27.5 x 3.8 on the new Trek fatbike at Sea Otter. It was stuck in a gigantic snow globe to protect from drool. They said it'd be available in August but maybe that's optimistic.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Nurse Ben said:


> Ya all need to stop talking at 29er and Ardents and the like, this thread is getting long and we need some focus!
> 
> So, can anyone help recap what tires are available in a 27.5 B+ format and provide time frame for new tires in the pipeline?
> 
> ...


Or, instead of complaining, you could go read this thread:

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-tire-bead-bead-measurements-972235.html

Upcoming tires that I have heard of:

Specialized Ground Control 3.0
Specialized Purgatory 3.0
Maxxis Chronicle, 3.0
WTB Bridger 3.0, TCS Tough & TCS Light casings
Schwalbe Rocket Ron, 2.8 & 3.0
Schwalbe Nobby Nic, 2.8 & 3.0
Kenda Havok 3.0

That's all I've seen, there may be others, so feel free to post them up.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

StinkyP said:


> Think I saw a 27.5 x 3.8 on the new Trek fatbike at Sea Otter. It was stuck in a gigantic snow globe to protect from drool. They said it'd be available in August but maybe that's optimistic.


I think it's even a 27.5 x 4.0, and it's on the new version of the Farley fatbike. Clearly a fatbike product, not a plus size tire. Interesting non the less!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

bikeny said:


> Or, instead of complaining, you could go read this thread:
> 
> http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-tire-bead-bead-measurements-972235.html
> 
> ...


Awesome, I hadn't seen that thread!

I used B to B measurements a few years ago when comparing tires for muni, glad it's caught on, it really is a better way to compare tires.

I rode my Mutz last night with the Vee TF 3.25's, they are pretty good tires for dry, but they are kinda big and wieldy, it might be time for a change, but I don't want to drop $$ to get a narrower version. I'd prefer to buy a tire that has a little more knobby like the DW...so I'm waiting.


----------



## DeeEight (Jan 13, 2004)

Pinkbike has a review of the new Scott Plus bikes and they use the Nobby Nic 2.8s on Syncros i40 rims.


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

Those schwalbes give me a boner.


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## laffeaux (Jan 4, 2004)

DeeEight said:


> Pinkbike has a review of the new Scott Plus bikes and they use the Nobby Nic 2.8s on Syncros i40 rims.


The Nobby Nic looks like it might be a good option for me. I've used Schwalbe's Racing Ralph 27.5 tire in the past and like it other than it seems to wear extremely quickly (too quickly given the cost of buying a new pair). Do the non plus-size Nobby Nics last longer?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

The NN 2.8 looks like it'll be my next B+ front tire! Nice knobs, good side walls, not huge volume so plenty of mud clearance in a Pike 29er fork

I'm sure it'll be expensive and rarer than hen's teeth for a while


----------



## dustyduke22 (Aug 22, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> The Nobby Nic looks like it might be a good option for me. I've used Schwalbe's Racing Ralph 27.5 tire in the past and like it other than it seems to wear extremely quickly (too quickly given the cost of buying a new pair). Do the non plus-size Nobby Nics last longer?


I dont think they are actually available yet. This is the first bike I have actually seen them on. I suspect they would last pretty similar to the others.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Honestly, I would love to try out 27.5+... expect I would want to keep it. Remember the first time going from 1.95" xc tires to 2.35" casing tires & lower pressure and the entire bike was 1000% more awesome. Sure, a bit less nimble, but the ability to plow through ruts and crap just made everything more fun. I imagine 27.5+ would just take things further in that direction!


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

How wide are these tires and what is the radius?

I really am interested in squeezing this size onto my Bronson but I suspect it just won't clear in the rear.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Suns_PSD said:


> I really am interested in squeezing this size onto my Bronson but I suspect it just won't clear in the rear.


Sorry, it won't. I tried on a Bronson C.


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## Suns_PSD (Dec 13, 2013)

Thank you very much for that info.

I know that Maxxis is releasing AM tires in 2-5-2.6 tires within a couple of months. I wonder if we could combine that tire size with say a Derby wheel and get a lot of the plus size benefit and keep our existing bikes?

I'm a big believer in the plus sizes and I want that advantage on AM rides.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

NH Mtbiker said:


> Honestly, I would love to try out 27.5+... expect I would want to keep it. Remember the first time going from 1.95" xc tires to 2.35" casing tires & lower pressure and the entire bike was 1000% more awesome. Sure, a bit less nimble, but the ability to plow through ruts and crap just made everything more fun. I imagine 27.5+ would just take things further in that direction!


It is just as you imagine, except not less nimble (in my case). FBNs on carbon rims are way quicker than Nates on Marge Lites.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

View attachment 997312








My custom bike packing / local trail riding rig.
I had fatbike on my mind for few years but
My troubled knees can not take 100mm BB:s and i do not like slow steering of fatbikes.

I have noticed that some people are dissing the new tyre sizes, but i am very thankful of this smaller plus size.

Geometry
Headtube 120mm
ETT 570mm
headtube angle 70°, seat tube angle 72.5°
BB drop 70mm
Chainstay lenght 435mm
83bb widht
183mm q-factor with 170 rear
Fork lenght 445 with 53 mm Rake

The frame was build from Reynolds 853 by local builder kongabicycles. the builder was fantastic to work with!

Big thanks to MTBR member Ferrstein for BB/crank idea!

I am extremely happy with the bikes handling, and this could not have been achieved with 26 or 29 rims.

I am waiting (dreaming really) for a fastrolling 27.5x4 tyres. Something like HuDus or fastrolling offerings from Schwalbe.

The 3.25 vee trax fattyes have awesome grip but they have huge rolling resistance with low pressures.


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

rikardo said:


> View attachment 997312
> 
> View attachment 997361
> 
> ...


very nice job on that. I ran across it on flickr and faved a while ago. 
70 mm of drop sounds like a lot for a bike like that though, do you have any issues with pedal strike?

mike


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

rikardo said:


> and i do not like slow steering of fatbikes.
> 
> I am waiting (dreaming really) for a fastrolling 27.5x4 tyres. Something like HuDus or fastrolling offerings from Schwalbe.
> 
> The 3.25 vee trax fattyes have awesome grip but they have huge rolling resistance with low pressures.


Im confused. You don't like slow steering and slow rolling tires on fat bikes, yet want a 27.5x4" tire?


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

D


senor_mikey said:


> very nice job on that. I ran across it on flickr and faved a while ago.
> 70 mm of drop sounds like a lot for a bike like that though, do you have any issues with pedal strike?
> 
> mike


I have 165mm cranks and i would not recommend it with longer cranks. I still do have to adapt a bit and still sometimes have a pedal strike, but i just love it for super techy trialsy staff. 
In winter with lots of snow, i prefer skiing anyway.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

06HokieMTB said:


> Im confused. You don't like slow steering and slow rolling tires on fat bikes, yet want a 27.5x4" tire?


Do no get confused.
It is just something i really would like to try.
Nextie vee traxx fatty combo feels quite close to fast steering 29er , wich is nice and probably that is lost with a 4inch rubber.
But for some situations it would probably work very well.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

rikardo said:


> I am waiting (dreaming really) for a fastrolling 27.5x4 tyres.
> .


See 2016 Trek Farley.

Although now we are talking Fat bikes, not Plus bikes.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

bikeny said:


> See 2016 Trek Farley.
> 
> Although now we are talking Fat bikes, not Plus bikes.


You are right with that fatbike/plus line.
I will check that farley tip!

Thank you for the early vee traxx fatty tyre, it helped to give me better sense, what would be possible to achieve. It is probably a pre production sample, but it is still running strong.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

rikardo said:


> You are right with that fatbike/plus line.
> I will check that farley tip!
> 
> Thank you for the early vee traxx fatty tyre, it helped to give me better sense, what would be possible to achieve. It is probably a pre production sample, but it is still running strong.


My Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 is still going strong as well! Running it on the front of my Jones on 40mm a Derby rim. I'm down to 9 psi and think I could go a bit lower. I can bash through anything with that tire, nice and burly. I just wish it would fit in the back as well! I have a 2.8 version on the back now and pretty happy with that as well.


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## brant (Jan 6, 2004)

bikeny said:


> My Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 is still going strong as well! Running it on the front of my Jones on 40mm a Derby rim. I'm down to 9 psi and think I could go a bit lower. I can bash through anything with that tire, nice and burly. I just wish it would fit in the back as well! I have a 2.8 version on the back now and pretty happy with that as well.


You think it tracks ok? I think they make good rear tyres, but front, not so great.


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## rokdad (Feb 9, 2006)

*El Mariachi 650b+ conversion*

WTB Trailblazer, Velocity Blunt 35, Salsa El Mariachi (small, 2011).
No issues. Dropped the BB by exactly 1cm. Wildly painless conversion by Monkey Wrench Cycles in Lincoln, NE.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

brant said:


> You think it tracks ok? I think they make good rear tyres, but front, not so great.


I'm not exactly sure what you mean by 'tracking', but I have nothing bad to say about it on the front. Then again, I'm not Mike C.! My trails are pretty low speed techy stuff, so I favor volume and low pressure over ultimate grip.


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## tedo (Apr 4, 2012)

brant said:


> You think it tracks ok? I think they make good rear tyres, but front, not so great.


I have been running the 3.25 trax fatty on my Beargrease front and rear for the last 2 months. Several hundred miles on them, and are really happy with them.

And like Bikeny states, I too prefer the size, low pressure, and traction on them. If these newer 27+ wheels / tires have not come out, I would be riding 4 inch tires all year round, so I am partial to skew on the "fatter" side of rides, instead of converting a 29er...

Tires are fine for rocky, rutty, New England...


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## Hardrake (Apr 25, 2015)

I own a 2015 27.5 Yeti SB5C with 40mm Derby rims.

Can I put 2.8 tires on it and will the clearance be OK? 

Please answer yes or no and explain why.....

Thanks...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

The Trax Fatty tracks fine, I ran 3.25" on my tandem,then switched to a 29 x 3" DW and didn't notice a huge change in tracking; I did notice a huge change in friction, the DW is faster.

I now run the Trax on my Mutz, it rides well, tracks fine, though it is a lot of tire, at time it seems "sticky" which is probably due to the high friction.

It doesn't autosteer at all.


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## whichway (Feb 8, 2014)

*Ryde Trace Enduro Rims*

Anybody have experience with these rims. 29mm inner width makes them similar to Velocity Blunts.

Home / Bicycle Wheels / Bicycle Rims / Bicycle Rim 27.5 Inch / Ryde Rim Trace Enduro 29 27.5 Inch 29-584 32 Hole - Black


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

radair said:


> It is just as you imagine, except not less nimble (in my case). FBNs on carbon rims are way quicker than Nates on Marge Lites.


Good to hear! Where is that rock feature? Must ride it! Also how is the riding up in the Whites, any good? I took off from Franstead campground a few years ago and was disappointed. Rode the valley off the side of the landing strip in Franconia and could only find a few grown in snowshoe trails and some old mtn bike trails that looked to be untouched for years. Looks like it may have been awesome a decade or more ago?


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

NH Mtbiker said:


> Good to hear! Where is that rock feature? Must ride it! Also how is the riding up in the Whites, any good? I took off from Franstead campground a few years ago and was disappointed. Rode the valley off the side of the landing strip in Franconia and could only find a few grown in snowshoe trails and some old mtn bike trails that looked to be untouched for years. Looks like it may have been awesome a decade or more ago?


That rock is at Russell Mill in Chelmsford, MA. Very fun tech riding. There are loads of great riding in the Whites. I'm in the North Conway area but there is also lots of tech singletrack in Franconia - you should have checked in at Franconia Inn where Big Ring Bob has a bike shop; you were very close to lots of good stuff. They just started a new NEMBA chapter and are getting organized and expanding.

On topic, a set of 3.25 Trax Fatties arrived via the brown Santa yesterday and I am stoked to try them out this weekend.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

whichway said:


> Anybody have experience with these rims. 29mm inner width makes them similar to Velocity Blunts.
> 
> Home / Bicycle Wheels / Bicycle Rims / Bicycle Rim 27.5 Inch / Ryde Rim Trace Enduro 29 27.5 Inch 29-584 32 Hole - Black


I've got a set built up on my HD3. Running 'normal' 2.4 tires on them. Very happy.

Would be a good rear rim option for bikes with less clearance in the back, more expensive than a Blunt35, but lighter and the offset/assymetrical spoke bed is pretty slick :thumbsup:


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

radair said:


> On topic, a set of 3.25 Trax Fatties arrived via the brown Santa yesterday and I am stoked to try them out this weekend.


I think you will like them. They are heavier than the FBN, but are wider and much tougher, inspiring more confidence to bash over/though stuff! You can also run the pressure lower because of the extra width and stiffer sidewalls.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Where are you guys purchasing these 3.25's? Found em on the intertoobz for $95-$100 best price. Hope they live up to the hype cuz thats more than I have ever $$$ for tires.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

NH Mtbiker said:


> Where are you guys purchasing these 3.25's? Found em on the intertoobz for $95-$100 best price. Hope they live up to the hype cuz thats more than I have ever $$$ for tires.


That's the price of buying into brand new technology! They can be had on Ebay for bit cheaper sometimes.


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

bikeny said:


> I think you will like them. They are heavier than the FBN, but are wider and much tougher, inspiring more confidence to bash over/though stuff! You can also run the pressure lower because of the extra width and stiffer sidewalls.


I have managed to damage the FBNs enough in ~500 miles that I have to run tubes so hopefully the weigh gain will be minimal. Definitely stoked for a bit more durability.



NH Mtbiker said:


> Where are you guys purchasing these 3.25's? Found em on the intertoobz for $95-$100 best price. Hope they live up to the hype cuz thats more than I have ever $$$ for tires.


$102 each from Cool Bike Parts and Accessories from the Coast of Maine since 1976 with free shipping. I think the days of $25 bike tires are long gone!


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

bikeny said:


> but are wider and much tougher, inspiring more confidence to bash over/though stuff! You can also run the pressure lower because of the extra width and stiffer sidewalls.


hmmmm, i think yer onto something here. but don't stop there. go true fat and the ride gets even better


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

newmarketrog said:


> hmmmm, i think yer onto something here. go true fat and the ride gets even better


Hahaha, these are probably bigger than your 26+ set up with FBNs!


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## newmarketrog (Sep 26, 2008)

radair said:


> Hahaha, these are probably bigger than your 26+ set up with FBNs!


dammit! i thot youd be out riding mr quick trigger! you could be right tho!


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## tedo (Apr 4, 2012)

I'm quite happy with the 3.25 VTF. They are so close to full fat (which is a good thing). But just a hair smaller... Slightly lighter (an pound per wheel) then ML and Dillingers (which is also a good thing).

People on the trail still think its a full fat set up.

Basically it's a great setup for us Chubby Chasers!


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## AZMB'er (Oct 19, 2013)

NH Mtbiker said:


> Where are you guys purchasing these 3.25's? Found em on the intertoobz for $95-$100 best price. Hope they live up to the hype cuz thats more than I have ever $$$ for tires.


eBay has a listing for $69.99 ea + $12.99 shipping, 3 available. Might be able to combine shipping if buying 2 or more. Saves a few bucks.

Vee Rubber Trax Fatty Fat Bike Tire 27 5" x 3 25" 120TPI Folding Silica Black | eBay

Update: Looks like they changed the ad to 3.0's.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I'll sell my 3.25's once something a little more knobby is available, they're good tires, though not well suited for loose.


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## tjamscad (Jun 10, 2015)

Do the 27.5+ tires need larger wheels? I want to try them but am not interested in new wheels.


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## rsullivan (May 16, 2009)

Yes AND No. .... you can fit them on a standard rim but will have to run higher pressure to support the sidewall. The benefits of the larger tire and wider rim let's you run very low psi to achieve large amount of traction. ..


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## tjamscad (Jun 10, 2015)

rsullivan said:


> Yes AND No. .... you can fit them on a standard rim but will have to run higher pressure to support the sidewall. The benefits of the larger tire and wider rim let's you run very low psi to achieve large amount of traction. ..


I am waiting for this tire. Bridger | WTB even with a higher pressure than would normally be run in a plus size it should still be plenty of traction.


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## Pynchonite (Sep 2, 2013)

Answers my question. LET THE AWESOMENESS COMMENCE!


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

tjamscad said:


> I am waiting for this tire. Bridger | WTB even with a higher pressure than would normally be run in a plus size it should still be plenty of traction.


Treads look great....BUT how can they call it fast rolling/lightweight at over 1200 grams?? I will stick with the VTF 3.25 unitl something competede with it overall.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

1200gm is too much. If you can build a tire like the Vee 3.25 at under 1000gms, I expect something skinnier to be the same weight or less.

My Surly DW 29+ are 1000gms each and they are awesome tires, I'd take those tires in a 650b!!



NH Mtbiker said:


> Treads look great....BUT how can they call it fast rolling/lightweight at over 1200 grams?? I will stick with the VTF 3.25 unitl something competede with it overall.


----------



## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

Maxxis Cronicle 27.5+ showed up on new Orbea hardtail today

2016 Orbea Loki trail hardtail lets you get mischievous with 29er or 27.5+ wheels


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Any sources for this tire??

I'm on the waiting list in three places...

Any other choices available that are not "bloated" Trax Fatty's or "boat anchor, not as wide as advertised" WTB's?

Actually, the Trax Fatty's are okay, I think they'd be a nice tire for where I used to live (TN), places that have solid soil or rock/roots, but for the dry conditions and moondust in Central WA, I need some knobbies!



twowheelfunman said:


> Maxxis Cronicle 27.5+ showed up on new Orbea hardtail today
> 
> 2016 Orbea Loki trail hardtail lets you get mischievous with 29er or 27.5+ wheels


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

twowheelfunman said:


> Maxxis Cronicle 27.5+ showed up on new Orbea hardtail today
> 
> 2016 Orbea Loki trail hardtail lets you get mischievous with 29er or 27.5+ wheels


Looks like an Orbea Loki B+ will be my next bike!


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> Looks like an Orbea Loki B+ will be my next bike!


This or the errrrr.... Jamis Dragonslayer (for steel)

Both are well thought out bikes, but that Loki has some nice lines!

I really just want to get my paws on a pair of the Schwalbe+ tires before the snow starts to fall


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Stopbreakindown said:


> This or the Scott Dragonslayer (for steel)
> 
> Both are well thought out bikes, but that Loki has some nice lines!
> 
> I really just want to get my paws on a pair of the Schwalbe+ tires before the snow starts to fall


Do you mean the Jamis Dragonslayer?


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

bikeny said:


> Do you mean the Jamis Dragonslayer?


Doh! Yes, corrected above


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

*Vee Fattrax 2.8*



bikeny said:


> So I finally got some time to play around with the Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.0 and 2.8 ties, and was a little surprised by what I found.
> 
> Quick recap: I'm running B+in a Jones Ti Spaceframe and trying to find the biggest tires that safely fit. I an running Derby rims that measure 40mm outside width and 34mm inside width. I'm running a Vee Trax Fatty 27.5 x 3.25 in the front, and that fit's fine. That tire is way too big for the back though. I originally tried the WTB Trailblazer which fit with room to spare, so I was searching for something bigger. Next I tried the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 27.5 x 3.5 (really more like a 3.0). When I first mounted it, it looked like the perfect fit, but after some ride time, it stretched quite a bit and would rub the chainstays during hard cornering and standing climbing. So when I saw the Vee 3.0 and 2.8 were available, I bought one of each to try out.
> 
> ...


 Did you ever get an outside diameter on the Vee 2.8?


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

*275plus Specialized Tires - First Look & Weigh In*

Opened up the Purgatory and Ground Control 275plus tires from Specialized and got their weights on camera. They arent the lightest, bUT they feel like they may be more durable than others.

https://ridealongside.wordpress.com...tires-first-look-weigh-in-video/?preview=true


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Are any of these newer 27.5plus available now?


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

I bought a set of Purgatories from our LBS that is a Specialized dealer about 3 weeks ago. Great tire, mounted on derby rim tubeless easy, little heavy, rolls good on the trails but some drag on hard surfaces. Oh and good price $ 55.00 each.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

exp18 said:


> I bought a set of Purgatories from our LBS that is a Specialized dealer about 3 weeks ago. Great tire, mounted on derby rim tubeless easy, little heavy, rolls good on the trails but some drag on hard surfaces. Oh and good price $ 55.00 each.


How wide and how tall they measure on the derbys?


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

Just over 3" wide and 28 5/8 tall
Sorry i have no idea how to rotate these pictures


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Appears those 3.0" Purgs aren't too wide for the Derby's? Your sidewall doesn't look to have as much bulge as I had expected. Looks fairly proportional?

Scott/Syncro's have said that they feel 40mm (internal) is the ideal sweet spot for a trail rim with 2.8-3.0 tires. Having ridden a Blunt35 (i30) and Scraper (i45), I think I agree.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Appears those 3.0" Purgs aren't too wide for the Derby's? Your sidewall doesn't look to have as much bulge as I had expected. Looks fairly proportional?
> 
> Scott/Syncro's have said that they feel 40mm (internal) is the ideal sweet spot for a trail rim with 2.8-3.0 tires. Having ridden a Blunt35 (i30) and Scraper (i45), I think I agree.


Might be because the casing size looks quiet a bit smaller than 3".

exp18: Could you please measure the casing width?


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

06HokieMTB said:


> Scott/Syncro's have said that they feel 40mm (internal) is the ideal sweet spot for a trail rim with 2.8-3.0 tires. Having ridden a Blunt35 (i30) and Scraper (i45), I think I agree.


That's good to hear from two reputable companies. Guess I figured right by going with a 43mm internal rim mated with 3.25 tires as a slightly wider sweet spot trail wheelset! ;D


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Vee Traxx Fatty 3.25 on B+ carbon 50mm rim (43mm internal) at about 15 psi:

3.20 inches wide- tires still fairly new with around 60 miles

29 1/8 inches high - tubeless

:thumbsup:


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

The casing on a purgatory measures 
2 3/4 wide on a 40mm derby. I like the profile it protects the rim a little.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

exp18 said:


> I bought a set of Purgatories from our LBS that is a Specialized dealer about 3 weeks ago. Great tire, mounted on derby rim tubeless easy, little heavy, rolls good on the trails but some drag on hard surfaces. Oh and good price $ 55.00 each.


Where did you find them? Are they TL folding? Does your LBS have more? If yes, then please send me contact info in a PM.

I went to the Specialized dealer in my town and they said no availability until October.

I want them now!!

How does the casing compare to other tires, Ardent, HD, etc...


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Where did you find them? Are they TL folding? Does your LBS have more? If yes, then please send me contact info in a PM.
> 
> I went to the Specialized dealer in my town and they said no availability until October.
> 
> ...


I just sent you a message


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

To answer your questions 
Yes TL and folding
The side walls and casing feel very tough I only have about 75 miles on mine with no problems. 
The traction is insane especially in the corners


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## Swedentrails (Aug 12, 2015)

whichway said:


> Anybody have experience with these rims. 29mm inner width makes them similar to Velocity Blunts.
> 
> Home / Bicycle Wheels / Bicycle Rims / Bicycle Rim 27.5 Inch / Ryde Rim Trace Enduro 29 27.5 Inch 29-584 32 Hole - Black


I bought these rims for my Trailblazers. I´ll keep you updated as soon the wheels are built.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

exp18 said:


> To answer your questions
> Yes TL and folding
> The side walls and casing feel very tough I only have about 75 miles on mine with no problems.
> The traction is insane especially in the corners


Which trails/trail conditions have those 75 miles been through? I am very curious about durability/longevity of the Specialized B+ tires since they are about 200 grams heavier than some of the lightest tires in the category, namely the FBN, which hasn't proven to be a very durable tire, but the FBN is indeed very lightweight. We have some very sharp rocks here in San Diego that have managed to cut through and through the Bontrager Chupacabra 29+ tire I am running up front during a rim strike when I was testing lower psi levels (~10psi) in a very rocky section. Finding the balance of pressure, tire durability, traction and weight is a fun challenge in the plus sized tire choice game.


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

Most of the miles i have rode has been rooty single track. 
I have a set of Chupacabra's also on my 29+ i would say durable wise they are about the same.


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

This weekend i am going for a 50 mile ride that has a lot of sharp rocks and rock gardens so i will let you know how they do


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

FBN's are too light, they need to rename them: Fragile But Nimble.

I can't ride on egg shells, we have waaay to much rock in the Central Cascades, so I have to bite the bullet on weight and ride what will stay inflated.

The narrower Trax Fattys are tough and not too heavy (sub 900gm), it might be worth your while to look into a 2.8" as a compromise for the 650b+.

On your 29er, have you considered the Dirt Wizard? We just started running them on our tandem, so far they have been very resilient, no cuts or loss of rubber. Tandems are just about the toughest test for a tire and we run ours hard downhill on sharp rock with no issues, and they are great tubeless (better than Trax Fatty).



forgiven_nick said:


> Which trails/trail conditions have those 75 miles been through? I am very curious about durability/longevity of the Specialized B+ tires since they are about 200 grams heavier than some of the lightest tires in the category, namely the FBN, which hasn't proven to be a very durable tire, but the FBN is indeed very lightweight. We have some very sharp rocks here in San Diego that have managed to cut through and through the Bontrager Chupacabra 29+ tire I am running up front during a rim strike when I was testing lower psi levels (~10psi) in a very rocky section. Finding the balance of pressure, tire durability, traction and weight is a fun challenge in the plus sized tire choice game.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Yeah! Way to hook a brother up!!

I got a set of 650 x 3 Purgatory coming south from AK 

They were surprised that I called from the Lower 48, apparently they got on the boat early, so they were the only ones (that I know of) to get Purgatory and Ground Controls before October.

Anyone want my used Trax Fatty 3.25's??



exp18 said:


> I just sent you a message


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

We are really lucky in Anchorage we have a number of great shop here. Glad they could hook you up, I think you will be happy with those tires.
Have a couple more rides on mine on the single tracks here in town, awesome traction that you pay a little for on the hard pack.
Some great rides with in a couple of hours drive from anchorage. Tomorrow I am going to ride the lost lake trail and small part of the Iditarod trail down by Seward, lot of different conditions. A lot of climbing, rocky areas and soft wet areas. A true text of these tires I will report back.


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## mowabb (Dec 9, 2011)

The rubber is here!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Lucky!

Mine are in the mail, from AK, so it could be a while...

but worth the wait to finally get rid of those bloated Trax Fattys!

I don't really have anything against the Trax, they work fine, they stick great to rock and firm soils, but where we live it gets to be moon dust this time of year and I feel like I'm swimming with these tires.



mowabb said:


> The rubber is here!


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## lukeNZ (Dec 13, 2012)

Any chance on getting a bead to bead measurement for each of those two?

Thanks



mowabb said:


> The rubber is here!


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

Nurse Ben said:


> ....but worth the wait to finally get rid of those bloated Trax Fattys!
> 
> I don't really have anything against the Trax, they work fine, they stick great to rock and firm soils, but where we live it gets to be moon dust this time of year and I feel like I'm swimming with these tires.


How do you think these tires will be an improvement? Not trying to be a d!ck, just not sure what you're gaining here?


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## mowabb (Dec 9, 2011)

lukeNZ said:


> Any chance on getting a bead to bead measurement for each of those two?
> 
> Thanks


Not, by the time. I'm waiting for the wheels


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## lukeNZ (Dec 13, 2012)

mowabb said:


> Not, by the time. I'm waiting for the wheels


Um, not sure why you would need wheels to get a bead to bead measurement? My understanding is you would just lay the tire flat and measure from the bead to bead. Guessing they'll be somewhere between 180mm-195mm but good to get some numbers from someone who physically has some.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Trax Fattys are mostly casing, the tread is thin and lacks knobbies on the shoulders, so it corners fine unless the soil is loose. The Trax is fast rolling, has a decent casing, but it's not an all around tire.

If I was going to roll one tire, needed the fattest casing, and didn't need the traction, the Trax are fine tires.

Wanna buy mine?



radair said:


> How do you think these tires will be an improvement? Not trying to be a d!ck, just not sure what you're gaining here?


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

Nurse Ben said:


> ....Wanna buy mine?


Thanks anyway. I have a set and they are working well for me. Not very loose here, rooty & rocky and mostly firm loamy hero dirt. The durability is a big improvement over FBNs.


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

My ride on my new purgatory's 
My ride started out in the trees over a little part of the Iditarod trail it was dirt and a few roots. After about 6 miles I crossed the main rode and start to climb pretty good. It started to rain so that section was muddy and rooty. After I topped out and started to descend it has some rocky sections that I was on the brakes hard locking up the rear wheel a fair amount. ( I got to try out my new dropped post out, it worked great) 
Crossed the main road again up the Lost Lake trail it was raining pretty good.That part of the trail climbs up out of the tree so it is muddy with a lot of big rocks embedded. A good place to get a tire cut or a pinch flat. 
I had no tire problems at all. The tire worked good in a lot of different environments. After getting back I inspected my tire. No damage at all. So I would say I like the purgatory's.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

My Pergs have landed, 990gm/970gm, the tread is a little thinner than I expected, but the casing is similar to the Trax. The knobbies are more open in the centerline and taller on the shoulder than the Trax as I expected

It looks like a fast tire, still not quite as aggressive as the Dirt Wizard 29+, but it's gonna be a nice change from my Trax. 

Speaking of timing...I found a sheet rock nail (still had paper on it) in my rear Trax, I pulled the nail and fluid spewed, so I was going to have to tube it or patch the tire, but now I have new tires 

Riding tonight, review to follow...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I'll measure mine tonight before mounting.

Edit: 180mm flat, 3" at outermost knobbies mounted on WTB Scraper i45 at 20psi. Measures the same as a Dirt Wizard 29 x 3.

Knobbies are about as tall as an Ardent 2.4, not nearly as aggressive as the DW, but way more aggressive than a Trax Fatty.

Went up tubeless with tape and a valve, had to use a bungi cord and a compressor for initial seal, 2 scoops, holding air just fine.

990gm/970gm

Off to ride 



lukeNZ said:


> Um, not sure why you would need wheels to get a bead to bead measurement? My understanding is you would just lay the tire flat and measure from the bead to bead. Guessing they'll be somewhere between 180mm-195mm but good to get some numbers from someone who physically has some.


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## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

How do the specialized tires compare to the trax fatty regarding hard pack and asphalt?
I have a set of the TF 3.25 and like them a lot, but I think they are a bit sticky and too much drag on hard surface and asphalt.


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## mowabb (Dec 9, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> I'll measure mine tonight before mounting.
> 
> Edit: 180mm flat, 3" at outermost knobbies mounted on WTB Scraper i45 at 20psi. Measures the same as a Dirt Wizard 29 x 3.
> 
> ...


Mine 180mm too


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

Tor said:


> How do the specialized tires compare to the trax fatty regarding hard pack and asphalt?
> I have a set of the TF 3.25 and like them a lot, but I think they are a bit sticky and too much drag on hard surface and asphalt.


ummm... all mtb tires suck on asphalt! I only ever ride on asphalt to connect to dirt and then its the sacrificial part of the ride; my speed there doesn't matter. If you're only riding asphalt and hard dirt, skip the fat and midfat tires and get a cross bike.

FWIW, the WTB trailblazer rolls pretty well with it's centerline tread.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I rode the Purgatorys last night on a local trail, five miles round trip, mix of double and single track, loose rock, loose dirt, firm dirt, swoopy stuff, some small terrain features, started at ~15psi, finished at ~10psi.

Having ridden this trail on a variety of bikes and tires, I feel confident in commenting on the Purgatory performance in contrast to the Vee Rubber Trax Fatty:

Swing Weight: Though very similar in actual weight, the Purgatory feels less bulky than the Trax Fatty, possibly due to being narrower and shorter. 

Responsiveness:The Purgatory is a quicker tire that the Trax Fatty, quicker to return to center, quicker to initiate.

Autosteer: The Purgatory has no autosteer, yeah!!. Whereas the Trax Fatty is autosteer central, wandering all over the trail and getting stuck at time whcih required some extra muscle to correct.

Bump absorption: Very similar, I might give the nod to the Trax Fatty, but it was a close call.

Tracking, traction, "bite": The Purgatory is far more grippy on loose soils than the Trax Fatty and it gives up nothing on loose rock and firm soil.

Sealing, holding air: Well, at low pressures 10psi, the Purgatory was squirting sealant at the bead, this was of course a fresh set up, so it will likely seal up over time. I had the same issues with the Trax Fatty, so it may be the rim.

Conclusion: Two Thumbs Up for the Purgatory!!


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

thanks for the review - sounds promising!!


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## tedo (Apr 4, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> I rode the Purgatorys last night on a local trail, five miles round trip, mix of double and single track, loose rock, loose dirt, firm dirt, swoopy stuff, some small terrain features, started at ~15psi, finished at ~10psi.
> 
> Having ridden this trail on a variety of bikes and tires, I feel confident in commenting on the Purgatory performance in contrast to the Vee Rubber Trax Fatty:
> 
> ...


Thank you for the comparison! I have been rocking the VTFs since April, and they are 90% a perfect tire... I have never experienced auto steer with them though. I have a couple thousands miles on them, and run tubeless with low psi ( rigid Beargrease). In Vermont they grip like crazy, and are as durable as all hell. I thought for sure a dozen times I almost ripped my sidewall, but never did.

Thant said, where they feel "off" is the rubber compound. It feels rather firm compared to my D4s and Swabbles. The Specialized ones seem like a new option, especially if the are slightly snappier and more grip. How's the rubber compound compare?

Thanks in advance!


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Google WTB Trail Boss 27.5 3.0 TCS

(Hint: AE bike and a few others list it, but show out of stock... WTB Trail Boss 3.0 27.5" TCS Light Fast Rolling Tire Folding Bead - AEBike.com)


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

The VTF are at home on firm soil and rock (slick), not sure I'd call the rubber firm as it wears relatively quick. I think what you're noticing is the lack of prominent knobbies that can grip looser soils. In that scenario, nearly any tire is going to be better than the VTF.

I just pulled my VTF and I was surprised to find the casing a whole lot less "thick" than I remember from when I first mounted them in early Spring. I put a nail through the rear VTF, never had that happen before except with a car/truck, so that was wierd.

I'd say the Purgatory is a much more well rounded tire, the tread profile is more square, so they wander less (autosteer), and the knobbies are deeper so I get better penetration. I find that I run more pressure in the Purgatory than the VTF, 10 vs 12psi, just personal preference but I like the Purgatory firm.

Overall control, especially at speed and diving into turns is far better with the Purgatory.

I don't know that they are the best tire, but they are certainly the best 650b+ tire available now. I'd love to have a set of the Surly DW's in a 650b+, now that would be a great tire!



tedo said:


> Thank you for the comparison! I have been rocking the VTFs since April, and they are 90% a perfect tire... I have never experienced auto steer with them though. I have a couple thousands miles on them, and run tubeless with low psi ( rigid Beargrease). In Vermont they grip like crazy, and are as durable as all hell. I thought for sure a dozen times I almost ripped my sidewall, but never did.
> 
> Thant said, where they feel "off" is the rubber compound. It feels rather firm compared to my D4s and Swabbles. The Specialized ones seem like a new option, especially if the are slightly snappier and more grip. How's the rubber compound compare?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

1100gms!! Good luck selling that to the FBN crowd 



06HokieMTB said:


> Google WTB Trail Boss 27.5 3.0 TCS
> 
> (Hint: AE bike and a few others list it, but show out of stock... WTB Trail Boss 3.0 27.5" TCS Light Fast Rolling Tire Folding Bead - AEBike.com)


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm looking for the biggest tire possible to fit my Pike 275. Currently I've got Flow EX rims with a WTB Breakout 2.5, which is apparently the same casing size at the Trailblazer at 168mm. 

My question is whether there are any other 27.5x2.8 tires that are under 180mm b2b casing size?

It sounds like the 3.0" Purgatory is 180mm b2b, and I thought I heard Specialized would also make a 27.5x2.8 tire. Maybe it will sit around 175mm b2b?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I have a bunch more rides on the Purgatorys, tubeless leakage has settled down as the tires glued themselves in place, I'm no longer getting regular squirts, the tires are holding pressure fine. 

I'm running 12 psi which is fairly firm, but it leads to the best performance at speed and it takes big hits better.

This is a good tread pattern, I have no fault with them, the ride is just right.


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

^ what's your ID rim size?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

FYI:

3.0 Purg's and GC's are on Spesh's site

Specialized Bicycle Components
Specialized Bicycle Components

Oddly enough, the GC claimed weight is higher. Seems like people here are finding the Purg and GC to basically weigh the same.

Purgatory
650b x 3.0"; Max Ride 20 psi / Max Install 35 psi; approximate weight 980g

GC
650b x 3.0"; Max Ride 20 psi / Max Install 35 psi; approximate weight 1045g


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> 1100gms!! Good luck selling that to the FBN crowd


Yeah, WTB tires always seem to be heavier than the competition



fishwrinkle said:


> ^ what's your ID rim size?


EDIT: sorry to muddy the waters

NB is using Scraper's (i45)
exp18 is on Derby's which (IIRC) are 34mm internal
mowabb has tires, appears to still be waiting on wheels

Good to hear that the Purg's work well on 34-45mm internal rims.

I just ordered a pair of WTB Asym i35 27.5's for myself :thumbsup:


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Scraper i45.

Are you curious about sealant "squirting"?

I had the same issues with the Trax fatty on the Scraper, not sure if it's the rim, tire, or both.

It also settled down on the TF over time, so I think it's more likely a tire bead/construction issue. Both the TF and Purg were rather loose fitting.

My shop buddy suggested that true TR tires have a much burlier bead and sidewall. He referenced a set of WTB Bridgers that he had in hand, which did have a burlier bead and a more rubbery sidewall, but at a cost of 1120gms!!

Personally, I'll take the occasional squirt to keep my wheel weight down 



fishwrinkle said:


> ^ what's your ID rim size?


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Scraper i45.
> 
> Are you curious about sealant "squirting"?
> 
> ...


On my derby rims when the shop set them up they said the first one they used a compressor, it set up so easy the second one they use a floor pump. I have had no leakage of seal and only had to add a couple more pound of air pressure after maybe 2 weeks. I run them at 18 on the rear an 15 on the front. So sound like the scraper is just a little harder to get a tire to seal.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

exp18 said:


> On my derby rims when the shop set them up they said the first one they used a compressor, it set up so easy the second one they use a floor pump. I have had no leakage of seal and only had to add a couple more pound of air pressure after maybe 2 weeks. I run them at 18 on the rear an 15 on the front. So sound like the scraper is just a little harder to get a tire to seal.


Yeah, I'm inclined to blame the rims, the fit was too loose with the VF and the Purgs. I like the Scarpers, they're tough and the price to weight ratio is fair, but if they're gonna be billed as TL Ready, they need to fit tighter.

I'm waiting for the CF rim prices to drop, then I might try a different build.

So you run some pretty high pressure on the tires, they must ping off rocks like crazy. Have you tried running lower pressure or do you prefer higher pressure? If you ran 8 psi, I'm curious if they would squirt sealant...


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## exp18 (Feb 15, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Yeah, I'm inclined to blame the rims, the fit was too loose with the VF and the Purgs. I like the Scarpers, they're tough and the price to weight ratio is fair, but if they're gonna be billed as TL Ready, they need to fit tighter.
> 
> I'm waiting for the CF rim prices to drop, then I might try a different build.
> 
> So you run some pretty high pressure on the tires, they must ping off rocks like crazy. Have you tried running lower pressure or do you prefer higher pressure? If you ran 8 psi, I'm curious if they would squirt sealant...


With my pack on I am probably 230lbs. I am afraid to go down to 8 psi because of rim strikes, I have had a few that I could hear luckily no damage at the pressures i run. Not too bad for the pinging off rock and roots.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I've got 27.5" x 3.25" Trax Fatties on 50mm Nexties and didn't have any problem getting them to seal initially or with them weeping or losing air afterwards. I'm probably 230 with my pack and I'm running 9/11 psi on my Mukluk. I'm slow though. The back tire auto steers if I go lower than 11.


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## ladange (Oct 4, 2011)

*Awesome frame!*



awai04 said:


> Update: Who needs boost. ...Meet my Carver "Surly"


What is that frame? It's awesome! Been looking for something like that for a while.

Thanks


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Thanks. It's a custom Ti frame that Davis Carver helped me design. Carver bikes has an option that lets you spec your own frame. This one borrows some geometry from a Mukluk (i.e. 68* HA / 73.5* SA) and pairs it with shorter (sub 17") seat stays, short-ish (70mm) stem, and longer top tube. I have room in the rear for up to 3" wide tires using a conventional 135mm wide hub, though up front, the 27.5 Fox 34 fork (set to 120mm travel) fits "only" up to 2.8" tires. I think with the Derby rims, the Trailblazers inflate to about 2.6" wide.

As for the "Surly" name, I just like the Surly frame aesthetic so some Pugsley influences found their way onto the design.

Traction is pretty awesome (especially for climbing) on my local trails with tires inflated to 15 psi! The chubby rear tire also helps mellow out some of the chatter on quick descents.









ladange said:


> What is that frame? It's awesome! Been looking for something like that for a while.
> 
> Thanks


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

awai04 said:


> ...shorter (sub 17") seat stays, short-ish (70mm) stem, and longer top tube. I have room in the rear for up to 3" wide tires using a conventional 135mm wide hub...
> View attachment 1012343


How wide is the BB on that thing? I'd love to have a 29er/B+ bike with those kind of numbers but with a 135mm rear and 73mm BB.


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

Standard 73mm BB. The frame's a dedicated 1x so there's a little more room for the rear tire. Fyi wheel size is 27.5+.



PHeller said:


> How wide is the BB on that thing? I'd love to have a 29er/B+ bike with those kind of numbers but with a 135mm rear and 73mm BB.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

B+ is easier to type and we all know what it means. 

Could you or have you tried running a 29x2.3 in your frame?


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

Welnic said:


> I've got 27.5" x 3.25" Trax Fatties on 50mm Nexties and didn't have any problem getting them to seal initially or with them weeping or losing air afterwards...


I'm running the same tire/rim combo and also had no trouble airing them up with a floor pump (after seating one side with a tube). I've run them as low as 6 psi but am usually around 10-12. Love the carbon rims for ease of tubeless - one wrap of Tyvek tape and they are good to go.

Great looking Carver Surly, awai!


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## awai04 (Jul 29, 2004)

I haven't. From the frame drawing, I should be able to fit a 29 x 2.3" wheel back there. I'm perfectly happy with the B+ wheel however. It's going to be slower than a regular 29er wheel, but I'm able to keep up with my friends on their 29ers and am enjoying the ride so far.



PHeller said:


> B+ is easier to type and we all know what it means.
> 
> Could you or have you tried running a 29x2.3 in your frame?


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

has anyone got a Duro Miner 27.5 x 3.0 already?


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## tjamscad (Jun 10, 2015)

What is the difference in diameter of a 29x2 and a 27.5x3? I can't find any information on this that makes any since. All I have found is this BikeCalc.com - How to calculate Bicycle Wheel Size and am not sure it is accurate.


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## Guest (Sep 3, 2015)

tjamscad said:


> What is the difference in diameter of a 29x2 and a 27.5x3?


That's not a question that can be answered without a lot of qualifications.

First off, the difference in diameter between 29 and 650B is 38mm. That never changes. You have to divide that by 2 before factoring it into the tire height differences so the 29er starts out 19mm taller.

Traditional MTB tires are similar in height to their rated casing width because they are rated on relatively narrow rims. A 29x2.0 tire will have a casing height around 50mm assuming it has a b2b measurement around 135mm. That is true of the Fast Trak that's I've measured. Narrower Schwalbe tires I've measured are smaller.

A plus tire is rated on a wide rims so its casing height will be less than its rated casing width. 3" plus tires commonly have casing heights around 70mm, not 75mm as you might think. This is the case for b2b's measuring around 185mm which is common for 3" plus tires. That means 3" plus tires are 20mm taller nominally than 2" conventional tires.

So...a 27.5x3 wheel will be about 2mm in diameter greater than a 29x2.0 wheel, essentially the same. Tread height differences and variations is ratings will matter more.

The real question is why you'd compare a 3" tire to a 2" tire. A 2.3-2.4 29er tire will be most functionally similar to a plus tire and it will be 12-18mm taller. If you had a B+ bike and wanted to fit a fast rolling 29er wheelset to it for smoother trails then the 2.0 size would be most suitable assuming clearance was tight (which I doubt).


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

craigsj said:


> ...First off, the difference in diameter between 29 and 650B is 38mm. That never changes. You have to divide that by 2 before factoring it into the tire height differences so the 29er starts out 19mm taller...


That's some funny math you have going there.


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

anybody got bridgers on 39mm duallys yet they can post measurements on?


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## Guest (Sep 3, 2015)

radair said:


> That's some funny math you have going there.


No, it's simply the difference between diameter and radius. A 29er rim has a 19mm greater radius than a 650b, if that's funny math then you need to study up.

Everyone talks diameters, but wheel radius is what affects clearances and BB heights. Tire height differences directly apply to wheel radius, you will have to deal with a factor of 2 one way or another.


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## tjamscad (Jun 10, 2015)

craigsj said:


> The real question is why you'd compare a 3" tire to a 2" tire. A 2.3-2.4 29er tire will be most functionally similar to a plus tire and it will be 12-18mm taller. If you had a B+ bike and wanted to fit a fast rolling 29er wheelset to it for smoother trails then the 2.0 size would be most suitable assuming clearance was tight (which I doubt).


That was a very informative reply. I want to compare those to sizes for general numbers sake. Remember the Trek 69'er? I have a Marlin and I have been riding alot of rough single track. I want to put a B+ on the rear for shock absorption and extra traction that I might gain.


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## foon (Jan 12, 2008)

Has anyone been able to measure the ground control or purgatory 27.5 x 3.0 mounted up? Thinking about building a set of wheels for my jones steel diamond frame. There are reports that the VTF 27.5 x 2.8 fits in the jones, and the specialized 3.0s have a smaller B2B measurements which gives me hope.


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## forgiven_nick (Nov 7, 2006)

I will try mounting both a purgatory 3.0 and ground control 3.0 on stan's flow rims this weekend. If successful, I will post a video up our YouTube channel as well as on www.RideAlongside.wordpress.com


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

foon said:


> Has anyone been able to measure the ground control or purgatory 27.5 x 3.0 mounted up? Thinking about building a set of wheels for my jones steel diamond frame. There are reports that the VTF 27.5 x 2.8 fits in the jones, and the specialized 3.0s have a smaller B2B measurements which gives me hope.


Other than the measurements posted 2 pages prior to your posting?

2.75 casing
3.0 tread
On Derby 40mm


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## foon (Jan 12, 2008)

06HokieMTB said:


> Other than the measurements posted 2 pages prior to your posting?
> 
> 2.75 casing
> 3.0 tread
> On Derby 40mm


Thank you that's all I need. Forgive me I somehow didn't see those posts. I foudn them now.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Sorry, forgot the winky face. My above post just makes me sound like a smart a$$.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Wait, so the Specialized Plus tires in 3.0" actually are a 2.75"?

Will they fit a Pike 27.5 (non-boost)?


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

As reported earlier, the casing is 2.75", tread is 3.0" (on a 34mm internal Derby rim). Don't if that answers your question.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Saw that. I guess my question is, what is the max tire a 275 Pike will fit? 

I think folks tried fitting a VTF 3.0 or 2.8 and it was a no go, but it sounds like the the Specialized tires are smaller than those. Is it safe to assume the Specialized tires are the smallest B2B of any true Plus tire?

Curious to see what Schwalbe's 2.8's look like in B2B and casing specs.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

If it helps... A FBN (on a Scraper i45) did not fit in a Pike 27.5.

The height (hit the arch), not the width, was the issue. I have a pic posted somewhere, but can't access it at the moment.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I remember seeing that. The FBN is also more like a "true" 3.0", right?


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## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

PHeller said:


> I remember seeing that. The FBN is also more like a "true" 3.0", right?


No, more like 2.75"


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I also posted casing and tread measurement numbers for that FBN setup. Which of course I can't access right now. Lol


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## Hootbmx (Feb 20, 2012)

Mine is close to 3" wide on a 45mm rim. I will get the actual measurement if you would like.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

06HokieMTB said:


> I also posted casing and tread measurement numbers for that FBN setup. Which of course I can't access right now. Lol


I got you.

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5/panaracer-fat-b-nimble-27-5-3-5-a-950398.html


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

PHeller said:


> I remember seeing that. The FBN is also more like a "true" 3.0", right?


Even if the tire measures to be 3", I wouldn't consider a tire marked as 27.5" x 3.5" to be a true 3".


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

How is the
Specialized 27.5x 3 CC and Purgatory outer diameter compared to Vee trax fatty 3.25?
I have been running VTF but not too happy with the rolling and auto steering characters.
But not wanting to chance for smaller tyre and lower BB.
How much smaller are the Specialized tyres?? 

any recommendations on which 27.5 would have biggest air volume and still be very fast rolling??
Very thankful for all info thoughts and opinions.


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## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

rikardo said:


> How is the
> Specialized 27.5x 3 CC and Purgatory outer diameter compared to Vee trax fatty 3.25?
> I have been running VTF but not too happy with the rolling and auto steering characters.
> But not wanting to chance for smaller tyre and lower BB.
> ...


I haven't had a chance to try the specialized yet. I'm trying to get my hands on a pair because I think they will be a great addition to the b+ world.

I have been very happy with the Maxxis Chronicles that I just put on. They roll much faster then the VTF, have no self steer and have great traction. I've ridden them on hardpack, rocks, roots and loose, dusty terrain.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Is the self steer of the 3.25 VTF a function of it's width? or it's tread pattern? or both?


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

plesurnpain said:


> I haven't had a chance to try the specialized yet. I'm trying to get my hands on a pair because I think they will be a great addition to the b+ world.
> 
> I have been very happy with the Maxxis Chronicles that I just put on. They roll much faster then the VTF, have no self steer and have great traction. I've ridden them on
> hardpack, rocks, roots and loose, dusty terrain.


What is your take on air volume and outer Diameter?
Between chronicle and VTF

I am running Nextie 50mm rims and sort of like the VTF 3.25 on soft and wet surfaces. 
On slick rock it feels tacky and awkward, with massive self steering.

I am comparing it to a 26 Husker du on 50mm rim. Hudus felt great on slick rock.

All comments are highly appreciated.

Tanks and nice rides!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

06HokieMTB said:


> Other than the measurements posted 2 pages prior to your posting?
> 
> 2.75 casing
> 3.0 tread
> On Derby 40mm


My Pugatorys are a little wider on WTB Scrapers, 3" casing and tread, square profile, very similar in size to my Dirt Wizard 29+ on the same rims..

The Purgatory is a great tires, awesome traction, pretty durable so far, maybe not the densest sidewalls as I have had some sealant seepage through the sidewalls, but only on the rear which tends to get a lot of abrasion...

For $50 each, the Purgatory is a winner, I would certainly not give them up for money or love, and I would certainly not reinstall the VTF.

There's been some discussion of the Chronicle being the go to tire, but honestly, after seeing "live" pictures, I can't really feel it. Sure, they look better than a VTF, but that's not saying much.

I realize not everyone uses their 650+ in mud and loose soils, BUT, for those that do, a thin tread is not going to cut it. I really liked my VTF for firm soil and slickrock, great tire for Moab.

Anyone want a well loved set of VTF 3.25"?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

06HokieMTB said:


> Is the self steer of the 3.25 VTF a function of it's width? or it's tread pattern? or both?


Tread.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

Nurse Ben said:


> My Pugatorys are a little wider on WTB Scrapers, 3" casing and tread, square profile, very similar in size to my Dirt Wizard 29+ on the same rims..
> 
> The Purgatory is a great tires, awesome traction, pretty durable so far, maybe not the densest sidewalls as I have had some sealant seepage through the sidewalls, but only on the rear which tends to get a lot of abrasion...
> 
> ...


How is the Purgatorys outside diameter (height) compared to the VTF 3.25?


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## singlespeedstu (Jul 6, 2006)

Can anyone tell me if the purgatory 27.5 x 3.0 mounted on a scraper rim will fit in the pike 29er fork please?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

The Purgatory 650+ tire is a solid 3" wide.

Height and width tend to increase at the same rate, so height may be a limiting factor. Take an Ardent 2.4 and add a 1/2", see what space remains.

I think there's a thread about fork and tire compatibility.

If the Purgatory is too big you could always back down to a WTB Trailbalzer 2.8 or VTF 2.8



singlespeedstu said:


> Can anyone tell me if the purgatory 27.5 x 3.0 mounted on a scraper rim will fit in the pike 29er fork please?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Any discussion yet for this new WTB tire:

Trail Boss 3.0 | WTB

Lots of knobs, double row, fairly deep tread, nice shape, still heavy like the Bridger, but I like the tread design 

Not available...


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I've got a couple Bridgers to test here pretty quick .. will report back how big they come out on a dually

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## singlespeedstu (Jul 6, 2006)

I already have a VTF2.8 fitted.
I was asking if anyone had actually tried the Purg /Scraper combo in a Pike rather than guessing that it might or might not fit...


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## pirpa (Jan 11, 2011)

Duro Miner 27.5x3.00 on ZTR Hugo


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

pirpa said:


> Duro Miner 27.5x3.00 on ZTR Hugo


Picture no worky... The Duro Miner 3.0 looks to be a beast when Googled


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I'm waiting on spokes now .. I am 90% sure they will fit the Mrp and 90% sure they will not fit the chainstay of the canfield 

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I saw a set of Bridgers at my friends shop, weighed them 1150gm each, fairly aggressive tread, seem durable, the 'V' tread pattern makes me wary for autosteer.

I'll wait on the Trail Boss 3.0


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## pirpa (Jan 11, 2011)

06HokieMTB said:


> Picture no worky... The Duro Miner 3.0 looks to be a beast when Googled


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

This thing needs some fattys like right meow....

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

I concur


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

OK, so somehow missed this thread, found it searching to find out exactly what's out there in B+ -_ great thread, lots of info._ Just finally got a Trailblazer and gave it a go on the front of my 26"/650B Trance as all I have built in 650B is front wheels using Flow rims, plan is for a WTB i35 rimmer rear wheel to try in my Banshee frames - _Prime, Phantom and Paradox._

Wanted to put my comments out about the CST BFT tyre they showed at the Taipei show - I got it to test along with a Chronicle for comparison in the 29"x3" flavour and for me, I liked the BFT much more than the Chronicle, the self steer on the Chronicle is amazing compared to the BFT and the BFTs knobs provide good traction, much more open and taller, good cornering. I ran them on the front of my rigid Monkey on Dualy45 rim. Been checking the CST site to see if it was listed, but so far nothing, really would love these in B+ flavour.


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## slower_than_u (Sep 28, 2008)

Here's the Innova Pro Gneiss 27.5x3.0. Both tires I received were at 1120 grams which seems to mimic the trend from other tire companies where the advertised weight is always a bit optimistic.

I'll be mounting these tubeless on Mulefut 50SL wheels. If you like understated sidewall graphics, these may be for you. There are no graphics or model name, just the model # from the catalog, the size and the small Innova.
INNOVA PRO


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

singlespeedstu said:


> Can anyone tell me if the purgatory 27.5 x 3.0 mounted on a scraper rim will fit in the pike 29er fork please?


It'll be tight... Might work.

I recently rode my Nimble 9 with a Maxxis Chronicle 27.5x3.0 mounted on an Ibis 741 rim on my Pike 29. If fit without problems but I didn't love the rounded profile of the tire on that rim, especially with the very squared off trailblazer in back.

I've now mounted a WTB Bridger. It has a taller rolling diameter than either the trailbalzer or chronicle but still plenty of clearance above. But there is less clearance on the sides than I would prefer and I can flex it enough by hand to hit the fork. I've not yet taken it on a proper ride but I've had no rubbing when rolling down steps or cornering near my house.

I was in Belmont Wheelworks a week ago and they had the Fuse and Stupmjumper 6Fatties next to each other. The Purgatory on the stumpy had a narrower casing than the Ground Control but the bigger nobs made the Purg almost as wide. The one caveat here is that the early stumpjumper 6fatties have a narrower rim than the WTB scrapers on the Fuse. But having the wide point further up may make for a tire that fits the old 100mm hubbed Pike 29. Unlike the trailblazer, the Bridger has nobs that are wider than the casing. If the full with was lower in the tire's diameter, it wouldn't fit as the width would interfere with the bulges from the fork's seals and bushings. But the Bridger's max width is higher up and just above those bulges on the for legs and can fit.

Ultimately, I'm guessing that 2.8 is going to be the sweet spot for trail bike like handling and the added cush and traction of plus bikes. For me, the Trailblazer was better the better compromise than the Chronicle which started to feel a bit more like a fat bike, at least on my narrower rims. My Canfield Nimble 9 still feels quite playful with the Trailblazer. Curious to see which side of the equation the Bridger lands on. And looking forward to more smaller plus tires like the schwalbe 2.8s.

Sorry about the rotated image...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

RPK3 said:


> Ultimately, I'm guessing that 2.8 is going to be the sweet spot for trail bike like handling and the added cush and traction of plus bikes.


This.

This is my opinion and is the opinion of others that have ridden B+ trails bikes so far.

Obviously your opinion can vary, but from what I've tried, 2.8 is where fun & traction converge.


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I like the 3.0 front and 2.8 TB out back combo .. little slower but the front just floats over everything

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

*doppelganger*



CougarSlayer said:


> I like the 3.0 front and 2.8 TB out back combo .. little slower but the front just floats over everything
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


Hi CougarSlayer! Great minds think alike? N9 Bridger/Trailblazer. Except I'm on a frame that's too small and yours looks too big. Wanna trade frames? 

Is that a specialized Fuse hanging out behind the Polaris? Comparisons to your B+ Nimble 9?

How are you liking your MRP Stage? I've got one sitting in a box. Need to slap it on. Oh yeah, this is the plus size forum... How's the clearance?

I mounted the Bridger a few days ago but still haven't had a chance to take it for a real ride. Any auto steer? Still lively enough to be fun?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

and all along I thought 2.25 was the sweet spot 

How about we all just pick our own sweet spot?

Tonight I threw some 29 x 3 Dirt Wizards on my Mutz, it's a tight fit, not one for the mud. It feels wonky, possibly no bueno, I'll play with it over the weekend.


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## Pynchonite (Sep 2, 2013)

Anyone know the width o' Specialized Ground Control 6Fatties on a 30mm inner width rim (cough like a Blunt 35 cough)?


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

RPK3 said:


> Hi CougarSlayer! Great minds think alike? N9 Bridger/Trailblazer. Except I'm on a frame that's too small and yours looks too big. Wanna trade frames?
> 
> Is that a specialized Fuse hanging out behind the Polaris? Comparisons to your B+ Nimble 9?
> 
> ...


Great looking Rig! Yes that is the Fuse back there .. My brother picked it up a couple weeks ago. The Fuse has a completely different feel than the N9. The neck is lower and you can slam the seat much lower (at least compared to my large) so the fuse really turns into a big kids BMX and the Nimble has much more of a downhill feel. Not much time in the dirt on either rig so will have to do some real testing back to back. I feel I can whip the N9 around better and get the front end lofted with alot less effort just doing wheelies down the street.

the stage is an awesome fork .. Love it! It's adjustable like a mo fo

No auto steer for me really....


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

CougarSlayer said:


> Great looking Rig! Yes that is the Fuse back there .. My brother picked it up a couple weeks ago. The Fuse has a completely different feel than the N9. The neck is lower and you can slam the seat much lower (at least compared to my large) so the fuse really turns into a big kids BMX and the Nimble has much more of a downhill feel. Not much time in the dirt on either rig so will have to do some real testing back to back. I feel I can whip the N9 around better and get the front end lofted with alot less effort just doing wheelies down the street.
> 
> the stage is an awesome fork .. Love it! It's adjustable like a mo fo
> 
> No auto steer for me really....


your Nimble9 is a large? it really looks like an XL...


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Yes Large .... at least I am pretty sure it is LOL

RPK = clearance is about 3mm on each side


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

CougarSlayer said:


> Yes Large .... at least I am pretty sure it is LOL


that's easy to know, take a measure of your seat tube length and you're done.

this is Sean's large


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Y'all seen the newly announced Maxxis 2.8 IKON+ and 2.8 Rekon+

At <900g, the 2.8 Rekon looks awesome!


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

All kinds of 2.8s getting to ready to drop .. gonna be a good year tater

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## Heath27 (Nov 20, 2012)

Do you guys know what the lightest 27+ tire is? Seems like a lot of them weigh more than the monty chuppracabra


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

With the awesome 2.8's coming out, I'm really on te fence if I want to mess with Boost...


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Heath27 said:


> Do you guys know what the lightest 27+ tire is? Seems like a lot of them weigh more than the monty chuppracabra


It ain't about weight. The Panaracer FBN is about weight and it's sidewalks are scary think.

Maxxis is getting the 2.8 IKON+ down around 800g... Which is impressive.


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## Heath27 (Nov 20, 2012)

Yea I know it's not all about weight but I wouldn't mind not having 1000g tires. That ikon sounds promising


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

Another Trailblazer rear and Bridger front kit for my titanium. Feels great! Lefty clearance is very good with Bridger


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

Hello.

I wanted more side nob so replaced TrailBlazer with Ground Control.
but it seems so rounded.

It's Specialized Ground Control 27.5x3.0 on Nextie 40mm rim.








more pics on my tumblr.
=here


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

That's 40mm external or internal? If external that's a bit narrow, but still that tread looks so round. I'm thinking they tried to be smart and used the existing tread design from the 4" tyre and put it on the 3" casing, hence the huge wrap. Would be curious to see it on a wider rim.


tsurun said:


> Hello.
> 
> I wanted more side nob so replaced TrailBlazer with Ground Control.
> but it seems so rounded.
> ...


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

LyNx said:


> That's 40mm external or internal? If external that's a bit narrow, but still that tread looks so round. I'm thinking they tried to be smart and used the existing tread design from the 4" tyre and put it on the 3" casing, hence the huge wrap. Would be curious to see it on a wider rim.


it's external width, internal is 35mm.
Fuze equipped this tire has 38mm internal rim(written in below URL) so slightly narrower than Specialized's, but seems similar tire profile like this pic.
SOC15: Specialized launches Fuse, Ruze 27.5+, new Rumor 650 trail bike, Command Post & more!


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Ground control on 45mm scraper

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Damn, looking at those photos the tread wraps way too far down on the casing, would think the outer knobs should have been where the last transition ones are. How freakin far over would you have to lean a bike to get those outer knobs to engage or what width rim would you need to bring them up to a more reasonable place? ut:


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I think 40mm is what the propeller heads are calling the ideal width for 2.8 - 3.0 ... I would go 40mm min -- 45mm personally .. or go big with a Hugo just cause it's koo if ya have some room

Here's a 3.0 bridger on a 39mm internal and a 2.8 TB (more like 2.5) on the same wheel



















Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

LyNx said:


> Damn, looking at those photos the tread wraps way too far down on the casing, would think the outer knobs should have been where the last transition ones are. How freakin far over would you have to lean a bike to get those outer knobs to engage or what width rim would you need to bring them up to a more reasonable place? ut:


I think that you are forgetting the fact that @ 12-16 psi the tire flattens out quite a bit.I've got some wear/shredding on my outer knobs and am running 35mm rims and a 2.8 with a fairly round profile.


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## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

LyNx said:


> Damn, looking at those photos the tread wraps way too far down on the casing, would think the outer knobs should have been where the last transition ones are. How freakin far over would you have to lean a bike to get those outer knobs to engage or what width rim would you need to bring them up to a more reasonable place? ut:


I'm running a GC on the back with a Purgatory on the front mounted on Nextie 50's. The Purgatory actually has more lean ability than the GC. I've found that the GC will break loose while the Purgatory is still holing strong. I'd like to run a GC front and rear to compare them with the Maxxis Chronicle. Those tires have an amazing ability to lean. I'm having to adjust my riding to deal with how well the b+ tires handle. I actually prefer them over a full 4" tire for handling on the dirt.


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## SteveF (Mar 5, 2004)

LyNx said:


> Damn, looking at those photos the tread wraps way too far down on the casing, would think the outer knobs should have been where the last transition ones are. How freakin far over would you have to lean a bike to get those outer knobs to engage or what width rim would you need to bring them up to a more reasonable place? ut:


No way-love me some good shoulder knobs! Especially up front...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

If you want the tire to have the profile it was designed to have, you need to use the appropriate rim width.

I realize some of you guys have limitations based on the use of pre plus sized frames and forks, but it is what it is.

I run WTB Scraper i45, they "fit" plus sized tires, placing the knobbies where they belong. I'm running Purgatorys now, looking at Trail Boss 3.0 as my next tires.


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## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

Nurse Ben said:


> If you want the tire to have the profile it was designed to have, you need to use the appropriate rim width.
> 
> I realize some of you guys have limitations based on the use of pre plus sized frames and forks, but it is what it is.
> 
> I run WTB Scraper i45, they "fit" plus sized tires, placing the knobbies where they belong. I'm running Purgatorys now, looking at Trail Boss 3.0 as my next tires.


I am really liking the purgatory as you suggested. Are you going to try out a Bridger? I'll bet Bridger front, TB rear would make for some serious traction. I've got one, but it seems ovrkill for my type of riding. I'll be running the Purgatory front, GC rear on the Coconino 250 bikepacking route in a few days. They will probably see a little time in Moab as well before the Chronicles go back on...


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Bridger Down!

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

schwalbe multi flats video:


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## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

pplucena said:


> schwalbe multi flats video:


They chose to use "performance line" tires that are very thin and light to save weight. Flat with those tires is inevitable ! :cryin: (any size, plus doesnt 'matter).


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Does anyone have any bead to bead measurements on these new tires(Maxxis, Specialized, ??)? It would be great to add them to the below thread to so how they compare the original offerings.

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-tire-bead-bead-measurements-972235.html


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## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

I just spent 2 days riding with a WTB Trailboss 27.5X3.0 front & VEE Traxx Fatty 2.8 rear. 14psi front 17psi rear on my Rumblefish conversion. AMAZING! I rode for 4 hours on the Buffalo Creek network with slippery gravel and was only able to get it to slip one time while playing the no brakes in the corners game 

Today I shuttled Gold Dust off Boreas Pass and made it to the bottom in under 45 minutes. Absolutely flew down with reckless abandon & only had one close call with a root. 

Endless traction, feels like I'm getting away with something, ha ha. 

Much more square profile vs. anything else I've seen. 

35mm inner width rims


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I'll probably get some Trail Boss 3.0, but the Purgs are fine for now. I'm just happy that the VTFs 3.25 are on a shelf vs on my bike!



plesurnpain said:


> I am really liking the purgatory as you suggested. Are you going to try out a Bridger? I'll bet Bridger front, TB rear would make for some serious traction. I've got one, but it seems ovrkill for my type of riding. I'll be running the Purgatory front, GC rear on the Coconino 250 bikepacking route in a few days. They will probably see a little time in Moab as well before the Chronicles go back on...


----------



## TooSteep (Oct 6, 2012)

twowheelfunman said:


> I just spent 2 days riding with a WTB Trailboss 27.5X3.0 front & VEE Traxx Fatty 2.8 rear. 14psi front 17psi rear on my Rumblefish conversion. AMAZING! I rode for 4 hours on the Buffalo Creek network with slippery gravel and was only able to get it to slip one time while playing the no brakes in the corners game
> 
> Today I shuttled Gold Dust off Boreas Pass and made it to the bottom in under 45 minutes. Absolutely flew down with reckless abandon & only had one close call with a root.
> 
> ...


Which rims are those?


----------



## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

SteveF said:


> No way-love me some good shoulder knobs! Especially up front...


That's because you understand how a tire works.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'll be experimenting with running a Breakout 2.5 in the rear and the a Trailblazer up front. Unfortunately I don't have enough room for a "real" B+ tire, but I wanted to see if the increased volume of the Trailblazer can make up for its lack of tread depth. My hypothesis is no, but I figure I can use the Trailblazer as a fitment checker for other bikes.


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## tjamscad (Jun 10, 2015)

PHeller,

Post#295 might be of intrest

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-frame-compatibility-thread-post-your-setup-957906-12.html


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I've been running the Breakout 2.5 up front and its a great tire, and I would've ran the Trailblazer in the back but I don't trust its casing. Gotta save up for a few months before I spring on another tire.


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## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

Nextie 27.5x40(outer) 35mm(inside) carbon


----------



## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

Oh man, Vee Tire stepping up to the plate! :banana boogie!

IB15: Aggressive Plus Size Tires Arrive from Vee Tire Co. in All Sizes


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Was checking those out! 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

tjamscad said:


> PHeller,
> 
> Post#295 might be of intrest
> 
> http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-frame-compatibility-thread-post-your-setup-957906-12.html


Also, check out my post (#385) for a height/width comparison of a Breakout and FBN on 29-30mm internal width rims.

The Breakout 2.5 is surprisingly tall... 28.25"
While it doesn't have the round volume of a FBN, it has darn near the height (within 1/4") and EXPONENTIALLY tougher sidewalls.

http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/27-5-frame-compatibility-thread-post-your-setup-957906-16.html


----------



## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

Stopbreakindown said:


> Oh man, Vee Tire stepping up to the plate! :banana boogie!
> 
> IB15: Aggressive Plus Size Tires Arrive from Vee Tire Co. in All Sizes


Will this be the first Vee tire that doesn't decide for you which direction to ride?


----------



## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

On Sale Minnesota 27.5 x 3in Fat Bike Tire

Just came across these


----------



## LAN (Jan 26, 2004)

What b+ tires have the best grip? (Of those currently available)

Bridger? Trail Boss? Purgatory?

I have no experience with any b+ tires but I am satisfied with the amount of grip in the Magic Mary Trailstar 29er. Would a Nobby Nic Trailstar 3,0 tire offer more or less grip than the 29 Magic Mary?

Basically what I am after is a tire that have similar grip to Magic Mary, but with lower rolling resistance.

What are your thoughts?


----------



## Gambit21 (Feb 6, 2015)

plesurnpain said:


> Will this be the first Vee tire that doesn't decide for you which direction to ride?


I ride forward usually regardless of the tire.


----------



## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

Gambit21 said:


> I ride forward usually regardless of the tire.


I found myself going sideways too often with the VTF. I'll sell you a set for a good price...


----------



## twowheelfunman (Aug 29, 2008)

Great price but no mention of sidewall protection.


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Anybody got any news on the schwalbe 2.8s hitting the shelf anywhere? Ground control 2.8? 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

CougarSlayer said:


> Anybody got any news on the schwalbe 2.8s hitting the shelf anywhere? Ground control 2.8?
> 
> Sent from The Bunny Ranch


I talked to someone at the Schwalbe distributor that said the Knobby Nics are arriving on 11/3/2015.:thumbsup:

Rocket Rons wont be in until early 2016.


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Thanks mang! 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Skip em', too much vee, they'll steer for you.



BXCc said:


> On Sale Minnesota 27.5 x 3in Fat Bike Tire
> 
> Just came across these


----------



## HomegrownMN (Nov 29, 2004)

Getting really excited to try these new Bridgers👍

27.5+ mounted to a Dually measures 2.995" wide and 28.995" tall.


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I wasn't impressed with the bridger (was running up front with a TB blazer out back) .. hope you have better luck with the them I found my front very washy.. 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

If you like the MM, then wait for the B+ version, an NN might also be a decent choice, but I would need to see them in person; sometimes when a narrow tire is "widened", the design changes for the negative.

Of the available tires and the ones you mentioned.. I ride the Purgs now, they are a well rounded tire, but the casing is just so-so, I haven't had casing failure, but the sealant is "spotting". The Bridger is very heavy and in person it did not impress me, I'll pass.

If I was looking for new tires, I'd get the Trail Boss 3.0 or wait on the Schwalbe offerings...maybe see what Maxxis does.

Your "desire" for an aggressive tire with less rolling resistance is a fools errand, sorry, but you need to pick one or compromise. Personally, I prefer having control when I go fast versus going faster but without control.

If I hadn't just bought a load of boulders and a Rancillio Silvia, I'd get a set of Trail Boss 



LAN said:


> What b+ tires have the best grip? (Of those currently available)
> 
> Bridger? Trail Boss? Purgatory?
> 
> ...


----------



## HomegrownMN (Nov 29, 2004)

CougarSlayer said:


> I wasn't impressed with the bridger (was running up front with a TB blazer out back) .. hope you have better luck with the them I found my front very washy..
> 
> Sent from The Bunny Ranch


Yeah, no ride time on them as of yet.

Where are you riding CougarSlayer?


----------



## Pynchonite (Sep 2, 2013)

My rear FBN is worn down to nubs after about 600 miles in 3 months and it got slashed badly on my last ride. The ride itself was pretty tame. For those of you familiar, it was the Bonneville Shoreline Trail in N SLC. This is a lot faster wear than I would hope for in a tire. I've got a Spesh GC on order and will give it a go. I will say that for the first couple months, the tire felt like magic. Never folded or burped and it survived a few rides down the Wasatch Crest Trail on a rigid frame. Front is going strong.


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

AZ singletrack.. mostly hard pack with washes n such .. I really like the ground controls, my brothers fuse rolls great and sticks awesome 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I'd like to see a thunder Burt in B+ .. rolling center with side knobs .. I will prolly try a set of rocket Rons when they show up

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

CougarSlayer said:


> I'd like to see a thunder Burt in B+ .. rolling center with side knobs .. I will prolly try a set of rocket Rons when they show up
> 
> Sent from The Bunny Ranch


Or maybe a Rock Razor.I had one on the rear before I "plused" and it had a lot more going for it than you would think.Ive got a Burt on the rear of my XC bike and as long as you are in a race with everyone going in the same direction it's great but not what I would call "socially responsible" for open trails.


----------



## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

Pynchonite said:


> My rear FBN is worn down to nubs after about 600 miles in 3 months and it got slashed badly on my last ride. The ride itself was pretty tame. For those of you familiar, it was the Bonneville Shoreline Trail in N SLC. This is a lot faster wear than I would hope for in a tire. I've got a Spesh GC on order and will give it a go. I will say that for the first couple months, the tire felt like magic. Never folded or burped and it survived a few rides down the Wasatch Crest Trail on a rigid frame. Front is going strong.


You had pretty good luck. I went through 4 in 2 months. I ride mostly in Park City, but do some riding at Corner Canyon as well. I think you will really like the GC. I'm running it on the rear paired with a Purgatory up front, but would like to try a GC up front. So far I've ridden this combo on many PC trails, the 250 mile Coconino bikepacking route and just came home from Moab, Thunder Mountain and St George. These tires performed well in a huge range of conditions, including 40 hours of loaded touring through some pretty rugged terrain.


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I can say that I am liking the 2.8 t-blazer up front vs the Bridger after a few loops .. sure is sticky at the same psi and turns faster, noticed better rolling .. hopefully these last until the new crop of tires are available to pick from. I vote the GC for the best 3.0 I have got to ride on so far. Would like to give the T-Boss a try tho... a pair of 2.8 GCs will be on order as soon as they hit, the 3" is only 55 bucks so also one of the cheapest! 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

CougarSlayer said:


> a pair of 2.8 GCs will be on order as soon as they hit, the 3" is only 55 bucks so also one of the cheapest!


So is that to save the 2.8 Ground Control will be similar priced at $55?


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

I wouldn't think they'd raise it .. so I sure close to it 

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## plesurnpain (Sep 9, 2007)

CougarSlayer said:


> I can say that I am liking the 2.8 t-blazer up front vs the Bridger after a few loops .. sure is sticky at the same psi and turns faster, noticed better rolling .. hopefully these last until the new crop of tires are available to pick from. I vote the GC for the best 3.0 I have got to ride on so far. Would like to give the T-Boss a try tho... a pair of 2.8 GCs will be on order as soon as they hit, the 3" is only 55 bucks so also one of the cheapest!
> 
> Sent from The Bunny Ranch


So far I give a slight nod to the Chronicle, but they are much more expensive than the GC. I found mine for $92. Really looking forward to the Icon...


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

I've searched so if I missed the info, sorry. Can someone please measure a 27.5x3.0-3.5 and give me the height please? Thanks!


----------



## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

obs08 said:


> I've searched so if I missed the info, sorry. Can someone please measure a 27.5x3.0-3.5 and give me the height please? Thanks!


You do realize this will vary with every manufacturer and model, right?


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Except them to be around 29" tall.


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

PHeller said:


> Except them to be around 29" tall.


Cool thanks! I was just looking for a general idea so that should work


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Purgatory update

Pros: Fast, smooth, good traction in mixed terrain, good tread life 

Cons: Not a TL tire, sealant seeps through sidewalls, lots of burps in the first dozen rides until there was a build up of dried latex.

In comparison to the VTF, the Purgs have more traction, better ride
In Comparison to the DW 29+, the Purg has less traction and a softer ride.

To be fair, the DW has also had sealant seepage through the casing, so it might just be a cheaper casing thing.

The VTF did not have sealant seepage.

I have some WTB Trail Boss 3.0 on the way.

Used tires if anyone is intetested: VTF 3.25, Purgatory 3.0


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Picked up some Trail Boss 3.0, review to follow, initial impressions:

Supple sidewall, significantly stiffer through the treaded area of the casing, 1100gm on the nose, center line tread is not too deep, side knobbies are deeper, lots of knobbies (busy), feels sticky, has a mild V pattern, maybe more square in profile than the Purgatory, I'm thinking it'll be a more burly tire than the Purgatory.

I'm curious to see how the Trail Boss goes up tubeless as I will now have both a WTB tire and WTB rim (Scrapers) that are in theory designed to work together. I did not feel the VTF and Purgs seated well in the Scrapers, lots of sealant leaking for the first weeks.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> Used tires if anyone is intetested: VTF 3.25, Purgatory 3.0


I've got a pair of FBN's I can't give away. lol. One is decently used and one is only lightly used.


----------



## mowabb (Dec 9, 2011)

FYI


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

*Duro Crux & Miner*

Just received one of each of these form a mail order place in Italy. Have not mounted them yet, but spec's here:

Duro Crux 3.25: B-B: 198mm 1072g
Duro Miner 3.0: B-B: 180mm 839g

More to come!


----------



## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Nice dood .. report back with measurements when ya can!

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


----------



## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

bikeny said:


> Just received one of each of these form a mail order place in Italy. Have not mounted them yet, but spec's here:
> 
> Duro Crux 3.25: B-B: 198mm 1072g
> Duro Miner 3.0: B-B: 180mm 839g
> ...


Like the dedication! Crux will be too big for me to use on my 29er but look forward to hearing about the Minor.


----------



## Carbonegear (Mar 3, 2015)

Has anyone gotten their hands on the Nobby Nics in 2.8 yet? With the snakeskin? 
I am running the WTB Trailblazers in 2.8 and they are laughable- The side walls are just tearing apart and to the point where the stans just sprays out and that is after only 5 rides. I'm not sure how anyone runs that tire in the rear.


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Yea don't run the Trailblazer as a rear tire for tire-shredding trails. I run one up front without an issue. 

The Schwalbes, despite availability as OE spec for some bikes, seem to be absent from retailers. Even zee'German retailers don't seem to have them in stock yet.


----------



## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

Good news!! Dirt Wizards in 27+ 
https://www.facebook.com/SurlyBikes/?fref=nf

mike


----------



## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

Carbonegear said:


> Has anyone gotten their hands on the Nobby Nics in 2.8 yet? With the snakeskin?
> I am running the WTB Trailblazers in 2.8 and they are laughable- The side walls are just tearing apart and to the point where the stans just sprays out and that is after only 5 rides. I'm not sure how anyone runs that tire in the rear.


I just got a set of 2.8 Nic's mounted on some LB 30mm internal rims.

Smaller that a 2.8 VTF ;

Casing is 66mm,tread is 68mm, overall height is 718mm

This is with 18psi,I imagine that they will stretch 2-3mm after a ride or two from my experience with other Schwalbe snakeskins


----------



## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

joecx said:


> I just got a set of 2.8 Nic's mounted on some LB 30mm internal rims.
> 
> Smaller that a 2.8 VTF ;
> 
> ...


BTW,they weigh 728 & 752 grams on my funky scale,lighter than specs.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

senor_mikey said:


> Good news!! Dirt Wizards in 27+
> https://www.facebook.com/SurlyBikes/?fref=nf
> 
> mike


27x3 DW will be an awesome tire for those that want it!


----------



## Carbonegear (Mar 3, 2015)

awesome- Thanks

how do they ride?



joecx said:


> BTW,they weigh 728 & 752 grams on my funky scale,lighter than specs.


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

joecx said:


> I just got a set of 2.8 Nic's mounted on some LB 30mm internal rims.
> 
> Smaller that a 2.8 VTF ; Casing is 66mm, tread is 68mm, overall height is 718mm
> 
> This is with 18psi,I imagine that they will stretch 2-3mm after a ride or two from my experience with other Schwalbe snakeskins


That puts them as small or smaller than the Trailblazer. Interesting. Very interesting. Especially if they do the Hans Dampf 2.8 similarly.

I'm curious if the weights given above are for the Snakeskin casing or not.


----------



## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

joecx said:


> I just got a set of 2.8 Nic's mounted on some LB 30mm internal rims.
> 
> Smaller that a 2.8 VTF ;
> 
> ...


Didn't happen to measure bead to bead on the tire, did you?


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## CougarSlayer (Aug 31, 2015)

Sounds like the NN will be an awesome conversion tire .. should be about 70mm on my wheels. They are launching both 2.8 & 3.0 right?

Sent from The Bunny Ranch


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

06HokieMTB said:


> Didn't happen to measure bead to bead on the tire, did you?


The B-B is 171 mm & they are the snakeskin version.

Rode them this morning and they do feel a lot faster rolling than the
VFT rear/FNB front combo I've been using for a while.Quieter on pavement/drippier in the dirt.

The VFT on the rear had minimal clearance ( 4-5 mm ) on my Turner V3 Flux,the Nic's have 8-10 mm all around.They have grown about 1-2 mm after a day mounted at 18psi.Rode them at 15r/14f and felt very stable on a 30 mm rim.I'll drop a pound or 2 next ride and see what happens.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Now the question is...where the heck did you get the things?


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

Merlin Cycles has the Nobby Nics in the 3.0 size for relatively cheap. The pair would be under $90 shipped. I would like to have one for the front but I'm not sure what my long term plan is yet.

https://www.merlincycles.com/schwalbe-nobby-nic-snakeskin-folding-275-plus-87734.html


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Drat. If Merlin had the 2.8s I'd be all over that, but I'm afraid the 3.0 won't fit in my application.


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

PHeller said:


> Drat. If Merlin had the 2.8s I'd be all over that, but I'm afraid the 3.0 won't fit in my application.


I got them directly from Schwalbe North America. 888-700-5860

They are not in the online catalog yet but the part #'s for the 2.8 is;

Pacestar compound is part # 11600828

Trailstar compound is # 11600829

You will be paying retail which $96 plus shipping.:eekster:


----------



## LAN (Jan 26, 2004)

Just ordered the Nobby Nic 3.0 from Merlin. 

Will report back with b2b, and size mounted to LB 45mm internal, and overall height when I get them.


