# WOW! BX-1 tool box



## timberstone (Feb 20, 2009)

While snooping around Parks website they are advertising the Professional Travel and Event Kit EK-1 which I looked at and googled to find a $500 + price on it. I thought wow but realized a lot of tools in there I dont' need right now and paying $500 is unthinkable.

Well I'm a case guy. Everything has to have a case. Today while looking at cone wrenches I found you can just buy the case. Hmmmm there's a thought my plastic tool box I bought is getting a little small but hey what do you want for $10.

I googled the case and almost fell off my chair. The case alone is $229! What? For a case! Wow! Don't worry not spending the money on one I can get a second tool box or another $10 and have $20 into cases but just thought the case was cool. Not $229 cool though.

Maybe this is inline with speciality cases not sure but sure took me by surprise. Here I was thinking oh $75 or so. That means the price of the case is half the cost of the entire tool kit!

Hmmm maybe next years christmas present!

http://www.parktool.com/products/detail.asp?cat=19&item=BX-1


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

Yep, it's Park. They have some great common tools at decent prices but their "professional" lineup is ridiculously out of price...


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## Nick_M2R (Oct 18, 2008)

I cant believe the price of there bb facing and chasing tool, $1100 AUD last i checked on CRC....


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## rallyraid (Jun 12, 2007)

Looks like a customized Pelican case. You can buy a Pelican camera case for $100 or less and park your truck on top of it. It won't break and is water proof.


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## themanmonkey (Nov 1, 2005)

PissedOffCil said:


> Yep, it's Park. They have some great common tools at decent prices but their "professional" lineup is ridiculously out of price...


So please explain why their stuff is "ridiculously out of price?" Please give an example or two of these ridiculous prices? I'd love to get better versions of my professional tools at a great price. If you're comparing professional tools to other professional tools you won't find a better deal than Park. Hozan, Var, Campagnolo, Cobra, etc will all cost you a lot more. Pedro's is OK stuff but in general it's the same price as Park, but the metal is softer and the finish not as nice.



[QUOTE=PissedOffCil said:


> I cant believe the price of there bb facing and chasing tool, $1100 AUD last i checked on CRC....


Have you checked the price on the Var or Campagnolo cutters? Just my cutting die for the Campy costs more than the whole Park tool. If you're looking at the Cyclus tools they're really not professional quality, except for a few of them and those are similarly priced to the Park.


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## bad mechanic (Jun 21, 2006)

themanmonkey said:


> So please...


^^^ This.


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## reptilezs (Aug 20, 2007)

i wish pedros didnt charge so much for their tools. i find them to be decent enough but they are made off shore and the price should reflect that.


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

themanmonkey said:


> So please explain why their stuff is "ridiculously out of price?" Please give an example or two of these ridiculous prices? I'd love to get better versions of my professional tools at a great price. If you're comparing professional tools to other professional tools you won't find a better deal than Park. Hozan, Var, Campagnolo, Cobra, etc will all cost you a lot more. Pedro's is OK stuff but in general it's the same price as Park, but the metal is softer and the finish not as nice.
> 
> Have you checked the price on the Var or Campagnolo cutters? Just my cutting die for the Campy costs more than the whole Park tool. If you're looking at the Cyclus tools they're really not professional quality, except for a few of them and those are similarly priced to the Park.


It's that time of the month heh?

That 230$ case is certainly one of them. Others I had in mind were definitely reaming and facing tools. For these needs, I've been eyeing Lifu tools but am not sure on the quality. They are half the price of Park and reviews aren't so bad... I'll most probably get them one day.

And it doesn't justify a thing that other bike companies charge the same ridiculous prices when you can often get equal quality tools from your local hardware store for a fraction of the price.


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## themanmonkey (Nov 1, 2005)

PissedOffCil said:


> That 230$ case is certainly one of them. Others I had in mind were definitely reaming and facing tools. For these needs, I've been eyeing Lifu tools but am not sure on the quality. They are half the price of Park and reviews aren't so bad... I'll most probably get them one day.
> 
> And it doesn't justify a thing that other bike companies charge the same ridiculous prices when you can often get equal quality tools from your local hardware store for a fraction of the price.


