# Should a crown race come off just by lifting it with your fingers?



## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

My fork on my new bike has felt loose, 4 rides so far and after every ride I tighten the stem cap and neck bolts but problem returns. Today I lowered the fork and when I toughed the crown race to check it, it just popped up like nothing and slid up the steerer tube. I have removed and installed crown races and have never seen this. Is this something new with new forks?

Also, there is a large gap in the crown race. This is the first time that I have seen one that was a complete ring. Is it possible it broke or is not the correct crown race?

Also, looks like whoever installed the crown race put a nice blemish gash on the exterior of the fork, you wouldn't see it unless you pulled the fork.


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

Your crown race is snapped, buddy. Change it out ASAP, and ream the guy who last installed it.


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## plantdude (Dec 30, 2007)

Something is not right if your race is not seating properly. And I have never seen a race that has a gap or any seam in it. Take the fork, lower race, and bottom bearing (with your headset model number) into your LBS and get a new crown race installed.


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

Last guy may have cut/slot the crown race to ease installation. Not uncommon, but not necessarily right either. You can get cane creek races easily. Just replace it and it should be ok. 

Use some grease to ease installation. They are usually a nice tight fit.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

i was wondering now if this is the race v. a shim for the bearing cup? But I don't see the race below it, I just see and feel fork crown.


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

^Looks like a busted race to me. Get a new Cane Creek race, and have it installed properly...even if you gotta witness it yourself.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Some headsets do come with split crown races but that doesn't look like one to me.


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

That doesnt look like a crown race at all to me. First, I just got a cane creek headset.. that doesnt look like it at all.. that looks like someone used the compression ring as the crown race.


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## pdxmark (Aug 7, 2013)

IIRC, only the WOODMAN races are split, but they also have a metal band holding the split closed. Not seen any Cane Creeks races split before.

Inspect the slice, the metal will show if it is a break or if it was machined that way.


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

Its probably not even metal... the cane creek series 10 headsets come with a plastic compression ring

actually, i am going to edit and say I just looked on cane creeks website and saw this about their series 10 headsets: "
Crown RaceSplit Glass-Reinforced Polyamide

"


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## Slash5 (Nov 27, 2011)

It's a split crown race, it's OK. I just got a Token integrated headset and I see it uses a split crown race too.

Cane Creek 10 series headset
Crown Race Split Glass-Reinforced Polyamide

https://www.canecreek.com/products/headsets/ten


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

Slash5 said:


> It's a split crown race, it's OK. I just got a Token integrated headset and I see it uses a split crown race too.
> 
> Cane Creek 10 series headset
> Crown Race Split Glass-Reinforced Polyamide
> ...


Ha, good catch, I was editing as you posted.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Slash5 said:


> It's a split crown race, it's OK. I just got a Token integrated headset and I see it uses a split crown race too.
> 
> Cane Creek 10 series headset
> Crown Race Split Glass-Reinforced Polyamide
> ...


Thanks! The top headset Cup says it is a 40 , but the spec says it is a 10. Maybe I got lower 10 and an upper 40?

Are the split crown races supposed to come off at the touch of a finger? All I did was lightly lift up and it is sliding up the steerer tube. It looks and sounds so economical (cheap) that It would brake into pieces if you tried to press it on. It is easily the most flimsy crown race I have ever seen, feels like a somewhat dense plastic.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Yes, the split crown races install and remove easily by hand. A lot of the ones I used to install (FSA's, A-head?) were made of plastic yet somehow seemed to work pretty well.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

J.B. Weld said:


> Yes, the split crown races install and remove easily by hand. A lot of the ones I used to install (FSA's, A-head?) were made of plastic yet somehow seemed to work pretty well.


Thanks! I tried pressing it back down but no luck. The pics below are the best I can do. Now I think I know why there is a big blemish gash on the fork crown. Whoever installed this thing had a hard time getting on and maybe used a tool that slipped.

So if the steerer tube gets loose then this race can just slide up and down with hard impacts?