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## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

Just ordered 4 x NN Trailstars 3.o form Merlin, ended up w/ free shipping and a 10% off Schwalbe coupon popped up. $150 shipped to Alaska, :bananadance


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Dang, that's a bit of a gamble or are you a Schwalbe guy already? Thinking of ordering 1 or 2 to give a try as a front tyre, hoping the redesign gives it a bit better performance in the wet.



Stopbreakindown said:


> Just ordered 4 x NN Trailstars 3.o form Merlin, ended up w/ free shipping and a 10% off Schwalbe coupon popped up. $150 shipped to Alaska, :bananadance


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Dang, I might have to make that jump, but I'm not even sure I could run them in my frame or fork, haha!


----------



## Stopbreakindown (Jun 27, 2011)

These will be going on a fat bike summer wheelset so fitment isn't an issue, and I have had good luck with schwalbes in the past.


----------



## CJD-uk (Sep 12, 2014)

Posted this on another thread..


My Question (apologies if its been covered).

- WTB 27.5 Trailblazer 2.8" on WTB 27.5 Scraper Rim.

- Fork: 150mm (may go 160mm) Pike Boost 2016 Solo RCT3 110mmx15mm


Can I get away with 27.5 Fork or will I need to go to the 29er version?


Cheers

Chris


----------



## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

CJD-uk said:


> Posted this on another thread..
> 
> My Question (apologies if its been covered).
> 
> ...


The 27.50 plus tires doesn't fit on 27.50 Pike boost because the bridge is too low, so you must take the 29 boost fork that is 27plus too. I check it on a bike shop.

The 27.50 boost fork is made for 27.50 frame that have boost on the rear like new Santa Nomad or some Trek. If I have a boost frame a want a boost fork, no ? 

On the photo my new Lirik fork 29/27+ (same lower legs as Pike).


----------



## CJD-uk (Sep 12, 2014)

MISTER HYDE said:


> The 27.50 plus tires doesn't fit on 27.50 Pike boost because the bridge is too low, so you must take the 29 boost fork that is 27plus too.
> View attachment 1030111


Cheers for replying.

Yes, for most plus 27.5+ Boost tires, a Boost 27.5+/29 fork is required.

I was asking about the 2.8 WTB Trailblazer, which is at the small end of Boost tires. Was hoping to get into a 27.5 Boost 2016 Pike.

Anyone tried?


----------



## MISTER HYDE (Feb 4, 2015)

CJD-uk said:


> Cheers for replying.
> I was asking about the 2.8 WTB Trailblazer, which is at the small end of Boost tires. Was hoping to get into a 27.5 Boost 2016 Pike.
> 
> Anyone tried?


Sorry for misunderstood. 

About your questions if this can help I can say that we try in the shop and a plus wheel with 3" tyre (Trax Fatty) doesn't fit for very few space on the 27 Pike boost, less than 1 cm. So I know that the TB is lower than the TF so maybe will fit but with very poor space under the bridge.

I suggest a 29/27+ fork anyway, so in the case you can use any B+ tires and not only the TB, or maybe you want to have a lower front position with a lower fork ? ? Cheers


----------



## CJD-uk (Sep 12, 2014)

MISTER HYDE said:


> Sorry for misunderstood.
> 
> About your questions if this can help I can say that we try in the shop and a plus wheel with 3" tyre (Trax Fatty) doesn't fit for very few space on the 27 Pike boost, less than 1 cm. So I know that the TB is lower than the TF so maybe will fit but with very poor space under the bridge.
> 
> I suggest a 29/27+ fork anyway, so in the case you can use any B+ tires and not only the TB, or maybe you want to have a lower front position with a lower fork ?  Cheers


Thanks MrHyde!

I've got a DMR Trailstar 2016 HT frame to build up - it takes 27.5+ 2.8" on the back (27.5+ 3.0" with a dropout mod), Want to run 160mm upfront, so yes, want to keep the front end lower with a 27.5 Boost Pike fork instead of a 29er Boost Pike as already pushing the frame Geometry a bit at 160mm travel.

Not quite sure, but think there is about 20mm difference in crown to steerer height between 27.5 & 29er Pike?

Maybe I'm worring too much and just run more sag


----------



## radair (Dec 19, 2002)

CJD-uk said:


> Yes, for most plus 27.5+ Boost tires, a Boost 27.5+/29 fork is required...


Boost tires? Isn't Boost just a new hub spacing? 27+ tires fit just fine on a Bluto. Tires don't really care about hub spacing.


----------



## CJD-uk (Sep 12, 2014)

Boost Forks are also be marketed as either 27.5+ compatible or not.

The Boost 2016 Pike 29er is marketed as compatible with 27.5+ tires up to 3"

What I'm trying to establish is whether the Boost Pike 27.5 fork can take a 27.5+ 2.8 WTB-TB tire.


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I run a Trailblazer in my Pike 275 with the normal 100mm front hub. This one is on a Stans Flow EX.

It's my understanding the wider rim will actually pull the casing out, making the tire less tall. That being said, I wouldn't run a Scraper on a bike with 160mm front fork (if your actually using all that travel). The Scraper isn't really an AM rim.

If you're really worried about stack (which is sounds like you are if you're worried about A2C length) then just run a 29er fork at 150 or *GASP* 140mm.

If your running big tires, they'll more than make up for the lack of 20mm of travel, especially considering _you've got no travel in the rear_.


----------



## CJD-uk (Sep 12, 2014)

PHeller said:


> especially considering _you've got no travel in the rear_.


LOL, that's exactly why I need more travel at the front ;-)

Ran my last HT with 160mm and that was great fun (Meta HT) with an extra bit at the front.

Thanks for the feedback on forks clearance.

Interesting you are on Stans Flow EX. I've got a spare set of those, but when I said to a few people about using them with the 2.8 TB, they laughed and said they would roll of cornering hard and be the wrong profile. I guess that';s not what you are finding 

Anyway, happy to try the scraper - not worried if they break/ding, this bike is a bit of a fun experiment. (known as the winter HT crisis)

Currently thinking just going for the boost 29er 160mm Pike and just deal with the slightly raised front end and BB.

Cheers


----------



## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I have no issues with rolling the tire or any of that. I run about 18psi up front and bash my way through rocky terrain. I'm not racing and most people I ride with aren't downhill oriented so I rarely have any problems staying at the front on that side of the mountain.


----------



## jacksonj51 (Mar 30, 2012)

Pulled


----------



## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Trail Boss 3.0 follow up:

I've gotten a few rides on the TB now, thought it was time for a little review.

I've run the gamut on these tires, firm dirt, mud, and snow/ice. These tires work well in all conditions, fast rolling, no self steer, supportive casing allows for lower pressures, holds air well (no burps that I've noticed), tread clears mud well enough unless it's clay.

For the price, it's a good tire. They are a little on the heavy side ~1100gms a piece, but to WTBs credit, the TB is also truly TLR which tends to make tires more portly. In contrast, the Purgs and VTF are not TLR, as evidenced by sealant leakage at the bead (both) and casing seapage (Purgs). 

I'm done looking for tires, these are keepers.

Two thumbs up.


----------



## Pynchonite (Sep 2, 2013)

In case you were consiering it: the WTB Trailblazers do, in fact, seat using just a high pressure pump and soapy water. For anyone considering doing this while their spouse is asleep in the other room, they do still make that loud bang.


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Anyone have a mounted carcass and tread measurement on the Trailboss 3.0? Inside width of your rims as well. Thank you, have a great T-day!


----------



## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I'm considering the Bridger 3.0 or the Trailboss 3.0 as replacement for my Trailblazers. Is the Trailboss wider than the Bridger? The Trailblazers corner like crap so.....


----------



## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

*Summary chart- OD and width vs rim diameter*

I almost hate to aks here, ('cos it's probably been covered in the 45+ pages of postings) but I'm wondering if anyone has an updated chart of tire Outside Diameter and width on various rims.
All I could find was the chart around posting #345, but there's no OD.

Trying to see what I can stuff into 2 existing frames without having to go the expensive trial-and-error route.

Thanks.


----------



## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

slower_than_u said:


> Here's the Innova Pro Gneiss 27.5x3.0. Both tires I received were at 1120 grams which seems to mimic the trend from other tire companies where the advertised weight is always a bit optimistic.
> 
> I'll be mounting these tubeless on Mulefut 50SL wheels. If you like understated sidewall graphics, these may be for you. There are no graphics or model name, just the model # from the catalog, the size and the small Innova.
> INNOVA PRO
> ...


Do you have any pics of these mounted up? Ride reports? Were those wire bead or folding?


----------



## Jpcannavo (Sep 4, 2015)

Have read through most of thread, but still unclear on what widest current 275+ tire is. Is it VTFattie ?


----------



## Tor (Jan 5, 2013)

Jpcannavo said:


> Have read through most of thread, but still unclear on what widest current 275+ tire is. Is it VTFattie ?


Yes, the VTF 3.25 but I think Trek / Bontrager have a 27.5 x 3.8 coming later this year or early next year

http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/carbon-farley-962249.html


----------



## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

Jpcannavo said:


> Have read through most of thread, but still unclear on what widest current 275+ tire is. Is it VTFattie ?


should we define the boudary between 27.5+ and 27.5 fat?

are you looking for a 2.8"-3.25" tire? or wider is ok? because you can find some 27.5FAT from Bontrager or a 27.5x3.5 from Panaracer


----------



## Jpcannavo (Sep 4, 2015)

savo said:


> should we define the boudary between 27.5+ and 27.5 fat?
> 
> are you looking for a 2.8"-3.25" tire? or wider is ok? because you can find some 27.5FAT from Bontrager or a 27.5x3.5 from Panaracer


Good question. I guess what I am wondering here is what the current upper limit is for 275 tire width for the emerging lineup of plus bike - STJ 6fattie etc.


----------



## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

The current widest 27.5+ tires are the Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 and the Duro Crux 3.25. The Bontrager 3.8 tire is a fat tire, not a plus tire. And the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 3.5 is way smaller than 3.5, it's actually around 2.9-3.0 depending on rim width.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Trail Boss 3.0 Update:

Since my 26 x 4 wheels are down for a couple weeks, I've been riding my 27+ in the snow, packing the trail as the layers build up.

The TB3 is a great all purpose tire, very nice riding in the snow, predicatble, fast, good traction, I only crashed "hard" once, and it was due to an icey spot in a corner; my butt hurts!

Running down to 8psi, temps in the teens, jumps, endo landings in the dark (woops), even tweaked my rim a bit, still not a seep.

Running WTB Scrapers, definitely matched to the WTB tires.

I put one of my Purgatorys on a muni, Blunt 35, sealed fine but burped like all get out. I think I'll get another TB3 for my muni


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

senor_mikey said:


> Good news!! Dirt Wizards in 27+
> https://www.facebook.com/SurlyBikes/?fref=nf
> 
> mike


I've got three snow rides on my 26+ Dirt Wizards and can firmly say that they're awesome.

The 27.5x3.0 Dirt Wizard looks to be a nice improvement over my 26+ tires.

Tires | Parts and Accessories | Surly Bikes

60tpi
Folding bead, tubeless ready
Reinforced Sidewalls
Updated rubber compound

That, my friends, is the best 650b+ tire that I've seen yet!

Running my 26+ Dirt Wizards on Rabbit Hole rims (50mm external, so approx 45mm internal). 15psi front/rear. I've got the rear mounted backwards to give extra grip in the recent snows in Denver.

I've ridden in a couple inches of fresh snow as well as on snow that's been packed by fatties and hikers. Frankly, I'm amazed at how much traction these offer. Obviously, they don't offer full on fat bike float, but for snow packed trails, they do quite well.

Rolling resistance (with the rear tire mounted backwards), is about what you expect... but the forward traction is very nice for Plus tire.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

MikenIke said:


> Anyone have a mounted carcass and tread measurement on the Trailboss 3.0? Inside width of your rims as well. Thank you, have a great T-day!


TB3 on Scrapers, ID 45mm, 3" width on the nose. It may be a little wider with more pressure and a little stretch.

Purgatory on a Blunt 35 is ~2.75"

Bridgers are pretty tanky too, maybe get a TB3 for the front?

So folks are still trying to fit plus tires on standard frames...., so if you have less than 1/2" to the chainstays and the bridges with a 2.4, then you are not going to run a 3" tire.

The only 2.8's are the VTF and the WTB Trailblazer, both treads suck.

Hey, let's keep this focused on plus tires, the fat tires have their own thread 

In all seriousness, plus tires are tires that fit on plus frames, granted they will also fit in fat bike frames (like moi), but the inverse is not true, hence the separation of forums.

I can't even imagine the wonkiness of a 4" tire on a 27.5 rim... 26 x 4" is bad enough!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

06HokieMTB said:


> I've got three snow rides on my 26+ Dirt Wizards and can firmly say that they're awesome.
> 
> The 27.5x3.0 Dirt Wizard looks to be a nice improvement over my 26+ tires.
> QUOTE]
> ...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I think many people are interested in the biggest tire they can fit on a bike that utilizes "normal" width BB and hubs. 

I have absolutely no interest in a fat bike at this point because it would require hubs, rims, tires, and cranks that would be limited to that style of bike long term. Even if I got a Boost 148 bike today that fit a 27.5x3.5, I could still use those parts on most 29ers produced now and into the foreseeable future. If I buy a fat bike, those parts will always be on a fat bike, whether I need a fat bike or not. My only chance of using such a bike would be downsize the tires, but that still means bigger hubs and wider cranks.

If I could fit a 27.5x3.8 (3.5" actual) in a Plus frame that might make a great hardpack snow bike.


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## 06HokieMTB (Apr 25, 2011)

Nurse Ben said:


> On those 26" I'd worry about casing failure, they have a reputation for being kinda flimsy.


Mine are wire bead - 27TPI, which are heavy, but more robust than the folding-120TPI versions that are known to have the paper thin sidewalls.

This is why I was excited to see Surly update the 27.5+ DW's to a reinforced 60TPI casing


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

I spend last months riding full suspension fat Bike and full suspension 27.5 plus and the biggest issue are punctures. Tires in the market are not build to agressive terrain and these bikes let you go more agressive than normal tires. Result is big punctures and time lost. I pray for a good rear tire, and 2.8 would be enough for me. Maybe New Maxxis Ikon and Rekon+, but trailblazer, vee, and Nobby Nic are not designed for rocks and hard terrain.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

pplucena said:


> I spend last months riding full suspension fat Bike and full suspension 27.5 plus and the biggest issue are punctures. Tires in the market are not build to agressive terrain and these bikes let you go more agressive than normal tires. Result is big punctures and time lost. I pray for a good rear tire, and 2.8 would be enough for me. Maybe New Maxxis Ikon and Rekon+, but trailblazer, vee, and Nobby Nic are not designed for rocks and hard terrain.


I just got my hands on a Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0, and I think it would be perfect for you. The sidewalls are the thickest of the 8 or so 27.5+ tires I have handled.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

bikeny said:


> I just got my hands on a Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0, and I think it would be perfect for you. The sidewalls are the thickest of the 8 or so 27.5+ tires I have handled.


did you get a weight on it? is yours the folding tire?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

obs08 said:


> did you get a weight on it? is yours the folding tire?


60tpi folding bead, 1306g!


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

There's times when things just get ridiculous, this is one, 1300g+ for a 650B+ tyre to have a reliable casing and decent tread ut:


bikeny said:


> 60tpi folding bead, 1306g!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

news24hours said:


> ertrgrg hmhh


Could you repeat that, it seems that you were mumbling.


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## richwolf (Dec 8, 2004)

You guys crack me up. You want big tires that weigh nothing yet are bomb proof and are sturdy enough to not fold over at low pressures.
You can't defy science with the materials that tires are presently made from.


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

bikeny said:


> I just got my hands on a Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0, and I think it would be perfect for you. The sidewalls are the thickest of the 8 or so 27.5+ tires I have handled.


Sure I would go for one if they made it in 2.8 size. I am using them in a BMC trailfox and clearance is not very good with 3.0 tires. Actually I am running Nobby nic 3.0 and clearance is critical. And even with good clearance I thing that a true 2.8 (70mm) tire with high resistance is the better option for a long travel full suspension bike. 
What is the true size of the Dirt Wizard? I thing that surly tires are always bigger than others so I supposed that it would be more than 75mm.
In the fat bike I am using Hodag for the rear and Vanhelga for the front and they weight around 1200gr and puncture resistance is ok, so I think that a 27.5x2.8 around 1100-1200 gr would be the target.


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## tirsintarsi (Feb 17, 2014)

richwolf said:


> You guys crack me up. You want big tires that weigh nothing yet are bomb proof and are sturdy enough to not fold over at low pressures.
> You can't defy science with the materials that tires are presently made from.


And also are cheap...

Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

Tor said:


> Trek / Bontrager have a 27.5 x 3.8 coming later this year or early next year


These (Jackalope) rims and (Hodag) tires are already available -- I've been building with them for a month+ already.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

just ordered a gc and a purg for my build. im waiting for the rekon/ikon as im a maxxis guy, but right now i think the spec tires are the best buy. they may not be grid but for $50 i dont think there is a better tire right now


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## Jpcannavo (Sep 4, 2015)

mikesee said:


> These (Jackalope) rims and (Hodag) tires are already available -- I've been building with them for a month+ already.


This interesting, as it would create an interesting option for plus bike owners. Wonder how it snuck by, little mention of it, and even hard to find on their website, but it's there. Wondering what riding experiences have been like.
Bontrager Hodag Fat Bike Tire | Bike tires & tubes | Cycling components | Equipment


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Jpcannavo said:


> This interesting, as it would create an interesting option for plus bike owners. Wonder how it snuck by, little mention of it, and even hard to find on their website, but it's there. Wondering what riding experiences have been like.
> Bontrager Hodag Fat Bike Tire | Bike tires & tubes | Cycling components | Equipment


There is PLENTY of talk about that tire and tire size on the Fat Bike forum as it's a fat bike tire. Not so much talk about it in this forum as it's not a Plus tire. I'm pretty sure it will not fit in any Plus bike.


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

3.0 Nobby Nic test fitted to enduro 29er and 2.8 Trail Blazer on front


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

Now reversed!


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

jpec29 said:


> View attachment 1032816
> Now reversed!


Sweet rig man! Is clearance tight with a 3.0 in the back?


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

obs08 said:


> Sweet rig man! Is clearance tight with a 3.0 in the back?


It was only tight on the driver side chain stay because there is a huge rubber chain pad, gonna stick with the 3.0 in front, haven't decided on the rear gonna stick with the 2.8 till more options come out I think


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

jpec29 said:


> View attachment 1032816
> Now reversed!





jpec29 said:


> It was only tight on the driver side chain stay because there is a huge rubber chain pad, gonna stick with the 3.0 in front, haven't decided on the rear gonna stick with the 2.8 till more options come out I think


Get rhe 2.8 rocket ron when it comes out, would compliment that 3.0 nic nicely


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

Hodag 26 3.8" is a fat Bike tire. It is around 95mm in 65mm rim so is not for a plus Bike. No for frame With boost hub and no for plus forks.
I ordered Nobby Nic 2.8 for the rear but it is pacestar. Trailstar would be better but I couldn't find it.


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## konacrasher (Dec 25, 2008)

*schwable 27.5 x 3.0*



jpec29 said:


> View attachment 1032816
> Now reversed!


how wide do those tires measure on scrapers?
hoping they might fit my niner rip

Thanks,

Andrew


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

konacrasher said:


> how wide do those tires measure on scrapers?
> hoping they might fit my niner rip
> 
> Thanks,
> ...


75.6mm measuring sidewall to sidewall


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Why does a bomb proof 650B+ tyre need to weigh 1300g+? The Maxxis Chronicle 29+ with EXO casing is still under 1000g and that's a 29+ and the EXO casing is pretty damn bomb proof from my experience, so why should we need a ludicrous 1300g 650B tyre ut: Heck even my wire bead exko CST BFT 29+ was under 1100g and it for sure is bomb proof.



richwolf said:


> You guys crack me up. You want big tires that weigh nothing yet are bomb proof and are sturdy enough to not fold over at low pressures.
> You can't defy science with the materials that tires are presently made from.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

I agree, we have tough tires already available in all sizes, so why should it "cost" 300gms to make these same tires into plus size?

Sorry, it just doesn't make sense.

I'm not a big tire abuser, rarely do I destroy a tire, but I know better than to start with tires that have wimpy casing.

I think most of the plus tires we have now are fairly durable, other than the notable outliers such as the FBN and the 26" Dirt Wizard.



LyNx said:


> Why does a bomb proof 650B+ tyre need to weigh 1300g+? The Maxxis Chronicle 29+ with EXO casing is still under 1000g and that's a 29+ and the EXO casing is pretty damn bomb proof from my experience, so why should we need a ludicrous 1300g 650B tyre ut: Heck even my wire bead exko CST BFT 29+ was under 1100g and it for sure is bomb proof.


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

So the dirt wizard and NOBBY nic are available in what size? Where. Thanks.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Justin MD said:


> So the dirt wizard and NOBBY nic are available in what size? Where. Thanks.


nobby nic is available on merlin cycles 3.0 size for $40. wouldnt exactly consider any schwalbe tire durable though


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Justin MD said:


> So the dirt wizard and NOBBY nic are available in what size? Where. Thanks.


Universal Cycles has the Dirt Wizard 3.0 and the Nobby Nic Pacestar in 2.8 and 3.0.

Or you could get a Dirt Wizard here: Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3, Duro Miner 27.5x3, Surly Nate 120tpi - Buy and Sell and Review Mountain Bikes and Accessories


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

LyNx said:


> Why does a bomb proof 650B+ tyre need to weigh 1300g+? The Maxxis Chronicle 29+ with EXO casing is still under 1000g and that's a 29+ and the EXO casing is pretty damn bomb proof from my experience, so why should we need a ludicrous 1300g 650B tyre ut: Heck even my wire bead exko CST BFT 29+ was under 1100g and it for sure is bomb proof.


I have punctured and ripped 800g specialized Slaughter Control 2.3 rear tires. Since I switched to the 1000g Grid version of the same tire all has been well. I guess I can't really expect a 3.0 tire to weigh less than the 1000g Grid Slaugher and hold up to sharp rocks but it sure would be sweet if it did.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

You should try using Maxxis then, wouldn't need to suffer the weight penalty for SpecialEDs shitty control casing  Seriously, I have been running Maxxis EXO casings since they came out, never had an issue on our coral, decided for whatever reason to give a Purgatory control casing a shot as they're about the same size and weight as my regular Maxxis/On One tyres, it lasted a total of 3 rides before being torn by our coral.



artnshel said:


> I have punctured and ripped 800g specialized Slaughter Control 2.3 rear tires. Since I switched to the 1000g Grid version of the same tire all has been well. I guess I can't really expect a 3.0 tire to weigh less than the 1000g Grid Slaugher and hold up to sharp rocks but it sure would be sweet if it did.


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## majr (May 22, 2012)

Dirt wizards are also available at your LBS through QBP.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I have found out the Bridger 3.0 on a Dually does not fit in a Rockshox Reba 29" fork without some rubbing where the old Trailblazer had fit just fine. This shock has been beat pretty hard so it is going under the dremel tomorrow. It WILL fit when I'm done. Looks like a proper plus size fork is in my future.


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

LyNx said:


> You should try using Maxxis then, wouldn't need to suffer the weight penalty for SpecialEDs shitty control casing  Seriously, I have been running Maxxis EXO casings since they came out, never had an issue on our coral, decided for whatever reason to give a Purgatory control casing a shot as they're about the same size and weight as my regular Maxxis/On One tyres, it lasted a total of 3 rides before being torn by our coral.


I've punctured an Exo Icon 2.35 long ago but still think that your giving me good advice. Once isn't a big enough sample size so I'll give Maxxis another try for rear tires. I know the Exo Minons are plenty durable but they aren't light. When (and if) I destroy the current Ground Control 3.0 I'll try a Chronicle Exo. I can easily live with a 950g rear 3.0 as long as it rolls nicely.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I can't get exo casings to last, always tear the sidewall on drops and random rocks where I ride. I have high hopes for the new DD casing though and Schwalbe Super Gravity casings seem to last.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Where are you putting this tyre, front or rear? If it's on the rear, then yes it rolls fine, but if you're putting it on the front the self steer for me was just too damn much at good trails pressures. Patiently waiting for the two new 29+ _(hoping they do 650B+ as well) _using what looks like a cross between a Minion and Ardent tread and the Ikon. If CST would hurry up and release the BFT, that is an excellent tyre, lots less self steer, more open tread pattern and slightly bigger overall knobs than the Chronicle, much better front tyre.



artnshel said:


> I've punctured an Exo Icon 2.35 long ago but still think that your giving me good advice. Once isn't a big enough sample size so I'll give Maxxis another try for rear tires. I know the Exo Minons are plenty durable but they aren't light. When (and if) I destroy the current Ground Control 3.0 I'll try a Chronicle Exo. I can easily live with a 950g rear 3.0 as long as it rolls nicely.


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## almander (Nov 16, 2015)

Pynchonite said:


> In case you were consiering it: the WTB Trailblazers do, in fact, seat using just a high pressure pump and soapy water. For anyone considering doing this while their spouse is asleep in the other room, they do still make that loud bang.


If your spouse thought that was loud, try bursting the bead. -doh









That 27.5 x 3 Ground Control went into the trash!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

almander said:


> If your spouse thought that was loud, try bursting the bead. -doh
> 
> View attachment 1034837
> 
> ...


Ouch!


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

You do know SpecialED has a 30 day unconditional guarantee right? Seriously, contact them, tell them what happened or better yet take it back to the store if you bought it from one.



almander said:


> If your spouse thought that was loud, try bursting the bead. -doh
> 
> View attachment 1034837
> 
> ...


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Got the Bridger mounted on my front Dually and the traction and ride are supreme despite the weight. Took a little trimming on the Reba, and gained plenty of room. 
Unfortunately i only have enough room for 2.8 in the back so temporarily stuck with a modified(siped center lugs)Trailblazer for now.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Does anyone know yet if the 2.8 NN are supposed to be close to width/girth of a TB?


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## m789 (Jul 19, 2013)

Mine is a true 2,8 BtoB is 155mm and mounted on id30 rim is almost 70mm... Weight is 810g


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

Got a set of 27.5x3" Nobby Nics to replace the Fat B Nimbles. Mounted right up tubeless on the Nextie 50 rims. Width is 75mm. About .8 pounds heavier for the pair, but hoping the durability is better. Test ride in the woods tomorrow.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

That looks awesome SmooveP, and thanks for the dimensions m789.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

To anyone running a trail boss, I've got them front and rear, as I rear tire it slides all over and rolls slow. What is everyone using as a tire combo with the trail boss?


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## SmooveP (Nov 30, 2007)

Did a 17 mile ride on dirt today on the 27.5x3" Nobby Nics. Started out at around 14 psi, which was way too high (I'm around 145 lbs). They felt like bricks at that pressure. Reduced the pressure a few times during the ride and that helped. They roll nicely given their aggressive knobs and have good traction, but they are a little slower feeling than the Fat B Nimbles they replaced. No surprises or handling quirks, good traction and they look to be pretty tough and well-made. Sweet deal at $55 ea. on eBay. These are the TLE/EVO/non-Snakeskin models. Very easy to set up tubeless on 50mm Nextie's, and no pressure loss overnight, which is pretty unusual in my experience.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I think a Nobby Nic rear and Rocket Ron front combo would be good to try. Soon......


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## Fatalpine (Feb 23, 2012)

MikenIke said:


> I think a Nobby Nic rear and Rocket Ron front combo would be good to try. Soon......


Or Nobby Nic front and Rocket Ron rear.
I hoppe the 3.0 NN are more resilient than the 2.35, the 2.35 NN are completely worn after 500/600 KM


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

almander said:


> If your spouse thought that was loud, try bursting the bead. -doh
> 
> View attachment 1034837
> 
> ...


Lol you never put the stans in first!


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Wow!, thats horrible mileage.


Fatalpine said:


> Or Nobby Nic front and Rocket Ron rear.
> I hoppe the 3.0 NN are more resilient than the 2.35, the 2.35 NN are completely worn after 500/600 KM


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I always add Stan's before inflation and never have problems, also good way to lubricate the bead so it seats easily. I use the Crank Bros Speedier lever, tire just slides right on the rim.
Different strokes for different folks.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

You can add it before if you want to make a mess if the bead doesnt seat right away or blows off the rim. Easier way is to seat bead, remove core and than add


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

MikenIke said:


> I think a Nobby Nic rear and Rocket Ron front combo would be good to try. Soon......


And that's backwards, nic front ron rear is how it goes


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I guess I'm not that coordinated, lol. I make a bigger mess trying to put it in the valve, but then I usually do things the hard way. 

The NN looks like a better rear digging/climbing tread to me, like a moto rear tire. And the RR looks like a moto front tire.
Are they front/rear specific tires?


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## Fatalpine (Feb 23, 2012)

MikenIke said:


> I guess I'm not that coordinated, lol. I make a bigger mess trying to put it in the valve, but then I usually do things the hard way.
> 
> The NN looks like a better rear digging/climbing tread to me, like a moto rear tire. And the RR looks like a moto front tire.
> Are they front/rear specific tires?


No specific front or rear, you can do like you want, but usually people prefer have more grip in front and less rolling resistance rear. On my 26 fs it's nobby nic 2.35 front and rear. The 500/600km it's for the rear NN.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

MikenIke said:


> I guess I'm not that coordinated, lol. I make a bigger mess trying to put it in the valve, but then I usually do things the hard way.
> 
> The NN looks like a better rear digging/climbing tread to me, like a moto rear tire. And the RR looks like a moto front tire.
> Are they front/rear specific tires?


The reason you go for more grip up front is cause if you put the big grip in the back you'll wash the front end real easy. It's much safer to have the back end slide a little then to ear dirt all the time. Meat in the rear is good but a lower tread tire in the back generally means less weight and less rolling resistance


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Fatalpine said:


> No specific front or rear, you can do like you want, but usually people prefer have more grip in front and less rolling resistance rear. On my 26 fs it's nobby nic 2.35 front and rear. The 500/600km it's for the rear NN.


Do you have the Trailstar or Pacestar compound on your Nobby Nics Fatalpine?


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

At least on level terrain, the majority of your weight is on the back tire. So the rear tire plays a bigger role in overall rolling resistance. It also tends to grip better with more weight on it. This is also why most also run higher pressure in their rear tire. And as obs08 mentions, it's easier to control and save back end slides. Front tire slides are much more "pucker" inducing so I tend to run a grippier tire up front. 

Orange Seal 4 and 8oz containers come with a flexible hose. I remove the valve core after seating the tire. This hose is a tight fit but will slide down over the valve stem and allow a nearly mess free flow of tire sealant to be pushed in. If I need help getting the tire to seat, some soapy water on the bead works well. Removing the valve core at the beginning also lets you push more air through the stem to get the tire to seat.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

I havent tried, or really even seen much orange seal here, but will have to ask for and try it next time. Everybody i know uses Stan's with very little mention of Cafe Latex. Thanks for the tip. 
I'm all about less rolling resistance in the warmer months here, but snow and mud changes things, and right now I'm more interested in traction. I like to run a more aggressive tire this time of year. I use a 2.8 rear 3.0 front combo currently so Schwalbe making their tires in both sizes helps me get that worthless TB off of my rear rim. An aired-down NN combo looks like it would really fit the bill on my local trails. I previously used Dirt Wizards here for winter, and although the traction is phenomenal, I'm not a fan of their weight and overall lack of size options.


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## MikenIke (May 4, 2013)

Pretty much all my plus size tire info comes from this forum so I really appreciate all the knowledge that is imparted here by everyone. Most bikes are skinny or fat in my area not much in between.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

As far as mounting tires, I do as others have suggested. Mount with soapy water on beads to help them slip into place easier. Then remove valve core and add Stan's sealant using their syringe/tube thingy. It threads onto the valve stem and makes for a clean way to add sealant. Inflate to around 30psi and then do the Stan's dance. I then lay the wheel on each side for a day or so. I've had no issues with this procedure, even with non-tubeless tires.


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

PHeller said:


> I think many people are interested in the biggest tire they can fit on a bike that utilizes "normal" width BB and hubs.
> 
> I have absolutely no interest in a fat bike at this point because it would require hubs, rims, tires, and cranks that would be limited to that style of bike long term. Even if I got a Boost 148 bike today that fit a 27.5x3.5, I could still use those parts on most 29ers produced now and into the foreseeable future. If I buy a fat bike, those parts will always be on a fat bike, whether I need a fat bike or not. My only chance of using such a bike would be downsize the tires, but that still means bigger hubs and wider cranks.
> 
> If I could fit a 27.5x3.8 (3.5" actual) in a Plus frame that might make a great hardpack snow bike.


I feel exactly the same. I've seen pictures of the Workswell Plus bike with Fat B Nimbles 3.5's but, judging by this thread, those don't count. So right now my personal dilemma is whether to get a fat bike or a plus bike and hope for the best.


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

Also, fo those that have ridden multiple Plus size tires, how much different is a 3.00" tire on a 40mm rim versus the WTB Trailblazer on a 30mm rim?


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

BXCc said:


> Also, fo those that have ridden multiple Plus size tires, how much different is a 3.00" tire on a 40mm rim versus the WTB Trailblazer on a 30mm rim?


I've had 3.0 Nobby Nic and 2.8 Trailblzer on a 45mm rim, huge difference in size and rolling.


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

Please tell us the difference in rolling!?


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

boblike said:


> Please tell us the difference in rolling!?


Well the 3.0 Nobby Nic is a lot bigger and more aggressive then a 2.8 WTB TB. Doesn't roll nearly as well. But has a lot more bite and traction. I think the 2.8 setup is a lot sportier and fun. Good setup for big travel AM or Enduro bike. Just need someone to make tires that are flimsy


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## TheUnknownRider (Oct 2, 2015)

if you refer to earlier pics in this thread, on a i40mm rim the 2.8 TB sidewall is wider than the tread, seems like a lean-over washout waiting to happen ...


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

jpec29 said:


> I've had 3.0 Nobby Nic and 2.8 Trailblzer on a 45mm rim, huge difference in size and rolling.


Is it worth getting a dedicated plus bike if you already have a normal 29er setup with WTB TB's? I won't be able to go much bigger. I don't think a real 2.8 would fit comfortably.


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

BXCc said:


> Is it worth getting a dedicated plus bike if you already have a normal 29er setup with WTB TB's? I won't be able to go much bigger. I don't think a real 2.8 would fit comfortably.


What bike do you have? I have a standard Specialized Enduro 29er, the WTB set up fits with tons of room. 3.0 is snug, no reason for me to buy a dedicated one for me personally. My Enduro has several advantages over a Stumpy 6Fattie. If you can fit a real 2.8 when some good options come out I don't see any reason for buying a dedicated bike. Easy upgrade to try out too and can switch back to 29 quickly


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## BXCc (May 31, 2012)

jpec29 said:


> What bike do you have? I have a standard Specialized Enduro 29er, the WTB set up fits with tons of room. 3.0 is snug, no reason for me to buy a dedicated one for me personally. My Enduro has several advantages over a Stumpy 6Fattie. If you can fit a real 2.8 when some good options come out I don't see any reason for buying a dedicated bike. Easy upgrade to try out too and can switch back to 29 quickly


It's a generic carbon HT that is the same as a Specialized SJ. Right now it pulls double duty as a 27.5+ in the off season and a standard 29er during the summer. I would probably keep it as a light gravel grinder as the frames aren't super expensive and just get the dedicated plus bike. Which would be another "china direct" frame.

I'm also thinking / hoping that a true 3" tire would suffice on hard pack snow as I am not a huge fan of the handling of fat bikes. Anyone care to chime in on that theory?


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## ledude (Feb 12, 2004)

TheUnknownRider said:


> if you refer to earlier pics in this thread, on a i40mm rim the 2.8 TB sidewall is wider than the tread, seems like a lean-over washout waiting to happen ...


That's exactly what happened to me on my TB/Scraper setup + Kona HONZO the other day....did a left handed lean over at a usul spot on my regular ride and BAM! I ate it hard, so hard my helmet/sunglasses came flying off.. Crazy I didn't even get hurt.


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

TheUnknownRider said:


> if you refer to earlier pics in this thread, on a i40mm rim the 2.8 TB sidewall is wider than the tread, seems like a lean-over washout waiting to happen ...


I've been continually surprised how well the trailblazer works on certain terrain. It gets a lot of flak here but I've found it works much better than it looks like it should with that narrow tread. For a while, I was running them front and rear. It "looks wrong" but always surprised me with good cornering performance. My assumption is that it flexes over enough as you corner that the tread stays in contact with the ground even at deep angles. That's the benefit of the high volume and low pressures. Tires are able to flex and conform and then find grip.

As long as I've been on soil of some kind, hard pack, loam or sandy, I've found plenty of grip with the trailblazer. In these conditions, my riding buddies are unable to keep up on their "enduro" tires. I come from a motorcycle roadracing background so high speed cornering is my strongest mtb skill and I've had a lot of confidence pushing this tire hard.

Where the Trailblazer comes up short for me is on rocky step-ups and steep slickrock descents. I'm not sure if it's the harder durometer, the center strip or something else but that's where I struggle with this tire.

This pic is a screenshot from a video Ibis made to promote their wide rims but it shows an example of what may be happening with tire flex in a corner.


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## TheUnknownRider (Oct 2, 2015)

Well the WTB Breakout 2.5 is just as wide as the TB 2.8 and almost the same diameter with a more aggressive tread pattern out to the sides. Weighs more too, but is extremely tough.

Anyone have time on WTB breakout 27.5? - Page 2- Mtbr.com

Seems to me that the Trailblazer 2.8 is just as the name implies, more of a general trail tire that can soak up bumps than cornering tire. Even with low pressure and it not rolling onto the corner it still lacks the ability to penetrate in loose surface conditions. Hardpack I'm sure it's just fine. Hope to try a 2.5/2.3 BO or 2.5 BO/2.25 TB combo on my non-plus 27.5 in the near future.


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## AK47 (Mar 22, 2004)

New to 27.5+ here. My Cannondale Beast of the East 1 arrived early, and took her out (after tubeless conversion) for a shakedown ride today. I think I'm going to love the bike, but need some help with tire pressure settings. Weighing 160lbs ready to ride, any suggestions on tire pressure settings to try? Thanks!


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Well, for sure I'd say you want to be below 20 PSI, probably start somewhere around 15 PSI depending on how fast/rocky your trails are and just keep lowering the pressures until they feel good. I'd expect you'll end up somewhere between 11-15 PSI depending on how you like your bike to feel, but the faster you ride/your trails are, the higher the PSI you'll want.



AK47 said:


> New to 27.5+ here. My Cannondale Beast of the East 1 arrived early, and took her out (after tubeless conversion) for a shakedown ride today. I think I'm going to love the bike, but need some help with tire pressure settings. Weighing 160lbs ready to ride, any suggestions on tire pressure settings to try? Thanks!


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## AK47 (Mar 22, 2004)

LyNx said:


> Well, for sure I'd say you want to be below 20 PSI, probably start somewhere around 15 PSI depending on how fast/rocky your trails are and just keep lowering the pressures until they feel good. I'd expect you'll end up somewhere between 11-15 PSI depending on how you like your bike to feel, but the faster you ride/your trails are, the higher the PSI you'll want.


Thank you!


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

2.8 Nobby Nic on I45 scraper


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## chiliconcrosso (Feb 24, 2012)

Weird, I have oem "3.0" Performance NN on 40mm internal width rims and they are a little smaller than your 2.8s. Are those EVOs on your bike.


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## jpec29 (Jul 22, 2015)

chiliconcrosso said:


> Weird, I have oem "3.0" Performance NN on 40mm internal width rims and they are a little smaller than your 2.8s. Are those EVOs on your bike.


Yes it's a evo, got a 3.0 on front it's huge. All my tires have measured wider then reported


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## chiliconcrosso (Feb 24, 2012)

Interesting. My local trails are generally hard pack and I would like to order 2.8 Rocket Rons. Have you seen those in person yet?


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## island trader (Jun 11, 2007)

edited


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## island trader (Jun 11, 2007)

Does anyone know when the ground control and purgatory 2.8 are going to become available? These will fit my bike perfectly! Thanks


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## UtahJohn (Feb 6, 2014)

I have used both Stan's and OS, and prefer OS. Stan's dries up so fast, and in my tires (Schwalbe) it weeps the sidewalls constantly. The OS is oil based and lasts a LOT longer before a refresh is needed. The OS does have to be cleaned out at refresh time, there will be latex balls rolling around in there!

On topic, I'm looking to do a 2nd wheel/tire set for my bike, in B+. It looks like a ton of fun! Anyone know what size will fit on a Mk3 Nomad? I suspect the limit will be my 27.5 Pike up front. I currently have 2.4" Magic Mary up front, with a 2.35 Nobby Nic in back. I have run the Rocket Rons too, and they seem too delicate to me for my rocky trails. I even have a couple Nobby Nics with under 20 miles on them with holes in them, very disappointing and expensive.



MikenIke said:


> I havent tried, or really even seen much orange seal here, but will have to ask for and try it next time. Everybody i know uses Stan's with very little mention of Cafe Latex.


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

bikeny said:


> There is PLENTY of talk about that tire and tire size on the Fat Bike forum as it's a fat bike tire. Not so much talk about it in this forum as it's not a Plus tire. I'm pretty sure it will not fit in any Plus bike.


I just got a sample of the Hodag 650B 3.8 and I can't agree that it's a "fat" and not a "plus", arbitrary as those classes are.

While the tire is named a "3.8" it is listed as a 584x88 which means it is rated as a 3.5" tire. It's b2b brand new measures at 215mm which means it will reach its rated width on a traditional 50mm plus rim. Not really different than plus so far.

The 215mm b2b also means that its internal casing height will be 77mm, 19mm taller than a 2.4"/155mm b2b tire. That results in virtually the same rolling diameter as a 29er Goma, Trail Boss or Conti TK and is perfectly sized to match a 29er 2.4.

I would say that this tire is certainly a plus tire by the measure of the "same size as 29er" hype. It's clearly in another league from a chunk and weight standpoint. I think it will be an interesting experiment as I expect it may fit in some 29er forks.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

craigsj said:


> I just got a sample of the Hodag 650B 3.8 and I can't agree that it's a "fat" and not a "plus", arbitrary as those classes are.
> 
> While the tire is named a "3.8" it is listed as a 584x88 which means it is rated as a 3.5" tire. It's b2b brand new measures at 215mm which means it will reach its rated width on a traditional 50mm plus rim. Not really different than plus so far.
> 
> ...


Imagine that, another tire that comes in well short of it's rated size! It's disappointing that the tire is that small(for the fat tire crowd), but that may be a good thing for some people(plus tire crowd). Did you weight tire? I would also like to see what you get for a diameter measurement after mounting it, as there seem to be some varying numbers floating around. I may have to pick one up and try it as a front tire as well.

BTW, I like how you claim the tire categories are arbitrary, and then make you own definitions for the categories. I would still consider a 3.5 tire a Fat tire.


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

bikeny said:


> BTW, I like how you claim the tire categories are arbitrary, and then make you own definitions for the categories. I would still consider a 3.5 tire a Fat tire.


Yes, I've made my own, my definitions are logical, evenly spaced, align cleanly with existing categories and prove that "fat" and "plus" are meaningless distinctions. Doing that shows that categories are arbitrary, exactly the point and the purpose of the work.

But sure, you can insist that a 3.5 tire is "fat" while a "3.25" is "plus" and the Surly Larry, even smaller than a 3.5, is "fat" because Surly says so, just like you can insist the TB is a "plus" even though it's smaller than a Breakout which is not. You do these things because it suits you, not because there's logic to it.

The Hodag matches 29er diameters better than other B+ tires so it is more suitable IF that is your goal. Whether it's a better tire for your application is another matter but calling it "fat" vs "plus" is irrelevant.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

craigsj said:


> Yes, I've made my own, my definitions are logical, evenly spaced, align cleanly with existing categories and prove that "fat" and "plus" are meaningless distinctions. Doing that shows that categories are arbitrary, exactly the point and the purpose of the work.
> 
> But sure, you can insist that a 3.5 tire is "fat" while a "3.25" is "plus" and the Surly Larry, even smaller than a 3.5, is "fat" because Surly says so, just like you can insist the TB is a "plus" even though it's smaller than a Breakout which is not. You do these things because it suits you, not because there's logic to it.
> 
> The Hodag matches 29er diameters better than other B+ tires so it is more suitable IF that is your goal. Whether it's a better tire for your application is another matter but calling it "fat" vs "plus" is irrelevant.


Why do ALWAYS have to get so defensive and attack everyone who might have a slightly different opinion than you? I don't get it.

So what are your logical categories and definitions?

Fat and Plus are not meaningless distinctions, they give people an idea of tire size. Can they overlap? absolutely. Do they tell you exactly what size a tire is? Absolutely not. What's a XC tire? does that mean 1.9"? or 2.3"? These arbitrary categories tell you something, not everything.

I'm not 'insisting' on anything. All I said was I would consider a 3.5" tire a fat tire. You can call it whatever you want. A 3.5" tire is not going to fit in pretty much every Plus size bike frame out there.

And who ever pronounced: Plus tire = matching the diameter of a 29er tire? I guess that's your definition? But what 29er tire, the biggest 2.4" tire? or a 2.0 tire?

I agree with a lot of stuff you post, but completely disagree with how you say it. Pretty sure that's a common sentiment around these parts.


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

bikeny said:


> Did you weight tire? I would also like to see what you get for a diameter measurement after mounting it, as there seem to be some varying numbers floating around.


Mine weighs 1240g and measures 742mm in diameter on a 35mm internal width rim. This is inflated to 20 psi with no stretching time, brand new.

Here it is next to a Chupa 29+. The Chupa is 23mm taller but is mounted on a 6mm narrower rim.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

craigsj said:


> Mine weighs 1240g and measures 742mm in diameter on a 35mm internal width rim. This is inflated to 20 psi with no stretching time, brand new.
> 
> Here it is next to a Chupa 29+. The Chupa is 23mm taller but is mounted on a 6mm narrower rim.
> View attachment 1042841


Thanks for that, interesting. My current front tire (Duro Crux 27.5x3.25") is 740mm diameter on the same size rim, 15 PSI & after some use, & 1072g.


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

bikeny said:


> Why do ALWAYS have to get so defensive and attack everyone who might have a slightly different opinion than you? I don't get it.


You don't get it? What is this you posted?



> BTW, I like how you claim the tire categories are arbitrary, and then make you own definitions for the categories.


You don't get when I respond directly to your insults?



bikeny said:


> So what are your logical categories and definitions?


You're the one who claims I've made "definitions", I've never said any such thing. I've simply defined a range of tire sizes, named A-Z, that are perfectly spaced and correspond strongly with existing tire sizes from road all the way though fat. It makes perfect sense, probably too much sense for it to be adopted by anyone.



bikeny said:


> Fat and Plus are not meaningless distinctions, they give people an idea of tire size. Can they overlap? absolutely. Do they tell you exactly what size a tire is? Absolutely not. What's a XC tire? does that mean 1.9"? or 2.3"? These arbitrary categories tell you something, not everything.


Sure let's wallow in terms that don't really mean anything and then claim they mean everything! Wouldn't tire size alone "give people an idea of tire size"?

If fat and plus can overlap then why do you insist that the Hodag is fat and not plus?



bikeny said:


> And who ever pronounced: Plus tire = matching the diameter of a 29er tire? I guess that's your definition? But what 29er tire, the biggest 2.4" tire? or a 2.0 tire?


A virtue extolled by WTB when they claimed to have invented B+. Of course, by 29er they meant the Nano 

What 29er tire? The one most likely used as an alternative if plus were not available, of course. That's a 2.4, not a 2.0. Why not choose a 700x23, that's a "29er" too.

Such stupid arguments that you put forth are not meant to inform anyone, bikeny, they are simply meant to argue.



bikeny said:


> I agree with a lot of stuff you post, but completely disagree with how you say it. Pretty sure that's a common sentiment around these parts.


I don't really care, bikeny, I'm not here to make friends with cliquish people like you nor do I care for what your comment suggests. For someone who "agrees with a lot of stuff" I post, you sure like to argue weakly about it. I suppose you feel you need to since you're apparently king "around these parts".


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

craigsj said:


> You're the one who claims I've made "definitions", I've never said any such thing.





craigsj said:


> Yes, I've made my own, my definitions are logical, evenly spaced, align cleanly with existing categories and prove that "fat" and "plus" are meaningless distinctions.


I'm sorry, where have you spelled out your:



craigsj said:


> range of tire sizes, named A-Z, that are perfectly spaced and correspond strongly with existing tire sizes from road all the way though fat


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

Anyone got the Vee Bulldozer 2.8?


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

savo said:


> Anyone got the Vee Bulldozer 2.8?


looks like it would make a nice front tire with a trax fatty i the rear


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

Mounted at Nobby Nic 3.0 on a 32.6mm ID rim @ 20psi. 2.900" on the dot. Both tires. 

Mounted WTB Trailblazer 2.8 on a 32.6mm ID rim @20psi. 2.457". My 2.4" Goma at 20psi on the same ID rims is 2.497. Nothing PLUS about the Trailblazer. What a joke.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Justin MD said:


> Mounted at Nobby Nic 3.0 on a 32.6mm ID rim @ 20psi. 2.900" on the dot. Both tires.
> 
> Mounted WTB Trailblazer 2.8 on a 32.6mm ID rim @20psi. 2.457". My 2.4" Goma at 20psi on the same ID rims is 2.497. Nothing PLUS about the Trailblazer. What a joke.


It's not a joke and it's not new news. The TrailBlazer is meant as a conversion tire for existing 29er frames. Everyone knows it's not a true 2.8. I can't handle a other trailblazer not a 2.8 whine


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## lancia_aurelia (Jan 18, 2016)

Boost Lyrik 27,5 w/ 3,0 Bridger on i45 scraper


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2016)

obs08 said:


> It's not a joke and it's not new news. The TrailBlazer is for existing 29er frames. Everyone knows it's not a true 2.8. I can't handle a other trailblazer not a 2.8 whine


No, the Trailblazer is a joke.
The Trailblazer was not "meant as a conversion tire", it was advertised explicitly as the first in a new, invented by WTB, format.
29er conversions were a "feature" of B+, not a separate class of tire according to WTB.
29er "conversions" themselves are a fraud, few are possible, the BB drop change is huge, and the effect not worth having.
Among conversion tires, the TB is the worst as it is the smallest.
If you can't stand whine, stop whining.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

craigsj said:


> No, the Trailblazer is a joke.
> The Trailblazer was not "meant as a conversion tire", it was advertised explicitly as the first in a new, invented by WTB, format.
> 29er conversions were a "feature" of B+, not a separate class of tire according to WTB.
> 29er "conversions" themselves are a fraud, few are possible, the BB drop change is huge, and the effect not worth having.
> ...


dude gtf over it. the trailblazer has worked well for many people. this isnt the first time ive seen you get butt hurt over the trailblazer topic. just get over it


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2016)

obs08 said:


> dude gtf over it.


Could say the same to you. The thread could do without the entirety of your useless comment.

For "many people" any tire works well. Doesn't mean the TB is anything other than a fraud.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

anyway, does anyone have ride time on the bomboloni 27.5? havent found much reviews but it looks similar to the chupacabras i had and enjoyed


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

Well I went out an rode the TB on my local trail. .8mile long. 400' drop. 11mph avg.

Like riding on ice. It works fine while flat/level. Climbs ok. But as soon as you lean over to try and rail flat corners its HORRIBLE. And I had to stop mid run because the 22psi I had in it was not enough. Went up to 26 and it didn't fold but it was even sketchier. I'm pulling it off and taking it back to my LBS. Effing junk tire. The only tire I have been on that was near as bad was a 2.0 AKA that was on a XC I bought.

Maybe it works ok for the slower trails. or the hard pack trails with berms so you can keep the bike level with the ground but as soon as I leaned on it there was serious drift. I even looped the bike like 120 degrees towards the end. Eye opener. My Goma's are SOOOOO much better than that tire.


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

Justin MD said:


> Well I went out an rode the TB on my local trail. .8mile long. 400' drop. 11mph avg.... I'm pulling it off and taking it back to my LBS.


I totally get that the tire is not so great, but please don't take it back to your LBS used. Just sell it to somebody else for whom it will be sufficient.


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## lancia_aurelia (Jan 18, 2016)

Try Vee 2,8 Trax Fatty (rear) and WTB 3,0 Bridger (front) instead of TB. I did


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

I have a 3.0 Nobby Nic on the front. Seems solid. So I have a 2.8 for the rear on order. If that doesn't work I might see if a Purgatory will fit.


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

iamkeith said:


> I totally get that the tire is not so great, but please don't take it back to your LBS used. Just sell it to somebody else for whom it will be sufficient.


It was $65. I'm not willing to swallow that. And it's dangerous IMO. I have a good relationship with my LBS. They will handle it with WTB.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

Justin MD said:


> It was $65. I'm not willing to swallow that. And it's dangerous IMO. I have a good relationship with my LBS. They will handle it with WTB.


i think what he is saying is that your lbs or wtb should have eat the cost because you dont like the characteristics of the tire. i dont think wtb wants to swallow it either


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## MMcG (Jul 7, 2003)

craigsj said:


> I just got a sample of the Hodag 650B 3.8 and I can't agree that it's a "fat" and not a "plus", arbitrary as those classes are.
> 
> While the tire is named a "3.8" it is listed as a 584x88 which means it is rated as a 3.5" tire. It's b2b brand new measures at 215mm which means it will reach its rated width on a traditional 50mm plus rim. Not really different than plus so far.
> 
> ...


How wide is the rim on the Bontrager 27.5 Fat bikes? And how would that tire measure out to on those rims?

Ahhhh nevermind - 80mm rims.......


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## mrsa101 (Jul 19, 2011)

can anyone measure their 27.5x3.5 tire, width and height inflated on a rim? anything 3.5 or larger, not smaller.


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## fishwrinkle (Jul 11, 2012)

i'm looking into building my 1st set of 650b wheels and was wondering what is considered minimal inner width for a b+? i have 29" dually's wrapped with minions and love em, but wagon wheels are to big for me when it comes to dual slalom. for DS i am going to build fr570's which have 27.5 inner width. just curious and hopeful that i don't have to build two sets


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## Collins (Feb 23, 2013)

I'm sure many others have had this idea -- I'd really love to see an list of specific tire makes/models with corresponding width and diameter while mounted on certain rims. I'll start here with one I was looking for, but maybe this should be its own thread...
Yes, this should be in mm, but no caliper available. Apologies for the rough start:

Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27.5 x 2.8
i40mm rim
Width: 2.765" after 3 rides 
Diameter 28 3/8"


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

Justin MD said:


> I have a 3.0 Nobby Nic on the front. Seems solid. So I have a 2.8 for the rear on order. If that doesn't work I might see if a Purgatory will fit.


I switched from a Trailblazer to a 2.8 Nobby Nic in the back of my Canfield Nimble 9. It has less volume than the Trailblazer and subsequently I find I'm running an extra pound of pressure in back to prevent rim strikes. I miss the higher volume of the TB but definitely prefer the tread pattern and grip of the NN. It also has a little less diameter so you'll drop bb height a little more.

I don't know what you weigh or how you ride but your previous comments on the TB indicated that you were running what I consider very high pressures for a plus tire. At 190lbs with an internal rim width of 35mm I needed 17psi with the TB in back and now 18 with 2.8NN. These tires will struggle to find good grip in the 25psi range. With a WTB Bridger up front I'm now down to 13.5psi. I aggressively ride rocky east coast trails with high speed loose descents and this works for me. While the TB is a compromise, (so is the 2.8 NN afaic) I think you may have better luck at lower pressures.


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## neblackb (May 8, 2009)

Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27.5 x 2.8 are too small.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

neblackb said:


> I have a brand new Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27.5 x 2.8 pacestar tire that I need to get rid of. Willing to let go for $70 shipped. Venmo is preferred payment. PM me if interested. I didn't post in classifieds because I don't get why I should have to pay $2.00 for a tire ad, but bike ads are free.


They are cheaper than that on ebay already but glws


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## neblackb (May 8, 2009)

obs08 said:


> They are cheaper than that on ebay already but glws[/QUOT
> 
> Yup


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

neblackb said:


> That really sucks. Cheapest I saw on ebay was $69 shipped. I will do $65 shipped if someone wants it.


Try pinkbike


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

RPK3 said:


> I switched from a Trailblazer to a 2.8 Nobby Nic in the back of my Canfield Nimble 9. It has less volume than the Trailblazer and subsequently I find I'm running an extra pound of pressure in back to prevent rim strikes. I miss the higher volume of the TB but definitely prefer the tread pattern and grip of the NN. It also has a little less diameter so you'll drop bb height a little more.
> 
> I don't know what you weigh or how you ride but your previous comments on the TB indicated that you were running what I consider very high pressures for a plus tire. At 190lbs with an internal rim width of 35mm I needed 17psi with the TB in back and now 18 with 2.8NN. These tires will struggle to find good grip in the 25psi range. With a WTB Bridger up front I'm now down to 13.5psi. I aggressively ride rocky east coast trails with high speed loose descents and this works for me. While the TB is a compromise, (so is the 2.8 NN afaic) I think you may have better luck at lower pressures.


I tried 22psi. That's where I ride my Goma TNT. No dice. The tire was tucking on hard bermed corners/g-outs. Pumped it up to 26psi, where I ride the DHF, and the tuck was better but it lost all traction. Super square profile.

And for those that want to know, my LBS is installing the TB on a customers Pivot 429. The 29 that came on the bike was traded in. Shop owner said it was a wash. Love my LBS.


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## Justin MD (Sep 30, 2013)

Just installed the 2.8 Nic on my 32.6mm rim. 20psi, 2.735"


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

mounted on nextie junglefox2 45mm internal, 87mm casing, 93mm tread, 745mm diameter. this was imediately after mounting tubeless, at 25psi, so it might stretch a bit, but the casing is pretty robust (1250g) so maybe not.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

that tire is beast!


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

dRjOn said:


> View attachment 1044353
> 
> 
> mounted on nextie junglefox2 45mm internal, 87mm casing, 93mm tread, 745mm diameter. this was imediately after mounting tubeless, at 25psi, so it might stretch a bit, but the casing is pretty robust (1250g) so maybe not.
> ...


What bike are you running these on?


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

well, this is a front wheel. it will mount to my Vertigo fat bike or my jones. the fat bike has a maxxis mammoth rear at present...i *might* build up a 27.5 rear for it. the jones currently has a trailblazer on the rear and a chupacabra up front...


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

Veetire bulldozer 27.5-2.8" received.
Strangely, bead to bead is 180mm, exactly the same as purgatory 3.0 is, but they clame 70mm versus 75mm of purgatory wide.
Bulldozer looks very resistant with a weight around 1.100gr and the sidewalls thick as a brick.
I have to wait until my traxfatty 2.8 wares out. I hope that 70mm were the true size, but with 180mm bb I think that maybe it stretchs almost nothing or it gives a bigger diameter to give only 70mm width. Anyone has mount this tire?


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## Jpcannavo (Sep 4, 2015)

dRjOn said:


> well, this is a front wheel. it will mount to my Vertigo fat bike or my jones. the fat bike has a maxxis mammoth rear at present...i *might* build up a 27.5 rear for it. the jones currently has a trailblazer on the rear and a chupacabra up front...


Thanks for the measurements dr. Those might actually fit my Spec 6 fattie.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

no worries!

got out today on it and it is impressive - conditions were sloppy and very slick on the roots and rocks. it is sure footed and rolls well given the knobbliness....although it replaced a chupacabra on a 29er nextie rim, at a gain of 400g, it felt pretty sporty...like it!

there is no doubt it is smaller than a full 29+ - strangely noticeable given its 2cm less diameter...not really that much all in all, but its a very secure tyre. like it so far...


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## iamkeith (Feb 5, 2010)

dRjOn said:


> no worries!
> 
> got out today on it and it is impressive - conditions were sloppy and very slick on the roots and rocks. it is sure footed and rolls well given the knobbliness....although it replaced a chupacabra on a 29er nextie rim, at a gain of 400g, it felt pretty sporty...like it!
> 
> there is no doubt it is smaller than a full 29+ - strangely noticeable given its 2cm less diameter...not really that much all in all, but its a very secure tyre. like it so far...


Thanks for posting! I checked out your video, too. That tire really looks like it was just made for the front of a Jones. Perfect size! Which is great, because that's where I hoped to use it too! I'm going to do it now for sure, but have at least 4 months before I can ride it, so will hold out just a wee bit longer in hopes of some other rim offerings . So jealous of the fact that you can ride dirt this time of year - even if it's sloppy.

Can you remind us what rear tire you have it paired with in these photos? [edit: never mind - you already did.] I wonder if the noticeable ride difference, due to the switch from the chupacabra, is mostly due to a steeper head tube angle.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

iamkeith said:


> Thanks for posting! I checked out your video, too. That tire really looks like it was just made for the front of a Jones. Perfect size! Which is great, because that's where I hoped to use it too! I'm going to do it now for sure, but have at least 4 months before I can ride it, so will hold out just a wee bit longer in hopes of some other rim offerings . So jealous of the fact that you can ride dirt this time of year - even if it's sloppy.
> 
> Can you remind us what rear tire you have it paired with in these photos? [edit: never mind - you already did.] I wonder if the noticeable ride difference, due to the switch from the chupacabra, is mostly due to a steeper head tube angle.


yeah, for sure. the trailblazer rear (smaller by a chunk than a beefy 29er) and the 29+ front tilted things back pretty far. it was fun on the down, but was a fish out of water in some ways...this brings things back a bit steeper again - still a wee bit slacker than a 'normal' jones would be.


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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

Is there a way to have a table on the first page of this sticky that is editable with all the information gathered here? I'm happy to work on it, I think it should live within the first post on this thread.


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## Collins (Feb 23, 2013)

^+1

There's this good info from user OhioPT on another thread
http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/wide-rim-high-volume-29er-vs-27-5-a-998579.html

27.5 PLUS:
-A 2.8" Trail Blazer on a 27.5" rim with a 30mm IW is 719-724mm (28.3-28.5") diameter and 58-60mm tread width (but 65mm casing width).
-A 2.8" Nobby Nic on a 35mm IW rim has a diameter of 711mm (28") and a 66mm tread width when brand new. The tread width stretches to 69mm over time, and not sure what the diameter will stretch to.
-A 3.0" Specialized Ground Control on a 29mm IW rim is 730mm (28.74") diameter and 74.5mm wide.


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## Guest (Jan 25, 2016)

Collins said:


> -A 2.8" Trail Blazer on a 27.5" rim with a 30mm IW is 719-724mm (28.3-28.5") diameter ...


That is not correct. It is much smaller in diameter than that.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

craigsj said:


> That is not correct. It is much smaller in diameter than that.


So if he measured them himself, he is incorrect?


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## OhioPT (Jul 14, 2012)

craigsj said:


> That is not correct. It is much smaller in diameter than that.


That is not my measurement, but I saw those figures in 3-4 reviews for the TB.


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2016)

obs08 said:


> So if he measured them himself, he is incorrect?


Yes, who measures it doesn't define it's correctness.

The TB is 705-710mm in diameter.


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2016)

OhioPT said:


> That is not my measurement, but I saw those figures in 3-4 reviews for the TB.


There were a number of conspicuously dishonest reviews of the TB when it came out. WTB was pushing a narrative and enlisted some "journalists" to the cause. The early measurements of the tire gradually gave way to inflated versions as those "journalists" realized the numbers weren't favorable.

Below is a TB immediately in front of a Goma 29x3.4. The Goma is 35mm larger in diameter and is in the 740mm range overall. Claiming the TB is 724mm is overstating the size by 20mm. Probably got that number from Guitar Ted...


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

craigsj said:


> There were a number of conspicuously dishonest reviews of the TB when it came out. WTB was pushing a narrative and enlisted some "journalists" to the cause. The early measurements of the tire gradually gave way to inflated versions as those "journalists" realized the numbers weren't favorable.
> 
> Below is a TB immediately in front of a Goma 29x3.4. The Goma is 35mm larger in diameter and is in the 740mm range overall. Claiming the TB is 724mm is overstating the size by 20mm. Probably got that number from Guitar Ted...
> 
> View attachment 1045448


My lightly used TB on a scraper rim inflated to 10 PSI measures 2263mm circumference yielding a diameter of 720mm. This correlates reasonably well to the 718mm I got by eyeballing a tape measure. I'm not a big fan of how much sealant I had weeping through the sidewalls of the tire so I decided to go a different route. Accordingly, I'd be more than happy to ship you my tire for independent verification.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

craigsj said:


> There were a number of conspicuously dishonest reviews of the TB when it came out. WTB was pushing a narrative and enlisted some "journalists" to the cause. The early measurements of the tire gradually gave way to inflated versions as those "journalists" realized the numbers weren't favorable.
> 
> Below is a TB immediately in front of a Goma 29x3.4. The Goma is 35mm larger in diameter and is in the 740mm range overall. Claiming the TB is 724mm is overstating the size by 20mm. Probably got that number from Guitar Ted...
> 
> View attachment 1045448


errr. i know we have sort of done this before...but your trailblazer is only 704mm diameter? edited as i dont want to start another too-ing and fro-ing.

i think guitar teds blog had initially stated around the 735 mark diameter and i agree it is doubtful any are that big - though if yours is truly 704-5mm diameter then we *are* seeing 20mm variation, in one direction. mine are 725-6 diamter on 35-50mm external rims. i am happy that my measurement is accurate i used 2 right angled steel rules, fixed together and measured multiple points. i *do* agree this is smaller than most 'big' 29er tyres.

out of interest, i assume you are not extrapolating diameter from a width measurement and the ISO? but measuring it? you have posted diagrams of a fairly round profile tyre with a flat spot indicating rim. if you are measuring a trailblazer at, say, 65mm width, assuming profile will be round, removing, say, 5mm for flat rim section and adding the ISO, ie 584mm + 60mm x2 - that is 704mm. just tryign to work out why such a discrepancy...


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## TitanofChaos (Jun 13, 2011)

27.5x2.8 chupacabra is coming, heard from my LBS this morning

it's also listed here but out of stock of course

Bontrager Chupacabra - Trek Bicycle Store Chattanooga


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

TitanofChaos said:


> 27.5x2.8 chupacabra is coming, heard from my LBS this morning
> 
> it's also listed here but out of stock of course
> 
> ...


lol yeah its $120!!!!


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2016)

dRjOn said:


> though if yours is truly 704-5mm diameter then we *are* seeing 20mm variation, in one direction. mine are 725-6 diamter on 35-50mm external rims. i am happy that my measurement is accurate i used 2 right angled steel rules, fixed together and measured multiple points. i *do* agree this is smaller than most 'big' 29er tires.


Mine were 705-710 as best I can recall. More specifically, mine were 35mm smaller than 29x2.4 Goma's which is what I was comparing them against at that time.

My measurements were taken following the standard protocol for MTB tires. I aired them up to a (high) pressure and allowed them to settle overnight and then I measured the otherwise new tire. Measuring used tires with varying amounts of wear produces non-reproducible measurements so I don't do that. Others do and apparently the TB benefits a great deal from that. I don't personally consider that a positive for the tire as it makes me wonder how sound those casings are. I've read claims as high as 177mm b2b. That's a half inch of casing stretch, it seems mechanically unsound to me. I've seen 6mm of casing stretch on a very lightweight tire, never 12mm.



dRjOn said:


> out of interest, i assume you are not extrapolating diameter from a width measurement and the ISO? but measuring it? you have posted diagrams of a fairly round profile tyre with a flat spot indicating rim. if you are measuring a trailblazer at, say, 65mm width, assuming profile will be round, removing, say, 5mm for flat rim section and adding the ISO, ie 584mm + 60mm x2 - that is 704mm. just tryign to work out why such a discrepancy...


No, I don't do that but it's a fair question. Overall diameters can be tricky to measure and internal casing heights are easy to derive so I generally like to work that way.

Recently you posted measurements on a Hodag 3.8". You measured 745mm diameter while I measured 742. I used a 10mm narrower rim and that accounts for 2mm of the difference so I'd say we measure diameters to pretty good agreement.

I believe the early discrepancies were because advocates of the tire were changing their numbers to support their arguments. Originally, everyone's numbers were the same and agreed with mine. After I pointed out how close the TB was to other tires the numbers changed.

Now I suspect anyone measuring a tire and getting a result different from mine must be measuring after an extended break-in. Otherwise WTB would have had to make a running change and the TB is now larger. That would be surprising but not impossible.

P.S. If you look at my spreadsheet for the TB you'll see a casing height of 59mm. Adding that to the rim size gives 702mm assuming no bead overlap. Adding thread thickness pushes that to around 710mm. Perhaps the 705 number comes from the way the tire sat on the bead in my measurement.

Thing is, to get to 725, you'd need to gain 7-8mm of casing height. That would require the b2b to grow to about 185mm which would be disturbing.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Um, well, I'lll chime in with my own measurements on a Stans Flow rim....

@ 15 PSI my TB measures 28.25"/717.5mm
@ 21 PSI my TB measures 28.375"/720.7mm
@ 34 PSI my TB measures 28.50"/723.9mm

Guess I'm just like GT and posting false numbers to make it seem better than it is :skep: In a few weeks I'll have some WTB Asym i35 rims to measure it on, will see what happens then. Unfortunately no width measurements as have mislaid my calipers ATM, but will make sure to look for and find them before posting those measurements. Will see if they come up to the same or more than his on the Blunt35s.



craigsj said:


> There were a number of conspicuously dishonest reviews of the TB when it came out. WTB was pushing a narrative and enlisted some "journalists" to the cause. The early measurements of the tire gradually gave way to inflated versions as those "journalists" realized the numbers weren't favorable.
> 
> Below is a TB immediately in front of a Goma 29x3.4. The Goma is 35mm larger in diameter and is in the 740mm range overall. Claiming the TB is 724mm is overstating the size by 20mm. Probably got that number from Guitar Ted...


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

i wonder if the casing does stretch significantly. my sidewalls also weep sealant. i wouldnt normally correlate these 2 things, but its curious.


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2016)

LyNx said:


> Guess I'm just like GT and posting false numbers to make it seem better than it is :skep:


It's remarkable when someone aspires to have even GT's integrity.

I'm surprised you can even read a ruler, LyNx, considering your ongoing contempt for "engineers" and "data".

I will look forward to your proof that tires shrink in diameter as the rim gets wider, LyNx.


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2016)

dRjOn said:


> i wonder if the casing does stretch significantly. my sidewalls also weep sealant. i wouldnt normally correlate these 2 things, but its curious.


I agree and it's the most obvious explanation. I have never seen a tire stretch as much as is claimed, but either it does or there was a manufacturing change.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

craigsj said:


> It's remarkable when someone aspires to have even GT's integrity.
> 
> I'm surprised you can even read a ruler, LyNx, considering your ongoing contempt for "engineers" and "data".
> 
> I will look forward to your proof that tires shrink in diameter as the rim gets wider, LyNx.


i hope you sell any and all plus size equipment you have so i no longer have to read your posts in this sub-forum. i actually looked this morning to see if there was a way to block seeing your posts but i didnt see one. if anyone knows of an option to block people please tell me, every time i read a craigsj response, a kitten dies.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Go to his profile and click on add to ignore list. Used to be you could do it straight from a post.



obs08 said:


> i hope you sell any and all plus size equipment you have so i no longer have to read your posts in this sub-forum. i actually looked this morning to see if there was a way to block seeing your posts but i didnt see one. if anyone knows of an option to block people please tell me, every time i read a craigsj response, a kitten dies.


They do and quite a lot depending on manufacturer from my experience. Remember when I first test fit my 29+ Chronicle to my Phantom and it fit fine on a Dually45, then months later after running it on my rigid tried it again with same normal drop outs and was locked off against the frame, would not even turn.



dRjOn said:


> i wonder if the casing does stretch significantly. my sidewalls also weep sealant. i wouldnt normally correlate these 2 things, but its curious.


I don't have contempt for all engineers, just the ones like you who rely on their graphs and numbers and don't bother to do real world testing/tests. You're the type that said a humingbird could never fly, because by the numbers it was just impossible.

What would contempt of some assh0les have to do with the basic ability to use and read measuring devies? ut:



craigsj said:


> It's remarkable when someone aspires to have even GT's integrity.
> 
> I'm surprised you can even read a ruler, LyNx, considering your ongoing contempt for "engineers" and "data".
> 
> I will look forward to your proof that tires shrink in diameter as the rim gets wider, LyNx.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

name calling, speaks to the level of maturity we are dealing with here


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## cpolism (Mar 20, 2010)

RPK3 said:


> I switched from a Trailblazer to a 2.8 Nobby Nic in the back of my Canfield Nimble 9. It has less volume than the Trailblazer and subsequently I find I'm running an extra pound of pressure in back to prevent rim strikes. I miss the higher volume of the TB but definitely prefer the tread pattern and grip of the NN. It also has a little less diameter so you'll drop bb height a little more.
> 
> I don't know what you weigh or how you ride but your previous comments on the TB indicated that you were running what I consider very high pressures for a plus tire. At 190lbs with an internal rim width of 35mm I needed 17psi with the TB in back and now 18 with 2.8NN. These tires will struggle to find good grip in the 25psi range. With a WTB Bridger up front I'm now down to 13.5psi. I aggressively ride rocky east coast trails with high speed loose descents and this works for me. While the TB is a compromise, (so is the 2.8 NN afaic) I think you may have better luck at lower pressures.


I'm building up the new 2016 Nimble 9 as a B+. WTB Asym i35's with new Hope4's (boost in the front). I'm looking at the Nobby Nic's, and am curious about the 3.0 fitting in the rear. I could go big on the front with the boost, but I'm more concerned with the rear. Given that the profile of the Nobby Nic has less volume than the Trailblazer, do you think 3.0 is doable on the i35? Or should I just stick with the 2.8?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

The NN 2.8 is wider knob-to-knob than the Trailblazer. The Trailblazer is taller than the NN in the same size. 

I mentioned this previously, but a better option may be the less aggressive tread on the Rocket Ron 3.0.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

craigsj said:


> Yes, who measures it doesn't define it's correctness.
> 
> The TB is 705-710mm in diameter.


Thats not tall enough. I am trying to go to around 730mm diameter in a plus size tire (on 35mm internal rim) if it exists...possibly a Vee Crown Gem or Bulldozer 2.8 to 3.0?

2016 Vee ({(Plusbike Tire Line Up!)})! |


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anybody know if the Specialized Plus tires are going to happen in a 2.8 size, or if the 3.0 sizes are undersized at all? Can't find anything on Specialized's site.

Edit: Found it:

a well used set @ 15 psi, 60°F

on Stumpy 6fattie 29mm ID rims: 68mm casing, 74mm knobs (2.7"/2.9")

on Fuse 6fattie 38mm ID rims: 72mm casing, 76mm knobs (2.8"/3.0")


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## Klurejr (Oct 13, 2006)

Stop with the personal attacks. No name calling, etc.

Mtbr Posting Guidelines


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## RPK3 (Aug 18, 2005)

Klurejr said:


> Stop with the personal attacks. No name calling, etc.
> 
> Mtbr Posting Guidelines


Hmmm. I wonder who that could be directed at...

Maybe it's Mr. (when you don't agree with me, my infallible science and my giant brain, I will sling personal attacks just to show you what kind of guy I really am)SJ.


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## trekninja (Oct 22, 2007)

RPK3 said:


> Hmmm. I wonder who that could be directed at...
> 
> Maybe it's Mr. (when you don't agree with me, my infallible science and my giant brain, I will sling personal attacks just to show you what kind of guy I really am)SJ.


lol true!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Recently compared my Trailblazer on Flow's to a Nobby Nic 2.8 on Syncros 40mm rims that are stock on the Genuis LT720 Plus. I've long thought that the NN2.8 would be a great rear tire for my 275 bike with big clearances, but now I'm not so sure. On 40mm rims it is a substantial tire.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Does anyone know if a Nobby Nick will fit a regular 27.5 Pike? Some people say it's wide but not so tall which is where the Pike tends to have clearance issues.


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## neblackb (May 8, 2009)

GRPABT1 said:


> Does anyone know if a Nobby Nick will fit a regular 27.5 Pike? Some people say it's wide but not so tall which is where the Pike tends to have clearance issues.


I don't know for sure, but I would think that the 2.8 Nobby Nic would fit. I bought one for my 6Fattie and it was a lot smaller than I expected.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

GRPABT1 said:


> Does anyone know if a Nobby Nick will fit a regular 27.5 Pike? Some people say it's wide but not so tall which is where the Pike tends to have clearance issues.


I think I read the diameter is around 711 so I'm pretty sure it will fit.

In fact I just ordered one tonight to try this out exactly. Unfortunately I won't have it for another week, but I'll post my results here later


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

Vee tire Bulldozer 27.5 2.8" is 70mm in 36mm internal rim. It is much more resistant at first impression than the rest of tires I have try: Purgatory, Nobby nic, trax fatty, bridger, trailblazer. Soon will test it on the rear paired with a Crown Gem 3.0 for the front.


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## sierraoffroad (May 14, 2014)

I'm looking for a fairly in expensive tire i can add studs to for my Beast of the East 2.
i like the WTB bridgers it came with and would like to leave them the way they are. the nobby nic looks nice for studding, but would like to find something around the 50.00 range.


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## Cody01 (Jul 23, 2014)

pplucena said:


> Vee tire Bulldozer 27.5 2.8" is 70mm in 36mm internal rim. It is much more resistant at first impression than the rest of tires I have try: Purgatory, Nobby nic, trax fatty, bridger, trailblazer. Soon will test it on the rear paired with a Crown Gem 3.0 for the front.


So you like the Bulldozer 2.8? Who sells them? I was thinking about trying those with some WTB ASYM i35's on my Trek Fuel.


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

I have not test the bulldozer, just mount and messure, but ir looks a very resistant tire. Maybe next week I have the New wheels laced and mount the combo crown gem 3.0 / bulldozer 2.8 
I bought them in NextdaytyresUK.
In US can be ordered in Vee web I think.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

what are the options for a tire that is as big or bigger in diameter than a 29"x2.4"? say at least 740mm, possibly more.
are 3.25 big enough? are there anything bigger apart the Hodag 3.8? Panaracer 3.5? Duro Crux 3.25?


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## OhioPT (Jul 14, 2012)

savo said:


> what are the options for a tire that is as big or bigger in diameter than a 29"x2.4"? say at least 740mm, possibly more.
> are 3.25 big enough? are there anything bigger apart the Hodag 3.8? Panaracer 3.5? Duro Crux 3.25?


Not sure, but i think the tire would have to be at least a true 3.5-3.8".


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

savo said:


> what are the options for a tire that is as big or bigger in diameter than a 29"x2.4"? say at least 740mm, possibly more.
> are 3.25 big enough? are there anything bigger apart the Hodag 3.8? Panaracer 3.5? Duro Crux 3.25?


From reading up on the Fatbike forum, the 27.5 x 3.8 Hodag measures around 750 to 755, and seems to be more like a 3.5 tire. The Panaracer 3.5 is not even close to that big, it's more like a 2.9. The Duro Crux 3.25 and the Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 are the biggest current 27.5 plus tires, but I'm not sure exactly how tall they measure.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

The first question would be what bike are you putting this on? 

If you've got a 29er that you prefer with 29x2.4, more than likely that bike would have an acceptable BB height with 29x2.2, and therefore a 275x3 tire really won't be much different. 

Secondly, if its a 29er from the factory, more than likely you wont be able to fit a 275x3.25 tire in the rear chainstay anyhow. 

Basically I think people over analyze BB height more than they need to.


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I just measured my year old 27.5 x 3.25 Vee Trax Fatty on Nextie 50mm rims at 15psi. 77mm wide at the knobs, 80mm wide at the carcass. 747mm in diameter. I remember those numbers when new at a random pressure being 75mm, 75mm, and 737mm.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

bikeny said:


> From reading up on the Fatbike forum, the 27.5 x 3.8 Hodag measures around 750 to 755, and seems to be more like a 3.5 tire. The Panaracer 3.5 is not even close to that big, it's more like a 2.9. The Duro Crux 3.25 and the Vee Trax Fatty 3.25 are the biggest current 27.5 plus tires, but I'm not sure exactly how tall they measure.


my sources have the 27.5 Hodag at substantially less than that. I'll report when I have mine mounted on wednesday.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Gigantic said:


> my sources have the 27.5 Hodag at substantially less than that. I'll report when I have mine mounted on wednesday.


I'll be interested to see what you get for measurements. Walt, Mikesee and others have posted measurements from 745 to 755. There is a HUGE thread in the Fatbike forum about this tire size, worth a read. Look around page 14 for so for measurements.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

neblackb said:


> Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27.5 x 2.8 are too small.


What is meant by "too small"? Can you measure your 2.8 NN tire mounted to the rim with width and height?


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

savo said:


> what are the options for a tire that is as big or bigger in diameter than a 29"x2.4"? say at least 740mm, possibly more.
> are 3.25 big enough? are there anything bigger apart the Hodag 3.8? Panaracer 3.5? Duro Crux 3.25?


I have desperately been waiting more tire options in true 27.5x 3-3.25 format, but all new tires seem to come very small.

So the answer is that if you want something similar to 29 x 2.35 outer diameter the vee traxx 3.25 is still the only option.

Even that might be discontinued by now.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

bikeny said:


> I'll be interested to see what you get for measurements. Walt, Mikesee and others have posted measurements from 745 to 755. There is a HUGE thread in the Fatbike forum about this tire size, worth a read. Look around page 14 for so for measurements.


I haven't yet measured them, but they're quite a bit narrower on WTB Scrapers than a fbn on a Marge lite, which is about 3.5" wide. Plenty of room on a bucksaw.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

rikardo said:


> I have desperately been waiting more tire options in true 27.5x 3-3.25 format, but all new tires seem to come very small.
> 
> So the answer is that if you want something similar to 29 x 2.35 outer diameter the vee traxx 3.25 is still the only option.
> 
> ...


The Duro Crux is about the same size. Why do you say the 3.25 Trax Fatty might be discontinued??


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## neblackb (May 8, 2009)

NH Mtbiker said:


> What is meant by "too small"? Can you measure your 2.8 NN tire mounted to the rim with width and height?


I sold the tire right after I put it on. I am on a 6fattie with Ibis 741 rims. I got used to the Specialized 3.0 tires. I didn't think that the 2.8 would be that much of a difference, but it was. I didn't ever measure them, but they are significantly smaller in width and height. I decided to go with the Schwalbe 3.0 tires. I have one on, and it is also smaller than the Specialized 3.0, but not by much. I'm willing to try them and see how it is.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

If I were to have a bike built custom I'd try to get it to fit a 93mm wide tire. Probably 83mm BB and Boost Hubs. Why? I think we're likely to see more "small" 275x3.8 tires than we are "big" 275x3.25 tires.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

bikeny said:


> I'll be interested to see what you get for measurements. Walt, Mikesee and others have posted measurements from 745 to 755. There is a HUGE thread in the Fatbike forum about this tire size, worth a read. Look around page 14 for so for measurements.