Your profile says you're a video game programmer and only been a cyclist for 5 years. I'm a professional bicycle mechanic with 25 years wrenching and 35 years cycling. Who do you think might have a better idea on what are professional bicycle repair tools?

Seriously, if you're looking at pro level tools Park is just fine and cheaper than most. Lifu/IceTools are a fine consumer tool, but they're not made to the same standards as professional tooling. Over the years there isn't many professional or consumer tools I haven't laid my hands on. Since this is my profession it's important that I know what's out there and how it works.

In the end you give one example and it's not even a tool, here is a Pelican case of similar dimensions and the the cost is $130 with foam at discount price, not full retail. Now Park has specific inserts made for them to fit the tools and things like that run around $100. So we're now at $230 which is the same price as the Park.

I know professional tools, they are my profession. When you talk about Lifu tools and screwdrivers it just shows that you don't know what professional tools are. You don't win debates with indignation and hyperbole, you win them with facts. Next time you come back please bring some.


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## the-one1 (Aug 2, 2008)

Now there's a professional tool.^


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## archer (May 20, 2004)

I don't think anyone mentioned any screwdrivers but themanmonkey.
I'd agree that LIFU screwdrivers aren't the best at least in their consumer kit.

I wouldn't buy Park though.
I'd buy specialty screwdrivers for firearms but there isn't any reason to pick up speciality bike screwdrivers or sockets or allen wrenches where the fasteners are the same as every other fastener.

The fact that the case has a Park label on it and is pretty much overkill in both application and price is the point. I was looking at Pelican cases recently and as I recall you can find them quite a bit less expensive than $130 even with foam included. The Park case is Park blue however and does include what looks like 'the standard traveling toolkit liner' used by copier repairmen everywhere. I've never really understood the plastic toolbox thing unless you are traveling then it might make some sense. Otherwise you are probably better off with a metal box with your own 'dead tool' cutouts.


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## timberstone (Feb 20, 2009)

archer said:


> I don't think anyone mentioned any screwdrivers but themanmonkey.
> I'd agree that LIFU screwdrivers aren't the best at least in their consumer kit.
> 
> I wouldn't buy Park though.
> ...


So far my tool kit goes where I go but I don't have a lot of the speciality tools yet. Once I do those will probably stay at home. Not sure I really need a chain whip when I go on vacation but for now the plastic box holds lube, tubes, patch kits, extra Co2 cartridges and basic hand tools. Some of the places where we go the only bike store that is within 50 miles is a walmart so anything that I may need for the bike I take with.

When I'm at home I keep everything in the same box just because it's easy. I do have a 3 drawer craftsman toolbox that I no longer use so that will get pulled back out for the tools I don't take with.


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## themanmonkey (Nov 1, 2005)

archer said:


> I don't think anyone mentioned any screwdrivers but themanmonkey.
> . . . (SNIP). . .
> The fact that the case has a Park label on it and is pretty much overkill in both application and price is the point. I was looking at Pelican cases recently and as I recall you can find them quite a bit less expensive than $130 even with foam included.


To your first point I was referring to what people usually ***** about which are screwdrivers and allen wrenches. As to your second part read again we're talking about professional tools not "overkill in both application and price is the point" because they're NOT consumer tools. You can say "you can find them quite a bit less expensive than $130 even with foam included" all you want but without links it means nothing.

Alas I can't comment on your profession and its tools because you don't list those things in your profile. I'm sure folks outside of your profession see little use for the yools you use to get your job done. I would never dare to tell *PissedOffCil* about the tools he uses to program. I've done programing and can get by with a text editor most of the time, but I would never say his tools were over kill or not worth the money.

I'll say it one more time. If you compare Park's prices to other PROFESSIONAL GRADE tools you will find that their prices compare favorably. Maybe you can now see why professional mechanics like myself don't come to these forums much. Everybody thinks they know what we do, but you don't.


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## fightnut (Jul 5, 2007)

themanmonkey said:


> I know professional tools, they are my profession. .


The argument isn't about their quality, it's about their price. They're overpriced.


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## archer (May 20, 2004)

I was talking about an overpriced box.
The fact that it is blue and has Park Tools label on it doesn't make it a professional grade tool.