Reason I ask is that another aspect of the poor install job on this fork is that the spacers were dead even with the top of the steerer tube, which is probably why it was loose to begin with. I checked the spacers after my first ride and replaced a couple with some spacers of different size to give me a little clearance above the tube and leverage on the bearing and star nut. Now I am guessing that when I did that the flimsy crown race probably moved a little and I wasn't aware of it.

Oh well, hopefully the steerer tube and HT are not damaged. A $3100 bike comes specd with this flimsy piece? It feels like a thick automotive gasket. I would gladly have paid a little extra for a steel crown race, which I guess is what i will be doing soon...and probably a new lower cup, too...what a PITA!


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## thickfog (Oct 29, 2010)

SandSpur said:


> That doesnt look like a crown race at all to me. First, I just got a cane creek headset.. that doesnt look like it at all.. that looks like someone used the compression ring as the crown race.


Looking like this to me too, but I don't know. Didn't even know they were doing split races from the factory.


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

I just put a crank creek 40 on one of my bikes and I can tell you for sure, the crown race is not only steel, but has a built in gasket. Off the top of my head I cant remember what material the compression ring was made of...

Did you buy the bike brand new? weird they would do a franken-headset setup...


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

SandSpur said:


> I just put a crank creek 40 on one of my bikes and I can tell you for sure, the crown race is not only steel, but has a built in gasket. Off the top of my head I cant remember what material the compression ring was made of...
> 
> Did you buy the bike brand new? weird they would do a franken-headset setup...


Yeah, bought it brand new. Santa Cruz web site spec says it is a Cane Creek 10 series headset. From the link that aother guy posted above, it looks like the 10 series comes with this flimsy gasket like crown race. It is a joke to me. i am speculqting that the only way to get a tight fit and not have this race pop off every time I remove my bars or fork for service, is to upgrade to a 40 series.

I would have gladly paid more for a 40 to begin with to avoid this crap. Should put a warning sticker "if you adjust stem cap--remove fork and re-set crown race." What a bummer...


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## Cayenne_Pepa (Dec 18, 2007)

SandSpur said:


> I just put a crank creek 40 on one of my bikes and I can tell you for sure, the crown race is not only steel, but has a built in gasket. Off the top of my head I cant remember what material the compression ring was made of...
> 
> Did you buy the bike brand new? weird they would do a franken-headset setup...


Gasket material for crown race, is Delrin Urethane. It looks like OP got a cane Creek 40(good) upper headset....and a Cane Creek 10 lower(meh). Give that sweet SC a Cane Creek 110 or Chris King, man!


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## shoal (Apr 26, 2012)

It looks like your race is for a nontapered fork... There should be no gap once the race is seated and shoild slide easily over the tapered section. Buy a cane creek 40 race. Its like 10 dollars and a pvc pipe to smash it into place. Good luck

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Do you know whether the lower cup is an external? It looks external to me but with headsets thes days I am never sure what it is. I am thinking that if I get a crown rxe for the 40 I may need to get a lower from the 40 series for compatibility.


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## shoal (Apr 26, 2012)

I dont think it matters... I think all of cane creeks races aee the same except for the 10 which is plastic. Just make sure you get the right diameter

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

1. Split races are not uncommon on inexpensive headsets and can function fine with no issues (particularly with sealed bearings).
2. The silver blemish on the fork crown in photos #1 and #2 is likely caused by cable rub. 
3. Do you have enough spacers? Is the top cap bottoming out on the steerer tube? Are you certain you're tightening the top cap and stem bolts in the right sequence?


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

N


Berkley said:


> 1. Split races are not uncommon on inexpensive headsets and can function fine with no issues (particularly with sealed bearings).
> 2. The silver blemish on the fork crown in photos #1 and #2 is likely caused by cable rub.
> 3. Do you have enough spacers? Is the top cap bottoming out on the steerer tube? Are you certain you're tightening the top cap and stem bolts in the right sequence?


1. Do you know if you have to use a crown race setting tool to get it back on? Although it popped off by lifting with my finger, it isn't pressing back down with finger force. Right now there is about 1/8" gap between bottom headset and fork crown because the race isn't seated flush.