3.5" at the knobs:







3.375" at the casing: 







740mm diameter at 15psi, to the top of the tread.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

neblackb said:


> I sold the tire right after I put it on. I am on a 6fattie with Ibis 741 rims. I got used to the Specialized 3.0 tires. I didn't think that the 2.8 would be that much of a difference, but it was. I didn't ever measure them, but they are significantly smaller in width and height. I decided to go with the Schwalbe 3.0 tires. I have one on, and it is also smaller than the Specialized 3.0, but not by much. I'm willing to try them and see how it is.


This is good to hear. I just received my 2.8 NN today, but my wheel (Heist 30) is still in transit. I placed the tire in my standard RS Pike, and although I can't tell specifically if it will fit when mounted, there is space in there.


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## Guest (Feb 10, 2016)

Gigantic said:


> 740mm diameter at 15psi, to the top of the tread.


Yep, mine measured 742mm in diameter at 20 psi. 740-745 is reasonable, can't imagine where the 755mm numbers are coming from. My casing width was also same as yours.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Gigantic said:


> 3.25" at the knobs:
> View attachment 1049137


Just to confirm this is a 27.5 x 3.8 Hodag on a WTB Scraper 45mm internal width?

Trying to keep track of real world width in a spreadsheet MMCG started.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

bikeny said:


> The Duro Crux is about the same size. Why do you say the 3.25 Trax Fatty might be discontinued??


Thank you Bikeny for the Duro tip. If the Hodag shall not fit well that is a interesting option.
The sample Trax fatty is still going strong in the rear!

The Hodag measurements are a tad confusing, but if the 745-750 OD measurements are true , it is close being same size as 29er 2.4 ardent.

I could not find any information about the 3.25 Trax fatty on the Vee Tire homepage few days ago. So i thought that it was discontinued.
Just checked again and there it was. So probably just my lack of atention at the time and i apologize for the confusing discontinued statement.

Nice rides to everybody!


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

affirmative.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

PHeller said:


> Just to confirm this is a 27.5 x 3.8 Hodag on a WTB Scraper 45mm internal width?
> 
> Trying to keep track of real world width in a spreadsheet MMCG started.


it seems I need reading glasses. They're 3-3/8 at the casing, 3.5 at the knobs... I've edited the original post.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

PHeller said:


> Just to confirm this is a 27.5 x 3.8 Hodag on a WTB Scraper 45mm internal width?
> 
> Trying to keep track of real world width in a spreadsheet MMCG started.


 got a link to that?


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## Ofroad'bent (Jul 10, 2010)

Any sign of studded 27.5+ yet? I know it's a matter of time. This was the year for studs or the couch here in Ontario.

Got my rear wheel built up with a wide carbon rim and a WTB Trailboss, but the bike's getting revisions at the builder right now.


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

I havent read this entire mega thread on tires but any suggestions on tires for loose over hardpack conditions along with a mix of granite/rocks. 

I was leaning towards the 3.0 purgs.


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## pplucena (Dec 25, 2010)

Purgatory, Crown gem or Nobby Nic. Vee Crown gem is the most agresive and resistant of them, and heaviest too.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Here is a visual of 3 plus tires mounted to different width rims side by side to a 29 wheel with a Minion tire....good comparison and measured up too!

Santa Cruz Hightower - Page 7- Mtbr.com


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

*Nobby Nic 2.8 with Pike*

Nobby Nic 2.8 with normal Pike 150


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## jazzanova (Jun 1, 2008)

Zerort said:


> Nobby Nic 2.8 with normal Pike 150
> View attachment 1052413


Which rim is that?


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Easton Heist 30


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## .thumper. (Jan 13, 2005)

In case any of you are interested, I posted in another thread my reviews of the Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27.5x3.0 and Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0.

Norco Torrent - Page 3- Mtbr.com


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Zerort said:


> Nobby Nic 2.8 with normal Pike 150
> View attachment 1052413


Was hoping that the NN 2.8 would be smaller than that. Bummer. Still looks like a dry-weather only setup for 275 Pike.


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## larryniner (Apr 6, 2013)

Is that spreadsheet with tire widths published?? available


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## larryniner (Apr 6, 2013)

FWIW i just measured my NN 2.8 and 3.0 on 35mm velocity blunts and width is 70mm casing 72mm nobs on 3.0 and 67mm casing and 69mm nobs, these are at 13 and 14 psi
HTHs


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

larryniner said:


> Is that spreadsheet with tire widths published?? available


Yes. This.


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## sheatrock (Jul 23, 2009)

*Vee Rubber Crown Gem 27.5 x 3*

Measures 188MM bead to bead, side walls seem to have good cut protection. Waiting on arrival of Nextie 50mm rims, will update once mounted.


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## namaSSte (Dec 19, 2003)

I literally (as in 10 mins ago) just swapped my front Trailblazer for a Bridger and the volume difference seems huge. I know the Trailblazer is an undersized 2.8 but they honestly looked and rode no differently than some of the 2.5 DH tires I've ridden. The Bridger 3.0 on the other hand...its a lot of rubber! The slightly more rounded profile seems like it will be a lot more predictable than the Trailblazer up front as well. FWIW, the Bridger fits fine in a 100mm Fox F29 RLC. Doubt you'd get any more in there but it works.


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## Guest (Mar 7, 2016)

namaSSte said:


> I know the Trailblazer is an undersized 2.8 but they honestly looked and rode no differently than some of the 2.5 DH tires I've ridden.


The Trailblazer uses a single ply 2.5" casing.


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## sheatrock (Jul 23, 2009)

sheatrock said:


> Measures 188MM bead to bead, side walls seem to have good cut protection. Waiting on arrival of Nextie 50mm rims, will update once mounted.


I got the tires mounted on my Nextie 50 rims (45mm internal). they measure 73mm knob to knob and 75mm at the widest part and have 723mm diameter.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

At what PSI? Absolutely useless info unless you note PSI, as size can vary by a lot from 30 PSI to 13 PSI.



sheatrock said:


> I got the tires mounted on my Nextie 50 rims (45mm internal). they measure 73mm knob to knob and 75mm at the widest part and have 723mm diameter.


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## sheatrock (Jul 23, 2009)

LyNx said:


> At what PSI? Absolutely useless info unless you note PSI, as size can vary by a lot from 30 PSI to 13 PSI.


Measurements at 15PSI


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## jon123 (Oct 11, 2009)

Zerort:

How have you found running the NN 2.8?
Since they fit in a standard 27.5 Pike I'm interested in giving them a try, just to see. Would be going on a rim with 29mm or 31mm ID (still deciding which carbon rim to go with).
Thanks


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

larryniner said:


> Is that spreadsheet with tire widths published?? available


about that spreadsheet...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It's not hard to make it yourself. Just takes a few minutes to build the spreadsheet. Estimating casing width on a given internal rim width from b2b measurements is a bit more tricky, but it's outlined in this thread: http://forums.mtbr.com/wheels-tires/how-much-does-rim-width-effect-tire-986843.html

Skim this post for b2b and actual measurements of 27.5+ tires and you're golden.

I've been working on mine for a few months, and I'd say that for the most part, the estimated sizing isn't really that close, and not even necessary. You could easily just track actual widths on given rim sizes and you'd start to get a good idea as to how a tire will look given its b2b. Plus, tread width plays a factor as well, so I've added a column to tell me how much larger a tires tread is over its actual casing width.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2016)

PHeller said:


> It's not hard to make it yourself. Just takes a few minutes to build the spreadsheet. Estimating casing width on a given internal rim width from b2b measurements is a bit more tricky, but it's outlined in this thread: http://forums.mtbr.com/wheels-tires/how-much-does-rim-width-effect-tire-986843.html


You could just copy the spreadsheet from here and enter your own b2b data. There are macros that calculate casing width and height from b2b and rim width.


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## GuitsBoy (Sep 24, 2013)

Thanks for posting the spreadsheet. Interesting info in there.

FWIW my panaracer FBNs on i35 rims have a 6 mm discrepancy between the spreadsheet and my own measurements.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

craigsj said:


> You could just copy the spreadsheet from here and enter your own b2b data. There are macros that calculate casing width and height from b2b and rim width.


Thanks Craig. I didn't want to be handing out your hard work.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2016)

GuitsBoy said:


> FWIW my panaracer FBNs on i35 rims have a 6 mm discrepancy between the spreadsheet and my own measurements.


I'll assume the spreadsheet you're referring to is mine.

All the b2b data in that spreadsheet I measured myself EXCEPT for the fat tires. I stole those from the fat forum for comparison. I can't vouch for any of the 26er measurements.

The FBN measurement I made myself. It's a 29er version. Idk if the 6mm variation is in b2b or width, I'll assume width since you mentioned the rim size.

Widths can vary from the prediction since casings have thickness and the bead shape of the rim can have a small effect. I've never seen more than a couple mm. A 6mm variance would suggest a 15mm or so difference in b2b which would be enormous. I'd suggest measuring your b2b and comparing that. The model itself works fine, if there's a difference its because there's a difference in the tires.

I measure new tires since those are the only ones that are readily reproducible. Some can stretch significantly with extended use. The ones that stretch 10mm or more (if there are truly any) make me uncomfortable. What's happening internally to those casings? How much internal failure is occurring that causes that much growth without rebound?


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## GuitsBoy (Sep 24, 2013)

craigsj said:


> The FBN measurement I made myself. It's a 29er version. Idk if the 6mm variation is in b2b or width, I'll assume width since you mentioned the rim size.


I apologize, the mistake is completely mine. I saw that you had labeled the wheel sizes, and then completely slipped my mind. You measured the 29 x 3.0, and I measured the 27.5 x 3.5. It was a total brainfart on my part. Sorry for any confusion, and thanks for the work that went into it.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

After few rides with the duro crux 27.5x 3.25 in front and Vee Trax fatty 3.25 rear i can say that i really like the Duro. They are very similarily sized. The Duro is quite round on a 45mm internal nextie rim but works really well. I am still hoping to see something properly big and fast rolling in the future. Racing ralph 27.5x 3.25 would be ace. But now i am extremely happy to get rid of the Vee trax fatty as a front tyre. Thumpsupsmiley!


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

Question - anybody got a suggestion for commute version of 27.5+?? I'm getting a Marin Pine Mountain 1 and will be 80% on road/bike path and 20% off road on hard pack. Look it's more bike/tyre than I need for the trip but who cares....

Best I can see is the WTB TrailBlazer, looks to have a decent centre ridge that'll roll nice. The Marin comes with Kenda Havok 2.8's rated to a 25kph top speed...


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## senor_mikey (Apr 25, 2009)

*Big one*



Berserker26 said:


> Question - anybody got a suggestion for commute version of 27.5+?? I'm getting a Marin Pine Mountain 1 and will be 80% on road/bike path and 20% off road on hard pack. Look it's more bike/tyre than I need for the trip but who cares....
> 
> Best I can see is the WTB TrailBlazer, looks to have a decent centre ridge that'll roll nice. The Marin comes with Kenda Havok 2.8's rated to a 25kph top speed...


the Schwalbe Big-one in 584-60 would be a great fast rolling tire for that bike Schwalbe Big One - Schwalbe Professional Bike Tires

mike


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## Capt.Ogg (Jun 5, 2015)

Berserker26 said:


> Question - anybody got a suggestion for commute version of 27.5+?? I'm getting a Marin Pine Mountain 1 and will be 80% on road/bike path and 20% off road on hard pack. Look it's more bike/tyre than I need for the trip but who cares....


Schwalbe has Super Moto-X in plus size, 27.5x2.8. I have no idea about availability though. Looks very tempting for a touring tyre for my fat bike.


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

> Schwalbe has Super Moto-X in plus size, 27.5x2.8. I have no idea about availability though. Looks very tempting for a touring tyre for my fat bike.


This looks good, and tough too! Many thanks, will check them out.



> the Schwalbe Big-one in 584-60 would be a great fast rolling tire for that bike Schwalbe Big One - Schwalbe Professional Bike Tires


These look better than the Super Moto's but durability I'm worried about, I suppose that's the tradeoff. They are supposed to be their lowest rolling resistance tyre ever too!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Vee Speedster?

Speedster27.5-N-27.5x3.0


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

bikeny said:


> Vee Speedster?
> 
> Speedster27.5-N-27.5x3.0


Woah! They look friggen rad! I never knew there were so many options, i need to be better at google.


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## Capt.Ogg (Jun 5, 2015)

Berserker26 said:


> Woah! They look friggen rad! I never knew there were so many options, i need to be better at google.


I would go with the Schwalbe tires. Speedsters tread seems to collect a lot of small rocks and get flats easily. There's a thread here about them here.


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

Capt.Ogg said:


> I would go with the Schwalbe tires. Speedsters tread seems to collect a lot of small rocks and get flats easily. There's a thread here about them here.


Can you even fit the 2.35 big boy on a 40mm plus sized rim? Or are the tyres going to be too small??


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## ShredMaster (Feb 7, 2015)

Mongoose Fat Bicycle Tire, 27.5" x 2.8", 2pk, Black - Walmart.com

I'm waiting for Pacific to get back to me on the weight, tpi, bead, and manufacturer as the rep on the phone I spoke to had absolutely no info on them. My guess is they are stiff boat anchors considering they are $28.00 for the pair lol.


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## sisu (Sep 16, 2006)

I ran FBNs last summer and liked them OK, not great for leaning the bike in corners...not much knob to rely on. But they were nice n light. I'm riding nobby nic 3.0s now, a handful of rides in and I'm still fiddling w tire pressure. At 12psi I notice self steer, and at that pressure they felt slow. Need to try them at 16ish, but coming off my winter fat (low psi) tires I started at the low end to see how they did. Tubeless setup was a breeze on 40mm carbon rims.

Interested in the rekon/ikon combo as well.


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## ro7939 (May 25, 2009)

For last 2.5 years I rode Salsa Mukluk FB alloy rigid year round, 26" x 80mm rims. In warmer weather I often ride cheap VeeRubber 3.5" beach tires (widths: 75mm tread, 95mm side wall). Have not found riding below 25F to be much fun, but still hooked on year round safety, comfort, and confidence of this ride. I'm 6-3, 250 lbs, running about 25 PSI.

I suspect my so-called "ideal" year round ride is a rigid carbon XL 27.5+. No new such bike exists. (Heller dealer website-not public-posts 27.5+ carbon HT, but I fit XL or larger and their biggest is L.)

Considering buying a new Salsa Beargrease FB carbon rigid, w/26" x 80mm rims (accepts 4.8 tire but only on stock 80mm rim, 100mm rim is too wide).

_Prior to delivery, seller would install WTB 27.5 x 40mm rim w/WTB Trailblaizer 2.8 tires. Any reason not to do this? I suspect I'd prefer 45mm or 50mm rim more than 40mm, for improved profile w/3.00 tires._


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## Welnic (Feb 6, 2013)

I would put 29" x 3" tires on the Mukluk as long as the frame fits you. I wouldn't put tires designed to fit in 29" frames with barely enough clearance on a fat bike.


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## ro7939 (May 25, 2009)

Welnic said:


> I would put 29" x 3" tires on the Mukluk as long as the frame fits you. I wouldn't put tires designed to fit in 29" frames with barely enough clearance on a fat bike.


Thank you Welnic.

If you refer to my post above yours, I consider 27.5+ on the FB, not 9er (though I used to park Joe Montana's car, and still like the 49ers).

Edit: in the past 1-2 weeks I decided to wait for 27.5+ carbon HTs to appear. Within a year several OEMs likely sell such bike. A reliable LBS predicted Trek should announce such bike in June.

Only Heller currently sells such bike, but their largest is 19" (L), and I need at least 20". Trek sells the carbon Stache 29+ HT w/separate axle mounts for 27.5+ option, but this frame looks too light weight for me, plus a separate new wheel/tire set is cost prohibitive.


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## Guest (Apr 27, 2016)

http://www.maxxis.com/catalog/tire-519-135-rekonplus


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Whoppe dee, still only in the catalog, not on their web store yet, vaporware for right now. I got my local Maxxis dealer to order 2 for me, but with them coming direct from Taiwan, they won't be here until July, so guess I will have to get by on my 2.8" NN for the time being.



nvphatty said:


> Rekon+ | Maxxis Tires USA


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## Guest (Apr 27, 2016)

LyNx said:


> Whoppe dee, still only in the catalog, not on their web store yet, vaporware for right now. I got my local Maxxis dealer to order 2 for me, but with them coming direct from Taiwan, they won't be here until July, so guess I will have to get by on my 2.8" NN for the time being.


yes well the point of the link was to share for those unaware and since this is the 27.5+ tires sub i Rekon:thumbsuppun intended) this is a good place to leave it.


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

Onza Canis tire now offered in 2.85 plus size - Mtbr.com

You guys see this one?


----------



## Guest (Apr 28, 2016)

Berserker26 said:


> Onza Canis tire now offered in 2.85 plus size - Mtbr.com
> 
> You guys see this one?


nope sure haven't but i enjoyed the read thanks. The light beige sidewall is kinda cool.


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## baltobrewer (Apr 22, 2015)

Gigantic said:


> I haven't yet measured them, but they're quite a bit narrower on WTB Scrapers than a fbn on a Marge lite, which is about 3.5" wide. Plenty of room on a bucksaw.
> View attachment 1049086
> View attachment 1049087


Gigantic,

Are you running Mendon clamps for your lefty? I ask because I have an MCS lefty on my Mukluk, and am currently running FBN's on 80mm HRD's. I want to build up a set of 27.5+'s for the summer, but am concerned that the narrower width of a 50mm Scraper type rim, especially if it is center-drilled, would force me to rotate the clamps forward too much in order to center the wheel, and mess with the geo. I really don't want to buy a second set of clamps. What was your solution?

Thx,
Jay


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

I am. I had MikeSee lace up the front wheel. There's plenty of offset in the wheel, so I didn't have to mess with the shock offset. 

Per my earlier comment on the Hodag width, it's exactly 3.5" wise on the scraper, same as the 26" fbn.


----------



## baltobrewer (Apr 22, 2015)

Awesome, thx for the info. Are you running a regular lefty or a supermax?


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

I have a 2008 lefty Max..


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## baltobrewer (Apr 22, 2015)

Gigantic said:


> I have a 2008 lefty Max..


Hmm, got it. I'm running a 2008 regular lefty scavenged from a Prophet, not a supermax. I would think that the regular width lefty hub would not provide as much leeway to offset using spoke lacing magics as the wider supermax hub does. I may have to have a convo with Mikesee about this one...thx again for the input.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

Talk to MikeSee. I'm a super-clyde and the wheel has been sturdy enough for me. His prices are Hella reasonable.


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## baltobrewer (Apr 22, 2015)

Gigantic said:


> Talk to MikeSee. I'm a super-clyde and the wheel has been sturdy enough for me. His prices are Hella reasonable.


Already messaged him on his website! Thx.


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## NH Mtbiker (Nov 6, 2004)

Buy 2, they're cheap....probably wire bead and real heavy!

Mongoose Fat Bicycle Tire, 27.5" x 2.8", 2pk, Black - Walmart.com

$14 per tire :thumbsup:


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## samduhspam (Jun 3, 2007)

What do you recommend for 27.5+ that is comparable to my non plus 27.5 Minion DHR (F) /Tomahawk (R) setup that is not massively overweight? Thoughts on Nobby Nic/Rocket Ron 2.8's?

I'm looking to experiment with 27.5+ on a 29er frame. If any of you guys have an extra set of 2.8's with still some decent meat on them and want to sell, I'd be interested in purchasing. PM me.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Is it just me or is the Maxxis Chronicle a pretty bad tire on anything off camber? I'm not that sold on its climbing traction either.


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## Berserker26 (Feb 13, 2014)

TimoA said:


> Is it just me or is the Maxxis Chronicle a pretty bad tire on anything off camber? I'm not that sold on its climbing traction either.


Haven't ridden it however at 990g for that tread pattern just seemed to me to be too heavy.


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Only tried it in 29" flavour, but wasn't impressed with it, neither for it's grip as a rear or it's self steer as a front, running a nearly 200g heavier tyre as a front over the Chronicle I have.



TimoA said:


> Is it just me or is the Maxxis Chronicle a pretty bad tire on anything off camber? I'm not that sold on its climbing traction either.


----------



## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Has anybody done a comparison in tread width between the 2.8 Nobby Nic and the 2.8 Rocket Ron? I am curious to know whether the Rocket Ron is just a touch narrower?


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

SB666 said:


> Has anybody done a comparison in tread width between the 2.8 Nobby Nic and the 2.8 Rocket Ron? I am curious to know whether the Rocket Ron is just a touch narrower?


The casing width is exactly the same,tread width is just under 2mm less on the RR.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

joecx said:


> The casing width is exactly the same,tread width is just under 2mm less on the RR.


GREAT! So if the NN is just a hair too wide at the tread, the Rocket Ron will give me just a mm or 2 of clearance that I'm looking for? Sounds perfect.


----------



## UtahJohn (Feb 6, 2014)

Just a heads up, I contacted Continental to ask about + sized tires. They said they were a year away, but likely the X-king and Trail King, both Black Chili, in 2.8 and 3.0".


----------



## larryniner (Apr 6, 2013)

i got a 2.8 trailblazer i could get rid of


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Has anyone compared the Nobby Nic 3.0 and Purgatory 3.0 head to head? I'm looking for some more aggro tires to replace Maxxis Chronicles.


----------



## Thustlewhumber (Nov 25, 2011)

NN has a much larger knobby tread with more spacing. Purgatory probably has bigger side knobbies, but the middle tread is not as aggressive as the NN.


----------



## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

Dirt Rag reviews Maxxis and WTB offerings:

Tested: Plus-size mountain bike tires


----------



## Hobine (Jun 16, 2004)

TimoA said:


> Has anyone compared the Nobby Nic 3.0 and Purgatory 3.0 head to head? I'm looking for some more aggro tires to replace Maxxis Chronicles.


I've been on Purgatories for quite awhile and just switched to Nobby Nics (snakeskin, pace star). First thing I noticed is how much harder the NN's ride at the same pressure. Gonna have to try lower PSI, not liking the stiff ride. Also noticed the Purgatories hold better in corners and seem to grip rocks better. 
Yea, so far I'm disappointed in the NN's. On a good note, they did air up tubeless very easily and don't leak. 
The only reason I moved away from the Purgs was the constant leaking of sealant thru the sidewalls. Had to refill every other week.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Hobine said:


> I've been on Purgatories for quite awhile and just switched to Nobby Nics (snakeskin, pace star). First thing I noticed is how much harder the NN's ride at the same pressure. Gonna have to try lower PSI, not liking the stiff ride. Also noticed the Purgatories hold better in corners and seem to grip rocks better.
> Yea, so far I'm disappointed in the NN's. On a good note, they did air up tubeless very easily and don't leak.
> The only reason I moved away from the Purgs was the constant leaking of sealant thru the sidewalls. Had to refill every other week.


Thanks!

The Purgatory sounds good apart from the sealant leak and is quite a bit cheaper than NN. Usually Specialized tires are considered to be very tubeless friendly - I wonder if yours could have been from a faulty batch?


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## L2theP (Mar 21, 2010)

TimoA said:


> Has anyone compared the Nobby Nic 3.0 and Purgatory 3.0 head to head? I'm looking for some more aggro tires to replace Maxxis Chronicles.


I have the NN 2.8 and 3.0, purgatory 3.0, wtb bridgers 3.0 and maxxis rekon 2.8 and wtb trailblazer 
Nobby nic in my opinion for Northern jersey rocky loose dirt is a winner all around, perfect tubeless set up, grips like crazy much better in corners than my purgatory
Purgatory both front and back leaking sealant like crazy not as aggressive knob and side knobs pretty low, good grip but not as confident as the NN
Wtb Bridger would be choice 2 over the purgatory
Maxxis rekon I wouldn't even consider a + tire, it's about the same as the wtb trailblazer, about 2.6" wide and no where near as tall as a 3.0 tire or even the NN 2.8
Maxxis is the biggest disappointment of them all, great tire just way too undersized...


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Let us know how they ride once you sort the tyre pressure thing out, guessing that that was your issue since the Snakeskin casing is much tougher/thicker than the SpecialED Control casing by a lot. I'd guess you'll want to be dropping your pressures by prob 25-30% on the NN to get the same feel as the Purgs.


Hobine said:


> I've been on Purgatories for quite awhile and just switched to Nobby Nics (snakeskin, pace star). First thing I noticed is how much harder the NN's ride at the same pressure. Gonna have to try lower PSI, not liking the stiff ride. Also noticed the Purgatories hold better in corners and seem to grip rocks better.
> Yea, so far I'm disappointed in the NN's. On a good note, they did air up tubeless very easily and don't leak.
> The only reason I moved away from the Purgs was the constant leaking of sealant thru the sidewalls. Had to refill every other week.


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## konacrasher (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks for the info. Its great to hear. i will be returning the puratory 3.0 I just got. You should try the rocket ron 2.8 its a great rear tire.


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

I have a Rekon as a rear tire on a 32mm internal rim and like it a lot more than the NN 2.8. I punctured and pinched the NN multiple times and wasn't fond of after it wore a bit. I've been running and extra psi or two at 17 and despite a few rim strikes haven't had any tire failures. That's really important. I don't know what it measures and don't really care. It has great traction for cornering and climbing although the braking isn't quite as great as I had hoped from it's appearance.

I also tried it as a front tire on a 45mm internal rim and didn't like it so much. The NN 3.0 is much better for me. For some reason plus tires seem more sensitive to rim width than 2.3's? I also tried the NN 2.8 as a front on the 45mm internal and didn't find it nearly as confidence inspiring as the 3.0. 

for comparison I've also run the stock 6 fattie narrow front rim with a Purg and find it vague and far from confidence inspiring when leaned over at the limit. I'll try the Purg with the 45mm front rim and may like it.

For me the upcoming Spec Butcher 2.8 and slaughter 2.6 are going to be magic.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

How are you killing a Nobby Nic but not a Rekon? I'm guessing you didn't have the snakeskin version? 

Also keen to try the new Butcher and slaughter, a semi slick in 2.6 would make it not so scary I think.


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

GRPABT1 said:


> How are you killing a Nobby Nic but not a Rekon? I'm guessing you didn't have the snakeskin version?
> 
> Also keen to try the new Butcher and slaughter, a semi slick in 2.6 would make it not so scary I think.


It was a snakeskin. I kept it running with super glue for the bead pinches and Hutchinson tire patches.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


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## PuddleDuck (Feb 14, 2004)

Thanks, what are you thoughts on these tires as fronts on the narrow / 32mm inner width rims (especially the NN 2.8 & Rekon)?



artnshel said:


> I have a Rekon as a rear tire on a 32mm internal rim and like it a lot more than the NN 2.8. I punctured and pinched the NN multiple times and wasn't fond of after it wore a bit. I've been running and extra psi or two at 17 and despite a few rim strikes haven't had any tire failures. That's really important. I don't know what it measures and don't really care. It has great traction for cornering and climbing although the braking isn't quite as great as I had hoped from it's appearance.
> 
> I also tried it as a front tire on a 45mm internal rim and didn't like it so much. The NN 3.0 is much better for me. For some reason plus tires seem more sensitive to rim width than 2.3's? I also tried the NN 2.8 as a front on the 45mm internal and didn't find it nearly as confidence inspiring as the 3.0.
> 
> ...


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## Hobine (Jun 16, 2004)

LyNx said:


> Let us know how they ride once you sort the tyre pressure thing out, guessing that that was your issue since the Snakeskin casing is much tougher/thicker than the SpecialED Control casing by a lot. I'd guess you'll want to be dropping your pressures by prob 25-30% on the NN to get the same feel as the Purgs.


Got a ride on NNs with around 12psi front 14 rear. The ride was definitely improved but still not as smooth as the Purgatories. The NN definitely breaks free in corners easier and slides out more. I'm thinking now it's because I'm using Mulfut 50s and the outermost knobs just aren't low enough. 
Those of you who are having success with the NN 3.0, what rim width are you running?


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## wilson1417 (Mar 25, 2009)

WTB Ranger looks Promising!!!! Lighter than previous + offerings from WTB...I've been digging the TrailBoss but would love something lighter. WEith numerous compound offereings etc WTB seems stoked on this tire.


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

wilson1417 said:


> WTB Ranger looks Promising!!!! Lighter than previous + offerings from WTB...I've been digging the TrailBoss but would love something lighter. WEith numerous compound offereings etc WTB seems stoked on this tire.


Agreed. Love my Trail Bosses, but the Rangers look good, and if I can shed a pound in tire weight, I wouldn't complain. I've become a committed fan of WTB's TCS system - their rims and tires work so well together, and make tubeless a breeze. I'm looking forward to these.


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## Cornfield (Apr 15, 2012)

WTB Ranger 27.5+ mountain bike tire gets official & rolls in their first 29+ size - Bikerumor


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Ooo sign me up for the TCS Tough 2.8. If its as tough as my Breakout but lighter and faster, it'll be a winner.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm also kinda interested to see the toughness of the Slaughter 2.6, being that its more of a Enduro tire with GRID casing.


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## dougmint (Oct 29, 2006)

wilson1417 said:


> WTB Ranger looks Promising!!!! Lighter than previous + offerings from WTB...I've been digging the TrailBoss but would love something lighter. WEith numerous compound offereings etc WTB seems stoked on this tire.


I'm wondering how the size of these compares to the Vee Tire 27.5x3.25 fatty trax. I don't want to lower my BB by getting a smaller volume tire.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Dude. You got the biggest Plus tires available outside of a 275x3.8. You cant expect any 3.0" tire to be close to the diameter of not just a 3.25, but a BIG 3.25 tire. 

Add more travel up front. Get shorter cranks. Can you 29+ on the Farley? Even 29x2.5 would be pretty plush.


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## dougmint (Oct 29, 2006)

PHeller said:


> Dude. You got the biggest Plus tires available outside of a 275x3.8. You cant expect any 3.0" tire to be close to the diameter of not just a 3.25, but a BIG 3.25 tire.
> 
> Add more travel up front. Get shorter cranks. Can you 29+ on the Farley? Even 29x2.5 would be pretty plush.


Well, I thought I'd ask the experts. I've heard it said that these tire sizes aren't always accurate, so sometimes a smaller size tire is actually bigger than a tire that is marketed as larger. I often ride a rigid fork, so I don't want more travel, and all my bikes are 175mm cranks, so I don't want to change that. Also, I'm not interested in 29+, as I don't feel the need for another wheelset. I guess I'll just stick with the fatty trax. It's no big deal. I like them.


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

dougmint said:


> Well, I thought I'd ask the experts. I've heard it said that these tire sizes aren't always accurate, so sometimes a smaller size tire is actually bigger than a tire that is marketed as larger. I often ride a rigid fork, so I don't want more travel, and all my bikes are 175mm cranks, so I don't want to change that. Also, I'm not interested in 29+, as I don't feel the need for another wheelset. I guess I'll just stick with the fatty trax. It's no big deal. I like them.


you have a nice option with the Duro Crux 3.25


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## dougmint (Oct 29, 2006)

savo said:


> you have a nice option with the Duro Crux 3.25


Looks to be heavier than the Fatty Trax, so I would have little reason to switch. Also, the Fatty Trax hold tubeless very well, and seem very durable.


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## ordinaryjoe (Aug 9, 2011)

Anyone here know when the Onza Canis 27.5 x 2.85 tires are going to become available?


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## Switchback Bikes (Dec 2, 2013)

*Rekon or RR*



L2theP said:


> I have the NN 2.8 and 3.0, purgatory 3.0, wtb bridgers 3.0 and maxxis rekon 2.8 and wtb trailblazer
> Nobby nic in my opinion for Northern jersey rocky loose dirt is a winner all around, perfect tubeless set up, grips like crazy much better in corners than my purgatory
> Purgatory both front and back leaking sealant like crazy not as aggressive knob and side knobs pretty low, good grip but not as confident as the NN
> Wtb Bridger would be choice 2 over the purgatory
> ...


@L2theP

I am running a 2.8 trailblazer on my frame....love the plus size (ran 3.0 Bridger and 2.8 NN on another frame) but not so fond of the trailblazer...loved the bridger and NN but they are too wide for the frame I am on now

Here's a pic of the trailblazer on the current frame, no issues w/ rubbing. Think a Rekon 2.8 or RR 2.8 would give me similar spacing? 















Thanks, Scott


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Switchback Bikes said:


> @L2theP
> 
> I am running a 2.8 trailblazer on my frame....love the plus size (ran 3.0 Bridger and 2.8 NN on another frame) but not so fond of the trailblazer...loved the bridger and NN but they are too wide for the frame I am on now
> 
> ...


Have you tried the 2.5 WTB breakout? I am running it on a i35 rim and it's definitely wider than 2.5. Also, has WAY mow volume than the rekon or ikon 2.8... I really like it as a rear tire option, give it a shot! It's taller than the NN 2.8 was on my i35.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

Switchback Bikes said:


> @L2theP
> 
> I am running a 2.8 trailblazer on my frame....love the plus size (ran 3.0 Bridger and 2.8 NN on another frame) but not so fond of the trailblazer...loved the bridger and NN but they are too wide for the frame I am on now
> 
> ...


I'll second SB666's recommendation on the wtb Breakout as a good option. Mine gives similar frame clearance to my Trailblazer. The 2.8 Rocket Ron's are very similar in width to the NN's (1-2mm narrower at the tread), so if NN didn't work for you I'd guess the RR won't either.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Switchback Bikes (Dec 2, 2013)

@sb666 and @mothertruckinsteve Great info, thank you will look into the Breakout


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

+1 for the Breakout. Mint rear tyre.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

SB666 said:


> Have you tried the 2.5 WTB breakout? I am running it on a i35 rim and it's definitely wider than 2.5. Also, has WAY mow volume than the rekon or ikon 2.8... I really like it as a rear tire option, give it a shot! It's taller than the NN 2.8 was on my i35.


SB666 - how do the Breakouts measure up on the i35's? I'm currently running a set on I9 Torch Trails (i23), and they measure 63mm wide and 711mm in diameter. I think they're a great tire, but more volume would make them even better.


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## Switchback Bikes (Dec 2, 2013)

GRPABT1 said:


> +1 for the Breakout. Mint rear tyre.


Ordered one up....it's on the way....thanks for the input guys!


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## ticketchecker (Mar 18, 2010)

Trail Boss 3.0 in my Bantam is a wee bit too bossy, need something a little less tall & wide. 2.8 Nobby Nic or 2.5 Breakout?

I'll have a lightly used TB 3.0 available if anyone is looking.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

ticketchecker said:


> Trail Boss 3.0 in my Bantam is a wee bit too bossy, need something a little less tall & wide. 2.8 Nobby Nic or 2.5 Breakout?
> 
> I'll have a lightly used TB 3.0 available if anyone is looking.


I have WTB Breakout 2.5's on my Bantam front and rear, and think they're great even though I'm currently running them on i23 rims (Industry Nine Torch Trail). I plan on moving to either i30 or i35 to take full advantage of their capability.


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## ticketchecker (Mar 18, 2010)

carbine_275 said:


> I have WTB Breakout 2.5's on my Bantam front and rear, and think they're great even though I'm currently running them on i23 rims (Industry Nine Torch Trail). I plan on moving to either i30 or i35 to take full advantage of their capability.


Thanks, I'm leaning that way for sure.

I've got i35's, just don't want to go too small. I'm liking the ride as is just gotta keep the rubber off the frame.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

ticketchecker said:


> Thanks, I'm leaning that way for sure.
> 
> I've got i35's, just don't want to go too small. I'm liking the ride as is just gotta keep the rubber off the frame.


I'm guessing they will fill out the back of the Bantam nicely on i35's. They should be approximately 28"+ in diameter, and 2.6"+ wide. They roll great, and are very durable with the tough casing.


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## tungsten (Apr 7, 2006)

> Anyone here know when the Onza Canis 27.5 x 2.85 tires are going to become available?


bump............


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## ticketchecker (Mar 18, 2010)

I went with the 2.8 NN, little disappointed as it looks like I could've fit the 3.0 in there. Man that Trail Boss is a big tire.

Did I mention I have a lightly used TB 3.0 for sale? Make an offer, it's just gonna hang in my basement now.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2016)

ticketchecker said:


> I went with the 2.8 NN, little disappointed as it looks like I could've fit the 3.0 in there. Man that Trail Boss is a big tire.


it'll keep the rubber off the frame though.


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## ticketchecker (Mar 18, 2010)

nvphatty said:


> it'll keep the rubber off the frame though.


yes it will, thanks for the reminder:thumbsup:


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## Switchback Bikes (Dec 2, 2013)

*Waiting on the Breakout*

I've been running a Mixer set up on my Unveil9 (first prototype frame from when the Switchback bike brand was alive)....I really liked it but wanted some extra cush and traction up front so I went 27.5+ in the front as well.

I rode it today for the 1st time, wanted to get out on the 2.8 Trailblazer rear one more time before the 2.5 Breakout shows up.

In front I have the 3.0 Bridger on an Easton Heist 30mm....holy smokes I dig it! It was writing checks the Trailblazer rear was having a hard time cashing 

Decent clearance on the Pike 29 non-boost 130mm fork (running 130mm rear too)...I don't ever ride in the mud so this clearance will be great for me

Can't wait to mount the Breakout in the rear so it can keep up w/ the Bridger


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Smithhammer said:


> Agreed. Love my Trail Bosses, but the Rangers look good, and if I can shed a pound in tire weight, I wouldn't complain. I've become a committed fan of WTB's TCS system - their rims and tires work so well together, and make tubeless a breeze. I'm looking forward to these.


The Ranger lite is too light, I holed a 2.8 on the second ride, either wait for the enduro casing or get a Trail Boss 3.0

What really miffs me is that I spoke to a WTB rep and he said the Trail Boss and the Ranger share the same casing, ie they're of equal durability...not even close!

The Trail Boss 3.0 has deepet tread and it's more aggressive, not to mention, I never came close to holing a Trail Boss. I'm putting the Trsil Boss back on.


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## ordinaryjoe (Aug 9, 2011)

Onza Canis 27.5 x 2.85 will be available September.


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## Guest (Jul 8, 2016)

*27.5+ 3.0 minion*

x posted

http://forums.mtbr.com/components/m...-5-3-0-tire-release-1016895.html#post12721391


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

dougmint said:


> Looks to be heavier than the Fatty Trax, so I would have little reason to switch. Also, the Fatty Trax hold tubeless very well, and seem very durable.


I also like the 27.5x3.25 tyre size and bb height. 
Unfortunately the industry seems to be eager to push the 27+ segment only with relatively small 2.8-3.0 tyres.

I have found the Crux much better in the front compared the Vee fatty.
The VTF is very good rear tyre but in front it has terrible tendency to self steer with low pressures on slick rock.

The weight difference was not huge , can't remember the exact amounts but i can't feel the difference in weight.

Both types do suffer from slightly too hard compound. they last long, but friction is not optimal.

Still dreaming of quality offerings by schwalbe. 27.5x 3.35 Racing Ralph with softest possible compaud would be the best dry condition fatbike tyre ever. sorry for lousy writing. too much stella artois for foreign languages.


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

I agree, but why stop there. I'd like to see something like a 27.5 x 3.8/4.0 Jumbo Jim or equitant. I'd be all over the hodag's, but I didn't like them as a 26!


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

There are some Maxis minions on the way this fall in 27.5x4, jumbo Jims would be swell, too.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I feel like the ability to run 275x3.8 or 29x2.6 would be awesome, especially if those frames only used Boost spacing (no fat bike stuff). 

Unfortunately the only full-suspension I know of that isn't a fat bike that can run a 275x3.25 is the RSD Wildcat.

EDIT: 

RSD said that 275x3.8 like Hodag might fit on the Wildcat depending on rim width. 

Will also fit 29x2.5


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

That's a start!


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## holiday (Apr 27, 2004)

Looking for new rear... feedback.

tires, I rode the 2.8 nics, but also put a month on the trek chucabara, which is my favorite, until lack of moisture got things really loose.

Now running 3.0 spec purgatory on front and 2.8 nic on rear. Like it, purg is a great front tire, and nic is good, but not nearly as tough as trek. I've flatted nic twice, no pinches on same type of impacts on spec or trek tires.

looking for good gripping 2.8 that is tougher then nic for rear.

Anyone haver recommendations?
I have a rekon on the way, may be tougher? or wait for 2.8 butcher?

Mojo great!


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

I'm also hoping for a tougher casing than the Nobby Nic... The Nobby on an i35 is where my frame maxes out, so I'm also hoping for suggestions but nothing wider than exactly 2.8 at the widest.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

The tough casing breakout has been great, but 1100 grams is my ceiling for this bike... Something in between the Nobby and the breakout in the high 900 grams but still considerably more durable than the Nobby would be my ultimate answer


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## nyrangerfan222 (Jun 22, 2009)

holiday said:


> Looking for new rear... feedback.
> 
> tires, I rode the 2.8 nics, but also put a month on the trek chucabara, which is my favorite, until lack of moisture got things really loose.
> 
> ...


What fork are you running?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## the_flynn (Aug 4, 2016)

Tried squeezing B+ tires into my Yeti Big Top frame. Fork had plenty of clearance for a 3.0", but the Trailblazer 2.8 barely fit between the chainstays. Not enough mud clearance for having carbon stays, IMHO. Maybe I'll run a 3.0 in the front and 2.5 in the rear?


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Anybody have any ride reports with the 2.8 ranger yet?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

SB666 said:


> Anybody have any ride reports with the 2.8 ranger yet?


Maybe check out the three page thread titled 'Ranger 29x3 (and 27.5)'


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## sixstroke (Sep 24, 2013)

Hey guys, trying to run some extra meat, but without just jumping in and learning the hard way.

Going off of manufacturer's specs, it looks as though I've got 91.6mm (3-5/8") between the narrowest part of the chain stay.

I found a pretty stellar deal on some Stan's Hugo's at 52mm innerwidth. 

I'd like to find a narrow(er) 3" tire, but woukd that defeat the purpose of the nearly 2" inner width of this rim?

For posterity this is a Large 27.5 Chiner (full susp) with a 29er Pike (non-boost).

Thanks for any input.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

This is interesting

EWS Race Tech: Jared Graves' New Specialized Tires - Pinkbike


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## PuddleDuck (Feb 14, 2004)

Very interesting - thanks for linking



SB666 said:


> This is interesting
> 
> EWS Race Tech: Jared Graves' New Specialized Tires - Pinkbike


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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Looks like Specialized has the 2.6 and 2.8 of the Butcher and the Slaughter tires spec'd out on their website. Can't buy them as of yet but they're there.

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/components/tires/butcher-grid-2bliss-ready/117849

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/components/tires/slaughter-grid-2bliss-ready/117871


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

the 2.8 tough fast-rolling as well as the 29x3' Rangers are all available on the WTB site now, you can add to your cart and purchase but no weights listed yet. I am very curious to see what the 2.8 tough fast-rolling ends up weighing!


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## artnshel (Jul 10, 2004)

StumpyandhisBike said:


> Looks like Specialized has the 2.6 and 2.8 of the Butcher and the Slaughter tires spec'd out on their website. Can't buy them as of yet but they're there.
> 
> https://www.specialized.com/us/en/components/tires/butcher-grid-2bliss-ready/117849
> 
> https://www.specialized.com/us/en/components/tires/slaughter-grid-2bliss-ready/117871


My shop called and found out that the Specialized 2.8's are due at the end of September.

I also just saw a Maxxis employee post in a Pinkbike thread that Minion 2.8's just landed in the US. However they don't show up anywhere so I'm still riding a worn rear Rekon that feels more like a slick.


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## holiday (Apr 27, 2004)

*found my tire combo*



holiday said:


> Looking for new rear... feedback.
> 
> tires, I rode the 2.8 nics, but also put a month on the trek chucabara, which is my favorite, until lack of moisture got things really loose.
> 
> ...


OK, found my mid summer combo and so far, best yet. will stay put for the season.

Front, 3.0 purgatory (I hear it can get squishy and 32m spesh rims, but on my 42, it works great.
rear, 2.8 Rekon, 2 rides now, and I like i much better then NN. outside knobs fold less when leaned over, better braking and less pinchable.

Cheers!
W


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## Chubb (Jun 27, 2011)

holiday said:


> OK, found my mid summer combo and so far, best yet. will stay put for the season.
> 
> Front, 3.0 purgatory (I hear it can get squishy and 32m spesh rims, but on my 42, it works great.
> rear, 2.8 Rekon, 2 rides now, and I like i much better then NN. outside knobs fold less when leaned over, better braking and less pinchable.
> ...


Which Rekon+ version did you go with, the 60 TPI Dual compound or the 120 TPI 3C compound?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

anyone try the 3C rekon for the rear? is it noticeably slower than the DC?


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

jacksonlui said:


> anyone try the 3C rekon for the rear? is it noticeably slower than the DC?


I have the 3C in the rear. It rolls very well and does not feel slow by any means.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Ok thx. Was gonna move my 3c front rekon to the back and replace the front with a dhf 2.8 when that comes out 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

jacksonlui said:


> Ok thx. Was gonna move my 3c front rekon to the back and replace the front with a dhf 2.8 when that comes out
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


That's a great idea. I might do the same.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I just bought my rekons. You might do it before i do.

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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Depends on how fast I can get my hands on the DHF. I have no idea where to find them as of right now.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The rekons are really good but i think the dhf front will be much better. The extra 100g is nothing to worry about up front, woupd be too heavy for me in the rear though. This way i hope the rear breaks loose before the front. Makes it more fun. 

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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Checking out Specialized's website looks like they are planning on releasing a 2.8 and/or a 2.6 wide tire in almost all of the Grid casing tires. Also seeing Rekons becoming more available.


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## BCsaltchucker (Jan 16, 2014)

frack this site is a nightmare for 403 errors upon searching .. so ...

Looking for opinions on the Nobby Nic Trailstar for wet wet wet PNW conditions for my new Devinci Marshall on order (coming with something awful called the Chronicle, prob not soft rubber). Where I ride it is ALL wet roots and rocks, wet loam. Cornering is not what we worry about cause never going fast, it is all about grip on mossy rocks and roots at low speeds and deep trialsy-tricks-and-wood-skinnies gnarl, with need for climbing grip on steep very loose stones too.

Not easy finding supplies Plus size tires around here yet. The shops like the Rekon ... but of course nobody actually has in stock. They are saying wait for the Ardent or High roller in a 3.0 soon, hope in Maxx grip or 3C. but none in stock. I have been using 26" 2.4 versions of those Maxxis for a couple years with good success.

So I ordered up a couple Nobby Nics in 3.0 Trailstar. A decently chunky-knobbed tire with soft grippy compound. I hope. Anyone else tried it in PNW winters yet?


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## LyNx (Oct 26, 2004)

Never tried Schwalbes Super Gooey compound, have heard that's good in those conditions, but the NN don't come in that. For those sorts of conditions, I trust the Maxxis 3C compounds, for me they have offered the most amount of idea of grip on those surfaces -_ you never really actually have grip on that $hit, just the idea of it _


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## greasyslope (Mar 4, 2008)

PHeller said:


> Ooo sign me up for the TCS Tough 2.8. If its as tough as my Breakout but lighter and faster, it'll be a winner.


I just received my 2.8 WTB Ranger in the Tough/Fast version. Weight is 1030 grams.
Tire looks and feels pretty nice. Looking at it in my 40mm rims, I would say it has a vaguely similar tread pattern to the Ikon it replaced, but I think a rounder profile -however, I'm not sure how that will translate once it deforms with my weight on it.
The casing definitely seems beefier, which is the main thing for me and this type of tire right now.


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

Finally more mid fat... Maxxis 27.5 x 3.8 in the flesh!!!
Rocky Mountain Launches Two 27.5? Fat Bike Models at Eurobike 2016 | Singletracks Mountain Bike News


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

jpfurn said:


> Finally more mid fat... Maxxis 27.5 x 3.8 in the flesh!!!
> Rocky Mountain Launches Two 27.5? Fat Bike Models at Eurobike 2016 | Singletracks Mountain Bike News


Those are fat tires, not mid-fat or plus.

That said, It's good to see them, I'm hoping to get some of those Maxxis tires for a winter setup.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Yeti is jumping on board: Yeti SB5+ First Look - Eurobike 2016 - Pinkbike


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

bikeny said:


> Those are fat tires, not mid-fat or plus.
> 
> That said, It's good to see them, I'm hoping to get some of those Maxxis tires for a winter setup.


Ya, maybe you are right on a 65mm or wider rim. I'm assuming they would be about 3.5" wide on my JF II's. So on plus rims I'm not sure what sub forum to post them in. What tire/rim combo falls into the Mid-fat?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

jpfurn said:


> Ya, maybe you are right on a 65mm or wider rim. I'm assuming they would be about 3.5" wide on my JF II's. So on plus rims I'm not sure what sub forum to post them in. What tire/rim combo falls into the Mid-fat?


Well they should obviously be in the 27.5 Super Plus Forum!:thumbsup:

I do hope they are bigger than the Bontrager Hodag 27.5 x 3.8. While that's a great tire, it's very undersized, especially on a 50mm rim.

I generally think of anything from 2.6" up to 3.25" as Plus or mid-fat, and anything bigger than that is fat. That's just my opinion, obviously others will disagree with me!


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

bikeny said:


> Well they should obviously be in the 27.5 Super Plus Forum!:thumbsup:
> 
> I do hope they are bigger than the Bontrager Hodag 27.5 x 3.8. While that's a great tire, it's very undersized, especially on a 50mm rim.
> 
> I generally think of anything from 2.6" up to 3.25" as Plus or mid-fat, and anything bigger than that is fat. That's just my opinion, obviously others will disagree with me!


Ok, I'm tracking now, mid fat is another term for plus. How about Pseudo Fat for this combo?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

greasyslope said:


> I just received my 2.8 WTB Ranger in the Tough/Fast version. Weight is 1030 grams.
> Tire looks and feels pretty nice. Looking at it in my 40mm rims, I would say it has a vaguely similar tread pattern to the Ikon it replaced, but I think a rounder profile -however, I'm not sure how that will translate once it deforms with my weight on it.
> The casing definitely seems beefier, which is the main thing for me and this type of tire right now.


Just got a set myself, Ranger TCS Tough 2.8 mounted on Velocity Dually. Measured out to 67mm at 30psi, still stretching before the first ride, sealed up well with a compressor, weighing 975gms and 1025gms.

Very burly casing, on par with a Chupa, should handle rocks hits a whole better than the Ranger TCS Light casing I holed last month.

I was riding Trail Boss 3.0 for the past year, love those tires, but theyre heavy and a little fat for riding fastand loose.

These Ranger TCS Tough make the Trail Boss 3.0 seem flimsy.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Good to hear that the tough Ranger 2.8 ended up a little lighter than the 2.5 breakout. Curious to hear ride reports!


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## savo (Oct 15, 2009)

SB666 said:


> Good to hear that the tough Ranger 2.8 ended up a little lighter than the 2.5 breakout. Curious to hear ride reports!


I'm still looking to hear wheather it will end up bigger than the breakout or just the same... 67mm on duallys looks really close.


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

Looks Like schwalbe has come out with some new 27.5+ and 29X2.6 tires. pretty pumped about the 27.5 x 2.8 G-One. super light and looks super fast for pavement and hard pack.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Anyone else get excited about the 2.6 Magic Mary's featured here? Liteville 601 MK4 Enduro Bike - EUROBIKE - 2017 Enduro and Trail Bikes - Mountain Biking Pictures - Vital MTB


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2016)

GRPABT1 said:


> Anyone else get excited about the 2.6 Magic Mary's featured here?


always liked mary and her magic...a lill plus mary never hurt no one.


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

Aren't the Magic Mary 2.4s already over 2.5? I'll be interested to see just how big those are.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I emailed Schwalbe requesting a 2.8 Mary about 10 months that ago. They replied that they have no plans to release such a tyre. I guess they were listening to the people.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

savo said:


> I'm still looking to hear wheather it will end up bigger than the breakout or just the same... 67mm on duallys looks really close.


67mm on Duallys, tread is the same as Ranger TCS Light, casing is very stiff, no concerns over cutting.

I ran them initially at 14psi and they were very firm compared to the Trail Boss 3.0 at the same psi, dropped to 12psi and ride was still firm, so dropped to 11psi and I got some autosteer, so I bumped back to 12psi and rode them.

It's a bit of an adjustment going from a true 3" tire to a barely 2.8 tire, esp going from a supple casing to a stiff casing, so the firmness could just be my "pricess ways". I didn't have this feeling with the Ranger TCS Light, but then that tires was waay to lightweight for this guy.

I'm going to take a long weekend to ride and play more with pressures, see if they break in, see if eh low presure autosteer is real. I didn't like the autosteer, grabbing ruts and such, but it could have been the soil conditions (damp dust)


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Nurse Ben said:


> 67mm on Duallys, tread is the same as Ranger TCS Light, casing is very stiff, no concerns over cutting.
> 
> I ran them initially at 14psi and they were very firm compared to the Trail Boss 3.0 at the same psi, dropped to 12psi and ride was still firm, so dropped to 11psi and I got some autosteer, so I bumped back to 12psi and rode them.
> 
> ...


The TCS Tough are burly. If you want a fast roller that won't be destroyed by rocks or low pressure pinches, this'll do ya


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

Anyone try the new specialized grids yet? Apparently they changed the compound that is similar to conti black chili.


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## bad andy (Feb 21, 2006)

*Nobby Nic 3.0 vs. 2.8 on same rim...*

Does anyone happen to have experience with the Nobby Nic 3.0 and 2.8 on the same rim? I'm concerned about dimensional differences between the two. Casing/tread width? Overall wheel height?

Thanks for any info


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Update: WTB Ranger TCS Tough. Yes, they are tough, but they don't have enough tread to support multi surface use, very thick casing, runs best at moderate pressure, probably a better tire for the Southwest where rock and rock abrasion are the thing. This is not the kind of tire I'd want to continue running in the PNW.

*Anyone wanna trade for some NN 2.8 or Rekon 2.8?*

So now a question: Which is tougher, a Nobby Nic 2.8 or a Rekon 2.8?

This lightweight tire game is really bugging me, for instance how can a tire be durable when they bump up the size but drop the weight (Rekon 2.8 lighter than an Ardent 2.4?)?

I'm no fool, I know an 800gm tire is not going to be durable, nor will it function well at low pressures. I expect a durable plus tire to run 900-1000gm tire depending on the tread design.

I'm tempted to get a fresh set of Trail Boss 3.0 or Purgatory 3.0.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> This lightweight tire game is really bugging me, for instance how can a tire be durable when they bump up the size but drop the weight (Rekon 2.8 lighter than an Ardent 2.4?)?


I've been thinking the Rekon 2.8 front might be tough enough for here in the southwest as I've been running a Trailblazer confidently without any tears.

The rear is a different story, and I wouldn't settle for anything less than WTB's Tough or Maxxis Double Down casing.

From what I've read the Specialized Grid casing is on par with Exo, but not as tough the aforementioned casings.

On the note of casings it's starting to get to the point where we need a universal test and rating number of casing strength. A testing rig that drops a nail and razor on the tread (spinning) from a given height, and the same testing for a glancing (45º) strike against the sidewall at say, 20psi or something.

I'd be really interesting to see how the "light" Trail/Enduro casings fair against the downhill casings.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Nurse Ben said:


> Update: WTB Ranger TCS Tough. Yes, they are tough, but they don't have enough tread to support multi surface use, very thick casing, runs best at moderate pressure, probably a better tire for the Southwest where rock and rock abrasion are the thing. This is not the kind of tire I'd want to continue running in the PNW.
> 
> *Anyone wanna trade for some NN 2.8 or Rekon 2.8?*
> 
> ...


I've got a 2.8 Nobby Nic pacestar I would trade but it has a repair... Only has 50 miles on it. 800 gram plus tire, not gonna be durable... I don't ride all that "light" though, so i benefit from tough casing.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

SB666 said:


> I've got a 2.8 Nobby Nic pacestar I would trade but it has a repair... Only has 50 miles on it. 800 gram plus tire, not gonna be durable... I don't ride all that "light" though, so i benefit from tough casing.


Yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking, it's almost like the only way I'm gonna get what I want is to stay with 3" tires until the 2.8's catch up with reality.

The Purgatory 3" and the Trail Boss 3" have never let me down, so I'm not sure what the mfg's are thinking with the 2.8 light casing designs. I'll either get some new Trail Boss or some new Purgs.

Isn't there a Purgatory 2.8 on the way??

There's a Nobby Nic 2.8 Apex @ 960gms (gravity casing) but it's not available.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Isn't there a Purgatory 2.8 on the way??


Slaughter 2.6 and Butcher 2.8 seen here and here



Nurse Ben said:


> There's a Nobby Nic 2.8 Apex @ 960gms (gravity casing) but it's not available.


Where you seeing that?


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

PHeller said:


> Slaughter 2.6 and Butcher 2.8 seen here and here
> 
> Where you seeing that?


German Schwalbe website

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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

Nurse Ben said:


> Yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking, it's almost like the only way I'm gonna get what I want is to stay with 3" tires until the 2.8's catch up with reality.
> 
> The Purgatory 3" and the Trail Boss 3" have never let me down, so I'm not sure what the mfg's are thinking with the 2.8 light casing designs. I'll either get some new Trail Boss or some new Purgs.
> 
> ...


my best case for the lightweight 2.8's is to maybe ease the "standard" tire crowd into the plus tire world? People running 3.0's are on dedicated plus bikes and are probably already aware of all the benefits/trade offs. They, like the full-on fat bike crowd, have already come to terms with the heavy rubber. The people converting their 29ers might get scared off by the extra 300 grams...

ill be be all over that apex casing when its readily available. NN is a great tire, just needs more durability.


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## Chubb (Jun 27, 2011)

Specialized lists new Grid versions of the Purgatory, Ground Control, Slaughter, and Butcher which will all be offered in 650Bx2.3, 2.6,and 3.0 sizes and gives approx weights for each variation (Purgatory Grid 2.6 - 970 gm, 3.0 - 1100 gm). None are available to order online yet but some are shipping with 2017 bikes.

Lee McCormack gives a positive first ride review of the Purgatory Grid 3.0

Durability TBD


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

Nurse Ben said:


> Update: WTB Ranger TCS Tough. Yes, they are tough, but they don't have enough tread to support multi surface use, very thick casing, runs best at moderate pressure, probably a better tire for the Southwest where rock and rock abrasion are the thing. This is not the kind of tire I'd want to continue running in the PNW.
> 
> *Anyone wanna trade for some NN 2.8 or Rekon 2.8?*
> 
> ...


I would look at the 60 tpi dual compound version of the rekon+, seems to be burlier than the 120tpi 3C

Rekon+ get the most possitives reviews for agressive trail riding in technical terrain


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Chubb said:


> Specialized lists new Grid versions of the Purgatory, Ground Control, Slaughter, and Butcher which will all be offered in 650Bx2.3, 2.6,and 3.0 sizes and gives approx weights for each variation (Purgatory Grid 2.6 - 970 gm, 3.0 - 1100 gm). None are available to order online yet but some are shipping with 2017 bikes.
> 
> Lee McCormack gives a positive first ride review of the Purgatory Grid 3.0
> 
> Durability TBD


I was told December, kinda late. Also kinda bummed by the 2.6, granted it's not a huge difference, but it's getting on the small size. I'm sure they sized it to fit more bikes...

I think I'll be riding DW this winter, I need some grip in the corners


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

Maxxis Highroller 2 and Minion are out in 2.8" should be availlable soon !


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Hey, the Purgatory Grid 650 x 3 is available! Got a couple on the way, 1100 gms, not much heavier than the non grid.


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## j3ffro (May 8, 2015)

I've been meaning to contribute to the actual sizing collection, but I only got my caliper yesterday. The tires have 200 miles on them.

Vee Crown Gems 3.0 on Easton ARC 40 Rims, at 18 psi they are 75mm wide at the casing, and 76.3mm at the knobs.

It's my first plus tire, but I loved 'em from the get-go, and I think they are even better today. Burly sidewall too.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

2017 seems to be the year of the plus tires, at least selection is increasing; Spec Grid, new Maxxis, Schwalbe apex, etc. Be patient... New 2.6 size is also out, will be interesting to see how it compares with the 2.8''. 

So far I tried the Maxxis Chronicle 3.0 on my Devinci Hendrix and they survive all the summer hard charging roots and rocks but they are a bit to big, drag a bit too much and they are bouncy even with the proper pressure. I also tried a Pivot mach429 trail, switchblade and a RM Pipeline all with Maxxis Rekon+ 2.8 and what an amazing tire for aggressive riding on technical terrain. Much more playfull than the chronicle. 2.8'' on a 35-40mm rim seems to be the pefect spot for aggressive riding and plus size tire advantages without the drawbacks. The new Maxxis high Roller 2 in 2.8'' seems very promising. Is a 2.6 even better or worse ? will see...


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

My only "dilemna" is the significant difference in sizing/volume I'm finding when I drop from a 3" tire to a 2.8" tire. Perhaps WTB undersized the Ranger, but it was far smaller than a Trail Boss 3.0, so I found that it completely changed the way my bike rode; for the worse. But honestly, the 2.8's listing have not been measuring out to their spec.

Like anyone, I am all for reducing weight, which was my intent when I picked up the Ranger TCS Light, but at the cost of having to run higher tire pressures and getting pinch, flats, I don't think so. Sadly the Ranger in a tough casing is just too tough.

Got a perfect set of Ranger TCS Tough for sale, great tire for firm conditions, hard to beat if you're a tire cutting kind of rider.

Reinstalled the Trail Boss 3.0, inpatiently waiting for my Purgatory Grids to arrive. I wish Specialized had gone for a Purgatory Grid 2.8, but I suppose the 2.6 is more saleable for retrofitting, so I can't blame them.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

SB666 said:


> ill be be all over that apex casing when its readily available. NN is a great tire, just needs more durability.


I wonder how much that extra durability will effect the weight. The NN 2.8 is a pretty lightweight tire for its size.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

PHeller said:


> I wonder how much that extra durability will effect the weight. The NN 2.8 is a pretty lightweight tire for its size.


100gm. I have a Hans Damph gravity, it was 75gm heavier than non gravity, but it is far burlier.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

It'd be interesting if the Rocket Ron 2.8 got the Apex casing as well. 900g for the Nobby Nic 2.8 ain't half bad. Not sure if necessary as a front tire, but the RR 2.8 with Apex would be a rad rear tire.


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## Fx1 (Sep 27, 2015)

has nobody ridden the 2.6" vs the 2.8/3.0 debate yet?


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## sergio8691 (Aug 6, 2010)

I have weighted Specialized Purgatory GRID 3.0 - it is 1137 gm - claimed weight is "approximately 1100 gm". The uninflated tire looks appropriately huge and sidewalls are definitely not flimsy (but probably not in Maxxis DD or Schwalbe Supergravity territory). Hopefully I will have wheels to put them on in a week or two...


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm really curious how Schwalbe's Apex compares to Supergravity, and how the GRID casing compares to those two. 

Judging by EWS punctures, you might think that GRID is not as stout as Maxxis reinforced tires.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

Nice tires setup here;

slaughter grid 2.6 rear and butcher grid 2.8 front:

Industry Bike Check: Sebastian Maag's Specialized Enduro EVO | ENDURO Mountainbike Magazine


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## HomegrownMN (Nov 29, 2004)

These shots were brand new, but after a few rides aboard these Dirt Wizards, I'm convinced this is the rowdiest front b+ tire out there!

SO good in all the conditions I've ridden it in and Surly seems to have nailed the rubber compound on this new batch of DW's.

:yesnod::drumroll::yesnod:

























It's amazing how quiet and fast rolling this tire is despite it's looks and weight.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Just mounted up a set of Rekon 2.8, 832gm and 834gm, 67mm, soft rubber, fast rolling.

I just dropped 300gms per wheel, that's coming from a TB 3.0, not bad at all.

DWs are fine tires, but I don't envy the weight, it certainly won't make a bike more playful.

So I rode some NN 2.8 on a Mojo 3, they seemed wider tgan my new Rekons, maybe they stretched or maybe they are wider?


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## eb1888 (Jan 27, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Just mounted up a set of Rekon 2.8, 832gm and 834gm, 67mm, soft rubber, fast rolling.
> 
> I just dropped 300gms per wheel, that's coming from a TB 3.0, not bad at all.
> 
> ...


Rim inner width affects tire width also. I read in a thread that each 1mm of rim width adds 0.4mm of tire width. 
What rim id are you using.


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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Maxxis HR2+, DHF+ and DHR+ are all up on the Maxxis site.

Fat Bike/Plus Tire | Maxxis Tires USA

Can't seem to buy them yet but they're there... one step closer!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Dually.

Rim width matters, but some tires just measure out marrower than advertised, ie Maxxis and some WTB.

I guess if someone is looking for a tire that is closer to advertised width, the NN 2.8 woudl be a true 2.8, whereas the Rekon 2.8 is closer to a 2.6. WTB Ranger 2.8 is in the same boat.



eb1888 said:


> Rim inner width affects tire width also. I read in a thread that each 1mm of rim width adds 0.4mm of tire width.
> What rim id are you using.


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## gasmanxj (Sep 29, 2014)

Nurse Ben said:


> So I rode some NN 2.8 on a Mojo 3, they seemed wider than my new Rekons, maybe they stretched or maybe they are wider?


My new 2.8 NN's after one ride measure 2.76 at the knobs on a 36mm ID rim at 15 PSI. Sidewall is slightly narrower. Guessing they will stretch a tad ending up real close to 2.8. Kinda disappointed the Maxxis are coming in narrower, really was looking forward to DHF/DHR combo but want a real 2.8!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Nurse Ben said:


> Rekon 2.8 is closer to a 2.6. WTB Ranger 2.8 is in the same boat.


Has anyone compared the Rekon and Ranger to the Trailblazer or Breakout? I run the Breakout 2.5 in the rear of my bike and I doubt I could fit anything larger, but I would like something of equal size and toughness...just lighter. Been think of doing the Rekon EXO as a front tire and the Ranger Tough or Specialized Slaughter 2.6 as a rear...if theyll fit.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

gasmanxj said:


> My new 2.8 NN's after one ride measure 2.76 at the knobs on a 36mm ID rim at 15 PSI. Sidewall is slightly narrower. Guessing they will stretch a tad ending up real close to 2.8. Kinda disappointed the Maxxis are coming in narrower, really was looking forward to DHF/DHR combo but want a real 2.8!


NN 2.8 and Rekon+ on same rims width are about the same height and width fully streched at the same tire pressure as reported by several other forums. rekon+ is a 2.8" on approved rim size (39mm inner width) at max pressure.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

maxxis rekon+ is now availlable with the silkshield exo at 885g 3C maxx terra 120 tpi

could be a good setup as a rear tire combined with the new minion DHF plus 3C max terra 120 tpi 980g in the front.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Davex1 said:


> NN 2.8 and Rekon+ on same rims width are about the same height and width fully streched at the same tire pressure as reported by several other forums. rekon+ is a 2.8" on approved rim size (39mm inner width) at max pressure.


Not the results I had. Rekon much narrower. Rekon fit in my frame, the NN rubbed.


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

My Rekon+2.8 on 35mm id rims, 68 and 67mm. 

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


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## Guest (Sep 18, 2016)

Zerort said:


> Not the results I had. Rekon much narrower. Rekon fit in my frame, the NN rubbed.


mass production at it's finest in play. As we discuss and share i suspect the diff between the two brands / sizes is a mere +/-2mm depending.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

nvphatty said:


> mass production at it's finest in play. As we discuss and share i suspect the diff between the two brands / sizes is a mere +/-2mm depending.


More like 2mm each side. Schwalbe are measuring 71mm plus. Maxxis, 67. Just look at the post above yours.


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## Guest (Sep 18, 2016)

Zerort said:


> More like 2mm each side. Schwalbe are measuring 71mm plus. Maxxis, 67. Just look at the post above yours.


my post was an attempt to shed some light on mass production and the inherent variables we see in the real world.

Case in point the two NN 2.8's i mounted new on i35 rims with 25psi measured 68mm knob-knob......now that they have sat and been ridden i suspect that stretch will take place but until i repair the dbl flat from yesterday i can't report....:bluefrown:


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

In case anyone's planning some icy winter rides.
Wrathchild | 45NRTH
Sorry if they've already been listed.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Davex1 said:


> maxxis rekon+ is now availlable with the silkshield exo at 885g 3C maxx terra 120 tpi


Is the Silkshield EXO a step up in protection over the normal EXO?


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

PHeller said:


> Is the Silkshield EXO a step up in protection over the normal EXO?


it is supposed to, yes

From the maxxis web site:

SILKSHIELD
SilkShield offers protection from bead to bead whereas Silkworm is found under the tread only. SilkShield provides an additional level of protection for sidewalls in addition to under the tread.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

What's the expected release date of the Specialized 2.6 tires?
_
EDIT: My local shop says they can get the new Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 in within a week. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like Specialized will be making a 275x2.6 tire with GRID and weight under 900g. _

What's the expected release date of the Schwalbe 2.6 tires?

_Both the Snakeskin and Apex casing Nobby Nic 2.6 may come in under or around 900g, with 810g for the Snakeskin and 910g for the Apex. Not bad, Schwalbe, not bad._


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

PHeller said:


> Has anyone compared the Rekon and Ranger to the Trailblazer or Breakout? I run the Breakout 2.5 in the rear of my bike and I doubt I could fit anything larger, but I would like something of equal size and toughness...just lighter. Been think of doing the Rekon EXO as a front tire and the Ranger Tough or Specialized Slaughter 2.6 as a rear...if theyll fit.





PHeller said:


> What's the expected release date of the Specialized 2.6 tires?
> _
> EDIT: My local shop says they can get the new Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 in within a week. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like Specialized will be making a 275x2.6 tire with GRID and weight under 900g. _
> 
> ...


2.6 Grid is late 2016

NN Apex 2017

Rekon 2.8 is available now 

So I just got from riding Angels Staircase, it's a pretty serious tire test, lots of granite, very steep, very fast, ran Rekon EXO 60tpi, 830gm, 13psi, and they never burped, they didn't even get scratched, but boy do they hook up!

I could see getting a High Roller up front so the rear works loose faster, more DH style, but honestly the tires worked so well that I'll probably run the pair.

I have a set of WTB Ranger Tough 27.5 x 2.8 that are fresh and in need of a new home, pm with offers.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Dhf2.8 front is another option 

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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

jacksonlui said:


> Dhf2.8 front is another option
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


some are also using a DHR II as a front with more braking performance. I red a report on this forum from a guy that just tried the new DHF 2.8 front combined with a Rekon 2.8 rear both in 60 tpi and good impression. I'm very tempted by this setup. Just worry about the rolling resistance of the DHF up front.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Rolling resistance is something to worry about in the rear tire more than the front. The front tire should have great traction. I had the dhr2 in the front on my 29er with a minionss in the back and was a good combo for me. 

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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

not2shabby said:


> In case anyone's planning some icy winter rides.
> Wrathchild | 45NRTH
> Sorry if they've already been listed.


I had not seen them yet, thanks! Hopefully the price is reasonable-ish.

Edit: Found them here for $129 but I have to think that price is going to change when they're actually available.

45Nrth 27.5X3.0 WRATHCHILD 120TPI STUDDED TIRE | Bike Tires | ERIK'S


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## benmcgill (Dec 30, 2010)

Has anyone tried to fit a 27.5 dirt wizard in a non-boost 29er pike?


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

benmcgill said:


> Has anyone tried to fit a 27.5 dirt wizard in a non-boost 29er pike?


I have a Maxxis chronicle 27.5x3'' in a pike boost for 27.5+/29 and this is a tigh fit. I'm sure it doesn't fit in a non boost pike.


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## benmcgill (Dec 30, 2010)

Davex1 said:


> I have a Maxxis chronicle 27.5x3'' in a pike boost for 27.5+/29 and this is a tigh fit. I'm sure it doesn't fit in a non boost pike.


Thanks for reply. Was hopeful but I didn't think it would fit.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

2.8 Magic Mary gets a mention and some happy snaps here. Singletrack Magazine | Cycle Show 2016: Radon Bikes 7.57kg Jealous Carbon Hardtail so keen for this tyre.


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## miamia (Sep 6, 2014)

I just bought these: Suomi Tyres Fat Freddie W348 75-584 27,5x3,0, studded tires. First time I have seen them. I should get them next week so let's see how do they look. It will be November/ December before we see any snow here so no ride report before that.
What comes to pricing the pair of them cost the same as one of those 45NRTH tires.


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## Patu (Jun 23, 2016)

Haven't had a good read through here yet but wondered what you all thought about running a 3" Nobby Nick up front and a 2.8" in the back?

I got a 2.8" in and it's really quite thin compared to the Rocket Ron.. So I've ordered a 3" because I figured it would give me a little more grip up front and then I'll move the 2.8" to the back to replace the Rocket Ron.

...if I'm honest, the NN just looks too skinny up front... The factory Pergatory was massive, then the 2.8" Rocket Ron looked and felt just right and now the 2.8" NN just looks so skinny...

Just wondered what your thoughts were on this setup? I could of course leave the RR on the back, it's just that it's a liteskin and I can't run it tubeless...a blew the last one on a drop!


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## mowabb (Dec 9, 2011)

Has anyone tried JungleFox rims with 2.8 tyres? Nextie recommeds 3.0-3.8....


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## Guest (Oct 4, 2016)

GRPABT1 said:


> 2.8 Magic Mary gets a mention and some happy snaps here.


pretty aggressive tread pattern on MM.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

nvphatty said:


> pretty aggressive tread pattern on MM.


Also pretty heavy. Has anyone tried the Ikon plus series? I didn't like the 2.3, but am a bit tempted by the 2.8, which apparently has a 2.36 casing width. All this whill waiting for the NN 2.6 to arrive!


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## bonesetter2004 (May 27, 2007)

Patu said:


> Haven't had a good read through here yet but wondered what you all thought about running a 3" Nobby Nick up front and a 2.8" in the back?
> 
> I got a 2.8" in and it's really quite thin compared to the Rocket Ron.. So I've ordered a 3" because I figured it would give me a little more grip up front and then I'll move the 2.8" to the back to replace the Rocket Ron.
> 
> ...


My mate is running that combo and likes it


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Just a quick bit:

I've got the new Specialized Slaughter 2.6 on the back of my bike and it's slightly smaller than the Breakout, but lighter and faster rolling. I like it, alot. 

I've also got the Butcher 2.6 on the way and if its grips as good at the Slaughter I think I'll have a good mix of high volume, decently lightweight, good grip and tough tires that you can get at your local Specialized dealer. 

I am however still interested in the Nobby Nic 2.6 Apex, as they are claimed weight in mid-800's and should be as tough as the Specialized GRID models.


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

Looking for a new set of tires on a budget. 

Anything wrong with running wtb bridger 3.0 front and rear? Or maybe Trail Boss? 
I could probably swing for the NN but that's about it on my budget?. 
On a budget what would you recommend??


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

Jatrma said:


> Looking for a new set of tires on a budget.
> 
> Anything wrong with running wtb bridger 3.0 front and rear? Or maybe Trail Boss?
> I could probably swing for the NN but that's about it on my budget?.
> On a budget what would you recommend??


WTB Breakout 2.5 or WTB Trailboss 3.0 are the best budget plus tires.


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

Davex1 said:


> WTB Breakout 2.5 or WTB Trailboss 3.0 are the best budget plus tires.


Isn't the Bridger a little more aggressive? What about trail boss rear and bridger front? 
Im new to this and just looking at different options.

Most of my riding is mainly hard and loose over hard and mostly flat turns.


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

Would really like to see some 2.8 Mountain Kings hit the market.


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## Patu (Jun 23, 2016)

Patu said:


> Haven't had a good read through here yet but wondered what you all thought about running a 3" Nobby Nick up front and a 2.8" in the back?
> 
> I got a 2.8" in and it's really quite thin compared to the Rocket Ron.. So I've ordered a 3" because I figured it would give me a little more grip up front and then I'll move the 2.8" to the back to replace the Rocket Ron.
> 
> ...


for those interested, I've now fitted the 2.8 Rocket Ron, 2.8 Nobby Nic and now the 3.0 NN and I'd say the 3.0 NN comes up more the size of a 2.8 tyre. The 2.8 NN is more like a 2.6" if you ask me..

I've got the 3.0 NN up front and currently running the 2.8 RR in back.

Yet to get out on them...but the 3.0 NN up front looks like it'all give me a lot of grip! Big and nobby!!!


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

The 2.8 rr is very close to a true 2.8 the 2.8 nn not so much.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

bdundee said:


> The 2.8 rr is very close to a true 2.8 the 2.8 nn not so much.


What tread width are you seeing with the 2.8 NN?


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

Simplemind said:


> What tread width are you seeing with the 2.8 NN?


71.5 mm on 31i rims at 16psi for the rr No actual info on the 2.8nn at this time as I took them off but if I remember right they were right around 67-68mm with the same setup. 
(Disclaimer the NN didn't have sufficient time to stretch so they could grow some)


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## Guest (Oct 8, 2016)

Simplemind said:


> What tread width are you seeing with the 2.8 NN?





bdundee said:


> 71.5 mm on 31i rims at 16psi for the rr No actual info on the 2.8nn at this time as I took them off but if I remember right they were right around 67-68mm with the same setup.
> (Disclaimer the NN didn't have sufficient time to stretch so they could grow some)


no disclaimer on my end.. nn 2.8-i35 rims= 68mm


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

Simplemind said:


> What tread width are you seeing with the 2.8 NN?


I bought a 2.8 RR and NN back in March (both snakeskin with pacestar rubber), upon getting them both had a b2b measurement of 167mm. I didn't measure tread width upon mounting them, because my calipers were misplaced, but they appeared close in tread width although the NN looked a little wider and they were both visibly wider than a WTB Trailblazer. I bought 2 more 2.8 NNs in July (this time they were snakeskin with trail star rubber), to my eye they looked the same size as my previous NN and RR combo upon mounting them. They have seen limited use, maybe 50 miles, and now that I found my calipers I can say they currently measure 71mm tread width on a 30mm internal rim.

Maybe the width others are seeing represents the differences in manufacturing tolerances, or maybe there was a second run of tires that run smaller? But I've had 3 NNs and they all seemed to be true to size 2.8s


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## voltairesb (Sep 2, 2016)

I mounted my rekon 60tpi 27.5x2.8s to my I9 backcountry
y 360 wheels today. NEVER have I worked so damn hard to get a bead over the rim. I'm not sure if there is a trick for tires this thick, but it was a serious chore. I don't know that I could add a tube and reseat on trail....


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## Hakka (Jul 7, 2008)

Is there much variation in the height between the different width tires? Currently running purg 3.0s on my 6fattie, i run dhf/dhr2 on my other non plus bikes, would like to give the 2.8s a go but dont want to lose any bb height.


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## crfnick56 (Mar 7, 2012)

Has anyone found the Maxxis DHF 2.8 in stock anywhere? I'm really anxious to try this up front with e Rekon in the back before the cold weather really sets in here.

EDIT: Found them in stock at Competitive Cyclist :thumbsup:


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

miamia said:


> I just bought these: Suomi Tyres Fat Freddie W348 75-584 27,5x3,0, studded tires. First time I have seen them. I should get them next week so let's see how do they look. It will be November/ December before we see any snow here so no ride report before that.
> What comes to pricing the pair of them cost the same as one of those 45NRTH tires.


nice find! where did you get them from and how much?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Is a 27.5x2.5 dhf considered a plus tire? Its pretty big considering the rekon is only about 2.65"

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## BSEVEER (Jan 31, 2004)

I'm running Surly Dirt Wizards, 27.5 X 3.0 on Hugo 52 rims and I think it's a great combo. The wider rims give the tires a great profile, not too round.


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Is a 27.5x2.5 dhf considered a plus tire? Its pretty big considering the rekon is only about 2.65"
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


No. The DHF is smaller.

I have a Convict 2.5 (slightly wider than DHF 2.5) on 31mm ID wheels and a Rekon on 40mm ID wheels and there is a big difference in size. The Rekon is larger.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Ok thx. I like the traction and weight but got a flat on the front today at black mtn. Maybe bad luck but never had a problem with my dhr2 before. 

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## Flash (Jan 30, 2004)

jacksonlui said:


> Ok thx. I like the traction and weight but got a flat on the front today at black mtn. Maybe bad luck but never had a problem with my dhr2 before.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Name dropping my favorite trail isn't fair. I haven't been down there yet this year. No tire problems for me last year though. Just the fractured elbow. 

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Ok thx. I like the traction and weight but got a flat on the front today at black mtn. Maybe bad luck but never had a problem with my dhr2 before.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Just get the DHF 2.8 then.  Maxxis Minion DHF EXO/TR Tire - 27.5 Plus | Competitive Cyclist


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Flash said:


> Name dropping my favorite trail isn't fair. I haven't been down there yet this year. No tire problems for me last year though. Just the fractured elbow.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


If you havent been this year to BM, the one near PQ, then youre missing out on the 2 new trails. Sdmba did an awesome job. Thats where i got a flat, on the 1st section descend there's a square edge sharp rock. Next time im gonna jump it.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

JCWages said:


> Just get the DHF 2.8 then.  Maxxis Minion DHF EXO/TR Tire - 27.5 Plus | Competitive Cyclist


Thx. I might do that since my rear is wearing quick. Ill move the fron rekon 3c to the back and put the dhf 2.8 up front. Is it suppose to he more durable? The weight should matter that much since its up front.

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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

I have the marin pine mountain with the stock wheels (Maddux DD40 27.5+, Double Wall, 40mm Inner, Tubeless Ready) and want to run studded ice tires on a budget. Does anyone know if I can use the 27.5 schwalbe ice spiker pro's on these rims? They are obviously not a plus size tire so I dont know if they'll fit.


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Thx. I might do that since my rear is wearing quick. Ill move the fron rekon 3c to the back and put the dhf 2.8 up front. Is it suppose to he more durable? The weight should matter that much since its up front.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Yes and stiffer too. That's my plan as soon as I get my hands on the DHF. I prefer the consistent traction of the Convict but they don't make it in a Plus yet.


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## miamia (Sep 6, 2014)

jayvee said:


> nice find! where did you get them from and how much?


I got them from here: Etusivu - Bikeshop.fi. 89 €/tire. They are big tires true 3.0, way bigger than 2.8 Nobby Nics


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

JCWages said:


> Yes and stiffer too. That's my plan as soon as I get my hands on the DHF. I prefer the consistent traction of the Convict but they don't make it in a Plus yet.


Yes please let us know how it performs. Youre on the ACV? Thats a nice bike.

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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

thanks. 89 euro is quite a lot with sterling so low. Any troubles with clearance? I'd be worried they might not fit at the back on the marin. Do you know if the studs are carbide?


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Thx. I might do that since my rear is wearing quick. Ill move the fron rekon 3c to the back and put the dhf 2.8 up front. Is it suppose to he more durable? The weight should matter that much since its up front.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


How about try the Rekon with their new Silkshield at 885g. A pretty good weight.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Yes please let us know how it performs. Youre on the ACV? Thats a nice bike.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I'll do a full report for sure. I love new tires and thanks. I'm loving this plus bike thing and the ACV is perfect for my style and terrain.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

I would stay away from 120 TPI tires for agressive trail use, Those are too soft and the sidewall are flexy and fragile. They are good for XC racing since they are light weight but I prefer a 60 TPI for the ride quality, performance and durability. 120 TPI might be more supple for absorbing trail chatter but gives too much compromises everywhere else.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Do you think the front tire needs to be more burly than the back because youre smashing into things or so you think the back because its more weighted?