IF it is a pelican case then it is overkill for use as a bike tool box even if it is used for 'professional' grade bike tools with the potential exception of if you are traveling with it. For the most part that exception applies to situations where you aren't in control of it during the travel where you have to contend with baggage or shipping handlers. 

The box you listed with foam is 18.94"L x 14.44"W x 7.75"D interior dimensions or 20.62" x 16.87" x 8.12" exterior. The Park box measures nominally 19" x 15" x 7" which means it probably not quite small enough to fit inside the Pelican case you mention. Subtract about $20-30 for Pelican's pick and pluck foam since it isn't included in the Park case. 

The box actually looks quite a bit cheaper than Pelican, more like Samsonite luggage, especially the latches, hinges and seal or lack thereof. They don't mention it being waterproof which is a hallmark of most Pelican products. 

Add a set of 'custom nylon tool boards' $10-20 retail. Plastic hacksaw to fit dividers like those included in the aluminum harbor freight briefcase probably shouldn't run more than another $20 retail at highway robbery rates.

I'm an engineer, my professional tools typically include a CAD box, electronic digitizing devices, occasionally another engineer or so, a drafter/designer or five, A&P mechanics, composite fabricators, CNC programmers and operators, and their tools. As a rule I always try and consult with the shop guys to make sure the aircraft mods or part fabrication instructions are something that makes sense. (And so they know what's coming down the pipe and who to yell at if anything looks odd rather than screwing up an expensive part that might kill the job.)

One of the best A&P mechanics I've ever worked with was a former bike mechanic and he taught me a lot about how not to screw up aircraft mods. The everyday socket wrenches, combination wrenches and what not he had to provide himself for working on a major airline's aircraft were mostly Craftsman. Some of the guys swear by Snap On or MAC but a whole lot more of them figured the added expense isn't worth it especially since Craftsman started offering polished wrenches and ratcheting stubby wrenches. 

Most specialty tools, like those required to drive certain blind fasteners, cold work holes and reamers are often provided by the company although most of the better guys have collected some air tools, and alignment or precision measuring tools of their own, even if they often can't use them from an accountability standpoint.

If you want to pay $230 for a cheap imitation of a Pelican case then go right ahead.


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

Monkey, although my day job is a video game programmer you go a long way to think I've never wrenched a bike. I assemble all my bikes myself, do all my maintenance myself and have my fair share of Park Tools, almost all of them to be honest. I've been cycling for five years and wrenching for the same time and although it might not be a lot of experience this debate has nothing to do with experience but with how overpriced some Park tools and equipment are.

300$ for a stand base??? WTF? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=37277
40$ for a small parts holder (box)? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=27041
180$ for a torque wrench? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=37252
70$ for a crown race setting tool? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=27040
160$ for 2 wheels and a base (hand truck kit)? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=17709
etc. etc. etc.

I do own some of those tools because I like to have the right tool for the job and prefer to pay rather than do homemade tools and sometimes I just have time to look around for other offerings. I'm not debating Park Tool quality although I think some of their tools are crap (I-Beam 3 minitool) or are useless (rotor truing tool).

250$ for a headset press? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=17482
90$ for a seat tube clamp? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=17707
120$ for chain tool pliers? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=13232

As for my example not being a tool... Huh I wonder what reaming and facing TOOLS are if they aren't TOOLS. Yes Lifu has those offerings at half the price of Park... Can't talk about quality, no frame prep in sight...

190$ for a portable work bench? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=17708
55$ for a locknut wrench? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=38426
375$ for a truing stand? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=5788

Enough said! And I repeat, I own some of these tools...


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## bad mechanic (Jun 21, 2006)

I no longer work in a shop, but have continued working on my bikes, and those of my friends, so I've seen both sides in this debate. It's totally different market segments with different requirements. 

For shop use, Park is worth the money, since they work very well and, just as importantly, can stand up to the abuse of shop use. It is very much overkill for consumer use, because the big ticket tools are designed to have an indefinite life span in a shop. I can tell you consumer tools don't have the greatest life span in a shop. You can expect that $500 BB facer to still be in use 20 years from now. Same goes for their shop stands; yes they cost of lot of money, but I don't think people understand the amount of use and abuse they go through. Once you start thinking about it relative to that much use over that much time, it makes a lot of sense.