2. I think you are right on cable rub, I noticed it last night. There is no gouge or indent and the cable runs close by.

3. The original bike setup did not have enough spacers and I think this is what started the problem. The top spacer was dead even with the top of the steerer tube. I replaced with different sized spacers so it would extend above the steerer tube (after first ride). Positive on the tightening order, learned that lesson the hard way over 10 years ago.


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## Brewtality (Jul 25, 2007)

cjsb said:


> N
> 
> 1. Do you know if you have to use a crown race setting tool to get it back on? Although it popped off by lifting with my finger, it isn't pressing back down with finger force. Right now there is about 1/8" gap between bottom headset and fork crown because the race isn't seated flush.


If it's split, it's broken. Replace it with a new one. The new crown race will require a tool to install. If it doesn't, then you need to inspect/replace the fork crown.

Due to the doubts and questions regarding your current headset, I would start all over with a known high quality headset. Cane Creek or King should be at the top of your shopping list.


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## J.B. Weld (Aug 13, 2012)

Brewtality said:


> If it's split, it's broken.


Not necessarily true, as already mentioned some headsets do come with split crown races. I agree that it looks like the OP has the wrong one and should either get the correct one or replace the whole headset.



cjsb said:


> 1. Do you know if you have to use a crown race setting tool to get it back on?


Every split crown race I have come across has installed easily by hand.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Thanks, J.B., after messing with it again today I can't see anyway to press the race back in by hand, it diesn't fit. So it is either the wrong race or I need the tool. If it is the wrong race it would explain the problem.

I am toing to get a 40 series race, maybe a lower cup, too. But if I can press this back in by hand I can at least ride until the parts come.

It is a bummer to have these issues with such an obscure part, but critical part, on a brand new bike. Oh well, my back up bike is a Yelli, rode it today can't complain too much.


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## shoal (Apr 26, 2012)

As i said that looks like the wrong crown race... For a 1 and 1/8 fork not a tapered fork. Split races go on super easy. Qhwn on rhe split should have much gap. Order another race. Gl

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


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## santa cruzer73 (Oct 22, 2013)

Thats perfectly fine. Nothin to worry about!!!


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

The one advantage split races have is that they can be removed without a crown race puller and generally installed without a crown race setter (using a screwdriver to spread the split temporarily opens the ID enough to slip on). 

As noted previously, split crown races come from the factory with an intentional split cut into them and does not indicate damage. Because of the way that crown races work, they rarely snap. With that being said, I don't believe Cane Creek uses split crown races on any of their headsets anymore. Assuming everything else checks out, I would try replacing the race first and go from there. 

As a precaution, some top caps have an edge that can bottom out on the steerer tube even when it appears to have enough clearance. You might try adding another small spacer.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

I really appreciate all of the helpful feedback, especially JB Weld, Shoal, and Berkley. I discussed it with Cane Creek via email and this crown race does go back on by hand and without setting tool. It is supposed to seat as you tighten down the stem cap.

So I just pushed it back down on the crown, it obviously doesn't sit flat but figured it would compress when tightening but it did not. There is still a 1/16" gap and that is with the stem bolt tightened like going ape **** on it, almost.

I replaced all of the plastic spacers with some King spacers I have lying around. I put a silly amount of clearance to make sure the stem cap wedge wasn't touching. But you were right Berkley, that wedge is so deep on the original POS stem cap that it likely made contact. You can see in the pics below that the original stem cap is cracked, it is very light cheap plastic and feels like styrafoam. I replaced with my old stem cap from my Enduro.

Stem bolt is slightly bent as probably most are.

Even with this silly looking all metal set up (except for plastic crown race) there is still a 1/16" gap, but maybe this is normal? It does not inspire confidence and you can see from my pic below of my Yelli that there is zero gap. Also, even with this setup now when I brace the front wheel with my knees and rock the handle bars you can feel the fork move. It doesn't move as much as it did before but to me it shouldn't move at all. My Yelli has zero movement.

I am going to send some of these pics to Cane Creek and see what they thing, maybe it is normal? Even if it is I don't trust it and I'll be getting a better headset and race.

Again, thanks for all the helpful feedback.