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

1100g tire is a lot to pedal uphill versus 850g

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## JCWages (Jan 26, 2015)

jacksonlui said:


> Do you think the front tire needs to be more burly than the back because youre smashing into things or so you think the back because its more weighted?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Usually use the "tougher" casing tire in the rear because it is weighted more and more subject to being slashed. It's harder to move the rear tire out of the way of sharp rocks compared to the front.


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## miamia (Sep 6, 2014)

jayvee said:


> thanks. 89 euro is quite a lot with sterling so low. Any troubles with clearance? I'd be worried they might not fit at the back on the marin. Do you know if the studs are carbide?


I had to buy a new fork. I had DVO Diamond 27.5 which had enough clearance for 2.8 NN, but not enough for this Fat Freddie. It is about 7,5 cm wide and about 8 cm height when mounted. Now I have MRP stage 29 in front and now the tire has enough room. It is almost as tall as regular 29. 
I think they are using hard metal studs made from steel.


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

miamia said:


> I had to buy a new fork. I had DVO Diamond 27.5 which had enough clearance for 2.8 NN, but not enough for this Fat Freddie. It is about 7,5 cm wide and about 8 cm height when mounted. Now I have MRP stage 29 in front and now the tire has enough room. It is almost as tall as regular 29.
> I think they are using hard metal studs made from steel.


thanks thats helpful, I'll measure the kenda havoks i have in there at the moment


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

I shredded the sidewall on the stock WTB Trailblazers that came on my Sherpa at less than 200 miles. I actually didn't mind them, but they really didn't hold up to New England roots and rocks. My only gripe is that at really low pressures the sidewall had a tendency to roll in the corners.

One thing I liked about them was the air volume - I have a buddy running Chronicles and they're quite a bit smaller when mounted than the WTBs. Not the best pic, but left is me, right is him.









I have Minions on my regular AM bike and my fatty, so I'd like something a little less aggressive (and more durable than 200 miles haha). What's out there that's big and wide with a lot of volume?

Edit: The Purgatory Control 3.0s look like they might fit the bill, and only $110 for the pair shipped from Specialized. Just ordered a set and will see how they do.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Seventh-777 said:


> I shredded the sidewall on the stock WTB Trailblazers that came on my Sherpa at less than 200 miles. I actually didn't mind them, but they really didn't hold up to New England roots and rocks. My only gripe is that at really low pressures the sidewall had a tendency to roll in the corners.
> 
> One thing I liked about them was the air volume - I have a buddy running Chronicles and they're quite a bit smaller when mounted than the WTBs. Not the best pic, but left is me, right is him.
> 
> ...


That is the first time I have seen anyone say the Trailblazer was bigger than any other Plus size tire. The Trailblazer is widely considered the smallest 27+ tire around, more like a 2.6. You're saying it's bigger than your buddies 3.0 Chronicle? Does not compute!


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

bikeny said:


> That is the first time I have seen anyone say the Trailblazer was bigger than any other Plus size tire. The Trailblazer is widely considered the smallest 27+ tire around, more like a 2.6. You're saying it's bigger than your buddies 3.0 Chronicle? Does not compute!


Don't look at me, I just pedal the things around. I'm talking about sidewall height and volume, not width. (I didn't really pay attention to how wide his was, to be honest.) Here's a better shot of that same pic. My bike is a medium, his is a large...


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

Seventh-777 said:


> Don't look at me, I just pedal the things around. I'm talking about sidewall height and volume, not width. (I didn't really pay attention to how wide his was, to be honest.) Here's a better shot of that same pic. My bike is a medium, his is a large...
> 
> View attachment 1099825


Gotcha. Yes the Trailblazer is tall for it's size, but I can guarantee that the Chronicle has more volume and can safely be run at lower pressure. The overall volume has to do with height and width. I assume they are on the same rims?


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

bikeny said:


> Gotcha. Yes the Trailblazer is tall for it's size, but I can guarantee that the Chronicle has more volume and can safely be run at lower pressure. The overall volume has to do with height and width. I assume they are on the same rims?


Yeah, same rims. I probably should have stuck with "taller" instead of "more volume", but like I said, I just pedal the thing around and try to look cool.


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## TOPFLiTE1994 (Oct 16, 2016)

I'd probably stay around 2.5 to get the best of both worlds


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

TOPFLiTE1994 said:


> I'd probably stay around 2.5 to get the best of both worlds


There is no best of both worlds. There are only trade-offs and priorities. That's not too day that 2.5 isn't the magic number for somebody, but it will have less traction less inertia and less weight than a wider tire.

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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

Suggestions on plus tires for winter riding in snow and muck?


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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

coolhand80 said:


> Suggestions on plus tires for winter riding in snow and muck?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've ridden last winter mostly using WTB TrailBlazer as rear tire, than pair of ISP:s (29er rear). If anybody has better B+ winter tire suggestion to be used in every day commuting in all weathers from nice snow to wet ice to -25°C, I'm very interested.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

*Specialized Butcher GRID 650B x 2.6 anyone find any?*

I'm looking to pick up a Specialized Butcher GRID 27.5 x 2.6. Anyone having any luck finding them? Out of stock online.


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

coolhand80 said:


> Suggestions on plus tires for winter riding in snow and muck?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


look up thread. Suomi fat freddie or 45nrth wrathchild, although expect the latter to be expensive.


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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

I've ordered WTB Ranger 27.5/3.0 light, it has same rubber compound as TrailBlazer but better thread pattern thus having high hopes for it to be better snow tire. Wet ice may be interesting tho... 

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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

mhelander said:


> I've ridden last winter mostly using WTB TrailBlazer as rear tire, than pair of ISP:s (29er rear). If anybody has better B+ winter tire suggestion to be used in every day commuting in all weathers from nice snow to wet ice to -25°C, I'm very interested.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


If you have enough room, look at the vee trax fatty 3.25'' tires on 50mm rims.


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

What is a warhammer? is that a new tire or are you referencing the Wrathchild?



jayvee said:


> look up thread. Suomi fat freddie or 45nrth warhammer, although expect the latter to be expensive.


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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

not2shabby said:


> In case anyone's planning some icy winter rides.
> Wrathchild | 45NRTH
> Sorry if they've already been listed.





Jefflinde said:


> What is a warhammer? is that a new tire or are you referencing the Wrathchild?


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

^yep wrathchild. I've amended my post.


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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

Plusforever said:


> I'm looking to pick up a Specialized Butcher GRID 27.5 x 2.6. Anyone having any luck finding them? Out of stock online.


Purgatory 27.5x2.6 is now in stock at Specialized online. Just ordered one. I'll put up pics and measurements this weekend of this tire and the Slaughter 27.5x2.6. Mounting them on 30mm internal width Roval carbon wheels.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

I sure wish they would have made a Purgatory 2.8. That along with a 2.8 Butcher front would have been sweet.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The 2.6 purg looka interesting. Im worried it wont provide enough braking traction and grip on loose steep terrain but it looks like a fast roller. Let us know how it rides

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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

Thinking out loud, Maxxis Recon rear/Specialized 2.8 Butcher front for wet weather?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I figured I'll try a thinner tire till the prices come down. But that combo sounds like a good one

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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

Plusforever said:


> Purgatory 27.5x2.6 is now in stock at Specialized online. Just ordered one. I'll put up pics and measurements this weekend of this tire and the Slaughter 27.5x2.6. Mounting them on 30mm internal width Roval carbon wheels.


Here's the width measurements. They have been aired up for three days. 20 psi. 30mm internal rims.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Oh my^^^^


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I don't wonder if the casing on the Specialized 2.6 tires is maybe a bit taller than most 2.5 tires. I've got the Slaughter 2.6 on my Stans Flow EX and it's definitely a tad smaller than my Breakout 2.5 (which is a good thing) but it's seems like its equally tall.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

The Spesh Butcher 2.6 did look fairly tall, heck there wasn't a lot of clearance between the arch of the Yari and the tire.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Thanks for the measurements. If they are only 2.5, i might as well stick with the 2.5 dhf/2.4 dhr combo. 

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## jab63 (Dec 31, 2012)

That is a very nice bike. I just ordered a YS last week and I am trying to decide to build it 29 or 650 B+. I know very little about B+ riding. Currently riding a SC Super-light thinking the B+ will provide darn near the same cushion i am use to plus a lot more traction. Are you still happy with the bikes performance? Do you ever exp. tire rub? Do you mind sharing your spec? This is going to be my first bike build so looking for a lot of advice. Move from Boise to the Netherlands. Not as many switchbacks here, but they are out there.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

*Nobby Nic, Purgatory, Dirt Wizard*








This shows left to right:

Specialized Purgatory Control on i38mm rim
Surly Dirt Wizard 3.0 on *i40mm rim*
Schwalbe NobbyNic 3.0 Apex on i38mm rim.


Widths at 20psi are:


Purg 73mm casing, 78mm knobs
DW 70mm casing, 76mm knob
NN 74mm casing, 76mm knob


The NobbyNic has only been installed for 48hourse, other tires for several days or weeks.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

I just installed a 2.8 Butcher on a 31i rim and at 20psi I have 66.5mm and weight was 1050g.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Just weighed the 2.6 Butcher GRID last night and it came in at 965g.


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

The purg looks fatter.


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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

PHeller said:


> Just weighed the 2.6 Butcher GRID last night and it came in at 965g.


Where are you guys getting your Butchers??? I haven't been able to locate one.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Nurse Ben said:


> Update: WTB Ranger TCS Tough. Yes, they are tough, but they don't have enough tread to support multi surface use, very thick casing, runs best at moderate pressure, probably a better tire for the Southwest where rock and rock abrasion are the thing. This is not the kind of tire I'd want to continue running in the PNW.
> 
> *Anyone wanna trade for some NN 2.8 or Rekon 2.8?*
> 
> ...


Isn't the Rekon supposed to be available with Silkshield casing protection in addition to the regular EXO casing


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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

Anyone know if the Butcher and/or Purg 2.6 will fit on a non-Boost Pike? 

I saw the 2017 Enduro with the Boost fork and the clearance seemed small, but the shop told me the arch height is the same as the non-Boosted Pike and it should fit, but height might be an issue.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'd think they would. I've got the Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 and both seem more like 2.5 in size.


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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

PHeller said:


> I'd think they would. I've got the Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 and both seem more like 2.5 in size.


Interesting, thanks for the info. Mine should arrive this week, I'll see how they fit and post info when I get a chance.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I think the Butcher will be tight in the crown of the Pike. I know when I was running the bigger-than-Butcher Breakout 2.5 that I couldn't really run a fender.


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## Osco (Apr 4, 2013)

*Maxxis Recon 27.5 x 2.80*

Just weighed the Maxxis Recon 27.5 x 2.80 Tubeless ready at 802 grams..
Measures 70mm/2.75" wide on 35mm I.D. rims at 17 psi after stretching them overnight at 35 psi. they started out at 17 psi showing 68mm wide or 2.65" before the stretch.

Really Nice Shoes, L shaped side knobs, ramped center treads.
Very supple, Nice firm sidewalls, should be a stable tire with little squirm when I go tubeless and drop the psi' down to the mid teens.

Gotta loose those heavy tubes.. 
I bet Two of these weigh more than three regular 650b x 2.35 tubes..

Whatcha thunk ?? who's weighed a mid fat tube ??


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Are there any issues with stretching tires out then running them with less pressure?

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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

jacksonlui said:


> Are there any issues with stretching tires out then running them with less pressure?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


No we've been doing it for years with our fat bike tires.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

jacksonlui said:


> Are there any issues with stretching tires out then running them with less pressure?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Tires are going to stretch out no matter what you do. Inflating them to a high pressure will make it happen a little quicker, but really the tire will stretch to it's maximum size after riding it for a while. Inflating to a high pressure when first installing a tire is generally a good idea for other reasons though. It ensures that the beads are seated properly to the rim, reduces the chance of wobbles, and helps get a good tubeless seal if you are running tubeless. It's also a good idea to put some soapy water on the beads when mounting to help them pop into place.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Thx all. Makes sense

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## WMBigs (Jul 11, 2009)

Hi all, 
Riding a Fuse and the rear Ground Control 27.5x3 is getting worn out. I have no complaints with the tire but thinking of something different. Maxxis has the Rekon in 2.8 or Chronicle in 3.0. Running tubeless. I do hit pedals at times, will the 2.8's drop me down noticeably? Riding hard pack, loose over hard, broken shale and round river rock, silty in some places. Rear tire spins on steep silty uphills and letting loose breaking around corners. I am leaning towards the Rekon at this time. Any advise??
TIA, MikeB


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

WMBigs said:


> Hi all,
> Riding a Fuse and the rear Ground Control 27.5x3 is getting worn out. I have no complaints with the tire but thinking of something different. Maxxis has the Rekon in 2.8 or Chronicle in 3.0. Running tubeless. I do hit pedals at times, will the 2.8's drop me down noticeably? Riding hard pack, loose over hard, broken shale and round river rock, silty in some places. Rear tire spins on steep silty uphills and letting loose breaking around corners. I am leaning towards the Rekon at this time. Any advise??
> TIA, MikeB


Mike - If you want more traction without lowering the bottom bracket I'd recommend replacing the rear GC with a 27.5x3.0 Purgatory. That paid big dividends on my 6Fattie.

I would not recommend going to 2.8 tires if you're concerned about traction and ground clearance as you'll have less of both. I've used a 2.8 Nobby Nic in front and a 2.8 Rekon in back on an Ibis Mojo. Nice tires, but traction, cushion and ground clearance are reduced compared to 3.0 tires.

I measured the height/diameter of the Ground Control and Purgatory 3.0 on a 32mm inner width rim as apx. 28.6". The Maxxis Rekon on the same rim was apx. 28.0" so the axle will be about 0.3" lower (7-8mm) than with the 3.0 tires. The 3.0 tires may sag/squish a bit more, but at similar pressures the Rekon will still give you a slightly lower bottom bracket.


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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

I mounted up the 27.5 Purgatory Grid 2.6 to my non-Boosted Pike on 36mm internal rims. 

The sides seem to have between 8-10mm of clearance between the outer knobs, the arch somewhere in the 7-8mm range, so it seems sufficient to account for any flex and bulging. I didn't take a BB height measurement, so I don't know how much it raised it, but it appears that the tire is ~5mm taller than my 2.3 DHRII in the back. The width is right at 62mm, so closer to 2.45in. 

I'm a little worried it'll end up choppered out and feel funny with a smaller / shorter tire in the rear. If it does, I may try to squeeze the Purgatory in the back and put the Butcher in the front. 

I haven't mounted the Butcher yet to see how it fares. I may give that a shot at a later date. The knobs seem slightly taller, so it may be a much tighter fit.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

I really don't think a 5mm taller front tire is going to make it feel funny.


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## WMBigs (Jul 11, 2009)

levity said:


> Mike - If you want more traction without lowering the bottom bracket I'd recommend replacing the rear GC with a 27.5x3.0 Purgatory. That paid big dividends on my 6Fattie.
> 
> I would not recommend going to 2.8 tires if you're concerned about traction and ground clearance as you'll have less of both. I've used a 2.8 Nobby Nic in front and a 2.8 Rekon in back on an Ibis Mojo. Nice tires, but traction, cushion and ground clearance are reduced compared to 3.0 tires.
> 
> I measured the height/diameter of the Ground Control and Purgatory 3.0 on a 32mm inner width rim as apx. 28.6". The Maxxis Rekon on the same rim was apx. 28.0" so the axle will be about 0.3" lower (7-8mm) than with the 3.0 tires. The 3.0 tires may sag/squish a bit more, but at similar pressures the Rekon will still give you a slightly lower bottom bracket.


I was thinking of Purg also. Just ordered one from the LBS. I'll put the new one on front and front one on the rear. Maybe I'll start cleaning some of those tough short grinds. Thanks for the help!
MikeB


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## Jingleman (Sep 15, 2004)

Hello 
I have built my wheels with 45mm no brand rims and Nobby Nics 2.8 and set them tubeless with Gorilla tape. All fine except..

..It was really hard to mount the tires on, but now is even harder to get them off , I guess that if I will cut the tires in the wood I will not be able to use a spare tube and I will have a long walk back home..
Is that normal that is so difficult to mount/dismount tires from wide rims?
I imagine that this is a particular combo of rim/tire that makes it so hard, no?

These are the rims.
Rim mtb db-x50 27,5+ alloy 32 holes black RIDEWILL BIKE Wheels - Accessories, Bike Rims Bike


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## GuitsBoy (Sep 24, 2013)

Jingleman said:


> ..It was really hard to mount the tires on, but now is even harder to get them off


Are you certain that the tire bead on the opposing side is in the center of the channel? It could be that the rims are just a slightly larger than usual diameter. But I dont think it should be as difficult as you describe.

I have no info on those particular rims. Considering the price, they look like thryre OK. I'd almost consider building up a cheap wheelset just to check them out, but the $135 shipping is a killer. Are you located in Italy? If youre in the US, there may have been other options for the same total cost, but I guess its a moot point now that youre already riding them.


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## Patu (Jun 23, 2016)

Jingleman said:


> Hello
> I have built my wheels with 45mm no brand rims and Nobby Nics 2.8 and set them tubeless with Gorilla tape. All fine except..
> 
> ..It was really hard to mount the tires on, but now is even harder to get them off , I guess that if I will cut the tires in the wood I will not be able to use a spare tube and I will have a long walk back home..
> ...


This might be obvious so sorry if you know this...but have you tried putting your wheel on the ground side-to-side, all air out of course and then put your hands on top of the tyre and apply pressure while sliding your hands either side (one left and one right) all the way around as far as you can, then flip the wheel over while still applying the pressure. Hopefully you will then find that your action has slightly stretched the tyre around the rim and the side that is now on the top will be a little slacker...you can then often get the tyre off without any levers but if you need levers it should be a lot easier..

Don't let the pressure off though, otherwise you'll lose the tension..

Again...sorry if this is obvious and you've tried it...


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

^ good tip. I had to do that too and it worked. Just make sure all the slack is out of the tire and its in the center channel

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## Adodero (Jul 16, 2009)

Following up with my earlier post, I mounted the 2.6 Butcher on a non-Boost Pike. The knobs were around 1mm taller than the Purgatory and 2-3mm wider at the knobs. That leaves about 8-9mm on the sides of the fork and around 6-7mm at the arch. 

IMO the Butcher was much more confidence inspiring and seemed to dig in a lot more where the Purgatory would slide around.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

Your tire should stretch some after time making it a little easier to get it off the rim. Also at least with fat tires we would leave just a tiny amount of air in just to help pop the bead loose.


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## Jingleman (Sep 15, 2004)

Hello Patu,
Yes I live in Italy and the total cost for 2 rims shipped, was something like 60 us dollars, so I guess it was a bargain. When I received them I was surprised that the weight was not bad too, given the price obviously, 695 grams each..
Yes, I tried to move the beads to the center, but they even don't move more than 1-2mm if I push the bead to the center, like that the tire beads are glued to the sides of the rims..It is also very hard to put the tire lever between tire and rim, I should force so much I guess I will break some before I will be able to dismount the tire . Mounting was easier since at that time I put soap on the tire beads, but my concern is about a emergency repair in the woods. I think I would be better to buy new rims, because, trail repairs apart, it is impossible to check for dry stans liquid and so on..Pity because the rims are ok otherwise..Maybe they would be ok with some others tires, but I like the Nobbys 2,80 and also Im not sure that a new tires will fix this, Im more confident to buy new rims instead.


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## GuitsBoy (Sep 24, 2013)

The tubeless sealant will always glue the bead to the bead hook. Youll need to break the seal around teh entire tire to dismount it from teh rim. It sounds like youre trying to stretch the bead over the lip of the rim while the opposite side is still fully seated, which isnt going to work well. 

Break the bead seal around whole wheel on both sides, pinch the bead together so its in the center channel, then try to dismount. By having the beads in teh center channel, this frees up just a couple of mm on the opposite side, just enough to pull the tire over the lip.

I apologize if I misunderstood, and you are already doing this.


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## Jingleman (Sep 15, 2004)

Patu said:


> This might be obvious so sorry if you know this...but have you tried putting your wheel on the ground side-to-side, all air out of course and then put your hands on top of the tyre and apply pressure while sliding your hands either side (one left and one right) all the way around as far as you can, then flip the wheel over while still applying the pressure. Hopefully you will then find that your action has slightly stretched the tyre around the rim and the side that is now on the top will be a little slacker...you can then often get the tyre off without any levers but if you need levers it should be a lot easier..
> 
> Don't let the pressure off though, otherwise you'll lose the tension..
> 
> Again...sorry if this is obvious and you've tried it...


Thank you for your help, but Im far away to try this, the tire doesn't move at all.. I guess that I need more muscles for these rims..The rim is shallower at the center ( obviously) but I can't move the bead over the center anyway. They are so much stretched on the sides of the rim that I cannot move them. I could try harder,but as I answered to Patu already, maybe I would ride with more peace of mind with new rims, especially if Im far away from home/car.


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## GuitsBoy (Sep 24, 2013)

One other thing, maybe the gorilla tape is too thick, creating too tight a seal between the rim bed and the bead? Maybe try a thinner tape like kapton / polyamide stuff. And only use 2 layers, no more.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

GuitsBoy said:


> One other thing, maybe the gorilla tape is too thick, creating too tight a seal between the rim bed and the bead? Maybe try a thinner tape like kapton / polyamide stuff. And only use 2 layers, no more.


Good point concerning the tape. With a rim like that, all you need is a thin strip down the center, just enough to cover the spoke holes. Something thin like Stan's or the generic equivalent. You do not want any tape on the bead area. To get the bead unseated, you need to grab the tire with both hands, thumbs facing each other and placed on the tire sidewall just above the rim. Then try to roll or peel the tire off, pressing on the sidewall with your thumbs. Once you get a bit of it loose, the rest will come off easily. It's actually a good thing that the bead is nice and tight, it means you will not burp air when running nice low pressures.


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## Dirt n Dust (Mar 21, 2014)

Didn't see this posted but maybe I missed it. New tire from Vee: Crown Gem 2.8


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

Use Stan's tape or equivalent it is slippery and give it some time it will stretch some making it easier. I had a fat bike that took me an hour to get off, once I ran stans tape and rode it for awhile it was a lot easier to pop the bead and get the tire off.


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## Jingleman (Sep 15, 2004)

GuitsBoy said:


> The tubeless sealant will always glue the bead to the bead hook. Youll need to break the seal around teh entire tire to dismount it from teh rim. It sounds like youre trying to stretch the bead over the lip of the rim while the opposite side is still fully seated, which isnt going to work well.
> 
> Break the bead seal around whole wheel on both sides, pinch the bead together so its in the center channel, then try to dismount. By having the beads in teh center channel, this frees up just a couple of mm on the opposite side, just enough to pull the tire over the lip.
> 
> I apologize if I misunderstood, and you are already doing this.


Thank you GuitsBoy, I tried this, maybe I need to try harder ( much harder ) . If I am able to push a portion of the tire bead a few mm to the center , when I try to move the next section of the bead, the previous part of the bead gets back on the rim side. But I am not so worried if I can try to do in my garage, I would not like to find it impossible to do when I on the trails .


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## Jingleman (Sep 15, 2004)

GuitsBoy said:


> One other thing, maybe the gorilla tape is too thick, creating too tight a seal between the rim bed and the bead? Maybe try a thinner tape like kapton / polyamide stuff. And only use 2 layers, no more.


oh..maybe is this the solution??!!..thank you !!! 
Infact I found the gorilla tape to be quite thick.. At this point I will try new tape in place of new rims ...!!! 
What size of stans tape ( or similar) you advise me to get for an internal width of 45mm?


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## majr (May 22, 2012)

Jingleman said:


> oh..maybe is this the solution??!!..thank you !!!
> Infact I found the gorilla tape to be quite thick.. At this point I will try new tape in place of new rims ...!!!
> What size of stans tape ( or similar) you advise me to get for an internal width of 45mm?


This.
I initially used a double layer of strapping tape on i45 rims that went all the way to the bead width. It was tough to get the tire broken free from the bead bench to dismount. I redid one with a single layer and that was much better. If yours is very tight you could only tape over the spoke holes and leave the bead shelf bare.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

majr said:


> This.
> If yours is very tight you could only tape over the spoke holes and leave the bead shelf bare.


In my experience (which is a lot) stans on the bead shelf even with the added thickness help in breaking the bead and getting over the hump way better than just bare carbon. There also is some blue tape that is thinner than stans that would work real good in this situation.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Have you tried letting it sit in the sun so its more pliable? The cold temp will shrink EVERYTHING. I swear its just shrinkage from the pool , he said

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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

I've rebuild my B+ wheel using WTB ASYM i35 rim and then mounted on Ranger 3.0 TCS light setup tubeless.

Tire seated well and after Stans blocked rim seam area it seems to hold air well and doesn't wobble at all.

That rim was my easiest to build and holds tire very well. Whole wheel is almost dish-less so expecting good performance and long life with less need for re-truing.

Tire width was pretty much as stamped 73mm from thread and casing approximately 68mm with 1.5 bar pressure.

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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

PHeller said:


> I'd think they would. I've got the Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 and both seem more like 2.5 in size.


I've got the Butcher 2.6 on a 30mm internal Roval carbon rim measuring at 2.5" now after a few days aired up at 25 psi.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Just received my Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.6 - weighs in at 620 grams.








Yes, these are the Liteskin and yes they are thin, but will work fine for the trails i ride.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2016)

^^ wow thats ultra light for sure.


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## Bobokiltz (Nov 16, 2016)

*27.5/27.5+ combatibilty*

hey guys,

I am currently browsing the bike market and came across a Rocky Mountain Sherpa at an amazing price point. i wanted to see if I could fit a normal high volume tire on a 27.5+ rim as a falisafe.

thanks for any available advice or info


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Bobokiltz said:


> hey guys,
> 
> I am currently browsing the bike market and came across a Rocky Mountain Sherpa at an amazing price point. i wanted to see if I could fit a normal high volume tire on a 27.5+ rim as a falisafe.
> 
> thanks for any available advice or info


wrong thread, this is a thread discussing tires, not bikes.

try here:

http://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-plus-bikes/rocky-mountain-sherpa-991849.html


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## Joe Strickland (Nov 17, 2016)

*Always been a fan of big tires*

[I've been looking at steel frame 27.5 + bikes for the last year and I'm convinced that I need another bike.QUOTE=vikb;11457321]









Just starting a thread to discuss the new B+ tire format that is starting to gather steam.[/QUOTE]


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## Joe Strickland (Nov 17, 2016)

*Steel 27.5+ bikes*

Is the Jamis Dragonslayer my best choice?


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## grubetown (Sep 22, 2013)

Joe Strickland said:


> Is the Jamis Dragonslayer my best choice?


See two posts above - this is a tire thread.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I see that many people prefer 2.8 instead of 3.0 tires but I am wondering if this is a good choice for the bikes that come with 3.0 tires from the factory? Won't using 2.8 tires result in a lower BB and more pedal strikes?


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## 950sm07 (Oct 28, 2011)

My Orbea Loki came with 3.0 Maxxis Chronicles now I'm running 2.8 Nobby Nics and I'm noticing the lower BB and more pedal pedal strikes. They roll better but for me they are not as much fun as the 3.0 tires.


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## Guest (Nov 20, 2016)

gpgalanis said:


> I see that many people prefer 2.8 instead of 3.0 tires but I am wondering if this is a good choice for the bikes that come with 3.0 tires from the factory? Won't using 2.8 tires result in a lower BB and more pedal strikes?


 The answer depends on a lot of variables. Probably a lot of 2.8 mentions because they'll fit in most 29'r frames, but you see folks routinely putting 2.0 tires in 2.25 frames (or other similar tire size exchanges).


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I am asking because I am also expecting a Crafty with 3.0 Chronicles and I was looking at other available options since unfortunately the new DHF and DHR2 are only available as 2.8. The High Rollers however are also available as 3.0 but at least for the beginning I will give the Chronicles a try.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Used 27.5+ Tires for Sale:

(2) WTB Trail Boss 3.0, good condition, 2/3 tread remaining.

(2) WTB Ranger 2.8, TCS Heavy Casing, like new, less than ten miles used.

(1 or 2) Specialized Purgatory 3.0, 3/4 tread remaining.

Also have some 29 x 3 Dirt Wizards, 26 x 4.0 Jumbo Jim Snakeskin, Vee Rubber Snowshoe 26 x 4.6

Best offer + shipping from 98801. Bonus for buying multiple sets.


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## psycorp1 (Nov 27, 2016)

Anyone know if a NN 2.8 will fit into a 2016 Mattoc? A Bridger just fits width wise but hits the arch. I have 30mm ID rims for reference.


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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

...


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## rmilesh (Nov 17, 2016)

*Rocket Ron 2.6 impressions*

how do you like those? thinking of getting some for my Fluid FS plus in order to lighten my wheels up a bit....



Zerort said:


> Just received my Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.6 - weighs in at 620 grams.
> View attachment 1105034
> 
> 
> Yes, these are the Liteskin and yes they are thin, but will work fine for the trails i ride.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

rmilesh said:


> how do you like those? thinking of getting some for my Fluid FS plus in order to lighten my wheels up a bit....


Great tires. Just like my 29 x 2.25 version. They really are my go to tire. Offer plenty of traction and roll fast.

In fact I just rode them tonight in wet leaf packed trails. Performed just fine.


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## rmilesh (Nov 17, 2016)

do u run them tubeless or with tubes? if tubes, which ones do you use?



Zerort said:


> Great tires. Just like my 29 x 2.25 version. They really are my go to tire. Offer plenty of traction and roll fast.
> 
> In fact I just rode them tonight in wet leaf packed trails. Performed just fine.


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

rmilesh said:


> do u run them tubeless or with tubes? if tubes, which ones do you use?


Tubeless with Stans on Reynolds Heist/Arc rims


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## rmilesh (Nov 17, 2016)

cool, was under the impression you couldn't run the liteskin tubeless... glad it works, thanks for the insight. looking forward to knocking about 400g off each wheel with those


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

rmilesh said:


> cool, was under the impression you couldn't run the liteskin tubeless... glad it works, thanks for the insight. looking forward to knocking about 400g off each wheel with those


You can. With patience.

Usually takes about two tries and spinning the wheel slowly horizontally for quite a bit to get the sidewalls filled. Both sides obviously.

After a ride or two, no worries.


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## rmilesh (Nov 17, 2016)

gotcha, thanks for the tips!


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

rmilesh said:


> gotcha, thanks for the tips!


No problem. I hope you enjoy them and the weight savings.


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

Zerort said:


> You can. With patience.
> 
> Usually takes about two tries and spinning the wheel slowly horizontally for quite a bit to get the sidewalls filled. Both sides obviously.
> 
> After a ride or two, no worries.


I can attest to this method working. i am running RR 3.0s LS tubeless. they seep at first but they seal up. i could not be happier with them.


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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

Does anyone have problems with there not being continuous side nobs on the plus sized Nobby Nic?


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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

javisst44 said:


> Does anyone have problems with there not being continuous side nobs on the plus sized Nobby Nic?


Yes. It doesn't like being leaned over. I have had a few front washouts now. Switching my front out to a DHF

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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

Really loving the new Purgatory 2.6 tire on the rear. Super grippy but rolls fast. This size is working great to give me clearance for the peanut butter mud of Pittsburgh. It measures 2.5" but has huge volume.









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## Osco (Apr 4, 2013)

Stock on my 2017 Scott Scale 720 Plus bike

Maxxis Rekon 120tpi,,bla bla bla
Terra on the front and Speed on the back, must be a compound thing.
Ramped center treads for speed and nice sturdy L shaped side lugs that ring like a church bell when they kick out a rock just right.
27.5 x 2.8 and they measured when new 2.65 at 16 psi, 
stretched to 2.70 after a few days at 30 psi.
Now after a 100 miles on my 35 mm I.D. rims at 16 psi I get 2.71 wide.
Very happy with the rolling and the traction.
I'm 172 wet, with pack and ride gear 180, bike Is 28.5 pounds 
I like 15 psi rear and 15 psi front.
Tubeless..
The tubes weighed 210 grams, took them out after a one half mile ride, Schwalbe tubes.
2oz bottle of Stan's sealant was 60 grams, we weighed the full and empty bottle. Saved myself 300 grams at the most critical place on the bike, rolling mass far away from the axles.
Lower psi's give me more bite than I need and the back tire bounces just a little too much out on the smooth Hi-cadence fast stuff below 15 psi.
.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

coolhand80 said:


> Yes. It doesn't like being leaned over.


I disagree.


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

GRPABT1 said:


> I disagree.


Funny, I disagree too. I have the 2.8 Nobby Nic and it likes to be... More so than Rekons.

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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

bogeydog said:


> Funny, I disagree too. I have the 2.8 Nobby Nic and it likes to be... More so than Rekons.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


Could you elaborate?


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Osco said:


> Stock on my 2017 Scott Scale 720 Plus bike
> 
> Maxxis Rekon 120tpi,,bla bla bla
> Terra on the front and Speed on the back, must be a compound thing.
> ...


Im using 15/15 psi on the rekons. Im 187 geared up. Any longer, I'll start hitting the rim. No bounce for me. At 17 i had some bounce, was a significant improvement for me. Give it a shot but make sure its not so low you'll hit your rim

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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

javisst44 said:


> Could you elaborate?


I have them on ID 35mm rims. I found that on my Mojo 3, I can lean the bike with more confidence and better results on the 2.8 NN rather than the Rekon. The NN has a rounder profile and this plants the edges better on the ground. The narrower Rekons are not as rounded. The Rekon is a fine tire, but the NN works better in the leafy fall stuff here.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Ive had NN in the past and they roll pretty fast but the knobs wore fairly quick. Maybe a dhf 2.8 front and NN 2.6 might be a decent combo seeing that both come in a little undersized.

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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

coolhand80 said:


> Really loving the new Purgatory 2.6 tire on the rear. Super grippy but rolls fast. This size is working great to give me clearance for the peanut butter mud of Pittsburgh. It measures 2.5" but has huge volume.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Nice, thanks for the impressions and the pics!!!


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## tamug92 (Nov 10, 2016)

I'm sure this info is in here but I can only find bits and pieces,..

I am trying to find out the true width of various 27.5 x 3.0 tires. I know it changes with rim width but I also know some 3.0's aren't even close to their described width.

Trying to figure out what I can squeeze on some 25mm rims I am going to use on a 29er conversion. Today, while messing around in the shop, I mounted a cheap walmart 27.5 x 2.80 tire on a 23mm rim and it measured only 2.4 max width. It was barely wider than the 2.35's on my 29er. It makes me think that a 3.0 tire on a narrower rim would only measure up in the 2.75ish range?


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## Guest (Dec 2, 2016)

coolhand80 said:


> Really loving the new Purgatory 2.6 tire on the rear. Super grippy but rolls fast. This size is working great to give me clearance for the peanut butter mud of Pittsburgh. It measures 2.5" but has huge volume.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 who sells those? I can't find them on line anywhere.


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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

Forster said:


> who sells those? I can't find them on line anywhere.


I got it from my local Specialized dealer. They were available for a time on Specialized's website but now are greyed out on the drop down menu for that size Purgatory.

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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

What is the consensus on plus size tires in the snow? I have 2.6 and 2.8. which do you think would be better?

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## flyinb501 (Feb 12, 2013)

I would also like to know this. I can't seem to find any 27.5 plus snow tires for sale...


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## Guest (Dec 6, 2016)

bogeydog said:


> What is the consensus on plus size tires in the snow? I have 2.6 and 2.8. which do you think would be better?


If we look to those that enjoy true fatness in snow covered conditions i suspect the general consensus of plus sized would lean towards 2.8's.



flyinb501 said:


> I would also like to know this. I can't seem to find any 27.5 plus snow tires for sale...


what's your definition of snow tires?? are you speaking of tall widely spaced lugs that aid with traction in snow covered trails?? there's numerous tires that fit this description but lack the label of a 'snow tire' per-se.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

flyinb501 said:


> I would also like to know this. I can't seem to find any 27.5 plus snow tires for sale...


I have Maxxis Chronicle 27.5x3.00 and they are very good in snow, Loose over hard up to 6'' deep and hard packed, not bad on ice also. Very impresive. I don't like them in summer but in winter this is another story... 45nrth are also making winter tires for 27.5+ I believe.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

If you are riding in snow, the wider the better. Real fat tires would be best, like 26x4.0 or larger. If you're sticking with 27.5, get the widest tires you can fit. 3.25 would be great, 3.0 would be OK, 2.8 might work, 2.6 probably won't be great.


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## flyinb501 (Feb 12, 2013)

Awesome, thanks for the suggestions! I have a diamondback Mason trail and I believe the widest I can go in the rear is 2.8. Any decent options?


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## markopic (Jan 12, 2016)

Has anyone tried new Schwalbe G-One Allround tires in 2.8 size? I wonder how do they compare to Maxxis Chronicle? Schwalbes are highly regarded in smaller size, I am not sure how do they perform in plus size.


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## 950sm07 (Oct 28, 2011)

markopic said:


> Has anyone tried new Schwalbe G-One Allround tires in 2.8 size? I wonder how do they compare to Maxxis Chronicle? Schwalbes are highly regarded in smaller size, I am not sure how do they perform in plus size.


I would be interested in this one too. My bike came with Chronicles and they are heavy and and sluggish compare to the Nobby Nic 2,80 that I installed for the winter. I think the G-One will be like a rocket.

I have bad experience with Schwalbe tires in regular sizes. They wear very quickly and on rocky terrain they can slice like cakes with the snake skin side walls so I'm running Maxxis tires with EXO sidewalls on all my bikes.


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

So I'm thinking of going with a DW or NN for light snow conditions. I was really hoping the 45nrth Wrathchild would be available by now, but winter is here and I can't run a RR on the rear any longer. I already tried the Hodags and was not a fan at all. I'd be interested in the Duro Crux, but they can be hard to find. 

Anyone having luck in snow with any of these tire's?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

markopic said:


> Has anyone tried new Schwalbe G-One Allround tires in 2.8 size? I wonder how do they compare to Maxxis Chronicle? Schwalbes are highly regarded in smaller size, I am not sure how do they perform in plus size.


The Schwalbe G-One Allround and the Maxxis Chronicle are completely different tires, not even comparable. The G-One is really a dirt road tire, not suitable for real mountain biking. If you are riding dirt roads, smooth paths and maybe smooth hardpacked trails it should work great. Otherwise I would stay away!


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

jpfurn said:


> So I'm thinking of going with a DW or NN for light snow conditions. I was really hoping the 45nrth Wrathchild would be available by now, but winter is here and I can't run a RR on the rear any longer. I already tried the Hodags and was not a fan at all. I'd be interested in the Duro Crux, but they can be hard to find.
> 
> Anyone having luck in snow with any of these tire's?


For snow, the wider the better. Of the tires you listed, the Hodag would work the best. What did you not like about them? The Crux would be my second choice.


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

bikeny said:


> For snow, the wider the better. Of the tires you listed, the Hodag would work the best. What did you not like about them? The Crux would be my second choice.


For me the Hodag provided less traction upfront then my NN. It also felt very stiff, dead, and heavy.

Are the readily available yet?


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## SirSlow (Mar 31, 2014)

Received my Maxxis Minion 27.5+ DHF 2.8 120 tpi last week. It came in at 950 grams. Mounted it up on an Easton AR 40 wheel at 20psi. I measured 2.5" across the knobs. Its got a way to go to reach 2.8!


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## 950sm07 (Oct 28, 2011)

SirSlow said:


> Received my Maxxis Minion 27.5+ DHF 2.8 120 tpi last week. It came in at 950 grams. Mounted it up on an Easton AR 40 wheel at 20psi. I measured 2.5" across the knobs. Its got a way to go to reach 2.8!


Wow that's skinny... It really holds me back from buying Maxxis "plus" tires as I want real 2,8-3,0. Only the Chronicles are true size the rest is a joke. If they would make 3,25 those would maybe come up to 2,80...


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

Maxxis are great tires but ridiculous when it comes to their actual size. Yesterday I saw the Maxxis 2.5 WT in a 29mm internal rim and they were identical or even slightly narrower than my Magic Marry 2.35! 

An actual 3.0 DHF / DHR2 combo would be a dream option for me but the one tire that I am really hoping to be produced is a 3.0 Magic Marry.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The dhr wt 2.5 and dhr2 wt 2.4 on my i34 rim measures to spec. The most confidence inspiring and best feeling combo but damn its heavy and i feel it after a long day of ups and downs. The rekon 2.8 only measured to barely 2.7. The advertised width seems to be a ballpark number. It would help if they threw in some more pertinent info like per internal rim width.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## SeanMurr123 (Jul 23, 2016)

SirSlow said:


> Received my Maxxis Minion 27.5+ DHF 2.8 120 tpi last week. It came in at 950 grams. Mounted it up on an Easton AR 40 wheel at 20psi. I measured 2.5" across the knobs. Its got a way to go to reach 2.8!


What's the sidewall measurement? I'm not so much fussed on width as I am on volume. Everyone seems to be comparing the width to a std 2.3 saying it's not much bigger but is the sidewall and volume much higher?

Cheers


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## SirSlow (Mar 31, 2014)

i need to get some miles on to see if it spreads out. Just mounted, the knobs were the widest part.


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## MattMay (Dec 24, 2013)

*Specialized Purgatory Control 3.0*

Just mounted Purg Controls on Nextie 39internal/45 external rims. Aired up double what I'd ride them at, I'm sure they'll relax, but still dang close to 3.0. Wanted the Grids but they're back ordered for a couple months...LBS says all the Levs are getting them stock, and the Levs are selling like crazy.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

Anyone used the Purgatory as a front tyre in the mud & was it any good?

Can't get Surly DW over here for love nor money & the Maxxis Minion & High Roller II in plus sizes aren't out until the end of Jan.


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## Eduvan (Jul 6, 2016)

xgsjx said:


> Anyone used the Purgatory as a front tyre in the mud & was it any good?
> 
> Can't get Surly DW over here for love nor money & the Maxxis Minion & High Roller II in plus sizes aren't out until the end of Jan.


I have purgatory "grid" in the front and It's good in mud. It's very diferent than control version. You can go with less preusure without problems.


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## fracaxis (May 2, 2006)

xgsjx said:


> Anyone used the Purgatory as a front tyre in the mud & was it any good?
> 
> Can't get Surly DW over here for love nor money & the Maxxis Minion & High Roller II in plus sizes aren't out until the end of Jan.


I've been on a HR2 plus for a couple rides now. It's a beast. Love it. The side knobs are substantial. You can really lay into this thing.

You can find them online.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

Nurse Ben said:


> (2) WTB Ranger 2.8, TCS Heavy Casing, like new, less than ten miles used.


I'm assuming these are sold, but do you know the weight on these?


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

s0ckeyeus said:


> I'm assuming these are sold, but do you know the weight on these?


Not sold yet, interested?

Two for one, $10 shipping.

PM for details.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

Eduvan said:


> I have purgatory "grid" in the front and It's good in mud. It's very diferent than control version. You can go with less preusure without problems.


That's good to hear. I might give the Purgatory a go.



fracaxis said:


> I've been on a HR2 plus for a couple rides now. It's a beast. Love it. The side knobs are substantial. You can really lay into this thing.
> You can find them online.


They're not out in the UK until the end of January (I emailed Maxxis & asked) & getting shipped from outside the UK is rather expensive for a tyre.
I will get one, but the Purgatory may well come before it.


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

Is the rear end bobbing problem, under pedaling load, more prominent on the 27.5x3" Ground Control tires, or is it better with a Purgatory? Every time I think I have it fixed with a PSI change it comes back.

I don't seem to have an issue with sidewall durability; I'd normally opt for the lighter Control casing over the Grid, if it doesn't matter.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

rijndael said:


> Is the rear end bobbing problem, under pedaling load, more prominent on the 27.5x3" Ground Control tires, or is it better with a Purgatory? Every time I think I have it fixed with a PSI change it comes back.
> 
> I don't seem to have an issue with sidewall durability; I'd normally opt for the lighter Control casing over the Grid, if it doesn't matter.


It's probably your pedaling style not the equipment.


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

What pedaling characteristics tend to exacerbate the issue?

FWIW: I have decent amount of time on a CompuTrainer, with SpinScan. My overall efficiency tends to be in the upper 70s, which is better than average. I'm definitely not a masher.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

rijndael said:


> What pedaling characteristics tend to exacerbate the issue?
> 
> FWIW: I have decent amount of time on a CompuTrainer, with SpinScan. My overall efficiency tends to be in the upper 70s, which is better than average. I'm definitely not a masher.


I've been on fat bikes pretty much from their birth and running anywhere from 0-12 psi and every winter it takes me a bit to get rid of the bounce. A lot of people will blame it on mashing which can be it but not entirely. I belive it has just as much to do with cadence and gear selection. Try experimenting using a little heavier of a gear and slowing down the cadence some? I have never experienced with my plus bike but I'm only on 2.8's.


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

Interesting, thanks.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Is there an ETA on the 27.5 x 2.8 Specialized Butcher & Slaughter? Love the 2.3s on my FS, would love to run on my plus hardtail. I see them listed on specializeds website, but out of stock w/no ETA.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

captain spaulding said:


> Is there an ETA on the 27.5 x 2.8 Specialized Butcher & Slaughter? Love the 2.3s on my FS, would love to run on my plus hardtail. I see them listed on specializeds website, but out of stock w/no ETA.


I have a 2.8 Butcher with about 10 miles on it I would let go reasonable. I just don't really need that agressive of a tire.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

bdundee said:


> I have a 2.8 Butcher with about 10 miles on it I would let go reasonable. I just don't really need that agressive of a tire.


I'll PM you, thanks!

On another note emailed Specialized and they expect the butcher and slaughter 2.8s to be in stock end of January.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

Another tyre Q...
I've seen a few folk that put 2.8 in the rear & 3.0 up front, but what about the other way around?
Would having a 2.8 tyre that can cut into softer ground (e.g. mud) up front & a 3.0 tyre at the rear work?


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## Guest (Dec 31, 2016)

xgsjx said:


> Another tyre Q...
> I've seen a few folk that put 2.8 in the rear & 3.0 up front, but what about the other way around?
> Would having a 2.8 tyre that can cut into softer ground (e.g. mud) up front & a 3.0 tyre at the rear work?


 Perhaps, but I think having float up front is preferred to having the front dig in. What I find is that my front tire packs the surface so my rear can bite. In reverse, I think the wider rear tire (if you were riding in a very straight line) would tend to grab the sides of the front tire track and you'd end up trail breaking with both tires. If you have both, why not experiment over the conditions you ride in and find out what works best for you?


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## Osco (Apr 4, 2013)

More tire/wheel mass Hinders acceleration and I read that this Is felt more with a larger rear tire.
A Larger contact patch up front for traction Is good as front tire wash outs are hard to recover from.
Rear tire wash outs are just plain fun and when controlled can get you around a tight spot faster under certain conditions.

Google Up the, 'Foes Mixer', Foes Mixer Trail - Mixed Wheel Bike 29"/27.5" | Foes Racing

So IMHO there is no advantage of a larger wheel on the back, only drawbacks.
I have never heard or seen a single thread talking of a wider rear tire being an Improvement.

I had 2.35's on my FS bike and when I put a 2.25 on the rear the bike Instantly felt faster, felt like a lighter wheel set and It Is well known That lighter, better wheels are the single biggest performance up grade you can do.


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## rijndael (Sep 19, 2016)

Osco said:


> More tire/wheel mass Hinders acceleration and I read that this Is felt more with a larger rear tire.


Here's an interesting post, with supporting data, about wheel mass and acceleration.

Rotating Mass... - Page 4 - Weight Weenies


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

I'll experiment. I've ordered a 2.8 tyre Vee Trax Fatty to try against my 3.0 Rocket Rons.
My thinking is for riding in the current weather in Scotland. Cold, wet & muddy.
I know the RR is probably really crap in these conditions compared to most other 3" tyres, but last time I went out I had to keep clear of mud entirely, unless I was going in a straight line only.

I'll put the Trax Fatty on the front to see how it copes with the mud & then the other way around.
I might end up with the FT on the rear & get a 3" Maxxis HR2 for up front when they become available here late January.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

What do the Rekon 2.8's measure for width of a i45 rim?

I want something lighter than the WTB bridgers I'm running now, but kinda like 3". I wouldn't want to go lower than actual 2.8" width in any case.

Also, what about the newer maxxis plus tires out lately (DHR/DHS/etc)... what tires is everybody's preference now?


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Then don't get Rekons. They'll never measure 2.8. You'll be lucky to see 2.6.


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## Guest (Jan 2, 2017)

jtaylor996 said:


> What do the Rekon 2.8's measure for width of a i45 rim?
> 
> I want something lighter than the WTB bridgers I'm running now, but kinda like 3". I wouldn't want to go lower than actual 2.8" width in any case.





Zerort said:


> Then don't get Rekons. They'll never measure 2.8. You'll be lucky to see 2.6.


^^this is correct from several on here.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

nvphatty said:


> ^^this is correct from several on here.


I've heard that, but also it seems most people that have measured them weren't using the i45 rims. You'd think there'd be *some* rim out there they would actually measure 2.8 on...

But even if not, are all of the maxxis plus tires like this? What about the DHR/DHF/others they sell?


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Yes, all Maxxis plus tires are running small.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

Zerort said:


> Yes, all Maxxis plus tires are running small.


Boo.

Then I guess my options for lighter 3.0" tires are basically just the Nobby Nics, right?


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## Zerort (Jan 21, 2013)

Yes, or Rocket Rons if they make those in 3.0

The 2.8 Rocket Rons were actually wider than the 2.8 Nobby Nics that I had.


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## fracaxis (May 2, 2006)

I just threw some calipers on mine.
Rim- i34, 19psi 
Rekon 2.8 measures 2.712"
HR2 2.8 measures 2.717"

This is after weeks mounted and a bunch of rides to stretch. They were substantially smaller when first mounted.


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## Parus Cristatus (Mar 13, 2013)

Zerort said:


> Yes, or Rocket Rons if they make those in 3.0
> 
> The 2.8 Rocket Rons were actually wider than the 2.8 Nobby Nics that I had.


Yes they exist in 3.0.
I have them...


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

Hi guys. What is the best 3.0 tire for winter conditions and especially wet and muddy terrain? My new bike came with Chronicles and I am not sure that they are the best tire for winter.


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## Guest (Jan 2, 2017)

jtaylor996 said:


> I've heard that, but also it seems most people that have measured them weren't using the i45 rims. You'd think there'd be *some* rim out there they would actually measure 2.8 on...
> 
> But even if not, are all of the maxxis plus tires like this? What about the DHR/DHF/others they sell?


in theory 2.8's of any brand are best suited to i35 rims as it does not expose the sidewall casing to rocks, roots and the like as much as an i45 would, anyone is certainly welcome to do so but @ the risk of increased casing wear / damage.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

I tried a search, but not having much luck.

Got a puncture & looking to get a new tube (puncture was fixed, but handy to have spare).
I'm struggling here to find anywhere with 27.5+ tubes in stock, though I have found somewhere on line.
I'm sure I saw somewhere on here that a 27.5x2.4 tube does the needful. Am I making things up?


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## Guest (Jan 2, 2017)

xgsjx said:


> I tried a search, but not having much luck.
> 
> Got a puncture & looking to get a new tube (puncture was fixed, but handy to have spare).
> I'm struggling here to find anywhere with 27.5+ tubes in stock, though I have found somewhere on line.
> I'm sure I saw somewhere on here that a 27.5x2.4 tube does the needful. Am I making things up?


use 26 toobs in 2.1 or 2.2 size.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

nvphatty said:


> use 26 toobs in 2.1 or 2.2 size.


26? I take it this is due to running lower psi?


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

i'd recommend this tube:

Bontrager Standard MTB Inner Tube 26x2.50-2.80"

long valve if you have deep rims, with removable core, slightly beefier/thicker than standard, but if memory serves it is only about 200g or so and it will easily fill a plus tyre but be a bit more resilient at lower pressure...

i think the link takes you to the bonty page so it is THIS one you need...


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## Guest (Jan 3, 2017)

xgsjx said:


> 26? I take it this is due to running lower psi?


in part yes, but 26 toobs are near identical to their 650 brother in sizing so they work quite well. I found the smaller 2.1 or 2.2 to work well at keeping excess toob inward and avoid pinching when mounting tires.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

Anyone able to give advice on how to get my tyre to sit on the rim properly?

I've got a Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x2.8. Fitted onto the rim easily enough, but when I inflate the tyre, the rim line on the tyre is different heights all around with some parts going a few mm behind the rim. The max PSI it says on the tyre is 20 psi & I'd hoped pumping it to that would have fixed the issue. Any ideas?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

xgsjx said:


> Anyone able to give advice on how to get my tyre to sit on the rim properly?
> 
> I've got a Vee Trax Fatty 27.5x2.8. Fitted onto the rim easily enough, but when I inflate the tyre, the rim line on the tyre is different heights all around with some parts going a few mm behind the rim. The max PSI it says on the tyre is 20 psi & I'd hoped pumping it to that would have fixed the issue. Any ideas?


20 psi max sounds pretty low to me, most Plus tires I've seen say max around 30 psi. Anyway, yeah, your beads are not fully seated. What you need to do is lubricate them so they will slide into place easier. There is a specific product made for this, called bead slip or something, but I just use soapy water. Get a small bowl, put some dish soap in it and a little warm water. You will need brush or something to apply it. let all of the air out of the tire, and even push the beads back to the center of the rim. Take the brush and whip the water/soap so it gets nice and foamy, and then brush it on both beads all the way around. Then inflate again, and you should hear a solid pop when the last of the bead seat on the rim. I would think you can safely go up to 30 psi, but it should happen much lower.

Good luck!


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

Cheers for that. All good now.


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

bikeny said:


> ... There is a specific product made for this, called bead slip or something, ...


@bikeny - how could you forget the name of a product like this? 










works a little better than soapy water in my experience

also helps the tire slide over the bead lock when you have to remove it


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Got a set of WTB Ranger 27.5 x 2.8 in Tough Casing. This is a bomber tire for the Clydes. They have fewer than twenty miles of riding. No damage.

PM with offers.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

I have a new Minion DHR 3c 120 tpi for sale or trade for a Rekon 3c 120 tpi.


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## EBG 18T (Dec 31, 2005)

jtaylor996 said:


> What do the Rekon 2.8's measure for width of a i45 rim?
> 
> I want something lighter than the WTB bridgers I'm running now, but kinda like 3". I wouldn't want to go lower than actual 2.8" width in any case.
> 
> Also, what about the newer maxxis plus tires out lately (DHR/DHS/etc)... what tires is everybody's preference now?


I have a brand new set of WTB 3.0" Trail Boss lights still in the box i need to move. Pretty light and good all around tire.


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## max-a-mill (Apr 14, 2004)

gpgalanis said:


> Hi guys. What is the best 3.0 tire for winter conditions and especially wet and muddy terrain? My new bike came with Chronicles and I am not sure that they are the best tire for winter.


i can't imagine a tire that would shed mud better than the minion dhf


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

Anyone have issues with stans leaking on sidewalls? I plan on trying orange sealant this season.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

stumpynerd said:


> Anyone have issues with stans leaking on sidewalls? I plan on trying orange sealant this season.


I had Stans leaking out of a non Grid Specialized Ground Control and switched to Orange seal after my shop recommended it. I've not had issues with the new sealant.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

The Grid Slaughter 27.5 x 2.8s are on Specialized's website, just ordered mine.


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## jcaino (May 26, 2007)

Gigantic said:


> I had Stans leaking out of a non Grid Specialized Ground Control and switched to Orange seal after my shop recommended it. I've not had issues with the new sealant.


I was just talking to someone over the weekend with Ground Controls and sidewall seepage with Stans. I've had mine setup for ~2 years now with Orange Seal and absolutely no seepage. After Stans failed to fix a couple of pretty small punctures a few years ago, I made the switch to Orange seal and haven't regretted it.


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## kryten (Mar 8, 2012)

I've browsed through the thread quickly yesterday, but still would like to ask. What would be the best tire for generally fairly packed winter single track that would work on a i45 rim well? This would be on a Norco Torrent which comes with 3.0 Nobby Nics I would use in summer.

I would like to find something hopefully wider to provide a bit more float that will still fit for winter. I would be DIY studding this second set of tires so good chunky supportive thread lugs would be great.

3.5 Fat B Nible is a no go for me. No cornering lugs, does not work well in winter. Had a 4.0 set on my first fat bike.

3.25" Trax Fatty, does not look like a good snow tire thread, aggressive enough.

3.25" Duro Crux? Seems like hard to get.

3.8" Hodag? Will it still fit Torrent frame? Is the profile ok on a i45 rim or really needs wider rims.

Something else?


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

kryten said:


> I've browsed through the thread quickly yesterday, but still would like to ask. What would be the best tire for generally fairly packed winter single track that would work on a i45 rim well? This would be on a Norco Torrent which comes with 3.0 Nobby Nics I would use in summer.
> 
> I would like to find something hopefully wider to provide a bit more float that will still fit for winter. I would be DIY studding this second set of tires so good chunky supportive thread lugs would be great.
> 
> ...


The 3.8 Hodag would be the best choice for winter, as it's the widest. It will work fine on an I45 rim. But, I have no idea if it will fit in your frame and fork, and have no idea if it will work well with studs. How much clearance do you have with your current tires, and how wide are they measuring? From a volume perspective, the Duro and Trax Fatty would be next, but I have no idea how they work in snow. I suspect the Crux would be better, but they are hard to come by these days. The 3.5 FBN are mislabeled, should be a 2.9. Otherwise you are looking at a bunch of 3.0 tires.

Maxxis also has a 27.5x3.8 tire available. It's pretty heavy and from reports seems to be about the same size as the Hodag.


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## Gigantic (Aug 31, 2012)

kryten said:


> I've browsed through the thread quickly yesterday, but still would like to ask. What would be the best tire for generally fairly packed winter single track that would work on a i45 rim well? This would be on a Norco Torrent which comes with 3.0 Nobby Nics I would use in summer.
> 
> I would like to find something hopefully wider to provide a bit more float that will still fit for winter. I would be DIY studding this second set of tires so good chunky supportive thread lugs would be great.
> 
> ...





bikeny said:


> The 3.8 Hodag would be the best choice for winter, as it's the widest. It will work fine on an I45 rim. But, I have no idea if it will fit in your frame and fork, and have no idea if it will work well with studs. How much clearance do you have with your current tires, and how wide are they measuring? From a volume perspective, the Duro and Trax Fatty would be next, but I have no idea how they work in snow. I suspect the Crux would be better, but they are hard to come by these days. The 3.5 FBN are mislabeled, should be a 2.9. Otherwise you are looking at a bunch of 3.0 tires.
> 
> Maxxis also has a 27.5x3.8 tire available. It's pretty heavy and from reports seems to be about the same size as the Hodag.


The Hodag measures 3.5" on i45 rims. If you have at least 3.75" of clearance, it may work. Looking at the specs for the torrent, I'm going to assume that it won't fit your frame, but ymmv.


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## kryten (Mar 8, 2012)

I don't have the frame, I'm just once again contemplating downsizing to one bike. First choice would be Torrent, second Big Honzo. Just trying to find out if this could work out for me or if I should keep what I have. Winters are getting pretty mediocre for amount of snow here lately and last couple of years there is so much fat bike traffic everything gets packed down quickly. This year I rode some and could have ridden probably 80% of the time on my 2.4" FS. Seems like B+ could be a good compromise for a year round single bike for me here.

Ideally I would want some 3"+ tires with stud pockets, but realistically will take any chunky 3+ tire and stud with grip studs, carbide studs or Kold Kutters.

Did you mean Maxxis Minion FBF & FBR 27.5x3.8? Those could be interesting if they would fit.


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## mothertruckinsteve (Mar 8, 2015)

kryten said:


> I don't have the frame, I'm just once again contemplating downsizing to one bike. First choice would be Torrent, second Big Honzo. Just trying to find out if this could work out for me or if I should keep what I have. Winters are getting pretty mediocre for amount of snow here lately and last couple of years there is so much fat bike traffic everything gets packed down quickly. This year I rode some and could have ridden probably 80% of the time on my 2.4" FS. Seems like B+ could be a good compromise for a year round single bike for me here.
> 
> Ideally I would want some 3"+ tires with stud pockets, but realistically will take any chunky 3+ tire and stud with grip studs, carbide studs or Kold Kutters.
> 
> Did you mean Maxxis Minion FBF & FBR 27.5x3.8? Those could be interesting if they would fit.


I've never seen or used one but 45NRTH lists the Wrathchild in 27.5x3.0 on their website. That's where I'd start if looking for a + snow tire.

http://45nrth.com/products/tires/wrathchildplus

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

I had a set of Vanhelgas on my fat bike and they were really good in snow. I'm sure they won't fit a plus bike frame, but the Duro miner in 3.0 has a very similar tread pattern with big knobs that look like they could be studded. I'm about to pull the trigger and get a set, but the only place selling them is in Italy. Expensive shipping!


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Forgot to add; the only thing that scares me about the miner is the weight. It's on the list here about 850 g. Pretty light for a 3.0 with big knobs. I wonder about durability.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Just put a hole in my 2.8 minion on the front of my Altitude. Ran it with 2psi more than my 2.8 Nobby Nic to offset the smaller volume and it still couldn't handle the rocks where I ride. Lasted not even 5 fairly short rides. Anyone have word on the 2.6 or 2.8 Magic Mary coming out? Really disappointed with my history of killing Maxxis tyres, seriously don't understand why they're all the tyre shops stock.


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## nyrangerfan222 (Jun 22, 2009)

Has anyone tried Specialized's Butcher or Slaughter 2.8s and can give some feedback?

I'm Currently rolling mojo 3 on 741s with 2.8 DHF and DHRs and while im enjoying the added traction when going downhill, on the other hand I can definitely notice the added rolling resistance on the climbs. Trying to find a happy medium traction/rolling resistance/durability. (looking for a unicorn really i know)

I enjoyed the 2.8 nobby nics, no complaints on traction or rolling resistance but went through 2 or 3 last year which was a bummer, any real world reports on the new apex reinforcement? 

I tried the rekons in the dual compound and wasnt a fan, preferred the nobby nics over rekons. Maybe 3c will make a big difference with rekons? 

Few setups im debating over and hoepfully will be able to try all at some point: DHF and rekon 3c, Rekon 3c F/R, Butcher F/R (can anyone comment on butcher rolling resistance compared to DHF/DHR), Butcher/Slaughter, and lastly the apex nobby nics.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

I had a Butcher 2.8 for awhile, not much difference than the DHF but slightly narrower and 100+ grams heavier than the Maxxis. Can't comment on the RR difference as I don't have any time on the DHF yet but it rolled fine with the Rekon in the back.


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## captain spaulding (May 7, 2006)

Running 2.8 Butcher/Slaughter on my Big Honzo, traction is much better than the Nobby Nics that came with the Big Honzo(bike did come with the performance line of Nobby Nics, so the crappier version). Casing is much stiffer and I haven't been getting any squirming that I was getting with the NN(I'm a big guy, so worth noting). Seems to roll better, but I've only had 1 ride on them and still dialing in the pressure. I run the same combo in 27.5 x 2.3 on my full suspension bike and I love it, I expected the slaughter to be much more sketchy, not the case, I only found that it didn't have enough braking in some steep bike park terrain situations. Wear has been good also, I went thru Hans Dampfs is a really short amount of time, this combo is def. outlasting the Hans Dampfs I had in the past. The price is hard to beat also.


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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

nyrangerfan222 said:


> Has anyone tried Specialized's Butcher or Slaughter 2.8s and can give some feedback?
> 
> I'm Currently rolling mojo 3 on 741s with 2.8 DHF and DHRs and while im enjoying the added traction when going downhill, on the other hand I can definitely notice the added rolling resistance on the climbs. Trying to find a happy medium traction/rolling resistance/durability. (looking for a unicorn really i know)
> 
> ...


What exactly didn't you like about the Rekon DC's? I ask because I literally have the same tires that you did (as in I bought my Rekons used from him) and I love these tires. I find them to be very supportive yet they conform well to roots and such. I think they roll well and have a very predictable grip. Maybe you just broke them in for me?

I also got a good deal on a set of DHF 3C's that I have on right now for the winter and they are a stiff tire and very grippy. I agree that they also roll a bit slower than the Rekon and are super sticky on the climbs. Oddly though one of the DHF's is a 3C Max Terra and the other is a 3C Max Speed which I didn't think they made and I wonder how much affect that has on perceived rolling resistance.

I do agree that I feel a 3C Rekon would probably make a better front tire though. That may be my only complaint is that when I do find the limit of traction on the Rekon (pretty rare for me but has happened) the front and the rear seem to break at the same time. I'd prefer to have the front stick better and have the rear drift out first. For that reason as well as for wear I will continue to run a 3C front and DC rear.

After winter/early spring is over I will definitely be running DHF front and put a Rekon DC back onto the rear. If we have another dry summer like last I will probably go with Rekon 3C front and DC back or maybe throw one of the Ranger's I still have back onto the rear with a Rekon front.

Another combo you might consider is a DHRII front and Rekon rear. I thought I read in another thread someone commenting on the fact they thought the DHR rolled better than the DHF but gave up just a bit in traction.


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## nyrangerfan222 (Jun 22, 2009)

StumpyandhisBike said:


> What exactly didn't you like about the Rekon DC's? I ask because I literally have the same tires that you did (as in I bought my Rekons used from him) and I love these tires. I find them to be very supportive yet they conform well to roots and such. I think they roll well and have a very predictable grip. Maybe you just broke them in for me?
> 
> I also got a good deal on a set of DHF 3C's that I have on right now for the winter and they are a stiff tire and very grippy. I agree that they also roll a bit slower than the Rekon and are super sticky on the climbs. Oddly though one of the DHF's is a 3C Max Terra and the other is a 3C Max Speed which I didn't think they made and I wonder how much affect that has on perceived rolling resistance.
> 
> I do agree that I feel a 3C Rekon would probably make a better front tire though. That may be my only complaint is that when I do find the limit of traction on the Rekon (pretty rare for me but has happened) the front and the rear seem to break at the same time. I'd prefer to have the front stick better and have the rear drift out first. For that reason as well as for wear I will continue to run a 3C front and DC rear.


I wasn't a fan of DC rekon up front, I felt it washed out a lot more than the nobby nic I was using before it. I also needed to run more pressure than the nic, it was smaller than the nic as well. Didn't notice any pro or con as a rear over the nic, again just needed to run more pressure in it. I didn't run them for long, perhaps gave up on them too early. Did feel I was having a hard time finding the perfect pressure.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

nyrangerfan222 said:


> Has anyone tried Specialized's Butcher or Slaughter 2.8s and can give some feedback?
> 
> I'm Currently rolling mojo 3 on 741s with 2.8 DHF and DHRs and while im enjoying the added traction when going downhill, on the other hand I can definitely notice the added rolling resistance on the climbs. Trying to find a happy medium traction/rolling resistance/durability. (looking for a unicorn really i know)
> 
> ...


Consider the 2.5 WTB Breakout on the rear. Rolls better than a minion, lasts for ages in the hard compound, very strong casing and grip on turns and braking I put on par with a minion. It's a big 2.5 and almost as big as a 2.8 minion.


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## majr (May 22, 2012)

nyrangerfan222 said:


> Has anyone tried Specialized's Butcher or Slaughter 2.8s and can give some feedback?
> 
> I'm Currently rolling mojo 3 on 741s with 2.8 DHF and DHRs and while im enjoying the added traction when going downhill, on the other hand I can definitely notice the added rolling resistance on the climbs. Trying to find a happy medium traction/rolling resistance/durability. (looking for a unicorn really i know)
> 
> ...


I have one ride on a set of Butcher 2.8 grids. They measure small, around 2.65-2.7" depending on rim width (I tried i35 and i45 rims, will be building a set of i40s for this tire soon). DHFs were closer to 2.75". Weigh 1074g and 1076g, so 100g heavier than my previous pair of DHF 2.8 3c tires.

The rubber is much tackier and overall grip noticeably than 3c Max Terra DHF. I'd say they even have more grip than my previous favorite, the Dirt Wizard. East coast rock crawling is the terrain I ride most frequently.

The side knobs are starting to show indications of tearing after only one ride though. We'll see. The DHF knobs were solid and wore nicely, no tearing.


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## nyrangerfan222 (Jun 22, 2009)

GRPABT1 said:


> Consider the 2.5 WTB Breakout on the rear. Rolls better than a minion, lasts for ages in the hard compound, very strong casing and grip on turns and braking I put on par with a minion. It's a big 2.5 and almost as big as a 2.8 minion.


Loved the 2.3 breakouts. Wondering when WTB is going to step their game up and give some more plus options. 2.8 breakout would be awesome. I would also love a bontrager xr4 in 2.8.

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## nyrangerfan222 (Jun 22, 2009)

majr said:


> I have one ride on a set of Butcher 2.8 grids. They measure small, around 2.65-2.7" depending on rim width (I tried i35 and i45 rims, will be building a set of i40s for this tire soon). DHFs were closer to 2.75". Weigh 1074g and 1076g, so 100g heavier than my previous pair of DHF 2.8 3c tires.
> 
> The rubber is much tackier and overall grip noticeably than 3c Max Terra DHF. I'd say they even have more grip than my previous favorite, the Dirt Wizard. East coast rock crawling is the terrain I ride most frequently.
> 
> The side knobs are starting to show indications of tearing after only one ride though. We'll see. The DHF knobs were solid and wore nicely, no tearing.


Wow so smaller, heavier and grippier. I'm looking for a bit of a faster setup than current DHF and DHR, so it looks like a butcher f and r is out of the picture. Perhaps i should just man up and drag these minions around.

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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

Have a pair of Terrene Chunk 3.0's bought off of eBay for 100.00, they look aggressive and have sidewall durability. Not much out there yet on them, anyone out there running them yet? Took a chance since price was good, been looking for another durable tire choice besides the Dirt Wizard which is a superb tire overall but of course always in the market for alternative choices.


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## jcaino (May 26, 2007)

techfersure said:


> Have a pair of Terrene Chunk 3.0's bought off of eBay for 100.00, they look aggressive and have sidewall durability. Not much out there yet on them, anyone out there running them yet? Took a chance since price was good, been looking for another durable tire choice besides the Dirt Wizard which is a superb tire overall but of course always in the market for alternative choices.


Don't have any experience with them, but they really remind me of the tread design of the WTB Stout.









Great grip, cleared mud real well, but definitely one slow-rolling tire.

You'll have to report your experiences...


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## MTB9488 (Jun 18, 2012)

I currently have a specialized Fatboy and recently upgraded to the 27.5 duroc 40mm (36mm inner)with WTB Ranger 2.8 (measures 2.6) I definitely want to go bigger preferably something that might truly measure 3 inches on my current rims. Would a wider tire 3.0 or bigger on a 40mm (36 inner) be a good combination or a 50mm rim if i want a more suspension/plush ride.


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

A 3.0" wide tire will provide about 25% more volume and cushion than a 2.8" tire.
It will also be about 1/4" taller have a larger footprint for more traction.

Specialized Ground Control and Purgatory 27.5" x 3.0 tires on my 38mm inner width rims are 2.8" wide at the casing and 3.0" wide at the knobs. I've also run them on 32mm inner width rims where they are about 0.1" narrower. They'd be fine on your 36mm inner width rims. 50mm seems a bit wide for a 3.0 tire.


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## mk.ultra (Jul 17, 2012)

Can anyone point me in the right direction? I have no idea where to start with 27.5+ tires.

I'm looking for some good value, tubeless ready tires for my Salsa Timberjack. 2.8-3" is fine. Just want something well-rounded for Wisconsin tight, technical trails. Lots of roots and rocks, not much climbing. Weight isn't a big issue, just want something durable and cost-efficient.

Thanks MTBros


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## Guest (Feb 13, 2017)

mk.ultra said:


> Can anyone point me in the right direction? I have no idea where to start with 27.5+ tires.
> 
> I'm looking for some good value, tubeless ready tires for my Salsa Timberjack. 2.8-3" is fine. Just want something well-rounded for Wisconsin tight, technical trails. Lots of roots and rocks, not much climbing. Weight isn't a big issue, just want something durable and cost-efficient.
> 
> Thanks MTBros


within this thread are copious amounts of info with what you seek friend, it just takes some reading. There's other threads within the PLUS sub forum that could be plenty of help too.


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

mk.ultra said:


> Can anyone point me in the right direction? I have no idea where to start with 27.5+ tires.
> 
> I'm looking for some good value, tubeless ready tires for my Salsa Timberjack. 2.8-3" is fine. Just want something well-rounded for Wisconsin tight, technical trails. Lots of roots and rocks, not much climbing. Weight isn't a big issue, just want something durable and cost-efficient.
> 
> Thanks MTBros


I live in the rockies and have great luck with specialized tires. Check out the Purgatory Grids. They seat with floor pump, 60$, and have held up pretty well in my area. Great for loose over hardpack and roll fairly quick for my tastes.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I think that the Nobby Nic is a good all around tire.


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## mevnet (Oct 4, 2013)

+1, NN is not bad at all, I have used them in 2.35, 2.8 and 2.6.. You can see the NN 2.8 it here on my Smuggler, end of this video. I did run it on snow and frozen ground mostly and it held it's own against fat bikes. I have a Ranger 2.8 in the Rear as the NN would touch the chainstays:


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## baltobrewer (Apr 22, 2015)

I am in the process of building up some 27.5+ wheels for my Mukluk, and want to stay as close to 3.0 as possible. Seems to me that my main choices are going to be WTB Ranger/TB, Duro Crux/Miner, Spec Purg, and Schwalbe RR 3.0's. I can go to VTF if I want to go 3.25, not sure that I want to do that. 

Of the 3.0 selections, which do you think would be best for fast rolling/light weight. I already have 4.0 fattys for when conditions dictate grip/float, etc. These would be mainly summer trail compound tires. 

Thoughts?


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

I have the RR 3.0s and they are crazy fast and very light weight. I am in the Midwest so more round rock and roots than sharp stuff but they have been great.


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## ArchieTolliver (Sep 6, 2016)

baltobrewer said:


> I am in the process of building up some 27.5+ wheels for my Mukluk, and want to stay as close to 3.0 as possible. Seems to me that my main choices are going to be WTB Ranger/TB, Duro Crux/Miner, Spec Purg, and Schwalbe RR 3.0's. I can go to VTF if I want to go 3.25, not sure that I want to do that.
> 
> Of the 3.0 selections, which do you think would be best for fast rolling/light weight. I already have 4.0 fattys for when conditions dictate grip/float, etc. These would be mainly summer trail compound tires.
> 
> Thoughts?


You have some good choices there. I can vouch for the Purgs. Nice sidewall, decent volume, corners well, and rolls fast. I also like the Schwalbe RR. While I didn't end up buying them, I have heard good things from fellow riders. I just set up a pair of NN 3.0 and find them to have great attributes. They have excellent grip, nice round profile and roll super fast. They are not as wide a profile as the Purgs though....

I just ordered a set of V-fatty's in 3.25, they should be here next week. I can't wait to try those for the remainder of the winter.

Hope you can find some more feedback.


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## lvkid89 (Jul 17, 2015)

I just put a Surly Dirt Wizard on the front of my stumpjumper 6fattie. It is a tad shorter than the stock front ground control but feels great. The traction on turning has greatly increased and I don't have the swishy washout feel that I got before. So far I am digging it. Using it in the southwest so dry, rocky, loose, sand, etc..


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

lvkid89 said:


> I just put a Surly Dirt Wizard on the front of my stumpjumper 6fattie. It is a tad shorter than the stock front ground control but feels great. The traction on turning has greatly increased and I don't have the swishy washout feel that I got before. So far I am digging it. Using it in the southwest so dry, rocky, loose, sand, etc..


Dirt Wizard rear,Terrene Chunk now my favorite front tire!


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

techfersure said:


> Dirt Wizard rear,Terrene Chunk now my favorite front tire!


Nice tires. Did you get the light or tough version for chunks?


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

stumpynerd said:


> Nice tires. Did you get the light or tough version for chunks?


Tough,needed where I ride!


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

I will have to consider those tires next season. I just ordered another set of purg grids. 

Hows rolling resistance on those chunks. With the square lugs kinda looks like they might roll a tad slow.


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

On front not so bad,and very confidence inspiring when pushed hard into turns. Would not use for rear.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

Which of the two is more aggressive?


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

gpgalanis said:


> Which of the two is more aggressive?


Terrene it seems to me,for all of the extreme conditions we have here in Eastern Pa,grips everything!


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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

All
Newbie here but curious Your judgement and advice.

Planning to converst my 29 Prime to 27+. Already ordered 45int rims and wondering if pick 2.8 or 3.0 Nobby Nic - anyone can share the real with of such setups ?
Secondly - whenever size of NoNic i'll choose it would be front one - can You advice also if rear should also be the Nic or maybe RoRo (also 27+) for lower rolling resistance would suit better.


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## lvkid89 (Jul 17, 2015)

techfersure said:


> Dirt Wizard rear,Terrene Chunk now my favorite front tire!


Looks like a dope setup! I will have to give that Chunk a try next.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

im still waiting on a review for the HR2 27.5x3.0. its been ''announced" for a bit now and on maxxis's website for quite a while. i will most likely buy these tires so long as they measure something close to 3". from what ive gathered, the HR2 2.8 seems to measure up just fine after a few rides.


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## dRjOn (Feb 18, 2004)

has anyone actually got one that isnt pre-prod?


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## BoomShakkaLagga (Apr 18, 2008)

Hey there,

I do not have any experience with 27,5 plus and am wondering how they behave long-term when ridden tubeless. My experience with "conventional" size tires with ProCore and low air pressure is that slowly but steady the sidewalls get "walked through" and the tires will sweat over after time.

How are the plus tires with regards to sweating? My understanding is that they are designed to be even lighter, so in my imagination we are all buying tubeless milk stock now or what? 

What are the experiences here?










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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

How low of pressures are we talking?


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

It's a possibility. I bought a used set of WTB Trail Bosses a while back and they seeped Stan's through what looked like little slits all the way around each side of both tires. Could be an issue with the Stan's also. There's a few threads about that. I switched to Orange Seal with a new set of Duro Miners. Time will tell. 
I think 120 tpi tires are less likely to do it.


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

The original Ground Control and Purgatory Control casings wept like a shamed televangelist at first. I replaced the Ground Controls, but shortly after I switched to Orange Seal, the problem went away on the Purgs.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

Surly Dirt Wizard and Terrene Chunk do not leak.


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## minirac (Dec 17, 2015)

Installed new rear and front Purgatory GRID GRIPTON 27.5 x 3.0 tubeless 38ID rim. Each come around 1160g. Replaced old model Purgatory Grid 27.5 x 3.0 .. Now this tire feels really robust. And what a grip! Even sealed & rideable perfect without sealant. And not a single leak from anywhere when sealant added! Insane tire, strongly recommended! Maybe even new Gripton Ground Controls can do a job for me, cuz i dont need so much grip.

Now i'm looking for second pair of more XC/fast plus tires. Would love to try chupacabra 2.8 but they are expensive as hell. Looks like RR 2.8 is fast, supple, light and not so expensive. Any thoughts/experience with new FastTrak 2.8 GRID gripton(900g claimed)?


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

Nice purgs. Im waiting on mine to arrive end of this month. On backorder.


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## Chasseur (Jan 28, 2007)

*Does 425 mi wear out a rear GC 3.0? Like 40 hrs of riding?*

Sorry this is sideways. Anyway, I've ridden 2.0/2.2 tires for 25 years, this seems like a pretty worn tire for this volume range. Is this what everyone sees, and I'm just out of touch? By the way, I ripped part of a knob off it a ride ago, booted it, and I have a 3" RoRo waiting. It's not terrible bad, but it's def lost some grip. Side knobs are better than mid range, but some of those middles are pretty sad. No tarmac, only Front Range track really.


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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

Hi, I'm in the UK, does anyone know of an online store in the US that I could buy the 2.8 Butcher and Slaughter GRIDs?


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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

Doe anyone have copared NoNic and RoRon both 2.8 on back. 
I'm really stucked as Ron is supposed to be faster with lower roling resistance but on other hand afraid of loosiing the grip. 
It's said that 2.8 with 15PSI shouldn't loose grip so trying tond swee spot.


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

Placek said:


> Doe anyone have copared NoNic and RoRon both 2.8 on back.
> I'm really stucked as Ron is supposed to be faster with lower roling resistance but on other hand afraid of loosiing the grip.
> It's said that 2.8 with 15PSI shouldn't loose grip so trying tond swee spot.


I've run a 27.5x3.0 Rocket Ron in the back on two different bikes at 12-14 psi. It rolls well and is OK on rocky surfaces (Moab type slick rock) and hardback "hero dirt" that's firm and tacky. However, it slides too much in loose on hard here in SoCal and does't bite enough in soft or muddy conditions.

I'd recommend a Nobby Nic if you need lots of traction. Another option in the 2.8 size is the Maxxis Rekon, sort of in between the NoNic and RoRo. Much better grip than the RoRo, more predictable when it does slide, also light weight, and fast rolling.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

levity said:


> I've run a 27.5x3.0 Rocket Ron in the back on two different bikes at 12-14 psi. It rolls well and is OK on rocky surfaces (Moab type slick rock) and hardback "hero dirt" that's firm and tacky. However, it slides too much in loose on hard here in SoCal and does't bite enough in soft or muddy conditions.
> 
> I'd recommend a Nobby Nic if you need lots of traction. Another option in the 2.8 size is the Maxxis Rekon, sort of in between the NoNic and RoRo. Much better grip than the RoRo, more predictable when it does slide, also light weight, and fast rolling.


A Rocket Ron in a 3.0 is not the same beast as a 2.8. The 2.8 version is quit a bit more aggressive.


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## levity (Oct 31, 2011)

bdundee said:


> A Rocket Ron in a 3.0 is not the same beast as a 2.8. The 2.8 version is quit a bit more aggressive.


I haven't seen or tried the 2.8 RoRo. Just thought the small knobs were a bit closer together on the smaller carcass. What'd they do different?

Ok, I see this previous thread by bdundee - good info there:

http://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-p...-but-very-different-1022488.html#post12823634


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

From a previous thread, ppl have reported much larger knobs on the 2.8 RRon than 3.0.

I have both the rekon 2.8 and RRon 2.8 and live in san diego. The RR definitely rolls faster and is lighter however has more undamped rebound. The Rekon measures 2.64 for me, 5mm corner lugs, 3mm center knobs. The RRon measures 2.68 for me, 5mm corner unsupported lugs, 3mm center knobs. I run 35mm iw rims.

The dhf2.5 has 5mm corner lugs and 5mm center knobs. The dhr2.4 has 6mm corner lugs and 4mm center knobs. These have much larger knobs and quite a bit heavier but true to size.

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## Guest (Mar 17, 2017)

bdundee said:


> A Rocket Ron in a 3.0 is not the same beast as a 2.8. The 2.8 version is quit a bit more aggressive.


there's that word 'aggressive' again...haha, yes the two are diff in terms of knob height & volume for sure.

surprised bob didn't post his link.

http://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-p...et-ron-same-but-very-different-1022488-2.html


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## Feendog (Oct 12, 2016)

Good Friday Evening,

I have the following three tires: 
-3.0 WTB Trail Boss 
-3.0 Surly Dirt Wizard 
-3.0 Specialized Ground Control. 