Now that I'm wrenching for myself, I'll most likely buy the Icetoolz BB facer for my use, because it's quite adequate the for the frequency and volume of work I have. 

Like always, they have some tools which have me scratching my head (like the chain pliers), but there appears to be a market there. 

PS - I like their rotor truing tool and have found it to be useful.

PPS - If the Park case is as durable as a Pelican, then yes, I can see it costing $230.


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## PG256 (Apr 21, 2009)

I use the rotor truing tool all the time, its great. Like bad mechanic said the price of Park's tools are pretty reasonable priced given there quality and the amount of use they get in a shop environment. And compared to other specialty tools (Campy, Var...) the Park ones are much cheaper.


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## zebrahum (Jun 29, 2005)

timber, I totally see your point, and I believe that Park must be making up their margins on things like tool boxes and screwdrivers because they sure shouldn't be charging those prices for those things.

I'm pretty much in line with what badmechanic said, I've spent a decade professionally wrenching and I've worked with plenty of Park tools that have been in service longer than I've been working in the industry. There's a place for the inexpensive tools like icetoolz, but that place is no where near me. They're great for consumer use, but for a serious mechanic Park is what you get (for bike tools, standard hand tools like screwdrivers and sockets are almost certainly better purchased through a company that specializes in those sort of tools). 

I may not be wrenching professionally at home, but I won't be buying second rate tools for my home use. I'll be buying Pedros and Park for bicycle tools, I don't see any value in low quality tools for my use; again I'm used to pro quality and I'll be a bit of a snob, but I'm the one footing the bill.

In the end, Park may charge too much for things like tool boxes, but their bicycle tools are great and skimping on tools can end in bloody body parts and tears.


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## timberstone (Feb 20, 2009)

Last night I was at my local LBS and what do I see? The toolbox on one of the mechanics bench. I go over and look at it and I must say I was impressed. They give you lots of room and there are dividers so you can reconfigure the inside. The outside of it is textured and I wasn't sure what to make of that. I tried pushing on the cover to see if there was any flex and there didn't appear to be much too it. I walked away thinking it's a nice box. I would have liked to move it around a little more but didn't want to get to nosey with it.


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## wesMAmyke (Nov 12, 2005)

The park tool case is a copy of this case here: http://www.biketoolsetc.com/index.c...le&c=Tools&sc=Tool-Cases&tc=&item_id=HW-9252B

I didn't add it up but if the park one comes with the tool pallets it might actually cost about the same as the C.H. Ellis, as you have to buy them separate.

I'll jump in and comment on the rest of the thread...

I would go Park for the fancy expensive stuff just because it would be easier to get parts if you needed them, IMO. VAR, Campy and Cyclus are pretty much sold through a single distributor in the US and most of the time the stuff is just sold out and impossible to find.

They do manage to have small parts and replacement cutters available for the most part for VAR etc, but the only Park tools that are hard to get right now are the out of production ones. It's just easier and usually cheaper to go Park tool.

I do have a few Cyclus and VAR items, but only where a similar item is not available. Example being the Cyclus or VAR steerer tube cutting guide. Or the old VAR crown race slide hammers with the brass inserts. I sure would make use of a boxed Campy tool kit if you gave me one though...


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## timberstone (Feb 20, 2009)

wesMAmyke said:


> The park tool case is a copy of this case here: http://www.biketoolsetc.com/index.c...le&c=Tools&sc=Tool-Cases&tc=&item_id=HW-9252B
> 
> I didn't add it up but if the park one comes with the tool pallets it might actually cost about the same as the C.H. Ellis, as you have to buy them separate.
> 
> ...


I think they need to work on their marketing campaign. I would go with the park one over the one in the link above over this.

"This case is strong enough to last several race seasons, or several years in your garage or workshop."

What? Ok first what is the difference between several race seasons or several years in the garage? Isn't a season a year so aren't they saying the same thing? Besides that to read $150 for a case that will last only several years in the garage doesn't sell me on the product. I would dish out the extra $80 on the Park case.