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## SandSpur (Mar 19, 2013)

You said this is a brand new bike right? why arent you having it warrantied?


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

SandSpur said:


> You said this is a brand new bike right? why arent you having it warrantied?


Well, that's a great question. So far I don't know whether this is normal or not? I have emailed the bike company but it might be better if I call and discuss it with them.

If the crown race isn't working, whatever that means, then yeah I'd expect a new one. But this is just cheapo stuff and the norm for cheapo stuff then I guess there is nothing to do. Just live with your cheapo stuff or upgrade. If it is the latter then it certainly leaves a bad taste, but that's life, too.


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

I've never heard of anyone using the preload cap to seat a crown race. I would consider that bad advice.

Try this: Take the crown race off and put some grease on the fork crown and bottom part of the steerer tube where the race will sit. Slip the race down as far as possible, then carefully use a flathead screwdriver or similar tool to spread the race open enough to fully seat it on the fork crown. I generally grease all crown races when seating them.

If that doesn't work, replace the race. FYI, this is the model of race you should replace it with: Cane Creek 40 Series 1.5" Crown Race > Components > Headsets and Spacers > Crown Races | Jenson USA

EDIT: And make sure to replace both the top cap and the bent bolt (the bolt is probably bent from cranking down on it).


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## ou2mame (Apr 23, 2010)

Pvc and a hammer? 

Sent from my 831C using Tapatalk


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## challybert (Sep 5, 2014)

ou2mame said:


> Pvc and a hammer?
> 
> Sent from my 831C using Tapatalk


^^^this. It takes all of 30 seconds to do, and $3-$4 for a 24inch piece of pvc. So many possible things to have to fix/maintain on a bike. The crown race is not one of the items you want to have to worry about.


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## Saul Lumikko (Oct 23, 2012)

As it has been established, the split is nothing to worry about. Some have it, some don't. I split my crown races on purpose when installing to make disassembly easier. The engagement between conical surfaces of the crown race and cartridge bearing inner race keeps everything nice and tight once it's assembled.

In your very first pictures I spy a concave step on top of the crown race and a conical shoulder below. I'm not familiar with this particular headset, but usually the conical side of a crown race is on top to mate with the inner race of the cartridge bearing. You might want to check whether or not it's the right way around.

Either way, there will be a gap between the fork crown and bottom headset cup because of this. Conical shape on one side and a concave step on the other - neither will be flush against the fork crown. Just the innermost part of the crown race will touchdown at the bottom and that's enough. 

Never ever over-tighten the stem top cap. It only serves to keep the assembly slop-free until you have tightened the stem pinch bolts.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Bingo! Thanks! The crown race was installed upside down. I explained to Cane Creek that the criwn race was not going to fit right because a ridge was extending down and there was no way for it to flatten. You described this as conical surface. When I read your post it occurred to me that it was installed upside down.

I remove the fork completely, pulled the race off and flipped it over. I still get this 1/16" gap between the crown and lower cup and you can see the race, BUT the fork no longer wiggles.

So whoever installed crown race, whether it was SC or CC, they put it on upside down. I hope riding it like that for the 4 rides I had didn't damage the lower cup bearings or the fork, who knows?

What a PITA, but thanks for your help. I kind of feel like whoever installed it incorrectly should send me a 40 series race just for my troubles.


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## Intenseski (Jul 2, 2006)

That is a very typical crown race for a low/mid rage bike spec.ed by the manufacturer. Split composite races are used regularly to keep costs low and work just fine if adjusted and maintained correctly. They do slide on/off easily by design but by the looks of your photos there is nothing wrong or atypical about your headset/crown race. The "gash" you are worried about is just the usual cable rub and could have been avoided by putting a frame saver sticker where the cables contact your frame. It does look like you have cracked your headset top cap when you tried to tighten your headset. Once again, a plastic top cap was spec.ed when the bike was put together by SantaCruz to keep the cost of the complete bike low. Nothing seems to have been done wrong when the bike was built. The standard split crown race and plastic top cap was used and if all went well and the bike was maintained and re-adjusted properly no issues would have come up during the normal live cycle of the parts. You should get a metal crown race and top cap installed as it sounds like you are planning to and keep them adjusted and maintained and you should have no problems for several years until the life of the parts has reached their end. If you are worried about the paint that was rubbed of by the cable rubbing against it then get some black touch up paint and cover the "gash" and put a frame saver patch over it and your GTG! Nothing abnormal or bad parts or improper installation here.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Regarding the cable rub, you must have missed that in a post above. I realized it was cable rub and not a gash.