What would you suggest as front and rear tire for the most reliable combo with the best traction. I recently got a 27.5+ Surly KM and will be riding technical terrain in New England.


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## mglder (Dec 8, 2015)

mugstud said:


> Hi, I'm in the UK, does anyone know of an online store in the US that I could buy the 2.8 Butcher and Slaughter GRIDs?


Why would you want to order from America? You'll get tax/vat added on once they arrive.

Get them from europe. HiBike.de sell them. And they are basically not far off the price of the regular size specialized tyres over here.

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## mugstud (Jun 6, 2016)

mglder said:


> Why would you want to order from America? You'll get tax/vat added on once they arrive.
> 
> Get them from europe. HiBike.de sell them. And they are basically not far off the price of the regular size specialized tyres over here.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk


They aren't available until the end of May/early June in Europe (Specialized UK won't be stocking the 2.8s at all) and I was hoping to get some now.


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2017)

mglder said:


> Why would you want to order from America? You'll get tax/vat added on once they arrive.


because often times they are not available just as when us mericans go in search for goods, sometimes we end up purchasing euro if we want it bad enough that's why.


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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

levity said:


> I've run a 27.5x3.0 Rocket Ron in the back on two different bikes at 12-14 psi. It rolls well and is OK on rocky surfaces (Moab type slick rock) and hardback "hero dirt" that's firm and tacky. However, it slides too much in loose on hard here in SoCal and does't bite enough in soft or muddy conditions.
> 
> I'd recommend a Nobby Nic if you need lots of traction. Another option in the 2.8 size is the Maxxis Rekon, sort of in between the NoNic and RoRo. Much better grip than the RoRo, more predictable when it does slide, also light weight, and fast rolling.


Huge thanks for this. 
This fear tire would be used i rocky, slippery terrain hence need to slick well but also be predictable when running downhill. 
Initally i thought that RoRon might work, but when more i search than see that this tire i actually more XC oriented and i might no benefit from roling resistance and sacrify too much of grip.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Feendog said:


> Good Friday Evening,
> 
> I have the following three tires:
> -3.0 WTB Trail Boss
> ...


Dirt Wizard front, Trail Boss rear.


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## majr (May 22, 2012)

Feendog said:


> Good Friday Evening,
> 
> I have the following three tires:
> -3.0 WTB Trail Boss
> ...


Dirt Wizard front, Dirt Wizard rear. Or if you only have one of each, DW front, TB rear.


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## Feendog (Oct 12, 2016)

majr said:


> Dirt Wizard front, Dirt Wizard rear. Or if you only have one of each, DW front, TB rear.


Thanks. I only have one DW. DW looks to be tiny bit more narrow than The Trail Boss. I do have a 2.8 Trail Blazer so maybe I'll go with that in the rear.


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## tdotrider (Aug 1, 2008)

Was wondering whether anyone has had a chance to ride both the Butcher Grid 2.8 and Purgatory Grid 3.0...?

My rims are WTB i35's and I installed the Butcher 2.8's last night. Just measured them now to be 2.65" knob-to-knob. Compared to the WTB Trail Boss 3.0's I pulled off the same rims, these look substantially smaller (lower volume). I was wondering whether I'd be better off running the 3.0 Purgatory Grid front/back, the Butcher 2.8's aren't looking much bigger than my regular 27.5 setup of Magic Marys on i30 rims. The 3.0 Trail Boss cleared my frame but not by much (4-5mm either side at the chainstays) so not sure if the Purgatory 3.0 would. I'm in the Pacific Northwest and ride plenty of wet rocks and roots so grip is important...question is...would I have better grip with the lower-volume Butcher 2.8's at say 17-18psi or the Purgatory 3.0's at ~14-15psi?


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

Is there actually a 2.8 Butcher Grid? I only see the Butcher Controls on the S website. The Butcher Grids have a much softer compound, but the Controls are only slightly softer than the Purgs. Softer compounds generally grip better in the wet than wider tire, because tire slip happens at much lower forces (before the tire deforms) when it's wet. I'm not sure how those two would compare in the dry, however. 

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## tdotrider (Aug 1, 2008)

phride said:


> Is there actually a 2.8 Butcher Grid?


I'm looking at it on my wheel right now - Butcher Grid Gripton 650bx2.8

That said, it looks like both the Butcher Grid & Purgatory Grid now use the Gripton compound...the only difference then being the tread pattern and knob height. I imagine the Purgatory would have a rounder profile whereas the Butcher is a bit more square (especially consider they'd be going on an i35 rim).


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

I'm not sure that Gripton means anything (although it sure sounds cool). The Purgatory Grid and Control both have rubber coming with 60a durometer rating on the center of the tread and 50a (softer compound) on the tread shoulder. The Butcher Control is specced as 50a throughout, and the Butcher Grid knobs are 42a (much softer), although the 2.8 isn't up on their website yet. Assuming it is the same, I would expect the Butcher to give you much better traction, and I would also think that you could run a lower pressure than 15-16, if you had the Trail Bosses at 14-15, as the Grid sidewalls should be much stiffer than the TBs'. Also, the Purg 3.0s have a much wider bead to bead measurement (180) than the Trail Boss (167), so I would expect that they wouldn't quite fit your current bike.

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## tdotrider (Aug 1, 2008)

I appreciate the insight, I didn't realize the Purg 3.0's are quite that big - definitely a no-go on my Remedy. Sounds like the super-soft knobs on the Butcher Grid will match up quite well with the generally wet conditions in my neck of the woods...might go with something a bit less aggressive for the drier summer months. Cheers!


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## majr (May 22, 2012)

tdotrider said:


> I appreciate the insight, I didn't realize the Purg 3.0's are quite that big - definitely a no-go on my Remedy. Sounds like the super-soft knobs on the Butcher Grid will match up quite well with the generally wet conditions in my neck of the woods...might go with something a bit less aggressive for the drier summer months. Cheers!


Purg 3.0s measure close to a true 3.0. Butcher 2.8s do measure kind of small, as you have seen.
As others have stated, the Butcher is a MUCH softer rubber compound, way grippier. I can't comment on your trails, but in the east on rocks/hardpack the Butcher is considerably grippier, and tougher. I would run a Purg 3.0 at around 15.5F/17.5R, whereas the Butcher 2.8 needs 18F/20R to keep from banging the rims on rocks.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

phride said:


> I'm not sure that Gripton means anything (although it sure sounds cool). The Purgatory Grid and Control both have rubber coming with 60a durometer rating on the center of the tread and 50a (softer compound) on the tread shoulder. The Butcher Control is specced as 50a throughout, and the Butcher Grid knobs are 42a (much softer), although the 2.8 isn't up on their website yet. Assuming it is the same, I would expect the Butcher to give you much better traction, and I would also think that you could run a lower pressure than 15
> 
> Pretty sure the Trail Boss is 180mm b-b also. I had a set on I-36mm rims and they measured out to 75mm knob to knob.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

Need real world info on a replacement plus tire. Currently run WTB ranger and would like to try a slightly more aggressive tire for mud season. Anyone know real measurements of a Rekon 27.5x2.8 vs a 2.8 Ranger? 

2.8 Ranger is the absolute widest my bike will fit..


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

Rekon 2.8 measures 2.66 on s 35mm iw rim knob to knob 

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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Back2MTB said:


> Need real world info on a replacement plus tire. Currently run WTB ranger and would like to try a slightly more aggressive tire for mud season. Anyone know real measurements of a Rekon 27.5x2.8 vs a 2.8 Ranger?
> 
> 2.8 Ranger is the absolute widest my bike will fit..


I have ran both on an i30 and they were within a mm of each other if I recall. If you are good clearance wise with the Ranger you will be fine with the Rekon. In my experience the Ranger would be fine on the stand but would squish out under weight while riding and my chain would rub when in the big cog. The Rekon has been more stiff and supportive and definitely better in the mud. I'm actually planning on running a Rekon front and Ranger rear on my wife's bike. I have the Rekon mounted up. I will try to get some time to mount up the Ranger tomorrow and take specific measurements for you.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

Super helpful, thanks very much!


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anyone want to take guesses as how big the Schwalbe 2.6 tires will be? 

I've got the Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 and they are definitely on the wider side, maybe even true to claimed width.

I've really liked the Slaughter 2.6, but it's side knobs are just a bit wide for my oldschool 27.5 frame. That and the Butcher is a slow roller. 

Thinking of trying the 2.6 versions of the Rocket Ron Snakeskin and Nobby Nic up front.


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## Guest (Mar 27, 2017)

PHeller said:


> Anyone want to take guesses as how big the Schwalbe 2.6 tires will *NOT* be?


fify, I guess, surmise, suspect they will not be true to their 2.6 label but rather 2.5ish....


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## coolhand80 (Oct 19, 2011)

PHeller said:


> Anyone want to take guesses as how big the Schwalbe 2.6 tires will be?
> 
> I've got the Slaughter and Butcher 2.6 and they are definitely on the wider side, maybe even true to claimed width.
> 
> ...


Another option is the maxxis Forekaster and Rekon both are available in 27.5x2.6 now.

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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

jacksonlui said:


> Rekon 2.8 measures 2.66 on s 35mm iw rim knob to knob
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Alright so mounted the WTB Ranger back up and took some measurements. I have 3 different pairs of tires. The WTB Ranger 2.8 light and fast, Maxxis Rekon 2.8 DC and Minion DHF 3C 2.8. All tires are mounted on Easton i30 27.5 rims.

Rangers measure 67mm knob to knob and 66mm casing. 
Rekon come out at 66mm k2k and 65mm casing 
DHF are 67-68mm k2k and 65mm casing

One final note. I have mounted up so many different brands of tires (WTB, Maxxis, Schwalabe and Specialized) on all 3 different popular diameter rims and I don't know what it is about these WTB's but I remember this the last time I mounted them... and that is I ended up making a ridiculous sealant mess like I'm new at tubeless or something. That and I have to put a lot more sealant in to get them to not leak air out the sidewalls.

Anyhow I hope this helps.


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## jeffreyjhsu (Jun 22, 2004)

31.3 ??? What's that?

am super excited about 27.5+ as it fills in one of the last gaps in choice for diameter/width (we now have 31x3, 29xanything you want up to 4.8", 27.5xanything up to 3" or so, etc) but honestly, they are not going to work that well on most 29" frames. Anything big enough to achieve the same diameter as a 29x2.3 or so is going to be too huge to fit in most frames, and a smaller tire (like the WTB) is going to cause a lot of people BB height/pedal strike problems, especially if run at low pressure where you're looking at 15+mm less BB height.

But they are still awesome and I want some.


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## IvanMTB (Sep 28, 2007)

Hi,

Looking to replace hated TrailBlazer :madmax:
Sidewall in that tyre is a joke...










I was eyeing Vee Crown Gem in either 2.6 or 2.8 flavor.

Any real life measurements on iw 35-40mm rim please?

Cheers!
I.


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## tdotrider (Aug 1, 2008)

I've had a few rides now on my Butcher Grid 2.8's (on i35 rims) and no surprises, traction is amazing...an excellent setup for PNW winter/spring riding. I'll likely replace the Butcher in the rear with something faster-rolling when the dry season finally shows up, but thus far quite impressed with the Spesh tires. They are literally half the price locally of the DHF/DHF2, which goes to show just how absurd Maxxis' pricing is.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

IvanMTB said:


> Hi,
> 
> Looking to replace hated TrailBlazer :madmax:
> Sidewall in that tyre is a joke...
> ...


I can't help you much with replacement tires, but part of the problem with the sidewalls wearing like that is not because the sidewall is thin, but because the sidewall is much wider than the tread. There are a decent number of 2.8 tires tires out there, but they are all wider than the Trail Blazer, which is more like a 2.6" tire.


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## IvanMTB (Sep 28, 2007)

True story mate...

Anyways, that's why I'm asking about 2.6 Crown Gem, providing it is REAL 2.6, not closer to 2.3-2.4...

Unless 2.8 is more like 2.6, so I can go for that...

Cheers!
I.


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## Guest (Mar 30, 2017)

bikeny said:


> I can't help you much with replacement tires, but part of the problem with the sidewalls wearing like that is not because the sidewall is thin, but because the sidewall is much wider than the tread. There are a decent number of 2.8 tires tires out there, but they are all wider than the Trail Blazer, which is more like a 2.6" tire.


bikeny is correct.



IvanMTB said:


> True story mate...
> 
> Anyways, that's why I'm asking about 2.6 Crown Gem, providing it is REAL 2.6, not closer to 2.3-2.4...
> 
> ...


the fitment of the TB with casing extremely exposed is the down fall. Give the crown gem 2.8 a shot if you like the VEE tires.


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## EBG 18T (Dec 31, 2005)

nvphatty said:


> the fitment of the TB with casing extremely exposed is the down fall. Give the crown gem 2.8 a shot if you like the VEE tires.


Crown Gem gets a :thumbsup: from me.


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## IvanMTB (Sep 28, 2007)

Do you have any actual measurements of that one?

Cheers!
I.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

The wtb ranger and trail boss are both true to size if using something that's actually a plus wheel.

3.0s are slightly over 3.0 on 45mm inner rims.

Trailblazer is garbage, 2.6 maybe on a good day and really square tread pattern. Ranger and trail boss are actually pretty good tires for me so far but I got the tough sidewalls. 3.0 tires still weigh less than trailblazer 2.8

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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Moving from Specialized GRID Butcher/Slaughter 2.6 (for sale) to Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.6. 

I really liked the Specialized stuff, but for 80% of my riding I don't need something quite so aggressive, and when I do I'd probably be happy with more normal 2.35-2.5 sizes. 

Hoping the Rocket Ron is fast rolling, tough (enough) and lightweight.


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## markopic (Jan 12, 2016)

Has anyone used Schwalbe G-One's in 2,8 size? I have finally purchased ones, but I have missed that there are two Evolution versions - Liteskin and Snakeskin which is tubeless easy. I plan to use the tires on DtSwiss XM551 rims, but I am not sure if they can be used tubeless. As far as I have looked, Snakeskin version is not available yet.
Should I use Liteskins, even with tubes, or should I exchange them for Snakeskin when they become available? I have only experience with LiteSkins on my fat bike (Jumbo Jims), which I use with tubes.
Many thanks in advance


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## mglder (Dec 8, 2015)

Have just put some 2.6 Nobby Nic Trailstars on some Roval Traverse 29mm internal wheels. They look small (shock eh) right now, but will maybe grow a little overnight.

They fit easily into the regular 27.5 Suntour Aion forks.

















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## Guest (Mar 31, 2017)

^^ good fit.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

Any news on proper 27.5+ tyres. 

All the news and exitement seem to be on these whimppy and skinny 2.6.-2.8 ones. 
I presume that the 27.5+thing should be past 29er conversion phase and with frames designed for bigger clearances people would want tyres with larger diameter and foot print.

Something in the true 3.0-3.25 region.
I have the VTF 3.25 rear and duro Crux 3.25 front and that combination offers good traction , but for some tasks i would like to try fast rolling rubber.

it has been long time since first VTF 3.25:s were available , but it is basically still the only tyre bigger than 3inch really available. 

I have trouble understanding the dicrection which 27.5.+ has taken.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

That's just it, manufacturers aren't producing bikes with big clearances. In most cases, 3.0 is the max fitment. 

I think market as a whole is just excited to see more high-volume, lightweight tires, and most people don't need a 3.25" tire most of the time.


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## Chasseur (Jan 28, 2007)

Giant insider told me a while ago they saw sweet spot at 2.6, so... there u go. For me,if it ain't 3.0, gtfo.


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## Davex1 (May 5, 2016)

rikardo said:


> Any news on proper 27.5+ tyres.
> 
> All the news and exitement seem to be on these whimppy and skinny 2.6.-2.8 ones.
> I presume that the 27.5+thing should be past 29er conversion phase and with frames designed for bigger clearances people would want tyres with larger diameter and foot print.
> ...


It all depends how and where you ride. Plus tires are for the right type of riders and the right type of riding. I like the traction of the plus tires on some surfaces and also the way they smoothen the ride, but I don't like the bounciness when I'm riding aggressively. That is why Enduro racers are looking into 2.5-2.6'' wide tires as they offer plenty of traction and grip but at minimum bouncing and also offers a more stable sidewall. a true 2.5 or 2.6'' tire on the proper rim width that is fast rolling and offer a good overall grip on a wide range of surface could be the ultimate trail tire. There is plenty of new tires in the 27.5x2.6 size like the Maxxis Rekon, Forekaster, Nobby Nic, Specs, Vee Crown Gem, etc. And some people rave about the WTB 2.5 tires that are real 2.5''. The plus bike is certainly here to stay but you have to know the benefits and the drawbacks before going this way to make sure it is for you.


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## c_mack9 (Oct 31, 2011)

To get more clearance in the frame you'll have to go down to a 22 tooth chain ring. Is that what you all want? Go look how close your 30t ring is on your current bike.


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## tfinator (Apr 30, 2009)

c_mack9 said:


> To get more clearance in the frame you'll have to go down to a 22 tooth chain ring. Is that what you all want? Go look how close your 30t ring is on your current bike.


What?


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## Guest (Apr 5, 2017)

tfinator said:


> What?


say wha???


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## Jatrma (May 8, 2016)

I recently started racing my 27.5+ trail bike, I realize it's probably not the best option for XC racing but it's what I have. 

Bike came with a Chinese no name, claimed to be 3.5" but actually measures 3.0. I switched to WTB Bridger 3.0 front and rear. I was losing the front end on our hard pack/loose over hard trails so I switched the front back to the factory tire. Grip is good with that set up, but it's time to replace the front. Any suggestions for a good front to pair with the Bridger rear?


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

Trailboss 3.0, excellent all around traction but rolls very well. Only weakness is probably mud but it's not terrible at that either.


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## mglder (Dec 8, 2015)

c_mack9 said:


> To get more clearance in the frame you'll have to go down to a 22 tooth chain ring. Is that what you all want? Go look how close your 30t ring is on your current bike.


I've seen some nonsense posted on here but this is up there with the 'best'.

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## matrix311 (Dec 29, 2014)

Just put industry nine backcountry 360 27.5+ wheels on my new pivot les with maxxis rekon 2.8 tires front and rear. Can't wait to test them out tomorrow.










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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

I've spent the past 5 days reading this thread because googling "Kenda Havok Pro" took me here. Not one mention of the Kenda. Damn


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## matrix311 (Dec 29, 2014)

agauna said:


> I've spent the past 5 days reading this thread because googling "Kenda Havok Pro" took me here. Not one mention of the Kenda. Damn


It's probably listed in someone's signature.

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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

My new purgs grids seem to be holding up fine. :thumbsup:


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## activ3 (Jan 17, 2011)

Sorry if this has been covered but what kind of pressures are you all running at bike parks? I'll have my Mojo 3 with 2.8 Rekons at Bailey Mtb Park this weekend and I'm not entirely sure where to start with pressures. The trails are smooth and flowy.


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## matrix311 (Dec 29, 2014)

I use those same tires and run 14 front and 16 rear and wright 185 all geared up for loose over hard pack terrain.

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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I run them 15/15 at 193 geared up on rocky terrain.

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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

Well I'm new to the plus thing and have ripped 2 tires in one month off riding. The first was the Nobby Nic 2.8 on the front. Last weekend I tore a WTB trail boss on the rear on the first ride. Both were inflated just below 20 psi. Was taking a hard fast corner littered with some small sharp-ish rocks. What happens at low pressure is on a corner the tire folds over a good amount, and the sidewall area closest to the tread is facing downward near the ground and those sharp rocks. I'm staying above 25 psi from now on at the suggestion of another plus rider out on the trail.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

25 would be bouncy. Maybe plus tires dont work for you 

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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

agauna said:


> Well I'm new to the plus thing and have ripped 2 tires in one month off riding. The first was the Nobby Nic 2.8 on the front. Last weekend I tore a WTB trail boss on the rear on the first ride. Both were inflated just below 20 psi. Was taking a hard fast corner littered with some small sharp-ish rocks. What happens at low pressure is on a corner the tire folds over a good amount, and the sidewall area closest to the tread is facing downward near the ground and those sharp rocks. I'm staying above 25 psi from now on at the suggestion of another plus rider out on the trail.


What width rims?


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## JACKL (Sep 18, 2011)

agauna said:


> Well I'm new to the plus thing and have ripped 2 tires in one month off riding. The first was the Nobby Nic 2.8 on the front. Last weekend I tore a WTB trail boss on the rear on the first ride. Both were inflated just below 20 psi. Was taking a hard fast corner littered with some small sharp-ish rocks. What happens at low pressure is on a corner the tire folds over a good amount, and the sidewall area closest to the tread is facing downward near the ground and those sharp rocks. I'm staying above 25 psi from now on at the suggestion of another plus rider out on the trail.


Just curious what your internal rim width is; if they are too narrow, that would be a contributing factor.


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

Aguana just a shot in the dark but your pump could be way off. I was using an floor pump that said I was at 15psi, but it was actually 10psi. Ended up bashing a flat spot on my rim fiddling with PSI. Went with an digital guage and no issues with running too low of pressure.

I live in the rockies and havent had any issues with rock punctures. I run about 150ml of stans which sounds high but no issues with flats. Plus tires seem to soak up more sealant anyways.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

I weigh less than 175 on the trail. My wheels are 38mm wide internally and I used my brothers brand new Topeak gauge. Funny thing is, I tore both tires on the same 12 mile trail... Within about 200 yards of each other, at about 11 miles in. I might be the first to have torn the Trail Boss, certainly that soon! So I've ordered a pair of Kenda Havok Pros 2.8. Just to experiment (these experiments are getting expensive). I'll run them both at 25 psi and see if I have better luck. I'm thinking the ride shouldn't be bouncy, instead harsher and probably less traction but surely no less than an ordinary 27.5 @ normal pressure. It could also just be coincidental bad luck!


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

25psi seems awfully high. My Purgatory grids have 20psi max on sidewalls. I run about 16psi out back and 12 or so upfront. 190lbs


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

I'm 275 and don't go over 20 even the back.

But if you have trails that slice sidewalls you need to get the tough casing not light. I run tough rear and light front for now at least.

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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Yeah I don't care if it's a plus or regular tire if you're riding hard enough on aggressive trails a more supportive and tougher sidewall is usually necessary. I suppose with plus tires that may be even more the case. I know the light and fast Rangers I have get squirrelly if I push them too hard. The Rekon DC's have been pretty good but the Minion DHF 3C has been in my experience the most supportive sidewalls of the 3 plus tires that I have ran. If you're pushing it then go for the toughest casing you can.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

Here's the NN and the Trail Boss for dramatic effect


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## Plusforever (Oct 5, 2015)

coolhand80 said:


> Another option is the maxxis Forekaster and Rekon both are available in 27.5x2.6 now.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I have a pair of the 120tpi lightweight 2.6 Rekons coming that I'll be testing next week on 30mm internal width rims.


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## xgsjx (May 24, 2016)

25 psi! :???:

I run 20 psi when I'm riding tarmac with the mrs (sounds like an ebike). On the trail it's 10 in the front & 12 in the back.


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## markopic (Jan 12, 2016)

I have purchased set of Schwalbe G-ones in 2.8 size, but unfortunatelly I have missed that there are liteskin and snakeskin versions in Evolution line, so I got liteskin version which is not rated as tubeless easy.

I have tried to fit one tire tubeless on my DT Swiss XM551 rims (40mm outside diameter) and it sits perfectly, no air leak on tire bead at all, but there are few small holes on tire sidewall. I have tried to close them with tire sealant (Caffelatex), but the tire still leaks air on these holes.

Do you have any experience with tubeless setup of liteskin tires? Should I keep trying or just put tubes in them?

Other than that, the tire is very tight and requires significant effort to fit on the rim. It looks pretty good, but I think that Maxxis Chronicle is much better tire - I have tried to supplement Chronicle with these tires for light gravel use. Liteskin sidewall is really paper thin.

Many thanks for all the help,


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

I have sealed up three sets of lite skins now and they all do this. I use orange seal and then make sure to go ride the bike once the sealant is in there. I had to Air them up a few times but eventually it holds.


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## Jefflinde (Mar 26, 2015)

Also, do you mind posting some pics. I am looking at getting some of those tires for my wife's rig for rail trails. I would love to see how they look all mounted up


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## markopic (Jan 12, 2016)

No problem, here are some pictures.
It still leaks air, so I would not recommend them.


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## 69tr6r (Mar 27, 2007)

So I'm fairly new to the plus wheels I threw on my Banshee Phantom, but loving it so far. I'm running Specialized Roval 29mm internal wheelset, with Nobby Nic 3.0 front and 2.8 rear.

I really have no major complaints, but now that summer is coming, and conditions are much drier, I'd like to try moving my 2.8 NN to the front, and getting something a little better at rolling in the rear. I've been looking at the Rekon and the Ikon, anything else? Probably stay 2.6-2.8 in the rear.

Suggestions?

Thanks!


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2017)

69tr6r said:


> So I'm fairly new to the plus wheels I threw on my Banshee Phantom, but loving it so far. I'm running Specialized Roval 29mm internal wheelset, with Nobby Nic 3.0 front and 2.8 rear.
> 
> I really have no major complaints, but now that summer is coming, and conditions are much drier, I'd like to try moving my 2.8 NN to the front, and getting something a little better at rolling in the rear. I've been looking at the Rekon and the Ikon, anything else? Probably stay 2.6-2.8 in the rear.
> 
> ...


The RR rolls superior to NN due to tread pattern so perhaps give it a go........there's a noticeable diff between the 2.8 / 3.0 RR because of knob height, hence the 3.0 being shorter will roll the best.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

I thought it has been said the knobs on the 2.8 was bigger than the ones on the 3.0

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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

jacksonlui said:


> I thought it has been said the knobs on the 2.8 was bigger than the ones on the 3.0
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


That's correct.


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## Guest (Apr 18, 2017)

jacksonlui said:


> I thought it has been said the knobs on the 2.8 was bigger than the ones on the 3.0
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk





Placek said:


> That's correct.


my apologies your both correct and i shall edit my post above.....:crazy:


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## 69tr6r (Mar 27, 2007)

Thank you guys for the suggestions. I'll look into the RR for the rear.


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## kidd (Apr 16, 2006)

During research it seems then 2.8 to RR is on the same casing as the NN, but the tread is wider. I've already committed to a 2.8 NN front and i35 rims. I want a RR rear just can't decide if the 2.6 RR would look better and still work on the i35 rim.
The 2.8 isn't really needed on the rear. Just need good tread wrap for the i35 rim. Not a lot of info on the 2.8 even less on the 2.6.


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## codysoyland (Jul 15, 2014)

Just noticed the new Schwalbe Addix compound tires include a new 27.5x2.8 model of the Magic Mary.

https://www.schwalbe.com/en/offroad-reader/magic-mary.html


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## Patu (Jun 23, 2016)

codysoyland said:


> Just noticed the new Schwalbe Addix compound tires include a new 27.5x2.8 model of the Magic Mary.
> 
> https://www.schwalbe.com/en/offroad-reader/magic-mary.html


Cool!


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

codysoyland said:


> Just noticed the new Schwalbe Addix compound tires include a new 27.5x2.8 model of the Magic Mary.
> 
> https://www.schwalbe.com/en/offroad-reader/magic-mary.html


Farken drool!

I asked them for this tyre a year ago. Finally my prayers are answered!


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## wakeboarderdave (Sep 30, 2008)

Anyone have any guides on making tire changes easier? I have a Salsa Timberjack and getting an old tire off was a PITA and getting the new tire back on was even harder. There was about a 12" section that took two people to put the tire on. There's no way I'd be able to swap a tire out on the trail.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

Not sure if you have the same situation I had. I just mounted some Kenda Havok Pros and I couldn't, for the life of me keep the air in, even with a compressor! Beads lubed and all. So I threw a tube in and seated the beads. Deflate, then carefully take one bead off and remove the tube. Put the valve in, lube the beads and re-inflate. The one bead should seat pretty easily every time after. Hope this helps.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

agauna said:


> Not sure if you have the same situation I had. I just mounted some Kenda Havok Pros and I couldn't, for the life of me keep the air in, even with a compressor! Beads lubed and all. So I threw a tube in and seated the beads. Deflate, then carefully take one bead off and remove the tube. Put the valve in, lube the beads and re-inflate. The one bead should seat pretty easily every time after. Hope this helps.


Another option is to push one side of the tire out from the inside with a tire lever. It doesn't have to be all the way seated as long as there's is somewhat of a seal between the tire and the rim. The tube method works too.

I think what wakeboarderdave is describing is something different though. To me, it sounds like a problem getting the tire on and off. Usually, if the tire is pushed all the way off the bead and towards the center of the rim, it's not too hard to get one side of the tire off the rim. Tire levers can help if you can't get it off by hand.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

wakeboarderdave said:


> Anyone have any guides on making tire changes easier? I have a Salsa Timberjack and getting an old tire off was a PITA and getting the new tire back on was even harder. There was about a 12" section that took two people to put the tire on. There's no way I'd be able to swap a tire out on the trail.


I'm not sure if you are doing this already, but you really need to make sure the bead of the section already on the rim is in the dropped down center section. It also depends on the rim, as some have that center section lower than others.


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## Gonzo-McGurk (Apr 18, 2017)

Wakeboarderdave, 

I had the same problem. It's a PITA. At least the first time. Make sure you have a good tire tool. I picked up the crankbrothers and it's very good. You have to work it slowly along the edge. Trying to do it all at once didn't work for me.


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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

69tr6r said:


> Thank you guys for the suggestions. I'll look into the RR for the rear.


As reference, today i had a pleasure to check RoRo 3.0 vs 2.8 on 45(internal) rim (EASTON ARC)

2.8 - 69,5mm wide, knob ~5mm tall
3.0 - 71,5mm wide, knob ~3mm tall

Difference in aggressivity is more than noticeable.
See pic below (2.8 left, 3.0 right)


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## bad andy (Feb 21, 2006)

Placek said:


> As reference, today i had a pleasure to check RoRo 3.0 vs 2.8 on 45(internal) rim (EASTON ARC)
> 
> 2.8 - 69,5mm wide, knob ~5mm tall
> 3.0 - 71,5mm wide, knob ~3mm tall
> ...


Great comparison. Would you be able to compare overall wheel height between these 2 setups? I'm running a 3.0 now and curious how much my bb might drop if I go to a 2.8. Thanks!


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## hotsalsa (Jun 10, 2011)

Any recommendations for a good 3.0 tire, or a 2.8 that sits a little higher? Not a fan of bridgers and Rekons do ok but I feel they drop the bb too much and already split a sidewall. Debating the NIC.


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## Steel Calf (Feb 5, 2010)

agauna said:


> My wheels are 38mm wide internally
> 
> Funny thing is, I tore both tires on the same 12 mile trail... Within about 200 yards of each other, at about 11 miles in.


A wider rim exposes the sidewalls more and may lead towards more potential cuts


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## Placek (Jun 9, 2009)

bad andy said:


> Great comparison. Would you be able to compare overall wheel height between these 2 setups? I'm running a 3.0 now and curious how much my bb might drop if I go to a 2.8. Thanks!


Sorry for late reply. 
The real difference is?~5mm when i put both wheels next to each other, so adequate to difference in knob height.


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## bad andy (Feb 21, 2006)

Placek said:


> Sorry for late reply.
> The real difference is?~5mm when i put both wheels next to each other, so adequate to difference in knob height.


Thanks!


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## Carl Mega (Jan 17, 2004)

Forgive me if this is already posted but you'd see the new company's offerings from mtbr front page?

Terrene McFly 2.8 tire is do-it-all option - Mtbr.com

US tire company. Weights look good to me.


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## EC3 (Nov 16, 2016)

hotsalsa said:


> Any recommendations for a good 3.0 tire, or a 2.8 that sits a little higher? Not a fan of bridgers and Rekons do ok but I feel they drop the bb too much and already split a sidewall. Debating the NIC.


RoRon 3.0 Front
WTB Trail Boss 3.0 Rear

On my second RR as a front tire. Tread doesn't look aggressive but I haven't been able to find its limits yet. Great front tire. Really bad as a rear tire where I ride.

Just put the TB on the rear last week after reading a few replies here. Not a WTB tire fan but very happy with the tire. Replaced a Maxxis 120 tpi Rekon that was way too thin for a rear tire. The TB says it has light sidewalls but they held shape well and knobs are slightly larger than the RR. It was really solid at speed and slowly stepping through rock gardens. It has a pretty hard rubber compound so I figured it would be good in the loamy stuff but surprisingly it shined on the granite slabs too. It also was 28.875" dia. initially which noticeably helped the BB height.

Still figuring out the plus thing but can't see ever running anything smaller than 3.0's again.

BTW- running 44mm internal Derby rims.


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## idbrian (May 10, 2006)

Any new good 2.8's coming out soon. I'm still trying to find a good tire that can handle the side cuts from rocks. NN's with protetection are the best i've found yet but i would be happy with improvement. Maybe bad luck but i tried Maxxis Ikon a small hole/cut right near the rim on my first ride. I was hoping Continental Mountain Kings with Protection would be out this year in a plus. I couldn't get a sidewall cut in those if i tried. 

Best investment i made for handling all the tubeless plus tire issues i had last year were plugs. Genuine Innovations G2650 Tubeless Tire Repair Kit on Amazon. Combined with Stans it will handle the holes too big for Stans. Pretty easy too There is of course a limit to what they can handle. I've done about ten aggressive rides on the Maxxis Ikon with that plug in it.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

So I've got a Maxxis DHF and Rekon+ mounted on my scraper i45 rims. They're currently stretching out at 45psi. Both measure 70mm at the casing. The DHF is 69mm to the knobs, and the Rekon is 67mm to the knobs. Hope they stretch a bunch.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

jtaylor996 said:


> So I've got a Maxxis DHF and Rekon+ mounted on my scraper i45 rims. They're currently stretching out at 45psi. Both measure 70mm at the casing. The DHF is 69mm to the knobs, and the Rekon is 67mm to the knobs. Hope they stretch a bunch.


The Maxxis are small, like most Maxxis. My DHF has been in use a while now and it's noticeably smaller than a 2.8 Nobby Nic


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

codysoyland said:


> Just noticed the new Schwalbe Addix compound tires include a new 27.5x2.8 model of the Magic Mary.
> 
> https://www.schwalbe.com/en/offroad-reader/magic-mary.html


I'm hoping that it wasn't a typo because I cannot find the 2.8 Magic Mary at all now on that link, only the 2.6.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

GRPABT1 said:


> The Maxxis are small, like most Maxxis. My DHF has been in use a while now and it's noticeably smaller than a 2.8 Nobby Nic


Well, at 45psi (lol) on i45 rims, they both actually measure 2.8" (71mm) on the casing. The knobs on the Rekon are at like 67mm but the DHF shapes up much better with the knobs being just 1mm narrower.

However, at usable pressures it's a different story. And these tires, especially the Rekon are not optimal for this rim width, either.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Maxxis measure their tyres at maximum psi, which is why they are small. Others measure at optimum working psi.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

An update on the Kenda Havok Pros. Finally got a chance to ride them this weekend. They are 2.8 and weighed 836g and 822g. I experimented with fairly high pressures for a plus tire @22 and 23 psi. Terrain on day one was chunky granite outside Albuquerque. Firstly and most obviously, the difference in total weight from the WTB Bridgers was huge. My whole setup was different so it's hard to isolate just tire performance but so far I think they're great. The knobs are smaller but more denser than the Nobby Nics but they bite down good even at those higher pressures. Can guarantee at the speed we were riding those rocks, tires would've pinch flatted or wheels bent with the low pressures I was running before. The ride felt more solid but not bouncy and still MUCH more plush than my brothers Cannondale Trigger with 2.3s. Will continue running my bike this way.


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## Simplemind (Jul 17, 2006)

agauna said:


> An update on the Kenda Havok Pros. Finally got a chance to ride them this weekend. They are 2.8 and weighed 836g and 822g. .


Nice, would not have that tire on my radar. Could you provide a tire width and on what width rim?
Thanks


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I emailed Schwalbe about the 2.8 Magic Mary and they sent this back.

"Thank you for your message and your interest in our products.

We kindly have to excuse that there was a few mistakes with the database matching while we updated the new website for the Addix launch. Amongst other things Magic Mary was concerned.

Unfortunately we can not confirm that this tire was developed.

We kindly hope for your understanding.

Best regards

i.A Stefan Franken | Kundenservice - Vertriebsinnendienst"

God dammit.


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## codysoyland (Jul 15, 2014)

GRPABT1 said:


> I emailed Schwalbe about the 2.8 Magic Mary and they sent this back.
> 
> "Thank you for your message and your interest in our products.
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing. In my opinion, a 2.8 Magic Mary would be a popular tire given the dearth of truly aggressive mud-shedding options in 2.8" width, so I would not be surprised if it's in development. I find their wording interesting: "we can not confirm that this tire was developed." Could be due to translation, but that seems to be a "hint, hint" sort of answer.


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## GuzziBen (May 18, 2015)

Mounted up Vee Bulldozer 3.0 on my Fuse- on Nextie Jungle Fox 52.
One ride in, 8 miles- they hook up. 
The side lugs look odd, but they're working. I'm not a super-deep leaner, but I was pushing it. 
Ran 14 psi front, 13 psi rear.


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

I'm running a set Maxxis Minion DHF / Rekon+ 2.8s. Time for a new rear tire. Been happy with the setup but kind of want to experiment with other plus tires. or possibly some 2.6s... but I'm scared to lower the bottom bracket height. Maxxis is expensive and was looking at some Specialized tires. Anyone measured a Ground Control 2.6 yet? I noticed they only make 2.8's in the fast trak, butcher and slaughter..


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

i ordered a set of Terrene Chunks, light compound. these things are beefy. mounted on a 50mm internal rim, they measure a touch over 3" wide at the knobs. the knobs stick out more than the casing and the shape of the tire is still pretty round. they measure 28.75" tall at 14psi. ive aired them up to max psi to stretch out. 

i dont have calipers to measure anything precisely so youll just have to trust my tape measure and calibrated eye, lol. no gram scale either. i suck at this apparently.


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

F29Lefty said:


> I'm running a set Maxxis Minion DHF / Rekon+ 2.8s. Time for a new rear tire. Been happy with the setup but kind of want to experiment with other plus tires. or possibly some 2.6s... but I'm scared to lower the bottom bracket height. Maxxis is expensive and was looking at some Specialized tires. Anyone measured a Ground Control 2.6 yet? I noticed they only make 2.8's in the fast trak, butcher and slaughter..


I've really been liking the 2.6 Specialized Purgatory. It measures around 2.5 on i35's but way high volume - it is taller overall than my 2.8 Nobby Nic in front. I am still able to ride the Purgatory at 17psi on most my local trails and I weigh 170-175 with all my gear on. It replaced a 2.5 WTB Breakout, similar volume and width, I like the way the Purgatory rolls and breaks free better though, and it's 150 grams lighter while still having a tough casing. I definitely recommend it!


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

thanks man! i noticed they did a 2.8 butcher this year. thinking of pairing it with a 2.6 ground control or purgatory.. they are a bit heavier then the maxxis setup I'm running... I'm on the fence between just ordering another rekon to replace the rear, or trying the specs... damnit can't decide......decisions, decisions.. haha!


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

I don't think you can go wrong with either, though the 2.6 Purgatory is the exact compromise between weight and strength I was waiting for. The low weight of the Rekon makes me concerned it will flat easier. The 2.5 Breakout was bomb proof, but at 1110 grams, it was definitely heavier than I prefer for a trail bike - though it really does roll well. The 2.6 Purg is right in the middle.


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## jacksonlui (Aug 15, 2015)

The rekons are 2.8 dc are closer to 900 now. Theyve made it sturdier. They also come in the silkworm option. Its a nice fast rolling tire with decent cornering knobs. Im glad they've finally come down in price.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

i noticed you can get them around 85$ on jenson now. thats actually pretty good for a plus tire. can't beat specialized thou price wise.


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

wish they made the purg in a 2.8


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

nyrangerfan222 said:


> Has anyone tried Specialized's Butcher or Slaughter 2.8s and can give some feedback?
> 
> I'm Currently rolling mojo 3 on 741s with 2.8 DHF and DHRs and while im enjoying the added traction when going downhill, on the other hand I can definitely notice the added rolling resistance on the climbs. Trying to find a happy medium traction/rolling resistance/durability. (looking for a unicorn really i know)
> 
> ...


I'm looking for thing. haven't tried the nobby nic in a 2.8, only the 2.35 29er version.. but was never a fan of that tire. felt super drifty in corners.. i think the minion DHF is a far better tire IMO.


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## jga013 (Nov 2, 2015)

*High Roller II and Bulldozer!*

Just got back from my first ride with new 27.5x3.0 High Roller II (f) and Vee Tire Bulldozer (r). Fantastic combination. I was worried about my decision to order the HR2 after reading some reviews here about it being slow rolling and no grip unless leaned over. I had no such problems. Just one ride, but it was really good in all situations. It probably rolls a little slower than Rocket Rons or Rangers, but not bad. Much better than a Bridger, and on par with a Nobbly Nic. Or maybe its just that the Bulldozer rolls that good it makes up for the HR2. Either way I'm happy. My best tire setup by far. Previous were Bridger (f/r), 3.0 NN (f) / 3.0 RR (r), 3.0 NN (f) / 2.8 Ranger (r), and Bridger (f) / 3.0 NN (r).

I definitely prefer the 3" tires over the 2.8's. I like the volume for east coast rocks and roots. Plus the 2.8's are just too small for a bike designed for 3" tires. Too many peddle strikes and too much time ratcheting over every little root and rock. The HR2 and Dozer are a little smaller than the other 3" tires I've tried but seem to be a really good balance between not too much weight and still having good volume. Both are about 28 5/8" diameter and 2 7/8" wide.

Saturday I'll get to test them on some really rocky rooty trails. Here are a few bad cell phone pictures.


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

jga013 said:


> Just got back from my first ride with new 27.5x3.0 High Roller II (f) and Vee Tire Bulldozer (r). Fantastic combination. I was worried about my decision to order the HR2 after reading some reviews here about it being slow rolling and no grip unless leaned over. I had no such problems. Just one ride, but it was really good in all situations. It probably rolls a little slower than Rocket Rons or Rangers, but not bad. Much better than a Bridger, and on par with a Nobbly Nic. Or maybe its just that the Bulldozer rolls that good it makes up for the HR2. Either way I'm happy. My best tire setup by far. Previous were Bridger (f/r), 3.0 NN (f) / 3.0 RR (r), 3.0 NN (f) / 2.8 Ranger (r), and Bridger (f) / 3.0 NN (r).
> 
> I definitely prefer the 3" tires over the 2.8's. I like the volume for east coast rocks and roots. Plus the 2.8's are just too small for a bike designed for 3" tires. Too many peddle strikes and too much time ratcheting over every little root and rock. The HR2 and Dozer are a little smaller than the other 3" tires I've tried but seem to be a really good balance between not too much weight and still having good volume. Both are about 28 5/8" diameter and 2 7/8" wide.
> 
> ...


Good to know, I'm on nn 3.0 f/r

Looking at other options and wishing maxxis made more 3.0 options, I have run 2.8 on the rear and had the exact same experience with pedal strikes....

Not sure what I'm going to do, as stupid as it sounds I would like to keep the same brand on the bike f/r

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I also have NN 3.0 and I am quite happy with them but I would like to try something more aggressive next time. I am between DHF 2.8 but I don't really like to go to 2.8 and HR 3.0 but I am not sure if they would be aggressive enough.


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## jga013 (Nov 2, 2015)

The picture quality isn't very good so it's hard to tell, but the HR2 is far more aggressive than the NN. The knobs are 2x or more the size of the ones on the NN. Especially the side knobs. The casing is also of a sturdier construction.


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## sergio8691 (Aug 6, 2010)

gpgalanis said:


> ...would be aggressive enough.


If aggressiveness is defined as "most uncompromising grip when using proper technique" then HR is probably the most aggressive from HR-DHF-DHR trio. It does require tipping the bike to start biting.
If you want more consistent (and faster) tire then Purgatory 3.0 is excellent. I run HR 3.0 front Purg 3.0 rear - works very well.
But probably any tire with knobs is "more aggressive" the NN 3.0, which is trash. If it is the only plus tire you have used you don't know what you have been missing


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

sergio8691 said:


> If aggressiveness is defined as "most uncompromising grip when using proper technique" then HR is probably the most aggressive from HR-DHF-DHR trio. It does require tipping the bike to start biting.
> If you want more consistent (and faster) tire then Purgatory 3.0 is excellent. I run HR 3.0 front Purg 3.0 rear - works very well.
> But probably any tire with knobs is "more aggressive" the NN 3.0, which is trash. If it is the only plus tire you have used you don't know what you have been missing


Yeah it's been my only one! I'll probably feel like I'm on rails on a new set up

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

From what I can gather maxxis doesn't really have any rear tire options for 3.0, sigh


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

Most probably once my NN 3.0 will need to be changed I will go for DHF 2.8 front and rear.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

rad3144 said:


> From what I can gather maxxis doesn't really have any rear tire options for 3.0, sigh
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


this is true and why i went with Terrene Chunks. i wanted something pretty aggressive and i wanted to stay matchy matchy (not a decision based in reality).

im not concerned with going super fast on singletrack, ill never be a super fast rider. i am concerned with traction over roots, rocks and when the bikes points down. the innova gniess i have are great at going straight and even ok with it comes to something resembling a slightly downhill (like, a pine cone might roll down it maybe) but other than that, nope.


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## sergio8691 (Aug 6, 2010)

I personally agree that Maxxis make the best tires around - but there is no law against mixing brands . For vacation in the Pacific Northwest I am considering using HR 3.0 both front and rear - but for dry and hardpacked trails of Colorado Purgatory rear is just better choice... I have never liked Purgatory in skinny 2.3 size - but 3.0 Grid is good. Just use Orange Seal instead of Stan - Stan is seeping through the sidewalls.


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## F29Lefty (Apr 10, 2014)

Im sure this has been asked before, but what tire rolls better... Minion DHF or HR2?


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## Bumba (Jul 22, 2016)

Has anyone used both HR2 3.0 and Surly Dirt Wizard 3.0? How does the DW compare to HR2? 

Seems like HR2s aren't available in Europe and I would like to find an aggressive tire in 3" size. I don't like the idea to lower my SJ6fattie BB even lower with 2.8" HR2/DHF.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

from what ive been able to gather, the DW measures out to 2.75" and the HR2 3.0 seems to measure a true 3.0". people generally like the traction of the DW but nearly everyone complains about the weight. i dont hear much about punctures or sidewall problems. the HR2 is a maxxis tire, so itll be reliable. both are aggressive, both will hold up to abuse. HR2 is expensive. 

the terrene chunk is an alternative. it measures out slightly wider than 3" at the knobs on an i45 rim. its very aggressive.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

*3.0 Mud Tires*



gpgalanis said:


> Hi guys. What is the best 3.0 tire for winter conditions and especially wet and muddy terrain? My new bike came with Chronicles and I am not sure that they are the best tire for winter.


For that you'd want:

*Soft compound rubber*, for grip on wet surfaces
*Tall knobs* to penetrate the muck
*Wide spaced knobs* to clear mud
*Tough casing* to allow lower pressure, to help get as much tire on the ground around wet rocks and roots


If you want to stick with 3.0 tires, I can only think of 3 models:

Surly *Dirt Wizard*
Maxis *HR II* Max Terra Exoskin
Terrene *Chunky* Tough
Schwalbe *Nobby Nic* Apec Trailstar Apex (while it's still available)

The first two run a bit small for a 3.0, but of course better than a 2.8 from the same brand. Don't know about the sizing of the Terrene Chunk

The Maxis has the thinnest casing. Schwalbe's casing is also thin for most of it, but it has a reenforcement above the bead, so you can run lower pressure without pinch flatting, but it will still squirm around during hard cornering.

The Terrene probably has the hardest rubber compound.

The Nobby Nic has far fewer knobs along the edge(more 'gap' than knob), so it won't 'carve' a turn like the others. But, if it's really sloppy and you are not leaning the bike over so far and riding slower anyway, that might not matter.

If you can deal with the lower bottom bracket (might actually be nice for stability!) there are several 2.8's, that would also offer extra mud clearance:


Maxxis DHF and HR II
Specialized Butcher Grid


Dirt Wizard and Nobby Nic(center and Right):


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

PHeller said:


> Moving from Specialized GRID Butcher/Slaughter 2.6 (for sale) to Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.6.
> 
> Hoping the Rocket Ron is fast rolling, tough (enough) and lightweight.


If you got the Snakeskin Schwalbes they should be good. Bike Magazin (germany) has a tire test recently, and the *Snakeskin* Nobby Nic beat the *GRID* Purgatory for puncture resistance.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Go out on pavement and do figure eight, cuties and hard corners, find the lowest pressure that they don't squirm. That should be plenty to prevent them squirming on real trails and if they are smooth, you aren't worrying about punch flatting either.


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## sergio8691 (Aug 6, 2010)

Tjaard said:


> The first two run a bit small for a 3.0


That's not exactly true. High Roller 3.0 is not as wide as some other 3.0 tire (though still pretty close to 3.0) - but it is quite tall. It's significantly taller than Purgatory 3.0 and is probably taller than horrible abomination of tire called Nobby Nick 3.0.


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

xblitzkriegx said:


> this is true and why i went with Terrene Chunks. i wanted something pretty aggressive and i wanted to stay matchy matchy (not a decision based in reality).
> 
> im not concerned with going super fast on singletrack, ill never be a super fast rider. i am concerned with traction over roots, rocks and when the bikes points down. the innova gniess i have are great at going straight and even ok with it comes to something resembling a slightly downhill (like, a pine cone might roll down it maybe) but other than that, nope.


Have you been able to put many miles on the Chunks yet? I'm leaning heavily toward these as my next tires for the Hayduke, but there are few real-world reviews out there.


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## RockyMntMonkey (Dec 13, 2015)

I've been running the Slaughter/Butcher 2.8 GRID combo on my Niner Ros 9 and I'm a little torn on them. On one hand they are suuuper durable, I've pinged off rocks I though would have punctured but they held up. They also have insane amounts of grip, it's slightly irrational how much traction there is. I've leaned my bike over in sand, loose rocks, ect and haven't felt any slip. These things will make your downhills a lot faster!

Now on the other hand there is the rolling resistance and weight. I live/ride the Denver front range (aka long rocky climbs) and I also like to attempt the occasional epic 40-50 miler plus the mellower XC trails and these things definitely take some effort to move. On the climbs their weight is really evident but so is their traction so you can clean features if you've got a low gear or lance armstrong's legs. On the flats they don't hold speed basically at all so you'll definitely get a workout.

TL;DR- Super fast downhill, super durable, heavy, don't hold speed on climbs/flats


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

RockyMntMonkey said:


> I've been running the Slaughter/Butcher 2.8 GRID combo on my Niner Ros 9 and I'm a little torn on them. On one hand they are suuuper durable, I've pinged off rocks I though would have punctured but they held up. They also have insane amounts of grip, it's slightly irrational how much traction there is. I've leaned my bike over in sand, loose rocks, ect and haven't felt any slip. These things will make your downhills a lot faster!
> 
> Now on the other hand there is the rolling resistance and weight. I live/ride the Denver front range (aka long rocky climbs) and I also like to attempt the occasional epic 40-50 miler plus the mellower XC trails and these things definitely take some effort to move. On the climbs their weight is really evident but so is their traction so you can clean features if you've got a low gear or lance armstrong's legs. On the flats they don't hold speed basically at all so you'll definitely get a workout.
> 
> TL;DR- Super fast downhill, super durable, heavy, don't hold speed on climbs/flats


I have the same bike with plus wheels and in any situation that the plus wheels don't work well for I run my 29er wheelset, they'll never be as fast or roll as well on Long rides or more XC type Terrain


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

My experience is the opposite but I avoided the massive knob plus tires. It's like running massive knob slow rolling fat bike tires. All about rolling resistance. I'm running 3.0 Ranger rear and 3.0 trail boss in the front and they out perform my 29er in every way except long climbs where the added weight comes into play, which is partially my oem wheels which are heavy. If I raced xc then I could see 29er being better but for my riding there's just no beating plus bikes.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## RockyMntMonkey (Dec 13, 2015)

Does anyone have some experience with the Specialized Fast Trak 2.8"? I'm looking for a faster rolling plus tire for general trail use


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## MattMay (Dec 24, 2013)

SPAM: I've got two Ikon+ (27.5x2.8) tires with all of 8 miles on them for sale. PM if interested. 2017 Maxxis Ikon 27.5x2.8 (2) - Buy and Sell Mountain Bikes and Accessories


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## joecx (Aug 17, 2013)

sergio8691 said:


> If aggressiveness is defined as "most uncompromising grip when using proper technique" then HR is probably the most aggressive from HR-DHF-DHR trio. It does require tipping the bike to start biting.
> If you want more consistent (and faster) tire then Purgatory 3.0 is excellent. I run HR 3.0 front Purg 3.0 rear - works very well.
> But probably any tire with knobs is "more aggressive" the NN 3.0, which is trash. If it is the only plus tire you have used you don't know what you have been missing


You know Serg a lot of guys actually like the Nics and as a mud tire the staggered knob pattern of the 3.0 works very well so your constant trashing of it is undeserved.

As they say,like a##holes everybody has an opinion.


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## GuzziBen (May 18, 2015)

Met Tim from Terrene at Copper Harbor Enduro, talked tires with him. They look the business, and they aren't trying to do anything but make competitive (financially and performing) tires. 
I won a pair of 29er Chunk hoops as swag, now I need to build more wheels!


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I just got a PB on 3" NN front 11psi and 3" RR rear 13psi first time out on them, faster then any time on other plus tires or 29"er wheel set. I was not feeling particularly strong that day either. I think the Rocket Ron was much faster rolling then the recon+ it replaced. 
I was getting tired of pedal strikes on the 2.8 Recon and wanted max efficiency and cushiness for big Colorado climbs and descents. RR maybe had a tad more slippage climbing steeps but I was hitting the technical sections with more speed. The RR was brand new and possibly slick from the mold release agent. Seemed better the further I went. First impressions are good but, more testing required.
I LOVE PLUS TIRES for rocky trails up and down to take the edge off everything. I got the biggest, 2.6" NN's, for my 29er wheel set for that reason. Once I felt the moon buggy cushiness and efficiency of high volume tires I'll never go back. I wish maxxis made their tires FATTER. Anyone know of other extra high volume 29" tires? I may have to try a terrain Chunk as a 3" front next???


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

Smithhammer said:


> Have you been able to put many miles on the Chunks yet? I'm leaning heavily toward these as my next tires for the Hayduke, but there are few real-world reviews out there.


im not sure how much help ill be, but here goes.

they weigh 940g (932g and 948g measured - kitchen scale), measure just over 3" wide and 28.75" on an i45 rim, aired up to 16psi. they are extremely round in profile despite a 45mm internal rim. i mounted them on i50s just for fun and they were a full 3 1/4" wide and still rounded. they went on the rims easily enough. i was able to slip the tire on both the i45 and i50 rim with my bare hands. it was a little tough but far from impossible. i had to use a tube to seat the beads, then deflate and slip it out. it inflated quite easily though. without sealant, the tire wouldnt hold air overnight. with orange seal, it sealed up nicely with hardly any bead seepage. theyll hold air a week at a time now.

they are slower in a straight line compared to an XC oriented tread pattern. they are LOUD on a smoother trail. reminds me of super swampers on a truck if you can relate. they stop exceedingly well. you can feel them dig in the trail vs the xc tire i had before before that would kind of skip over the surface when i REALLY needed to stop. they grip rocks/roots excellent. i have climbed a few things i didnt think was possible and held traction on inclines steep enough cause me to start to loop out even when i was hovering over the nose of the seat and leaned forwards. i can lean the bike over in corners without the fear of washing out. kind of scary, actually. the first few times, i felt like i was laying the bike down practically.

i think for me, chunks f/r is overkill. i think a chunk up front is a smart choice. one in the back is probably overkill for a lot if trails but its been a godsend for me thus far in colorado due to the amount of rocks ive contended with.

id suggest the tough casing in the rear. i put a hole in the sidewall when bouncing/plowing through some larger rocks. admittedly, i had poor line as it was my first run down the trail. the orange seal did its job and hasnt leaked since.

these tires offered me the confidence to try things i wouldnt have before, and i think thats the most important thing a mtb tire should do, inspire confidence. i would buy the chunk again without hesitation.

how was that?


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## ReelMan (Jun 1, 2017)

I, too, am interested in a mid-plus. Something around 2.6 front and rear for hardpack, loose and granite. I'm utterly confused at this point as to what the inner and outer diameter should be on new lightweight carbon wheelset.

What is the collective experience with 2.6 front/rear, or is it better to have more roll in the back with a 2.4? Experience with CF wheels for these sizes?


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

ReelMan said:


> I, too, am interested in a mid-plus. Something around 2.6 front and rear for hardpack, loose and granite. I'm utterly confused at this point as to what the inner and outer diameter should be on new lightweight carbon wheelset.
> 
> What is the collective experience with 2.6 front/rear, or is it better to have more roll in the back with a 2.4? Experience with CF wheels for these sizes?


I'm extremely happy with LightBicycle 31.6mm inner width rims and the nobby nics.

I had to shave 2mm from the center knobs on the rear for clearance, but the profile at that width is great. I think 35mm inner would also be good.

Better roll is a pressure thing to me. I find I add about 2psi in the rear only and it almost feels like a road bike, but doesn't give up any traction. This was true before I shaved the knobs, too.

These fit my needs perfectly. But if I wanted more traction, I'd go back to B+.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

This Schwalbe tech info on rolling resistance is GREAT, https://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_info/rolling_resistance
The real downside, for me, of big tires is their weight. Specifically, their rotational mass, which adds up to about 3X the weight of any other non rotating component on your bike. That is where carbon rims are nice to off set the heavy plus tires. I felt like an Egyptian rolling a pyramid on a log, up a hill, with my stock i45 Scrappers and Bridger tires. Acceleration in steep climbing technical spots was rough, tough to get those fatties rolling up some big step from almost a stop. 
I had buyer's remorse for ever buying that bike, till I got a DT Swiss 29" i22.5 wheel set and turned the Ponyrustler into a Horse thief (Salsa). Felt like I got a new lowest gear and was Superman! That kept me happy for a season, till winter came and I needed plus for the snow. Black thursday Nextie sale got me i43 27+ carbon hoops that took 5 weeks to arrive from China, then built up from my old scraper's hubs and CX spokes. Now the Ponyrustler is a magic carpet up and down whatever. Incidentally, Salsa outfitted their next years Ponyrustler with carbon rims and 3" NN's for their '17 edition.






I think 2.6"ers on i30 carbon rims are perfect. That's what I run with my 29er, 2.6" NN. Too wide a rim is not only more weight but more side wall exposure, not to mention rock strikes on the rim if your plowing loose chunks. i.e. white ranch, becher hill. In retrospect, I would have bought i35-i40 rims for a 3" tire, not my 43i . . . 
I just wish they made a RR 2.6 in 29er for my rear tire, they feel FAST. I'm sold on schwalbe for now since I've found the highest actual tire volumes, great rolling resistance, decent side walls with snakeskins, good traction and the lightest weights. I have several maxxis tires . . . they do wear better, are the most popular . . . 
Yes i'm rambling now . . . but if fat tires actually do have less rolling resistance in rough terrain AND most of your weight is actually on your back tire, would it not stand to reason to have the fatter tire in rear absorbing everything and slightly narrower/lighter super aggressive treads on the front? I know i'll feel some flames for that. The world used to be flat. . .just thinking out loud. 
PS Only inside diameter matters on a rim as far as tires go.


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## jtaylor996 (Jul 8, 2016)

I think 29/2.6 on a pony rustler is about optimal, if you can deal with the clearance on the seat stay arch. Makes me thing 29+ would be sweet, but then you get a deader feeling longer chainstay bike. So if you can squeeze it into the B+ bike you gain a bunch in nimbility.

Someday I will do carbon for the B+ wheels. Right now I've got a 2.8 DHF/Rekon+ combo on there, but that would be a lot more optimal on i40 carbon rims. Maybe next year. They really do have more traction than the 2.6, and it's an obvious difference, but I have better technique now, and feel that I can get away with less traction and then get speed gains of 29" wheels. It's no longer a "just throw it at rocks and go" bike, but being 3# lighter sure is nice


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

Karlewski, the difference between a terrene chunk 29x2.3 and a 27.5x3 is approx 60g. 880g vs 940g. 

A Maxxis HR2 27.5x2.4 vs a 27.5x3 is 65g. 915 vs 990. A 29x2.3 is 920g.

I think people are blowing the weight of plus tires out of proportion. They weigh more but it's not significant enough to make that much of a difference. You could add a little less tire sealant and make up the difference. 


If you're worried about a plus tires sidewall, read my review above. The chunk is VERY wide at the knobs. The sidewall isn't even close to bulging, even on i50 rims.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Truer words have never been spoken regarding the tire weight situation with plus tires.

But FC has been going off lately about it so many think it must be true. Ya when you compare xc tires at 600-700 grams there is a difference vs knobby tires of the same size. So plus is going to weigh a tad more. It's insane.

And as long as people don't go wider rims than the "inaccurate" tire sizes are meant for, sidewalls aren't an issue. Like maxxis tires. Size is over rated so people go too wide of rims and sidewalls are sticking out (and then measure true to size at the sidewall which is bad for everyone).

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I know you guys are right, the numbers don't lie. Having the rim on 27.5 closer to the hub, less lever arm, must help too. I think the boat anchor Bridgers and scraper rims left a deep impression on me. Getting a personal best on plus tires is also testament and, there was 50% climbing. 
My rocket Ron 3" is truly rocket fast and it only weighs 830gm for a 3". It was way faster accelerating on the downs and holding speed everywhere today scared/surprised me but, I did find myself sliding out on slick roots and moist rock more on steep climbs. 
The verdict for NN FRONT AND RR REAR is an all around winner for easy trails i.e. Buffalo creek but a trade off on technical climbing stuff. Likely still the fastest but less gratifying to clear fewer climbing challenges. I'm going to focus on technique, hopping bouncing and weight transitions to see if I can make the most of the RR during climbs. Breaking was worse but, I mainly use the front tire for that so nonissue.
I'll slap on the 29" wheelset with 2.6 NN's for more sustained technical adventures. 
The new schalbe adix rubber has my curiosity. I'd like to try a "soft" 29 Hans damph in front??? Wish it came in 2.6".

Im thinking the chunk 27 by 3" for a rear come winter. What would be best for snow and some mud? I've got the ice figured out short of studs, while on it set up to never alter your vector and stay with the fall line! Or brace for impact, pads keep me warm in the winter, lol.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

youll want skinnier tired for mud. they sink down in the slop and bite into the layer underneath. that being said, the chunk is ok in the mud. ive dealt with mud when crossing creeks and it clears out well enough. it flings mud EVERYWHERE the second you move faster than 1mph. the center channel stays clean and the only build up occurs between the main & transition knobs. ive read that the HR2 does ok but will pack up. no feedback on DWs. i imagine theyre similar to the HR2.

for snow/ice: Wrathchild | 45NRTH

AFAIK, there are only 3 decently aggresive plus tires: Maxxis HR2, Terenne Chunk, and the Surly DW. none of the others come close.


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## grrrah (Mar 26, 2004)

SB666 said:


> I've really been liking the 2.6 Specialized Purgatory. It measures around 2.5 on i35's but way high volume - it is taller overall than my 2.8 Nobby Nic in front. I am still able to ride the Purgatory at 17psi on most my local trails and I weigh 170-175 with all my gear on. It replaced a 2.5 WTB Breakout, similar volume and width, I like the way the Purgatory rolls and breaks free better though, and it's 150 grams lighter while still having a tough casing. I definitely recommend it!


This answers my question, but are there other known tires, either 2.6 or 2.8 that measure narrow (close to 2.6), but are taller (close to 2.8 or more)?


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

Mounted up a new Minion DHF and HRII today....seriously impressive traction, climbing, descending, whatever....:eekster:


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## GuzziBen (May 18, 2015)

A week on Vee Bulldozer 3.0

Rode in varied conditions, from mud to rock and everything in between. The 'dozers rock. Running tubeless on 52mm rims at 14 psi with Orange Seal, no flats- no punctures noted. Plenty of opportunity, lots of sharp rock around. 
As far as mud, they clear themselves well and the large side lugs keep digging in. 
These may not be the lightest and fastest, but they are aggressive and tough without deep center lugs to slow you down.


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## stumpynerd (Oct 8, 2012)

RockyMntMonkey said:


> I've been running the Slaughter/Butcher 2.8 GRID combo on my Niner Ros 9 and I'm a little torn on them. On one hand they are suuuper durable, I've pinged off rocks I though would have punctured but they held up. They also have insane amounts of grip, it's slightly irrational how much traction there is. I've leaned my bike over in sand, loose rocks, ect and haven't felt any slip. These things will make your downhills a lot faster!
> 
> Now on the other hand there is the rolling resistance and weight. I live/ride the Denver front range (aka long rocky climbs) and I also like to attempt the occasional epic 40-50 miler plus the mellower XC trails and these things definitely take some effort to move. On the climbs their weight is really evident but so is their traction so you can clean features if you've got a low gear or lance armstrong's legs. On the flats they don't hold speed basically at all so you'll definitely get a workout.
> 
> TL;DR- Super fast downhill, super durable, heavy, don't hold speed on climbs/flats


I had similar experiences with butchers on my 26er. I ride in front range and south eastern Wyoming. My favorite tire is the purgs. Seem to roll a bit quicker and grip better in loose over hard pack than the butchers.


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## Rumblefish2010 (Mar 29, 2012)

codysoyland said:


> Just noticed the new Schwalbe Addix compound tires include a new 27.5x2.8 model of the Magic Mary.
> 
> https://www.schwalbe.com/en/offroad-reader/magic-mary.html


I do not see any 2.8 from the models of Magic M? Only 2.6??


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## codysoyland (Jul 15, 2014)

Rumblefish2010 said:


> I do not see any 2.8 from the models of Magic M? Only 2.6??


Read the follow-up posts in this thread. It was a mistake on Schwalbe's website.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TxTrailhead (Dec 16, 2012)

2.8 vs. 3 -

Hey guys,

I'm currently riding a 2016 Scott Genius 720 Plus up in the PNW, I bought this bike slightly used from a guide service that had put 3" Rocket Rons on vs. the 2.8" tires that come stock on this bike. I have an opportunity to get a deal on an Ikon+'/Rekon+ combo, do you think this would be an upgrade on the current setup? I'm wondering if it would be as versatile, I'd imagine it would give the bike a bit more of a playful feel. Also should I be looking at upgrading the stock rims as well? They are the Scott Syncros 40mm.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

For the guys running DHF or HR do you have the dual compound or the 3C? I can only find the dual compound and I am not sure whether I should buy them or wait for the 3C to be available?


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

gpgalanis said:


> For the guys running DHF or HR do you have the dual compound or the 3C? I can only find the dual compound and I am not sure whether I should buy them or wait for the 3C to be available?


I'm running both in the 3C/120 tpi versions. They are excellent.

Your LBS shouldn't have any problem ordering them - mine had them in less than a week.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

codysoyland said:


> Read the follow-up posts in this thread. It was a mistake on Schwalbe's website.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Actually they still have Rock Razor and Magic Mary as having 27+ Apex speedgrip models. They need to clear this up I am waiting for those tires if they aren't coming I'll buy Dhf instead


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## Bumba (Jul 22, 2016)

Smithhammer said:


> I'm running both in the 3C/120 tpi versions. They are excellent.
> 
> Your LBS shouldn't have any problem ordering them - mine had them in less than a week.


That is a whole different story in Europe. No 3" HR available at all, 3C DHFs and 2.8" HRs are out of stock in basically everywhere


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I've been riding my NN3" and RR3" a lot lately and come to very clear conclusions. I've had a few good crashes while attempting steep technical rock climbs and spinning out with my rear mounted Rocket Ron. Don't you just love those slow-motion falls off tall rocks. It hurt so much, I switched out my wheelset to 29"x2.6" NN's and was clearing almost everything.
I put the 3 inch tire/27.5+ wheelset back on today for a big ride at Buffalo Creek. The NN fr./RR rear 3" tires just loved those conditions!!! I was floating over loose gravel/sandy trails super efficiently. The scattered course granite slab and rock climbs were grippy enough for the Rocket Rons to perform well, especially if you never slow down, lol. 
On the bike park style decent over tight twisty loose gravel sections of little scraggy trail I did have some rather abrupt losses of traction with the rocket Ron rear. Right at the beginning of the twisty sections my rear end broke loose and I spun around about 120°. I kept thinking it was going to hook up but it took forever! I thought it was going to be a yard sale for sure. I started unclipping the inside foot on sketchy turns to post up if necessary and it worked sweet. I felt a lot safer in drifting turns! I never used to do that, I always thought that was a flat pedal down hill guy move. I didn't used to run a dropper post either, lol. I did see one rather bloody crash :eekster: , he had a worn out front tire... Anyway, the plus tire set up I was running felt like an excellent cross country / minimal technical set up for me with lots of efficient speed and comfort, but I'll definitely be using something way more aggressive for the rough Rocky mountain climbs yet to come now that the snow is melting fast. Different tools for different jobs I guess but, it does suck to have that draggy, chunky tire on the long steep climbs, till ya really need it! I'm gonna put the chunky tires on my 29er wheelset just to keep my bottom bracket up for BIG CHUNK.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

Jensen got the Magic Mary 27+ 2.6-2.8 multiple compounds up for sale.
Also have Rock Razor 2.6 listed. Yay 😎


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I would really like to see a photo next to the 2.35 version and also their actual dimensions.


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## fracaxis (May 2, 2006)

Kevin Van Deventer said:


> Jensen got the Magic Mary 27+ 2.6-2.8 multiple compounds up for sale.
> Also have Rock Razor 2.6 listed. Yay


Have any real weights on those? Definitely one of my favorite combos in the 29x2.35 variety. Would totally jump on a set of 27.5+ for my other wheels if not too porky.


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## Jukahia (Jul 8, 2015)

*Minion DHR 2,8 flat after 3 hours...*

Are the Maxxis dhr 2,8 exo dual tires really this bad...? Ordered one two weeks ago. I have now ride two times with [email protected] (3hours) and today on second ride I got flat. After one hour, rideing relatively easy Enduro tracks. Tire has total 3 holes on side, right where side begins... 
I have Id 45mm carbon hookless wheels and I use 20-18psi pressure. As the front DW on same wheel has already taken beating in two races & lots of hard rideing and it's in great condition!





























Will se if it's going to hold as tubeless tomorrow.. I left it overnight with tube inside on an original mondraker wheel. Dhr now has total six patches two/hole (in&out)

I think mainly as these are skinny ass small plus tires one should try only to assembly these on narrower wheels... and use max pressure to avoid them to twist under wheels when cornering ... this would hopefully avoid hitting skinny ass sides to rocks when bouncing like crazy without traction on trails.

Do you think these are all the same or should I try to warranty it...


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## SB666 (Aug 12, 2014)

You might actually be experiencing these punctures due to too much air pressure... Less air would let the tire flex around square or sharp edges more. I don't know what you weight, but on an i45 rim I would probably be running these at no higher that 16psi - I weigh 175 with all my gear on


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## Steel Calf (Feb 5, 2010)

Jukahia said:


> I think mainly as these are skinny ass small plus tires one should try only to assembly these on narrower wheels


45mm rims may already be too wide for 2.8 tires, exposing the sidewalls too much and making them prone to damage (remember the WTB Trailblazer 2.8 + WTB Scrapper i45 combo!)

Scott specs 2.8" tires on many bikes since 2015 and while they initially started of with 40-45mm rims they eventually have downsized rim width to 35mm on their 2018 lineup


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## drew840 (Mar 4, 2013)

That's interesting to hear that about Scott bikes. I previously had a 2.5 tire on i35 rim and it scraped really bad. 

Just started running 2.8 tires on i40 rims and I don't think I will have an issue with scraping, at least not anymore than any other setup I have run. My 2.8 tires are Maxxis Rekons - only two rides on them so far but I really like the combination of traction and that I don't feel a lot of rolling weight, not much resistance like tires with bigger knobs. I'm running them on front and back right now.


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## Jukahia (Jul 8, 2015)

If I remember it correctly Maxxis stated on DHR 2,8 package that min. Id. 39mm rims.

Here it's on I 40 rim with tube







I would say that sides are still outer than knobs..


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## k1creeker (Jul 30, 2005)

I've run a bunch of 27.5x2.8 tires and one 3.0 (Surly DW) on my Pivot Mach 429. I'm currently running the 2.8 Nobby Nic Apex and am luke warm on them. They offer a whole lot more sidewall support than any Maxxis I've run. 

But, I've been curious to know more about 2.6 sizing. Are these typically built with shorter sidewalls like a "traditional 27.5" or the taller sidewalls found on the plus sized tires? I'm assuming the former so regular 27.5 frames can be retrofitted. I'd like to try out some 2.6's but am concerned about dropping the BB height even further.

Any thoughts?


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## bogeydog (Apr 13, 2015)

I found the 2.6s are almost 1/2 shorter than 2.8s 

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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

I hate the sidewall exposed like that. IMO that's a tyre design problem where the tread area is too small for the carcass size.



k1creeker said:


> But, I've been curious to know more about 2.6 sizing. Are these typically built with shorter sidewalls like a "traditional 27.5" or the taller sidewalls found on the plus sized tires? I'm assuming the former so regular 27.5 frames can be retrofitted. I'd like to try out some 2.6's but am concerned about dropping the BB height even further.


They're quite progressive - for example NN + RR 2.6" are definitely taller than the big Schwalbe 2.35 (i.e. MM), but not as big as their 2.8s. Very much a half-way point. That seems to mostly be about bead-to-bead measurement, so the width and height go mostly hand-in-hand.

If you don't want to drop BB then yeah I'm not sure going 2.6" would be a great idea - why do you want to? Also something to keep in mind - related to the above puncture discussion - some of the 2.6s also have bad carcass/tread coverage, others are fine. NN 2.6" IMO doesn't belong on a particularly wide rim - i29 and the sidewall is out past the tread! A RR 2.6" however has the tread ~2mm wider than sidewall on that same rim. It's not consistent.


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## mglder (Dec 8, 2015)

My 2.6 NN on an i29 rim doesn't have the sidewall sticking out further than the outer most knobs. Even at high pressures.

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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

The DHF/HRII combo continues to seriously impress me. I've been riding the hell out of these tires on all manner of loose, rocky stuff and they eat it for breakfast. I've had some bad sidewall hits on jagged rocks and they've laughed it off, when many other tires likely would have left me digging out a tube to put in. I'm carrying speed through things I used to have to feather the brakes on, with no sign of these tires cutting loose. Tubeless setup on Scraper i40s was a piece of cake. After a month of abuse, I'm having a hard time imagining running anything else.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

What are their dimensions after a month use?


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

gpgalanis said:


> What are their dimensions after a month use?


I don't own calipers, but somewhere in the nether region between 2.7 - 2.8 - phücking awesome?


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

Thank you. What tires did you have before?

For me the DHF - DHR2 are really no brainer but I am afraid that if I downsize from 3.0 I will have much more pedal strikes so I am still reluctant to do it.

I am currently looking at Dirt Wizard 3.0 but unfortunately they are not available so I guess I will have to wait a bit more.

Of course there are other options as well (Terrene Chunk, Duro Crux etc) but I am still undecided. The Terrene Chunk seem like a really good option but they are quite expensive.


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

Yeah, the Chunk was on my short list as well, and looks like another good option for a more aggressive tire. I usually see them listed for less $$ than the Maxxis options. 

Previously I was running Trail Boss/Ranger combos for a while. I suppose the DHF/HRII might have lowered my height slightly, but I also put a taller fork on at the same time, which likely have negated any loss in height. Regardless, I can't say I've noticed any difference in the real world. And the improvement in traction and handling has been huge.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

So despite my hesitation to downsize I have just ordered a pair of DHF and hopefully I won't regret it.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

the DW measures more like 2.75-2.8. its a very sturdy but heavy tire. 

the terrene chunk is the same price as any of maxxis's 2.8-3.0 offerings and weighs 50g less in 120tpi and is the same in 60tpi. 

if you ride somewhere it's predominately rocky/rooty/moist/slick, the chunk will work perfectly. its a slower rolling tire as evident from the tread pattern, but itll grip like no ones business. i run the 650x3.0 chunk front and rear. i would only trade them for HR2s, maybe not even then.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Kevin Van Deventer said:


> Jensen got the Magic Mary 27+ 2.6-2.8 multiple compounds up for sale.
> Also have Rock Razor 2.6 listed. Yay 😎


This is interesting after Schwalbe themselves told me the 2.8 Magic Mary wasn't coming. I'm totally ordering one on pay day this week.


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## fugsworth (Feb 28, 2015)

Has anyone compared the height(diameter) of the 3.0 HRII vs the 2.8 DHF or DHRII ?


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## defy1 (Jul 9, 2017)

I have a pair of NN 2.6 on the way...anyone tried those ? vs 2.8 tyres?
I want to reduce my rolling resistance but retain a little bit the plus size feel and grip


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

GRPABT1 said:


> This is interesting after Schwalbe themselves told me the 2.8 Magic Mary wasn't coming. I'm totally ordering one on pay day this week.


Be aware they have it listed as shipping in 2-3 weeks so probably not in stock yet.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I have the NN 2.6" in 29er flavor and I love them. I'm running a Trailstar up front and a pacestar in back. Excellent all-around tire in my IMHO. Definitely retains much of the cushy ride characteristics. Darn good traction and respectable rolling resistance as well. I'm pretty sure I'll be buying them again, which will be a first for me with any tire. I did chew through the rear pretty quick though, I'll get the new Addixs speed grip for the rear next time and keep a trail star up front.


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

*Maxxis Rekon & High Roller 2 2.8s*

Off to Spain for 3 weeks where riding will be very different to UK, with long rocky climbs and descents so i've treated my Mojo to a new pair of shoes for the trip: HR2 (front) and Rekon (Rear) 2.8.

havent ridden yet but hoping to get short ride in tomorrow before we leave.

Sizing wise, fitted tubeless to my Derby 40mm rims the HR2 (15psi) comes up at 2.8" spot on and the the Rekon (16psi) is 2.6" pretty much on the nail too.

More excited about the HR2 up front which replaces a NN, but i'm not as confident in the rekon so i'll be taking an NN with me just in case. Will update with ride report when i have done some miles.


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

I run hr 2's front and rear, it's an excellent tire 


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

Damn that HR looks sweet. Any chance you can measure overall diameter for me please?

I'm interested to hear how the Rekon goes for you. I ride in rocky stuff all of the time and struggle with rear tyres holding together - NN 2.6 SS couldn't cope. I want something tough but fast rolling (dry, so the rocks have tonnes of grip).


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

My recon 2.8 rear tire held up great but, not the awesome rolling resistance I hoped for but not bad. I now run a rocket Ron 3.0 inch and it lives up to its name but not great traction, I've spun out on solid rock too many times. Definitely more of an XC tire even in the 3".


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

I've read on here somewhere that the 3.0 Rocket Ron has the smallest knobs of all Rocket Rons. I have 2.6 and 2.8 Rocket Rons and find the grip better than I initially expected, at least for some of my riding - it's the strength (or lack thereof) of the casing that is my main gripe.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

Karlewski said:


> My recon 2.8 rear tire held up great but, not the awesome rolling resistance I hoped for but not bad. I now run a rocket Ron 3.0 inch and it lives up to its name but not great traction, I've spun out on solid rock too many times. Definitely more of an XC tire even in the 3".


I run Rekon 2.8s for wet, sloppy conditions and they are absolutely phenomenal in the traction department. They make me excited to ride when my 29s would have me dreading the experience. I ride mostly trail /technical fwiw.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Kevin Van Deventer said:


> Be aware they have it listed as shipping in 2-3 weeks so probably not in stock yet.


Just placed my order. Willing to wait as I just fitted a new Nobby Nic. I get the feeling though that it's another clerical/advertising error and I'll get a disappointing email eventually.


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

phreeky said:


> Damn that HR looks sweet. Any chance you can measure overall diameter for me please?
> 
> I'm interested to hear how the Rekon goes for you. I ride in rocky stuff all of the time and struggle with rear tyres holding together - NN 2.6 SS couldn't cope. I want something tough but fast rolling (dry, so the rocks have tonnes of grip).


Hi Mate, went out for an hour last night, bit of rooty singletrack and a few downhill runs, so my ive not much to report on yet, but initial impressions coming from NN and RR 2.8s was an unsurprising increase in grip at the front and the reckon seems to run somewhere between the nn and rr in terms of rolling speed on the back. The most noticeable difference in feel was stiffness of tyre walls. where the scwhalbes feel much more molded to the terrain the maxxis feel slightly less connected if that makes sense. I'm going to drop them a couple of psi on the next run. I'm not saying this was a negative for the maxxis it was just different.

The biggest surprise came from a look at strava when i got home, because i'd pr'd both my favourite downhill runs and 3 of the flatter singletrack sections. All of which had times set on my old evil following. This was quite a shock because i thought i was riding both slower and more tentatively on new tyres. I only did 12 miles so i'm excited to see how they go over 20-25 miles and on trip to spain where the trail conditions are much harsher with lots of rocks both sharpe and wet plus more flat out fast. (should be a real test of the rekon's durability. i'll update again in a few weeks time

in the meantime i measured the diameters and the hr is 73.5 cm and the rekon just under 73cm. Hope this helps but let me know if there's anything else specific you're after. Oh and the tyres seem to be readily available now in the uk at £85 each which is about £20
a tyre more expensive than scwhalbe and does seem very expensive unless they last considerably longer.


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## rschultz101 (Oct 5, 2009)

wanted duro tires in 27.5 3.25 in the us online order. can't find any
crus , miner


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

phreeky said:


> Damn that HR looks sweet. Any chance you can measure overall diameter for me please?
> 
> I'm interested to hear how the Rekon goes for you. I ride in rocky stuff all of the time and struggle with rear tyres holding together - NN 2.6 SS couldn't cope. I want something tough but fast rolling (dry, so the rocks have tonnes of grip).


I can measure it sometime, on vacation at the moment

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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

phreeky said:


> Damn that HR looks sweet. Any chance you can measure overall diameter for me please?
> 
> I'm interested to hear how the Rekon goes for you. I ride in rocky stuff all of the time and struggle with rear tyres holding together - NN 2.6 SS couldn't cope. I want something tough but fast rolling (dry, so the rocks have tonnes of grip).


Hi Mate, sorry i answered both posts in one response, but in case you didnt see it the HR2.8 measure 73.5 cm diameter running on 40mm rims. Cheers


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## Ferroide (Aug 26, 2015)

Hi, any body knows where I can find some minion DHF 27'5 x 2.6 in europe?


Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

DHFs 2.8 have arrived but I won't be able to ride them untill Saturday. They are narrower than the NN 3.0 but much more aggressive!