I should add when I did the first post I had no clue what cases cost. Seeing other cases are in the $150 range doesn't put it too far out of line. Keep in mind my thought when I saw the case was I was guessing the price would be $75ish so that is where I was blown away.


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## wesMAmyke (Nov 12, 2005)

Here is the company that actually makes those cases: http://www.chellis.com/

The site I linked to is a mixed bag with the descriptions and pictures of products. Some are very well described and some are a joke with out of date pictures and info.


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## archer (May 20, 2004)

Bike Tools ETC. isn't price competitive on most tools.
They do seem to have a lot of the more oddball speciality tools like particular fork maintanace tools and so forth but if you can find it somewhere else the price will often be a lot less expensive.


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## lane (Mar 6, 2006)

I have Park tools in my kit that have outlasted some of my Snap On stuff over the last 12 years of heavy shop use. The only things I've seen better than that is some older Hozan and Var. (Campy is a whole other league entirely). In my opinion its worth every penny. As I tell my customers, you can buy good tools once and give them your kids when you die or you can buy consumer quality tools a few times over. It all costs the same.


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## zoro (Mar 14, 2007)

PissedOffCil said:


> Monkey, although my day job is a video game programmer you go a long way to think I've never wrenched a bike. I assemble all my bikes myself, do all my maintenance myself and have my fair share of Park Tools, almost all of them to be honest. I've been cycling for five years and wrenching for the same time and although it might not be a lot of experience this debate has nothing to do with experience but with how overpriced some Park tools and equipment are.
> 
> 300$ for a stand base??? WTF? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=37277
> 40$ for a small parts holder (box)? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=27041
> ...


Your prices are way out of range!! Jenson offers, for example, the headset press for 140$ US. That's a full 100$ difference! Here


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

zoro said:


> Your prices are way out of range!! Jenson offers, for example, the headset press for 140$ US. That's a full 100$ difference! Here


You really think I went out and checked the price for every single item posted there? 140$ is still too much anyways...


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## jrabikerepair (Dec 29, 2009)

Park tools are built, and priced, for the professional mechanic who requires tools that stand up to the daily abuse. Much better steel quality and actual tool measurement tolerances, to name a few. Lifu/Spin Doctor tools are meant for the home mechanic who wrenches occasionally on one or two bikes, and does not put tools through constant use. Additionally, hardware store tools are not built for the bicycle; they lack ergonomics and clearances needed on some bicycles. I could go all day with this, but basically, you get what you pay for. When you look at the Professional race/event kit, just imagine the places that box will get thrown around and abused (race mechanics can be very hectic), but still survive the next few seasons.


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## boogenman (Sep 22, 2006)

WOW...There are some dumb a$$ posters on here. I gave up on reading after the first 10 or so posts. 

I agree 100% with themanmonkey, I am also a ex pro mechanic, 10 years wrenching in shops and for regional teams. 

I no longer have a need for many of the tools I used as a pro but I still feel that many of the tools park offers are superior to hardware store tools or cheaper bike specific tools. 

What is the point of coming on here to ***** about how much park tools cost? Obviously there is a market for them or park would not still be in business. You just are unaware of that because you are the typical no it all pro. Any long term bike mechanic has certainly had a run in with this type before.


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## jrafter (Mar 27, 2009)

i keep all my tools in one of theses

http://specopsbrand.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductID=50


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## banga (Aug 3, 2004)

PissedOffCil said:


> You really think I went out and checked the price for every single item posted there? 140$ is still too much anyways...


No its not. Its a a tool that will last 10+ years even when its being used dozens of times a week in a workshop.

Like all the other mechanics and ex-mechanics the vast-majority of Park Tools are worth the money. Lifu tools are very hit and miss, some are adequate while some are total rubbish. In a busy workshop its definitely one instance where you do it right the first time and it pays dividends in the long run. Just so happens that doing it right more often than not means Park.


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

Damn what is wrong with these people?

Really who do you think you are to judge my finances? Nobody here said that the quality wasn't there, that it wasn't worth it for a given indiviual or a shop or whatever. For me, 140$ for a headset press is too much because cheaper options do the same job. Other individuals with different needs and views might not agree and as I already said I often jump in myself...