Hiwever, you are wrong about the other stuff. The crown race was installed upside down, which is how the bike arrived to me. That is why the fork was loose. 

In any event, they are sending me a replacement setup, awesome customer service all the way around from Competitive Cyclist, Santa Cruz, and Cane Creek. It was an honset mistake that anyone could have made, unfortunately happened to me. First time I purchased from Competitive Cyclist, but based on their service I'll be a life-long customer.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

Thanks again for all of the great feedback to my issue and questions. I am getting a replacement headset and crown race. Prior to my issue I had never seen or heard of the split ring crown race. After going through my tools to find my crown race press tool I am starting to see the value of these split rings. But I'd rather have one made of steel than plastic. Simply placing the race right on the crown without a tool is really convenient. I must have borrowed a friends setting tool the last time I did this, so probably use PVC this time.

Just curious whether anyone has cut the metal ring crown race to convert it to a split ring? Do they sell steel split ring races?


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## Berkley (May 21, 2007)

Generally you can cut a steel race to make it into a split race. The races Cane Creek uses now have a rubber seal on them to keep grit out of the lower bearing. Because of that, I probably would not cut it.


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## Saul Lumikko (Oct 23, 2012)

Good to hear you got it sorted!

I have aluminum or steel crown races on all of my bikes. If they weren't split by the factory, I did it before assembly. I would not hesitate using a plastic part here - it is supported by the steerer from the inside, crown from below and headset inner race from the top, so there's nothing to worry about.

The split has no ill effect at all and it saves me the hassle of finding suitable pipe or buying a tool.


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## cjsb (Mar 4, 2009)

G


Saul Lumikko said:


> Good to hear you got it sorted!
> 
> I have aluminum or steel crown races on all of my bikes. If they weren't split by the factory, I did it before assembly. I would not hesitate using a plastic part here - it is supported by the steerer from the inside, crown from below and headset inner race from the top, so there's nothing to worry about.
> 
> The split has no ill effect at all and it saves me the hassle of finding suitable pipe or buying a tool.


After getting everything sorted I think I agree with you on the plastic split ring. CC sent me a free headset upgrade (incredibly generous--they let me choose any from their site). I put the steel race on with a proper tool to prevent damage and the makeshift PVC rammer, no problems but the plastic race is sooooo much easier.

Ordeal ends with an ugly twist or should I say "Grip" as in "GripLock" I chose a 110 headset but they were out of stock. I was too impatient to wait so I chose a King. I had a King on my old bike for like 8 years and never had issues getting it on or off. But this new GripLock is insane. I got it on first time no problem bu there was a gap, so I tried to get it off and I thought I would have to cut the steerer tube. Finally got it off but there was no way it was going back on, the worm like O ring kept popping out. Frustrated to the hilt I pulled the fork again and popped the King upper out and re-installed the 40 series upper that came stock with the bike.

I never seen anything so frustrating as this GripLock thing. It was enough to make me not want another King product. I should have waited for the 110 stock to arrive!


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## bobm79 (1 mo ago)

cjsb said:


> My fork on my new bike has felt loose, 4 rides so far and after every ride I tighten the stem cap and neck bolts but problem returns. Today I lowered the fork and when I toughed the crown race to check it, it just popped up like nothing and slid up the steerer tube. I have removed and installed crown races and have never seen this. Is this something new with new forks?
> 
> Also, there is a large gap in the crown race. This is the first time that I have seen one that was a complete ring. Is it possible it broke or is not the correct crown race?
> 
> ...


i think it was upside down


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## Battery (May 7, 2016)

bobm79 said:


> i think it was upside down


I'm sure they probably figured it out 8 years ago.


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