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## Seventh-777 (Aug 30, 2013)

I am running Minion DHF/DHR on my Sherpa. I'm very happy with them - I also run the 2.4 version on my Trance and the 4.8 version on my fat bike. They perform like you'd expect. Grip for days, not the lightest tire around but rugged as can be.

DHF is 70mm at the nubs.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

rschultz101 said:


> wanted duro tires in 27.5 3.25 in the us online order. can't find any
> crus , miner


Tire mtb 27,5+ miner 27.5 x 3.0 foldable black DURO Tyres, MTB 27.5+ Bike
I went with the Miners, got them in about a week. Only place I know that sells them. Much better grip than the Chupa 2.8's . Shipping cost more than the tires, but still under $110 for a set. 
Measure just a hair under 3 inches knob to knob on Duroc 40 rims.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

After my first ride with the DHF 2.8 I am quite happy with them but I have to admit that they feel more like big regural tires and less like plus ones at least compared to my 3.0 NN mainly in terms of their floatation feeling over the roots, rocks etc. Also the bike looks more like a regural 27.5 instead of a 27.5+.

On the other side as expected they seem to grip much better when leaning the bike etc. Today I will go for another ride in a different terrain and report back.


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## deonkretch (Jun 13, 2010)

Anyone with any experience or suggestions for decent all-weather Skinwall Tyres - preferably something around 2.8 to 2.85 wide?


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## fissiontofallout (May 16, 2017)

The only two skinwall B+ tires I am aware of are the Onza Canis 27.5x2.85 and the Vee Crown Gem 27.5x2.8. I don't have any experience with either tire though.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

*Nobby Nic 2.8 Addix Speedgrip Apex snakeskin*

Got 2 of these, weight was 932g and 972g respectively.

Will post pics and measurements once mounted


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

2 - WTB Ranger 27.5 x 2.8 TCS Tough, barely used.

For sale or trade.

Looking for 27.5 x 3", no junk, Purgatory Grid or similar.

Send PM.


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## bdundee (Feb 4, 2008)

Found one thanks.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

bdundee said:


> Looking for a 2.8 27.5 DHR or HR if anyone is looking to offload one?


I have a set, 120tpi, mounted TL, only ridden once, a little skinny/shirt for my needs.

Might trade em for something fatter...


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Still waiting for Jensen to send my 2.8 Magic Mary. They still have none in stock. They've sent me 2 emails so far, still waiting for the one if/when they realise 2.8's aren't available.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Tjaard said:


> Got 2 of these, weight was 932g and 972g respectively.
> 
> Will post pics and measurements once mounted


Any experience with these yet? Even better, any experience in wet conditions?


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

TimoA said:


> Any experience with these yet? Even better, any experience in wet conditions?


I have the trailstar version on front. My favourite tyre thus far and I've tried a lot. In the wet and in hero dirt a tyre like the minion will outperform it, for dry and loose stuff where I ride it's way better than a minion in my opinion.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Actually I have the TS version too. Wondering about the new Addix ones.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

*Nobby Nic 2.8 Addix Speedgrip Apex snakeskin*

Nobby Nic 2.8 Addix Speedgrip Apex snakeskin.

Got 2 of these, weight was 932g and 972g respectively.

Width is 70 mm casing, 71 mm tread on a i38mm rim at 20 psi.


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## Losvar (Mar 21, 2016)

2.6 MM is probably bigger than Maxxis 2.8, so I guess it could be called a plus tire.


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

Can someone point me to a thread or list of carbon 27.5+ wheels? I'm looking for a lighter set for my Hightower than the Arc40/novatecs. Currently eyeing the Lightbicycle plus sets but I'm looking to learn more. I am pretty happy with the 2.8 Rekons but am also interested in maybe trying some 3.0". If this is in the wrong spot, please let me know and I'll delete it and post elsewhere.


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## phidauex (Apr 17, 2013)

Jakeg1999 said:


> Can someone point me to a thread or list of carbon 27.5+ wheels? I'm looking for a lighter set for my Hightower than the Arc40/novatecs. Currently eyeing the Lightbicycle plus sets but I'm looking to learn more. I am pretty happy with the 2.8 Rekons but am also interested in maybe trying some 3.0". If this is in the wrong spot, please let me know and I'll delete it and post elsewhere.


I don't have a full list, but in addition to the Lightbicycle, Derby and Nobl combos which are quite popular, the Bontrager Line Pro 40 was a nice find. Carbon rims w/ 41mm internal width, 54 tooth hubs, tubeless prepped out of the box, and the hub has a Shimano and XD freehub option that you swap without tools. They run on eBay in the $700-$800 range as takeoffs from Trek bikes.


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## c_mack9 (Oct 31, 2011)

Ibis 742 is a good option too.


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## Jakeg1999 (Mar 23, 2017)

I tried some Ibis 742's and I really liked them but they are quite a bit more than the LB wheels. I'd like to know what folks think about the difference between 30id, 35id, and 40id? I like the weights of the 30id rims and I'm ok with a bit thinner/rounder profile as they seem to roll and corner well. I'm just trying to decide if 40mm is worth the weight increase. I'm in the exact same boat with a set of 29+ wheels too that I'm running on Stans Arch 26id wheels and the tires are 3" that caliper to 2.7. They roll and corner awesome and climb like a goat on my hardtail, so I'm torn on going with some wider carbons that will weigh about the same if not a little more. I really like the idea of a lighter wheelset.


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## wickedmtb (Mar 11, 2012)

New build up. 
Trek Remedy 7 on WTB I35 wheels 
and Nobby Nic's 27.5x2.6 tires. Cant wait to test these out


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## jeffw-13 (Apr 30, 2008)

What width are you getting with your 2.6 Nobby Nics? I mounted a pair on Stans Flow MK 3 rims (29mm internal) and they're only maybe 1/16th inch wider than the 2.35 Nics they're replacing. They measure under 2.5. 

By comparison the 2.8 Nics on Spank Oozy 395 rims (34.5 internal) measure the full 2.8.

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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Still waiting for Jensen to pull their finger out of their ass and send me the 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary I ordered a month ago, keep getting emails every week saying it's still on back order. 

I emailed Schwalbe again myself to get confirmation on wether the tyre even exists.


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## Rumblefish2010 (Mar 29, 2012)

GRPABT1 said:


> Still waiting for Jensen to pull their finger it of their ass and send me the 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary I ordered a month ago, keep getting emails every week saying it's still on back order.
> 
> I emailed Schwalbe again myself to get confirmation on wether the tyre even exists.


How could that happen? Schwalbe have not this tyre in their product line?
Would like to see their email answer.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Yeah it was wishful thinking when I ordered it but figured it was worth a try. Jensen still have it listed.


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## wickedmtb (Mar 11, 2012)

Sorry for the late response.
Tires mounted on the 35mm ID wheels come in at the full 2.6.
This is at 38psi. to stretch the tires a few days. I'm sure once stretched, and about 10 to 15psi less, the size will come pretty close to spec.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

OK a bit of an update on the Magic Mary 2.8.

Jensen sent back this:

Hi Josh,

Thank you for writing in. I do apologize about the delay. Schwalbe has pushed back the date on the tire. There are still about 3-4 weeks out. Is there another tire you might be interested in?

Hoyee Chow
|Gear Advisor Coordinator| EMAIL: [email protected] | PHONE: 951.300.2882| WEB: jensonusa.com

And Schwalbe sent back this:

Hi Joshua,
The 2.8'' Magic Marys aren't even officially released yet. Nothing is going to ship to Jenson or anyone else until the beginning of next month and I unfortunately can't guarantee that Jenson will be receiving any of the tires you have ordered. I can confirm that yes, the tire does exist though (kind of by 'popular demand' situation).

Kind regards

Andrew Batchelar | Customer Service / Tech Support

SCHWALBE North America
USA | Canada
1-888-700-5860 | 250-598-0397 ext: 106
[email protected]
schwalbetires.com

So the tyre exists! But I won't be getting it for quite a while.


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## hece (Feb 27, 2017)

Got myself a Terrene Chunk 3.0 Tough to front from PlanetX. It's still in good discount (36e!), go grab some. It has the widest tread from my tyres so far (Nobby Nic, Rocket Ron, Purgatory, Ground Control). About 78mm tread on 45 ID rim as new with 2.0bar. The casing was 71mm which is least out of those tyres. Haven't checked after riding and with rideable pressures. Seems very reassuring tyre. It weights a lot though, 1180g and the other one was 1240g! That's way above the promised 1060g.


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## tsurun (Mar 13, 2009)

__ https://www.facebook.com/Slam69BicycleShop/posts/2123308261028733


finally its out.

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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

After searching through the threads a little, I have a question or two. I'm looking to replace my 27.5x2.8 Chupas on my 17' Trek Fuel EX8. I'd like to go as wide as possible on the stock i40 rims. I do have a discount on WTB and Kenda tires, so I've looked at the WTB Trail Boss, Ranger and Bridger 27.5x3.0s. Can anyone chime in as to which of the WTBs is widest or are they all about the same?


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## Averbuks (Oct 24, 2014)

Jukahia said:


> Are the Maxxis dhr 2,8 exo dual tires really this bad...? Ordered one two weeks ago. I have now ride two times with [email protected] (3hours) and today on second ride I got flat. After one hour, rideing relatively easy Enduro tracks. Tire has total 3 holes on side, right where side begins...
> I have Id 45mm carbon hookless wheels and I use 20-18psi pressure. As the front DW on same wheel has already taken beating in two races & lots of hard rideing and it's in great condition!
> 
> View attachment 1145022
> ...


What rims are those?


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## watermonkey (Jun 21, 2011)

Pack66 said:


> After searching through the threads a little, I have a question or two. I'm looking to replace my 27.5x2.8 Chupas on my 17' Trek Fuel EX8. I'd like to go as wide as possible on the stock i40 rims. I do have a discount on WTB and Kenda tires, so I've looked at the WTB Trail Boss, Ranger and Bridger 27.5x3.0s. Can anyone chime in as to which of the WTBs is widest or are they all about the same?


The Kenda Havoc is really not a bad tire. My bike came stock with the wire beads, the new Pro's are lighter and tubeless ready - planning on replacing the non-tubeless ready tires with the Havoc PRO 2.8's. The 2.8 Kenda on i32's are wider than a Maxxis 2.8 on an i35, and way taller. They are a TRUE 2.8 (imagine that) - I haven't seen a 3.0. I've rode them from Utah desert to Colorado alpine, and they've served me well. They don't have huge side knobs, but they do roll well and hook up pretty good. I've nothing good to say about WTB tires at all, won't even buy them at a discount.


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## Back2MTB (Jun 4, 2014)

WTB trailboss 3.0 is a big, big tire with tons of volume and Ranger 2.8 is also a proper, high volume size tire. 

Trailboss has settled in as my current favorite front but the ranger lacked a bit of bite for wet/rocky trails though it's great for dry/groomed/fast and rolls extremely well. 

Maxxis Rekon 2.8, my current rear, is a little undersized but has velcro like gripon rocks and roots and has been pretty durable thus far.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Pack66 said:


> After searching through the threads a little, I have a question or two. I'm looking to replace my 27.5x2.8 Chupas on my 17' Trek Fuel EX8. I'd like to go as wide as possible on the stock i40 rims. I do have a discount on WTB and Kenda tires, so I've looked at the WTB Trail Boss, Ranger and Bridger 27.5x3.0s. Can anyone chime in as to which of the WTBs is widest or are they all about the same?


I'm no tire expert, but love my 3.0 Duro Miners. Big improvement over the Chupas. Under 1000g each and 3 inches wide knob to knob. A bit slower rolling, but pretty aggressive knobs and great traction. Set up tubeless easy too.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Hi all, 

I owns a 100mm travel cross country bike with plus wheels. I have 2.8" WTB trailblazer tyres. Been riding for a year to this date and the tyres is wearing out. I rides mostly all mountain. I rode at Derby, Tasmania, Australia, and loved it there. Great mix of trails from soil to rock (heaps of rocks). 

I am after new tyres but I don't know which one will be great?
Maxxis Minions DHF and DH2 or Schwalbe Nobby Nics? Any recommendation you guys have?


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Tjaard said:


> Nobby Nic 2.8 Addix Speedgrip Apex snakeskin.
> 
> Got 2 of these, weight was 932g and 972g respectively.
> 
> ...


How does this tyres perform? Where do you ride usually?


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

snowboarderVB said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have 2.8" WTB trailblazer tyres. Been riding for a year to this date and the tyres is wearing out. I rides mostly all mountain. I rode at Derby, Tasmania, Australia, and loved it there. Great mix of trails from soil to rock (heaps of rocks).
> 
> ...


Trailblazer looks crazy fast rolling, I think a DHF/DHR2 would feel like somebody has put an anchor on your bike. Don't get me wrong, they roll OK for the amount of grip they have, but they'll still roll real slow comparatively.

From Maxxis, perhaps a Rekon? I'd be a little concerned about Maxxis sizing compared to WTB, they will probably come up smaller. I think the tread pattern of a Rekon is a nice compromise.

From the Schwalbe world the Rocket Ron has excellent traction:rolling resistance and they're a decent size. The Nobby Nic actually rolls quite well as well, however if going Schwalbe consider Nobby Nic front/Rocket Ron rear.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Hi Phreeky, 

Yes, I noticed that its fast rolling tyres but no side knobs to grip when I lead my bike to keep in balance with my body upright. I fell on dry hard pack trail just because there's no grip on the side. I always worry about doing that on berms and fall hard which is something I don't want to.

Yes, I see what you mean with DHF and DR2 being slow because of those knobs which are massive compared to other tyres.
Ah Maxxis Rekon+, it's a mix of minion and ardent....I will look in this, pretty sure they have a good sizeable side grip to lean the bike better?

Rocket Ron from Schwalbe? Fast rolling like Trailblazer? I saw some people put Nobby Nics 3.0 on front and 2.8 on rear....may I ask why? 
Also they made new ADDIX compound, I am sure its better then original compound?

Cheers


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

Lately I've been rolling on a HRII+ and DHR2+ for rear tires on two different bikes. I'd give a nod to the HRII for being a bit faster rolling. The DHR2 is sloooowww..... 

I'll prolly switch back to a Rekon in the rear after the HRII wears out for a little better rolling speed. Still liking the DHF up front, tho.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

So I see some of you prefer to have fast rolling tyres on rear for better traction, riding uphill instead of bigger, heavier knobbier tyres.

I am sitting on fence between 2 choices I can get here in Australia. 
- 3.0 Nobby Nic on front and 2.8 Rocket Rons on rear
or
- 2.8 Maxxis Minion DHF with 2.8 Rekon+ rear

Does any of you ride on those? How's the grip level when riding downhill with berms and riding uphill?


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

snowboarderVB said:


> So I see some of you prefer to have fast rolling tyres on rear for better traction, riding uphill instead of bigger, heavier knobbier tyres.
> 
> I am sitting on fence between 2 choices I can get here in Australia.
> - 3.0 Nobby Nic on front and 2.8 Rocket Rons on rear
> ...


Your first choice. I tried a 2.8 minion on my enduro bike and went back to 2.8 Nobby Nic. Minions won't do you any favors on a 100mm travel bike


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

GRPABT1 said:


> Your first choice. I tried a 2.8 minion on my enduro bike and went back to 2.8 Nobby Nic. Minions won't do you any favors on a 100mm travel bike


What make you change back to Nobby Nics? Oh you ride 2.8 Nobby Nic? Have you tried 3.0?


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

snowboarderVB said:


> What make you change back to Nobby Nics? Oh you ride 2.8 Nobby Nic? Have you tried 3.0?


I have run both 2.8 and 3.0 Nobby nics, I don't care for them that much, to me (it's subjective) they didn't have enough bite in the corners for loose, I'm currently on hrII s f/r. Lot of people love them I just didn't care for them.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

snowboarderVB said:


> What make you change back to Nobby Nics? Oh you ride 2.8 Nobby Nic? Have you tried 3.0?


I have not tried the 3.0 Nic, I don't have the wheel width for it. The 2.8 is supposedly more aggressive in knob height though. I changed back from the minion as I ride in very dry loose over hard surfaces with many rocks and the minion just doesn't get the chance to bite on our dirt and no transition knobs is sketchy here as it's hard to lay the bike right over. The 2.8 Nobby Nic was also a bit bigger and that seems to help. The minion I had was also a harder rubber compound which didn't help. I punctured the minion second ride on it but repaired it with a patch on the inside and rode it some more before swapping it out. If I rode on softer, wetter dirt i'd consider a minion again but with the Magic Mary coming that'll be my next front tyre.

On a 100mm travel bike though I wouldn't consider full on downhill tread like a Minion or Mary.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Interesting opinions guys, thanks!

For you all who owns Schwalbe tyres (NN or RR)...how's their durability? Is it strong tires to do those downhill riding sometimes or technical rides such as rocky trails?


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

Durability wise (resistance to cuts in the tread area) I've found the NN and RR plus tyres terrible. Both I've had to patch from the inside, and I've lost count of how many in the RR.

I REALLY like the RR tread on the plus size, but they need to beef the casing up (not just the sidewalls). None of them have wept sealant, they're not THAT thin, but they simply cut too easily. These were all pre-Addix. They're Snakeskin non-Apex versions.

I normally run Maxxis Exo tyres and I've only ever had one puncture in them, so I don't consider myself some sort of tyre-destroying hard charger.

FYI I had a DHF 2.6, RR 2.6 and NN 2.6 mounted side-by-side and the burlier casing of the DHF can be felt by hand.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Ahh make sense, so it's better to get Addix and Apex version of Schwalbe for futute-proof/long run term after all?

I checked my bike and it has 45mm internal rims....I wonder which one is better to run with? NN 2.8 or 3.0 for the front? Knowing I am pretty much set on 2.8 RR for the rear.

https://www.bikerumor.com/2015/04/1...-fun-with-fat-nobby-nic-and-rocket-ron-tires/

I know this website is 2 years old, it say better to run with 2.8 on 45mm? I was thinking of getting 3.0 on that rim?


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

Got the Nobby Nics that came on my bike as 27.5+ x 3.0. Like them fine for float and traction with the right balance of plush I need on a steel h/t (as a 56 year old guy). 

Wanted to keep an eye out for other tires that are sale priced to grab as future needs and just picked up a Rocket Ron x 3.0 for $48. 
I think I'll prefer the tighter nobby for the rear tire per trail traction and smooth roll on hard surfaces. NN are still doing great though. In soft loose dry stuff, I think the RR will benefit.


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

snowboarderVB said:


> Ahh make sense, so it's better to get Addix and Apex version of Schwalbe for futute-proof/long run term after all?


No idea whether the Addix/Apex help there sorry. I think the Apex is just a sidewall thing, probably does help prevent pinch flats though. Maybe I just had bad luck or something too? It's hard to know. I'm sure a lot of people are having different experiences with these tyres.



> I checked my bike and it has 45mm internal rims....I wonder which one is better to run with? NN 2.8 or 3.0 for the front? Knowing I am pretty much set on 2.8 RR for the rear.


I ran 2.8 on 29mm rims, and predict 35-40mm is ideal. 45mm I'd lean towards 3.0 but you can probably get away with either - it's not like 40mm is perfect and then suddenly 45mm is terrible.


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## ideate (May 28, 2016)

I have 45mm Dartmoor Aircraft, wtb i40 and Hope 35W's and find 40mm seems prefect for 2.8 Minions.


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## Losvar (Mar 21, 2016)

What are the grippiest tires for roots and rocks?
Should have a decent casing that can take some hits too.


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## Rumblefish2010 (Mar 29, 2012)

Losvar said:


> What are the grippiest tires for roots and rocks?
> Should have a decent casing that can take some hits too.


My best tire choice until now is Vee Tyre Crown Gem 3" with Synthesis side walls. They have more agressive side nobs than Nobby Nick and has better grip then all 27.5 tires I have tried. Decent weight also.

Second is the Maxxis, but have never got hold of 3" Maxxis DHF, I really want HR2 but cannot get hold of them.

Next up to try is the Specialized Purgatory with Gripton. They suck in the weight department though.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Losvar said:


> What are the grippiest tires for roots and rocks?
> Should have a decent casing that can take some hits too.


New 2.8 magic Mary will be a grip monster


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## Negotiator50 (Apr 21, 2012)

bachman1961 said:


> Got the Nobby Nics that came on my bike as 27.5+ x 3.0. Like them fine for float and traction with the right balance of plush I need on a steel h/t (as a 56 year old guy).
> 
> Wanted to keep an eye out for other tires that are sale priced to grab as future needs and just picked up a Rocket Ron x 3.0 for $48.
> I think I'll prefer the tighter nobby for the rear tire per trail traction and smooth roll on hard surfaces. NN are still doing great though. In soft loose dry stuff, I think the RR will benefit.


Where did you get the RR for $48? I want to buy a set.


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## fugsworth (Feb 28, 2015)

Tire height: Maxxis HRII 3.0 vs DHF Minion 2.8 Anyone measured the difference in height between them? 

I'd prefer the DHF but I want to keep my BB as high as possible.


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

IMO you're best off choosing a tyre design that suits you and extend your fork if you can. It's generally easier to gain 10mm of fork height (a bit less depending on HTA), but 10mm of tyre diameter is unlikely.


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## jga013 (Nov 2, 2015)

The HRII 3.0 is about 28 5/8" in diameter. The only 2.8 I've tried is the WTB Ranger. It was 28 1/4" in diameter (which seems to be fairly typical for the 2.8's from what I've read). It may not sound like much, but it made a huge difference in the number of pedal strikes with the 2.8 on back (and still having a 3.0 on the front).

I really like the HRII. Definitively one of the better full 3" tires out there. Probably not as much grip as the DHF, but a lot better than the XC based tread patterns.


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## fugsworth (Feb 28, 2015)

jga013 said:


> The HRII 3.0 is about 28 5/8" in diameter. The only 2.8 I've tried is the WTB Ranger. It was 28 1/4" in diameter (which seems to be fairly typical for the 2.8's from what I've read). It may not sound like much, but it made a huge difference in the number of pedal strikes with the 2.8 on back (and still having a 3.0 on the front).
> 
> I really like the HRII. Definitively one of the better full 3" tires out there. Probably not as much grip as the DHF, but a lot better than the XC based tread patterns.


Thanks for the info. I'm actually looking for rear tire, so more than likely it's going to be the HRII.


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## rad3144 (Sep 28, 2016)

I'll second that, I'm running 3.0s HRIIs front and rear, they grip like crazy, you feel the knobs and sure it's a little slower rolling, but I just set 4 prs with them on so there's that 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## dudek (Jun 1, 2004)

Terrene Chunk Tough 3.0's not so tough. 
After a year running S-Grid WTB Ranger combo with no drama mounted Terrene in the rear. Same bike ,same terrain -
Within the week pinched bead in one and put a hole in second . Sidewall in much softer then worn out Rangers. Rubber is also much harder. Nobs are nice and aggressive but casing is thinner. I'll give'em one more try. If they fail me again I'm back to Rangers.


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## RVbldr (Sep 10, 2015)

fugsworth said:


> Tire height: Maxxis HRII 3.0 vs DHF Minion 2.8 Anyone measured the difference in height between them?


Stuck a HRII 3.0 on the front (i29 rim) and it's coming in at 2 11/16". I have a Spec Purgatory Grid and it comes in at about 2 13/16. I only have two rides on the HR II but initial impressions is that it's a really grippy front tire. I had dual Purgs but found the front started washing out with a little wear. I still like the Purg grip on the rear so I just replaced the worn tire with a new 3.0.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

pinching a bead is more you than the tire. 

chunk is 62a middle and 51a side knobs. 

ranger is 60a middle and 42a side knobs or 60a middle and 50a side depending on type.

ive taken the light version of the chunk to colorado springs and in arkansas, both places have sharp rocks all over the place. i picked up two holes in CO. both times were my fault and ANY tire would have punctured. 

ill take your word on the thinner sidewalls compared to the ranger, ive not owned one of those. that being said, to say they are not durable is untrue, especially considering your experiencing pinch flats.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Plus Tires For Sale:

*SOLD *Maxxis Minion DHF/DHR 120tpi, 27.5 x 2.8, complete set, very fresh, best offer plus $15 shipping.

Anyone?? WTB Ranger 27.5 x 2.8 TCS Tough, complete set, very fresh, best offer plus $15 shipping.

Send a PM.


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## wideawakejake (Jan 18, 2015)

I have 27.5 2.8 Rekons on my Tallboy right now. They seem to be a pretty good all round set of tires. Is there a significant amount of gain in speed and less rolling drag gained by putting a 2.8 NN on the front, and a 2.8 RR on the rear? They would go on the stock RF 40's. I cant say I have any complaints on the Rekons, but am I missing something?


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

I'm running Rekons f/r on one of my bikes right now, and I'm pretty impressed. More traction than I expected from the looks of them, and they still roll pretty darn well. There are times I wish I had a little more traction up front, especially when cornering hard (though I'm used to a DHF), but all in all they are one of the best all-around plus tires I've used. 

They are also light, but without the noticeable sidewall squirm, and sidewail frailty, that I've seen with other tires in the same weight range.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

bogeydog said:


> I found the 2.6s are *almost 1/2 shorter* than 2.8s


Do you mean *0.5 inches* (13mm) *shorter* or *1/2 as tall*, ie: 1.4" compared to 2.8"?

Do you mean height of the tire, vertically above the rim? Or Overal diameter of rim+ tire, or width?


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

snowboarderVB said:


> How does this tyres perform? Where do you ride usually?


I put this tire on the rear of our bikes, because it is very tough for its weight (including the Apex pinch flat protection strip, so you can run lower pressures without bottoming out on the rim).

To get a similar level of durability in casing from most other brands you'd be looking at a _much_ heavier tire.

The knobs are well spaced and decent sized, so they hook up for climbing and braking traction quite well, in a variety of surfaces. The Compound is firm, but not rock hard. I haven't tried them in wet, and wouldn't expect them to excel. But since that's rare for me, and they are on the rear, I chose better rolling resistance and lower wear.

Schwalbe has the best rolling resistance of any brands out there. so again, good choice for the rear.

The downfall of plus sized Nobby Nic's is the lack of cornering knobs, since 1/2 of the 'normal' cornering knobs become intermediate knobs on the plus tires.

This is why I don't like it as a front tire for agressive and higher speed riding.

In the rear, I don't mind as much. You have to be really leaning it over for this to become an issue, and even then, it's not like there are no knobs, there are simply about 1/2 as many as a 'normal' design, so it will slide a bit, but controlled.

I have been riding them in Park City, UT at Dear Valley bike park, both jump trails and steep technical trails, and on cross country trails with both smooth and rocky sections. In Big Sky, MT I rode them on both jump trails and steep technical trails in the bike park, as well as some XC.

So I have had them on hardpack, loose over hard, dust, solid rocks, loose rocks and a scree field. I am not the fastest rider, so if you are very strong and really load the bike for super cornering, and really lay it over for high speed corners, you might find the tire to slide more than you want, but for most riding and riding skills, a tiny bit of (controlled)rear slide, i.e. oversteer, is actually nice.

Braking and climbing traction has been great.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Could you put a caption above each picture telling us which tire model and size and rims(size) they are?

Thanks!


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

Negotiator50 said:


> Where did you get the RR for $48? I want to buy a set.


Oops, missed your question-

The RR tire I got retails at $80- something ea , got it for $48 @ chainreaction. 
If they were $48 a pair I'd have picked up a bunch. Now I"m thinking of the 3.0 front and going lesser on the rear when it's time to swap out worn knobs.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

phreeky said:


> Durability wise (resistance to cuts in the tread area) I've found the NN and RR plus tyres terrible. Both I've had to patch from the inside, and I've lost count of how many in the RR.
> They're Snakeskin non-Apex versions.
> 
> I normally run Maxxis Exo tyres and I've only ever had one puncture in them, so I don't consider myself some sort of tyre-destroying hard charger.
> ...


Interesting, in lab tests the Snakeskin tires (Schwalbe) usually come out better than the EXO tires (Maxxis) for puncture resistance.

Rocket Ron is a very light tire, so I could see that, but Nobby Nic should normally do quite well for a 'lighter weight' tire (ie not 'enduro casing' or similar)

Puncture test results from Bike Magazin (regular 650b x 2.3, not plus tires):

Schwalbe Nobby Nic *Snakeskin 120 tpi*: *133 N*, 751g
Maxxis Agressor *EXO*, Dual Compound *60 tpi*: *121N*, 848g
Maxxis Forekaster *EXO*, Dual Compound *120 tpi*: *106 N*, 759g
Specialized Purgatory *Grid 60 tpi*: *108 N*, 832g.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Losvar said:


> What are the grippiest tires for roots and rocks?
> Should have a decent casing that can take some hits too.


Surly Dirt Wizard.

Soft Compound for grip on roots and rocks, decent spacing to get next to them and bombproof casing.
Good volume allows lower pressures for more grip without pinch flatting.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

NH Mtbiker said:


> What is meant by "too small"? Can you measure your 2.8 NN tire mounted to the rim with width and height?


Mine are 70mm on a i38mm rim, at about 16 psi. 70mm is a 2.8 tire, so definitely not 'to small'. If you want bigger, get the 3.0.....


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## j3ffro (May 8, 2015)

gpgalanis said:


> After my first ride with the DHF 2.8 I am quite happy with them but I have to admit that they feel more like big regural tires and less like plus ones at least compared to my 3.0 NN mainly in terms of their floatation feeling over the roots, rocks etc. Also the bike looks more like a regural 27.5 instead of a 27.5+.


I could not agree more with this statement. I went from 3.0 Vee Crown Gems to 2.8 DHF/DHR to 3.0 High Roller II's, and am very surprised at the difference between 3.0 & 2.8. 3.0 feels like Fatbike Jr, while 2.8 feels like a normal tire, just a bit bigger. My DHF/DHR only have about 200 miles on them, so I'm keeping them for future consideration, but at this point I'm definitely in the Fatbike Jr camp.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I've been saying for a long time now that 2.8 is the point where speed and fun converge. If you want maximum grip in loose conditions to go as fast as you can, 2.8 is the go. If you want a cushy, floaty ride with oodles of forgiving grip to make any trail fun, then 3.0 or bigger. Personally I like going fast so I'm in the 2.8 camp.

Still waiting on my Magic Mary from Jensen, that I paid for Kit 14th. I just fired them off a short stern email.


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

After many more rides on the 2.8 I still have the same feeling. I miss the flotation feeling of the NN 3.0 but I enjoy the better grip of the DHF / DHR2 2.8. Personally I wouldn't mind a DHF / DHR2 3.0 option but I don't see this happening in the near future.

Here is a before and after photo with NN 3.0 vs DHF 2.8.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I can hardly believe it but I just received an email from Jenson saying that my 2.8 Magic Mary has been shipped. Little bit excited.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I have found fast, fun, smooth and awesome rollover characteristics with a 29 X2.6 NN. Insain traction on crazy steep climbs too. Same size as most maxxis 2.8. I highly recommend those as a do it all tire if you can fit them!!!
I've eaten through my rear 2.6 tire over the course of a heavy summer of riding. I haven't had any damage issues with those tires aside from pinholes the sealant instantly fills. My rocket Ron, on the other hand, dyed an ugly death on the fourth ride. Big puncture in the tread. I was the drift master with it on my rear, it made me nervous. 
I just ordered the Addixs 2.6 NN and will be installing the Huck Norris rim protectors in my rear tires. At 165 pounds I've been running my 2.6 rear tire at 13 PSI and it rolls like butter but I do hear a little rim spank about once every big ride. Usually if I mess up a landing onto a rocky patch. Oppsy!
My Pony Rustler will except 27+ or 29 inch wheel sets so I bought an Addixs apex 3.0 as a rear tire for this winter. I'm hoping to run it in the single-digit psi range with the heavy casing for support and a rim protector just in case I get carried away:eekster:. Winter has already arrived to the high peaks of the Colorado Rockies! Just a cameo appearance I hope.


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Just wondering if anyone here run on Rekon+ on front and rear? Is it any good? 
Nobby Nics or Rekon+ for 100mm travel bike?
Cheers


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

They are both good, more volume in the NN. I did NN in front and recon+ rear last winter. I changed out the Recon+ to a NN 3.0 because reckons ramped nobs were not great climbing in the snow and I wanted max volume to raise my BB/reduce peddle strikes. More volume is always nice with less travel too.


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## matt.s67 (Nov 4, 2016)

snowboarderVB said:


> Just wondering if anyone here run on Rekon+ on front and rear? Is it any good?
> Nobby Nics or Rekon+ for 100mm travel bike?
> Cheers


I'm running Rekon 2.8s front and rear on my Mojo 3 and love them. Plenty of grip, not much flotation compared to the 29x3.0 Chupacabras I was riding before on my Stache. But the Rekons lean much more predictably and IMO find the balance between wide and grippy, and predictability.


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## phidauex (Apr 17, 2013)

Anyone have any recent thoughts on the Vee Crown Gem plus tire (https://www.veetireco.com/listings/plus-size-crown-gem/) in 27.5 x 2.6, 2.8 and 3.0? Not a lot of reviews out there yet.

I'm interested in a moderately aggressive tire for rocky/sandy conditions in CO. Need to be pretty durable, but light enough for long uphills (I like to ride long singletrack ups with technical downs). These seem like a good option (also considering the Rekon, Purgatory GRID, and Terrene McFly). I like that the Vee Crown Gem is available in a full 3.0 - I've got the frame for it, so I want the meat. 

Any comparisons or recent ride reports?


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## T1C (Nov 10, 2016)

Wow! Where is that?


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## snowboarderVB (Aug 23, 2017)

Karlewski - Ahh I see! So, Rekon+ is more of summer tyres insted of winter, muddy trails?

matt.s67 - Ah plenty of grips? Easy to ride anywhere? Even technical downhill trails, flowing trails? Ride well like all mountain bike?


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## codysoyland (Jul 15, 2014)

Received a 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary (Addix Soft) today from Universal Cycles. Weighs in at 1096 grams, which is 136 grams more than Schwalbe's stated 960 grams. The numbers on Schwalbe's website don't make sense; for example the 27.5x2.6 is stated to weigh more: 1000 grams. Still 1096g is not awful for a tire this burly.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I have a NN 3.0 plain snake skin on the front and I just tested the new 3.0 NN APEX Addixs with a Huck Norris foam insert rim protector for a couple of rides on the rear at 12 PSI. The first ride in light rain on soft ground. I noticed the weight right away and got shut down on a few technical sections due to a lack of acceleration on steep rocks. I was bummed and spent the rest of my ride up thinking about how to get rid of the new tire. Then I turned to bike downhill and OMG. In the rain, half blind by wet glasses and I was ripp'n through wet roots and rocky sections with huge stability and mega break power. I started feeling better about the new tire. 
I road it for 3k vertical feet yesterday near Vail (Colorado trail near ski cooper) on a huge variety of trail and it felt much better. The last section of trail was a fairly steep dry river bed, constant rock gardens of basket balls and grapefruits. I dumped some air out of the rear tire, to ~10Psi. The weight was still there but getting reacquainted with the nuances of the bigger 27+ tires was key. I was riding my to 29er wheelset before this ride. Using the added compression/bounce was instrumental to unweighting/pogo sticking up over the unavoidable big chunks. Getting used to the the bounce and timing of fatter tires was definitely a "thing" for me. Although I hike a biked some I was pretty excited about the overall performance. 
Blasting back down was great. I was actually grateful for the heavier apex casing and rim protector at that point. Killing a tire and or rim out there would have been VERY unpleasant if I had to walk out, I guess the beast tire has its place and should be great winter training to build more explosive leg power plus, fixing a tire on the trail in freezing conditions is HELL. 
I was scared and held back considerably last weekend with old tires at 12000ft in snow and cold wind on technical terrain. I knew equipment failure would have likely meant abandoning the bike and being happy just to get home in one piece. 
With modern technology everything is a trade off...
PS those MM look like the ULTIMATE gravity tire! Intended use? I'm a huge schwable fan!


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## phidauex (Apr 17, 2013)

Picked up a pair of the Vee Crown Gems in 27.5x3.0, in the Synthesis sidewall for the very reasonable price of $56 each from Universal Cycles. They look quite nice, and the synthesis sidewall does look pretty sweet, being a bit more interesting than a black sidewall, without going all the way to skinwall.

MFG Page: https://www.veetireco.com/listings/plus-size-crown-gem/

German review (that I picked because the photos of the Synthesis sidewall and knob configuration are better than what I would take for you):
VEE TIRE Crown Gem 27,5×3,0 - Testintro

I haven't mounted them yet, but will be putting them on a pair of Bontrager Line Pro 40s (41mm internal).

They weighed in a little heavier than anticipated - Vee says 990g for this size, but mine came in at 1005g and 1045g - 1.5% and 5.5% higher. Not outrageous, but someday it would be nice to get a tire that actually weighed a bit _less_ than the MFG claim.

They seem like a nice profile with good center lugs, enough side lugs to give me something to grab (my current complaint about the Specialized Ground Controls I'm riding), but without getting to full DH monster (like that Magic Mary). Hopefully they use that extra weight for durability (I've already put one pinch flat on my Ground Controls, repaired with a patch on the inside of the tire) - the trails here in northern CO are quite rocky and sharp.

Given their weight, and the fact that they seem to run large, I'm now wondering if I shouldn't have gotten the 2.8... But what the heck, we've got a plus frame, so let's ride plus tires.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I read somewhere on here they were very good in the snow. I'm interested to hear how they do. I could not find any good reviews either...


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## Jukis (Sep 26, 2016)

codysoyland said:


> Received a 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary (Addix Soft) today from Universal Cycles. Weighs in at 1096 grams, which is 136 grams more than Schwalbe's stated 960 grams. The numbers on Schwalbe's website don't make sense; for example the 27.5x2.6 is stated to weigh more: 1000 grams. Still 1096g is not awful for a tire this burly.
> 
> View attachment 1159797
> View attachment 1159796


Any measurements?


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## MTB9488 (Jun 18, 2012)

I recently purchased a 2017 specialized with 3.0 purgatory tires. I like the tires but the ride is a little stiff. I understand specialized has increased the sidewall stiffness for people that run lower pressure. I don’t run the lower pressure and don’t ride hard anymore... rode hard 20 years ago...im 50+, now looking for ride comfort. Looking for 27.5x 3.0 tire recommendations there are not as stiff.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

what pressures are you running in the tires currently? Perhaps what you have can be tuned before moving on to different options. Wider tires tend to work best with lower pressures due to the volume the tire provides. Even if the Purgatory indeed has a stiffer sidewall, its still plenty flexible.

adjusting the tire pressure to your body weight should help a great deal.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

MTB9488 said:


> I recently purchased a 2017 specialized with 3.0 purgatory tires. I like the tires but the ride is a little stiff. I understand specialized has increased the sidewall stiffness for people that run lower pressure. I don't run the lower pressure and don't ride hard anymore... rode hard 20 years ago...im 50+, now looking for ride comfort. Looking for 27.5x 3.0 tire recommendations there are not as stiff.


I've got the same tires with the GRID sidewall, and typically run them 14psi front, 18psi rear, and don't notice any harshness in the ride. Mine are mounted up to Nobl TR45 rims on an Intense ACV.


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## MTB9488 (Jun 18, 2012)

carbine_275 said:


> I've got the same tires with the GRID sidewall, and typically run them 14psi front, 18psi rear, and don't notice any harshness in the ride. Mine are mounted up to Nobl TR45 rims on an Intense ACV.


I have tried tire pressure from 9 to 16. In the past I had WTB ranger and chupacabra I liked the ride quality, but definitely not the greatest in traction.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Jukis said:


> Any measurements?


And pics of it mounted? Diagonal and straight across the top (showing the profile)?

Given Schwalbe's history of not adapting treads to wider casing sizes (ie Nobby Nic), I'd really like to see it before replacing omg current tires with it.

BTW, I saw listed weight as 1050g, so that's a bit closer to what you've got there.


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## Steel Calf (Feb 5, 2010)

MTB9488 said:


> I recently purchased a 2017 specialized with 3.0 purgatory tires.


I also bought the same "Specialized" bike with 3.0 Purgatory/3.0 Ground Control tires this year and cannot find an optimal air pressure. Below 15psi the bike feels plush but also unprecise/squirmy, above 15psi the tire starts to bounce off obstacles and grip advantage seems to be gone

My recommendation: Burn that bike


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## c41xracer (Sep 2, 2017)

Steel Calf said:


> I also bought the same "Specialized" bike with 3.0 Purgatory/3.0 Ground Control tires this year and cannot find an optimal air pressure. Below 15psi the bike feels plush but also unprecise/squirmy, above 15psi the tire starts to bounce off obstacles and grip advantage seems to be gone
> 
> My recommendation: Burn that bike


I have a 2017 6 Fattie and I'm 215lb in my riding gear. I ended up at 18lb in the front and 20lb in the rear on almost every trail I ride. Any more than that I bounce around and less than that I get squirm.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

codysoyland said:


> Received a 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary (Addix Soft) today from Universal Cycles. Weighs in at 1096 grams, which is 136 grams more than Schwalbe's stated 960 grams. The numbers on Schwalbe's website don't make sense; for example the 27.5x2.6 is stated to weigh more: 1000 grams. Still 1096g is not awful for a tire this burly.
> 
> View attachment 1159797
> View attachment 1159796


God dammit. I ordered mine from Jensen 3 months ago now and it still hasn't arrived.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Finally received my 2.8 Magic Mary! It fits in my standard 27.5 pike juuuuust at 40psi, a little bigger at the lugs than the Nobby Nic as expected. Wouldn't work if you ride in mud.


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## DevinciSean (Sep 6, 2007)

Anyone running Maxxis 2.8's on 35mm ID rims? Any positive or negative feedback?


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

DevinciSean said:


> Anyone running Maxxis 2.8's on 35mm ID rims? Any positive or negative feedback?


Yup - DHF/DHRII on i35s. They work great.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I've got a crazy new idea and I'm looking for opinions, suggestions, warnings and advice. I have to admit firstly that I am somewhat of a tire junkie. 
Recently, I purchased a new Intense Primer and was chatting with the salesman about other exciting developments in the bike in the world! He said the Vittoria tires with the new graphine chemistry were the best thing going. After doing my own research they do sound very promising. 
Vittoria should have the new Mescale 29 X 2.6 available by spring. Sounds like a great tire for XC and light trail use as a back tire but, not for a front tire. 2.6 NN could do pretty well there but, it sure would be cool to put a 2.8 x 29 up front if there was such a thing, and it could actually fit in my forks. 
So here is my half baked plan, I could slap the 2.8 Vittoria Morosa on the front in the 27.5 flavor since I have those rims/wheels too. I am well aware that this will alter my geometry and steepen my head tube. I could increase my forks travel by 10 or 20 mm to counter that affect. But I've also ridden motorcross for years and even the current motorcycle in my garage has a larger diameter front tire then back tire. Going really fast through big rocks on the motorcross bike demands great front tire roll over characteristics for control. Would my mountain bike suffer with this setup? The Morsa front tire is really light too. I think it would climb great since I pick my front tire up over all the big chunks anyway. 
Generally speaking motorcross bikes have a wider rear tire then front tire, we never do that on our mountain bikes since the engine is so much smaller. Did I just find a new great breakthrough! Probably not, what do you think? Is adding volume/traction and dropping weight up front like this a viable move toward improved overall performance?


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## [email protected] (May 28, 2010)

Anybody ridden the 45NORTH 3.0 or 4.6 Wrathchild unstudded on dirt who can share a review? thanks...


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

Good news for ice riders schwalbe ice spiker pro now available in 27.5+ 2.60. Good to have another choice apart from the 3.0 nokian fat freddies. Anymore 27.5+ studded tyres in the horizon? I am discounting 45nrth because of the crazy prices.


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

ideate said:


> I have 45mm Dartmoor Aircraft, wtb i40 and Hope 35W's and find 40mm seems prefect for 2.8 Minions.


Are those the 2.8 super moto x? How do they roll? Been thinking about throwing some on as they're often on sale but worried they'll be heavy and slow


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## ideate (May 28, 2016)

jayvee said:


> Are those the 2.8 super moto x? How do they roll? Been thinking about throwing some on as they're often on sale but worried they'll be heavy and slow


They're actually pretty good. They're not like Hookworms if you've ever had those before. These actually feel lighter! Welcome to try mine if you're local. They are FAT though so if they're running lower psi's they get a bit sluggish. But all tyres do I suppose.

Where on sale? I've bought many but all have been pretty expensive at about $70.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Anybody put a set of calipers on a 275x3.8 Hodag installed on 35mm rims?

I know it's about 3.5" (87-89mm) on a 45mm rim once stretched. I know it can grow as big as 92mm on a 50mm rim. 

What I'm unsure about is how wacky this tire will get on more versatile rims in 35mm internal width range.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

After a few days to stretch the 2.8 Magic Mary measures at 2.7" wide at the casing and 2.75" wide at the outer lugs on my 30mm internal rims. I'd say bang on 2.8" on proper 35mm internal rims. Really pushing the boundaries of clearance with my standard Pike sue to the lug height, fortunately this will get better with a bit of wear.


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## Losvar (Mar 21, 2016)

GRPABT1 said:


> After a few days to stretch the 2.8 Magic Mary measures at 2.7" wide at the casing and 2.75" wide at the outer lugs on my 30mm internal rims. I'd say bang on 2.8" on proper 35mm internal rims. Really pushing the boundaries of clearance with my standard Pike sue to the lug height, fortunately this will get better with a bit of wear.


Need pictures of them mounted!


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## dbnickles (Sep 15, 2005)

quick ?... are the new crop of 27.5/2.6 tires considered + tires. I'm looking to build a winter set for my 29er and I would like to keep the bottom bracket height close to the same. I'm not a huge fan of tires bigger then this, thanks in advance as I haven't seen any info on this


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## Thustlewhumber (Nov 25, 2011)

Did a quick read through and didn't see anything about the Specialized Butcher 2.8's? Side by side comparison of the knobs makes the Minion DHF look tiny, and makes my Purgatory 3.0's look like semi-slicks. Super chunky tread pattern looks almost like a dirt bike tire.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

dbnickles
Going from a 2.4 x29er to a 3"x 27.5 drops the BB roughly 1/4". Personally, going from any 29" wheel/tire to even a 2.8" in 27.5 rim yields me many more peddle strikes when the going gets rough. 
I'd say your best bet would be a 2.6" on a 29er rim if you can fit that in your frame. You would actually gain tad of BB height and also have a bigger contact patch. The nobby nick is the only one out right now I know of but vittora (mescal) and maxxis (recon) have both said they are about to come out with some 2.6" this spring.


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## Negotiator50 (Apr 21, 2012)

Just put on Rocket Ron's 3.0 on 45mm internal / 52mm outer nextie rims. Rolling resistance was great, but I felt that the front was washing out a little too much for my liking. I had previously tried Nobby Nicks on the front but felt too bogged down. Any suggestions for a 3.0 tire with knobs between those of RR and NN that would be good for the front?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


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## WMBigs (Jul 11, 2009)

Negotiator50 said:


> Just put on Rocket Ron's 3.0 on 45mm internal / 52mm outer nextie rims. Rolling resistance was great, but I felt that the front was washing out a little too much for my liking. I had previously tried Nobby Nicks on the front but felt too bogged down. Any suggestions for a 3.0 tire with knobs between those of RR and NN that would be good for the front?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


The Specialized Purgatories work great for our conditions. Hard pack and loose over hard pack. Round and sharp rocks. Not good in mud, but our mud will usually pack up and bring you to a halt very quickly.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

WMBigs said:


> The Specialized Purgatories work great for our conditions. Hard pack and loose over hard pack. Round and sharp rocks. Not good in mud, but our mud will usually pack up and bring you to a halt very quickly.


I'll second that - running Purgatory Grids f/r on Nobl TR45 rims on my ACV. They seem to roll very well, and aren't too heavy considering their volume.


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## pjames12 (Jan 29, 2017)

Thought I'd share, Merlin's has 3.0 NNs for $33...just picked up a pair. These will be my first plus tires ever, and they seem to be a popular choice so I hopefully they work out for me!


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

pjames12 said:


> Thought I'd share, Merlin's has 3.0 NNs for $33...just picked up a pair. These will be my first plus tires ever, and they seem to be a popular choice so I hopefully they work out for me!


3.0 N.Nics came on my h/t and is a good all round tire for my riding area. Nothing extreme or fast, just bumping around on the trails and impressive stiction on roots, upper climbs with loose surface, and smooth riding on a h/t set up in my case- love the ride. I like the look of the Rocket Ron and found a nice price so that's on the shelf for rear replacement after I run it down. It'll be RR rear NN front.


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## jayvee (Sep 29, 2016)

Thanks I am in Sweden so doubt you are close by ?

This thread gave me doubts, but I'd still like the try em. http://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-plus-bikes/schwalbe-super-moto-x-2-8-a-1011730.html

They seem to be on sale on a few euro sites, if you're in the US shipping will probably be too high. But here's a link anyway https://www.bike24.com/p2101819.html


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

Has anyone expierence with Spec Purgatory 3.0" Grid up rear? Want it for technical up- and downhill _and_ some (steep) miles on fire roads.
What pressure?
Thanx.


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## buballez (Feb 14, 2009)

*WTB ranger tires*

Shoot me an email at [email protected] if your tires are still for sale.

Thanks

Brian



Nurse Ben said:


> Plus Tires For Sale:
> 
> *SOLD *Maxxis Minion DHF/DHR 120tpi, 27.5 x 2.8, complete set, very fresh, best offer plus $15 shipping.
> 
> ...


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## I hate tree gates (Oct 22, 2017)

Curious what everyone’s views are on the new Magic Mary’s and Forekasters

I have run 3.0, 2.8, and now will never run anything but 2.6 again. It is literally the greatest thing I have found in yrs on my bike. Rolls fast, crazy grip, lightweight, and I have less tubeless burps and sidewall roll on fast tight corners.

Currently running rekon+ 2.6’s and find them super grippy with fast roll and only like 720 weight. They have held up well to all the rock gardens I can throw at them even with the 120 casings.

I loved my rocket Rocket Ron’s but they don’t make enough sealant to fix the constant schwalbe leaks.

Chupacabra 2.8’s roll fast but offer next to no traction.

Ikon’s were nice, but I liked Rekon+ way better. 

Let me know everyone’s thoughts on Magic Mary’s and Forekasters


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## RVbldr (Sep 10, 2015)

quite.right said:


> Has anyone expierence with Spec Purgatory 3.0" Grid up rear? Want it for technical up- and downhill _and_ some (steep) miles on fire roads.
> What pressure?
> .


Yep. Running the Spec Purg 3" on the rear and have been for the last 2 years in the Seattle area of PNW. I'm about 210# with gear and run about 15 -16 psi. I'm happy with the tire here even through the winter, and we do a lot of climbing around here. I did upgrade the front to a High Roller II, which seems to have more grip and less washout in the dry stuff.


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## Smithhammer (Jul 18, 2015)

Love my DHF/Rekon combo - please Maxxis, make these in a_ real _2.8" tire!


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I hate tree gates said:


> Curious what everyone's views are on the new Magic Mary's and Forekasters
> 
> I have run 3.0, 2.8, and now will never run anything but 2.6 again. It is literally the greatest thing I have found in yrs on my bike. Rolls fast, crazy grip, lightweight, and I have less tubeless burps and sidewall roll on fast tight corners.
> 
> ...


Sounds to me like you wouldn't like the Mary if you prefer those light fast rolling tyres.


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## Mikeyff (Sep 15, 2017)

I hate tree gates said:


> Curious what everyone's views are on the new Magic Mary's and Forekasters
> 
> I have run 3.0, 2.8, and now will never run anything but 2.6 again. It is literally the greatest thing I have found in yrs on my bike. Rolls fast, crazy grip, lightweight, and I have less tubeless burps and sidewall roll on fast tight corners.
> 
> ...


What size rim are you running 2.6 reKons on?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## I hate tree gates (Oct 22, 2017)

I am running these...
Kitsuma 27.5 Carbon Fiber Mountain Wheels | Nox Composites

42mm external and 36mm internal. I broke/bent beyond repair 2 hoops before I went carbon. Makes all the difference in the world on plus. I lost nearly 1.5lbs rotating weight switching the hoops alone to carbon. Makes the bike feel so much more snappy and playful and after a yr of all the abuse I can throw at them they are still perfect. They have lifetime warranty also and were lighter at the time than the compatible enve's at nearly half the price.

Can't speak highly enough of this wheel.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Been riding with the new 2.8 Magic Mary up front for 6 rides now and I love it. Seriously don't know why they took so long to release this tyre, I couldn't ask more from a chunk of rubber honestly. It's has grip all the way at maximum lean angles but still predictable everywhere in between, no vague spot like I noticed on the 2.8 Minion DHF. Thank you Schwalbe.


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

You guys running Magic Mary's up front. What are you running in back. I like my NoNi 3.0's on the 6Fiddie Plus for most all my riding but want/need a more rocky gnar downhill friendly tires to put on my 29'r wheelset for those occasions when I hit the DH style trails locally. The NoNi sidewalls just get eaten up on that network of trails. Is running a MM front and back typical or is there something better suited for the rear. Minions are the preferred tire by most regulars, I'm sort of hoping to keep it in the Schwabe family if possible. A 29x2.6 would be my desire but I'm not seeing them in the MM's yet.


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

*Schwalbe Magic Mary Addix Speedgrip 2.8*

With winter coming i just swapped out NN 2.8 for Magic Mary Speedgrip 2.8. It weighs in at 1049g and i'm running 14psi. First long ride with it today and the grip is mind blowing, but i guess you'd kind of expect this. The bigger revelation is the rolling speed, very little noticeable drag and not much harder to pedal with than the NN it replaced. See how it performs after few more rides in different conditions, but if it carries on like this i could see it staying on all year round


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

More photos please and also actual dimensions if possible.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Pics of my 2.8 magic Mary in my (slightly sanded for clearance) standard 27.5 non boost pike. Mounted to 30mm internal Zelvy rims.

I have this paired with a WTB Breakout 2.5 and it's a great combo, love these tyres.


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

gpgalanis said:


> More photos please and also actual dimensions if possible.


Measurements on 35mm (internal) Derby rims:

- Magic Mary 2.8 speedgrip - 73mm/ 2.85" Wide & 28.75"/730mm Wheel 
Diameter
- Nobby Nic 2.8 Trailstar - Identical to MM

The Nobby Nic 2.8 has stretched a bit and is 0.05" wider than when i first fitted it about 2 months ago, so i expect the MM will probably do the same.

I've ridden with the MM and NN combo a couple more times since my last post in considerably muddier conditions and i'm still just as impressed. Up until now i've been unconvinced by 2.8s in muddy conditions, but the MM works really well cutting through, finding grip and clearing too.


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## bikeny (Feb 26, 2004)

0.5" wider? You sure about that?


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

bikeny said:


> 0.5" wider? You sure about that?


yes sorry missed a zero meant 0.05


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## boblike (Mar 13, 2012)

teknorob said:


> yes sorry missed a zero meant 0.05


Is your Pike a boost version. Do you think it will fit in a standard non boost 29er Pike?


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

boblike said:


> Is your Pike a boost version. Do you think it will fit in a standard non boost 29er Pike?


yes it its 29er boost but there's loads of clearance either side so a non boost fork should be fine


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

PHeller said:


> Anybody put a set of calipers on a 275x3.8 Hodag installed on 35mm rims?
> 
> I know it's about 3.5" (87-89mm) on a 45mm rim once stretched. I know it can grow as big as 92mm on a 50mm rim.
> 
> What I'm unsure about is how wacky this tire will get on more versatile rims in 35mm internal width range.


Interested in this as well... For a friend.


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## Gios78 (Sep 2, 2012)

Hi everyone, I'm looking for a 27.5 plus tire with same rolling character as my JJ 4.4 snake skins. The only other tire I'm familiar with is the Dirt Wizard on my KM. I'd like to stay at 3.0 if possible but I'm willing to go down to 2.8. I rarely ride aggressive terrain but still value decent sidewall protection, just not as much as less rolling resistance. Thx


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Your not going to match a 4.4 fat tire to 3.0 plus tire for "rolling charactersistics". Just nothing is going to match up with tire sizes that are so different. I have a 4.4 JJ on the back of my fat bike (4.8 front) and a few different plus tires. Nothing comes close. 

Biggest reason is, the tire size. 27.5+ rides so much different than big 26" fat tires.

If your looking for low rolling resistance there is plenty, high cornering traction there is plenty. Something that as good of a mix of the 2 as a JJ, nothing.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## WLB (Apr 25, 2011)

Anybody running 27.5+ 2.8" Rekons on 45mm internal rims? I've got a set of LB rims that I'm having relaced to Onyx hubs for my Hightower build. I currently have a set of Terrene Chunk 3.0 tires on them, and will probably ride them till they wear out, but I really don't want to go Fat Bike Jr, as I already have a fat bike with 4.8 tires, I want something more like the 2.8 Rekons for longer rides, both up and down, but not sure how well they would play with the wide rims.


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## Faapaa (Dec 6, 2007)

WLB said:


> Anybody running 27.5+ 2.8" Rekons on 45mm internal rims? I've got a set of LB rims that I'm having relaced to Onyx hubs for my Hightower build. I currently have a set of Terrene Chunk 3.0 tires on them, and will probably ride them till they wear out, but I really don't want to go Fat Bike Jr, as I already have a fat bike with 4.8 tires, I want something more like the 2.8 Rekons for longer rides, both up and down, but not sure how well they would play with the wide rims.


I'm also running LB i45 rims and tried them with nobby nics in 3.0 on a hightower, sadly I thought it was too tight. Am also afraid it will be too tight with highrollers in 3.0. What clearance do you get with the Terrene 3.0 tires?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## EC3 (Nov 16, 2016)

I rode Rekons on my Derby 45's when I first got them. They were fine on the TBLTC but when I moved them to the Hightower I noticed more pedal strikes and have been on 3.0 Schwalbes ever since. One note, the Rekons didn't like PSI under 15, they felt very sluggish and squirmy.


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## Faapaa (Dec 6, 2007)

EC3 said:


> I rode Rekons on my Derby 45's when I first got them. They were fine on the TBLTC but when I moved them to the Hightower I noticed more pedal strikes and have been on 3.0 Schwalbes ever since. One note, the Rekons didn't like PSI under 15, they felt very sluggish and squirmy.


I liked the rekons, good tires but somewhat small. Nice to hear the did fit on 45 rims

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## WLB (Apr 25, 2011)

Faapaa said:


> I'm also running LB i45 rims and tried them with nobby nics in 3.0 on a hightower, sadly I thought it was too tight. Am also afraid it will be too tight with highrollers in 3.0. What clearance do you get with the Terrene 3.0 tires?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ah, that's the rub, so to speak. The LB 45's are just getting rebuilt, so I haven't had the chance to try them yet. May find out the Terrene 3.0 is too wide in the back. Maybe run a 3.0 up front with a Rekon 2.8 in the back


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## rupps5 (Apr 9, 2010)

Sorry, wrong thread...


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## teknorob (Apr 12, 2014)

*Nobby Nic & Magic Mary 2.8 Combo After 250'ish miles*

Quick update on Nobby Nic (trailstar) & Magic Mary (addix speedgrip) 2.8. I've ridden my evil following MB about 250 miles with this combo, mixture of muddy, wet and dry root infested trails in the last 4 weeks and i cant say enough good things about these tyres. Ive been running the NN for over a year, front and back, so this wasnt too much of revelation, but the MM 2.8 speedgrip has been awesome on the front. Sure the grip is amazing, but its the rolling speed and the damping which have convinced most. I know its very much personal choice, but i have tried Reckon and HR 2.8s, which i liked but didnt think much of their feel compared to Schwalbe, yet until the MM 2.8 came along they were missing a tyre that could cope with bike park visits and the more gnarly trail stuff so id stuck with the HR 2.8 for these occasions. However i 100% will be sticking with MM up front for these bigger occasions because for my riding style/ ability it offers far more all round performance than the HR 2.8. I know this comments going to start a few fires and as i say this is just a personal preference based on where/ what i ride and how i ride it


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## TenBeers (Apr 17, 2009)

WLB said:


> Anybody running 27.5+ 2.8" Rekons on 45mm internal rims? I've got a set of LB rims that I'm having relaced to Onyx hubs for my Hightower build. I currently have a set of Terrene Chunk 3.0 tires on them, and will probably ride them till they wear out, but I really don't want to go Fat Bike Jr, as I already have a fat bike with 4.8 tires, I want something more like the 2.8 Rekons for longer rides, both up and down, but not sure how well they would play with the wide rims.


I'm running the Rekon+ 2.8" on an i9 45mm wheelset. Pretty good profile, just enough clearance on the back of my Remedy. While they seem to work fine, I think 45mm is about the max I would do with this tire, and they might do a bit better on a 40mm rim (marketing pics actually show it mounted on a MulFut 50mm). As someone else stated, they don't seem to feel right at lower pressures, kinda squirmy, so I keep them at 18R/17F psi. Great grip, no issues in corners, but I haven't hit any extremely off-camber turns really hard yet. Anyway, you should be fine. What I have found on the interwebs seems to indicate that a rim width at 50% to 65% of tire width is the ideal range, and 45mm with 2.8 is 63%. From the combinations I have run, this range seems pretty accurate and I tend to like rims on the wider side. The stock Stache 29+ rims are 48mm with a 3.0, which is the same 63%.

I got the SilkShield/3C/EXO model, and I noticed a wiggle in the rear yesterday. 
I thought it was my rim, but I checked and the rim is true. So, the tire casing on that one must be off quite a bit, the bead is fully seated. Front seems fine. Didn't seem to notice it while riding, just looked down when riding between trails and noticed a hop to the side. If this kind of thing bugs you, you may want to mount up with a tube first and check uniformity.

I've got a set of 2.6" on the way that I am going to try on the stock 30mm rims as a comparison. That's 45%, which is a little on the low side, but nothing like the 29mm/3.0" combo Specialized was originally putting on the 6Fattie.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I would definitely agree the 2.8 recons are quite a bit smaller, bead to bead width, they were equivalent to my 2.6 Nobby nicks.:bluefrown: I think it’s a safe bet that the highrollers 3.0 will be skinnier then the NN 3.0. I slapped an apex, adixx speed grip 3.0NN with a foam Huck Norris rim protector for my rear tire and I feel confident plowing BIG CHUNK petty fast at 12psi, 170lbs all up rider weight. Heavy but good piece of mind in the middle of nowhere. 
As far as rim to tire %s go, I think the 50 to 65% range, rim to tire is ideal for casing support at nice low PSIs but, that’s just part of the overall picture. The weight of 45mm aluminum rims was quite noticible to me and I would have been happy with 40mm. I ended up replacing them with Nextie 42mm carbon rims and saved a TON of weight and I’d never buy a little recon again, the peddle strikes were frequent with occasional BB/chain ring encounters. 

Anther consideration is side wall exposure. With most current tires the tread/nobbies do not extend past and shield the casing if the rim is much over about 55% of the tire size. On big long rough rides I do not feel comfortable with my casing/side walls exposed that much, more rim exposure too. Sidewall danage could make for a very long walk.:smallviolin: I heard a folded dollar bill covering a tear can work in a pinch...to keep your tube from squirting out the tear allowing you to roll home.
Word is with the newish wide rim standards more “wide trail” type tires will follow to help this issue.
Bigger in not always better, just mostly


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## MTBforlife (Apr 27, 2009)

Negotiator50 said:


> Just put on Rocket Ron's 3.0 on 45mm internal / 52mm outer nextie rims. Rolling resistance was great, but I felt that the front was washing out a little too much for my liking. I had previously tried Nobby Nicks on the front but felt too bogged down. Any suggestions for a 3.0 tire with knobs between those of RR and NN that would be good for the front?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


I love the 3.0 Rocket Ron on the rear. I have been running a 3.0 Trail star Nobbie Nic up front with great success. With plus tires being so sensitive to pressure it may come down to adjusting pressure by a half-a-pound to dial it in.

Cheers


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

I just got some plus rims (Industry 9 450 27.5) and now im looking for some tires. I was thinking of trying out a WTB Trail Boss 3.0 up front with a 2.8 Ranger on the rear or a 2.8 Highroller 2 up front with Recon 2.8 on the rear? 

Im looking to use them from dry hard pack to soft dirt, some rocks. 

Any suggestions?


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

sml-2727 said:


> I just got some plus rims (Industry 9 450 27.5) and now im looking for some tires. I was thinking of trying out a WTB Trail Boss 3.0 up front with a 2.8 Ranger on the rear or a 2.8 Highroller 2 up front with Recon 2.8 on the rear?
> 
> Im looking to use them from dry hard pack to soft dirt, some rocks.
> 
> Any suggestions?


Am I reading specs correctly on what you have? 23mm iD? I'm just curious as I bought all my wheel components and had them built but I have a buddy that is borrowing my fattie set now to try and he wants a set and is asking if I can help him get hooked up. I'm running ARC 35's and wouldn't go any narrower. I've thought about maybe going carbon, now. Just toying with the idea of factory builds.


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## sml-2727 (Nov 16, 2013)

Oh My Sack! said:


> Am I reading specs correctly on what you have? 23mm iD? I'm just curious as I bought all my wheel components and had them built but I have a buddy that is borrowing my fattie set now to try and he wants a set and is asking if I can help him get hooked up. I'm running ARC 35's and wouldn't go any narrower. I've thought about maybe going carbon, now. Just toying with the idea of factory builds.


No the I9 backcountry 450's are 45 inner and 48.8 outer width.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

Faapaa said:


> I'm also running LB i45 rims and tried them with nobby nics in 3.0 on a hightower, sadly I thought it was too tight. Am also afraid it will be too tight with highrollers in 3.0. What clearance do you get with the Terrene 3.0 tires?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The Chunk i have on the front of my bike measures just over 3" on an i45 rim at 14-17psi. Put a half in hole in the rear Chunk due to a landing directly on a jagged rock, replaced with 2.8 McFly. It measures 2.8" exactly on an i45 rim at 18psi.

Sorry I didn't see this sooner.


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## MTBforlife (Apr 27, 2009)

GRPABT1 said:


> Sounds to me like you wouldn't like the Mary if you prefer those light fast rolling tyres.


I agree. Magic Mary is an awesome tire. It is extremely heavy.


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## AxelNose (Sep 5, 2017)

I literally read every post and am still confused 🤷🏼*♂🤷🏼*♂

Ok here’s my dilemma. 
I have a Stumpy 29 with the standard roval rims running 2.35 E13 TRS (f) aggressor 2.3 (r) and I just acquired a set of cheap Alex 40mm rims in 27+ and put some 3” Purgatory Grids back and front for the DH/shuttle days, but... they are so damn heavy at 1250g per tyre and just fun sapping comparing to my 29 wheelset and the grip isn’t worth the effort. So should I put a set of 3” NN (f) and 3” RR (r) and make them my xc wheelset and keep the 29 set as my Enduro/DH set.


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## techfersure (Dec 17, 2010)

Chunk is best tires period for all the terrain diversity here in Eastern Pa and roll well. Have used Bridgers, Wizards, Dura Crux Ground Controls.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

The NN 3” FRONT with RR 3” REAR was a great set up for me! Fast and plush with great efficiency over sandy and cuncky terrain. I did suffer a bit on really steep technical climbs spinning out the RR, breaks loose rather abruptly too. I did hear the 2.8 RR has slightly bigger knobs. I’d do that if I did it again but, being an obsessive climber and snow rider I need the NN on both ends.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Is the Ranger still one of the largest true 3" tires? 

As in, in order to go bigger you've got to move up to the Duro 3.25 or 3.8 tires?


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## cameden (Aug 28, 2013)

how would y'all feel about this combo


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Stay away from the tire on the left lol. Heavy, narrow and just a bad design.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## cameden (Aug 28, 2013)

cameden said:


> View attachment 1176462
> 
> 
> how would y'all feel about this combo


Trailblazer on the left ranger in the right, both 2.8...gotta sneak them into a ROS 9 frame on 275 wheels...any other options from WTB I get a smoking deal on them?


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

xblitzkriegx said:


> the DW measures more like 2.75-2.8. its a very sturdy but heavy tire.
> 
> the terrene chunk is the same price as any of maxxis's 2.8-3.0 offerings and weighs 50g less in 120tpi and is the same in 60tpi.
> 
> if you ride somewhere it's predominately rocky/rooty/moist/slick, the chunk will work perfectly. its a slower rolling tire as evident from the tread pattern, but itll grip like no ones business. i run the 650x3.0 chunk front and rear. i would only trade them for HR2s, maybe not even then.


Thanks for the review, I'm pretty sure this is my next tire. I was wrestling with getting the DHF/DHR but I really don't want to step down to 2.8. Still kinda thinking about the Purg's for a bit less money, but it looks to me like the Terrene Chunk Tough has the most aggressive tread in a 3.0 tire. Maybe the HR II's are similar. But let's face it, anything is going to be more aggressive the the Chronicles I've got on now.


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## Honda Guy (Mar 29, 2011)

TheBaldBlur said:


> Thanks for the review, I'm pretty sure this is my next tire. I was wrestling with getting the DHF/DHR but I really don't want to step down to 2.8. Still kinda thinking about the Purg's for a bit less money,


You should go for the Purgatory Grids. I really love it as a front with the Ground Control rear.


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## Honda Guy (Mar 29, 2011)

To those who have gone from a 3.0 to a 2.8 - was the change in bottom bracket height noticeable? What did you like and not like about it?


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## gpgalanis (Apr 7, 2015)

I went from 3.0 NN to 2.8 DHF - DHR2 combo and I like the better traction but miss some of the floating feeling of the bigger tires. As for the BB I didn't notice any difference when riding.


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## bachman1961 (Oct 9, 2013)

MTBforlife said:


> I love the 3.0 Rocket Ron on the rear. I have been running a 3.0 Trail star Nobbie Nic up front with great success. With plus tires being so sensitive to pressure it may come down to adjusting pressure by a half-a-pound to dial it in.
> 
> Cheers


NN front and rear on the bike as new; 27.5 x 3.0 - doing fine for now.
Liked the look of RR and seen them on sale, got one thinking it would be good for the rear when time for new meat on the back.

See a lot of posts running this lately, .


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## pjames12 (Jan 29, 2017)

I'm going to be building up a second wheelset for my plus bike, and would like to get some different tires for it. I want to stick with 27.5x3.0. Currently running NN front and rear.

I think the HRII would be a good option for a front tire, but I'm not seeing a Maxxis 3.0 tire that would be good for the rear. The only other one I see really is the Chronicle--has anyone run that as a rear tire? Initial thoughts are it wouldn't offer enough grip, but if anyone has run it would like to hear about it.

Other option is Specialized Purgatory GRID front, Ground Control GRID rear. Specialized specs this on their Fuse's and it looks like it would be a good combo.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

The Chronicle is a tire for fun, for dry and flat conditions with a bigger part of pavement...
I use the Purg / Ground combination on my 29er and i'm very happy with that. Thats why i put the Purgs on front and rear on my plusbike. So i can recommend the named Specialized tires.
NN and GC are about the same grip-wise. The GC has a lower rolling resistance and the sides are more stable and robust.
You can try two HRII or Purg / Ground. The Purgy should have more Grip than the HRII.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Chronicles are what came stock on my bike in 27.5x3.0. In loose over hardpack they slide way too easily and have almost no braking grip. Rolling resistance is good, but I can't recommend it for a rear (or front) tire.


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## pjames12 (Jan 29, 2017)

That is what I was thinking with the Chronicle.

HRII front and rear is a viable option? I don't think it would roll well as a rear tire, looking at the tread pattern. That's what lead me to look at the Specialized tires--the GC looks like it would be a perfect rear tire.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

you would be trading a bit of speed over traction. whats more important to you? the hr2 wont be that bad, it has ramped center knobs at least. if you wanted a faster rear tire from maxxis, either use a rekon or an ikon depending on your needs.


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## pjames12 (Jan 29, 2017)

xblitzkriegx said:


> you would be trading a bit of speed over traction. whats more important to you? the hr2 wont be that bad, it has ramped center knobs at least. if you wanted a faster rear tire from maxxis, either use a rekon or an ikon depending on your needs.


Yeah, I wanna stick with 3.0 though. If Rekon was in 3.0 I'd probably go for an HRII/Rekon setup. Might go that way anyways with a 2.8 Rekon, but I like the bit of float that the 3.0 tire provides in the rear, especially on a hardtail.


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## j3ffro (May 8, 2015)

Honda Guy said:


> To those who have gone from a 3.0 to a 2.8 - was the change in bottom bracket height noticeable? What did you like and not like about it?


I went from a 3.0 Vee Crown Gem to 2.8 DHF/DHR and the bottom bracket drop was noticeable. I was pedal striking on things that I never even thought I could. I took them off after less than 200 miles, going to 3.0 HR2s, and the pedal strikes stopped.

That said, the DHF and DHR are damn good tires, but my bike was definitely designed for a 3.0 tire, so trying to make a 2.8 work was probably not my smartest move.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

j3ffro said:


> That said, the DHF and DHR are damn good tires, but my bike was definitely designed for a 3.0 tire, so trying to make a 2.8 work was probably not my smartest move.


If Maxxis would make the DHF / DHR in 3.0 that's probably all I'd ever run.


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## jpfurn (Oct 21, 2014)

I’ve ran to many tires to mention, but was also forced to stick to 3.0’s because of BB height and rim protection. I ran NN’s for awhile which I love for the volume, but was blown away on how much better the HR2 was up front. I noticed a huge gain in traction the first corner I encountered. It is a great upgrade! I bought two expecting to replace the rear NN, but I think they compliment each other. That being said I have a brand new HR2 3C if anyone is looking for one.


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## RVbldr (Sep 10, 2015)

jpfurn said:


> ...but was blown away on how much better the HR2 was up front. I noticed a huge gain in traction the first corner I encountered. It is a great upgrade!


 Running HR2 on the front, and Purg on the back, same impression. I really like the HR2 up front for our PNW area.


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

How does the HR2 compare to DHF or DHR2 for rolling resistance?


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## stangmanrider (Oct 18, 2017)

I have a 2017 Cannondale Cujo 1 which came with some stock Comp. WTB Ranger Tires which can't be mounted tubeless. I purchased a set of Maxxis Minion DHF/DHRII tire combo for the Cujo in size 27.5X2.8. I am going to set them up tubeless and was wondering how much "Stan's" fluid do I add for a tire of this size - 3oz., 4oz. or more would you recommend. Any other tips/tricks/recommendations to help me with this setup would be appreciated. Just waiting on the fluid,tape,etc. from Stan's to be delivered on Friday and hopefully do the work over the weekend. Thanks!


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## scrrll (Mar 31, 2017)

stangmanrider said:


> I have a 2017 Cannondale Cujo 1 which came with some stock Comp. WTB Ranger Tires which can't be mounted tubeless. I purchased a set of Maxxis Minion DHF/DHRII tire combo for the Cujo in size 27.5X2.8. I am going to set them up tubeless and was wondering how much "Stan's" fluid do I add for a tire of this size - 3oz., 4oz. or more would you recommend. Any other tips/tricks/recommendations to help me with this setup would be appreciated. Just waiting on the fluid,tape,etc. from Stan's to be delivered on Friday and hopefully do the work over the weekend. Thanks!


I used about 4 oz mounting same tires on nobl tr45 rims.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

stangmanrider said:


> I have a 2017 Cannondale Cujo 1 which came with some stock Comp. WTB Ranger Tires which can't be mounted tubeless. I purchased a set of Maxxis Minion DHF/DHRII tire combo for the Cujo in size 27.5X2.8. I am going to set them up tubeless and was wondering how much "Stan's" fluid do I add for a tire of this size - 3oz., 4oz. or more would you recommend. Any other tips/tricks/recommendations to help me with this setup would be appreciated. Just waiting on the fluid,tape,etc. from Stan's to be delivered on Friday and hopefully do the work over the weekend. Thanks!


I use two oz. No need to put that much sealant in. The only time I had two oz of sealant fail me is when I put a half inch hole in the tread and hole in the bead at the same time.

If it matters, I use orange seal.


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## Honda Guy (Mar 29, 2011)

xblitzkriegx said:


> I use two oz. No need to put that much sealant in. The only time I had two oz of sealant fail me is when I put a half inch hole in the tread and hole in the bead at the same time.
> 
> If it matters, I use orange seal.


Two ounces will do it and you'll have less rotating mass to push uphill, but I find that putting in 3-4oz means I don't have to refill my sealant as often.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

good point. i popped the bead on my front tire and checked the build up after 9 months. it was minimal so i put it back on and added a tiny amount. the rear tire destroyed itself so i had to clean/inspect/replace it. that was in sep/oct. 

dunno if it matters or not but i used kapton tape to seal the rim. zero orange seal was built up on the kapton tape. none, zilch. i didnt expect that.


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0. Just bought a new Karate Monkey Plus bike and they were on it. Very stout tire but I was struggling on my first 3 rides before I pulled off a wheel and held the rim/tire combo in my hands. Holy CHIT was that a heavy-assed combo. Granted, they had plus tubes in them and those things are incredibly heavy but that Wizard is a chunk of tire. I have 3 or 4 sets of Nobby Nics in my inventory so I put those on and set them up tubeless, of course. Ahhhh....much better! Anyhow, I just skimmed and searched a bit through this thread. So much backlog of info but didn't notice much on the Dirt Wizard. They remind a lot of Minions but I haven't had my hands on Plus Minions yet. Are the Dirt Wizards a decent tire with a long service life? I'd consider them for riding some of the gnarliest trails we have in our area but my regular riding haunts, though chunky and technical, don't require quite so much heft like these DW's have. Impressions from anyone that's run them through their paces for a while?


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## david.p (Apr 11, 2011)

Run the 60tpi 29x3 on the front of my Jones paired with a 29x2.4 Goma in back on NE roots and rocks. Love the Dirt Wizard here - not as bouncy as most 29x3s and handles everything.


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## stangmanrider (Oct 18, 2017)

stangmanrider said:


> I have a 2017 Cannondale Cujo 1 which came with some stock Comp. WTB Ranger Tires which can't be mounted tubeless. I purchased a set of Maxxis Minion DHF/DHRII tire combo for the Cujo in size 27.5X2.8. I am going to set them up tubeless and was wondering how much "Stan's" fluid do I add for a tire of this size - 3oz., 4oz. or more would you recommend. Any other tips/tricks/recommendations to help me with this setup would be appreciated. Just waiting on the fluid,tape,etc. from Stan's to be delivered on Friday and hopefully do the work over the weekend. Thanks!


Well I took the time today, rainy Sunday, to change my tires and set them up as tubeless. The job went pretty much as planned but the hardest part was wrestling on the Maxxis tires on the rims. That last foot or so was really hard and just took some patience and I had to let them sit and stretch some. Even after putting the tires on the rims yesterday and letting them sit overnight, they still were a bear to put on. Setting the bead for me was easy as I have a compressor with a large tank that I use to blow out my sprinkler lines in the yard. Bead Popped real easy!

Hopefully I don't have to remove them on the trails for any reason because I don't know how I would get them back on. Hopefully by bringing some 2oz. Bottles of Stan's sealant and having the DynaPlug with me I won't have to worry about flats anymore. I ended up using around 3 - 3.5 oz. of fluid in each tire. Thanks for all the help and advice. I have them sitting horizontal now with 35lbs. of air in them. Will air them down to 18psi/20psi front/back to start with tomorrow morning when I put them back on the bike.


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

Maxxis tyres aren't normally an overly tight fit, even on Stans rims. You probably just need to work a bit more on pushing the bead into the centre channel, and do the part near the valve last.


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## Miker J (Nov 4, 2003)

Maxxis Rekon 2.8 on an i30 rim 

Ok ???

A real 2.8 probably not, but I know Maxxis runs small.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

Honda Guy said:


> To those who have gone from a 3.0 to a 2.8 - was the change in bottom bracket height noticeable? What did you like and not like about it?


went to a 2.8" in the rear with a 3" up front. dropped ~2-3mm. chunk is 28.75 and the mcfly is about 28.5. .25" = ~6mm. half that for radius, so 3mm. only dropped size in the rear so overall effect is slight. i measured 2mm drop (from memory). ie, not enough to notice.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

Oh My Sack! said:


> Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0. Just bought a new Karate Monkey Plus bike and they were on it. Very stout tire but I was struggling on my first 3 rides before I pulled off a wheel and held the rim/tire combo in my hands. Holy CHIT was that a heavy-assed combo. Granted, they had plus tubes in them and those things are incredibly heavy but that Wizard is a chunk of tire. I have 3 or 4 sets of Nobby Nics in my inventory so I put those on and set them up tubeless, of course. Ahhhh....much better! Anyhow, I just skimmed and searched a bit through this thread. So much backlog of info but didn't notice much on the Dirt Wizard. They remind a lot of Minions but I haven't had my hands on Plus Minions yet. Are the Dirt Wizards a decent tire with a long service life? I'd consider them for riding some of the gnarliest trails we have in our area but my regular riding haunts, though chunky and technical, don't require quite so much heft like these DW's have. Impressions from anyone that's run them through their paces for a while?


no direct info. have read many peoples experience with them. the consensus i gather is that they run slightly narrow, are extremely heavy, have excellent traction in all areas, high rolling resistance, and generally only useful for extremely rough trails. great front tire.

imo the hr2 or chunk is a better choice but a DW mainly due to weight as neither sacrifice durability to the DW.


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## stangmanrider (Oct 18, 2017)

phreeky said:


> Maxxis tyres aren't normally an overly tight fit, even on Stans rims. You probably just need to work a bit more on pushing the bead into the centre channel, and do the part near the valve last.


The rims I have are the stock ones that came on the Cannondale Cujo ! - WTB STX i35TCS. The bead was in the center channel and I did the section near the valve last. They were just really tight on these rims - the DHF was tighter than the DHRII. Hopefully now that they are on, it will stretch some to make it easier for maintenance.


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## Mugtree (Jun 28, 2007)

Thanks for the review esp in muddy conditions. I run this comb (but in 2.35 and 2.25) on my hard tail and they grip is amazing, snow and deep mud and super steep techy muddy and snowy drops, and super fast rolling too. On my full sus I currently have High roller 2.8s great tyre but the grad is killing me so thinking of this combo in ether 2.8 or most likely 2.6. Mmm which size will be best, need to think. Thank you.


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## Mugtree (Jun 28, 2007)

Sorry a quick question if you know. Would you choose the speed grip over the soft for all day use?


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## Mugtree (Jun 28, 2007)

teknorob said:


> Quick update on Nobby Nic (trailstar) & Magic Mary (addix speedgrip) 2.8. I've ridden my evil following MB about 250 miles with this combo, mixture of muddy, wet and dry root infested trails in the last 4 weeks and i cant say enough good things about these tyres. Ive been running the NN for over a year, front and back, so this wasnt too much of revelation, but the MM 2.8 speedgrip has been awesome on the front. Sure the grip is amazing, but its the rolling speed and the damping which have convinced most. I know its very much personal choice, but i have tried Reckon and HR 2.8s, which i liked but didnt think much of their feel compared to Schwalbe, yet until the MM 2.8 came along they were missing a tyre that could cope with bike park visits and the more gnarly trail stuff so id stuck with the HR 2.8 for these occasions. However i 100% will be sticking with MM up front for these bigger occasions because for my riding style/ ability it offers far more all round performance than the HR 2.8. I know this comments going to start a few fires and as i say this is just a personal preference based on where/ what i ride and how i ride it


Thank you. This is amazing to read. I have HR2 2.8, great but super draggy. Have ordered Rekons hoping this will help but looks like it won't. My hard tail has MM and NN and it's blindingly fast and the grip is amazing. Will try this combo on the full sus when I get some more money after spending so much on the Maxxis


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## eyeluvdirt (Dec 15, 2017)

If you don't care about weight you cannot beat the WTB Bridger, that thing will handle everything. I'm even riding it as a winter tire in Minnesota right now and it is demolishing it. It's fast rolling on pavement and has great grip even on technical rooty climbs.