An item being overpriced is a very personal matter, it's not black or white dammit...

It's amazing how people take this personally, start calling names, try to disregard other people's views by saying they have more experience, etc. It's depressing!


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## bad mechanic (Jun 21, 2006)

PissedOffCil said:


> An item being overpriced is a very personal matter, it's not black or white dammit...


I disagree, and feel saying something is overpriced is more an objective qualification. If a Chevy Aveo is priced at $200,000 it's over priced. If a Lamborghini Gallardo is priced at $200,000 it's not over priced, it's just too expensive for me. See the difference? That's why, when you start shouting that Park is overpriced, people get a little annoyed.

Also, when it comes to the valuation and worth of professional grade tools, yes, experience counts for a hell of a lot.


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

I never shouted and people get annoyed because they somehow take it personally that people don't agree with them.

Oh and I'm so sorry for not being a native english but I know the meaning of dumba$$ and by checking definitions online I get :

Expensive : Marked by high prices
Overpriced : To put too high a price or value on

Overprice is subjective, as is expensive. We all have a personal value referential.

And since you truly believe in experience, I believe you should be a professional coffee tester to truly see the value of a 9$ coffe mug!
http://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-Coffee-Mug-MUG-1/dp/B000NVAHJ0

Can we let this thread die now?


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## bad mechanic (Jun 21, 2006)

PissedOffCil said:


> And since you truly believe in experience, I believe you should be a professional coffee tester to truly see the value of a 9$ coffe mug!
> http://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-Coffee-Mug-MUG-1/dp/B000NVAHJ0


I <3 my Park mug. 



PissedOffCil said:


> Can we let this thread die now?


Then why do you keep posting in?


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

Because I'm not rude and I answer people who talk to me... Don't you have the same kind of well behaved manners?

Oh and I'd gladly have a Park mug and barbecue tools!!!


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## bad mechanic (Jun 21, 2006)

PissedOffCil said:


> Don't you have the same kind of well behaved manners?


Yes, but I usually choose to ignore them. :thumbsup:



PissedOffCil said:


> Oh and I'd gladly have a Park mug and barbecue tools!!!


I received the BBQ tools for Christmas. Not only are they utterly pimp, but they work exceedingly well.


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## archer (May 20, 2004)

jrafter said:


> i keep all my tools in one of theses
> 
> http://specopsbrand.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductID=50


Not enough room.


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## Bikinfoolferlife (Feb 3, 2004)

PissedOffCil said:


> Because I'm not rude and I answer people who talk to me... Don't you have the same kind of well behaved manners?
> 
> Oh and I'd gladly have a Park mug and barbecue tools!!!


Don't forget the toilet paper roll dispenser...works great! As does most Park stuff. FWIW it's one thing buying Park at retail as a consumer vs the shop from distributor level...


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## MTGseattle (Jun 29, 2008)

Hey all, I'm going to throw my 2 or 3 cents into the mix; Where I grew up Park was really the only game as far as specialty tools, so I used to think they were all ridiculously priced because I had no alternative. Personally, I'd love to have a Park headset press, but I only need one maybe once every other year if that. So for my needs, it's too much. I do have some shop experience, and the Park truing stand is top notch. normal (not cone) box wrenches and hex keys, sockets etc, I buy Craftsman. You can get cheaper, but with cheaper you can't bring your dead wrench/whatever into the store and exchange for new. I think the Craftsman t-handle hexes are pretty nice, I also use Bondhus with the "ball" end. Anyway, if you can afford the Park stuff, go for it, if you can't there are alternatives. Sorry if some of this seems redundant. Oh, and Pelican cases imho are worth the money. Cheers.


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## Crankenator (Mar 27, 2007)

As a former purchasing agent in the tool industry, I can confidently say that Park is overpriced for the most part. It's not that simple, though. They're filling a specialized niche with their products, for which there isn't really a lot of competition and not as large of a consumer base compared to other tool makers. They're also a relatively small company. The combination of the two necessitates somewhat higher pricing. That said, Park was still fairly high in their wholesale pricing as well as being a bit out of the norm with their policies. Assumptively, that's because they're doing well where they are and possibly want to maintain better control over distribution and/or dilution of retail pricing. We considered adding them to our mix and declined once we got a closer look.