For racing and summer riding I love the Rocket Ron 3.0's though... I race longer races 50 mile+ though so I might not be taking as much risk as some people on the more technical downhill parts. But they're light and fast rolling and I only have a few spots where I lose traction up hill, like wet logs where I can't get up and over it and keep my ass in the saddle. But, butt in saddle with these you never lose traction in my experience.


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## mhelander (May 9, 2014)

eyeluvdirt said:


> If you don't care about weight you cannot beat the WTB Bridger, that thing will handle everything. I'm even riding it as a winter tire in Minnesota right now and it is demolishing it. It's fast rolling on pavement and has great grip even on technical rooty climbs.


Well, to beat weight partially there is WTB Ranger. It's lighter, has even better rolling knobs and is my favorite winter tire here where trail grooves riding is big fun when over knee height deep!

The rubber in my Ranger TCS Fast Light Rolling variety, both front & rear. Just installed 2nd pair as rear knobs were almost gone, to regain little more grip for climbs & slippery fresh powder snow...


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## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

Anybody have a solid measurement for a ranger 3.0 on a 40mm internal???


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I've heard before that the Ranger3.0 and the NN 3.0 are the two largest 3" tires on the market. I'd like to further clarification of that. 

Of course, there is always the Duro Crux and Miner 3.25.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Ranger is 3.06 (measured 3.01 brand new at the knobs) on a 45mm rim so will be 2.9-3.0 on a 40mm.

Rangers, trail boss, and schwalbe tires I know for sure measure right on true to size on 40-45mm rims.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Duro miners 27x3, 75mm knob to knob on i36 rims. About 850 grams. Lots of volume and great traction. I run 12f/14r and weigh 180 rtr. Seem pretty durable too.
https://www.ridewill.it/p/en/duro-305650215-tire-mtb-275-miner-275-x-30-foldable-black/48730/


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## Chippertheripper (Sep 10, 2014)

Thanks y’all.


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## desertwheeler (Sep 1, 2009)

Anybody have experience with slaughter 2.8? I just put one on today and it measured 66mm on 34i wheels. Anybody run them?


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## MikeInPA (Mar 18, 2017)

Karlewski said:


> The NN 3" FRONT with RR 3" REAR was a great set up for me! Fast and plush with great efficiency over sandy and cuncky terrain. I did suffer a bit on really steep technical climbs spinning out the RR, breaks loose rather abruptly too. I did hear the 2.8 RR has slightly bigger knobs. I'd do that if I did it again but, being an obsessive climber and snow rider I need the NN on both ends.


This was my set up for most of last year, but with the 2.8 RR on the rear. Really great for just about everything, and they have been amazing in the snow. It's not a fast set up, but if you get the pressures right they are unstoppable in technical sections.

This season I'm headed back to a slightly faster tire, 2.8 Ikons front and rear. Ridden them twice so far this year and they were awesome on hard pack and rocks but they are close to useless in mud, so I put the stock wheels (Fuel EX8) back on with my "winter" NN/RR tires and I'm waiting for things to dry out.


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## MikeInPA (Mar 18, 2017)

Honda Guy said:


> To those who have gone from a 3.0 to a 2.8 - was the change in bottom bracket height noticeable? What did you like and not like about it?


I'm on a pedal strike machine (EX8) and I still like the 2.8 rear better overall. Quicker acceleration. Also, I think no matter what 27.5 tire I use, technique will prevent more strikes than an extra 5mm BB hight...just my opinion. Also, might be my imagination, but the 2.8 RR has suffered almost no sidewall abuse on the rear whereas the 3.0 NN that was back there was all scraped up with weeping everywhere. I think the slightly narrower tire back there slips between the rocks better while I can steer the 3.0 front to go over the rock instead of grazing the sidewall, if this makes any sense


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## Dr Evil (Sep 20, 2015)

MikeInPA said:


> I'm on a pedal strike machine (EX8) and I still like the 2.8 rear better overall. Quicker acceleration. Also, I think no matter what 27.5 tire I use, technique will prevent more strikes than an extra 5mm BB hight...just my opinion. Also, might be my imagination, but the 2.8 RR has suffered almost no sidewall abuse on the rear whereas the 3.0 NN that was back there was all scraped up with weeping everywhere. I think the slightly narrower tire back there slips between the rocks better while I can steer the 3.0 front to go over the rock instead of grazing the sidewall, if this makes any sense


I'm on the same bike. 2.8 Rekons and switched to 165mm cranks. Looking forward to this upcoming riding season.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

Do you think the shorter cranks helped, made a big difference? Personally I was surprised how may more peddle strikes I was having with a 2.8 rear Recon vs the 3” NN and was considering trying the shorter cranks too. On my Pony Rustler I can also fit 29 wheels and the 29x2.6 NNs are awesome clearance wise but . . . Sometimes I’d still rather be on real plus tires.


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## Dr Evil (Sep 20, 2015)

Karlewski said:


> Do you think the shorter cranks helped, made a big difference? Personally I was surprised how may more peddle strikes I was having with a 2.8 rear Recon vs the 3" NN and was considering trying the shorter cranks too. On my Pony Rustler I can also fit 29 wheels and the 29x2.6 NNs are awesome clearance wise but . . . Sometimes I'd still rather be on real plus tires.


I haven't installed them yet but will shortly for the upcoming riding season. Going from 175mm to 165mm. It should definitely make a difference. I'll take any improvement. Plus, I'm 5'4" and the more I research I did the more I saw the reason to change.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Dr Evil said:


> I'm on the same bike. 2.8 Rekons and switched to 165mm cranks. Looking forward to this upcoming riding season.


What cranks did you get? Sram gpx BB or Shimano?


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## Dr Evil (Sep 20, 2015)

not2shabby said:


> what cranks did you get? Sram gpx bb or shimano?


sram crank gx eagle boost gxp 165 black 12 speed w 32t x-sync 2 direct mount chainring, bb not included.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Ahhh, Eagle wasn't out yet when I was looking for a 165. Ended up with a 170 GX, no 165 aftermarket.


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## phride (Sep 14, 2015)

Time for some new tires for me. I'm currently running 27.5x3 Purgatory Controls front & rear. I really like the tire on the front and the way it allows for a fairly mindless tip-and-rail turning experience, so I'm pretty sure that I'll go with the Purgatory Grid on the front. However, I think I want something different for the rear. I was not thrilled with the Ground Control. I thought the rubber compound a bit too hard on the shoulders, as it gave-up traction on some damp sidehill rock lines. Ideally, I'd get something softer than the Purg in the back, too, to get some additional straight-up-the-hill traction on steep rock hits. Lower-profile center knobs would be appreciated, too, but it seems like those go hand-in-hand with hard rubber, so I'll sacrifice a little and accept additional rolling resistance. Still, I'd rather not run something super heavy, if it can be helped. I'll gladly take suggestions for either a 2.8 or 3.0.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

phride said:


> Time for some new tires for me. I'm currently running 27.5x3 Purgatory Controls front & rear. I really like the tire on the front and the way it allows for a fairly mindless tip-and-rail turning experience, so I'm pretty sure that I'll go with the Purgatory Grid on the front. However, I think I want something different for the rear. I was not thrilled with the Ground Control. I thought the rubber compound a bit too hard on the shoulders, as it gave-up traction on some damp sidehill rock lines. Ideally, I'd get something softer than the Purg in the back, too, to get some additional straight-up-the-hill traction on steep rock hits. Lower-profile center knobs would be appreciated, too, but it seems like those go hand-in-hand with hard rubber, so I'll sacrifice a little and accept additional rolling resistance. Still, I'd rather not run something super heavy, if it can be helped. I'll gladly take suggestions for either a 2.8 or 3.0.


Take a look at the Kenda Havok Pro. I ran that one past year and really liked it.


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## trailwizard (Mar 12, 2018)

desertwheeler said:


> Anybody have experience with slaughter 2.8? I just put one on today and it measured 66mm on 34i wheels. Anybody run them?


I've ridden the 2.8 slaughter out back with a 3.0 purgatory up front. Wasn't very impressed on any particular terrain. Ended up with a 3.0 Purg/Purg combo and never looked back. I'm running 38mm wheels.


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## wreckster (May 22, 2014)

Same as above, The bike came like that. I actually like the slaughter. Something to note though, if aired down too low you get some squirm. I run the rear at 19PSI (235lbs with gear) and it is about perfect 16PSI squirms when suspension is compressed. Bunch of riding buddies are very surprised the grip I can manage climbing with the tread design, it just works.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

After being mired in the paralysis of analysis I finally picked some new tires for this spring. I knew I wanted 3.0 width and I'd had great luck with Maxxis in the past, but the only thing Maxxis offered me is the HRII, no slouch but I had the itch to try something new. I'd also had good luck Specialized tires on a previous bike and thought hard about the Purg's. Ultimately I bought the *Terrene Chunk (Light)* for the front and the *Vee Crown Gem Synthesis* for the rear.

Both tires mounted easily enough and both required a tube to get the beads to set. Using the tube wasn't a huge deal, but it was the first time I'd had to do that when setting up a tubeless tire. To be fair, my other tubeless tires had all seen limited use with a tube before being converted to tubeless, so that may have something to do with it.

The Chunk has an advertised weight of 940 gr and mine weighs 1024.

The Crown Gem has an advertised weight of 960 gr and mine weighs 1037.

~8% variance in weight seems like a lot as a percentage. By comparison I weighed the well worn Chronicles that I took off and one weighed right at, and the other slightly under Maxxis claimed weight .

The Chunk at full pressure measures 3.03" wide at the outer knobs.

The Crown Gem at full pressure measures 2.85" wide at the outer knobs.

These are on Devinci rims measuring 35mm inner width.

Both tires are taking a longer to seal up and stay sealed than anything I've run tubeless before. In fact, I'm still bleeding sealant from both tires enough that I'm not going to review how they ride until I feel confident airing them down. The Crown Gem has one nagging leak at the bead. I broke that bead, soaped it and reset it but it's still bleeding a little. The Chunk had 4 or 5 pinhole leaks in the sidewalls like someone had poked it with a straight pin (not saying they did, just that they were clean round holes, not jagged tears). You could hear and feel the air coming out there without any need of soapy water for a telltale. One sidewall hole is about 1/2 inch from the bead and that one worries me a bit as to how it will behave once aired down and flexing, but we'll see. I checked with some others who've run the Chunk and my experience seems to be unique so I'm not ready to condemn them. If need be, I'll have Terrene replace the tire and if that one behaves the same then, well....

Again, I'll report on how they ride once the sealant has cured enough that I feel comfortable airing them down to mid teens. For now, at high pressure, they're certainly knobbier than my Chronicles were but that was the idea.


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## agauna (Oct 26, 2016)

TheBaldBlur said:


> After being mired in the paralysis of analysis I finally picked some new tires for this spring. I knew I wanted 3.0 width and I'd had great luck with Maxxis in the past, but the only thing Maxxis offered me is the HRII, no slouch but I had the itch to try something new. I'd also had good luck Specialized tires on a previous bike and thought hard about the Purg's. Ultimately I bought the *Terrene Chunk (Light)* for the front and the *Vee Crown Gem Synthesis* for the rear.
> 
> I tried the Vee Crown Gem in 2.6 last year and really liked it. That somewhat hard sidewall seemed perfect for deflecting sharp rocks. However, after only a couple hard rides one of the knobs started to tear clean off. I could see the thread underneath. I ended up replacing it before a 25 mile epic. It may have been a one off so hopefully it'll work good for you, if so I'd consider buying that tire again.


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## VitaliT (Jan 17, 2015)

not2shabby said:


> Duro miners 27x3, 75mm knob to knob on i36 rims. About 850 grams. Lots of volume and great traction. I run 12f/14r and weigh 180 rtr. Seem pretty durable too.
> https://www.ridewill.it/p/en/duro-305650215-tire-mtb-275-miner-275-x-30-foldable-black/48730/


mine are 77mm on 40mmid rim


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## richj8990 (Apr 4, 2017)

These also have 26+ and 29+ in them but at least 1/2 are 27.5+:

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mtb-gear/35-plus-tires-a-comprehensive-guide-for-mountain-bikers/


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

TheBaldBlur said:


> Ultimately I bought the *Terrene Chunk (Light)* for the front and the *Vee Crown Gem Synthesis* for the rear.


Follow up to my own post with riding impressions. Once they both sealed up, they've held air very, very well. So I aired them down and took them for a few spins on several of my usual trails. The first hundred yards or so I noticed a definite increase in the rolling resistance, but after that I forgot all about it. Cornering bite and stopping grip is monumentally better than what I had. I can actually lean the bike over in corners now, couldn't do that before without outriggers. Braking power is like someone tossed out an anchor - it come s to a halt right. damn. *now*.

To be fair, I'm coming off Maxxis Chronicles, so ANY knobby tire would be an improvement! So in a way it may not be fair to rave about these tires in particular.

The first ride out, I easily cleared some obstacles on climbs that I'd struggled with before. "Hot starts" are a lot easier too since the back tire digs in and pushes instead of spinning in the scree like the Chroni's did. I'm still playing with tire pressure but so far it seems like I prefer these at a pound or two higher pressure than what I was running on the Maxxis. The Synthesis sidewalls on the Vee have slid off enough pointy rocks that I expect they'll hold up well. And the Light version (120tpi) of the Chunk is taking my Colorado terrain and riding style in stride. My riding partner is on NN 2.8's and he says he can feel loads more traction than his NN's. In fact he was all set to order a Chunk for his front but his Mojo won't take a 3.0 tire.

So 3 or 4 rides in and haven't been to Fruita or Moab yet, but so far they're great and I'd order them again! In fact, I'm kicking myself now that when I bought this bike last spring I should have cut the Chronicles off in favor of proper tires in the first place.


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## Dr Evil (Sep 20, 2015)

Dr Evil said:


> I'm on the same bike. 2.8 Rekons and switched to 165mm cranks. Looking forward to this upcoming riding season.


Rode 3 hours for the first time this season yesterday with the new cranks. HUGE DIFFERENCE! One pedal graze on trails that I would have multiple rock/root strikes. Definitely led to more confidence riding. Awesome upgrade for me.


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## nimm_zwei (Dec 28, 2005)

Here is a banal question: Is "plus" tire viable on a 65mm rim?

Furthermore, which 27.5x3.00 tires currently available on the market have the biggest volume?

I'm contemplating putting a "plus" tire on my _low fat_ Suzi Q for summer trail riding. In my case, this involves combining a 3-inch tire with 65mm Mulefut rims, which I know is a controversial move. I'm aiming to mitigate the negatives of combining 3-inch tires with such wider rims, hence the search biggest volume&#8230;

Images below (courtesy of Pinkbike) are just for an accurate illustration of how it all might look. It's not my bike. But I guess I should be looking for a bit more rounded profile...

Thanks for all input.


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## Osco (Apr 4, 2013)

I wouldn't go wider than 40mm ID rims for a 2.8 wide tire and 45mmID's for a 3.0 wide.
Loosing that nice rounded tire shape/profile would make transitions into lean angles very unpredictable in the traction and control arena.

And just as Important a more squared off tire profile would place more tread than was necessary on the ground when riding a straight line causing more rolling resistance than I would want to deal with.
I need my watts to climb not push a tire..
,
Would also likely expose more sidewall Inviting tire sidewall damage,

And now you have more rim weight for a slower accelerating bike,

ANnnnd now you have a rim that's more exposed to rock damage,

Need fatter than that ? It's Fat Bike Time


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

nimm_zwei said:


> Furthermore, which 27.5x3.00 tires currently available on the market have the biggest volume?
> .


Terrene Chunk
Surly Dirt Wizard
suspect some of the WTB tires may make that short list but can't be sure


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Duro Crux/Miner

Bontrager Hodag and similar 3.8's will be the next step up, and fit more comfortably on 65mm rims.


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## nimm_zwei (Dec 28, 2005)

Fair enough. To be clear, the Suzi Q is a fat bike, and the 65mm rims are what they are – great for 3.8” Minions, which I use.

I was thinking a seasonal tire swap for the summer, using the very same rims. I ride non-aggressive XC on that bike, so the unpredictable traction in cornering I wouldn't mind (probably), but the added rolling resistance (as opposed to standard/narrower rims) is no good, as it would negate the whole purpose of going 27.5+ for the summer, instead of stock 27.5x3.8. Also, I suspect that going tubeless with that combo would not work out well. So yeah, it's fat bike time year round, apparently.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I'd get a second 29er wheelset, personally.


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## nimm_zwei (Dec 28, 2005)

Strangely enough, only the carbon Suzi Q frame officially supports 29+. My alloy version doesn't. In any case, alternative wheelset is not something I'm willing to fund at this point, with the 177mm rear hub, XT 11-46T cassette, etc… a costly option.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

the Terrene Chunk measures about 3.125" at the knobs at 14psi on an i45mm rim and slightly wider on an i50 rim at the same psi. they measure 28.75" tall.

theye slow rolling but extremely aggressive. you will not have issues with climbing or braking. cornering is pretty good but climbing and braking are where they shine.


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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

Just try the 3"!


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## Ltdan12a (Jun 15, 2012)

xblitzkriegx said:


> the Terrene Chunk measures about 3.125" at the knobs at 14psi on an i45mm rim and slightly wider on an i50 rim at the same psi. they measure 28.75" tall.
> 
> theye slow rolling but extremely aggressive. you will not have issues with climbing or braking. cornering is pretty good but climbing and braking are where they shine.


Just replaced the Kenda Havok's on my Haro with a pair of Chunk 3.0's, and the climbing/braking grip is insane!!!


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Ltdan12a said:


> Just replaced the Kenda Havok's on my Haro with a pair of Chunk 3.0's, and the climbing/braking grip is insane!!!


Yep, I'm loving mine (thanks xBlitzkriegx!) I've got people on the trail asking about them almost every ride and pulling out their phones to take pictures to remind themselves later. They seem to be the "best tire no one's ever heard of" but everyone who's ridden my bike with them mounted comes back with their eyes wide and out come their phone. Personally the 27.5 x 3.0 is perfect for me but I hope they release a 29 x 3.0


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## Ltdan12a (Jun 15, 2012)

I've put a few Mcfly's in 29x2.8 on customer bikes and the response so far has been really good


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Yeah I've got a buddy who runs 29+ and was disappointed that he couldn't have a Chunk in 29+ but he's all in on getting a set of McFly's for his next tires


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## StevePodraza (Jun 29, 2006)

anyone running the new minion 27.5 x 2.8 on a mk3? what is your width? thank you


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

TheBaldBlur said:


> After being mired in the paralysis of analysis I finally picked some new tires for this spring. I knew I wanted 3.0 width and I'd had great luck with Maxxis in the past, but the only thing Maxxis offered me is the HRII, no slouch but I had the itch to try something new. I'd also had good luck Specialized tires on a previous bike and thought hard about the Purg's. Ultimately I bought the *Terrene Chunk (Light)* for the front and the *Vee Crown Gem Synthesis* for the rear.
> 
> Both tires mounted easily enough and both required a tube to get the beads to set. Using the tube wasn't a huge deal, but it was the first time I'd had to do that when setting up a tubeless tire. To be fair, my other tubeless tires had all seen limited use with a tube before being converted to tubeless, so that may have something to do with it.
> 
> ...


Hey i was wondering what size the vee crown gem tires that you bought? I see it measured 2.85" inches. I'm currently looking at a Marin pine mountain and it comes with 27.5x2.8 crown gem tires. 
Thanks Anthony


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

echefanthony said:


> Hey i was wondering what size the vee crown gem tires that you bought? I see it measured 2.85" inches. I'm currently looking at a Marin pine mountain and it comes with 27.5x2.8 crown gem tires.
> Thanks Anthony


27.5 x 3.0


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

I'm looking for some suggestions. What 27.5x2.8 tires are atleast 2.8" but not quite 3" when mounted? I'm looking for the tires that fall in between 2.8-3. Thanks


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## Phantomtracer (Jan 13, 2004)

Ritchey 2.8 Tire is your answer. Compared to the maxxis Rekon it is much wider and taller. It just barely fits in a boost 27.5 fork. Only issue I had was it’s a slow roller. I went back to the Rekon.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Glad to see Terrene expand their offering already. The Chunk is now available in 2.6 widths for 27.5 and 29 wheels. Hopefully they'll offer 29x3.0 or 29x2.8 soon as well.

New Terrene Chunk 2.6 trail tire for trail and enduro use - Mtbr.com


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## reynoldseight5three (Mar 22, 2010)

I have a Maxxis recon and a Minion DHF (3C, Maxx Terra, EXO and TR) on 45 mm scraper rims. on my first ride i got down to 10psi before they felt good. i'm 250lbs bike and gear...i am wondering if i spent to long on 3.8's and need to air up a bit on these 2.8's...


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

Has anyone used the vittoria mezcal 27.5x2.6? They weigh 830 grams and come with something called vittoria Anthracite Sidewall which gives it a different color sidewall. They are very popular tires among people doing the tour divide.


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## Ben B (Nov 16, 2014)

echefanthony said:


> I'm looking for some suggestions. What 27.5x2.8 tires are atleast 2.8" but not quite 3" when mounted? I'm looking for the tires that fall in between 2.8-3. Thanks


That sounds like almost all the "27.5X3" tires currently available.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

Ben B said:


> That sounds like almost all the "27.5X3" tires currently available.


That's what I'm wondering. The ranger 2.8 looks nice, I just don't know if it'll last a long time. I'm really liking the vittoria mezcal 2.6. Even though it's smaller, that type of tread is really what I'm after. I currently have the Clement xplor mso on another bike and the mezcal is the closest I can find.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

Surprised noones running or talking about 2.6 magic Mary/2.6 rock razor combo.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

IDK, just my opinion but I don't consider 2.6 plus tires...


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

Kevin Van Deventer said:


> Surprised noones running or talking about 2.6 magic Mary/2.6 rock razor combo.


I'm looking for more of an endurance tire, magic mary is aggressive. I'll check out the rock razor if it falls into that category.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Is it just me or are these tyres a complete ***** to get off a rim when it's time change (due to puncture etc)? Holy ****, this 2.8 rocket Ron held on to the rim with demonic possession. Even resorting to cutting took so long. I'm hoping it's a one off, but my God there's no way I could do this out on the trails.


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## bad andy (Feb 21, 2006)

lucifuge said:


> Is it just me or are these tyres a complete ***** to get off a rim when it's time change (due to puncture etc)? Holy ****, this 2.8 rocket Ron held on to the rim with demonic possession. Even resorting to cutting took so long. I'm hoping it's a one off, but my God there's no way I could do this out on the trails.


I've had the same experience with certain Schwalbe tires. Some rim/tire fits are just tight. On the plus side - a tight fit makes sealing up tubeless very easy.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

lucifuge said:


> Is it just me or are these tyres a complete ***** to get off a rim when it's time change (due to puncture etc)? Holy ****, this 2.8 rocket Ron held on to the rim with demonic possession. Even resorting to cutting took so long. I'm hoping it's a one off, but my God there's no way I could do this out on the trails.


Some tires have stiffer sidewalls than others and are correspondingly more difficult to mount / dismount. Rim width can also play a factor. When I changed tires a few weeks ago, I was able to dismount my Maxxis Chronicles without tire tools. At remounting time the Chunk's went on by hand and the Crown Gem's needed only a little extra soapy water to slip over the rim. In contrast a good friend changed his Chupacabra's and had to cut them off because he couldn't get the bead to break loose. On both bikes and motorcycles I always try to get the old and new tires nice and warm before mounting because it helps soften the compound. I've changed tires in a cold garage in winter and it was NOT fun. Another factor, and the one that I think bit my friend in his experience above, is that sometimes sealant can get under the bead and literally glue the tire bead to the bead hook of the rim. That's not altogether a bad thing, but it can make trailside bead breaking more of an endeavor.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

Just had the same experience 2 days ago.
BTW still running schwalbe...but that rr 2.8 the worst tire it cut in the sidewall it cut thru the tread.
Glad to be rid of it and never again.
Any 2.8 that weighs like a 2.35 is doomed to failure.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

The specialized fast trak grid 2.8 interests me. Fast rolling with grid flat and sidewall protection. $60 a piece isn't bad either.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I loved my RR-Snakeskin 2.6. Im tempted to use it on the back once my Slaughter GRID wears out.

A Fast Trak GRID 2.8 would interest me as well. I need tough tires, but im ok with drifty tires.


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

Prices of these things are still stratospheric. I once thought Aus$70 was a lot for the 2.35s. But I'm seeing Aus$120-140 for the 27.5+. People pay that for car tyres!


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

PHeller said:


> I loved my RR-Snakeskin 2.6. Im tempted to use it on the back once my Slaughter GRID wears out.


Weakest tyre I've ever owned. Loved it for how it rolled, gripped decently enough out back for certain duties, but I ended up gluing around 8 patches inside it until I decided to bin it. Punctures straight through the tread area were the worst, and a couple of times I didn't notice immediately and it got snake-bitten on a rock soon after due to dropping pressure. Another 150g or so into the casing and the RR would be awesome.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

phreeky said:


> Weakest tyre I've ever owned. Loved it for how it rolled, gripped decently enough out back for certain duties, but I ended up gluing around 8 patches inside it until I decided to bin it. Punctures straight through the tread area were the worst, and a couple of times I didn't notice immediately and it got snake-bitten on a rock soon after due to dropping pressure. Another 150g or so into the casing and the RR would be awesome.


So the specialized grid tires don't offer good flat protection? It seems that every tire I look at is more designed around being light. I need a 2.8 tire with good flat and sidewall protection for long distances. I'm running clement xplor mso in 700x32 on my flat bar bike and they're great.


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

echefanthony said:


> So the specialized grid tires don't offer good flat protection?


My post was regarding the Rocket Ron. Sorry, I've should've made that clearer. I've never tried a Spec tyre with Grid casing.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

phreeky said:


> My post was regarding the Rocket Ron. Sorry, I've should've made that clearer. I've never tried a Spec tyre with Grid casing.


Ok, I kind of got that from people talking about the rr. They seem good but too light to offer enough flat and sidewall protection. I have read plenty of comments about the specialized 2.8-3.0" tires in the grid and it seems that they are tough tires. I would really like the ground control but it only comes in a 3.0 tire and seems to be a full 3.0. The fast trak grid looks like it'll be good for a mix of conditions. I also like the looks of the Ranger tough but it seems to be wearing fairly quickly from what I've read.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Just to clarify, you guys who are having isses with the Rocket Ron, are you running the Performance or Liteskin models? 

the Snakeskin model should have reinforcement somewhat similar to the Nobby Nic, Hans Dampf, etc.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

PHeller said:


> Just to clarify, you guys who are having isses with the Rocket Ron, are you running the Performance or Liteskin models?
> 
> the Snakeskin model should have reinforcement somewhat similar to the Nobby Nic, Hans Dampf, etc.


I was running the rr 2.8 snakeskin. It does not feel like the regular snakeskin side wall. It looks and feels less robust.
To me a thin very balloon like quality to them.

I have a addix 2.6 magic Mary on the front with snake skin apex sidewall and it is must more robust.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

PHeller said:


> Just to clarify, you guys who are having isses with the Rocket Ron, are you running the Performance or Liteskin models?
> 
> the Snakeskin model should have reinforcement somewhat similar to the Nobby Nic, Hans Dampf, etc.


I don't have any experience with the nn or rr. I have read many people complain about how the snakeskin and liteskin models are just too light to offer enough protection, 785 grams snakeskin. I used to run the racing Ralph tires so I like schwalbe tires but for my purposes now I would rather a tire that has good sidewall and flat protection, and be a little heavier. I guess it also depends on what type terrain you ride.


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## eyeluvdirt (Dec 15, 2017)

I have over a thousand miles on my RR and I have had zero issues with them...still look new besides the sun faded lettering. But I run a 3.0 (why get a 2.6 or 2.8 if you want a plus tire? just my opinion). My rims/tire combo is as light as the guys I'm racing against with 29ers, I roll just as fast and have never cut my tire or sidewall.


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## eyeluvdirt (Dec 15, 2017)

I ride through everything also, except glass piles though


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

eyeluvdirt said:


> I have over a thousand miles on my RR and I have had zero issues with them...still look new besides the sun faded lettering. But I run a 3.0 (why get a 2.6 or 2.8 if you want a plus tire? just my opinion). My rims/tire combo is as light as the guys I'm racing against with 29ers, I roll just as fast and have never cut my tire or sidewall.


Which tire the lightskin or snakeskin?


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Reason I ask is that I've got a Snakeskin Rocket Ron 2.6 that I've ran on the front, and while I've shredded other tires it keeps going, with good wear as well. The 830g Addix 275 x 3" Rocket Ron with Snakeskin would be rad, but now I'm worried about running it as a rear tire.

I want a fast rolling true 3" tire that is relatively light weight. The Fast Trak GRID would be great, but at only 2.8 I'll run my 29er setup instead. 

I'm a bit hesitant about the Ranger because WTB products are generally quite beefy and the 27.5" x 3.0 Tough/Fast is no exception at 1080g. 

Then again the Ground Control GRID 275 x 3" is 1000g as well. If I was willing to scale down to a 2.8" fast-rolling but tough tire the Fast Trak might be a good option at 918g.

Maxxis Chronicle is available in 275 x 3" but the EXO casing is 990g. 

Kenda Havoc 3" is comparable with the Chronical and GC GRID at around 980g.

Anyone have any experience with the toughness of the Vee Tire Crown Gem or Bulldozer? Both look relatively fast rolling and somewhat light.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

PHeller said:


> Maxxis Chronicle is available in 275 x 3" but the EXO casing is 990g.
> 
> Anyone have any experience with the toughness of the Vee Tire Crown Gem or Bulldozer? Both look relatively fast rolling and somewhat light.


I have the Crown Gem on the back in 27.5x3 which replaced the Chronicles that came on the bike. Actual weight and rolling resistance of each are very similar, but the Crown Gem has a much better tread. There have been several reports of Vee's tearing knobs but mine have been fine so far as has sidewall durability riding on the front range of the Rockies.


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## eyeluvdirt (Dec 15, 2017)

echefanthony said:


> Which tire the lightskin or snakeskin?


Snakeskin

PHeller, I agree, anything smaller than 3.0 why wouldn't you just run a 2.3 29er?
I have loved the RR for fast rolling. In group rides with my team I'm always on my brakes unless in the front. It's ridiculous how well they roll for a 3.0. I never ran the Ranger but I ran WTB Bridger and they are super heavy, that being said you are glued to the trail and they are a pretty nice rolling tire too. My shortest race is 40 miles so I try to keep weight down (by no means a weight wienie, obviously, racing a plus bike) But for just bumping around on trails a tire like Bridger or Ranger would be phenomenal.

I have the addix RR waiting to get mounted, but I'm nowhere near needing to, even been running the snakeskins on paved trails to try to wear them down instead of the road bike.


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## echefanthony (Aug 9, 2013)

I just got an email from vittoria that the mezcal 27.5x2.6 Tubeless Ready (TNT) Anthracite Sidewall 830 grams is now available. I know its not a true plus tire but they definitely interest me. Link below
https://www.vittoria.com/us/mezcal-15805.html


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## phreeky (Sep 25, 2015)

Yep I have run both the RR 2.6 and 2.8 in Snakeskin. I've had no real issue with the 2.8, however I only ran it up front on relatively tame trails. The 2.6 was torn the shreds on the rear by rocks - and no, not the sidewalls, but punctures straight through the tread area - and yes the casing feels very thin. And although the Nobby Nic in the Snakeskin casing was a little more durable, I found it also problematic.

What is basically an equiv Maxxis (2.6 Rekon Exo) on the same trails I've had no issues at all, and holding the tyres and feeling the casing with my fingers it's clear that the Maxxis is a more robust tyre.

I ride a lot of rocks, where little sharp ones are embedded in the trail surface. I've run the RR 2.8f and 2.6r for an XC race on dirt/gravel/rooty surfaces and had no issues at all and loved them, so they have their place.


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## GuzziBen (May 18, 2015)

I ran Bulldozer 3.0 this last season, seemed at first like they might roll slower than the original GC’s on my Fuse. Seemed they didn’t reach the same terminal velocity rolling down a familiar road. 
Other than that, no complaints for traction and no flats at all, running tubeless around 14 psi. 
I might do a free-rolling comparison between them, the GC’s, and NN’s, see what happens.


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## phidauex (Apr 17, 2013)

PHeller said:


> Anyone have any experience with the toughness of the Vee Tire Crown Gem or Bulldozer? Both look relatively fast rolling and somewhat light.


I've been on a few rides on the Vee Crown Gems (27.5x3.0, Synthesis sidewall), and have mixed feelings. I'm coming from Spec Ground Controls, and in comparison, they are noticeably slower rolling at a variety of pressures, and somewhat heavier. Mine came in at close to 1100g, more than I was hoping for.

That said, they are much stiffer, and have more aggressive tread - they lack the supple compliance of the Ground Controls, even at 12 psi they feel hard, and ride hard. But I also think they would be a lot more resistant to the minor pinch flats I got on the Ground Controls, and just handling them you can tell they are a heavier duty tire on both tread and sidewall.

I think they are a bit more tire than I need right now, and my current habit of long (30-50 mi) rides with only some technical sections means I'm looking for something a bit more compliant, but for more aggressive riding I'd say they would be a great value, being cheaper than most other alternatives. The Synthesis sidewall looks great, too.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

im on the HR2 3.0s now, coming off of Terrene Chunk/McFly combo. trying them for a change, the Terrene tires are great.

the HR2 are slightly lighter than what they replaced, and they measure a full 3" wide mounted on i38 carbon rims at 15psi and theyre 28.75" tall. i run a 3C/EXO/TR up front and a EXO/TR Dual out back. they mounted up easily with a bike pump with no fuss at all. i use kapton tape, single ply for those thatre interested. used it on a previous set of wheels for over a year and when i pulled it off, there were no signs of seepage under the tape, but thats for another thread, i digress... 

rolling resistance seems to be about the same, maybe a little better. i havent felt the lack of transition area grip that is oft lamented about with HR2 tires. i think some of that is negated by the size of the tire. actual cornering grip is actually better than the Chunk, mainly due to the shape of the knobs on the HR2. theyre physically larger than the Chunk's knobs. well, the L shaped knobs are, the rest are basically the same size but shaped differently.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

You got them in 120 tpi ?

That's the tire I almost got when I bought my Chunk so eager to hear how they compare for you.


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## xblitzkriegx (Jul 29, 2016)

120tpi front, 60tpi rear. 

to expand on the cornering grip, the chunk corners quite well and so does the HR2 but the HR2 has more total grip on the surfaces ive used both on. to put it on a scale, if the HR2 is a 10 for cornering grip, the Chunk would be a 9. the chunk recovers quite well if youre off line or youve over committed.

braking and climbing grip i would say are equal between the two. 

the HR2 *might* roll better. the chunk has more total knobs but theyre not ramped like the HR2. 

i could repurchase either tire and not lament the loss of the other.


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## I hate tree gates (Oct 22, 2017)

I have run multiple options over about 2k miles. Rocket Rons were my favorite for cornering in the loose over hard I often ride but I had constant issues w them leaking. Sidewalk tears on 2 in rear but no major issues up front except constant small sidewalk leaks. 

I since moved to maxxis rekons as similarly light weight, great rolling resistance, and they have been bomb proof. 

Biggest thing I try to avoid is weight on plus bc it adds up quickly on these big tires and becomes relevant.

I also have cheated down to 2.6’s which I love.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

TheBaldBlur said:


> I have the Crown Gem on the back in 27.5x3 which replaced the Chronicles that came on the bike. Actual weight and rolling resistance of each are very similar, but the Crown Gem has a much better tread. There have been several reports of Vee's tearing knobs but mine have been fine so far as has sidewall durability riding on the front range of the Rockies.


Update on my rear CG: I put a hole in the middle of the tread a couple days ago. I was coming down a boulder field on a trail near my house that I've run a hundred times. At the bottom of the run I heard that dread hiss that was not a snake. I found a spot on the tread about an inch off the centerline where the sealant couldn't keep up. Upon removing the tire later at home I examined the spot from the inside of the tire and found a ~5mm slit/tear/hole. I put a patch on the inside, retaped my wheel, added new sealant and this morning it's holding pressure fine. I usually run the back at ~16 psi.

These things happen - sure. I could have taken a slightly different line, run it harder that day, there could have been debris that wasn't there before... any number of factors. I'm not ready to fault the Vee CG yet, but just observation from the trail.


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## fsrxc (Jan 31, 2004)

Nobby Nic 2.6" sizing?
I just bought a pair of NNs (2017 non-Addix) from bike-components de and after mounting them on 30mm rims, they are much different,
Front - 27.5x2.6 Snakeskin Trailstar Tubeless Easy - tread width about 66mm
Rear - 27.5x2.6 Snakeskin Pacestar Apex Tubeless Easy - tread width about 72mm
Annoying because I would rather have the front larger than the rear, but don't want PS front or TS rear.

Has anyone else noticed this? Just wondering if it's a random thing, or whether the Apex tires are bigger?


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

fsrxc said:


> Nobby Nic 2.6" sizing?
> I just bought a pair of NNs (2017 non-Addix) from bike-components de and after mounting them on 30mm rims, they are much different,
> Front - 27.5x2.6 Snakeskin Trailstar Tubeless Easy - tread width about 66mm
> Rear - 27.5x2.6 Snakeskin Pacestar Apex Tubeless Easy - tread width about 72mm
> ...


Odd. I never noticed a difference in size between my Apex compound and non-Apex compound sizes and I've been, and still am, running lots of those. I bought in bulk but none of them are 2.6 sized.

I've been having troubles sourcing the 2.6's every time I place a substantial order from all of the cheap sites. It pisses me off! :lol: I just bought a bunch of 27.5+ tires from B-C.de and they are blanked on the 29x2.6's and IIRC, when I checked B-D.de, they had the 2.6's but none of the 27.5+ I needed. I'm pretty sure they're just f'n with me. :lol:


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## fsrxc (Jan 31, 2004)

Oh My Sack! said:


> Odd. I never noticed a difference in size between my Apex compound and non-Apex compound sizes and I've been, and still am, running lots of those. I bought in bulk but none of them are 2.6 sized.
> 
> I've been having troubles sourcing the 2.6's every time I place a substantial order from all of the cheap sites. It pisses me off! :lol: I just bought a bunch of 27.5+ tires from B-C.de and they are blanked on the 29x2.6's and IIRC, when I checked B-D.de, they had the 2.6's but none of the 27.5+ I needed. I'm pretty sure they're just f'n with me. :lol:


thanks for the reply.
I just checked it again tonight - the PS Apex tire has a big wobble (close to 1cm side to side and yes the bead is seated straight) and it's hitting the chain in lowest gear, so I can't use it on the back. Since it's Pacestar I don't know if I'd trust it on the front (on any roots or wet conditions), but not sure if having a wobble justifies returning it to B-C.de, so it's kind of lost money like happens with mail order. The Trailstar has a fair wobble too, but it's slightly under-sized so clearance in the fork (non-boost Mattoc) looks ok.


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

fsrxc said:


> thanks for the reply.
> I just checked it again tonight - the PS Apex tire has a big wobble (close to 1cm side to side and yes the bead is seated straight) and it's hitting the chain in lowest gear, so I can't use it on the back. Since it's Pacestar I don't know if I'd trust it on the front (on any roots or wet conditions), but not sure if having a wobble justifies returning it to B-C.de, so it's kind of lost money like happens with mail order. The Trailstar has a fair wobble too, but it's slightly under-sized so clearance in the fork (non-boost Mattoc) looks ok.


PM headed your way...


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## Nubster (May 15, 2009)

Any WTB recommendations for a 2.8 rear and 2.8 or 3.0 front...riding packed dirt, loose over packed, some rocks and roots but nothing too nasty. Looking at WTB's because I can get them 40% off retail. They'll be mounted to i35 rims.


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## hece (Feb 27, 2017)

fsrxc said:


> thanks for the reply.
> I just checked it again tonight - the PS Apex tire has a big wobble (close to 1cm side to side and yes the bead is seated straight) and it's hitting the chain in lowest gear, so I can't use it on the back. Since it's Pacestar I don't know if I'd trust it on the front (on any roots or wet conditions), but not sure if having a wobble justifies returning it to B-C.de, so it's kind of lost money like happens with mail order. The Trailstar has a fair wobble too, but it's slightly under-sized so clearance in the fork (non-boost Mattoc) looks ok.


For sure a 1 cm wobble is a valid reason for a return. I had to return a 2.8 Magic Mary soft to B-C.de due to ~1cm wobble. They replaced it without further questions. I did include this link:


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## fsrxc (Jan 31, 2004)

hece said:


> For sure a 1 cm wobble is a valid reason for a return. I had to return a 2.8 Magic Mary soft to B-C.de due to ~1cm wobble. They replaced it without further questions. I did include this link:


Yes I'm getting it warranteed and have my choice of tires, so should I go with another NN 2.6? (which should fit assuming it's not oversized or wobbly)
I'm wondering about other options - is the Rock Razor 2.6" true to size or could it be bigger than the NN?
Another option is a Rocket Ron 2.6. No Apex option though so how would this be for a rear Trail/AM tire?


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## Sage of the Sage (Nov 10, 2011)

Anybody have experience with the WTB rangers in 27.5x2.8”?

I just ordered a Salsa timberjack, and it comes specced with these tires...


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## StumpyandhisBike (Jun 26, 2012)

Sage of the Sage said:


> Anybody have experience with the WTB rangers in 27.5x2.8"?
> 
> I just ordered a Salsa timberjack, and it comes specced with these tires...


Yes. Like all tires it depends on your expectations and riding style. They're fast and they perform well on hard packed trails. I found that they weren't that great in mud and weren't supportive enough for aggressive riding. They are a good tire. I still have one mounted on the rear of my wife's bike. They didn't fit my needs though. Ride them, they might work great for you on your trails.


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

Just thought I'd chime in my own results on the Vee Crown Gem. At approximately 18psi on my 2017 Fuel's stock SUNringl� Duroc 40 i36 rims, they're about 28.5 inches tall and 2.92 inches wide. I had one on the front...a Synthesis and I really liked the look. When I first put them on, they weeped Stans for a bit, but settled in. Loved the tread and seemed to roll efficiently (coming from the stock Bontrager Chupas). Grip was good and certainly improved from the old Chupa up front.

I ride in Tucson, with some pretty rough and rocky areas. Sidewalls held up great. I had an injury last year and was just getting ready to get back to the trails. Was raining today, so I thought I'd clean my bike up and found this:









Pretty bummed as the tire didn't have a lot of rides on it. If I could get the tread and height/width/price ($55 at Universal Cycles, out of stock) of this tire with a bit more reliability...I'd be in heaven.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Add me to the list of those bitten by torn knobs on Vee Tires. I read about others having this problem right after I mounted mine but hoped for the best. At least it was on a local trail where I could walk out; tore the knob right through the casing.

Vee Crown Gem on the rear in 27.5x3.0 if anyone's interested.

ETA: That's too funny Pack66 that we both had torn knobs on the same tire the same day. Same part of the tread too. Actually NOT funny but a clear indication of the poor quality of this tire.


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## Sage of the Sage (Nov 10, 2011)

I bought and mounted up a set of Teravail Coronado 27.5 x 3” tires on the Timberjack. 
Now that I have about 35-40 dirt miles on these tires, I can give a decent ride report... 

For their size, they are a fairly light tire, weighing in at 1,046 and 1,049 grams per tire. The tread design is unique, with a center row of low, chevron shaped lugs, followed by siped angular lugs that are progressively taller, and then the cornering lugs, which can really only be described as dog-shaped... this all combines to produce a remarkably fast plus tire with very low rolling resistance. These roll better than my Bontrager XR-4 29x2.3s, despite the fact that they weigh nearly 300g more per tire. 

The local terrain is a mix of hardpack, sand and silt, and big-ass rocks; these tires perform admirably on all three surfaces. They tend to wash out pretty badly in deep sand (3-4”), but then, that’s fatbike territory... 

Cornering behavior is good as well, although these tires need to be ridden more aggressively when it’s loose; they need to lean over for the side lugs to bite. Once leaned over, they hook up quite well...

Mud. Who knows? Not me... it’s too dry ‘round here.

Climbing and braking traction is decent, with some slippage being encountered on gravelly terrain in both directions, which, to be honest, is normal for most tires. Running low pressures more than makes up for it, I’m at 18 rear and 17 front; and these tires stick pretty good. 

I haven’t yet experienced any sealant related issues; no weeping sidewalls or leaky spots on the bead so far. 

Time will tell the tale of durability, but the rocks out here haven’t killed them yet, which is nice...

All in all, the Coronados are a pretty solid tire. If you’re looking for a true 3” tire, take a look at em..


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

I just ordered a 29er wheelset for my plus bike for dry season duty so I'm thinking about changing the current Nobby Nic/Rocket Ron combo on the plus wheelset for something more suitable for the coming slop season. Slop in this case would mean wet rocks and roots and near 0 deg C temperatures and even some snow. Luckily there is no sticky mud involved as the soil is mostly peaty loam. Weight and rolling resistance should still be on the lower side as gravity is not my friend around here, on the other hand EXO/Snakeskin is robust enough. What would be the current best options for me? I am looking at Purgatory 3.0 F/R and maybe Magic Mary / Nobby Nic 2.8.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

MM up front and NN out back work great for me in WPa. Really good in soft loamy conditions and mud. I run this combo on my Chameleon mounted on i38 rims and couldn't be happier.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

They also have the redesigned Hans dampf in 2.8.
That's what I'm running this winter on my plus bike 2.8 Mary 2.8 dampf f/r.


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## MRMOLE (May 31, 2011)

*Ikon 27.5x2.8?*



I'm looking for opinions on this tire. My only plus tire exposure has been with the 2.8 recons that came with my bike and the 2.8 liteskin rocket rons I've been running recently. Recons off-road performance was fantastic but were very draggy on road were as the Ron's are light and fast (everywhere) but steering and cornering traction off-road are a bit meh compared to the Recons. I've run Icons on some of my 29ers before and liked them and was thinking a Icon (R) + Recon (F) combo might retain the wonderful off-road performance and bridge the speed difference compared to the Ron's. 75% of my riding is paved or crushed granite canal banks so speed is important. I guess I could also try a Nobby Nic (F) and Ron (R) combo too. Any feedback would be appreciated, especially on the 2.8 Icon since I've seen no information on this tire except mfg. specs.
Mole


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

Sage of the Sage said:


> Anybody have experience with the WTB rangers in 27.5x2.8"?
> 
> I just ordered a Salsa timberjack, and it comes specced with these tires...


I've been riding with a 3.0" Ranger in front and a 2.8" in the rear. They are pretty good most of the time. They can get sketchy on fast, loose turns if your body positioning and technique aren't spot on, but even then they are decent. I've ridden them here in KY, IN, and in NC. I would say I ride fairly aggressively.

If you're worried about it, you could run the Ranger out back and get a knobbier front tire. That might be what I do once I wear our my current stock.


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## RAKC Ind (Jan 27, 2017)

Ranger rear for me, have trail boss in the front. Haven't wanted more traction this way. But ranger as a front I dont think I could do for some of my riding which can get into loose rock (cant remember the type of rock some us more flat on 2 sides as well as decent chuck) and tires like the ranger dont corner well. Trail boss has done way better than I expected while still being fast on the pavement.

NN to me a way to aggressive and draggy for anything I could ever find to ride. The knobs are insane on their plus versions. Remind me more of dirt bike tires.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Vee Tire deserves a follow up on their Customer Service. I reached out to them via their website after my Crown Gem failed as described above (identical to Pack66's failure). Vee Tire could NOT have been MORE helpful in addressing the issue. I had already thrown the failed tire in the garbage but they offered to replace it with a SET of their tires of my choosing. After the knob history with Crown Gems I was leery of them and personally like a more aggressive tread pattern, so I asked for the Bulldozer and T-Fatty. In the meantime, I've replaced the back with a Maxxis HRII, but I'll try out these replacements soon enough. But Vee gets high marks for their responsiveness and going the extra mile of customer service.


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## GuzziBen (May 18, 2015)

That’s pretty awesome for CS at Vee. 
I swapped out my Bulldozer 3.0’s for Ground Control thinking the Dozers might be a little slow, but I have no complaints for durability. I’ve taken them to Copper Harbor MI and Cuyuna Lakes MN- both with plenty of sharp rock- and no cuts or gouges, but nice edge wear after around 500 trail miles. The GC’s show less wear indicating harder compound, less smooth surface grip than the Dozers. 
Running NN 3.0 on another plus bike, love those 1st world problems. They’re fast and grippy.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

gdb85 said:


> MM up front and NN out back work great for me in WPa. Really good in soft loamy conditions and mud. I run this combo on my Chameleon mounted on i38 rims and couldn't be happier.


Which compounds are you using? MM is available both as Soft and Speedgrip - just wondering if Soft would be too draggy for basically XC kind of riding.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

TimoA said:


> Which compounds are you using? MM is available both as Soft and Speedgrip - just wondering if Soft would be too draggy for basically XC kind of riding.


I run the soft compound for trails (not the DH super soft) Not draggy at all in the right application (soft & wet). I do not use these when its dry & hard pack, I have another set of wheels with a DHF and Rekon mounted up for those conditions.


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

Thanks for the heads up TBB. I'll check out Vee's site. When you get the next set, can you post up measurements?


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

TimoA said:


> Which compounds are you using? MM is available both as Soft and Speedgrip - just wondering if Soft would be too draggy for basically XC kind of riding.


I rub the MM in soft and I wouldn't consider it for XC riding. The NN rolls much better and is plenty for XC.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Pack66 said:


> Thanks for the heads up TBB. I'll check out Vee's site. When you get the next set, can you post up measurements?


The new tires arrived last week but won't be mounted for quite a while as I've already replaced the rear with a Maxxis HRII. Frankly they'll probably sit on the shelf until I need one.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Here's a tire question I'd never considered before - Do you guys find that in addition to size, conditions, etc. that tire pressure is a function of tread count?

For example: assume a Maxxis HighRoller II on the back wheel - one in 60tpi and another in 120tpi, everything else is the same. Would you run the same pressure in both tires?

I'm tempted to think that 60tpi tire will tolerate lower pressure than a 120tpi tire. The 120 should be more supple but, other things being equal, more prone to damage. Of course in the case of the example HRII the difference in thread count also comes with a different tread compound.


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## ACLakey (Jul 7, 2012)

I am currently tire shopping as well. I have an NS Djambo with a T-Fatty 27.5x3.25 front on a 40mm internal wheel and a Maxxis Ikon+ 27.5x2.8 on the rear with a 35mm internal width wheel. I have run the Ikon on my 29er quite a bit in the past and have a good feel for it. The plus version works very well and rolls pretty darned fast. 

The T-Fatty I do not like at all on the front, it has a weird steering feel to it and feels awkward. I have been messing with tire pressure a lot and still can't get it dialed in...with the current loose over hardpack conditions here I keep loosing the front end. It threw me in the dirt again this morning, I don't like front wheel drifting!

I am looking at a Maxxis HRII 3.0 on the front with the wider 40mm wheel and a Rekon 2.8 for the rear on the 35mm wheel but haven't seen any feedback on this combo. Does anybody have input on this combination or would I be better off with a 2.8 DHF on the front?


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

Well I contacted VEE yesterday. We'll see if they get back to me...still looking at other options. I noticed a user on the 2017 Trek Fuel 27.5 thread (not2shabby) was running 3.0 Duro Miners...I've found them on eBay, so that may be my next option.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Ha ha! I've given the Miners good reviews several times but nobody ever seemed interested so I quit. 
They've been great on Midwest trails but I don't know how they'd handle the sharp rocks you guys have out west. They're not expensive, give them a try! 
I got a set of 29er's to try out 2.6's and like the rollover for the trails here. I'm thinking about selling the 27.5 wheels. 
Anyone interested in a set of Durocs with Miners mounted tubeless?


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

I'd be interested...but we have the same wheels lol. I've actually thought about going 29 for my FEX8 too, but I'm short on cash...too many hobbies, not enough money. Plus I still have a fat bike to try and build.

At any rate, still no word from Vee. 

TBB, how long til they got back to you? I didn't request a warranty exchange...maybe I should have.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

I've been having trouble finding the Miner in 275x3.25 size. The Crux/Miner are unique in that regard, they are only the TRUE 3.25" wide 275+ tire. Next step up would be the 3.8 Hodag (which really measures 3.5"). 

In my experimentation, I've come to the conclusion that if I want to ride the "plus bike" I want the biggest tires I can fit outside of requiring a true fat bike. If I'm going to be hitting lots of drops and jumps, I want a tough, sturdy sidewall to prevent squirm, and I'm content with 2.35-2.5 in that situation.

For reference, I've run 2.25, 2.35, 2.4, 2.5, 2.6 and 3.0. Even the 2.6 GRID casing Specialized Slaughter I was running was hairy when doing drops. This is partially why when I got my new full suspension I wasn't too concerned with "only" being able to run a 2.6 tire in the back...if I'm really hammering, a 2.4-2.6 tire with proper support is all really need.

On a hardtail, I want as much cushion as I can get (at least when I'm not trying to set records), hence 3" or better.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Pack66 said:


> At any rate, still no word from Vee.
> 
> TBB, how long til they got back to you? I didn't request a warranty exchange...maybe I should have.


I just checked my email and it was 3 days later. I have additional info that I'll share with you via PM.


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

The miner only comes in 27x3. Crux is 27x3.25. Ridewill.com was the only place I found them for sale at the time.


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## PHeller (Dec 28, 2012)

Per the Duro Catalog, the DB-1080 (Crux) and DB-1072A (Miner) both come in 275x3.25".


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## not2shabby (Sep 19, 2014)

Well....maybe they added the 3.25 miner since I bought a while back. It wasn't on their website when I bought them.


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## rikardo (Jul 8, 2005)

PHeller said:


> I've been having trouble finding the Miner in 275x3.25 size. The Crux/Miner are unique in that regard, they are only the TRUE 3.25" wide 275+ tire. Next step up would be the 3.8 Hodag (which really measures 3.5").
> 
> In my experimentation, I've come to the conclusion that if I want to ride the "plus bike" I want the biggest tires I can fit outside of requiring a true fat bike. If I'm going to be hitting lots of drops and jumps, I want a tough, sturdy sidewall to prevent squirm, and I'm content with 2.35-2.5 in that situation.
> 
> ...


I am running Duro Crux on front and vee trax fatty in 3.25 rear.
Vee fatty is also rather big tyre. 
It was the first proper sized 27.5 plus tyre and find it weird that not many new options have come up after the beginning of the plus thing.

World is full of whimpy 2.8 options but only three tyres around 3.25.
I love the cush that 3.25 gives and with light carbon rims it still feels like flickable and fun 29er and does not have that monster truck
gyro which i hate on fat bikes.


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## arka (Apr 28, 2010)

*Looking for supple, grippy and light 3" front tire for trail riding*

Hi! Looking for something to replace my 3" nobby nic trailstar as front tire. Been loving the Nic up front, except for slightly unpredictable cornering in loosepack due to the spaced out side knobs. Apart from that its got everything I want from a front tire. Unfortunately they ditched the soft rubber option for the new NN and will only offer it in Speedgrip compound.

Any suggestions? What I want is 3" size, soft rubber and a thin supple casing such as snakeskin, 8-900g weight. For me, thicker casings such as Spesh GRID with weights around 1000g or more kills the supple feeling of having more travel that I get from snakeskin or Spesh control tires.


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## Oh My Sack! (Aug 21, 2006)

arka said:


> Hi! Looking for something to replace my 3" nobby nic trailstar as front tire. Been loving the Nic up front, except for slightly unpredictable cornering in loosepack due to the spaced out side knobs. Apart from that its got everything I want from a front tire. Unfortunately they ditched the soft rubber option for the new NN and will only offer it in Speedgrip compound.
> 
> Any suggestions? What I want is 3" size, soft rubber and a thin supple casing such as snakeskin, 8-900g weight. For me, thicker casings such as Spesh GRID with weights around 1000g or more kills the supple feeling of having more travel that I get from snakeskin or Spesh control tires.


Have you tried the Speedgrip up front yet? I've always rolled with TSC in the front and PSC in the back and had the identical dilemma. I finally bought the Speedgrip and I have it up front on my 29x2.6 as well as my 27.5x3.0. Surprisingly, I'm not hating on it as expected. The Speedgrip is just a different kind of animal and so far it is working as well as the TSC did.

That said, check some of the european sites. I recently bought a slew of old school EVO, SS, TSC and PSC's in 3.0 for about $24 a piece! I have a fookin' tire shop here to choose from until they're all gone.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

arka - I'm still loving my Terrene Chunk Light (120tpi) up front. Grip for days and supple without being squirmy. The Light casing (940gr advertised) has been durable enough for my riding the Colorado Front Range and I'm not too particular about where I point it. I've got some other tires waiting their turn in the rotation but right now they'd stay on the shelf and I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Chunk.


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

not2shabby said:


> Well....maybe they added the 3.25 miner since I bought a while back. It wasn't on their website when I bought them.


Hey not2shabby, have you made the switch full time to 29x2.6 on your Fuel? I'm considering it for next year after I get my fat bike built.

As for an update, I was able to get a hold of someone at Vee. He said that they were suffering from spam to their website, thus the delay. I've sent in my warranty information, hopefully I'll hear word back soon. Fingers crossed.


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## eude (Sep 25, 2018)

Hi there,
I’m getting back into biking after a long hiatus.
My old jump bike is dead, and it seems jump bikes have come a long way since I stopped riding, so I’m now looking for a hardcore hardtail, ideally a steel one.

I have a question about 27.5+ tyres.
I’m likely to spend the large part of my cycling on road/pavement. Am I stupid going down the 27.5+ route, or are there suitable tyres that could be run at a higher pressure to make this set up work for me?
I’ve found the Vee Speedster 2.8 and the Schwalbe G-One 2.8, would either of those do the trick, or should I be looking at a regular 27.5 or even a 29er?

Cheers,
Eude


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## Bassballer150 (Aug 9, 2017)

currently running specialized ground control/ purgatory on my Fuse but I really like the gumwall of the Vee tires what would you guys recommend for an all around tire from vee? crown gem or bulldozer?(2.8) I live in oregon


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Anyone tried the WTB Vigilante 2.8? Could be a possible replacement for my Magic Mary which are getting very hard to find.

https://www.wtb.com/products/vigilante-2-8


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## Pack66 (Jul 7, 2015)

Just an update...Vee took care of me. Thanks for the great customer service Vee!


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## lucifuge (Jul 1, 2011)

eude said:


> Hi there,
> I'm getting back into biking after a long hiatus.
> My old jump bike is dead, and it seems jump bikes have come a long way since I stopped riding, so I'm now looking for a hardcore hardtail, ideally a steel one.
> 
> ...


IMHO, a bad idea if you plan a lot of cycling on road/pavement. The real point of them is that they offer grip and the extra low pressure targets high speed rebound events very well; all of which is OFF ROAD. All you will get on road/pavement is significant rolling resistance. Its pointess, and expensive! The bloody tyres cost a lot. Go 29er, much cheaper and faster!


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## eude (Sep 25, 2018)

lucifuge said:


> IMHO, a bad idea if you plan a lot of cycling on road/pavement. The real point of them is that they offer grip and the extra low pressure targets high speed rebound events very well; all of which is OFF ROAD. All you will get on road/pavement is significant rolling resistance. Its pointess, and expensive! The bloody tyres cost a lot. Go 29er, much cheaper and faster!


Thanks for the input, I'm not very tall, 5 foot 5 and I'm worried about the physical size of a 29er, standover height etcs, plus before I gave up on cycling before I rode jump bikes, tiny frames, 26" wheels and I worry that I'll miss the fast twitch acceleration and agility of a smaller bike. Yes I used to commute on my jump bikes too...

Would perhaps looking for a small framed regular 27.5" bike be a more sensible option?
I wish Orange still made the 2017 P7, it would have been perfect, and I don't like the new one 

Eude


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Just got some 27.5 a 2.8 Hans Dampf, Addix Speed Grip EVO Snakeskin, measure out to 2.75" at 20psi on i45 rims.

First ride today. They are burly, lightweight, true to size.

EDIT: First ride in the snow today, 2-3" of "hero" snow, nice and sticky, tires were awesome, minimal slipping unless I was drifting intentionally, surprised at how good they are in snow; also work well in mud and sand.

Great tires for all around riding.


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## Vandals (Oct 21, 2018)

Sage of the Sage said:


> Anybody have experience with the WTB rangers in 27.5x2.8"?
> 
> I just ordered a Salsa timberjack, and it comes specced with these tires...


I run one on the rear, seems fine. I've got a Bridger 3.0 up front. Seems like a good combination though the Bridger is about a pound heavier. I'm looking for a lighter 3.0 replacement for the bridger. No complaints on the Ranger for climbing in mud/dirt/roots.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Has anyone had the calipers on the WTB 2.6 tyres? Specifically wondering about the Trail Boss and if it's just on the same casing as the 2.5 Breakout which is the biggest tyre I can fit iny rear triangle.


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## ST_Paul (Dec 4, 2017)

Anyone rocking Michelin Wild AM or Force AM 2.8? Thinking about trying them out, I've only seen reviews on the 2.35 size and it didnt seem too promising, of course this was back when they first came out. Right now on Worldwide Cyclery they got them for $39, pretty much half as much as some Maxxis tires. If anyone has some experience on them please let me know, thanks!

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

ST_Paul said:


> Anyone rocking Michelin Wild AM or Force AM 2.8? Thinking about trying them out, I've only seen reviews on the 2.35 size and it didnt seem too promising, of course this was back when they first came out. Right now on Worldwide Cyclery they got them for $39, pretty much half as much as some Maxxis tires. If anyone has some experience on them please let me know, thanks!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Not specifically that tyre or size but I have some Wild Rock'R 2's on one bike and they're great tyres. They aren't light in the heavy casing but they're very very well made, durable and grippy. If you like the tread pattern I'd say go for it at that price.


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## jcmonty (Apr 11, 2015)

GRPABT1 said:


> Has anyone had the calipers on the WTB 2.6 tyres? Specifically wondering about the Trail Boss and if it's just on the same casing as the 2.5 Breakout which is the biggest tyre I can fit iny rear triangle.


I have a WTB 2.6 Trail boss (Light casing) on 37mm rims. The tread measures a true 2.6 and the casing slightly smaller. Sorry no calipers, but this was using a ruler and best eyeball. Feels almost as large as my 2.8 Butcher up front, but less volume. Great tire so far


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## nitrousjunky (May 12, 2006)

Nurse Ben said:


> Just got some 27.5 a 2.8 Hans Dampf, Addix Speed Grip EVO Snakeskin, measure out to 2.75" at 20psi on i45 rims..


You have any pics of the tire profile on the i45 rim? I've been curious if i45 would be too wide for the 2.8 HD and MM....

Aslo have you by chance measured how tall the HD is?


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## Psychlist73 (Nov 19, 2018)

I've been riding Michelin Wild Grip'R 2.25's and 2.35's for several years and I have always had good experiences with them. They are burly and chunky, which I like. I was wondering about the 2.8's as well for my new bike.


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## projekZERO (Jan 9, 2014)

Over the past decade I have gone through countless tires. I have several Home Depot bins full of tires, many with only a few rides on them because I didn't care for them.

I have two wheel sets for both my bikes, 29er and 27.5+. I use to run a cross country setup with 29er wheels and trail setup with 27.5+. 

In trying to find the biggest tire I could fit on rear of my Enduro, I ordered a Onza Canis 2.85 hoping it would be a bit bigger than the avg 2.8. The downside is that it not that big. It’s a hair bigger than say a 2.8 Rekon, but a tad smaller than say a Rocket Ron 2.8.

What I can say is that it is the absolute best rear tire I have ever run. I run nothing else on my bikes anymore.

When I first tried B+ I was never sold. Yes you have more grip, but the rolling resistance sucks and the tires feel heavy and sluggish. I ran my 29er setup most often because of it. My first few rides with the Onza I felt the grip was phenomenal for the relatively small knobs and cornering was quick and always predictable. But my mind was blown when I switched back to my 29er setup. Usually I can feel a difference right away with far less rolling resistance when I put my 29er wheels on (Ikon 2.35 rear), but this time I actually felt more drag with the 29er wheels.

I grabbed both my wheels sets on my next ride and did some back to back comparisons on a slight asphalt climb and a smooth fire road climb. The difference was obvious. I had a friend compare with me and it was obvious to him as well. I immediately ordered another Onza Canis 2.85 for my single speed and have even raced on it. I have no trouble keeping up with riders on skinny XC tires. It defies logic how fast this tire rolls for a plus tire.

I would honestly say the Onza Canis 2.85 rolls about as well as a Racing Ralph 2.35 or Fastrax 2.3 but with grip just short of a Rekon 2.8. I’ve never had a puncture, cut, or knobs coming off, (compared to Schwable tires), so reliablility has been perfect so far over the last 18 months or so.

Really disappointed I am seeing bike shops drop the Onza Canis 2.85 and nobody talking about it on the forums. Like I said, best rear tire I’ve ridden and it never comes off the rear of my bikes. I do still run a 29x2.6 on the front of my enduro sometimes.


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## mojak (Sep 27, 2005)

teknorob said:


> Measurements on 35mm (internal) Derby rims:
> 
> - Magic Mary 2.8 speedgrip - 73mm/ 2.85" Wide & 28.75"/730mm Wheel
> Diameter
> ...


Hi, is your fork boost or non boost? 29inch or 27.5inch fork?

I have the xfusion sweep 27.5inch non-boost fork with a 2.8 DHF in front now.

*Ok I've read below..your is a non-boost 29er fork...


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Some new WTB tyres I ordered arrived today. I ordered a 2.6 vigilante and a 2.4 trail boss (both new tritec versions) to replace a Schwalbe Magic Mary and WTB Breakout 2.5 to try some smaller volume. Some findings that may be interesting to people are the 2.5 Breakout measures 160mm bead to bead and the 2.6 Vigilante is only 152mm (this is comparing 2 new tyres as I had a spare Breakout). So indeed the 2.6 tyres may be disappointing in size to some people.

This is somewhat annoying to me as I can't physically fit my large Pepi's tyre noodle.


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## desertwheeler (Sep 1, 2009)

GRPABT1 said:


> Some new WTB tyres I ordered arrived today. I ordered a 2.6 vigilante and a 2.4 trail boss (both new tritec versions) to replace a Schwalbe Magic Mary and WTB Breakout 2.5 to try some smaller volume. Some findings that may be interesting to people are the 2.5 Breakout measures 160mm bead to bead and the 2.6 Vigilante is only 152mm (this is comparing 2 new tyres as I had a spare Breakout). So indeed the 2.6 tyres may be disappointing in size to some people.


I don't think you will be disappointed in the WTB 2.6's. Mine measured 67mm on a i35 wheels. The breakout wasn't designed for wide wheels so I'd take that into consideration. They are still pretty good size.

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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

desertwheeler said:


> I don't think you will be disappointed in the WTB 2.6's. Mine measured 67mm on a i35 wheels. The breakout wasn't designed for wide wheels so I'd take that into consideration. They are still pretty good size.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The tread width is definitely wider on the vigilante 2.6, but the volume is going to be smaller. That still may translate into a benefit for me but I'll have to wait now till I can get a different tyre insert. Not keen on running a much smaller 2.4 in the rear without an insert after using the big Breakout with an insert for so long.


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## slevin011 (Sep 26, 2016)

Thinking about some new tires for my Fuse - right now it still has the 3.0" Specialized Ground Control in the rear and Purgatory in the front that it came with, but they're starting to get a bit worn down after a few seasons of regular riding (and I just have that early springtime itch to buy something new). I was thinking about downsizing slightly to 2.8" and was looking at the Specialized Slaughter for the rear and Butcher up front. I ride pretty mellow trails in SE Michigan that are mostly hard dirt but have an unfortunate amount of sand. How would the Slaughter/Butcher combo work out? Should I look at any other options? I have heard good things about the Maxxis Ikon/Rekon and Rekon/Rekon combos as well. Let me know. 

Thanks!


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## Bassballer150 (Aug 9, 2017)

slevin011 said:


> Thinking about some new tires for my Fuse - right now it still has the 3.0" Specialized Ground Control in the rear and Purgatory in the front that it came with, but they're starting to get a bit worn down after a few seasons of regular riding (and I just have that early springtime itch to buy something new). I was thinking about downsizing slightly to 2.8" and was looking at the Specialized Slaughter for the rear and Butcher up front. I ride pretty mellow trails in SE Michigan that are mostly hard dirt but have an unfortunate amount of sand. How would the Slaughter/Butcher combo work out? Should I look at any other options? I have heard good things about the Maxxis Ikon/Rekon and Rekon/Rekon combos as well. Let me know.
> 
> Thanks!


I just switched to a butcher/slaughter 2.6 on my fuse for summer riding will see how it goes but definitely going back to 3.0 Purgatory front and back for the winter

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## Bassballer150 (Aug 9, 2017)

The new Eliminator 2.6 looks good too I might try that sooner then later as a rear tire


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## Pat2A (Jan 20, 2008)

slevin011 said:


> I have heard good things about the Maxxis Ikon/Rekon and Rekon/Rekon combos as well. Let me know.


I have the Ikon 2.80 in the rear of my bike. I'm a little disappointed because it's too narrow, 2.6 in reality (27mm internal rim), and there is a lack of traction when climbing on soft ground. I have the RoRo 2.8 SS in the front and it's perfect for me.


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## desertwheeler (Sep 1, 2009)

You will be underwhelmed with the slaughter if you have soft ground. It just doesn’t have the lugs for it. It’s great in rocky and harder conditions. But I took mine off because once it got loose i would spin out. Rekon is a good all rounder in the rear.


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## Losvar (Mar 21, 2016)

ST_Paul said:


> Anyone rocking Michelin Wild AM or Force AM 2.8? Thinking about trying them out, I've only seen reviews on the 2.35 size and it didnt seem too promising, of course this was back when they first came out. Right now on Worldwide Cyclery they got them for $39, pretty much half as much as some Maxxis tires. If anyone has some experience on them please let me know, thanks!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Running Wild AM 2.8 front and rear on my hardtail, very happy with them. 
They work well in most conditions, and they seem to handle abuse pretty well, no punctures yet, and we have a lot of razor sharp rocks where I ride.

Awesome tires, can't really go wrong with them.


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## Karlewski (Dec 3, 2016)

I tried the combo wild front and force back. I was not impressed and fairly quickly went wild rear and the wild enduro front. That was much better. To be fair these experiences were on the 2.35-2.4 sized tires. Force traction just was not there compared to the other semi slicks i’ve ridden and not faster either.


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## -Kap- (Jan 26, 2017)

I just mounted a Michelin Wild AM 2.8 up front on Friday and thought I'd post here to share my first impression of it (and found it funny to see that the only posts in the past two weeks, which both happen to be from today, also mentioned the Wild AM).

The only other plus tire I've ridden is the Kenda Havok 2.8, which has slightly more casing volume, but abysmally small knobs. It seemed to do well as a fast-rolling cross country tire, but it was far too easy to push past its traction limit in the corners (don't ask me how I know). In contrast, the Wild AM has big, chunky side knobs that unsurprisingly grip so much better in the turns and inspire much more confidence. I only have one ride on it so far, but I've intentionally tried to push it past the Havok's limits and it still hooks up nicely. I don't mean to exaggerate too much, but my bike feels a bit like a point-and-shoot weapon now, as opposed to a car with too much understeer.

It was also easy to install, seated up on the first try with just a floor pump, and was even airtight before adding sealant. It seems like a nice tire. If I were to look for downsides, it wasn't free, still didn't make me faster than Nino Schurter, and kicks up a bit of debris in sandy sections. I guess it's time for a fender.


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## Losvar (Mar 21, 2016)

Karlewski said:


> I tried the combo wild front and force back. I was not impressed and fairly quickly went wild rear and the wild enduro front. That was much better. To be fair these experiences were on the 2.35-2.4 sized tires. Force traction just was not there compared to the other semi slicks i've ridden and not faster either.


Was it a Force XC, AM or Enduro you had?
I tried the Wild Race'R Enduro, which looks identical to the new Force Enduro, a few years ago, and I survived one of the steepest and rootiest descents in my area with it, wet, and that's not something I expected on any semi slick.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

I just bought a Specialized Eliminator 650b 2.6 Black Diamond to use as a rear. I haven't mounted it yet but the bead to bead and outer tread lug to lug measurement is almost identical to the WTB Breakout 2.5. Many people (myself included) love the Breakout as a strong, high volume rear but with it now discontinued I think I've finally found a good replacement. Good news is the cornering lugs look much more serious and sturdy, I have high hopes for this tyre.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

Anyone have suggestions for a 2.8 or small 3.0 rear tire that would play nice with a Specialized Purgatory 3.0 up front? I had a Ground Control, but I was getting chainstay rub. I've since mounted a 3.0 Ranger that I had lying around, and while it's working fine, I'm worried I'll still get some frame rub when cornering hard (I have the chainstay taped for now to see if I'm getting rub). I ran 2.8" Rangers before, but I had to pump them up to 18 PSI to avoid rim strikes. Something with stouter sidewalls than the Ranger would be nice.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Just fit the 2.6 Eliminator and it's almost identical in size to the Breakout, a fraction bigger. 65mm at the sidewall and 63mm at the outermost lugs on a 30mm internal rim at 40psi. Also possibly the thickest and stiffest sidewalls I've ever seen on a bike tyre.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

GRPABT1 said:


> Just fit the 2.6 Eliminator and it's almost identical in size to the Breakout, a fraction bigger. 65mm at the sidewall and 63mm at the outermost lugs on a 30mm internal rim at 40psi. Also possibly the thickest and stiffest sidewalls I've ever seen on a bike tyre.


As a fan of the Breakout, I'm really interested in seeing how the Eliminator compares out on the trails.


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

carbine_275 said:


> As a fan of the Breakout, I'm really interested in seeing how the Eliminator compares out on the trails.


First ride today on the Eliminator, seems to do everything the breakout did just as well, if not better. I think I've found the perfect combo for my local loose, dry over hard pack rocky trails, 2.6 Eliminator rear and 2.8 Magic Mary front.


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## carbine_275 (Nov 15, 2015)

GRPABT1 said:


> First ride today on the Eliminator, seems to do everything the breakout did just as well, if not better. I think I've found the perfect combo for my local loose, dry over hard pack rocky trails, 2.6 Eliminator rear and 2.8 Magic Mary front.


Thanks for the feedback - looks like I'll be giving it a try as well.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

New season is started and I'm very happy with my new Magic Mary 2.8 up front. I can push the bike more on the front so the rear tire looses grip. To get rid the Purg up rear also I look for a grippy rear tire in 27.5x*3,0"* to support the Mary with their stiff sidewalls which I really like.
Unfortunately I'm not willing to push a heavy and knobby tire 2-4 hours uphill on steep fire roads. What about the Nobby Nic Addix Speedgrip in 3" for Enduro / Freeride style? I'm interested in the Addix compound. My Bike Mate has bad expierences with ripped studs both on Hans Dampf and Nobby Nic but on the older version with Trailstar compound. Does this problem still exist?

Terrene Chunk 60TPI on the rear?

Any other suggestions are welcome!


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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

quite.right said:


> New season is started and I'm very happy with my new Magic Mary 2.8 up front. I can push the bike more on the front so the rear tire looses grip. To get rid the Purg up rear also I look for a grippy rear tire in 27.5x*3,0"* to support the Mary with their stiff sidewalls which I really like.
> Unfortunately I'm not willing to push a heavy and knobby tire 2-4 hours uphill on steep fire roads. What about the Nobby Nic Addix Speedgrip in 3" for Enduro / Freeride style? I'm interested in the Addix compound. My Bike Mate has bad expierences with ripped studs both on Hans Dampf and Nobby Nic but on the older version with Trailstar compound. Does this problem still exist?
> 
> Terrene Chunk 60TPI on the rear?
> ...


The new addix compounds don't tear knobs off. But I wouldn't run a 3" rear, I'd run a 2.8 or 2.6.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

GRPABT1 said:


> The new addix compounds don't tear knobs off.


Good to know. Thanx!



GRPABT1 said:


> But I wouldn't run a 3" rear, I'd run a 2.8 or 2.6.


The 3" are needed for BB height and cushion.


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## -Kap- (Jan 26, 2017)

quite.right said:


> The 3" are needed for BB height and cushion.


Running a larger tire in the rear could have some possible downsides, though. If the rear wheel is taller, it would (slightly) steepen the bike's head angle, which many would find undesirable, and the wider footprint could make the rear tire grippier than the front, which could be dangerous if you break traction.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

quite.right said:


> New season is started and I'm very happy with my new Magic Mary 2.8 up front. I can push the bike more on the front so the rear tire looses grip. To get rid the Purg up rear also I look for a grippy rear tire in 27.5x*3,0"* to support the Mary with their stiff sidewalls which I really like.
> Unfortunately I'm not willing to push a heavy and knobby tire 2-4 hours uphill on steep fire roads. What about the Nobby Nic Addix Speedgrip in 3" for Enduro / Freeride style? I'm interested in the Addix compound. My Bike Mate has bad expierences with ripped studs both on Hans Dampf and Nobby Nic but on the older version with Trailstar compound. Does this problem still exist?
> 
> Terrene Chunk 60TPI on the rear?
> ...


On my Chameleon I run a 2.8 MM up fr (addix soft) and a 2.8 HD in the rr (addix speed grip) love the combo in eastern woods. Like it so much I run the same combo on my Pivot 5.5 in 2.6 flavor.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

The Hans Dampf was my first idea. Unfortunately there is a 2.8" only  Any problems with the knobs?
@-Kap- , you are right: There is a slightly change in the bike. But the Mary has tons of grip and braking traction. And I'm just looking for a fork with a longer travel. So no worry.

Any recommendations for the rear?


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

No problems with the knobs and I ride a lot of roots & rocks. The 2.8 runs real nice on i38 rims, don't think I'd run it on any wider than i40 though. Sidewall would be a couple mm's wider than the tread.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

Would You please measure the height and width for me? Thank you!


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## NoobKnob (Apr 28, 2019)

Hiya all! Was wondering if someone's already experimented with Mavic XA35 and Nobby Nics or Rocket Rons on 27.5"x3". Recommended? Upsides/downsides? Would you recommend alternative tyres for snow float on XA35? 

Thanks in advance.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

quite.right

Sorry for the late response just never remembered to measure when in garage. Anyway with 16 psi on i38 rims the MM and HD measure 28 5/8" high and 2.75" wide (70mm) that is tread at widest knob and 68mm at sidewall. Both have the Apex casing not that it matters a lot but allows for lower psi without sidewall roll.


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

Thanx gdb85. Your help is highly appreciated.
I decided to go with the Hans Dampf because of the not equal tires (3"r & 2,8"f) just now and the Apex version available on 2,8" tire.


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## WMBigs (Jul 11, 2009)

Do the 2.8 Nobby Nics and Rocket Rons measure out to their advertised width? Will be using i40. Don't want BB to drop too much from 3.0 Purgatorys on i45. Thanks, MikeB


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

Reifenbreite Schwalbe Rocket Ron 27,5x2,80
Reifenbreite Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2018 (Addix) 27,5x2,80

hth
q.r


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## WMBigs (Jul 11, 2009)

quite.right said:


> Reifenbreite Schwalbe Rocket Ron 27,5x2,80
> Reifenbreite Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2018 (Addix) 27,5x2,80
> 
> hth
> q.r


thanks!


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## ST_Paul (Dec 4, 2017)

Are 2.6 still considered plus tires?

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


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## DaddyFatStax (Dec 10, 2018)

ST_Paul said:


> Are 2.6 still considered plus tires?
> 
> Sent from my SM
> 
> No. The hairs have been split.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

Just a note to anyone else who's a fan of the Terrene Chunk. I heard from Tim Krueger this morning and he says there's no plans anytime soon to offer the tire in a 2.8 version.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

WMBigs said:


> Do the 2.8 Nobby Nics and Rocket Rons measure out to their advertised width? Will be using i40. Don't want BB to drop too much from 3.0 Purgatorys on i45. Thanks, MikeB


This might help you.
My bike was sold with 3.0 on 40 mm and 175 arms.
I decided to go to 2.8 so i switched to 165. I just love the difference, well worth the few $$.


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Thinking about resurrecting my 27.5+ wheelset for occasional bike park use. For tires I might as well go with a really burly tread and a tough casing. Mostly thinking about Schwalbe Eddy Current or WTB Vigilante 2.8 Tough. Any other viable options? Those tires may be overkill for 140/130 trail bike but I can't really see any harm on it either.


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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

Magic Mary 2.8 soft front Hans dampf 2 2.8 speedgrip rear.

Both have Apex casing.


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## Bassballer150 (Aug 9, 2017)

Super impressed with the new wild enduros

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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

Anyone laid their hands on Vittoria Martello 27.5x2.8 yet? Looks aggressive and at 1100+ grams is probably not made of paper either.


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

Just received a WTB 27.5 x 3.0 trail boss. TCS "Light"/Fast Rolling. Weight is 1180 grams! Mounted on i40 scraper rim. 3.00" at outer knobs, 2.90" at casing. Sidewalls actually seem a little soft, but we will see about durability. Mounted as a front tire. I ride very rocky terrain (Colorado Springs/Pueblo) and hoping it lasts. Planning on WTB ranger 2.8 tough for the rear.


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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

That's insane! "light" at 1180g. I have a 1000g DHF 2,8 and a 840g Rekon 2,8. Both in exo maxterra version. Isn't that enough as a front tire? Do you have the legs of superman?


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## maynard4130 (May 12, 2019)

javisst44 said:


> That's insane! "light" at 1180g. I have a 1000g DHF 2,8 and a 840g Rekon 2,8. Both in exo maxterra version. Isn't that enough as a front tire? Do you have the legs of superman?


I'm only 155 lbs, so no... definitely no superman here. I had a couple rides with the big WTB tire in the front and had mixed results. It really did a great job of eating up the trail and plowing over anything monster truck style. Unfortunately, that's not my style I'm learning. I didn't like the vague, numb feel. I have learned riding a rigid single speed exclusively on 2.2 tires and really learned to pick line and finesse my way up and over things. This just wasn't possible with the bigger tire. If my preference was to blast away on a sloppy straight line, it would be perfect. I put the stock 2.8 (actual 2.66) rangers back on and will run those for a awhile until they are bald. I will keep the 3.0 tire around for a backup or possibly for a ride down pikes peak. I could feel they weight as well (especially since I still ride single speed) but sometimes that heavy rotating mass = momentum which you learn to harness. I will probably run the same set up you have next. 2.8 dhf front, 2.8 rekon+ back. Both exo.


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## stm32disco (Jun 7, 2017)

Winter is coming and there wasn't been discussion of studded tires in quite a while. These are the commercial options I see:

Terrene Cake Eater 27.5x2.8 - https://www.terrenetires.com/pages/cake-eater
Schwalbe Ice Spiker Pro 27.5x2.6 - https://www.schwalbetires.com/bike_tires/off-road_tires/ice_spiker_pro
45NRTH Wrathchild Plus 27.5x2.8 - https://45nrth.com/products/wrathchildplus
Suomi/Nokian Fat Freddie 27.5x3.0 - These don't seem to exist anymore

Any others?


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

The parent company of Suomi Tyres went bankrupt so if you can find Fat Freddies grab them while you can.


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## desertwheeler (Sep 1, 2009)

Anyone running the Hans Dampf 2.8? I am running the 2.6’s and curious if the 2.8 is a bit more open and would make a bit better front in softer ground. Can some one share some pics?


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## Bassballer150 (Aug 9, 2017)

I might try that studded tire by Schwalbe in the front and a 3.0 pergutaroy in the rear


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## quite.right (Sep 29, 2016)

. 
deleted


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

Oh My Sack! said:


> Surly Dirt Wizard 27.5x3.0. Just bought a new Karate Monkey Plus bike and they were on it. Very stout tire but I was struggling on my first 3 rides before I pulled off a wheel and held the rim/tire combo in my hands. Holy CHIT was that a heavy-assed combo. Granted, they had plus tubes in them and those things are incredibly heavy but that Wizard is a chunk of tire. I have 3 or 4 sets of Nobby Nics in my inventory so I put those on and set them up tubeless, of course. Ahhhh....much better! Anyhow, I just skimmed and searched a bit through this thread. So much backlog of info but didn't notice much on the Dirt Wizard. They remind a lot of Minions but I haven't had my hands on Plus Minions yet. Are the Dirt Wizards a decent tire with a long service life? I'd consider them for riding some of the gnarliest trails we have in our area but my regular riding haunts, though chunky and technical, don't require quite so much heft like these DW's have. Impressions from anyone that's run them through their paces for a while?


I run the Dirt Wizard on my bikepark front wheel. They have held up well, but I don't put that many miles on in the bikepark, so it might be different if you are riding more.
The are much larger and much heavier than my DHF 2.8. Part of that weight is in the size, but part is in the casing, there is a lot more rubber on the casing.


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## Tjaard (Aug 17, 2007)

TimoA said:


> Thinking about resurrecting my 27.5+ wheelset for occasional bike park use. For tires I might as well go with a really burly tread and a tough casing. Mostly thinking about Schwalbe Eddy Current or WTB Vigilante 2.8 Tough. Any other viable options? Those tires may be overkill for 140/130 trail bike but I can't really see any harm on it either.


I have been using a Surly Dirt Wizard up front as my bikepark wheels.
Tough casing, although perhaps not as tough as the Super gravity and WTB tough. For the front, I would prefer the WTB 'light' casing, since it is a bit less stiff under the tread, for better feel, and less trail buzz. It's still super tough. I don't have puncture issues with my front tire, so as long as it's stiff enough in the sidewalls to support the tire in corners I'm good.
I have the Vigiliante 2.6 and would not pick it for general bikepark use, the knobs are pretty flexible. It's better for soft ground I think, or al least less high speed riding than a bike park. I think on firm ground, under high speed cornering or braking, the knobs would squirm to much.

Eddy Current seems interesting.

Part of it is geometry. I run the 3.0 in the front in the bikepark to increase wheel diameter, and thus trail.

If you want to keep trail similar then stick to 2.8, it seems like a better size over for bikepark riding.


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## Riding Dad (Sep 15, 2019)

thinking of jumping from 2.6 recons to 2.8 dhf/dhr II


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## Riding Dad (Sep 15, 2019)

Smithhammer said:


> Yup - DHF/DHRII on i35s. They work great.


what do you think about running them on 30mm and whats your impression of the 2.8s, did you bump up from smaller size?


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## cka3o4nuk (Jul 17, 2013)

anybody compared MM 2.8 vs High roller 3.0?
it seams that size is almost identical


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## MyCol (Oct 3, 2012)

*Hans dampf hs491*



desertwheeler said:


> Anyone running the Hans Dampf 2.8? I am running the 2.6's and curious if the 2.8 is a bit more open and would make a bit better front in softer ground. Can some one share some pics?


I haven't ridden on 27.5x2.6 , but I own and use the Hans Dampf 2.8 as my rear tire.

Originally I had a NN 2.8 Addix (blue) and the tire was light and fast rolling. Grip and sidewall into berms for a rear tire was not very good. With that being said, the tire failed causing the rear rim getting a little flat spot due to the easier puncture wheel and soft sidewalls.

I ended up removing the NN 2.8 , fixing the rear rim and purchasing / installing the Hans Dempf (new version) and the side walls are much more stout, traction is aggressive and a little heavier (by specs). However.... this tire was top notch for rowdy riding (lots of loose rocks and soft dirt) and the tire just holds up to everything I hit!

Not a light dude and weigh about 210 lbs (without gear on). I don't ride or hit technical sections with finesse. I just plow and that Hans honestly to me is top gun!

My front tire is still the NN 2.8 (as it was in the rear) and for that it is a good decent XC tire which I know it be nice in more packed and groomed trails.

As for loosing speed (rolling resistance) coming from the NN 2.8 to the Hans 2.8; I too thought it was going to drag when riding (slowing me down), but that was total opposite as I did not see any speed or roll resistance loss going to the new Hans 2.8.

Hope this helps from one rider to another that is curious about the new Hans 2.8.

Cheers!


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## Riding Dad (Sep 15, 2019)

Well I thought I would give people an update, I put a DHR II 27.5x 2.8 exo max terra 3c on the front, replacing the 2.6 recon....what a difference, like riding a completely different bike. If I had a rim wider than 30 I would put it on the back and try a 3.0 but its as wide as recomended by DT for that rim.


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## OneTrustMan (Nov 11, 2017)

Two days ago my plus hardtail with 2,8" magic mary tires got a real test.
There is a trail in Freiburg ( germany ) which is called the canadian Trail, because it was build by canadians.

This trail is very steep and gnarly with lots of roots and sharp rocks.
So pretty much DH stuff.

And man I just freaking love those MM tires.
Even at 15 psi they are so durable when smashing over all those rocks and roots.
Very good grip in muddy conditions.
And they still roll so easy on dirt even at 1150g.


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## hardmtnbiker (Feb 22, 2005)

I’ve used the DHR II 2.8 on a i30 rim. They run about the same volume as a 2.6” Nobby Nic.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

Out east here in Western Pa the Magic Mary (27.5 x 2.8) on i38 rims is pure bliss on the front (SC Chameleon). I never ran one on the rear so can't comment on that. I usually run a faster rolling tire on the rear like a 2.8 Nobby Nic in soft conditions and a 2.8 Rekon in firmer conditions.

Off topic a bit but I like the MM up front so much in my area that I run a 27.5 x 2.6 on my Mach 5.5 and a 29 x 2.3 on my new Stumpy.


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## fishywishy (Feb 23, 2008)

i mounted a 2.8 minion on a 29id rim. before any stretching, it was about the same size as a 2.6 minion, however the knobs are much bigger. i wanna say the size is very similar to a 2.6 bontrager xr4.


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## tomahawk66 (Sep 10, 2019)

I'm on a Trek Roscoe 8 and still using the stock 2.8 Rocket Rons front and rear on 40mm rims (36mm inner width)
They are fine for most of my local trails (in Singapore) and really fast rolling.

However I'm planning a trip to neighboring Dangas bike park in Batam and will be riding far steeper and technical terrain. I'm looking to put something much more aggressive on the front and maybe leave the rear with the Rocket Ron. It's mainly rocky and loose over hardpack.

My LBS is trying to order in a Maxxis DHF 2.8 for me and I think there is another shop that carries Magic Mary's in 2.8.

Any tips?
Is it gonna be strange having the rocket Ron on the back with a tire that aggressive?


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## TimoA (Dec 22, 2014)

My bike park experience with a not too dissimilar burly front XC rear tire combo that you are thinking of was definitely sub optimal. When it is steep and sketchy having very little braking grip in the rear does not feel good. I'd probably put Magic Maries to both ends.


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## tomahawk66 (Sep 10, 2019)

TimoA said:


> My bike park experience with a not too dissimilar burly front XC rear tire combo that you are thinking of was definitely sub optimal. When it is steep and sketchy having very little braking grip in the rear does not feel good. I'd probably put Magic Maries to both ends.


In the end they didn't have Magic Mary 2.8s in stock - not many 27.5+ riders in Singapore...
As my trip is Tuesday I just went with what they had: Hans Dampf front with Nobby Nic rear. Both 2.8 and both in TLE Apex Speedgrip. I've put in Rimpact tire inserts as well.

I've been previously running Rocket Ron's front and rear so I'm assuming they'll feel like they have way more grip and will certainly be good for my confidence/safety on some new trails.

I'll let you all know how it goes after a shake down ride tomorrow, but due to my limited frame of reference I don't know how valuable my review would be!!

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## Kevin Van Deventer (Jan 31, 2015)

tomahawk66 said:


> In the end they didn't have Magic Mary 2.8s in stock - not many 27.5+ riders in Singapore...
> As my trip is Tuesday I just went with what they had: Hans Dampf front with Nobby Nic rear. Both 2.8 and both in TLE Apex Speedgrip. I've put in Rimpact tire inserts as well.
> 
> I've been previously running Rocket Ron's front and rear so I'm assuming they'll feel like they have way more grip and will certainly be good for my confidence/safety on some new trails.
> ...


 Mmm i dont know about running a speedgrip HD on the front.

Its a non directional tire thats designed to be a bit drifty.

I have a 2.35 soft that i ran on the rear for a couple rides and it is indeed drifty but in a fun way. Don't know how that would work out on the front.


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## tomahawk66 (Sep 10, 2019)

Kevin Van Deventer said:


> Mmm i dont know about running a speedgrip HD on the front.
> 
> Its a non directional tire thats designed to be a bit drifty.
> 
> I have a 2.35 soft that i ran on the rear for a couple rides and it is indeed drifty but in a fun way. Don't know how that would work out on the front.


Interesting... All the advice I'd been reading was suggesting HD front NN rear as NN is less aggressive/grippy than HD.

One thing I have noticed is 2.8" tires act very differently from their 2.35/2.4 cousins.

My test ride today was a good one: our trails saw a lot of rain last night: they were muddy and the rocks and roots were very slick. Running front HD at 17psi and rear NN at 19 I had tonnes of grip and when the back did go it was predictable. The front didn't wash out once and I had the confidence to ride harder than usual (on the Rocket Ron's). Got a bunch of PBs on Strava and cleaned a technical climb that I've never managed in the dry.

The rolling resistance was pretty good too. didn't seem much slower than the old Rocket Ron's.

Yes, I'm sure that a softer compound and a more aggressive tread like a Magic Mary/HD in Soft Grip or a Minion DHF/DHR would give me (possibly a lot) more grip. But for my uses I think this pair will be ok: they'll wear slow enough that I won't feel guilty using them for the commute, they'll be fast enough on the techy XC loops and seem to give me enough grip for my ability and speed on the local downhill line.

I'll see how they (or should that be I?!) survive a shuttle day on Tuesday!!

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## prancisfena (Jan 30, 2012)

*Vittoria Bomboloni*

Hey Guys,

Has anyone have any experience on Vittoria Bomboloni 27.5 x 3.0 tires?


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## tomahawk66 (Sep 10, 2019)

tomahawk66 said:


> Interesting... All the advice I'd been reading was suggesting HD front NN rear as NN is less aggressive/grippy than HD.
> 
> One thing I have noticed is 2.8" tires act very differently from their 2.35/2.4 cousins.
> 
> ...


So... Shuttle day at Dangas in Batam, Indonesia.
First off, we don't have a lot of gravity options near Singapore so the 1 DH line and 3 Enduro style trails at Dangas, serviced by a pick up truck shuttle are the best we have for a day trip.

It'd been dry for a week and a little overnight rain to soften the trails made it look like the conditions would be perfect. And they where for the first 3 runs: great gnarly steep single track with some fun tropical loam flow sections and a couple of big features.

The Schwable Hans Dampf front and Nobby Nic rear (both 2.8") performed admirably - although I wish they stocked the Softgrip compound in Singapore rather than just the Speedgrip as you could always go for more traction! I was running them with Rimpact inserts at 15psi front and 17psi rear.

Then on our 4th run and our first attempt at the DH line the heavens opened and it rained full Indonesian monsoon level rain... The trail we were riding quickly turned into a river which was a thrilling experience! I actually had great grip and thoroughly enjoyed the ride!!

The rest of the day was on off rain and seriously wet trails. For the most part the tires held up really well other than in one or two super muddy sections where everyone was losing grip even the guy on 2.35" Magic Mary's front and back.

Awesome fun on the trails dispute the weather and getting clay and sand everywhere! I've signed up for the amature Downhill race weekend at Dangas in February: same tires, my 27.5+ xc/trail hardtail Vs a bunch of Enduro and DH bikes, should be fun!









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## GRPABT1 (Oct 22, 2015)

Not exactly plus but for those looking for a big 2.5/2.6 rear, I bought a Vittoria Martello 2.5 to replace the WTB Breakout I can no longer get and it's actually bigger. Too big in fact that it won't fit my frame. I think that officially makes it the largest 27.5x2.5 on the market.


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## blaklabl (Mar 14, 2011)

TimoA said:


> Anyone laid their hands on Vittoria Martello 27.5x2.8 yet? Looks aggressive and at 1100+ grams is probably not made of paper either.


Bump for this question....


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

GRPABT1 said:


> Not exactly plus but for those looking for a big 2.5/2.6 rear, I bought a Vittoria Martello 2.5 to replace the WTB Breakout I can no longer get and it's actually bigger. Too big in fact that it won't fit my frame. I think that officially makes it the largest 27.5x2.5 on the market.


Is this for the just the 2.5 or does this also apply to the 2.6? Were you able measure it to see true size?

This reviews says the 2.6 measures out to around 2.4.https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/biking/mountain-bike-tires/vittoria-martello-2-6


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## RollingBuffalo (May 5, 2018)

I just went tubeless....Got a Maxxis Minion DHF 2.8 on the front and a Purgatory Grid 3.0 on the rear...Ran them today for the first time, and it was awesome...Started with 18psi in both the f and r.....then dropped the 17 psi in both f and r....I weigh about 215...How low does anyone think I can go in these tires ?


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

RollingBuffalo said:


> I just went tubeless....Got a Maxxis Minion DHF 2.8 on the front and a Purgatory Grid 3.0 on the rear...Ran them today for the first time, and it was awesome...Started with 18psi in both the f and r.....then dropped the 17 psi in both f and r....I weigh about 215...How low does anyone think I can go in these tires ?


I guess you are close to your sweet spot. Mine is 13 but i am much lighter. The Purgatory is a rare thing for rear in my area so keep it if you like it or switch if you want more rolling.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Need suggestions for a tire that measures over 3" wide when mounted on a i35 rim...I ride pavement 80% of the time with occasional excursions in the dirt. I can fit a pretty wide tire in my frame...a Maxxis FBR 27.5x3.8" won't quite work.

Tried the Vee T-Fatty 3.25" but it didn't hold up very good and a couple other Vee tires I have tried did not perform for me so looking for other options. 

I have A Duro Crux 3.25" on the way to give it a try.

Any other options for a 27.5" tire that is over 3" but less than 3.8" and not made by Vee Tire Co.?

Just want to make sure I didn't miss anything in my research .

Thanks


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## Daholla77 (Jun 7, 2015)

Has anybody made Kenda Havoc Sport tires tubeless? There are wired bead. It doesn't say you can. Thank you

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## -Kap- (Jan 26, 2017)

Daholla77 said:


> Has anybody made Kenda Havoc Sport tires tubeless? There are wired bead. It doesn't say you can. Thank you


I've been running one tubeless for a year now with no issues whatsoever. :thumbsup:

Kenda doesn't consider the wire bead Sport to be tubeless ready as shown here, probably because they leave out a layer in the casing for cost savings, and I'd seen pictures in the past of older non-tubeless ready Kenda tires (specifically the Nevegal) that had bubbled and delaminated from natural latex sealant, so I thought I'd play it safe and go with Continental's Revo sealant since it uses synthetic latex and is ammonia-free. It's been working like a charm so far.

On a side note, as a rear tire the Havok seems to roll fast and gets plenty of grip from its width, but I had to put something meatier on the front since the tiny side knobs washed out way too easily for me in looser conditions, and I don't even ride all that aggressively.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Anyone here try the Teravail Cumberland in a 2.8? I know it's a rear tire but I'm thinking about running it as my front tire to have a fast-ish xc-trail tire.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Funoutside said:


> Anyone here try the Teravail Cumberland in a 2.8? I know it's a rear tire but I'm thinking about running it as my front tire to have a fast-ish xc-trail tire.


I never used one but if you rarely see mud the 2.8 Rekon 3c is fast and many like it in front. It was great for me as a rear.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Yeah I rarely see mud. Mostly loose over hard & mostly green & blue trails & road.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Funoutside said:


> Yeah I rarely see mud. Mostly loose over hard & mostly green & blue trails & road.


I have been without a car for 20 years so i pedal to the trails often 5 miles or more, play in the wood and pedal back. So i enjoyed that it is a good roller with enough grip. I have just ordered a bike and it has 2 Maxxis Rekon on 35mmi rims.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

I will keep that in mind. I just want something too sluggish on the road. Does it measure out at least close to 2.8 or is closer to 2.5 like some 2.8 tires?


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Funoutside said:


> I will keep that in mind. I just want something too sluggish on the road. Does it measure out at least close to 2.8 or is closer to 2.5 like some 2.8 tires?


It was on a 40 mm rim, the volume and width were visibly more than 2.5. My bikes are used on street, roads, cycling paths, trails. It was just a bit less than the 3.0 Chronicle it replaced. Even their 2.6 is wide on a wide rim. After a week to find my optimal PSI i just loved it.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Thank you.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

HD 27.5 x 2.8 measures true to size, a little over size on an i45, great rear tire, terrible front tire. Wears like iron in a blue stripe.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

I might looking at the wrong tires. I have a budget of under $50, so it seems like the Teravail tires are out of budget for me. I am looking for suggestion on a 2.8 or 3.0 dry/loose over hard(SoCal) xc-ish tire that confident downhill but isn't to draggy on the road/hardpack & not easily punctionalbe. This would be for a front tire. I tried to find reviews for some of the tires I am looking at, but there seem to be not many reivews for those models. One of the tires I am looking at is the Michelin Wild AM Performance TLR in a 2.8 & Hutchinson Taipan Koloss 2.8(comes in at $50).

Come to think of most of the curent 2.8 should be better than the WTB Trailblazers. correct?


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Funoutside said:


> I might looking at the wrong tires. I have a budget of under $50, so it seems like the Teravail tires are out of budget for me. I am looking for suggestion on a 2.8 or 3.0 dry/loose over hard(SoCal) xc-ish tire that confident downhill but isn't to draggy on the road/hardpack & not easily punctionalbe. This would be for a front tire. I tried to find reviews for some of the tires I am looking at, but there seem to be not many reivews for those models. One of the tires I am looking at is the Michelin Wild AM Performance TLR in a 2.8 & Hutchinson Taipan Koloss 2.8(comes in at $50).
> 
> Come to think of most of the curent 2.8 should be better than the WTB Trailblazers. correct?


Maybe you can be lucky and find a takeoff on some facebook page, pinkbike, etc.. Like you i am shopping for 2 2.8 and probably chainreaction will be my solution. Now with the virus our shops are kind of sold out for bikes and tires.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Funoutside said:


> I might looking at the wrong tires. I have a budget of under $50, so it seems like the Teravail tires are out of budget for me. I am looking for suggestion on a 2.8 or 3.0 dry/loose over hard(SoCal) xc-ish tire that confident downhill but isn't to draggy on the road/hardpack & not easily punctionalbe. This would be for a front tire. I tried to find reviews for some of the tires I am looking at, but there seem to be not many reivews for those models. One of the tires I am looking at is the Michelin Wild AM Performance TLR in a 2.8 & Hutchinson Taipan Koloss 2.8(comes in at $50).
> 
> Come to think of most of the curent 2.8 should be better than the WTB Trailblazers. correct?


Maxxis DHF 2.8" Dual Compound would be my recommendation. I just went through a bunch of research and have purchased just about every 27.5x2.8" tire known to man...sent a lot of them back without ever mounting them. DHF is my pick for a front tire for ANY conditions. I even run it on my electric bike that never leaves the pavement and it corners very good on asphalt as well as lasts a long time...IF you go with the Dual Compound.

Tough to find for $50...they usually run about $68 unless you can find a coupon code or a sale.


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## BlackTrails (May 28, 2020)

Funoutside said:


> I might looking at the wrong tires. I have a budget of under $50, so it seems like the Teravail tires are out of budget for me. I am looking for suggestion on a 2.8 or 3.0 dry/loose over hard(SoCal) xc-ish tire that confident downhill but isn't to draggy on the road/hardpack & not easily punctionalbe. This would be for a front tire. I tried to find reviews for some of the tires I am looking at, but there seem to be not many reivews for those models. One of the tires I am looking at is the Michelin Wild AM Performance TLR in a 2.8 & Hutchinson Taipan Koloss 2.8(comes in at $50).
> 
> Come to think of most of the curent 2.8 should be better than the WTB Trailblazers. correct?


I found a high roller 2 3.0 from Chain Reaction Cycles for around your budget a month ago. I also really liked my specialized purgatory which are on the budget end too.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Bullfrog123 said:


> Maxxis DHF 2.8" Dual Compound would be my recommendation. I just went through a bunch of research and have purchased just about every 27.5x2.8" tire known to man...sent a lot of them back without ever mounting them. DHF is my pick for a front tire for ANY conditions. I even run it on my electric bike that never leaves the pavement and it corners very good on asphalt as well as lasts a long time...IF you go with the Dual Compound.
> 
> Tough to find for $50...they usually run about $68 unless you can find a coupon code or a sale.


Thanks for your input. I ride to the trails so it will be a nice replacement. I like my 2.6 2c Rekon but when some mud come i will stop liking the performance. I also made my mind for a DHR 2.8


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## sroc3 (Feb 28, 2014)

desertwheeler said:


> Anyone running the Hans Dampf 2.8? I am running the 2.6's and curious if the 2.8 is a bit more open and would make a bit better front in softer ground. Can some one share some pics?


I have a TREK Roscoe 7 Hardtail and run 2.8 Schwlabes. Hans Damph FR/ Nobby Nic RR. Works great on my hardtail, just took forever to get the right pressures for my weight of 158lbs. I used to run low - 12.5/12.5. But now at 15/15, it's perfect and gives me juuuuust the right amount of compliance and rolling resistance.

Untitled by P.L. L, on Flickr


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## -Kap- (Jan 26, 2017)

Funoutside said:


> ...I have a budget of under $50, so it seems like the Teravail tires are out of budget for me.


It looks like Universal Cycles has a bunch of plus tires on sale within your budget, including the Light & Supple model of the Teravail Cumberland (which you had mentioned you were considering) for $41. (Sadly, they don't have the Durable casing model on sale, if that was the one you were after.)



Funoutside said:


> One of the tires I am looking at is the Michelin Wild AM Performance TLR in a 2.8...


I don't ride mine on the road, and the conditions here in the wooded northeast may be a bit softer than where you ride, but I've been quite happy with the Wild AM as a front tire for the past year. I've never thought of it as draggy, but it does grip well and is chunkier than what I'd consider to be an XC tire. If you decide to get one, Chain Reaction Cycles currently has it for a mere $31.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Yeah I just noticed UC has a sale on those models this morning. I will have to see how the light & supple compares to the durable & how the Cumberland compares to the Kenebac. Cause I like the idea of the faster rear tire Cumberland as a front tire. Anyone know how weak/durable the light & supple is? Should I just go Coronado? 

I did some searching but one the Michelin tires I saw a review from was a bit slow rolling on hardpack, which is some of the trails here(hardpack with dry loose). I'll have to look up the DHF II also.

Thank you all for the replies.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Update: I did some searching & the light & supple should work for my usage as it's still durable enough from what people on here & other sites were saying. I also re-looked into the Coronado's also as the l&s variant is $50 & gets positive markets. However, I think since I'm on i40 rims & two reviews here suggested it's better on at least i45 rims I will have them off the list. So, I will be ordering the Cumberland in a 2.8 as it shouldn't be too bad on hardpack or even road. The Kennebec is a bit more for wet weather, which is not a real thing here. Thanks!


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## DudeAbides (Oct 18, 2018)

Keep in mind Teravail are a true 2.8 whereas most end up 2.6ish.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Prefect! The fork on my Beyond+ can fit 29x3.0 but frame maxes at 27.5x3.0(knobbier true to size & all oversize ones graze the chainstay). Really looking forward to trying the tires, hopefully this weekend.


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## dantae (Dec 5, 2019)

BlackTrails said:


> I found a high roller 2 3.0 from Chain Reaction Cycles for around your budget a month ago. I also really liked my specialized purgatory which are on the budget end too.


Hi, can you please comment a bit more on the High Roller II vs the Purgatory. I love the Purgatory but was looking for something with a little more grip for the front. DHF or DHR II would have been ideal but both are available in 2.8 only and I am concerned about reduced BB height with those. 
Is the High Roller II 3.0 a good choice, concerned about it being too slow.
The Purgatory is susprisingly quite an awesome tire. 
Thanks.


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## wallydog (May 18, 2017)

Thought I would comment on the High Roller II. I bought a 27.5 X 3.0 because I wanted the tallest tire I could find for my front tire. It worked great in the loose rocky , dry conditions we have now in Park City. I didn't realize how massive it is until I bought one to put on the rear. It fit (barely) and I have had a few rides on it. No complaints other than it is too big for the rear of my bike. I took it off because I didn't want to take the chance of damaging something if those big lugs picked up something. If you want a big taller tire that works well this would do.


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## dantae (Dec 5, 2019)

wallydog said:


> Thought I would comment on the High Roller II. I bought a 27.5 X 3.0 because I wanted the tallest tire I could find for my front tire. It worked great in the loose rocky , dry conditions we have now in Park City. I didn't realize how massive it is until I bought one to put on the rear. It fit (barely) and I have had a few rides on it. No complaints other than it is too big for the rear of my bike. I took it off because I didn't want to take the chance of damaging something if those big lugs picked up something. If you want a big taller tire that works well this would do.


Thanks for your response. So are you happy with both the rolling resistance and grip of the High Roller II?


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## wallydog (May 18, 2017)

I can feel some rolling resistance/drag but...not bad. I would attribute that to my running lower air pressure (14 or less) and the overall mass of the tire. The positive aspects of great grip and cushioning outweigh that for me.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

dantae said:


> Hi, can you please comment a bit more on the High Roller II vs the Purgatory. I love the Purgatory but was looking for something with a little more grip for the front. DHF or DHR II would have been ideal but both are available in 2.8 only and I am concerned about reduced BB height with those.
> Is the High Roller II 3.0 a good choice, concerned about it being too slow.
> The Purgatory is susprisingly quite an awesome tire.
> Thanks.


DHR and HR wear very quickly and have a lot of resistance, certainly not a tire I'd run on the front and really not a tire I like on the back.

My fav tire for front and back is the DHF.

If you want a fatter tire, the HD 2.8 is a great rear tire and measures out true to size, a tad bigger on a wide rim like the i45.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Have to agree with "Nurse Ben"...the DHR II and High Roller have a little more drag and less tread coverage than the DHF...I still put up with them on the rear and run a DHF on the front. Of course I have some help with my motor so it is not that big of a deal for me .

With a motor for help, I run a 3.0 High Roller on the rear and a 2.8 DHF on the front.


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## BlackTrails (May 28, 2020)

dantae said:


> Hi, can you please comment a bit more on the High Roller II vs the Purgatory. I love the Purgatory but was looking for something with a little more grip for the front. DHF or DHR II would have been ideal but both are available in 2.8 only and I am concerned about reduced BB height with those.
> Is the High Roller II 3.0 a good choice, concerned about it being too slow.
> The Purgatory is susprisingly quite an awesome tire.
> Thanks.


I believe the HR II is better than the purgatory in every aspect except for maybe a slight reduction in rolling resistance, however being that it's my front tire and I don't race, it doesn't bother me. It has better sidewall support for lower pressures and longer life (my purgatory sidewalls degraded faster), and the sidewall support reduces roll over and squirm when cornered hard. I'm not sure if it's the Maxxis tire compound and/or the lug pattern, but the HR II hasn't let me down in the traction department either, I feel when the trail gets a little more loose it shines when compared to the purgatory. This is also a YMMV sort of thing, being a subjective review and all. Hope that helps


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## wallydog (May 18, 2017)

Horses for courses. Thats what is so great about the relatively cheap option of trying/using different tires on your bike. Nice we have so many options to change up the "feel" of your bike so easily.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

World Wide Cyclery has some good videos on tires if you plan to ride off road.

They seem to favor the Maxxis, WTB, and Schwalbe brands in that order...at least a little bit IMO. After trying all three and a few other brands, I prefer Maxxis. If I didn't have a motor :eekster:, I'd probably run a DHF front and rear because IMO it rolls a little better than the DHR II and t he High Roller.

Although several of us prefer a DHF on the front :thumbsup: and DHR II rear...Jeff, the owner of WWC likes to run a DHR II front and rear. If I could fit a 3.0 High Roller in my fork I would try it but it won't fit so that makes my decision easier.

Sooo much is personal preference AND we all ride different terrain i.e. sand, rocks, hard packed, mud, etc...so there is no correct/incorrect answer...just what you like the best .


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Nurse Ben said:


> DHR and HR wear very quickly and have a lot of resistance, certainly not a tire I'd run on the front and really not a tire I like on the back.
> 
> My fav tire for front and back is the DHF.
> 
> If you want a fatter tire, the HD 2.8 is a great rear tire and measures out true to size, a tad bigger on a wide rim like the i45.


I like Rekons but i want to try a bit more grip for some mud spots.
My rims are I35mm. I am contemplenting
- 2.8x27.5 DHF x2
- 2.8x27.5 DHF with 2.8 DHR
- 2.8x27.5 DHF with 2.6 DHR
Since my bike came on 2.6 any combo is OK to keep pedal strikes minimal.
I like to climb so my question is will the (rear)DHF 2.8 perform well on wet roots, etc...
Happy trails !


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## Dr Evil (Sep 20, 2015)

33red said:


> I like Rekons but i want to try a bit more grip for some mud spots.
> My rims are I35mm. I am contemplenting
> - 2.8x27.5 DHF x2
> - 2.8x27.5 DHF with 2.8 DHR
> ...


High Roller II in the front and Rekon in the rear. 2.8x27.5 on 40 rims. Had Rekon on the front previously but enjoy the grip up front more with the High Roller without the weight of a DHF.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

33red said:


> I like Rekons but i want to try a bit more grip for some mud spots.
> My rims are I35mm. I am contemplenting
> - 2.8x27.5 DHF x2
> - 2.8x27.5 DHF with 2.8 DHR
> ...


Your traction over wet roots is going to be determined more by the rubber hardness than anything else but nothing is going to work real good.

Unless you are doing some serious downhills and/or running a motor, IMO the 2.6" is the way to go as opposed to the 2.8"...just easier to keep the 2.6" rolling with less weight and less drag.

You can play with air pressure a lot to increase grip and/or change rolling resistance as well as the amount of cushion you get.

The 2.6" DHF and High Roller are listed at the exact same weight on the Maxxis web site (there is not a EXO+ High Roller) with the 2.6" DHR II being a few grams lighter.

Your rims will work with 2.6", 2.8", and 3.0" so that isn't a factor.

My preference is 2.6" DHF front and 2.6" DHR rear if I am pedaling.

For higher speeds and/or a motor, I like 2.8" DHF front and 3.0 High Roller rear.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Bullfrog123 said:


> Your traction over wet roots is going to be determined more by the rubber hardness than anything else but nothing is going to work real good.
> 
> Unless you are doing some serious downhills and/or running a motor, IMO the 2.6" is the way to go as opposed to the 2.8"...just easier to keep the 2.6" rolling with less weight and less drag.
> 
> ...


Thanks, i need to digest things. I was on HT for 4 years so the + was an advantage. Now this is my first FS 130/120 and according to my LBS Giant suggests i use 2.8 or less. I had 4 nice weeks(very dry) on the 2.6 Rekons but after rain like today and in the fall with the leaves i want a 2.8 in front and presently i think i might get a DHF or a HR.
From riders i read some love the HR and others do not trust the transition zone. I have no clue if they just use too much PSI or maybe improper rim with. 
Serious downhill is 0% of what i do. I enjoy climbing, some technical and flow sections.
For roots i was happy with a 2.8 3c Rekon but with a reverse mount for Xtra grip. I will probably reverse mine.


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

The Rekon is a fine tire, just not ideal for sand or slippery soils.

The HR is kinda draggy and wears fast on hard surfaces, same with the DHR.

Mike Curiak at Lacemine29 suggested DHF front and rear, so I took his advice and that's been my go to for my FS bikes. 

On my hardtail I'm running a HD 2.8 in back and a DHF 2.8 up front. The HD is a good rear tire for all around, pretty durable, but it runs wide so I'll probably swap for an HD 2.6 or another DHF.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Nurse Ben...what is the "HD" you have mentioned a couple times...wasn't sure if it was a typo and you meant HR for High Roller or is HD something else?
Thanks


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Hans Danf if I remember correctly.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Ahhhhh, makes sense. Thanks


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## jkb818 (May 24, 2020)

Nurse Ben said:


> Mike Curiak at Lacemine29 suggested DHF front and rear, so I took his advice and that's been my go to for my FS bikes.
> 
> .


how have you liked the DHF on front and rear? my local shop also suggested that and have installed them in 2.8 size on my pivot switchblade. been too busy to ride it though and been worried that I made the wrong decision and should have got the DHR II for the rear....


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## jkb818 (May 24, 2020)

Nurse Ben said:


> My fav tire for front and back is the DHF.
> 
> .


can you share why you have come to this conclusion?

thanks!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

Fast, good traction, carve well, durable, long wearing.

I have run DHR and HR out back, they wore quickly, were boggy, and didn't handle as well as the DHF.

The HD, Hans Damph, was the tire I was referring to in the other posts



jkb818 said:


> can you share why you have come to this conclusion?
> 
> thanks!


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## Sanchofula (Dec 30, 2007)

BTW: Anyone have a set of 27.5 x 2.6 tires they're not using, this is for a hardtail, so something like a Rekon, light but durable.


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## jkb818 (May 24, 2020)

Nurse Ben said:


> Fast, good traction, carve well, durable, long wearing.
> 
> I have run DHR and HR out back, they wore quickly, were boggy, and didn't handle as well as the DHF.


cool thanks! based off my initial testing of the DHF front and rear I'm digging it. Feel like I have more grip than with the Rekons front and back. not noticing any difference in rolling resistance.


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## wallydog (May 18, 2017)

Anyone know the tallest 2.8 x 27.5 for rear use? I am finding the 2.8 x 27.5 HR ll not tall enough and the side wall not stiff enough. Really liked the HR ll 3.0 but it is too big/tall for my frame. Maybe there is a "shorter" 3.0 out there? Thank you.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

Most mountain bike tires have an aspect ratio real close to 1:1...i.e. the height is equal to the width. Assuming you use the actual tire dimensions and and not the numbers some manufacturers use to try and make their tires sound bigger. 

I am not aware of any that vary much from that ratio as far as tires that are in the 2.3-3.0 range. Some "Fat" tires are a little different and it varies by manufacturer.

At least that is my experience with all of the tires I have measured...don't take my experience as gospel, I am sure there are exceptions.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Onza Canis 2.85 might be a little taller, but that's more of an xc tire.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

It can vary depending on your rim. A i29mm will keep the tire slim so higher but a i45mm will make it wider so probably not as high but when rolling the difference is likely tiny. I am ordering a pair of Maxxis 27.5x2.8 DHF and from other Maxxis i had are like advertised to put on i35mm. Some say they like it so i will see. If you have a problem with pedal strikes you might want 165mm arms, i just love them. Many use them and keep the 175 for road.


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## jkb818 (May 24, 2020)

33red said:


> It can vary depending on your rim. A i29mm will keep the tire slim so higher but a i45mm will make it wider so probably not as high but when rolling the difference is likely tiny. I am ordering a pair of Maxxis 27.5x2.8 DHF and from other Maxxis i had are like advertised to put on i35mm. Some say they like it so i will see. If you have a problem with pedal strikes you might want 165mm arms, i just love them. Many use them and keep the 175 for road.


I definitely wanna try 165 cranks. Only bummer is that my bike came with some pretty nice carbon Raceface cranks.


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## Bullfrog123 (Mar 21, 2018)

I agree with the shorter crank arm idea...I like shorter cranks and then I just adjust what gear I am in to allow me to get enough torque to the wheel for whatever I need to do. I don't have to bend my knees as far which helps me physically since I am getting old and can't flex like I used to.

Regarding the circumference discussion....I tried a 26x4" tire on a 96i rim and on a 62i rim and I could not measure a difference in circumference when wrapping a tape measure around the tire when using the same inflation pressure. Amazingly the inflation pressure changed the outside diameter but there was only a 3mm difference in circumference when making swings in the pressure. After doing the little experiment I got to thinking about it and IMO the lack of change in OD is because the tire carcass basically is constructed so it has a steel ring (or whatever fibers your tire uses to construct the carcass) around the OD of the tire...the sidewall changes shape to accommodate the rim width change but the steel ring stays the same diameter regardless of the internal rim width. I was pretty surprised. Just my observation and opinion on what is going on.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

wallydog said:


> Anyone know the tallest 2.8 x 27.5 for rear use? I am finding the 2.8 x 27.5 HR ll not tall enough and the side wall not stiff enough. Really liked the HR ll 3.0 but it is too big/tall for my frame. Maybe there is a "shorter" 3.0 out there? Thank you.


My Vee Bulldozer 2.8 measures more like a 2.9 on i40 rims. The tire performs fairly well in the rear, but I'm not sure about its durability.


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## dantae (Dec 5, 2019)

BlackTrails said:


> I believe the HR II is better than the purgatory in every aspect except for maybe a slight reduction in rolling resistance, however being that it's my front tire and I don't race, it doesn't bother me. It has better sidewall support for lower pressures and longer life (my purgatory sidewalls degraded faster), and the sidewall support reduces roll over and squirm when cornered hard. I'm not sure if it's the Maxxis tire compound and/or the lug pattern, but the HR II hasn't let me down in the traction department either, I feel when the trail gets a little more loose it shines when compared to the purgatory. This is also a YMMV sort of thing, being a subjective review and all. Hope that helps


Thanks for your response. I am getting a 3.0 HR II for the front. Will report back on my experience with them!


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## grthdbls (Jul 6, 2020)

*Will Maxxis Rekon+ 27.5x2.8 Plus Size Tire fit my 2017 Access Growler Charlie 27.5+?*

Will these Maxxis Rekon+ 27.5x2.8 Plus Size Tires fit my 2017 Access Growler Charlie 27.5+'s stock rims [links below]? First time tire swap out for this bike and instead of going with 29s I found these tires on Facebook Market reportedly off a 2020 Roscoe 8 (owner is swapping to 29s) for $50. Seems like a steal but will it fit my wheelset: Alloy, 32 spoke, 15x110mm Boost front, 10x151mm Boost rear, which currently have these tires: Schwalbe Nobby Nic, 27.5x2.9mm. The concern is the actual measurements of these tires on online reviews place them at 2.66mm so I wasn't sure if that will work with the rims in addition to the fact that they are a tubeless setup [will I need anything else for that?]. HELP!

LINKS:

Bik w/stats: https://www.globalsources.com/si/AS...Growler-Charlie-27.5 -Fat-Bike/1147360930.htm

TIRE:https://www.amazon.com/Maxxis-Rekon...e&qid=1599758905&sr=8-3&tag=amz-mkt-chr-us-20


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

grthdbls said:


> Will these Maxxis Rekon+ 27.5x2.8 Plus Size Tires fit my 2017 Access Growler Charlie 27.5+'s stock rims [links below]? First time tire swap out for this bike and instead of going with 29s I found these tires on Facebook Market reportedly off a 2020 Roscoe 8 (owner is swapping to 29s) for $50. Seems like a steal but will it fit my wheelset: Alloy, 32 spoke, 15x110mm Boost front, 10x151mm Boost rear, which currently have these tires: Schwalbe Nobby Nic, 27.5x2.9mm. The concern is the actual measurements of these tires on online reviews place them at 2.66mm so I wasn't sure if that will work with the rims in addition to the fact that they are a tubeless setup [will I need anything else for that?]. HELP!
> 
> LINKS:
> 
> ...


What's the internal width of your rims? You should be fine with those tires. If you're talking $50 total for a set of tires, it'd definitely be worth a shot.


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## grthdbls (Jul 6, 2020)

s0ckeyeus said:


> What's the internal width of your rims? You should be fine with those tires. If you're talking $50 total for a set of tires, it'd definitely be worth a shot.


Thanks for the quick reply, not sure because they are no name alloy rims, but will surely be taking that chance on those tires for that price! May follow up with tubeless install questions but grateful for this forum!


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

What the true width for 2.8 & 3.0 Nobby Nics on i40 rims? UC has a good sale on both sizes & trying to see if the 3.0 is true to size or not as rear clearance for me is 2.9 due to chainstay. Cause I know some 2.8 tires are undersized a bit.


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## 69tr6r (Mar 27, 2007)

Funoutside said:


> What the true width for 2.8 & 3.0 Nobby Nics on i40 rims? UC has a good sale on both sizes & trying to see if the 3.0 is true to size or not as rear clearance for me is 2.9 due to chainstay. Cause I know some 2.8 tires are undersized a bit.


Not sure about 2.8 on i40 rims. I'm running 2.8's on i30 rims. They measure 2.7" @ 17psi.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Good to know. Cause I read somewhere else someone has a 3.0 on i35 rims & those came out to a little over 2.8 in size. If it's 2.7 on i30, it should be closer to 2.8 on i40. Heck even 2.7 would be acceptable for me as long it's not going under 2.7.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Is there a list somewhere that has the actual width measurements of 27.5+ tires(2.6 too as I know some are oversized to 2.7)?


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Funoutside said:


> Is there a list somewhere that has the actual width measurements of 27.5+ tires(2.6 too as I know some are oversized to 2.7)?


It is kind of hard to do. I was lucky i just got a 3.0 Nobby Nic in the box for a real bargain. I mounted it yesterday and it is about 2.7. After some rides it might get to 2.8 and that is on Giant I35mm so it is probably 2.9 or 3.0 on wider rims. I can see it is a bit more than the 2.8 Rekon it replaced if we consider width but the volume difference is there. My fork manufacturer said 2.9 is max so i am happy to go try it later.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

I know it depends on rim it's mounted on & such, but a more simple it would be between these widths would be cool. Like the WTB Trailblazers 2.8 that came on this bike(which I am not running anymore) measures out to 2.5 no matter the rim. Like a general it's going to be undersized, about true to size or oversized would be cool.


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## velib (Nov 26, 2015)

I'm getting a new Karate Monkey and I think I will replace the stock Dirt Wizards since I won't need that aggressive tires. I will use the bike for commuting (in the winter, just a couple of miles), running errands, doing small family trips (with a trailer or a child seat) and hopefully bikepacking at some point. Maybe some trail riding too, but I have another bike for that and a fat bike for when (if) we get snow. My options at the local shop are Teravail Coronado 3.0" and Onza Canis 2.85", and I will most probably get either one of those. I guess the Canis would probably roll better, but I kind of like the looks of the Coronado. Would the 3.0" tire feel bouncy on pavement, like a fat bike tire does? This is my first plus bike so I don't know where the tipping point for that is in terms of tire width. I understood the Coronado measures true 3.0" whereas the Canis is probably less than 2.8".


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

velib said:


> I'm getting a new Karate Monkey and I think I will replace the stock Dirt Wizards since I won't need that aggressive tires. I will use the bike for commuting (in the winter, just a couple of miles), running errands, doing small family trips (with a trailer or a child seat) and hopefully bikepacking at some point. Maybe some trail riding too, but I have another bike for that and a fat bike for when (if) we get snow. My options at the local shop are Teravail Coronado 3.0" and Onza Canis 2.85", and I will most probably get either one of those. I guess the Canis would probably roll better, but I kind of like the looks of the Coronado. Would the 3.0" tire feel bouncy on pavement, like a fat bike tire does? This is my first plus bike so I don't know where the tipping point for that is in terms of tire width. I understood the Coronado measures true 3.0" whereas the Canis is probably less than 2.8".


I ride to the trails so i did pavement with 2.4, 2.6, 2.8, 3.0 and fat. I never had any bouncing so i guess with proper PSI that problem is solved.


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## velib (Nov 26, 2015)

Yeah I guess the bouncing was when riding back home from the trails with trail pressures. I guess 4-5 psi is not enough on pavement


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

velib said:


> Yeah I guess the bouncing was when riding back home from the trails with trail pressures. I guess 4-5 psi is not enough on pavement


4-5 is enough for my lightweight but only on 4.8. I just carry a mini pump and occasionaly i use it for my return. Happy trails.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

velib said:


> Yeah I guess the bouncing was when riding back home from the trails with trail pressures. I guess 4-5 psi is not enough on pavement


4-5 psi is not enough anywhere.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Any know anything about these tires? Arisun Big Fatty? Comes in 27.5 & 29 x 3.0 & 26 Fat. ARISUN INTERNATIONAL CO., LTD.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Funoutside said:


> Any know anything about these tires? Arisun Big Fatty? Comes in 27.5 & 29 x 3.0 & 26 Fat. ARISUN INTERNATIONAL CO., LTD.


Basically a Fat B Nimble copy.

And, they can try again on the Mount Baldy...


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

Hello I am looking for a tire with such blocks in size 2.8 / 3.0.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

^^^Look at the 27.5x2.8 Magic Mary...


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

And there aren't any in size 3.0?


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## javisst44 (Jun 27, 2016)

Rey112 said:


> And there aren't any in size 3.0?


For a 3.0 to be stable in corners you'll need a rim of 45ish, which noone runs and it's also too wide for most frames so no market for it. Plus the industry settled on 2.6 and 2.8 because of stability. If you're never turning with speed, keep you're hopes up 😉


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

I have i45 rims.
I do not ask what rims I need or what the industry has decided on, but what tire models are available in size 3.0 and have an aggressive, high cube tread.


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## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Rey112 said:


> And there aren't any in size 3.0?


Last fall i found 3 27.5x3.0 lightly used. I had no problem with rims of 40 even 35 mm internal.


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## k1creeker (Jul 30, 2005)

The Surly Dirt Wizard is available in 27.5x3.0 and is the most aggressive tread I’ve ever ridden in any size. That thing will never lose traction. It’s fairly heavy, but any meaty knobbed tire in 3.0” is going to be. Worth a look if you need all the traction.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

javisst44 said:


> For a 3.0 to be stable in corners you'll need a rim of 45ish, which noone runs and it's also too wide for most frames so no market for it. Plus the industry settled on 2.6 and 2.8 because of stability. If you're never turning with speed, keep you're hopes up 😉


Not really. 3.0" tires can be stable on a variety of rim widths with the right tire pressure, especially if they have decent sidewalls.


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

k1creeker said:


> The Surly Dirt Wizard is available in 27.5x3.0 and is the most aggressive tread I've ever ridden in any size. That thing will never lose traction. It's fairly heavy, but any meaty knobbed tire in 3.0" is going to be. Worth a look if you need all the traction.


The tread is like Hans Dampf or higher?


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Might find rocket rons & nobby nic in a 3.0 but not Hans Damf type tire.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Funoutside said:


> Might find rocket rons & nobby nic in a 3.0 but not Hans Damf type tire.


Rocket and Nobby are hard to find since being discontinued. Hans Dampf was not offered in fatter than 2.8, and it is a shame...


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

Rocket Ron has a tread like it doesn't. Nobby also has nothing too high tread.


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## tschram72 (Oct 21, 2012)

Does anyone know if this is true? And if so, when would it be coming out? I am looking for a 27.5 x 3.0 option in SE Michigan and think this would be an awesome tire for here! I prefer racer boy Renegades for my XC bike, but think this would be a nice blend of fast/aggressive for my Suzie Q.


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## the_eleven (Apr 5, 2004)

Were there any new 27.5" tire announcements at Sea Otter, or is this segment fading according to the whims of the bicycle industry?


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Currently running 27.5 x 3.0 Teravail Coronados on i45 rims. Casings are nice and plump, but would like to find something with meatier tread. I tried 27.5 x 2.8 Nobby Nics and 2.8 Kenda Havoc/Havoc Pros, but they all ran narrower than claimed. Any suggestions are appreciated.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

WTB Vigilante 2.8? I've read that the 2.6 measure out closer to 2.7. I would think 2.8 wouldn't be undersized. Have tou also looked at the Teravail Kennebec 2.8? I have the Cumberland(rear companion to the Kennebec) 2.8 on Scraper i40 & it looks to be about the same width as my Onza Canis 2.85 I have on the rear. Had my LBS shop measure it out to 2.81 on i40 rims. 

Related question anyone know if the WTB Ranger measures out larger like the 2.6 model does or is it true to size? My frame rear maxes out at about 2.9 & my lbs has two Ranger(forget which casing) for $33, which is a great deal at a good time as I'm close to needing new rear tire. Just not sure if it will fit the rear. Front can fit 3.0 but I like a little more grippier xc tire in the front


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Funoutside said:


> WTB Vigilante 2.8? I've read that the 2.6 measure out closer to 2.7. I would think 2.8 wouldn't be undersized. Have tou also looked at the Teravail Kennebec 2.8? I have the Cumberland(rear companion to the Kennebec) 2.8 on Scraper i40 & it looks to be about the same width as my Onza Canis 2.85 I have on the rear. Had my LBS shop measure it out to 2.81 on i40 rims.
> 
> Related question anyone know if the WTB Ranger measures out larger like the 2.6 model does or is it true to size? My frame rear maxes out at about 2.9 & my lbs has two Ranger(forget which casing) for $33, which is a great deal at a good time as I'm close to needing new rear tire. Just not sure if it will fit the rear. Front can fit 3.0 but I like a little more grippier xc tire in the front


Thanks. Unfortunately, those all appear to be sold out at the moment.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

Funoutside said:


> Related question anyone know if the WTB Ranger measures out larger like the 2.6 model does or is it true to size? My frame rear maxes out at about 2.9 & my lbs has two Ranger(forget which casing) for $33, which is a great deal at a good time as I'm close to needing new rear tire. Just not sure if it will fit the rear. Front can fit 3.0 but I like a little more grippier xc tire in the front


It depends on the rim width, but I remember the Rangers being pretty close to size, whether at 2.8 or 3.0 on an i40. They are probably ideal in the back, but they were actually pretty good on the front as long as things didn't get too dusty. Even then, they were fine. I'd think you'd want the 2.8 though for your frame though. The 3.0 would rub in the back of my bike, so I had to downsize.


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## s0ckeyeus (Jun 20, 2008)

mchandler said:


> Thanks. Unfortunately, those all appear to be sold out at the moment.


It seems most plus tires have either been discontinued or are not in stock. I think the Vigilantes 2.8s were discontinued.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

s0ckeyeus said:


> It seems most plus tires have either been discontinued or are not in stock. I think the Vigilantes 2.8s were discontinued.


Yeah, I'm starting to stockpile tires in case companies completely abandon the 2.8 and 3.0 widths.

Been tempted to pick up some dirt wizards, but have read that run a bit narrow.


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## nemesis256 (Aug 16, 2014)

I'm looking at the Maxxis site and see that they no longer list 2.8" wide tires (Rekon and Minion DHF specifically). But I've found that the Rekon measures closer to 2.6", I suspect the Minion would be the same. They do list 2.6" on their site however. So my question, is this 2.6" they list a true 2.6", therefore the same size as the old 2.8"? Or will 2.6" be smaller?


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## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

I’m seeing them in the UK site but not US...well that sucks!






Off-Road Cycle Tyres Archives


Whether you're starting out with your first mountain bike, or you're a keen downhill cycling pro, you will have heard of Maxxis; we have the tyres for you.



www.maxxis.com






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## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## noosa2 (May 20, 2004)

nemesis256 said:


> I'm looking at the Maxxis site and see that they no longer list 2.8" wide tires (Rekon and Minion DHF specifically). But I've found that the Rekon measures closer to 2.6", I suspect the Minion would be the same. They do list 2.6" on their site however. So my question, is this 2.6" they list a true 2.6", therefore the same size as the old 2.8"? Or will 2.6" be smaller?


I currently have a 27.5x2.6 DHF on a 32mm ID rim and it measures just over 2.5”.


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## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Teravail has discontinued the 27.5 x 2.8 Cumberland and Kennebec.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Booo. I like the Cumberland. Wait where did you see it discontinued? I only see it is sold out on their site.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Funoutside said:


> Booo. I like the Cumberland. Wait where did you see it discontinued? I only see it is sold out on their site.


Teravail confirmed it via an email.


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

The vigilante's aren't OOS everywhere


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Do the Vittoria Cannoli and Bombolini run true-to-size?


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## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

Sorry if I asked this already but are there any 27.5 2.6 tires that run true to size or even larger? Possibly similar in size to Maxxis in 2.8? @mikesee would you know? Just curious if there are 2.6 I could consider that would not dramatically affect the ride height of my bike and also work with 40mm IR wheels...


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

Maxxis Rekon 27.5 x 2.6 white letter, 120tpi, Exo, 3C, MaxxTerra, Tubeless ready, 755g


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## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

Grinchy8 said:


> Maxxis Rekon 27.5 x 2.6 white letter, 120tpi, Exo, 3C, MaxxTerra, Tubeless ready, 755g


Is that a response to my question?


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

Not directly @jay_paradox . I just happened to have that tire show up over lunch today . . . It has medium side knobs, but low center and small transition knobs. I plan to run it on the rear of my mullet when I go 2.6/2.6 or 2.6/2.8. I haven't ever run a Rekon, but plenty of people have and could provide more direct experience.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

jay_paradox said:


> Sorry if I asked this already but are there any 27.5 2.6 tires that run true to size or even larger? Possibly similar in size to Maxxis in 2.8? @mikesee would you know? Just curious if there are 2.6 I could consider that would not dramatically affect the ride height of my bike and also work with 40mm IR wheels...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've read that the WTB Ranger & Vigilante measure out to 2.7. Bikepacking.com recently measure the Ranger on an i30 wheelset.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

jay_paradox said:


> Just curious if there are 2.6 I could consider that would not dramatically affect the ride height of my bike and also work with 40mm IR wheels...


Based on my i35 rims and 2.6 tires, I'm not so sure it would have an optimal tire profile with i40 rims. Probably be a pretty square profile. I'd stick to 2.8 if I had i40 rims. JMO.


----------



## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

Grinchy8 said:


> Not directly @jay_paradox . I just happened to have that tire show up over lunch today . . . It has medium side knobs, but low center and small transition knobs. I plan to run it on the rear of my mullet when I go 2.6/2.6 or 2.6/2.8. I haven't ever run a Rekon, but plenty of people have and could provide more direct experience.


I had the 2.6 rekon for a season. Never measured to see if it's true to size, but I doubt it's bigger than 2.6 

IME the rekon is good for hard pack or flow trails, but can get pretty damn sketchy on loose surface, leaves, etc and isn't the best at braking traction. I switched to a 2.6 Nobby Nic in back for more traction, and it still rolls really well.


----------



## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Last winter i spent many days riding my 27+.
About the first 5 weeks i was on 2.8 studde cake eaters wich i liked.
Than i found 3.0 studded Warthchild wich i loved.


----------



## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

d365 said:


> I had the 2.6 rekon for a season. Never measured to see if it's true to size, but I doubt it's bigger than 2.6
> 
> IME the rekon is good for hard pack or flow trails, but can get pretty damn sketchy on loose surface, leaves, etc and isn't the best at braking traction. I switched to a 2.6 Nobby Nic in back for more traction, and it still rolls really well.


I agree, i like the Rekon but only for rear. If i find one i will get a Nobby Nic.
Thanks for sharing.


----------



## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

33red said:


> I agree, i like the Rekon but only for rear. If i find one i will get a Nobby Nic.
> Thanks for sharing.


Yeah, no way I would even consider a Rekon up front. That would be a disaster waiting around every corner here.


----------



## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Weights of recent tire purchases:

Terrene Chunk (light), 27.5 x 3.0, 986g
Terrene McFly (light), 27.5 x 2.8, 828g
Vittoria Cannoli, 27.5 x 3.0, 1100g
WTB Ranger (light) 27.5 x 2.8, 891g


----------



## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

Michelin Wild Enduro Rear Gumx3d 
27.5. X 2.8
1366 g








It’s a nice feeling tire. Outside Knobs suitably aggressive.
Casing 166mm wide
Outside of widest knob at casing 44mm from edge


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

1366g is 3.8 territory, good Lord!


----------



## Vandals (Oct 21, 2018)

33red said:


> I agree, i like the Rekon but only for rear. If i find one i will get a Nobby Nic.
> Thanks for sharing.


I run the rekon on Florida trails front and rear. Rolls quick and good steering in the sand and debris here. I would run something heavier if we had mud.


----------



## MattSPL (Dec 28, 2021)

d365 said:


> Yeah, no way I would even consider a Rekon up front. That would be a disaster waiting around every corner here.


Hi, new here and back into bikes after about 6 years away from the hobby. I just bought a 2021 Trek Roscoe 8. It came with Maxxis Rekon’s on it. 
what’s the reasons you don’t recommend them on the front? Thanks


----------



## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

MattSPL said:


> Hi, new here and back into bikes after about 6 years away from the hobby. I just bought a 2021 Trek Roscoe 8. It came with Maxxis Rekon’s on it.
> what’s the reasons you don’t recommend them on the front? Thanks


It is about where we ride. It is designed to be not the lightest and not the heaviest, a compromise tire. On our surfaces it works great most of the time
but some days it lacks traction and in front it is not what i want. Many put a front tire with more traction because it will not slow you much.


----------



## MattSPL (Dec 28, 2021)

33red said:


> It is about where we ride. It is designed to be not the lightest and not the heaviest, a compromise tire. On our surfaces it works great most of the time
> but some days it lacks traction and in front it is not what i want. Many put a front tire with more traction because it will not slow you much.


Thanks for the reply.
The shop I bought the bike from has the Bontrager xr3 and xr4, so I might try those next.


----------



## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

MattSPL said:


> Hi, new here and back into bikes after about 6 years away from the hobby. I just bought a 2021 Trek Roscoe 8. It came with Maxxis Rekon’s on it.
> what’s the reasons you don’t recommend them on the front? Thanks


Picking tires is all about matching tread patterns with your trail surface conditions, and what performance characteristics you prioritize. I guess, how you ride matters too. I'm pretty aggressive in cornering, and pushing the limits of traction. 

My bike came with DHF front/Rekon rear, both 2.6. DHF is a pretty good front tire that works well in a lot of terrain, good cornering, but it lacks some in transition knobs. I'll probably try something new, when it finally wears out, but it's mostly fine.

The Rekon just doesn't have much bite, cornering or braking. Rolls great, but it's better suited to hard pack, dry surfaces IME, where you don't need bigger knobs to dig through loose surface to find traction. On my trails, it mostly worked fine as a rear summer tire, but when the leaves fall, or moisture makes the trail soft, it was always breaking loose way too easily, and unexpectedly... which is why I would never even try it as a front tire.


----------



## MattSPL (Dec 28, 2021)

d365 said:


> Picking tires is all about matching tread patterns with your trail surface conditions, and what performance characteristics you prioritize. I guess, how you ride matters too. I'm pretty aggressive in cornering, and pushing the limits of traction.
> 
> My bike came with DHF front/Rekon rear, both 2.6. DHF is a pretty good front tire that works well in a lot of terrain, good cornering, but it lacks some in transition knobs. I'll probably try something new, when it finally wears out, but it's mostly fine.
> 
> The Rekon just doesn't have much bite, cornering or braking. Rolls great, but it's better suited to hard pack, dry surfaces IME, where you don't need bigger knobs to dig through loose surface to find traction. On my trails, it mostly worked fine as a rear summer tire, but when the leaves fall, or moisture makes the trail soft, it was always breaking loose way too easily, and unexpectedly... which is why I would never even try it as a front tire.


Thanks for the reply.
It sounds like the rekon will be a perfect summer tyre for me, but will have to get more use in the current weather to make a judgment on them. I’ve certainly much more grip than my old bike with 2.1 tyres on it.

Today was only my 3rd time out on the bike and I’m just getting the seat position right and trying different tyre pressures. I’ll see how tomorrow’s ride goes now I’m getting a feel for the bike.


----------



## Jil (Jan 21, 2018)

Hello,
I'm looking for 3.2-3.25" tires (for 27.5" wheel).
Apart the Duro Crux (discontinued?), is there other models on the market ?
Thanks !


----------



## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

Jil said:


> Hello,
> I'm looking for 3.2-3.25" tires (for 27.5" wheel).
> Apart the Duro Crux (discontinued?), is there other models on the market ?
> Thanks !


This is just from a quick search, i have no opinion on those 


https://www.amazon.ca/Vee-T-Fatty-27-5x3-25-Bicycle-Compound/dp/B07B5GH59S


----------



## Jil (Jan 21, 2018)

Thanks. But Vee doesn't make it anymore in 3.25 : PLUS SIZE | T-FATTY - Veetireco


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Jil said:


> Hello,
> I'm looking for 3.2-3.25" tires (for 27.5" wheel).
> Apart the Duro Crux (discontinued?), is there other models on the market ?
> Thanks !


So far as I know, Duro still produces the Crux and Miner in 3.25.
It still is listed in their catalog.


----------



## offrhodes42 (May 1, 2009)

My other post has received zero responses, so I am trying this in this thread. 
My current tires are a Nobby Nic 3.0 in the front and a Rocket Ron 3.0 in the rear. This past year we had a very wet summer and fall and the Rocket Ron did not do so great on all the wet roots. I did like the Nobby Nic. I have found multiple tire deals under $50/tire and am looking for your experiences with these tires for typical rocks, roots, dirt of New England trail riding. This will be going on Stan's Baron (i35) rims.

1. Terrene Mcfly 2.8 for the rear
2. Terrene Chunk 3.0 for the front
3. Vittoria Bombolini 3.0 potentially for both front and rear
4 . Vittoria Conoli 3.0 potentially for both front and rear

For slightly more money I can get a WTB Vigilante 2.8 for the front and a Ranger 2.8 for the rear. I really liked the Ranger in the past (light supple casing) for a rear tire, but that thing wore out FAST. 

Much of the searching I found was for people in desert climates, so looking for feedback from people that ride wet roots and rocks.


----------



## 33red (Jan 5, 2016)

offrhodes42 said:


> My other post has received zero responses, so I am trying this in this thread.
> My current tires are a Nobby Nic 3.0 in the front and a Rocket Ron 3.0 in the rear. This past year we had a very wet summer and fall and the Rocket Ron did not do so great on all the wet roots. I did like the Nobby Nic. I have found multiple tire deals under $50/tire and am looking for your experiences with these tires for typical rocks, roots, dirt of New England trail riding. This will be going on Stan's Baron (i35) rims.
> 
> 1. Terrene Mcfly 2.8 for the rear
> ...


Here is what i can share from my experience. I am a bit north(Quebec) so 2 summer ago i loved a Maxxis Rekon 3c 27.5x.8. After a week i had dialed the PSI 
and it was a real good climber any day unless after a big rain we stay off to avoid damaging the trails.
Now i am on 29 but i think for rear you would like the Terrene Cake Eater i have 2 2.8
I have never had yet a Vittoria for mountain.


----------



## Jil (Jan 21, 2018)

I have looked at some of the main manufacturer's websites, the only 27.5x3.0 tires that are actually displayed (I'm not talking about tires for sale elsewhere), and then probably still manufactured, are the following ones :
Dirt Wizard | Mountain Bike Tire | Surly Bikes (1240 g)
All-Around Tire | Knard (1185 g)
PLUS SIZE | T-FATTY - Veetireco (1340 g)
PLUS SIZE | SPEEDSTER - Veetireco (1220 g) - gravel/road tire, not mtb

It seems that there are more 29x3 than 27.5x3. A lot of 27.5x2.8 though.

No 27.5x3.2 tires anywhere (even on Duro's website).
Did I miss some ?


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Jil,
It looks like Duro has some conflicting information between their US and tw websites...


----------



## offrhodes42 (May 1, 2009)

I was searching around for plus size tires and came across the 27.5x2.8 Slaughters on Specialized website for $17. So, might as well give those a try. Reminds me of the Terravail Cumberland that was on blowout last year and I missed out on getting one. I am going Slaughter in the rear and Butcher in the front, both 2.8. It may not solve my wet roots issue with the current Rocket Ron, but I am cheap and have other bikes with more aggressive tires I can take out if conditions dictate.


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Jil said:


> I have looked at some of the main manufacturer's websites, the only 27.5x3.0 tires that are actually displayed (I'm not talking about tires for sale elsewhere), and then probably still manufactured, are the following ones :
> Dirt Wizard | Mountain Bike Tire | Surly Bikes (1240 g)
> All-Around Tire | Knard (1185 g)
> PLUS SIZE | T-FATTY - Veetireco (1340 g)
> ...


Travail Coronado, 29 x 2.8, 27.5 x 3.0.
Coronado


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

offrhodes42 said:


> My other post has received zero responses, so I am trying this in this thread.
> My current tires are a Nobby Nic 3.0 in the front and a Rocket Ron 3.0 in the rear. This past year we had a very wet summer and fall and the Rocket Ron did not do so great on all the wet roots. I did like the Nobby Nic. I have found multiple tire deals under $50/tire and am looking for your experiences with these tires for typical rocks, roots, dirt of New England trail riding. This will be going on Stan's Baron (i35) rims.
> 
> 1. Terrene Mcfly 2.8 for the rear
> ...


I have a McFly on the rear in 27.5x2.8. I live in PN and I’m running it for the winter. It’s medium knob middle big knob side. Working fine, but I haven’t ridden it lots and lots of miles yet.
It is more knobby than a recon, which I also have. I tried a dhr2 on front, and now trying a cake eater.


----------



## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

I hear the McFly's measure out closer to 2.6(2.68 or so if I remember), which is a bit of a shame cause they look good.


----------



## Schmeg (Nov 2, 2021)

For you snow and ice riders, if you’re on the fence on which studded solution to use, 45Nrth Wrathchild is definitely next level in traction. Spent the first day out on them in hard pack conditions mixed with some ice. These things grip like Velcro. Speedy, but so worth it. Today was a perfect day for plus. A lot of people bash the Roscoe 6 or any of the pre 2022 versions, but used as a “skinny” fat bike in the tight single track woods, they are perfect.


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

Funoutside said:


> I hear the McFly's measure out closer to 2.6(2.68 or so if I remember), which is a bit of a shame cause they look good.


I put the caliper on mine. 27.5 I35 rim at 14 psi. 2.65 casing
2.70 widest knob


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

Schmeg said:


> For you snow and ice riders, if you’re on the fence on which studded solution to use, 45Nrth Wrathchild is definitely next level in traction. Spent the first day out on them in hard pack conditions mixed with some ice. These things grip like Velcro. Speedy, but so worth it. Today was a perfect day for plus. A lot of people bash the Roscoe 6 or any of the pre 2022 versions, but used as a “skinny” fat bike in the tight single track woods, they are perfect.
> View attachment 1964958


I only wish they would have been a good example of 3.hellsyaaaa! I have a pair of first year Wrathchild 2.ohhellno. They are well below the labeled size. They do ok on blacktop style snow. Not too shabby for dirtin' as well.


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## TheBaldBlur (Jan 13, 2014)

offrhodes42 said:


> Much of the searching I found was for people in desert climates, so looking for feedback from people that ride wet roots and rocks.


I'm in Colorado so a lot of loose over hardpack, not exactly the terrain you're looking for - but I've run many of the tires you mentioned.

McFly (2.8) - I ran it on the back and liked it for a fast rolling, mid-grip tire. Very comparable to the Rekon but for me, if price was the same I like the Rekon better but I'd go McFly again if the price was right.

Chunk (3.0) - this was my hands down favorite front tire until recently (more next bullet) and wish they'd make it in 2.8. Grip for days!

Vigilante (2.8) - my favorite tire currently and I have to say I like it better than the Chunk - good mix of rolling and grip. When my first Vig wore out I re-installed my old Chunk and immediately noticed it felt draggy, a lot more so than I expected from a 3.0 vs 2.8.

From your comment about liking the Ranger but wearing out fast, for the rear get it in 60tpi instead of 120 - I can tell a difference between those on my front tire but not in the back except the 60 wears longer.


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## 2sharp7 (Aug 29, 2013)

So what is the consensus? Are 27.5x2.8 and 3.0 tires going away? I'm trying to figure out what wheels/tires to get for my new SS HT build. I was leaning toward 27.5 with i35 rims and running 2.8-3.0 tires but it seems like they're pretty scarce. Is that due to supply chain issues, or are they fading away? As someone above mentioned Specialized has some 2.8" for $17 each....which makes me think they're closing out?


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

2sharp7 said:


> So what is the consensus? Are 27.5x2.8 and 3.0 tires going away? I'm trying to figure out what wheels/tires to get for my new SS HT build. I was leaning toward 27.5 with i35 rims and running 2.8-3.0 tires but it seems like they're pretty scarce. Is that due to supply chain issues, or are they fading away? As someone above mentioned Specialized has some 2.8" for $17 each....which makes me think they're closing out?


You’re fine. Plenty of FUD to match the amount of tires available. 

I’m trying out a new HR2 front and a rekon rear (both 27.5 x 2.8) on my hardtail. Feels good as a plus, but rekon in the front isn’t my fave but fine in the rear.


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## offrhodes42 (May 1, 2009)

Plus is not going away. Schwalbe, Maxxis, WTB, Specialized, and more are still making 2.8 tires. 3.0 may be more limited, but it will not vanish.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Didn't WTB just discontinue the Vigilante in 2.8(& 2.6)? I've also heard rumors of the Ranger 27.5x3.0 is also being discontinued.


----------



## offrhodes42 (May 1, 2009)

Funoutside said:


> Didn't WTB just discontinue the Vigilante in 2.8(& 2.6)? I've also heard rumors of the Ranger 27.5x3.0 is also being discontinued.


 From what I have heard/seen, yes. Only the ranger in 2.8 for 27.5. The 2.8 Vigilante is on sale in quite a few places if anyone wants to stock up.


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## 2sharp7 (Aug 29, 2013)

You guys say it's not going away, but tire mfg's are dropping them left and right.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

2sharp7 said:


> You guys say it's not going away, but tire mfg's are dropping them left and right.


Yeah, I'm stockpiling 27.5 x 2.8 and 3.0 tires whenever I have a few extra bucks.


----------



## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

2sharp7 said:


> You guys say it's not going away, but tire mfg's are dropping them left and right.


Prove it. Everyone is having supply chain issues, and tire manufacturers aren’t immune. I’ve had no problem finding them.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Looks like the Onza Canis in 2.8 is no more. All the sizes, except for the 29x2.25 size. It was a great rear tire for the blue trails in my area.


----------



## jay_paradox (Oct 21, 2020)

One of these days I just gotta bite the bullet and throw some 29er wheels on my bike. I’ve yet to even try them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Funoutside said:


> Looks like the Onza Canis in 2.8 is no more. All the sizes, except for the 29x2.25 size. It was a great rear tire for the blue trails in my area.


Bummer. Those were on my "to try" list.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

You might be able to find it online somewhere. It really does make a great xc rear tire. It wasn't that bad on the road either when I would ride to the trails.


----------



## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Anyone ridden the 27.5 x 3.5 version of this tire?









Fat B Nimble Folding Fat/MTB Tire


The Fat B Nimble is the next step in Fat Bike tire evolution. High-quality and reasonably priced, the Fat B Nimble combines an aggressive tread with larger, cut, center blocks for tremendous grip and changes up to the block cut edge lug for fantastic cornering traction. ▪ Available in 26 x 4.0...




www.panaracerusa.com


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

mchandler said:


> Anyone ridden the 27.5 x 3.5 version of this tire?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


it’s a 2.7


----------



## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

BansheeRune said:


> it’s a 2.7


Ugh (thanks, though).


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

mchandler said:


> Ugh (thanks, though).


I bought a pair of em for flow trail time and thought they would give Sarge better fuel economy in a nice, portly tire. Sadly, they are so grossly undersized I was disappointed. I emailed Panny and let them know that being labeled something it is not is just piss poor business practice and is without honor.


----------



## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

I used those 4-5 years ago on my 6Fattie. Undersized like others stated, dry condition tire only IMO and extremely week/flimsy side walls. Other than that...


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

gdb85 said:


> I used those 4-5 years ago on my 6Fattie. Undersized like others stated, dry condition tire only IMO and extremely week/flimsy side walls. Other than that...


Frankly, the Teravail Coronado is a better general purpose option.


----------



## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

BansheeRune said:


> Frankly, the Teravail Coronado is a better general purpose option.


I've been riding that tire (in 29 and 27.5) almost exclusively for several years. Just wish the tread was a tiny bit taller.


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

mchandler said:


> I've been riding that tire (in 29 and 27.5) almost exclusively for several years. Just wish the tread was a tiny bit taller.


I'll give it that... Tread depth is a little shallow but that makes for better sand performance in the powder sand, anyway. 
I have a few pair of Rocket Ron 3.0 Liteskin that are awesome and also feature a shallow tread. The serve well and since I don't freeride or DH em, have zero concerns of trail hazards.
They roll nicely and help out with fuel economy too.


----------



## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

BansheeRune said:


> I'll give it that... Tread depth is a little shallow but that makes for better sand performance in the powder sand, anyway.
> I have a few pair of Rocket Ron 3.0 Liteskin that are awesome and also feature a shallow tread. The serve well and since I don't freeride or DH em, have zero concerns of trail hazards.
> They roll nicely and help out with fuel economy too.


The RR sounds like a good tire. I tried the 2.8 Nobby Nics and wasn't impressed.


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

mchandler said:


> The RR sounds like a good tire. I tried the 2.8 Nobby Nics and wasn't impressed.


Nobby Nic 3.0 performance has been a good tire choice in my case. The Snakeoil version was slow as molasses and I promptly gave em to a friend. Air pressure is key! A little too much and wash out can be expected, too low and the issues of squirm and rim damage.
RR has its place and is awesome in that role.


----------



## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

mchandler said:


> Anyone ridden the 27.5 x 3.5 version of this tire?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I was shuffling some inventory around this morning and stumbled onto two of these that I'd forgotten were here. New in packaging.

Drop a line if you wanna try 'em out -- cheap.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Oopsie (Vittoria Cannoli)...


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

What the hell did you do??


----------



## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

mchandler said:


> The RR sounds like a good tire. I tried the 2.8 Nobby Nics and wasn't impressed.


Can confirm with you on the 2.8 NNs.


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## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

mchandler said:


> Oopsie (Vittoria Cannoli)...
> 
> View attachment 1975000


Just because the tires are called Cannolis doesn’t mean you need to chew on the knobs.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

BansheeRune said:


> What the hell did you do??


Not sure what happened here. These were dead stock tires that I purchased on eBay. Used my normal sealant (Orange Seal), never over inflated, etc. Bike is stored away from direct sunlight and electric motors. It does see some reasonably drastic temperature changes, but that's never affected my other tires. I live in one of the areas impacted by the (Colorado) Marshall Fire, so it's possible the tire(s) may have come into contact with some chemicals. Not going to take any chances, so I'm planning on replacing both tires (even though the rear appears to be OK).


----------



## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

mchandler said:


> Not sure what happened here. These were dead stock tires that I purchased on eBay. Used my normal sealant (Orange Seal), never over inflated, etc. Bike is stored away from direct sunlight and electric motors. It does see some reasonably drastic temperature changes, but that's never affected my other tires. I live in one of the areas impacted by the (Colorado) Marshall Fire, so it's possible the tire(s) may have come into contact with some chemicals. Not going to take any chances, so I'm planning on replacing both tires (even though the rear appears to be OK).


I thought you were too close and farted or sompin. 😉 
Can't blame ya for replacing both.


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

What's wrong with the 2.8 NN? I was thinking of trying that tire this summer. I really like the 2.6 NN.


----------



## stripes (Sep 6, 2016)

d365 said:


> What's wrong with the 2.8 NN? I was thinking of trying that tire this summer. I really like the 2.6 NN.


If you wanna buy a set cheap, lemme know. You're welcome to mine.

eh, I dunno.. I'm still looking for a plus tire I really like. the NN 2.6 is great for a rear tire for me, but I haven't liked them on the plus side.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

d365 said:


> What's wrong with the 2.8 NN? I was thinking of trying that tire this summer. I really like the 2.6 NN.


My biggest complaint was their relatively small volume. Granted, I was coming off of 3.0 tires with plump casings, so YMMV. I also didn't like the fact that the beads would unseat when the tires were deflated--something I'd not experienced with other brands' 2.8" tires (on i45 rims).


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## BansheeRune (Nov 27, 2011)

stripes said:


> If you wanna buy a set cheap, lemme know. You're welcome to mine.
> 
> eh, I dunno.. I'm still looking for a plus tire I really like. the NN 2.6 is great for a rear tire for me, but I haven't liked them on the plus side.


I run em in 3.0 performance since I couldn't stand the snakeoil version. Air pressure is essential, I must say.
2.6 is the new minus...


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## d365 (Jun 13, 2006)

stripes said:


> If you wanna buy a set cheap, lemme know. You're welcome to mine.
> 
> eh, I dunno.. I'm still looking for a plus tire I really like. the NN 2.6 is great for a rear tire for me, but I haven't liked them on the plus side.


Yeah, the 2.6 NN has a great blend of traction and rolling resistance to me. Figured the 2.8 would ride comparably for what it is. 

Makes a good front tire in the summer, and good rear tire the rest of the time, around here.

Thanks for the offer!


----------



## A. Rider (Jul 25, 2017)

Anyone know how wide Bontrager XR3 27.5 x 2.8 tires run on i45 rims? And if they are not-too-square on that width rim?


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## Mk3Rider (Dec 7, 2008)

27.5x2.8 High roller 2 3c on an i30 rim is an amazing front tire paired with a rekon+ dc rear on i30s.

That is all.


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## A. Rider (Jul 25, 2017)

A. Rider said:


> Anyone know how wide Bontrager XR3 27.5 x 2.8 tires run on i45 rims? And if they are not-too-square on that width rim?


Bueller? 

Bueller?


----------



## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

A. Rider said:


> Bueller?
> 
> Bueller?



I have heaps of those tires here, but no i45 rims.

So I can't measure them for you.

But 'too square' is purely subjective anyway -- only you can decide.


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## wallydog (May 18, 2017)

I like a 27.5 x 3.0 tire. I have been using Rocket Rons and have worn out my last one. In the meager search of what is available for a replacement I decided to try a set of Specialized Ground Controls 27.5 x 3.0 in the T7 casing. One ride and I am impressed. Weighed 1100 grams. They are atleast 3/4 inch taller than the RRs and substantially fatter. Measure a tad over 3.0 and RRs are 2 3/4 inch. Nice round profile on my ARC 40 rims. Tread is similar so rolls nicely but a bit larger knobs and side blocks on the GC. We will see how the durability is. I do run inserts for the benefits gained.


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## rockychrysler (Aug 9, 2003)

Be honest, does this bike make my my tires look big?








Specialized Butcher 27.5x2.8


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

rockychrysler said:


> Be honest, does this bike make my my tires look big?
> View attachment 1999052
> 
> Specialized Butcher 27.5x2.8


Niiice. What’s their actual width?


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## mikesee (Aug 25, 2003)

rockychrysler said:


> Be honest, does this bike make my my tires look big?
> View attachment 1999052
> 
> Specialized Butcher 27.5x2.8


If anything, that bike makes your tires look small.


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## rockychrysler (Aug 9, 2003)

mchandler said:


> Niiice. What’s their actual width?


These Butchers are 71-584, officially. As installed, 69.65mm actually.


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## mchandler (Oct 23, 2021)

Don't know how good these are, but the price is right (available on Specialized's website). They also marked down the 27.5 x 3.0 Ground Control Grid 2Bliss Ready T7.


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## kneedropper (Feb 27, 2007)

What’s the consensus on running a 2.6 tire on a 40mm internal width rim? I know 2.8 and up are recommended, but I’m not thrilled with many of the + tire offerings.


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

I wouldn't do it but that's just me. 2.6 is not a plus size tire. If you have them and want to give it a try, do it. You may like it but I think you'll be disappointed. Most likely be too squared off and make the cornering knobs useless.


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## kneedropper (Feb 27, 2007)

gdb85 said:


> I wouldn't do it but that's just me. 2.6 is not a plus size tire. If you have them and want to give it a try, do it. You may like it but I think you'll be disappointed. Most likely be too squared off and make the cornering knobs useless.


Good stuff. I’ll prolly just grab a couple 3.0 Spesh Ground Controls that are on sale currently. Bike I’m running the setup isn’t really a + bike. It had 40mm internal rims on when I bought it and haven’t swapped them out.


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## david.p (Apr 11, 2011)

I'm running a 2.4 (rear) on an i40 with no issues (for the past 4+ years).


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

To be fair some of WTBs current 2.6 options do measure out close to or at 2.7 even on an i30mm rim so on an i40 it probably be a little over 2.7, which might match some of the undersized 2.8 tires.


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## Rey112 (Jan 1, 2021)

Hello
I am looking for the most aggressive 27.5 x 3.0 tires available, the tread is to be high as in motocross.


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## Grinchy8 (Jul 6, 2021)

Rey112 said:


> Hello
> I am looking for the most aggressive 27.5 x 3.0 tires available, the tread is to be high as in motocross.


Try the 27.5x2.8 Michelin Wild Enduro Gum X 3D.
It's very sticky too.
Short side of side bump is 0.2", tall side is 0.5". Middle bumps 0.175". Carcass is 6.5" wide
I'm measuring a 'Rear'


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

Rey112 said:


> Hello
> I am looking for the most aggressive 27.5 x 3.0 tires available, the tread is to be high as in motocross.


WTB Vigilante 27.5 x 2.8 is pretty darn aggressive in my mind. I have it mounted on i38 rim and its big and gnarly...


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

How wide are the 2.8 Vigilantes cause I heard those don't measure out a little under 2.8(oddly the 2.6s measure out over 2.6).


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

Bike is at LBS getting some exposure, its for sale. I'll be down there this weekend and get a measurement. I have a 29x2.6 Vigilante on a i31 rim and it is pretty big also but the 2.8 is wider on the i38 rim.


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## Funoutside (Jul 17, 2019)

Which i31 rim was that & which i38 you going with?


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## gdb85 (Mar 4, 2017)

i31 is from DIY Carbon laced to Hydra hubs and the i38 Rovals are carbon from Specialized laced to Roval branded DT350's


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