Park sells almost nothing that is poor quality but they haven't been without some duds and failures/redesigns. One other thing they attempt to offer is one-stop convenience (which end users are paying a premium for, trust me...but that isn't uncommon in the industry). Many of their non-bike-specific tools are rebranded and are certainly more expensive than what can be found elsewhere. You can find equal or better quality for the same or often lower pricing. All in all, it's not a bad deal for bike shops. Most shops that I've gotten acquainted with use a healthy mix of Park and other brands (including automotive and hardware store brands)....it's smart purchasing, and it goes to show how they feel about Park's pricing. Savvy shops look for the cheapest service-worthy alternative and use the bike-specific brands only if needed or if convenience nullifies small price differences/availability/time spent. If a shop is doing well enough or concerned about image (yes, there are some of those out there), they seem to go Full-Park. That's fine. It works. 

Personal opinion, I think a person would have to be blind or completely inexperienced to call the torque wrenches, tool boxes, hammers, crescent wrenches, screwdrivers, allen wrenches and several other items in their gp and miscellaneous lines a "good value". It does give Park a more complete offering...one-stop...but customers on any level pay dearly for that. 

On a similar note, if more people knew the true cost of the "off brand" consumer tools, they'd probably be screaming much louder than they do about Park's pricing. That goes for automotive and common hand tools, too, not just bike tools. Really, it's ridiculous.


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## JonathanGennick (Sep 15, 2006)

Crankenator said:


> As a former purchasing agent in the tool industry, I can confidently say that Park is overpriced for the most part. It's not that simple, though. They're filling a specialized niche with their products, for which there isn't really a lot of competition and not as large of a consumer base compared to other tool makers.


^ ^ ^ 
This.

I've no idea about manufacturing cost of that BX-1 tool case, but the manufacturing cost isn't what matters. What matters are: 1) the size of the audience, and 2) the amount of competition. There are few sources for many of the tools that Park offers, so they can afford to push the pricing envelope. They also won't sell many of whatever they offer, which requires them to push the pricing envelope.


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## froggy97 (Oct 16, 2009)

Monkey, are you a Park rep? Seriously?

Park tools as a 'general rule' are over priced. The specialized tools are necessary, the pedal wrench is a good example. However, a chimpanzee can make a chain whip with some bar stock and excess chain links

Before you get your knickers in a knot and cop your "i'm a pro" attitude... I've been wrenching on cars, boats and bikes since 16. 

For someone that sells himself as "experienced" you lack that old-timer sensibility of making your own tools. It's amazing what you can do with a mig welder, bench grinder and drill press, when you need to create something. Someone that works in a shop has access to those things...and yet you pay someone else to make the tools?

You sound trained, not experienced. The difference is about learning and extrapolation of concepts


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

No need to bring this back up man, it was all settled down now...

Calm down, just calm down.



froggy97 said:


> Monkey, are you a Park rep? Seriously?
> 
> Park tools as a 'general rule' are over priced. The specialized tools are necessary, the pedal wrench is a good example. However, a chimpanzee can make a chain whip with some bar stock and excess chain links
> 
> ...


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## ctxcrossx (Jan 13, 2004)

I have been a mechanic for the past 15 years working in several shops. I'm not sure if anyone else felt this way, but when I was reading this thread, I thought that we were only considering the specialized tools that park made (not the hammers, screwdrivers, etc). I haven't been in an actual shop setting, and I don't believe those types of items were even available then. If they were, we never considered getting them.

I personally feel that the specific bike tools made by park are pro quality and are an excellent value.

Chris


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## themanmonkey (Nov 1, 2005)

froggy97 said:


> For someone that sells himself as "experienced" you lack that old-timer sensibility of making your own tools. It's amazing what you can do with a mig welder, bench grinder and drill press, when you need to create something. Someone that works in a shop has access to those things...and yet you pay someone else to make the tools?


Such venom from nowhere. Over the years I've built lots of tools, but most of them can be bought for much less money. In a professional environment time is money. Sure I can build something that takes me $2 in materials and and an hour, but at shop rate I've just spent $62 instead of $15 if I ordered the tool from QBP.

There are lots of tools you have to make. I made fixtures and tools for 2 years as part of my job at Bike Friday because tools were never made for those bikes. We still bought lots of Park tools and lots of them were the root of new tools. I love making tooling and fixtures, which is why I love framebuilding.

You say you've been working on stuff for all this time, but have you ever had to make your living with it? Just so you know 99.9% of bike shops don't have MIG welders or real machine tools, rarely do they have an actual drillpress. So even your meager listed tooling needed are beyond the capability of most shops.

In summary, as a professional mechanic time is money and Park makes me money, whereas making my own tools (no matter how personally satisfying) doesn't make me money, except in very rare cases.


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## Shurenuff (Sep 20, 2009)

So, back on topic... I'm going to pick up this case next week, lol. Found it for $170, still expensive but a little better.

I'll let you guys know how it works out and what I think of it in regards to quality when I get it.


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## space49 (Jan 24, 2010)

Where did you find that price at ?


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## Shurenuff (Sep 20, 2009)

I picked it up from here along with a few other things.

I'm very satisfied with the case. It has an aluminum frame which feels like quality and the tool boards are very nice. I like the combo lock and the key locks. Looks really sharp in general and is perfect for what I need. All my tools are perfectly organized now.

For those familiar with Pelican and their "indestructible" cases, I do have to say that the main blue part of the case does have much more flex than a Pelican. If you were to lay the case down and sit on it, the Pelican would definitely hold it's form better. Not really an issue for me though.

Besides that one observation, I have nothing but good things to say about this case. I plan to keep it for many, many years.


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## jtmartino (Jul 31, 2008)

#41 is right-on.

Park is "overpriced" for what you actually get because they have tremendous market share (as #41 and 42 pointed out.) I say overpriced because the quality of Park tools, for many of their offerings, is quite average (pedal wrenches, hex tools, cassette remover, etc.) when compared to other brands of hand tools.

If a company like Craftsman were to make a "professional grade" line of bike tools to compete with Park, just like they did with Snap-On, and if they offered a lifetime replacement warranty like they do with their other tools, you would probably see a lot of bike shops make the switch. Then again, a lot of people would stick with Park because they know it works. Or they like the color blue.

I'd also like to see some evidence backing up themanmonkey's claim that Pedros tools are made out of softer steel and Park tools. I have both brands of square taper crank pullers, and use them almost equally. The threads of the Park tool have lost their finish and seem to be wearing significantly faster than the Pedros tool. Durability aside, many Pedros offerings are more ergonomic than their Park counterparts...I see strengths in having both around, which is why my cycling toolbox has both blue and yellow-handled items.

That being said, I'd never be cool enough to drop ~$200 or more on a toolbox.

Edit: ~$200 or more on a toolbox like the topic of discussion on this thread.


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## PissedOffCil (Oct 18, 2007)

It's been a while since this thread. For those interested, I found an interesting alternative that is much cheaper!

Aluminum Tool Case with Strap | Canadian Tire

I'll go see check it out in person but it looks like a nice case for the stuff I bring to races. Not as much organization options but that can be taken care of with some thinking,


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## aBicycle (Jun 13, 2012)

PissedOffCil said:


> Monkey, although my day job is a video game programmer you go a long way to think I've never wrenched a bike. I assemble all my bikes myself, do all my maintenance myself and have my fair share of Park Tools, almost all of them to be honest. I've been cycling for five years and wrenching for the same time and although it might not be a lot of experience this debate has nothing to do with experience but with how overpriced some Park tools and equipment are.
> 
> 300$ for a stand base??? WTF? Park Tool 135 - Repair Stand Base | Buy Online | ChainReactionCycles.com
> 40$ for a small parts holder (box)? Park Tool Bench Top Small Parts Holder | Buy Online | ChainReactionCycles.com
> ...


Um, the CRC prices are much higher than american prices.


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## Toff (Sep 11, 2004)

I just use a nice fishing tackle box for my tools and stuff.

Works great, holds alot and was $30 or so.

Been using the same one for maybe 10 years. Its been to many camping trips and even a few races. Holding up well.


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